Human Rights Violation Hearings — Port Shepstone — 1996-08-13

WITNESS:   You see, I am not learned.  I am not educated.  I will just bear children, and I don't know how old she was at the time.

COMMISSIONER: I see from your statement you said that she was born in 1969, so she was just a little over 20 years old.  And your granddaughter must have been much younger than that.  Mrs Mzindle, this happened in 1992, and you must have talked often about it.  You must have talked with other people who lost children.

WITNESS:   You know, the children trouble me so much.  Each time, you know, when I wake up even at night I think about them, and I feel so troubled.  You know, this attacks me, this feeling keeps attacking me, and it leaves me so hopelessly.

COMMISSIONER: We understand the terrible trauma that you've been through, Mrs Mzindle, and we would certainly recommend that you get some assistance.

WITNESS:   You know, I was attacked by these headaches since that day, and I still get the pain even now.

COMMISSIONER: Have you been seeing a doctor, or have you been going to the clinic, or have you been going to the hospital for your health and for the way that you feel?

WITNESS:   I do go to the doctors, even the clinic, and they tell me I have sugar diabetes.  And I also have the disease that ... (inaudible) ... disease.

COMMISSIONER: Do you feel that you need to see another medical specialist, or a different doctor, or do you feel that the treatment that you're getting is sufficient?

WITNESS:   Yes, I would like to get proper treatment.

COMMISSIONER: You're receiving a pension now, Mrs Mzindle?

WITNESS:  Yes, I do get pension, and that's the very one I use to educate and pay the fees of my children.  I also clothe myself from the same pension.  What bothers me most is that the other older child of mine was attacked by this trauma up to this day, you know, he's highly affected, and he's not functioning properly. So are you saying that there was another child of yours who was present there and who was injured and did not die?   ---   One got injured and the other did not get injured, and it's the other boy who was injured on the ankle, and he is attending school.   And at times this thing attacks him even highly, and he cannot walk properly and he's having problems, experiencing problems.

COMMISSIONER: What is his name?

WITNESS:   Sibonelo.

COMMISSIONER: How old is he?  If you don't know ... (incomplete)

WITNESS:   He's the seventh one.

COMMISSIONER: And is he at school or is he working?

WITNESS:   He is still young.  He is in sub B.

COMMISSIONER: And he was injured, he was shot in the leg, is that correct?

WITNESS:   Yes, he was one of those.  Yes, he got injured.  The ankle was ripped apart, but now he tries to walk.  It's difficult though.  At times it gets better, but at times it's worse.  And the bullet went through the hip and got out the other side.

COMMISSIONER: Mrs Mzindle, we'll get further details about him after you've given your evidence, because you didn't mention him in your statement.  Mrs Mzindle, have you ever heard anybody expressing any views as to who did this, who attacked you?  I know that you don't know, and nor do any of the other people know, but have you heard any of the other people who suffered the loss of their children - have you heard them giving their views or their opinions as to who did this?  Do they think it was the police?  Who do they think it was?  You said the people ... (incomplete)

WITNESS:   I wouldn't know.  I don't know really, except that the white police who came in a helicopter, on Friday came - that was on Saturday when they came in a helicopter, and we just heard that one has been shot in Gamalakhe.  So I don't know any further thing than this.  I don't know how they even discovered that.  I don't know those whites, what they were up to.

COMMISSIONER: As my colleague Mr Lacks said, there was an inquest into this incident, but the Magistrate could not find out who was responsible.  I don't know whether we on the Truth Commission will be able to find out who was responsible for this terrible thing, but we will certainly try to do that.  And we have heard all the other requests from the other witnesses who have been here today about what they would like the Commission to help them with, and we will take all those requests to the Government, to the State President, and we will make recommendations as to how we think you and other people like you should be helped.  Now, I am just going to ask my colleagues if they want to ask any questions about this case.

MR LACKS: Mrs Mzindle, you mentioned that there were two boys that were affected.  You told us the name of the one who was shot, Sibonelo.  Who was the other one that witnessed the event?

WITNESS:   The other one is the girl.  The elder one is not doing fine healthwise.  That bullet was extracted, but since then he's not so healthy.  She does go to school.

MR LACKS: What is her name please?

WITNESS:   Silindile.

MR LACKS: Mrs Mzindle, I want to ask you something.  I want you to explain a little bit about your family.  You say Nthombinkhulu, the one who died, had children.  How many children did she have?

WITNESS:   Two. Those two were not affected?   ---   Yes, those two were affected, but they did not die, they made it.

MR LACKS: And they are the children of Nthombinkhulu?

WITNESS:   Yes.

COMMISSIONER: Mrs Mzindle, we want to thank you very, very much for having the courage to come here today and tell us about all these terrible memories, to relive these memories.  Since the Truth Commission started holding hearings in KwaZulu-Natal we have heard many, many stories, dozens and dozens of stories of shooting and death and torture and the burning of houses, and almost all the people that have come to give evidence have been members of the ANC ... (intervention)

WITNESS:   That's true.

COMMISSIONER: ... or other organisations that existed in the 1980s, like the UDF.  And you and the other people, Mrs Dlamini, Mr Kheswa, Mr Linda, you are the first large group of people from Inkatha who have come to the Truth Commission, and we want to welcome you here today.  We know that many members of Inkatha, many ordinary people, suffered a lot over the past years, and that many of them have been killed, and have been affected in the way that you have been affected.  The massacre that you have described to us is one of the horrifying events that we have had to listen to.  Your descriptions of this happy group of young people, eagerly waiting to go on their journey, being killed by guns, those visions will live with us for a long time, and we should ask ourselves what did that violence achieve?  What it achieved is that it destroyed at least 12 families, it made people bitter, it made them sad, and it left them with awful memories that  will never leave them.  And the evidence that we have heard today from both members of the ANC and members of Inkatha has been very similar.  It's been about the killing of innocent people.  And we are very glad that you and the other people from the IFP were here today to listen to the members of the ANC and their families giving their stories about how they suffered, and we are very glad that they were here today to listen to how you suffered.  Both of you, both groups, know that the only thing that this violence has brought to you is grief and tears and a sense of loss, and we hope that this experience of sitting here and sharing this together will bring about an understanding, a mutual understanding of how useless the violence is, and that this understanding will maybe bring you together, and that it will help to promote reconciliation in our province.