Special Hearings — Mandela United Football Club Hearings — 1997-11-25

MR KUNY: Is there any truth in the allegation that you and your group wanted to kill George because you accused him of being an informer?

MS FALATI: That is what has been fabricated by the general and Mrs Mandela - that is fabricated by Mrs Mandela, to implicate me into the dirty things that - my hands are not dripping with the blood of the African children.  I've never compromised my comrades, I've never even compromised her, I went to prison for her as my leader - I don't compromise my comrade, never in my lifetime, I don't compromise the just cause, so that is why I went to prison for her - she was so much ungrateful.

MR KUNY: Lastly, she points a finger at you in the very next paragraph arising out of the death of Stompie Sepei and she says that on the basis of the information that you provided, four boys were severely assaulted and Stompie Sepei was subsequently killed.

MS FALATI: I beg your pardon Sir, I lost some words?

MR KUNY: She points a finger at you for the death of Stompie and the assault of his comrades on that occasion which has been discussed and she in effect blames you for their assault and Stompie's death because you provided the information which led to the assault, what is your comment about that?

MS FALATI: Well, you know she regards us - she dehumanises a person, she reduces a person to nothing.  She regards herself as a demi-God, she regards herself as a super-being, she wants everybody to cover her up by all means - she orders.  There are comrades who were taken from their places - the witnesses, to be bribed if they refused - who are going to testify here because she wants to be clean all the time because she regards herself as a demi-God.  Unquestioning submission corrupts leaders and ...[indistinct] follow us - making a cult out of a leader, is always a mistake.

MR KUNY: Mr Chairperson, I don't have any further questions, if I just may say that there - I have not led the witness on all the aspects I would have liked to but it's been indicated to me that the Commission does not want this to go on.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very much, thank you.
  Hanif?

MR VALLY: Thank you Archbishop.
 Miss Falati, all the youngsters who were kidnapped from the Manse say that you participated in the assaults on them.

MS FALATI: Pardon?

MR VALLY: Say you participated in the assaults on them, that you were party to the assaults on them, what is your response to that?

MS FALATI: Is it all the people that were ...[intervention}

MR VALLY: The people who were taken from the Manse, the youngsters.

MS FALATI: Yes.

MR VALLY: Mono, Katiza, Mekgwe as well as Katiza, say that you were also taking part in the assaults on the young people.

MS FALATI: I didn't take assault because I have taken assault on them I would be saying here that I've taken assault because there's nothing to fear.  I went to prison, for that there's nothing - I would be saying that ...[indistinct] I was ordered to sing as to drown the voices of those who were crying for mercy - to drown the voices and ordered by Mrs Mandela - to sing as to drown the voices of those who were crying for help.

MR KUNY: The question is why would they say that you took part in the assaults on them?

MS FALATI: Well, that was a confusion, that room is just a very small changing room - it was a confusion, people were taken out and there and I was scared.  You know, I was scared and puzzled.

MR VALLY: Do you say all of them were confused?

MS FALATI: They were confused.

MR VALLY: Let's go on.

MS FALATI: You do not know the brutality of this woman.

MR VALLY: Is it true that the reasons that the youngsters were taken from the Methodist Manse is because you took a complaint to Mrs Madikizela Mandela about them?

MS FALATI: Yes, I went to Mrs Mandela to lay a complaint - to tell her about the complaints of the boys.

MR VALLY: At this stage you say you did not know her well?

MS FALATI: Yes, I didn't know her well, that is ...[intervention]

MR VALLY: So if you did not know here well, why did you take this complaint to her?

MS FALATI: You know I went to Mrs Matsea - that's point number one, Mrs Matsea was one of the Mother's Union who usually came to the meetings ...[intervention]

MR VALLY: I'm aware of that.

MS FALATI: Yes, but then after that Mrs Matsea said to me

<UNKNOWN>: "Go and tell one of the leaders", so Mrs Mandela was the nearest leader - just one, two, three streets - two streets, the third street is Mrs Mandela, same Vilagazi Street.

MR VALLY: Was it the first time you had been to her place?

MS FALATI: No, because I went her place and that was 1987 when I asked for my daughter's schooling which Bishop Sinu Nqwane of the Anglican Bishop bought the clothes of my daughter because Bishop Sinu Nqwane of the Anglican Diocese is the South African Bishop of Johannesburg was buying or all the poor people or the destitute comrades.

MR VALLY: Miss Falati, you have given evidence at two trials.  At the trial of Jerry Richardson, you had stated that Stompie Sepei had informed you that Pelo Mekgwe, Thabiso Mono were sexually abusing him.

MS FALATI: I beg your pardon, can you come again?

MR VALLY: You said at the trial of Jerry Richardson that Stompie Sepei had informed you that he had been sexually abused by Pelo Mekgwe and Thabiso Mono.

MS FALATI: I didn't say he was sexually abused, I said

<UNKNOWN>: "Stompie Sepei cried in the middle of the night", he said he was being - when I asked him early in the morning he told me that

<UNKNOWN>: "Mama, Thabiso and Pelo and another boy Douglas ...[inaudible] that's what Stompie Sepei said and then that was when I was scolding the boys, Father Verryn came out from the bedroom telling me

<UNKNOWN>: "Xoliswa don't behave like a 14 year old - that is when he told me that there.

MR VALLY: The youngsters say that the only sources for allegations of sexual abuse was you.

MS FALATI: I was told by Katiza Tabeko, that's point number one and number two, I had to think that means even Stompie when he was - I thought Father Verryn was - after the complain from Katiza Tabeko, I thought that by the time Verryn was saying to me

<UNKNOWN>: "Don't behave like a 14 year old", he was actually covering up what he was actually doing to Katiza Tabeko - that was my thinking then.

MR VALLY: When Stompie was crying and you heard the complaint by the other two people, why didn't you report the other two people also like you reported allegations about Verryn?

MS FALATI: Report them to?

MR VALLY: Whoever you wanted to report it to.

MS FALATI: I have reported them to Mrs Mandela and that is why we were taken from Mrs Mandela's place ...[intervention]

MR VALLY: Why didn't you go to Reverend Verryn seniors?

MS FALATI: ...[indistinct]

MR VALLY: Why didn't you go to his senior members in the church.

MS FALATI: That was December time because I went to Bishop Semu Nkwane, the other person that I told you was Bishop Semu Nkwane.  I went to the East Rand to Bishop Semu Nkwane - he was staying in Benoni, I actually told the Bishop - after telling Mrs Mandela I told the Bishop and I told the Bishop that I have told Mrs Mandela.
 You know what the Bishop said, he said - he actually scold me, he said

<UNKNOWN>: "Xoliswa, you have shouldn't have told Mrs Mandela, don't you know that she reduces a person to nothing - she's going to reduce you into nothing one day" and each time when I was reduced by her ...[indistinct] that you've been told before because the people warned you, if a person warns you, you must watch out.

MR NTSEBEZA: I would say Mr Vally, you are the one who is leading her now.

MR VALLY: ...[inaudible] these are very serious issues. You've had your opportunity, you have been led so answer my questions directly please.
 Your allegations regarding Reverend Verryn came from Katiza Cebekhulu as you say, is that correct?

MS FALATI: Pardon?