Human Rights Violation Hearings — Queenstown — UNKNOWN

MS MAYA: For how long were you receiving this R54-00?

MRS MBANGO: It was just for a few months that I received R54-00 then they stopped giving it to me.

MS MAYA: What is your wish, how can we help you as a Commission?

MRS MBANGO: I'm asking this Commission to send my children to school and also to organise accommodation for me, because I am really hurt.  I am suffering if my sister was not there, I would just be nothing.

MS MAYA: We thank you Mrs Mbango.  We shall ask Nolifisi Loliwe Nondleko to give us her side of the story.
 Ms Loliwe, could you tell us of the pain you experienced on the 12th of August in 1985 about Shwalakhe your son?

BONGANI FINCA: We are asking for silence please.

MS MAYA: when you talked about him, you said he was your last boy and he was 15 years old because he was born in 1970.  Now could you tell us briefly.

NND LOLIWE: Yes, everything is like that as you've said.  QUEENSTOWN HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE
14 NND LOLIWE
I was at work and it was in the morning.  Some children came to call me and they said there was fire in the location.
 When I got there I couldn't see this child, so I went looking for him.  I asked his friends as well, they said they had last seen him in the morning, so I went to the hospital.
 When I got there, I met a clerk at the hospital.  I asked him whether they had not seen these children, then he said some are there, but yours is in the mortuary.
 I did not go there, I turned.  I woke up in the morning on a Tuesday and went to the hospital and then I asked them to show me the body of my son.
 Then they did that.  He was - the body was placed in a very bad way and his eyes were not closed, he was laying on his side as if they had just thrown the body anyhow, so I went back home.
 I asked men from my family to go and prepare his body and even put his body straight, so they went and they did exactly that.
 We then went to the police station together with Mbango to find out about certain things.  The police distanced themselves, but we kept quiet and we did not get any attention for quite a long time, until we got attended to.

MS MAYA: ; Why was your son shot at?

NND LOLIWE: He was coming from school.

MS MAYA: Was he a student in that same school where there was some disturbances and policemen were involved?

NND LOLIWE: I don't know, because I was in the place where I was working.  I just heard that he had been shot at by Grootboom.

MS MAYA: Was this Grootboom ever taken to court or arrested QUEENSTOWN HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE
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or any charges that were laid against Grootboom?

NND LOLIWE: No, there were none and I really didn't know because I was just all by myself.

MS MAYA: ; So there was no follow up to that effect to find out what had actually happened?  As you were preparing for the funeral, is there anything that was disturbing to you?

NND LOLIWE: ; Do you mean the policemen?  Yes, they troubled us because when we were going to the grave, they were there waiting with guns in their hands.

MS MAYA: Did they disturb you where you were conducting the funeral?

NND LOLIWE: No, they did not.

MS MAYA: I am sure you have got aims by coming here to this Commission.  Do you need perhaps any help in as far as the injury of your son is concerned?

NND LOLIWE: I wish that I could get help, because the father of my son is paralysed, he is not working and I also don't have any income.

MS MAYA: I want to ask this question to all of you.  You may not answer this question now, but perhaps if you are ready, you may ask it.  Those children of yours who died, how can they be commemorated?  Is there any answer to the question, are you ready with your answer?
 We shall therefore give you time so that you bring the answer one other time after you have perhaps discussed this question.  Not now, Mr Ndletyana, you can take your time and give us the reply later.  Ms Loliwe, we thank you.  We have heard your story.

BONGANI FINCA: Let us now thank Ms Maya.  Are there any questions?  Mr Ntsikelelo Sandi, over to you.

MR SANDI: These few questions I am going to ask, can be
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answered two of these males.  When all this happened, was there a curvue in Molteno which is a law which forbids people to be moving up and down at night?

W NDLETYANA: No, I've never heard of it.

MR SANDI: Could you come closer to the microphone.

W NDLETYANA: Me as a listener, I've never heard anything of that nature.

MR SANDI: ; We heard when you were explaining what happened to your people, are there any other facts that you are aware of that could have been done by the policemen to other people who happen not to be present here today?

W NDLETYANA: There are people who suffered, just like us, who are not present here today.

MR SANDI: What are those the shooting incidents and the killings?

W NDLETYANA: ; Yes, they were shot at by Potgieter.  He is the very person who was shooting.

MR SANDI: ; Besides the problems that were there at school, in as far as the education of your children is concerned, are there any other problems that were there that were affecting the community members because I observe that you all talk about disturbances and troubles.  What were the problems that people as community members were encountering?

W NDLETYANA: As community members, since there were two parties there, the ANC and the PAC, there were no serious clashes between these two organisations.

MR SANDI: ; I'm actually referring to problems that were posed by the requirements of the people like lack of taps, lack of accommodation, lack of work.  I am just giving these as an example.

W NDLETYANA: Those were the main problems in Molteno.
QUEENSTOWN HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE
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Accommodation, lack of water and many others were the problems.
 And this is still the same case, even now.

MR SANDI: Many people there in Molteno, I am asking now what the situation is there, because I have never been to the place.  People there in Molteno, how did they actually live?  Where do they work?  Do they work in factories, are there any?

W NDLETYANA: There are only two factories in Molteno, that is a bakery and a factory for bones only.

MR SANDI: Thank you.

BONGANI FINCA: Mr Sandi.  Mr Ndletyana, were there some other organisations, community organisations or the organisations that were from the Government that were attending to these problems which you referred to earlier on?

W NDLETYANA: Organisations that were there that were established by the Government was a Crisis Office, then another one was to help the residents which was the ANC office.

MR SANDI: Do you want to say there was a Residents' Association or Civic Association - was there anything like that there?

W NDLETYANA: Yes, there were but we really can't figure out what is happening, because you don't know how they were established and then we just can't get anything how they operate.

MR SANDI: Were there any Community Councils?

W NDLETYANA: Yes, Community Councils were there before, but they were just like terrorists to the people.

MR SANDI: Thank you.   Thank you Chairperson.
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BONGANI FINCA: How many headphones do you have there? Now we are going to ask them to put on their headphones, because Dr Ramashala is going to give a summary.