Human Rights Violation Hearings — Bisho — 1996-09-10

WITNESS:  I was shot right outside the stadium but not having reached the front as I had intended to, I just saw people dispersing and running away and teargas was being administered and that was an instruction that we should lie on our stomach and I was lying there in the stadium.  I'm not certain whether it was a hand grenade or a bomb but there was a very loud sound I heard just nearby so I jumped up and ran away.  Then I was hit on my leg with a bullet and I could not run further.  Then there was a car there in the stadium so I crawled and got into this car to hide but as I was still crawling I was shot on my arm and then I hid under the car.  I was there for about 20 to 30 minutes and there were bullet shots, it was, I couldn't see properly because of the teargas smoke.  I was there and I was joined by many others.  After a long time I then heard, I was also feeling dizzy at the time and feeling very weak.  I couldn't even stand.  Then some comrades took me into a van that had taken all day injured people.  Whilst I was there we were taking more people, even the dead bodies and I was still very dizzy and I could hear that there were some who had died and I just couldn't believe it and I wanted to indicate that I was still alive so I decided to come out of the bodies that were on top of me to show that I was still very much alive.  So we were taken in this van to Frere hospital, to Gray hospital and we were told that the Ciskei police had been there and I was advised to get to East London and I was not trusting and I didn't have any way to defend myself so I decided to get to East London at about five, that is how I got treatment.

MS MAYA:  So you say you got your treatment in East London?

WITNESS:  Yes.

MS MAYA:  How was the extent of your injury?

WITNESS:  I had a wound on my leg and here on my arm.

MS MAYA:  How long were you in hospital?

WITNESS:  I got treatment that very same night and discharged because the hospital was very busy and some of us, they had to take out the bullet and so they did the same to me and they discharged me that very same night but I couldn't go home that very same night.  I had to wait for transport to Queenstown.  I had gone there in an ambulance so in the morning I went home.

MS MAYA:  So did these get healed completely?

WITNESS:  My leg took time to get healed but presently I feel better.

MS MAYA:  Do you perhaps have a request or a wish to say to this Commission.  What is it?

WITNESS:  I would like to say to this Commission that the period from 1992 up to now is too long and yet I haven't heard anything about the perpetrators.

MS MAYA:  What did your lawyers say about your claim?

WITNESS:  My lawyer, Mr Vabasa, who I gave my statements to used to call us now and again but would say there was nothing that he could tell us but he would call us later.

MS MAYA:  Is that all you have to say to this Commission?

WITNESS:  Yes.

MS MAYA:  One last question to you.  When you talk of perpetrators, who are these people you are referring to?

WITNESS:  I'm referring to the killers who are killing people as if they were killing flies.

MS MAYA: Thank you to you Lungisile.

CHAIRPERSON: June Crichton?

JUNE CRICHTON: Mr Cotani just one very quick question to you.  You mentioned teargas.

WITNESS:  Ja.

JUNE CRICHTON:  We have heard that the shots were first and not much mention of teargas.  Can you tell me please when the teargas happened, when you noticed the teargas.  Were you already shot?

WITNESS:  The teargas was before I was shot.  When we were being shot, the teargas was being released as well.

JUNE CRICHTON:  At the same time?

WITNESS:  At the same time.

JUNE CRICHTON: Thank you Mr Cotani.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you.

TRUTH AND RECONCILIATION COMMISSION: BISHO MASSACRE - DAY 2 - 10 SEPTEMBER 1996

CASE NO: 10

MS MAYA: I would like to call Butiki John Kibi.
BUTIKI JOHN KIBI   Duly sworn states

MS MAYA: Mr Kibi we'd like to greet you.  Can you please tell us what happened on the day of the march.  What happened to you?

WITNESS:  On that day in Bisho, before the Bisho massacre I was arrested here in King William's Town on the 13.8.1992.

MS MAYA:  Why did they arrest you?

WITNESS:  There was a roadblock in Bisho in front of the prison and I was with my friend Adam Campinga.  We went to fetch our friend Nemamembelo Ntanzani and when we were approaching King William's Town we saw intelligence security passing by.  When I parked the car near the prison, we went to the public phone to make a telephone call.  While we were phoning, the white guys together with black guys came to us.  Their cars were over 26.  I told my friend Adam Campinga to withdraw to phone and to look back what was happening.  These guys were carrying rifles.

MS MAYA:  Why did they arrest you?

WITNESS:  When they arrested us they told us, the white guy told us that we are guerrillas and they said we are going to intimidate Brigadier Oupa Gqozo in King William's Town.  I asked this white guy how do you know me?  Why did you say I'm a guerrilla and then he said that I know Chris Hani sent you to prepare for the Bisho massacre which was going to take place on the 7th.  We were arrested there.  They didn't release us.

MS MAYA:  How long did they arrest you?

WITNESS:  I was, what they did to me, they hit me with their rifles and they searched us with a machine.  My friend was carrying something but I didn't know what it was.  That caused us to be taken. Because I was the oldest and he was the youngest we were arrested together in King William's Town.  On that night we didn't sleep.  We were tortured by eight guys.  There was a tall man from Transkei which claimed that he was from the National Intelligence of Security and he said that what we are planning to do with Chris Hani is going to end.  They're going to sort the programme and they're going to shorten it.

MS MAYA:  Do you know this guy from Transkei?

WITNESS:  No he was just wearing private, he didn't wear a uniform.  After that a coloured man came in.  He also asked us what we are going to do and what is our business in King William's Town and he told us to say the truth and I was so scared at that time.  I could see that these guys knew something and I asked them why did he call me a kaffir and he just told me that we are used to fighting and this was South Africa, not the outside countries.  That guy left us and then the Afrikaner guy came in.  When I tried to take off my shoes this guy asked me what am I doing with my shoes and I told him I was just taking out my shoes and then he said since I was Chris Hani's friend, we are going to kill you one by one and we are going to start with Chris Hani.  You are not going to succeed with what you are planning to do to Brigadier Gqozo.

MS MAYA:  Do you know any of these guys, of these police guys?

WITNESS:  No but there's one African that was speaking Xhosa.

MS MAYA:  Do you see them now?

WITNESS:  No but one of them told us that he is from Queenstown.  He said that his intelligence told us that we were in King William's Town.

MS MAYA:  How long did you stay there in prison?

WITNESS:  We stayed the whole night and then they released us at half past three  ... end of Tape 2, side A ... I was released that afternoon.  Before they released me I asked a question to this guy Mr Adam Campinga about his whereabouts because at 12 o'clock at night I heard that he was sent to Berlin where people were killed and that Boer told me that the guerrillas' heads are cut off in Berlin and I asked them where is Adam Campinga.  They said he is inside and then I asked them to brought him and I asked them why did they arrested him and then they said they found a gun to him and they released me.  At half past three I went to Queenstown.