Amnesty Hearings — Boksburg — 1998-03-06

MR SIBANYONI: I heard you saying that you were suspected or you were regarded as being close to the SDU's, am I correct?

NOMBUNISO NDWANE: Yes, they suspected that I was Nxeba Sonti's sister.  They perceived me as Nxeba Sonti's sister.

MR SIBANYONI: Were you close to the SDU's?

NOMBUNISO NDWANE: I was used to them.  Some of them were my home boys.

MR SIBANYONI: Were you aware of the differences or problems the SDU's had with the ANC Youth League?

NOMBUNISO NDWANE: No, I was not aware.  Because even if we would meet, we would not talk about problems of the SDU or ANC Youth League, we just talked about personal things.

MR SIBANYONI: Some of the applicants told this Committee that the SDU's attempted on several occasions, to hold a meeting with the ANC Youth League, but that the League was avoiding such a meeting.  Are you aware of that or not?

NOMBUNISO NDWANE: I have no knowledge of such, the only thing I know is that Nomfundu was told to get dressed and go to a meeting called by the ANC Youth League at Block E.
	But because she did not go to the meeting, I never did find out why they were called to the meeting.  I am not aware about other meetings.

MR SIBANYONI: You said the meeting was supposed to be held at a place you call FNB, where is this place in relation to the shack where Bulelwa was staying?

NOMBUNISO NDWANE: It is not too far, it is quite close.

MR SIBANYONI: You said Thokozani Buthelezi,  that is Mr Buthelezi's son, asked for a key, what key was that?

NOMBUNISO NDWANE: I don't know what key this was.  However, I thought that it was a key that belonged to a shack that was opposite this lady where I was, where these children would gather regularly.

MR SIBANYONI: From the day Bulelwa asked questions at the meeting about the formation of the new SDU, how many days thereafter was she killed?

NOMBUNISO NDWANE: I cannot remember.

MR SIBANYONI: Were there many days, a week or less than a week?

NOMBUNISO NDWANE: I don't want to lie, I can't remember.

MR SIBANYONI: You said you were woken up by somebody in the morning, who asked you whether you heard some gun shots, who is this person who woke you up?

NOMBUNISO NDWANE: It is Zwandile.

MR SIBANYONI: What is the surname?

NOMBUNISO NDWANE: I don't know what his surname is.

MR SIBANYONI: Did you personally hear those gun shots during that night?

NOMBUNISO NDWANE: Yes, I did hear the gun shots.

MR SIBANYONI: Thank you Mr Chairperson, no further questions.

MR MALAN: Ms Ndwane, did I hear you correctly saying that when you got to Bulelwa's corpse, that Buthelezi was there saying to you that he did not sleep the whole of the night and he was looking over the corpse?

NOMBUNISO NDWANE: I did say that.

MR MALAN: And this is Thokozani Buthelezi's father?

NOMBUNISO NDWANE: Correct.

MR MALAN: He was guarding at the corpse the whole of the night?

NOMBUNISO NDWANE: That is what he said, he said they were guarding the corpse the whole night.

MR MALAN: Did you see any of the SDU members there?

NOMBUNISO NDWANE: I don't remember seeing members of the SDU, I just saw members of the community because we had also gone to see the corpse as part of the community.  I did not really notice any member of the SDU.

MR MALAN: Did I hear you further correctly when Mr Madasa led your evidence that you were saying that you were told that that meeting at Block F was called and that a new SDU was going to be formed?  Is that correct?

NOMBUNISO NDWANE: Correct.

MR MALAN: And then you were asked who called you and who told you and you said you don't know.  Is that correct?

NOMBUNISO NDWANE: I am not sure about that sir.  Are you saying that I said that I did not know who called the meeting, I said the meeting was called by the members of the Block, the one person that I noticed was Mr Buthelezi.

MR MALAN: Yes, but you were asked - let me put the question to you again, when that meeting was called and when you were told to come to the meeting, did they tell you what the meeting was about?

NOMBUNISO NDWANE: No, you are not supposed to be told what the meeting is about when you are being called to a meeting, you hear when you are at the meeting.

MR MALAN: So at that stage you had no knowledge of the new SDU to be formed?

NOMBUNISO NDWANE: At the time the meeting was called, I did not know that they were going to form a new SDU.

MR MALAN: Thank you.

CHAIRPERSON: Yes, Mr Motata?

MR MOTATA: Thank you Chairperson.  Ms Ndwane, did Nomfundu tell you the name of the members who comprised their Executive Committee of the ANC Youth League?

NOMBUNISO NDWANE: No, she never told me.

MR MOTATA: You said when she came back from the meeting, she never carried any book whatsoever.  Do you recall saying so?

NOMBUNISO NDWANE: I did say so.

MR MOTATA: Did she describe what kind of Secretary she was in the Executive of the Youth League?

NOMBUNISO NDWANE: I never asked for details.

MR MOTATA: I am asking you this because in the bundle of documents we have here, there is one David Marema who says he was the Secretary General of the ANC Youth League during 1993.

NOMBUNISO NDWANE: I don't know that person.  She just told me that she was the Secretary of the ANC Youth League.  I am not sure whether I am referring to the ANC Youth League Block F, however she was the Secretary of the ANC Youth League.

MR MOTATA: Thank you Chairperson, I've got no further questions.

CHAIRPERSON: You were not a member of the SDU, were you?

NOMBUNISO NDWANE: No, I was not a member.

CHAIRPERSON: You did not patrol together with the SDU, did you?

NOMBUNISO NDWANE: I never did.

CHAIRPERSON: How did you know that the SDU patrolled all the Blocks?

NOMBUNISO NDWANE: As a member of the community, I knew that the SDU patrolled all the Blocks, but I was not patrolling with them.

CHAIRPERSON: You were not aware of any complaints against the SDU?

NOMBUNISO NDWANE: Yes.

CHAIRPERSON: Were there no complaints against the SDU from Block F?

NOMBUNISO NDWANE: I never heard anyone complaining.

CHAIRPERSON: Do you - and I take it that the SDU also patrolled Block F?

NOMBUNISO NDWANE: I did not hear well.

CHAIRPERSON: The SDU according to you, also patrolled Block F?

NOMBUNISO NDWANE: I think so.

CHAIRPERSON: You resided at Block F?

NOMBUNISO NDWANE: Yes.

CHAIRPERSON: Did you see the members of the SDU patrolling Block F?

NOMBUNISO NDWANE: We would sleep at night, certain that they are patrolling the area.  I never made certain that they actually do patrol the area.

CHAIRPERSON: Do you know of any reason why some people in Block F would want to form a new SDU?

NOMBUNISO NDWANE: I think I already said that the reason I heard about was that they were forming a new SDU because they were saying that their parents were being attacked, I am not certain who exactly was attacking their parents.

CHAIRPERSON: Whose parents were being attacked?

NOMBUNISO NDWANE: Parents to the children who wanted to form a new SDU.

CHAIRPERSON: The meeting that you attended, was it attended by the Youth at which the decision to form a new SDU was being discussed?

NOMBUNISO NDWANE: I am not sure if the Youth was there, because when you talk about the ANC Youth League, it is not somebody - it is not, I cannot put a face to the ANC Youth League, I don't know the people.

CHAIRPERSON: Are you aware of any reason why the residents, the parents of Block F would want to form a new SDU?

NOMBUNISO NDWANE: I have no such knowledge because I was not a part of those parents.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you.  Mr Madasa?

MR MADASA: No questions, Mr Chairman.

MR MADASA: .

CHAIRPERSON: Mr Mapoma?

MR MAPOMA: No questions, thank you Mr Chairman.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you Ms Ndwane.
WITNESS EXCUSED

MR MADASA: Mr Chairman, may I call Matthews Mohlakwane?

CHAIRPERSON: Mr Mohlakwane, what language are you going to speak?

MATTHEWS PISTO MOHLAKWANE: Sotho sir.

MATTHEWS PISTO MOHLAKWANE: (sworn states)