Human Rights Violation Hearings — Pretoria — 1996-08-13

CHAIRPERSON: ... and to, and is that a friend, a family member who is with you?  Your sister.  Welcome, I see your statement is in Afrikaans.  Do you wish to speak in Afrikaans?

CUNGANT QUEEN KENNY: Yes.

CHAIRPERSON: Mr Tom Manthata is going to assist you with your evidence.

MR MALAN: Is it Mrs Kenny?

INTERPRETER: The speaker's microphone.

MR MALAN: Will you please rise.

CUNGANT QUEEN KENNY: (Duly sworn in, states).

MR MALAN: Thank you very much.  You may sit down.

INTERPRETER: The witnesses microphone is not on.

THOMAS MANTHATA: Mrs Kenny can you just relax.

INTERPRETER: The witnesses microphone is not on.

THOMAS MANTHATA: Not on.

INTERPRETER: The witnesses microphone is off.

THOMAS MANTHATA: Mrs Kenny, you are welcome.  Can you feel at home.  Can you please tell us what happened to Martin Patrick Mahlangu.

CUNGANT QUEEN KENNY: On the 18th of March in 1986 my sister-in-law called my husband and advised him that there were people looking for him.  Two weeks later I received a letter which was addressed to my sister-in-law.  It was a letter written
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in husband's handwriting.  In there he instructed two men to come and collect some of his clothing.  These two men came to fetch the clothes and they also asked for accommodation.  Three days later they left.  Since then I have never ever heard from my husband again.  
 I started looking for my husband.  I went to various hospitals, to various police stations and to various mortuaries.  However, all of these searches were fruitless.  At the time of my husband's disappearance we were married for three years.  We were very close.  I have never ever received any money from his previous employers.  He worked at Siemens.  
 Nine years later on the fifth of August in 1995 a policeman from the Department of Justice came to my home.  At the time I lived with my sister.  They then advised me that they suspected that my husband died nine years ago.  I then had to visit the Department of Justice.  They requested me to make a statement.  One of the men who I accommodated at that time I recognised on that day.  I immediately recognised him when I saw him.  I had so many questions and he said that he was sorry and that he, in fact, was one of the policeman connected to Vlakplaas and that he regrets it and that he dearly regrets what he did to his own people.  He also advised me that the last time he saw my husband was at Vlakplaas and he said that when he later enquired from other policeman they said that he was involved in a bomb explosion and that is how he met his death.  
 I very much would like to provide my husband with a decent funeral.  The police advised me that they are still awaiting on a reply from the Police General, but up until now I have still not heard anything from them.  I feel that 
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those policemen involved in my husband's killing should be prosecuted.  I am not even able to acquire a home of my own.  I am still struggling to come to terms with everything.  My son is now 11 years old.  I would very much like this matter to be investigated.  My first question is when am I going to receive a death certificate?  I would like to receive his money from his previous work of employ or place of employ.  I would like the Commission to get behind the whole truth and to establish as to whether he is dead or not.

THOMAS MANTHATA: Are you still going on, Queen?

CUNGANT QUEEN KENNY: No, I am done.

THOMAS MANTHATA: You talk about the Civic Association man from Mamelodi.  Did you know their names?

CUNGANT QUEEN KENNY: Not really.  I did not really know them.  I only heard from his one friend that he was a member of Mamelodi Civic.  I heard that him and Stanza Bobape were both members.  That is what I was told.

THOMAS MANTHATA: Did Siemens ever try to help you to look for Patrick?

CUNGANT QUEEN KENNY: Not at all.  At that time he was still employed at Siemens and his disappearance happened the night after he came back from work.  So he was still employed at the time.

THOMAS MANTHATA: What I mean is for the following days when they could not see him at work, did they not show interest in his absence?

CUNGANT QUEEN KENNY: Nobody came to ask me for anything.  They did not enquire about him.  I went to them and advised them that he had disappeared and that I am unemployed and that I had to look after the child by myself.  They said that they were not able to give me any of his money because he had only disappeared, that they could only do so once I had produced
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a death certificate.

THOMAS MANTHATA: I do not know whether I missed this.  You talked or you referred to the Vlakplaas man.  What is his name?

CUNGANT QUEEN KENNY: He said his name was Chris and was one of the Vlakplaas policemen.

THOMAS MANTHATA: It was just Chris, no other name?

CUNGANT QUEEN KENNY: No, he only said that he was Chris from Springs.

THOMAS MANTHATA: You say it was the second time he went missing.  First was when he went to Swaziland.  Were you already together at that time?

CUNGANT QUEEN KENNY: No we were not together.  That is only hearsay, I only heard that he had disappeared.

THOMAS MANTHATA: And then you talk of, is it, Bashirt in your statement.

CUNGANT QUEEN KENNY: He was also one of the organisers of the Mamelodi Organisations.  So he also belonged to the Mamelodi Civic Organisation.  He was a member.

THOMAS MANTHATA: And you did not get his other names?

CUNGANT QUEEN KENNY: No, I did not get the other name.

THOMAS MANTHATA: You did not.  What other help did you get from your sister-in-law?  The one who called your husband out and maintained that the people waiting for him are familiar to the family?

CUNGANT QUEEN KENNY: I did not receive any help or anything from them except that my sister-in-law said that he is man enough to find his own way home, but she was the one that received the letter.  The letter was addressed to her.

THOMAS MANTHATA: And she gave you the letter to read?

CUNGANT QUEEN KENNY: Yes, fortunately I was present and therefore I could recognise his handwriting.  Although he signed the
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letter Putu which must have been his pseudo name.

THOMAS MANTHATA: And there was no full address given.

CUNGANT QUEEN KENNY: No there was not.

THOMAS MANTHATA: I am sorry.  I have no further questions.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you Tom.  Wynand.

MR MALAN: Mrs Kenny, this person named Chris whom you recently identified was he personally present there at the Department of Justice?

CUNGANT QUEEN KENNY: Yes, I personally spoke to him.

MR MALAN: And he admitted that he was the person that came to your previously?

CUNGANT QUEEN KENNY: Yes and I even asked him what happened to my husband's clothes and he then said that he had given the clothes to somebody else.  He said he gave the clothes to another person at Vlakplaas.

MR MALAN: And he also told you that he was prepared to give evidence in court, but you have never ever heard that he had appeared in court?

CUNGANT QUEEN KENNY: The Department of Justice said that they were waiting for the case to come up.

MR MALAN: You also said that you suspect that he might have turned State witness in the case of Captain de Kock.

CUNGANT QUEEN KENNY: I have not ever been to court. I have not been there.

MR MALAN: Have you ever heard that he had testified?

CUNGANT QUEEN KENNY: No, I have not.

MR MALAN: This was in August 1985.

CUNGANT QUEEN KENNY: Yes.

MR MALAN: And the year before you said that you had heard that he was prepared to appear in court, but up until now you have not actually heard him in court?
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CUNGANT QUEEN KENNY: No, I have not.