The Statesman.
London, England, 1815-02-24 00:00:00

THE STATESMAN.

whole House, to consider farther of the Resolutions
resi7ting,the Corn Laos,
LO rd SOCELYN contended that the apiculture
of Ireland enquired the protection of some legisla-
tive measure of this kind. That agriculture, by the
aid it had contributed to our national resources, had
materially assisted in the successful termination of
the war. lie could never consider the country to be
secure till w e wE re entirely independent of foreign
supplies. Such was the distress in Ireland at pre-
sent, that in a letter which he had lately received
from a most intelligent person, he declared that if
any farm were now offered him rent-free, be should
not venture to go to the expends of tilling it.
Mr. FINLAY admitted this to be a question de-
manding the most extensive enquiry, and the most
deliberate consideration. His own opinion, however,
was decidedly, that with a view to an economical
and an abundant supply, some restriction on foreign
importation was indispensable.—[Hear, hear
He was the more strongly of this opinion because
that a certain moderate 'average price was the state
of things most beneficial to the manufacturing into.,
rest. If our laud went extensively out of cultiva-
lion, he could not see what security we could enjoy of
a regular and certain foreign supply. He had presented
during the last Session many Petitions against any
change in the Corn Laws, but he was convinced he
should best answer the views of the Petitioners, by
giving his support to the Resolutions before the
Committee. The lion. Member concluded with a va-
riety of observations iu favour of a relief to Um agri•
cultural interest. _ _

Sir JOHN NEWPORT less dreaded the opposi.
tion of political economists, whose power lay rather
in their ability than in their another', that, be did i
those who professed a desire to give protection to
agriculture and yet narrowed its limits, and endea-
voured to delude those whom they professed to sup-
port. This class was like one of the two classes
that opposed the abolition of the Slave Trade, and
who really prolonged its existence under a pretence
of desiring its gradual abolition. The mass of taxa-1
Lion was an insuperable impediment to a great fall in
the price of Corn. Unless that could be lessened,
we could not hope to struggle in an equal cempeti-
doe with all the foreign growers in Europe. It was
not fit for a great country to depend for its means of
existence on foreigners. The protection of agricul-
ture in Ireland, was our chief resource. It could
not be impressed too strongly upon the country that
the tie between landlord and labourer was stronger
in this country than in any other: here our land.
holders actually live on their estates, but it was not
so in France. Those topics, introduced into this
discussion, which tended to draw lines of distinction
between different classes, might have been well i
spared. The interests of all classes of the commit-
' nity should be viewed as bound up together, and
connected together for the public good. He la.
mented to hear it said, that there was an attempt to
force this measure, whereas it received a full and fair ,
discussion. Exaggerations would naturally creep
into such debates ; but it was the business of Mem-
bers not to inflame the people, but to moderate their
feelings. The object of this measure was only to
give to agriculture the same sort of protection which
was afforded to other branches of industry said cons..
merce. In looking at the state of the labourers, he
presumed, that others besides them in the maonfae.
luring classes were contemplated. Of the popula.
tion of England 4,500,000 were connected with
agriculture; and in Ireland four millions out of her
population of six millions. The increase of Irish
agriculture supplied England when she could not get
a supply elsewhere. lo 1808, 1800, and 1810,
there were 1,800,000 quarters of wheat imported
from Ireland into England, whereas just before those
periods there was only 975,000. In 1812, 1813,
and 1814, the quantity imported rose to 2,170,000
quarters. In the Irish population, the linen trade
counted only one million. The four millions of
agriculturists were clothed, and bad their bowies
furnished, chiefly by the manufacturers of England;
and thus Ireland returned three-fold to England, for
what she received for her supplies of Corn. The
interests of the two countries must be one and the
same. The absentee remittances were a source of
great advantage to British manufactures. It was na-
tural that there should be many absenlees from the
circumstances of birth, relationship, early habits,
and a variety of connections. It had been asked
why the Irish should feel so much mileage.% when
the decrease of her exports was only 30,000 quar-
ters ; but she had also decreased 210,000 quarters
iii foreign exports to Spain, Portegsl, &e. A
country like Ireland might feel difficulties, even
though exportation increased. There were many
farmers who had not capital to enable them to bold
back from the market, and must, therefore, sell,
whether for profit or loss. They must go to market,
even though it was going to their ruin. He was con-
vinced it was en essential thing even for our manu-
facturers that we should be independent of foreign
countries. The real strength •of our country was
concerned in it, and in every view of our interests
it was necessary that a legislative measure should be
enacted.
Mr. FIIANIELAND, LEWIS admitted that ha
had opposed, the measure of last year • and did not
shrink from the charge of haviagehanged his opinion.
He haft given the.subjezt all the consideration he
coisla ; and was inclieed to afford some protection to
the agricultural interest. He could do no more than
to form, his judgment upon a diligent investigation..
Certeinly, if something was not done numbers would
be "exppsed to eerious danger. The interests and haw
portence of agriculture were greater thaa those of
any of our other branches of industry. It way.
therefore' peculiarly incumbent on Parliament .te
provide for and to protect them. It was stated that
the average price throughout France might be tau*
at 465. per quarter. The depreciation of our our.
rency he considered as a great cause of the present
emtlarrassmentr. The discouragement to our agile
culture arose, not from the quantity of corn import.'
ed ; but from the reduction pf prices, which stood
reduce our own supply. A small quantity imported
had the effect of throwingdowa our prices. If, for
a qate, we were ;applied with large goaalliles of
Frepch corn, say at 455.$ it would produce a rod
effect op our agricultural interosta, and• occilhisser wt.
ti:nately a rerylsiors which ;gold tharinA bet sticalated•
The relief now asked was an faspedimeut to the las.
postilion of foreign core. A greater fitil bockats"

peration of these thin,
place than the mere imports could j , to wait. andf see the operation of peace, awl s„
• ustify • and
x perm
was more particularly evident in the fall of barlethyis• of taking off the Property Tax. That ta
postponed at least six or sell
state
effielo
othfeopenscuebojecetvehraydabretiecille. Ile wished the consid„e,,,.,
Some ewarerlihaefdseechmitegdy roecacasosinoanbedle.theThprese coarse of .
and that in the mean time further e • enquiry should
time as almost entirely to impede importation ; tpit
difficulty : the events of the war were such for a long, weeks till we could see the o
°Pim+.
.rstade. But he was so anxious to-fethear from
was the subject ofsuch • •
posed to a competition with all foreign growers. II t,
now by the arrival .of peace, our farmers were exe-
oil',
tu e' a course which
pus- the country, or from throwing obstacles in the way
general wish, that tie would rather take up el,
elofwthaes
pro. .
of tbe
thoughtsibleco tihisei•srteantetityombierhfierre
solely the protection of subje..ct as now proposed,
though the objections k•
W ~c
posed measure, which was gshreoautidobbjeectas
Our own agriculturists against a great impending pressed upon' him ss ere not not felt to be of aew,t
danger. In attempting to ascerts
% the precise limit, with the majority. The question was, whether el,
measure should be permanent or temporary; ht, i,,,,
he must confess he met great difficulty. Great vari-
ations in prices existed in various parts of the king- at first view inclined to prefer that it should be te,„
dom. Grain from Northumberland, and further porary, but upo
e .
rence: for he was sure that if t,n further consideration thought i• ~
north, had, for instance, to bear all the charges of matter of indili
shipping, which must be added to the price in the measure should lie found inconvenient it would i*.
'London markets. Ile thought it of importance to come only . p temporary;—[hear, orary ;—[hear, hear-1—and o,ro
be no difficulty of getting rid of it, if all I
reconsider and amend the mode of taking the averages, would r a ee,
which in the present way were often fallacious ; and ,of the country called out for such riddance. The
' he wished to know whether any better plan was in- l best way was
to proceed to the material subject of di.
' tended. In each of the twelve districts, lie under- I cussion, namely, the price ; and every man wutui
d that the returns were directed to be made ac-stoo agree, that the lower that could be fixed the been
cording to the quantities sold, which was stated in
• would the object be answered. It was tick ems led •, i
.
the returns, and to the average of the selling prices. that the farmers had had a good time of it durincr ILI
They were then sent to the Corn Inspector, who ar- ware and he was glad of it: but let them recolie,
ranged them from the prices of all the twelve returns. that . the most flourishing times of our agriculturell:l
This was net a correct mode of taking the averages, been times of the greatest importation ever knowl,
I •n In his county some gentlemen took so violent „,owing to the difference of quantities and prices u
different places. In the maritime parts of Wales, alarm at the state of agriculture that they calleds
and in Cornwall, the price had been generally Uglier Meeting, which, at first, they called of the coudg,
than in London. High prices, when but small quan- but afterwards altered that title, in Which they passe&
~ IpieL.
tities were sold, gave false averages. The average resolutions which they. sent to every town in n
should be taken from the whole quantities through- shire, without procuring a single signature to them,
out the kindom. It was very desirable that the We knew what had become of the Kent Moeting,
average should he a fair one ' • and for this purpose when an hundred and odd gentlemen were forced to
the mode of taking it should be changed. The law withdraw to an inn and vote a Petition. Tmfatme,,,
of 1804 had not yet been carried into es,r.7raiion.— generally speaking, instead of attending Meetings,were
Such an alteration might bettiiiiivalent to an increase waiting patiently the result of the wisdom of the
'of duty of three or four shillings. He should rather House, and were not troabling it with Petitions.—
prefer 765. to 80s. If they took Ws. they ought to , The Right Honourable Gentleman proposed the sum
look at all the circumstances. In making a new of 80s.—an immense rise from the present price....
' enactment, he thought the House and the country , We should be cautious not to raise the price of cora
might look with satisfaction at the progressive im- beyond the reach of the wages of the people. If the
provement of our Corn Laws from the time of Bill passed, the system of paying the people's wages
Charles 11. when it was prohibited to buy corn and out of the poor rates must be had recourse to. Ws
sell it again, down to the present moment, when i this desirable in the time of peace? In times of ne.
there existed a perfect freedom of the trade between : cessity it was perhaps the best method. The lion.
England. Scotland, and Ireland. 1 Gentleman says, " No :" would he then raise the
I Lord PROBY supported the resolutions for the , labourer's wages to 20s. or 30s. per week ? Would
.sake of the agricultural interest, and therefore for I not wheat immediately upon passing the Bill rise to the
the interest of every man in the British isles. The 1 utmost limit of importation ? This year it certainly
Hon. Gentleman (Mr. Baring) was himself a striking would. To average the price of 80s. the best wheat
instance of the advantages which were possessed by I must sell for 100 s. at least, or 110 s. This was a fact
merchants's eons, and he saw no reason why the sons which could not be disputed. Was this desirable,
and daughters of farmers should not share them. or necessary to protect the farmers ? The mi.
i Mr. CALCRAFT was sorry that an:,- measures on dence before the Committee was evade entirely.—
' the subject of the corn laws were pressed at this 1 They wanted to make a case, and they have made a
time ; but as they were, be should not refrain from case. He looked at it merely as such : there was no
entering into the consideration of them. The Hon. I cross-examining ; the witnesses staled what a plough
Member (Mr. Baring) had talked of large tributes' costs, and what a horse. This was not the ways
1
which had been paid to the agriculture of the eoun- farmer went to work ; ho might as well charge the
try : he (Mr. C.) though one of the landed interest, fare of a hackney-coach. He
.thought the price of
did not feel that he hail received any proportion of. 80s. was too much. The House was pateicaterly
this tribute, and considered himself under no more I bound to discuss the subject with coolness and ma
obligations to the manufacturing interest than that i deration, end without prejudice or passion,oentlting
'was to him for the produce which he bought of them.. their view solely to the best and most important ia•
He had also talked of a want of connection between . terests of the country. When he said this, he Mend
thelanded gentlemen and their tenants. Now, who- Ito be understood that in thoie interests it was hie
ever knew any thing of the state of this country, or i intention to include Ireland, now so immediately
had even travelled through it, must he aware that and intimately interwoven with us that it would he
' our country gentlemen lived at least half the year absurd to suppose the interests of both countries
amongst their tenants in the very centre of their were not the same. He was sorry, therefore, Wiwi
. estates; and, therefore, he could not subscribe to the that the state of Ireland in respect to this measure
Hon. Member's opinions on this point, any more than was not so prosperous as he could wish ; at the sere
he could, on the other hand, to those of the sup- time be must say Ireland ought to be fairly and imo
porters of the resolutions, that the price of the pro- partially considered in all its bearings on both sides
' duce of land was unconnected with its rent. It was lof the question. The House would recollect that
impossible to say that rent was not a component part Ireland had no poor rates, no property tax to con•
of the price of the commodity, when we looked at the tend with—and as to the article of labour, they were
' rents of lands in Scotland or freland,*—when we saw able to procure. it at a much lower rate than could
one man renting 420 acres, at 25001. per annum, possibly be done in this country. It would also he
and in the estimated calculation of his profits at remembered that the witnesses who had been ea'
50001. allowing half that sum as paid to his landlord. emitted before the Committee on 'this subject of prices
What was the reason that the comparatively small were surveyors and farmers, who could not be said
importation of corn this year had produced so great to be entirely unprejudiced. With setipect to him.
lan effect ? The French corn was so much better than self, he thought in regard to tht prices that 72c.
our's, that the millers would not boy the latter unless which was 9s. a bushel, would be a fair price to the
they could get it almost for nothing. This was the farmer, and ought to satisfy the wishes of the most
I reason why the importation this year had been pro- sanguine supporters of the measure. He bad no
ductive of a mischievous effect en the price of corn io doubt in his own mind but that price weeld be a
respect to the farmers. But what was its effect upon fair remuneration to the Irish farmer., and woodsy
f the other classes of men ? He had had an opportunity answer the purposes the House had in view, whi :il‘
of asking a farmer what he could have gotten for his was to make an experiment intended to glee
inferior wheat, if it had not been for the French relief to the sufferers in Ireland. In this cow-
importation, and the answer was, 66 Whatever I had , try, though there might be considerable degree of
, asked." He was thereforeof opinion, that the importa- distress, yet it was a consolation to reflect that such
tion was a most salutary and beneficial supply. He a misfortune was not universal. tf the propositin
I heartily wished the country tobe enabled to feed itself. were modified in the way he had stated, he thought
Barley this year was a mere drug ; and the exports lit might be made palatable to all pertles. He was
of it equalled the imports. The reason was that Go. sorry to say that the measure of shutting the touil
Ivernment was no longer a customer; and the tax, on ; agiinst importation had operated to raise the priced
malt being so immense that the peasants of the Hon. 1 grain, and be was much afraid the generality of pee-
Gentleman's Gentleman'neighbourhoodwere prevented from ' Ve in this country would attribute that vise to this
I
iprocuring that beverage which was tic, gratUrtil and ill. In what he said on this point he was not ac.
' •proper for them : it was not applied to thine pur. ! tuatedby any'prejudice in favour of either the lauded
I poses. no lion. Gentleman (Me. C.) took a prat- lor commercial interests, but spoke the unbiassed see-
tical view of the question, and was of tipinioa, that I timents of his own mind. It was true he lived on
I neither the legislature, nor the Government, bad a rents, and might, therefore, be supposed to have a
right to interfere with the trade of any particular I personal interest; but he could assure the House,
clam of men further than suds interference might be was not guided or swayed by any such bearing on
contribute to the benefit of the community. If he the question. He had heard mane objections mide
could bring his mind to believe, that this was the to the interests of the Members of the House of Corn-
, case in the present instance, he should think that the mons, but never before understood they had been
I Committee were warranted ire interfering even to the I considered as too landed; be that it there
as might,
extent proposed by the resolutions. Last-Session he I were certainly various other interests of a different
I had the good fortune to oppose the measures on this description fully adequate to check the landholders;
Isubject, and he had received the thanks of the far- and if the House proceeded in a slow, considerate,
i wetland others in his neighbourhood for his 4ote.— and dispassionate manner, he had no doubt but the
I
The question now came before the Committee more' coeclusioa of their deliberatioue would be highly sq.
favourably in one respect, inasmuch as the distress of tisfactory to the country at large. Above all, he
the arable farmers was now greater than it was then. f wished them to pay attention to the wants and neces.
The envoi,/ this Session bad. been carried on in a cities of the middling and
lower orders of the comma-
f more elaborate and temperate manner, and with more oity. • • ..
.ability and. research than ow the former occasion ; Sir N. COLTIIUIIST said it had been industrious-
but still tbere Was far from that perfect body of in- ly spread abroad that this measure would increase
formation before the tommittee which It was right the utter of bread,thought
1 7 h e so, no man would
'there-should-be. Another objectionlaf to. the par.' be More ready to. vote against it than himself. In
.
Oracular mode in whit:lathe subject Wes taken up. We saying this file trusted he should be believed, when
bad now entered upon a new order of things : peace it was recollected that he was the Representative of a
oas
w,hardly yet completed; .the farmer was et least He
, populous and commercial city.' trusted the
'llscure for the neat three months. We hid never House would, on this occasion, give, by its Grni-
been so situated before, the price of corn never haw. ness, a proof to all tine
world, that it was determined
tog yet owe down to the minimum. He preferred to afford
protection to agriculture. •

Iheefreee
period./
or sell
e thin;t
honk{
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itltlun
the way
ce up the
ns
of weie:,t
ether !h,
: he la,,
I bete„
wed ;
at if t:,g
ould hp.
tnd there
II clasp
ce. The
tct of
ssoind
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nwledgei
uring 14
recoiled
!tate LI
know,
iolent gq
called;
C couttig,
Y Passed
► D inet.
to there.
Meting,
forced to
fatmeil,
ings,were
11 of the
I the earn
price..-
1 of cora
If the
es wages
o. Ws,