Star.
London, England, 1807-07-01 00:00:00

the prefent occalion. The HottimiAblistato'neti
had lad night entered into a very fhlt and fatistkehry*!
explanation of the tranfigtion in Teettion; had egad
with the greateil delicacy in defirtng that, in the pre-
fent (fate of things, he might not be named in the
Comniittee. Having Rated fo much, he could Zit but
notice and Tv:pelf the attention *of tbe)Hrintiottj the
original formation •of the Committee,. Antis* &dieted
*bat; id the annals of that Houfe, there hall naltenbeen
a Oomrnittee.confilling of fp.great a number of Cep-.
flatten as twenty-one, who had been appointed in a
fititilar manner. Two.Gentlernen who were on it, he
believed, had voted againtt the late Adminiftration,
ewe:more-had voted fometimes with theNoble•Lord.
boa all the. refs were'Members who,'•unifisproty voted
with the late.Adminiflration on every qtreflion ; and,
he believed the Hdule would think with him that a
Committee appointed on filch principles, was not the I
heft calculated in the world to be impartial in all
thoreseafes•which might come under 'its' confidera.
lion. Irr framing this Contoritrewonew, it • was not
his intention to recommend any confiderable increafe
of the number, one or two could make. no great dif,.l
ference, but he thought twenty-five would be too
many. He wifhed, however, to ?111-oft-other Urines
into it, and in fo doing he -Mould be guided €l'what
he thought wouldtnott niareriallytend.to procure as
much impartiality as# poffible. •He had left five
names fur the purpore of introducing five others,
which he thought would tend to that definable pur.
pole he had juft mentioned. He-had .alto determined
to follow another fugo,eition of 'theltfo'ble Lord op •
polite to hirn tLord Howich), viz. to nominate the
Members openly, inaead of by ballot: He•thought,,
fur his own Oirt, that the mode by tillot was pre-
ferable,,but, he.gave up his own opinion to the Noble
Lord'ii fuggetlion, becanfe he a:ight it might be
made,ll4.fuNed of much high flown declamation--
that ittnight.beffid to mean Come Iliiitter or under-.
hand dealtug..to 'change the mode, of forming the
Commiticetoithat of. billot,.and to avOld any fuch
irOputatiOn,be wdold•fecit remain as . before. lie
wouhritate tcrthe Houle alt the names he intended ,
for the prefent Committee, that the Mule might fee
dilliceily the alterations whiitiliod been made. In
(Wing that he fradleft out Conic hamesthat were on
the former Committee, be begged the Houle to rer
Oiled the reafeins he had iffigned for dding fu.and he
thought the' Houle woad be caotiotts how they en:
trolled perfons with the examination into 'all the
public tranfadions of the:kingdom, who had, on all
occations, fhewn Co decided add onrenritting. a-parti-
ality for all the 'Ails of the late Attrniniftrattoo. Tke
Houle would eafily reiolled ,that
.mutt: • had been
laid by the late Minifters on the fobjtet, and-in con-
demnation of granting places in rever lion. He had
very: lately come to the knoWledge Of a tinia extr•tor-
dinary,grant of rev.erfloo, asp 'lae believed, had ever
been heard of. ..A very thort 'dine ,before the late
Minift'ers.tetited from. office..they granted, in rover-
god, the places of Collator, temptreller, &c. of
13uettosAy t es, though they .lonewat the time the place
wasnot.then.in our polfalion, and that appointments
having taken place jug before they went out of office,
Viewed pretty -elearly the) have not a claim to all
that wonderful abflemiottfnefs they wiihed to be
thought poll-cited cf. He had, before, on another
orcafron. mentioned-the three hundred Surveyors of
Taxes. -:He would.not Far that it might not be ne.•
ceffary, on Tome occafions, to appoint additional Sur-,
veynrs ; but m create•fo great a number in the month
of Oetober, jilt} when Parliament was about to be
diffolved, was a eiremmltance that, coupled with the
influence fo .many perfims ma' have in various
places throughout the country, by no means favour-
ed of that impartiality and noninterference in elec-
tions, to %diet they laid fuch broad claims. There
.....tras another appointment which he thbught fully as
exceptionable .as any of thofe he had before mention•
. eti, and that was, the appointment to the patent of-
'fice df Gazette writer -it, Scotland : that offize was
created by tire late Adminittration,and given to one
. of their friends with a Nary affixed to it of 3001. a
year. Ever (tote the year ty93, this bullock had
been !tone by threenewfpaper writers in Edinburgh,
who had been appointed to the office by Mr. Pitt, on
the •eirprefs condition that no expence whatever
.Theuldthereby accrue to this country, and they had
been perfeftly fatiified therewith, and adually
°voted that They 'made an advantage of about tool.
it year from the fervice it seas of to their papers.—
Yet thofe men, thus gratuitoufly pentorming this
duty; were turned out by the late Adminiftration for
the fele purport of appointing an individual, one of
their own adherents, with Co confiderable a yearly
falary. There were, he laid, a great number of others,
bnt he could affure the Hanle he did not mean to go
throreh them all (a kad laugh). He would not
mention the profeifors of mAical forgery and medi-
cal jurifprodence, for lie fhould be really getting out
or his depth. having
.never before heard of fuch of-
fices, and therefore he did not pretend to underfland
what they meant. There was one more grant, how.
ever, that he could not omit to notice, which was
that of a petition, Coriog, pleafure, to a Civil and Cri-
minal Judge in Scotland. I'his was only not carried
into execution, becaufe thofe who were to do it hefi-
toted, from a doubt whether they could legally be-
come parties to furls a tranfadion. From all thole
circtimaances it behoved the Houfe to appoint filch
a Committee as they might espett would tet with the
4iri 9ell impartiality ; and it was evident there would
lie fornething more fur theM to do, than to Ping the
praile.sof the late Administration. He would now
iced the names of the Committee as they flood, and
part nut, as he went or, thofe who were on it tre-
fore,ind 'bore who wire not. It had been dual. that
tape perf.rn voila nattiest rhe Committee fhould always
fland the Grit on the lift, bin from this he begged to
be exenfed. The Noble Lord oppofite to him (Lord
H. Petty) had done the fame ; but the Moire had
declared 'it ro have been the ufnal pradice, and on
-that alone he was iodated to &Infinite on it. He
-ithitikhentreitr, there *weld be no- irregularity in'
ills reettelting to be *tenor of it.
WA POPS alt +Mt Cm al %WM" g•
Mr. Bonlitsas faresmr W. TN:ammo—was
Mt. BLldnlgitt-6-ersen Me W. Ctrendah.—not
nat. Mr. Alderman CnintSe.—stat
Mr N. Olivet. ..not
ittr: T. Bariiit-wiot
4.1 r. Binder—Was.
Mr. brotme Sumner—not •
. Mr P.,Carow—oot

PikA trav:Aciit.
ihMT.Sr
Cord FI. Pdttr-tvhs
14,111 15.11rowne--was.
Adil.Ctrairsio—wale
JoddrolA—not-
Mr. H ANltteriour.aorit
IVIr. Leak Fotter—oot
Lord A.

, '.

`TY'

ea td4blne tomiGatitfellien Office.
'• ifiltad4itli.
'lkrly for Scottand and Ireland, and thofe were,
"sot korrams,
Lord A. Hammon '• Mr. Rutherford
1- "CI IllatiliD' .
Mr. Grattan • Mr. Leine Ma. ,
. I He then' moved, that a Committee be appointed to
dontider what, rekelatiorts red check* mar be Oa-
-blifited-tfs eontroul•the public Expenditure in Great
!b Britain and Ireland ; and) ivhethev any further im
provements may be made therein, by retrenchments
and other means;• & ..
.: Lord HENR.Y.PETTV raid, that it had been int-
potlitile'fortirfiliot td atilt-tire the fingtilar Candour
and mOderation'orthe Rht'flons Gentleman, who,
!in moving for a Cithinittee.rfrthistiattire, bad (hewn
A charitable dirpofitiln to five-them lime labour and
tvritinle in'the•eitfcbtron'of their deity, by a grofitind
pattial tlatement of matters that might come before
' therm (loud crier of bear! hear!) When te faid " was
and partial," he did not mean to far that the date:
stunt was intended-to be-fo, but that it proceeded
from. iliias'• towards' a ‘particulai ladFty,-of'whieh,,
I however. the Right Hors. Gentleman ought to haFew
1 'teen fuffizirntly aware, not to have prejndged matters
which might occupy, the attention of the vet y Conv
mittte foe the 'ittpoidttriesnt of tvhichlte *al Crinifiig.
'I hes:. Right liPtil Cetitreitian, sand thlofe with whom
he acted, had the other day deprecated a decifion upon
A charge,for Want of a finele document, though a full
notice bad been given, and yet he was not afhamed to
call for an opinion upon charges, reTpedilig 'which All
the dOconfzitts'We're wanting, and of isitlch' no notice
had been given t lindthiat'aboirt cafes whieli'mott de-
pend open rpecial circunittances, and where even the
dates might be, of importance ! Under all thofe d,ifacl-1
Vantages however,an.d without any notice tillnow that.
any'charges were tnliebrotight againft him', he would
as far as hi ,recolle.fti.rn enabled him, refute thtcharges.
One cif them was'the appointment of a Comptroller
and Colletor for. Bee nosAyres. It might be tuppoicd
that this revert-tan as he called it, would have been,im-
mediately on its appointment a burthen to the pil,lic.
' It. was thetifote a graft want' of cini:lour ih the Right
Honourable Gentleman brit ttilshve` itatetts,Tulte 'fie
brought the affair forward at thictitne, that thelottr.
den would only cotnraettceip c,onfequence of the pof-
feffiln of the place, and that, the appointment was
without falary. • The want of Tuch officer hid' been
feverely felt' when the place was firft taken; and' this
Was .the 'reafon that they were appointed • to, as .in
cafe it'lhcrold be retaken. Then the Right Hot.
Gentleman adverted Va.the Surveyors of Taxes, .but
acknawiedged that the fuggeßitnihad come frain the
Board of Taxes..l3ut liC Zeliev'iid that the fa!lwai,
char 'ihC'p'pointments had 'cot adually taken plate on.
ail the3lrdatteefhould be fubmitted to Parliament.—
Some notices might have been given,hut he had heard
that feveral recommendations had been received, to
which the anfweis had 'been that ItO fappointtnent
could take place till the ineafure wax finally adopted.
Thfs was 'the hate of the cart as far as his memory
ferved him at prefent. With regard to the ap-
pointment of Gazette writer in Scotland, it was
one that ought to be excepted out of the general
'ride. 'lt was a cafe that peculiarly depended' tin its
°yin circomllanCes, and when thefe were examined
it mull appear obvious to every candid and liberal
;mind; that no blame could attach to that inflance.—
This appointment had been conferred on a perfon
eminent for talents, literature, and fcience. He had
through a ling courfe of life devoted liimfelf to the
public fer vice, and 'to the promotion of the intereas
lof learning and knowledge. Mr. D. Stewart was one
of the molt dilliuguithed characters of the age, and
I had pea. rated his important duties in the moll
I zealous and honourable manner. Yet his falary
did not amount to much more than :col. a year.—
It was thought right, confidering the high impor.
tance of his favices is the departments 6f fcience
and literature, to grant him this appointment, which
be might enjoy without any encroachment on his
other avocations. It was not on fuch men that the
public money was in danger of being wafted. The
appointment was certainly, as the Right Honourable
Gentleman had Dated, taken out of the hands of the
editors of the newfpapers, where no doubt he would
leave continued it in preference. That was the fort
of literature which they cnl'ivated. (Hear, hear !)
—That was their fcience ! The Gentleman who re
ceived it from the late Miniilers had no claim what-
ever upon them, except that of uncommon merit in
a department ale lag importance to the public and
the human race. When the prefent Government
could find fuch attnther man, he certainly would not
objet' to their •being equally liberal. 'tae Right
Honourable Gentletnan had talked of a penfion to a
civil and criminal Judge in Scotland. With the eir-
cumflances of that cafe, he was not acquainted, and
therefore could fay nothing refpeeting they at pre-
fent. He had replied to fuclrof the charges as he was
more immediately acquainted with. No Government
could, perhaps, in the prefent Date of the expenditure,
guaid againd every poffible abufe, and there'. re he
was a friend to all Committees of Inquiry, whether
appointed like the Commitlianers of Military Inquiry,
or corn poled of Members of this'Houfe. Both mightibe
eminently ufefol, and recourfe ought to be had to them
1 front time totirne,under every Govcrnmentfor in loch
a large expemlititre all Governments mull be liable to
f abufes. Ile would now fay a few words as to the form•
1 ation of this Committee. The Right Hon. Gentleman
ihad anticipated his with, in having the Committee
appointed openly, and in excluding all perfons in
offices under Government. He had alfo anticipated
1 k as to the Hon. Baronet againit whom a charge
I now depended. This led him to ads'ert to the Gen-
j flenteri who had been Members of the frirmer Cana-
l*Avec, and had done their ditty in the molt zealous
1 and honourable manner. . Why were fo many of
1 thefe excluded ? The Right Hon. Gentleman had
maintained that the dilrolution was not in any degiee
intended for the purpofe•of puttintan eiidtri the C: m_ 1
nsittee of Finance. If that was the cafe, Why (horrid
not the former Members he appointed acfar al that
could potfibly he done? Why not leave the Committee.
as much as potlible in the fame Rate as bernre. Aker
naming all the MeMbers of the fOritter Contlhittsee
who. Were in the prelim Parliadient'oiith'tifi viten-,
tinnof thea:tvrts already' mentintted.' he' stioult Rill
have had eighty) limply, and this might Curdy hav,e'
,fatisfied him.. He,mult _Appeal to the .fenfe of the
'Honfe, whether fame of thofe d'ho were firma hid
not merited confidence, by the diligence and• fidelity
with *filch titer had done :their duty. Hr cnn'dud.
ed hp rerding.the statues of the foll..wiole pelloati
who, tie raid, ought all to have been in the lid:—

-.7,

• -a •,••

---7. lipillirr7l7"•.—r:::
. 4 , • .
• ' ' .
Mr. H. Thoristoa . . Mt.:Lambe
Mr. Bank, ' ,; . ~
Mr, Whitbread
lord Mahon . . Mr. Broaden
Mr,Diddulph Mr. Calvert ti
Lord Archibald Hantilven Mr. Welters
Mr. Cavandifh Mi. Shaw. . 1
' He propofed that the Right Honourable :Gentle-
man fhould in the fir* place propofe the names re-
trained of thofe who held been in the former Com-
rilittee, to which there would be no objet ion, and the
reft afterwards.
' Mr. BOYLE, Snlicitor, , General tor Scotland,-
thoughethe Right Honourable Gentleman (Mr. Per-
ceval) had ailed more candidly in particularizing the
different inflamer- in which he alledged that the late
Minifters had dime amiss, than if he had in general'
accufed them of improper exereire of their power.—
Had he done otherwie, the Noble Lod opptifite•
'would have •faid .4 Use rile inftances of what you
.chargt againft me r, The Right Hon. Gentleman
I did fn, and now the Noble Lord laid, he called upon
' him, without preparatinn, to anfwer a-number Olfpe-
''Cific charges. As to the firft intlance, namely, the,
,sappnintment of Collators, Comptrollers, &c. fir pa-
tine Ayres, he left it with thegood fettle of the Houle,
if this was a judicious and propel exercife of power.
Did they properly difcharge their duty in appointing
Men to of which did nut exift 3 This was.indeed
a new fpecies of tevertions. 'The fecund itiftance was
one which impoled a grievous hardthip and burden
on. the country; for' whatever might be the ntetits
of the 'perfon on whom it *.was bellowed. it was..
no other than the creation, of7et new place,. that
'too • a finecute—the pure* .4 all finecores—as be,
!hewed by a ftatement of the duties of. the Cflice
from its otiginal apraintment in the -year •5793.
when it 'Was bel6lved or, the prnprietors of the Mer-
cury. Courant, and Herald, of lidiuhurgh, they being ,
intitled to nothing,but the profits of the paper. Here, '
however, the grant we.. made to Dr. S:ewart, his
heirs and alliances, for the period of 2 t years, with
a Miry or 3001. per annum. The appointment. of
new Sheriffs, much as lit rerpeited the Gentlemen
who•haid bun uninitiated to, thole newly ellablithed
ofiice', he regarded as a thing moll unnecefrary, and,
' therefore,•as a very improper wafte cf public money.
He-watperfeElly (visaed that thole Genilemerl who
formerly held the joint charges, 'did ample juilice to
the duties of both. . .: •!:, . 4.1 . ~
Mr. BIDDIJLPH fait!, . he erad.not be foppofed
to haVe any pat ticularpredilatiotsfor the Gentlemen
a ha formed the fall 'Cotannitter,:frir .though he had
made the motion, in conliquefice oftilltich the Corn-
mittee had been appointed; (hey had hokbeen named
by him. He conking-art, however, that the fpirikof
' candour,' of jollice. of inquiry, 'and of :impartiality,
by which they had heen:aftuated, had not,. and could
not bi exceeded: It ...villa, have been impoffible fin-
any perfon unacmfainted with the- Gentlemen who
compelled it, and who only judged from their conduct
there, to have difcnvered the rolitical creed of any ohe
of them. The only aft they had done was that of
infiruCting their Chairman to move for leave to bring
in a Bill to prevent the granting of Offices in Beyer-
fion. It might have been fuppofe'd they migl:rt.have
done more, bin a great.part of their time had hen
occupied in fending about and making inquiries. The
Right Honourable Gentleman (hlr.Perceval)feemed
to think that the Committee haft appoirzed was for
iavelligating the accounts of one let of-men, apd that
to be appointed by him for invelligating the accunts
of another let of men. In aching to, he foray did
1 himfelf effenttal injury. It he wilhed the ails of any ,
future Committee to be esteemed ails of fainters, im-
partiality and jullire, for O.,D'S like let them gn
forth as the nets of the Committee originally appoint-
ed. This could alone fatisfy the public. The names
propofed by the Right Honourable Gentleman were
no doubt, u rerceptionaLle in theznfelves. At a proper
time he fhould take an opportunity of propcfing the
name of a per fon known to eneertain the keenelt fenfe
of public wrongr, and who was particularly zealous
in his defire to alleviate the burdens of the people.
Mr. BRAND conceived, that the Houle was call-1
ed on to appoint fuch a Committee as would fatisfy I
the anxious wifhes of an expelling and oppreffed peo-
ple.
He might be prefomed to think well of thole ;
men who computed his NI tjelly's late government, of '
whole conduit he had hitherto approved, and to many
of whom lie was bound in the firmcft ties of regard ;
but if the accufations againft them fhould.be true, he
would be one of the first to fuppor any inquiry, in.
veftigation and accufatiln againli them. When he
looked, however, on the Treafury Bench, and raw
that there were pot two on it who had not penfions,
reverlkons, expeitancies for themfelies and their fa.
milks and friends, he ivifhed to fee a general and
fair inquiry. This he afkcd in the name of his con.
flituents and of an exceiting people. He vithed that
a fair, or rather an ecrufing Committee, fhould be
appointed.. If thofe with whom he had hitherto ailed
thould ditto' from him in this, he fhould think it high
time for hini to leave them. When, hOwever, he
law perfons anxious fir inquiry, (lit-miffed from the
Committee, and when be law the prefentGovernment,
thought in poffeffion of 8 vacancies in the Committee,
which it vows in their power to RI lip as they pleafed,
not fatisfied with doing fo, but anxious to procure a
majority of their own friends into the Committeethe
could not believ t it would continue, that eager,
zealous and ben i!1 Committee-which the country
required. He timid therefore fuggelt the propriety
of allowing the names in the former Critiimittee again
returned to Patti intent to continue in it, and to move
on tome after day for the appOintment of a Corn
mirtee to inquire into the othet charges now first ex-
hibited.
Mr.SECRETARY CANNING hid nn doubt the
firMourable Gentleman who (poke Taft, delivered the
genuine fentiments of his mind, in thinking well of
the Gentlemen with whom he was conoefted, and that
he would alto think that the fairest aytAnsnff ufeful
'Committee could be formed from among %he'll'. As
no part of the eonduft rf the gook, however, was
taw
t. .
wanting to thew that there are parties in it, he
i no danger in ailing insthe prefent cafe on thOrillree
. tical grounds, by which their cOnduci was itigineril
regulated. The public knew well, that apart, feel-
ing pereaded the public life and publid tbriduer of
'the Members orthis Houle. It would hi ridleultiut,
therefore, as welt as improper, to endeavour to titioe i
the public mind, by pretending, on an ocealion.likel
• the prefent, that all therr.ufual habits and feelings for.
foOk them: The beltway Was•to appoint perfons of dif-,'
ferent ways of Oinking, left, if all of one perty,.their
!.prejudices might lead diem, withont, tegerrl to the'
1 teak merits of a cafe, all to incline one way. It
• .

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