The New York herald. [volume] (New York [N.Y.]) 1840-1920, 1875-01-22
Iscs Who held the check. or who presented the

certiuCufoe 10 me Tor my signature. presume,
although ! do not know, that there was some
| satisfactory explanation made 70 me at the time
30 induce me- to indorse the certificates; but did
aoar Of the money. have no reco!.
| lection OF ever having any business with
| and that never received any money IRON them
| or any evidences OF money on my own account.
Ny explanation OF the transaction that the per-
son VINO neld the cheeks must have come TO me
with the certincates OF deposit for my indorse.
ment and that, having secured standing IN tie
bank, oy he initials II. d. q. on the original
checks ne was enabled 10 continue the business IN
my name. which suited him, perhaps, better than
any otner course. Having no interest IN the
matter TOOK no note OF any OF these clrcum
stances, and cannot now rememoer anything
ABOUT mem one way or the other. aid not know
that had Endorsed the certificates OF deposit or
that they mad ever been issued until they were
produced uelore the committee. Ihe transaction
Is Oh several Years. standing ana mas passed en-
tlrely out OF my mind. In regard 10 the Caliior-
MA draft oil $4,000 have not the slightest recoi.
lection OF that transaction. IT 1t was sent to me
by Mr. Irwin ~ was sent with directions what was
same manner. had no recolle, tion or Knowlecge
OF ANYTHING anoutlt until saw references to 1t III
5no I n" isx r ND sent me o s he
with direct ons, suppose and | passed 1t away
according TO those directions. That Kept dollar
OF 1t or ad the oenent Of dollar oil u aave not
the slightest RECOLLECTION. know that did not
have any personal interest 10 It, professionally or
otherwise.
VERY EMBARRASSING GENTLEMEN
rms Is very embarrassing, gentlemen; know
very well the remarks tnat are made IN regard 10
my signature TO those certificates, but am ted
Ing you Goa's truth, according to my recollection.
to me in the ONCE Of the Pacific NAH stealusnip
Company, ave have rumors on the street that
TINS man or mat man in the senate or House rs TO
get up and move to rescnd or abolish that portion
OF the Post ONCE Appropriation OIL which relates
to the Subsidy, and we want you TO go
and the moment such move Is made we want
you TO telegraph Us immedately;" came here
and STAYED at Wormley's whlle mere was met
every day on the street by men whom mad never
seen before, swinging their arms, cursng and
had hnA Thnr In
agent o the ' Pacific Nail eamsnp Company
had gone to California and that they
some OF them even showed me letters rom the
directors Of the company; they were persons
would come ana SIT In my room all day long. and
follow me no TO the Caplto and harass me morn
ing and ngn usr became was The res
pany; am sorry or the position am in. owing
to my signature TO these certificates oil deposit;
but That IS all can say TO you, gentlemen; am
IN your hands.
THE CHECK FOE TWO HUNDRED AND sEvENTY-FIvE
THOUSAND DOLLARS.
Mr.. Schumacher, on being interrogated said he
had no recollection or ever having stated to MIR.
IRWIN that he wanted $30J0oo instead OF 1915 900,
or that he received any additional amount from
MIN.
Mr.. Roberts asked witness many questions, to
Twin came to mis- ONCE in New York, and IN
connection with his business attorney IN the case
OF Luther and Challis against tue Pacific Mail
steamship Company, he was retained IN connec-
ton with the subsidy; the understanding vas
bUIJ ne suOuu Keep Irwin pOSCeu auOuL tue iltlru-
ton IN New ork, ana wnen necessary he should
come TO Washington: as the Subsidy Oil was
barrassed oy suits against the company in New
mittee OF tue nature OF the salts, which.
1t was thought, were brought to emDar-
Irwin gave him tue check Tor s275, 900 as he was
about 10 start for California; ne thought IRWIN
came into his ONCE aud tnre " the check upon the
table; lie had no recollection why the check Was
Tor that particular sum. as he had no previous un-
derstandlng with Irwin 10 that effect: he had no
n
ne did receive such cheek 1T was disposed OF at
Mr. Roberts called his attention to the TACT OF
tho certificates or deposit here, on which checks
had been drawn by Mr.. Schumaker's order. but &c
had no recollection OIL the TRANSACTION.
z. Can you swear positively you did not receive
any money on these certidcatesS A. cannot
swea positively; have no recollection.
Q. BY reason OF the magnitude OF tue transac-
ton the witness ought to be able to say yes or no.
A. have mad various transactions, but they nave
Mr.. Kelly also propounded questions to the wit
ness with reference to his paying $4,000 to man
quently ascsrtalned TO De Morgan L. Smith.
Y. DID you ever know case In law or equity,
cate was drawn, aad ne received the money, cbud
reneve himself IN any way from responsibility A.
check ana received the money.
O. Can you prove that nowf A. have already
Q. Does not the law hold a party responsibles
A. I d not like to commit myself to assume la
O. DID you not when you Endorsed the check
commit yourself for the whole amount? A. l did
NOT, because what did was satisfactory to some.
body else.
VERY POOR MEMORY.
Mr.. Dawes next INTERCEPTED the witness, and
informed HIM that he had TWINS bank account
Otner Tor $3Soo0 but the witness did not remem-
Der having received the money-ir SO he DIS
minced the witness that ne stayed aW re n
washington until the subsidy bill became law
on the LIST OF June and renamed some days there
Ia fnr nod
Jay Cooke Co.'s with check, with the witness
as indoI SER
June. transacted tnat business IN person DO
you remember anything yeu we're doing at tue
time A. Not particularly.
Q. VIII you not tell me whether you had on your
books any specific charge against the Pacific Mail
Steamship Company
The witness replied that be had not; he did not
Keep Gay book or ledger. but only register OF
law cases; nor did he keep regular account OF
fees.
BOYD WINCHESTER ExcULPArgD.
By MIR. Beck-You know Boyd Winches ter, q
member OF the last House charge has been
made against him that ne received money from
the Scnumaker Pacific Mail corruption fund. A.
Winchester never received dollar from me IN
any way, shape or manner; that gentleman was
throughout opposed t. the subsidy bill: there Is
not Word o. truth In me report nor DID talk
never indorsed any check or certificate for any
member OF Congress.
having lnoorscd check at jay Cooke Il Co.'s
bank; then now can you say sou never Endorsed
Que IOI any IHtmDel Ol COUbTeSa A. thlnK [
would remember II had Endorsed Tor any mem.
Ger OF Congress, but would not have done so Tor
III member.
COMMUNICATION FROM THE COMPANY.
NJ. Clark Bell. counsel OF the Paciuc NJ all Steam.
'aIp company read In behalf OF the company the
.o,iowIng:-
/. Thomas J. Gamble, Secretary OF the Pacific Mail
steamship Company, hereby certify that have
FUZZY examined the minutes Of ali the
the Board OF Directors All AL tue ings OF the cxec
other committees said ny from The Ist
day OF January. 1871. 10 The 3st Gay May 1873 and
that the names OF John o. sehu'naser and Richard @