Human Rights Violation Hearings — Welkom — 1996-10-09

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you.  You have also not had that.  But maybe you need the medical treatment both of you.  We have noted that, that you may be needing medical treatment both of you because of the trauma you have received after your son's death.  We thank you very much for coming to tell the painful story about the death of your son, still very young to have been killed in this way.  Give or love, our support and prayer to your wife and your whole family.  We shall be thinking about them.   Thank you.

WITNESS:   I also thank you.

CHAIRPERSON: /CHAIRMAN

CHAIRPERSON: Seipati Susan Moroane.
EXCHANGE OF GREETINGS BETWEEN CHAIRMAN AND WITNESS

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you for coming to tell us about - which is a pain in your heart, about the death in detention of one of your beloved ones.  Now, before you tell the story, you are supposed to take an oath that what you are going to say here is the truth and nothing else and God being your helper, you are going to do it.  Can you stand please and take the oath.

SEIPATI SUSAN MOROANE: (Sworn states) (Through Interpreter)

CHAIRPERSON: The person who's going to be leading you through the process is my colleague Mr Mdu Dlamini.  Now, I want to call upon him.

MR DLAMINI: I greet you, Mrs Moroane.

WITNESS:   I greet you, Sir.

MR DLAMINI: First, before you tell us your story, can I ask you tell us about your family?  Are you married?

WITNESS:  Yes, I'm married.  I'm staying in Theunissen, No 302.  I'm a resident there.  I got married there and I was also born there.

MR DLAMINI: Is your husband still alive?

WITNESS:   No, my husband has since died.

MR DLAMINI: How many children do you have?

WITNESS:   I have eight children.

MR DLAMINI: Can you give us their ages or at least the years on which they were born?

WITNESS:   My firstborn was born in 1953, my second-born was born in 1956.  In 1958 is the third-born.  1952 is my fourth-born.  I believe my fifth-born was born in 1962.  Okay, can I remind you, Mama?  You said the firstborn was born in 1953.  The second one 1956.  The third one 1958.  The fourth one, you said 1952, I suspect you intended 1962.  Am I right?   ---   Your right 1962.

MR DLAMINI: Okay the next one?

WITNESS:   The other one was born in 1958.

MR DLAMINI: Okay, can I assume that you mean 1968?

WITNESS:   That is correct, 1968.

MR DLAMINI: Thank you.  Then the next one?

WITNESS:   1970.

MR DLAMINI: Can you remember the next one?

WITNESS:   The other one was born in 1972.

MR DLAMINI: Do you remember the last one?

WITNESS:   He was born in 1972.

MR DLAMINI: Are there any school-going amongst them?

WITNESS:   They are all married.

MR DLAMINI: They're all married now.  No wonder you cannot remember their ages.

WITNESS:   Four died and I'm left with four.

MR DLAMINI: It's sad to hear that, Mama.  And your son Ramareiki, when was he born?

WITNESS:   Ramareiki was born in 1962.

MR DLAMINI: Thank you.  You are coming to tell us about the death in detention of your son Ramareiki.  Perhaps before you relate the story, can I ask one question?  Was he a member of any political organisation?

WITNESS:   Yes, he was but at the time that he got arrested he was taken after the political activity had actually subsided.

MR DLAMINI: When you say that the political activity had subsided, had there been any problems before that?

WITNESS:   /Yes,

MR DLAMINI: Yes, there were, but I've forgotten as to what was actually happening just before he got arrested.

MR DLAMINI: I see.  Would you please tell us what happened in 1986 and also mentioning the police officers who arrested him or who came home to fetch him?

WITNESS:   The came to my place.  It was a certain policeman by the name of Moatludi.

MR DLAMINI: Thank you.  Continue, Ma.

WITNESS:   It was only a day after he had been arrested and then on the second day, on the morning of the second day, I was told that my son had died.  He had hanged himself with his shoelaces and we wanted to go and enquire as to how he could and himself with his shoelaces.  And the person told us that he was no longer at the police station at that moment because we wanted to go and see him.  And this policeman who had come to inform us also informed us that we would not get my son at the police station in Theunissen because he had been taken to Bloemfontein.  And we were quite surprised at that type of behaviour as to why he was taken to Bloemfontein because he knew the family quite well.  Why couldn't he come and tell us that my son had died?  Why was he taken to Bloemfontein?  And he said we will know after he had been returned from Bloemfontein as to how he died.  We ran up and down to Bloemfontein trying to get my son's corpse.  Then he went away with a certain policeman to go and fetch the corpse in Bloemfontein and we were told to bury him but we never got his death certificate up till today.

MR DLAMINI: When he was transferred to Bloemfontein was it after his death as far as you know?

WITNESS:   Yes, it was after his death.  I think he was arrested today and the  following day he died and he was taken out of Theunissen after he had died.  But there was so much confusion we did not actually know what happened.  Which happened before, which was it?  Was he taken to Bloemfontein after or before death?

MR DLAMINI: Was there any inquest, that is the court inquiry, to find out what actually killed him?

WITNESS:   We made some effort to go to the charge office to try and enquire but nobody could help us.  Each time we got to the charge office, they would all go out of the charge office and we would be left all by ourselves in the charge office.

MR DLAMINI: Were you ever called in the Magistrate's Court at any stage?

WITNESS:   I was never called by the magistrate at any stage.  Nobody came to us to inform us as to what had happened.  We buried my son in the dark.

MR DLAMINI: According to your statement the police alleged that he was arrested, firstly, for having fought with somebody and then later they changed their story and claimed that he had been arrested for theft.  Were there any complainants?  Did they tell you the names of the people who had complained on these two occasions?

WITNESS:  There were no complainants because we believed that if the complainants came forward we would get the true story behind his death.  But the following day when we prepared ourselves to go and ask as to why he was arrested we were never told.  They just told us that he had died.

MR DLAMINI: Do you know whether a post mortem examination was conducted and which doctor conducted it?

WITNESS:   I don't know anything of that nature taking place. In your statement you mentioned a police officer Moloi as the one who came to tell you that your son had died.  Police Officer Moloi, is he still around?  Is he still at Theunissen?   ---   He's here in Welkom.

MR DLAMINI: He's now in Welkom?

WITNESS:   That is correct.

MR DLAMINI: Do you know the police station concerned here in Welkom?

WITNESS:   I'm not quite clear on this aspect but I know he's in Welkom.

MR DLAMINI: Ja, I'm sure it will be easy to find him.  And the officer who fetched him from his house, that is your son, Moatludi, do you know his whereabouts?

WITNESS:   He's in Theunissen.

MR DLAMINI: Have you seen him after the death of your son and has he said anything to you?

WITNESS:   He has never said anything to me but I've seen him several times.