Human Rights Violation Hearings — Newcastle — 1996-09-10

WITNESS:   That is correct.  That was the same day.

COMMISSIONER: (Inaudible) ... the names of some of the IFP youth people who were there.  Do you remember who those people were?

WITNESS:   It was Sikananda Mabuso, Dudule Xulu.  I made a mistake somewhere.  On a Monday the 28th the police came to my place, and Dudule was also there when my house was burnt.  He is the one who threw the petrol bomb.  Then on Monday they made other bombs and they said they would not stop to bomb my house until it's burnt down to ashes, because they wanted everything to be burnt down.

COMMISSIONER: (Inaudible) ... when the cars were attacked the ... (intervention)

WITNESS:   The cars were stoned up to St Louis, as well as St Louis.  They broke the windows at  St Louis.  Some were already at the meeting and some were following behind.  They did not go there all at the same

COMMISSIONER: time.  They shot the windows and the Inkatha fixed the windows.

COMMISSIONER: (Inaudible) ... mentioned that the son of the then Minister of Health for KwaZulu Government, Dr Mdlalose, you mentioned that his son was also present, is that right?

WITNESS:   That is correct, Thabo was there, but he has since been deceased.

COMMISSIONER: (Inaudible) ... Thabo, is that right?

WITNESS:   That is correct.

COMMISSIONER: (Inaudible) ... present when these cars were stoned and when your house was burned?

WITNESS:   No, he was present when the cars were being stoned during the day.

COMMISSIONER: (Inaudible) ... after your house was burned that Dr Mdlalose came round, drove round past your house?

WITNESS:  Yes, that is correct, in the morning.  No, he was just passing by.  He looked at my house.  Somebody was driving and he just looked at my house because the car went on slowly, and my children swore at him and I admonished them.  He went away, he never got into my house.

COMMISSIONER: (Inaudible) ... you mentioned the name of a policeman by the name of de Kock.  Was this man a member of the South African Police?  Was he SAP or KwaZulu Police?

WITNESS:   He was here in town.

COMMISSIONER: (Inaudible) ... head of the Security Branch here in Newcastle?

WITNESS:   That is correct.

COMMISSIONER: And the name of the policeman who shot your son, Dumisani, that was Vusi ... (incomplete)

WITNESS:   Vusi Khumalo.

COMMISSIONER: Vusi Khumalo?

WITNESS:   That is correct. KwaZulu Police.   ---   That is correct.

COMMISSIONER: He was arrested and charge for that, but he was

COMMISSIONER: acquitted, is that right - or was there a trial?

WITNESS:   He was not arrested, but we did attend a case.  It was an inquest.

COMMISSIONER: And he was not thereafter charged?  He didn't face a charge of ... (intervention)

WITNESS:   From the inquest, no, there was nothing that was done.  They said this lay in the hands of the KwaZulu Government because the testimony had already shown - the Magistrate asked as to how he had shot him on the back, because he said Dumisani was chasing him.  He said when Dumisani saw the gun he turned his back away from him.  That's how he shot him at the back, because he was having the gun and he wanted to shoot him in the heart.  And the Magistrate was quite surprised by this explanation.

COMMISSIONER: (Inaudible) ... Khumalo now?

WITNESS:   He is in Dundee.  He was transferred immediately after the case.  He was transferred to Dundee.

COMMISSIONER: Mr Kubheka, do you know why your family was targeted by the members of the IFP and the police?

WITNESS:   No, I have got no idea.

COMMISSIONER: (Inaudible) ... because of your son Zwelinjane's trade union activities?

WITNESS:   I think that could possibly be the case, but at the time that he was a member of the union they could not burn my house because that was a union matter.  It had absolutely nothing to do with being a member of a political organisation.

COMMISSIONER: Are you still living in the same house?  Have you rebuilt that house?

WITNESS:   Yes, I am still staying there.

COMMISSIONER: (Inaudible) ... working?

WITNESS:   I am not longer  working.  I left work in 1988 on the 15th of July.  We got retrenched.  I never got into pension, but we were

COMMISSIONER: retrenched.

COMMISSIONER: How are you surviving at the moment?  Are you receiving a pension, or how are you surviving?

WITNESS:   I am not getting any pension.  They said I do not qualify, I am still young.

COMMISSIONER: (Inaudible) ... with your children, your surviving children?

WITNESS:   That is correct.

COMMISSIONER: (Inaudible) ... assisting you?

WITNESS:   They do.

COMMISSIONER: And are you bringing up the children of your son, your grandchildren?  You said Dumisani left three children, is that right?

WITNESS:   It's my children who are maintaining them because I am not working any more.  Even this one I am with is not working.  It's only my eldest son, who is a teacher in Standerton.

COMMISSIONER: (Inaudible) ... said in your statement that you expect the Truth Commission to assist you with bursaries for these children, is that right?

WITNESS:   That is correct.  That is correct.

COMMISSIONER: (Inaudible) ... want to know who the perpetrators were of these things, who burnt your house and ... (intervention)

WITNESS:   That is correct.  I want them to come forward so that I may see them, and I want them to explain as to why they did whatever they did, because even the youths that were being used I want them to come forward and tell the community, as well as me, as to why they were doing this.  As well as Mthethwa.  I want Mthethwa to come forward and explain as to why he withdrew from the case and why he was transferred.

COMMISSIONER: (Inaudible) ... station commander of the police  station?

WITNESS:   That is correct.

COMMISSIONER: (Inaudible) ... now, do you know where he is?

COMMISSIONER: He has just died.  He died this year.

COMMISSIONER: (Inaudible)  ... colleagues if they want to ask any questions.

WITNESS:   Ndudule was arrested by the police, but the case never went on because Inkatha, as well as the police, were now colluding, and I was not even told as to what had happened, whether he came back or he never did.

MR LAX: Thank you, Chairperson.  Mr Kubheka, just two questions.  The first is just to clarify the situation that this chap - you spoke about a Chris Mkhize.  You mentioned the name Chris Mkhize.  Who is that person?

WITNESS:   He has since died.  He was a member of the council, or a councillor.  He was a councillor at section two.

MR LAX: You then spoke about another Mkhize later in connection with the death of Alfred Kubheka and Mkhize.  You said that they were both shot.

WITNESS:   He is the same one.

MR LAX: The second ... (intervention)

WITNESS:   Chris Mkhize was shot first, and Alfred was shot later on when they had already buried Alfred.  He is the one who was a councillor.

MR LAX: So this Mkhize that was a councillor, was he a member of a political party?

WITNESS:   He was a member of Inkatha.

MR LAX: Now, let's talk about Mr Alfred Kubheka for a minute if we could please.  You said that he was your brother.

WITNESS:   He was an Inkatha member, a councillor at section three.

MR LAX: (Inaudible) ... just that he was your brother, is  that right?

WITNESS:   No, he is not my real brother, but because we share the same surnames.

MR LAX: Okay.  So he was just another IFP leader in the area?

WITNESS:   That is correct.

MR LAX: You've spoken a lot about Mlaba.  He is the lawyer, Kwenza Mlaba, is that right?

WITNESS:   That is correct.  He is in Durban.  He is working at Casanova.

MR LAX: (Inaudible) ... to get the details of all the cases where he represented your family would you have any objections to that?

WITNESS:   (No reply)

MR LAX: Would you give us permission to speak to him to get details of all the cases where he represented your family?

WITNESS:   That is correct, as well as Gaja.

MR LAX: (Inaudible) ... Gaja?