The New York herald. [volume] (New York [N.Y.]) 1840-1920, 1867-08-05

States lays docn lhese principles With the strong
intercourse and interchange of and fraternza
ton which takes place between the two peoples may
We not expect that 'ohat going in america will De
undated here, and that shall this country TO
the assertion " similar principles and the agitation Of
similar qaesionss Let observe that such opinions
working people-and here l am speaking OF what
KNOWN no spirit Of spoliation know that large
proportion OF the working classes have deep and
working people of religious views-that pro-
perry 70 not distributed as property ought TO
accumulation of property in single hands that
70 take away by legislative enactment which s In
excess with view to besow 1t those who have IN
suncient means, Is not breach Of law, human or
divine. am certain that many entertain these opn-
ions; am certain also that limos Of distress and
dsmagogue or by any person Of power influence
among the people would take possession Of their minds
nna ueePy into tnsr and they mac
70 those principles they would do 90 speedily and en-
phatically But this measure would lead other and
certain evils II Is curious to find honorable gentle.
man In the House OF Commons who, until lately, had
no strong opinion in favor OF the ballot declaring
that he should support by every in his power
because 1t will be necessary now 70 protect mob against
mob, people against people there s longer any
lear OF intimidation from rich manufacturers rich capt.
tasts rich lawyers or rich anybody else; the danger
to the people Is from themselves and they must be
tected from themselves fear that among other things
we shall soon arrive at the institution Of riennia Para
ments, ana with them We shall have all the various
evils OF frequent elections and with frequent changes
memDerS we snail nnal stroke C0nStt-
tuition OF the House OF Commons As counterpose to
all this we have certain amount OF security, OF
IN the shape Of enactments and in the shape of
hopes We are told In the first place. that this Is essen
tally the same bill that first introduced into the
House Of Commons. II Is very true that II you take
and dvest him Of Shoes stockings pantaloons
and shirt he is essentially the same man-(laught
although you have deprived him Of everything which
gave him decency aud protection Qaaghter)
Everything at the present day is swift and gigantic We
haze gigantic rars, gigantic ships gigantic spec,ddtons
gigantic frauds, gigantic crimes, gigantic Reform bill
and much fear that zoe shall hare gigantic doionfdn
After all this there will great social question.
From all which have and heard feel assured that
.aeas VIII arse 10 TINS country ana speedily 100 re-
Want and the House of Plenty. You then will have
new schemes, new agencies, new conditions and new
social questions, and verify believe that those who
have been foremost in urging the naSipg OF this meas
ure will be among the very first denim it, But
l will only say this, that II it.WUo necessary for
the real advancement Of the human race, " it
necessary for the interests of England, | am quite
sure your lordshps would be ready to accede to it, In
stituOns must Jy expanded 10 suit men, and not
cranped to salt institutions But, my lords, should have
thought that statesmen of high minds and patriotic
cordant elements might have been brought into bar
mony so that for time at least all that appears Earring
single movement. But, my lords am prepared to say
that however dark and dismal may be the future OF Eng
land it is our duty to stand by country into what
ever hands the power and the government may pass
England, though not SO great and happy formerly,
will yet be great and happy land Whether monarch-
cal. republican democratic she will be England STILL
And let US beguie our fears by INDUCING imagna-
ion, and BY pcturipg to ourselves what never be
realized-tadt out Of the ashes Of British institutions ci
drlse the great and glorious phor Of conservative de-
mocracy. Cheers and laughter.)
Tho DUKEtor ARGYLE said-Remember, In the FIRST
place, in mitigation OF the terrors held us by my
noble friend Lord Shaftesbury) that precisely the same
predictions were hazarded with respect to the great
measure Of iosZ There Is no more melancnoiy reading
We remember the great intellectual powers which are
sometimes exered in Parliamentary oratory and think
Of the very small value which il has in after times
the contrast is melancholy indeed No. than
one or two speeches In generation, and those
20 in after Ss a
pose Of seeing the arguments which could be
used BY. and the vaccinations which could fright
en-, the most powerful intellects of the time.
will refer my lords, to tho of the late Lord Lynd-
hurst His form Is not long departed from among US,
ringing in I beg those noble lords who ara
impressed by the terrors held them tonight oy my
noble friend to 20 back TO the speeches delivered BY
noble friend has predicted tonight that the House OF
Commons would, as consequence Of tho measure of
1882 become what he described "herce and demo-
cratic assembly, Hear, hear.) What have the
actual resusG Have they corresponded with the predic
tons Have the predictions any relation the existing
facts Has the House OF Commons for many years
been cnmmed with the sons and the brothers, the neph
ews and the cousins Of your ordshps and Il not no
party 70 which have referred having been nsru
mental in bringing about the difficulty from which we
are now suffering, to boast that the House Of Commons
has been the author Of the greatest and most beneceut
means Of legislation HEAR Is true thcn matter
and dsn,ocraic assembly," And yet observe that the
basis Of Lord Lyndhursts arguments rested much
arithmetic as that or my noble friend he Earl OF Car
narvon 1t true that in the existing constituencies
there is largo majority between f10 and eco and that
the whole power OF the country II they acted together
as class would be thrown INTO the hands OF the small
shopocracy That the fact arithmetic would prove
IT, but observe the enormous contrast between the pre-
dictons and the facts That enc comfort which draw
from the experience OF the past Allow TO draw
another from tho experience Of the present There
was no part OF the returns which We procured last year
vh NM tha nuu,ha af
workingmen which II Was then found were the Eegis
ters To the immense surprise Of all parties appeared
that very nearly oneourh Of the existing constituencies
might fall under the category Of workingmen- Though
was SAID wlte certain amount Of truth that con-
Siderable humber OF Keepers Of beershops and other
small shops were classed workingmen, yet believe
there but little error In return, aud that nearly
6neourth OF the constituencies belonged to the working.
government cheering The argument which nov use
but beg your lordships TO observe ths
which he and his eolleaguei made 81
are very glad now 70 be reminded that one
fourth OF the constituencies belong to the working
to mako addition which will give the workngmen
an absolute preponderAnce 10 the constituencies Of the
kingdom" Hear hear.l But was there not wiser VII.
Lard before Parliament You unconscious last year
s.s n3 formed 80 large proportion ,ns, q
ever have acted together as separate class' Iear
hesrD II they had you would long ago have been con
scous Of their existence and Of the hostile element that
truth Is It might be said Of the different classes Of this
country that they have been, aud trust they VIII con-
tnue TO DO ..s,s - 'ss-y~sss.s '-'-S ~
Bound each to each by natural plsty.
Hear, hear) And now, my lords let look at the
theory involved in the matter and for that purpose
shall take the volume published by my noble friend
the cross benches ari Grey the subject Of Para
menarx reform. II has been said thsi obliged
10 adophe conclusions Of noble friend To grsa,
extent that Is true. But beg the House TO remember
thai there is competent 70 draw the con-
illusions which ought 10 DO drawn from given premises
There one In this House with larger experence very
few with greater ability, and almost none With greater
honesty and ssraghtforwardnoss Hear hearl Ny noble
friend has said -" n you touch the franchise there must
be complete revision Of the whole system You must
surround with safeguards against the predomi.
nance Of class" In fact, my noble friend susgested
no than twelve safeguards which were absolutely
necessary will not trouble the House By recountng
them suffice TO say that they involved not only plu-
ray OF votes and multiplication Of social constituencies
such as guilds Of workingmen, but the decentralization
of the House Of Commoua will only say that those
schemes Of my noble friend were purely visionary q
the constitution they intended TO build up They
lie beyond the atmosphere Of present system; u q
impossible that they could succeed Look At the very
small attempt made by the noble earl opposite IN the