Human Rights Violation Hearings — East London — 1996-04-18

MR SANDI: Can I just disturb you.  During all this period who was the person who was available, is it Dr Labuschagne who was doing this?

JOE THETHINENE JORDAN: Yes.

MR SANDI: Who is the other one?

JOE THETHINENE JORDAN: Yes it was Dr Labuschagne, and the other one was a Black person and the third one I do not know him.

MR SANDI: Thank you.

JOE THETHINENE JORDAN: But Labuschagne, Sergeant Nefling, something like that, he was at court, but Labuschagne didn't appear in court.  They pleaded with me to open the briefcase again and I still refused because I didn't know whose briefcase was this and I didn't know what was inside it.  They pleaded with me for a long time, and said as I am giving problems they told me that this is the estate.   I said even if it is an estate you are the people who know about this estate and I am not interested in it.
 One man opened it, and the minute he opened it he said to me, there were bundles and bundles of R50,00 notes, and they said if you tell us where Steve is we buy you a car, you buy you a car and a house and we give you all this money, if only you can tell us where Steve Tshwete is, we want him.  You just involve yourself in something, we don't want you, we want Steve Tshwete.  I said you can take your money.  What I said before I told you that I do not know him.  They dragged me with my feet and they fastened me again.  Dr Labuschagne jumped again.  He said he is treating me and he told me that I am Dr Labuschagne, I am here to treat you.  They continued with the electrocution.  Even in my genitals they did this.  They did all that they can do, even through my anus they did this. They electrocuted me 
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through every hole that they could find in my body.  And on my head there was this tube, I was suffocated, I couldn't cry, I couldn't do anything.
 At the end they removed the tube.  They took a stick and somebody fetched a stick, they brought it along.  I was beaten on the sole of my feet because my feet were just hanging.  I could not count how many times I was beaten until I was numb.  They were just carrying on and I didn't feel anything at the time.  
 They came back again and took these charges.  They electrocuted me again.  I do not know what ended.  The only thing that I can remember is that I passed out and I was revived in the cells.  My belongings were just next to me.  There was my next door neighbour who was also staying in the same vicinity where I stayed, I was shocked again to feel somebody kicking me on the ribs.  When I turned my head I was told to stand up.  When I was standing up I could see that it's only the head that could, the arms, all my limbs were unable to move.  There was some pain on the spine and I couldn't move.  
 Major de Villiers was the one who was also, he was the one who was kicking me.  He was a major at Fleet Street and the Duncan Village Police station you know it was at Fleet Street at that day.  Major de Villiers said I must stand up.  I told him that ...(tape ends)    ... the police station, I was dragged along.  Imagine, I was naked.  I was dragged along.  You know it was not the lawn, starting from the stairs I was dragged along.  It was only the arms now which had regained the strength.  When I was just before the police station there was one man, Mr Ngwane who was the owner of the garage.  He was moving out of the police 
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station, when he saw me he was shocked and he even put his hand on the mouth.  I was unable to get into the police station because the steps were very high.  They kicked me and they couldn't do anything because I was really unable to move.  So they picked me up, put me in one of the cells.  The bandits were there were taken and were ordered to dress me up.  The bandits would not consider the condition in which I was.  They didn't even think and consider what I was suffering from.  They were not aware that my back was injured.  They dragged me along and put clothes on me.  Whilst they were dressing me I was told that there was a statement that I was supposed to give.  
 I was asked what had happened.  I said the only thing that I can say is that ask from the commanders of this police station, the only thing that I can say is that I was arrested in a certain point and then I was brought in here.  That is all that I could say to them. I refused to give them the information of what happened in the cells and I said that one, I will give as evidence at court.  Then after that they took the fingerprints.  As they didn't take fingerprints before it was the first time that they were taking these fingerprints.  
 We were told that we would be taken to court.  When we got there we were alighting from this, Zola was the one who was transporting me.  There were three others.  When we were going to underground at the cells there were policemen.  Mostly it was the Black policemen and most of them I didn't know.

MR SANDI: Are there any lawyers who went to the cells?