Special Hearings — Chemical And Biological Warfare Hearings — 1998-07-07

DR MIJBURGH: Via his Project Officer.

MR VALLY: Yes.  What if you decided to manufacture mandrax and ecstasy on a large scale to make private money, how would he know?

CHAIRPERSON: Doctor Mijburgh?

DR MIJBURGH: I don't know, we did not do it so I wouldn't know how he would have known something like that.  It's speculative, I would have to speculate over it.

MR VALLY: Well you did make ecstasy and mandrax on a large scale, the question is what for?  If there was a private frolic by any of your employees, which there was at one stage besides the thousand, you are aware of the attempt to manufacture ecstasy privately?

DR MIJBURGH: I understood that they did not, or at least at that stage the investigation showed that they tried to manufacture the substance but they were not successful but this was immediately stopped when they realised what was going on.

MR VALLY: You're aware it happened?

DR MIJBURGH: Yes.

MR VALLY: Did you lay criminal charges against any of these people?

DR MIJBURGH: No, because there was no proof that any criminality had taken place because they were not manufacturing MDMA.

MR VALLY: Was mercuric oxide used as an ingredient in the manufacture of ecstasy?

DR MIJBURGH: I do not know.

MR VALLY: You were not aware of purchasing mercuric oxide?

DR MIJBURGH: No.

MR VALLY: Did you know Mr Kidger?

DR MIJBURGH: No.

MR VALLY: As you aware that Doctor Kidger delivered mercuric oxide to Delta-G?

DR MIJBURGH: No.

MR VALLY: Would you have been aware of deliveries of such items?

DR MIJBURGH: Not necessarily.

MR VALLY: Who'd be responsible for that?

DR MIJBURGH: The storeman or store personnel or the production manager there, depending where the order was placed.

MR VALLY: And who would sign the cheque for payment of that?

DR MIJBURGH: Depending on the size of the cheque, the Financial Manager or Director.  I might have had to put a second signature on the cheque.

MR VALLY: Who was the Financial Director at the time?

DR MIJBURGH: When did the transaction take place?

MR VALLY: I don't have an exact date right now.

DR MIJBURGH: It could have been Mr Andre Redelinghuis or Mr Ben van den Berg.

MR VALLY: And Mr van den Berg was also one of the Directors of Medchem Technologies?

DR MIJBURGH: I think so, yes.

MR VALLY: Did you have to check anything out with the Surgeon General before you did it?  Could you spend limitless funds for example?

DR MIJBURGH: No.

MR VALLY: Was there a limit which you could spend without consulting with the Surgeon General?

DR MIJBURGH: There was a budget submitted to the Surgeon General at the beginning or each year before the company was privatised, and during that period it was a detailed budget to a reasonable level and money was spent within those parameters.

MR VALLY: Approximately how much annually was the budget?

DR MIJBURGH: It varied.  When the contract was cancelled finally I think it was approximately twelve million a year.  I do not have the specific amount but it started at a much lower amount at the initial stages of the company.

MR VALLY: Have you had an opportunity to have a look at the list of front companies which I gave you earlier?

DR MIJBURGH: I looked through it quickly, I did not study it in detail.

MR VALLY: Well maybe I should reserve that question for after lunch then when you have an opportunity to do so.  Do you know Mr Corrie Botha?

DR MIJBURGH: Yes.

MR VALLY: What was his position?

DR MIJBURGH: He was the Production Manager at Delta-G.

MR VALLY: When you asked him to manufacture methaqualone - sorry, are you aware that you asked him to manufacture methaqualone?

DR MIJBURGH: I cannot remember, I do not know whether he was Production Manager at that stage when methaqualone was made.  It might have been Doctor Johan Botha at that stage, I'm not sure.

MR VALLY: We've got it - from our investigations, it indicates that you asked him sometime after 1988.

DR MIJBURGH: That's possible.

MR VALLY: He states that you gave him a recipe which was the formula for mandrax.

MR VAN ZYL: Mr Chairman, it seems once again that there is possibly a statement from this person and if that's the case then we're in the same position, that this document was not made available to us.

CHAIRPERSON: Are you relying on a document Mr Vally?

MR VALLY: There is no document regarding this issue, it was in investigations, in discussions etc.  We have no statement from Mr Corrie Botha.  Oh, I beg your pardon ...[intervention]

MR VAN ZYL: I accept it as such.

MR VALLY: There is a statement which my learned friend does have.

DR MIJBURGH: There is a statement.

MR VAN ZYL: I'm not sure whether there is a statement or not.  Mr Vally has just said that there isn't one, that this was discussions and now he says that there is one.

MR VALLY: Let me correct it myself, he's playing games Mr Chair.  He has got the document, there is a document.

CHAIRPERSON: Well Mr Vally, one time we have a statement, the next time we don't, now we have a statement, can we be referred to the statement, all of us?

MR VALLY: In any event, did you ever give ...[intervention]

CHAIRPERSON: Is there a statement?

MR VALLY: Yes, apparently there is which was given to them.  This is what I'm advised Mr Chair.

CHAIRPERSON: I see.  Will you return to this when we are able to?

MR VALLY: However, that statement is not relevant for this particular question, apparently this arose from discussions with Mr Corrie Botha.  But my question is very simple, did you ever give him a formula for  manufacturing of methaqualone?

DR MIJBURGH: No, Mr Vally.

MR VALLY: The budget issue, the budget that you worked from when you were Managing Director of Delta-G, did the Surgeon General approve of the budget initially?

DR MIJBURGH: Yes.

MR VALLY: Did he check regularly whether you kept within the confines of the budget?

DR MIJBURGH: Within our reports, yes.  We reported back in writing and sometimes orally on a quarterly basis and on a monthly basis the financial reports were handed to the Project Officer.  Whether it went to the Surgeon General I cannot say.

MR VALLY: Other than the financial reporting, what other reporting did you do to the Surgeon General?

DR MIJBURGH: The CMC we reported in general about the activities of the company.

MR VALLY: What sort of activities?

DR MIJBURGH: What was undertaken, what was produced.

MR VALLY: Quantities and details?

DR MIJBURGH: I would have thought yes, that it would have been included.

MR VALLY: And to whom it was delivered?

DR MIJBURGH: The written report I think was given to Doctor Basson most of the time.  On occasion I also gave a written report to the CMC.

MR VALLY: You personally appeared before the ...[intervention]

DR MIJBURGH: Yes, especially regarding the budget at the end of the previous year and when we had to submit a budget for the next year.

MR VALLY: Did you also manufacture BZ at Delta-G?

DR MIJBURGH: Not that I'm aware of.  Can I just correct that, maybe not in large quantities.  As part of one of the projects, small quantities might have been manufactured on laboratory scale.

MR VALLY: We were advised by Doctor Koekemoer that there was production of BZ and its analogues at Delta-G.

DR MIJBURGH: There was a project, that's why I say on a very small scale.  We are talking about a gram scale, this might possibly have been manufactured.  There was not a production process that BZ was manufactured at the plant.

MR VALLY: Who would have requested Doctor Koekemoer to manufacture BZ?

DR MIJBURGH: It was part of one of the projects.

MR VALLY: Would you have made that request?

DR MIJBURGH: Excuse, I am not with you.

MR VALLY: Would you have made the request of Doctor Koekemoer regarding BZ?

DR MIJBURGH: No, there a project with the Defence Force.

MR VALLY: I understand.

DR MIJBURGH: And that specific request would have come from the Defence Force, from Doctor Basson.