Human Rights Violation Hearings — East London — 1997-06-10

UNKNOWN: I can't say that.

BONGANI FINCA: After the shooting was anyone shot?

UNKNOWN: I did not see anyone but my car as well as other police cars were damaged.

BONGANI FINCA: You say that you got an instruction that you must go to NU 13, was this to all the other policemen or just you?

UNKNOWN: This instruction was to all the police that were patrolling.

BONGANI FINCA: Were you here when Mr Madikane gave evidence?

UNKNOWN: Yes.

BONGANI FINCA: Did you hear his evidence?

UNKNOWN: Yes, and I cannot match with mine.

BONGANI FINCA: Reverend Xundu?

REV XUNDU: Thank you, Mr Chairperson.  You say that you were sent to go and look at the damages.

UNKNOWN: Yes, that was the instruction from the control office.

REV XUNDU: What were you going to do to people that were marching there?

UNKNOWN: I said that we would have to assess the situation and then respond.

REV XUNDU: What were you supposed to do?

UNKNOWN: We were not given any direct instruction.

REV XUNDU: Were you trained in a way that when people are causing unrest in a particular manner you act in a specific manner yourselves?

UNKNOWN: Yes, we were.

REV XUNDU: What were you supposed to do as police to control the crowds?

UNKNOWN: At that particular moment?

REV XUNDU: Any moment when you go to a place of chaos or unrest?

UNKNOWN: Well there are police trained specifically for that would that answer you better.  I was just called to those premises to protect them and the police.

REV XUNDU: So what you're saying is that the police that shot were taking the law into their own hands as they had not been instructed to do so.  Were you armed with rubber bullets or real bullets?

UNKNOWN: I had my own pistol.

REV XUNDU: So you went there not trained to control a crowd and depending on your pistol therefore if you are shocked you shoot?

UNKNOWN: It would depend on the situation that I'd find myself in.

REV XUNDU: Thank you Mr Chairperson.

BONGANI FINCA: Thank you Mr Gola just one small thing, what was your rank at the time?

UNKNOWN: I was a Sergeant I'm an inspector now.

BONGANI FINCA: Thank you for your evidence, we are now more confused than we were initially.

UNKNOWN: I'm also confused having been put here and not having done anything, I'm innocent.

BONGANI FINCA: Your evidence has left us more confused than we were before.  When Mr Madikane gave evidence we thought that there was a bit of light but your evidence is contradictory to his meaning that we are far from the truth because this is conflicting and contradictory evidence there's one true and one false evidence and as the Truth Commission we have to find a way to get the truth.  Thank you for coming.   As I said to Mr Madikane we are not contemplating making a finding at this stage but we are going to continue with our investigation and when we contemplate making a finding we will let you know.  I hope that you are going to help the Commission in investigating this matter and in reaching the truth.  Our country that we abide in stipulates that at least we live in truth and the whole country is waiting for us to come forward with the truth.  Thank you Mr Gola, thank you Mr Madikane. Mr Mbandazayo thank you for coming before us, you are kindly excused.

MR MBANDAZAYO: Thank you.