Human Rights Violation Hearings — Louis Trichardt — 1997-04-09

TSHIBILI SIOBO: Well, according to me, I would say it was just a deliberate incident.  Because it is very difficult, I mean it is unrealistic for one to - suppose you are facing somebody like this and then you go there directly is it realistic?

RUSSELL ALLY: For what reason do you think that this man would have done something like this to you?  What would the reason have been?

TSHIBILI SIOBO: Well, I take it that I was given that big thing to go and put it there because he knew what was going to happen, because he did not even want to check whether it was in its proper place.

RUSSELL ALLY: And before this incident with Rogers, this person you are speaking about, what was your relationship with him like?  Did you fight a lot, did you argue a lot about certain things?

TSHIBILI SIOBO: No, I do not remember any incident like that.

RUSSELL ALLY: Did he ever accuse you of not working properly or having certain views which he did not agree with, or you were trying to change things where you were working?  Was there any of that kind of interaction between you and Rogers?

TSHIBILI SIOBO: Well, I do not want to really add to what has happened.  It was just surprising, it was with the first time that, that took place.
 However, I would like to say something again, if give the time.

RUSSELL ALLY: Yes, certainly.

TSHIBILI SIOBO: When I got injured, surprisingly, I had to pay thirty rand for the ambulance.

RUSSELL ALLY: Thank you, I do not have any more questions.

TSHIBILI SIOBO: Okay.

THOMAS MANTHATA: Did you belong to any trade union?  Were you unionised as golf workers?

TSHIBILI SIOBO: No there was nothing like that.

THOMAS MANTHATA: All the time working with this Rogers, what was his attitude towards you people?

TSHIBILI SIOBO: Rogers is not a White man.  He is just a Black person.

THOMAS MANTHATA: How did he relate to you as workers?  Was he a nice chap if I have to put it that way?

TSHIBILI SIOBO: Well, Rogers was a very good person.  Well, you know, people change at times.  You know, sometimes they are moody.  As workers that is very normal in the working place.

THOMAS MANTHATA: Otherwise, are we referring to the same Rogers who said good afternoon when you were saying good morning?  Is it the same person?

TSHIBILI SIOBO: This Rogers is a Black person.  That is the one I was involved with in the tractor thing.  This other one is a Boer, a White.

THOMAS MANTHATA: How does he come into the whole tractor accident?

TSHIBILI SIOBO: The tractor episode is a separate thing and the beating is separate.  I said something about the first statement and the second statement.  You know, I wrote two statements about the beating and the injury.

THOMAS MANTHATA: Okay.  The injury is by Rogers and then the beating is by the White man?

TSHIBILI SIOBO: Yes.  Baas Daan was the one who beat me up.

THOMAS MANTHATA: What has Baas Daan to do with the tractor?  Is he a separate thing all together?

TSHIBILI SIOBO: Separated things.

THOMAS MANTHATA: No further questions, thank you.

CHAIRPERSON: Tshibili, we have heard your story and we are very sorry for what happened to you.  Is both Roger and your ex-boss still around?

TSHIBILI SIOBO: They are still at the golf course.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very much.  We might send our statement takers there to get some statements from them relating to what had happened to you.
 Thank you very much for coming.
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