The Statesman.
London, England, 1813-02-26 00:00:00

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thi.
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I ved
make
tty
of
had lint
.)F dis-
Antnbera
'7 Joined in
Catholics in.
condi,
meta
•e am
beerucd
the
,
that was
130 in.

guettiou
canons, by
of the hod'
ceedings
seemed

rok
Itioi
'r
out
had become common to almost every great country
in Europe, excepting England, they proved their ;
charges true in argument., founded on their pr47n7
though fake in fact; and they brought quote;
from certain Writers, to shew that the Fathers,
the existing Catholics, held precisely the. sami
nets. . This was all founded en monslrelstl
and monstrous misstatement. Tito
established their principles a,, ley.
jured et* inimical principle liiipsited
oaths Named by Protehtanta, and orc,
a .Protestant Parliament, ‘—::ontits framed with
careful attention to all the minutiae on which
objections could be raised7—oaths which the Catho-
lics had taken, and Still took ; and by taking .which
they _ acquitted. themselves of those bad principles
Which had been falsely imputed to,them. They went
1 farther. and denied that the
,cherges we made were
1.. • .
i ia identifying them in all cases with their ances-
ten; but we took this as a condemnation of them-
selves, and, instead of believing their oaths, charged
upon them the retaining of 'all the obsolete notions
of earlier periods of their Church. The Clurrch, it
was, tree, was said to be always the same. So, in-
deed, it might be said, a true. Christian was al rays
sthe

they
. iy a. Tench
as separated frote the thleirch' did tathoistawbe- slpentheir Church-. The Catholic was not against
Here MTh to have authailty over the temporal affairs 10eirrity, but against making his liberty a conditional
Indirect,' Ho Skid, " take. any security you Wok ne.
for •your religion, if it dues not derogate
our liberty, or impair our Church." The
and the liberty of the Catholic; were per.
compatible with our liberties; and the -wisdom
shootd find- oat how to unite them.
4 Ceonv tteland did not attack the prin.
but snggested modifications of it ; and this
'fair in the Protestants. lie codld not
that the Church of England was, as a body,
impious and e.. and contrary to the laws of ' inimical to the civil liberty and. franchises of the
'God and nature. Another instrument to prove Ca- I Catholics ; nor could he think that the people of
tholic allegiance, was the oath taken try the AeT of 1 England 'were so. He was sure that he, might
the 33d of the King, which swore due allegiancetl,tepose without fear on their good sense and
and the defence of, the. Crown, person, and dignity . integrity. Some had explained their object to be the
of the King, against all attempts ; to disclose all I security of their religion by exclusion. lie did not
,treasons or conspiracies; and to support the sums- condemn their
.object, hut hated the means. They
sion to the Crown as limited to the descendants were not rightin telling Parliament that religion was
of the Princess Sophia, being Protestants. They to be saved by denying rights. lie wished to gratify
further swore, that they rejected• and detested all parties in the security of their religions. tie
the notion, that it was lawful to depose .or murder I wished to root these principles in the very foundation
Princes, on pretence of their being heretics or infi- lof the island. Soule petitioners said "on must save
dels„ and the impious principle of violating faith wilig-tbe-Clievoh.--by. a 'monopoly of ali.power to Pro-
beret:( - denied of - _

the same ; but that was not a case which included , .:cs ; and they all power .4. tbe....Pog! - testa*. s." He Would secure the Church by the same
1
criminal Christian.; yet here we went contrary to I direct or indirect, in temporal authority.- By. ; means as the State must be secured—by the identifi--
ebsereation of what had pissed almost over all Eu- I Act of the 33d, peculiar to Ireland, the Catholic , cation of the people with the constitution. He would
rope, iud %we said there had been no change._ It was swore that he abjured, condemned, and IletesteC gratify the Catholic by repealing the excluding laws,
very hssty, and eery imprudent, for any respectable I these deetrines as impious; and declared before.G.ta, ! and thereby qualifying him. Repealing, these laws,
set of men us Say, that any considerable portion of 1 that no act, immoral 'and wicked hi itself, eduld-,; he would bring in a Bill to take care of the perm:-
our fellOwesubjects were enemies to the Church.Why.l ever be excused by any pretext of its being tribielfor 1, vent interests of all Colleges, Hospitals, and Peck-
enemies.-to the Church, unless the Church were an the Church, or by any ecclesiastical power wltglatier, : SiastiCial Courts ; and then such other provisions as
enemy to theth ? See how that question stood: if the Absolutions, without the regoleites for- that' rile;limight be considered necessary might be provided by
Catholics' rights and the Church's security be de- it was sworn, only occassioned an additional sin,'. the wisdom of Parliament; only they should not go
dared by the Church to be totally incompatible, was by the violation of the ordinance. ,It was /et fare t, eo far as to condition theliberty.(which would be iiis-
not the Church equally an enemy to the. Catholic? ther sworn by the' Catholic, that he would ad'-', i gracing the very gift), or to affect the religion of
I How enemies to the Church ?. Was it in penance ? I here to the settlement of property in Ivfand as' the Catholic, or the integrity of *Church. lie
Was. it. in absolittion ? Was it in extreme unction, it was by law established ; he disclaimed 'its'lee I wield have the preamble of the ACtso framed as to
that the.enmity was to be discovered? Could he go tendon of subverting the Established .Church, in gthiern both Ministers and people in both countries.,
into partiCulare, it would be found, that, on this order to substitute a • Catholic Esteblitemeot ; : Ile would set forth the absolute necessity of the
head, the anti-catholic petitioners_ stated nothing bid and swore that he would exercise no privilege Which ! measure; he would make the act a covenant of con-
; that which would excite, not conviction, bat scorn ! he"had, or might obtain; to disturb or weaken i cord, tuput au end 40 ittf national and all rellifosts
Enemies, then,. to the. State--enemies to *he Go.the Protestant Religion and Protestant G'overn:' animosities.- The tiro. tesets,Vel 'the'esvo Isidore,:
vensmeet! How ? What was meant.by enemies upon 'meat. What far4lter declarations or securities were ' had been too lett in a state of pnlietea- 14,44 - inft,
principle? What did that House do, when they re. requisite? The • counter-petitiPuirs might act and hostility. The liberty of the press Should- be loci in
turned thanks to our armies for gaining battles f Did think with good intentions, but they supportedtheta ! the exercise of perfect freedom, except it were 1.
Ithey mean to say, that the Catholic soldiers to whom by very bad argnmenie. When they
made such I prevent subjects of different religions from abusing\
they voted their.thanks were very good soldiers -in heavy chargesv they ought to prove them. What, if . one another out of their common aliegience.—
battle, but great enemies to the State? Bat why ene. the printer of such foul charges, against his Majesty's 1 —There were subjects enough: there were the
l
1 mies? Let the petitions go to a Committee, add see Catholic subjects were criminally prosecuted by my French, and the Dutch, and other foreign people; •
whether these injurious allegations could he rupporte Lord Fingall, or any others of the Catholic Body ? . and at home there were the Ministers ; and *hen
1 ed. It was said boldly, they were enemies Ate the If so indicted, woiddle produce the obsolete cauous : they did not furnish matter enough for attack, why
State; and to support this, the deem" of the in Court for his justification?' Would my Lord El- i then there was the Opposition.--[A laugh.]---" You
Councils of . Lateran, Constance, and Trent, leuborough suffer, or would my Lord Kenyon have ; cannot too soon put an endto your religious disputes
1 would be brought forth. Very well : but he would 0 u ffered; the decrees of the Councils of Lateran, , and animosities. If you adeert to your geographical
i produce against these proofs, the authority of a Treat, and Constance,, to be . put in as evidence i situation,--to the spirit of your Constitutionl—to
I British Parliament, who, by the . vierious thanks' against the Catholic? Would the defendant say, that ! your union under one Sovereign,—you will see that
! which it had noted, had shown an opinion of their he had no particular meaning against any individual, ! you can have but one interest. You are, and should
! allegiance .. and practical loyalty ; and not a but was general in his charge against a whole Body ? Imost important interests, this outcry of religion is
be, bueone people ; but united' its you are in the
theoretical, unfoUnded, and abominable.. suspicion. That would be'to excuse himself by saying, that he
Enemies to liberty l—Whet,
was Mare Charta go had no antipathy against an iedivideal ; but thathe i heard, *bile the voice of nature dropped.—Put
proof of attachment to liberty ?-lie would•go to the i meant his charges against four millions of his fellow-lan end speedily to this abominable contest."—
! Declaration of Rights, as a Parliamentary document,lsubjects. The doges against Catholics implied not His first step would be to
.move for a Committee,
for that Declaration, for the most part, declared old only a political dereliction, but a moral turpitude; pursuant to the resolution of last year. If asked by
laws, which formed the great body and force of Bri-1 which, if true, rendered them quite incapable of the. any Hon. Member what he would then do, he would
fish liberty. Who were the authors of these invalu- I.daties of society, and Qf all those necessary ant...telkhim: he should, therefore, read a resolution which
Isle laws, but these' enemies of Church and State?-.- I plastic principles which held the community toi. 'iWa Committee he intended to propose. The resole..
Why had we not gone farther at the Revolution,lgether. They made the Catholics .not men, bet don risid by. Mr. Grattan was in substance,. " that,
but because we thought our ancestors had been such! monsters. It was impossible 0 suppose persons bee with a view to such an adjustment as would be coil,
friends to liberty, and had established such statute.. : lieved in such thariges,but they made them to exclude ; ducive to the strength and security of the Established
securities as their wisdom, co:11d not exceed? lie ethers from all power. The Clergy of this cOuntryo Church, and to the peace and concord of all his Ma.
i should place these facts, drawn from Magna Chatta. no doubt, understood religion perfectly ; but. therc jetty's subjects, it was highly desirable to remove the
and the Bill of Rights, against the injurious and appeared a mighty 'difference iii their opinions Orit; disqualifications affecting his Majesty's Roman Ca-
calumniousimputations, that our Catholic, fellow: 1 language when they prayed, from wring they itosi tholic subjects ; preserving safe and unaltered the
subjectsL. were the enemies of liberty. Yet the Ca. i when they petitioned. In prayer they addressed ilieolestent succession nvording to the Act of Settle-
! titolics were charged with maintaining the doctrines' .the Deity as the universal God, who sent his Son :meet and maintaisfing the Pretniktent.Estahlished
Lend tenets which they absolutely denied, and pp. 'into the world to spread his divine revelatiat4C
01114er Englawkood freiencl,4l bill* establish.
'sitively foreswore,- ,certain decrees of those anti-red to saes otivivkinil;* but wififf--they --Pitt- c T'st the Kirk of Scotland." After moving that
• ....What. was tire -'aniontTrorshese tioned, their seutimente appeared re rerind ; they ! the rilioletion of last Session be read, which was
;charges ?—The -prinOple of the Pope's deposing seemed to think that the Deity•hlid almost abate. 1-deUe, he moved for the going into a Committee.
.power, the regicidal principle, and the reward of per- dotted his revelation, and that prgfessed Christians'l Mr. VONSONBY. seconded the motion.
Jury !..-As tb the deposing power, end the regicidal i throughout -the greater part of Europe were worse Mr.•TOMLINE then rota. Impressed as he was
power, such principles acted upon would constitute i than any other people on the globe, and, were loath .the Importance' of' the subject, he could not
treason, yet eters these were charges. There could ! actually monstvrs: that the Deity had been almost; eedaider himself as having discharged Ms duty, if he
be no doubt,, that IT they held such principle., they driven out of Europe, except where he had beest;2l.raWed
ought not to be adiwitted at all within the .pale of saved by the Dutch and
it .to pass with a silent vote. In the few
a few others on the contr.' ' ' • tionshe had to make, he should avoid every
constitutional privilege : but be defied those who neat, amid by the Colleges and Corporations felts *Oleic thet could excite irritation, which, he lament-
mede.such charges, to support them by the practice petitioned, thrOugh the intervention of certain gdaidg eld to say, was too prevalent. One argument, usual-
,pf the Catholics, or by any other means, except by , and barriers ; and these securities were,- In .faCte'tly brought forward when the Claims of the Catholics
use fruitless, contemptibly and obsolete canon., nothing else than laws, by Which such pedtioneee-Were *cussed, was the name of Mr. Pitt. He should
which the Catholics had eorsworn._[Le_we, brave). confined, and would perpetuate all powers and silllittlite ilse reasons which appeared to him to take
.When such a charge was made, he begged to read ! profits to themselves'. [Hear !]--This was nothiug,ekititjemuielt from the force of that argument. In the
the opinions delivered, at the request of our go-lin truth, but a coestinn for exclusive power and year 1800, 'the resignation Of that great Statesman
were/twit, by the Universities of Salamanca, Val-i pine. • The God of Prayer las a different being took place, previous to the proposal of any measure
ladotid, Alcatel Paris, Loueeine, anti Douliy.7.- i from the God of -Petition :if the ascriPtioitt of the . respeCtint.the-Catholies. Ile never made any de'
Those authorities were appealed to as the best • prayers were that . precise lute'
and they all did nut merely deny, but rejected; sertions in the liied five er.
with scorn, the imputations of the Pope's having a !., be. anderstood
depOsing power ; and of the doctrine of keeping:oomq of the pet
no:faith with heretics, 'which- seemed so abominable I berty with their
that they were almost ashamed to hear of it.— irrespect•for them,
What could be wished farther ? 11, would give :period their ecru,
something from a book, which had been described as:should seethem I
a means of keeping alive the bad prejudices of Cs- and fellow-cltristionit,
tholics, and the duties of infidelity and niertler;* It cause of their
was used by the students of . bleyuooth.( :roulette/og(e . it.neces sari that
Eciktio), and of whieheit-was 141, that *posterity. time, for the -
was corrupted by.thitcriski4l:slemmitarybook. Ile Catholic went
shaald read quigirjelajte,Okkisikkjll,4 and de...the commuully.
.

. ..." I .
. - •
' .
•
A ' TI-1141. siT , -:.„,...„. , ........ .• . •
.. .tay lois. • merderoes. The accusations fohoded
-- • ' --- "', . - ---". -,.-e.6.1 a, .•-o:Ati•-, 10" . • -' .a. - ..., r, • , ... ... ~ .
.•' ,4 - ,Apia ...""' '" - *Mut ottitatia'the set • '---yt Ibeiebel - r
that they had any good idea ,of t. •
T. . ..4.: L._
~..____,,,, , . - . . . .. - oft, rom. their eifeed, ti
...".!.,, tenierna of inotti;eoa;ctase- the old oanooseasounted to nothing less. Thus also at the cases of Prussia and of Itusslik.2 Mielele!e_„.,: • ' : _t; ir ,:re,„4,,,,i...i.tgagoeurT, or to
was, that they did not tolerate. to the elelf.Ptatalr" ..-- • -• . us ,
-ly :they to exclude one-Afth of, the, population Catholic Governments actually did. CAlhollo`oth 7 ' . ' "'ilkilleteitker directly "
•• or
-*patios were to continue dispates till they 5, ,i,
!Ph; yet. ovoid. the
any
and igity _esiAre, by arguments such as these; and the din
vernmeets bestowed not obi; religious liberties" be -
but civil qualifications, apd the Church 'agreed' Ito et
6 latertAfk pt
them. 31148, .!el tdonatf b0t0C,410,14r • 00eftelelesello .• . ~ _ , .
s" : istke4 out if their political and civil connects
but *an L'llqtrlth eittettaa‘l4„,.., WeikhoWereq, 14 : . • .reitnark, that do: . "rhikde.3. ' "eharges , might be ripeatesir-till •'some bpii,
.
defined that p 0 that 4 and • ,1
erVgell-teinibnwillhAl grant* it With. Plank and OP .. ~_ ,
ifi. f theiirif lirio. "
pedaklei. -.We ad ahltierely dOrtia. Gatelike of ;'fbrieutallifes'elle itstrseles Natl
"civildrassAitair..kiit dilan.of. Adigialffa. . __ it_
thehigarliament to examine and see whether we had
Wirt. talwayi mu
Church &chiefly petitioned, that the disqua
.s, . 0 0 .
•pe- -it present the elements of concord. Iternotal ofd
bons laid upon them should belier-petuall...The whole Prom Aeolis* . -mOtsfd:Atir to, which had 'qualificatioot was. asked for, and. greqt *umbers
; question was, not what were the dogmas sod the , alio- bent seeik; "iniereffeeeet-m47 the Catholic .Irish Protestants .of rank and .property joined
cinons hut- what were the principles and thelemper Prayer.book.-111.tions fagot it 'ftatet,. that -Mr teliessit" 'lt -was, said, that the Catholics
of the body, and what was-the character of the pro- I" no General eWhellp Inch Wait eithshtery, could dsted on Insithlg-101611 :they desired without con
ceedings of the petitiqners. The counter-petitioners' depose a King; and that atibliscta were not bound dons. Suppose It were so; that iris no arc
seemed totally ignorant of the facts on.'which they ': by such a-deceee :. AO the lintig.nf 'England's sub- WhY Parl'ament _was not to -legislate, to make
rested their petitions. The clergy and corpneations jects reooonoed: by their. oath ranch a *trine, on Act, and to provide the modifications, that soca
asserted, that the Catholics were Just the same," in ell grounds, is ekaognalbt to' the fundamental. -advisably: The honest interpretation ef what I
the worst of times—in periods, of massacre and, her. ; laws of society; 'lnjurious •to the siren*? power, , Catholic said, was, that he saw linnet:amity for ad
ror. Thts they stated, after witnessing the demon- ! and deltritatted 'of the -ends; of Government.— I *Hon.' akerityy he having given aircady all that i
tioh of the Vatican, the prostration of the Rely In- ' It said, they lielikved the Bishop of Rome to be the , in his power.. The Synod' had said, they had. no 1
quisition,_ the downfal of the Pope, who fell with-'1 Head of the Chtiteh'3 the Church being a universal , disposition whatever to every reconciling step; tt
out any Catholic to. help him ; and after toleration ; body under. one held tebut that he wits not inTallible, 1 would do any thing necessary, that did not tree
. . . • fresh,' tho Plen reit' ii-ndie. lid Vs A Altos, lk. , . -- AL ..! _ na____a_ rr...—. A. :. ..

-. •
their premises, :of Princes and States? directly or Indirectly. If he ' grant. LiAlgek
slit quotations abseilvid, or dispensed with, alfmeatice in charges of :cessary ' for -ye
e Fathers, and : hereiyor schism, the, act would be vain and null; , froni our Übe,
r the, same te- : and 011 Catholicewould be' hothell'he conscience, not- " Church, and tb
streas mistake, withstanding, to defend the sing and the country,as ' fectry. compatib
441 -Catholics had,: much as any Protestants-404 against the Pope himalef IN. meat e
424, Iyhich -..b-b- fief abiuld he iodide the klotdose.;l4Mak..l,-74,ii '' ' • tka•
14d op them,— for the,problemeldcal.ditqiutiolliitte rjeltst, :~d , p 1 e, but am
I Ordained by 1 they were not responsible; bit' With regard ..to the'lleas perfeelly 1
wined with a King-killing doctrine, it was' expressly dated to be ; believe that du
iito on which i impious and execrable, and: contrary to the laws of i inimical to thl

1 true, he must maintain that the as, , claration of • his • precise intention twin that at, tilect ;
e petitions were kb,. He ,begged tertend, thOughle Hied five years after, he never thought
I that he professed i great respect foqprOper to bring the subject forward.. The present
petitioners, but he mist take some ti.. Lord Chancellor . declared that he otter knew of
teir arguments ; he could not feel die- " any such Intention beinsentertained.Mr. l'itte—
em, since he hoped that at no distant • Every persoollnetithat be afterward discouraged
cronies wattld by overcome, and that hel , such Chtitni. 7 NucoMmunication of 4.4, such [men-
ern all united with their fellow-mtbjects tiott was ever: made to bit friende.,. The adrocr.tei
leaflike*, 'in the • ;mimeo interests- and for repeal could not, therefore, rest,lgpe:Mr. Pitt,
cotameo cepAtry. rhZ96l#r!] ile.thought 'as flavo#4.ble 'to that dare. Tfe.,,-Tepid: allow,
lutt an end- should
... pit to this cow ; that no argument frein tuthoritt was,gned... It-was
“PA4l"Vitio.
sprit of the
.prefosAtion. against lite! tp the .410,AtptAPIP1Pre .thiL - rilliii*P"
tto esseludeilor eggeltirtea•portion .4, den 51-1. Al* *eaves :that:4lo , elii.,eppir
V* ke*ZWILIc.kOI4 41.ai? ,411001-riK#C,02.)!.#40.24*0. '41214gr

• - .7..1-77=r-•-,,•,77.- •
• , •-•
rots tharti/Eed, this
mentions founded
thing less. Thus Were
the, population of tli,.
these; and the difil-r.
ispotes till they 5; )Ided
aad civil conoectioh.
etir-till 'some belioved
iered them to be mitio
Wag thP. great 4loty of
e ishother We had not
.ord. itemotal of dis.
tad gretkt •cumbers of
id .property joined lit
hat Catholics in.
esired without condi.
hat was no arg:Lnent
legislate, to male an
itioations, that seeeicri
rirtadoa of what the
ne necessity for addi. .*
alrrady all that was
I said, they had. U 0 in.
reconciling step; they
that did not trench •
mile was not against
s liberty a conditional •
rarrity you tttiulc.ne.
it does not derogate
our Church." The
s Catholic, were per-
dies; and the :wisdom
t bow to unite them.
d not attack the prin.
dons of it ; wad this
slants. lie cottid not
gland was, as a body,
and• franchises of die
c that the people of
sure that he, might
teir good sense and
their object to be the
xclusion. lie did not
led the means. They
meat that religion was
lie wished to gratify
' their religions. tie •
in the very foundation
s said "on must save
f all-power to Pro-
le Church by the same ...-
erect—by the identifi-- •
nstitution. He would
rot the evetudine law! • - -