Human Rights Violation Hearings — East London — 1996-04-16

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very much, thank you Mama.  Are there any questions?

DR BORAINE: Mrs Mkhonto, I just have one question, to assist us to do what you 
would like us to do, I need a little more information and it may be that some of your 
EAST LONDON  HEARING TRC/

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SANDISWA MKHONTO: colleagues next to you could help you with this as well. You have said that you have made 
a civil case against the State and that no settlement has been reached yet, but you are 
hoping that it will come soon.  You are asking us to try and expedite that.  It would help us 
a lot if you could tell us whether the relief you are seeking, has been asked from the 
Department of Justice or from the Department of Defence, or both, or some other 
department so that we can try and make contact with them as soon as possible?   Shall I 
repeat the question?

SANDISWA MKHONTO: Yes please.

DR BORAINE: Sure.  I was saying that one of the requests that you have made to the 
Commission is that we should try and help to bring the settlement, the claim that you have 
made, as soon as possible, and we of course, would like to do that but it would help us if 
you could tell us against which Department or against which Minister, you are making this 
claim, so that we can be in touch with them as soon as possible?

SANDISWA MKHONTO: It is the Army and the Police that I request, both departments.

DR BORAINE: That's very helpful.
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MR SMITH: Mr Chairman, I will now proceed to lead the evidence of Mrs Mhlawuli.  
Good afternoon  Mrs Mhlawuli.

MRS MHLAWULI: Good afternoon Mr Smith.

MR SMITH: You are a lecturer at Belville Training College at the present moment?

MRS MHLAWULI: Yes Mr Smith, I've been seconded to Belville Training College as a 
lecturer in the new Department of 
Xhosa.

MR SMITH: So are you residing in Belville or Cape Town now?

MRS MHLAWULI: No we are in Claremont at the moment.

MR SMITH: Tell us Mrs Mhlawuli, a little bit about yourself, your husband, you're 
obviously here to tell, to relate to the Commission the disappearance and subsequent 
murdering and killing of your husband?  When did you meet Sicelo for the first time?

MRS MHLAWULI: I was born in Cradock.  I am Nombuyiselo Zonke.  I attended 
school there at Cradock and Sicelo was attending school at the secondary school. Matthew 
was my teacher who was a friend to Sicelo.  When I finished schooling at Cradock, I went 
to Mount Isa college where I trained as a teacher.  I came back and worked for a short 
period in Cradock.  I went again to Tembasa. At that time Sicelo was working at 
Temblabantu High School as a teacher in Zwelitsha.  We struck a friendship which 
developed into a relationship but we were not married at the time. We got married in 
1980.
 We were blessed with two children, Bawuli was born in 1976 and Nsika was born 
in 1981. The third child, the late 
Bantu, was born in 1985.

MR SMITH: At the time when your husband was teaching at EAST LONDON  
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MHLAWULI: Dimbaza, and you were also there at Dimbaza, he had some problems with the then 
Ciskeian authorities?

MR SMITH: Yes it is like that, there at Dimbaza, when he was working Tembalabantu, 
the students were striking there.
My brother and his cousins were amongst them as well as my husband.  They were 
arrested and taken into custody in Zwelitsha.  Sicelo went to court and he came back the 
following day.  In fact he was called and informed that there was a section of intelligence 
which was headed by Charles Sebe, and this messenger came in and we started to be 
frightened because we knew what was going to follow because of Section R252 under 
which, if you were arrested, you knew that you would be put into detention in Zwelitsha 
where the police cells were very cold.
 At the same time I was afraid and I was putting myself in his boots.  Charles Sebe 
asked him what he wanted at that place.  A receipt was taken out and he was told that he 
was going to be watched. He went away from Tambalabantu and came to join me at 
Dimbaza. There is a school there, Atchivelile and he was there.  At the time there were a 
lot of things to do and there were times that we had to do some of the things that we didn't 
like.  We went to Keiskammahoek and we were obliged to pay certain taxes which we 
didn't understand. Because Sicelo didn't want to pay these fees there was a lady who used 
to pay on his behalf because she feared that he would get into trouble.
 This continued for quite a long time. One day while 
the students from Atchivelile were engaged in unrest, the Ciskeian police came and 
assaulted the children while dispersing them, and this they did until there were 
injuries.  Sicelo, my husband, took the children to Dimbaza EAST LONDON

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MHLAWULI: clinic and this got him into trouble, because the following day, the police came in and took 
him into custody where he was interrogated. He was asked why he took the children to 
hospital and he said he was trying to save their lives. He was released but from then on the 
Ciskeian police periodically interrogated him wherever he might be.
 This created a label against him. I was always very frightened when I saw a police 
van, because I would get his clothes for fear that they had come to take him away to those 
cold cells.  He would just keep calm but at that time they didn't take him. We discussed 
the matter and felt that we ought to leave Dimbaza and I was highly expectant that June. 
In July I started to work as a teacher.  We decided that he should be the one to leave and I 
would keep the home fires burning.  
 The following year I joined him and then in October 1981, I delivered. In 1982 I 
went to work at Oudtshoorn.  We worked together for quite a long time. He was my 
principle at the time, so things were quiet for a while, but the times at Oudtshoorn when 
we could realise that we were struggling because it was a very small place.  There was no 
accommodation, you would put up even a shack which we didn't mind as long as we had 
dropped the trail of the police.
 When we saw people demolish a house, we took the bricks and tried to extend the 
house in which we were able to stay. At a later stag, because he was a friend to Matthew, 
there was a rally ...(intervention)

MR SMITH: Before we get to that, did your husband become involved in politics when 
he was at Oudtshoorn?

MRS MHLAWULI: Yes he was involved in politics, there was
a youth organisation and he also took part in the community EAST LONDON  
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MHLAWULI: based newspaper..  (end of tape) ....

MR SMITH: This relationship with the others, with Matthew and the others?

MRS MHLAWULI: His friendship with Matthew started some time back, as I said 
before, he was the teacher and in 1976, between '76 and '77, Matthew was arrested in 
Wellington at Umtata.  When he was arrested, Sicelo said that we should go and visit him. 
It was stated that not everyone could go in and as the child was not allowed to enter, I was 
left behind. He was very angry about this because he couldn't see me.  When he was 
released he even told me that the mere fact that I had travelled such a long distance and 
yet couldn't see him, gave him a problem.
 At this time I was afraid to refer to him as Matthew, and always called him 
Teacher but at that time I had to do it.  Our friendship started a very long time ago, it didn't 
start in 1985.

MR SMITH: Now your husband also went to attend the launch of the UDF, that was in 
1982?