Amnesty Hearings — Cape Town — 1999-10-26

MR JAMIE: And obviously you'd been on these missions before you testified so you knew that the police could in fact, according to you, they were waging war and they were attacking people so they could basically have come from anywhere, couldn't they, the police?  The police patrol for instance, not so?

XOLA TEMBINKOSI YEKWANI: Yes that is correct.

MR JAMIE: So you as a trained operative with your fellow persons who were there that evening must have been keeping watch as trained personnel do when you are on a mission, not so?  You wouldn't be just looking in one direction?

XOLA TEMBINKOSI YEKWANI: We were actually focusing on the route from Philippi and Nyanga Police Station.

MR JAMIE: Okay, now can you describe how you first noticed this vehicle, what was the vehicle doing when you first saw it, Pro Jack's vehicle?

XOLA TEMBINKOSI YEKWANI: I did not see it when it was coming.  When I turned the car was already there and I didn't get a chance to look at other things, I just turned and started firing.

MR JAMIE: So when you fired you didn't move towards the vehicle you turned and fired, is that correct?

XOLA TEMBINKOSI YEKWANI: Yes I didn't even move, I just turned and I started firing, I didn't even move.

MR JAMIE: Now until you turned and fired as you've testified, you as I understand your testimony you were not aware of the vehicle and didn't realise the vehicle was approaching, is that correct?

XOLA TEMBINKOSI YEKWANI: I didn't even hear it coming, I was told by a comrade next to me who told me that there was a car behind me.

MR JAMIE: Now you've also testified and you demonstrated in the court that where you were standing to the vehicle was about two to three vehicles to where you were sitting to where Advocate Bosman is sitting in front, is that correct?

XOLA TEMBINKOSI YEKWANI: Yes that is correct.

MR JAMIE: Now sir, would you like to explain to the tribunal how it is that a vehicle with its lights on could approach you up to a distance of two to three metres and you are unaware of the vehicle, either the sound of the vehicle's engine or you also were unaware of the vehicle's lights, how is that possible, sir?

XOLA TEMBINKOSI YEKWANI: I didn't hear the engine sound and even the lights of the vehicle, I didn't even see them because I was actually focusing on that road from Philippi Police Station and I was panicking because the time was moving on and I wasn't even sure that the van had moved or not.

MR JAMIE: So now you say also you were panicking because the time was moving on.  You didn't testify to that effect before?
Is that correct, you didn't say that before?

XOLA TEMBINKOSI YEKWANI: I was not looking from any other direction because I thought that if I lose focus I'm going to miss this van.

MR JAMIE: So is your evidence, sir, that you were so focused on Lansdowne Road that you didn't see a vehicle with its lights on come up to as close as two to three metres from you?  Is that what you ask the tribunal to believe?

XOLA TEMBINKOSI YEKWANI: Yes that is the truth, I didn't hear the engine of the vehicle, I do not want to lie and say that and testify to that effect because if I heard the engine of the vehicle I could have seen the car without being told.  Even the lights, I did not see them.

MR JAMIE: When you turned around and saw the car tell us what you saw?  Did you realise it was a sedan vehicle?

XOLA TEMBINKOSI YEKWANI: All that I realised when I was shooting at this car, I realised it was not a van but it was a private car.

MR JAMIE: You realised as you were shooting at the vehicle that it was not a van but a private car?  Now what do you mean when you say a private car?

XOLA TEMBINKOSI YEKWANI: This car is the - the private car to me is different from the police van, that is why I'm referring to it as a private car because it's different from the police van.

MR JAMIE: As you were shooting and you realised it was a private car who did you think might be in this private car?
Did you think it might be civilians?

XOLA TEMBINKOSI YEKWANI: I thought there were police inside because I knew that they sometimes used their private cars.

MR JAMIE: So you thought it might be police because they sometimes used private cars, is that correct?

XOLA TEMBINKOSI YEKWANI: Yes that is correct.

MR JAMIE: Is it correct as you testified earlier that when you were shooting and when you ran away you were sure you had shot police?  At one point in your evidence earlier ...(intervention)

XOLA TEMBINKOSI YEKWANI: Yes I was certain that those were police because there's no one who could just leave the road and come to my direction as I was standing there.

MR JAMIE: Is that why you were sure they were police?

XOLA TEMBINKOSI YEKWANI: Yes that is correct.

MR JAMIE: For no other reason?

XOLA TEMBINKOSI YEKWANI: No, there's no other reason except the reason that I have stated.

MR JAMIE: But now you made a statement to Mr Killian on the 13th August at these offices which you signed, is that correct, that's the statement that is I presume in front of you, is that correct?

XOLA TEMBINKOSI YEKWANI: Yes that is correct.

MR JAMIE: And is that your signature which appears on the last page thereof?  Just the name Tembinkosi?

XOLA TEMBINKOSI YEKWANI: Yes that is correct.

MR JAMIE: Now in paragraph 9 of that statement you said the following that when you ran to the squatter camp in Brown's Farm you went to Michael's house where "we discussed what had happened" and then you said you say this
"I asked the others whose car it was that we had shot, whether it was the police or the detectives.  None of us knew.  At that stage we did not know who we had shot."
Do you want to explain that part of your statement, sir?

XOLA TEMBINKOSI YEKWANI: Yes that is true because no one knew the car but I was certain that those were the police though no one knew about it but I wanted to confirm with them if they knew that the people in that car were police.

MR JAMIE: But now how can you give that answer when your statement says "at that stage we did not know who we had shot", that includes you, you did not know who you'd shot according to your statement.  Why are you now contradicting yourself under oath, sir?

XOLA TEMBINKOSI YEKWANI: I am saying that because I was certain there is no on else who would come to me knowing very well that I'm armed and leave the road and come to where I was, that is why I said I was so certain that those were the police.

MR JAMIE: So are you saying you were not telling the truth or you were not being correct when you in this statement say that you did not know "we did not know who we had shot" and when you also say "none of us knew", that is not correct?  Is that correct?

XOLA TEMBINKOSI YEKWANI: We did not know, we only got that information the next day.

MR JAMIE: What information?

XOLA TEMBINKOSI YEKWANI: Michael brought a newspaper with this information saying that Pro Jack was shot at Lansdowne Road.

MR JAMIE: So then you knew who had been shot but before that you thought it was, you were certain it was the police that you'd shot?

XOLA TEMBINKOSI YEKWANI: Yes I was sure on that night that I shot the policemen.

MR JAMIE: Now the impression you've given in this matter so far in your testimony is that you turned and shot, you didn't have an opportunity to observe anything, is that correct?  You just turned and you began firing?

XOLA TEMBINKOSI YEKWANI: Yes that is correct.