3 background information concerning Oswald's defection. Would | | that have escalated the significance of his contacts with the | E 7 Soviets in Mexico City, in your opinion? | a 7 | Mr. Angleton. Let me see that again. I think that would g "| be a solid trace. In other words, it would be from Scott's | F | point of view a matter of considerable interest. » ; Mr. Goldsmith. Why is that? | : fo | Mr. Angleton. Because it does not read like a lot of | Z i third hand information. It looks like it is pretty solid | Z 12 | information. It is not a lot of allegations and so on. | ee : 43 Mr. Goldsmith. Why would Scott be concerned about the 3 al fact that Oswald was a defector? I guess I am asking you to | 2 il = sl state the obvious. _. : = a Mr. Angleton. He had been: .in-countérintelligence all his) = 17 | life and he had handled an awful lot of Soviet cases. - al | Mr. Goldsmith. The last sentence of pagraph five indi- , : °| cates "Please keep headquarters advised of any further nodes ¢ 0 contacts or positive identification of Oswald." | H | 1! : Assuming that the Mexico City station,.-prior to the j & ca? 33 : assassination, knew that Oswald had also contacted the Cuban | HY 0955 37 lil somebody who had a record on him. is Mr. Goldsmith. The next paragraph makes reference to headquarters and by using the words or the phrase "assuming he tas i { | 23! Embassy, should that information have been communicated to t { i I | that Mexico City station knew", I mean actual knowledge, they |. Docld: 32263411 Page 116 SLOQES SON BEBORTING COMPANY ©
38 112 had linked the contact of an individual with the Cuban Embassy, specifically Oswald, should that information have va { 3 || been communicated to headquarters? Mr. Angleton. You mean if they thought the same. indi- 2  . | vidual hwere had been in touch with the Cubans? a 5 | Mr. Goldsmith. Yes. een a S | Mr. Angleton. Sure. a 4 Mr. Goldsmith. I note at the bottom left hand corner Ss 4 D> of the document that Thomas Karamessines was the releasing officer. Why would someone as high up in DDO as Karamessines | | have been the releasing officer for a cable of this kind? { . . | Mr. Angleton. I think that the reason for that would be that when you have more than one division involved plus a staff and all that, he probably wanted to have his finger on | REPORTERS BUTLDING, WASHINGTON, B.C. iste ub, 16 Mr. Goldsmith. What other: division besides DDO was | | Ss. 7 involved here? E 7 Mr. Angleton. SR Division. Since the fellow was from 2 \g | Russia and all that Russian background it. would be involved. : ell ‘Mr. Goldsmith. We have Western Hemisphere units con- ——- ne cerned and also Soviet Russian units concerned? SS Mr. Angleton. Thae is right. Mr. Goldsmith. Do you know whether the Mexico City sta- tion ever obtained a tape’ recording of Oswald's voice? . WwW bee Mr. Angleton. I would assume so but I don't know. I
39 113 i t assume they did when they talked about that previous informa- tion you showed me. Wait a minute. Let me recapitulate: to 3. "According to so and so American spoke proken Russian 4 and said his name was so and so." It was obviously a tape. 2 5 Mr. Goldsmith. Do you know if there were any tape record : pi : ings of Oswald's voice in existence at the time of the assassit 3 7 nation? | | z a ) Mr. Angleton. I don't know. ; 3 | Mr. Goldsmith. I would like to show you a letter dated. | : ‘a | November 23, 1963 which I regret is not in very good form, | Z MH | in other words, a poor ‘xerox. The letter is from Mr. Hoover : 2 12 to the head of the Secret Service. I am only going to ask | | i 2 7m you to read one paragraph in it. starting.at the bottom of page| E ra four, going on to page five. If you have difficulty reading : = tg this, I will be glad to read it to. you. : = té - Mr. Angleton. This is from whom to whom? | = 17 | Mr. Goldsmith. This is. from Mr. Hoover. to Mr. Rowley of : E 1a the Secret“Service. : , | | 15 | , -Mr. Angleton. I can't read it. | € 20 -Mr. Goldsmith. Let me read it then and I apologize for 31 | the poor form. ' . th ge? 74 "The Central Intelligence Agency advised that on October | 23 | 1, 1963, an extremely sensitive source has reported that an | a 24 : idnvidual identified himself as Lee Oswald contacted the : a3 ' Soviet Embassy in Mexico City."
40 114 j Then it is sanitized. The next relevant sections are nm as follows: Special agents of this Bureau who have conversed | i with us from Dallas, Texas, have observed photographs of the a individual referred to above and have listened to a recording of his voice. These special agents are of the opinion htat { i { -In other words, the substance of this paragraph suggests 4% ! | P the above referred to individual was not Lee Harvey Oswald." 20024 (202) SS%~2945 — that there was a tape recording that was listened to after the <b assassination by FBI agents. The recording purported to p.c. i . contain Oswald's voice but the agents were of the opinion that it was not Oswald's voice... Do you have any information con- cerning this issue? Mr. Angleton. No. Does; that indicate whose tape it is? i ; - | Mr. Goldsmith. It does not. The inference is that it is) a CIA tape. Frankly, this is a sanitized document. REPORTERS BUTEDING, WASHTHCTON , o i i ‘ i i t f t ‘ Su, 7 . Mr. Angleton. I wondered if the Bureau had a tape. | ‘Mr. Goldsmith. The inference here is tnat at the time boy 3 i i t ‘ 1g) the Bureau was in possession of the tape. | | - Did the CIA's Mexico City station ever obtain a photograph . | 390 Tru STRET, Oo io | of Oswald as a result of its. photo-surveillance operation | against the Soviet and Cuban Consulates? - ea al £27 3 Mr. Angleton. I don't know. — Mr. Goldsmith. Do you think that they should have obtained a photograph of Oswald in light of the scope of the Sty AS / 4 Hod t3 be daa coverage? : HW 50955 Docld:32263411 Page 119
41 115 Mr. Angleton. I don't know how good the coverage was. i In other words, I don't know -- in those days cameras were not: i) hwat they are today, I mean in germs of automated or the type f - , | that takes one ver minute. I don't know what it was set > 3 ‘to. be | | | } : z a 6) Mr. Goldsmith. In any event, you have no pe-sonal know- | “ | ° S " ledge of this? Sg! Mr. Angleton. No. I don't know whether this is a movie | g | be - 9 } ox still. ° | a | | 2 oi il Mr. Goldsmith. You made reference earlier to Win Scott = | " ; | = 1 | whom I take it you regarded as an extremely competent indi- = 34 vidual? | - “| ; «3 . : : ! HE = 44 | Mr..Angleton. Yes. = | , : Z ota | Mr. Goldsmith. Was Win Scott well known for maintaining id | = A | Eo og | an extremely thorough record system? 9 ~ i = re Mr. Angleton. He was. He was always fighting the “A al administration part of the Agency, who always wanted to reduce). - | , — . = ta the files or burn stuff and so on. | = 13 | Mr. Goldsmith. The administration people wanted to burn : é = files and he was inclined to keep them? } mo : j | 1 Mr. Angleton. Yes. . Ra } ce x27 x Mr. Goldsmith. Do you know where his files are stored? ! 224 Mr. Angleton. He had a big office. i | Mr. Goldmith. In Mexico City? ‘ Mr. Angleton. Yes. , | HW 50955 Docld:32263411 Page i120 ALS 2230
42 116 . : | Mr. Goldsmith. Did Win Scott also maintain materials in | | 8 2 anpersonal safe? 3 | Mr. Angleton. I am certain that he dia. | a i 4 | Mr. Goldsmith. .Do you know where that safe was? | \ ree Mr. Angleton. I don't know but I know it would certainly! = | | = P | be under his eye and it would be:zin his office, I would assume} cs 7 Mr. Goldsmith. After Win Scott's death did you ever visit = | | =, 2 | Mexico City for the purpose of removing materials from Win . 5 | Scott's safe?. 3 74 . | - 19 Mr. Angleton. Yes, I visited there but not for the pur- | = ‘ i | S : i g 7 | pose of removing stuff from the safe. $ 1 Mr. Goldsmith. What was the general purpose of the visit? a = 13 | Mr. Angleton. Well, number one, I was appointed as an = ta | official by Dick to go down there to the funeral. Number two, | = 1s 1 Win was going to write a book, a manuscript. My purpose was. = | | = | 1 to go down and get all copies of the manuscript. | | - 17 Since I was a close friend of his and I knew his wife and : = 12 all that, I combined both things and talked to her and | . 5 | explained our position on it. eS 39 | Mr. Goldsmith. Were you able to obtain this manuscript? =] | Mr. Angleton. Yes. OR aaa 4 A G e279 3 i Mr. Goldsmith. Did you have occasion to review it at i i 33 | all? ft i @ 22 4 Mr. Angleton. I looked through it. He made more than 72 i one draft. : [ i a 4 i i ' i HW 50955 Docld:322963411 Page 121 “. ses . waaay ALESNSON RESORTING COMPAN:
43 117 H ‘ | Mr. Goldsmith. What was the general purpose of the manu- script, to give an account of his experience with the Agency? 3 Mr. Angleton. Well, it was sort of a last will and ; testament of an operator in which a lot of it was camoflaged” | = ; | and romanticized into a story. It had a plot and all that. nu | ; 5 5 Win had written under a pseudonym some seven stories of his S 7 youth’ in Alabama which were sort of Mark Twainish. He had & , | at privately printed. ; 5) It was an extremely good book. TI think that he was try- | : ot ing to write a mystery novel but at the same time he was mak- | 3 1 | ing a lot of observations about the world of espionage and | =. oo: i < a me in particular. Ee : =r Mr. Goldsmith. — Was this particular manuscript ever | ae = 14 published? : | Mr. Angleton. Not to my knowledge. =) it : ra Mr. Goldsmith. Was it intended to be a fictional or 3 tT nonfictional account? - ; 7 = 13 : Mr. Angleton. . Both. — I mean, it was fictional but it | - 7 was recognizable. I mean, anyone who was in the business would £ 10 | have recognized a great deal in it. | | we 2! oe Mr. Goldsmith. How did the Agency know that Scott was | genes writing that manuscript? | 333 ‘Mr. Angleton. I don't know. I know that his wife, as I recall, his wife didn't know he was writing. I don't know ais / ‘ a re) precisely how we found out, whether he told us or how it came ‘ ppm pene gem eS TENG CONE SY HW 50955 Docld:32263411 Page 122 ALi RASGN REPORT
44 118 to us. I knew at one time but it slips my mind precisely ee | how we knew. Mm Mr. Angleton. None of them. 3 Mr. Goldsmith. Did you obtain any materials other than 4 | this manuscript? | | = 5 Mr. Angleton. I don't know. I can't remember. I know | 3 P I got an awful lot of material which I turned over to the | 3 5 | Chief of Mission down there to dispatch back through the E a ; pouch. | | - 3 : Mr. Goldsmith. Do. you recall how long the manuscript | z 19 | was? How many pages? g 74. | Mr. Angleton. It was sort of thickish,- about that. thick. = ho - $ 12 (Indicating). I can't tell how many drafts there were. fs 2 13 Apparently it was far’ from being finished. It was well on -- = tA Mr. Goldsmith> Did he ever discuss it with you? & i = 1g | / Mr, Angleton. No. EE Mr. Goldsmith. Why don't we take a brief recess now or | = IT | perhaps Miss Brady will resume questions. “I will review some. ' a | . i g 13 materials that have been provided to me by the Agency. I might 19 | add that so far as I am concerned, we are in. pretty good shape £ 39 in terms of time. | . i ee 1! Miss. Brady. ‘pia you have any contact with Bernard i ry * 2S x | Barker, Howard Hunt or Eugenio Martinez during your CIA career? 23 | Mr. Angleton. Who was the first one? | @ 24 Miss Brady. Benard Barker. | ;
doa 2 202% (202) 55-2345 ery Ch P.c. REPORTERS BUTLDING, WASHINGTON, Su, ts con x - a] _ co ind oF HY 50955 Docld: 32263411 Page i234 119 Miss. Brady. At ahy time?~: Mr. Angleton. No. I want to explain the Hunt business. i One of the things that this Joe Trento, the reporter, gave out | i t that he learned form this Committee, he put it that he learned! from the Committee that they had a memorandum between. myself and Dick Helms to the effect that I wrote a memo to Dick say~ ing that Howard Hunt was in Dallas at the time of the assassi-; nation and I was suggesting or proposing a cover-up. Miss Brady. To whom? Mr. Angleton. To Helms. Now, when I was called before | the Watergate Committee I was challenged about soom such and what they were talking about. I determined that that is where, all the Watergate people were hanging about, Hunt. | 4 ] | | such in the Executive Office Building. I didn't even know | | i I kept getting all these threatening telephone calls from Seymour Hirsch of the New York Times and all of that. I i { ' couldn't honestly understand what they were talking about until ) the whole Hunt thing hit the fan and they arrested Hunt and so on. “os Then a journalist came to me and tole me that there was ~ in inspector Bast, he called himself Inspector Bast, who is. | supposed to be a well to.do man, a lawyer of some sort, a private investigator in McLean, and he had invited Colson to his. swimming pool and that he had a hidden microphone in the shrubbery and that Colson told him that Angleton had recruited
46 120 Hunt and was running Hunt in the White House as his agent and that Hunt reported to Angleton daily. I | | 3 Bast was reported to have this tape recording which he | & 4 | made known to this journalist. The journalist was going to : a 2 3 | print all of this. a . : : Miss Brady. When was this? During the Watergate period? & Z | Mr. Angleton. Sometime maybe a little after or during. z 3 | So I laughed at this fellow and told him, I said "That is just. ; 5 ; about as crazy as’ anything I have ever heard." I said, "If | : tg you pursue that", I told him, "vou will be exposed on this.” z iy : nS I never met Howard Hunt in. my life." i 2 7 He was arrested on a Firday or Saturdy. The first work- | ; r | : al ing day I asked the Office of Security to supply me with eight | , = ta | by ten photos of his security badges.- In our organization : 4 you go to hundreds of meetings without knowing all the people.: = el It is part of the compartmentation, if you would like. there- = a fore, I had to be doubly sure because the newpaper picture of : : 7 Hunt “was about this big and you coulén't get any features out | ¢ ro | So, when they showed me the photographs, I had never 7 seen Hunt in my life. - i The curious thing here, and I never explained it to the ! press or anytobyd, is the fact that my Deputy's name is: Jim , | Hunt and I just let them go along, since they started the myth, we i let them live with it. But Jim Hunt being retired and playing. | od + HW 50955 DocId: 32263411 Page 125
47 121 gol£, I saw no reason to give an explanation and ruin the 19th’ hole so to speak. ho i t } i ! | a2 the things he also said to me at that time was, "Has Hunt ye | So, when Trento called me at the Army-navy Club, one of been in touch with you?" Again he is on that same Colson-Bast ° t ' . j : et cetera, route as the others. cae tn gg en eee te : . Miss Brady. So it is fair to say, apart from whatever was made known publicly about the Watergate incident, you had | aa > | no independent knowledge of Hunt's activities with the Agency?! | Q Mr. Angleton. No. Later when he was picked up, yes, I | called for his file and read his file. I might also add that | +4 | I feel quite honestly that the man has suffered a great deal, i: mean a very great deal, the death of his wife and all the | things he went through and tragedies and trying to put his life back to gether again with all. these character assassins still running after him. He paid his:price. So I ama little sympathetic with the fellow without even knowing him. | “Miss Brady: Was there ever really any Agency document about Hunt's whereabouts on November 22, 1963? ad | ann Vt STRENT, SoU, REPORTERS BUTLDING, HASUTHGTON, D.C. 20024 (202) 654-2345 rae said, Hung didn't mean a thing to me until after the Watergate a eee | | | Mr. Angleton. I don't remember any suca thing. As I | 7 i Miss Brady. Do you have any knowledge of the pre-Bay of Pigs operation called "Operation -40?" i 44 Mr. Angleton. By that name? What is it about? | ze Miss Brady. Another one of the anti-Castro groups
4&8 122 = ; involving some of the anti-Castro groups down in the Miami area. bb - Mr. Angleton. No. |: 4 | and Miami? Are you talking about the Domestic Branch? We | had what is called Domestic Operations which was on the overt 1 Miss Brady. Targets and operations against Cuba, you ! E a had no knowledge of that? | | . : 7 Mr. Angleton. I may have at some time or another but | E "| you have to keep in mind that the Counterintelligence Staff z z | Was not involved, that the Special Group on Cuba had its own | ; | liaison with the FBI and their own counterintelligence. In | : 1g other words, I loaned them or gave them one man in particular | : 7 whom I know who was fluent. in Spanish, and he ceased to be a | 2 1 member of my, iIomean, he was taken off my rolls and trans~ Ee Z 4 i ferred to them. | : 14 ' | “He was one of the principal counterintelligence people. | : 3 | Then later on, when Harvey was running it, he had another one ! a \ = te | of my men, but they were severed from the CI Staff and inte- ! = | gratéd within that. | ! af _. In other words, they allegedly had.their own counter- : 4 | Intettigence capabitiey built into the Task Force. g ‘a | | Miss Brady. What is the extent, if we ean call if, of “a counterintelligence in Miami and New Orleans during 1 | 6 fel 2} the early sixties? : - 2! Mr. Angleton. Domestic counterintelligence in New Orleans. Gl | HW 50955 Docld:322963411 Page 127 ALDEMSON RESORTING COMPAR
49 123 | side of the house. | . . . . . : | Miss Brady. I am asking more in particular if there were} 3 any covert activities that you were aware of? | | 4 | Mr. Angleton. No. The only people who had that capa- Es 5) bility « would be the Office of Security which had I think people ‘| under cover. g | Miss Brady. So if there were domestic operations you. 5S a are saying the Office of Security would have been in charge of ‘ 7 them? é . / = ise) Mr. Angleton. They would not have run operations there. | ‘They had people under cover for investigative purposes, . personnel and security checks. I mean applicants, field security checking. . Miss Brady. Was either Counterintelligence or the Office i] { i i of Security aware of Castro G-2 operatives in the Miamia area?) dae REPORTERS BUTLDENG, VASHTHC ry | 18 Have tthey been identified? : A 17 Mr. Angleton. What period are we talking about? | : a Miss Brady. The early sixties again. | = 7 Mr. Angleton. That would have been the jurisdiction of | ¢ 29 | the code name J.M. WAVE outfit who had direct liaison with | | : | nee 2! the Miami field office of the FBI. i ‘Miss Brady.. Was J. M. WAVE a separate component or was |: it run out of another office? ad Gre communications for that entire task force based in Miami. he Ay Av rep hwnd BSStgoOM REPORT. NG COMeP4SLY . 7 Obes woes) oe 2 O53 Sea et ! i i | | e # i Mr. Angleton. I think J. M. WAVE was the code name on { HW 50955 Docld:32263411 Page 128
124 Miss Brady. Did you at any time have any knowledge of any contact by Oswald with the Cuban G-2 in either New Orleans or Miami? i dad Mr. Angleton. None. be = B Miss Brady. Now you mentioned a Domestic Intelligence 2 4 | Office, is that how you phrased it? i . ~ : | Ss 7h Mr. Angleton. Yes. It had different names. It was once a 2} .called "OO". I can't remember what that means. - Anyway, it = “ i . . . i i 3; Was a collection part of the Directorate of Intelligence, - ‘o | which means that it was not a part of the Clandestine Services S i = 1; | but of the Deputy for Intelligence. S| It was a domestic so that it did not work clandestinely. | : | i es : : = i . . . . @ = 2 4 Its offices were in the telephone directory of the major ; ‘= is ; Cities where they were located and its basic thing was to s 1 Se , 5 ved interview Americans who had been behind the Curtain. It was 2 i . B | . ‘ . = is | a vacuum cleaner so to speak of every kind of human being they ~ i : ; : id msl a 7 | had the manpower to interview, and they did some very good : mt | work. = i vy : a “< | 1 OP ‘t : OSS | Se ll: 6 52 aa aLOSASOM az BW 50955 Bocld: 32263411 Page 129 3
is fols mhl' : 3 - of James Angle- ton ~ @:. 1978 be aan O. 20624 (P42) Sen-2445 4 1 On TOU, 7 a AUELDING, CASELTEC Qty REPORPEES - = fa Koos in =~ o oad Ne) in its entirety? 125 j Mr. Goldsmith. We were discussing the manuscript that you obtained from Win. Scott's residence in Mexico City shortly after his death. Do you recall whether Winn Scott's pen name was Ian Maxwell? Mr. Angleton. How do you spell the first name? Mr. Goldsmith. Ian. Mr. Angleton. I think it was, at least from the books that he published. Mr. Goldsmith. Did you read through that manuscript Mr. Angleton. I read it in its entirety but my problem; is that there was more than one draft, but I read it pretty thoroughly at one stage. - Mr. Goldsmith. Do you recall if it contained a chapter whcih discussed lee Harvey Oswald's visit to Mexico City? Mr. Angleton. No, r Aon't recall that. In fact I didn't. know there was a chapter on it. Mr. Goldsmith. Let me show you what we have obtained from the Agency by virtue of a committee request for materials, that were obtained from Mr. Scott's safe or residence after his death. This is a chapter from a manuscript. It is fairly long. . Mr. Angleton. Is it a part of the book? Mr. Goldsmith. Well, I only have one chapter here. It says Chapter 24 from a draft manuscript of "The Foul Foe," a praLrr cA pm wm ng 6 wet IMG OSE ay