The New York herald. [volume] (New York [N.Y.]) 1840-1920, 1873-04-09
tlate the loan ;Bishoncheim is curious compound


OIL hberai1ty and avarice.
COMING TO THE POINT.
General A. 3. Owen was the next witness and
Mr.. butcher did not show me list OF names OF
members; he gave me memorandum OF sums Of
money paid to Senators, and also a sum paid to q
committee OF the Assembly; lie gave me the names
OF Senators verbally and made memorandum
Mr.. Stickney asked II the committee would direct
General Owen to give the names given by Mr.
butcher
MI. Lncoln-For one. say no.
Mr.. Carpenter thought 1t would be only right to
the Senators themselves whose names are handed
about as having been bought and sold that they
might have chance to make a relntation.
Mr.. Wight-ln order that all may not be con-
founded, 1t is but due TO the innocent Senators
that they should not rest under any imputaton,
and those charged can have a chance 10 explain
Mr. Lincoln ito witness)-Did MI. butcher state
who gave HIM the names
General Diven-He told me that the money was
not paid by him. but by Barber and Van Vechten
1t seems to me that by compelling me to give these
names you are backing the characters OF men on
very questionable authority; ii these men, Barber
and Van Vechten got this money and kept it them
selves. u would De wrong TO name any senator's
men pretended to give money to Senators and did
Mr.. Babcock-How are the Senator's to prove
that Ii Is not SO II 1t Is not?
Mr.. Stickney-li that list, or copy oft, were
shown you, would you recognize the names
General Diven-When testified before, gentle
man who was sitting behind me, showed me list
which struck me as being the same names; am
not positive OF the names.
Mr.. Stickney-State the names OF any Senators
mentioned to you by Mr.. butcher
This question was asked, but witness was told
not to answer until the committee should take &C
ton on IT, Looks OF trepidaron came on two or
three In the room. The members OF the committee
gave their ideas, as ioll0Ws:-
Mr.. Wight i am in iaver OF General Diven stat
ing all he knows II Senators be falsely accused
they will have chance to vndicate themselves.
We cannot get Mr.. butcher here, and General Owen
is the next best testimony we can get on the
matter.
Mr. Carnentar aynraesad similar yiaws Mr.
Lincoln let his eyebrows drop, looked rather
sullen, and speaking in very low tone,
ing one name unless he can give others. Mr..
Babcock, the chairman, looked rather nervous.
He remained looking down at his hands, then
slowly pared his hnger nails with his pocket knle,
and after few moments he said he was IN favor OF
witness giving all he positively can state.
Mr. Stlckney then askec-What names do you
General Diven-Before giving the names will
say that don't believe the names given me are
correct l remember now the name OF Senator
narrower.
Mr. stickney-H the list were shown you con-
tanning the names could you remember them.
General Diven-I hardly think 80. l was present
when the vote was taken on paying $50, 900 Tor ex-
penses at Albany. 1t was an uncontested vote,
perhaps not more than one or two voted
Mr. Lincoln here moved to strike out of the
minutes all that part which had re erence to Sena-
tor Narrower, but no action was taken ON the
motion.
The piece OF paper which the chairman had r e.
ceived from Mr.. O'Doherty was handed the wit.
it down. In response to further questioning by
Mr.. Stickney, he reped:-
this money for legislative purposes; i have
the examined list; there are six names on it;
recognize one other as having been given by Mr..
butcher; that name is General james Wood; AIN
not positive about others; cannot remember any
others; never saw the list since ! made it; |
wrote 1t at my table IN the Directors
room in the Erie Office l think there
was nobody nearer than the secre-
tary's room; thought | put it in my pocket; l
looked for and missed 1t within day or two after
wanted to show it to somebody but could not
find 1T; have no knowledge or information of
where it went to- the memorandum wrote was
in pencil; think wrote the names on the same
memorandum Mr.. butcher gave OF the amounts
paid out my recollection was that the amount paid
to the Assembly was $l20OO have some recol-
lection OF other names, but not Il very clear one
there were SIX names paid $4,000 each, think.
1t being apparently futile to attempt to stir up
the Generals memory on the point. he was dis
missed, and the committee adjourned shortly after,
to meet in Albany on Thursday afternoon, at tour
O'Clock.