Human Rights Violation Hearings — Empangeni — 1996-11-04

WITNESS:   As I've already said, the investigators would come and say Gcina Mkhize was involved.  I want to hear it from the horse's mouth.  I want him to admit or I want somebody who has got tangible information to tell me, because this does not hold any water.  I'm not sure at this juncture as to who killed my husband, so I would appreciate it that whoever did it must come forward and tell me, so that I may know the truth, because what disturbs me even more is that I don't even have a clue as to how he died, why and who killed him.

CHAIRPERSON: We will certainly pass this information on that your husband told you that it was probably Gcina Mkhize who would harm him and the police told you that Gcina Mkhize was involved.  We will pass this information along to the Amnesty Committee, because in due course they will be receiving an application for amnesty from Gcina Mkhize and they will question him as to whether or not he was involved in the death of your husband, and that may be a way in which you can finally come to know who was responsible for the death of your husband.  It certainly seems likely that he was involved.  That is the area in which ... (end of tape 4A)

CHAIRPERSON: 3B/0 ... senior IFP people in the area - that is the evidence which came out at the trial and it does seem likely that Gcina Mkhize may have been certainly involved in the death of your husband, if not directly responsible.  We will certainly investigate that.  Thank you.

KHOZA MGOJO: Zanele, I just want to clarify an issue here.  In this meeting that was held, which your father-in-law attended, where you later got a report from your father-in-law, where it was discussed that your husband should go back to the Transkei, who was chairing the meeting?

WITNESS:  I do not know, because I never went there.

KHOZA MGOJO:  Who called the meeting?

WITNESS:   We were told that a meeting had been called by a certain chief and that his name is Mkhwanazi.  His surname is Mkhwanazi.  His name is John.  John Mkhwanazi.

KHOZA MGOJO:  Is he still alive?

WITNESS:   Yes, he is.

KHOZA MGOJO:  Is he still a chief?

WITNESS:   That is correct.

KHOZA MGOJO:  What is his ruling place?

WITNESS:   It's KwaDlangezwa.

KHOZA MGOJO:  Thank you.  Officer Khumalo, is he still alive?

WITNESS:   I'm not positive.  I don't know whether he's still alive or not.

KHOZA MGOJO:  Was he at Esikhaweni Police Station?

WITNESS:   That is correct, he was working at Esikhaweni.

KHOZA MGOJO:  Thank you.  At the time were you asked about the children, as well as yourself, it is very clear that you have been disturbed emotionally as a family.  I have gathered information that you have never consulted any psychologists or psychiatrists.

WITNESS:   No.  I would go only when I am physically ill to see or consult with a doctor.

KHOZA MGOJO:  Would you like to try and see some psychologists or psychiatrists to try and get some counselling, because your state of mind can affect your whole well-being or your whole body?

WITNESS:   I never thought of going to a psychiatrist.

KHOZA MGOJO: But would you like us to see some people who can help you, together with your children to see psychiatrists and well as social workers to help you in your predicament?

MRS GCABASHE: Let's go back to Officer Khumalo.  You said he was at Daya's Supermarket.  Did he have an office there?  Because you have just said now that he was at Esikhaweni.  Did they have an office at the supermarket complex?

WITNESS:   That is correct.

PROF MAGWAZA: I have just one question that I would like to ask you, Mrs Taliwe.  Your requests are very clear and it is very apparent that you are worried about your children's future.  As we have already pointed out, we do pass these recommendations to the State President.  You said you are a teacher.  Is it a lower primary or higher primary school?

WITNESS:   It is a lower primary school.

PROF MAGWAZA:  What's the name of the school?

WITNESS:   It's Mnchangule.

PROF MAGWAZA:  A certain thing you've told us the children's years, but I don't remember you telling us as to what standards they're in.  So you've already given us their classes or which standards they are.  Thirdly, your husband worked at Mondi Paper in Richards Bay.  Did you get any pension money or any grant from them?

WITNESS:   He had already taken a package by the time he died.

PROF MAGWAZA: That is correct.  I just wanted to know only about that.

CHAIRPERSON: Mrs Taliwe, thank you very, very much for coming in to talk to us today.  We can see how upset you still are about this incident and, understandably so, to have your young husband taken away from you and your young children.  You have told us a lot about the circumstances surrounding his death, the context in which it happened and it seems as though his last words to you were correct and although it may be a difficult thing for you to accept, that the people who probably caused his death are now about to apply for amnesty and it is possible that they may be given amnesty, this does give an opportunity for them to be closely questioned about all the deaths that they were involved in causing and not only those for which they have already been convicted.  So, as I have said, we will be ensuring that this man, Gcina Mkhize, and any other members of the Esikhaweni hit squad, which caused so much misery in this area, Mr Romeo Mbambo and Israel Hlongwane, they too will be closely questioned as to your husband's death and we hope that will be able to solve that mystery for you and we hope that once you do know who did it and why they did it and who told them to do it, it may make more sense to you and you may feel more happy in yourself.  So, thank you very much for coming and talking to us today.
/CHAIRMAN
4B/0

CHAIRPERSON: The next witness is Elizabeth Mbatha.  Good morning, Mrs Mbatha, we welcome you here today.  Thank you for coming in.  You have come to tell us about the death of your father, is that right, Sibekho Mbatha?

ELIZABETH MBATHA: Yes.

CHAIRPERSON: And he died in Esikhaweni in 1992.  Before you tell us that story, can you stand up, please, and take the oath.

ELIZABETH MBATHA: (Sworn states) (Through Interpreter)

CHAIRPERSON: Now, is it correct that you live in Esikhaweni Township?

WITNESS:   Yes.

CHAIRPERSON:  And just tell us briefly something about yourself.  Are you married?  Do you have children?  Are you working?

WITNESS:   I'm not married.  I'm staying at home.  I'm staying with my boyfriend.  I have four children and my siblings.  We were five from my family, from my father  - three girls and two boys, and we were all staying at home with my father and our children.

CHAIRPERSON:  And your mother, is she living?

WITNESS:   My mother died in 1986.

CHAIRPERSON:  So you were staying at home with your father and your brothers and sisters?

WITNESS:   Yes, we were staying at home with my father and my sisters, except for one brother of mine who left home for over two years.  He never came back.

CHAIRPERSON:  And are you working, Elizabeth?

WITNESS:   No, I'm not working.

CHAIRPERSON:  Right, now, can you tell us of the events which led to the death of your father.  You said in your statement that it started in about 1990, when your brother was attacked at school.  Is that right?  You said your brother was Tedius Mbatha and that he was attacked at school.  Could you just tell us what happened there and how that led to the death of your father?