Approved For Release 2000/08/08 : CIAGRRP96-00788R001900120001-9 IAGPA-F-SD 20 April 1983 MEMORANDUM FOR RECORD SUBJECT: CENTER LANE Interview Summary - CL-1004/8305/01 (U) 1. (S/NOFORN) On 120900 April 1983, source #01 was interviewed by #66 in an attempt to locate and identify a specific item of interest. The project 8305 sponsor had provided a photograph of the type of item of interest (see Incl l). (s/cu-3/NOFORN)) 2 For this interview source was provided a sealed envelope containing the photograph provided by sponsor. Source was asked to focus his attention on the "rail yard" which he had reported in another interview (see CL-1003/8305/01, 110900 Apr 83) and look for the item depicted in the sealed envelope. Source was not shown the photograph or provided any other identifying data. The collection plan called for the use of this information as "feedback" and cuing material for possible subsequent interviews. 3. (U) A transcript of the interview was prepared including a narrative explanation of the drawings which source provided (see Incl 2). 4. (U) A DA Form 341 (Agent Report) was prepared for the sponsor. This report related the salient points of the interview. Attached as an exhibit to the DA Form 341 was a copy of source's drawings (see Incl 3). 3 Incl filed J Ho ATWATER as CPT, MI OPS/TNG Officer CLASSIFIED BY: MSG ,DAMI-TSH DTG: 051630ZJUL78 DECL: Originating Agency's Determination Required NOP RELEASABLE TO YOL2IGN NATIONALS Approved For Release 2000/08/08 : ClAsigilipiliniaiaeieiia01900120001-9
Approved For Release 2000/08/08 : CIA-RDP96-00788R001900120001-9 Approved For Release 2000/08/08 : CIA-RDP96-00788R001900120001-9 Twe/l Z
” * * Approved For Release 2000/08/08 ¢ 7 TRANSCRIPT #66; This will be CENTER LANE Interview for 0900 hours 12 April 1983.......Focus your attention now solely and completely, relax, relax and focus your attention on the area you know as the rail yard staging area. Relax. Focus on the area known to you as the rail yard staging area and the events and activities of 8 and 9 April 1983. The events of 8 and 9 April 1983. Focus and describe your perceptions to me. #01: ...Okay....-See a......8ee an object with a...an end shaped like a four leaf clover. It's a...oval in shape, fairly long, maybe 12 feet long. Looks like a container, stacked 4 on a wooden platform, banded together.....It's cartons.......See a..an object that's towed, it's got two fold out arms and wheels that pop up off the ground. A long straight piece that comes up in the air. #66: In a larger perspective, have you acquired the rail yard area? #01: Yes. #66: Tell me the scene you perceive. #01: Everything's being off loaded from the trains..Moved into the holding areas. Some things being loaded on the trucks, being hooked up to trucks. Crates turned side ways on “lowboys." #66: All right. Now I'm going to ask you to widen the time window, so that events from moment to moment are no longer perceived. A window of 24 to 48 hours, covering the whole time period 8 and 9 April 1983. As you broaden the time window and particular activities are longer identified, focus your attention now on the envelope I've provided. The object in the envelope, the item in the envelope and return to the scene and search out a like item or items, similar items, exactly the same as items. #01: eeeeeeeee Okay... Keep seeing the belly plates of an aircraft. Something that looks like a bread pan, nozzles. Can't tell if it's....there's some kind of exhaust coming out of it. Impression of a...doesn't make any sense, but it looks like a flat tripod with wheels mounted cock-eyed on it. And a pointed object standing on its end. HOT RELMASABLE £0 FO SeCN NATIONALS. ES Apptoy For Release 2000/08/08 : FleRESE. 09 88R001900120001-9 ci Erie — Lwel 2
Approved For Release 2000/08/08 : €IA-RDP #66: #01: #66: #01: #66: #01 #663 #01: #66: #01: #66: #01: #66: #01: #663 Gabh788R001900120001-9 ra_atrim, TEP Tell me the setting in which you perceive this, what's around the area? See aircraft near it. Okay. From, from here, where is the rail yard area? It's a...east, southeast, close enough to see, no more than 3 kilometers. These things are sitting in inside circles. Ask yourself, the relationship between the aircraft area and the rail yard, ask yourself the relationship between the aircraft and the rail yard area. ...-eThere's a....I'm having trouble finding any relationship. Keep getting on image, keeps pounding on me, it's a, like nozzles or exhaust nozzles or spray nozzles....It's a, these supplies are brought in by rail, but they have something to do with aircraft. Okay. I find no relation between your descriptions and the item of interest in the envelope. Perhaps there is a connection that I don't understand. I don't a..... Let's set aside this perception and try to understand it later. That's fine. And focus now on the envelope and let's focus on the envelope and describe the item in the photograph in the envelope. Then we will search for that item. Focus only on the envelope and describe the item in the photograph. -.--eJust see a white cylinder. From what perspective do you see this white cylinder? Laying down, just a long white cylinder. I'm trying get a.., I don't have anything to lay against in size, but-- I understand. 96-00788R001900120001-9
Approved For Release 2000/08/ #01: #66: #01: #66: #01: #66: #01: #66: #01: #663 #01: #66: a cENTES PS, Sate pptoyed For Release 2000/08/0 88R001900120001-9 Just a minute........It's a..fairly large, 80 feet, 70 feet, somewhere in there, seems like. Okay. I want to check one more time here, not to describe the picture itself, but using the photograph in the envelope and describe the actual item through the photograph, access and describe the actual item. weeeeee8ee a rocket on a slanted launcher. It's got stubby little tail fins. It's very fat. Okay. It's not a..it's not an...anti-aircraft type rocket, it's more of a .....-hmm, I want to say long range, but it's like short range, salt type rocket, 800, 900 kilometers.......I'm not getting any of these at the site. Okay. Now I have no further questions for you, but I would for a moment like to have you review the images you've had. I can tell by your voice that you, you know, you lost your concentration a little bit. But I 'd like you to review for a moment, while you're still relaxed, and as you review, tell me any things that sometimes happens during these interviews, that you throw out overlay, because you're sure that isn't right. I get a... strong impression of..parts being at the target area. I don't see entire object, I see parts of it...part here and a part there....Seems the most common items is the exhaust parts, the nozzles, they have distinct design. You seem to have described those today, yes. I keep going to those for some reason. I see those at the target site, but I don't see a complete item like in the envelope. Okay. It's the only common thing I could find, everything else is pieces. Okay.
88R001900120001-9 #01; There's one other thing.....The thing in the envelope, I see in a like a slant rear launcher on a truck, a large, large truck..1 don't see any of those trucks at the target. I see a tripod type apparatus that I....keep wanting to turn into that truck. I can't, it's just a tripod. It has some commonality there, but I don't know what it is. Could be it's the same function. #66: Okay. Anything else? #01: Yes, the aircraft there, support aircraft. Ah--- #66: Break that out. #01: First impression was..these objects defend the aircraft, but it's backwards, the aircraft defend the objects. #66: Okay. #01; That's all I got. #66: Okay, fine. 88R001900120001-9
Approved For Release 2000/08/08; CIA-RDP9600788R001900120001-9 DRAWING EXPLANATION #01: Okay. These are pretty much explanatory. Page #1, I rendered a, these are bits and pieces that I was getting. (A) is one view of my clover design. (B) is the bread pan shape. It seemed like it was big fat slab of something, I don't know. But it was molded and rounded and everything. (C) is a nozzle that moves around. I got a feeling of exhaust or spray or something coming from it, but it's afixed to a, like a heavy metal plate of some kind and it's rotatable, you know, it moves around, points in different directions and sprays something or has an exhaust or something like that. #01; Page #2 is a, I don't want to call this anything except a concept. But I got the feeling like that this was over near the aircraft area and has something to do with targeted object. #01: Page #3 are more clover leaves. It's like a design or pattern on something. And then I had the item (F) which are my white tubes or containers. I felt like they were hollow or something. They held something in them and they were banded together in fours. #01: In page #4, I tried to render the truck with the launcher, but it's not coming out as a truck and a launcher. It's not like that, it's different. It has something fat sitting on the launcher. And I keep trying to make it into a rocket and I can't, I keep coming up with something stubby and I just can't do it right, I can't render it justice, so, you can do whatever you want with that. #66: I understand. Anything else? #01: No, that's all. Oh, well, I have, I have a really strong feeling, an impression that the targeted envelope, okay, is, I don't know, maybe it's a doctored photograph, if it's really a photograph. But I get a really strong concept feeling like. I don't know how to explain that, like I'm getting into somebody's head when I targeted that envelope today. It's was like I was getting conceptually into somebody's head and trying to get from them their concept of what the target is, that kind of thing. That's all I have. #66: Okay. Approved For Release 2000/08/08 : CLEREPSSTO ooe 1 900120001-9