Human Rights Violation Hearings — Mmabatho — 1996-07-08

DR RANDERA: Zero, you must forgive me but I'm going to just
extend so that we can actually look at that, trying to develop a complete picture of the period we are looking at and like Meyer Galeng, your name also comes up in many of our statements and I particularly want to take you back to 1985 and the burning of an individual and the stabbing of an individual and I was just wandering whether you want to make any comment about that period, so we can understand it MMABATHO HEARING TRC/NORTH WEST
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better.

UNKNOWN: Yes, I have no problem talking about that.    What I remember about 1985 is that Frida Mabalane who was a member of the Huhudi Youth Organization - and if I remember well - Frida Mabalane had a case of public violence against her.   We used to work together with her in the Huhudi Youth Organization.   She was also my girlfriend.
 What amazed me about Frida is that on the 25th of November while we were together in a meeting, because we as the youth was being attacked by Inkatha, and we realised that if we could leave the situation as it is then maybe disperse, nothing would happen to us.  So we had to unite and tried to protect ourselves against the Inkatha people.
 On the 24th, it was on a Sunday, someone has attacked Bra Hoffie's house, that is Hoffman Galeng and his family, were being stoned and were being hit with knopkieries and pangas.  Because these people having killed all our leaders we will have to take initiative to go and gut Mr Hoffman Galeng's house and we went away and when we were at the corner of Mahuro and Magapero there came a van of the Inkatha leader by the name of Mathong.   The van was indicating to the right side and when he saw the group, he didn't turn to right they went straight to the group  and they pulled the brakes up there and we watched them, we wanted to see what they wanted to do.  
 Two of them ran back to the shop.  From the shop they were carrying pangas and guns.   The other two were in the van, that was the driver and the other guy.  The other three were in the back of the van.   They started shooting around and no one could stay at that place.  We all ran away.
 We I was trying to jump a fence I found one of these MMABATHO HEARING TRC/NORTH WEST
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guys running behind one of the leaders of the Huhudi.  It was Keeper.  And then I ran after this guy who was Jason Keeper until the Sihumi and Makasani Streets corner.  When we got to the corner he turned to overtake me, that was the person by the name of Joba.  When we got into Barclay Street there was another car which nearly hit Joba.  It was about five  o'clock and people were knocking off from work and all those people dispersed and ran away.  And we stayed at the corner of the street.  I wanted to see what was the aim of those people.
 Just there they stopped and they were shooting at the direction of the people and the people ran away.  And then they reversed the car.  I ran into the corner house.  When I entered it one of my friends, Sylvester Gasabui came running and Frida was standing on the other side, shouting, saying that they should leave him alone, they should leave her alone.  And then I left Frida there.  
 In the evening we went to guard Mr Hoffman Galeng's 
house.  It was already on Monday.  Sylvester had already been kicked by these people.
 On the following morning when we were still sitting Frida came along and she wrote something, where she was.   I asked to come to me and she tried to run away and I went to her and asked her to see what she had written and she refused.  And then I asked her again.  And then she refused again.
 I took out a knife and I stabbed her and she ran away.  And I took what she had written.  I read it and I gave the people what I read.  It was our names on that list and I said to those people, do you see how we get killed?
 And on the night of that day I last saw Frida.  One MMABATHO HEARING TRC/NORTH WEST
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thing I heard about her is that she was burnt, because when I went to sleep no one was roaming the streets in the night because the situation was bad.  There were only police and the Inkatha people running around at night.   And I think it is only the police and the Inkatha people who could know how Frida died.
Because they were supposed to know whether Frida was a member of the Huhudi Youth Organization.   She must have seen how Sylvester was killed.

DR RANDERA: Thank you very much.  That was my last question.  If Mr Malan have any questions or Joyce has?

CHAIRPERSON: I have a question if Zero could answer that or maybe any of the other two witnesses.  The case against Gabriel I assume he was represented by lawyers at the time and do you know who the lawyers were and in which court in which city was that case tried?  Was it at Vryburg or Kimberley?

UNKNOWN: Gabriel's case was conducted at Vryburg.

CHAIRPERSON: Who were his lawyers at the time?

UNKNOWN: I think the lawyer was Chris Walters.

CHAIRPERSON: My question to Violet:  What would you like or request from the Truth Commission regarding to what happened to you?

MS VIOLET MOKOTEDI: I couldn't hear him.

CHAIRPERSON: I was asking, what would you like for the Truth and Reconciliation Commission to do for you for all that you underwent?

MS VIOLET MOKOTEDI: I will ask for the Truth Commission to help me, because there is no other breadwinner at home.  Can't you help my child so that he can work for me, because he is the only boy in the home?   I thank you.
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CHAIRPERSON: I would like to ask Zero:  yesterday we have heard Frida's mother and her sister, they were sad for what happened to Frida.  Now I remember the mother was saying she would like any person who will come forward and explain as to what happened.
 Now I would like to ask:  wouldn't you try to go to the Mabalane family and explain to them as you have explained to us today.

UNKNOWN: No, I don't think there is a problem there, but the only thing is that I cannot do that alone, because in 1987 when there was a state of emergency I wanted to look for a place at school and when we arrived at the roadblock I don't know whether it was her uncle, but he is closely related to Frida with the name of Dile, he left me at the roadblock and he took me to the Mmabatho Police Station and he assaulted me, saying I have come here to burn some people a I have burnt Frida Mabalane.
 I asked him whether the Attorney General could come and observe what was happening?.  He started insulting me and there was no one to stop him.  Therefore, I am afraid to approach the family alone of what they did to me and tomorrow it might look as if I was going to attack them if I go there alone.

CHAIRPERSON: Yesterday we heard when Galeng was telling us that he is trying to unite the people in his community who were vigilantes before, so he is trying to bring them together so we can work as one union.
 Wouldn't you now ask Mr Galeng to unite you or to call you together with the Mabaleng family so that you can reconcile and live in peace?   I would like to suggest that.
Now we heard the pains you have gone through about a child.   MMABATHO HEARING TRC/NORTH WEST
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The one who was growing so well, attending school.  Showing that in future he will become something in the society.  Now you've also said also that this child was so helpful at home doing the laundry and cooking, now we know the pain that you are going through when you look at him, especially in the condition he is.  
 We are very sorry about this young person who has missed out on his youth and lost out.
 Therefore, when he returned home he was looking like 
something helpless, he couldn't help at home.  We trust that we would help you in a certain way, regarding this child of 
yours, who was attacked by the police.  
 We are so happy that you came around to tell us your story.