Ga ~L6- {td like to ‘see a drawing.’ They use operators? © Yes, they do. You mean you would like to see a sheet? Yeah, I'd like.to see the results. tit get you ones . You cen get all you want down on Hall Street. Do you have stations here? | Tes. ae | | 7 They have writers who go around. the. whole neighborhoods When-I wes a patrolman, 1 saw a bunch of :policy. writers with tickets sticking out of their pockets, picked them all up, picked about: eight of them up. Charged them with -.What did I charge them with? ’Gaming?. Oh, I don't: remember. what , the charge was... I think it was gaming and vag. I vagged them,. and they. kept putting it off and putting it off, end you know how hard ‘it: is to remember nig- gers, the next time they came in I. didn't .remember a.one of them. But come to find out, not only didn't I remember them,. but: they. had. changed niggers: and social security cerds. .But it's a big thing. This policy. Very big. Don't they have big front boys in Chicago? Theretre never. any front boys. Never were (There: followed further general: discussion ofthe policy. geme'in Chicago sim- {lar to above.) cot oe ee That's oné thing; since I’ Have. been with the: Vepartment;- there's. never been anything done ebout policy. - , Se _4t's never. been closed: There's never been a policy wheel. raided and they have the drawings right out in-the opens ~ Yon't you think something should be done. about that? Yes, I dow I really. do. -I sure do. Find-out where the ten wheels ‘are and teke all of their equipment, and they're: in bad shape.’ Printing press and everything. " Se Close her down. Naturally, when you take the machines, just hide them. They have different color slips. ‘Pink, yellow, green, white. They have WW 50529 Docld:322413873 Page 46
-4,7- different names for each nvmber. I don't know .a whole lot about i+ other than . just what I've seen. because in the Department. they: keep. pretty. cool on’ those things. - . . : mots P: You see, here the D.A. could keep one or two, then you would have something. S: Well, now the reason there's so many. They're a greedy: bunch of. people. . Some- body will get something on somebody else. Well, swe'll give them 6 wheel and let him hush up. Yo this FRIEDMAN Killing’ here. about ten years ago-: BENNIE VICKERS killed.Mr.. FRIEDMAN. ‘69, in order.to keep Mrs. FRIEDMAN happy, they--- - “Have her a wheel, and now I think she's got two or three wheels. &; % far as I know, BENNIE ‘has’ them .all ‘but one. s: Is that right. I: didn't know that. G: He has a couple of wheels in Fort Worth, maybe more... You see, the niggers down there go for thet policy in @ big waye - St: That and dice. That's another thing. Theretre about fifty nigger dice games there and some of them are, big. They're not: controlled by anybody. Anybody. P: Well, 1 tell you what we can do with those niggerss:. I can - They cleaned out nigger town:one. time. You remember, -I told youe : S: You mean: North Dallas? | Ps ‘iL gta nigger doctor over there.” I've known him: for yearse He had three things that. he wanted to do. He's a very wealthy nigger, and there's -a lot of wealthy niggers here, but it's a-restricted town. -There's no place they can g0- . There's nothing they can do, the stores don't ellow them in.  Neiman:Marcus don't let them in, + don't-care who they aree- He wented me to,open a nigger night club. In fact he took me over there and met the owner of Roseland..« He wanted: a swanky nigger club. ~ He prought ETHEL HORN.’ She was going to opene eG (further discussion by. JONES followed regarding. errengemerits made for the negro | night eClub to -be built on the ground ‘that. Dr. SAMUELS donated: to :the city: at Central and Hall)s °° 0 0 i (JONES. ‘also discussed the negroes! ambition.to have negro policemen on ‘the po~ lice force.) . - oe . Lo G: The negro business here, it's a pretty big racket. They've a club out here now called Cocoanut in the county._ . . am G: As I wmderstand it from the conversation we had this morning, .you and the boys are going to look it over and then bring this other man back here. » M: What 1 want to know is can we take your word? | ! | \ | Ww 50529 Docld:32241373 Page 49
S: Wetre negotiating. Now, do-you think it-woulda be ‘a good idea for. me’ to do. busi- ness with PAUL or anyone:élse, or. do you think it would be better to. do busi- ness with my lawyere. oo: oe _ Me Lt think it would ‘be best’ for you. ' Who is your. lawyer? Se ell, I'd rather not sey. Unless we're going to do business. I'd rather not mention his name. © - . _ Ms. Fell, that's your business.. If you'd do business with PAUL or personally. Dt fell, I'LL think it over.: lie's a: good boy. M: "ell, he must. be. md iW 50529 Docld:322413873 Page 50
eect enna te neem rata eagimaenne ota orem & HW 50529 Docld: 32274187353 Page 51° “yOlo=4 ~ OS Jot 7 Oo ~ Contacted Paul Jones. He is leaving Dallas at 12.55 tonight for Chicago. He said his life nad been threatened several times lately. There is some friction be- tween tne Lipky and the Wineberg factions. The Fed. Gov't has put a stop to his activities in Mexico, temporarily, at least until Aleman gets in. The syndicate he is connected with operates from coast to coast and in Canaada and Spain. He is going. to be sent to Spain in the near future. From Chicago he will go to N.Y. get nis wife and return to Dallas in ab- out a week or 10 days. His outfit always keeps up with his local doings. ite only goes places where his outfit will Know who he goes with. He could go into any fairly large city in the U.S. sand his syndicate would have some connection there. In case he ran into any local trouble he would call his office long distance and they yould send him the money he needed, or all the men he needed, or he could get help from Waxey Gordon whose phone number he hed in his pocket. nanan While he was in Mex. City someone broke into his apt. and stole his snub-nose 38 pistol & he wanted to know if he would find out if it was an officer or 4 thief who took it. That Labriola wes & stepson of Mangano, 4& big time Chicago criminal. Labriola was Of@ of the men.at large wao was called in to settle differ- ences for the syndicete. ; That Lipsky was one of the greatest conmen in the country. That his outfit was buying lots of sugar for $20 and $21 dollars a 100# and re-selling it for $27.00 per 1lOO#. That generally wnen they want into a town they operate through a fix, who was powerful enough to run things. in return his outfit did every- thing they could to keep the heat off the town. That Wichita Falls would be an unusual opportunity for them to make lots of money. . That in Dallas he was authorized to offer the new DA. & Sheriff 1000.90 per week each plus 123% each for complete protection. That the Jones boys, colored policy operators in & $200,000. for the snatch there and tnat they are now ik crepes ern nnnmnee COT/EG> DO
That his outfit was muking every effort to teke over the wire service whose headquarters are in Chicago and whose take is epproximately $1,000 ,000.90 per week over the country. That should his syndicate get a fix in the county and in the new City Government, that they ere sure Will move in in May, his outfit will seeito it personally that much local crime is eliminated by persuasion. Most of the black market handled by his outfit got to Spein via Vera Cruz Mexico and are packed for shipment in Mahogany crates. That the Dallas people who operate for his syndicate ere well known. None of the operations are ever operated anywhere by people brought in from the outside, but by local people who front for then. iiis outfit has a large number of slot machines they can and will move into this areawhen they get the go ahead signal. Wineberg put a lot of heat on Lipsky by his crude methods. Wineberg end Lipsky are on the outs. Panl Jones seemed to go cut of ‘his way to emphasize the idea his people did not want to stir up 4ny trouble emong local gemblers, but he had been approached by some of them to bring in a non-limit crap game for the Fair. t . 10-29-46 - 10.30 P.M. | Psul Jones called my house and after some casual conversation asked if i had seen Steve G. lately. I told him I hed played golf with Steve the day before and would play golf with him again tomorrow. That t had been on my . vacation for the past 2 days and had not been around the house much. He said he would consider it a favor if I could meke some arrangements for him to telk to Steve. Paul will call again tomorrow night at 6.15 P.M. Call- ed the office to report conversation but Lt, Daniel & Capt. Fritz were both gone. | 10-30 - Re: Paul Jones | After the golf game today I asked Steve if he had ever heard of Baul ! Jones. . He laughed end said "Are you kidéing?" "Wonder why someone hasn't all ready killed him?” Then i explained the police dept. was very much interested in Paul's local connections and activities and thet Paul want- ed to talk to him and we would epereciate it if he would help us out as it mey ada to our information ebout Paul's methods of operating. Steve agreed to do this and mentioned Col. Garrison at Austin - who Steve had met | while attending school. Thet he yould like for his own protection to make | recordings of what was said for future reference. Steve said to tell Paul | to come over tomorrow night at 8 P.M. if ne called. iW 50529 Docld:322413873 Page 52
HW 50529 Called the office to report this and find out how and if to proceed. Lt. Daniels off. Capt. Fritz working on the liquor store killings and not able to contact hin. Fhoned Uhief Hansson and toid him the setup, explaining that setup and my inability to find vapt. Fritz or van ~ that 1 wasn't going over their head but thought some one ought to’ know what the deal was; Asked me what hours I was working and I told him 1 yas on vacation. Said to go on With the deal - thet when my vacation was over 1 vould be transferred with Cannawey into the vice squad. 11-23 Paul Jones returned to Chicago this A.M. te got into Dallas some time Monday with his wife. It was unexpected for him — the ouick return to Chicago. Some Jocal jew alreedy has the bond racket sewed up in Dalles under the new administration. Thought to be Bill sSolters. who is reported to have sold his pawn shop to set enough money to operete on. cam Passman is said to have engineered this "monopoly" for a nice consideration. The jews ere attempting to tie Dslles up politically, end this gravy trein is one of their first. Jack Darby and Rill Holcomb had a drunken brawl. Two of Jeck's friends grabbec Pill and held his earns. Jack then slipped behind Holcomb end hit him in the heed several times. They split up end Bill Holcomb is now work~ ing for Herbert Noble. Said Fill was going to work for an insurence com pany and would receive an unusuel good income, Paul Jones is back in town. . 8 . . 10-25 . aatt ~ : ‘4 Vontacted Peul Jones who seid — GE wg?  y “e wes guestioned be‘ore ne left Chicago about the Kelly killing. The motive for the killing was Kelly's embition. He, Kelly, would go into & location operated by @ competitor. He would make the ower of the joint & proposition, giving him 10% more then he had been getting. He would then take his competitors machine out, put it on the sidewelk ene then put his own in. Paul Jones said thet king of business was bad for the heelth in Chicego. Jones has been celebreting his wedding anniversary today. 4de is tak- ing his wife on a shopping trip thts é.M. Docld: 322741873 Page 53
HW 50529 He pulled out a roll of £100.00 bills end told me that he wanted me to have a good time on him - that 1 wasn't always putting him in jail. “e also wented me to contact some of the big boys for him and see if 1 could arrange a fix. He said his syndicate would be willing to put in slot machines for any one who could make a fix. After all expenses were paid out his outfit and the siad fix would divide 50 - 50. Said he was sure some One would take him up as he could furnish the letest equipment, which in- cluded some of the electric slot machines. h. Y. Bankston has two airplanes now. He has e Howard 5 passenger ; 2c “onoplane painted "treme" with a black stripe. This plane has some of the best equipment. +t is stored in the Dalles Aero Service Hanger #5A. fe also has a twin engine Beachcraft, ell metal, silver colored with a lightning stripe dow the side. This ship is also a well ecuipped job. It carries about 7 or 9 passengers. It took off todey with some -~~ fAgein contacted Paul Jones who Said - Starting the first of the year his people were reelly coming into their own. The nationwide wire service formerly operated by Ragen would be oper- atec by his syndicate under the name of Mid-Nest Wire Service. By having control of this service they would have a 00C Téver With waren to pry fur- ther into other profiteble sources of income. That they were going to ex- pand their licuor interests in Dallas. That Steve could really do himself a lot of good when he goes in by operating through their set up» Thet af- ter Steve had held office one term and wented to run again his outfit would buy off all competition and pay ell his cempaign expenses out of their end of the profit. Also thet come election time, Steve would get letters from his good (?) friends Bob Hannegan and President Truman, congratulating him on his wonderful record and expressing the hope the good people of Dallas would. see fit to re-elect hin. : \ Under the new system which his syndicate operates, the Sheriff or the DL. A. (whichever one they meke their del with) enters into a 50-50 partner-— ship with each other. Steve could pick out any friend of his thet he liked and trusted. The Chicego outfit would Set this friend up in the coin mach- ine business, furnishing him withsell the capital and ecuipment necessary. this friend would operate the business on & purely business basis, keeping track of every cent coming in and going out. The syndicate would furnish this lucky operetor with e machine mechanic and a good well coached accoun- tent to handle the books for Uncle Sam's sake. UVtherwise Seve's man would be on his own. In addition, should any slot machine thief, or rival op- eretor, steal e machine or csuse any trouble to the new operation, they would be broke of the habit (in due enc ancient form). On the big crap geme they would like to Open, the same kind of Geal would be mede. Their syndicate would furnish expert operators working under the supervision of local people. After 411 expenditures and pay offs to other grafters, his outfit and Steve will divide the net profits. DoclId: 322741873 Page 54 ~~
HW 50529 Also, Steve would get 50-50 on wire service, footbell and baseball service, politicel races and all like income. This super-dooper crap geme will play for the big boys. It will be a non-limit game and will be fair and square. Of course, he says his outfit will furnish dice experts to keep some dice sherp from cheating them. There will be no set up to contend with like the recently publicized Freddie. Merrell and Dub Mcllannahan mess wnere it was a freme up and they met later to divide the "take" 4n order to keep the rest of the court house grafters pecified each would be paid a weekly fee, all of which to come ovt of the gross profits. Ne estimated that Steve could meke #150,000. per year, meybe more. When + asked him who, in his opinion, was locally gualified enough to handle a big set up like this he suggested ~ front men for the rackets Chick _ Lencester, Olin Lancaster for the unlimited erape game. Clint “urchison, ‘Todd Lee Wynne. The ebove two multi-millionaires and capable of bringing big money into the gambling tables. These men ere well known, not only locally, but nationally to the sporting and gambling world. , Jones has a great deal of contempt for what he called "chicken feed" that the local grafters were getting. This hesitation on the part of local rackets and vice to fatten up the nut when times were good is the reason his syndicate is having such an easy time in most cities they are organi- zing. He seid the pay outs for & city the size of Dalles should be.10 times what they are. When 1 asked Jones how strong his outfit was tied in with the Federal Government, he seid they were fixed and mentioned Truman and Hannegan. His people, he said, had no fear of government intervention. He seid St.Louis, Kansas City, New Orleans, Little Rock, to name a few, were well oiled end everybody was making money. Lipsky was recelled to Chicago and pulled down off his high horse. His group made a mistake in Lipsky end it cost them plenty. They mede several costly mistakes and heve found out it is best to remain in the background and let the local men do all the active work. eo , “e said T.E. was doing some ground work for them but would not make any proposition to anyone until he geve the word. He also admitted thet his syndicate was willing and ready to finaen- cially beck any strong local group in the city elections, where e pre- arranged deal justified the confidence end expense. He also stressed the strong (to him) point thet in cities controlled by his crowd, major crimes had decreased. The boys had an effective police force of their own. DoclId: 322741873 Page 55
HW 50529 word on that should eny of his group be hermed they would demand a return of 10-1. That is, ten local dead to one of his syndicate. There were sev-~ eral of his boys in town that were active and ready to go. They kept track of each other and if One wes out of pocket the others "knew where to start in.” This brings back the incident of the first arrest of the Chicago group by local people, aia, 1 Be Was talking to Bill D. when the "phone rang. +t was tyy Miller, “iller wanted to know who and what the eddresses were of the Vhicago boys. Pill turned to Al and asked him what to-do. Al seid "Tell him" so Bill did. Twenty minutes later Fritz, Gaddy and Smert érrested them. Some connections. The local nut, both Vity & County, is thought to be about %17,000.00 per month. . Jones is fairly well informed on the local set up. He Sound aut whet Dean's percentage wes and it was very low. He said the police captains in other towns did lots better. fe could almost tell a man how meny white faced cattle and Palamino horses a certein local thug hed on his renches, where the ranches were, how meny employees, the pay roll, etc. Se said I-would be very muchly surprised if I were thoroughly in the know ehout my own department. aA petty larceny bunch of "begcars", he called them. The man McWillie killed McBride, was killed by accident. The man he should have killed thet might has been taken care of as has one more mane They have simply disspoeered. Names will be furnisheg later. Archer and Fletcher will soon join them. ‘Noble is still the hottest thing around Dallas. : : Paul Jones met Steve Guthrie ‘and Butler at Steve's house at about 8 P.M. end stayed until about 1.30 P.M. all conversation was recorded by Dub. Naylor of the Dept. cf Public Sefety (Ranger) Fresent at the meeting were Paul Jones, Steve Guthrie and Geo. Butler, Naylor and his helper recorded ell meeting from back bedroom. Jones car~ ried home by Butler and expressed himself as pleased with Guthrie's possi- bilities, telling me I would be well teken cere of for my troubles, 11-3-46 Paul Jones called me at Steve's house tonight, long distance, operstor 6440, Chicago, and seid he will be in Dalles Tuesday with his top people, Docld: 322741873 Page 56