Human Rights Violation Hearings — Karoo — 1996-10-08

MARY BURTON: Good afternoon Mr Siyoko.

MR SIYOKO: Good afternoon ma'am - yes I hear you.

MARY BURTON: Please will you stand to take the oath.
ELLIOT SINDEZAMA SIYOKO duly sworn states

MARY BURTON: Thank you - we thank you again for coming to give your testimony today and advocate Potgieter will facilitate your evidence.

ADV POTGIETER: Thank you Chairperson - good afternoon again Mr Siyoko and welcome here.  You will tell us a different or give us a different perspective on the incident that we have heard about concerning the death of Mr Nkumbi.  You were one of the persons arrested and tried and eventually convicted and sentenced and then released in connection with this incident.
 Now perhaps before we talk about that in 1985 were you involved in politics - were you involved in the structures in Hanover.

MR SIYOKO: I was a member of a youth organisation in 1985.

ADV POTGIETER: And how old were you then?

MR SIYOKO: I think I was 18 years of age.

ADV POTGIETER: And were you still at school or had you left school already?

MR SIYOKO: I was not at school.

ADV POTGIETER: Now this incident we know happened on the Christmas eve on the 24th of December of 1985 and you were subsequently arrested in fact you were on New Years morning or no - no the 31st that was the last day of that year of 1985 you were arrested very early in the morning in connection with this incident.

MR SIYOKO: I will try to clarify things - in 1985 I had a friend of mine that I hung around with all the time.  But unfortunately on the 24th of December I was in De Aar and this is the day Tozmane was killed - I got here on Christmas morning with my friend he is a resident of De Aar.  We intended to spend Christmas this side.
 We then heard that Albert was killed - after a while around the 3rd of January, in the morning boers came over to the house, they entered my home.  I was naked, I only had my underwear on, they threw me into the van - I was thrown into the van like a dog - I endured this, when we got to the cells they asked me where Tozmane was, I told them that they know where he is.  After that this men put me in a cell - I was naked -  my clothes were brought later on by my parents when I was already there - after that.
 These boers beat me up, after that they accused me of having killed Tozmane until I was sentenced in Grahamstown.  The whole time I was detained - I was given bail but because I had to go to Cape Town to get my money as I was working in Cape Town - I went to Cape Town to get my money.  This meant that I did not go according to the rules of the bail setting.
 I stayed in jail  in 1991 - 31st of May - it was a public day, that is all I have to say.

ADV POTGIETER: [indistinct] you were arrested early in the new year - early in 1986 and then you were released on bail but was one of the bail conditions that you couldn't leave Hanover - or did you have to report.

MR SIYOKO: I made a request with the Magistrate when he gave us bail - that very day I told him that I work in Cape Town.  I had to sort out my life - I had to get certain documentation - I made a request but unfortunately because I did not have money I did not come back on the due date then I had to go back to jail.
 The date kept on being postponed for the court case but I was in jail.

ADV POTGIETER: So - so just to clarify it - you were given bail and was one of the conditions of the bail that you can't leave Hanover you got to stay here in this place.

MR SIYOKO: No those were not the conditions.  The condition I was given was that on that day when I was meant to have come back I  should have been here, but I could not, I had my own reasons.

ADV POTGIETER: I see - so you - you missed the postponed date that you had to be back at court - you missed that date and then they took away your bail and they re-arrested you.

MR SIYOKO: Yes sir - yes sir those were the conditions.

ADV POTGIETER: [indistinct] how many days did you miss this postponed date of the trial.

MR SIYOKO: By one day sir - you explained to the Magistrate that you had to go to Cape Town and you had to fix your affairs up and you - you couldn't possibly - you couldn't make it to be back in time, but he didn't except that.

MR SIYOKO: I made a report even my lawyer tried to explain to the Magistrate - the UDF provided a lawyer for me and they tried to negotiate with the Magistrate but he refused.

ADV POTGIETER: Did you come back to court voluntary or did they first arrest you and then bring you into court?

MR SIYOKO: Let me tell you exactly what happened - the day I was meant to be at court, I tried by all means to tell the police that I was going to be late - they then [indistinct] with the Magistrate - told the Magistrate that I was going to be late.  But the Magistrate said the conditions are such that you should have been here the previous day, we are going to re-arrest you, those were the conditions.

ADV POTGIETER: Well thank you very much - and then - and then you spent - your bail was then taken away and you spent all the time in custody until the trial - until you got sentenced.

MR SIYOKO: Yes sir.  They took me from Hanover on to a place called Dodrecht from there to Grahamstown, I was sentenced on the 11th of January 1988 I was sentenced to 18 years for having killed this man - I did not kill this  man because the police killed him.
 They were suppose to have protected him but they ran away because they wanted him to be killed so that this conflict with the community - it is the Government - it is Hutton I will never forget his name in my life - but I will forgive him.  The time I have spent in jail if I have taken even a small stone and thrown at Tozmane I would then have peace in my heart, because then I would have been guilty -that is my problem.  
 I have a father that I was working for, he is a pensioner - when I was in jail he would take from  his pension money and try to help me and go and see me because the people that the authorities were wicked.  I stay in jail until I was released - I thank Mr Mandela - it is because of him that I was released.
 I thank the people who were in the struggle because today I am released because of that.  That is my case.

ADV POTGIETER: So what you are suggesting is that the police are actually responsible in a way for what happened because they knew that this Mr Nkumbi's life was at risk and they accompanied him into the township and then they ran away they left him there behind.

MR SIYOKO: It is the police who killed Mr Nkumbi.  They knew that the community could not accept him, knowing that - they still took him back to the community and left him there, even though they were cognisant of the fact that the community could not accept him.
 Even at court we tried to explain in every sense but - but the Court could not accept that because they had their own intentions - they were on their own mission.

ADV POTGIETER: What was the problem around Mr Nkumbi?