Amnesty Hearings — Durban — 1998-04-17

MR WILLS: Thank you.  Now I want to spend a little bit of time on paragraph 18, I just want you to refer to that in your affidavit, page 9 of the record.  Basically here's a list of people who you regard and you say here "this I know from personal experience" and from what you were told by Mkhize and from discussions with the IFP leadership that these people had been members of the hit squad set up.  By this are you referring to Mr Mkhize's hit squad or what are you referring to?

ROMEO MBUSO MBAMBO: I am referring to the eSikhawini hit squad and hit squads which existed in KwaZulu Natal.  It should be understood that we were not the only hit squad at eSikhawini.  All the police stations or perhaps all the districts in KwaZulu had their own hit squads operating in those areas but we were based at eSikhawini under the eSikhawini region which had five police stations but at Gommokuta there was a hit squad their as well and in other areas they also had their own hit squads because it has transpired here in the testimony that the Caprivians were distributed to all the police stations so that when this conflict erupted between the IFP and ANC, especially strong here in KwaZulu Natal, all these Caprivians in these areas started to be used as was the case in eSikhawini.

MR WILLS: Yes can you just for the sake of clarity and for the benefit of those persons who don't have the bundle in front of them, just read those names into the record?

ROMEO MBUSO MBAMBO: First in my statement is Prince Gideon Zulu who was Minister of Pensions in the then KwaZulu Government followed by M.Z. Khumalo whom we called Isindaba, that was his code name and we also had Dalkolo Luthuli also known as Mdlandula whom we called Nicky.  We also had Robert Msemela who was Secretary of the Legislative Assembly.  We also had Mrs Umbiasi whom we called Mokabai.  We also had Brigadier Mate who was a General at the time of my writing the statement.  We also had Captain Hlungwane who was then Major and he was Mpobo, that was his code name.  We also had Captain Shlengwa who was working in the IFP office in Durban, he is now retired.  We also had Msemela who District Commandant at eSikhawini.  We also had Captain Nkunu also in eSikhawini and we had Major Nsama at Inzundumbili, Sipiwhe Umviani who was at Umlazi at the time, Brian Dlamkhize, Lesley Unkulhize who a member of the hit squad under the B.S.I. at Ulundi.  Peter Nsami, Joyful  who is here at Ensilini, Zwele David Dlamini and another Z.G. Dlamini, Israel Hlungwane and Cele, we used to called him Mr Cele, he originally came from Inglangobo and he was a driver at the Chief Minister's department and we also have M.R. Mkhize who was in charge of the IFP office at Empangeni and Constable P.S. Nglovu we called him Umbusifele, that was his other name.  We also had Mandla Umtuno called Swanepoel and we had Matenja also known as Matengo, Lucky Umbiasi, Bernard Mlambo, Sibo Umbiasi, Chief Mmtaba also called Ngambi and Constable Mia who used to work at Unzundumbile and others who are not mentioned here in this statement.

MR WILLS: I see from this that in fact the minority of these names are those that were associated with hit squad in eSikhawini, most of those are from other areas, is that correct?

ROMEO MBUSO MBAMBO: That is correct.

MR WILLS: Now we've indicated, I mean Mr Mkhize has indicated that he after you accepted this honour as you describe it, he gave you certain training with certain weapons and you detail that in paragraphs 19 and 20 and I see that a lot of the weapons that you list are clearly not weapons that you can come across legally in this country or particularly then or even today weapons like the AK47, the Scorpion machine gun, Mokorov and Tokorov pistols, the Stechcom, RGD5's, RPG7's, PE4 explosives.  Where did you get these things from?

ROMEO MBUSO MBAMBO: These weapons came from different places.  Some came from the Port Danford camp where Thomas Buthelezi resided, he was a Caprivian and others came from the hit squad base at Umkuzi and some came from Ulundi.

MR WILLS: Where did you train?

ROMEO MBUSO MBAMBO: I trained at Port Danford and from that place we would take guns, go to the eSikhawini beach at Port Danford and there are no people in that area and that's where I did my training and I would come back to eSikhawini.

MR WILLS: Now you're obviously a KwaZulu policeman with normal regular police duties as a Detective Constable at the time when you were doing this training not so?

ROMEO MBUSO MBAMBO: Yes. That is correct.

MR WILLS: How did you do this training at the same time, weren't there questions asked about your whereabouts?

ROMEO MBUSO MBAMBO: I was a Detective Constable at the eSikhawini Police Station.  Dina Mkhize was also a constable and there were officers who were Lieutenants but it appeared as if we were above them in rank.  We came to eSikhawini at our own time and left as well as we wished and nobody would question that, nobody would question our movement because the Commanding Officer knew what we were doing and therefore all these Branch Commanders under whom we worked did not have a say in what we were doing.

MR WILLS: So in other words although ostensibly you were a Detective Constable where my understanding of the police is that when you arrive, you have to arrive in the morning and there's a military roll call to check to see if you're there and your day is regimented in the sense that people know where you are all the time.  You didn't suffer those same limitations or those same restrictions?

ROMEO MBUSO MBAMBO: No not at all and ever since I became a police I never took leave but I was not always at the station, there were times where I was required.  There was no where I took a sick leave but I was not always at work and for example if a police is always absent from work and sick leave forms are filled such a police would be fired on the basis that he is not doing his job properly, he is deserting because he is not always present.  I don't have any sick leave form in my file you can even go and check now and yet I was always at Ulundi at Chief Mataba's place, Chief Umsimela, Chief Umshasi and all of these other places.

MR WILLS: You also received training from Mr Mkhize in respect of house penetration, buddy buddy system, tracking reconnaissance and infiltration and sniping, is that correct?

ROMEO MBUSO MBAMBO: That is correct.

MR WILLS: Mr Chairperson, Members of the Committee, I am going on to this next area which starts at page 21 which I do want to deal with in a bit of detail because this applicant was in fact together with Prince Gideon Zulu at this attack so I would like at this stage to adjourn for the weekend.

CHAIRPERSON: I think it would be a convenient time, I see it's just before one o'clock as well Mr Wills.  As mentioned earlier we will not be able to be sitting this afternoon and we therefore are postponing this matter now until next Monday morning, that will be the 20th April 1998, that's next Monday at this hall at 9.30 in the morning.  We'll continue then.  Thank you.
WITNESS EXCUSED
COMMITTEE ADJOURNS
 
ON RESUMPTION ON 20TH APRIL 1998   -   DAY 7

ROMEO MBUSO MBAMBO: (s.u.o.)

MR WILLS: Thank you Mr Chairman, Members of the Committee.
	Mr Mbambo can you hear me okay?  I just want to - before I start - to remind you of the comment made by the Committee Member Mrs Khampepe - the Committee Members are all writing notes so I just want you to relax if it's possible and just talk slowly so that people can clearly hear you and clearly have time to take notes.  If at any stage you get tired and you request a break you must make that request.
	Mr Mbambo, when we left on Friday lunchtime, you had read into the record a list of names which appears on page 9 and 10 of the record and it's your paragraph number 18.  Can you turn to that in your affidavit?

ROMEO MBUSO MBAMBO: Yes I've located it.