The workingman's advocate. [volume] (Chicago [Ill.]) 1864-1877, 1868-02-22

IG*1 xbA punishment in case they 90 NOS OBEY
- rnles.
The profits from that source will be greai
lin proportion to the reluctance there 10 tc
nhay the ruless Yes, clearly 90.
Chairman-And according TO some OF the
| rnles which have seen for very small Of
xonees (if mi. ht use the word) and which
/ tfex certain humanity speaking, TO occur
many times, the fine Is very heavy indeed
| On course, a society might be set up on thai
| f0Bting and its Profits be enormous II the
mbmbers remained in its Bot there il
nothing either oppressive or unidlr about ouI
Sir ID. Gooch-You do not look on youI
fnss % part Of your income2 No, | simply
3enliOned 1t az q fact that the members %
ocasionally run into arrears and are lined
| IL consequences.
~ Sir Il. w. Head If the subscriptions are
xznctnAlly paid and the money paid into the
bank, it would bear interest, would it not
| Yes, undoubtedly.
~ Then the fns 10 mos ell pure gain, but
Mere 10 the loss Of the interest to be taken
ht4ko accOunt2 Yes bat We would not ge,
~ interest on 90. Mr.. Tucker expressed q
f4ouht ut the same time a. to what would ap-
ny to trade privileges. IshaS be very glad
Nd give him any inf0rnstion on that point
And may conaude this part Of my evidence
~ stating that Mr.. Allan will follow me and
tell you that their society (the amalgamased
Sngineers) was passed when 1t started ca .
Nd years. experience of two Of the largest So
cEeties IN existence, and that it has succeeosd.
Er. Guile, of the ironmoulders, will follow
E you desire it, and tell you that they have
Done what the engineers have done for hfty-
aeven years.
i Mr.. Hughes-Do the fines in fact drive
naen from the society? No.
Sir d. GoOch-Do all the members who
him your society become entitled to your SUI
peranOation One uniform payment of q
sailling entities them to superannnation and
every other benefit, but they have to be in
~ years, IL years. and 25 years respective
", and then they m ust through old age and
faHrmity be enabled 70 work at the trade be-
Fore they are entitled % that benefit. | wish
" make statement in reply to a question
that Lord Lichdeld asked me last time as TO
Whether our society had any better check in
-eRard to the health o. the men admitted than
6f0fnary benefit societies; he said that al
s9und benefit societies had medical exami
nations before they ad aitted men. can
U|XtY obVa uCEC ~ VIC OOOA Va E0tco Vi b4C
Hoyal Stande1j Society, which has been pro-
pbanced BY Mr.. Tidd Pratt to be the best, or
spe OF the best, and they have no such rule.
We have the advantage OF them, therefore,
hcause We have medical examination,
Al NJ thes have none.
fEarl Of Lich6eld-Do they provide SUPER
alhuation for their members do not
HnbW ANYTHING about that
Everything would depend on that, would
i4note IL would not make any difference
"a isr as sick benefit il concerned.
&c not dispute what you say with refer
eom 20 that society, but it does appear to
naef0 be most extraordinary thing that q
so@eey OF that desoribtion, providing SUPER
sAAuatsoh ssssiey, and tie payment Q: GER
" sam Of money at death, should not re-
qSke the certificate Of doctor It is very
extraordinary, and only goes to show that
il sOciet, which Mr.. rTidd Pratt believes
ssibs the very best tbsre are strange things
dose a. asli as in trade societies.
~. Hyghes--Hswe 200. .ipquirc -hssher
gnB Royal STANDARD insist " NOT on q iledi
ca1 account before they admit q man am
assured By q member Of our society who is
ID the room, and who is q member Of the
Royal Standard, that they do not, and that
they do pay supersnnuation-
Chairman-In the second head OF the evil
denc~ you Wish to give to-day, you say that
Mr.. Mault has made incorrect and exsgger-
Ated statements Yes.
VIII you direct us to the question in Mr..
ManlESs evidence 70 which you wish to give
&C answer, and we should follow you better
| will endeavor to correct the statements so
far as have found them to be incorrect.
= lt before making the attempt just desire
o say that with me Il is simply mSit:.ccs- e.
10 sisting this commission to ascertain the
ruth. For Mr.. Mault, personally, have the
n satest respect, and have no reason to feel
aud in fact | never bad a wrong
' lrd with an employer in my life, either as
! workman or ss representative OF work
nkmsn. Therefore, though some Of my
statements may conflict with what has been
siven by Mr.. Mault, ] trust that they vii!
De- regarded Is given 10 a trnth-desiring
,pirik. In the first place, Mr. 4ault endea-
EorB to show what the number OF non-socie-
" men are Id our trade in proportion to So
ciety men, and be states (quoNng from the
census Of 1867 that there are 504, ,l33 car
penters and joiners. Nov ia that number
hr. Mault has included SO 1856 boys under the
age Of 20 years and 1878 men Of the age Of
SO and upwards. He has included, there
fore, rs, 40l persons who ought fairly to be
deducted from th i number woich he gives,
and then, instead OF the number that be
states, there will be lsft l25 ,e75 who are ell
igible to join . trade society; the others are
boys too young and men too old to admit Of
his comparison being q fair one. Now ia
With those Numbers he states
that there are 2l 900 trades unions or l0.S
or the number. do not know where Mr..
Maalt gets his information from, but car
tell you as matter Of fact the the general
union OF carpenters and joirers now num-
bers IL, 900 members; our own, the Anal
gamated Society, numbers $500; and the
Scottish Joiners' Society numbers 5000. In
those three national organizations alone
are a. 800 members, which is 2,aOO more
that Mr.. MauIt says there are in union in
the United Kingdom. During the last SIX
ysars I have been In correspondence with
ssast number OF local societies, all over the
Nsanffy with view to ge. them 10 join our
nsrn body. Therefore, | have knowledge
Oh local societies numbering many thousands
OF members, though cannot state definitely
tks number, bat in London alone there are
no less than 1000 members of local societies
altDgether apart from the local societies in
the country. II add them to the three ma
tional sociesies, I get 5000 against Mr..
Msalrs statement OF 81 900. state these
q ssfsets, because think it Is most unfair
thnt in stating the total number OF men in
tAe trade boys, on the one hand, and men
wish one foot in the grave, on the other,
sh0ald be included, While in stating the mum.
.br OF society men In comparison with them,
a. these associations should be ignored en-
tifsly and what Is more. that even taking
ths three national organisations, $500 of
thsir numbers should be Topped OF BY him
zhich proves his statement to be unreliable
may say further, that In the census where
thsy state the number Of carr 90 tsrs and join
en-, believe that the ship joiners are m
clnded, because there is no return whateser
81 ship joiners; there is . return Of ship
waRhts, but shipwrights are not ship jein-
ers. II that Is 50 then l must bring I'm on
~ other hand the whole Of the Ship Join
~ Association /; and on the Tyne. Thames,
q ~ +Hw<-