Amnesty Hearings — Nelspruit — 1999-02-04

MS THABETE: Yes, Madam Chair.

CHAIRPERSON: Yes.

ADRIAN CHARLES O'FARRELL: (sworn states)

MS THABETE: Mr O'Farrell, can you please say your full names for purposes of the record?

MR O'FARRELL: Adrian Charles O'Farrell.

MS THABETE: Can you explain to the committee what you are
doing right now, what work you are doing right now?

MR O'FARRELL: I'm a South African police detective, specialising in the investigation of vehicle orientated crimes.

MS THABETE: Can you explain the events which led to the shooting on the day when Mr Van der Spuy was shot, or Warrant Officer Van der Spuy was shot?

MR O'FARRELL: Okay, on the said day, myself and Warrant Officer Van der Spuy were having to collect another stolen vehicle that was in a different area of that certain township.   Upon doing so, we were then contacted by one our personnel at the office, one George Ndbane, who informed us that the army requested that we assist them in the inspection of a possibly stolen Mazda 626 at Block B.   We then informed him that we were currently busy and that we would attend to the matter once we were finished.   Then, I presume at approximately just after 1:00 in the afternoon, we then went through to Block B, with this other vehicle on the back of ours, where we then drove up the main street through the trust area, where we didn't find any army members.   We then reached the end of the tar road where we did a U turn and then continued back.    Warrant Officer Van der Spuy then noticed several vehicles standing under a tarpaulin netting at one premises, where we then stopped, as this was not the - this looked pretty suspicious.   We then got out of the vehicle and then proceeded to enter onto the premises.   At this stage, the applicant, I could hear the applicant shouting from about, from, there was an empty plot next to the premises and then there was the place where the applicant was, where he was sitting on the back of, it appears to me to have been a Mazda 626.   He then started shouting and carrying on from there, where we then just ignored him and continued onto the premises.   Upon entering the premises, we noticed a gentleman sitting, a black gentleman sitting on, or sitting near a big heap of sand, busy doing something.   Warrant Officer Van der Spuy then approached the gentleman and said something, but I wasn't too sure what was said between the two gentleman.   At that stage, the applicant came into the premises, walked straight past me, still screaming and carrying on, and walked straight to Warrant Officer Van der Spuy.   As already led by counsel, the said deceased, Warrant Officer Van der Spuy, then identified - took out his police identification and identified himself to the applicant.   At this stage the applicant then continued shouting.   Warrant Officer Van der Spuy then warned him that if he were in any way to further obstruct us in the commission of our duties, he would then arrest the gentleman.   Upon such, the applicant then... (intervention).

MS THABETE: Sorry, sorry.

MR O'FARRELL: Sorry.

MR LAX: Mr O'Farrell's speaking fairly quickly, I don't know if the interpreter's able to keep up with the interpretation, with respect.

CHAIRPERSON: Miss Translator, are you able, madam, to keep up with the pace at which Mr O'Farrell is speaking?

INTERPRETER: If he can speak a little bit slower?

CHAIRPERSON: Mr O'Farrell, the translators are requested that you just speak a little slower than you are doing, because they can't keep up, and are unable to translate everything that you are saying for the benefit of Mr Sambo and the members of the public who are present.

MR O'FARRELL: As requested, Madam Chair.   Okay, on the... (intervention).

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you.

MR O'FARRELL: ...as I said, when it started, as I said, the applicant then walked directly past me towards Warrant Officer Van der Spuy, where they then started, where the applicant then started shouting, etcetera, etcetera, making a hell of a situation, where Warrant Officer Van der Spuy then took his police identification out of his pocket and identified himself to the applicant as a police official.  The applicant, however, ignored this and continued making a hell of a row and arguing and carrying on.   Warrant Officer Van der Spuy then said to him that unless he were to stop his actions or allow us to continue our work, that he would be arrested.   However, the applicant continued carrying on.  Warrant Officer Van der Spuy then reached out and attempted to - or grabbed the applicant by the wrist, at which stage the applicant then, in the type of rugby tackle style, grabbed him round the waist.   At that stage I was standing, I must presume, about three metres, three, four metres away from where this was happening, and was starting to move closer to where everything was happening.   At that stage, I then saw that the applicant then attempted to remove the firearm from Warrant Officer Van der Spuy's holster, however was unsuccessful.   At this stage, Warrant Officer Van der Spuy seemed to have got it right to be able to push the applicant away, draw his own firearm, at which point he then fired a warning shot into the ground, I would say approximately a foot to two foot away in front of the applicant.   The applicant, however - it didn't seem to hinder him, so he then again attacked Warrant Officer Van der Spuy, at which stage Warrant Officer Van der Spuy informed me that the applicant was attempting to disarm him.  At that stage, several people, I don't know where they came from, both ladies, men, one especially an old man, which I later became aware of was the applicant's father, the same gentleman who we found sitting on the sand heap, as well as several other persons in that area, also then joined into this little problem, and then also with other objects such as kieries, with pipes, or hosepipes, not pipes, just hosepipes and several other objects, just started hitting myself and Warrant Officer Van der Spuy.   Okay, Warrant Officer Van der Spuy then shouted and told me that the applicant was then busy biting his wrist, trying to disarm him, at which stage I then attempted to assist and also then said to the people there, in a language which I thought was reasonably relevant, that we didn't want any problem, we just wanted the firearm.   However, this came across dead ears.

CHAIRPERSON: What language was that?