Amnesty Hearings — Potchefstroom — UNKNOWN

CHAIRPERSON: Is that all that was said about you?

NDOYISELE ELIAS BUSAKWE: That's correct.
4

CHAIRPERSON: /...
134	MR BUSAKWE

CHAIRPERSON: Why did you not tell the Court that you went there to help the deceased after he had been attacked?

NDOYISELE ELIAS BUSAKWE: My problem for not giving my evidence, from the first day when I was arrested I lost hope in the system.  The prosecutor told me that you are going to be sentenced whether you like it or not and that is when I lost hope in the court of law.

CHAIRPERSON: So even though you were perfectly innocent you did not give evidence.

NDOYISELE ELIAS BUSAKWE: I tried to show that I was innocent, but nothing helped.

CHAIRPERSON: ... tried to show.  I said did you not give evidence?

NDOYISELE ELIAS BUSAKWE: Explain your question further on, Sir?

CHAIRPERSON: From what you have told us you went there to lift this man after he had been attacked.  You prevented somebody from putting paraffin on this person for him to be burnt.  You did all that, yet you were charged with murder and you don't go and tell the Court that you did nothing else but to try and help the deceased.  Why didn't you do that?

NDOYISELE ELIAS BUSAKWE: I think I explained that to the Court.

CHAIRPERSON: Is that the best answer you can give?

NDOYISELE ELIAS BUSAKWE: I don't understand you, Sir.

CHAIRPERSON: Can I get your assistance in this matter, please.

MR: Mr Busakwe, Chairperson, I am rephrasing your question in the language the applicant is speaking, not undermining what the interpreter has been doing.  Did you give evidence on the day when you were prosecuted or sentenced for committing murder?
4

NDOYISELE ELIAS BUSAKWE: /...
135	MR BUSAKWE

NDOYISELE ELIAS BUSAKWE: Yes.  I gave evidence.

<UNKNOWN>: Now what evidence did you give the Court on that day?

NDOYISELE ELIAS BUSAKWE: The evidence that I gave the Court was exactly what took place on the day of the killing.

<UNKNOWN>: You didn't tell the Court that the part that you took was lifting the deceased in trying to help him?

NDOYISELE ELIAS BUSAKWE: Yes.

<UNKNOWN>: The Committee was given evidence by Peter Lebona, if I remember, that he was given a gun by you.  Do you agree or do you disagree with this?

NDOYISELE ELIAS BUSAKWE: I agree with what you have just said.

<UNKNOWN>: Was such evidence given on the day you appeared before the court of law?

NDOYISELE ELIAS BUSAKWE: No, such evidence was not given.

JUDGE WILSON: Did you appeal against your conviction or sentence or have you appealed against it?

NDOYISELE ELIAS BUSAKWE: Not.

UNKNOWN: Were you legally represented at your trial, Mr Busakwe?

NDOYISELE ELIAS BUSAKWE: Yes.

UNKNOWN: And who was your legal representative, was he  a person who came from your organisation?

NDOYISELE ELIAS BUSAKWE: He was a person whom my parents got for me.

ADV DE JAGER: Could you kindly repeat the answer, Mr Interpreter?

NDOYISELE ELIAS BUSAKWE: My parents found me a lawyer.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very much.

MOKOTEDI MPSHE: Thank you, Mr Chairperson.  In the former cases there is a witness I would like to call, who is the mother to the deceased, David Mayeko, and the next-of-kin to
4	the/...
136
the deceased in question now, Dlamini, is the father Charles Dlamini.   The mother with the first case to Mayeko, is available, she is seated herein, and the father to Zenzile Dlamini, I was told by the policeman that he is going to be fetched now.  I would propose that we adjourn until tomorrow morning at nine o'clock for me to lead both of them in order to round up the two sets of applications.

CHAIRPERSON: Is she not here to give evidence?

MOKOTEDI MPSHE: She is here, Mr Chairman, I was afraid not to disrupt the Committee by taking the Committee back and I have not consulted with her.  She has arrived.  I have not consulted with her but she is available.

MR: I have no other witnesses to call in this particular matter.  However, Mr Chairperson, having thought that we may proceed with the next  matter I wanted to raise certain concerns or issues.  The Chairperson asked me to get the maximum information relating to the co-accused in the matter of Popani and others, and I am still trying to get hold of the information.  I phoned the national headquarters of the ANC to provide with such an information.  The response I got was that the Justice Department was phoned about the matter and they were asked to dispatch a letter before such information could be released.  The ANC has done so.  They are still awaiting that information to be faxed through.  My request was should that information be available in the earliest it should be faxed at the fax number that I provided of this office.  Further to that, the concern was raised by the applicant in this matter who informed me that they show their concern about what happened and they took certain steps in an attempt to rectify the situation or to get clarity more.  I am told that a
4	memorandum/...
137
memorandum in the form of a petition was directed to the Supreme Court TPD.  The response that came concerning the same matter was that they were referred to a certain Captain Schoombee who apparently was dealing with the indemnities.  The response is still being awaited from the Captain Schoombee.  What I was trying to put before this Committee is, there is a concern from the applicant about the same matter as well.

CHAIRPERSON: We can only hope that all this becomes available as soon as possible tomorrow morning.   There are no other witnesses whose evidence can be heard now.  Is that the position?

MR: That is the position, Chairperson, from my side.

CHAIRPERSON: Mr Mpshe, this lady comes from Khutsong to give evidence.  If you are given 15, 20 minutes to consult with her and then we can sit and hear her evidence so that she can go home instead of being here until tomorrow morning.  Is that not possible.

CHAIRPERSON: We will take a short adjournment to enable you to consult with her.
COMMITTEE ADJOURNS
COMMITTEE RESUMES

MOKOTEDI MPSHE: Mr Chairman, I indebted to you and the members of the Committee for the time given.  I have consulted with the witness who is presently on the witness stand.  It is in connection with the very first matter, the matter of Faltein and Ncube, wherein the deceased is David Mayeko.   The witness is going to testify in Setswana.

LUCY LOMANDLA: s s

MOKOTEDI MPSHE: The boy who has died, David Mayeko, is he your
4	child/...
137	L LOMANDLA
child?

LUCY LOMANDLA: Yes, he is my second son.

MOKOTEDI MPSHE: Do you know that he has died on the 24th December 1990?

LUCY LOMANDLA: Yes, I know.

MOKOTEDI MPSHE: There are applicants who have come before this Committee, Faltein and Ncube.  They have given evidence yesterday, they are asking amnesty for killing your son.  You were not there, but I've explained to you how they have killed him, do you remember?

LUCY LOMANDLA: Yes, I remember.

MOKOTEDI MPSHE: Again, you were not there when your son was killed.  You didn't see.

LUCY LOMANDLA: Yes, I didn't see.

MOKOTEDI MPSHE: Whilst I was talking to you you said on the day when your son was killed you were with him.

LUCY LOMANDLA: Yes, I was with him.

MOKOTEDI MPSHE: I am requesting that you explain to the Committee what you know which has happened on the 24th December 1990.

LUCY LOMANDLA: On the 24th December 1990 I knocked off at one o'clock.  I left and then I went to buy David a TV so that he must come and enjoy Christmas with me.  When I arrived when he was staying my son was clean and neat and then he said do you see how neat I am?

MOKOTEDI MPSHE: Were you not staying with him?

LUCY LOMANDLA: No, I was not staying with him.

MOKOTEDI MPSHE: Where was he staying?

LUCY LOMANDLA: He was staying with his friends because they knew that they were going to burn where I was staying so I was not staying there.
4

MOKOTEDI MPSHE: /...
138	MS LOMANDLA

MOKOTEDI MPSHE: Why didn't he stay with you in one house?