Star.
London, England, 1801-11-04 00:00:00

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of it was not known until in Britifh hands, it had
felt the benefits of Britifh induflry and Britifh
inapitaL Such were the colonial poifeff.ons which
we bad acquired by the War. °lt was true that
the War was net undertaken for the parpofe of co-
lonial conquefts ; yet the force of the country had
b:enntoft wifely direfted to that lthjeft for when-
ever we were at war with FIVACC,OIIe dour Srtl ob-
jeas mull always be to cripple her marine, which
could never be better done than try contracting her
commerce—by depriving her of her colonial lief-
feffions. But although we 'were difappointed in
the objefts of the war, thefe poffeffscus fhould
ueverthelefs have been held as pledges of in-
demnity, and Rill more as pledge. for fecurity.
And if the Continent of Europe could not have
been reftored to its former date, they ought to
have been retained as a counterpoife to the ,
power ef France. The Noble Secretary teemed
to reit a great part of his defence of the Tveaty by
a fort of arzessewan ad IN:Aiassit. by a comparifon
of the Treaty with the Projet of Lille. He dif-
dained to Tetrad what he then did, bwt he thought
the prefent queftion ought to be decided by argu-
ments of higher importance; and drawn from the
nature of things thcmfelves. But it efcaped the
Noble Lord's mentery, that in addition to what
they propofed to cede by the Projeft qf Line, the
prefent Treaty gave up Surinam, Malta, and Mi-
norca ; upon what new principle in negociation
was it, that after four years of additional war and

exptnce that they fhould offer more to receive
kfs; which was the cafe, as between the pre-
' fent Treaty and the Projet of Lille. The
Noble Lord raid, that they treated on a foot-
ing of equality. At Lille the cafe was different,
for at no time during the continuance of the war
%vas the fpirit of the country fo much depreffed as
jug at that period. If he were aiked, why did
they chufe fuels a moment or defpondency to ne-
gociate ? He would fairly fay, that it was a mo-
mast preferred by no man ; but they were fully
convinced, though it was then a melancholy re-
geaion, that the war could no longer be carried
on, unlefs the people of this country were con-
vinced that peace would not-be granted by the
then Rulers of France, upon any terms of mo-
deration.• or fuch as could be acceded to. A va-
riety of caufes all combined to produce that def.
pondency : The goppage at the Bank—the confe.
quences of which were expeited to be more
dreadful than they turned out to be : the de-
fe6tion of our Allies, which was as difcouraging
as unexpetted : and, above all, from that caufe
which he wifhed it were poffible to blot front his
memory, he meant the deplorable mutiny in our
fleet. If fuch were the fituatiiin of the country,
the terms then might have been defended upon
necegity. But at prefer* no man had ventured
to affert that the prefent was a meafure of that
more. It was contended, that by the prefent
Treaty much was obtained, as betide Ceylon and
Teinidada, we had obtaistedfecurky for our Allies.
His Lordflip contended, that in the negociat ions at
Lille we had gipnlated every thing for our Allies,
and had beer. willing to concede on our own part.
In the precept Treaty we had made no provifion I
for the NinceofOreogt, for whom, in the Pro-
jag at Lille, there bad been an exprcfs flipnlatioa.
It was the more hemming on the part of this coun-
try en have tome fuch a ftipulatiou, becatife the
Colonies which had been regored to Holland had
beak 9btailwAll by mug of him. Tse Noblc Logi,
•

,11=anrte otrlTttrieli
mull be by an examination of thole terms ; by
weighing our cdfions and our conquers; and by
balancing our loffes, our acquirements, and our
relative tituation. Ia entering into mgociation,
every flatefinan knelt that are bafis nauft be
one of thefe two—either to take the original
Mate of things at the commencement 'of hot:
tilities, the jatsu gee ante bedura ; or the aftual
hate of things, the ail pojideris, at the moment
of negotiating. From one of there points every
negotiation mutt fet out. True it was, that if the
Bate of things were fuch, that they could not be
replaced in their original pofition; or that tbefu-
perioriry of one tide was fuch as to treader ridicu-
lous fuck a projeft, at lean every deviation in the
other cafe ought to be narrowly watched and ma-
turely confidered. If we were inferior' to our
enemy, that molt unquellionably mutt be taken
into eonfideration. But that was not our fitua
tion—he heard every Noble Lord difclaim it—
which relieved him from the neceffity of going
into a detail, Which itherwife he thould have
done, to prove that at no period of the tali
year were we inferior to the enemy either in
thought, means or refources, to Zontinne the
contett with vigour and diva. If it were fo ; if
the fituation of the country was elevated and prof-
s, we ought to,have had honourable terms of
Peace, becanfe we were in a condition to demand.
them; and entitled to alk fuch as were adequ-ste
with our rank and power. This being the titua-
tionolisur own,country, he Acta their lordthips
next to confider what was the fituation 00 France?
and by comparing the two countries to fee what
were tbeir relative conditions. It was far from his
intention to under-value the acquisitions of France;
onthe contrary he thought them more important
than they were genentlly efteemed. She had
made the Rhine the boundary of her Empire ;
Me had acquired Savoy, &c. And had not only
extended her territory beyond what the ma& am-
bitious of her Monarchs ever had in contemplation,
but the had her frontier protefted by Dependant
Republics, and Tributary Kings. On our fide me ,
had fuccefies no lets brilliant and ftriking; we had
multiplied our colonies, and our navy rode invin-
cible. We had refcued Egypt e we had captured
Malta : we had polkaed ourfelves of Minorca; and
the Mediterranean was shut up from the Chips of,
France and Spain. In the Eaft Indies we had
every thing except Batavia, and that we thould
lave pollElfei, but it was not thought worth the
colt of an expedition. We had the Cape of Good
Hope, if not the only, at leap an important key
to the Eaft. In the Weft Indies we had every
thing defirable Martinico, Trinidad, &c. Upon
the Continent Of South America we had an abfo.
lute empire, in extent almoft equal, and fuperior
to that power to whom we rellored it. He meant
Surinam, Demerara, &c. &c. indeed, the value

tlse7iQt-7474--iewiif virll ittl''..-7';d—lTeen done for Porte -w
gal, which he confidered tis too little, and as den-,
gerous to our interells, by affording the French a
Niyal Station in the River of Amizons.—.li' the
EA,. his L!zrdfhip confidered the aceeffion of --
Myfore territory as not to be under-rated, but
forming no part of the merit of the prefent Peace.
He deprecated the ceffion of Cochin, for which the
projed at Lifle ftipulated fo esprefsly, and on the
importance of which to the fafety of India, his
Lordlbip particularly .nulled. With refpea to the
Cape, he coniidered the ceffica of it particularly
unfortunate, when we had loft, as we lhould
find we bad done on the event of a new War,
Portugal as a place cfrefreflintent for our Troops
on their voyage to India. In the Weft Indies he
regretted that Trinidada 'had been preferred to
Martinique. In the Moditerrauean, all that we
had taken we had ceded, and the Porte bad been
compelled to exclude us from enjoying any parti-
cular commercial advantages, softer the greateft
fervice that had ever been rendered by one country
to another. • His Lordlbip particularly inveighed
againft the Preliminaries as unfatisfadory, and as
leaving too much to hr fettled by a definitive treaty.
He confider ed'Prdlimioarics, where fo much was
left to be difeuffed, as little better than a naval
armiftice. On the fubjea of the Newfoundland
Fifhery, the words of the treaty were different limn
. thofe generally employed, and therefore dangerous.
His Lordfhip, at great length, went into the danger
to which the country would, in its intern' fituation
be expofed, and concluded by hoping that the peace
eaabbiliment would be,fuch as to avert danger.
Lord Git EN WILLI was followed by the Lord
Chancellor, Lord Rawdon, Lord Warwick. Lord
Mulgrave' the Nilo:1p of Itochefier, the Bilhop of
London, and Earl Fitzwdliam ; for a report of
their fpeeches it is impoffible for us at prefent to
make room,
After which Lord Sr: Vtupswe rote to take no-
tice of an exprefLon which bad fallen from a No-
ble Earl for whom he bad thehighat, raped and
elteetn. 'That Noble Earl (Lord apogees-) had laid,
that the Preliminaries on the Table Were attended
' with circumflances of humiliation and difgrace to
this country. His Lordfhip denied that any thing.
like either attached to them. The Preliminaries,
he was convinced; were eenallT honourable and
' 'advantageous to- this country, and the Owe he
had the bottom to have bad in advifutg their
being acceded to, be lhould ever confider as the
pride of his life. By the Peace. the Preliminaries
of which were under coofideration, we Ited ob-
tained two of the roof valuable iflands to the
F whole habitable globe, confidered either in a poli-
tical or a commercial view. On many other ac-
counts, which he would not at that late hour at
tempt to detail, the Peace WRS a fit fubjea of ex-
ultation, and not of lamentation.
I Lord Na Lieu rife to (peak a few words refpea-
ing a point, ,in regard to which no one of their
Lordfilipscould, perhaps, (peak with more. infor-
m. con than himfelf. With regard to Malta, that
Hand, when the noble Earl fent him d'oern the
Mediterranean, was in the hands of the French,
and on his return from the battle df Aboukir, be
thought it his firfl object to blockade it, becaufe he
deemed it an invaluable piece of fervice to refcue
it from the hands of the French. 'ln any other
point of vices, he could attire their Lon:Mips, that
Malta was of no fort of confegnence td this coun-
try i it lay at too great a difkance fibril Toulon,
to ferve as a Ratios to Watch the fleets of the
French that put to fea from that port.
The Nary iiitof Bucant 9 time lainentedfiontrelY,
that he could not give his confetti to the 1-
naries on the table, becaufe he thou& them hi y
Prle
humiliating and difgraceful to this ccqq~~aattrryy In
lira place he held them to be dilhontile, inat.
mochas they did not keep faith with our Allies,but
left them expofed and unproteCted. Portugal, in
particulars was molt shamefully abandoned, and
he could allure the Hotife that the Treaty with
France, of which they had heard and teen fo much,
that there could be no .doubt of its authenticity,
although they had it not Parliamentary on their
table had been ratified llncce the firft of Odober,
the day on which the Preliminaries were figned.
By that Treaty with Franey this Country was ill
but excluded altogether from her former tinnier-
, Lial istercourfe with Portugal. anr,l if it were true
that the cloths of France were to be received as
thole of the moll favoured nation, our manufactu-
rers of woollen cloth would food talk the bitter
fruits of this price, for they wouldnot eerily forget
that Portugal, if not now our greateft cultarner for
woollen, cloths, was certainly our oldea collomer.
So much, therefore, for the good faith of the peace.
The Earl of C.a s aaaaa ow aligned his reafons for
not concurring is the motion for approving the pre-
liminaries. He *greed with the Noble Marquis that
there was nothing wale than a hollow truce, which
gave no fecurity to the Country for a continuance
of Peace,land was difgraceful and dillionourable,
becaufe it did not (hew that we had kept 'our
faith with our Allies. His Lordlbip declared he
fhould vote against the motion.
Lord HOBART in a pointed but fummary @eel,
replied to the leading arguments that bad been
urged againll the motion.
the quellion being put from the Woolfack, the
Houfc divided. Contents 94—Proxies zo—Not
Contents to—Proxies o.
The Mover, Seconder, and other Noble Lords
withdrew as a Committee to draw pp the Addrefs
from the Refolutions that had been voted. and
loon returned, when
Lord Konya w prefented it to the Woolfack.
On the Qseftion put, it was agreed to, and the
Lords with White Staves ordered to wait on his
Majefly, to know when he would be. pleated to
receive it.—Lord PeLitAtil then moved, that the
Lords be fummoned for next Tuefday—Ordered.
• The Lords then adjourned to Friday next. ,