The workingman's advocate. [volume] (Chicago [Ill.]) 1864-1877, 1868-02-08


Have yea not seen in those reports THU
point dis.icsly explained and have you moi
se3u II stAted-In those reports tnat he 10 In
no way responsible for the legality Of thoss
rulesf n i have heard it stated since |; ] do
knoE that .sFer / have read Il But here y
the fhct that We have deposited our rules
With him on the supposition that % has
testified BY the very fact Of allowing
them to Be deposited. that these wss nothing
in thsm In violation Of the iaw. II
Now that you have sid tA-. these socis.
ties should have the protection OF the law u
the rules have been deposited, may ask you
whether you thank that they ought to have
that protection without any reference to the
manner 10 which their funds were raised or
expended No, certainly not. 7 should not
ask for the protection Of any society which
had expended its funds 10 the manner thar
some Of them have expended them In Shelf
field recently.
Then your answer to that question is no !
IL you mean this, without reference to any
payment for strikes or lock outs, or support
ing men In getting more wages, or less time,
| say yes r2
Whit want to ascertain is what your de-
ought not to be certified a. legal, and ask
with regard to that, do you think that the
rules ought 70 be certified ~ legal, and | ask
with reference TO the manner in which the
funds are raised and spent, and you say in
answer 10 that, HNo"i Decidedly not.
What guarantee would you propose that
these societies should give in order 20 gain
the privilege which you say they ought to
have Of protection for the proper expendi-
ture, a. well IS the proper raising Of their
funds? | cannot conceive any further guar
antee than that they should deposit their
rules, and that they should issue monthly,
quarterly, and annual reports Of their pro-
csedings. and that they should send hem to
the registrar, anj send them to the public
prsss, that they should make their affairs
pubic in fact, and keep nothing at all Sc
cret.
Do you think that returns Of the annual
income and expenditure Of the society sent
In that way w0uli be Of the slightest use
unless those funds were kept separate under
separate heads would they be any guide as
10 how the money was either r.ised or X
pendedp Yes, I sm sure that would be a
guide, from the fact that although in our re-
ports we insert trade privileges so much,
every penny Of that Is accounted for, and the
reason why it 10 not printed is that it would
cost more than the sum is worth, perhaps
but we have detailed account Of every pen
~ Of It.
That may be the case in your society, but
think yeu have admitted that there are
rases in which money is spent Ii very elf
ferent way from that in which 1t is spent in
vour society2 These revelations at Shelf
Be d have shown that.
Lord Elcho-Is it not the case that besides
the written rules there is q common law, q
code Of custom and practice in many trades
Yes, and that custom and practice will exist
whether there is any society or not.
And that custom or that common law will
not appear before the registrar certifying,
will it OF course the societies could not be
held responsible for the customs in any par
.icular loe..Ity.
But supposing that the money is expended
not only according to these rules, but ac-
eording 20 these customs? There should be
no violation of the rules would have
clearly defined code and make them adhere
10 it. H
Earl Of Lich6eld-But unless the accounts
Of the society were rendered in detail and
under different heads, what guarantee could
Vou possibly have that under the head Of
such an item, for instance, a. trade expendi-'
sure, amounting in the case Of your society
Tor one year to . large amount, whatever it
may be, great many items would not be in
sluded which you would think really ought
not to be included 2 would refer your lord
ship to the report which you hold in your
hand you viii there find that every branch
renders detailed account Of all the expeudi-
ture, whether it is los. expended for sick,
,r Sd. in postage stamps; that is surely de-
tailed sufficient. s
Is that the case with regard to the contin-
gent fund2 Yes; and | cannot conceive q
more detailed account than we have. You
will find the words "trade privilege" in the
net income and expenditure, but detailed
account is rendered weekly of every penny
70 spent.
This detailed statement in the book in my
hand really would be the statement which
you say ought to be presented yearly TO the
registrar, whoever it may be, OF the friendly
societies, in ORD ar to give these societies the
Of he law. Iwant to know wne-
ther there !, anything in that annual state
;ssst ;sS..., a. es Il Tsse out 10 Your book,
which VIC lld be guarantee that great deal
of that money had not been spent improper
w.. sill, therefore, ask, do you propose to
rendef the accounts in that shape to the re-
gistf,.r, or do you propose merely to send in
your annual ststements I would send in
the whole Of the detailed report and give him
the privilege, and give him the right if he
likes, to come and exaVaine the account books
himself personally.
am very glad to hear you say sor Un-
doubtedly, Twill even go that for.
In point of fact, having had the manage
ment Of large society for long time, VOC
see no objection whatever in giving the full.
est account Of the expenditure? Not in The
slightest. | believe that we have suffered
ten times more from the notion that some
people entertain that societies desire to keer
their affairs secret than from any illegal ex-
penditure which we may have resortsd 10.
do not mean when say I'VE" our society Al
all, because we have not practiced that kind
of think.
You say, and am glad to hear you say
that you see no objection to the accounts BE-
ing given in detail under the separate heads
That really IS the case at the present time
With regard to the worc "delegation," ..
that bss oeefl mefti0s.sa once * twaSc,
win give you an instance Of what is real,
meant by It. About fortnight or tire
weeks ago | had occasion to 60 down to Gar
diff on delegation Ths chances are tina
that will cost the society about 60s4 Their
we're 6fty Of ouf men on strike there. va
there somsthing like twenty-four houfs, au'
met the employees and wofkmen, and the re
suit q That delsgasion was thst every IA
resumed work with code Of working rule
THAT gave perfect satisfacuon, end receive
the thanks Of masters and men At the snd Z
the affair. Now, that strike was costing on
society l5s. week each for tia ffty mem
bers. and the chances are that that delsga
tion which win cost the society 5Os. ma
hare the effect Of saving huadrsds ef pousd
u -. 81