Amnesty Hearings — Johannesburg — UNKNOWN

MR NOFOMELA: They were Askaris who were turned into policemen.   Apart from Simon Radebe, he was a policeman.

MOKOTEDI MPSHE: Mr Nofomela, I am taking you back to matter No 10, the abduction of September.  Did you receive any award for the act or your participation?

MR NOFOMELA: No, I did not receive any remuneration.

MOKOTEDI MPSHE: ... I want to go, Mr Chairman, to evidence Book 3, paginated page No 63.  I will show it to the witness.

CHAIRPERSON: Is that the manuscript?

MOKOTEDI MPSHE: Mr Chairman, information from the Harms and other documentation.   It is a newspaper cutting, the fourth block on page 63, paragraph 3, which I will read.  I have shown this to the witness.  He said here, they are referring to the witness Nofomela
"He said he had received R1 000 for the assassination of civil rights lawyer Griffiths Mxenge and R500 for the September abduction".
How do you respond to that?

MR NOFOMELA: I do not recall that.  I do not recall that.

MOKOTEDI MPSHE: Do you not remember it or it did not happen?  That is two different things.
21.1 - 4A

MR NOFOMELA: /...
MR MPSHE	182	MR A NOFOMELA

MR NOFOMELA: According to my memory it didn't happen.

MR MARAIS: Mr Chairman, the statement which my learned friend is putting to the witness comes from a newspaper report.  I don't know what the value of it is.

CHAIRPERSON: Yes, you can put it to him that it was reported at the time.  What is the answer to that?

MOKOTEDI MPSHE: The question was you don't remember it happened or it did not happen?

MR NOFOMELA: As far as I can recall, Sir, no such thing happened.

MOKOTEDI MPSHE: Thank you, Mr Chairman, no further questions.

BERNARD MAKGABO NGOEPE: But is it possible that you did receive it?  I know that you are saying that you don't remember, but I want to know from you whether there is a possibility that you did receive that amount of money.

MR NOFOMELA: It is possible.

BERNARD MAKGABO NGOEPE: Are there in fact occasions during which you got rewarded for having carried out some missions?

MR NOFOMELA: Yes.

BERNARD MAKGABO NGOEPE: Which ones do you remember?

MR NOFOMELA: I remember the incident of Griffiths Mxenge and another PAC member in Manzini and I don't remember any more.

BERNARD MAKGABO NGOEPE: Were there many?

MR NOFOMELA: No, there weren't many, that is why I cannot remember.

BERNARD MAKGABO NGOEPE: Seeing that you cannot remember as to whether or not you did receive remuneration in respect of the matter which Mr Mpshe has put to you and seeing that you are not ruling out the possibility, are you in a position to disagree with what the newspaper is saying, that you were
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JUDGE NGOEPE	183	MR A NOFOMELA
paid?

MR NOFOMELA: I can dispute it, Sir, because the incident involving this PAC member was also in 1986 and it seems to have been more or less at the same time as the September incident, and I remember receiving money for the PAC member incident, but I do not remember being remunerated for the September incident.  That is why I can dispute having been rewarded.

BERNARD MAKGABO NGOEPE: ... whether or not you were rewarded in respect of the September matter?

MR NOFOMELA: The reason for that is because I received one payment and both these incidents took place in 1986, that is why I dispute the fact that I was remunerated for that because I remember this one incident.

BERNARD MAKGABO NGOEPE: You are not sure as to whether or not you were remunerated in respect of the September matter, or are you saying you are sure you were not remunerated?

MR NOFOMELA: I still put it in the way as I had said, I have no more words.   The honourable member can take what I am saying in the way that I answered it.

BERNARD MAKGABO NGOEPE: What you have said to me was that you don't rule out the possibility that you were remunerated.  That is what you said.

MR NOFOMELA: I did say that.

SISI KHAMPEPE: Mr Nofomela, are you able to enlighten us with regard to under what circumstances you were remunerated for carrying out the instructions and in what circumstances you were not remunerated.

MR NOFOMELA: You were not told, when you had executed a task, you were not told when you were instructed that you were going to be remunerated, but when you had executed the
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MS KHAMPEPE	184	MR A NOFOMELA
task you would be remunerated..

SISI KHAMPEPE: You remember the incident of the diamond dealer who was killed around October 1981  wherein you were involved, Mr Chikalanga and Mr Joe Mamasela, you remember that incident?

MR NOFOMELA: Yes.

SISI KHAMPEPE: Mr Chikalanga has given evidence that you and Mamasela tricked the diamond dealer to come back to this country.  Why did you do that, why was there a need for you to employ tricks when in fact you had gone back there to demand a refund of the R5 000 that you had paid for diamonds?

MR MARAIS: Mr Chairman, before the witness replies to this question, he is not applying for amnesty with regard to this incident, and I would advise him about his rights with regard to self-incrimination in this regard and if necessary ask for an adjournment.

CHAIRPERSON: Was he involved in the matter?

MR MARAIS: Mr Chairman, the witness is not applying for amnesty with regard to this matter, and if he is asked questions about it I would want to consult with him before he answers any questions in this regard.

SISI KHAMPEPE: Mr Marais, you are free to consult with your client.  We would appreciate it if he can respond to that question.

CHAIRPERSON: Would you require a short adjournment?

MR MARAIS: Yes, thank you, Mr Chairman.

JUDGE WILSON: Could I deal with one matter before we adjourn while I have got the references in front of me at the moment.  Is it correct, Mr Nofomela, that ion your application for amnesty you set out at the beginning of
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JUDGE WILSON	185	MR A NOFOMELA
the application the fact that you received R1 000 as a special bonus in respect of the Griffiths Mxenge murder and also a R300 bonus in respect of another incident?  This is on page 2 of your papers.  Is that correct?

MR NOFOMELA: Yes.

JUDGE WILSON: Then later in paragraph 30 on page 23 you set out that you received a R300 reward in connection with the kidnapping in Swaziland.

MR NOFOMELA: Yes.

CHAIRPERSON: We will take a short adjournment.
COMMITTEE ADJOURNS
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186	MR A NOFOMELA
COMMITTEE RESUMES

CHAIRPERSON: What is the position, Mr Marais?

MR MARAIS: In terms of the Act on the Promotion of National Unity and Reconciliation, there is a procedure in terms of section 31 that has to be complied with before any person can be compelled to give evidence that might incriminate him.  I have pointed this out to the witness and also the provision in subsection 3 that an incriminating answer given may not be used in criminal proceedings against him and the witness in this case has indicated to me that he is willing to assist the Committee and will answer the question put to him by the member.

A NOFOMELA: s u o

SISI KHAMPEPE: Mr Nofomela, can I then pose my question again to you, are you ready?

MR A NOFOMELA: Yes.

SISI KHAMPEPE: I want to know why in October 1981, when you went back to Lesotho on the advice or the instructions of your commander then, Mr Dirk Coetzee, to return the diamonds and get the refund of the money you had paid for the diamonds in the sum of R5 000, you then decided not to insist the refund of the money, but to get that diamond dealer to come down to the country, to South Africa.