Amnesty Hearings — Durban — 1999-10-05

ROBERT JOHN MCBRIDE: Before I read out my statement, I wish to state that I have already served a sentence for most of the activities detailed in the amnesty application, almost seven years, considerably longer than any apartheid Minister.
	Secondly, since 1987 when I was convicted and sentenced to death for activities on behalf of the ANC, MK, these activities have been in the public realm and there has been no further legal action initiated against me all this time.  I come before this Commission in the spirit of reconciliation, I live reconciliation every day in my life and for me, it is not just a buzz word.  I also wish to clean the slate and put the conflicts of the past, behind me, hence I have included relatively minor incidents such as the burning of Fairvale High School.  I have also included activities for which I was acquitted at the time of the trial.  I place my trust in this Committee that it would treat my case fairly.  Other than reconciliation, I have nothing to gain from applying for amnesty.  For my activities to liberate myself and my fellow oppressed South Africans from apartheid, I have been scorned and insulted by a small minority of South Africans, as well as by that section of the media which is white owned and controlled.   This hearing will also give them an opportunity, the last one, to learn the facts about me and my opposition to apartheid.  I now turn to my formal statement.
"I was born on the 6th of July 1963 as a second class South African citizen, an oppressed person.  I was born in a ghetto, a product of apartheid.  I received inferior education.  My rights as a citizen were denied to me for the benefit of a small minority.  I have experienced since childhood every possible form of racial insult.  The State classified me as coloured, a term I have always detested as it infers being lessened by my black South African blood.  As a result of this, I have developed political consciousness during my early years and I was involved in various non-violent activities directed against apartheid until 1984.  In 1984 I assisted a number of ANC members in the distribution of pamphlets and ANC literature.
	However, I soon realised that the South African government and its surrogates, would not be persuaded to end racism through moral persuasion.   I accepted at this stage that violence was necessary.  The evidence for me of the correctness of this part was that before I was born ..."

CHAIRPERSON: ... the?

ROBERT JOHN MCBRIDE: That is correct sir.
"... The ANC initiated a limited armed struggle hoping to persuade the racist government to change.  They did not change and throughout that period, continued to oppress black people.  This oppression increasingly included mass murder and cross-border massacres.  The government did this with ever increasing ...(indistinct) support from the white community.   My sense of anger, frustration and helplessness in the face of this injustice, came to an end when I was formally recruited to MK Special Ops.  For the first time in my life I was able to do something against the system.  For the first time in my life, I was regarded as a South African, full status, without racial categorisation.   This elevation in my status was for me the most empowering moment of my life.
	For this I thank the ANC and all those in the movement, that I have had the honour to work with.  For this I will always remain loyal to the ANC.   When I joined Special Ops, I decided to give myself completely to the ANC.  I broke off my relationship with a woman I was in love with and with whom I was discussing marriage.  I also decided not to complete my final year of my Higher Diploma in Education for the sake of pursuing the struggle on a full-time 24-hour basis.  
	I joined MK Special Ops in 1985.  I was recruited by Gordon Webster.   On recruitment I was told that I would be part of Special Ops.  It was emphasised that Special Ops was separate from the provincial machinery.  Our Overall Commander was Aboobaker Ismail or Rashid as we knew him, who reported directly to the NEC and in particular to the then President, Oliver Tambo.   
	On recruitment I was also told I would not be given medals or money for my work, and that in all likelihood I would be killed in action.   I would also participate in actions where people would be killed.  I was given two weeks in which to think about this and after two weeks, I accepted and became a full member of Special Operations.  I was 22 years old at this stage.   I was told that I must be true to the Organisation and its leadership and also told never to volunteer information to the enemy.   
	This in short was the understanding under which I formally joined the armed struggle against apartheid.  At the time I joined MK Special Ops, the ANC had more diplomatic missions abroad then the then South African government and was recognised as the most effective liberation movements against the apartheid regime.  The ANC was part of an internationally recognised and legitimate liberation movement.  I carried out all my operations under the auspices of the ANC and at all times, under the instructions of the ANC.  I did this to the best of my ability and with great risk to myself and my family.  
	I have served almost seven years as I have said earlier, in prison for my activities on behalf of MK Special Ops and the ANC and four of these were on death row.  I was released as a political prisoner in September 1992 as a consequence of negotiations between the ANC and the National Party.  I have had no gain whatsoever in material terms form my contribution to the struggle to rid South Africa of racism.  On the contrary, I and my family lost everything that we have built up over many years of hard work.  For this I have no regrets, South Africa is free.  I am no longer a second class citizen and my children will never be classified in this way.  We now have one of the best constitutions and Bills of Rights in the world.  However, I am truly sorry that in my quest for this freedom, I have caused the deaths of other South Africans.   Of this I am not proud.   This is the tragedy of the civil war that South Africa experienced as a result of apartheid.  
	I also cannot isolate the sadness I feel at those deaths, from the sadness I feel about the countless number of South Africans who died because the apartheid regime wanted to perpetuate itself.  
	At this stage I want to turn to another matter.  I would like this Committee to help ascertain a list of precisely who Mr Richard represents as this was repeatedly requested of Mr Richard by your Committee and in as much as Mr Richard says he has the list, he has not yet produced it.  This list will assist me for purposes of reconciliation, to amongst other things, understand precisely who opposes my amnesty application and in regard to which count this relates.  
	More importantly I would like to know before I begin to traverse the details of my application, as to whether the victims Mr Richard represents, still persist in the denial of all matters relative to my application for amnesty as Mr Richard indicated, or do they now, having had the benefit of Mr Ismail's testimony, admit any aspect.  This enquiry is important as I and my legal representative can then know precisely what I am not required to prove or not.  Thank you."

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you Mr McBride.  Mr Richard concerning the list, I know that you did indicate previously that there was a list which certain names had been marked, etc, has that been finalised now?

MR RICHARD: I handed my list to the logistics person who is not in the corner at the moment.  I have not had the list back yet, but nothing has changed.  However, I don't seriously believe it is for the applicant to challenge my locus standi to present the victims.