Amnesty Hearings — East London — 1999-06-17

BENJAMIN MVUYISI YOYO: The people who were coming in, whereas the others were already there on the podium, but those who were coming in, my duty was to collect their firearms.  We were not taking those firearms by force, they would be told that they would be sitting there nicely and their firearms would be kept safely.

MS COLLETT: Why would there firearms be taken from them though?  Why couldn't they keep them?

BENJAMIN MVUYISI YOYO: We wanted to keep their firearms safe and there was no complain after that and there was no complain before.

MS COLLETT: But surely being senior Policemen, they were capable of keeping their own firearms safe?

BENJAMIN MVUYISI YOYO: Each and everyone there, the people who got up to the podium, would be able to keep their firearms, but I had to keep their firearms.  The firearms of all the people who were on the podium, I had to keep their firearms.

MS COLLETT: You see, you are not answering my question, I want to know why.

BENJAMIN MVUYISI YOYO: If you go  up to a place like that, like a podium, your firearm should be kept safely somewhere else.  Even the soldiers who were senior soldiers, their firearms were with me, I had to keep them.  The reason being that we wanted the people to sit there nicely, nothing bad was happening, the people were just singing as they were sitting there.  We had to take their firearms, there was nothing else.  People sometimes do commit suicide after having some thoughts, so we had to keep their firearms safe and we succeeded in doing that.

MS COLLETT: Is that regular practice to take firearms away from senior Officers if they sit on the podium?

BENJAMIN MVUYISI YOYO: We had to keep safe their firearms for each and everyone who would be going up the podium.

MS COLLETT: On other days besides this day?

BENJAMIN MVUYISI YOYO: That was a normal procedure to keep the firearms.

MS COLLETT: Would you agree with me that the senior Officers were on the podium unarmed, whilst all the other Policemen that were in the hall, were armed?

BENJAMIN MVUYISI YOYO: I am talking about that particular podium.  The people who were not on the podium, were singing.  I am talking about the podium that I was on.

MS COLLETT: Yes, I know, but do you agree with me that the other Policemen that were in the hall, had firearms?  Their firearms were not taken from them?

BENJAMIN MVUYISI YOYO: Even those who were on the podium, some of them were armed, more especially the white Officers because we couldn't touch them at the time.  I am certain that they had firearms, the white Officers, that is.  A person who would come in, would hand over the firearm to me for safekeeping.  He wouldn't be forced to do so, he would just place it on the table.   Because it is what was said that nothing was going to happen to those Officers, therefore they should just hand over.  There was order in that hall.

MS COLLETT: Were those superior Officers that were on the podium, guarded with people who had firearms?

BENJAMIN MVUYISI YOYO: I am the one who was sitting there with them, what do you mean guarding them?  They were already under guard because they were sitting there in order with me, as I was also on the podium.

MS COLLETT: I mean were there other soldiers who were not senior Officers that were pointing firearms at the senior Officers?

BENJAMIN MVUYISI YOYO: No one was pointed at with a gun.

MS COLLETT: No further questions.
NO FURTHER QUESTIONS BY MS COLLETT

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you.  Mr Mapoma, any questions?

MR MAPOMA: Chairperson, thank you, I've got no questions.
NO CROSS-EXAMINATION BY MR MAPOMA

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you Mr Mapoma.  Has the panel got any questions?

ADV BOSMAN: No questions, thank you Mr Chairman.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you.  Any re-examination?

MR OBOSE: One question Mr Chairman.  You mentioned soldiers, what had they gone there to do or what did they do even when they got there?

BENJAMIN MVUYISI YOYO: They were just sitting there and they were also interested in getting Gqozo down.

MR OBOSE: Thank you Mr Chairman.
NO FURTHER QUESTIONS BY MR OBOSE

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you Mr Obose.  Mr Yoyo, thank you, you are excused.
WITNESS EXCUSED