Star.
London, England, 1822-04-23 00:00:00

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earth ; and Itsovrtng the collo:Wee of Parliament to
be withdrawn from their Government, was it likely
such knowledge would induce them more readily to
return to their obedience, if it did not prompt more
determined acts of insubordination? If he had fol-
lowed the Right Honourable Baronet correctly, he
had ascribed the whole of the evils now -afflicting
Ireland to three principal causes,—first; Misgovern-
ment ; secondly, the efforts made to raise the retenue ;
and, thirdly, the tithes; and he believed he had'ulper-
added to these, that the settlement of which he'said
ought to be the corner-stone of all that was to be
done, the Roman Catholic question. He' thought
these were au the grounds on which he had touched.
To enter on them then would compel him to occupy
more of their time than they would wish to be'
so occupied, and much more than he was dis-
osed to take up. The question on the Roman Ca-
tholic claims must, at all events, be considered
bne that ought to be reserved for a separate debate.
It was not one that could be incidentally discusied
(Hear, hear).—lt was one that affected not Ireland'
alone, but the whole empire, and when entered upon,
a fair opportunity ought to be afforded to those who
differed on it, for stating their opinions as to whether
the present system should be continued, or some'other
code substituted for that which was at present in
force? With the present disturbances in Ireland that
question had nothing to do. He was one ofthosel
who was led to believe, from all the inquiries he had
made on the subject, and he had taken much paid,
to obtain correct information, that the present dis-
rurisances did not originate in anything connected
with the Catholic Claims, nor did he suspect that their 1
termination at all depended on the settlement of that
question. It might be, that in the course of the dis-
turbances. some indications of religious hostility had
been manifested. The Protestants forming the higher,
the Catholics the lower classes in Ireland, it was
natural that at such a period they should feel exaspe-
rated apinst each other. The one class looked with
envy at those who were richer than themselves; the
other with indignation at those who appeared anxious
to form a conspiracy to transfer from the right owners
to themselves the property of the country. These
feelings must naturally lead to some spew of religious
hostility, but these were not the causes of the present
disturbances. He believed every one who went into
the histor) of Ireland would see that all the evils now
complained of sprang from the early misgovernment
of Ireland, he might say their cause was to be found ,
in the original conquest of the country. -That con-
quest had differed from the conquest of any other
country. There had been no attempt on The part of
the conqueror to conciliate the conquered, or to
amalgamate them with their fellow-subjects ; but the
policy pursued had been that of dividing them, and
thus the foundation of future discord had been laid,
and the original cause of quarrel had been carefully
hanJed down from father to son. This practice
had been adhered to through many ages, and there
were those who now considered it as incumbent
on them to take up the 'quarrel as those had
done who were originally aggrieved—(Hear).—
It would surprise those who had not attended to the
documents—the denunciations of various kinds put
forth in the course of these proceedings:— to find how
the parties harped on that period when the name of
an Englishman was unknown in Ireland—when Ire-
land, as they supposed, shone as an independent na-
tion, the glory of the world, and superior to any other
nation in the world. To the original error of the first
conquerors of Ireland, he mainly attributed the evils
now the subject of complaint. He thought it would
be clear, though errors might be imputed to the Eng-
lish Government, that in latter times much of the
difficulty of Ireland had grown out of the habits of '
the natives, from the difference of feeling between
this country and that, and from the embarrassment
which the Legislature had felt in applying laws framed
for the government of one country to the peculiar cir-
cumstances of the other. The Right Hon. Baronet
had spoken on the subject of the revenue raised in
Ireland. He had, however, supplied in the course of
his speech, a solution to the argument raised on the
heavy burden thrown on Ireland. He had said that
Ireland was too highly taxed up to 1817, and that
this drove the native Gentry from that country to
England. But the Right Hon. Baronet, though he
sheered Ireland to have been charged with two seven-
teenths of the burdens of the empire, and though That
might be too large a proportion for Ireland to bear,
he took away that argument altogether, when he ac-
knowledged that this country had taken upon herself
the debt incurred on account of Ireland to make up
one seventeenth of the proportion charged upon her
which she was unable to pay. But when it was said
that taxation in Ireland forced the Gentry of that
country to seek refuge in England, he would remind
the Honourable Baronet how incalculably great the
weight of taxation had been in this country during
the war to what it was in Ireland, and ask if any
man, from such motives as the Right Honourable.
Baronet had supposed, could have been induced to
take up his residence in England ? The argument
to account far the absence of the Irish Gentry, it ap-
peared to him, was wholly incapable of being main-
tained. The question with respect to tithes, which
had been touched upon by the Right Honourable
Baronet, was one which appeared to him (Mr. Goul-
burn) to demand a separate consideration.—
This he thought was the view which the Right Hon.
Baronet took of it himself, from the short and suc-
cinct manner in which he had noticed it. He would
agree with the Right 1-lon. Baronet, that in respect-
ing the rights of the Church, they ought not to for-
get the rights of the People; if by this lie meant that
such a settlement ought to be made as would do jus-
tice to both. In considering this question, it was
proper to remember that the right to tithes was as
sacred as any other sort of property, and the princi-
ples on which they acted with respect to tithes they
might be called upon on a future occasion to apply
to every other description of property. With respect
to the oppression complained of from the tithei being
collected by another party in the name of the Church,
if that was a reason for invading the Church, he
would ask the Irish Gentlemen if there were not one
that might at once be transferred from tithes to
landed p.operty ? They must be careful that they
did not adopt a principle which woul:i lead to the
general invasion of property, and which would pros
. duce a degree of confusion and disorganization far
heyon.l what could be occasioned by any other means.
This question was one of those that were most diffi-
cult to tree. The complaints of those concerned in