Amnesty Hearings — Pretoria — 1996-07-01

ANDRIES HENDRIK ALBERTS: AWSA is for Action to Save White South Africa. It was a new political body which came into being in the early Eighties.  As the name indicates it was to save White South Africa from the Communist onslaught, as the perspective in right-wing ranks in those days was. In the early Eighties I began to act as an activist at political meetings, disrupting political meetings.  This resulted inter alia in a situation in which for the first time since 1948 when the National Party came to power, that in the Transvaal we could introduce successfully a motion of no-confidence in the Minister of the National Party. On occasions I also disrupted the meetings of Minister Hendrik, Minister Fanie Botha at Groblersdal and Marble Hall, to the extent that they were unable to hold a meeting.
	Actions of this type that resulted that we continued to prevent National Party Ministers from appearing in public. It led to an offensive in Brits where Minister Louis Nel was literally chased away and prevented from holding his meeting.
	At that stage actions of this kind grasped the imagination of the supporters of right-wing politics. I prevented Mr Kobie Coetzee from holding a meeting at Nylstroom.  This had a snowball effect.  Until at Pietersburg we prevented Mr Pik Botha from holding a meeting.  I think it is important in the development of right-wing politics in these time to note, and I want to say this in the context of the fact that we now have to deal with the NSP and organisations which began with four members. Unfortunately their arrest shortly after their establishment still consisted only of four members.  With the AWB of which I was a member, if not a founder member, but that was founded with seven members.  
	At the time of this incident at Pietersburg, the tremendous extent it attained, it is difficult to say how many, but there were more than 6 000 supporters from right-wing ranks at this occasion, and we took over the Jack Botha hall, and we were eventually driven out there by the police with tear-gas.
	This was prominently mentioned in the media and the AWB became an important factor in right-wing politics. In the days following that, we couldn't cope with the applications for membership and our membership grew up to the 100 000s.
	It is important to make the point that we began with seven and then we literally grew by hundreds of thousands in these years.
	It was really all about ideology, a liberation ideology. I think that to a degree the ideology had its origin in the National Party, the early days of the National Party.  Then the National Party frightened us with the total onslaught, which was presented to us as manifested in Central Africa and the liberation phase of Central Africa, films which were displayed here as was mentioned here yesterday, Adios Africa, for example, Afrika Adios, in which there was an emphasis on violence. The national media in the early Sixties showed many photographs of the violence in the Belgian Congo and so on.
	In right-wing circles, I believe there was a psychosis of fear, a fear that incidents of this kind would repeat themselves here, particularly if we found ourselves at the mercy of a Black Communist government. I think that also provided the basis for the entire right-wing resistance movements as manifest in the AWB, the BBB, the Boerestaat Party, AWSA and numerous such like right-wing movements. Many of which sprang up, which perhaps weren't as well-known.  But there was an all-encompassing right-wing feeling of resistance.  
	Actually, as I said it was a psychosis of fear which manifested itself.  The fear that we would find ourselves at the mercy of similar unfortunate situations as had occurred in the rest of Africa.
	As part of my resistance, as early as 1987 in the May election, I placed a full page colour advertisement in a local newspaper, to warn against this trend, a political trend of that time. In essence, the main theme of this advertisement was that nobody had done more to promote the interests of the ANC and the Communists in South Africa, than the National Party at that time.  	
	In numerous conversations and discussions that I had with Minister Adriaan Vlok, with whom I was closely befriended in those years, I expressed my concern to him about this trend and their failure as police to act against the Communists in the propagation of a Communist policy in South Africa.
	It went to such an extent that I threatened him with certain action, because the police failed to act - and I am referring to August 1987, but this is an approximate indication, when Mr Joe Slovo was allowed to appear on South African TV for about three quarters of an hour in a discussion, while in fact technically the ANC was still a banned organisation.  The National Party and the Police failed to act.  
	You see, in right-wing circles this made us feel that we were already then thrown to the mercy of this, the mercy of a Communist system was already happening. In fact, this is how we experienced it.
	I and Minister Vlok had a debate which lasted some time about the people who had gone to Dakar to hold discussions with the ANC.  This included Dr Van Zyl Slabbert, Alex Boraine, that group. I led the demonstration at the airport, to prevent this kind of thing, and some of our people were arrested there.
	I am telling you this so that people can see that it wasn't simply an emotional swelling of resistance. It was considered and deliberate well-thought out intention and act in the right-wing circles, to resist a process that we saw happening. 
	Discussions between me and Adriaan Vlok dealt with the fact that I said that these people were traitors.  At that time according to the National Party the ANC had been identified as the enemy of the people. 
	Now if one goes and has discussions with the enemy then that's high treason. But there was no action. No action was taken here.
	As I said, in my own capacity as a political activist, I showed my resistance at political meetings.  At a meeting at which Mr P W Botha appeared, I asked many questions and held the views that I didn't accept the appointed chairperson. He chastised me.  I laid a charge at the South African Police which was investigated. A charge of crimen injuria.  The investigation proved that I did have a well-founded case but didn't go any further.  The Attorney-General refused to prosecute.
	However, I used this situation specifically as political propaganda against the National Party, in order to discredit the National Party.
	At another time I publicly objected at a meeting of Minister Louis le Grange who was Minister of Police at that time and I objected to the misuse of the security forces at political meetings.  This had become an institution at National Party meetings. I said that I would not apply for bail because I didn't want to try to buy my freedom, because I couldn't exercise my democratic rights in this country.

UNKNOWN: Could you perhaps get to Du Plessis and Van Wyk a bit more quickly so we can see about your involvement there.

ANDRIES HENDRIK ALBERTS: Mr Jean van Wyk and I held certain discussions during 1990, at which we talked about these political views.

UNKNOWN: Was Mr Van Wyk alone?