Amnesty Hearings — East London — 1999-06-14

KWANELE ARTHUR MFENE: Yes, that is correct, it was like that.

MR OBOSE: Now, a meeting was at some stage held in April on the 15th, is that correct?  At the Bisho police college.

KWANELE ARTHUR MFENE: It was on the 22nd of March.

MR OBOSE: Please sketch the background and how this meeting was organised and by whom.

KWANELE ARTHUR MFENE: This meeting, as some of us were responsible in separate offices, we were commanders in separate offices, in different offices, because we didn't know what was happening, we would meet as the police and discuss our future and then it happened that fortunately we received a message from the commissioner of the time.  We then decided to meet at that place and discuss what was going to happen.

MR OBOSE: Which place was this?

KWANELE ARTHUR MFENE: Police college in Bisho.

MR OBOSE: I just want you to specify, I mean was this to include all the policemen or certain, or the branch commanders only, this meeting?

KWANELE ARTHUR MFENE: This meeting, all the inspectors, all the male inspectors were called in this meeting.  It was only the male inspectors who were called.

MR OBOSE: No, it was said it's been called by the commissioner.

KWANELE ARTHUR MFENE: I would like to explain this way.  We received messages that the commissioner would call us on a certain date and then when we were preparing ourselves to go to that meeting, that would be cancelled.  We would be called again and then when we were preparing to go to that meeting we would then be told that it has been cancelled, we would be given another date.  Then on this occasion we were called and indeed we went there, we didn't receive a message that it had been cancelled.  We then went to the hall in the police college on the 22nd March.

MR OBOSE: How were you called to this meeting, over your police radios or by announcement in the media, the radio, Radio Ciskei etc?

KWANELE ARTHUR MFENE: There was a correspondence which we received in our offices saying that on the 22nd of March the commissioner would like to see us.

MR OBOSE: Were these letters under the hand of the commissioner?  Were they, had they been signed by the commissioner, or from the commissioner's office?

KWANELE ARTHUR MFENE: It was signed by the DC in Zwelitsha because the commissioner would send a message to the DC in Zwelitsha and the DC would call the station commanders and the branch commanders and give them the message.

MR OBOSE: Did this correspondence specify as to what was to be the agenda?

KWANELE ARTHUR MFENE: No.

MR OBOSE: Did you then maybe as branch commanders, or as inspectors, discuss maybe that, what issues you would place on the agenda in the meeting?

KWANELE ARTHUR MFENE: As branch commanders and members who were in my rank, we had hoped that the commissioner would speak to us and then we would then give the report to the police with lower ranks.  This is what we thought was going to happen, even though we also had our grievances, because we would be called to a meeting and we would be told that it has been cancelled even though we wanted to go to that meeting.

MR OBOSE: Now, did you maybe have a certain list, you know  saying that we're going to place these issues on the agenda for the commissioner to answer to?

KWANELE ARTHUR MFENE: Yes.

MR OBOSE: Could you list maybe a few?

KWANELE ARTHUR MFENE: Yes, I can list them.  First of all it was our future as the Ciskei police.

MR OBOSE: Could you just be a little bit specific there, what do you mean by future, what were you apprehensions at the time?

KWANELE ARTHUR MFENE: What we thought about at the time is that our officers were close to Brig Gqozo and the government of the time, or the present government was said, they said that if we did not co-operate with that government we would be out of work, so we wanted to know what was going to happen to us when the government was changed.  We just wanted to know about our future.

MR OBOSE: Any other item?

KWANELE ARTHUR MFENE: Secondly, there was an officer that was found guilty in a court of law.  He was sentenced after he was suspended but under that commissioner, that police was returned back to work even though he was found guilty and he was given an order to give back or hand over the money he had supposedly taken and we didn't get any explanation about what was happening about that particular officer.

MR OBOSE: So you wanted to raise this issue and inquire from him as to how the policeman got to be back at work?

KWANELE ARTHUR MFENE: Yes.

MR OBOSE: Now you personally went to this meeting?

KWANELE ARTHUR MFENE: Yes.

MR OBOSE: With whom were you, did you go?

KWANELE ARTHUR MFENE: With the majority of male inspectors as the commissioner had wanted them there.

MR OBOSE: What time did you get to Bisho Police College?

KWANELE ARTHUR MFENE: At 9 o'clock in the morning because the meeting was scheduled to start at that time.

MR OBOSE: I'm going to ask you just to relate the whole story for the Commission please.  What then happened?  Try to be as chronological as possible.

KWANELE ARTHUR MFENE: When we arrived there at the college we had hoped that we were going to meet our commissioner and we would discuss issues as the police.  We were surprised that there were other, there were inspectors who told us that the elections would go in a certain way.  That is when I stood up and said that we were expecting to see the commissioner.  We are not against the election, we wanted to vote and wanted to see what our future was going to be, but we were there to see the commissioner.

MR OBOSE: Do you remember which policeman addressed you, which inspector?  Was it part of the group that's been called or part of the policemen who worked at the Bisho police college?

KWANELE ARTHUR MFENE: No, he was not part of that group.  It was the two inspectors who were addressing us from the college.

MR OBOSE: Do you remember their names?

KWANELE ARTHUR MFENE: Yes, I do remember their names.

MR OBOSE: Just place them on the record please.

KWANELE ARTHUR MFENE: It's late Inspector Suys and Captain Falteng.

MR OBOSE: Did they purport to be sent by the commissioner?

KWANELE ARTHUR MFENE: They said that they have a message about how the election is going to go about, they didn't say that they were sent by the commissioner or they didn't say that the commissioner sent them.

MR OBOSE: Now this meeting, were all inspectors as you could determine, from Ciskei mostly, at least there?

KWANELE ARTHUR MFENE: Majority of the male inspectors were there.

MR OBOSE: What then happened after you had objected and insisted that you had gone there to see the commissioner and where was he?

KWANELE ARTHUR MFENE: The two inspectors, they went out and called the commanding officer, Brig Kuwuza, who is no longer working now.  They called him, he was there in the college, they called him to come and address us.  When he arrived there we asked for commissioner Nqoya, the one who called us to that meeting, because there were some issues we wanted to discuss with him.

MR OBOSE: Yes and what did they say?

KWANELE ARTHUR MFENE: He didn't waste time.  He made a call.  He said that he was going to call him, he made a telephone call and after some few, after some time we were outside the hall and Commissioner Nqoya arrived.

MR OBOSE: What time was this now roughly?

KWANELE ARTHUR MFENE: If I can estimate, it was before 11 o'clock.

MR OBOSE: That same morning?

KWANELE ARTHUR MFENE: Yes.

MR OBOSE: Was he alone?

KWANELE ARTHUR MFENE: Yes, he was alone.

MR OBOSE: Did he then proceed to the hall, or he went to some other office?

KWANELE ARTHUR MFENE: He went to the hall.  He called us inside.

MR OBOSE: Also by this time when you waited for him you had dispersed and you were outside the hall and you were grouped what he came, when he arrived?

KWANELE ARTHUR MFENE: Yes, that is correct.

MR OBOSE: Right and then?