Human Rights Violation Hearings — Ladybrand — 1997-06-25

WITNESS:   Those who I was detained with.  Our decision was to start a hunger strike.  We were 16 in all.  We started on the 24th, and after seven days the comrades requested us to withdraw the hunger strike.  I was left on my own.  I said no more turning back.  In our cells we wrote on the walls, "Release or death."  Now, all the comrades having withdrawn themselves - at that time there were already MK comrades who were sentenced.  According to the prison law we were not supposed to mix with such people.   I was now on the eighth day of my hunger strike, and one of the already-sentenced members of the MK came to me.  He came to convince me to withdraw from then hunger strike.  I was opposed to his idea.  I said to him, "It's so funny that you come here today to convince me."  He said to me, "No, I asked permission to come and see you."  On the ninth day I was vomiting blood.  They then took a decision to take me to Pelonomi Hospital.  When I arrived at the hospital the doctors put a pipe in my stomach, checking what was going on, and they informed me to withdraw that action because I had already developed ulcers.  I refused, I carried on with the hunger strike.  I was alone, all my visits were cancelled, nobody was allowed entry.  I remember it was on the 9th, but I just happened to forget the day.  It was the 9th of January 1989.  The head of the Security Branch, Lieutenant Coetzee, and others arrived with the doctor, and the prison doctor said he was not going to examine me at all, he was not going to attend to me at all.  They decided to take me again to Pelonomi.  I do not know what were they checking because I was weak.  I felt a needle between my fingers, and after that I was strong, but I did not show them that I was strong, I pretended to be in that position of weakness.  And the same evening they gave me a fax that they sent to Mr Vlok requesting my release.  On the 17th I was informed that I was going to be released because I had already withdrew from the hunger strike and I started eating.  What happened was on the 20th in the morning I was told to pack my belongings and leave.  When I arrived in their offices I was given a form to sign.  They said I will only be released provided I sign the form, and that was a restriction form, I was restricted.  And I refused to sign that form.  I totally refused.  I said, "You had better take me back to the cell," until the prison manager referred me to the offices of the Security Branch to give me an explanation.  I left the prison without signing that document.  When I arrived the two comrades who had been released before me - the other one is Carlo Letsabi, he's a selector, and the other one is Comrade Motsabi - they signed that restriction.  Now, realising that they had already signed the document I was forced to sign, and this restriction did not allow me any movement.  I was allowed to leave my house at 5 o'clock in the morning, and 6 o'clock in the evening I should be back.  And between those hours I should have reported to the police station.  And every night at 9 o'clock the police came to my house to check on me.  I have already mentioned the issue of incorporation of Botshabelo to Qwa Qwa.  That was a very terrible time.  Dikwankwetla Party had formed a vigilante group called the reserves.  These people were using axes and spears.  They were attacking the comrades.  Now, when every car went into the yard as they were checking me I did not know whether it was the policemen or their hit squads, because I was arrested in my house.  Now, in that same year as the year was progressing MDM, the Mass Democratic Movement, took a decision that all the restricted people countrywide should defy those restrictions.  If I am not mistaken it was on the 27th of August in 1989.  Everybody who was restricted defied that restriction.  Myself and other comrades, like Trevor Manuel, Segayo, except the stalwarts.  The stalwarts defied the restrictions and the youth were involved in this action.  The MDM, through the SACC, helped them with cars.  They provided the men with cars so that they could not be found.  On the 37th day of my running away I took a decision to hand myself in.  I was at Qwa Qwa, I remember.  That was when I met Dikwankwetla, and some of the members of Botshabelo were in Qwa Qwa.  I was chased away like a dog until I survived in Bethlehem.  When I arrived in Botshabelo everywhere I stopped to get food the police were there, and I had to be on the run again.  I went to Smithfield to spend some time there.  Because I was already in the run for a long time I decided to give myself in.  As all these things were happening my family was affected, because my wife left me, she went to her parents.  I went to see them and I gave them the few rands that I had in ... (inaudible - end of Side A, Tape 4) ... at the office where I am working.  One issue that contributed to myself giving myself in was that we had permits that we applied for, and I had to apply twice a week, and this permit was issued when they felt it was necessary for them to keep me, and if it wasn't necessary they would not provide me with a permit.  Now, the members of my organisation were aware now that the police are not - they said they are aware that I don't want to work any more, I was not now on the run.  That is when I decided to give myself in.  The police came in large numbers with the South African Defence Force, and they picked me, they took me to Park Road Police Station.  When I arrived there the Park Road Police did not allow me in their premises.  I was then taken to Botshabelo.  Now, the police in Botshabelo said they will accept me.  I appeared before the Court on Monday and I was charged with 41 counts.  Now the problem was to find a lawyer for myself.  They borrowed me their telephone so that I can inform my office.  I did inform the office, and after that they came to me, they said that head office found me a lawyer.  When this lawyer arrived he said he was given a mandate to negotiate on my behalf the bail, and the bail was R500,00.  The week after the bail day I was supposed to appear before Court.  This lawyer was June Oosthuizen.  He was working for Webbers.  And the lawyer informed me to plead guilty.  That was after submitting my statement of being on the run, and the lawyer said I should plead guilty.  I refused, but not to June.  When I appeared before the Court I was told to plead guilty or not, and the lawyer stood up and said I am guilty.  I jumped and I said, "No ways.  I am not guilty.  You are no more my representative."  I told him there and then.  Now, the decision taken by the Court was that my bail should be withdrawn because there was a piece of paper saying I did not follow the proper channels of bail.  At a certain time the police went to my house to check me and I was not at home, and that's how the bail was withdrawn.  I was taken back to prison, and that was the start of the trial.  I spent three months and I did not have any lawyer to represent me so that I could be given bail, until I transport the message with one of the prison warders, Mr Tsokolo.  He was in a position to call Ismael Ayob's firm to come and negotiate bail on my behalf.  Advocate Hussain was able to negotiate a bail on my behalf and I was given a R1 000,00 bail.  Can I carry on?

CHAIRPERSON: I would like you to carry on, but if you could start to tell us about the incident in March 1990 when you were detained and accused of shooting children.