Human Rights Violation Hearings — Durban — 1996-05-09

INTERPRETER: 11B/0 Start from, "Granny where she was selling".  The interpreters couldn't hear you.  Excuse the interpreters.  It's cut off again.

KHOZA MGOJO: If you could start all over again and see if we will hear you.

WITNESS:   My Granny sells second-hands.  I was forced to go with her to where she was selling these things, because they were worried about my safety, because they thought that Siphiwe would come back when I was alone at home.  As things went on, after a while ... (intervention)

INTERPRETER: Excuse the interpreters.  It's cutting again.

KHOZA MGOJO: Please continue.

WITNESS:   There were newspaper people.  There was a telephone call that there will be people from Johannesburg who would come to take photographs.  Indeed, those people came in midday.  They took photographs inside the house and outside and in the street.  In my grandmother's bedroom before the day of the funeral, just a day after this had happened, there were bullets that were found, which had cracked.  On the wall on my grandmother's bedroom there's a hole where the bullet had entered.  While the investigation was continuing, there were lots of incidents that were happening, done by Siphiwe Mvuyane, because he had not been arrested.  While the situation was still like that, after a while, after a long time we heard that there was going to be a court hearing, although I wouldn't be able to go and give evidence.  They just told us when it was going to be the following week, that it was going to be on

KHOZA MGOJO: /a Monday.

KHOZA MGOJO: 11B/2 a Monday.  On that week-end and the court hearing was going to be on a Monday, we heard that Mvuyane had died - that he had also been shot.

KHOZA MGOJO: When you heard, who had shot him?

WITNESS:   I never knew.  After that there was never any court case.  I had expected that the court hearing would continue, because Mvuyane wasn't alone.  Those who were with him had participated.  Those he was with also harassed me.

KHOZA MGOJO: How did they harass you?  Could you explain that?

WITNESS:   They were nasty.  They were swearing at me.  Even if Mvuyane, I think even those other people also had guns.  They were also guilty.  Even those people - our neighbours were harassed by them, who were just innocently walking in the street.

KHOZA MGOJO: Could I ask you some questions?  I know this is very painful and I empathise with your pain, because your brother was killed in that way, in that manner.  I'll just ask a few questions.  Was there a death certificate?  Was there a medical certificate?

WITNESS:   Yes, there was.  Yes, it was done.

KHOZA MGOJO: In your statement you were speaking about Dina.  Could you tell us something about this Dina, Austin's colleague, Dina, who came with the police?

WITNESS:   Please excuse me, it is not Dina.  I didn't want to talk about a name.  He is one of the boys who they had taken along the street to come and pick up Austin.

INTERPRETER: Excuse the interpreters.  We cannot hear.

DR BORAINE: I am sorry to interrupt you, Dr Mgojo.  We are still having trouble with the interpreters.  Could we please have some alternative arrangement.  Whilst I'm making this announcement, could I make sure that all cell
 /phones are
11B/4 phones are switched off, please.  They are very disturbing.   I have been informed that the microphone is faulty.  They are getting a new one.  We apologise very much for this interruption and especially to the witness.  I have also been informed that cell phones are interfering with the microphones, so please make absolutely sure that all cell phones are switched off.  Thank you.

KHOZA MGOJO: Was there any organization that he was involved with - any political organization?

WITNESS:   He didn't have a card, although most of the youth in Lamontville were followers of the ANC.

KHOZA MGOJO: I think this is the last question.  You said in your statement - you were asking, you were requesting the TRC to educate the son of the deceased.  How old is this son?

WITNESS:   When Austin died there was a girl he was involved with.  It was discovered that at the time when he died this girl was pregnant.  She comes from Umlazi.  This child at the moment is with us and my Granny at Lamontville and his name is Fuyele.

KHOZA MGOJO: Has he already started schooling?

WITNESS:   He's at pre-school.

KHOZA MGOJO: Where?

WITNESS:   At KwaGijima (?) Primary School.  He was born in March 1991.

KHOZA MGOJO: Is there any other thing you would like to request from the Commission to do for you besides this?  Granny can't speak, because she didn't make an oath.

WITNESS:   I would request the Commission to help us whichever way it deems fit.

KHOZA MGOJO: Like what, for instance, my daughter?  If you could be free and just clarify, even if we cannot do it, but, please, do state it.  Don't be afraid.

WITNESS:   With regard

KHOZA MGOJO: /to Austin's

KHOZA MGOJO: 11B/6 to Austin's son's life, because I would say we were brought up by my Granny.  This child is also under Gran.  My Granny is old.  She can no longer work.  She survives on pension.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very much.  Dr Boraine.

DR BORAINE: Mrs Majola, let's get the earphones on.  Can we just test that?  Can you hear me all right?  I want you to go back to 1990, on the day that Austin was killed.  I want you to think what happened on that day.  It's very painful, but just to help us.  Some people came into the house at about 8 o'clock.  Now, think back, what were they dressed in?  How were they dressed?

WITNESS:   They were wearing private clothes.  None of them was wearing any police uniform.

DR BORAINE: Thank you very much.  The second question is, Siphiwe Mvuyane - you've mentioned his name several times - was he a private person?  Was he a policeman?  Was he a member of an organization?  Who was this man who you say killed Austin?

WITNESS:   He works for the KwaZulu Organization.

DR BORAINE: Just to make absolutely sure, so he wasn't a policeman?

WITNESS:   He was a policeman.

DR BORAINE: With the SAP or the KwaZulu Police?

WITNESS:   It was KwaZulu Police.

DR BORAINE: And when he was killed on the week-end before the court case, there was no more court case?

WITNESS:   No.

DR BORAINE: Thank you very much for your help.

CHAIRPERSON: When they are asking questions then you can switch off.  Thank you.

DR MAGWAZA: I have got a question directed at you personally.  During the time all this was happening you

DR MAGWAZA: /were very

DR MAGWAZA: 11B/11 were very young.  How old were you then?

WITNESS:   I'm 28 years old now.  This happened in 1990.

DR MAGWAZA: You look very young.  As you have been relating I will talk about what I felt inside me.  It would see like you were alone throughout this situation.  Was there some kind of support you got from your family, because you kept on saying, "I and my grandmother.  I and my grandmother".  It would see you were all on your own, facing this situation.

WITNESS:   It doesn't mean that the family members were not there.  We do not live with them.  There is my aunt, who lives in KwaZulu.  There's also another one who also stays in Lamont, although we are not staying in the same house.  I'm talking about my Granny, because she's the person I live with in the house.   There is also another boy and my children, two children.

DR MAGWAZA: I will continue, because to me you are like people who are victims, because you were harassed, you suffered.  If you look in your life, how were you affected by this situation as far as your health is concerned?  Is there some that happened that affected your health?