Human Rights Violation Hearings — Soweto — 1996-07-25

HENRY ISAACS: I work as a management consultant right now. Initially my principal prime base was non-governmental organisations and community-based organisations. I also do work for mainly Canadian and American companies who either
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invest in this country or seek to invest in the Southern African region.

YASMINE SOOKA: Thank you. I don't have any further questions.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you.  I just have one or two comments.  You mention in your statement that because you were married to an American citizen, people suspected you to be a spy.  Did you inform your ex-wife that you would be coming here to give your testimony so that maybe she could be part of the healing process as well?

HENRY ISAACS: No, that is because the relationship is non-existent, communication is in fact extremely bad.  No, I didn't say that they suspected that I was a spy. After the fall-out, after my resignation in 1982, because I was married to an American citizen, they then made allegations that I was - they would say oh, Isaacs is CIA, that kind of thing.  But then, like I said, such smears were also the stock in trade of exile politics.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you.  Just a related comment. You mention something very, very important. You said there will be a need for reconciliation, even within the community of the oppressed themselves.  Can you make some, can you give us your perspective on that, because partly the aim of the Act that guides us is to promote national reconciliation.

HENRY ISAACS: Well, my suggestion is based on my experiences in Zimbabwe and my observations in Namibia.  These two countries are also countries that gained independence after years of struggle and were ultimately under the leadership of political organisations that were previous liberation movements.  But because of the nature of the political settlements they were forced to pursue policies of national reconciliation, but on closer examination, the policies of
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national reconciliation meant essentially that those liberation movements were pressurised to forgive the former oppressors, and in the case of Zimbabwe, for instance, while Ian Smith lived happily and peacefully, the same could not be said of the people in Matebeleland, where the civil war had seriously traumatised the people of Matebeleland, and it is only now that the atrocities and human rights violations that took place there in the period between 1983 and 1986 are being addressed in a serious fashion.
 Similarly in the case of Namibia.  Shortly before the elections in 1989, allegations were made against Swapo of very serious violations of human rights in their camps in Angola.  It is only now that there is a serious attempt to address those particular grievances and there were recent calls for the establishment of a truth and reconciliation commission in Namibia, akin to the one that has been established here.  
 When one looks at our own experiences, while there has been a readiness and a preparedness to forgive, even those who murdered anti-apartheid activists, I have seen very little willingness to forgive and forget amongst individuals in organisations where there have been political or ideological differences.  Similarly, there hasn't been a readiness and a willingness to have the same kind of reconciliation amongst different political organisations. It is this kind of unwillingness to seriously reconcile on the part of the oppressed, that exposes us to the kind of manipulation by the Third Force that makes possible the violence that has so ravished communities in this part of the country as well as KwaZulu/Natal.
 So what I am saying is that inasmuch as there is a need SOWETO HEARING TRC/GAUTENG
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to emphasise reconciliation, I think that those of us or those who are in positions of leadership need to set the example for genuine reconciliation amongst those who were formerly oppressed. I think that this start could be made at the level of political leadership, so that the followers can see that there is a genuine attempt to reconcile political differences with a view to establishing a culture that tolerates differences. 
 When one looks at the former oppressed communities in this country, it is not uncommon to find that two individuals who belong to two different political organisations, do not even speak to each other.  They have so personalised their political differences, that it makes personal friendships or communications difficult.  
 In the United States, for instance, you may find a Democrat and a Republican slogging it out on the floors of Congress and in the Senate, and they would walk out and share a dinner or a meal together.  The political differences do not necessarily stand in the way of personal communication and friendship.
 This is what I am saying, there is a need for those of us who were previously oppressed and who were involved in the liberation struggle, to begin to live out.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very much. I will ask Glenda Wildschut to thank you.

GLENDA WILDSCHUT: Thank you very much for coming before the Commission today.  The insights that you have given us indeed help us to be aware and to recognise some of the very important tasks that lie before us as a nation and as individuals to move towards reconciliation.  You have made reference in general to the vindication of victims, the
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vindication of people who have been given titles and labels and given - stripped of their status within communities.  We need to think of ways in which people's dignity in that respect can be restored.
 You have also shared some of your own insights with us about how we can strengthen civil society so that we ensure that human rights abuses do not take place again. In particular, you have referred to the issue of governance at institutions and universities and you have also made reference to strengthening institutions like the judiciary, that we can ensure that we have a strong legal system, for example, that could address some of these human rights violations.
 I think that it is important that we hear your plea about people whose careers who have been truncated, people who could have been leaders in this country and whom we could have benefited from their wisdom and from their - ja, from their wisdom, and that now we are suffering that loss and that in fact we do not have the leaders that we could have had had these human rights violations not taken place and people have not died.  Thank you very much for coming before us.

HENRY ISAACS: Thankyou.
(APPLAUSE)
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