Human Rights Violation Hearings — Durban — 1996-08-30

KHOZA MGOJO: What day was that?

WITNESS:   No, before he died.  That was before he died.

KHOZA MGOJO: Was it on the 6th?

WITNESS:   No, it was not on the 6th.

KHOZA MGOJO: Do you remember when he was shot?

WITNESS:   It was on Sunday, and he died on Wednesday.  So it was around three, because they died on Wednesday, the 7th.  The ANC group said, "We will kill the people."

KHOZA MGOJO: Now, let's go back again.  When they were killed on Sunday did they survive that, or was there any person who died?

WITNESS:   No, no one died.

KHOZA MGOJO: Was it ANC shooting Inkatha.

WITNESS:   Yes, it was ANC shooting Inkatha, and the Inkatha was running away.

KHOZA MGOJO: Msomi was there?

WITNESS:   Yes.  He came on Tuesday and I explained to him that, "Tonight it's war, it's ANC fighting IFP."  I told him that Mfushane came and told us that Mlambo said you should ... (intervention)

KHOZA MGOJO: Who is Mfushane now?

WITNESS:   Mfushane is Mthethwa, is Mr Mthethwa.

KHOZA MGOJO: He belonged to IFP?

WITNESS:   No, he was just the community police.  And Msomi said, "I am not going there.  I won't go there.  I won't set my foot there.  Tomorrow I am going to work."  Truly he slept.  He did not go anywhere, he just said he wanted to have his supper and he slept.  The following morning he went to work.  Around quarter to five I heard people knocking at the window.  They said, "Makabhayi, Makabhayi."  I said, "Yes."  They said, "Where is Msomi?"  I told them, "Msomi has already left.  He went to work."  They said, "What time did he go, and what time did he board the bus?"  I told them at four.  I looked at the watch and the watch was quarter to five.  They came back after a while.  They said, "Ma Nkosezwe, Nkosezwe's mum."  They said, "You go to the bus stop.  I hear there is some attacks."  They left again.  They passed my shack and they went to the third shack from my shack.  There were all sorts of assegais in that house.  I had my walking stick.  They said, "You rush to the bus stop."

KHOZA MGOJO: Who had the assegais?

WITNESS:   The ANC had the assegais.  Truly I went to the bus stop, and I waited just for a while, and also took on - I saw this woman running, approaching, and she said, "What's happening?"

KHOZA MGOJO: Do you know this woman?  What was her name?

WITNESS:   She was Mrs - Ma Zondi.  She was Mrs Zondi.  I don't know her name.  She was a single lady.  She said, "What's happening to you now, Mrs Msomi?"   She said, "Msomi has died and he is lying there at the bus stop."  You see, I did not know whether I was coming or going now when I heard that.  I went past those men, because I had already got the truth now.  I knew what was happening.  I went back home and I woke up the children, and I told them to go to their aunt, who was at Lindelani.  We went there.  I saw - my family came.  As we were still preparing our clothes so we could take off the following day one child came and whispered to me, saying, "Mum, there are some boys going to Mlambo's place."  I didn't know how to hide my child.  I went finally to board the bus to go to Inanda.

KHOZA MGOJO: Those were your two brothers, or what?

WITNESS:   No, those were my two sisters.

KHOZA MGOJO: And where were the husbands?  Were you together?

WITNESS:   Yes, we were together going home now.  We went home.  He died on Wednesday, and the funeral took place on Saturday.

KHOZA MGOJO: Now, when he died - when he was lying there when did you fetch the corpse?

WITNESS:   Bhekizela came.  He had gone to check on his store.

KHOZA MGOJO: Who is Bhekizela, and which group did he belong to?

WITNESS:   He belonged to ANC.

KHOZA MGOJO: What is his surname?

WITNESS:   His surname is Mbele.  He came in his car and asked, "Who has died?"  They said, "It's Msomi.  He said, "Oh, this is my cousin.  So this is my cousin who has died."  Then he went to call the policemen from his place.  The police came, and C R Swart.  There were 12 cars.  We were not aware, and yet there was one other person who was dying in fire on the other side, being burned.  And the police asked one guy at the bus stop, asking, "Who is the person who is burning there?"  He answered that it was Mr Mhlope.  And one lady went to cover that corpse, the burning one, to cover it. So Mr Msomi was killed at the same time.  This happened concurrently, these two incidents, the burning one and Mr Msomi?   ---   Yes, that happened and took place at the same time.

KHOZA MGOJO: What happened after that?

WITNESS:   The police came and took him.

KHOZA MGOJO: Where were the police coming from?

WITNESS:   They were coming from Mtshabeni.  And Mr Mbele is the one who gave them a telephone call.

KHOZA MGOJO: You mean your cousin?

WITNESS:   Yes, our cousin.

KHOZA MGOJO: He was taken to ... (incomplete)

WITNESS:   He was taken to the mortuary.  They asked for my ID and his ID book.

KHOZA MGOJO: Did they have any post-mortem or something conducted after that to prove what killed him?

WITNESS:   Yes, they did specify that he was killed from being stabbed many times, and also all over most of the places in the body and on the head.  They explained to me that he had fatal wounds, but I never got to see him.  I was scared, I was afraid.

KHOZA MGOJO: Did you get any death certificate?

WITNESS:   You mean death certificate?

KHOZA MGOJO: Yes, I mean death certificate.

WITNESS:   We have it.  It's at home.

KHOZA MGOJO: Did it also state that he died from wounds, fatal wounds?

WITNESS:   Yes.

KHOZA MGOJO: Was there any kind of investigation in this regard?

WITNESS:   No, no investigation whatsoever.

KHOZA MGOJO: Did you report the matter to the police?

WITNESS:   Yes.

KHOZA MGOJO: Which police station?

WITNESS:   Mtshabeni Police Station. Would you happen to know who was the station commander then?   ---   No.

KHOZA MGOJO: Did you bury him?

WITNESS:   Yes, I buried him.

KHOZA MGOJO: Where?

WITNESS:   At Ndwedwe, at Newsel.

KHOZA MGOJO: Your cousin, Bhekizela Mbele, the ANC member, did he attend the funeral?

WITNESS:   No, they did not get the opportunity to attend, because they died on Wednesday, and on Saturday we buried them - buried him.  He didn't spend time in the mortuary.

KHOZA MGOJO: Dying in this manner, how did this impact on your life?

WITNESS:   Yes, it did impact, and it disturbed us, and it was such a traumatic experience.

KHOZA MGOJO: What happened besides this crying?

WITNESS:   After his death I experienced problems with my heart.  I would at times feel I am being attacked.  You know, I had this heart attack, and I got this problems with my eyesight.  My eyesight is so poor I cannot see.  Things are not visible enough to me.

KHOZA MGOJO: What about your children?  Were they severely harassed, and how did this impact on them?

WITNESS:   This harassed them, because even at night they get frightened as if there's something attacking, or there is something they see approaching.

KHOZA MGOJO: Do you get some kind of help in this?

WITNESS:   No, and no one is helping.

KHOZA MGOJO: Did you ever consult the psychologist?

WITNESS:   You mean social workers?

KHOZA MGOJO: Yes, also social workers and psychologists.

WITNESS:   No.

KHOZA MGOJO: Would you wish to be in touch and consult the psychologists or social workers?

WITNESS:   Yes. What you need to do, after this - do you know our offices by the way?  They are at Smith Street.   ---   The place where we gave our statements?

KHOZA MGOJO: Yes.  In case you don't manage to consult the psychologist or social workers today please you must go to our offices and get in touch with this doctor, Dr Magwaza and she will help you a great deal.  Your children now, who is educating your children?  Are you working?

WITNESS:   No, I am not working.

KHOZA MGOJO: How do you survive?  How do you make ends meet?

WITNESS:   Well, there is some white family who gave us some money.

KHOZA MGOJO: Is that enough?