Human Rights Violation Hearings — George — 1996-06-19

MS SEROKE: What was happening in your area that was showing any oppression and showing that you were fighting that?

MR CLAASEN: [No audible answer]

MS SEROKE: What is happening then about the PE bus?

MR CLAASEN: I was not there during the burnt down of the PE bus, I just heard about it, but I was not present at that moment.  I was in the struggle because I wanted to get free, because the boers were torturing us like anything, they just chased us without any reason, because anyone knows about the South African oppression.

MS SEROKE: After they had taken you to Da Gamaskop and then they took you to Mossel Bay they tortured you more - they tortured you  more and in your statement here you say this torture was more severe than before and there were more of them this time, there were no longer three now.

MR CLAASEN: When I got to Mossel Bay after three days at Da Gamaskop the torturing was more severe than at Da Gamaskop because here at Mossel Bay, that's where they stuck my penis and that's where I got the cut behind me head from Sergeant Calitz, that is why I say it was more severe because they never did before.

MS SEROKE: Whilst they were detaining you in this six months,  was the torture going on or did they stop torturing when you were attending court.

MR CLAASEN: When I was attending Court, there were no longer torturing now, because we now under the care of the Prison Authorities and they had no access to me they didn't have authority to take me from prison, because the torturing took place whilst I was still detained in police station.

MS SEROKE: Who were the lawyers that were representing you?

MR CLAASEN: I can't remember them but one of the - if I remember very well his surname was Abercrombie, Abercrombie, but there is a colleague of mine who will remember these names, but I can only remember this one.

MS SEROKE: We would be very happy if those names are remembered by your friend and then we would like to have them.   Now you say the extend of your injuries resulted in your bleeding through the ears and you couldn't hear properly, what is the state of your ears now.

MR CLAASEN: The pain is not that much now in my ears, but what I am experiencing now is deafness, I don't hear properly when someone is not speaking aloud, I think it is due to that kicking and the hitting, that's what....[intervention]

MS SEROKE: And your genitals is there any indication of a damage that was done?

MR CLAASEN: I didn't have money to go  to the doctor but I use to go to the daily clinics but that's - and I was paying R8-00 every day, but the pain still come back now and again, but then the daily clinic helped me.  But I can't really say whether the healing was complete or not, because I never went to a doctor to examine me, because I always go the clinic doctors - I meet this one today - the next day I meet another one.

MS SEROKE: [indistinct] there is a trend in the three  - two cases we have heard today, in the manner in which the torture was commited, it's the same method of the genitals put and pressed, and it's by the same person Maritz and Calitz and what -  and Calitz and October.  
 Do you have any children - do you have any children?

MR CLAASEN: Yes I do have children.

MS SEROKE: How many?

MR CLAASEN: I have now three children.  But when I had - I already had the daughter because she was born in February '86.

MS SEROKE: Do you work?

MR CLAASEN: No I don't work.

MR CLAASEN: Since you left you never worked.

MR CLAASEN: Yes I once worked at Barons in cycle shop, but now I left this place and I am not working I depend on my sister, my father and the mother of my children.

MR CLAASEN: How old are the children?

MR CLAASEN: The first one is 10 - full 10 years.  The second one is in Sub A now, Mfundo is 6 years, and then the third one, the youngest one Dinki is 3 years now.

MS SEROKE: And Maritz and Calitz and October - do you ever see them now, have you ever met them since>

MR CLAASEN: Maritz and Calitz and October I see them daily, Calitz he is - he is fishing now he is retired as a policeman, he has got some fishing boat, he is a fisherman, Maritz works as Mossgas as a security officer and October is still in the Law Enforcement, but I don't know which unit he is in.  This torturers are not people from outside Mossel Bay, they are Mossel Bay residents.  You see them almost every day, because they belong to that place and they were working  amongst the people and they have their homes well established here in Mossel Bay.

MS SEROKE: Thank you.

MAPULE RAMASHALA: Mr Claasen the Sergeant Maritz, Captain Calitz and Sergeant October - what goes through your mind?

MR CLAASEN: When I am seeing Maritz and Calitz let's say the three of them my mind - it is as if - I am absent minded, if this day couldn't come that the day of the truth and reconciliation, let me say the truth, I told myself that I will revenge any help that I was going to revenge.

MAPULE RAMASHALA: What would you like the Commission to do?

MR CLAASEN: As you said this is the Commission of Truth and Reconciliation, if they could come forward and admit what they did and they know what they did, come forward and tell everybody what they did to people, maybe there will be reconciliation.  But the cost - what we suffered of psychologically and my sisters up to the mother of my  children, the cost that paid I would love if there is something that can be done by the Commission.

MARY BURTON: Thank you very much Mr Claasen, we too share your hope that people will come forward and admit and take responsibility for what they did, so that we can begin to take steps towards reconciliation.  And we have taken note of what you have suffered and experienced and we will see how it is possible for us to help you, thank you very much for coming forward this afternoon.
 We will now take a short break and reconvene in twenty minutes time.
MEETING ADJOURNS