Amnesty Hearings — Welkom — 1998-11-16

CHAIRPERSON: Oh yes, alright.
MR MAKHURA
"I later learnt from Wellington Fokazi that he wanted to take along this Johannes Nxala, away from Sebenzile.  So for us to go back, the two or us to the car again to proceed to Natal.
	But before that can happen it seemed as if the car came to look for us.  I heard AK47 gunshots.  I was a little bit far away from the incident of the shooting of the police.  Then since I heard the shots of the AK47, I said to the others: "Look let us proceed to the township, there seemed to be trouble there."  I know when I hear AK47 gunshots trouble was there and I knew it was the people I was travelling with who were shooting.
	I want to make it clear to the Committee that one of an outstanding order from Polla Park was that at no stage was anybody from the Security Forces or whoever to disarm us or to take weapons from us, we were to shoot out our way.
	Then we proceeded towards the black township of Bohlokong. 
...(intervention)

CHAIRPERSON: How far away were you from the township when you started walking?

STEPHEN DONALD MAKHURA: I will probably say less than five kilometres, Sir.

CHAIRPERSON: Sorry, Mr Makhura, and the road that you had stopped on, was it the main road or was it a farm road or a side road or a back road?

STEPHEN DONALD MAKHURA: It was a main road, Sir.  A main road, a road to a place called Harrismith.  That's where we left the car, Sir.

CHAIRPERSON: Continue.
MR MAKHURA
"Then we proceeded towards the black township called Bohlokong.  There seemed - there was a car which approached us at a fast speed, driven by white men and there were four blacks at the back of it.  They were carrying ...(indistinct).  That car came to an abrupt standstill in front of us.  The man spoke, the white man, the driver, spoke to us in Sotho, yes in Sotho.  He used even vulgar language which I'm not prepared to mention here.  It's a very horrible and ugly word, Sir.
	The man pointed a firearm at us.  By that time, Sir, I was armed with a pistol.  My co-accused, Wellington Fokazi had a pistol too.  The man pointed us with his firearm and ordered us to climb at the back of the car.  It was an Isuzu car with an aerial and no canopy.  
	The car then made a u-turn towards the direction of the tarred road to town.  Well in my mind there was one thing, the man did not tell us where he was taking us to.  The man pointed a firearm at us and the manner in which he was talking to us was not good, he was talking to us in a threatening way.
	Then we took a gravel road towards the tar road which leads to town, that's the Bethlehem town.  I said to my co-accused: "Look here, before we come to that tarred road pull out your gun and shoot to scar this man."  My co-accused, that's Wellington Fakazi did the same.  He shot and scarred the man.  He did not aim at his body.  The car came to a standstill and the man got out of his car.
	I jumped out of that car and the man was already out pointing a firearm at me.  I raised my hand in this gesture, in a surrendering way ..."
...(intervention)

CHAIRPERSON: Just for purposes of the record, the witness puts up both hands above his head in the usual hands-up stance.

STEPHEN DONALD MAKHURA: Yes, Sir.
"Immediately after that first shot four blacks began to struggle with my co-accused, to wrestle the gun from him.  They were not aware that I had a gun too.
	The driver of that car, that white man got out of the car and pointed a firearm at me.  After realising that I was not carrying anything at all, he did not see that I was carrying a gun too, he went around the car, probably to go and shoot my co-accused.  That's where I shot the man.  I pulled out my pistol at the man with two bullets."

DR TSOTSI: Now these co-accused you're referring to, are these the other two men?  Which co-accused are these?

STEPHEN DONALD MAKHURA: I'm referring to Wellington Fokazi because the other Johannes Nxala escaped, he ran away from the incident immediately after the car came to a   standstill.

CHAIRPERSON: This man that you shot, was he a policeman or didn't you know?

STEPHEN DONALD MAKHURA: No, it later emerged in the Court that he was a farmer and I'm still going to talk a lot about this incident, Sir, after completing this.

CHAIRPERSON: Yes, continue.
MR MAKHURA
"Then I ran towards the township.  My co-accused, that's Wellington Fokazi ran towards the township too.  It must be noted by this Committee that immediately after I shot at the man, those four blacks who were struggling with my co-accused to wrestle the gun from him also ran away because they already discovered that I had a gun too.  Then together with my co-accused we ran towards the black township, Bohlokong.
	We hid in a certain house there.  I do not know that place, Sir, but one of the guys we found there subsequently sold us to the police.  I was subsequently arrested, Sir."
I believe I have got to go back to that incident I said I will 	talk about it, that's this second shooting of that farmer.
"Sir, it emerged in the Court from the victim that he was not carrying a gun.  I say the man was carrying a gun, Sir, right at the spot where he came driving that car fast to us.  If he had no gun at all I was just going to run away from him because he was fat, he couldn't run after me but that threatening way of pointing a firearm at me caught me unaware and unbalanced, that is why I climbed at the back of the car.
	Now it emerged again - it is obvious that the man was taking me to the police station, it also emerged in the Court that the very same victim had already collected money from the bank to come and pay his workers.  
	Sir, in 1992 it was during the height of the killing of farmers, I say now that man couldn't have gone to the bank to collect money without carrying a firearm.  And it emerged again in the Court that that suitcase, that briefcase he was carrying disappeared at the scene of the   shooting.
	So the only reason why I shot at that man was that he was taking me to the police station, to my enemy by that time ..."
...(intervention)

CHAIRPERSON: Do you know anything about the missing money bag, the bag with money?

STEPHEN DONALD MAKHURA: No, Sir, it only emerged that there was money in that bag and that money was taken by his wife when they came to collect the injured from the shooting spot.  Sir one of the things which I say ...(intervention)

DR TSOTSI: How many times did you shoot at this white man?

STEPHEN DONALD MAKHURA: I shot him with two bullets, Sir.

DR TSOTSI: On what occasion, the same occasion or different occasions?

STEPHEN DONALD MAKHURA: No, on the same occasion.

DR TSOTSI: The same occasion.

STEPHEN DONALD MAKHURA: Yes.

DR TSOTSI: That is when he was taking you to, as you say to the police station.

STEPHEN DONALD MAKHURA: To the police station, yes, Sir.

DR TSOTSI: Now when you ran away from the car when he was - when you ran away from the car you didn't shoot at him?

STEPHEN DONALD MAKHURA: No, I did not shoot at him.

DR TSOTSI: Oh I see, alright.

STEPHEN DONALD MAKHURA: If I had other minds, Sir, I could have taken that car away from him because I know how to drive and the gun also but I wanted nothing from that man.  The only thing I wanted was to neutralise him from taking me to the police station because those shots of AK47 I heard later, I mean I heard before, I was convinced that trouble was brewing.  The man was taking me to the police station, Sir.  I had to do everything with all my power to stop him from taking me to the police station, Sir.

CHAIRPERSON: Do you know who the man was that you shot?

STEPHEN DONALD MAKHURA: Pardon, Sir?

CHAIRPERSON: Do you know the man's name?