Star.
London, England, 1813-05-06 00:00:00

HOUSE OF COMMONS.

Counsel were heard, and witnesses called in a Committee on
Chamberlayne's Divorce BM,
The SPEAKER observed, that as Monday next was the last
day appointed for receiving the Reports of Private Committees,
it was desirable, in order to prevent futuie embarrassment, that
Member. would conic down to the House at an earlier hour.
Mr. DUNDAS presented a Petition from certain persons in
Edinburgh, praying for legislative encouragement in propagating
the Gospel in India.
Several other Petitions of the same tenor were presented from
Cornwall and Bedfordshire.
Mit LYTTLETON moved for a Copy of the Minutes of the
Court-Martial held on the Officers and Crew of his Majesty's
ship Java.
PAPERS RESPECTING THE PUNISHMENT OF MR. HANCOCK.
Sir F. BURDETT rose and commenced by ob-
serving, that he did not conceive justice would be
fully done in the case of Hancock, which was lately
under the consideration of the House, unless all the
documents connected with the proceedings of the
Court of Inquiry were laid upon the Table. lie
was actuated by no wish to encourage a sort of in-
subordination in any rank or description, still less so
in a military body, the very existence of which de-
pended en the observance of discipline and regula-
rity. The facts, however, which had been repre-
sented to him were of that nature, and constituted a
case of such aggravation, that he should consider?
himself as deserting his duty and refusing to listen to
the calls of justice, if he did not persist in moving
for the production of those papers. When he first
brought the question under consideration, he was
Unacquainted with the character of the parties on
either side, but it was most gratifying to him to
say, that from all the information which he had
' since received, and the subsequent inquiries he had
made, it appeared that Captain Phillimore was not
only unexceptionable, but stood as high as that of
any officer in the navy.--(Hear, hear, hear.)—
He had likewise learned, that the character of the'
supposed sufferer was not of the same favourable de-'
i- scription. What he contended now was, that this '
t was not the case merely of an individual, but that of
the whole British navy, and that the Public was en-
' titled, after all that had passed upon the subject, to)
have an ample and circumstantial statement of the 1
1, proceedings of the Court of Inquiry laid before them, I
and not to be referred to general or particular cha-
racter in either of the parties. He was happy, how:
. ever, to embrace the opportunity of reading those
testimonials which he had received, to the kindness i

and humanity which had characterised the conduct
.......

of Captain Phillimore.—[Here the Hon. Baronet
• read the letter signed by the crew of the Diadem,
' anti by Captain I-far:met, Captain Phillimore's- suc-
cesstr.]—The impression on his mind undoubtedly
bad been, that Hancock, wearing the uniform of an
officer, atter losing a leg and a thigh in the service,
and attaining die age of twenty-two, had suffered an
ignominious punishment, the infliction of which it
was under ►ucn circumst-nces impossible to justify.
if a justific4tion could be produced or established, it
would gratify him much to hear it, and to find that
40 unusual au act of severity was no departure from
that correct and laudable course of conduct which it

appeared Captain Phillimore had generally pursued.
If he stood in the situation of the avowed fiend and
advoclte ct Captain Philimore, he should think that
he was now acting no other part in moving for the
Papers in question, than would become hun in that
character. He could see no possible injury likely or
possible to result to the public service from their pro-
duction ; but, on the contrary, very great danger
and inconvenience to the public interests, from those
secret tribunals which could not pronounce a corn.
piece asquittal any more than they could legally
convict. and which only served the purpose of casting
;fur and calumny on innocence on the one hand, or
. acrcenirg and protecting guilt on the other. lie,
tberdore movett, that the minutes of the Court of

Inquiry held on Captzia Phillimore be laistupon the,
Table of the House.
The SPEAKER enquired who seconded the
motion ?

After some pause, Mr. LYTTLETON said, that
as no other Gentleman seemed disposed to second
the motion of the Hon. Baronet, although he should
have felt great hesitation as to his vote upon the
question, the friendship which he entertained for.
Captain Phillimore urged him not to lose the oppor-
tunity of doing justice to that friendship, and of pay.
ing his tribute to the character and conduct of that
respected officer. This he could not have done on
that occasion when the Hon. Baronet first brought
forward this vague accusation against that honour.
able officer, but was now enabled to do by the result
of the Court of Inquiry, and by the admissions of the
Honourable Baronet himself. It was not difficult to
anticipate the fate of the present motion, and it was
unavoidable therefore in him to refer the House to
the weight of character compared on either side as
the guide cf their judgment. On the one side they
had the explicit testimony of numerous officers, all
of unimpeached honour and credit ;—on the other,
they had the declaration only of an interested wit-
ness, and the opinions of an Honourable Baronet, for
whose honour and veracity he had the greatest re-
spect, but for whose judgment in this affair he bad
no respect at all. He had once passed three weeks
on board Captain Phillimore's ship, and never before
met with an officer who appeared to have so much '
dislike to those corporal punishments to which the 1
Honourable Baronet himself had so many objections.
Every thing in the nature of punishment was accom-
plished by shame and ridicule alone. To accede is
these circumstances to the motion would be to esta-
blish an example which might be of the most injuri-
ous consequence. He had himself frequently called
for the reports of the proceedings of Courts. Martial,
but never without being possessed of a strong. a priori
presumption, and without ample previous inquiry.
Some line must obviously be drawn, or no end could
be imagined to the reviews of judgments which the
House would be called upon to take.—(Hear, hear.)
He had spoken certainly with a strong impression of
friendship, but he trusted he had not distorted or
coloured facts;. and he was quite persuaded that
Captain Phillimore himself had no dread of the pro-
duction of these papers.
Mr. W. DUNDAS remarked, that the Honoura-
ble Baronet had morde out no case for inducing the
House to review the judgment of those Officers of
unimpeachable character and integrity, and that he
seemed disposed to set his face against all discipline
and authority of every description.
' . Mr. DICKENSON, from his knowledge of all the
facts, was enabled to say, that Hancock, after a long
course of the most disgraceful conduct, had at length
been threatened with punishment for an act of mu.
tiny. He refused to be so punished, when Captain
Phillimore told him he should be flogged. On fur-
.ther reflection, fearing lest this might injure his fu-
ture interests, he resolved to take him below, and flog
him, like a boy. He was sorry to say that the lan-
guage now used by disorderly. seamen, when threat-
ened with punishment, wag, then we will appeal to
Sir Francis Burdett."—(Loud cries of hear, hear.)
Let the House consider what must be the situation
of the Captain of a ship, if, amidst his other arduous
and perilous duties, he should be reduced to contend
with a spirit of this inflexible description. It was not
the punishment inflicted, nor those who inflicted it,
that caused the cruelty and the alarm • but the prac-
tice of those men who were constantly engaged in
stirring up the lower orders against the higher. The
Honourable Baronet had disclaimed, in a subdued,
an humble, and an altered tone, any disposition to
promote or encourage insubordination. How was this
tone to be reconciled with the temper of that letter
which he had written coolly, and sent deliberately to
the populace Palace-yard, in which, without the
apology of the heat of speaking, and certainly with
no effusion of eloquence, he told them, that his plea-
, sure was in addressing them, not in doing his duty ;
in Parliament ?—(Hear, hear.) When, he asked, was
pure democracy snore openly avowed ? The Duke
of Orleans himself, who spent his life in corrupting
the multitude, and consuming for this unworthy pur-
pose, a fortune larger even than the Hon. Baronet's,
had never uttered a sentiment more servilely demo-
cratic. In his first speech, so different in substance
and manner from his present, the Hon. Baronet had
expressed his confidence that Captain Phillimore's
promotion was stopped. Here the Hoa. Gentleman
referred to Sir F. Burdett's complaint of the treat-
ment of the prisoners in Ilckester gaol, and concluded
by stating his intention to resist the motion.
Mr. CROKER was astonished that the Hon. Ba-
ronet should have declared that he knew not on what
grounds this motion could be opposed, when the
grounds were precisely those on which the Honour-
able Baronet had begged leave to withdraw his mo-
tion of a former night, with the difference only of the ,
separate characters of the individuals immediately
concerned being fully ascertained. Now the Hon.
Baronet came down, with a milk and water speech,
as if his only desire was to conciliate Captain Philli-
more, although but a few nights had elapsed since
he professed the greatest alarm at the report of that
Officer being appointed to another ship. He had in
his hand the testimonials of all the Captains under
whom Hancock had served, all declaring him to be
most incorrigible, almost always drunk, and his con-
duct to be most disgraceful to the service. He had
now the honour to tell the Honourable Baronet that
Captain Phillimore had been just appointed to one
or the finest frigates in the navy, and probably would
not choose to encumber himself with Mr. Hancock
any longer. He was determined not to permit the
Hon. Baronet to withdraw his motion after the state
of ferment and uneasiness in which the minds of offi-
cers had been kept, and trusted that the House would
not fail to set a seal and mark upon it.
Mr. SWAN related several particulars relative to
the character and youthful appearance of Hancock,
which he had received from_a relative on board the
vessel.

Lord COCHRANE had understood that Captain
Phillimore was the only Officer in the British Navy
who bad been able entirely to dispense with the prac-
tice of flogging in his ship. He was against the ma
tion, because he did not see how the House could
Celtic to any judgment upon the proceedings of a
Court unknown to the law, where neither Judges nor
witnesses were bound by an oath, and which could in
its operation only be comparcd to that Inquisition

which once existed in this country. It would be to
sanction tribunals of this nature, in his opinion, to re-
view their proceedings in that House. With respect
to Captain Phillimore personally, he had always heard
him spoken of as a deserving, able, and amiable Offi-
cer ; and had seen letters from Hancock's uncle,
thanking him for his lenityand liberality tohis nephew.
Mr. OSBORNE vindicated Courts of Inquiry from
the observations of the Noble Lord.
Mr. WYNNE could not see what beneficial effect
a motion of this kind could have upon the service, or
operate otherwise than to make Parliament odious.
That House was undoubtedly a Court of review
upon all military tribunals, but still such appeals
ought to be rarely and cautiously made. With re-
spect to the distinction between the Courts of Inquiry
and Courts-Martial, it would be productive of the
most serious inconvenience were every offence to be
submitted, in the first instance, to the latter. He
thought the Hen. Baronet ought to have made fuller
inquiry, and to have given a longer notice, before
he brought this subject under the consideration of the
House. Neither was it perhaps fair, in justice to
Captain Phillimore, to let such statements go abroad
to the world without enabling him to put in his an-
swer at the same time.

Mr. CROKER observed, that the Court of In-
quiry had been held at the immediate desire of Han-
' cock himself, in order to discover whether there was
ground for referring his complaint to a Court-Martial.
Sir FRANCIS BURDETT said, there appeared
to be no small degree of misconception, and, indeed,
of misrepresentation pervading all the speeches which
had been heard in opposition to his motion. In the
first place, he must contradict in the most decisive
terms the unworthy insinuations in which the Right
Hon. the Secretary of the Admiralty had indulged
himself, as to his motives in rendering his tribute to
the character of Captain Phillimore. The Honour-
able Gentleman who seconded his motion for the
sake merely of gratifying a feeling of friendship, had
untruly charged him with bringing forward a vague
accusation. Had he not named the specific offence
of which he complained, that of/it-Ain/dor, treating
and flogging a man of twenty-two like a boy ? Was
he wrong in supposing a punishment thus disgrace-
ful and ignominious was unfit to be inflicted on a
Naval Officer ? He had been originally misinformed
as to Hancock's birth—he now understood he was
the son of a private seaman ; but this only served to
make his case the stronger, for he had a right to as-
sume, that, being born in so humble a station, he
could no: have reached the rank he was in without
having recce un.nded himself to promotion for good
conduct, however changed t: conduct might re-
cently have become. To suppose the contrary,
would not be more injurious te him, than to the cre-
dit of those who had so promoted him. He was
there, however, not to vindicate the character of
Hancock, but to vindicate the naval character and
the naval uniform of England from degradation.—
He was not aiming at the subversion, but the preser-
vation of discipline, when he condemned irregular
modes of punishment. The authority given to mili-
tary bodies by that House of inflicting punishment,
was one which could be communicated without re-
luctance. It was the character of men to acquiesce
in all punishments that were founded in regularity
and justice. He had been accused of instituting no
previous inquiry : he had made the fullest into all
the facts which he stated, and he now reasserted
these facts, and challenged contradiction. With the,
character of the parties it was not incumbent on him
to interfere. When he first nientioneu the case,
he had bad no communication whatever from Han-
cock; and as to his being an interested witness,
every prosecutor who had been injured might be
called so, with equal propriety. The Right Hon.
Gentleman (Mr. Croker) had intimated that the sen-
tence of the Court of Inquiry had been favourable to
Captain Phillimore.—{Mr. Croker here said, he had
stated nothing on the subject.] Was it then other-
wise ? The Noble Lord's reasoning against his mo-
tion appeared to him to be the strongest that could
be urged in its favour—that of the unconstitutional
and dangerous character of these secret and inquisi-
torial proceedings. The petty childishness of men-
tioning his name did not, in his-opinion, render the
argument of the Hon. Gentleman below him (Mr.
Dickenson) very formidable. It certainly was not
very desirable to press the motion, with such an ar-
ray as he now saw on the other side of the House—
Lords of the Treasury, functionaries from the Admi-
ralty, and others—all, no doubt, very independent
Gentlemen (a laugh), but who, it he was rigntly in-
formed, had heretofore taken a very different view of
Captain Phillimore's merits from what they now
seemed disposed to do, insomuch that in consequence
of charges which were preferred against him by Ad-
miral Berkeley, they kept him in hot water for no
less a space of time than two years. It was not ul-
timately thought expedient to bring him to a Court
Martial ; but he should be glad to be informed why
it had been found so. to supersede him in the com-
mand of a sh:p ?
Mr. CROKER," Captain Phillimore was depri-
ved of the command of one ship, only in order that
the command of another attended with greater ad-
vantages might be conferred on him."
Sir FRANCIS BURDETT—,, Then the Minutes
of the Court of Inquiry held on the conduct of Cap-
tain Phillimore ought to be made public, that it may
be known how just and reasonable the rewards are to
which he has been thought entitled."
Mr. CROKER, rising in explanation, said, that
the Hon. Baronet opposite, when he had preferred a
grave charge of misrepresentation against him, should
have stated in what that misrepresentation consisted:
from what he had said, indeed, he could collect that
there were two points in particular in which he con-
ceived himself misrepresented ; the one was, that he
had been stated to have asserted that Mr. Hancock
was a person of high honour—the other, that he
asserted him to have been the companion of Lord
Nelson. He was still of opinion that the Honour.
able Baronet had made assertions to that effect. He
bad talked of Hancock as a young gentleman, and
had uniformly affixed to his name the stile and titles
usually appropriated to persons of honour, and had
complained, that in his person a young gentleman
had been duhonoured. This was assuredly virtually
affirming him to be a man of honour. With respect
to the footing on which he had asserted him to have
stood with Lord Nelson, the Hon. Baronet had sta.
ted that he had called him his companion, in the

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be shok
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victory. I repeat, that I have not willingly misre-
presented any thing the Hon. Baronet said, nor caa
I feel towards him in any other way than I did when
making she observations of which he has complai..-
ed, in language, which I mint say, was neither co:,
sistent with the usage of Parliament nor the courtesy
of Gentlemen."

Sir FRANCIS BURDETT.—e, I am perfectly
indifferent as to what feelings the Hon. ermtlemart
may cherish towards me. I did not mean to use lan.
guage which was not perfectly Parliamentary, nor
did I swerve from any courtesy which was due to the
Hon. Gentleman."

Mr. LYTTLETON said, in explanation, that the
Honourable Baronet had taxed him with making
vague assertions ; he conceived that the application
of the epithet tyuh would have been more approprt•
ately applied to what he had advanced.—The Hon.
Gentleman was then proceeding to detail his reasons
for this, but was stopped by a cry of Sink, spoke 1
from various parts of the House, and obliged to N.
sume his seat.

LOAGaGe•le G ••••., • I.GN

le sense in which all those who hai shared V%
ories might have been termed his companions. It
lot for him to form .conjectures as to the stve
vhich he had used the word companion. He 11J.:
I it, and in so doing had afforded sufficient grour,.'s
what he (Mr. Croker) had said. On neither of
points on which the Hon. Baronet seemed to
:eive himself misrepresented had be been so : he
willing, indeed, to accept his own interpretation,
rhat he had said ; but, with respect to that,
llection was perfectly clear, and he would not ply
su unmerited, or himself so bad a compliment,
) retract any thing he had advanced in cone.
Ice of it.
it F. BURDETT.—" The Hon. Gentlem)r.
states quite a different thing from what he stated
,re. He now taxes me with having talked (i
Hancock as aGentleman. Sir, he was a gentl:.
1, his situation gave him a claim to be consi(l,l::.,l
uch, if his birth did not, as his sharing tile vic.
,s of Lord Nelson gave him a claim to be de, k;.
id as his companion."
Ir. CROKER..^." The Hon. Baronet calLi
acock the companion of Lord Nelson ; to
ressed properly what appears was his meanirg
,hould have said, the associate of Lord Nelson.';