Amnesty Hearings — Welkom — 1998-11-16

STEPHEN DONALD MAKHURA: Yes, Sir.  It was called black on black violence, normally by the media and other people who were not involved there in that violence but we knew that violence was not black on black violence, Sir.
"As a cadre of Umkhonto weSizwe I got in contact with some of the operatives inside the country and they advised me to go and help there at Polla Park,  to go and train the SDUs there. Polla Park was a very strong hold of the ANC.  Even militarily the place was feared by the previous rulers of this country.  We had all assortment of weapons including Vinanti airguns there.  The record states clearly that even the police, the Security Forces couldn't penetrate that place.  It was a base, a guerilla base.
	During that time violence continued because there are still hostels near Polla Park.  It was again exacerbated by the media that the ANC was fighting, I mean Xhosa speaking people were fighting Zulu speaking people.  We know by the time that it was not true.
	After getting in contact with some of the Self Defence Units there - by that time I was still staying in the township but sometimes I went to Polla Park because Polla Park is not more than five kilometres from where my brother resided in Thokoza.
	I missed being killed many a times.  Almost all my friends have been killed in Thokoza.  
	I was advised by the Self Defence Units of Polla Park to go and stay there in Polla Park.  I was given a shack to stay in.  We sometimes undertook missions to go and defend other places, for example Ermelo, Ratanda, Thembisa, Meadowlands and other places.  Some of my comrades, the SDU were arrested during those missions and some killed.
	On the 1st of April 1992 I was approached by Sebenzile Ndabene(?) ..."
Pardon Sir?

CHAIRPERSON: Just repeat that name please.
MR MAKHURA
"I was approached by Sebenzile Ndabene.  Sebenzile Ndabene was one of the high-ranking ANC members in Polla Park.  He was also Self Defence Unit member but there is a difference according to us between the SDU and operator in Polla Park.  When we talk of operators we refer to those who carry weapons of war and those who are highly trained.  Then when we talk of Self Defence Units we refer to each and every person who is capable of carrying any rudimentary weapon to defend the people ..."
...(intervention)

MR SIBANYONI: Excuse me, is Sebenzile Ndabene the same person as Nozulu?

STEPHEN DONALD MAKHURA: No, Sir.

MR SIBANYONI: Okay.

STEPHEN DONALD MAKHURA: No, Sir, they are different.
"On the night of the 1st of April 1992 - before I proceed Sir, it must be noted again that I arrived on the 27th of February 1992 inside the country from exile and the incident I'm applying for amnesty for happened on the 2nd of April 1992, it means I stayed less than four weeks inside the country after so long in exile.
	It happened that on the night of the 1st of April 1992, Sebenzile approached me to clean five AK47 rifles and to load 10 magazines of bullets.  I did so.  He said to me: "We will be going to Natal to go and defend people there".  It was a normal thing for people to come and ask assistance from Polla Park since a very strong hold of the ANC politically and militarily.
	Another point to be noted Sir, is that in Polla Park there were political leadership and military leadership.  It's possible that those who are engaged in military actions may not know what's going on from the side of the political office of ANC at Polla Park.
	Then I cleaned the rifles.  The following day was the 2nd of April 1992, we embarked on our trip to Natal.  It was Sebenzile Ndabene, Nozulu, Mac Gregor, Wellington, Joe, the driver of that car ..."
...(intervention)

CHAIRPERSON: Sorry, I think if you could just take these names slowly because we've got to record them down, Mr Makhura.  So it was Sebenzile ...

STEPHEN DONALD MAKHURA: Yes, Sir.

CHAIRPERSON: The next one?

STEPHEN DONALD MAKHURA: The second one was Nozulu.  I'm afraid Sir, I do not know their surnames.  The third was Mac Gregor, the fourth was Wellington, the fifth one was Joe, the sixth was the driver, the seventh was Nxala and lastly myself.
"I need to state it clearly that two of the people I talked about here are now deceased, that's Sebenzile Ndabene and Mac Gregor.  They were gunned down on that day in Bethlehem in the Free State.
	Nozulu went for training in the former SADF.  He was one of the highly trained SDU member in Polla Park.  Joe trained with Frelimo forces in Mozambique.  
	I do not know the type of training or any knowledge whether they know these following people of the trip to Natal, that's the driver and Nxala.  I only knew of Sebenzile, Nozulu, Mac Gregor, Wellington, Joe and myself as trained members of the ANC and those who were going to Natal, Sir."
...(intervention)

CHAIRPERSON: Now of those names you mentioned, Mr Makhura, Wellington, is that Mandla Wellington Fokazi, one of your co-applicants here?

STEPHEN DONALD MAKHURA: That's correct, Sir.

CHAIRPERSON: And Thozamile Clement Ndabeni, who is he?

STEPHEN DONALD MAKHURA: He's the driver.

CHAIRPERSON: Is he the driver?

STEPHEN DONALD MAKHURA: Yes, Sir.  I did not know his name prior to that incident, Sir.  That is why I only wrote "the driver", but now I know him.
"We proceeded to Natal but I heard from Sebenzile that he had to pass at a place called Bethlehem in Free State - that's the place I did not know at all, so as to collect his money from Nxala.  Nxala is my co-accused, he is Johannes Scalo Nxala.  That's the reason why we had to pass at Bohlokong black township in Bethlehem.
	The entire morning on the very same day I stayed in the house together with some of the people I mentioned here but it was Nxala and Sebenzile who went out with the car.  I do not know where they went to.
	On the very same in the afternoon we proceeded to our destination, that's Natal.  We passed at a garage somewhere in the town in Bethlehem but I heard later that the reason why we had to pass at that town was for Nxala to collect money for Sebenzile.  Then we left for Natal.
	Just outside Bethlehem town the car stopped.  There seemed to have been an argument between Nxala and Sebenzile.  According to my knowledge, Nxala was not going to Natal.  The reason why he was in the car from the garage to the spot where the car stopped was to show Sebenzile the road to Natal, but I believe he will come and confirm that on his own, Sir.
	There seemed to have been an argument between Sebenzile and Nxala and since Sebenzile was a trigger happy person I thought something was going to take place.  He was angry, this Sebenzile.  Then Wellington Fokazi said I must disembark at the back of the car.  It was a van, Sir.  I disembarked and together with Johannes Nxala, it was Johannes Nxala, Wellington Fokazi and myself then proceeded on foot to the direction of the township.
	I later learnt from Wellington that the reason why we disembarked from that car was that Sebenzile wanted to do something very horrible to Mr Nxala."
...(intervention)

CHAIRPERSON: Sorry, who went back on foot, Wellington, that's the first applicant, yourself and who was the third person?

STEPHEN DONALD MAKHURA: Johannes Nxala, Sir.

CHAIRPERSON: Is that Joe?

STEPHEN DONALD MAKHURA: No, that's not Joe.

CHAIRPERSON: Oh, Johannes who?

STEPHEN DONALD MAKHURA: Johannes Nxala.

CHAIRPERSON: Oh, okay, so ...(intervention)

STEPHEN DONALD MAKHURA: You've Joe and Johannes Nxala on that case.