The Liverpool Standard and General Commercial Advertiser.
Liverpool, Merseyside, England, 1833-02-22 00:00:00

DISTURBANCES IN IRELAND BILL.

Bad GREY moved the second reading of this bill.
The Earl of WICKLOW said that in justice to that wretched
country, (Ireland) he must lend his assistance to any measure
by which it would be relieved from its present situation, and
he could not do so better than by supporting the -bill before
their lordships. He had joined with others, sometime since, iu
noshing for strong measures for the security of life and property;
and the vindication of the authority of the laws in Ireiaud, but
they had heretofore been answered by a reference to the
ordinary powers of the law, and were told by the noble and
learned lord on the woolsack, that the government of that'
country possessed the power, if necessary, of suspending the
habeas corpus act. Instead, however, of any thing of that kind
being done, the agitators had been allowed to carry on their
proceedings with Impunity, and had even been favored with
silk gowns and patents of precedency. (Hear.) Considering
these things, he must say he looked upon the change which had
so suddenly. "come over the spirit of the dreams" of his
Majesty's ministers with something like surprise. [The noble
cart then adverted to the elections m Ireland, and said that the
contest lay between the Radicals and the individuals called
Conservatives.] The Whigs wore every where scouted, and it
was with a view to retain the power whieb they now possessed
that they come forward with these measures—measures which
they know that noble lords at his side oftlit house would,
without any reference to party feeling—(laugMer)--support.
lie could not, however, refrain from expressing his honor of
the doctrines promulgated by a minister of tne Crown iu
another place, upon a measure which was not then before their
lordships, and which he trusted never would be. (Hear.) He
could not but feel deeply at the effort to lay sacrilegious hands
upon that venerable fabric—the church of Ireland. Was that
dune to please the taste and gratify the eye of the agitator of
the day? They would be told, uo doubt, that the policy. of
Ineasures of conciliation going along with measures .of coercion
was a wise one. He contended that such a line Cif policy was
leily holding a prize to -the Irish agitator, for pursuing his
disgraceful calling. (Hear, hear.) The first thing they should
do was to see that the authority of the law was established, and
teach the agitator and his dupes,that lawless violeuoe would 'be
put. down; and, this being done, then the government should
come forward and grant measures as a boon which, if this
course were not adopted, would be said to be forced from them
by fear. (Hear.) He would-support the 'measures before their
lordships, but he could not but consider the hands in which it
was going to be intrusted. It was a fact, that every .party in
Ireland exclaimed against the conduct pursued by the Lord
Lieutenant of that country. The noble marquess was unjustly
treated, and he said so when he (the Earl of Wicklow) brought
a charge against the government of Ireland last session. tie
thought then, and he now thought that-no one-was more anxious
to serve that country than the noble marquess. (Rear.) He
hoped the noble lord would be allowed to act for himself. But
he was overridden by the secretary for Ireland, and he -must
say it was a very bad system to have a secretary for Ireland a
cabinet minister. Ha:must necessarily assume a dictation over
the acts of the noble lord. (Hear.) He did not say this against
the right hon. seerp4ry. for Ireland, but against -the system.
He trusted that if th 4 right hon. gentleman were appointed to
another place in the councils of the King, that he would be
succeeded by. a person, possibly_ not of as great talents but of
greater experience. .(Hear.) He trusted that the noble mar-
quess would be allowed to exercise his own views as to the mode
and manner in which the measure before their lordships should
be carried into effect. He should give his assent to .the bill.
(Hear.)
Lord MELBOURNE said he could not allow some of the re-
marks of the noble earl to pass without observation. He assured
their lordships that every effort had been given by the govern-
ment of Ireland to give effect to the existing laws in Ireland.
With respect to the delay of the measure before the house, he
must own that he pleaded guilty to the charge of delay. It was
nut until all other efforts were made to support the authority of
the law that this measure was proposed. The noble earl com-
plained of measures of conciliation and coercion going hand in
hand. He owned that he thought the policy a wise one. The
language of the noble earl had been too long used to the people
of Ireland. It was used and acted upon in 1786 and 1787.
When Mr. Grattan brought forward his measure respecting
tithes, coercion was used, but no redress followed (hear, hear),
tend the consequence was the present state of things. The noble
earl had only done justice to the noble marquess at the head of
the government in Ireland; and he only regretted that the noble
earl had adopted the course he had, as it would only tend to
weaken any
_powers which might be intrusted to that noble
marquess. With respect to the allusions made to the right hon.
Secretary for Ireland, he could assure the -noble earl that no
inconvenience such as that adverted to could or did arise in the
administration of affairs in England.
The Earl of LONG CURD thought that the noble marquess had
misgoverned Ireland, and,that by his conduct he was incapacited
tom holding the reins of government in that country. He con-
tended that the Protestants of Ireland had no confidence in the
noble marquess, and it was unjust to them that he should be
again suffered to go to that country.
The Earl of RODEN bore testimony to the necessity of such a
measure as that before their lordships being passed into a law.
Nothing short of it would do. He had, iu the last session, laid
a strong case before their lordships respecting Ireland, but they
would not attend to him. He was glad, however, to see that
his Majesty's government took shame to themselves. (No, no.)
Then they ought if they had not done so. He denied that the
-law was vigorously enforced in Ireland, and he contended that
the magistrates were not supported. He trusted his Majesty's
ministers would not give up any of the provisions of the bill in
toe other house, for if they did the peace and tranquillity of
Ireland would be in danger. lie could never look' back with-
out regret to a measure which passed that house in 1829, (the
Catholic question ;) for to that he attributed all the misery that
had once, and at the present timeaffiicted Ireland. The noble
earl (Grey) had himself lately admitted that he- had been griev-
ously disappointed in the benefits he expected to follow to Ire-
land from that measure ; and he (Earl Roden) believed that
the noble duke (Wellington) by his side was also much disap-
pointed on that head. lie (Earl Roden) opposed that mea-
sure from political and religious motives. In the present bill,
however, he would most cordially unite with his Majesty's mi-
'misters, in the hope that by its application to the evils that now
afflicted the unhappy country to which he belonged, they would
be enabled to save even the wreck, and keep the vessel a little
lonr above water. With respect to the powers to be given
ge by aris bill to the Lord Lieutenant, he did not think they were
tootxtensive or severe. He differed very widely from the no-
ble marquess who was, at present, at the head of the Irish go-
vernment upon political matters, as regarded Ireland, but he
had a great regard for the private character of that nobleman,
and he (Earl Roden) doubted not that in the exercise of the
powers giVen to him by this bill, the noble marquess would be
directed by the excellent feelings that belonged to his heart,
and that In putting down disaffection he would restore peace
aid security to the country. The noble marquess might feel
-Assured, that to attain thi, desirable object, he should have his
('Earl Roden's) best assistance as a magistrate. He could not
sit down without saying a word in deprecation of the measure
respecting the church of Ireland that had recently been intro-
duced in the other house of Parliament. He felt convinced,
that that measure would be the ruin of the Protestant church
in that country, and would speedily be followed by equally disas-
trous consequences to the established church in England.
The Marquess of CLANRICARDE, said, that he could not avoid
alluding to one part of the noble earl's observation, or suffer it
to pass unnoticed : he meant the disappointment of which the
noble earl had spoken with reference to the Catholic relief bill.
He knew not what hopes might have been entertained by the
noble duke (Wellington) opposite, but he (the NI arquess of Clan-
ricarde) felt that the main feature of that measure, and the chief
grounds upon which it had been passed by the legislature, were
tally satistied.thul satisfactorily established; he meant the justice
of the cause itself, in giving to a great portion of the King's
subjects their undoubted rights to enjoy the full benefit of the
British constitution. (Cheers.) The evils that afflicted Ireland
at present did not by any means, as the noble earl supposed,
arise from the passing of the Catholic relief bill, but they arose
on the contrary from the too long delaying that measure of jus-
tice (Cheers,) and refusal to listen to the voice of wisdom that
had so long and loudly called for it. It had been said that much
evil had resulted from the want of proper and sufficient vigour
iu the administration of the existing laws in Ireland, by the pre-
snit govermnent. In reply to that, he could say, that fifteen
mouths ago the part of Ireland with which he was best ac-
quainted was in an extremely disturbed state, but by a vigorous
application of the powers of the law, tranquillity was restored,
ts-aa that poitiou or•lreland was now in a perfectly peaceable
state. He hoped that in the operations of the present bill, that
care would be taken that it should not be made an instiument
for sowing dissension iu the hands of the tithe collecting people
in that country. 'lie hoped that it would not be used to gratify
Lost class or faction. Ile supported-the bill, Lecome hoped