Star.
London, England, 1801-11-04 00:00:00

. •
:0 le;
•.. • ;1111P 0 ..t • ••_, •• . _ .... ,4_ , ,-, ,
•
• i -
110 ••• 4, 1);"",r, ;',ll, • . .
- . .
-. . . . .: ' Ilt $.• . ; , i. • . i°-‘; - - .
~,,. .• , • ) --„, . • . .
. • ••, , ... , . • lik P.
_ .
.
- . , .
~.......______

MALLeftlaNr.fßt. P:MCEANNOS.

confdlent with propritty,',-Or With corder' 'to colt
on the Houfe at once to plunge into abufinefs
on which they didri4kOffefi the nacenbrgyinki-
mation ? and he congaed, that it Was coMpe-
tent for any Noble locate ici spore a quefi)on pre-
vious to the. Order of the Day being oroseeeded
upon.
r
After finite firther, tikuvetfatidn let Ween Vie
Luca Chaneellere die Duke of Bedford; #rd
Grenville," 4c. tbeliCari agreed to proceed upqn
the Ovder Oldie DaY. ,
That part of . his blijeKes Speech iebicb reiat..
lid to the Preliminary-Treaty, end
-'the Treaty if-
Alf, being then read,....
~
Lout It9mOrr 144, 'ilia fall he boned their
Lordffilps would ,coot with him in returtlinit '
thanks to his Makfly far the communication he
had been gracioully -pleated to make to them, 1
they were, be raid, at the date of along and ex.!
pude* ware which, from the great Oct-Wens that
had beep blade in carryit in for the defence
9( ale Conftlfation, had d the.enuntry of a
greet portion of its Wealth. t was not a war ofl
our feeking: it bad *bein forced on the country
by the propagation of principles, which at One
time bad been received and approved of by great
numbers of people.. ,flaviog Elated this, he muff
espreff the great fatisfaaioo he now felt at feting
did& principles abandoned and uhiverfally dii•
liked, not only in Great Britain, but in the
very ;swag with which we had kill made
Peace—the ,rolipg power of which was as ini-
Mical to them is we ourfelves wclc. He was
furry to fay, that ;in "the courfe of the war great'
burthens had been laid on the people ;" but he had
the confolation to retied that ,the country was
eininentlyfuccefsfui in her exertions; and although
France-had eplaiged her territory, and aggran-
dized her plower, ,the refult of the war was not
lets atigantagepus and honourable to. Great Bri-
tain.. Let this war be compafed with others in
which we 4ta4 been engaged ;"let it be compared
with that carried on by the great Lord Chatham ;
and there mufti 'not :be found anYthino, to equal
the ,brilliapt erploits.that bid been atchieved both
by feathdlangia theeciurfe of the contpft ; and at-
no pe,rloti,),dtiring the courfe of the war, did our-
ftice,o:is appear with more fplendour, and become
more detifive, than doring-the courfe of the pre.
fent year. 'This was a happy moment to entertain
thoughts of peace. When our roc:cores were fo
great, it would nqtliive been wife to have puthzd
them to Jill rX.treiniti that might dcfbvy the
chance of ' returning tranquillity. The patience
with which The Cotuitry Gentlemen had borne
their burthens was a folzjea worthy the attention
of Government; they had Tirade great faeritices,
and cootributcid a (hare proportionably greater"
'than any other defcription of men, without a
#ipnnur i and it was- the -duty. of "Government
to relieve the 'at
.the very firft opportpnity it
~, could du rowith hoitourto itfeff and the nation: No
MtaildnirbiZeforthezion;
Co lascettenptt of the wiairiawasrd.fo
[hip tbcn took a view of the &fellers we had Inf-
. fad at different times ; and the almoft ruinous
.fkate in which our finances were at one period ;
he next proceeded to thew how different every
amnion and eireandlauce of the country was
now; obfervisig that our refinarees &mai to in-'
creak as it were with our debt, and then afked,
whether it would haste been wife or necefary to
carry on the war any further, or whether we,could
.expea to accomplish any Oita by continoing it ?"
The Preliminary Articles of the Treaty, whatever
Might be the opinion of others on the &hie& he
mnit ,confidir as higbly,adrantageous to this coun-
try. It was net only .unneceffary to carry on the i
war any longer, but its further continuance would
have encrealed the public burthenl to an enor-
mous pitch. He admitted drat our Allies had been
defeated, thetthey wereobligedto. make a feparatc".
Peucoand that France hadaggrandizedher power
in a very,reat degree; but -Rill he contended we
had gained the abjea for which we (truggied; we,
!were fuceefsful lb far as regarded our own. exce-
-1 Lions. :It was not a war of choice on our,
i part, but a war of necellity ; and as fuch we
were fuccefsful in ,the war, becaufe we removed"
the evils that gave rife to it. We engaged'
io it for the protettion of our Laws, our Coal-
Aption, our Liberty, and Religion; and in this
, °hied we fucceeded. Comparing the objefts of.
this war with thee of all others in which the court-
try was ever engaged,
.there was not one in which
we were fe fuccefsful as the .prefent. There were
Come who thought that agreat facrifice of territory
' was`anade by-, this country. He would ark,, of
what value could thole Iflands that were ceded be
to this country, compared to the evils of continu-
ing the war? Many of them, fo far from increafing
'.ore revenues and helping our finance, would have
been, a drain upon.the country; anti as to the Cape
of Good Hope, the fame "edvantage.s were to be
derived from it as if it-was to remain in our pot-
felktua: it was to remain a harbour for our °lip-
, ping, and we were to enjoy there every privilege
las in a place of our own. Their Lordthips mutt
not forget the great advantages which our arms
Thad gamed in India, by the overthrow of Tippoo
Sultana and the caorsqueTit acquifition of terri-
tory. ibis was not•the only benefit arifing from
that conquell ; the tenuity of our pollifGens in
India was completely eltablifhed. There was
every chance and profpea •f the continuance of
the .bktlings we were about to enjoy, and the heft
sixaratay.for the peace was the mutual advantage-
! which both countries mull derive from it. With
may to the I:nonvntiirnenttailtrlizerrnss, hine haopedr thatth
Frauce.tsin.Couutry, after the experience the bad,
would keep-slur of them. It was not to the ad...,
. an:; scot Groat .11raaaa.to farm Coatan al-

HOUSE OF LOUD TUESDAY, ItOVEMIPIR
Oa Lord Pawl ai moving the circlet of the Day
for taking into cortrularation the AcirlreCi to his
*city on the) am*,
Lord Ge.unft‘ts requeited the Noble Lord
Would give the Bottle the inferination afked for on
preceding day, rellfkre ,tmi • the Treaty between
France and Potng.* and in *bat' Inanner
St
would bear on ont,ourii. •,, ,
Lord Paaidwie Add, it win 44 tory inconie,
nierit to giVe t it/fßOatif, sA the ;mita' flags of
the bunal4 -
Ligd Oeureii.oraid, the iallintoti on ?tad tteeri
imly.genoraill,raWonred out of dirt., in conk-
queue 0fy1mi4.414 Plod blotto:1w place. He
waked nt know, Anther the whole of the territory-s
of Portugal rscreptiOrroed to that country °root?
Lord Prrimayo thought the general prtociple of
the Treat,' -brownrP this Country and Frances
could be eekt,epomPlpiircnired, wi:hout going into
the anemia °fight Treaty with Nautili, or dif-
eutring lay pegOnalar artick Ile arbnitted that
reafothis eaozatn *
witrAerlgte be 0; brit be few no
:livered Ou thel
lim
eaty it,
mif 4A rotber Powers bad done. The
Tr Atimilefruig .to public rumour,
bad bean ra -and a part of the territory Of]
ggal "lat•!V.• the caul c4ariikof Alivcn-
MN= Wa4kAnIUJ to spaisa en account of the
finu,ggling trade, bad been ceded. The Treaty
with Francohad not been ratified. •
Lord gatevl:4* thought the explanations he
had defined .weye emaremely necelClry- Time Treaty
of Madrid, if what he. had- heard was truer did
not leave Pprogel ;t liberty to continue its for-
mer ornmereal relations with this Country. lie
wilked to have this importint 14(mi:cation before
;he geoeralinhjera of the Peace was.slifeuffed, in
order-to know whether it aio not interfere with
our Preliminaries
Lord Tailsow confidered the onefkion of the
Yoble Baron wan not a. proper one; fusee there was
museclier • anlon,-be the Idoufe. He thought
wasettaltoofkful to *tam. ou(e with lTich
4.11 H •
a coontrfattnot. and should therefore mote for the
Vitierikthe Day:
L,otclOßcµvw staid, tbeltiotion for the Order
of the 1114 ma& sat before tbs. Hoare, t he thou!cl
therefore mere, Oat . a copy 7-of ,the Treaty of
betwgn ft-4r= Porugtal, mould be
laid 'icier; the fleck. ;notion was not af-
feared rot• nnrdaty infArmnatiton given, the Houle
proddraw a very unfaveur"ie omen, and a bad
eoneltilion of the caadourwhiei was to be ea-
peded from the•otitee. cat. was notorious that
a Treaty bad boon concluded .at. Madrid. • He
fubmitte; tobabler-it was neeti4aMe urthe Dlobie
Secreutenaledr, lkonciorAbi to be Morel
thinks h 0014,0014 *Ponta decade on the Peace,
when Arch n :try 'otuatiou:svas refoCed ?
LordlidouoiVoreige oblete4, that thedikutrion
'the lioatbutmteolled to enter tq was to con'
-fader the.-Pinary Artirles•of the Treaty be:
:went thiie and France, and not to debut
It Treat, Arleen- Fr ace ,and ,Portugal. .He
opted Lor#, pebetheeitile y!ere in the
..fituaticipmfrbie,hiabln icaid,,lte would not afore
the laioraustion,alemautded,l
The Lena Piot-cc-410.0s Acakd, the Houfe was
. totering7 on thejlifeuffion of a tUbjett of the /aghea
imporutpce, imatnely. to, eoufider the-As/inks of
. tltesPreirisialyNreakel , between which god: the_
•fettliag of the Definitive TifeatY, 4te, coneciopl it.,
• improper that oity,fue* gtintlions pa, thofe *artist:
by biolinige..biegd .iikottki take t 9 the.";e4Pn"
of the hlnitfe,,,such a Fooeeding was not Parlia-
mentary, and it had a tendency to retard and
porms4teaecomplilletaestof ev ary-falutary par- ,
-111"thiqb bin lotaistraillerthia
• swat wile IFFirad "'pedlar it was.
enfaliorit with the deny that Houk owed his
boa
jeliys to cal fit information which might lead eat
iimeespofuretui ohiags.that.at tbia,period, it wouW.,
lheimaproper-to make known ?
•LSool4ittvai.ow faid,thnolle Houle nmaillen,
ptaccod tottlan Order ofithe Day there was ,no
040,4'141mi before it, nor. could any motion
precede that order. , -
Lord Gerovate.e •fitidl.he certainly had a right
, to move an. antendmentoo Ole motion, which wart
That..au lamb*. Addrefs be orefented to his
iiraying that be would be pleafed toorw-
der re be laid before the Hole a copy of any,.
Tiestmentered-into between the Court of Litho;
mulch:hat ti Great Britain."
Lead Ticeit.ow obferved that it was a new
ittode.nflineeedinr to bring forward a new MO-
teoa v>lett an ordetof the clay was already before'

ehe Hcnfe.
Lord Getzsrrn.it .contiende:l he had a right to
melee Itteh an urneniment, and he waited to-do
fi
before the slifsailforn an the Preliminary. Tsenty,.
beguile he. conceived it lOL'eetrety to Ilttge the
fungi information that emit& ire given on-the
Gib-
It It was 6r from his intention to delay that
dilentßoahy introducing any queftion about or-
der; hot, in point of ,osier, he contended. he had
a righted put thematic* he had made
-
Lord DAalekee foil], that he, forme, wee ready
se -*soar into she bible& Which •thc Houle• was
lbw* to proceed upon. without
_any (Lich infor-
maiiowas Alas required by the liohle Lord, and
bethought the circler of the.day wok firiL be ,pro-

eesded
Lord Tutrasow and -she Loafs Casalic. issue
veers of the ifseorsempiniou.
Earl liireirvra fopported his Noble Friend's
swienartutut, 'which he thought the Hoofe ,wars
Jour oesths m receive. sad not to cafe* ce tbs
OTift orders, even if tint could be done.
LudloL C.aeree /mos whe immis was

fiances--to hiffoad *Froteal
, cerwards fbrfook her.
rations, his Lordfhi
" That an humble
Maidly, thanking 'hi
efeicenflort in dirt lint
liming ry Treaty with
be laid. before the Hi
jetty that the Houle
conflilitation the Arty
with heartfelt Patisfae
ifaad to the effects of h
&rentl in concluding
Mel? to be followed
.vantages, -and to pror
pf the country:,
' Lord LIN le lc it feci
aflonifhed that the to
confidered by any 1
country. -Whatever
nature in the treater
tal ?own* no pais
every' pert of the wort
on our own efforts, f
wsre crowned with tat
chip took a brief review of our expeditions, and
dwelt with "exultation on the iffue of the campaign
in Egypt. He lamented the fate of the Prince of
Orange, a Prince defeended from a race of heroes
who had for two centuries been the champions of
the civil. and' eeliginas liberties of Europe, and
ever attached to the interefts of this country ; but
however hard his fituation might be, it was upon
the. Powers of the Continent, and not upon us,
that the odium mutt attach. One great advantage
which he regarded as refulting from the Peace;
was, that it mutt give a death blow to the hopes
of thofe who ftill laboured to fan the flames of dif-
content in Ireland.' While there remained any
chance of afliftance from France, there was little
hope of tranquillizing the deluded part of the
population of that country, many of whom, nn-
fortutiately, regaided theconceflions made to them
as originating more in a fpirit of fear than clemen-
cy." His Lordfhip then contrafted the advantages
obtainedby the prefent Treaty with thofe of the
Treaty copcluded in 1788. The Minillry who
concluded that Treaty had been driven fie= their
places by a coalition ; he hoped there was no mea-
fure of that kind in agitation for expelling theatre-
fent Miniftry.
'laird SPENCER regretted that he fhould Rand in
the fituation of an oppofer of men with whom lie
bad long acted with fatisfattion ; but he could not
avoid _placing himfeW in that firuation, continently
„with ihe difelarge of his duty to his own charac-
ter, his King, his country, and his Goo. How
could that peace be called honourable, by which
'we gave up every thing to our principal enemy,
njiiie he ceded nothing ? How could it be called
fecore, when we yielded, without any jug equiva-
lent, Rations of the outmoß importance to the ene-
my, in cafe of future holtilities, and which largely
contributed to the means of profecuting them ?
How could the Article relative to Portugal re-
dound to our honour, when its conftruaion was
finch as to ratify the ceflion of a part of her territo-
ries to our enemies ? Was it to the negotiations of
our Misitters that Turkey would confider herfelf in-
debted for the expulfion of the French from Egypt,
and for the integrity of her dominions ? No! that
obligation the owed to the heroic valour of our
failure and foldiers. As to Rome and Naples, the
ilipulation was equally nugatory. He anderßood
that the Roman territory was already evaeulted,
and that very few French troops remained in the
other-kingdom. But why attach any importance
to the evacuation of thole dominions, when we
leave our enemy in polfeflion of every facility to
invade them at pleafrire. The noble feconder had,
in terms which left him little-to fay, lamented the
&nation of the Prince ofOrange : could the treaty-,
then, be termed honourable, as far as his interens
were involved, when it did not appear that a finale
effort had been made in his favour ? In vain aid
he look in any of its flipulations for what had re-
peatedly been declared to be the objea of tile con-
tell, "indemnity for the pail, and fecurity for the
;future." His Lordfhip, purfuing this line of ar-
gument, expatiated upon the imprudence of our 1
eeffions in the Eat! and Weft Indies, and the Me- 1
diterranean. The terms, he Paid, were unequal,
and it was hence impoifible that they Ihould imply
fecurity. tie did not rely much on the guarantee
which we were direaed to look to in the mutual
interefts of the two countries. Nations were Come-
times plunged into war in oppolition to their real
interelts ; and it not unfrequently happened that
the intereft of all ufurper differed very widely from
that of the people. His Lordfhip, however, far-
ready prayed, that events might thew that his
fears were groundlefs ; but mutt confers the full
extent of thofe fears, though he knew that they
had expofed him to the ridicule of a certain clad
Of men; and he hoped that Minifters would thew
that they were. fallible of the new and perilous
fituation of affairs, by keeping up a fixong naval
and military ellablif)iment.
The Duke of CL AR ex c r, in foppon of the Ad-
drefs, took a detailed review of the events of the
war, from the landing oC his Royal brother, the
Duke of York, in Flanders, to die conclittion of
the conteft in the furrendcr of Alexandria, and
contended, that at no period of our 'noels hed the
Brain) character Rood higher in poiet of naval
and military glory. The retreat of the l)ukc of
York, and the Cubfequent cooquetts of the French,
lie afcribed entirely to want of co-peretion on the
part of the Continental Power The glory of our
armies be regarded as confurrimated by the dig-
nified moderation difplaycd in our propofals for
;Peace. Hii Ilighoefs expatiated on the advantage%
we thould derive from the pacifies of Ceylon and.

tent, and that too when thofe u. ,
which we had taken up arms, raged with unabated
violence. Yet it would be found that the terms
on which the late Admindlration were willing to
make Peace, differed in no material degree from
thofe of the Treaty before the -Houle. The only
efental vatiation was the fubiiittition of the Mind
of Trinidad for the fettlement of the Cape of Good
Hope, and he did not conceive that they were lb
pertinacious upon that point as to continue the sear
in order to procure its ceffion ; much lcfs if the
enemy had then confentcd, as they now have, to
its being made a free port. With rape& to Per-
tngal, he admittedthat its limits were notregat- 1:11
as precifely defined at the time the Preliminaries
were figned. The Treaty of Madrid, however,
having been concluded fetbfequent to the Treatld
y
with this Country, it was to be fuppofed, wou
he fupstrfeded by the, latter. But upon this point,
however, much as he might be preffed, he could
only give that general intlumation which he had
gis,en on a former earening. It would certainly be
fully difeuffed by the Plenipotentiaries appointed to
conchade the Definitive 'Treaty. To them likewife
was referred the indemnification of. the Prince of
Orange, and 'therefore, there was no neceffity for
introducing the fubjeft into the PrOinliaary. 'Treaty.
The Itlpulation for evacuating Lower Italy was
intended, as far as we could, to remove all danger
of a fudden attack upon the territo.ics of the Otto-
man Porte. With refpeEt to Egypt, as it was never
fuppofed that we were to retain it, it inrely was of.
fome importance, notwithltanding the brilliant
fuccefs of our arms in that quarter, to have a for-
mal claufe inferted for its evacuation,and for main-
taining the integrity of the Turkifh dominions.
Malta only became an °bled of importance to us
when it fell into the hands of the French ; and it
would hardly be contended, that the retention of it
in our hands would jullify the continuance of holli-
'kitty when the French Government ;tread to its
being reßored to the Knights of Malta, unthir the
guarantee of a third independent Power. His
Lordlhip concluded with Willing, that the terms
of Peace were in every refpeet fuels as were truly
honourable to the char:liter, while they were
ftriEtly confiftent with the inure-as of the Brie&
nation.
Lord GRENVILLE (aids before he proceeded to
the ionlideration of the general gelation bcfore
their Lordibips, be derived molt carnally to affure
than, that it would have been matter of great fa-
tisfa6lionindeed, of the moft lively jay—if the
di, etes of his own judgment would have allowed
him to concur in the line of corivatulation ,as
marked out by the Noble Mover of the Ad drefl
before the It would hive been matter of
the mot heart-felt fatisfaaion to him if he 'could
have agreed to an Addras, ftating that we had
brought an arduous and important contcft to a
fuecelsful termination. But, he was furry to fay.
that according to the belt cc niideratioti he had
been able to give the fubjeert, no one of the objeas
for which we had warred fo long had been attain-
ed. The Noble Lord hart Rated, that feet'.
rity had been the utjea of the war. It was .1: .
but inflead of obtaining that objeet, we were sow
left in a fituation of far greater infectit;ty than we
were at the commencement of the war, or at any
time during its continuance. In examining the
queltion before them, he thought it material to
Rate what was precifely and aittintlly the nature
of the propofed motion. If it had been n qualion.
whether our naval and military ett its had been
great and glorious, and bad been crowned
with fuccefs beyond all termer times? he (hould
readily agree with it. He alfo agreed as to
another paint, namely, as to the exr.atiency
of peace upon fecure and honourable terms. He
conceived the queltion was not whether peace
was defirable upon lecture and honourable terms;
for peace upon fuch terms was the objet of eve' y
war ; nor whether it &mild, or fheiuld not nos
be agreed to ; for the honour cf the nation was
now pledged to perform the conditions ; and as io
many facriliccs had been already made, lie was
the left men who would propof;: to fact iiice the na-
tional honour; but that it was this—what were the
merits of the prefent Treaty ? and litould the
Hotife carry to the foot of the Throne an Ad tree,
which told his Majcity they' had eily
thee merits, and that the terms were Bitch as de:
Peeved their approbation ? To this he could e,
agree. becanfe he thought the ter
tageous to the country, and fraugl
elation and national humiliation.
being thus narrowed, the neat coots
'how was it to be tried ? It had been

.. -., . ;...-fat,...., ..... jh
~.16 - • " har.L. •,, s
' • • •• -. t ;•-• 417, "
. .
'5.11.- , •
4( -:`•/ /
44MIL AS/eh / littar4E .% .., •
P•14:Al. f 1 v \ .'N
•
I I ROI - •
-MICE
I,IX-PENCk. 1.
- -----
roteition to countries that af- Trinidad. Thefe were all of our conquefts that _
r. • After Tome further obfer. we could prudently retain with Out imprudently
i concluded with moving, draining our population, which indt:ed was per-
4dihsfs be prefented to his haps too renal' for the extent of territory we Rill
urn fortis molt gracious con- polfeffed. It was, he believed, to this cause, that'
1g that the Articles of the Pre- the defencelefs Rate of our colonies in the Weft-
h the French Republic, fhould Indies, is 1783, was attributed. The ar:icle in
Hour.; and afTuring his Ma. the Treaty between Itnilla and France, proved
re would take into its ferious that the latter had abandoned her clifc,rganiting
nicks in queftion ; that it was principles, anti he mutt fay, that but for the gi-
faition the Houfe looked for• gantic exertions of this country in oppofition to
if his Majeßy's juilice and mo.- thofe principles, fttch a cones ion would not
ing a Treaty of Peace that was have been obtained. His liighnefs juftified Mi.
red by important national ad- nifters in reflorins the Cape of Good Hope,
that by ‘
the fubltantial interefts citing the eority of Lord Keith, wO faid, N
romote
fcttlement, uthif retained, would prove a mill-ftone.
seconded the motion. He was Lord PILUAM compared the relative fituation I
terms of the Treaty fhould be of this country and France at the prefent trills,
perfon as humiliating to this with what it was in the years 1796 and 1797., and
er there was of a humiliating remarked upon the fingular contradiaionbetwee fers c
is concluded with the Continen- the principles and views.upon which the oppo
of it-could attach to us. In of the Addrefs now argued, and-their conduit it
world where we had to depend the above period, when they fent Lord Malmtbury . .
1, bar foldiers and our allots to treat for Peace. France was then in polleffion of
laurels. pn this topic his Lord.
eas wide
~ an extent of continental territory as at pre.
*-*--- --I —s. ...i th2r too when thofe doitrines, againft

qutt•
fulcrett;olll
itili ej atii[
•