Amnesty Hearings — Bloemfontein — 1996-05-13

N JACK MENERA: Yes that is correct.  This incident of Billy caused that, or rather shown to us that as we were known as members of the ANC, this gangster would come after us and kill us.  What we must do is to defend ourselves against them.

UNKNOWN: Were the killers of Billy arrested and tried for the offence?

N JACK MENERA: I would explain it quite broadly to the Commission.  I do not believe that they were arrested because whatever was done by this gangster would not be seen as an offence.  They would not be arrested. You would not know what happened about their case.  For example after we were arrested in 1991, the same year explosives were found in Mr Phelane's house.  He was arrested but later bailed.  We do not know what happened.  Nobody knows what happened about the trial.  Himself and the police know what happened.
	Many other activities done by those gangsters, when reaching the ears of the police would end there. Even in court such things would not be dealt with because this gangster assisted the Boers to oppress the black people, because  they shut the ANC down in Brandfort. They did such kind of operations, nothing happened about them. I can make an example again.  Accused No 8 who died in my trial Zola Christian Bosman, he's accused No 8 in my case.  After Zola was released from trial, the attorney general released him because there wasn't adequate evidence at our trial.  After two months of his release he left for Johannesburg for about two weeks. On his return at Brandfort he had an argument with Edward Phelane's son and he was shot with Zola.  When the comrades explained the following day that the person who shot Zola Bosman was Sibikhoto.  The very witness was arrested and lashed and assaulted and the blame was laid on him.  As ANC members we knew quite well that he was the person, this Edward Phelane who killed Christian Bosman.
	The police when investigating, or rather dealing with the inquest of Christian Bosman, we never heard of the suspect regarding Christian Bosman's murder.  The person who was questioned about Zola's death was Morgan Phelane. I want to put this that the police knew very well who the killer was, and I'm referring here to Zola's killer or murderer.

UNKNOWN: Now you were telling us about the activities of the gang, did the gang in any way openly collaborate against the police in circumstances where activists were, let's say for instance holding meetings?

N JACK MENERA: I will explain it in this manner so that the Commission understands when I say that the gangster had a good relationship with the police.  When I refer to the first action taken against Mr Phelane, these toilet bucket action that we spilled at his house, the comrades were arrested on that day were not arrested by the police, they were arrested by the gangster, taking them in these police vehicles.  In this case which I'm still on trial for, after we took this first action against Mr Morgan Phelane, these two comrades from Virginia were not arrested by the police, they were arrested by this gangster and he took them to these police vehicles. I want to say, the gangster and the police collaborated, they worked together.

ADV DE JAGER: Who was driving the police vehicle?

N JACK MENERA: Are you referring to the day we took the first action against Mr Morgan Phelane or on the arrest?

ADV DE JAGER: They arrested, the gangsters arrested some of you and took them into the police vehicles. When the gangsters arrested some of you and took you to the police vehicles, who was driving the police vehicles, the gangsters or the police?

N JACK MENERA: The police vehicles were driven by the police themselves.

UNKNOWN: Now you told us earlier on that Mr Phelane was amongst people who were detained during the state of emergency 1986 and that about three months later you were released. Is it correct that Mr Phelane was released before you were released?

N JACK MENERA: Yes he was released before us.

UNKNOWN: Now did, you have earlier on referred to Mr Phelane as a person who was in a leadership position vis a vis the youth activists in Brandfort.  Once you joined Michael did Mr Phelane still act as a leader.

N JACK MENERA: Yes that is correct.

UNKNOWN: Did you have, what activities did you engage in this capacity as the leader of the youth?

N JACK MENERA: As I have already explained, I would explain in this manner. Of all the actions we took in the township referring here to burning policemen's' houses, Mr Morgan Phelane was the one who sought legal representatives for us, advocates.  Mr Morgan Phelane used to bail us.

UNKNOWN: Can you recall any other things that he used to do to assist the youth?

N JACK MENERA: I would say Mr Morgan Phelane as I have said, was in the leadership.  If there was an action taken by the police against one of the youth and we decided to attack the specific policeman, anything that we would do we would consult Mr Phelane beforehand and tell him that Sergeant So and So did this and that and at this very moment we want to go and burn him, or rather burn his house. And I do not remember Mr Phelane denying our suggestions or actions that we were about to take, even petrol bombs that we used mostly to burn policemen houses.  We used to prepare them at his cafe. The petrol, or rather fuel that we used to make these petrol bombs were taken from his cars, he voluntarily gave petrol to us that we can prepare those petrol bombs and take out our action.

UNKNOWN: Now you had come to the stage where you told us that Mr Phelane formed a gang that was essentially anti-comrades and you also described the activities of the gangsters.  Can you then tell us what the effect of Mr Phelane's and Mrs Phelane's refusal to resign and the activities of the gangster were in the community of Brandfort?