The New York herald. [volume] (New York [N.Y.]) 1840-1920, 1850-07-02
The Defeat o. ,he Rms,l.n Ministry.

The Defeat 90 tf,r Rns,ilsh Ministry.
PIE DEBATE IN TliE .'u-E oP lords ON THE GREEK
eyESrIuH.
On Monday nigh., gLe l7th lust, the discussion
on Lord Stahiey's iaouoA 10 the Greek question,
drew together aa unusually large attendance OF
Peers. The steps ci h. throne, the space behind
the bar, the galleries ior strangers and for the men,
bers of the other house, were al crowded, aud
there were also wdng Perfesses present IN the por-
ton of the house a-sigurd 10 them. Seldom on
any similar occasion Dds the Upper Chamber pre-
sented more aninis,ed and striking appearance
Before the debate commenced Lord Brougham
created some anuse Went by movng that the stand
inc orders OF the Houre ~ enforced with reference
10 the ChevaiieT BuusSn, who Was then occupy
ing the room of Two ladies 10 the Peeresses' gal
lery. His exceileUCy srrnSd disposed TO retain mis-
seat, but the Usher of the Black Rod shortly APP
peaTed al the side rntrdCcc, and Lord Brougham's
object was accomplish-d. After the stir which this
incident excited had subsidized,
Lord STANLEI SAID, Ir wa far from his wish TO
drag the House through the papers lying on its ia
BILE, but he could nforu them that he had risen
with regret and pain 20 the p'oi5ality of folly, the
lavish expenditure # misplaced ingenuity which
they disclosed The course which her majesty's
government had pursued calculated to en-
danger the peaceful relations of this country with
the other great powers. He hoped and trusted
no such result wouid follow hat he would ask,
whether the conduct of the government had
not been characterised oy unnecessary rashness
and whether the claims which had been compu-
sorily urged upon The Creek government had
not been to large extent unjust He re-
minded the house that Greece was a kingdom
of not more than II years standing, and that
Its independence was Guaranteed by England,
France, and Russia For many years past, the
representatives of these three great powers APP
peared to have been intent, not on strengthening the
authority of the Greek monarchy, but on intriguing
TO strengthen their own influence IN the government
of that country. ~ iale, French influence had
been in the ascendant, and, in consequence, 1t
was believed by our representative at Athens, that
the government was acting In compliance with
French Interest aud IN hostility to that of this
country. The greater portion of the claims put
forward, and III which their iordships had heard
50 much, Were behalf of persons who could
never be considered entitled TO An interference such
as that undertaken on their behalf. In the of
sStelliO .Sumacbi redress was demanded for haviNg
tortured British subject, though it Afterwards
turned out, on lsga! inquiry, that torture had
ever been inflicted. The noble lord then passed
in review the case OF the Fantome and that of the
lonian government, and declared that il Was diff
cult 10 argue such claims for compensation those
against Greece IN a satisfactory manner, wearing,
as they did, NOR. thr appearance of a tradesmen's
IN than a national grievance. He must how
ever, express his Indignation that out of such in
significant questions should arise the risk of
European war. The modest demand made by
Mr.. Finlay, for piece of land which cost him 300
drachmas, was 0,000 drlchmas, or El 800; yet,
while the British government were laying papers,
with reference To this demand the table of their
Lordships' House, il Was aware that Mr.. Fnay's
claim had been settled by arbitration with his con-
sent. The noble lord described such conduct as q
breach'of faith on the part of the government and
famperng with their lordshps' confidence. With
regard TO the claims of M Pacihco, he rdiculed,
amidst the laughter of the House, the accuracy
with which the furniture of M. Pacfco's house
had been specified. lie pointed out the extraord-
nary absurdiiy of the British government insisting
on the payment Of f2l 900, for alleged claims
against Portugal, which the government of that
country had declared not 10 be worth one farthing
and remarked, in indignant TERMS that the British
government had pressed for the payment of all its
demands on Greece IN "a, and had sat its fleet
to enforce that payment within twenty-four hours
He then described the course which the questions
thus raised between this country and Greece had
followed, and how the extent of M. Pacifco's
claims had interfered with Il settlement. He bore
testimony TO the noble and digniied conduct of the
Greek government, who were unable to resist, and
whose sutierings had excited the sympathy of
Europe. Mr.. Wyse and Admiral Parker had only
acted according te their instructions, and he was
sure that the latter would rather have been en-
gagged in the most deadly contest of an honorable
warfare, than in such Transactions The noble lord,
in eloquent terms, contrdsted the tone OF the En-
peror of Russia's letter on the Greek question, to
his representative IN this country, with that which
Lord Palmersiou had thought tit to adopt to the
defenceless government at Greece. He reminded
the House that France, though she desired TO
pursue a NEST friendly course ef conduct towards
England, had been alIendled by the treatment
which she had received. The question of the
island of Saplenza was one on which the British
government had no night TO act independently OF
the other protecting powers; and now that Russia
had protested on the subject he supposed the claim
which had been made would be Withdrawn. The
order TO take forcbe sion Of the island, how
ever, had not been rescinded, and had only not
been executed, because Admiral Parker and Mr..
Wyse had had more discretion than Lord Pamers-
ton. lie thought that he had made out the points
stated in his motion and If they had been guilty
OF njustice-if they had made extravagant de-
mands-if they had oppressed the weak and dis
gusted the stfoug-It he came that House to show
that the government of England was not England.
In strain Of the highest eloquence, he called on
the House to yindcate the authority of great
nation, prostituted by attempt TO enforce unjust
demands upon a weak and defenceless State.
The MARQUIS or LANSDowSE, in reply, acknow-
lodged that the Government was responsible Tor the
fransac tons which the noble lord had brought UNI
der review, but IN the House OF Commons, Lord
Palmerston had been subjected to no attacks upon
the matter in question:; aud he hopedt TO satisfy their
lordships that the speech which Lord Stanley had
made, was indebted much more TO the el0guence OF
the speaker than 10 IT. intrinsic merits lie dispu-
ted entirely the soundnsss OF the resolution before
the House, in point OF international law. lie
pointed that injuries To the persons and properties
of British subjects abroad had always been held to
justify peremFlory demand Tor redress, and that
without reference to whether the government OF
the country where the inuries.were sustained, was
m absolute monarchy, constitutional monarchy,
Ora republic Greece, as the House had oeen told,
was an independent government, and II she were
20, she must accept the responsibilities aswe the
privileges of that porlfion. lie quoted a number OF
instances where foreign nations, whose subjects
had been treated with ndignity, had enforced re-
dress in equally decisive manner in the case
before the House; aud he closed has last by estion-
fng that at the present moment american ships Of
bds ucre on th,U ray Ia Lpbon 10 support Pcrerp-
tory dsr,ords f0r redress made By the government Of
the United States that of Portugal Coming TO
the main point of the noble lords speech-he ex-
pressed his regret that Lord Stanley had con-
dcscended 20 attack VI. Pachco's character.
Whatever that character might be, il had nothing
whatever 20 do with the question. Mr.. Wilkes
might have been a gamhl.r, sand cheated at play,
yet the principles which were associated with
his name not compromised thereby.
In the same way, Lord Stowell had pronounced
many splendid decisions on points OF law, evolving
great and important truths, though the people TO
whom his judgments referred many of them
slave dealers, piratoe. aud aduterers. The noble
lord had referred to Mr. finlays case, but through
the influence ct the Greek Government the arbitra-
tors had never been allowed to meet and the wri-
tiers on International law declared that delay was
as bad n DENIAL 1T justice. Again, in the case Of