Human Rights Violation Hearings — Pietermaritzburg — UNKNOWN

MR SINGH:  Your story is the sad one, Mr Zondi.  We can tell from the way you relate your story.  You know, you've gotten into the details of the story, and we can tell from the way you relate that you are so highly affected.  Now, tell us about the cattle.  What happened to those cattles and so forth.  Did they sell them?

WITNESS:   I had cattle.

MR SINGH:  (Incomplete) ... took the cattle, did they sell those cattle, or what happened to those cattle?

WITNESS:   Oh, now I understand.  They took those cattle to slaughter them, because on Thursday one of them said that - I can't even remember his name - said, "You see the soldiers doing

MR SINGH: /"this

MR SINGH: this and that.  I did slaughter two Zondi's cattle."  Some were taken to Elandskop Mafuza(?) where they were distributed respectively to some people, and two of those cattle were returned.  They came back to my place.  They came, two cattle.  Now, one day as I was just taking a walk, and hiding at the same time so that I may not be seen, I took those two cattle.  I told the boys that I have seen my cattle and I will take them with to Edendale.  Unfortunately, most unfortunately, they came to steal them from Edendale.

MR SINGH:  You've also said that when there was a visitor - one visitor was hurt, was injured on the arm and was admitted to the hospital.  What hospital was the visitor admitted to?

WITNESS:   He was injured on his arm.  He is though far away from our place.

MR SINGH:  Where is that?  What are you talking about?

WITNESS:   He did not die.  He is still alive.

MR SINGH:  No, Mr Zondi, I don't get you, I am lost now.  You say the one who was injured on his arm is still alive.  You mean the boy who was injured?

WITNESS:   Yes, he is alive.  I have seen him, although his arm was highly affected.

MR SINGH:  You mean now his arm never functioned quite well after that?

WITNESS:   I don't think so because he was a Malombo boy, where my sister was married to.

MR SINGH:  I think we should encourage that family as well, you know, so that we get the full details of the story direct from them and see how we can help them.

WITNESS:   I will try my best to meet the uncle, because the uncles are still there at Mnyandu.  They are still a few of those who never left the area.  I can get back to the uncles. My last question, Mr Zondi.  At Mnyandu and the neighbouring places what's there now?  Are there any houses still, or how does the area look like now?  Has it changed completely?   ---   You see, the houses that were not attacked the owners went back to occupy those houses, but as for my area I think it was only one or two families that went back.  I also from time to time go and see how things are going on.  My kids are there, but I am not there.  And there's no day when I've arrived at that place and see nothing - and discover nothing.  Every day damage was taking place.

MR SINGH:  Mr Zondi, you've said in your statement there was a white policeman, and the policeman came to you and said you and your boys have to repent and join the Inkatha organisation so that the rest of others can easily follow.  Would you perhaps tell us his name?

WITNESS:   Yes, I know, but I won't mention his name because I may be killed tomorrow. That is the very policeman that gained entry through the window, and the other one.  They came inside the house through the window.

MR SINGH:  Well, I do understand why you don't want to tell us his name.  Maybe some other time you will tell us.  But you also said there were policemen that came to arrest you and you were detained for the whole weekend.  Do you know those police now who arrested you?

WITNESS:   I know this white policeman, because he was also there, but when we went to the police station he drove past and he handed us over to others, the black ... (intervention)

MR SINGH:  You mean the black policemen?

WITNESS:   No, they were mixed black and white policemen. Do you know their names?  What I want is their names.   ---   You mean the police?

MR SINGH:  Yes.

WITNESS:   No, I won't disclose their names.  In fact I only know one police because he was so much known, notorious because of things he used to do.  Otherwise the rest of the policemen I don't know their names.

MR SINGH:  Mr Zondi, what court did you appear in that Monday and then where the case was withdrawn against you?  Which court was that?

WITNESS:   I beg your pardon?

MR SINGH:  Which court did you appear in, which Magistrate's Court?

WITNESS:   It was just Vulindlela Court.

MR SINGH:  Thank you.  Which of the two courts there?  There are two courts.  We can go back and look at the records, you see.

WITNESS:   At Vulindlela.  There is only one court there, but it is divided into two rooms.

MR SINGH: That's right.

MR SINGH:  Mr Zondi, we've discovered here that the media people did come to you to converse with you from overseas in Holland.  I think those were the ones you met on your way.  We will be showing that picture on Thursday morning at 9.00 am.  In case you are interested to take a look on that photo please do come and look at it.  We think you are the one who talked to those two men.

WITNESS:   Yes, different white men came.  Others were from Scotland.  I have forgotten the others where they were coming from, and they were with Peter.

MR SINGH: They were coming from Holland, as I have said.  On Thursday morning at 9.00 am we will be showing that picture.  Please, we invite you to come and take a look on the picture.

MR SINGH: Mr Zondi, thank you very, very much.  The story that you have told us is a story of political intolerance, not a story of war.  I agree with you that war implies a clash of two armed groups or two armed forces, and it doesn't mean the murder of innocent people.  You said that you and your father and your grandfather were all born in KwaMnyandu, and it seems that on that one day in March that the work of three generations was destroyed.  And now as a pensioner you have ... (intervention)

MR SINGH: Please, good people, do not embarrass us.  Please don't embarrass us.  The Commissioner is trying to talk to Mr Zondi, but you are making noise.  Please, we call that you maintain order and behave yourselves.  This is embarrassing, for your information.

MR SINGH:  ... and that as a pensioner you are now left without a home and without those assets that you saved up for your old age.  And you might wonder why you have been asked to go through this again, to tell us your story, and as difficult as it is for you it's important to do what you and your brother a few minutes ago did, to tell your story about this event.  This story has never been told officially before.  Statements have been taken, but this story has never ever been told officially, and you and the other witnesses who have given evidence today have told that story, and this enables us to make recommendations to the Government, to the State President, as to how you and the many other people who suffered during that time in 1990 should be helped.  So it is important that you come here today, and we thank you for having had the courage to come and relive those days.  Thank you very much indeed.