The Liverpool Standard and General Commercial Advertiser.
Liverpool, Merseyside, England, 1835-02-24 00:00:00

FEBRUARY ;14, 1835'

Duke of Somerset was-appointed master ofthe horse hene,lol
attended-the privy council meetings, and when the Earl a
beinarie held a similar situatiou he alsu declined attending;
If the right hon. gentleman had signified that such a Pli
ing would _not be becoming in him, if he had intialaute,
slightest wish that he thought such a proceeding inc -:
with his public character, he would have been at once es
-The number of privy councillors is not so small as to
7,
'"
the attendance of every individual—they au.sunt iu all t 0
and upwards, and it therefore cannot be necessary t
Speaker of the House of Commons should appearthere ag,,
the known opinion—against what would have been theder4
opinion of that House of Commons. (Loud cries of ' a
hear.") -I think it cannot be doubted that the right hens°
would hardly have done that, if we were in the
middle et',
sion of parliament--if it was, for instance, during the
recess, I fancy he would not have attended four or heels
councils, and be prepared to meet parliament, and ask for
approbation for' a provisional ministry, consisting solet10!
entirely of the Duke of Wellington. (Loud cheerumo iiii
regard to the charge of degradation that has been matte, t''
that the right hon. gent. cannot view it in such a ' hlefea
there is nothing in the question that would make that gentile
retire from this house with mortified or painful feelings..,
the oritgilly;tphoeinn.t thego(nmwtiteifiectille,s question turns is with re'l7,:il
po►
proposinglbias.iticalhn
istk:n a fi
the hon.,rtn
for Yorkshire observed when inerobsot
stun, his political feelings did not remain inert, but got the
of him, and made him do acts which, as the Speaker of tiler
he should have avoided. 'Phis would be a ground-with nit,',
fess, for having the election of speaker pure; and it is usj
my reasons fur not choosing the right lion. geutleinau. (t
hear.) It has been urged that Lord Grey's Kw:criminal,
proved of the right hon gentleman on two occasions- ' -
respect to the first of them, it was in the year 1831, wilt
right hon. gentleman still continued in the office of spell,
and nothing occurred to -render his removal necessary, t°
pod of the session of 1832. On the other occasion the
,hou, gentleman did retire—he stated to the house that hlss,
acted as speaker for six sessions, and he asked its pernsisse"
retire. 1. think that the right hon. gentleman will admit,
was not one of the most grudging of those who offered
_.,
tribute of approbation and praise to that right hon. gentle",
(dear, hear.) 1 bore inv testimony to kis conduct, durio
siding of parliament, and 1 believe that he behaved in the,,
exemplary manner. If he had any pasty- bias he did o°'
tempt to shew it, nor was there that danger to be apprehe'a
from its_ indulgence than when it was a weak party that 1:°.
happen now.
,In 1832, the right hon. gentleman having ret''
and havint, obtained by act of parliaineut his retiring P 5
he was elected speaker the following session. I know tints ,•
the objects or feelings of, those who proposed him were, ht',
my part 1 felt exceettnigly solititous for the character:of-0e;
rosined' House of Partiamept. '-' (Heap hear.)' Tffereil,
doubt, iu grunt of intelligence,-iu point of honesty, and i'e
of integrity, it was far superior to any other house that Imaa_w
sat, but I did feel sure that, having a great number of me;.,
who had not turned their attention to parliamentary forrn9i; v
might nut be some deficiency in those forms, which would
come the subject of undeserved obloquy. From these grog
I departed from my views, which exactly were, that the s'l,
should be the organ and representative of the house. hear.) ' I shall now turn to a question, which, 1 think, by .B,l!rir
.most important, namely. how.far public principle is involv`if
i,
our present choice. 1 thick it is necessary to place in that c„
a man who is zealous on behalf of the liberties of the pe°;,
zealous on behalf- of popular prerogatives, to be the orgsgos
this house to the Crown, to represent their feelings tics
zealously, and without fear of offending, or a wish to conr''',,
those who have the power of dispensing favours. T 0 his 1 .
doctrine of the reformed House of Commons, whicb i'rt:i
especially necessary to vindicate at the present moment.
parliament which, I shall sac, was as loyal to the Crown as?,.
parliament that ever existed was suddenly dissolved. it is',
well-known prerogative oft he Crown, and that prerogative 00.
serted; but when this naked sword wits drawn, it was ueee. 0,
to have the shield and buckler of popular privileges. (Deed/
I know of no right more sacred or less to be infringed, that'll,
of this house placing its representative in the chair. Vie,,S
but
all been sent here by persons, not because they like our man
because they agree with us in our political sentiment', i
because the think that we will reform abuses. (Loud chee;i
So I say. Let us, let all who wish to see reform of abi,la
have a speakeriu this house to aid us in those reforms.
was the doctrine in ancient times, when the Prerogative ts
f
also asserted,ias in the time of Charles the Second, when Al
tempt was made to force upon the House aeon:m(4ls a spell ,1
favourable to the court. 'the attempt was resisted, and sacr•
fully resisted, still I will call the attention of the house leg
moment to the sentiments expressed by Sir Herbert John'tf•
' and Mr. Sergeant Williams upon that occasion. The le:of
ments of those eminent men were very different from t"s
which I have heard to-day. (Cheers.) Sir H. Grinistone al:
with indignation;." shalt We not have the liberty of choosini,
own servant to do' our own work as we wish it done." Is)
again, when. he called upon "every man to consider the tt
of the people of England." (Great cheering.) This' is
n wit°;;
say on the present occasion. I also say, let eve- man here',
suer the rights of the Commons of England. (Great cheerio!,
We have for our choice a man of the character I have ei
tioued, who, in addition to-his legal and historical kunol!,s
adds a sound knowledge of the constitution and the priar':,
of the liberty of the people: (Hear.)- Let us give the entre
an earnest that we mean to set zealously about reform-41't
are not going to deceive the people by mock reform—let asst
that, with undoubted loyalty to the Crown, we are deterinisa
to maintain the privileges of the Coinumns. (Treatises'
'cheering.)
Sin ItoBEET PEEL then rose, and was received with 15,;
cheers. He said—l will pursue the course generally adl r
by every one who has addressed the house, namely, th'_.4
4ainiting the discussion on the present occasion to the matte,o,
kateaEton. I appear here as a 'witness to perform a task I feed;
[ wholly unnecessary, that of confirming, so far as- ray tee,
apathy can, the accuracy of my right hon. friend (Sir C. AL !ass tys
n.) As to what took place previous to:my arrival ill, li
country. I will stay nothing. I will speak only with regard
what I know myself. In undertaking the duty-assigned tiro;
_by his_ Maiwily,,ol4.o. least•saortly afierwards—l -bud •an in "sr
v4aissasitisaat-sieto 4...rfeinmtkl... friend -Sir Charles Ntanni•
Sutton, amid informed ininisf. the task Iliad undertaken, and
the principles upon which I was determined to proceed, nateesa
'that I should seek for aid iu the performance of that taskfrvf"l
every man whoin I thought could unite with me consistent'i,
with his honour. I asked Lim, respecting, as I did, his abdit:)
and experieuce in. public-life, whether it was consistent °do
his feelings and sense of duty to enter into the services of
111
Crown ? (Cheers.) Sir, I received from the right honour" 0
gentleman this answer, that he did not seek employment s
an official capacity in the service of the Crown,
0,
there is,
defect in that which I will supply, as probably that o.'o,
main reason which iuduceds him at such a time to "I la
hold his services from his Mkjestv ; he stated I 111 I
served in the- Chair for a period of' eighteen years, eo;',,
do feel that if I were now to enter into the arena of discuesi°
I should, after so long a service in the, and my personal c°,:1.1
nexion with, the authOrits of that situatiou, 'I she°,
run the risk of lowering it, if T appeared in the House of C(l.,
mons as a member of the government. (Cheers.) 'chat ":„.
the reason, sir, my friend assigned to one for his willingo,7„,
nay, his desire, to withhold his service upon that occasisli
(Cheers.) When I understood from my natithon. friend tP
he was not willing, upon that ground, to enter into the saratraief
of the Crown as a member of the House of coilloion fear' if
that there might be something that might lower his authority 4
he became a member of the government at a time when it s.f‘i '
likely that there would be a stormy discussion, I aid not lebei.,
it to be my duty to consult my right hon. friend either as t0t,,,-
formation of the government or its policy--a great cheeSingid.
and not one word passed between my right hon. friend airlin4 '
self upon the subject. (Hear.) I then asked him whetheei:o
would wish again to fill the chair of the House of CommOo'.li
case of a dissolution. (Cheers.) : My right hon. friend s''
that he had no wish or feeling upon thubject, that it isle°
e s
matter in which he could have no personal interest, frogs t liberality towards hint of the House of Commons. (Cheer
t'i
At the same time he stated that the impediment of ill heel J
whiAli had led him to inediaite retirement no longsr existedrsila
if I thought..the public had claims on a continuation Of bo
services, so lung as health would permit him to exercise v
duties he would not withhold himself from the House of COl,
molts. Such were the circutnstauces, and such the course Oh
sued by my right hon. friend, and the question now is, whether'
since lie -has been proposed, and professed his williugness...,
serve the office of speaker, it is right and fitting that ttristorte
should select another. (Cheers.) The noble lord 0pp051,3
says that we have a right to choose whom we please. I adtt'i's
that proposition to the fullest extent. But I say that the no'
lord who professes to be loudest iu favour of the public gov",
ought not to insist upon an abstract right; but ought to e();
eider, iii an instance like the present, ;o:ether that right eef
be exercised with
,justice. ' (Cheers.) • The noble lord saystbs_
he would bring forward precedents; in all his historical rfi
search he can only produce one against the reformed parliarneßs,
under the government of Lord Grey—(hear,
Fletcher Norton e
ample of Lord North, in the session when Sir
—a worthy example truly—tgreat cheering)—the great obje': 4
Lion to Sit:Fletcher Norton being a speech which he had nlof
at the bar. The noble lord cited a case in question—that ea
Lord North; that Lord North answered to this. Did IO
North, however,present a case parallel to this? Did not Lot;
North substitute that by reason tif ill health a Sir Fletcher. Nest° ii
resigned the duties of the chair, such was the case under Le,
North's administration. Lord North was so convinced that wht:
ever might abstractediv.he the right of exeicising thiS Oivilegl
he must tie compelled to invent Some other'pretence for Os
giving a tru6 - -reason - why hi did so. The noble lard ales
has another precedent. But if the noble lord has that preeei
dent, he must have concocted that precedeut when he .though
that change had arrived which rendered it in perative for a ne”,
Speaker to be elected. (I-lear.) But 1 ask the noble lord whr
titer this charge was not instituted against my hon. friend '''
' the belief that he had been instrumental in 'instigating a disco"lution of parliament. The noble lord has cited anolber cases
-also that of Sir Edward Seymour,-The House of Comin°°-
then elected a Speaker. (Here an hon. niember observed
"Against the wishes of the Clown.") Against—against! '
care not who it would be against, though I ought to beg pardon
for any apparent warmth which may be observable. M v sitar
tion is far too onerous for me to set an example of warmth in
this house. The case which the noble lord has cited is no es'e 0
at all. The Crown wished to elect a Speaker, another 4,
;
elected by the houL. in his stead; but I would- ask the hen'i
and the noble lord whether the case which has been arldue
has any reference to time slate of the circumstances at preset'."
and were not totally different .frone thern ? Not- in the tear
doubting your right, as far as the office is concerned—but 4_l
just, or is it fait towards time individual, looking at it in lit ses.l47'
of ccmmon justice and common fairness, that the
caul? POI%
gent. who has received that election during six seveasiva Par
liaments—against whom no charge has' been bristigliwh"r"
health permit's him to exercise its most arduoas diities;and e'}'"'
without one motive of personal interest to 'gratify, has consent'
ed to undertake the performance of its FalioluiS ?" The question
then resolves itself whether you will pernsit a Speaker to- suffer 1
by six weeks of uncontradicted calumny against hiut.—( Cheer/
l'tiay never contradicted by himself 'en
.authority, 4ticl whie,
calumnies have aroused the feelings of indignationswhich have
been displayed througl'imit time house.—(l-lour, hear.) Note,
Sir, I again repeat, inay. I ask the noble lord, and I um sure
the candottS of the. no,ble lord will instantly avow it, whether
this change wi;s not instituted from the supposition that tt
right hen, friend had been instrumental in promoting a disci'
',moo of i;:iitiameot ?
Spveraf voices—" No doubt." .

Lord Jous lit;ssELt —My impression extended no further
than that he attended in the formation f thatgovernment
front its position, could do no otherwise. My grounds a ob;
jectiou were certainly founded on the supposizion that he ha'
been a party to that advice by which the tate. parliament *4l
dissolved, - •
• Sir R. PEEL resumed.-11 this was their impression, IW.
the members of this house will have the manliness to keep LA,
their terms of opposition, but if they had determined to oppee"
on most other grounds 1 hive Ibat,eonlidence in their honour
th t they will relinquish their opposition-=( Hear, hear.) What
are the arguments which have been used.in favour of the other
side of the question? One honourable gentleman says
the speaker shoidd always represent the- majority of the house'
Is that a principle which ought to Le established ?—(Nu,,llo')
Is it wise that a speaker should be seeking favour with $
majority of the house of commons, to secure his election?'
( hear. hear.) is it nut infinitely wiser to look at his (mantic.;
tions for 011ie rather • than to look et his political twining'',
12. et that question was decided by the first rerormed parhanntlin