Amnesty Hearings — Mmabatho — 1998-09-23

MR TERREBLANCHE: Thank you Chairperson.  It is general knowledge that the next morning, the morning of the 11th, on the request of Mr Rowan Cronje who was then the Minister in the Mangope regime government, Mr Jan Breytenbach, who was in charge of the whole Unit which was there, the AWB was told to leave the country.
	The Bophuthatswana government, Mr Cronje and others are able to control the unrest which is prevailing there and indeed, they did retreat.  The media covered these stories and these events.  There is a heading in a paper and it was shown here which says, we are going home when they were lying there and the media asks him, where are you going and he said, we are going home.
	Everybody knew and there is only one way home, and that is the way the AWB drove.  The vehicles in the front was already passed under the bridge and then the last vehicle found itself in this situation. 
	I know that there are misperceptions with regards to what happened and to a certain extent one must give a few points to the people who say that because AWB's were killed here, they were stopped, but it was not the truth.  It was the discipline of the commanding officers of the movement that they did not go back and cause massive destruction.
	I was outside of Bophuthatswana because I was requested that evening to go and I did retreat.  After I met the men who did retreat, Chairperson, we received this news.  I carry the responsibility that I did not allow the AWB to go back and cause revenge.  So if we can correct this misperception.

ADV MOTATA: If I may interrupt you Mr Terreblanche, that what you are telling us now is not before us other than in argument.  We've got to look at your argument, taking what evidence was presented to us viva voce.  We don't have that kind of evidence from the interested parties, like for instance the AWB.
	What we have before us is the evidence under cross-examination and the applicant's evidence only.  We don't have the side of the AWB of the situation that obtained on the 11th of March 1994.  We are faced with this problem, please help us, that we have the applicant.  He says on the 11th of March 1994, a war situation prevailed.  It stops there.  We get a reporter who says I can ascribe the situation that prevailed on that particular day to a war situation.
	That is the end of the evidence before us.  Even in cross-examination, this has not been put in the clear terms as you put it, that we have been requested to leave and we abided with that request to leave Bophuthatswana, but it only surfaces in argument and I have a great problem there, how far would I take the argument you have presented in coming to a decision whether we should grand or not grant.  I have a big problem there, if you could just take me over that.

MR TERREBLANCHE: Mr Chairperson, in my cross-questioning I put it very clearly the AWB is gone, I am quoting myself, the AWB has left.  I asked was there another vehicle behind this Mercedes and he said no.  I asked if there is one in front of it and he said that he cannot remember, because the fact of the matter is there was no vehicle behind that vehicle.  At least he did not say there was one, that was the last vehicle.
	I tried to the best of my ability to make it clear in my cross-questioning as far as the war situation is concerned, I said that these people had left.  Advocate appearing for Mr Uys also spoke about that.   The fact of the matter is they have left.  If you can give me a second, we can look at the bundle in front of us.
	Mr Andy John de Koker testified Chairperson, and this bundle is available to you, it is page 18.  I noticed that there were around eight to ten vehicles in a convoy.  The last vehicle in this convoy was a blue Mercedes.
	The next minute this vehicle came to a standstill on the left hand side of the road.  I noticed that the driver of this vehicle had his hands in the air, a sign of surrender.  I also noticed that the passenger on the left side was making a gesture with his hands.  I could see that there were three people in the vehicle.  All three were dressed in khaki and one shouted in English, don't shoot.
	The last vehicle - the other vehicles, they were not shot at and they themselves did not shoot any anyone.  Where are they?  They did not stay there and created a war situation, they were on their way home.  This vehicle was the last in the convoy Chairperson.

ADV BOSMAN: Mr Terreblanche, can I just ask you.  Except for the fact that this blue Mercedes was the last vehicle, what would you say are the other factual factors which made the applicant think that the AWB has retreated?  Is there anything else?