The Liverpool Standard and General Commercial Advertiser.
Liverpool, Merseyside, England, 1833-04-12 00:00:00

THE LIVERPOOL STANDARD.

even with 60 beds the Infirmary would not be large enough, and if
'more were added it would. become so unwieldy that one com-
mittee eould- not properly conduct it. Even since 50 beds had
been added 30 or 40 patients per week: had been unavoidably
rejected, and ou the average 7 cases. per day were unpro-
YAW: for, at the present. 't hey were told that some cases
should not be admitted, but supposing that- M should, it
would leave the number which their 50 beds would have pro-
vided fora He could say, that those who had originated this
scheme had not done so with the idea of intercepting the sub-
scriptions of those who subscribed to the infirmary, for if any
person felt inclined to withdraw from it, they did not want
their support. Their dependence was on such as had not been
applied to before, or did not think of coming forward until
necessity required it. A person had been employed to look
through the directory, and there were pages and pages not
containing an individual who subscribed to the Infirmary, and
consequently there was no fear of their interfering with it.
He agreed with Mr. Hodgson that there was such a good feel-
ing in the town that no appeal was ever made to it on behalf
01 the necessitous without a plentiful supply to meet it. (Ap-
plause.) There were many cases that could not be taken to
the Infirmary on account of its distance, and many others
would not because they might be kept throe or four weeks
before admittance: (Hear.) He did net attribute any blame
to the management, for accidents had invariably been admit-
ted; but acute and inflammatory diseases would not bear any
delay. It had been urged that the establishment would be
holding out a bonus to paupers; but surely no person would
be foolish enough for that reason to throw themselves wilfully
into the way of aecident. He had seen with regret that many
had thrown themselves into the hands of empyrics because they
wished to have medical aid cheap. He entreated those who
had fears, to pause before they threw any obstacles into the
way, as the very fears they entertained might give rise to the
very evil they dieaded. 'I hey proffered the hand. of friendship
--let it not be rejected. He then concluded by seconding the
resolution.

The Rev. J. B. Monk inquired whether the meeting was not
to consider the propriety of an additional hospital.
The Mayor said, that the Meeting had been called for the
purpose of promoting the establishment of an additional Hos-
pital; and although Mr. Monk might nerhaps. he out of order
in opposing that object, yet he did not think there could be any
objection to his stating his reasons for adopting such course.
Rev. J. B. Monk, in continuation, said, that he was not an
enemy to the proposed establishment, and he felt astonished
that the idea should have originated, that there was any feeling
of jealousy on the part of the Infirmary Committee.
Mr. Rector Campbell thought, that Mr. Monk should enter
upon the discussion with great caution, and if he had the least
hostile feeling, in the present state of things, it would be better
for him to sit down.

Rev. C. T. Giadwin. bad no doubt that Mr. Monk was actu-
ated by the purest motives, and expressed a wish that he should
be heard.

The Rev. J. B. Monk again disclaimed all feelings of hosti-
lity. He had read over the report with care, and found nothing
in it to justify the present proceedings; and it was all assump-
tion, with tins exception, that the committee in 1825 had been
unable to accommodate patients, since which 50 beds had been
added. Several persons had refused to go to the saine place'
with certain unfortunate individuals ; but, as a separate accom-
modation was now being built for them, that objection would be
removed. Since 1825 the accommodation had' increased with
the population. At'that time there were one hundred and eighty
beds, since then one hundred had been added, and the popula-
tion had not increased in that. proportion. In short, the necessity
of the case, in his mind, had not been made out, although
the arguments had been very eloquently and abiy handled
by his friend Mr. Hodgson. The accommodation at present in
the Manchester Infirmary, did not equal their own, to it were
conveyed the sick from Rochdale, Oldham, Manchester, Sal-
ford, and Stockport. (Mr. Hope, Stockport has an Infirmary.)
It was building, but not yet finished. The present funds of the
two great charities, the Infirmary and Dispensary, did not
amount to £5OOO per annum. Of the £2300 given to the Dis-
pensary nearly £BOO was subscribed by the parish and other
great bodies in the town; the same was nearly the case with
tne Infirmary. Was it probable, after the great exertions Made
to raise this sum, that £3OOO in• addition would be procured?
The proposed plan would require £l5OO per annum, and the
patients to be received in the new buildings of the Infirmary
would require as much. It seemed, therefore, only prudent to
wait unfit the Infirmary had secured a sufficient support for
their additional patients. He could ask for that delay, as he
felt assured that the committee and trustees of the Infirmary
would not have ventured upon their new buildings had this new
Hospital been proposed before the commencement of their
works. But if they were to proceed with both places at once,
he was persuaded they would both fail, or if the new Hospital
was supported it would probably cause an equal number of beds
to remain vacant in the Infirmary, and thus the suffering poor
would receive no additional relief. But, after a little delay, if the
necessity for a new establishment was found to be urgent, it
might be carried forward with much less difficulty, and both in,
stitutions might go on and prosper. He agreed with Mr. Glad-
win, that the present Infirmary was large enough, and ought not
to be increased, were not the Lock Hospital absolutely required.
All that he requested was, that they would wain a little time
until their affairs were effectually settled.
Dr. Collins wished to reply to the last speaker, the general
tenor of whose observations were so unjust and injurious to the
new Hospital. He said that the gentleman who first spoke had
not made out any case, and that he thought the idea of a new
Infirmary not justified in the least,—the necessity of which was
allowed in almost every society he had mixed with. He said,
that the present Infirmary would be large enough when the
Lock-Hospital was added; but he would ask, were they to de-
prive those unfortunate creatures who might now be suffering
from sickness and disease of medical aid until those buildings
were completed? By doing that, they caused a direct injury to
the town, and he was surprised that any opposition should arise
from the last speaker, for, of all others, clergymen should bind
closer the bonds of charity. Since the erection of the Infir-
mary, the population had increased 50,000, and there irad not
been a corresponding increase in accommodation at the Infir—
mary. Thirty or forty persons were every week rejected, which
demonstrated, as clear as the noonday sun, the necessity of
such an erection as that now proposed. The Infirmary was
opened for admission once a-week ; this. might do for chronic
diseases, and those of a lingering character, not requiring
prompt attendance; but suppose an inflammatory bowel com-
plaint, which decides itself in. two or three days, were taken
there, and refused, it might prove fatal to the patient ;—this
was sufficient to attest the necessity of another Hospital. Belt
to look at it in another point of view. In consequence of the
increasing size of the town, the removal of the patient*as dan-
gerous to a great distance, whereas, were an Hospital in the
vicinity, there would be a greater chance of his recovery, whilst
one or two miles might hurry a man into a premature grave.
Mr. Rector Campbell felt confident that in opposing the
erection of a new hospital it would not be attributed to his
wish to stop the course of Christian charity, which was very
far from his intention. There were very few in that room who
would accuse a clergyman of attempting to sever the bonds of
charity, and if he thought that any one would consider it an
Act of hostility, he 'would hold his. tongue. All were agreed
that an additional hospital was desirabie; but the considera-
tion was, could they. get the necessary money, and it resolved
itself entirely into a question of finance, and if it was ;neon-
testibla that they could both go into the town and collect
money at the same time, all lie could say was, "In God's
name do it." He feared they would not be able to carry it
through, and that they would injure the funds of the Infirmary.
He would take upon himself the responsibility which Mr. Hodg-
son had made awful, as he feared the consequence would be
that the committee of the Infirmary would be thereby com-
pelled to shut up some of the wards. The prospects of an in-
crease in subscription were not so good as some gentlemen
would lead them to believe, the field had been already well cul-
tivated. The committee had taken the greatest possible pains.
The fact was, that the public charities of Liverpool were sup-
ported by SW individuals, and although the population had in-
creased.so rapidly, the subscriptions had not increased in pro-
portion ; it was not for want of diligence, as every exertion had
been used by the members of the Infirmary. He agreed with
Mr. Monk, that if their project had existed prior to the coin-
' mencement of the Lock Hospital, the latter ought to have been
given up, as he considered that it was the best, on account of
the great distance of the Infirmary from the northern parts of
the town; but the'Lock Hospital having been commenced, he
thought they ought to postpone the new' hospital, for, if they.
enter the town together,• both would fail. lf, however, they
felt satisfied they could get an additional £3OOO, let them go on
in God's name.
The Rev. J. B. Monk thought the imputation cast upon him by
Dr. Collins totally undeserved,•as he had no other motive for
speaking as he had done than to serve the cause of charity.
Mr. Aspinall; as Treasurer to the Infirmary, said, that with re-
spect to the finances of the' Infirmary and Dispensurids, they
would find the subscriptions decreasing to .both for the last three.
years. The census of population in 1821, was 151,000; in 1831,
210,000, taking in the suburbs. In 'lB2l, the subsciiptions to the
Infirmary were £2105, and in 1831 ..C2670, thus the.population had
increased more than one-third, while the subscription had only
increased £565. The expenditure in 131, was £sB2e); and
last year the subscription had decreased £oo. Towards these
was received ,from Corporation bonds £5O, fom Dock bOnds
£.I, from ground rents £157105., for the board of patientrin the'

Lunatic Asylum £2050, for patients in the Infirmary £6O, an
for sundries £216, so that with. the additional Lock Hospital
that was now building, to contain upwards of 70 beds, they
would have to look to the benefactions of the public for the
support of the Infirmary alone of nearly £2OOO every year.
If the public were aware how uncoul teously they weresometimes
received whilst their soliciting for subscriptions, they would
shudder, and he wished it known that many who received thou-
sands of pounds from the town, did not contribute one far-
thing to any of the Charities. He was certain more than '
£3OOJ a-year would be required for the management of the
Hospital, and if the projectors had the experience he possessed,
they would see the impracticability of raising that sum at pre-
sent in the town. _

Dr. Carson, as an old practitioner in the town, begged to
offer a few remarks. He considered that day would be a new
Era in the Medical History of Liverpool. The question ap-
peared to him to embrace two points,—the rendering more
efficient the medical practitioner; and the better accommoda-
tion of the poor: and whatever could render the medical man
more efficient must of necessity. contribute to the comfort and
relief of the poor. Hospitals must be considered as monopolies,
in opposition to the medical men of the town, and it might be ar-
gued whether they had pvcr been of decided benefit to the poor of
the country, and the monopolies effected by them should, as far
as possible be removed. He conceived that having another
Hospital in this town would be the means of discovering lurk-
in" talent in the medical practitioner, and on that ground he
should advocate the establishment of the new Infirmary. With
respect to funds, it appeared to him that there were a great
number of opulent persons who did not subscribe at all, which
it would not be right to attribute to their want of charity, as
they might be dissatisfied with the present Establishment, and
thus they would both be benefitted by the rivalry existing be-
tween them. For his own part he disclaimed all personal views,
as he had served a very long period in the Charities, but he
considered that the abilities of the medical men would be en-
hanced by it.

Mr.. Samuel Hope thought that he could suggest a 'plan that
would suit both parties, that before any farther proceedings were
undertaken, an active canvass should be made with a view of
ascertaining whether they could raise the sum of £1,200, which
they required, and if they could they might then go safely on
without the fear of impairing the efficiencies of the present
Infirmary.

Mr. A. Hodgson perceived nothing in Mr. Hope's sugges-
tion that would not be effected by the original motion, as it
was stated, that the Hospital would not be commenced until
the subscriptions were obtained. No one would subscribe to
the uncertain scheme, but say, get the I:800 you require first,.
and then come to me.

Mr. Freme, sen., said, it appeared to be the opinion of many'
that tire-present Infirmary would not be strpported if the new.
one were commenced, but he never knew an instance when
the town of Liverpool would submit to have the house shut for
want of funds. What objection was there to a smaller one for
the benefit of the poor, and the medical practitionersi—there
was plenty of wealth in the town, and let it be put to the test;
the more the public are applied to,. the more liberal they would
be, and let them not check that spirit through want of canvas-
sing them. There were funds enough in the town, not merely
to supply one, but two Infirmaries ; and that would be an in-
creased stimulant to the town to subscribe more. If there was
a feeling in the town to be liberal, why not afford an opportunity
of subscribing this money, as it was well known the more libe-
red feelings were excited the stronger they became.
Mr. W. W. Currie thought they ought to make an attempt by
canvassing as soon as possible for to procure the requisite funds,
if they failed they would be satisfied that they had left nothing
undone for the success of their undertaking, and come forward
again at a future period.
Mr. Carr asked Mr. Brown whether it was intended to con-
fine the operation of the Hospital to the neighbourhood in
which it might be located, or to make it generally useful.
Mr. Brown replied that it certainly was intended to be gene-
rally useful, but that it should be located in the north.
The resolution was then put by the mayor and carried unani-
mously.
The Rev. Mr. Buddicom begged to move the second resolution,
"That a subscription be now entered into, and that books for
that purpose be placed in the different Banks." He said that
there had not been merely an increase of the population, but par-
ticnlarly of the pauper population.
Mr. Cartwright seconded the resolution, which was carried
unanimously.
Mr. Brown was glad that no one doubted the expediency of
the proposed measure, but that their sole reason for opposing
it was with reference to their finances. He, however, had no
difficulty on this point, as he felt convinced that they should
derive a considerable income from donations, a point which the
worthy Bailiff had overlooked. He had a resolution to move
that their excellent chief magistrate, Charles Horsfaik h'sq.
should- be their Chairman for the ensuing year.
The Rev. Mr. Lawrence seconded the resolution. He had no
doubt of their success. The Liverpool Provident Society was
a brilliant example•before their eyes.
This resolution was carried by acclamation, and the Mayor
briefly returned thanks for the honour done him.

Mi. W. W. Currie then proposed the following gentlemen as
a committee:—

Rev. P. Buddicom I T. K. Hitssal

Rev. C. T. Gladwin I Ambrose Lace
Rev. Lawrence I James Lawrence
Rev. Robinson i Harmood Banner

T. R Horsfall
W. W. Currie.
Jno. R. Freme.
Lewin Mozley
Chris. Rawdon
Jas. Dawson
Robert Bieliirsteth

Rev. Thom

Samuel Hope

Wm. Brown
Jas. Ackers

Adam Hodgson
C. F. Dickson

Cartwright Win. Russell
G. J. Wainwright Charles Warner
Mr. H. Banner seconded the resolution, and it was car Died
unanimously. _ _

----- The Mayor having vacated the chair, the thanks of the meet-
ing to him were proposed by Mr. H. Banner, seconded by Mr.
James Ackers, and carried by acclamation.