Human Rights Violation Hearings — Soweto — 1996-07-25

ARTHUR LOLLAN: I believe that because of Stanley's illness he was inactive later in England.  Because of that I think he had little contact with the hierarchy of the ANC.  According to James Phillips who also died in England, Stanley was very active. I believe he would go with him to various places in and around London, teaching people freedom songs and the like and being busy holding meetings everywhere.  So that alone tells me that Stanley was active, and that he was often left alone when he had to go home at night.  That's the time when these agents - because he was always talking about these agents that were following him around. I remember distinctly an Indian shopkeeper in Marlborough Road, in Upper Holloway, he just came out of the blue, when I went to Stanley's flat.  He said to me hello, you look very much like Stanley, is Stanley your brother? I said yes. He asked who am I. I said I am Arthur, I am from South Africa. He says man, you had better stay here and look after your brother, there is always people hanging around outside
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his flat assaulting him when he goes back at night to his flat.

THOMAS MANTHATA: The way you described Stanley, he was a very powerful man and very courageous. Did you ever consult with him when you had to go to South Africa House to ask for his return and when you went to people like Dawn Mateman to solicit her intervention, that he be brought back home.

ARTHUR LOLLAN: I have a letter here which I wrote to the South African authorities, I have the letter in my attache case, but I don't know if that letter influenced the South African authorities in any way.  What I do know is that the ANC, they assisted me in getting Stanley back to South Africa.

THOMAS MANTHATA: My question was, would Stanley have approved of your request to the South African Embassy and to people like Dawn Mateman at that time, to intervene that he be brought back to South Africa?

ARTHUR LOLLAN: I also have a letter in my attache case here, which proves that he wrote a letter to the authorities, asking to be sent - asking them to be sent back to South Africa.

THOMAS MANTHATA: Thank you, no further questions.

ARTHUR LOLLAN: I have here a photograph of him, that's him.  That photograph was taken by Ele Wynberg, many years ago.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you. I will ask the Commissioners to assist you in giving more information. Yasmin Sooka?

YASMINE SOOKA: I don't actually want to ask you a question, except to ask, there seems to be a tendency in our country to forget people who were heroes in the 1960s.

AUDIENCE: Hear, hear!

YASMINE SOOKA: Part of, I think part of our job is actually to make recommendations to Government about reparation and
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rehabilitation, but it also includes, I think, some form of acknowledgement for people who lost their lives in the struggle.  Do you have any particular recommendation which you would like us to think about?

ARTHUR LOLLAN: First I would like a tombstone to be erected on his grave site, and I am talking about financial compensation, I am not so keen on that.  As I said before I am not asking for hand-outs, but there is a certain amount of reparation to be done, and I wouldn't be in a position to say what it should be or should not be. I leave it to the Commission to decide.

YASMINE SOOKA: There also seems to be in our country, from a lot of the stories that have come through, that many people are still suffering with the anguish and the pain and many families like yourself, have been harassed.  There have been suggestions by some of the people who have come forward, that one needs to have trauma centres set up right around the country.  So that people can actually begin to deal with their pain, before we become a society which is even wracked more by violence than we have at this point in time.  Would you support that kind of idea?

ARTHUR LOLLAN: Yes, by all means.

YASMINE SOOKA: Thank you, I have no further questions.

CHAIRPERSON: Joyce Seroke?

MS SEROKE: You mentioned Tom Madumo, who lived in Swaziland and was very close to your brother.  Are you still in contact with Tom?

ARTHUR LOLLAN: I have lost all contact with Tom, and I believe his wife died, she was a lovely person. We all knew each other from way back in Sophiatown, where my father had a house, No 17 Good Street.
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MS SEROKE: We know where Tom is at the moment and we would have contact with him if we need more information about your brother, when he was still in Swaziland.

ARTHUR LOLLAN: I will be very grateful.

MS SEROKE: And I can also furnish you with his telephone number now.

ARTHUR LOLLAN: Thank you very much.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very much.  I will ask Hugh Lewin, one of the Commissioners to thank you for coming.

MR LEWIN: Mr Lollan, thank you very much. I would like on behalf of the Commission just to say how much we recommend, commend you for your courage and perseverance through all these years, you and your family.  Also I think to thank you especially, because listening to your story has been, it is almost a litany of our history over the past 30, 40 years.  I think the only sad thing about it is to think that your brother, Stanley didn't actually share in the events, particularly of the last five years.  But we would like to thank you very much and commend you. Thank you very much.

ARTHUR LOLLAN: Thank you.
APPLAUSE

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very much.
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