The Madisonian. [volume] (Washington City [i.e. Washington, D.C.]) 1837-1845, 1839-12-12


Of the Government organ. Now, though there
might be some gentlemen here, on both sides, pre-,
pared 10 go all lengths IN party view YET ne haa
reason 10 beiieve thai there was, In tins House,
large body OF what he would call Conservatives,
belonging 10 both parties. who would not sacrifice
the principals OF the Consinio 10 suit tranSiiory
purpose. Whether these afiidavits had been legally
taken not, they might be read as part OF speech
Nay The gentleman from Ohio might, " he pleased,
read that exposition OF reasons which had been con-
cocled tor the Clerk; or any thing else he might
think TO have favorable bearing on bis side Of The
question Bui on the question OF present righl 70
seats here, the regular certificates produced ny me
gentlemen from New Jersey were not prtma faets
evidence msrely-ihey were conclusive evidence,
and Of full binding force the hnal right, alter an 70
yestigation OF the election, was another analr Bui
The argument OF the gentleman from New York OPP
posile (Mr. Vanderpoel) went 10 disregard all law.
The gentleman relied much the replies OF the
gentleman from New Jersey (Mr, Randolph) to his
caiechism Now, the gentleman from New Jersey
might make what confessions he pleased-he con-
fessed Tor himself alone. Mr.. Z. had not been able
10 hear word OF what the gentleman did say but,
whatever il was, IL did not bind the Hou,e-lhey
were not TO be influenced BY u as testimony The
gentleman from New York could foresee very plain
y that The difficulties would arise the next ques-
on 10 be taken and he wanted 10 get confessions IN
part 10 those difficulties bur he wanted II IN
part only, The confession, SO far as IL related 10 the
total of The bliloibox he WINS willing 10 get but not
as 10 the Illegally of large portion Of the yotes.-
The gentleman would go behind the returns SO lar
to count the votes, but mol SO far as 10 examine
into their illegality.
The only mode Of ascerlanng the prelin mary
question as - The occupation Of seat was founded
on the practice Of sixty years; the Clerk had now,
for the first time, departed from the practice which
had prevailed from the foundation OF the Govern
ment but the question at last com. back To the
House. The gentlemen bearing the Governors Ger.
Ii6cate had produced the same evidence Of their
right which MIR. E. had Of his own, neither had any
member there better; but the gentlemen from New
York insisted on walking over IL, and over all law,
and going To the ballot boxes
Mr.. VANDERPoEL said that his position had been
that the Governor and the county clerks were only
retaining officers and had right TO suppress bal
lots TO suit themselves
MIR. EveRgrr resumed The clerks were return
ing officers in their State; but who was the re-
lurning officer Of the State 10 this house, Were
the county clerks Who was IL, according to the
Constitution and the laws, who alone could make the
return heIel Mr.. Z. appealed 10 the laws Of New
Jersey TO answer, and they declared that II was the
Governor. But if the gentleman insisted so strongly
going TO the People " let him 60 10 The People
and see what he would find. There was not ques-
lion with which The People were better acquainted
Sach at least, was the case in the New England
States. In Vermont the. constables were made the
returning officers and whoever came 10 the Legis-
laure, bringing the constables' return took his seat
as OF right, and the final question settled alter
wards. Nothing was better understood The gen
tleman went to the People in vain. Mr. L. could tell
him what The People would say; they would say 10
The gentleman, You have attempted, for the first
time in sixty years, 10 break down the settled course
of the law-you have, 10 serve an imaginary party
purpose gone in The very face Of the Constitution !;
but You can gain nothing By ii You would have lost
no power BY letting things take their proper course,
aud therefore your outrage is wanton one"
Ii men are not entitled to seat and you prove it,
you have the power oil turning them out and when
that question comes up no member who is Interested
personally in its decision will be permitted to vote
upon it. There was, therefore, no Just excuse be-
And thpr.
should hnally turn out that, owing TO false returns
and the admission OF members not rghlully entitled
10 seat, the majority had been deirauded Of their
right 10 appoint their own presiding officer MIR E.
would go for reorganization OF the House Why
had not the Clerk proceeded in the undertaking track
which had been pursued by all his predecessors Z
The People would say thai gentlemen for mere
party purposes had kept back the organization of the
House for a week.
Mr. K. believed there was little doubt that the gen.
tIemen bearing the regular commission from the Co
vernon OF New Jersey had not only pima fucte evil
dence OF right to sit now, but would, investigation,
be proved TO have the ultimate right to remain
IN their seats, as elected by majority of the people
But the question: aud the only practical question now,
was Shall the State Of New Jersey be represented IF
these gentlemen not admitted sit, none other
had better proof to show. and then the State could
be represented all There was no petty question as
10 the per diem of gentlemen, because members
| regularly commissioned there doubt OF their
right TO pay. They possessed all the rights which be-
ongcd any other member that floor, aud could not
/ legally be deprived OF them ...s..... w..
| He again insisted that there was nothing now pend
ing but the question, Shall the State Of Ne,c Jersey be
| represented heref This the States question.
Whether or b should represent her was subsequent
matter, aud OF far less consequence. The question then
would be, Who had the most legal votes I The qnes-
ton no,p " as Who has the legal return The gentle
man from New York (Mr. Vanderpoe) was wiling to
60 part of the way into the first question: but all the
way. He was for setting aside the returns OF officers
appointed by law, and yet he would go into the
question whether those who had voted were aliens or
| not. None could help seeing he would say what
the motive OF this was, but what the effect would be-
The argument could not have been addressed to the
sound judgment of the house. Mr. E. had that conf
dence both their judgment and integrity that he
ready 10 leave the question in their hands Was this
question to be determined by a mere party vote He
trusted not Nor did he believe that there had been an
| hour since the commencement Of the session when
there not orty Of thirty in favor OF sustaining
the gentlemen who had the legal certificate Of their
State. Mr.. E. concluded with the expression OF hope
that all objection to the reading of papers would be
withdrawn, and that the gentleman from Ohio would
| have care blanche to read any thing he liked.
| number Of gentlemen now endeavored TO get the
1oor and confusion took place in the struggle.
| Mr.. BLACK of Georgia, said that his colleague by
his side (Mr Colgu) had risen repeatedly TO address
the Chair, but in vain while others, who had repeat
edy spoken, permitted to speak.
| MANY voices called TO order,
! Mr.. w COST JOHNSON, Of Md, was proceeding
to speak, when
| MI BLACK again, and with some warmth, appealed
to the Chair behalf Of his colleague, and referred
the rule Of order which declares that gentleman shall
be permitted to speak more than on the ques
ton withou, leave Of the house The gentleman from
Mary land had spoken, he believed, twenty times,
Mr. JOHNSON denied this to be correct, and insisted
on his right to the floor Does the gentleman deny my
possession Of the floor
Mr. BLACK do not but insist
Mr. JOHNSON Then call the gentleman to order.
l.oud cries of " Order, order ~
AZ InrINs hn t,rnsn Iis-