Amnesty Hearings — Nelspruit — 1999-02-04

MR O'FARRELL: I by all means deny or wish to deny any forms of amnesty.   My opinion of this Truth Commission is where the entire truth should be told in order to reconcile the nation.   However, I have noticed since day one, with the applicant, Mr Sambo, that both with the inquest, with the criminal hearings, and even today, everything he says, I must quote one of His Honourable Judge Curlewis's statements, where he states
"It's a viagra of nonsense",
which I totally agree with.   He by no means even touches on the proper truth of this matter, I don't know where he got these stories from, each time he seems to attempt to - when he's asked a question, he then tries to swing the answer so as to into his favour, which he also then tried with the court hearing.   He also stated that he speaks only partial English, as he stated in the court hearing, where he said he only spoke partial Afri..., where he didn't speak Afrikaans at all.    However, as noted through this entire day, he is asked several questions in English, but before the interpreter can start, he's already answered it back in Swazi.   So I feel that is also just a blatant lie and just an extra part of his character.    That is basically that.  And I believe that the fact that Warrant Officer Van der Spuy was disarmed and then shot in cold blood, and his fact that he reckons we're assassins is a blatant lie, I was a 20 year old constable, and Warrant Officer Van der Spuy a 32 year old man with a four year old daughter and a wife.   His daughter's last words to us before we left that morning were "Totsiens Papa" and she was crying on the front stoep of that house, and for that reason I will never forgive the accused.   He has put me through absolute hell, I've undergone over 18 months of psychiatric help, I've both been into a psychiatric clinic for evaluation, because of suffering from post traumatic stress syndrome, and by all means, if I was indeed an assassin, I promise you I would not be suffering from either of these.   That is all, madam.

MS THABETE: Thank you, Mr O'Farrell.
NO FURTHER QUESTIONS BY MS THABETE

MR BLACK: At the outset, Mr O'Farrell, at no stage have you been accused of being an assassin, let's get that straight.   It was a perception and the belief of the applicant at the time, given the absolute hell that he had gone through by security police and policemen that he perceived you to be there to kill him, for the purposes, especially after the army had sweeped the place, checked the cars, ensured that there were no arms, and then you arrive.   Insofar as - I don't propose dealing in detail with your evidence about the incident itself, the applicant has already testified, and where your evidence differs from his, those differences have been put to him by the leader of evidence and the applicant has already denied them, so I don't propose to repeat denying them.   So... (intervention).

CHAIRPERSON: You have no questions to put therefore to Mr O'Farrell?

MR BLACK: No, I do, with respect.   Now... (intervention).

CHAIRPERSON: Proceed to do so, Mr Black.

MR BLACK: Yes, I just wanted to explain to Mr O'Farrell.   Now, Mr O'Farrell, the time, when were you instructed by Mr Ndbane to go, or was Mr Van der Spuy instructed or you were instructed to go to Block B?

MR O'FARRELL: Sir, we must have been instructed approximately, it must be an hour and a half, two hours, prior to the incident.

MR BLACK: Now I know that, just to get the police language right, if a vehicle unit, department, or whoever it is, is given say a list of five registration numbers and is asked to check and see if those five registration numbers belong to stolen vehicles, and if the report then given in Afrikaans, I just want you to explain it, not in Afrikaans, but if the report is received in the Afrikaans language, that as a consequence of the search done in respect of those registration numbers, the result is "negatief", does that mean therefore that those vehicles which were researched are not stolen vehicles?

MR O'FARRELL: Sir the investigation of ve..., okay in that aspect, the pronunciation "negatief", as you state, is indeed the fact that the licence plate tests negative.   However, the inspection of - our job entails the inspection of engine chassis, you name it, we do it on the car, and that means that, as you must know, 90% of stolen vehicles all recovered, all have false licence plates on them, which most of them the engine and chassis numbers have also been changed.   That's why we are a specialised unit in that area, in which we specialise.

MR BLACK: Did you or Mr Van der Spuy ever receive any reports from the Vehicle Unit pertaining to certain vehicles which you had to go and - when I say reports, reports back from the Motor Vehicle Unit relating to the vehicles which you had to investigate or whatever?

MR O'FARRELL: No sir, as already stated, the report we received was that of, to inspect the Mazda 626.   However, as already stated, also on the premises in that certain area where those vehicles were found, it's not, we created the reasonable suspicion that these vehicles intended inspection.

MR BLACK: Well, what was attached to an affidavit, a supplementary affidavit, filed by the applicant, is an Annexure C, which is an affidavit of Anton Carel Nel, who sets out the steps which he took in order to instruct the Vehicle Unit to investigate five registration vehicles, that's the registration numbers.   He then deals further, how he spoke to Sergeant Ndbane from the early morning, unfortunately it's not paginated, but it's one of the annexures which was handed up this morning, who was researching these vehicles by way of the computer from about eight o'clock, it was a Captain Kaggelhoffer who spoke.   That affidavit goes on to state how they were contacted and how eventually you came into the picture, but paragraph 8 of that affidavit says
"Kaptein Kaggelhoffer het my toe versoek om weer die Voertuig Diefstal Eenheid te Komatipoort te skakel en hulle te versoek om iemand na Blok B, Tonka, te stuur."
But then it says there:-
"Kort tevore het sersant Ndbane van die Voertuig Diefstal Afdeling te Komatipoort my teruggeskakel en my meegedeel dat die gegewe registrasienommers negatief was."
Now would that mean that Ndbane phoned, after doing some research on the computer, phoned Captain - I don't know his rank, but Mr Nel, to inform him that, according to the computer records, these vehicles appear not to have been stolen?

MR O'FARRELL: Yes, as I already stated, these vehicles may have tested negative via their registration numbers, but as I already stated, vehicles are stolen, numberplates are changed and so are engine and chassis numbers.   The army has no competence in either the inspection of such engine or chassis numbers, and are not trained in such areas, whereas we are, that's why they call us Spes Units.

MR BLACK: Now it's quite clear from your evidence that you did not know exactly where you had to go to, the address - just hold on - because you were going to meet members of the army there who were going to take you to that address?

MR O'FARRELL: We were told by Inspector Ndbane that the army personnel would be waiting at the scene, at the premises for us.

MR BLACK: But then it appears, from the affidavits of Nel and the reports of Ndbane, that they were not there?

MR O'FARRELL: That is correct, sir.

MR BLACK: Yes, but they were supposed to take you to this house and to the address, not so?   They were supposed to take you to the particular address?

MR O'FARRELL: We were supposed to be met there, that's what his evidence is.

MR BLACK: You were to meet - you did not know the address where the vehicles were, is that correct?

MR O'FARRELL: That is correct, sir.

MR BLACK: You were then told by Ndbane that you would meet the army at Tonga B, or Block B, or whatever it is, who would then take you or guide you to where the address is?