Amnesty Hearings — Johannesburg — UNKNOWN

ANSWER: Well generally I would say it depends which sectorthe union is organising in, but as far as I can remember yes therewere some Cosatu affiliates who get involved in consumer boycotts,but you see there are other unions also who couldn't get involvedin consumer boycotts simply because what they are producing wasnot something that was directly consumed by the community, thereforeit was difficult for you to say to the community boycott thisparticular product.   Therefore I will say yes some unions gotinvolved in consumer boycotts but others did not, depending onwhat kind of products was involved.
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<UNKNOWN>: /...
MR DU PLESSIS 297 G D TIBEDI

<UNKNOWN>: Mr Tibedi am I right in saying that you testifiedthat you were arrested a few times, is that correct?

ANSWER: Yes that's correct.

<UNKNOWN>: Would it be correct to make the deduction thenthat you were a thorn in the flesh of the authorities of the apartheidregime at that time?

ANSWER: I would prefer to respond this way, that theywere a thorn in my flesh.

<UNKNOWN>: Thank you Mr Chairman I have no further questions.
NO FURTHER QUESTIONS BY MR DU PLESSIS
NO RE-EXAMINATION BY MR MPSHE

JUDGE WILSON: : Mr Tibedi how long had you lived in yourhouse before it was bombed, approximately?

ANSWER: I moved in that house in 1983 beginning, letme say 1982, it was the end of 1982.

JUDGE WILSON: : I think I understood from your evidencethat you had electricity connected there?

ANSWER: No.

JUDGE WILSON: : It wasn't an electric stove?

ANSWER: No.

JUDGE WILSON: : Did you make use of that address?

ANSWER: Yes I, I, my family still stay in the house atthe present moment.

CHAIRPERSON: They still stay there?

ANSWER: Yes.

JUDGE WILSON: : Your sister, would she have used that asher home address at school?

ANSWER: She used that as her home address at school.

JUDGE WILSON: : Your neighbours did you know them all?
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JUDGE WILSON 298 G D TIBEDI

ANSWER: I know a few but I can be prepared to presenta list of addresses.

JUDGE WILSON: : I don't mean as personal friends, but theyall knew you lived there did they?

ANSWER: They know, they are still living there even atthe present moment.

JUDGE WILSON: : Why I'm asking you is to find out whetherthere was any possibility that anybody who had made enquiriescould believe that that was not your home?

ANSWER: I can extend an invitation to all members ofthe Commission to visit that house and verify, they will findout that that is still my residence.

JUDGE WILSON: : And it was in this day of 1987?

ANSWER: Exactly.

JUDGE WILSON: : You see, we've heard evidence that informantafter informant said this was a safehouse.   Could anyone havebeen under such a belief?

ANSWER: I don't know where that information came fromMr Chairman, but I can only say that that is not true.

JUDGE WILSON: : How far is your home from the police station?

ANSWER: Maybe about 10 kilometres roughly.

JUDGE WILSON: : How long would it take you to drive?

ANSWER: About five, seven minutes.

JUDGE WILSON: : So it's possible the police, if they'dbeen notified immediately of an explosion, could have driven toyour house from the police station?

ANSWER: That is very possible, the only thing that struckme is that whether the Colonel was working night-shift, whetherhe could be ready to get up within 10 minutes and be at my place,leading a squad of 10-15 men, that is the kind
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JUDGE WILSON 299 G D TIBEDI
of information I can't find an answer when I keep on thinkingabout it.

JUDGE WILSON: : It's the kind of information that oughtto appear in police records.

ANSWER: I'll guess so.

JUDGE WILSON: : Thank you.
NO FURTHER QUESTIONS BY JUDGE WILSON

CHAIRPERSON: Was your house situated in a built-up areaat that time?

ANSWER: You mean, can you repeat your question sir?

CHAIRPERSON: Was your house in a built-up area?

ANSWER: Yes my house was, it was, it's in a built-uparea, it's also, I also bought a stand, a site in that particularplace and I was preparing myself to build when this thing happened,I didn't really have a formal structure.

CHAIRPERSON: Yes, and the adjoining houses that were damaged,how far were they from your house?

ANSWER: Well you see from my neighbourhood up to thefourth house, both on the left and on the right, my front opposite,it's like a township structure as you might know it.

CHAIRPERSON: (Inaudible).

ANSWER: No it's not the veld, it's a township, it wasactually a middle-class area to be specific.

CHAIRPERSON: The people that came to your house a few daysearlier to enquire about what car you drove, were you not at homeat the time?

ANSWER: I was attending a executive committee meetingof Cosatu at the time in Pretoria.

CHAIRPERSON: So who was it that spoke to those people, wasit your wife?
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CHAIRMAN 300 G D TIBEDI

ANSWER: My wife yes.

CHAIRPERSON: The question they asked your wife was whatcar you drove?

ANSWER: The first question that he put to my wife waswhether I'm in the house or not and she said no I was not in thehouse.   They begin to enquire about my movements and they saidactually they were coming to inform me that the police were afterme therefore I should take cover and they were saying they willbe available in case I would like to be assisted in terms of whereto go an hide so that they should actually drive around with meand they, they took some rounds, a few rounds, two or three roundsin that area before I actually arrived.   Fortunately my wifewalked up my neighbourhood and she actually used a telephone,a telephone, in one of the houses in my street where she was actuallytrying to find out where I was at the time.

CHAIRPERSON: Your motor vehicle was parked in your yardthat night when your house was blown up?

ANSWER: Yes it was parked in my house.

CHAIRPERSON: Is that where normally your car is parked?

ANSWER: Yes it was normally where my car is being parked.

CHAIRPERSON: Your neighbours and the people in that areaall know that that is your car?

ANSWER: Yes sir they will know that.

JUDGE NGCOBE: When you say you used the address of thathouse, did that also mean that you actually received post throughthat address?

ANSWER: Yes sir.

JUDGE NGCOBE: This vehicle, was it registered in yourname?

ANSWER: Yes it was registered in my name.
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 JUDGE Ngoepe 301 G D TIBEDI

BERNARD MAKGABO NGOEPE: To which address?

ANSWER: The very same address, 589 Block U, Makopane.

BERNARD MAKGABO NGOEPE: So the registration authorities would haveyour name and your particulars of your vehicle and your address?

ANSWER: Yes, although the car is sold to a differentperson but the records will have to be there.

BERNARD MAKGABO NGOEPE: Ja I mean at that time?

ANSWER: Yes.

JUDGE WILSON: : What was the address you said?

ANSWER: 589 Block U, Makopane it's about 3 kilometresaway from (indistinct).

UNKNOWN: How many people came and made enquiriesat your house at that time, the few days before when you weren'tthere?

ANSWER: The information I have received is that one personcame to knock at the door but they were driving in a Kombi andas that person was moving back to the Kombi my wife saw that therewere a number of people in the Kombi but she couldn't actuallytell how many were there.

UNKNOWN: Could she say whether it was black or whitepeople?

ANSWER: Well the guy who came to knock at the door wasa black person but those who were in the car we don't have anyinformation.

UNKNOWN: Thank you.

SISI KHAMPEPE: : Mr Tibedi had any person earlier, before7 October, been to your house looking for you?

ANSWER: Not that I can remember.

SISI KHAMPEPE: : So what made your wife suspect that thepeople who came in calling themselves comrades, your
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MS KHAMPEPE 302 G D TIBEDI
comrades and looking for you were in fact, she suspected thatthey were from the police?