The Liverpool Standard and General Commercial Advertiser.
Liverpool, Merseyside, England, 1843-04-28 00:00:00

PRIVILEGE.

Mr. JAMES LAWRENCE, after reading and pointing out
some inaccuracies in a statement which had appeared in a
leading article in the Albion concerning him, said he wished
to explain what had fallen from him at the last council.
The MAYOR said Mr. Lawrence bad used the word " jus-
tification " at the
.last meeting, or he would have been al-
lowed to explain.
Mr. JAMES LAWRENCE thought he had then said he
wished to explain. With reference to the officers, he was
willing to admit that Dutton had an excellent character on
the books of the committee; the reason for his (Mr. Law-
rence's) observation was, that he, had made a statement be-
fore the committee, which he a few minutes afterwards de-
nied having made.

After a few observations from Mr. BIRKETT and Mr
THORNHILL, the subject dropped:

SALE OF THE HOUSES IN BANOVEIt.-STREET

Mr. EARLE brought forward the following motion, of
which he had given notice :—•' That it is not expedient to
dispose of the houses in Hanover-street, which were with-
drawn from the public sale of the 15th instant, as the pos-
session of them by the Corporation appears to afford a fa-
vourable opportunity for abating certain nuisances in that
part of the town, for the general remedy of which clauses
have been introduced into two acts of Parliament recently
obtained." Mr. Earle entered into a very minute statement
of the several nuisances complained of.
The motion was supported by Mr. Bramley Moore, Mr.
Samuel Holme, and Mr. Platt, and opposed by Mr. Hodg-
son, Mr. G. H. Lawrence, Sir T. Brancker, and others.
Mr. Earle ultimately withdrew the motion.

LOAN OF PICTURES TO THE COLLEGIATE INSTITUTION

Mr. BUSHELL moved
Pursuant to notice, " For the loan
of the pictures in the Town-hall to the Directors of the Col-
legiate Institution during the period of the approaching mid-
summer vacation, with a view to their forming part of a poly-
technic exhibition." The Directors of the Collegiate In-
stitution were desirous to have the loan of these pictures as
a sort of nucleus of their intended exhibition at midsummer.
Twahse
onlypiet tureisioisne
in
the ctohuencdilracwhiaamgberroowmer, and, also Hiltonse not asked for : it
picture of the Crucifixion. It had been suggested that the
splendid statue of Canning should be included in the motion,
but he had not done so because the Corporation had no con-
troul whatever over it, not being their property, it having
been placed in the Town-hall by the subscribers. There
was a precedent for the motion when the use of the pictures
was granted to the Directors of the Mechanics' Institution,
and he did not anticipate any objection to the present ap-
plication.
Mr. ASPINALL seconded the motion, adding that the Di-
rectors of the Collegiate Institution would be answerable for
any expense and damage.
Mr. Alderman EVANS.—What are the pictures you want?
Mr. Busitsm..—The pictures of the Crucifixion, and those
by Shee, Lawrence, and others, of the Royal Family.
Mr. ALDERMAN EVANS.—Have you not included Sir
Thomas? _ _

Mr. S. HOLME.—No ; we have the original. (Laughter.)
It was then agreed that the pictures should be lent upon
the usual terms.

THE FIRE BILL

The Council then resolved itself into a committee for the
consideration of the Fire Bill.
The DEPUTY TOWN.CLERK read the proceedings of the
committee since the adjournment. At a meeting held on the
24th inst. at which Mr. Rowlands, architect, was present on
behalf of the parties who deemed their interest affected by
the bill, it was resolved that the following modifications in
the bill be proposed to the council :
No cellar used for the deposit of goods shall make the
building above liable to the regulations if the cellar be made
to comply with the regulations affecting it, and be arched
with brick, or the ceiling lined with sheet iron, zinc, or other
approved material.
[This modification would exempt chapels over cellars used
for goods.]
The door-frames or jambs, door-sills and beads, window-
frames and pent-houses, and also catheads (except the
sheaves, which must be of hardwood), may be of wrought or
cast iron, at the option of the party ; or, as to existing ware-
houses, may, with the exception of the pent-houses and cat-
heads, at the party's option, be lined with sheet iron, zinc,
or other approved material. But doors and window-shutters
must be of wrought iron, or, in existing warehouses, be, at
the Option of the party, lined as above mentioned. Teagle-
blocks, not being used in warehouses, to be struck out of the
bill.

The doors and door-frames or jambs, door-sills and heads,
and window-shutters and frames of a room in a warehouse,
not used as a warehouse-room or as a forwarding room,
shall be exempt from the regulations : provided that in new
warehouses no room immediately under any room used as a
warehouse room shall be exempted, unless the same shall be
arched, or the ceiling arched with sheet iron, &c.
[This would exempt offices, counting-houses, sale-rooms,
news-rooms, &c.]
Palm oil to be excepted from the list of dangerous goods.
The dangerous goods specified in the list to be allowed to
be disposed of in existing warehouses, having doors, &c.,
lined with sheet iron.

The boiling of oil, blubber, or tar, and the manufacturing
of vegetable or mineral naptha, or varnish, to be inserted in
the list of dangerous trades, with the exception, as to any
building detached by 75 feet from any other building.
At a meeting on the 25th instant, it was further resolved
that the following exemptions be proposed to the council :
Of buildings and rooms in which retail trades only shall
be carried on, such trades not being in the list of dangerous
trades ; of warehouses or rooms attached to or forming part
of buildings entirely in the same occupation, and used only
for retail trades not in the list of dangerous trades for the
purposes of which retail trades only, goods shall be deposited
in such warehouses or warehouse-rooms ; of buildings de-
tached from any other buildings not in the same occupation,
and in which manufactories only shall be carried on, such
n gs
of
committee.
manufactories not being in the list of dangerous trades; of
warehouses or rooms attached to or forming part of
entirelybuild-
s i
n any h
i lt
ottbee r occupation,
same
occupation,
and detached from
buildings and which shall be used
bythe Mr. Nicol., moved
the
only for manufactories not in the list of dangerous trades,
for the purposes of which manufactories only, goods shall be
deposited in such warehouse or rooms.
Sir
Mr. PARKER opposed the bill. lie thought the measure
was unjust to the ratepayers, because it was a mere question insured.
Mr. the insurers and the
Mr. THORNHILL said it was his intention to oppose the
confirmation rfinr°mmaitiso rjr 3ogfA thec g
proceedings
eed secondedi
additional halfpenny in the pound, proposed to be added to
the Fire-police rate.
Some allusion having been made to the Water Bill,
Mr. ASPINALL said A
deratuni that
. a constant and abundant supply
of water was the great ..es, This had been experi-
enced in numerous cases iu this town. At the fire on Satur-
day night last, at Messrs. Robinson and Co.'s premises, it
fortunately happened that there was a tank of water on the
premises, or the whole stack of warehouses would have been
destroyed. With prompt supplies of water, none of the
recent great fires in this town would have attained any meg-
uitude.

r. HoLme answered at some length the arguments urged
egain*t the bill.

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propLaly the town, mid big() (30[M:bring tlio sliGet time the
hill had been btfore the itihabitants, it should he withdrawn
for the present session, but that the council was of opinion
that at present the town is not sufficiently supplied with
water.
.\lr. KILSHAW Seconded the amendment.
_ _

Mr. Bit ANt LEY MoonE opposed the bill as distressing and
arbitrary, and urged the necessity of delay, in order that the
town might have an opportunity of judging of it.
Mr. G. Fl. LAWRENCE expressed similar opinions, but
was afraid the Paving-board would also withdraw their bill.
Mr. J. HoLatEs said there was no such intention. The
Water Bill would proceed under any circumstances.
Mr. G. H. LAWRENCE proceeded to say that the fault was
in the bad regulations of the present warehouses, and the re-
medy would be in building warehouses round the docks,
which were the proper places for them, and the only places
of safety.

Mr. EARLE said the great requirement was water. The
bill imposed great hardships and offered no commensurate
good. The regulations were not the cause of the evil, for
all the (treat fires had originated not in the warehouses but in
the buildings adjoining.
A conversation ensued on the subject of the effect of giving
up the Fire Bill for the present. It was again stated that the
Water 13111 would be persevered in, and that it had been read
a second time and would go into committee on the 11th May.
It was intended to use fresh water, though power would be
given to use any water, salt or fresh. The Town-clerk ex-
plained, that if the Fire Bill were postponed, it would be
necessary for the council to give their assent to the water
clauses. But if the bill provided that the council should pay
£5OO a-year for the water, it was necessary to have a pro-
vision to enable them to lay a rate of a halfpenny in the
pound to meet that payment. It was stated by several
members of the 'Watch Committee, that the present rate of
a halfpenny in the pound would be more than sufficient, as
they had a surplus sif £2500 in hand over their expenditure.
Mr. Lloyd's amendment was pat, when there appeared—
For the amendment..
Against it ...

Majority.

The following is the division

For the amendtnent.—Councillors : Isaac Holmes, Thorn-
hill, Copeland, Thompson, North, H. Holmes, Hornby, J.
Holmes, Aspinall, J. Lawrence, Wood, Procter, Lloyd, Kil-
shaw, Parker, Brassey, Plumpton, Lace, Platt, Sheppard,
Harbord ; Aldermen : Houghton, Earle, Freme, Crook,
Bramley-Moore, Evans.-27.
Agaitut it.—Councillors : Shand, Hodgson, Aikin, S.
Holme, Birkett, G. H. Lawrence, Trotman, Smith; Alder-
men : Bulley, Brancker, Turner, Holt, Nicol, Molyneux,
Moon, and the Mayor.-16.
The council proceeded to the consideration of the clauses
of the Water Bill, and Mr. BIRKETT, seconded by Mr.
EARLE, moved that the clauses be adopted.—Carried.

BREWERS AND SPIRIT DEALERS ON THE WATCH

COMMITTEE

Mr. EARLE was about to bring forward his motion on this
subject, when, being past three o'clock,
Mr. G. 11. LAWRENCE suggested that it should be post-
poned, urging that at that late hour it would be impossible
to do jultice to the subject.
Mr. Alderman EARLE said he had been called on by the
Mayor, and he regarded this interruption as an unworthy
attempt to stifle what he (Mr. Earle) was determined should
go abroad.
Mr. G. 11. LAWRENCE.—Then you should have a special
council for the purpose.
Mr. Alderman EartLE.—l disapprove highly of what the
Chairman of the Finance Committee says : the Chairman of
the Finance Committee is " I, I, I," upon every occasion ;
and it is really setting every body else in this council practi-
cally at nought. I must protest against this sort of thing—
Mr. G. H. LAWRENCE.-1 do not know that I have said
" I, I, 1 ;" but go on, if you like.
Mr. Alderman EARLE then said, it was upon public
grounds alone that he had put this motion upon the paper,
for he had had no personal feeling whatever upon the subject.
(Hear, hear.). Mr. Hodgson might sneer, but he (Mr. Earle)
would give the council his honour that it was so. (Hear.)
The MNYon thought that Mr. Alderman Earle's assurance
should be received.

Mr. Alderman E'Astr.E.—And very• likely, with the excep-
tion of Mr. Hodgson, it would be.
Mr. HoousoN.7-We shall hear that by and bye. _

Mr. Alderman EARLE.—I have no wish to hear any thing
from you. (Order, order.) He must now request the Deputy
Town. clerk to read certain acts of parliament of which he
had a list.
The DEPUTY TOWN-CLERK then read them.
Mr. Alderman EARLE then said he had desired these acts
of Parliament to be read, in order to :thew, as they had all
seen the notice he had put on the paper, bow jealous the le-
gislature was of persons acting as justices in matters where
their private interests were likely to interfere with their pub-
lic duty. It was quite impossible that any man could stand
altogether independent of private feeling ; he accused no man
with doing wrong, but he contended they ought not to be
placed in such a position. He dared say that he (Mr. Earle)
should act as any other gentleman would under similar cir-
cumstances ; and therefore he thought it an act of propriety
on the part of the Council not to place gentlemen so situated
upon the Watch Committee, and of delicacy on their part not
to seek for those situations. At the last Council he made
some remarks about Mr. James Lawrence, which, he dared
say, were incorrect, and that he had no tenants in public
houses; but it was very well known to the magistrates that
gentlemen in that business (and he wished he was doily, such
a good business himself,) were the owners of public-houses.
At least they were in the habit of giving notice that they did
not object to the transfer of licenses. Mr. James Lawrence's
name was often brought forward in this way, and other gen-
tlemen on the committee came before the magistrates very
often, in like manner, for allowing a man to remove his li-
cense from one house to another ; and unless they were the
owners and proprietors of the houses the magistrates could
not receive it. That, then, shewed the proprietorship. It
was very clear, therefore, that the police, seeing there were
so many of these gentlemen upon the watch committee, and
their masters, would be biassed thereby ; of course, there-
fore if publicans were brought up to be fined, who were their
tenants, it must interfere with the proper discharge of their
duties, although they, no doubt had every disposition to do
so. It was not likely,—we could not expect it, that the cir-
cumstances would have no influence upon them.
Mr. PARKER hoped the worthy alderman would confine
himself to facts, not to suppositions.
The MAYOR called Mr. Parker to order, observing that
he would stop Mr. Earle if he went wrong.
Mr. Alderman EARLE said he was only arguing according
to the law of the country. There was surely no suppositions
there. He did not know what Mr. Parker meant.

The MAYOR said that Mr. Parker would have an oppor-
tunity, if he chose, of expressing his sentiments.
Mr. Alderman EARLI, in conclusion, said that with these
observations he should move the following resolutions :
" That in the opinion of this Council, it is their imperative
duty to do all in their power to enforce the salutary law pro-
hibiting the sale of ale or spirits on Sundays before the hour
of one in the afternoon ; and that, in accordance with the
spirit of sec. 6, 9th Geo. IV. cap. 61, quoted below, no
brewer, spirit dealer, or other person selling wine, beer, or
spirits to publicans, should sit on the Watch Committee when
any case affecting publicans and beer-sellers, or informations
against them, or the conduct or employment of any officer
on any case respecting a publican or beer-seller, shall be un-
der discussion."

" That no Justice, who shall be a common brewer, distiller,
maker of malt for sale, or retailer of malt or of any exciseable
liquor, or who shall be concerned in partnership with any
common brewer, distiller, maker of malt for sale, or retailer
of malt, or any exciseable liquor, shall act in or be present
at any general annual licensing meeting, or at any special
session for granting or transferring licenses under this act, or
shall take part in the discussion or adjudication of the Justices
upon any application for a license, or upon any appeal there-
from ; and no Justice shall act upon any of the aforesaid oc-
casions in the case of any house licensed or about to be
licensed under this act, of which such Justice shall be owner,
or for the owner of which he shall be manager or agent, or
of any house being in whole or in part the property of any
common brewer, distiller, maker of malt for sale, or retailer
of malt or of any exciseable liquor, to whom such Justice
shall be, either by blood or by marriage, the father, son, or
brother, or of whom such Justice shall be the partner in any
other trade or calling ; and that every Justice who, being
hereby disqualified, shall knowingly or wilfully so offend,
shall, for every such offence, forfeit and pay the sum of one
hundred pounds."
Mr. Alderman FAEME begged to second the motion : in
doing so he would observe that this was one of those pain-
ful duties which a man was sometimes called upon to per-
form ; and it was the more painful to him because it would
have something like the appearance of personality. He as-
sured the council, however, that he did not second this mo-
tion upon personal grounds, or from any objection to any
individual member of the Watch Committee, but because
the system was founded upon an unsound principle. He
did not second the motion because the gentlemen affected by
it were opposed to him in politics, but because this was no
new thing with him, for it was a question be had mentioned
years ago when the party to which he was attached were in
the majority. He then proposed, at a private meeting,
exactly the same thing, and it was unanimously carried.
There were then only a section of gentlemen in that parti-
cular trade in the council, and he thought then, and it had
always struck him, as being a dangerous principle in as much
as it brought men too much in contact with their own interests.
The Watch Committee was not to judge between the publicans
and the police only, but it was the judge to see that the in-
terests of the public were duly regarded, and the law should
be administered by them, not only with reference to the pub-
licans, but with reference to the public also. Now, he had
always thought that there was too much sympathy in that
particular committee, between the brewer and his customer,
that it was putting them in an unpleasant position, or, at all
events, laying them open to suspicion. This was not a ques-
tion of party polities ; but it was a question in which the real
interests of the public were concerned. The 'Watch Com-
mittee should have the perfect confidence of the public, and
be destitute of anything like suspicion, which was certainly
unpleasant to them, but arose from the nature of their trade,
and from their strong connection, nay, their identity almost,
with their customers. But the great feeling which he (Mr.
Alderman Freme) had, was this—he did not think it fair that
those publicans who were not the customers of brewers upon
the committee should be put upon a worse footing than
others who were : these latter might say, " Oh, I have a
friend at court who will protect me from the consequences of
every thing, which another man can not do." A little thing
in this way once occurred to himself. A gentleman said to
him he was much annoyed to find, on speaking to the police.
man to interfere; he said, " I dare not speak to the publi-
can, because he belongs to so-and• so, who is on the Watch
Committee." (Great cries of " Name, name.")
Mr. JAMES LAWRENCE called upon Mr. Freme to name.
Mr. Freme was a member of the committee when it had
something to do with informations; and he called upon him
to name the case in which this matter occurred. It was most
unjust that statements of this kind should be made without
the shadow of proof. (Hear, hear.)
The NI AYOR. said it was competent for Mr. Freme to make
statements, and he (the Mayor) did not see that, in this
instance, it was necessary for him to give names, inasmuch
as he was merely advocating a principle, and he had given
an assurance that he did not mean any member of the present
committee.

Mr. COOPER.—I think, as Mr. Freme made a direct
charge, he ought to give the names. (Hear, hear, and
" order.")
Mr. Alderman FREME.—But I do not know who the gen-
tleman was. (Hear, hear.)
The MAYOR.—He merely stated that such things had oc-
curred, without giving names.
Mr.PARICER.—Mr. Mayor, I now think you have allowed
suppositions, instead of facts. (Order.)
The MAYOR.—Names have not been mentioned.
Mr. Alderman FItEME, in continuation, said he had stated
he did not know within his own knowledge that the fact had
occurred, and that a gentleman had only told him so. He
wished, however, clearly to prove that this motion was not
seconded because the gentlemen concerned differed from him
in polities, but upon the ground that they were liable to
great suspicion in the discharge of their duties. When he
was upon the Watch Committee, the gentlemen in the trades
referred to, so far as his own knowledge went, never did any-
thing unfair or improper; he had never seen anything of
that sort in them, not the least; but as a general principle he
did think, especially as there were other committees to which
they were eligible, it was unwise to put them upon this par-
ticular one—namely, the Watch Committee.
Mr. PARKER wished to give both the worthy aldermen
who brought forward this motion every credit for their dis-
interestedness. Mr. Alderman Freme had said that the
Watch Committee must become popularized—roade popular

114 4tfi it 3 4.11, 4t4,04, WMA4
C,44,10W w al; Wo pi;l4ilv,l. wituiT; kw 0 r#40“1:,
421-4, t#6ol 4kt3 ii 44) thA Proiligti; irroailzir if he
could; point to any ona of those affeotad by this umtion who
had not gone into it with the full confidence of a constituency.
(Hear, hear.) None of them were aldermen who brought
forward charges which were mere assertions instead of fiicts,
and who said they might or might not be true, but they had
heard them, and, though they did not believe them, thought
it becoming to publicly mention them. (Hear, hear.) The
fact was, these charges had been " trumped up ;" and,
coming as they did from two magistrates, they made their
appearance with very little grace. Said the worthy aldermen,
" the Watch Committee we wish to stand upon good grounds
with the public." Why, there was not a single member of
it now concerned who would not, if it were necessary, wil-
lingly appear before his constituents to-morrow ; he would
himself go to his constituents, and, if they brought one tingle
charge against him, he would resign not only his seat in the
Watch Committee but in the council and pay the fine, be-
cause the allegation of any member being unfit to sit on the
Watch Committee what did it imply but that he was also un-
worthy to hold a seat in that council. (Cheers.) Let the
worthy aldermen go to his (Mr. Parker's) constituents, call
a meeting of them, and lie would resign if the majority said
so ; but there were those who had not a constituency to
appeal to, who had been rejected by the inhabitants, and who
had been returned into that council, by the then dominant
party, contrary to the wishes of the people. He was not
quite certain whether the alderman for Exchange Ward
(Mr Earle) was not himself in that position; at least, report
said he was—
The MATOR.—I think you are getting a little out now; I
do not see what the council have to do with that. You are
getting out of the line.
Mr. PARKER.—Very well. lie then alluded, first of all,
to the names of the seven gentlemen, beginning with Mr.
Preston, affected by this proceeding. Every one of them had
been personally attacked by the motion, and being himself
one of them, he claimed the privilege of defending himself
against the attack made upon him personally. The worthy
Alderman for Exchange Ward had said, and it was rather a
bold assertion to make, that it was impossible for any of them
to act conscientiously
The MArort.—l did not understand Mr. Earle to say so.
Mr. Alderman EARLE.—I did not intend to say so.
Mr. PARKER.---I took it down so.
Mr. Alderman EARLE.—You took it down, and the Mayor
is taking you up. (Laughter.)
Mr. PAniccu—That is the impression upon my mind.
The MAYOR—Perhaps Mr. Earle will mention what he
did say.
Mr. Alderman EARLE bad meant to say that the legisla-
tion had provided against this sort of thing, because their
own interest might interfere with their conduct, and because
a man could not always divest himself of the feelings of pri-
vate interest. The man did not fancy he was doing wrong,
but look at the difficulty he was placed in when his private
interest was concerned ; it was on account of this very ditfi-
culty that the legislature had prevented anything of the kind
occurring.
The MAYOR.—You make no charge of not acting con-
scientiously?
Mr. Alderman EARLE.—Not at all.
The MAroa.—Then it is quite satisfactory.
Mr. PARKER resumed. The clauses which the Deputy
Town-clerk had read referred only to justices of the peace;
and they could not by any ingenuity be made to apply to
members of the Watch Committee. Did lie (Mr. Parker) hold
the same sentiments, he would not call them liberal though
proceeding from liberals, for they were illiberal. As to the
particular trade followed by members of the council being

an objection to their forming a committee, he might assert
that the five gentlemen forming the Fire Committee had no
business to be there because they were interested in pro.
perty. To carry out his ow❑ doctrine, Mr. Earle must, of
course, assume that their private interest could sway their
public opinion. lie (Mr. Parker) should be very sorry to
say anything like that ; he should be sorry to suppose there
was any gentleman in the council who would act from any
other motives than those suggested by conscience and prin-
ciple. Those were the motives upon which he (Mr. Parker)
had always acted, and on which he always would act ; but he
hoped that out of this charge (for he could call it no less,)
something definite would be attempted, some dereliction of
duty without throwing a shield over it. (Hear.) The fact,
however was, that the Watch Committee had no more to do
with the charges preferred against publicans than the coun-
cil, for they never came before the committee in any shape.
Besides, the offences referred to in the clauses just read, re-

(erred to cases before justices where the parties were heard

upon oath. The Watch Committee had nothing to do with
oaths; and he appealed to Mr. Hornby to say whether any such
cases had come before•the committee. The only case which
had been before them, as far as he knew, was when Mrs. Dixon
made a charge against the officers Cunningham and Dutton,
and that would not have gone before the magistrates if it
had not been for the vice-chairman. Mr. Whitty said, the
characters of the three men were affected by it, and it had
better not go before the magistrate, but the deputy chairman
said, that as the character of the force was concerned, it
should go before Mr. Rushton. It did go before the stipen-
diary magistrate, not that Mrs. Dixon was thought of as a
publican, but because the committee were looking at the
character of their men. If Mr. Hornby, a member of the
committee, had brought forward this motion, or Mr. Hodg-
son, (the public would see that the committee was not alto-
gether a " refuge for the destitute," and that there were some
respectable men upon it,) there might have been supposed to
be some grounds for complaint; but what was the present
motion founded upon? Absolutely nothing. If there were
any charge which could be brought either against the com-
mittee or against himself (Mr. Parker), he should be happy
to meet it; but he did think, that without some such inten-
tion existing, there had been a want of that courtesy and
respect which was due from one member to another. He
was not accusing the mover of the resolution of any thing
else ; no doubt he had acted upon what he considered right
principles, and he (Mr. Parker) gave him credit for that ;
but at the same time, where individuals were attacked with-
out there being the slightest grounds for a railing accusation
against them, there was not only a want of courtesy, but a
want of good breeding and good manners. (Hear, hear.)
Mr. ASPINALL was very sorry to have to rise on this occa-
sion ; but he really thought that when six or seven gentlemen
upon one committee were assailed--
. . . . • _

The MAYOR suggested to Mr. Parker that he should with-
draw his charge of " a want of good breeding and good
manners."

Mr. Alderman EARLS.—Never mind it, Mr. Mayor; we
will take our pattern from him hereafter.
Mr. PARKER said that if, in the excitement- of debate on
this subject, he had said anything which was considered of-
fensive, he would willingly withdraw it.
Mr. AserN ALL was very sorry to take up the time of the
council on this matter, as he was neither a member of the
Watch Committee nor a justice of the peace; but he did not
like Mr. Earle, who had been a member of the Watch Com-
mittee for five years, and sat with some of the gentlemen
whose conduct he impugned nearly the whole of that time,
(for he held the cards in his hands of the members during
that period,) bringing the subject forward now for the first
time, when he had never thought of mentioning it before.
(Hear, hear.) And it was the more remarkable because Mr.
Earle had himself been a member of the Watch Committee
when Sir Joshua Walmsley was chairman. (Hear.) He
(Mr. Aspinall) mentioned the name of Sir Joshua Walmaley
because that gentleman was a justice of the peace, and be-
cause justices of the peace were particularly and exclusively
referred to in the clauses of the several acts of parliament
which had been read by the Deputy Town-clerk. Mr. Enoch
Harvey, for whom he (Mr. Aspinall) had always entertained
the highest respect, although a brewer, was also upon the
committee at that time, and he was never objected to-
Mr. Alderman FRIME.—Yes, yes. (Counter cries of
" No, no.")
Mr. ASPINALL.—Mr. Harvey was never once objected to
in the council, whatever might have been said at the Angel.
(Hear, hear.)

,
. The Nl.A.You.—You must not refer to what has been done
at the Angel, Mr. Aspinall. That is not the question.
(Hear, hear.)

s Mr: ASPINALL.—I only referred to the Angel, because
Mr. Freme was permitted to refer to it. (Hear, hear, and
cries of" Order.") _ _ _

The MAYOR..—.I did not hear Mr. Freme say anything
about it.

Mr. ASPINALL.—I only repeat Mr. Freme's own words;
and will sit down, Mr. Mayor, if you wish me. (Hear.)
The MAYOR.—AII these things are not necessary at all;
but proceed.
Mr. ASPINALL had only to say that it was most incon-
sistent in Mr. Alderman Earle now to hold up to obloquy
seven gentlemen of the Watch Committee, when, for a period
of five years, he had himself been a member of that body
without making any objection to the system. (Hear.)
Mr. Alderman EAULE.—I beg your pardon. (Cries of
" Order.") .

Mr. ASPINALL declared it was neither fair nor consistent
in Mr. Alderman Earle to adopt such a course. (Cheers.)
Besides he (Mr. Aspinall) would appeal to the Town-clerk
whether, in point of law, the council could now make a law
which should be binding upon those who might come in next
November, and require them to act upon it. (Hear, hear.)
The gentlemen alluded to ought to have been objected to, on
the ground of their trade, at the time when, or rather before.
they were appointed ; and the council could neither make
a retrospective law nor one by which the new council in
November next should be guided. (Cheers.) Again, what
had the members of the Watch Committee to do with the
justices of the peace? If any of the gentlemen to whom
the motion had reference sat as justices of the peace at the
licensing sessions, as licensing magistrates, they would each
have been liable to the penalty of £lOO. (Hear.) There were a
great number of gentlemen connected by blood and marriage
with members of the Watch Committee, some of whom had
even acted as chairman of the licensing sessions ; and Uzi law
was made for one why should it not be made for another.
(Hear, hear.) Yet here, at the end of seven years, this
thing was brought forward ! (Cheers.) It was most ungra-
cious and uncalled for. (Cheers.) Ile was sorry to make
use of this strong language, but he did not like to hear gen-
tlemen holding themselves up, at a very late hour, as if they
had done nothing wrong. (Hear.) He (Mr. Aspinall) was
one of those who thought that every gentleman admitted to
a seat in that Council ought to have some independence, that
he ought to be considered as a man of honour, and no mo-
tives imputed to any one before it had been clearly proved
that wrong had been done. (Great applause.) Such were
his feelings ; and whether the gentlemen alluded to consisted
of the same party as himself, or were opposed to him, he
would at least have done them the justice of sitting in the
Council with them without imputing improper motives ; but,
at the same time, if he had ever seen, or believed them guilty
of any job, or impropriety, he would have been the first to
stand up against them. He had spoken warmly on this sub-
ject, because he was sorry Mr. Earle had been so ill advised
as to bring it forward; and he thanked the Council for the
attention they had given to him. (Loud cheers.)
Mr. A. jun., objected to the motion; because,
however much the intentions might be disclaimed of reflect-
ing upon the characters of individuals sitting on the Watch
Committee, certainly, if the motion were carried, it would
convey an imputation, of no light nature, upon the seven
gentlemen referred to. (Hear It would go forth to the
public, as a charge against them, of having acted in an im-
proper manner upon that Board. (Hear, hear.) There was
no analogy, whatever, between the extracts from the Acts of
Parliament read by the Deputy Town-clerk, and the case of
those gentlemen ; the gentlemen who sat on the Watch
Committee had no direct intercourse with the publicans,
because if informations were laid against them they were
taken and heard before the magistrates. (Hear.)
Mr. Alderman EARLE.—By the police ?
Mr. A. SMITH continued. The police laid all informations,
but not before the Watch Committee. (Hear.) If the%. e.in-
formations were heard, as in the olden time, before the
ratt. Watch
Committee, there might have been some ground_ for the
motion, but they did not now go before the Wathereforera-
mittee ; they went direct to the magistrates, and h
o
.h.eer(elkel
or.nScemrintehd)
ienoublrdewnoertiecsonacnediveinhtre
sale
e.
rgentlemenspirits
h‘ovl
sale, could in the slightest degree incapacitate them from
sitting upon the Watch Committee. (Hear, hear.) They
bad heard many times, a great deal of discussion of an un-
pleasant nature in thatiroom ; and, in order to put a stop to
it, he should move, as an amendment, that the Council de-
precate the frequent personal attacks made in the Council
upon individual members of its body, which have a tendency
to bring the Council into disrepute, and provoke rejoinders
of an unpleasant nature.
Mr. llonosoN had no difficulty in rising to second the ,
amendment. The council had just changed their position
greatly : a while ago they were discussing a subject in which
all must deeply sympathize, and feel a common interest,
namely, the great subject of extinguishing tires, but now, to
use a common phrase, they had fallen " from the frying pan
into the tire." It was clear to him, inferentially, that the
resolution, if tolerated by the council ,would cast a most in-
jurious imputation or reflection upon a large body of
moat respectable councillors, who had beau sent into that

topti * IN* ttl4 lA4vitptiAJ iNitrorAi wilow gi 13446tiv, iii,,,,114i4F.j 4tiota (coi,ll4' pre
coolc4„ tb4t 013 t,. OU.;p kha (4-41-#4egorir4,o-(;lort,
ilo4pon the awe:l(l4lmA pormidoratile length,
Much discussion followed, of a very warm, and occasionally
of a personal character; with a 'view to terminating which Mr.
I.,AcE moved an adjournment. The following was the de-
cision _
•

For the adjournment
Againg ..

Majority
A further discussion then followed upon the amendment.
On a discussion there appeared—
For the amendment
Against it

Majority for the amendment • 19
The amendment then became the original motion ; and Mr.
G. H. LAWRENCL, seconded by Mr. BUSHELL, moved a;
an amendment that it do stand as follows :—That the motion
of Mr. Alderman Earle is uncalled for and unneusaary. The
cuuncil divided, and the result was—
For the amendment
Against it

5
22

Majority for the 'notion .. 17
Mr. Alexander Smith's ►notion was then ordered to be en-
tered on the books; and at a quarter before Ave o'clock the
council separated.

FOREIGN INTELLIGENCE.

UNITED STATES.

We have received New York papers to the 7th instant
inclusive, by the packet-ship Independence, Captain Nye,
which arrived at this port on Wednesday forenoon.
The papers contain two sets of correspondence between
Mr. Webster and Mr. Fox, both relating to the disputed
territory on the north-eastern boundary. The first set had
reference to a resolution of the legislature of the State of
Maine, relative to certain proceedings of the Government of
New Brunswick, supposed to be in contravention of the
terms of the treaty of the 9th of August, between the United
States and Great Britain, by attempting to collect from
American citizens bonds or securities for lumber eut, be-
longing to the disputed territory, that was to be surrendered
by Great Britain to the states of Maine and Massachusetts
under the treaty. Mr. Fox had so long ago as October last,
on receiving intelligence from Lord Ashburton of the sig-
nature of the treaty of Washington, issued orders to the
Attorney-General of the province to suspend all proceedings
upon the bonds in question; the Attorney-General had duly
obeyed the order. "It appears, therefore, says Mr. Fox,
" that the resolutions of the Maine Legislature cannot have
been grounded upon an accurate statement of facts." The
second set of correspondence had reference to the seizure,
by the British authorities, of an American citizen, named
Colum-
bia. them
ae3frl
oft Sirrce.aui slb;
,gyreseb,:oaotfernwrr
leceihttotewet territory i
ettgion)aercvyl
gave on
territoryoos ten' dtthhaee U
on
fi tNedewStautersu,naawndiebky,
satraritevmaleonft tohfe
the b
cbd.,:tueondfdSbatylvmapgteera.snoyn2lBl rns.de Firsvoci xrnegst
indiscretion
dsoethat,
irregularity
' a'
ui t t
hiot r
ishallthyaso of the
British provincial Government, he has no doubt that the
matter will have been already set to rights by the Lieuten-
ant-Governor."
The papers also contain a letter from Mr. Webster to Mr.
Everett, the American minister at London, and dated March
28, on the subject of the right of visitation. It is a vindica-
tion of the passage in the President's message at the opening
of Congress relative to the right of search, which it will be
remembered, gave rise to discussion in the British Parliament.
Neither the stock nor the money market had presented
any features of interest. Prices of State securities were
improving.
Bills on London were in limited demand for the Indepen-
dence. The rate was 1031 to 106 per cent. premium. Oa
Paris the rate was 51: 421 c. to sf. 414 c.
broughtof m forwardin
dan and intellect
a variety
f of )
The papers contain the report of the trial of a man named
White for the murder of his father in Genesee county,
Western New York. In the defence the counsel for White
set up
the plea of
I an
side all such defence. The
jury found the prisoner guilty, d g sentenced him
ftahcetsc,rismhoinwal ; but the judge seta` showing
the Jude singular eccentricity
d
a
to be hanged.
The sheriff's jury in New York had, In a case of sedue-
assessed the damages at 10,000 dollars, or £2OOO sterling.
go by default,
tion, in which judgment had been allowed to

The city of Brussels has been greatly excited for
murdersome
his
freetttue
rr n 7::
days, by the trial of M. Cournartin, for the alleged
of M. Sirey, in the apartments. of Nladelle. Heinefetter, an
actress of some celebrity both in France and Belgium. 'M
Caumartin, who resides in France, was a lover of Madelle.
Heinefetter, and had accompanied her from Paris to BNB'
sels, where he left her for some time. During his absence
he received a number of passionate letters
M. Siren,
fromalso
athFerleandeb.
whom he expected to find devoatetd
.tioadheilmie.onliehi
Hoping
.tp give her a surprise, he returned unexpectedly.
and was self much more surprised than delighted to find
that gjohteasenorthi%e.arlilomveert,
apartments, after the theatre,. and there had a.quarrel, which
ended in the death of M. Sirey, from a stab in the body in-
flicted with a sword cane. On the trial, M. Caumartin
stated that the deceased not only began the quar.rel, but that
he attacked him with a knife and wounded him in the thigh,
and that he was killed in rushing forward to repeat the blow:
The jury, after hearing the evidence, unanimously acquitted
the prisoner.
_____.....„,...