Richmond enquirer. [volume] (Richmond, Va.) 1815-1867, 1829-12-10

tenant Governor, and two Councillors Cio shall per-
form the duties, and In all other respects hold the
same relation to the Governor as the present Council
of State.
"Ths said Councillors shall be elected by the Gen.
eral Assembly and shall continue in office three years,
bu, m,y be re-. Iected IRON 10 term All vacancies
a-oned by death, resignation, removal from the
Commonwe"th, or other disability, shall be supplied by
'h- General A.ssmbly.
T. Two Of The lad Council shall form a quorum, and
in case OF equal division of the Council the Governor
shall have the casting votc."l
Mr.. WILSON demanded a division of the question
on striking out aud Inserting; but withdrew the motion
at the request OF
Mr.. FIrzHUcH. who wished Mr.. Upsuvn to have
an opportunity OF explaining AMI advocating the amend
men he had offered; but who gave notice that II il
adopted, he (Nr. F.) should move to amend il ia
nanner which he xplsned.
Mr.. UPsHUR then went into an cxp ,nation, at some
length, OF the amendment, reinforcing the arguments
which he and others had advanced this subject when
Il las, debated and the substance of which
already reported When MIR. Nicholas proposition for
hCouncil OF four was considered, the chief obj ctio
II was, that the boiy numerous than neces-
sary bis amendment met and removed that objection
All seemed in favour Of Council Of sort, and The
question waJ whether IL to consist OF per,ons elect
ed specifically TO that Office and duty, OF those who
discharged other duties under the Government. He
briefly his against the latter and in
OF the former but forbore 10 press them, the sub.
ject had been already fully discussed. He concluded
by expressing it as the object of his amendments pre-
serve the organization OF the Council it stood.
but to reduce tn. expense by reducing the number OF
it, numbers
Mr.. MERCER suggested objection to Mr.. Up
sHURs scheme; as the advice Of the Council
nain as at present, obligatory the Governor, and "a
II was to consist OF Lieutenant Cover and two
Councillors, any two Of whom were constitute quo
rum, il they were TO advise him against his judg-
ment oil what was right he must comply: and thus il
might happen thu, Lieutenant Governor and one Coun-
cilor, Constituting majority OF the Counc) nigh,
rule the Governor and the other Councillor because the
Governor was TO have none but casting vote. Here
then, the Governor and OF hi. Council would be
technically and in effect MINORITY
Mr.. LEIGH replied, that the Governor Is not hound
to 10 whatever the Council advise lin dol but is only
restrained from doing what they oppose.
| MIR. MERCER admitted the distinction, hut insisted
that the eff ct would still he he had stated; and add
ed that the Lieut. Governor would be the most unfit
person in the world adviser Of the Governor, as
he nigh, have been his rival. He preferred the plan
of MIR. Fiizhugh.
| Mr.. WILSON now renewed hi, demand for diyi
sion Of the question: striking and inserting: il
was divided accordingly: and the question being on
| striking cut,
| Mr.. ScorT expressed his wish TO have the Council
organized as Mr.. UPsHun proposed, but without Civ
ing the advice OF Council bin''ng authority, in any
respect, upon the Governor. He gave notice that il
the motion to strike -ded, and Mr. UPsHuR's
am- niment should then be inserted, he should move
so TO amcn az TO produce the effect he had me ton
ed.
| Mr.. RANDOLPH suggested that the Resolution pro-
posed to be stricken out conaiNed, az now amended
two distinct poposons-the first he wished to retain
the second to stike out according the best of his
knowledge and belief, il English
The CHAIR decided that the question of striking
out could not he so sub-livied, but the gentleman
would obtain his object by moving TO insert one
the clauses. il in come xion with other words.
The question on striking out. then put and de-
cided in the affirmative, ayes 47-noes 40
| (Mr Madison aud Mr. Marshall, aye }
So the Committee struck the third r .soluon az
amended.
And the question now being put on Inserting Mr.
| UPsHURs proposition az a substitute,
Mr. Scorr moved 10 amend il by striking from |, III
word. "who shall perform the duties as the
sent Council" his object being to require the Cover
n the viz nf l.
all matters Except those Of his military function as
commander in chief hut not to bind him by IT,
Mr.. RANDOLPH opposed the motion, on the ground
that what the present duties of the Council were was
well known and established: but what The new duties
| to no assigned them were, could not be known ill
those duties had been expressly defned and no man
could tell whether the Government would remain in
existence unit, then. He thought they had had ex-
perence enough induce them never to depart from
the law adudged and established He was for what
was settled and certain and not for getting at ipnof
per fgnotius. fthey said, that the duties of the Coun
Gil were to be the same as they now were, the
ing was known and understood; hut if these words
were TO he stricken out, the committee would imrnr-
datelv be al sea- and long of aljudged deci-
sions would he rendered of no value.
| Mr.. BRoDNAx suggested that the Governor was
now not compelled 10 follow the advice Of Council
and would he still les, if their number should be re-
duced from 8 TO 2.
Mr.. Scorr explained his object to be- 10 leave the
Governor ree and to the uncertainty of meaning it
would he no greater than at present.
| The question was now taken on Mr. ScoTr's amend
| men, TO Mr.. CPsHURs proposition for Council. and
decided in The affirmative; ayes 81.
| (Mr Madison and Mr. Mar-halI, aye)
Mr.. WILSON moved Tor the ri.ing Of the committee
bu, it was opposed by Mr.. CLAIBORNE, and lost
! ayes3t
| Mr.. Scorr moved further to amend Mr. UpsHuR's
proposition, by striking out the parts in brackets see
above
| twas agreed to without debate
| Mr.. Scorr then moved the following am ndmeni:
"ReSOlUsd, That the Governor shall be fore he per-
forms any act in his official capacity other Than as COM
mander in chief, take the advice of the Executive
Council thereupon; but he shall he at liberty to adopt
or reject the sane"
| Mr.. THOMPSON opposed 10 the amen,Ime MT.
thinking that if the State were to pay 80 dearly for
having this advice given TO the Governor the least ne
could do would he To treat il with sufficient respect 10
| be governed by ii.
Mr.. GILES being unable from hoarsane.. to 90 a.
large into the debate suggested 10 Mr. Scorr that the
words OF his amendment went far beyond what he pre-
sumed to be the purpose of the mover. II restrained
| advice OF Council Now, there were multitude of
matters OF form which needed such advice such a,
the Authorization Of documents, &C.. SC.
He expressed his regret that the gentleman from
Fsuquer would not content himself with what had
worked 40 well for 81 years. but would aim al making
u absolutely perfect, and in the effort throw all
into uncertainty and embarrassment He thought the
remark Of MIR Randolph entitled 10 more weight than
had been given IL, when he had spoken OF changing
long fixed, organic law Mr.. g. again briefly explain.
ed the present relations between the Governor and
Council and expressed his fears Of the embarrassing
effect Of Mr. SCoTr's amendment.
Mr. ScoTr said, that he had come To the Convention
persuaded OF the propriey Of aboli.bing the Council
altogether; the gentleman from Amelia mr. Ges) had
induced him 10 abandon one half Of his bere,ie
on that snbiec but he could not a. yet at least he
come an entire convert. II was very possible he had