Star.
London, England, 1822-02-19 00:00:00

AGRICULTURE.

The Marquis of LONDONDERRY having al-
ready troubled the House with his view of the pre-
sent situation of the agricultural classes, would not
detain them now in moving, that the Report made
in the las: Session of Parliament by that Committee
should again be referred to their consideration, to-
gether with the Petitions presented to the House on
the subject of Agricultural Distress in the last and
present Sessions. He wished to avoid saying any
thing that might provoke a debate at this time on a
subject of such complexity and importance, as he
thought the question could be much more advan-
tageously discussed when brought before the House
by the Report of a Committee of their own body.—
He then moved—
u That the Report of the Committee on Agricultural Dis-
tress, with the Petitions presented in the last and present Ses-
sions of Parliament he referred to a Select Committee to be ap-
pointed to inquire into the allegations thereof, and Report their
opinions to the House."
Mr. GOOCH wished to offer a few observations.
He was desirous of correcting some of the misrepre-
sentations which had taken place respecting him at
several Public Meetings. He had been described, net
by name perhaps, but still so that lie was understood
to be alluded to, as having brought forward this sub-
ject last-year, in collusion with the Government, in
order to prevent inquiry. If he had acted such a
part, he should have thought himself unworthy to
represent that county which sent him to Parliament,
or any other. Having been sent there to represent
one of the first agricultural counties in England, he
had believed it to be his duty when he saw their
table covered with Petitions, signed by numerous
members of the yeomanry of the country, all describ-
ing the existence of one unusual scene of distress, to
call the attention of the House to it. Though little
qualified to perform such an arduous task, he had
determined on taking' it up as nobody else did.—
He wished for that inquiry which had taken place,
but which, he was sorry to say, had done little good.
He had, in the first instance, thought it right to ascer-
tain his own strength, and the strength of those op-
posed to him. Peeling no wish to raise the landed
interest to the injury of other interests, he had not
anticipated much opposition from the commercial
and manufacturing interests. After consulting those
connected with those interests, he then went to the
Noble Marquis to alc what the Government pro-
posed to do? The Noble Marquis told him Mu Mi.

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'nisters would .slot oppose t 1 Motion for a CClll3lhtt
las they felt foe the llittlAtiOfi of the agricultural:di
as math as he (Mr. Gooch) could 413, He (.
Gooch) then said to the Noble Miyquis. he was
rather surprised that with these feelings they had not
come fohward with some measures for their relief.--
The Noble Marquis said, that as a Minister, he had
no right to bring forward a measure unless he could.
offer a remedy, as he wished not to bold out a hope
to the country which might not be realised. But, he
added, ho would willingly attend the Committee, and
give eveii aid in his power to the prosecution)of the
inquiry. That pledge, in the Committee, the Noble
Marquis had most fully redeemed. He had stated
thus much to chew what his conduct had been, and
he hoped he should not be again misrepresented.—
Now, with respect to the Report of the Committee,
he would say, that to him it appeared worse than
useless. This might seem strange, coming from the
Chairman of the CoMmittee from which the Report
had emanated, but he believed that. it had thrown
.dust in the people's eyes, instead of opening them,
and that it would not afford them relief or anything
!else. Perhaps he might be allowed a few words on
'what had fallen from the Noble Marquis on F:iday.
No man had more at heart the welfare of the landed
interest than the humble individual who then ad-
dressed the House. His duty, his inclination, and
his interest, all led him that way. • He thought the
statement of the Noble Marquis (the Marquis et
Londonderry) in many respects most satisfactory.—
He begged to congratulate the House on the,state of
the finances of the country. It was a most gratify.
ing circumstance to find that we were in posses-
sion of a clear Sinking Fund of more than five mil-
lions. For the general welfare of the country, it was.
necessary that public credit should be secured—
(Hear, Istar).—Nothing could tend more to the relief
of the country than thus improving and strengthen-
ing public credit—(Year, hear).—But when he came
to speak of what the Noble Lord had said on the sub-
ject of agricultural distress, he should not speak
truth, if he were to state it to be his opinion; that it
would prove satisfactory to the landed interest. • He
thought they, would be discontented because more
was not done ; but it was one thing to say, that what
had been proposed was not sufficient, and another to
point out that more ought to be done. He did not
see what more could be done; but he was most anxious
to see as large a diminution of taxes as could Ise made
consistent with the maintenance of the great interests of
the country. The question then became one of quantity.
He was one of those who did not wish the numerical
strength of the army to be more diminished ; but he
wished for further reductions in the civil departments
of both army and navy. When the estimates came
before the House, he would vote for such reductions
as he thought would be proper. When he looked at
what had already been done, in the course of the Ses-
sion, he congratulated the House on the system which
had been opened. He explained the circumstances
which, in the last Session, had frequently prevented
him from being in his place in that House. He con-
gratulated them on what had fallen from the Noble
Marquis. He hoped to GOD that he would follow
up what he had then stated, and he implored all sides
'of the House, at this important juncture, to forget
party feeling, and, bearing in mind those words which
they heard so often, "lay aside all prejudices and par-
tial affections," and unite with but one object—the
good of their country.
Sir J. SHELLEY said, the Hon. Gentleman who
had just sat down seemed surprised to find how much
the Noble Marquis had done. He also was surprised,
but in a different way—he was surprised to find how
little the Moble Marquis had done. He thanked the
Noble Marquis for taking off the Malt Duty, but was
sorry to see him giving £3,000,000 to that fallacy
the Sinking Fund. He would not dwell on this sub-
ject now, as a motion, on Thursday, would bring the
Sinking Fund before the House. The diminution of
taxation was called for by the whole country, add' in
his opinion the Noble Marquis, in bolstering up the
Sinking Fund, protected the monied interest at the
expense of the agriculture of the country, and there-
fore he was not satisfied.

Mr. WODEHOUSE rose to put a question to the
Noble Marquis, which he had no doubt be would an-
swer, but first he would offer a few words to explain
the principles which regulated his own conduct. He
did not hesitate to declare that in his view of the
subject the Government did not go sufficiently far to
relieve the landed interest, but he was equally free
to say, that the measures they had devised, when in
the fair course of operation, seemed to him likely to
prove extensively beneficial. He highly complimented
an Honourable and Learned Gentleman and a Noble
Lord for the view which they had taken of the agri-
cultural question, and proceeded to shew how much
happier the cultivator in England was than the cul-
tivator in foreign parts, where the former was a
slave, or so oppressed by feudal exactions, that his
state much resembled that of slavery. He had now
a question to put, and the House, when he mentioned
it, would recal a debate on the subject of prohibitory
laws, the principal part of which • lay between Mr.
W. Elliot and Mr. Horner. Such a subject cculd
not be in better hands. Mr. Horner contended, that
where there was political danger, prohibitory laws
were justifiable, and Mr. Elliot could not conceive
that political danger could be consistent with com-
mercial safety. He now wished to obtain a distinct
answer from the Noble Marquis as to the part which
Government meant to pursue—the principle on
which they meant to act. lie skewed the import-
ance of the questions by describing the agricultural
distress now existing, and then called the attcu-
tion of the House to the sentiments put forth in a
former Report of one of their Committees, which
he regarded as a demi-official document. The Ho-
nourable Member then stated, that he understood a
Right Hon. Gentleman on the floor (Mr. Huskisson)
to be the author of the Report of the Agricultural
Committee, or at least that it had his full concur-
rence. He begged the House to allow him to read
some passages from that Report. llaving done so,
the Hon. Member inferred that they were at variance
with the Right Hon. Gentleman's declared opinions'
upon former occasions, and contradictory in their
own nature. His object was to know upon what prin-
ciples they were to proceed? He believed that no one
would attribute to him the-wish of exciting angry
discussion upon this topic; but the deplorable state of
necessity to which they were now reduced, 'rendered
it imperative.that something should be done without
delay. He believed that no one doubted the talents

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17V4

of the light Hens Gentleman below Mm, *ih M!?
teie must remember the celebrated peroration to his
speech Upon the Corn BBL in which he called upon
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Mr. CURWEN was afraid, from the views of the
Noble Lord, that much would not be done in the
present Session. It was the duty of Government not
to send the subject to a Committee. From the di-
versity of opinion in the Committee. no good was to
be expected. He (Mr. Curwen) admitted that the
diminution of the Malt Tax was a great boon. TO
take offfhe taxes on barley, salt, and leather, would
be a relief of tweuty per cent. In the meantime, let
us have a few more millions in the way of relief
for the plans of the Noble Lord were wholly inade.
quate. Any plan to take off the surplus produce
would be highly advantageous both to 'the grower
and manufacturer of corn. He was surprised at the
language of the Member for Sussex, ay had the Coupe
try Gentlemen been united, they would have coma
pelled the Ministers to make the necessary reductions,
Had Government given up twenty per cent. in that
way of relief from taxation, that, joined to twenty pet'
cent. from the landlord, would amount to forty per
ceitt. and with such a reduction the country could go
on. He (Mr. Curwen) had that day seen one thou-
sand head of cattle driven off from Smithfield for
want of buyers. "He hoped the Committee would
make a Report before Easter.
Mr. BENETT (of Wilts) hoped the Noble Lord
would be more explicit as to his plan of relief. What
had the Agricultural Committee to inquire into ?
The Corn Bill had been most destructive both to the
agricultural interest and to every other class of the
community. He was not an advocate for high duties,
because he was no friend to high prices. The present
system of taxation fell with tenfold more pressure ou
the poor than the rich. The' poor consumed as much
salt as the rich ; but on them it fell with intolerable
pressure. One plan was to support the Sinking Fund,
but that Fund he had always regarded as a delusions
As to the loan of money to parishes, in aid of the
Poor-rates, he was sure no parish would borrow mo-
ney on such terms. The reduction of Is. on the Malt
Tax would have but little effect in the way of relief.
The first cause of the public distress had been the
suspension of Cash Payments, for which no adequate
cause existed. He had no wish to interfere with the
law by which the country had returned to Cash Pay-
ments. One mode of relief had been overlooked,
that from economy and retrenchment. No reduction
of rents could save the tenantry of the country. The
lands of the country were not mortgagel f(-.r the
whole of the National Dabt, though he dlumated they
were mortgaged for a part. llc (though a landholder)
must admit that the landlords were suffering whet
they deserved, as they had supported all the Tory
Administrations for the last 50 years.
Mr. STUART WORTLEY said, - that he had
heard the Noble Marquis with much pleasure one
former night. He felt no-shame in having supported
the Government during the war. He- believed that
war had been for the liberties of Europe ; and but
for it, he believed, we should have been a province of
France. When there was a fund of five millions
above our expenditure, this was a most satisfactory
circumstance, whether applied to the Sinking Fund,
or to relieve the present distresses. He had heard
with much satisfaction that retrenchments had been
made to the amount of two Millions ; though he
trusted his Noble Friend would nit stop there. He
felt no satisfaction at the proposed loan in aid of the
Poor-rates. The object of the Committee would be
to prevent the excessive importation of foreign corns
He should have failed in his duty if Le had not stated
his sentiments to the House—(Cheving).
Mr. RICARDO could no: agree with the last
speaker as to the satisfactory statement of the Noble
Lord. A Sinking Fund, if preserved entire, would
be of the most beneficial effect ; but after the expe-
rience of Sir. Robert Walpole's and Mr. Pitt's Sink-
ing Funds, 00 hopes could be entertained of any good
result: in a few years the present Sinking Fund would
experience the fate of all its predecessors. He had
said that the fundholder had a fair claim on all the
property of the country, and he was still of the same
opinion. Instead of being in a state-of distress, he
looked on the country as in a state of great prospe-
rity. It was not above a yehr ago that they were
told of. the manufacturing-and commercial distresses,
but he then predicted that they would Improve, and
they had improved accordingly. At the same time,
he was averse to the Corn Bill, and hoped they would
soon find out a sure method of fixing a fair remu-
nerating price for Agr:cultural produce and labour.
He warned the Bank against issuing four millionsmore
of gold on Exchequer Bills, unless they were sure of
having plenty .of coin to carry on the currency of the
country ; but if they had 'not that it would be dan-
gerous ; and though he allowed that they had made
a great effort, and though he believed them most
honourable men who were at the head of the Bank
Direction, yet he did not think them calculated to
carry on so difficult and intricate a measure as at-
tempting to alter. the value of gold. If the Bank had
continued to pay in bullion, as he had proposed, till
1825, they would have kept back still longer, with.,
out any inconvenience to the country, the necessity
of recurring to payment in gold coin. He was stir,
prized to have heard, on a former night, the Honour.
able Member for Chichester supporting loans on the
security of corn or parish rates. Ile (Mr. Ricardo)
should shut the door against a producer who cams
plained that he could not obtain a remunerating price
for his commodity, because they should tell him to
regulate his produce according to the demand for it.
On the contrary, their door should be open to the co.' •
plaints of the consumer, for all the taxes weighed on
him. The taking off part of the Malt Tax would
benefit him more-than the agricultuihl prodOie of the
nation. And so with the taxes on salt, soap,. and in-
deed it would go through the whole ranged' tam ors
It had been injuriously said of-him, that lie had said
in-that House, that the taxes were a benefits On the
contrary, he had always said that the cases were-ae
es tiaytteootfh de hsatremses,sitthueay,
should not
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lion as we were in before the war. It was, howester,
our duty to make instant preparations to return to it.
even
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