The New York herald. [volume] (New York [N.Y.]) 1840-1920, 1875-04-21

Mr. Beecher before tue Plymouth church lnyesti-
gazing committee as already stated above, add
ing that part where Mr.. Beecher sald that AFTER
tn $4,000 nad bsen PAID he felt very much dlsSai-
isned with himself ABOUT 1t.
Y. Now. did that dlssatlsfac ton with Yourself
ARISE IN lsl4 as you have stated. IN the month OF
August A. Atterward; yes SIR
q Ia tue month oil August, 1874 a. Two years
ment.
you mad paid tine s., 600 mat Dlackmall beng
taken rom YOU how did II happen you PAID
the S5,000g A. l didn't consider that as black
mail, sir.
q. Didn't consider what as backmaiI A. the
.. dion't ask YOU that' A. You asked me
how considered 1t as blacKmail when paid the
$4,000.
me question was repeated by Mr.. Fullerton.
The Wltness-I did mos consider that, nor did
consider the other.
O. Well, we Will employ other terms then. II 1t
had oeen nitting through your mind that perhaps
you paid the 81, 600 aiterwaro. A. ala not con-
sider mat Mr. Moulton. III levying any part OF It
q Que moment. Just leave out Mr.. Moulton, II
you Please, and everybody ese am talNing
about the abstract payment OF the moneys A
am talking about the same thing.
Q. ask the question again question repeated)f
A. Because that do not SAVIOR OF biacEmau to me
thea; nor did me other unul alterwarC;
q. Wen, after you had paid the $4,000 did IL
SAVIOR OF blackmans A The suggestion came
q. Well, now, I ask you after those suggestions
came TO your min. that II was biackmali. now asa
ii happen that you paid lurtner money 7 A. The
suggestion aid not come 10 my mind that the
lurtaer money was blacSmail.
q. didn't ask You that
Judge Nellson-Wel, did those suggestions
come to your mlnd until after all the money had
been PAID overy
The WItness-The suggestion came TO me In this
orm:-Tnat Mr.. Moulton was pursuing course or
ton in wnich ne was willing To use my nelp Tor
himself, anu when MIR. Mouton represented the
great advantage which would be had in setting
tue Golden Age Tree from all its dtlculties by I'M
mediate and liberal contributions. and ending
therefore It's difficulties, had not the slightest
thought 1t was packmail.
O. Now / repeat the question-If the thought
ntted through yoGr ar, mna .naI se 1920
cause, SIR, didn't think that that savored OF
q. You told me a moment ago that II you had
any idea that the contributions savored of black
mail you would not have pal them at all A.
dld not think that IL savored Or Dlackmail at all
\ until after they had been PAID.
\ q. The $4,000 you thought savored OF blackmailY
\ Q. Did It occur to you, or did the thought come
1 to you, or come 10 your mind in any way, taat the
4 $4,000 savored OF blackmall before you paid the
/ 5000? A. Not under that designation, sir.
4 Q. Wen. under wnat designations A. do not
4 think mat the thought OF Oackmail came 10 me
untn after the commit tee's investigation in 1874;
did not put that name on. out ~ was put on, and
\ / spoke Of It because we were counselnng on the
subject and l called It by the name heard IL
VINO SUGGESTED BLAcKMAILf
Q. Now, VINO put II QUIZ A don't know which
I oil them.
I q. Well, tell us who were there ana let them
divide the nonors QaughteT; where was II and
/ who were present. A. ! don't know any partlcu-
lar interview that can designate.
.. Tell me, Mr.. Beecner, II YOU please, who IL
was taat suggested YOU tnat the payment or
this money was blackmsnS A. l think AR. Smear
man VIII nave 70 take part OF ~, won't her
q. / thIuk 50, perhaps the whole OF itg A No.
Il q. WAC eseY A. suspect II must have been
o. Dld you think IL was beaten into you by
sound arguments A. Wed. don't think IL was by
argument exactly.
o. Wen, has It stayed in you ever since you came
to believe II was blackmdlly A.
FALL FROM GRACE ONCE IN WHILE
I and recover aualn.
q. Wen, recover as best you can and tell me
whether you believe now tnat Francis ID. Moulton
intelded TO blackmall you In Obtaining these
sums VI money from you? A. have never yet
O. Tell me whether you believe 1t nowf A.
o. You can say "Yesu or .No.n A. just now I
have no thought ABOUT L. In the matter In the
confusion and excitement OF your question that
does not rest as matter upon my mind.
z. Now want to know upon what, therefore,
your suggestions rest mat IL might be probable
! tuat ne LEVIED 0lGckmail upon you A. IL Is upon
toe representa- that on sucn man as I am the
but 70 work upon his kindller feelings oY the Ut
most de!lcacy, ana with such delicate touches my
feelings were wrought upon. they knowing my
generosity was WEAKNESS, and so the money was
obtained
BY MORAL BLAcKnAIL-
Q. BY moral Olackma.lf A. Yes sir
U Is that the way the lawyers argued 10 with
your A. Pretty mucn that way,
That's pretty the way tney rubbed It IN TO me.
Y. Mr.. Beeeher, your answer 10 the question
which put 10 YOU whether you now believe tnat
Francis ID. Moallon intended 10 levy blsckInsl
upOn you mas not been answered Satisfactorily TO
my associates, and put 1t TO you again 70 your
present nenei? A Well. sir, II You mean py black.
natl that he levied contributions for his own al.
vantage on me / do not think he did but Il you
mean that he levied money upon me, using my
generous Feelings as tue lnstrulneniallty Tor the
I benent OF MIR. TlltOn. think he did.
q. DID you not hear from various quarters that
Dir. Monlton was condemned, Ia unmeasured
terms Tor having levied oacEmall upon yous A.
Not much; was oat or town at the Waite Mount
aims; don't reeollec. hearing OF IL there.
z. Well, what occurred IN October. 1874, which
hVQ chr nm Ar "a
blackmail? A. The same thing mat operated Ia
the beginning.
Tracy and Mr.. Snearman and Mr.. Winslow and
Mr.. sage and Mr.. StOrrs and MIR. Cleaveland, and
anybody ABOUT those times; they didn't push mo
in that direction can't say talked TO them ALL
but think IL quite likely recollect alkns with
Nj. Sage aud tninE with Mr.. wlnsow; Mr.. Wins
low IS a lawyer and l think. lie thought IL was
blacKmall; also talked win W. Q. BARTLETT, OF
New York.
q. You talked with these men after they were
put on the committee, did your A. Yes.
q. And they insisted upon 1t 10 you thar this
was olackmallf A. Members OF the committee
don't think l TAXED Win 30 much as did with
the lawyers Tor the committee.
.. Wen. what nemoers OF the committee did
you tails with about TINS DlacSma A. II 1 were
say wltn Mr.. cleveland and Mr.. sage; Ii is quite
possible tGat talked vita Mr. Storrs aDouL It. al
though don't recolect Is distinctly.
q. rnis was before evidence was taken before
the committee, was It not A. IL while tue
committee we're taking the evidence.
q. Was II before your evidence was taken
A. can't say positively.
o. What Is your beat recollection about IL ?
A. / talked also with Mr. Ross W. Raymond. and
MS hand was always very heavy upon me.
q, You had
A HARD TINE OF IT,
no doubt (Laugnterl A. did.
U. Now, ham, you stated flcts to Mr.. Cleave-
LAND before the committee was formed A. Mnat
facts
q. In regard to the payment Of this money! A.
presume did, OUT can't say.
u. DIdn't ne express opinion before ne was
put upon tue committee A can't say made
some statements oil some facts come cted win tne
case TO min before he was appoln ted on the COM
mittee.
a. bid no express an opinion upon ,nose facts
wnlch you thus stated r A. On some or yhem no
did
rec1l ", slr.
u Mas 1t favorable or an adorable 10 you A.
On, II PROBABLY favorable 10 me; he vas =