Human Rights Violation Hearings — Worcester — 1996-06-25

MR DE BRUIN: Yes he was shot and killed.

ADV POTGIETER: Yes, now perhaps you can start by telling us a little bit about yourself - where do you live?

MR DE BRUIN: I come from Robertson.

ADV POTGIETER: So you from Robertson.

MR DE BRUIN: Yes.

ADV POTGIETER: Is that where your family lives?

MR DE BRUIN: Yes.

ADV POTGIETER: And is this where this particular incident took place?

MR DE BRUIN: Yes.

ADV POTGIETER: When did it happen?

MR DE BRUIN: It was the 22nd of November 1990.

ADV POTGIETER: What were the circumstances in Robertson on that day that led to this incident?

MR DE BRUIN: Well on that day there was a  rent boycott and most of the pupils and their friends from Robertson school were to hold a placard  demonstration at the Municipal offices.  On their way to the offices, on the corner of Barry Street at the Grand Hotel the police confronted them and asked them where they were going.  They said they were going hold a placard demonstration at the Municipal offices.  The police then ordered them to turn around and move back.   The police then shot teargas into the crowd and the children starting running away in various directions, but most of them just carried on in the direction of the shops.  Whilst they were running away this woman came out of her shop and she shot in the direction of the children and [intervention]

ADV POTGIETER: Mr De Bruin we realise this must be a very, very difficult thing for you to do to relive the pain of that day.  We really understand you must be experiencing a lot of pain but please take your time, as we understand exactly how you feel.  Are you feeling a little better?  Right.

MR DE BRUIN: Well this woman shot him on the left side of his chest.  He fell in the road and when the ambulance arrived the pamphlets were still strewn around him.  Those were the pamphlets he'd been carrying and that was the 22nd.  They picked him up and took him to hospital, but he was dead on arrival at the hospital.
 On Monday the 26th of November myself, my son of 15 years, my daughter of 14 years and the one of 7 years went to town.  While we were on our way to town I went into the shop because I know this woman personally but here mother didn't want my son of 15 years to come in so I went in with my daughter aged 14 years and the one of 6 years old.   I took them by their hands and went through the side entrance right into her lounge.  I then told her that I came to her this morning with two conditions, seeing that the newspaper reported that someone carrying a broken bottle ran into the shop and she then wounded this person in the chest.  
I asked her whether that was true, I asked her whether that in fact happened that somebody came into her shop with this broken bottle in his hand.  To both my questions she answered me and said no Dirk as there was nobody in the shop,  should I have let the child come into the shop and maybe kill me or take something that he wanted to take? She said that she saw somebody outside her shop with something that looked like a can of Doom, but she said that I mustn't saying anything about this can because she was telling me the truth but she was keeping to the statement she gave the police.

ADV POTGIETER: Is that the conversation you had with this person who shot your son.

MR DE BRUIN: Yes that was the woman who shot my son.  We sat together, she put her hand on my leg and she said Dirk, this morning I am telling you the truth, but I am sticking to my police statement.   It was then that I asked her if the children weren't into the shop, why did you shoot? She said she was scared that the children would run into her shop.

ADV POTGIETER: Was there a court case after this incident?

MR DE BRUIN: No, to this day there has been no court case, there was just a sort of an investigation when my wife and I went to the Magistrate, Mr Lategan and he asked us why we wanted to make a fuss because our child was already dead and my wife said to him, sir do you think my child is a dog but he did not answer her. 
  I said to him I believe the case is not finalised yet and he took out a book and said he would sign the book that the case was finalised today and I said it can't and that he must leave the case.   I then contacted my attorneys and the attorney said that it couldn't be because they didn't even know that we had to go to that courtroom.

ADV POTGIETER: When a person dies from unnatural circumstances the law says that there must be a judicial inquest should be held.    Did you hear anything about an inquest in connection with the death of your son?

MR DE BRUIN: We just received a form which stated that he had been shot in the chest.  That was all we received.

ADV POTGIETER: Can you still remember whether was this shortly after the incident or was it a while afterwards?

MR DE BRUIN: It was quite a while afterwards.

ADV POTGIETER: Did you ever make a statement to the police in connection with this incident?

MR DE BRUIN: I personally went to the detective, a Mr Uys who investigated the matter to report the matter as well as what she told me but up to now nothing has been done.

ADV POTGIETER: So there was no court case?

MR DE BRUIN: No, there were no steps were taken against the woman and she still runs that shop to this day.

ADV POTGIETER: How old was your son when he was shot?

MR DE BRUIN: He was 18 years old and in Std 7.

ADV POTGIETER: So he was at school?

MR DE BRUIN: Yes.

ADV POTGIETER: Was he involved in any political activities?

MR DE BRUIN: I can't really say that he was a member of the Youth Organisation at that stage because I worked away from home, so I didn't really know  but when we attended meetings, ANC meetings, they were also present but they never left the area.

ADV POTGIETER: Could you ever succeed in finding an eyewitness or somebody who saw what happened and could tell you?

MR DE BRUIN: Yes definitely.  At that stage there was a person who worked for a firm   [indistinct] something like that, Ruben Jacobs and he worked across the road from where the incident took place.  On that day when the children were moving down the roads, he specifically told his men to stand still and to leave they work because he was  scared they would get hurt. 
 At that stage, how can I put it, nobody was singing or chanting or toi-toiing and the placards were all still rolled up and he stood there watching how the police sent the children back and how this woman in the shop, she still told me that she had a little revolver in her drawer and that day she was wearing a dress with pockets and when the children moved down the road she took the revolver out and put it in one of her pockets.
 The witness saw how the woman came out of the shop and how she shot.  There isn't only one witness, there are many even some White people who came there before I did whom I went to see and they told me they would help me with this matter.

ADV POTGIETER: Now according to those witnesses, the person who shot was outside in the street.

MR DE BRUIN: She came out to her doorway.  (end of tape)
(beginning of new tape - tape 3, Day 2 - does not blend in with the rest)

MR DE BRUIN: They were beating my son named Cosby. ... not satisfied that he would investigate the matter further but nothing has happened so far.

ADV POTGIETER: How long ago was this, how long have you been waiting for this?

MR DE BRUIN: Well since he was shot until today, 5 years.

ADV POTGIETER: Maybe I can just explain to you or perhaps before we do that, maybe I can ask you, what was the version given by the person who fired the shot - not the version she gave you, but the version she gave the police?  This broken bottle business, what was that about?