Approved For Release 2000/08/07
:
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#01:
Okay,
what
I want you to
do now
is to
let go
of these objects.
.
.
and fall,
and tell me
what you hit.
#25:
Hit
the ground.
#01:
Describe the ground.
#25:
No grass right where
I
fell.
It
was
sandy,
rocky.
It was wet
.
There was
a ...
I
hit
tHie~7"
.
.
my back.
First
I
fell with my butt
on the bottom,
not with my
feet.
Just pushed
back and let
go.
My back hit
first
not because
I tilted in the air but because the ground goes
down into
a slope.
PAUSE
#01:
Okay,
relax there on your back.
And when
I
tell
you
to.
,
.
keep your eyes closed now.
.
When
I
tell you to,
open your eyes
at the target.
When
you open your eyes tell me the first impression
of target
function.
Okay,
open your eyes.
Describe the function.
#25:
Its
a home.
PAUSE
#01:
Describe why you say that.
PAUSE
#25:
I
can't.
Its just
a feeling.
PAUSE
See
an older woman
inside.
PAUSE
#01:
Okay,
why
don't you ask her what
she's
doing.
PAUSE
#25:
Well,
very quickly
I
got
-
cleaning,
but
I
thought
that was overlay,
so
I asked again
.
.
and
I
don't
get any
.
.
.
#01:
Okay.
PAUSE
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:
#01:
Okay now,
remembering everything that you have
to this point,
said.
I
have no further questions
for you.
What
I want you to
do now #25
is to
relax and just
think about the target
and tell
me
any additional
information that you think
I
should know.
Just take your time.
Use whatever
time you want.
#25:
I saw asphalt
shingles.
Light colored gravel on
dark colored asphalt
- tiles or shingles,
not
tiles.
What
I'm up against
is
.
.
.or what
I've been
touching and feeling ...
I'm still
life on the
ground.
.
at
the bottom of
it
is
an appendage built
out
like
a room built
out.
.
.
to
the side of the
main building.
#01:
Remember what
that
looks
like.
PAUSE
#25:
I
just moved in
it
like the angle
of
(not
audible).
PAUSE
Seemed like
a little dirt road up by the side of
the building.
Probably
a drive way.
#01:
Very good.
#25:
Trees over that.
Seems
to be
lots of thick trees
around.
That's
about
all.
#01
:
Okay
.
a>|UM>t^UVixC>
•
•
*
#25:
( Met audible )
home now.
Its gone.
#01:
Okay,
relax and shake your arms
and legs
a little
bit.
I'm going to put
the tape on
hold.
Come
back to this room now.
Just
relax,
take your
time coming around here.
PAUSE
#01:
Okay,
you're finished your drawings
here.
Why
don't you start with Number
and explain your
way through
this.
#25:
Okay,
Drawing
is
a
.
.
just
a
.
.
view of the
stilts.
At
first the vertical
lines.
.
that
I
first saw and that's.
.
that's pretty much what
they look like even though this
is
a very simple
drawing.
The
.
.
the
.
.
.
they were dark against
a light background.
#01:
Urn
hm.
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#25:
#01
:
#25:
#01
:
#25:
#01
:
#25
:
#01
:
#25:
#01
:
#25
:
#01 :
#25:
#01
:
And then,
I
don’t know if there was
.
.
.
there
seemed to be more
.
.
I
keep wanting
to draw
one out here but
then
it
starts
to make
a box
and
I
didn't
get
a box feeling
at
all.
And,
so
I won't
do
it
,
I'll
leave
it
at that.
Urn
hm.
Drawing
is what the stilts evolved into
- the
double lines.
.
are now the stilts.
And,
I tried
to
.
.
I
hung.
.
clung
to
the stilts
right
here,
felt this shingle here labeled "A"
and that' s the
feeling that
I described -
it was the rough ridges
where
I
first said
it was redwood and
it
felt
like
the
.
.
different kind of shingle,
the rough
shingle
.
PAUSE
The building,
I
didn’t
draw
in,
but
its here where
I've labeled it
as building or home.
Here.
The
ground,
this
is sort of
a hill that goes
down and
comes around like this,
so this
area's
lower.
Okay.
Its really tough to
draw.
So this appendage
is sort of hanging out
from thej
building.
Yeah.
Proper.
And supported above ground on the stilts.
Yeah.
Okay.
I
just
got the idea that
this might be water here
so
I'm gonna say
- could be water.
Okay.
PAUSE
Okay
.
Then you
.
.
you
des.
.
.
can you describe
for me
the
.
.
the type of shingle that
.
.
.
v\
i;.
If
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#25:
Ah,
yeah.
I
don’t know the name of the shingle
but
its
.
.
.
its.
.
ceramic or
a fiber type
shingle that has
an edge
-
if you were
to slice
it
and look down the shingle
it would look like
Drawing Number
4.
#01:
Um hm.
Okay.
#25:
Okay.
Drawing
is
a overhead view which
I never
got during the session but
I tried to draw here.
#01
:
Um hm
.
#25:
Just
to show where my view was.
The star indicates
my view.
#01:
Um
hm.
#25:
The grassy area was out
here.
While
I was looking
at
the grass area
- when
I wanted to go out
to look
at
it
to describe
it,
I made
an effort
to go around
the building
to get
out here
to
see what was
on the other side of the building
.
.
#01
:
Uh huh.
#25:
Which
is blocked as you can see from that
.
.
from
my view here and
I
couldn't
see.
I
couldn't move,
I couldn't
get out of there.
#01:
Where
is the road that you were describing?
#25:
Oh.
Okay.
The road would come right
along here
where
I've written
an overhead view.
Dirt
road.
And
it goes like right up against the building.
#01:
Okay.
#25:
Curves around this way too.
And the trees were
all around in that
road.
#01
#25
#01
#25
:
#01
:
#25:
Approved For
Um hm.
Not
in the road,
but on the sides of
it.
And you had a pattern,
in Drawing Number
4 called
wavey
lines.
Yeah.
That was one
of the first patterns that
I
saw
.
.
Um hm.
.
.
after the leaves,
which
I didn't
draw.
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#25:
But which
I’ll draw here
in the middle and label
it
5.
PAUSE
This
is just
a cross section
to
a pattern that
I
saw.
This
is sky
in
here.
.
.
#01
:
Um hm
.
#25:
What
do you do with the leaves.
.
.
#01:
Why don't you circle that
so
it matches
the
others
.
#25
:
Okay
.
PAUSE
#01:
Okay,
do you have anything else that you’d like
to add?
#25:
No.
#01:
Then let’s go find out what the target
is.
#25:
Okay.
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