The Statesman.
London, England, 1820-10-23 00:00:00

THE STATESMAN.

The Earl of Lienarool. answered that the sags in-
cluded the Milan Commission, bat not the witnesses
under it.

TILE QUEEN•

gOUSE OF LORDS.—(Tstis kloontee.)
no peers were called over immediately after players.
fye a/rashers were Lords Erskine, Carrington, and
Lupo, and the Earls of Mayo, sod Carrick.
vivo gad of HARROWIT brought up the report of
lb, good Committee, appointed to examine the ex-
too from the correspondence between Col. Brow*
0,1 Br. Powell relative to Rastelli's absence. The
veer/as read by the clerk of the House, and although
„ow of some length the entire substance of it may be
wororood from the following sentences. Colonel
si rote several letters to Mr. Powell expreuivo
dupe satiety felt by the families of the witnesses now
ie mislead, in consequence of the reports in Italy roe-
the disturbance at Dover. These rumours, as
Mof with all rumours, exaggerated the eircuto.
sow, sod the witnesses, it was said, were brutally
mg. tee murdered, and there were doubts as to
to „wry of several others. Colonel Brow*
lowkood by begging that a person might he
dads, to compose the minds of their fa•
sic mod Mr. Powell, in compliance with this en.
I.loopetched Rastelli with directions for him "to
10.04 i the Ist of October. Colonel Browne, how-
ter. is the subsequent correspondence, expressed his
two, olio Rostelli was ehuAiwa. and wished to avoid
„wag. if• possible ; for he was by no means sods-
tei oda die reception he had met with in Eoglaad.
Mr. lowa's replies impressed on Colonel Browne
th, Awhile Necessity of Rastelli's return ; and the
fonder of Colonel Browne, being the last of the
soompeadesce, describes Rastelli as being ill of a
fOOO, and confined to his bed.
It was ordered, that the Report should lie on the
Ib, sod be printed.
remise! were then called in.
(M Counsel rowing to the Bar,
Mr. Beocanatt requested to have Mademoiselle
Dement called to the Bar.
After a pause et about ten minutes, during which
period expectation stood on tiptoe again to behold this
paragon of perfection,
The Sotactros-Oexasat, informed the House that
this lady could not then be And. Mr. Vixard stated
*Ash, would not ha wanted until 12 o'clock, and she
west away with that impression.
Mr. :ocute to hoped they would have the good-
ness to send for her. The Learned Oentletnan then
addressed the House. In the preamble of the Bill be-
fore tleir Lordships, her Majesty was accused of great
isimeacy of conduct. It was also assumed therein,
that is consequence of this vicious conduct, great
sandal sad dishonour bad been brought on the Royal
'say. That the same Royal Personage had de-
Zher station, and brought herself and the Royal
ily
into contempt. is the eyes of foreign na-
tem. He had evidence is his hand to show,
tiot tke estimation in which her Royal Highness was
hiN by foreign nations, was wholly incompatible with
*statement in the preamble of that Bill. He then
proiseed an Austrian °nett,. in which, after de-
Villesig her Soya hlighness, as a POWeraa of great
adunr, it goes on to state, that she arrived at
Trieste, on the 15th of April, at twelve o'clock in
its forenoon, end left it at five is the evening, of the
following day, accompanied by all those manifesta-
tion of joy usual on su:h occasions.
TVOPATTOSIN ET-OaN la A I. could nut avoid expressing
Vseftstonishment, that his Leared•Frienil would read
be contents of that paper, well knowing, that it could
sot be received in evidence. What would their Lord-
ships say, if he had produced Continental papers,
describing, as many of them did, the Princess in a
very different manner ?
The SottcrronDue elm. did not know what name
he CO:11.1 give this attempt of Mr. Brougham to make
au int, ression on their Lordships' minds. His Learned
Friend must well know that it could not possibly be
nceirrd in a court of justice.
Sr. BSOUGWAS: Was quite willing to admit that

multi not he received as evidence in a Court of Jr 'ace.
Bat he (tlr. B.) was standing in a very different
plate from a Cower of Justice. In a Court of Justice
he should be ?Nem challenge the Jurors. He should
be able to object to the p-osecutors, to the party that
had employed his Learned Ft lends. He should be able
to prevent she same party from appearing one day
in the character of prosecntors, and the next, changing
their nature, and assenting the character of Judger,. If
his Learned Friends would change that Honse into' a
Veen of Justice, and grant him all these admissions,
he was ready to withdraw his evidence.
The Lotto CHANCILLOR said he was ordered by the
House to inform him that that paper could not be receiv-
ed as evidence.
Lieutenant HOWNAM was then pot to the Bar,
and produced his dirk one of the order of St. Caroline.
31,. BROC4:IIINI—is that the seal of that order ?--It is.
The witness II en withdrew.
Tie Interpreter here translated to the Honse the di-
plomas of the different gentlemen of the order of St.
Caroline- Bert ami was designated Brand Master,
and Lieutenant llownam, Mr. William Austin and
some others were created Knights of the Order, with
remainder to the heirs wale. Ihr dirlomas then went
on to describe tl.o ornaments which should be worn by
the tii.Terent members of the Order. The description
did nut materially differ from that of the ornaments
which are worn by the Noble Knights of the Barter,
the Mali and the Thistle, but their Lordships laughed
very heartily while the Interpreter was reading.
The [Julie of Sorranwr observed that he now
wished to ask Lieutenant Hownam a question, but at
the suggestion of Earl they the Noble Oahe con-
tented to wait until the Queen's Counsel should have
closed the defence.
Lord iiiII.LAND now rose, and referring their Lord-
Alps to the aerunnt oa the table of the sum expend-
ed in these proceedings, remarked that he had observ-
ed a man of no less titan eigAteeis thorn:ad pentads
If.:r secret wrier.. He wished to ask the Noble Lord
what was meant by this item, or in other words, what
was the nature of these secret strikes.
The Earl of Ltvanroot. said, that as the transit-
firm, up to th, Parliamentary proceedings, was a se-
cret transaction. the services for it were paid out of
the fund annually voted by Parliament for secret
services.
Till Earl-of Dassuts wished tO know whether this
sum included the expences of the Milan Commission,
and of the witnesses examined uuder it.

A considerable pease now ensued, as the witness
Dement was momentarily expected to make her appear-
aece. During this pause the Earl of Lauderdale came
towards the Bar and entered into a conversation with
the Attorney-General: but as we did not bear it, we
cannot give It to our readers ; 'but even if we had heatd
the conversation we should have abstained from report-
ing it, as the conversation could not possibly have any
reference to the present proceedings.
It being intimated that Mademoiselle Demont was
is In attendance,
Mr. DENMAN rose and said, that before the witness
I re-appeared, he wished, that no misconception might
possibly arise, to state the object of his desiring
to re-examine her. lie should examine her to
certain declarations be could prove she had made.
If she should admit that she made these declara-
tions, it was very well, and his Royal Client
would have the benefit of that admission. If, how•
ever, she should deny she had made those declarations,
be proposed caUing witnesses to contradict her.
The Lord CMANCILLOR was of opinion, that the
Learned Counsel could not take this course. The ex•
amination of the witness had been finished, and any
Ifurther question from the Counsel, must be suggest
to the House, and put by their Lordships.
LOUISE LEMONT called in, and re-examined by
Mr. WILLIAMS.

Do you know a person named Martini?—No.
Not a woman of that name who lives at Mauge?—
No.
The person of whom I speak, is a milliner of that
place?-1 know a milliner called Martine, at Mauro.
Do you remember seeing that woman under the
amended name in 1818 ?-1 have seen her several
times. Ido not recollect what month.
But in the year 1818 ?-1 do not recollect, but 1

may have seen her in that year.
Do you remember sending fur that woman to alter
a bonnet for you?-1 cannot recollect ever sending for
her, because I did not reside at Mauge.
Did you see her in any part of the year 1919, shoat
this bonnet ?----I may have seen her, I cannot positive-
ly recollect, whether I did or not.
Now I wish to knew, whether you had any conver-
sation with her, about the Princess of Wales, in the
year 1819 ?—.I do not recollect seeing her in the coarse
of that year, I cannot recollect having any oenversa-
tion with her.
Do you not recollect seeing the woman Ma e,
after leaving the service of her Royal Highness '
Yes, I have sees her afterwards,
Had yon any conversation with her then about her
l Highness the Princess of Wales ?—I do not re-
?
t, whether I had any conversation ; it may be,
t I do not recollect it.
Do ris not recollect the woman Martine, speak!'
Is you epos the sobject of the
Princess's journal
410 not • --
ef the '
Pr
versa'
lb.:
I blot i
De
ups
moll
Tor do you recollect saving any thing to her about
any of the persons surrounding her Royal Highness?
I have often spoken of the Princess, but not of those
who surround her.
You do not remember Martine saying any thing to
you about the conduct of the Princess of Wales E.--
1 do not recollect any conversation with her about it.
It may be, but I do not recollect.
Do you remember being at Mange?—Yes, I have
been there several times.
I wish to know. if you remember this woman Mar-
tine putting this question ;—whether the Princess was
not a woman of Intrigue ?—1 du not recollect. Ido
not recollect having any conversation with her re-
specting the Princess.
Do you mean to say you had not a conversation, and
I that the woman did not put the question I have niela-
tioned ?--I do not at all recollect it.
Do you mean to say the question was not put to you?
I don't recollect if this question was put tome; 1 have
no idea of it.
Do'you remember becoming angry when the slues.
lion was put to you?--1 do not recollect this conver-
sation ; I have not the least idol of it.
Did you say to the woman Mllrtine, that all which
was said against the Princess were calumnies, and that
it was her enemies who spread such rumours:—l do
not recollect any thing like it ; I do nut recollect it at
all.
I wish to know if you will swear that you did not
say so ?—lt may be, I will not swear. I have mot the
least recollection of it. Before I was called I was pat
on my oath. I never said any thing of what passed
in the house of her Royal Higlines..
Then you will swear that you did not use these en-
pressions I have repeated, or any thing to that effect?,
—I h tee not the least idea of such a conversation ; I
do not recollect it at all.
Bat will you swear that vou did not say so ?--I will
not swear, but I have not the least recollection of it.
Did you not say to Martine, that at the time you
left the Princess, she was surrounded with spies ?—I
never could have said so, because I, myself, never saw
any spies.
Will you swear you did not say what I have we
repeated ?----I will not swear, I do not recollect having
said so.
I thought you said you could not have said so, be-
cause you never saw any spies ?—I do not recollect
having said so et all, Ido not recollect this con-
versation. I have no idea of it.
I thought you said you could net have said so, be-
cause you saw no spies ?—I do not believe I said so.
Will you swear it 2.-1 will not swear, I do net re-,
collect it. Idu not recollect this conversation at all.
Again ; did you not say. that the most simple se-
dos of the Princess's life, was always misinterpreted ?
—I don't recollect ever saying so. Ido nut recollect,
this conversation.
Will you sweat, that this conversation, nor no part
of it passed in the year ISIS ?--I cannot swear, I
do not recollect any thing of it. ,

;g the

Do you remember ►isiting a Ironton called
at Mange?---I have bees there several times.
is the year ?--I was several times there after
quitting the service of the Ptioceis, but I nut re-
collect where.
Were yon ever on a visit to the person you just men-
tioned ?—Yes, in ISIB.
Have you ever had a bonsai altered by person of
die name of Marchini ?---It may be, but je acme reps
rile pea.
Have you not said to the same person that you were
always about the person of the Princess?—.le ae vie
rappelle pas.
Will yon swear that Marehial did not say that as
you had always been about the person of the Princess►
you must have observed all her actions 2--Je me me
reoppelle pas. It might be, bat I have not the least re-1
collection of it.
Will you swear that it did not occur, if not In these
words. at least, to that effect ?--Je :re me neppelk pas.
1 Will you swear that Marchini did not ask you if
you saw any thing unchaste in the conduct of the
!Princesa?—Je a. me rappel's pas.
Will you swear that you did not reply, If not in
these words, at least to this effect :--" My Ood, no.
It is imposeible. There dues not live a more chute
frgronsan than the Princess?"—l do not remember
baring any conversation of this kind with Marchini.
Will you swear that you did not use these eitpm-
lions ?—Je lee m♦ rappelle pee. Bit Ido not think
that if she asked me that question, I would have
given that answer.
Hare you not said to the same person that the only
friend the Princess had was the old King ? —I have not
the least idea of it.
Will you swear that you did not?-1 will not swear.
Hare you been at Mauje is Nov. holy?-1 have been
there several times. I might have been there then.
1 wish to know vshetber you have any recollection of
it?— It might hare been, but je me me rappel's pas.
Did not Marchini ask you whether the Princess was
muck affected at the death of the Princess Charlotte?—
Je we vie Tappelk pas.
And did you not say in reply. "Ties, it is very na-
tural, as she has lust every thing, when she lost her
child ?"—Je we me reppelle pee.
Do you believe that conversation did occur 7
Je we eras pas.
I wish to know, whether you did sot say, that it
was possible, after the death of the Primeessi:leartatte.
her Royal Highness would make some diminution i■
her household ?—1 have not the least idea.
Will you swear, that it did not occur ?—1 bare not
the least idea.
I wish to know, where was the first place she was
put upon her oath relative to this business ?
The CIIANCILLOR wished to know, whether she had
been exonerated on that point before. If not, Mr.
Williams should state to the House with what view he
asked the qaestion.
When were you first pat upon your oath respecting
Princess -

d appeared
Princess's enndnct
what she meant
was examined

ZRAL.

been examin-

any ,
Had vow ever said any thing about her Royal High-
ness before you were examined here?---I have spoken
often of her *Royal Iltg!mess before 1 was examined at
Milan.
What do you mean by saying that before yon were put
upon your oath you never said any thing about what
passed of her Royal Highness f—l mean that I never
said any thing about her conduct with Ilergami.
Do vita mean that you never expressed soy thin; about
her conduct with liergami?-1 made enr deposition at
Milan.
By the Earl of Latocanaut—ii'hat was the day of
the month when you left her Royal Highness at Pesaro?
—lt was the beginning of November. 1 don't know the
day.
Before yonr leaving her Royal Highness at Pesaro
*td,aceounts coins of the death of the Princess Charlotte ?
Mr. B11101:6111AM now proposed, that a witness, who
was in attendance. should be brought to the that
Dumont might see her. •
Mr. 501.'417011 UIVIIIRAL opposed this, and E'en*.
plained that his Learat-et "Ffiencl was in the habit 01
hesisting upon whatever he wished.
Mr. Boot:Gnaw said, he was always unwilling le
insist upon any thing, which was not usual.
Mr. B1101:011tNI•S proposal was rejected, and the
witness was then ordered to withdraw.
MADAME FOI.RCHETTE MARTINEZ was then
brought to the Bar, and sworn.
Examineildby Mr. WlLLtsur.
Are you the wife of henry Martine?—Yes.
Of where ?—Mange. lam a dress-maker.
Do you know Madame Demont ?—Yes.
How long have pin known her ? From the time
she was at Mange, till she was going.
War that iefore she entered the service of the
Princess of Wales:—Yes, a long time before.
What age was Demont when you first became ac-
quainted with ber?—.lbout 16, I think.
Do you remember seeing beniont at Mange. nny
time in the year 1919 ?—Yes, in April.
On what occasion ?—1 t was at the house of Madame
Jacquerean, where I was calling for some work.
Had you before then seen the journal of Madame
Demont ?--1 had.
When you saw Demont there, did you speak to her
about her Journal or abut the Princess of Wales ?
Yes.
Do you remember asking her any question respect-
ing the conduct of the Princess of Wales?—Yes, the
first time I saw her after 1 bad read the Journal.
Did you ask any question respecting the conduct of
the Princess of Wales?—Yes.
What question did you put to her?—
Mr. ATTOANZT-OZNIMAL objected to this question.
He was at a loss to conceive how the answer either
way could be wade evidence.
After some discussion, their Lordships ordered that
the efideitee of Demont should be referred to, as to her
denial of the conversation with Madame Martinet.
That_ part of the evidence was accordingly referred to,
and MP. Bessegisais then again preload the question,
whir* YU vain objected to by the Counsel fur the BA

Do you not recollect the woman Martine, speaking i the princes a? all ? . • -
ton upon the .abject of the Princess's journal ?..--il- Were a discussion arose as to the ternvoof p
not at all recollect bee talking to me on the auliect question ; when it was at length decided tb
he ournal.
' ness's former answers on this subject 'Mould
Clo jyou untlak Vt. say that yma dam* lusidresi‘itipe mg tesA 03 bre% Her .eddirgo. we *kiwi
**eh* ages, ac accordingly referred to, by which reference
Cation twin Vile woman Martinet
...a.L i she said she never had spike, of the Princes
journal t—l play have had a a'aftliat4" """' I before her examinarion; on being asked wha
or
', but Ido not terollt rt it. .. , . Iby this, she answered, 1 mean before Iwa
Do you not remember this woman sprawls% lire . here.
on the conduct of the Princess of Wales ?-1,40 not Examined by Mr. SOLICITOR-OENZR
ollect it. Before yon were examined here had you ht
-- - .. • _ .t.:__ ~ 1,...1,„„i , ell any where else:--Yes, at Milan.