Special Hearings — Mandela United Football Club Hearings — 1997-11-26

MR VALLY: After you left Mrs Madikezela-Mandela's house, do you recall a community meeting in Soweto to which you were taken?

BAREND THABISO MONO: Yes.

MR VALLY: Can you briefly tell us about this community meeting?

BAREND THABISO MONO: We were taken to the community meeting in the company of Reverend Peter Storey.  He fetched us from Krish Naidoo's office. We were taken to that office by Doctor Nthatho Motlana.  Reverend Storey told us that we should tell the people gathered at the meeting exactly the right version or what we know, and he said we should tell the people, that we shouldn't be afraid to tell the community if Paul was sleeping with us.

MR VALLY: What happened at the meeting?

BAREND THABISO MONO: We were asked to explain what happened and we told them everything.

MR VALLY: Is what  you told them what you told us today?

BAREND THABISO MONO: Yes, it's what I told them.  And one other thing is that I apologised to Paul because what I told those people was because of the circumstances of that time, and we explained to them that we were ordered before meeting these people.

MR VALLY: ... referring to and what did you tell them?

BAREND THABISO MONO: I'm talking of Sydney Mufamadi and them, because we were briefed and we were given instructions by Jerry and Xoliswa not to tell them anything.

MR VALLY: What did you tell them?  Sydney Mufamadi, Sister Bernard Ncube, Mr Aubrey Mokoena, what did you tell them?

BAREND THABISO MONO: We told them that Paul slept with us, that is why we left his place for Mrs Mandela's place, because Xoliswa and Jerry wanted us to tell them that.

MR VALLY: ... who else spoke there?

BAREND THABISO MONO: If I remember well Katiza  spoke, Ikaneng spoke.

MR VALLY: What did Katiza  and Ikaneng say?

BAREND THABISO MONO: Ikaneng told his story about being stabbed at the neck, and Katiza  told the story about the assault that took place at Mrs Mandela's place.

MR VALLY: Finally, you gave evidence in the Jerry Richardson trial as well as in Mrs Winnie Madikezela-Mandela's trials.  Just prior to giving evidence in Mrs Madikezela-Mandela's trial, your colleague, Mr Pelo Mekgwe,  disappeared. Can you tell us anything about his disappearance?

BAREND THABISO MONO: There is nothing I can say about Pelo's disappearance.  What happened was, I talked to Pelo on Friday, and we went to Potchefstroom - I had to attend a funeral on Saturday, and we asked Paul to give us permission to go home.  He took us to our lawyer to tell him that we are going home and when we were coming back, and we told him that Sunday evening we will meet at a certain place, and Paul would get us there to transport us to where we were living.
 I only met with Pelo on Sunday morning, and we made arrangements for leaving, and he said I should wait for him at home at a certain time.  I waited for him, and when I realised that he was not coming, I took a taxi, I left until I reached Johannesburg.  And I went to a place where we were supposed to meet with Paul. We waited for Pelo for about an hour. He never came. Paul took me and Kenny to our place.  I think Paul went back to that spot to wait for Pelo, but he couldn't find Pelo.

MR VALLY: Sorry, sorry to interrupt you - that's fine, you don't have to give us that whole story.  Just tell me briefly, you were initially very reluctant to give evidence at Mrs Winnie Madikezela-Mandela's trial after the disappearance of Mr Pelo Mekgwe, can you tell us why you were reluctant?

BAREND THABISO MONO: It was my intention. together with Pelo, to give evidence,
and we were prepared to give out everything. All of a sudden I was told that Pelo had been taken away by people whom I do not know, and I did not know what was happening.  And I was supposed to first think of my life, whether if I take an action of testifying, what was going to happen to me.

MR VALLY: Thank you, Mr Mono, that's all.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you.  Mr Semenya?

MR SEMENYA: Thank you, Chairperson.
 Mr Mono, when did you hear for the first time that Stompie's alleged to be an informer?

BAREND THABISO MONO: If I remember well, there was an allegation in the house that Stompie was an informer, and we sat down. Paul called a meeting,  we discussed this issue.  And Paul told Falati to stop calling Stompie an informer because Stompie was just a child, and this issue stopped just there.

MR SEMENYA: ... who for the first time accused Stompie of being an informer, as far as you know?

BAREND THABISO MONO: According to my knowledge she's the first person to came out with such an allegation, and it was resolved with Paul, and this matter was put away.

MR SEMENYA: And the reason you were assaulted, was because you were alleged to have been sodomised?

BAREND THABISO MONO: That's correct.

MR SEMENYA: And the reason Mekgwe is assaulted is for the same reason?

BAREND THABISO MONO: That's correct.

MR SEMENYA: And Stompie, is that he's an informer?

BAREND THABISO MONO: That's correct.

MR SEMENYA: What I know from Falati's evidence is that Cebekhulu was also alleged to be sodomised.  What I do not understand, though, is why was Cebekhulu not assaulted at all?

BAREND THABISO MONO: I also do not know why was he not assaulted, but what I know for a fact is that Cebekhulu was also part of the people who were assaulting us.

MR SEMENYA: ... Cebekhulu is also assaulting, and yet he's accused of the same problem that all of you were accused of, is that right?

CHAIRPERSON: Sorry to disturb you, we were just being thrilled that we are getting fresh air.

BAREND THABISO MONO: During the assault I did not know that Katiza  had been accused also of having been sodomised, I just saw him on the site of the people assaulting us.

MR SEMENYA: ... is a possible explanation, and let me call for reaction.  It would seem that, during the course of the proceedings, Richardson would admit that he was registered police informant. You have no information to gainsay that, right?

BAREND THABISO MONO: I don't have any information regarding that, I do not know anything.

MR SEMENYA: And Xoliswa Falati and Cebekhulu must have been operating, all of them as police informants, you don't have any reason to ...[indistinct] say that, do you?

BAREND THABISO MONO: I do not have any reason to believe that - I do not know, I do not bear any knowledge.

MR SEMENYA: The explanation I therefore have is that Richardson, Falati and Cebekhulu must have arranged the facts to suggest that you people were sodomised, what would be your reaction?

BAREND THABISO MONO: There is nothing I can say about that.  If ever they put up a story to come up with this allegation, I do not know.

MR SEMENYA: Now, Mekgwe  does not confirm your evidence that Mrs Mandela beat you with fists - at least before this TRC. What's your reaction?

MR NTSEBEZA: ...[inaudible] is that a correct reflection of the evidence by Mekgwe? He seems to have said a lot of things, at one stage or at the other.  There was a stage where he referred to a sjambok, there was a stage when he talked about fists, and I do not think that you are putting the proposition on a proper basis.  I don't stop you from putting your question, but I think you must give the whole picture.

MR SEMENYA: Maybe let me put the same question, I may have been misunderstood.  I'm saying, notwithstanding what Mekgwe  would have said elsewhere, when he made the statement to the TRC he said he did not say that he was also assaulted with fists by Mrs Mandela.  Did I put it correctly, Mr Ntsebeza?

MR NTSEBEZA: I don't want to enter games of ...[indistinct. Put your questions, and if I really feel that you are not putting your question properly I'll say so. I have not said so.

MR SEMENYA: Can you respond?  Can I repeat the question maybe?

BAREND THABISO MONO: Yes, repeat your question.