Amnesty Hearings — Kimberley — 1997-10-30

MR MTHEMBU: Is it further correct that the said incident occurred on the 1st of December 1990 and that the deceased in the matter was one Esrom Hapane and that on the second count of attempted murder the victim was one Casium David Gwete?

GIFT SEKITLA MOSES MOHASA: That is correct.

MR MTHEMBU: Sir, were you given an order by an organisation or any person to commit these two offences and if so, who gave you the order?

GIFT SEKITLA MOSES MOHASA: The instructions to commit these incidents were given during the time of the fight when it was intensified between the comrades and the Million gang.  The Executive Committee of the African National Congress in Kroonstad gave these orders that members of the Three Million because they are attacking people and harassing people, we should defend the community against them...

MR MTHEMBU: Sir, with regard to the Daveyton incident, did you personally know the victims or not?

GIFT SEKITLA MOSES MOHASA: I did not know the victims.

MR MTHEMBU: Did you know which political party they belonged to?

GIFT SEKITLA MOSES MOHASA: I didn't know their political affiliation but they have contacts with the Three Million gang.

MR MTHEMBU: Did you meet them for the first time at the tavern that day or not?

GIFT SEKITLA MOSES MOHASA: That is correct, it was for the first time.

MR MTHEMBU: And was there an argument or a fight between yourself and them?

GIFT SEKITLA MOSES MOHASA: The argument was there because I was accused that I am chasing a certain person whom I did not know.

MR MTHEMBU: Would you then Sir in your own words explain in full to the Committee why did you have to kill the deceased Esrom Hapane?

CHAIRPERSON: I think it would be better for us to follow if you were to first tell us what happened.

MR MTHEMBU: Thank you Mr Chair.  Would you tell the Committee what happened on that day, the 1st of December 1990 at the tavern where you met the deceased and Mr Gwete.

GIFT SEKITLA MOSES MOHASA: In 1990, the 1st of December, we were supposed to have a meeting with the members of the SDU's in the East Rand where we were going to discuss the strategies used in their region which is the East Rand and to discuss further the exchange of arms between the two SDU's.  We left with Bennie Steven - it was Bennie Sitibe, we were supposed to go and attend the meeting.
	Bennie Sitibe was not found for the whole day and I left by myself and a girl who accommodated us that other side.  When we arrived at the tavern we enquired about Bennie Sitibe and we found the relative called Pat Namami, we asked him and he told us that Bennie Sitibe went out, he would come back and we sat.  After a while we realised that he was not coming back and I told this lady to leave.  
	Even before we could reach the exit these guys arrived and they accused me of having chased one of their friends and just there a fight broke because I did not know what they were accusing me of and their manner of approach gave me a suspicion - I saw them that they full of fighting spirits.  The deceased stabbed me behind because he a knife in his possession and he held me with my hands and the others were hitting me with their fists.
	I managed to open his hands and I saw this knife and I got hold of him and I defended myself with that knife.   And because the deceased was more brave than the others, it was discovered that he was the person that I stabbed many a times.  And when the others ran away, I also ran away.

MR MTHEMBU: Could you then tell the Committee why was it necessary for you to kill the deceased.

GIFT SEKITLA MOSES MOHASA: It was not my intention to kill the deceased, I was defending myself against an attack launched at me - it was not my intention to kill him.

MR MTHEMBU: Now Mr Mohasa, this incident occurred in Daveyton and the Three Million was operating from Kroonstad, on what basis or how do you link the victims to the Three Million?

GIFT SEKITLA MOSES MOHASA: I link the two incidents because Bennie Sitibe, the person who was with me has a brother called Machangani and his brother used to visit Daveyton,  during his visits he was a member of the Three Million and Machangani and the deceased knew each other very well, in other words, the deceased and Machangani were one.
	At one stage I had a feeling that Bennie was also involved in the plan of their killing.  I went back to Kroonstad and I appealed - I reported what happened in Daveyton and it was discovered that during my stay there Bennie was not there, it was Machangani, in other words, it was planned that I should be killed.

CHAIRPERSON: Why did anybody come to that conclusion that Bennie and Machangani had planned to kill you Daveyton - it was their plan?

GIFT SEKITLA MOSES MOHASA: I think it was their plan because on that day we were supposed to have a meeting with the self-defence units of the East Rand and Bennie knew about this meeting because it was the only reason that took us there and to my surprise he was not there, in other words this whole thing was to take place in his absence - I was supposed to be killed because if he didn't know about this thing he would have there, he would have been present, he would been also involved in this whole issue.

SISI KHAMPEPE: Were you supposed to have a meeting with the East Rand SDU members at that tavern where this incident took place?

GIFT SEKITLA MOSES MOHASA: I went to the Tavern to look for Bennie Sitibe.

SISI KHAMPEPE: Where was your meeting supposed to take place?

GIFT SEKITLA MOSES MOHASA: Our meeting was supposed to take place ...

INTERPRETER: The last part of the answer was not audible enough.

SISI KHAMPEPE: Won't you repeat your answer so that the translators can translate what you said.

GIFT SEKITLA MOSES MOHASA: Our meeting was supposed to take place at Tokohsa.

MR MTHEMBU: Mr Chair, may I approach the applicant to speak a little louder.

GIFT SEKITLA MOSES MOHASA: Thank you.

MR MTHEMBU: Mr Mohasa, how do you come to the conclusion that Machangani used to visit Daveyton and was well acquainted with the area?

GIFT SEKITLA MOSES MOHASA: On our arrival in Daveyton we were accommodated at Bennie Sitibe's relative and Bennie Sitibe and Machangani are brothers.  And I stayed quite some time there and I discovered that Machangani was well known in Daveyton, especially the gangsters.

MR MTHEMBU: On reading the Judgement in this particular case, it is said therein that it would appear that the fight that ensued between you and the victims was over a cigarette and a girl, do you have any comment to make regarding that statement?

GIFT SEKITLA MOSES MOHASA: Yes.  Can I please explain one issue?  When we arrived to look for Bennie, these guys were sitting drinking beer and their cigarette boxes were on the table and there was no reason to fight for a cigarette because they had their cigarettes on the table - they would be smoking while drinking.
	And about this issue of this girl - of the girl, it was impossible really to fight for the girl - I know the husband to this girl and I know that this girl had a child and I did not have any suspicion that among those guys there was one who was going out with this girl and I was accommodated at her home.  
	Now, our fight over a girl with them is something that doesn't give sense, it is an issue brought in so that it's sort of a cover-up so that we do not know the start of the whole issue - I know her husband.  We arrived in Daveyton and we were accommodated at her home and there was no reason to really fight with anybody over her.

MR MTHEMBU: It's further on record that immediately prior to the incident, there is a person by the name of Mpho who was with the deceased who came to you and asked you for a cigarette which you said you didn't have, you then accused him of looking improperly at the woman or the girl you were with and did threaten him with death, do you have any comment to make?