Human Rights Violation Hearings — Duncan Village — 1996-09-24

BONGANI FINCA: We are going to call upon ... silence please, it is towards the end.  We are going to call upon Maki Ntshunde.  Is he here?  Mxolisi Tototo Mbewana.

REV XUNDU: Let me swear him in.  Will you rise.

UNKNOWN: (sworn states)

REV XUNDU: Thank you.

BONGANI FINCA: We welcome you Mr Mbewana.  We are going to hand over to Mr Sandi who is going to ask the questions on behalf of the Commission.  thank you.

MR SANDI: Thank you Chairperson.  Mr Mbewana, let me greet you this afternoon.  First of all, I want to confirm you names.  Your full names, Mr Mxolisi  Tototo Mbewana, is that correct?

UNKNOWN: Yes.

MR SANDI: Today you are going to tell us about what happened to you  during the conflict here in Duncan Village.  When I look at your statement, you say that on the 13th of October in 1985, you were shot.  Can you please tell us what was happening?

UNKNOWN: I'll start from the beginning like this.  In 1985, we were still using busses.  After work we were told by the driver of the bus, that the bus is  not going to get in Duncan Village because there are hippo's who are shooting people who are shooting people, even the bus could be shot at.
DUNCAN VILLAGE HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE
2 MT MBEWANA
 We alighted at Dugashe and we walked, it was already dark.
 There were people who were laying on the ground, being shot.  I managed to reach the C-Section, I was staying at Section 13, but my children were not there any the house was open, and my wife was not there also.
 I went to my next door neighbour's house, I found my wife behind the door and she told me that the soldiers are around and they are just shooting randomly at everybody.
 I told her that I saw this also, I also saw this boers.

MR SANDI: Which time are you referring to now, Mr Mbewana?  Were you on your way to work?

UNKNOWN: No.  We didn't sleep on that particular day because the soldiers were shooting all over.  The following day...

MR SANDI: Mr Mbewana, I would like to request that we stick on those events that are here on your statement, because in your statement you say you were shot at and evidence that you are giving now, should stick on that.  What happened and where did the whole thing take place, what was happening.

UNKNOWN: I'm right there.

MR SANDI: What happened?

UNKNOWN: Early the following day there were people who were toyi-toying from the other direction.
 They were saying that we must go and break that bridge so that the boers must not be able to go over the bridge to reach our place.

MR SANDI: Were you already shot at this time?

UNKNOWN: No.

MR SANDI: I would like to lead you Mr Mbewana, you said when you were at Ndzuzu Street, where is this Ndzuzu Street?
DUNCAN VILLAGE HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE
3 MT MBEWANA

UNKNOWN: Ndzuzu Street is just on the other side.

MR SANDI: You say you saw a casper coming from the direction of Ford Street to join the Ndzuzu Street?

UNKNOWN: Yes, that's correct, that's what happened.  Because this hippo was in front of me.

MR SANDI: You say this casper came to your direction, is that what you are saying?  Who was inside this police casper?

UNKNOWN: When this hippo turned, I gave way.

MR SANDI: What happened?

UNKNOWN: Some soldiers, White soldiers, alighted from this vehicle, and they didn't ask any question, they shot me.

MR SANDI: Where did they shoot you?

UNKNOWN: On my eyes.  I couldn't realise immediately that I was shot at.

MR SANDI: Which eye was that?  Is that the right eye or the left eye?

UNKNOWN: It is my left eye.

MR SANDI: Then what happened after that?

UNKNOWN: I heard a voice of people that the hippo had passed.

MR SANDI: ; Did you fall?

UNKNOWN: Yes, I fell.

MR SANDI: Were there any utterings that were made by this soldiers while you were laying there?

UNKNOWN: I don't remember hearing any of their voices, but I just heard ordinary people saying that I must be helped, I must be taken into a certain vehicle and be taken to the hospital together with the other people from the C-Section.
DUNCAN VILLAGE HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE
4 MT MBEWANA

MR SANDI: Were you taken to the hospital?

UNKNOWN: Yes, I was.  In this van I was taken by this van to the hospital.  I lost consciousness while the vehicle was next to the hostel, I regained my consciousness the following day in the hospital.

MR SANDI: What hospital were you admitted in?

UNKNOWN: I was in Frere Hospital.

MR SANDI: When you regained your consciousness there, what was happening?  In what condition were you in?

UNKNOWN: When I woke up there, when I touched my face, I didn't feel any pain, but I could see that, I could feel that there was something, but I discovered that the other side of me was swollen and I asked for a mirror so as to see what was happening, and then they said you are shot.  There is no need for a mirror, there is only a bandage on your face.

MR SANDI: You say while you were in hospital, the soldiers were visiting you regularly.  What is it that they were looking for?

UNKNOWN: They were just asking people concerning their injuries, whether they got injured at Duncan Village or wherever, but I didn't tell them, because all the people who were there, were under regard of the soldiers and after that person had recovered, that particular person would be taken by the soldiers.

MR SANDI: Were the soldiers going there in the evening or maybe during the day?

UNKNOWN: They used to visit the hospital day and night.

MR SANDI: Were there nurses and Doctors there when the soldiers were visiting the hospital?
DUNCAN VILLAGE HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE
5 MT MBEWANA

UNKNOWN: Yes.

MR SANDI: Were they asking for any permission from the nurses and Doctors to talk to the patients who were shot?

UNKNOWN: I don't know any idea whether they were getting permission or they were just doing that.

MR SANDI: You say whenever you saw this soldiers, you used to hide and have you ever - did you tell the nurses and the Doctors that the soldiers used to come there and ask for the folders?

UNKNOWN: No, I didn't, because they used to come to the hospital in the presence of the nurses and Doctors.

MR SANDI: So do you think there was a certain connection between the nurses and the soldiers?

UNKNOWN: I think the nurses were scared of the soldiers also.

MR SANDI: Did you approach any attorney Mr Mbewana, concerning this matter?

UNKNOWN: No.

MR SANDI: You didn't hear that maybe there were certain lawyers that the people who were shot at, used to visit?

UNKNOWN: I was told that there are lawyers, but my uncle said that, my other uncle who is a policeman is going to ill-treat me if I can lay charges against the police.

MR SANDI: What uncle are you referring to?

UNKNOWN: He died, he used to stay at Ediping.

MR SANDI: What department was he in?

UNKNOWN: He was not a police, but he was just a driver at Mlambabeki.

MR SANDI: Is that all Mr Mbewana that you would like to tell us?  Is there anything that you would like to say.

UNKNOWN: Yes, there is something else because even now DUNCAN VILLAGE HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE
6 MT MBEWANA
that I have recovered, I had a car - people know that car.  One day I was driving with Bravido who was accompanying me to the petrol station.  When I was going passed the shops, there were soldiers who were pointing their guns downwards, when I came back, there was another boy, they said I must turn.
 I must take this car to the camp, military base that was there.  We went inside, we were ordered to face the wall and open our legs, we had to place our hands on the wall
and they asked this boy - this little boy asked me why did I make a certain sign to him.

MR SANDI: Besides that you are injured in your eye, what else, where else were you injured?

UNKNOWN: My both thighs were injured.

MR SANDI: Is there any treatment that you are getting or maybe you are in a condition that allows you to get  medical attention?