Amnesty Hearings — Benoni — 1997-06-23

GEORGE BIZOS: We are not unmindful of that letter Judge Wilson.  We have taken the matter up with her.  What we are asking you to do is that this is a very difficult part of Mrs Hani's life, she is torn with conflict and inner conflict and it may be that the letter is unfortunate but I would submit it should not weigh too heavily on the Committee as to whether or not a postponement should be granted.  If we were dealing only with her personal reasons it may well have been a different matter, but we submit that there are cogent reasons.  In fact you will see, Judge Wilson, that on top of page 2 Mrs Nicholls says that it was agreed, more than three months ago that this would be the date.
	But if we go on with the further reasons Mr Chairperson.  We in fact, and I don't want to read the affidavit out, we in fact only got a substantial portion of the documentation two weeks ago, and we had to go to the Johannesburg International Airport in order to get it.  Whoever's fault it may have been that is a common cause fact.  
	Also we note that these voluminous documents from Ada Parker and Mrs Lewis in Die Patriot were obviously burdensome to members of the Committee and the Committee asked by letter would they please indicate which portions of these documents are they relying on.  Apparently the Commission was favoured by highlighting a number of these documents.  We were not favoured by this.  
	Indeed in truth and in fact we have some 230 pages of -in the amnesty application, which we only got two weeks ago and which we could try and sift out during the long weekend, from the 14th to the 16th, those new documents.  
	Those new documents introduce a new ground, the one that I indicated as number four, that is that Mr Hani was a military target and this is why he was shot.  That inquiry will require viva voce evidence and documentation in order to show that there was no war on at that stage, he was not a military target.  We will have to produce documentation and evidence that he in fact had relinquished his role when he took over the position of general secretary of the South African Communist Party.
	There is some argument about the number of pages that were actually served.  Matters are not decided by the number of pages, with respect, or the weight of paper, but rather by the contents.  If this case were to be decided on the basis of the applicants, that we only have to look at Ada Parker's letters and Die Patriot, then of course not much research would have been necessary.  But, as a result of their putting up a case that they acted on behalf of the Conservative Party, to collect some of the documents is not very difficult, but to interview persons who made public statements dissociating themselves from the applicants' acts, in the highest positions of the Conservative Party, is a matter which requires preparation and consideration.
	Furthermore, we submit that this is a matter, and I did make an offer to counsel for the applicants before we came here, I think it was Wednesday of last week, we should actually have a meeting, such as a pre-trial meeting, this not being a trial we could call it a pre-hearing meeting, in which irrelevant documents are removed from the files and let me say, that it isn't only the Ada Parker and Die Patriot, the applicants have sought to burden the Committee with literature relating to perceptions of Marxism and character assassination of the late Mr Hani, which we submit that on a proper appreciation of the main issues in this case do not have to burden the record that you have to consider.  We ourselves, mindful of what our submission is, will try and avoid personal references to the background ...(tape ends)  ....I have given notice of what the main issues are likely to be from our perspective of the case.
	Having regard to what I have indicated we have already taken up the better, if not the whole part of today, to do this case on a piecemeal basis is going to be wasteful and we will not be able to do justice to the case.  Cases are best decided where there is a continuity in the proceedings, where we muster all the information that we have to put to the applicants right at the outset rather than later when it becomes available so that there are no adjournments and not recalling of witnesses.  
	Therefore I would submit that the proper course to adopt for the Committee at this stage is to grant a postponement to a date suitable to the Committee and because we, as counsel, have already been involved in the matter and the parties no doubt have spent some expense in order to retainers and preparatory work has been done, we ask that both sides should be considered as to when they are available and that the matter should be postponed, preferably to a period of more than five days.  It may be that there are other applications which can possibly be postponed to subsequent days on an ad hoc basis, not those of long duration, which may not make it necessary for the Committee to waste the days that may not be taken up.  But we submit that from our view of the case that at least 10 hearing days will be necessary for the proper adjudication of this case.
	Thank you Mr Chairperson, Members of the Committee.

BERNARD MAKGABO NGOEPE: Can I ask you with regard to - you mentioned that it has become necessary for you to consult with people of some authority within the Conservative Party, but I thought that as early as in March this year when the application was served or thereabouts, already there was some indication that the applicants are leaning on to the Conservative Party.

GEORGE BIZOS: With respect Judge you are correct that there was a hint of it.  In the new documents it became firmer, as I believe with respect to my learned friends or the applicants, that it became clear to them that a mere suggestion may not be enough.  Now they are telling us that they were acting on behalf of the Conservative Party.

JUDGE WILSON: What new documents are you talking about Mr Bizos?  Is it part of the application, the amendment to the application?

GEORGE BIZOS: From page 49 to 186 ...(intervention)

JUDGE WILSON: Oh those documents, not a replacement of the original documents?

GEORGE BIZOS: The Addendum C, 41 pages of the court record, making it a total of 210 pages, and I may say that page 33 has alphabetical sub-numbers behind it which gives us another 33 pages and those we got approximately two weeks ago.

SISI KHAMPEPE: Mr Bizos you obviously are aware that the applicants are contending that the new documents that you are referring to are not that elaborate and that in fact certain paragraphs of these pages need not be read, and if they are read they are all marked in green, they have been highlighted for you, and this can be done within two hours, that is the applicants' contention.

GEORGE BIZOS: Documents are either relevant or they are not. The time that it takes you to read it isn't the time required for proper consideration, and isn't the time required for the purposes of getting documents or witnesses in order to contradict them or explain them or controvert them in some other way.   So that for the applicants to say that it will only take you a couple of hours to read it, those of us who have some experience in practice know that that's the easiest part of the work.
	The other is that there are things there which are not relevant and those which are relevant are highlighted.  We don't have that, we never had it and no explanation has been given to us as to why, if there were 200 odd pages filed, why we only had to look at highlighted passages which were not highlighted for us.

SISI KHAMPEPE: Mr Bizos are you therefore saying that even if it were possible to read the highlighted portions of these documents you would not be able to comprehend the context in which the highlighted statements have been made without reading, without having to read the whole material?