Human Rights Violation Hearings — Soweto — 1996-07-23

CHAIRPERSON: Earlier on I had said Reverend Thema was the last witness.  My apologies, please, we have the last witness, Yvonne Makgolo, who is our last witness for today and I would apologise for Commissioner Yasmin Sooka and Hugh Lewin as they have to urgently go back to the office while the Commission is in session.  I will ask that you may be seated.

YVONNE MAKGOLO: (Duly sworn in, states).

CHAIRPERSON: I will ask Russell Ally to assist Mrs Yvonne to give her testimony.

YVONNE MAKGOLO: My child ...

RUSSELL ALLY: Hello, hello Mrs Makgolo.  Sorry for keeping you waiting so long.  You are going to tell us about your son, Victor, who was shot at age 16 in June 1986.  Will you please tell your story to the Commission?

YVONNE MAKGOLO: I had sent him, when he got back he met the Boers and the Boers shot him.  They took him to the hospital and when they diagnosed him they found out that they shot him in the head.

RUSSELL ALLY: I am sorry, I did not hear the translation.

YVONNE MAKGOLO: It was on the 16th of June.  I had sent my child, when he got back, I had sent my child.  It was on the 16th of June.  When he was coming back he met the Boers and the Boers shot at him.
SOWETO HEARING GAUTENG PROVINCE
2 Y MAKGOLO

RUSSELL ALLY: Mrs Makgolo, this was on the 16th of June 1986.  Is this correct or was this 1976?

YVONNE MAKGOLO: It was in 1986.

RUSSELL ALLY: So this happened on a day when they were commemorating ten years of June 1976.  Was that what was happening at the time?

YVONNE MAKGOLO: Yes, this happened at the time.

RUSSELL ALLY: And you son, was he involved in commemorating June 1976 or was he just an innocent bystander?

YVONNE MAKGOLO: No, he was just a bystander.

RUSSELL ALLY: The reason I ask that is because in your statement you say that your son was actually arrested by the police before this incident.  You say that it was in 1986, you do not remember the day or the month, but do you know why your son was arrested in 1986?

YVONNE MAKGOLO: No, I do not know why my son was arrested.  I do not know why he was arrested.

RUSSELL ALLY: So you do not know if on this day that the police were actually looking for your son or that the people who shot him may have known that this was your son?

YVONNE MAKGOLO: I just heard that they had arrested him and they had imprisoned him in Protea Police Station.

RUSSELL ALLY: And was any inquest held into his death, the cause of his death?

YVONNE MAKGOLO: No, there was not any inquest.

RUSSELL ALLY: It seems, Mrs Makgolo, that your son actually did have a history of political involvement because firstly he was arrested before this actual shooting took place and you also say that when he was actually buried, that there was a strong police presence at the funeral.  Is that the case, did the police actually interfere in the funeral proceedings SOWETO HEARING GAUTENG PROVINCE
3 Y MAKGOLO
when you were burying your son?

YVONNE MAKGOLO: No, they just came in the premises of the Church and they surrounded the Church premises.  They never shot, they were never shooting.  They were following us to the graveyard.  They just surrounded us.  They just surrounded the grave.

RUSSELL ALLY: Thank you Mrs Makgolo, I am going to give you back to the Chairperson.

CHAIRPERSON: I would refer to the others if they have some questions.  I will start with Piet Meiring.

PROF MEIRING: Two questions, Mama Makgolo, if you do not mind.  The first question is when your son was shot, you said that two young boys came to tell you about that.  Do you remember their names or are there other witnesses who were there who could give more information?

YVONNE MAKGOLO: I cannot remember them because I was very confused.

PROF MEIRING: Thank you, thank you for the answer.  The last question is was he your only son or are there other children also in the family?

YVONNE MAKGOLO: I had two daughters and he was the third one.

PROF MEIRING: Who is looking after you at the moment?  One of your daughters?

YVONNE MAKGOLO: Here is another one, but he is deaf and dumb.  That is the only disadvantage.

PROF MEIRING: Can I just get that correct that there are two daughters and the one is deaf and dumb?  I am so sorry, I did not get that, the translation.  We just, we need to write it down.  You have two daughters and one is deaf and dumb.  So there is only daughter that can look after you.

YVONNE MAKGOLO: The one who is not normal, the one who is
SOWETO HEARING GAUTENG PROVINCE
4 Y MAKGOLO
deaf, I cannot say she is looking after me because she is a little bit disabled.

PROF MEIRING: Thank you very much.  No more questions.  Thank you.

CHAIRPERSON: Joyce Seroke.

MS SEROKE: Mama Yvonne, you say your neighbour, another woman is the one who came to tell you that your son has been shot.  She only saw the police and the children were running away from the police. What was the reason, what was the reason that made the children to run away?

YVONNE MAKGOLO: (Xhosa not translated).

MS SEROKE: Do you mean, is your daughter getting any disability grant?  Are you getting any pension fund?

YVONNE MAKGOLO: Yes.

MS SEROKE: Are you staying, it is only the two of you in the house?

YVONNE MAKGOLO: Yes.

MS SEROKE: Is your daughter who is married, is she staying, where, somewhere else?

YVONNE MAKGOLO: Galibo.

MS SEROKE: Thank you Mama.

CHAIRPERSON: Maybe if I can just ask one question.  Surely when you approached the Commission you had a special request in your own mind.  Can you tell this Commission as to what exactly do you expect or hope to get from it?

YVONNE MAKGOLO: I hope the Commission will help me to get something like a tombstone so that I can remember my child.