Human Rights Violation Hearings — Duncan Village — 1996-09-24

MR SANDI: Today by being here in front of the Commission, you are going to tell about something that happened to you
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in August 1985 when it was early int he morning.  You were shot, is that so?

UNKNOWN: Yes, that is correct.

MR SANDI: I am going to hand over to you so that you can tell us in details how did this happened.  What happened on that particular day.

UNKNOWN: In 1985, it was early in the morning, I remember it was on a Tuesday, I was coming from the toilet.  When I was nearer to the house, I saw a hippo, a casper which was at a distance.
 When I was still looking at this hippo one White man alighted from the police casper.  While I was still looking at this, I fell.  I felt a bullet, when I tried to stand up, I couldn't.
 I lost my consciousness.  I regained my consciousness at the hospital, I think it was at (indistinct) day.  After that I remained in hospital, I think I was in the hospital for three months.
 When I was discharged from the hospital I was taking a treatment until 1986.  At least the pain was no longer as serious but at some stage I could still feel the pain - though I can't remember the years.
 But even here, last year I was admitted again in the hospital.  It was something like two weeks, it was concerning my operations.

MR SANDI: Do you still remember the name of the Doctor who was examining you in hospital?

UNKNOWN: That Doctor, I can't remember, I think it is something like Barnard, I'm not sure.

MR SANDI: But Mr Rubushe, you said you went to Lloyd police station to place a claim concerning a shooting.  Can you
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tell us Mr Rubushe, what happened at Lloyd police station?

UNKNOWN: When I went there, they asked me a question who shot me, I said it is soldiers.  They asked me the name of the soldier, I told them that I don't know the name of the soldier.  They said they won't take the case because I don't know the name of the person.

MR SANDI: If I hear you clearly, you said you were not - just because of the fact that you did not know the name of the soldier who shot you, no attention was paid to you claim?  Was there anything that, maybe you, did you ever approach any lawyer?

UNKNOWN: No, I didn't.

MR SANDI: Were there any people who saw you when you were shot, when you were being shot?

UNKNOWN: Yes, I can say because there are people who took me and one of my neighbours once told me the story.

MR SANDI: What did he say?

UNKNOWN: He said he saw me while I was being shot by the soldiers.

MR SANDI: At the police station, do you still remember the name of the police that you were going to who said he is not going to attend to this case of yours, because you don't know the name of the soldier?

UNKNOWN: No, I don't remember.

MR SANDI: Did you ever go to the police station again or maybe you didn't go there after that?

UNKNOWN: Yes, I tried to go to Fleet Street, I tried to institute another claim again.  Even there, I was not attended to, just because I didn't know the name of the person who shot me.

MR SANDI: Did you go to Fifth Street police station on the
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very same day?

UNKNOWN: No, I didn't, I think after a few weeks I went there.

MR SANDI: Whom did you approach at Fleet Street police station?

UNKNOWN: It was a White man.

MR SANDI: What did he say as a response?

UNKNOWN: He also asked the very same question that who shot me.

MR SANDI: By the time you were there, were there any other people who used to go to the police station concerning the very same problems just because they don't know the name of the police and they were not attended to?

UNKNOWN: I don't know, I won't say, but to me that's what I was told.

MR SANDI: Mr Rubushe, can you go on with your evidence?  Is there anything else that you would like to say, anything else that you would like to add?

UNKNOWN: The other thing that I would like to add is this, although I was shot by this person whom that I don't even know, at least something must be done to try and find a reason for this to find this person who shot at me.

MR SANDI: As far as you know, what do you think that might be the reason, what do you think that might be the reason?

UNKNOWN: No, I don't know anything.

MR SANDI: Are there any incidents that took place in that particular place where you were shot at, maybe a conflict between the soldiers and the residents?

UNKNOWN: No, there was nothing in that place, nothing happened.

MR SANDI: In conclusion Mr Rubushe, what are your requests
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in this Commission?

UNKNOWN: The request that I have today is that I wish that the Commission should investigate the people who shot me at that day.

MR SANDI: Nothing else that you said in your statement Mr Rubushe?

UNKNOWN: Can you repeat that again?

MR SANDI: Is that all, is that your only request Mr Rubushe the investigation about the person who shot you, is there anything else?

UNKNOWN: Yes, there is another request that I had.

MR SANDI: Can you tell us about that?

UNKNOWN: I just discovered that my condition needs some, I must go and get some disability grant.

MR SANDI: When was that?  Did you happen to get that grant?

UNKNOWN: I think it was in 1993, 1994.

MR SANDI: Are you employed now, or what are you doing now?

UNKNOWN: I'm not working.

MR SANDI: Is that all that you would like to say concerning your evidence just before I hand over?

UNKNOWN: After I was granted this money I have children who are still at school and I am responsible for everything and I had to go again to ask for something else because my wife also, I had to get another one, because my wife also, must also take care of the children.

MR SANDI: Thank you very much, I'll hand over to the Chairperson, thank you.

BONGANI FINCA: Revd Xundu?

REV XUNDU: While you got this accident, were you working?

UNKNOWN: No, I was unemployed.
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REV XUNDU: How many children do you have?  How many children do you have?

UNKNOWN: I have six children.

REV XUNDU: What standards are they doing?

UNKNOWN: The first one is doing standard 7, the other two are doing standard 4.  The other one is doing standard 7, the two is doing standard 4.  And the other one is doing standard 2.

REV XUNDU: Thank you Mr Chairperson.

UNKNOWN: There is something else that I forgot to say but I think it is written in my statement.  I have a problem concerning my operations.  Sometimes, especially in Winter I suffer a lot they are very painful.  I visit the day hospital regularly and then I get some tablets.
 Especially the one on my leg sometimes it is very painful, that is the reason why I was admitted at Frere Hospital.

BONGANI FINCA: Thank you very much Mr Rubushe.  Me are going to go to Mr Sukwana now.

MR SANDI: I greet you Mzwamadoda de Villiers Sukwana.  Those are your full names, is that so?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: Yes, that is correct.

MR SANDI: Let me first confirm that you were born in 1969?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: Yes, that is correct.

MR SANDI: You reside at C, Duncan Village, is that correct?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: Yes.

MR SANDI: What you are going to tell us about here today happened in August 1985 here in Duncan Village?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: Yes, that is correct.

MR SANDI: As from 1969, if I'm counting from 1969, I notice that you were only 15 years old or 16, you were between 15
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and 16 years, is that correct?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: Yes, that is correct.

MR SANDI: Let me start by asking you this question.  What are you doing now, are you attending school?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: No, I'm not a scholar.

MR SANDI: Are you working here in East London?