Human Rights Violation Hearings — Johannesburg — 1996-04-29

ROKAYA SALOJEE: Every time you go there they would put names forward to you, you've got to take out your identity card where you stay, where you work, what you do, whose your friends, that also I said if you are a drunkard you also associate with drunk people, if you are a church-goer then you associate with church-goers, I am a political person I associate with political persons, but you people can put all the names down I will say every name I know whether I knew or not because I am not going to say anybody specifically.  And that was one of the worst days.  Except one night when I went to a friend they chased me with a car.  I was just lucky that when they went with the car it was go for me and
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it was stop for them and I went and lay on the stoep and they couldn't find me.  When I came back that night my sister and a friend of mine was in the house, he was staying with me and this gentleman came and visited me, he was a friend of my late husband and will you believe it they gave him such a hiding that we had to call Dr Jessad who just stayed around the corner and since that day he never came to my house because they told him if he ever comes there again they would take him for detention.

YASMINE SOOKA: So they tried to isolate you from all your friends and family as well?

ROKAYA SALOJEE: Ja.  I am not going to relate the whole story but when they called me again they said that I should go after my boss came from overseas.  When I went there they asked me a few questions, I didn't answer.  I said whatever you people want to know you know more about my life than I know myself you know which time, which date, where and why and what, you people know more than I do so you should tell me, I've got nothing to tell.  I said because you've got a dog that sits outside my door the whole day and the whole night so he's giving you all the information.  You don't need any information from me.

YASMINE SOOKA: I just want to take you back a little bit to just after the death of your husband, was there an inquest held?

ROKAYA SALOJEE: There was an inquest held.  After he died they told me to go to the cell, to the police station and  I went and got his clothing from there.  The clothing he died with I don't know what happened, I suppose it was full of blood and they didn't want it to - they must have burned it or what, but the clothes that was in the cell that was in JOHANNESBURG HEARING TRC/GAUTENG
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a paper bag was full of blood.  There was so much blood that I actually didn't know what colour it was because it was so hard that it's gone black already.  At the inquest when I did take that clothing the inquest lasted about five minutes and the magistrate, whoever it is, when I went up to the witness stand I could only mention my name and where I stayed and who was my husband.  When I said I would like to say something, I'd like to know why was there blood on my husband's clothing, and the magistrate said "that will be all".

YASMINE SOOKA: Are you saying that the magistrate didn't allow you to ask any questions?

ROKAYA SALOJEE: I wasn't allowed to ask any questions.

YASMINE SOOKA: Were you represented by any lawyer at the time?

ROKAYA SALOJEE: Ja, Bizwa I was represented by him.

YASMINE SOOKA: Did he ask questions?

ROKAYA SALOJEE: No he only asked questions what he was supposed to ask. I suppose at that time he also felt that he shouldn't ask too much because he was the only one out that could help us also if there was anything.  I mean at that time I wasn't the only one that had suffered, but at that time I was the only one in that year that had somebody that has died, and he was really flooded with work but he was very helpful to me.

YASMINE SOOKA: Tell me at the inquest did they produce any medical records, did any doctors see your husband while he had been in detention?

ROKAYA SALOJEE: No they say he fell from Grey's building that was what they actually gave the death certificate.  They didn't say he hanged himself or he jumped or anything, but they didn't give me any medical record about my husband.
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Because when I asked that I would like to see a magistrate to ask about my husband because I believe he's sick and then they sent me to Colonel Clint and that is the answer I got from Colonel Clint.  I have never ever seen a magistrate or a medical doctor for my husband.

YASMINE SOOKA: How old were you at the time when all of this happened?

ROKAYA SALOJEE: I was 26 years of age.

YASMINE SOOKA: Tell me what effect has this had on your life?

ROKAYA SALOJEE: Well like I said I had a breakdown and it lasted at least two and a half years.

YASMINE SOOKA: Do you receive any counselling still?

ROKAYA SALOJEE: No, but I do go to the clinic and I am still on medication.

YASMINE SOOKA: Did you ever get a passport?

ROKAYA SALOJEE: Yes eventually after my boss came back, that was in 1979 they did give me a passport.

YASMINE SOOKA: I know that you have suffered immensely and particular in the time when nobody would help you because to be associated with you would mean harassment for them, but what do you think the Commission can do for you?

ROKAYA SALOJEE: Well I would like the Commission to bring forward, I'd really like to know in every detail, from the time my husband, my late husband was arrested till the time of his death, what had happened to him and who had tortured him and they must be brought to book.

YASMINE SOOKA: The Commission has to recommend a policy on reparation, is there anything that you would like to recommend to the Commission that they can do about people like yourself?

ROKAYA SALOJEE: Well like I say I have been unemployed for
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many, many years, not that it will help, that is the thing that you can never, although it's easy to say you must forgive, they say you never forget, but would you believe it now that we are in the new South Africa I still hate some of the Whites.  I am sorry to say that, but that's how - if I see a White policeman I hate him.  I've got many White friends but it's unfortunate that at that time you had informers, if I think back then I think I shouldn't hate the White man only, I should hate my own people that worked with the system because if my own people were not there I think so many people would have been arrested and harassed like Salaam Mayatz and them.  If they didn't inform about us and make our lives unpleasant, like the late Mrs Mary Moodley, she was one of my great friends, and one day the same fellows, Salaam Mayatz stayed across and he knew, because he was not working he was sitting there the whole day and watching who is coming at that house.  
 One day I went there because she was banned and she said to me go and jump in the coal box, they had a big box that they put coal in, she said because I think this fellow is going downstairs because her husband used to stand on the corner and watch for us, her being banned she couldn't have more than two visitors, and in that house there were always people.  She said to me go and jump in the coal box.  Now I know when she said jump in the coal box so if they come and search the house they wouldn't find me in the house they would find me in the coal box.

YASMINE SOOKA: And so they wouldn't be able to get there into ...(intervention)

ROKAYA SALOJEE: They wouldn't go into the coal box to go and see if there's anybody.
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YASMINE SOOKA: Rokaya you sound as if you have accepted, in a sense, the whole political life that you've led and other witnesses have said that they are innocent bystanders, you, however, in your testimony have said that you accepted that when you married your husband ...(intervention)