Star.
London, England, 1806-06-07 00:00:00

Mr. TYRRWHIT JONES thought, that had the
tax been perfitled in, the prefent idiniffers would
have become as unpopular as any who had ever gone
before them. He would _advice the Noble Lord,
however, to revert to the tax on iron, in preference
to an increafe of the Affelfed Taxes.
Sir W. WILLIAMS WYNNE obfarved, that pri
vate brewers generally ufed double the quantity of
malt and hops to that conlumed by the public brewer
for producing the fame quantity of beer; and there-
fore as much ex pence attended the private brewer, as
the confumer of beer from public breweries. Befides,
it was not always in the option of an individual to
have recourfe to public brewers ; he could (tate, that
in the whole principality of Wales, there was only one
man of that defcription.
• Mr. W. SMITH confidered the clamour that had
been railed againft the tax, 23 unneeeffary and ex-
ceffive. He thought that if the people of that part
of the country, with which the Honourable Gentle.
man who (poke lag was conflated, put lets malt into
their beer, both their health and their morals would
be improved by the change.
Sir W. WILLIAMS WYNNE, in reply, obferv-
ed, that they ufed malt and hops, which the public
brewers did not.—(Laugh.)
Mr. CALVERT was not aware of any peculiar
preffure on the labouring poor, which had been pro-
duced by taxes lately impofed. The demand for
labour had increafed, and with it the increafe of
wages ; but the middle ranks of fociety had felt the
preffure much more feverely.
Mr. ROSE thought that the fituation of the public
brewer was not Inch as called for favour and protec-
tion, by impofing a countervailing duty on private
brewers. The quantity of malt ufed by the public
brewer was inconfiderable, when compared with that
ofed by the private brewer. It had been found that
the porter brewers of Louden produced three barrels
and a half of beer from eight bufhels, while the pri.
vale brewer required ten bufbels to produce a hog.
(head. It had been calculated, that the public brewers
produced as much from 2,40 rt 000 bufhels, as the
private brewers from (even millions of bullsels. He
could not, therefore, fee how the public would gain,
by throwing the production of beer principally into
the hands of the brewers ; as what might be gained
by the increafe of the duty on beer, might be 101 l by
the defalcation of that on malt.
Mr. WHITBREAD obferved, that the public
brewer could not be Paid to be well acquainted 'with
his trade, unlefs he were able to make a much better
ufe of his materials than the private brewer. He tor.
reCted the calculation of the Right Hon. Gentleman,
obferving that only three and a quarter barrels were
generally produced from eight bufbels.
Mr. Alderman COMBE confirmed the correanefs
of this calculation, and obfcrved, that the public
brewer had great advantages over the private, in re•
fpelt of the quantity from the fame materials, arifing
from fupesior (kill and machinery.
It was then ordered that the Houle refolve it fell into
a Committee of Ways and Means on Monday next.
MUTINY BILL. _

Mr. WINDHAM then moved the Order of the
Day for the third reading of the Mutiny Bill.
Mr. WALLACE then role, and entered into a
very extenfive detail of the arguments againft the
Bill. He cnnfidered it as an infraction of the prero.
gatire of the Crown, and thought that the meafure
Mould rather have originated from the Crown, than
receive the fanaion of Parliament, as in that way
the whole refpoufibility would have been placed on
the (houlders of Mininers, who might afterwards have
been accountable to the country, while the prefent
mode of proceeding officiated Parliament with Mini
hers, and freed them from that refpontibility. He
dwelt at confiderable length on the invidious diftinc.
tion which it went to produce between the foldiers of
the prefent army and thofe who might enlift after this
bill paired into a law. Thole veterans who had bled
and conquered in the fervice of their country, were
to remain in a Bate of confeffed hardfhip, while re-
cruits were to enjoy fuperior
_advantages. He con-
tended that it would have a pernicious influence on
the general difcipline of the army, from the anxiety
which officers would feel to retain the foldiers in the
fervice, at the expiration of the period for which
they had engaged. He did not coped much from
the mixture of the citizen and the foldier, and thought
that the inconveniencies of military fervice would be
more cheerfully borne, when the foldier looked for.
ward to the military life as his only refource. On
thefe grounds, the prefent Pill fhould meet with his
decided oppofition in every tlage of its propels.
Mr. WILBERFORCE laid, he had felt it his duty
to inform himfelf on the fubjee, and he had cettainly
been materially of ned by feveral able productions.
The great queltion was, how the regular army was to
be increafed ? He thought it was neceffory to increafe
the Banding army, not fo much with a view to a defers-
, five as a dilpofeable force. It was to be confidered,;
that in a naval nation, which had the power of tr..nf-
porting its troops as it pleafed, the fame army might
be appropriated to a variety of different Cervices. He
thought that the principle upon which the army ought
to be increafed, had been well Bated by the Right
Honourable Gentleman when he opened his plan tr.
the Houle. The mode of entitling men for life was
calculated to terrify men from entering a fervice
where there were nod& vrylrgia ertrorfirm. The fy nem
now propored, he had no doubt, would remove one
of the greaten impediments to perfons entering nn
military life. He obferved, that in the late Admini-
nration, there was an intention to create an order of
merit in the Navy, in order to reward great exploits.
He hoped that idea would not be loft fight nf, but
that it would be extended to the army. He was con.
vinced that the meafure now propoted would improve
the tone and charaeer of the army. He remarked
that the armies of free countries had always been fu-
perior to thole which were not free. Whether he ad-
verted to Greece, to Rome, or•to England, it would
Ee found that military fucceffes were always in pro-
portion to the Bare of public freedom. The people
of England had fignaliLed themfelves from the period
of Magna Charta till the eflablithment of their liber-
ties by the Revolution. It was pleating to refleft,
that the A LM la Ivry' in giving men liherty, had given
them the means of pre-crying it. Doubtles the
French had atchieved great conquens under the ic-
fluence of that enthuGafm by which they had been
actuated, but he was convinced that if they remained
long under the form of Government they did now, it
would nit be in the power of Lcgions of Honour, or
any artifices employed by their Ruler, to counteraCt

the eternal order of things, and givithem the energy
of a free country. He did not believe that the mea-
fure would excite difcontent in the regular army now
erifting, becaufe the principle had been tried in the
American war, and found fuccefsful. The men en-
lifted for five years, or during the war, had been put
into the ranks with thofe whole fervices had been on.
gaged for fife, and yet no one heard of any difratisfat-
lion in confequence of that mixture. He was alfo of
opinion that the Navy would not be situated by any
mean jealoofy in confequence of any fuppofed ad-
vantages granted to the Army in point of limited
fervice ; he did not fee how fuch jealirfy could trill,
becaufe at the end of a war the failors, or a great pan
of them, were difcharged ; 'fo that in feet the engage•
spent of a (anew might be faid to be for a limited pe-
riod. It would be alfo remembered by the Moore,
and would, he had ao doubt, be recollefted with gra.
titude by the Navy, that the Noble Lord who was
at the head of the Admiralty had done much to im-
prove the condition of the claffes of which it was corn -
poled. He tru Red, ho wever, that the Noble Lord would
not flop fatisficd witla what was donet but proceed
(till to do more. He meant particularly to call his
attention to the propriety of making an eflablifhment
for the wives and children of failors who mould have
fallen in the defence of their country. With refps
to colonial fereice,he perceived no difficulty in making
an arrangement both beneficial and fatisfaeory, if
the preterit fyftem of 'livery were abolilbed in our
Mends. We were obliged to keep up a large military
force in the colonies, and to fend out frequent rein-
forcements, not fo much for the purpofe of oppoling.
the common enemy, as to awe and rule the flare who
cultivated them.-if Haver y were removed, then in-
ternal arrangements c3uld be made calculated to de.
fend and prefervs them at little expence either for life
or treafore.

Mr. DDINGTON raid, that as this would pro-
bably be the salt time the fubjeft would be dircuffed
in that Houle, he could not avoid shortly expreffing
his fentiments upon the important queltion then be-
fre rte Honfe. He thought that his Right Hon.
Friend (Mr. Windham). had not been handfomely
or fairly treated, when his plan had been-to often
called a whim, and a wild and fanciful theory. The
word theory was generally applied to fyllems, an
opinions h tally adopted : but the Gentlemen on the
ether fide of the Houle had been complaining, week
after week, and day after day, of his Right Hon,
Friend having taken fo much time us; confider, and
mature his plan, before he prefeuted it to the Houfc.
In the full reffinnfibility of the meafure, not only
his Majefty's Minillers in that Houle, but a Noble
Lord in the other (Lord Grenville), would willingly
take thetr fullffiare. As for himfelf, though he had
no (hare of the refponfibility, yet when he heard his
Right Honourable Friend charged as P raft and haR y
(peculator for introducing it, he mull fay, that he
fo perfettly appraved of it, that he fhould with ho
political character in that refpeft to Rand or fall with
that of thnfe who introduced this meafure. A good
deal had been raid in the cootie of the dikoffion that
had taken place on this mullion, of the opinions of
the General Officers not being laid before that Moore.
The opinions of Officers were given upon a miellion
referred to them by the Commander in Chief, and
which was different from that which was now under
.lifculfion. The quellion which had been referred to
them was merely between limited fervice and fervice
for life. There were, however, in the prefent plan.
fo many auxiliary inducements combined with the
propofed limitation, that ehe moilion then to be
confidered was totally different from that which bad
been referred to the General Officers. As to the mo-
tives which induced men to call, he believed the
non•eommiffioncd officers conld (peak better than thti
Generals ; but every man of e ,:nmon fence, and who
was at all acquainted with the character of the Eng-
nation, might forma good judgment on that Cub-
jett. Ht confidered that the cattalitie; of the army.
reckoned at 15,000 annually, would not be near to
great in future, is the pripcipal part of it, arifing
trom defertion, would be in a great meafure dont
away.'• He was much more fanguine in his expec-
tation of immediate (heeds than his Right Hon.
Friend, and conceived that it was in hit 'charaßer a
trait of that generous policy, which, according to the
praftice of our ancellors, legitlated as much for the
good of pofterity as for the prefent time. Some Gen-
tlemen had (aid, "we were well enough as we were
Whoever would look on the map of Europe, and fee
nothing but France, excepting the territories of our
magnanimous allies, the emperor of Ruffia and the
King of Sweden, could hardly bring himfelf to think.
that "we were well enough as we were." Afteir
commenting for Tome time on the dektiption a Noble
Lord had given of the Rate of the cbuntry, when he
considered that Ministers repofed on a " bed of roles,"
he (hewed/sow much that fituation had been changed
for the worfe, in confequence of the failure of the
Coalition in the tall unfortunate campaign, and con•
chided by expreffing his firm conviction, that this
, would not only be a moll efficient meafure, but that,
in time, it would be a very popular one. He h 44
converted with many military officers on the fubjeft,
and they had all, without exception, confidered that
the army would be benefited by ir. He alfo
had converted with (everal foldiers who had been
difcharged, and they all agreed that fuch a meafure
would be" the making of the army." This, he was
lure, would be the general feeling of all the foldiers
in the army, and at all thofe claffes from which fol-
diers were to be obtained, and he therefore thought
that the meafure was the moll likely for rapidly re-
cruiting the army.
General TARLETON Paid the Rig'.t Hon. Gen-
tleman (Mr. Windham) looked to the army not as
an Englishman and a foldier, but as a philoffipher.
and as a philnpher of a very bad fchool, who knew
nothing of the human mind, on which his fpeculae
tions were to operate. The General had fame expe-
rience of limited tervice in Portugal, when the Baron
De Rolle, who had the command of a Swifs Regi-
ment, did not dare put them to ordinary duty, left
thofe whole time was expiring (hould quit the military
lite. Then wit, imagination, hilts-try, and every thing
rife was preffed into the debate, excepting what be-
longed to it, for the mere purpofe of doing what the
lawyers called " blinking the mteftion " Amonglt
the refl. the French fervice was held up as an ex-
ample, and he would admit the wifdom of the maxim,
Far efi ab 4yie doceri, but in the prefent cafe the prece-
dents adduced had either nn application at all, or
were opofed to use argument of the Right Honour-
able Genticutata. The truth was, the officers of the