Amnesty Hearings — East London — 1998-04-06

THEMBELANI TANDEKILE XUNDU: Ja, that is why I myself having been the originator of this document, I question it's validity and that is what leads me to believe that it's not the final product because I don't understand why we can complain of the shortage of personnel because as far as I can look in to see into the Golf Club Operation and the fact that, I mean, the person who drew the operational plan and who knew the requirements in terms of equipment and personnel would then again complain of shortage of personnel.
ADV. GCABASHE: So there was no shortage of personnel?

THEMBELANI TANDEKILE XUNDU: No.
ADV. GCABASHE: Right, specifically at that paragraph 12: "the personnel was deployed approximately two months before the Golf Club Attack".  Now I've go a few questions relating to that paragraph and it ties in a bit with what Mr Stanford asked.
	When then was the attack planned?  You talk here two months before personnel was deployed.  When was the target chosen?  Do you remember?

THEMBELANI TANDEKILE XUNDU: Really, I can't remember but I think in as far as the paragraph is concerned, I mean I can explain that the deployment of personnel two months before - the personnel, I mean the Golf Club was not the only target and therefore as a matter of operational requirement we, I mean, prefer to help personnel deployed in the area because there were lot of targets in the area.

CHAIRPERSON: Well, did you take part in any other incidents in any other attacks?

THEMBELANI TANDEKILE XUNDU: No, Mr Chairman.

CHAIRPERSON: And you were senior ranking, in charge there, you've just told us "there were lots of other targets."?

THEMBELANI TANDEKILE XUNDU: Yes there were a lot of other targets on the pipeline.

CHAIRPERSON: But you took no part in attacks on any of them?

THEMBELANI TANDEKILE XUNDU: No.

MR PRIOR: Were those other targets ever operationalised in the sense that you actually commenced in the operations against them?

THEMBELANI TANDEKILE XUNDU: Were they?

MR PRIOR: Were they operationalised, did you ever execute any operations, not you personally necessarily, but other components of your detachment or your unit?

THEMBELANI TANDEKILE XUNDU: Not the operations that I was talking about but okay, the only operation which our cadres attempted and they all failed and therefore does not hold any substance to talk about it.

MR PRIOR: Well what was their operation, whether it failed or not is irrelevant, what was the operation - your cadres went on it?

THEMBELANI TANDEKILE XUNDU: Okay, it was an ambush on the SADF in Tembisa.

MR PRIOR: When did it happen?

THEMBELANI TANDEKILE XUNDU: It must be at the beginning of '93.

MR PRIOR: It was after this attack?

THEMBELANI TANDEKILE XUNDU: Yes.

MR PRIOR: And you personally weren't involved in that?

THEMBELANI TANDEKILE XUNDU: No.

MR PRIOR: You didn't issue any commands or be involved in the information gathering?

THEMBELANI TANDEKILE XUNDU: No, no.  I didn't issue any commands but the - our - my senior commanders were quite aware of the recognisance of the situation here because I mean, I was the person who was on the ground, I knew the composition of the patrols of the SADF, I knew the ...[inaudible] of the SAP, so to that effect they were quite convinced in what is happening there though I was not there.

MR PRIOR: The original question of my colleagues still stands then, which was - maybe she can re-put it to you.  It  was a question of these people were deployed two months ahead of time and she was canvassing that in that context what - it was in relation to the postponement as well, if I remember correctly, but I trying to get some explanation from you - well what did these people do for two months?  Maybe that's a better way of putting it?

THEMBELANI TANDEKILE XUNDU: Ja, okay, now I understand now.  I think I understand now.  I mean, as a command practice or as a routine of APLA during the - you must have noticed there were so called Molotovs thrown in, those concentrated petrol bombs which were thrown in that day in the Golf Club.  It takes some ...[inaudible], because you must cut the sticks put it in a certain part and all those mixtures there, so that we call production and also political work that is things like political versus reviewed political situation, I mean that was led by myself as a commissar and also cadres on their own could give me a hand for logistics supplies that they could get.  If for instance they can get a file on somebody who can supply us with arms, I mean, they would exploit and explore that avenue.  So the cadres - and also the training - so the cadres already had something to do.
ADV. GCABASHE: And you are saying that they were able to do all of these things without knowing what the target was?

THEMBELANI TANDEKILE XUNDU: What they knew that - from the briefing that they were given I'm sure in Umtata and the briefings that I gave them as soon as they arrived this side I told them "Gentlemen you are here for operations".  So what they knew is that they must be battle ready.
ADV. GCABASHE: Then again in relation to your own part in information gathering, over what period did you gather this information?  So the question really relates to for how long were you a caddie?  One day, two days, a week?  I must have missed that somewhere.  Over what period?

THEMBELANI TANDEKILE XUNDU: I think I went there eight or more times.
ADV. GCABASHE: In one week, in a month?

THEMBELANI TANDEKILE XUNDU: No not in one week, because it must have been two weeks, a month because at some point in time I was joined by my Commander, Comrade Lester.
ADV. GCABASHE: And you are saying that at the time that you were gathering information the date of the golf date had been set to your knowledge?

THEMBELANI TANDEKILE XUNDU: That the what?
ADV. GCABASHE: The date of the Golf Day, the Radie Golf Day, the Radie Sponsored Golf Day, that date had been set already, in the time you were gathering information, the three weeks?

THEMBELANI TANDEKILE XUNDU: The three weeks I was gathering information, I was not gathering information only in relation to the Golf Club.  I mean I think it's worth mentioning.
ADV. GCABASHE: Okay.

CHAIRPERSON: I think you said, I may have misunderstood you, but you didn't know about the Golf Day - what you were told about was the party in the evening?

THEMBELANI TANDEKILE XUNDU: Yes.
ADV. GCABASHE: No, but you have answered me saying you were gathering information generally, not specifically for this mission when you were gathering information?

THEMBELANI TANDEKILE XUNDU: Yes.
ADV. GCABASHE: That's what I needed clearing up.  Then we come to the participation of your colleague, your Comrade Ntintili, Lungi Ntintili, I just lost you again somewhere because you talked about trying to dispose of the Jetta, going through that - having difficulty with doing that and then coming back to ask Mr Ntintili to assist you.  Is that, did I get that right?  You first tried on your own, couldn't do it, then you had to come back and get him to follow you with the Rover so that you could actually dispose of this vehicle?

THEMBELANI TANDEKILE XUNDU: Ja, the aim of coming back was to arm myself as well.
ADV. GCABASHE: Now, just to summarise, just go through that process for me?  The first attempt and the second attempt - just in summary?

THEMBELANI TANDEKILE XUNDU: Okay, went off to the National Road between Alice and King William's Town and we're heading for King William's Town.
ADV. GCABASHE: And when was this, how soon after the mission itself, execution of the mission?

THEMBELANI TANDEKILE XUNDU: After the execution of the which mission?
ADV. GCABASHE: Yes, this one, when you had finished at the club, how soon after that?  Just date it for me - the next day the days later?