The Plymouth weekly Democrat. (Plymouth, Ind.) 1860-1869, 1868-04-16
PRESIDENT JOHNSON.
What He Says About Ben. Butler
EOrney, and "Ad Interim

A correspondence OF the C1ncnna.
/ Commercial.
In an interview with the president or
Sunday evening, asked the president il
Gen. Butler hadn't applied to him in 1865
for cabinet Office? "No," he said, "But,
ler himself never did, but his friends did
it for him. 4 strong movement was made
to get Butler in Stanton's place, and, be-
cause it didr't succeed, Butler has been
very sharp after me ever since. The idea
was to put Butler in the war office as the
first step towards reorganizing the demo-
cratic party with such men as he at the
4 head of it."
asked the president if Forney wasn't
on the came track with Butler IN the mat
ter of reorganizing the democratic party.
eyes" he said, he was, and he IFcrney)
began to grumble as early as December,
lS64,-just after the presidential election,
because democrats like himself had been
neglected and badly treated during Lin
coins first administration. The first thing
he did was to write me a letter, hoping
that when l came to the yice-presidency [
would give him the control of some pat
ronage that he said belonged to the Office
of secretary of the senate, but had of late
years been given to the sergeart-at-arms.
He hoped l would change that. Then
when l became president he was still more
importunate for something or other that
ne wanted. He always wanted something.
He thought he could take charge of me
and control everything, and when l would
not let him do that he quarreled with me.
He was mighty small man to quarrel
with, but, if it was worth while, [ could
very easily show the motive of his oppo-
sition to me-" The president also showed
me letter from Forney, dated Jan. 7,
1865, in which the writer hopes the ad
mission of Tennessee and Louisiana will
not be embarrassed by the question of ne
gro suffrage, and doesn't see how northern
men can vote to enfranchise the iliterate
negroes of the south while in nearly every
state in the north the blacks are disfran-
chised,
Much of the conversation related to the
testimony already adduced in behalf of
the prosecution. l remarked to the presi-
dent that they hadn't yet shown that Gen.
Thomas spoke from any authority from
him when he talked of using force to eject
Stanton. "No," said he, "and they won't
show it either. On the contrary, it will
appear before the trial is over, that [
warned him to be very careful how be pro-
ceeded, as | wanted everything done qui-
etly and peacefully, for no other purpose
than to test the validity of the tenure-of-
office law. Thomas seems to be queer
old gentleman" continued the president.
He has acted very strangely in parts of
this matter. But the fact is he got little
refreshed over his appointment at first
You know how it is with these military
men, how much style they like to see
put on, and how much fuss they make,
and how much they like to show their au-
thority Well, Thomas felt very big when
he got to be secretary of war. Stanton
had treated him pretty sharply on some
occasions, and here he thought was good
chance for him to show himself a bigger
man than Stanton He felt his import
apce that day very much, and was SO much
elated that he ran around telling every
body what he would do. Well, now ifhe
means to do anything very bad, he would
not have talked so freely about it. Men
generally don't moan what they say when
they brag as much as ne did. But, so far
from my authorizing him to use force, l
sent for him that morning, while his ap-
pointment was being made out, and talked
to him in this very room, to caution him
to proceed quietly. when his commission
and Stanton's removal were made out,
put them down on the table here, and said
to him: Now, this thing must be done
very carefully and very regularly. Here
is your commission, and here is Stanton's s
removal. You'll keep this and show it to
Stanton. He (Stauton) will get the no.
tice of his removal. You had better take
somebody with you when you go to the
war office, to use as witness in case there
is trouble He went over to the war Of
| fee and talked to Stanton, and came back
in few minutes very much rejoiced. He
said he had seen Stanton, that it was all
right, and that he would get possession OF
the war Office just as soon as Stanton could
pack up his papers. He felt that he was
secretary Of war and member of the cab
met, and all that, and never saw a man
more elated over position in my lite
But the first thing he knew, Stanton had
reconsidered his determination to pack up
and leave, and the next time he called al
the war Office the trouble began. How
ever, the whole thing will be cleared uT
as the trial progresses. 1t will be known
that not only didn't authorize Thomas
to use either threats or force, but that
warned him against both, and told him t.
proceed cautiously and quietly; and il
presence of witness. Of course they
can't hold me responsible either for wha
Gen. Thomas said, or for what he did, in
dependent of my orders. Suppose l order
ed Thomas to go to New York on business
/, and that he went down to the railroad de
, pot with company of soldiers and siezeC
a train to take him there, would be re
sponsible for that act simply because ha,
!, ordered him to New York? Certainl
not; and neither am I responsible 70
,, what he did or said outside of my order
in the matter of the war Office"
r Further on in the conversation, tn
. president expressed disappointment an
: regret in the appointment of Thomas bu
he thought all the trouble arose from tn
fact that Thomas got refreshed" owe
J his promotion, and felt so big at the ide
Il L.