Star.
London, England, 1812-03-14 00:00:00

TO I'HE FREEHOLDERS OF TaCCOUNTY OF PERTH.

GENTLISILN, •
IBEG leave to return you my sincere and grateful
thanks for the many and flattering marks of friendship I have
received durit.g my canvass of the Coitnty, and, as the Sheriff
has fixed the day of Election for Thursday the l9th instant, I
have earnestly to solicit the honour of your support and early
attendance on that day at Perth, whith will canter on me an
additional and lasing obbtation.
I have t'.e honour to be, Gentlemen,
Your most obedient and humble servant,
Strathallan, March 5, ItSl2. JAMES DRUMMOND.

LLOYD'S, MARCH 13, 1812.
AT a GENERAL MEETING of the SUB-
SCRIBERS for the Relief of the Widdws and Families of
the Officers and Men lately lost on board his Majesty's Ships
S GEORGII, of 08 guns,
HERO, of T4guiler---
DEFENCE, of 74 guns,
SALDANHA, of 36 guns, •
held in conformity with the Resolution of the General Commit-
tee, and of Public Notice, to take Into consideration the pro-
priety of allowing the Widows and Families of the Officers and
Men belonging to his Majesty's late gun-brig FANCY, of 12
guns and 50 men, to participate in the Subscription now raising.
'the Right Hon. Admiral Lord GAMBIER in the Chair.
Resolved unanimously, That this Subscription should be ex-
tended to the relief of the Widows and Families of the Officers
and Men belonghig to his Majesty's late gun-brig FANCY, of
12 guns and 50 men, that vessel having belonged to e.r same
Fleet, and lost nearly a; the same time.
Subscriptions advertised £4168 174. 10d. independent of a
Subsuiption of Two Days Pay from 46 of his Majesty's Ships
had Vessels already advertised.
J. B. Monck, I.sq. of T. Bothatn, Esq. Salt Hill 3 3
Reading £2O 0 John Corderoy - 5 0
Lord Somerville 10 10 Mrs. Vansittart S 0
hen Ord, Esq: 5 5 Miss Vaughan. S 0
.Cisolp Sandford, Esq. 10 0 The Right Hon. N. Van-
Edward Milward, Esq. sit tart • - 5 Q
Hastings 10 10 Sir Thus. Maynard Hem-
Duke of Somerset 10 10 bridge, Bart. .
Danhy, Esq. 10 0 Sir Robt. Presten, Bart.
The Hon. H. Watson 10 0 (second Subscription) 10 10
Den. Edw. Paget- 5 0 Robert Stevenson, Esq. 10 10
Cat Edward Paget 5 0 Further Subscriptions at
1.. 1 0 Oxford, per Sla.Sau.
Two Sisters at Bristol 5 0 marez -• 12 15
James Steers, Esq. - 5 5 William Price, Esq. 5 5
Mrs. Mary Barad 10 10 Peter Fetter, Esq. Dover 10 0
John Woolett, Esq. Rye 10 10 John Mink Feetor; Esq.
J. G. 5 0 ditto - - S 0
Capt. A. Sproule, R. N. 5 51 Thomas Wbod, Seq. 25 0
The Proprietors of the Star 5 5 I George Ward, Esq. 10 10
Yeats, Brown, and Scott 1 5 Stein, Smith, and Co. 10 10
John Francilin, Esq. 5 5 The Officers and Men of
Mr.Kite,Admiraityoffice 5 0 his Majesty's ship Par-
Praeds,Mackvrorth&Co.lo 10 tridge, two Day's Pay
Subscription at the Royal Lord kardley, (second •
Hospital, North Yar- Subscription) 10 10
mouth - - 10 10 George Bragge Preerse,
Scott Burn, and Co. 10 Esq. 10 10
Rear-Admiral Foley 10 10 Adnural Thornborough 10 10
lhos.Paimer,Esq.Chearnlo 10 Capt. Hawker, R. N. 5 0
Capt. Cumming 2 2
Subscripdons received by the 1
all the Bankcra in London and V
T HO M,
No S, George-yard, Lombard

5 5

IlVfasters of this House, and by
Westminster.
AS FERGUSON, Secretary.

TIMBI R.
TO BE SOLD paranantsto a Decree of the High Court of
Chancery, bearing date the 6th day of . February, 1812, made
.in a Cause, whereiu the Rev. Charles Richard Beaumont and
others, are Plaintiffs; and John Beaumont and others are De-
f.:whims
A LARGE quintity of TIMBER standing at or
near Whitley Hall, in the Parish of Rirkheaton and pares
adjacent, in the County of York, and Mytton Hall, in the Town-
ship of Little Mytton, and Parish of Whalley, iii the County
Palantine of Lancaster, late the property of Richard Henry
Beaumot.t, Esq. deceased. Such part of the Timber as lies in
the County of York will be Sold with the approbation of Samuel.
Courron Cos, Esq. one of the Masters of the said Court, at
the Beaumont Arm% near the Church of Kirkheaton aforesaid,
on Monday, the Seth day" of March, 1812, the Sale beginning at
Twelve o'Clock; and 'itch part thereof as him in the County of
Lancaster, win be Sold with the approbation of the said Master,
at the sign of the Boat, at Little Mytton aforesaid, on Friday,
the 3d day of April, 1812, the Sale beginnh'g at 12 o'Clock.
Particulars of the said Timber may be had, gratis, at •the said
Master's Chambers, in Southampton-buildings,. Chancery..lama
Loudon ; of MOST.. Horne and Rogers, Solicizori, Serle.strent,
Lincoln's Inn • of Mr. Eyre, Solicitor, Gray's Inn-square; of
Mr. Van Hsyehuyson, Solicitor, John-street, Bedford-row of
Mr. Richard Addinell, of Tadcaster; of Mr. John NerUis of
Spotsbrough, near Doncaster; of Mr. James Hinchliffe, Bradley-
lane, near Hudderseelii ; of Mr. Thomas Rylils, of Dewsbury,
near Leeds ; at the Beaumont Arms, Khidieaton; at the Baal;
Myttos Bridge ; at the Whalley Arm., In Whalley; et the SWOP
tplitaszue and at Whitley Hall, nest HaddetsliaL

Admeasures - 180, 88-94 Tons. -
The very desirable, and well known. Ship, was built of the
Mt materiab, at Emsworth, purposely for the Packet Service, in
whist employ she continued until captured by the enemy. She
coppered and copper-fastened, with a Figure Head, pierced for
18 guns, has ten 18-pound carronades, abd two long 6-pounders
mounted, with a large hold, excellent accommodations, and is
well calculated fur a Packet or Transport, Letter of Marque, or
fur the West India, Mediterranean, or any other trade requiring
burthen and dispatch.
Also, the following Goods, landed out of the said Ship;
3 Trunks containing Calico, Cotton, and Nankeen.
4 Cases Cotton, Irish Linen and Platillas
3 Ditto Primes, II Ditto Checks
4 Ditto Irish Linen, Silesia' Sheeting, Towellbsg,
Diaper, and Thread.
2 Ditto Assorted Slops, 16 Pieces Packing Canvas
2 Bales Baize and Flannel, 4 Cases, 1 Trunk Shoes
2 Cases Stationery, 1 Trunk Perfumery
8 Cases Assorted Nails, 4 Cases Shot
1 Case Cutlasses, re Sbevels
2 Casks, 1 Bag, Handcuff. and Shackles
3 Long Iron Chairs, 3 Rolls Lead
3 Casks Nails, 'roots' 'Tinware and Ironmongery
10 Iron Half-hundred Weights, 1 Quarter ditto
2 Cases of Agricultural Instruments
2 Medicine Chests, 1 large Beam and Scales
8 Cases Pickles, Sauces, Oil, &c.
4 Cases Ratafia, 6 Kegs Tongues
330 Bars Iron, S bonds. Iron Hoops; I Cask, 1 Case Fishing Lines
1 Cask, 2 Jars Paint ; 1 Cue Twine, 2 Cates Glass
93 Iron Pots, 43 Woo Bowls; 8 Casks Flour, 3 Kegs Lard
16 Casks Provision. 2 do. Herrings; 6 do. Rum, 4 Casks Rice
16 Jars Greta, Peas, &e. ; 8 Half Hhds. American Tobacco
114 Iron-bbund Rum and Water Puncheons, and a quantity of
loose Staves.
6 half-Barreb, 4 Quarter-Barrels Powder, one Cask-Ball-Car-
tridges, and a quantity of Muskets, Cutlasses, and Other
Warlike Stores, &c.
After which will be Sold, the handsome fast-sailing &hamar
GENERAL I'ALAFOX, about 150 tons measurement. She
is a well-built serviceable vessel, coppered and copper fastened,
figure head, sails remarkably fast, pierced for 14 guns, has good
accommodations, will stow a large cargo, and is deserving the
attention. of persons in want of such a Schooner.
And then the following Goods, landed out of the said vessel:
SO Puncheons Rice 9 large Iron Hatch Bars, and 4
7 Ditto Rum Iron Rods tor Bolts
29 Hhds. 2 small Casks Ame- A quantity of empty Casks and
rictus Tobacco iron Hoops
13 Bartels salted Herrings One Bale of Coarse Blue Cot-
t* Deals, from 18 to 19 R. long ton, and all her Powder and
.1 large spare Iron Caboose Warlike Stores

and

The above Vessels were captuvred near the Coast of Africa, by
his Majesty's ship Amelia, tila Hon. Frederick Paul Irby, Cap-
tain, and with their Cargoes are condemned u Prises.
For Catalogues, Inventories or further Particulars, apply to
the said Commissioner, George Street, Plymouth.

Ot."Aivritskrvelaa-ive.aaLinitibliffektkinOts =••
'At the London Tavern, Foxhole-street, Plymouth, on RA,
the 20th instant, at Twelve,
.THE beautiful fist-sailing Schooner MATCH-
LESS, about 190 Tons measurement.—This most their-
able schooner is New-York built, copper-bottomed and fastened,
and nearly new ; sails remarkably fast, and stows a good cargo ;
she Is in excellent condition, well found in stores, and might be
sent to sea immediately; captured on. her voya;,ofrom New York
to Bourdeaux.
Also, the Part of her CARGO under mentioned, viz.
152 Boxes White Sugar 18 Bales New Orleans Cotton
et Tierces/
Coffee. Wool.
'66 Bags Barrels Provisions. •
163 Elephants Teeth. 10 Dell linos.
6 Boxes Indigo. About st Tens Logwood.
Afterwards, thy, handsome copper-bottomed schooner YOUNG
CAROLINE; about 140 Tons measurement.—This is a very
fast-sailing vessel, with good capacity for stowage, copper fastened,
pierced, for 16 guns, well found in stores, and might soon be got
ready fur sea, at a trifling expence ; captured on her voyage from
Bourdeaux to New Orleans.
And then her CARGO, consisting of
129 Hhds. superior Claret, (Medoc de Mont Ferrand,) four iron
hoops each.
14 Casks Vin de Grave, (about 40 gallons each).
105 Cases choice old Claret, (Medea de St. Julian, 1802,) one
dozen each.
94 Baskets Olive Oil ditto.
170 Cases Eiu de Cologne, (6 bottles each.)
' 72 Bags Claret Corks-12 Boxes Prunes.
1 Case Aniseed Cordial. •
19 Cases and Trunks, containing Silks, Sattins, Cambric, and
Cambric Handkerchiefs; Lawns, Silk Fringe, knd Jewellery; Silk
and Sattin Ribbon; Chenille, Silk Handkerchiefs, and Shawls •
Crapes,Silk Umbrellas, and Parasols; elegant Lace Veils, Silk
Robes, and Pelisses; Silk and Kid Gloves, Artificial Flowers,
pomatumv, Essences, and Perfumery; Snuff Boxes, Buttons,
Razors, and a variety of other articles.
And One valuable Musical Time-piece, (by Bourdier, Paris)
plays 26 Opera Airs and Waltzes; in an elegant Mahogany Case,
with' Ladles' Secretary and Book-case.
Both the above Cargoes are perfectly dry, and in excellent
order and condition.
After which will be Sold the French Transport Galliott LE
NIULET, about 165 Tons measurement. She is a remarkably
strong vessel, will barthen about 250 Tons, peculiarly adapted
to the timber trade, and having been purposely fitted for that ser-
vice is well worth the attention of Merchants in want of a vessel
for that employ.
Afiso, a quantity of strait French Oak skied Timber, and Oak
and Elm Plank of large dimensions and superior quail tit, intended
for the French Arsenal at Rochefort, and landed out of the said
galliot.
And then the strong New York built Ship LOUISIANA.
Length - - 75 ft. 4 in. f Depth - - 11 ft. Ib.
Breadth - - 23 5 I Admeasures 167.78-98 Toaa.
She is a very handsome hale ship, sails remarkably fast, has a
Figurehead, temporary, between Decks 6 feet 1 # inch high, and
excellent accommodations. She is equally calculated for a packet
or for a running ship, Is well adapted tor. the Newfoundland or
Mediterranean trade, and her Stores, being in goad condition,
she might be sent to Sea at a small expence.

After Wards the Good Brig. FORTUNA,
I Length 77 ft. 7t in. Depili 11 ft. el In.
Bram; h 21 ft. 8 in. Admeasures 15079-94 tons.
This P. a strong Oak-balk Brig. shoat 900 tons hurdles, well
found, and in good repair; has a brie hold. of easy draught of
water, Is well caladated tot. the camber trade, and might ba sent
to Sea itainediately.
AU the before-mentioned Vessels and Cargoes were captured
by Ms Majesty's ship %drama, Charles Richardson, Esq. Cap-
tain, and soademotd as prize to the said.frigate.--Om concern.

And the then following GOODS, viz.
41 Hogsheads prime American Tobacco (York andlamesalver)
1 Pipe high devoured Sourdeaux Brandy! , _
lOU Bales Juniper Berrie--111,000 11111016 Wily Ills
2 Hogsheads Red Ocre.—And for
About 16,000 Wine Hogsheads Staveß=Ving. •
All regularly condemned as P
Por Samples, Inventories, Catalogue!, or fallerpedaloes
sppiy to .0-Thomas Cole, Coorge-street, Pliplllollllla • "I
• Piremillt, February 97, 111114

" G. P. ft.
" The Prince Regent, in the name and on behalf of his
Ong, thinks proper to inform th • House of Commons, that the
mammas which be has been able to give to the Portuguese Co.
cerement, his Allies, has famished the means of improvieg the
military establishment of that country, sod of rendering conapls
cuous the valour and discipline of its armies, in the sitenvenvi de•
Usenet.* from, and defence otPoetegai against the many. The
Prime; therefore, trusts, that he will be enabled to give the same
assistance iu the present year, as to the last—from wbk such
important consequences to the muse ofthe Allies have ranked."

The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER thee sesoval,
that the Message should be rotated to a Committee of Siqn,
so Monday aext.

STROUD POOR BILL.
Upon the Order of the Day tar the third rowan et the Stroud
Peer le Joan rd. •
dr S. ILONIILLY stated, that be wished to impose some
Amendments. By the present practice warms plias had bees
adopted to alter the law as to employing the Poor. This practice,
he thought, should not be suffered, as the law on that sobjsit
should be uniform, and should not vary la differmit prishes.o—
But the practice had been carried to a snot length by didierent
Parochial Sills. la some places the punishments were severe, sod
in teen gentle, muck depending in these cases ups the hidirie.
dual who Drought in the Bill. But the law ought to he uniform
and extraordinary powers should pet be codined sidle he the
case of this er of any ether pond'. Perhaps k might be a unifid
regulation to make a Standing Order, eye so Parochiel Jill
should pass, till it had been submitted to a Coomalttee of the
whole House. The parish pobr, though nomleaßy protected,
were really out of the wekcdon of the law. There were at •
present no less than .brae Bills before the Haute Le altstrieg
the mode of treating the poor io different paddies. is the ra-
gout Bill he had an objection to the clause, by which dal cruse
tees were empowered to bind out childrvO et the age et fosin•
teen•years, or sooner if they thought fit. By this a pewsr was
given to bind out at the age et two years, lithe trollies that&
proper. He also had an °Weeds° to the clause gfv the power
of binding out cbiklriso in bectlasd, as well as in Ingtemi mad
Wales. The nett provision which was a ammo. ewe MAIM
of that description, enabled the trestles to Mt wit the Peer for
worts of Weeny. This was, however, a greet Mimeadmi ea
the law as lt existed, and it proper to the pretest case, amen
be so in every similar one. He should move to resit that dim
also.

The SPEAKER stated the regular coune.to be, to bat lb
Bill :tad, and Men to move the Ameudmeats.
Mr. D. GIDDY agreed with the receding speaker IP ladle
necessity of uniformity iu these Parochial $Us, but thought true.
tees should be armed with considerable powers to prevent the
impositions that would be attempted to be practised on them....
'Them of the Poor Laws required great sad general d•
A discussion ensued on the subject, In which Sir E. Kee,
& Re • -

mtg.
mutt, Mr. Tuois puss, bir Mr. asear, Mr.
BULLER, and Mr. G. VAIIIIIITTAILT took pot. •
When Sir S. ROMILLY moved, that indeed et " the age of
fourteen years," those words, " the age of MO years &bawd be
substituted.
Mr. D. GIDDY said he should move, that Instead of fourtassi
years, eight shusdd be substituted.
The House divided upon Sir S. RowiLtv's Amendment, wiles
the {umbers wen}—For the Amendmeat 37—Assiut it
so—
Majority S. After Which, Mr. Ginov's Motion was castled
without a 4iThioa.
MILITARY FLOGGING.
On NO Order of the Day for the third reading of
the Mutiny Bill, being read.
Sir FRANCIS BURDETT'
following effect I rise, r
ing..a duty towards the arm,
towards the people of Engl..
I rise in order to make another
abolition of that most odious

Talent in our army, or,
punishment, an improper phrase,
of the practice, as if tfiey
quired to be disguised, when .
been proposed to be substituted
ral punishment. It is not
that punishment should be.
army, or even tnat it should
topunishmentforcivil transgresciont.
both that punishment is necessary,
must be always made for promptiti
tion ; .but I never can be
that there may be found between
Lion of death, which has been
alternative, and Hogging, sol
efficient, and not so entirel)
character of a soldier, the •
tier, witli
ittrcharacter of . nation,
• a Mgt 046.18 gar bmii imputed.—

^.

. '

I

• _We_

ETT rose, and spoke to the
not merely for perform:
my, but to perform a duty
;land, including that army'.
Mother effort towards the
ms custom of flogging pre.
as it is called, corporal
ihrase, used by the abetton
were conscious that it ft-
ten in fact that which hal
tuted fur it is itself a corpe-
by any means my Trish
altogether abolished in tb
ibe completely assimilate
gresciont. lam fully aVral4
xessary, and that prow; •
promptitude in its execu.
re ()fought to believe but
)etween the extreme ingid.
een represented as the °Wr
some punishment equall,y
irely inconsistent with the
e very essence of which is
maws of the nation, to
as new bon imputed..

I am-.,satisfied but 'the greater nufnber of those
who now' hear me have not formed any adequate
....
eo,lceriton of what the punishment of flogging is.—
It is A punishment, the severity of which, both in
the minds of tf.o more humane of our own people,
ansin those of the inhabitants of other parts of Eu-
,.,, FP , disgraces.this country. It ie it punishment, the
ilea
sing nature of which disqualifies those who have
ne it for fulfilling the duties of citizens.-
- Heretofore, indeed, but a few individual(weresub-
, *lie it, even thee the voice of humanity should
have been raised to ?moue its abolition ; but if its
abolition were then expedient, its existence most as-
_ suredly now -cannot be considered as admissible,
. when, if it be suffered to remain, the •whole popula-
tion of England is exposed to it. h is of consequence
to keep this circumstance in our minds in the nurse
of the present discussion, as well as the fact before-
, referred to, that the pdnisliment entails legal disabi.
lilies, and for this fact we need seek no higher autho-
rity than Sir William Blackstone, who says, that the
circumstance of an individual having undergone the
punishment of flogging, would forma sufficient
pound of objection to his being placed on a jury ; it
as,. as it were, upon a level with felony. Before I
proceed any farther in recommending the removal of
this abomination, it may not be improper to observe,
that it would be difficult to ascertain how it found
entrance, how it crept in amongst us. I have reason
to think, indeed, that though it is not actually the
.produce of the present war, yet that it is in the course
• of the present war that the evil has attained its pre-
' .sent alarming magnitude ; and we may naturally ex.
pect, that, terrible as that is, it will go on incrtasing
—for when one degree of severity is adopted, and
not found to produce the effect expected from it, as
it appears that this has ant hitherto done, recourse is
most usually had to a further measure of it, and,
both in military anal civil life, it often reaches
that point from which humanity recoils with disgust
• and horror, before an admission of its inefficacy can
be extorted. I have no doubt, that most individuals
in the country feel some aversion to the practice 1
have reprobated. I have no doubt that many cherish
towards it the same detestation that I do myself ; and
the very circumstance of its being calculated to rouse
every better feeling of our nature against it, as it
seems to make the discussion of it unnecessary, so it
certainly renders it somewhat difficult, for we know
not well how to go about seeking for reasons against
a practice, the bare mention of which, we think,
ought to suffice to convey to every heart a full and
• adequate notion of the disgrace and cruelty which it
involves; nor is there any thing better adapted to
quiet-the emotion that gives birth to sentiments so
just, than to enter into a cold calculation as to the
' quantum of the evil, or the incentives requir-
ed to retain it. I have observed that the art of
. preserving discipline in our army by flogging is not
• of ancient date, and in fact we find old Statutes re-
• gulating the penalties for, military offences, from
which it appears, that. there was a period when sol
-
• diets were tried, like persons in a civil capacity, be.
fore a-judge and jury. By an Act of the 18th of
Henry V I. it was made felony for a soldier to take
! pumey for serving in foreign wars ; and.for this of-.
fence the offender was to be tried in the usual way,
that is, by a jury. By other Statutes, of Henry VII.
and Edward VI. other punishments,asuch as fine
and short imprisonment, were awarded for absence
. - from duty, or, as we should now say, from drill, and
-' other minor crimes. By a statute of Edward VI.
.' desertion. was made a capital offence, but in this case
• also thetrial was to be by jury. There are other statutes
of the last-mentioned Monarch, and of Philip and
Mary, in which no distinction in this particular is
made between the military and the other departments
of the State ;, and in the reign of Henry VIJI. it was
madelelony, still punishable by the civil law, for a sol.
dier to take money and depart the kingdom. If we
descend from those early times to the period of the
great and glorious victories of the Duke of M.rrlbo-
rough, we shall cot find that the se victories can be
in any degree imputed to the lash. Nay, I have con-
versed with. many military officers of long standing,
• who have assured me that they could remember but a
very few ir.s:ancei of punishment in the course of their
service previous to the present war.. I have been in-
, tbrmed by one officer in particular, that he remem-
bered but a single instance, -and then the individual
.was turned out of the army. I remember myself, when
a boy, hearing it said, that such a one was a black-
guard, who had been turned out of such or such a
regiment, and if such really was the practice, and
that we never hear of it now, we must infer not that
:crimes worthy of ' expulsion have decreased as 'the
number of our troops have multiplied, but that the
lash is now considered as the only instrument by'
which discipline can be preserved. But what is the 1
round for the necessity, if such necessity does sub-
sist, of this practice ? It is nothing more nor less than
this—you do not render the condition of a soldier in-1
Viting ; his emoluments are scanty, and therefore the
fear of the lash, and not dread'of expulsion or the call
of honour, must be his incentive to the performance
of his duty. You do not find it necessary to flog offi-
cers, they have other incitements, and if you hold forth
-more of reward and less of punishment to the brave
men placed under their command, you will find that
the necessity is not greater in the oae instance than
in the other. An Honourable and Learned Gentle-
'man on the opposite side of the House (the Judge-
Advocate) declared on a late occasion, that in tne
space of more than two years there had been but
eight sentences passed by General Courts Martial
'laden in England, and out of these eight sentences
but one had been executed, and that by the choice of
the individual of whom it had been passed, and who
refused to commute it for foreign service. I really
am quite-at a loss to know what object the Judge-
'Advocate had to serve ky imparting such informa-
tion, Did he mean to spew thereby that the practice
*of flogging was on the decline? • Sir, it has never
been,a common thing for flogging to be inflicted by
virtue of the sentence of a General• Court Martial i
but will the Honourable and Learned Gentleman'
'enumerate the number of sentences passed by Regi.
'mental Courts Maria!, and executed too within the
period that has supplied him with a boast as to the
lenity of General Courts Martial ? If he will, I have
little doubt but that he will be compelled to make a
melancholy change of his units to so many thousands.
.1 think myself, inconsequence of the numerous con:
versations I have had with officers op the sub*el
- justified io mulish% that 'even that bddy of ihtilk,

though, from being aceustomed to the pectice of
flogging, they have been led to consider it as ne-
cessary, do yet unanimously agree that it is sadly
abused, and that if permitted, tl.' offences for which
it might be inflicted should be accurately specified.
4 is.the opinion of General Colburn, that it should
never be inflicted but for those offences which, carry,
jag with them a character of meanness and infamy,
would lead to a punishment of a similar nature in
civil life. We have now the opinions of many Offi-
,eers on record against this barbarous practice.—
Among these, it was first protested against by Major
James, in his work entitled " The Soldier's Compa-
nion," and protested against with eloquence and ter-
', your. He has been followed by Sir Robert Wilson,
General Stewart, and General Coiburn. All these
gallant Officers concur in thinking the punishment of
flogging infamous, and adapted to stigmatize the in-
dividual who suffers it. They say, that such an one
rarely holds up his head afterwards, and that. for one
whose habits are amended, numbers are rendered
more depraved and incorrigible. I have been assu-
red,
moreover, that there have been instances of per-
sons of acute feelings, who, having incurred by same
venial trespass a punishment abhorrent to those feel-
ings, had, after the lapse of years, when the moment of
their disgrace recurred to their memory, wept like chil-
dren. I put it to the House, whether it be proper to adopt
a treatment towards persons engaged in a profession,
the basis of which is honour, which is only fit for
managing the vilest and most incorrigible animals?
Is it proper to subdue that high.toned moral feeling
on which we must ultimately depend in the hour of
trial ? I would ask, whether the injustice of ill treat-
, ment be not a thousand fold enhanced by the good
conduct of our soldiers, who have so nobly upheld the
military renown of our forefathers, and are every day
reflecting new splendour on the country which they
protect ? Is it possible to reflect with patience on one
of these gallant men dying in consequence of the se-
verity of punishment, without any inquiry whatso-
ever being made as to the cause ? The Honourable
Gentlemen opposite have indeed done their best to
justify the continuance of the system, by the intro.
duction into the army of a multitude of persons from
the hulks ; and could it even be worth while to ob-
tain an augmentation of the numbers of our army to
the amount of two or three hundred persons by such
means ? But is it reasonable to thus infect the ranks
of our gallant army, and then inflict a punishment
which humanity shudders to repress—crimes which
bear no proportion to the efforts made to produce
them ? Muchlias been said with respect to the prac-
itice of flogging having been abolished in foreign ser-
vice; but we need not leave the limits -of our own
country, in order to find proofs for the little necessity
there subsists for it. An illustrious instance particu-
larly is to be found in the conduct of his Royal High-1
ness the Duke of Gloucester. His good sense and
humanity had taught him to think that flogging was
not necessary to form a soldier ; and having inspired
the officers of his regiment with sentiments similar to
his own, the consequence has been, that there has not
been a punishment in it for the last four years, But
this is not the only proof of the plenary success of
:he experiment, A battalion of his Royal Highness's
regiment is now serving in the Peninsula, and Lord
Wellington having been lately driven to the necessity,
of inflicting the punishment of death on some indivi-
dual of his army, when it was thought expedient tt
make every other regiment witness the executiog
this battalion was specially exempted, Lord Welling.
ton conceiving their general conduct to be such as
rendered their attendance unnecessary. The Honou-
rable Barofiet,maintained, that they must know very
tittle indeed of mankind, and of the feelings of the
army in particular, if they were not convinced of the
fact, that it was much easier to lead men than to
drive them. The esteem of the soldiery ought to be
'courted by all pcy able means; but that esteem was
not to be torced by rigorous treatment and harsh-pu-
nishment, as might be supposed by vulgar minds, it
was to be clitained by the Officers as well as the Go-
vernment sheaving a consideiation and affection for
the men. The principle of Caligula, however, seem-
ed ta he ailoptect— . _

• a Oderint duin mettent."
He bad again brought the degrading and odious
practice und:r the consideration of the House; in-
deed, he conceived that he should not have done, his
duty to his constituents and by his country, had he
not made a fresh attempt to remove so foul a stigma
from the co 1e of our military discipline. He should
beg leave to propose, that a clause be inserted in the
Mutiny Bill, to abolish the practice of corporal pu-
nishment, which clause should state the reasons for
adopting it, namely, eat the mode of punishment by
flogging rendered men infamous, incapacitated them
to perform certain civil functions, &c.—[Sir Francis
was proceeding, when the Speaker informed him that
the question then before the House was, tha►. the Bill
should be read a third time ; when that was disposed
of, the Honourable Baronet would have an opportu-
nity of regularly submitting his clause to the conside-
ration of the House.]—Sir Francis then gave notice
that he would move such a clause as he had described.

Mr. MANNERS SUTTON observed, that the
Honourable Baronet set out with professing, that
what he had to say would be rather an appeal to the
hearts than to the understandings of Members ; but
the whole of his speech had been rather an appeal to
the passions than to the understandings of men.—
Convinced he was, however, that there was nothing
at which our soldiers would more recoil with feelings
of indignation, than on being told that they were
placed in a state of degradation • that nothing could
ever wipe out the stains inflicted by the system of
discipline to which they were subject ; and that no
rewards were provided for military merit, or for the
comfort of veterans. *(Hear, !gar.) There were no
terms of any kind that would be too strong for ex-
pfessing their utter contradiction of any such state-
ment; and nothing was more calculated to call forth
the indignant feelings of the army, than many of the-
arguments introduced into the speech of the Honour-
able baronet. (Hear, hear.) The Hon. Gentleman
had asserted that no man after receiving the punish.
ment of flogging could ever again hold up his head
among bis comrades : but this assertion the Honour,
able Baronet would find on inquiry to be a grievons
misstatement. In various regiments there were many
men to be found who had received corporal chastise-
ment, and who yet had afterwards risen to be non.
commissioned officers. The Honourable baronet
had charged him (Mr. Sutton) with deluding the
House on a formg night,. by a statement which be

had made as to the number of times in which this
punishment was inflicted in the course of last year ;
but if the Honourable Baronet 'had thought proper
to be.present on the occasion, and had not taken Op
his opinion from mere hearsay, he'would have been
spared that assertion ; and the clause which he had
now introduced would theta have been better.disposed
of, as the House was. in a Commiuee on this very
Bill. But the Honourable Baronet, for reasons best
known to himself, did not think fit to be in his place
on that occasion ; and now, upon the third reading,
had'brought forward a clause, which, if adopted,
would introduce changes into a great variety of other
clauses, which respected the infliction of military pu-
nishments. What he (Mr. Sutton) had said in the
course of the discussion which took place in the Com-
mittee on the Bill, was shortly this :—After stating
the small number of cases in which corporal punish-
ment was inflicted, he had added, that he for one
felt it utterly impossible to abolish altogether the
practice of flogging. As far as the case would ad-
mit, the utmost deference had been shewn to the
feelings of many Gentlemen on this subject, by in-
troducing the discretionary opinion to courts-martial,
of confinement instead of corporal punishment. But
he had also stated, that the exercise of this option
was not in many cases practicable on foreign service,
where the means of confinement were not at hand.
—The Honourable Baronet had, however, grossly
exaggerated the. number of fl iggings which took
place at home ; and he (Mr. Sutton) still remained
of opinion, notwithstanding all his arguments, that,
till an adequate substitute could be obtained, the
discretionary power of inflicting corporal punishment
might be safely left with Courts-martial. The Ho-
nourable Ba'ronet had observed, that flogging might
now be reckoned necessary from the badness of some
men lately introduced into the army : but had he
been present at the discusion which took place on
that subject, he would have learned, that no such
bad men had been introduced, in fact. He had also
asserted, that a man in 'consequence of being flogged
incurred certain civil incapacities, and had referred
to Mr. Justice Blackstone, in support of this doctrine.
Now, he (Mr. Sutton) had never heard of any such
civil incapacity, and believed the doctrine, though
so much dwelt upon by the Hon. Baronet, to be to-
tally unfounded. Upon the whole, the clause, when
proposed, should have his decided negative.
Mr. ABERCROMBY said, that though an advo-
cate for free discussion in general, he thought if there
WAS any one subject to be approached with caution,
it was that now before the ljouse. In his opinion,
much was done by the clause of +est year towards
the abolition of flogging ; and perhaps, by gradually
giving a higher tone to the feelings of the army, the
practice might, at no distant period, be abolished
altogether.
Sir G. WARRENDER wished to set the Honour- I
able Baronet right as to one or two points in which I
he seemed to be in error. The Honourable Baronet
had asserted that military rewards were not conferred
upon our soldiers : but had lie forgot the fact, that '
atter the battles of Busaco and Albuera, Lord Wel-
' lington had desired every regiment engaged to send
in a list of its most meritorious serjeants, who were
promoted to commissions on the spot ! Even in
l'the small regiment of militia which he (Sir G. War-
Irender) had the honour to command, he knew three
instances of men who had been in the ranks, who after-
! wards obtained commissions in the line. The Hon.
'Baronet had talked of the practice in foreign armies ;
I but, besides the inestimable advantages of our system
1 of Courts-martial, it was the distinguishing charac-
teristic of the Brit sh army, that no officer could
raise his hand and strike a private, without being'
liable to be cashiered ; while it was generally known,
that in the French army the soldiers were beaten most
unrritt cifully by their officers.
Mr. CHARLES ADAMS' argued generally
against the clause, In allusion to what had fatten
the other night, from an Hon. and Learned Gentle-
man, (Mr. Broogham), he wished to say. that Mr.
Cobbett did not deserve the praise bestowed upon
him. He did not know what might have been the
military education of Mr. cobbett, but he was in•
dined to imagine, that, if tile discipline of the lash
bad been prevalent where hiliad served, that person
might have been afterwards saved from another spe-
ties of punishment. He did nct impute any bad mo-
tives to the Honourable Baronet in bringing for-
ward this motion, and it could not be a love of po-
pularity certainly, for he had already a large stock
of that material on his hands : whatever were his mo-
tives, he was convinced, however, that this discus-
sion must do mischief, because it tended to raise
hopes in the minds of the soldiers which could not
be realised.

General LOFTUS spoke briefly against the clause.
Captain BENNET agreed with the arguments,
and would support the motion of -the Hon. Baronet.
From the tone and manner assumed by the Right
Hon. Gentleman opposite (Mr. Manners Sutton), it
would. almost seem, that the question was not for the
destruction of an evil, but for the continuance of a
' blessing in the army. The system of punishment
against which the clause was levelled, was one which
was already abandoned in principle by many great
military characters ; and he should not, theretore,
take any abstract views of it. He did not either
conceive it necessary to trace this mode of punish.
went to its origin, although it might not be amiss to
! say, that it was first introduced here by King Wil-
liam amongst his Dutch troops : it was sufficient for
the House to know that it now existed in England
alone : that it was not practised in France, nor in the
military states of Germany ; and that so far from
corporal punishment being upheld in foreign armies,
an officer would be likely to tall a sacrifice to the in.
' dignation of the soldiery, if he dared to raise his hand
against a person in the ranks. He believed, contrary
. to what was said by other Gentlemen, that the dis-
cussions on this subject were productive of great good.
-.Was it not in consequence of them, that Courts-mar-
l. tial were now sworn—that the evidence before them
was obliged to be given on oath--and that the dis-
cretionary power of commuting punishment wa.s in
existence? He thought that this punishment degraded
'the soldier, and prevented the peasant from enlisting
. lit the army.
Lord PALMERSTON was glad to see that the
discussions on this subject had been productive, at
least, of one effect ; it was now, in fact, avowed oti
all sides of the House, with scarcely any exceptions,
that the abolition of the species of punishment under
consideration was rite impracticable. The lion.

LaonrdeoPual :meth -a:
Tinßdlitthant ham;
Hon.but
Gifenhtelem(
'Baronet had spoken in just terms of praise of the nib,
ton) knew any thing of that high character; 1
mcolrYvinocfedMthna‘‘t•le oat
beard nothing with more indignati •
on, than the H
nourable Baronet's comparison this night, of the sol.
diers of England to negro slaves—( Ikar 114,,,f
rook
Mr. Perceval). Nothing could have been
pngnant to his feelings, than to hear the Honourable.
Baronet describe the army, as the most degraded a
mut wretched of human beings. The whole of t
Hon. Baronet's speech was made up of a series
of
contradictions—every sentence, in fact, seemed to be
filled with propositions hostile to each other ; such,
for instance, as saying in one breath, that the coadi.
Lion of our alaip was most degraded—and in the
next, that this degraded army performed the met
glorious exploits. He did not think it fair to ark:
from analogy against this mode of punishment. ":
foreign armies, where corporal punishment was not 4
systecnotic, there existed what was still more de.
grading to men—a, system of wanton and capricious
ill-usage. The Honourable Baronet had said, that
in speaking on this subject, he, like the author whom
he quoted, would not trust himself to redo& That
was, in his opinion, a very good reason why the
House should not adopt his clause. He hoped the
House would never consent to the abolition of this
punishment, until an efficacious substitute should be
proposed for it. Again, the Honourable Baronet had
said, that all was done by punishment, and nothing
by reward, in our army. He begged leave to differ
from the Honourable Baronet totally on this point;
and, indeed, the Honourable Baronet had shewa
himself entirely misinformed upon it. After the bat.
tl.• of Busaco, for instance, he had to tell the Hon.
13arosiet, that ten Ensigns' Commissions were sent
out by the C )mmander-in-Chief to be at the d.srool
of Lori NVellington, for the reward of the Nonoom.
missioned Officers n ho had particularly distinguished
themselves. Was this doing every thing by moo.
ment, ani if e i ifluence of fear ? The Noble Lord
concluded his svech by arguing on the adequacy o
Chelsea Hospital to support those who had grown oil
in the service of their country.
Mr. W. SMITH could not give his vote mai*
the Honourable Baronet's clause without stating Iss
reasons for so doing. He maintained, that the eve.
to-be-lamented Mr. Windham was a great benefatar
to the army ; and he also thought that it was moo
indebted to the Honourable Baronet for bringingtho
discussion forward so often ; yet, at the same um,
he was compelled to acknowledge, that the mode in
which the Honourable Baronet treated the subject
this night met with his disapprobation. Hethottght
that a discussion of this nature should be conducted
in the calmest and most rational manner, and that
every means should be taken to avoid any thing that
might tend to inflame. Ho complained of the clause
being brought forward on the third dating title
Bill ; if it was now adopted it might make the whole
Bill ineffectual ; whereos it it had been int *toed ia
the Committee, precautions might hav: two takes
to prevent such an evil. He had no doubt but that
they would all live to see this punishment dispensed
with, and he thought that of the probability of this
event, the abolition of the slave trade was an ample
illustration. In almost every case theory corrected
practice ; for, if we were to trust to the opinions of
practical men alone, we would scarcely ever have
the grossest abuses corrected. He had heard from
distinguished officer (a Member of that House), dig
I imprisonment was attended with better effect thee
flogging ; and, with respect to tile influence this pis
nishment had upon the character of the men, le
stated that a Highlander was never known to boll
up his head after receiving it. He was not sure tie
the army could be governed without the influeaced
fear ; but he was convinced that by abolishinglief
ging by degrees the character of the army yea
become at last such as to sender it unnecessary. Bt
thought that it was a very great hardship to subject
the Local Militia to this punishment, as it might le
injurious to the sherds ut the peasantry of the cow
try, he trusted that it would never be adopted.
General TA ItLETON expressed his latentiou
giving his entire support to the code of discipline it
its present form. He looked upon the Honuurabk
Baronet's motives as puie, but tie thought his argo
menu very errone. us. It was true that the Officer
were not flogged, but they owed the exemption 1:
their education : soldiers were punished fur offence
which education prevented, such as for beastly druo
kenness, which led to the commission of every crime.
As it appeared, that through our existing system d
discipline we had attained our present height of gboo
he did not see a reason for making any innovaticoo
With regard to rewards, he stated, that the promo
tion of a private did not end in an Ensign's Coulluto
sion ; instances had occurred of their attaining the
highest rank in the army, as was the case with a Pe
neral Officer who died the other day, and who leh
behind him a fortune of ,080,000. lie would maio
tail, that the soldiers of the British Army were better
oder
paid, and in a more elevatedsituaticuo than an
soldiers in the world. It was stated, that she frock
discipline, and the French mode of punishments we/
superior to curs ; he would not commute any dig
Boca for any tiling French, and he would satodut
our soldiers were better than theirs, and not aka
eu
meet them on any plain, or any place. lie alluded
to the Speech of an Hon. and Learned Gallium!!
(Mr. Brougham) on a former night, in whioLa
stated, that General Money and Sir RobertWrrii
perfectly agreed with him in opinion. He (oe
etto fico
Tarleton) stated, that he had received al
koori
General Money, an extract from ohich he
leave to read to the House. It. was in sae sl`t
" that having seen in the Papers that his Stair.
mentioned in the House, as agreeing in %hi • •
professed against corporal punishment, he
• /0
state, that although he desired its aboldoot
was convinced that it could not be 'clone without
ring the discipline of the army."—(Hooralt! mg'
The gallant General then concluded with ,
he wculd vote against the Motion. , •
sir SAMUEL- ROMILLY felt it hirduto'.l
post the Motion, though he would not pledge
to at:log all the opinions advanced in support I
The tubjoct, he owned, was difficult ; but hew
prised how any one could imagine that t!foT
grace, and ignominy were not the natorat,
quences of that mode of punishment. !WA
to be lamented that there should he.agr,
continue such a mode of punishimet gm
ill which it was /Toper to

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