Special Hearings — Mandela United Football Club Hearings — 1997-11-24

EBRAHIM ASVAT: I didn't follow that?

MR KADES: Sorry, also the fact that the patient's card shows that Jerry Richardson had returned to the surgery on the day of the murder, probably within an hour or two of the murder, before the murder took place?

EBRAHIM ASVAT: That is correct, that is recorded on the patient's record.

MR KADES: Yes, do carry on please.

EBRAHIM ASVAT: Between 2 pm and 4 pm on Friday, 27th January, hours before his assassination, Dr Abu-Baker Asvat is allegedly visited at his surgery by Mrs Winnie Madikizela-Mandela and Katiza Cebekhulu, allegedly a volcanic row ensues and Mrs Winnie Madikizela-Mandela is understood to have demanded a medical certificate confirming the sodomisation of Cebekhulu.
 Mrs Albertina Sisulu is present in her office at Dr Asvat's surgery during the volcanic row with Katiza Cebekhulu in the waiting room.  Mrs Albertina Sisulu needs to explain exactly as to what transpired between Mrs Madikizela-Mandela and Dr Abu-Baker Asvat at the consulting rooms on that particular day.

MR KADES: Yes, now Mrs Albertina Sisulu was called as a witness at the trial of Dlamini and Mbatha, the two convicted murderers, is that so?

EBRAHIM ASVAT: That is correct.

MR KADES: Did she ever (indistinct) to this, was she ever led on this aspect of the matter?

EBRAHIM ASVAT: Not at all.

MR KADES: Yes, carry on.

EBRAHIM ASVAT: Stompie Moketsi was seen by Dr Asvat after a brutal assault on the 29th of December 1988 and this is from Katiza's journey.  Along with the other kidnapped boys, Katiza Cebekhulu was examined by Dr Abu-Baker Asvat on the 30th or the 31st of December of 1988, as recorded on his medical record card, and double entry patient registration logbook, now in Police possession.
 Suggestion of Police cover up.  It is alleged in the Mail and Guardian, page 3 of the 5th of September 1997, that senior Superintendent H.D. Moodley Investigating Officer of Dr Abu-Baker Asvat's assassination, visits T.N. Dlamini at Westville Prison, Durban as late as June 1997 although the investigation on Dr Abu-Baker Asvat's murder was closed down in 1995.
 Dlamini states senior Superintendent H.D. Moodley claimed to represent the Truth and Reconciliation Commission and allegedly takes Dlamini's amnesty application.  Truth and Reconciliation Commission denies amnesty application received by it.
 Senior Superintendent H.D. Moodley strongly defended by Commissioner Fivas recently, is reported in the Sunday Tribune of the 21st of September 1997, that senior Superintendent H.D. Moodley was convicted of fraud in 1984 for attempting to falsify a blood test for his co-accused, who was trying to escape paying maintenance for his child.
 Also senior Superintendent H.D. Moodley, a former Durban Security Policeman, accused hit squad Commander Dirk Coetzee of claiming to have been tasked by National Intelligence Agency to spy on Commissioner Fivas and other top police figures.
 It is also reported in the same article that senior Superintendent H.D. Moodley was subjected to a lie detector test by the Parliamentary Intelligence oversight committee.
 It is stated that senior Superintendent H.D. Moodley failed on virtually every count.  Superintendent Moodley denies failing the lie test.

MR KADES: We have already heard from Minister Sydney Mufamadi that he instructed, at your instance that the investigations relating to the death of your late brother, be reopened some time in 1995, is that correct?

EBRAHIM ASVAT: That is correct.

MR KADES: Do you know who was tasked with the further investigation after it had been reopened?

EBRAHIM ASVAT: Well, it was both Henk Hesslinga and Superintendent Moodley.

MR KADES: Had Henk Hesslinga, the policeman Henk Hesslinga, had he been also one of the previous policemen in the investigation of the death of your brother?

EBRAHIM ASVAT: That is correct.

MR KADES: So the same two people, both - do you know what Mr Hesslinga's background is in regard to his police service?

EBRAHIM ASVAT: Well, I do know that Colonel Henk Hesslinga at one time told us that he was also a member of Koevoet.

MR KADES: And is it all these facts and what you have heard over the years, that have caused you to come to this Commission on behalf of the family and to hear and to make further investigations concerning this matter?

EBRAHIM ASVAT: That is correct.

MR KADES: Thank you Mr Commissioner.

MR KADES: .

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very much.  Hanif?  You did it in 15 minutes.

MR KADES: Yes, I take your constriction rather seriously.

CHAIRPERSON: Hanif, 15 minutes, show them that you are even nicer.

MR VALLY: Thank you Archbishop.  Dr Asvat, I first want to ask you about the medical record which indicated that on the 30th of September 1998, Mrs Albertina Sisulu made an entry regarding ... (intervention)

CHAIRPERSON: Just get your dates properly, what year?

MR VALLY: I am so sorry, I am reading verbatim, but it is clearly it should have been 1988.  Under your heading under chronology of events, on the 29th of December 1988, the last sentence or let's start with the last paragraph.
 Mrs Madikizela-Mandela claims she and Falati took Cebekhulu to Dr Abu-Baker Asvat's surgery on the 29th of December and it should be 1988 as opposed to what it says there?

EBRAHIM ASVAT: That is correct.

MR VALLY: And that she left for Brandfort on the evening of the 29th, returning on the 31st.  Medical records show that she took Cebekhulu for surgery the following day, the 30th of December 1988.  Did you see this medical record yourself?

EBRAHIM ASVAT: Yes, I have seen the medical record myself.

MR VALLY: Did you recognise Dr Asvat's - I am sorry, do you have that, Archbishop?

CHAIRPERSON: It seems as if you keep saying September, you don't say December?

MR VALLY: No, I am saying December.

CHAIRPERSON: You said September.

MR VALLY: I am so sorry, something is wrong today.

CHAIRPERSON: It is Monday and I understand.  I mean blue Monday and all that.

MR VALLY: I will finish my mint Archbishop.

CHAIRPERSON: Try again.

MR VALLY: All right.  We are dealing with the chronology of events leading to the assassination of Dr Abu-Baker Asvat which is annexed to your statement.
 We are looking at the second paragraph where you start off medical records show that she took Cebekhulu to the surgery the following day, 30th of December and it should be 1988.
 Dr Asvat's nursing sister and assistant Mrs Albertina Sisulu, was present when Cebekhulu was brought to the surgery.  Mrs Sisulu's handwriting appears on the medical card recording patient details, including date stamp.
 Do you confirm that you have personally seen this?

EBRAHIM ASVAT: Yes, I have personally seen that medical record.

MR VALLY: Do you recognise your deceased brother's handwriting?

EBRAHIM ASVAT: Yes, I do.

MR VALLY: Can you briefly recall what he had written on regarding the patient Cebekhulu?

EBRAHIM ASVAT: Well, may I just have a look at it, I don't have it with me here.   The top section refers to the patient and his details, as to where he lives, what his name was, any allergies and the card number and his occupation.
 And that is in the handwriting of Mrs Albertina Sisulu.  The date stamp is then attached, which says 1988-12-80, it says mentally confused, occasionally cries, occasionally hysterical, insomnia.  My brother then treats him.  There is no further notes attached to that about the examination except that the treatment given was lethal, which is (indistinct), a sedative, hypnotic, to be taken one at night and he was given 10 of those, he was given some Panado tablets and multivitamins.  He was not charged.  The n/c stands for no charge.  And the details about the medical history is written in my brother's handwriting.

MR VALLY: Thank you Dr Asvat.  You discovered this and you forwarded this to the Police?

EBRAHIM ASVAT: That is correct.