Star.
London, England, 1805-06-21 00:00:00

FRIDAY, JUNE 21, iBo.s.

termined on. He would go (lA. farther ;he would
even bring in a bill of indemnity for Mr. Trotter, if
it was neceffary, to render him a• competent witnefa
againti Lord Melville. The other points he had no
dlobt would be fully cleared up when they came re-
gularly before the Houfe. •

.. .
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER
declared that in his opinion, it was•nttetly impolfible
for his Right Honourable and Learned Friend (the
Attorney General) to be able to grottnd a profecti.
tints on what had lonfely palled in that Houle. He
would require not only to be negatively kith-need,
but he would fiod it sequifite to have it po6tively
and accurately pt;inted out to him upon what part of
the. debate he was to found his proreeutinn, and- by
what precife orders his conduet in that proceeding
was to be regulated. After the Houle had once de-,
tided that a cilmin..l profecutitindhould he inflituted,
he (horrid not wit% to peels an'y other Gentleman to
the dedsration of a contrary fentiment ; but on his
own part, he mull confers that he was Advetre both
'to the mearitte of impeachment and to that of the
proreeution by the Attorney General. But if either
lluft.be adopted, if it were abrolirtely unavoidable to
accede to one of the two propolitions, he &mid think
the form of an impeachment the more preferable.—
He was c mfidem that a confiderable majority of
' other Members who voted for the criminal profeca.
tion, were neverthelefs fittingly inclined in their own
minds towards the tneafurc of impeachment. The
more he confide'red this circitinßance, the more he
was dilpofed to think that it was A hefty decilion—
the more firong.y he felt the neceffity of a revifion of I
the vote of that night, the more clearly be faw that it
was due to a rerpen for the other Houle of Perlis.
ment—the more clearly lie raw the neteliity of fuck a
ilep in order to do fiihitential jultice to the party....
The difficulties which had been mentioned by his
Honourable and Learned Friend, in addition to all
thofe other confederations, were dill further and molt
convincing proof, to hi mind of the neceffity of con.
fidering delibcrztely and fairly of what was due to
the Conflitution, what in jultice to an individual of
high rank and exalted station, in proceeding upon a
cafe' of such high importance as that which was now
alluded to. • .

Mr. PDX raid that, for one, he could not acqui-
efce in the difficultiei that had been urged by the
Attorney Gene' al. The Houle had frequently or-
dered profecutionrof the fame nature, and there was
always a refponfibilitir Telling on the Attorney Ge-
neral. He could not, therefore, think why the re.
fpontibility Ih:odd be taken from him in the prefent
inaance With regard ro the mode of proceeding,
he was fir impeachment, and remained Itill of the
fame opinion ; but he could never allow that the ferife
of the Houle was not fairly taken. The moti,n of
his Honourable Friend was refuted, and another fub-
ftituted, which Wah carried, contrary to the expetta-
tions of the Right Hon. Gentleman and his Friends,
the aim of which was to make the proceedings of
the Houle look ridiculoirs. He was now informed,'
that many who voted against both queftions would
have voted with them for the impeachntent, if they
could have forefeen what had happened. He was
happy to think fo ; and if the matter thatild be
brought under confederation again, that would be a
proper tine to difcufs it. He protefied againft the
difficulties that had been flayed to-day ; for if they
were admitted, older :Hoag of the fame nature might
be brought forward on any other occafion, and form
a bad precedent. He withed the tioufe to pre&rve
its right ter both Erodes of proceeding.
Mr. BOND then gave notice of a motion fora
negative inftruition to the Attorney General as to the
Proceedings refpetling that part of Lord Melville's
cafe which relates to the arrears of Mr. Jellicoe.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER
was decidedly of opinion, that the queltion thould
Mend to a revifion of the fubjeft, there was an
evident mifunderfianding at the time of the former
vote, there not having been above 5o in the whole
who were for the junket', i.,n by the Attorney Gene.
rat, independelatof thole who voted for the Impeach:
Meat: .
Mr. SHERIDAN atferved, that a Secretary
State might be himfelf the pertim who was to be pm-.1
(muted. Wendt! the Right Honourable and Learned
Gentleman in that cafe apply to him to confult as to
the molt effectual mode •)f proceeding againit him-
fell? But the Right Honourable Gentleman oppofite
(the Chancellor of the Exchequer) had fuppofed that
there was not above Sc. Members who were attually
and pofirirely inclined to lupport the Vote for a Cri-
minal Profecurion. It was known that there were
about 470 Members in the Houle at that time, and
if that were corrett. the filial' minority of 5o car-
ried the vote of that night againft a majrnityconfifting
of po. If the Right Honourable Member (the Chan-
cellor of the Exchequer) found that he was not ftrong
enough, or that he was not able to perfuade the
Hoofe from his known experience it might hare been
expetted that he would have been able to explain
things more fatisfaaothy at that time.
Mr. CANNING obferved, that it was worthy of
coofideration that the Houle thould examine into the
(paths of--:Whetber they would order any perfon
not to be tried• by his Petra ?
Mr. HARRISON declared, that it was the fief
time that he had ever heard of an Attorney General,
a principal Crown Lawyer, and one of the chief fer-
rants of the public in the law department, Acing in-
fit rations from a let of perfons who did not prattice
the law, or profefs a knowledge 'of its forms, what
c.rinrfe he was to purfue in a profeeution at law It
was his duty to find out where he would have the belt
ground. When loch difficulties were ttat ted, he really
thought it appeared to be nothing. but a plan to de-
tulle the public and to evade the jti dice of the country.
The ATTORNEY GENERAL laid, that the in.
.entions of the Houle, he believed, were ufually ex-
ireffed on filch occafions, although the law ofncer
would exercife his judgment as to points which re-
quired a knowledge of the law.
Mr. BANLES thought the mode which had been

adopted was the heft; but at the fame time he Nras
of opinion, that thofe who fupported the original mo-
tion, if they had to revile that vote, and failed of car.
rying it, would vote again tor the criminal profecut ion.
Mr. ROSE believed that no profecution fimilar to
the prefent one was recorded on the Journals of the
Houle, or that was of fo complicated a nature.—The
notice was 63ted for Monday.

STATE uI THE NATION.
Mr. GREY role, and ('poke in fubflance as fol-
lows—Mr. Speaker, I rife for the purpofe of calling
the attention of the Houle to the prefent molt critt
cal State of the country, and in doing fo I am not
aware that any other apology will be neneffary, than
what the fulsjed itfelf will • afford. Whether we
look to our foreign or our clOrneßic Rate, whether
we fix our view .on our colonial ellahlithments, on the
Situation of our commerce, our finances, of our army
or navy, whether we look at the Rate the war, and
thethance of our Rate, even in the event of peace,
we fhall find that on every one of thefe points, form-
in& in the aggregate the actual flare of the empire at
large, there is matter of Serie= confederation, that
upon the whole there is room for much anxiety, and
that to carry us Safe through the prefent crifis, will
demand all's:te wifdum and energy we poffefs.
embrace all this variety of fubjeas in a tingle
difeaf-
lion,.would exceed any ahikies, however great; and
for me to offer even wllight (ketch of them, might
feem prefumption, were.it not that the Rite of affairs
itfelf fo imperioufly calls for invefligation, and the
importance of the interetts at Rake, renders it the
duty of a Member of Parliament to bring the Situa-
tion of affairs before the public. It is now two years
Since the commencement of war, a war in which we
are Still engaged, undertaken after a Short, uncertain
interval of unavailing peace. It naturally fuggefts
itfelf, them, to inquire, wha: were the -grounds on
which the war was commenced? what the objets to
which it was direeted ? what the profpeas of fuccefs
with which it is attended ? and what the heft policy
in the condlid of it ? The firft objet which prefents
itfelf is the Rate of our finance.- a fubjea of itfelf
Sufficient for mote than one day's dircuffinn ; upon
which, however, I Shall enter into no detail, particu-
larly as of late it has been the practice at the end of
the Seffion. to Ity before the Hoare a Statement of
the public finances, as they (Land at the time, and I
hope an able.and Honourable Friend, cf mine, who
has already diftinguiffied 161111%1f in this bufinefs, will
this year favour the Houle with a Similar exertion of
his indultry. At the beginning of the war we were
affured, that the war could be carried on for Several
years, without any addition to the capital of the debt,
by burrowing no more than was extinguilhed by the
operation of the Sinking Fond. I at the time doubt-
ed the folidity of this promile, and we now are cer-
tain that it was fallacious. For three years of the
war forty millions have already been borrowed, and
an addition of at lealt thirty millions made to the
capital of uur debt, beyond what the Sinking Fund
has redeemed. • Such is the effea of the war, as to
the Capital of our debt already, but when we contem-
plate the magnitude of our expenditure, when we
confider that salt year our expence amounted to 7o
millions, and that this year., in all probability, it
wilt be more, it is impollible not to fee that our finan-
ces, though undoubtedly they are Rill great, and
with good management, adequate to the greateß ob-
jeas, mug deferee the Serious attention of every Bri-
tifh flatefman. They are in Such a Situation as to
render either prodigal admitaration, or wanton ex-
pence, in the highest degree criminal ; and in a com•
pariton of our profpeas they Strongly remind us that
war ought not to be purfued, if peace on fair and
honourable terms can be obtained. But it is not the
amount of uur extraordinary war expenditure that
mug increafe. Even were war to ceafe immediately,'
our permanent expenditme mull be greatly encreaf-
ed. I Shall not, I believe, be contradided, when I
fay chat the whole amount of the interefi, &c. of our
debt, will be at leaft 3o millions, and looking at the
State of Europe after a peace, it cannot be imagined
that we could fit down with a Peace Eflablithment of
lel: than forty millions a year. At a time then, when
the amount of the taxes is fo great, and when for the
firß time there appears reafon to conclude from their
produce, that they have been carried as far as they
can go, it is the more neceffary to enquire whether
war be indifpenfible ? But leaving this lubjeC4 I Shall
barely allude to the State of the army, becaufe at the
beginning of the Sefton that fubjea was fo completely
difcuffed by my Right Hon. Friend (Mr. Windham)
and a notice of a notion has beets given by an Hon.
Colonel (Craufurd) fo well qualified t s do it Janice.
This much, however, I may ()Verve generally, that
the neceflity of an improvement of our army was Salt
year univerfally admitted. It was particularly in-
filled Upon by Mr. Pitt, in the Shape of a charge
againft others, that it cannot now be forgotten or
difputed. Yet it has been (hewn that any improve.
merit that may have-taken place is far Shot t both of
what the nation had a right to expea, and of what
its Situation demanded. The Supplementary Mili-
tia has been reduced, and this meantre, as far as it
goes. I do not difapprove ; but let it he remembered,
that if it gives us any advantage in point of dilcipline
and quality, it adds nothing to our number for home
defence. But allowing as much for this as can be
claimed, yet when we compare our whole military
force with that of the enemy, with its increasing
means, with its uninterrupted exertions, with the
menaced attacks upon us, withdrawing our naval
protection to foreign Rations, we than be forced to
conclude that we have not kept pace with the progrefs
of the foe; that in comparifon with our danger boor
means of Security have not advanced, and that in rea-
lity the country is now lef: upon an equality with the
preparations, and with the means of F. aace, than it
was lalt year when the Right Hon. Gentleman fo
Strongly err Aigned the imbecility and incapacity of
his predeceffots in office. It appears from a paper I
have before me, that Since January 1805, there have
been railed four thoufand two or three hundred
men by ordinary recruiting. Of thefe above two