Special Hearings — Chemical And Biological Warfare Hearings — 1998-06-08

CHAIRPERSON: We are about to resume ladies and gentlemen.  I believe Mr Vally is on his way but perhaps we - well, I believe Mr Chaskalson is going to be Mr Hanif Vally for purposes of this afternoon.   Do you want to place yourself on the record Mr Chaskalson?

MR CHASKALSON: My name is Jerome Chaskalson and I will be leading the evidence on behalf of the Commission this afternoon.

CHAIRPERSON: Yes.  There are other legal personalities that I think need to place themselves on the record.

MR VISAGIE: My name is Deon Visagie.  I am here on behalf Mr Brian Currin who is the attorney for Jan Lourens.

CHAIRPERSON: Can I get that name again?

MR VISAGIE: Sorry.  Deon Visagie, Mallinicks Attorneys.

CHAIRPERSON: Okay.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Chairperson, good afternoon.  Norman Arendse, Cape Bar on the instructions of the State Attorney.  Finkhuizen has been standing in for me.  I'm representing the Department of Foreign Affairs, thank you.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you Mr Arendse and thank you Mr Visagie.
 Mr Chaskalson?

MR CHASKALSON: Thank you.  Our next witness will be Doctor Schalk van Rensburg.

CHAIRPERSON: Doctor Schalk van Rensburg, welcome.  We are pleased that you have been able to come.
 I take it Mr Polsen that you represent ...[intervention]

MR POLSEN: I once again act for Doctor van Rensburg Mr Chairman.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very much.
 Before you testify Doctor van Rensburg, I'll ask Advocate Potgieter to swear you in.

UNKNOWN: Doctor, just your full names for the record please.  Full names for the record.

SCHALK JANSE VAN RENSBURG: My full names are Schalk Janse van Rensburg.

UNKNOWN: Do you have any objection to taking the oath?

SCHALK JANSE VAN RENSBURG: (sworn states)

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you Doctor van Rensburg.  May I just indicate to you that you are free to express yourself in the language you are most comfortable with.

DR VAN RENSBURG: Thank you, I'm most comfortable in English.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very much Sir.  But for the audience, those people who would rather listen in to the Afrikaans, it is on Channel 1.  Thank you very much.
 Mr Chaskalson?

MR CHASKALSON: Good afternoon Doctor van Rensburg.  Could you please indicate for us your background and qualifications prior to 1984 please?

DR VAN RENSBURG: I qualified as a Veterinarian in 1957.  I worked with the Department of Agriculture for 11 years, specialising particularly in animal reproduction studies.  I gained the degree of Doctor of Veterinary Science.  After problems with the Department of Agriculture at the time due to my unacceptability in the political atmosphere at the time, I was worked out by the Broederbond.
 I then went on to the Medical Research Council and had 15/16 wonderful years there working exclusively on the causes of diseases amongst our rural underprivileged people.  Later the research funds and so on were diminishing for basic studies like we were doing and I then joined Roodeplaat.

MR CHASKALSON: Could you tell me who approached you to join Roodeplaat?

DR VAN RENSBURG: Initially there were visits by Doctor Basson to our Nutritional Diseases Institute here in Cape Town at the Medical Research Council.  Doctor Basson had certain problems that he discussed with me and a lot of my research group.
 These problems were, firstly as we now know there was apparently a threat of Chemical Biological or some Chemical Biological capability, acquired by some of our neighbouring states, Angola  and Mozambique in particular.  They had go technology via Cuba from the Russians.  We knew the Russians were working on a new generation of chemical weapons based on fungal toxins, the mica toxins and the one most promising product was Yellow Rain of course which is actually a fungus toxin from the Fezerium group.
 Now my research group were already experts in this field.  Minute amounts of these same toxins that were used for warfare sometimes occur in food and they can cause fatal human disease, so we were researching this intensively.  We'd even had laboratory accidents with exposure to these Tricotasines as we call them in this country, Tricothekenes they call them in America, extremely irritant compounds.
 Now according to Doctor Basson and others, the intelligence was that the testing had been done in Afghanistan, had been done in Cambodia.  Those conflicts were sort of ending and they were expecting tests to be done with these fungal toxin weapons in Angola.  So that's immediately how we initially made contact.
 He also had problems, and he sketched very credible incidents of which I don't doubt are true, of covert exposure to border troops and some incidents where they could not determine what the cause was.  People on patrol were definitely exposed to toxic substances but they could never find out what and it did cause occasional deaths.
 So really to investigate these things you need a good laboratory backup, so he approached us.  We were very keen to do any contract work even at the MRC then because funds were becoming very short for basic research.  So we discussed it with him and he went back and they did a security check apparently on the Medical Research Council.  The message was, there are known communists on the Board of the Medical Research Council so they can't do work with us and from that it seems they decided to establish their own group.
 I'd refused the first two approaches.  Ultimately Doctor Daan Goosen flew down to Cape Town, sketched a very attractive plan for a Contract Research Laboratory.  I knew, and he was open about it, it was a military front company initially.  The plan was to ultimately privatise it.  We assumed it would remain the property of the government but operate as a private company doing contract research.
 I'd had immense respect for Doctor Daan Goosen.  I was a great admirer of his achievements.  We both had similar good reputations internationally in the Laboratory Animal Science field.  Apart from that I had the research reputation.  My work is still quoted standard in many medical text books overseas.  It's still quoted by even Nobel prize winners in reviews.  So I had the scientific credibility to help build up the contract research. 
 When I talk about contract research I mean private research, genuine research, particularly to the pharmaceutical industry but also various other industries.  Then of course part of it would be the confidential work for Doctor Basson centred on these requirements I've outlined.

MR CHASKALSON: Doctor van Rensburg, can you put a date to when you joined RRL?

DR VAN RENSBURG: I started at RRL on the 1st of August 1984.

MR CHASKALSON: And can you explain the structure that existed at the stage that you joined?

DR VAN RENSBURG: When I arrived I was the third Director.  We had a Managing Director, Doctor Daan Goosen, we had the Research and Development Director, Andre Immelmann.  There was the Administrative Director, Doctor David Sparmer, Mr David Sparmer and then myself,  I was appointed as Director of Laboratory Services.  It was my job to establish laboratories, to help equip them, to appoint the right staff, work out the optimal structures for our purposes and so forth.

MR CHASKALSON: You mentioned earlier that you were there to do commercial projects, was it your understanding that there would be other projects that were not of a commercial nature?