Human Rights Violation Hearings — Ladybrand — 1997-06-24

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you, Liesbet, for coming with this very painful story of losing the mother and brother in such a way.  Some of the questions which you have not answered will be investigated, and we will try to get the answers which have not come out clearly, as Lax has just said that in one of the cases we have some clarification which will clarify some of the things about the story you have told us.  Thank you very much for coming.  God bless you.
/CHAIRPERSON

CHAIRPERSON: (Inaudible) ... Dumela.  Good morning, Sir.

DANIEL JAS: Good morning.

CHAIRPERSON: How are you?

DANIEL JAS: I am fine, Sir, and how are you?

CHAIRPERSON: I am also fine.  Thank you for coming to tell your story, and before you tell your story, your pain, I am going to ask again Mr Ilan Lax to make you take an oath, and after that he is going to lead you when you are telling the story.

DANIEL JAS: (Sworn, States)   (Through Interpreter)

MR LAX: Mr Jas, you come from the Bethulie area, is that right?

WITNESS:   Yes, you are right.

MR LAX: Before we go into your story can you just give us a small picture of your family?  Are you married?

WITNESS:   I am not married, Sir.

MR LAX: Do you have any children?

WITNESS:   Yes, I have two children.

MR LAX: Are you working at present?

WITNESS:   Yes, I am working.

MR LAX: What do you do, if you don't mind me asking?

WITNESS:  I am a security at Bethulie Tavern.

MR LAX: Thank you.  How old are your children?

WITNESS:   The other one is 13 years old and the other one is seven years old.

MR LAX: Are they both at school?

WITNESS:   Yes, both of them are at school.

MR LAX: Thank you.  And your parents, are they still alive?

WITNESS:   Yes, both my parents are still alive.

MR LAX: Thank you.  We are then going to turn to the story that you have come to tell us.  You say in your statement that it happened in the beginning of 1991.  Do you remember the date at all, or the month?

WITNESS:   I think it was in May 1991, on the 8th of May.

MR LAX: Please tell us what happened.

WITNESS:   I was in the Bethulie district in Platkop when I saw a police van.  In the van was Sergeant John Simano, Constable Bagabu.  Sergeant John Simano came out of the van, then accused me of having an illegal gun which I was given by Faso.  I replied to him that I am not in the possession of a gun.  Then I said to him that he must come in the house and search as to whether there is a gun inside.  They tortured me firstly by pointing guns at me.  They locked me up in the van, then they went into the house, where I was staying together with my brother.  They just went there for a half minute, then thereafter they came out.  Whilst on the road when we were at the tarred road, at Gerrit Dam they stopped.  They said to me I should put off my clothes, but I was left with an underwear.  Then they put me again in the van and they were driving fast.  Then we arrived next to the dam.  When we arrived at that dam we returned again to town.  On our way to town there is a road.  We turned off at the road next to the shooting range.  When we arrived there I found Sergeant Steerman, Sergeant Phillips.  They were at the shooting range.  They made me to take off my clothes and made me to sit down.  They then cuffed me on the table.  On my buttocks I was wet.  They then handcuffed me on the table and they put a hessian cloth on my head.  There are things which they were tying on your fingers, left and right hand.  They were speaking Afrikaans.  Then he said one of them should put it on.  Then I shouted.  From there they would take off the cloth on the head, thereafter I would tell them that I don't have a gun, and I don't know what kind of a thing is a gun.  From there they hit me with batons.  They would electrocute me up to afternoon.  After that they put me again in the van and I was taken to the police station, then from there they took me home.  At home we found my mother and my sister.  My mother said to me what was happening.  I told them that they suspect me to have a gun.  My mother said, "Here is the house.  Go in and search."  Sergeant Steerman hit my mother with an open hand, then they threw a tear gas inside the house.  Inside the house they didn't find a gun.  They took my mother and myself and locked me in the cells from Sunday up to Monday, then on Monday my mother was released.  I was released later.  Then I went home.  When I arrived home my cousin took me to the doctor, to Dr Bates.  Dr Bates examined me.  He just looked at me, then from there he wrote a letter, then from there he said I should go to the police station to open a case.  When I arrived to open a case - forgive me for a while.  On a Monday I asked the station commander to meet with him when they were coming to take complaints from those detained.  Then they sent a station commander.  It was Warrant-Officer Veldman.  When I arrived in his office I found Sergeant Simano in that office.  When I explained everything - when I arrived in that office he said to me, "Where is the gun?"   Then the station commander said Simano must hit me with an open hand.  Then I said to him, "Do you still say to Simano to slap me?"   Then he said, "You must give us the gun.  If you don't produce that gun I will tell them to continue with the torture."  Then I left that office.  Then they locked me again in the cell.  On Tuesday when I went to the doctor he gave me a letter - I still have a copy of that letter with me - so that I should open a case with that letter.  I went to the police station.  When I arrived at the charge office to open a case I don't remember the police who were there, but they were white policemen.  When I told them what was the cause of opening the case they laughed at me.  Adjutant Veldman talked with them outside.  After some time they were writing something, which I don't know what they writing, right, and then they denied that I should look at that statement.  Then they said they will come to me, but up to this day they haven't come yet.

MR LAX: You say that you've still got the letter from Dr Bates with you?

WITNESS:   Yes, I still have the letter.

MR LAX: Can you let us have a copy please, because we've contacted Dr Bates to try and get copies of his records, but his records - it's quite a long time already, so he doesn't actually have the old records from that long ago.  So it will be very helpful for us if you could let us have a copy of that letter.  I just want to take you back a little bit.  You said in your statement that after Simano first searched your house they came back with the SADF.  Do you remember that?  You didn't tell us about it now.  I am just helping remind you about that.

WITNESS:   The police arrived when we were arriving in the house.

MR LAX: In your statement you said that first Simano met you and accused you of this, and they searched your house but they found nothing.  You said then a few days later they came back with the SADF, with the soldiers.  Do you remember that?

WITNESS:   Yes, I do remember. Now, when was that?  What actually happened that day?   ---   It was at night when the soldiers arrived after I had been released from the cells.  This person used to come all the time saying I have a gun.

MR LAX: You see, what I am trying to understand is were you arrested the first time they accused you when they just searched your house, because you say you were released from the cells?

WITNESS:   They took me from the farm and they detained me, and then again when I was released then he came together with the soldiers.

MR LAX: I just clarifying this.  In the statement we have from you these things are a bit mixed up, so this must come at the very end.  Now, you've said in your statement that at that time you were running a vegetable stall, a little stall, is that right?

WITNESS:   That's true.