Human Rights Violation Hearings — Soweto — 1996-07-22

ELLEN KUZWAYO: The very fact Madam Commissioner that the institutions, the educational institutions that served Black people, first they were not established by, not even by the United Party.  The United Party  as well as the Nationalist Party maybe they, particularly the Nationalist Party government, they never even helped to promote the Native Education that up to that time was serving the Black communities.  It was that Native Education that promoted all the educational institutions that were established by missionaries from outside the country.  They made sure that these institutions, educational institutions went on and they helped to make sure that the teachers were paid salaries.  They were able to make sure that the children that went to those schools were educated.
 To the contrary the Nationalist Party closed those institutions, closed the Lovedales, the Hilltowns, the Adams Colleges.  The ones that survived were those that were run maybe because they had some money by the Marionhills which were run by Catholic schools and also perhaps the Anglican schools which maybe the countries from which they came still promoted and tried to pay the teachers that were in these schools. There was a vast difference between Bantu Education SOWETO HEARING TRC/GAUTENG
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and Native Education.  Native Education is what produced the Motlana's of this country, the doctors, the lawyers, the educationists.  But to the contrary the Native Education - I am a little diabetic, or a lot diabetic, I'd like to get some sugar water just to drink it and this will help me to go on.  I don't want anybody to sympathise with me.  It is because it is a condition that I need to look after.  I have sweets here and I knew with this strain I would have - and don't feel guilty about it, I don't want Commissioners in front there to feel that they have put me under.  I live with it.

YASMINE SOOKA: What we will do is we will just ask you to just complete that particular answer to the question that I asked you and then we will break for tea.

ELLEN KUZWAYO: Madam Commissioner speak a little louder.

YASMINE SOOKA: I think if you put your earphones on you will be able to hear me.  Can you hear me now?

ELLEN KUZWAYO: A little louder.

YASMINE SOOKA: Can I ask somebody to assist you to put earphones on.

ELLEN KUZWAYO: Oh yes maybe you are right.

YASMINE SOOKA: Thank you, can you hear me now?

ELLEN KUZWAYO: Yes.

YASMINE SOOKA: I said that I will not detain you for very much longer but will simply ask you to complete the answer to that particular question please.

ELLEN KUZWAYO: I want to say in no uncertain terms that there is a completely great difference between Bantu Education and Native Education.  Native Education is the education that went on in those institutions that were put up by missionaries from the international world to promote the
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education of Black people in this country.  And it is this education that was so very different from Bantu Education.   I want to say in no uncertain terms there is a major difference between the Bantu Education which was introduced to promote slavery or semi-slavery for those who received it, as against the Native Education that produced, made Black people to be able to stand their own, even at international level it is the education that my children said to me Mummy you got this education but what is going to happen to us with Bantu Education.  Thank God that some of us still managed to help our children to go on to become somebody's.  In certain communities, certain families in the Black communities managed to make sure that their children get the education by even sending them to schools that were able to produce children who became some people.  They sent some of the children out to Lesotho.  Some of these families sent their children out to Swaziland and paid a little more to make sure that their children were able to become something, not the products of Bantu Education.  Bantu Education is a curse.  It was a curse in the Black community.  And we hope that some day the National Party will apologise because it is the Bantu Education that produced the children that have promoted violence in this country, because they rejected that and nobody listened to them when they said this education is not education, it is a curse in the community.  
 The very fact that Bantu Education was never equalled in the White community with something that would have probably been called Boer Education.  They gave us Bantu Education, but never equalled that with Boer Education.

YASMINE SOOKA: Thank you very, very much.  I think we are all
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very, very grateful to you for coming to share your own experiences with us.  I think you sight a problem which is going to remain with South Africa for a very, very long time to come.  Thank you for sharing that.

ELLEN KUZWAYO: Thank you very much.

YASMINE SOOKA: We will now break for tea and we will resume in 15 minutes time.  Thank you.
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