They've got stable states in which different ethnic groups share and alternate power and the state is not ethnicized. The state is not the creature of a particular ethnic group and that then means that people go and sleep in their beds and don't fear being attacked, and that in my view is what keeps the civic state going. Just that it's solved the fear problem. That's an important insight. That's very true.
Fear is the driver everywhere.
I mean being convinced that you're going to be dragged out of your house and put on a tractor and sent across the border or your wive's going to be raped or your children hit on the head. That kind of fear drives hatred. It's the basic driver of everything, the driver to create your own nation, the driver to commit ethnic cleansing against those you fear. The whole thing. It comes about because all the states in that region are so incredibly fragile or they've been the instrument of tyranny.