Star.
London, England, 1830-03-31 00:00:00

5°051 acres, which had been rescued from the sea, divided the
en tire property into tenements, at a rent of 10,0001. a year ; and
he ( llr. Harvey) had reason to know. that that gentleman had re-
ceived at his last audit 9,000!. The whole Island now consisted of
six thousand acres of the finest and cheapest land in the kingdom ;
and -what he wished to ask was, why the commissioners of Woods
and Forests, with all the land revenue at their disposal, had not
expended this 10,0001. as well as the Reverend J. Lonadale, and
by this means have so enhanced the valise of this property. The
next subject to which he should call the attention of the house was,
the improvidence of the commissioners in the letting of houses
belonging to the crown. (The hon. member here mentioned a number
of houses in the neighbourhood of Pall-mall and Piccadilly, amount.
ing in all to 31.) These had been let at an average rent of 1251. a
rear— a sum which, for houses in the most valuable part of London,
every gentleman in that house must know was a most inadequate re-
turn. In Holborn, near the Turnstile, there were nineteen houses
at an average rent of 50L a-year, which lie had known to have been
estimated at 1091. each. In Spring-gardens there are three houses
of nearly the same size—the noble lord opposite, who occupied
one, could inform the house on that subject—their rental was
only 2361. a-year, with a condition for expending 560 E in re-
pairs. In Huntingdon, tenements had been let to Sir J. Throg.
morton for 1071. a-year, whose estimated value had been 1,1041.
He should now consider the inadequate consideration which had
been received by the commissioners for real estates; and he
wished to call the attention of the house to their singular
mode of disposing of the real property of the'crown. In the year
1812, the manors of Eltham anti Queen's Chief, with all the courts,
royalties, tenements, &c. thereunto dependant—and every gentleman
knew how the value of an estate was enhanced by those privileges—
had been sold for 20 years' purchase. A part of Newmarket
race-course had been similarly disposed of ; and, as if this ar-
rangement had not been sufficiently tempting to the purchasers
and detrimental to the interests of the crown, the land tax had
been redeemed by the commissioners at 39 years' purchase. In
1809 the singular transaction respecting the Rockingham
Forest estate, to which he had already alluded occurred.
By the 36th of George 111. the Commissioners bad been authorised
to sell that property, for an adequate sum, to the Earl of
Westmoreland. But from the year 1760 up to 1805, it appeared
that he had only paid a rent of 71. 53. 3d. Since then a more
appropriate rent had been paid ; but on a sum of several thousand
pounds due by his lordship for the estimated value of the timber
on the estate, he had only paid an interest of five per cent. while
his advantages on that part of these transactions were equal to
ten per cent In this manner, and by such proceedings, the
Commissioners of his Majesty's Woods and Forests had the
power directly to influence and coerce one half the members of
that house, while much of the other half could not avoid being af-
fected by their power. From the year 1786 up to the present time,
he found that out of 408 of those Crown tenants, 200 were persons of
title. There must have been something advantageous in this con-
nection, beyond the information laid before that house, to silence the
scruples which many of those gentlemen must have felt at holding
the subordinate rank of middle men and under tenants. The hon.
member then mentioned a few of the names of those to whom he
had alluded ; amongst others, those of St. Albans, Bathurst, his
Royal Highness the Duke of Gloucester, the Duke of Newcastle,
Sir Barnard, &c. &c. Having thus alluded to the improvi.
dent manner in which the Commissioners of Woods and } °rests
had leased out the crown lands, the honourable member said he
should now turn to the converse of the proposition, and endea-
vour to show to the house, that their purchases had been equally
liable to censure. But rat he would ask, whether those cons.
missioners had power to dispose of the crown lands revenue as
they pleased, without consulting the will of that house? He
understood that a public-house, called the Whestsheaf, In the
neighbourhood of Virginia Water, had been purchased for
5,000 f. and afterwards let to Alvan. Rainsbottom and Co. for
fifty pounds a-year—making a return of one per cent. for their
expenditure—(hear)-40,0001. had been paid to the Duke of Port.
land fur the Alarylebone rectory ; 21,0001. for Moat Park, leading
to Windsor ; and 3,8501. for a house in Privy-gardens for Lord de
Clifford, at the time when they had sold their own houses for a
much less proportionate sum. Other messuages, near Windsor,
had been purchased from Sir J. Coventry, for 7,3501. and resold
to Mr. Western-a for 6,0501. In the year 1819, the Duke of
Richmond being desirous to give, up his interest In his house
in Privy-gardens, the Commissioners agreed to allow hint
5,0001. for it. with the exception of 7001. which had been owing
front his Grace to them from the year 1791. It might be said I
that at the time when many of those transactions had taken plain
the want of a proper system of valuation had led the commiesionens
into error ; that the repetition of similar circumstances could not
again occur ; as, for the future, all estimates should be taken es
oath. He did not think that the oaths of individual valuators were
to be depended on. He had himself experienced their fallaciounims
in the valuation of a house at Clapton, upon which the event of his
election to his seat in that house had inged; on which occasion dif.
ferent valuations on oath had differed in the most extravagant man-
ner. As another instance of the truth of his opinion on this subject,
in the year 1806, Sir J. Granger had purchased the manor of
Eltham for 3,923 L and had afterwards, notwithstanding_ a valu-
ation, received a premium of f. 5,0001. on his bargain. The Hon.
Member then went into a calculation of the Irish land revenue,
which he estimated in quit-rents and Crown lands, at one million
and a half. To this should be added a sum of 500,0001. for the'
amount of remainders and reversions of considerable value, and
or every description of property, which would soon accrue—
making, in all, a sum of two millions of available rens
nue. From 1826 to 1829 the receipts were 1,449,1201. thus
making the total receipt, from 1793 to 1829, 5,883,7411. The
Honourable Gentleman proceeded to state how much of this had
been made available fo public purposes. For ten years from 1793
to 1804, all that had gone to the revenue was 10,1201. • from 1806
:o 1815, a sum of about 215,0001. ; from 1815 to 18118, out of up.
wards of 2,000,0001. received, the whole sum applied to the public
Tre.tsury was 8,6241. ; and from 1826 to 1829, during which time
they had received 1.000,0001. of money, not one farthing had the
public benefited, so that the balance against the commissioners of
woods and forests was near 5,000,0001. but of this several disburse-
ments were to be given credit for, such as Buckingham Palace, that
ornstr.ent of the Park, 596,1691.; together with improvement of
!ousts, and extraordinary expenses,
auamonting in the whole to some-
thing Inure than four millions, /caving balance of 500,0001. for the
expenses of n:anagement during the last thirty quire. If any one
looked to a course of this management, and to the cheap and simple
,tanner in which rents were ordinarily collected, the comparison
would at once show the extravagance, for, upon an average of three
year., the cost of management, with law charges, &c. amounted
to about 166,0001. being a fraction more than 20 per cent. on the rents of the esetes. The actual value of the land revenue of the Croon, unconnected with the department of Woods and Forests,
and with those portions devoted to Royal purposes, would be,
including 130 manors, which he valued at 1,0001. each—free-
/teed lands, estimated at 500,0001. a-year—waste lands, ntents on enclosures bills, church livings, would, hi the whole,
amountmoan to 17,1365,2001. The hon. gentleman, after dwelling upon
sir lice of examining into this subject, which he said was
4:eutnntended to the good opinion of the house by its tendency to
produce the most beneficial and pure specimen of political economy,
tnemittch as it would add to the revenue without taxation, moved
that a select committee be appointed to examine into the condition
and the management of the land revenue of the crown, which was at
Present committed to the care of the commissioners of woods and
Sir EDWARD KNATCHBULL hoped that his noble friend
(Lord Lowther) would pardon him for following the hon. member
tor Colchester, as he wished to allude to one case mentioned by the
bon. gentleman, for the purpose of putting it in a true point of
'mew. Ile meant the case of Sunk Island ; and with respect to the
character of the Rev. John Lonstiale, he would only bay that it was
such as must command the respect of every one. Sunk Island, in,
reign of Charles 11. was a mere bank of sand, and contained
ss,su 100 acres. In consideration of the loyalty and attachment of
rue Ismily. it was granted in that reign to them at the rent of M. a
ten', at.d the lease had subsequently been renewed by the amnia and exits:, to the exertions of the family, and sums of UMW%
amounting in the whole to 30,0001. laid out by them, it NW
amounted to 5,000 acres, for which a rent of 3,2001. a year wall
e the crown. The lamellate family had, moreover, to 111
action tgainst them, or rather against the crows, at an aniSINIO fle
mere than 6001. and these being the facts, he did not this!
either the crown or the lessees ought to be excised of unfair •
if, as the hon, gentleman said, the last rental did amount toff,
tihr great expense they had gone to, and the rent of 3,2001. a
Yvvthe crown, this was no more than a fair and reasonable ad-
. ,O.• Upon another point alluded to, he should merely say, that
wJti in the last year or two some crown lands were offered for sale,
I:.ilich.,lle (Sir E. Knatchbull) had a desire to purchase. Ha sent
slaasneni t to offer for Lim, but the lands were sold for from 4001. to
ore than he wished to give for then; and this, he though;
and r a sincere desire, oo the part
of the contenissionem of Woods
west., mush to make as has was possible of the crown lands
12tLivslltloit; ItENTINCKII wished to set right statement made re-
tvive "
, s case of alarylehone, for which his noble father had re-
aml for the truth of his statement he called on the
insmber for Liverpool to vouch. His noble father wished
dispose of his interest in that living, and having it valued by his
'lle t.ent and surveyor, the return made was that it was worth 40001.
at 1,113, sd .n offered 42,0001. or 44,0001. for it by the Dissenters,
it lather could not endow from his love towards the Church,
"tar foe t
es 4 be
_he sake of 3,0001 or 4,0001. it should fall into bad hands,
gait. it,Zessel:li ly wrote to the right
,hon. Member for Liverpool,
Croon would take it, he would prefer that they should
10,1`0111:_l_iv,inn, and accordingly the purchase was made for 40,0001.
0cd4,1 less than the sum offered in the market.
•OIVT..IIF.R said that the honourable member for Col-
-1 au notified, for the two last sessions,
his intention of sub.