The Liverpool Standard and General Commercial Advertiser.
Liverpool, Merseyside, England, 1833-03-22 00:00:00

THE LI VEIO3OO I, STAN DA RD.

discuss : and he, therefore, felt that the present postponement of
his motion to an indefinite period would be a postponement for
the Session. Now, in his opinion, the question should not only
be discussed, but settled in the present Session; because he was
satisfied that, if it was not settled in that house, it would be
settled elsewhere, in a manner far from satisfactory to that
house. However obstinate it might seem in him, and however
difficult he found it to resist the request of the noble lord,
he was bound to say now as he had said in private, when
the same application was made to him, that he could not post-
pone his motion unless the noble lord fixed a day for bringing
forward the question.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said the hon member
had named two conditions, with the first of which, it was im-
possible for him to comply. (Hear, hear.) As to the other
condition, however, he had no objection to state the day his
Majesty's government had fixed for bringing before the house
their view of this question. If there was no objection, there-
fore, he should fix Tuesday, the 23rd of April, for bringing
forward this question. (Hear, hear.)
Mr. F. BUXTON, when he used the phrase total abolition, of
course meant such an abolition as was consistent with the safety
and security of the colonists and the slaves themselves. As he
had the noble lord's pledge (and he could wish no better) that
the question would be brought forward on the 23d of April, he
should accede to what seemed to be the prevailing wish of the
house, and withdrew his motion. _ _

The order for the motion was then discharged.
BEER HOUSES.
• .

Upon the suggestion of the CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER,
who stated that it was not the intention of his Majesty'y govern-
ment to oppose the motion for the appointment of a select com-
mittee on the state and management of beer-houses, the Mar-
quess of Chandos withdrew his motion on that subject.
Mr. PRYME also postponed his motion regarding the allot-
ment of land to labourers under Enclosure Acts.
Mr. ROMILLY was also induced to defer to the sense of the
house, and withdrew his motion for a bill to render freehold
and copyhold estates liable for the payment of contract debts.

OBSERVANCE OF THE SABBATH.

Sir ANDREW AGNEW pressed to be allowed to bring in his bill
for the better observance of the Lord's day. He was anxious
that the bill should be brought before the house in a printed
shape, and the discussion m►ght be taken at a future stage.—
The hon. hart. persisted in moving the first reading.
The CHANCELLOR of the ExcireQuc a would extremely regret
if it couid be supposed that he was wanting in any courtesy to
the hon. 'mt., As other hon. members, however, had postponed
measures of great importance at his request, in order not to
stand in the .way of public business, he felt himself bound to
them to oppose the ►ntroduction of the hon. bert's bill. If
the . hon. bart. persisted, therefore, he (the Chancellor of the
Exchequer) should move that the discussion on the hon. bart.'s
motion should be postponed until that day fortnight—(Hear.)—
The other motions which, according to the order in which they
stood on tine paper, would otherwise have had priority, having,
by the courtesy of the members whose names were prefixed to
diem,. been postponed, in order to make way for the early con-
sideration in committee of the Irish Disturbances' Bill.

The motion was then postponed.
IRISH DISTURBANCES' BILL.

The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER rose, and moved that
the order of the day for the house to go into committee on the
Irish Disturbances' Suppression Bill be now read. •
EXCISE LAWS (IRELAND).
Colonel LEITH begged to ask the noble lord on the Treasury
bench whether it was the intention of the government to insti-
tute anv inquiry into.the state of the excise laws in Scotland?
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said that the commis•
sinners appointed for the purpose of examining into the excise
laws, would, of course, include those of Scotland amongst the
objects of their investigation.
POOR LAWS (IRELAND).
. . . '

Mr. O'CONNELL begged to inquire if the government at
present entertained any intention of introducing, a system of
poor laws into Ireland ::for, if not, he would shortly give notice
of a motion on that subject, when the question could be argued
whether there were any objections to urge against a safe and
effectual plan for the introduction of poor laws into Ireland.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said that the govern-
ment had at present no time for the consideration of the ques-
tion of poor laws for Ireland, and, consequently, no plan to
propose for their introduction into that country, neither was it
probable that any such would be brought forward this session.
The order of the day being then read, on the question that
the Speaker do leave the chair being put,
Mr. T. ATTWOO n, on the ground that nine-tenths of the time
of the house since its assembling had been exclusively directed
to the consideration of Irish affairs, whilst the great business of
the English nation had been wholly neglected that the general
discontent now prevailing in England require immediate consi-
deration; that the present state of Ireland did not call for the
immediate application of the coercive bill, and that the reme-
dial measures ought to be brought forward now, and to go pari
passu together with that bill, moved, " that the further consider-
ation ot the bill for the suppression of disturbances in Ireland be
postponed for the present.
Mr. H t:lfiE seconded the motion.
Mr. STAN LEY denied that the state of Ireland was such as
not to require increased celerity in passing the bill.
Mr. D. W. HARVEY thought that after the noble and honest
but ineffectual opposition offered by the Irish members, they
had better desist from any further resistance, and thereby pro-
pitiate the English nation, and throw the whole odium of the
measure on Government.

After some observations from Mr. O'Connell, Mr. H. Grat-
tan, and Mi. Cutlar Fergusson, the House went into the com-
mittee.

The CHAIRMAN read the 9th clause.
Mr. STANLEY intimated that it was intended in unproclaimed
districts to allow
.any meeting to take place, if properly con-
vened by the sheriff or any authorised person, and in order to
prevent the suppression of the right to petition, meetings would
lie allowed with the consent of the Lord Lieutenant, but that
no one non-resident in the county should attend that meeting,
and if so that he should incur the penaties of a misdemeanor.
Mr. FINN suggested that those possessing property should be
allowed to attend.
After some remarks from Mr. Hall, the clause was read.
On the question that it stand part of the hilt,
Mr. O'CONNELL remarkedthat it was a curious circumstance
that where the meetings had taken place, there the districts had
been most peaceable. He objected to the consent of the Lord
Lieutenant being required; notice of an intention to hold a
meeting should be sufficient. The hon. member moved that the
words " consent of the Lord Lieutenant" be left out.
The So Limn: Hi-GENERAL considered it would be prudent for
.the sake of the meeting to require the consent to be given, as it
was better that a body of persons should know whether they
were to lie allowed to meet at all, than after having assembled
to be dispersed without notice.
Mr. O'CONNELL replied, that this effect was involved as the
Lord Lieutenant keep them in suspense.
The amendment was then negatived.
The luth clause, relating to the trials of offenders by. mili-
tary courts-martial was also, after some discussion, carried by
a majority of 140. The numbers on the division being—
For the clause 270
Against it l3O
On the CHAII:M AN reading the llth clause,
Mr. It may WASON moved au amendment, by,which it would
be necessary for the Courts-martial to be unanimous in the
finding and sentence on the accused parties on trial before
them. .

The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said that a very ma-
terial concession had already been made upon this clause, as
originally constructed, by rendering it necessary for a majority
of seven out of nine, a majority of rive out of seven, and that a
Court-martial of live should be unanimous in pronouncing upon
the guilt of all prisoners tried by them.
Mr. O'CONNELL supported the amendment.
Au hon. MEMBER (name unknown) suggested that the num-
ber of the persons composing the courts-martial ought to be the
same in all cases, and then unanimity might be insisted on.
After a few observations from Mr. WASON in support of his
amendment, the Committee divided, when the numbers
ap-
peared
For the amendment 42
Against it
Majority -104
Mr. BOTCH objected to the next clause, in consequence of
his knowing what the House was perhaps unacquainted with,
that it was the practice on Courts-martial to clear the Court
whenever the prisoner took an objection, so that the case was ar-
gued by the Judge Advocate against the prisoner, bereft of the
aid of advice or Counsel on points of law, often very difficult
and abstruse. To remedy injustice, he proposed as an amend-
ment, that noobservation should be made or cases cited in the
absence of the prisoner or of his legal adviser. He recollected
that in consequence of this practice being followed, a case
where sentence of death was pronounced on a point of law
against a prisoner, who had not been heard in answer upon the
point on which he had been found guilty.
Mr. It. GRANT opposed the amendment as unnecessary, since
the Judge-Advocate was bound to see justice done to the pri-
soner by virtue of his office.
The amendment was negatived.
! Mr. WARBURTON proposed an amendment, that no conduct
of acquittal should be revised by the same or anv other Court-
martial or that no sentence should be increased iu severity by
the Lord-Lieutenant on a revision.

Mr. RouT. GRANT conceived there were grounds for the fiat
recommendation of the hon. member for Bridport.
After a few words from 111 r. R. GRANT and Mr. WARBUR-
TON, the amendment was agreed to.
The clause, as amended, was agreed to, and the Chairman
having reported progress, obtained leave to sit again to-morrow.

CHURCH OF IRELAND REFORM BILL.
Sir M. W. RIDLEY brought up the report o; the Select Com-
mittee appointed to search tor precedents in reference to the
Irish Church Reform Bill. The report stated that the commit-
tee could find no precedents to sanction the principle upon
which the bill was brought in, and that, as it was a tax bill, it
ought to be introduced in a committee of the whole house. ..
On the motion of the CHANCELLOR of the ExcimcluEa, tse
order of the day for the second reading of the bill was then dis-
charged, and the noble lord gave notice that he would, on Mori
day next, move for a committee of the whole house on the
subject.
The other orders of the day being then disposed of, the house
adjourned at three o'clock.
WEDNESDAY.

The SPEAKER took his seat a few minutes after 12 o'clock.
A person from the Trinity House appeared at the Bar, -with a
return of the revenues of that Corporation. •

Mr. Crafer, from the Treasury:, also appeared at the Bar,
with a return of certain duties which had been ordered.

Lord KERRY presented a petition from. certain, oe.upiers crf
land in the county of Somerset, against the Black Log Road
BA—Referred to the Committee on the said bill.

Lord HENNIKER moved the third reading ut the bill to repeal
the Act of the 4th Geo. 111., for the better maintaining the
Poor of Bosmere and Claydon, in the County of Suffolk, and
for making better regulations in lieu thereof.—The bill was
read a third time and passed.
Sir R. LOPEZ presented a petition from Westbury, in So-
merset, in favour of the Black Dog Road Bill.
On the motion of Mr. WINDHAM, the bill for repairing the
road from Norwich to Windhill, in the county Of -Norfolk, was
read a third time and passed.

THU, RAJAII OR TRAVANCORE'S DEBTS.
Mr. BrirscoE brought iu a Bid to provide fur discharging the
debt due from the }rajah and Government of Travancore to
Bury Hutchinson, as representative of the late John hutch-
inson.—Head a first time.

Mr. DAWSON inought in a Bill to enable the Leicester and
Swallingtou Railway Company to make auditional branches of
railway, which was read a first time.
Mr. PIIILLPoITs brought in a Bill to amend the Acts relat-
ing-to the Cheltenham and Gloucester Roads, and to provide
for the payment of certain mortgages.
Read a first time.
Mr. WASON gave notice of his intention to bring forward the
Suffolk Assizes Bill, on Friday, the .29th instant.

LIVERPOOL SHIPOWNERS' PETITION.
. Mr. EWART rose to present a petition from a number of
Shipowners of Liverpool, who owned 100,000 tons a British
shipping. They. prayed for no additional restriction upon trade,
but, on the contrary, for an extension of it. Hear, hear.) He
should not do justice to the petitioners if he did not read the
petition atlength.
_ _

To the llon-ourable the Commons of the United Kingdom of
Great Britain and Ireland, in Parliament assembled, the ham-
ble Petition of the undersigned owners V British Vessels trad-
ing from the Port of Liverpool,
" She weth—That 3-our
.petitioners labour under many disadvantages
in competition with foreign shipping, in consequence of the higner
cost of their vessels and the greater expense of navigating them, in
the charges for provisions, stores, and wages ; and also to their being
subjected to many imposts to which foreign ships are not liable, such
as the stamp duties on policies of insurance being one quarter, mid
often one half per cent. upon the value of their property on each
voyage. The South-sea dirty, still levied upon shipping, of one slin-
ling and sixpence per ton homewards, although goods outwards hiss •
for some time back been free from that duty. The Greenwich Doi -
pital dues of sixpence per month for each of the crew during tie
voyage, and the dread of the impress service—the most unjust, tyro,-
mezd, iniquitous practice of manning the navy, resorted to in time of
war, and which deters many youths of .respectable connections from
embracing the sea service as a profession.
" That in addition to the above serious disadvanfa;es, your petitio: -
ers, in their trade with Brazil, Cuba, St. Domingo, Java, Sincapon ,
Manilla, and the Indian Archipelago, are deprived of a large portion
of homeward freight, in consequence of the chief productions of those
countries being prohibited from use or consumption in this kingdonn
" That for the reasons before-mentioned, British shipping caunne
be navigated in cempetition with the American and other foreign
shipping, when carrycot cargoes to foreign ports, as besides the I'Mfa
expense at which tribal-1 vessels are navigated, they also incur a _
further charge for commission and management to a foreign agent,
and have to perform a second voyage in ballast to a British port, or
return in ballast to amore distant one for further employment.
" That Brazil alone furnishes freightage for one hundred and twenty
thousand tons of shipping annually in sugar and colke, nettry the
whole of which is imported as returns for British manufactures, ned
were the productions of. that country admitted for use or consumption
in this kingdom, they would be brought inwards and a great part
thereof re-exported in British vessels.
"That St. Domingo, Cuba, 'Manila, Sincapore, and the Eastern
Islands, likewise furnish upwards of two hundred thousand tons of si, •
milar productions, the greater part of which, as well as the produce of
Brazil, is carried by American and other foreign shipping to European
ports, although actually the property of British merchants, or recess',
in return for British manufactures.
" That the British trade with China is strictly confined to the Hem.
East India Conspany's ships, whilst Americans, Danes, Swedes, and
other nations tire permitted to sail from British ports with British
goods, freighted on British account, and to return with cargoes of tea
and other Chinese productions, to the various ports' of Continental
Europe, whilst the vessels owned by your petitioners are pr eluded
from every share of this profitable and extensive carrying trade.
" That yonr petitioners attribute the present depressed state of the
British Shipping Interest, mainly to those unjust and impolitic mono-
polies and restrictions, and that if the trade with the lit fire-named
countries were placed on a fair and liberal basis, additional employ-
ment would be given to a large extent of British tonnage, now lying
idle in the ports of this kingdom, or unprofitably employed in vain
competition with foreign slopping, trading to foreign parts.
" Your
_petitioners, therefore, humbly pray that your honourable
house will take this their petition into your most serious and imme-
diate consideration ; and that an interest, hitherto considered so im-
portant to the welfare and protection of this kingdom, may not be
suffered to go to decay, whilst the marine of our American and Conti-
nental rivals prospers by its destruction.
" And' your Petitioners will ever pray."
He most sincerely supported the prayer of the petition. He
could see no sources of relief from the grievances and depres-
sion under which the country now laboured, but from a dimi-
nution of taxation and the extension of commerce. Every
removal of the unjust and impolitic restriction and monopoly
which had hitherto incumbered and impeded the prosperity of
the country necessarily would go toward the diminution of tax -
atiou under which the country laboured.. He hoped that while
the people looked to the direct taxation, which was more iripme-
diately visible, they would not shut their eyes to that indirect
system of taxation arising from commercial restriction and
monopoly, which not only indirectly pressed upon them, Liu en
the commercial relations of the country. He hoped the sLsLi-
jectwould meet with the full consideration of Government',
It was connected with the sugar refining trade, a trade conside-
rablys reduced, the manufacturers nut having materials to cart y
on their work. He hoped that Ministers, as soon as possible,
would give them relief.
Lord SANDON was prepared generally to support the prayer
of the petition, althoUgh he could not enter into a discussion • f
all thte details contained in it. Each sentence admitted of a
long and important discussion; but at present he could only
say that he geueiaily approved of its prayer. -His wish was,.
that as much restriction as possible should be taken off com-
merce; but he did not agree, in that particular, to the full ex-
tent of the petition, that all articles of foreign produce should
admitted to free use in this country. Even on the produce of
our own colonies there were restrictions ; and it would intro-
duce complete confusion into the m hole commercial connection
of the country to grant the prayer of the petition to its full ex-
tent. He expressed his concur' ence iu that Mart of it which di-
rected the attention of Government to the duty ou marine
surances, whirl pressed very heavily on the conameree.of thin
' country. He hoped the Chancellor of the Exchequer would be
prepared to give some relief in that respect.
Mr. W. tit T Hermits: was of opinion that the utmost freedom
should be given to the commerce of this country from all res-
trictions and monopolies. He sincerely trusted that his Majes-
ty's government would seriously direct their attenticu to this
subject, as he was fully convince- d by that means alone coutti
the difficulties under which the commercial and shipping inter-
ests of the country labours, be removed.
Mr. EWART presented a petition from Glasgow to the 8817,6'
effect. Also a petition from the bankers, merchants, and•houK-
holders of Liverpool, complaining of corporation abuses, cor-
porate preference, and of the want ofudequate inquiry and con-
trol. The lion. member also presented a petition from the Jews
of Liverpool, praying for the removal of their disabilities. •
Lord SANDON expressed himself favourable to the remoNal
of these disabilities.

Mr. GRANT also presented several petitions from the inhabi-
tants of Liverpool. Also a petition from the inhabitants of Li-
verpool, praying for 'a relaxation of the severity of the crimi-
nal laws. Also. a petition from the Commissioners of pollee,
praying for the hat °dm:6°n of poor laws-into Ireland.
Mr. HATComn,•the member for Dover, took the oaths all his
seat, and the Speaker then left the

. MARY-LE-BONE ELECTION.—This contest ended on Tue,:-
day, at four o'clock, by the return of Sir Samuel Whale,.
Ent., in the room of 'E. B. Portman, Esq., who has accepted !lit-
Chiltern Hundreds. Atthe conclusion of the poll the numlicrt
w.eke 4s follows:
Whalley
I(i)
Murphy'

- - '287,0
- - - '2075