The Statesman.
London, England, 1820-02-19 00:00:00

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ionsiont.' " Ott !Mastery) • WWI Slot Vivre*" tot e
Motion of Sir W.-LESION, the oststatel., ghe•Civil List *Meow the Fourth ?.f
1+40.1 eit Etpatatim 'Mt 1 tad- saidi Maids Majesty's Mistatera had
Uirport-, raneredtdered Nekelbid before-the iiffousa - t pia up their tolods M. the suhject. What could
A PUJILIC saTt.VNI. . °Mutat the necessi:y of any Sheraton? Why depart
.
Maelstrom, from the flank of Zngland, pretest.. !root the establishid usoare. -Ls to the
. measstrei pros
Account of tile Public llelisucca its the liandstof -by the Noble Lord, if the ;Wordy of on imme-
iii.—Orriered to Le printed. • • • !Bate disolution were once acquieseeN in, to those par-
'Arno, from the City of London, preeestskikess tinder measures he could have no objection. He must
.t of the Persons committed to the varinns?risoasl make one exception. In an early part of the present
City of London during the last seer.--Ordered to Mosaloo, in consequence of the representations that had
led. . been made of the disturbed state of the counter, Perlis-
'ates, from the Pay offiep, presented an Account meet voted an additional military forte of II;000 men.
total Etcpenditure of that Office during the All alarm, he apprehended, was now dissipated, and be
Ind, 1613, and 1619.—Onlered to lie on the imagined that there were no sounder sleepers than the
man of the subjects of the country. Why, therefore,
was it requisite to keep up this additional military force
of 11,000 men to the Voli of June? And what chance
was there that at that time it would be reduced ; it being
notorious that the attendance in the (louse mould at that
period be very insufficient ? Where was the necessity of
deferring this and other important questions until a sea-
son when no reliance whatever could he placed on their
being fully and fairly considered ? He could nut give
his assent to the Noble Lord's motion, conceiving that
the Noble Lord was first housed to show what objection
there was to vote the Civil List at once, as was usual in
similar circumstances.
Lord CAm VLF:Hi:A(IH, in explanation, assured the
Right lion. lientletnan that he had no other purpose,
in the propositions which he had submitted to the
House, than that which he hod distinctly avowed.
Mr. TIERNEY wade some observations on the sub-
,kct of the Civil List, which were not audible in the
allery.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said.
that it wits generally called the hereditary revenue of
tie Crown, went now to the Consolidated Fund, hut
the Act which settled this point was nose expired. He
agreed with the Right Honourable Member (Mr. Tier-
soy), who said, that the Crown was at this moment
without any other revenue than that portion of the he-
reditary revenue which belonged to the Civil List,
asuminting to betweesi 500,0001. and 600,0001. lie
would on Monday next bring forward some measures
on this subject. It was his intention to move, that one
quarter's revenue of the Civil List, at its present rate,
which would become due on the sth of April, should
ho paid ; this would carry on the royal establish-
ment up to the sth of July, before which time the
Necessary steps would he talien by the new Parliament.
By this means all inronveuience would he avoided.—
The Right lionoorable Member had objected to tie
Coatinusnce of the increased number of troops, but it
should be recollected, that a considerable number of the
troops previously employed had been subsequently dia.
charged, so that in fact (as we understood the Right
lion. Member) the previous Mutiny Bill would cover
the whole number of troops to be employed. He felt
mtisfartion in stating, that it would not be necessary to
tote any additional mins fur this part of the public ser-
vice, there being at present a sufficiency in hands for
the purpose. It would be necessary to continue the Mu-
tiny Hill, and some other Bills, which would otherwise
expire with the dissolution of Parliament.
Mr. 11ROUGHA31 sod Mr. HUME rose together ;
sad there were repeated calls of " Mr. Brougham, Mr.
Brougham." 31r. 8., however, gave way.
THE QUEVN.
Mr. HUME said, it was proposed that several Bills
Now about to espies., were to be renewed. It was known
ihat by the 54th 14eo. 111. chap. 16, a sum of 35,000 f.
was settled upon the late Princess of Wales, now our
Ibmie. On the demise of his late Majesty, this grant
onanod ; he expected, therefore, that either the Noble
I-Lord (Castlereagh) or the Right Hon. the Chaucellor of
the Exchequer, would have stated whether this proii-
' Moo was to be continued, or whether any and what
other was to Ise substituted in its stead.
Lord CASTLEREAGH was understood to say, that
every pains would he taken to prevent any inconvenience
arising in the quarter alluded to, from the dissolution of
Parliament.
Mr. BROUGHAM said, his Right Hon. Friend (Mr.
Tierne) had so fully anticipated him in the view which
he intended to take of the subject, that lie had very little
M offer upon it. He could not, however, help express-
tog his surprise at the extraordinary nature of' the pro-
ceedings adopted by his Majesty's Ministers. With re-
spect to the subject alluded to by the Hon. Member who
had just sat down, lie assured the House that it was not
then his intention to offer a word upon it. He intended
to confine himself to that part of the Royal Message
whirls referred to the dissolution of Parliament. They
were called upon to give an opinion whether the pro-
posed dissolution was a well-advised measure or not.—
Titus called upon, it was no wonder that they should en-
ter upon the discussion ;—it was no wonder that they
should consider whether they ought to give an aye or a
ao to the question put to them. For himself he was as
Little averse to all immediate dissolution of Parliament
as the Noble Lord or any of his colleagues could
be.—He had, bon ever, one remark to wake upon
this advice given to the Crown ;—lse presumed
that they had maturely weighed the inconvenience
to which the country would be put by having the
election come on in the middle of the Assizes ; and
also the inconvenience which would arise, particularly
M professional men, from having the Term cool smote su
soon after the Assize*. On the former dissolatim of
Parliament the tarn was postponed, hut it could not be
done in the present instance. The next point to which
be should refer, was more material. Ile could not help
cioarratulating the House upon the admission which had
been, though slowly, wrung from Ministeis. Not long
'since they were told, that so great was the alarm in the
public mind—so inherent was vice ie the countrY-1
leo great was the number of discontented and designing
who were plotting the subversion of the Con-
,otitntion—that it was necessary to bridle the public
-Mind, and to deprive the people of their hitherto con-
stitutional right of meeting. But now the fart was, that
lore of these restrictive measures expired with the Par-
liament, and as Ministers did not exercise their discre-
tion in proposing its renewal, it skewed that the neees-
'lily for it had ceased, or else they were about to plunge
ther
viathwi
in,co:l:at:6:rd: o.ltsat)ottbst_i
e_dih pointt
refreshingin
jer. country
o thoughtot
CANNING obh toueioirtlnoatiwtssa.
ks
httli.fefth
e(eri.ur
eedlinan..sei ujosietthaneniedvltlwe
stun Constitution.
actuated.
phoeawinbcrolityhiflbaehjme ie•tttionsicri nOtielswnatS atahnt
lb.
oYorroeeri itsethel if:: ed—l
spoken lat it hlliaairei
on the other side of the House seemed to entertain one
motive fur advising the immediate dissolution of opinicro, that Ministers had some concealed and larking
Par-
liament. lie knew not how such a charge was to be
answered, unless by protestations to the contrary. Now
he moat distinctly denied that either himself or his col-
leagues had any such motive or object in view. The
Gentlemen who made this charge would, at a proper
dta, have an opportenity of comparing those protesta-
tbe • -nuld be introduced.
s would be
' same
of

Tog is mammon.
Order of the Day fur taking into consideration
lest y's Message of vesterday-la ing been read,
motion of Lord CAIITLEIMAIN the Slessage
read Iry the Alert.
:ASTLtaltAtill observed, that in rising to
Address in answer to his. Majesty's must gra-
ms's...T.., it might be for the convenience of the
to state .hat course it was the intention of
s to propose? in consequence of the recent and
It events. "here were only two courses which
pursued—either to en.leavour to go through
tole of the business, by extending the present
to the utmost lengih which the law would allow,
a new Parliatnein. The House would see that

inconveniences would attend the former of those
It would in all probability be scarcely prie-
d complete all the Parliamentary tinniness
prescribed period, and to select those topics to j
luck the especial atteution of Parliament should be di-
Tould be a difficult and an invidious task. Any
not completed by the natural close Of the !ifs-
would not stand so advantageously with reference
new Parliament as if absolutely commenced
' Parliament. IVeighing the alternative pre-
them, namely, olictffer the great business of
should be brought forward in the present or in
tenement, his Majesty's Ministers had decided
of a new Parliament. It appeared to them,
2, that the only sound proceeding was, to endea-
confine the measures to he proposed in the pre- ,
liament as ninth as possible to those which ,
ispensible to the public service. Ile was per-,
'are that it had been the usage on similar occa- ,
i the first meeting of Parliament after the de-
the Crown, to make provision for a great proper.
the civil establishment of the country,—li
was the wish of his Majesty's lioverimient
subject should be satisfactorily arranged.—
ild now state to the House the particular business
is Majesty's Ministers meant to propose for thel
ation of the present Parliament. With reseed
rate business, the House was aware of the course
' been pursued on former dissolutions—namely,
such so arrangement as would place private
in the new Parliament in the same situation as
which it had been left in the old, so that
iscoovenience would accrue to private interests:—
, public business, it was the wish of Hovels.
that the new Parlimisent should be placed in a
ion the most calculated to he advantageolto to
iblic service. It was sot proposed to rote any ad-
' sum for army servicesduriog the present Samisen.
i had already been granted to cover the expetoli-
the interval that would elapse before the niceties,
e new Parliament. It was intended to propose *el
continuance of the Mutiny Bill to the With of ,Ina., ail;
of several other Bills that annul otherwise ex.;
was probable that the House would wive at
of its labours by the end of the present abatis.
if it should accomplish all that woe necaleory
I or 4th of March, the new Parliament might
by from the 211th to the 25th of April, whentbe
of the year would be immediately entered iuto.
expressed his readiness to afford any explana-
aformation that might be required. the Noble
Included by moving an Address to his Majesty. '
vas an echo of the Message of yesterday.
iERNEY declared that the whole of the pro-
was the most extraordinary of the kind that he
heard of. He did not believe that there had ever
accession to the Crown without some comninui-
to Parliament efa nature very different from that I
hod been made in the present instance. It had
been usual to say something of the feelings ell
Monarch, and of. the course of policy which it
a intention to pursue. In the present case, the
had only been drily told, that his Majesty's Ho-
• found it convenient to send them about their
as soon as possible. Nut the remotest referees,
made in the communication from the teettni,
ulterior course of policy a Bich it was intended
wsue. lie mast observe, without meaning to say
ing offensive, that the omission of all such amb-
ition was very inilecorens. There was soother
great constitutional importance. In all for-
ams, on the • ion of a new Monarch to the
he expressed to the House his conhileace
, would make good the hereditary revenues
Crown. This operated in two ways. It te-
i the power of Parliament to vote those re-
not. It was highly important that it should
taken for granted that those revenues were not
the controul of Parllanseut. It was true that
them were so. But what were generally called
irreslitary revenues of the Crown, expired on the
of the Crown, and could not be legally collected
new Act of Parliament. Could any man doubt
here was something at the bottom of all this extra-
• proceeding( not hitherto explained ? What it
;new not ; but he was sure that no Administer-I
Ail wantonly, and without cause, depart from
was the atdimiq esiiies•-au steels oemisimpa.
could he comprehend the object of hnuselliately
log Parliament. All that the Noble Lea
that it would be inconvenient not to dlesolve
liawent ininseiliately. The Noble Lord's notion if
-avenient period for the laborious business of the
that it should commence in May—a season not
ig preceding that at which most Hoisostrabfe
to were in the habit of going into the country,
thereby rendering the proceedings of Parliament a
:ter. With respect to the dissolution. he (Mr.
'Hersey) was as desirous as any man to get, as speedily
Possible, through all the difficulties and annoyaner
och en election occasioned. But he had ditties first
perform in that House, which. he was bound not to
and lie could not, therefore, concur in the Ai-
proposed. From what had fallen from the Nobbt
;t dish not appear that it was intended to ask tido
Parliament for any further grant.--(An
xn of dissent from the Treasury Bench.)--Wits It?
,oble Lord and the (tight Honourable tleattleesist
seem quite agreed on that point. He wished
ild settle it. Did the Right Hempstead, o.i tt
so to propose a Vote bf Credit 10 the
ippiy ?
CHANCRLIOR of t:
(ended to - ob.
List up
TIERNST
'tad been
.. would
eartgn* tI
which" tk
that

...twilit it, disallow goat insportaiit ivalttes sf"1tilmf Sslb-
i ' siva would come on at a.per6olree the, year whwa it was Qs the
. almost t 11111111114.4 to kn.
.p a eitffieiellrlOttrasbeettf,Aelnkft& AeOkrels
is limn'.
• ... . • . , • , •.• • -s. i vett' turri*
Ept orni meg obenvc4ll4esild tettle ituithefee •
oftfiiSeesiun was yet to be Ism., ad eueitetisH4 that it, 'my. An
..ould be..Ampuesitile -to :get tistvitigltit in time to pre. a anAce,
pore Mr a Meselution at the end of sTY months. With the ia...,,,h
regard to the precedents _Omani fn. he would hare their
Mr.
Lordships to sednoisier in what state the petifie.hasiosia P.
.
re
Aceount co
t as on those different occasions. Tbe death of queen of the tit,
Anne took place la the month of August, n hen the busi- be rioted
1 to•se
:94 the Sissies was at an cud; that .of itieorge Om Hr. Vat
F4sl took glace in June, when the ppblic husineti was of tho tt
csolftliteriably advanced t and tbaf of tieorge the Second years 17*
in October. when the businels was conclovied, lu those taw,.
eases, therefore, there was no necessity for adapting the 1
nouns, which under the present circumstances ay pored I The On
expedienC Besides, since the death of his late Iligesty, his shiest
i
there was more emotion thronp bout the country, on the (tir the
prospect of the new elections, than prohably existed at itself „,
1,111 fornWe period. Perhaps there was not Ms instance Lord C.
known before, in which the save Paper that comma- ..„„, a„
.1
cleated
.*hr death of the King contained at) advertiae- Mous His,
; anent from e candidate fur the representation of seventy. House to
The example was followed in other instances, and upon Minister.
the *bole there was a degree of ferment in the country important
i• bash rendered the proceeding advisable. Knowing, could be i
this, and knowing that if they eutered into business the whole
row, it mast occupy at least five or six months, the, Session to
hail taken the middle course, as the one most suitable ,or to call
to the circumstances in which they were placed at the many ince
.
moment,
Liird Kr.lo said,courses.
that the immediite dissofitilie .liyable to
wotild bring them to May before the niar Pirlietnitilt • the tame,
totafel eseet. and he would leave it to the House to con- which the
skier to what time the Session must extend In that ease. „tied, wo
It was true, that they had a balance of convenience and nwasure n
inconvenience to decide upon, but thee there was uniform sons woo'
practice on one side, and that practice was, that after to ,„ net
the demise of the King, Parliament should proceed, in that
with as little delay as possible, to the arrangement of semis! to I
the Civil List. Ily dissolving now. they would leave the year a
the Crown without a Civil List. The hereditary re- a new Par
venues of the Crown were divided into two brioches : in favour
one, 6y far the smaller branch, was strictly the here- therefore,
iiitary eel-roue; but the other, which was considerably „or to „
mure extensive, depended on the vote of Parliament.— sent pariii
No man, he presumed. would attempt to apply that wen indit
part of the fond to the purposes of the Civil List, with- teeth airs
out the authority of Parliament ; nor was he sure wise- sions, on I
ther there was not some portion of the hereditary reve- raise of the
noes that expired with the late Sovereign. Upon the tins of tl
whole, he was adverse to the immediate dissolution of certainly
Parliasuest, without taking the Civil List into consider- that this
anon, as it was a mode of proceeding not respectful to He would
the new Sovereign. which Isis
The LORD I'HANIELLOR said he would state in considerat
a few words the grounds on which he gave his vote, to private
eepeeially as some Noble Lords, whose opinions were that had I
entitled to respect, had intimated that those who sup- to make
ported the motion sanctioned the Minister in venturing business it
unconstitutiosal advice to the Crown. But that was not
his view of the (location ; for, according to the law of that in a
no incouv
parliament in tomer times, on the demise of the As to pu
Crown, Hs* Parliament was ipesikete dissolved. He did meat that
,wt mean to say that it was not right for Partialness to sitastin,
nevi. extended its own existence for six months after the the public
demise of the King, as was dose by the Act of William diaries! se
the Third. His notion was, that the enactment was E h h
•properlyrly made, with a view to the public interest ; but Isis in th,
be that Act it was not determined that the Parliament of the net
should necessarily exist fur six months after the demise continuan
--s-lt was still left open to consideration how far the well as of
bailie convenience required that it should coed, ire. it
nee se to taint or not. If. os the other hand, they the close ,
thwarted the purpose of dissolving Parlianieut, toy if so, or i
going on with business shin the public convenience by the 3d
did uot require It, they were the persous who took assemble I
1 pit themselves to *ay that the Csaiwn should out business s
shut:Ave the Parliament. If they threw obstacles in Having „
the tray of the dissolution. they took spots themselves Lion or inl
thewotkority of deciding the question; and therefore Lord con:
Le naiad vote with his Noble Frit/oda, mot with a view whirl, wax
to Wink in epos the prerogative of the Crown, but to Mr. 111
pieVeat the prerogative from being istawfered with. ceeding a
The Varquis oILANSDOWN *sited, .whether it was had „wit
the ihtentien of Ministers to apply *bat part of the been an at
•
• h .reditary revenues. whisk were strictly such, to cation to 1
ii.ake up the deficiencies of the Consolidated Fend, in which hod
the interval between this and the meeting of the new aliwairs his
Parliamsut ? dos new )
The Earl of LIVERPOOL sosweeed, that he would was his i
not. take spots biumelf to say whether the other House
House hoe
aosifd adopt any temporary ineessire of finance dams/
vernment
tat interval; hut whether they did or not, ass wisteria business a
iniouvenience would follow, either to the public serviee had been
or,,,tvehe state of the Consolidated Fond. 11 ith respect as to the
to the army, he could also assure their Lordships, that to non,,e.
no shay slionld be continued in this conntry, even for any thing
.
I: so snort an luterval, without the authority of Patine inutile:di°
mail , point of 1
' $ The motion was then carried without a division.- ono suer cases,
the House *different till Monday. Throne,
--awe— that tey
HOUSE OF COMMONS. of theh Cr
cognised
slr W. CI*RTIS presented it :Petition frtim the Prison- venues or
ors uonfinal for Debt io the New Prison, praying for nut be tale
r. lief.—OrJereil to lie on the table. under the
1 Mr. A BERCItOoIBIE presented a Petition frost the „„,„f ti
1 Insolvent Debtors in the King's Bench, praying for a the hired
f e • litinuance of the law a Lich was to *spite on the t2d demise of
1. etant. without a
On the motion for laving the Petition on the table, that there
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCIIEQUER sind.that ordinary i
1 among the measures which it was intended to propose, was he la
• .
• i d 'ping the continuance of the present Parliament was lion wools
unealpr the prolongation of thelßill itt.lioftkkan... , that whit'
' to any eitretor oleo* Nor conk
Lan! AlTltlhOaßt Pi;
wwilibldreirsteteunicurch more ekpediene to dissolving
suck, argued
be to de more than to attempt auy amendment of the said was. ,
exierrig law. . Parliemen
The petition was then ordered to lie on the table. the court
Panocut Al. £BOllO. • year was.
I Sir W. DE CRESPIONY presented a Petition from i very long
1 respeetable tradesman. a chairman of a Committee of lientlemer
the Parishioners of Newingteto Butts. gainplaining of a and therel
r system of freed which had been dismayed in the pro- dead tette
I ceedinp of a collector in that parish, and praying fur Tierney)
redt'Cia. as possild
After a short conversation between the Coasent.i.on which an
♦ of die Excntovea and the Stasis'. ante the regu- to perform
'•
; lerity of receiving flitch* Petition. it was torght ap and neeleet ; i
ortkrteti to lie on the table. - dress prop,
Lord, at dwanes& LAW. •
lifr. BUXTON. in the name of en Iffliwlionhl. and present P
Learned Friend of his, whose intentino it bari bee* to &,1
tension •
move the re-appeintosent. ii SW point Session, of the ie Nobl
Voittenittest on the Criminal lA*. gave belie* that hia did nut a
Hon,. and Learned Prised, itibtoever- the opportunity .they nook
*Sold be afforded him by the reseinestiolieg of Parlim fan ioso
:tient, would move for the ' ninent of that Com; of
;biting. He was persuaded his illima-aO4 Learned. . The
Friend would, in that treat. the iireoirodoo of 1111 ifltei.th
Its, important euhloet is
react and assiduity as be
it tickle it Itierbi
Ileaelit4.l ;
01 Oa wood's of Dr. PMlttlit
roalllng of the Ma
Act A
raid to /Way. ~ n aria oe touch dia. laivil Loot
..rtialool what te- ' Mt. Tf I
„., • • .
.
-.
..... whirl% had
''
.;:: .. liaise.
.nt w
•lie "tow. _liras ere*
%Me. I.
-Pre7tlag. *hit
"—whatever,
a
-..

t• *Mike
• uselil *pal etedirisaw forth, Cita
*obi* Lord raid. Mal

, iime, nave an opportunity of comparing those pritteita-
VCIP.CLOR of the'r'AcilrtVEg salt 4 that ,tione with the measures wide* would be introduced.
to prom ao' gralit for t is paretiot of the He eonW macre the Ham, that the Civil List ovoid be
latherlitb araPril., at the iteemulit We. armaged with 'every tiew to etwoosy, awl, at the tease
NET resamad.-7Aeconliogistbpoedoeitot &hi* Att. . amid Net peraoa the omission of
ven made 4.
it:listilw JA tipapsw 11Par. a t emit tithe dignity of the Crows ?--(Heart)
Id not Ise ame ea L?, the ISt er. Aka. It. ...6.41 Wei tat fn of *a Majesty's Nielsen hi
theraforeAtVat. am would he its. ao)et waile.failt this illjdaet at • preyed. An; seek
iitaloorst
tb.-&„ „,ii slum*.. iii M, 4wiWeedloit lie lieolitisteot tifto the.Pbut which
ist Ow liunsc knew of. Allihis appeaeid they Wooded to follow. The flooonialiie sad Unified