Amnesty Hearings — Boksburg — 1998-06-24

PETRUS PAULUS STEYN: Afterwards after we decided that this attempt of ours would not be successful he recommended that he knew people in a flat, friends of his. It seemed to me as if they were his friends but when we got there it was a female friend of his at a flat. I do not exactly where this was and I would not be able to confirm even today where this was.
	We arrived there and we parked the vehicle in the street in front of the flat and the two pipe bombs were in the back in the boot at that stage and then we found the people in the flat.  There were two ladies, an older one and a younger one if I remember correctly.  The younger girl I do not know exactly how old she was I would say she was about ten.

MR PRINSLOO: Were there any men there?

PETRUS PAULUS STEYN: No not at all Chairperson.  He chatted to them and he introduced us to them and then they offered us some coffee and after we had finished our coffee they were busy with packing. We couldn't determine if they were leaving on holiday or what was going on but afterwards I found out or I learned from them as we were speaking that they were also members of the AWB but they were unknown to me because they did not live in my area or my district.
	The two ladies and the young girl, after they packed their things Jaco Nel asked them if we can use their flat just to stay over for the night. I do not know if he gave them any reasons, I cannot really say because I was not with them the whole time.  He was moving around quite often within this building, mostly in the foyer where we drank coffee we sat there.  He went with them to the room and helped them to pack and they had a vehicle I think it was a blue Golf and they moved around in this vehicle.  They had lean to where they parked the car underneath.  This was at the flat where they stayed.  
	I am not sure but I think Jaco asked them if they could not pull the car out and whilst they were putting their luggage into the Golf, Jaco pulled his car underneath this lean-to so that the car wouldn't be visible because at that stage he still had the original registration plates on the car and there was talk that he would put forged number plates on it later.
	After a while the people left and when they left Jaco Nel told them that he would see them later because he knew where they were going.  Apparently it was a resort at the Hartebeespoort dam where they were going. I still to this day do not know where that place is but I confirm that I was there myself. They used this place for training purposes according to him.

MR PRINSLOO: Let's stick to what happened in Pretoria.

PETRUS PAULUS STEYN: Afterwards they also said - let's stay with Pretoria, afterwards they left and we were there alone. Then we walked to town.  We knew that we couldn't go on a mission then because of the strong presence of the police.   I had a shoe problem, the sole of my shoe went loose, this is the shoe I was wearing.  If I remember correctly we went to the OK Bazaars and I bought myself a pair of takkies or trainers. I think Jaco also bought something it might have been clothing, everybody bought something there.

MR PRINSLOO: At that stage did you get any number plates?

PETRUS PAULUS STEYN: This was at the same time that we went to the OK.  Jaco said we had to stand on the one side of the road and that he is quickly going to get number plates made, so he went to the place where he made the number plates and he had to wait awhile.  In the meantime - he said he will go and fetch it later, so in the meantime we went to the OK and when we went back he got the number plates.

MR PRINSLOO: Were these number plates similar to the ones he had?

PETRUS PAULUS STEYN: No they were just different.

MR PRINSLOO: So obtained these number plates.  And these number plates did you attach it to the vehicle?

PETRUS PAULUS STEYN: The number plates later that day when we drove we changed the number plates, we removed the original ones.

MR PRINSLOO: Those number plates - did you drive again in the evening with the vehicle or at any other time?

PETRUS PAULUS STEYN: I am not a hundred percent sure, during that time while we were there I am not sure if Jaco was driving with his vehicle or whether he was driving with the females vehicle.  He might have said that he wanted to go around to his wife. At that stage I was not sure of his wife and the problems between the two of them so I did not know anything of that, I assumed that he was going to go to his wife.

MR PRINSLOO: So he left the flat for a while?

PETRUS PAULUS STEYN: Yes he left alone but myself and Gert Fourie stayed behind on our own at the flat.

MR PRINSLOO: And Jaco Nel, did he return later?

PETRUS PAULUS STEYN: Yes he returned later.

MR PRINSLOO: Now with regards to that specific evening to come closer to the event, did you drive again?  Did you go and look for a target?

PETRUS PAULUS STEYN: We went back to this taxi rank where there was still a lot of police around but according to me there was even a stronger police presence than it was the morning or the time we were there during the morning.  Afterwards Jaco said, I am not sure, he said he was going to drive to another taxi rank, the one we went to the previous day.  On the way there, this is a type of a beer hall or something, I don't know what you would call it, we drove past this place and there were quite a lot of people around and vehicles were parked at the side of this building and I assumed these were the peoples' vehicles who were inside the hall.  Jaco then said what is wrong with this place.
	We looked at the place and we said well whether we throw it at a taxi stand or whether we detonate it here it doesn't matter, as long as we only achieve our goal which was to shock people and to create the psychosis of fear within them so that they would be aware of the fact that bombs are exploding and that they will receive a message some way or another, a message saying that they should not go and vote.  That was the instruction which we received, we had to sow panic.

MR PRINSLOO: So did you decide it was an appropriate target?

PETRUS PAULUS STEYN: Ja we decided it was appropriate but mostly Jaco. It was mostly Jaco's target but we identified ourselves with him because we were his subordinates.

MR PRINSLOO: So it was his instruction, is that what you are saying?

PETRUS PAULUS STEYN: Yes.

MR PRINSLOO: Now at that stage did you use the pipe bomb?