Special Hearings — Faith Community Hearings — 1997-11-17

WELCOME IS REPEATED IN AFRIKAANS AND XHOSA: We welcome representatives of the different Faith Communities. We welcome representatives   of the different Christian Denominations present here. We welcome representatives   from Councils of Churches. First I want to express on our behalf our very, very   heartfelt thanks to Pastor Chris Venter and his people who have made available   to us this splendid facility. We were able to hold a service here last night,   a splendid service, and we have the use of these facilities, I think it is at   no cost. Having said that it is at no cost, I doubt they will charge us! We   do want to say a very, very big thank you. But I also want to say thank you   to all of you coming from the different Faith Communities who have made submissions   to the Commission, and especially a big thank you to those of you who have subsequently   accepted the invitation to expand you written submissions with a verbal intervention.   In many ways we ought to be able to say this is a gathering that is probably   the most representative of the different Faith Communities of this land. God   has blessed us wonderfully and we should be those who give thanks to the Divine,   the Transcendent, who has led us to here. With regard to the Christian Community,   this could be said to be perhaps the most representative gathering since the   Rustenberg Conference, and possibly have a wider representation of the extraordinary   religious Christian Community in this land. May I also express my appreciation   as the Chairperson of this Commission, to my colleagues, fellow commissioners   and committee members, but especially those who were charged with the responsibility   of arranging this particular hearing? Dr Mgojo, Bongani Finca, Mcebisi Xundu   and Piet Meiring. I don't know, I mean they didn't seem to have gender sensitivity   here. They are all men! The women will have to say that if anything goes wrong,   it is clear the influence of women was not there!
But I would like to ask you to give a warm clap to the Centre for their generosity   and to all of you for coming and to this Committee for arranging this hearing.   Please just give them a clap. 
APPLAUSE.
It is almost trite to say that this country is possibly the most religious   country, it certainly is a very religious country. Let me not be engaged in   comparisons. Now that doesn't say a great deal because religion is not necessarily   a good thing, not necessarily a bad thing. It can be a good or bad thing. It   was, after all, German Christians who supported Hitler, but then it was also   Christians in the confessing church who showed that wonderful resistance to   the awfulness of Nazism. And we know that in this country we marched against   the awfulness of Apartheid as members of the different faith communities Jews,   Muslims, Christians, Hindu and we were marching against a system that was buttressed   by others who claimed to be Christian as well.
And so we have a peculiar responsibility as members of religious communities,   for we have, I think still a great deal of influence if we wished to exercise   it. I hope that it will be clear to the world that this particular hearing has   a different quality to it from all the other hearings we have heard so far.   That splendid son of the soil, as they say, a great Christian leader, Archbishop   Hurley had a lovely story that he tells of three Archbishops standing in front   of the altar and they are all beating their breasts and saying, "Lord,   I'm not worthy, Lord I'm not worthy". Then the church cleaner comes along   and stands next to them and he also beats his breast and says, "Lord I'm   not worthy, Lord I'm not worthy". Then one of the Archbishops nudges his   friend and says; "Just look who thinks he's not worthy". 
But I hope that the story of the Pharacies and the Publican will have informed   the submissions and will inform our gathering. You know that in the theology   of sacramental confession, you are meant to accuse yourself. You are meant to   confess your sins, not the sins of another. You are meant not to justify yourself.   A self-calpatory exercise is a futility. You are meant to say what went wrong   with yourself and then other people may then say, "Actually, he was not   so bad. She was not so bad". Because if you say it of yourself, then there   is no need for others to try and be nice to you. We are here, not in order to   ridicule anyone, we are here to say to God and the world, we have fallen short   of your glory. You have used us as we are and there are some wonderful things   that you enabled us to do. There is no church that I know of that will not have   something to confess of its shortcomings, and very few that might not have some   good things to say. The church to which I belong could never be triumphalistic,   could never come here and gloat because the church to which I belong and which   I love so very deeply, as just a small example, for a very, very long time,   paid different stipends determined by race. It was only very recently that we   had an equalisation of stipends. So Anglicans can't come and appear to be "beter   koffie". And I'm sure that they are not going to try and do that. But it   will be important for us to say where we fell short, what we did do that was   good because of the grace of this incredible compassionate God. But much, much   more important, what are we going to do for the healing of this land? That is   going to be the major challenge. What are we going to do to carry out the ministry   of reconciliation that has been entrusted to us? 
(Cellular phone rings). It's mine. My apologies. I have this awful thing. If   you have this awful thing, switch it off. Thank you very much. What are we going   to be doing? We are meant to be able to encourage those with the burden of guilt.   Jettison that guilt. Confess. Because God is a faithful God and will forgive   us our sins. And to say to those who have been victims of it all, "Be willing   to forgive". And we in the churches and religious communities have a wonderful   opportunity of counselling, of standing there besides the perpetrators and their   families, because they too are still children of God. To stand by those who   have been shut up, and it is we the religious community who are going to have   to do something about the moral fibre of our country. It is we who are going   to have to say to this country, even the most awful perpetrator, still remains   a child of God. And that perpetrator has the capacity to change. After all,   we Christians speak of a soul who becomes a pall. For all of us are beneficiaries   of the inestimable grace of God and ultimately we are going to be the instruments   of the grace of this compassionate God. And I'm sure we will tell people that   it is not enough just to confess it is not enough just to be forgiven. But there   is something called reparation. Restitution. And we are going to be the ones   who have to be persuading people to do something to show that you are in earnest   about what happened in the past. Thank you.
Thank you very much. General Secretary Hlope Bam please. I will ask - oh I'm   so sorry I have not introduced the panel. Mcebisi Xundu is a member of the Reparations   and Rehabilitation Committee and he is based in our East London/ PE office.   Khoza Mgojo is a commissioner and a member of the same committee and he comes   from Kwa Zulu Natal. Bongani Finca is a commissioner member of the Human Rights   Violations Committee and he is the original convenor in charge of the Eastern   Cape Office of the Commission. Piet Meiring is a member of the Reparations and   Rehabilitation's Committee and is based in our Gauteng office. Virginia Gcabashe   is a member of the Human Rights Violations Committee and she comes from our   Kwa Zulu Natal/Free State office, based in Durban. Joyce Seroke is a member   of our Human Rights Violations Committee and is based in Gauteng. Tom Manthata   is a member of the Reparations and Rehabilitation's Committee and is based in   our Gauteng office. Will you administer the oath?