Amnesty Hearings — Ermelo — 1998-07-29

MR HATTINGH: As well I would like to put it to you the witness will also say that when she and Chris Ngwenya as well as Lindiwe Nkosi came down the street, Chris Ngwenya was in fact walking on the side of the group and that Lindiwe Nkosi was in the middle of the group?

PAULOS PISTOL NKONYANE: That is not correct.

MR HATTINGH: Lastly, could you assist the Committee, until approximately what time, or are you still resident in Ermelo?

PAULOS PISTOL NKONYANE: Yes, that is correct.

MR HATTINGH: During the period following the killing of Chris Ngwenya, did you remain resident in Ermelo?

PAULOS PISTOL NKONYANE: That is correct.

MR HATTINGH: Can you give any indication as to approximately when the conflict became, the extent thereof was becoming lesser and lesser?

PAULOS PISTOL NKONYANE: I would say that the violence did not come to an end.  Instead it continued.  People were dying, others getting injured.

MR HATTINGH: What was the position in 1993?

PAULOS PISTOL NKONYANE: The situation was better and the violence had subsided.

MR HATTINGH: Thank you Mr Chairman, no further questions.

MR HATTINGH: .

CHAIRPERSON: Mr Mapoma, have you got any questions?

MR MAPOMA: Thank you sir, no questions.

MR MAPOMA: .

CHAIRPERSON: Mr Patel, have you got any re-examination?

MR PATEL: No questions Mr Chairman.

MR PATEL: .

ADV SANDI: Mr Nkonyane, let us go back to the scene where this shooting occurred.  When you positioned yourselves in the manner which you described, whose suggestion or decision was this that you should so position yourselves?

PAULOS PISTOL NKONYANE: We were conferring.

ADV SANDI: Whose decision or suggestion was it that Gushu should be the first person to open fire?

PAULOS PISTOL NKONYANE: I said that because I was standing behind.

ADV SANDI: Where did you go after shooting Chris Ngwenya and the persons who were in his company?

PAULOS PISTOL NKONYANE: Would you please repeat the question?

ADV SANDI: From the point where you shot Mr Ngwenya and the two girls who were in his company, where did you go?

PAULOS PISTOL NKONYANE: We went to the place where we stayed.

ADV SANDI: Did you have any discussion about what had happened?

PAULOS PISTOL NKONYANE: Yes, we did after having carried out the mission.  But then it wasn't something serious really.

ADV SANDI: Okay thank you.  Thank you Chairperson.

CHAIRPERSON: Mr Nkonyane, are you the brother of the previous witness?

PAULOS PISTOL NKONYANE: Yes, I would say that we are related in so far as surnames are concerned because we share the surname and therefore we share the same respect.

CHAIRPERSON: You seem to be very angry, am I correct?

PAULOS PISTOL NKONYANE: That is not correct.  That is my nature, there are times that my facial expression is such that that you cannot look at me when I talk to you.

CHAIRPERSON: How do you feel about what you have done?

PAULOS PISTOL NKONYANE: I feel very sorry.

CHAIRPERSON: Are you still in Ermelo, are you stationed in Ermelo?

PAULOS PISTOL NKONYANE: Yes, that is correct.

CHAIRPERSON: And you now officially in government?

PAULOS PISTOL NKONYANE: Yes, I would say that I am working for the government officially, but I am not within the South African National Defence Force.

CHAIRPERSON: One of your duties as an official or employee of the government, is to ensure as best you can, harmonious living within the country, is that so?

PAULOS PISTOL NKONYANE: Yes, that is correct.

CHAIRPERSON: Not only is that your duty as a government official, but it should be your moral obligation as well, would you agree?

PAULOS PISTOL NKONYANE: That is correct.

CHAIRPERSON: In particular in this area, the strife that we have been hearing about, listening to, can only be described as tragic.  Would you agree?

PAULOS PISTOL NKONYANE: Yes.

CHAIRPERSON: What are you willing to do to rectify the position, such that the people of this area live as I understand it, the way they used to and the way the ought to live?

PAULOS PISTOL NKONYANE: I would say here before this Commission that I am prepared to reconcile with people to restore the tranquillity that prevailed here before the violence.

CHAIRPERSON: Do you think you can participate in that?

PAULOS PISTOL NKONYANE: Yes.

CHAIRPERSON: Are you willing to do everything you can to attain the peace and tranquillity that you talk of?

PAULOS PISTOL NKONYANE: Yes.

CHAIRPERSON: Do you think it is a good idea to do that to get this tranquillity and peace?

PAULOS PISTOL NKONYANE: It is a good idea and an open mind.

CHAIRPERSON: What do you think can be done to avoid a repetition of what has gone by?

PAULOS PISTOL NKONYANE: I must participate in whatever is happening within this community, so that there is no division as was the case before.  We were being set against each other as a result of a third force.  I am prepared to work hand in hand with the community or people and the victims who suffered through the experiences, and I also must make it clear that I would like to appeal to them so that they come down, indicate to them that myself and my colleagues are not animals.  We are human beings, we were just forced by circumstances.
	The part that I play here in this community is very important, because I am working hand in hand with the Police.  I am working for the Community Policing Forum.  I am not into violence really.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you, you are excused.

PAULOS PISTOL NKONYANE: Thank you.
WITNESS EXCUSED