The Statesman.
London, England, 1812-01-30 00:00:00

_~+~~..

I .
i

~_

I'

•

•

making the Bill permanent instead of tem-
he agreed with Sir J. Newport; but he
a agree with him in his objections to the ae-
'the English census in 1801. His own em-
end enquiries had given him reason to think
ttatements were correct; and in confirma-
ie alleged increase of population, he must
that a detailed account lately taken in the
'christenings went far to chew that a very
tble accession had accrued. Leave was than

could be obtained only from himself : and such in.
quiry, according to the present order, might lead I
him to criminate himself. As to the point of evi-
dence insisted on by the last Speaker, he (Mr. Per-
ceval) conceived that the House might very possibly
be disposed t# allow an extract of its proceedings to
be taken ; and such 'extract would, undoubtedly,
be received as evidence against a person in any court
of law in the kingdom.
Lord FOLKESTONE said, he could not compre-
, bend how the House could come at the qualification
unless the order stood as it was originally made. It
appeared that a measure of great importance, viz. the
qualification of Magistrates, had been passed into a
law ; and slow when it came to be enquired into, it
was alleged, that if application was made to the
clerks, they could not give the necessary information
as to the exact situation of these qualifications. It
was, therefore, incumbent on the House to ascertain
this point according to the enactment of the law ; and
I it appeared to him that could only be done by suffer-
ing the order to stand as originally made.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said,
the order as it stood must be productive of great in.
conveniences, without a possibility of coming at the,
truth. Police Magistrates might have been duly qua.
lified, and have given in a particular place where that
qualification lay at the time they became Magistrates ;
and yet, having parted with that property, there was
uo way of coming at the foundation of where their
! qualification now lay, but by compelling them to as.
certain it. This did not apply to Police Magistrates
alone, but to every Justice of Peace in the kingdom.
Mr. BANKES thought it would be easy to
mo-
dify the matter effectually by an Amendment of
. the present motion, in only adding a few words so
• as to reach that qualification under which the Ma-
gistrate began to act. Howes sure the House would
ever be slow to exercise its inquisitorial power ; but
Iso far as this went, he thought it might very fairly be
I done.
Lord. A. HAMILTON moved, that this debate be
adjourned to Friday.
Mr. RYDER objected to the adjournment, as he
had given two days notice, and had also sent a pri-
vate intimation of his intention, and of the purport of
his motion to the Hon. Bart. who had originally
brought forward the subject.
Lord FOLKESTONE said, the Right Hon. Gen-
tleman gave his notice only on Monday evening, when
almost all the Members had left the House. For
his own part he knew nothing of it till he saw the no-
tice yesterday afternoon, just before he came into the
House. lie should therefore vote for the adjourn-
meet of the debate to Friday.
On a division, the numbers were, for the adjourn.
ment, 21—against It 53.
' Mr. Ryder's motion passed without a division.
On our being re-admitted,
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER
. moved for a list of the Magistrates acting under the
Police Bill, with their original qualifications.—
, i Agreed to.

:DEN gave notice of a motion for Tuesday
.t, lative to the Expenditure of the Civil List.
Potach, MAGISTRATES.
Mr. Secretary RYDER rose to move for the dis-
c iarge of so much of the order of Sir Francis Bur-
dett relating to the Police Magistrates, as required
from them a list of their qualifications (under the
statute) for holding their of-Rees, viz. a statement of
44 where they are and what they are." The impro.
priety of this part of the order had been pointed out
to hini•bv a Learned Member not, now in his place,
the Attorney-General. It was this,—The Act im-
poses severe penalties on those Magistrates who do
not comply sith its conditions ; and the tendency,
therefore, of the Hon. Baronet's Motion would be
to exact from the Magistrates such accounts as might
subject them to criminal proceedings for a breach of
the statute. Ile had communicated his own seeti.
Intuits and intentionsen this -topic to Hon. Boto-
net two days ago ; bet as he hail streived,no answr,
he supposed thatliti"iispeopriety was acknowledged
by the lion. Baronet. in contlelion, is. slyOuld
merely state, that he had no communication ivhaftvelr
with any Magistrate. Ile therefore moved, that so
much of the order should be discharged as required a
statement "..what and where are the qualifications of
Magistrates."
Mr. WIHTBREAD observed, that perhaps the
Honourable Baronet had not received the communi-
cation : at any rate the order should not be dis-
charged in his absence, without giving an opportu-
nity of stating any objection to such a proceeding.
Ile could not see the great inconvenience to Magi-
strates which was apprehended by the Right Ho-
non able Secretary. It might perhaps be the object
of Sir F. Burdett to shew that some one Magistrate
had not given in the required specification of his qua-
lifications, which would no doubt be the ground of a
penalty. This might be the object—but not having
had any communication with the Hon. Baronet, he
could net tell ; yet, aLany rate, he saw no reason
why the House should not postpone the debate on this
subject.
Mr. Secretary RYDER said, he had no doubt that
his note had been received, for it was left at the
house of the lion. Baronet. He might afterwards,
if he pleased, revive the order by taking the sense of
the House.
Sir JOHN NEWPORT strongly objected to this
last proposal. It would lead to this absurdity,—
that the House should be employed ore day to make
an order, next day to rescind it, and afterwards to
revive it. For himself he could see no harm in mak-
ing the Magistrates give in an account of their quali-
fications. What would be the result ?—merely, that
the Legislature shoui• interfere to take cognizance
of4heir conduct, instead of the qui lain informers.—
At all events, the debate ought to be deferred till the
Hon. Baronet came down.
Sir THOMAS TURTON could by no means
agree with the last Speaker, that it was the duty of
this House to compel Magistrates to render accounts
which might criminate themselves. The lion. Hato-
met ought to have attended.
Mr. TIERNEY said, that it did not follow be-
cause the Hon. Baronet had not answeivd the corn..
municatioa, that be therefore assented to it. What
was the meaning of the present Motion? An order is
made for , Magistrates to state their qualifications ;
and the Right Hon. Secretary moves to alter it, be-
cause he finds that some Magistrates will be crimi-
nated by it. [No ! no! from the Ministerial Benches.]
Why really that was the result of his reasoning,
when stated, that it might produce great inconveni-
ence to some Magistrates, He himself thought the
order very useful. If any Magistrates had evaded
the act, it was fit they should be animadverted upon :
if any should be found to have acted unintentionally,
it would be in the power of the House to relieve
therm He could not approve of the suggested method
of reviving the order. It would give the other side
of the house an opportunity of using their favourite
moment, that after the House had once expressed
its sense by a majority, it should not again be taken
t the same subject.
Mr. KENRICK thought that the House would
exercise its iniquisitorial power very improperly, if I HOUSEHOLD BILL,
it f reed Maeistrates to criminate themselves; nor On the question, that this Bill be read a third
wo I Pi. order produce the desired effect. Thepre- time,
sent q_ualilica lone of •Magi Orates might be xery. dif- J Mr. C. HUTC.HINSON said, be could got sunk
ferent from those "whip they possessed at first ; they l it to pass any farther stage with a silent vote. He was
might have sold or changed their original qualifica- much dissatisfied with the whole of the arrangements ;
tions ; and it would be too inquisitorial for the many of which, he was sorry to say, shewed a profll-
House to demand an account of changes which it gate expenditure of the public money. He was far
might be inconvenient to'state, from wishing to abridge the Crown of any thing that
Mr. HORNER asked, was it to be endured, that was necessary to its dignity and splendour, but he
the House should be required to give up its inquisi- could not agree to the 70,0001. which was to go to
torial power, because the parties examined before it the payment of the Prince Regent's debts. Ile
would perhaps be found to have broken the law ? I thought it would be much more to the honour of the
Was it not rather the objest of their inquisitions to Prince, and to the dignity of the House, to have
detect such criminals ? But he denied, that in this paid all these debts, and given the Prince the whole
case the Magistrates would be called on to criminate of the Civil List, He objected to all the other parts
themselves. The proper officers appointed in every of the Biil on much the same grounds as Mr. Tierney
county would present the desired information to the arid others had -previously done. He found great
House. At any rate, the present proposition was fault with the large sum ranted to the Marquis
not to be endured. It was, indeed, a principle of Wellesley for a few months' expences in Spain; and
law, that a man should not be called on to criminate thought the House ought not to lose sight of the
himself, because his confession might be used to his strictest economy in our expenditure, as we were
conviction. But the evidence received in that House engaged in a most expensive war, which no one
could not be admitted as evidence to criminate a man could venture to say when it would end ' • and that
out of 'it. No court of justice would allow it. He our resources were in such a state, he feared we
insisted, therefore, that the House should not, by could not carry It on more than a very few years for
admitting the proposition just suggested, destroy at want of means. He also found fault with the cl-
one blow their whole inquisitorial power. Admit it pences of our embaisy to the Turkish Court; tied.
now, said the Hon. Member, and it will be used thought it not only idle, but injurious to our intev
hereafter as a precedent to check all inquiries into rests, to attempt to vie with the expensive splendour
criminal abuses. of the embassies of France, Russia, and other Go-,
The CHANCELLOR. of the E4CHEQUER ob. vernments, sent to the Ottoman Court. He begged
served, in support of Mr. Kenrick,rthat a Magistrate pardon of the House for having so long detained
might possibly be qualified at the taking of his office, them ; but conceiving the Bill to be of the highest
hid a list of such qualification might. easily be fin- Importance in all its provisions, he could not, con-
nihed by the regular officer appointed for such par- sistently with that duty he owed to his consti-
poses ; but if he had cheesed his original qualifica- treats and to himself, suffer it tit pass without two
Lion, the nature of that $l ha At present held catering bit protest against it.

REGENCY EXPENCEM MUG.
On the question, that the Regency Expences Bill
be read a second time,
Mr. TIERNEY begged to ask a question of the
Right lion. Gentleman. On a former night, that
Right Hon, Gentleman had promised to give some
information how the proceeds of the Duchy of Lan.
caster were to be applied, with respect to medical
advice, attendance, &c. ; and particularly as to the
10,0001. mentioned in the Bill. He, therefore, wished
to know if he could then satisfy him on that head.
The CHANCELLOR of the EACH EQU Elt said,
he was sorry it was not in his power to say any thing
decisive on the subject. The Council had not as yet
come to any settlement on that point. He believed,
however, it was intended to carry the whole surplus
of the proceeds of the Duchy of Lancaster to the
account of the Privy Purse ; and out of that, 10,0001.
was to be applied towards defraying the expellees of
medical advice, attendance, &c.
Sir J.-NENVPORT wished to know what was to
'be done with the Civil List of Ireland.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER
said, no arrangement had yet been made on that
head; and he conceived, that the surplus, after what
was at the disposal of the Lord Lieutenant, would
I be so small, that it would ,be of no great consequence
I either to the King or the Regont,
The Bill was then read a second time, and ordered
to be committed on Friday.
Mr. LUOHNO roN brought up the Report on
the Household Officers' Bill, which was read and
lagreed to, end ordered to be read a third time on
Friday.

- Is •
THE STA MAN.

~~, ...
~.;
,q

• se: **-1 ' Ahr: . • -

_..,

The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER
said, be was sure the House would not expect him to
follow the argument of the Hon. Gentleman, 'after
the very ample discussion which the Bill had re-
ceived. There was one point, however, which, As it
was novel, it was requisite for him to notice, and that
was respecting our Embassies to the Ottoman Court.
Those of France and Russia had certainly been car-
lied to a high pitch of expensive splendour ; and in
that, we had never iu any degree attempted to vie
with or imitate them. It was for the House, how-
ever, to consider, whether it would be proper or po-
litic, that we should so far divest our Ambassadors
Ofiwlitat was naturally in the course of affairs attach-
ed to their character, as to materially lessen their
weight and dignity, merely to save an expence,which,
when compared with those he had mentioned, was
positively insignificant in its amount.
Mr. ARBUTHNOT said, that as an opportunity
would soon be afforded to speak particularly to this
subject, he should now say but a very few worth.—
Ile should pass over every thing relating to himself ;
but he would inform the Hon. Gentleman, that of
such importance did France deem her Embassies to
the Porte, that a fleet had been for some time lying
at Toulon for the purpose of taking an Ambassador
in a suitable manner to Constantinople.
The Bill was then read a third time, and passed.—
Adjourned to Friday..

FOILEIGN ATTELLIGENCA
• -••••=7-
We yeiterday reeeiveilitarobiirgh Paper, to the
Bth instant, from which the following are extracts:—
I HAmeutten, JAN. 7.—lf we add to the details
in the Moniteur the intelligence from Copenhagen,
we find that the English on the coast of Denmark
hare not suffered less than on the coast of Holland.
Nothing is more natural than to deduce front the
shipwreck of the St. George, the patron of Great Bri-
tain, the symbol of an act of solemn justice by the
Divine Government directed against the nation which
employs its policy only to pour forth the blood of its
subjects and its blind allies for the sake of the gold of
its neighbours, and to use its latest efforts in the sup-
post of that national credit which is the ruin of man.
kind." _ _ _

" COPENHAGEN, DEC. 31.—The Officers of Pub-
lic health have given notice, that the yellow fever
has broken out in the Canaries, and that a danger-
dm disease raged at New Jersey, in America. In
consequence of this information, precautions are
adopted with respect to the Canaries as a place of
contagion, and with regard to New Jersey as a sus-
pected place."
" NAPLES, DEC. 7.—According to the most re-
cent news from Corfu, two frigates had arrived to
cruise in that neighbourhood, and two more were to
be employed on the same duty from Toulon.—The
English have made an•attempt upon Reggio, the re-
sult of which is that they have had many killed and
wounded, without accomplishing their obje:t."
C A iTELN AU DAI ItY, DEC. 16.--A Laboratory
for the manufacture of sugar from beet root, has
been established here since the Ist inst. It is easy
to anticipate its advantages, and the proprietors are
already anxious to expose to sale their commodity.
The Public Authorities second the views of these
individuals, who deserve particular encouragement."
" CASSEL, DEC. Excellency Count Ma-
rio, Grand Page of his Majesty, Commandant of
the Royal Order of the Crown of Westphalia, &c.
&c. died here yesterday, after 30 hours of agony.
Ile was assassinated the evening before by a common
labourer. General consternation has been occasion-
ed in this capital by the circumstance." '

Arr. Mails. Due.
1
0
0
0
0

KING CNA RLIIIIII IVAiTTittocow--Ifoliday e 141 Public Officer.

•''THE STATESMAN.

LONOON:
PliillUDAY, irlimly3o, 1812.
'N6ll'

r'

NOTTI. ALAN RIOTS.
The disturbances with which this unhappy part of
the country have been long afflicted, seem rather to
, be increasing than diminishing, notwithstanding there
is a strong miStary force in that quarter, and the
most active of the Bow-street Officers have been sent
dQwu to assist them. The Luddites, as they are
r termed, are, in fact, so vigilant in their operations,
that not one of them can be seized, while they con,
tinue, with a daring unparalleled, to commit the
Imost extensive depredations against private property.
The following letter, which we received this morning
*from our Correspondent at Nottingham, contains
some interesting and important particulars on this very
alarming subject, which have uut yet met the public
eye
NOTTINGHAM, JAL 29.
It Is a consequence that might naturally be ex•
petted, from the number of men cast out of employ-
ment and rendered desperate by want, that crimes
would increase, both in magnitude and number ; and
ludeed such is the case ; for, as the frames are
broken, the frasne-breakers increase, and their de-
structive, daring, and systematic operations increase
In a like proportion. This neighbourhood has in
fact the appearance of a state of active warfare : sol-
diers are daily passissg to and fro, and are quartered
upon the farmers, for went of public-Muses to con-
tain titans ; ad the trembled eta* of the pub-
.

IF

,
•
4111.1;
priety of
PorarY) h
,ouuu 110 t
curacy of
perieoce a
that the st
• lion of tlu
mention,
article of
consideral
granted.
Mr. EI
next, vela

1.0L-
;;k