Human Rights Violation Hearings — Newcastle — 1996-09-11

WITNESS:   Because if we are talking about the Hlobane people are confused, they don't know what actually happened, but what I will like to explain here before the Commission is that there was no union which grouped all the employees together at Hlobane up until 1983.  It was on the 12th, it was on Monday.  There was a confusion at Hlobane.  There was an electricity cable which was called 84.  68 people were killed in that mine on that day.  Three of them were whites.  The employers said we were supposed to work on that day even though people died.  That's when people - employees started saying, "No, we can't do that.  We can't work when people had died like this."  A lot of people got injured as well.  Some people went to Rand Mutual Hospital in Johannesburg.  After other employees went to visit their relatives they met a general secretary.  At that time that general secretary of the union was Cyril Ramaphosa.  He was there because he wanted to find out what was actually going on.  Employees tried to explain to him.  He introduced himself to the employees and he also introduced his union.  So employees realised that this union had objectives which were good for them, so employees decided to join the union.  Employers said employees were going to die if they joined this union.  They said they were going to give us only R500,00, it doesn't matter if you have a large family or a smaller family.  We as mineworkers we had no light.  We didn't know our rights.  Besides, even if we knew our rights those rights were not our rights, they were white people's rights.  People who died received money.  People who didn't have dependants received R14 000,00 for his parents.  Those who had children I am not quite sure how much they received, but at least people received money, and this is why we were so interested to join this union. All of us Hlobane employees in 1984 we became the union members.  In 1985 in October - if I am not mistaken, it might be August - that's when we had negotiations with our employers concerning increase.  Mr Watson was the manager at that time, and he was stubborn.  At that time people who were working right underground they were so underpaid, they were getting less than R200,00 even if they worked more than 30 days, or 30 days.  Employees decided and agreed that they should stop working, they should go on a strike.  That strike took three days.  We agreed with all of us employees that police were going to work, people who were working in the kitchens were going to work, and the administrators were going to work, but those who were working underground are not going to work.  Nothing happened after three days even though we received what we were fighting for, but we were not satisfied.  In 1985, it was on the 30th of November, the federation was formed which grouped all the unions together.  It was called COSATU.  NUM was one of the unions which was affiliated there.  The employers were now angry.  They were calling us terrorists, they were calling us names.  We couldn't understand what was going on.  In 1986, if I am not mistaken it was in March, if not February, there was an announcement which said that there were people who were coming from KwaZulu Government and they were asking to meet mine employees.  Because we as mineworkers we were one, so we were happy, we were looking forward to meet these people from KwaZulu Government even though it was the first time.  These people, even though I couldn't even see them before, some people said - I heard people saying one of them was Gideon Zulu and Mr Ntombela.  Maybe what actually happened there was in that meeting we also had women who were married to mine employees.  This man, Gideon Zulu, put it clear that if you are a Zulu there's no need that you should join any union or organisation, because there is an organisation for the Zulus, and that organisation it's Inkatha.  We were confused whether we were right as Xhosas to be there in that meeting or we were supposed to leave, but he put it very clearly that these organisations were organisations for other people, not for the Zulus.  The women from locations were angry because they were married to the Sothos, to Xhosas, and now they couldn't understand why this person was putting it like that.  We were many who were worried.  So we saw these women leaving the hall because they couldn't stay there an listen to that nonsense.  We also followed these women.  There was a second man by the name of Madela Qesa(?).  He was an executive.  He had a question that, "Now that you are saying so, Mister, in 1983 people died here.  What did Inkatha do?"  That's when it got sour, because this person got angry that how come this person is asking him such a question.  After that it became clear that the union or the - that workers be caming together or united was one thing which was going to lead to problems.  So one day, it was myself and one guy from - Jack Senele, he's a Xhosa guy as well - our chief called us.  David his name.  He said he would like us to explain to him because he was disturbed.  He wanted us to explain what exactly did we say to the union.  So we asked him to explain to us.  So he said to us he heard by Ncube that Xhosas are saying - I would like to with your permission to say this, because he was swearing at us, but I like with your permission to say exactly his words.  He said, "Xhosas are saying that the king of the Zulus, Goodwill Zwelithini, will be Mandela's teaboy, and Mangosuthu Buthelezi will be the garden boy for Mandela."  We were surprised because we didn't say this, and we asked him, "Who said we said so, "because it's so clear that you heard it from someone?"  "That's why I am confused, because I am also Xhosa, that's why I am asking you."  When the meeting was held this issue also came up.  He wanted to know who were those Xhosas who actually said those words.  They said it was Phumelani Mdletshe.  Phumelani Mdletshe was the organiser of the NUM.  John Shangase was also an organiser.  Maxwell Nxumalo.  Maxwell Nxumalo is a chairperson of the union.  All these people are from Nongoma, and Madela from Qesa, Fanisile from East London, Jonas - I have forgotten his last name.  They said, "These are the Xhosas."  And the chief said, "I have a problem, because among the six men that you have mentioned there is only one Xhosa.  Why now are you saying the Xhosas are saying this, because you should have said the Xhosa said, not Xhosas?  After the meeting there was this picture now, because this issue came with the people who were working for the Welfare Department, the administrators.  Now, this became a very hot issue.  As you've said before that I will say something, and if I leave something my brother here with me will fill in the gaps.

MR LAX: Who was this Chief David - what was his surname, that you spoke about?  This chief called a meeting that you went to, and you said his name was David, but you didn't give us his surname.

WITNESS:   I have forgotten his last name.

MR LAX: (Inaudible) ... before the troubles really started, and that was that in May of 1986, as you've told us in your statement, UWUSA was formed.  Can you continue from there and just tell us that.

WITNESS:   Okay.  In that meeting people who were left behind decided that they will

MR LAX: /from a