The New York herald. [volume] (New York [N.Y.]) 1840-1920, 1874-03-15
CHURCH AND STATE.
The War Between Bismarck
and the Papacy.
The Effect of the New
Church Laws.


BERLIN, Feb. 10, 1874
I went to TIE Reichstag to-day and saw some
half dozen OF the leading members OF the Imperial
Diet. to whom Mr.. Bancroft had courteOusly In
troduced me. Alter the preliminary bowling and
nne words were over settled down INTO close
talk with gentleman OF about Ave and thirty
years OF age. who Is a representative man and who
occupies very prominent position In tue German
Parliament.
He is healthy, strong man, overlooking with
words and energy, and as the pale French bishops
from Alsatla and Lorraine went by, with heads
bowed down and speaking in Whispers could not
help thinking what very short work he could make
OF them were this great struggle which agitatng
the whole Christian world to be decided by isti-
cuffs. As we spoke together tall, stout man, also
Astounding in health and strength, handsome.
erect, with remarkable elasticity in his move
ments, came past US, drew himself up Or mill
tary salute. smiled with something more than
irendltness and strobe on into the Parliament
House. That was Prince Bismarck. "Lpok here"
(Sehen SEE, said my energetic Parliament man
rather disdainfully, ''th0se French bishops are
come here to have row to-day. They won't sue
ceed We shall be loo many for them. They
bismarck Is more firmly seated in autnorlSy
Will make no dsreaos. We DO not Know macS s
about the Crown Prince, except that he Is ruled
her here In Berlin. do not know why. She Is o
good wife ana good mother, but she interferes
with politics. and we do not fancy that. The old
Queen, too Is on the side OF the Catholics but she
has no influence Nobody has any influence. The
King is jealous OF his authority and in this ques-
ton Prince Bismarck has got his ear He would
not have ventu ed on these nigh handed measures
with the Catholics 1t he had not mad nine-tenths
OF the nation with him. We do not believe In re-
vealed religion at all in Prussia-that is to say, the
lower classes believe In 1t up TO certain point;
educated people not at all rhe Kings death.
a n
determined to take against the priests. We
intend TO put down ecclesiastical authority alto
THIS Parliament man was so active and sturdy
that could not help thinking, as iooKed at MN
and remembered the mighty Chancellor VINO mad
gone by with sucn hrm step and naughty CREST
that the
DEVIL IS VERY STRONG AT BERLIN.
81 admitn resum ID the Parliament man, ''that
Bismarck has made o blunder; but he could not
help himself after he had once done 1t. He began
by looking upon this renglous business as potl.
cal question ana now II the Catholic clergy would
preach Tor the unity OF the German Empire under
the supremacy oil Prussia he would make 1t up
with them as far as he is concerned; but ne thinks
that they support tine Catholic interests rather
tnan the national interests and he is AFRAID Of the
Empire breaking up If there is an independent
Power In the midst OF 1t. This Archbishop
LedOchowski who Is now on his trial, wentto Yer
his temporal dominOns The Emperor, then In
the full flush OF his triumph over the French, re.
turned an evaSive answer. Then the CathOHcS
from one end Of the Empire to the other began to
preach against him.
"Halloal gentlemen" said Prince Bismarck,
81 will not have this sort OF thing - but they would
not be gu.ded They made common cause with
the French, with the Austrians, with the Bava-
rIans who are not yet quite 0gested into the i'm
perial system; 50 Bismarck put mis- foot down and
"Ah % said l. $50 that Is one view Of your case
Is it9 And what nextY Is the imperial Chancel-
lOr prepared 70 condemn all the Callolic clergy OF
the Empire to Imprisonment Tor HE. or do Won
suppose that the Catholic clergy viii yield up Their
cOnsciences."
ave have thought Of all thas" answered the
Deatn
law which viii send them al into banishment II
they 90 not yield; and as 1or yieiding, o why
have already presented list OF candidates to the
Grand Duke prepared to act with the government
Grand Duke S wv w not near Of person who win not
obey MN; and, therefore, tins lact looks like the
beginning OF trinm lor u.s. G 1os .her are
possibly" said 1; .but few OF Them at least.
love their laith more. We have seen evidences or
their resolution when oppressed, even III modern
history. They are very eloquent some OF them.
They Will plead with great ability Tor their Church.
They will DEFEND themselves IN writings. which
Will be read from one end OF the civilized world
to the other.n
.Bah ., observed the Parliament man. syly,
1--WE stopped their tongues two years ago; and
now we mean to stop their pens Here ttakng
Just proposed to the kelchstag by Prince Bismarck.
Just run your eye over clauses two, three and
may be published IN defence the Catholics
without subj Getting all persons concerned IN the
production or publication OF such things to heavy
fines and periods OF Imprisonment varying from
three months TO four years. rather think we
have got the Catholics tnere!'
allowed that these were strong measures but
that nevertheless still stronger ones mad often
been taKen against Catholics without much per-
manent effect For instance, the worlds history
reveals the tact that they had repeatedly been
thrown to wild beasts and Durned.
EYES," he replied, laughing; 'Dut we have done
with all that. Prince Bismarck told me only yes
terday that we must not make too much OF this
business We must treat it lightly, trumpery
thing not worth attention. and take care not 10
make too much noise about II. All the govern
ment papers have got orders to publish as little
as pOsslD e bout It,"
land what end do you propose to yourselves Yn
inquired. ''Do you ioresee that you may nave to
drive all the Roman Catholics who have con-
science out OF the imperial domlnOns, anu that they
number $4,000, 900 souls.
..We shall not do that" remarked the Parliament
man; 1--WE shall only expei foreigners. There are
ways and means OF stopping the emigration OF
Germans"
$50, then, you are really armed at all points,"
Eyes, think we are" answered the Parliament
man.
ner hour, dined at the table dh6te of the Hotel de
Rome. The table dhOte was crowded There was
THE BISHOP OF sTRAsBOuRG,
who Is staying here,
THE BISHOP OF METZ
and several of the Catholic Deputies Of Asace-
Lorraine, looking all very pale and anxious, for
the debate, as might be supposed, had gone against
tnem. There also were grave, sad faces, such as
are seldom seen at German tdbte rh0te IN winter
time They were the faces oil the directors and
treasurers OF catholic institutions whose revenues
were seized or about to be seized, and VINO were
full of concern Tor the poor and the helpless, the
halt and the lame and the deaf and the blind who
depended on those revenues for their daily bread,
and aiar of In
THE OLD FRENCH VILLAGE OF ALSACE-LORRAINE,
! fancied / could hear the wall oil many women
and the frightened moan OF orphans. whose future
looks awfully dark now that the men or God, who
fed and clothed them. are to DC driven out OF the
land where float the imperial banners OF the black
German eagle.
BERLIN, Feb q, 1874
Almost at the gates of Berlin there is
SMALL COLONY OF FRENCH HUGUENors,
and their history might be not unworthy the con-
sideration OF Prince Bismarck. IL was composed
OF men who left their homes, their country, their
professions, their interests, and all that selfish
persons hold dear, rather than give up one article