Human Rights Violation Hearings — East London — 1997-06-13

MR MNYUTE: They gave me a new name that I am an informer.  These pamphlets 
were distributed, because we were oppressed by the White man and our own people 
from the homelands.  I was one of the people who made a way that, of people to be 
outspoken especially for the youth together with my colleague who is late.  We started 
the East London Youth Congress.  We had not gone far, but because they realised that 
I was not well educated we were being undermined, demeaned.  The youth opened 
another organisation.  This youth organisation was in conflict with our own 
organisation.  
 The East London Youth Congress started fighting with the other youth 
organisation.  Their battle ended up at my own house.  I have children, but fortunately 
at home I had members of the East London Youth Congress.  The other group came 
together with other girls.  If it was only the ANC, I am not scared, I could name them, 
but we are mixed and you are going to capitalise on that.  I am not going to divulge 
the names, but what I wanted to say that since I was released from Robben Island I 
could not be employed, therefore, I employed myself and I told people and I told 
people about the ANC.

ADV SANDI: Excuse me Sir.  Could you go back to the pamphlets.  You were 
saying that these pamphlets referred to you as an informer?

MR MNYUTE: Yes.

ADV SANDI: Did people believe that?

MR MNYUTE: In politics, you see, those who are against you they go and spread a 
bad spirit about you.  Those who are working with you listen.  This issue about being 
an informer, you see, I had combis.  They said that I am using these mini-busses so 
that the other youth group can fight, can be fought with the aid of these mini-busses.

ADV SANDI: When the other group came to your house were your cars damaged or 
perhaps your furniture?

MR MNYUTE: No, it was not on that day.  After a while Comrade Msawuli and 
Sitho and other Comrades were called to Lusaka.  They came back.  After they came 
back I think that there was a conclusion that something should be done about 
informers.

ADV SANDI: We have to focus on the matter of your house being bombed.  Perhaps 
not go into other details.

MR MNYUTE: When I came back from Lusaka, apparently I had been called to 
Lusaka as well.  I said I knew nothing about it.  The day Comrade Msawuli was 
beaten up I was also beaten up on that very same day.  I was beaten up at 12 midnight.

ADV SANDI: Were the perpetrators found?

MR MNYUTE: No, because the Ciskeian Police together with the perpetrators 
worked together, they were in cahoots.  They were scared of me however.  They did 
not know what I was going to do.  Secondly, after they had bombed my house what 
saved me was my mini-busses were parked almost against my wall.  The grenades they 
threw into the lounge my wife leapt and I jumped over her, right over her so that she 
would not be injured.  However, she got greatly injured.  Then they threw yet another 
one around the dining room.  That hit the wall and went back to the cars.  It damaged 
the cars.  My wife was injured.

ADV SANDI: Were there other people who were injured in the house except for 
your wife?

MR MNYUTE: I was also injured.  The children, fortunately, were not injured.  It is 
just my wife and I who got hurt.

ADV SANDI: Did you go to hospital to get some form of treatment together with 
your wife?

MR MNYUTE: After we had taken my wife to hospital she was admitted for six 
months.  I was only in hospital for two weeks.  I do not, I thought only of revenge.  I 
was thinking how I am going to organise my own boys to fight.

ADV SANDI: Where was your wife?

MR MNYUTE: She was in hospital at that time.

ADV SANDI: Did she heal totally?

MR MNYUTE: Yes, she is in the Transkei.  She is a soldier.

ADV SANDI: You would like us to investigate this matter?

MR MNYUTE: It has been a while, asking for the truth, wanting this matter to be 
investigated.  I was also saying that those people who said that I was an informer must 
also come forward.  They must come and say who I sold out.  They  must be 
investigated, they must come.  The ANC must try to pay for the damages.  My 
children I cannot look after them well.  My one child is at university.  Mandela himself 
must come and himself must investigate this matter.  I was working underground as 
well.  I will give him names.

ADV SANDI: You also requested that people like Vusumzi Artwell, Bawule and Mr 
Msawuli their matters be investigated as well?

MR MNYUTE: As a matter of fact the ANC should have looked at these matters a 
long time ago, but because of the respect and discipline of our organisation we thought 
we should wait and see what the ANC would do, because Msawuli and I were 
working together also Sitho.  We kept on thinking that the perpetrators would be 
found, the ANC would find out who they are, but that is not how things go.  The ANC 
itself, in my perception, has been infiltrated a lot by the enemy.

ADV SANDI: Let us not get into that Sir.  I trust that that is all you have to say.  If 
my colleagues have questions they will ask.  Thank you.

CHAIRPERSON: We thank you both.  We remember the time of folly when our 
people were fighting against each other.  It was painful.  I think it is true when you say 
that truly the organisation should handle this matter.  The ANC that is.  People died.  
The community should have gotten together, walked hand-in-hand for the liberation of 
the struggle.  It makes me angry really, because it is painful to see our own people 
fighting against each other.  Msawuli was a brave man.  This should not have 
happened to him.  Thank you.  Mrs Msawuli, you cannot mention peoples' names, 
unfortunately, in the hearing.  These people should be given a notice 21 days before 
the hearing.  However, you can go to our investigators, give them the names and we 
will investigate the matter further.  Thank you.  You may step down.  
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MRS MSAWULI: MDANTSANE HEARING TRC/