Human Rights Violation Hearings — Nelspruit — 1996-09-05

HOBOHOBO EDWARD GONDWE: When I asked him he said there were many white policemen, I can't recall their faces now, because this thing happened a long time ago.

CHAIRPERSON: I would like other Commissioners to ask questions if they have got questions to ask.

MR LEWIN: Could I ask, what do you think happened to your brother?
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HOBOHOBO EDWARD GONDWE: We heard that lots of people went into exile.  We heard also that other people who were in exile tried to contact their families.  They tried to find out if they have died or whether they are still alive. With my brother, it is a different case. My brother disappeared from town, immediately after he left the shop. Up until today we have not heard anything.  We are certain that something very bad happened to him.

MR LEWIN: Can you put into words what you think might have happened to him?

HOBOHOBO EDWARD GONDWE: As I can see today, him not being back, I am sure that he was killed, because he was not the only one who was killed in exile.  A lot of people were killed.  Lots of people disappeared.

MR LEWIN: I know it is a difficult question. You mentioned the note that he wrote, saying "spend this money on my funeral". Had he ever shown signs of being depressed?

HOBOHOBO EDWARD GONDWE: Yes, the way he wrote that note, I think he had thought that since the police were arresting him, it was the usual thing that police will kill you or they will not even find your body. So he knew that he would not come back. That is why he wrote that note to his family, that we must use that money to arrange his funeral.  He was trying to tell us that the disappearance meant that, and if we were lucky we would find his body and bury it.

MR LEWIN: Do you feel that he felt that he was under threat from the police?

HOBOHOBO EDWARD GONDWE: That note, it is a puzzle. When someone is using spectacles all the time like you, Mr Commissioner, I trust that if you take off your spectacles you cannot see very well, and if you take off your expensive watch and money,
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and people came to see you and you knew that these people are hunting you. If you can do that and give it to someone and ask that person to take it home, it shows that if you are lucky you will escape and if you aren't, obviously you will die.  But my kid brother, the way he did, he knew that immediately as he was leaving the shop, these people were going to kill him or he was going to die in jail.

MR LEWIN: Have you checked at all with the political parties, particularly with the ANC, whether your brother's name is on their lists at all, of people who died in exile?

HOBOHOBO EDWARD GONDWE: This kind of question that you are asking me, are you asking me because you are referring after exile or after people came from exile or before?

MR LEWIN: I am asking whether you have made enquiries with them, whether they might have his name on a list? Because if you haven't, then that is something that we could assist you with.  That is what I am saying.

HOBOHOBO EDWARD GONDWE: We tried and asked many times.  After his disappearance my mother went to Poswa, Jabula & Partners, and she also went to the police station.  She opened a docket and the police didn't want to take that statement. Then she went to Poswa, Jabula & Partners and she told them she had a problem, because she was looking for her son. They told her that they were going to help her, they are going to try and find out where he went.  We couldn't find him.  After 1990 when people came back from exile, we tried and asked other people, ordinary people if they had something that they know. We tried to ask them.
 Another thing, I don't know people who are from exile really. I didn't know where to go and ask, but what I am sure about is that Vincent Pieti Malazi came to me one 
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night, and I asked him where my kid brother disappeared to. Then he answered me back and said he does not know, he is the ANC camps. He did not want to explain to me very clearly because he was a policeman himself.

CHAIRPERSON: Mr Gondwe, when Pietie came to see you the first time, to tell you that Roy should be careful, did you ask him why Roy should be careful?

HOBOHOBO EDWARD GONDWE: They will ask you a question and you will answer back, but when you ask them they won't answer you back.

CHAIRPERSON: Also, you said that when you spoke to Mrs Mkwatha, she said that Roy had spoken to two security men. How did she know that they were from the security branch?

HOBOHOBO EDWARD GONDWE: She said Roy was one kind of a person that you can't catch.  He was restless on that day. She also said that there can be an investigation and a good one, Nelspruit policemen under the security branch will actually tell more, because she was certain that if they can bring policemen who were working on that day in front of her, she can actually point out those two black men who came to the shop.

CHAIRPERSON: One more question.  Your brother Jabulani, does he still work at Mamelodi police station?

HOBOHOBO EDWARD GONDWE: Yes.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you.

MS MKHIZE: We thank you very much and your testimony, it is one of those testimonies that we are facing every day and the Commission is going to investigate and do some research to find out what really happened. If a person died with no explanation, it is our duty as the Commission to investigate and find out what really happened.  So that we can come back to families and tell them and actually explain to them what really happened to their family members.  There are things
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that happened when one person leaves this world. It is so sad that one person can just disappear within the family and the family members don't know what really happened. Your testimony is one of those that needs to go to the investigation unit, and they will do some researc and the investigation. You gave us names of people and places.  Those people will help us to investigate more. We thank you very much.
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