The Statesman.
London, England, 1810-02-27 00:00:00

•
e

.. 1 : ♦'

•

,

i

PRICE Bib.

was only surprised that it proved so little. He
objected to reversions, as, having a tendency to
generate sinecures, and the augmentation of sine.
cures produced new reversions in an endless eirclo.
This was a real and proper reform which he ap• '
proved. As to the question of parliamentary re.
form, he certainly could not by any Means go the
length that some speculative men did, although he
and others might think there were some defects in
'the representation, which ought to be correcteu.
But the misfortune of withholding from the pub.
lid the real and proper reforms to which they
were entitled, was to drive them into these dan.
gerous speculations. The vessel of State, which
had weathered the continental storm, was already
among -the rocks and shoals, and could not be got
off without other pilots. His Lordship then called
upon the. Bishops for their support, and asked
tbesn,_whtither they did not esteem the Art of Ell.
wkiefriseevental,bnnoticipation of:their
revenues as the great prop of their establishment?
Upon thesamo principle which led them to approve
of that Act, they ought to support this Bill.
Tito House then divided upon the question that -
the Bill be read a second time—

'

COMMAS Net Contents
Present - 33 49
Proxies - 34 '57
67 ' 106
Majority against the Bill 39.—Adjourned.
•tsWente
• HOUSE OF COMMONS, FRI. 96.
Mr. Sheriff WOOD presented at the bar the Pea.
Lion of the Corporation of London against Lord
Wellington's Pension, Upon the motion of Al.
derman Combe, it was ordered to lie on the table.
The Worthy Alderman also stated his intention to
postpone for a short time his intended motion rela.
tive to the manner in which the Livery were
treated, when the Sheriffs required au audience of
the King.
Mr. BARHAM made his promised motion re- ,
lative to tho abuse of certain funds by the Direc.
tors of the West IndinDock Company. • He stat-
ed, that by the Act if Parliament which embodied
that Company, the intrust rpm the sems advanced
by subscribers was limited to ten per cent. and the ,
enrplus'Of the profits was appropriated to the ex.
tinction of its debt, and to the service of the city Of
London. In the interpretation now given to that
Act by •the Directors, they took upon themselves
to pay the full dividend of ten per cent, to the pito-
pricier", charging the surplus with the payment of
the income tax ; so that, in fact, the subscribers
were now receiving eleven per cent. in contractile..
tints tO the positive enactments of that law. He '
V
coltlnded bylpoving, that the Animal Accounts of
re t,,st tale D'ock. Coin.pany b referred co-s
Select Committee, and that they report thereon. _
Mr. HIBBERT contended that there was no
necessity fur the motion, as there was no disposi.
tion with the Directors of the Company to deny
the statement. The question was, either they in.
fringed or they had not; if they had infringed,
they were subject to a process at common law; and
if they had not, there could be no necessity for the
present motion.
:After some farther observations from Mr. Mar-
ryat, Mr. Baring, and Mr. Barham, the motion
was agreed to, and the Committee appointed.
LORD CHATHAM.
ThnCHANOELLOR of the EXCHEQUER.
appeared at the bar, and stated that his Majesty
had been waited upon with the Address of this
House of Friday last, the 23d of this month, to
which he had been graciously pleased to direct the
following answer to be given :
" The Earl of Chatham having requested his Majesty to
permit him to present his report to his Majesty, and having
also requested that his Majesty would not communicate it for
the present, his Majesty received it on the 15th of January
last and kept it till the teeth of this month, when in come.
come of a wish having been expressed by the Earl of Chat-
ham; to correct the same, his Majesty returned is to him.
The report, as altered, was again tendered to his Majesty,
by the Earl of 'Chadians, on the 14th of this month, *hen
his Majesty directed it to be delivered to his Secretary of
State, and his Majesty has not kept any copy or minute of
this Report, as delivered at either of dame times, nor has he
had nt any time any other report, memorandum, narrative,
or paper, sabmitted to him by the Earl of Chatham relating '
to the lute Expedition to the Scheldt."
Mr. WIIITBREAD observed, that in the roes..
tiou he was about to put to the Right Honourable
Gentleman opposite (Mr. Perceval). he wished to
be understood as animated with the most sincere
veneration for the Crown, and not less so for the
wearer of it. His question was this—Who was
the Privy Counsellor, a Member of this House,
who took his Majesty's pleasure upon the Ad.
dress ?
The CHANCELLOR *of the EXCHEQUER.
replied, that although it was theordinary courtesy
in that .llouse to answer questions put from one
side to the other, yet, from the menacing manner
in which the Right Honourable Gentleman put the
present question, he felt it his duty to decline an.
peering it, Mail called upon by the vote of that
House.
Mr. WHITBREAD.—'' Really if there hof
been in the manner in which I addressed the Right
Honottrabie Gentleman any thing obnoxious to hit
feelings, or as he has conceived menacing, it iffen. ,
I assure him, far from my intention, and I Wet
111
sincerely beg his pardon: If, however, the bight .1
Honourable Gentleman is determined to persevere,
in his silence to my question, it will be most cer.
tainly my 'duty to bring it forward is a more for. ,-
mat manner. But wishing as I do to divest hi,nt
of the ilea) that I intended to convey my question
•

•
•

, ,

•

i, r

• . •

I

:'

-

~ 4

•
•
•
•

~_~ `;v .~

~~-.

;. , .

In any ancourteons manner to him, I take kayo
to put it again."
Mr. PERCEVAL.—gi I was the Privy Coen-
eellor that took his 3litiestl's pleasure upon the !
Address." •
In answer to a question from a Member, the
SPEAKER stated, that the Address was commu-
nicated-to the Crown in the way usually adopted
it pita such occasions.
Lora TEMPLE allndid to the manner in which
the Address upon the Chancellorship of the Pa.
eby of Lancaster was. conveyed to the rupee, as
a proof that there were some deviations_ .
The SPEAKER replied, that he did net insi-
mate, that it was the only mode ever adopted.
bIt.PONSONBY, without giving any opinion
at *resent upon the answer now giveif, trusted,
that it tiould be inserted upon the Journals of the
Musa, in order
.bat, if necessary, an applica-
tian might be made to it on a future occasion. .
The SPEAKER.stated, thatit was the uniform
rule to bate the answer inserted on the Journals.
MILITARY EX pENPITURE.
Sir THOMAS TURTON stated his desire be-
fore he brought forward the motion of which he
kid given notice, to set himself right with the
house and the Country, in answer to cliarg.CS
brought against him by Ministers upon a former',
night, lie was then told that his object was to
riishaud the army and stop its pay. The injustice
of such a charge was evident front the fact, .that
the delay his motion woul l.occasion in voting the
Army Estimates, could not be produCtive of any
such effea, inasmuch as Use Mutiny Bill in England
would not cvpire before the 25th of March, oar io
Ireland until the l't of A pril. Independent of that,
t ie House had already voted the sum of five millions
fir the army. Surely then the House would do him
• the justice of bc'ieviog, that his motives were not
those imputed to him, and that he was but exec.
rising his duty when he objected to give such an
army .ts was voted last year, after the evidence
they had received ; namely, that out of 105,000
effective men according to the last year's estimates;
Ministers could not provide in the month of March
last 16,000 (or foreign service. But he was told
by the Minister, that it would be much more cue.
rect to bring at orteca specific charge against them,
rather than take his present course. this answer
was, that he would not vote au army so large to
their disposal, whom he accused of being critni-
till!y lavish blood and treasuns of the country,—
to whose conduct, he attributed the . loss of
Spain, and the depreciation of the King's
G•ivernment in the estimation of the public.—
Such men he would not trust with the nation's
means to be squ'andered in such Expedi.
lions as that of Walcheren. It was true .that
seine of them had changed places whilst others
had retired, and although the present War Secre-
tary had not as much military ardour as his pre-
decessor, sill such was their atarsta for ruinous
expeditions, that lie would not be much est°.
iii,ll..d at some attempt,. even now, to renew the
mut hto Paris. [A laugh After some other
observations the lion. Baronet concluded with
moving, " That there be la;d before the House a
Iteturu of the amount of the Expenditure of the
isii!itars Force of the Country from the 24th of
Dee. to the 25th of Dec. 1809."
Mr. LONG btated, that if it was in the con.
temptation of the Honourable Mover to have ac.
Coo " of the Expenditure of our whole Military
Force, both at home and abroad, that was im-
practicable without considerahle delay. There
could be no objection to produce an account of
the sums issued by the Secretary at War for the
time, although from the late period (the very day
on which the Army Estimates were to be consi-
dered) at which the Honourable Baronet brought
fu;ward his motion, lie could not see how it was
possible that such return could answer his (Sir 'f.'s)
object.
Sir JOHN NEWPORT suggested, that it
would be advisable for the future to provide that
the Mutiny Bill should not expire until a more ad.
sauced- peried of the Sessions. It would in the
case of such arrangement be practicable to have
the accounts of the preceding years laid in the fol.
lowing Session b.-fore the House.
Sir THOMAS T, URTON, in explanation, ob.
served, that much information would be communi.
cated by getting the account, so far as it could be
Made up. Why not give the account as it refer.
red to the ilt•ne Service, and to the Expenditure
of the army sent to Walcheren. There P0(1111 be
no injury to rho public service by delaying the con..
sideratien of the Army Estimates for eight .or ten
days, and in the mean time an account could ho
prepared calculated to impart very satisfactory iq.
formation. •
Mr. HUSKISSON said it would be impossible
to prepare within a given time the general account
required by the reliant motion, the only practi.
cable object woulit be to obtain the sums issued.—
With reipeet to the akenrie-essot -to Wileiteree, it
w is to be recoiled, that the expenditure for sub.
sokting that army would have been the same, who.
tiler they remained' at home or went upon ser.
nice.
Mr. PARNELL considered it no (answer to a
ill-ocher of Parliament to inquire into the public
~ mntliturc, to be told thet.the account could not
be made up. It was only a proof that our sys.
tern of accounting was defective, end ought to be
corrected.
Mr. CALCR AFT contended. that the House
shook! pause'before it voted a new army tq hli.
misters, who, as was proved in evidence, could not
out of 105,000 effective voted last year, provide
in the mouth of March last 16,000 fur the public
service.
Lord PALMERSTON answered, that the ex-
planation on that point was, that although there
were 105,000 effective men, there could not at
that time be provided a disposable force of snore
than 16,000 men.
Mr. CA ICRA FT—So then out of the 405,000•
effective men, it is now to be understood there
were 89,000 non-effective.
The CHANCELLOR. of the EXCVEQUER
Rated, that the full force was. effective, but that
the obstacle the tins alluded to arose from the
Mate of the new eguipmento.
fir GEORGE' WARRWPER remarked,
- -

.;

1

-

[ i's7lf C__ ',:..x.qtrt,',;:xl._

~.:~..

KIT"

1-,
•

.. ~.

Tftv TOATESNIAN.

that such an explanation was only applic.ible to
the army which returned from Corunna. By the
Estimates 'before the' House, it-was evident that
independent of that force there was a return of
70,000 effective men in the month of January last,
to whom to whom the explanation with respect
to the state of their equipments could not apply.
The house then divided, when the numbers
were—

• •For the radio°. of Sir T. Turtoa 35
4j4irbt it .• - - - 76
• Majority —4l
VELLERsizip OF THE EXCHEQUER,
The CHANCELLOR. of the. EXCHEQUER
monad fur a new writ fur the-couuty of Cambridge,
in the"room of the Right Hon. Charles Yorke,
who since his election hail accepted the place of
ono of his Majesty's Tenets of the itchsquer.,--
Agreed to.

~

- -
Mr. HENRY MARTIN gave notice, that he
would, on the first open day after theOermination
of the Inquirg, move fur leave to bring in a Bill to,
extend the provisions of the Act, relative to
Masters and Suitors in Chancery.
LORD WELLINGTON's PENSION.
Mr. WHITBREAD, on the Order of the Day
for the second reading of the " Wellington Pen.
sioit Bill," said, that irirderstanditig that a Petition
from the City of Loudon had been that day pre-
sented to the House, against the Bill for granting
a Pension to Lord Wellington, he trusted that the
Right Honourable Gentleman would see the pro-
priety of net pressing the second reading on that
day. •
The CITANC.ELLOR of the EXCHEQUER
confessed, that he could not possibly see the ne-
cessity of any such forbearance. He should
therefore move that the Bill bestow read a second
time.
On this question being' put frbm the Chair,
Mr. WHITBREAD said, that he was sorry to
trespass upon the time of the House. He had al.
ready occupied too large a portion of their attention
and, perhaps, wearied out their indulgence in deli.
awing at full, upon a former occasion, his opinions
upon the merits of the late campaign in the Penin.
sills. Ho should not now re.statc thoseopiniona, but
content himself with referring the !Louie to the
consideration of the Petition that had that day
been presented to them from the Corporation of
the City of London. The objections to the
grant in question were put In so plain, clear,
full, and satisfactory a manner, as could not
f..il of making a serious impression upon the mind
of every unprejudiced man. Hu thought, too,
that even those who thought more highly of the
services of Lord Wellington than he did, might
have very different notions as to the lavish expen-
diture of the public money ;. they were not merely
to consider whether Lord Wellington deserved that
remuneration, but whether it ought to be derived
to him from the public purse ? A near relative of
the Noble Lord had, on a former night, favoured
theta with a statement of his private means, .which,
though not of splendid munificence, was yet, he
thought, such as proved that there was no neces-
sity to press further, in the present instance, upon
the.public burthens. One million of money was
to be voted towards carrying on the war in Portu-
gal ; the result, as yet, of all our efforts its that
quarter was, that tho Junta was driven to the for-
tress of Cadiz. lie thought that, under such cir-
cumstances, such a Bill ought not to be hurried
through any of its stages. On these grounds he
should oppose the second reading.
Sir JOHN NEWPORT rose, merely to make,
in addition to the observations that had been
made by his Hun. Friend, ono remark that it had
not occurred to him to make—it was this, that in
consequence of the late melancholy fate of a much.
respected and justly valued friend, an occasion had
presented itself to Ministers amply to remunerate
the services of Lord Wellington, without making
any additiou •to the public burtheirs. [hear,
hear !] •No sootier, however, had the lamented
fate of his regretted friend (Mr. Eden) been
ascertained, than the Tellership 'of the Exche-
quer was conferred upon a person, of whose ser-
vices Ministers might have had such an opinion as
to think if he fought no -battles abroad, he
had at least fought 34.)M);( at home. He thought
that the Bill should not be now pressed,' if
it was only in common resin& to the Petition of so
respectable a body as the Corporation of the City
of London---a Petition that put the question in
the clearest and simplest poincof view. He admit.
ted the gallantry of Lord Wellington, but thought
this a question not involving merely the considers.
tier) of his merits. lie regretted that the unques-
tinned and unquestionable merits of a lamented
0 Meer had not been more attended to. He thought
that the glurious service's of the immortal Hero of
Corunna had not yet beca answered by the public
gratitude as they ought to have been.- It/oars
'hear !1 • .
hlr. HUTCHINSON spoke, in terms of high
eulogium of the general nature of the military ser.
vices of Lord Wellington.
• Mr. HENRY MARTIN expressed hie surprise
that the very important and pressing observation
made by the Right Honourable Baronet, on the
filling up the vacancy unite Tellership of the
Exchequerl had not been thought worthy of some
reply from any of his Majesty's Ministers. lie
felt satisfied, that if Ministers had advised his Ma-
jesty to confer that place upon Lord Wellington,
there was nut a man in that douse who would
have questioned the propriety of the oppuinttnent.
With respect to the Gentleman upon whom that
appointment had• fallen, he believed' that his ser-
vices in behalf of the poblie were yet to b 9 made
known. .
Sir WILLIAM CURTIS said, that there was
no man who felt a higher sense of respect for the
Corporation of the City of London than ho did ;
but however he respected their opinions, he could
not implicitly sacrifice his own. lie expressed
himself in terms of unqualified praise', in speoking
of the services and military qualities of *L'ortl Wel-
lington; and valuing those services as be did, he
could not think that they were oven•ated by the •
epmparatively paltry grant of aCeOOO a year.
The question being thee loudly called fur,. the

""

• '

. .
•

• .

.

gallery was cleared for a division, when chore ap-
peared for the second reading—
Ayes -
Noes - . 01
majority —7O.
On Our. re.adinission, we found the Ikon is
Committee on the
ARMY ESTIMATES.
Lord PALMERSTON, after a few prefatory
observations, iu which ho claimed the indulgence
of the House,. pwmised to trespass upon it as
shortly as possible. He proceeded to recapitulate
the digerent heads of the estimates, which he
stated in all to amount to twenty.one. He
proceeded through them, one by one, shew-
log as ha went along the changes, if any,
made in the respective Departments with which
they were severally connected, and the increase or
decrease that resulted from that change. The first
wide of the twenty.one heads he stated to be
that of the, Land Forces. He said, that the ge-
neral rule in fixing the establishment was where
the effecting fall short of 400 mcn. The catab,
lishment of the whole was fixed at 400. There
would be found an increase un this establishment,..
owing to the transfer to the Commissariat Depart-,
ment, of the supplying the bread and meat to tho
men. There was also a reduction ih consequence
of the abolition of the agency of cavalry mon.—
The next article was that of the Cavalry. Here
there was a reduction caused by the dismount.
ing of twenty men in each ,troop. Under the
head of Household Troops there was a decrease in
numbers of 720 men, and in expellee of 41,2191.
Under the head of Dragoon and Dragoon
Guards; there was a decrease in numbers of 486
men, and in expellee of 262,2301. This great sav-
ing was owing to an arran,geinent by which Troop
Quarter,:nosters were discontinued, and Serjeant-
majors substituted in their place. Under tire
head of the unnumbered corps, there was a de-
crease in numbers of 1,237 men, and an expellee
of 49,7211. Under the head of Garrison Bat-
talions, there was a reduction of two Battalions,
and a saving of 39,3171. Under the head of the
origina
lly
of Waggon Train, which consisted
of 12 troops, it would he found that live of those
twelve had been discontinued ; for, however use-
ful in foreign service, the establishment was thought
to be uallecessarily large while remaining . at
home; under this head, of the Royal Waggon
Train, there would be found to be a saving of
123,4331. The next head was that of the Barrack.
Artificers at Gibraltar, but that ices not in this
year's items. Under the head of Manx Finical/les,
there was a reduction of 317 men: Under these
tWo last heads would be found a saving in the one
of 13,8541. and in the other of 4,4731. So much
for the decreases. With respect to the increases,
tiro first was that of 27,7531. in consequence of the
addition of field officers. There was also an in.
crease of 113,0-201. to make good the losses sus.
tailed ill the services in Spain and South America,
as also on account of the increased allowances to
regiments et home, and the indulgence to officers
in the remittance of duties epee wines. Un-
der the head of Land Forces, the increase of men
was 127 men, anti the increase of expence was
98,4991. The next head was that of the East In.
dia Regiments, 'the charges of which were defray.
ed by the Company. The it,ext head Was the
Troops and Ceinpanies • Recruiting for the East
India Regiments; here there was a small increase
of 3471. Under the head, of the Embodied Mili-
tia, there was an increase in men of 501, and in
expence
,of 150,7661. Under the head of Staffs,
Garrisons, there was an increase of 21,2171. ;
this increase was not owing to the Staff. There
was also an increase in consequence of the new ar.
rangements for putting the Chaplains of the Army
on a better footitig ; every person appointed an
AraiyChaplaiii must first havehis lestinionians slgis-.
ed by either of the two Archbishops or the Bishop of
London; after eight years service he may retire.
on half pay of ss. a day, or if he continues in the
service, his payis to be =ream' to sixpence a day,
wail it amounts to full pay., The decrease of Su.
pernumerary Officers amounted On expence to•
14201. , Under the head of Public Departments Us
the Pay Office,t here was an increase of 112721. and
in the War Office of 8,8651. making under this.
head an increase of 21,8971. There was a lies'
patation of the two Departmerits for examining.
Accounts and carrying on Correspondence, and
the addition of three Superintenclants and. 24
Clerks. As to the Army Pay. Lists in the Of.
.fice of the Examiner of the Army Accounts, there
welt a saving to the Public of the whole salary of
erne Office-z• Mr. Moore, late Deputy Secretary of
War, had retired upon a salary of 18001.; Mr.'
Merry, the Purveyor of Coals to the Garrison of
Gibraltar, was appointed to succeed, on the con-
dition of hit giving up altogether that employntent,
"which is since abulisliud. In the Quarter. Master.
•Gerieral'a Office an increase of 80771. In the
tAliany-ftletlical .Hoard-flt2t. This -Board was to'
4
itudergo a change; a Committee had sat upon this
subject, and the result of their deliberations was,
to recommend the establishment of another Board,'
consisting of one Direefor.General and three prin.
cilia! Inspectors, but to be excluded from all private
practice, which the present members are notexcluded
from. In consequence of tliis exclusion, their sa-
fare musthe raised. Of this establishment the in-
creaseywilld be 21,8371. • The rest of the items
we will just recapitulate : Chelsea—lncrease
of Out-pensioners 535, expence 81,5921. ; of the
200,0001. giveo in as uaclaiined Prize. Money,
14,0001. had been claimed; and of the remaining
102,0001. 100,0001. was taken to be applied to
this feud. Widows' Pensions; an increase of
6,6111. Volunteers, a decrease of 131,2581.--
Front the discontinuance of the Corps of Local
Militia who had transferred their services, there
was in clothing an increase of 25,0001. Local Mire
!ilia 576,1531. Foreign Corps, men 975, cape -
14,7701. Royal Military College 40,9721. dike:
concluded his detail by stating, that the total is.
crease 'mounted to 129.7381• ; and that the te*
decrease amounted to tllll2ol. !geeing a sus tef
736,9921. for gross savms, and in all a sum . •
total Of• 952,0921. Ile stated, that we had.
600,000 men in arms, anti that If we added tliv
Navy, we had actually noel actively engaged in
the service of the country

e• 7
*'llll‘, 17C6-414
'
• „
*±,`,: •

rr •
• :

•

IC Sr
Cher oh]

"theearei:
gratulated the Heide and the Countr
ressy
ebUndant proofs of
tithoeit uton
jEuxpire, which, might 'be said to have • •
ic:itdheildoirdecesttroy.thetn. agreed with rt: that by avr
to
lion. Gentleman on the poor, that au
never stood in a* more proud or glorious troy,
Asa it now did.
tai
e
General GASCOIGNE took' this op' pothl.
of complaining of a variety of 0ppre4,,i,,,,.
sr
were increasing every year, and which
iwnhdiecodh,the Officers of the Army labou
.
real itb
likely still to do so. It would surprise the
itf
to be informed that Officers of the Army 41' vi,
nerally speaking, loss pay now thou they b*
a Cots,
ii
ant
son, but shilling for sia.pence fur ltc
the year
A 16.
tioliet amen t I thisolte no
i thtn en
day, new he had only 15s. 3d. deducting tilt
come T. • A Major had then 14s, now ht
14s. 6d. A. Captain had lOs. new be
Os. 6d. The others, to be sure, had ncr
a Lieutenant had then ss. I Id. now
he a o esne 11
tl
An Ensign had 3s. 8.1. now he had 41.
At the time alluded to, the • salary of
tary at War was.9,os. per day ; now, lie bad
doubt, it was nidltiplied ten limes. The 1;4
Secretary had then 7s. tid, per day ; now, he
lieved, hu had as malty [mods ae• he had t
shillings. During this period, Major Grill,
had received no addition; and the only
seemed to present itself, as accounting fur this'
consistency, was, that they were not repte,Znt
as Secretaries at War had been, iii that House.
The Honourable General vroceeiled to anemia!'
number of other grievances under which oi.
in the army laboured, aiul 'stated that the s.
proposed to be allowed them for wine, not !a.
more than at the rate of 255. a year fur each I
cez could not Ie ...)11‘iviE
nk4tll felt d
yreeiiii:l,-dl:
Lord G. L. Gri ointed
at.,
.statement he had heard. Ho hail trusted
-burdens of the public, as connected with At
Estimates, would have been alleviated to a
.greater degree. He did nut think (hie items
been looked into with a sufficiently scrutinizing
Ile was of opinion that the practice of buying
the cavalry, horses at tWir years old, by is
means the expellee of keeping them till they
of use, often exceeded tog'. ought to ha
awAy. The Waggon' Train too, instead of
reiruccil, ought to be done away entirety.
Manx corps was of no use; . the Officers
lowed other avocations, and the prinks *:
labourers; yet they had full pay, as if they
efficient regular troops. The City blilitit, y,
the Tower Hamlets, whose services were cx
tremely limited, lie thought were not of real oft
lity. For the home district there were two
rals—the Duke of Cambridge and Lord , • I
field, who had 44,000 or £5,000 a year
looking after 2,400 men: There was •a
Honourable General in that House who he
surprised was not ashamed to hold his district;
in Scotland, to 11,000 men there were eleven
:tends. All these things, he thought, required,te
looked into.
Mr. PERCEVAL stated that it could nut he lei
that Government had been inattentive to-any u.
the points referred to by his Noble FricnJ rM
spoke last. It was no doubt the easiest way •
order to produce econiony, to do entirely a
such parts of a system as seemed to require**
ment ; but lie conceived that this weght'tei les trua
with caution.
Lord G. L. GOWER. explained.
General TARLETON, alluding to an
ration of a Noble Lord (Esord G. IL. aim
asked why he shim. be ashamed to •buld a • ••
atiun after having been SI .years in the sesrriq
ilivhad been second in Coentflitild in 111044 ad
aftaegaining the good wilt of ibis inhabitants: lid
been, scut into itsectivity, thoraby, as he cl
ceived it, being disgraced, andment to Sibrl
Ld laugh.] II
. Mr. if LJSKISSON felt disappointed at the itt
tiniates now submitted to then Clouse, every ilea
of which ought to have been fixed with 1.110
I'the strictest economy. A considerable diaiiiinnolt
in our ex peuditure Was essential, or rather was at
.di•ipertsible to the safety of the country. Thit
could only be effected uy retisiun cud retrench.
scent. lit order to sliew the necessity art
called for economy, the lion. Member stated
the growth of our revenue—the net
proceed;
of its produce. was, itt 1762, only
by the year 1792 m
, notwithstanding the at'
industry of Mr. Pitt to promote retrenchment, it
ruse to 16 millions; and, in the year 1809,4'
amounted to 60 Millions. Thus, in the cons
of 27 years, our revenue had advanced no less than'sit-fold. With this statement before the Cowan.
tee, he was sure, that every Gentleman mint be fl
tisfied of the propriety of devising every postibld
means to reduce our expenditure. It was ohviaas
that there must be a limit to taxation, and the p
licy of considering this subject iii due time was tea •
cibly urged by the systein of the enemy, whew
hostility 'was principally aimed at our Oslo;
The objects and character of our enemy, .4'41,
rendering the restoration of peace so problonsti•
cal, it peculiarly behoved us so to husband utir re.
sources as to be prepared fur a long period of
He was aware that it might be said, that Ili;`was not a time at which it was proper tu_
dwell upon the difficulties of the country. Berl
he differed from those who might advance that el::
section. - For in his opinion the wisest way "!.
fully to exhibit the situation of the counltir.7
order that adequate prevision Might be seasue4
made to meet the dangers which ineaaccil 4- • I 'I
first objects to which liu wished to direct ths atig2'
den of the Conitnittee, with a mew to sal)
were the Army and Navy. In beth °weeder?
. mentsi be conceited that considerable Hue" ;
nietiansight be made.- Almnst livery Imiti of oil" a
applilredto esecailire. lre Iliad a much larg
'navel force now, than 'wheeethie many 444 a lllnt
co
powtst to epsomite', and' our army 1.45 11%
than any itiltatAlia to probable pecessltY called (yo
larger cutisideretdytie,in an titular ise
__me *hosier..e
was very generally erpeined. A reduction is nl~
army wae the more sele jn his mied, as WC
numerous a

I ..i‘