Star.
London, England, 1804-04-11 00:00:00

SelteAVM

Admiral ABRICELE Y. -feting the Seirettiry at
War at in his place. Rated, that there were certain I
papers connofted with that Right Hon. Gentleman's I
department which he withed to move for. .After
foam remarks, be accordingly moved, that there be
prefented to the Honfe,
I. A Copp d the Cootrads entered Into between the favesid
Bader, and the Dorsch Mader GcnesaL
a. An Account a the :Aim:live Periods at which the feveral
Bainsals were to be completed, slnd What Pcnaides were annexed
to the Nip-fultiment of faeleEngegerftente.
3. CooU- or the Cortneates granted to tlowtratton, ihrwine
the Bamako to be is that time of licadinefs as toWntkle them to
replaces.
An Acitoostforthe rental Barracks, with the Number od Men
and Hales Mei were Ns to Wectiontruidate la ihe Pcdredion of
mama at the Petite of Ansiecw, luck as were Urea.
The SECRETARY lac WA Rated, that though
the Ham. Admiral had been kind enough to Me*
him the motiiin feveral days ago, he could not ditco.
Ter any neceffity for Inch papers. The Hon. Gen-
tleman had brought forward his motionfroM an idea
that the expences of the Barrack departnient had
been extraordinary, without mcolleeting that extra-
ordinary exertions required extraordinary expenses.
As to the firit paper moved for, he could fee no good
porpofe its produCtion could !hive, as an account of
the fame nature had been, in raft, already before the
Houle, la confequence of a motion made louse time
ago, and as no return crin Irk Made on this fubjefl
different from that already in pollifilon of the Houle.
He had no objelion, however. to produce a copy of
the mode of the certificates, and begged the Hon
Gentlemen to reeolket in gcreraithat at the peace of
Amiens, fame of the Barracks were fold, and Come
had been only hired dririnF the War.
Admiral BERKEI.F.I contended, that all that
had been laid before the Houfe relpeeting the Bar.
rack cnntrads had been evtraCls only Whereas his
object was to fee the contraes thernielece, which in
his apprehenfion had been lo ill digellcd, And whe-
ther or not there were any penalties attached to them.
From the experience he had had in a certain Board
(Admiralty Board) contraCts of this defctiption
ought always to be accompanied with penalties. He
writhed only to Ice if the Barrack Board had made
loch contraes a. they ought to make.
. The SEC ft r.TA RV at WAR admitted that there
were no penalties in any of the contracts in gae:tit•it ;
but at the fame time contended that no board had
, ever more controut over the contrattors, than the
Barrack Board, which rendTred loch penalticx
wt-
neceftary. If tht Hon. Admiral would more the
produftion of any individual contrail, he (hould have
no objettion to the motion.
Admiral BL R then moved, inflead or the
fita paper, a copy act the row' aft C11....red into on July
the .oth, tsol,h-tteccn T. Neil at:.l the narrtch Ntal-
i ter General for the Barrack Ci.icheilte. The
Admiral withcd it to he undetflool 'het hue luau! fe-
le:tell o'l from no ptrticuitr het merely
as one of Oink takm notice ei in the paper,. 1411lik!CII
to be the Right I I onoura b!.: ret y, a- t.! it.;•;:3
his own

~.

. .
. The SECRETARY at WAR faggellea that, ta
the particular contra& was fpecified, thee. was as
ntCeirlii for retaining the date..: ,
The firit ruction, *as *Mended, was aocordingly
paired. . • . . ; i
The fecond.tnotion Paged without oppofidoa.
• The third afro pared, after receiving An &Mead
tactic faggefted by the Secretary at Wars thohltillaml
of loading the table of the litotfe whit X Iltntlf of
fuel; certilester, it stotfld be better dap &mil,
Ofthr farm add thodeoffitartertificatei hit
.a•
Tht fonith motion was then agreed to.
,a.. . . team smarms . '• •.. ..
• r.• &crow liettgit same the Itrder et the Day fOr a
Committer ,if axe st•hoic HOISCU Oa litt w warmer Ists Ma•
jag r,oarolyt.ai Mthe stet' of Imhof the WWI Cop4,li..ia Ireland
es Rd ilereirran.ihre e.:.,telit shiai ca;naa.
~. asa. a4.,-,.
On the letrettlen hen Om that the gramma do irate the
Chair,
_i . - •
Mr. ELLTOT /Ore to *lie his otitstlVe In tie
meafure. Anti die peaet, the -failitia of 'Maid.
for what rtafon he knew ant, had been difeharge., I,
and the fyftem vparently difeouraged. ,Bsvut it as
again foot' after trustily adoeitkdr ands t koock two
sr
ordered rik be rifted at a bounty:of t • •At
that period iv was thoagly etnatensiod ' • Weed
ought to base a litiftia fer..iq dila --; end
wastivete any reafon novi be aced. for a change of
opiniorsin.this refine 4 new..
Militia force of trsd
was admitted to. be of, ettediette epiatityy bit Shim
inellfeleat. as stattlet appelit frets)* e -pretraft . Mt.
faro in that part of the country, And moll thoittfasse
.beirrehightoVer to this chantey In.weler So lief .0t
their education. He rdvetted to the pat kOW alt.
itotdr_thi Mt Minds a dos 'pet all[ I.k.
lint bra hoar** ais coitainir
oil=
.prefent meaf.ift went to itiolaen :.
olio to the 111/11, ire it bad oat Whit *kW Op de a
principle of fieeeiStt. fits atillbritt fee Oilsatil4-
non was contained in the words firtateriy made aro
of by a Noble Lord °mate ( Lord • CaPsestedis.)
TO tVe Ofteti thick by ilia Ira filiiiiii, lit slria. ihr
titularly objea; whether he confititVeift k__,_tia ort)t-
nating with die office', of the noun lite Wren;
could not be eanfidered Is oeindillrh %rhea a few'
Zandisg in ill the Miters to Ibilik,,ihrn •
. being grunted. and inlay rider.debtfriakintie
a refohnion -of this kind. After fame otheaallifeo.
it
variturs the Hertattrable Octallethilt. es his.
*amanita' at the conduit of NW' Neje in Shin-
fters. They hid declared the MN& id so
be its aid defeats, mod now at a veryperiloos sib
they were about to deprive it Of that defuterwhich
Wei bid fernifilytheideft foaeteilktys
Mr. Eleeretary YORKt toad tick help dealt/11ft
on the ocean's& diet dett.limu Gentladist
who jell flit down edit* Aide is the 1 Ipp,
al mica &Clete/yid Wild. ifs. Itee
il of ihatotaitsp, pored.* MI. I,*ll_lljete:teoteteriboe,
1 iiiibiiime Mr MajellY to trail hiaddif if the fertices
of the isidthinitie hveltistonatip. afire otontietful
Orange WNW; Slid 'l%. Illifet tit Idle lieu.
Geritiiillihd 'i - RisteaM pow, paratitlitir
when ii ir con i re that. at the 4iIIM the Said .Ad
ties palled. tithed MIS is the SSW* d!ifigatuttlth
fores
resed.
front internal cenditetioti and4telia a altelly.
Therebdholto tad idt at thattilhellinti frt.
and Aft' teal Bruit bad rafted ireitirard er rola the
coon off's-awe, Ma direltion, as was' • for
4relsimis Thereon& we toraparifons" bedereen
the danger,of that petted andel! prefent; sad yet
the Han. Gehthillan no eppdfed a matt eitich
he then apfiriiV.ed in a miffs of dft laubit &ester.
Ae•beela dot in thiulitcorer asy ~MM. Tits
.itight itiast Sectetary thinfeettpadartd the vie* ha
had formerly given of ebb Vianfltro. fie Mined it
to be confidered as Psis of I Pa n't an=
the difpofable torte of this estuary. Teo
mere were to be brought from Indaml to this malady,
but the defence of Ireland would fallain on %bey.
as an equal number was, prepared to be railed in
that country to fupply their plum It had ham
Rated that this *weft*, weateolaftehlfaidt with Ilse
iimiliA: frill Militia, and that it was COMM" ie.
fyitero. Met the fat was, that the . .40Pre
preftrided to be recognized Wine
crates. It wit deperted Van lllll:Steauft.
war, in tircustlanices equally maths
Bog all circus:46mm cdaW.eted, it oettfalthyvall2
be a fair queftion, even in point of 'Pledels .
it Might not be proper on the relent ocealon to
ftrengthcn the force of this country, though, in Tome
reptile, at the eipence of Irelaad. It wit not die
intention of Government, however, to diatinith the
force of this emintry. The ten thOefand seen oleghe
be replaced by dthcr troops froth this ortoritYy Than
the Army of Referee, for intbinee, ihdepeadently of
the intreafe of their own Militia, which is ago in con-
taisplation. The Hon. Gentlernaa had mailtfaeme
&Worn on the ditbanding of the Militia at the con-
elution Of peace; (he lid Wes. (hat oh thitoinition
it would be found that moll of the men then cott
pofing the Militia had fervid their ftipolated time,
and were therefore loft to the public. Meddle! wilily
fee that the Hon. Gentlftnan was ne Mend tp who
Militia fyllem in Irelisnfi ; het, as /se aid not aw:eit
on ch.& fot.jodi., he world *twat orrefit-aafter iota...any
vindication of it. He would only remind the Hoare
that the lout guineas had not been pro as a
bounty to the Militia•in Ireland till after hr:liiray..
Meliltge, when the demand, for men became more
urgent ; but then the Regulars received g teirestss.
lie was hirptired to hear Tu znoch Paid lithe viola•
tion of the Militia Syliem. There was no violation
nor breach of faith in the prefent inflanee. It would
not even now have beets aluellion, indef. the wen
thtmfelves had had the (pint and patriotifm to id.
'MUM!' the estenflon of their cervices. Fat 'from
thinking that the hills Militia would be mush better
any whore die than at home; far from fufpeting
their loyalty, he thought them a mall excellent force,
and were only to be brought here train their own so.
luntary offer. They were not inferior in any refpet
• to any corps in the United Kingdom (base ! hoer !)
. The i'Aighflt Militia were fent to Ireland, it is sruc.
in the year 1798, when there was an urgent call fto
their affillarce ;but the Militia was fent ilfo fromtki
country to Ireland when all danger was over. Bin
what tile, the lionmitable Gentleman'fay to the att
of the It illi Parliament, of which he himfelf was, a
Memhet, lenJinz the 16(11 Militia when there was•r
• nver-rviing nee: fri!, But it i. atetted, that the a!,
1 . mill: n of fuch i.ff.rs introduces into the army tie
r liberation, oloch is to ai togerous to order and dis..i
i plinc. Of ,lchberatirc powers, to a certain extent, in
any (1C1C1;,,t1..fl Of it orp,, he was ready to admit 1:•.:
ct.,7-i;,:z. But Ili: Ili.ai. Ciotti:Tr-it ittratd to regyo

he
:it
.7,
Ile

every apptpach to deliberation as foalething very
terrible. Might not a captains however, eoniult his
company in what wooer they would be Rid their
arrears, without any very remarkable dative cube;
to order er difcipline I What will the Gentleman
fa/ of this& who went to Egypt, though their Cervices
.wee eta limited nature ? What will he fay of the
.4th regiment, headed by*Coloneltpencer, or of the
ohl Isns Taacilticer with five or fix • other regimehts
(hor,how) ehor netwfthltanding their engagements
of limited fervid*, volenteered to go to Egypt, and
mare accepted' the argument the Hon. Gentleman
bud drama. from many being unwillingly dragged
, lots Awl offers from tear of blame, or of an impu-
•eatiow of want of fpitit, would militate equally
wiaft the votes of this Houk. Of the number
•
1 ~ vote upon any quenton, there are many who do
:Co from very different motives. An officer's-name
) bad ban mentioned in the Account fubmiucd to the
lima who bad refufed-to extend his cervices to this ,
try. No Ganthiman could regret the arcane:
Iheione mote than he did; itittutthe fame time he vats
'far from attaching any blames to that oiler. la i
his tearn regime:at, be reeoileBlli when geniis-to he*
Aand, there were fueratolficees vsho could not as+
company them, from, family emmallions, or- other
reafone of a fouler nattnea hut wo.difgrace was ever,
*mulled to them oq that &wog.' The Right Hon.
Gentleman concluded by pofitively declaring, that
the rnetfure was 'not by any. means adopted with a
view to fend the Britifh Militia.to Irelands though,
at the fame time, he would not pledge him elf, thould
may bloody rebellion break - out in that country, or
.fhould the enemy, invade it. not to concur in fending
the Miliva of this Country to their altßance, bould
they have fpirit enough, as he believed they would,
to volunteer their let vices. He could fee nothing its
else fpirited offer of the Irith Militia, but an expref.
lion of gratitude for the &reins they had received
firm the Militia of this Country, when they were in
went of their alliance. As ado&er of Kilda, be
one a friend to the assafure.
r 4 Mr. CALM/VET idmitted•that there were fame
=in which he agreed with the Right Hon. Gen.
who.heA Fat down; but could eat be con.
also* at she ikon time, by any airman* he had
• • alliniend. thaeshe prefect astatine was of a nature
itomiesephatolioadi Should any over.rnling
falleaty vasith the Righollem.Onstkessis hod-amen-
elanabia lireostenthf. nohappily eta, there mold
=l;vesture ft) thy, be one opittion on des
1% itch raltetlty could belled for this
eligearitile hoe .ar, i. fifth *toeleh°lle was' efraid otkdse gr wouldn
leamem,h itoigerous precedent. If it wasconfidered
iSsalot. ia note operate rectprocally. Sbonld this
agilliitit bilk it moll lay to under new
.
in.tbeir curl airs melt be dX
charged, which may lead in the end to very never
IlitattOttal confequences. The queftion ought car.
haply to be argued on a conititutional point; but
this esti of the fabled the Right Hoo. Gentleman
has paired over very lightly. Sr could not but eon-
War the inealitre its a refs breach of the Militia law,
which required the Cervices of this fpecies of fence to
be coated within the kingdom where they were
railed. If you change the nature of the fervice, bow
Mitosis expel" that Geodesics of landed property
and of interred in the country, as =oft of the Militia
oft:era are, can (abash to thelnconveniency of fere-
ilig.in foch corps ? How (hall you expea to have a,
Mwil agitated or a well difeiplined Militia, if you
orewert them into a deliberative body ? . Yoe have
introduced a deliberative fibrin into corps of another
44ription (the liohnowirs.) the. inconveniency of
winch is already Ulan* felt. Yaw might not
tharafam. by the. fame seams, to dilemmas and
render left valuable the metastatic and coollinnional
form alba country. Moe it not be reckoned a de.
eciritunslienm by ea giber of Writ to have
mtdrawn up in a body, and to .imimWt them in 1
Oath a make if they wsrawffriug to Carve abroad ?
Were this country se !Immediate' Jaeger and taro.
tedled at home. thsthoelltbelfe eleoe apology for the
aiming& But when both comdelee are equally in
dove, ma these-boaay promise? or
order
in de-
riving one of a needier, defence in order to motet
the other I . But, fappok that we feud ten thou-
lasoimen to inland in place of dusk to be drafted
Irons it, what advantage mold accrue, be withed
to know, from faith an arrangement ? It was the
opinion of military men, that molt fervice will be
obtaiatifrom militias in the country or particular
ditirid in which they are railed. The Right Hooour-
able Gentleman certainly could not pat the prefent
meefure on the fame footing with the Englith militia
going to Ireland in t 709, when the French were ac-
tually in that country. No man could have a greater
relpeti for the Irilh militia than he had. No man
could honour more their motives for offering their
fervices to this country; but the nature of the maids
force renders loch offers extremely improper. By
this means we kopek alto additional hoidens on the
landed men of Ireland, who at confrderable expence
have already railed the 3 8,000 militia, that were
eiem,ht by chi. oeuntr) Culige:~. by isty;nB them
under the necetlity of railing io,ooo more. If to:00o
more are really neceffary, let them be railed on a
general plan, without particularly affeaing any chats
of men. No fufpicion was pretended to be entertain-
ed. indeed. from what he himfelf had witneffed, no
fufpicinti could be entertained of the loyalty of the
Vint militia ; no pretence of this kind therefore could
jultify the meafure. By this new levy, alto propofed,
of the additional to,coo men in Ireland, a compcti•
tinn would be crested to the fix battalions now to be
tailed there. He could not think it by any means
prudent, betides, to withdrew the men of propeity
from Ireland, as this meafnre went to do, in the pre-
fent cribs. What would the Englifh fay, were
they called upon to leave their country and their fit-
linlies at the prefent moment of danger ? Would
they not think it unfair to be called on to defend
ethers while their own families were in equal dan-
ger ? After leveret other pointed oblervations, the
Hon. Gentleman concluded, by Rating, that if the
meafiire were in any degree warranted by expedi-
entY. he &mild not °bred to it; but without fend
obvious neeeflity, he mull oppofc the relinquitionent
of conititutional principles.
Mr. A LIXANDER. chi:login every ps inciple of
i public policy &mild induce the Houle to accept of
tie offers in quettion. England was at prefent eer-
tain'y mote menaced than Inlaid. The minterous
fotce of the mealy collated oppofite the Englith
toad, reader thejegbei Ram of preps lion in this,

•u,
tan
net
ing
[CC.

va
Pen
w!)

Rf[•
(Ur
Bllt

lIK a

I
it, it
t C.l
IC*