The Wheeling daily intelligencer. [volume] (Wheeling, W. Va.) 1865-1903, 1876-12-13

l
consideration. Everybody can see that
there can be very great public question
that will turn upon the 22d joint rule,
and prefer that whenever all come 10
that discussion we shall come 10 II on .
direct issue with fall debate. therefore
withdraw the appeal.
Mr.. Springer asked Mr.. Garfield II the
joint rules were In existence at the close
Of the 33d Congress. g,-,ts4
Mr.. Garfield declined 10 answer until
he had examined the question.
Mr.. Speaker-The Chair does not wish
by any statement OF his to anticipate
the question, except what is connected
withlmatter OF fact; this House is CON-
posed OF some OF the same gentlemen
who, Notwithstanding, did ut the end Of
the last bess:on recognize the fact that
the Joint rnles were 10 existence by adopt
ing unanimously resolution to suspend
Joint rules numbered 10 and II.
Mr.. Springer-These joint rules have
never been re-adopted by any subsequent
Congress, from. the foundation OF the
Government TO the present time. The
22d joint rule was acted under In the
counting Of the Presidential electors In
1869 and also in 1873, and yet was never
adopted but once, in 1855.
Mr.. Hoar asked Mr.. Springer whether
the rule Of action which had been handed
down by tacit consent from Congress to
Congress, as TO the mode Of the proceed
ing OF the Houses, was not necessarily
abrogated by message from one OF them
TO the other that II considered the joint
rules no longer In force. Otherwise
would mol the House be bound not
merely by the net oftbe previous House,
a. 10 case OF its own rules, but Ivy the act
Of previous Senate? Ia
Mr. Springer-lf the doctrine be main
tained that when q Joint rule is establish
ed between the two Houses one OF them
can abrogate that rule at its will, there
Is no necessity whatever for adopting
joint rules, because they do not bind eth.
er party to agreement.
The Speaker stated the history Of The
two houses as TO the joint rule, and
showed that when any proposition by one
house to amend them, failed in the other
house the rules continued to be 'recogniz.
Cd, accepted and acted under rs II they
we're In full force. y az l''''~
Mr.. Kasson-That only shows that the
house proposing the amendment consent.
edihat the rules should go on without
the amendment. ..............-
The Speaker-Thc Chair thinks that
which takes two. bodies TO do takes two
bodies to undo. II is mere matter Of
opinion. ]. Z ..,& -Ia
Mr.. Sprinyer--The joint rules were
adopted in the form Of u concurrent reao.
luton, aud u concurrent resolution can
not be repealed by one body without tue
consent Of the other. ss,-fS - ~ -
Mr.. Hoar--Does the gentleman say
that rule adopted by concurrent reso.
luton at the beginning Of The government
binds successive Houses Of Represents.
,iyes forever until the Senate abandons Il!
Mr.. Springer-Until both houses aban.
don it, l do certainly. The gentleman
from Massachusetts, himself, when the
Presidential votes OF 1873 were being
counted, objected 10 the votes being cast
for Horace Greeley because he was dead,
and his objection was based on the 22Q
Joint Rule, which never had been re-
adopted since its adoption in 1855.
Mr.. Hoar-Both houses were acting
under II by consent. "
Mr.Springer-It never had been re-
adopted, and hid no validity at all except
that given to Il in 1855. .a+e
Mr.. Haskins--Ii the gentleman from
Illinois holds that these joint rules can
not be abrogated except by the consent
Of both houses, | would like to inquire
by what law or authority, after the Sen.
ate has repealed and refused to recognize
them, the House or any other body can
enforce them? P
Mr.. Springer-We can not compel the
Senate 10 abide by It's own rules. That
body Is law untoitself. But we can on
our part abide by those rules, and we
chooseItodo it. [Applause on the Dem.
ocratic side. >, -
Mr.. McCary remarked that Speaker
Kerr decided, at the beginning Of last
session, that each House has, under the
Constitution, an absolute right to make
the rules which govern It's actions, and
therefore the rules which had been
adopted in the 43di Congress were not in
force at the beginning Of the 44th. That
decision covered the whole ground in
this controversy, unless the gentleman
would say that a joint rule was rule for
the government Of the House OF Repre-.
sentatiyes.
THE Speaker2-It does not follow the
House, 1t Ii not governed by the joint
rules especially when the House il re.
minded OF the fact that the two bodies in
so far as the 22d joint rule Is concerned,
have several times operated under il In
counting the electoral vote, and so far as
the Chair is concerned, he Is not aware
Of any reason why that rule should
not be executed once more, applause on
the Democratic side. ,.,,n
Mr.. KassonG Can there be aioint rule
to which both Houses are not at the
time agreed; does II not cease 10 be u
Join rule the IN oment that either House
dissents. va y 'Hsis
The speaker-ln the judgement Of the
Chair the joint rules operate to bind both
bodies until they are vacated. 49,
Mr.. Kasson-By one body.
The Speaker-The Chair did not say
that. -,Isat ln. aaa1
+ Mr.. Hoar remarked that the PROPOSE
tion advanced on the Democratic side
was Tsd.stio. ad obGurdIR, and lie was
willing to have any eoIlsetion' Of school |
boys or any Nollection Of 6tateSmen In the |
country, able toinndersland those princi- |
Piles OF parliamentary law, which every |
American baby Id the cradle was sup.
posed to know iutuitiyely, to consider |
such proposal as that, -.s
Mr.. Springer, In his reply to Mr. Hoar,
reiesred him to the opinion OF his former
colleague, Gen. Butler, given in an in.
teryiew, TO the effect that il an instrn.
ment says that A and B are to be parties
to certain thing, as, for example, 10
make an award or to enter r Judgment, |
A can NOT do it,without B, nor can B Do
itwithoht A. Au N.1G1l H51 |
The discussion here closed, and under
the ruling Of the Speaker the House pro.
ceeded, 70, the consideration Of the uniin-
iAhed blisiness. Of the Last morning hour |
Of the last session, which was Bill re.
ported by Mr.. Bland, from the Commit.
lee on Mines and Mining, to utilize the
products Of gold and silver mines.
2 Mr.. Banks explained that In The pres.
-. lf,sa.l s.,sdt.tn, - .Ln uo,,..sIIkI |