The Statesman.
London, England, 1810-04-06 00:00:00

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eineasoret Now whit had Hall done ? Ile
had published a work reflecting on the house or
Cutntiions-unil..srjete of-the Itlenibers of it, for
which he, was summoned before the Privy Council,
and also hofore the !Nose. Ile refused to ap.
pear. Ile would not attend ; and the House pro:
ri .•tled on this complicated clierge.—[llore Sir S.
ii umilly. Irefid the report of the case, by which
it appeared that she defendant was fined GOO marks,
expelled. the house, and that at the end of the sit
months imprisonment, he l.te continued still further
confined, until he should make such retractation of
his sentiments as should be satisfactory to certain
Members of the Governineut, who were thea
named; and unless he made that retract:item, to the
satisfaction of the servants of. the Crowvi, hesnight
remain in prison for life, for Parliament was nut
regularly assembled.] Was this a precedent.hy which
the House of Commons of the prevent day was Sa
be guided? He wished to ask, Whether the House
was prepared to say, that they would adopt tspre.
cedcnt, by which a man. might be imprisoned fur
life, for a libel reflecting on the conduct of as indi.
vidual Member of the House, not on the Home it.
self; fur enforcing the standing Order of the flonso
was all that was imputed in the libel of Oulu Jones
on Mr. Yorke, and that after the whole of thej
subject to which it related was over, and that it
was not the act of the House was clear Neu this,
that there was no debate upon. it,. it was enforced
by Mr. Charles Yorke. It was therefor* a libel
on that (gentleman, and on him alone, 14100 .s
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• 0011:4, ileitoreal EiNgllti. leo k verily
,fielleied,
that however right that dedgi..l4ht be id *elf,
-Or however cortsdientiously Memba,t 4+itakt have,
voted in that majority, the Hoists of Coniniotts-
and the Notion- were of dijeeiint opinions upon
the subject....(No, 150; no ! from seoerai parts'
of the hlouse.)—Sir S. Romilly retained 'his opi.
niou on thest subject, notwithstanding the cond.
deuce of the negetiVe Which had just been tittered:
with so much vehemence ;, and he added that whelk
the Itesulution now before the House was disposed
of, he should mote that Gale Jones be discharged"
without petition, on the ground that,• drst„ he
ought not to have been imprisoned oo that, war-
rant ; and, secondly, if he ought, he had already
suffered enough.
Mr. STEPHEN compliniented his Friend en
the moderation and urbanity, so consistent with hie
manly character, which he had on the present 0r...'
casket displayed, but lamented that he bad (while
speaking on a subject on which he wished the
House to be unanimous) adverted to a topic of
all others the most likely to. create disNion. If
unfortunately the vote of the House had not tic.
corded with the sentiment* of. the People, it did
nut then follow that they were not to assert,
their privileges. If the House had fallen in the
public estimation„ it teas soot the .way to retrieve
its character by pnvOraidieg the Public, that both
shiest while lovettigufing a great constitutional
ciplei bad uojustlicommittedn subject to prison.;
-His Hon. Friend:bad not iutorrupted the lineal.
nit/ of 0%44.9)14A T. his single dlssint. More Sir
&ilia, STOW 6d-ti'aslia'o4inEj he"
werb ent presint; feelingly alive as he ;natio the
interests of Miley**. had that conttnittal struck him
as being unjust theirst time ho had entered the
Mow afterwards Ire' Would hate moved .for the
discharge of Me. Jones. He therefore' contended,
the house had not unjustly encroached on the
liberty of the *Object while asserting their own,
His Honourablei Friend on the forever evening was
' riot prepared tip Say whether or not the paper
,before them eras libellous; be. (Mr. Ste.
phen) biped he would have formed
his opinion by "that time (yesterday), s but he
had been disappointed. If he were disposed.tO
think the paper' *qs a libel, alt those elaborate ar.
• guments W which-be had called the :attention of the
1.41150 were irreleiant to the question before him,
and did not bear him out in opposing the motion.
He could not consistently oppose it Without main.
taioing that that House had in no case a right to
commit. The paper of the Honourable Baronet
(Sir F. Burdett) went to say, that they had violated
the Constitution of the. Country, trampled on
Magna Charts, and subverted the liberty of the sub.
ject. He meant to infer that' they had violated
their int great duty, and usurped a tyrannical
power to imprison a man illegally without trial by.
jury, . and that they had. transgressed beyout
the bounds which :won and which *Oahe
should prescribe to thee. He had endeavoured to*
substantiate this. by at sort of syllogism; setting
forth-that no court possessed the power of
toning the salkject bill a Court of Record, and that
no court•could be. I Court of Redord in which daw
ranges amoantinn tolebove Could not be re,
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k7leier get with credit, and they ought
issquive beets passed. offer. Tie Hon. Member
tare related :in anecdote of a man called 14A ker.,
' . who happened to engage in
.a quarrel,
whic‘tic.weebeat In a- most unmerciful Manner:
• 'e next air trapoeared with his eyes closed from
the contusions he had i*ecived,./Lept on his, nose;
and several of his teeth driven from the front of-his
meith. On being met by i countryman, he asked
'bins hew he coilld suffer himself to be disfigured ini
such a manner, Ind fur which he was a diSgrace to
:his country. To which he replied, that lie took,
:the world aisy. Such a principle, it was scares
necessary for him to observe, was the worst pot:,
'Able method of getting clear of, or accounting for
-a misfortune. As, to the. question before the
House, be tionld certainly rote for the letter's be: "
ing a breach 'of privilege ;'`but if it were passed
Over, the fitst course which should be taken; mutt
beto compeetete Gale Jones kir the losses he had
suStainedOnsd, Then to unsure from the *dome tat
power of ciaiereittal.
Mr. ,ADAM congratulated the MON. on its
coming coolly and deliberately to consider this
portant question. - If th; opinions delivered by
his Hon. and Learned Fiiend (Sir S. Romitly)
were promulgated, he would say there was an end
of the. authority of this Houk.- Should 440
Hem, the Chimpion of the iibertiei of the people.;
which It vindicated against the inanities's of James,
kind Charles IL—Ohotild ibis Ilnuse which
feria Jamei 11. to Odle-ate his ilifont
his ever struggled against the innovation of the
Crosnr,-Antt ld *bleb .struggtwit triiitsenti
aucemsful, though coped with tyrsiany,oboaldi
he said, this House now; resign its rights ? Should
democratic power, When probed to the .bettorn„,
.be .now plated over in Silesia, ?—(fitvsr
:was astonished, that one of -such perspiegity
And application as • his Learned Priced should
State, that the present question depended on the' .
case of Gale Jones—that the House viai oicupied
in the consideration of the past, and not the pre.
.sent subject. On what does .the power° of a
• Cued of Judicature rest, but on the maintenance
Of its character ?..—has it been forgotten, that•thisi
.14 one of the primary Courts of Judicature He .
then proceeded to read a passage from Lord Coke's.
4th Institute; where it states that it is Impossible.
for a Court to be high in tho'estimation of the pen.
plc, or to maintain its authority, without a iertabs
power ; this power, when lieentions, is certainly
injurious; but still it is essential to Goreitsusent•—•
[Hear ! hear !] in a word, no eupreme power Can
exist without a right of punishment for contetipt.
The ease of Gale Jones was a despicable ground
on whiCh to put this question. Upon this subject
it was argued that no one could be considered
guilty of contempt Unless committed in presence
of the Houte. Could it be possible that•the au.
thority of . the House of Commons and the House
of Lords is put in the situation of that of the
constable of the night, who possesses the right of
committing a drunken man to the watehhouse, be.
cause he is an obstruction. • (Loud cheers.) Me.
Juitice .Blackstone states as cleat as possible, the
the authority of a Court rusts on its inquisitorial
power; and. in what doettiris cosmetic be.Q.‘l3l

wet aqiich -was sa,tr.t befon...tbAL tilleinr Pub-
'Weil. Sir Samuel Romilly begged to be iiidert;
stood stotasafefentlitig the libel itself, ter 4.sias
a publication.of which he greatly disapproved, as
he did the measure by which. it was preceded--he
meant the debate at the Society of which Mr. Gale
Jones was a member, where a number of persons
assent hied on payment of a shilling apiece, or some
trifling suns of money, to hear persons• display
oratorical powers upon occasional, and there•
fore, to a populace, engaging subjects, at the
expense of public characterss who lisuPitti means
of defending themselves, and .who were generally
out that account roughly treated—but still lie
was hound to say he did ant conceive this a sub.
jest for the commitment of the individual to
prism+ ; lie did not think it an obstruction to the
proceedings of the House of Commons, because
the thing to which it related was user; and he
thrther observed, that arguing from analogy to
Courts of Justice, in which ho did not pretend
to be perfect in his recollection, although he had
some experience in them, but he rather in:
clintal to think there was no case, certainly nut
snooty, in which Courts of. Law had committed a
party, for auy libel oh its proceedings after those
proceedings were over—for libels pending the pro.
'emaliogs he knew there were, but they had no bear.
in; on this case, for here the proceeding was over
before the publication .of the libel. He maintain-
ed, that the case .of Brass Crosby, in the Court
of Common
.Pleas, decided nothing as applicable
to the question now before the House. He
thought the doctrine contended for by Sir Sohn
Anstruther was alarming, to-the liberty of the
subject,; fur it went ,to this, that .the Heusi
of Comotena. ill. to....itt.dge., PL. ka. casmari,,,
_.
....„. , .._, _.,r,.....-....,..-.swpr.-s? arca; sucquif wr "9.$•••• ..... e------s .v.-----1-" s--... u'air. ,-
hates to an indefinite extent ; and that it **he saininiirtmrofraritierhAfre olkattttUllave'stated of this, its enthority is lost among the pis:tsk,' •
exercise its authority without either restmint bill Intetstion it insn. he admitted the tight of the without it, to oppose the influence of the Crolino '
or limit but its own moderation ;Jo that there Reese to oommkin certain ceses, though he .de. Would be ineffectual ;itis a right which csinootr '
was no remedy, if the exercise should be. nicd that Mr. G. Jones had merited to bo.so corn. he told when it commenced, but stands on Wise.' -"" 4:
tome ever so enormous or inhuman.--. Now,. nutted. Thinking so, it world not be enough morial usage. The•time would crime • when the -
said the Learned Member, I should be very that he should move for his . discharge: -He 'voice of the people, throrigh that Hock,' Vociulda
glad if-any Gentleman would tell mo'what is the ought to go farther, mid solicit the Crown drive away the present Ministers from -the veinal
fair, correct definition of arbitrary power, other to afford him some remuneration for - the of power ; such was his devoted prayer; rat
than that power which has no restraint or limit its confinement he has endured. If ho could this was an object unattainable, unless by • ..
its exercise but its own moderation. Ile then persuade the House to 'that,. still one quell_ tecting their privileges. The Honourable Mn'iai.
took up-Site subject of rho tiolence of the fan. lion would remain behind—whether the .act of ber referred to the precedent of 1774; in thus '
rage, As it had been .called, of Sir Francis committing him wad.wilfully illegal,. Wanton, and case of Mr. WOodfall, who published -a Oar
Burdett; in this publication, and maintained it arbitrary ?—.es stated in the pimphlet. They had against the then Speaker. Mr. Fox mated the* . .
to be much inferior in violence to that which been 'told that the opinions of all the great law he should be committed to Newgate; *bee • •
was adopted in. the Resolution of that' House; authorities quoted Were not to he heeded, and he and ' Mr, Horne were brought in *costar; ' •
and that after •a conference had with the Lords his Hon. Friend had Censured the decision Of Lord to the Bar, the latter pleaded not guilty,. bee . .
on the subject of a writ of error on the proceed. Kenyon. He had not been able to collect . from he dared not then tell what he has Oa,.
ins of the Aylshury Election, by -which the the pamphlet-the grounds on which these were peed some ahem now. (Loud cries of Hear!)
House of Commons had. told the House of Lords, impeached.' In the case *of Crosby, the Court When the greatest authority and experience ea.
" That their Lordships- Were contriving to bring had stated the House to be the best judges isted, in the time of Lotd North, the rights of
the rights and liberties of the subject into the.sole of -their own privikges. The light thus thrown Parliament Were never doubted; such contumacy
gulf of their Lordships' discretion, which would •on the Legem el- consuetidixens Parliarnenli was left to those times. At that time there was
swallow op the' rights and liberties of the, peo. was.sufficient to establish the right of the- not one word heard about the privilege'', of the
pie, end to which their Lordships gave the Com. House to com:nit for a breach of ;their privi. House. It was thb more extraordinary, beanie
mops nation to *lay, they were utterly to dig. 'lege*, twin the case of Mr. G. Som. The dor. an acrimonious discussion took pence, and the .
regard their', edgrneet [we think it *as] When trines quoted on.behalf of Btirdett had been um; most' eminent characters of the country, Fez;
thetionsidered in what manner it had been Geer_ fairly cited. They had insidiously Optleieeured Tharlow; Loughborough, dm. took 'part in the
eised.'i,Now., suppoeing Sir Francis Burdett had to. give the words .of Coke on - the "listens, of a debate;,- but it never occurred to them the House
thetigh`t the Hot* had trampled upon the rights Court of Record, *a meaning diredtit eouteary
,te of Commons did net possess the power to commit
and liberties of the subject, whether he took a their true one,
..as he, of silt others, had been mot either Mr. Woodfall or Mr. Horn. It was
right of a wrong view of that subject, it was na_ in favour of allowing that
,Hodse, the ppweri at *. WI for the times in which we fire, to dig.
.W 0 such power and privilege; and he al. '
rural enough that he Simla have adopted some Court of Record. In support of_ ,thisissertioni'
warmth of expression, and indeed Sir Francis had ho ihstanted severed passage* in Poke, to:sbow •ntost Considered ieddent:t a Waste
The of
reiolutiont time to refer
been unfairly treated tnight by a Noble Lord that that. House had exercised the,aelitortty ofot •tA . 007 other pr
tonight(Binning) who spqte early in this debates. when al. Conran( Judicature: The case Of
.04 was ik. 1701, 'otteraf Kentish Petition; the division of,
lesion was made to some things he bad said out actty'in point; but in that •ease the, Hotta pro.,' set 'extraordinary a nature which followed; the
farther occasions, and on other subjects. Whether seeded meets lariher thelit would think of pro. events of that- period down to • 17/4; form a
the sentithwits uttered by Sir F. Burdett on other cooling its the ,present ease. . His Honourable ground of arguinent from which kis impostible•to
(Katie:nand on other subjects were right orwrong, Friend had said, ho was net' aware of any be dislodged. The ease of Ashley and White was
it was improper Bow to discuss, fur lie was not to authority of it Court to punish libels .On put an end to by a dissolution of Parliament ; IRA
be judged of by what lie had uttered on other oe: its Members. , Here the Honothable Chntlensan this, as' the. necessity of a sepreme intervening'
jcasions, but on this occasion; and here again he quoted Blackstonomst some length to prove the power was evident,' was a wise resolution' Crosby
I must be excused for the• prelinlices of This habits, Howie had acted illegally. Ho was *astonished well refused s Habeas Corpus ; and In the. year
when he said, that in a Court of Justice no re. that one so-skilled in law, so strenuosis an "die. 1762,' #le Murray was brougbe
it fi-efore the
Habeas
Hoter,
ference was ever alloared to belted to the conduct Bate for liberty; should deny the privileged of who applied te the King's 'Pch tor •
of an accused party other than n hat related to the Parliament, -and leave them to be trampled on, or. Corpus. This was refused by Justice •Wright, . •
question immediately before the Courts-,-a practice go begging•to e .Cuort of Law to establish their an:upright Judge, and of utbietnfished
chertotet,
which the house might with. adeautage imitate. authority.' If the House did not Vindicate its pri. who declared that in so doing he felt- per. -
Sir F. Burdett was nut to be tried by the House vileges, should the Judges appointed •hy the, fectiy Itkey in his • cooseleicei: inessin. asmuch,' as •
the
ha
of CoMmatts upon a eliciting whether that IloW,e .Crown -be the arbiters ? %mad the vindication conesiweil, such- a refusal to ~... tu t to •
approved or disapproved .of his political semi_ of the privileges of the House of Commons be. „feelings of thi5,_,,..:•..
,:, sntteemb
mesas or not, but whether he bad or lialt slot , finally vested, by la . natural tranaition, in the hesiquoted the onikurily orifor,,. ,^7 ldriustice
committed a breach of the privilege of the .House House of Lords ? Ile was hapPylo Say popu. 'Hale, from the maaoscript in th ' Tememian ee
of Commons, which .ho thought he had not. lay discontent no longer existed. The Expedition, 'Mr. Hargrave (page -244. chap. 11.):arlsich states
The next point was the time in which ibis aubjet't
•and the motives which directed it wete now ex. thct tho power of .committal beiongiehathe House
had been brought forward ; and the feeling*, tite plained sad sippsfeed of ; for the sake of, the by.anquestionabloommeibut It had sot tile etoWer
1
of giving damages; . This as farther centabberarect
hlr.. Hargrave a Discourse on• the History of
public on the,present occasion. JC.w.as.ltato reffel. permanent interest:of Ike ConstitatiOu, end foe
lected,that this was a subject whichgri osst, isfObe the authority of the 110V1104 'OA eonsidetatios. .in
'rheneante AillitinAwl urt
"
11/sleben ()
% Expedition, for the or eau' teed by Aerial preclude the atceseity of punishing patient
M r.Yorke vies to exclude strangotsTrO in lie gallery who treated k witheonteend. He was quite as.. hPearli slusesll4"l4l tqatriYote j,ilidiocan t d
luir, bllie . that of one
sod Judges is Able coca ihide... .whom he never Gould .speak witlin'ut the- feet.
during the whole of the esamination•orsvidenee tuniShedai the assertion that the Beassf was the might say watt educatett in Parliatueetond f
upon that Zspedition, and it was that eisinsion parties, accusers,
potties ; their otssbeettir wee logs of ardent veneration and allection. • .M r.
which pendeced the libel of Galeloise, and Is eied.that,they were
was the commitment of that person which prodec ant exercised lot their own; nor for. the sake of' Pox being- asitedi- btfw fat the mower of ' the
cd the publication 'of Sir Francis Bartlett. - Now. any; indiehlaal, bat for„the sake of those, whoient :Roue . extended in , emirates, 1. he onewercds
ugoa tho dvcisiou oil duo Hobs of
,Coonnostron them Akers. 'Out of such questions the lions -it could cOtamit for contat9t, or taisdetes
•suosr,
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