Amnesty Hearings — East London — 1998-04-15

VUYISILE LEBRAN MADASI: The platform that we are at today is such that liberation fighters, I will not say perpetrator because that means something else altogether, this platform is such that liberation fighters and victims hold hands and reconcile in this new South Africa.
	If this Truth and Reconciliation Commission would not be here, if it didn't exist, we wouldn't be here, I would not have come here.  That in itself depicts my attitude.  We made a decision as the PAC that we should come to the Truth and Reconciliation Commission.  We have come to reconcile here as liberation fighters and the victims, so that we do not begrudge each other, or that you do not begrudge us.
	If there is a way within you that we can meet, and talk and see what we can do.  As APLA is an affiliation of the PAC, the PAC itself is trying to see which programmes can be constituted so that us as liberation fighters and the families of the victims, could reconcile.
	We are at that level now, at that stage.

DS DE KOCK: Mr Madasi, one last question please.  I hear that you say that the families of victims also, that you and they be reconciled and vice versa, is there anything that you want to say to Mrs Jerling personally, her father, Mr Goosen was actually the father of Johan, because he raised Johan.  His own father was also passed away years ago and to the deceased's closest friend here, Mr Nel, is there anything that you want to say to them personally this morning, please?

ADV GCABASHE: If I can just suggest that you speak just a little slower, because the interpreter on my understanding, sitting next to you, is missing quite a few things that you are saying.  The sense she is giving is correct, but maybe just slow down, so she can add a little more, if that is all right with you.

VUYISILE LEBRAN MADASI: Okay.  What was the question, is there something I would like to say to the parents?
	First of all I do not know these people, I don't know whether they are in this room.  However, if they are here, I am prepared to talk to them and tell them that I am sorry that they lost their son.
	However, they have to know and recognise that we were in a war, it was not my personal battle or war, it was for the country, there was war here at home.  I would like to shake hands with them, because I have no problem with that.
	However, they must know that it was a war.  Everybody knows about it.  I hope I have answered you.

DS DE KOCK: Mr Madasi, thank you.  It would have been wonderful if I could have heard a deeper answer from you, but at this stage I have asked the question and you have answered and I think we can leave it at that, without further comments.  Thank you very much.

VUYISILE LEBRAN MADASI: Thank you.

<UNKNOWN>: .

MR DIAHO-MONAHENG: (sworn states)

MR PRIOR: Thank you, just for the record, Mr Mtembu if you could just place yourself on record please.

MR MTEMBU: Thank you Mr Chairman, my name is Mtembu.  I appear on behalf of Mr Nkopane Diaho-Monaheng.   May I proceed Mr Chairman.

CHAIRPERSON: You may proceed.

MR MTEMBU: Mr Diaho-Monaheng, how far did you go in school?

MR DIAHO-MONAHENG: I did matric sir.

MR MTEMBU: And when did you join APLA?

MR DIAHO-MONAHENG: I joined this APLA in 1990.

MR MTEMBU: Did you receive any military training, and if so, when and where?

MR DIAHO-MONAHENG: That is correct sir.  I received training, it was in Transkei for about nine months.

MR LAX: Sorry the question was where did you receive your training and when did you receive that training.  Could you just answer that question please?

MR DIAHO-MONAHENG: I received training in Transkei, it was in 1990 sir.

MR MTEMBU: And it was for nine months, is that correct?

MR DIAHO-MONAHENG: That is correct, it was for nine months.

MR LAX: Which base in the Transkei, we know there were a number of bases in the Transkei, which base did you receive your training at?

MR DIAHO-MONAHENG: I was an Nqobo base.

MR MTEMBU: Through you Mr Chairman, for the sake of curtailing proceedings, I will just ask Mr Diaho-Monaheng to confirm certain paragraphs of Mr Madasi's affidavit.
	Is it permissible Mr Chairman, thank you Mr Chairman.  Mr Diaho-Monaheng, you have read the affidavit of Mr Madasi, is that correct?

MR DIAHO-MONAHENG: That is correct My Lord.

MR MTEMBU: Now, on paragraph 9 thereof, various firearms have been mentioned therein.  Would you inform the Committee, amongst these firearms, which firearm or firearms did you use in the Yellowwoods Hotel attack?

MR DIAHO-MONAHENG: Among the arms that have already been mentioned, those that I used when an attack took place, I had an R4, I had a revolver, 3.8, that is the one that was used to alert my other comrades that it was now time to retreat to the place we were attacking.

MR MTEMBU: Do you also confirm paragraphs 10 and 11 of the said affidavit?

MR DIAHO-MONAHENG: Yes sir.

MR MTEMBU: Now, with regard to paragraph 12, could you explain to the Committee how the owner of this Mazda Marathon was robbed of his vehicle?

MR DIAHO-MONAHENG: The person who testified yesterday was my Commandant, and he already indicated that he issued out an order as the Commander of the Unit.  He said we should bring a car that would be used to attack that target, which was the Hotel of course.
	Yes, I left Lungesi Nqeba and Sky.  At that time when a kombi was fetched, I had F1 hand grenades in my possession.  Sky had 3.8 Special revolver.  Nqeba had an Uzi machine pistol.  Yes, we went until we met this kombi, we came across this kombi.  We were lucky enough to find the occupant of the car alone, and we expressed ourselves as passengers.
	We told him that we wanted to go to King William's Town.  He said well, yes, I am also heading for King William's Town, get in.   The three of us went into the kombi.
	I was right behind him, that is just the seat after the driver's seat.  Comrade Nqeba, because he was going to be the driver of the car, was seated next to the driver, the owner of the kombi.  Comrade Sky was seated next to me.
	We came across this kombi net to a hotel in Alex, I just happened to forget the name of the hotel.  I already indicated that we were passengers in the kombi, and we drove for a little while and we pointed a gun at him and we told him that he should take instructions from us, because we are not taking this kombi, we are taking it to go and fulfil a mission, and we will tell him exactly on our way, the details of our mission.
	Yes, he drove down the street.  Towards the end of the street, he jumped out of his car.  We were next to a taxi rank for taxi's from Alex to King William's Town.  The driver of the, the Commander of the Unit which is comrade Nqeba jumped onto the driver's seat, because he was seated next to him, and then he drove.  We carried on with our journey.  
	We arrived at the place where we left the Commander of the Unit, who is comrade Sutha and comrade Dizi.  When we put into the car some of the arms that we were going to be used, we saw lights approaching and we decided to do it very quick, so that we can drive off.
	These lights that were following us, were from the Police in Alice, these are the Police who pursued us.  We sped off and we just dropped the kombi in the wilderness, that we went back to Fort Beaufort.
	I think that will be the end of my explanation with regard to the kombi.

MR MTEMBU: Who actually produced the firearm and threatened the owner of this vehicle?

MR DIAHO-MONAHENG: The person who produced the firearm in the kombi, was ... (tape ends) ...

MR MTEMBU: 13 and 14 of Mr Madasi's affidavit?

MR DIAHO-MONAHENG: Yes sir, I confirm that.

MR MTEMBU: Do you also confirm paragraph 15, except that you are not the person who gave a report to Mr Mpahlele, but Mr Madasi did?

MR DIAHO-MONAHENG: Sir, the Commander was Mr Madasi.  It was his duty to report after the attack at the Hotel.  I don't know whether I answered your question.