The Statesman.
London, England, 1810-05-25 00:00:00

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Mr. W. POtE felt it kis. duty, in justice 'to
Sir Henry Cavendish, to state, that his balances,
had been paid off with the geeatest.pussible punt.
tuality. • .
Mr. FOSTER and Mr. CHOKER. bore'egnal
testimimy.to the celerity with which the balances
of Sir Henry Cavendish had been paid in.
- Mr. W. SiMiTH thought. it a monstrous
posi-
:tioit to maintain, that any one had a legal right to
make use of the public money for their private
gai". •
BANKViliquoted an observation of Lord.
Kenyon to the same effect. He really thought
that in.that House there was generally too great a
'solicitude for the interest of individuals, and too
great a disregard fur the interest of the public.
He thought that it was too much the custom of
Government on both sides of the water to cons'.
der 'offices more as things created for the benefit of
the individual who held them, than for the good of
.the public. He thought no man ;mad a right to
claim
,compensation merely for abstaining from
abuses.

The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER.
thought tic Hun. Gentleman had spoken too
harshly of persona who followed the custom of
Itheir predecessors in office. If any great severity
or rigour. was to be used with respect to Receivers
of public money, they should at least have fair
notice of it, and their characters ought nut to be
branded for acting in a manner that they conceived
legal, and according to the custom of their pretle.
cessurs in office. He attacked with great warmth
the opinion delivered by the Hon. Gentleman, that
Government considered offices more with respect
to mho individual who was to get them, than. the in.
terest of the country. He thought this the severest
attack belted over heard in that House against men
in office, and it came with peculiar severity from
an authority so respectable as the Hon. Gentleman.
For his part, he disclaimed any such idea of offs.
cee, and mould confess himself unworthy of con.
_tinning a moment in office, if he did.entertain such
an idea. . •
Mr. BA NKES, in explanation; said, that. he
spoku of Government in general, and did- not
Mean either to allude to the Right Hon. Gentle.
man, nor .tdahe Chief Governor of Ireland, the
Duke of Richmond, whom he most highly re.
spected.
Mr. H. THORNTON thought, that by the
strict law, no compensation was due.
Mr. FOSTER said, that when he came into of.
ace, it was a few days before the death of Sir 11.
Carentlisk, and he found there was a balance of
no less than 330,0001 in his hands. This balance
he, of course, felt it his duty immediately to call
fur. Sir George Shee, who was afterwards ap.,
pointed to the place, was no political friend of
hid, and he could have no reason to propose the
'compensation except a sense of duty. The 'fact
was, thatindependent of time use of public money,
there was, by old custom, a per centage given to
,the Receiver.Gencral, for the sums he received.
froni the Collectors. It was for this per centage,
that he advised the compensation, which was
13001. ayear ; whereas the per centage produced

A long conversation then took place, in which
G. Johnstone, 4,1 r. W. Fitzgerald, the Soli.
Ator.Gaieral, Mr. Marryatt, Mr. Long, and
Der: Wilberforce took a share.
Sir jOIIN NEWPORT, in liirraply, utterly
denied that there was any old custom even about
• the pet:cunt-age.: As Ow place had been abolished
in 17D2;..b7statiitc, on its revival it must be con.
sidered sift .new oiliCe.
• .Ths. louse then divided—
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. For the Motion, - • 48
Against it ' • 99

Majority - 51.
• COMMITTEE OF SUPPLY._

On the tileSilol[ fur bringing up the Report,
Mt-. TIERNEY rose, and hoped he would have
the indulgence of the House in stating his opioion
upon a subject that he knew was generally eon-
littered dry and uninteresting. The question was,
nothing more or legs than whether: an entire new,
scheme of Finance was to
.be adopted, withent
any previous resolutions of the House approving
of such a plan. He was aware that he now atom!
upon very unpopular grounds. It might he said
of him, is was said in some paper of the Opposi;..
tiun, that they were extremely angry at the' new
plan of the Clianeelltst of the' Etehequer, at not
giving them fresh taxes to eavii.at. Notwlthstand.
ing that he felt that he -Stood 'plan grouad Whet
unpopular, he would freely. state his opinion, Allot
the Chancellor of . the • Eichequir ought either to
have pursued the old syatcm and laid taxes to. meet.
the loan'ef She-year, Arlie ought tp have shown
to the ['Ouse sufficient reason fur, departing film.
the old system. The loan .of the year.watteight.o4l.,
lioni, and it would be recollected that 8,300,004
of Exchequer Bills had been funded. According
to the old system of the Sinking Fund, the one
per cent. to be raised ou account of these sixteen
millions, would have gi len an annual interest of near
200,0001. ' In the whole, there was an annual charge
of 970,0001. thrown upon the ConsolidatettFund,
and there was no tax whatever imposed to assist •
the Consolidated Fund., bysteason' of the burthen
so thrown on it. Thi* Right 'Hon. Gentleman
(the Chancellor of iheEzeltequer) defended this,
on 'the ground -that:stamp 'duties; which he had
calculated it ,110.,tiOr. 'had aettrallr Produced ,
1,19440061.. He, thin:fore' bottomed his present
plait, on'tiis Wing Made aye sky of near Amen
hundred thousand ptiafids, former estimate..
Ile 'really hoped 'before' Min, that the
Hotta& would. perceive tlott. Ala important
6nancial,question air had •eiee-eilipiged their moss
actions attention. It had 'hitherto been a received
PelneetPle• in dilute; that nothing was 'more desir.
able than that so large s suds should be raised.
within .the year as that the income and expencas
should tally as mtich as possible: -Now shat was
the kegtilar income of this country? •°. There were
first the three millions' annually, generally de.
scribed as the Land and Atilt Tax ;'< then. there
were the IVar Taxes; Oud lastly the. Surplus of
thi Consolidated Fund. AVhoever then broke' in
upon this surplus, wai'breakitig *upon the'per:.
manent income of the country.. To this system
all other 'Ministers had been friendly. Mr. Pitt

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WATESMAX.'

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*ever broke in upon this sal; plus; ank *hen Mr.
Addington bad, oecasion.for tit increase Of revenue
pr three' million's, he deliberately 'thought it need.,
any to lay on 'taxes, which gave' a surplut of
1,800,0001. The late Administration bad felt so
much the necessity of adhering to this principle,
thalthey ventured to 'incur the unpopularity of
raising the Property Tax tread} parr Wit. to 10
per cent. A very sufficient reason not to charge a
loan upon the surplus of the Consolidated Fund
was, that there was nothing so uncertain as what
this surpins would be. This fund was established
by Mr. Pitt, in the year 1786, and it certainly did
him infinite credit. The establishment of the
Consolidated Fund at once chewed the public cre-
ditor the security which he had for his money.
After establishing this Consolidated Fund, the po-
licy of Mr. Fitt was always to cherish, increase,
and foster it. Mr. Pitt never in any exigency laid
his hands upon this Consolidated Fund. If the
fend had grown so great that the policy of Mr.
Pitt might now safely be departed from, he would
wish to know what surpkis there ought to be, in
the opinion of the House, before all the old ideas
,on this subject should be departed from. Ile
must own, for his own part, he was not over san-
guine. It had been said that the operations of
war by no means deranged our finances; if that
were the case, ho must then suppose that peace
would not much alter our financial situation, and
that if there was to be a peace signed to-morrow,
he could not suppose that the lucerne of the
trade's would receive a great increase. - There was
no 'Gentleman that would deny that there were'
some duties, which much be diminished considers.
bly on the return of peace. He would mention
the duties on wine, sugar, teas, and many Whit
articles, which it was well known were collected
much better in time of war, and when the seas
were covered with our cruisers, than they could,
possibly be in times of peace. In this apparent
increase of the produce of the Consolidated Fund
for the"present year,, it must be recollected, that
there were great arrears which .had been received.
Ho felt that he would not perforMohis duty: to his
country, if he did not call upon the House, with
all the power that lie•possessed, not to touch the
Consolidated Fund. In the-yew 1808 there hid
been many advantages. In the first
,peace, there
wore Short Annuities which Tell hi to theimnunt
of 375,0001. In the next place there was await-
ditional sum obtained from the. Bank for Araniaet.
ing the public business.. Independent of that,
little care appeared to have been taken "of the
Consolidated Fund foe the last five years". The.
Consolidated-Fund appeared to have bettered very
little for any thing which had been done in the
last five years. Independent of the accideetel
increase which •he had mentioned in the year
18054, the produce of the fund fur the last 5
years was as follows :
For 5 years charge incurred - - 5,7:19,000 • ,
Produce of Taxes 6,439,000
Balance -4706,000 New, In that favourable year of 1805-6, there
was a deficiency of surplus to the amount of
314,0001. He mould go further, and state that
the total surplus of the taxes voted in the last
seven years amounted to 1,287,0001. Now,. if
from that surillus there was deducted 970,0001.
which would be necessary to cover the interest of
the loan, the Funded Exchequer Bills, and the 1
per cent. for Sinking Fund, there would no more
iemain from the produce of the last seven years
than 300,0001. lie considered it a direct infrac.
doe of good faith to lay their hands upon the
Consolidated Fund, which was the only security
to the public creditor. If they-did lay their hands
upon this fund, the security of the public credi-
tor must be depieciated; lle would say, that in
the plan of the present year, the Ministers had
nut dealt fairly by the Sinking Feud—[hear!
hear ! from the Ministeriql Benches.] Ile should
have no . difficulty in explaining, in what he
'thought they had acted unfairly. The principle
of the 'Sinking Fund was, •that 1 per cent. addl.
'Aiunal should be raised, in aid of the Sinking
Fund, that was, to extinguish the debt. Now,
'horn 'lid the Charicellor of the Exchequer provide
tot this Sinking Fund ? He thought he was pro-
viding for it by taking from what was there be.
fore. He really did not wish to create any alarm
oil the subject of Finance, nor did ho believe
that it was possible to raise any alarm ; but at the
same time ho thought that he had a right, as a
MeMber of Parliament, to ask of Ministerii
what were the principles upon which they were
proceeding ? As for going on-from year to year,
that might be done until the whole surplus of the
Consolidated Fund :was swallowed up. In the
observations that hid been made on Lord Henry
Petty's plan of Finance, it had been .said truly,
Aid t.B.toe regular income that the country could
tie proved to possess as disposable to its necessary
establishments, was the annual three millions voted
as land and,malt tax; and five millions, as surplus
of theXonsulidated Fund. The argument then
was, that no peace establishment could be calcu-
lated-at less than fifteen millions; and that we had,
only a revenue of eight millions to meet it. Ile.
could not conceive any thing which would have a'
mere. natural, tendency to alarm the public credi.
tee than the measure proposed. It appeared to
hint,that sonseihing also ought to 4 said about the'
Unfunded Debt, which was now very conshlyra-
blo, amounting to about thirty millions. He had'
heard it said, however, that the Chancellor of the
Exchequerkariat laid pp taxes that were produe.,
ti'v,e beyond expeetationt should be- allor4d tq
' take the, benefit of his own labour. Now, In
order to pkwirtstin. the ford of :WS argameot,'
was 4ecesylry to consider whether It was the fact.
In the yesl., 1808, .se,ror‘l things fell' in Whicti
were nut, to be calculated owai'uften recurring.?—.
There. were .the Sliyrt Aonsitle), to the minim'
amount of.' 407,0001. the . Hank Duties 76,0001.
and the,infrease of .the Mimed Taxes and
Stamp Dunes'. The Chenceltrir 'of the Exche-
quer 'had, with 'weak ileittarity, taken to him!
self the 'credit of the **hole .increase upon' the
Stare p Duties, the 'amcnikt of 1,200,0001..
whereas he could not fairlygive hiMaelf credit for
more-than from thd
.sth of January Ito,. to We
Mh '
of January, 1810, whiliti woultileave bill
}$017)00,01. Nov it (ruin that sum were deducted