Star.
London, England, 1825-05-03 00:00:00

ROMAN CATHOLIC BILL

hi

SONDRA CORN.

Itlr. PLUNKETT, in moving the Order of the Day for the
House resolving itself into a Committee on the Catholic Relief
Bill, begged to state that he was requested by the lion. Member
for Westminster, who le was eatremely sorry to mention now la-
boured under severe indisposition, to postpone the Committee on
the 13111 till Friday neat, when the lion. Baronet hoped to be able
to attend. The postponement was accordingly agreed to.
Mr. LITTLE TON said by should now, in consequence of the
postponement of the Catholic Relief Hill, move the postponement
of the committal of the Irish Election Franchise Bill, also till
Friday neat, on the understanding that his motion should on that
day have precedence.—.lgreed to.

SHREWSBURY POOR BILL.
lar. P. CORBETT moved the second reading of this Bill.
Mr. C. PELHAM opposed the measure, and moved as an
amendment, that it be read a second time this day six months.
Colona ritENCH oprused the Bill.
Itlr. C. J EN KI NSON, supported the measure.
Lord CLIVE wished the MU to go to a Committee.
Atter a few words from Mr. S. Boos" the House divided.
Fur the second reading 27
Fur the amendment 60
Majority for the Amendment —33
Mr. J. ELIAS presented a Petition from the Chamber of Com-
merce in Dublin, praying for the Establishment of Manufactories
in Ireland.

A Message from the House of Peers signified their Lordship?
Assent to several Private Dills.
A Petition was presented from St. John the Evangelist, West-
minster, againsa the Catholic Claims—Laid on the table.
A similar Petition was presented from Tyrone.— Laid on the table.
Lord B 1 NNING took this occasiop to observe that he had
been misrepresented in certain Scotch prints as having, upon the
sec rod reading of the Catholic Relief Bill, expressed an opinion
aping the Protestant Church Establishment in Ireland. The ar-
gument he bad used was precisely the opposite of this.
Mr. CA LC It A FT bore testimouy to the correctness of the Noble
Lord's statement upon the present occasion.
Mr. SYKES presented a Petition from a Rev, Individual in fa-
vour of the Catholic Relief Bill.—Laid on the table.
The Juries' bill, on the motion of Mr. Secretary PEEL, was
recommitted.

Mr. WKSTERN proposed the adoption of a clause which
should render persons possessing personal property equally liable
to strve on Juries as those who were in possession of herit-
able propet ty.
Mr.SecretaryPEP.l. hail no objection to the clause being brought
up and printed with the Bill, and the discussion upon it taken when
the Bill should be recommitted.
After a few words from Alt. A articsomas, Mr. LOCKHART, Mr.

Corms and Mr. 'Warr, the Clati.e was received. Some other
Serbal amendments were made, and the I louse having resumtd,the

Report was ordered to be receiv. d this day setiniglit:
Mr. Secretary PEEL brought in a Bill for the Regulation of
Transported Convicts.—Read a first time and ordered for the se-
cond reading on Friday nest.
Sr IIUSSEY VIVIAN presented a Petition from the Mayor
Mid Corporation of Truro against the Catholic Claims.—Ordered
to be primed.
Sir RV WILSON postponed the motion of ' Mr. Hob.
house for the Repeal of the Window Tax to the 12th May.
COUNTS COUNTS BILL.

Lord A LTHORP brought up the Report of the Committee
on this Bill, and briefly explained the nature of the alterations which
had been made in the Committee.
Mr. 131t00G11 AM considered that the alterations
were much for the better. He confessed he had opposed
that part of the Bill which went to confer the patronage
of
of 23 ces amongst the Members of the Btr upon the
Crown. Ile thought such patronage was likely to endanger the
purity of the Bar,in which high and low were equally interested. Ile
had no doubt the Rikl would be highly beneficial to the country.
The Report was then received, and ordered to be taken into
consideration on Wednesday next.
Sir GEORGE hi URRA Y presented a Petition from Perth,
against any alteration in the Corn Laws.—Laid on the table.
Mr. J. BE NETT presented a Petition from the County of
Wilts, against the County Rates.—Laid on the table.
A Petition was presented from the Millers of ShelfieW, against,
any alteration in the Corn Laws.—Lid on the table.
• COMMITTER OF *IMPLY.
The House having tesolved itself into a Committee of Supply,
two votes were agreed to for the disembodied Militia of Englaud
and Ireland.
The HOWe resumed, and the Report was ordered to be reeeived
co Wednesday.

Mr. lIUSILISSON moved that the House resolve itself into a
Committee open the Importation of Cern Acts.
CURWEN wished, before the Speaker left the Chair, that
a Committee should be appointed to inquire into the quantity of
.Cots in the country. The belief at present in the country was,
that there was 8o want of firkin. Ile was anxious that this opinion
should be controverted if false; but if not, he should be under the
*nisi necessity of voting against the 'measure of the Right Ho-
aamerableGruiletnan.

I dr. CIURTKIS ...kilted to hear what the Right Hon. Gentleman
had to say before hr decided upon the merits of this measure.
Mr. LOCKHART thought this measure was well calculated to
monad the opinions and feelings of the people upon this momentow
question.—The &roams having left the Chair,

Mr. HUSK ISSON said, that after the discussion
which this subject had tmdergone in the course of the
last week, it would not, he thought, be necessary for
him to enter into any long discussion upon it. Ile
wished only to bring before the consideration of the
House, the law relating to foreign corn as it now stood,
and the facts which were connected 'with that law, in
'der that they might both be distinctly understood.
They were, then, simply these :—ln'the year 1815, an
Act ',vim passed by which all foreign corn was pro-
hibited ilom being admitted into the ports of Great
Britain whenever the average prices should be under
80s. per quarter. A subsequent Act of 1822 left the
lair Act unaltered, but it provided that foreign corn
should be admitted when English corn had reached
4705. per quarter, upon payment of 17s. per quarter.
This was the state of the law at the present moment,
with regard to this description of corn. It had oc-
_
bad paid atten-
present circum-
, which corn had
which the corn now

_ likely to suffer,
should be afforded
consumption,
would afford

•
should be available. This view was taken, not for alit
bole& of the individual holders, but for the sake of
the public. No other consideration should have in-
duced the Government to recommend a departure
from the present regulations whiCh affected this branch
of commerce. Now, with respect to the facts, he bag-
ged to remind the House that three weeks ago. the
price of English corn was 69t. per quarter. Since that
period the price had been gradually rising. Th a day
it was higher than on Mcnday last by three shillings
per quarter, as he was informed. (An Hon. Member
behind him said " four shiliings.") Well, if it were so,
he had a right to assume that the former low prices
were the consequences of an unnatural stagnation, and
that the rise had taken place owing to the time of year
and the b lief that no alteration was to be made in the
existing laws, at least during the present year. It might
be said that we could take off the limitation as to the
price reaching 70s. when the corn would be admitted
on payment of 17s. but to this there was an objection.
Patties then, under the expectation that prices must
rise, would pethaps abstain from sending in their corn,
because as they knew that they could always bring it
in at 70i. on payment of the duty, they would believe
that they might as advantageously release it at 80s. on
payment of no duty at all. The object of the pre-
sent regulation must, therefore, be to induce the holders
to bring the coin into consumption before the 15th of
August next. Before the debate of last Thursday, he
(Mr. Huskisson) had cautiously abstained from seeing
any. one interested in this question, because to have had
any communication with them would, he felt, have been
open to the objection that it was likely to give rise to
speculation. He had since been induced to fix the duty
at 10s. believing that amount would be sufficient at
once to secure the Public, and to induce the holders to.
bring-their corn into consumption ; but he had heard
that even with this duty, the holders would prefer to
keep back their corn until after the 15th of August, in
the hope that the average price would then have
reached 80s. If, in the ccurse of this discussion, the
10s. per quarter should be thought too high, and that
it would defeat its object, he was not indisposed to lower
it, for it was not a question of high or low duty, but of
what regulation it would be most advantageous to adopt
for the benefit of the Public and the con:sumer. His
proposition would be this...that the holder should tare
the option of bringing out his,stock in portions of ow-
third at a time. There would be a space of three months
between the passing of the Bill and the 15th August,
when its provisions were to terminate. During this
period the corn now in warehouse was to be admitted
upon payment of a duty of 10s. per qriarter, after which
tire present regulations were again to come into force.—
The Committee would therefore see that this measure,
besides the objects he had mentioned,would accomplish
that of preventing corn front reaching too high a price.
The quantity of corn now in the warehouses, tncluding
a small quantity of barley and of Canada corn, was
about 400,000 quarters. The effect of its introduction
must depend chiefly upon the supply at present in the
country. In the year 1820, the introduction of a very
small quantity of oats had depressed the markets very
materially ; and in the last year the same circumstance
had produced no shell effect. From the state of the
markets throughout the country, as well as that of Lon-
dna, it was evident that there was a tendency to increase
the prices of corn. He was therefore entitied to con.
tend that this introduction ought not to be complained
of by the holders. Part of the wheat which it was the
object of the measure Co release had been in bond six
years. Some of it had arrived here just at the period
when the ports were closed in 1819, and o her parts
bad been actually shipped at that per sod, and :rad been
kept back by contrary winds, until after the passing of
the Act in that )ear. It was, how ever, wholly imprac-
ticable upon such a question to enter into a considera-
tion of the interests of any individuals. The regulation
was proposed solely upon public grounds, and however
it might serve hereaf er to point out any alteration in
the corn laws generally, it was intended naw to apply
solely to the Corn under bond. The other resolution I
wlich he had to submit was relative to Canada corn, of
which there was now in this country about 20,000
quarters. It was, perhaps, hardly necessary to legislate
upon that quantity, since it would be liberated by tire
operation of law. at 675. per quarter. He should, how-
ever, propose immediately to set Canada wheat free,
upon payment of a duty of ss. per quarter. The freight
could not be less than I4s. or lfis. per quarter, and this
would probably be quite a sufficient protectioir. The
Right lion. Gentleman said, in allusion to a remark of
the lion. Member for Taunton (Mr. Baring) on a former
evening, that in 1815 he had been present at A meeting
at Fife House, when the question of the corn laws was
discussed, and he had then proposed a duty instead of
the alteration between a free trade and a monopoly.
He afterwards supported the regulation which was sub-
stituted for that vet ich he had recommended, because
he was satisfied that some alteration was necessary.
lie stated this, for the purpose of chewing that his
opinion of the principle had undergone no change.—
'The Right lion. Gentleman concluded by moving the
following Resolution.:
" 't hat it* is the opinion of this Committee,- that all torn and
wheat flour (not being the produce of the British Colonies and
Plantations in North America) now warehoused, and which was
warehoused upon the importation thereof, on or before the 13th
day of May. 182=, shall be admitted to entry for home cousump-
den, at the times and in the proportions following; that is to say,
" One-third of each of the several quantities of such corn or
.wheat Soar belonging to the respective proprietors, between the
15th day of May and the 15th day of June, 1825.

" One other third of such quantities between the said.lsth clay
of June and the 15th day of July following; and the remainder of
such quantities between the said 15th day of July and the 13th day
of August following; and that upon the entry of any such earn to
be taken out of the warehouse fur Dome consumption, within the
respective times and in the respective proportions herein before
mentioned, there be paid the duties hereinafter mentioned, in lieu
of all other duties thereon ; that is to say,
For evert' quarter of Wheat . £0 10 0
For every quarter of Rye, Peas, and Beans 0 6 6
For every quarter of Barley, Beer, or Bigg 0 5 0
For every quarter of Out . . 0 3 6
For every cwt. of Flour . . 0 2 10

" That it is the opinion of this Committee, that all prohibitions
and restrictions now in force, and that all duties now payable upon
the importation of wheat, the: produce of, and imported friwn the
British Colonies and. Plantations in North America, shall cease and
determine; and that in lieu of all such duties, there be paid on the
importation of such wheat, a duty of ss. for every quarter thereof."
Mr. BARING said, the present measure he considered
wise, and the alarm it excited was unnecessary. He
thought, however, it world be better to give the holders
of landed corn a shorter time for bringing it into the
market, as if the prospect of the harvest shoul3 be. bad,
they would prefer keeping their corn out of the market
till the ports would be open, when they could sell it
without duty. The measure would materially inter-
fere with the speculator in English corn ; but that was
no reason Parliament should not legislate for the public-
good ; besides, from the state of price on the Conti. ,

.• - •
nest. they dada teplacs their stock at abakt iq'sarter, brougie
ham Eng!ant
•
Ur. WODEHOUSE denied that the present Corn Lew mused
fietuatimes io price, the gustiest Sectaatiois known bad taken place
between 179$ and 1103. before the present law was emu&
Mr. BENETT, of Wilts, thought the duty at which
the bonded corn should be admitted into the market
ought to be 176. which would still be a great advantage
to the holder, as he was satisfied it could be replaced by
importation at Mts. a quarter. He was confident the bonded corn
would be brought into the market even at a duty of 30s. a quarter.
Mr. LESLIE FOSTER thought there could be no-
thing better for the agriculturists, than to let out this
corn ; for it would be infinitely more to their advantage
that that should be done, than to open the ports to a
silt years accumulation of corn in Poland, which was now selling
at nos. and which at the duty might be admitted at 2ss.
General GASCOYNE acceded to the measure,
because he preferred it to opening the ports, and he
thought that to the agriculturists themselves it would
.be a great advantage; but he thought that art improve-
ment • might be made on the Resolution of his Right
-Honourable Friend, and be should propose, as an Amendment, that
instead of ten shillings, the duty shoold..he sight shillings.
Mr. SYKES was of opinion that the revenue could not surer in
consequence of the popositlim, which he thought a wise one, and
be should therefore sepeortit.
Sir MON'I'AGUE CHOLMELEY expressed his assent to the
Resolution.
Mr. Alderman THOMPSON said, the capital which
had been locked up in this corn for so many years,
could not amount to less than a million of money ; and
if this were set afloat, it would be a great advantage,
and it was the duty of the House to do it. But he was
disposed to go a step farther than the gallant General
on the floor, and he should propose, as an amendment,
that the duty should be ss.
Mr. FARItAND contended, that the whole of the bonded corn
should be admitted into the market duty free.
Colonel Woon objected to, and Mr. Caters supported the resolu-
tion. He wished that Honourable Members would withdraw their
amendments, and allow the resolution to pass unanimously.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUEIt said,
that as far as he could judge of the sense of the House,
it was in favour ef making ten shillings the rate of
duty. As the measure propozei was intended as-a
boon, he did not think that the holders of the bonded
corn hAd a-y tight to complain. If he thought the duty
of 10s. would have the effect of keeping that corn out
ef the market, he should ce.t tinly. vote for a lower
r ,te; but believing that nn such re-sult would follow, he,
shoals' support ii he .original Resolution. The Corn-
mittee would do him the justice to believe that he was ant influenced
by any consideration of the miserable amount of revenue that would
be derived from the higher amount of duty.
Mr. HANDLEY supported the Resolution, but disapproved of
the importation of Canada corn.
Dlr. MAXWELL said, that before any alteration
was made in the Corn Laws, some inquiry should be
instituted as to the rate of wages of labour in this country and
the Continent.
Mr. NIONCK said that the Corn Laws gave a bounty
of 14,000,0001. per annum to the landed interest. Such
a sum was certainly a generous tribute to what was called " the
unpaid Magistracy of the country."
Mr. HUSKISSON replied.—He said that he had
carefully avoided giving any opinion as to the quantity
of corn in the country ; he thought that the prices at
present were sufficiently high, it not too high. He was
certainly of opinion that the scale of duty on flour ought
to be higher than that on corn. His only object was to release the
ecru now in warehouse, so as to keep up the supply.
Mr.NVEST EltN said, that notwithstanding the odium
lavished on the existing Qum Law, it had practically done good.
Mr. HUME said them was a ste.st anxiety on the
part of the manufacturing interests to see au end to the ruinous
fluctuations of prices.
The question was then put on the Resolution for admitting the
Foreign Corn to enter for Home Consuvnption at a Daty of lOs.
a quarter, which was carried without a division.
Mr. HUSKISSON next moved, that all restrictive
duties now in force on the importation of corn from
Gur North American Colonies siiould cease and deter-
mire, and that there should be imposed in lieu thereof
A duty of ss. per quarter on all wheat imported from
those colonies.

Mr. LJOSTER said, that this Resolution was on
quite di rent grounds from the last, and contended,
that without investigation, we had no data on which
to decide, whether ss. duty wfis the proper sum at
which importation from Canada should take place.—
That investigation had wit taken place ; and if in the
absence of it, Honourable Members were prepared to
say that ss. should be the duty at which corn should
be imported from Canada, he did not see what should
hind .r them float gong at once into the whole ques-
tion, and cfc ding what should be the duty at which
we might import it from Daatzic. The price of wheat
at present in (Jana: a, they were told, was—SBs. the
expense of its transit across the Atlantic was 12s. per
quarter. and the prop:;sed duty ss. which would make
Use quarter here 555. but what -proof had they that
38s. was the average price in Canada? It might be
much less for aly thing the House knew at present on
the subject. The Honourable Member then entered
into a statement of the prices of corn in Amsterdam
Tor the last five years, u hich shewed that the average
price in the whole of these years was not more than
325. 7d. and he contended that it could be imported
at the same rate into this country. Under those cir-
cumstances, he did not think it would be wise or pru-
dent to introduce any alteration in the laws with respect
:to the introduction of foreign corn. We had tried the
extremes of prices. We had cora at a high price, and
we saw the good eff:cts of it operate on the manu-
facturer, who got a proportionately good prise for the
articles of his trade. We bad afterwards very cheap
corn, and the manufacturers had t, deal only with
bankrupt customers. He concurred in the observation
made by an Honourable Friend on a former evening,
that 655. or'6os. might be a fair remunerating price ;
but he did not think that, without some investigation,
the market ought to be opened permanently to Canada
ecrn at 55..
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER ob.'
served, that the Honourable Gentleman who had just
sat down, seemed to forget that Canadatwas a part of
this country, and that it ought therefore to be consi-
dered entitled to every protection that • the country
could extend to it. Looking only at the narrow prin-
ciples of the question, the same objection might have
been urged in 1806, against the admission of the Irish
corn. Did his Honourable Friend forget that Canada
was one of our colonies ? Did he forget what had
happened to some colonies lately belonging to another
country? Did he forget the circumstar.ces that led to
the alienation of those colonies from the Spanish Go-
vernment ? That by the Spanish Government pre-
venting the cultivation of the vine in those countries,
they threw off the Spanish yoke? We should be
act;ng greatly against our own interests if see did not
make a distinction between our colonies and

countries. The Honourable Member ought to sircol-
- how large a portion o( the population of atssad
consisted of Irishmen, whom we had •year after yea
,encouraged to emigrate. Whatever system of mkt

ion we 'bight deeni it pruclent to adopt tosiards
countries, it would be a species of suicide riot to give
every possible encouragement to the productions of Ca:
nada—(Cheers.)
Mr. NEWMAN said he agreed with what bad failed
from the Right Hon. Chancellor of the Exchequer ; belt
he was infornied that large shipments of cora had al-
readi been made in the Baltic, with a view to import
it through Canada into this country. This, he thought, Ought to
be 'guarded against.
Colonel WOOD said, the Right Hon. Gentleman (the
Chancillor of the Exchequer) had not brought uncle
the recollection of the House,- the state of the law as it
stood at present; for the Canadians had an advantagf..
as their corn was admitted at present at 675. per (Assaf.- '
ter. If that were not advantage enough, he would ra-
ther that ;he import price were lowered to 50s. pe
quarter, in preference to breaking up the whole principle of the
law as it stood at present.
Mr. WESTERN said that if he considered the Itesc:
lotion to interfere with the general principle of the
Corn Laws, he should object to it; but he did not be-
lieve it to possess that character.
Mr. BARING supported the resolution, on tlia
ground that the real consideration with regard to the
Canadas was *hut which bad been stated by the Chan-
cellor of the Exchequer. It was preposterous to sup-
pose that corn would be sent from Dantzic to Canada,
and be imported from Canada into this country. The
freight would be so high as to render such a trade any
thing but profitable. It was equally preposterous td
suppose that it would be sent into Canada from the
United Sates for such a purpose. Incoming Ira
' Canada from the United States, it, must cross a broad
river; and it was almost impossible that in doing so it wouhl
escape observation.
Mr. HUSKISSON contended for the propriety of
the resolution. The Canadas drew all their manufac •
toted goods from England, and ought to be allowed to
send us in return for them their staple, which was corn.
At present they were allowed to send it hem, but the',
as soon as it arrived, it was placed under lock, and re-
mained useless until the markets reached a certain
price. The consequence was, that the bills of the Ca-
nadian merchants lead been protested, and our own
manufacturers deprived of payment. He would Ask •
whether the CanAdian,ought to suffer such indignity ;
and whether it could be expected that they would long
submit to brook it quietly ? As to any alarm being
created by this mea,nre, he utterly denied it. He had
stated the outlines of it six weeks ago; and yet none
of the petitions which had recently been presented on
the subject of the corn laws contained one syllable
about the Petitioners feeling any apprehensious as to the result of
this measure.
Mr. NEWMAN said that he was credibly informed
that a vessel was at this moment chart-red at Hatn-
burgh, to go from that port to Canada with corn, which
was afterwards to be imported into England. The
idea, therefore, of such a trade, was not quite in preposterous as the
Hun. Member fur Taunton seemed to suppose.
Mr. LOCKHART maintained that the interests of
the population at home might be considered before
those of the Colonists. Toe Hon. Member read a
translated passage from Tacitus, in confirmation of his
opinion, where the historian speaks of the f•nine in the
re.gn of the Emperor Clandian, and condemns the prac-
tice of relying on Africa and Egypt for grain, when Italy is so ca-
pable of producing h.
The requlution was then agreed to. The House resumed, and
the report was ordered to be received to-morrow.
DISSENTERS SIRRIAIAO2 RILL.
Mr. W. smtni moved the further consideration of the report
on this Mill.
On the motion that the Semite. do now leave the chair.'
Mr. ROBERTSON rose, and opposed it at cons:-
derahle length. He contended that the Protestant Dis-
senters were nbt twitted to the privileges which this
Bill would bestow upon them, because they were not
even so much of Christians as the Mahometans. These
Protestant' Dissenters denied the Divine Mission of
CHRTST, which the Mahometans admitted. In proof of
this position, the Honourable Member read several
passages from the Koran. Ile then proceeded to sheer
that even the Jews were better Christians than the Dis-
senters, and concluded by moving that this report be
taken into consideration this day six months.

Nobody being found to second this amendment, it fell to the
ground. The original motion was then put and carried. The Dill
was then committed.
In the Committee, Mr. W. SMITH remarked that he sleould
not deign to answer the speech which had just been made by .Mr.
Robertson, as it skewed a total ignorance of the tenets of the
sinners' and of the details of the present &emir—Wear).
The House resumed—Report to.morrbw.—The other Orders of
the Day were then disposed of, and the House adjouned at
Tway ti 0.0.01[.

• carted to him, and also to others who I
tion to the snNect, that under the pt
stances, lookiag to the high prices wk
ached, and to the deterioration which
in the warehouses and under bond was li
it wis.desirable that sense facility shots
to the admission of that cams for home
tbe supply which the watt harvest