Human Rights Violation Hearings — Soweto — 1996-07-26

NOBELUNGU LEBALLO: The very same people, the people who feel that the painful things, they must come forward. It is only the people of my church, only the people of my church.  Otherwise the ordinary people, even if they want to ask me about the child, I just feel very bad.

GLENDA WILDSCHUT: Thank you, Mamma.

CHAIRPERSON: Mamma, I would just like to ask you a few questions.  Was your son a member of any political party?

NOBELUNGU LEBALLO: Yes, he was a member.

CHAIRPERSON: Which one?

NOBELUNGU LEBALLO: The ANC.

CHAIRPERSON: During his employment with Mrs Mandela, was he a member of the football club?

NOBELUNGU LEBALLO: Tisetso was not employed by Mrs Mandela, he was employed by the ANC.  Make no mistake, he was not employed by Mrs Mandela.

CHAIRPERSON: But he was her driver.

NOBELUNGU LEBALLO: Yes, he was her driver and that ended there. He was working under the ANC he was not working under Mrs Mandela, he wasn't getting paid by Mrs Mandela.

CHAIRPERSON: When he was in exile, do you know what he did in exile, was he a member of MK?
SOWETO HEARING TRC/GAUTENG
11 N LEBALLO

NOBELUNGU LEBALLO: The exile story is very painful, I don't even want to talk about it. Because they were taken to Quattro.  He didn't even want to tell me about that, about the Quattro camp. I don't even know what was happening in the Quattro camp.

CHAIRPERSON: When this story came out in the City Press, did you go to the ANC offices to ask them if they knew any more about it, did they have any more information on the fact that this report had appeared, which alleged that they had been blown up by De Kock?

NOBELUNGU LEBALLO: I didn't go to the ANC.  The officer who was in charge of De Kock's case, is the one who came to ask me to testify in Pretoria Supreme Court.  I didn't go to the ANC.

CHAIRPERSON: Mamma, one more question. You say you were asked by the officer to go and testify at De Kock's trial. Could you tell me who the officer was?

NOBELUNGU LEBALLO: It was Michael Holmes.

CHAIRPERSON: Did you go?

NOBELUNGU LEBALLO: Yes, me and his father went there.

CHAIRPERSON: Could you tell me were you asked to testify?

NOBELUNGU LEBALLO: They said I must tell them what I am telling you today.

CHAIRPERSON: Did you hear anything more about your son's death, from the evidence that was being presented at the trial?

NOBELUNGU LEBALLO: The person who was giving evidence was a White man. He was testifying because he was nearer to the place of the accident.  He was telling them whom he saw and what was happening. I didn't listen to further evidence because I wasn't there.
SOWETO HEARING TRC/GAUTENG
12 N LEBALLO

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very much, Mamma. We are very sorry to hear about your story. I think that it is very difficutl when you lose a child and then you still have to live with the fact that you don't know exactly how he died, or why he died.  We feel very sorry for you and we hope that through our investigation unit that we will be able to assist you in finding out what happened to him.  Thank you very much for coming to share your story with us.
APPLAUSE

CHAIRPERSON: We will now break for lunch and I would appeal to people to leave behind ... (RECORDING SWITCHED OFF).
SOWETO HEARING TRC/GAUTENG