Human Rights Violation Hearings — Durban — 1996-10-25

WITNESS:   One is with me and the other one I don't know where he is.   He has disappeared a long time ago.  I don't know whether he is still alive, because I tried to look for him but I just couldn't get any clues as to his whereabouts.

CHAIRPERSON: (Inaudible) ... that whilst your mother was being buried they weren't able to do anything in the church, was this because the police were harassing you, or did the priest in charge refuse to do anything in the church?

WITNESS:   No, he did not refuse, but there were certain members of the SB and they told the priest or the reverend that there mustn't be any of the stuff that is being done in funerals, it must just be a simple plain funeral.

CHAIRPERSON: You mentioned that your family blame you for your mother's death.   Do you also blame yourself, because that - you seem terribly emotional about that, and one gets the sense that you fell a certain amount of guilt about that.   Is that correct?

WITNESS:   At first it felt very unsettling, very painful, as well as disturbing, because I was separated from my family, I was actually ostracised, and when I came across problems I couldn't contact anyone and I didn't have anyone to talk to because all of my relatives were blaming me for my mother's death.  Secondly, they just neglected me and they did not accept me.   And I also couldn't accept the situation but I ended up having to accept it, because that is just how it was happening.  But my sole source of conciliation was that I was with my other siblings, and they were my solace.  I found solace in them.   But when my mother was sick, I asked her as to how she was feeling about the whole issue of my joining politics, she said to me what I was doing was right, because I was fighting for rights.  I think she said that on a Monday and she died on a Wednesday.

CHAIRPERSON: (Inaudible) ... glad about that, hey?   How do you support yourself now and your son?

WITNESS:   There is a certain elderly woman who is a neighbour, ever since my mother died she is the one who helps us keep head above water.  She always comes to my place to help us with whatever we needed, and whenever I get temporary jobs I would also give back to her, because I know later on she would help me out of my problems.   Because I couldn't get a permanent job, but two weeks back I received a letter and I found that I had been listed as a new recruit, so on the 5th of November I will be leaving to join the army.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you for your story.  I am going to ask the other commissioner if they want to ask you any questions?

UNIDENTIFIED COMMISSIONER: Thank you, chairperson.  I will also ask you a few questions.    It is apparent that you are very troubled emotionally.   In your statement you have stated that you were also harassed and they also wanted to know about the weapons.   Are you any of the young comrades who were trained in handling arms?

WITNESS:   I never went outside the country to get trained to handle the arms, but there was a certain way we used to transport the arms, but we never used the arms personally.  They would arrive and we would take the consignment out.

UNIDENTIFIED COMMISSIONER: My second question is, were there many women in this organisation who were helping in accepting the arms and transferring them?

WITNESS:   We were only two women.  And there were six males.

UNIDENTIFIED COMMISSIONER: As you can see that today the truth commission hasn't adopted the usual normal procedure.   Can you tell us how you felt as a woman, when you look back now as a woman, how did this all affect you?

WITNESS:   It affected me quite drastically because I am not sure whether I was a proper mother to my child, because I never had time to raise him up.   So, I don't know whether I acted in the proper manner, I doubt myself as a mother.   Secondly, there are certain things when I look at other women, I find that they have progressed so much and I feel that I haven't done anything as a woman, because I've never lived with women for quite a long time.

UNIDENTIFIED COMMISSIONER: Nomhle, I have accepted that as the commission we should also assist our president as to what should happen to people or victims of the atrocities of the past.  What do you think we, as a commission, should do so that women must not pass this way again?

WITNESS:   I think that when a woman is arrested, they must take certain things into consideration, because my living conditions in the prison were quite terrible.   We want it to be explained to us many women are very scared to join politics and they are scared to go in prison, because they always take us that we cannot possibly handle ourselves as women, we cannot be involved in politics, but I feel is we as women can act and do things that men do and we can do much more than they can.  And we want to be respected, we want to be independent, because even in jobs they would say, no, this is a woman, you can't do this job.   We want to get our rights as women.

UNIDENTIFIED COMMISSIONER: Lastly, before I hand over to the chairperson, if you could see the police who were torturing you, what are the things that you would possibly tell them as the police who actually tortured you and detained you without trial?

WITNESS:   I would tell them about the manner in which they assaulted me.   I don't wish to see any person or any woman going through the same torture and through the same torture, same trauma that I went through.  I couldn't change, I couldn't wash for days on end.   And the food that I was eating was not proper.   I was assaulted to such an extent that at times my eyes were swollen shut.  I don't believe a woman should be subjected to that type of treatment.   Because I believe if you ask a person you talk to that person, probably that person may end up wanting to give you the information, because the manner in which they assaulted me made me even more stubborn, and it made me fearless, to such an extent that I never told them anything.   Probably if they talked to me, I would have given them some answers to their questions.

UNIDENTIFIED COMMISSIONER: I have got two questions, Nomhle, that I am going to ask from you.   This is a very painful story, but we take you as a hero.   It is apparent that when you grew you, you lost your childhood, you never had a chance to be a child.   You were thrown into the world of being an adult.   And you lost your opportunity to be educated.   You also lost your right to humanity.  Now, today, when you are sitting and thinking what are your wishes, what are your aspirations that you had as a child but couldn't reach?

WITNESS:   I wished to study medicine, because at school I was doing science, maths, as well as biology.

UNIDENTIFIED COMMISSIONER: How did you fare at school?

WITNESS:   I used to pass my courses, but at times I wasn't going to school so I lost touch with my studies. What are your dreams now?   ---   I would like to continue with my education, because I used to do private courses, at times when they were offering free courses, because I did not have money and I would travel by foot from Sobantu to town.

UNIDENTIFIED COMMISSIONER: You do have aims in life.   My second question is, we know that the family is very important, especially when a person is traumatized as well as tortured or emotionally disturbed.   Now, I can see that you have got some wounds that haven't yet healed, with regard to your relationship with your family.   Do you wish us to be in an intermediatory position where we can try to bring your family back together again?

WITNESS:   Yes, I do have that wish.

UNIDENTIFIED COMMISSIONER: Is there a way in which you can advise us as to how we can approach or broach this subject?

WITNESS:   I really do not know, but they totally don't accept me, but I do wish to talk to them as they are part of my family.