Daily globe. [volume] (St. Paul, Minn.) 1878-1884, 1878-06-13

| letter; you were about being candidate for
collector, and that being the condition of
things. you wrote to Anderson to help you.
A. Yes, sir.
@. Now, then, you expected help from him
on aceDunt of having these documents!
| A. Certainly, certainly.
Q. And you expected to get into Office upon
the fears Of the administration, through some
OF lts principals or attaches, OF the publication
| of these documents?
| A. That was one of the means.
! @. That was one Of the crutches you were
| to walk on.
| A. Certainly.
@. Whether the right bower or left bower
we won't say now. The records show you
worked up to the best Of your ability that
right bower.
A. Certainly.
Q. Now, sir, don't you believe you failed be-
cause copies Of this matter had got abroad !?
Was not that it,
A. In my opinion either myself or some
other party suggested by Anderson would have
been appointed but for the fact that it was
known that copies of these documents were in
possession of other parties, and that they were
virtually public property.
@. Ii these documents had not been pub
lished you would have been willing to have
owed your election to the efforts of perjurer
and blackmailer with false documents as col
lateral at one Of the principal Offices. You have
| stated him to be such?
A. You yourself stated it now-I not of my
own personal knowledge.
@. You know the man to be corrupt; you
believed his affidavit to be false; you knew his
acquaintance would say he was drunkard,
| and you knew that using these documents for
this purpose was simply matchmaking?
+ A. Certainly, certainly.
@. Then haven't you stated all that I have?
A. Substantially.
@. Then we don't substantially differ, and
you We're sorry you failed?
A. Naturally. (Laughter.)
@. Now, then in regard to that interview.
You say you saw Matthews at his house, did
you?
A. Yes, sir.
@. Did he send for you, or did you go vol
UNFAIRLY?
A. called on him at my own suggestion.
| Q. State the first thing you recollect that
| either of you said?
| A. l suppose you mean anything that will
! bear on this and effect point you Want
| to make.
O. You have no more idea of the point
want to make than you have of the Indian
| language. l intend that you shall go on with
your story and let my points alone.
I A. The first thing that | recollect is that
stated to Matthews that it had come to my
| knowledge that copies Of those documents OF
papers, or whatever they were, were in exist
ence in the newspaper office of the New York
Sun, and that copies of them or the originals
had been offered to parties in New York repre-
senting Tildcn.
Q. Do you have any recollection of any thing
occurring before that in that interview?
A. We probably discussed this matter of
the collectorship before that After I had told
Matthews this about the papers, he informed
me he had the same information from some
| the effect that be did not care whether the doc
ument SO far as he was concerned, was deliv-
cred to other parties, or purchased, or bought
or what was done with it. We then discussed
what is called the Sherman letter. I told him
what had heard in regard to it's existence, and
| did not believe any such letter had ever been
written, and no original was in existence. Dur
| ing the interview, it was mentioned that An
derson, or parties representing him
Q. Who mentioned it,
| A. It mentioned by myself, and he hac
heard the same, that parties representing An
derson would dispose of those documents, anC
I told him Anderson had been over here at re
quest of nine and inquired in regard to the
papers and documents, and that he had assured
me they were in his possession and would re
main safely there. Matthews remarked that il
case of my appointment or the appointment O
some one suitable to us, Anderson should b.
that he had and forego any claims that he had
on him (Matthews) or the administration.
Q. You have spoken of papers generally
you have even told us three times over tina
Matthews introduced the Sherman letter b.
saying he did not care about the papers SO ia
as he was concerned. except as to the Sherman
letter. Did not Matthews introduce the subjec
of the Sherman letter first?
! A. cannot recollect who first spoke of tn
| Sherman letter.
@. DO you recollect of its coming in in an,
other way than you put it in your direct ex
animation?
A. do not.
Q. That he in substance said he did not car
about anything else, but it was the Sherma
letter that was important. Why didn't yo
say, Mr.. Matthews, what is the Sherman letter
Didn't you say that to him?
A. There was nothing of the kind said. Th
Sherman letter at that time had been discusse
in the papers, and it is to be supposed every
body knew what it was.
Q. Pardon me. lfyou tell me what is i
the newspapers you will tell me great man
things that are not true while you are testify
ing under oath; therefore don't do it, Qaugt
ter.) Did he refer to the newspapers as hi
source of information?
A. Neither of us referred to the new:
) papers,
give him about the Sherman letter in that cor
versation?
A. My source of information was Mr.. Pc
|
had heard of it through him.
Q. But what information did you give hill
about the Sherman letter as distinctive?
A. l can recollect nothing as distinctive.
Q. What information did he give you abo,
the Sherman letter?
A. None whatever.
2 @. Then the Sherman letter was spoken
as matter that you two knew all about?
A. Certainly. it we'll known thing.
, @. It was after the fifth of April and b
: fore the 10Th of that month"; you saw the p
pers Anderson had?
A. Yes sir.
O.. On the 10Th you had learned your COZ
didature was up; in the old saying, your cal
. was dough, and the papers were not any long
instrumental in helping you. Why did yo
$ want them on the 18th of April?
A. cannot give you any information as
:. that. I can't explain that telegram.
: @. Let me see if can help you. You h;
: just been beaten. Were you not as well sati
fed then to have the papers published?
4 A. Oh, no, sir. had no such idea as that
t not at that time.
r @. Afterwards you told him he had bett
pitch in?
e A. There is but one explanation can gi
q as to that telegram, and | am positively certa
:, l saw the documents previous to the 10Th
S April. About the time the appointment W
n made and few days before went HON
Packard notified me he had telegraphed Andt
a son to come over and had signed my name
the telegram, Anderson having better a
K quaintance with me than with Packard, thou
he was well acquainted with us. That may e
It plain the matter.
@. But Packard was beaten before you
gan, and you wanted to antagonize him. Y
n were beaten, and Packard too, by the 10Th
n April. How do you explain that Packard want
r the papers? They were no longer reason
his appointment.
A. have given the best recollection ha,
d @. Now, then, when you saw the papers th
didn't seem to you to be of any consequent
A. Well, would consider the letter
l. Matthews and Sherman, if the originals col
III be produced, as important documents.
n When Anderson showed Won tho M ma