Amnesty Hearings — Boksburg — UNKNOWN

UNKNOWN: Did you believe that therefore that killing was part of the duty of the SDU to protect the community?

TSEKIMYANA RODRICK SINGO: Yes, I understood it that way, that that killing was to protect myself and to protect the community, as I've explained that when they were interrogated, they said they were instructed to kill every member of the SDU's, they were following a list.   As Blanko was the chairperson of SDU.

CHAIRPERSON: Bulelwa was not a member of the SDU, was she?

TSEKIMYANA RODRICK SINGO: Bulelwa was not a member of the SDU.

CHAIRPERSON: And from your understanding, they wanted to kill the members of the SDU?

TSEKIMYANA RODRICK SINGO: Yes, it was like that, that they were going to kill all members of the SDU's, as they were following a list, as instructed.

CHAIRPERSON: Yes.   Are you aware of the rumour that Bulelwa was killed by the SDU?

TSEKIMYANA RODRICK SINGO: I did not hear that rumour that Bulelwa was killed by SDU, I know that, I heard that Bulelwa was killed by the youth, together with Blanko as they were killed.

CHAIRPERSON: Do you know why the Youth League would have wanted to kill Bulelwa if she's not a member of the SDU and if they had a list of SDU members that they wanted to kill?

TSEKIMYANA RODRICK SINGO: I would not know, sir.

CHAIRPERSON: Yes, thank you.

UNKNOWN: Now, let's assume that the SDU members were indeed killed by these youths as they threatened.   Now, my
question is, would that act have left the community unprotected?

TSEKIMYANA RODRICK SINGO: Yes, Your Honour, because as we were protecting the community.

UNKNOWN: I have no further questions, Mr Chairman.
NO FURTHER QUESTIONS BY ADV MADASA

MR MAPOMA: You say Mchebe instructed that they be taken to the veld and did not explain what to be done about them in the veld, is that what you said?

TSEKIMYANA RODRICK SINGO: He said they should be killed.

MR MAPOMA: So when you were sjambokking them on the way to the veld, you were aware that they were going to be killed?

TSEKIMYANA RODRICK SINGO: At that time when I was sjambokking them, I was not aware that they were going to be killed, I thought they were going to be beaten, but he said they should be killed.

MR MAPOMA: When exactly did he say they should be killed, at the veld or when you were on the way to the veld?

TSEKIMYANA RODRICK SINGO: When we were at the shack, when they were locked in the shack, but I didn't hear that, when we left I didn't hear that instruction that they were going to be killed, I only learnt that from the scene.

MR MAPOMA: Did he repeat the instructions on the scene, that they must be killed now, is that what you're saying?

TSEKIMYANA RODRICK SINGO: When we arrived at the veld, he shot, then operators who were armed followed with the shooting.

MR MAPOMA: Now did you get any instruction from Mchebe to kill them?

CHAIRPERSON: I thought Mchebe issued an order that these people must be killed?

MR MAPOMA: Yes, chairperson, I want to find out from him if he did get the instruction, because he says in his evidence that he was not aware that Mchebe said they must be killed, that's what I want ...(intervention).

CHAIRPERSON: At what stage, at what stage, I mean is it an issue that Mchebe issued an order that these individuals be killed, because the evidence we've heard so far is that Mchebe issued an order that these people must be killed?

MR MAPOMA: Thank you, chairperson.

CHAIRPERSON: Is it an issue?

MR MAPOMA: I thought, chairperson, it is an issue insofar as he is concerned, because he himself did not get an instruction to kill.

CHAIRPERSON: Yes.   Ask him then.

MR MAPOMA: Did you, as a person, get instructions from Mchebe to kill?

TSEKIMYANA RODRICK SINGO: He gave me an order, because we were many, I saw people going out and they were saying, "Mchebe said these people should be killed".   He gave me that order even if I did not hear that order, but he was instructing each and every member of the SDU.

MR MAPOMA: So you did not kill anyone, even though you heard the instruction to kill?

TSEKIMYANA RODRICK SINGO: No sir, I did not kill a person.

MR MAPOMA: Thank you, no further questions.
NO FURTHER QUESTIONS BY MR MAPOMA
NO RE-EXAMINATION BY ADV MADASA

CHAIRPERSON: Mr Sibanyoni?

MR SIBANYONI: Thank you, Mr Chairperson.   Mr Singo, where did you get the sjambok from?

TSEKIMYANA RODRICK SINGO: I don't know from whom I took it from, because I was the person who was going to work, I joined them at Blanko's place, I took it from a certain person, because many people were having different kinds of, assortments of arms, so I took, I took that sjambok from somebody.

MR SIBANYONI: Were you specifically instructed to beat, to hit these youth, or you only used your discretion as to what contribution you should make?

TSEKIMYANA RODRICK SINGO: I hit somebody when he was brought, even if I don't know his name, that they were responsible for Blanko's murder.

MR SIBANYONI: Now, during the actual killing at the veld, is there anything whatsoever which you did?

TSEKIMYANA RODRICK SINGO: During the killing, I did not do anything, as I've already explained that I had only a sjambok.

MR SIBANYONI: When they were tied, did you take any part in tying them?

TSEKIMYANA RODRICK SINGO: No sir, I did not take part.

MR SIBANYONI: How were they tied, were they tied all of them together or in certain groups?

TSEKIMYANA RODRICK SINGO: They were tied with one rope.

MR SIBANYONI: These youths allegedly, or they were suspected of having killed some people at night, and specifically they were suspected of having killed Majosi, yet they were never killed at that stage, it's only when they killed Blanko and Bulelwa that they were killed, and to me it appears as if it was either retaliation or revenge on the part of the SDU who were now saying they've killed another member of the SDU and Bulelwa, who was supportive of the SDU.   What would be your reaction to that?

TSEKIMYANA RODRICK SINGO: During the death of Mr Majosi, I know nothing because I was staying at Khumalo Section, I came later, then I learned from rumours that Mr Majosi was killed by, was killed together with his two cousins.

MR SIBANYONI: The crux of my question is, had these youths continued to hijack, to loot and kill other people and not members of the SDU, they would not be killed.   What is your response to that?

TSEKIMYANA RODRICK SINGO: With my own observation, I would say that they were killed because they killed Comrade Blanko and Comrade Bulelwa, as they continued killing.

MR SIBANYONI: When there were hijackings, lootings, were members of the community able to say the perpetrators are members of the ANC Youth League, or were they just saying the perpetrators were members of the SDU, could the community make any distinction between ANC Youth League members and SDU members?

TSEKIMYANA RODRICK SINGO: The committee knew.   I remember one day when the meeting was called to talk about the lootings and the hijackings, things like that, it was found out that where we met there was a car which has been left in a ditch, and the other issues that in the meeting a certain van came with a group of youth driven by Vips.

MR SIBANYONI: Now what was the allegation from the community?   Was the allegation that the people who are causing trouble are members of the ANC Youth League or are members of the SDU?

TSEKIMYANA RODRICK SINGO: The community tried to reprimand them as they were there in the meeting, that people should disassociate themselves with criminality, they knew that it was the Youth League.

MR SIBANYONI: Thank you, Mr Chairperson, no further questions.

CHAIRPERSON: Mr Malan?

MR MALAN: No questions, thank you.

CHAIRPERSON: Mr Motata?

ADV MOTATA: I've got no questions, Mr Chair.

CHAIRPERSON: Mr Madasa, is there any re-examination?

UNKNOWN: No re-examination.
NO RE-EXAMINATION BY ADV MADASA

CHAIRPERSON: Mr Mapoma?