Amnesty Hearings — East London — 1998-05-25

MR PRIOR: Sorry, we're trying to clarify which distance you're referring to here, because there seems to be a confusion.   What distance are you referring to, just clarify that for us, this 200 metres, what is that in respect of?

MPHAMELO PANGELE: It is the place, the brick place where Mr Makase was working and that is between that brick place and the place where Mr Makase said the truck had stopped.

MR PRIOR: Now what was the distance from the truck, where the place the truck had stopped, to where you found the body?

MPHAMELO PANGELE: It could have been about 40, 50 paces.

CHAIRPERSON: Thanks Mr Prior.

MR PRIOR: Thank you, Mr Chairman.   The applicants indicated in their evidence that the young girl, Done Meyers, was taken, carried over a fence to a spot where she eventually was killed.   Was there a fence in that area, in other words did you have to go over a fence to get to the body?

MPHAMELO PANGELE: Yes, you had to pass a fence.

MR PRIOR: All right.   You obviously, or let me ask you the question, did you investigate the area, did you search the area for articles or clues or disturbances of the soil or whatever, was that part of your work there?

MPHAMELO PANGELE: That is so, yes sir.

MR PRIOR: I understood from our discussion before you gave evidence, that eventually reinforcements and support came, so you weren't the only policeman on that scene, shortly after you got there reinforcements arrived is that correct?  I understand a helicopter also arrived?

MPHAMELO PANGELE: Correct, sir.

MR PRIOR: I want to show you bundle C, it's the photo-graphs, Mr Chairman.   The photographs depict various positions from, or various places at the scene, you know different angles from which the body was photographed.   Do you confirm that the body of Done Meyers was in that position as you see in the photograph?

MPHAMELO PANGELE: That is so, yes, correct, sir.

MR PRIOR: I need you to clarify one aspect, possibly two aspects:  the first two photographs indicate that the blue jeans, the denim jeans, of Done Meyers had been unbuttoned;  and then the other photographs 3 and 4, I think indicate that the jeans are closed.   Now I've had the benefit of seeing the negatives which showed the sequence of the photographs, and unfortunately I put up the bundles in the wrong sequence, I just wanted that to be clarified for the committee, when you saw the body for the first time, were the jeans closed?

MPHAMELO PANGELE: The jeans were buttoned, as shown in 3 and 4.

MR PRIOR: Okay.   And I've heard the explanation why the jeans were opened.   Can you maybe explain that just for the committee, because I don't want any wrong suggestion to be maybe levelled at this stage, why were the jeans opened and that photograph taken?

MPHAMELO PANGELE: When we got there, the body was as is shown in photo 3 and 4 with the trousers buttoned.

MR PRIOR: And the blouse, was it in that position or in another position?

MPHAMELO PANGELE: The blouse is as is shown in photo 3.

MR PRIOR: It appears to be pulled up, exposing a portion of her brassiere, is that correct?

MPHAMELO PANGELE: Correct, sir.

MR PRIOR: Yes.   Those photographs were then taken.   Now let's go back to photographs 1 and 2, just, you were explaining why the buttons of the jeans were opened?

MPHAMELO PANGELE: It was because the jeans were soiled with blood and they wanted to determine as to whether she had been damaged in her private parts.

MR PRIOR: Now, in your statement that you made at the time of this investigation, Mr Chairman I refer to page 27 and 28 of the bundle, that is the typed statement, and then his hand-written statement is 29, 30 and onwards, towards the end of your statement you said
"Seemingly there was a struggle as I saw the track of the training shoes wearing by the culprits and the scattering of the articles from the truck."
Can you maybe just expand on that and explain that, were there signs of a struggle that you could determine from looking at or examining the ground or the terrain there?

MPHAMELO PANGELE: I saw a lot of papers scattered around at about where the truck had stopped and marks of training shoes that were in that vicinity in that road.

MR PRIOR: And where the body was lying, were there any, I know it may be difficult after all this time, but is there anything in your recollection that may have indicated a struggle or not?   If you are unable to say that, say that clearly from the beginning and we won't pursue that?

MPHAMELO PANGELE: I'm not saying there was a scuffle, but what I'm saying, there was proof of things having been strewn around in that road and the marks of those training shoes in that vicinity.

MR PRIOR: All right.   Mr Chairman, I have prepared another bundle, it was photographs that had been taken.   Unfortunately there's no index.   I've prepared copies for the committee and if I may mark it L, and if I may also have the committee's indulgence just to take this witness through the ten photographs?

CHAIRPERSON: I suggest you should mark the first bundle C1 and this C2.

MR PRIOR: Thank you, Mr Chairman, I'll do so.   So that is the first bundle C1, and C2.   May I ask if Mr Mbandazaya could be so kind, I only have a limited amount, five, if he could maybe just assist?   Thank you.
BUNDLE OF PHOTOGRAPHS HANDED IN AS EXHIBIT C2

MR PRIOR: If I can go to C1, that's a photo - I beg your pardon, C2, photograph 1, that's a photograph of Mr Tuta, is that right?

MPHAMELO PANGELE: Correct, sir.

MR PRIOR: Now, were you there when that photograph took place, or these photographs were taken, or were you at some other place, let's just clarify that?

MPHAMELO PANGELE: Yes, I was present, sir.

MR PRIOR: And behind Mr Tuta, I can see clearly a - it looks like a fence, with the droppers and so forth, do you remember that?

MPHAMELO PANGELE: Yes, there is a fence there.

MR PRIOR: I just want clarity, was the body found beyond that fence or is that the fence - is that some other fence on the other - sorry, the fence on the boundary of this track where the vehicle stopped?   In other words, if I'm looking in the direction of the photographer, behind Mr Tuta, was the body found beyond that fence?

MPHAMELO PANGELE: The body was found beyond that fence.

MR PRIOR: If you look at photograph 2, there seems to be a wet patch in the foreground.   Are you able to remember what that was?

MPHAMELO PANGELE: It looked like a patch of oil where the truck has stopped.

MR PRIOR: Was that the area indicated where the truck had stopped before the shots were fired, is that your... (intervention).

MPHAMELO PANGELE: Correct, sir.

MR PRIOR: If you look at photograph 3, can you remember what that photograph depicts?   If not, say so.   Yes, it shows a track with rocks in the foreground, it looks like a thorn bush.   Was that just a photograph of the general area?

MPHAMELO PANGELE: I cannot recognise that place at No 3.

MR PRIOR: All right.   Photograph 4, Mr Tuta appears to be pointing to, it looks like a yellow plastic carrier, or certainly yellow plastic with it looks like something white.  Do you remember that, or not?

MPHAMELO PANGELE: This plastic looks like a plastic that had fallen from that truck.

MR PRIOR: Okay.   Photographs 5 and 6, they seem to indicate a pathway, a rough path, from the initial positions in photographs 1 and 2.   In photograph 6, Mr Tuta is appearing, apparently pointing, it looks like a dark object, it could be a piece of cloth of sorts.   Can you remember that?

MPHAMELO PANGELE: No, I cannot remember clearly.