The Statesman.
London, England, 1812-04-29 00:00:00

'l'llE STATESMAN,

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of the Session at which they came forward, spun, all by Government, anti if so oteployed; he next
dantly sufficient for agitating the operation 41 that wotala ask what that employment was ?
point of view ; may on the same principle now c.tti. The Karl of LI VI:RPM/I, replied, that Mr.
seder a similar period for discussiou totally insure. Henry was never authorized by his Majesty's Go-
civet, when their opinions were changed as to the vernment in any capacity whatever ; that he had, it
grand question of cryntinuatien. Whatever the dif. appealed, Oren employed by Sir James Craig to oh-
ference of opiuiou may be upon almost all- other : n some information respecting the disposition of
points, they were all decided that a great and effec. me of the American States, With regard to their
tual change must take place in the w hole system ;. a " amity Of. hostility towards Great Britain ; but that
consideration which would bear no comparison with 1 until retorts to Quebec, not even his name he 4
the mere question of continuance. But there war been known to, any of his Majesty's Government,
another consideration which it was impossible any I Lord HOLLAND subjoined a few words whieh
Noble-T.4 rd. could oreklook—that which ‘s as pr.... 'we could not distinctly hear.
seated by a view of the diitresses of the country, by i figt.B COIN BILL,
the cries and lamentations of their fellow saleects, I Upon the Order of the Day for Worker Sal*
for opening' new markets, when the trade and corn. ! second reading of the Gold Coin Bill, • . •
merce of the country were in the lowest, and most I Lord BATHURST rose to state, that from what
distressed situation ever known--a situation to had passed in another House upon the subject, he
which the weak and wretched policy of Ministers did not expect that it would undergo much debate
had, reduced them. The subject and the luestion there. His Lordship entered into a wide and dr.
arising oat of it were now greatly and essentially dif- cumstantial enquiry into the question in all its bear.
ferent -; they had to look more especially to every I iags and relations,' recurring. to the various periods
possible means of reviving the -wonted commercial i of history in which the-course and rate of exchange
prosperity of the country, the very existence of was connected with the state of the current coin and
which was now at stake. thacobitnercial 'credit of the nation.
The Earl of LIVERPOOL said he must be al'-' ' Lord KING maintained, that the present Bill, is
lowed to observe, that there was no djapOltien what. reality, constituted Bank-paper a legal tender for
ever, nor any reason to suppetre 'there was, on the 1 the current coin of the realm. The Bill of last year
part of the King's servants to avoid any course of I protected payments in paper out of Court, and the
proceeding' iet Would give to Parliament and to the i Amendment of this year protected payments of pm..
eetioitry the fullest opportunities of deliberating -on , per in Court. This his Lordship regarded as a new,
the subject in 'question., Even if the course adverted 1 era in' finance, and a triumph of Bank-paper owe,'
to was adopted, it would still be at the option of any I ancient bonds and engagements. The same langnagO
Noble Lord to bring forward any of the great I had distinguished the introduction of the Bill in
ehes of the ' tbject ti lsidemth tder his Sessie' ' what had led it in the Session

brand of _ subject to conL ion under sepa-
rate discussion. With respect to what was said of
the occasion in 1793, if he were not mistaken, there
were also at that time the strongest representations
from all the manufacturing towns, soliciting that the
trade might then be thrown open to the country at
large. And au arrangement had been proposed, by
which it was expected that great benefits in the way
of trade would be gained by individuals through the
medium of the Company. Much difference of senti-
meat existed, whether this turned out to be the ex-
pected boon or not, but he did think, that whatever
the object of the arrangement was, that it had not
answered the purpose for which it was intended by
those who introduced it.--(Near!]—'There was an
essential change in the law, as appeared by what had
been adopted, partly from the state of the thing it-
self, and partly in consequence of the representa-
tious of those bodies. In another point of view,
that part of the question was misrepresented, namely,
in that period being one of unexampled prosperity.
He was far from being insensible to all the difficul-
ties and dangers of the present moment—but this
was the *first time he ever heard the year 1793
pointed out as one of great prosperity. On the con.
trary, it may be doubted, possibly with the exception
of the present, whether there was ever a period in
which the universal commercial distresses of the
country were greater than at that very period. The
measures which the Government of which the Noble
Baron (Lord Grenville) was a member, proposed for
the relief of those distresses, viz. by loans and ad-
vances of Exchequer Bills, were a proof thot he was
under a most material misapprehension ; and he must
say, that at the former period a material change in
the system in question then took place, and especi-
ally with respect to the general state of the trade.
The Earl of LAUDERDALE contended that 4
great and striking difference existed in the state of
the question at present, and at the period of 1793.--
They had not then, as now, a prospect of India be-
ing a burden upon the finances of the country. A
Noble Marquis, then in his eye, had most ably do-
monstrated the great benefits which would result
from a free trade to India; the military and political
parts of the question also constituted An essential
difference. Neither was there any comparison be-
tween the state of this country at the period alluded
to and the present time. They well recollected how
goon the country recovered from the temporary cala-
mities of that year—calamities which were consider-
ed by otninent Statesmen of that day, as in some
points of view, proceeded from the excessive prospe-
rity of the country at the time.
Earl GREY argued that the line and principle of
proceeding which obtained in the former instance
with respect to the discussion of this great national
question. It was no reason, because the Legislature
might have neglected its duty on that occasion, that
it should do so at ptesent ; he hoped that if the sub.
ject were to be brought forward, it would be at a-
period, when it would be possible to enter' into It
with some prospect of being able to do justice to the
extent and magnitude of its importance.
The Petition was then ordered to lie upon the
table.
AMERICAN PRESIDENTS ME;SACCF.TO Cowman.
Lord HOLLAND rose to call the attention of the
Noble Secretary (Lord Liverpool) to a rumour which
had generally prevailed respecting a State Intrigue,
charged against the Government of Great Britain in
the published speech of the President of the United
States of America to the Congress. The report, in.
deed, was such as he could by no means give credit
to; it stated the detection of a conspiracy, said to
have been framed anti acted upon by the"Gocern-
ment of Great Britain for the disunion of the Ame-
rican States. lie had no motion to make on the occa-
sion. He repeated, that the charge alluded to was
such a one as he could not bring himself to give any
credit to • but he felt it incumbent ou him to call

-unctionirould be put on it than hadbeen given it by , tallied. He found, however, that a new D -clam.
the coone Lord (Holland). I tioa had been issued by Ministers, the policy of
Lord 1101,1Apji) expressed his resolution to per- which he could not but condenni, as it was th.ittor
severe, since Lord Liverpool had declined' to answer more nor less than proclaiming to the Petitioners
his enquiry. -. , . who were now thronging the avenues of the House,
The other (*dors of the Day work:them disposed thatustes ltawatsheithresedpetopEncaitnioatniso,nboutf
toG opreerrseilltneere'sltinnotht::sr
s,
former measures. This declaration, which was
of, when the House adjourned at One o'clock. I
_
llolli P. OF COMMONi. i stated to have been issued in consequence of a nits.
Mr. DICKENSON presented a Petition from Me Woolley' !sage from the Frer.ch Minister to the Conservative
rem 011ie ‘ouney of timbered,. ablest the-Orbers id j senate, was still reprehensible on principles of a
more statesman-like nature. What was it but sue.
rim-,..l3.,vosTrder.d.:liNtolieottoneithae l'
Isolliagstst the
__y of tissexPtlPbiritaeiy.°inng"anillilefilOirmillbieorgtharree'Re. i rendering its own free will, pledging itself to a par.
tZgabilea of the range in Pahlanteot• °rdered to Be" Bib ' titular policy, and resolving to make its own fnturc
preliminary asoeuragosa, . measures, under any circumstances, dependant on
Ili. DICKINSON, after a few
Imo to WIWI(' 4 Bill to amend the thoAct_.,_o(Biel?th, those of the enemy ? He had felt it his duty to ea.
rentleaahliog Magistrates at Quarter
. °°°"••""Q' r•Paivi quire minutely into the extent and magnitude of those
The mpg roma, wooimer Forest, mil Parkhurst Forest distresses, under which the manufacturing classes of
Bah triunity wet* through a Committal 04 be reported 0- the community were now lahouring, and from every
-morrow,
committeewthe who'd/o%m quarter lie had received accounts, varying as to the
"Onazathe
foe
to.rnistreof blrw..RtOoSE,n
take
into consideration the Dirties ' particular degree in which they were felt in different
ea
places, but all agreeing as to its universal existence.
2.n . obtained leave to bring in a Bill, for the wore r
tog mommeg of ships employed in the soothe= Male Fishery. In some places, employment was not to be had, in
The Tobioco-pipe Clay gig war read &snood Woe. • others it was scanty, iii all the prices of necessary
Oa the motion of Mr. 11.08 E, accounts were ordered to be ..
low before eso Home,
of the real value of the exports the articles had increased in nearly the proportit,n of
Kingdom, from January, Iggs, so January, 1811 ; also, ac. one.third. In one part of the country, wile! a pota.
comae of dm number and tonnage of Milo that hat clelirt'd iy- toes formerly-
sold at the rate of 7s. per t 4011). too
wards and outwards daring the saine period, with the flambee of
price of the same quantity bad risen to 175. A slnilar
men aid boys by which they were saanortlosPecifY jog such shill*
quantity of oatmeal formerly bought for 445. now
lie were iretiliti,.
petition, signed, he observed, cost 675. Wages varied from 7s. to Ds. and I Is. par
Mr. L r ETON presented a
i.atia.otants of Kidderminster and
le the maim- week. In other parts they were rather higher, but
bitsyvir°ciarty.
factures of that pan of the country laboured, and prayed that they were obtained only by working over hours and
measures aright be adopted fur the attainment of an hounnratile
pegging,
setrestoTtitiatbbleedifficulties under wii ti
beyond the usual habits. A Magistrate of one dis-
nw Peeling,
ituldraYtiotredcot.baumtertire triot, whose letter he held ill his hand, stated, it was
and manufactures of the counts.), es they might degn cape. impossible in his ' ' :hbourhood, that -
*oPel'snchtheine=serfceor to
relieving India,

this , ~ton as .. , accompamil .ittne...._
la ;rife, and twoonerithghree children, ev-eanwteahov4rhs they
good health, coOd earn a subsistence, not so
preceding, namely, that unless a permanency was be. LOCAL TOKENS. ,
. Mr. PERCENT AL gave notice, tbat tomorrow he should above were in
stowed upon the Bank-paper we would not be able
fort the iotrothoden of a hill to regulate, with a view to re rra_
to manage a successful war in the Peninsula. By the the jam ruled Token,. p --e i much Prom ; *depression of wages, which were rather
enactment of such a measure we were exhausting! Sir J. NEWPORT gave notice, that this day foreign!, b° . higher than at the same time last year, but from the
ourselves, and unnerving the military against the :ah"ld briar under' the c°°"lderatil;° of lh° 11"'", lb° el_.+l'. great Wane in the price of provisions. [lkar! from
day when battle might more closely approach us.— ttlitreellOordt:he fords
destined to
improve
the Inaillit lislirmwime 4. the Minisleiial Benches.]—Flom Liverpool his •
IN
The same assurances had been held out on the is. i PETITIONS AGAINST THE ORDERS IN COUNCIL ! formation stated, and it came from a highly respects-
suing of the French assignats, and the same-reason, Lord STANLEY, on rising, expressed his regret ble person, that the number of vessels now in dock,
given for adopting the measure ; but we refused to , that it had not fallen to the lot of -some abler person ; was 61, that in the graiing docks there were 11, that
be warned by the disastrous consequences which at.f than himself to bring the important subject on which he ;66 carts were employed and 117 idle. Not one half
tended the mighty policy. We might, indeed, talk! was about to address them before their consideration.' of the carpenters were employed, about one-third of
of restraining within moderate bounds the . issues e It was not his intention, however, to go at any ; the sail-makers, and a very inferior; number q the
Bank-paper ; but while we conversed concerning the great length into the general question of the policy 1 block-makers. Such was the; state of the coca.
means, we issued a quantity of Exchequer Billsetio , of the Orders iq Council, a subject so lucidly and ; try with which he was peculiarly connected, but
as to augment the issue of Bank-notes, by having eloquently treated on a recent occasion by his Ho.; the Petitions on the table too fully proved that, the
those Bills disbursed at the Bank. On the whole, he nourable and Learned Friend. _ lieshould limit him- , distress extended to all the manufacturing districts.
.was prepared to declare, that, by all appearance, the self therefore to thet view of those Orders whiols..watl Under these circumstances, be felt himself justi-
Bill had originated in fraud and folly—folly ou the connected with the immediate motion Which he was , fied in asking the Houle to take the subject into
part of the Government in attempting to enrich the about to submit. fig the' year 1006/ the violent; its .full cousideration.—[titer, hear, hear !]—
Bank by a fraudulent measure. , measures and del:Weill' a the enemy induced the Bri-- He called upon them to do this as the only means of
The Earl of STANHOPE declared the swaddling tish Gnvernmettftoielie such steps as seemed beat : giving satisfaction to the• country. If they listened
clothes of the infant (the Bill) were very Onee but calculated, by. n ..fiinnter operation, to inflict *spin ;to his proposition for going into a toiemittee at the
they were not of his putting on. The nursery maids the French Oolerasiiiiir those commercial injuries whole HsTse, and the result should beau Address to
merited all the praise. [A laugh.] His habitation . with •which itybOlitiaeoe-oured to assail us, What. : the FFiege:ikagenlv erayinghim to revoke the Osiers
was serrounded by schemers, and numerous were '• ever might be ill4biiiy -of the Order then issued,' in Couocii,,iie should be happy in having borne his
the inventions which they had laid before him. One he must dellsthat' it:. vlienconstruCted upon any no- : pert in pro4diing so detitebie a Mai ; if, on the
had discovered the perpetual movement, another had . vei,er unprecedented principles. Similar principles' contrary,liti Present policy should be approved, it
dreamed of the longitude, and the third,, equally had been soiopted in 1739 andl7s6 ; they had been . would be his consolation that he at least had dis-
sagacious, had found out the philosopisemfa stone ; acted on during the American as well as the late charged his duty. He concluded by moving, " That
but no one of them all equalled in rarity of ha/mention ware, Never, however, had they been attended the Petitions agalast the Orders in Council should be
the state alcbymist (Lord King), who had determined with those consequences which unfortunately now so referred to a Co' mariner tvf the whole House."
to make geld appear, where. he said, no gold siis distinctly mark the traderuedemeseereser the assay Oa the_qpestion being put,
to be found. [A laugh.] When Bonaparte heard of try. Neier had thej been found to produce the Me. HOSE declared, that rte OM Was more au-
the glorious measure he illuminated Paris. [4 laugh,] practical result of destroying the manufactures, and lotto for a full and impartial discretion of tee real
The Noble Lord had maintained that the price of annihilating the trading prosperity of the Empire. ; merits of the Orders hi Council-that himself. He
corn was affected by the metallic currency, an opi- [Hear, hear, he*(j 'So far from-their having been `expressed his astonishment at the assertion which had
pion which recalled to his mind a notable remark on followed by any such effect, it was well known that' been made by the. Noble lord (Stanley), that the
the comet which appeared during the last year. Two until the present' period, those manufacture*, con- , Berlin and Milan Decrees were net of a novel na-
' gentlemen of intelligence amongst incomprehensible . tinned to flourish More and more, and that prospe- I lure, and that they were conformable to measures
things, standing one evening at Margate, one de." rity progressively to Increase. Had Bonaparte any , which bed been taken in former wars, without any
dared to the other that the tail of the comet which be' greater power than his predecessors in the-Govern. injury or interruption to the commerce of neutrals.
then saw streaming so brilliantly along the sky had meat of France to enforce his hostile-schemes against ,In answer to this statement, be quoted- the arbitrary
been shuffled to and fro. " Aye, and by an easterly ; our commerce ; were his fleets so targeln • his corn.: and exorbitant demands of the French Government—
wind too," replied his friend. So he would main. mend over the ocean, so entire as to enable him to 'by which it was required that Great Britain should
lain, that as the comet's tail had been waved about do what the former rulers of his territories, had never ' renounce these ordinary and indisputable rights of
by an easterly wind, so had the price of coral been in- , ; succeeded in accomplishing? But admitting ..bis ob. I maritime war, which had ever been recognised as the
fluenced by the metallic currency. , ject to be the complete exclusion *1 all commodities , laws of nations. These were demands which had on
Lord DARNLEY supported the Bill. 1
. of British growth or manufacture, from all the ports I no former occasion been made, and which, consist-
The Earl of LAUDERDALE opposed the Bill, of his dominion, what was this but acting on a policy tautly with our independence and our commercial in-
inasmuch as it tended to enrich six hundred indivi- which had been exercised by ' other continental terests, could not be conceded. The Right don.
duals concerned with the Rank, to the manifest in- powers, as well as by the British Government, at va- Gentleman then proceeded to detail the various oc-
jury of the nation. . rious periods? What was it in short but adopting a currences which led to the passing of the Orders in
The Eari of WESTMORLAND supported the principle of policy, and enforcing it with more than'Conncil, in the course of which he cited various in-
measure at considerable length. ordinary vigour, which every state had an inherent stances of the injustice of France, and contrasted
Lord GRENVILLE said, that the occurrences of right to adot, as a principle of mere municipal re-1 those acts with the disposition which had at all
levery hour displaYed the British,natinn persisting in gelation i [Hear!] It remained for others to skew ; times been evinced by Great Britain to conciliate
a course which had overobelnied other nations with how any such regulations could affect the trade be- ' the Neutral Powers. With respect to the repeal of
misery. We were called upon to concede a measure is een neutral states and the Belligerent, against ; the Orders in Council, a measure which had been
which would lay the nation prostrate at the feet of whose interests they were directed. They had not !so strongly contended for, he denied that any of
, the Bank Directors 3 without any restrictions put up- operated in the present instance to raise the rate of 1 the effects .which • seemed to be anticipated as
on them but what their own discretion dictated. The . insurance,and the remittances from Europe rose sub-! the result of such a course would take place.—
Noble Lord (Grenville), in conclusion;contended an serpent te 'their promulgation. What was the'case! Did any body know, if the Orders in Coen-
the:necessity of making the Raids independent of the after the system, the childish and impotent system, of . cif were repealed, that America would open her
Government, and the Government independent of , retaliation wasadopted on our part ? [Hear, hew n.---! ports to us ? No body living could say so. On
the Bank. I The remittances fell in a short time in the retie of ' the contrary, by their declaration, we had been
"—Lord LIVERPOOL replied to Lord GrenvWe at LURID .39,I_Oenericeotteost the only neutral niewitanght to understand, that they would not, unless
considerable length. The opposition of that Noble lion, was disgusted, her ports were sittit again ns, •we were fa a galenite:lmre to conform to the esor-
Lord applied rather to the measure of 1797 than to alt intercourse ceased, and not only the trade which bitant demands of France. Were we, then, to pur-
the Bill before the House. If he were of opinion, 'we carried on directly with her but that which we chase an intercourse with America, by giving_ up
that the Bank ought to resume its resit payments, ' maintained circuitously through her means, and , our maritime rights? [Hear, hear, hear!] And
still he should say, the . Bill before them was which it was beyond the power of the enemy to pass ', even if we were disposed to barter those rights, t
necessary for the justice and security of the Public. Whit before he was aided in his views by our own would be at best but for a precarious advantage.
As to what had been said about two prices—about a injurious and disastrous policy, were sacrificed loge. —The trade of France had already suffered most,e
gold price and a paper price—he maintained, that titer. But whether all the evils that were now so bitterly. We knew that she could not get
hat the
there were not, generally speaking. any such things ' deeply felt, ought -or ought not to be' traced to the raw materials of her umnufact.ures, and t i
in existence.'-[loud crier of hear, hear from , operation of the Orders in Council, it:was uudeni. trade was consequently cramped luau unprecedented.
Lords Greneiffe and Lauderdale.] i
! able that there was at present great and general dis. manner. This was attributable to the Orders
ll tee
Lord LAUDERDALE was surprised at what had , tress, and ai a Member of Parliament, and more par- Council ; whereas, if they were repealed, all the
th
fallen from Lord Liverpool, and to show' him that ! ticularly es the Representative of part of one of the ports In the world would be open to her, and she
there were two prices, he should, on Friday next, . counties affected in a peculiar manner by that siis-
moie for a COmmatee to enquire into the Bank con- : tress, he had deemed it his duty to can the attention selves In the foreign markets. Through the 'merlin
nections with the Government, &c. &c. !of the House to the Petitions now lying on the table. of America she would have an opportunity
of sending
would be able to enter into competition with our
move
After some further observations from Lord Liver-' _.._r were, keur n—lic did not presume to say, that her manufactures to the Brains and to Spanish Arne-
i.
the suggestions contained in those Petitions would
Ante-
pool and Lord lArderdale, the Bill was read a se-
cond time, and ordered to he committed. form the most effectual remedy that could be sp• our
tari from the Havaunah, thereby excluding
led
AMERICA. plied, or whether the remedy would be best found , West India merchants from the advantage they
0.
rice, and would be able to bring into Europe the
Lord HOLLAND again adverted to Mr. Henry's in retrenchment, its the abolition of sinecures, ate Wtherto maintained in the exclusive possession I
Correspondence with Sir James Craig, and enquired in the non-renewal of the Fest lonia Company's' that trade. The Right Hen. Gentleman then en-
whether the Noble Lem (Liverpool) intended to lay h Charter; as to the latter, by fur the most important . tered into n minute statement of the progressive ill-
it officially before the House. The correspondence point, whatever might be his opinions on that nub.), crease of nor commerce, which, he contended, oi
authorised Henry to produce certain papers to cer-
tain individuals, who might feel inclined to separate lief could not be attained till after the expiration of at present, than at any period preceding the los.
ject, Renee to be recollected that this anticipated to. r in a condition far more flourishing and'prospere.is
the Eastern Countr from the Western, under the two ',elms. lint the calamities of the country could :nits of the Orders in Council, while the trade
,(f.
authority of this Government; and it was of such, not wait two years.—[dinar, hear! —Thotte cola- the rest of Europe and of America had been creme, !
nature, that it involved the honour and character of mines were more severe and extensive than many ;in the most Obits manner. From Altich circ.urn
the country. If the Noble Secretary declined layhog Gentlemen in that Mose seemed to imagine. The I stance, as welt as from redoes other consitletatmoi:
before them the oorrespondeuce, he (Lord 11.)should
move for it ott Friday next. e ss steers
assimilating France and f Asked to two men drown. of any measure which would go to alter the
.. "P""siona end tty a Right Hon.Gentlernan opposite, he strongly urged the inexpediency of the atteptio
Lord LIVERPOOL felt ee'isfied, that When the !Ing In buckets of water, ked•not tended to alleviate now pursned. He then alluded to the charge which
matter shall come to be known, avery different con- hthent, or to %islet the apprehensions that were enter• had been brought-against him, of having treated the

upon the'Noble Secretary opposite for distinct and
explicit information.
The Earl of LIVERPOOL felt no hesitation to
assure the Noble Baron, in behalf of himself and of
those Noble and llotiourajtelifisons with whom he
acted, that they utterly ed not only hnving
given any authority, but t* possessing the least
knowledge of any pre iedt or intention to disunite,
separate, er alienate, salty of the Amerkatt States.
With regard to thilndivittnal who had been named
as the agent of I a. design, he could only say,
that whatever Che Lave done, he had no autho-
rity, warrant, Instrucilon fur his purpose from his
Majesty's C iffloutt.
Lord II .1) vetka glad to hear the disavowal
made bite Secretary, yet he could not help
express a ••eto he more minutely and sa-
tisfactorily infornsed, and I.•e wished to know,
whether the Minn mentioned (it was useless to con-
ceal his name), a Captain Henry, was employed at,