Amnesty Hearings — Johannesburg — UNKNOWN

MR PRETORIUS: Thank you Mr Chairman.  When were you issued and when did you put on your bullet proof vest?

COLSON TEBOGO BEEA: In the morning sometime, I don't know whether it was at ten or eleven, I don't know but in the morning.

MR PRETORIUS: Mr Beea I just want to put to you on behalf of the objectors that I represent and Dr Van Wyk represents, that none of them were armed with firearms on that day, they never attacked or were never part of a group that attacked Shell House, that they merely marched behind their Indunas that day when they were attacked by the guards of Shell House and they were shot at unjustifiably.  That is all Mr Chairman.
NO FURTHER QUESTIONS BY MR PRETORIUS

MR HUMAN: Thank you Mr Chairman.  Mr Beea I would just like to clarify something.  The information that you received, you said that the information was not clear but you knew that the march was going to be used to attack Shell House.  Is that correct?

COLSON TEBOGO BEEA: I would say that I knew because as I say, one handled quite a lot of sources and one handled, if this is what you want me to say, Indunas within hostels and these are then some of the people who said that be careful the march is going to be used as a ploy to attack Shell House.

MR HUMAN: But is it correct that you did not know that a certain group would be used to attack Shell House, in your mind you perceived it that the march was going to be used to attack Shell House?

COLSON TEBOGO BEEA: Honourable Chair I said it again first and I want to repeat again that I did not know the nature of the attack, I did not know whether they were going to throw grenades, I did not know whether they were going to use RPG7s, I did not know how the attack was going to be carried out.

CHAIRPERSON: Nor did you know how many groups were going to be involved in the attack?

COLSON TEBOGO BEEA: That's correct M'Lord.

MR HUMAN: Then isn't it strange to you that the security personnel of the ANC allowed certain groups to pass Shell House at the entrance, right in front of Shell House two to three metres away from the entrance?

COLSON TEBOGO BEEA: No it is not strange because, and I don't want to code them, but it is not strange because some of the marchers when they passed I was part of the people who were outside Shell House and we did not see any reason to shoot at them because we could have had we wanted to.

MR HUMAN: But the point I'm trying to make to you is that the information that you had was that the march was going to be used to attack Shell House, so why do you take a chance in letting any marchers pass Shell House at the entrance, in front of the entrance?

COLSON TEBOGO BEEA: What else do you suggest I should have done if you say take a chance because police were supposed to have re-routed the people, they didn't.  You put the blame on me that people were in front of Shell House?

MR HUMAN: Mr Beea it is clear from the evidence that we lead that the ANC guards took certain action with specific reference to one specific group.  Why didn't the ANC guards or yourself, you said that you volunteered to help there that day, did not try and stop the other groups from marching in front of Shell House?

COLSON TEBOGO BEEA: Let me make it clear for the Committee once again and the truth is, had the march or the marchers in front of Shell House opened fire we would have retaliated with fire ... (intervention)

MR LAX: Sorry I didn't hear the last part of your answer, just repeat that please?  You said had they opened fire you would have some ...

COLSON TEBOGO BEEA: We would have retaliated with fire, we would have shot at them had they shot at us.

MR HUMAN: Were you outside or in front of Shell House when these groups that passed Shell House in Plein Street, were you outside and present there at that moment?

COLSON TEBOGO BEEA: These groups passed at intervals and at some point when these groups passed, yes I was outside.

MR HUMAN: There was evidence led here that a small group in Plein Street shot in the direction of the people that was in front of Shell House.  Did that group then disappear again and did not near Shell House again.  Did you perceive any fire when you were in Plein Street in front of Shell House from any groups whatsoever?

MR TIPP: Perhaps witness should answer but my learned friend is not putting the evidence absolutely correctly.  I don't want to influence the witness's answer.

MR PRETORIUS: Let me rephrase my question.  Did you hear or see any firing from any marchers that moved from east to west in Plein Street while you were in front of Shell House?

COLSON TEBOGO BEEA: No I did not.

MR PRETORIUS: When you went to Shell House that morning, what was your purpose.  Why did you go to Shell House that morning?

SISI KHAMPEPE: You mean to Shell House where he's working?

MR PRETORIUS: That's correct.

COLSON TEBOGO BEEA: Honourable Chair I was employed at Shell House and the purpose of going to Shell House is because I was employed.

MR PRETORIUS: But you had also information that Shell House was going to be attacked that day?

COLSON TEBOGO BEEA: Honourable Chair whether or not I had information, I had to go to Shell House.

MR PRETORIUS: Then just a complete - the objectors on whose behalf I appear would also testify that they did not form part of any attack on Shell House and that they did not carry any firearms with them on that specific day and that they were shot on by the ANC guards unjustifiably.
NO FURTHER QUESTIONS BY MR HUMAN

MS VAN HUYSTEEN: Mr Chairman just a few questions.  Mr Beea, up on the 18th floor in Shell House at the office where there's Mr Ntlhantlha's office or the boardroom, would you say that if shots were fired in the vicinity where you observed that group coming down de Villiers Street, would you say that you would have heard gunfire on the 18th floor if any shots were fired down there?

COLSON TEBOGO BEEA: Honourable Chair maybe let me start by saying that my surname is Beea and it's difficult, it is very difficult I'm not too sure if one would have heard gunfire.  Maybe if people shot while I was there I would have, but I don't know if I would have.

MS VAN HUYSTEEN: Now I want to take you down to when the actual attack took place, this so-called attack.  Can you tell me if there was not gunfire, would you have actually fired at this group charging, if there was no gunfire as you described?

COLSON TEBOGO BEEA: Honourable Chair there was already gunfire around Shell House in town and that did not warrant me to shoot and I'm saying that I shot because at that particular moment under those circumstances, given that psychological mind, I was under the impression and belief that the gunfire that I heard was different to the sporadic gunfire that I had heard in the preceding moment.  That one specifically I believed was directed at me and I shot.

MS VAN HUYSTEEN: Is it the gunfire combined with the charging forward of the people that made you fire?

COLSON TEBOGO BEEA: It's a combination but let me equally say that I do believe that had people charged with the so-called traditional weapons that they carried, charged at us, I want to believe that the possibility exists that I could have fired.

MS VAN HUYSTEEN: Why did you then not try it when there was a so-called mock attack that you mentioned in your evidence?

COLSON TEBOGO BEEA: Because it was a mock attack.

MS VAN HUYSTEEN: How do you know it was a mock attack?