Human Rights Violation Hearings — Bisho — 1996-09-09

UNKNOWN:  Are you no longer a soldier, have you stopped being a soldier?

WITNESS:  Yes I stopped in December last year.

UNKNOWN:  Were there any reasons for you having resigned from the Defence Force?

WITNESS:  Yes there were reasons for my resignation from the Defence Force.  Firstly, after this incident with my brother I changed and I couldn't work properly any more.  Secondly, I was someone who upon waking up at the camp wouldn't want to speak to my superiors and they couldn't tolerate me.  Thirdly, I saw that there was no other way, that I couldn't tolerate this place any more.  I did what is known as AWOL [absent without leave] and I took leave without having been granted permission at base and I was taken to what is known as a court martial.  This is what came with the whites when they came to Bisho Military Base and that is where I was on trial and I was found guilty and I was sent to prison in East London.  From Fleet Street I was sent to the medium prison and that is where we were taken by the white men at the medium prison and were told that we were now free and that we were being released and that all my army uniforms and everything of mine that belonged to the army I had to give back and that is how I left.

UNKNOWN:  Is that all you would like to say Mr Nqabisa?  Before I ask your mother any questions, is that all you would like to say?  Will you allow me then to proceed to your mother while you are still pondering anything else that you might not have said?  May I proceed to your mother?

WITNESS:  What I would say is that I would like to know because it hurts me very deeply that the problem with my older brother is something that I hear all over the show.  What I would like to know is where the bullet came from?  Did it come from the Defence, the side of the Defence Force, where did it come from and who fired it?

UNKNOWN:  Did you say Mr Nqabisa that what happened to your brother affected you even healthwise.  Could you just elaborate on that for us.

WITNESS:  Yes my health was seriously affected because even in playing in sport I was someone that was very active but even up until today I find that I am inactive because I just cannot cope because it all comes back to me that instead of having people's children killed over here, I would rather take them all and live there by myself.

UNKNOWN:  Is that all you would like to say Mr Nqabisa?  We would like to thank you for the co-operation you have offered.

WITNESS:  Finally, what really gets to me is thinking about it because my intentions are that if it was me and if I was in charge I would have rescinded the instruction.  I would have withdrawn the order and this effected my life and it made me a nervous person who gets angry very easily.  Thirdly, I get violent very quickly, yet those are things that never used to happen to me when my brother was still alive and now no matter what I do I always say that gee whiz, you know, there were two of us before and now I'm alone.  That is all.

UNKNOWN: Thank you very much Mr Nqabisa.  Let us just go to your mother now and hear her side.

CHAIRPERSON: Order.  Order please!  You don't listen.  You are not going to leave here.  When we leave you are going to remain behind.

UNKNOWN: Ms Nqabisa thank you very much once again.  Good afternoon and I would once again like to express my appreciation for you for appearing before this Commission.  You say that this, the tidings of your son having been shot there that day, how did you receive the news?

WITNESS:  Reverend Touw came on the 8th on the Tuesday.

UNKNOWN:  Could you please come closer to the microphone Ms Nqabisa.

WITNESS:  Reverend Touw came to the house on the 8th at approximately after 1000 came with some people and one of them was a [indistinct] girl and they had come to bring the news that in the mass action the previous day here in Bisho, there was this unfortunate incident that Vusumzi was the first person to be struck and that everybody else was injured because he was the first one to have fallen and that he was one of the first persons out of all the people to be injured here in Bisho.

UNKNOWN:  Were they trying to say that the people that were in the march did that?

WITNESS:  Yes I am saying that he was the first one to be shot with, which sparked off this whole incident here in Bisho which lead to the death of all these people.

UNKNOWN:  Your son who was giving evidence before you, said that this affected him severely, the fact that his brother had fallen and I found that in his evidence I observed that it seems as though they were very close and tell me, had it affected you in any way, the death of your son?

WITNESS:  He is right, it affected him severely and it affected me too because that was the last - the last thing I remember was when Reverend Touw was at my house and the next time I came to, was when I was in hospital.

UNKNOWN:  As your son said, how do you think that the death of his brother affected him?

WITNESS:  He is a wreck.  He is not what he was before.  He has so much anger and he gets so emotional because thereafter he nearly killed his brother with the weapon and he did not even know how that had happened.  Many people had to stop him.  He is right in saying that it has affected him severely, mentally and physically.

UNKNOWN:  Are there any other signs to show that he was really affected by this?

WITNESS:  Yes there are, so much so that some of the evidence can be obtained from the police station where they kept [indistinct] because you would find that once he went into this mental state, you wouldn't know what had happened, he would sort of just black out and people would have to take this weapon from him and the police would have to come to the house and stop him.  It's right what he says that he was really affected because he likes to carry this weapon and he loses his temper easily.

UNKNOWN:  Does he get any treatment from any doctors?

WITNESS:  No.

UNKNOWN:  Do you deem it necessary when looking at him and the way you know him?

WITNESS:  Yes it is very important for him to receive treatment.

UNKNOWN:  Let us just quickly come to you now.  You said that you yourself were affected by this, can you tell us how you were affected by this?

WITNESS:  Yes I've got, I suffer from high blood pressure.

UNKNOWN:  Can you just tell us what your request is or what your wish is that you would like to place before this Commission.

WITNESS:  Mine sir?

UNKNOWN:  Yes ma'am.

WITNESS:  My wish is that the killer, the person who shot Vusumzi, I would like that person to come forward because they really struck me a low blow and since I had gone to Tienies, an Italian by the name of Olivier in King William's Town, there was nothing forthcoming from the claim because I had submitted the claim and my file was taken from here with an  [indistinct] from here because there was no finality on how much I should receive and when the office was taken to Pretoria, everything changed and the answer came back, the attorney saying that I should bring a claim number and I went to the soldier base at group 8 and I was told there that those were only for soldiers that had been injured and survived and that they did not have any numbers for soldiers that had passed away.

UNKNOWN:  How old was Vusumzi at the time or can you tell us what year he was born in?

WITNESS:  He was born in 1966.

UNKNOWN:  Had he been married or had he any children?

WITNESS: No he did not have any children or he wasn't married at the time.

UNKNOWN:  Ms Nqabisa is that all you would like to say?