The Statesman.
London, England, 1810-05-26 00:00:00

oiler beet adop. . the ambition of the
Ruler of France stook! not leave them long
without knowing where to apply for aisistance.
it might nut be the duty of a Member of Par.
liament to state what was the opinion of
the Sovereign on any particular subject; but,
unquestionably, it became the duty of a Minis.
ter, when the point at issue was one most condu.
cive to the support of the Throne, too warn the
Sovereign of the feelings and sentiments of his
people, and even to enforce on the Royal ear the
necessity at compliance, though that measure
should not be agreeable. It might not be in the
power of a Minister to effect a change in the senti-
ments of the Sovereign*, but still he had it in his
power not to remain longer in the public service.
America was lost to this country not by the ad-
•ice of Ministers, but by a vote of that House;
and if Parliament was not on its guard, so would
it be with Ireland. It was the duty of the
servants of the Crown to proceed to the dis-
charge of their avocations free from any bond
or obligation whatever. His Majesty, however,
had been advised to ask from his present Mi-
nisters a pledge, that they should never intrude
on him any advice as to the propriety of acceding
to the wishes of his Catholic subjects ; if such
counsels were to persevered in, he could not pre-
tend to say—he dreaded to contemplate—where
the matter might end.
Lord JOCELYN explained.
Mr. PERCEVAL was happy to bear what had
fallen from the Right Honourable Gentleman
(Mr. Ponsonby) relative to Dr. Milner, the more
particularly, as he observed, in a pamphlet by Mr.
Keogh on the subject, a statement by Dr. Mil.
oer, in which he expressed a belief, that the Right
Honourable Gentleman might, in support of the
sentiments he had now delivered, quote a letter.bf
his (Dr. Milner's), written to him, in a hurry, in
a bookseller's shop. The Right Honourable Gen.:
tleman proceeded to argue against the motion. To
desire of -the Catholics, however, to surrender the
veto, would, to his mind,- be equally intolerant at
to demand theni to relinquish their claims altoge.
ther. If they could concede the veto, why might,
they not subscribe tO all the oaths which alone
cause the disabilities of which they now cum..
plained ?
Mr. WHITBREAD adverted to the systeett:
pursued by the Minister to aggravate the situ'.
•• lion, and insult the feelings of she Irish Catholics,
from the first moment of his introduction to office.
This system he conceived more galling then even
the refusal of the Catholics' Claim to Emancipm,
lion. Hu did not mean to charge the 'execution'
of this system upon the. Duke of Richmond or
Lord Wellington, or his brother, the present Se.
cretary for Ireland, but upon the extraordinary
Privy Counsellor (Dr. Doigenan), who seemed to
enjoy the peculiar patronage of the Right Honour.
able Gentleman (Mr. Perceval). From this
Learned Doctor, whom it was thought expedient
to silence in that House, he had seen sOme recent
publications which- really serialized arid shocked
from the wish they betrayed to revive the most
mischievous prejudice. Second only to the mis-
thief meant by this man, was that done at least
to a certain extent by Dr. Milner, whose conduct
throughout seemed particularly calculated to
promote dissension. As to the objection of
the Right Hon. Gentleman and others to the claims
of the Catholics upon the ground of the devotion
of their hierarchy to the Pope, who is the prisoner
of Bonaparte, it was stated by the Noble• Lord
(Castlereagh) that the hierarchy possessed very
great power and influence in Ireland, and that
statement, he observed, was relied upon, as a
support of the objection. But he would request
the House fairly to consider the nature of this ob-
jection. Let it be remembered, that the Pope,
the prisoner of Bonaparte, at this moment pos-
sessed the infiuenee Objected to among the Catho-
lic hierarchy, and consequently, as 'it was stated,
among the Irish Catholic people. If so, them.
would it not be wiser to concede to and conciliate
the hierarchy, with a view to attach.theni 'to this
country, and to guard against the progress of
French influence, than by offending and disgust.
ini them, render them more susceptible of that
influence. But he denied the position, that there
existed among the Catholic hierarchy of [retail'', or
any other nation, such an extraordindry devotion
to the Pope at to interfere with
,their allegiance to
their respective Sovereigns. Such a position
was, • indeed, controverted by the conduct of the
Catholic Clergy of France itself towards that SO.•
yereign who had totally destroyed the temporal
.. power and consequence of this Pope. But it was
pretended that the Pope's consent must be had be.
fore the Catholic Clergy could assent to any change
in the appointment of their Prelates ; and that 4.
was impossibly to gel at the Pope, because he was
now the prisoner of Bonaparte. What! could alai
French prisoner be inaccessible to that sagacious
Ministry who contrived to send Baron Kolli to
Ferdinand VII. ? [near, hear! and a laugh.]
The whole of this pretence was, however, too fri.
• volous for any serious notice, but it betrayed the
nature of the cause which it was adduced to sup,

port.
Mr. CANNING, in speaking against the mo.
(too, oxpiessed his opinion, that the time mutt
• clime, And he hoped very soon, who the claims
of the Githuiics might be safely acceded to. But
he regretted to think that from the nature and ex-
tent of existing prej"•.lices, the time was not yet
ripe in this country for tnaking the' concessions
which the Hon. :Hover had in view.
Mr. HERBERT supported' the motion.'
Upon the motion of Mr. C. HUTCHINSON'
the debate st as, at four o'clock this morning, .ittla;
journed till Fruity next,

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