Human Rights Violation Hearings — Krugersdorp — 1996-11-12

CHAIRPERSON: Motsisi Paulina Mamikie.  Hello, can you hear me clearly?  Can you hear me?  Good morning.

PAULINA MAMIKIE MOTSISI: Good morning to you too.

CHAIRPERSON: Who is accompanying you this?

PAULINA MAMIKIE MOTSISI: This is my mother.

CHAIRPERSON: We also welcome you, mam.  Dr Randera will help to take the oath.

PAULINA MAMIKIE MOTSISI: (Duly sworn in, states).

CHAIRPERSON: Yasmin Sooka is going to lead this witness.

YASMINE SOOKA: Hello Paulina, are you able to hear me properly?

PAULINA MAMIKIE MOTSISI: Yes, I hear clearly.

YASMINE SOOKA: You have come to tell us today about the story of your brother.  Before you tell us about him, will you give us a few details about yourself, how many members of your family there are and what your brother was doing at the time of his death.  Then you can tell us the story that you have come to tell.

PAULINA MAMIKIE MOTSISI: My name is Paulina Mamikie Motsisi.  I am staying in 5 58 Mohlakeng.  My mother had eight children.  My brother was the eldest.  He was my mother's first born, my brother.  Is that all.

YASMINE SOOKA: How old was he at the time?

PAULINA MAMIKIE MOTSISI: He was 26 years old at that time.

YASMINE SOOKA: You can carry on with your story then.
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PAULINA MAMIKIE MOTSISI: It was on the 18th of June 1976 when we heard about my brother's incident.  It was me and the whole family, including my mother, in the house.  Whilst we were there we saw Mzondile coming in who came to tell us that my brother has fallen around the corner.  We were listening to Mzondile because my brother was around in the yard, what time was this.  At that time it was at 12 o' clock.  At that time Mzondile when he came into my mother this, we decided to follow Mzondile to see where is Patrick.
 When we got to Gaphlo Street and Terbinara Street corner we found that he had fallen down there.  As he was lying there my mother approached.  My mother asked Mzondile as to what happened to him.  He said he was shot by white policemen who were travelling in a yellow Sierra.  We went into a nearby house and we saw that our brother was still lying down there around the corner.  When my mother tried to wake him up, only to find out that he was already dead.  There was a big hole behind his head.  
 After some time a big police van arrived and they asked my mother as to what is happening in the street.  My mother told them that I am also surprised because I have just been called from my house.  That is why I am sitting here.  One white man stood up and he pulled him by the leg and said to my mother, this child of yours was a stone thrower.  My mother wanted to know how could he be a stone thrower at his age.  These two white policemen told the black policemen that they must take my brother and throw him inside the van.  They did that.  They were holding him with his arms and legs and they threw him into the van.  We just sat there shocked.

YASMINE SOOKA: Thank you.  Are you able to carry on or would you like some water.
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PAULINA MAMIKIE MOTSISI: I will have some water.

YASMINE SOOKA: Do you want to tell us what happened then?

PAULINA MAMIKIE MOTSISI: After having taken him and thrown him in the van they drove away.  We were just sitting around there and we decided to leave.  After three days, it was on the 20th, a police motor car arrived at home and they knocked.  They asked my mother who was sleeping at the room, as to whether it was Patrick her son.  She said yes.  They just went away with a piece of paper.  They never came back till today.

YASMINE SOOKA: Thank you Paulina.  I am going to ask you a few questions just so that we can make sure that we understand your story properly.  This happened on the 18th of June 1976.  Is that right?

PAULINA MAMIKIE MOTSISI: That is true.

YASMINE SOOKA: Could you tell us, you mentioned in your evidence that your brother was 26 years old.  Was he employed or was he still at school?

PAULINA MAMIKIE MOTSISI: He was working and at that time he was on leave.

YASMINE SOOKA: Was he a member of any political party or a member of the UDF or any of the civic structures at the time?

PAULINA MAMIKIE MOTSISI: He was nothing, he did not take part in politics.  That day he was just on leave.

YASMINE SOOKA: Could you tell us a little bit about what was happening in Mohlakeng because we know that around the 16th of June there had been riots in Soweto.  Was this happening in Mohlakeng as well?

PAULINA MAMIKIE MOTSISI: At that time students were running away from school when police were chasing the students.  He was together with his friend called Mzondile and they were going KRUGERSDORP HEARING TRC/GAUTENG
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to the shop to buy cigarettes.  This incident met them when they were going to the shop and students were just all over the township and the police were chasing them.  It was at that time when the police were shooting and he was caught in the crossfire.

YASMINE SOOKA: You mention that when your mother was still sitting there with his body on the ground that two policemen came and they said that he was part of the group that had been throwing stones.  Do you think the policemen who spoke to her were the same ones who had shot him or were they different?

PAULINA MAMIKIE MOTSISI: I believe those policemen are responsible for the shooting of my brother because when they were talking to my mother they said what do you want here.  Then they were saying what is happening to the person who is lying here.  Then my mother said that is my son and they kicked my body.  When they looked where he was shot at the back of his head they said, it is then that they said your child was throwing stones.  Then my mother said how can he throw stones whilst he is a worker.  It is then that they took him to throw him in the van.

YASMINE SOOKA: When your mother saw the body, was his body lying facedown on the ground?

PAULINA MAMIKIE MOTSISI: You mean, when, he was facing up.  It seems he was lying on his side, but I am not sure what, we saw him, he was put straight and he was facing upwards.

YASMINE SOOKA: Were there other bodies next to his or was his alone there?

PAULINA MAMIKIE MOTSISI: He was the only one who was lying there.

YASMINE SOOKA: You mention that after these policemen visited the house on the 20th of June that you never heard anything KRUGERSDORP HEARING TRC/GAUTENG
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more.  Were you people never called to attend any court case or any inquest on this matter?

PAULINA MAMIKIE MOTSISI: We did not go there because we found out this other police were responsible.  Everything is in their hands.  That is why we waited for them to come.  They did not tell us that they are coming, that they will come back, but we waited for them to come.  It is then that we heard about the Truth Commission, we decided to come.

YASMINE SOOKA: Paulina, when your brother was buried, was he buried alone or was this part of a mass funeral?  Can you tell us a little bit about that?

PAULINA MAMIKIE MOTSISI: He was buried alone.

YASMINE SOOKA: Did any of the political organisations assist with the funeral?

PAULINA MAMIKIE MOTSISI: At that time the tribal people came and spoke with my mother and my father.  They did say they would come back and from there we did not see anybody coming to assist us.

YASMINE SOOKA: Your brother, was he the person who was supporting the household at the time?

PAULINA MAMIKIE MOTSISI: Yes, he was the person who was supporting us at home as he was the eldest one.

YASMINE SOOKA: Did he have any children of his own, was he married?

PAULINA MAMIKIE MOTSISI: He was not yet married at that time.

YASMINE SOOKA: And did he have any children that he was supporting or nothing?

PAULINA MAMIKIE MOTSISI: No, he did not have any children.

YASMINE SOOKA: Could you tell us how old you were at the time?