Amnesty Hearings — Johannesburg — 1998-04-23

PETRUS JOHANNES MATTHEWS: The instruction was that General Jappie Oelofse had said that the revolution would begin that night and that he wanted us to use the hard option. That he wanted to see corpses.

MR PRINSLOO: And after that you went to whose home?

PETRUS JOHANNES MATTHEWS: Firstly we went to Jaco Badenhorst parents' home.

MR PRINSLOO: What happened there?

PETRUS JOHANNES MATTHEWS: Those vehicles which we were not going to be using because we had too many vehicles for the operation, were left there. And those vehicles which we would be using we changed the number plates there of in order to make recognition difficult. And from there on we went to Visser's apartment.

MR PRINSLOO: Before you went to the place where the roadblock was held did you use any alcohol?

PETRUS JOHANNES MATTHEWS: Earlier on in that day at my home I drank a beer or two. We had a braai but I was already in bed and sleeping when I received the call.

MR PRINSLOO: And after that you heard the testimony of your colleagues saying that they had, had whisky. Did you have anything to drink?

PETRUS JOHANNES MATTHEWS: At Mr Visser's home I had whisky and I also had a glass of neat whisky which has been mentioned here.

MR PRINSLOO: After you had the whisky and you departed who drove with you?

PETRUS JOHANNES MATTHEWS: I was driving with Mr Kloppers and Mr Martin in the Mercedes when we went to Mr Martin's residence.

MR PRINSLOO: And when you arrived there, what happened?

PETRUS JOHANNES MATTHEWS: When we arrived there they told us that we would be setting up a roadblock. And they went to fetch the necessary equipment which we would be requiring for the roadblock.

MR PRINSLOO: Did you have any alcohol at Mr Martin's house?

PETRUS JOHANNES MATTHEWS: No I did not.

MR PRINSLOO: And from there you went where?

PETRUS JOHANNES MATTHEWS: From there we departed for the Radora crossing where the roadblock would be set up.

MR PRINSLOO: You have already heard the testimony of Mr Martin and Mr Meiring, were you yourself involved on assault on black persons before you arrived at the place of the roadblock?

PETRUS JOHANNES MATTHEWS: Yes I did assault people along the way.

MR PRINSLOO: Where was this?

PETRUS JOHANNES MATTHEWS: Approximately a kilometre away from Mr Martin's residence we found 2 black people who came walking out of a plot. We stopped, we jumped out, asked them what they were doing there and they did not give us satisfactory answers. And we then assaulted them.

MR PRINSLOO: Did you have an instruction to carry out this action?

PETRUS JOHANNES MATTHEWS: No. When we arrived back at the Mercedes with Mr Kloppers and Mr Martin they were very angry. Especially Mr Kloppers who had said to us that this was not part of our instructions. That we should stick to the instructions which were issued.

MR PRINSLOO: So therefore he admonished you for this?

PETRUS JOHANNES MATTHEWS: Yes he was rather angry with us because of that.

MR PRINSLOO: And in which vehicle did you then travel?

PETRUS JOHANNES MATTHEWS: From Mr Martin's home we were redivided and I was in the Sentra after that.

MR PRINSLOO: And then you went to the Radora/Ventersdorp crossing?

PETRUS JOHANNES MATTHEWS: That is correct.

MR PRINSLOO: At the crossing a roadblock was set up by Mr Meiring, what was your function there with regard to the maintenance of the roadblock?

PETRUS JOHANNES MATTHEWS: I was given part of a reflector jacket which we had received at Mr Martin's home. And when they would give the signal to pull the car off the road I would stand in the road as a traffic officer and do so.

MR PRINSLOO: There has been testimony that motor vehicles were apprehended.

PETRUS JOHANNES MATTHEWS: We pulled over a number of motor vehicles I am not certain of exactly how many.

MR PRINSLOO: How many of those vehicles were searched?

PETRUS JOHANNES MATTHEWS: All the vehicles were searched. The passengers were questioned and they were let go.

MR PRINSLOO: Was there any occasion where there was a vehicle which would not start?

PETRUS JOHANNES MATTHEWS: Yes. If I remember correctly it was a Ford F100 which was pulled off. We searched the vehicle, found nothing and then the vehicle would not start after that. Mr Kloppers gave us instructions to set the vehicle alight which we did.

MR PRINSLOO: And the passengers of that vehicle, were they black?

PETRUS JOHANNES MATTHEWS: Yes, all the vehicles which we pulled over had black passengers.

MR PRINSLOO: During this specific roadblock did you ever seize any cassette tapes?

PETRUS JOHANNES MATTHEWS: Yes. I did this upon the instruction of Mr Kloppers. I found the cassettes and the equipment box. He told me to take them and that they would be given to the appropriate persons because the cassettes might have contained propaganda and the tools could be given to our mechanics division.

MR PRINSLOO: Did you then hand those items over to specific people?

PETRUS JOHANNES MATTHEWS: I gave the equipment to Mr Meiring because he was the training officer and I gave the cassettes to Mr Visser, also one of the applicants. He would have gone through the cassettes because he had the necessary musical equipment to do so.

MR PRINSLOO: Later a Honda Ballade and another vehicle were apprehended, what happened when these vehicles were apprehended?

PETRUS JOHANNES MATTHEWS: Just before then we received the signal that we had to pull them over and before we reached they had gone off the road already as the others had testified. We heard the doors open and close. We did not really know what had happened there. They approached us and we pulled both vehicles, the Cressida and the Honda off the road. I told them to get out of the vehicles and to sit down at the side of the road. I searched the boots of both vehicles and that is where I found the cassettes and the equipment box. We searched further and Mr Martin was constantly questioning those who were sitting on the ground. Questions such as where do you come from, where are you going, to which political party do you belong? And so forth. Mr Visser walked around the back, or Mr Kloppers walked around the back and if some one who Mr Martin was questioning did not want to answer Mr Kloppers would hit them on the back of the head. Mr Kloppers and Mr Martin came together and called us closer. They said that this was the group and that we would have to eliminate this group, that we would have to shoot them. We formed a line where in which Mr Martin fired the first shot. I did not shoot immediately because my weapon became stuck in my clothing and I could not fire quickly enough. Mr Martin told me not to simply stand there but to shoot. Because he was standing on my right hand side. When I managed to retrieve my weapon I shot at the people.

MR PRINSLOO: How many shots did you fire?

PETRUS JOHANNES MATTHEWS: Six.

MR PRINSLOO: And you said that you fired these shots at the people?

PETRUS JOHANNES MATTHEWS: I fired in the general direction of the people, where they were sitting.

MR PRINSLOO: And is it correct that 4 people were killed during the incident?

PETRUS JOHANNES MATTHEWS: That is correct.

MR PRINSLOO: The first shot fired by Mr Martin, what was the purpose for that?

PETRUS JOHANNES MATTHEWS: That would have been the commanding shot. When he fired the shot we would begin firing immediately there after and then we would know that everybody would be on their places and not end up in the line of fire by accident.

MR PRINSLOO: After shots had been fired at the people what happened then?