The Statesman.
London, England, 1819-02-10 00:00:00

THE Si' eVIESMA*,'

e--•a:

airily from the landholder, and that, lois wiihnot
benefiting the lower orders. An flonnorablo Gem.
'lnman opposite (the Member for Wincheises) had
promised. lest sear, to institute sommomosore (ee
etliiiiting the Poor Rates, whkh he regretted Mild
tint yet hoes broeght foretold by him. That Hon.
Gentleman had not been a Member of the lam year's
Committee; and he was smiles. to know if his Geo.
refitted asd•porsoits 'sold allow him to alkyd -Ms
•teiMastas at the Commitiste._ahmlig_lop ratted
for the preened Miaow" orPerfeament. pow his

moving, that • keret Consaaitee be -appoisted to
-take into their cotelderstiow the several Laiis
Peovisions for the Poor,: and to repeat therm from
airman times
Mr. CUR WRN rote. under the impression, ha
said, of ronsiderable feeling of pains-as he felt him.
self called upon to oppose the preseet motion. Ile
was spinet' the re-appointment of the Committee,
because he was of orioles, that oho Ilene, from the
votheinoes Reports of former 'Committees' bed 1
owfficiesecy Isf details before them. The business at
present; he thought, was not to collect more details,
bet to tale en enlarged and general view of the sub-
ject in its meat ostensive Wirings, for the purposes
of speedy and aeries! !restrain. And this could
set be more effectually done by any persons than it
could by the C overflown t of the country, who had the
whole infoanatien.fully within their reach. From the
very ninety of she system itself, it was manifest
that the yells of lb* Poor Laws had I en greatly in-
crested. And safely it did nit require mach sage-
city to see that those who are sure of being pro.
tided for al the 'spree, authors, will not take touch
tree' le In providing for themselves. Though there
were early proofs of the demoralizing tendency of
the system, yet these proofs, sad the evils to which
they /elated, had been at least quadrupled within the
lase 23 years. Of this events there were three great
causes. viz. 'semen tension, • greet depreciation
of money, and consequent rise le the prices of all
She necessaries of life. To attempt to remove the
evils of the present system of the Poor Laws, witti-
est removing or lessening these three great evils,
would be huts sure mockery of legislatiors.—Ulcor,
bear!)-As the Government bad the whole situation
of
the country before them. it was they that were
celled upon to act with energy le this business.—
Within the last twenty-five years, the paces of
swages had i I only ese.founk, while the
prices of she necessaries of life had intoned sue.
third.—[//tor, hoar[—Thy tens epee salt, leather;
soap, and cosh, were the heaviest burden on the
shoulders of the 'shouting poor. What be bad to
pay on these accounts alone, amestited to, at least,
one-isinth of the labourer's iacente.—[flear, hear 9,
If the Ilises• were armless that the country -shoold•
preset,e its proud situation, they ehoetl nut theme
selves to raise and better Ike condition of the work-
fog orders. Though be could not concur in the ter,
littering statements of the prosperity of the country,
which he understood to have been made by the No-
ble Jest night, be would say, that it was in-
cumbent upon all, even from the Prince down to
the lowest individual, to make considerable sacri-
fices in the present condition of the country. la-
sted of having decreased, the sem for the main.
tease co of the poor bad been progressively increasing.
Aud though the farmers complained, that they were
most heavily lased for the maintenance of the poet,
yet lie mast slim, that they paid only nominally,
whilst the payments came ultimately from the
pickets of the great proprietors. Weald it not
be better, at sore, sad directly, to lighten the ber•
dens on the People, and to place thews upon real
property ? He was persuaded, if the present system
was allowed to continue, that the whole mass of the
People would be ultimately pauperised.—(h ear!)—
acknowledged that the astkly potatoes was one of
the greatest blissiegs which Provideoce bad *Wooded I
to the poor, bat be deprecated It as a staple stational
food, because it cootribeted w lamely to the loans'
of population. The abide policy of Administration
as to the Poor Laws, was contracted sod etsjest.—
It recognised principles which, when they were
acted an, produced the worst of consequences. The
pittance to each individual who was the object of re-
lief saes regulated according to the standard waste of
the sumarried man, and the result of this system he
nested not them detail. Ile agreed with the Noble
Lord that it was bolter to employ the People in some
way or other, if it were only in digging clay out of
• ditch and throwing it beak again, thin to lease
them without employment, sod coeseqrseutly with-
out soy wages. list the nosegays to which 'grin!.
feral labourers were subject, hail been always so
peculiar, that it became imperative on Parliament
to take them under its protection. The tascourage-
wets to combination met with his decided con-
sent, because they more painterly applied to •
class of labourers whose services could oat be dis-
pensed with, and therefore their caprices should be
guarded aniest—he meant the manufacturing la-
. boerers.—[Cries of War, hear, hear I—Bot the
egliceiteral laboerer was escieded from all nobles-
lion. He was too distant, too disconnected from all
those who might be able to @lndia* with him, and,
at worst, he was at the mercy of his master, who,
could easily do without him for many months in the
'ref.—(llear, hear!)—There would be, therefore,
greet wisdom and justire io Wag the wages of the
latter class of labourers. In those of manufactures,
it was utterly impossible to mkt • wooden!, because
the proprietor was at all times to be governed by so
massy foreign eiteninsioneee in the payment of his
men. The Bill introduced by the lion. Gentleman
contained several classes worthy of approbation.
There was one law included is this Bill, to which he
wished particularly to draw the attention of the
Douse, namely, the law relative to satlensents.—
( Hoar, bear!)—Bet in effectoehat was the object of
the Bill after all ? Emplaning even that every thing
it contemplated was put effectually into esecution,
still noshing would be gained. It avoided, besides
its other deficiencies a most serious greinoce,
tamely, bastards. lie would state witboot fear
of contradiction, that net of nineteen millions
of the population of the country, sir and a
half were bastards. The total itiadeqsacy of the law
to protect the public feed, as sell as to provide te.
dress to the injured parties, amounted to a very cis,'
oppression. 'rue Committee had new eat foe toe
years, sod the result of their labours leas been but very
slightly felt as yet. Nothings in short, could seemly
depot evil 'kick of cemplaiued off bat the removal

Wow:emoriboos tonisiest, Thd Committee tyre In-
eltopstelis rat:prolog, soy swellototlto of • 'bps
Wrlesporo, bls.s.lbry had net sulfi egirt primes*
so to the root of thew. They wore unable to ori.
&nolo any 11110111114111 of themselves, sod their Mawr
oo OW account west always prove abortive. The
groat owl.ollistool 'boredom wield oleos be wade by
ttoso Is whim power it was to amend the finance

*tom .of the ariteitry ; end motets they shooght
_proper ti rose iheward sad Wafer, to the necessary
extent, all hope from soy other eyesore, er any other
glories, was chiroesiest.—( Hear!)
Lord CASTLEREAGH °Norwell, that, in his
'epistle., the preposltio• of his Hon. Friend by
no meeni tool to a general discussion of the Peer Lein.
(near 1)If those laws were lobe circumstantially
considered by the Hesse. the proper time for sects a
discussion ups when the Bill "meld be introduced be.
foci Partiament.—(Heor!)—lt contained eight or
eine cites's, embracing the whole beptortent part of
' the Poor Lows, and when theseshoold be propounded
a very fair opportunity opened for observation upon
them. 11. Word the lion. Gentleman who spoke
last at all times with pleasure, bet he most say that
the remarks which hod Wes from him Were calm-
hued rather to give the House an isles that it was the
Finance System, sod not the Poor Less, that he.
mete the 'object of his considetatio(//ear 1)- -
If the Hoe Gentleman thought he dricovered • plan
of amelioration, by remmelog the burdens of taxation
from one part of the commewity to the' ilietAdess of
soother, it was a secret in political economy with
which Ministers were totally enargosinted, and be-
fore hit Majesty's Government should be called upon
to adopt the Uon. Gentlentass's suggestion, it was
but reasonable to expect that he should communicate
the chasm by which it could be elected.—[//earl]
Ministers, it was tree, had not taken up the subject j
of the Poor Laws, sad they were accused of supine-
ness on that account. Bat he ( Lord C.) protested
against such animadtersions. Ministers were satiate%
to avoid outrunning the Committee or the Haase.—
They apprehended that, if they originated any mes-
tere upon thaw questions, it would be less accept.
able to the country, merely because it might be look-
ed upon as a boon ; whereas, hiving waited to identify
themselves with the House, and tote,. only the pert
•f individuals in any proposed messes', they would
obviate all the jealousies and soplessant feelings with
which, as a t: sent measure, It might have
born reativell.—[Hear, heir I] —Th. Committee had
prodoced great improvement isr the riser!' admini-
stration of the Poor Laws, although they found that
it *as impossible to makes more extended one, With.
out involving an injury to these personal rights which
the poor sight have esteemed as their unalienable
property. It was unfair to ingest that Government
had been guilty of remissuess upon this occasion,
since, if their interference was required, the Commit.
lee would not have failed to demand it.—`Meer!]
With respect to the state of the country, he was fully
bore, out by facts is toe prosperous view he had
taken of it ;• and the esti:trace of distress among the
poor was not to be considered es injuring the troth
of those statements, since it could not be denied that
there never was a moment in the most brilliant pe.
clod of our history, when distress could not be found
in seine quarter or another.—[llear!)—There newer
was a coontrythet an speedilyemereed from depression
las this, altogether. The Committee were proceeding In
I their taboo's, sad there was nothing that experience,
I talent, and assiduity could •Irord, that might not
be *sleeted, from the Committee. It was formed
of individuals whose characters spoke for themselves,
and among whom ate patty-iuterest was salered to
prevail—[/lcer I]]
Mr. W. BURRELL stated, Shut in the parish of
West Grinstead, the propostims helve., the ability
!of the inhabitauthaed the nec..ssary supply for the
Ipoor was oppressive its the esteems. A .umber of
the labs:meth were employed et six-pence a day in
stone quarries, and the deficiency was made up to
them out of the poor fend. This state of thine, es-
' isted mot only on this parish, bat throughout Sestet
and its vicinity. The most part of the young single
men were placed he the workhouse of that latish fur
want of employment.
A MEMBER said it would be a delusion to the
country, to say that Government could ever arc.
molly remove the injuries arising from the pretest
citudition of the Poor Laos, otherwise then by a
disainetion of oases. While the dreadful load of
tales continued, the landlord was compelled to keep
up his rent, the Waal kept down his wagers, and
the lebeeriag poor were in reality the only self .
In the West of Engleod, where the distreu of proprie-
tors was a bar to all employees% the condition of
the poor 'forded a useful lesson to blieisters. The'
reverse of the picture which now presented iteell,
must take place ; the labourer meat be fed and kept,
not by charity, bat by the wholesome product of his
own industry.
Mr. LONG WELLESLEY opposed the selection
of. Committee. Nothing was more nineties, than
the distreu of the poor of lie 'edilisirsiv;and nothing
was more certain than that the molt espiellllloo
means of antelieratieg their showiest were necessary.
—He did not agree with an lion. Grottoes's' (Mr.
Curium), that the potato. was to be deprecated ass
staple article of food. Stich were his Irish predilec.
lions, because it was favourable to the growth of
population. Let population thrive, bet the only
means to primes' the i knee of it, would be
to peocvre employment for Shots who were able and
willing to labour. The Execetive Government should
originate the salutary measures that were to be
adopted on this occuien. How could they be more
gloriously employed than in relieving the distresses of
the poor ?—[lktor, hear !]
Mr. Alderman WA urn m AN said, he did not in-
tend to detain the Howse long. Ile apprehended
that be did not uoderstaod the subject so well as
thou lion. Geotlemen who had spoken before him ;
but ha thoeght himself called on to mention a few
facts which would disprove the statement of the No-
ble Lord. He could not believe that the country was
its so flourishing a situation as had been repre-
sented by the Noble laud, bevies.- he had the
testimony of his eyes and ears to the contrary. In
the parish in which be resided whets in the countly,
there was en increase of distress and of the number of
poor. The want of gardens attached to their col-
leges, was • great misfortene to many poor peo-
ple. la his parish there were about two
baudred cottages, sod oat one of then had a

bit of groubd. In this case, alien 'Ake', eeksit
entirely on potatoes, 'Misers no growled
tosiOsititre for ibibmseltes, Irbil could fourths them
from conimistingdepredstions on neighbouring pots-
toe-fields? Ile Assorted, that from the number of
Enclosure Bills which passed shrank that noose,
proprietors of land were more desirous to le& their
grounds in parks, titan to accommodate the poor wish
cottages and isformi. The Ward which he repre-
sented contained use parishes, and he had occasion to
know, that the pressure of the Poor Rites in all those
parishes was most were. Ile presided at the Board
by which the People were summoned for their Poor
Rates • and he had known caste in which numbers
had been summoned ewer and over again, is cense-
(wrote of their inability to pay : it required, in fact,
continued efforts to keep them cut of the workhouses.
He most have something better than Castors-hoes,
hooks, to coeliac@ him that the country was in a
Nourishing condition ; for when that was asserted, he
understood it to imply the general diffusion of com-
fort and happiness. As to the mestere now proposed,
he was convinced that it was impossible to give any
real relief to the poor, bet by altering the present
system, and reducing the sates which oppressed the
country. That was the object to which he should
' with to sea the stionoion of Parliament directed.

Colonel WOOD had heard many observations in
the coarse of the debate, which he thoeght nook' be
worthy of the consideration of the Committee; but
he had not heard any evident reason assigned
why the Committee 'boatel not be appointed. lie
wished to make now observation, relative to the
calmly which he represented. It bad been said, that
in the MI which was to be proposed, • residence of
three years was to constitute a settlement, bet
although he had no objection to the principle, he was
swore that this Outdoes of the law of settlement
would be ruining, in that county. It was distressing
indeed in reflect nn the creel manner in which the
lA. of Settlement was enforced; end be thought
they would do better to go back to the original eats.
Withstood of the Law in gams Elizabeth's time.
A MEMBER, whose name we could not learn,
wee eosins• to see the Committee of last year revival.
lle had always teen the greatest gratitude expressed
by the poor who had been sired from crime and
want, by the protection of the Pee► laws, and there-
fore he viewed with apprehension any Snowier' in
the east* state of these laws. lle remarked, that
in the county in which be acted sea Magistrate, land
had in tome cows risen roe-third is valor, in the
vicinity of aaaufaeinriee.
Another 11 EMBER, whom we did not know,
spoke in favour of the re-appfletment of she Com-
mittee. The gentian, that the Committee be op.
pointed was then pet and unanimously agreed to.
After a few oh...readout from Mr. S. BOUIVIE, OD
the necessity of altering twee of the names in the
' former Committee, the See Mt% read over the names,
end the Committee was sppoisted.