Human Rights Violation Hearings — Empangeni — 1996-11-06

WITNESS:   Yes, and my son drove away the car, so they said they were going to kill him, because he got away with the IFP supporters.

KHOZA MGOJO:  So you have any names of these people?

WITNESS:   No, we don't, because there was never a case.

KHOZA MGOJO:  You didn't go and open a case for this?

WITNESS:   No, only a detective came to my house one evening.  He was with his girlfriend - my son's girlfriend.

KHOZA MGOJO:  What is the name of this girlfriend of your son, Tilly?

WITNESS:   Mkhize.

KHOZA MGOJO:  Where is she staying?

WITNESS:   I can't tell, because of this political violence.  A lot of people ran away from wherever they were staying.

KHOZA MGOJO:  Who was the detective?

WITNESS:   No, I don't know.  It was late at night when they came.

KHOZA MGOJO:  And that was the end of the story?

WITNESS:   The detective told me I must come the next morning at 8 o'clock to give the statement.  Did you give the statement to the police?   ---   Yes.

KHOZA MGOJO:  What happened?

WITNESS:   I told the police that I heard that my son had been killed at the taxi rank at Isipingo.

KHOZA MGOJO:  Where did you give this statement?

WITNESS:   I gave it to the Isipingo Police Station.

KHOZA MGOJO:  Do you know the name of the policeman?

WITNESS:   No, I don't.  The last thing they told me is that they will call me.  They were still going to investigate, but they never came back to me.

KHOZA MGOJO:  Then you buried Kumbulani?

WITNESS:   Yes.

KHOZA MGOJO:  And then after that what happened as well?

WITNESS:   It was at Dimoshwa.  People came to my house and they told me that we were going to be attacked and we stayed there, panicking, until the funeral, because even people from my church were scared to come and comfort me, because they were scared because there was this rule that if you're staying in this area you aren't supposed to go to this other area.  People from my church didn't even come to the funeral.  The funeral was just family members, because people were scared for their lives, because they were told that if you come for another area or from ANC area and you go to the Inkatha area then you are going to be killed.

KHOZA MGOJO:  Where were you staying?

WITNESS:   We heard that the area where we were it was IFP stronghold area, so we don't know who came out with the idea.  We buried Kumbulani and one family member came.  His name is Shandu as well.  He said to me I should change my mind.  I should think of moving away from that area, because we were not safe.  So he asked me that we should leave that area and we should go to a rural area where he would give us a place to build a new house, because he said from where he was there was no organization, no political organization at all.  I considered that and I called my brother.  I decided that I should follow this idea, because he was going to give us a piece of land for us to build our house, and then we decided that after Kumbulani's funeral we should leave, because we were always scared.  After the funeral my children had arranged trucks and lorries to take us.  We took - it was on Thursday - it took us two days, Thursday and Friday, and we left for Umgababa.  That's where I lost all these other kids.

KHOZA MGOJO:  You went to Umgababa?

WITNESS:   Yes, we went to Umgababa at Umgobosini.

KHOZA MGOJO:  What happened there, because apparently this lady promised you it was quiet?

WITNESS:   I don't know what happened in her life, because when we arrived there at night it was on Saturday, after the funeral, when we arrived there we went to bed.  The next day on Sunday evening we heard people singing song or slogans and I said to this lady, "But you told me there are no political organizations in this area.  What's going on now?  Who are singing the slogans?", and she said, "This is the first time that I'm hearing this.  I think the kids are playing".

KHOZA MGOJO:  Now, wouldn't this lady from Umgababa just deliberately call you for - do you think she called you deliberately or she had plotted this thing for you, for your children to be killed?

WITNESS:   I think so.

KHOZA MGOJO:  And then what happened on the 20th?

WITNESS:   When we arrived there I stayed.  We slept with her.  The next day she told me she was leaving and I asked her as to where was she going.  She said I must stay there, and she said she wasn't staying in her house, and I asked her where was she staying.  She told me she was staying at her father's house and she said the reason she is staying at her father's house is because her mother was sick and she's helping her.  So I asked her why is she leaving her children and go and nurse her mother.  Why can't she take her mother and bring her down here.  Then I realised that it was going to be difficult for me to stay there alone without her in her house.

KHOZA MGOJO:  What happened on the 20th?

WITNESS:   On the 20th July 1990 my son woke up.

KHOZA MGOJO:  Which one?

WITNESS:   Bethwell.  Bethwell woke up in the morning.  I heard him talking to his sister that she must bring his red shoes and maroon shirt and jeans and then he dressed up and he left for work.  In the evening I realised that he was supposed to be back home and I was troubled as to what was going on, how come he wasn't at home until this time, and then at that time I had my new house built.  I went to this lady's house, the one that I came and stayed when I first came and when I was there I saw the lady's daughter and I greeted her and I heard gunfire and when we looked we saw people - a lot of people - going up and down and this girl said to me, "Do you have any idea as to what is going on?"   I said, "No, I don't know".  I went back home.  I told my other children.  I said, "I heard gunfire and my child is not home yet", and I could realise that my other kids were also worried.  I couldn't sit down.  I kept on looking up and down and a girl from Shandu's family came and she called my daughter, Ntombifuthi and she said, "Come here".  Then I went to them and they were talking.  When I was there she left, she ran away, and I asked my daughter, "What was she saying?" and then she said, "She was asking where was my brother", and then I decided to follow her to the Shandu family, and then when I arrived there her sister was crying.  Then I asked her why was she crying and she said she saw someone being shot at the bus stop.  I said to her, "How come, because we both heard the gunfire but you didn't cry?  Why are you crying now?", and then she said to me, "No, your child is not dead".  I said to her, "It means he is dead", and then I decided to go back to my children, and I told them that Mboteni, the girl from Shandu, is now crying and the boy who usually goes with my son is back home and what about my son, he is not back home, and the children said, "No, let's go to the bus stop "and check if he's not there".  And then I said, "My children said they are going to check from their brother", and the girl from Shandu said, "No, I'll go with them", and one boy who was 10 years old at that time and this boy said, "They won't come back if they are going to the bus stop", and then she said, "Why are you saying they won't come back?  They will come back.  Let's go and check for him", and my children came back crying and they said, "We can't find our brother there and when we check at the bus stop we can't see anything and we saw a fire and when we go there people are coming, so we were scared, we ran, and these people aren't saying anything to us, but they just look at us badly, so we ran away up until here at home", and then it was clear to me that child has died.  My neighbour came and she said to me ... (end of tape No 2A)