Star.
London, England, 1812-03-04 00:00:00

ad po'llticAl point of view, As to the preposition
made by the Hon. Member (Mr. Brougham), he
thought it a very reasonable one i for be was of opi.
slims, that the House ought to go into Inquiry to as.
certain whether there was any possibility of palliating
the tendency of our present system. The House tuna
remember that they were called upon to inquire re-
specting the effects of the Orders in Council, they
were not required to decide on the policy of the Or-
ders in Council. When there was so much dissatisfac-
tion throughout the country, and when there was so
much commercial distress, that House ought not to
refuse inquiry. , lie was a friend to the proposed in-
quiry, beCause it would tend to remove all possible
prejudice and objection—(Hear, hear,)—indeed he
conceived it would be paying a due attention to those
who suffered. (Hear, hear.) He thought America
had some cause for complaint, for we first excluded
her from the Continent by Orders, and then we went
there ourselves, by virtile of our Licence system—
! (Hear, hear.) But inquiry was necessary.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER
opposed the motion, but not, as he could assure his
, Honourable Friend who spoke last, from any appre-
hension that the result of inquiry would be against
the wisdom of the system. He opposed it lest those
who suffer might be led for an instant into the mistake
that their distresses were to be attributed to this sysa.
tern. He could prove to demonstration, from incon-
trovertible documents, that the Orders, instead of pro-
ducing their distresses had been the very means of
hitherto staving them off.—(Hear.)—He was not
surprised, however, at the reasons given by his Ho-
nourable Friend ; for so great was his desire for, and
disposition to inquiry, that he never recollected a mo-
tion of this sort which was not aimed at him, by the
Gentleman opposite, which was not framed so con-
genial to his general wishes as to be calculated to
catch him. But it was strange enough that his Ho-
nourable Friend and his Right Honourable Friend
also (Mr. Canning) should vote for inquiry, on the
particular ground of desiring to be satisfied that in
fact their existed no ground for inquiry. This, how-
ever, must be their reason, since they appeared satis-
fied that the present distresses were not to be attribu-
ted to the Orders. He was glad of one circumstance,
which never occurred on a debate on this subject ;
that there was not the least intimation of the injustice
of the system, the more so, then, as it was not so for-
merly : for he well recollected how often the House was
told of their injustice, and in what terms they were re-
probated. The Right-Hon. Gent. declared in answer,
to what had fallen from his Right Hon. Friend that he
never looked on the Orders in Council in any other light
than as measures of retaliation warranted by the la*
of nations ; on the principle, that if France chose to
depart from the law of nations, and to :e.sert rights
incompatible with the acknowledged rights of others,
such nation must be opposed, by retali,,,ing her mon-
strous system upon herself, otherve.:,e she could use
her violation as a sword against ,ethers' rights, and
at the same time make it at a shield in her &fence.
As to his Right Honourable Friend's argument on
the blockade of 1807, he insisted that he never spoke
in that House on tile pohat, without distinctly saying,
that retaliative against France was meant in the fol.
lowing way :—That as France had said by her
blockade, that we should not trade with any part cf
the world, we said that no other part should trade
with her. if this had not been its meaning, it would
have been no retaliation at all If we had abided by ,
the law of actual blockade, then the system would ,
have been the annihilation of trade and our relative
commercial situation, by which we alone would,
suffer. After the full statement of his Right Ho-
nourable Friend ( Mr. Rose), and tle able speech
of his Honourable and Learned Friend, it was
not necessary to trouble the House with many
remarks. It was unfair to attribute the distresses
existing to the Orders, when a more rational source
was before the eyes of the country, namely, the losses
in the Baltic. Did not those losses check speculation,
and thereby affect the manufactining classes? They
had another source in the natural temporary stagna-
tion after the excess of 1809 and 1810. He thcn read
licences granted by the late Administration, and ar-
gued, from the Customs of France, the serious effect
which the Orders had produced on French trade, and
shewed, from the expose of the French Minister, and
the address of the Senate, the vast expellee which
would be incurred to fill the arsenals of the Empire.
The repeal would take off all the manufactures of
France, and open to her the Eastern and Western
World. After a variety of other observations, he
eroiested ss6ngly agains, a Committee, as calculated
to let louse all those subjects connected with America
which it was now expedient to smother.
Mr. WHITBREAD said, he thought it necessary
to offer to the House a few observations, which it
was impossibleao avoid, in consequence of the extra-
ordinary speech of the Right Hon. Gentleman. He
had never heard a speech in Parliament more calculat-
ed to mislead the House from the question. The
Right Hon. Gentleman had endeavored to make them.
believe, that the question was, whether the Orders in
Council ought to be mentioned ? The question to be
decided was, whether this country had acted fairly
towards America ? but the Right Hon. Gentleman,
instead of discussing that point, had entered into a
statement of the difference between the resources of
England and France, contending that Bonaparte
had no revenue to carry on the war.—( Cry of No
and hear, hear.)—The Right Honourable gentleman
might be well skilled in French and English finance ;
but that was not the question for the consideration of
the House. The People starving, and most of the
Manufacturers of the country out of employ, was
the subject which claimed their attentios. He had
understood that Petitions from Birmingham and
other manufacturing towns, in various parts of the'
kingdom, stating their disasters, had been sent to the
Prince Regent, which from some circumstance had
not yet been presented. He was surprised at the
'delay, as he conceived that illustrious Person to be
'easy of access. Ministers could not be ignorant of the
misfortunes tto which he alluded, yet they were con-
stantly treating the subject as if no such disasters
were in eiistenee. CoUld they be ignorant that in all
paid of the country petitions were preparing ? Had
'they not henrd that petitions were preparing in York.
shire ? When they knew those facts, and they were
asked to name a Committee to inquire into the effects
sarhich the Order!! in Council :lad produced on the
trade and manufactures of the country, the. Right
Hop. gentleman had gone'on with a fine flourishing
sitatemeiit of finance, saying, ,f Is this not an answer

to the manufacturers ? and tell me whether there can
be any ground for appointing a Committee to inquire
Into the Orders in Council. The Right Hoq. Gentle-
man reminded him of the conduct of a Noble Lord
with respect to Sir John Moore. When that Gene-
pl applied for men, he was answered, You have so
many men with you ; here they are on paper. The
General replied, The question is not what I have on
paper, but what I have in the field; I cannot muster
near that number. But the Noble Lord persisted that
the men were on pottier, (in the returns) and the Ge-
nerallad them. It was the case with the manufacturers.
When they asked for bread, and their masters were un-
able to support them, they were told by the Rigl4
Hon. Gentleman of exports and imports on paper. 10id
'they not know what bankruptcies had occurred, and
1
of the speculative trade which had been the ruin of the
manufacturers ? Petitions from that suffering class I
!would soon be laid on the table, and they would read
the history of all the disasters. The system of the
Orders in Council had been productive of ruin and
, misery. The Right Hon. Gentleman had told the
i House what the situation of France, with respect to,
commercial advantages, would be, if the Orders in
Council were repealed; but let it be remembered, that
the Motion before the House proposed no repeal,
though the operation of the Right Honourable
Gentleman's Licensing System, was constantly op.
posing the Orders for which he professed so much
respect, and, in fact, they had never been fully eite-
cuted. In the picture which had been drawn,
of the flourishing state of our exports in 1809, it
seemed to be forgotten, that the markets of Spain.
and Portugal were then open to us. Now what had
:the officious Orders in Council to do with that outlet.-
1 In the same manner, the Right Honourahle Gentle.
!man held up a table of our Custom-house entries with
his right hand, and exhibited the confiscations of Na-
poleon with his left. Did he not know, that thew
confiscations were formed of part of the exports of
which he boasted, and that the ruined merchants
could not proceed in such a trade ? The exports
had of course, according io the accounts up to the
Ist of February, sunk nom twelve to one million,
and, in fact, must fall to sero. He wished the
House to consider what would be the consequence
of a war with America, the favourite object M Pas*
liament, and, he believed, of the people of this coon:
try. If a war broke out with America, it would be
impossible for us any longer to supply the armies in'
the Peninsula. Last year a million of barrels of flour
were scut from America to Spain and Portugal.-1
' This was at a time when we could not feed our own
population without importations from France, and
for the corn we received fions thence, Bonaparte
would take nothing hut hard gold and silver. The
lino. Gentleman then proceeded to press on the con-
sideration of the House the effect of the Licensing
System in producing foreign seamen, and referred un
that question to the remonstrance of the Hull Mer-
chants. He next observed, that one of the subterfuges
to which the Chancellor of the Exchequer resorted, was
the setting up the Order in Council ot 1807 as a defence
of the present Orders. Such an argument might be,
very well, if the conduct of Lord ick were the
question under consideration, but how was a referene
to his conduct to give bread to the starving manufac-
turers in every corner of the country. Those who
supported the present Motion were nut bound to vin-
dicate Lord Howick, but he should just observe,
that there was a material difference in point of
policy, between the mere essay of a principle, whether
1 tight or wrong, and the pushing of that principle to
1 its utmost extremity in practice. He must also re-
-1 mind the Right Hon. Gentleman of the defence of that
1 I Order of 18u7, made by a Learned Civilian near him,
when Lord Howick was blamed for not acting
upon it to a greater extent. That Learned Civilian
said, that to carry the principle farther would be to
imitate the monkey which throws at his assailants
cocoa nuts in return for stones, aud yet it was upon
this rneakt , 9
_polity the ,Right on. Gentleman was
ambitious ot acting. With regard to the pompous eit-
I hibition ut our exports and imports, it reminded him
of the boasting calculations with which a French
Emigrant Knight used to amuse the, country about
twenty years ago, and who went on proving that
France must be overcome, because her trade and
finances were ruined. He proceeded to prove that
I all the gold in the world was in England, while iss ;
France there was nothing but paper ; and with this '
consolatory doctrine he proceeded until he got a
I pension. It happened, however, that the first pay.
rent of his pension was made in paper, in conse-
quence of the stoppage of the Bank of England.
The Vice-President cf the Board of Trade and the
1 Right Hon. Gentleman near him, had dwelt mush
. upon the effect which the repeal of the Orders iti
Council would have in throwing a profitable metal
' into the hands of the Americans. It appeared then,
that the main reason for continuing these Orders,
was not. what the Right Hon. Gentleman pretended.
, a retaliation for the commercial regulations of Frances
which formed a legitimate measure of war, such as
any just return on our part would equally be. It was
not kir this retaliation the Orders were to be con.
tinued, but to prevent America from profiting by a I,
trade which we could not engross to ourselves. This
I was the mere spirit of Commercial rivalry, and not
hostility to the enemy. If the Howe should go into a
Committee, in consequence of the motion of his Lear-
ned
Friend, it did not follow that any discussion
would arise on the questions between this country and
America ; that object, if he were to be a Member of
the Committee, he should disclaim ; but with regard
to the Orders in Council, two questions would arise;
First, Whether it would be good policy to continue
1 them ? and, if that should be answeied in the i.ega-
five, Secondly, %Thither it would be consistent w to
the dignity of the country to abandon 11. cm ? If it I
should appear,hpon inquiry, that they had been it.its•
rious to the trade of the country, that would afford
'the Government fair ground for their repeal.
Mr. HERBERT rose, notwithstanding a loud
cry of Question ! and stated, in reply to what had
, been stated on the subject cf Licences, some facts
which had come to his knowledge in the courts of
certain proceedings in the Admiralty Courts. He
observed, that no Qaths were required at our Custom
House, because it was the object of the Licence to fa-
elli4te exportation, but that the vessels could not
eater the-parts of the Continent without the sinau•
Ilnied papers being supported by false oaths.
' Lord G. LEVISON GOWER conceiving.that he
Thad been alluded to by the Hon: Gentleman (Mr.
Whitbread) thought 'it right to state• that he had

been directed by certain person, h the &arm.*
Potteries, to present a Petition against orders.
Council to the Prince Regent. He hafpleeed it!
the hands of the Secretary of State for the Herael
partment, tied had written to the individuals who,
entrusted him -with kon the subject. Th" di;
proved of his parting with it, obspi sing, ;hat
kept it in his own lipids, an etperunity,
wiold have occurred to preset tit to the Reset
For such an opportunity be had waited in vain
ring the las; three weeks. He felt it his duty to
ed
port the motion.
Viscount MILTON said he we* exactli in these
situation with the Noble Lord who had just spout
Mr. BROUGHAM shortly replied.
The Question being loudly called for, the litt
divided, when there appeared,.
For the Motion, 144—Against 14216—Majority;
• Ads..riourned at Five eclodt in the Morning.
EVENING STAR.

LONDON,

WEDNESDAY, MARCH 4.
PRICE OP STOCKS THIS DAY AT ONE (nun
Spoor Ct. itedoes4 61H-4 per Coro. stsf
per Ct. C. far online" 6i ti—Do. for ace. 6li
Spar Ct. 921 In--Do:ids las. 176., p.--Loog Apt, 4,4 648,

•
The enders of the Sraa hale more than once Lena aelato
that Trtmisten had resolved neither to ressat4 rot modify
"Orders in Conseil. Qt. this veaticn a mist
took place last n'ght in the Commons, when k wathaese,
they f.hall continue. The sturnaents of the eigata,
resent a clear view of the rubject in all its bearings,

French Papers arrived yesterday after the Srr s west Pik
!Du t their contests were not of such intrriance ab to ituitsc,
stop the Press. They present such a phdippic against •
as Might be carved, when trsating of she jilt dump
dly. They aliu mention the capture of Pause*, sod
SVCIILT was now directing Lis attention to the SiegeslAgii
These Papers, we are sorry to state, anooonce the
the Anna Dorothea, the Ceres, and the John, by the
French privateer, which carried them into Rostock. no
Frederica, is taken by the Happy Henry French
carried into Travenaunde. A ship of MO tpas,tsyw
and rum, from Jamaica, was taken between the Vdi Joel
and 3d February, by the Juno French privateer, sad NNW!
de Ras, supposeti to be the Margaret, from Matto*,

•
NOTTINGIAM, MARCH 2.-114 Town mt.* fah
presented a novel, and, in some degree, a trrrik elms
The military quartered here attended divine serrate ula
bayonrts, to the uo small surprise of the inbatruistr,•ilen
not been the smallest appearance of commotion requites.
An opinion prevailed (as I am informed) amoog the Coma
Authorities, that an attempt was to be made wa the ern
prison for thy liberation of the numerous pennies cosiedd
on suspicion nt being one way or other eeneelsollie Ihr In
kg of frames : a guard of twelve soldlue is third* fiiss
the prison to prevent any surprise. An ulnas *boils II
for u many of the hussars u could be speraimpreephig
&lei to SWIM, the *ldlers being drawn bara thou uil
derslielii, dm. whale, we understand, serious deb coadiuti
rdingly, a patsy proceeded for that place at dire o'cisdlu
earning. To.day the whole of the troops r this tug
beighbeurhood were reviewed be °emelt Hamm; ago
the two pieces of artillery belonging to the LOB'
Wilde presented a martial and imposing aplearaem-1
fit/MAdegie lescreale of oaupere, the peors Mite love
bey, as insupportable burden.

NAVAL INTiLLIGENCL

FALMOUTH, MARCH 1.
Arched the Princess Elisabatt packet, Foautaatt,
Falvey; Oche harbour. the k. press, Warms's, hand
Rio Janeiro; his Majesty'. &manes Hamlett. trust Pl*
to take convoy to the Eastward; the schoooer Alatss,Lat
Caesar, from Messina, last from Olbrallsr. The allp
Brunswick, DaR Ht.s r, horn St. Kites, with sago% foot
put in here on Friday last, with loss of main ass#lnlasegrai
mat overboard, and great part of her cargo damaged. 11410
Majesty's brig 2' vac* It to the Westward; the Compel
convoy for Cork; the Janata, Warta', for at. Midalibl
Marione Ann, Caans.von, tor Gibraltat sad hitlta.

Mao wiled the following Packets, Math, via--
rough, Rota., and Walionhani, Roads IT 8. for Lgliwo
ter, itoonts, for the Leeward Wands"; Frailly*, Pa
Jamaica; Lord Hobart, Nepotism for Cidlt;
herrn-gator America; Splay. Sotaaat.strs.fstde
terrappean; and Windsor Castle, for Serious and )m
FOWEY, MARCH 1.
Sailed the Esprow Packet, for Rio ierebvi the
Packet, tor Falmouth; the Frederic, cartel, for Marliki
brig Henry, fur tie Brasile; the sloop &steep/LAW
and the brig Hope, for Dublin. Wind N.N.L.
PLYMOUTH, MARCH 1.
Came In the Sammons frigate with a boob
pierced for to guns, which she captured WM Worani.
rived the Matroataxa frigate from Port/mouth. 11411
and other Oaken es board. brood to Lisbon ; Uni
gate from the Irish station; mid tie I'o:upsa pe
cruise. Sailed the revoratrg sloop of war es evils
Westward ; %%MAGI I3oop of war With s Miff hires
sad the Janata cartel for Medal: ; N alkam soil Nosy&
bon ; Navigator for the Havannab ; Madge. sad
New York; and the Coffee Mama, Carmel
Dubiln.
PORTSMOUTH. MARCH 3.
Arrived, his Majesty's Alps NAIAD, Rocas:sr. 4
nos from the Downs, amid the Vas num* 6044
burgh. Wind S.W.
DEAL, MARCH 3.
Cams down ?min the River lad eveSl sogaillllll
'n'lsliag the Airs lOphiestone and Maple. Goa Mail
him Majesty's Air la Hodge sod Malaga. sod mit
tied the fiesamalwa Inner. shot Ise* "
Pentommult.—Whid

A

The eaten end mei of its hiejestre *IP Ai eswiS
obboathe Moto days pay to dos Midst die widow
tat' dm oaken and men bandy lon a the labili b."
Admiralty would ant *bow nab ao mimosa di 1
bang beyond what Is haunt, aad /Maly te Limo &ken
eft WO'
COIN MAW r, MAIR•LAML.".•I.O4IIre dig" - era
arrival. of Wheat, but roierabie supplies ea WI of tbr P"
IS
vats mei the Nsrth Coontryi ligisatiki °wag= a
siis
Mar/ sae, newsy at hot prices. Aye, rater
=ill Pod aunty; lobo •liimerise bawl' Mg _
Mid Albite else keep Mei: : 1 wit INN I. •
=III Oila are mil last peke A
Floor, watboair imilioa. :...00111e1

DON . Mused by I.lvei t•sur, nea=l
published thefts led et the SPlff.laloiT