Amnesty Hearings — Boksburg — 1998-03-09

LETUSANG RAYMOND SHARON LEKABE: We did not gather at my home we gathered at a Sparza shop.  It could have been forty to fifty members of the community.

MR MOTATA: And Mr Buthelezi had not said who killed Bulelwa?

LETUSANG RAYMOND SHARON LEKABE: He had not explained yet who killed Bulelwa.

MR MOTATA: Whilst gathered at this tuck shop or Sparza shop you deliberated with the community what next to do, isn't it so?

LETUSANG RAYMOND SHARON LEKABE: The community pronounced it's dissatisfaction - they said enough is enough.  I did not address them.

MR MOTATA: I want to understand, Mr Lekabe, that at that stage nobody knew who killed Bulelwa.  How did you arrive at the decision that you should now round up the members of the SDU and start with the top structure, probably Blanko.  How did you arrive because you had no knowledge who killed Bulelwa?

LETUSANG RAYMOND SHARON LEKABE: Chairperson I explained already that the community was dissatisfied of the activities of the SDU in Mololeke, they took a decision that enough was enough, they were not going to wait for yet another incident.

MR MOTATA: Mr Lekabe, is it not the understanding that when the SDU's were formed you were protecting largely the community of Katlehong against Inkatha.  Is my understanding correct this far?

LETUSANG RAYMOND SHARON LEKABE: It was not against Inkatha as such, it was against any attack that would take place any time.

MR MOTATA: Yes, you're correct and the other attacks would be acts of criminality against the community?

LETUSANG RAYMOND SHARON LEKABE: To give an example, let's say there's a hit car who would be responsible for such attacks.

MR MOTATA: Yes, now what I'm merely saying, let me be open to you is that whilst I said I want an understanding, my understanding, correct me if I'm wrong, that in Katlehong and confining ourselves to Mololeke section, we knew that one of the enemies of Mololeke would for instance be Inkatha, am I right?  That's the first?

LETUSANG RAYMOND SHARON LEKABE: That is correct.

MR MOTATA: And other people who would attack for reasons unknown, those would also be the enemies of Mololeke section is that not so?

LETUSANG RAYMOND SHARON LEKABE: According to the situation, anybody who attacked was regarded as an enemy.

MR MOTATA: So we have a number of possibilities and quite rightly the community says enough is enough.  What I want to find out from you that there wasn't one enemy - how did you come to a conclusion or decision by the community that you should go for the SDU and Blanko in this instance?

LETUSANG RAYMOND SHARON LEKABE: I think I explained in my evidence that even though they patrolled there would be some incidents the next day.  Now that is the reason why the community said enough was enough - because even during the threats the community was present, that is why the community took a decision.

MR MOTATA: Yes but you did not explain in your evidence in chief what led the community to say it is the SDU's, you did not say that, did you?

LETUSANG RAYMOND SHARON LEKABE: I do not recall.

MR MOTATA: I can assure you I was listening attentively, you did not, hence I'm asking you that question.

LETUSANG RAYMOND SHARON LEKABE: My lord, just elaborate a little.

MR MOTATA: Mr Lekabe, my question is this simple.  I said to you there was an enemy in Mololeke section and then we would say the first enemy was Inkatha, remember I said that?

LETUSANG RAYMOND SHARON LEKABE: Yes.

MR MOTATA: Now there were other people who committed criminal acts and they also were members - they were the enemies?

LETUSANG RAYMOND SHARON LEKABE: Yes that is correct.

MR MOTATA: Now when you deliberated at this Sparza shop where you gathered, where the community said enough was enough, now to specifically go to SDU, what is it that was discussed about the SDU that led you to go straight to the SDU?

LETUSANG RAYMOND SHARON LEKABE: I explained Chairperson on Friday that on Sunday the 5th there was an altercation between myself and other members of the SDU.  We were fighting for sites in Mololeke.  I think the community did not get that right, they thought I was disturbing them in their duty of issuing out sides.  Now it was then decided that I should be eliminated before the end of the week.

MR MOTATA: Mr Lekabe, I tried in many ways to explain this question to you because we know, the first thing Buthelezi did not tell you who killed Bulelwa?

LETUSANG RAYMOND SHARON LEKABE: Yes that's correct he did not.

MR MOTATA: Now you met at this Sparza shop, you were forty to forty five according to your estimation, in other words, during that gathering you did not know as yet who killed Bulelwa?

LETUSANG RAYMOND SHARON LEKABE: Yes that's correct.

MR MOTATA: Now you specifically identified members of the SDU to revenge, you said we now are attacking Blanko.  I want to know, when you deliberated, what is it that led you to take that decision of attacking the members of the SDU because you did not know as yet who killed Bulelwa?

LETUSANG RAYMOND SHARON LEKABE: My lord, I explained that the community said enough was enough and the allegations that members of the community, the leaders of the community, were supposed to be killed was already flying.  I think I explained that my lord.

MR MOTATA: Yes, my brother, I heard that one but you are not answering my question.

LETUSANG RAYMOND SHARON LEKABE: Maybe I do not understand your question.

MR MOTATA: This is my question shortly - You met at the Sparza shop, during that meeting you did not know who killed Bulelwa?

LETUSANG RAYMOND SHARON LEKABE: Yes that is correct.

MR MOTATA: Now, you knew as members of the community that you had enemies such as Inkatha?

LETUSANG RAYMOND SHARON LEKABE: Yes that's correct.

MR MOTATA: There were other enemies committing criminal activities in Mololeke?

LETUSANG RAYMOND SHARON LEKABE: Yes that is correct.

MR MOTATA: Now you explain already that during the patrols by the SDU there would be things the next day despite the fact of patrolling?  Now let's put it this way - we now have three enemies?

LETUSANG RAYMOND SHARON LEKABE: Yes you are correct.

MR MOTATA: Now among these three enemies, one should be responsible for the killing of Bulelwa?

LETUSANG RAYMOND SHARON LEKABE: Chairperson can I ask a question?

MR MOTATA: No answer my question first.

LETUSANG RAYMOND SHARON LEKABE: Yes that's correct.

MR MOTATA: Now there are three enemies.  Now what led you to specifically say enough is enough and then you took a decision to go to this other enemy which is the SDU?  What is it that you discussed, what is it that you discussed that led you to taking the decision of attacking the SDU?

LETUSANG RAYMOND SHARON LEKABE: My lord, I'm explaining that Mololeke is a place that you would not commit a crime in Mololeke and then get away with it.  It was that simple.  Now the community decided that among members of the SDU the truth must come out. You would not commit an act in Mololeke whether during the day or during the night
but you would not get away with that.

MR MOTATA: No further questions.

CHAIRPERSON: Did the members of community suspect that Bulelwa had been killed by members of the SDU?

LETUSANG RAYMOND SHARON LEKABE: That is correct Chairperson.

CHAIRPERSON: Were you present at the gathering where the community said enough is enough?

LETUSANG RAYMOND SHARON LEKABE: That is correct, Chairperson.

CHAIRPERSON: Can you recall what time that gathering was?

LETUSANG RAYMOND SHARON LEKABE: As I've explained Chairperson, I don't remember time because I spent much time to calm Mr Buthelezi, it might be before nine o'clock or after nine o'clock.

CHAIRPERSON: Was that gathering subsequent to the visit to you by Buthelezi?

LETUSANG RAYMOND SHARON LEKABE: That is correct, Chairperson.