Sylvia Tirado Interview Page 41. Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: What happened? Somebody took them to the Consulate. Okay. You said the main gate. Was that the area that, on Exhibit One, you marked as being the door to your office, or some other area? He was closed. In the afternoon he was closed. But perhaps he came. The door on Area One was.locked up. Okay? Yes. and then he was open. Over near Number Seven, is that correct? Where they let the cars in? Yes. There was a door there £00? Yes. It was the garage and another door. ‘And the doorman from that area brought him to your office? Yes. What occurred on that occasion? What? What happened on that occasion? Well, he came in and he said that,he- already have his Russian visa and uh, he want to get his Cuban visa. And I said that thatwas not possible be- cause he has to be first sent to Cuba and then
Silvia Tirado Interview Page 42, “wait for the answer, no, it was necessary that he has to have first a Socialist visa, the Russian visa. And, uh, Cornwell: Did he show you his passport with a visa in it? From the Russian Embassy? Tirado: No, No. .I dont' remember exactly but what I remem- ber is he says that he already has his Russian visa and I said I don't see it and well, I don't remem- ber exactly what we discussed in that moment. But, he was very stubborn. So, I say, well, I'm going to call to the Russian Consul, so I called the Russian Consul and I said hey, listen, here's a man that, he say that he already got his Russian visa. And he said, yes, I remember it. He came to us for visa but uh, the answer will be in three or four months, that was the usual time. Cornwell: So as you recall, then, the person at the Russian Embassy said in effect, no, he doesn't have it yet, he's only applied for it. Is that right? Tirado: Yes. yoo Cornwell: Okay. Go ahead. Tirado: And uh, and I told him what the Russian Consulate says and then, he was angry. He get angry. And he insisted that he was a friend of the Cuban Re-
Silvia Tirado Interview Page 43. Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: volution, that he has already been in jail for the Cuban Revolution, that uh, oh, that he wanted that visa and that he couldn't wait for so long time because uh, his Mexican visa was finished in three days. So he was insistent and uh, I didn't have time and well, I couldn't make him understand that. So, I went to the Consul's office and I explained to him, and would you please come and talk with him? Agcue came, Mirabal I think he didn't speak English, so Azcue came and told him those things, all the requirements that he needs to fly to Cuba, and he was really angry. He was red and he was almost crying and uh, he was insisting and insisting so Azcue told him to go away because if he didn't go away at that moment he was _. going to kick him, or something like that. So, Azcue went to the door, he opened the door and told Oswald to go away. | Okay. So he went to the door which was in the area we marked ‘one,' which was the Consulate Office? Yes...Remember, I was feeling pity for him. because he looked desparate. | He looked desparate? Yes.
Silvia Tirado Interview Page 44, Cornwell: “0; you felt kind of sorry for him? Tirado: Yes. Cornwell: At any time during these three contacts, did he indicate to you that he could speak or understand Spanish? Tirado: No. Cornwell: During this period was your normal work week, did it include Saturdays? Tirado: Yes. | Cornwell: Is it possible that, in addition to his visits on Friday, he also came back the following day on “Saturday morning? Tirado: No. Cornwell: How can you be sure of that? Tirado: . Because, uh, I told you before, that it was easy | to remember, because not all the Americans that came there were married with a Russian woman, they have live(d) in Russian and uh, we didn't used to fight with those people because if you, they came for going to Cuba, so apparently they were friends, no? So we were nice to them with this man we fight, \ I mean we had a hard discussion so we didn't want to have anything to do with him.” ° Cornwell: Okay. TI understand that but I don't understand ee how that really answers the question. [In other
Silvia Tirado Interview Page 45. words, the question is, what is it about the- events that makes you sure that he did not come back on Saturday, and have another conversation with you? Tirado: Because I remember the fight. So if he (come) back, I would have remembered} Cornwell: Did Azcue work on Saturdays? Tirado: Yes, we used to work in the office, but not for the public. Cornwell: Was there a guard, was there a guard out here at the corner near number seven on your diagram on Saturdays? Tirado: Excuse me? Cornwell: Was. there a doorman out near the area that you marked as number seven, on the diagram? Tirado: Yes, but on Saturday he never let people. Cornwell: Never let people in. Tirado: No. Cornwell: Not even if they came up to the doorman and didn't \ . speak Spanish? And were very insistent? Tirado: No, because they could answer or something. They could ask me for instance, no? by the inter-phone. Cornwell: They could do that on a Friday, though.
Silvia Tirado Interview Page 46.. Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: But what I remember is that Oswald has my tele- phone number and my name and perhaps he-show to the doorman (Spanish). When did you give him the telephone number and name? In the second visit, perhaps. Okay. I used to do that to all the people, so they don't have to come and to bother me. So I used to give the telephone number and my name and say "giveme a call next week to see if your visa arrived." Well. Are you saying that based on your memory the guard was allowed to bring people in during the five till eight o'clock at night uh, sessions during the week but not on Saturdays? No. Is that correct? Yes. Lom Do you have a distinct recollection with respect to telephone calls to the Russian Consulate, was it just one call or was it more than one call? , ae Only one. Just one. . The . . .I believe I asked you this, but just to be sure, although the application was typed with
‘Silvia Tirado Interview Page 47. a carbon to make two copies with one typing, did he have to sign both independently?” Or did you allow them to use a carbon to sign the paper? Tirado: No, no. It was the original. Cornwell: Two original signatures. All right. Tirado: Yes. | Cornwell: Was anything said that you recall at this time which looking back on it indicated the possibility, “even on that date, Oswald had on his mind some intension of killing the President of the United States? Tirado: No, I don't think so. Cornwell: | Let me read something to you, and ask you if it at all refreshes your memory or if your have a memory of a conversation similar to this? I don't believe I read this to you before, when we talked the other day, or did I? Did I read an excerpt from Daniel Schorr’s book to you? Tirado: No, you told me. Cornwell: Okay. I'll read it to you then at this time. It's an excerpt from a book called Clearing the Air, written by Daniel Schorr, published in the United States in 1977. And page 177 reads as follows: "Tn an interview in July 1967 with a British journalist, Comer Clark, Castro
Silvia Tirado Interview Page 48 Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: (meaning Fidel Castro) said that Oswald had come to the Cuban Consulate twice, each time for about fifteen minutes. The first time, I was told, he wanted to work for us. He was asked to explain but he wouldn't, he wouldn't go into details. The second time he said he wanted to free Cuba from American imperialism. Then he said something like 'Someone ought to ‘shoot that President Kennedy.' Then Oswald said, and this is exactly how it was reported to me, Maybe I'll try to do it." Do you recall any conversation like that in either what was said to you by Oswald or that was said by Oswald to Azcue or anyone else that you might have overheard? No, I don't remember. . Did any part of that conversation occur? No, because I don't remember that he says he was to go to work in Cuba because he only that he wanted to go in-transit. That's what I remember. What do you think, well, first let me ask you, do you think that conversation could have occurred and you just forgot it? In other words, is that the kind of conversation which, if it occurred, you would definitely remember it? « Yes. Because in the fight with Azcué there was shouting and crying and things like that. I could miss something, but not, because even if would say so, I mean, I could have heard, no, I mean
Silvia Tirado Interview Page 49. Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: if you kill Presidént you're not going to change the whole system. — , So You see, that's why I give you answer, even Azcue. I mean that's not the, I don't think so, that he had that conversation with anyone. He was arguing. Do you remember any part of the conversation indicating that Oswald piamitg the United States or President Kennedy for his inability to get to Cuba? I don't remember but that could be possible. In other words, if he's frustrated and he comes to the Cuban Consulate, he might feel animosity or anger towards various people. He might be angry at you, or Azcue, or at the Cuban Govern- ment or at the Russian Government or perhaps the United States Government, depending on how the conversation went. What do you recall about that? Who was he angry at when told he couldn't go to Cuba . He was angry at us. That's why I called Azcue: a Because he was not a strofig man but anyway, I didn't like to fight with him. He was very angry and he was blaming me and Azcue: because he thought it was in our hands to give the visa immediately, and he couldn't understand that the visa has to
Silvia Tirado Interview Page. 50. come from Cuba. Cornwell: You mentioned earlier that you had discussed with Azcue on this, as I understood this, during the third visit with Oswald, the suspicion that you had about the documents. Is that accurate or did I misunderstand? Tirado: No, it was the third time when I told Azcue that there was a man that bother me, that when I told him about. this man, I mean because it was normal, I used to, that was my job, to attend veople who come in so I didn't have to bother the Consul for every man who came, because there was a lot crazy men from the United States that they wanted to go to Cuba. Cornwell: Okay. So, from what I understand then, when you went in to Azcue, to bother him, since you normally didn't do that sort of thing, you gave him a sort of background resume of your dealings with Oswald. Is that correct? Tirado: ‘Yes. Cornwell: And was it at that point ‘that you tald him of your suspicion about the documents? Tirado: I think so. ae “Cornwell: What was his reaction? Azcue's? Tirado: He was worrying. When he went to my office, force tra al
Silvia Tirado Interview Page 51. Leap: Tirado: Leap: Tirado: Leap: he was very tranquil, he -was very polite, he was explaining things, very polite... And uh, he was starting to get angry when he saw that he was a stubborn man, that he didn't want to under- stand, and he said uh, I remember now, he said "you're not a friend of the Cuban Revolution, be- cause if you are a friend, you have to understand that we have to take care, to be very careful with the people that are going to Cuba, and if you don't understand this, you are not friend of the Cuban Revolution.' And he was shouting and, I don't remember how long was this conversation, but uh, they got really angry, both. May I call you Silvia? Yes, At any time during your conversation with the Consul, did you discuss the possibility that Oswald was a penetration agent? Intelligence agent for a. foreign power? Did you discuss that possibility? No. I don't think so because we didn't have time. Because this man was in my office and I was in Azcue's office so I couldn't leave him many times alone. Did you ever have conversations with Ascue out- side of Oswald's presence relative to the issue? spree
Silvia Tirado Interview Page 52. Tirado: Lopez: Tirado: Leap: Tirado: Leap: Tirado: Lopez: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Repeat the question please. Did you ever have a conversation with Azcue when Oswald was not in the office about the pos- Sibility that he was an intelligence agent for some country? I don't think so. No, no. We only thought that he was /a crazy man, an adventurer, or something like that. Did it ever enter your mind that he was a pene- tration agent? Perhaps. Perhaps, because it happened, it hap- pened sometimes that somebody came and - say this: is a policeman or something like that. That's all the questions that I have. The only thing that I can say, it was that it was strange, travelling with all of his documents just to prove one thing. Do you think now, looking back on what happened then, that he may have been an intelligence agent? Perhaps. Did anything else ever come to. your attention? That caused that suspicion? Other than just his presentation of the documentation? Anything else ever happen? With him? No, no. The only thing that was strange is that if you belong to the Communist Party,
Silvia Tirado Interview Page 53. Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: any party. Your French, but French could get Cuban Visa but Mexico, for instance, if you're Mexican and you're a member of the party, of the Commu- nist Party, you don't have to go and ask for application visa because the party writes to the Cuban Communist Party, and they arrange every- thing. That was the strange thing. There's no need.. At first, he said that he was a Communist. That was strange. Because it would be really easy for him to get the visa through the Commu- nist Party. | At any point in the conversations that you have told us about, did Oswald say anything indicating that he really wanted to stay in Cuba? No. He just wanted to go and visit and saw what was the Revolution. Okay. That's sort of what I meant. In other words, he did indicate that he didn't sust want to pass through, that he wanted to spend some time there. Is that correct? Yes. a What do you recall about that part of the conver- sations? “ I told him that he get to Cuba, for instance, at two o'clock, and there was a plane going to
Silvia Tirado Interview Page 54. Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Russia at five o'clock, he has to stay in the airport, in the Cuban airport. That he couldn't go out. Why didn’t vou tell him that? Because he was saying that he wanted to go to Cuba to visit and to see what the revolution had made. Did you ever see him again, after the argument with Azcue? No. Did you ever talk to him again? No. | Not in person nor by telephone. No, he never call. He could have called when I wasn't there, but I used to get the message, if somebody answer, I used to get a message. | Did anyone else overhear any of the conversations you have described? Other than the one time in which Azcue was involved? , of Yes. Could be that people from the Commercial Office, could be Mirabal. Was there anyone else vhysically present in the Consulate's Office during those conversations as you can recall?
Silvia Tirado Interview. Page 55. Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: I can't remember. The only thing that I remem- ber is that it was only Mirabal. . And did Mirabal come out in the reception aréa during the conversations as you recall? No, I think he stay in his office. But he could have overheard it at the time. Yes, everybody who was passing through, even in the streets, they were shouting, really: Were the windows up as I guess they might have been at that time of yvear? (Didn't understand.) The windows would have been up? The windows to the Consulate Office would have been open? What? I. In other words, you're saying people on the street might have overheard it? Yes, yes. If you were here and there was always a polic: here, they could have heard the. shouting, the crying. (Lots of noise in background, unintelligible.)
KENNEDY SELECT COMMITTEE ON ASSASSINATIONS TAPE 2 Name Silvia.Tirado (Duran) | Date June 6, 1978 Time Address Place. Interview: Cornwell: You told us previously when we discussed informally with you that you were sympathetic towards the Cuban Revolution during the early 1960's-- Tirado: Yes. Cornwell: Did you ever overhear any conversation either in the Consulate or among any of the people you may have as- sociated with concerning the possibility of killing the President? Tirado: No, because I think the people I used to know during that time, they think like me, and I think the death of a man doesn't make anything good, I mean, you have to change the structures, I mean, it's just. like a building, no? The President:is like, I mean, for instance, a roof--not the top, but if you take the top, the building still stands. You have to de- stroy the whole building, not one man. If you kill ye the man,-you make a hero. So, is no good. Cornwell: What were your own feelings towards President Kennedy? Interviewer Signature Typed Signature Gary Cornwell ‘Date transcribed 6-26-78 By: br Form #4-y
Silvia Tirado Interview Page 2. Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Lopez: Cornwell: Lopez: Tirado: Cornwell: Lopez: Tirado: Well, I like him. TI mean, he was very nice, he was very intelligent. And I think of the relations with Mexico, as I remember now, they were very good in the commercial area, the cultural area. He came to Mexico and he was very acclamation. They loved him. They liked him very much. | And, what you're saying is, you're describing what you understood to be the basic reaction of the Mexi- can people? Is that correct? ‘Yes. Was that feeling the same even among the part of the Mexican people who were sympathetic towards the Cuban Rewblution? Uh, translate, please, Ed. JI want to be sure of the question. Would you repeat the question, please? Was the feeling that you just described as being that of the Mexican people? | (Pranslated question. ) In general. The ‘same with respect to that part of the Mexican people like yourself who were sympathetic to the Cuban Revolution? (Translated.) pe Well, yes, more or less. Because I mean, if you're uh, how can I explain this, uh, if you're a President tenes
Silvia Tirado Interview Page 3. Cornwell: Lopez: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: of a country that is against uh, against Latin America, undeveloped countries, you don't love them, of course, but you may see that is different, that he has been a good President, that he was, I think he was ingenious with his Alliance for Progress, that he tried to have more friends, not. like Dulles who said we don't have friends, we have interests, things like that. Do you know that phrase? One more time. | (Speaks to Tirado in Spanish.) Dulles. He said once the United States has no friends, they have interests. (Speaks in Spanish.) And Kennedy tried to destroy that phrase, saying we want to have friends. And he was changing the politics of Latin America, Kennedy. So, you're saying that because of President Kennedy's policies towards Latin America, that even the part of the Mexican people who were sympathetic to the Cuban Revolution, they also very much liked President Kennedy? I think so. Now, I'm not sure, I mean I-- At least-- oo” Yeah, but you make difference with one President and another. ‘ I understood your answer to my question a moment ago but let me ask it one more time, nevertheless.
Silvia Tirado Interview Page 4. Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: I asked you if at any time during the early. 1960's you had overheard any conversations among people who were in favor of the Cuban Revolution to the effect that they would consider killing the Presi- dent, and you answered with a statement on the logic of the situation, that you don't change the system by changing the President. Nevertheless, let me ask you again, more pointedly. Did you, never- theless, ever overhear any such conversations? No. Did you ever overhear them within the Cuban Consulate or outside it? No. I'm sorry, go ahead. No, but I'm Mexican and I was in Mexico and I was working there and you have to see that uh, even though the Cuban people know I was a friend, they would not say things like that in front of me, of course, no? When the news came over the television and in the news- papers that President Kennedy had been killed, and , : then you heard the name Lee Harvey Oswald, and saw the picture, I guess you immediately reflected back on your contact, correct? Yes. At that time, did anything come into your mind
Silvia Tirado Interview Page 5. Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: in connection with those contacts that you could have read as foreknowledge, in other words, did it totally surprise you that that was the alleged assassin, or was there anything about your contact with him which Ss it understandable? No. No, even now I don't think that he would have done it. You still don't think that he killed him? No, because I think that he was a weak man. I saw that he could get angry, but uh, for me, he was not a man thatcould kill the President, because even when I saw him on television and he said all the time, "I'm innocent" and if I kill someone very im- portant, I would be proud. I mean, because even if I'm with police I know that I'm going to be killed or die or something like that, I'd say, "Yes, I killed the President" and I don't think so. So based on all of your contacts with him, you do not think that he killed the President? I don't think so. __S Let me ask you just some miscellaneéus questions” about the nature of your contact with him. Was there ever any conversations or indications about money problems that he had? Was that ever the sub-
Silvia Tirado Interview Page 6. Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: ject of a conversation? No. The thing that I remember only that he was very in a hurry because his visa was finished and I think he said, he mentioned that he only had three days to stay here in Mexico City. | Did he ever indicate that he hoped the Cuban Govern- ment would finance his trip? I don't think so. Had you ever done that before? Had the Consulate ever done that sort of thing? No, no. We used to do that but they were visitors and we had instructions from Cuba, from the Cuban Government. Only visitors from Cuba, is that what you mean? No, no. For instance, your--the Cuban Revolutionary Anniversary, they invite people, they do have every thing paid. In other words, it was persons that. had been invited to go to Cuba by the Cuban Government? Yes, yes. Well, even though, then you would not, or the Cuban Lf a ; ; Government would not have financed this trip, did he ask for such assistance? At the time that I was working there, it never hap- pens. Specifically Oswald.
Silvia Tirado Interview Page 7. Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: - Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: No. Did he ask for monetary assistance? _ I don't remember. I don't think so. But I don't remember. Did he ever say anything or did you ever observe anything to indicate that he had travelling compan-. ions in Mexico City? No, he didn't mention it. Did he ever say anything or do anything that indi- cated that he knew other people in Mexico City? I don't know. I don't remember. To the best of your knowledge he knew no one, is that correct? Yes. Do you know when he left Mexico City? No. By what form of transportation? No. Did anyone ever call or come by the Consulate on his benalf? No. Did they ever deliver anything. to the Consulate for him? | No. There have, let me ask you this--Has any allegation ever been brought to your attention that you met
Silvia Tirado Interview Page 8. Tirado: Cornwell: with Oswald outside of the Consulate? No. , oe On--let me show you two books, one of which is labeled photo ident book and has roughly three inch by five inch pictures in it and the other one which is labeled JFK Document 7549 and has smaller pic- tures in it, and I'll turn the recorder off for a second and give you a few minutes to look through them and ask us, and I will ask you if you recognize any of the people in these photos. Recorder turned off. Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Okay. We've turned the tape recorder back on and you've had five minutes, maybe ten, I don't know, to look through the two books. In the first book, you only picked out photograph-- . This looks like Fidel. But not exactly. Which one: Number 12? Yeah. Who does that look like? — a Fidel but not exactly. All right. Just a little. Yeah.
Silvia Tirado Interview Page 9. - Cornwell: Okay. And you also I believe pointed to Number 57 when you went through the book. Tirado: Yes. Cornwell: And wha do you think that. is? Tirado: Oswald. Cornwell: Lee Harvey Oswald. Now, many of the pictures in the book are not that clear, of course. When you saw him the first time in the. book, you indicated that that looked like him except that as you recalled him, he had either blue or green eyes and blond hair. Correct? Tirado: Yes. Cornwell: When you say blond hair, what color is that? Is it very light? Tirado: Light. Cornwell: Let's see if we can find an example. Looking in the second book--that's all you found in the first book, correct? | Tirado: Yes. ‘ Cornwell: All right. Looking in the second book, uh, take as y an example, Number 266 04 268,, would’ that be basically what you recall to be the color of his hair, blond? Tirado: Yes. Here it looks very, very light, not that light. Cornwell: Okay. That would be what you describe as blond but your memory is that it was close but not quite as
i j 4 i dette pee erent ee eine oe g ' f a P¢ ‘ ; Silvia Tirado Interview Page 10. Tirado: Cornwell: light as that? Yes. Okay, but the tape recorder was back away from us so - just to make sure we got that answer, you picked out Tirado: in the first book photograph #57. You stated that it looked like the way you recalled the ‘man who came to the Consulate except that he had blue or green eyes and blond hair. And then we were trying to determine what shade you recall the blond hair being, and I asked you--all these are black and white--if it would be similar to photos #266 and #268 in the book 7549? And you said in those pictures that it looks very light and that it would not have been that light, quite that light to your memory. Is that right? Yes. (Long break.) Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: I don't know how, working with black and white photos, we can do much better than that? But-— A little lighter than your eyebrows. A little lighter than my eyebrows? There's another photo. . .In the second book, number 26 or 27. You also pointed to those photos when you went through the book. Would the color of that hair approximate the way you remember it?
Silvia Tirado Interview Page 9. Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: _ Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Okay. And you also I believe pointed to Number 57 when you went through the book. 7 Yes. And whe do you think that is? Oswald. Lee Harvey Oswald. Now, many of the pictures in the book are not that clear, of course. When you gaw him the first time in the Book; you indicated that that looked like him except that as you recalled him, he had either blue or green eyes and blond hair. Correct? Yes. When you say blond hair, what color is that? Is it very light? Light. Let's see if we can find an example. Looking in the : second book--that's all you found in the first book, correct? Yes. All right. Looking in the second book, uh, take as an example, Number 266 04 268, would’that be basically what you recall to be the color of his: hair, blond? Yes. Here it looks very, very light, not that light. Okay. That would be what you describe as blond but your memory is that it was close but not quite as compet
Silvia Tirado Interview Page 10. . light as that? Tirado: Yes. Cornwell: Okay, but the tape recorder was back away from us so just to make sure we got that answer, you picked out in the first book photograph: #57. You stated that it looked like the way you recalled the man who came to the Consulate except that he had blue or green eyes and blond hair. And then we were trying to . determine what shade you recall the blond hair being, and I asked you--all these are black and white--if it would be similar to photos #266 and #268 in the book 7549? And you said in those pictures that it looks very light and that it would not have been that light, quite that light to your memory. Ts that right? Tirado: Yes. (Long break.) Cornwell: I don't know how, working with black and white photos, we can do much better than that? But-- ‘Tirado: A little lighter than your eyebrows. Cornwell: A little lighter than my eyebrows? There's another photo. . .iIn the second book, number 26 or 27. You also pointed to those photos when you: went through the book. Would the color of that hair approximate the way you remember it?
Silvia Tirado Interview ‘Page ll. Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: No, because he had very light, almost white: Okay, again, it would be not as light as that? No. All right. \ Then going to the second book, you pointed to photograph #4, when you looked at the book the first time. What that? is your memory about He reminds me of Mirabal, he reminds me but not exactly. All right. Yes. If I skip a photograph you me know, but I jotted down ‘em when you looked at the to number 26 and 27. Does the same man? Yes. ~~ And who was that? Ernesto Lefel. He used to He looks a little like Mirabal? remember looking at, let: some notes as you came to book. You next pointed that appear to you to be work with my husband. Ernesto LefeL And what's the nature of the associa- tion between he and your husband? He was working with him. In the architectural business? Yes, yes. He's a designer? He's a designer.
Silvia Tirado Interview Page 12. Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: He started working with us. He learned some-— Is he a social acquaintance of yours in addition? Is what? | Do you know him on a social basis in addition to his being a business associate of your husband? No business associate. He was working for him, for Horacio. Okay. That's what I meant. He was an assistant. Assistant. All right. No social. Sometimes he came to our house to dinner, or something like that. Next, you I believe pointed to Number 57. Is that _correct? Fifty-seven? Yes. Who does that look like? He looks like Gavino Fernandez. What's the first name? Gavino. Gavino? And who is he? we , Well, he's uh, dignitary, and~he used to go to the Cuban Institute. He was a dignitary of what? He was working for the Social Security and he was working, not in this Government period, in the last
Silvia Tirado Interview Page 13.. Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Solchi Vargas? one, and he was working even with the President. I see, so he was a dignitary of the Mexican Govern- ment. - Yes. Okay. But when he was going to the Cuban Institute, no, he didn't? You also knew him from the Cuban Institute? He's an economist. He's a what? Economist. Economist. You then pointed to Number 65. Perhaps. And that's a face that you're not sure you recognize? Yes. But looks a little bit like who? Solchi Vargas. Yes. Okay. And who was she? She's Mexican lady who was married with’ a journal- ist, he used to work for the Cuban press, and she used to live in Cuba. And now she's 4t the Cuban Institute. I believe you next pointed to Number 1ll--
Silvia Tirado Interview Page 14. Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tiardo: Cornwell: “when you Yes. And that's a, sort of a three-quarter shot from behind. Yes. Of a man you think you might recognize, is that correct? Yes. I'm sort of trying to recall the way you stated it first looked at the photographs, so if I misstated it, just correct me. Who do you think that man may be? The attache, the Cuban Cultural Attache at that time, Luis Alberu. Alberu? Alberu. And then I believe you next indicated that you may recognize Photograph 115? Yes. om And who is that? Luis Alberu. That of course is a front and you can clearly recog- nize him from that photograph, is that correct? Yes. a Then, you next pointed to Photograph 133. Do you recegnize that man? | Yes. Who is he?
aed Silvia Tirado Interview Page 15. Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: Tirado: Cornwell: f The doorman. Now I don't remember the name. But he's the doorman who left Lee Harvey Oswald into the Consulate on his third visit? Yes. That's accurate? Uh? .I said yes. Okay. And then I believe you pointed to photograph 158? | Numbers 157 and 158. 157 and 158. Who was that? I think that he was working at the Consulate in Vera Cruz? And do you know what his position was at the Con- sulate? | | I think he was Vice Consul but I'm not really sure. And which Consulate is that? In Vera Cruz, Cuban, the Cuban Consulate. The Cuban Consulaté in Vera Cruz. | And I believe finally you recognized possibly the center man in the group photograph labeled 275. Yes. fof And who do you think he is? An American. ae Do you remember anything more about him?
Silvia Tirado Interview -Page 16. Tirado: No. Cornwell: Do you remember where you saw him? Tirado: No. Cornwell: Do you think you recognized the photo from a per- sonal contact or froma picture? Tirado: From a picture I think. I think he was an American Ambassador. Cornwell: American Ambassador? Tirado: Or something like that. Cornwell: All right. And you don't have any memory what his name might be? | | Tirado: No. Cornwell: Okay. Uh. . . Tirado: But tell me, who is it? (Laughter.) For a change. Cornwell: Do you recognize the man in photo 266? Yes, that's the one I want. 266? Tirado: No. He looks like Russian. Cornwell: Do you recognize the man in 265? Tirado: No. \ Cornwell: Do you recognize the man in 213? Tirado:. No. You're not going to tell me who's~“chat man? Cornwell: Not right now. (Laughter.) But maybe later. When the assassination occurred, do you remember where you were, when you first heard the news re- ports? dhescaperpe
Silvia Tirado Interview Page 43. Tirado: Lopez: Tirado: Lopez: (Laughter. Tirado: Lopez: Tirado: Lopez: Tirado: Lopez: Tirado: Lopez: Tirado: Lopez: Tirado: Lopez: Tirado: Lopez: Tirado: Yes. For example, let's start at the beginning. Was he tall, short? | | Short. Short. Could you stand up for a minute, Gary? | ; Would you say he was as tall as Gary? Yeah, more or less. Would you say he was taller than Gary? No, I think just the same. He was about my size. About your height? “Yeah. Okay. And what's your height? 160. I think 160 or 162. Was he skinny? Yes. Skinny. Could you estimate how much he weighed? About your weight, more or less. About my weight. We already went over. He has stronger shoulders, perhaps, than yours. Just for the record, my weight is 1]9 pounds. You told us before he had a suit on. That I don't remember very well. I think he was wearing a jacket but what I can remember is that he was not wearing nice clothes, expensive clothing. ro tie al
ae IN O Cy t bX (Db n | ee (b 0) @) ry W) ( }~ iu cr {D Oo x @) o wy (b Ou a) ci i oO © oO {uy 3 be ct ry morning to the public and it closed at 2:00 p.m. in the (uv rh cr Oo i (@) Q AZCUE: Yes - 10:00 and 2:00 sometime. I think it was = 1 around 1:00 o'clock. Then we asked him for photos to attach to 3} the application. Then he came the following day and brought with him nis photos -- probabiv that same date listed on the Ie ct ‘application, the 27th of September. BLAKEY: How long was he there the first time? as a vesult we could not do anything more for nim at that time. BLAKEY: Was thers any conversation nad that did not ry wD ke tu ct (D cr re) cm by c(i) < {~ 17) fy ~ r z, Was} ayy3 a} =4 —— = > BLAKEY: Was he with anyone the first day? f oT 7 ied mate _ ~ a4 AZCUE: NO. He a2liways came alone. BLAKEY: Did you see somecne outsice that he ma he we fu <q (D .gone out to meet? \ AZCUE: That I was not able to see, for my office did not . a a have a window looking to the exterior ai tne duilding. I could really not see outside. re . BLAXEY: Was there anything that ne said that would lead. you to believe that he may nave been witn someone else?
Eusepic Azcue Interview page 4 AZCUE No. BLAKEY Was there anything that he might nave said ws NS Q ty i @) Hy (3) @ Qu ts ce) ry ra) (vy rm) Oo 5 ct 6) ry (D hk (u ct (D ov ‘3 N 6) b that informa- ¥ BLAKEY: Could vou tell us about what time he came the second time? AZCUE: He came 2t approximately the same iime that ne Came on nis first visit - to bring the photos and also to th f+ 2 | imal Oo G ct w my u) ju a8) 'O re {+ Q fu ct t 4 oO Me AZCUE: No, he did not. BLAKEY: Did he indicate to vou why he did not bring them with him the first time? a AZCUE: Nobody brings them the first time. Ze brought pavers that belonged te nis wiite that stated that she was a did not understand. But Later I will explain now I found out. BLAKEY: Could you state what was said and done on the second occasion? ww , AZCUE: On that occasion he asked me how long it would take for the visa apolication to get authorized. BLAXEY: And what did you tell him? ;