The Liverpool Standard and General Commercial Advertiser.
Liverpool, Merseyside, England, 1835-04-21 00:00:00

FOREIGN -INTELLIGENCE.

FRENCH CHAMBER OF DEPUTIES, APRIL 15,
THE AMERICAN CLAIMS ON PRANCE. .

The discussion of the bill relative to the American treaty was
resumed.
M. Dumon continued his summary, and replied to the several
arruirients adduced against the report.
Che chamber then proceeded to discuss the articles of the bill
on the American claims.
' The president read the article 1, to the effect that—" The'
Miuister of the Finances is authorised to take the necessary
measures for carrying into execution articles 1 and 2 of the
treaty signed on the 4th'of July, 1831, between the King of the
;French and the United States, the ratifications of which were
exchanged at Washington on the 2d of February, 1832, and
according to which a sum of 25 millions of francs is to be paid
by France."
M. Berryer ascended the tribune, and declared that nothing
could beanore unjust than to attribute to political opinions the
disapprobation of the bill expressed by the opposition deputies
of; the chamber. He was not unjust enough to say that ministers
defended the bill only with a view to keep their places, and that
their friends supported them only for the sake of the favours at
their disposal. (A laugh.) Ministers ought to he equally con-
siderate. It had been asked whether a single member of that
chamber could deny the justice of the American claims. He,
for his part, denied it; and he hoped to bring over to his way of
thinking such hon. deputies as wished conscientiously to discuss
the interests of the country. (Sensation.) The reporter of the
committee had stated that not only was the sum of 25,000,000.
due, but that the Americans might even have raised their pre:
tensions still higher. The hon. deputy then entered into some
considerations on the principle of neutrality. He denied the
assertion that America had been prevented by her feebleness
from resisting the pretensions of England, and he maintained
that it was a mercantile spirit which had stifled every sentiment
of honour in the bosom of the Americans. President Jefferson
had wished to resist England, but he had been prevented from
so doing by the interested speculators of America. They had
violated the prohibitions both of England and of France—they
had broken through the laws of their own country, and was
France now to recompense their cupidity ? (Hear, hear.)—
Whilst other powers sustained disastrous wars, Ainerica profited
by them, and yet she now demanded an indemnity ! He would
say that the Americans were paid. One of his correspondents,
had informed him that under the empire the English insurance
companies had guaranteed the American cargoes to such an
extent that the English insurers were now holding meetings in
London to form an opposition with the French government to
the payment of the 25,000.000. He contended that it would,be
icandaloui to pay an indemnity to a nation whieji had profited-
so exorbitantly at the expense of France. When he saw the
profits made by the Americans and the severe losses sustained
by French maritime places, and especially by Bourdeaux, for
which a claim was made to the amount of 10,000,000, he was
tempted to demand that compensation should be made for the
damages done to French trade, and nut for the supposed losses
sustained by Anamica; he almost thought that the Berlin and
Milan decrees should be enforced in favour of the trade of Bor-
deaux before the Americans were paid. He might be accused
of departing from the question ; he might he told that it was
worthy of France to treat the question according to the rules of
probity; for such was the language of the President of the
Council in his last speech. But, fur his part, he considered
political yrobity an enlightened virtue, and not a culpable
weakness which rendered a nation the dupe of interested
Cupidity. He would reduce the question to these simple terms :
—France had made a compromise; France was ready to pay
25,000,000 to those who had really suffered losses; but when
were those losses sustained, or could they be proved ? He could
see no proof of good faith, but rather of the contrary, in the
varying estimates which the Americans had formed of their
claims. M. Dimon had yesterday attached much importance
to the last document received by the government. That hon.
deputy seemed to entertain no doubt of the veracity of that do-
cument, which elevated to 99,000,000 the sum total of the claims
to be discharged out of the 25,000,000 promised in 1831. M.
Dimon thought that document worthy of implicit credit, as it
had been drawn up by the American committee after bearing
all the parties who were interested in the payment of the
25,000,000 of francs, and who exercised a mutual control over
their respective titles. He (the hon. deputy) bud not had much
time since yesterday to study the "document made out in 1834,
and from which an attempt was made to deduce such important
consequences; but be had ,made a few hasty. observations on
and he would now submit' them to the chamber. in the first
page of the documents printed in support of the report, he found
that a vessel hart been rejected, because it had been noted on
the returns of the American committee as an American vessel,
whereas it was in reality an English brig. That circumstance
proved that the justifications of the American commission were
not worthy of implicit credit. In the third page the ship Eliza
had. been rejected by the French commission, although it figured
in page 102 of .the American return. This was an additional
confirmation of his opinion that the American document was
not perfectly accurate. The reporter of the committee thought
otherwise. lie was of opinion that from the moment that the
claimants took their oaths and called themselves Americans or
claiming in behalf of Americans, no objection could be made ;
he (the lion. deputy) admired this singleness of heart, that dis-
believed the existence of trickery, but the inaccuracy of the
documents was not on that account the less apparent. he had
another remark to make. The object of the commission of
1831 was to summon all the legitimate claimants to participate
in the distribution of the 25,000,000 L It could not be-forgotten
that in 1803, at the period of the .cession of Louisiana, it .had
been- stipulated by the First Consul that 80,000,000 f. should be
paid to 1' ranee, but that 20,000,000 f. should be reserved to pay
off all`the claims prior to the month of September, 1800. Ne-
vertheless, the loyal government of the United.Stateshad not
paid its own subjects. (Great sensation.) In pioof of this
assertion he would read the ttillowing from the Afiniteur of the
19th of January, 1835 :—" A letter from Washington states
that Mr. Webster has presented to the Senate a bill for the
grant of an indemnity to the merchants who suffered losses from
France, before the Ist of October, 1800. Mr. Webster estimates
the indemnity at 5,000,000 of dollars." It was then manifest
that the American government kept the money received by it to
make the payments in question. (Agitation.)
The President of the Council said that Mr. Webster's deMand
was in addition to the 20,000,000 f. previously distributed.—
' (Murmurs from-the left.)
M. Berrver said that the American government hadudinitted
that the 20;000,000f. retained of the price of the cession of Lou--
isiaua would exceed the amount of the debts to be paid, and that
'consequently an additional sum of 25,000,0(Xif. ought not to be
now demanded. If the demand were made, 45,000,000 f. would
be required for the payment of a debt for which 20,000,000 f.
were originally more than sufficient. (Murmurs front the
centre.) After the instance just quoted of the good faith of
America, was it to be expected that the returns of 1834 should be
regarded as infallible ? The hon. deputy proceeded to specify
several vessels which had been noted by the American commis-
sion in the returns. An attempt was thus made in 1834 to claim
the amount of the debts, for the extinction of which more than
the necessary funds had been received. Nay more, it world
presently be seen that an attempt was made to obtain payment
for the same debts, not twice, but even three times. (Murmurs
from the centre.) lie had proved that no reliance was to be
placed on the labours of the American commission. M. Rives,
in 1831, and M. Cialatin, in 1822, had intimated that the Ame-
ricans would be satisfie,l with much less than 25,000,000. He
knew nor if the language held •by M. Rises had been uttered
with a view to enhance his own merits in the eyes of his govern-
ment, but he knew that 25,000,000 was too much, as individuals
who ought to have been-paid out of the 20,000,000 received in
1803 were to participate in that indemnity. No sufficient do-
cument had been produced in support of the treaty. He-would
now ask why the titles in support-of the American claim had
not been produced ? It was not to be supposed that a com=
tnercial people like the Americans should not have the necessary
documents at their disposal,. but the reason that they were
witheld was, that their production would prove that the vessels
captured at the end of 1807 and at the beginning of 1808 had
fraudulently quitted American ports and had taken up cargoes
in the English colonies—that they had trafficked for Enollid.
He would now remind the chamber of a fact mentioned -last
year by M. Bignon. Towards the end of 1808, out of 12 or 15t
vessels carrying American colours, and seized at Rochefort and
La Rochelle, the American Consul himself had admitted that
one-half were provided, with papers forged in London, and the,
ocher half were to all eat earance English vessels furnished with
old American papers.;:- He would now ask if the -committee
had consulted the Archiles of the Marine at Versailles ?
M. Dumon replied in the negative.

APRIL ?1, 1836

Mr. Berryer said that the circumstance was to be regrett
as in all probability, if those archives had been .consulted, an ac-
count would have been found of the different sums paid by the
Caisse des Invalides of the Marine. He would now lay beforo
the chamber a communication made to him that morning by an
unknown individual. The hon. deputy here unfolded amass of
papers which he said were bills of exchange to the amount
of 360,000 f. paid by the cashier of the Marine, and made payable
to the order. of Mr. Jarvis, the captain of the American vessel
the Perseverance. Notwithstanding that payment, a brig
named the Perseverance figured on the returns of the American
commission. (Great sensation.) He did not intend to say that
this was proof positive, as there might be two ships each named
tffe-Perseverance, but he repeated that it was' to be regretted
that the matter had not been cleared up by a reference to the al-
chives of the Marine.

M. Dumon said that the archives of the Marine at Versailles
had been consulted when it had been found necessary to ascer-
tain the value of the ships and cargoes sold. He remarked that
a number of the American ships, and even of the American
captains, bore the same name, and he conceived that it becalms
the hon. deputy (M. Berryer) to ascertain whether the two
vessels to which he had alluded were identically the same.
M. Berryer, in continuation; insisted that the prec:eding ins.;
tifications were absolutely incomplete. He would now ask u
the committee had found- the necessary verifications at Ver-
sailles ?

M. Donlon replied in the negative.
M. Berryer demanded if the negative just given meant that
an examination bad not been made at the archives, or merelY
that no information had been obtained there.

The Minister of War ad interim explained, that as the retort's
of all. captures were sent with the other documents to the autai-
pistration of the Marine, and in case of contestation to the Con'
sell des Prises, it was impossible that any of the documents is
question could be found at Versailles.

M. Berryer replied that he only knew that every ten year all
documents relative to captures • were deposited in the archives
of the Marine. He repeated that the question now under consi;
Aeration Was of a most singular nature. -Not a single clear aa",
positive document of the same date as the treaty of 1631 ilea
been laid before the chamber. The only document furnished
had been made out in 1834. He was at a loss to understand
why the necessary documents. had not been produced by th°
United States, unless it was apprehended that such documents
would prove that the vessels named in the returns were la
reality the property of the English, or had sailed from English
varts. Not only had the claims of the American hip
aried, but even the estimates made out for each ship hid in'
creased prodigiously at different periods. A vessel, rated by M.
Rives at 9,000 dollars: had been estimated at 19,000 dollars by
the American commission of 1834. The value of another shiP
had been augmented from 6,000 to 35,000 dollars. It might he
said that a mean term had been taken for the valuation of each
vessel ; but the iacouveuieuee was, that I.lot, only. the claims of
the Americans had been increased Um 20,000,000 to 90,000,tr
but that nothing could be known as to the parties to whom the
25,000,000 ought to be paid. The bill had been rejectedlast
year, and at present new documents in proof of the debt were
furnished, and yet, strange to say, the returns of 1535 had no
connexion with those of the preceding year; not the least re-
semblance existed between the documents furnished for the t_s„,wo
years. He would ask if burdens to the amount of 31,000 Aw
(for, including the interest, the amount would extend to that,.
sum) ought to be imposed upon the nation on the strength 0'
such documents? It had been said that the claims of the Ame-
ricans had been invariably admitted, but he would assert that
they had never heen admitted, except with regard to vessels
burnt to prevent them from giving information relative to the
manoeuvres of the French squadrons, and also with respect to
vessels confiscated by the French government subsequently to
1810. Claims of this nature would amount, to 5,000,000 at the
utmost. Much had been said of the reduction of the duty o_,°
French wines, but that reduction was far from having been If
vantageous to France. (Interruptions from the centre; 'Tile
minister of the interior shrugged up his shoulders.)
M. Berryer.—" My assertion seems to excite the disdain of
the minister, but let me be heard to an etid." (Hear, hear.)
The Minister of the Interior.—" Not a word has been Wore"
from the ministerial benches."
M. Laffitte.—A gesture is often more significant than
word.
M. Berryer, in continuation, said that M. Dumon, for the
sake, no doubt, of brevity, had omitted to quote the reports of the
Duke de Bassano. The first of those reports stated that a°
claim prior to 1810 should be admitted. The second was to the
same effect. In the report it was stated that if, udder existing
circumstances, any favour could be shown, it could only be to
such vessels as had no knowledge of the decrees. He would en'
treat the attention of the chamber to the fact, that a favour, net
a right, was here talked of. The grant of a favour was by
means the recognition of a right. The hon. deputy then sal
that Messrs. de Montmorency, de Damas, and de Polignac
no more acknowledged the American claim than 'the -Duke do
Bassano. With regard to the treaty of the Florida,, he all
unable to conceive that Spain bad been made to pay what had
been paid in 1803. He then passed to the question of the con?'
pensations admitted in the treaty to the amount of 1,500,000 f• in
favour of France. He considered that by the acceptance of
that paltry sum the interests of France had been shamefully
sacrificed. The danger of rejecting the bill had been talked 0'
the misery which that rejection would bring upon 500,000
the working classes had been depicted in glowing
Fiance was also in. negotiation with M. ds Lubecki • but .it
would be argued that the claims of the Russians should be satis"
fied in order to prevent the murmurs of the working elasse'i
In conclusion, the hon..deputy said that the chamber ought na.
to pronounce on the American claim at a moment when that
claim was demanded with insult. (M. Berryer here quitted t
tribune, and received' the felicitations of several of his friends'
on whom his speech produced considerable impression.)
M. Maguin requested the minister for fareign affairs to pro,
duce, in the course of to-morrow's sitting, the original returnet
colourS7
the American claims. He intimated that a compliance wit",
,
this request would spare him (the hon. deputy) the necessity::
entering to-morrow into explanations that might prove di-L
greeable to ministers. (Sensations among the deputies in he

centre.)
The President of the Council maintained that the copies certified
and delivered by the government were in every respect wortt.
of confidence. Besides, the original documents relative to 6
labours of the American commission were not in his possessi°ll'
M. isambert supported the demand of M. Magnin.
M. Mutton complained that M. Berryer had argued from n,Let
documents without having previously communicated them t.?l,"`
committee.

The further discussion of the bill was then pnstponed till tod
morrow (Thursday.) The sitiing was adjourned at half-pas'
six.

LONDON POLICE REPORT.

MANSION-HOUSE, LONDON, THURSDAY.
SWINDLING BILLS OF EXCHANGE.
order
The Lord Mayor yesterday stated it to be his duty, in
to caution his fellow-citizens against the tricks of the scheieil
part of the community, that he had within a few days receive
a letter from a gentleman at Ipswich, enclosing a printed par;
from a money him in London,[offering the most extraordlnaL
accommodation to merchants, traders, and others who might u"
St
desirous of getting good bills discounted. The letter was
follows :
" TO THE RIGHT HON. THE LORD MAYOR OF LONDON.
" Knowing your great desire to protect the commercial inv.:,
rests of the country generally from imposition, have
the liberty of forwarding the enclosed circular for your exavt:
nation. I need scarce add, that I have no knowledge of t".;
parties who have addressed me, but see clearly the object i 3 '-
entangle the unwary and needy tradesman. -
" Leaving the case in your lordship's hands, I am, very je"
spectfully, " EDWARD CORDER,'IpSWiCh.. h
The following are extracts from the printed circular,
is headed, "Commercial Information and Temporary Ass",:i
ance to Merchants, Manufacturers, and Private Gentlemen
Respectability" :
" Although the bill system has been objected to, we genet
rally find upon inquiry that it is by. those who have used they
i
most, and have not been regular in paying them when doe'
as the most respectable merchants and traders in. the country
are in the habit of paying some of them annually. Any tin.
muuication to promote your interest, and every explanats•d,
will be given to these parties who may feel interested irl
dressing us. At the same time our friends may rely with t„
most perfect confidence upon our keeping every transaction
our usual confidential manner; and we would also recorao3_l,
them to keep it in the same way, and not to mention any nab
,"
or correspondence upon the subject. At the same time, to ge'",,
against any inadvertent exposure of business, we beg leave 'd
observe that we can exchange the bills daily, if required,
in a great variety of forms, to prevent their having the awl,
ance of accommodation paper, so that they may at any time
aD
paid away in the ordinary course of business. ( Here follows
account of the utility of bills drawn up in the style of the a°'„„
rious Coster.) Bills are like other things in point of advsra
tages being gained by them; those parties who buy them Sv'h,
undoubtedly make a profit by them, or else they are better w";,4
out them; notwithstanding all the trash and nonsense thatg.,
sometimes stated to the contrary, this is beyond all contra
tion, let it come from what quarter it may, as we have upvca
of 10,000 bills of this description, duly paid, and now in °Lull%
session. Any time, if it should happen sou have good bills 'h„,
hand, and find sales dull or difficult, and wish to make trial,
sending us part, we will use our best endeavours to turn th 7,
into money for you to advantage towards paying your bills is
they become due, and remit you the cash as they are sold; th ,
we can attend to at any time, whether you require bills or n°o
having a general shipping connexion, and for which we chola:,
a commission of 21 per cent. upon the n.§t eineiunt.• t of
rhiropportunity of observing, that at anytimaslaabte r
any description, at a fair market price, will be taken for o.la
commission for bills when requested; where parties have 170 r
stock for a considerable time they perhaps may find a vent
them by a small speculation of this kind.
"it is particularly requested, it this circular is of no itn—nct
diate service, it may not be shown, unless to a confidential 3_4
respectable friend, whose object it is likely to serve, or
might wish to avail yourself of this assistance upon some fie,
occasion, as it is not multiplicity we want, but respectah' n•a,
and in this safe, quiet, mercantile manner, which our frie
have now for so many years approved of. wbe
per centage for bills, but we presume respectability will
compared to charge in transactions of this kind. The bills _in
he such as are generally used in respectable transactioaler.
business, and will be accepted in the usual mercantile inanuoi
The bill system, like anything else, may
.be abused by those box,
make hazardous and rash speculations with fictitious credit. to
acted on with prudence, holds out many decided advantage.,ty
honest enterprise and deliberate calculation, and to such 70
we address ourselves, as we look for patronage only so fl.f the
'our conduct shall merit it. We now conclude by saying., ti"
lds,
mode here pointed out.mects our views, or any of your frie
the commands of the same will at all times meet immediate
confidential attention by,
" Sir, your very obedient servants,
" Waterloo-bridge-road; London.
" Be just and fear not.'
A dat°'
" P.S.—We always keep a handbill of all amounts an-
from £5O to £5OO, accepted by merchants and factors, and ales
dossed by
-respectable brokers, tradesmen, and agents. oje•
able goods, at a fair market price, will be taken for our come re'
sion, when bills to the amount of £6OO and upwards arl,olo
quested, and we can also change them in great variety
time to time, as circumstances may arise to require it, to I..;er•
vent them having the appearance of accommodation rarto-
We can frequently dispose of datnaged or soiled goods i° „es'
portation, provided the price is au inducement; and vr°,o,;ori'
siunally make small shipments 'of every description ut e'r
able goods.
"To Messrs. Shewell and Corder, mercers, Ipswich." ,
• Mr. nobler stated to' the Lord Mayor, that by means oln,
culars of the above description, and advertisements, Coster csiij
trived to get an immense number of bills into his hand e!0,05
recovered upon several by ,getting some of his gang to
that he bad given value for them.
The Lord Mayor said, that he had also received aCO ,nnt
cation irons a military gentleman of the first rank, static 10
he had been induced to intrust his bill of exchange for 01.'..1..0ut
a person who advertised as a money lender, and that, iii
having received a farthing he found that his bill was l'o'rof
marl;et, the scheme being ingeniously contrived by a et; be
London swindlers. The system of plunder was greatly
_cevt
' deplored, but be did not know what to do in such cases, .e2`diers
to inform the public that there was no shape which swig
wese not now in the habit of assuming.