The Statesman.
London, England, 1821-01-24 00:00:00

Il~r;

.

ST,

l'e intended to move for the pearittetinei of certain ;enotatit of One real state of the case, and lie wished
s epee., which he coneeived absolutely n--,-esary to a for ine,,,.eation on the sobjeet.
proper understanding of Lon! A. Hamlin, -•;.-motion. Air. It. BATHURST thanked the Honourahle
Lord C A STL ER EAGII thought the. Honourable Member for a caution, which, if the case tiere as he
l'i:vieher 'amid not make any motion of co• kind with- stated, would save, him 5001. But, bef re the lion.,
out ii.ifice. If he nislied for the prude •.••n of any Member had manic the observation, lie ougint to have!
pnat•re. he conk! avail himself of another opportunity made himself master of the feet. The act alluded 'to!
oi'interiei fur them. said nothing of persons filling offices without salary]
Mr. tVE lIIRRELL said, that provi-;rd he could Conimissioners of the Hoard of Contronl were ap
*rain his object, the mode by which le !Id so, was i pointed without salary, lied the King afterwards
qaite i•ematerial to him. He tens ready no bait/ to the granted a eei tain salary. The act alluded to did not
will of tee Moose. The papers for whic:, inf. Was about compel sc. S.IIIIA appointed to offices without salary to-
.t., move were, in his opinion, absolutely necessary, in vacate their seats, and he was precisely in that pre-.
tiler to remw to a proper utulerstantlin _f of the Noble dicarnent ; for, bolding the office of Chancellor of the I
Lord's motion. Correver, in deferent.. io :111. opinion Duchy l'f Lancaster at present, be received no saiary •
of the Comer, lie was ready to reverse le proceeding, as president of the Board of Controul —(lmughing).
had to give notice fur a future day.-0 ries of " no, Mr. TI EItNEY said, that there was a salary of '
run, melee now.")--Ile would then ts, eve at once— i 1,5001. a.vear attached to the office of Commissioner I
l(linear. in ear)—for " Copies of all Coll. •-4 taken froth of the Board of Controul ; that salary was afterwards
the priteed Litureies of the Church, ", whirls the increased. The question was, whether the Itielit lion. '
alnico( •i.e Queen Consort has heel, flout time to time Member acted as a Supernumerary Connuissioner, or
!write'.' trent the resign of James I. it ii in to the pre- :as President of tine Board of Control!! ? If be acted
rent time. Aso t'opies of all Coliects cieded from a, prei,iiir„t of the Board of Cont;oul, as appeared by
the Li..er_-y a .netted to the Act of Unifiormi y, Passel the Gazette, then it would b•for him to Nay whettier
intim reign inf Charles 11. (limn to C.e resent time, i that was not a phase of prolix and emolument, accord- '
with a spes•tiestion of the bl nks left n any of thet.'4sag to the meaning of the Act.
seal I. eeleeletalleon rmy of the (Inter in Couticil of Mr. B. BATHURST repeated that the appointment
Hs. I gib of Jr. hen ory, I'2o, by which her Majesty's of President of the Board of Controul was in the Crown;
a tune had b eras exoluilcd from the Litur.-y." He th'i but that li -, holding another appointinenit, received nu
t cis a ills avew of enabl ng the Heou•e to understand salary in this Ida second celice.
fully the nat ire of the m .Con which Le Nob.c Lord Mr. TIER\ EY said, they had to congratulate tie
had fixed for Friday. No doubt 1.u7 every Gristle- country on Isai-ing• the office (.1 President of tins Hoard
nian's r eeeee eh had brought boom to Min the prater of Controol tilled by the Chancellor of the Hurley of i
Information Iti this subject. Ile is used for those I Lancaster willo:mt any salary.---(A laueli). I
papers as public records, which were absolweiy neces- Lord MILTON observed, that the question was net
'try to a proper unit, rstanding of the !motion of whether a mart actually received profit, but whether
which notice bad leen 0-en. The Liturgy was a he' accepted a place from which lie had a riOit to re-
public record. under tier Royal sanction, as was the ceive it?
Act of Uniformity. It would be st.am .e and absurd Mr. CIIEEVEY remarked, that tier eineation was,
to come to a decision upon such a question without re- was it an ether of profit ntin:er Goverunient ? If en.
ferencr to the recited', and the Statutes of us eie con- the Member of mettle vacated his seat.
mooed with the subject. Ile maintained that the Mr. 11. BATHURST referred to the Art in question,
House could not, with justice to themaelves—tae the whirls be contended, Cid not include Mt-Inhere boldinel
✓ountry--to the Eine-, or to her Majrs•y, enter upon ollieel whiten' scsineT• Time Hight Hom_ Helli_belt_ Ikea
the Nolen Lord's motion, without havieg the duce- prone led to argue upon the question before the House.
Biennia fur is hick he woe Id, laid upon the tab!e. Ile 11.1.6N...41c 1' crliti (U2'41'1111(9 hail no objecnon to the
principle of tine motion, lent lie rimeriveni some delay
would also move for " Copies of ail Orders in Caen- welters., in order to procure the doruments called fur.
ail fruit the reign of James I. down to the present sic .1: 31A1'Ktrrosil cousin! not agree with the
time, resaectiug any alterations in the Liturgy in the Kale Lord opposite. that the motion of his Honourable
bawd a of the King, Queen, or Royal Family." and Learned Friend (Mr. Wetherell) would canoe a post-
Lord CASTLEREAGH thought it noulil be more poneoe..ol of the mutton ferret for l'.r.i'llY. It his Ma-
eloy a ministers were nut in possess of tine ',rupee
coins imient to give notice of the motion.
Thc 11°n• Value:miens., then they acted illegally and uticonatitii-•
Member was transgreseitii the rules and forms of the
tionally, in erasing her Majesty's name from the Li.;
111/USC. Hl. was Ulm ing %tithed notice fur ductlineets ;avec ; if, outthe other hand, Rosy were in possessiow!
which nobody understeoli. If the Honorable Me is- of ;hem where was the rause of an boar's delay
her thought there was any reluctant eon his (Lord C. a) 'flue SOLICITOR-41F.NERA I, lertsged to oiler a few
part to produce those document-, he was snitch mis- observations upon this question. His Honourable anil.
sal,eii ; so far from it, t•lat his only objection has as • L eirined Friend must have known that the name !of her
mild not horve bees excluded from she Liturgy i
to the time and manner of makino the motion. Ile • Majesty c
* , without an express Order in Connell to that effect. . 'lle ;
Fut it to the House whether the country was lily I} l'otincil enlist of course have read the documents whirls
to improve from the late reformations which had taken authorised them to make sorb ate order. lie should
place in tine form of making motions in Parlietnteit.— vote fur the previous question, a, siii:l.ient ground had.
(A laughs.)—lie was sorry that the inflitence of a err- not been made nut, either for the present serenity of ,
toils Gentleman on the other side ...as nut exerted.— the 'seniors or fur the stigma which was attest:pled to hr
his M,,jest•, 's ministers.
(Loud Inueleing on the Opposition ei.le)—to prevent ; casirnP;n...tittA.ori, ;0 • • - te:_
leerve.l, that it a to )Sash.
illations ulsiels only tended teremeltt eilmoottr. For Gish that these doioninenta wi•re nere• • ity to consider whe-1
part he was nut aware in what office the informatioa I timer the „,.I„iion „f In .1. 11 1
~611JC.1IL 'l% name from the Li- ;
ullcil fin by the Honorable Alentinen• could be lotted. torgy wit-, Ise. WWI id 111.! ..;1r legally, but constitalloVel
Ile hail no means of judging preeitelv at that moment . ally, and ni ids oroprict.. ,•,r, NA. That was to he die-
whether he ought or ought not to I.lmetir in the nes- cusses! e. !why in,:ep. ii•i••• i of the dry question of law.
lien. Under those eiremnstancen, lie I,,,iwa the ~,o. ' The ealeind of delay ••q as not a sufficient realms, for his
t
lion would he for the present A. ithdrie ii.—( :ci, no.) Learned Friend (‘lr. II eulierell) o withdraw his motion.
For Isis neva part, he believe I tli . whole of these do.
1f it was good for any thing it it mild en to postpone entnents (-mill le• lir/Tat...A ill the 'muse of one morning.
the motion which stood fur Friday—it would operate Mr. Serjeent o.Ssia 1I1•. aldinuEh he thought it
a. an absolute bar Wit. If the motion was not 'sill,- would Is ive been better not tie have introduced the am-
drawn he felt himself under the necesaiti of moviug Gon at the present moment, still contended that as it
the play; Ur
; hail aloe heels discussed nearly an hour and ten minutes, ,
creation.
;or. lc RA ni(71151. seconded the A Tneinhneo. ' be thought it shotild be acceded to. The information
• sought f ir, iron' the proilnetion of three 16ettittellta.
' Mr. TI ERN EY said, that as far as he untletnestil the •
teas st necessary. It
return.! to a subject, en which
Noble Lord, he had no objection to the Hon. and Leant-Sievery man must admit the i•otintry was at this moment
ell Member's motion, but only to the Gni. of mak- !fatally convii:stel—(lnear, hear, hear !). lie wishes! time
ing 'it- It was most extraordinary that any objection • 'sense to consider hoe the retinal of any motion for in-'
as ha time shetild lie made, when the documents moved formation would, under such eircionstarees, be received
fee were those npon which the exclusion of her Ma- 1 wit of doors. To supply the Necessary information, lee
! 'multi then vote for nit :motion of his Learned Ft herd
jestv's name from the Liturgy had been founded ;
nut ; 'glint he plerleerl hiaisel cur. rot ther.ileterioined as lie was,
the Noble Lord had no idea is here those doeutiwnts
so help him God, to discuss the question to which it
could be .funnel. if that was the case, lee 51""1."I wish • referred, as a great legal question, whistle divested of
to know e".ere the Noble Lord had laid hit lingers all political bias.
upon them, when the Order in Council was made for ! 'rise CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER fully
' concurred in the observation of the. Learned Sedalia
excluding her Majesty's name from the Liturgy--
(Ilean, hear!)—lle would not have added anoilier ' who last addressed the House—an observation on which
eaery Member, he trusted, worldfeel it his ditty to act,
word, were it not for an observation which had been namely, that the question to which the present motion
made by the Noble Lord (Castlereagh) over the I`.3Y. i . referred, should be discussed as one of Constitutional
his Lordship expressed a wish that he (Mr. Tierney)• tee without reference to party or partiality. Ilut,
would exercise his infliteuce in preventite.r; certain . though he armed most fully with bins in that feeling,
motions from being made. What did the Noble Lord •be still umst consider the present a must improper time
swan by this? Did bit Lordship think. that lie (Mr. 1, for each a motion, calculated as it was to anticipate the
1 iertiey) could have the impudence, even it lie ha i , Idisentssion of that grave consideration.
Ilse House then divided on the previous question—
the inclination. to say to any Honourable Member that Axes 2nto
surfs a motion should or should not be made ? The i Noes lnn

Noble Lord indeed knew what his influence IV:IS at
his uon side of the House; he could turn round to
any ul his party and say, "Sir, yon hold such a
place, and you shall lose it if you do not do so and
P laughing.)—But did the Noble Lord ima-
gine that by (Mr. T.) could do thi,?
Lord CASTLEREAUH rose to explain amidst lowsd
• cries of spoke, spoke."
311.11'ETHER ELL said, that her Majesty's name had
been exclasle,i front the Liturgy by an Order in Coun-
cil of the 12th Febrtilrv, 12420. He presumed that
the Noble Lord and the rest of the Council had read
the documents fur which he moved before they made
"tido order. If the Noble Lord said that the thing
was done unadvisedly (and unadvisedly lie believed it
was dour) it he meant to say that a Fen nits at oiler
Ceawii across her Majesty's name without reference
t.i the usage of former times, what a severe erasure
did be pronounce upon his colleagues iu other.
Mr. B. BATIICRST ruse, amidst cries of "
tion.'"f he Right lion. Member was proceeding to
address tie House when—
Mr. HOME rose to order. The Right Honourable
Member (Mr: Bathurst) was about to address the
Howe, and, of course, as a Member of that House.
Now, since Parliament had been prorogued. that Right
lion. Member bad been promoted to a high office, BO
it- (Mt. Hume) was not aware that he had, since his
pronsueluni, been re-elected as a Member of that Hoes*.
. 'lsht conceit*. that the acceptance of an awe of 1140".
Wyear was, ender the act of Parliament, s just graded
"coin a seat in Parliament. Ile awl others were

LTF:g

••• ....i••• ........

trintnathi, to give a stimulus to that chitalry which de-
lighted ra the plumed steed and polished armour. It
may be 'hill, linereeer, fur a Prince to estimate dilly all
the 'lle of inch a Collf•O before he entered on a war.
In defy Ile
net there was no alternative but. perm:-
verancaintler 'eery peril, ur submission pith degrada-
tion. if a Monarch should hare gloriously adopted the
former course ; if he should le .v done all that the safety
aniPiglory of his people should have required, it was nu
small drawback that mold-cancel such an ebb motion.—
(Hear, hear, hear?)—But what if it should appear that
at the moue time it was endeavoured to dispel the evils
of ignorance, to extend instruction, is here ignorance be-
fore prevailed, and that too frequently the um springs
of knowledge ware endeavoured to be poisoned at their
source, " That was the unkindest col of all." Ile ass
reminded of the lines of the Poet, when he expreaaed the
keea pangs of the bird, wounded by the arrow, feathered
from his owe wing
o His was the lot, a teener pans to feel,
Ile parsed tae pinion that could hear the stee'."
It was no new thing for slander to arraign all that was
high awl sokadn in the land. But it remained for the
present times to see the extent to which it wonld pro-
ceed. The venerable institutions of the countrY may for
a time repel ha approach--Blasplarmy way be repulses,
from tit:actuary of the tesnple, but the effect of such
p_tibli tien, unless repressed, the ruin touilsolat
arlaat.—(llear,isear!)—The same shows, same pa-
grains, that characterised the present day, n-ere those of
stir las: year. The music, the march, and the banner,
were the order of that period. The same kind of meet-
itios, proceeding from the same origin, and profeasiog
the same I.:Amato tendency ; with this difference, that
the dermaciations of the last year were against
tLe Aristocraty—of the present, against the ( ro n
But that voice of (labour was wed kown ; it was the
saute cry that called in- a Reform. which they' at the
sante time odnaitttel to be iinprac:icahle ; it use the cry
which refused that-protection to the agricialtitval interest,
under which alone the agricultural laboutrr was. eu-i
shied to obtain his daily bread. It aasby a firm 444
of resistance that such clamour was before repressed:
whenever it reappeared, activity was a slut'; and the
supineness of loyalty was cowardice. After continnitax
this straits awhile, and • then advertina to the several
topics in his Majesty's speech, the lloranarable tienth.-
mass combatted by moving, that an innuhle .Valiess he
presented to the king, tbauking his Majesty for his gr.--
dons condescension and fur the cononeddication :un
tained in his speech to Partisans,.
The Address was then read, which was, as usual, an
echo of the speech.
Sale Illt4lllM, the *swedes of the Address, time rose.
lie brie in a tone of voice quite inaudible, and it ices
only at Sidereal% that we could eutch his sue:suing. At
first lie laboured nosier considerable etubarrasstnant, but
WAS eticour.tgesl hy the House, anal enabled to proceed,
though net with petifect confidence. As we uuderstood
the !hoe tient lentafelie called the attention of the House
to the different shapes in which party had lately appear-
el, to the manifest danger et all that was accost vssitothle
ist society. lie would set wish to dwell on acet:es which
such fartinus feelings bad produced; but be hailed their
teratinatiott would hare a salutary elect ou duo's a Sao
ha i been led RlThy, by the prevalence of false principles,
ta lend their aid to mischievous projects. Ile could' not
imaging on what aronnds any opposition conk' be offer-
ed! to elle present Address. ilse:e was one national to-
Pic introduced by the address, which Hilt of sn mull lo-
ftiest, that though he might be accused of going- out of
the course in nte.stimainr 41, still he could not refrain
trimi noticing it hrictly. BY Dove• strange infatuation,
the business of Irclatq,.lll &sal House, was raceittal ei-
ther' wites/111klitainees„ orat moat, decided after very
short consnltatioos. That country had suffered ouch—
:Intl what hail been her contlnct &Avg the late procecal-
i.l go It had been most (mitt and orderly. Not even
tee most furious demagogue had raised his Yoke to apt
p!aaal the scenes that were acting in this country.—
( Hear. hear.)—The most distant attetept had sot yet
been made to introduce to that coontrythe new doctrine
—that of allowing to femaleosanocra in the suited king-
dom the mow liceiete and latitude that were permitted
in foreign lands.—(Langliter and hisses4—lt was nut
necessary for him to quote various anthem% to show that
national debauchery and national ruin wyntihand in
hear.)—lle would pursue the subject nu
fruitier. He sincerely Impel! Ministers would adopt a
'ours? of measures beneficial to the country, and worthy
of the great glories they hail achieved fur the nation by
the firmness and vigour of their councils.
The question bring put from the Chair,
Mr. Cl RIVEN rose, and admitted with the Mover
and !Seconder of the Address, that tha Speech from
th- 'throne did not contain any topic on which diets
conA be any material difference of opinion; but al-
though what it contained was not likely to provoke
discussion, yet lie could not hut remark upon what it
heal omitted. When he looked to the state of agri-
cailtdire—(Hear, hear !)—lie would ask, conk' the
Noble Lord hi really ignorant that the agricultural
interests were in sn'wretched a condition, that even
no abatement would after some tune induce the culti-
vators of the land to go on with their labours' This
being the case, he was sorry to find that the Crown
on tine present occasion had not express-al one solitary
feeling of regret for the fallen prosperity of agricul-
ture, ant' the ruin of the spirited and har•iy race,
whose labours had previously placed it in so flourish-
ing a condition (Loud cries of hear.)—He coati'
d not tell why this topic had been passed over ; he did
j not speak of it as an irritating subject, nor did he wish
Majority of ito recal the events of past times. He had loug ago
den our re-admission into the Gallery, see found
told Ministers that they were leading the coulary t
Mr. WETHERELL on his legs, giving notice of dais, ruin, and he saw that their measures were so partial
intention to renew his motion on to- row•
and confined, that in avoiding one evil they necessa-
The rlandleatine Outlawry Rill was then read a first
time pro forma. rily fell into anothar. Deeply did he lament, that
KING'S SPEF.(II. ',mho' after session should be suffered to ;bass without
The SPEAKEIt than reai his :Majesty's Speech, for . any attempt to discover a real and effectual remedy to
which ride Corals. J such a state of things, yet he still hoped that it was
Mr. B.tSKES said, that in proposing an Address to
gone for that remedy to be app
et
which the House had some boors past heard from the lied. The
his Majesty in acknowledgment for that gracious Speedo i too .far
Hon. Itentleman then adverted to the subject of Re-
Throne, and which, at last, it had the opportunity of form is Parliament; he stated that a temperate Reform;
taking into consideration, it was not his intention- to such a Reform as would make that House be respected
trespass on the attention of the Home at any nnneces- b; the people, and further he would not go, was es-
say Ivy .el , sential to the re-establishment of internal peace, and
sary length. As one of his Majesty s many,
and devoted subjects, be raw g.eneral rotitidence and prosperity. As to Ministers,
gal emotion,. should approachtrairsTrar'soeneilluaittlitilsanfalatd."- s:
had fully proved their inability to govern ; never
dress, conveying, in the language of sincerity sina affect IneY
lino, the loyalty of • people sound at heart, of a peoplee; was the community so universally impressed with the
who, after the most successful triumphs of national re i-convietion of the incapacity of their responible rulers,
uown during a long war, were not by that peace, which : ea at the present moment ; so general was that feeling
those triumphs prornred, so lulled into a
PhiernAtic I that all 'auks of men looked to their removal as their
de
apathy as to visit with iogratitu thee Sovereign, 'tinier only hope. Even the Loyal Addressers could not ap-
whose sway tboae deeds of renown were achieved, and eof the conduct of Administration. It was La-
p
Ithe blessings of peace established. Folly may, no doubt,:
ossible that the country could go on and pay the
j discharge its debt to such a Monarch by ingratitude;
' whilst the spirit of mischief, incapable of pnv gratitude, enormous taxes with which it was burtheneti ; how,
would renew its hostility against the power that defeat. 4 indeed, could it be erpeeted, that with au iucome so
! h., malignant designs. and endeavour to &smelt the decreased, catch au overgrown system of taxation could
L tranquillity of the p'ace'maker. In war, shat spirit was ahe discharged ? The Hon. Member cunciuded by
seen anxiunslor diameter, with all its hone) Lent on evil
tepeating his ea:-nest wish, that the agricultural state
In peace, the„eame spltit wit. to Id' travel' More& acrr•
!baud
sad
reatigaiii..pnwancisorthenuriusia dolomitic, qf `of the
, _u_ry would be seri onsly takes into consider-
! earth," seeking to disturb and to destroy. Renown in at'ob•
iota was too likely to create a restless desire for ribllY I Mr. TIERNEY observed, that he did not intend to j