The Madisonian. [volume] (Washington City [i.e. Washington, D.C.]) 1837-1845, 1839-12-12

the tnlerrugatory at DIS cOilcdSur.
The question" ON The point OF order b.ing here
The CHAIR said he understo d the gentleman
from Kentucky Mr.. Graye>l 10 have Withdrawn Il.
In answer TO IhiS, Mir GRAVES said that, il the
gentleman from OHIO Vi. nuncanl chose 70 pro-
coed in his remarks, he.[ Mr. q would not occupy
the time Of the House with ques ions OF order; but
he commended that the gen leman could not yield the
floor Professionally reserving his right 10 address the
House. Perceiving, however, as he thought, that
the gentleman was about 10 speak, he Mr.. G had
Withdrawn his point OF order.
Mr. JENIFER having thea submitted his PROPOSE
tion ia writing, TO The purpon above givrn)-
MIR yANDERPoEL said he should vo:e against
the motion, because il went on the presumption that
The gentleman from New Jersey had not The same
right 10 vote as others. In the present slate OF III.
case, Mr.; v. commended that The gentleman had as
much right 10 woe as others.
Mr.. WISE said that this was the b.St form in
which the question could be presented He wJnld
now give notice thai, II Mr. Dickerson attempted 10
address the House, he Mr.. w should iaquire for
his credentials That would present the question al
once. As personal friend aud as an act Of cour.
tesy, MIR. w. would extend 10 thai gentleman, and
would ask for him, every considerations bat when
the gentleman came there claiming seat as mem
Der OF the House Mr., w. bad no courtesy 10 extend
10 him beyond that Of fulfilling the requirements OF
the law. He thereiore asked The gentleman 10 pro-
duce !his certihcate-hS credentials; and until he
did So and thus satisfied him that h. had right 10
speak Mr.. w. could NOT consent to hear him This
was good mode Of meeting the question as any
other and the House might as well decide il in this
form.
Mr. DICKERSON being again abou, to speak
Mr. w. Z. JOHNSON rose to order He again in
sisted either that the gentleman from Ohio should pro-
ceed that he should take his seat according 10 the
rule. lie had right TO be standing ia the aisle,
nopoizing all the time Of The House 10 himself
Mr. PROFIT rose, but intercepted by cries
for order.
The CHAIR. Does the gentleman from Ohio yield
the hoori H..
Zones of mo no :" "D5n't yield,"l
Mr. DUNCAN replied in The negative.
The CHAIR said that, not having yielded the floor,
the gentleman entitled 10 proceed.
MIR DUNCAN then proceeded 10 address the House
at length on the various matters involved IN this cuntro
versy He had he SAID, since the members had
sembed here felt great interest in the progress made
by this body, for by other could he call II
He bad not ielt the alarm which gentlemen had
expressed in regard TO public Interpretations. He well
knew that the motives which actuated hun accorded
with the views OF the People Of the United States, -
He knew that he maintaining here principle
which they would maintain. and that was the purity Of
the elective franchise He knew he should be sustained
In the course he was taking here. ."..
Again. He could not feel the alarm nf public dis
appreciation which some gentlemen felt This
question which must be decided, and it mattercd
whether it was decided now hereafter.
What was the history Of this matter! Mr. d. then
proceeded into diailed history Of the proceedings Of
the House up to the time Of the Of Mr. Randolph
having been called He stated distinctly that he had
himself objected to the Clerk calling The name Of the
next gentleman the roll He knew not whether he
had spoken loud enough TO be heard, but he had OBJ
Jected. He did not know whether the Clerk or
not interrupted by his objections alone He yIndi
Gated the course taken by the Clerk as the only one
consistent with his oath aud duty, asserting, the
time that in adopting that course, the Clerk had acted
not under the dication of his (he Democratc) parly
but under his conscientious conviction of his duty
ted Mr. \ ! pa Saii ~, has
tlemen had the evidence Of the certificate OF the CO.
yernor-that twas the only eviaenceyes that is
pfina tacie evidence The whole Argument put him
in mind OF liltle book he had once read on logic He
had never studied ii; bu there were logicans here ;
and although he had hOught nothing Of that book for
long time, yet he heardgentemen of learning and
aSuteness arguing for four or five days and alvan-
cling no other principle of logic but what that book
contained; as, tor instance, 'Genenren wear boots
A wears boots, therefore b is a gentleman u
Ladies wear corsets: Miss wears cor>ets there
fore Mss A is lady" According to this logic,
that gentleman wore boots was prima tacie evil
dence that he was gentleman. Now he held that
ii was not prtma tacie evidence He knew many
persons who wore boots who were not gentlemen !:
and, indeed so very general itthat 10 wear boots
was not even prtma facis evidence THAI man was
gentleman. he Knew many women and girls who
wore corses who were not ladies'. General laugh
ter And, indeed, very general was that fact
that wearing corSets was not even pftma lqcie evil
dence OF lady. So it was with members OF Con
7'css' Iic hheW, ana had known, pretended mem
berS OF Congress who were not members having the
broad seal and certificate" which did not amount
10 PTL6ea jacte evidence that they were MEMBERS
49, commented at length in an roncal strain on
tMvlItues attached 70 the great seal
he would then proceed (he said) to show that the
&HFk had the most conclusive evidence in his pos
session that the names he had read were not mem.
b'rs 81 The 18th Congress, and that therefore, he
was bound by proper respect for his oath and his
duly not 10 enrol them such.
l ne CLERK then read certain d0cume tba
tihcate OF The Secretary of State $50 often referred
10 in the course OF the weeks proceedings lists of
the polls of Melville and South Ainboy &c, 10.
sether with other Statements documents and ali la.
wits,
The CLERK bsng still in the process of reading
the ahidavits--
Mr.. HALSTED submitted to the Chair whether
II was competent for a gentleman 10 have read as a
part OF his speech, afidavts taken er pQrtg without
notice given, and which were not according to law
II 50, said Mr.. III. have ahidavits taken pDon mo-
ee gre" 70 hese gentlemen, pointing out the frauds
that have been practised and the Illegal votes that
have been given, for the reading OF which we vii!
call.
Mr.. DUNCAN said the gentleman might ask for
the reading, if he pleased.
The CHAIR said that the gentleman had a rich,
to have the papers read if no objection was made
II objection was made, vote OF the House must be
taken.
Mr.. DUNCAN expressed the hope that the read
ing would not be interrupted
The Clerk again proceeded in, but had not gone
through with the reading OF the dispositions, when
Mr.. WHITE, of Kentucky, rose to point of
order He would inquire whether these dispositions
were taken upon due notice given, and in contorni-
" with the law Of New Jerseyl
The CHAIR was understood to say that all he
knew OF the papers that the gentleman from
OHIO had introduced them as a part of his speech.
Mr.. WHITE objected TO the further reading OF
theiestimony; and discussion of very desuliory
character arose on the point of order: and in which
Messrs' White, OF Kentucky, Craig, Duncan, r.
Garland, Tillinghast, Vanderpoel, Randolph, and
Bynum participated.
The CHAIR read the rule providing tina, when
objection was made 10 the reading OF a paper, the