Human Rights Violation Hearings — Lusikisiki — 1997-03-26

MAGDELINA NOMBULELO MATSHAYA: Yes.  I stayed at home and while I was still watching Nombuyiselo's shop I saw that Ndabambi's house was also burning and Ntombentsundu.  I did not know what was happening.
 I went outside and inside the house, I saw Kekeni's white van, a small van and people came out running from that van.    I wondered because I did not see where this van came from, I just asked myself where this van came from and it was said that these people were police and they were chasing the youth.
 I saw houses burning down and Amelia Jozi's house and I saw another house next to Amelia's house being burning down.  I did not know what to do and I could see that my house was also going to be burnt down because my children were members of the ANC.

MS MAYA: You said people came out of Kekeni's van.  When you are speaking of Kekeni, are you talking about Barnabas?

MAGDELINA NOMBULELO MATSHAYA: Yes.

MS MAYA: These people were police and they were chasing these children?

MAGDELINA NOMBULELO MATSHAYA: Yes.

MS MAYA: The police came with Kekeni?

MAGDELINA NOMBULELO MATSHAYA: Yes.

MS MAYA: Who are these children we are talking about?

MAGDELINA NOMBULELO MATSHAYA: It is the  youth, the Youth League of the
ANC.

MS MAYA: Please continue, Ma'am.

MAGDELINA NOMBULELO MATSHAYA: While I was still watching Amelia Jozi's house being burnt down, I saw Velele Miachana's house burning down.
 I saw a group of men and I couldn't stay at home, I went out to look and I saw these men coming to watch my house.  They were coming to me.  I went back to my home, I closed the door.  I was scared, because I thought that they would kill me because they were a group of men.
 I tried to hide outside in the back.  This group of men waited outside.  Kekeni and others went in, they had a white pale and there was something inside that pale.  Kekeni kicked the door and the door opened.
 And the closed the door.  When they went out, there were flames all over.  And Kekeni ordered them to go and take, and fill the pale with the petrol and they went to my other rooms but my other rooms did not burn.
 After that they went out and they went to Ndabambi's house to burn the house again.

MS MAYA: Ma'am, you said that you were in the back of your room.  Did you recognize any of them?

MAGDELINA NOMBULELO MATSHAYA: Yes, I knew all of them.  I knew the men because most of them, they waited outside.  Kekeni and his two workers went inside.

MS MAYA: Thank you Ma'am.  Did you give us these names in your statement?

MAGDELINA NOMBULELO MATSHAYA: Yes.

MS MAYA: Which other houses did you see them burning down?

MAGDELINA NOMBULELO MATSHAYA: I did not see them with the other houses, but I saw him with his men as they were going up the road from
my house, they went to Ndabambi's yard and that house was also burnt down.

MS MAYA: Is that all you have to say Ma'am?

MAGDELINA NOMBULELO MATSHAYA: I think that is it.

MS MAYA: What requests do you have to the Commission?

MAGDELINA NOMBULELO MATSHAYA: Because of my ill health - those days would sleep outside on stones, won't the Commission please help me financially with a pension because I have no money to go to the doctor.

MS MAYA: Did you make a formal request for a pension?

MAGDELINA NOMBULELO MATSHAYA: No, but I go to the clinic.

MS MAYA: Thank you Ma'am.  Is that all?

MAGDELINA NOMBULELO MATSHAYA: My other request, I have children who are at school.  I cannot support them.  We are poor, the father has no work.

MS MAYA: Thank you, we will come back to you.  Can Mr  Miachana now take over please?  Mr Miachana, could you briefly tell us because we've heard the story, please tell us briefly what happened to you on that day?

VELELE MIACHANA: I was next door?

MS MAYA: Where?

VELELE MIACHANA: Next door from my house, I was with my son-in-law.  Somebody said that my house was being burnt.  We went to put off the fire, as we were trying to do that, there was a group that I did not know.
 This person was trying to put the fire out.

MS MAYA: Who?

VELELE MIACHANA: Nobopo.  He was putting the fire out.  Then somebody else said that how can you be putting the light off, the fire out when we are trying to burn this house down.  Then somebody else said that how can you ...

MS MAYA: Do you know who these people are?

VELELE MIACHANA: I cannot point them out.

MS MAYA: And that is how your house was burnt down?

VELELE MIACHANA: Yes.

MS MAYA: Do you have requests before the Commission?  Do you have requests before the  Commission?

VELELE MIACHANA: I cannot hear you well.  My house was burnt down.

MS MAYA: According to your knowledge, why was your house burnt down?

VELELE MIACHANA: I don't know, but my wife sometimes says she asked one of the youth members.  She then said this youth member then said, that one of my children were part of the ANC Youth League.

MS MAYA: Is that all?

VELELE MIACHANA: Yes.

MS MAYA: Eunice Nozizwe Ndaba.  Mrs Ndaba, we agreed that you were going to confirm the evidence and then give us your requests, is that so?

MRS NDABA: Yes.

MS MAYA: Is this evidence as it is, your house was also burnt down?

MRS NDABA: Yes.

MS MAYA: April 1990?

MRS NDABA: Yes.

MS MAYA: What are your requests to the Commission?

MRS NDABA: As my house was burnt down, I request that the Commission - the statement taker said the Commission helped people with compensation.  Two of my houses were burnt down, if the Commission could help me.  I have started building another house.  I am trying to build this house but
I don't have all the finances.  I have two children - one is in the College in Matatiele.  It is very expensive, I cannot afford, I don't have the strength to work for it.  The second child is in matric.  Could the Truth Commission help me with these children?

MS MAYA: We will put forward your requests to the State President, thank you.  Busisiwe Ndabambi, you have also heard the evidence that was put before the Commission that your house was burnt down in 1990.  Is this true?

BUSISIWE NDABAMBI: Yes.

MS MAYA: What are your requests to the Commission?

BUSISIWE NDABAMBI: My requests to the Commission are such that I need a medical aid.  Since 1990, I have been admitted to hospital three times.  The doctor said that I was very ill, I could not even get up.  Twice at Matatiele, I was admitted.  Then to Maritzburg, from Maritzburg to Johannesburg in Hillbrow Hospital.
 Even there I was admitted for two weeks.  I could not be helped fully.  I have a bone ailment, bone ailment.  Since 1990, I have not been back at my normal health.  My back hurts me.  I need some form of medical aid so that whenever I am not well, I can go to the doctor.

MS MAYA: Thank you Ma'am, is that all?  You can proceed.

BUSISIWE NDABAMBI: I don't know whether this is appropriate, my wish as we are sitting here - Kekeni must talk to his wife.  We are dying in the village, his wife was saying anything she would want about us ... (tape ends)

MS MAYA: Amelia Nomatshawe Jozi.  Mrs Jozi, you have heard the evidence before us.

AMELIA NOMATSHAWE JOZI: Yes, Ma'am.

MS MAYA: Your house was burnt down in April 1990?

AMELIA NOMATSHAWE JOZI: Yes, Ma'am.

MS MAYA: Is this evidence true?

AMELIA NOMATSHAWE JOZI: Yes.

MS MAYA: And what are your requests?