Amnesty Hearings — Durban — 1998-11-09

I D BOSCH: When I wrote this Chairperson, or rather I was a member of Vlakplaas, I was an anti-terrorist member and this person we killed was a terrorist.

MR MALAN: Would you now please page to 10(a), it's on page 17 of the bundle, the second sentence starts
"Because we could not legally prosecute this person it was necessary to take the threat that he held for the general public as well as the then government out of the way."
You wrote this too years ago, where did you get this information from two years ago?

I D BOSCH: From my memory, Chairperson.

MR MALAN: But from your memory you didn't know why the person was there.  I'm trying to tell you that if you can remember anything else, as soon as it becomes clear please tell us because at this stage you are confusing me and I'm only trying to play open cards with you, I just want to see whether you might be able to help me.

I D BOSCH: Chairperson, like I'm sitting here I am as confused as you, I don't know whether it's morning or night.

MR MALAN: Thank you, Mr Bosch.

CHAIRPERSON: Mr Bosch, can you explain to me why on page 5 of your handwritten application you said there was financial advantage, you got a bonus in cash?

I D BOSCH: Chairperson, this has got nothing to do with this incident, this pertained to something else.

CHAIRPERSON: Well tell me what incident it has got to do with?

I D BOSCH: I think it was an external operation, foreign operation.

CHAIRPERSON: On whose behalf?

I D BOSCH: Vlakplaas.

CHAIRPERSON: And they paid you a bonus, a cash bonus did they?  Who paid it to you?

I D BOSCH: The people on the farm paid it.

CHAIRPERSON: Was that the normal practice at Vlakplaas?

I D BOSCH: No, Chairperson.

CHAIRPERSON: Well where was this external operation?

I D BOSCH: In Lesotho, Sir.

CHAIRPERSON: What was it?

I D BOSCH: It was the killing of people, a cross-border attack.

CHAIRPERSON: How many people were killed?

CHAIRPERSON: I think seven or eight, Sir.

CHAIRPERSON: And when was it?

I D BOSCH: 1985/86, Sir.

CHAIRPERSON: So this was before this, you'd been on cross-border killing people in Lesotho and paying bonus for it?

I D BOSCH: And a medal, Sir.

CHAIRPERSON: So it wasn't your first killing this one?

I D BOSCH: That's right, Sir.

CHAIRPERSON: You mustn't consult with your legal advisor while you're answering questions.

CHAIRPERSON: How many people from Vlakplaas were paid this bonus?

I D BOSCH: All the people that took part in the operation, Mr Chairman.

CHAIRPERSON: Who were they?

I D BOSCH: It was Major Eugene de Kock, Willie Nortje, myself, Snor Vermeulen, Anton Adamson and security policemen from Ladybrand.

CHAIRPERSON: Have you applied for amnesty for this?

I D BOSCH: Yes, Sir.

CHAIRPERSON: And have you disclosed that you received a cash bonus?

I D BOSCH: It's in this thing, Sir.

CHAIRPERSON: And have the other people done the same?  It's in the same application?

I D BOSCH: That's correct, Sir.

CHAIRPERSON: We can check on the other, thank you.

MR ROUSSOUW: Sorry, Mr Chairman, I don't know if there are any further questions for Mr Bosch or whether he can be excused?
WITNESS EXCUSED
MACHINE SWITCHED OFF

MR VISSER: We'll be here at 9 o'clock, Mr Chairman.

ADV PRIOR: Mr Chairman, may we just announce it so that the public can hear.

CHAIRPERSON: We will now adjourn till 9 o'clock tomorrow morning.

ADV PRIOR: Ladies and gentlemen, please all stand.
COMMITTEE ADJOURNS