Human Rights Violation Hearings — Krugersdorp — 1996-11-12

CHAIRPERSON: We welcome you all to the second day of our hearings.  Yesterday those of you who were here, we dealt with violations that took place mostly in the Carletonville and Khutsong areas.  Today we are going to focus on the violations that took place in Mohlakeng, Toekomsrus and Swanieville.  Some of these cases are related to police shootings and some of them are related to inter-organisational conflict.  Basically, between the conflict between the IFP and the ANC.
 The Commission being an independent body and evenhanded has tried very much to get a balanced picture of the conflict, but we regret that we have not been successful in that we did not have statements from the IFP.  Nevertheless, we are still going to try to get those statements because it is not only the hearings that are important for us, but it is important for us to gather as many statements from the people as possible.  So, we feel, perhaps, we will be able to reach out to the other parties.  
 Two of our Commissioners have joined us this morning and I would like to introduce our panel.  Starting from the right we have Professor Piet Meiring who is a member of the Reparation and Rehabilitation Committee.  Then we have Yasmin Sooka, Deputy Chairperson of the Human Rights Violations Committee.  On my left we have Dr Randera who is 
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also a Human Rights Violations Committee member and, of course, I am Joyce Seroke, who is a member of the Human Rights Violations Committee.  
 We shall now begin and we will call our first witness.  Our first witness is Agnes Sekhoacha and Dr Randera is going to do the oath.  I will hand over to Dr Randera.

DR RANDERA: Mrs Sekhoacha, good morning.

MRS SEKHOACHA: Good morning, Sir.

DR RANDERA: Are you well?

MRS SEKHOACHA: I am well, because I am here, God has blessed me.

DR RANDERA: I welcome you and I want you to feel as relaxed as possible.  You have come to talk about something that happened many, many years ago, 1963, but before we come to that will you please stand to take the oath.

MRS SEKHOACHA: (Duly sworn in, states).

DR RANDERA: Thank you Mam, will you please sit down.

CHAIRPERSON: Professor Piet Meiring is going to lead this witness.  Over to you Piet.

PROF MEIRING: Mrs Sekhoacha, from my side too, very welcome and I do hope that you find it a healing experience to be with us today.  You are going to tell us your story, an incident that happened 33 years ago.  At that stage you were a young girl of 20 years of age and it is the story of what happened to you and to Maria, who was at your side.  Just before you tell the story, can you give us the date when it happened?

MRS SEKHOACHA: May I talk?

PROF MEIRING: : Yes please.

MRS SEKHOACHA: It was in 1963, I was staying in Leshwana at the old location.  I was still a child.  I was schooling at
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Manseville High at that time.  In our yard, there were people who were residing there because in those times people use to build shacks in the yard.  We use to stay in peace.  You could not just call them anything.  You could take them as your relative.  Maria Gobganie's parents were staying in one of the shacks in the yard.  We were the same age, Maria and I, but I was in 1943 on the 1st of January.  
 It was during examination period in November.  We were doing the same standard, but in different classes.  She was in A, I was in the B class.  We were on our way from school.  We use to travel by bus in the morning and in the afternoon at four o' clock.  During examinations, this bus would not come.  The reason being we would finish quickly and we would come back home earlier.  It was the last subject that we were to write on that day and it was Afrikaans.  We were travelling along the Monument Road so that we could be able to catch the train to go home.  We were quite hungry on that day if I can remember well.  We rested a while under the shade because it was quite a hot day.  
 She took three stones and she was playing.  It was a game that we enjoyed, playing with these stones while walking.  When we approached the Paul Kruger statue, we were attracted by bees.  Whilst we were standing there and watching the swarm of bees, we could not see that there were policemen who were standing around there.  We were chatting and our laughter was the result of that conflict.  We were laughing heartily and we were watching the swarm of bees as they were flying about.  
 The two policemen emerged and as they emerged they did not give us a chance.  They talked to us in Afrikaans.  They said what are you laughing at Kaffirs.  We were dressed in 
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black and white uniform at that time.  We were scared because at those times it was a fearsome period because the white children would beat us up every day.  They took us, they were dressed in a khaki uniform.  They had long rifles.  My school uniform was torn apart.  They beat us, they assaulted us.  I was so scared, I was frightened.  I did not feel that I was walking on the ground.  The one was holding Maria and the other one was holding me.  We were taken to a cell that I cannot remember even today, but we found ourselves in a prison.  
 In this prison, it was a strange small house.  Inside it there was a palm, a plank and a bucket and a few blankets that were thrown on the floor.  This white man, he is not the one who opened, the one who caught us.  He opened and then we went inside.  He closed the cell once we were inside.  He said that we are going to cut off your tails today.  We looked at each other the moment he said that.  He beat us.  The painful part of it is whenever he beat the other one, this plank that was separating us, it would injure you and should you fall, you would be in trouble.  We were bleeding.  It was a huge white man who was holding me and he was beating us up.  Thereafter, he asked us, what were you laughing at.  Whilst I was trying to explain what we were laughing at he hit me finally and I fell.  When I fell I lost consciousness and when I revived he was not there anymore.  When I stood up I saw Maria standing in front of me.

CHAIRPERSON: Okay, Agnes.  Drink some water, Agnes, and please take your time.