The Statesman.
London, England, 1812-03-10 00:00:00

cern, as money might be raised upon the boxes for
that term, to enable the theatre to be built, which
could not be done if they could only be let from year
to year. ,
The question was put, that the word " twenty"
stand part of the Bill, which was agreed to.
The Duke of NORFOLK then moved the in ,
tion of words at the end of the Bill, to the
that nothing contained in the Bill should tend t,
any more legality to the Patents than they be a
had.
A long conversation took place on this motion.
Earl of IgAUDERDALE agreeing that the
monopoly ought not to be sanctioned, moved to post.
pone tine 'farther Consideration C.irflie Bill till, to-
morrow, in ordectoateertain with Certainty that it
contained nothing to gin any more legality to the
Patents that thoyilreidy 'possessed.
Lord ERSIPNE was of opinion that the Bill c,on.
lath& nothing that Could tend to give any legal sane.
'fiefs torn. Patents.
Earl GREY thought the consideration of the Bill
ought to be postpotiod; if there was'aily doubt upon
the subject. • -
Lord REDESD.ll..F.inclined to the opinion, that
thd'Bill did not tend to give any legal sanction to the
Patents. t:
The, Logi) CHANCFALOR was alio of the
Satin opimiii.
After'some further eonversa4on, the motion for '
.postponitg,the consideration of the Bill till to-mor-
-40W, was negatived, eaves aho the Duke of Norfolk•;
Isoaon, and the Bill was read a third time and passed,
sent back to the Commons for their coecurrence
• dietbe Amendments.
. .
Adjournediill to-morrow (this day).
• - '

every Gentleman knew well that
calamity as rebellion in Ireland, o.
indeed, was in a state of perfect
in as far as had been produced '
fortunately resorted to by the 1.
Gentleman opposite, and In commit.
L
pp.avth. e•e en the bt
4etriircam, Icao;esill
toe 14
.- • • liairbeflerelss
4 . AMU.. taaboadel, —44 alv 000.
l'orinly grania -striae e Union? .4 if * stuii...—_
sum were not grantecrOiiitis head, the only mode of
makin up the deficiency would be, to have recourse
'to the'Vege Of ettdit, In WhiCh case the greitWould
not coeso*;diptinetty undei the cognizance eiC•the
'House. 14.) I
Sir 'JOHN NEWPORT objected to the gftit,kon
two pounds: ist. Because the Vote of Credit was
41(pi117 amenable to this 'service as to 'any other ;
'and secondly, because it went to proclaim the ap-
prehension that Ireland Would be in a state of rebel-
IfOnt a circumstance which that Rouse, or the Right
Hon. Gentleman, had no right to anticipate.
After some farther conversation between Mr. Hut-
chinson, Mr. W. Fitzgerald, and air John Newport,
the Resolution was agreed to.
There were farther granted— - -

For pratique in the poet- of Dublin - £1,017
For Treasury Incidents 4,000
For Lottery Offices in Ireland 2,1376
For Fire Fruits 10,000
For Nos-conforming Ministers • 4. 9,464
Fur Seceder Minister - 9,931
For the Linea blannfactare 91,600
On the Motion for granting 80001. for completing
the Survey, &c. of Begs in Ireland,
Mr. W. POLE stated, that he bad reason to under-
stand that this would be the !Mt .sun the Hones
would be called on to grant wider this herd.
Sir J. NEWPORT hoped this would afford to the
House a lesson not to be led on, step by step, to
grant sums of magnitude to objects of comparatively
no public benefit. As well might they have ordered
a survey, at the public expence, to hate been made
of Yorkshire; the persons who were benefited by
the survey of the bogs in Ireland, being, in general,
the richest men in the kingdom.—The motiou was
agreed to.
There were then granted.,
For the Works of Howth Harbour - £52,000
For the Dublin Society for Eacuuragemat
of Arts, &c. 10,000
For the Farming Society 5,000
For the Cork Institution - 9,500
For the Protestant Charter Schools - 41,539
Mr. HUME asked, if it was intended to engraft
on the purposes fer which the sum of 41,0001. was
granted, the new plan of extending the advantages of
education to the poor. It was surely material to en-
deavour to make a saving amounting to the difference
between ¶2O and 8, and even 4s. in some cases, to the
annual expence of educating children. It appeared
that the sum was now expended on the education gf
between 4 and 3000, while the calculation on the
other plan showed, that, for the same sum, 180,000
children might be educated.
Mr. W. POLE, after adverting to the Reports et
the Commissioners on Irish Education, observed, that
the Schools to be provided for were Protestant Char-
, ter Schools, and included all the expeace of Clothing
and Maintenance.

HOUSE OF COMMONS. _
INFANT SUITORS IN EQUITY.
Sir A. PIGGOTT gave notice that he would to-morrow move
for leave to bring in a Bill for the Relief of Infant Suitors in
kulty, holdinfi sooty in the funds or other public stock.
ELAYS TN F.QUITY SUITS.
Mr. M. A. TAYLOR tooted for lessee for the Committee on
Chrcd.aacery Suits to sit during adjournments of that Hone--
deOr-
The Woods and Forests, sad the Marine Mutiny Bills were
committed for tat:sorrow;
Mr. atcucha gavvietice, in the absence of Mr. Yorke,
that he would, i Friday next, in the Committee of Supply;
Move for a Groot towards the carrying on of the Breakwater
Works at Plymouth Sound.
Thalodemnity Bill paced through the Committee, and the
Report was ordered to to be received to-morrow.
The Sounder's Lands Bill-was read a second time, and ordered
to be cdsopitted to-nson.W.
Mr. KENRICR presented a Petition from the Clerks, &e. in
the Account.int's °dice, atainst a sill then pendiu: is that
Mouse, which was referred to the Committee on said Bill.
Mr. WILSON postponed his notice for kiwi fora Bill to ex-
plain thelMarriage Act till Wednesday.
The Legal Quays' Bill was read a second time and committed
tor to-morrow.
The Lottery_ Mondays! Bill was read a third time and passed.
Mr. DRUMMOND moved the second reading of the Bankers
Embezzlement Bill.
Mr. MORRIS opposed the Bill on.two grounds, principally,
that it was an uenecettory extension of the penal code,
and next that it would have the practical effect of enabling frau-
ilitleat ponces to screen themselves by not answering in a Court
Lquity.
Mr. WILisON, and Mr. JOHN SMITH, also opposed the
principle of the Dili.
Mr. fMtATISI MOND thought, that upon is subject of Inch in-
tris.acy. it at least s.`inuld be allowed him to go into the Commit-
tee. The Bill woos then ordered to be read a second tiatc,*aud to
sisnd committed for Friday sennight.
FRAME WORE RILL.
A Message from the Lords acquainted the Douse,
that the Lords had agreed to the 'Frame Work Bill,
with an Amendment, to which they required the
concurrence of that House.
The SPEAKER thought it necessary to call the
attention of the House to the nature of the Amend-
ment. That House had made the penalty in this par.
tiettlar part of the Bill, to he fine and imprisonment
—to which the Lords had added, " or either," which
itt substance did amount to this, that that House had
prescribed the penalty in such cases to be by fine, and
the Lords had voted that it should not—an amend-
ment upon fines or forfeitures had never been per-
mitted by that House, such being their rightful arid
peculiar province. The amendment was then nega-
tived nem. con. and a message ordered to be sent to
the Lords to pray a conference touching the same.
Mr. W. WYNNE took that opportunity of sta-
ting, that he had understood, from undoubted au-
thority, that the progress of the Bill had had already
the eltect of closing up mach of the channel of in-
formation hitherto received by the Nottingham Ma.
gistrates.
- - -

, .

Mr. RYDER said, that he was certain that Go.
♦ernment had received no proof that the channel of
information had been at all open since the beginning
of the riots.

Mr. W. WYNNE al.inded to private information,
and not that which could be adduced in a Court of
Justice.

Mr. JOHN SMITH confirmed the statement of
Mr. Wynne.
Sir J. NEWPORT imputed the stoppage of in-
formation to the making the offence a capital felony.
The Wanderers' Bill passed through the Committee
--;-the Report was received—the Bill ordered to be
engrossed, and to be read a third time to-marrow
(this day).
•A Message from-the Itardt eetitiatuted the Irene,
that the Lords had agreed to the Watch and Ward
Bill with one Amendment, to which they desired the
of that It

, but might make them de- Right Hon. Gentleman (Mr. Percival) had obeuofse:
/as this wished for ? Was it the augmentation in 1807, but was then foiled;1,14 incompetent persons to teach the as that augmentation had been sanctioned by Parlia.
into andehea:
tetenyorsapntiokne.
now
othteasnomvietters
o:out:ft
oeifngfhwo,ouaseA:ctithiaoattf
and it
. of 13,0001. was more needful- ment, he considered the subsequent
of
t6.redh.uction as an
then went
tid, both 0 the • spiritual and Ministers of the Prince. They told the Kiting'
124)7Ca.thdilliec
they now merely. support it in cens
-being in principle against the grant flocks, could not be disprity..
they might Maynooth,
and in this resPect
aped , with the Clergy_of aey este. quence of an obligation arising the. College of
-.gent Whatteeir Pjfietliiii(e`Mtitii Observe. Union. There was nothing in the Act of Utfion to
fintkssiht concluded **metier that 13 0001. should prevent them from acting ott their prtficiples;
be sAstitui • ' • f • in ' •
ed irt peace of the sum the estimate. would•beletterior. eth • 'usl end of starving the
R.Xleka beliased.thst the College of May-
nothad been it tuition ,' w
n Lae mems of aiding the proselytteg consent tato Grant. fle:ihetild bi' Y-
e bill
froth' theEstablfiihed Miurcli to the Catholics. He feeirn,thefeseids -of glad to hear
. . .
...., ... 11 tritillr4l- lignekr4ispiit
was favourable to a liberal toleration ;. bat averse to meld, Ot an •
inateuce. propelAt .
occasioned by
dr principle of granting any thing to the support of the College of ltf ailiVotiv. If he' ste
atitd no iustanies
a diffeeent religion hem that of the State. Upon the why did he throw out t false *alarm; for the pO4;
lame principle, Dissenters of all kinds might demand of deterring others. frpm acceding to this GPer--)
rant .-
lassistance from Government. He wished from his The Chancellor of the ETA
....,.. -ft-equer, in answering Li'
kart that Maynooth College had serer existed. ' ' —, t iion:TireTA (Sir J. 'Newisort) had argued- I•s
Colonel DILLON thought le looked rather•ua. :Way" perions wed annually out of Maynooth C,lll.
Vicious at this time, wheri the House were not very lege.; but Oioswas •unquestionehli adr 'the rifte '
scrupulous in their -grants of money for sinecuee Notwithstanding the great increase its tins pule -sti
elects, that an opposition. should be made to such a every dile/ since the institution of the 'College, .-
moderate sum forthe religious education of the Clergy Right lion. Friend merely calked' on the liasets
of a whole nation. • ways to the grant of 1807. It was natural to sup.
Me.. HERBERT, of Kerry, wondered how the pose that this would be censidered as etouctiste
House could refuse accedingto the additional giant. by the Catholics of Ireland to judge of what. h;
• The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER were to expect from this new ore,. ..They Would'
contended, that it wag not the amount of thestemeni , consider that the whole itfluence of the (t?ovetnmsot
which he opposed the additional grant. It was note I was now applied to sacalitce •ti
an ins tette, which
fair representation to say that they were now with- had its origin under a itil • mate., whom the Right
1 drawing a grant which was formerly made by Perlis.- Hon. Gentleman pr Ai 164 up to when it
anent. The sum now proposed was the sum which .suits his purpose. elt Tould -wish theI attention of
' the Parliament .of Ireland had thought proper to the people of England.. to be called to one paint.--
grant, and which hed,been. continued regularly since: They had often heard ofsthe greet influence which
by the Parlientent of the United Kingdom, with the the Emperor of France wouid pout* through the
exception of the alteration in 1807. It was the Mi- Pope, over the Catholic Clergy of Ireland; and it
! nistry of 1807 who were the innovators. He agreed was now wanted to drive the Catholic Clergy hbrosi,
I with his Right Honourable Friend (Mr. Ryder) near for their education, to the dominions of -France, or
him, is thinking; that if this grant had not pre- countries subject tether influence. The house were
viousty been made by the Parliament iu Ireland, it 'no wore bound to follow the estimates of former
ought not now to be continued. To wish to establish years for this, any more than for ether grants; they,
one system of religion and maintain that establish- had just voted additional sums to hospitals and other
meat, and yet to provide for the education of the institutions, because they wanted more; why were
clergy of smother religion, was inconsistent and ano- they not•then to exercise their discretion respecting
malous. He did not object to the Roman Catholics the sum necessary for the College of Maynooth ? •
themselves providing that education; but he could The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER
not well see why the State was to be at the expence of I
had some difficulty in understanding" what had been
grant
it. He would, however, consider this as -a so often asserted, that he had been guilty of itmota.
pitet of .the Union, and on that principle give it ids; tion. The amount voted for this Institution had
vote. He wished' those Gentlemen, who thought ',.continued the mate from the Union. until 1806 ; and.
that Parliament were acting illiberally, to consider :so far there was no adoration. In 1801', hoe:Overt
what part of the education of our own clergy was ; when those Ministers came into power, wise' had eni-
paid by the State, and they would find that it bore I formly been distinguished'for doing every this' lhat I
no proportion to :the grant to the Catholics. When could in any way operate as a promotiou to
the College of Maynooth was first established, the licism (which might be very proper,' Id
Catholics did not .wish 'Government to be at the principles they professed), the vote had been ant
whole expence of the education of the Catholic priest- mented to 13,0001. To this propositioo he (the.Chini.
hood ; they said, if you will give us only a basis, we
ocellor of the Exchequer) gave his. most strenuous
will come liberally forward with our contributions.-: opposion ' • but the vote was never completed, of in-
It had been said, that the course of . the students at serted in the Appropriation Act In consequently of
Maynooth was too short ; but let• us look at home. the diseglatieo of Ettriiialente-41isei,-/teirr!;-la
How were the clergy of our owe establishment edit- I the new Ppliament, those who, whenia Oppiiktion,
cated in Wales and in • the North? There was no had conceived it their duty to reilst such etwourige.
end to this system; thousand after thousand might ment to the Catholics, felt le rigitt etiA:tfi-tieniiitWe
be panted without end, till Maynooth was as large innovation which hullosen : •t• their ;leeks:
as Dublin,' Cambridge or Oxford. . censors, and to restore.putt to• r former State.
Mr. GRATTANssaieI it did not follow that be- Because, thsrefori,'the' present Administration bad
cause the House adopted the principle of the Irish resisted what was new, and supported whit wits old,
Parliament in supporting the establishment of May- they were called innovators-.-{Hear, hear!]-If the
nooth, they were not to exceed the limited sum of word innovation meant doing that which had been
60001. voted
nd by that Parliament. The provision done before for a long series of years, undoubtedly
must correspo to the times, otherwise it was no- the accusation was just; but if it implied, as vat
mina!, and a cheat. 'Were the means adequate to usually understood, the introduction of something
the end ? It was to be recollected that the Protestant entirely novel and unprecedented, the crime 'of in.
Church was paid by the Catholics; and it was but novation, if it were so, must be placed to the ac-
just that the Protestants in their turn should contri- count of the last Adqiinistration. Bit it was said,
bate to the Catholic college. Apother Church had that the novelty was, that the Ministers of the Prince
been established among the Catholics; and every Regent should resist this"augmentation. Undoubt.
means of indulgence ought surely to be given, them idly when he (the Chancellor of the Exchequer)
not to propagate their religion,' but to practice it..- tank into poster under the King, he had exhibited
It was not in the power of a Legislature to extend the strange phenomenon (which seethed to strike the
1.
the faith of any sect. When force was applied to other side with so much wonder), of a person con-
the professors of any religion, it only made them Itinuing his resistance to the increased grant which he
adhere to it with spore tenacity; and it became then ' had opposed when out of office. That a man in Ad.
lot so much a matter of religion as of spirit, to ministration should act 00 the same principles' that
*la by the religion of the ancestors. To refuse had governed him while in/Oppositiottotoubtlesss 'ap-
=on to the Catholics would' not make them peered not a little extraordinary to Gentlemen whorl
tants, but might make them Deists; and no he had now the pleasure .to see on the other side of
Protestant would say, that to possess no religion was the House. [firer, hear, hear 1 It might Me-
better than to be q Catholic. The foreign education wise seem still more supriaiug to them to filet tl4t
was not objectionable because it was Catholic, bet the same Ministers,' who, under the King, had strP.
because it was disloyal; and it was upon that ground nuously withstood this grant, should persist in the
that the Legislature thought proper to establish May.. ' same line of conduct under the-Regent. It was,
nooth College. Why was it established ? To pro- i however, a mistake on the part of the Honourable •
vide the Catholics with religious instruction. Would! Gentleman (Mr. Whitbread) to.say, that any earthey then give them only one-half of this object.?- argumeet had been now introditeed by him into the.
I
Was. it proposed to leave the half of them without debate, because, from the .beginning, he had objected
any,lietigion at all? The Right lion. Gentleman had ; to the grant in its principle altogether : however
said,"bpon the same principle they might be called ; absurd- it•mighet be to emp!oy it (and no doubt it sp:.
upon -to pay for the education of the Disseutera.--; peered to the Gentlemen. over against him a great
But the pen eof Ireland paidmore than iiiia-e-t
..,ebsurdia,y), .he hatlimiAmilliALit.eser since the
rad . 'we: another country'.- lfaCtesg , fear
butilthougit such a p
ses. his decided °-
oll!,
_tkillti. religion "of the state, was. the rell‘. nion, as the vote of 80001. had been hitherto passed
gird itt ellisitr of the ,uhtion?, ' 40: iby Parliament, he did not think it necessary to
ever „1104iiiiiitry wbioli, we. t throw it out in toto. With regard to the assertion
... - - " -- - - -41., part; he had made (whick had heenalenied) that a'l the
al; tt College •

. . .
1 •
i 44tIV;11111;231alit a frl7
. ilitiO Zlibizta
im.APrOtistitnts
,• • .
or done.. Was
niluii rihoeutsuinmcoor;
t troops
byßtighheturinsilonoorell"lbl: 7.owt7idthwoeitasyi,iroishi.Bo7B2
riltanoseq24olo übitenee
,of wxhficorh. _
itilrip„to
of
their I agrees
___
........„.......................
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