Amnesty Hearings — Cape Town — 1997-10-28

CHAIRPERSON: You may call the next applicant.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Mr Madasi?
	Mr Chairman you got prepared statements in front of you, there is a material change to that statement and I will deal with it when I read it back to Mr Madasi.  I've also made available settled copies of Gqomfa's affidavit of yesterday and also the Mabala's one that will be dealt with today.

CHAIRPERSON: Yesterday's affidavit was before us yesterday, I've got that thank you very much.

NORMAN ARENDSE: The settled one of this morning.

CHAIRPERSON: Yes, that's right.  And now the Madasi one is being placed before me.  Are you calling him now?

NORMAN ARENDSE: I'm calling Mr Madasi Mr Chairman, and then I'm just pointing out at the outset that there will be a material amendment to this statement.  Obviously it's unsigned and I'll deal with it now under oath.

CHAIRPERSON: Very well, go ahead.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Can Mr Madasi be sworn in Mr Chairman?

VUYISILE LEBRAN MADASI: (sworn states)

CHAIRPERSON: Please proceed.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Thank you.  Mr Madasi, I'm reading back to you a written statement which you haven't signed, I'd like you to confirm the contents thereof whilst you are under oath.  It reads as follows
"I am an applicant in this matter and I am 26 years old.  The facts to which I depose are true and correct and within my personal knowledge unless the context states otherwise.  I went to school and passed standard four.  I joined the PAC in 1988 through AZANYO and I joined APLA in 1992 while I was in the Transkei.
	I also underwent military training in the Transkei under one Mzala.  I was involved in three APLA operations before the Heidelberg Tavern attack.  The first one was in the Eastern Cape in approximately March 1993 and the other two were at the Nyanga East and Lingelethu West stations which have been referred to by Humphrey Luyanda Gqomfa in his affidavit.
	The affidavit of Gqomfa has been read to me, I understand the contents and I confirm it insofar as it relates to me and I respectfully request that it be incorporated in this affidavit.  With regard to the first operation, we had received our instructions from Leshlapa Mfashlele but the Cape Town operations including the Heidelberg Tavern operation, we received our instructions initially from Nonuba and subsequently from Gqomfa who was the commander of our unit.
The first time I was told of which targets we were to hit was on the day the operation took place".  
	Now Mr Chairman, the material and very critical and important amendments relate to paragraph 7, so I just want to ask Mr Madasi to relate to the Committee, his role in the Heidelberg Tavern attack.
	Mr Madasi, according to your comrade Luyanda Gqomfa, you were - your job was to fire the rifle grenade as a withdrawal signal, do you remember that?

VUYISILE LEBRAN MADASI: Yes, I can remember that.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Now on the night of the attack, is that what you did, in other words to only fire the rifle grenade?

VUYISILE LEBRAN MADASI: No, I didn't do that only.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Can you tell us then what else you did and why you did it?

VUYISILE LEBRAN MADASI: I went inside the tavern because I could see that there was someone who was doing some movement inside the tavern, so I took an initiative to protect our unit as a whole.  I decided to right inside the tavern and I went inside and I started shooting until all the bullets were finished.
	After finishing that I took another magazine - there was a bank so that I could launch, I could use it to launch the rifle grenade and then I launched the rifle grenade as the withdrawal sign.  Seeing that this rifle grenade couldn't explode I asked the other comrades to withdraw, the last person to get into the car was Luyanda - that's the role that I played during the attack.

NORMAN ARENDSE: While you were inside the tavern, what did you fire with?  What weapon did you use?

VUYISILE LEBRAN MADASI: I had an R4 rifle.

NORMAN ARENDSE: And as I understand it or you can tell me if I'm understanding you correctly, that same R4 rifle was then also used to launch the grenade, is that correct?

VUYISILE LEBRAN MADASI: Yes, that's correct Sir, but the other magazine had a blank, the one that I was supposed to use to launch this rifle grenade and I did so after shooting - after finishing the whole magazine.

VUYISILE LEBRAN MADASI: We know now that the grenade failed to explode, we know that, is that right?

VUYISILE LEBRAN MADASI: Yes, that's correct.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Have you got an explanation why it didn't explode or failed to explode?

VUYISILE LEBRAN MADASI: No, I have no explanation because I launched it, I don't know why it did not explode.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Do you still have the photographs there in front of you?  Mr Madasi, I think you ...[intervention}

VUYISILE LEBRAN MADASI: No, Sir.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Can a seat be made available to the witness please?

CHAIRPERSON: Yes.

CHAIRPERSON: Mr Prior just - these photographs have been handed in, they've not been numbered.  They'll be handed in as Exhibit A and the sketch plan will be Exhibit B.

NORMAN ARENDSE: As the Chairman please.

CHAIRPERSON: Yes, please do carry on.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Thank you.

CHAIRPERSON: You have before you, the photographs?

VUYISILE LEBRAN MADASI: Yes, I have then.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Can you look at the first set of photographs on page 1.

VUYISILE LEBRAN MADASI: I'm looking at them Sir.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Can you indicate to us where you entered?

VUYISILE LEBRAN MADASI: There are two doors here, I entered in the one opened - on the left one.

NORMAN ARENDSE: According to the sketch plan which is Exhibit B, as you enter that door which is open there - do you see that?

VUYISILE LEBRAN MADASI: I don't have a sketch in front of me Sir.

JUDGE WILSON: The second photograph shows what you see when you open the door - go through that door, doesn't it?

NORMAN ARENDSE: I wanted to ask him that Mr Chairman.

JUDGE WILSON: Sorry.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Now as you - if you look at the second photograph on page 1, - as you enter that door, is that wall there with the panelling, do you see that? Would that be on your right or on your left as you enter the door?

VUYISILE LEBRAN MADASI: There are walls on the left and the right-hand side, the one I can see when you go in is the one on the right.

NORMAN ARENDSE: You referring to the second photograph on page 1 of the photos?

VUYISILE LEBRAN MADASI: That's correct, Sir.

NORMAN ARENDSE: So where would the - if you look at the photos on page 2 at the bottom, the second photographs on page 2 where you see the benches and one of the deceased or two of them sorry, and the raised area there - the raised platform area and if you see it again on page 3, the second photograph and one sees it again on page 4, where would that area have been as you entered the tavern?

VUYISILE LEBRAN MADASI: The wall on my right at the tavern, it goes on until there's a door - something like a door that leads you to where the benches were where the victims were sitting but the door that you entered in is not too far from that.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Where were your other comrades positioned?  Can you remember where they were positioned?

VUYISILE LEBRAN MADASI: I remember comrade Luyanda and comrade Jantjie clearly, they were standing by the double door.  The other comrades were standing at the car, Comrade Maxeba was at the car as a driver.

NORMAN ARENDSE: And on the photograph on page 1 the first one, you refer there to those - where you saw Gqomfa and Jantjie, are those the double doors there?  Where they there?

VUYISILE LEBRAN MADASI: Yes, that's the door.

NORMAN ARENDSE: And you saw them there as you entered.

VUYISILE LEBRAN MADASI: When I was entering they were standing by the double doors.

NORMAN ARENDSE: And when you saw them there were they standing there, were they shooting?  What were they doing?

VUYISILE LEBRAN MADASI: They were shooting Sir.