Human Rights Violation Hearings — Klerksdorp — 1996-09-24

LYDIA MOSEBI NTHOROANE: Yes, he has only one child.

UNKNOWN: What is it, is it a son or a daughter?

LYDIA MOSEBI NTHOROANE: It is a daughter.

UNKNOWN: And what is her age?

LYDIA MOSEBI NTHOROANE: She is 17 years old, Sir.

UNKNOWN: Now your late son was involved, politically involved, is that correct?

LYDIA MOSEBI NTHOROANE: No, Sir, he didn't know anything, but when people were singing he went there to join them, because political activities were not popular in our area.

UNKNOWN: Why do you think that he was assaulted and killed, both assaulted in 1986 by the police and subsequently in 1989?

LYDIA MOSEBI NTHOROANE: At Leeudoringstad, when they hit him, they hit him on the head, because on the body we didn't see traces of being assaulted, he was complaining about the head.  Even the doctor who did the post-mortem didn't give us any evidence.

UNKNOWN: But why do you think he was assaulted, for what reason?

LYDIA MOSEBI NTHOROANE: I don't understand the reasons, because he was not active in politics. I think it is just because he was affected mentally.  He was mentally disturbed at that time.  Even Dr Selwyn, after that, said one of the veins has KLERKSDORP HEARING TRC/GAUTENG
7 L M NTHOROANE
been injured.

UNKNOWN: Perhaps just to try and clarify this completely, do you think that his assault and his death had anything to do with politics at all?

LYDIA MOSEBI NTHOROANE: No, Sir.  Because during that time the comrades were just singing at that time when they were beaten.  They were singing on the streets.

UNKNOWN: Was there an inquest or a court case about his death?

LYDIA MOSEBI NTHOROANE: No, Sir.

UNKNOWN: Did the police give you any information about investigating the incident, investigating the death at all?

LYDIA MOSEBI NTHOROANE: No, Sir.

UNKNOWN: So they have never given you a report on what they know about the case or how far they had gone to look into the incident?

LYDIA MOSEBI NTHOROANE: They didn't tell me anything.  Even the doctor didn't give me any information.  This Dr Erasmus, when we went to ask him he didn't give us anything.  He just said under investigation, Sir.

UNKNOWN: Mrs Nthoroane, is there anything else you would like to tell us in connection with the death of Pule, before I conclude?

LYDIA MOSEBI NTHOROANE: In regard to this incident, is what made me very hurt, when Herbert took us to Leeudoringstad, when we were asking them about the post-mortem, they didn't explain anything to us.  They just brought the tackies and the belt, not the trousers, it had disappeared.  I asked them what made the clothes of my son to be wet, then which means - I told them which means you have washed the tackies, because
KLERKSDORP HEARING TRC/GAUTENG
8 L M NTHOROANE
they were bloody.  Then we took to AVBOB.  So both of them were not telling us any information about the causes of death. The person who was there, who knows is Rudolph Sipimati, who has recently died.  He was shameful because he didn't want to look us in the eyes, because he was there.

UNKNOWN: This Rudolph that died, was he a policeman or what was he?

LYDIA MOSEBI NTHOROANE: He was a policeman.

UNKNOWN: Mrs Nthoroane, we have noted everything that you have said. I don't have any further questions, I am going to hand back to the Chairperson. I thank you.

DR RANDERA: Mamma, I just want to ask two questions.  One, you say a post-mortem was done.  What did they say on the death certificate was the cause of death?

LYDIA MOSEBI NTHOROANE: They didn't write anything, they just write under investigation.  I have that letter in my bag. They just wrote under investigation.

DR RANDERA: We would appreciate it if we can have a copy of that, if our statement-takers can just make a copy of that.  Thank you very much.
 My second question is, what you have just said just now to Commissioner Potgieter, that you thought your son was mentally disturbed after his first assault. Is that right, is that what you said?

LYDIA MOSEBI NTHOROANE: Yes, Sir.

DR RANDERA: But he was still managing to hold a job at the mines.

LYDIA MOSEBI NTHOROANE: Yes, Sir.

DR RANDERA: Thank you.

PROF MEIRING: Mrs Nthoroane, just two questions.  You are already 60 years of age. Do you still have to work?
KLERKSDORP HEARING TRC/GAUTENG
9 L M NTHOROANE

LYDIA MOSEBI NTHOROANE: I am not working, I am sick.

PROF MEIRING: Who looks after your financial needs every month?

LYDIA MOSEBI NTHOROANE: My husband doesn't work also, but my eldest daughter is the one who is working and supporting us.

UNKNOWN: Mrs Nthoroane, then you said there was a child of seven years old, your son's child. Who looks after that child?

LYDIA MOSEBI NTHOROANE: I am the only one who is looking after her and that after I am not working. I just give her what I have. She doesn't get proper care.

PROF MEIRING: Thank you very much.

YASMINE SOOKA: Mamma, can I just ask you, although you have said that your son was not involved in any political activity, you do say that he worked at Vaal Reef Mines.  Was he a shop steward?

LYDIA MOSEBI NTHOROANE: No, he was not a member.

YASMINE SOOKA: Was he a member of the union?

LYDIA MOSEBI NTHOROANE: He hasn't joined yet at that time.  He worked only for five months.

YASMINE SOOKA: You do say in your statement that he was actively involved in politics. Now I am not quite sure if I heard you tell Adv Potgieter that he was not involved.  Could you just clear that for me?

LYDIA MOSEBI NTHOROANE: They were just singing, but he was not a member.  He was not a person who likes political activity, he is not a person who likes political organisations.

YASMINE SOOKA: Mamma, you also say that you went to Dr Erasmus. Was Dr Erasmus your doctor or was he the district surgeon who performed the post-mortem?

LYDIA MOSEBI NTHOROANE: He is a doctor at Leeudoringstad, he is not
KLERKSDORP HEARING TRC/GAUTENG
10 L M NTHOROANE
from Makwassie but he is from Leeudoringstad.

YASMINE SOOKA: Who sent you to him?

LYDIA MOSEBI NTHOROANE: The police sent me to him for a certificate. Then he denied to give me the death certificate and then he said I should go and ask it from the police.

YASMINE SOOKA: Were you ever called to come to court, Mamma by the police?

LYDIA MOSEBI NTHOROANE: No, Sir.

YASMINE SOOKA: So you don't, and have you yourself ever consulted a lawyer to find out what actually happened?

LYDIA MOSEBI NTHOROANE: I was not able because after the death of my son I was ill and they were just coming to me with forms for me to sign, but I denied.

YASMINE SOOKA: Thank you, Mamma.  We have noted all that you have given us.  We would appreciate if you could make sure that before you leave today our statement-takers make copies of all the documents that you have. It is a horrible story and needs some kind of investigation. We will hand this matter over to our unit and will come back to you.  Thank you for coming today.
KLERKSDORP HEARING TRC/GAUTENG
y