Human Rights Violation Hearings — Pietermaritzburg — UNKNOWN

WITNESS:   And in this kombi, the Toyota kombi, there was Sergeant Delport, Sergeant de Wet, Constable Mchunu, and a Special Constable Zuma.  And they came close to my Canter and then we talk.  From there Duma came back to pick up this truck now and to put some goods into the truck.

MR SINGH:  Sorry, can I just interrupt.  What goods are you talking about?

WITNESS:   I'm referring to the television and radios.

MR SINGH:  Yes.  Where were these goods coming from, Mr Shabangu?

WITNESS:   These items was coming from the houses what's burnt down.  And also I realised some of the special constables and some of the Amabutho they was chasing the cattles.

MR SINGH:  Yes, where were they chasing the cattle to?

WITNESS:   The cattle was carrying from the KwaShange area and down to Gezabuso and up to KwaMafunze.  And by the time when the Amabutho was fighting they was taking the cattles, taking the items, and I realised there was another group the time when I entered to the kombi.  There was another people coming from Ezibomvini area.  The man who was leading those people his name was - I know him as Gavaza Khanyile.  That's a  man who's passed away already.  And he was belonging to the IFP that side.  He was coming on the other side of Ezibomvini, and these people with David Ntombela they were coming from this side, from Gezabuso.  And I realised on this moment all the people who are running down, they were running down into the valley, and they were running down to Vulisaka, down to Edendale.  And the unit vehicles came.  Some of the vehicles were parked at Vulisaka, far away from KwaShange.  And on that moment there was no action was taking to attend the scene.  And from there we drive away from the kombis, we went to KwaMafunze area.  That's where the vehicle was parked, that Cantor, and all the items was inside there.

MR SINGH:  Sorry, the items you're referring to being the TVs and radios?

WITNESS:   That's correct.  And on this stage, while I was sitting in the Cantor, and these people carrying the stuff, and some people chasing the cattle, I realised I saw one of the men what I know him.  He was belonging to the IFP.  I know this man the time when I was working at Mqonqo area.  That's Philip Powell.  He was driving - David Ntombela's son was driving the vehicle.  That was a white Sapphire.

MR SINGH:  Sorry, just to draw your attention to your statement.  You say Ford Sierra.  It's paragraph 26.

WITNESS:  Ja, Ford Sierra and Sapphire, I was thinking it as almost same.

MR SINGH:  Yes, all right.

WITNESS:   Well, the Ford Sierra is the old model, the Sapphire is the new model.

MR SINGH: Yes, thank you, Mr Shabangu.  And from there - and then Constable Delport and he recall everything what is happening to the scene.  He recall everything that's happening to the scene, and he inform them back at the office.

MR SINGH:  Mr Shabangu, if I could just assist you.  I know there was some disturbance at the beginning.  Could I just take you back to paragraph 25 of your statement, which you have omitted in your oral evidence?   That's the part where afterwards you contacted the unit, the Riot Unit, and asked them to despatch vehicles to attend to the scene.

WITNESS:   Ja.  On this moment in paragraph 25 there was a lot of vehicles near the unit people.

MR SINGH:  Yes, what vehicles are you referring to?

WITNESS:   I refer the Unit 19 people.  That is people coming from Pretoria.  And the Unit 8 people.  But on this specific moment all the people was nominated they came from the Unit 8.  There was yellow vehicles.

MR SINGH:  Yes.  Was there any discussion then between Mr Ntombela and the Riot Unit?

WITNESS:   On this moment I won't say there was a discussion because I had moved on.

MR SINGH:  Yes, all right, proceed further then over the page.  Can you carry on from there then?

WITNESS:   On paragraph 28 I nominated where I saw this specific man.  He came in from Ezibomvini.  He was driving a Datsun.

MR SINGH:  Yes, and your paragraph above that?

WITNESS:   Which one are you talking - which paragraph?

MR SINGH:  I think you may have a different copy - paragraph 27.1.

WITNESS:   Paragraph 27.1.  David Ntombela he spoke with some of our members at the scene.

MR SINGH:  Please try not talk while the witness is talking.  Yes, carry on, what did he say?

WITNESS:   David Ntombela he spoke with some of our members from the Riot Unit.  So you can see that paragraph 27.1.

MR SINGH:  Yes.  Is there anything else you wish to add?

WITNESS:  (Incomplete - end of Side B, Tape 4) ... where Duma took the Canter.  From the school he drive it where these lot of goods was loaded in.  In paragraph 31.1, that's where the stuff was - TVs and all the items was loaded into the Canter and was taken to KwaMafunze area.

MR SINGH:  All right, then does that conclude your evidence, Mr Shabangu?

WITNESS:   Sorry?

MR SINGH:  Are you finished now?

WITNESS:   That's correct.

MR SINGH:  Mr Shabangu, just to summarise, do you remember when this incident took place?  You didn't give us a specific date as to when this took place.

WITNESS:   I think I say from the beginning that was during March 1990.

MR SINGH:  Yes, but do you remember approximately which day was it?  Was it during this period that has become known as the Seven Day War?

WITNESS:   On this moment I couldn't recall everything on a specific date, because of I couldn't remember the date.

MR SINGH:  All right, but just to summarise your evidence.  You said that you went with Special Constable Duma in an Isuzu Canter motor vehicle, you picked up 25 special constables from Elandskop.

WITNESS:   That's correct.

MR SINGH:  Where were they staying at Elandskop?

WITNESS:   They was staying in Elandskop.

MR SINGH:  Where?

WITNESS:   Some of them was staying in KwaMafunze.

MR SINGH:  Okay.

WITNESS:   Some of them was staying Emaswazini.

MR SINGH:  Okay, so you picked them up from their houses?

WITNESS:  They were collecting to the bus stops.

MR SINGH:  And then you went from there in that vehicle to KwaShange.

WITNESS:   Before we came to KwaShange that's where we find Amabutho.

MR SINGH:  There's where you found Mr Ntombela and Amabutho.

WITNESS:   That's correct.

MR SINGH:  Mr Ntombela told them to get off the truck, is that right?

WITNESS:   That's correct.

MR SINGH:  And then how did - did you go from there to KwaShange?

WITNESS:   This is the same time when Duma assisted - he told me I must drive the Canter and the groups of special constables accompany with the Amabuthos and David Ntombela.

MR SINGH:  So did they travel in the vehicles - in the vehicle?

WITNESS:   No.  They was travelling with foot.

MR SINGH:  On foot.  To KwaShange?

WITNESS:   To KwaShange.

MR SINGH:  And then what happened at KwaShange?  What did the special constables do?

WITNESS:   On KwaShange I drove the Canter behind them, and approximately next to the school, there's a school next to the hill there, about two kilometres from the main road, that's where some of the special constables and Amabutho was running down to the  houses, and some of them was running up to the houses.

MR SINGH:  And what did they do at the houses?

WITNESS:   Firstly when I realised - when I hear - I hear gunshots.

MR SINGH:  So you heard gunshots.

WITNESS:   I hear gunshot.

MR SINGH:  Coming from?

WITNESS:   They were coming from - the sound of the shotgun, because the special constables were carrying the shotguns.

MR SINGH:  So did you conclude that the shots were being fired by the special constables?

WITNESS:   And they were firing - the reason why I say that was them, because of some of the people were running out from the houses.

MR SINGH:  Okay.  And then what happened after that?

WITNESS:   From there there's where I realised to ask assistance, because I didn't realise what was happening.

MR SINGH:  So you radioed for assistance?

WITNESS:  That's correct.