Amnesty Hearings — Vereeniging — 1999-01-25

CHAIRPERSON: Are you ready to proceed Mr Strydom?

MR STRYDOM: Yes Chairperson, the next applicant is Sonny Michael Mkwanazi.

CHAIRPERSON: May I indicate that I have been advised by the interpreter that there is only one Zulu interpreter and that being the case we may either have to slow down or take adjournments every time and again so as to give the only interpreter present time to rest.  I am informed though that another interpreter is on her way from Cape Town so once she arrives we should be able to proceed at the normal pace.  Yes thank you.  What is the name of this gentleman?

MR STRYDOM: Sonny Michael Mkwanazi, number seven on the list.

CHAIRPERSON: Mr Mkwanazi what language our you going to speak?

SONNY MICHAEL MKWANAZI: Sesotho.

CHAIRPERSON: Very well, would you state your full names for the record?

SONNY MICHAEL MKWANAZI: (sworn states)

MR STRYDOM: Mr Mkwanazi, what is your level of education?

SONNY MICHAEL MKWANAZI: Standard 5.

MR STRYDOM: How old are you presently?

SONNY MICHAEL MKWANAZI: I am 23 years old.

MR STRYDOM: Which year were you born?

SONNY MICHAEL MKWANAZI: 1977, it was in February.

MR STRYDOM: You have signed a so-called Form 1?

SONNY MICHAEL MKWANAZI: That is correct.

MR STRYDOM: Your signature appears on page 133, do you identify your signature?

SONNY MICHAEL MKWANAZI: Yes I can see the signature.

MR STRYDOM: Do you confirm the contents of the application form, Form 1?

SONNY MICHAEL MKWANAZI: That is correct.

MR STRYDOM: You've indicated now that you were born during 1977, I see in this form your birth date is given as 11th February 1976, can you just make that clear?

SONNY MICHAEL MKWANAZI: I have just applied for an identity document in 1997 and I only learnt then that I was born in February 1977.

CHAIRPERSON: Mr Mkwanazi, would you please speak up so that people at the back of the hall can hear what you are saying, do you understand?

SONNY MICHAEL MKWANAZI: Yes very well.  I have just taken in a new identity document, it was in 1997 when I applied.  It is then that I only came to know that I was born in 1977 in February.

MR STRYDOM: And next to your application form is a typed out document setting out inter alia the political objective you wanted to achieve with the attack.  Now this document was translated to you and shown to you.  Do you confirm the contents of this document?

SONNY MICHAEL MKWANAZI: Yes that is correct but I must say we did not have an interpreter on that day.

MR STRYDOM: Yes but I'm referring today this contents have been explained yet again, do you confirm the contents?

SONNY MICHAEL MKWANAZI: That is correct.

MR STRYDOM: In your own words, what was your motive and objectives when you decided to go along with the group that attacked Boipatong?

SONNY MICHAEL MKWANAZI: The objective was to go to Boipatong and teach the people of Boipatong a lesson.  They didn't want us to live in the township.  I wanted to teach them a lesson.

MR STRYDOM: Before you moved to Kwamadala Hostel were you a victim of violence against yourself personally?

SONNY MICHAEL MKWANAZI: That is correct.

MR STRYDOM: And according to your application you moved into the hostel during 1991, is that right?

SONNY MICHAEL MKWANAZI: That is correct.

MR STRYDOM: Did you become a member of the Inkatha Freedom Party?

SONNY MICHAEL MKWANAZI: That is correct.

MR STRYDOM: Now the next document I want to refer you to appears on page 136 of the bundle, that is the request for further particulars and your answers appear on page 138 to 140.  Do you confirm that the questions and answers were again shown to you?

SONNY MICHAEL MKWANAZI: I confirm.

MR STRYDOM: You indicated that there's a wrong answer, is that right?

SONNY MICHAEL MKWANAZI: That is correct.

MR STRYDOM: And you indicated to me, well I'll read you the question, you give the answer that should be given, that's question 5.2
"Did Mr Khosa warn hostel dwellers at the meeting that they should burn all evidence that linked attackers to the massacre including goods stolen from the hostel and clothes stained with blood?"
The answer that appears on page 139 under 5.2 is "Yes"
Do you stand by that answer?

SONNY MICHAEL MKWANAZI: No I don't stand by that answer.

MR STRYDOM: What should that answer be?

SONNY MICHAEL MKWANAZI: I said he might have said that but not in my presence.  I had not arrived at the meeting.

MR STRYDOM: Can you give or tender any explanation why the answer was given as "yes"?

CHAIRPERSON: Well isn't it what he's saying that what he said was that he might have said that but not in his presence?

MR STRYDOM: That is his answer today but I just want to give him the opportunity to explain why the wrong answer appeared on the application initially.

SONNY MICHAEL MKWANAZI: My advocate was with me during that occasion, he must have mistaken me for a wrong answer.  On that day I said to him he might have said that but I had not arrived at the meeting yet.  The mistake comes from his side.

MR STRYDOM: Do you remember if an interpreter was used?

SONNY MICHAEL MKWANAZI: No.

MR STRYDOM: Would you speak a little bit of Afrikaans?

SONNY MICHAEL MKWANAZI: No that much.

MR LAX: Sorry Mr Strydom, does he know that there wasn't an interpreter or he does not remember, I'm not quite clear what his answer is?

SONNY MICHAEL MKWANAZI: No.

MR LAX: No to what?  Was there an interpreter or that you just don't remember?

SONNY MICHAEL MKWANAZI: There was no interpreter.

MR LAX: Thank you.

MR STRYDOM: When your statement was taken were you in custody at that time?

SONNY MICHAEL MKWANAZI: That is correct.

MR STRYDOM: Now the next document I want to show you is an affidavit which appears on page 141 up to page 143.  Now this document has been shown to you again and interpreted to you and you indicated that there are certain aspects that are not completely correct.  The one paragraph I want to read out to you is on page 142, the second paragraph which I will translate
"Before the night of the 17th June 1992 I knew nothing of any attack which was going to take place"
Is that correct?

SONNY MICHAEL MKWANAZI: That is correct.

MR STRYDOM: When was the first time for you to become aware that Boipatong would be attacked?

SONNY MICHAEL MKWANAZI: It was on the 10th at the meeting.

MR STRYDOM: Who spoke during the meeting of the 10th you refer to?

SONNY MICHAEL MKWANAZI: It was Mr Mkhize.

MR STRYDOM: Do you remember what he said during the meeting?

SONNY MICHAEL MKWANAZI: Yes.

MR STRYDOM: Can you just repeat what you remember?

SONNY MICHAEL MKWANAZI: He said we should get ready for an attack but he did not tell us as to when will the attack take place.  They said we should go and revenge against the people of Boipatong who did not want us in the township, the people of Boipatong who killed us when we went into the township.

MR STRYDOM: So if I can refer you to page 142 again, is that statement then correct, the one I translated to you?

SONNY MICHAEL MKWANAZI: That is correct.

CHAIRPERSON: Mr Mkwanazi, the statement that your counsel has just read to you says that before the night of the 17th June 1992 you did not know or you were not aware of any attack that was going to take place, do you understand that?

SONNY MICHAEL MKWANAZI: Yes I do.

CHAIRPERSON: You've just told us now that you first became aware of the attack, of the pending attack on Boipatong on the 10th June 1992?  You see, do you understand that?

SONNY MICHAEL MKWANAZI: I understand.

CHAIRPERSON: So the statement that appears at page 142 cannot be correct can it?

SONNY MICHAEL MKWANAZI: What I know is that we were told to prepare ourselves for an attack.  We were not told the date of the attack.

CHAIRPERSON: And you knew what place you were going to attack didn't you?

SONNY MICHAEL MKWANAZI: We did not know.