Human Rights Violation Hearings — Soweto — 1996-07-23

RUSSELL ALLY: Three daughters apparently.  What happened to them?  You say they left the country.

ELLIOT NDLOVU: They joined the ANC.  Two went to Zambia and one went to America.  Did complete their courses in America and the two completed out at Zambia.  They are back in the country fortunately.

RUSSELL ALLY: That is very encouraging to hear.  As a school teacher I would just like to know what your reaction was to this instruction that students now had to be taught in the medium of Afrikaans.

ELLIOT NDLOVU: I have known one of the most disturbing things is to have pupils fearing a subject.  You encourage pupils.  The thought of how to teach mathematics and then people just spitefully, I say spitefully because I do not know how many meetings did we attend with one very, very stubborn white inspector who said that, you will do it.  That is you will teach through the medium of Afrikaans, like it or not.  It is a very difficult subject to pupils.  Some of them fear it, but if you go down using new methods they get to like the subject.

RUSSELL ALLY: You also, in your statement, speak about one of
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the negative results of 1976.  The breakdown of discipline, of culture, of learning.  The MEC for education is with is, the engine is here.  What, from your wealth of experience, how do you think some of this can actually be restored in our schools again?

ELLIOT NDLOVU: I think they are following the correct lines by having the parents involved.  The parents, the teacher and the student also involved.  That would very much make relationships better.  I see a bit on that nowadays and I think that is going to pay dividends, but I think this will not succeed if people do not change their attitudes.  You see attitude goes a long way.  There are still people who feel that they still want to wield the power when we speak of Government, of actual unity, but they still want to wield this power as before.  So I see there is a change of heart, not only from one section, but also from the other societies.  Then I think you will succeed.

RUSSELL ALLY: Thank you very much Mr Ndlovu.  I am sure I speak on behalf of the whole Commission when I say that we salute your courage and your wisdom.  Thank you Sir.

ELLIOT NDLOVU: Thank you.

CHAIRPERSON: Yes, Ms Sooka.

YASMINE SOOKA: Mr Ndlovu, one of the tasks of the Commission is to recommend reparation and rehabilitation and also special methods of remembering people who have died.  You have talked about the contribution that was made by the youth in June 1976.  Is there anything that you would like to say about how they can be remembered?

ELLIOT NDLOVU: They started, in actual fact, I would say a start has been made this year by letting these people know the importance of this day.  As I have said those fallen
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heros' they are just not be left unsung like that.  I think that will help even the coming generations to know about this event.  It is very important and I think it is having a global effect, not only on Soweto either.  You see other countries are trying to know what they are worth.  See now, if you are globally consciousised about June 16, what happened and the results thereof, I mean, we have to keep the youth together.  They are the future rulers of this country.

YASMINE SOOKA: Thank you.

CHAIRPERSON: Mr Ndlovu, I will ask you, can you switch off your mike please?

ELLIOT NDLOVU: Once again the blue.

CHAIRPERSON: Yes.  I will ask you a related question to what the fellow Commissioners have just asked.  On the basis of what you are saying we are concerned that we need to assist policy makers to help the present generation of students to raise critical questions about June 16, but at the same time, I suppose, they have a responsibility to guard against creating the, maintaining the diversities that exist which were created by our previous Government in terms of black, white.  What do you think needs to be done to assist students to be aware and to understand what happened, but to move closer to each other instead of maintaining their diversities.

INTERPRETER: The speakers mike is not on.

ELLIOT NDLOVU: As I said they need a lot in their different students.  It is privilege that there are so many of these associations, but if we had one association speaking one language, coming together from time to time, discuss their problems I think the present set of people in the education, SOWETO HEARING GAUTENG PROVINCE
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I think they are there for the help of the students.  Let us not neglect putting their problems before any action, putting their problems to the people who are, relevant people.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you.  Joyce Seroke.

MS SEROKE: Mr Ndlovu, one of our functions is also to investigate some of the conflicts that were taking place such as black on black violence and you mentioned a while ago that when the police came to take you out, nicodemisely, as you said, they made promises to you.  Could you share what those promises were when they wanted you to work for them or that kind of thing?

ELLIOT NDLOVU: No, not to work for them.  Not to work for them.  You see the threat, in those times I did not elaborate on the threats.  The threats were the children.  Where are these children?

MS SEROKE: No, I thought you said they made promises to you.  I thought that is what you said.  If that is not the case, it is okay.

ELLIOT NDLOVU: No, no, not promises.  Not promises.

MS SEROKE: Let us go on and when the children discussed the issue of Afrikaans with you as a principal, did you think that they found it difficult or was it just an attitude against this Afrikaans?

ELLIOT NDLOVU: What had happened prior to the, I was in the primary school then, the present subject then had taken the form ones into the higher primary school and in some of the schools already then, they were boycotting classes.  They were no more attending classes.  Now, I did not have that difficulty because I had sited on giving the children terminologies to, given to them terminologies and then I had SOWETO HEARING GAUTENG PROVINCE
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no boycott, but then all students started boycotting the maths classes and by that boycott they could show that they are not and inspectors knew about it.  When we tried to say, hey man, have a heart, our problems.  No, those were not met.  They were just taken as teething problems when they were really problems.

MS SEROKE: Thank you.

CHAIRPERSON: Mr Ndlovu, I just want to, once more, emphasise what other fellow Commissioners have said.  That we really thank you in a special way for your courage.  You seem to have constructed a meaning for yourself of what happened around that time and that has helped you somehow to live with the losses that directly affected you as a person.  We thank you for that and hope that you will encourage many other parents in a similar position like yourself who had major personal losses.  We thank you very much.

ELLIOT NDLOVU: Thank you.
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