Human Rights Violation Hearings — Moutse — 1996-12-03

CHAIRPERSON: Lydia Komape Ngwenya, Member of Parliament.  Is Mrs Ngwenya here?  Where is she.  I am told that she is out for an interview, but welcome to her nonetheless.  Mrs Ngwenya, welcome, glad to have you with us.  Then a member of the Moutse TLC, Martha Maklala.  Where is Mrs Maklala.  Probably also still coming in, but welcome.  Oupa Rakow of the National Initiative for Reconciliation.  Where is Mr Rakow, Oupa?  There he is.  Welcome to you too and then I want to extend a special word of welcome, also, to two members of Safety and Security, really responsible for all the arrangements outside.  Mr Sipho Shongwe and Piet Mellow.  Could the two gentlemen, if they inside at the moment, just show themselves.  Probably attending to our wellbeing here, but welcome and thank you again to them as well.
 May I then further check whether some of the witnesses who had not arrived this morning yet could be around at the moment.  It is Mrs Martha Mthimunye.  Has she arrived?  Aaron Mashiyane, Jan Sipho Mahlangu and Amos Khubeka, Amos Bongani Khubeka.  Not here.  Okay, if they should come tomorrow as we have had witnesses who were placed for yesterday and testified today, we may be able to hear their stories too, but I then call to the witness stand Mrs Windy Thabile Sithole who will be giving evidence in connection with the death of her husband.  This is a necklacing case.
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 I did, while she is taking the stand, earlier refer to statement by her when Prince James Mahlangu was on the stand and I have already, again, spoken to her, confirmed the mentioning of the statement and that she should feel free to give her understanding of the situation as it was as to what was really the factual situation, that is for us to be found out, but it does not help much if we have ideas in our minds and we do not speak them, because then we will continue to have a specific perception or understanding which cannot be changed even if that understanding is wrong.  So, if we have the implication of people, it is against the background too, of the two statements that I quoted to Prince Mahlangu when he was on the stand.
 Mrs Sithole, welcome.  We really appreciate that you are here.  We know that this is, in all respects for you, a very difficult experience.  I did mention to you, my mentioning of your statement and I would like you to feel free to really share with us your knowledge and your understanding of the circumstances that led to the death of your husband.  If you will please tell us your story as you know and understand it and after that we may put some questions to you.  You also need to take the oath.  I almost forgot about that.  Will you please stand.

WINDY THABILE SITHOLE: (Duly sworn in, states).

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very much, you may be seated and you may continue with your story.

WINDY THABILE SITHOLE: Majonie Mahlangu came to my place.  I was sitting with my husband.  I spoke with my husband because they use to talk alone.  My husband came back and said to me that, to inform me that James Mahlangu wanted to see him.  I asked him how are you going to go there because the
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situation is dangerous.  He said there is nothing I can say, I have to go there.  He went to the shop.  When he came back from the shop he said to me again he met at the shop, he confirmed that the Prince wanted to see me.  He requested me to go to the shop to go and look after the business.  
 After he had already left I went to the shop.  I stayed outside of the shop because there were people who were working there.  After some few hours, I think after five hours, and then I saw Majonie.  There was a grand combi which was coming from the left side.  While I looked at Majonie because the road was along the street.  I was coming from the left side and then I saw another man called Mota, they were together, they were three.  I saw that they were saying something to each other and then he came to me, Majonie came to me alone.  He said to me your husband has been taken by the boys, by the youth.  I asked him which boys and he said the comrades took him away.  I asked him where he is.  He said they took him, they went with him to the bush.  I asked him what did you do?  They said to me I should come back to you to inform you that they have taken him away.  I asked him whether he saw where they took him to and then he said he does not know where they took him to except that they took him to the bush.  He said he cannot be able to go and show me the bush where they took him to.  He went to the Indoena.  He left me alone.  
 I requested one boy who was inside the shop, my boy Impigilelie.  I sent him to Baba Sibiya to ask Mr Sibiya to take me to the police station.  He arrived, Mr Sibiya, he took me to the police station.   When arriving at the police station they took me, alighted me into the van.  They took me to the Thabanie.  On arrival at Thabanie at the school 
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known as Sityakoswa School, when I was in the van, there I saw Mervyn.  It was inside the school.  When I saw the van it was like it was, it seemed as if there was somebody inside.  I thought my father, he was inside.

CHAIRPERSON: Take your time.  We know it is exceptionally difficult.  Relax and when you feel together you may continue, but we will wait for you till you are ready to continue.

WINDY THABILE SITHOLE: When I arrived at the van with the hope that I will find him only to find that he was not in.  I did not know what did I do.  I saw, at that time, soldiers holding me.  They took me back into the van.  He said take the mother back home because she is making a lot of noise.  They took me back home.  When I arrived home, I stayed.  At around six in the evening police came to take me to Jhana, they told me that my father was necklaced and was taken to Groblersdal mortuary.  The van that was in the school, the very same van was set alight.
 The day for his burial arrived after nine days.  He was buried.  After his burial, after some two years there came a policeman by Apanje.  That I must call my father-in-law to go to Pretoria where in we are going to be told how my father was killed.  When we were inside he said witnesses were not there.  He said one day he will come back to tell me.  Until now I have not heard anything.  It happened again in 1992 once still unrest we are in.  
 The shop was hired by Mr Skosana.  There was this thing that they need not buy from the Imbokhoto business.  Other shop was still used.  Did not arrive after two days, it was set alight.  After it has been burnt in 1994, in 1993 the insurance paid me.  KNDC paid for the buildings.  I also 
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paid for that the buildings were still old.  That I was supposed to pay for the building and I took the money.  The father that his belongings burnt inside, it was said that his belongings must be paid for.  Again, he came in and used that buildings and said that I need to pay for the materials that was inside.  I have tried to go another lawyer whom I am striving with whilst I am working.  Although it is difficult for me to take care of my children because others are still at school.

CHAIRPERSON: Really, take your time.  Do not feel pressured.

WINDY THABILE SITHOLE: Until now Mr Skosana is still in that store.  I am still up and down.  I am thinking of that as you have called us today, there is something that you will bring our hearts back so that the poor thing that we have seen can be solved.

CHAIRPERSON: Is there anything more you want to share with us Mrs Sithole?

WINDY THABILE SITHOLE: It is through now.