The Liverpool Standard and General Commercial Advertiser.
Liverpool, Merseyside, England, 1833-03-05 00:00:00

THE LIVERPOOL STiiNDARD

• not think that the small farmer in general made anything like
. that, nor had it, he dared to say, come into their heads to cal-
culate. He meant to represent this as the general state of the
farmers of 10 or 15 acres, who have a greater proportion cer-
tainly. The examination of Mr. Walsh proceeded as follows,:.
[Here the right hon. baronet read extracts from the evidence
of that gentleman.] He never would admit that it was fair or
just to hold up the clergy as the chief cause of the evils of Ire-
land, particularly in a place from which by law they were ex-
eluded. This was not the place where it was either generous
or just to exhibit the clergy, as victims of popular clamour and
spoliation. But, passing from this topic, he admitted that some
suggestions had been made on the subject of measures to be
adopted for Ireland, which deserved the best attention of, the
house.:. With reference. to poor laws—with every desire to at'-
. ford relief—he confessed that he was one of those who were
checked in their progress by A fear of extinguishing property
and adopting a, complete agrarian law. (Hear, heat.) How-
• ever, he did not say, that such a modification of the poor laws
as would confine relief to cases of extreme distressnnd destitu-
tion might not. be, resorted to With safety; but he felt that this
was not the time to pronounce an opinion on the subject. He
almost feared that the description of the. Roman historian was
applicable to the race of poor-laws in Ireland, and that it might
be justly said; "Ad hmc tempora, quibus nec vitia •nostra net
remedia pati possumusi preventum est." But leaving that sub-
ject, this he must say, that howeVer they might talk of adopt-
ing healing measures, andnotwithstanding they might .hope to
conciliate potverful parties by concessions, Parliament would
gainnothiug by giving way to popular clamour, or yielding
one single point beyond that which their sense of justice die,
tated. ' (Hear.) If ministers established pyinciples leading to
future confiscation, they might be cheered in that house by th-
voices of many around them, but not only would they .fail to
procuie additional security for life, and, peace, and propertye
but so farfrom.satisfyings their deluded countrymen, they would
only, whet their appetites for further rapine. (Cheers.) He
shouid vote for this measure, but he accepted it as no compro-
mise on any subject: He voted for it on his own principle, and
would consider whatever measures should be presented on their
PrinciP4 If ever there was. a country in which it was esaeu-
tial jealously to uphold the rights and properties of all classes
With nview to the preservation of Order, the maintenance of
peace, and the protection of life, :it was that country now un ,
happily so disturbed. 'Therefore, in answer to the argument
that this measure' offered no permanent remedy, he at once ad-
mitted the fact, but contendedthat a suspeusion of the reigning.
disorder was necessary, in order to leave the legislature at li-
berty, and afford it an opportunity to try an effectual remedy;
He wished only to take the leadine-arguments against the bill,
passing without notice all the rubbish with which gentlemen
had filled up the interstices of their arguMents. (Laughter.)
Such were appeals of this kind—" Was this measure the proof
Which ministers gave of their_ gratitude to Ireland ? • Was this
the gratitude of the Legislature for the assistance received
from Ireland on the Ream Bill?" As to the latter appeal. it
could „not be supposed to produce much effect upon him who
. had opposed Reform. Still he admitted that he should be
quite as base as those charged with ingratitude, if he consented .
to apply a law which was,not necessary for.the tranquillization
of Ireland.. But this was ,no question of gratitude or ingrati- .
tulle: The' liberties of a country were not to be complimented
away. The question was, did the state of Ireland require such
ameasure ? If it did, what room was there to talk of grati-
tude ? It was simply a measure of necessity. Parliament was
to determine whether bands of armed ruffians were to be per-
mitted to break- open houses by night, to plunder arms, to in-
jure property, to destroy life, as if some proclamation of mur-
der had lasen issued, and-liberty of rapine end destruction were
established. It had been said that this was a suspension of the
British constitution. He admitted that it was a measure cf
severity, of intolerable e ;erity, unless there was a paramount
necessity for it; he admitted that but he denied that this was
a suspension of the British constitution. He said that the
British constitution, in many parts of that country, as described
by Dr. Joy, by Baron Smith, by the Rev. Mr. O'Connor, had
bZ;en long ago. gone. He saw a ghastly form that called itself
the British constitution. What was the British constitution? It

was not 'a form of jurisprudence intended to give impunity to
crime. The British constitution pre-supposed the existence
of institutions and implements which could be employed for
the protection of life and property. The British constitution
. never supposed that the doctrine of passive resistance would be
resorted to by any man as an aulhoiity for the purpose of
depriving others of their rights. When acts like these went
unpunished, when they were triumphant, do not let any 'man
say that this was a suspension of. the British constitution.
(Hear.) All that form was gone while such a state of things
existed. ' It was a cruelty, it was a mockery to talk of its being
a suspension of the British constitution. Could any man have
the barbarity to go to the family of Mr. Houston, and tell them
that lm Sell by the British constitution ? (Cheers.) Mr. Ma-
rlins waitinurdered in his .own house. Was it not a mockery
to talk of the British constitution and -of Lord Chatham to the
widow of Mr. Martini, after she had seen her house entered,
and her husband murdered in the middle of the day ? Talk of
the British constitution ! It was ills impunity of guilt (hear,)
which was perpetrated under the shield of the I3inish constitu-
tion, which was degraded by being thus sent, as it were, on a
forlorn hope. He was reconciled to the suppolt of this bill,
because he 'consulted the honour of the British constitution in
endeavouring to prevent the odium of these ati °cities being
cast upon it. (Hear.) But it had been said, would England
tolerate this law ?' He asked, would England tolerate the
state of things which existed in Ireland? (Hear.) He would
tell them- that England, rather than submit to such a state of
things, would submit to new laws; and Ireland would have
cause for gratitude for the kindness and protection is hich this
bill afforded her. The measure had two objects in view, and
one of the main objections to it was that it had -only two
objects. The first object for which it provided, and which ex-
tended to the whole of-- Ireland, was to prevent every species
of political agitation; the other Object was to prevent those
insurrectionary..psoceedings called agrarian disturbances. The
objection was that political agitation was unconnected with in-
surrccti9ns in Ireland, and that it was unnecessary and unjust
that there should be precautions taken against political agita-
tion. He would make no personal applications, but this he
said that he would •-not vote for a law. which should arrest the
ignorant and dehided offenders, unless it laid its interdict upon
the system which encouraged and incited Ahern. (Hear.)
This was the most important part of the measure. It
would be unjust to *limit the law to a number of wretched
Whitefeet, whilst it made DP attempt to prevent the proximate
cause of insurrection. He could see no justice in au tiet
which punished the deluded conspirators, if it did not take,
some precautions against the system of political agitation.
There were great fallacies on this part of the subject. The
argument was this—that there were two matters, political
agitation and insurrectionary violence, but that hey were
altogether unconnected;' that the system of political agitation
—he spoke of system in the abstract—was not connected with
the insurrections. He should tiy to draw the line between the
truth and the mistake. There were occasions when the objects
of the two were disunited; yet for a certain distance they
travelled' the same road, and political agitation undoubtedly
so far counteracted insurrectionary violence, when instil section
ary violence defeated the object of political agitation. (Cheers.)
He admitted that there had berm most laudable and praise-
worthy exhortations to tranquillity, sobriety, and order.
Ile gave no credit to these artful declarations; It was the cun-
ning of the serpent (hear,) that issued declarations of that kind;
and he would prove to the satisfaction of the house, that at
other periods, when there was peace in Ireland, we were
treading on the edge of an abyss, and that to confide in the
profesSions of temperance and of obedience to the laws em-
ployed to cover mischievous intentions, was not the way to en-
sure. the salvation of government. He could not admit that
political agitation was an ally of government; for the time
would ,arrive when it would separate from government,- and
turrs'against its deserted ally. He granted that there had been
associations in Ireland which had maintained tranquility and
made the stormy waves of discontent subside. But should that
diminish his apprehension ? He could imagine no state of
things more formidable, than that the tranquillity of a country
should depend upon the existence of such au agent, for the
time. would arrive in Which that same political agitation, which
could perform the miracle of calming the passions of a discon-
tented people, could perform the much smaller miracle of con-
verting calmness to .disorder. (Cheers.) All he contended
was that the counselling of peace and repressing disorder were
no real proofs of the absence of evil intention, and ought not to
reconcile us to the .existence of political agitation. (Hear.)
It had been said over and over again, that spies were. sent out by
government for the purpose of holding intemperate language
theniselves, in order that they might urge the people to violence.
He (Sir R. Peel) had, some years ago,been connected with the
government of Ireland, and he had not the slightest cognizance
or connexion with the employing of spies ; and he sincerely
thought that a government which relied on such resources was
as justly an object of ridicule as of execration. (Hear.) This,
however, had been the story for the last fiftyl years in Ireland,
and on his conscience he believed no story was ever more false.
(Hear.) - There was another circumstance referred to in the re-
port. In the early part of MS there had been a great seizure
of persons. On one, of the name of Edward Grattan, a thousand
papers, were found, which were copies of an address to the-United
,Irishmen so remarkably-decorous and proper; that it was like a
sermon. • Itexhorted them to peace and sobriety, to refrain front
all kinds- of violence, to be patient and submissive; it stated that

237

the taking away arms by force from houses would be productive
of great evil, and that if any man was sent to prison for this of-
fence, he would not be maintained by the society. If this had
been the only paper found upon Mr. Edward Grattan, he might
have been regarded as an apostle of peace; but, unfortunately;
there were other Tapers, amongst which were three oaths, ore`
for a private, one for a sergeant, and one for an officer. The
sergeant's oath was to the effect that he would implicitly obey his
superior officer and no one else. Besides these oaths, there was".
a return of the 'number of united Irishmen iu thirteen towns of
Ireland. The return gave 111,300 men, 6000 horses, 1000 pikes,
besides bayonets, powder and balls. Side by side, with the ex-
hortation, was this list of 111,000 men, and 1000 pikes (hear;),
and this showed:that exhortations to peace and sobriety may be
very consistent with the exertion of a moral' influence over large
bodies of men to purposes of mischief. Bat he asked any man,
who knew the state of the country, whether he believed there
could be a system of political agitation there, without a•predis-
position to insurrection. How could that system otherwise find
support and pabulum Y The time would come when some great•
question, like Catholic emancipation, would be to be settlhd in
Parliament ; and be denied that the system could keep the corgi-.
try permanently in subjection. This was all he thought it neces-
sary to say asto the principle of the measure. The question thdn
was, whether he should vote for the introduction of the new law,
or arrangelimself under the banners of the right hon. gentleman
(Mr.
on his tna
constitution,nnYdsa:rudo'
r)t hw,e,i,ißmoroihttialsdoh eloarfNeve,
oct erTddrhei
aai sit
death
standard dard on this occasion.
(Reiterated laughter.) If the right hon. gentleman had depicted
thing of an inspiriting kind, he might hayeuif'b.t)he
But-when he exhibited so unromantic a motto'" that the
been
e:ehBmatcilptbneedde btnoyai not hi:
bin be read a first time this day fortnight" (laughter)--a-when he
merely said " tarry awhile" (laughter)—'` let us wait another
fortnight",(laughter)—he must excuse him. Suppose the matter
was postponed to that time, what where they to do? TO sce
whether remedial measures would have any efiect ? (Laughter.)
Had not the right honourable gentleman a detail of the crimes
perpetrated from 18*A9 to 1832? Had no remedial measures
passed in the mean time ? There was reform (hear); there was
the extinction of tithes (Bear; ) yet these remedial measures had
had no effect, for the year. 1832 was the worst of all. Diddle
• es-
pect such a wonderful -Change in the course of a fortnight?
(Laughter.) The right hon. gentleman invited them to stand
still-for a short interval on the banks of a turbid current ("hear;"
from Mr. 'Tennyson,) and in the hope that in a few days the
stream would heless treaked or discoloured with blood. (Cheers.. )
If it was less discoloured, it would riot prove that the law was not
necessary; but if in the course of those few days murder aud ra-
- pine increased, we were depriving of protection those who were
entitled to claim it. He (Sir R. Peel) would pass the stream
whilst-there was time; he would vote for this bill, in order to
secure for the poor of Ireland that protection which the law did
not give. Let us be resolute. Let us not be suspected in Ire-
land of a want of energy and, firmness, and he would answer for
the result. The passage was practicable now; a want of reson-
tion might close it for ever. He referred those who doubted of
the policy of this course to the records of crime before them.
These were his justification for suspending the ordinary law.
How could the state of society be worse, and how could. he
think that the people of Ireland could be better off by persever-
ing in the existing law? One hundred and ninety-four murg
ders ! Why, great battles had been gained, great victories had
been achieved by this country, at a less expense of human blood.
(Hear, hear.) The battle of St. Vincent had been gained at
less cost of life (hear); the sanguinary bombardment of Algiers
had caused less loss of life (hear) ; we had rolled back the im-
ietuous tide of French exultation and hope at the battle of
usaco with less expense of human life. (Hear.) There was
something animating in the idea of a battle ; but, good Gorr,
what horrid recollections haunted the mind which had witnessed
a murder. Would the house bear with him while he mentioned
one fact for the purpose of showing how feeble an idea was con-
veyed of the distracted state of society in Ii eland, when it rested
even upon the number of individual instances of murder? It
would serve to show the fearful anxiety, the extremity of moral
suffering, which for weeks and months previously to assassina-
tion haunted the victims of outrage. How many, alas! had
been compelled, in consequence of receiving notices of their in-
tended assassination, to fly far from the scenes which associa-
tion had endeared to them, or submit to pay the forfeit of their
obstinate attachment by their lives! The fact he was about. to
mention would serve also to prove what extraordinary energies
the human mind, even as it exists in the lowest grades of So'
cicty, is capable of when the immediate prospect of death is
presented to it. He recollected a man, a resident in the county
of Clare,_ who came to Dublin for the purpose c. f giving him
(Sir R. Peel) information respecting the perpetrators of a cer-
tain outrage. Now, that man, though he was fully convinced
that he was maiked out for the vengeance of the friends of the
person he had been the means of bringing to justice, yet the
stone. desire he felt of revisiting his native spot, and embracing,
his wife and child, overcame every consideration of peiscuat
security. 'lle (Sir R. P.) knew the man's- danger, and earnestly
advised him nut to go. His advice, however, was not accepted,
and some weeks after the man had taken up his abode with his
family, an attack was made upon his house be nine or eleven
men, who, after much deliberation, had come with the deadly
determination of immolating their innocent victim, who, 'after
so many weeks of impunity had begun to flatter himself with
the idea that the clanger was averted, and that " he might
at length rest in security. How vain were his anticipations!
They attacked the house while he was asleep; they broke -open
the door, called out the man—they murdered him with pitch-
forks! and this bloody work did they perpetrate in the hearing'
of his wife and child, a child only nine years of age ! Now,
let the house mark what he was about to relate.- While her hus-
band was yet in the struggles of death, the mother took the
child, and, placing. it in a recess by the fire-place, she said:—
such was her heroic fortitude—such her almost incredible self-
possession, even with the frightful cries of her expiring husband
ringing in her ears—she said to the infant:—" You- hear the
cries of your dying father. I shall certainly be the next victim.
When they have murdered him, they will murder me too; but
I will struggle with them as long as I am able in order to give
you time to do what I place you here for. My last act shall be
to put this lighted turf upon the hearth. Do you, by its glare,
-mark the faces of the murderers. Mind you watch them nar-
rowly, that you may know and be able to tell who they are,
and so avenge the cruel death of your parents." (It is impos-
sible to describe the sensation which this narration produced
upon the house.) As the unhappy woman said, so it fell oat.
The butchers, after completing their bloody work upon- the
man, barbarously murdered the worhan also. After a short but
unsuccessful struggle with the ruthless miscreants, she was
dragged from the cottage, and inhumanly slain upon the
bleeding body of her husband. But the child had carefully
obeyed the last injunctions of its mother,—had closely scannea
the faces of the murderers,—was able to identify them,-,--and
by the evidence of that child, corroborated by other evidence,
five of the wretches who committed this horrid deed were con-
victed and hanged within a month after the perpetration of the.
crime. (A burst of applause.) That child was for some
ears afterwards under his [Sir R. Peel's] protection. (Cheers.)
hat, then, he would ask, were the consequences of the
existence of such a state of society ? Why, that all law must
be
,paralyzed where- scenes such as he had described pros
veiled, and every moral restraint must be at an end. •In
Ireland the horror which in every other country attends the
perpetration of murder seemed almost extinct. They had
heard, in the figurative language of eloquence, of the most
inanimate parts of nature being moved at horrible crimes ; but
even those feelings of superstition which often led to the detec-
tion of murder appeared to have little or no effect in Ireland.
All moral checks—all restraints were removed. Could it, then,
be denied that some measure like that introduced by his Majes-
ty's ministers was not necessary for personal security in Ire,-
land ? ( Hear, hear.) It had been asked by what means was
evidence to be procured ? He would answer by restoring per-
sonal security. It had been asked how would the courts-mar-
tial b 6 able to procure it? By changing, he would answer, the
relative position of the two parties. When the energy displayed
by the government began to strike terror into cowardly hearts
—when the innocent man began to feel assurance and courage,
then, indeed, the political atmosphere might be said to have
undergonc.a change; the relative position of' the-parties, he re-
peated, would he altered, the one receiving an accession of con-
fidence, the other a feeling of depression. (Hear, hear.) Now,
if under the present circumstances of the country, the govern-
ment refused to art with due energy, what would be the conse-
quence ?—what the alternative ? -One universal chaos of sh-
day, in which the very foundations of civil life would be sub-
verted, every rule of moral justice reversed, no punishment ex-
cept for the Innocent no security but for triumphant crime.
('I he right hon, baronet sat down amidst the loudest cheers,
which lasted for several,minutes.)
Mr. RUTHVEN moved an adjournment, which, after some dig-
cussion, was agreed to.