Amnesty Hearings — East London — 1998-10-14

CHAIRPERSON: ...[inaudible] and I'm going to ask my colleagues to similarly announce themselves.

ADV DE JAGER: Chris de Jager.

ADV SANDI: Ntsikilelo Sandi.

CHAIRPERSON: As well as the representatives.

MR MAPOMA: Chairperson, I'm Zuko Mapoma, the Leader of Evidence.

MS COLLETT: Mr Chairperson, I'm Sally Collett representing the applicant in this matter.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you, Ms Collet.  Miss Collet, before we proceed, we had an opportunity to peruse the bundle of papers.  None of us are absolutely clear as to which part of the Act the applicant relies on for his application, can you perhaps enlighten us?

MS COLLETT: Mr Chairperson, this is somewhat of an unusual case.  The applicant relies on the fact that he was a headman that was appointed by the then Gozo Government and he claims that the act that he committed was as a result of political pressure of the previous Ciskei Government, by virtue of his position as such.

CHAIRPERSON: Now if you look at Section 20(2), there is a number of sub-sections to that sub-section, under which would you argue this application?  We think that it could possibly be argued that it falls under (2)(b) of Section 20 but even that gives us a few problems in terms of what is contained in the application.  We can't see it falling under any other category.

MS COLLETT: Mr Chairperson, as I've said to you, the applicant is relying on, is stating that this was politically motivated in the sense that the persons who were killed by him, at the end of the day were members of the ANC party and people whom he feared, well he feared for his life with regard to the ANC faction because they were opposed to the headman system.  Maybe it ...[intervention]

CHAIRPERSON: Carry on.

MS COLLETT: Maybe it will become more apparent when I'm leading his evidence as to exactly ...[inaudible]

ADV DE JAGER: Was he an employee of the State?

MS COLLETT: Yes, Mr de Jager, he was a headman appointed by the Gozo regime.

ADV DE JAGER: And being paid by the regime?

MS COLLETT: Yes, they did receive remuneration.

CHAIRPERSON: Now Miss Collett, on page 1 of his application form - you say that he committed these acts that he admits to, in his capacity as a headman.  Now the form that is completed by applicants normally requests very briefly whether the applicant was an office bearer or member or supporter of any political organisation.
	It must be understood, I'm sure you will agree, referring to the capacity in which the actions for which amnesty is applied for was committed and actually what hat he was wearing at the time.  Now here he says he was a field worker, he was acting as a field worker of the Pan Africanist Congress.  Now from my experience in this type of matter, one would be quite surprised if he was a headman, acting as such, and yet a member of the Pan Africanist Congress at the same time.

MS COLLETT: Mr Chairman, the form was filled in without the assistance of a legal representative.  That is the first thing I would like to point out.  The second thing is that the headmen that were appointed under the Gozo regime were appointed by the community, by the community electing them as suitable persons and then their appointment as such was ratified by Brigadier Gozo at the time.
	Now it didn't matter that the applicant was not a member of the ADM, which was the party of the ruling leader at the time.  What did happen - and without trying to give evidence here, I'm sure this will become apparent from the evidence that I intend to lead, is that members who were headmen were regarded as being supporters or members of the ADM, whether they were or whether they weren't.  It's against that background that the applicant is actually applying for amnesty.

CHAIRPERSON: Was he wearing a Pan Africanist cap at the time he committed the offences?

MS COLLETT: Mr Chairman, his affiliation to the Pan Africanist Association had nothing to do with the way he was viewed by the community at large.  He was viewed as a supporter of Gozo by virtue of the fact that he was a headman, and the headman system was seen to be implemented by the Gozo regime.  Consequently all headmen were regarded as ADM supporters, whether they were or weren't was not at issue at that stage.  	Obviously he had to support the Ciskei Government to be a headman otherwise he wouldn't have been a headman.  The great opposition to the headman system as will be apparent from the evidence, was the ANC Youth League and the residents in the particular locations at the time.

CHAIRPERSON: Well let's hear what he's got to say.  Maybe it will become clearer as he testifies.

MS COLLETT: As it pleases you.

CHAIRPERSON: Mr Mahayiya, is that how you pronounce it?  Which language would you prefer to use?

DANIEL MAHAYIYA: Xhosa.

CHAIRPERSON: Very well.

DANIEL MAHAYIYA: (sworn states)

MS COLLETT: Thank you.
	Mr Mahayiya, is it correct that you were a headman and you were appointed as such in 1992?

DANIEL MAHAYIYA: Yes, that is correct.

MS COLLETT: Is it correct that the headmen system was introduced ...[intervention]

ADV SANDI: Sorry Miss Collett, can we get more specifics, when was it in 1992?

MS COLLETT: As it pleases you.
	When was it in 1992 that you were elected as a headman?

DANIEL MAHAYIYA: On the 24th of February 1992.

MS COLLETT: How were headmen elected?

DANIEL MAHAYIYA: In other places members from the government under Brigadier Gozo would elect these headmen but in my village there was a difference.  When the people had problems with the offices and they couldn't go on with their problems, they couldn't solve their problems, they saw the necessity to elect a headman.
	A meeting was called with residents and youth and the candidates were named.  It was myself, Mahayiya, Mr Ntusi and Mr Mate.  The time for vote came and the people voted for us and I got 98% and the others got 8%.  I was taken to the authorities of the village.  The person there, the highest authority was Manuang Sizwe, approved the decision and I was taken to Mr Tali in the Magistrate's offices, the Chief Magistrate who was there.  I started with my duties on the 26th(?) of February in 1992.

MS COLLETT: Was your appointment confirmed by Brigadier Gozo?

DANIEL MAHAYIYA: After that I was taken to Brigadier Gozo and the members there in his office confirmed by appointment.

MS COLLETT: And did you receive remuneration from the government for that?

DANIEL MAHAYIYA: Yes.

MS COLLETT: Now what was the perception of the community regarding the ...[intervention]

ADV SANDI: Sorry, Miss Collett, if I may interpose on that.
	How much were you earning per month?

DANIEL MAHAYIYA: It was R900,00.

ADV SANDI: You say  you commenced your duties on the 24th of February, what duties were you supposed to carry out?

DANIEL MAHAYIYA: I used to attend the problems, complaints of the people because there was no headman for a very long time, so I had to solve those problems.  I used to see to it that their land claims were attended to and their pensions.  Those were my duties.

ADV SANDI: Is that to say that if people were making applications for pensions they would have to do that through your office?

DANIEL MAHAYIYA: At the time they were forced to do so because when the people go to the office they were told to bring their headmen.  If they did not have headmen they would not get help.  And the people from the townships had to go to the rent office but in the villages the headmen were responsible for that.

ADV SANDI: Thank you.

MS COLLETT: Now as a headman, what political affiliation was it regarded that you had?

DANIEL MAHAYIYA: I got in there as a PAC organiser but as a headman we were not supposed to be members of any political organisation.  The only organisation was the one that was under Len Makoma under the traditional leaders in Ciskei that was from Contralesa.

MS COLLETT: What did - how did the community regard the headmen?