Human Rights Violation Hearings — Pietermaritzburg — UNKNOWN

WITNESS:   Yes, there was no violence at that time ... (incomplete - end of Side A, Tape 4) ... we haven't find anything up to now.  We don't  know what happened.

MRS GCABASHE: It happened just like that?

WITNESS:   Yes.

MRS GCABASHE: This looks very painful, this disappearance of young children at that time.  I don't know, as you have said this daughter of yours was there at the time when you gave in your statement maybe she might be able to help us.  Does she think there's anything that you have left out?

WITNESS:   I don't know.  Maybe she can tell you something.

MRS GCABASHE: Is there anything that you think it's left out - you left out?  Oh, let me first ask the Chairperson.  We would like you to take an oath.  Please stand up.

THEMBALIHLE MAZIBUKO: (Sworn, States)

MRS GCABASHE: Thembalihle, I would like you not to repeat what your mother have said.  Just tell us what you think has been left out.

WITNESS:   Yes, I will do that.  I would like to say that what happened is that we were preparing to go to school.  It was February 1987.  My brother, Eric, was the one who used to arrange our school things.  He was our leader, and that's the one we trusted.  We saw each other in the morning at home.  He went to school on that day.  We greeted him and wished him well before he left.  At home we left our grandmother.

MRS GCABASHE: Where were you schooling?

WITNESS:   I was schooling at Charts High School(?).  He told us he was going to fetch his results.  His were matric results.  We were staying at Imbiza place, which was dominated by UDF people.  While he was walking to school there was a place which separate - a boundary of which separated us, the UDF, and the IFP people.

MRS GCABASHE: What boundary is that?

WITNESS:   This was just a small way where it sort of like there was water running down.  It was separating the two places, the Inkatha and the UDF places.  When he were on the IFP stronghold then he happened to meet his friend on his way, and that's where they caught him.

MRS GCABASHE: Do you remember the name of his friend?

WITNESS:   No, I don't remember well, but his surname was Makhatini, something like that.  When he met him he was running, and when he met him he didn't tell him the truth.  And he asked him exactly, "Why are you running fast?" and he said, "No, I have forgotten something."  While he was walking he happened to meet a group of people, and this young man saw him when they kidnapped him.  They took him away.  And he ran away to my place to tell my grandmother about this.  My grandmother went to fetch us at school.  They also informed my mother about this at work.  We were nine children as she have just explained.  This young boy came to tell us that Eric has been kidnapped.

MRS GCABASHE: Can you please tell us exactly the things that your mum might have left out.

WITNESS:   As this young boy has already tell us how they kidnapped him we tried to search.  We went to fetch my mum, who is a sister to my real mother.  We went to Mr Ndlovu to report this and ask him about this.  He didn't even seem to be co-operating or doing something about this.  The people who were concerned were the UDF people who were staying in our place.  They tried to report the case to the police.  These were the ZP police, so they didn't like anyone to come and report any case having something to do with the IFP.  So because of that they didn't do anything.  We went to report it at court and they told us that, "Just wait and be cool then come back."

MRS GCABASHE: When you go to court was a court case opened or were you just going to report the matter?

WITNESS:   No, we were just going to report the case.  After reporting this painful matter they said we must bring photos.  We gave them the photos and they said they will search for him.  At that time at Shongweni there were police.  There was violence, so they were always there to keep order.

MRS GCABASHE: Which policemen?

WITNESS:   These were the police from Pietermaritzburg, SAP Police.  They started to help us to search for him.  We went to the mortuary and also the places where they used to dump bodies.  We couldn't find him.  The ZP didn't help us in any way.  We went to the mortuary to look for him - at hospitals.  We couldn't find him up to now.  After some time they didn't even bring back his photos.  We even decided to run away from the place because like it was so violent, so we had to run away to another place called Washburn.  I would also like to say that we couldn't find anything having anything to do with him.  We'll be so happy to find even just a bone.  We only want to find - we only want his bones.

MRS GCABASHE: When did you go to Washburn?

WITNESS:   We went there at 1991.

MRS GCABASHE: It's very painful to lose your beloved one.  As you have requested the Commission to help you to find if ever we could find him, and also to try to find out the people who kidnapped him.

WITNESS:   I wish the Commission could help us to find him, especially Mandla Ndlovu should be asked as to his whereabouts, exactly where he is, so that if ever he is killed we can take him and bury him.

MRS GCABASHE: I would like to ask you my last question, as I can see that you are hurt is there any after-effects after his disappearance?  How did it impact on you?

WITNESS:   We had serious problems about this disappearance.  My younger brother, after he heard this his brother has disappeared he started to feel ill, and he had a problem with his head - headache.  He started just wandering around like doing nothing.  We still have a problem because he was a breadwinner.  Maybe today he was the one supposed to be taking care of us.  Maybe if he was around his brothers were going to have good life.  My mum is crying.

MRS GCABASHE: How was your mum affected?

WITNESS:   It's so difficult because this it always comes back to her, and she is not feeling well at all.

MRS GCABASHE: What about the younger brother that you told us about with psychological disorder, is he getting any treatment?

WITNESS:   Yes, he does go to Pinetown to collect some medicine.  This is the tablets which keeps him alive, but he normally goes away because he doesn't know what's going on with him.  I believe that the Commission might help to organise any help, try to contact the Health Department or anyone who can help us.

MRS GCABASHE: They might be able to help you, brother.

WITNESS:    We would like to thank you.

MRS GCABASHE:  I only have one question to ask.  Let me take you back to Makhatini.  This Makhatini came to tell you that the Inkatha people have kidnapped others.  What was his name, this Makhatini?

WITNESS:   I don't remember his name because we were not used to him.

MRS GCABASHE: You said he died.  What killed him?

WITNESS:   I don't know.  We just heard that he died.  They were staying at another place far away from us.

MRS GCABASHE: She didn't tell you exactly, the woman who told you that he died, what killed him?

WITNESS:   Yes, they didn't.

MR LAX: (Inaudible) ... others were abducted on the same day.  Do you know anything about those others, those families, who those people might have been?  Did you touch any of the other families in the area to see if their children had been abducted as well?

WITNESS:   Those who were kidnapped on that day I don't know their names.  I don't know them.

MR LAX: (Inaudible) ... Mrs Mdluli, do you know anything about that perhaps?

WITNESS:   No, I know nothing.