Human Rights Violation Hearings — Duncan Village — 1996-09-24

BONGANI FINCA: We are going to call upon Michael Makeke, Joyce Wili and Nomathemba Grey.

REV XUNDU: Let me swear them in Mr Chairperson.  Michael Makeke, can you please stand up.

UNKNOWN: (sworn states)

REV XUNDU: Thank you.  Joyce Wili.

UNKNOWN: (sworn states)

REV XUNDU: Nomathemba Grey.

UNKNOWN: (sworn states)

REV XUNDU: Honourable Chairperson, they are sworn in.

BONGANI FINCA: We welcome you.  We are going to hand over to June Crichton, who is going to ask questions.

JUNE CRICHTON: Can you hear me?

UNKNOWN: No.

JUNE CRICHTON: It is my fault, I wasn't switched on.

INTERPRETER: Yes, I can hear you.

JUNE CRICHTON: Good.  You're comfy?  Mr Makeke, you were shot on the 16th of August by the South African police.  Would you tell us what happened please?

UNKNOWN: On that particular date, on the 16th of August in 1985, I was on my way from work.  That happened in front of my yard, in front of my home.

JUNE CRICHTON: You were working at the time.  Where were you working?

UNKNOWN: I was working at Quigney Hamlong Electrical.
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JUNE CRICHTON: Now your statement says that the bullet hit you on your right lower leg, is that correct?

UNKNOWN: That's correct.

JUNE CRICHTON: And where else were you, did you have bullets.  In what other area?

UNKNOWN: Behind on my knee cap.

JUNE CRICHTON: You were then taken to hospital.  Which hospital were you taken to?

UNKNOWN: It was Frere Hospital.

JUNE CRICHTON: On the way, something happened, what was that?

UNKNOWN: My brothers took me, while my brothers were taking me to the hospital, we met a police casper where  policemen asked me what happened and I told them what happened.
 And they slapped me across the face.

JUNE CRICHTON: For what reason did they do that?

UNKNOWN: I don't' know the reason.

JUNE CRICHTON: Did they say anything to you?

UNKNOWN: Nothing, they said nothing.

JUNE CRICHTON: Do you know who they were at all, do you recognise any of them?

UNKNOWN: ; I don't know them because it was late in the evening.

JUNE CRICHTON: Your statement says that you had to spend some time in hospital as a result of all of this, another hospital, is that correct?

UNKNOWN: Yes, I spent three weeks at a hospital.

JUNE CRICHTON: And then when you returned to you place of employment, you were dismissed immediately?

UNKNOWN: That's correct.

JUNE CRICHTON: Did they give you a reason why you were
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dismissed?

UNKNOWN: I was never given any reason for my dismissal.

JUNE CRICHTON: Did you ever consult an attorney about what had happened to you?

UNKNOWN: I didn't consult an attorney because I spent six months in Queenstown because I burnt my clothes since they were full of blood and at home they just decided that I am insane, so I stayed for six months in Queenstown, I didn't get a chance to go to the lawyers.

JUNE CRICHTON: Do you feel that it helped you, that hospital?  Did it help you, do you feel that you are well now?

UNKNOWN: Yes, I think I'm well now.

JUNE CRICHTON: Are you on medication?

UNKNOWN: Yes, I'm taking treatment.

JUNE CRICHTON: Right, is there anything else you want to tell us before I ask you what your request is to the Commission?

UNKNOWN: What kind of request?

JUNE CRICHTON: Do you want the ask the Commission to recommend to the President anything specific for yourself and your family?

UNKNOWN: Yes, there is something that I would to request.

JUNE CRICHTON: Carry on.

UNKNOWN: I wish that the Commission as I sustained injuries on my leg and I won't be able to get employment again, at least the Commission should be of assistance to me.

JUNE CRICHTON: Do you mean by means of a disability grant, pension?

UNKNOWN: I am getting a pension.
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JUNE CRICHTON: So you are looking for some form of compensation, is that what you are saying?

UNKNOWN: I request that the Commission should assist me and my child so that my child can go to school and the other thing, the Commission should try to investigate this case and the soldiers who shot me and I will never be able to get employment again.  And at least the Commission should be of assistance to me.

JUNE CRICHTON: Mr Makeke, how old is your child?

UNKNOWN: My child is 13 years old.

JUNE CRICHTON: Thank you Mr Makeke, I hand you back now to the Chairperson.

BONGANI FINCA: Mr Sandi.

MR SANDI: Mr Makeke, how much time did you spend in Queenstown?

UNKNOWN: I went to Queenstown, it was December 1985, I came back in 1986, which was the following year.  I spend six months in all.

MR SANDI: When you went back to your place of work, do you mean that they, do you say that they dismissed you?

UNKNOWN: Yes, that's correct.

MR SANDI: You say you were working at Hamlong Electrical.  Did they give you any reasons for your dismissal?

UNKNOWN: No, they didn't give my anything, they just told me that there is no job for me.  Somebody else is there to replace me.

MR SANDI: Is there any place where you happened to get employment after that?

UNKNOWN: No, I'm just doing some part-time work.

MR SANDI: Thank you.

BONGANI FINCA: Thank you very much, Mr Makeke.  We are going DUNCAN VILLAGE HEARING TRC/EASTERN CAPE
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to call upon Joyce Wili.

JUNE CRICHTON: Hallo Mr Wili, can you hear me?  You can?  Thank you for coming today.  You are here to tell us about what happened on the 11th of August to Goodboy Wili, your son.

UNKNOWN: On the 11th of August I was at Galine with Goodboy's father.  We heard some gunshots outside, while we were still there, we heard some teargas.
 We decided to go outside so that we can get shot.  But when we were going out another canister was right at the door, we were the first to run away with the child.

JUNE CRICHTON: In your statement you say that the cause of Goodwill's death was the fumes of that teargas, is that correct?

UNKNOWN: Yes, that is correct.

JUNE CRICHTON: You were not affected yourself, you and your husband as you ran away?

UNKNOWN: We were also affected and the child also, but the child is much younger than us.  We are not the same, we are not affected the same.

JUNE CRICHTON: Now you say that you went to some attorneys in Pefferville, and that you don't remember their names.  Are these attorneys still at Pefferville?

UNKNOWN: At Pefferville I was called since my child was affected by this teargas, I was called to explain what was happening.  We were told that an attorney from Gauteng is coming to take this kind of, to listen to this kind of explanation.

JUNE CRICHTON: Did you actually go to court?

UNKNOWN: No, I didn't go to the court.

JUNE CRICHTON: And when these people came, you spoke to
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them, the people from Gauteng and told them what had happened?

UNKNOWN: Yes, I told them.

JUNE CRICHTON: And you have not heard anything since then?

UNKNOWN: I heard nothing from them since then.

JUNE CRICHTON: Is there anything else that you want to tell us about that event particularly?

UNKNOWN: I didn't put it in my statement, my child didn't die on that particular day.

JUNE CRICHTON: Explain further for me please.  What happened then?

UNKNOWN: We took him to the hospital.  I explained the whole incident.   The Doctor examined him, he gave him some cough mixtures.
 We went back home.

JUNE CRICHTON: You went back home with the baby?

UNKNOWN: We went back home, but that night we couldn't sleep because he was coughing.  I had to take him back again to the Frere Hospital.  He was examined again, his body was swollen and the feet were swollen and he was admitted.

JUNE CRICHTON: Do you know the name of the Doctor who was treating him?

UNKNOWN: I don't know the name of the Doctor, but he is one of the casual Doctors.

JUNE CRICHTON: Would you recognise him if you saw him?