The Statesman.
London, England, 1819-03-19 00:00:00

BANKRUPT LAWS.

Mr. JOHN SMITH, is as Ting for letire to bring
live Silt to amend the fires relating to Bankr•ptcy,
rook the oeportenity of stating to many Honsierable
Gentlemen, who, be bad no doubt, were ignorant of
the fact, that such was the confusion of the existing
Code on that subject, that it was very difficult so say
to whom It might or might not lie unexpectedly sp.
died. He was induced to say this lucistiterpsence of
e recent and retraordinary decisieo on the subject,
end also with a view to call the attention of the
House to the high importance of revising the system
—not alone on 'crowd of the importance of it to
the commercial world, bet as it involved mime of the
most valuable interests of jestice and morality.
The Ilsosourable Gentlemen then obtained leave to
bring in the Hill.
JUNIOR LORDS OF THE ADMIRALTY.
Sir M. RIDLEY row, he said, in consequence of
the notice he had giver, of moving ass Address to
his Royal Highness the Prince Regent to reduce the
'somber of the monitor Lords of the Admiralty. He
was sensible of the difficulty he Ist.••:ered under, not
merely from a consciousness of i-ssility, bet from a
recollection that it would ant he his power to add
any thing to the strength of the upsilon(' already
employed span this subject. With these feelings
operating en him, the difficulty of the undertaking
was still lightened bye conviction of its importance.
lie bed Retuned himself that the necessity of agita-
ting this question now would have been prevented in
consequence of the opinion expressed upon it derieg
• fernier Session of Parliament, by a very consider.
able minority in that House. When that opinion
was echoed by the Public throughout the country,
be felt some hope that it would have induced
Ministers. when a vacancy occurred among the
Junior Lords of the Admiralty, to advise his
.royal Highness the Prince Regent not to make
soy immediate appointment for filling it up. He
should not have brought forward the question of re-
duction now, were it not that be felt it his duty an to
do, when he perceived that Misiarers were not dir.
pored to comply with the wishes of the country. Ile
could not but feel surprised et the iddelicate burry
with which an individual was lately 'whited is, a
vacant place in the Admiralty. The appnisoment cc.
cursed while the discussion of the subjett was p.m!.
ing, god when the writ was :noted for' in C411“.-
9 arm., of that appointment, he (Sir M. Ridley)
runitately gave notire that he would briny it under
the consideration of the House. It would have been
bet proper on the part of Government, to with.
bold the nomination of the individual alluded to
while the propriety of confirming the place to whirls
he was raised was under deliberation. The lest time
be brought this subject before the House, the Noble
Lord opposite (Cestlerengii), induced them ring to
seppert his proposition, liveries. he raid it o es likely
the matter would be referred to a Committee. Ile
could sot bet take this opportunity of espressing
his regret that, of late, there seemed a strong in.
&Motion to depart from the mood old system, and
to throw rather too much of the public huvittese
into the bands of Committees.--(llcar. !)--The
matter, as the Noble Lord said, was referred to
a Committee, to whose Report lie would beg lease
s • call their siltation. It was in the month of February
he brought the sehject before the Hoes., and the
Report made its appesrence in June. In that Re-
port, the comber end salaries of the Lords of the
Admiralty were mentioned, bet with this ob -
'ion, that the Committee was withheld tr,.m recent.
mending anything open the subject by a tale decision
of the House. The Noble Lord (Castlereagh) was a
Member of that Committee; se that at one time the
Noble Lord disseaded the House from agitating the'
subject, became It was to be referred to a Commit-
tee, and in the Committee, it was decided that they
had no power to take it into consideration, le con.
seqcence of a late vote of the Home. This was a
standard by which the Report might be valued.—
When brought forward it was only as as argument
against discussion ; and if the Committee had recom-
mended that She number of junior Lords should be
diminished, there was very little reason to 'sped
that their retemeteedatioe would be attended to.

Tilt ATATt.qMAN

That such would be the case appeared frnin this tier. it was will tsewn that the *limier Lords were
comsteure. _ The Comaiselenetwof the Navy Beard I only required to sign sueltollecueseets that were
Weis so neaterees, that a Committee recommended , placed before them for that perpme. 'lt was per.
an esetninetlee late the necessity of their cooties.' haps neeessary that some owe shoold be appointed
once' before any (date vacancies were filled up.' at the out-pert ; did if necessary, would they send
However, contrary to the Report, twenties were , a person who could scarcely distingoists er74.gen
filled up. Whatever may be the good qualities, or I ship from a eaail.cooch ?—At this period while the
however high the character of the indisideal lately I country was in a slate of profound peace, be consi.l
appointed ro a place in the Admiralty, it should net dered that three Sea Lords and pee Lay Lord were
hr• done while the matter was ender coesiderdion. It quite competent to the basin's,. There were his
was not the chewier of the individese bet the ne- views of the question, and the grounds open whirls
entity of the office that could justify the cep. he should press the motion. The question was nue
peleinient. He would now beg leave to call the at of considerable importance, because it was Jaspers.
.aeration of the House to the Report of the Commit- tire upon the Hesse in protecting the gerierel into.
lee attach sit in 1797. It was composed of men of rests of the community to cut of every place where
considerable knowledge, of great ',patience, and lit might be elected without inconvenience, and that
well inclined to terve the Public. Of this there t with the view of establishing the principle of re-
mold remain no doubt, when lie mentioned some of henchmen! and economy, and this of all periods was
the names. Their late Speaker, the present Lord Col- the season for conducting politic busiems *pots a li-
cheater; Mr. Dudley Rder. now Lord Harrewby ; tidied scale. It would be well for the House, as
Mr. Henry Thornton, and Mr. Charles Yorke, were guardians of the public purse, to 'tierce* a spirit of
of that Committer. and they were not likely to re- i discretion, and he implored them before they ease
commend any measure injurious to the country, or their votes to take into consideration the stare of the
likely to take away from the necessary and salutary country, and be with confidence anticipated, teat
power of the Crown. In this Report It was stated, his motion would he supported by a triumphant sea.
bat the Committee thooght it their duty to observe, , jority. Ile thee snowed that an hatable Address be
that there were six. Commissioners of the Nisi, be. I presented to his Royal Ittihad' the Prince Regent,
sides the principal ; that no reduction was likely tol that his Royal Highness would be plumed to r.
take place at present ; but that the Coodesttee the number of the Junior Lords of the Ada natty,
thought it worthy of consideration, whether, if such es far as was consistent with the present state of the
a reduction of the Nave took rise* as must diminish esentry et this reams of irrofnen.l peace.
the besierca of the Onice, the member of Commis. Sir GEORGE COCK BURN would not have
elopers end Clerks might net also be reduced.— rises on the present occasion, If the Honourable Bs.
Ceevernment, in one respect, conformed to the Re- ronet bad not made a direct attack of an act of im-
part; bet whom did they dismiss? Was it those who' justice in the appointment of a Chaplain at Pons'
were unnecessary sad quite useless? They reduced mouth.
the clerks from 50 to 30 ; but in every other respect Sir M. W. RIDLEY said be had been mistaken.
eetrencleneet arid economy gave way to the stronger Sir 0. COCKBURN proceeded. Ile had ender.
lalleence of patronage. The !tininess of the office was stood the Henoerable Baronet to say, that the Chap.,
diminished, as appeared clearly by the diminution of !sin at Portsmouth had been appointed in cease.
I the dere& Another proof of it was, that formerly I tweet of the influence he possessed in that borough;
Iva Boards were held every week ; and they were this, however, was tint the case, anti be would state
sow reduced to three.—(deer!)—This was ample the poetical'', to the Howe. After considerable
peeof of a diminution of business. In the year 1797, discussions on the subject the Board decided that
1140,000 seamen were voted foi the service of the three senior Chaplains should be appointed, one at
year. Up to 1814, the number varier! from 140,000 Portsmouth, one at Plymouth, and one at Chatham ;
to 1.10,000 mess, and there were 1000 sail in vita. after it had been thus determined, dispatches were
mission. The number of seamen now were 40,030, dot dishing 'a
return of the three sellers, and in the
end all the ships of war in commission were only M. list received, the Gentleman at the heed was the one
Yet for this number of seamen and Alps, tbete were who had been appointed to the Portsmouth station.
as many Junior Lords of the Admiralty as when there This being the fact, he w Geld ask whether, he
were 120,000 seamen, and 1000 ships in commission. could wee any decency base opposed the sp.
They were of course either too few in the former po. pointmeat, because that Gentleman happened to be.
✓iod, or too many at present. There was no eons. long to Portsmouth?—[Hear, hear!)—The lion.
plaint of there beteg too few. It was right to pre. I Baronet had remarked upon the reductions that had
CL't: te then, that sit Junior Lords were considered soy- I been made .in the Navy, although he believed the
ficreirs ; oud that if sufficient when the Naval este. statement waled overrated ; them at present in corn-
biisliment was so large, there could be no necessity mission were divided Into 10 or 14 stations, to each
for continuing them at present. It was tree, that Go. of which a Commentier.in-Chief was appointed, on
vernment had made many redectioate in the Navy.— whom the miner tidiness devolved ; with thcse the
They carried it perhaps further thee good policy re- Board had to support a centimes! correspondence,
cloned. It was to be regretted that it was not kept added to which there were 9,oooofficers, dispersed
sip to the fullest event, for it was the niters! tie. over all the quarters of the globe, with whoa a cot-
fence of the country ; and many persons who loved respondence was carried on ; for the Officers of the
that country could not bat lament to see soother Navy differed frees thole of the Army; they were
li-
service preferred to it. high as that service deserved able to be celled into immediate serstce, end it was
to be valued. He hoped, if future circumstances consquently Necessary that their every movement
should render war neavoidoble, Goverment would could be known; there were a.su numerous applies-
sent find it difficult to meet their twenties on that elle. lions made that required constant attention. During
ment where the British Navy bad acquired so mach the war, the efforts of the Officers were directed to.
glory.—[/Isar, bear, heart]—In such an event, be wards one object—the common eerie,' of the coon.
much feared they could Dot easily conect a body of try ; but sow their talent, were directed le prim.
seamen solicieut for the public service. With re. ciples of science, and namberlss were the plans for
apect to Junior Lords of the Admiralty there was no Improvement of rigging, sails, bulk', and not cos.
cease for eppreltension. They need not fear, in fined to these points, bet tbeir enquiries were "s-
-lime of necessity, to base as many josior Lords of tended to discoveries in astronomy ; it was tree,
the Admiralty as they wanted. The colliery would many of the propositions were not olopted, yet they
produce them without the least difficeity. While required attention, and were taken into considers.
the Board of Admiralty continued so numerous, lion. Gentlemen who, like himself, had passed e
Government, in other respects, bad recourse to great part of their lives la the sea service, meet m-
a redaction that might be spared—he alluded to ceive the necessity of a competent number of advisers.
the Chaplains. A remonstrance was made on the He would ask the House, whether they ever knew
subject • and the answer 'ensured war, that the re- two professional men agreeon a professional subject;
doted Chaplains shook! have a preference its port up. and to convince them of this, he might refer them to
pointments to do harbour duty. This determination the conflicting opinions of physicians. The Lords of
was just ; but how was it adhered to? lo Ports. the Admiralty, anthem to conduce to the public
mouth an individual was eppeluted who had no claim letterset, had adopted • regular mode of proceeding.—
at all. Ile did Not know veracity the grounds of this Certain days were appointed for discussions, and
appointment, but believed they might be looked others for correspondence. He could assure the
for in the last Election. It could not be dieted Howse, that from the moment of his appointment en.
that Government 'honed a disposition to act sport 111 the present, his !meagre had been incessant; so
a system of economy end retrenchment, grime mesh se, that it was difficslt for him to take a walk
in cases where it interfered with painterly. Ile even for half an hour ; and his colleagues IMO ill
believed It to be a fact, that the person to whom he equal attendance, 'seeming they were not detained
just alluded. received his appointment in commitment so late in the treating. lie felt the responsibility
efelectioneeting exertions? What motive could there attaching to the tidies of the office, sod was
be for continuing so many Lords of the Admiralty persuaded that three Sea Lords and three Lay
snider present circumstance'. The fact was, that they Lords were absolutely Necessity. If the numb",
had hardly say business except merely to receive was reduced, the difficulties that should be obviated I
their eateries, and to egoist each ether in doing No. would occur ; and to conduct hosier's on an ad.l
thing..-(Mr.Croker arfkd.)—The llonoerable Geo. 'adaptd plats, it was absolutely eecessety that
demon might laugh. He should be glad to beer him there should be a decided majority one way or the
esplrin elm the laborite of the Board were. The other.—(Loargeter.)—Any alteration would be
basis epou which the Board of Admiralty woe con. highly prejudicial to the public interest, and the sp.'
strutted, was in consequence of a Committee held tem bed been found obsoletely sectosary during a pe.
thereupon during the reign of henry VIII. since tied of epwsrds of 100 years, and bad been lustre-
which period there were many instances where the mental in effectuallycoodscting lb t ryibroegb an
Commissioners of the Admiralty were composed of a arduous war. During that period, ships were sent to sea
smaller ounsher ; in 1704 there were four, in 1706 in a most imperfect condition; but now it was thedetyl
four, in 1714 five, in 1717 five, in 1775 five Lord es it bad been the end f the Lords of
t►e 11
Sniti • ich. the First Lord ; in 1789, Earl Chetbarri Admiralty, to place the fleet in the most efficient state;
at that time the First Lord, there were sir • in and he believed that it was at this moment its a mere
the coulie of that year Sir F Drake was removed I perfect condition thee it bad even beets before. Great
death, and frees December 1789, to November 1790, attention had been paid to keep them tree from the
the number of the Commissieeers was only five. dry rot, and to preserve the ships, so as to be ready
(,)" referring to the documents within his command— for immediate service, Jai case if a renewal of the war.
(although the Right Hon. Gentleman, he was aware, These I &Mkt occupied much time and Men.
hail contradicted the statement' bet he, of course, lion. Besides It was not to be espected that the Com.
could only judge from the records of the House)— missioners could always pass the year free from sick
yet, from the documents to which be bad access, I nest ; and it was necessary that such an emergency
there were never any specific estimates, they were might he provided spent. Ile apologised for basing
included in the item of the midweek,' of the Navy, I introduced himself to the notice of the Home, nor
end this had been the course for limey yeses pest. would he, bed he not bees personally called upon.
Another objection had been stated, that it was tie- Sir ISAAC COFFIN would ask the Right lion.
cessary that the documents required to be signed by I Gentleman, whether tbe First Lind of the Admiralty
three 'Commissioners: this difficulty might easily be had signed five documents, excepting the receipts fur
sormounted by his Royal Highness the Prieto Re-' his salary ? Of what was the Beard now composed ?
gent signifying, that the signature of two should be If that would restore it to the efficiency it formerly
sufficient. Besides, general documents were signed possessed, he should not complain.
by the Secretary, and it was only upon particular Sir G. COCKBURN having been asked a direct
occasions that the signateres of the majority of the i question, replied, that the First Lord attended in his
Commissioners was requisite; could any ma. be- turn, and was always punctual in his attendance.
lie," that the First Laird of the Admiralty weld I Sir M. RIDLEY, io eaplenation, said, that he had
allow the Junior Lords to she upon there the' written to Portsmouth, and was informed that the
&potability polio!, 'attach's' to himself; for facts were as be had stated them to it,e House.

• FA LGSART en.,, amidst ad cries of
iltresifo rt,eprestion !--ife thnught tffielevech of the
Hon. rra.' oppositelended to show. that there
had Median! Ni•efficAs of the Admiral'', during
the war. Ile bed dioptajerl the multiplicity of busi.
nets that envied, the correspondence with the Com.
maniere on the ten or twelve stationA• sod the or-
reossry vonnsonication with the 8006 Neve! Offierrs.
Notwithstanding this statement, he could got be p.r.
seeded. that the business was not reduced 'Jae. the
resterstioe of peace. Whrn this subject had beaus
formerly discut.se•f, it bed been argued that rhea.,
Offices were necessary es a school of elore,ion,
requisite as a preparation for public haloes.,
but no men coold behest the person, pies
of an equal quantity it business.—The patron-
age end iefluenee of the Crown was too Wended,
at.:l where it was possible to reduce a place without
injury, it was the imperative duty of the Hoes, to
carry it into efrect ; sod could it be said that any
danger would result Item the redaction of the two
Officers now proposed! It would be degrading to
the country if such a palpable imposition could he
overlooked. perticelerly when promises of economy
he.l here held forth; but if foilsmen/test was to be
Confined to mere talking upon the subject. the Hoots
would do well to vote in she large majorities antici.
patrol by the Gollaut Admiral. It appeared that when
specific retrenchment was proposed, either that it
was not proper, or th.t the time was ill chosen.
The fart eat, that no perticialsr objection prevailed,
unless it touched the power of the Administration.
He had no doubt of the laborious mations of the
Gallant Admiral; be bad not the pleasure *1 his cc-
apsainteace sufficient to know whether he could
walk for half an hour in the day, but he need
set be alarmed for the health of the Junior
Lords, who found time to walk and to ride in
Hyde Park every day. As to the offices being ac-
cessary, as initiatory to public basin's% be could
sot forbear alluding to a certain Noble Marquis who
Lihad been introduced ender that swegestiou; hot it
was certeioly 'other 'Weir. that after he had been
twelve months in ernce, and hod received his edeu-
tine, that he should be dismissed, and a Hammel be
introduced without an Admiralty education. The
'skint. as Car as argument was concerned, he coo-
siderrd to be disposed of ; hot how via Junior Lord.
could be necessary, nitre the ?levy originally con-
notes! of Itiau ships, out! 1-10,000 seamen, bat now
reduced to 127 ors.ols, hr acs ate loss to conceive;
sod when it was considered that peace generally pre.
Tailed, be anticipated th .t the motion of his Ilea.
Friend must be cart led by a largo majority ; nor
could he beiieve, unless he saw it, that the House
could oppose the propologi retrenchment.
Mr. GRAHAM was engines to support the pria-
ciple of o my, because he considered by that
alone the country would be enshi.-d to surmount hi
difficeltieo. lie should be
notion of the power of the Crown, but he ihneeht it
bad too much inctesa.d, sod ought to be diminished.
He was persuaded that the present Administration
had boat the public confidence, end resisted every at.
tempt to reduce those espences by which their is.
Gera* wee supported. He thought an Administre.
Lion might be folioed to conduct the business de.
peudeot alone upon public opinion, instead of ore
that was plated by the patronage of the Crevr• be-
yond its Inluente. Upon these principles the melee
bed his cordial approbatirso and support.

Mr. CANNING epnko in a low tone of voice, bet
ooderstood kin to say, that he should oppose the
motion.

Lord 3. RUSSELL remarked, that the grounds oil
which tins question bad bees formerly resisted Wet,
epee the priteciple of edecating yoeng meta, bat now
Ibis argesmet was abandoned, and it was found that
8000 Offices, were engaged in sew discoveries,
amongst *Yids the orient* of eatroneney was intruded.
The Lords of the Admiralty too had to decide upon
the right of nations, hence it was necessary that they
should receive a complete till, education, land have
the works of Cyclist and PetTendert by heart.—
It had bees said that two professional meta could
not be sent to the ostports, because they seldom
speed, and therefore as a remedy another ac-
companied them who was altogether Ipiorsat of
tee business. It was however apparent that
the messages of the Ministers had undergoes a
considerable change.--Formerly say attempt
In enquire into th- state of the Bask, or into the
Criminal Law was strenseesly opposed, bet
letterly,Cosomittees bad been appointed OS theme sees.
sal subjects, and if the present usotioa was resist.
ed. what wosid it be but soling to the coustry that
se concede to as enquiry into the stale of the Basta
and into the Criminal law, bet as Ministers, we
Idepend net os public opinion, nor the affectioeate
attachment of the subject, bet we are supported end
will protect tier ;toner supported by the patronage
and places in the gift of the Crona.—(lleat,hear!)
Mr. T. L. W. POLE did not consider that the
intimate of the Crrwn was too myth iscreesed,Aed
felt persuaded, if the lino. Member's opposite would
consider the question dispiminnately, they wield
form a different ovision. Of this he felt penueded,
that many sot ti6ced their ;nitrate opinion to the Aries
of popolailty.
Strangers were ordered to withdraw, and the Reese
divided, 'Mott there were—
Noes atii I Ases Pit I Majorit♦ acetate the Mabee SI.
The remaining Orders of the Day wet, then dis-
posed of, and the llosiio adjourned at Tee .'Clock.

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