Special Hearings — Helderberg Flight Special Hearing — 1998-06-03

CHAIRPERSON: Shall I formally welcome you, Mr Braizblatt, let me formally welcome you to this enquiry. It's an investigative enquiry, it's not a disciplinary enquiry, it's not a trial, it's not a hearing and it is intended to gather information around the issues which I hope were mentioned in your invitation for you to attend.  We are thankful that you are here and we have to apologise that we have had to cause you to wait whilst we were taking other testimony in relation to something else.  Before you testify I would like to swear you in.

MR BRAIZBLATT: (Duly sworn in, states)

CHAIRPERSON: Mr Terreblanche?

UNKNOWN: Thank you very much for coming so far, you still live in Israel?

MR BRAIZBLATT: I do.

UNKNOWN: We have been in need to question you about a number of things.  Can you just briefly tell us when you started your career in SAA?

MR BRAIZBLATT: In 1969.

UNKNOWN: And you have been Cargo Manager in Tel Aviv since then, and you still are?

MR BRAIZBLATT: Correct.

MS PATTA: Mr Braizblatt, we have heard a number of witnesses telling us that during the mid 1980's there was an SAA flight that went over Portugal and Italy and then landed in Tel Aviv?

MR BRAIZBLATT: A passenger flight.

MS PATTA: Was that a weekly flight?

MR BRAIZBLATT: A weekly flight.

MS PATTA: According to some of the pilots and crew who were on that route, you as Manager was aware of some military cargo that was off-loaded in Tel Aviv, is that correct?

MR BRAIZBLATT: I don't think that they've got it correct, no.  I think that what they're referring to are boxes, large boxed that were freighted on board the aircraft.  I doubt very very much if it was military cargo.  I have my doubts.  Once again we can't know what type of cargo it is, there's no way we can know, we can only go according to what's written on the airway ...(indistinct) manifest.

MS PATTA: Right, so you have no knowledge of the cargo that you off-load for SAA?

MR BRAIZBLATT: Well, there's no way we can know what we off-load, I mean, we don't off-load it physically, Israel airport authorities off-loads the cargo.  The cargo is then taken to the customs warehouse.  We're not even allowed to look into the cargo, by international regulation, it's not our job to do so.

MS PATTA: Even if it's then re-loaded on another flight?

MR BRAIZBLATT: Customs.

MS PATTA: Right.  Mr Braizblatt, let me take you back to 1985, the 4th of June.  A South African flight was standing over waiting and they were off-loading and one of these crates apparently fell out.

MR BRAIZBLATT: I know of that, I know of that incident, yes.  I was called out to the aircraft once they'd already got the crate onto her belly.

MS PATTA: And did you see the contents?

MR BRAIZBLATT: I saw something there, I didn't see the actual contents because I only saw the part that was facing towards me when I came to look at what was happening down there.

MS PATTA: So what did you see?

MR BRAIZBLATT: What I saw was a metal object.  I can't tell you what it was, because I - to be quite honest with you, at the time it didn't even interest me what it was.  What interested me was getting the cargo off-loaded the aircraft and getting everything out as soon as possible so as we could re-load and go back.

MS PATTA: Now, as I understand, the pilot on this flight, Mr Flippie Loog ...(intervention)

MR BRAIZBLATT: It's possible that they saw things, - that, yes, because I wasn't on the ground or I wasn't at the aircraft belly at the time of off-loading.

MS PATTA: Well, Mr Loog told me that he went to you and asked you what - if you can confirm that this was a missile, and he wanted to know whether it was with or without fuel.  You said that you did not know, but that they should not make such, let me just read to you this,
"I asked Jossie whether the missile contained fuel, and if so solid or liquid, after all, I was flying with it.  He said he did not know.  Jossie admitted that this was off-loaded every week.  It was loaded at Jan Smuts and flown on the route Portugal-Italy-Tel Aviv and is destined for the military missile programme with Israel."

MR BRAIZBLATT: Definitely incorrect, I think that's very malicious to say a thing like that.  Two things, no 1, as I said to you, we had large boxes, it's not my duty to look into these boxes and see what's inside these boxes, definitely not, I'm not even allowed to do it, that's no 1.  No 2, to say that missiles were on board an aircraft, I would never say a thing like that, and I doubt very, very much whether the Israeli authorities would allow any dangerous missiles or anything like that to land at Tel Aviv Airport on board a passenger aircraft, knowingly, because of the implications involved should a thing like that happen.  Just think for one minute, if an aircraft should have an explosion or a mid-air disaster, whatever, the first thing the Israeli's would say is, this is a sabotage attempt against a company flying into Israel with Jewish passengers on board.  Do you understand the ramifications, therefor the Israeli's would never ever, as far as I know agree, to any cargo like that been placed on board the aircraft.  There might have been military shipments on board the aircraft, but not of a dangerous category, they certainly wouldn't allow it.  Another thing which, I mean, just living in Israel, I know, the Israeli authorities would never allow anything military to come into Israel by a 2nd or 3rd country because this would be already a breach of their own security.

MS PATTA: Mr Braizblatt, but let's remember the time, it was 1985, Israel was good friends with South Africa.

MR BRAIZBLATT: That doesn't matter.

MS PATTA: And it was a time when we were - we now know with hindsight we were defying the arms embargo, we have information about front companies having been used.  It seems remarkable that Flippie Loog would lie about something like this, something he was reluctant to talk about initially anyway.

MR BRAIZBLATT: Miss Patta, first of all, it's highly likely that there was movement of whatever there was in between the two countries.  It's likely, I don't know anything about it.  If there was, I doubt very much if it would have been on board a civil aircraft because of the ramifications involved in whatever aspect there could be.  Now I certainly don't know of any missiles, armed, fuelled or not fuelled.

MS PATTA: So Flippie Loog is lying?

MR BRAIZBLATT: I don't know.  I am certainly not lying because I certainly don't know of any missiles that - look I'm also explaining to you the ramifications involved.

MS PATTA: Let me just ask it to you ...(intervention)

MR BRAIZBLATT: Just think for one moment of a passenger aircraft coming into Israel and something happening to that aircraft.  In 1985 when we had plenty of enemies looking for Israeli aircraft all around the world and found a lot of aircraft bound for Israel around the world - the Swiss Air, the Swiss aircraft that went down over Switzerland, the first thing the Israeli's would have said, there's a sabotage against a civilian air-flight into our country.

CHAIRPERSON: Let's imagine, Mr Braizblatt, that the South Africans and the Israeli's were embarking on a joint nuclear programme, a programme that they didn't want the Americans to know about, a programme they didn't want anyone to know about, not if there were ingredients which they have to get, let's say uranium and all sorts of stuff like that, and even rock fuel, these would not be things that they would want anybody to know about ...(intervention)

MR BRAIZBLATT: Exactly.