Amnesty Hearings — Boksburg — 1998-09-15

MR PRINSLOO: I am speaking under correction but I can't remember which towns were in that specific area but I would say that it would be approximately in the vicinity of Schweizer-Reneke. The map would stipulate it.

ADV GCABASHE: Just for clarity. You drew that map. That is what you said to us yesterday. Am I right?

MR PRINSLOO: Yes, in cooperation with members and information which we received.

ADV GCABASHE: Thank you.

MR MALAN: Chairperson I would just like to ask one more question. I don't know if this witness will be of any more assistance to us. You had orders for operations in PWV area. In other words the Witwatersrand incorporating Pretoria and the Vaal Triangle. In Generals in staff you had a colleague who was your senior in years and experience and in military training and his name was General Japie Oelofse. Other evidence which has been placed before us indicates that he is by nature a military person. So why didn't he receive the orders to carry out these important tasks?

MR PRINSLOO: Because I was at head-office and I had to do it. I am older than General Japie Oelofse.

MR MALAN: I am not asking whether or not you are older. I am speaking about his seniority with regard to military expertise and his involvement in operations as well because you were acting as a secretary, as an administrative person and in two weeks all of a sudden your duties are redefined and you receive different tasks. In a short matter of two weeks and it was because of an important issue of preventing the elections and sowing the psychology of fear. Well in terms of experience Japie Oelofse had, had much more experience with this. So why didn't he receive the tasks?

MR PRINSLOO: Because he had his own region and therefore his own tasks and duties which he had to carry out.

MR MALAN: I would also like to ask you, according to other evidence which was placed before us Japie Oelofse was arrested in the beginning of 1994 after a number of bomb explosions. Do you remember that? Do you know anything about that?

MR PRINSLOO: Yes, that is correct.

MR MALAN: When was he released from prison?

MR PRINSLOO: I think in December 1994 or 1993 he was arrested.

MR MALAN: And for how long was he in detention?

MR PRINSLOO: I can't remember.

MR MALAN: Was he still in detention when this matter took place?

MR PRINSLOO: He spent quite some time in detention and at that point in time he was in detention. I don't know whether or not he was released during that period.

MR MALAN: But he has given evidence of his being present during this period of time. Are you sure that he was present at Fynbos?

MR PRINSLOO: I have said that I am speaking under correction. That these members who were present there, whether or not they were definitely there such as amongst others Japie Oelofse would be uncertain for me to give a definite answer about. I know that he spent time in detention with regard to bomb explosions.

MR MALAN: Why do you say that he had his own region that he was responsible for if he was in detention?

MR PRINSLOO: He was in command of Witwatersrand area.

MR MALAN: But that is my question exactly. Because your area of task was the Witwatersrand area. You would place all your bombs in the Witwatersrand area apart from the one in Pretoria.

MR PRINSLOO: We had to operate in the Witwatersrand.

MR MALAN: In Japie Oelofse's area?

MR PRINSLOO: Yes, that is correct.

MR MALAN: But you were in command in his area?

MR PRINSLOO: No, I was in command in my area.

MR MALAN: To go and operate in his area?

MR PRINSLOO: That is correct. Those were the orders to operate on the East and West Rand.

MS CAMBANIS: Thank you Mr Chairman.  So let us assume for purpose of this question that this was an AWB operation and that the decision to go on indiscriminate killing was taken a couple of weeks before the election. Could you please inform this Committee the decision to go to that form of warfare, when was that decision retracted or has it been retracted by the AWB?

MR PRINSLOO: Well that has always been the viewpoint or the discussion point among others at the staff meetings that members and supporters of the ANC/SACP alliance would be attacked.

MS CAMBANIS: Yes, does that decision to carry on this form of warfare to attain this Volkstaat still exist?

MR PRINSLOO: At this stage?

MS CAMBANIS: Yes.

MR PRINSLOO: No, not at all.

MS CAMBANIS: When was that decision - when was it decided to cease hostility so to speak?

MR PRINSLOO: On the day of the election.

MS CAMBANIS: When on the day of the election?

MR PRINSLOO: Well I can't remember exactly at what time this took place.

CHAIRPERSON: Were you part of that decision?

MR PRINSLOO: To cease everything?

CHAIRPERSON: No, to cease the policy.

MR PRINSLOO: To cessation of the policy of attacking the ANC?

CHAIRPERSON: Yes, well that as well.

MR PRINSLOO: The policy of attacking black people? Well that all formed part of the same thing.

CHAIRPERSON: Well let us call it the terrorism then. Were you part of a meeting during which this decision was made on that day, that day of the election?

MR PRINSLOO: Well this kind of meeting was never held, at least where I was present.

CHAIRPERSON: Then how do you know that it was ceased?

MR PRINSLOO: I am speaking under correction but the night before we received communication from a person who was working at head-office. I can't remember exactly what time on the day before the election.

CHAIRPERSON: Was that person credible?

MR PRINSLOO: Well he was a member of the administrative staff.

CHAIRPERSON: Was he reliable?

MR PRINSLOO: I believe so, yes.

CHAIRPERSON: Did you believe him?

MR PRINSLOO: At that stage I received a report or information that members at the shooting range were arrested or some of them had been arrested.

CHAIRPERSON: When was that?

MR PRINSLOO: On the day of the election.

CHAIRPERSON: I understood you that you received the message the night before the elections that everything is going to be stopped.

MR PRINSLOO: Well on the day of the election, the last bomb that went out, that was the Johannesburg.

CHAIRPERSON: No, when did you receive the message?

MR PRINSLOO: That evening.

CHAIRPERSON: The night before the election? Are we talking about that night?

MR PRINSLOO: No, it was the Monday, the Tuesday we heard about what happened at the shooting range. If you could just help me there.

CHAIRPERSON: No, let us talk in relation to the elections. As I understood your evidence the evening before the elections a message was sent and it was brought by a person who you trusted.

MR PRINSLOO: I was in Ventersdorp when I received this message.

CHAIRPERSON: And you believed it and everything was stopped officially. But why the bomb at the airport then?

MR PRINSLOO: The persons still went out.

CHAIRPERSON: Why, if everything was stopped under your charge or command?

MR PRINSLOO: I had not arrived at the shooting range yet ... to the shooting range and that was where Mr Smit them were already arrested.

CHAIRPERSON: From where did the men go when they planted the bomb at the airport?

MR PRINSLOO: It had to be from the shooting range in the Rustenburg area.

CHAIRPERSON: The bomb at the airport was planted the day of the elections.

MR PRINSLOO: Yes, that is correct.

CHAIRPERSON: Then why weren't those people stopped then? Because everything was stopped.

MR PRINSLOO: Because they left early that morning to the airport.

CHAIRPERSON: But you knew it the previous night and you are in charge of the whole operation. You certainly know where these people are or the men are. Why didn't you tell them to stop and wait?

MR PRINSLOO: There was a stage or time as with the members at Koesterfontein that we did not exactly know 24 hours a day where all the members were. The same with the people who would be responsible for the airport.

CHAIRPERSON: Did you try and get hold of them?