Amnesty Hearings — Durban — 2000-04-11

CHAIRPERSON: Yes we want to carry on.  The next application that we will hear is that of Mr Lindane Ntiyane.  The amnesty reference number is AM3688/96.
	The Panel is constituted as has been indicated on the record earlier, and the Leader of Evidence is on record as well.  I will allow Ms de Klerk to place herself on record, on behalf of the applicant.

MS DE KLERK: Mr Chairperson, I'm Marcia de Klerk, and I appear for the applicant in this matter.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you, Ma'am.  Is there anything that you want to put on record?  Can we proceed?

MS PATEL: Yes we may, Honourable Chairperson.  If I may just state that the victims in this incident, the Dladla family, have been served notices and have also said that they don't have any opposition to this matter and do not wish to oppose it.

CHAIRPERSON: You're happy that we can proceed in the circumstances?

MS PATEL: Yes, Honourable Chairperson, thank you.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you, Ms Patel.  Ms de Klerk, is there anything that you want to put on record, or do you want your client to be sworn in?

MS LOONAT: My client to be sworn in, please.

CHAIRPERSON: Very well.  Are your full names Lindane Ntiyane?

LINDANE NTIYANE: (sworn states)

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you, you may be seated.  Yes, Ms de Klerk.

MS PATEL: Sorry, Honourable Chairperson, it appears that the victims have been arrived.  I've just been informed.  If you would just grant me a few moments.

CHAIRPERSON: Yes Ms de Klerk, can you just hold on, I just want to make sure that it is in fact victims.

MS PATEL: Sorry Honourable Chairperson, it appears that they wish to oppose the application, I'm going to need to take instructions.

CHAIRPERSON: Yes, I was going to suggest if it were in fact the Dladla family, that we stand down to allow you to at least just investigate what the situation is.  I mean, you'd just better investigate whether they really want to oppose or whether they just want to be present.

MS PATEL: Absolutely.

CHAIRPERSON: And let us know what the position is.

MS PATEL: Yes.

CHAIRPERSON: We will then stand down.
COMMITTEE ADJOURNS
ON RESUMPTION

CHAIRPERSON: Ms Patel, can you just first of all, indicate to us who is actually present?

MS PATEL: Thank you, Honourable Chairperson.  Present we have Regina Dladla, R-e-g-i-n-a, and Themba Dladla.

CHAIRPERSON: Have you had an opportunity to talk to them?

MS PATEL: I have, thank you Honourable Chairperson, and I have explained the applicant's version as it appears on the papers before us, and my instructions are that they do not wish to oppose the application.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you, Ms Patel.  Yes that is very much in line with what is before us in any case.  It appears that that has been a consistent attitude on their part.
	Ms Dladla and Mr Dladla, we have noted that you are present and we have listened to what Ms Patel has told us.  We've made a note of that.  We were busy hearing the application of the applicant.  He hadn't started giving evidence yet when you arrived.  We will now carry on, or proceed to listen to his evidence.  But we have noted your presence.
	Yes Ms de Klerk, I think you can proceed.

MS DE KLERK: Thank you, Mr Chairperson.
	Mr Ntiyane, where were you living before going to prison?

LINDANE NTIYANE: At Danganya at Umkababa.

MS DE KLERK: How long did you live there?

LINDANE NTIYANE: I think I was six years old when I got there.

MS DE KLERK: In the time that you were living there, did you belong to any political party?

LINDANE NTIYANE: Yes.

MS DE KLERK: What was the name of that political party?

LINDANE NTIYANE: First of all, it was Danganya Youth Congress, under the UDF, and in 1990 when political organisations were unbanned this group became part of the ANC Youth League.

MS DE KLERK: Which branch of that political party did you belong to?

LINDANE NTIYANE: The Danganya branch.

MS DE KLERK: How old were you when you joined that party and that particular branch?

LINDANE NTIYANE: In 1990 I was sixteen years old.

MS DE KLERK: And why did you join that particular political party?

LINDANE NTIYANE: The reasons for my involvement in a political organisation is because of what was happening at the time.  The government of the time - many things that were happening were not pleasing to us blacks.  The manner in which we were handled.  That is the reason why  we joined these organisations.  That's the reason why I joined this particular organisation, because I believed it could help us out.  That is the reason why I joined the ANC.

MS DE KLERK: You say you thought they could help "us out", in what way?

LINDANE NTIYANE: It would help us because many things were wrong.  There are so many things that we blacks noticed which were not done right.  Even though I was still young, I realised that our education was not the same as that of the white children and I came to a conclusion that if we one day obtained freedom and the ANC came to power, all of these were going to change, and our treatment at the hands of the whites would obviously change.  That is why I believed that the ANC would in the position to bring about change in this regard.

MS DE KLERK: So as a youth you played an active role in the ANC Youth League.

LINDANE NTIYANE: That is correct.

MS DE KLERK: What was your role?

LINDANE NTIYANE: When the branch was launched I was appointed as, or elected as Chairperson of the ANC Youth League.

MS DE KLERK: How were decisions made in that branch?

LINDANE NTIYANE: Decisions were such that a Committee would convene a meeting and the Branch Executive of the Committee would be the one making and taking decisions within the ANC, but that would go only insofar as the branch itself was concerned.

MS DE KLERK: Did you as a member of the branch, have any authority in making decisions?

LINDANE NTIYANE: Yes, as Chairperson.

MS DE KLERK: Can we move on now to the history of the fighting in the area.  Tell us about the political instability in the area in which you lived.

LINDANE NTIYANE: I would say there was this youth organisation, it was called Danganya Youth Congress.  If I still remember very well it was established between 1987 and 1988, so that in 1988 when we were officially launched, I became President of this organisation and the first conflict started I should say, in 1989.  Where we were in conflict with people who did not belong to any organisation, but were on the side of the chief in the area and the headman.  These are the people who were fighting us at the time, saying they did not want any political organisation in the area.

MS DE KLERK: Were people killed regularly in that area?

LINDANE NTIYANE: Yes, the real change in terms of how many people were dying, happened in 1990.

MS DE KLERK: Were any of your branch members killed?

LINDANE NTIYANE: Yes.

MS DE KLERK: You said that the real change occurred in 1990, what caused this change to occur in 1990?

LINDANE NTIYANE: I would say that was the time when political organisations were unbanned, and many areas in the province of KwaZulu Natal experienced this problem.  I cannot say exactly what led to the conflict and the dying of people, but I as a member of the ANC then, would conclude that these attacks were directed at the ANC, so that it should not grow.

MS DE KLERK: Can we move now to the day of the incident, the 12th of April 1992.  What happened on that day?