The Portland daily press., 1878-04-13
Senator's Blaine and Thurman on the Pa.
ciiic Railroad Funding BIZ.

ScuAtUIS Dialne anu IHurmBu on the IA
ciilc Railroad Funding BIZ.
AT the conclusion of Mr.. Thurmsn's princI
pal speech on the Funding Bill Mr.. Blaine
made the following reply.
Mr.. Blsine-I did not desire TO interrupt the
Senator from Ohio while he was speaking; but
there is one point upon which before he leaves
his seat L should be glad to have an answer
from him. l understood the Senator, as did
maintain that my amendment if adopted would
divest Congress Of all power over the corpora
tons; that the power to amend, alter aud re-
peal would be gone. Did l so understand the
Senator?
Mr.. Thurman-Why, oaoad the debt IL "a
gone.
Mr.. Blaine--Quoa the debt, but the Senator
did not limit himself in that way when he was
speaking of it.
MI. Thurman-I did not. 1 do not intend to
limit myself.
Mr.. Blaine-Then. what want to ask the
Senator is, where will that power be when the
debt is all paid? VIII the payment of the debt
extlnguish the power? VIII the power to alter,
amend or repeal this charter be extingoished
when the debt to the Government is finally and
| fully paid?
Mr.. Thurman-Not the least bit of 1t.
Mr. Blaine-Then why or where does my
amendment interfere with the power?
Mr.. Thurman-For this reason suppose--
Mr.. Blaine-But the Senator did not make
the least exception. He made the assertion
broadly that my amendment destroyed the
power to repeal, alter or amend.
Mr.. Thurman-I certainly spoke secund,tyn
Su0ectun1 Doateridne as the lawyers say
Mr.. Blaine-I think the Senator will 6ud
that the language ne used does not justify that
conclusion.
Mr. Thnrman-The Senator asks me aues
tion, but he will not give me chance to an
swer.
Mr.. Blaine-Oh will sit down and let the
Senator answer at length.
Mr.. Thurman-I say that the amendment
proposed by the Senator would take away from
Congress all control over these roads in respect
OF the Government debt for twenty years. ex-
cept those provisions which are contained in
the acts of 1862 and 1864, and in this act, and
that, therefore, no matter what shall be the
condition of affairs hereafter, no matter how
much their revenues should increase, and they
might be better able to indemnify the Govern
ment and save their creditors. or on the other
duct, our hands will be tied. was speaking of
the debt; but l do not presume to follow it out
to Its consequences, as the Senator from Yer
mont did this morning; bat do sag that every
word that the Senator from We. mont said as to
the scope and effect of the amendment, if it
were adopted, is worthy of the most serious
consideration of the Senate.
MIR. Blaine-Then the Senator limits his re-
mark to that Now, another thing When
the Senator went on TO describe with minute
ness just how this amendment would operate
he failed, as think, to keep his argument on
all fours, because after he had given the table
from the expert in the Treasury Department
showing that there would be S36, ,OO0, 900 left at
the maturity of the bonds from both roads he
went on to say, "but we all underrate the i'm
mense development of these roads," He gives
1t as his opinion that the development would
far outrun any of the calculations submitted.
l agree with him. think SO myself. think
his bill takes sliding scale of 25 per cent. Of
the net earnings that will far more than pay
the debt to the Government within the time.
All the arguments have made heretofore have
been based upon taking the Senator's own cal
cnlatlon and his own figures. As had no
time myself to make any calculations | was
compelled to take those of the Judiciary Com
mittee and was very willing to do so, because
supposed they lad been made with care,
But the Senator takes occasion himself to as
sure us after those calculations were given in
the last remarks he made that the development
OF this road still in its very infancy he says is
to be so enormous that it will fer outrun any
calculation made upon it, L should like TO pro-
pound this query TO the Senator: Suppose
that you could lay down to-day exactly this
ground. that this company shall pay every year
enough to absorb the interest and part Of the
principal, and that right along from now for
the next twenty years there should be enough
paid every year to wipe out the entire debt be-
fore its maturity, would the Senator agree to
make that conclusive and final quodd the pecu.
mary obligation of the road?
Mr.. Thurman-I tell the Senator would not
agree under any circumstances to suspend the
power of Congress over these corporations for
one day, and it he would make the amount to
be paid into the sinking fund So, 900, 900 year,
or $10,000,000 year, l would not agree to sur
render the power of Congress.
Mr.. Blaine-Not over the debt?
Mr.. Thurman-No, not over anything.
Mr.. Blaine-Then ask the Senator if these
railway companies would briug all the money
here tomorrow that is owed to the government
and offer It in payment would be still insist on
the power?
Mr.. Thurman-Cersainly. We are talking
OF the roads.
Mr.. Blaine-Over the debt. was speaking
solely of the 'debt The Senator says that il
they would agree to pay $4,000, 900 year he
would not make conclusive bargain as respects
the debt. 1t seems to me, with entire respect
for the Senator that he has seemed TO place
himself in the position of the man in the story
who was SO contrary that he would not allow
himself TO do as he had mind to. The Sem
ator said if the companies would come here
and offer $40 100000 a year he would not put
provision in and say "We will not legislate on
that ss conclusive on the debt; we will not
agree that we will not demand $l1, 900, 900 next
year That is the spirit of this legislation.
Ohio He brings in a bill here. elaborateIy
studied, thoroughly prepared. He demon
strates to us that its provisions will nav the
debt within the time. Nay, more, he says to
os, the roads are in their very infancy, they
"A-A wv. ehio huu IaE D6yOuu 1ueH L
say to the Senator do not let us have these rail-
roads here perpetually in Congress. Do not let
as invite the presence of the lobby which so
qisturbs the dreams of the Senator from Yer
mont Let us say to the railroad companies
that if you will do this which will in good
faith pay the debt it shall be final on that point.
The Senator from Ohio declares that there is no
case where he will make such a conclusion.
Lest should have possibly misunderstood him
in the original argument, he tells us now that
if the railway companies come here and offer
to paw S10,000,000 year he would not accept
the offer as final and conclusive respecting the
debt; he would not agree that we should not
Immediately demand Sl0,000,000 per annum
fsom the companies, though $1O,000,000 per ap-
mum would pay the entire debt at least twelve
years before it is due
Such, then, is the spirit in which this meas
ure is offered, and when they have prepared it
and we were willing to make it finality If
the companies will obey it and faithfully COM
ply with it, the Senator from Ohio says no. 1t
seems to me that the Senator puts himself in
the attitude of simply not being willing to
make any offer that he thinks the companies
would agree to and live under. A Senator
Mr.. Gordon] suggests that should address
the Senator from Ohio question as to whether
$2O,000,0O0 year would satisfy him. II would