Amnesty Hearings — East London — 1998-04-07

MR MBANDAZAYO: Correct Mr Chairman.
ADV. GCABASHE: Now it proceeded on the basis of an application that had been filed?

MR MBANDAZAYO: Correct Mr Chairman which was filed on the date of hearing because the other one was lost which we are referring to.

MR LAX: Mr Prior, perhaps you could, through your good offices try - Mr Coetzee might have a copy of the letter of 15th September.  It's another way of trying to find the same thing.

MR PRIOR: Will do so Mr Chairman, thank you.
ADV. GCABASHE: Is it possible to get hold of, it might just assist us, Advocate Arendse, Mr Sisani and maybe Mr Paglele, just to sign short affidavits, that might assist us as well, if it possible for them just to fax something to you, confirming because they're the people you mention on page 24 and also in this affidavit as people who were there - if they are able to assist you.

MR MBANDAZAYO: Mr Chairman, I'll do my best to get hold of them Mr Chairman but Mr Chairman I want to also put on record that the mere fact that the St James one was also made on the day of the hearing, I think it was accepted on the part of the TRC that it was indeed filed, the initial application was indeed filed with the office of the TRC because the other applicants which were with him when he made those applications whilst Mr Arendse was there were found in the office and on that basis I think the TRC accepted it that indeed the applications were filed but nobody knows what happened with them because the other applicants which were with him in prison and who filed - who applied for amnesty together with him - and applying for the same incident St James but himself he was applying also for Golf Club because he was charged and also a bail application has to be made for Golf Club so he has to do them the same time at Cape Town where he was kept so on that score it was accepted by the TRC that the applications were filed because other applicants who were with him, their applications were found but Mr Chairman, as I indicated, I will do my best to get hold of Mr Sisani in Pretoria and Mr Mphaglele and Advocate Arendse if I manage to get them.  Thank you Mr Chairman.

CHAIRPERSON: ...[inaudible] regret that we should have to delay proceedings like this, this is a matter that should have been clarified weeks ago before this matter was set down for hearing.  You should not have to be troubling yourself now with trying to contact people while conducting a hearing and I regret that the TRC did not raise the queries that are quite obviously there before setting the matter down for hearing when they did not have an application for amnesty in respect of it.
	In the meantime let's proceed with the others.

MR MBANDAZAYO: Mr Chairman, I'm calling Malusi Morrison, Application AM5923/97.

MALUSI MORRISON: (sworn states)
EXAMINATION BY MR MBANDAZAYO

MR MBANDAZAYO: Mr Morrison do you confirm the contents of the affidavit which is before you.

MALUSI MORRISON: That is so.

CHAIRPERSON: That is the affidavit at page 46 of the papers.

MR MBANDAZAYO: Correct Mr Chairman, affidavit at page 46 but he has a copy Mr Chairman, I made a copy for him.
	Mr Morrison I'll take you to some other portions of your affidavit to enable to clarify this to the Committee.  Can we Mr Chairman go to paragraph 4 of his affidavit?  I will read the last sentence Mr Chairman.
"I was given these arms by Comrade Tumiso and asked me to deliver them to Comrade Thembelani Xundu in Tembasa and advised me of the road that I should take in order to be safe. I was given a car and money for petrol."
	Now can you for the enlightenment of the Committee tell me what department did you belong in APLA?

MALUSI MORRISON: Myself in APLA - I was at logistics dealing with guns and transport.

MR MBANDAZAYO: Are you telling the Committee that your duties within APLA Logistics Department was concerned with arms and transport.  Can you tell the Committee what you were doing with the arms and transport?

MALUSI MORRISON: Guns or weapons at logistics - all the things that are supporting the soldiers what were busy at logistics, weaponry and transport.  The transport was used to transport the weaponry and everything needed by the army soldiers upon the ground.

MR MBANDAZAYO: And now can you then tell the Committee regarding this incident which we are talking about in your affidavit that you were given these arms - can you take the Committee step by step what happened, what were you told in detail?  How were you approached as you indicated here by Comrade Tumiso?

MALUSI MORRISON: Comrade Ngoba told me that there are operations that are going to take place in the border region and that I am supposed to take weaponry to the border.  They are going to take Thembelani Xundu at Tembasa.

MR MBANDAZAYO: Whose car did you use to go to Tembasa?

MALUSI MORRISON: The car used to go to Tembasa as I said I was working with transport at logistics that had transport and other necessities of the army so I used an APLA vehicle.

MR MBANDAZAYO: Can you tell the Committee which route did you take to go to Tembasa?

MALUSI MORRISON: I moved from Umtata, used the road going to Queenstown.  Along the way there was a branch before you get to the first border gate at Transkei that time, it turns and goes to Cathcart, Stutterheim up to Tembasa.

MR MBANDAZAYO: Tell the Committee where did you meet Xundu?

MALUSI MORRISON: I met Xundu at a garage at the filling station at Tembasa at the road that goes under the bridge going to Tembasa.

MR MBANDAZAYO: And what happened when you met him at the garage?

MALUSI MORRISON: I passed the weaponry to Thembelani and he filled them in the bag that was there.  He took these guns to wherever they were necessary, I do not know where it was.

MR MBANDAZAYO: Now can you tell the Committee whether when you took the arms to Thembelani Xundu, did you know where are they going to be used?

MALUSI MORRISON: No I did not know what they were going to be used for but I what I knew what that they are going to be used that a fight was going to take place them being used.

MR MBANDAZAYO: Can you tell the Committee when did you become aware that arms were used in Golf Club?

MALUSI MORRISON: That those weapons were used at the Golf Club I got to know after the operations at King William's Town.  The King William's Town Golf Club was hit and I left the guns in the vicinity of King William's Town, that is Tembasa.

MR MBANDAZAYO: Now tell the Committee whether when you took the arms to Tembasa did you voluntarily do that or were you forced to do that?

MALUSI MORRISON: As I'm saying I was an APLA soldier so there was no compulsion that I must transport weapons because I joined APLA voluntarily.  So it was one of my duties voluntarily in order to free our nation.

MR MBANDAZAYO: Now after you have heard what happened after you left the arms in Tembasa that the Golf Club was attacked, what was your feeling, did you have a feeling that that was a wrong target or you were ...[inaudible] yourself at the Golf Club?

MALUSI MORRISON: As I've said already I was part of APLA so I had no qualms or any doubts or any criticism.  I favoured what happened at the Golf Club.

MR MBANDAZAYO: Now can you take the last paragraph, paragraph 6 of your affidavit, I would just like to read the quote you have made there and I want you to explain to the Committee.  I read it Mr Chairman.
	"In conclusion I want to quote the words of the founding President of PAC, Robert ....[inaudible] when he said, 'We do not hate the whites because they are white, we hate them because they oppress us.  Remove oppression, the hatred will go.  It is therefore plain dishonesty to say I hate the sjambok not the person who is yielding it."   Can you explain to the Committee what did you mean by that?