Star.
London, England, 1812-06-23 00:00:00

„,a been the ardent supporter of tittie .;;trims ; that
;enof the most various views on other subjects,
but tat imbued with warm philanthropic feelings,
had concurred an this : if all this was taken into
due consideration, it would be admitted that a body
of authority existed sufficient in itself to decide the
veipn), althuHe
ch tigh every other argument were left
unemloyed. would now tou on the danger
„ha was insisted on by depositing political power
in the hands of the Catholics ; and first, it was ob-
vino, that we had done so already, and that in the
' past dangerous way, for surely it would not be con.
tended that there was more danger in admitting one
'oared Catholic Gentlemen to sit in that House
on in letting loose so I.trge a body of Catholic elec-
too 25 were now empowered to send Representatives
.10 parliament. The danger, he would own, might.
be ret of admitting Catholic representatives in a
100,1 and limited Parliament, where they might in
lime entirely exclude Protestants; but now the mat-
ter was widely difltrent, and a hundred Catholic
Members sitting in that House, where they would of
~ossity always be in a minority, was infinitely less
&arms than to have the mass of a Catholic pope-
llama, armed with the elective franchise, and those
excluded from power and merged in discon-
- by whom this formidable multitude would be
maaally influenced. Another argument brought to
• the Catholic claims, was the influence which
• ' ” hood possessed over the Peasant! y ; whom he I
tisk, was the people who were not influenced by
,asthood ? And wasit not desirable that they should
•be so influenced? If in the present instance this in-
we was ultra steduen, and if the priesthood were
.I
too near a level with their flocks, there.was;
..ea obvious remedy for both these evils—such as had
•theen already resorted to were only calculatectsto pro-
;joie them. He was nernow prepared to come tar.
,aard with any plan for foaming a provision for the
Catholic Clergy, though some time or another such
,a,plan must be brought forward ; but preparatory to
'this and Hat r htaling meas.u:es, much might be done
ifihe Catholics were in the hands of and made the ,
instruments of agitatOrs. He 'would say, rob them
derety fretext for delivering themselves up into I
such hands. These were only two methods of blunt-
ing the edge of disaffection, either by correcting the
. purposes of the discontented, or wresting from them
their instrument ;—to the former of these, perhaps,
we-could not have recourse with any prospect of
-success ; but to make use of the latter, kind that
with effect, was entirely within our power. As
_to the security which we demanded of the Catho-
lics, it could not be expected that they should he
extremely quit k-sig heed to perceive tho danger
;against which we u ished to provide ; it was not their
bushiess to propose such security, it would be mon-
VT() i to maintain the converse of this proposition
We felt thedanger it was for us to name theesectoisy
we requited, and he had ntidotibt, that if rea-sortable,
it mould be cheerfully acquiesced in. The lti"ht
'BIM. Member then expressed a h«pe . that nu tur-
f .puent effusion cf hostile feeling on the part of the
• iraihulics would prevent the House front taking their
aim into cnnsideration ; referred again to the unani-
may with respect to religious affairs prevalent on the
Continent ; stated;thSt in the conduct he was now
,yirsuing lie had kept his eye fixeclain the auspicious
/assures which- had More immediately led to the
• makable settlement with respect to Irish commerce
1782, and to the ultimate abolition of the slave
,wade ; pass( d a high eulogium on the English Ca-
' Mies, stating, that it Otis the wish of that respect- I
able body of men, that the discussion of their more
pwlicular claims should .be waved for the present,
.kg it might operate to the prejudice of their lash •
,brethren ; and concluded by moving—
Tim 'that the Heise will, early its •he next Session of Par-
ham?, tabs into its most serious consideration the state of the ;
Lk* affixing los Majesty's Roman Catholic Subjects in Great
. hew and Ireland, with a view to. such a finsl and conciltatot y
ellement as may be conducive to the react and strength of the I
Theted Kiogdoni, to the startifltt of the !Pi °treat* rteabilsli-
net, artd to the rnerat satisfaenon and concord of all cla ;its of 1'
111 fiaj -sty'. Subjects.—(Loyd sheeria: from Op)* of thd Malt) 1
After the motion was seconded, and put,
General MATTHEW observed, that he had taken
in every discussion upon this subject, except the
• Morbid' was brought forward by a Noble Lord
(lad Morpeth) in a manner that was, as he thought,
lit designed and premature. He did conceive, that it
wok have been more glorious for the Regent to
slikastanted to the Irish people Emancipation as a
beir.aod not as a right : such, he thought, would
!mimeo the first act of his unrestr?cted reign, and
Xit hid, the country would not now have been in its
Pewit calamitous situation. It was too true that
• *Lopes of the Irish people had been disappointed ;
"the deprecated the manner in which the Prince
• was attacked,upon the subject, for he was convinced
-that, at the bottom of his heart, he was a friend to
'Maud and the empire at large. (fear,-Year.) He
waslure that, in recent events, he had been- misled,
counsellors, who were ignorant of the state of
.isslassf,and incapable of giving any advice on the sub-
',* I
t. la the rebellions of 1715 and 1745, the Cithol cs
. d beland remaioed tranquil, and protected a Protes- •
Lait.lilla against his Protestant subjects. The Re-
al 1793 was sewn by the Vtesbyttrians, in
dleNorth of Ireland; and nothing was done by the
eaglalic 5, till in the departure of their favourite Lord
,_.
nt, Lord Fitawilliant, they lost all hope of
laripatien. By that event, the cup of Freedom
datbed from their-parched lips, and bigotry,
endollwance, oppression, cruelty, and, coercion,
hcle
the order of the day. Only for the death
4 a Protestant Nobleman at that time, behind
"llld be now a free and independent Country.—
SillltLa features !noticed the insurrection of 1803.
Au Illustrious Duke, in another place, in a most
excellent speech, which had been long before the
Public, ckaily showed that loyalty had ever been the
haw
• t •
enstic of the Irish people. It was the Mi-
ni4ets opposite (with the exception of a Noble Lord
• Li° was not then in office) who had infected the
tinct'c ter with their diabolical counsels, and who,•
frk
t, so, deserved impeachment. It any Member
Would •
impeach them, lie would be most ready to
'ald the motion.—(Loard laughing, and cries of hear.)
Illfttime called for something more than a silent vote,
and every man, .
thet, to etas not criminally indift•rent to
welfare of his native land, should throw aside all
:firconsiderations, and come forward to deliver
111'..•o Plutons on this subject with truth and frankuess.
Every ma •
snt read in Ireland had declared himself against
teniteof the system of intolerance which was
guPt mteciilaky eboseowhey o sat opposite to him, who fed
Oti
Mla• hn
• of the land, who came ?au-
.


~`
..

: • .
Pets into °Ace, and who now haAced in affluence and
ease.—(Loud laughing.) " 0 People of Englend !"
said the Hon. Member, 64 how long are these men to
be allowed I 0 People. of England, how long are
they to be endured t,.—(Leteehing and hear.)—They
should take care how they acted this night ; the ques-
' eels went &teller than they thought ; the sacred flame
of Liberty had kindled in Belfast, in the North ; had
reverberated from Cork, in the South ; (Hear, hear.)
and had extended from. Wicklow to Mayo.— (Hear,
hear.)—Their decision would tell, whether they re-
presented the Minister of England or the People of
Ireland. It had been said, that it would be open to
the Members of the Cabinet to vote on the subject as
they pleased. He could not perceive why Ministers
thought the people of Ireland such weak idiots as to
be gulled in this way; there were too many old sol-
diers among them to be taken by such a bad manciu-
vie.—f Loud laughing.)— He believed the Noble Lord
(Castlereagh) wasteh onlmne among them who
was sincere in what he said; he had considerable pro-
perty in Ireland, and he therefore feared for its safety,
if he should object to the Motioa.—(Hear,
If it was not carried, Cie rest of the Cabinet weeld
have nothing to depend on for the support of their
measures but the bayonet ; but, in his opinion, they
would be more secure in giving peace to the nation,
than if they converted every house in it into a barrack.
He called on the House to rally now round the ban-
ner of independence ; in the hour of danger, the Mi-
nisters of England would leave them in the lurch,
and they would remain as fixed figures for " the hand
of scorn to point its slow and moving finger at."—
( Hear, hear.) —Fie concluded by moving,
That, &stead of the wonls Harty it. the next Session; the
following be inserted, • immediately taken into consideration,
itc.' and that the House do resolve itsclf Into 4 Committee for
that purpose on Thursday next.
Mr. HUTCHINSON-seconded the Amendment.
Mr.°WELLESLEY POLE said, he should not
long detain the House in delivering his sentiments.
Ho persen could lament more thett.himself the intent-
penile Resolutions which reached town that morning,
because he was apprehensive that they would be in-
jurious, rather than favourable, to the Catholic Ques-
tion. In those proceedings he found particular refer-
ence to himself, but in delivering his opinion upon
-the Claims rf the Catholics, he should divest himself
entirely rif all personal feelings. Whenever the ques-
tion of Catholic Emancipation was agitated in that
House, he toota very small_partin the discussions,
but he never said, that the doors to Enuti cipation
should be eternally shut against his Majesty's Catho-
lic subjects. When the Claims of the Catholics were
formerly discussed, the House was entirely ignorant
of the sentiment of the Throne upon the subject, but
at present the House knew that a Noble Lord lied
been authorised by his Royal Highness the Prince Re--
Fent to form a new Administration, which should feel
inclined to consider the Catholic Claims with a view to
conciliation—( Crier of order, order.) He was sorry to
feel himself out of order, but he knew, from very high
A utlicri.y, that tl:e claims of the Catholics were to be
taken into the mostserious consideration, and that many
Gentlemen who had been adverse to. the admission
of those Claims, lately wished !dilate Right Hon.
Friend to bring the subject before Parliament and to
concede the demands •of the Catholics- on the one
hand, but on the other to obtain some security for
.the preservation of the State and Established Churai.
He agreed with his Right Honourable Friend,' that ;
the present was a proper time to consider ofthe civil
disabilities under which the Roman Catholics la-
boured,
and be conceived that the intelligence which
art ived in town that morning, strengthened his opi-
' nion. At the same time he wished it to be tinder-
stood, that when he should vote in favour of,the Ca-1
dllies, he should expect that security to be given on
their part which our ancestors had thought necessary
fOr the safety of the Constitution.
Mr. RYDER. said, that from all he could bear and
learn, there was not a likelihood of satisfying the
demands of the Roman Catholics, without granting
them the sante political power, which was by the
Constitution • vested in Protestants. Nothing short
of such a concession, would, in his opinion, be sad.
factory to- the Catholics, and therefore, as he ex-
pected no such concession would be made, he could
, not concur in a Motion which held out expectation,
which could-not be realized. He hoped, however,
that the 'time will soon arrive, when the Roman Ca-
tholics of Ireland would be free from that spiritual
boas:age in which they now were, when only the
i Legislature could concede their demands.
Mr. IvIAUlt ICE FITZGERALD hoped that
j there would be a general concurrence in the Motion.
I The only objection he heard made to Catholic Email.
cipetion was, that the Catholic people offered no secu-
rity.for the Protestant Establishment; but he wished
' it to be remembered that the Pope's authority had no
reference to the civil rights of men who professed the
Romaa Catholic Religion.
I Mr. FULLER said, that no man he hoped would
suspect him of e hostile feeling towards any religion
`in which any man thought that he served GOD better
than he did himself ; but there might be.reasons for
keeping down the tenets of one religion, when they
. watitea more than all the other dissenting sects. The
tit'e deeds of his estate were the saute as, the title
deeds of the constitution—(a laugh,) and he was sure
no generous Irishman would ask hint to give up his 1
title deeds, without proper securities against their
abuse. lie was glad that the question was put off.
Ni man credit admire the Lush more than he did :
they were a manly, fine, generous race ; they agreed
perfectly in his sentiments, for they loved women and
wine as much as he did.—( Loud aid relined herrn of
langhter.) —Their religious tenets, however, prevented
them from a greater share of freedom ; s .me of those
enets credibility could hardly swallow, and lie
thought he was right in asking them, as they believed
so much already, that they would not believe much
more— (a laugh.)—He was glad the preposition was
to be put off, es he hoped they would be able to find
intermediate means. Every man who wished well to
the British empire, must be anxious to see its religious
feel ngs and political strength united ; and if tied
could be done, and this question of Catholic Eman-
cilation carried with perfect security to Church' and
State, no man would be happier to grant it than him.
Sir JOHN NEWPORT strongly supported the
Claims of the Catholics. He denied that they were
under any spiritual bondage 'which rendered them
hostile to the established Church and Stete. With
the Right Flmvittrable Ccntl:man he regretted the
number of infamous pamphlets which anqually NA
-
peered against the Roman Catholics, which contained