Human Rights Violation Hearings — Pietermaritzburg — UNKNOWN

MR DLAMINI: According to your knowledge why did the Court - did the Court give any reason for releasing the perpetrators?

WITNESS:   We were told that the testimony was unsatisfactory.  The evidence was just not sufficient for a conviction.  Even the manner in which the investigators handled the case, even the parade, the manner in which the identification parade was conducted was very unsatisfactory.  There were certain aspects of the case that were not written down or listed.  There were spaces which were not filled in which made the evidence to be very much insufficient and scanty.

MR DLAMINI: We will try and follow that up, see if there's anything that we can do to satisfy you.  We've got a death certificate here.  It's a temporary one.  Did you ever get the original one that details as to what the cause of death was?

WITNESS:   No, we never got any death certificate.

MR DLAMINI: In your statement you say your expectations and your wishes are that a monument could be built for all the 11 victims who died so violently on that particular day.  The Committee of Reparations and Rehabilitation, Dr Mgojo, as well as Dr Magwaza, who are members, they are taking that into consideration and they will further their recommendations to the people who have all the authority.  We are going to do a follow up, see if there isn't  more evidence and testimony that we can get with regard to the case.  We will get back to you in due course.

WITNESS:   One other thing that I want to point out is I think there are certain aspects of our law that should be revised, because on that particular day when Bheki died 10 other people died.  On the following day one died.  That was the 11th.  But amongst all the people who died there isn't even a single person who got convicted with regard to the deaths of those people.  There isn't even a single person who got arrested in all the 11 cases.  Now this poses a problem because that means we've got absolutely no law in our country.

MR DLAMINI: We do agree with you Mr Maseko.  At times you find that there are people who belong to a certain political group who are really not members of these groups, but they are just being put in there as spies to spy on whatever the organisation is doing.  Were there no such people within that ANC stronghold?  Is there anything you know of such people?

WITNESS:   Well, I will say at that time there were certain groups which were called Mgovu and Mgongo.

MR DLAMINI: Can you please explain to us what that Mgovu and Mgongo means.

WITNESS:   I won't be able to actually explain, but it was little groups that called themselves Mgovu, and the other ones called themselves Mgongo, but you wouldn't know whether Mgongo was under ANC or IFP, or Mgovu was under either of them.

MR DLAMINI: I'll hand over to the Chairman.  As soon as he has asked the questions we'll move on further to the matter with regard to your child.

MR DLAMINI: We don't have any more time.  We'll just ask a few questions.  Amongst all those suspects, Mr Maseko, you counted Sidney Sizwe Bhengu, Nthokozizi Buthelezi and Sergeant Thusi Khumalo.  Where are they now?

WITNESS:   One of them is still around, the other one is in gaol.  I don't know about the third one.

MR DLAMINI: What about the one who's in gaol?

WITNESS:   He got arrested.

MR DLAMINI: What for?

WITNESS:   I think he had killed a person.

MR DLAMINI: What about Sergeant Thusi Khumalo, is he still working?  One of the three people, according to your statement, Sergeant Thusi Khumalo.

WITNESS:   No, he's not Sergeant Khumalo, but he's the sergeant's son.

MR DLAMINI: Do you know the wall at Mpophomeni which has got a list of people that were harassed, tortured?  Now, are those names listed on that wall?  Have they been written?

WITNESS:   Yes, they have.  Especially Bheki's name it is there.  I am sure about that one.  I am not very positive about all the other names.  But the names of the people who were killed then are listed there.

MR DLAMINI: Do you remember the ceremony that was conducted for the erection of that monument?  Now you want a real monument that is different from the one that has already been made?

WITNESS:   My request was that those who died on that particular day, on one day, maybe if we could make a monument for them specifically for the 14th of April 1993.

MR DLAMINI: So we'll look into that.

WITNESS:   Because the main reason why we should have the monument was that everybody who got injured, who got killed at Mpophomeni should have his name listed in there, the day, the month, as well as the year and the name of the person.

MR DLAMINI: Now we'll look into that.  Thank you.

MR DLAMINI: Thank you, Mr Chairman.  I thank you, Mr Maseko, for persevering.  We are now going to go on to hear the story about your son who died, Mlungisi Jerome Maseko, at Mpophomeni.  When this happened he had visited his uncle, is that true?

WITNESS:   Yes, it is true, it's his uncle.

MR DLAMINI: At the time when he died he was 15 years old.  Was he still at school?

WITNESS:   Yes, he was at school.  He was in standard seven.

MR DLAMINI: Now, tell us about your family.  Do you still have a wife?

WITNESS:   Yes.

MR DLAMINI: Is she here?

WITNESS:   No, she isn't, she's at work.

MR DLAMINI: Where is she working?

WITNESS:   At Mondi.

MR DLAMINI: You pass our regards to her, as well as our heartfelt sympathy.  What about your other children besides Mlungisi?

WITNESS:   I've got six other children.

MR DLAMINI: How old are they?

WITNESS:   They are working, two of them are working.  Four are attending school.

MR DLAMINI: Can you please explain what happened on that particular day when your child got injured?

WITNESS:   I was at home in the afternoon.  It was at about six or seven.  Three boys came into the house.  They said to me I should rush to a certain spot where Mlungisi had been injured that was next to the supermarket.  I took my car, I drove towards that direction.  When I got there he was on the ground sprawled.  I thought probably he had just been injured ... (incomplete - end of Side B, Tape 2) ... went to the police station.  When I got to the police station they said I should wait, they'll send the doctor to come and check him.  When the doctor came somehow I had a feeling that he had died, because when I looked closely I could see that these were bullets that were sticking out of his skin.  When the doctor came he examined him and declared him dead.

MR DLAMINI: Who is the doctor who examined him?

WITNESS:   It's Dr Hyslop.

MR DLAMINI: Is he a surgeon, a State surgeon?

WITNESS:   Yes.

MR DLAMINI: Are there are police who came to take a statement from you, or were there any cartridges that you found in the area?

WITNESS:   There's one CID who came to take a statement from me.  His name was Aron Kunene.  He is the one who came to me.  We did not get any empty cartridges, because even when I asked what type of a gun with which he was shot he flatly refused to tell me.

MR DLAMINI: What happened?  What were the circumstances preceding your son's death?  Who was there?  Were there any political organisations that were there?  Was there any friction?

WITNESS:   At that time there were soldiers in the location.  They were called 32 Battalion.  That was the time where they went around assaulting and shooting people, especially at night.

MR DLAMINI: So you suspect that he was shot by the 32 Battalion?

WITNESS:   Yes, that's my suspicion.

MR DLAMINI: Is there anything that was said by the 32 Battalion at the time that your child was already injured?  Maybe they asked for forgiveness or they did something or say something.

WITNESS:   No, they said absolutely nothing.

MR DLAMINI: Is there any evidence or testimony that would contribute towards getting the perpetrators?

WITNESS:   No, I don't know, because they were travelling on foot, they were not even in cars.