Star.
London, England, 1825-05-18 00:00:00

They must* bad subjects rmlessthey sverebadlogiciantr
Lf.the argument of his Noble. Friend, *M good for itay
thing, it certainly was g od'for too much.' It was impos-1
sible for the Roman fth.tlic Church to contradict or
dissent frogs what It bad acknowledged for its authority;
therefore the House alight wait for ever before it passed
a Bill for their relic', if it waited for that. The Pope
never would renounce his authority, although he knew
that in tempoptl matters it was valueless. it had been
so declared by the French Bishops. in Council, with
Bossueit at ther head,' in 1682. Thirty- years ago, when
the same nue tion was propounded to all the Univer-
sities of Europe, they rejected it with disdain. The
• Catholic Church in Ireland gave a disclaimer to it, and
when his Noble Friend (Lord Liverpool) hid stated
th it the Roman Cathblics c )uld not make good sub-
jects, the same remark would apply to them on the
•
same ground in the Roman Catholic States. The ob-
jections that had been taken to the secresy of confession
availed nothing, as all the mischiefs, of it existing at
rese it Could not be made more dangerous by any
enactment in favour of the Catholics. He certainly.
'disapproved of their regulations with segard to the
win-circulation of the Bible; but he could . not see
how those regulations ought to be made to affect
th,ir civil rights. The same might be said of their
canons relative to marriage and exeomn unication.—
If they furnished reaso4s for excluding tie Catholics
now, they were etrally valid teas( ns for their non-
admission to the privileges which they already enjoyed
--*-If.the argument wE goof for anything. the Legisla-
ture bad already gone too far for its own safety. Would
any one state now, • that he thought that such tenets
should debar them from the full exercise and enjoyrnet.t
of the privileges of their fellow-citizens, and yet justify
the pas tug of a law which bad au: .endeied the corn-
.
mend of our armies and our fleets to men I f that
persuasion ? If such an argument was true, when
question arose between the Pope and the King, the true
Roman Catholic would desert the King, and follow the
Pope ; but he ved the insinuation altogether.
With regard tO 'he fears of those who apprehended
• mischief from the admission of Catholic Members in the
• Commons, hi thought they would not a bit worse than the Pro-
testant' Members who were returned by the Catholic influence. and
• that if over a Minister should attempt to support his tottering
power by their Means be would be sure to fall. With regard to the
restrictions Order Which the Sovereign was labouring respecting his
religion, they were grounded on matters of political expedieucy,
• he might say of absolute necessity. He apprehended no danger to
the Constitution, either from the Pope or from physical force.
But, ewer should the alarm be well founded—let them provide
against the mischief in the same manner as their ancestors had
done; at the time When there was a cascaded Papist on the throne,
and a known one the heir to it; when Louis the Fourteenth, then
'in the plenitude Of his power, was, as was then suspected, and which
• was afterwards confirmed, paying the King money, and bribing
him to enslave his people, the Legislature then provided an ample
.remedy, and might do so again, in the event of a repetition of the
• danger. He trusted.tbat their Lordships would not, by their vote of
that flight, afford'iniumpli and satisfaction to those countries, whom
he would not invidirossie call the enemies of this country, but who
certainly were hi rival..
The LORD CHANCELLOR said, he would not
enter into Abe merits of the C4thnte Question, but
would merely state his reasons for not agreeing to the made= IlOw
heroic their Lordships. He did not understand how it
'that this, hill came before that House in its present okapi" aui Mm.
;He saw from the writes of the other Home of Parliament think
was connected with a Bill which went to disfranchise s great mow
her of the freeholders of Ireland, and he also observed, from rate
same votes, that it was aerated expedient that the Government
should pay the salaries of the Catholic clergy of that many. No
permit conversant with Parliansestary practice coed view these asea
sures without perceiving that they were nearly comet tod with the
present Bill ; and yet they were asked to decide eta that 8111 without
knowing what was to become of the two ineasures which were lona
traduced with it. This be must say, was not a peeper mode el
hating; and if he had no other reason foe opposing tho*ll been timer
Lordships, but the single circumstance to which he bad adorned,
be .would make his stand oo that ground. WOOS the pried of the
Union with Ireland, he never hard of tee "mem Inesith
fru ward, without mention being made of ample • dm the
Protestant Church and Pro te:east Estabfkleasent. It : been
his duty, from mtny. many cirenuntament to separate.
from the Xliniste who conducted the affairt.of Govenwroon, at the i
period of the Union. on account cicalas diSerenses of
That Minister was favourable to the Roam Cathode end
he had often asked hint what were those nieurlder which be in.
tended to propose, and without which he bed dedimed be weak! I
not agree to the measure of Emancipation not-
withstanding all his inquiries, he never could and what
these securities were. Although there was a degree of in-
genuity displayed in the manner In which this Hilt was drawn
up, which be had hardly Olaf seta before in the composition of as
Act of Parliament, there was no variation in the preamble of de
from former hills. That Womble Cositaloedr—first, 'a seism
acknowledgment that the t Establishment of this maim
in Church-and State must be inviolably and permanently secured;
then came an allegation that they were Inviolably and permanently
secured. He allowed that they were secure, provided the Acts I
a bias rendered them so were permitted to madam in Esse; but 1
if their Lordships task away the substance of Mose Acts. whores
then, was the inviolability of their security, or their seenSity at
all i• Nest came a statemeut that it was jot to unite the hearts of
all his Majesty's subjects in one and the semointersto; bet Paris-
assent, it seemed, was to be an reception. f*Me Bali en them all
• by the ears. His Lordship then alluded to the provisions is the
- Bill for Rodual Catholic commissions, and said that the title "peek
of nonsense," by whicka Noble Friend of his had described it, was
full as respectabiea are as It deserved. What security against the Jain-
es ice of Rome was afforded by three Commie:Misers, who t*enadves
refused to acknowledge an undivided allegiance to the Sovereign=
1 beCconntiesitio had been proposed 114 a oecurity,t, t that amounted
to no security M. his mind, as this Commission was to be composed
of Roman Catholic Prelates, and neither -the Ilisweeeign nor the
Government was to have any direct interference whatever in the
appointments a loch they might think proper to make: Ile for
axe could never agree to this Bill, for he had repsnedly here and I
ehewbere declared that no foreign Prince or Peanuts bath or I
ought to have any jurisdiction ist this country. Two • eminent
lawyers one a distinguished lawyer from •Iretand, and mother of
this cr.triltry, aided by a Mt. J. K. I. (a great friend Of the Chard I
no doubt—so great a friend that be would gladly pull it down in
order to build up a new ore)—( Hear and a latego)--rehae Geode
men explained awsy. the spiritual jurisdiction by.sayines that this
jurisdiction orient a lurisdkttoo nut recognised by low. This was A
certainly a very oriole and jesuitical distinction, but was 'not one
by any means satisfactory to his mind, or one' that would induce
him to dispense with the qualibettians which were at -present
requisite to be takeri, and in the sense to which they were
taken, as qualifications to places of political power—(Hear, hear).
The oath of alltgiatice, be contended; could no longer be taken
consistently with truth. according to Load Hale. the oath of
allegiance included the oath of -supremacy. He could net possibly
give his consent to any measure that derogated from the supremacy
of the Sovereign. It was said that the jurisdiction of the Pope in
this country as ecknowledged by the Bodkan 4tholics, was merely
spiritual; but he the (Lord Chancellor) weld *Gehring his mind
to understand what was meant by mertly spirittudjudediction. If
re o Catholics here were married by a Protestant _Oarsman, the
I' would force Mem to live smolder, and the CORIUM) LW would
o.di e them to live together. Now, was not that eterdeini a tem.
pus' jutisdiition? lie did not thinleetat in the discussion bare or
elsewhere, the .
question had been as largely pet as
iehr.
Thcould hey not Mss i Illoglisb Catholics what they to
Kau !rah t that they would be booms! to put tbaosher • ter,
tit this country on an equal foodeg with the Catholics so that it
would ultiatiately arose to this--that all the bulwarks and fames
*MA. theft antamors bad provided for the safety of the Protestant
'Church wield -turn out to be wholly useless. 'But • let their
Lords) iph leeway what they
.weret delis If they took these away.
Ai to-tse measure to siren salaries and stipends ICI the Pekoe
of the Itomati Catholic Unitas, nrold'idwie ILordships refuse them
in that c..se to dated persons of Aber persuasfirw? and it they.
Slanted dimer-in Ireland. thermuid cos refuse.**•
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