Human Rights Violation Hearings — Duncan Village — 1996-09-24

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: I once worked in Gauteng.

MR SANDI: Let's start on the day of the 15th of August 1985 as you said in your statement.  By the way you said on this particular day it was after the houses were burnt and some other places here in Duncan Village, is that so?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: Yes, that's correct.

MR SANDI: Can you tell us Mr Sukwana freely what happened on that particular day?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: Yes.  On the 15th it was midnight, it was midnight, I heard someone kicking the door.  It was White men who were in the company of Siphiwo Jamjam.
 When I tried to tell my mother that she must know that I'm being arrested, the Whites took me to the hippo.  They said I must lie there because some of the comrades were already there.
 We left because these people had a list.

MR SANDI: You say here in this hippo there were some other people who were arrested?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: Yes, it is true.

MR SANDI: Were those people young people or maybe people who were at an age?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: Yes, there were older people and there were others who were of my age.

MR SANDI: You're saying the hippo was patrolling, they were looking for people?
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MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: Yes, they didn't get the people, they took us to the police station.  When I was at the police station, they said I must take off my clothes and they electrocuted my private parts with electric shots and they hit my underneath my feet.
 After that they asked me about the organisations, political organisations that I was involved in.  I told them that I was a member of ELYO.  They locked me up in the cell and after that they took me to the courts and from the court we were taken to Westbank.
 When we arrived at Westbank, the police ordered us to take off our clothes.  They were hitting us with batons.

MR SANDI: Let's go back a little bit Mr Sukwana.  At the police station, do you still remember the policeman who were harassing you and torturing you and assaulting you?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: No, I can't remember, because they didn't have their name tags on.

MR SANDI: Let's talk about Westbank now.

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: Do you mean Fort Glamorgan now?

MR SANDI: Yes, that's correct.  What happened there?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: When we arrived there, they ordered us to take off our clothes.  They were chasing us, assaulting us with batons.  There was one other policeman by the name of Nkunzemnyama who said we must salute Botha.
 He was hitting us.  If there is no sort of echo, he'll say that he's not counting that lash and then he'll start afresh hitting us again.

MR SANDI: How long did this assaults take place?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: Since we were there we were being assaulted every day.

MR SANDI: You said you stayed there for 3 months?
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MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: Yes, that's correct.

MR SANDI: Do you mean that every day in this three months, you were being assaulted and tortured?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: Yes, he used to wake us up early in the morning and drive us like sheep, hitting us with batons, even if you come back, the same thing would happen.

MR SANDI: This person, this Nkunzemnyama, do you mean this man's name was Nkunzemnyama?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: Yes, that's the name that they were using.  I don't know his other name.

MR SANDI: Did you ever hear anything about this?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: Yes.

MR SANDI: What is it that they were saying about this Nkunzemnyama?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: I used to hear that he was mishandling, manhandling the people.

MR SANDI: Did you see Nkunzemnyama after that?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: Yes, I did after I was released from detention.

MR SANDI: Is he still around?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: No, I haven't seen him for a long time.

MR SANDI: Is that all concerning your evidence Mr Sukwana?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: Yes, that's all.

MR SANDI: Is there any wish that you have that you can tell this Commission about?  Is there any request that you would like to make in this Commission today?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: Yes, I have a request that the Commission must try to investigate the White men who came to my house and I would like to do something about them.

MR SANDI: Do you have any aim, do you have any intention?  Is there anything that you would like to do?
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MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: Yes, I would like to take them into my lawyers, because they broke my teeth.

MR SANDI: You say they broke your teeth.

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: Yes, they hit me with the rifle while I was trying to call my mother.

MR SANDI: Are there any teeth that you lost during that time?  How many of them?  Mr Sukwana, let me as this question, are there any injuries that you sustained by being assaulted by the police?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: Yes, they hit me on my ribs, even now I don't feel good, because sometimes it is painful.  Some of - the other side of my ribs can be painful.

MR SANDI: Is there any treatment that you are getting from a Doctor, maybe from a hospital?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: No, I try to use some other kind of medicine from the herbs.

MR SANDI: Is it necessary to use those herbs if you are not well?  Are you still using those herbs even now?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: No, I'm no longer using them.

MR SANDI: Do you mean that those traditional treatment helped you?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: Yes, it did.

MR SANDI: Is that all that you would like to say Mr Silwana?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: Yes.

MR SANDI: Thank you very much Mr Silwana.  Thank you Chairperson.

BONGANI FINCA: Revd Xundu.

REV XUNDU: Were you still at school when you were arrested?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: Yes, I was still at school.

REV XUNDU: What standard were you doing?
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MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: I was doing standard 5.

REV XUNDU: Did you ever go back to school after that?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: No, I didn't.

REV XUNDU: What was the reason for that?  What is the reason for you not to go back to school again?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: There was no specific reason, I just decided not to go back.

REV XUNDU: Would you like to go on with your education since education will also help you in life to go on with your life?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: Yes, I would like to go on.

REV XUNDU: With what?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: With my education.

REV XUNDU: What kind of education is that?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: To go back to school.

REV XUNDU: To start doing standard 6?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: Yes.

REV XUNDU: Are you working now?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: No, I'm not working, I was working in Gauteng, I was working at a garage.  After that, I didn't go back to work.

REV XUNDU: You didn't get any grant?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: No.

REV XUNDU: Did you try to make any application?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: No.

REV XUNDU: Thank you.

BONGANI FINCA: Ntsikelelo Sandi.

MR SANDI: Mr Silwana, are there any other people that you know that you were together at Fort Glamorgan?

MZWAMADODA DE VILLIERS SUKWANA: Yes, there are.  One of them is Vusumzi Mzuvukile Mbengo who was here yesterday and Mongia Zimanxa.  DUNCAN VILLAGE HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE
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There is a lot of them, I won't be able to quote, to tell you all of them.

MR SANDI: Thank you.