Amnesty Hearings — Durban — UNKNOWN

DJ MKHIZE: Mr Chair, our syndicate ended up having lots and lots of weapons.  I have already explained that I was instructed by Capt Langeni from Ulundi to go to Port Dunford to pick up some of these arms from Mr Thomas Buthelezi who was in charge of the camp.  And I also got hold of several bullets.
	And some of the weapons, like hand grenades, I also still remember that there was something at Esikhawini at the time because there was Mr Khumalo who was in assistance of Inkatha.  He too sent me to fetch some of the hand grenades at the camp.  And some arms came with Joyful Mthethwa.  I am not quite sure where he got these arms, but I must also state that I indicated yesterday that at the time when we were forming this hit squad Joyful Mthethwa was one of the people to whom I was referred for assistance.  So that arms and guns such as Scorpions came with him from Nseleni.
	There is one particular gun, an AK rifle that was collected by Romeo from Mrs Mbuyazi, and it too became part of the arms cache that we had.
	We also raided homes, some of which we already knew that they had guns.  We would not arrest those people during the raids; we would simply take the guns so that they could be used by the syndicate.
	We really confiscated several guns, including shotguns.  And the guns that we received later on were the ones that were taken by Romeo and Constable Mthethwa.   And these guns came from J1; two pistols and one AK.  And by so doing the number of guns that we had accumulated.  I brought also one from Maritzburg.  This came from some people that I knew.  But that is not included in my affidavit; that there is a gun that I brought from Maritzburg.  And this became part of the arms cache.  And we ended up having lots and lots of guns.  And we kept these guns in a trunk which was at Romeo's house which we referred to as "12", that is the trunk.  Because "13" is a place where they used to keep exhibits at the police station.  So we referred to Romeo's place as "12".
	And this is how we would communicate, pertaining to the obtaining of fire-arms.  And that is basically how we accumulated these guns.

MR WILLS: (Indistinct) that you had certain dealings with some Inkatha Youth and by them I refer to Nkanalipho Mtenjwa, Lucky Mbuyazi and Syabonga Mbuyazi.  Now you've indicated in para 96 that they conducted certain attacks as well in Esikhawini against ANC members in your absence, and that you had nothing to do with these attacks.  And you've indicated in your affidavit that they reported to you a particular incident when one time during 1993 they conducted an attack where 11 people were killed at a shebeen, or near a shebeen.  Sorry, I'm just going to check that if the Commission will bear with me.  I'm not sure about the number, but they conducted attacks which involved the killing of many people in your absence.  Now you indicate that you had nothing to do with those particular attacks.  Is that correct?

DJ MKHIZE: Yes, that is correct.

MR WILLS: Now you're obviously aware that there are a number of community members and leaders from Esikhawini who have shown a great interest in these proceedings and are here today and have been here since this hearing started in Richards Bay.  Now you would obviously be prepared to answer any question and relate to them any knowledge you have relating to these attacks, even though you yourself were not involved.  Is that correct?

DJ MKHIZE: I would say to the community as I have explained yesterday, we are prepared to regurgitate, expose all the truth between the fighting pertaining to the ANC and the IFP so that it should be known who did what to who, when.  And therefore I am prepared to answer any question whether it comes from the community or whoever.  If I knew something about those incidents I would expose all the truth and if I was involved in an incident, I would say so.
	I am actually expecting all sorts of questions which I am prepared to answer.

MR WILLS: Yes, thank you.  Now Mr Luthuli has given evidence about his involvement in the plans to basically assist you to evade arrest when it became evident that you were going to be arrested.  But prior to that there was an incident which I think is relevant for the Committee's purposes, whereby you were transferred to Nquthu police station from Esikhawini.  Now was this a normal transfer, or can you explain how it came about?

DJ MKHIZE: I would explain.  Yes, I was transferred under abnormal circumstances.  Normal channels were not used.  I was located where I was, and I was told that Brig Mzimela wanted to see me.  Brig Mzimela told me that I am being transferred.  I asked him where, and he said he didn't know. He wanted to know which police station I wanted to go to, and I wondered how it came about that he doesn't know where I am being transferred.  He gave me an option to choose.
	I asked him why I was being transferred and he indicated that there is a person by the name of Melville who was an advocate.  He has sent a fax to the fact that I should be transferred with immediate effect.  And I had to be transferred immediately.  I didn't know why.  And he then indicated that I was being investigated, but I would not be investigated if I would still be around because I would interfere with evidence and people were scared of speaking out whilst I was still around.
	And I wondered if there was not any other way they could stop this.  And he indicated that the high authority has already made a decision to the effect of my transfer to Nquthu.  Because I also had a house at Dundee and therefore Nquthu would be nearer home.  And there was no ZP station at Dundee.  And I therefore agreed to be transferred, even though we differed quite a lot.
	And later that evening I took whatever belongings I could and concluded that I would come later to pick up the rest, and I was then taken to Nquthu that night.  I was ferried in State vehicles.  That's how I was transferred.

MR WILLS: It's correct that Adv Neville Melville was in fact the police reporting officer in Kwazulu Natal at that time.  Is that correct?

DJ MKHIZE: Yes, that is correct.

MR WILLS: I think that your arrest and the circumstances surrounding your arrest have been covered by Mr Luthuli and I don't think that it's important at this stage to get into that.  There's just one area which we need to cover.  You were arrested on the 18th of August 1993 and you were detained in the Empangeni police cells.  It was Sydney Croucamp from the South African Police who had arrested you.  Is that correct?

DJ MKHIZE: Yes, that is correct.

MR WILLS: And you phoned Maj Langeni and informed him about your arrest whilst you were in those cells.  Is that correct?

DJ MKHIZE: Yes, that is correct.

MR WILLS: Now what became of these promises that you had and that you've given evidence of?  When you initially commenced these operations you indicated that you were promised by very senior persons in the IFP like MZ Khumalo, Major Langeni, Gideon Zulu that you would be protected and supported in the event of your arrest.  Can you explain to the Committee?