Human Rights Violation Hearings — Pietersburg — 1996-07-19

MR MALAN: You told us a harrowing story of the things that have been happening to you.  You have given us much of that also in your written testimony but you've added a number of things which we've taken note of.
 You asked about the possibility that your mother and friends also may testify.  Of course that can be arranged, they will have to do it in the same way as you did it that they will approach a statement taker who will take their testimonies and then when we return to Pietersburg or to somewhere near to Pietersburg, they will be given the opportunity also to testify and add to what you've said, but they are very welcome and maybe they can even arrange today with statement takers when they can take their statements.
 You've a long account of what's been happening to you and we noted that.  I only want to ask one question for clarification and maybe some of my colleagues would also want to add a few questions.  The question that is bugging me is, why did this to you, why did they keep harassing you for two years, were you in a leadership position, were you involved in many aspects ...(indistinct)?

MR MOGANEDI: Yes I was a leader at that time.  I must say we requested the scholars to give us their support.  It was on the third of March and they said no, they were busy with their tests.  I asked them what we should do because we were fighting against the poor education and no one listened to me.  I then approached the other community and asked them what we should do to get the support of the community.  We came together by selling liquor at home so that we were disguising ourselves so that the police could not see that we were holding a meeting.
 Now some were in the dining room drinking and some were in the bedroom caucusing and a person from Moshate came and then he went to tell the chief what was going on. He told him that there were comrades on the other side who planned to attack him.  I was asked why I was fighting against the chief and what it was that I had against him, but I denied this and said that I only want freedom which cannot be easily achieved.  I realised then that there was a conflict between myself and the chief and I continues with my comradeship work until I met another comrade from outside and on the third of March we started stopping combis and busses and I went to the schools personally to request the scholars to come and support us.  That is the time when the Lebowa government was about to fall.

MR MALAN: Another question for clarification, in those days we heard much about the stoning of police houses and the burning of police cars.  Were you involved in that too?

MR MOGANEDI: I think I've never been involved in the burning, but Mashego was my enemy, yet I've never been to his place to burn his house.  I've never been to his place.  He stayed with me in Jane Furse and he's still there, he doesn't want to speak to me.  I so wish to communicate with him but he doesn't want to.  This is the same person that I referred to in my speech, Mashego, the CID man, he twisted my testicles and I am just worried about them, that is what worries me.

MR MALAN: Any other questions?
(The Chairman asks for order).

PROF MEIRING: I have one question Stephen, you started your evidence by saying that you went to Tafelkop to look for a combi that was stolen and you got hold of the combi and you brought it back.  Whose combi was that and by whom was it stolen?

MR MOGANEDI: This was the combi belonging to Wonder Furnishers and the people from Wonder Furnishers requested us to go and look for this Combi.  It was used to transport meat from the butcheries.  The comrades were inside, the school girls were raped because they were on their way from Ponura Store, then when we heard that this combi was now stolen and the school kids were inside the combi, we started searching for it.  The Wonder people wanted the combi and said that if we get it, we will be rewarded.  We went to search for it and got it and then we also received the reward.  Now as comrades we took it to a place where we knew we'd discipline them.  We took them to a stone where we gave them 10 lashes each and then took them to Ga Marishane where they were supposed to accept that they were guilty.  The people wanted satisfaction because these radicals raped these school kids and we couldn't take the matter to the police because the police were our enemies by then.
 Now we arrived at Ga Marishane, we made them lie on the floor and they got lashes.  They asked for forgiveness and they were released to go to their different homes.  Even now those boys left these terrible things like stealing meat and raping girls since that time and we are living happily and peacefully at Jane Furse at this present moment.

PROF MEIRING: You say that you took them and you lashed them till they confessed that they did steal the combi and raped the girls, is that what you were saying?

MR MOGANEDI: Yes, that's what I said.  They also accepted that they were guilty of rape and they stole this Wonder combi and they took the meat that was inside of it.

PROF MEIRING: Do you not feel bad about your procedures at the time, by lashing people and torturing them into acknowledging that they did a crime or did something wrong?

MR MOGANEDI: No we didn't actually hurt them, we only lashed them on their buttocks.  Each one of them got five and we didn't give them more than five lashes.

PROF MEIRING: I thought I heard you saying 10, a little earlier when you started telling us, but that's not important.  Mr Moganedi, thank you very much, do you nave any further questions?  Dr Ally?

RUSSELL ALLY: Mr Moganedi you say that you were charged with public violence, what exactly were you charged for, this was in your statement, you were arrested and you were charged with public violence, what was that charge and what happened?

MR MOGANEDI: These charges were because I was a comrade and they took me to court but I didn't plead guilty.  From that time, on the third of March and the 6th of April till 1988, I did not plead guilty but they took me to court.

RUSSELL ALLY: And what happened in court, were the charges dropped against you?

MR MOGANEDI: Yes all the charges were dropped, I was acquitted and nothing was done to me.

RUSSELL ALLY: Just one last question, have you ever had a medical examination to establish if you are not able to have children or are you just assuming that as a result of what happened to you that's the case?

MR MOGANEDI: My wife is here, that is why I said to you I spent 12 years with her and nothing is happening.  I sleep with her every day but I cannot procreate.

PROF MEIRING: Thank you very much.  (Calls public to order)

THOMAS MANTHATA: Do you say your mother can witness or can testify that you were mishandled by the police?  Were you referring to the tortures that they were applying to you, was your mother close to you or in the presence of the police?

MR MOGANEDI: They would take me in the presence of my mother at home, but before they could go away with me they would hit and assault me.  She would stand there and look at me, and I said to her, "Please mother don't cry, I will come back!  But if I don't come back, don't worry".  They wanted so many things from my mother and they forced her to take the AK 47 rifle out and she was even assaulted by those soldiers.

THOMAS MANTHATA: I thank you.

PROF MEIRING: Thank you very much for your evidence.  We will study all that you have given us.  We will appreciate it if you will take your friends and your mother also to make further statements that can shed more light on the subject and we can study those when they come to us, and we will in due course come back to you and report to you, and we will certainly report on this matter.  Thank you very much for giving us of your time.  May you go well.