Human Rights Violation Hearings — Durban — 1996-05-10

WITNESS:   No, the police have never been to me.  Nothing happened after that.

MR LYSTER: Where was your family buried, Mrs Gabela?

WITNESS:   They were buried at Dlangezwa graveyard - at Dlangezwa.

MR LYSTER: And will you be able to give us any document that

MR LYSTER: /you have,

MR LYSTER: 15A/16 you have, relating to your family's death, such as death certificates, to enable us to try and follow this matter up?

WITNESS:   Yes, there are some documents I could give you.

MR LYSTER: Have you thought what you would like the Truth Commission to try to do for you?

WITNESS:   What I'm thinking about, I would like them to assist me to educate my younger sisters and also help us with the house, because we are living at other people's homes.

MR LYSTER: Are these sisters that you talk about, are these people who survived the attack on your house?  Who were there at the time, but survived that attack?

WITNESS:   Yes, they are younger children that survived, but they are disabled.

MR LYSTER: You said in your statement that the people who attacked the house threw stones at them.  Is that right?

WITNESS:   No, it wasn't stones.  They were shooting at them.  They were throwing bombs and shooting at them.

MR LYSTER: Mrs Gabela, we've taken note of what you've said.  We've heard your very terrible story.  We - the Truth Commission - part of the job of the Truth Commission is to make recommendations to the Government as to how victims of these sorts of incidents should be assisted and we have heard what you said.  We've made a note of it and we hope that we will be able to help you at some stage in the future.  Thank you very much for coming in today and I hand back to the Chairman.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you.  Any questions.  Dr Mgojo.

KHOZA MGOJO: Thank you, my daughter.  There are things that I would like you to clarify so that we've got good records.  In your statement there was somebody - Betty was

KHOZA MGOJO: /harassed.  Who

KHOZA MGOJO: 15A/22 harassed.  Who was Betty?

WITNESS:   Betty is my mother.

KHOZA MGOJO: And who is Jameson?

WITNESS:   Jameson is my father.

KHOZA MGOJO: And who is Jethro?

WITNESS:   Jethro is my brother.

INTERPRETER: Excuse the interpreters.  We do not hear the question.

KHOZA MGOJO: And Zebron also is your brother and Zingkle is also your brother.  Thank you.  I just wanted to be clear about all these names here.

CHAIRPERSON: Ilan Lax.

MR LAX: Thank you, Chairperson.  Mrs Gabela, I know it's difficult to talk about these things, but how old are you at the moment?

WITNESS:   I'm 34 years old.

MR LAX: And how old are your surviving siblings?

WITNESS:   There is one who was born in 1973.  There is one who was born in 1978.  There is one who was born in 1990.  There is one who was born in 1991.  There is one who was born in 1984 and 1982.

MR LAX: Are these children schooling at the moment, the older ones?

WITNESS:   Yes, they are.  Yes.

MR LAX: You've told us that you're living with other people and you would like to have your own place.  That seemed to be implied in what you were saying.  Is that correct?

WITNESS:   Yes.  Yes, we are staying at different places.  I am living at hostel.  There are two of us who are living at a hostel.  The other one is at the university.

MR LAX: And the very young ones?

WITNESS:   The younger ones I asked for them to stay at Hammarsdale at some other people's places.

MR LAX: Thank you.

CHAIRPERSON: Dr Magwaza.

DR MAGWAZA: Mrs Gabela, the first thing, if I could get

DR MAGWAZA: /clarity on

DR MAGWAZA: 15A/27 clarity on the number of people who died.  I thought I heard you say there were six.  I thought you were talking about the people who died in the house they were six, but all in there are seven people who died?

WITNESS:   Yes.

DR MAGWAZA: You also said some children were shot, but they didn't die.

WITNESS:   Among the children who died, there's only one who died.  The other ones managed to escape, but they had been shot.

DR MAGWAZA: Another thing that I realise here, it seems like a whole family was harassed by this - was affected by this.  Is there some kind of help you are getting at the moment with regard to children or with regard to anything in your house?

WITNESS:   We never got any assistance.  We just got some money from my father's workplace, but now it's finished.

DR MAGWAZA: Is there somebody who is working at home?

WITNESS:   No, there's nobody who is working at home.

DR MAGWAZA: But how are you surviving?

WITNESS:   I survive by selling.

DR MAGWAZA: Thank you.  You say you survive by selling.  Are you the only one working?

WITNESS:   Yes.

DR MAGWAZA: You said your sister is at the university.  Who is educating her?

WITNESS:   We took my father's money to educate her.

DR MAGWAZA: Thank you, Mrs Gabela.  We are just wishing to get a very full picture of what happened to your family so that maybe the Committee of Rehabilitation and Reparation, if it can recommend any assistance it should have the full picture.  Thank you very much.

CHAIRPERSON: Dr Mgojo.

KHOZA MGOJO: And your sister who is at the university, what

KHOZA MGOJO: /university is

KHOZA MGOJO: 15A/29 university is she in?

WITNESS:   She's at Ongoye.

KHOZA MGOJO: What year is she studying?

WITNESS:   She's on her first year.  My mother left her at the college.  After she got disabled she got a bit insane.  She's just been released from a sanatorium, but now she's ... (intervention)

KHOZA MGOJO: Fort Napier?

WITNESS:   Yes.

KHOZA MGOJO: When you said she got disturbed, what do you mean?

WITNESS:   She got insane.

KHOZA MGOJO: Is she better now?

WITNESS:   Yes, now she is better.

CHAIRPERSON: We have run out of words that we can say to you to help to ease the pain you went through.  We do empathise with you.  Although words may not be of any assistance to you, you must know that you are among the colleagues and friends, people who really sympathise with you.  Thank you very much for coming here.  We are going to try by all means at our disposal to meet your wishes and see how we could assist you, so that maybe you can achieve your wishes.  Thank you very much.
/DR BORAINE
15A/30

DR BORAINE: Mr Chairperson, I would like to say a special word of welcome to Judge Andrew Wilson, who is the Deputy Chairperson of the Amnesty Committee.  We are very grateful and glad that he's amongst the audience today.  We have adjusted the programme slightly, to accommodate some people who were a little late in arriving.  We will come back to them after they have had a chance to settle a little bit.  Therefore, we will now call as the next witness, Ms Nxumale Dube.  Could I ask the briefer to make sure that the small mike is handled very, very delicately.  Could you please make sure the earphones are put on.  Thank you very much.  Mrs Dube, can you hear my voice in your earphones?

NXUMALE DUBE: Yes, I can hear it.

DR BORAINE: And you can hear the translation into your own language?

NXUMALE DUBE: Yes, I can hear them.

DR BORAINE: Well, that means I can speak to you and begin by thanking you very, very much for coming and to welcome you most warmly to the Commission.  You were probably told that you were only coming before the Commission this afternoon and we are very grateful that you have been willing to move up, as it were, in order to accommodate people who were a little delayed in getting here.  Thank you again very much.  Now, you have somebody with you.  Could you tell us who that is, please?

NXUMALE DUBE: She is my sister.  I come after her.

DR BORAINE: I welcome your sister also.  It's good to have somebody with you at such a time as this, because you have come to tell us about something that happened in 1987, when your husband, Sipho Senkose Dube, was killed.
 /Before I
15B/1 Before I ask you to tell that story I have to ask you please to stand to take the oath.

NXUMALE DUBE: (Sworn states) (Through Interpreter)