Amnesty Hearings — Pretoria — 1997-02-26

UNKNOWN: transporting defence force staff. The attack was approximately 150m from a Swaziland Defence Force base 
and we could not hang around there for too long, so the house was not searched thoroughly. 
	After the operation we went back to Oshoek and crossed the border near the border post back into 
the Republic. Thereafter I contacted Brigadier Schoon and informed him that we had killed two persons. 
	The following morning De Kok and I drove to Pretoria where I handed the documents which we 
had seized to General Steenkamp. Before I left I had arranged that Geoff Besigu be treated in the Ermelo 
Hospital. Thereafter I was merited with an award for outstanding service and also De Kok, Van Dyk, 
Pienaar and Rohrig. Geoff Besigu and Nofamela were both promoted to the ranks of sergeant as well as Joe 
Mamasela. 	Mamasela played a big role in the preliminary investigation into Nyanda but he was not 
there that night and for this reason he was also promoted. The medals which were awarded to me were 
handed over by the ex-Minister of police,  Louis LeGrange. 
	When I entered the room where McFadden, the man whom I had shot, and I hadn't known at that 
stage, I had no choice but to shoot at him. I did not know whether he was armed or not and whether he 
would have shot me or not. The normal reaction in such a case is to shoot. We expected that everyone 
should have been armed, everyone inside the house, and where such an attack was launched, there was no 
time to ask the person whether or not they were armed first. I assumed that he was a member of the ANC - 
that he assisted Nyanda and that he would probably have been armed. 
	This operation has to be seen in the light of the 
PRETORIA HEARING	AMNESTY/

ADV DU PLESSIS: 203

UNKNOWN: unrest on the side of the Liberation Movements on the one side and the South African Government on the 
other. There were many acts of terrorism at that time in Natal which increased from month to month.  
Many of the attacks came from Swaziland and were planned by Nyanda.   Nyanda, as far as I can 
remember, was responsible for the death of several civilians in Natal at that stage, through his planning of 
acts of terrorism. It was done in agreement with the government's revolutionary strategy to suppress the 
liberation movements and to prevent the Republic of South Africa from being destabilised any further.

ADV DU PLESSIS: Very well, Brigadier. When you saw McFadden could you see whether he was armed 
or not?

UNKNOWN: As I said he was wrapped in a blanket and I could not see what was in his hands under 
the blanket.

ADV DU PLESSIS: Did you foresee that he could have been armed?

UNKNOWN: I expected that he would have been armed.

ADV DU PLESSIS: Was there any time for you to determine whether he was armed and if he was?

UNKNOWN: No, not at all.

ADV DU PLESSIS: Do you know today whether he was armed or not?

UNKNOWN: I do not know if he was armed, as I said, there were weapons found in the house, but 
there was no time to search the property.

ADV DU PLESSIS: Was there a woman in the house?

UNKNOWN: Yes, there was a woman there, but it was our policy, so that where possible we did not 
wage war against women and children, or at least I should say innocent women and children.
PRETORIA HEARING	AMNESTY/

ADV DU PLESSIS: 204

JUDGE WILSON: Brigadier, you used the word "innocent" there, she was an innocent woman was she, 
although she was in the same house and the same room as McFadden?

UNKNOWN: I didn't know her at all, Mr Chairman and I had to assume that she was innocent at the 
time because I had never heard of her before.

ADV DU PLESSIS: Where was she Brigadier?

UNKNOWN: She was hiding in a wardrobe.

ADV DU PLESSIS: Did you know about McFadden before the time?

UNKNOWN: We did not know about McFadden.  We knew that there was another man with the name 
by "Cecil" who we knew was a trained terrorist, was also in the house, but Cecil is the one who jumped out 
of the window.

ADV DU PLESSIS: Did you expect when you entered the house that there should be more than one 
armed man in the house?

UNKNOWN: I knew that there would be at least two.

ADV DU PLESSIS: You expected there to have been at least two?

UNKNOWN: That is correct.

ADV DU PLESSIS: At the stage you shot at McFadden how many men did you see in the house?

UNKNOWN: There were only two. I would just like to mention that I, myself did not see Cecil 
jumping out of the window because at that time I was at the kitchen door.

ADV DU PLESSIS: When you shot at McFadden you were aware of two males and the woman, where 
was she?

UNKNOWN: She was in the wardrobe.

ADV DU PLESSIS: In the room where McFadden was shot, was she armed?

UNKNOWN: No.
PRETORIA HEARING	AMNESTY/

ADV DU PLESSIS: 205

ADV DU PLESSIS: When you shot at McFadden, did you think that he was the other male whom you had 
information about?

UNKNOWN: Yes, I was under that impression.

ADV DU PLESSIS: Now, Brigadier could we go to Page 58 where reference is made to the political 
objective and the general justification which we have had from all the applicants is contained in this, 
namely intimidation and protection of information and combatting acts of terrorism. Do you confirm the 
information from page 58 to page 62?  That is the justification.

UNKNOWN: Yes, I confirm it as such.

ADV DU PLESSIS: Could you go to page 63 or rather page 62. Could you just read from the bottom 
paragraph to the Committee.

UNKNOWN: "All the above lead to the fact that the National Party remained in power and that 
communism was combatted successfully. These actions, the objective of these 
actions was to combat the ANC and other strong liberation movements who 
were waging a revolutionary battle against the government and to destabilise 
them. The objective was so that Nyanda, who a trained terrorist and who was 
the head of the ANC operations in Swaziland, and who had been the cause of 
several acts of terrorism in Natal, be eliminated.  McFadden was shot in the 
course of this operation.  The context in which this act took place was part of 
the Republic of South Africa's battle against the liberation movements who 
were responsible at the time for political unrest
PRETORIA HEARING	AMNESTY/

ADV DU PLESSIS: 205

UNKNOWN: and unrest throughout the country and in order to destabilise the government".

ADV DU PLESSIS: Brigadier could you please just read the last paragraph on Page 63.

UNKNOWN: "The objective of the deed was directed at the ANC which was a liberation movement 
which wanted to overthrow the government of the day".

ADV DU PLESSIS: Brigadier you say on page 64 that your direct command came from Brigadier Schoon 
and General Steenkamp, is that correct?

UNKNOWN: That is correct Chairperson.

ADV DU PLESSIS: Do you confirm the rest is merely a repetition of evidence? Do you confirm the 
contents of page 64?

UNKNOWN: Yes, I do.

ADV DU PLESSIS: Could you go to page 65. Did you receive any financial reward?

UNKNOWN: No. Not at all.

ADV DU PLESSIS: You merely received a medal?

UNKNOWN: That is correct.

ADV DU PLESSIS: Who awarded you with this medal?

UNKNOWN: Ex-Minister Louis LeGrange, he was the Minister of Police at the time.

MOKOTEDI MPSHE: Mr Chairman may I, before I proceed in cross-examination, respond to the Committee 
members question about serving notice, Mr Chairman, right now that in this matter all parties implicated 
have been served except General Steenkamp and Geoffrey Besigu.  And why they were not served is I did 
not have the particulars where to contact them. I 
PRETORIA HEARING	AMNESTY/

GAUTENG: 206

UNKNOWN: have just perused the document that was given to this Committee on Monday by Advocate Visser. I have 
noted there is a Steenkamp on their list but I don't know whether it is this Steenkamp mentioned herein Mr 
Chairman,  but all parties have been served and I have got returns of service. Thank you.