Human Rights Violation Hearings — Cradock — 1996-02-10

THEMBINKOSI TSHABE: The students were fighting for their rights, because the Boers took us to town while we were to increase the standard at school, because we had to increase the classes up to standard 8, we didn't have enough classes and the Boers refused when we tried to negotiate.  The Boers refused to listen to us.
 That is when COSAS took over and they also burnt COSAS and the Boers from Middelburg came and said after 10 minutes, we should dismiss.

MR SANDI: You said you were also shot, what Hospital did you go to?

THEMBINKOSI TSHABE: While I was shot, I couldn't go to the
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Hospital, I went with this woman who was here who was shot there and we went to the Doctor.  That was Doctor Kashent.

MR SANDI: Is he also from Venterstad?

THEMBINKOSI TSHABE: Yes.

MR SANDI: Is he still there?

THEMBINKOSI TSHABE: No, he left.

MR SANDI: Did you see the police who shot at you?

THEMBINKOSI TSHABE: No, I couldn't because I wasn't expecting anything.

MR SANDI: Were you listening when the lady before you was testifying?

THEMBINKOSI TSHABE: Which one?

MR SANDI: The one who was testifying, did you see her?

THEMBINKOSI TSHABE: Yes.

MR SANDI: Did you hear her when she said there was no law in Venterstad?

THEMBINKOSI TSHABE: Yes, I heard her.

MR SANDI: As far as you know, do you think that that is true?

THEMBINKOSI TSHABE: The rights that we were actually fighting for, were the students' rights, but in the community, there was no commotion.

MR SANDI: What kind of treatment were the people getting from the police?

THEMBINKOSI TSHABE: They were not doing anything, in stead they used to invite police from outside.  When we went there to ask about this matter, they told us that this police from Middelburg are not under Venterstad, so they don't ask for anybody's permission, they just do whatever they would like to do.
 Even if one policeman is trying to prevent them from
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doing what they were doing, they wouldn't care, they wouldn't consider, they wouldn't take care.
 And they also told us that this police - they don't go to the police in charge and get permission.

MR SANDI: Can you also say that the police were taking the law into their own hands?  Do you also confirm that?

THEMBINKOSI TSHABE: Yes, it is so.

MR SANDI: Thank you.  Let us continue.  By being here today, Thembinkosi, do you have any wishes or requests that you would like to tell the Commission?

THEMBINKOSI TSHABE: I am here because I would like to request the Commission to help me in my studies and my ill-health.

MR SANDI: Can you specify about health?

THEMBINKOSI TSHABE: Since after that time, me and one of the gentleman who were shot, when we went to the Doctor, Doctor Kashent, he said he won't give us treatment, we must go straight to the hospital.
 But because we are not politicians in Venterstad, we were told that we mustn't go to the hospital, because it might happen that the police could come to the hospital and arrest us, so we were afraid, we didn't go to the hospital.
 The comrades took us and they tried to remove the pellets, it is only three pellets now that are embedded in my body and after some time that affected me because I normally have sharp pains, I feel dizzy some times.

MR SANDI: Do you mean that you have pellets embedded in your body?

THEMBINKOSI TSHABE: Yes, three of them.

MR SANDI: Is there any way how this whole thing affected you especially in your studies?  Was your time wasted?

THEMBINKOSI TSHABE: Yes, it is so because as from that year I
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couldn't concentrate, I couldn't think quickly.  Especially if I am in class, sometimes I become dizzy.
 So since after the incident, I couldn't succeed with my studies.

MR SANDI: Lastly, if you say you request that you get assistance in your studies, is there any career that you would like to pursue?

THEMBINKOSI TSHABE: What I thought about was being a nurse, I also thought of being a male nurse or a Social Worker.

MR SANDI: Do you mean that you would like to be a male nurse?

THEMBINKOSI TSHABE: Yes.

MR SANDI: Thembinkosi, is that all that you would like to tell us about just before I hand you over to the Chairperson?

THEMBINKOSI TSHABE: Yes, that is all for now.

BONGANI FINCA: Mxolisi, I want to start with you.  The people who did all these things to you, what is it that you would like the Commission to do about them?

MXOLISI GOBOZA: I would like the Commission to investigate and get them and punish these people.

BONGANI FINCA: And you Thembinkosi?

THEMBINKOSI TSHABE: That is my wish also.

BONGANI FINCA: Thank you.  I think that is the very first time in this area in this hearings of the Eastern Cape that we are listening to the testimonies of the people of your age, more specially Mxolise who is only 15 years old.
 We normally listen to the elderly people, it is for the first time that we are listening to young people, a young person like Mxolisi.
 That has actually touched us.  We thank God that He has
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protected you that you didn't die that day.  As we are looking at you, we think about a lot of children who are like you, who were not so fortunate to be alive.  Young boys and girls who never escaped like you.
 We wish you all the best in your lives.  You have seen great things at a tender age in a country where the elderly people are shooting the children.  In other countries the people say that children must be protected, given love and cared for.  In this country the elderly men are shooting the children of your age, saying that they are protecting themselves, saying that they are maintaining law and order.
 We have a wish if it is possible, that you can grow up and the careers that you would like to pursue in life, that should also happen.  In Ventersdorp, you would be the leaders, you have seen many great things at a tender age.
 We thank you for coming to the Commission.  Your wish that you would like to see these people getting punished, we have noted it.  My wish is that those people one day should see, they should go to Ventersdorp and they should take a closer look at you and say we apologise for nearly destroying your lives.  Thank you.