Amnesty Hearings — Vereeniging — 1999-01-26

ADV SIGODI: And so you only went there to attack simply because you were scared of threats by Damarra Chonco that you would be killed if you did not join the attack, is that correct?

SIPHO ALFRED MR BUTHELEZI: Yes, that is correct.

ADV SIGODI: Thank you, Chairperson.

CHAIRPERSON: Mr Sibanyoni?

MR SIBANYONI: Thank you, Mr Chairperson.
	When Nosenga told you a different story than the one that he was sent by the ANC to plant the bombs, did these events happen when you were washing the car, on the same day or was it on different days?

SIPHO ALFRED MR BUTHELEZI: As I was questioning him as to what was the reason for him to come to Kwamadala hostel, we were still washing the cars and he told me that the people who were accusing him of being an IFP member.
	When I heard from Chunkie the following day he said the reason for that person to come to Kwamadala hostel was to assist the possibility of planting bombs.  I went back to him and I said;  Sir, I asked you the reasons yesterday and you told me that the people who were accusing you of being, you told me that you were being accused of being an IFP member whereas you know very well that you were there to check whether you can plants the bombs.  And he told me that he was afraid to tell me the truth.

MR SIBANYONI: So when you confronted him of having told you a lie, was it also at the spot where you were washing cars?

SIPHO ALFRED MR BUTHELEZI: We were in the house, in the room when I was asking him that question.

MR SIBANYONI: Earlier in your evidence when you were asked about the shot you directed at a house, I heard you saying that you directing it at the dining-room, but under cross-examination you say you directed it at the bedroom.  Did I understand you correctly?

SIPHO ALFRED MR BUTHELEZI: No, you did not hear me well.

MR SIBANYONI: You said Nosenga was left to live in the hostel because he was asked by an elderly person at Ulundi and he said that he was an IFP person, he was no longer ANC, did Nosenga become a member of the IFP?

SIPHO ALFRED MR BUTHELEZI: Yes, he became an IFP member.

MR SIBANYONI: At what stage, when did he become a member of the IFP?

SIPHO ALFRED MR BUTHELEZI: After the conference in Ulundi.

MR SIBANYONI: Thank you, no further questions, Chairperson.

CHAIRPERSON: Is there anything arising?

MR BERGER: Chairperson, there's just one question and it's for clarification only.
	Mr Buthelezi, the Mkhize that you saw armed with a shotgun, that's Bhekinkosi Mkhize, am I right?

SIPHO ALFRED MR BUTHELEZI: Yes, I saw him with an AK47 rifle.

MR LAX: Sorry, the question was, which Mkhize did you see with a shogun?  We're trying to clarify which Mkhize you saw with a shotgun.

SIPHO ALFRED MR BUTHELEZI: No-one was armed with a shotgun, it was
only a rifle.

MR LAX: So that was Bhekinkosi Mkhize that had an AK47?

SIPHO ALFRED MR BUTHELEZI: It is Archie's one.

CHAIRPERSON: "It's my co-applicant, yes."

SIPHO ALFRED MR BUTHELEZI: It is my co-accused.

MR BERGER: I'm sorry, Chairperson.
	In answer to a question by your counsel under re-examination as to who else had shotguns, you mentioned a person by the name of Mkhize, and I want to know that Mkhize, is it Bhekinkosi Mkhize, your co-accused.

SIPHO ALFRED MR BUTHELEZI: Yes, I thought you were referring to a rifle.  I just said he had a firearm, I did not know that he was referring specifically to the size of the firearm.

MR BERGER: Thank you, no further questions.
NO FURTHER QUESTIONS BY MR BERGER

CHAIRPERSON: Anything arising?

MR STRYDOM: No further questions.

CHAIRPERSON: Very well.  Thank you, Mr Buthelezi, you may stand down.
WITNESS EXCUSED