The New York herald. [volume] (New York [N.Y.]) 1840-1920, 1866-06-12

| his might tend To crminate him.
The Comsni-sloner "a d To rec how this
would firm link in a chain of o idcncc aga the
with IS II he put trial. II h. said Mr. Roberts
wa pr.-dent IL he were indicted and Il u could DO
shown that Dir. Roberts received I've hundred dolsrs
from Mr.. Gibbons that would tend % crimnate him
u on ih trial Of Mr. Gibbons and otter Fenap the Dis.
rict Attorney proved that Mr. Gibbons kew who the
President OF the v.-.:s organization ..as along with
o.a.r c,. II would DO link In tho chain Of evidence
Mr. C,s5tney-If Mr. Gibbons gave i've hundred dol
lars to Pres ent Roberts, would that mako Ar gibbons
LII i for tho purpose stated in tho
complaint agains,' Mr. Roberts 49,, =. 80.
Mr. Courtney - Wv 'o1 ' ~
comm sr sdnsr =. elbows he knew the President.
thai might be mpor hh hna "a sns ,|sn 70 The
President, knowing him 70 be Pm 'us" ~ s o - sv
orsanizat on, that might be link ,in his objection
Mr. CourtnevIt does no, see,n 10 ma that that the
law at all
The Commissioners allowed the objection. s,w,n.
Q Where Mr. Roberts place OF busineA ua''"s
the last three weeks, II you known ,ha
~ McKcon-Do you mean his place Of business In 80
Mr. coursney-I do not | mean his Eenian place Of
business
witness-I refuse to answer that
Q Where was his place Of business during the last
weekf A. What place Of business His place Of bust.
O. Do you know OF his having any other place Of bus
incss but In the Boweryf A. No. sir
g Have you had business transactions with him a
answer that question for the reason have already
stated
Commissoncr-You Of opinion that the answer TO
that would crmlnate your
Wness-Yes, sir.
Commissioner Il sustain this objection.
Q Have you attended any public meetings Mt which
Mr. Roberts has made specchesS
Mr. McKcon-I object 10 that
Coh.missoncr-It must be answered.
After some remarks from Mr.. McKcon witness sald:
have not attended any meetings at which Mr. Roberts
presided
Q. Have you hoard Mr. Roberts mako speeches outside
OF the circles during three monthss A. Within three
monthss
O. Outside six monthsf A. cannot say as that
Mr.. McKeon-n the District Attorney tres 10 get any
IL there anything an Irishman 1t public in
former pity the District Attorney for his want Of In
formation
wltncss-I raano. say that heard Mr. Roberts making
speeches within six months; that is my best recollec
tion In the matter.
Her, long discussion Of some law points occurred.
@ Have you Mr. Roberts attending the head.
quarters OF the Fen an organization in this citys
Mr. hcKcon-l advise him not TO answer that question
witness-I cannot answer that question, AZ I am sails
fen II would nd 10 crmiaate me-
Have You heard any orders given or issued ny Nj
Roberts 10 regard to the Fenian organization Of which
he Is at the hsadf A. object to answer that question:
as am satisfied It would tend 10 criminatc me.
Commissioners sustain that objection.
Mr. Conrtncy-Your Honor will note my exceptions to
all your rulings on this question.
Commiss 0ner-Ycs.
Q. Do you know Of Mr. Roberts ordering arms and
ammunition from this Fenan organization persons
Broadway? A. never knew Mr. Roberts 10 order arms
10 any persOn.
Q DO you know of any arms or ammunition beng
sent from headquarters to any persons Ia Canada A.
decline to answer that question for the have
Q Do you know either from your own knowledge or
from what have heard from Mr.. Roberts OF his hav
ing fitted out an armed expedition to 20 TO Canadaf
The witness declined 10 answer on the same ground.
HIS objection was sustained by the Commissioner.
have heard ay q
hc WAS at tho head Of an organization 70 At out an expe
dition to make war on tho British government The
Aarli uUlt kATnR
Q Have you heard the defendant say what, IL any,
amount OF money bc had contributed had furnished
CanadaS A. decline answer on the ground that IL
would clearly implcate himself
COMMISSIONER think you must answer that CUES
witness-I mover heard Mr. Roberts say how much DO
had given or would give for an expedition to Canada
@ Did ever hear him say, did he ever tell you,
that he had money In his possession for the purpose OF
invading Canada or for an invasion Of Ireland OF words
In substance 10 that enec1 The witness again declined
10 answer and his objection hold good by tho Court
Ho coat'nued to IL decline to answer who her
or Canada q which Mr Robots wss ii lie heaa have
never seen Mr. Roberts send any commissions 10 olcers
to conduct alleged invasion Of Canada: know bis
@S IL S s.sag
General sweeny and Mr. Roberts together decline
q Was il IN Now York; A Yes, have seen ,hsm in
q what part Of New York; think have me,
q J.M refresh Jour memory and see whether you
have met them anywhere elsef objcrtt to that cues
ton the ground that answering IL would lend to Grim
ipale me.
Commissioners That question, In It's broad form mus,
wituess-I have me, them a hotel
Q Any other place except At . hotelf A. object 10
answer that; II would criminaie mo.
O Do you know BriRadter General Murphy or Colonel
Murphy A. have mot him several tines
Q Have you over sen him and Mr.. Roberts tn con.
O Have YOU General swecny, Colonel Roberts and
Colonel Murphy sther Of you been In eonsui'ai on
a tho headq iariers In Broadway regarding the invasion
@ Have you and those gentlemen have named been
Ia consultation in New York in regard TO sending SOL
dcrs and money into CanadaS No. air; never
Have you received any desi ehes during the last
week, or have you any received by Mr. Roberts,
from the so called army In Canada' A. decline TO an
Commissioner-on the ground that /, would crimIna,e
your
Commissioned sustain the objection.
q Has Mr. Roberts shown you Any Dispatches re-
o Has any person from that organization shown you
any dispatches from the officers OF that army A. Ne,
Mr. KcKcon-T am beginning to til uk that all this
Mr. courtncy-Ycs, I think 80, too, from tn, state
witness IN continuation said-I decline TO answer
whether concerned In send ng men TO Canafa on
tho GROUND that my might crimnate myself, tho
headquarters Of the FenAn brotherhood were a, 700
Mr. Cour,ney-who presided there'
winess-I decline 70 answer that
Court sustained The objection.
TESTIMONY or PATRICK CuFFr.
Patrick Cuie, examined BY Mr. Courtney. He sald -
reside lio ives, fy-thr I'd street. know Mr. W. X.
Roberts; have read In the public papers that he Ia
President OF the Fcnian brotherhood; have had con
veratons with him during the lat three weeks bust
ness matters when going home In hts wagon two
weeks ago got into the wagon with him at his stable
In Great Jones street have recollection that he said
anything In that interview In regard TO getting up
or forming expedt 10 Canada; ] went TO him on
business altogethcr apart from Fenanism, am no,
Fenian some conversation may have aruen way
home, bat cannot say what was; ! think was in
the headquarters the evening vent TO the stable
I have no recollection that ! know any per- IN a.
the headquarters; think remained there about bali
an hour the best Of my recollection did not ask Mr.
Roberts whist he doing - 70 fitting ont an exped-
Canada, anything In that regard, something
may have been said about u, have no recollection "
what passed the subject Of Fenansm he night have
said something tho subjcct, do not AGO Why he
would have addressed himself 70 me, not being mem
Der Of the orEanxsttnn think he did say somesbing
what wss don't know; canno, give you tho words
he used do not sspecs that you Mr. Courtney brought
here ~ public prosecutor, DO not think Ne had
any conversation 81 all In the about Fcniansm.