Special Hearings — Women's Hearings — 1997-07-29

CHAIRPERSON: Our next witness is Nozibonelo Maria Mxathule.  What is your language preference?

NOZIBONELO MARIA MXATHULE: Swana.

CHAIRPERSON: Swana.  Okay, I will assist you in taking an oath.

NOZIBONELO MARIA MXATHULE: (Duly sworn in, states).

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you.  Can you assist us with the channel please, as to where.

INTERPRETER: Swana is on channel four.

CHAIRPERSON: Channel four.

INTERPRETER: Swana is on channel four.

INTERPRETER: English on channel two.

CHAIRPERSON: I will ask you to tell the Commission a little bit about yourself and how you got involved and then also to talk to your story.

NOZIBONELO MARIA MXATHULE: I thank you for this opportunity to appear before the Commission and also tell my story about the past.  I therefore thank you.  I will start about the 1991 matter, about Mr Willard and Douglas Mandla.  Douglas Mandla was a person that I struggled with in the ANC and was an informer or rather friendly with the police.  We were not quite aware that this person was betraying us.  In 1991, on the fourth of May at about nine o' clock Mr Willard called at my place.  He used the next doors telephone number.  I stay at 1003.  When he phoned I answered the telephone.  Ambrose Ndlovu was there.  As he answered the telephone he asked him who he was.  He said I am Picilie.  He said he wanted me to come and assist him to remove a room divider, because they were fitting in ceramic tiles in the bedroom.  They shifted the room divider into the diningroom.  The third piece of the room divider was taken to his bedroom.  This son said, I said to this son that go and tell Picilie that I will not be able to come to his place, I am working. I was cleaning the kitchen floor at that time.
 When this child arrived, said Picilie wants to see you.  I said, no, I would not be able to go there, go and assist that person, because this boy was visiting me during school holidays.  When he came back the second time he stated that this person is your neighbour, I do not know the person.  However, the boy was angry.  When I enquired why he did not explain.  I went out of the house.  As I entered this person's place, we moved the first piece of the room divider.  We got the second one.  The third one was in his bedroom.  He entered first into the bedroom.  As I was about to pull the room divider he kicked the door and then I started asking what he was doing.  
 He said you are aware and you could see what I was doing.  He pulled me, started kicking.  Now we were fighting and struggling for him not to close the door.  He managed to kick me.  I was fighting back.  He grabbed the hand gun on top of the speaker.  He tried to hit me three times on the head, but I used my left hand to block that blow.  He could not manage to hit me.  I was bleeding on my leg and I did not stand any good chance to defend myself.  I managed to push him the other way and as I tried to run away he called at me and I found that he had a gun in his hand, but he could not manage to shoot at me.  
 There was this one Lungile, who was a Comrade, in the diningroom.  We were together in the struggle.  As I entered the gate Lungile left Picilie's house through the diningroom's door.  I told what happened, but she said that this person was just about playing games with me.  I was bleeding then, rather menstruating on that day.  As I entered the house, I phoned, my house I phoned his wife, Jubatine, who had worked at Klerksdorp.  His wife came.  As they came in they jumped over the fence.  His wife came to my place.  We talked to each other and stated that she will meet Picilie and Picilie's father and his mother so that when we address this issue, Picilie should be present.
 After four days I asked Lungile as I have been bringing my father back and forth here and he is quite sickly.  She told me I am late.  His, her husband does not stay at home and that is how the matter was dealt with up till today.  The reason for this having happened was that because my husband is a cripple.  His right hand is lame.  He never even came to ask for forgiveness from me.  This has happened over seven years.  We do not even speak, we are not even on speaking terms with each other up till today.  I can forgive him.  I know you can forgive somebody even though they had, they might have hurt you in the past.  I so wish he could come to me, where I stay and ask for forgiveness.  I would forgive him.  
 The second point, in March 1986, on the date I have written on my submission or statement.  I think it is, it was on the second or the third or fourth, we were from a funeral in Kanana, after burying three or four Comrades with whom we were in the struggle with.  We went to the funeral by taxis.  On our way back from that funeral, there was also a funeral at Jubatine involving four kids who were shot by the police.  We attended the funeral and we came back.  On our way back we were walking on foot, because we feared something, that the police staged a roadblock along the route.  We took a different route, because Jubatine and Kanana are closer to each other.
 As we approached Dawu at about past ten, late in the night, before we came to Jubatine we held a meeting.  We left for Jubatine.  En route to Jubatine the police came after us, chased us.  They managed to arrest a few.  We sought refuge at some of the houses.  In Mr Plaatjies street the police appeared.  There were White policemen amongst these Black policemen.  We, some of us sought refuge at Mrs Boyeni's house.  Most of us were left behind.  Some managed to run away.  I hid myself underneath the car.  They managed to get some of the Comrades from different houses.  They pulled me underneath the car, kicked me and assaulted me.  They really tramped on me.  
 Those that I managed to see as they took us in combis and caspirs.  They took us to a guest house.  At this guest house they let us in.  We were bleeding.  They ordered us to strip naked.  They were in a line, a row.  They told us to face the wall.  We stripped naked, all of us, against the wall, boys and girls the same.  They assaulted us.  They assaulted us timeously, because I was already dizzy at that time.  They threw us out on the grass and poured water on us and left us there.  At about six o' clock to seven in the morning they woke us up and ordered us to leave.  We could not, it was difficult.  Some of us were taken by caspirs and some had already passed away.  We were lying on the lawn.  Some of us were taken to the mortuaries.  
 At the moment I have a hearing problem.  I am not physically healthy, but the policemen I identified as CID April, CID Tsetsie, Sergeant Copella, Mohauw Gadiema, CID Kutumela.  They are still around and they are still working in the same positions or rather in the same work they did previously.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very much for sharing with us your experiences.  Just to organise your story, I will try to ask you a few questions really aimed at making sure that we get a clear picture of what you have said.  Did you say you were a member of any political position?  If so, did you hold any position?

NOZIBONELO MARIA MXATHULE: I was a member of the Youth Congress.

CHAIRPERSON: If you say "Bacheng", are you referring to a youth structure?

NOZIBONELO MARIA MXATHULE: I am referring to the Youth Congress.

CHAIRPERSON: Youth of which organisation?

NOZIBONELO MARIA MXATHULE: The ANC Youth League.

CHAIRPERSON: Were there any other women who were actively involved like yourself or you were the only woman in your area?

NOZIBONELO MARIA MXATHULE: There were quite a few of us and some are them are still around.

CHAIRPERSON: When you started off you told about an experience where a man was trying to enter the door.  Can you just give a clear context of that, because the way it came it was not clear enough as to what was the reason behind that.