The Liverpool Standard and General Commercial Advertiser.
Liverpool, Merseyside, England, 1842-11-01 00:00:00

FINANCE COMMITTEE

The proceedings of the Finance Committee were read.
Amongst them was a resolution, arising from a request of
Mr. Samuel Holme to be released from a contract with the
corporation, in order to qualify him to be returned at the
municipal election.
Mr. G. H. LAWRENCE said he did not know that there
was anything in the proceedings of the committee to which
he need direct the attention of the council, save the resolu-
tion passed on the preceding day to relieve Mr. Samuel
Holme from the contract for the Observatory. They had a
precedent before them in a former act of the committee,
when Mr. Deaken, who sought a seat in the council, was re-
lieved from his responsibility to supply coals. Mr. Holme
had substituted Mr. Isaac Renshaw for himself in the con-
tract in question. Ile moved that the proceedings be con-
firmed.

Sir THOMAS BRANCKER seconded the motion

Mr. YA.xxs expressed his regret that the committee had
declined to interpose in the memorial from Mr. Williams,
relative to the consumption of smoke. Mr. Yates spoke of
the clouds of smoke emitted from the manufactories at the
north end of the town, and said that there were many re-
medies offered ; amongst others, that of Mr. Wye Williams,
which was both effectual and economical. He spoke for
the sake of the poor, for, while the rich could retire to
their country houses, the poor were obliged to endure Jim
inconvenience, to the injury of their health. The Connell
of London, he said, bad given great attention to the' sub-
ject, and he would move that this part of the report be re-
ferred back for consideration, in order that the committee
might gain all the information possible connected with the
subject.

which c

DBACII said, if there were any invention which
• :e safe and economical, undoubtedly it would
effect, for all who owned mar
moire, would be glad to consume h,
He had been connected with one of the Water Com-
. .

ufactor

panics, V

h bad five stations. They made much smoke,
and were very desirous of consuming it, as they bad been
indicted. They had tried all the inventions. At two of
these stations, they tried the plan of Mr. Wye Williams,
which at first failed, but at length succeeded, but not with-
out great difficulty, insomuch that Mr. Williams himself
could not succeed for some time. The same plan had also
been tried by the Liverpool and Manchester Railway Com-
pany, and it succeeded. It was not so clear, however, as
Mr. Yates seemed to suppose, that any of the plans would
succeed entirely. With respect to the Finance Committee,
it was merely necessary to say, that they had not the power
to do anything in the matter.

Mr. G. H. LAWRENCE Said it was not the province of the
Finance Committee to sit as a sort of committee of inquiry
on all the inventions which had been made for the con-
sumption of smoke, and they bad not the power to compel
parties to adopt any of them.
The proceedings of the Finance Committee with the leases
were confirmed.
IMPROVEMENT COMMITTEE.

The proceedings of this committee having been read,
Mr. SANDBACII said, that in moving their confirmation
for the last time, he was happy to congratulate the council
on the arrangements being so completed for widening
Lime-street that both sides were ready to be pulled down.
There would then be an open handsome space from Ranelagh-
place to the new courts, which would be an ornament to the
town and a credit to the inhabitants.
The motion being seconded by
-s were confirmed.

ceeding

Mr. KILSEIAW, the pro-

WATCH COMMITTEE

The proceedings of the Watch Committee were read. The
committee had granted £lO to the father of Hodgson, the
policeman who was killed at the late fire. The committee
had also granted rewards to the officers employed, which re-
wards were proportioned to their exertions.
The proceedings were confirmed.
MARKETS' COMMITTEE.
_ _

In the proceedings of this committee it was set forth, that
George Read and John Thompson had been appointed In-
spectors of slaughter-houses and meat, and that, on the
motion of Mr. Kilshaw, a resolution had been passed to il-
luminate the clock of St. Martin's Market.

The proceedings were confirmed.
. EDUCATION COMMITTEE

The report of this committee contained the following re-
turn :—The number of children in the North Schools were,
of the Church of England, 520; Dissenters, 200 ; Roman
Catholics, 56: total, 826. South Schools—Church of Eng-
land, 526 ; Dissenters, 99 ; Roman Catholics, 48 : total, 673.
Average attendance—North School : boys, 254 ; girls, 201;
infants, 203: total, 658. South Schools : boys, 207 ; girls,
131; infants, 188: total, 526.

The proceedings were confirmed.
GAOL COMMITTEE

The proceedings of this committee having been read,
Mr. BOLTON said he thought it necessary to allude to the
unsatisfactory manner in whidh the contracts were made for
the supply of bread to the prison. It appeared that the con-
tract had been made on the 20th of September, with Mrs.
Aldersy, who was the only competitor. The contract was
made at such prices that, if there bad been competition, he
had no doubt the charge would have been twenty-five per
cent. lower. Instead of advertising he would recommend
that circulars should be sent round to the bakers, for, at
present, there was no practical competition. He mentioned
an instance of a proof which had been obtained on one oc-
casion of the charge for bread being too high, on the repre-
sentation of which Mrs. Aldersy agreed to take a farthing per
pound less. He was not inclined to disturb the existing con-
tract, but, in future, he would recommend the adoption of
the mode which he bad proposed.
. .

Mr. HOUGIITON said Mrs. Aldersy was the only one who
seat in a contract on the day in quest;on, and that the prices
was after the market rate.

Mr. PROCTER said no system could be so good for the
purpose of ensuring impartiality and competition as that of
advertising. Circulars might be only partially sent, and thus
favouritism would be engendered, but an advertisement was
open to all. . . _

Mr. H oncsoN expressed a similar opinion.
Mr. BIRKETT said, the subject required investigation.
The paupers were maintained at less expense than the pri-
soners in the gaol.

Mr. ISAAC HOLMES said, the council were much obliged
to Mr. Bolton for bringing the matter forward. The contract
was much higher than the articles could have been obtained
for in other places. He had called at the shop of Mr. Hick-
son, and found that the prices charged by Mrs. Aldersy were
much higher than those current at the time.

Mr. EVANS said, all contracts of this scut should go
through a committee of the council. The market price of
oatmeal on the day when the contract was made was 235.,
and it was charged 305., and it was well known, in the face
of an abundant harvest, that the corn market was falling.
The committee had amongst them some of the most acute
and intelligent mercantile men in the town : the corn market
was ever at hand, and they might have found out the current
price of corn in a moment, but they did not give themselves
the trouble. If they had been liable to be called to account,
as that council always was, such a contract would not have
been made. Without any investigation, they entered into a
contract, covering a half year, for one of the largest gaols in
the country, in which there were, on an average, seven
hundred prisoners, and that at a moment when there were
universal complaints of the parochial rates and other burdens.
He would take this opportunity of enforcing a prinliple. In
the former government there was a very great hankering after
depriving all councils of their power. "'LA-Lyng-0 was made at
this council to deprive them of the appointment of officers to
the Borough Gaol. Be resisted this with his whole power,
and was one of a deputation to London on the subject, when
he found it extremely difficult to prevent the council being
placed in a situation to have nothing to do with their own
gaol but paying the expenses thereof. The council, chosen
as it was, was better to be trusted than an irresponsible body
like the magistrates. Be hoped in future that contracts like
these, which were to be paid for by the money of the council,
would be left in the hands of the council through its com-
mittees. The council and the justices might become two
conflicting bodies, or the council might become much more
democratic than it was, and the two bodies might entertain
very different views. If the power were not placed directly
in the hands of the council, he hoped it would be understood
that the magistrates should make no contract that was not
subject to confirmation in that room. Mr. Evans concluded
by intimating that if this were not done, he should, at the
commencement of the next municipal year, be prepared to
move in the matter.

Mr. G. H. LAWRENCE said that he was glad that Mr.
Bolton had brought the subject forward, but as to any alte-
ration, he was afraid it was too late to amend the Reform
Act. No doubt there would be a wide distinction between
the two bodies, but there was no fear that they would not
agree. It would be observed, that the committee had or-
dered a new fire-engine, and that, however necessary, he
thought was beyond their province.
The TOWN-CLERK explained the law relative to the ma-
nagement of the gaol. The only part that belonged to the
magistrates was the regulation of the gaol, with the condition
that they conld make no order for the payment of money,
It was only by the courtesy of the Council that it was at pre-
sent otherwise. There was some confusion in the gaol acts,
which made it convenient that the Committee of Justices
and of the Council should act together. • On the 9th of No-
vember next it would rest entirely with the Council, under
the new circumstances, whether it would continue to associ-
ate in the management those of the jusfices who were not
councillors. _ _ _

Mr. BUSHELL said he would just state to the Council, that
the cost of maintaining paupers was 2s. id. per head, and of
maintaining prisoners 3s. 4d. per head. This showed either
theft the gaol committee were not doing their duty, or that
the prisoners were too well fed.
Mr. YATES begged to ask where Mr. Bushell got that in-
formation.

Several members intimated, that the cost of maintaining
the prisoners was not so high as Mr. Bushell had stated.

Mr. BUSHELL said he had been furnished with the infor-
mation by Mr. Birkett.
Mr. But Kerr said he had received the information from
Mr. Houghton.
Mr. HOUGHTON said, that the sum mentioned included
the salaries of officers and all the charges of the gaol.
Mr. BIRKETT said no doubt the charge of 2s. ld. per head
for the paupers included the payment of officers too. (No,
no!)
Mr. EARLE said Mr. Birkett had given some information
to a gentleman who had made use of it, and when it was
sifted it turned out to be all wrong, as information from that
source frequently was. Such things made people look a lit-
tle foolish. _ _

Mr. PLATT said Mr. Aspinall informed him that the dif-
ference between the prisoners and the paupers was not three-
pence a head.
Mr. BOLTON said the expense for prisoners was about
2s. 2d., and that for the paupers 2s. Id., which might be
accounted for, without reference to the high price paid for
bread, by the fact that many of the prisoners were young
people with good appetites, who would eat more than the
paupers, who were chiefly old people and children'. '
After some conversation on the propriety of suspending
the standing orders, the report was adopted, with the excep-
tion of that portion which relates to some rewards recom-
mended to the officers of the•gaol for their exertions during
the fire, which were reserved till the meeting of the 9th No-
vember, in compliance with a standing order.
The proceedings of the Gardens, Courts of Law, and
Church Expenditure Committees were severally read and
confirmed.

WASH-HOUSES AND BATHS

The proceedings of the Health Committee were read. It
was set forth, that the working classes had experienced great
comfort and convenience from the new wash-houses and
baths. Some increase was recommended in the charges for
the baths. It appeared that, from the 3d June to the 23d
September, the numbers of persons who had used the re-
spective baths were as follow :—cold baths 2150, hot baths
2358, private cold baths 300, private hot baths 113; total
4926. Receipts for the same, £57 2s. 11d.
Mr. BRIGHT opposed the increase of charges. The ex-
pense to the corporation was only £75 per annum more than
the receipts, and surely the corporation would not increase
the prices when the effect was so beneficial.
Mr. PARKER spoke highly of the baths as a great good to
the poor people, whose gratitude, when he called at the
establishment, it was quite delightful to see. He hoped they
would soon have one at the north end of the town, and
indeed one in every ward. _ _ _ _

,
Some discussion ensued on the subject of the proposed ad-
vance of the prices, and at length it was agreed to refer the
matter back to the committee.

DOCK COMMITTEE.
The proceedings of the Dock Committee were read an
confirmed.

MEMOIHALS

The MAYOR presented a memorial from Mr. Wye Williams,
praying that a penalty of £5O, incurred by a party for not
consuming smoke, should be remitted.
The TOWN-CLERK said, the party was prosecuted and
pleaded guilty. The council had not the power to give up
the whole or part of any penalty.
The MAYOR presented a memorial, signed by several
passenger brokers, requesting that a by-law should be passed
for licensing the men whom they employ as runners. Re-
ferred to the Finance Committee.