The New York herald. [volume] (New York [N.Y.]) 1840-1920, 1876-04-29

tors should have the opportunity to speak
The PRESIDING OrricER ruled this could only be done
BY unanimous consent
Mr. EpNrSDs objected and submitted n motion 10
strike the latter paragraph the order submitted
by Mr. Conking. as foiows:-
The motion that testimony be heard touching the
time Of such resignation and touching the motive and pur
pose q such RESIGNATION y reserved without prejudice I'll
and insert in lieu thereof the foilowing:-
And that the Managers counsel such argument
the question whether the issues OF tact material
Mr. I.onD said, behalf OF the managers that they
were satisfied with the amendment offered by the
Senator from Vermont.
Mr. HAxLS moved that the rules be suspended for
ten minues SO as 10 afford opportunity 10 the Sena-
tor from Ohio (sir. Thurman) 10 speak.
Mr. MoRroS-Do you want that to apply to one Sena-
tor only
would withdraw his notion Us he lhr. thurman did
not desire privilege not extended to other Senators.
This question mad TO be discussed here or somewhere.
Mr. HAaLIs-That IS what want, and II should be
discussed here
The PaKsIoIsc OFFICER reminded the Senator from
Maine Mr. Hamin) thar his motion 10 suspend the
could only be entertained by unanimous consent
and the senator IRON Vermont Or. Edmunds) had al
ready objected
Mr. ANTHONY moved that the Senate retire for consul
tation, which motion agreed to, and, at twenty
minutes 10 two NJ the Senate retired TO the rcccp
AT four clock the Senators returned the Chamber
and the presiding officer (Nr Ferry announced that
several orders had been agreed upon. which read
BY the Clerk, as ollows:-
s da s @ hear
Is amenabe 10 trial by impeachment for done
aud that managers counsel such arguments dis
eas The question whether Issues Of fact e material and
~ the cuse Of Representatives in the pleading subsequent
to the articles can be those alleged II the
a.. ss ssin on ss the so eth
In. and close OF The arument " given 10 the cspondent
ss tsG sI may on and
that time be allowed for Argument the said
and the counsel may desire.
Mr. LORD said the managers desired to DO heard
the question US to the opening aud closing Of the argu
mcnL
The PRESIDING OFFICER said the gentleman was not in
order order Of the Senate could not DO discussed
Mr.. ANTHONY, OF Rhode island, inquired II there was
way Of reaching consideration OF the order.
Mr.. EpxuNps Of Vermont, said the managers could
move TO set aside the order as in any court /.
Mr.. LoRD moved to rescind tho order, and said Mr..
Hoar would speak Tor tho managers on behalf OF The
motion.
ARGUMENT or MR.. HoAR
Mr. HoAR said he had not expected that this question
would arise at this point He understood that the rules
Of proceeding upon impeachment were not governed
by principles presidents of ordinary criminal
courts, though the House OF Lords the Senate sit
ting as court of impeachment undoubtedly derived
great light from them IN applications OF principles Of
common justice and OF law. Still II was proceeding
which stood on It's own constitutional ground. IL was
investigation into the guilt Of great public offenders
who abused their official trusts by the legislative bodies
Of the country, and in that Investigation, us every
where else, those legislative BODIES were equal Neither
branch Of the American Congress stood as sutton at
the bar Of the other Neither branch OF tho
British Parliament stood ms suor at the bar OF the
other but The judgment OF the TWO branches
necessary impeachment, just as II was to an
act Of legislation. In the English Parliament bill
brought the bar OF the House OF Lords and the
OF the Lords requested thereto and in the
way great public offender brought to tho House
OF Lords that his guilt might DO ascer-
tanned. 1t was an absolutely settled principle
OF right that upon all questions which arose
in tue trial OF impeachment the House
OF Commons had the right to reply. This was right
which had existed IN England unqucsioned for 400
which had been invariably recognized all
Of impeachment that had been conducted by the
American Congress He also wished the Court 10 re-
member that this matter the manager really under
took the Affirmation Of the issue II was
that the respondent had intcrposcd
and that the jursdicton question had been raised by
making is that plea But that was matter
lit TO enter general plea of not guilty. the question
Of the jurisdiction Of the Senate would have been in
yoved IN the final vote upon that question So that
by the logic Of ordinary practice they we're brought 10
the result they would he II II ques
ton simply OF the rrerogaiiye OF tho House.
Mr. McDoxALp, OF Indiana. moved that tho vote by
which the order in regard the Of discussion in
the question OF jurisdiction was passed be recon-
sidcred
Mr.. HOWE moved that the Senate, sitting as court
OF impeachment, adjourn till tomorrow ut haii-past
twelve O'Clock.
br extended to tho counsel for tho defence which mad
been extended tho managers and that they should
be heard upon the question
MR.. CARPENTERS REPLY.
In regard TO the opening and close of the argument
Mr. Carpenter said that from the course OF argument Of
the managers the counsel for the defence were very
much doubt whether they had any at all in
this business 1t seemed TO DC rather conference be-
tween the two houses than an Impeachment proceed
ing. They had just been informed by the man.
ayers that they had been tried and convicted
and that tho managers had brought the
Of the Senate and the only remaining question was as
to how ana in what form the Senate should concur in
between The TWO Houses in Witch the defence had no
interest on the merits of the motion to rcscind.
Twenty five years practirc in the courts had convinced
him that sale 10 leave Court TO vind,catc its
own orders. Amer this Court had made an order the
defence assumed that that order would DO adhered to-
In the place whatever nigh. be the presidents In
tho House OF Lords, they had the authority of no
less distinguished gentleman than Mr.. Hoar
for saying that these were not applicable
to n tral OF impeachment under our constitution.
He having taken that ground IN tho House Of Repre-
scnaivcs il possible that where the constitution
said the accused to have trial, and tho House Of
Representatives presented itself In the Senate
cuscr that the House became part OF tho court and
entitled to any favor which the accused not
entitedy The rule uniformly adopted by all courts OF
law was rule which experience had determined to be
wise and proper and the rule which the Senate had
ordered Tor this trial Was IL desired by the House
managers that the ordinary Justice should 10
changed for this trial and that they should be invited
10 new entertainments and that they should be borne
down by oppressive prcccdents OF the House OF Lords
Mr. HoAR SAID that the gentleman tME Carpeuter)
was mistaken In regard to the ground he ir. Hoarl
had taken In the House OF Representatives and spoke
In support Of the motion OF tue Senator from Indiana.
Mr. HOWE renewed his motion that the Senate sit
ting as court oil impcachment ADJOURN WI tomorrow
ut halfpast twelve.
Mr. CAMERON moved to amend by making II read
Monday nj half past twelve O'Clock.
Mr. Camcrons amendment was lost
Mr. Howe's motion to adjourn until to morrow was
rcected--yeas -, nays 81.
Mr. CAMERON moved 10 adjourn till Monday ut half
pssi twelve O'Clock.
The PRESIDING orficxR said the motion not in
order, having been already voted upon.
Mr. CAMERON said he would make his motion then
FIVE minutes later. viz THAT the Court adjourn till
twenty-five minutes to one O'Clock on Monday, which
agreed TO, and tho Senate sitting court OF
parchment at halfpast nve O'Clock adjourned until
Monday.
After the resumption by the Senate OF legislative
proceedings, motion of Mr.. Anthony the vote by
which the resolution in regard to printing the proceed
ings in the Impeachment trial reconsidercd and
the resolution amended TO provide for print
Ing 900 copies OF the proceedings Tor the Of the
Senate twenty-five copies for the of the rcspon.
dent and counsel, and the number OF copies for
the use OF the managers, and Amendments 1t was
passed
INDEPENDENT LABOR PARTY