Human Rights Violation Hearings — Bisho — 1996-09-10

WITNESS:  Yes I can hear you.

MAPULE RAMASHALA:  Yesterday we heard detailed discussion on the incident surrounding the Bisho massacre and some of the witnesses described the incident from their perspective.  What I would like you to do today is describe the incident from your perspective, specifically with respect to the death of your son Tobile Kali.  How old was Tobile?

WITNESS:  Tobile was 26 years old at the time.

MAPULE RAMASHALA:  Could you then proceed Ms Kali and describe the death of your son in the context of the incident, from your perspective as briefly as you possibly can.

WITNESS:  I saw late that evening at approximately 6 o'clock while watching TV at the time, he was, a marshal was holding him, he was wearing a khaki shirt and a khaki jacket and holding onto his waist and looking up and that was the time that he was dying.

MAPULE RAMASHALA:  You saw your son in that condition on TV?

WITNESS:  I saw him on TV in that situation.

MAPULE RAMASHALA:  Proceed with your story.

WITNESS:  So much at that time I couldn't even talk after that because I was sitting at home with my husband who was alive at the time and while sitting there, my younger brother came to my place to ask me if I heard that the child had been injured in Bisho, and I said to him yes I saw this on TV but I don't know what I can do about it because my husband then already, was like someone that had suffered a stroke on the one side and his right arm and his mouth was all twisted and I didn't know what to do and he went, the following morning my brother and my cousin went to look for him and they found him in Cambridge.  I'm not sure if it's Cambridge but somewhere near East London, the mortuary there.  He was found there and they came back and told me that they had found him.

MAPULE RAMASHALA:  According to the information you got, your son was shot to death just when he was about to reach the Bisho stadium, is that correct?

WITNESS:  Yes he was shot when he came close to the stadium, when he was right near the stadium.

MAPULE RAMASHALA:  What was your son doing at the time, was he working, was he in school?

WITNESS:  He wasn't studying, he was in this group that had come back from Durban.  When they came back from Durban they had been retrenched from their jobs.

MAPULE RAMASHALA:  Ms Kali could you talk about the effect of this on your family, particularly to the two children, he has two children, is that correct?

WITNESS:  Yes that is so.

MAPULE RAMASHALA:  Could you talk about the effect of your son's death on your family.

WITNESS:  My son's death caused me to regain my consciousness at the clinic and the following morning my husband had to be taken to the hospital because he couldn't even hear what was being said, he was just somebody that would sit next to the kraal not knowing where to go, he would just be sitting there and they had to take him to hospital.  So much so that in 1993 on the 8th July he passed away.

MAPULE RAMASHALA:  Proceed Ms Kali.

WITNESS:  I am someone that suffers from blood pressure because this child was my firstborn and he used to help me at home, so much so that I used to always say that this was the child that would take care of me because his name suited him so well, Tobile, he used to take care of me at home, so much so that now I've battled so much since 1992 and 1993, not knowing what to do.  That is how badly I suffered, and I went to social workers to ask for assistance as far as the children were concerned, and the three children were assisted by them and on the 17 September 1993 and the whole year went by and I had to get their birth certificates.  I got copies of the birth certificates and submitted them in February.  I don't know what the date was but it was in 1994 and the whole year went by, so much so that my daughter who comes after Tobile, Nunuvuo, I asked her to go and work because she was working for a doctor who was near the bakery, used to work near the bakery.  Not the one that's there now, the one that was there previously.  She had to leave school because I was battling so much because I used to work for two days a week and her aunt from Port Alfred said that if she worked, she wouldn't want to go back to school again.  She should go and stay with her so that she could go back to school.  It was even difficult for Tamsal Kali to go to school and I had to ask him to become a gardener at people's homes just so that we could have something on the table at night.  He couldn't proceed with his schooling.  Nunuvuo continued her schooling education and she is in standard nine now and Nomilikaya who comes after her and Nomilikaya is in standard three.  The younger ones, the one is in sub A and the other in sub B.

MAPULE RAMASHALA:  In your statement you say that you have no source of income whatsoever but you have to take care of all of these children, is that correct?

WITNESS:  Yes that is correct, I even [indistinct] because I am battling so much now, I don't have a cent to even send to the one in Port Alfred.

MAPULE RAMASHALA:  Ms Kali was there a case through which you might have received some financial settlement?

WITNESS:  The money that I know about when my husband was still alive is only R600.  I never even saw any other money.

MAPULE RAMASHALA:  Have you tried to apply for a pension?

WITNESS:  No I never tried.

MAPULE RAMASHALA:  Ms Kali is there anything else that you would like to bring to the attention of the Commission?

WITNESS:  There is nothing else now but what I would like to ask the Commission is if it is possible that it should help me with my children and my grandchildren.

MAPULE RAMASHALA:  These are the two children you are talking about is it, your son's, your grandchildren?

WITNESS:  Yes and I even battle with my own children because sometimes the money which I received in 1995 I received in March and by May or June, July or September I was told that it was finished, that I would have to re-apply and that I never got anything in January and I never got anything in March and I never got anything in May and I only got it in July.

MAPULE RAMASHALA: Ms Kali thank you very much and over to you Chairperson.  Thank you.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you.

TRUTH AND RECONCILIATION COMMISSION: BISHO MASSACRE - DAY 2 - 10 SEPTEMBER 1996

CASE NO: 12

UNKNOWN: BUSISIWE VERONICA GWAYI [sister]

REV XUNDU: Veronica Gwayi is our next witness, Mr Chairperson.
BUSISIWE VERONICA GWAYI   Duly sworn states

REV XUNDU: Are you Busisiwe?  I don't want to make a mistake again.  In your statement you say that Thembinkosi Harold was your brother, is that correct?

WITNESS:  Yes.

REV XUNDU:  How exactly are you related?

WITNESS:  He is my uncle's son.  My uncle passed away and Thembinkosi and them had to be raised by my mother while they were still young.

REV XUNDU:  So he was raised by your mother and that is where he grew up and he was educated.

WITNESS:  Yes.

REV XUNDU:  On this day in September 1992 Thembinkosi, was he working at the time?

WITNESS:  In 1992 he was still at school.

REV XUNDU:  Was he sent there by Mosas or was it still school education?

WITNESS:  My mother had sent him so that he could get done with his education.

REV XUNDU:  In your statement you say that he was working at Mossgas.  Had he stopped working at Mossgas at the time or was he on leave?

WITNESS:  He had already been appointed at Mossgas and my mother had said to him that he should go and finish his education at Zweletemba.

REV XUNDU:  On this day of the 7th he also went, like so many other people, to Bisho stadium.  He was part of the march on that day, is that so?

WITNESS:  Yes.

REV XUNDU:  How did you hear that he was one of the people that were injured and had been shot and killed?