Star.
London, England, 1814-11-10 00:00:00

k • ARMY IN MINA.
CAPTAIN of INFANTRY, whose RegimenA
i, in India on full-pay, is desirous to Eithange in a Reel
inert at home on full or on half-pay.
Lczters post-paid, addressed, with real signatures, to N. N 1 _Fr.
21, Tooke's-court, Chancery-Igoe, will he attended tn. - i

P4RLI4.III.6I'TAR rPRGCEEDINGS..7

• HOUSE Mr COMMONS, NOV. e. .
Petitions were presented from various quarters; praying lir
leave to introduce Private 80..
Serjesnt OssLow gave notice of a Bill for more effectually
securing the Liberty of the Subject, which he proposal to bring
forward on the eed instant.
Mr. CR OK La &ave notice of a Motion for the fartherße-
ward sod Encotaraiement of Petty Officers and Seamen, and
the Cesoolidadon of t:te Naval Chests ; which was fixed for
to•
Z;yen the Marley of the Spumes, thl Grand Committees
of kelgion, of Grievances, Courts of Justice, of Trade, and of
Prsvileges, were renewed, together with the usual Standing
Orders.
BROC DEN moved the revival of the Committee for Ex-
Firing I aws, which was agreed to.
The CuaNcettos of the EI ER gave notice of his In.
mention CO move for the erection of a Monument to General
A 055, on Friday.
Mr. WHITBREAD enquired, whether Ministers'
were ptepared to communicate the correspondence
between General Prevost and the American Corn.
minders, previous to those acts of retaliation which
lad been committed on our part ? He wished also
to know, if any enquiry had been instituted with
regard to the two Spanish Officers who were given
up it Gibraltar? •..
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER
replied, that it had always been the wish of Sir G.
Prevost to abstain front that system so mush repro-
bated by the Hon. Gentleman ; but he had found
himself compelled to retaliate, in consequence of the
measures of the enemy. As to the Spanish Chiefs,
measures were taken to ascertain the truth of the
statement respecting them.
Mr.FREEMANTLE rose, for the purpose of ex-
acting some information from Ministers, as to the
Paper mentioned by a Noble Lord (Castlereagh) last
Session respecting the troops at present maintained
by us in the Low Countries. He condemned the
negligence of ;Ministers in not having procured the
ratification of the Convection, by which the troops in
question were stipulated tor, while they had the con-
fidence to come down to Parliament, in order to ob.
ban support (or them. The Convention was in itself
unconstitutional, being negotiated without any direct
cow IntellieatiOn to Parliament ; •and he would call
upon the
.Right Hon. Gentleman • (the Speaker) to
determine whether it were noes°. Parliament was
still ignorant whether the troops now in the Low Coun-
tries were Dutch, Spanish, or British ; but it was
certain that they were commanded by a foreign
Prince, who, although he had illustriously served
under the Duke of WellinFlon, was not amenable to
British jurisprudence. 1 here was so instance of a
foreign Officer, under such circumstances, having the
- command of Bri.ish soldiers. It was, therefore, ne-
• cersary, to watch this subject with jealousy, as it was
new to Parliament; not as it was 41430334 We to fore-
see the consequences to which it might lead. He
conceived it proper that the Conventren to which.he
adverted should *be produced; and ace-orally,.
eloalld now move—
o mat in benthie Antlers tw pritsettic& to his Rtiyal High-
ness the.Priace ite,tent, prit)itig tfiat be soould.be gr...ciously
pletleAl to Coe ttwitaitato to that House say espy or (owlet or any
engagement !with foreign Powers for the maireteattnee and sup-
port of lirldth or for fan twors."
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER
said, that if the Honourable Gentleman had thought
fit to wait a little lorig,:r, he would have declined the
Notion now made. Although the Convention was
signed on the `29:h of Jane; it had not, owing to the
circumstances of the Congress, been ratified, and
could not, of couree, be submitted to the House.—
The Converaten arose ont of the Treaty of Chau.
moat, which conditioned the union of the forces of
the Allies against France ; and though the number
of such forces might appear to be rendered less ne-
cessary, from the circumstance of the restoration of
the' legitimate :none' chy of that country in the person
Of Louis XVIII. still it was deemed fit to keep up a'
Portion of such troops until the final arrangement of
affairs. These troops were accordingly sent, as our
contribution or contingent. We should have sent
them, even if no such Convention existed, for the
pt otection of Holland, so highly and justly estimated
by sie. Parliament having once approved of the
force, he knew nothing that ought to prevent its
being employ' d. There was not any thing so inte-
restiitg to u', nothing which the greatest of States-
men bad so prised. as the.protection and conservation
of Holland, sensible as they were of its paramount
importance to this country. No one could already
have forgotten • the manner in obich the French had
overrun Holland ; nor could any one doubt that it
became us to prevent a recurrence of the same evil
in times to come. Respecting the Prince of Orange,
le must remark, that what had been observed of
other foreign Officers could by no means apply to
him, who bad served in the British army, and was
amenable to <the British Law-Martial.— (Laughs
frost the ONualiion side.) —As to the Convention itself,
at was still unratified, and could not therefore be a fit
subject for such a Motion as the Hon. Gentleman
had just proposed to the ilouse.
flee the SeEAKEK was proceeding to put the
motion ; when
Mr. WHITBREAD rose. Lie began by describ-
mg the consolation to be extracted from the citcum-
stance of the Prince of Orange, who commanded out
troops in the Low Countries, being at all subject to
martial law, as a Emitter 'perfectly ludicrous. How
were we to get et him ? It was worse than Tidiest.
lour to imagine that he would repair here to be Wed,
on any occasion ; though be himself did disclaim, at
the same time, the nrost distant idea of supposing
any imputatiop likely to attach to that illustrious
young Prinee. Were it necessary for him to be tried,
laawevcr, wp might send an army after him, and yet
not sun zeed in catchiag him.—(4/eseeh).....But the
Idea Hone Gentleman (Vansittart) did not know
%%bah r the Convention was ratified ; this he knew
riot, though fie knew hew to come down to that
House fur money it) pay the troops stipulated for.
—Now, why might not Lord Castlereagh, by his
frequeot ceuriere, have succeeded so far as to have
obtaintd a ratification of the paper ? It was called a
piece of paper, is was somewhat sarcastically called
iv, as be 'thought, by the Right honoureble the
hasiceiler of the Duchy of Lancaster. Yet if pacer
of no value, what sere we to put our faith in

What did we accept in every condition of life, as the
pterige of every thing valuable to us, but paper ?
BOnaparte's fall, however, ought to have superseded
the Treaty of Chaumont, or else the Right Honour-
lithfCtentleman (Vansittart), that we were still
tbliged to-proceed with.arms in our hands, and that
we could not confide its the restoration of the Bour-
bons. When, indeed, was Holland to stand alone,
'if not now ; now, when we were at peace with
'France, and when the legitimate family of that na-
tion was established on its throne ? To imagine the
contrary, was an imputation on the sincerity of that
dynasty we had struggled to establish in its scat.—
Forces had been sent to Holland, however, since the
signing of the Convention; without any reason being.
given for such a measure; except that, perhaps, as
Austria and Prussia had, during the Congtess, been
extending their territory, and keeping large armies
on foot, it might appear right for England to pursue
a similar kind of system. But this. was not a situa-
tion in which the House was called upon to vote away
the money of its constituents.
Mr. B.' BATHURST maintained the manifest
impropriety of communicating the papers specified
in the Address now moved, since they were not rati-
fied in any sense of the word, and, of course, not
proper to be laid on the Table of the House. That
they were not ratified, as the Honourable Gentleman
(Whitbread) supposed they might have been, was
entirely to be attributed to things being out of thel
ordinary course. The negociations having been car-I
tied on by the principal Secretaries of State instead of I
the common channels of diplomacy, there had not
been sufficient time to attend to lesser matters, and
indeed to some transactions of a higher stamp.—
Still the thing was in reality done, the Convention
was just as valid as if it were actually signed, and it
remained in the same state as at the close of the last
Session. The great Allied Powers had, by the
Treaty of Chaumont, agreed to keep on foot a cer-
tain proportion of forces, till such time as the spoils
accumulated by the enemy should be definitively dis-
posed of. But it was impossible for the House to,
entertain the least jealousy of any forces that were
employed in the Low Countries. He was reminded,
here, that he had described the Treaty of Chaumont
as a piece of papers true, for what was that Treaty,
or, indeed, any other sort of treaty, more than paper,
unless well followed up, and acted upon ? It was
necessary to follow up the Treaty of Chaumont, and
to this point he wished to bring the feeling of the
House. Belgium was full of fortified places, it re.,
quired to be garrisoned from one extremity to the
other ; and ought not the troops of this country,'
above those of any other, to have those fortresses in
their keeping ? It was the necessary consequence of
the Treaty of Chaumont, that each of the contracting
Potentates kept up such a force as was necessary to
carry its operations into full effect. Even hid no
such compact existed; it would, nevertheless, have
been our duty to have taken care to secure an uncon-
troulabte possession of what the enemy had been
compelled to concede. We had an interest in doing
this, imperative in all circumstances, hut peculiarly
so in the present state of things. He could see no
propriety in the motion before the House, which called
for a communication it was impracticable to grant.
Mr. TIERNLY observed, that the distinction be-
tween thecase of Prince Ferdinand and the present
.vas this—that Prince Ferdinaud was Cu:inlander-
in-Chief of all the troops which composed his army,
as to their employment on general set vice, or their
direction to any 'particular destination ; but had no
power to authorize the infliction of punishments, or
the appointment of Courts Martial. The authority
for that purpose had been vested in the Marquis of
Granby by a Special Commission. The Pr:lice of
Orange, on the contrary, was absolute Commander.
iu-Chtef of the British army in the Netherlands, not
only as to their employment in the execution of mi-
litary operations, but as to the assembling of Courts
Martial, and the maintenance of discipline by the in.
Aictian of punishment. This was a situation in
which British troops had never before been placed;
he therefore hoped the Right Honourable Gentleman
would take care that a British Officer should be ap-
pointed to this army with the same powers which
had been possessed by the Marquis of Granby, to re-
gulate the proceedings which might be necessary as
to punishments for the preservation of discipline.—
With respect to the motion of his Honourable Friend,
it was his npiaion, that a return could be made to it
without difficulty, and one which would be satisfac-
tory to the House. The object of the motion. was to
obtain a copy or copies of any such engagements as
hid been entered into with Foreign Powers relative
to the maintenance and employment of a British
force in the Low Countries. To this the Right Ho-
nourable the Chancellor of the Exchequer answered,
that as the Convention, though it had been ratified
by his Majesty, had not received the ratification of
the other contracting parties, it could not be laid be-.
fore the House. He could net conceive any objec-
tion to the production of that which had received his
Majesty's sanction. It might be accompanied by an
explanation stating the reasons why it had not been
formally ratified by the other Powers. He wanted
to know what was the nature of this Convention?—
why the other Powers had not ratified it ? and what
was the number of troops to be maintained by this
country ? before he should be called upon to vote the
sum necessary for their support. It was highly inde-
corous—it was unprecedented, for Ministers to enter
into such engagements with Foreign Powers, without
having first communicated to that House the condi-
tions that they had agreed to, together with an esti-
, mate of the expense that would be incurred. Accor-
ding to the practice of Parliament, they had never
beta called upon to vote supplies of money, without
being informed of the mode-of their application.—
Beyond the fact that they were to vote these supplies
they knew nothing. The Right Hon. Gentleman
only told them that some troops were to be employed
in the Netherlands for a certain object, which object
he bad not made them acquainted with. Under
these circumstances, what idea could any one form
of it Could any Gentleman tell what wail to be
the number of the troops ? This neither the Right
Honourable Gentleman in this instance, nor the
I Noble Secretary for Foreign Affairs, towards the
I close of last Session, had condescended to communi.
caw to the House. It may be forty thousand men,
and it may be seventy.five thousand men, as he bad
heard it reported—and be Wince, the latter number
Ito be nearer the fact ; but . still that House was left
in the dark upon the subject. But whatever might

be the number. it was understood tat England was
to supply a certain thrcein men or in money: If she
could not.furnish her quetirsnitiitive troops, she was,
as he was informed, to provide whit she could no:
so supply, by paemente, at the rate of £2O per man.
Would that House submit to such an arrangement,
and to the application of large sums of money, for
an object which no man living could know ? The
Right Honourable Gentleman indeed asserted, that
the money was to be expended for the employment
of a force sufficient to secure the Dutch barrier—an
object in which this country bad at ill times felt a
warm interest. But were the troops actually on foie?
He believed that there had not been at any time
since the peace a force of seventy-five thousand men
in the Netherlands. It the coops were not there,
how was the money applied The money must be
paid somewhere, and that it was the duty of that
House to insist upon being made acquainted with.—
The only answer to an inquiry on Cie subject was,
that there were some engagements which were to be
carried into effect. But when these engagements
were called for they were incomplete; and it was ra-
ther a singular reason that had been assigned for their
being defective—that the business had been managed
by Secretaries of State, and therefore done badly. If
it had been said, that in consequence of the absence
of the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs, every
thing was going on wrong, that would be a perfectly
intelligible and satisfactory account for all the errors
and mistakes of the Right Honourable Gentleman
and his colleagues. The sum, however, of what he
wanted to know was—why the Convention in ques-
don had not been ratified ? Lie would not then say
whether it was tight or wrong to enter into such a
Convention ; but he required to be informed why it
was still incomplete ? and how the money wastobe ap-
plied—whether to a common object or a particular ob-
ject—to an exclusively foreign or a purely British pur-
pose ?—The Right Honourable Gentleman who-had
Just sat down, had stated, that the Convention had
not been acted upon ; and that therefore the House
liras not concerned in knowing its conditions. For
his part, he could not subscribe to such doctrine.—
That House was to provide the money, and was
therefore entitled to the fullest information as to its
application. If the Convention itself could not be
laid on the table, such information of its contents
might be communicated to the House as would justify
them in voting the money that was to be demanded.
Mr. B. BA.CHURST here stated across the Table
that he offered to lay the substance of the Convention,
though he euuld not form;dly produce the document
itself in its present unratified state, before the House.
He had made this offer to the Honourable Member
who brought forward the motion, before he rose to
address the House, and he hid repeated the offer
distinctly in the course of a few observatirns with
which he had himself subsequently troubled thellonse.
Mr. TIERNEY denied basing heard the Right
Hon. Gentleman make any such proposition, which
might have arisen from his being a little deaf in one
ear, bat would be satisfied with the early production
of the information promised by the Right lion. Gen-
tletnan.
After a few further desultory ol:servations on both
sides, Mr. Freemantle's motion was withdrawn by
consent, and an Address voted to the Prince Regent
that he would be graciously pleased to direct the
substance of the Couveution to be
before
liatneut.

ORDERS AND NOTICES.
On the motion of the CHANCELLOR of the
EXCHEQUER it was ordered, that in coni.deration
of the convenience that had resulted from a similar
arrangement in former Sessions, the Orders of the
Day should have precedence of Notices on Mondays
and Fridays.
Mr. WHITBREAD, in consideration of the rea-
sons he had already repeatedly stated against this.ar-
rangement, felt himself called upon to protest ag.orist
it, anal declared that he should not be bound by it,
if it should be necessary to bring on any motion, of
which he may give notice on either of the days spe-
cified.
It was then ordered, on the motion of the CHAN-
CELLOR of the EXCHEQUER, that no private
Petition should be received atter Monday, the 25th
of this month—no private Bill be read a second time
after Monday, the 6th of March—and uo report of a
private Bill be received after Monday, the sth May.
DISEMBODYING MILITIA.
Lord MILTON wished, before the Report of the
Address should be brought up, to ask a question of
Ministers, on a subject which, he considered of
much importance. He wished to know why a con-
siderable,body of the militia had been retained embo-
died. He was aware, that in the two principal Mi-
litia Acts, that of 1786 and that of 1802, there was
no provision for disembodying the militia. But it was
understood, and had been the practice, that they
should be disembodied on the conclusion of Peace.--
He wished to know then why thi. practice had been
departed from in this instance? A selection had been
made from the regiments, and some had been re-
mained, while others had been disbanded. By means
of which selection, burdens had been cast upon par-
ticuiar counties and districts. It was known that the
wives and families of men serving in the militia were
supported by their respective counties, and that, by
retaining particular regiments embodied, this burden
was continued upon the districts and counties to which
they belonged. It was, besides, a grievance to the
men themselves, who had entered in the expectation
of returning to the bosom of their families at the end
of the war. It no complaints bad been made by the
militia officers against the Measure, it was because of
the manner in which the militia had been treated, and
on account of the duration of the war, which had
rendered it necessary to appoint such officers as
dreaded the disenib,clying, as much as regular offi-
cers did the reduction of their corps, there being little
more than the Colonel and Field Officers together, a
few Captains in any corps qualified as the old militia
law required. Looking upon the subject as of im-
ortance, he wished to be informed why the selection
had been
Mr. GORE LANGTON observed, that lie had
the honour to command one of the regiments which
had been retained disembodied. Notwithstanding
their having served for twelve years, and their being
on the r return to their native country, when they re-
ceived the order countermanding was for their being
disembodied, they commenced it march from theis
ntatelt and dearest connections, and proceeded troni
(Word to rotts:nuutil with a zeal ;And alacrity that