Public ledger. [volume] (Memphis, Tenn.) 1865-1893, 1868-04-09
A PRESIDENTIAL TALK.

eral Butler came up on Sunday evening,
as the town was full Of rumors about the
great speech to be made next day by that
distinguished gentleman. ! asked the
President if Butler hadn't applied TO
him in 1865 for Cabinet Officer No.,
he said, Butler himself never did, but
his friends did il for him. A strong
movement was made TO get Butler in
Stanton's place, and because it didn't
succeed, Butler has been pretty sharp
after me ever since The idea was to
nut Butler in the War Office as the first
step toward reorganizingthe Democratic
party with such men as he at the head oil
I asked the President il Forney wasn't
on the same tack with Butler in the
matter of reorganizing the Democratic
party. "Yes," he said, he was, and he
| iForney) began to grumble as early as
| December, lS64-just after the Presi-
DENTAL lelcction-bscause Democrats like
himself had been neglected and badly
treated during Lincoln's first admins
tration. The first thing he did was to
write me o letter, hoping that when |
came to the Vice Presidency, | would
give him the control of some patronage
! that he said belonged to the ofiice OF
Secretary of the Senate, but had OF late
years been given to the Sergeant
st-arms. He hoped | would change
that. Then when / became Presi-
dent he was still more importunate
for something or other that he wanted.
He always wanted something. He
Thought he could take charge of me and
control everything, and when wouldn't
let him do that he quarreled with me:
| He is a mighty small man to quarrel
with. but, if it was worth while, could
very easily show the motive of his oppo-
sition to me-" The President also showed
me letter from Forney, dated January
7. 1865. in which the writer hopes the
admission of Tennessee and Louisiana
will not be embarrassed by the question
of negro suffrage, and doesn't see how
| Northern men can vote to enfranchlse
the illiterate negroes of the South while
in nearly every State in the North the
blacks are disfranchised as ttlat
Much of the conversation last evening
related to the testimony already ad-
duced on behalf of the prosecution. L
remarked to the President that they
hadn't vet shown that General Thomas
smoke from any authority from him when
he talked of using force to eject Stan.
ton. "No," said he, sand they won't
show iteither. On the contrary, It will
appear, before the trial is over. that l
warned him to be very careful how ne
proceeded, as ! wanted everything done
quietly and peacefully, for no other pur-
nose than to test the validity of the
teuure-of-office law. Thomas seems to
he a queer old gentleman" continued the
President. He has acted very strangely
in parts of this matter. But the fact is,
he got little refreshed over his appoint
ment at first You know how 1t is
with these military men--how much
style they like to put on, and how
much fuss they ike to make, and how
thew like to show their authority. Well,
Thomas felt very big when he got to be
Secretary of War. Stanton had treated
him pretty sharply on some occasions,
and here, he thought, was good chance
'for him to show himself a bigger man
than Stanton. He felt his importance
that day very much, and was so much
elated that he ran around dttelling every
body what be would do. Well, now if he
meant to do anything very bad, he
wouldn't have talked about it 30 freely.
Men, generally, don't mean, what they
saw when they brag as much as he did,
| But so far from my authorizing him to
use force, sent for him that morning,
while his appointment was being made
out, and talked to him in this very room
to caution him to proceed quietly,
| When his commission and Stanton's
removal were made out, l put
| them down on the table here, and
said to him: Now, this thing must be
done very carefully and very regularly
Here is your commission, and here Is
Stanton's removal. You'll keep this
and show it to Stanton. He (Stanton)
will get the notice of his removal. You
had better take somebody with you when
YOU 20 to the War Office, to use as a
witness in case there is any trouble He
went over to the War Office and talked to
Stanton, and came back to me in few
minutes very much rejoiced. He said
he had seen Stanton, that it was all right,
and that he would get possession OF the
War Office Just as soon as Stanton could
mack MP his papers. He felt that he was
! Secretary of War and member of the
Cabinet, and all that; and never saw
a man more elated over a position in my
| life. But the first thing he knew, Stan
TON had reconsidered his determina-
tion 10 pack up and leave, and the
next time he called at the War
Office the trouble began. However, the
whole thing will be cleared up as the
trial progresses. 1t will be shown that L
not only didn't authorize Thomas to use
either threats or force, but that in fact L
warned him against both, and told him
to proceed cautiously and quietly; and
in presence of O witness. vi course
thew can't hold me responsible either for
what General Thomas said, or for what
be did, independent of my orders. Sup
nose / ordered Thomas to 60 to New
York on business, and that be went
down TO the railroad depot with COM
many of soldiers and seized train to
take him there, would be responsible
for that act simply because l had or
dered him to New York; Certainly
not; and neither am responsible for
what he did or said outside Of my orders
In the matter Of the War Office"
Further on in the conversation the
President expressed disappointment and
regret in the appointment of Thomas;
hui he thought all the trouble arose from
he faot that Thomas got refreshed over
his promotion, aud felt so big at the idea
of being above everybody else IN the
army. that he hardly knew how 70 con-
tain himself BE thought that the TACT
Of his being found at 8 masked ball, that
nirht. explained q good deal Of it, and
was itself an explanation Of Thomas
"elated condition
/ i ssked the President If be had read
the testimony Of General Emory, given