Amnesty Hearings — Cape Town — 1998-09-08

NORMAN ARENDSE: Tell us about that, just describe the arms and ammunition you had on you.

ANDILE SHICEKA: Two R4's, magazine cassettes, a hand-grenade and a rifle-grenade.

NORMAN ARENDSE: When you came to Cape Town, where did you go?

ANDILE SHICEKA: I went to Tembani at Khayelitsha, at 19 April Close Street(?), Khayelitsha, Tembani.  That is where I was told I was going to meet Tanda.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Did you meet him there?

ANDILE SHICEKA: No, he found us there because when we got there we found ladies and a number of people.  When we got there we asked as to whether he was there and we were told that no, he was not there but he was soon to arrive, and he did.  In a couple of minutes time, it should be less than one hour, he did arrive.

NORMAN ARENDSE: When Tanda arrived there had you seen him before then?  Did you know who he was?

ANDILE SHICEKA: No.

NORMAN ARENDSE: So you met him for the first time?

ANDILE SHICEKA: Correct.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Did he introduce himself to you as Tanda or did he introduce himself to you by some other name?

ANDILE SHICEKA: He gave himself the name Tanda.

NORMAN ARENDSE: And you and your other comrades introduced yourselves to him, by which names did you introduce yourselves to him?

ANDILE SHICEKA: I was Thabo, DK and Chicken Licken.

NORMAN ARENDSE: So Chicken Licken is the constant in the equation here, he kept his name.   Then what happened after you met Tanda?

ANDILE SHICEKA: I told him as to what our mission was because when I left there having talked with Power, he told me that I was going to meet Tanda, whom I then met and I told him what the plan was.  We stayed at April Close Street for some days until we left.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Then how long after you arrived and met Tanda did the Khayelitsha Train Station operation take place?  How long after that?  Was it days, weeks, months?

ANDILE SHICEKA: I think it was days.  Yes.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Tell us who was responsible for planning the Khayelitsha Train Station operation?  Firstly, who identified that as a target and then who planned the operation?

ANDILE SHICEKA: It was DK.  He came with information that there were policemen at the station, let us go there an carry out an operation.  After that what happened, I told him at this time at the station there are a lot of people and if we can go there right now a lot of people could get hurt who were African, so can we not use another time later because it was at about sevenish, late, or eight.  I told him we could not go there then, we had to wait a little so that we can make sure that no people get affected, that the ordinary public is not affected.

NORMAN ARENDSE: So you went a little later in the evening?  You can't remember what time?

ANDILE SHICEKA: No, I cannot remember but it was late then.

CHAIRPERSON: A month are we talking about?

ANDILE SHICEKA: In 1992, late in 1992.  I cannot remember the date precisely.  I think it was late in that year.

NORMAN ARENDSE: You eventually went to the station to do the operation, is that right?

ANDILE SHICEKA: Correct.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Give us the names of your other comrades involved.  You were involved, who else was involved in the operation?

ANDILE SHICEKA: Myself, DK, Shaun and Chicken Licken, Shauna and Chicken Licken.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Where does - we know now you said that DK and Chicken Licken had arrived with you from the Transkei, Shauna, who is Shauna?  Where does Shauna come into the picture?

ANDILE SHICEKA: Shauna is another member.  You see when I was staying at Tembani, I stayed for some few days there.  As I saw that our security at that house was not safe, how, that house belonged to a PAC member.  A lot of PAC members used to visit that house and sometimes we would hold meetings.
	I then decided that we must leave this house because at the end of the day we would be caught.  That is where I had to meet Shauna, a person that I know as a person who stays here in Cape Town.  We used to be at school together.  That is the person I approached.  When I approached him we then left that house.  Other people - I had to stay at Shauna and others had to find their own places, places I had already secured.
	Shauna I know because we had grown up together.  He was an old PAC member, even before I left and most of the times we use his place.

NORMAN ARENDSE: So there were then four of you in a group?

ANDILE SHICEKA: Yes, we were four.

NORMAN ARENDSE: You eventually went to the station, you were armed?

ANDILE SHICEKA: Correct.

CHAIRPERSON: By you you're meaning him collectively or him?

NORMAN ARENDSE: Collectively, sorry Mr Chairperson.
	All of you in a group, is that right?

ANDILE SHICEKA: Correct.

NORMAN ARENDSE: What were you armed with?

ANDILE SHICEKA: R4, one R5, one AK47.

NORMAN ARENDSE: You went to the station, what were you going to do there at the station?

ANDILE SHICEKA: To attack and disarm those policemen.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Do you know whether there were any policemen at the station or on the station?

ANDILE SHICEKA: The information brought by DK was that there were policemen there.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Just tell us what happened, how did you go about the operation?

ANDILE SHICEKA: We went there.  When we got there at the ...[indistinct] Station, it has a bush area.  We stayed behind those bushes and we sent DK to go again and to check whether those policemen are still there.  DK did go there, he went to look.  When he returned he ...[indistinct] all the things are okay.
	When we went there we saw someone running.  Apparently he saw us when we went up holding weapons.  Apparently when he ran towards the other policemen he was going to report that there are people who are coming to attack them.  
	When we reached the area it was some time after he had gone in and we saw that that policeman was inside a room.  The door of the room was closed.  We shot through the door.  What happened was, the door was locked and we could not go into that room.  We withdrew after having shot through that door.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Did you shoot through the door?

ANDILE SHICEKA: Yes, it was I and DK, others were holding firing cover.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Now we know that there was someone behind the door, in the room.  You know there was a person there and that person died as a result of the shooting?

ANDILE SHICEKA: We knew that there were people inside that room but that a person was killed at that time we only got to hear about that the following day.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Do you know whether any policemen went into that room or ran into that room?

ANDILE SHICEKA: No, I cannot confirm that I know that they went into that room but what DK came to tell us after having checked was that those policemen were inside that room.  When we went to go and attack there, when we got there the door was closed.  Apparently that person who had ran had also gone into that room.  That is when we started shooting through that door.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Were you - would it be correct to say that you were under the impression, based on what DK had told you, that there were policemen in that room?

ANDILE SHICEKA: Correct.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Is that the reason why you shot through the door?

ANDILE SHICEKA: Correct.

NORMAN ARENDSE: After the attack, after you finished shooting, what happened?

ANDILE SHICEKA: We withdrew.  After withdrawing we went to Shauna's house.

NORMAN ARENDSE: This attack, would you describe it as having been successful or unsuccessful?

ANDILE SHICEKA: Unsuccessful.

NORMAN ARENDSE: Why do you say that?

ANDILE SHICEKA: Because when we heard over the news, we only heard that it was not the right person who had died.  By implication it was not the correct person who had died.

NORMAN ARENDSE: How do you feel about the fact that someone died that you intend to kill or disarm or injure?

ANDILE SHICEKA: It is a very, very hurtful thing.