JFK Assassination System Date: 3/20/201 Identification Form Agency Information Released under the John F. enned Assassination Records AGENCY : FBI - sliection Act of 1992 {44 TSc * RECORD NUMBER: — 124-10250-10233 Pid? Note). Case#:Nw 53130 Pate: 06-01-2017 RECORD SERIES: CG AGENCY FILE NUMBER: = 62-6115-909 Document Information ORIGINATOR: FBI FROM: CG TO: HQ TITLE: DATE: 06/27/1967 PAGES: 13 SUBJECTS : SEE FBI 62-109060-5483 DOCUMENT TYPE: PAPER, TEXTUAL DOCUMENT CLASSIFICATION : — Unclassified RESTRICTIONS: 4 © CURRENT STATUS: —Redact DATE OF LASTREVIEW: = 01/11/1999 OPENING CRITERIA: INDEFINITE COMMENTS : wY'53130 Docld:32189523 Page 1 1
§ 6/27/67 “— | AIRPEL | FO: : > BBX (88-209060) . stl PROM: GAC, CHICAGO (62-G215)- SUBIZCT:  ABBSASBIRATION OF eRES DENT JOHN PRTSOSIALD RENERDY 31/22/63, Dollies, Teras. ASSAULTING GR RILLENG A FEDERAL OFFICE . Enclosed fox tha Burenu are three copies ach of a sol2-oxplanatory confidentish report ond additiounl isfercation portaining to captionsd antter, tuo copies cach of the report. atid intorention are enevlosed fox the Ballina and Nev Grleans Aviaione. The onclosed infermation vas made avaliable by PCr LEQUARL GARRULSOU en 6/20/67, on an extremely confidential basis. PCL urged thet under no cireummtanses should hia idoatity be divulged? a5 2 Source of this infernation and extreme cantion be exerciacd in any use of this information so as net te in aay way violate the confidential rvotationship: botueon PCr and these naged in the enelessd anterink. — Due to the sonsitive and confidential unture of the enclered daforgation and PCi's uaqugstioned value to the Chicago Division, this ingvernatien ig agvt being submitted in a fern suitable for disseniaation and is ovbaitted for information purposes only. 3 ~ Bereanu. (Ene. 8) 2 - Ballas (S9-43) (Enc. 4) ~ How Orleans (Bae. 4),) ~ Chicage @ fw— Sort as yea eh oe 7 i y HW 53130 DoclId:32189523 Page 2?
On June 22, 1967, L. H. Harrelson, in a telephone conversation with a con- fidential source in New Orleans, Louisiana, obtained the following information with regard to Perry Russo. and who is a polygraph examiner eler Polygraph Institute, stated that Perry Russo was \_Bxaminéd by another polygraph examiner with the Sheriff's Office in New Orleans “and that he had heard that the Sheriff's Office examiner stated that Russo was lying regarding the story of the plot to assassinate the late John F. Kennedy. a (f this informant also advised L.H.H. that Perry Russo had been subjected to arco-interrogation, using sodium pentathol and that he had further been subjected ( #? hypno-interrogation. He stated that a local psychiatrist subsequently blasted District Attorney Garrison for using these two techniques and suggested that Russo should be examined on the polygraph which should be more reliable. This informant —stated that he received a call! requesting him to exarnine Russo in regard to his | [ btory. ie stated that he was told that Russo wanted to meet him first to see what kind of a person he was. | He stated that he made an appointment and met Russo for the first time Friday, June 16, 1967. He stated that at this time he tal! This informant, who is well known to L.HOH. i| having been trained at the Ke ~~ c Hat he be given a trial run on the polygraph and that he wanted to be asked 10 or 20 \\ yuestions and intended to lic to some of them to-see if the examiner could detect “\ ies The source stated that he instead had Russo write down a number on a piece of aper and place it in his pocket. He stated that he then made Russo a bet of $3.00 | that he could pick out the number. He further stated that Russo called the bet, the test was run and the examiner picked out the number. He stated that Russo appeared in his office on June 19, 1967 to be examined in re- gard to his story reporting the plot to assassinate the late John F. Kennedy. He stated that he attempted to exarnine Russo but that hisPneamo tracing (breathing) was so erratic that he reported to D.A. Garrison that he felt Russo was an unfit subject for polygraph testing at this time. He further stated that he did talk with Russo about his tracing and explained to him that he obviously had something _ bothering him. He stated Russo told him that he told the story in court because he “was getting so much pressure from D.A. Garrison and also NBC. He stated that “Russo further made the statement to him that he did not know if-Clay Shaw was ‘‘present at the meeting or not. He stated that Russo added that if he had to say "yes" or "no" that he would have to say "no" that Clay Shaw was not presant. . : i] ’ - Mo. : - a HW 53130 DoclId:32189523 Page 3 ked for a while and Russo requested ale eee me age “atm ene cet Ae REE A Ne RN: on nt ee
This examiner stated that he asked Russo why he went into court and under oath stated that Shaw was present at the alleged meeting. He stated that Russo replied that he fully intended to go into court and testify that he did not know if Shaw was present or not but became angered by Shaw's attorney's question, 'Do you believe - in God" and afterwards did testify that Shaw was definitely present. _ This informant stated that Russo admitted having undergone psychiatric treatment for one and one-half years. He stated that Russo admitted to homosexual acts. his informant stated that he fully believes that he would have been able to break usso had hecontinued. He stated that after giving a verbal report to Mr. Garrison | that Mr. Garrison told him in no uncertain terms to keep his mouth shut and not to ay anything about the test or what Russo said. This informant further stated that is official written report to Mr. Garrison is going to indicate that in his opinion Russo was an unfit subject on Monday, June 19, 1967. OTE: Ci The erratic breathing pattern that was described by this informant can indicate claustrophobia, however, in all of the experience that I have had in conducting [Polygraph examinations, an erratic breathing pattern as a general gule is an indica- ion that the subject is being deceptive. pO , L.H.H. mad HW 53130 DoclId:32189523 Page 4
re? oe ‘ CO ES # 9816 - 67 1 June Zl, 96 Lex Hawkias, Attorney at Law , \ 836-842 Fifth Avenue a es Moines, Iowa LI ARRANGEMENTS: | “ . ~- z . t Le ye your request, LILLIG MAE AiG MAINES was examined on the polygraph, a cetection of deception technique. ancard polygraph procedure was exercised throughout this examinaticn. [Subject was examined in this office on June 19, 1967. She was given a Relevant.. iL and Irrelevant type examination for the purpose eofas certaining if she possessed ; [aay knowledge of an alleged rnceting in Dave F errie’s home wherein there was | verbal intercourse relating to a plot to | assassinate the late John F. Kennedy. U During the pre-test interview, the Subject stated that she was born Lillie wine J Hrotiett cn Gctober 22, 1944, in Lucedale, Mississippi. She-stated that her real \ frothe: died when her younger sister was born and that she was raised by one of Yher father's cousins, James Moffett, and his wife Ethel. She referred to these per in as her parents. She stated that she was raised near Mobile, Alabama. She said that she does not know whether or not James and Ethel Moffett ever acopted her. Subject stated that she is presently mar ried to Jarold MeMaines, aged 38 years. She said that he coes not have a regal job and works out of an “employment Oifice’tin Omaha, Nebraska, as a truck driver and as 2 furniture mover, The Subject stated that ever since she was old enoursh to understand and remeinber, p} & . her "mother' constantly told her that her older sister Gertrude, who lived in New Orleans, Louisiana, was "a tramp and no good." She stated that these statenicents HW 53130 DoclId:32189523 Page 5
‘ co \ Ne Page 2 Mr. Hawkins ; . June 21, 1967 | se RE: Lillie Mae Mehaines: RESULTS (cont'd): finally caused her to run away from home in 1962 and proceed to New Crleans to locate her sister Gertrude. She said that she just had to find out if her sister was really "bad." During six hours of interview and interrogation, the Subject gave the following information regarding her stay in New Orleans, her returnto biobile, Alabama, 1¢a on to San Bernadino, California, then back to New Orleans, then to Omaha, Nebraska, and finally to Des Moines, lowa. Jubject stated that when she first went to New Crleans she decided to use the name Sandra Moifett. She explained that she had been in New Grleans for appro:- imately three weeks before her sister permitted her to go out "on the town!" by Rerseli, She said that the first night she went out alone she met Perry Russo. dhe said thet the meeting occurred about 10:30 P.M. as she was walking dow os ourbon Street and that Perry Russo, "Ken," Leity voter son and "Timiuny’! were \\#ilso walking along Bourbon Strect. She related that as they passed on the street, “Jimmy winked at her and she smiled. She continued that they all stopped on the | freres to drive her horne. « a aaa 3 jeunes would not permit her to go with him but her sister did agree that she coula . a sidewalk and telked. She said that during this conversation, Perry Russo volun- . She continued that she, Perry Russo, lefty, Ken and Timmy all got into Perry's car and proceeded to drive toward her sister's home where she was staying but they stopped on the way ior coifce and gasoline. She said that Perry Russo asked her if she would go to school with him the following morning and she replied to him nat she would go with hirn provided her. sister would permit her to do so. he continued that Perry Russo stopped by the house the following morning but her {tend a party that was being given for Ken Wink that night. Subject stated that that party was held at a place called the Frenchman's Inn. She- said that Perry was supposed to pick her up at &:00 P.M. but he was late because it was raining hard. She said that she and. Perry arrived at the party at approxi- “mately 9:00 P.M. The Sudject stated that she and Perry continued to cate until the carly part of 19 She said that she became pregnant and aiter she told Perry that she was preg vnsat he told her to “get lost" until alter the baby was born and then she should look him Up again. HW 53130 DoclId:32189523 Page 6
: 7 oan “Page 3 . Oo . ; | Mr. Hawkins . June 22, 1967 ~ . RE: Lillie Mae McMaines ° ESULTS (cont'd): a 4 The Subject stated that when she jirst told Perry Russo that she was pregnant, aman {unknown to her) placed Perry in a hypnotic trance and questioned hirs. She said that while in the trance, Perry acknowledged that he was the father of ‘her yet unborn baby. She said that Perry later denied that he was the father. She went on to explain that she, Perry, and the unknown "hypnotist" (she des- ribed his age as between 49 and £0 ycars) went to a place called the Royal Castle and, while there, this unknown “hypnotist" again placed Perry iaa hypnotic trance. She said that he did not question Perry at this time but gave firm a post-hypnotic suggestion, "When I snap iny fingers you will awaken, get oif the stool, walk to the coor and then return to the stool whera you will ireeze in your tracks and will be unable to move." She said that when the man sna pped ( xis fingers, Perry opened his eyes, got off the stool, walked to the door and hen turned and walked back to the stool. She said that Perry stood by the stool ni went through what appeared to be attempts at moving his body but he did not actually move. She added that, in her opinien, Perry was faking his inabi lity to move while standing by the stool. Eubject said that the neat time she saw Perry (after telling him that she was | |pregnant) was avery short time later and she spent about one~hals hour talking with him in his home. She said that when she csparted his home, -a friend of his named "Fido" knocked her down on the lawn, hit her in the stomach with his fist, and made the comment, "Why don't you leave him alone?" She explained that she screamed loudly when struck by Fido hoping that Perry would come outside but ye cid not. She said that Fido went into Perry's home after knocking her down And striking her. She said that as soon as she regained her sense of direction, [sue got up and went home. [| The Subject stated that when she was about three months pregnant, she atie:pted suicide by. taking 175 aspirin. She said that a girl friend named ay | found her and took ker to the Charity Hospital in New Orleans by taxicab. She said that her stornach was pumped at the hospital and she said that the hospital not tii ed the police departinent but her girl friend Kathy talked the officer out of taking her te jail. HW 53130 DoclId:32189523 Page 7 ee te eee
s Myr. Hawkins June 21, 1967 RE: Lillic Mae MicMaines RESULTS (contld): Subject stated that when she was about four months pregnant, she married a Frank Adams in Dallas, Texas. She did not tell the circumstances surrounding a divorce froin Sdams. - The Subject stated that when she was between 15 and 16 years of age, her Nimother' took her to a psychiatrist because she bad run away from home. She daid that she visited the psychiatrist about four times but she did not know what he reported about her. * Subject x related that she gave birth prer:naturely on August 30, 1963. She said he was released from the 1ospital on Septernber 3rd or 4th, 1963. She said hat she went to Perry Russo's house the day following her release from the a: opital but she cid not see or talk with him again until June or July of 1954, Pa ~ by Ao) ~~ mf ws, tee | subject then related how Perry Russo photo gr aphed her on several occasions oS \Upvhile s she was engaging in the act of coitus with different men. She explained that Perry had his own cark room and developed the pictures h imself. [ }Babject then related that she and a girl named Ann visited her baby in the hospital requently. She further stated that her parents" came fro om Alabama to New Orleans and also visited the baby in the hospital. Subject continued that her baby was released from the hospital on September 20, 1963, and on this sarne date she left New. Crleans with a James Robert Ervia fRus so had introduced her to him). She said that the two of them and the baby ‘\\/Avent by bus to her "parents'’ home. She gave her Nparents' address s Box 326 l in Eight Mile, Alabama and she said that this town is located near + saobile. She went oa to explain that James Robert Ervin was unable to find employment in Mobile and so he went to New Crieans and obtained a job in an establishment called Little Crystal Cafe. She said that this establishment is located on Royal Street in New Orleans. She said that Jimmy worked and stayed in New Orleans . | during the week and he would hitchhike to her ‘parents'" home in Eight Mile, 4 Alabama, over the weekends. HW 53130 DoclId:32189523 Page 6
Page 5. Mr, tiawkins ; . June 21, 1967 | RE: Lillie Mae MeMaines RESULTS (cont'd): Subject stated that she and Jimmy leit Eight Mile in February of 1964 (leaving the baby with her 'mother") and they went to San Bernadino, California, where they stsyed with an aunt of hers. She said that from the time she left New Orleans to go to Eight Mile and then to California, she did not rnake one trip to New Orleans. Subject related that she and Jiramy went through a wedding ceremony in Tiajuana, Mexico, in June of 1964. She continued that Jimmy left her the latter part of this same month. She said that the day after Jimmy left her, she went to New Orleans by bus. . Subject related that when she arrived in New Orleans, she called Perry Kusso dnd he came te the bus depot and drove her and her personal belongings to his ome. She said that she spent the nicht in Perry's apartment and then the follow- ag day she rentea a room for herself. She said that after she rented the roam, ghe went job hunting and she met James Robert Ervin onthe street. She said that they decided to live together again, She said that she cid obtain a job as a barmaid. She said that she and Jimmy lived together for only one week and he Bi; gain walked outon her. She said that he left on July 3, .1964. The Subject said that she thea turned to prostitution az a means of supporting herseli.and in-order to save up enough money to get her baby back from her “mother." She further explained that she gave Perry Russo “around a hundred doliars'' to keep for her but he never gave it back to-her. She said that on one ther occasion, she loaned Perry $20.00 to use to pay his insurance but he did ot repay this money either. The Subject stated that the first time she rnet Dave Ferrie was in either the latter part of January of the first part of February of 1965. She explained that she was with Perry Russo and he wanted to sce Dave corns about something and so the two of them went to Dave's apartment. ohe aid that Perry introduced her to Ferric and his two roommates. She said at they stayed at Dave's apartment for only a few rninutes and they leit. HW 53130 DoclId:32189523 Page 9
Page 6 Myr. Hawkins . SO a, June 21, 1967 - Re: Lillie Mae MeMaines RESULTS {cont'd}: The Subject said that the next time she saw Dave Ferrie was less thana week after first meeting him and was ona Sunday, She explained that Dave invited hex to his apartment fox lunch with hirn and his two roommates. She said that. Dave picked her up at her place ina blue Ford station wagon and they arrived at Dave's apartment at approximately 12:36 or 1:00 P.M. She said that she stayed at this apartment until about 5:50 PEM, at which tirne he dreve her back to her Subject said that she next saw Da ive Ferrie on the following Wednesday or Fhursday when he carne by Sanai's place where she was employed. She eaicd that Pave asked her if she would go out with him the following Friday night. vues icct said that on this Friday night, Dave picked her up at her apartment about 6:99 or 6:30 P.M. and they first proceeded to Dave's apartment where one L bE Dave's i} Foommiates and his date were waiting. She said the four of them then 5 re rhe Sabject crphs atically denied ever meeting Shaw or Oswald. She sais that she in rever attended a party at Dave Ferric's house. She stated that sho had never been fo a football ‘game but sha dic attend basketball and baseball pames with Perry Russo and Leity Peterson. The Subject eta ted that Perry Rasso was extremely interested in politics, She gaid that he was a Republican and a strong advocate and i backer of Goldwater. \ The Subject stated that she attended a political mecting with Perry Russo and three other men but she could not be sure of their names. She related that the meeting was held in’a big house on Canal Street in either April or May of 1965, U She said that she and three men stayed ina back reom of the house and watched television. She said that she did not see all of the people at the mecting. She said that ¢he did not hear anyone 3 peaking Spans sh nor cid she see any Spanish, Cubans or Puerto Ricans at this inmecting The Subject commented that Lefty Peterson is "ofi upstair s" but is a good guy otherwis HW 53130 DoclId:32189523 Page 10
o O Page T : Mr. Hawkins - June 21, 1967 © RE: ili 420 MelMaines RESUL 3° 5 {could}: The Subject explained that Perry Russo habitually made notes about everyth Ange She said that he made notes of things he had to do, the times he was supposed to be somewhere, and places he had to go. She said that Perry told her he mac le notes of everything because he wae so busy that he cid not want to forget anything. (A The Subject explained that on one occasion she went to Perry's house and aJike ea itvgerald was there. She said that Mike told her that he had just found Perry 2 ee i | in fhe bathroora with his wrists all slashed up and that he had tried to coramit wee . She said that she then left and did not see Perry. ° The Subject stated that when Perry first introduced her to Jimmy Hrvin, he suggested they all so to Jimmy's apartment and he would like to make photograpis é her and Jim umy engaging in coitus. She saic that a girl fricnd of hers named - Jeannie became very angry with Perry when he rade this suggestion. She said they did not go. . The Subject stated that the most men she ever engaged in sexual intercourse with, one immediately following the other, would be two. She said that these were two [Faimen she hustled when she was working ag a prostitute, She related that she LJ inactied one man ene night and he went into the bathroom after undressing. She | snid that she locked him in the bathroom, took $120.09 fror his pocket and van - 1 cut of the room. She stated that on one occasion Perry wanted to photouraph her Lo and 4 girl named Kathy engaged ina sex act together but she said that someone ame in unexpectedly and the act was never consu ummated. \\ “\\// The Subject related that two investigators from District Attorney Garrison's office came to her homme in the middle of the night of Merch 8, 1967, in Omnaas She said that they requested her to leave immediately with therm and return t | New Orlcans for the purpose of looking at some p: notogra aphs. She said that th cy tuld her that they did not know what the photographs were. She continued that she told therm that she could not leave then because she had a ceat and other clothing in the cleaners, Zhe said that these two rnen, Simnis and Jonah, told her not to worry---they would bay her some new clothes. She said that they further told her that she would stay in the finest hotels and eat the £ inest foods. “ “ a - Td nH HW 53130 DoclId:32189523 Page 11
Fage § a Mie. Hawkins June 21, 1967 Rie: Lillie Mac MelMuaines RESUL J" 5 {cont!s)i - , She continued that her husband (Harold MeMaines) spoke up and stated that he cid net want fo let her go and that he wanted to consult with an aftoracy. She said that the two investigators then offered to buy a ticket for her husband also. She said that after ber husband insisted on talking with an attorney first, the two investigators told ner husband not ee consult with an attorney because she niuight get hurt if he did and they wanted to keep everything quiet. She said hat they did leave however. Oo he Subject explained that she teld thie entire story to a reporter names 4) tivomery man with the World-terald in Omaha. She sald that after the atury appeared in print she- and her hus band both lost their jobs. She went cn to relate ~ that the reporter Zimmerman told her that she aceded an attorney and arranged (¢ \for her to meet attorney Lex flawking. The Subject was given four separate testa and was asked the following relevant questions and gave the answers indicated: a |] ‘Eizet Test: Q. Do you have any intention of trying to lie to me during this test? A. No. Q, Have you told me the complete truth since we have been talking? A. Yes. ©. Did you attend the party at Ferrie's home that Perry clalins you attended? A. Wo. \\ /A2. Dic you ever meet Shaw? A. N \//Q. Are you deliberately trying to withhold any information from me regarding - the party? A. No. , Second Test: @. Have you told me the complete truth here to Q. Did you attend the party Perry cays you dic Q. Ave you. tryl ag to withhold any iniormatio A. No. Qu hh from me regarding this case? HW 53130 DoclId:32189523 Page 12
Passe 9° > May. Hawking June 21, 1957 RE: Lillie hae MeMaines RESULTS {conths)s Third Test: &. Did youle to Mr. Hawhias at all? A. Yes. RQ. Did Perry ever tell you that the President was polng to be assassinated? A. No. 2. Did you go to the party at Dave's house i at Perry says you did? A. No. a Are you atte: cepiing to protect or cover p for anyone? A. No. G. Are you trying to hold back any informatio on from me now? A. Ne. } eoursth Test: (ae liave you told me the complete truth here today? A. Yes. ip. Would you lic if it woulu help you stay out of jail? A. Yes. |. ad. Were you ever present when any people talked about assassinating the t i President? A. No. WR. Is Perry telling the truth about you attending the party? A. No. Q. Are you attempting to withhold any information from ime now? A. No, Have you purposely lied to any of my questions ? A. No. a « During the first three tests, her polygrams contained reactions to the relevant gusstion:. “Are you trying to withhold or conceal any information from me?" Following the third test, she explained that she suspects Perry Russo might be "a little queer" for Mike Fitzgerald. There was not a reaction to the question \Prt the test following this explanation. Tae Subject was asked by this examiner why she t this story. She explained that the last time July of 1968, he asked her if she would marry him. he wantec to marry her so that he wouldn't have to e go into the military service. She stated that she told him she would not marry h She then quoted him as saying, "You have got to marry me and hela keep p me out of the service. '' She stated that she again told him she would not marry hiva and then lurther quoted himas saying, ‘if you won't marry me, I'M have to find se:neone else who She added that she believes he is telling this story in an endeavor to avoid go into the military aervice. . co ught Perry Russo was telling him m, Which was in June or She stated thet he ssid that lile * . HW 53130 DoclId:32189523 Page 13 ! |
“eq, sen NW _—- = Pape lo ; June 21, 1967 RE: Lille Mae hichiaines CONCLUSION: eA te Nt i etre ' After careful analysis of this Subject's polygrams, it is the opinion of the examiner that she told substantially the truth duving her examination and interrogation. Seastnod verre son HW 53130 DocId:32189523 Page 14