Human Rights Violation Hearings — Mooiriver — 1997-05-28

CHAIRPERSON: Do you feel that you are coping better now?

WITNESS:   I think I am better, but my child was severely traumatised.  She is quite forgetful.  At times she complains about the pain on her chest where she was hit by the big rock. Have you ever received any form of counselling or anything like that to help you through this experience?   ---   No, I haven't.

KHOZA MGOJO: Ria, I am just going to ask a few questions.  You have talked about Lagcabasi.  What is Lagcabasi's surname.

WITNESS:   I do not know Lagcabasi's surname.

KHOZA MGOJO: Where does he stay?

WITNESS:   They say his surname is Hlongwane, Lagcabasi Hlongwane.

KHOZA MGOJO: Do you think he is one of the killers?

WITNESS:   Yes.

KHOZA MGOJO: Did he see that you saw him, or did he also see you?

WITNESS:   Yes, he saw me coming.  We ... (inaudible - end of Side A, Tape 1) ... he had just done.

KHOZA MGOJO: Who is Lagcabasi?  Is he a member of the community, or where does stay?

WITNESS:   He was staying at the hostel.

KHOZA MGOJO: Have you ever asked yourselves as to why you were being attacked, because what we have been told by the other witnesses who testified was that there was a conflict between Inkatha as well as ANC members.  Now, in your own opinion why do you think that you were attacked or your house was targeted, and who do you think attacked you?

WITNESS:   It was Inkatha members from the hostel.

KHOZA MGOJO: Did you belong to any political organisation?

WITNESS:  I was an ANC member personally, but my mother was not involved in any politics.

KHOZA MGOJO: Now, do you think that you were attacked because you were affiliated to the ANC?

WITNESS:   I think that is the case because the area was an ANC stronghold - that is Brandville - so when they came to attack they knew that we were members of the ANC.

KHOZA MGOJO: And what about your brother that you have just referred to?

WITNESS:   He stays in Durban.  He has got a house in Durban in Newlands East.

KHOZA MGOJO: This is a very difficult thing to understand as to why men just went to target and attack a house where women and children stay, because the trend was that they were attacking houses with men or males.  Now, let me just ask from Khumbuzile, as she submitted a statement.  When your mother died how did this affect you?

WITNESS:   It has traumatised me.  I am in so much pain.

KHOZA MGOJO: How were you traumatised?

WITNESS:   I was traumatised mentally as well as physically.

KHOZA MGOJO: What is it that is troubling you?

WITNESS:   I am always thinking.  My daughter and my mother are always in my thoughts.  At times I even cry when I think of my mother and my daughter.

KHOZA MGOJO: Is there any psychological help that you are getting to try and cope with your pain?

WITNESS:   Yes, I once went to some doctors, but I couldn't be helped.  The other one told me that I should think too much.

KHOZA MGOJO: Take your time.  We do understand your pain.  (Pause)  I would suggest that your sister, as well as yourself, submit your names so that they can be forwarded for you to be able to get some psychological help or counselling.  You can submit your names to the briefers and they shall assist you in trying to arrange appointments for you to get some form of counselling without having to pay.  By the way, where was Lagcabasi staying?

WITNESS:   He is staying at the Mooi River Hostel.

KHOZA MGOJO: Was it the last time you saw him on that day of the attack?

WITNESS:   No, I do see him in town.  He is quite a common site. What does he say to you when he sees you?   ---   He never says anything.  One day he greeted me and I kept quiet.

KHOZA MGOJO: Why didn't you greet him back?  Do you still feel bad about what he did?

WITNESS:   Yes, that is true.

KHOZA MGOJO: I would like to ask you one more question just to set the record straight.  Your sister, Thando, what was her real name?  In your statement you have stated that your sister is Thando.

WITNESS:   A mistake was made because ... (intervention)

KHOZA MGOJO: What's your sister's name?

WITNESS:   There were only two of them.

CHAIRPERSON: We want to thank you both very much for coming and telling us this very, very tragic story.  I remember reading about this incident at the time in the newspapers, and I remember it was a short piece in the newspaper and it said 18 people had been killed in Brandville township, and then the article went on to talk about the conflict between the IFP and the ANC.  But it didn't tell us about what happened that night.  It didn't tell us about the horrors that you experienced, and you have brought that to life here today in a very real way for us, and enabled us to understand how terrible it must have been for you at that time.  This massacre in 1991 has been quite well documented since then, and the IFP hostel residents concede that it was from that hostel, and it was supporters of that party, that came out that night and attacked people and killed them, and they say that they did it in order to prevent an attack which they believed was going to take place later in the day, or later in the week.  But, whatever they believed, nothing on earth can justify what they did that night.  These people called themselves an impi, a group of armed men, warriors.  They weren't men, they weren't warriors, they were cowards and they were murderers, because that is really all that one can say about people who break into a house and stab to death an elderly woman and her granddaughter.
It's also shocking that nothing was done by the police, that statements weren't even taken, that people weren't arrested and prosecuted, and locked up for this terrible deed.  And we hope that this sort of thing will never happen again, and if it did happen again that there would be a very, very, very different response from the authorities and the police.
We will try and do what we can do to find out who the person is that you mentioned, whether that person was ever investigated, although it will be a very difficult job.  This took place a long time ago.  Many of those people have probably left Mooi River.
But we thank you again for coming here, being brave enough to come and talk to us and tell us that story, and we hope that the fact that you were able to appear on stage there together has given you both some strength to deal with this incident.  Thank you very much indeed.
/CHAIRMAN

CHAIRPERSON: The next witness is Joseph Mthethwa.  Good morning, Mr Mthethwa.  Can you hear me?  Thank you for coming in today.  You've come to tell us - you're from Brandville, you've come to tell us about the death of your son, who died in December 1991, the same day in fact as the previous witness.  Before you tell us that story can you stand up to take the oath please.

JOSEPH SABELA MTHETHWA: (Sworn, States)

CHAIRPERSON: Dr Mgojo will help you.

KHOZA MGOJO: Good morning, Mr Mthethwa.  We're glad that you came here before the Commission to tell us your sad story about what happened to your family.  Before we start talking about what happened I would like you to paint a picture of your family.  Do you have a wife?

WITNESS:   Yes, I am married and she is still alive.

KHOZA MGOJO: How many children do you have?

WITNESS:   I had seven children.  I am only left with three.  Four of them died.

KHOZA MGOJO: When you said four of them died you also counted the one that you came here ... (incomplete)

WITNESS:   Yes, I have.  These other three were ill and they died.

KHOZA MGOJO: These other three who died, how old were they?  Were they married?

WITNESS:   No, they were not.  They were old and they were in school.

KHOZA MGOJO: And what about these remaining three, how old are they?

WITNESS:   They are old, they aren't that young.

KHOZA MGOJO: Are they married?

WITNESS:   No, they aren't married.

KHOZA MGOJO: Are they still staying with you?

WITNESS:   Yes, they are.

KHOZA MGOJO: Are they working?