Human Rights Violation Hearings — Bisho — 1996-09-11

REV XUNDU: Let's now ask Mr Freddie Tutani to come forward.  Mr Thembela Mtyingwana?
THEMBELA MTYINGWANA    Duly sworn states

ADV SANDI: Let me greet you first, Ms Thembela Mtyingwana.  By the way your request is that you should appear before this Commission to talk about what happened to you on the 7th September 1992.

WITNESS:  Yes it's like that.

ADV SANDI:  And Thembela could you now explain and tell us about your experiences when there was this shooting.

WITNESS:  We were marching up the main road and we were facing the stadium.  I jumped over a fence and I walked for a short distance and I thought I had stumbled because I fell on my face and I was trying to stand up.  I noticed blood, then I tried again to stand up but I couldn't walk.  Then I crawled because there was a certain car parked in front and I was trying to get to that car to go and hide underneath and I kept there for a while.  There was the gunshots and then the owner of the car saw me under the car and he took me into the car and drove me to the Gray hospital where I was given pain tablets and admitted, which was on a Monday.  Then on Wednesday I was transferred to the Frere hospital where I was given a medical examination and discharged on a Monday.

ADV SANDI:  Now you say, where were you shot?

WITNESS:  I was shot here on my thigh.  The bullet pierced through my thigh.

ADV SANDI:  Do you still have a bullet in your body?

WITNESS:  No the bullet just went through my body.

ADV SANDI:  Then at Cecilia Makiwane hospital, did you ever get any treatment?

WITNESS:  Yes I did.  At Cecilia Makiwane, when I was shot in 1992, I used to go there to get treatment, at Gray hospital as well.  Then in 1996 my leg got swollen and I went to the Gray hospital.  They referred me to Cecilia and I was hospitalised for a week and they operated on my leg because it was swollen and they said there was some poison in my leg.

ADV SANDI:  Now you say this was all as a result of the shooting, as a result you can't even work well.

WITNESS:  Yes, I can't work properly because some other times my leg does not function well, I feel some sharp pains, it becomes very painful.  Even now it is still swollen though I'm still taking my medication and treatment.

ADV SANDI:  How often do you go to the hospital to get your treatment?

WITNESS:  I always go whenever I feel some pains and then they will give me a date to come back to them.

ADV SANDI:  I see here in your statement that you have a request that you should be granted a bursary to further your studies.  What are you doing presently?

WITNESS:  I'm doing nothing.  I'm staying with my mother who is working and yet there are five of us and we all go to school.  I passed my standard 10 last year and my wish is to pursue my studies and because my mother is the only one who is employed, is the one who gives me the money for transport and for admission in hospital.

ADV SANDI:  What work does your mother do?

WITNESS:  She is a shop assistant in King William's Town.

ADV SANDI:  Are there any other requests that you may be having to forward to this Commission?

WITNESS:  My request is that this Commission should assist me as my mother is the only one who is employed and who provides me financially.

ADV SANDI:  Is there any lawyer you want to see for any advice in connection with this?

WITNESS:  My mother did go after my injury in 1992, to a lawyer here in King William's Town.

ADV SANDI:  Do you still remember the name of that lawyer?

WITNESS: Yes I do.

ADV SANDI:  And what happened there?

WITNESS:  Then this lawyer said we should wait but up to now we haven't received any response.

ADV SANDI:  What is the name of this lawyer?

WITNESS:  He is Mr Smith.

ADV SANDI:  Is he the one who was mentioned earlier by the others?

WITNESS:  Yes.

ADV SANDI:  When last did you talk to Mr Smith in connection with this matter?

WITNESS:  It was last month when my mother talked to him and then Mr Smith said we should expect a letter which hasn't come.

ADV SANDI:  Did Mr Smith explain to your mother that - how far has he gone with this matter?

WITNESS:  Yes he did and mentioning everything and he has got all the documents that are necessary with him.

ADV SANDI:  Now you say this Commission should find out from Mr Smith how far has he gone with your claim?

WITNESS:  Yes if it is possible.

ADV SANDI:  Is that all you have to say to this Commission?

WITNESS:  Yes that's all.

ADV SANDI: I thank you Ms Mtyingwana.  I shall now hand you over to the Chairperson.

CHAIRPERSON: Are there any questions from anyone?  Thank you.

TRUTH AND RECONCILIATION COMMISSION: BISHO MASSACRE - DAY 3 - 11 SEPTEMBER 1996

ADV SANDI: We will request Wandile Mbathu to come and give testimony.
WANDILE MBATHU   Duly sworn states

ADV SANDI: Could you come closer to the mike sir so that we can hear you properly.  I would like to just make sure that I've got the right names.  Is your name Wandile Mbathu and not Mbethe?

WITNESS:  No it's not Mbethe.

ADV SANDI:  Mr Wandile Mbathu?

WITNESS:  Yes, thank you.

ADV SANDI:  Mr Mbathu you said that you were at the march when people were being shot.

WITNESS:  Yes I was.

ADV SANDI:  Can I request that you tell us what happened to you that day.

WITNESS:  We went to Bisho.  When we got there we were shot.  After we were shot, as I was shot in the head and fell down.

ADV SANDI:  Where exactly?

WITNESS:  It started on my side to the front.

ADV SANDI:  Please carry on.

WITNESS:  I fell down and when I tried to get up I was very dizzy and I fell again.  After I had fallen, people came and put us in cars and then we were taken to the Gray hospital.  When we got to the hospital I was walking.  I was given tablets and medicine then I went home.  When I got home on the fifth day I started having fits and I was taken to the hospital.  I was taken to the [indistinct] hospital.

ADV SANDI:  In your statement Mr Mbathu, you say you were taken from the location of the shootings and you were thrown in with corpses.

WITNESS:  Yes I was.

ADV SANDI:  Did these people think that you had also died?

WITNESS:  Yes they did.

ADV SANDI:  Where did you hear this from?

WITNESS:  Someone told me.

ADV SANDI:  Did he see you when you were being put in the van?

WITNESS:  Yes he was there.

ADV SANDI:  Mr Mbathu, we just want to hear fully about the injury that you sustained as a result of you being shot.

WITNESS:  I was taken to hospital in Mdantsane.  I stayed there for about two months.  They were trying to remove the bullet from my head.  I was operated on.

ADV SANDI:  Did you receive any treatment?  Are you still on treatment?

WITNESS:  Yes I continually go.

ADV SANDI:  Where is your doctor?

WITNESS:  He is in Mdantsane.

ADV SANDI:  Is he in the hospital there?

WITNESS:  Yes he is at the hospital.

ADV SANDI:  What kind of medical treatment are you receiving, is it for pain?

WITNESS:  I constantly get cramps and I just fall all the time.

ADV SANDI:  Did you go to attorneys to put a claim?

WITNESS:  Yes I did go.

ADV SANDI:  Which attorneys are these?

WITNESS:  Smith.

ADV SANDI:  What happened?

WITNESS:  He said that I would receive my money sometime, I went last Tuesday as well.

ADV SANDI:  Do you mean last week?

WITNESS:  Yes last week.

ADV SANDI:  Did he say how much you are going to receive?

WITNESS:  No he did not.

ADV SANDI:  Do you have a request to put forward to the Commission?

WITNESS:  I request that as I am injured, that I could get my money because it's quite problematic.  I need pension.

ADV SANDI:  I notice here that there is another request that you have made, that has nothing to do with you personally.  Do you remember that request?

WITNESS:  Yes I do.

ADV SANDI:  Can you tell us Mr Mbathu?

WITNESS:  I said I wanted a house.