Amnesty Hearings — Pietermaritzburg — 1997-08-01

CHAIRPERSON: And it was only because it couldn't be reached then that it wasn't heard, is that so?

BHEKI F MBUYAZI: That's correct.

MR WILLS: Mr Chairperson, I just would like to place on record that that is news to me being his council and that I was only appointed later and I don't have copies of that correspondence.  Mr Mbuyazi, what political party did you belong to?

BHEKI F MBUYAZI: I am an ANC member.

MR WILLS: When did you join the ANC?

BHEKI F MBUYAZI: I joined the ANC in 1989.

MR WILLS: Why did you join the ANC?

BHEKI F MBUYAZI: The reason why I joined the ANC was because of my elder brother who encouraged me to join the ANC and I personally thought it was necessary that I should join the ANC because it was fighting for the liberation of the people.

MR WILLS: This elder brother you refer to, can you tell the Committee what his name is?

BHEKI F MBUYAZI: Yes, it's Patrick Mbuyazi.

MR WILLS: Now was Patrick Mbuyazi a prominent ANC member in your area?

BHEKI F MBUYAZI: Yes.

MR WILLS: Now prior to us going into the actual incident itself, I want you to tell me what it was like being an ANC member in that particular area where you resided?

BHEKI F MBUYAZI: In my area in that time it was very difficult for a person to join the ANC because the whole area was controlled by the IFP.

MR WILLS: So what happened if you were an ANC member?  When you say it was difficult, what do you mean?

BHEKI F MBUYAZI: It was difficult because meetings used to be called by the IFP people and if he didn't attend such meetings it was so difficult for you to live because people attacked you because of your absence during such meetings.

MR WILLS: Do you know the name of the chief who presided over that area?

BHEKI F MBUYAZI: Yes, I knew him he's Umzimba Tebe.

MR WILLS: And do you remember what political affiliation he had?

BHEKI F MBUYAZI: All the people are - the indunas were IFP.

MR WILLS: No, I'm asking specifically about the chief, chief  Umzimba Tebe.

BHEKI F MBUYAZI: Umzimba as a chief, I won't be specifically able to say before the Committee that he belonged to either of the particular orginsations but what I know that I thought personally he was an IFP member.

MR WILLS: Did he do anything to prevent the forced, forcing people to go to meetings of any particular party?

BHEKI F MBUYAZI: Even if I can't say that he encouraged or forced people to attend meetings however the headmen in that area were the people responsible for calling meetings and I thought that the instruction should be coming from him as a chief.

MR WILLS: Did you yourself attend any IFP meetings?

BHEKI F MBUYAZI: I never attended even a single meeting of the IFP.

MR WILLS: What happened to you as a result of that?

BHEKI F MBUYAZI: That's where the trouble started because they started to perceive me as an unwanted element in the community.

MR WILLS: When you say trouble, what do you mean?

BHEKI F MBUYAZI: I'm trying to say that I had a big bad image because people started to attack me.

MR WILLS: Can you give the Committee details of these attacks?

BHEKI F MBUYAZI: I was attacked three times.  On two of those attacks, no one was in - two of them no one was injured.

MR WILLS: I just want you to expand, when you say you were attacked what do you mean, were you personally attacked or was your kraal attacked, what was the position?

BHEKI F MBUYAZI: We were attacked as ANC members because they didn't want us in that area.  We were bad elements in the community because we didn't attend IFP meetings therefore we were to be chased out of the country or be killed.

MR WILLS: Yes but where did these attacks take place, where were you when the attacks took place?

BHEKI F MBUYAZI: In most cases I wasn't staying at home, we used to stay in the hill because we were afraid that we might be injured.

MR WILLS: So, are you implying that the attacks were directed against your home?

BHEKI F MBUYAZI: Truly speaking it wasn't directed to my home but it was directed to ANC members as they were not wanted in that area.

MR WILLS: Let's look at the first attack, what happened on the first attack?

BHEKI F MBUYAZI: They came looking for me an my elder brother - we were not at home on that particular day - they intimidated my father and mother, telling them that we should also attend IFP meetings and if we don't we'll see what is going to happen after that.

BHEKI F MBUYAZI: Was there any damage or injury to any person or damage to any property or anything on that occasion?

BHEKI F MBUYAZI: At that time no damage was done.

MR WILLS: The second attack, can you give the Committee details as regards that incident?

BHEKI F MBUYAZI: They came again for the second time and they told our parents that they should talk to us because what we were doing, they don't like what we're doing.

MR WILLS: Were your parents threatened in any way?

INTERPRETER: Please repeat the question.

MR WILLS: Sorry.  Were your parents threatened in any way?

BHEKI F MBUYAZI: Yes, they were threatened because they were intimidated to convert us to be IFP members.

MR WILLS: The parents you refer to, is your father Mapweka Mbuyazi and your mother Maria Mbuyazi?

BHEKI F MBUYAZI: Yes, that's correct.

MR WILLS: And the brother you've been referring to up until now is consistently Patrick Mbuyazi, is that correct?

BHEKI F MBUYAZI: Yes.

MR WILLS: Now let's concentrate now on the third attack, what happened in this instance?  You can give the Committee as much detail as you ...(intervention)

CHAIRPERSON: Is this really relevant to the respect of this application, the details of these attacks, are they explaining why he killed three women aged sixty two, sixty five and twenty?

MR WILLS: In my respectful submission Mr Chairperson, I'm trying to create the context in which his response occurred.  I realise that on the papers before us that it appears that this wasn't in fact the case.  My instructions are completely differently and I will get into explaining that.  I will try and be as brief as possible but basically the motivation on this Applicant is very briefly that what occurred was that he was under this political pressure - immediately prior, a couple of days before the incident occurred, he was attacked and there were certain injuries and it was as a result of that, that he retaliated.

CHAIRPERSON: He retaliated because he had been injured - revenge.

MR WILLS: Judge, that is partially - I can't concede - I have to concede that, that was partly the motivation but it is my respectful submission that there was in fact more to that.

CHAIRPERSON: Let's get on with it because at his trial he said he was acting in self defence.

MR WILLS: Yes Judge, I will deal with those statements in due course - I am aware of that, thank you.  Mr Mbuyazi the third attack, what occurred then?

BHEKI F MBUYAZI: During the third attack they came in the evening at about six o'clock and they attacked, killing my elder brother and burnt our home.  They also injured all the elder people who were at home.

MR WILLS: You yourself weren't injured at that time, is that correct?

BHEKI F MBUYAZI: Yes, that's correct because I tried to run away and escape.

MR WILLS: Do you know who was responsible for this attack?

BHEKI F MBUYAZI: Yes, I knew the people who were attacking us.

MR WILLS: Will you tell the Committee?

BHEKI F MBUYAZI: The people who were attacking us were IFP members.  In them there was Mzana, Mr Mthembu.

MR WILLS: Now what did you do as a result of this attack?

BHEKI F MBUYAZI: After that together with my father, we went to report the matter to the police.

MR WILLS: Which police?

BHEKI F MBUYAZI: Kwa Zulu police.

MR WILLS: At which police station?

BHEKI F MBUYAZI: At Kangwana police station.

MR WILLS: What happened as a result of that report?

BHEKI F MBUYAZI: No attempt was made by the police, they just came to collect the corpses and they did nothing after that.