Amnesty Hearings — Pietermaritzburg — 1997-07-28

MDUDUZI M GUMBI: There was one person standing outside of the door, one of us shot at the person.  That person wasn't seriously wounded, he managed to run away and we managed to get into the house or the homestead.  When we arrived inside the house we found it was dark, we couldn't see clearly, therefore myself I don't remember well, it looks like we were competing to fight or attack the people because we were many.  However, I took part.  There was one person who was injured, I don't remember well, but when I found out later it was Gogo, it was Grandma maDlamini.
	We were over 60 in number and I don't remember exactly.  However, we grouped into two, the others had to attack one of the homesteads nearby.  We injured one of the aunts and a child and we, after attacking that house, we continued to the other houses which had the light switched on because we thought there might be people inside these houses.	We were of the view that there wasn't anybody in those houses because it was rumoured that they had to leave that place.  All we knew that is that if ever we find a house with lights on there must be people inside.
	We continued to the next homestead, that was the Kunene family.  The other group have already attacked that house so we passed that house and we went to another place called Matafene.  There we found some aunties in the bushes. We met them as we were passing.  One of the aunts was carrying a child, or had a child with her.  We told her to run away and she ran away towards the bushes.  Again we continued and we met other people on the way.  And I also suspect that the one that we met was also injured by the other group.
	As we started arguing with the other group that they shouldn't take women and we had to take the young child and save her, however, we differed in opinion. We took the young child together with us and continued and we left the child at the Dlamini family and told them to take the child to court the next day.
	We continued to Mtolo's family.  Mr Mtolo is an IFP member at that place.  He is also the one who informed us as to where the other people were camping.  He was referring to the ANC members.  He said we are going to find them at Zwandile Mbongo's home.  We also surrounded the house. While surrounding the house there was some shooting from inside the house.  I suspected that they saw us and we also entered the house while shooting and I was also in possession of a 9mm, a shotgun and also a spear.  There were some other people who were carrying big guns and one of them is my co-accused in the trial was also carrying a big firearm and most of us were armed.
	We entered the house and we started shooting.  When we got there it was this house, a rondavel, and we started shooting through the windows and we injured a lot of people there.  I think there were four, but some of them survived.
	After that incident we continued to the Tosi family.  This Tosi man used to regard himself as an IFP leader in that particular area.  We arrived at Tosi's place and we had to pass his place because we ran out of ammunition and we thought he could help us with ammunition.  He gave us about eight rounds of ammunition and we continued to a place called Tshlahle.  I don't know this family name but the place was known by the name of Tshlahle.  
	We arrived at one homestead, the lights were on, people were drinking in that family.  We shot one man and he died and also some other people whom we met on the way.  After attacking that particular homestead of Tshlahle people who came towards their house were also attacked by us and they died instantly.	
	We continued and we were going back.  When passing Matafene on our way back we passed the first homestead we found women, we didn't do anything to them.  However, on the second family we found women, we injured those women, I don't remember the number, there might have been four or five, so we were arguing at the time and we were not of the same view among our group.  Most people survived, they knew that we were divided at the time, I mean within us, our camp, some people said we shouldn't kill women, others insisted that we should kill them.  After that we went back home and that is how it ended.

MR DE KLERK: Would you just explain to the Commission in what area were you staying in Richmond?

MDUDUZI M GUMBI: I was staying at Mkobeni.

MR DE KLERK: Was that an IFP stronghold?

MDUDUZI M GUMBI: That's correct, an IFP stronghold.

MR DE KLERK: Is it correct that the ANC area bordered on that area?

MDUDUZI M GUMBI: That's correct.

MR DE KLERK: Which area is that, the ANC area?

MDUDUZI M GUMBI: It was Magoda which stretches up to Ndalene and Thabalendeni and also Thlahle, all those names I have mentioned.  At Ndalene there were also a few IFP members.

MR DE KLERK: Who was the ANC leader during 1991 of the Richmond area?

MDUDUZI M GUMBI: It was Sifiso Nkabinde.

MR DE KLERK: Who was the IFP leader of that area?

MDUDUZI M GUMBI: It was Vezi, Paulus Vezi.

MR DE KLERK: Were you ever instructed by any of your political leaders to attack these people and kill them?

MDUDUZI M GUMBI: We were not given instructions by the leaders, it was our own view as the person Mfas Bangi(?) was just a normal person in the community, he was not our leader.

MR DE KLERK: Why did you 60 people decide to go and attack what you perceived as your enemy?

MDUDUZI M GUMBI: May you please repeat your question.

MR DE KLERK: Why did you 60 people, on that day, the 23rd of June 1991, why did you decide to go and attack the people?

MDUDUZI M GUMBI: We decided to go and attack them because we knew we were not going to sleep because most of our people had been killed at that time and we decided that we should do something about it to protect ourselves.

MR DE KLERK: So Mr Gumbi, if I understand you correctly, there were attacks on yourself and your community prior to the attack that you took part in?

MDUDUZI M GUMBI: That's correct.

MR DE KLERK: During your trial there were several accused, is that correct?

MDUDUZI M GUMBI: That is correct.

MR DE KLERK: And six of those accused were convicted?

MDUDUZI M GUMBI: That's correct.

MR DE KLERK: Do you know what happened to them?

MDUDUZI M GUMBI: I don't know.  However, it was said that our evidence was not in correlation with each other.

MR DE KLERK: No, no, I accept that.  Let me put it to you like this.  Mr Jabulani Mbanjo, do you know where he is now?

MDUDUZI M GUMBI: He is at Ncomi Prison.

MR DE KLERK: Mr Sitembisho Mcunu do you know where he is now?

MDUDUZI M GUMBI: He is in Pietermaritzburg in prison.

MR DE KLERK: Sithole Zanile Mkhize?

MDUDUZI M GUMBI: At Ncomi Prison.

MR DE KLERK: Mafika Dlamini?

MDUDUZI M GUMBI: Westville Prison.

MR DE KLERK: Do you know of any of these prisoners that will be released or go on parole in the near future?

MDUDUZI M GUMBI: I don't know and I can't explain.  All I know is that they received different sentences.  I don't know.

MR DE KLERK: Is it correct that you have been in prison from when you were arrested and convicted in 1992 until now?

MDUDUZI M GUMBI: That's correct.

MR DE KLERK: How long of your sentence do you still have to serve?

MDUDUZI M GUMBI: I think it's nine years and I will be completing my fifth year on November this year, it means I am left with four years.

MR DE KLERK: How do you feel about this act that you were involved in?  Do you think it was the right thing to do today?

MDUDUZI M GUMBI: As I have decided to make an application for amnesty it is because I am not happy with what happened.  It was not my intention, however, I find myself in that situation.  That is why I have made an application for amnesty.

MR DE KLERK: How old were you at the stage when this attack took place?

MDUDUZI M GUMBI: I was 19.

MR DE KLERK: Is there anything that you want to say to the victims of that attack today?

MDUDUZI M GUMBI: Yes I do.