Human Rights Violation Hearings — Durban — 1996-05-08

MR LAX: Mrs Siphe, this story is very painful for you, and we understand that.  I need to ask you some questions just to clarify some aspects.  Did you receive a death certificate of any kind for Stompie?

WITNESS:   Yes, I received a death certificate.

MR LAX: Are you satisfied that you buried your own son?

WITNESS:   I am satisfied.  I buried Stompie.  I buried no one but Stompie.

MR LAX: Now this lawyer, Mr du Toit, was he from Parys?

WITNESS:   Yes, he was at Parys.

MR LAX: Did he tell you how he came to know that your son had died?

WITNESS:   He didn't say anything.  He just said - he said Stompie was ill for a short time and he died.

MR LAX: You've also told us that some boys insisted that Stompie wasn't dead.  Did you ever speak to them and find out why they thought that he wasn't dead, what basis they were making this observation on?

WITNESS:   They said they heard from the news, and Mrs Mandela also kept on saying, "Stompie is alive, Stompie is alive."  That gave them strength.

MR LAX: Okay.  So they were just hearing this from other people, they didn't have any personal knowledge of the thing?  They didn't have any personal knowledge of this information, they just heard it on the news and so on.

WITNESS:   Yes.

MR LAX: You said that Stompie was a member of an organisation.  What organisation was that?

WITNESS:   They had an organisation - during that time it was - they had a Khozas organisation.  He was a leader of the so-called 14s, the young ones.

MR LAX: Was that organisation connected to any other organisations?

WITNESS:   During that time we used to call that organisation UDF, but they were connected.

MR LAX: Thank you.  Since that time it would appear there was quite a lot of feeling against you and your family for burying Stompie when people wanted to believe that he wasn't dead.  Have those feelings in the community gone away, or have you still experienced any further problems?

WITNESS:   People still refuse.  They say Stompie is in Botswana.  They say I buried a wrong person.

MR LAX: You told us a little bit about Stompie being in prison, going to Leeuhof, Sasolburg, Heilbron, Koppies, Potchefstroom and so on, and in your statement you told us that he was inside for approximately 11 months.  Did he ever speak about that time?  Did he tell you what happened to him when he was inside?

WITNESS:   Yes, he told me.  The first time I saw him at Potchefstroom he told me that they assaulted him, because his eyes were swollen.  I asked him, "Stompie, what happened?"  He said, "The SB fetched me from here and they shocked me on my private parts."

MR LAX: I want to just get a bit of a clearer picture about your family.  How many children have you had, or do you have?

WITNESS:   I have two children now.  It's Matabelo.  She is doing standard three.  I gave birth to this child during the state of emergency.  The other one is Matsidiso.  She is two years old.

MR LAX: How does Stompie's father feel about what has happened to him?  It's all right, it's working.  We can hear you.

WITNESS:   Stompie's father died in 1979.  He died in Johannesburg.  He didn't marry me.  The one that I am living with now is the father of my two children. Stompie's father passed away while Stompie was five years old.

MR LAX: Thank you, Chairperson, I have no further questions.

DR MAGWAZA: Mrs Siphe, what you have told us is a very heart-rending story.  I would like to hear from you, after all this suffering and pain how would you like the Commission to help you?

WITNESS:   I would like the Commission to help me a lot.  There is something that's really hurting me.  I don't get deep information about Stompie.  There are people whom I know, there are people whom I do not know.  Stompie was very young.  He would be working for me now.  I wouldn't be suffering.  Can the Commission do something to help me?

DR MAGWAZA: Ja, I understand that you want the Commission to help you financially.  Is that what you are saying?

WITNESS:  Even if it doesn't help me financially, but something has to be done.  I am staying in a shack, I am a very poor woman.

DR MAGWAZA: Thank you very much, Mrs Siphe.  The Commission understands your situation and they'll help where they can.  Thanks.

CHAIRPERSON: Just to point out she was saying that she wants to get to the bottom of this whole story, to know the truth.  That was her main concern.  We've seen this story in the newspaper, and it's been on the media for quite a long time.  Many people know about your son.  Mr Boraine has already said we are together with you in this big problem, especially when others still say you are lying, you buried a wrong person.  It seems as if these people are still opening up the wounds and pouring some salt.  Now, as the Commission we bring our condolences, we say may God be with you.  Let Him wipe away your tears.  We thank you for your presence here.  We thank you very much.

WITNESS:   Thank you very much, Sir.  I want to thank the Commission because I could come and bravely open my chest to tell you the story.

DR BORAINE: Chairperson, before I call the next witness I want to say how delighted the Commission is to see some schoolboys and girls and their teachers in the audience.  Part of the mandate of the Commission is to try and uncover the history and the truth of the last 30 years from whatever side it may come, and it is particularly important that young people know where they are coming from in order to build a new future, to make what has happened so often impossible to happen again.  We are delighted that you are here.
Secondly, Chairperson, we have received a number of messages, many of them verbal and telephoned, of good wishes to the Commission since we've arrived in Durban.  This morning we received one such message from the Manning Road Methodist Church, and inter alia they say, "May the Truth Commission be God's instrument of healing in our country."  It is of tremendous support to the Commission to know that they are being borne up in this way.
Now, we're changing the programme slightly to accommodate someone who has to leave, and we are inviting Mrs Kerney to come to the witness stand please.   Ms Kerney, may I welcome you on behalf of the Commission.  We are very glad that you are here.  We understand that you were going to be here yesterday, but were prevented from coming from other responsibilities, so we're particularly glad that you could find time to be with us today.  You will know that two sisters of Marcel Gerrard, who died in the bomb blast at Magoo's bar, were here yesterday, and we heard about their own grief and pain.  You were actually there.  They weren't, so it's very important for us to have you as an eye witness, and I want to welcome you very warmly, and thank you for taking the time.  As is our custom we ask a member of our Commission to lead witnesses as they tell their story, and in a moment I am going to hand you over to my colleague, Mr Ntsebeza.  But before I do that could I ask you to please stand to take the oath.

HELEN KERNEY: (Sworn, States)

DR BORAINE: Thank you very much.  You are now under oath.  Thank you very much for coming, and I hand you over to my colleague, Mr Ntsebeza.

MR NTSEBEZA: Thank you, Dr Boraine.  Helen, I will add nothing to what Dr Boraine has said by way of introduction ... (inaudible - end of Side B, Tape 6) ... before we go into the events of the 14th of June 1985 I would like you to tell us about yourself shortly, very briefly.