Human Rights Violation Hearings — Worcester — 1996-06-25

MR LONDON: As I have said before, I can say the  reason the police handcuffed me it's  because a person who has been shot in Zolani or Ashton was involved in the struggle of boycotts.  That's how I can think about it so far.  I can't give you a clear definition and explanation.  That's what I experienced.  I couldn't question them as I  was also afraid and I was painful.

WENDY ORR: Sometimes when we are asking you questions we need to clarify even the people who are listening, we want them to get a clear clarification.  Most times we want a witness to tell what you were thinking of during that time.  These men, Kokoloi, Matroos and Watu and even Koki, Panie Matrossi -  are they related to each other?

MR LONDON: Yes, they are.

WENDY ORR: Michak Jonas who used to come to your home and Musak Ndabene , Golas Ndabene, Mulungi Seketsu and Tusuloo and others, are they still in Zolani?

MR LONDON: Yes, they are still there but Mr Koki and Matrossi passed away.  But his family still lives in Zolani.

WENDY ORR: Do you know where are they staying?   Do they attend the community meetings, churches, funerals and all the other community involvement's?

MR LONDON: Yes, I do know where they are staying.

WENDY ORR: How do you live with these people, how do you communicate?  It's not the first time they have been mentioned.  Maybe the other witnesses who come to the stand will mention them.
How do you feel to stay amongst people like this?

MR LONDON: As we are staying  with  them, no-one is  giving them any hard time, they are just staying as happy  as we are during this period.  When you see them, what do you think of them?

WENDY ORR: When I see them what do you think of them.

MR LONDON: When I see them -  especially Mishak Jonas,  I hate him a lot.  The reason is what he did to me is unacceptable and I can also say that he is telling lies that he was not shooting at me.  Because what he did to me was  unacceptable and I dislike it at all end of Tape 2, Side A ...
My sisters my brother and my mother was  also unacceptable, the year then was 1985, my mother got arrested in one of the police cells and was detained and released again after some time.
After a while my sister also was detained - her name is Jackie.
My brother was also detained and what they did to him like Mr Kokoloi, Watu and others, the treatment they were giving to him, the beatings, I didn't like them at all.
I still have that hatred but I don't show it to them. I communicate peacefully with them, I don't think I'll show it to them.   I communicate peacefully with them as if I have reconciled.

WENDY ORR: Maybe it is very difficult to stay with the people who were oppressing your family so much.

MR LONDON: That's what I can say so far - it is difficult but there is nothing one can do.  There is no other way,  I must stay where I am staying, I can't revenge them,  I will be arrested if I do that.  I am just staying with them, welcoming them peacefully, there is no other way I can do.

WENDY ORR: Thank you very much Wessel.

MR LONDON: Thank you very much.

CHAIRPERSON: As I was reading through your name, Wessel London, I thought you were coming to speak English and I thought  you were from abroad.  We thank you very much, because by the time you got shot you were still young  aged eleven and the words you passed to your family, those were also treated badly during that incident -  what and the fruits of the struggle that you were involved in -  it was painful -  it is  still painful and yet we thank you a lot.
The things that you are stating - putting forward to the  Commission, we will try our best to help and assist you.  Thank you very much, you may leave the stand. 
We are going to mention how is the Truth Commission, the procedure of the Youth Commission.  People from rural areas do come forward and you give the statements to them.  It is not everybody who is giving out a statement, who will be able to come and witness for what to the Commission.
We are receiving a lot of statements.  There are many people all over the country who would like to come forward and witness what they saw.  We plead to you not to get bored or tired.  And you must not ignore the way we are treating this situation.  We are trying our best that in hearings like these we are trying to have as many examples as possible.
Like for instance I would say, we don't like to show you that it's only the comrades who struggled during that time of the apartheid era.  Other people did also suffered.  We heard about necklacing???  we heard about white people who were also tortured so that people can know this Commission serve world-wide all over South Africa, that's how I can say it.
And what we would like to achieve and say to the people we would to get a history of the incidents that happened as from 1960 up to 1993.  So we are pleading with you don't get a negative attitude if you didn't get your change to come to the witness stand or think that what you told us we would throw it in the dirty box.  No, it won't be like that, we will accept it, and keep it.
Even your story will be in the report that will be given to the President of our country.  And if you find that you are the person who were  assaulted - heavily assaulted, everything that was going to be done to you if you did come to the stand or as you didn't come, we are still going to help you a lot and assist you and support you right through.  
Someone who may not have witnessed here should not consider that their written statement will be ignored.  This is not so, the written statement will be a  part of the eventful report to the President.  Even if you have only made a written statement and not a spoken witness, your notes will also be referred to the Committee of Reparations even if you did not appear before the Commission in person.
So don't loose your temper if we can't get you to come  and speak before us personally as if it's some new apartheid that only some people gets an opportunity to speak and others don't get an opportunity to speak.  Thank you very much.  
XHOSA -