Human Rights Violation Hearings — King William's Town — 1997-05-13

ADV SANDI: You mean that the Doctors in Stutterheim who was supposed to be helping people, were police who arrested you?

KHAYALETHU HELA: Yes, they were wearing camouflage uniforms.

ADV SANDI: You would see them together with the police?

KHAYALETHU HELA: No, they would be in hospital and the police would come and arrest us.

ADV SANDI: You said that you have birdshot still embedded in your body?

KHAYALETHU HELA: Yes.

ADV SANDI: How do you feel?

KHAYALETHU HELA: I don't feel very well.

ADV SANDI: Do you get treatment concerning this?

KHAYALETHU HELA: No.

ADV SANDI: Why not, did you go to a hospital?

KHAYALETHU HELA: No, I did not go to any hospital.

ADV SANDI: Why?

KHAYALETHU HELA: I don't have money to go to hospital.

ADV SANDI: Did you go to any Attorney to lay a claim?

KHAYALETHU HELA: No.

ADV SANDI: How old were you at that time, were you 19 years old?

KHAYALETHU HELA: Yes, I was 19 years old.

ADV SANDI: Were there any police you identified that day?

KHAYALETHU HELA: Yes.

ADV SANDI: Who are these police?

KHAYALETHU HELA: There was Sergeant Dion Oates.

ADV SANDI: Is this the same Dion Oates which the lady referred to?

KHAYALETHU HELA: Yes.

ADV SANDI: What did he do?

KHAYALETHU HELA: I don't know whether he shot, but he was there when the police were shooting at us.

ADV SANDI: Were there any other police you could identify in that group?

KHAYALETHU HELA: Yes.

ADV SANDI: Who are these police?

KHAYALETHU HELA: Mkulule was also there.

ADV SANDI: Mkulule?

KHAYALETHU HELA: Yes.

ADV SANDI: What are the full names of Mkulule?

KHAYALETHU HELA: I don't know his first name but his surname is Mkulule.

ADV SANDI: Is he still in Stutterheim?

KHAYALETHU HELA: Yes, he is still a police, but I don't know in which police station.

ADV SANDI: Is he still in the Stutterheim region?

KHAYALETHU HELA: Yes.

ADV SANDI: Are there any police you can remember?

KHAYALETHU HELA: Yes.

ADV SANDI: What about Fumanekile?  Is he Mgwanda?

KHAYALETHU HELA: No, he is Mgwadla.

ADV SANDI: What was he doing?

KHAYALETHU HELA: He was in that group of the police.

ADV SANDI: Is he still in Stutterheim?

KHAYALETHU HELA: No, I think he is here in King William's Town.

ADV SANDI: What about Swanepoel?

KHAYALETHU HELA: Swanepoel was also there.

ADV SANDI: The police you mentioned, did you know them before that day?

KHAYALETHU HELA: Yes.  Because they would be there in the township when we were toyi-toying and singing freedom songs?

ADV SANDI: Is that all Mr Hela, before I can ask your requests?

KHAYALETHU HELA: Yes, that is all.

ADV SANDI: You said that you want to be helped to get medical treatment due to the injuries you sustained?

KHAYALETHU HELA: Yes.

ADV SANDI: Do you have any other request?

KHAYALETHU HELA: I cannot even work for myself now.

ADV SANDI: You've also mentioned that you need an immediate medical check up?

KHAYALETHU HELA: Yes.

ADV SANDI: Is that correct?

KHAYALETHU HELA: Yes, that is correct.

ADV SANDI: What about Vuyani Zali, where is he?

KHAYALETHU HELA: He is in the township.

ADV SANDI: Blakey Maki, where is he?

KHAYALETHU HELA: He is also in Stutterheim in the township.

ADV SANDI: Is that all?

KHAYALETHU HELA: Yes, that is all.

ADV SANDI: Thank you Mr Hela.    Let us go to Mr Maqubela.  Mr Maqubela, you are also from Stutterheim?

WONKE WITHIEL MAQUBELA: Yes, that is correct.

ADV SANDI: Your incident happened in 1985 in Stutterheim?

WONKE WITHIEL MAQUBELA: Yes.

ADV SANDI: You said that in 1985 you were arrested.   Were you a member of this Youth Congress?

WONKE WITHIEL MAQUBELA: Yes, that is so.

ADV SANDI: Let me now hand over to you Mr Maqubela and tell us what happened to you.

WONKE WITHIEL MAQUBELA: In 1985 it was on the 17th of November, on Sunday,  it was in the morning, I was arrested by the police.  If I remember well, it was after midnight.  Sipho Ntebe and Linda Witbooi were the police who arrested me.
 They said that they were looking for me and they had a list with them.  They said that they were looking for me because of an incident that happened, a man had been burnt down together with his house.
 They took me to Stutterheim police station.  I spent the night there and then the following morning - I don't remember the Constable who opened the police cell, but I was taken to the office where Mr Peters was.  He was a policeman.  He was together with Dion Oates and Sipho Ntebe.
 Mr Peters was on the other side of the table, the other two were standing.  They then asked me about the incident that happened.  I told them that I know nothing about this incident.  I tried to explain to them that I've got nothing to do with this.
 They did not understand this, they then assaulted me.  I could see that they were instructed by Mr Peters.  I was beaten up by Sipho Ntebe and Dion Oates.  I was then taken out of the office, taken to a store room in Stutterheim police station.

ADV SANDI: Without disturbing you Mr Maqubela, Dion Oates and Mr Ntebe, how were they assaulting you?

WONKE WITHIEL MAQUBELA: They were slapping me, kicking me.

ADV SANDI: They were asking you about this person who had been burnt?

WONKE WITHIEL MAQUBELA: Yes.  I did not know anything about that.  They took me to this store room, it was dark but I could see when they opened the door.  There was a hosepipe, a lawnmower and old blankets in that store room.  They then teargassed me and they would close the door and they would leave me for a few minutes.
 I would fall down because of the teargas.  They would then open the door and take me back to the office and ask me about this incident.  I told them that I know nothing about it, they would assault me and beat me.  It was when Sipho Ntebe hit me against the wall, I lost my two teeth, today I have false teeth because of that incident.
 My teeth were chipped.  I then requested them to take me to a Doctor to pull the teeth out, because my teeth were aching.  They did not take that seriously, they just carried on beating me up.  A statement was taken, I cannot remember who wrote the statement amongst the three policemen.
 Then I was told to sign.  The statement was written in English.  I had to sign it reflecting that I agreed with what was written.  After I had signed, I realised that I had bound myself.  They then told me later when the gave me this document to sign, they said that the document was saying that I don't know anything about this, I was dizzy at the time, but when they read it out to me, I realised that the statement was binding me in that I was one of the group that went and burnt this man's house down.
 After that the 17th of November we were taken to the King William's Town prison.    We were bailed out on the 6th of June 1986, if I remember well.  R500-00 bail, on the Monday the came to bail me out from home.  It was on a Monday the 9th, I think.  We were given instructions that we should go and report in Neliswa said, because we were together.

ADV SANDI: What happened, was there a court case?

WONKE WITHIEL MAQUBELA: No, until it was taken to the Supreme court.

ADV SANDI: Were you sentenced?

WONKE WITHIEL MAQUBELA: I was sentenced.

ADV SANDI: How long?

WONKE WITHIEL MAQUBELA: We got the same sentence, five years imprisonment, three years suspended.  I served two years.  In court I was sentenced due to the statement I was forced to sign.
 I tried to reveal the truth in court, I tried to describe how the place was where I was teargassed, the lawnmower, the hosepipe and the old blankets.
 There is something called a trial within a trial, the police were called in to give evidence and a picture about the police station and the state thereof.
 Their evidence corresponded with mine.  Therefor my Attorney said that if the police's evidence that in the store those contents were there, what was I doing in the store, but in the end they did not take this evidence into consideration.