Star.
London, England, 1830-03-24 00:00:00

INDIA.

Sir JOHN LOWTHER p►eeented a petition from the inhabi.
nant* of Carlisle, in favour of a free trade to India.—Ordered to be
printed.

Clio MIDIAL LAWS.

Mr. DUODALE presented--a
petition from the magistrates,
clergy, merchants, " bankers," manufacturers, and inhabitants of
Birmingham, praying • revision of the criminal laws, and against
the punishment of death for forgery. The Hon. Member observed
that it gave him pleasure to see the " bankers" coming forward to
join in this and similar petitions, as they had been represented as
adverse to any alteration in the law for the crime of forgery.
The petition au ordered to be printed.
Mr. RAMSDRN, in the absence of the member for Yorkshire
presented a petition from the inhabitants of Yorkshire, praying for
reeenchment, is reduction in all public officers' salaries and passim,
and ter a reduction of the taxes.

Mr. CAVENDISH presented a petition from the farmers and
inhabitants of Blythe, in Sussex, against the tax on malt.—Ordesed
to be printed.
Mr. 310NCIE presented a petition from a town in Ireland (the
name of which we could not hear), praying that a parliament be
held in Ireland once in three yearx—(A laugh.)
Mr. lIONCIC presented a petition from sertain persons in the
city of London, of the Jewish persuasion, for the removal of their
civil disabilities.

The hon. MEMBER presented a similar petition from a Roman
Catholic Clergyman of Ireland, complaining of arts 23 and U
Geo. 111. affecting the Jews in that country.--Laid on the table.

IMIGRATION.
The Marquis of CHANDOS prevented a petition from a hundred
in Buckinghamshire, complaining of the existing distre►s amongst
the working and lower orders of society, and praying that govern.
ment would hold out proper encouragement to those classes to emi.
grate to foreign colonies.
Mr. WU...Hu T HORTON assured the noble marquis that be
hoped to he able to bring on his motion on the subject of emigra-
tion, which stood for the 4th of May next, under circumstances of
encouragement and support which might lead to the completion of
the petitioners' wishes. If the house received his propositions on
the subject of emigration favourably, he pledged himself to take the
sense of the house on them, should he experience In any quarter an
opposition he did not contemplate.
Mr. PORTMAN thought it high time the government should
come to some deci.lon as to the pert it ought now to take, and the
mode it should point out for adoption by the country, relative to the
prospect there might exist of relieving the poor.rates of this country
by holding out inducements to the indigent to emigrate.
Sir THOMAS FRE3IANTLE supported the prayer of the
petition, and thought it highly improper that, when there was
so fine a field for the exertion of industry in our colonies abroad,
so many thousands of poor should be employed in breaking stones
on the road-side.

Mr. Secretary PEEL said he believed his right honourable
friend had nearly matured all the preliminary of the
system he meant to propose to parliament on truslubject of
emigration—such as the pointing out the most desirable and
healthful situations in North America, and the projected
stations for provincial agents of emigration at the several
outpons. As to the other question, whether parishes should
be called on to impose rates in furtherance of the projected removal
of the poor by emigration ; or, in other words, to forward the plan
by enabling the landowners and overseers of the poor of each parish
jointly to mortgage the poor-rates, to Assisi in getting the surplus
population to emigrate : it was a question of some delicacy, and his
majesty's government ought to be allowed to entertain an opinion
for themselves upon a question of that nature. He, however, be-
lieved that every species of information that was desirable on such
a subject had been collected with great cars by his right honour.
able friend. He should not now prejudice the question_ by en.
tering into the discussion, further than to my he was ratislia that
no inquiry had been conducted more satisfactorily than that prose.
cited by the Committee on the Poor Laws. If any professional
person, well acquainted with the subject, would attempt to consoli.
elate the laws on the subject of the poor, the matter would be, he
imagined, much better managed than through the medium of the
interference of his Majesty's 3linisten, and probably lead to more
satisfactory results.
Mr. RI DLET COLBORNE concurred in the propriety &some
definitive arrangement of this difficult subject being attempted as
speedily as possible.
Col. WOOD believed the evils complained of arose in a great
degree out of the mal.administration of the poor laws, more pant.
cularly in the southern counties of England.
The petition was read and laid on the table.
CIVIL insasibiTtes OF THE JEWS.
A lung conversetion wok place as to the propriety of postponing
the motion of Mr. It. OR aNT, relative to the civil disabilities of
Penes.* of tile Jewish persuasion, on the ground that a more impor.
taut subject—namely, the adjourned debate, on the motion of Mr.
Daveriemee, respecting the distress of the manufacturing and
44ncidettral cleans—also stood on the paper for this evening, end
one in other must give place &r the sake of public convenience. In
thee conversation llr. ESTCOURT, Mr. Secretary PEEL, Mr. R.
Lease, the CulaeczbLoa of the EXCHEQUER, and Dr. Limn.
teoTus: took pan, and it was agreed the motion should be pat.
Potted to a day which the CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER would
tit on prior to the Easter holydays.
Amseired SOTH EKON presented a petition from the owners of
lands in Nottinghamshire, and Mr.W. HARVEY from those of
tolehrster, praying the interference of the legislature in removing
dee caosee of the present distress.—Both writ otdered to be printed.
atter a few words from Mr. Hume, Mr. O'Courittb, and Mr.
DATIL bY,
On the motion of Sir T. FREMANTLE, returns were ordered of
the butter inputted irom Ireland, end butter and cheese imported
fruit, foretell ports into England, during the last year.
Sir '. BARING presented a petition from the owners of land in
the neightsturhood or the borough of Chipping Wickham, corn.
planting adisurrv4 generally in 'hat district.
iIr.WE•TERN ',resented a similar petition from the hundred
01 Meek thew, in the county of Norfolk.
oti the motion of Mr. BERNARD. a return was ordered of the
moneys paid to the officers and servant. of the Trinity House for a
err i'riud.
Lunt M -HP. TH brought up the report of the Committee on
Nllrtlll/4, Road. —laid on the table.
Mr. Di NIStrN presented a petition from the freeholder* of the
comity et burley, praying for a further redumon of tazation, and
t'.r Parliamentary reform. The Honourable Member observed
that tie currency question was quite as important, under the pre-
sent circumstances of the country, as the Catholic question had
fir`"'' snti the sooner it was taken into consideration the better.
lir recominended a reduction of the assessed taxes, of the colonial
riptiuliture, of the dead weight, and of the tax upon coals; and
a those reductiaa were allowed he had no doubt that the spirit.
"'trey, situ resource* of the country, would bear it triumphant
ev.r veer), difficulty.
Mr PA LEM ER bore testimony to the respectability of the peti-
t,,
' abet concurred a concurred with his 110111. colleague in thinking that re-
u mTheime might go, and ought to go, still further.
petition was onitral to lie on the table.
Mr. C. PALLMEIt presented a petition from the labourers of
D.trtubib* 151,11, in the county of Surrey, complaining of the extent
of the public expenditure.—Orderrd to lie on the, table.
Sir H. PARNELL 1140Vld fur an account of all moneys expended,
doting the last five year*, upon the dainties of the united kingdom,
and their respixiire establishments —Ordered.
Sir M. 1.. RIDLEY patented a petition from the churchwardens
userseens of Newcastle upon Tyne, respolailthe rating of
WWII for the poor rate to s. Ordered lie as the
Mr. CARTEL: pre.ented a pennon from the borough of Rye,
of an undue election. Ora:root° Be on the table.
WAltill/hIC/N pee•ented a pendia from the physicians

and surgeons of the town of Sheffield, coneaniag the supply of eaw
tomical subjects.
Mr. MA ItSti %LL supported the payer of the petition, and
hoped that the prejudices at present entertained would not long be
op to to a satisfactory arrongement.
The petition was ordered to lie on the table.
Dirt R. GRANT fired his nodos relative to the disabilities under
which persons of the Jewish passed= laboured at tee present day
for Monday the sth of April.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER hoped that, as he
had given up the precedent:eon that day to Mahon. friend, the house
would not think It unreasonable if the government availed them-
selves of the Wednesday following.
Lord NUOENT presented a petition from Mr. Thomas Wilson,
architect, praying the consideration of the house to a plan for the
erection of a cemetery in the metropolia.--Ordered to lie on the
table.

Lord P. L. GOWER *abed leave to bring in a bill to eons*.
colidste the several acts repealing the bounties on fisheries.
The order of the day for resuming the adjourned debates on the
distress of the country having been read,
Mr. HUSRISSON said that, before the house proceeded to the
order of the day, he wished to allude to a subject which affected
his own character, and in some degree the character of the house.
He was aware that the greatest exertion was made by the public
press to give the speeches which took place in that house to the pub.
lie, and he believed that the task was performed Industriously and
honestly. He was aware also of the inconvenience under which it was
often performed, and particularly in crowded houses, and upon
late debates. In the debate which took place on the subject of Por-
tugal, he had compared the oppressor of Portupl with our own
Richard 111. and stated that if a struggle should arise between his
party and that of the rhtful Queen, he hoped fee the sake of high
lineage and royal blood, that he would disport one of the charges
against him by closing his life with an act of courage. This ob.
serration was to the effect he had just stated, but in a paper of the
following day he was made to state in one sentenee—undesignedly,
he was sure—that he wished Don Miguel might dies death of vio-
lence. Had he seen the passage sooner, he would have called the
attention of the house •gt it before, as it seemed to countenance and
recommend what every Englishman would shrink from with horror,
the crime of assassination. He had no motion to make upon the
subject, nor any thing farther to do than to dunk the house for the
attention with which they had heard him.

STATE OF TUE COUNTRY.
The order for resuming the adjourned debate was then reed.
Mr. O'CONNELL sail be owed an apology to the house es one
of those who had been instrumental in causing the debate to last fee
another night. But he had a great apology to offer—it was, that
he felt it a duty which he owed his constituents not to let the debate
close without stating his opinion on the important subject before
them. The Irish members constituted more than one-seventh
of the house, and he must say that, with the exception of the
honourable member for Louth, no Trish member had yet
spoken. He therefore rose now to enforce upon their attention
the necessity of so inquiry. Inquiry alone was sought—but
rather than lose it as it was let out in the original proposition of the
hon. member for Shaftesbury, he would vote for the amendment.
He put it seriously to those gentlemen who opposed the motion, upon
what ground it was that they refused inquiry ? Was it to be said that
no sufficient case had been made out for h? Assuredly not. It was
understood that there was distress deep and general in England ; this
was admitted by all. In Scodand it was not denied but that very
great distress prevailed, and in Ireland its existence was beyond the
possibility of doubt. He had himself stated that in Dublin, Cork,
and Random, there had been great distress ' • but since that he was
sorry to say that he was obliged to add the towns of Newry,
Drogheda, and Kilkenny. In these plates there were hundreds and
thousands reduced to a state of absolute starvation. The honourable
and beamed Member for Louth (Mr. Leslie Foster) had taken
upon himself to assert that the distress was but partial in Ireland ;
but what were the sources from which he drew his information? The
Receivers in the Court of Chancery, who, by the terms of their at)-
, poiniment, were bound to collect the one Mtlf.year as soon as the
, other became due---(hear). And this was the only evidence which
he aired of the condition of the poor in Ireland. He was aware
it might be said that there was already a Committee
ittctilent upon
the subject of Ireland up stairs. But that Committee directed Its at.
tention only to the means of relieving the absolute paupers of the
country, but did not touch the condition of those whose distresses
were, If possible, still greater—those who were ashamed to
beg, and unable to obtain a living by labour. It was not of
the number of the absolute mendicants in Ireland that he can.
plained ; perhaps at other dates their number some as great as it is
now ; but the reduced conditions of the middle classes, by whom
the wants of the lower classes used to be &applied, was now the
subject of complaint. In former years, when the manufacturers In
that exotic commodity, silk, were in distress, 20001. or 20,0001.
were collected amongst the gentry and shopkeepers of Dublin
for their relief; but in the last year not mom than 3,0001. could
be raised, and of that the Lord Lieutenant contributed 8001. from
hie own purse. This was the worst feature in the pawl
distress in Ireland. The people asked for inquiry into the
causes of this distress; they had a right to demand it. It was
the business of this House to afford relief, for our business could
not be exclusively to Cote away the money of the people for sup.
porting armies, but to make the people comfortable. The French
Parliament were more considerate to their constituents. In the late
Address which they presented to the King, and which did them
great honour, they noticed the falling off in the revenue, and de-
' clared their determination to inquire into the distress which it ne.
eessarily evidenced. He was sure a body of English, Irish, and
i Scotch Gentlemen would be as ready to relieve their country.
men as the Members of the French Chamber. The Right
Honourable Gentleman opposite (Mr. Goulburn) said that
he had given relief to the amount of 3 600,0001. by the repeal of
! taxes. To him (Mr. O'Connell,) however, it wee a curious way
of relieving people in a state of immediate distress, that, if they
chanced to live till October next, they would have beer more
cheap. But what had the right honourable gentleman done for Ire-
land ? Worse than nothing. Supposing that he had taken of
47,000!. in the way of the leather tax, had he not added 110,0001.
in the duty on stamps, and 30,000/. or 40,0001. upon spirits ? this
was giving relief with a vengeance. And this mode of relieving
was toot the act of an Irish Psoliament. His (Mr. O'C.'a) country.
men knew better than to blunder in this way, calling an human
of taxation a relief, and telling us, when they wanted to lighten the
load, that the best way was to make us carry double. (A laugh.)
But this was not all. He had heard it said, even in this house,
that Ireland had nut been sufficiently taxed. This he denied. If
the rental of England had been made out as it ought to be, it would
be found that Ireland paid too much taxes by contributing four
millions. Let it be recollected that in addition to the taxes, there
was a million spent in grand jury jobbing, tithes, churches, ote.
besides the very large portion of its • income which was spent
out of the country by absentees. The principal opposition to
this motion had been made by the right honourable Secretary
of state. That right bon. gentleman (Mr. Peel) had made an able
and luminous speech. and never, to his recollection, had he beard •
document more completely answered than that produced by the right
hon. member foe Liverpool (Mr. Iluskisson), respecting savings'
banks, had been. The right hon. gentleman's speech was alto ha-
mourous. He had no objection to this. It was well, though misery
should prevail out of doors, that merriment reigned within; sad k
was a consolation that, though there were starving artisans and a
pauper population abroad, within these walls we had facetious privy
counsellors and laughing legislators--(hear and laughter). The
right honourable gentleman's principal grounds of opposition
were, that the motion, if successful, would endanger the stabi-
lity of two principles, which he assumed to be fixed—namely,
free trade and the cunency. But were these fixed ? (hear, hear)—
or, if free trade was one of the causes of the present distress of the
country, why should it not be inquired into as well as any other
subject? He had no wish, he assured the house. to enter upon the
unpopular topic of the currency ; but who could say that it was
settled when we had one currency and one system of banking in
England, another in Ireland, and another in Scotland ? Yet, with
these several variations before our eyes, we' were to be told that the
question of the current., was fixed. The very children in the
streets would laugh at such a statement. He asserted that the al-
teration in the currency had been most prejudkal to Ireland.
Since 1797, all the transactions there, between landlord and tenant,
had been conducted upon the basis of a paper CRUM''' but
the late return to a metallic currency in this country had al-
tered the relations and prices of every thing in that country. The
hon, and learned gent then entered into a vindication of a much.
abused class of men—the middle-men of Ireland—whose residence
in the country counteracted the mischiefs of absenteeism, and
contributed, by their giving employment to the labourers, to keep
in circulation a great sum of money in the neighbourhood. These
were the men, too, who composed the volunteers in Ireleml,
which prevented effectually the introduction of French revolution-
ary principles into that country, and saved the institutions of this.
The effect of the change of currency was plainly shown as regarded
tithes. In :8-13 and 1824 tithe composition acts were passed, which
were intended to give to the minister ooe.tenth, but by the al.
terations in the currency since, he was now actually receiving
me-fifth. He also contended that by government occasionally
giving relief by an issue of paper, they conceded the principle that
a change in the currency might not be injuriously felt. The hen.
and horned member then proceeded to comment upon the at
which had been advanced against the motion. He noticed that of a
gallant officer opposite (Sir H. Vivian), which he stated to be that
low wages were not an evil. He (Mr. O'C.) did not agree in this;
but, if the thing worked uniformly and equally, th. re might be
something in the argument. If be was informed that fleld.nimshalio
and colonels of regiments gave up portions of their Isepe salaries,
he must allow that it would not be very hard *Poo otoshootso to
hare their email incomes alaridged. But, as the argument steed at
ptesent, it seemed to be aimed only at the mechanic' and the pear,
while the wealthy and the great wen- nottratitoti by it. Me (Mr

O'C.) protested against this. The honourable member concluded
by reiterating the several arguments which he hid advanced in fa-
vour of inquiry.
Sir HUSSEY VIVIAN complained of being misunderstood by
the hon. and learned gent. as to the import of his argoment. He
never said a word about low wages 1--what he said was. that low
wages were not abstractedly and necessarily an evil. With respect to
what had been said of the army, he could assure the hoooutable and
learnsd member for Clare that there was nobody in the public ,ey-
elet more willing to make sacrifice* in the public behalf.
Mr. (Ya./NNELL explained—The gallant officer himself must
see that low prices would necessarily lead to low wages—and it was
in that way he had used his argument.
Lord F. lA. GOWER said he had not intended to have spoken
upon this subject, but from the observations which had fallen from
the hon. member for Clare. No man denied the existence of dis-
tress in this country or in Ireland. But, with respect to Ireland,
there was already a committee upon her condition sitting up stairs,
of which the hoc, member was himself a member. He was not
prepared to say that the punctual payment of rents was a prtof of
prosperity ; on the contrary, to say the most of It, it was of very
doubtful authority, especially as to the state of Ireland. With
respect to the commercial parts of Ireland, he would ask if
discounts and loans could not be easily bad by any man who
had any property ? He would ask if there was any general
stagnation in the state of property now to what it was only ten
years ago. In 1820 he first visited Ireland, and the best asses
ciations were connected with it. His real had not since abated ;
he was now a salaried officer of the Crown ; but when he should
tease to be so his services would be devoted to that country. There
were no less than thirty.five steam vessels sailing from the port of
Dublin, seventeen of which sailed for Liverpool, and this could not
be done for nothing. The number of passengers coming to Eng.
land bad materially increased; and there was a ba'ance of pauper-
ism in 'farina of Ireland to the amount of 21,000 persons. Imemal
navigation hail also greatly improved in Ireland, and one conclusion
he would draw and only one, from the few circumstances he had
stated, was, do tot. disturb her by inquiries which can lead to no
Let Ireland be allowed to exert her own great energies—let's
ittilexLgreat measure which had so recently and so wisely passed work
Ito own good ; and of that measure he would ray that it was the i
moral panacea of Ireland. The great hopes from that measure
was that British capital would flow into Ireland, and he had letters
before him which convinced him the fact would have been so, if in
1824 the high hopes which had been excited had not been fruit-
tested by the administration of Lord Liverpool. The capital then
remained in this country; but now, however, be had reason to
know that there was every disposition to invest English capita in
land in Ireland, and he hoped it would be effectually carried into
effect.—(Hear )_lt; on the whole, inquiry was vet, properly re.
stated as to the state of England, he considered it still more unne-
cessary for Ireland. Under these circumstances, he certainly felt
himself bound to oppose the motion.

Mr. BEAUMONT said he would recommend the ori-
ginal motion to be withdrawn. This was a question in.
yawing a censure of his Majesty's ministers, to which he
for one would not be a party. Minima, had shewn every
disposition to do their duty conscientiously and sincerely, and
he thanked them for it. He regretted, howeverphat more had not
been done in the shape of a reduction of taxes. It was of no use
to say that they would do more If they could, for th.tt could be no
answer to the sufferings of the people. The remedy to be looked to
was a simple one—a very great reduction of taxes. He would cut
down all the establishments of the country to the lowest scale, and
if distress still continued, he would then boldly say to the fund.
holder-6, Share with us the diminution of our means."
Mr. W. PE Eli denied that there had been any assertion made on
the part of the government that no distress existed. He thought the
government ought not to act the part of alarmists, but to continue
their good work of reducing the expenditure of the country and re-
lieving it from its burthena. He hoped never to see the day when
the issue of one U. notes would be again permitted, and wished
that the Chancellor of the Exchequer would add a million to his
budget by a tax on those who spent their money abroad, awkwardly
aping the vices and follies of foreigners, only to be laughed at, and
then complained that the foreign policy of the government had yen.
dried Englishmen unpopular on the continent. He thought that
no man was justified in saying that there was a revolutionary spirit
abroad in the country, and that nothing was so likely to sow dis-
loyalty and disaffection, where nothing but loyalty existed, as such
assertions made in that house. He had every confidence in the re.
sources of the country, and in the speedy return of its prosperity. Re
should therefore vote against am inquiry which could do no good.
Mr. BEAUMONT explained.
Sir T. GOOCH raid he should vote against the Committee, be-
cause ha thought no good could come from it. He was grateful to
the Government for what they had done in the remission of taxes,
and he thought no prudent man would desire to see them remit any
greater amount during the present year. They had, however, only
taken one step in the good work, and he trusted they would redeem
their pledge, and proceed in it until the country was relieved. He
was of opinion that the taxes pressed unfairly upon the labouring
deates, and did not sufficiently reach those who possessed the cont.
forts and the luxuries of life. He should be &Towable to a modi-
fied Property Tax, which would relieve the lower classes and reach
those who were better: able to bear the burthen. He opposed the
appointment of a Committee, because he thought It a delusion and a
humbug.
The Marquis of BLANDFORD said that he could not refuse
I his consent to a motion which had for its object an inquiry Into the
&ore-saes of the country. He was unwilling that, by silence on
such an occasion, he should be deemed insensible to those distresses.
He was of opinion that the only proper remedy to be adopted, under
I the present circumstances of the country, was to be found in a re.
duetion of taxation to the'arnount of ten or twelve millions, mem-
ponied by a reduction of expense in all departments of the state.—
He alto, for one, should consent to government imposing• tax upon
capitaL If ministers did not adopt such • course the people had
but little to hope from their representatives in that house. They
had nothing to expect front the sympathies of the other house, and
it should he their last and only expedient to assemble from one end
of the country to the other ; and respectfully, but firmly, to present
addnases to the throne, descriptive of the utter wherry to which
they had been reduced, and which they could no longer patiently
endure.

Mr. I.IENNA HD said that he believed the government had
taken the only right view of the distresses of the counuy, and
were in earnest in adopting the only remedy, which was an ionise.
dime and an extensive reduction of taxes. He thought many other
reduction a ought to take place in our expenditure He would not
vote foe the motion because he would not lend himself tea delusion.

General 0 ISCOYNE admitted that there was no distress in Li.
vespool, but said that in the country round it, the distress was as
great as in any part of the kingdom. The reason why the labouring
population of Liverpool were not distressed was, that they were all
employed at the present moment upon the public works there ring
on. The proprietors of the Liverpool and Manchester Railway
could scarcely find labourers to carry uo their work. It was, there.
fore, mast fallacious to infer what the state of the whole country was
from the state of a portion of it, so accidentally employed. The
very remission of taxes which the Government bad announced was a
proof of the tottensive character of the distress. He thought the
metaphor 4.64 doctors did not apply so well to the case u an-
other. He should say that instead of a consultation of doctors, it
was mere She the case of a jury empanelled to inquire whether the
medicine administered by his Right Hon. Colleague and the Right
Honourable Secretary of State, had not caused the death of the pa-
tient. He would ask what was to be done with the Petitions of
the people, now upon the table, if they were mat inquired into?
Unless the government took them into their consideration, hereafter i
the people would have no hope, and it would be useless foe them to
approach that house again. The time must come wheel gentlemen
would have to answer for the votes of that night, and sure he was
that those votes would be well remembered from one cad of the
country to the other. As long as he had a seat in that house he
would never be found to vote apinst inquiry into the distress of the
people.
Sir F. BURDETT said that the petitions of the people had
been insuldngly, as he thought., subverted by ktters • written
individuals, and produced from the pockets of members of that
hottest. The Teal pith of the question was, whether or not
high prices could be maintained. Those who asserted that they
could not, had failed to make out that proposition. He believed
that they could not do so. The honourable baronet, the mem.
ber for Suffolk, notwithstanding his refusal now to vote far an
inquiry by that house, which he described as a humbug upon
the people did, in the year 1821, propose a resolution of
the same et:Ratter, and almost in the same words, when the agri.
cultural classes alone were distressed, and that resolution was
adopted by the house. Not only was the resolution adopted,
but it was followed by an Wire of one.pound notes, and by a
revival or prosperity throughout the country. The honourable
baronet reviewed the contractions of • the currency at different
periods, and said they had uniformly produced the greatest
distress and suffering to the country. Yet, in spite of Ueda ex-
perience, the righthonourable gentleman hud forced upon them
his golJen idol, which, it seemed, ail. the eouutry were to
fall down and worship. He thought, however, that they should
be mole besotted than the Israelites, when they set up the calf in
Horeb, if they suffered their reason and common sense to be cheated
by words without meaning, such as " fictitious happiness" and
" dirty rap." He should be very glad to be restored to the Seri.
dome happiness which the country possessed is the years 1812,1813,
and 1814, up to the very end of the poslipee expensive war in
(ditch the country was last engaged. It ww to talk of taxation
having tiny thing to do with the ehoese which the matey had
undergone since that peeled. Whets she ooppottol so toomosoo
expenditure, and west on itteressing bet wealth Is se esesempled
degree. He could not agree with his noble Need, the mombee
fee Northarpron that these were times as that this was a soak Ili
which diet msgls; to refuse to lima PS the prim et the tellies

I people, fet fear of their votes heists coasteued into a censure apes
minima. He saw nothing that was to mike him so sender of ca.
oaring the givrernmens when he heard a prime minister convict him-
self of mob a disacqoaintanoe with the oonwnereial concerns et the
moire se to me. that with 111.00.01101. of gold circulation tithe
Maid be as great an amount of circulating medium in the came; as
when the circulation was all carried on In paper. These were not
times in which they. could afford to be so scrupulously alive I keep-
ing any set drool in their places, and he confessed that other hear-
ing such a statement as that to which he had alluded, his alarms
' went entirely the other way. He was rather inclined so adopt the
sentiments of Lord Chatham, when, upon seeing a list of the (1(.-
1 penile appointed at the breaking out tithe French war, he olvativetk •
I " I don't know what it may do with the enemy, but it makes me
tremble." He could act upoa not inch feelings ss those which
had been expressed by his noble Mend. They were arrived at
the point when the salus impull, the supremo Ira, ought to
come into play, and he could be guided by no other considerations
in disposing of such a question as that now before them. He hoped
they were not to be so fooled nut of their mama and comnion sense
by empty words as to be afraid Of being called chests and rogues
foe wishing to pay a debt in the same money in which it was con-
tracted. He was sanctioned in this by the highest law authority in
the country; by an authority in matters of law and equity. which
no man in the kingdom, be he layman or of the law. would call in
queetiolt—he meant the opinion of Lord Eldon. The right him.
eceretort _hod declared. in his speech on Friel iy night, that it was
the settled-policy of the government that the landed interest must
remain permanently depressed. (6, No," from Mr Peel.) That
was what the right hon. gentleman's argument declared.
Mr. Secretary PE t.L—s• I said no such thing. I did not."
Sir F. BURDETT understood the Right Hoa. Gentleman to
say that the Landed Interest must no more look for war prices. and
he (Sir F. Burdett) contended that wilhout high priers it was im.
possible out that the Larded Interest must remain di-pressed. lie
called upon the la-cled Gentlemen to remember th a. and would say
to them in the language of a beautiful poet-.-
`• Are we, compelled by fate's unjust decree,
No more our homes and pleasant fields to sea?
Or shall we mount again our rural throne,
And rule again the kingdom once our owt ?
He woold maintain that the land was the root from which all the
other interests sprang, and that without a prosperous landed interest
it was id's.: to 'elk of other interests being successful. He believed
that all the interests of the country would still prosper and flourish tf
the right hon. gentleman were not to cram his gold down their
throats whether they would or no. They did nut want gold. Gold
was all the evil ; yet the house had chosen it as Midas did, and,
like the choice of Midas, their choice had been followed by
.the punishment of starvation ; and for his part be did not see why
they should not be crowned in the same way—Atiriefflas
pis soil habit. He maintained that high prices might just as
well be had in time of pace as in time of war ; and that high prices
formed the only remedy for the distress of the country. The dis-
trait was owing to two distinct causes, which affected the highest
and the lowest. That being so. be could not be satisfied with the
mode of inquiry proposed. lie thought, however, that either of
the motions might be adopted. His hope was that Hon. :isemliers
would not decide that distress was beyond the controul of Pu-
liament, thereby adding despair to the misery of the people.
Mr. Secretary PEEL thought it necessary to notice a most ex.
tranrdinary misconception on the part of the hon. baronet, of what
had fallen from him the other night. The hon. baronet had paid
that he ( Mr. Peel) had avowed that it was part of his policy to de.
press the landed interest. All who had heard him with attention
must be convinced be said no such thing. He said a great deal
of bad land had been !nought into cultivation, and that he could
not avoid feeling for the individuals who were endeavouring to keep
up their respectability and station in society by the produce of
such lands.

Sir F. BURDETT said he did not mean to impute to the right
hon. gentleman any intent to recommend such a system of policy.
His meaning was, that the policy and principles the right hon. gen.
denten was determined to putsue would materially lead to it.
3lr. PEEL observed, that he had merely expressed his regret
that the cultivators of bad soil should suffer.
Sir. F. GOOCH also complained that the hon. baronet had mis-
represented what he said.
Sir F. BURDETT explained.
Mr F. LEWIS deprecated the argument of the honourable bare.
with respect to the eurrettee. When the hon. baronet praised the
Bank Restriction Act, he was opposing the best interests of the
country. The doctrines of Mr. Hume and Mr. Tooke had been
perverted. If the hon. baronet looked to restriction of gold currency
as a panacea, and expected the landed interest to be supported at
the expense of other interests, he would be disappointed in his ex-
pectation. The hon. ban, must know that the bank restriction met.
sure had failed from its own weakness. The currency was restored
to Its power in 1816. and it created a convulsion of distress never
before known. Tite Honourable Baronet said they might have what
prices they liked. They must leave real prices. They might have
nominal prices, but the value of products would remain the same.
If an equitable adjustment was to be expected, would any Gentle.
man say what the standard was to bey The dream in the heads of
wandering speculators was that they were to have a fluctuating on.
certain currency. The doctrines of the Hon. Baronet upon that
subject were not founded upon a system of plain practicable dealing
with the country.
Mr. STANLEY opposed the motions for inquiry In committee,
on the ground that It would produce no beneficial effect It a ape-
cific proposition on the currency or any other question were sub.
mined, he would meet it fairly.
Mr. WESTERN said there could be no doubt that distress per.
vaded the country, and the question was, whether the petitions of
the people ought to be thrown under the table. He contended that
they ought so enquire into the general distress. It they 6Y not it
would be an lough to the country. There would be dissatisfaction
from one end of the country to ;be other. During the period which
has elapsed since 1816, there had been a constant depreciation of all
the products of industry, occasioned by a change in the monetary
system.
Colonel WILSON opposed the motion. After the proposed
inquiry he thought they would fled themselves just where they
began. What were they to inquire into? Was it the dieter*
of the country ? That had been sufficiently ascertained. Ile
was much better satisfied with his Majesty's Government than
he had been. If any one had told him, a few evenings since,
that Ministers would lake of five millions of taxes, be would
not have believed bi.n. It had been insinuated that he was
sneaking to Ministers. He warted neither place nor pension.
He would have none of the loaves and Hetes. (A laugh.) His
Majesty's Ministers should have his support whilst their efforts
were for the relief of the country. If he had been Prime
minister—(a laugh,) he would have taken off the assessed taxes and
established awe regulated property tax. That was his idea, but
still he believed his majesty's ministers had done all they could.
But for the good done by his majesty's ministers they might have
sat debating in that house, and they would have been just our of the
mud into the mire..--(a laugh) The pzoof of the pudding was is
the eating of it. That was the fact.—(Cries of " Question.")
3lr' D. W. HARVEY said he should not trespass now on the
time of the house, the subject having been exhausted after so many
nights' debate. All the petitions nearly were unanimous as to the
mode of relief they prayed for, and that was a repeal of taxes, and
the substitution in some cases of others less buithensonse that; the
resat. He was astonished to hear the member for Westminster.
the advocate atilt rights of the people, assert that taxation was if
little import, sod that the only effectual relief would be high ices.
He could easily overthrow the reasoning of the hon. baronet Sir F.
Saida° ; but at that late hour he should not trespass further on
their attention._

Mr.TRANT rose amidst loud ales of " question" and "spoke."
If he was not heard he should that instant propose an adjournment.
He was pledged to a large body of gentlemen in the City yesterday
to "arm his opinion and their* on the subject. (Cries of" ques-
tion.' ) He would tell the noble lord that he was not to be put
down. (Cries of" name.") The opinion of these gentlemen was that
distress did exist to an mormous amount in the counny, and they
wished to have an opportunity of proving the fact. The Right
Hon. Gentleman (Mr. Iluskis,on) in a letter written by hint in
1814, on the corn laws spoke of the evils that would arise ream a
low price of agricultural produce. He wculd recommend to that
Right Hon. Gentleman to return to these Pound doctrines which be
furmerly maintained.
Mr. lIONCK said the only remedy wee the reduction of expen-
diture and the consequent reduction of taxes. To be able to com-
pete with foreign manufacturers they must repeal the unnatural
c ten law He must oppose Ibis Inquiry, as he felt satisfied that it
would end in nothing.
Mr. BENETT said he should vote for inquiry, but mot from any
hostile feeling to ministers.
Mr. Alderman THOMPSON said he was a member of the body
alluded .4) by the member for Dover ( %:r. Tram), and be must erter
his pieta( against the idea that that committee attributed the dia.
tress to the ;immures of the member fur Liverpool. lie must bow.
ever admit that distrait; very generally prevailed. 1 hat was the
ease in Leeds sad the neighbourhood, as he could state from
private communications in contradiction to what fell from the
honourable member (Mr. [reins). He denied that the manufacture
of 'lron watt extended if late, and he knew minima were embarked
In that trade saprodiatively fur the last Lay year.. It was no rout
of prosperity that the nuinufieturet went' on pndueing. He felt
quite coneissed that the new systems of banking supsosted would
utterly fail. The evil ma, that bankers had sow no easedetee in
while beeriest% had willeleat ctiaddetwe I. batiketv.' He'
leillittrik thee was /ISMS NN, is clotted', sew, diat it eteit
the eseleety wins thaw 40,11,11,0111 d.
desightlhat the mkt fatal maxim the
flow auM adapt, with a view wi Whetting the dimly* coots* hr
So huts tkpansittee ou the entrag—(hear, hew; tubbed with
••• ' •

• 2, • •

7',

!;

1;1-9j
r
• • -.1-3 ry-
•

eree of question"). If they went into Committee, the cense.
quenee would be that every bank in the country which did not
possess gold enough to meet the full amount of its issues, must
unmediately stop paymeat—(hear, hear.)
Mr. IRVING rosk amid loud cries of "Question,' and " Spoke,
spoke;''' and proceeded for some time, in the midst of confusion, to
reply to the arguments of the hon. member for London.
Sir T. D. ACLAND stated, as member of the committee to
which the hon. member for Dover had referred, that the application
for relief had considerably diminished within the last fortnight.
(The uproar and cries of " Question" were again renewed.)
Mr. EWART explained.
tie. E. DAVENPORT replied at some length, but the noise In
vile House rendered his observations, for the greater part, inaudible
i a the gallery.
Mr. E. DAVENPORT consented to withdraw the original mo-
t inn in favour of the amendment.
The SPEAKER explained that if the original motion was with.
drawn, the amendment must follow, as there was no other motion
before the House.—(Hear, and laughter.)
Mr. PEEL suggested that it was better to divide upon the amend.
ain't, and let the original motion be negatived without a division.
The House then divided, when there appeared—
For the amendment ..
Against it 256
Majority for Ministers.. --ICA
The other Orders of the Day were then disposed of, and the House
adjourned at Half.past Two o'clock.