Human Rights Violation Hearings — Uitenhage — 1996-08-26

MR GOBODO: Now, if they were saying "Why do you kill the elderly person", it seems as if therefore they had instruction to kill the young boys, didn't you hear that perhaps they were looking for young boys?

NOTAYITI MAVIS NDOTSHAYISA: No.

MR GOBODO: These Ama-Tshaka, what kind of policemen were these. Where do they come from and where were they employed, according to your knowledge?

NOTAYITI MAVIS NDOTSHAYISA: I don't know where they came from, but they were all over Soweto and they went into our house raiding.

MR GOBODO: What language were they speaking?

NOTAYITI MAVIS NDOTSHAYISA: They were not speaking proper Xhosa the way we speak as Xhosa's.

MR GOBODO: So, you are trying to say they were not Xhosa people, do you think they were speaking like Zulu or Sotho?

NOTAYITI MAVIS NDOTSHAYISA: Yes, they were. What I am certain about is that they were not speaking Xhosa the way we speak.

MR GOBODO: So, you could say they were policemen who came from another area, not from the Eastern Cape?

NOTAYITI MAVIS NDOTSHAYISA: I don't know.

MR GOBODO: The reason why I am asking is, I am trying to ascertain whether these policemen came from other areas to come and cause commotion here in the Eastern Cape so as to be able to do all the evil things they did, because it could have been very easy for people to come and kill, because they were not staying with these people. Despite they were black, they could do all the evil, only because they were not resident here, so that is why I am asking this question. Thank you.

CHAIRPERSON: Over to you Mr Tiny Maya.

MS MAYA: Thank you Mr Chairperson.
 Mrs Ndotshayisa, I have one question to pose to you. I am not even sure whether you did perhaps answer it. You say there was a court case once where you were represented by Lawyer Majodina. What was the outcome of this court case?

NOTAYITI MAVIS NDOTSHAYISA: This case was just dismissed. That was all.

MS MAYA: Thank you.

CHAIRPERSON: Can you recall the name of the Magistrate?

NOTAYITI MAVIS NDOTSHAYISA: No, I don't know his name.

CHAIRPERSON: What year was that?

NOTAYITI MAVIS NDOTSHAYISA: It was 1986.

CHAIRPERSON: In 1985, at the time of the Langa massacre the Magistrate was Mr Groenewald, so you are not certain who the Magistrate was at the time?

NOTAYITI MAVIS NDOTSHAYISA: Yes, I wasn't.

CHAIRPERSON: So this case, this case was referred to a Port Elizabeth court?

NOTAYITI MAVIS NDOTSHAYISA: Yes, because I live in Port Elizabeth.

CHAIRPERSON: We thank you Mrs Mavis Ndotshayisa for your report as forwarded before this Commission and I think that it is an indication that here in Uitenhage, the policemen were doing as they pleased. From morning to day we have been listening to all the stories about how policemen were just shooting widely, shooting people to death, we have been going round this country and even in this region, but I don't remember us getting so many witnesses testifying against policemen who were shooting widely at people.
 I think this is quite evident that here in Uitenhage the policemen were war unto themselves. We may perhaps get more testimony on this matter but you can see that policemen were just shooting at people as if they were shooting at animals in this area. From the evidence we have, we therefore feel that Uitenhage is outstanding in such atrocities. 
 We are going to investigate as much as we can even in that court where there was this inquest and find out if they said no-one was responsible for your husbands death, when your husband was actually killed in front of you and shot at by the policemen. We would want to know from them what they meant by that.
 We would therefore thank you for your evidence as forwarded to this Commission and we are going to do our level best to get the truth of this and perhaps this could console you if you were to get the actual truth of what happened to your husband. We thank you.