Human Rights Violation Hearings — Ermelo — 1997-05-22

DR RANDERA: I'm sure you've asked this question many a time, but why Queen? Why do you think people I mean these Amakati attacked Queen and killed her ?

MAMANE MABUZA: Yes, I always ask myself that question.  I still ask myself that question today because Queen was not involved in any type of political activity and ever since this happened, I've been very sickly.

MAMANE MABUZA: Were there, at the time of Queen's death, were there other people being killed as well by the Amakati ?

MAMANE MABUZA: Yes, there is quite a number of people who were murdered but on that particular day she was the only one that was killed.  A number of them were killed over the days.  Some before her, some after her.

DR RANDERA: At the funeral, did the community give you a great  deal of  support ?  Did any political organisation give you support ?

MAMANE MABUZA: No.  We did that single handed as a family.  We had no support whatsoever.

DR RANDERA: Mrs Mabuza, my last question.  I'm just trying to understand the contact in which Queen was killed.  We have in the stories that we have heard in the other areas come across situations in small communities where sometimes people have been identified because they happen to be the girlfriend or boyfriend of one gang or another.  Was there any possibility of that, as far as Queen's death goes, in your understanding ?

MAMANE MABUZA: No, she was never involved in any of those things.  She was just a student.  An ordinary student.

DR RANDERA: Thank you very much, Mrs Mabuza.  I have no further questions  Chairperson.

MR LEWIN: Thank you Dr Randera.  I'll ask the other panelists if they have any questions.  Tom Manthata ?

THOMAS MANTHATA: Mama, what I would love to know is do you still have around you Queen's friends ?  That is those students who were moving around with Queen, do they still come to your house ?

MAMANE MABUZA: No, they don't.

THOMAS MANTHATA: What about Queen's teachers ?  Were they by any standard ever knew your family to explain her progress, her associates and so on ?

MAMANE MABUZA: No, they never came.

THOMAS MANTHATA: Never came.  At Church level, was she a Churchgoer ?  What did the Minister say about her ?

MAMANE MABUZA: Yes, she used to go to African Full Gospel Church.  However we received no help from the African Gospel Church nor any condolences.

THOMAS MANTHATA: Yes, what we are trying to establish here is perhaps some of these groupings could have given you a hint of Queen's political outlook.  Whether she could perhaps, in secret, where you yourself do not know or did not know associated with political groupings.

MAMANE MABUZA: No, she wouldn't have been afraid to tell me if she was politically involved.  She definitely  wasn't.  She was never involved in any political activity whatsoever.  She was nineteen years old at the time.

THOMAS MANTHATA: Would you then say she could have been killed for rituals, you know these ritual murders or  ?

MAMANE MABUZA: It is the Inkatha that did that and it could have been a ritual murder because they gouged her parts, her eyes and they took her internal organs including the uterus.  It's highly possible that it was a ritual murder but I know it was perpetrated by the Inkatha members.

THOMAS MANTHATA: You never knew what Inkatha wanted or what was it fighting for in the community ?

MAMANE MABUZA: I don't know what they wanted.  They were just killing the residents at random.  These were just random killings for no apparent reason whatsoever.

DR RANDERA: Did you ever know that Inkatha was a political party ?

MAMANE MABUZA: Yes, I do.  ... (interrupted)

THOMAS MANTHATA: Thank you.

MAMANE MABUZA: Because we used to be informed by the youth who knew better than we did.

THOMAS MANTHATA: Thank you Mama.

MR LEWIN: Mama Mabuza, if I could just ask one further question.  You ask us to trace a case number.  Now in your statement you do mention a case number from 1990.  Was that the case where you actually reported ?

MAMANE MABUZA: Yes, that is.  My husband reported the whole matter to the police.  That is the number that you have in my statement.  The matter never proceeded to court.

MR LEWIN: There was no further action as far as you know, taken by the police in following up this case ?

MAMANE MABUZA: No, the police never lifted a finger in helping us.  It's only now that the Truth Commission has come that I believe I'll know something about my daughter's death.  They said they would come back to me in due course.  Up to today I haven't heard a thing from them and I'm totally dissatisfied with the manner in which my daughter's case was handled because they were able to take photographs of the scene of the crime but they could find nothing or no tangible evidence with regard to my daughter's murderers or murderer.

MR LEWIN: Ma is there anything else that you would like to tell us ?

MAMANE MABUZA: Yes, I would like to point out that since my daughter died.  She was the only one and she used to do things for me in the house and I was hoping that she would also help me, she would support me.  Ever since then my husband died.  I'm left all by myself and I just cannot cope with the pain and anguish that I'm going through.  I see no reason for going on like this. ... (interrupted)

MR LEWIN: Ma Mabuza.

MAMANE MABUZA: I still feel very terrible.

MR LEWIN: Ma Mabuza we can well understand that it's very difficult to try and console you in any way because the story have told us is one of tremendous pain as you say and anguish but it's also of horror for those of us hearing this for the first time.  We would like to salute you for your courage in coming forward because this is part of our past which we can't ignore and all we can say, I think, is that the experience that we've had in the Commission over the last twelve months in holding hearings of this sort and hearing stories, not in any way similar to yours because your story is unique but stories of the same sort of pattern, of people suffering.  Everything seems so needless, so useless and so arbitrary.

MAMANE MABUZA: I also have children.  There are children in the house but I can't look after the children because I'm physically disabled since this happened.

MR LEWIN: How many children do you still have ?

MAMANE MABUZA: There are four.

MR LEWIN: What we will, we will try and follow this up and find a case number and we would also call on the community as Tom has indicated to help support you because that is what the community is there for and to try and, what we would say is that you have shown tremendous courage in coming forward to-day.  That must be, that shows the tremendous strength that you have in yourself and that must, in yourself, also through your family and your friends in the community to provide some sort of comfort.  So we'd like to thank you very much for coming.  Thank you.

MAMANE MABUZA: Mrs Dube wants to say something.

MR LEWIN: Mrs Dube do you want to add anything ?

MAMANE MABUZA: She's the one who went to identify Queen.

MRS DUBE: I did not think there was a need for me to add anything else because she said whatever I think needs to be said.

MAMANE MABUZA: I think she should say something because she's the one who identified Queen's body and the position in which she was at the time that she was discovered.  Maybe she could shed some light to the Commission with regard to that.

MR LEWIN: Ma Mabuza, I think what we could do there, we do have your statement which is very full.  If Mrs Dube could possible see the statement takers and make another statement as well.  That would be the way to do it.  Okay ?  Thank you very much indeed.