Amnesty Hearings — Pietermaritzburg — 1998-02-10

NORMAN ARENDSE: How did you react when you learnt or heard that one person was killed and two people were injured?  Did you expect that number to be killed and injured or did you expect more people to be killed and injured?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: The killing of a human being is not similar to killing a chicken or any other animal.  We felt it, but we are killing people.
	If it was possible that I can get out of prison and ask the PAC as the mother body of APLA to talk to the government and arrange a meeting between myself and my family and the families of the victims in order to reconcile.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Now, when you - how long did this attack last?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: I will not be exactly sure as to the time period, however, we knew that we don't have to take a long time.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Are we talking about seconds or minutes?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: I don't know how many minutes it was.

CHAIRPERSON: Sorry the other question actually was, when you heard the following day that only one person was killed, what did you think?  Did you think that, or did you expect that more people would have been killed or what?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: I personally as a person who was given directions to command the people, I saw it as an unsuccessful operation.

CHAIRPERSON: So you know yourself how many shots you fired, you know how long you kept the fire on.  Did you think, when you left the discotheque, did you think that more people would probably be killed or did you think only one would be killed?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: When the firing started, the lights went off and it was dark.  I wouldn't be able to see the target inside.
	Therefore, I wouldn't be able to know how many people might have died, however, we used lots of ammunition rounds.

CHAIRPERSON: So the following day when you heard that only one person was killed, you were not surprised?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: The truth is I didn't know.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you.

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: Meaning that he was surprised.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you.

NORMAN ARENDSE: When you returned to the motor vehicle with Shiceka and where did you go to after that?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: You mean after leaving the restaurant?

NORMAN ARENDSE: After leaving the discotheque, yes.  After you shot?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: We went back to the place where we were staying.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Yes, and what did you do there?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: I arrived, I got the members who were with us out.  I said to comrade Shiceka that he should get into the car so that we can go.  We went away on the way to the place where Bongani stayed and we requested a car.
	I gave the car to Shiceka who drove it to the owner of the car.  After that I took out R10-00 and gave it to him to put petrol into the car, because we didn't know where he stayed.  Even if I used the petrol, I put R20-00 petrol into the car, I had to give him an extra R10-00 because I didn't know where he stayed in that area.
	We gave him his car and came back and stayed in the house of Buthelesi.

NORMAN ARENDSE: You were arrested the very next day, is that right?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: That is correct.

NORMAN ARENDSE: How did you react to the arrest?  The fact that you were arrested so soon, so quickly, after what happened the night before?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: I couldn't react at the time when I was getting arrested, the reason being that I was in possession of a shotgun which has ammunition, seven bullets.  The rifles we had already left them behind at Malevu's brother so the (indistinct) arrested us, we couldn't counteract through the use of a pistol.

ADV SANDI: Mr Arendse, are you not really asking the witness how did he feel about his sudden arrest?

NORMAN ARENDSE: Thank you.  Mr Tanda, I asked you how did you feel about being arrested so soon after the incident took place just the night before, and now you are faced with this contingent of police stopping you and arresting you?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: I was not suspecting any person who could have sold us out, or even think there is that possibility.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Is it then your view that it was a pure coincidence that the police stopped you that day, the next day?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: When we were going to Malevu's brother, there was a bakkie which we came across on the way.  It was driving towards the township, as we were getting out of the township, when going back, we also met it again.
	I suspected that, we didn't suspect much because had already dropped the guns and went back to Matadeni.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Thank you Mr Chairman, no further questions.

CHAIRPERSON: Is he not applying for amnesty in respect of the illegal firearms, ammunition and the like?

NORMAN ARENDSE: Thank you Mr Chairman.  Mr Tanda,  you were also found guilty of possessing arms and ammunition and hand grenades and you heard me say in my opening statement, that you were correctly convicted for committing those offences, do you agree with that?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: That is correct.

NORMAN ARENDSE: And would it be correct that you are also applying for amnesty in respect of those offences?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: That is correct.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Thank you Mr Chairman.

NORMAN ARENDSE: .

CHAIRPERSON: What did the police find in your possession, what weapons did they find?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: When I arrived at the police station, we were searched.  They found a phone which links me to Jones.
	They also found the shotgun I referred to, the 9mm shotgun.

CHAIRPERSON: And some ammunition?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: That is correct.

CHAIRPERSON: Where did you get this shotgun with its ammunition and the hand grenade?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: The hand grenade and the arms were from Umtata.

CHAIRPERSON: What did you want to use them for?  For what purpose did you want to use all those weapons and ammunition that were found with you?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: The truth is that the gun, the arms were to be used for the operation.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you.  Yes, Mr Prior?

MR PRIOR: Thank you Mr Chairman.  Mr Tanda, in a statement which is unsigned, you indicated that you arrived in Cape Town in 1992 where you started a Task Force and trained members of APLA in order that they were able to carry out operations, is that so?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: That is correct.

MR PRIOR: Are you able to tell us where in Cape Town this training took place?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: I would like to ask a question.  The hearing in which I was supposed to appear in Cape Town, does the operations which took place in Cape Town affect the operation or are they linked to the operation that we took out in Newcastle?  Because I think I was supposed to talk about the operation which is specifically mentioned, about this, because I have already talked about these operations before.
	Unless, if that is not going to affect me, because I didn't have much consultation with my Advocate with regards to the operations in Cape Town.

CHAIRPERSON: It is your Advocate who took us to Cape Town.  I assure you though that I am sure the questions are not going to ask you what you did in Cape Town, what did you do and the like.  I am sure the questions will not get into that.

MR PRIOR: Mr Chairman, may I assure the witness?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: I think the question he asked me is referring directly to what happened in Cape Town and not about the ...

CHAIRPERSON: I don't remember what the question is, can you repeat the question.

MR PRIOR: Mr Chairman, I certainly won't go into the detail of those separate incidents.  But for way of background and his training in the use of arms in particular, I think the question is a general question and relates to the training that he did in Cape Town.