Amnesty Hearings — Palm Ridge — 1998-11-30

JOHANNES AMOS METHULA: Yes, that is true, I cannot deny that.  In such a situation anything can happen because I could say that there was no time to say you're scaring a person off, you had to shoot to kill or prevent the enemy from advancing.

MR MOPEDI: So did you kill or injure anyone?

JOHANNES AMOS METHULA: As I've already explained, immediately after pulling the trigger the crown dispersed, the Internal Stability Unit approached and I was shocked.  I also ran away.  I wasn't able to wait and see whether there were any injured or people who died.  I ran for my life thereafter.

MR MOPEDI: You don't exclude the possibility that you injured or even killed someone with your act?

JOHANNES AMOS METHULA: I would not exclude that possibility because it's a well-known fact that a gun kills.  Even though my intention was not really to kill but to actually prevent an eminent attack.  But if there was a threat upon my body and limb I was prepared to kill for that.  I was prepared to kill in order to protect myself as well as members of the community.

MR MOPEDI: Are there any further incidents in which you were involved with your firearm?

JOHANNES AMOS METHULA: Yes, there are other incidents that I was involved in, minor incidents.  For instance patrolling and looking for people who were in possession of illegal firearms as well as the SPUs.

MR MOPEDI: So if you found those people with illegal firearms or weapons ...(indistinct) the weapons, what did you do with the illegal weapons?

JOHANNES AMOS METHULA: Since I started patrolling the firearms or the arms that we used to get, assegais, tomahawks, axes, we would confiscate them and give them to the commander and he would pass them over to higher authority.

MR MOPEDI: So the AK47 that you used to scare away IFP members, that you used to fire at IFP members on the day of the funeral, what happened to it actually?

JOHANNES AMOS METHULA: With regard to this particular incident, I spoke about one AK47 that was in my possession.  It would happen sometimes that in a particular section there would be only one or two guns.  This firearm that was in my possession during the year 1993, I think it was nine days before the elections.  It happened that Stambu - there was a fight that had broken out at the hostel and Stambu went there and apparently the gun was confiscated by the soldiers because the soldiers came looking for the gun.  The explanation that we got was that this gun was confiscated by the soldiers and Stambu ran away.

MR MOPEDI: Were you personally there or was it explained to you?

JOHANNES AMOS METHULA: Could you repeat your question please?

MR MOPEDI: My question is, when the firearm was taken away from Stambu, as you have testified, were you there personally or is that what you heard?

JOHANNES AMOS METHULA: When the Gun was taken from Stambu I never went there, I wasn't there to fight because the guns were few, but when he came back he no longer had the gun.  As to whether the gun was really taken I cannot say with certainty.

MR MOPEDI: So are you asking for amnesty?

JOHANNES AMOS METHULA: Yes, that is correct.

MR MOPEDI: And are you asking for amnesty for being in unlawful possession of an AK47, firing the shot at members of the IFP?

JOHANNES AMOS METHULA: Yes, that is true.  I'm asking for amnesty for possession of the AK47, illegal possession as well as firing at the enemies or the then enemies.  It's because of the situation that prevailed at that time.

MR MOPEDI: Is there anything that you would like to add which you might have left out?

JOHANNES AMOS METHULA: There is no other incident that I was involved in.  These are the incidents that I've already referred to and testified to.

MR MOPEDI: Thank you, Mr Chairman.
NO FURTHER QUESTIONS BY MR MOPEDI

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you.  Questions?

ADV STEENKAMP: No questions, thank you, Sir.
NO CROSS-EXAMINATION BY ADV STEENKAMP

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you.  I assume there is no re-examination, Mr Mopedi?

MR MOPEDI: None Mr Chairman.
NO RE-EXAMINATION BY MR MOPEDI

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very much.
	Mr Methula, you are excused, thank you.
WITNESS EXCUSED

CHAIRPERSON: We will adjourn at this stage until tomorrow morning at 9 o'clock or as soon thereafter as we can start the proceedings.  We're adjourned.
COMMITTEE ADJOURNS