Human Rights Violation Hearings — Durban — 1996-05-08

KHOZA MGOJO: I think we, as the Commission, we will try and meet the family.

WITNESS:   I will be very grateful to that, Because we haven't even been to Ixopo Springfield.  We are planning to go there.  At the moment for us to get full information we will need to get this from the family, but we are happy that we came here.  And also give us courage and strength to go to this family.  We are going to try and reach them and see what we can do for this family, and get all the information.   ---   Yes, I am very happy about that.  But what made my heart sore was that I didn't hear anything about his death.

KHOZA MGOJO: Is there anybody with a question?

DR BORAINE: Chairperson, I'd like to ask - well, I'll wait until the earphones are in place.  I'd like to ask Mr Mayi - when your cousin was taken by the police, and you mentioned a name of a man by the name of Grant, did you ever hear whether your cousin was charged or arrested for any particular offence?  Why did they take him?

WITNESS:  They said he is a terrorist.  I don't even know what a terrorist is.

DR BORAINE: And when they told you that he was dead can you remember what was the cause of death?

WITNESS:   They used to say somebody has hung himself with his own shirt.

DR BORAINE: Can you tell me was there any doctor, or any court case that you can remember?

WITNESS:  (Incomplete - end of Side A, Tape 9) ... I'll be very, very happy if you could investigate what happened.

DR BORAINE: Thank you very much.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very much, Baba.

DR BORAINE: Mr Ndedelwa, we'd like to welcome you very warmly to the Commission, and we want to thank you for coming.  You have come to talk about what happened to you, not about a member of your family, and you want to tell the Commission of times when you were brutally attacked.  Now, before we hear your story you have to take an oath that you will tell the truth, so could you please stand.

SILELANE NICHOLAS NDEDELWA: (Sworn, States)

DR BORAINE: Thank you very much.  Please be seated.  Mr Ndedelwa, Dr Magwaza, who is on the Commission - she is sitting over there - is going to help you to tell the story of what happened in your own life, and I hand over to her now.  Thank you very much.

DR MAGWAZA: I greet you, Mr Miya.  We want to welcome you here, and we are grateful that you are one of the people who could come and give us evidence here.  In your statement you said you are here representing yourself, together with another person called Mpanza, is that right?

WITNESS:   Yes.

DR MAGWAZA: I am going to ask you, Mr Miya, to start with yourself.  Tell us who are you, where do you come from, so that we can know you.  We don't want to hear anything about Mpanza now, we just want to hear something about you.  Yes, you can start.

WITNESS:   I am Silulane Nicholas Ndedelwa.  I come from Inanda.

DR MAGWAZA: Are you finished?

WITNESS:   Yes.

DR MAGWAZA: Before getting into your story I want to know, this Mpanza you want to talk about, is he related to you, or was he just a friend?

WITNESS:   No, we were not related at all, but I knew him because I knew all the youth.  He was still very young, he was 15 years old when he met his fate.  I think on the 17th of September it was on a Sunday.  It was round about 4 o'clock.  We were returning from a meeting called by the organiser.  He called everybody who was a leader of the street, because at that time I was also a leader in our community.

DR MAGWAZA: Can I interrupt you a little?  Can you tell us what you were?  Can you please tell us this thing?  You said you were something.  Can you clearly indicate?

WITNESS:   No, there is nothing I am afraid of.  I am going to put everything clear, but if I make mistakes I'll request you to please forgive me.  At about four, when we were coming from the meeting, I saw many people running, whereas they were - the one they were chasing was on the river.  I didn't see this person.  I saw those people who were chasing.  As I just parked the car at home I saw this one running from below, and I parked the car and I went to peep.  As I was peeping, before I arrived to him, I found that this one had already been grabbed by two men.  These two men who had grabbed him it was Cele and Mthembu.  I went to them.  I said, "Oh, guys, what is happening?  Why are you grabbing this man?"  And also all this other crowd also running towards him.  They said, "No, he was running away.  We were trying to chase him so we can find out."  This boy said, "No."  He said, "These people came at home and they attacked us at home.  When I tried to run away I ran towards the back of the window and ran away.  They saw me running.  That's why I was running away.  So now why are you coming here?"  At that time he said, "No, I was running towards this man because I saw he might save me, because I know he is a person who is always at home.  So "I came here because he's a person I trust who can really mediate and help me."  He was pointing at me.  At that time I had just arrived.  I said, "But why are you catching this person?"  This person said, "We want to hear from him.  We found him running.  Now we want to hear from him."  I said, "Please leave him alone," and when these people are chasing him they will do whatever they want.  Maybe they'll hurt him.  I said, "Please leave him because I also don't know, you also don't know, because you can see people are running away, so may you please leave him, let him run."  They grabbed him and the first person came, and I said, "Please don't do it."  This person respected me.  The second person came, and the third one.  When the third person arrived he said, "What are you waiting for?"  He said, "No, we're being disturbed by this man.  We've got this kid now."  While he was still holding the other one stabbed at him while the others were just standing there.  They stabbed at him, and he jumped and fell towards the house.  When he got up he was dizzy.  They chased him towards the street and he fell, and they stabbed and stabbed and stabbed him, and lots of them came now at the place where he had fallen.  I went there again.  I also was confused, I was frightened.  I was confused by this death, because the people who were doing these things were children.  While I was still trying to reprimand them they said, "You are the one who will follow this person because you are reprimanding us doing our work.  We don't need you.  Could you just keep quiet and leave this whole thing, because if you try to reprimand us we are going to continue with you, but we are going to go away and we will come back."  But I said, "What you are doing in front of

DR MAGWAZA: /"me I