Special Hearings — Chemical And Biological Warfare Hearings — 1998-06-09

MR VALLY: And at the top of the letter it says
"Navrae"
Would you read the name?  "Navrae" meaning enquiries.
DR KOEKEMOER
"Enquiries: Brigadier W Basson"

MR VALLY: Whom we've been referring as Doctor Wouter Basson?

JOHANNES MATTEUS KOEKEMOER: Yes.

MR VALLY: And what is the date of this letter?

JOHANNES MATTEUS KOEKEMOER: 7th August 1992.

MR VALLY: Can you read this into the record for us please?

JOHANNES MATTEUS KOEKEMOER: Do you want me to read the whole letter?

MR VALLY: That's right.

JOHANNES MATTEUS KOEKEMOER: It is addressed to
"Doctor P A Mijburgh, Medchem Technologies, West Street 265, Verwoerdburg.  0157
 Dear Doctor Mijburgh, 
 PRODUCTION OF DMA Dimethyl Phenetol Amine (Baxil)

MR VALLY: Can you just stop there.  For the record, you understood that this code name Baxil referred to Ecstasy?

JOHANNES MATTEUS KOEKEMOER: Definitely yes.

MR VALLY: Will you read the letter please?
DR KOEKEMOER
"Your quotation dated 30 July 1992 refers.  With this I want to confirm the production of 1000 kilograms of abovementioned product at your plant.  Regarding your request to the protection against criminal prosecution, I can say that it is only within our ability to give this as regards the supply of raw materials and successful delivery to our supplier.  Any irregularity which arises during the production as well as any supplying to other clients directly or indirectly through means of theft from you plant will be the full responsibility of the ...[No English translation]  Signed: Knobel - Surgeon-General"

MR VALLY: So this was a formal order placed by the Surgeon-General.

JOHANNES MATTEUS KOEKEMOER: Surgeon-General.

MR VALLY: And you were concerned about this.  You went as far as talking to Doctor Lothar Neethling about the production of Ecstasy?

JOHANNES MATTEUS KOEKEMOER: Yes.

MR VALLY: What was Doctor Neethling's former position at the time?

JOHANNES MATTEUS KOEKEMOER: He was head of the Forensic Department.

MR VALLY: Of?

JOHANNES MATTEUS KOEKEMOER: Of the Forensic Department and I suppose that ...[intervention]

MR VALLY: Of which branch of the ...[intervention]

JOHANNES MATTEUS KOEKEMOER: At Pretoria, at Silverton

MR VALLY: Was this the Army?

JOHANNES MATTEUS KOEKEMOER: No, it's the police.

MR VALLY: The police.  So he was the head of the Forensic Department of the South African Police at the time?

JOHANNES MATTEUS KOEKEMOER: Yes.

MR VALLY: And instead of saying: "That's terrible and it shouldn't be done, he started discussing ...[intervention]

JOHANNES MATTEUS KOEKEMOER: Chemistry with me.

MR VALLY: Production methods.  I just want to - I'm still busy with section 77, sorry document 77(a).  That chemical name at the top next to Baxil, what does it refer to?

JOHANNES MATTEUS KOEKEMOER: Well, it hasn't really any chemical meaning, it's a Dimethyl Thinethol Amin, so this would be a Dimethyl substituted Phenethol Amin which would be a compound similar to but not, definitely not MDMA Hydrochloride.  The small d would probably refer to some Dextra, in other words that would be a specific stereo isomer.

MR VALLY: So in layman's terms this doesn't make sense?

JOHANNES MATTEUS KOEKEMOER: It really doesn't make sense.  I have never seen these documents, I have never seen these quotes so I couldn't correct any of these names even if I wanted to.

CHAIRPERSON: It doesn't seen to make sense to scientists Mr Vally, let alone lay persons.

MR VALLY: If someone was to say that this is some product that is not Ecstasy which was used for something else would you refute that?

JOHANNES MATTEUS KOEKEMOER: Let me just make sure.  So this would be a Dextro m Alpha Dimethyl Phenethol Amin, yes, it could, no it could make sense, chemical sense.

MR VALLY: And what would it be used for?

JOHANNES MATTEUS KOEKEMOER: It would be one of the Amphetamine series of compounds.

MR VALLY: But as far as you understand, once you see code name Baxil you know it is MDMA, Ecstasy?

JOHANNES MATTEUS KOEKEMOER: That's right.

MR VALLY: If you look at - stay there with the documents please, the document before that, TRC 77.

JOHANNES MATTEUS KOEKEMOER: Yes?

MR VALLY: That is for Medchem Technologies.

JOHANNES MATTEUS KOEKEMOER: Yes.

MR VALLY: And it says
"Dear Brigadier Basson"
It's addressed to:
"Brigadier W Basson South African Medical Services, Sevamus Building Verwoerdburgstad.
 Dear Brigadier Basson,
OFFER FOR THE MANUFACTURE OF BAXIL

CHAIRPERSON: Excuse me Mr Vally, where are you reading from, what document?

MR VALLY: 77.  I beg your pardon, TRC 77.  Do you see that?

JOHANNES MATTEUS KOEKEMOER: Yes, I see that.

MR VALLY: It talks about a thousand, point to 1000 kilograms, again mentions that same chemical compound and in brackets: (Code Name Baxil).

JOHANNES MATTEUS KOEKEMOER: Yes, that's probably why General Knobel actually also spelt it the same way in his formal order of this material.

MR VALLY: Right.  Was this, as far as you understand, if he talks about
"1000 kilograms of this substance, Code Name Baxil at R2.800 per kilogram, delivered to your premises in Verwoerdburg"
Is this the product that you understand you personally were responsible for manufacturing?

JOHANNES MATTEUS KOEKEMOER: Yes, I was personally responsible for the development of this work and I kept an eye on the manufacture but I wasn't personally ...[intervention]

MR VALLY: You did run the machines?

JOHANNES MATTEUS KOEKEMOER: It was done by the production personnel, just to put it in perspective.

MR VALLY: Fair enough.  So if I was to say this is a document which was used for ordering Ecstasy, would you confirm this?  Offering to deliver Ecstasy, would you confirm this?

JOHANNES MATTEUS KOEKEMOER: Yes, that's the way that I would understand it.

DR RANDERA: Professor can you just, Professor over here.  Hello?  Can you just clarify something for me?

JOHANNES MATTEUS KOEKEMOER: Yes, Doctor Randera.

DR RANDERA: The order talks about 1000 kilograms, if somebody orders 1000 kilograms one would expect that to be delivered at one time and I would have assumed that Medchem would then also have asked you to produce 1000 kilograms of Ecstasy but I heard you say earlier on that you delivered this in small amounts.

JOHANNES MATTEUS KOEKEMOER: Yes, because the reason for this is because this material wasn't made, the capacity of the reactors available for us for the purpose of manufacturing Ecstasy was too small to produce a large quantity at one time so we had to do it in batches.
 And apart from that, in order to obtain the purity required of the product we had to have a high vacuum distillation of one of the intermediates which required rather sophisticated equipment and we did not have large scale equipment to do this.  So this material was actually distilled in 20 litre glass flasks in one of the plants.

DR RANDERA: So did you get an order from Medchem asking for a thousand kilograms?

JOHANNES MATTEUS KOEKEMOER: I was told to produce a thousand kilograms and this went via the normal financial channels of the company.

DR RANDERA: And how long does it take to produce a thousand kilograms in your unit?

JOHANNES MATTEUS KOEKEMOER: It took us quite a few months to make that.

DR RANDERA: Thank you.

JOHANNES MATTEUS KOEKEMOER: It took the Production Department quite a few months to make it.

CHAIRPERSON: Mr Vally?

MR VALLY: Thank you.  If you could stay with the documents.  I want to go to TRC 62 and TRC 63.

CHAIRPERSON: Mr Vally, are you going to be quite long on these two documents, otherwise this would be a convenient stage to take the tea adjournment.

MR VALLY: I think we can take tea now Mr Chairman.

MR WILLS: We will take the tea adjournment now and we will resume at 11 o'clock.
COMMITTEE ADJOURNS

<UNKNOWN>: ...[inaudible] if you don't start.  Thank you.  Doctor Koekemoer, you are reminded you are still under oath.

JOHANNES MATTEUS KOEKEMOER: (s.u.o.)

CHAIRPERSON: Mr Vally?