Human Rights Violation Hearings — Leandra — 1997-06-03

CHAIRPERSON: The next witness, could those people who are leaving please keep as quiet as possible.

LUCAS MBONANE: (Duly sworn in, states).

MS SEROKE: ... was killed, he was also attacked in return and he had to away to Krugersdorp where he was arrested continually in many jails for having taken part in the killing of Chief Mayisa.  That is the statement that we have been given.  He has also stated the names of the people who took part.  Also the Zondo family has been stated as having taken part.  Maybe if you want to add something to the information that we already have you can do that just briefly, but before you go on I would like to ask you as to whether you have submitted a statement.

LUCAS MBONANE: That is the statement that was submitted by my son.

MS SEROKE: We are going to request you to submit your own statement, because you have been sworn in and you are appearing on his behalf.  Please go on and add to whatever information that we have.

LUCAS MBONANE: There is not much that I can say as you have already explained.  This statement is in accordance with what I know.  My child suffered a lot in this area.  He was arrested and he was arrested so many times as if he had killed a person and they left the other ones alone who were also involved in the killing of Mr Mayisa.  I thank you for giving me this opportunity to be able to say what I know with regard to the incident.  That his death has left me with his children.  They are destitute and I do not know what to do with the children.  I thank you.

MS SEROKE: At the time that Lucas was arrested in Krugersdorp did you go to, did you see any attorneys?

LUCAS MBONANE: Yes, his mother went, because the ANC attorneys tried all in their power to go around looking at the police stations as to whether there was anything that was being done with regard to his case, but nothing seemed to happen, because the killers were chasing us even when we were at the police station and we could not get any help from the police until one time I had to give up giving the statement or signing any documents, because the perpetrators were at the police station right inside the building.

MS SEROKE: According to Lucas's statement at the time that he was arrested he requested to change the statement as to what had happened to Mr Mayisa.

LUCAS MBONANE: Yes, it is like that.  A certain attorney, I was sent a message that they were calling me to Boy's place and when I got to Boy's place I came across an attorney.  I think it is the perpetrators attorney.  He said to me my son had tied himself, that is his feet as well as his hands and he had made an admission or a confession which could get him into trouble, because the other ones were denying being involved in the deed.  He said that my son still had the right to go back and change the statement or whatever he had said in that statement and I went to tell my son that that is what the attorney had said.

MS SEROKE: Now, after being released from jail and after he had gone to Krugersdorp how was his life when he came back to the community as well as the people with whom he killed Mr Mayisa?

LUCAS MBONANE: His life was not good at all, because he was now an enemy of the people he acted with.  He was going to turn State witness and I think his death has got a lot to do with having gone to volunteer a statement.

MS SEROKE: Was he sick before he died?

LUCAS MBONANE: No, he was never ill.  His death was a surprise.  He died right before my own eyes.

MS SEROKE: Did he tell you as to whether he had any problems, health problems, nightmares or bad dreams.  How was his life after that?  Maybe it could have contributed to his death.

LUCAS MBONANE: He was staying with us, he was suffering.  We were trying by all means to put food on the plate, because at that time he was not employed any more and when he died I got into debts.

MS SEROKE: How many children did he have?

LUCAS MBONANE: He had two children.

MS SEROKE: How old are they?

LUCAS MBONANE: If I am not mistaken his first born is 13 years old and the one after that could be 11 years old.

MS SEROKE: Where is his wife?

LUCAS MBONANE: His wife is still alive?

MS SEROKE: Is she staying with you?

LUCAS MBONANE: No, they are staying at their own place.

MS SEROKE: Now at the time that Lucky died was there any autopsy that was conducted?

LUCAS MBONANE: Yes, we did try, but the pathologist at first said the cause of death was high blood pressure and we never followed the matter up.

MS SEROKE: We do have his statement before us.  He further goes on to tell us that after they had taken Chief Ampie they doused him with petrol as his son had already testified.  They left him there burning.  What I could say to you, Mr Mbonane, is that you should get some strength from the fact that your son was brave enough to come forward and confess as to his deeds, because he felt he wanted to make amends with the community that he wronged and he wanted to tell the community as to his participation with regard to the murder.  The words that I am giving to you are that you should be at peace with yourself.

LUCAS MBONANE: This is what he said before he died, that he was asking God to give him a chance to testify as to how he participated in the killing of Mr Mayisa.  That he could not do that, because his co-accused did not want him to testify.

MS SEROKE: I also thank you Mr Mbonane.  I will now hand over to the Chairperson if they have any questions that they would like to ask.

CHAIRPERSON: Tom Manthata.

THOMAS MANTHATA: No questions.

CHAIRPERSON: Wynand.  Mr Mbonane, I would just like to ask you one question is why do you think your son, how do you think your son died?

LUCAS MBONANE: I think my son died under suspicious circumstances, because one time when I went to see him there were three women who knocked at my place.  They were scared, I think they did not see me, because I was walking on the other side of the railway and they were walking along the street and these women went into Lucas's place.  Just after they got into Lucas's place I knocked and one of them jumped and ran away.  The other one mumbled something that I did not understand and also went out.  His wife was at work at that time.  Even the third one mumbled something that I did not understand and I felt very bad, because his wife was at work when these three women were in the house.  I went out and told my wife and after I had told my wife he, she also went there and she got an empty bottle of beer as well as a glass next to it.  The glass was also empty.  Before my son died he always wanted to drink beer, he also said beer.  He could not say all the other things, but he kept on saying beer, beer.  Maybe he was poisoned through beer or something.

CHAIRPERSON: Mr Mbonane, we would like to thank you very much for coming particularly under such difficult circumstances.  I would also like to suggest now that it would be worthwhile your making a statement yourself just to give the, to give us sufficient evidence to follow-up on this case and in saying that I would like to record that we do have your son's full statement and it would help to have your own.  So thank you very much for coming.  Thank you.