Amnesty Hearings — Durban — 1999-08-11

MR VISSER: I see that there is a gap here in Exhibit D.  Could you just inform the Committee what the arrangement was and how the arrangements were launched.  You were in Durban, what happened then?

H J P BOTHA: Yes, Col Taylor came to speak to us, at least he contacted me and requested my presence when Vorster came to visit him with the request that we assist in the recruitment of Cele.

MR VISSER: Yes.  Colonel Taylor was Col Andy Taylor?

H J P BOTHA: Yes.

MR VISSER: And he has since then passed away?

H J P BOTHA: Yes, that is correct.

MR VISSER: Very well.  Now you had this order and what did you do?

H J P BOTHA: We began with the preparations.

MR VISSER: Who is the "we"?

H J P BOTHA: That was Col Andy Taylor, Col Vorster, myself, Laurie Wasserman.  From Pietermaritzburg there were persons by the name of Jerry Brooks - I cannot recall his rank anymore and ...(intervention)

MR VISSER: I beg your pardon.  Please continue.

H J P BOTHA: ... and then Col Taylor also called Frans Labuschagne from Middelburg, as well as a Sgt Verwey to assist, due to their knowledge of the road network in Swaziland.
	The planning was that we would enter Swaziland illegally via a border post and that we would meet the informer Neville in Manzini and that he would point out to us the college where Cele took night classes.  We did not know him physically, we just knew his name.  
	And then after the informer had lured him to a vehicle we would take him illegally over the border fence to the RSA, and for that purpose Labuschagne and Verwey would be of value to us because if we experienced a problem within the Swaziland territory according to our knowledge, they knew the dirt roads which led to the fence where we would then cross the border illegally.

MR VISSER: Very well.  And as far as you can recall, Sam du Preez was one of the members who went with you from Durban?

H J P BOTHA: No.

MR VISSER: Because Mr Verwey stated in his amnesty application that Mr du Preez indeed accompanied you, but you say that this is not the case?

H J P BOTHA: No, that is incorrect.  Chairperson, it then also came to be that during July 1988 we travelled to a place which belonged to the Department of Forestry and was situated between Nerston and Amsterdam, where we spent the night.

CHAIRPERSON: Just give me the name of the place again, where?

H J P BOTHA: N-E-R-S-T-O-N, Nerston.  It's a border post, Chairperson and the town is Amsterdam, as in the Dutch Amsterdam.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you.

MR VISSER: What did you travel with?

H J P BOTHA: We travelled a hired Volkswagen kombi.

MR VISSER: Where was the vehicle hired?

H J P BOTHA: It was hired in Durban, from Avis.

MR VISSER: And who went with you in the kombi to Swaziland?

H J P BOTHA: With me in the kombi there was Laurie Wasserman, Andy Taylor and Vorster, as well as Jerry Brooks, who drove with a vehicle and Verwey and Labuschagne joined us later.  I don't know whether this was at Amsterdam at the place that belonged to the Department of Forestry or at a later point.

MR VISSER: You say that Taylor and Vorster travelled with you.  In the kombi?

H J P BOTHA: No, they travelled in their own vehicle.  We travelled in three vehicles.

MR VISSER: Brooks in the one, Taylor and Vorster in the other and you and Wasserman in the kombi?

H J P BOTHA: Yes, that is correct.

MR VISSER: Now let us go to the point where you arrived in Swaziland.  You and Wasserman then went through the border post into Swaziland?

H J P BOTHA: Yes.

MR VISSER: Legally?

H J P BOTHA: Yes, legally.  Just to supplement that, before the night of the seizure action or the abduction we legally entered Swaziland via the Nerston border post with our passports, we met our informer at the George Hotel, he identified the college to us, he identified Dion Cele to us and according to that we could undertake planning in terms of where we would seize him.

MR VISSER: And who had to be placed where in order to undertake the reconnaissance surrounding this entire operation so that it would run safely?

H J P BOTHA: The following evening we went in three vehicles to the Nerston border post and crossed into Swaziland.

MR VISSER: Were you and Wasserman still in the kombi?

H J P BOTHA: Yes, Sgt Wasserman and I were in the kombi.  Sgt Verwey was in a vehicle and Col Vorster and Mr Labuschagne were together in a vehicle.

MR VISSER: Where was Col Taylor?

H J P BOTHA: Col Taylor and Sgt Brooks remained behind at the Nerston border post ...(intervention)

CHAIRPERSON: Can I just stop you there. I got the impression that you were already in Swaziland and you say now the following you were back in Nerston.  That's in South Africa.  So you legally entered Swaziland and did you come back again into South Africa?

H J P BOTHA: Chairperson, I will explain.  I said that the entry to Swaziland did not take place upon one occasion only, the night of the abduction was preceded by a reconnaissance trip to Swaziland during which we followed the entire procedure of picking up the informer at the hotel.  He showed the college to us, he identified Dion to us and surrounding that we understood our planning for the abduction operation.  We returned to Nerston and then the following evening we re-entered Swaziland.

MR VISSER: So there were two occasions, Chairperson.

CHAIRPERSON: Well this time, did you enter legally again?

H J P BOTHA: Legally again.

CHAIRPERSON: Yes, do carry on.

MR VISSER: You were in a kombi with Wasserman and you have already told us who manned the other two vehicles.  I think that would bring us to paragraph 4 of Exhibit D, but before we get to that, did you meet Neville again in Swaziland?

H J P BOTHA: Yes, we met him again at the George Hotel.

MR VISSER: Did you pick him up there?

H J P BOTHA: Yes, we picked him up and a small distance from the George Hotel, Neville then took over the driving of the kombi while Wasserman and I concealed ourselves in large cardboard boxes which had been placed in the back of the kombi.
	He drove to the college and parked diagonally opposite the gate.  Sgt Verwey and his vehicle stopped some distance ahead of us, and behind us were Vorster and Labuschagne.  They would be our backup should something go wrong.  The informer met Dion after he had finished his classes at the college and accompanied him to the kombi.  
	For the purpose of the abduction we damaged the left front door of the kombi so that it could not open.  We wanted him to enter the kombi by means of the sliding door.  After he had climbed into the kombi he sat down on the seat directly in front of us.

MR VISSER: That would be next to the driver?

H J P BOTHA: No, directly behind the driver.

MR VISSER: I beg your pardon, perhaps we are misunderstanding each other.  Mr Cele climbed in by the sliding door.

H J P BOTHA: Yes, and sat down on the seat.

MR VISSER: Which seat are you referring to?

H J P BOTHA: The kombi had double seats behind the driver's seat.

MR VISSER: So he sat in the second row of seating on that bench.

H J P BOTHA: Yes.

MR VISSER: Very well.

H J P BOTHA: And I just want to explain.  Because a kombi usually had double bench seating, the first seat next to the sliding door had been removed so that we had more room in the kombi.  In other words, there were two seats in the front of the kombi, one for the driver and the passenger and then one bench seat which was adjacent to the engine and adjacent to the section containing the boxes in which we were concealed.

CHAIRPERSON: Is all this detail necessary?

MR VISSER: Not really, Chairperson.

CHAIRPERSON: Well you must try and control it.

MR VISSER: Very well, please proceed.  Cele then climbed into the kombi, and did you move away?

H J P BOTHA: Yes, the vehicle drove away and while it was in transit, Wasserman and I seized Cele and kept him under control.

MR VISSER: Did he scream?