Human Rights Violation Hearings — King William's Town — 1997-05-13

CHAIRPERSON: Mrs Nana, who is with you?

VUYSWA NANA: My daughter.

CHAIRPERSON: Is she going to testify?

VUYSWA NANA: Yes.

CHAIRPERSON: What is her name?

VUYSWA NANA: It is Vuyswa Nana.

VUYSWA NANA: (sworn states)

KOKO GODANA: (sworn states)

REV XUNDU: Thank you Mr Chairperson.  Your story Ma'am, in front of us, I would like you briefly to give us a clear picture of what happened to Desmond Nana on that day. Please come nearer to the microphone.

VUYSWA NANA: It was at about half past six, we heard that Desmond Nana was shot by Macebo Ndinisa in the township.

REV XUNDU: Who told you this?

VUYSWA NANA: One young man came asking whether we knew them.  I said yes, he was my son.

REV XUNDU: Was he a member of any political organisation?

VUYSWA NANA: He was a member of the ANC.

REV XUNDU: At the time of this incident, what was happening in the township, was there a consumer boycott?

VUYSWA NANA: There was a toyi-toyi in the township.

REV XUNDU: There was no boycott?

VUYSWA NANA: Yes.

REV XUNDU: The municipality police were the ones who were disrupting the people who were in the struggle?

VUYSWA NANA: Yes.

REV XUNDU: This Kits Constable is he Macebo Ndinisa?

VUYSWA NANA: Yes.

REV XUNDU: Do you know him?

VUYSWA NANA: Yes, I know him.

REV XUNDU: Where is he now?

VUYSWA NANA: He hanged himself.

REV XUNDU: Between your family and Ndinisa's family, was there a conflict?

VUYSWA NANA: No, there was no conflict.

REV XUNDU: He shot your son because he was against Kits Constables?

VUYSWA NANA: Yes.

REV XUNDU: Would you like to add something my sister?

VUYSWA NANA: Yes, I do.  He told my brother to give him a passport.  My brother told him that he left his passport at home, that is when he shot at him.

REV XUNDU: That was the reason for the shooting?

VUYSWA NANA: Yes, he shot him because of that.

REV XUNDU: Did Desmond have a wife at that time?

VUYSWA NANA: No, he did not have a wife.

REV XUNDU: Does he have any children?

VUYSWA NANA: No.

REV XUNDU: Was he at school?

VUYSWA NANA: He was working at the time.

REV XUNDU: Where was he working?

VUYSWA NANA: He was working for SACHA.

REV XUNDU: You were depending on him?

VUYSWA NANA: Yes.

REV XUNDU: What would you like Ma'am, what would you like the Commission to do for you?

VUYSWA NANA: There is nobody supporting me.  There is nobody working for me.  I am just staying with my children.  There is no one at home.

REV XUNDU: Do you get an old age grant?

VUYSWA NANA: No.

REV XUNDU: Were you affected, how was your health affected by this?

VUYSWA NANA: My left arm is not working properly.  I got injured at work, I was working in the bakery.

REV XUNDU: You mentioned children.

VUYSWA NANA: I have two children.  This one and a young boy.  My young boy is still at school.   This one is not attending school because I don't have money.  She completed standard 10, my young boy is doing standard 2.

REV XUNDU: Those are your requests you would like us to forward to the President of this country?

VUYSWA NANA: Yes.

REV XUNDU: Thank you Ma'am.  Let me now go to Mr Godana.  What is your clan name sir?

KOKO GODANA: I am Nuyabe.

REV XUNDU: Please tell us briefly sir what happened to you so that we can find out what the condition was at that time.

KOKO GODANA: I am here today.  I have a brother by the name of Joseph Mzingaye Godana.  He was working in the mine.  He came back home, he stayed for two weeks.  There was a toyi-toyi then.  Two people came.  He was working in the yard at home.
 These people said that the crowd was looking for you, he said I am busy working.  They ten came to the yard to take him.  They gave him five litre petrol.

REV XUNDU: Was your brother a member of any organisation?

KOKO GODANA: No, he was working in Johannesburg, he was not a member of an organisation.  He just arrived from Johannesburg.  He was not a member in the township.
 Everybody was supposed to go with the crowd.

REV XUNDU: Were these people members of any organisation?

KOKO GODANA: They were the people who were toyi-toying.  He was taken by the people who was toyi-toying.  They were going to Cenyu in Vusumzi Kula's home.  Alcohol was banned in the township.  Vusumzi had a sjibeen.
 These people were going there to burn down his sjibeen.  They found Dlomba there.  Dlomba in the sjibeen.

REV XUNDU: Who  is Dlomba?

KOKO GODANA: Dlomba is a policeman.

REV XUNDU: What happened then?

KOKO GODANA: When he saw them, he pulled out his gun and he shot at them.  He shot three of them and others ran away.

INTERPRETER: The speaker's microphone is not on.

REV XUNDU: What then happened?

KOKO GODANA: He was shot, that happened at about eleven o'clock.  He got help at about three o'clock.  He was shot by Dlomba in the head.  They were going towards the sjibeen.

REV XUNDU: Was there a case against Dlomba?  Was there a case against Dlomba?  I don't know whether Dlomba is his surname or his name.

REV XUNDU: Was there a case against him?  You said that Dlomba is the one who shot your brother, was he charged of anything?

KOKO GODANA: No, he was not charged.  It is the first time that this thing comes to public.

REV XUNDU: Did you go to any Attorney?

KOKO GODANA: No, I did not go to any Attorney.

REV XUNDU: Did you go to report this matter to the police?

KOKO GODANA: Yes, I did.

REV XUNDU: What did they say?

KOKO GODANA: The police showed me my brother in the mortuary.  I saw my brother, I saw the bullet hole in his head.  We then buried him.

REV XUNDU: Did you get a death certificate?

KOKO GODANA: Yes, I did.

REV XUNDU: Who was the Doctor?  Who was the Doctor who signed the death certificate?

KOKO GODANA: I got the death certificate in the police certificate, I did not get it from the Doctor.  He was not taken to a Doctor.

REV XUNDU: Did your brother have a wife?

KOKO GODANA: No, he did not have a wife.

REV XUNDU: Did he have children?

KOKO GODANA: No.

REV XUNDU: What would you like the Commission to forward to the President of this country?

KOKO GODANA: I would like to be helped to build a house and to get money from where he was working in Johannesburg.

REV XUNDU: He did not get anything from his work?

KOKO GODANA: No.

REV XUNDU: Did you get any letters from them?

KOKO GODANA: No.

REV XUNDU: Do you still have his ID?

KOKO GODANA: His ID is in the police station.

REV XUNDU: We have to get the documents so that you can be helped to get his pension money from Johannesburg.
 What else is your request?

KOKO GODANA: The government will see what to do for me.

REV XUNDU: You mentioned Creches at Bethel Mission?

KOKO GODANA: It is a house.

REV XUNDU: A house for what?

KOKO GODANA: It is a house for me to stay and my children.

REV XUNDU: You will say that the creche is the house where you and your children are staying?

KOKO GODANA: Yes.

REV XUNDU: I thought that you wanted this creche for the young children?

KOKO GODANA: I just want a house.

REV XUNDU: We will forward your request to the President of this country.  For now, let me hand over to my Chairperson.  Maybe he's got questions for you.

CHAIRPERSON: June Crichton?

JUNE CRICHTON: Vuyswa can answer if it is better, I don't mind.  Vuyswa you told us that a civil claim was instituted on this case.  I am not sure if I missed it when you were being asked questions earlier.
 But can you tell us the name of the Attorney who instituted that case?

VUYSWA NANA: The case was opened in the police station, it was never taken to an Attorney.  Mr Dunkin Qacqa said that he was going to consult an ANC Attorney.  It was the last time we heard about it.  We then went to the police station to open a case, but the case did not go any further.