Amnesty Hearings — Pietermaritzburg — 1997-07-30

VINCENT POSWA: No, we were not free.  On the 12th I was at home.  I left at about half past three, going back to work.  When I arrived at home in Claremont where I stay, I got a call telling me that my brother's son has been shot.  I asked who shot him.  They said he was shot by Keswa Poswa.  On the following day, I could not go on that particular day, because it was late at night.  The following day myself and Armond Poswa and Vimba Poswa, we drove to Richmond.  We arrived in Richmond, we found my brothers sitting at the garage and I asked what happened.  They told us that the son has been shot and been taken to a mortuary.  Vimba Poswa and Fana Poswa, Armond Poswa left to Gengeshe.  Only the IFP people were left behind, Zimboeza and others.  They were trying to go and talk to them to find out the cause of his death, the reason why he was shot.
	They did not come with an acceptable answer. After that we went to the Richmond Magistrate and we told, reported the whole case.  No actions were taken by the magistrates.  On the 11th, it was Saturday, some helicopters came, there were three.  They searched our homestead.  I was present on that particular day.  It was a rainy day with some few showers.  They wanted to get into my house, they wanted to get with their shoes on.  I refused, because it was muddy.  However, they managed to get inside and search it.  They could not find anything in the homestead.  After that we talked to Mr Matthyson, even if I cannot pronounce his name very correctly or well.  His nickname was Kongolo.  
	He said when we were telling him about the burial of the, of our son he said he does not want Comrades and he is going to shoot any Comrade who is going to pass by his gate.  Therefore, we had to bury our son at Ndaleni graveyard.  This son I am talking about is my brother's son by the name of Spatelie Poswa.  We buried him at Ndaleni.  On Sunday, the following day, early in the morning, Kewe Umgoukwela and Tswetswe arrived.  They met our brothers at Richmond at Flower Garden.  They were coming to talk peace with us.  Indaba Zimboeza who was the one who was supposed to come and talk to them, unfortunately, he was not there. Therefore, we could not talk to those people, because the relevant person was not there.  They had to go back to collect the relevant person.  We stayed there until late.
	On the following day we waited, they did not come.  After that I, personally, visited Poswa and Armond Poswa and Timothy Poswa, who is an Induna or headman in that area.  We went to report the matter to the chief at Bulwa.  That was a chief on that area, of Gengeshe area.  We were trying to get him to come and reconcile the community.  After the chief have heard about this, that the Comrades are being killed, he said, he promised that he will come on Tuesday. He said we must wait for him at the Magistrate's offices.  We sat at the Magistrate's offices.  He did not come even up till today.  We talked to the chief himself, personally, with his secretary writing everything and we were at the offices in Shlanganana, Bulway.  
	After that we tried to go back to remove our belongings, possessions at home and then they started beating us or attacking us.  I managed to took out some clothes, furniture, wardrobe.  I could not carry my kitchen furniture.  Even my house, which I bought in 1990, at the cost of R35 000,00 was destroyed in that way.  That is what I can say.  What we, some things that we heard was that when people were leaving Gengeshe, they were told they must pay R500,00.  If they were trying to run away from Gengeshe, the IFP supporters said you have to pay R500,00 and then you can leave after paying it.  Number two Indian people died who were coming to remove people in that area.  They were coming to remove their property.  They died there with their lorry which was burnt.  If you are an ANC member you could not even leave the area that is Gengeshe.  Our children and everything were left behind.  That is all I can say.

MR WILLS: ... Chief Dlamini in Bulwa.

VINCENT POSWA: I am referring to the chief who was in charge, that is Chief Dlamini.  Even if I do not know his name he took over from his father by the name of Kosingdaba Dlamini.  This one was the one who was successor to Vusie Dlamini.

MR WILLS: Thank you.  Just looking at your own personal position, the inference of your evidence is to the effect that you also left Gengeshe on the, shortly after the 12th of the, of April 1992.  Is that correct?

VINCENT POSWA: The last time I slept at Gengeshe was the 11th.  The situation was bad.

MR WILLS: And what was, what happened to your property?

VINCENT POSWA: They took all my property, the IFP supporters.

MR WILLS: Thank you, no further questions.
NO FURTHER QUESTIONS BY MR WILLS

MOKOTEDI MPSHE: No questions, Mr Chairman, thank you.
NO QUESTIONS BY ADVOCATE MPSHE

ADV POTGIETER: Mr Poswa, where were you on the 26th of September when the incident that we heard about happened?

VINCENT POSWA: I was at work.

ADV POTGIETER: In Durban.

VINCENT POSWA: That is correct.

ADV POTGIETER: And at that stage, where were you staying?

VINCENT POSWA: I rented a place in Claremont.  I rented that place, because I was working in Durban.  So it was convenient for me to stay, to rent a place so that I could only stay there during the week and during the weekend I can go home.

ADV POTGIETER: Did you have any idea that this incident was going to happen or that your brothers, your family was going to try and go back to their homes that were, that they left behind in Gengeshe?

VINCENT POSWA: No, I did not have that idea, but I heard during the nine o' clock news on the radio that people have been killed at Gengeshe.

ADV POTGIETER: Thank you.

JUDGE WILSON: Thank you.

MR WILLS: That is the case for the applicants Mr Chairperson, committee members.
APPLICANTS'  CASE

JUDGE WILSON: Mr Mpshe.

MOKOTEDI MPSHE: Mr Chairperson, committee members, during the lunch break I had a very brief consultation with the victims who are herein present and there was an indication that one of them would like to say something, but I did not consult fully with them.  May I make a request for ten minutes break ...

JUDGE WILSON: Very well.

MOKOTEDI MPSHE: ... to consult and to lead him.

JUDGE WILSON: How many victims are there here now?

MOKOTEDI MPSHE: We have a total of three now.

JUDGE WILSON: One more has come.

MOKOTEDI MPSHE: Yes, Mr Chairperson.

JUDGE WILSON: Very well.  See if they wish to say or you can say or choose to make any remarks on their behalf, I think you could do so.  Find out what they would prefer.
COMMITTEE ADJOURNS

JUDGE WILSON: Right, Mr Mpshe.

MOKOTEDI MPSHE: Thank you Mr Chairman.  Mr Chairman, I am indebted to the Chair and the members of the committee.  Mr Chair, I call to the witness stand Sikilele Mthembu.  May he take an oath?

SISI KHAMPEPE: Mr Mthembu, may you please stand up so you may take an oath.  May you please furnish this committee with the full names.

ALFRED SIKILELE MTHEMBU: Alfred Sikilele Mthembu.
ADVOCATE MPSHE CALLS

ALFRED SIKILELE MTHEMBU: (Duly sworn in, states).

SISI KHAMPEPE: You may be seated.
EXAMINATION BY ADVOCATE MPSHE

MOKOTEDI MPSHE: Thank you Mr Chairman.  Mr Mthembu, one of your children, Dumisani Mthembu, was killed in the incident that led to this hearing today.

ALFRED SIKILELE MTHEMBU: That is correct.

MOKOTEDI MPSHE: And he is actually victim number eight on the list of victims, Mr Chairman and members of the committee.  Mr Mthembu, is it correct that you have been in contact with the family of the Poswa's?

ALFRED SIKILELE MTHEMBU: That is correct.

MOKOTEDI MPSHE: And that, in fact, the other members, victims who are here, herein present, belong to the Poswa family?

ALFRED SIKILELE MTHEMBU: That is correct.

JUDGE WILSON: Did you say eight, victim nine is it not?

MOKOTEDI MPSHE: Yes.

JUDGE WILSON: Count nine?