Human Rights Violation Hearings — Durban — 1996-10-25

WITNESS:   My detention was directly related to the sabotage, in fact it wasn't until after my release 18 months later that more members of the communist party in Cape Town were arrested and my name was found.  I mentioned Fred Khanisan, who was then I believe on the central committee and had been responsible for recruiting me, he was kept awake, not allowed to sleep for a week, and was I think eventually put into an oxygen tent to save his life.   A list was found with my name on it.  I was then flown back, I was in East London at the time where my parents were living,   I was flown back to Com... (inaudible) ... Building in Pretoria, and seen again by H J van den Berg, the head of security, and asked about my membership.   I denied it.   I remained a member, an active member in exile as well throughout those years until I think my most recent count was in 1991.   And I must salute the party for having taught me about courage and about how to be a human being in this society.

MS H MKHIZE: As you are aware that our special focus today is on gender specific forms of humiliation, having gone through the prison, the detentions in this country, do you think you were treated any better than other women of colour who were with you, charged with similar practices?

WITNESS: Certainly. There is no question about that, that it was unusual the reason why my case perhaps was even resolved by getting a payout from the State, was that it was unusual, that it made front page headlines, it made international headlines, because I was hit. As we all know this was common place for black women in this country.

MS H MKHIZE: You have kept on referring to the Dutch Reformed Church, then the Nationalist Party, the Broederbond, and I am sure you are away as the truth commission that we are charged with the most difficult task to assist the people of South Africa to move towards reconciliation and healing.  On the other hand we have the victims, on the other hand we have the alleged and in some instances now the identified perpetrators.   And as you can see, the whole predominantly black, what is your suggestion in terms of moving towards national reconciliation.

WITNESS:  Without question reconciliation is necessary for the survival of our country.   And I think if it wasn't for our president, it would have perhaps been harder for me and many people like me, to even contemplate the possibility of reconciliation.   I think I feel particularly bitter because once I came back into the country I found that it did matter to me that I wanted my culture back.  I did feel - I do feel very bitter and angry that these people took my language, they took my being, and they turned it into this machine, and I have no doubt that the cultural aspect of what happened in this country was what - it was the springboard for the murderous behaviour of people like Eugene de Kok.  I have no doubt about this.   And I also know that there is an Afrikaner that to "belei", the Afrikaans term "beleindenis" is a term that is well understood.   And what De Klerk did after the acquittal of the generals around the KwaMakhuta massacre, to almost blame the victims for their own suffering, is unforgivable.   It reminded me of one of my lawyers who warned me that when I was beaten up that the police would say it is your fault, you attacked us, your eye jumped up and hit our poor policemen's fist.   It is turning the whole thing upside down.   There is no question to me that systemically the Broederbond, the Dutch Reformed Church, and the National Party, prepared the way, nurtured the culture that led to the suffering that we have heard from the truth commission - within the truth commission.

MS H MKHIZE: Thank you very much for your resilience.   I will ask our chair, Jasmine Sooka, to take over.

CHAIRPERSON: Question?   Stephanie, I think that day by day through the last nine months we have heard stories of horror, and particularly in the last week, the video that we have seen on Prime Evil, the testimony that is coming through the amnesty applications, fills one with a sense of horror, but in all of that when we hear testimony from people like yourself, you are saddened by the fact that so few people were able to make the choice of going a different way, people like John Harris, yourself, Braam Fisher, Llewellen, all made a different choice, and they all lived in the same country, and I think part of the struggle in this country is to find the solution to what gives people the ability to make those choices.   Because that is going to make the difference to salvaging this nation, because some times reconciliation seems to be very cheap, and the price is often the cost of the victims, and I think that what we are really struggling with is what you have said in your last few remarks.   That we need for people to say more than it was a mistake.   We need for them to really come forward and repent, because only in that repentance will the rest of us be able to find some kind of solace that the reconciliation on which we are building this country will not be a cheap one.  Thank you for coming forward and for sharing your testimony.  I think for many of us who have heard your story before, you have always been a shining example.  We do salute your courage in coming forward.   Thank you.

WITNESS:   Thank you.

CHAIRPERSON: /PHYLLIS NAIDOO

CHAIRPERSON: PHYLLIS NAIDOO

CHAIRPERSON: ---  Who is going to lead me?

CHAIRPERSON: Nobody will lead you specifically, but we will just ask you to do it in the same way that the lady this morning and Nosiswe did as well.

WITNESS:   Okay.   I wanted to taper my account to fit in with the Truth and Reconciliation Act, to start from 1960, my political life goes long before that.   So, I have started as early as 1960 and told you that we were ordered, if detained, not to make statements.   I mean everybody said, if you are picked up, don't say a word, right.   And we had merely to give our names and addresses, but nothing else.   That soon changed with people like Stephanie Kemp, but it changed a little earlier, when we were faced with the torture, Indress Naidoo had been strung up in a bag, and beaten out of his mind and he had been shot in his arm.  And then we knew they were very serious.   So, people hadn't started to die by then in detention, but we knew that they were going to break us.  So, we altered it.  Say what needs to be said, no more.  Right.   Supposing they wanted to know were you at that meeting, confirm it, you know, don't keep saying, no, because then your body gets it.   Now, the evidence of Stephanie Kemp and her successful prosecution of her tortures left us in little doubt that force, violence, was going to be used.   Violet Wynberg, she is late now, spoke of her detention, and was one of the horrors of our life at that time, to see Violet, this elderly person, with her shoes covered with her swollen feet ... (inaudible) ...

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