The Manitowoc pilot. [volume] (Manitowoc, Wis.) 1859-1932, 1861-04-12

hr. oouS as. nave no QOuOt the
Senator entertained the idle hope that, by
the bayonets and threats of using it, they
are gong to reduce those states into ODE
dience.
Mr.. Clark. Allow me to correct the
Senator again. | have no such hope, nor
have ever made any such decIaration.-
| have no idea of reducing those States.
Mr.. Douglas. Then | understand he
has no expectation of enforcing the laws
in those States. lie has abandoned all
purpose Of enforcing the laws in them, |
suppose
Mr.. Clark. Not at all, il the Senator
will allow me. l 90 not propose to GO
On with these interruptions in his speech
if they are unpleasant to him. But do
believe that, with conservative, jndicious
administration the tiue is coming. and
not far distant, when the laws will be
obeyed by the whole of the states of the
Union, without the use of the bayonet or
anything Of the kind.
Mr.. Douglas. Still, Mr.. President. no
body can deny the fact that seven states
have seeded Seven states have expelled
the Federal authority from their limits
In seven states you have no human being
recognizing your authority or willing to
enforce your laws.
Mr. Simmons. Will the Senator allow
me to ask him
Mr. Clark. One moment.
Mr.. Douglas. One at time, if You
please. Lauehter.i
Mr.. Clark. | want to inquire of the
Senator from Illinois if the posi- office de
partment does not run its mails in every
one of those states yetl
Mr.. Douglas. Mr.. President, believe
the post office department runs its mails
in the seeding states by the leave and
permission of those states; by their au-
thority. They open your letters; and you
cannot punish the man for opening them
and you do not try it. Knowing YOU
could not. you applied to Congress for au
thority on behalf of the Postmaster Gen
eral, to suspend carving the mails in Ger
tain cases, where they could Tot be sus-
pended without such authority. But here
is the point; the Senator from New
Hampshire is opposed to using military
force to execute the laws in those states
hence he does not propose to enforce any
laws in South Carolina or any of the states
which have seeded, SO long as the people
are against it; but be does intend to en-
force them when the people come back.
think there will not be much difference
hat. Ii h.. II
cannot enforce our laws in a country not
in our possession. We cannot enforce
our laws within a state where we have no
judge to issue writ, no marshal TO serve
It, no district attorney to prosecute it, and
no jury that owes allegiance to this gov
erntnent to try the case.
Mr.. Clark. If the Senator will allow
me once more to interrupt him, will ask
him, suppose Congress gives the President
he power to COLLECT the revenue on ship
board, can it not be done? Could not
the law be enforced as to the revenue?
Mr.. Douglas. | suppose if Congress
should give power to the President to col
lect revenue oh shipboard, he then would
have the power to do it, that is legally ;
but | am talking about the laws as they
are. Now, we have got the admission
that they do not expect to collect any rev.
enue on shipboard until tn law is changed
A great many persons thought otherwise
when | announced it the other day.
Mr.. Clark. desire the Senator not to
take the admission as including anybody
else but me. l simply pu, the question
to him about a policy of which | knew
nothing, and as matter which occurred
TO my own mind.
Mr. Douglas. l only take the admis
sion as to the Senator himself; but as the
admission was so clearly true, | thought
it was no otfense to gentlemen on that
side Of the Chamber to include them in it.
Mr. Clark. |. is not to NE. Ask their
permission as TO them.
MIR. Douglas. | suppose they will take
no otiense Of my attributing the truth to
them, inasmuch as they have told the
country they were going to collect the
revenue the moment Mr.. Lincoln was in
augurated. They were going to find oat
whether we had government or not
the collection of the revenue was to be
the test The President said he was going
to collect the revenue to the extent OF the
powers confded to him. Yes, they all
said, Now, that means that the revenue
is going to be collected on shipboard."
rose, and told them, mo, that is not
wha. Mr.. Lincoln means. Mr.. Lincoln is
a lawyer; he knows that be cannot col
lect revenue, except in the eases and pla
ces where the law permits him; and Mr.
Lincoln is not going to violate the law O,
his oath" They said, on that side of the
| chamber. it was very impertinent for me
to pretend to interpret Mr. Lincoln's pol
icy, when | said he did not intend to per
jure himself. | had done it, they said, un
asked, uuinvited, and they did not recog
nze my leadership at all !; but now th,
Senator from New Hampshire is convinc
ed that revenue is not to be collected OF
shipboard until Congress gives the power
Mr.. Clark Mr.. President, / do no
suppose the Senator means to be under
stood, though | do not know whether h
does or not, that anybody on this side O
the chamber, any Senator here, said tha,
immediatel" upon Mr. Lincoin's inaugu
ration, we were going to collect the reve
nue. on shipboard. Does the Senate
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