Approved For Release 2000/08/07
:
#07;
It's construction*.....
I don't think
I understand the
question.
#66;
What's it made of?
#07:
What's it made of?
I
feel like... feel like steel!
I
don't know.
Never thought about
it.
It feels like steel,
but it..... I've been trying
to figure if it's a casting
or
a welded plate.
I get a very abrupt,
very abrupt,
angular bend.
I
just assumed
it
I don't know.
I
just assumed it was welded at that angle,
rather than
cast
.
#66:
All right.
I want you
to relax and concentrate for
a
moment,
and listen very carefully
to what I'm going to
say.
Relax and concentrate.
We're going to do something
now,
that only you can do from your position of observation.
Something that only you can do in your unique form of
observation.
I want you now to in your mind cut away
a portion of this frontal plate.
In your mind cut away
a
portion of this frontal plate so that you can see how
thick it
is;
how it is constructed,
and what it
is made
of.
Using your mind,
simply dissolve
a portion of this
frontal plate so that you may
see all that
is necessary
.
Do
so now and report your imagery to me,
#07:
I
think we ought to dump this you know.
I got
it cut
in
half fore and aft.
#66:
Tell me about
it.
+28
#07:
It's
a
hmmmm
it's
a
I guess this must be
a
mock-up,
'cause it's,
it's,
it's a... oh,
shit.
I
thought
the damn thing was real!
It's got about 3/4 inch thick
.....material.
I
thought
it was metal,
and then it... it's
got some kind of backing.
Looks like,
looks like aluminum
honeycomb
,
and then it's got a thin... 8 th ori inch...
another layer,
and then there's something.
It is another
substance.
It seem3 almost completely granular.
It's
about,
. .between
3 and 4 inches thick.
But,
it seems very
hard and granular.
There's another layer inside
that.
There's another layer inside that,
that.... it doesn't
seem very thick either,
and inside that is
I don't
know...... it looks like kind
of,
a styrofoam,
and then
a,
a metalized cloth
liner snapped on inside
this
thing.
I don't know.
It must be some kind of experimenting
...
.
. .but. ....
#66:
What is the overall thickness,
now?
#07:
I don't know.
I
thought,
at first
I thought about
9 inches,
but
I didn't add it all up here.
Approved For Release 2000/08/07
: CIA-I
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Approved For Release 2000/08/07
: Cl
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#66
#07;
#66 ;
#07;
#66 ;
Okay.
You be
very careful
to remember
thi.3 particular
portion. ....
OhJ
I
can't remember all that.
Do you want me
to go
through that again?
No.
We have it on tape,
but
I want you to look
at
it
while you’re looking at
it now,
so you can draw it for
me.
I have
it all on
tape.
I don’t know why.
It don’t make any damn sense.
They
would be out of
their mind
to built
a tank like that.
dust don't analyze,
dust report what you see.
#07:
Must be
a mock up.
#66 ;
#07;
#66 :
#07;
+32
#66 ;
#07:
Now,
tell me why you say it’s
a mock up.
Well,
it just don't make any sense to me this way
seems this portion here seems relatively light.
You
know.
I don't know why
I went to all that trouble
though.
It
Okay.
....
That's fine.
Jut
the,
the outside
of
the front seems... I
don
t know.
[ don't know.
Not,
not that,
that
it looks more li
•
...uh...it's a funny white kind of metal,
you_know.
Which.
first,
I thought the look of
it was
I
though
the look of
it was like some kinds
of alloys of aluminum.
r+
nratn that whits look rather than a 'mirror
look.
Okay.
Which metal
is this?
Is this outside or inside?
It was outside there.
That's
I expect they're going
to paint
it.
#66 :
#07:
#66 :
Okay.
But,
I,
but it,
like
it.
1 was surprised.
I wasn't going to say anything
it don't look like steel,
but
I thought it felt
kay.
I have some other questions now,
so
I would like
o move
on.
You've been observing the
tank now in a
ut awav form
I'd like you now
to return to your original
hseSion point of... which was off the front left quadrant
,nd tell me what you have achieved there.
Approved For Release 2000/08/07
: CIA-I
01-3
#07;
Okay.
I'm,
I'm port side.
. .mid-ship. .. .about 10 foot
away.
#66:
Okay.
Move now around
to the rear of the vehicle.
Position yourself slightly up in the air so that you
are looking at the rear deck obliquely,
and describe
to me what you see.
#07;
Boy!
The size of this critter!
I'm having a little trouble with winking here.
#66;
Take a moment to relax and concentrate.
#07:
What
I
think is
the exhaust port is what
I
see an open.
rectangular,
tubular. ...
how the hell
do- I describe this
I
see
a port
that
I
think might be exhaust....
it appears. ..cross section,
rectangular rather than round
as
I would expect.
I'm looking at the one pointing aft
port side.
#66:
Have you achieved the position of observation
I
required?
#07:
I'm about 8 feet up.
#66:
All
right.
Then describe
the rear deck
to me.
#07:
Rear
deck .. .okay ...
.
It's kind of complicated.
They got
real heavy grill work on the left and
I assume the same
thing is on the right,
but
I can't
....no!
it,
it
now,
where
I'm looking it don't look symetrical.
It.
.
. . .grill work is
a little different.
For some reason,
it kind of forward towards turret.
It seems.
I
can't make this out.
Kind of little higher in the center
just after the turret,
and it is
on each side there.
It...
there is something new here.
I don't know why
I
said
that,
but there appears to be some kind of box like shape
near the back...
.1 don't know what
it
is.
Just
a
minute.
I
think
it can be opened up.
Yeah.
It's some
kind of boxes that,
that it's either made of molded
fiberglass or it's
a big castings. .. .because of the built-
in structural stiffening.
. .ribs.
. .pattern cast into
it.
It's either fiberglass or,
or metal casting.
Appears
hinged on the aft and,
and opens up towards the
front.
#66:
Okay.
Listen very carefully
now.
As you look at the rear
of the vehicle now,
in your mind's eye,
dissolve those
portions of
the vehicle which conceal the power plant.
Simply dissolve them in your mind,
and describe
the power
plant
to me.
Approved For Release 2000/08/07
: CIA
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Approved For Release 2000/08/07
: CIA-RDI
01-3
#07;
#66 :
#07:
#66 :
+32
#07:
#66 :
#07:
+43
#66:
#07:
#66 :
#07:
Well,
I
don't
I....uh...I thought
the damn thing
looked like
a big..
big
like
a big electric
motor. .generator
thing,
you know.
It's about
I
don't know
I
thought
it was about
3 foot
in
diameter.
I expected
to see
a big
V-12 or something,
you know.
This thing looks kind of round with
round
big round wires or
tubes
or something.
Okay.
That '8 fine.
There are things that look like
like. .. .injector
pumps.
You know.
Big,
big,
like big diesel injector
pumps.
Okay.
Now,
relax and concentrate.
They're metal
tubes!
They're not wirel
They're metal
tubes!
Okay.
Relax and concentrate for
a moment
now,
relax and
concentrate.
I want you to regain your perception,
your
original perception off the front left quadrant.
Tell me
when you've done
so.
Okay.
I
got it.
I have no further questions about this vehicle at this
time.
Before we draw those perceptions that you've had,
I'd
like you
to add anything that you think appropriate.
PAUSE
Thing appears to have an awful
lot of electrohydrolic
stuff
in
it.
I
don't know how much is a
lot,
but!
I: have
the feeling that this thing has more electrical than
usual.
What type of electrical?
There seems to be
very heavy electric cables inside,
and
some pretty darn big motors,
and
I
tried
to exact trace
them backwards
to see what loaded
all
this,
but
I couldn't
figure where all the power was coming from.
I don't know
how much they're supposed
to have,
but
I
feel that there's
more electrical than usual.
There was one other
thing.
What
the hell is that.
Oh!
Yeah.
For whatever it's worth.
I don't remember ever seeing this critter before.
You
know.
I,
I have seen a
lot of pictures of world tanks.
I
don't,
I
don't recognize
this.
The top seemed rather
broad and flat,
like
a bullfrog.
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: CIA-R^I
01-3
Approved For Release 2000/08/07
: Cl
001-3
#66:
Okay.
Fine.
Is there anything else now before we
draw?
#07:
I sure would like
to crawl around through this critter
a little.
It's okay.
#66:
Perhaps we can do that a little
later.
Anything else
now?
PAUSE
#07:
I
don't
know.
#66:
Okay.
Let's prepare to draw those perceptions that you
had.
#31:
Let's start with your target acquisition imagery from
my notes.
I have
a road with vehicles moving
on
it.
A fence and metal building.
Okay.
Sawtooth roof and a
railroad track somewhere.
#07:
I
never did actually see that railroad track.
#31:
That's okay.
#07:
I guess
I
just,
I knew it was there.
I don't know why,
but
I gathered it was somewhere beyond
or behind the
sawtooth building from my observation point.
Well,
that first metal building
I felt was newer than
the sawtooth.
I
didn't see this fence much beyond the
length of the line here.
We're looking down on top of
a fence here,
and it's got this. . .anti-intrusion
wires along the top.
By the way,
there was no screen
on
the wire.
You know.
You could see right through
it.
There was nothing
to keep. ..... .and this is
a bit
higher back of the fence here.
The road seemed almost
as high as the fence,
because
I could see the wheels
of vehicles
I
felt through the top of the fence.
Oops.
This
is
a white line down
the middle of the road.
Why
the line down the middle of
the road... I'm not even
sure there is a line,
but it was two-way traffic.
I didn't see the left side of the building so
I
I'm not even going to bother drawing
it.
This is the
newer,
shinny metal building
Approved For Release 2000/08/07
: CIA-R^B!