Star.
London, England, 1813-05-21 00:00:00

period of twenty ear had elapsed, with their wit-
nesses dead and proofs lost ? In his opinion, the pub-
lic faith was pledged to give compensation to these
persons ; and the-House could not refuse it without
acknowledging that it was banbkrupt both in subitance
and in honour.
Mr. WILBERFORCE thought that, where the
interest of individuals was sacrificed to the interest of
the State, the State at large was bound to make that
loss good. Such was the case in the present instance,
and therefore he was in favour of the original motion.
If this was a large sum of money for the State to pay,
it was 3 still larger sum for individuals to lose.
Lord CASTLEREAGH agreed, that if the jus-
tice of the claim of these individuals could be esta-
blished, the magnitude of the sum could not be con-
sidered as an object. He, however, agreed perfectly
in all the arguments which had been advanced by his
Right Hon. Friends (Mr. Bathurst and Mr. Vansit-
tart) against the claims being granted, which, con-
sistent with justice towards the State, he was of opi-
nion could not be justified. These persons had given
up all hopes of recovering any part of their claim at
the time Lord Liverpool undertook their cause, and
thereicre when he received £600,000 of this bad debt
for them, could it be supposed that Lord Liverpool,
or the parties themselves, contemplated.that he was
saddling the State with a debt of £860,000. When
Lord Liverpool recovered for these persons £600,000
which they never expected, was it imagined, that by
so doing a claim would be given to them to come
and d.p their hands in the public purse for the re-
mainder? if such a doctrine were once established,
it would render Government exceedingly careful how
it iinei iered rn behalf of individuals in future. For
these reasons he should oppose the motion.
Mr. FINLAY conceived, that the debts due by
the MerchaLts had been assumed by the two Govern-
ments in ilieir conveations.• ' The amotiot of the
claims of the British Merchants was perfectly known
by loud Liverpool at the time of the last convention.
Mr. MARItYAT observed, that in questions of
this nature, respecting claims of individuals. the
Members were always exposed to a considerable deal
rivatc solicitation. After bestowing a deal
of atteutien to this subject, he must say; that ap-
peared to him that the claim was not well founded.
He would ask, what was the real value of those debts
ackruieledgd clue in 1782, but of which not a far•
thing had been received in 1791 ? Yet it was on ac.
count of those bad debts that £600,( Of) had been ob-
tained in 179.1; but that was now sought to be made
a foundation for a much larger claim upon this court-
try.: He thought that many other Merchants, who
had suffered by the ill faith of foreign Governments,
had an equal riht to claim compensation from the
Government of d.is country.
Mr. LOCKHA R T replied, that if the debts had
become desperate in 1794, America on that account
awed a reparation to this country, whin, if Govern-
ment did not think proper to insist upon, individuals
ought not to suffer upon that account.
The Hasse. divided. For the Motion 87—Against
it 100—Majoi ity 13.
LEATHER 'TAX.
On our re admission into the Gallery,
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER
teas addressing the House on the second reading of
the 811 for repealing the tax. If it was put merely
on the ground of repealing a tax which pressed upon
the lower rdcrs, there were many other taxes which
he would prefer repealing. The taxes upon houses,
windows, and coals,-also pressed upon the people,
and they could only be supported on the ground of
its being imp. asible to do without axes which did
not press upon the poor in some degree. The revenue
of last year had been less productive than formerly,
and the circumstances of the times were such, as not
to allow us to give up any part of our fixed revenues.
He thought that even from the evidence, it appeared
bat the Petitioners bad suffered very little from the
to;; but they, like every other class a men in trade,
bad probably suffered from the depression of trade in
general. The shoemakers might be in distress, not
on account of the tax, but from those causes which
Ikad lowered the earnings of the poor in other lines.
He believed that Stafford had not at present any of
the Government business ; but perhaps by extending
somt of it to that town, this particular distress might
be in sorie measure relieved. The disturbances in
the neighbourhood of the River Plate was a sufficient
reason for the pot importing so many hides in the last
year as in the former years. As to the tanners (al-
though the business was stated as so very bad), yet
their number had constantly increased from 1803
to 1812.
Lord ALTHORPE reminded the House, that
the tax was imposed last year at a very late period
of the Session, when there was but a thin attendance
of Members, and carried only by a majority of eight.
-s—The Petitioners, therefore, appealed from a small
part of the House to the whole.
Mr. PHILLIPS said, that this tax did not press
in the same manner as the house tax and the win.
dow tax, which fell heaviest upon the rich ; but
being laid on the weight of the material employed, it
pressed heaviest upon the poor. He thought, that a
tax so unpopular, both in the House and out of it,
ought not to be continued.
Lord CASTLEREAGH conceived that his
Right Hon. Friend (the Chancellor of the Exche-
quer) had acted with the greatest candour upon this
tax, in submitting to such a length of detailed exa-
minations on the part of the petitioners. It was well
known that the persons brought forward on such ex.
aminations had usually some bias on their minds.—
Unless it was said that the country had such a super-
abundant revenue as to afford a .reduction of taxes,
he saw nothing it the principle upon which this tax
was sought to be repealed that might not be applied
more 4trongly to the case of other taxes. As to the
peculiar pressure upon the poor, it WcIS evident that
even in the article of shoes, a rich man who wore
more of them would pay a higher tax than the poor
man ; but when it w,,s recollected in how many
ether ways leather was used, in carriages, saddler}',
&c. be thought it would not be easy to find a tax
that would be distributed in a more proportional
manner, It this t ix was opposed on any other ground
than merely a relief to the poor, be thought that the
tradesmen had already-indemniffed themselves by an
addition to their prices of three timer the amount of
the tax. It must be recollected also that for some
years back they had got the foreign hides, the raw
menial of their tr44e, from Duclios Ayres; at 4

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