New-York tribune. [volume] (New York [N.Y.]) 1866-1924, 1875-09-11
THE FRAUDS AT RED CLOUD.
BISHOP HARE5 TESTIMONY.


WEIGHING $50 POUNDS REcEIpTED FOR ~
WEIGHING 1913.
IsI IELgaRAfu TO THE TRIsrNrI
WASHINGTON, Sept. 1O.-Tho Special Indian Com
mis;iOners appointed 10 investigate the affairs OF inc
Red Cloud and Whitest"ne Agencies aud composed
of Messrs Fletcher, Harris, Faulkner, and Atherton
held their first regular session in this city to-day
There wcrs present, beside the gentlemen named,
Prot. o. G. Marsh, Indian Commissioner Smith, and
Bishop Hare. The session was called to meet at I'D
o'clock, but the Commissioners were 80 busy with
the perusal of the pamphlet Of Secretary Delano,
suddenly metamorphosed into instructions to the
Commissioners, that they coGldnOt get down to the
work before them until an hour afterward. Bishop
Hare who TO give his testimony, was also rather
late. The pamphlet referred to- although professedly
Issued for the purpose Of instructing the Com
Irissioners, was really cover from which
to assai Prot. Marsh. 1t was issued several weeks
ago ~ the readers of TnE TRIBUNE will remember,
and widely circulated but the Commissioners
enabled to look it for the first time to-day,
although il was regarded az a scml-oilcial docu-
ment, and was printed ut the Government Office
SINE CONc UsIoNs OF THE BISHOP LAST YEAR.
The only witness examined to-day was Bishop
Hare who WIS one of the Commissioners to Invcstl-
gate the sane agencies a year and half ago. In
April, 1874, he made report, in which were dozen
re, concentrations and number of conclusions,
which, in the light Of faces known to-day, are not
sustained. Among the latter is the statement that
Agnt saylle is eyoncrated and deserves confidence
and COMMUNICATION also, that beef has been over
issued but the agents helpless to prevent IL
also that beef has not been issued in such quantities
tdat j has been left to rot also that the supplies
II all kinds were wholesome ard of at least fair
qnality.
INPDsrtNT CHARGE SUSTAINED.
The frs. portion of Bishop Harc's testimony. to-
lav was in rela ion to Tie isse of cattle TO the Red
Cloud Agency, Nov. II, 1874. These cattle Prof.
Aar.h RED. did not weigh on an average more
than $50 or $50 pounds Agent Savilie declared. IN
the Dr.. sencc Of both Prot Marsh and Bishop Hare,
ast June, that they world avrraee $50 pounds.
The last named gentleman, in his testimony to-day,
admitted this fact AID said that Prof. Marshs
settlement in this respect was c"rT"e; The o'hcIai
records show that Sayille receip;ed on that day. not
for cattle averaging so pounds, but for cattle
averaging 1,Ol3, and the contractors were paid for
cattle OF that weight OF 1913 pounds PER head more
tan Save hal declaei they ighed in presence
Of Bishop Hare. Bishop Hare said that when the
facts were made known to him, his heart sank
within him.
Subsequently in answer TO questions, the Bishops
testimony was conflicting. At one time re said ms
op:nion Of pr. Sayle had been Of the highest char
lc'er previous to lure, 1874, and Ieforo that date
he hal consd, red him an honest man. At another
time hen asked if he did, previous to June, regard
Savll,e a. morally weak he declined to answer AZ
s;ih another time he declined to answer as TO Sa-
yilles part cpdt0n in the frauds, Us between 500
and 100 pounds, because it wOnld aft CT the clar-
acer Of Saye, who had wife and child. lie also
said that he be eyed Sayille guiltess, but he
Thought he w2s not the man for the place. He came
to tbs Conclusion he said partly because OF saviiles
bad temper and partly because he was opposed by
so many persons that his usrfulness was gone lie
farther considered hat the Episcopal Church ought
not TO be re- polsiule for against whom SO much
was sal l..
In answer 10 question by Prof. Marsh, the Bishop
,aid he did understand that Siville ant to allow
only $50 pounds per head of cattle instead Of ,0i3
which lie actually rece pied for. There can be no
doubt Tat one important charge is thus sustained
by the testimony to-day Gov. Fletcher the Chair
nan. asked the witness if he had any knowledge
that voald SUSAN the Marsh charges. tie an
,woted that he lad nothing to say but he was not
ware o. any frauds on the part Of Saville.
WITHOUT KEOwLEDGF or FRAUDS ONLY sUs-
PICIO:s.
He was not aware of any frauds in annuity
good. he defended with good deaf of enthusiasm
thc Interior Department and the Indian O,ice say
Jag that he never brought 10 the attention OF the
Department any suspicion that did not receive AT
.entiull. " All my intercourse, SAID H., with the
oi.cers OF the Department increased my respect and
.ogard for them. have never known tnein 10 com
mi, or tolerate fraud As to agents, he said he did
not ike 20 answer. However, lac had no knowledge
oily suspicious lie has become more suspicious OF
ai.ars at tie led CiouI Agency since he vas there
He said that iii all his experience among
Indians he had always found the rations good
and wholesome, but not frst-class. lie had
however, az h. stated ias"l, seen bad hour ~ Tie
ned Cloud IL cncy it vas Hiiidc"ei and mouldy,
ana stuck together though IL Dat been wet. RATS
cad also been IA IT, ana tie bags were muddy a.
though they had Jeon dropped IN Inc mud. lie how
ever s; tnat 80 far rs hc knew this flour was only
issued 10 the ponies. lie thought Samuel walkers
report uufIiI, and n many respects coutemptioie.
he said, IA answer to Prof Marsh, that his whole
investigation at the Red Cloud Asoacy was 'onii-ed
90 ..ys hours L day iJr Ave d.ys; tnat the agent
know III ad, that ne a.s coming put lie ula h"'
KNOW tEat any preparation WAC made
Mr. ilaI.is asked II IL vas III the power Oh an
agent to reject cattle Or supplies. The answer WAS
nat the agent would have 10 De a very bsaYe man 10
do 3d. Inc Bishop thought tie Government ought
:, keep the cattle ~ shOrt time as possible; That
lie, are Liable 10 be stanpetied by thunderstorihs
ani Oticr Caacs stolen by the Indians.
nAis ..DR POLICY ADvoCArLD.
lie said he was ia favor of cutting Oh meat, coffee
and o,her supplies. and putting the military on
,,a1d around tleun, aud compelling them TO OBEY
t.s agents. 81 think said he, " that the Govern
rlepf + t,iiid. | think the President IL tmld, and
haze tod him so. No agen. should have more than
3 UUv to care for and opposed 10 consultations
no spirit OF the Indians should be broken,
they will give less trouble de believes
III harsh treatment, and thinks that If al
indian comes down irv. ais hi ..a. proud pJs.tion
cultivales tie land, and g.'s ,nya s.AAi crop, 1t
- II ~. Ito mahing OF M i. after bs spirit il brOAen.