Special Hearings — Helderberg Flight Special Hearing — 1998-06-03

JOHAN LODEWIKUS STEYL: Let me answer it in this way, when we chartered a plane we would tell the owner of the plane or the crew of the plane what these commodities were.  They then submitted their flight plans, worked out their own route and ...(indistinct) their flight plans, and we left it to them to make the necessary flight arrangements.  We in Armscor did not notify the neighbouring countries the plane needed overflight rights, but we didn't notify the neighbouring countries that a plane was about to cross their airspace and that it had specific armourments on board.  That we did not do.

UNKNOWN: What would have happened if there was such a flight containing dangerous cargo on board and also cargo which needed to be kept a secret from the numerous countries that were hostile toward us at the time and should not have known about our armourments, what would have happened if such a plane encountered some difficulties or problems?  What would Armscor's approach have been?

JOHAN LODEWIKUS STEYL: I don't think we could have acted prescriptively towards the crew, the captain was at all times aware of what he was conveying and he was in charge of the plane.  We had basically no radio communication with him once he was air-borne, we did have communication with his owners.  But if he was in trouble and he had to make a crash-landing or emergency landing, that would have been the decision of the captain of the plane.

UNKNOWN: Would Armscor in all cases have owned the person as the person flying with their cargo?

JOHAN LODEWIKUS STEYL: Obviously Armscor was running a risk, it had a risk because it was placing cargo in possession of a conveyer or a carrier and the only claim which Armscor had against the carrier was this cargo manifest accompanying the cargo, and on this document there was an addressee, a person to whom it was being sent.  And if this plan was to land, the Authorities of that country would obviously have known who the sender was and who the addressee was and what the commodity was.

UNKNOWN: Unless of course the plane landed up in the sea?

JOHAN LODEWIKUS STEYL: I have my doubts about the question or the answer to that, because there are certain cargo documents that would not necessarily be on the plane, there would be, for instance, air freight letters or cargo manifests which the owners of the plane would have in their possession.  In other words, they would be able to state or explain should the plane go missing what exactly the cargo was and where was it going to.

UNKNOWN: Captain Deon Storm who was a pilot in the South African Airways, a former Air Force pilot and also later a security officer at Jan Smuts, he said that they did a kind of a spot check which indicated that almost 80%, I just have to verify that, say 60% of all cargo which was not declared or declared incorrectly, contained military or military type or Armscor type of cargo.

JOHAN LODEWIKUS STEYL: I can't comment on that because when we received cargo or when we sent cargo off, I was operating on the information given to me or to my people.  We never did any inspections or it was very seldom that inspections were done to see whether the actual content of the consignment corresponded with the freight documents, so I can't comment on that.

UNKNOWN: So you say you're not aware of any such thing, that it actually occurred?

JOHAN LODEWIKUS STEYL: I am aware, or I believe that most of the cargo was vaguely defined, I'm not talking about dangerous stuff or explosives, I'm not talking about that being defined or described as harmless, but for instance if there were aeroplane spare parts being shipped, it might just be vaguely described as parts, and the particulars would not be given.

UNKNOWN: It is quite co-incidental that you mention that example, because Captain Storm and somebody else also said that, Mr Rene van Zyl of the Civil Aviation Directorate, they both said that virtually all Armscor goods incorrectly described was described as plane spare parts.

JOHAN LODEWIKUS STEYL: That may be, but I must also point out that by far the majority of these consignments were actually aeroplane spare parts.

MS PATTA: I'd like to just read you something from a former Armscor employee,
"That South Africa's Ammonium Perchlorate production facility was set up in the 1970's at Somchem.  The initial capacity of this plant was about 100 tons per annum.  Around the time of the Helderberg crash South Africa was involved in military operations in Angola, Namibia and on the home front.  The operational demand for solid rocket fuels was high, also around the time of the crash Armscor was busy developing the means to produce its own inter-continental missile ballistic programme using US technology obtained in a devious manner by Israel.  The development programme was getting well advanced about then, with full-scale rockets being tested and at a new secret test facility near Rooi Els.  I mention the ICBM to emphasise that not only was the military demand for APC high at the time, but the demand for APC to feed these big hungry space rockets was also soaring.  Somchem with its 100 ton per year capacity was not keeping up with the demand.  Of course this had been foreseen and a decision was made to double it.  This involved shutting down the plant for the duration of the extensions.  Because of the on-going demand it was impossible to stock-pile APC prior to the shutdown.  Obviously for a period of several months a large quantity of APC had to be sourced outside the country in defines of prevailing military sanctions.  This was difficult and expensive and I believe that initially the necessary APC supply was sourced from America and that it was brought in on SAA passenger planes as an integral part of the necessary deception."
Are you aware of this, Mr Steyl?

JOHAN LODEWIKUS STEYL: Chairperson, I'm not at all aware of that.  It may be that there were problems with the plant, and if the plant was closed, I can't comment on that, I don't know about that, but that there were that vast amounts of the chemical entering the country, well, I'm not aware of that.  I can't think for one moment that such vast amounts could enter the country commercially from the States and I also can't conceive of such large amounts of the stuff could be brought in in the cargo holds of planes.  You mentioned Israel, the sea transport or traffic between South Africa and Israel was done on such a regular basis that it could actually have been conveyed very easily between South Africa and Israel.

UNKNOWN: I would just like to ask Mr Peyaga something, should I ask you first?

CHAIRPERSON: I can't understand how you can do that, he's not testifying.  You can't, if there's anything that you want to clear with him in his capacity or whatever, I think you should find the time to do that and we can make an arrangement in terms of which we will receive whatever he has to say, but we can't in the middle of putting questions to the witness put other questions to somebody else who is legal representative of that particular person.

UNKNOWN: Is this something that I can read into the record?

CHAIRPERSON: Can we adjourn quickly so that I can appreciate the nature of your request.  We'll adjourn for five minutes.
HEARING ADJOURNS
ON RESUMPTION

JOHAN LODEWIKUS STEYL: (s.u.o.)

CHAIRPERSON: Ms Terreblanche?

UNKNOWN: I don't have any more questions, Ms Patta?

MS PATTA: No.

CHAIRPERSON: Is there something you wanted to place on the record?

UNKNOWN: I would just like to say that I think we really should be addressing some of these questions to a representative of Somchem at the time, either the former MD or the former Procurement Officer, we have the names of, but can't locate, and I think that perhaps Mr Steyl is not the right person.

CHAIRPERSON: Mr Steyl, do you know of anyone from Somchem whom you think would be appropriate to come and address us?