Amnesty Hearings — East London — 1999-06-17

MS COLLETT: Because my instructions are that him and his bodyguards inter alia Luwana were en route to the Police College because they found out that the wife and child were there at the Police College?

PUMULELA ARCHIBOL LONI: No, they did not tell you the truth, because I was present when we got in there.  When we arrived in that guard post, they were sitting inside with soldiers and Police and his bodyguards, three of his bodyguards.

MS COLLETT: Did you disarm the bodyguards?

PUMULELA ARCHIBOL LONI: Yes, that is correct.  I remember because we had to take their firearms.

MS COLLETT: Why?

PUMULELA ARCHIBOL LONI: We did not want anyone to be aggressive on that particular day.

MS COLLETT: You did not regard yourselves as being aggressive, forcing people to go where they didn't want to be?

PUMULELA ARCHIBOL LONI: We just wanted everyone to get a message, to know where we were, so that there should be no bloodshed, everything should go according to a plan.

MS COLLETT: Is it not correct that statements were released to the media by the Police at the hall on that evening?

INTERPRETER: Can you please repeat the question, Ma'am?

MS COLLETT: Is it not correct that statements were released by the Police, the role players at the hall that evening, to the media?

PUMULELA ARCHIBOL LONI: I was not inside the hall, so I don't know what was happening inside.

MS COLLETT: You see, I want to put it to you that there were such statements released to the media and that if any Policeman who didn't know about the meeting, wanted to know about it or wanted to go there, they could have gone there voluntarily and associated themselves with you people.

PUMULELA ARCHIBOL LONI: I don't know anything about these statements.

MS COLLETT: If the Commission would bear with me.  Is it correct that you didn't know about the plan for Gqozo to stand down?

PUMULELA ARCHIBOL LONI: I heard that when I arrived at the College.

MS COLLETT: But prior to that you had no knowledge about that?

PUMULELA ARCHIBOL LONI: No, I didn't have any knowledge about that before I arrived at the College.

MS COLLETT: Okay.  Who gave you the information when you got to the College?

PUMULELA ARCHIBOL LONI: It was Inspector Mfene and Peteni, Inspector Peteni.

MS COLLETT: What did they say to you?

PUMULELA ARCHIBOL LONI: They said that that meeting was concerned or it was, there was a meeting because they wanted Gqozo to be removed so that we can have free elections in the Ciskei.

MS COLLETT: Were you concerned about your pension payout at all?

PUMULELA ARCHIBOL LONI: No, I wasn't concerned about the pensions.

MS COLLETT: Were you concerned about your future deployment in the South African Police Force?

PUMULELA ARCHIBOL LONI: I am still even concerned today  about my future at the Police Force.

MS COLLETT: Because you see I put it to you that those were the reasons that Nqoya was allegedly sent to Gqozo to go and get answers to earlier that morning.

PUMULELA ARCHIBOL LONI: I don't know about that, that is news to me.  What I know is that we wanted Gqozo to resign from his position.

MS COLLETT: Thank you, I have no further questions.
NO FURTHER QUESTIONS BY MS COLLETT

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you Ms Collett.  Mr Mapoma, any questions?

MR MAPOMA: No questions.
NO CROSS-EXAMINATION BY MR MAPOMA

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you Mr Mapoma.  Does the Panel have any questions?

ADV BOSMAN: No questions, thank you Chairperson.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you.  Any re-examination?

MR OBOSE: None, thank you Chairperson.
NO RE-EXAMINATION BY MR OBOSE

CHAIRPERSON: Mr Loni, you are excused.
WITNESS EXCUSED