Special Hearings — Helderberg Flight Special Hearing — 1998-06-01

CHAIRPERSON: Mr Mitchell, welcome once again.  We have to apologise for having kept you for the best part of the day but as in any, and I'm sure you have been to inquries of this nature, sometimes time logistics is not always a manageable commodity.
 Without further ado, let me introduce the members of the panel.  Commissioner Glenda Wildschut is a Commissioner in the Rehabilitations and Reparations Committee.  I am a Commissioner in the Human Rights Violations Committee and Wilson Magadla to my right is head of Special Investigations in the Commission.  To our right we have the person who has been investigating this case, Chrystelle Terreblanche and with her is Doctor David Klatzow who is contracted to the Commission on a consulting basis.
 Evidence led here is of a confidential nature.  It is not for public consumption.  It is taken in camera, precisely because it is intended to be of an investigative nature.  It's an inquiry seeking to probe but we do it under oath in terms of the Act, so that the evidence that we take is evidence by any legal yardstick.  
 Whatever you say here you commit yourself to a version under oath and what is more, it is not the sort of evidence that is going to be used by us in the panel in order for us to arrive at any finding because it is not a trial, it is not a hearing, it is not a disciplinary inquiry, it's is an investigative probe which is why therefore, only people who are in the Commission and people who are contracted by the Commission and those who have come to depose to statements that they have or to lead evidence are permitted and are here.
 Before you testify I will ask Commissioner Wildschut to swear you in, which is what I'm asking her now to do.

GLENDA WILDSCHUT: Could you please state your full names for the record?

MICHAEL PETER MITCHELL: (sworn states)

CHAIRPERSON: Miss Terreblanche?

MS TERREBLANCHE: Thank you Mr Chair.  I think Doctor Klatzow is ready with some questions.

CHAIRPERSON: Doctor Klatzow?

DR KLATZOW: Captain Mitchell, you are a long time employed of the South African Airways, a senior member of the flight crews, flight staff, is that correct?

MICHAEL PETER MITCHELL: You just said Flite Star.

DR KLATZOW: Flight staff.

MICHAEL PETER MITCHELL: Oh, I'm not hearing this very well.

DR KLATZOW: Sorry.  You are a senior member of the flight crew at SAA, is that correct?

MICHAEL PETER MITCHELL: Yes, thank you, I can hear you now.

DR KLATZOW: And you were at the time, in charge of the operations room, that is the time of the Helderberg accident in 1988, you were the most senior flight operational man present in the operations room in charge of the disaster, is that correct?

MICHAEL PETER MITCHELL: Can you hear me?

DR KLATZOW: Yes.

MICHAEL PETER MITCHELL: Mr Chairman, Mr Commissioner, yes, I was.  I am retired now from the South African Airways.  I was a senior member of South African Airways staff.   At the time, and may I comment on your letter which you sent to me saying that I was Chief of Operations.  That's not ...[intervention]

DR KLATZOW: No, that's not what I've put to you.  Could we just go by the question because we've got limited time.

MICHAEL PETER MITCHELL: Okay.

DR KLATZOW: You were the man in charge of running that operation that night, from a flight crew point of view.  You weren't the Chief Executive Officer but as an operational man, a flying man, you were the most senior man there that night?

MICHAEL PETER MITCHELL: No, I wasn't.

DR KLATZOW: Who was the more senior flying man?

MICHAEL PETER MITCHELL: No, not, not flying, flying man yes, I was a flying man but not when you say, of the operations.

DR KLATZOW: Captain Mitchell, listen to the questions very carefully because we're going to save a lot of time.

MICHAEL PETER MITCHELL: Okay.

DR KLATZOW: I said you were not the Chief Executive Officer, you were not the most senior man there that night but on the flying side you were the most senior man?

MICHAEL PETER MITCHELL: That's correct.

DR KLATZOW: And there were various other people there that night who were there to do your bidding?

MICHAEL PETER MITCHELL: Yes.

DR KLATZOW: What time were you notified of the loss of the Helderberg or the potential loss?

MICHAEL PETER MITCHELL: I was at home in bed and I would guess around about 2 o'clock in the morning.

DR KLATZOW: And who phoned you?

MICHAEL PETER MITCHELL: Operations.

DR KLATZOW: Can you remember the name?

MICHAEL PETER MITCHELL: No.

DR KLATZOW: What did you do?

MICHAEL PETER MITCHELL: I got up ...[indistinct] I then phoned Viv Lewis because in actual fact I have pointed this out to you right now, I had been put in the post of Chief Director Flight Operations by 27 days when this accident happened and being new in the post my immediate reporting, Viv Lewis was the Director Flight Operations, he'd just gone into ...[indistinct] at the beginning of the month, so I phoned Viv immediately because I took over his seat at the beginning of the month.  So I phoned him immediately and said: "Viv, the aeroplane's crashed".

DR KLATZOW: The moment you were phoned?

MICHAEL PETER MITCHELL: Oh immediately.

DR KLATZOW: Right.  And your words if you remember correctly were: "The aeroplane's crashed"?

MICHAEL PETER MITCHELL: That and: "the aircraft has crashed", words to that effect, I can't remember ...[intervention]

DR KLATZOW: But did the word: "crash" come into it?

MICHAEL PETER MITCHELL: I can't remember doctor.

DR KLATZOW: Well it's likely that if those are the words you used now, that they were the words you used then because foremost in your mind was the aircraft was in the ocean?

MICHAEL PETER MITCHELL: We didn't know that at the time, we had to sit down and work out.  The very fact that I got a report from Operations saying that the aircraft is missing ...[intervention]

DR KLATZOW: Captain Mitchell, listen to the question very carefully.

MICHAEL PETER MITCHELL: Okay.

DR KLATZOW: You were phoned just after 2 o'clock?

MICHAEL PETER MITCHELL: About, yes.

DR KLATZOW: You immediately picked up the phone and phoned Viv Lewis?

MICHAEL PETER MITCHELL: Correct.

DR KLATZOW: And you said to him: "We've lost an aircraft" or words to the effect that the aircraft had crashed?

MICHAEL PETER MITCHELL: Words to that effect.

DR KLATZOW: That's what I wanted to know.

MICHAEL PETER MITCHELL: Okay.

DR KLATZOW: Now what did you then do?

MICHAEL PETER MITCHELL: I then got up and I got in my car and went to the airport.

DR KLATZOW: And you went to the operations control?

MICHAEL PETER MITCHELL: Well that's on the 5th floor, yes.

DR KLATZOW: Is there a ...[intervention]

MICHAEL PETER MITCHELL: It's called: "Ops".

DR KLATZOW: Sorry?

MICHAEL PETER MITCHELL: That's "Ops".

DR KLATZOW: Correct.  Is there a standard way of dealing with this situation in airlines in flying circles?

MICHAEL PETER MITCHELL: Are you talking today or then?

DR KLATZOW: Then

DR KLATZOW: Just can I finish my line of questioning, and if there's anything which I have not traversed, you are most welcome to cover it, but please, there will be plenty of time for you to make whatever submissions you want to make.  Are you aware that there is a lost tape?  Whether it contained anything or not is not part of the question, are you aware that a tape went missing?

MICHAEL PETER MITCHELL: I feel very strongly about a discussion on something that possibly didn't happen.

DR KLATZOW: So are you... (intervention).

CHAIRPERSON: No, no, no, I don't think that's the inquiry.  I'm indebted to you for everything that you have said about the recent trip.

MICHAEL PETER MITCHELL: Yes sir.