Human Rights Violation Hearings — Johannesburg — 1996-04-30

YASMINE SOOKA: Freddy, when he came back from Botswana, did he ever tell you that he knew anything about why Andrew had been taken and killed?

MABEL MATLALAKA MAKOPE: No he didn't say anything.

YASMINE SOOKA: It is Freddy who is running the business again?

MABEL MATLALAKA MAKOPE: Yes.

CHAIRPERSON: Russel Ally.

RUSSELL ALLY: Queen Skosana she was actually with your husband when he was taken, is that correct?

MABEL MATLALAKA MAKOPE: Yes they were together.

RUSSELL ALLY: And will she be able to identify anybody who - the people who actually took your husband away, has she said that she knows, or that she can identify these people?

MABEL MATLALAKA MAKOPE: She said she doesn't know them.  She cannot even identify them because she wasn't clear whether they were policemen or whether they were ANC members.

RUSSELL ALLY: Have you given an address to the Commission where she can be contacted?

MABEL MATLALAKA MAKOPE: I don't know the address, I can't remember it just from my head.

RUSSELL ALLY: The combi that was used you said it was a well-known combi, did anybody ever take registration number or can they describe it, the colour or?

MABEL MATLALAKA MAKOPE: Nobody can describe it, it's only Queen who
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saw, it's Queen who can give us clear information.  It was blue tinted windows and the driver was a White person.

RUSSELL ALLY: Thank you.

CHAIRPERSON: Yasmin.

YASMINE SOOKA: You said that your eldest son was quite disturbed, could you tell us a little more about that and whether he's receiving any treatment for it.

MABEL MATLALAKA MAKOPE: Yes the treatment is under-way.  He is being treated now.

YASMINE SOOKA: Thank you.

DR MAGWAZA: I just want to make a follow-up on the question asked by Yasmin.  You mentioned that you are sick and that your in-laws have to support you, can you tell us more about that?

MABEL MATLALAKA MAKOPE: Since Andrew's disappearance I fell very ill and I was diagnosed having a heart attack, ulcers, high blood pressure, in most cases I just feel dizzy.  Sometimes I would feel like running away.   There is not even one month that I stay without going to the doctor or the hospital.  I spent most of my time in the hospital.  I couldn't spend any time with my children.  I would stay at home a week and then the next I'm in the hospital.  This is the situation until now.

CHAIRPERSON: Hlengiwe Mkhize.

MS MKHIZE: I will just ask one more question, and I can see you're getting exhausted in talking about the most difficult experience in your life.  Partly as a Commission we have a responsibility to think about what needs to be done to promote healing and reconciliation.  The question of the disappearances is the difficult one.  I wonder whether you can share with us your vision as to what is it that the
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Commission can do for those individuals and families who have people who disappeared, any thoughts about what you think might heal, might begin to heal those families?

MABEL MATLALAKA MAKOPE: The most thing that will soothe me, that will be accepted by my children as well, is only when they can get their father and he can be buried dignified.

MS MKHIZE: Your view that if he can be buried, a person can be buried like a person with dignity is appreciated.  I don't know whether you had finished what you were saying, thank you.

MABEL MATLALAKA MAKOPE: There is one thing that I am requesting again, can Mamasela appear before the Commission so that the two of us can sit down?  So that he can explain why did he kill Andrew, maybe I can be comforted.  I am referring to Mamasela.

MS MKHIZE: We thank you very much.

CHAIRPERSON: We thank you very much.  As we have been saying to other people we ask God to really grace you.  Your sorrows are our sorrows as well.  If we say we feel the same pain you felt one would think it's a joke. People around here and those who are not here when they hear these stories they will open their hearts as you have done today.  We are grateful, your heart will be open, the oil will be poured in and you will be soothed.  We really feel the same way as you feel.  Let God Bless you.
 We are suggesting that we do not take the tea break here.  We have just one more witness.   It may be better that we take the last witness and then adjourn until Thursday.