Lewistown gazette. [volume] (Lewistown, Pa.) 1843-1944, 1857-12-17
Mr.. Bigler-Where did You get thatf

Z
Trumbull) Yesterday read from speech made
by Mr.. Buchanan twenty years ago, to show
| that a Legislature had no right to create a
Convention to supersede the Territorial Gov
ernment, and to attempt it would be gross
usurpation. The Democratic party has held
/ that doctrine ever since, and asserted it year
ago by endorsing his Mr.. Douglas'sl report
! from the Committee on Territories. Three
hundred thousand copies were circulated as a
/ party document, and he himself paid for a
hundred Thousand of them. Laughter,
| Mr.. Bigler entered his protest and claimed
the statute of limitation. lie could not con-
sent that Mr.. Douglas should hold the Presi-
dent responsible for principles laid down
| twenty years ago under entirely different cir
cumstances. 1t is not half SO long since Mr..
| Douglas declared the Missouri line the best
compromise. and in l848 he proposed to ex-
tend it to the Pacific Ocean, yet he repealed
! the whole of it.
Mr.. Douglas denied the right of Mr. Bigler
to offer statute of limitations. None but
the authorized Attorney of the party can thus
interfere. AS the Senator has denied his
authority to speak for the President he can
not file that plea. Mr.. Douglas approved of
| the statute of limitations. He needed one
very much himself He had never boasted
that he had never changed his opinions. He
felt every year little wiser than the year
! before. Has the President ever withdrawn
| that opinion?
! lie denied the right to plead statute of
limitations against the Cincinnati Convention
until the Charleston Convention met He
stood now where he stood last year because
! he believed he was right Ii was true he
voted for the Toumbs bill, and was ready to
vote for it again. BY doing SO there would
be no quarrel. 1t would not do to taunt him
with once voting for measure he would not
vote for now.
Mr.. Bigler said he had not taunted the
Senator, who had complained that great
wrong was done by not submitting the entire
constitution to the people, when he had voted
to put State Constitution into operation
without submitting any part to the people
Mr.. Douglas replied that his explanation
was IN the language of the President, who
IN his instructions to Governor Walker took
1t for granted that the constitution was to be
submitted to the people. Mr. Toombs' bill
being silent ON that subject, he took it for
! granted that the constitution would be sub
mltted to the people. If the President was
! right in taking that ground, why was not he
! (Douglas) right?
! Mr.. Bigler said he did not intend to hold
the Senator from Illinois to anything which
+ did not appear on the journals At a private
meeting, before Mr.. Toombs' bill was intro
I duced, 1t was held that in view of all the diff
hcnitIes surrounding the question, it would
I be better that no provision to submit the con-
stitutInn to the people should be inserted in
the bill. And it was his understanding that
/ the Convention which the bib proposed would
make a constitution, and send it to Congress-
without submitting it to the people.
Alr. Douglas, in reply. said be would not,
1 like the Senator from, Pennsy ylvania, insinuate
| what he would not openly declare If be was
/ present at the meeting referred TO, and sane
toned such a doctrine, let hin, say So
/ Mr.. Bigler said if he was constantly at
fault, 1t was painful indeed. Perhaps he had
wrongfuIly spoken on the subject lie had
told the Senator he did not intend to reflect
upon him.
Mr.. Douglas remarked that he would release
Mr.. Bigler from secresy, and asked him
+ whether he knew that he (Douglas) had eth
er publicly TOR privately agreed that the con-
stituton should be adopted without consulting
the people.
Mr.. Bigler stated what his distinct recollec
ton was. lie remembered very distinctly
/ that the subject was discussed in the house of
! the Senator from Illinois. lie was not sure
! in which it was argued that under all the cir
cumstances, there was not to be a proyiso in
Mr. ToombS' bill requiring the constitution
to be submitted.
Mr. Douglas remarked, that the point he
made was, that when the bill was silent on
that subject it was understood, as q matter of
course, that the Constitution was to be sub
mltted. That he was party to force on the
people Constitution, was not true.
Mr.. Bgler explained that he had called Mr.
Douglass attention 10 his course on Mr..
Toombs's bill, because it was in derogation Of
his doctrine laid down to day. When the
Senator from Illinois introduced his prepara-
tory bill for Minnesota. he provided that
Constitution should be submitted If the in
ference was that Constitution would be sub
mitted when such bill is silent, why was the
clause inserted in the Minnesota bill2 lie
did not impugn the Senator's patriotism or
honorable motives, or courage. lie had not
q more constant admirer than himself. and
one who Uftener defended him.
Mr.. Hale wanted to know some of the yery
peculiar circumstances which rendered the
fair exercise of the elective franchise extreme
ly difficult Laughter.
Mr.. Bigler said that no one had said more
on this subject than Mr.. Hale, and of the Vi
olence used in keeping the Free State people
from the polls. He Mr. Bigler) was inter.
ested in getting Kansas into the Union.
Mr.. Douglas said that in order to prevent
wrong impressions, he would ask Mr.. Bigler
whether he meant to be understood as saying
that he (Douglasl, in his own house, or else,
where, had expressed himself in favor of
Constitution, without being submitted to the
people?
Mr.. Bigler-I made no such allegation
Mr.. Douglas-You left it to be inferred, I
will not allow it to be inferred that | so de-
clarcd in my own mouse. If did not, aequit
me of it.
Mr.. Bigler-I repeat that have no recol-
lection of the Senator participating in the
debate alluded to-
Mr.. Douglas-If had nothing to do with
it, | don't know what my house had to do