Amnesty Hearings — Nelspruit — 1999-12-08

MR OOSTHUIZEN: Madam Chair, yes.  That is indeed a question that came up during the criminal trial as well, and I think we are now looking at the aspect of negligence and intention.  It is my respectful submission Madam Chair, that when this act was committed, there was not much time for my client as he had a job to do, he had certain orders that was given to him, and he as a faithful member of the IFP ...

CHAIRPERSON: But my question is, is it your submission that they should have foreseen the possible injury or possible deaths of other people inside the shop, yes or no?

MR LAX: If I may just put it subtly differently, did your client foresee it in shooting in those instances, did he foresee that other people would be harmed and then was he reckless as to those consequences?

MR OOSTHUIZEN: Madam Chair, yes, I think if I can put it, if I can put it in this way, indeed my client must have foreseen that other people was in the shop, other people could have got hurt and indeed so, the argument of the Honourable Panel is indeed correct if they say that my client should have foreseen.

CHAIRPERSON: That is not what we are saying, we want to find out from you if that will be your submission or if that is your submission.

MR OOSTHUIZEN: That is indeed so, Madam Chair.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you.

ADV BOSMAN: Sorry, Mr Oosthuizen, if you could just enlighten me here, the firearm which was used in the killing of Mr Tiledi, was that a lawful firearm, was it in lawful possession of your client?

MR OOSTHUIZEN: Honourable Member of the Panel, the firearms were gained from, if I am not mistaken, from ...

CHAIRPERSON: From Mr Mbambu?

MR OOSTHUIZEN: From Mr Mbambu indeed, who gained it from the IFP Headquarters in Ulundi, and that firearm was used when committing the said act.

ADV BOSMAN: Was it in lawful possession of the IFP, or was it an unlawfully possessed firearm?

MR OOSTHUIZEN: Honourable Member, as far as I can remember with reference to the previous hearings, I think the firearms were the lawful possession of the IFP Headquarters. Maybe not, it is so that the applicant was maybe not a lawful licence holder but I think the firearms belonged to IFP members.  I am talking ...

CHAIRPERSON: You are speaking under correction because they did not possess any lawful firearms, that is the IFP?  There was a consignment of firearms that were used by the hit-squad not only in respect of this incident, but in respect of other incidents, which were unlawful.

MR OOSTHUIZEN: Madam Chair, I will go with that.  As I am saying, I am speaking under correction, I cannot deny that.

ADV BOSMAN: Your client is also applying for amnesty in regard to the unlawful possession of firearms, is it?

MR OOSTHUIZEN: That is indeed so, Honourable Member.

CHAIRPERSON: Can you just, Mr Oosthuizen, refresh our memory, what particular firearm was used in this case?

MR OOSTHUIZEN: Madam Chair, with permission, may I just get instructions from the applicant?

MS MTANGA: Chairperson, if I may be of assistance, on page 49 of the record, it is indicated there that Mr Mbambu had a 9mm Z88 and Mr Ngxongo had a 9mm Baretta.

MR OOSTHUIZEN: Madam Chair, that is indeed the instructions that I just got from my client as well.

CHAIRPERSON: Mr Mokoena, can we press at the same time, so that we can maintain the same sequence of communication.  Do you have any submissions to make on behalf of the victims?

MR MOKOENA: Madam Chair, I don't have any submissions to make.

CHAIRPERSON: Do you leave the matter in the hands of the Committee?

MR MOKOENA: That is correct Madam Chair, that is my instructions that I leave the matter in the hands of the Committee.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you Mr Mokoena.   Ms Mtanga?

MS MTANGA: Chairperson, my position is the same as that of the lawyer for the applicant, I would like to leave this matter in  your hands.
NO SUBMISSIONS BY MS MTANGA

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you.
F I N D I N G

CHAIRPERSON: The application by Mr Mondli Wiseman Ngxongo is the application which is as a result of an incident which involved one Mr Romeo Mbambu, whose application in respect of the same incident, was heard in Ermelo under the so-called Caprivi Hearings.   The decision in respect of Mr Mbambu's application has already been given by the Panel which sat and presided over that application.   The Panel that sat in respect of Mr Mbambu's application have reserved its reasons with regard to the offences for which Mr Mbambu sought amnesty for the killing of Mr Japie Tiledi.
	For purposes of consistency, this Panel shall similarly not advance its reasons until that Panel has furnished its reasons in respect of the same incident.  We are however, in terms of the Act permitted to give our decision without having to advance such reasons, and we shall now proceed to do so.   
	This is the decision of this Panel sitting in respect of the application moved by Mr Ngxongo, our decision is as follows: amnesty is hereby GRANTED to Mr Ngxongo in respect of the following offences: 
(1) the murder of Mr Japie Tiledi at Bushbuckridge, committed on or about April 1993,
(2) the attempted murder of Mimi Matsani and Boy Mokoena also committed at Bushbuckridge on or about April 1993 and thirdly the unlawful supply and possession of firearm and ammunition, in contravention of the provisions of Act 75 of 1969, during April 1993.  The same being used in the commission of the offences for which amnesty has been sought and granted by and to Mr Ngxongo.  That is our decision.  We thank you Mr Oosthuizen, Mr Mokoena and Ms Mtanga for having assisted us to reach a just and quick decision in respect of Mr Ngxongo's application, thank you.  You may be excused.

MR OOSTHUIZEN: Thank you Madam Chair.