The New York herald., 1878-08-25
HARD TIMES.

TIoNs MR. FRANCIS B. THURBEa ON THE
DEPRESSION IN TRADE.
The Hewitt Committee continued its investigation
of the labor troubles Tor short time yesterday
morning. The main testimony was that OF MI
Francis B. Thurber, who. after giving his views Oh
tho situation in general, directed attention 70 'ne
evils OF railroad transportation Only Mr. hewitt
and Mr. Rice OF the committee were present
The first witness was Mr. John j. Hinchman, OF
Brooklyn, formerly merchant, who appeared before
tho committee to present some tables ana STATISTICS
which he had prepared, bearing on the subject
OF employ menL Two years ago some one,
ne said suggested TO him that holders
OF bonds and receivers OF interest should, duriug
hard times, relinquish a part OF their interest,
and make things easy for others while retaining
margin OF prolt. Witness replied TO this that ne had
better plan OF his own, which was that people IN
hard times should 60 TO work. Witness said that hs
had made some Investigation OF the condition Of labor
in tho country, aud had reached conclusion that IN
great country like this, II labor were properly or
ganized-tha is, Il 1t wsre properly Observation-Disclosures
would be no lack of employment for all
THs HISTORY STAPLES
His first inquiries were directed toward agriculture
and he had trace the variations OF thlr'y.sevon
staple productions, beginning at 1850 He divided his
table into ihree periods OF compar From 1850 TO
1860 only three Of the thlrty staples showed
falling or IN gross production. These wore rice,
sugar and nome made products The population dur
ing that period increased thirtynve per cent, and
eight staples failed TO show proporonate increase.
Those were sheep, swine, oats wool and maple sugar
III addition to the three named above.
From 1860 TO 1870 eighteen OF the thrty-seven art-
cles fell on in gross product, VIZ Meat, cattle,
mules, swine, rye, corn rice, tobacco cotton, buck
wheat sweet potatoes peas and beans, clover, grass,
ho,c.
prouucts. Inc population from 1860 TO 1870 was IN
creased twontytwo and onehalt per cent. and tnerc
showed a ratabie decrease. In addition TO the
eighteen named there were improved acres, acres IN
farm, cheese butter. market gardening aud horses.
These facts appeared TO The witness to establish
the fact that while Americans had been
increasing their uacures tncy mad been neglect
Ing the suostanta products that roman with US and
add TO the nations wealth. Witness believed thero
market in the world tor all TODD produced here;
II not abroad, then we could use II at home
He thought that IT the Uuitcd states we're sur
rounded by wall barring 1t frcm all com.
munication with the rest of the world
ci.izens could stil supply them selves with all
and comforts neccssary the first thing required ny
mankind was tood, tine second raiment and the third
shelter; they should sock TO get these IN The order
that they were needed
The witness then dwslt upon the numbers ont Of
emrloym and estimated that two per cent oil the
entire population were idle. In a little town IN Yer.
mont thut he was familiar with there mad been but
an average oi one pAupsr ia population of two
thousand for iorty years past.
LAND IMPROVEMENT.
the su bject Of Improved lard. In 1850 there were
113, 900, 900 acres of improved land ~ the United
States In 1850 this number mad been increased @ @ 10
acres IN round nombcrx From 1860 10 1870 the popu.
lation increased swen'y.two and ono-haf per cent
while In the same period the increase in improved
acres was but sixteen per cent. On the other hand,
ne found that manufactures for tho same ten years
showed an improvement Of sevcnty-sx per cent
Witness did not thing protection was the switch on
whcn we iran on the main track" az be expressed
t. but ne did think protection hsd placed us bad
m eel
the effort 10 strike tho real root Of the labor troubles
the witness said :"I think We are in something OF
the pOs on of the Governor who took such tremen-
cous view OF things that he could not turn them over
in his mlnd.'' LAughter)
There's been good deal OF that sort OF thing here"
Witness then took up tho subject Of articles OF re.
fined manuiucture-that Is. articles oil luxury and
comior,, not ol necessity. He found that between
1850 and 1870 there was increase N tho outlay Tor
the manufacture OF these articles OF ninety per cent,
while tho same period the Increase OF population
was twenty.two and hall per cent. Witness be.
hcved this outlay would nave been better directed
toward tue Improvement of land. Ho concluded by
hoping the oommittoe would accompany their report
with statistical tables showing me basis OF tao
opinions arrived at Mr. Hewitt rcph,d tnat tho
committee had Intended SO doing, ard added that the
next census report would also include some valuable
statistics bearing on the subject OF labor
h. rHURBER's VIEWS.
AS Mr.. Francis b. Ihuroer, dealer IN food products
was invied TO SIT before tho committee wors.
laoorer had 10 make his wants known u tho com
mnlce. Mr. Hewitt replied that every man had
letter, and u not nvned BY tbc committee 10 testify
before them could write out his views and they would
Mr.. rhurpcr then camo forward ana said no had
written out some OF his IDEAS on the subject Of stag
in trade, and WAS invioi 10 read the same 10
the committee He did So as ioilows:-
believe that there a substantial basis for the dssas
faction which exss .mons the working classes, and tina.
whilo some "t tn ir demands may he chmerca and i'm
practicable tas others again are quite just and must IN
isSs",ion Of the quarter o. century has been more
largely in the interest OF capa and crporations than u
middle classes are sustaining more than their share Of the
ts 1,s,uraly evaaes taxation VIII ever practiea6 5n.
there orms OF tn alton which cannot be eyaded AID
poor For instance tarn taxes portion Of what We
tariff aoss reach by our internal
nue. ana largely by enaig.s of tr,nspoasat,or ms Is
STOOL but which 10 borne ase by tue poor and rch.
arssd Beyond what viii paw iair return for the capital
paid IN providing transpsr'aiiea s.ies Is direct and
this n TAX p's may Dc "eryd roa s ,hsi the receipts
St s.s. ss ISaa Ens"s a a az sp, naa
ally ana have seen . stated sna ssliese :, 60 be true
Interest on the capital actually PAID by stock and
feysna.s Of ,hs ss.,e derived from tax.ii"n no
ct ana se "s nas sm cry
ior the mos. necessary pnrpses whe an the time tne
charges tran,portaton many times greater than tue
entire amoun. required for the esgsnse OF soyeramen
popersy is thereby greatly enhanced anu tae price &C. OF
should be- ~ one person can consume eat aoont ven
quantity OF the nscessaries Of life the poor man pays
nearly as much Of THIS tax as the rich man he peor
always the largest taxpayer III popor on I" ms
II government Is bad ati taxes aie tucr cnsed
insreUy. 6wnsr real estate sensrsy sads them
whirh ho from trnnnt. who thus in
eytaoy larsc share OF the taxes even though he
has surpu, store LAID by against rainy day." and
has dep ~ upon his daily IaDor rpr Subsistence
The condition Of TO-DAY !. great improved
that 0i the aoorer Of half century ago, aud justly
All civilized nations made Ereat striucs forward
ia providing tine material comforts OF lite whether tue
labo classes have shared this improvements 20 au
equal with the cl .sses controlling
capital Tor committee ascertain Ny own opnio
IL changes
laws will have g. De made to the great changes whh
almcst unuotced .nizcd, taken place
during the last quarter OF n century
TRANSFORMATIONS
Wien he mad conc. .udsd Mr. rnuruer, In answer TO
Mr.. Hewitt. went into fufther explanation oil what
had been read Ho believed thcre ought TO he some
limitation OF work done BY machinery or else there
would not DO sufficient room lot Tor manual labor.
Tho conversation dritca tho subject OF transport
tat,on by railway, TO which Mr. Ihurber has gwen
tculary the course oil tho Now YORK Central aud
HUDSON River. Mr. NAnderblIt. he sad, aIter IeavInK