Star.
London, England, 1823-06-24 00:00:00

SUPPLY.

Lord A. HAMILTON wished to know from the
Right Honourable Gentleman if it was his intention
to give up the duty on coals carried coastwise?
The CHANCELLOR cf the EXCHEQUER said,
the duty upon stone would be repealed, but he had
never expressed his intention to propose the repeal of
the duty upon coals: however, in the Committee
upon thc Customs Duty (Scotland) Bill, it would be
seen what modifications of that sort were called for,
and might be conceded.
The following items of the remaining Irish Esti-
mates were then voted :
£15,000 for the works at Donagbadee Harbour.'
£29,254. 9s. 2d. for defraying the expense of the London and
Ilolyhead Roads.
£45,000 for the works at the Royal Harbour, called King
George the Fourth's Harbour, at Kingstown, formerly Dunleary.
-Mi. HUME asked, was that sum to be the last for
those works ?

The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER feared
not. The works were on a very large scale, and con-
ducted by Commissioners, and therefore not under
the immediate controul of the Treasury. He had
written to the Commissioners to ascertain, in direct
terms, the objects they had in view, the original inten-
tion having been (as was not unu.ual in such cases),
considerably extended. He had also directed en-
gineers to proceed from this country, to ascertain
if it was necessary to go on with the works to the ex-
tent contemplated by the Commissioners. The ob-
ject of the works was of considerable importance.
Mr. VESEY FITZGERALD supported the vote,
and defended the conduct of the Commissioners.—
The expenditure upon the portion of the works that
had been completed was nearly one-third less than
the original. estimated expense.—After a few words
from Mr. Hums, the vote was agreed to.
£20,870 for completing the works at Holyhead Harbour.
Mr. H. G. BENNET complained of the great ex-
pense of a harbour, merely for the use of packet-boats.
The CHANCELLOR cf the EXCHEQUER said,
so far from the harbour being now confined to the
use of packet-boats, that in every gale that occurred
the harbour became so crowded with West Indiamen
and other merchant vessels, that the packet-boats were
frequently unable to enter it.—Vote agreed to.
£2,300 for printing the Journalssof the House of Commons.
Mr. HUME said, that in the last Session a Com-
mittee hid sat to consider the manner in which the
expenses of the Stationary Office were incurred; but
he was sorry to say, that the object of that Commit-
tee had nut been allowed. The Hon. Member pro-
ceeded to co:nplain generally of the abuses in the
Stationary Office, and complained that no alteration
had been made in consequence of the recommenda-
tion of the Committee. He thought that the expense
of printing the Journals was much greater than was
necessary. The lion. Member then descarved at great
length on the character and conduct of a Mr. Jen-
i.ings, who had given evidence before the Commit.
tee, whom he described to be a most honourable man,
altlptigh he had been ill used by the Treasury and
vilified by the public prints.
Lord PALMERSTON defended the conduct of
the Committee against the charges of die Hon.Mem-
;)er. The lion. Member had had the direction of the
Committee. He and Mr. Jennings had conducted the
inquiry altogether. With regard to Mr. Jennings's
character, lie (Lord Palmerston) would say, that his
opinion of that Gentleman was completely the re-
verse of that of the Hon. Member's.
Mr. RICARDO felt it necessary to state that the
conduct of Mr. Jennings had been so eccentric, that
it had been quite as much as the Committee could do
to keep that individual in order. •
Mr. BANK ES vindicated the intention of the incti-

vidnals comprising the Committee. He felt astopished
that the lion. Niemlltit for At..eideen should have
praised Mr. Jennings; after all which that Member
had witnessed in the Committee. His conduct had
been so extravagant and improper, that he bad put
the Committee to a trial which und...r nh other cir-
cumstances they would have borne. • The man ap-
peared to have an excuse for his eccentricity, for he
would call his conduct by no stronger name.
Mr. T. COURTENAY said, that when the lion.
Member'had said that Mr. 3:.nnings had brought for-
\vard nothing but that which he could prove, be had
made a, statement more incautious than any of the
statements in which even • that Hon. Member in-
dulged. Mr. Jennings had accused him (Mr.'Cour-
tenay) of a le *al as well as moral offence, and the He-
pourable Member now sought to exculpate his film!
Mr. Jennings, by sa) jet; that he bad heard it in some
alehouse or other, and therefore no blame coulJ attach
to him for britiag it forward.
£7652 for making good the deficiency of the grant of last Ses-
sion for printing the Acts.—Agreed to.
Lord PA LMEUSTOIs: moved that there be granted the sum
of Xi 89,483 for the disembodied Militia of Great Britain from
December, 1822, to December, 1823.
A sum not exceeding 1-99,248 for the disembodied Militia of
Ireland was then proposed, and after a few words from Mr.
Haste it was agreed to.
A sum of £5850 for the Society for Propagating Christianity
Abroad was then proposed.
Mr. HUME thought that some case ought to be
made out to justify this new grant.
Mr. WILMOT-HORTON.—The reason of the in-
creased grant was the entire failure of the funds of
the Society to support the Missionaries and School-
masters who are now in North America. As the co-
lonies improved in their circumqanees there was no
doubt that this grant would be diminished.
Colonel DAVIES thoVit it would be expedient to
give to the House some lot Cher information upon this
subject before they acceded to this vote. It would be
right, he thought, that some information should be
laid upon the table, and that in the meantime the vote
should be postponed.
Mr. HUME said, if the colonies required religious
instruction they ought to pay for it.
Mr. WILMOT-II owroN said, thatif the manage-
ment of the Society was exceetiimable, those who
thought so had, no doubt, a right to oppose the grant;
but the Hon. Members who had hitherto sanctioned
this Society by former votes were, in hTs opinion,
clearly bound to vote a supply for the present defi-
ciency. It by no means followed that the vote would
again be renewed.
Sir J. MACKINTOSH, with respect to the addi-
tion, observed, that if the increase rested upon the
King's Government he should vote for this increase;
but he thought inquiry was necessary, and that a
strong case should be made out before he could be
satisfied that the Colonies were not capable of main-
taining their own religious establishments.
Sir ISAAC COFFIN thought, that the sum ex-
pended in distant Colonies for education could be
much more advantageously employed at home.
Mr. HUM E again observed, that there was no case
made out for this additional grant.
After a few words from Mr. WI Lmor-Howrox,
strangers were ordered to withdraw: the numbers
were—For the Vote 49, Against it 21, Majority 23.

That £15,000 be granted for facilitating emigration fer the
people of the South of Ireland to the Canada. and the Cape of
Good Hope.
Mr. AI3ERCHOMBY feared this measure would
afford no redress, because it was not sufficiently ex-
tensive. They might as well remove a few rabbits
from a warren under the notion of clearing it. If ap-
plied to proprietary judiciously, he snould not object
to it. One of the great evils of Ireland was the cottier
system, by which the labouring man received Hale or
no wages, but in lieu thereof a cottage and plot of
ground. If such persons, not being able to pay their
rents, were allowed to emigrate, and those small plots
were consolidated, he thought the application of this
money might prove useful ; but that only under such
conditions as he had mentioned.

Sir J. NEWPORT concurred with the views of his
Hon. and Learned Friend. He attributed much of
the distress prevailing in certain parts of the South of
Ireland to the decline of the Newfoundland fishert.
Mr. WILMOT-HORTON said, that the views
mentioned by the Hon. and Learned Gentleman (Mr.
Abercromby) were not lost. sight of by his Majesty's
Government, who were quite aware that this sum
could give the Irish people no efficient relief. The ob-
ject of the grant was to shew what Government would
do, and enable the Irish people to take advantage of
it or not, as they might feel it eligible. The present
estimate was'grounded upon a calculation that £95
per head for men, £25 for women, and £l4 for chil-
dren, would take them out to Upper Canada, and
supply them with the means of obtaiaing a moderate
independence for after life ; giving them also, in the
first instance, a passage, husbandry implements, a
cow, and subsistence for a year. He held out no
hope, however, that this could be acted on very ex-
tensively; but as far as it had been tried, it proved
particularly successful. He should here add, that
four hundred persons were to be sent to the Cape of
Good Hope, whose expense was to be defrayed out of
this vote. The Ron. Member adverted to the advan-
tages of such emigration, when the emigrants would
be employed, and at a rate of wages higher than many
Honourable Gentlemen might believe to be really
now paid at the Cape.
Mr. AIIEItCROMBY expressed great apprehen-
sion at the emigration of farmers, who had some
means, to the United States. He thought something
should bedone to put a stop to such dangerous conduct.
Mr. WILMOT-HORTON said, it was publicly
known in Ireland that such encouragement would.
not be given except in cases when the necessity of
giving it was most evident.
Mr. S. RICE approved of the proposed vote.
Mr..C. HUTCHINSON did not object to the pro-
posed grant; buche wished the poor of Ireland to be
employed as much as possible in that count: y. The
Hon. Member emphatically called upon the Govei li-
mn to devise some means of employing the poor,
and thereby prevent those excesses which uhfortu..-
nately dig raced Ireland.
Mr. PEEL said; the reason of taking so small
a sum was in order-to try 'whether the scheme would
be successful or not. The best means of employing
the Irish people was rather by removing the restric-
tions on their trade, than by lending money to any
persons. However honest the Government might be
in io 'intentions, the application of money collected
by trlIatil)11 could never be as useful as' if that money

was left in the hands of the industrious, who coop
employit'AMAllT Mr. J. S H regretted to hear such sentimen4
from the Right lion. Gentleman. M. as it Lot po:.
sible to employ the poor of Ireland? Ar.Nitnbo,aad
I many other persons acquainted with the stateofthe
(Irish people, could tell the Right Horrid fen.
tleman how the poor of Ireland could he cored
The linen trade could. be encouraged veryAmcb
the grant of a sum of money.
Mr. D. BROWNE arqued in favour of a grant to
the linen manufacture of Ireland.

Mr. RICARDO was favourable to the vote unit"
consideration, as an experiment; but he could rota:*
sent to ;lily large grants for that purpose hereafter,
Sir J. NEWPORT agreed with the Hori, member
If7erlain)(drta•allsinngott°sno' that the security of property
great as it ought to be. 11.4iletse
office of Sub-S!ier 'was one of traffic as now, thew
curity of property could not be great.
Mr. J. SMITH explained. Unless England:tye,'
o-ive Ireland a fair treatment, England would re
tva
it bitterly.

Mr. HUTC I I INSON heat tilt' agreed with thole%
Gentleman who had lat:t stated his opinion—The
Resolution was agreed to, a, was a Vote for
1.7700,000 for Schools now sorporteel by Voluntary
Subscription, to enable the Lord Lie,,tenant of Ire.
land to supply any deficiencies in th, fends thereof.
The CHAIRMAN was ordered to report thew Re.
solutions to the House, and the [Lase resumed...4in
repot t was ordered to he received to-morrow,