Special Hearings — Faith Community Hearings — 1997-11-17

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very, very much, I'm very impressed at the restraint   that you have shown that your sermons have been reduced in length. Just I think,   a brief intervention - Mncebisi?

REV XUNDU: Thank you your Grace. 
I do want to commend you for the open way in which you have shared with us   your pain and your struggle towards coming together as a church and also making   a tremendous confession of the sins of the past. You will have noticed that   almost all the churches - the interdenominations, which had persons coming from   different divides, shares in one way or another, the great degree of complicity   that those who were privileged went on to enjoy at the expense of those who   were not privileged.
Nonetheless, one can see from what you have given here, that you are undertaking   to address those as far as it is possible and make sure that the scandal of   division in the church is not perpetuated through your efforts. I do not have   any particular question except to say those words, thank you.

CHAIRPERSON: We probably would have asked questions but I think that your submissions   have been comprehensive and have covered the sort of areas that we would be   asking questions about. And we do want to give thanks as we have been giving   thanks to others for the candour, for the humility and the openness which as   I said, we would hope will begin to permeate our society,
And we thank you for the efforts that you are making of being reconciled as   the two groups, reconciled on the basis of truth and we will be looking with   some interest at your own Baptist TRC. So, thank you very, very much and God   bless you. You may stand down.
We are going to have to take an abbreviated lunch for those who - the lunch   is for the ones who are guests and then others. We are going to try and have   an abbreviated lunch, can we try - I mean it may also be that the logistics   up there are not quite what we can offer. I'd like us to come back at a quarter   past one. Can we say grace, let's just say grace please.

CHAIRPERSON: Can we call the delegation of the Apostolic Faith Mission? We   welcome you and are thankful that you are accepting the flexibility relating   to time. Pastor Burger, you will introduce your colleagues and then take the   oath or make the affirmation, thank you.

PASTOR BURGER: Thank you Chairperson. On my left-hand side, is Pastor Frank   Chikane who is the Deputy President of the church, Pastor George Mahlobo on   my right-hand side who is the General Secretary, Pastor Peter de Wilt who is   the General Treasurer and then also felt it wise to bring with us two leaders   of our church before our unification, that played an important leadership role   in ...[End of tape 3A - no follow-on sound]

CHAIRPERSON: ...[no sound] all six of you might in fact speak?

PASTOR BURGER: Yes.

UNKNOWN: (sworn states)

CHAIRPERSON: Thank you, we are now entirely in your hands but you will remember   the sort of structure, it's a total of 30 minutes with maybe 20 or so minutes   given to your corporate submission and 10 minutes or so for questioning, thank   you.

PASTOR BURGER: Thank you Archbishop. I have requested a video TV monitor and   I hope that it will be brought before I've completed my submission. I will do   the submission and then I would like the delegates with me to respond to any   questions that may come. 
Commissioners, it is in all humility that we are appearing before of you today   as the reunited - and I want to say reunited Apostolic Faith Mission of South   Africa. The AFM was founded at the turn of the century by American Missionary,   John G Lake, the AFM then was one. Today we consist of 1.200 congregations,   1.800 pastors and 650.000 members apart from adherence.
We are thankful for this forum, we know it is not perfect but then the AFM   also is not perfect. The TRC is the only forum with some credibility and acceptability   available to us in which we can publicly apologise to all those who had been   hurt by the travesties of the past. It is the most effective way available to   us which we can use to offer help and healing to those who had committed unacceptable,   often even gruesome deeds against fellow South Africans.
And that offer goes for people on all sides of the line. There are few better   ways than this rostrum, from which the AFM can reach all those falling in all   these categories, that is why we are thankful for the TRC. As we have said earlier,   we were one when the AFM was founded but as time moved on and this fair country   became increasingly besotted by political and racial ideology, placing impediments   on multi-racial worship, we were ...[indistinct] asunder and ended up being   four churches, Indian, Black, White and Coloured.
Our isolation never dampened the yearning to become one again and by the latter   part of the freedom struggle, we were close to unity. By the grace of God, at   Easter 1996, the AFM was able to celebrate it's new unity during a nationally   televised service at Centurion Park. This made us the first church denomination   to unify since the advent of our democracy. 
There at Centurion Park spontaneously and obedience to God, I on behalf of   the former White AFM and Pastor Frank Chikane on behalf of the former composite   division - that was the Black, Indian, Coloured section, in public embraced   each other and sought forgiveness and transgression for transgressions committed   by the AFM churches and members against each other during the years of separation.   God in his great mercy, helped us to grant each other pardon.
I've brought along a short edited video recording of this act and I trust that   it will be possible to just show it to you before the end of our submission.

CHAIRPERSON: Have you made ...[intervention]

PASTOR BURGER: I've made arrangements, it's in the process.

CHAIRPERSON: It's going to happen, all right.