Human Rights Violation Hearings — Vryheid — 1997-04-17

WITNESS:   I don't know.  Oh, those are the guns that they carry with.  That's how we got shot.  And I heard the sound of the gunshot and we lied down instantly so we could retreat, and that's how now I got shot as I tried to crawl to the safe place.  They were able to see us because they were in the dark and we were right in the light.  I fell, and remembered and thought that the person could see me, maybe I should just try crawl as fast as I could to hide away.  And I managed to hide away, and I tried to call the others and warn them of the situation that was prevailing.  And at the time they were trying to show how many of us were injured.

MR DLAMINI: Where were you injured?

WITNESS:   I sustained injuries on my right leg, up of the thigh, and at the hospital I was operated on the left side, appendix I think.  And I could not go to the toilet and had no appetite at all.  However, gradually I managed to get back.  My heart was torn apart, because each time I looked at this operation I felt like crying.

MR DLAMINI: Were you at Ngwelezana Hospital?

WITNESS:   Yes, I was there.

MR DLAMINI: And according to our records you were there almost one full year.

WITNESS:   Yes.

MR DLAMINI: Do you still have the hospital records with you?

WITNESS:   Yes, I have IP numbers of the Ngwelezana file, the hospital file.  I have them at home.

MR DLAMINI: Do you have them with you right there or they are at home?

WITNESS:   No, they are at home, I don't have them with me.

MR DLAMINI: We'll make means to get those files so we can get in touch with the hospital personnel to gather full information and be furnished with all the details.  Right now I have seen that you are not walking properly.  Where else have you been injured?

WITNESS:   This is the leg that was fatally injured, and I could not even show my parent how brutal the wound is, because I know that after that she won't cope with that, my parent won't cope with that.  To date I am suffering from that wound of the gunshot.  Even psychologically when I think - you know, there are times when I sit alone and think, and I will cry, I will cry bitterly.

MR DLAMINI: We'll wait for the witness to regain composure.  Take your time, Mr Nsibande.  (Pause)  You were still explaining how the wound is, and you are even sceptical of showing it to your parent.  And we are aware that even psychologically, even mentally, you are highly affected, that there are things you cannot carry on with now.  And have you been in touch with the doctors or something?

WITNESS:   I think I am not a male any more.  I can't have children since the attack.

MR DLAMINI: Maybe you should contact the - did you ever think of contacting the doctors in this regard?

WITNESS:   I don't have money to pay the doctors.

MR DLAMINI: Even the pension is not sufficient?

WITNESS:     I am not getting any pension fund even now.

MR DLAMINI: One other thing.  Maybe have you tried to receive psychological help to face the situation that you are faced with at the time?

WITNESS:   No, I did not receive any such help.

MR DLAMINI: Would you appreciate such help?

WITNESS:   Yes.

MR DLAMINI: There are people who will talk to you after this, and open up to them and do make mention of the fact that you need psychological help.  And I think also you need to get the doctor's view with the fact that you are now unable to have children.  The doctors will give you their views in that perspective.  How many people were injured on that day?

WITNESS:   We were eight.

MR DLAMINI: What about the other seven, how is their condition?  Did they go to the hospital?

WITNESS:   We were all taken to the hospital.

MR DLAMINI: How are they faring now?

WITNESS:   Some are better, and there is this one other, Xolani, the bullet penetrated through his knee and it was never extracted, and to date his knee is not functional.  And there was one who was shot from the back, from behind, and I think he is much better now because he even drives his car.  And the girl that was with us - we were seven, and we had a girl with us, and was shot right on her feet.  Others were shot in such a way that they were able to receive preliminary medical attention, and they responded to that quite well.  I was the worst because I was in the hospital for a long time.

MR DLAMINI: Would you perhaps know if the others did submit the statements to the Commission?

WITNESS:   Thetelele, who was one of us, did submit his statement, and we submitted our statements at the same time.

MR DLAMINI: Thank you.  Did you lay any charges?

WITNESS:   It wasn't as easy, because when we were taken to Ngwelezana it was as a result of the police.  One of the sergeants, SAP sergeants, said - and he wasn't aware that I was there - that he was saying, "We are looking for them.  We went to Nongoma, we went to the hospital because we wanted to kill them right inside the hospital."  That was the sergeant saying that, the SAP, and he was not aware that I am around.  We could not lay any charges due to that, because the police station commander was collaborating with the Inkatha people and the ZP.

MR DLAMINI: The police in the car, the car that was shooting, where are they, the police that shot from the car?

WITNESS:  One of them I just heard that he is a sergeant in the Stability Unit.

MR DLAMINI: Who is that?

WITNESS:   That is Nyuni Nyango.

MR DLAMINI: Where is Nyango located, in which police station?

WITNESS:   I don't know.

MR DLAMINI: But you just heard that he is with the Stability Unit?  What about Maseka?

WITNESS:   I wouldn't know where -well, he is located in KwaKeza.

MR DLAMINI: What about Gribond?

WITNESS:   Gribond has been since deceased.

MR DLAMINI: What killed him?

WITNESS:   That much I wouldn't know and wouldn't explain, because he collapsed in front of the office where he was working from and that was it.

MR DLAMINI: As you were injured were you able to work, and where were you working?

WITNESS:   I was working at one building contract.

MR DLAMINI: What is the name?

WITNESS:   It's WJ Construction.

MR DLAMINI: Did they give you any compensation as a result of your injuries?

WITNESS:   No.

MR DLAMINI: Did you get any green card?

WITNESS:   Nothing.

MR DLAMINI: Where is this construction office based?  Do you have the work records?  What about the pay slip?  Do you have any?

WITNESS:   No, I don't.

MR DLAMINI: What were you, were you a part-time worker, or were you a full-time?

WITNESS:   No, I was a part-time worker.  I was working temporarily.

MR DLAMINI: How long did you work there?

WITNESS:   I worked there for five months.

MR DLAMINI: Mr Nsibande, we do empathise with you, with what you went through, especially what you were facing, with a future to face on top of that.  There are requests that you've made mention of in your statement, some of which we've already addressed.  As we have said to others, likewise we will say it to you, that your requests will be compiled in a report and be forwarded right to the Cabinet and the President of the country.  We will recommend on your behalf as to what will be helpful to you, and we want to assure you as well that a report will be compiled and be forwarded to the Cabinet and the State President, and it is their prerogative to see what to do after that.  And the other things that we've already addressed, like your psychological problems, to contact the doctors, and the like, we will pay attention to that with immediate effect.  Thank you very much.  But don't leave yet, the Chairlady has a word or two too.

CHAIRPERSON: Mr Nsibande, I think I heard you saying you have children with your sister and some with their mother.  Did I hear you right?

WITNESS:   There are two with my sister, and the other two are with their respective mothers.

CHAIRPERSON: Now, you don't have any child with you?

WITNESS:   No, I would not afford to support any child at this stage.