Star.
London, England, 1823-04-18 00:00:00

*ire*, IM He had Li therto surPorted the'
eman,
,becaust lie-believed that he'l
advocated the cause with Sincestty.. He now thee% rt.
the atlair was a perfect trick; or what in familiar
languagf- was called a hoMbuF. It was not the'
Right in. Gentleman coming down to that House
with honied words, and fine sentences, which would
convince him of his sincerity. He did not believe
the Right Hon. Gentleman to be sincere. He had
heard the Right Hon. Gentleman make the very
speech alluded to by the Hon. liar onet ; and yet he
now saw him sitting on the Treasury Benches, acting
with a Government hostile to the question. In the
face of the Right Hon. Gentleman, he told him he
did not believe him to be sincere. He should not pm
himself into the cart with such a set of comedians.
He would not lend himself to such a trick. lie had
no doubt the Irish Gentlemen who opposed this ques-
tion opposed it honestly. But the people of Ireland
h'ad just cause to complain of this Sessional motion
moved by the Right Hon. Gentleman and others of
his stamp. He had often been delighted at the elo- t
cknence of the Right Hon. Gentleman, and it was
with real pain he spoke of him, as he thus found him-
self compelled to do.
Mr. Secretary PEEL said that something had
fallen from the Honourable Baronet which rendered
it necessary for him to trou'ole the House with a few
observations. Ile had insinuated a doubt as to the
sincerity of the opposition to this question. He (Mr.
Peel) declared that the opposition was as sincere as
the advocacy. If the lion. Baronet advocated to-
leration, he surely would tolerate the difTcrerce of
opinion which he met in his adversaries. The opt
nions of the Honourable Bat OnCt, as he had expressed
them, were the strongest proofs of intolerance. The
Honourable Baronet had no right to arrogate to him-
self an exclusive propriety of opinion. The Hon.
Baronet had asked whether he (Mr. ('eel) was appre-
hensive of the Pretender or the Devil; just as if an
answer to that question would furnish the Hon. Ba-
ronet with the grounds of his opposition—(Hear,
hear).—lf his Right Hononrable Friend should press
the question, he should persist in giving it his de-
cided opposition; and would state the grounds of it;
but until then let the Honourable Baronet keep to
himself his doubts of the sincerity of others. He
(Mr. Peel) would rather consent to his eternal exclu-
sion from office, than consent to the slightest com-
promise of his opinions on this question—(Cheers).
—He had never deviated from principle upon it. He
cared not for the opinions of others. Though all the
People should be uaanimous in favour of this ques-
tion, he, so long as he remained unconvinced, should
persist in his steady opposition to it—(Cheers).—
/Co circumstance had appeared to warrant the Hon.
, Baronet's chargeof insincerity; and he must desire
the Honourable Baronet to abstain from such charges.
When he (Mr. Peel) had entered office, he expressly
claimed the privilege of acting as he thought fit on
this question. And, in the appointment of the Mar-
quis Wellesley to the office of Lord Lieutenant, and
of his Right Honourable Friend near him (Mr.
Wynn) he had found no obstacle to co-operation
with a view to the best interests of the community.—
He had the honour to hold office in Ireland under
three different Lord Lieutenants, and he could con-
fidently defy any imputation of impartial justice
being properly brought against his administration
during that period. He had never heard of such an
imputation.• He-never could admit that his feelings
towards the Catholics of Ireland were ever any other
than their warmest friends could de:sire, consistently
with the existing laws. He knew his conduct was
liable to misconstruction, and that • it had rendered
him open to the idle charge of his being the advo-
tate of a wicked Orange system. He believed, how-
ever, that the well-informed, the general body of
the Roman Catholics, would not bring such an
putation against him—(Hear, hear).—He should
not have troubled the House had he not fek himself
Called upon to do so by a sense of honour in conse-
quence of the remarks of the Honourable Baronet,
and ono or two expressions which had fallen from his
Right Honourable Friend.
Sir F. BURDETT explained. He did not mean
to convey any personal reflection upon the Right
Hon: Gentleman. He bad said that his own opinion
on the question was so decided, that he would al-
most take the issue of the debate upon the statetnent
of the Right Hon.. Gentleman, as to his sincerely be,
hewing danger would arise from the concession of
this question.
Mr. Secretary PEEL said that the Hon. Baronet
had not only said that the apprehension of danger
was groundless, but also that those who said they had
such an apprehension did not sincerely feel it.
Mr. WYNN also explained, and diiclaimed any
intention to throw an imputation on his Right Ho-1
nourible Friend.

Mr. BROUGHAM said, that the question was.
whether this great subject should be given up now
and for ever ?—(Cries of " No, no.")—He was much
cheered by this irregular negative—(A laugh). Well,
as the question was, whether the Right Hon.
Gentletran should bring it forward or not ; and as
some Hon. Members had recommended him not to do
so, he rose to protest against any such recommenda-
tion: Agreeing, as he did, in almost all which had
falters from his Right Hon. Friend (Mr. Tierney),
having the -Worst opinion of the conduct of those who
had substantially abandoned their duty to the ques-
tion, instead of pursuing the manly, plain, and intel-
ligible opposition which was given to it by the Right
Hun. Secretary of State for the Home Department,
Who-had never taken office to abandon the question
substantially and support it only by words: still he
would not hive the question kept back. The Right
Hon. Secretary of State for the Home Department
had opposed the question honestly and heartily. Of
him no one could complain. But when the point was,
whether the Hon. Secretary for Foreign Affairs should
go to India into honourable exile—(Hear, I lear)—nt
take office in England, and not submit to his sentence
of transportation—( Hear, I lea r)—but be condemned
to hard labour in his own country—(cheers and laugh-
' ter)—doomed to the disquiet of a divided councit—
Sitting with his enemies, and pitied by his friends—
(Much cheering)—with his hands chained and tied
down on all those lines of operation which his own
sentiments and wishes would have led him to adopt
—(aratinued chcering)—at thin critical moment,
:Olen his fate depended urn Lord Chancellor Eldon,
%Id his sentiments upou the- Catholic (Adm... at that
Critical sirrioment It she hied, said Ik-the 'Fast night
that he would not truckle to a Noble Lord (kola-


._~

stone), had then exhibited a specimen, the inrva ;n,
credible specimen, of monstrous truckling let,ilk
r urpose of obtaining office, which the *4ll4gcbutote;* •
of -political tergiversation could
• M. S:Tretary CANNING here inlerfered,
said, " SI-, I T I Ceclare that that is ft:lse
Immense confus.ion immediately ensued. Clift
of Crder, Order ! Chair, Crlair ! were loudly-re*
ferated from all sides of the [louse.
Mr. BROUGHAM endeavoured to make. hirritik;
heard ; but he could only utter—" I implore thc
Hoth.e As he could not be heard, he histiii
turned round, took up his hat from bissr.n, and was.'
pt oceeding towards the door to quit the I-I,aehe. ra,44
Menthe; s laid hold of him, and prevented him fro*.
quitting the House; Mr. Boo:Jot:am theicupoo.ke
sumed his seat.

The SPEAIiEII called upon the Right non. St.
cretary to retract the expression..
Mt. Sect ct y CANNING sr,id that-he had nn obr
jection to alter thi word, but ro consideration- 0#
earth should induce biro to retract the sentiment.

The SPEAKER. tl,en said; that the duty-wki
devolved upon him would admit of no enuttges.
mice. Having had no• time for considetatiot kit
must call upon the House to wist him.—lt was cif:
for him to remind the House of.the course proper t
be taken in such a case as the present. He helicra4i,
it was well known that such an expiession•as had.bes,.
used must be recalled without any qii:ditication.:
Mr. Secretary CANNING said he'should be eimi
to fail under the displeasure of the House. Wilde
submit with' resignation to any censer, italiikaiti,
flict upon him, but he thought ha had a nee*
use the expression.
The SPEAKER said he must then implore *
support of the !louse substantially and effectively..
The CHANCELLOR of the FACHEQUEItai
it was impossible to entertain a doubt as to the pow.
priety of the suggestion which had 'alien from thir.
Chair. There could also be no doubt that, with No
faience to the Ordets of the House, the langnageisi
question was disorderly. At the same time, he mita
a-lt the Honourable and Learned Gentleman, speak,.
ing as one Gentleman would to another—v:4mq_,
whether the language which fell from him was
highly irritating. The Honourable and Is
Gentleman was in the habit of speaking in that
with great eloquence, and with a strength of
pression peculiar to him-elf Had such terms atm&
been applied to his Right Honourable Friend, tert*,
of the severest repro ich, not merely addressed told*
as a Minister, for in that character he tt
everything, but addressed to him, as it weft pp%
'ottani, he feared he should, at the moinentOopme
expressed his own sentiments in language' noel*
measured. The Honourable and Learned Gentlemidl
would fat feit nothing in character as a man, or asa,,l
Member of that House, if he were to retrace unless;
gunge which had called forth the expression.
thought the Honoulable • and Learned Gentleman.
never could have meant to convey a personal impu-
tation. They were ail liable to irritable feelings;
and under the influence of which, intemperate lot-
gunge would escape from the most guarded of thee.
The SPEAKER said, that the observations tide
Chancellor of the Exchequer led him to fear dim
some part of the difficulty was occasioned by hiaa-.
No, no!)—It Was suggested, that the languageide
Honourable and Learned Gentleman appli -
Right Honourable Secretary, was no. onl:
to his public conduct, but had a.nreaoitig
offensive. in such -
duty to interfere ; a,
so, had he imagined
tion. He now cash
Learned Gentlemar
tended the words to
Mr. BROUGH/C
Mr. TI E RNEY rose
Chair, that when the r
the language of the
be personally offensi,_
the words be taken down
explanation of there.
thing like debate if
Right Hon. Secretary
middle of a sentence,
much the conclusion
member of it. 'ft.
Learned Gentleman
timely and proper ir
qien to give it, was,
The expression of
been se-affirmed. He
Hon. Secretary that
imputation upon his
the expression he had
the explanation of •
The SPEAKER
Hon. Sect etary to .
lion, but not the sent
bring about that
pear in a declaration
and Learned Gentleman
vial conduct of the
Mr. Secretary CA
the decision of the F.
igiectfully, but he ,
expression he had ask
Lord A RCHIB.O
the present case he
trusted the Howe
ahought there must
this case, should it
there were such abum
Mr. liA NKES said•
formed its duty, by
Tutor of the ordets
making use of the expression
Get of disorder. He •
Secretary had not
might have done .
The Honourable Mr
" That the Right Ii
Henry Brougham,
of the Serjeant at A
Mr. Serjeant ONS.
• Mr. C. W. WYNN
Learned Gentleman
loot concluded his
LWarrantcd 'in interrul
pert the Motion of
not perceive any real
nation. He thought ."
, lion. Ir; icad was not

yotiE
Alasembit
MA- Met
' W.

jhouh.
13E1

:ou
perso

Ci
,ham Nwr*• beer

)aside
rat
tot

r
Ern 4.017' ...11
' he was P "
ffi
of monstrous true ft ilk
g office, which thewgiro -hittotti
•• • andlieolle.4i
.sat ion could furnish_.:. .. ..,,. 11t4AfiutPI
ANN'S° here imerfeied. *air,:
o declare that that is jhiser :,:lm,; unbeConin.el!_.
;.ion immediately ensoed. Clip% ; House seh tell
a Mr. C. W.
Chair, Glair! were lonely-mar • in 4 Pei.°l/11_.s
!es of the [louse. . ... he saw An ow
endeavoured to make. hiossaii; to demand a
ild only utter—" I implore thk• match Mr. Almor"aft akouh
AB
El
could not be heard, 1;e histiii
up his hat from his sein, and eras. ) Wed a
the door to quit the Hello.. I'4s
...
c°l7lthmer he hi
of him, and prevented him fru, -
whe
he thoug
e; Mr. lino:rot:au theicupoo.kle ""e•
factory, and i
wn Orders, 1
the House svii
called upon the Right Hon. Se. "
cached f ~
tach from ~
he expression.
A NNING sr.id that'he had nn obo Mr. NVIL
W 2
e word, but too consideration- rop
experience-bsi c vet he
e biro to retract the sentiment. • —r)nit'.flom
. then said; that the duty- whiril4 •
) him would adfnit of no enustner.
. ixarned Men
d no• time for considetatiort, Ise
- • orst be bdund
House to assibt him.—lt was tit:
..jities_ bait 1
the House of.the course proper to member woo
case as the present. He heliessa,, nothing pens
;well to the es
that such an expiessionas hadben,. Wilmot) decl a
cd without any qn:lification.• ...
;,.: •aeovessions ee
ANNINU said heshould be .
era hive C 4
ispleasure of the Haase. Woe; dwro bee,
anion .to any censer, ixoniihate .
.honout ninny
rig
the thought ha had a *
forei.lefrit to tl
• Sir F. BUR
',. said he must then implore tha.
‘,
Sir
had
Ise substantially and effectively. 4.. •
quite confiden
,1.,01i, of the FXCHEQUEltairliv II appeared to
o entertain a doubt as to die prat;
fruezetfn. respecting r,
estion which had fallen from dlr.
Id also be no doubt that, with reo of the Right I,
ens of the House, the langnagena setting, aside i
derly. At the same time, he markt offensive. If
,e and Learned Getaleman, speaks. last conceived
non would to another—(Chterep•o offensive, he o
cage which fell from him wen* . tan down in
The Honourable and Leiria Sir ROBEIi
the habit of speaking in thank., solved in diffic
rnce, and with a strength of He thought tl
3 him-elf Had such terms as hid: Hon. Gentler))
i Right Honourable Friend, ter* peliti ea li y i Roc
ro ich, not merely addressed tent,Mr. CANNI
in that character he sitilitiliir General right[;
ddressed to him, as it welt. pis aria) from a
he should, at the monsentdram
s
sentiments in language' not- net lot:rite), t
guiltybat wi
, of
mourable and Learned Genital* so f, as lam b
ing in character as a man,
or asa, same time sritl
louse, if he were to retrace thole.. , I will further
called forth the elpression. lb •
the Learned G
our able and Learned Gentlernas ; me: personally.
meant to convey a personal imps- • having unbeco
e ail liable to irritable feelings; I swage, for do
tenet of which, intemperate leo L- tation which is
se from the most guarded of their. 'l, If that intentioi
L said, that the observations ofthe 'ifit be applied
• Exchequer led him to karat » ' The SPEALi
ifficulty was occasioned by bins. now to conside
suggested, that the languageidn. .s made sufficient
earned Gentleman applied Mit., If not, the Hot
Secretary, was nos.. only ditsig the Orders, so ;
ler, but had a•meacing peril* what seemed n
I a case it was his the Speak' standing. He
and he certainly should backrest cretary to have
al the words bore such a cannon House. Severs
ailed upon the Honourails.arg first used tp ha
an to state, whether lie hi lil r iip . sidered them tic
:o convey such a meaning? ''.'. House to decla:
NI was about tii speak, Am. .... to proceed fard
rose to order. Ile submitted tails • Mr. BitOUG
be Right Hon. Secretary cooed* codsult his own
le Hon. and Learlied Gentleman.. fore he entered
sive, heshould have first mosigikit remainder of th
down ; and then have callediatt terrupted by th
n. But there would be an cod seal Canning). Bel
'such an interruption as that of it le begged it•ao
ary were allowed. It was 1.110, planation had n
ice, before any one could t lip(iststitttlhysennsaisrbefath,
amwth.ej
glik -
lion of it might qualify
r ; o call now upon the Heat
an for an esplaaation, wie ° farina of its ord
interference would have cow ptilig mined by ever
,he thought, entirely emir dome& .. taken into putt
f the Right Hots. Secretary hal . was•not cyan e
le, for one, could assert the Sight should also and
tat he thought there woggle/4 , heir, glen). 11
his honour it be would eitkikAg, ', part of that pre
ad used, in order to makes*ist to its-pries a
the Hon. and Learned Goodwin.. custody, in cos
L said be had understood the IS4 been addressed
say, that he withdrew roar" setuface in whil
entiment. His eudeasamemee bileeeisaadwianstiewelfli r
fair explanative) which veroglier
on that the language of digger'' he hill made 9*
leman was ippked only 4100."'”"1.41/t
; Right Hon. Secretary. - 4 not take upon
IANNINCI said he•shouldo4l" used words that
House, and receive its oesooteios and personal ap
•
could ant either recal of 14111 iliCecharacter of
used. ..... •.. . the boundaries b
ALI) HA ItIILTIN taid4ll4l# ;L_III/Ireter of his I
he knew diet/hair wouldirNkle. ._
._weeHouse to juC
would, do its duty. Ware 411ellairellstihe ha,
net be someobitsg very pea11it._......, %sot' k vas un
eSSOne w)Ai,ch I
,tunenddasitintusseritta : 44 flitguosioss ,1
pambinalietl geguarnephasr7
said, the 'Chair bad -.- 6, tenegly osotbe 1
y odfecthlaerifingauc. who %Iles
tuke.. • .ri
~ .1 tthem, and I
i
eaves. eat) Aso of
repression in question w oallse !ancialiStatll
11**e:cited wh
eEtwhsociaus.g'bsriet.rcenuotorittisole itdiodShrzuht 14_ '.-
..,
c.s.e..7denta.
111)1,11:
Id: li
constswady• with. his see ' ~ -••• reettleellinte
JUN, •
Member .conolusind 41 *Air Nap. sigetiqg 1
Lionour.ibia.tieogip "
.4
ladaginnerledge
Arms." ) ~„, ,
4SLOW second , the • f°l*, Mutes al
'elte plib
gN thought thet a the : .
~,....._. lia .
n were disorderly, bursts its.,, , nligai/bestip
lysfor
I
TsuepntteinngceLlmie.didneootcapreekita.
~- . 'filield'il"Pltiess
f the flun.lientlents% 'q.t.. tettli'Rf fit tic
eal difficulty in the welln,. . . taks„,:
.- ...
it that the explaisatiothaf tires . oto,_ich he
consi
be sileeble:
DI sufficient.' He thoon
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