Human Rights Violation Hearings — Durban — 1996-10-24

MR LISTER: Dr Meer, sorry, I am reluctant to interrupt.    Could I, could I just gently remind you that we are really here to focus on ...    [intervention]

DR MEER: Mine.

MR LISTER: Things which affected your life.

DR MEER: Yes, well it all leads up ...    [intervention]

MR LISTER: I don't want to ...    [intervention]

DR MEER: You see, the point is that it is in that situation I suffered, or our family suffered the second arson attack.

MR LISTER: Before you go on.    Do you recall how many people were killed in that Umlazi Cinema Massacre as it's came to be called?

DR MEER: I recall somebody having said that eight people had died during that particular massacre.

MR LISTER: Because we had evidence here a couple of months ago from one of the people who was with you on that day, Mr Gaza -  and he explained in some detail the mayhem which took place in the cinema which was attacked by, by scores of people with

DR MEER: Yes.

MR LISTER: Traditional weapons etcetera.    Sorry, ...[intervention]

DR MEER: Yes, well ...    [intervention]

MR LISTER: Could you go on.

DR MEER: To my mind I must say that my interpretation is that those people who actually attacked and did the killing were instigated were machinated, were orchestrated by the pernicious system of apartheid to do so, and therefore I do not dwell on that too much.    But the point, the reason why I have taken the trouble to paint the scene, is because it is in the midst of this that we suffered a second arson attack.
During this time I found myself very fully involved in trying to assist people who were under threat, and I want to highlight the fact that the police literally withdrew.    I would go to the police and they would point blank say to me that these people who complained that they were going to be attacked, that they deserved the attacks that were being made on them, and the police came to no rescue.
I want to recount that at Phoenix, the Ghandi settlement, the police came, and there was a rising situation of racial tension between Indians and Africans and I asked the Casspirs loaded with the military to intervene and they remained pyramid-like stationed in their Casper and never bothered to get off to assist at all.    I want to state, that later in the day, I returned to the settlement with some food for people who were marooned on that settlement and seeing the place - the situation having worsened, I went to the police and said, please accompany me and they refused to accompany me.
I want to state that at the end of the day I returned again to Phoenix and saw the main house being set on fire and I phoned the fire brigade and I was told by the fire brigade that they had specific instructions not to go out there an help in any way.    I feel, I may be taking more time than I should and not getting on to what happened to me personally, but I - after all said and done - what happened personally to individuals was totally wrapped up with what was going on in the country at large, and therefore we need to focus on this.    
I want to quote here from a statement I had read at the time in the papers, where a representative of the public relations, police public relations in Pretoria, Colonel Jaap Venter had said that the police had instructions to keep a low profile to avoid accusations of instigation.
Instigation was so real, and they were so conscious of the fact that they had instigated this whole situation that they now actually said they wouldn't go there in order not to be accused of instigation.    In that situation, our house was arsoned, obviously because I had also become - once again - a target.    I had become, I was seen as being a little bit too active in trying to assist or, or overcome the machinations of the police and the military, of the system which always remains faceless, nameless.    
That, I would say was the last of the attacks that we ourselves suffered during those times.    I would merely like to add that both racism and tribalism were used to divide people and neighbours from each other.    I we cannot - if we do not understand the full scope of the perniciousness, the sort of diabolic planning that went into the massacres that continued in the Natal region from 1985 onwards, we will never really - we will never really see the full scope and the full cruelty of the system of apartheid.    
To my mind, it is a system which succeeded Nazism and which had within it all the elements of Nazism.    If you are to ask me what do I expect from this Truth Commission, my own feeling is that the true perpetrators, the true organisers, the true architects of apartheid will probably remain beyond the reach of this Truth Commission, ensconced as many of these personalities are in the structures of our new Government in all its structures.    In the judiciary, in the - in  Parliament itself, in the bureaucracy, and so on and so forth, and that we will be left dealing with those who ... end of Tape  1  Side  A ...   
[Indistinct] I think that this Commission has to look into the role of the press and the role of the judiciary during those times.    I have been asked to contain myself to events relating to me, and therefore I will not go into that here.    Thank you.

MR LISTER: Before you finish off, do you like to tell us something very briefly about how these events affected you and your -  your, not you, but your family.    You had children during these times, how, how what sort of effect did this have upon you as a family and on your children?

DR MEER: Well my children were infants.    Rashid was only three months old when my husband was arrested for treason.    His absence from home affected the children fairly profoundly.    It had an effect on our family life, but I must say that people in my position who are articulate, who had the comfort and support of friends, who knew exactly why we were opposing the government.
We were far better placed to cope with the - with these sorts of persecutions.    We knew that they would come.    And therefore in a sense, both psychologically and materially, we were prepared for these onslaughts.    I mean just add that we also had - I, I was brought to trial twice for having breached by banning order.    Each time I had pro deo, or free legal assistance and of the best of kinds from friends.

MR LISTER: Dr Meer, thank you ...    [intervention]

DR MEER: I, I just want to point out that the whole tragedy of this period and the whole persecution of this period was heaviest on people who did not have the kind of support we had.    Who lost lives, who lost homes, and who lost educational opportunities, even of a very elementary type and who, up to now, as a result remain maimed and incapable of entering into the mainstream of our society.

MR LISTER: Dr Meer, thank you very much, you've painted a very vivid picture of your life and the life of political activists like yourself during the 50's right up to the 80's.    And this sort of contextual material is very valuable for the purposes of our report.    I am going to hand now back to the Chairman to see whether there - any questions that he or others on the panel would like to ask before we finish off.    Thank you.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you, Mr Lister.    Thank you, Dr Meer.    Dr Mbojo do you have any further questions?

DR MBOJO: Just, just a question about the, for our records.      When  Ms Meer was saying she said that she was first banned in - when she said it now - she said that she was first banned in 1954 whereas in the statement she says 1952.

DR MEER: That is incorrect.    I was first banned in 1954.

DR MBOJO: So 1952 is incorrect?

DR MEER: Ja, I would like that to be corrected.

DR MBOJO: Thank you - thank you, sir.