Amnesty Hearings — Pretoria — 1976-07-19

MR GIMSBEEK: Soon after that certain offences were committed, you were found guilty of certain offences, could we go on to that now, can you please explain how you became involved there, and also perhaps expand on those offences?

MR VAN WYK: In July 1991 when I officially became a member of the organisation we swore a blood oath of the organisation.  Essentially this stated that we would be loyal to the aims of the organisation to the objectives of Afrikaners in South Africa. That we would give our lives for the organisation.  And that if we deviated in any way from the principles of the organisation or if we revealed any of the information that we could be punished with a trial.  Quite possibly we could impose the death penalty.
	At that stage I wasn't bothered by that, in a way I was proud to be part of such an organisation, to be part of this resistance we were going to present to the onslaught that was coming and to which people were too blind to see.  We felt we were doing something noble to be prepared to sacrifice our lives for our volk and for our people.
	Our first operation was put in motion soon after we were sworn in.  That's the first time I met Jurgens Grobler.  Our first operation was to steal arms at the headquarters of the commando at Louis Trichardt, R1's, pistols and so on.  White had already done the reconnaissance.

MR GIMSBEEK: Could we just pause.  In a moment we will hear about Mr du Plessis' background, but White and Grobler, could you just explain to us were you aware of their background?

MR VAN WYK: Yes I was aware of White's background because I had known him since December 1991 when at the envisaged establishment of SARU, he was involved in 32, he'd also done an officer's course and as I understood it he'd also achieved the rank of captain.  He was involved in 32 and at that stage he was involved with the Louis Trichardt commando.  So he had something of a military background.

MR GIMSBEEK: Was he the same age as you?

MR VAN WYK: No he was two years older than me.

MR GIMSBEEK: Mr Grobler?

MR VAN WYK: I didn't know him well then.  As I said I met him for the first time at the establishment of the organisation.  He was a student.  He was younger than me, I think almost two years or three years younger.  He was a student at the University of Pretoria.  He was a member of the ASF, the Afrikaner Student Front.

MR GIMSBEEK: You testified that you had planned to rob the base at Louis Trichardt?

MR VAN WYK: It wouldn't have been a robbery it would have been a breaking-in.  As I said White had already done the reconnaissance, the planning of the whole operation had already been done before I was sworn in and that's precisely why I was asked to become a member then, it was precisely for the purposes of this operation.  Du Plessis had received a motor vehicle and a couple of thousand rands from a sympathiser in rightwing circles for the purposes of the operation.
	One evening, I think it was July or August, I am not quite certain, we went through to Louis Trichardt.  We were armed with an AK47 which White had acquired, his R1 and I think also a petrol bomb which Jurgen Grobler had with him.  	When we arrived on the scene it was about 12 o'clock at night, I can't remember the exact date, White decided to abandon the operation because there had been a change in the situation and his reconnaissance no longer agreed with the actual location.  For example there was a caravan which hadn't been there before and he thought that possibly information might have leaked out and that possibly there was a task force in the caravan waiting for us to enter the premises.  He also had a .32 pistol with which he was planning to shoot out the lights in front of the commando.  We decided to drop the operation and so the operation never took place.

MR GIMSBEEK: This is important, can you tell more about the pistol that you had with you that you planned to shoot out ...(intervention)

MR VAN WYK: No I had the R1 with me.  White had the pistol.  It was a pistol with a silencer precisely intended to be used to shoot the light out in front of the building, and of course we didn't intend to make any noise because we didn't - we were planning to break in.  If I remember correctly White also had a key which he had had made for the safe, the magazine where the arms were kept, so that it wouldn't be necessary to use a cutting torch.

MR GIMSBEEK: So then the operation didn't happen.  Were there other operations which were planned which were not carried out?

MR VAN WYK: Yes.  At that stage we used all our funds which had been acquired for that operation which ultimately had not positive result so there was a shortage of funding.  It was decided to rob a shebeen to get money in Durban, but that operation also didn't go forward after reconnaissance at the location, it was decided there were too many people present and that it would have been too difficult.

MR GIMSBEEK: Right.  Could you continue and tell us a little more about the offences committed.

MR VAN WYK: One of the major operations which we planned and the planning was done in detail, one of the operations was to attack the weapons store, arsenal, to obtain weapons and ammunition (...indistinct) squadron for use in an operation, namely attacking an army base at Pomfriet and to rob some of the army's weapons to furnish the training base in South West with weapons.  So we would rob some weapons at 32 with the equipment stolen at Oudtshoorn.
	White had said that a certain amount of weapons would be needed for the operation at Oudtshoorn and he said that he knew where these weapons could be found.  He said, for instance a .22, a .223 and an R4, he said he knew where to obtain these arms.  He knew of certain premises where these were kept and he said it would not be difficult to obtain them.  Du Plessis also approved of the operation which would have entailed theft of the arms and ammunition and the Louis Trichardt murder case also arose from this.

MR GIMSBEEK: Can you give us detail regarding this particular operation, how was it planned, what took place etc?

MR VAN WYK: Well White knew the premises and he knew the movements of the people on the premises and he said it would be quite a simple operation.  We just had to go in and take the weapons.  He made certain arrangements beforehand and asked du Plessis to leave his 9mm because du Plessis would have gone away for the weekend, the weekend that we planned to do the operation.  We wanted to equip ourselves to be able to resist any possible police intervention.  And on taking the oath we associated ourselves and reconciled ourselves with the possibility of being captured or shot. We would have preferred to rather become involved in a shooting incident, that is how purposeful we were at the time, how committed we were.

MR GIMSBEEK: Could you tell me how White got to know the layout of the premises etc?

MR VAN WYK: Well White lived in Louis Trichardt and he knew the people working there.

MR GIMSBEEK: Do you know what the exact link was between him and the people?

MR VAN WYK: Well he knew the Roux girl from his school days.

MR GIMSBEEK: So according to you he was familiar with the  ...(tape ends)

MR VAN WYK: And the intention was to commit theft on the premises.  The idea was that there would be a servant on duty that morning and that we would enter the premises without her noticing anything and according to our plan if she found us on the premises we would have tied her up and put her in the wash room.

MR GIMSBEEK: Now I ask you to explain to us in detail what took place during this operation.