Amnesty Hearings — Johannesburg — 1998-10-13

SOLOMON MOLOI: We had a tiff with the applicant during the year 1980 or the early 1980's, I am not sure as to which year was it, but during the early 1980's, we had a squabble.  As a person that I knew who grew up in the same area where I lived, when the strikes started, the applicant was burning people using different instruments, even plastics, to burn people.
	On this particular day, when I was coming back from work, he was at a gate at number 299.  I greeted him.  He also greeted me and I asked him to explain to me as to why he engaged in these activities of burning people.  That is how the tiff arose.
	He even threatened me that he was also going to burn me, because that was none of my business that he was burning people.  I actually wanted to advise him and admonish him as he was younger than me.  That is when the squabble started, then he started threatening me.  I assaulted him.  He told me that he is a member of the ANC, he is an askari.
	They were able to separate us.  Then during 1990 I bought a house in Palm Springs, that is where I went to stay and I did not expect this to happen.

ADV STEENKAMP: Sorry to interrupt you, if you can maybe just go to the day of the incident.  Why are you feeling that the testimony of the applicant as far as you are concerned, he is not making a full disclosure?  If you can, go to the day of the incident, thank you.

SOLOMON MOLOI: On this particular day, I had visited house number 299.  At about two or three o'clock during the day, I knocked off at work, from work at one o'clock and proceeded to my place.  My place is not far from my in-law's place.  I took my wife with from my in-law's place to my place.
	Then when we were going back to my place at 299B, we were accosted by the applicant.  He had a gun in his possession, as well as a hand grenade.
	I don't know whether it was only one hand grenade or more than that.  Bongani said to me, yes, do you still remember me?  I said but you grew up under me and you are young, how can you address me in this manner.  He said to me do you still remember what you did to me when you assaulted me?
	To me it came as a surprise that he could say that, because I thought that the past had all belonged to the past.  Then he threatened me with the hand grenade and we were still in the street at that time.  I was with my wife at that time.  I said if you are going to injure me with the hand grenade, then you should do that whilst I am still outside, then my wife said, just leave this young man, let's go into the yard, and forget about him.
	We went into the yard and it was at about three o'clock.  As I was sitting there, I was quite perturbed and thinking about this young man who had threatened and accosted me.  I had seen earlier that he had a gun and also a hand grenade.
	I advised my wife that we should phone the police.  At that stage I phoned the police.  They took quite some time before they arrived, but they ultimately did.  I explained to them as to what had happened, that he had threatened me with regard to the past incident.  He even said to me I was an informer, I was a police informer and that particular day he was just going to kill me, he was going to use the hand grenade to kill me.
	The police promised to patrol the area or the house, but this policeman knew this young man, the applicant, he even referred to him by his nickname Gundwani, which means mouse.  This policeman pointed out that Gundwani was a very dangerous man, and they needed to patrol the area of the house since I had been threatened with death.
	I said to the police they should stay with me because I was also scared, but they refused and said that they were going to patrol.  At about seven o'clock, we heard some kids knocking at the door.  My wife's sister responded, she opened the door and my grandmother was in the kitchen, as well as James.  The children said they had been sent by Bongani, that is the applicant.
	He had said to them that there was a police dog that he wanted to kill that particular day and he wanted the people to switch off the lights.  I was at the dining room at that time.
	I said they should go and tell Bongani that we are not going to switch off any lights.  They left.  I think they went to tell him our response to his request or his demand.
	After about three to five minutes, the applicant himself came because he was quite a dangerous man in that area, he came personally and as I peeped through the door, I could see that he had gotten into the kitchen now and my wife as well as her sister were in the kitchen at that time.  I was in the dining room.
	My brother-in-law, Mr Mazibuko, that is Joseph, was next to the stove in the kitchen, just sitting and lazing around there.  That is when I saw the gun that he had as well as the hand grenade.
	We decided to try and prevent him from attacking us.  I pounced on him, we were fighting for the hand grenade as well as the gun.  We struggled for the gun and the hand grenade.  That is when I opened the drawer, I came across a fork.  I thought I would get something better in order to be able to cut his hand.
	I used the fork in order to try and make him or force him to release the hand grenade that was in his possession.  Whilst I was still struggling and grappling with him, my other brother-in-law James, because he was now scared and this one was screaming, the applicant was screaming that the pin of the hand grenade had been released and now we were in danger.
	I said that is fine, if the two of us were going to die, I was going to die fighting him.  I was going to fight him to the bitter end.  James got scared by the fact that the pin of the hand grenade or the safety pin had been released.  That is when James opened the door.  The one who died, was the one who was sitting next or just behind the door.
	When James opened the door, the other gang that was with the applicant was able to gain entry.  As he went out, that is the applicant, he threw this hand grenade inside, because the gun had fallen, it slid right under the table inside the house.
	When this gun slid, I dived for the gun trying to run after him.  That is when he threw the hand grenade and that is when my brother-in-law fell onto the ground.  When I got into the street and tried to shoot them with their own gun, or with his own gun, I found that the gun was not functioning.  I don't know whether it did not have bullets in it or it was dysfunctional.
	All the testimony that he has rendered here, is just blue lies.  He is not telling the truth, that was very much intentional.
	My other sister-in-law that is Sophia Mazibuko, was also injured and she got mentally disturbed after the incident.  She also got injured and mentally disturbed from that time till now, now I have to maintain her children.  The applicant is coming to seek amnesty whereas there isn't a single scrap of truth that he has spoken before the Committee.

ADV STEENKAMP: Just indicate to us, how were you injured and what type of injuries did you sustain?

SOLOMON MOLOI: I was quite lucky to escape without any serious injury, except for minor scratches on my forehead.

ADV STEENKAMP: Thank you Mr Chairman, that will be the testimony of Mr Moloi.
NO FURTHER QUESTIONS BY ADV STEENKAMP

CHAIRPERSON: Mr Moloi, when the applicant came to the house, did you hear what he wanted there?

SOLOMON MOLOI: He never told me, but I heard from the boys that he had sent before, that he wanted us to switch off the lights because he wanted to kill a certain dog.  Then I thought I am the dog that he was supposed to kill because earlier on he had actually threatened that he was going to kill me.
	I thought he had come to do just that.

CHAIRPERSON: But he, to your knowledge, he didn't come to the house specifically looking for you?

SOLOMON MOLOI: According to my knowledge, he had come to look for me specifically.