Special Hearings — Chemical And Biological Warfare Hearings — 1998-07-07

MR VALLY: I need to understand something, because it's one of two things, either you prepared it as an incapacitant, we're talking ecstasy, MDMA, and you can't be sure, you were just given orders to manufacture and your earlier state, and again I'll ask you that question, prior to your arrival in 1985 they did not have the manufacturing capacity at Delta-G, is that correct?

DR MIJBURGH: Not for 1000 kilograms, no.

MR VALLY: So it was only done after your arrival in 1985?  Medchem Technologies is created in 1990, is that correct?

DR MIJBURGH: Correct.

MR VALLY: An order is placed with you for 1000 kilograms of MDMA, ecstasy, is that correct?

DR MIJBURGH: Yes, for MDMA.

MR VALLY: Are you aware of when this order was placed?

DR MIJBURGH: I am not exactly certain what the date was, but it would have been more or less when the quotation was issued in July, so it should have been after the 30th of July 1992.

MR VALLY: After that date, you say it's after that date?

DR MIJBURGH: Yes, it would have had to be.

MR VALLY: We find it very strange as to how you used front companies, and let me tell you why.  Were you ever involved in Medchem Technologies?

DR MIJBURGH: Yes.

MR VALLY: Were you a director of Medchem Technologies?

DR MIJBURGH: I think so, yes.

MR VALLY: Were you a director in 1991 of Medchem Technologies?

DR MIJBURGH: I think so, I'm not quite sure.

MR VALLY: Why would Medchem Technologies change its name on the 11th of December 1991 to Data Images?

DR MIJBURGH: We used a company which was available and Medchem Technologies was not a very active company and I think that this was the company that was in position.  I cannot comment specifically why Medchem Technologies was used for this.

MR VALLY: You're not aware of Data Images at all?

DR MIJBURGH: I am yes.

MR VALLY: You're not aware that Medchem Technology's name was changed to Data Image?

DR MIJBURGH: Not specifically.

MR VALLY: I have a letter - certificate of change of name of company,
"This is to certify that Medchem Technology has changed its name by special resolution.  It's now called Data Image Information Systems."
And it's dated 11th of December 1991.  Are you aware of it now?

MR VAN ZYL: Mr Chairman, if reference is made to a document and the witness is asked to reply to it, I would like him to have it in his possession.

MR VALLY: We are forwarding a copy to Dr Mijburgh right now.  As you can see, I've given you three documents.

CHAIRPERSON: Are you going to go into a completely new field, Mr Vally?

MR VALLY: I just need to ask three questions regarding these three documents.

MR VAN ZYL: Chairperson, Mr Chaskalson has only now handed us the document.  Could my client please have an opportunity just to peruse it?

CHAIRPERSON: It looks like they are fairly straightforward documents, company documents.

MR VALLY: These are very straightforward documents, there are two documents which said "Application for change of name of company", and there's a document referred to as "Certificate of Incorporation".

CHAIRPERSON: Go ahead, Mr Vally, place your three questions.

MR VAN ZYL: Thank you, Chair, my client will now answer the questions.

MR VALLY: Are you aware of the change of name?

DR MIJBURGH: On these documents, yes.  I can't specifically recall why we used Medchem Technologies and changed its name to Data, I'm not aware of the specific reason or I simply can't remember at the moment.

MR VALLY: Well, I'll put it to you, you've got a company called Medchem Technologies, it changes its name to Data Image Information Systems.  Apparently on the same date you establish another company called Medchem Technologies again, but with a different company number.  Do you see Certificate of Incorporation, do you see that document, Certificate of Incorporation, one of the three I gave you?

DR MIJBURGH: Yes.

MR VALLY: Do you see the sentence "This is to certify that Medchem Technologies (PTY) Ltd was this day incorporated under the Companies Act"?

DR MIJBURGH: Yes, it still exists to this day.

MR VALLY: Do you see the date, the 11th of December 1991?

DR MIJBURGH: Yes.

MR VALLY: Do you see the date on the Change of name of Company, "Medchem Technologies (PTY) Ltd has changed its name by special resolution, it's now called Data Image Information Systems?

DR MIJBURGH: Yes.

MR VALLY: Do you see the date, 11th of December 1991?

DR MIJBURGH: Correct.

MR VALLY: The same date.

DR MIJBURGH: Yes.

MR VALLY: Now, do you see that under the certificate of change of name of company, the company registration number is 90/03541/07?

DR MIJBURGH: Yes.

MR VALLY: Do you see the certificate of incorporation of the new company, the company registration number there, it's 91/07197/07?

DR MIJBURGH: Yes.

MR VALLY: Do you have any explanation for these changes?

DR MIJBURGH: Mr Vally, at the moment I don't know why it was done, I would like to find out because I assume that there must have been a financial reason for this structuring, but at this stage I can't give you an answer.

MR VALLY: Was Data Images a private company?

DR MIJBURGH: Yes, it was.

MR VALLY: It is still a private company?

DR MIJBURGH: Is, it still exists.

MR VALLY: And who is the directors?

DR MIJBURGH: I'm the only director.

MR VALLY: Is it possible that company orders made up and delivered in terms of one company number and payments would be made to the same company number, but with a different name?

DR MIJBURGH: I don't think company numbers are generally used in orders, we work on the name of the company.

MR VALLY: Is it possibly a mechanism used to divert funds which were payments - you go to your bank, you say here's my cheque for Medchem Technology, but I've changed my name, here's my certificate of change of name of company, it's the same people, please deposit this in my account.  Are you aware of the possibility of that happening?

DR MIJBURGH: No, you're losing me here, I can't think that new current accounts were opened.

CHAIRPERSON: I think this should be a convenient stage, before we all get lost, to take the tea adjournment.  Mr Vally, may we after the tea break move on to, quickly I would hope, on these companies and fraud and everything else, to establish the real purpose of these hearings in so far as they should impact on our understanding of how this facility was used for perpetration of gross violation of human rights.  We'll adjourn until 11h00.
HEARING ADJOURNS
ON RESUMPTION

DR MIJBURGH: (s.u.o)

MR VALLY: (cont)

CHAIRPERSON: Before we start I would like to welcome Mr Cilliers.

MR CILLIERS: Thank you very much.

CHAIRPERSON: You have heard all the bad things I have said about you in your absence.

MR CILLIERS: I understand that you made the allegation that my conduct borders on contempt and I don't understand that.  I'm appearing here as part of a team with my learned colleague, Mr van Zyl, for Dr Mijburgh.  Now how the absence of one member of the team could border on contempt I don't understand, but I've taken note of that, yes.

CHAIRPERSON: Yes, you're really abandoned you, if I must say so, because he didn't seem to know about all the issues, but I think we'll deal with that between you and Mr Vally, but if you've heard all the bad things, you must have heard also I said it was subject to whatever representations you might make, I might be persuaded otherwise.

MR CILLIERS: I can only refer you to page 58 of the record where it is put very clearly that Mr van Zyl and I are acting as a team on behalf of, amongst others, Dr Mijburgh.

CHAIRPERSON: I think the matter of Dr Wouter Basson and his presence, or otherwise will be dealt with between you and Mr Vally and then we can deal with that possibly after the lunch break.  Certain things were placed on record in your absence.

MR CILLIERS: Yes, I've heard of those, yes.