Star.
London, England, 1805-03-29 00:00:00

ISLE OF MAN.

Mr. CURWEN moved, that there be laid berm! the Houle Co-
pies of the opinion delivered by the Attorney and Solicitor General
before the Privy Council, upon the claims of John, Duke of Athol,
on the Me of Man .—Ordered. _ _ _

Mr. CREEVEY rote to nuke his motion rcfpeeling the claims
of the Duke of Athol upon the Me of Man. He obkrved, that
during the Taft adminitiration, an Order Isrdl been made adverfe to
the dams of that Peer, bearing date in Augult, 1802. He was
defirous of knowing what gave rife to the sudden change of fenti-
ment with regard to the claims of the Noble Duke, and produced
a contrary order in March UR He would therefore move,
That an humble Addrefs be prefented to his Majeity, praying
that he would dim% that there be laid before the Houk a Copy of
the Order of Council of grR March Taft, in favour of the Claims
of John Duke of Athol."
Mr. ROSE laid, he believed there was no filch order as that al-
ludtd to by the Hon. Mealther.

Bill,

•
• .

Mr. CRIMVFY believed there was fuel' an order.
Mr. ROSE laid, if the Hon. Member perfißed in hi; rtotor,
he (hould not oppofe the production of the paper, if i.ny fa& tent •
ed ; b..t he tilotiAt no inconvenience -zooid relult if lie pollio
it for 14 hours that he might have an opportunity w make the tie.
ccfrary enquirieA.
Mr. CREEVEY perfilling in his motion, It was put and
aged to.
Mr. CREF.VEY her,ed leave to enqu're, whethe- the paper
wioeh he moved for on a former day was to he produced. as it was
of great importance in the cordideration of the fubjeet ? He appre-
he lided a Petition was to be pr.:kilted from the Duke "t" Athol, re.
quelling a compenfation. When he moved fur the raptr on a for-
mer day, he was told that the flarplus of the money raft gran red
was far the fel vice of the Wand, whereas it ought to have been
paid into the Exchequer of Erzland. He 'believed there sa as
illegal grant of the furplus money, and withed the paper he had
moved for fhoull he laid upon the Table.
Mr. ROSE was incapable cf giving arrinformation on the fah.
Jen., but at the,fame time was willing that the Hoeft (hould be ig
poffeflion of every parer on the fubjedt.
Colonel S fANLEY moved far a copy of the Memorial prefent -
eel to the Privy Council by John Duke of Athol.
Mr. CURWEN role to move for feveral additional Papers rela-
tive to the Duke of Athol, and wlfhed for the production of copies
of all the Papers of the procedings relative to the "inapt:dation
granted at the time of the tale to Government in s 7(.b.
- .

Mr.ROSE obkrved, that the molt regular way of proceeding
would .have been for the tjon. Gentleman to have given previous
notice of his motirns.

The SPEAKER having acquainted the Hon. Member :hat thin
amild have been more conformable to the rules oUceved by the
Houre; Mr.eurwen named to-morrow.

COMMANDER IN CHIEF IN INDIA.

Lord CASTLEREAGH, pitifuant to his notice
of yesterday, moved for leave to bring in a Bill to
amend the At of the 32d of the King, which pre.
fcribes the powers to be given to the India Company
in the appointment of a Commander in Chief to the
forces in India, and regulates the duties of the Go-
vernor General in Council at Bengal. In making
this motion, however, he Mull inform the Houle,
that it was not his intention either to makt any ma-
terial alteration in the forms or add confiderably to
the expence of the Eflablillunent. But, in the event
of an ex:;lted militarycharaatr taking the chief com-
mand of the forces in the field, he thought that it
would he of effential benefit to the fervice, and
would tend to the further fecurity of our Nati:AE(lns
in that quarter, if the perfon who was to have the
chief clirenion and management of our armies in the
field Ihould have an opportunity of fitting in the
Council And giving his advice or communicating his
information on matters that were intimately-con-
netted with their Welfare. He Mould therefore pro-
pole, that the Commander in Chief Ihould have a
place in the Council at fort William. When that
illustrious perfonage, that noble and gallant officer,
the Marquis Cornwallis, was formerly in India, as •
the office of Governor General and that of Com-
mander in Chief are both united, and as he leas a mi-
litary man of great experience, and pogaing the ut-
muit ability, he had the direaion of the Councils and
the management of the armies in the field at the
fame time, but for the latter duty he had no 'min.
ment, notwitliflanding his bravery and his fuecefs ara
known f i well to have diferved the utmoll compen-
fation. By his exploits, and from eircumllances which
have fince happened, our territories in the Eaa have
confiderahlY increafed fince the time of that noble and
gallant officer having firft taken t'he Feld, and Gen.
tlenien need not be told that the *duties of the Civil
Government of our polrefEons in the Ball mutt con-
fequently have become mare numerous, and that it
mutt require more time and a greater.degrez of at-
tention to direa the Civil Affairs of the Company 41
the Bail than it did at the dillant period to which he.
alluded. And, in the event of the perfon whoM be
had already mentioned going to India, it would be Or
the utmolt importance that the Council at Fort Wil-
liam fhould have his experience and ability added td
that of which it is already polrefred. He therefore
moved, that leave be given to amend the Aft which
he had mentioned on introducing the lubje6 to the
Home.

Mr. FRANCIS then rofe and Paid—Sir, I am not
aware of any objeaion to the provifions of this Bill.
The cafes Rated, though I hope not likely to happen,
ought to be provided for. The frippofition cannot be
made without lbme painful refleCtions : that Lord
Cornwallis, on his arrival in Bengal, which cannot be
c•imputed at lefs than fix months from this period,
will find India Rill involved in war, and that he may
be obliged to take the field in perfon. If that be
well founded, it gives us but a melancholy prolpen
of the :late of our affairs in that quarter. Ido not
percei se that the Bill gives Lnrd Cornwallis any new
or extraordinary powers; and, if it did, I fhould not
be inclined to oppofe it, for two reafons ; E.rltr be-
caufe I thould think it not at all unlikely that the exi-
gencv of the cafe might requ're fuch powers; and
then, becalife I know of no perfon among thole who
have aaccl in great Rations in my time, whom I
thould be more ready to trua with great power, than
in), Lord Cornwallis. Judging of him by all his
public conduct, I am convinced that power may be
lately trufied in his bands, sod that be will never
nfe it but fir the benefit of the public fervlce. If ray
voice could contribute to his honour, he should have
it without receive, for the fpirit that prompts him to
undertake fuch a talk, as I know it to be, and at fuch
a time ; and if it were poffible to give him fupport
in the execution of it by any effort of mine, he might
be fate of it. lam convinced that his great objeft
will be to compote the diforders of India, and to re.
llorc peace and tranquillity to the unfortunate inha-
bitants of that country.
Leave was then given to bring in the Bill, which
was brought up, read a fi, It, and ordered to be read a
fecond time.

MILITIA REDUCTION BILL.

On the motion being put for the Houle refolving
into a Committee of the whole Houfe► on the above

General FITZPATRICK role to fuggell what to
his mind would be a moft defirable improvement.
and to give notice that he lhould, in the Committee,
move for a claufe to cad the objet he had in view.
-What he alluded to was limited fervice. In the Bill
of 1799 there was at claufe introduced to give the op-
tion ot serving for five year, only, or eluting the war,
or till fix months after the termination ot the war.
He did not think it wife in the Howe to depart from
that fyllem, for which realm' he wilted to fee the
chuff*, of which be had given notice, introduced ; a
clanfe which would, he believed, much more tend to
render the meafure effeetual, than any at prefeni in the
Bill. By the Att St 1799, the Jetvice was limited
to Enrope ; but of the expediency of adopting that
further limitation, the Houfe would judge, lhould it
do him the honour to adopt his claufe.
Mr. ELLISTON laid, the Bill was nt,ither mon-

Ilitutional nor unjuß and if it w the motto of the
Conllitution neither to bend or bow, yet as the Mili-
tia was but one branch of the great tree of the Con-
flitution, the Militia might be conftitutionally made
both to bow and bend, to receive alterations, not
only without violating the Conaltittion, but In as at
once to maintain it, to guard it frim the encroach.
ment of real violations, and by extending the fphere
of its confervative power, to keep off the blights of
time from the tiered body of the Conaitution. He
would not admit that the Bill would be a tax on
the landed interelt. The Militia was originally, how-
ever, more a taxation on the landed intereft than on
any other. It was a wrong idea to floppore that the
Militia was raifed for its own . defence merely ; for
what would he our (*natation if, on the call of dan-
ger, the York or Lincoln Militia were to refute to
*rve any where but in its own county ? For thefe
reafons, he thought the Bill neither unconßitutional,
union, nor oppreffive. As to what was laid of its
being a breach of faith, it was not that, but a corn-
inumtion. Still he admitted that nothing could juf-
tify the meafure but the neceffity of the cafe. With
verped to men's feelings, he could only fay, that he
neither felt himfclf infulted or degraded by the Bill,
and lhould tell his men, at the head of his regiment,
that" Here, my lads, is a better way of ferving
your country, and I know you will choofe the better
way." He took notice of the remarks on the paper
figned by the thirty Militia Officers, mentioned on a
former night, and laid, that although he was prefent
at the meeting of thefe Officers, he had never under-
flood that any refolution was paired, and had never
figued his name to any, although it did appear at
the publifhed refolutions of that meeting.
Earl TEMPLE laid, that the Hon. Member was
certainly reran at the meeting, and expreffed no fort
of diffent from the Refolutions.
Mr. ELLISTON, in explanation, did not deny
basins been prefent, but as to the Refolutions, there
were, in fad, none propofed while he was prefent, or
none which, from the confuflon and uproar (a laugh)
he could underhand. But, molt certainly, he figncd
no Refolution or Refolutions whatever, and he cau-
tioned Gentlemen how they went to meetings in fa-
tore, the Refolutions of which might be inferted in
the Public Joust's, with their names, without their
authorities.

Col, net FRANKLAND jußified the meeting,
and in a fpecch of great zeal oppofed the Bill. He
wifhed that every man in the empire would turn his
attention to military fukieds, in order to the coun-
try's deriving the full benefit of its whole talent in
tbib new fituation of the world.

General TARLETON thought the preterit Rate
of Europe, when one man was teen pulling down
Carle monarchs and creating other new ones. was
tufficient evidence of the imperious neceQity which
laid the foundation of this meafure. and which ren
dered it highly deferable to gain an addition to our
difpofeable force of 19,0c0. This was not a trifling
infignificant war, like that which a great general
clime dela ibed as a perm depot de thank', but an att.,.
ful conteil, which could never be decided by a mere
Blew of volunteers in arms. We mull flat look
to a force limply defenlive, when, in the EaR. the
Well, and all other quarters. the enemy was purfu-1
ing the moll important enterprises. He conlidered
the Militia to be in a very high Rate of difciplinc,
and had himfelf infpedlerl fume regiments of them.
wad ken others, which were fir forward as to require
but very little improvement to put them on full as
good a footing as the regulars.
Sir W. ELPORD fpnke very &only in favour of
the Bill; and Lord STANLEY renewed his former
objections to it.
The Houfe then divided on the quellion for the
Speaker's leaving the Chair, when the numbers were
—For it, 113 ; agaitill it, 49.—Majotity, 64.
The Houle now went into the Committee, Mr.
ALEXANDIa in the Chair.

A thou converfation took place between Mr.Sms s
and the CHascsi.t.mt of the Esc/mums, refpeeting
the preamble of the Bill.
Mr. STILES %viand, as the Bill was a virtual re-
peal of fo much of the Defence Alt as relates to the
gradual reduaion of the Militia, that it might fo be
expretred in the Bill.
The CHANCELLOR.of the EXCHEQUER ad-
mitted that it would be a virtual repeal of that AR,
in the fenfe it was defcribed by the Honourable Gen-
tleman, but fuggelled, that as the preamble was
never voted until after the feveral claufes and amend•
stunts were gone through in the Committee, the
better method would be to referve any alterations
that thould be deemed right to be made in the pre-
amble, till the claufes and amendments were Co gone
through.
The CHAIRMAN now read the fiat claufe, when

Mr. YORKE propoied the amendment, of which
he gave notice in fubltance on Tnefday laft. He
wilhed a power to be granted by the Bill to the
Crown to enlilt into the Royal Marines and Artillery,
but to exclude the Guards.

The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER
had no objection to the Houfe giving a difcretionary
power to his Majefty, to aflign a certain portion of
the I 7.c00 Militia to the loyal Marius and Artil-
lery. He could not, however, concur in opinion
with the Right Honourable Gcntl:inanrefpating the
Guards. The Foot Guards were a body of men in
the highefi degree qualified for the molt important
branches of the public fervice.
After a few words from Sir WILIJAM ELTORD,
WI4DHAM, and Mr. You a, the claufe was
%mended, by the infertion, after the words " Regu-
lar Forces," of the words " and battalions of Artil.
t_ry, and divifiuns of the Royal Marines."
The Claufe for empowering the Commanding Of-
ficers of Militia Regiments to fet apart, in the firli in-
fiance, the quota of each Regiment, was next moved.
On this a converfation arofe between Sir WILLIAM
POLTIN IT, General TAILITON, Lord STARLIT, Col.
&ores, General NORTON, Earl Tastrut, and the
CHANCILLOR of the Excitsoy BR. The General Of-
ficers wifhed the Colonels cf Militia to be deprived
of that power. The Colonels of Militia thought it
almofi their right, though they were willing to re-
ceive it as a conceffion. The Chancellor of the Ex-
chequer adhered to his opinion, that the Command.
ing Officers ought to have the power ; and did not
doubt but that, when this Bill fhould be paired into
a law, here, as in all other cafes, thcfe Gentlemen
would honourably, impartially, and patriotically life
their btft endeavours to carry the law into full effect.
The Ciaide was then read and agreed to in its ori-

ginal form. Several other parts of the Bill were then
read; and denied to with little comment. On the
Claufe being propofed, which direas that ten guineas
be given to each man on his enliffing into regular
.ferrite, Come oppoGtion was made by Lord STall•
LIT, Sir Waren' WILLIAMS WYIIIIII9 and other
Gentlemen, and as the Route was about to divide
upon it.
Mr. FOX role to ezprefs his hope that the Com •
mittee would not divide on fuch a quellion, as it
teemed to invulie the merits otanother, he meant
the queftion of putting the whole of the Bridal army
on limited fervice. He was Cure that the divilion
propated would lead to a conjeatue that the Com-
mons of England had increafed its judgment, and
given its deci6on on that important objea. He cer
vainly intended to bring this matter forward for grave
inveftigation on a future day, and he trufted, that
this Maud would not be the only country where un-
limited military ferviee was to prevail. From the
peculiar freedom of the Bridal Connitution, which
was the glory and beppinefs of the kingdom, it should
appear to be molt oppo(ed to loch a fyftem, and it
teemed moll natural that the fame fpint of liberty
fbould prevade our civil and military inflitutions.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER
faid, he did not with to protraa the bufinefs before
the Houle, by deviating into any thing irrelevant—
but, as the fubjea had been collaterally introduced,
he would fo far fatisfy the Hon. Gentleman, as to
allure him it had undergone the ferious attention of
Government. It was, however, true, that great dif-
ferences of opinion prevailed regarding it, and at lean
in one refpea this(' who had been confulted on the
, :cafiod, teemed per.fealy agreed, namely, on the
impolicy, and even tmpraaicability of effeaing this
meafure during war. If, therefore, it should be fob.
mined to the Houle, in the canting circumftances,
he &odd be under the necelSty of oppofing it. In
antwer to the obfervation on the comparative fitua
lion of the military in foreign countries, it might be
urged that the condition, in many effential retpeas,
was fo ditlimilar, that no fair comparifon could be
admitted.
Mr. FOX raid. the objedlion on account of the
war might be eafily removed, as the limitation of ler.
vice need not take place before its termination.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER
reluaantly law this matter intrude Will on the butt.
nets of the Committee ; he would now only briefly
remark, that the fuggeflion of the Hon. Gentleman
would not diminith the difficulties attending fuch a
meafure at filch a period. The Claufe was then read
and agreed to without; divifion.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQLJER
fubmiited a Claufe, enaaing, that no volunteer from
the Militia, under five feet four inches nature, fhould
be received into the line.

Earl TEMPLE obferved, that by the militia laws
five feet two inches was the lowa ilature at which
recruits were taken in the Militia ; thus it was ob-
vious that it would be a hardfhip on the Militia Offi-
cer to be called en to turn out none under five feet
four inches. He was free to own, however, that in
seneral they were boys of the Rature of rive feet two
inches who were taken into the Militia.

The CHANCELLOZ of the EXCHEQUER
could nit think of giving 'bp the clank. Haley were
in general boys who were fo entitled, it WAS fair to
prefume that they vanuld, on becoming men. be moll
of them of the (tame required by his clank.

After a few obftrvations from Sir Warcitts WIL-
LIAM WYNNZ, General TAILLTON, and Lord STAN-
LEY, the queltion was put and agreed to.

A converia•ion art& betweenfeveral Members re-
fpe&ing the palibility of Serjeants of the Line tam-
pering with the half fet apart by the Commanding
Officers. Sir W. W. WYNNE deprecated the interfe-
rence, with the Militia, of that dangerous animal, a Re-
cruiting Serjeant lord lau0).
"fhe CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER re-
minded the Committee, that by the Bill the Recruit-
ing Officers of the Line could not enlift from the half
fet apart by the Commanding Officers of the Militia,
or, if they did, their money, incentives, and perfua-
fives would all be employed in vain.
The Houfe having refumed, the Report was re-
ceived, and ordered to be taken into further confider-
ation to morrow.

IRISH MILITIA.

The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER pre notice,
that be fhould co•mortow bring forward a propofizion relative to
the Militia of ireland.

m•agyi3 CORNWALLIS.

Lord CASTLFREAGH brought in the Bill he moved for to
the early part of the evening, for confer' ing ten...in powers oo the
Governor General of India, Stc. which was read a firft time, and
ordered to be read a fecood time to•morrow.—Adjourned.