Star.
London, England, 1807-01-24 00:00:00

I.

.g

:"...,

.

-S•<,

:...

i

~.. ~ ,

.

• H.:,

,

were:to beromsd in the Efiimates 'upon the table
above thpfe Of the Preceding year.
Mr. THORNTON approved highly of the general
nature of the new Military Sy Hem, which appeared to
him to he well calculatee for improving the difeipline
and value of the art +, by introducing men of a
better defcription. He thought, however, that force-
thing ail' remained to be done. He wi(hed that the
Training Bill thould be carried into effeEl, and that
expeditious means timid be taken to place the
country in a proper (late, either for defence or for
annoyance to its enemies.

Mr. JACOBS, at Come length, defended the
meafures of Miniflers, in not fending nut reinforce-
ments to Buenos Ayres, until the fuccefs of the
enterprize Ihould be afcertained.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER, in
a fprech of confiderable length, force, and
not only defended the military fyflem of his
Right Honourable Friend (Mr. Windham) againft
the attacks of its opponents, as well as on the wound
of its fuperior produaivenefs, both in the number
and defeription of men railed under it,' compared
with the fyilem of the lall AdminiQra•ion, but yin
dicated the eflimates for the fervice of the yei, on
the ground of ',economy, againft the charges of Mr.
Johnflone and Mr. Role. Thcfe Hon. Gentlemen
had feized upon fome part of the fyflem of high
bounties, and encouraging allowances to the trovs
in fupport of their allegations; but he was convinced,
that when the counry, reflefted upon the fuperior
and permanent advantages that muf} obviltifly ac-
crue to the military fyflem, they would by no mears
confider the increafe of expenditure for this porpofe
in the light of profufion, or unwarrantable excels.—
The Hon. Members, however, in arraigning a pre
tended profufion in the exceedings under fovue heads,
carefully avoided to notice the contiderable favings
on others. They teemed totally to forger, that under
the head of Commiffariat, in which a laving of
500,0001. was effeeed laft year, there was a fur-
ther laying of 50,0001. upon the eflimate for this.
—They forgot to notice that upon the Staff alone,
there was a laving from the laft year of 47,0001.
But from thefe circurnflances the country would
fee that if, for a more produflive and permanent
fyflem of increafe to the army, by a fuperior de-
fcription of troops, and of encouragement to the
hopes and provifion for the old age and retreat of
thole foldiers who devote their lives to the fervice of
their country—an exceeding of ex pence was created;
that exceeding was counterbalanced by a faring in
the fuppreffion of erlabliffiments really ufelefs and
inefficient to the public fervice : he added, that not-
withflanding the boatted economy of the Right Hon.
Gentleman (Mr. Rafe) which he would have prat.
tired, and the aflonithing reforms in public expence,
and wonderful increafe in the army he would have
effeaed, had nut his country been unfortunately de-
prived of the advantages of his fervices by the change
of Adminiftration, yet there was found in the office,
immediately after his departure, a military eltimate
for the fervices of the eafuing year, which, though not
figned with his name, had, without doubt,his fanaion,
amounting to no let's a fum than 14,000,0001. which
was 648,0001. more than the eltimate which he this
night charged with walte and pruft:fion.
Mr. ROSE replied in fupport of his former argu-
ments, and laid, that although the Eltimate alluded
to by the Noble Lord might have been found en a
fhelf in the office, it was one prepared in the War
Office for the infpeetion of his Majetty's Government,
but never approved by them, nor rne.lnt to have been
ailed upon ; on the contrary, the eflimate which they
really meant to have adopted was above 5cc,0001.
below that adapted by his Majcfty's prefent Minitters.
The SECRETARY at WAR fpnke in fupport of
the prefent eflimate and military fyitem.
Lord CASTLEREAGH against both ; and con-
tended they were utterly fallacious.
Sir JOHN NEWPORT role to make one nbfer.
'anion, in anfwer to Mr. Johnftone, relneaing the
exiftence of two Mutter Matitrs General in Ireland,
as another intlance of profufion ; he begged, how-
ever, to inform the Hon. Member, that whether
there were two or only one, the expence to the
country was not thereby innreafed, as their emolu•
meet arofe entirely from fees, and not from Glary.
There was one document l)ing on the table, of %hich
no Gentleman thought proper to take any notice,
namely, a Bill to abolifh no let ; than thirty-eight
fintcute places. with high Walks, and to abolith, or
render more efficient, tweoty-fix more, all of them
not only created by the unpardonable profufion of the
former Adminitiration, but promifeJ three deep, in
reverfion, to nt.w occupants ! and though, in fome of
them, two of thole had fallen off within the last two
years, yet the places were Rill in exitlence, and likely
In t- continue for lime time. From the ab-liti in of
thate places, the Houle would lee to which let of
men the liticerity of profellion belonged ; for it was
now evident that his Majetty's prefent Miniliers were
carrying into circa the principles they pi ofeffed when
out of office.

Mr. PERCEVAL replied to the Hon. Baronet,
and argued, that the al),.lition i f thofr places was in
conrequence of the reconimendati,‘n of Commillioners
appointed under the late Adminillration, and that
the credit of the meafure did not hrlong to the pre-
Colt Government. Ile then adverted to the preterit
milita y fyltem, avaiall which he repeated many of
the arguments all eady °pooled to it, deifying that it
h .J or could have the effats which weie attributed
to it.

• Mr. WINDHAM replied to Mr. Percival, and
(Aid the fpeech he had uttered conliited nnlj of the
line arguments, affertions, mil-conceptions, and mit-.
reprefentations which had over alid over again been
knfwered, difprayed, or refuted. .

The dilcuffion was kept up without any thing novel,
between the Secretary .at War, Mr. Perctval, Lord
Caftlereagh, Mr. Bragge Bathurtl, and Lard Ho% ick,
11 the comparative merits of the late and prefent mi.
Wary fytlems, and at three in the. morning the grief-
t.on was put, that the refolutions be now read t which
vas agreed to. They were then read, atter which
d.e Secretary at war obtained leave to bring itc.the
Annual Mutiny Bill.
Sir JaHN NEWPORT gave notice, that on Mon-
day, in the Committee of Ways and Means, he thould
in,.ve for Exchequer Bilk to the amount of one mil-
lien, for the ferrite of 7 nd.—At, a quarter pat
three o'clock this m ' the Hawk adjourned to
Zrlorday.