Amnesty Hearings — Cape Town — 1998-09-08

NORMAN ARENDSE: Now is it correct that you carried out this particular attack?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: I do not want to say the attack was successfully carried out but I must say that there were people who were killed because the intention of the attack was to disarm those people.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Now you were accompanied during this attack by other persons, who were they?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: I was with Simon and Graham.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Do you know them by any other name?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: No.

NORMAN ARENDSE: When is the last time you saw either or both of them?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: After that I used to meet them and I last saw them in 1993 when I left Cape Town.

NORMAN ARENDSE: They're not here today, just for the record?  They're not here today?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: Yes, they are not here.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Where did you meet them?  I'm coming back to before the attack now, where did you meet them?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: They were Africans that I used to work with, that is Graham and another member.  We used to train under ...[inaudible]

NORMAN ARENDSE: Were they members of your unit or were they from some other unit or were they deployed to Cape Town to assist you?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: No, they were under my command.

NORMAN ARENDSE: In your unit?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: Yes.

NORMAN ARENDSE: When - you said earlier that you were, as commander of the unit you were responsible for identifying the targets, was this particular attack also as a result of your identification of the target?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: It is I who identified the target.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Now the target in this case were two policeman or what you thought were policemen, is that right?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: Yes.

NORMAN ARENDSE: And this particular incident happened not far from the Cross Roads police Station, is that correct?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: Correct.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Why did you think that the two person you attacked were policemen?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: You see policemen use a uniform and their uniform is different to other uniforms.  The general public do not wear uniforms.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Chairperson, just for the record, if the Committee peruses the police docket in this matter, it appears from the photographs in the docket that both the deceased were wearing blue coloured uniforms.
	Now these two policemen, they were not in a vehicle, they were walking, they were on foot, is that right?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: Yes, correct.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Where were they walking?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: In front of other some shacks, moving from the direction of the police station of Cross Roads.  When I saw them I said we must go between the shacks and Graham and Simon must be on the side of the police station with the intention to have someone giving me some firing cover, in order to prevent policemen who might appear later, from assassinating me.
	They came on as they were moving on foot and they were within reach of my fire.  When they were within reach I then shot at them with an AK47.  When they fell I said to Graham he must disarm them.  We gave Graham firing cover and when that happened a kombi appeared and it lit directly in our direction, that is where I said: "Let us withdraw", because I was avoiding a situation of us being identified.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Now ...[intervention]

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: ...[no English translation]  to avoid the people in the kombi identifying us because it had lit on us at the time.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Why did you shoot at these policemen, were they armed?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: You see a policeman in uniform, it becomes a very unusual thing that he walks around without his weapon whilst he is in uniform.  The uniform is also - you wear a uniform plus your firearm generally, that's what I know.

CHAIRPERSON: The question was, you told Graham to disarm them, did Graham disarm them?  Did he recover or get any arms from them?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: No, he could not get any weapons from them because when that happened a kombi appeared and then I said we must retreat.

NORMAN ARENDSE: So you don't know whether they were in fact armed or not?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: That is correct.  As I've said, to a policeman his uniform is together with his firearm and I saw that there were people coming from the police station in uniform, I thought they must be armed as they are on duty.  They were on duty at the time.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Now after the attack you, Graham was unable to search them and find out whether in fact they had arms, what did you do then?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: We returned to the house we used.  If I want to see somebody I would use that house as a shack(?) point.  That is where we returned to.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Where was this house?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: At Site C.

NORMAN ARENDSE: At Site C in Khayelitsha?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: Yes.

NORMAN ARENDSE: I'm not sure whether it's still the case, but at the time it was a squatter camp, is that right?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: It is still a shack place.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Now do you know what happened to these policemen or these two persons?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: You see, the following day I woke up the following morning and went to where this attack occurred and I looked around and I noticed that indeed two policemen were lying there and the public had gathered there and investigation officers were on the scene.  After that I reported the matter, the whole operation to Mzala.

NORMAN ARENDSE: What did you say to Mzala?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: I told him that two policemen had passed away in that operation and that that operation can be claimed under APLA, though the weapons and the ammunition used could not be retrieved from the policemen because we were disturbed by that kombi that lit on us.

ADV SANDI: Sorry Mr Arendse.
	That kombi, the kombi you're talking about, did it come and stop there at the scene where these police were shot?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: It was on the road.  The driver stopped the kombi and lit directly at the area where this whole operation was on.

ADV SANDI: Yes, but it came and passed?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: No, it did not pass, it stopped.

ADV SANDI: Thank you.

CHAIRPERSON: A bit strange isn't it?  This happened late at night, the kombi arrives, they see policemen shot, they do nothing about it, because the next morning you go there and the policemen are still lying there.  That is strange isn't it?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: Yes, it may surprise you, though I do not know why those people did not go and report this matter and why those policemen were still lying on the road even the following morning.  I would not know.

ADV SANDI: This shack Mr Tanda, you say you went back to, was some sort of a hide-out for you?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: Yes, it was a place I used.  Even before we go on operations, that is where we meet to discuss and then from there we move to whatever scene of operation.

ADV SANDI: How far was that shack from the place where the police had been shot?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: Site C is at Khayelitsha and the policemen were attacked at Cross Roads, next to the Cross Roads Police Station.

ADV SANDI: You mean to say that the - I want to be sure that I understand you clearly, you mean to say that the shack was far from the scene where the police had been shot?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: Yes, far.

DR TSOTSI: The place where the police fell, was that a public road?  The road where you shot the policemen, was that a public road or a private road?

WALTER FALIBONGA TANDA: Yes, it was a footpath but where you could use a car also because it was an open veld of sorts.

ADV SANDI: Did it have lights or was it dark in that area?