Human Rights Violation Hearings — Newcastle — 1996-09-12

COMMISSIONER: Thank you, Mr Makhanya, Vusumuzi, for coming in an telling us your story today.  Like so many other people that we have heard from in the last three days you were assaulted by those people who were employed and trained by the Government to protect us and assist us, the police.  But in fact, as we have heard from so many people during the life of this Commission, many police didn't do that.  They did the opposite of protecting us and assisting us, they assaulted, harassed and tortured people.  I don't know how many stories we've heard where the police in effect acted as prosecutors, judges and executioners, where they tried people, convicted them and punished them, but in fact they didn't charge them at all, they just meted out their own punishment.
We hope very much that we are moving to a stage where we have a police force that we can respect and that we can trust, and this is something that we should strive for very, very much, because without a police force that we can trust, without a police force that we can turn to when we need to, we are going to continue seeing the lawlessness which we already see in this country.
So, as Mr Dlamini has said, we will try to carry out the investigations that you have asked us to, and we thank you very much for coming in and giving another perspective of what life was like in Madadeni township in 1993, and we hope that those things don't happen again.  Thank you very much.

COMMISSIONER: We greet you and welcome you here today, Mr Mbhense.  We had hoped to hear your evidence yesterday, but in fact you couldn't make it.  And you have come to tell us about the death of your brother, Elliot, who was killed by the police in 1987.  Can you stand to take the oath before you tell us that story?

DUMISANI MBHENSE: (Sworn, States)   (Through Interpreter)

COMMISSIONER: Thank you.  Mr Dlamini will assist you.

MR DLAMINI: I greet you once more, Mr Mbhense.  As the Chairman of the Commission has already said that the KwaZulu-Natal province, together with the Free State region, we were expecting you yesterday to come and give your testimony.  Even though we are running out of time, but we appreciate the fact that you were able to come here before us.  You have come to tell us about your brother, Elliot, who was shot by a certain policeman.  In your statement that you submitted it was as if they were gambling, and then this policeman came to shoot your brother.  According to the rules, as well as the law governing the Commission, this matter does not have anything to do with human rights violations, but we shall hear as time goes on whether it's got anything to do with politics.  Was your brother involved in any politics?

WITNESS:   No, he was not a member of any political group.  It was just a gambling thing, but he was shot by the policeman.

MR DLAMINI: As I have already pointed out this matter does not fall within the ambit of the Truth Commission or the Act governing the Truth Commission, because this seems to just have been a gambling fight.  What we shall advise

MR DLAMINI: /Mr Mbhense

MR DLAMINI: Mr Mbhense to do is that we sympathise very much with your family.  This is a very sad and painful story.  Nobody has got a right to take another person's life, and a policeman's duty is to arrest a citizen, but not to kill that particular person.  We want you to take this matter to the attorneys so that they can follow this matter up.  Is there anything that you wanted to say to the Chairman?

WITNESS:   I wanted to say - I wanted to explain to the Commission the manner in which this happened, because I had just arrived.

MR DLAMINI: As I have already said, Mr Mbhense, we would be wasting your time because this is not within the ambit of the Truth Commission.  You should seek some advice from attorneys.  There are also human rights attorneys who deal with such matters.  I think even here in Newcastle or in Durban you can be able to see the attorneys in order to be advised as to what steps to take thereafter.

WITNESS:   What I was explaining is that the person who was shot was not gambling, but the policeman wanted to shoot one of the people who were gambling.  They had had clash before with the police, and now the one who was shot was not involved in gambling.

MR DLAMINI: Yes, this is a matter for the attorneys as well as human rights lawyers.

COMMISSIONER: (Inaudible) ... thank you for telling us that story.  It was only through your explanation that we were able to ascertain, as Mr Dlamini has said, that the shooting of your brother did not arise from a political motive, and that is our work under this - the Act - the Act under which the Truth and Reconciliation Commission is constituted we have to look at deaths or assaults, torture, which arose from a political motive, and it's quite clear that the very sad death of your brother did not arise as a result of any political motive.  And we hope that, with the assistance perhaps of an attorney, you may be able to get closer to what happened to your brother, and to perhaps see that the perpetrators face justice in some way.  And if you like you can get an address from us afterwards and we will refer you to an attorney who may be able to help you.  So again thank you for coming in and explaining to us.
/COMMISSIONER