Amnesty Hearings — East London — 1999-06-17

CHAIRPERSON: Yes Mr Obose, who is next?

MR OBOSE: Mr Chairman, it is Mr Nduku.  His application appears at pages 99 to 105, thank you Mr Chairman.

CHAIRPERSON: Is that Mr Nduku?  Can you give your full names please?

NDOZAKHE NDUKU: Ndozakhe Nduku.

NDOZAKHE NDUKU: (sworn states)

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you, you may be seated.  Mr Obose?

MR OBOSE: Thank you Mr Chairman.   You are attached to the South African Police Services, what rank do you hold Mr Nduku?

NDOZAKHE NDUKU: I am an Inspector.

MR OBOSE: In 1994, March, what rank did you hold?

NDOZAKHE NDUKU: I was a Sergeant.

MR OBOSE: Did you attend the meeting at Bisho Police College on the 22nd of March 1994?

NDOZAKHE NDUKU: Yes, that is correct.

MR OBOSE: Why?

NDOZAKHE NDUKU: I heard that all the Police were wanted at the College.

MR OBOSE: Who made this announcement, do you know?

NDOZAKHE NDUKU: I was just coming from Umtata, I just got that message that all the Police were at the College.

MR OBOSE: You then proceeded to the College?

NDOZAKHE NDUKU: Yes, that is correct.

MR OBOSE: What time did you get to Bisho Police College?

NDOZAKHE NDUKU: I arrived there after eight o'clock in the evening.

MR OBOSE: What did you find in the hall?

NDOZAKHE NDUKU: The people were singing freedom songs, the Police.

MR OBOSE: Any slogans, were they shouting?

NDOZAKHE NDUKU: Yes, that is correct.

MR OBOSE: Which ones?

NDOZAKHE NDUKU: They were saying "down with Gqozo" or "away with Gqozo".

MR OBOSE: What impression did you then gain from this gathering as a Policeman?

NDOZAKHE NDUKU: I just participated, I did not think of anything.

MR OBOSE: Did you see the nature of the gathering when you got there as being political or neutral?

NDOZAKHE NDUKU: It was more of a political mood or situation.

MR OBOSE: You said you joined in what was going on?

NDOZAKHE NDUKU: That is correct.

MR OBOSE: By doing what?

NDOZAKHE NDUKU: I joined the singing, saying (own interpretation) "down with Gqozo" or "away with Gqozo".

MR OBOSE: Did you want him to step down or not?

NDOZAKHE NDUKU: Yes, I wanted him to step down.

MR OBOSE: Did you get inside the hall or you couldn't, it was full and you were outside?

NDOZAKHE NDUKU: I stood at the entrance, I did not get inside.

MR OBOSE: Did you fetch any Officer, bringing him to the meeting?

NDOZAKHE NDUKU: No.

MR OBOSE: You just took part in what was going on there, by singing and shouting slogans?

NDOZAKHE NDUKU: Yes, that is correct.

MR OBOSE: Were you armed?

NDOZAKHE NDUKU: Yes, I was armed.  As a Detective, my firearm is always with me.

MR OBOSE: And the other Policemen in the hall and in the parameters of the Bisho College?

NDOZAKHE NDUKU: I did not notice, but all I know is that I was armed.

MR OBOSE: Thank you, nothing further, Mr Chairman.
NO FURTHER QUESTIONS BY MR OBOSE

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you Mr Obose.  Any questions Mr Nompozolo?

MR NOMPOZOLO: Thank you, no questions, Mr Chairman.
NO CROSS-EXAMINATION BY MR NOMPOZOLO

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you, Ms Collett?

MS COLLETT: No questions.
NO CROSS-EXAMINATION BY MS COLLETT

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you.  Mr Mapoma, have you got any questions?

MR MAPOMA: Thank you Chairperson, no questions.
NO CROSS-EXAMINATION BY MR MAPOMA

CHAIRPERSON: Has the panel got anything?

ADV BOSMAN: Just one or two.  Mr Nduku, did you know that the Officers were brought to the hall, the senior Officers?

NDOZAKHE NDUKU: I just saw them at the podium, maintaining the usual positions during the meetings.

ADV BOSMAN: Did you know that they were not allowed to leave?

NDOZAKHE NDUKU: No.

ADV BOSMAN: Did you identify with this whole scene there of the Officers being there and people not leaving the hall, did you associate yourself with that?

NDOZAKHE NDUKU: If it was said that you should do this, you were supposed to do that.

ADV BOSMAN: Thank you.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you.  Any re-examination?

MR OBOSE: None, thank you, Your Worship.
NO RE-EXAMINATION BY MR OBOSE

CHAIRPERSON: Mr Nduku, you are excused.
WITNESS EXCUSED