Star.
London, England, 1822-07-18 00:00:00

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-.71.01pre.
• ""1".70/110,*-4- -
•- - • -

ld be i
voted a breach Of privildie,l4
etc 7 keeet& to z t
ass._
In his
c4ul4 the Home .___ einilientag Istp iiiarecoscairt
ld at-Cede' to The a third ' the 'mums' • 'Lit IL
ress.
motion of his Hon. Friend. There was no example' Put " ttiislitiationp or *r
*hat a person so situated had been let olf wiehosit any every 41itealiteate-ekelebeLisset,' wits either a filk
punishment, in consequence of an explanation. .But an enessysind then.sayors
he had beard no explanation; all that the party. mid oout coltduct... . Ale was has:o4;tyamuto lived:theta butil.thilitn.
was, that he acted under the imp:mine ted x,nd.l;ea..nter 4 •Getitlem. 151 r. Abercrornby,)
feelings. No denial bad been made by Mr. 'Hope that meted he Was let:it-ant prthe. ace of the SCotob
lie had intended to provoke his Hon. Irrieiid to Bar. But, in consee' treiiie of the 'statement made,
breach of the peace. If be was allowed to leavi the both "
teas Hawse nerd ibe 'Rabb- *e had lama a -icor
bar of the House in that manner, never had the. harsh ,and top" staitr ofMr..Hope. He bid .no,
House been placed in so contemptible a vitiation, and. sloubt.that the Poo. Gentleman would hate done as:
which, little as the Member for Westmiaster valued: "he said, "and corrected any err into which he.had,
its privileges, even he could scarcely wish to witness. fallen. Mr. Hope had ititedlsis case with it frankness'
(The 'Mon. Gentleman tat down antidikuidUheeriug). that surely was not "tfewrisatg— Of repran. and. Mr.i
Lord BINNING had hoped that this unpleasant Hope Was to be treated as one who, being placed in a.
affair had been hastening to a termination, till he tryingsitisations had frankly told the House
heard the speech of the Learned Gentleman. Inge- must vindicate his character, even though in so doing
neral it was a rule, after an explanation had been he ihould be so unfortunate as to incur the' • "are
given, to treat any case with the greatest possible of the House.
lenity. He would appeal to the House, if they had Lord A. HAMILTON said, that theltioneefb,:tn he;
ewer heard a more fitai—(Lord cheers from the Op. sympathy with Mr. Bar, bad forgetten the erns-
pesition)—he would repeat the word, a more firm,
.pithy due to his Hon, Friend. Thepreed vote.
or more respectful explanation to the House ? Mr. was not consistent with what was due*lir ao the
Hope had stated, that he had no intention whatever to House or to his Hononrable Neil It wain fact a
violate the privileges of the House, for which, as well mere nullity.
tss for the House itself, he professed the most profoUnd Sir JAMES MACKINTOSH anted; thafhe had
-respect. His Learned Relation (Mr. Hope), had stated, been ignorant of the practice of the Scotch Bar. He
that he had found both his character and prospects in- had no objection to any lenity that might be shewn
jured. He (Lord Binning) could state, that had there to Mr. Hope.
been any prospect of the charges against Mr. Hope Mr. BROUGHAM wished to know if the Hon.
and the Lord Advocate being discussed this Ses- and Learned Gentleman would introduce the motive,
sion, that letter would never have been written.— as assigned by the Member for Ynareshorough, and
11 He (Mr. Hope) had been stated as having been a the President of the Board of Trade?
Counsel in a casein which he had not been Counsel; Mr. COURTENAY acquiesced and moved that'
and as having acted with a view of prejudicing an the words " His eapressions of regret," be introduced.
unfortunate Gentleman on his trial. He would have The original motion was then withdrawn, and the
been ashamed of his Hon. Relation, if he had not amended one substituted.
given such charges an indignant refutation—(f/ear) Mr. BROUGHAM trusted, that the words would
—but his Hon. Relation had never accused the Hon. be left in under all circumstances," for otherwise
Member (Mr. Abercrontby) of wilful misrepresents- the House could not commit, in future, Printers and
tion. It had been stated by the Learned Gentleman, Reporters, or persons whose politics might run cou-
that the two Advocate Deputes had patronized pub- ter to that of the majority of the House.
lications that led directly to crime, bloodshed, and Mr. COURTENAY said, the omission was units-
murder. That had been all proper, had the facts tentional. The words were then introduced.
been true. He was sorry that the Member for Knares- Lord A. HAMILTON suggested, whether the Re-
borough (Sir J. Mackintosh) had lent the authority of solution was not putting words into Mr. Hope's mouth,
his name to such unfounded accusations, and had ani- which he had never used? He heard no expression of
madverted on what he termed the furious zeal of the regret from him.
two Advocate Deputes. It had been truly said, that Mr. COURTENAY hoped the Noble Lord would
Mr. Hope was upon his trial, and he trusted that the believe, that he would not have introduced the words
House would do nothing to prejudge the cause. Mo- if he had not heard them.—The Resolution was then
tives had been imputed, that, had they been true, agreed to.
would have prevented any Gentleman from culti- Mr. HOPE was then called in and discharged by
eating the acquaintance of Mr. Hope. The House the SPEAKER.
should recollect, that the breach of privilege, on the Mr. COURTENAY moved that William Menzies,
part of Mr. Hope, had been founded on a breach of Esq. be called to the Bar (which was ordered) and
privileges connived at by the House in the publica-. told by the &MAUER the nature of the Resolutions of
tion of the debates of the House. His Hon. Rela- the House. He was then shewu his letter, which he
Lion could not have preserved his station in the circle admitted. On being asked what he had to offer in
of society in which he moved, had he not taken the explanation,
step he had done. Mr. Mzsztes began, in a low tone of voice, by
Mr. ABERCROMBYlansented that any act of his stating, that he was most anxious to assure that Ho-
should have interrupted the usual business of the nourable House, that he had always entertained, and
House. He was sensible of the impression made by still did entertain, a profound respect for that Ho-
Mr. Hope's letter, but while he had a seat in that nourable House, and that nothing had given him
House, to that House only would he give any expla- greater pain than to know that he had done anything
nation-7(Hear,hear).—At the time he made his state- to offend against its privileges. Having observed in
meat he did not know how far the Advocate Deputes the Courier Newspaper the report of a speech of a
were responsible for the paper; and he was also ig- Member of that Honourable House, containing a se-
norant of the practice at the Scotch bar in the signa- vere attack on his conduct, made, as he conceived,
tare of papers. He had stated that the case of Borth- under the erroneous idea that he had acted on a par-
wick was one of great oppression, and he was still of titular occasion in an official capacity, he felt him-
the same opinion. Had he been informed in a pro- self called upon to address the Honourable Member
per manner that he had fallen into any error, he to whom it was ascribed. As the Honourable Mem-
would have been the first to have admitted and cor- ber had acted upon false information, he considered
rected the mistake—(Cheering). it to be his duty to that Honourable Member and
The Marquis of LONDONDERRY was happy at to himself to state, how false was the information he
the tone and temper of the speech or the Learned had received, and how much-be had been deceived.
Gentleman who had just spoken. *Much, in reference He had published that statement in the hopes that
to the debates of the House, would depend on the the Hon. Member would in his place state the real
termination of this affair. No doubt could exist as facts of the case. In a few days after be had so
to the breach of privilege to publish the debates at all. written he received an answer from that Hon. Mem-
The present case was not to be 'looked at too nicely, ber, 'in which be said, that out of regard for the
but with reference to the general practice. In the case privileges of Parliament he could not permit hinv.;
alluded to Mr. Hope had nothing to do as Advocate self to give any explanation on anything which ap-.
Depute; and he would put it to the Hon. Gentleman, peared in a Newspaper; but he admitted that the.
or to any other Member, if his conduct would not report was substantially correct. However much be
have been similar in the case of a similar mistake?— regretted the course pursued by that Hon. Member;
He Conceived that Mr. Hope had balanced between he acquiesced in -it. He then felt himself called upon!
his respect for the privileges of the House and his to address the Editor of the Newspaper in question t.
anxiety for the vindication of his character. The and he begged to assure that House that he had not
motion of his Learned Friend was substantially an other intention than to vindicate his own character;
admonition to Mr. Hope, though the word was not before the world. If he had thought any other cocH
mentioned, and he hoped would be adopted by the struction could be placed on what he wrote, he would
House—(Hear, hear). not hate written it. He could not but feel that the
Mr. TIERNEY could not agree with the Resolu- charges preferred against him in that report were un-
tion of the Learned Gentleman. If it were adopted, warranted, groundless, and false. Considering the ef-,
no man ever left the bar of that House so triumph- fect they were likely to produce to his prejudice in hisl
antly as Mr. Hope. He must say, that the speech of professional character, be had put that statement is j
Mr. Hope was not satisfactory to him ; as he had a Newspaper, which had been voted a breach of the
stated, that, notwithstanding his respect for the pri. privileges of the House of Commons. He had, in
vileges of the House, he felt compelled to adopt the the first instance, written to the Hon. and Learned
course he had done. He by no means meant to say Gentleman, being convinced that what had appeared
that a person attacked in that House should have no was gross and calumnious misrepresentation. The
remedy; but there were various methods, without course which he had subsequently taken was solely
any infringement on the privileges of the House. with a view to the vindication of his character. He
Abuses would never be detected it the persons so de- had now only to assure the House, that in anything
tecting them were liable to personal attack. Simply which he had done, he had net the slightest inten-
to read the Resolution to Mr. Hope, would be to him don to provoke a breach of the law, nor any idea
*great triumph, Which it could not be the intention that acting as he had acted, he should commit a
of-the House he should enjoy. He should oppose breach of the privileges of that House.
the Resolution, unless something in the nature of re- Mr. MENZIICS bowed, and withdrew.
primand was inserted. Should the Resolution pass, Mr. W. COURTENAY said, after the speech which
the doors of the House would be shut against all in- they had just heard, he thought the most consistent
quiry into the. conduct of public delinquents. The course Mould be at oecitto declare, that in come-
course adopted onto be fatal to the rights and pri- quence of the full and satisfactory explanation which
vileges of the House, and to the freedom of debate. had been offered, no further proceeding was neces-
Mr. WYNN had supiscirted the motion made on a nary. He therefore conceived, under all thecircum-
format evening, as he conceived the present ease to stances of the case, that he should. meet the unani-
be a substantial breach of the privileges of the House.
,moss fading of the House, by moving. " That Ms.
poblication of the speeches was only tole- Menzies be discharged from further attendance." -
raid, no *ember could be called upon on account *Mr•BROUWiIAbf role a monad the-motion of
Of the report of his speeches. Though the conduct the Hon. Gentlenaaa. He fait that the House
of the Gmalentan lately at the bar could not be jus- reason to be satisfied with the real • explammen aad,
titled, yet' it ans, greatly extenuated. Had he ani- vindication of Ins conduct which had Of
seistdverted on the atitemeat in the Newspaper, not the Learned Geatlallalta Win) had isaft
preSataaaag to. be correct, no impropriety would their Bar. He Genteaded that as that.
hats. Isom dramiliitted,,. 'wished to repsd -toe ; eo„ view to Llama das peace, and no wish to ani.
.ounce as insievatt tone tras- the iiiitsaty oT fringe the privileges of the Houses but had merely

,

,
-

aesireint rtioviii it' faints
s vnitte-dnerges con-
se report, nothing further wat'lletiLitUry.
him highly satidfsesory that the matter
J terminate thus. Aber what had passed, he
. that,the priirileges'ar-dre Home were as safe as
inw_the 'honour of all she parties c
The istotion for dissinerin from fur-
iher *Was then Rt'ltts4 Animist.
. . siker.* AM**, .
tolt;nel IVANYES.sand
gritslash frig:ate in the whine -Aare leant Shy
.
guns, ye Turki-sh jramfn, old
some British banters. lie wished to knew if !lie
,Noble Lord meant to allow this gross breach of his
Poreign Enlistment Bill?. , .
"'he Ittirinip of LbiliDOMMll.ltlrsaid, thn; she
:'ere from the Pacha of tgy pt with lituseedf
aid a collection for. the British Mingo m.. .An
aßph-
cation was made to allow )3rip:l3 seamen to navigute
ertn hoei .tk r answewas,„ that there could 'lke no
'objection, provided he left them at.l44ita, 04,0_
Silted her home with his own people. Military stoles
and guns were refused, as well as the purChase of two
frigates for the Paiha's service, because it would
'blase the neutrality.
Colonel DA VIES mid, the secondin
told him, boastingly, that he was going to cruise•
against the Greeks, and that she had '5B guns, and
a ins and ammunition. •

The Marquis of LONDONDERRY had stated
what •had appeared itehisOlSce. If she did anything
against the Greeks, they could complain to this Go.
vei nrnent.

Dr. LUSHINGTft said, a great object would be
gained by the Koble Lord undertaking that no more
men would be allowed to this vessel, as there was ho
necessity to navigate her to Malta.
Mr.C. HUTCHINSON said, the Noble Lord would
recollect that the Pacha of Egypt was not an inde.
pendent Sovereign. He was a servant of the Porte,
nd he had sent a fleet to assist it against the Greeks
The British crew of this vessel might be so dispersed
throughout the Turkish fleet as to enable them to
destroy that of the Greeks.
Mr. F. ROBINSON said, this vessel came here as a
merchantman; if she was now fitting out as a man
of war, those who entered on board of her without an
Order in Council, were subject to the Foreign Enlist-
ment ♦ct.

Mr. BARING regretted that this country was la-
bouring under a base aspersion, that we were assist-
ing the Turks against the Greeks. This was the opi-
nion of every statesman on the Continent, that he had
conversed or communicated with.

.•
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.. I. .
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party gives--a &size *hi& no elltoThir 'Ol 4* . •
-trosirlhedW h was to him
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mao out of the lioeseVuoplid be allowed! is w..., vilitroefthallisemoseitotwillistaidiog . felt that,the pr
With every wish that Mr. Rope should be looy I.of UP Nkosap. to moors* to what bit boo to was, the lictocui
[Tatted ht he c'eulit nnt eee'heiv. &OA". the .1141 c I. 7i^ilig .isiured Lamar? In Ain PAY_ *IMMO OWI t ‘i'. '.......1 _