Human Rights Violation Hearings — Alexandra — 1996-10-29

OBED BAPELA: Maybe to deal with the first question.  I am a gender activist myself, there are no cultural or traditional custom rules that prohibited Constance to give a statement but then she wanted to give her own statement during the women hearings of what she suffered.  I mean she has been in detention as many times as one can no longer count.  She was one of those people who was in custody the longest amongst the women in Gauteng I think.  People were just coming and going and she just stayed there in the state of emergency and she just wanted to talk about those issues and then I think when the women hearings takes place in Gauteng she will be amongst those who will be giving a testimony there.  On the second question I must say that in the conduct of the struggle it is true that there were things that went wrong in many instances but then the wrongs were not planned by
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the organisation, the wrongs were not planned by the leaders and therefore those wrongs when they occurred people had to come in and say stop it.  In some instances we did succeed, in some incidences we did not succeed, where people tell you who you are and they just continued with those particular activities.  And that was the situation unfortunately where in some areas we could not really give maximum control on.  And then just to be specific on occurrences on the peoples courts, the peoples courts were set not by us as leaders, not by us as organisations but it was the residents who demanded them by frequently going to the youth and say may I solve your problem now and (indistinct) until we are solved.  Those were the incidences when we went deeper, as we were preparing for their cases too but how they came in to being because all of a sudden we were charged with these peoples courts.  We then got this other information that people demanded and wanted them and because they found solace in them.  But the unfortunate as I earlier indicated, was that some people got excited after the events of the six days war.  Alexandra changed completely.  There was complete anger that dominated Alexandra then but a period prior to there was that very good organisational control over the situation and unfortunately the deaths and the massacres that then followed really worsened the situations and one will not therefore say that everything that was done thereafter could be justified as just because the wrongs you know did occur unfortunately but not because they were planned or mastered by certain organisations or leaders.

COMMISSIONER: Just before you leave.  I would like to thank both of you really for coming forward to share and also to support the people of Alexandra.  The story that you have
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told us is one of those sad ones.  As I was listening I was imagining a pregnant woman sleeping in a house and all of a sudden having to jump around for her safety and also I would like to share, I suppose your gratefulness for being alive today.  Many people in the eighties who were trapped in those circumstances didn't survive.  Also I would like just to affirm what you have said and to thank you for your spirit of reconciliation.  In this community in particular you have referred to different political groupings, to people who assist the security forces and to the police themselves.  The call you have made is the call that we have been making since we started that, it is only if people come forward and apologise and talk to the people whose rights were violated that we can begin to talk about healing and reconciliation.  I thank you very much for coming forward.  How we will proceed we will ask Mr Bennet Lekalakala to just take five minutes in giving a perspective.  We are told that he has a written statement.  He is not coming here as a witness so the Commission will be happy to get a copy of what he is talking to.  And then after that we will break for tea.