The Statesman.
London, England, 1821-01-25 00:00:00

THE STATESMAk

u freely as any one of these Petitionert. Hti denl
that these Petition wee persons of any weight in
the Borough. The did not consist either of the
respectable or thi intelli nt portion of ea itihabi-
tants.
!lit P. BURTA rT observed, it was easy to under-
stand the quantity'of weight which the Worths-Mem-
ber who last spoke would be dispoood to extend to the
four hundred Petitiolers, compared with the claims
of the twelve Aldermen who returned him.—(Hear,
hear.) He thought that the present cue way be
taken as a fair spechrien of the manner in which the
Cumulous of England were faithfully aud adequately
represented. He did, howev-r, trust that more at
!notion than was u,ually bestoweil, woull, under the
present circumstance-, be given to the petitions of the
people ; that at length time wool 1 he allowed to at-
tend to those objects of public solicitude, which were
more pressing on the consideration of Parliament. If
he understood the Noble UM, and he wished to be
accurately informed, he underst.owl hits to say that all
further hostile steps agstiost the git”en were abaudon-
ed. Shell an annuiwialon to the country would be
most consolatory, and he productive of the greatest ad-
vantage to the country.
Lewd cAsTIAREmni felt it necessaay to guard
against the impression, that kis Majesty's Ministers
has recently adopted any new coarse, or given np any
opinion they entertained when the late investigation
ceased. He wished to a...,tire the House, that the inten-
tions of his Majesty's Government had since that pe-
riod undetgone uo change- They remained in the
same position of determination liv which they were de-
cided when his 1))1)10 Colleague Lad, in another place,
withdrawn the Bill of Pains and P).tialties ; from that
hour there was Ito intention of substituting any other
measure.

Mr. Ewen! •RT denied that he was returned by
twelve Aldermen of the Borough of Devises, as had
been asserted by the Hon. Baronet : be was elected by
a Corporation of 36 Burges..es.----(A laugh.)---But
though elected by them, he considered himself the re-
presentative of the whole population.
Sir F. BURDETT wi,lied the Nolde Lord had fa-
voured the House with more explicit information as to
the future intentions of his 31.1je.ty's lhoisters rela-
tive to the queen than was conveyed in the phraseo•
logy of their remaining its the saute position of deter-
mination.

Lord CASTLEREAGH said, he had only to repeat,
that front the moment the Rill a Pains and Penalties
was abadoned, no further pri.ccrtliug Ito,tile to her
Majesty was contemplated. lint it did not follow from.
such a declaration that floc arrangement as to the lA-
turgy was to be disturbed.

BROCGIIAM wished to know from the Noble
Lord, whether his view of institutint,• no new proceed-
ing against her Maks.), was to he nwrely this, that all
investigation was to cease ; trial to be discontinued ;
but punishment to go un.--•(l{e.tr.)
Lord CASTLEREAGH ucnicd that the terns pu-
nishment could be applied to all arrangement Haile in
consequence of an Order in Council, preparatory to
the investigation.
Lord J. It CSSELL begged to call the recollection
of the Noble Lord (Castlereagh) ; the grounds on
which last St ,lion the exclusion of her Majesty from
the Liturgy was defended by his Majesty's Miui'trrs.
Would they, it was asked, place in the Liturgy the
name of a pet sun over whom heavy charges were pend-
ing, and w !deb name, in the recut of guilt being es-
tablished, they would be bound to erase ? lf, then,
such exclusion he continued, he was forced to con-
clude that Ministers take for g✓ranted that those heavy
charges have been substantiated against her Majesty.
Dr. LUSHINOTOX rose to present a Petition from
the Freeholders and Inhabitants of the Borough of
Ilchester, on the subject of the Queen. Alter some
preliminary observations, the llonottrable and Learn-
ed Gentleman proceeded to state, that the Petitioners
prayed their Honourable House to take the necessary
steps to restore her Majesty's name to the Liturgy.!
and to put her in possession of all her rights and pri-
vileges; also to institute an inquiry into the origin
and conduct Of the Milan Commission, and to hring
to justice all those who were engaged in the foul eon-
:Tinley against the honour and security of the Queen.
He would to God that he could entertain a rational
hope that the House would agree to the prayer of the
petition; but so lung as that {tom represented but
a small portion of the people, so lung be was firmly
convinced would it be inclined to oppose the best en-
forced opinions of the nation at large, and so long
would the petitions of the people be neglected ; but
the day would cotter, and he believed it was much
nearer that many expected, when that would he done
in baste, anti perhaps rashly, which could now be
temperately and satisfactorily settled.
Lord CASTLEREAGH rose to correct a miscon-
ception respecting some words which had falleu from
him upon this subject in the last Session. It had
been stated that lie bad said on a former occasion,
that if the Rill then pending in Parliament against

the Qucen did not come down to that House, he would'
under any circumstances have proposed to the House
the question of the provision fir lieu Majesty ; be had
never said any such thing; he could not have said it;
he had no such impression span his wind. He did
say distinctly, that if the Bill came down lie would
enforce the call of the House, but if the Bill did not
come down, the call shouts be discharced. Now, so
far from this implying that he would cute: on the
question of the provision for the Queen. it implied
quite the contrary. That question could not be taken
into consideration without embracing other subjects
closely interwoven with it, all those collateral goes-
thins which could not be discussed without a cats
the House. There were at le tst two very importunt
questions sachisvly connected. that they could net he
separate& namely. the pr.tvision for the Queen, and
her Majesty's conduct. Tire necessity of the tall of
rthe House upon those questions was obvious; but he
must repeat, that be did not intend to enforce the call,
unless the Bill came down from the other House. He
must, therefore, deny the propriety of the construe-
lion tvhieli had been put upon his words.
I laird FOLKESTONE said that be did net see the
force of the reason which the Noble Lord bad given,
The fact was, that if the Bill had been gone on with.
it would have been necessary to enforce a call of the
House, because the feelings and opinions of most were
averse to the instituting of it at ail; bat on the, aw

being throtratint, the mprohn of the provision, and
time arrangement of wher subjet is must have fallen
In with the iatentiOns of atl parties, and the propriety
_ _

of arranging them would have met with the concur-
came of every este; so that in torch a case a Call of
the House would not have been necessary, and the
Noble Lord might have dispensed with it, and yet
gone fully into the qnestion. He then proceeded to
observe upon what had fallen from the Noble Lord, in
answer to the questions of the Honourable Member
for Essex (Mr. Weston) and the Gallant General (Fer-
guson.) The Noble Lord had refused to give a direct
an over to the questions of those Gentlemen, respecting
inquiry into the Milan Commission. He said, indeed,
that those Honourable Gentlemen might hriug fur. I
ward what motions they pleased on the subject. Bat I
no one knew better than the Noble Lord the difference
of a question coming forward from that side of the
House anti one originating with his own.
After a few words from Dr.LUSHINOTON, in reply
to what hail fallen from the Noble Lord opposite (Lord
Castlereagh). The Petition was then read, and
ordered to he printed.
Sir THOMAS ACLA ND presented a Petition from
the Freeholders and Inhabitants of Axminster, in De-
voe, praying that the Queen's name might he re-
stored to the Liturgy, and her Majesty put in pos-
session of all her rights and privileges. The Petition
was read, and orderd to hr printed.
Sir T. ACKAND presented also a Petition from the
Borough of Ilonitnn, to the same effect, which was si-
milarly disposed of.
Mr. Alderman HEYGATE rose to present a simi•
tar Petition from the Inhabitants of the Borough of
Sudbury. He observed, that it prayed her Majesty
tuieht be restored to the enjoyment of all her lawful
rights and privileges; and, what was not common in
throat days, the language in which it was couched
was not only respectful to both Houses of Parliameut,
but also to the Sovereign. lie wished to take that
opportunity of expressing his opinion on the subject
of the Petition, which his constituents had called
upon him to support. No man could deplore more
than hr the introduction of the Bill of Pains and Pe-
nalties; and he deplored it because he firmly believed
that it was not justified by any State necessity, nor
could tend to any good purpose. lie could not hot
congratitlete tloe House and the country on the decla-
ration of the Noble Lord opposite (Castlereagh), that
there would be no further proceedings upon that sub-
ject. He was also displeased at the original omission
of the Queen's name in the Liturgy, because he fore-
saw that it would he isroductire of many evils, and
because it gave the best opportunity to those who cared
nothing for the Liturgy, to abuse and embarrass
the Government of the country.—(Bear, hear, from
the Ministerial Benches). But it was one thing to re-
gret the original omission, and another to vote for
an Adders. to the Sovereign, to request the insertion
of the name. This subject was nut to be decided by
the Queen's guilt or innocence alone as to the charges
preferred against her. There was another very im-
portant consideration ; the line of political conduct
which her Majesty had chosen to pursue since her re-
turn to this country, and which was not more unbe-
coming her dignity, than at variance with the coun-
sels of her sound and higitimate advisers. This line
of condect she had persevered in during the last four
months, yet, on her first coining to this country, and
when the proceedings against her had just cotnmenciel,
she declared that she would not mix her cause ; the
vindication of her character and honour ; yes, she said
she would not mix up that cause with the views of
any political party whatever. Unfortunately, her
Majesty dill not persist in that determination many
days ; she soon put her name to a letter addressed to
her Sovereigu and husband ; yes, to her husband, and
he spoke as he was sure every man would speak, who
felt fur the character of his country ; this letter con-
tained sentiments, which, addressed to a private (leo-
would have been considered disrespectful in
the extreme ; but, when applied to the Sovereign,
because little less than what, in any other person must
have been visited with the punishment of the law.
This letter was followed by a long series of attacks on
both Houses, its which she did not hesitate to say that
if the Bill were to pass, it mast he gravely proposed to
the people whether it ought to be obeyed. Direct
encoura:eiteet u as also held out to the )Military, who
were paid by that !loose and the Crown, to try how far
they ought to disobey bole If others were now pre-
pared to forget those things. he was nut prepared to
du so. It therefore became the House of COlllllllOl/4 to
reflect, before it touk any steps which might be coo-
strued into an approbation of such proceedings. The
Parliament ought still to coosider, that should they
carry up an Address to the Throne in favonr of a per•
son who had so conducted herself, it would appear as
if they acted upon a recognitien of the propriety of
such conduce—Meer, hear, from the Ministerial
Benches.) He hoped that the moment wont soon ar-
rive whets the memory of all those unhappy proceed-
Inge would be buried in complete oblivion.—(Hose,
hear, and laughter from the Opposition.) lie trusted
that the time would soon come when this question
would altogether disappear, and the permanent and
great interests of the cossittry occupy the attention of
Parliament, that we might be no longer the ridicule
of foreign oations.—(Laughter). We had already
suffered from this question ice many respects, and he
did not wish it should long continue to interrupt the
proper hasineea of the Legislature and distract the
community.
Mr. HUME said he wag Parry to hear the worthy
Alderman charge her Majesty with a crime little Imo
than treason, fur having uttered the sentiments NW
tained its the letter to which lie alluded. He held the
letter ice his hand, and he called *pen the Hon. Gen-
tleman to point out a single sentence which could
bear out the serious charges he had made. He (Mr.
Hume) was as sell inelined to support the dignity .s
power of that House as any wan in the county;
he would venture to affirsti,that there was not a senti-
ment or expression in that letter from whirl, he should
take offence, nor was there any thing like improper
feeling.--(Cheers oa the Ministerial lienehes.)--As to
those men who could lay tkrir hands upon their hearts
and say that they acted right or manly in persecuting
a defenceless oissuan, he dui nut care for their cheers.
He wished that they would imagine themselves in the
situation of that Female, and then think what their
filings and expressions would be. It was the part of

a dastardly nTan to )ramose upon a woman, but ]beds.
tees did endeavor to trample upon the Qaeee ; and
when they thought that she Ira, in the dust, by their
infamous proceedings•---(he used the word intimate
in the broadest sense w high the English langutee
3c
gu de
st giveto it),eo theymp spaletelae-rd h
reibtiLliingthat ma
From begliiisce enin7l4
to
end of those proceeding,, it was well worth cemsisler-
ing what was the sitoatigis of that unfortunate amd
illustrious woman. If the principle which the
Honorable Gentleman had laid down was right, whit
did it come to? lie (Alderman Music) had
admitted the injury receive.] ; he conferred that it wag
a great wrong to have excluded her name front the
Liturgy, and yet he tells her that, because the f.„
been aggrieved, insult innst be added to injere, ant
complaint must be met by new acts of oblmine an I
iajustice.—(]tear, hear:)—As to the Noble Lord eta
had cheered the Worthy Alderman, he slid not eery
him his sensations when such reflections ma-t Wm on
his pillow.—(A laugh.)—The House ought to can
to its mind how her Majesty was placed isk"
she ieturned to this Country. The Honourable Ow.
tlemen then proceeded to review the grievances of bee
condition, and the cruelties th it attended the vomit.
logs against her; and inaintained that in her "peal
she had only demanded a fair trial, bad the, asked it
any man demanded the same, would the Hee. Member
deny it to him? She claimed no more from her help
bawl, and it was really too much for as huliwidealte
stand up and reprimand her for it.—(Hear, hear.)
Mr. Alderman HEYGATE said, that he must .4.v a
few words in reply to the attack which the Helmer.
able Gentleman bad made upon him, for giving a fair
expression of his opinions on a public and important
matter. The Hon. Member bad called upon him to
point the passages in the Queen's letter to which bit
had objected. He had not that letter by him, and he
had spoken of it from recollection. Yet he believed
be reniembereil one passage which would bear out ha
assertion. If lie recollected right, that passage said, is
addressing the King, " Your Conn is a scene of low
debauchery." He would pat it to the Hon. Member
and the feelings of the (louse, if such language
could be justified.—(llear I. and order!)—He had
some extracts from her Majesty's answers to Ad-
dresses, which he believed would corroborate his
remarks : one of these spoke of the Bill
darkening the present, while the future appeared
lowering with civil war. A limber, the Answer to the
Address from the parish of hlarylebone (we believe)),
had this sentence, " The time is come when it is under-
stood that the interests of the military are not dtstioct
from Close of the people." Again, it was said that the
Sovereign was the slave of his appetites, and only re-
markable for fatuity." Another mentioned the" insoles&
domination" of thi Government. Her Majesty had set
even hesitated to declare, that she would not submit but
by force to any sentence not pronounced against her is
a court of iIIStICC. The Answer to the Address from
Cripplegate Witholit stated, that if the Bill passed the
Legislature, it would be matter of consideration hew
far it might to be obeyed. la her Auswer to the Ad-
dress from the Artisans, sloe said, that " it was °witty
to the hard-beartelness of the oppressor that the sweat
of their brow during the day was followed by the tete
of atiiict• at its close, bet such things would her
he regarded as the scenery of a troubled drelen." inlet
lie had quoted cumulated indeed for the greater part of
general is/axiom, but they derived their force from the
foamier of their application, and from the time in which
they had been addressed to the Sovereign. For him-
self, 1w mist repeat, that it would be the last thing he
to should think of attack without cease, the character
of an unfortunate and illustrious female. Ile deeply
lamented (cries of spoke, spoke!).
Mr. LOCKHART, after some prefatory remarks, is
reply to the observations of the Honourable Member re-
specting her Majesty, stated, that the conduct of Mi-
nisters, in refusing to insert her name in tier. Liturgy,
while they settled a proviaion upon her, would give bet
command and influence, with a disparaged character,
and enable her to keep a Court, while they pat her in a
situation to deprive her of the association of persons et
elevated statious and feelings. Under these circus•
stances, and with a disparaged character, into wheel
hands was it likely that her Majesty would fall ? The
llottourable ?Merman had read extracts from the ea-
s.vers which bee Majesty hail been advised to give It
the vast number of addresses that had been presented I.
her. IVas it not probable that, under the ctretonstanoss
which he had described, instead of falling into the heads
of advisers, who would give her Majesty coostitetiosal
advice, she would fall into the hands of those who, as
the llomsurahle Alderman had said, would make a tool
of her fur their own purposes; not with any sincere
view to protect her, and wholly regardless of her gailt
or intowesice? Was it not probable that her Majesty
would again fall into the hands of such irresponsible ail-
risers, who would attain deluge the country with ar
suers to addresses similar to those on which the Ike
mineable Ahleruian animadverted.? If her Majesty woo
placed in the situation in which an Wilmot penile
ought to be placed (and he had a right to call that tote
son innocent, against whom no accnsatiou had been
established) tube would immediately have about her poi-
sons of rat* and character, by whose advice and es-
ample, aided by tier own good sense, she might becomes
not the base of the tramisillity of the coomery, but still
is some degree the ornament of it. It was Lis most
earnest wish that, instead of the advice of the writers of
those %bitted addresses, which cootedned all she aar
sense uf the French Revolutionists, her Majesty should
be placed in a situation in which she should receive the
advice of the able, honourable, worthy, and independesl
men who defended her on her trial. But, unless het
Majesty were placed in such a situation that her rim.
racier would remain untouched, she would be as a tit*
brand in the country, and her presence weeldronstantb
increase that discontent, acrimony, and angry &thalami
of opinion which at present existed, and which wellt
never cease until the Caine should be removed. M
menient when the agriculture and the mastafactares
the country west is sea langoishing a state, how weal
the people endure that their best interests 'Weld Moak.
unattended to, while they were debating on a nsere pow
tilio, a point of hemmer of Ministers? Ought the nughlf
and sacred interests of the country to be left to shoo*
lion by such trilling ? He was no enemy to the plea°
Ministers. He never had been so. During' lona. 511.11,1
he lied been their tins friend. Ile highly sP1111•4 7.
their conduct at the time he alluded to; and he had NW.
then, as he said now, that their moues would stand hr
in history. By their perseverance. fortitude, and w
Eons, they had extricated this country from a aitoat.i
of the almost per But he much doubted if they ste
biy
&wood the arts of peace as well as they had sliotiui
had done those of war. In his opinion, it woul d
more manly in his Majesty's Minister'', having t
ifes
in some degree. to weeile altogether. 'I his wield
tranquillity to the country, and would l"tal,lT 3LIF
the destructive sohjert at prevent so niiiireiet_,
agitating the country ; leaving the Legislator, at I;
ty to devote its 'Mintier!" us the real interests o
country. •