Indiana State sentinel. (Indianapolis, Ind.) 1861-1865, 1862-07-14

Mr.. H~oward-Does the Senator wish an an
swer7
Mr. Cowan-Certainly / do.
Mr.. Howard-The United States of America
in Congress assembled have the right to make
that Government and enforce il.
Mr.. S~umner-Beyond all question.
Mr.. Cowan-Then you must proceed against
them precisely as though you proceeded against
a foreign State in case of conquest, but that is
not under the Constitution.
And this doctrine of the right of conquest is
precisely the doctrine which was held by the Par
lament and King of Great Britain in our Revo-
luton. 1t Is the doctrine which has been held
bg all tyrannies from the time the world began
that when a government is once established there
is no right to change it; but we proclaimed the
right of successful revolution from the first. II
this Government becomes a tyranny, how is it to
be changed, there is some such right OF revOlu
ton somewhere? Mr.. President, i hold that this
war is a war of rescue; for the restoration of
rower to the hands of the loyal people within the
rebellious States; and it is not a war for the sub
~jugation or conquest Of any State. to take it and
hold it as such, and was never so intended. This
Congress solemnly and unanimously resolved that
it was not, and it is too late now to assert the
contrary doctrine. however convenient it may be.
Mr.. Carlile-Mr. President, when the PROPOSE
ton was first introduced into the Senate by the
Senator from Massachusetts, which ! take it gave
rise to this bill, it met with the universal condem-
nation, so far as / I'm advised. of the eutire press
of the country. 1t is true the Senator from
Massachusetts,. with his usual boldness and
frankness, which no one admires more than [ do,
calle'l his proposition By the right name. Hei in
tended by that resolution to assert the power in
Congress to reduce States of this Union to a ter
ritOrial condition; and that is what will be effec-
ted ~ this bill. although it comes TO us under
the name of provisional governments. confess
l am surprised that as good a constitutional law
yer as we know the Senator from New York to
be, should have contented himself with the argu
ment which he has addressed to the Senate in ia.
vor OF this Proposition. He derives the power
from the clause in the Constitution making the
United States the guaIantor for the States to Sc
cure to them a republican form of government.
Perhaps no one in this Senate understands better
than the Senator from New York what is the un-
dert9king of one who guarantees the performance
of act He is not the principal; he does not
make the Government any more than the guar
antee upon a note makes the note. The Govern
ment is formed by the principal. The principal
in this case is the people of the States. They
have formed their government. There is not a
single rebellious State to-day that has not a
State government, and that State government a
republican form of government, AS has been well
said, recognized by the Constitution OF the United
States and all the departments of the Govern
ment created under it. That State governments
for the time being in allegiance by virtue of the re-
bellion. 1t has been unable to execute its Office.
The guarantee that you have given them in the
Constitution of the United States is that YOU will
remove this obstacle to the successful operation
Of that State government. That is your duty
that is your power; nothing more, nothing less.
But the Senatorfrom Michigan puts TO the Sena-
tor from Pennsylvania a question: What will you
do if there are no loyal people in any of these
States; if they are all d~islOyal? ! understand from
the Senator from New York that it is not propos.
ed to exercise the power under this bill until after
the rebellion shall have been suppressed in the
State. Ii there are no loyal people left in the
State after the suppression of the rebellion, / take
it there will be no people in the State TO govern;
for as long as the people are disloyal, the rebellion
continues, and in the case put by the Senator from
Michigan, when the rebellion is suppressed there
are no people left to govern. You will have ex-
terminated them, and it will be a vast wilderness
so far as population is concerned, TO be repeopled,
and when repeopled to have a Government estab
lished by the people inhabiting the limits of the
State.
Mr.. Howard-I will ask my friend from Vir-
ginia whether be expects rebels are to Idle i'm
the last ditch" and leave the country totally de-
populated. or whether there is TO be a residuum of
human beings after the war is Overt
Mr.. Carlile-I have proceeded always upon the
tneOfN tndJ lueTe NOulu De II IeSluuulu, anu u
very large one, a loyal population left in each and
all of these States. 1t is the theory upon which
We have proceeded, and the only Theory that we
can go on in the name of the United Suites and
wage this war. If it is waged under any other
theory, it can only be justified upon the ground
that rebellion has dissolved the Union, and that
this is a war on the part of the non seeded States
against the seeded States Cor the purpose of COM
pelling the seeded States to regard their contract
| xuli,b fbara .forn ,nfD ,,fI tIa M, ra,oI,I .l.o.
they adopted the Constitution of the United States.
1t is the only theory by which the power claimed
for the Congress of the United States by the Sen
atOr from Michigan can be exercised or can be
justified; and then the Senator is u~ntrammeled by
constitutional obligations. Sir, this is a Govern
ment composed of States. 1t is the State Govern
ments that are the support of the Government of
the United States, and when the State Govern
ments cease to exist the United States Govern
ment ceases to exist.
But, sir, the Senator from New York talks of
conquering States. Where does he derive the
power, under the Constitution Of the United
States, to conquer a State and hold it as II con-
quered StaJe, Territory, or Province? Are the
powers of the creature greater than the powers
of the ~creator? Is a Limited Government formed
by these States, with certain specified powers.
greater than the Governments forming it with
powers unlimited, save and alone where they have
~ fAAAN(1 N'Nh INV " ST IA ~ OFfn vi
ganic act? TIL very instant you suppress the
rebellion, the State Governments spring again
into full vigOr and life; and the reason assigned
by the Senator from New York that there may
be a period of time-short,h however, he supposes
it will he. between the suppression of the rebel
lion and the organization Of a State Government,
when this bill is to operate-never can exist. be-
cause State Governments are in existence. Each
one OF these States has its own State Govern
mont In il rendored inafactiva and pauarlaSa
by virtue of the rebellion. The instant you sup
press the rebelliOn-and it is only when the re-
bellion is suppressed that you propose to execute
the powers under this bill-the instant, 60 in
stGnti. that you suppress the rebellion, the Gov
eminent of that State springs into lille and full
vigor again, and goes on operating as il did be-
fore, and as if no rebellion had ever occurred.
But sir, it is too warm to-day tn make anything
like a speech. This Is a proposition that | think
cannot command a majority of this body.
Mr.. Harris-The Senator from Pennsylvania.
for whose ability and judgment | entertain the
most profound respect, has started with a propo-
sition which TO my mind is a political heresy I'M
der our system OF Government. 1t is this, and
his argument is based upon il: that where the peo-
pie of a State are unanimous in repudiating the
Government of the country we have no right as
a General Government to suppress that rebellion;
that it is only where they are divided upon the
question, where some OF the people want to re-
main in the Union and some want to 60 out of
the Union, the United States Government have
authority to hold them in the Union. | regard
that doctrine as a heresy and a most danger
Gus heresy. Sir, how does that Senator know,
how does any Senator know, that there is a 10y
al man IN South Carolinal The presumption
is against it.; and according 10 the doctrine of
the Senator from Pennsylvania, unless it hap
pens that there is some loyal man or woman in