The Statesman.
London, England, 1810-03-29 00:00:00

THlt's,

he could not but think that every Hon. Officer
who had served on the Expedition would have
wished for mountains to cover, or seas to over.
wheim him, in artier to escape the indignation of
the public. [Hear, hear !) When charged with
a wish to delay the di.cussion on the conduct of
the Expedition, the Right Hon. Gentleman had
referred to his conduct during. the whole of the
investigation to prove the contrary. He. was
ready to admit, that the Noble Lord, not then
in his place, had conducted himself with
great • propriety • throughout the whole 'of
these proceedings. But when the Right Honour.
able Gentlemen referred to the papers not yet de.
livered from the printer's as a cause of delay, be
must observe, that whatever might be the abilities
of that Right Ilbn. Gentleman, he could du but
one thing at a time. It was the opinion of a great
.hi'

-man, that that was the manner in whirl' All things
were dune. As they were not pressed fur time
as •to the present question, there was no ground
fur interrupting that in which the House been
previously engaged- When the notice if the
motion had been given by the Honourabk Gentle-
man, it was suffered to lie over for twenty-four
hours. Why, then, not lie over fur a longer pe-
riod ? He care the Hon. Gentleman (Mr. 14(11. •bridge) credit, when he said, that he hail nut
lout himself to any man in the course had taken;
but he must 'be allowed to all, that the
Ho-
nourable Member had allowed himself le be intlu.
awed by the. Chancellor of the Exchequer. [ilear,
hear!] • The Honourable Member teas witting to
allow time, but the, Right Honourable Gentleman
had availed himself of this question as a Godsend
[hear! hear!], in the same manner as a drown.,
iag man would catch at a straw. It was an flit;
saying, that many things happened between the
cup and the lip, so also did many things hap.
pen between the baiter and; the
pear ! hear! .Iseitil] He did not mean to,say„,
If hit mks t* go to the extreirtits., that the Right
Honourable: Gentleman was entitled to be behead_
ed, neither had he meant to apply the allusion to,
him. Gentlemen might recollect the case of a
soldier, who, on the retreat .in Spain, had hcen
tried by a Court Martial cur sciineheinims offence,
arid sentenced to be shot. The 'detachment of
cavalry was drawn up for this execution ; but,
fortunately, the enemy came in sight; the cavalry
escaped, the culprit was put on a horse, and flesh
with the rest, and so the whole ended. As he trust-
ee! the House of Commons would never sheet any
feat, so also he hearted Oath would not manifest
tither faVonear partiality to anjperson. [Near!
hear!) He* thou;ht the House,. by acquitting the.
Right Honourable Gentleman last Session, had
slidon boa; partiality, aol, thereby contributed to
that degradation into which some persons supposed
the public- to consider it as fallen. The Right
Honourable Gentlemen had certainly been charged
with a breach of the privileges of s that House.
Lord Catitlereagh, however, had, and if not for

to publish the substance of his speech.
lie had read the letter, and thought that there
was nothing •in it which any country Memb,r
might not have addressed to his Constituents.
—Having read the letter, he put the argii.
ameat in his pocket, supposing it to be the•
same as the speech a hick he had heard. On coin-
ing down to the !loose, however, he was informed
that notice had been given of the motkin by the.
lion. Member: 11-hen he beard this, he thought
that the matter would soon be over, as he did not
'think there was any thing exceptionable in the
.speech. But he was afterwards informed that there
were many things in the argument which were nut
in the speech ; and it -was own the ground that
he was not prepared to'girc an opinion upon any
one of these new passage}, that he wished for
the adjournment of the discussion. It was
impossible to say that any one passage was a
libel, without considering the whole, and ascer.
taining how each might be explained or no.
.dified by the context or other passages in the pa.
per. That he should do, if allowed time to con.
siilet the paper ; but if not, he should not be
driven to vote for the Resolutions of the Hon..
Gentleman. As a Juryman, and he looked upon"
the House as in that iti.tance called upon .to per:
form the functions of Jurymen, he should, in'
ease of any doubt, feel himself bound to
.pro.
flounce the party innocent. Others were no doubt
ill the same situation with Mm; and he had no hee.
sitatiou in saying, that any lion. Member who felt
a doubt upon the subject, was bound to say not
guilt . What detriment, he would ask, could result
from agreeing to the adjournment of this discussion ?
A lkGen Omen were not so highly gifted as the ;tight
Hon. Gentleman, to comprehend the details of two
important subjects at once. They had not, as that
Right Honourable Gentleman seemed to have,•
cells in their brains for the reception. of different
kinds of evidenee, nor that constitution of in.
tellect which Citahled him to cast shades over
one description of evidence, whilst he applied his
attention to another, and then to withdraw these
shades at will; for the purpose of proceeding to
-b-

the gentlemanly terms in which he made his ex-
cuse, which disarmed the resentment of the
and the amendment of a Bight Honourable Gin.
Conan (Mr. Canning), w belt ovo rise to the coin.;
age of a pew word, in the laruzuagc of the Right.
Honourable Gentleman, " lest a mistakeable
record should appear upon the Journals," he I
must hare been cen:icted. Bat the Right Ho-
nourable Gcot:emon desired that the __Ouse shouted
not slain- itself to be intimidated. Fur himself,
he could say, that be had never at any time been'
afraid to avow his sentim. nts. Yet at the same
time that he would not be intimidated from express-
ing his sentiments, he would not be intimidated to
act with a false crira.4e, or to do a thing in order
to shcw that he durst %In it—[flear, hear !] nor
to do any thing, which, in his best conviction, he
should nut think right. If he were the only one
who was not, and had nut an opportunity to be
acquainted with the paper, then he might be the !
• only one who should vote for the adjotirninent,
and on a ground which to him appeared unanswer.
able ; but he hail another ground, arising out of
the good feelings of the lion. Members opposite
(the Mauer and Seconder). When he heard these I
lion. Gentlemen, in stating their sentiments, al-
. lode to.comhinations in that Hoop, and the spirit
of Jacobinism out of it, he could scarcely be.
Here that he was not listening to the organs of the
'tate. Mr. Yorke—(he begged pardon) of the late
Member for Cambridgeshire. This was the le-
gacy bequeathed to that Home by the Teller of
the Exchequer. [llear, hear!] That Right Hon'.
Gent: hail made a complaint against John Gale
Janes, who made a respectful apology at the bar.
[Nolno!] As he was informed, that person had con-
ducted himself with decorum at the bar, and 011 that
'ground it was his opinion at the time • that he
should be discharged. Every thing that had since
been done on the subject tended, step by step, to
Make Jones a greater personage than he could
otherwise have hoped to become. It was nut his
intention then to give any opinion as to the right
of the House to commit for conternid ; that opi-
nion he had before stated, and it was not newt..
sary' for iiiitiro—teP4t. Ile begged here to retain
to what he had been drawn oti from loogec than
he had intended— the allusions of the lion. Geo.
tlemau • (Mr. Lethbridge) to combinations in thai.
House. The Hon, Member had said, that oti
hearing certain statements in that House, to was
to affected, that his hair stood on end. [A laugh.]
Now that the lionse knew that be had the gilt of
I inguage (though indeed he had heard that lio.
microbic -Gentleman before make 'a motion re.
specting double.harrelled guns), [A laugh] he
trusted that he would not remain silent ; but
when he became sensible of this visible vf.
feet, rifler his moral to overcome his phypical
• impressions, and move that the terrifying words
be - -

the conshk•ration of the temporardy.secluded
jects. When the Right Hon. Gentleman. there--;
fore, called upon the flutist, not possessing the
same advantages with himself; to divide their at-
teation between two questions, he was doing au !
iojery to the llou,e, .0 each individual in the
House, ant to the nation. Butt whatever effect
the Right lion. Gentlemao might have 'expected
from this interruption, he trusted be would. he
disappointed, as well within as witbont the .walls
of that House. • Ile might suppose that the pub.
lie would be distracted by this gentian) from
paying the same attention which it would other.
wise to the qeestion in which he was SO deeply
ant) personally interested. But the public he
believed to be too wise to give into that de-
lusion. The Right Honourable Gentleman would
gain but a short respite before the derision should
be pronounced upon him. The Honourable
Baronet had claims on the (louse not to proceed
precipitately in this question. The House of Cam.
mons, whose rights and privileges were interested
no less than, the freedom of the people in the deci.
sion, had cialtits upon that House to proceed
calmly and deliberately, not rashly and precipi.
tately. When the Honourable Baronet had made
his motion for the liberation of Jones, he was not
convinced by his speech, but had voted for the,
discharge of Jones, beeanse his previous confini-
wait appeared sufficient punishment, because his
utfence was light, and because he had conducted
himself respectfully, when at the bar of that
House. Ile did not mean to detain the House
longer, as he should not go into any argument
as to the right w'iich had been questioned.' He
was sure, if the right was nut consistent, with law,
that the (louse of Commons was too liberal not to
relinquish it ; but if on the contrary the right was
legal, that House would always bp bold .enough to'
maintain its just rigitli and privileges.
Mr. SIDNEY YORKE .said,---44 The Teller
of the Exchequer has left to this House a legacy,
a valuable legacy ; 'toil it is as valuable to.us, •
coining from a Teller of the Exchequer": as jf
canto from a-brewer -of lifter.".
These words prodneed an immense agitation'
in the House, with Cries, of'Order, Order, Order!
Chair, Chair ! ' " •
Mr. WIIITBREAD.-." I can dect myself,
affected but one wny by • the •expressioos of the
flooourable Member who has iost spoken, and•
that is as a tradesman, by' being held Out •as or
brewer of bad porter." [Hear, hear! for *Oise-
time.] " I have only to hope, as the 'Hun.
Gentleman who has conceived so bail awopinion
of me as a tradesman, and thinks that I have so
far deviated groin the precepts and exam* of my
father, that he would do me the honour to, buy a
cask of my porter, and I. will sell him the best,
that all the voters of the Teller dill° Exchequer
drink his health." Ill,hear! Chair

[a

taken down. pi laugh.] It would err.. ! Inv :ear, ---• •
tainly he on every account desirable that he should 1 chair I)
not suffer the agitating words to remain in oblivion Mr. SIABAKIifI. The Honourable Member
for three weeks, and then the unfortunate titterer is in'piroiession of the flo,ise, to proceed on the
of them become the object of another charge, by I question, unltit.s some Ilotionrabk Member speaks
bringing t4em in judgment against 'him.— [dent-, to order.
hear !] He should appeal to that Bench of Law- Lord MILTON spoke to order, and expressed
yens whom he saw before Itim—[o laugh,] whether a desire of taking down the words of the ilvn.
rich a practice would be allowed in any Court of Member. (Yo, no, pretty generally from all
Justice: whether, on a trial fur one offence, it quarters.]
. would be tolerated to give in evidence a previous i Mr. 1V BR.EAD.—" I wish, as lam sore
' act which had never been questioned ? Hu was ' I feel perfect good humour on this subject, and


edr4ttg

~K.

bold enough to diger fres the Hnnourabl&llarts. thilron.Gentleman, as I perceive by his coun.
net, though he had .not read his statement." He.. 4 tenao- ee, it restored to tranquillity, the House
had heard the speech of that-Honourable Baronet *wild not call fur an apology ; I require none on
with attention, but without being convinced. That this occasion." [near, hear !]
41)eeeit 91111Wud, to hiln at, able one, butthe fait .dlir. CROKEIt tentplimented the tioneurahle
be found• with it: was, that it would not, if agreed Gentleman on the manly matinee in which •he re-
.te, advance thnobjict of the Honourable Baronet eeived the sarcasm, which he thought to he unit's-
one step. lie also found fault with his having pub. tifiable ;• though many of the observations which
lisped in. his .argement any thing which* had not fifell (ruin himself on the subject of *bate, his
stated in his speech, when he brought forward his conceived tu. be .as Nieto& as the sarcasm whicli
proposition. It would have been matter of surprise Was just *used. -This tleptailidr) of the legislative
if his Noble Friend (Lord Porchester) had not powe' was arrested in the execution of its rights.
brought forward any motion calculated to pro. The liotiourdble Baronet was well aware he dared
mote the objects stated in his able speech, on the not. utter one sentence on his legs here of what he
proposing the resolutions founded ou the late in- afterwards published 119 argument. •The present
vestigltion. Another • complaint he had to make discussion is. whether we shall in 1810 give up the
against the Hon. Baronet was, that when he pub- right L:f exi rciSing. the privileges of dur ancestors
lisped his Letter and Argument, he professed [No, no! from the Opposition.]---11a persisted
till --A!stion.-

111 saying 'ltch %vas the nature of is que.
Could the ll,,onnrable Baronet doubt the autho-
rity of the House to- commit strangers for Con-
te:no-I, which he had attempted to prove in lan..
gunge not only inconclusive, but of a bad taste—
laugit.]•;i—",'Wtatilti not you, Sir,' (addressing
itinisrli to the Speaker) who have ever filled that
Chaie*With manly dignity, interpose your autho-
rity if such expressions, which I shall now read,'
.%% ere uttet:eil here, expressions aiming at and in-
sulting the dignity of this Ilouse and that Chair ?"
" t.el ink instrument, 'this thing, sni zenerit, he centrist-
ed ith the description above given of properties of a
lawful! warrakt. Dors it not evidently appear that this piece
of uasealed w per, sioed by the Speaker, by which an un-
tried suhjecr has been outlawed, hears no feature of k-
gality 7, •
If such were his expressions There* he repeated
it would he the duty of that Chair to have called
the. lion. Baronet to order. Is this libel so oh.
seem and doubtful, as that. it should be adjourned
over ? No; argument the Hon. Baronet had left
aside, and launched at once into a libel on the
House of Commons; a libel monstrous in itself,
and made up of vituperative language :
" Inflated with their hieh-blnwnfattrieti idealbilf Majesty,
and tricked out in the trappings of Royally,'*—
What can the If Bart. mean by this.? He
knew of net trappings but the mace on the table ;
and did he arraign this ?--lle should conclude, he
said, by reading another passage:
" One cannot, with such impteKinns in nn.!'s mind, help est-
tertainittz a fear that the Gentlemen of the nausea Commons
may, in time, unless they revert to the great principles of the
Citte•titutimt, be in danger n incurring the temente of St.
Paul !item the insolent and tyrannical High Priest, who
command:4l him to be truck for opening his month in hit
own defence.—" Gtidshall smite thee thou whited wall: for
titt,st thou to jinie me after. the law, and commandest me to
be omitten contrary to the law 7"
What does the Hon. Bart.. mean " revert ?"
Can it be explained ? if criticism could turn aaWe
the sting of the libel, the adjournment eT s *CA
' would tint he sufficient for the. purpose, . • .•
Sir SAMUEL ROMILLY thought the Home •
.
call 11 on, out of respect to their own Character, to
&liberate longer before they croe to any decision
in this case. *Though they were' here lodges from
nor sir 'et let Or ttbt forget that itley, were

ecessity,
Judge in their 'ipwn atitse. This' Was a dine at
which they were called:On not sharply to catch at
every copposed or etsperwat violatioti of their poi.
vileges, but to prOtect them with temper arid Mo.
' deration, never overstepping the tiheial'amt
,stantial ;Isles of justice. With all the pains he,nad
been abin 49 bestow, in the short period.he had it
in his potter, on the reading or the putilicatiwa in
y6141601', he had considerable doubt in declaring
that it was a WI. If he should be compelled
to come to a vote on it That night, he mhst, on
every principle of law, soil from considerations
arflutbstantial justice, as practised in the Courts
in which he.had .been educated, say' that it was
not, because so lung as he remained in dirubt,
he must, of necessity, incline to-the side of inno.-,
mice. He was not a person to conic to the deci.
siert of a qiiestiowof this kind with that sharp re—
tort, and with that heated temper, which some
Gentlemen seemed to have 'brought along with
them. However Gentlemen seemed to &vita his
assertion, he begged of them to come to the de.
cisitin of the question now before then' with tem- '
per and moderation. There was not a man who.
wished more than lie did to hold a high-cheek over
attacks on the privileges of that House. So far,
he Wever, from protecting their privileges, by now
acceding to the proposed Resolutions, he was sa.
fished that to do so would have a contrary
effect. He was told that the House was not
to listen to language of intimidation. He con.
fesscd that lie had not courage, considering what
had lately passed at the numerous great meet.
imp throughout the co entry, in which, opi.
*lions, in many instances unanimous ones, on
grand public ques‘ionsi• wore declared contrary to
the decisions of that Hone, to contend that the
majority of that House must be correct, and the
great body of the nation wrong, or to set up his
own opinion, had he originally formed one in
those majorities, against the vuioe of the nation.
The House was now proceeding, however, to dis.
X9lO of. the prestintliseetien, Without tieing aEcu.
rattly acquainted with the true hature and bearing
of it. No thought he should be able to satisfy
some Gentlemen, Who seemed auxions to come to
an immediate decision on the question, that this
was the case ; and that if they were at this moment
to decide it on the facts as they uoderstood them,
they would deride contrary —to- the true impart
and meaning of the very passagee on which their
decision was built. An Hon. Gentleman under the
gallery Itatl,-as the ground of his opinion, cited a
particular paragraph from the ar,onetit in goes,
tion, giving it an interpretation which it is until
not bear, and withoof weighing the impart of D,
after a cursory reading, asked was not this and
this libellous ? The Honourable Gentleman (Mr.
Owen) had construed the passage to which he
entitled, as if it char ' the Hie - with cur

-
vetting, the Bin of Rights into a Bill of Wrongs ;.
whereas, if the Honourable Member had pervis4tilk
the passage attentively, he would have found it'
stated' that no one blember agreed with Mr.
Yorke in imprisoning Mr. Jones under sstic-•
tion of the Bill of Bights. If the house had
agrees!. with the Honourable Gentleman under the
gallery, in his interpretation of the passage, they
mast have taken it for granted, that this was the
decision of the whole house. This was a strangii,
anJestravagant construction to have i;is en the