Human Rights Violation Hearings — Pietermaritzburg — UNKNOWN

KHOZA MGOJO: If ever the Truth Commission would like maybe to contact him can they find him in the Trust Feed?

WITNESS:   Yes.

MR LYSTER: (Inaudible) ... put what happened to you in its proper context.  You were detained on the morning of the 2nd of December.

WITNESS:   That's correct.

MR LYSTER: All the men over 35 that were not Inkatha were detained that morning.

WITNESS:   That's correct. The massacre which is public knowledge happened than very night.   ---   That's correct.

MR LYSTER: Thank you, Mr Chairman.  Dumisani, can you please assist me here, because you talk about finding a job.  What are your qualifications?

WITNESS:   I have got matric.

MR LYSTER: Do you have any skills, or have you studied for any job or career after matric?

WITNESS:   I did a commercial matric.

MR LYSTER: Did you ever work at any place?  What are those places?

WITNESS:   There were so many.

MR LYSTER: I mean we want to find exactly what kind of work that you can do.

WITNESS:   I can do clerical work.

MR LYSTER: Thank you

MR LYSTER: (Inaudible) ... very much for coming to tell us your story today.  You have, like the previous witness, Mr Mbongwe, again focused on the tragic events which took place on the 2nd and 3rd of December in Trust Feeds.  What is very significant about your evidence is that it is clear that you and the other able-bodied men of the Trust Feeds area were arrested by the South African Police about 12 hours before the massacre of 11 women and children by those same police.

MR LYSTER: As a result of this you were forced to leave your house and, as you put it in your statement, your family disintegrated completely and you were forced to live in rented lodgings in various townships around Pietermaritzburg.

MR LYSTER: As I said to the previous witness, what happened to you was not a random event, it was a deliberately planned strategy orchestrated by the police and other people to enforce the policies of the Government of the day, to enforce homeland consolidation and to ensure the political dominance of the Inkatha Freedom Party in the Trust Feeds area.

MR LYSTER: We have taken note of everything that you have said, and, as my colleague Mr Dlamini has said, we shall be making recommendations to the Government as to how people like you, and others who have suffered in the same way, should be assisted.  So again we thank you very much for coming in and telling us your story, and we wish you well.  Thank you very much.

MR LYSTER: THABONIWE NGCOBO

MR LYSTER: Good morning, Mrs Thaboniwe Ngcobo.  We would like to thank you for having been able to appear before this Commission to talk about the way in which you were harassed, so that even those who didn't know that there was a time of harassment, when they hear they will be able to know that there has been a difficult time where people were harassed.  We pity you.  You were very still young at the time you were harassed.  From your statement it seems as if you were born in 1972, which means during that time when you were harassed you were about 13 years old.  I would like to ask, before we get into your evidence, to tell us more about your family.  Do you have parents?

WITNESS:   Yes, I do have parents.

MR LYSTER: Are they staying at this address you have given to us?

WITNESS:   Yes.

MR LYSTER: How many are you at home?

WITNESS:   We are 11.

MR LYSTER: Are they daughters, female children?

WITNESS:   We have got five daughters and five boys.

MR LYSTER: Are there still some children who are still going to school?

WITNESS:   Yes, we do have.

MR LYSTER: Do you have a child yourself?

WITNESS:   Yes, I do have a child.

MR LYSTER: One?

WITNESS:   Yes, one.

MR LYSTER: How old is he?

WITNESS:   He is seven years old.

MR LYSTER: Can you tell us what happened to you.  Maybe you should start from the 11th of September 1985, where you were staying at Mpophomeni.  Can you tell us about the situation in Mpophomeni at that time?

WITNESS:   At that time - I would like to start from the April.  On the April 30th there was a strike at Sarmcol at Howick.  At the time where I was staying the community was united.  It was COSATU working with UDF.  UDF was mostly organising the youth activities.  At that time anything which was happening in the community, whether it was harassment by police, the community used to stand together.  The person or the family which has been harassed the community will come to sort of assist.  There was no opposition party.  We were united as one community.

MR LYSTER: Thank you very much.  Can you tell us more about what happened on the 11th of September?  Can you tell us more about that date?

WITNESS:   On the 11th of September on Wednesday it was at night.  Before that night we heard some rumours.  There was a place on the other side where the chief used to reside, and this was the Inkatha area.

MR LYSTER: What was the name of the chief?

WITNESS:   It was just called - this is the chief's place.  That's the name of the place.  There were people there who were also involved in the strike at Sarmcol.  These people didn't agree in views with the community of Mpophomeni, and they decided that - we heard that they were going to attack the Mpophomeni place.  And it happened that when we looked at them we could see that they are coming to attack at that time.  As I said we were united, like if there's something wrong we used to come together to try to sort it out.  At that night we started to toyi-toyi so that the people on the other side from the chief's place, "We're not asleep yet," they can't do anything.  It happened that at night at home I just finished washing.  When I get out I heard a song.  It was something like as if it was so interesting or so jubilant.  It was the community doing something together.  I wanted to listen and I listened.  I saw the people toyi-toying. and then I ran into the house and tell the others who were inside.

MR LYSTER: Who are the people who were in the house?

WITNESS:   Those were my brothers and sisters.

MR LYSTER: Can you tell us their names?

WITNESS:   The one that I remember well - there was this one, Phi, and another woman called Lindiwe.

MR LYSTER: What's the other name of Phi?

WITNESS:   His name is just Phi.  While they were sort of arguing with me and saying, "There's no such a thing," and then these people were so near.  And people were saying, "Okay, wake up, the chief is attacking us."  When we get out to see what's happening outside that is the time when the police arrived.  Some of the police were on foot, some were driving in vans.  We sort of like joined the toyi-toyi, and others shot while like - the fired tear gas, and all the people started to disperse.

MR LYSTER: Were you also involved in the toyi-toyi?