New-York tribune. [volume] (New York [N.Y.]) 1866-1924, 1868-04-13
NEW YORK, MONDAY, APRIL 10, 1865.

Mr.. BUTLER TO that we object. / suppose we can can
20 the date IL the l4h OF January On the
18th Mr. Stanton reinstated and the th was the oay
Mr.. sTAEBERY ito witness)-Can you give the date
Of that conversation A. According to memorandum
s stanton was Var on Tuesay the 18th
January and the conversation occurred on wednesday
The CHIEF-JUsTICE-The ChefJustce thinks the
question admissible within the principle OF the decision
already made BY the senate but he VIII De pleased
| the question 10 the Senate.
Senator CONFESS demanded the Yeas and Nays on the
MT. sTANBERY rose to argue the point. He said The
counsel for the President ask merely 70 state the ground
on which they claim TO put this question They expect
/ Mr.. BUTLER dnterruphng)I object to your stating
that did that. That is attempt TO get be-
fore the Court mean before the senae-the testimony
by the statement by counsel ~ t the pres 9Ies
can be given in evidence What these declarations are
1t would be Improper to state because that would be peg
ng the whole question and attempting 20 get them IN
that way By recital Of the counsel The whole question
is whether any declarations OF the President can be com
petent evidences therefore there Is no occasion 10 state
Mr.. sTANBERY-Do you propose to argue it nowi
Mr.. BUTLER-We do not want TO argue II.
Mr.. sTANBERY-Then viii. Mr. ChefJustce and
Senators, the testimony which we expect to elicit from
Gen. sherman look upon adDissbea and as testimony
which we are entitled TO have, upon grounds perfectly
well understood and perfectly answerable presume
say in argument what expect TO prove First OF
all, what is shown here What Is the point which gentle
men assume TO make against the Presdent LEI, Ley te
honorable Manager who opened this case page W Oh MS
Having shown hat the President vnhuy violated act Of Congress
without heasop both in the removal Of Stanton and the appoint
ofthe War oe foree aesi be- aud certau by nmaoa
Who r l .S & A"sw no not ss Of the high erne and
msdemeanors charged against him IN the ir,t eight areesf
Then page O9 speaking Of the orders Of removal he
fh.e and set. that bis attempt
get Of M military force Of the Government by the 'eng q
the Depsraept ofw lone Pursuance Of bis general design ~
nov claims b. sassr the right 70 control y bus VIII FOR the
ssd diplomatic Seree Ofthe uniied States.
The difficulty that reefs IN the minds Of my learned
friends the other side Is that they cluster
about the 2lst Of February They 20 forget
that the act Of the 2si Of February lsfs was only the
eulmat9n OF Iuose iVFga Ops as cry "a he e
t5 I'm W 70 o lie must ee totrol Of the war Office But
what GOOD does that 90 il he get somebody who
shall be his servant, m slave dependent on MS breath 10
thcrfre he begau when stanton was suspended and
t"son and the reasons for II before the Senate and
IN d. d not live there one moment after Il got
fairly consdsged Now he begins what IS the hrst
thing he does 10 gSt IN VIZ LII III
can get him in the War Department" That is the first
make AN appo.ntment The difficulty that we lind is that
are obliged to argue our case step Dy SOP
fccuics always OF putting IN case that sharp Keen
ingenious counsel can INSIST az all steps on lmpal,
have got 10 proceed n little further. Now, our eyi-
douce u yOn allow n 10 come n j. first that he made
this appointment that this falling he sent tito the Senate
ana Cooper vas r cted SIN determined TO have Cooper
in he appointed him od btGD, precisely as tins dd T.
fer1a was aprnted, without law aud against right we
put il s pars 81 the whole machinery by which to get
hold. get hhe could his hand in the Treasury OF me
United States although MI Chandler has just stated
there way 10 get except by arequisitonthrGugh
tie War Depariner and nj INC same moment to SHOW
that tins part OF the same illegal measures
you that although Mr. McCnloch Secretary OF the Treas
ury, must have known that Thomas was appointed, yet
the President took pains I'VE have put II n me paper 70
serve Mr. MeCulOch attested copy OF the aPpoln
ment Of Thomas al mrn IA oidG s"t ne aI nov te
might recoBdze his warrans ibis rs 10 SHOW .lae
the intention Of the President begun as early a.
h te me lih S an met Of Mr. Cooper in the Fall
Of 1901 goltg through all the subsequent time
gst of Fehrry by President finding the proper tool
70 mi in the Mar Office" According 20 this argument
Who Would az lis bidding; and after that search they
es og9a M AGED sd S one m ES aad scna
to- especial those OF YOU who are lawyers WHAT case
a5s hy h as s sa Certain acis That does not make
him guilty AT he did those acts hidld gde' WIN an un
lawful intent I'd criminal purpose. They do not. there
fore attemn prove that purpose by any positive ties
inony buf 4 say there are certain facts which raise
pycsi,mptf Il criminal intent THIS being what is
ne rne 70 rebut tLls prcslmponi when prosecution
is allowed raise presumption Of the intent OF me acts
rsbtcd by proof of other crcums 10 show that
the accused had no such intentont Was anything ever
Mr. BtTTER~lr President and Senators, was quite
willing chye this case 70 tue judgment % both lawyers
and laymen OF the senate without word OF argnment
aud only speak now to Lawyers DScausc Sne Hlcp n
lie had expected some peculiar advantages on speaking
10 lawyers. All the rules OF evidence are founded on tne
GOOD sense OF mankind experienced III courts OF law,
las shown what most likely or most unlikely 70 pe true
ana 10 elicit the truth They address themselves Just as
urh TO aymen they DO 10 lawyers because there are
no gentlemen in the senatenay there are no gentlemen
anywherewho cannot understand the rules OF re-
agree that labor under any great difficulty In me
argument Just made, but do labor under great dliGuy
in the opinion OF the presiding ocer anu ~ DE-
ithn the ruling Of yesterday. II IL did should not
ed m bow 70 ali decisions of the tribunal before which
act; bat this entirely another ana dieieht ease
wit on the l4th OF January-what conversation TOOK
place between the President and you In reference 70 e
removal OF Mr. stantoni' What conversation Ihey 90
moi ask for acts is this offer Of evidence attempted
10 be supported agree that the first part OF the arg
nent made BY learned Attorney General was the very
hest one he made IN his fe because contested III
his merely reading what had SAID; lLaughterI hd
have right to say without any imnodesty because nc
adopted all that said which Is one 81 the bghes com
piments ever paid 10 me. laughter thouSnt ~ T -,
good argument az the time made II, and hopeu 70
the argument do any better now IN the mouth OF tue
ATTORNEY General desire the result. was argu
In his appointing Mr. Cooper and tried In every way TO
convince Senate that IL ought to admit them Dnt the
senate decided by an almost solid vote that would not
NV argument failed TO convince you. VIII ~ 10 any
better when read by the musical voice OF my friend nom
Ohoi lIaughterI think not The point then was that
| was trying prove not declaration OF MI Johnson
but an act Here they offer his declaration. Ihe
oept such charged In the articles, We uV DV
charge the sarticles any attempt on me par 9i MI
johnson to bride to mud tool In the gentleman
now on the stand, for whom we all nave sneA hign
respect do not think that We nave hat G ,d
az him What do we chargel We charge that ne useu
the man who the same stand an hour before as
tool and Judge ye whether he Is or NOT on ns I'm
here iii instrument. Judge ye, Judge ye. iou sd" INN
weak vacating vain old man Just ny TO DC panpeieG
by little bride 10 do the thlng when no otaNc i'iI
would dare do. The eounses ground - tnat u GopT
tent order to show Andrew J0hnsons so0a Sal
II they put that In testimony VIII open 'n s Ipo
Ihave no objection whatever that they sha oner ~
Laughter will take evidence on his character as 10
his loyalty, patriotism on any other matter tnae .hS
may wish to prove 10 you; but now 90 hey pIopos9 ~
prove good eharacter BY showing what ne ssa 10
another gentleman DID You ever nave chu non,s
proved In that way, lawyers OF the senate man