Human Rights Violation Hearings — Bloemfontein — 1996-07-04

WITNESS: He stayed in Bloemfontein. We stayed there with the otherComrades. We also had female Comrades. We were all wanted. We stayed with mygrandfather. We could only go during the night or in the evening. During theday we had to stay inside. He used to run up and down getting us food and whateverwe needed, because we couldn't get out because we were still being hunted bythe police. We were hunted until the 6th of April 1986. It was approximately1.00 am in the morning when the kombis came. They took us into the kombi.We drove in the kombi and we got to Ladybrand. When we got to Ladybrand we gotinto the farms in Ladybrand. My grandfather is the only one who knew the Lesothoroute. As we were travelling we saw poles and we realised that we were towardsa soldiers' camp. And the soldiers sort of dispersed and they allowed us toget some space to move. We moved in between them. It was late at night, it was2.00 am in the morning. Others were able to run away, but I was amongst theones who were arrested. Some of the Comrades came in the morning. We stayedthere. We started to plan that we were going to pretend that we were a religiousgroup. We told them we were a religious group, we came by church or we had somechurch affiliation, until the soldiers took us to the soldiers' camp in Ladybrand.That's where we were assaulted. They even changed our names. They told us differentnames that we should address ourselves in. As we were still in there they kepton calling us into certain rooms. We kept on being assaulted. You would just feel somebody kicking you,you wouldn't even know who was kicking you. Thereafter they called the LadybrandSpecial Branch. When the Special Branch came they took us to the soldiers' camp.From the soldiers' camp they took us to the police station. It was then in theafternoon. It was a Monday on the 6th. We sat there up til they transferredus to Bloemfontein. When we got to Bloemfontein they took us to Ramkraal. Theyalso took us to the Fountain Police Station. It was black policemen as wellas white policemen. They put us into a certain room. When we got into that roomthey took me and Jewel Makubalo out. Jewel was my co-accused. They were accusingboth of us. Then they took us to separate rooms. That's where they started torturingus, assaulting us, violating us. They wanted Steve. They wanted to know fromme where Steve was. I told them that I didn't know where Steve was. Then theyasked me where was I going, because they arrested me during the day and I hadtold them that I didn't know anything. They closed us there and they kept onassaulting us until they told us that I was - they told us that I was the onewho was involved more than the others because I knew where Steve was. So theysort of separated us. They charged the other ones with terrorism. On the WednesdayI was assaulted, I couldn't see, my eyes were swollen shut, and two policemenfrom the location came. The other one is Tsilwani, the other one I have forgottenwhat his name is. They asked me where are the other ones. I told them that wewere very scattered, we were at different places. The person who was killedwas the person that we were staying with. His name was George Musi. I said I didn't know anything about anyone who had died.Even my family wanted to see me, but the police had hidden me. Nobody couldsee me until my mother came to see me. She asked me whether I had killed mygrandfather. I denied that. She told me that according to gossip I had killedmy grandfather. I said I don't know anything about that. The murder case neverwent forth. The other cases of terrorism and the rest went forth. Mr Blakeyand Mr Foreman accused me and Ober. The policemen turned all the othercorps Comrades into State witnesses so that they can testify against us. Whenthey got into court they could not go further with the testimony because theysaid it was forged. Then it was a whole lot of confusion. We were in and outof court with the fabricated statements and testimony. The person whom theysaid I had killed was suspected of having killed my grandfather. There was gossipthat I and my friend had killed my grandfather, but according to our knowledgewe left him intact when we went away. From there the case started until it gotto an end. When it went to the end Mr Soman(?) took me to my uncle because mylife wasn't safe in Butsabelo. So I went to my uncle. My uncle was a traditionalhealer so he wasn't staying at home, he used to go in and out of the place.I went back to my mother, and her life wasn't quite well because they used tochase her also. I didn't know what I would do because the police would stillcome searching for me. They wanted to get Steve. They always wanted Steve fromme. Thereafter I went and enlisted some help from the Comrades, only to findthere were no Comrades. All the Comrades that I knew I had lost contact with.Now I was constantly assaulted until my uncle stood up.  Thereafter they continued coming, they continued harassingmy mother. At times they would come and search the place, saying they were lookingfor weapons, they were looking for guns, and I would tell them there were noguns there. Even at night they would just come. I would just be taken to anoffice. Even if I hadn't done anything they would just put me in that officewithout eating, without doing anything, just sitting. Thereafter they wouldjust chase me away and say I must go, so they did that continuously quite severaltimes. The policemen that I can remember it was Captain du Plooy, it was NickSwanepoel, it was Lieutenant Terblanche, du Plessis. They were the people whokept on harassing me day in and day out. Even when I got arrested I went toa mental hospital. That mental hospital was in Orange. I stayed for one monthin Orange and I kept on seeing these people who were harassing me. There wasanother nursing staff nurse. At some stage I saw Swanepoel and Mafisa, and thestaff nurse told me that I was wanted, so they tried to change my room. Thatis where I was admitted. I was taken and put into another room because she hadtold me that they would come looking for me. I went to Thaba Nchu. They fetchedme from Thaba Nchu and brought me back. That's where I'll end.

UNKNOWN: Thank you very much. There are a few questions which I'd liketo ask to make sure I understand your story. First, just to help me, what wasthe name of your grandfather?

WITNESS: His name was George Musi.

UNKNOWN: Thank you. Now in 1986, when you and your fellow Comrades triedto leave the country, how old were you then?

WITNESS: I was 26.

UNKNOWN: Now, you mentioned that you were first picked up by the soldiers and you were in a soldiers' camp, and then theSpecial Branch came and they took to you a police station in Ladybrand, andthen on to - back to Bloemfontein. That's right? And where you were badly assaultedin the camp, but also at the Fountain. Now, you were charged, were you, underthe Terrorism Act? Were you ever found guilty, or were you acquitted, or whathappened?

WITNESS: The police were looking for the Comrades. The Comrades when theygot to court they never testified according to what they told the police, orin accordance with what they told the police.

UNKNOWN: (Inaudible) ... what happened at the end of the trial? Wereyou just dismissed, or did you spend time in gaol? What happened?

WITNESS: The casejust ended there and they just released us. As we were free we continued beingharassed despite that the case just ended there.

UNKNOWN: But you were badly harassed, but you were never put back intogaol?

WITNESS: After we had finished in court we were taken - I was taken to my place.I never went back to prison. I was taken to Rockland.