JFK Assassination System Date: 2/8/2016 Identification Form Agency Information AGENCY: HSCA . RECORD NUMBER: _ 180-10142-10099 RECORD SERIES: CIA SEGREGATED COLLECTION AGENCY FILE NUMBER: © 23-08-04 Document Information ORIGINATOR: HSCA FROM: ’ Beleased under the John TO: ; . Kennedy Ws5assination Records TITLE : ollection dct of 1992 (44 USC 2107 Note). ase#: NW S3080 Date: He—-O1-2017 DATE: 06/06/1978 PAGES:. 32 SUBJECTS : OSWLAD, LEE, POST-RUSSIAN PERIOD, TRAVEL, TRIP TO MEXICO NAVARRO, RUBEN DURAN DOCUMENT TYPE: TRANSCRIPT CLASSIFICATION: — Unclassified RESTRICTIONS: 1A CURRENT STATUS: — Redact DATE OF LAST REVIEW: — 08/07/1995 OPENING CRITERIA : . COMMENTS : Box 12. ‘ > vO1 HW 530860 Docld:322371403 Page 1
os me os | - KENNEDY i ous | _ INVEST IGArTON INTERVIEW SCHEDULE L. ‘Identifying Information: _ . oo es cc Name "Ruben Duran. Navarro : Date June 6, 1978 - Address _ _ Place _. City/state . _ Telephone «Date of Birth M or § : _. Social Security Spouse == a ee . Children [2 Physical Description: 7 oe i. ee Height . OO - Color Eyes Hair © Weight . +. Special Characteristics ° . _ | Ethnic Group oo BF 7 oo ose Tt uo. ner nes eee 3 Cpersonai # History: a. “Present Employment :_ Address ee Telephone co b. Criminal Record. oe re ae acre . 1. Arrests oo a ae : 2. Convictions 4. Additional Personal Information: .a. Relative(s): Name Address b. Area frequented: -C. Remarks: an : : ; lan a a a’ Investigator _ oe _ Se Date a | . Form $4-B HW 53060 Docld:32271403 Page 2?
Pot A Lee loonie Cd aan a iene peter es nen rad item. hae Santana mes Rab tg A Ra ial eet Retna lad fa Neate ete Wa ES ie ete pa ng AAR Ea RE A th 9 thi pre H 4 i } A 4 | KENNEDY posh C SELECT COMMITTEE ON ASSASSINATIONS '- Name Ruben Duran Navarro Date June 6, 1978 Time 11:15AM Address | Place | “So Interview: : Present: Gary Cornwell, Dan Hardway, Ed- Lopez, | HW 53060 Harold Leap, Honorio Escondon and Dr. Alfonso Orozco Contreras G. Cornwell : Representing the Mexican Government, : ‘Honorio Escondon and pr. Alfonso Orozco "Contreras. We spoke to you last’ week = on Wednesday and we have come back today. to simply make a record of your memory of the events that we have an interest in. R. Duran - : Yes. | | a G. cornwell ~: Could you tell what your present occupation | is. mo ; R. Duran | ; Interior Design 2 G. Cornwell +: What is the business address? ‘R«z Duran : Here? = ? | _? -G. Cornwell : And how long have you had that occupation? R. Duran : Since 1948 Interviewer Signature Typed Signature | Gary Cornwell. Dan Hardway,_E d Lopez, Harold Leap Date transcribed 6/30/78 DoclId: 322771403 Page 3
coe ea nee L > ° Interview: Ruben Duran Navarro > Se O HW 53060 G. Cornwell _R. Duran ’ G. Cornwell _R.. Duran . ' 6. Cornwell R. Duran G. Cornwell OR, Duran G. Cornwell R. Duran G. Cornwell R. Duran G. Cornwell DocId: 32271403 ve During that period of time, have you had any other jobs or’ sources of income? No. | I'd like to direct your attention to the week of November 22, that was a Friday, of 1963. “pid it come to your attention — on that day, that President John F. Kennedy had. been assassinated? 7 | Yes.» | Do you recall where you were when you first heard that news. Well, it was Friday, I was probably working. » I don't remember exactly where I was but I ae hear the news, I read the papers and all other excitment. Did you at that time have an occasion to - . discuss the assassination with any other person? Yes, probably with my brother, with my | wife, with everybody that is near me. And for the record what is the name of - your brother? - ae Horatio Duran Navarro. And your wife's name? Betty Serrato Azucka de Duran. And are you still married to her? Page 4
| HW 53080 R. Duran G. .Cornwell R. Duran: ~ 6. Cornwell R. Duran G. Cornwell R. Duran G. Cornwell R. Duran DocId: 32271403 "Interview: Ruben Duran Navarro 3 bo” Yes. Did you have an occasion, on that day, to discuss it with anyone else? | | | I don't. remember exactly who I discuss it oan a. - | On that day, or shortly thereafter, did you read in the newspapers or see on television-— or hear on television, the 1 name and the face of the. alleged assassin? .I remember that I read the. papers out of the--sure everybody read the paper, everybody read the paper to see what happen. The only — * thing I didn't--er don't remember who was. the ee killer til they took us to the ? _? a precient. _ ‘That was the first time I hear his: name. Had you, then to the best of your. memory not ‘discussed the name of the assassin, Lee Harvey Oswald, with any friends or relatives . prior to being taken to the police station? No, because during that hour that they took. us=~ . that hour, I did not know the name of this guy. Do you recall seeing his picture on . television or in the newspapers? - 7 T remember the first time I saw his picture was on TV when they took it and they kill him. Page 5
HW 53060 G6. G. DocId: 32271403 Cornwell Duran Cornwell Duran . Cornwell ‘Duran Cornwell Duran Cornwell Duran Cornwell Duran Cornwell — Duran Cornwell Duran . Interview:. Ruben Duran Navarro co oo a oe ee oe Correct? — ‘What were the If I know Lee peel That would have been the occasion on which he was killed, the assasin was killed, or the alleged assassin was killed in the police -station in Dallaz? “Yes. That would have been then on Sunday the 24th. Yes. . | Upon seeing Lee Harvey Oswald then on television at that time did you have any memory of ever seeing him on any prior occasions? . No. ‘Going back then, to your statement that his. name came to your attention when the police contacted you. ai Yes. Would it be accurate. to state that was on November 23rd, Saturday? | . At that time the police came to your home? Correct. And they also took you to the police station? Yes. nature of the questions they asked you? Oswald. They don't ask me if Page 6
HW 53060 - Ge G. OR. G. G. G. R. Cornwell “Duran Cornwell , Duran Cornwell Duran Cornwell _ Duran. Cornwell Duran > Cornwell Duran Cornwell. toInterview: Ruben Duran Navarro og ee, 5 know him. They told me that he was my friend ? 7 | In other words they made the allegation or the accusation to you that he was your friend, is that correct? Yes. In order to get you to respond? . Yes. Did they make any other allegation or accusation you? No. Did they look through any of your books or | = papers or records? They look through--when they went to my home, they went through my pictures and my papers — Between my sister-in-law went to my house. going to. see what' Ss going on. Then when they all _these people, get into my: house, they started looking in all my “papers, all my draws, everything. They did a thorough search of your ‘home? Yes. compete search? well, I don't think it was’a complete search ‘because they they just looked for pictures. IL . had a lot of pictures. a ‘But they looked everywhere in your house?” Docld: 32271403 Page 7
HW 53060 ‘Interview: Ruben Duran Navarro ae . 6 ‘Duran Cornwell Duran Cornwell ‘Duran Cornwell Duran Cornwell "Duran Cornwell ¢ Duran Docld: 32271403 on I don't remember if they looked everywhere in my wife's house -~man, it was so many Well, people over there. “around probably they looked all through my house. To you knowledge did they find anything ‘which: indicated any association between you and Lee Harvey Oswald? No, it was impossible. How many people do you recall being taken. to the police station? 7 It was er, my sister-in-law, my brother, my wife, this American girl, Barbara was ” there, her boyfriend that went to pick up her and ? he's dead already, girlfriend of my sister, she was "eating with my brother and my sister. “When were all of you released from the police station? At the same day--the next day Sunday. at’ about two or three o'clock in the morning. So it would be very late Saturday? Around twelve hours they took us there--eleven to twelve hours. ‘After that do you recall again--or do you recall discussing the interrogation with your relatives? Yes, I discussed that. We asked my sister-in-law a Page 6
Interview: Ruben Duran Navarro what was going on and she told us that she could not talk. The only thing that she | could tell us that the reason they took | | us over there because he has her name-~ Lee Oswald has her name in her phone book. Gs Cornwell : OK when you say your sister-in-law, you are oo 7 “referring to Silvia? | -R. Duran : Silvia, yes. ~~ G. Cornwell : When did this conversation occur? a RR. Duran 3 In Samborne's after _ they let her. go we a ty : -went all together when \ we got away from there | | to have something to eat. : C ~~ G. Cornwell So this would be two or three o'clock in the | cee - “ morning? | R. Duran Boy Yes. Three or four. _ G. Cornwell: You went to Samborne's? “RI Duran - : Yes. | | - @. Cornwell : And that. is a large department store, cafeteria, on cate?’ . | R. Duran : Yes, it's only one block from there. It's a | - cafe that's open 24 hours. The only one there © Open 24 hours. | G. Cornwell : And at that time you discussed the nature of the questions that had been asked by the police? R. Duran .§ ¢: Yes. oo G. Cornwell Did you learn through those conversations that HW 53060 DBocld:32271403 Page 9
Interview: Ruben Duran Navarro_ 8. . pecs the police had asked aby other kinds of questions other than the ones they had oe ey _ asked ‘of you? In other words, did they _ — | any kinds (of accusations of the other >  people=- of Silvia or Horatio? -'R. Duran a : No, no, no. They all asked the same thing re and all--they told us it was a pig mistake | and that. we have to forget about everything. - G, Cornwell : OK based on the. conversations that you had © at Sanborne's , it appeared to you that the police had asked everyone the same type of . . questions? | | C.-° "R) puran |” Fyes, I think that everybody asked the same-- | : } my brother, they asked him to, my wife too and everybody. | | \G. Cornwell + All right. Based on those. conversations, aid | oe anyone, ~~your brother, your wite, ‘anyone eyes oe - indicate that they had ever met with or seen Lee Harvey, Oswald besides Silvia? R. Duran ; The only one was Silvia. G. Cornwell : And would you tell us as best you recall exactly a | what Silvia said at that time the nature or | her contact with Oswald was? a | R. Duran :.My I speak Spanish? - G. Cornwell : Certainly, we'll translate.. R. Duran : OK HW 53060 DBocld:32271403 Page 10
‘Interview: Ruben Duran Navarro Qe Hoes R. Duran . : I remember that we arrived at Samborne's. | Oo We were all very anxious to find out exactly , what had happened--what this whole thing was all about. Than Silvia said to us, the problem was, the accused assassin of John F. Kennedy had been in Mexico looking for a visa to go to Russia via Cuba. Ed. Lopez - -: In other words a in-transit visa. R. Duran - : And that she had been the person who would ae | handle him, and so that he would not consistently or persistently visit the Cuban Consulate, she had given him her telephone so that he could C. BT cones —_ communicater with her and for that reason they ee had looked her up and they had found data with > ~ her name ina address book of Lee Harvey Oswald's.- R. Duran . ‘That's it. .G. Cornwell Did she tell you anything about any other . nen ‘conversations which may have occured inside of the consulate? | R. Duran . ‘No. We did not discuss any of that because _ - we were all very tired and really none of us| knew anything about this. The following day I'm not sure if it was the following day or the day after that, they again detained her to the Security Station to protect her. >. T.V. so that she would not be alone. eae east me gees ioe . HW 53060 DBocld:32271403 Page 11
HW 53060 Interview: Ruben Duran Na-arro a . LO obs? -G. Cornwell R. Duran © G. Cornwell R. Duran : G. Cornwell R. Duran _ G. Cornwell R. Duran DoclId: 32271403 Then again I did not see her-- we've never _ really been that close-- until it all ended. Did she mention to you anything. about her reaction to Oswald--what she thought about her? I'm not sure if we talked about that, but we probably did talk about it since it is. So strange, so out of the ordinary. I tried to figure out what was going on and I became _. very interested and I asked ? - to be | more ? about it. Where did you read about it? In the newspapers. Anywhere else? ? ‘Did she tell you whether or not Oswald had made her mad, whether she felt sorry for ‘him, whether she’ tried to help him or any thing along those lines? What was her personal reaction to him? I'm not exactly sure, but I. have an idea. She gave him the telephone number because she felt very sorry for him and he continued to insist--insisted-- and I think that's why she probably gave him the phone number, as he remembers. a 2 cee ee Page 12
aes comet ME vain Eee RI ARO ERR I Ret yt a CN Se A a Ne te eno ae meen ee anit 9 een ets nce ee Interview: HW 53060 Cornwell » Duran Cornwell Duran Cornwell ‘Duran > Cornwell * Duran > Cornwell Duran Cornwell Ruben Duran Na ‘arro : — / 12 eet cen ae eats treatin enim antnie ir abstinent Did she ever express any doubt about whether | or not the man who was in some the newspapers and on television was in fact the man who had come to the consulate and visit with her? No. Did she ever Say anything to you that lead you to believe she’ might have met with him outside of the Consulate? | | No. Has that allegation or accusation ever come to your attention before? Have you ever heard any conversation about that possibility? No. Did she ever say anything to you which indicated ' that he may have made comments in conversations we with ner: that indicated an intention in his - part to possibly to shot the president? ‘No... | ‘Are you sure about that? Yes. i m Let me read to you a small excerpt out of a book written by Daniel Schorr, a correspondent from the United States,. called Clearing the Air which reports apparant comments by Fidel Castro and ask you if she she ever relayed anything like this-- a conversation like this to you-- eee DoclId: 32271403 Page 13
Soa CEES Tet Scat DCE ete nO a UNIT OO BEL SS OCDECCONCELY OR SUESCCTU SSE STO EOCENE ToL CEO EOC OCEO SIE ss Ose NOES SPOTS SSS SS = OUST TSO SEPT EOE oo SRO PeIAUE LORD SATIS SL DOTS TLE 101 a 4 . Interview: Ruben Duran Na arro . 12 Oob! silvia did. It states in the book on page 171 "In an interview in July 1967, with’ a. _British . Journalist, Comer Clark, Castro said that. ~ Oswald had come to the Cuban Cousulate twice - each time for about fifteen minutes. The first time I was told he wanted to work for us, he was asked to: explain, but he wouldn't, he wouldn't go into details. The second time he said he wanted to free Cuba from American Imperialism. Then he said something like oo . Someone ought to shot that: President Kennedy then Oswald said and this was exactly how it Co oo : a was reported to me, 'Maybe I'll try to do it'." — | oS -. Did Silvia ever explain her contact with Oswald in terms--in any way resembling that? , . oo} R. Duran No. none absolutely. a G. Cornwell : Did she ever indicate the possibility, that: es oe perhaps when she was leaving the Consulate, | Oswald was waiting outside to talk to her? Was there any contact like that outside of the Consulate? a R. Duran. : No. I. don't if she really has some kind of a | | contact with him or relating with the Visa or ‘something like that, but he--I never heard any- thing like that. G. Cornwell : Ok that, exactly the possibility that I meant | HW 53080 DoclId: 32271403 Page 14
_Interview:. G. , Duran “Cornwell “Duran » Cornwell Duran Cornwell - Duran > Cornwell Duran... “Cornwell | HW 53060 DBocld:32271403 Ruben Duran Navarro © a ee 2: ae pete -to ask you about, the possibility that he had waited and said, you know "Can you give me some more help on this Visa” or anything like that. Tt can be possible. ‘But you never heard any stories? ‘Oh. no, no, I never heard any stories. | You indicated earlier, that the: subject matter, of course with Silvia's contact with this man interested you enough that you read the newspaper: articles on it? Yes, I have read all the probleris during that “ time for that reason and. — Had you ever read the Warren Commission report? Had you ever read any part of it, for instance the’ part dealing with. Silvia? No. I don' t even. know what it is. ghe | arrest: and detention by ‘the Mexican authorities, in and of itself is of no interest to us, except with respect to one point and that is, was there — “anything about that arrest or your treatment | which led you to provide them anything but the truth about what happened? In other words, did. arrest or the detantion cause you to make any false statements to them? Page 15 rane mane oe ee gee i ee esta eo
RE etc eR mm vate a tea ab ST Dine ee endear ea, Semaate Rete semen nett a ate Sine ene mene Smee ee agneneseiatn wet ail eA e ceanRCEe SieFae interview: Ruben Duran Navarro . a - 14 O61! R. Duran = No. - G.. Cornwell : Did you tell them the ‘absolute truth when they interviewed you? “RS Duran os Yes. It was very little to say. I didn't have | ne to really think about it. | | ~@. Cornwell : So everything you told him was the truth? oT R. Duran | : Yes. oe -G.. Cornwell : Did you know Sabio Asquay? ~ -R. Duran Thissis the first I-hear his name, I don't know. G. Cornwell : He was the Council at the Cuban Consulate. “R. Duran ~ Um hum. .  G. Cornwell CR puran  G. Cornwell ~ You did not know him though? oO a - | - No, I do not know him. ae +e Had you ever met him? R. Duran > Never. — \G. Cornwell Did you know an employee there, Theresa Prorenzo . ee { R.° Duran No. : DO oo G. Cornwell : Dia. you ever now a person name Louisa Calverone? Re Duran « Louisa Calverone? No. G. Cornwell. Did you ever know Camillo Carbiedo? R. Duran : Well, I hear his name in the Papers, he is 3 ek a writer 2. cee ‘But I never met him. ee G. Cornwell ; A cousin of yours Deba Guiera. “R. Duran | +s Deeba. 7 Not ? It's Debake Gueria de ? ‘She's a cousin of mine. Her husband was my _ professor--an art professor of mine at St. Carnabis. ——— swt meet HW 53060 DBocld:32271403 Page 16
| oceans i 7 : eee aaa Interview: Ruben Duran Navarro | are 15 O67 e.. G. Cornwell : Did--was your realtionship with DeBakke or | Ellena or her daughter Ellinita more than | just a family relationship? Was it social . | at all? | | a oe oe eo, R. Duran og No, we--when we were kids we used to see | OSs - each other very often, but after I got. married and after, I don't know probably a since 1943 since I didn't see them very often, only once ina while. _ 6. -Cornwell 2 On those occasions what was the nature of | a those associations? What type of events? ! -R. Duran 3 Well, since her husband was broken she (CC Sree S was trying to sell his paints outside | | interior design the greatest, so I sometimes | I sell some of his paints to some of my clients. | G. Cornwell = Who is this you are talking about? | ; -G.- Cornwell : Did you ever go to parties with DeBake or a oo a - " Ellena? -R. Duran . : Well not during that ‘time, probably when we. | | were, kids. G. Cornwell =:. Only when you were kids? R. Duran; Yes. . . + : 1 | G. Cornwell During the 1960's we understand that you and Silvia and Horatio had dance parties, is that “correct? Oo. ee Oo . | | ioe ~ J [ - rs pe ae ae 1 ~ - er eee ne ene eee med HW 53080 DocId:32271403 Page 17
— -R. Duran G. Cornwell R. Duran "6. Cornwell R. Duran _.G. Cornwell Re Duran G. Cornwell 7 R. Duran G. Cornwell R.: Duran . G. Cornwell ’R. Duran: Interview: Ruben Duran Navarro a - a Dow - :: Do what? : Dance parties, where you get together with a bunch of friends and do the twist and. ‘that sort of thing? Oh yes, Yes, yes. : Did Elenna or Ellinita DeBake ever come - to those parties? No, we don't see each other for some time and they are older than us. She is about . 10 years older than I am. | | | : Where were those parties held? In my. house where I used to live and ? 2 - after I change address from -Erridoto, where they arrest us, where they | went for us, we moved-to another part of the street up ‘from. there. There we used to have Parties. :Oh, about ten parties in three years, something» like that. Did during this same period of time, you ‘or we Horatio or Silvia know any persons £rom Cuba? ae . “Here in Mexico? Yes.’ : No, not that I know. : Not that you knew anyway? Did you recall during that period of time ever meeting a Negro from Cuba? os No. RT RR oN aE nC eR BEAR REBT BEAR ORES HON ee hein ys nant eee elena Te HW 53080 DocId:32271403 Page 16