Amnesty Hearings — Messina — 2000-07-04

CHAIRPERSON: Yes, thank you.  Yesterday when we adjourned we had just concluded the evidence of the applicants.  Mr Wagener.

MR WAGENER: Good morning Chairman.  Yes, we are ready and I wish to call as a witness my client, Mr van Eck, he's sitting next to me.  He's prepared to testify under oath and he's ready to take the oath.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you.

JOHANNES FREDERIK VAN ECK: (sworn states)

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you.  Mr Wagener.

MR WAGENER: Mr van Eck, during 1985 where did you live?

JOHANNES FREDERIK VAN ECK: In the Tzaneen area.

MR WAGENER: What was the job that you did?

JOHANNES FREDERIK VAN ECK: I was a bus contractor and a farmer.

MR WAGENER: We now know that you were married at that stage.  How many children did you have?

JOHANNES FREDERIK VAN ECK: Three.

MR WAGENER: What were their ages?

JOHANNES FREDERIK VAN ECK: At that stage 9 and 4 and 18 months.

MR WAGENER: This job that you did, it had two divisions or sections, you were a contractor and a farmer.  This transport contracting business, was it a successful business?

JOHANNES FREDERIK VAN ECK: Yes.

MR WAGENER: Was it profitable?

JOHANNES FREDERIK VAN ECK: Yes.

MR WAGENER: Can you tell the Chairperson just broadly speaking how many people were working for you and what the work entailed?

JOHANNES FREDERIK VAN ECK: Mr Chairperson, my business was farming.  I worked with approximately 400 workers.  I also had a school bus contract and four whites worked for me and that is basically what the business entailed.

MR WAGENER: So can one then accept that you were financially successful?

JOHANNES FREDERIK VAN ECK: Yes, Mr Chairperson definitely.

MR WAGENER: At that stage in 1985 what was your personal health like?

JOHANNES FREDERIK VAN ECK: It was excellent, I was a qualified PT teacher, I taught for eight years and I then retired because of other activities, but I was a very healthy person.

MR WAGENER: We now know, Mr van Eck, that you and your family were involved in an incident on the 15th of December 1985, together with the family of Mr Koos de Nysschen.  Can you tell the Committee how you got to know Mr de Nysschen or what your relationship was?

JOHANNES FREDERIK VAN ECK: Mr Chairperson, I was the Chairperson of the Primary School Management team.  Mr de Nysschen was the Vice Chairperson, our children went to school together and we became friends.  It was in a school context.

MR WAGENER: Was Mr de Nysschen then also a resident of the Tzaneen district?

JOHANNES FREDERIK VAN ECK: Yes.

MR WAGENER: This farm where this incident of 15 December took place, who was the owner of that farm?

JOHANNES FREDERIK VAN ECK: Mr Chairperson, the farm was the property of the de Nysschen brothers, they used it as a holiday farm and they're still farming in the Tzaneen District and that was their game farm that they had, it was more for holiday purposes.

MR WAGENER: So they were not resident on this farm?

JOHANNES FREDERIK VAN ECK: No, there was a caretaker who looked after things on the farm.

MR WAGENER: Was this caretaker a white person?

JOHANNES FREDERIK VAN ECK: No Mr Chairperson it was a black person.

MR WAGENER: Mr van Eck, just for interest sake, how far is this game farm from the area where you lived at that stage, you and Mr de Nysschen?

JOHANNES FREDERIK VAN ECK: Mr Chairperson, I cannot remember the exact amount of kilometres, but it must be approximately 250 kilometres.

CHAIRPERSON: Mr van Eck where exactly is this farm?

JOHANNES FREDERIK VAN ECK: It is, Mr Chairperson, approximately 25 kilometres west of Messina.  It is on the Pontdrif road.

CHAIRPERSON: And do you know how big this farm is?  Is it a big farm or not?

JOHANNES FREDERIK VAN ECK: Mr Chairperson, it was not an exceptionally big farm, it was in terms of the areas, it was one of the smaller farms.

CHAIRPERSON: Mr Wagener.

MR WAGENER: We now know that out of the documents that you and your family were visiting the de Nysschen's on this specific farm when this incident took place, is that correct?

JOHANNES FREDERIK VAN ECK: Yes, that is.  We were on holiday, we went through the game reserve, the Kruger National Park, and we concluded our holiday by going to Mr de Nysschen to go and visit them on their farm, they were also there at that stage.

MR WAGENER: Before this incident, were you on this farm before?

JOHANNES FREDERIK VAN ECK: No, not at all.

MR WAGENER: In other words, it was your first visit to this farm?

JOHANNES FREDERIK VAN ECK: Yes.

MR WAGENER: Just for the record, the farm or the specific farm, what was the name of the farm?

JOHANNES FREDERIK VAN ECK: Chatsworth, if I pronounce it the right way.  Chatsworth.

MR WAGENER: Can you describe to the Committee what the set-up was concerning the roads?

JOHANNES FREDERIK VAN ECK: Mr Chairperson it's very simple, it is a farm with a camping ground.  Furthermore it consists of smaller roads.  There are no big roads, there's no traffic through the farm it's only normal farm roads.

MR WAGER: Was this farm fenced in?

JOHANNES FREDERIK VAN ECK: Yes, it had a game fence.

CHAIRPERSON: And Mr van Eck, the type, was it a double lane road?  Did it have a centre?

JOHANNES FREDERIK VAN ECK: No, but sometimes there is grass that grew in the middle of the lane on the road.  I wouldn't say that they were cleared away from driving, but I think over the years it was cleared by just driving on it.

CHAIRPERSON: And how far from the border was this farm?

JOHANNES FREDERIK VAN ECK: The farm does not go up to the river, there are still farms between this farm and the border or the river.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you.  Mr Wagener.

MR WAGENER: Did I understand you correctly Mr van Eck, there were no thoroughfares through this farm?

JOHANNES FREDERIK VAN ECK: That is correct.

MR WAGENER: Does that mean that to get to this farm with a vehicle, you had to drive through a gate?

JOHANNES FREDERIK VAN ECK: That is correct, Mr Chairperson.  To get to the farm you leave the tarred road.  First you drive through another farm, past a house, then the road goes into the area of the farm.

MR WAGENER: We heard yesterday and evidence was led that the applicants had instructions to plant landmines on roads where the military did their patrols, you heard this evidence?

JOHANNES FREDERIK VAN ECK: That is correct, yes.

MR WAGENER: What was the position in this regard, on the farm of Mr de Nysschen?

JOHANNES FREDERIK VAN ECK: Mr Chairperson as far as I know, there were no patrols by the military on that farm.

MR WAGENER: Furthermore you saw in the Criminal Court that Mr de Nysschen testified that there has never been a military vehicle on that farm.

JOHANNES FREDERIK VAN ECK: I accept that because he knew exactly what happened and how things worked regarding this.

MR WAGENER: When you were in that area during this visit, did you see any military patrols outside of this farm?

JOHANNES FREDERIK VAN ECK: Mr Chairperson no, because the Sunday of the 15th of December we arrived there approximately 12 o'clock the day.  We were in the Kruger Park in the morning.  On the 15th we drove over the landmine, so in that time when I was there, I never saw any military activities.

MR WAGENER: In other words it was the same day?

JOHANNES FREDERIK VAN ECK: Yes, it was the same day when I got there.

MR WAGENER: Or when the landmine was set off.

JOHANNES FREDERIK VAN ECK: That is correct.

MR WAGENER: Can you just tell the Panel and the Chairperson at what time that day did the explosion take place?

JOHANNES FREDERIK VAN ECK: Mr Chairperson the explosion took place approximately 5 o'clock the afternoon.

MR WAGENER: Mr van Eck, I do not want to take you through the facts of the explosion itself, but we know now that you and your family and the family of Mr de Nysschen were on the vehicle that set off this landmine, is that correct?

JOHANNES FREDERIK VAN ECK: Yes.

MR WAGENER: Mr van Eck, what type of vehicle was this?