Amnesty Hearings — Durban — 1999-10-12

HELEN BLOSSOM KEARNEY: I'd say about 180 people squeezed into that tiny space in Magoo's bar.  I'd say the Why Not bar had about 160 people and Garfunkel's tables were full.

MR RICHARD: And how many people could be seated in Garfunkel's?

HELEN BLOSSOM KEARNEY: In Garfunkel's approximately 200 people.

MR RICHARD: Now why do you recall so clearly that?

HELEN BLOSSOM KEARNEY: Well I work, that is my work log, this is something that you learn and this is something that you cope with.  As far as getting stocks and seeing how many people are in bars you know exactly when the fridges are empty to the clientele which you need in the pub.

MR RICHARD: Now let's start with the residential hotel part.  How many rooms?

HELEN BLOSSOM KEARNEY: We have five floors and we have eighty rooms and on the first floor we have twenty three back rooms down the side and round the back which was let out to students of all walks of life and different colours, elderly people, for accommodation.

MR RICHARD: When you say to students of all sorts and walks of life and colours?

HELEN BLOSSOM KEARNEY: Yes.

CHAIRPERSON: Sorry, you say those twenty three back rooms they were let out to what you may call permanents, people who would take it for a month or even a year maybe?

HELEN BLOSSOM KEARNEY: Students, permanents, yes residents, yes.  They had to sign for three months.

CHAIRPERSON: So yes, you would classify them as permanents and they would do their own thing in their room, they didn't have to rely on Garfunkel's for their dinner or anything like that?

HELEN BLOSSOM KEARNEY: Not at all, no.

MR RICHARD: Chairperson, it has been indicated to me that my two clients to my left need to go home to their families and children and may they be excused?

CHAIRPERSON: Certainly.  Thank you.

MR RICHARD: And Ms Kearney also indicated to me that she is expected at work shortly.  May I ask for how long it would be?

CHAIRPERSON: I don't know how long any cross-questioning would take but otherwise we can decide when we finish here how much time she needs and maybe do cross-examination tomorrow.  Just depending, I don't know if we can get some indication of how long.

HELEN BLOSSOM KEARNEY: No problem.

CHAIRPERSON: I don't know how long you will be Mr Richards?  When do you have to be at work?

HELEN BLOSSOM KEARNEY: 5 o'clock.

CHAIRPERSON: 5 o'clock?  I think it would be better if we could get to the end of evidence-in-chief, you know, rather than adjourning midway?

MR RICHARD: Certainly.  Now you said people of all races and colours were ...(intervention)

HELEN BLOSSOM KEARNEY: Permanent residents, yes.

MR RICHARD: Were there any police, soldiers, sailors, traffic cops?

HELEN BLOSSOM KEARNEY: Permanent residents?  No, no.

MR RICHARD: Now that was on the first floor?

HELEN BLOSSOM KEARNEY: That is correct.

MR RICHARD: Now on the second to fifth floors?

HELEN BLOSSOM KEARNEY: Second to fifth floors, second was mainly staff, there were a few rooms that were let out to clientele which I mean is the day-trippers coming in for two days or one day at a time.  Third, fourth and fifth floors were for holidaymakers, tourists or whoever wanted to book into the hotel.

MR RICHARD: Was there any colour bar on who may take accommodation?

HELEN BLOSSOM KEARNEY: No, definitely not, not in five floors.  At one stage we had some Kenyan people down for seven days seminar and they had the fifth floor.

MR RICHARD: And if a local South African of colour?

HELEN BLOSSOM KEARNEY: They could choose any room they wanted, there was no difference.

MR RICHARD: Now you've heard mention of a Dunnottar motor cycle gang have you ever ...(intervention)

HELEN BLOSSOM KEARNEY: No, I have to correct that, there was no such thing as a Dunnottar Motor Cycle Club, it was a Dunnottar Air Base Club.  They used to come down once every two years, 19 year olds to about 22, 23 year olds with a major or a lieutenant and even fly down in their Dakotas and were given Friday and Saturday as a weekend off for entertainment and they came down to the entertainment that was offered them.

CHAIRPERSON: Was that quite a big group of them that would come?

HELEN BLOSSOM KEARNEY: It was about twenty four of them, yes, with the lieutenant, but it was not a motor cycle club, it was the Dunnottar Air Base club.

MR RICHARD: Now how often would that happen?

HELEN BLOSSOM KEARNEY: That was the general thing for about two years at a time.

MR RICHARD: Every second year?

HELEN BLOSSOM KEARNEY: Every second year.

MR RICHARD: And would other members of that air base come and stay there at any other time?

HELEN BLOSSOM KEARNEY: No, not to my knowledge.

MR RICHARD: Now during the six months prior to the 14th June, had the Dunnottar Air Base people been in the hotel.

HELEN BLOSSOM KEARNEY: They had been the previous year April, around April.

MR RICHARD: That is April '85?

HELEN BLOSSOM KEARNEY: That's right.

MR RICHARD: Had they been there at any time after?

HELEN BLOSSOM KEARNEY: No, no.

MR RICHARD: Thank you.  Now your vantage of being both a barlady and then chief barperson, did you know your clientele?

HELEN BLOSSOM KEARNEY: Pretty well.

MR RICHARD: Now would you have known whether any people fitting into the descriptions of soldiers, sailors, firemen, traffic cops, Security personnel?

HELEN BLOSSOM KEARNEY: Yes, I would know.

MR RICHARD: Now did they frequent your hotel?

HELEN BLOSSOM KEARNEY: A lot did, they're from all walks of life, we never had - the first law we learnt when we went into the hotel trade was we were given a sheet of paper and under no circumstances those days with the laws were we allowed to serve anybody in uniform, whether it be fire brigade, policemen, whether it be traffic department, or motor bike policemen, we were told no uniform was allowed to be - anybody in uniform was allowed to be served.  As far as plain clothed, we did have, we did have, we had plain clothed policemen there on various occasions, we had traffic departments, we had the fire brigade, I got to know all these people.

MR RICHARD: And indeed you told me that in fact it was a group of about twenty?

HELEN BLOSSOM KEARNEY: At the most, yes.

MR RICHARD: That you got to know?

HELEN BLOSSOM KEARNEY: Yes.

MR RICHARD: Now it is also correct that at no one stage did all twenty come as a cohesive group?

HELEN BLOSSOM KEARNEY: I have never seen that.

MR RICHARD: And ...(intervention)

CHAIRPERSON: Sorry, just to get this into perspective I just want to find out what you're saying Ms Kearney, you say that you knew about twenty of these - let's call them servicemen?

HELEN BLOSSOM KEARNEY: Yes.

CHAIRPERSON: Be they policemen or firemen or whatever.

HELEN BLOSSOM KEARNEY: Yes.

CHAIRPERSON: Are you saying that they were the only twenty who came there?

HELEN BLOSSOM KEARNEY: Oh no, I don't say that ...(intervention)

CHAIRPERSON: They're the ones that you got to know.

HELEN BLOSSOM KEARNEY: Yes, the ones that I knew, that I could actually say that he's a cop, he's a security man or he's from the traffic department or he's the head surfer from the Surfing Association.  That I knew.

CHAIRPERSON: Yes.

MR RICHARD: Now if of that group of twenty, let me rephrase that, sorry, you are saying that if you were to count the number of people falling within the definition that we've outlined and frequented the hotel over a six month, one year period, you say it would total twenty?

HELEN BLOSSOM KEARNEY: At one time.

MR BERGER: Chairperson, the witness never said that and my learned friend is now leading evidence himself.

CHAIRPERSON: Yes I think she's basically said that she can say that servicemen did attend regularly, she knows about twenty of them.

MR RICHARD: Now how many might possibly ever have been there at one time?

CHAIRPERSON: Are you talking of the people she knew?

MR RICHARD: Yes.

HELEN BLOSSOM KEARNEY: Well in each different category?

MR RICHARD: In the whole category.