Evening star. [volume] (Washington, D.C.) 1854-1972, 1873-01-29
some further explanations, and he would be glad

| The memorandum Of witness showed IL was
given TO him (Scofeld) 10 pay the sixty per cent
| dividend on ten shares Of credit mobilier stock.
| Judge Poland read another check for $50
dated June I'D, and payable 10 Cakes Ames or
| bearer.
Witness testified that he could not remember
| to whom that given. He may have drawn
| the money himself and handed it 90 whoever
was entitled I'd It. IL may have been 90 CARRIED.
| The check was for dividend on credit mobilier.
They all received their dividends.
=. Was there any other gentleman who
oeivsd 1893 except those who have been named
A. don't think Of any, sir.
=. DO You remember whether the payment
of 1929 to Mr.. Garfield was made by che ok or
whether you paid him in money.
A. 1 don't know. II did pay him in money
! drew il from the Sergeani-at-Arms ON a
check.
MR.. AnEs' MEMORY eoHs BACK on HIN AeAIs
Judge Poland.-on June I'D there was check
for S212.59 given by you on the sergcant-at-
There is no name In il. Can YOU say 10 whom
that was gwen?
A. No, sur: don't know as can. IL NAV have
been TO pay bill or something else.
@ Their is another 20 pay draft Of 81 Az
TO whom was that given?
A. 1 don't know; I suppose il was a draft 1
got on New York or Boston.
Q. Did Mr. Dawes receive any money from
you by a check on the sergeant-st-arms.
Q: Did You find anything on the books given
to Mr.. Dawes?
A. On my memorandum have Mr.. Dawes
Q. You think you paid him s40o was il by a
check on the sergeant at arms?
A. can't tell. The books will show. think
paid it by a check ON the sergeant at-arms.
@. You say you hold stock and certificates Of
bonds due on credit mobilier?
q. Has there been any dividend paid on c MON
Pacific stock?
\ a. No, sir.
WHO hR. AhEs ExrscIs TO SETTLE wiTH.
Witness resumed.-Sccfield, Dawes and Logan
went out after the dividend of sixty per cent.
Mr.. Kelley was entitled TO dividends, and wit
ness expected TO settle with him; had settled
\ with Patterson.
Q. And Mr.. Colfsx. do You consider he is en-
| titled TO the dividends?
| A. I do.
9. And yOn hold them in trust for him.
As TO Mr. Allison he sent his stock back and
| said he would have nothing more to 10 with il.
Witness supposed he had really given 10 up.
| Allison had an idea that there was an excited
political contest i'm his state, ami he preferred
| not to have the stock. Witness supposed the
/ stock being returned TO him by Allison was
| real transaction and not a nominal one. Had
had no agree ment with him about the matter
| though. He received the bond and cash divi-
bends, but the stock and stock certificates wit
o. Do you think Mr.. Allison ever returned to
You any part of the money You paid over TO
| him?
A He returned me the stock. Witness had no
| recollection of Mr.. llison returning him the
| 500 div idend. Had no recollection that he in
Il ii
| the settlement of another matter. Had had no
l correspondence with any OF these gentlemen
except Mr.. Patterson since the investigation
| had been in progress. Had conversations with
l several OF them, or most all of them.
z. Well. sir, what the committee wants TO
| learn is whether, in conversation with any OF
| these gentlemen, they have stated the matter
to you different from what they stated before
/ the committee?
/ A. Well, don't know.
| q. State if Mr.. Garfield claims, in a converse
| ton with YOU, that he regarded the transaCtio a
between you ana him as loan?
| A. can't remember. 4 have had two or
| three conversations with Mr.. Garfield. He
| wants to put the transaction ON the basis of a
| loan. He says when be came back frem Europe
| he Was short of funds. and called on me for n
loan. L can't remember about these things sir
SO MUCH SAID ABOUT A LOAN, AND ALL THAT.
| L told him he never called on me TO borrow
| money. and I knew nothing about him being
| short. He never asked me 10 lend him any
| money.
Q. We'll, 60 On Mr.. Ames, and give u. his
l Mr.. Ames-Oh! 7 can't remember all thess
| conversations about going % Europe. &c. TIL
| conversations L had with him would be iniu-
| rious to him, and am a bad man TO repeat con-
! versations. Ii will injure his reputation.
9. Did he make any request OF you to omit any
A. am not positive about that Ny impress
sion is that he wanted me To say a. little as
| could, that he might
GET OFF AS EASY As he COULD.
Il a
| transaction between YOU and MIR. Garfield?
| A. Yes sir. Nh. Ames then produced piece
OF paper upon which were the following figures.
1000, 600, 400: total, 400; and testified that
| the figures were made by Mr.. Garfield. The
| first GO referred to Union Pacific bonds, the
| second to credit mobilier stock, and the 400 to
| something else he could not remember now.
| Q. Was that what he received or what he was
| en- titled to?
A. What he is entitled to, though think he
| Is IN ERROR ABOUT THE S4o0.
Il -. Did he this down A. his resOileetiOn n
| the transaction between you?
| A. Yes, sir.
Mr. Merrick-I understand in substanc. he
wished you to state little possible about il.
Mr. Ames.-fes; that is my desire to.
Mr.. Merrick.-weli, Mr.. Ames, allow me IL
| state that We want YOU TO state all YOU know.
Mr.. Ames.-I have stated to the best of INV
| memory all know. The figures were made on
piece of paper on the table in my room at the
| time of the conversation. did not paw any at
| tention to them for three or four DAYS after
| wards; when found there was a conflict in our
| testimony preserved them. Witness did no;
l remember when Mr.. Garfield went to Europe
| Q. Did you understand by the conversation
you had with Mr.. Garfield that that gentleman
conceded your statement TO be right and true?
l A. Well, can't say. He would not have been
| very apt TO recall to his mind the amount due
l him, unless he agreed with my statement.
| Y. And the statement you made to him in
substance IS the one you have made to us?
Mr.. Ames further testified that he had
| CONVERSATION WITH JUDGE KELLY
II
| IL a loan. and had stated, nd said TO witness
he wanted to pay that loan" Witness replied
he did not consider it. Mr.. Kelly said be
/ would give me check ON his bank, and wanted
l to know when he should date it. 1 told him IL
1 would make difference. He gave me a
| check, that was before this investigation com
menced and L tore it in half and handed il
| back TO him.
@, What did he say when you tore it in two
| and handed Ii back:
A. Both Of us appeared to be satisfied with
| the transaction. (Laughter.l
y. Was it done In q moment Of passion?
| A. No. sir. 1t was done very good naturedlv
| did not consider he owed me anything but 1
| owed him, and told him 90. He did not deny il.
g. He wanted to call il something else?
i "A. That u the way l understand him. He
/ wanted to be clear Of the transaction.
Mr. Ames said II was important that he should
leave here for his home tonight. The final paw
ment on his extension Of time came due Febra-
airy 9TH, and he had to raise six hundred thou.
| sand dollars by that time. The committee
could get along without him now as the q uestiou
of bribery had been settled, and all the commits
some one else he'd VI
Adjourned until tomorrow morning at te.
O'Clock. W"