Human Rights Violation Hearings — Bloemfontein — UNKNOWN

MR LYSTER: So we thank you again very much for coming today, and we wishyou well. Thank you very much.

MR LYSTER: Thank you for coming in today, Mr Molatseli.Could you please put on the earphones which you see in front of you. Can youhear me? Are you able to hear me well enough?

UNKNOWN: I can hear you.

MR LYSTER: Thank you very much. You have come to ustoday from the Tweefontein area, where you live, which is near ... (intervention)

UNKNOWN: A little louder please.

MR LYSTER: Sorry, I'll speak a little louder. You'vecome to us today from Thaba Nchu, where you live, and you've come to tell usabout harassment, torture and detention which you suffered in 1978. Before yougive your evidence I'll ask you to stand to please take the oath. Could youstand up and take the oath. Is that better now? Can you hear me clearer now?Are you able to hear me? If the briefer can just indicate whether she can hearme. Okay. Could you please fit the earphones again, Mr Molatseli, and tell mewhether you can now hear me.

UNKNOWN: Yes, I can hear you.

MR LYSTER: That's good. Can you stand up please.

UNKNOWN: (Sworn, States)

MR LYSTER: Thank you, Mr Molatseli, you can sit down,and I am going to ask my colleague, Mr Dlamini, to assist you with your evidencetoday. Thank you, Mr Dlamini.

MR DLAMINI: Good afternoon, Mr Molatseli.

WITNESS: Good afternoon,Sir.

MR DLAMINI: Can I confirm if I've got the right person? The person thatwe are supposed to hear was born on the 18th of August 1914, and you look verymuch younger than that.

WITNESS: Yes, you are talking to me.

MR DLAMINI: Can I confirm that you are 82 years of age?

WITNESS: Yes, I am 82,but they've made a mistake, they've added three more years.

MR DLAMINI: Thank you. We really appreciate your presence here, and thetime that have accorded us, and ... (intervention)

MR DLAMINI: Can you repeat that, Sir?

WITNESS: We really appreciate your presencethis afternoon, and thank you very much for the time you have given us. CanI ask you to start by telling us about your family. Is Mrs Molatseli stillthere, and the children, what they are doing? --- Mrs Molatseli is still alive.My wife is still alive. I have two sons. Can I carry on?

MR DLAMINI: Yes, tell us more. We are interested.

WITNESS: I have two sons.The other one is in Transvaal. He is now married and he is a teacher at a school,in a high School at Sebokeng. And the other one was at Vista University, andhe completed his degree this year. He is now working.

MR DLAMINI: May I know again whether Mrs Molatseli is present here? ---She is not here, she is at home. She is at home, she is not here with us.

MR DLAMINI: Can you please convey our regards to her.

WITNESS: I will do so,Sir.

MR DLAMINI: Thank you. Can I now get into the incident that took placein 1978, which is one of the sad and unfortunate parts of the past history ofour country, where at your age you were harassed the manner you were. Wouldyou please tell us what happened and what were the reasons for the experiencethat you incurred on that particular day?

WITNESS: Please bear with me. I am a bitdeaf. A policeman that I have indicated in my statement injured my ears and I cannot hear perfectly well. Do you hearme, because I can't hear myself?

MR DLAMINI: Yes, I can hear you.

WITNESS: I think you heard me when I told youthat my ears are a bit affected now. It was early in the morning in April in1978 and I was on my way. Just before the sun could rise I was on my way toschool, and I heard a knock at my door. When I opened the door I discoveredthat it was two policemen, and they pushed themselves into the room that I wasstaying in at Selosesha. I was a principal at a place called Kroondraai. Thepeople that are at Botshabelo presently were first living in Kroondraai. I hada few teachers assisting me. Those were the people who sacrificed a lot. I wasstaying in Selosesha and I had a small room. My original home is far. It's about40 miles from Tweefontein to that place. Now, every morning I would be preparingmyself to go to school. On that particular morning the police came in and theywanted my identity document. I gave them and they started searching the house,and they found a book called, "Up from Slavery," that was written by T Washington,who was a principal at Etuski College(?). They took that book and they said,"Get out of this house because you are a terrorist. You are teaching at a Kroondraaischool. What are you teaching those children? Are you teaching them terrorism?"And they were behind me, coming - you know, pushing me, and they pushed me intoa big lorry that was parked there. I found many people in that truck, and theytook me to Selosesha Charge Office. I was accompanied by one policeman to thecharge office, and he said to the other policemen there, "This is a person whohas been

MR DLAMINI: /"teaching