New-York tribune., 1867-08-16
THE REFORM BILL.

THE REFORM BILL.
On the 1st of August the House Of Lolds
proceeded in Committee with the consideration OF the
Reform bin On Clause To- relating 10 tho redistribution
of seats Earl Grey moved 10 amend the clause by pro-
vdng that Boroughs Of 1900 inhabitants instead OF
10000 should return only member each Earl Grey
argued that his proposal would make the measure more
complete and that the subject one which the House
Of Lords was better fitted deal with than the House OF
Commons, inasmuch they could consider II more
calmly and disrassionately Twelve more seats would
by this amendent lie l the disposal Of the Government
and II this propositfth were carried be would make
further proposal to group certain Of the smaller horoughs
so that they might return members jointly, and thus
create il more vacancies making % In all Out Of these
he proposed TO allOt three 70 the Inns OF Court
which would secure the return 10 Parliament OF
men Of the highest ominence IN the legal
profession and the remaining 20 he wonld divide among
nlaOu exceeding 10000 Earl Derby, WHO appeared 1of
iondiv cbearsd n rising. He said that il would be ab
srd late IN the session n the LIST OF August Tor thef
lordshps TO entertain propositions so eA,esve so lluha ma
ture crude and so absolutely incomplete, even an the
mind Of the noble Earl who proposed them The Premier
then went 10 show how nconslstent Moud De ior
their Ordshps 70 go beyond the House OF commons III le
matter OF dsfmnChsement Earl Grey ne tald proposed
70 give additional members ana MAKE IEer ser hnlpeT oi
cornered consttueucessO so ta nnueI tg
OF the House IN his absence mnOrliies might oe more
largely represented This he considered inconsistent with
the principles OF the Cohslt'1i anu ueeu a "n IA e ny
been present on the previous tuesday, he would nave
Lord Cairns although that affected at present ieWeon
stituencies. Lord Derby proceeded; >, A.,
i Wi not, however discuss that question 10 does
not arise here except that the noble earl admits that one
OF his objects 10 get certain number oi seats Whereby
In all counties having moro than certain number o1 i
habants and represented chiefly by Conservatives, he
may introduce third member and under pietense OF
protecting the minority secure Liberal representation
Tor portion OF those counties hear, hoaI Although
the noble earl read list OF the Doroughs from whlch he
proposes TO take one mcmhor, lie has not tod ns the
names those which he Intends partially 10 dsfranchse
by grouping Now, when on the lst OF August ne comes
to ten us what lie intends 20 do with the seats he has OBJ
ained he admits that he j. not Possessed Of information
to enable him 10 form an opinion himself but3he ahks
10 take up his Grade, undgested nlconcoeted
scheme and 10 make sense out a that when az present
is nonsense checr and ia ghteT-wbat az least az pres
e scsc Tor 80 gives no idea or sketch OF hscheme
dear hoaI sh0uld Ike 10 know what the noble earl
would have said OF tie Government II the Goyernnent
had forward with his uroosa and had on the lst OF
August suggested 70 me House OF Lords thal ~ oQpo-
son 20 the House ~ Commons they should partially dis
franchise Ia Borounhs and oup 49, ana telling i, m that
when they had agreed 20 that they would inform them es
To the way they intended q dispose Of the seats so OBJ
tanned. think such proposition from the Govern
neHt would have been secuted by yonr Lordshi near
hear] II pnsses Iuy comprehension how the noble LaT
could have supposed that your Lodsps nj th period
he session would consent tOsend down To the House o
Commons an entirely plan OF redistribution. Hear
eyeTVtiing would b. left IN state of confusion ancted
ness and ahsolute chaOs; and yet this IL what = pro-
posed, In the hope perhaps, that out OF tnis e.lso
something may De o'G.. Iest
hear II lie noble Earl had brought forward proposal
81 fbs kind three months ago bacEcd by the abiy he
always displays in such questions, might have said
that Il wu5 fair subject Tor the kpuse TO consider
der that the nobie Earl might lay befdfe the
the details OF his scheme; but when az ths period
OF tho session. and this stage Of the BILL the noble iaI
biucs forward this proposition must say that 10 hp
pear 10 be capable OF only resuthat Of throwing
sEsa sya ng 52 ess hs been ri ne etenent
Of doubtful and difficult question: aud hesitate NOT 20
gtage Of menaoethnt II unhapply 20 crude an amend
mend should be carried, II viii be NY duty az once 70
consult with my colleagues as % what course we oughtto
pursue Cheers, and cry Of near nom Earl Grey ~
The noble Earl cheers say cannot uGdciake on the
part Of tie Government, 10 accept an anedhcht Wch
hppoaf 10 unsettc everything and 10 settle nothing TO
introduce new pHngpe-that Ol osilSnci.sth.ht I,r
the sake of dsfnchs alOne-and 10 cast us blind
fold into struggle for o dhpoal Of seats not forfeited
by anyIm!scoIduct OF those who now hoid then, anu
without any clear and intcgible view OF the quarter
from which you propose TO obtain them" Cheersl.
The Earl OF HaIrOwby and the Duke OF Argyle having
sp6lrcu n favor Of the amendment, and Lord Cairns
against itEarl Russell ard briefly reviewed the his
tory OF tue bill and the delays which had occurred with
IT, owing TO the immaturiiy of the Government scheme
Ha sand that the ls Of August they
told that II they considered tins matter as they
ought 10 consider st. with view 90 It's ua settlement,
the bill might hayo To be Gbandcd altogether This he
thought, was placing tho HoUee of Lords IN very hu.
miatu position. lie most osOus'of settlement
OF the Reform question but this was not the way 70 settle
H. He believed IL would be very serious eyil Indeed 10
the country IL the bill passcdSwithOu general re-
distribution OF seas being finally settled and no room
left for further alterations or agitation Oh the subject
The Lord Chancellor said he thought the Government
were ever likely 10 ger on he subject
The EIs Of Cardisau ad stanhope spoke in favor OF
the GoNciIinet Can-" ma inc EalIs OF hmDeIIy, fOI
tesCue and GIanNiir ior he amendment,
Lord Derby rose TO reply TO the various arguments
which had been addUced and concluded thus: My OBJ
lection to the motion upon the grounds firstly that
think tho disfranohisement Is not called for next that
any scheme Of dsfraneh!sement sAQMd Pe brought for
ward at an earlier period, and also that more defle
scheme ought to have been prop0i0cu' leoItml tnet
he
are II more admit the difficulty OF dealng wlth them
bat call upon the CoyGnnent TO Diiig iofwnta plan
"a scheme founded upon nothing but that there are
certain number OF seats vacant when are 10 DC ned up
1g sSoud Gt p be- carried L m Sy greatly
ebarass The bill at its present stage and at hs period
OF the year aud at this phase Of the BILL II would necets
tate my moving that your lordshps report progress forth
with, IN order that the Government ngh cOhhuer lne
lords that Il an answer 10 the qhesh1h pus 10y y! 6 iS
noble Earl opposite. certainly bhould DC Vey Eau
could consider tho scheme as u az present STANDS as
likely 10 be permanently acceptance cannot sa5 i INA
indulge that anticipation, but as ttle 90 SApct tnI
proposition Ike that Of the noble Earl would prove saus
factory. tIIear hear hHeeyef yon hiy uVl ~ y . Al
that you cannot lay down plans OF redistribution accord
every nagant anomaly oil you can 90 s 10 remove ma
Grant abuses and to extend the representation TO great
Importance and you must proElae III ts IA s DeSt
way you can that H. By taking away part 0i yonr repre-
sentative power io t9 less boever wafy co
sdered II is impossible TO say that reasons may not be
shown for alteration and y IN the course on Sne ensuing
finct pfopOson-for giving greater enfIanohsement,
casnot say that should not be prepared 10 give It con
which, 10 the best Of their Judgment Her Maestys Gov
ernment Thought they might fairy ana rightly submit
for the consideration and adoption OF PaIainnt M mas
been accepted choefuy and readily by the other House
OF Parliament aud trust that at rms Stage no unneecs
sry obstacle Will be thrown in the way Of the passing Of
The House divided and the result was in favor Of the
Government and against the amendment py majority
OF IA In House OF ib Peers present ana NOuug proxies