The Statesman.
London, England, 1823-04-25 00:00:00

THE STATES]

KCliffil OR whom his Imperial Majesty hatkbetter make es-
ii
The Emperor, in his neat letter, said that when
he saw that passage in his Lordship's letter, which etym.,
ed his intentions to provide the people of Warsaw with L
Constitution, he began to conceive a different Opinion of •
his Lordship, and it would be difficult for him to remote th*:.
impression it made on him. rade, the cirevmstancro,, be
thou4ht it better to let the correspondence deep.-0
(t laugh). One groat objection to the Constitution of
e'Sonto was. thatshit/ Ind not two Vltitinberi. The' No:
hls.l:l4lkeliin his half-orklal:letter. told the Spaniards that
tlf bed our Chantbor, Ant Abot .they ought an bars-segol
WitUldshe Secretary of Stale for Foreign Affairs, or Sir
' William -A'C'enet, give that ingteol:ol to Awif eople Of
Stparti to elf's., their Constitution, tf they hid sot been so
' ••lbstrnetiOre his ffl*stv's Ministeri? • It wss pot true
• tbate-StiiiirkniatiCerwelitation. wps esperifeettt °Pk. It
• trattettitertive Mott .sterol obßeatiOns. • Ma MI ate ye
bearrrhafttse greatest *datakers of a resolution were
it untietidell men's opidlents with respect tollitir in •
thert:- le will stesafe to attempt to change what was.elitar
• • Vilma rib•Wellinifily. The teal Stolidity of a Constitatloo
. ."Ismi•founded••Orr the fidelity bf the people, and on their ad.
• cilinonce to theta oaths. 'Another objection to the present
..Viestituttrin'of Spain wig. that the King could not marry
/of orboete a *if& fdr hiMaelf. Neither could the King
*lO this toiletry. The ,Noble Duke also said, in his note,
:Mat thtt• Kik 'could' not perform his fanetions.—(A.
-
,iiiireh.) m: Chetralbriand said. that his Majesty was
/154 at liberty to go to wateiin&leees.—(A laugh.)—'
The Noble Dnke again laid, that the Kiog was not trust•
ed by IA (Internment.; but why was not the King
-`tristecl"....--(Hrar, hear.): Was* worthy of being trusted)
•.II yr to a:tnatter of some eirtrise tbiit it did net strike the
• Meade Duke 0a thing ltispriCticuble-to niake4Re parses
• trust anotlier,—(Hear, heir.) 'Another 'egg op made
to the Speniardi by the authority of Miniatete,•', was to
'lame the valiftcations of the Members of; their Ferns-
titent. Suppos, the Members of the Aluniser• had the
-;. sired tiplificitigns, wq that a way to assitultem in the
. ..,
,for: qieri of *Obit functions ? bid their Lordships
Aiiffiat 10,4 *gra Aliaimore trusted by the ponaseion of
•v. P- ••ILasonnht geisha' certainly iu this country. It
l.w.tliedie44tirinps,mitle.a viemte•anist the perfortisaocar
• • • ..•of;skeres dinwtions •thatit Aces reconmehded to the Spa•
• - . repiraschrio prortdinws',Chombers of Parliament. ilie'be.
. ' noved eiseCceclArat the etitiraettr of the Syshidh people
. ••ttdit tbey would set. lisOitto jtalif_flt use stiggitions.—
' .:Tlieronntry wide id ritionstritere against the toterfer—
l'ent4..ofthlt Alli4it•Pnifitil-4rit ica•tt toomout of irritation
7:- Ol.r
.v .aslitallipeio:ty give up their Coostitution. • Few
...'...4 SOW realt-Withotit tears the ancnifices the Spaaiarsla mere
Illsqlcing in .the present aeruggle, but be hoped splialiti
• lb•-itlt the spiriting the substantial manes of defooilierber•
f ..Stalf. He had'ilio authority of Arguello!** ay. that no
•Iniferation would be made in the • Constitutioli, . War or
re was not die question now, Ile was &vitae ; Minis-.
• /3 were for peace. They had Wee, and•wire shlej sure
ethey would have peace? Did they not literally perceive' the
• • falters of war'? Did they not hear of the canter. of t Spa-
-risli teasel by the French in the western •seaa by the Order
•of fie French Ministers? Was • that like aft asneanee of
-pertfc when that ship was indent? in this 'Omni to i tiny
slake Wmount ? He remernbefeChaiing 010 the Noble
1
• Ear. (Liverpool) whether there •was any treat wilt Basle
nr
or the other Pt rt-bindirrg•fisiVeonittry toil France, and
it: cpse °fin& treaty; bd isked,if Portagef ere to be at-
tract:kW. whit scone he the Mindett 'Oreille*, 'Earl woad
uporne? The. Noble Earl inkweievi, that the illied Powdis
bad not the same motive with respect -to Porttipel. Siff, be
- • •wculd ask, if the establishment of the SPIV& eenstitution.
• a! Lisbon did,not afford a motive 'entrees eftlist which led
France to dlte Invasion of Spain.? Bur ft was 0 objection
to the Spanish Rendition that it was effected by (byte. He.
would ask if the amiable John would have granted Niagsa
Ct.arta without force.—(lfter, heir.) 'Mere. wps a great.
disdke smog the Aided Powers to the iberty of the press,
and to the freemiroof debate io that and in the other House ;
of Parliament. Yet the liberty of the press Mid 'of debate
was the only check which this country had over them. With
respect to the necessity-el preserving s bgilalie df power in •
Europe..he fully contented • with the oplifons-vrhich were
once delivered in that House by a ?debit-tot* (Urenville);
rot thee in tite.Honee,ihttugh hefted sot the good fortune td
agree in many :aspects with that Noble Lord. The posses,,,
IllaWarlfaii by. IFrance wouidlead to the uniettltng.of Bathe-,
isnee. Our.ant•estors were correct in their enfants, when they,
oehlidered the lodepeuuleneeof Use Netherlands the best seen-
:ray of the safety of Europe, from the then inordinate power
._of Spain. Did the Noble Duke think the independeoce of
Slain leap incesaary now, than Shay of 'the Low COuntries
tit a formative:4o ? Bet if the Freunh• took military pin-
session of the Beeinsale, would not shebe wore formidable
an she *as odabyfornier occasion? Had the decendabey
'of 'Fraiseel over the •totincils of Spills no effect on the
'Mite- of Europe since the peace of Utre'elit. It was to that
inky astetitleney thatistinse wise persons, had ascribed to the
• seemantlation of air bath:mil dent. The seven years' war
widths Aniefican war wend*. eopeequences of that ascen-
dency. Stem the days otellizabeth, the greatest dancers
to this *minify arose from the,combined attack of. the French
,and Speriphfimits in -the Americair war. This Noble LAO
,Mitt illatliiego mi.no danger now to be apprehended frost,
Filmic. • IDrtd thle:eigoble fiord. mean that if the. Preneli
teached tadiz and got the itittrt)f Spain into their handl,.
)bitOronid then alien/lon theeb try, and let the Spaniards
• alone to settle Abele eitnatinticit '• This` ountry could not
rid so *heft we, with !hi mnis, look po-nit:mot France..
°Austria did' net do 'ao.. in the bins of Naples and Pied-
'. moat. which Misreweas still under military occopation. Ile.
Invest, boweser,..that-Spaio would be successful. Ile
.thought pot. by the opiniuct of alinisters, we had lost
.a globes. oppertunity ,of assistin g the weak against the
illd'abg lii a %pupa, the justice of which was cot disputed.
innl.GllAKVllslskl•said lie did not think it upon..
Aatry to eater fully. into•the history of. the lets tegoeia-
ipifitna. lie was of opistiog that the papers as thett•inis-
l.oril-
3111tPs4 tahialree:oot Oil conduct of Ilia Majesty's . M
.hose.. In the eisitetinth...eiottuy all Erttrqpe waa disialed
..tween tottenligioos, in the present age Alm %as . di-
rel4eolnto the aopporters of Monarchy andAlirmocraey.
, .Tiae. So* Csard, after /04120 more observe...o9ns,, which
wore inaudihbf,belper the bar, concluded by. naovistg an
ittetendruests 19.014,1k05i.0f expressiog thetr loOgitaltios
josseurrpm*in IM tonne penned 4,1,4. Ni..l.,,kyf gi.-
. Jima I and isyltiaoss their satiefnekpe, that by,
litir•evettlan,. wort etied from 1 • gostamtry ;.1•44
li
••sigtoioor tiwir rac•644.ittoiailits fir atone
.tet revolt • war between lapse stud Sp a, awl givipc
An nauratice to his Vainly, that he paight olwoyasoopt
op theif conk:Queue..4la titr erant of beiwg,itionspellcd Id
.. no ke 41,aelise part in,that war. .
~•• ~
• • -
• Tier Maloof HUCK INtillAM. was auxitens..to have
,•Ortiat Viii cineatioe sacred frobrpopular chewier i but nn-
lidilliniiky no questiowlt id ken-toot* ya.diied by it than
kid tioli67, 14 must be eritlif tit'ffgret, to Wit Noble and' 1
I IlisseliOna: Frlen &neer Metrithat:tliate for Wises had. 1
foughe should • had' so kit Vigetio; tkessibtres Me to
pbinge Ettiope'aggifi.ibto disk r *Out begibite they lead.
•leLitglit of their kilo* It w.ts'isiat Ifni is tie -lose teght of
lanai. He for one tliditght italiiitikirdethit'itialttleoitht
To reniain IA pehee. It was bat duly, affetirgtnigic nth'
nation of the•dxswer of th'e..4otiti.Bl4.oA ,i4o..irtqc rou
arc Will. and Iritl.itroreil: Wri. *III take" anfine at . neu-
rrality:, •It wee .alise • our ditty •not to reflneast other
gopanes. the 'sights shot we ciainsed eursolves.• We
Pa do. right to interfere with Itktaip, because iiir revolu-
tion could not injoce us"; . but We had no right' to say that
France should not inteeere,•iflior security was likely to
lie effected by the rewihr ion its Spain.* Franeersvid;.that.
effortt were made by the Spaniards to deladeher people
and seduce her artur.aed wet it
s fight to Plot's llea
o e did not believe tier, n at would r e re-
csistance of these,etteuipts: • .We had is right to offer un-
di atioc. but not tO go forpier. Aut, said the Noble Lsid,
what will beccinte;of the balance of power, and quoted a •
noble relation ot his jinn he woundsay, .the belatierf of
powei,esmied by the Noble Lerd, was' a name—(llear.) •
Miley !Oohed to the time of hattis XIV, they would . see'
it wee not the influence of 'France over Spain ihtl
PJrtupf tieefety !dust *as dreaded, but ever Spain
...

~. ..-.

F-

rFetflir slio*frrel
. ,
Ave, itgil.tbi ice of 'pniWii 110 Ine. • •
C 6144 Tie agree • 4'i-there sviis any c se was,
eien if there were, Ire tbought the country yea not io a
state •te enter into war. Our commerce, inuwernotaves;
and agricolltire were all depressed: poi (Too Lord
said, that the former wig for the balance of power bird
preserved the Netherlands—maw it Might be tireless al
Hanover to Prussia. . Neutrellty be considered our duty,
-hat if we should be forced into a war, whatever obloquy
'be might incur by the declaration, he would pray that
we nn ht *not be celled into the field in support of the
princiiles now acted on in Spain..,—Tear, brig, front the
Oppotition.)—He was prepared for o. bulbs could
feint the horrors of the Fiencli revolution; and he
we,. persuaded that not one of the Noble bards Apposite,
when in hie closet, could lay his hand en his heart sod say,
that the revolutionary spirit did not still exist, sod eaten-
dearouring to overturn all regular Gesernmeals. But he
would now call on those who governed this .country to
recollect, that they called oa the country for thirty years to
repel those principles, and the country aoswermi the call ;
and if the same detestable principles were stilt in action, he
hoped they would not now give them their support. ,•
The Duke of SUSSEX said he did not agree with the
Noble Doke in the opinion he had formed of the balance of
power, on which subject he thought,the Noble Duke formerly
entertained a different opinion. On the subject before the
house he also entertained opiujons directly contrary to the
Noble Duke's, but should not interrupt the debate by any

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r_ _. _._ _ .... ~~

Vogl
ikee

imetthened statement.
Lord KING thought that, in the recent negoeiatiult,
our Ministers had stint their eyes, as if they were del*lsi
mined not to see what was known to all the rest w the
world. He bad read the papers with shame. ''alike
was not one sentiment in them that was consistent,
with proper and manly feeling—with those senti-
ment" that ought to be poseessed by, Minister'
_sensible of what was slue to the intetesti and deo
ratter of this .conntry. They • took credit to them:
selves •for having ailed with prudence. The* Piesi
dent of the Council said that peace was better than woe 0
but in the.course that hail been pursued by Ministers,. it
was not prudence that guided them ; it was cold'-hearted
apathy. Their Lordships must go to the time of dal
Stuart. to find a parallel for such conduct, and to the pe.
riod of Louis the Font teenth's reign, when the deterimn-
ation was avowed to aunt: Spain to France. 'At that
period a like base principle might have been proclaimed,
in somewhat similar language; they might fancy the
Ministers of that day declaring to France—Do whit you
will against Spain, we will not go to *sr. They might
also imagine die Noble Duke declaring like lappitip at
Verona; and endeavouring to allay the ferment. Mr.
Fox, in observing on the remarkable circumstance of.
Lord Churchill being sent to Paris by the bite Court.
could not but remark how great that individual appeared:
at one time, and how little at another. Some persons•
were fond of tracing resemblances between the Duke of
Wellington and Lord Churchill ; he regretted that there
was so much resemblance in the principles of the missions
on which they had been engaged. Viewing the r' salts
of our several tlegOCia: i 011.4. he thought this country had
lost its influence by its fellowships and its allianCes with
other Powers to put down what were called popular
;rights. •We now appeared enable to assert the best
;rights and interests of the country. According to the
Noble Duke on the cross bench, we had done enough in
-initiating one despot; hut be seemed to forget that we
were now opposed to three despots, intent of one ; but
'that fact was nothing with the Noble Duke. Theta
' was, however; netting perfect to fittroan art ; and that
Might afford consolation in now discovering that the
grand pacification of Paris Was Mat :a work of Perfection.
Time earl ofAIIFEDEEN subieitted that if the Pa-
pers, and the atats of the negociations, were attentively
viewed, it would be found that the Fr.'nch Government
, approached chi war with great reluctance. But nett if
the Noble Duke had been as persuaded of the duplicity
of France as Noble Lords opposite now were, he was
rill 'Prepared to contend that the NOhle Duke was juetja
'Red In holding thirltngoaiete maintained is the tier,
riation. Tilting Lord Londooderry's •Paper pf 18`2I as
hid guille,4rilhout involving himself in epdless inter-
changes of Notes, the Noble.Dok 4 wisely directed all his
attention and arguments, to show France the danger.
that might follow the invasion of Spain. But the Noble
-Lords said that our negoriators ought to have asserted
•- higher tone. Had such course been adopted, besides
imitating our difficulties, be questioned whether it would
atif hie-largely contributed to make the war against
-Volta popular in France. Had England need menacing
,laiirpage, what would have bu-n its situation at the pre-
sent ineient. especially if hostile measure' had been
threatened withopt being adopted ? As to the conduce
which the Ministers had to.pursne,- it would be recollect-
ed that they had to deliberate before they involved this
country in hostilities. Were they, without the utmost
deliberition, to involve the coantry in fresh taxes and.
'new difficulties, by engaging in a war of whiff' ' they
cOpiti uot possibly have calaplated _where or when it
would end'? Had the Illiniaters so acted, he feared diet_
would have beep censured for their rashness; or had the'
Noble Duke adopted the tone which some advised, he
questioced whether the Noble Duke wonlil not have been
accused 4 views ing with complacency that state of things
which might afford.fresh opportunity for his personal'
exertions. It hail been so said of the Duke of •Marlbo;
niogis I 'it Might then have been so reinarked of the No•
bleOulte.—(flese, hear.)'-Ile had, on the contrary, Is.
be4ied to preserve pest" ; and lie could not bat thiok
Hutt liiiittlie Noble poke unwisely pressed the sentiments
of the ILOglish tiorernment in a menacing tone, the dif-
ficulties of the cowl would have been greatly increas-
el.--(lieer, bear.) e thought our conduct throughont
had hem clear, to maintain steictimatedity; and Eng;
land was constamentirpoWle a situation to be appealed
to by either party. He shoulii;. without hestrattan give
his vote against the mount!'; ,lie should have Sept hose
to ensure any Ministers, whole yriaclitle tl4 peen tho
giftpenance Of th easeace of this country.—t rene,lo
ral.J MINLII
.lf denied that his Noble tfrdir limit
Ipientbe adeocaigi 'foe War t :god he maintabenia4babeet
Mom decisive policy, nu the part of England, wooldl
dem been more likely to secure the contiouioce of peat*:
He doubted not that the Noble Duke had strictly adhered
to his ,teetrnetions ; but las the negotiations, Englaini
had lost sight of her high station—to be at the. head of
libeeifpfmeiples, and net aiding those of despotism and
•siaveryl- " -
%lie:Duke of WELLINUTON obiereed,that Le felt it
'doe to likmself and their Lord4bili to ;rouble the ifouse
~
ritlitiOvins observations, lie stood before , their Lord-
. . .
;hips net ugly as a Negociator at Verona, but se.a Mem-
ber of the Cabinet that' had issnod the instructions able,'
were acted upon at the Congress. He would rail on
these Lords opposite; who censured. the course that had
been famed, whether they would hare advised a course
of piece or war C They bad argued far war; but their
conclusiorts {Mt been peace.—(ll.ar.) He went to Vero-
na wi; h instructions to maintain neutrality. He forward-
el to Ministers, from time to time, report' of the pro.
ceedings there ; all the important parts of such docu-
ments had been •commanicated to tarir hardships; and
on those papers he confidently rested his defence. Is
would he recollected, that it wei to the -Sovereigns and
Ministers of other States that he had to address each
arguments as lie deemed best c slculated to maintain the
_honour at England and the peace of Ent- me ; sad that
he had to act conformably to the principles laid down in
Lord Londonderry's paper of Itql ; the principles of
which paper were not admitted by the• Ministers and Au-
thorities art' Foreign Powers. He was sent to Verona to
,wefuse to become party in any way In any ieterferense
with Spilt. On that principle he s ood. lie iti,l an
. . . ..

.. • .. •
induce She French jlgrircorti.2-%-
ig. the threatened step aleialit Main. n
lensive propositions aploptted, i w s said
add been the dupe of the'7rencia
that offensive proceedings wereconteinplated. Not only
be. bat the Government at item saw dieverribiiirrof
airm6inie °Mations vo the part of. France. Was he to
be toll' that he ought at sue t time to have adopted lan-
;wage, which the Soverelgos and Mtntstersairaildtave
Illtetexd insuisiog and menaciug? Mrasit to be Pad. that
Jot ought than to have urged . ,pointa Of
paper of 1821, &c., instead of pressing these observations.
ftstdl arguments which he knew would, At least. experi-
' neve attention ? He was thinkftil to those Noble Lord/
-who had expressed an anxiety that •he should come out
the inquiry clear; yet he meet regret, that with all
anxiety, they shoulttlisee:perverted -his language,
*Melt Ire maintained they had to tot instances. He
eras told 'us hail disobeyed his instructions. This was
netthe fact, and it was not sspportcd by the papers.
•When he learnt that there existed the determination on
',be part of FrassOe to interfere, by menace or force, with
he promptly declared, that England woeld be nu
party to such proceedings ; and on reference to the pa-
pers; it would be loud, that he had expressed each de-
claratiop on the part of England, in as strong language
as could well have been need.' As to the maintenance
of the Army of Observation, he thought Frew was jtis-
Mid in having maintained it: when civil war and re-
hellion were raging in a neighbouring kingdom, W 44
not France right In placing herself in attitude of defence
and erotection? No person, he thought would dispute
the right and propriety.of such acoceeding ? When of-
fensive operations were threatened, he repeated, he omit-
ted no opportunity to make all the representations that lie
deemed it hie-duty to make against such proceedings.
He was prepared th abide by the letter which he person-
ally sent to-Spain, and which was mainly founded on
his former connection with that county; the principles
a the letter were, be thpacht, clear, and he
some reason to believe that his tannage might steel-
Beate the preservation of peace. It .called on the Spa-
'sheds, as they regarded theli own interest+, to Inekt
some coneessions for the-take of preserving peace. Ile
apuloe-,ized for hiving troubled the House; but lie could.
notallow the opportunity of umic;itg these observations
escape, without thus far trespassing on their Lordships'.
attention.
Earl GILEY rose, and Arid he would offer some ohms'.
vatiens upon the policy of this citatory, as :it had been
described by the Noble Lords who had spoken on the
other side. lie dies:Wawa for himself or Ms Noble
Friends any desire to impute blame to the Noble Doke'
who•liad eandacted the riegocietitirs.whiuh PM now be-
fore the [louse. It was 1,10 vain eeitoplisuent to say that
be had justly acquired artery by lA* brilliant tektite at ta
former period of his life, It was to be lowleoted that
these est.:tin:keens should have been teroished ip the re-
cent. trantaikkiiii. He, had heard with surprise, that
ceibe Winitifdlirik,it, was the determination of bill Ma-
jeety'sllitstateis Ye, Remain tranquil. What a strange
doctrine web' thia.?" Oh, unhappy country, that now
couid sett quietly when the conflict was going *tensed
which might tender an influence and ascendancy dap:
yrroos to its liberty 1 It was asserted, although SOP
should behmiklertel to France, Gceat Britain would have
ao cancer/I.ln rescuing her frets that thraldom. Th.,:
Nusile Earl said, were it not at so late an hour, he affsold
go through the details of the negociatione, Through-.
out the coarse of those negociatiuns relating to -Frame.
and Spain, hie Majesty's Ministers had shown favour to
France.--.(ilear.) With :revert to the Army of Obser-
vation, that was a measure which doubtless tended. to Ir-
ritate and provoke the Spaniards. The inanrreetipes
wave excited by that armed Corm protected sod:en-
couraged the system. Such ameasure must be rept*
bated as ao iniquitous proceeding. So late as July -lot
the most solemn assurance was made by the King of
France, that this Army of Observation, this " cordon
sanitaire' " was only iuteuded to prevent the epidemic
• ordeefronv paring into the French dominions. At
that very time an agent was living in Paris, carrying on
;communications with the disaffected in Spain. Did not
the English Ambassador know this ? If lie did, why did
he not communicate it to his Majesty's Government?—
In answer to a question put by him (Earl Grey) to
the Noble Earl opposite (Lord Liverpool), a night or
two back, the Noble Earl admitted that information
had been received that French intrigues and French
money had been used in Spain; and although no
direct proof was produced, yet there was every
reason to believe that such were the facts.—(ifear.)—.
Was it possible to hear these things, and War feel the
heart moved by them ? Could those measures he. Jesti-
ded ? The despatch from the Spanish Ministry was
written in the noblest simplicity, and ought to have pro-
duced a different effect upon the Allies. The Noble
Earl alma alluded to the state of Ireland, which he
represented as bring in a state almost of actual rebel-
lion; and he pat an hypothetical case as to the French
Government interfering with it, as between this coun-
try and Ireland. He then reverted to the Army of Ob-
servation, and maintained that Spain had an unloubted
right to demand that army should be withdrawn. Ile
begged to know why Ministers had favoured the injus-
tice of France, as it regarded that measure, sad
.shrank
from defending the common justice which Spain bad a
right to demand? lie frlt shame and hamitiation, tis
an Englishman, at such conduct. The French Gevern-
meat hod not given the least assurance that peace would
be restored, should any concessions on the part of Spain
be granted. There was not a word to that egoist in all
the documents which Monsieei Chateaubriand tiA'd
,dl.l-
tated. Military- preparations were still going
,lbritard_.l
Could the British Minister see this without 'eutit?;
What were the principles issued by Prance?' They,
were, that Spain must yield to whatever that (lowa-,
ment should dictate. Tbe best friends of Spaie had as-
serted that some change was "necessary; bat the model
adopted-by France was not likely to lead to a henefiCial.
result. 'Nb legitimate measure was proposed, and pope
practised. .Chateaubriand had been called n "tanner
bad-books, and worse speeches, he (lord.
should say he was also a • sulker •of bad state
papers. 'llls reasoning about thrreoncessions which Spain
ought irp mate to France was As' *reek. as his cause was
bad. Item ridiculous tO telt Or %a qusntuni of concessloo
which might be made, for any concession, under these cir-
emanates, *meld be a surrender of principle. Ile could
not staid up and say, that peace was not consistent with
the hatemar of this country. He bad ever voted for peace
In the course of his political life„.except when war was Ine-
vitable. But to warrant the necessity of war, be should be
eeorleeed that the catering upon it was eonsistent with tbe
interests of this country. Without going into discussion of
the merits or demerits of the Spanish Constitution, it was
clear that the English Government could not sanction the
claim of right which Francs assumed of interfering iu the
internal economy of *nether State. No man venerated the
Whisk Constitution more than he (Lord G.) did, but he was
not blind to its defects. Amongst theie he believed the
present Constitutioa of the House of Commons to he the
lea Aug one. He would wish to see that Constitution re-
formed,but.if a foreigner were to suggest that it was danger-
ous to the peace of Eurepe, and that it ought to be alter-
ed, he would he then so wedded, even to its defects, that ra-
ther than cons. nt to the least modification he would shed
the last drop of his blood.—(Hear.) Thu present invasion
of Spain was founded upon principles as exception-
able us that of Buouaparte, which provoked this cowl-
try to aide agaiu.a France. It was admitted that
the principle of interference was unjust, but it was said
that it did not touch us ao nearly as to call upon us to inter-
pose. This reasoning could not apply, when the daoger
ass at our doors. The Noble Earl's backweriluess to
proceed must arise from either of two causes---tunt he
was so opposed to liberty, that be preferred seeing
Fr.nca triempheut than that liberty should prrisrer--

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Oe; tr noteikesandireg„hin Welts ,of • 1144:-
ya d er of this eolutily^bb.lad,• been [hie
administration disabled frond taking that course ich
the national honoer demanded, and our ancestors would
have follooe L—(Hear.) •I3ut, though war might be •
the consequence of assuming a firmer tame, it did not fol-
low that it would be an immediate conwiewnee. If this •
country, in her mediation, had assumed a inertly attitude,
onmeniglasleam bees *sweated. No onenseeld-earthet
• decisive tone wool I not avail, when it bad trot been
tried. It was not given to us to look into the womb of
- twi see what fruits certain seeds would produce,
when the serdi had not been sown. The advantages of a
peece o%taincd for Spain by our manly interference would
have been inestimable-so this country. A harrier to tho
illabitien of Franee•-•A closer alliaoceoritleSpniM—all
effects whirls we suppose her gratitude would mirk' far
eseepeact with her colonies—together with more sub-
stantial commercial advantages, would hare bred some
of thetenents d-ri veil from so desirable a consummation.
If the altitnotire was war, we should came to the contest
with a 'vantages which we never can pliSseis again—
With a good raise, the approbation of Europe. the good-
reill of tSpeits and of the people of .Franue itself. liet
',whet bad arailed, after all the surrender whiela we of
emit of theaationel hatemar ? Had war.been reeeneso ?
It had nut.—(llater.) But it was sail that our interfer-
ieg Would make the war popular in France. • That 'Meta
bi 4he rase if we were the ageressors, ant the French
Hoeernrnent were acting defensively; but wh ,n we were
obliged to act in self-defence, oar interference cool
not make the war more palatable ta the .French people.
At all events, whatever goods spirited inteeferenoe might
hire done. it was.elear thatstame conduct bad douse no era-
ries, fur peace wasoot yet savored. It pas saad that even
if the French were successful, horse not inteneed so take mi-
litary occupation of Spain. lie OW not believe it. France
damndest of the Spauierals that they should stow: toils.
Was the shareef.pewer which be formerly oeseeseed. This
demand, if secitessfully enforced (attach time in late meats,
.forbid), must .make the King unpopular. file moues mimic
be effected, but it could not be prepteved witlioatthe :debt
foreign bayonets. Hue If the Attempt dial succeed, what ryas
the dagger to this country 'I Spain, It was true.did nut poo
sees a navy, hut the had a large extentor C 03.4, and every
means of restoring her shipping. Ail tt.ese advantages must
fallinte thaohends, not of the French alone, but Of vhe Holy
Alliance, by whom France was supported. And was there
limners danger to the.coantry t Let the llouseitonceivevha
hosts ofMe forced who are leequed tuaet•er for tne &Prue
tion of liberty—toe Cosseeko of the insolent despot of the
North, who goats familiarly of the " the Western Pro-
vinces of Furohe," eateaticiag to.stale Cie altered Ileum of
freedom in its last haunt in these i.leuds. Let theta tint, of
the fawnlike *hie!' Spain would give to t`tese leerte>s des-
petit! rulers, and they would feel too ex oedioncy of taking
some step In self-defence, whilst it unit be Cone to adios
tags. These *ere not idle fears—Whilst a ildifillianee
existed all rational liberty W provrihril, Hurtled was
ea exeeption to -Contineutal policy—her inetitetions seem a
bed example to the Maud sleeves of other &totem Tim laws
of barbecues Hooka were now aware to be diremlvad, than
eves that .power which Napoltlellattempted to constraet pram
the ruins of a prostrate world. lf, on the oilier hole,
France was puseccessfel, was this el/mitre ?Iroise:dig we
slat Veinier iu repelling au invasion by Spain.? (hear,
beer, bear). U. (Lord U.) Impel Coo, malt er any rir-
eurestene,ts we slipup[ [sot be induced to take part with
France after the couduct she has roomed towards Swim
Whoteeer the reach thou was, nor inseroS amid eraloag
ob:ige us 14 take a decided part ore aroy-Or the
other. Considering the importmace of this euwolry, it
was impossible thai we ,could reeieteip [seer. tang in
any event. The alterastive then of war or pore was sot
fairly pat. The question was not now whither wo shmid
not ovoid war, Intl unite what circausgsnemit was 01-
visealle to undertake that which was inevitablei Whether
it Pas better toga to war at once, than to ester upon a
peace, the length of which most precarktuk, and the
Mwmio result pf which mast he war. sl'esitever the re-
sult seigh,t 114 be klaird G.) could only fervently may
that this country. wh4h Lad been so Waif the Seposita,/
of the sacred tiouge of Libertyoisigitt ant he. lostoinoire
hoet of netionshieb at present have 1,10 all reeolleetion
pf blessings, no lad coins forward, io order $b relieve
himself from the imputation which WWIel attach to every
public man, whose silence mi,:ht be contrued into a
sanction of these aggreslous. lie hot been sick its toee
but a hasty view of so compreliensOe a stO-ject, but the
lateness of the hour now prevented Lim frAn Kivint• full
scope to his feelipos. Ile 'wished, therefore, only once
more to discluipt all pNiatipation in a pleasare which
was fraught lob Aat logo diagraceo and to say that the
vote which the should,, glee upon . this occasion, or;
given sith4asaysch sinceritylas any he ever gamin Lie life.
The EatieflatVEßPOOL said, that the speech of
the Noble Earl wbo bad just sat down had et least °X
merit, that of being intelligible. lie had spoken nut;
he bed not dioguised his sentiments; but free the lace
guage of the address which had
.been prooosed by the
Noble Baron it was impossible to-say whether it vesat
pence Or. Argr. /felled expected from the preeesiing diss
cuSsions whicb,Mok place to bear expressed in the art.
dress, you,sisoaid have done this at A'erone, or that at
Paris." Illetkesteed of eatbodying the case of the Noble
Lords opposite, it is fact was constrocted to catch a tea
rotes, by saying aotiiine at all, and blinking the entire
question.—(Hey:; hearq—The English Government had
a most dilhealtpoint Id determine, whether he should
adopt war or •heattality,. and having chosen netitiolil
they were bound tespehic their ppigonts and state their
detertnioatitun'telily and Candidly. . /deny men were led
inko error. 11159 ming the question by the motion;
" 111111..yeariplea is neutrality, but your policy should
boes•beepdbferest; but he was sure thew Lordships
•oroolalfeel 'Heat Uwe. consistent with the liononr and
aligsity of tit% coantry to abstain from osensce, unless ee
itedibtendAl is fotlevrit up with war. In that ca'c, oar
liognige ih6o4. hire been, ' If you invaie Spain, we
tell you as elituy as you, please, we will not consent to
it.' But the.intitianit neetrality was chosen, then it would
,have been dnaproper use strmng language." ills
Noble Friend had not been called upon to date or
declare opiniews. The sentiinentshati been avowed over
,and over again. There was no chance of coovineing the
Allies that thest Were-wrong and we were right, but We
had a chance (and comae was, more thirty than hie N'f•
ble Friend) ttlfonvinee them that their interests were ne•
posed to the invasion, and he therefore eddreas-d
the
most powerful principle—their interest. Tbe Noble gall
had omitted one material cousideeatiop with referee?* to
the state of Spainin the year 184/8, and that in whioa. sae
now stood. ' In ISOS, Spain was united, how she was a
divided confitry. There was a decided division is Cot
country, nova very eeequal one perhaps, between dime
who favoured and those who opposed tl.e Cons!itution.-
11is, he contended, formed a material consideritiou in
the great qnestimo of peace or war. The Noble Lord
says, " Youare 4 peace,, but are you likely to remain
so?• tiro (toted Liverpool) was ready to admit that
we ought to be at all times prepared for war, paricalai,v
in the event of disturbance in rountries so eoutiguous as
*Frans, or Stain ; hut before we embarked id so great an
'evil, he sconceieed it to be the duty of those who obi:
' nistered the retworces of the country to calculate abut
owietirelettearc.hantic:sw,
ansn
rdeseadhyattoscontillainihtetthhee
jupsrtoicbeabaletherespreillts.
ciple, that to avoid a greater evil, a lesser oug•it sometime
to be inclined ; het that principle Was not upplicable, he
contended, in the present instance. That Prance could aot
succeed in subduing Spain, te.less the whole populan in of
the country rose in her favour, he was firmly colatiaced.—
If she were assisted by the whole population of that commis
the question would of course be there . But looking tore
'Alum' situation of the two countries, he thought the soitt•
'cation of Spain, under any other circumstances. i opossioe
Spain was a country as large as France; it was iutsrieetio
by lofty mountains, watered by deep risers, and the viler'!"
tor of its people was of itself a stiffleier.t barrier asksosl
rasion, awl wonld Alford the most cleCtual resistance. I".

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