Star.
London, England, 1807-08-05 00:00:00

I.Asit.iiiAiENTART PROCEEDINGS.

HOUSE. OF LORDA, TUESDAY, AUGUST 4.
In the cattle " May v. Wharton," judgment was again deferred
anti' Friday next.
'lle Matta .1 rad., and feveral private Bills, were brought up and
read a firft time.
Lord HOLLAND prefentcti a petition front certain perfons at
agliort the Eaft India Bonds Bill.
The I.OR t't CHANCELLOR obfcrved that the petition could
not be received. as the fignatures were tint anntxed to it. As It
r ared at prefent, it was a petition wi.ho It names, or a fet of
ram. s without a petition. It was rejected (al account of this
informalit y.

OFFICES IN REVERSION.
On the Order of the Day bring read for the fecond reading of
the Bill fur preventirg the granting of Officcs in Reverfion,
L ,rd A ItDEN role to oppole it. He confidered
the Bill to he an unneceffary and indecent attack
upon the King's lawful prerogative. N•'thing what-
ever had been Rated to prove that Inch a meafure
was necelLtry, except merely an expreffion in the
p•eamble of the Bill, that it was expedient for the
public fervice. The manner alfo in which the Bill
originated was very unufual, and no ground had been
!hewn to prove that there was any n;ceffity to make
fuch an attack upon the King's juft prerogative. He
Should therefore oppofe the Bill and take the fenfe of

the Houfe upon it.
Earl GROSVENOR exprefred great regret at the
oppnfl.inn given to this Bill by his Noble Friend.
He conceised the Bill to be fo completely in unifon
with the popular feelings at the prefent moment, that
it would be unwire to rejeCt it, and he thought his
Majefly's Minifiers, by oppofing the Bill, would ren-
der themfelves to unpopular that they would not
long remain in office. He was a warm friend to the
8.11, not merely for its own fake, but for the fake of
thole meatuses of reform relative to the public ex-
penditut e, of which he confidered this merely as the
forerunner ; meafures which were highly neceffary
at a ctifl. like the prefent, when it was of In much
imp..rtarce to engage the hearts as well as the arms
of the people. He nulled their Lordthips would
not be induced to rtjea the Bill.
Lord LAUDERDALE expreired his aflonifh-
Ment at the intended oppofition to the Bill. It was
extraordinary, he Grid, that Mmitiers chide to abfent
themfelve on this (Teat-inn; that they did not venture
upon a perfonal opp. lotion to the Bill, but Cent down
their relatives and conneetions to froother it. Upon
refletion, however, he was not furprifed at their con-
do& ; 1.4 with what conlifiency could they concur in
rejecting a Bill which they had recommended in the
fpetche- tr.m the Throne, at the conclufion of the
an.t commencement of the rrefent Seffion ? The
Bill was broughr in will the univerfal approbation of
the whole kingdom : it polled the other Houfe witlo
out rippothion, and was refetved for rejection here.
114 d th. fe who approved the principle of the Bill the
hall idea that an oppoluion to it was intended, the
attend oxe on his tide of the H .ute would have been
rnuth ereater. He wifhed that the difcuffion of it
!world Ire adjourned for 24 hours.
Lord Viteount MELVILLE laid there was only
one point in which he agreed with the Noble Lord
(Lauderdale), namely, that which related to the ab
fence of Nlit:iacts. He wifhed they had been there
to declare their fentiments in oppofition to the Bill,
if fuch were the lentimen:s which they entertained
upon the fu jeCt. But when the ablence of Mini.
tier s was tp. ken of, he would Mk, where were the
Mutinous Members of the late Adminitiration ? why
did not they attend to Cupport their own Bill, and
difplay their parental fondnefs for their own offspring?
He denied that this meafure had been approved of or
alluded to in his Majetty's fpeech. 't he Ipeech ap-
plauded the general objeCi of the Committee of Fi-
nance, namely, to inquire into the means of reform-
ing and economiling the public expenditure; but
could not be made to aptly to the prefent meafure.
N.) argument had, he contended, been adduced in
favour of the prefent meafure, except an affertion,
that it was agreeable to the public ft cling. He did
not believe that there was any loch feeling in the
public mind, nor was there any thing in the Bill
by which the public could be benefited. If the Bill
were to pals, not a fixpence would be faved by it ;
the officers would remain the fame, and the only
object of it would be to encroach upon the King's
juli and lawful prerogative. The Noble Lord had
fpoken of revetfions being granted to children, but
was it n t the praCtice when great feevices had been
performed by an Admiral or General to confer he.
reditary honours, and to grant all an annual fum,
which was not confined to the perfon to whom
granted, but was extended to I..is defcendants. It
had been the conliant praClice of our ancetlors to aCI
upon this principle. He would pro a cafe alto. to
Phew the expediency of afting up it in other in-
fiances, loppofe a perfon was rendered incapable by.
age or infirmity trorn executing the duties of an of.
ce which lie had held for twenty or thirty years.
Such a perfon was not to be turned oat wiihout Come
provifion. There were in this cafe only two modes
of aaing ; the one by a penile's), and the other by
granting the tevertion of the office to his fon or other
relation, who might allift him in the (Tice. By the
former mode, a charge was made upon the public
during the life of that perfon, and in the latter there
was no additional expence. He could difcover no
thing in tupport of this Bill, but an affertion that it
was expedient ; witillt on the other hand there was
the uniform praftice of our anceftor s. lie could not
therefore cunt-tint to fuch a Bill as the prefent, nor
ceold he for a moment content that after a beneficent
reign of nearly half a century, fuch en attack fhould
be made upon the prerogative and influence of a be-
loved and revered Monarch.
Earl GROSVENOR and Lord Viicount MEL-
VILLE mutually explained.
Lord HOLLAND fupported the Bill, in a fpeech
of conliderahle length. He thought it was incumbent
on thofe who wished that the prefent Miailiersfliould
(land well in the public eflimation, to prevent a de-
from raking place in fo thin a Houle. The
ao!ence of Minitiers molt certainly arofe from their
Ittprfing the Bill to be of fo popular a tendency,
that it could meet with no oppofition. At a time
eeleen a ten ti part of every man'a income was appro-
priated to the exigencies of the State, it was natural
chat they ihneld be deeply interefted in the fate of
this Bill. His Lordlhip then proceeded to argue,
thst rh- Crown, intlead of kiting any thing, would
be confider ably a pie er by the meafure, by having
the offices, as they became vacant, at its immediate
ditpotal. He concluded with moving that the debate
Would be adj 'tuned until to-morrow.

lIDUCATION OF THB POnft.

Mr. WHI rBREAD moved the further confider-
ation of the Report of the Parochial School Bill. I.
Mr. DAVIES GIDDY did not intend politively
to GlT:ft to the Bill in its prefent Rage, although he
certainly thought that fome alterations ought to be
made. He dreaded the danger of corrupting the
minds of the poor by inflammatory publications, when
they fhould be enabled to read.
Mr. WILLIAM SMITH obferved, that the ar-
guments againft the Bill proceeded upon the abufes
of a thing very proper in itfelf. But if we were to
carry that principle fomething farther, we fhould not
only Phut the eyes but (lop the ears of the poor. It
was eafier to perfuade an ignorant multitude by in-
flammatory converfation, that the way to prevent fa-
mine was to pull down mills; that machinery pre•
vented work for the people, intlead of encouraging
it by the increafe of manufaftur es, and to pnifon their
ears with pernicious and narrow views of that fort,
than to inculcate !edition and immorality by writing.
Betides, education was the mode to place them
above all effrrts of this fort. He, therefore, was for
expanding that Wendt which he could not do away
it he would, and which he would net if he could..
Mr. POLE CAREW propofed an amendment,
the objeft of which was to do away the purchafing
of hoofer. It was better to have twenty facets in
a parifh than one, if that could be done, for he was
an enemy to large eftablifhments, which certainly
had no tendency to encourage morality. He thought
it could have no good effeft to give refined education
to the poor. He was perfuaded that this plan would
not have the effea of diminithing the poor rates.
Mr. WHITBREAD in reply Rated that the ar-
guments of the Hon. Gentleman had been refuted
before in the Houle, and by every writer on the lab-
jed, and were more fit for the times when the poor
laws were eflablifhed, than for the prefent time. He
talked of a -refined .education. What was it that
was intended to be taught ? letters—the elements of
education. As to the twenty fchools, that was fug-
gelled with a view to diminifh the expence fuppofed,
for then there would be twenty fchoolmallers to payl
He did not profefs that this meafure would immedi-
ately diminifh the poor rates ; he did not fay that a
man would eat lefs for being able to read ; but he
certainly did fay, and maintained, that by elevating
the minds of the people, you would make them
afhamed of refottity, to parifh relief.
Mr. POLE CA li‘EW explained, and raid that he
did not think it worth while to notice the contemp-
tuous manner in which the Hon. Gentleman had
treated him.

• Mr. WHITBREAD was Corry that his words or
manner Mould convey a meaning which he never
intended. He might have a contempt for the argu-
ment witkout having a contempt for the perfon that
ufed it.

The Amendment of Mr. Carew was then rejeaed
without a divition.

Mr. DAVIES GIDDY brought up a claufe rela-
tive to the mode of proceeding in varies in cafes of
incorporated patifhes.
Mr. MORRIS alto propofed a clank for confining
the expence at fartheft (for buildings we fuppofc) to
three pence in the pound !telling annually.

Dot.ll were agreed to.
Mr. POLE CAREW then objeCted to the pream•
ble, both as far as regarded the alledged effeas of
education among the 1 weer orders, and as far as re-
garded the example of Scotland, about which we
had not the requilite infilrmation. The advantages
of Scotland might proceed from the attention of

The Earl of LAUDERDIe*LE again referred to their clergy, and other caufts, diflinCiftom their edu-
his Majeity's Speech at the dole of the raft Seffion, cation in parochial fchools.
his Majelty's fpeechat the opening of the prefent feffion, t Mr. WINDHAM oblerved, that different people
and to the Votes of the Hoof. of Commons, con- were apt to miliake the effete for the caufe. The
taining the Refolntion on which the prefent Bill was education of the lower orders of Scotland might be
founded ; and contended that his Wetly% Speeches owing to their charaeler, and not their charaCter to
contained a full approval of this meafure. their education. And, with regard to teaching the
Lord Vifcount MELVILLE again contended' poor to read, it ought to be confidered that there
that his Majeßy's Speeches only contained an appro. was as much bad reading as good.
val of the general ()Neel of the Committee of Finance. Mr. WHITBREAD would net content to alter
The Earl of SELKIRK approved of the Bill, the preamble, which was the foundation of the Bill.
upon the principle that it was to be confidered as the He had not expeCted that his Ript Hon. Filend,
forerunner of other great and important matures. (Mr. Windham) would have been In the Houfe, and
Lord BORINGDON expreffed his regret at he was altogether unprepared for his oppofition, tho'
differing from many Noble Lords with whom he out of tendernefs to him (Mr.Whitbread) he had made
ufnally allied ; but when he confidered that this Bill it lighter than before. He was furprifed and grieved
had been fupported by Minillers, had patted the other that he fhould lend his talents to thofe who feemed to
Houfe, and had been received with nearly an unani- think education an improper thing for the lower orders
mous content, added to the circumilances of the pre- -but even againft his great abilities he would engage
fent moment, he felt it his duty to vote for it. to maintain, that education contributed to morality
The Houfe divided on Lord Holland's Motion : and virtue. He was aftonifhed that in a mind fo en.
Contents n—Non.contents 16—Majority 7. I lightened, there fhould be a fpeck fo dark. If he
Strangers were not again admitted till the further hAd not known that his Right Honourable Friend
difcuflion of the Bill was over; but we undertiood was one of the mot enlightened men of the age, he
Houfe I
that the Hou again divided on a Motion fur reading would really have fuppofed that he had heard ono.
the Bill a fecond time ihii dal' three months:— ther Jack Cade, who had accufed Lord Say and Sele
Contents is—Non-contents 9—Majority 6. of corrupting the minds of the people by introduc.
The Bill is therefore alit:wo out. '• ing grammar fchnnls and printing, and nouns, and
Adjourned till to-morrdw (this day). . . verbs. When one oppofed that for which he him-
- .
.felf was remarkable, this was calld " the Devil
HOUSE OF COMMONS. rebuking Sin." We heard of mathematicians who
A Mirage from the Lords informed the Houfe, that their.
Lordlhips had agreed to the Frogmore Houfe thc Woollen thought mathematics the only deferable education—
Clothiers' Sufpenfion Bill, the Coffee Warehoufing Bill, the Britith -navigators who preferred navigation to ,every
Fifheries Bill, the London Coal Market Bill, and to feveral prk, thing, and fo forth ; but here was a molt remarkable
vote Bills. thing—a man of the greateß knowledge himfeif op
The Confolidated Fund Bill was read a fecond time, and the poling the communication of knowledge. There had
reported ordered to be received to-morrow.
A Perfon from Greenwich Hofpital premed at the Bar an been a defet iptiou of men, indeed, from whomhe would
Account of the Expences of t!.e Royal Hofpitalat Greenwich from have been willing to withhold education, he meant
March ;, 1806, to March t, tBcy.—Ordered to lie on the table. the African Slaves, becaufe education would only
The Foreign Goods Duty Repeal Bill was read a third time and open their eyes to a more horrid view of their fitua-
paired. quays tion, and therefore prove a perpetual punithment
The Bill for purchafing certain warehoufes on the legal
was brought up, read a firft time, and ordered to be read a (geoid roltrog ue immanis vultur °bunco,
Immortale jecur tunden,, feecundaque pants
time to morrow.
Mr. HOBHOUSE brought up the Report of the Committee of Vifcera.
Ways and Means, eortaining the Vote of Cre.lit for a soo,oool. But fince the labours of his Honourable Friend
for England, and soopool. for Ireland, to be realized by Treafury Mr. Wilberforce, had been at lag crowned with rue.
Bills to that amount. The amendments were agreed to, and Bills eels, and even the Africans were in a filtration to
ordered in thereon. education, he would with to extend it over
The Reports of the Royal Kent Canal Bill, the Swedifh Her- profit by
rings Bill, the Silk Duties Repeal Bill, the Spirits Drawback Suf- the world. What he wanted, was to have men who
pen'ion Bill, were feverally brought up and agreed to, and the !honkd know their duties, and could therefore the
Bills ordered to be read a third time to morrow. better perform them—who fhould know their rights,
Tit Weft India Goods Audtion Duty Sufpenfion Bill, and the
and fbould therefore be more able and willing to de-
Malta Trade Bill, feverally went through a Committee, and the
Reports were ordered to be received tomorrow. fend them. If you did away the Preamble, the balls
of the Bill %world be deßroyed. In anfwer to what
R FCRUITING 51,51'51,4.
On the motion of Mr WINDHAM, returns were ordered of had been Paid about miltaking the caufe for the effeCl
the numbers of men railed by recruiting, in the firft fix mouths of in the cafe of Scotland, he only begged to refer Gen.
the years sBos, tBo6, and 'Soy; and alto the numbers of men tlemen to what the character of the Scotch was, be.
railed by Officers recruiting fir rank, during the fame period.
fore there fchools, as defcribed by their
Mr. WHI I'BR FAD laid, that a• an encouragement had been own authors,
held out to enlilt men for the Volunteer h ftabliffiment, he willed one of whom (Fletcher) he had before quoted; they
to know. if any returns could be yet made out of the numbers fo were thieves, t obbers, drunkards, vagabonds, and
entitled ? mifcreants of the worft defcription. The change was
Mr. LONG anfwered that be did not think this fyftens had hi-
therto been added upon, and therefore no returns could be yet attributed by the late Lord Advocate of Scotland
made. and by others who had the bet! information on the
fu'ojett, to thefe fchools.
Sir THOMAS TURTON contended that we had
not fufficient information to warrant the citing of
Scotland as an example, and that in many inflances
great danger might refult from the abglity to read in
the lower orders. He referred, as an inßance, to the
late mutiny in the fleet, which had been encouraged
by the reading of newfpapers on the quarter deck by
the tailors, who perverted the fenfe, and turned it
into what moll fuited their purpofe. However, he
did not with it fhould be fupp (fed that he was againft
infltu&ing the poor ; he only objected to the trade.
But he was convinced that the Bill would be as a
dead letter on the Itatute book.
Mr. M'CLEOI) fpoke in favour of the Bill, and of
the preamble as it 11 rod. He contended that the
people of Scotland were naturally men of good cha-
rafter, certainly bettered and improved by education,
which was effential, lie thought, to the knowledge
that every mar, aught to have of the fublime truths of
the Chrillian
Mr. WINDHAM in explanation, laid, that he had
not been well undernood by his Honourable F,iend
on the other fide. He would take an opportunity
to let himfeif right in Lis opinion, but at pi efent the
attempt might lead to too great a length of
dit-
coition.
Mr. WILBERFORCE obferved, that the Hon.
Baronet (Sir T. 'l'urton) feemed to be out of hu-
miur with his own opinion, and therefore he had
hopes of him. The truth was, the principle he and
others appeared to profefs, would, if followed up,
lead to confequences which they themfelves could
not poffibly admit. If mankind were not to be instruc-
ted, it would pretty clearly follow that we ought in
many inflances to mealure our iteps back, and pro
mote barbarifm and ignorance. His gratitude to
Heaver; for his exitteuce was for the rwianal powers
and the capability of intlrunian which had been
giren him, and our object ought to be, to augment,
and not extinguith, ibis glory of our nature. He
would be furprifed that in any country there fhould
be an'oppofition tointituCtion, but more particularly
in a country like this. If our liberties led to fuch an
abufe of our faculties, it might be a fubjea for Con-
fideration whether the body ought not to be enflaved
rather than the foul ? As to tne former part of the
preamble, he could not affent to leave it out, as it
was the moll important part of it. He alto thought
that the latter part of it ought to be retained. This
was due to Scotland in a regulation of this fort.
Mr. LOCKHART withed the preamble of the
Bill to be retained.
Mr. DILLON faid, that Hon. Gentlemen argued
very etroneoully when they timed the common peo-
ple in Ireland to be dcflitute of education. The fait
was widely the reverie ; for in the Welt of Ireland,
fuppofed to be the lealt civilized part of the country,
he had the good opportunity of knowing that fchools
for the lower orders were very numerous and gene
rah throughout that province ; and that molt of the
common people knew how to read and write, as well
as fonething of arithmetic. He wasforry; peverthe-
leis, that a fpirit of turbulence prevailed amaitgil
them; but he was convinced that a better education
would be the bell remedy for the evil.
Mr. GRATTAN laid, the queftion in difeuffing
this Bill feemed to be, whether knowledge or igno.
ranee was the better principle for prolnoting the ci
vilization and happinefs of a
people ? In his mind,
knowledge bad a molt decided preference ; and he
appealed to all hillory and experience to cf nfirm the
opinion. With refpeCt to the peosple of Ireland, it
was a great millake to luppufe them an illiterate peo-

pie. They were in general very much the reverfe,
and particularly in the South, where the people dii
played a ttrong mite for letters, and poffeffed a great
acutenefs of intelled ; and Co far from being injurious
to the murals or profper ity of a people did he think the
education of the lower orders, that he conlidered it
peculiarly calculated to promote both. Indeed how
knowledge could injure any clafs of people, he was
at a lots to conceive. He thought the more inftruc.
ti n they received, the mare mull their morals and
induar y improve ; and perhaps the Itigheft orders of
the country did not know too much. In any fy(lem
of education for Ireland, he thould be inclined to
look much to the example of Scotland, where the
benefits I efulting from a national education were Co
obvious. That nation had advanced much in letters
and pltilofuphy. The people of Ireland were not de-
ficient of capacity for either, and thoull not want a
much more extenfive opportunity of improvement,
than they enjoyed. It ought to be given them, the
more efpecially as ample means were not wanting in
the generous bequens of individuals, and the bounty'
of the Leginature for the endowment of &velars
(acids, the operation of which had too long laindor.
mant. He had prepared a plan of education, both
for the lower and higher orders, founded upon the
refult of enquiries yet on foot by the late Admini.
ftration, and which, had they continued in offisk,
would certainly have had the fanaion of their fup•
port. His Majetly's prefent Mininers were in pof.
feffion of the plan and the materials, and he hoped
they would not abandon it.
On the fuggenion of the Speaker, Mr. P. Carew
agreed that the amendments he propoled on the pre-
amble fhould not be moved all at once, but in their
order. In this way, his firil amendment would nand
thus—" That whereas the a v ticious innruetion of
youth tends much to the promotion of morality and

virtue"—
Mr. WHITBREAD objedled to this amendment,
on the ground that the introduelion of the word
" RELIGIOUS" went to give a falfe glofs to the Bill,
which was not meant to convey inaruElion by oral
teaching.
Mr. WILBERFORCE, after the word was pro-
pofed, could not objeCt to it.
Mr. WHITBREAD propofed, that it fhould ra-
ther (land—" Whereas the intlruetion of youth tends
much to the promotion of RELIGION, morality, and
virtue,* &c.
Mr. SHERIDAN.faid, the term " RELIGIOUS in.
Rrtielion," would go to exclude the children of dif.
fenters from the benefits of the Mts.
Mr. P. CAREW fuggefled that the claufe fhould
be worded thus—" That whereas the inftruai, a of
youth in religion, norality, and virtue tends much,"
&c.
Mr. WHITBREAD and Mr. WILBERFORCE
both obj,:efed to' this amendment, on the ground that
lit went to vary the whole intention and meaning of
the chafe, which expreffed an opinion that infiruelion
was produeive of the good effels there enumerated,
On the ftiggeilion of the CHANCELLOR of the
EXCH EQIJE R, it was at lan refalved that the ;lege
fhould (land thus—" Whereas the right inflrotaion of
youth tends greatly to the promotion of religion,
morality, and virtue," &c.
On the following words,
," whereof we have the
moil convincing proof in that part of Great Britain
called Scotland," Mr. P. Carew moved that thefs
words be omitted.
Mr. SHERIDAN thought that the intrquilion of
the word " RELIGION," had rendered the expreffion
leis charaCterillic: he was not aware that Scot/and
was more religious than the othei parts of the Ern.
pire.
Mr. WHITBREAD rather felt fortified in hie
opinion. The Houfe divided, for the original words
of the preamble 33—for omitting them 28—Majority
in favour of the preamble 5. - •
On the motion for the third reading of the Bill on
Thurfday,
The CIiANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER
fubmitted to Mr. Whitbread, as there was little pro.
file& of the Bill getting through the otlt,Houfe'clur-
log the prefent ftffion, if it would not be better to have
it reprinted as amended, In that it might be refumed
on the commencement of the next fellion, as a mea-
fore which had been approved of in that Houle, rather
than as one which had been throWn out in another
place.
Mr. WHIT4READ wifhed the Bill to take its
chance in the other Houle. If its progrefs was flop-
ped in confswience of his Majeity thinking it proper
to prorogue Parliament, that could not be regarded
as a rejection, but as an unavoidable delay of the
meafure, which would again come forward with no
worfe grace than that which had formerly attended it.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER did
not oppole the motion for the third reading, which
was occur fixei fur Thurfday.
WEST INDIA TRADE.

Mr. LUSHINGTON begged leave to call to the
recollalion of his M +jelly's Chancellar of the Er
chequer, a motion which he had fume time fence
made, for the piinting of the Report of the Weft-
India Committee, with the evidence upon which it
was formed ; but owing, ht fuppnfed, to the preffure
of other bufinefs, neither was yet printed. The Cub-
ice, of Well India commerce was of the moR impor-
tant confederation to this country, and it was appre.
hended by the parties, moll deeply concerned in that
trnti.e, that it involved a 14te Treaty with a Neottal
Power. What he wifhed now to know 'from the
Right Honourable Gentleman, was, whether it was
his intention to adopt any of the menfures fuggefted is
the Report of that Committee? Mr. L. was pro-
ceeding, but was called to order by the SPEAKER,
who laid that the fame rule and order applied to
queflions of this fort, introduced by fpeeches of length
as to motions without notice, as the Houle might, by
that means, be led into difcuffions, without previous
intimation upon the topic; to which they related.
The CHANCELLOR. of the EXCHEQUER (as
we could under Rand) anfwered that the evidence bad
nor yet reached him, and that of courfe he was not
prepared to anfwer the queltion of the Hon. Member.
MISR /ISMS BILL. °
Mr. LONG having moved that the Honfe do
now go into a Committee on the Irifh Arms Bill,
Mr. WHITBREAD laid, there were in the Bill
many very objectionable claufes, loch, indeed, as
feemed to him to be allurements to the enemy, rather
than checks on the difaffeaed. It being his with,
however, to render the Eill as palatable as poffible,
he should not opp ale the Speaker's leaving the Chair,

77-

but ffiould move thole Amendments in the Com.
mittee, which, if agreed to, would in tome meafure
reconcile him to the Bill.
Mr. HERBERT thought it would have been
moth more defirable at fuch a period as the prefent,
had the Bill of laft feffion been carried into a law,
in which cafe they might now have been palling
an act for the diftribution, rather than the teltriaion
of the life of arms.
Mr. LONG Paid, the meafure had been thought
net by the late Government, and he hoped
fuch modifications might be introduced into the
Bill, as to make it acceptable toGentlemen on all fides.
Sir JOHN NEWPORT Paid, unlefs it was greatly
mitigated, he Mould not find himfeif at liberty to
tote for tbt Bill. At all events he defired it to be
underftaod that he did not oppofe the Speaker's leav-
ing the Chair, limply on the afrurance that the endu•
ranee of the Bill ihould be limited.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER
raid, it was never in their contemplation that the
meafure Mould be any thing more than temporary.
It had been thought in Tome lhape or other necef-
fary by the late Government.
Mr. WINDHAM did not think it followed, had
the late Government been allowed to carrf forward
their conciliatory meaffires, that the prefent Bill
tnight not have been found unneceffary.
Mr. PONSONBY could not, even as it was, agree
in the nceffity of the meafure.
The Houfe having gone into a Committee on the
Bill,
Sir J. NEWPORT prcpofed, that in cafes where
the Jutiices of the Peace i efuled a licence to any per-
fon applying rit t 9 ufe arms, that an appeallhould
lie to the Lord Lieutenant and Council.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER
thought it would be better to give the rightof review-
ing fuch fentence to the Quarter Seffion of the County.
Sir J. NEWPORT objected to this, as a co-ordi-
nate jurifdiaion.
It was, after Come dircullion, ordered that the
Appeal lhould be made to the county At large, or if
in a city, to the county in which it (lands, or to an
adjoining county.
There was a great deal of difcutllon about the
Claufes authorizing warrants, by which any Conlla.
ble or his Affiftant might break into a houfe, in fearch
of arms fuppofed to be concealed, at any hour.
Lord H. PETTY, Mr. WH!THIBAD, Mr. Wttio
SIAM, Mr. DILLon, and others, oppofed the granting
of filch extraordinary power, not only daring the
time that fuch a diftria might be proclaimed to be
in a dilturbed Rate, but for the whole term of the
duration of the Bill, and throughout the whole of the
country, which was unfortunately to be fubjetted to
the exercife of fuch arbitrary and capricious antho-

rity.
Mr. STURGES BOURNE did not think the in-
convenience of the meafure of WI magnitude as the
Gentlemen on the other fide appeared to believe it
to be.
Mr. WHITBREAD anted, would not the Ho.
pourable Gentleman himfelf think it rather an ob-
noxious proceeding if he were to be called upon at
every hour of the day or night for a return of what
aTtbs he had in his polreffinn ?—Would he not think
It rather inconvenient if any petty Conliable or his j
Affitlant were to be authorifed to break into hisl
houfe on fufpicinn only
Sir SAMUEL gomitLy nbferved, that as
there was let's probability of difcovering a fecret de-1
pot in the night time than in the day light, therefore
if there was to be any fearch, it ought to be confined
to the day time. We boafted that an Englifhman's
houfe was his Cafile, and feeling as Englifhmeo•
we ought to confider fomething of the feelings of our
fellow fubjeons in Ireland.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER
'unified the proceeding on the ground of the necef
fity of the cafe.
It wa,, however, agreed that the fearch fhould
not be made but on the oath of one or more credible
eritneffes.
Mr. DILLON propofed, that the fearch fhould
not be made before fun rife or after fun let, or die
in the pretence of a Magilirate. This was fup•
ported by Mr. Whitbread, Mr. Grattan, Sir Samuel
itomilly, Sir John Newport; &c. and oppofed by
the Chancellor of the Exchequer, Mr. Folter, &c.
Mr. WINDHAM and Sir JOHN NEWPORT
!poke for the Amendment, and the ATTORNEY
GENERAL againa it.
Mr. DILLON propofed a further Amendment,
that thole dillries only which thould be proclaimed
under the InfurreCtion AEI fhould be fobjeCt to the
operation of this law.
Mr. W. SMITH fopported this Amendment, be-
cattle he could not conceive any thing more irra-
tional or onjull than that of fobjeeting the people of
Ireland to a law of this nature during a period of
tranquillity.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER
thought, on the contrary, that a period of tranquillity,
namely, before difirias were proclaimed, migh► be
that in which it would be moll proper and ricceffitry
to aa upon this law and fearch fur arms, in order to
take away the weapons of thole who were ditpoled to
dill bance.
Lord MILTON argued with peculiar energy in
favour of the Amendment, and, in fupport of its
principle, quoted the provifions of the Al for dif-
arming the Highlands of Scotland ; where a gua-
rantee was to be found fimilar to that propofed in this

_
clank. _
Mr. SHERIDAN was adverfe to the whole Bill,
but if it were determined to prefs it, he thought the
(lade propofed by his Honourable Fe lend ought to
be adopted, as it promifed to diminifts the malignity
ofits charailer. If there were not magifirates enough
to execute this claufe, let them be increafed; and
that increafe was the lefs inconvenient in a country
where the neceffary qualifications for the magiftracy
were feldom required, although country gentlemen, I
Sully qualified, were perfettly ready to ad in that
capacity. He did not now, however, mean to dwell
'upon the charaßer of the Irifh magiftracy ; but he
would put this dilemma to the Right Honourable
Gentleman (the Chancellor of the Exchequer) either
it was neeeffary to execute the Aft under coEfidera•
lion, in the feveral diftriElt of Ireland, Cr it was not.
If it was neceffary, then the Irifh Infurreelion Act
ought to be put immediately into univerfal execution.
But if it was not neceffary, this AR was molt foul
and tyrannous, and the principles upon which it reft-
ed, namely, its application to diftrias which were not

diaurbed, would watrant its estetinii to England
and Scotland—CA cry of hear, hear The Right
HonourableGentleman, however, difelsfmed any ail
!sedition to enter into the principle of fach a meal-ore.
When men were heard difcuffing abode the propriety
of allowing women ten minutes to drefs themfelves
before a fet of ruffians litould be allowed to bresle
into their dwellings; and when fuch a propofi,i.in
was rejefted, he felt it impollible to engage in the
difcuffion, or partially to c nfider the telethon upon
which it retied.

Mr. BARRY vindicated the Irifh Magifiracy.
Mr. SHERIDAN explained, and applauded the
meafures taken by the late Lord Chancellor of Ire•
land, to purify the Irifh Maginracy.
Sir J NEWPORT (fated the cafe of a Mr. Jacob
of Wexford, who was difmiffed from the Magiftracy
by the late Lord Chancellor, and reamed by the
prefent. The Right Honourable Baronet condemned
the manner in which this Jacob ailed upon his rello-
ration, by marching triumphantly, on the 12th of
July, into the town of Ennifcorthy, at the head of an
Orange corps, with all the infignia of their indica
tion, fo offenfive to the populati ,n of Ireland.
The Committee divided on the Claufe,

Ayes s3—Nees 79
Upon the motion of Mr. LONG, Claufes were
adopted for allowing Grand Juries to recompense
the Clerks of the Peace for their trouble under this
Bill ;- alfo that arms taken up fhall he lodged in a
place of fafcty until the infurteelion is over ; tnat
Magifirates (hall give in to the Clerks (,! tha Pace
the names of the perfons whom they (hall app4in to
execute this Aft within feven days after ft:ro 4protot
ment be made.

The feveral Cladis being gone throne ,he F Ire
refumed, and the report was ordered t•t be
up this day.

IRISH MILITIA TRANSFER BILL.

Lord CASTLEREAGH propofed the third reading of the Mi-
litia Transfer Bill. _ .

_ _._.._._.
Mr. WINDHA M protefted agaiull i•relt a propolitinn at fo late
an hour of the night, as fo many Gentlemen were difpofed to deli-
ver their fentiments upon it.
Sir ROBnitl' WILLIAMS concurred in this proteft. and
moved au adjournment until to morrow. Upon this motion the
Houle divi.l.!d—A yes 13—Noes 7 t .
On admifßon of Strangers we found Mr. WINDHAM on his
legs,objeding, iu ftrong terms, •o the prelfing the third reading of
the Bill at th.it hour and after fo long and teating a diftuffion as had
taken place for the Taft e' ho urs. It, was depriving the Parlia ff
meat and the Country 01 a great and principal Rage in its legifla-
tive enaClntents. He was aftonifhed that ever. the Nob.e Lord
could think of treating the country fo infultingly and carrying
fetch a meafure in fuck an unprecedented way, and with fo high
a hand. i here were many great and formidable ohjedions
which had not yet been touched upon, and which it became
the Noble Lord to go into, and it poffible remove. The Right
Honou►.:hlc Gentleman concluded with an animated appeal to the
Houle, not to treat the country and the mils with fo Indifcreet a
levity as to hurry forward at that late hour the third reading of a
Bill of Inch a queltionabic nature and fraught with fuch moment-
ous confequences. if, however, Minitters thought fit then to
pref, the third reading, he had no hefitation in laying, that it was
depriving the Le- ifiature of the third great Rage of its enactments.
Lcrd t ASTI.EREAGH replied with Come warmth, and de.
Fed even the charaderiftie ingenuity of the Right Honourable
Gentleman to flort a NOVEL idea in any difeuffion on the prefent
Bill, however prolonged.—All that could be laid by the Right
Honourable Gentleman had been already exhaufted—and as to the
Rate oi• the Houle, it was then much better attended than it
.vould be at 4 or t to-morrow evening.
Mr. NLI 1A741 explained.
Mr. L'ALCRAFT vindicated the motives of his Right Ho-
nourable Fricrd in wilhing to defer the third reading to a more
feafonable opportunity, and laid, if the Noble Lord would be bold
enough to perlift, be Mould continue to follow up every attempt of
the Nob!c Lord's with the motion of adjournment. He now
therefore moved that the Honied° now adjourn.
The SPEAKER objeded to putting the queftion of adjourn-
ment again without the intervention of a new fubjedt. He had
grounded his opinions on the precedents of the 12th of March,
1771, and rdth March, 1772. It had been latterly the ufage of
the Route, but an ufage that he had no fcrup:e in flying was un-
founded. Hr did not think the motion ell the Honourable Member
regular, and he fhould not, therefore, put it. The queftion was
then rut, that the Bill be now read a third time; when, after a
forcible. fpeech from Lord Milton, againft the principle of the
Bill, Sir John Newport moved that, infixed of the word "not:•,"
be inferted the words " this day t" upon which Amendment the
Houle dividedi.-For the Amendment i—Agaitill It 73 —tsilajo•
rity 61.—Mr. Wiiberforee voted with the Minot ity.
While Rrangers were excluded we underftood that another
divifion took place of 13 and 73, when Lord Cattlereagh ftated,
that fling Gentlemen were determined to prefs amendment after
amendment, and keep the Houle till to morrow night, or have
their way, be ihould yield and give them their way : the third
reading was then poftponed till this day.
PARLIAMENTAP.Y WRITS.

Mr. BARHAM, after a fpeech of confiderable length, ob-
tained leave to bring in a Bill for 'ezuring difpatch io the coo•
veyan. e of l•ketion Writs to the !taunting Officers.
Adjourned at half pact two.

LONDON.
WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 5.
PRICE Or s'l OCKS f HIS DAY AT ONE O'CLOCK
3 per Cent. COW 6ti 4—for Auguft 6il 1-3 per Cam Red.
6:l—Olunium clic—Exchequer BiUs pat is. prem.

Yefierday morning, Mr. CoNCREVI embarked at
Yarmouth on board the Claudia cutter, having under
her convoy three hoops, laden with rockets. attic' other
(toter, prepared under Mr. Camas' s's infpation.
The Claudia and the tranfports failed for a fecret
deilination• Our Readers will recoiled that Mr.
CONG ayes new invented rockets were Come time ago
exhibited in pretence of the Ordnance Department,
and highly approved of by that Board.
We hope foon to be able to lay before the Public an
account of the fuccefsful application of thefe imple.
ments of war in the defirudion of the enemy's fleet
at Come point in the oppotite Chores.

The latell intelligence that has been received from
Admiral GANBIER is dated on Wednefday laft, at
which time he was turning into the Cattegat with a
favourable wind.

The force which embarked laft week confined of
feventeen regiments, a brigade of Guards about
a6OO ftrong, and eight companiesof At tillery,amoun-
ting to z 000 men. The whole may be computed at
17,000 men at lull.
The Bth, or King's (Hanoverian) regiment of foot,
commanded by DANIEL HORTON, Efq are on their
march from Ireland, in three divifions, for embarka-
tion at Hull, fuppofed to join the expedition ;—or, if
not, to aft as marines on board his Majefty's (hips.
Tranfports have failed from the Dawns for Hull,
1 to take on board the 7th and Bth Infantry, now on
their march from Ireland, to embark at that port ;
twenty tranfports are alfo colleted at Sheernefs,
1 waiting further orders.
The 4th dragoons are under orders for Canter-
; bury, where the fiat divifion will arrive on Sunday.