Amnesty Hearings — Durban — 1998-04-21

MR HLONGWANE: On the first day of the arrival of the bombs Lucky and I went to the beach. They exploded such that we realised that they were dangerous. They are not like M1 or M26. You would light this piece of string and it would explode different from the ordinary bombs. Instead of exploding upwards it would explode downward. Tabeli was the driver and Lucky Mbajuwa who is a police now at Ulundi.

MR WILLS: Yes I think Mr Hlongwane do you know did anybody die? You say in your affidavit that you would throw these bombs at houses. Is that correct? Did you in fact throw these bombs at houses in eSikiweni?

MR HLONGWANE: Yes that is exactly what we did.

MR WILLS: And you say that: "I am not sure if anybody died during these attacks." Is that right?

MR HLONGWANE: Yes that is correct.

MR WILLS: And you say: "These attacks took place at various places in eSikiweni township and I am able to identify 3 such targets." Is that correct?

MR HLONGWANE: Yes that is correct.

MR WILLS: So if the police were to take you to eSikiweni today you would be able to point those out to people?

MR HLONGWANE: I still remember some scenes not all of them but others I still remember very well. There are only a few incidences or scenes that I can identify because that was my job anyway. That was the kind of job that I was doing as a member of the hit squad.

CHAIRPERSON: Did these bombs cause damage to the houses that you threw them at? Did the bombs cause damage and if so what was the extent of the damage? Was it small damage or did it destroy the houses? What sort of damage did the houses cause to the houses?

MR HLONGWANE: These bombs exploded such that they would bore the floor. They would competely destroy the floor. It looks like they were manufactured specifically for mine usage or usage at the mine to carck rocks. So that windows and the walls were not necessarily damaged but the floor and everything that was on the floor. That is how I can put it.

SISI KHAMPEPE: Mr Hlongwane I think you have not responded to Mr Wills questioned when he asked you whether you would be in a position to identify the 3 targets that you have stated in your affidavit to have to be able to identify.

MR HLONGWANE: Yes I can identify some of the three, some of the houses among the three.

MR WILLS: Thank you members of the Committee. Mr Hlongwane the final incident that you record in this long sorry tale is the incident involving the shooting at persons spray painting a sign in eSikiweni. Can you remember that incident?

MR HLONGWANE: I remember that very well.

MR WILLS: Can you tell the Committee and members of the public about that incident?

MR HLONGWANE: The Mayor, Mr Pipi Biyela together with Mrs Mbuyazi they bought sprays and they said that we were going to spray the roads, you know give them IFP names such as Bambata Road.

MR WILLS: Sorry. Mr Hlongwane I get the message from the members of the gallery that they not hearing you. Can you try and speak up a little bit?

MR HLONGWANE: The major, Mr Pipi Biyela and Mrs Lindiwe Mbuyazi bought sprays, the kind of sprays that are used for graffiti. And they said we were going to give these streets names such as Bambata, Battalion, IFP and we did that. The mayor brought the sprays and we did that. We started spraying at, the people at eSikiweni know the place, it is a bus stop called eSthlageni, just before the mayor's house. That is where we started spray painting and we proceeded towards the mayor's place and continued further down. That angered the mayor and he indicated that we should spray paint and wait there. And some boys who had come to delete the names came and we started beating them up. And we started shooting at the boys. We used Mr Biyela's vehicle and it was driven by Thanduxulu. Lucky Mbanju and myself were doing the spray painting. The car would drop us at a point, we would remain behind spray painting and the car would pick us up later. And that is how we proceeded.

MR WILLS: Do you know when you shot at these boys I see that there were some serious firearms used. You again used your 357 Magnum and Lucky used either a shot gun or a pistol. Do you know if any of these boys were injured or killed when you shot?

MR HLONGWANE: They were very close. I can say that they died. We were leaning against an electric transmitter I think. That is when we hit them, that is when we shot at them. I want to believe that definitely they must have died.

CHAIRPERSON: How many boys were there Mr Hlongwane that you shot at?

MR HLONGWANE: There were about 2 or 3 but it was certainly not 1 person. These were people who had come to delete what we were writing.

CHAIRPERSON: And when you say they were boys, were they young boys, little kids or young men?

MR HLONGWANE: No these were youngsters like myself. They were just of my same size then.

SISI KHAMPEPE: And how old were you then?

MR HLONGWANE: What year is this by the way?

SISI KHAMPEPE: 1992, 1993.

MR HLONGWANE: I was about, I am 30 years now. I think therefore I might have been 26 or so. I cannot be sure.

MR WILLS: Yes Mr Hlongwane I am wanting to conclude your evidence now. It seems to me that you started getting involved in these murderous activities at a very young age. Is that correct?

MR HLONGWANE: I was actually 16 years.

CHAIRPERSON: Quiet please.

MR WILLS: Is it not so that you continued for in these activities for at least a period of some 8 years? From 1985 to the point of your arrest in December 1993?

MR HLONGWANE: Yes that is correct.

MR WILLS: And in that time you have killed many, many people is that right?

MR HLONGWANE: Yes that is correct.

MR WILLS: And it is also correct that you cannot even remember the names of the people, of many of the people that you have killed. Is that right?

MR HLONGWANE: Yes that is correct.

MR WILLS: Now there, the people from eSikiweni are here and I believe there are some people from Mandini here as well today. Do you want to say anything to them as a result of your activities in the eSikiweni and northern Natal region?

MR HLONGWANE: Yes. I would like to apologize unreservedly even though they may regard me as a beast. But what I would like for them to do is to look at the Inkata and National Party government, these were the people in power or position and if these people give you instructions you would not have objected because that would endanger your life and that of your family. There is therefore so many people that I have killed.

CHAIRPERSON: Please be quiet, let Mr Hlongwane continue. Please let the witness continue.

MR WILLS: Mr Hlongwane are you in a position to continue or do you require a 5 minute break? I ask for a 5 minute break at this stage? Thank you Mr Chairperson.

CHAIRPERSON: We will take a short 5 to 10 minute adjournment and then we will reconvene and continue.
COMMITTEE ADJOURNS
ON RESUMPTION

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you. Mr Wills are you ready to continue with Mr Hlongwane?

MR WILLS: Yes thank you Mr Chairperson. I express my appreciation for that indulgence.

CHAIRPERSON: I notice Mr Stewart is not here. Is he around or can we start without him?

MR WILLS: I presume we can start Mr Chairperson. I have asked somebody to advise him that we are proceeding.

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you.

MR WILLS: Mr Hlongwane we got to the conclusion of all the events that you described. Now my understanding is that since your arrest you have participated extensively in various investigations done by various people, mainly policemen in regard to giving information about the large number of cases that you are aware of. Is that correct?

MR HLONGWANE: Yes that is correct.

MR WILLS: Is it not so that in this regard that you have from an early stage spoken to the Goldstone Commission?

MR HLONGWANE: That is correct.