Amnesty Hearings — Vanderbijlpark — 1999-05-11

MACHIHLILE WILSON BALOYI: He said he was not certain whether they were going to attack Boipatong or Bophelong, but they were going to attack a place, some place between those two townships.  Thereafter I informed my wife that it appeared as if Inkatha was going to attack and that afternoon, later on that evening when I was watching TV, at about twenty past ten in the evening, I heard a noise in the streets.  At first I thought it was comrades just walking passed the street.  I told my wife and children that they should stay up, they should not go to bed because an attack was apparently imminent.  Therefore my wife told my children not to wander around.  At that same time, a Police van arrived, it stopped right in front of my garden.

MR BERGER: Where were you at that time?

MACHIHLILE WILSON BALOYI: I was just seated, fully dressed, watching TV.

MR BERGER: If you were watching TV, how could you see the Police van?

MACHIHLILE WILSON BALOYI: My window is big and I could hear the engine running and my window has a lace curtain, so you are able to see what is happening outside, but that person who is outside, cannot see inside the house.

MR BERGER: Mr Baloyi, can I just ask you to speak a bit slower, because the Interpreter has to keep up with you.

MACHIHLILE WILSON BALOYI: Okay.

MR BERGER: What did you see through your window?

MACHIHLILE WILSON BALOYI: I saw a Police vehicle.

CHAIRPERSON: Just a minute, what is the word you used?

MACHIHLILE WILSON BALOYI: It is a Police vehicle with a back door.

CHAIRPERSON: No, what is the name that you just used, what do you call that?

MACHIHLILE WILSON BALOYI: We know it is a "koyoco".

CHAIRPERSON: Okay.

MACHIHLILE WILSON BALOYI: A casspir is a smaller vehicle.

MR BERGER: So this vehicle that you saw, looked bigger than a casspir to you?

MACHIHLILE WILSON BALOYI: Yes, it was much bigger than a casspir.

MR BERGER: Yes, please continue.

MACHIHLILE WILSON BALOYI: It moved off, thereafter there was a noise in the street and I looked through the window, but I didn't see anything, I just heard a noise.  After a while as I was still looking, I saw a large number of people approaching.

MR BERGER: Could you describe these people?

MACHIHLILE WILSON BALOYI: They were a large crowd, some were carrying TV's, others were carrying different items.

MR BERGER: What were they doing?

MACHIHLILE WILSON BALOYI: They were walking along the street and as they came near my house, they went into the Nqwani household and some went into the Buwa household.  I was watching.

MR LAX: Can you just slow down a little bit, I am finding it hard to keep up with you and I am missing bits and pieces.   What was - you said - what was the first house you said they went into, I didn't catch the name?

MACHIHLILE WILSON BALOYI: Nqwani, Victor Nqwani's house.

MR BERGER: What street would that be?

MACHIHLILE WILSON BALOYI: Bafokeng Street.  They also went into Buwa's house.

MR BERGER: Would that also be on Bafokeng Street?

MACHIHLILE WILSON BALOYI: Yes, also on Bafokeng Street.

MR BERGER: Mr Baloyi, please slow down.  I was watching, because these two houses are opposite mine.

MR BERGER: All right, what were they doing in those houses, did you see?

MACHIHLILE WILSON BALOYI: They first broke the gates, they broke the windows, I was watching at the time.

MR BERGER: You didn't run away?

MACHIHLILE WILSON BALOYI: I will come to that later.

MR BERGER: Right.  Please continue?

MACHIHLILE WILSON BALOYI: These windows were big, at Buwa's house they did not use the door to gain access into the house, but they just went in through the windows, because those windows were big.  They broke the door at Victor's house.  We were watching, some of them were walking passed the street.  After they had finished at Victor's house,  they went out, the people at Buwa's house also went out.  Somebody called one of my children, Silo.  He said Dududu, Morene Lucky, these people used to stay with Inkatha members or they used to dance with the IFP members at the hostel.

MR BERGER: Who was that person who was calling out to the young people?

MACHIHLILE WILSON BALOYI: This was Mtwana.  These are all his children.

MR BERGER: When you talk about ...

ADV SIGODI: Sorry, I don't know if I misunderstood you, who is this person who was calling out your children?

MACHIHLILE WILSON BALOYI: Mtwana Zulu.

ADV SIGODI: Yes.

MR BERGER: And the names that he was calling out?

MACHIHLILE WILSON BALOYI: He was calling him by Dududu, which was a nickname, Silo's nickname.

MR BERGER: What did Silo used to do with Mtwana Zulu?

MACHIHLILE WILSON BALOYI: They used to do traditional dance together.

MR BERGER: Where did they used to do that?

MACHIHLILE WILSON BALOYI: All over, but they used to practice at kwaMadala hostel.

MR BERGER: How did you know that it was Prince Zulu?

MACHIHLILE WILSON BALOYI: I was watching them, they were outside.

MR BERGER: Did you actually see him?

MACHIHLILE WILSON BALOYI: I told my child not to go outside, I told him to go and hide with his mother.

MR BERGER: No Mr Baloyi, my question is did you actually see Mtwana Zulu outside your house?

MACHIHLILE WILSON BALOYI: I know him very well, I saw him.

MR BERGER: How did you know him very well, from where?

MACHIHLILE WILSON BALOYI: He is married to one woman who stayed four houses away from mine.

MR BERGER: Did he used to live in Bafokeng Street?

MACHIHLILE WILSON BALOYI: Please repeat that question?

MR BERGER: Did Mtwana Zulu used to live in Bafokeng Street?

MACHIHLILE WILSON BALOYI: The house in Bafokeng Street belongs to his in-laws.  He used to come there regularly.  He had a house at Majola Street.

MR BERGER: What happened - slowly please - after you heard Mtwana Zulu calling out the names of the youngsters?

MACHIHLILE WILSON BALOYI: He did not come to my house, the people who were at Buwa's house, went out.  The people who left Nqwani's house, then came to my house.  They broke down the gate and the broke all the windows.  My door was broken, by that time I was standing.  They entered the house, I was just looking at them.

MR BERGER: Mr Baloyi, could you describe what they looked like?

MACHIHLILE WILSON BALOYI: The people who entered the house had red headbands on.

MR BERGER: Anything else that you noticed?

MACHIHLILE WILSON BALOYI: One took a hi-fi, one took a box of records, one approached me, he had an axe.

MR BERGER: Please continue.

MACHIHLILE WILSON BALOYI: I stood in front of my bedroom door, he approached my directly and he wanted to hack me.  I went into the room.  As he tried to come into the room, I slammed the door on him.

MR BERGER: Yes?

MACHIHLILE WILSON BALOYI: He fell onto the sofa, he got up and came to me, approached me.  I tried to get him to the room, I was holding onto the door.  He tried to hack me again, I still slammed the door on him, and he fell again.   When he fell, a suitcase that he had been carrying, burst open.

MR BERGER: We are not getting interpretation.

INTERPRETER: I was requesting the witness to repeat what he had said.

CHAIRPERSON: Yes, just before you repeat what you said, Mr Baloyi, are you saying that this person had an axe and at the same time he was carrying a suitcase?

MACHIHLILE WILSON BALOYI: When they entered, there were three of them, they had brought it along, and they put it on a table.  They were just trying to kill me.  I saw the one person taking a hi-fi, the other took a box of records, they had just put the suitcase there.  When I slammed the door on him, he fell onto a chair, he got up, approached me again wanting to hack me, I still slammed the door on him, and he fell again and then he fell on the suitcase, which then burst open.

CHAIRPERSON: Yes.

MR MAPOMA: Mr Baloyi, are you able to hear the Interpreter speaking to you?

MACHIHLILE WILSON BALOYI: Yes, I can hear.

MR MAPOMA: I noticed that your earphone is not properly on in the ear.