The Liverpool Standard and General Commercial Advertiser.
Liverpool, Merseyside, England, 1833-02-22 00:00:00

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sea °NEEL!. rose to address the house. I
_ , _
__,
..., , n
‘OOO ssuvoured to direct its sympathies towards th
see,
rence of expression,—indeed, he felt far toe
----"seiisl!Y, unhappy, ill-fated Ireland, he never I
tfeeell'uos as at that moment. He would most cat
Mr. COBRETT conceived that the ancient practice was 4.
'need the redress of grievances before- the house voted su Is :adeeling in mere vituperation. He had on a f
and therefore he for one could not suffer the house to geocth e use of the terms " brutal and sanguinary"
committee the
he had claimed redress for the grieranc etse,:, address it: answer to the speech from the a
al longer apply to it the language of i
fleeted with the inequality of taxation. The laws con,sv ':I having since obtained the sanction of t
with this subject had been made by the nobility and the I°-,, pre la
the proceedings of ministers to
proprietors, and were the most oppressive; it was obserfijlt sent object was far other than attempting to t
that they always took care to exempt themselves frowrij
.. rt, lesmr„e
operation, and, as a body, were the most unjust legislar_tes a4°4...Use injuries were so deep, that to denounce
ever had existed in any country. What he had to st'ns ea've language would deprive grief of its dign
not mere assertion, but facts, which he would prove, A 0 %.:st.t.o address the house in reference to the th
arguments, but by a reference to acts of Parliament, aneust ~s7s of ministers so as to be known to belong
did not, before he sat down, substantiate and convince th ''s; tl,,teed by his accent. He would speak as he
of the tyranny and gross partiality between the taxation v', ti::',4id feel it his duty to do if ministers threat(
rich and the poor man, he would surrender all claim to ter,l Bj_liople of England or of Scotland of the bens
session of common sense. The right hon. secretary f.ers, sur titutiug in their stead the most iron and rE
Meas.) He would speak as he shot
land hactsaictihat a government must be feared before I% fib`e'rsos.
be loved. The act to which he was about more espeelns cherries of Englishmen were threatened with des
refer could only inspire hatred,—he meant the StamP Al tat stud feel if outlawry were declared against the
the 55th George 111, from which it was scarcely necess ii,Aotiand, as if either were about to be banded
him to do more than read extracts, without match coralo'cit et,lt,ny countrymen
his own. The taxes imposed by this act, including the co, i, 411
Is military officers, provided they "have bt
collection, amounted to little less than eight millions aye i rive service, and have attained the age of 21."
, to the tender mercies of
which 'the nobility and landed proprietors paid nothing's is:, comparatively tranquil temper would he addr
tiztlareatened by the King's ministers--measu
while they bore no part of this burden, had taken especisiso q,,toe, obtain their ear in pointing out in their tr
to make it heavier and heavier as it descended in its opera their tv.`4.,tr hideous deformity, themeasures with whit
i deprr.rri Englishman must feel that death would
upon the humbler classes. The legacy duties on persons')o
perry began at one and ended at ten per cent. From
duties freehold property was entirels, exempted. Thud the vvlug him, as they would,, of all the rights of o
estates of the nobility were exempted, but the father or oper lash nest slave.ry. (Hear.) Yes, though an Irisi
who might possess a small funded or other personal pre as that , —the iron of despotism had not so eater
could not give it even to s child without subjecting it to seel ks ,he did not bitterly hate slavery, and death
The probate duty on any sum exceeding £2O was two per the lover of liberty he denounced the cruelty—i
when it amounted to 20 or 30 thousand pounds, this dut)(11 ,I(.ll7,l(l'ikeediless—of the policy pursued so long tot
only 30s. per cent., and as the amount became greater th!,), 1 ~ hit was now endeavoured to crown by. am
became less ! They might laugh at this, but he would ash j Tiett altogether of the protection of the British h.
was this justice ? Would the country laugh with theut:44r thatY.',were told that the ministers stood so well wi
hon. baronet had asked him to bring forth his rnage'"tt the taey could count on a strong majority; so um
projectanswer, he had only to say he had no preless
bring forward, but would like to know why that hon. bs')-i', lees that ministers, who had already done so a
had not paid, when he came into possession of his proper))view hi
hearudi'—nee in the uprightness of their intex
tw°°-- not seek for such extraordinary power
years ago, the sixty thousand pounds, the sum it ought to a Ile e ° effecting more good for that country. I
been charged with; supposing the tax to be impartially le`hi thei,°4l,l wish to see their claim to despotic pee
had to borrow that sum, and paid interest on it from tha cep
If he had'paid this sum 30 years ago, the nation would notsi Isae.l3ast
repo They have proposed two good measures—s
The duty on conveyances under £2O was 10s., or 2ts per,f,J ilet,stisi doings.towards Ireland. Let us see wl
and one respecting corporations. He wa
under two hundred thousand pounds only one thousand po'i
or half per cent. Thus the poorer man paid 20 times assts hat 4 their measures—it was a boon to Ireland,
as the richer man, who escaped almost scot free. The- atlilo vihe farther • besides that its beneficent operatic
(PA ofat so far as the abolition of the church cc
leases was equally oppressive. It might be said these tto
were done in a hurry. He (Mr. Cobbett) had no don I 1 hale__ with the monstrous church establishment,
that these thing were done by night, for they never couldaii: triie ;Or where it now is—in all its ignominious g
ileete(Y, ProspeCtive ; it relieved no other existing
been done by day. They duty on a mortgage of £25 lc 0 he Ik,at he had met the announcement of the meat
If the sum be twenty thousand pounds the duty was only si eii,„.!,tiot disposed to retract a letter of his appn
duty of four pounds per cent. on the poor, and two shillio? jiii'l`" tendency ;it was too seldoin that such op]
cent. on the rich man, and he would ask, were they wh°34l tts r g measures of kindness towards Ireland were
posed and passed these duties honest men ? An anal, •6'eated that the abolition of the vestry ces
£lO pad r was subject to stamp duty of
flit. sane if
hit ,t,il Ireland. Ile would go further, and say, I
yearonly £25, instead of £2OO, and were granlill shelo: In
£lO,OOO, or any greater sum it only paid the same. i's. 01 he 'vie. aU• Stated. . But no other burden or grie
exchange for an amount of two pounds was subject to y lalie poorV d h a greater extent than the noble lo
e sY the proposed church reform, and th,
of one shilling, and the largest sum on any bill was
shillings. Wh), should the needy tradesman be snbje.co ;t1,1,,e„
es dby it. Then why, it might be asked
Pei/ (41,414an's pigs and his tenth
.potato would
this impost, why-not keep up the proportion upon all i. 04 o'.osdvet?ing so warmly approve of it ? Because
This disproportion might have arisen from oversight or inet'd tea
~_Planct.pie,
he could not attribute it to any but interested motives, tliKa ,:stalinnied in that house and elsewhere, that the
the poor man one pound per cent. meddle rich sixpence 0.1."; t ;be snment was far too massive and costly for t
(hear,) because it admitted what
pence on the same kind of instruments. The henourable, Pis pri,Ttrilual
then noticed the inequality on life insurances, and sae? vrts east twice too large. (Hear, hear.). E
wants, of its members—according
former legislators might have been fox-hunting squires, or,r,ia be treasureees, recognized an admirable principle
lords unacquainted with business generally, but in these 1'.',,0 atit4"i`iti not shrink, namely, that where there wen
they had taken good care of themselves, for the duty on 8;0 Th'estah
praisement of fifty pounds was 2s. 6d., and on five
hilios they .."'t
he, therefore, hailed it with satisfeeti
:,,,te, was to be no spiritual receiver of tithes
pounds was only 155., and above that sum, up to a million, 41, ey eiie admission of these excellent principles of c
only amount to £l. Had he (Mr. Cobbett) seen in ther kt. as,y t ?11,st
lord at the head'of his Majesty's government any inteo, 2_ors e(l4°, web forms and injunctions as they please'
taking off one farthing of taxes of any description he shod..o fists id invest their ecclesiastical commississio
- not be eluded, and the measure would p
have made this exposition; instead of doing this, be sa"es sti,°o4 benefite (and he was anxious that this shou
prepared and determined, even at the point of the bayoDol Clieli the than might be apparent on tl
enforce them if necessary. In one instance, however, be_sa sse rem e plan of corporation reform was before th
admit that the stamp duties were levied impartially, he V 'he hiutO bestow upon it every praise to which it
those charged on apprentices indentures. These descent'? itaattnly state might, perhaps, laugh at what he 1
proportion to the premium paid; but then it must be obsv headot 4esi.te
f k to declare that he hoped to see the
it, because they seldom became apprentices, andwere mos'ssi sack at 'e government which had dared to bi
that the sons of lords, baronets, or parsons, were not affect ; 0 rate to those measures, ne verthel
monly disposed of in other ways. The auction duty 01,1 ,1 f&,,ad, to
_Outrageous' violation of all law and just
and jewellery was 7d. in the pound. Property of this leitiestii `-:! the ettlriitswer for his conduct to the ,justly indigna
rally belonged to the rich and noble, but every other Ver. :„L .was fss &I
,empire, (Repeated cheers from the
property belonged to the tradesman, however poor, was 07. '4.11 i
st cos,' •lasulkdt 'louse that evening, to tell the mint
5 per cent., except in cases of distress for rent or tithes', , _ ld 40, , a reformed Parliament—and Ma se
the noble were again protected. " No, you may tax the° 'attetion'ftia)o mistaken—that a reformed Fullest's
tradesman, but you must not touch the property of my 0 , ei
a h r c°ll et, Busliension of all law and would indig
the parson." Would a reformed parliament sit in tn—
and tolerate the continuance of these things ? He mill , ° he
0-e wa:* Such was the object he then propos'
them to take these things into consideration;. and wouldJo, (itgli4, a;,,much more anxious to elicit the sentil
fore move, " that on the let of March this house do ta
see -'oey toi'L Scotch members respecting the props
its consideration the tendency and effects of the several. siow , let
It Ireland of ministers, than expri
tt4t'eahlw"ere a peaceable and censtitutional
parliament imposing the stamp and auction duties." 4to a 107 t. be understood that if that atrocious I
Dr. BA snwns seconded the motion, and expressed !. ply ,lid, the
that the Chancellor of the Exchequer would repeal the expressed eery
ieseers sPersonal freedom—may be imprisoned
glass, which he had said that he would propose in a rew t liy red °, the Lord Lieutenant or the Irish Secre
People of Ireland will be liable tc
Parliament.
~... ',l-sn' togertese s Whatever, if imprisoned unjustly, for
Lord Atrtione admitted, that the duties of which ssw iji i'ay, it de. to 'petition for redress for their gnevan
gentleman complained, were heavier on small than lan, slio this teoperoled on the mere caprice of the Iris'
sections, on which there was a less per centage paid in p, , stollen religious minds was well worthy of eon
,
Lion to their amounts. The hon. gentleman would fill t°l. this °,. a strictly religious meeting as incurring
the same rule was generally observed, because the gre9. ~lle, if '' But even these provisions were not a
of transactions to Which these duties referred, were of the sw ,eauseroPossible, still more atrocious behind—hi
amounts. ' With respect to a duty on real property, if °ell' t M. Wr changing the venue.
ilenn.
._ correct in statiug
per cent. had been imposed upon it, in the course of a sp"ltl '''e rigjeNx rose to order. He did not attempt
years the whole of it would have passed through the Pitd, teatttr, win• gentleman so long as he confined hit
the crown. The stamp duties were now under consideV,d the i. upon the general policy of ministers, but
with a view to an alteration of them, and he put it to the rot Z,itittre„Liut hon. Speaker whether it was not di
whether during the last two years it had been possible 0,401 hoses,
' ;° the rules and usages of Parliament to
this subject forward? Some of the lower stamp dun 0 ""lise. ° a measure not yet under the consider
et! loostEci
thought too , but the scale proposed by the bon. Op ilr, Ode °Wear.)
man, he should object to altogether. Although the stsweer ,ttltiar bi,'?Nriar.r. had not specified a single deta
ties did press heavier on the smaller than they did on the Ilse. i rai nesters,
he was merely referrinf to the propos
mercantile transactions, they could not be said to affect I ijiiesp (" Order," "Chair.' )
housing population. (They do.) Perhaps they mighlotte 1
pilii
ER said that the right hon. gentleman
indirectly, because if they press on the employers, they s.1:0001
some degree the employ Cd. He did not mean to queseti.,,en „R.. isj._ and. more inconvenient to the despatch 1
correctness of the hon. gentleman's facts, but the ii3Pl- . 4,l.lttiv'es, than to discuss the details of a measure
which he drew from them. 11E1 hi: tt,34,e‘Q tY before the house, but the question Ni
Mr. O'CONNELL said he thought that the noble letienev sl 134bappheable to the observations of the leas
strengthened the arguments advanced by the hon. gesiiid s?,,' s Nterrn• (Hear.) The great difficulty which '
The case being made out, he hoped the noble lord we.'„ set.,. etNetrul with in discussions like the present was,
that nothing could 1
point a committee at once, and not talk of his ele'Teoun s4ats, line between general comments on wha
which it appeared he intended to lay on the table oft n, ri, zsQt matter of notoriety. through publicity, ant
The shilling paid by the poor man was equal to the 0 uleralie,,i talt'le, e. a minute criticism of the details or pr.
by the rich. • He would, however, suggest to the bon' eat, a' sad IID t,),,',Nbich, as not yet before the house, tl
the propriety of withdrawing his motion for the pre' re,,• gooq'glal'2oguizance.. Much must be left to t.l
bringing it forward at some future time. dor Aark taste of the speaker himself, and he
to 6- Pl'e of
M. HUME was about to suggest to the hon. ember to be s seisveetie the right hon. gentleman would have
that course, and substitute for it another, which tat boo' oft
/ learned member for Dublin from ti
framed as so have his resolittiOrrprnitto,-uud put in r"" , w4il . hiso,sgu,srd in
the remainder of his address. (
of every member of the house, who would then come prep °Old t,oe •
b Whist cheek •.sa.a. said he was sure reproof so milt
to discuss the subject. _ eurm he 'um, if even disposed to forget the rul
Mr. D. W. IttliVEY conceived that the motion ohs_ be h,_ as ,
-/c4va: U°t• He would not speak in reference
friend was plain and straightforward. If they werejube a " ri„.l e
pobt.‘at, on -, Past or prospective, of ministers, but
same as the former House of Commons, they would
a des- statee es „' ait occasion when they asked £3,0(
generate and -corrupt body. If they'were -reformed is r
\ti the °-eY to be intrusted to their man
well as in word, there would be a greater show in fee"' i :41.9, The gto,Otuls on which he refused them hit
. .
equality of justice.
°'sit bid eu,ji he , woeld not confide the public In
Mr. ROBINSON said, that since he had had the h0n0r.,t,,..j.
et_ 4 the o
- Propose& te thaugethe venue of trio
scat in that house, he had made several attempts to cau.:, WA. .24.txbtt , recottbet , , .3 , ~.
, *oat leo in t.,e revolutionary rs
tention to the unequal ties of taxation that prevailea is'bjee, ;.eiee3,..ithica cost, us America ? kle ‘s°Lad
country. This was not the best form in which the. sn of, ~elluse,l- venue,
They removed the trial of offer
might be brought forward. The answer of the .noblesr2;oo7 i:‘,4l of 'ls to the mother country,.and the result "at
not one that would be satisfactory to the country. -"Zoo!, tr,lrever`i:nweti9an independence. Something infi
suggest to the house that, instead of going into a coni„iii,oat!oi, oh to , 4s intendector the Irish. When they
the stamp duties, they should go into the subject ot, :axatio!, ,;:bi.e .. trial, he
as rt.,;.- s what tort of triletittel was their guilt
generally. He observed that the present system ois'uner Fs, t4letess !!, 0 pied ? Forsooth, by. a majority of
could not be upheld much longer, and no other natiectioY, s„,tsea tZ‘:ll..l?aft been two Leers ma the services t
mained to alter it than by a thorough revision of it. ‘,1_74 test!, l',7!tsk, r toll age of 21. The change Soya Amer's
were made to a property tax, and-would continue We_°st eft Kst 1114_ u.,tlace, the trial by jury wait retained (
paid at present fell so heavily and concealed thetbeo7lo Orrs WotiVleq_lreland there was a ehatge .ef totem
other. He would acid his request to,tbe. hon. mealt°,seratifs vassia_orlof trial by jury, (Hear, bear.) Was tht
ham to withdraw his motion for the present, 611f-tin' s' tise7 t ? When and aunt to placing the lives
illation were gained.the be ;,tuft people of Treland at the disposal—irrespon
that d to
4 You** ig - he had I,'
Mr. Fir DEN rose and expressed- his hopes . an
,st s ens as or lieutenants,
member for Oldham -would not withdraw bis motioa it e astssn the honour of the British army. He
could riot refrain from expressing his satisfaction tunitnata j gtl6l-o,Viry 116,*r entered the'fielil—that its of
been made. Whether right or wrong it was an i t":lild /3: i-:,T. Z. in their private relations as high-minder
fact that, when grievances -prevailed, our ancestors hoof en ,:zitie7l,
.ct ; but, still they were human being
vote mil/Ales of tugney until those grievances h 51ci17.0dott."; eves
„by all the hope's and fears which were
mined into and redressed. It had been said that the talitieri eto human conduct. Then, think of the
the hon. member for Oldham was tinged with WWI" boutOof tB/1,3 til*
ti Y would be Plaegd. by the proposed se
but was that to he a valid objection with a reforisvence is tl'e liens,._ They were young end ardent—say '
The question wasswas the matter complained of a er „,otictatii, ,2etti
.atenants or ensigns—of course anxious f
not? If it was,-that was the reason for proposing w
not be 011. iL4et.?"teas refuse to promote the views of their
regard to i. 't He could not see why property should
thent , ~,,, ri, , ,„ Might he not reitent their doing so by 1
,w' 1.0 'ft kNOLi '' He ; A
lowed to pass freely from one person to
el° a °lll' ti'i 'le' opt h , o. ) sa... yes. It was part of
hindrances and expenses which at present attache ...., of i , Nl;e .Crown to confer promotion and app<
Mr. WARBURTON and Mr. Gash-: joined in the urgitre...e ! 1e,51",, and these tribunals would consequentl
hon. member for Oldham to withdraw his motion, to WP , species of apprehension. They would be
Mr. COBBETT, at length, assented.
STATE OF IRELAND.
rollgrsx). Dt elI
The report of the Committee of Supply was then .I,ts
and read, and on the question that the sum of £3, Teed,
granted to his Majesty for the support of certain lane ''
- _