Daily Ohio statesman. [volume] (Columbus, Ohio) 1855-1870, 1865-01-30

| WneH Cney pTOnlDlLeu every SudCc from III
creasing its interest in slavery by any i'm
portation of the people from abroad who
could increase it, and in what respect this
amendment differs in kind from that in
corporated in the Constitution itself, which
declares to the States that they shall not
swell by one, after the year 1908, the slaves
they then had within their borders? ask
him on principle, not on detail on kind,
not in degree, what the difference is.
Mr.. PENDLEToN. Mr.. Speaker, it is well
for gentlemen to understand exactly the
position which their antagonists occupy be-
fore they go into a discussion Of the kind
suggested by my friend from Iowa; and
would like him to answer the question
whether or not he believes. with the gentle
man from Pennsylvania, Mr.. Thayer, that
the adoption of an amendment OF the Con-
stitution, such as | alluded to, would legal
ly carry the institution of slavery into the
! Northern States.
Mr.. KAssoN. will answer that question
directly the gentleman frankly and clearly
answers mine.
Mr.. PENDLEToN. The gentleman says he
Will answer my question as soon as answer
his. | say to him that was very unfort-
unate if did not make myself clearly un-
derstood in the proposition that | was ar
gning. | was considering the powers
considering only those powers, and | eX-
pressly distinguished between the right of
revolution and the right under which gen.
tlemen claim that they have the power to
make this amendment.
For all purposes of this argument have
only sought to place myself on the Consti-
tuition of the United States, and not to in
woke the authority of any law that is high
er than it. have taken extreme cases.
told my colleague Mr.. Ashley that in
tended to take extreme cases, because it is
only by extreme cases that the sOundness
of principles can be measured.
Mr.. WILSON. | desire to ask the gentle
man from Ohio, Mr.. Pendleton,] in order
to fully understand the theory upon which
he Is conducting this argument, whether
he believes that the States, acting in what
he calls their sovereign capacity, have the
power or the right to make portion of the
people of State slaves?
Mr.. PENDLEToN. That is question
which | will discuss with the gentleman
from Iowa, Mr.. Wilson, whenever it is
pertinent to the subject in hand.
Mr.. WILSON. was going to suggest to
the gentleman that understood his theory
to include that. If | misunderstood him,
then ask his pardon.
Mr.. PENDLEToN. The question which we
are discussing to-day is not the power of
the State government to decide the status
of the people within its boundaries. But
the question is as to the power reserved in
this compact of confederation to its constit-
uents, which are the Statess
Mr.. WILSON. Mr.. Speaker-
MIR. WADsWoRTH. | object to the gen.
tleman from Ohio, Mr.. Pendeton.l yield
ing the floor to any further interruption.
Mr.. PENDLEToN. hope my friend will
not object to any questions until | do.
The SPEAKER. The Chair will cause the
rule to be read.
The Clerk then read the following rule of
the House:
while member is occupying the floor he may
yield 1t TO another for explanation Of the pending
nao@-urn as woil a. fa' rarsnnal evplanation."
The SPEAKER. The rule is very broad
one. The Chair does not see how the gen
tleman from Ohio Mr.. Pendleton] can be
limited in his right to yield the floor to any
member who may desire to ask him ques-
tion.
| Mr.. boutwell,. / understood the gentle
man from Ohio Mr.. Pendletol] to say that
he dissented from the doctrine that the
| power to amend the Constitution was an
unlimited power. wish to say that also
dissent from that doctrine. do not agree
that under the article of the Constitution
authorizing amendments we have the right
| tn amand tha Constitution On ~ to ast, hi;sb
slavery or to invite the King of f. Ds%omsw %
to rule over this countrv. think the i'm,
itation If the 0entInmsn from Ohio fWr
Pemdletonl viii hear with ma n mom'nt
LONGER is toundin the nreamhle ne follo,vss
W.,Lo % ~. II.,,., e..,1
form M ore perfect noD estabsb Cror 70
domestic Tranquility, provide for the common dc.
Tense, promote the general welfare, and the
blessings OF Oery q 0qfsees ,i ana our posterity,
N'o'u"'N "'O '. '4'' o"''''N'"' ..
One provision OF the Constitution Is that
III acertaln way 1t may be amended. When
ever it is amended 1t must be amended, in
order that 1t may have both moral and legal
force, in conformity with the objects for
which the Constitution was framed, as set
forth in the preamble. And an amend
nent whlcn TENDS 10 "a more perfect union,
TO establish justice, TO insure domestic
tranquility, to provide Tor the common de-
tense, TO promote the general welfare, and
to secure the blessings OF liberty to our
selves anu our posterity," is an amendment
which, when made according to the form
prescribed III the constitution, Is both NOR
ally ana legally oinding upon the people Vt
the country. But II IL oe MADE III Violation
0I tnose great ooJects, alChouSn IL may be
legally operative, lt mas no moral force.
ihe argument would De, IN my mind, that |
Ghe amendment we now advocate Is In con-
1ormlty with tnose ooJects' whiiean amend
ment to establish slavery would be contrary |
TO them.
MT. FENDLET0N. lsee that the gentle
man from Massachusetts Mr.. Boutwell,
appreciates very Weii the argument L am