The Sun.
London, England, 1842-07-13 00:00:00

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, cause of the existing distress . lie denied that such an opinion !
ANTI-CORN-C . AW' CONFERENCE
. , prevailed. 'Hie belief —the couvietion was, that the. Corn-
The Delegates met again Yesterdey uryening at I,eve, it.w., were the great, the leading cause of the ciletsesse's the
o'Clock, at Herbert's (tate Beown's) Hotel; Paiace-::. an', earent of the mews causes, and if it were removed ad thoe
:Mr. P. A. Taylor in the Chair., .. II I i nor C:ilbt's would aiso vanish. The
thoursh Mr. ;le d the reusing in bad harvests were
The CHAIRMAN said he thought than al e , • am, a,
Villiers had been defeated last night in the House of country. Providence was thus blasphemously charged with
causing the suffering of the. poor. But when measures were
Conmonee-em event which he apprehended would rst
astonish any (A. the gentlemen around him, because they taken to prevent the introduction among us of the productions
could have expected nothing else—yet lie did think that of other countries which had not had bad harvests, were not
there was some subject of congratulatino f r them in the e authors of those measures also the anthers of the distress ?
o
Let those persons take care how they continue to counteract the
tone of many of the speeches treacle last night by °"() their -
thbenefits of Providence. Let them look to what had been the fate
nents. In the first place, there was a very great soreness
thanifeeted towaOs the Anti-Corn-law League ; and he of other countries, where the rights of the people were thus
held back. Let them look to the example of France in the last
_took that to be no very bad sign.—(Hear, hear.) They
century—of old Rome, of Greece, and many other countries.
were spoken of as an annoyance, but he did not read ii But the lust of Mammon had a more powerful influence on the
•t he reports of the proceedings that they were treated minds of the aristocracy, than the experience`hf history. The
with any marks of contempt. lie read nothing that Duke of R chmond had, on a former occasion, ssailthat: tile
showed•their efforts were undervalued. Their opponents Corn-laws were repealed, he would flee toe a„ fiajrneliegsns lyaooud repeal
were dissatisfied with their power, but that was not a (Mr. Hawkes) would say to the Dk ,
thing for them to grieve at. They were dissatisfied that the Corn-laws you shall be compelled to flee." He (Mr.
• of the House should attempt to influence
part s+ out Hawkes) w.ondered if it had occurred to the Duke, to think
that both himself and the members of his order would have to
ealernbers in the House. He need not remind them that
it was for that very object they had come together
—flee if they would save their lives. When a man was starving
when he saw his wife, his children, and all those
—([liar)—and therefore the regret expressed was at
most dear to him ready to die of want, the dictates of
any rate an evidence that to some degree at least they religion had little or no influence upon los mind. He (Mr.
had succeeded in that which they hed attempted. lie Ilawkes) trusted those meetings would continue, ant that the
thought also that Sir R. Peel had nut crowed quite so Press would continue to enlighten the nation on the deplorable
loudly as he had done a little IN bile since. A short time condition of the people. If the people were instructed as to
ago he did not hesitate to say that the measures which the cause of their sufferings, and the besfterepmreedssiesfo t.odor a)il eftheo-
the Government had passed would be most certainly per- acingesthoefmtheansaittiownaws oluildthbee aocw^oemr of
shed at no distant time,
be given them ; and he spoke of his policy sieted in. But now lie only hoped that a fair trial would
awind:l 'that, too, without the effusion of blood.
as a sort et
The Rev. Dr. PERRY, of Reading, wished tooffer an observe •
experiment ; and supposing the experiment did not sue-
tion on a remark that had' fallen from the last speaker. That
coed, he expressed his readiness, notwithstanding his
gentleman had said that those who were oppressed with hunger
by-gone opinion, to try something else—(Hear, hear)
would not be influenced by the dictates of religion in his efforts
—that was to say, he should be prepared to alter that to remedy his sufferings. Now he (Dr. Perry) must say that
which he had been so confident would succeed. In self-preservation was the first dictate of the Christian religion
the whole tone of the debate of last night, in the —it was the first law of nature, and lie contended that those
mode in which the proceedings of the Delegates who neglected that law—who acted not upl to that die-
me
were .estimated, and in the annoyance expressed at those fate, and did not preserve hislife,
was
sSogounierty than
hana orbuffer
proceedings, it appeared to him they had satisfactory evi- whichor
hiswere forbidden—murder.
deuce that they' had succeeded to some extent since they himselfall
children to starve, he (13r. Perry) would
had met together in Lonion.—(Hear, heat.)
take bread from the table of the Prime Minister.
Mr. LEWIS, the Delegate from Stroud, then addressed the
The c trentatAN then read the following lettere, or ex-
meeting. As it might be imagined that the West of England
tracts of. letters, from correspondents in the country:—
was in a flourishing condition he must be allowed to say a few
Bury, July 10,1842. words. He believed there was no part of England in which
My dear Sire-at assure you
.I cannot express the gratitude
the shopkeepers and the middle-classes were in a worse condi-
] feet for your exertions.' in order to ' rid our country of that,
tion than they were in the West. The part of the country he
its foulest blot, the Corn-law. For your three letters sent me
represented was noted for the fine cloth it produced. It had
I am very much obliged, and have to inform you I have vile- been said by Mr. Ferranti that the falling off of the trade in
culated the contents of them as much as possible, and that they
Yorkshire had arisen in consequence of the introduction of
have given unlimited satisfaction to all those who felt themselves
devil's dust ; now with respect to that article it had been sup-
interested in your deputation. Your remarks to the Confer-
posed that it was a species of dust. Such, however, was not
enee have pleased all parties here, Whig, Tory, or Radical—all
e the case ; it was the old cloth manufactured by a certain pro-
entertain and express themselves that they are a true state or
cess. He believed that such manufactures took place in York-
the condition of the inhabitants of this town and neighbourhood.
shire, but it was unknown in the West of England. The falling
Since I received your letter this morning I have seen seven
off of the trade in that part could not be attributable to that.
ar eight ef the friends, who take a part in these proceedings,
In the Vale of Chafer, one of the finest in the world, there
who are all of them of one opinion, that is, you must
was the greatest distress. In that part there were originally
remain in London until the Conference separates. You
thirty-three manufactories, and now there were only three.—
are aware we cannot get up a meeting of the Council
(Hear, hear.) In Painswick there was not a soli •
of the Association before to-morrow evening, when your cum- tart' manufactory at work—( Hear, • bear)—although for-
munications shall be laid before them, and I will write to you
merly there were twelve or fifteen, and at the present
felt particulars, which you will receive on Tuesday afternoon,
moment one of its principal manufacturers was an inmate of
or Wednesday morning at latest. All the friends to whom I
the union workhouse.—( Hear.) Cottage property had become
have' spoken express their readiness to join in the expenses
of no value ; he (Mr. L.) had 12 or 15 vacant, and he could not
which may occur in the increased time of your attendance i
let them at any rate ; and he knew a gentleman who was about to
London. pull down eleven in order to clear the ground.—( Hear, hear.
I shall be very glad to hear from you at all times, and
lie wOuld now cross oier the hills crowned as they Were with
I particularly rejoice that you have had an opportunity of verdure, to Heighley, Dursley, Coley, and Cann. Dursley,
stating your opinion of things to the head of the Government,
twenty years ago, was the principal manufacture of fine cloth
knowing full well you would deal faithfully with him. Mrs.
and kerseymere, but the Shepherds and the other great menu-
Helt joins me in kind regards to you, and believe me to remain,
fact urers had gone, and mita that had originally cost 60,0001.
your obedient.servant, THOMAS Hor.
had been sold for 4,0001., and places where originally thou-
p. S.— .:Ir. E. Hardman, it is reported, has i unformed his
sands of hands had been employed had now became partly
printers that if they will work for the prices paid to apprentices,
iron-foundries. In other parts the mills were entirely dismantled,
be can employ them; if not, he will have all hie work done
and paces that were formerly flourishing had now become de-
by boys. • ,_ : versed, and mew who'hed forrinerly,occupied the, manufactories
- Todmorden, Friday,--July 7, 1842.
were gone to Saxony or Americae-e( Hear,- hear.-.)e In Stroud,
We beg toetpress-our approval of the plans at agitation re-
which might perhaps be considered - the most favoured part of
eeinmended:byeyoile Corninittee; we thinieethem prudent and
Eogland., the greatestelistress existed, and the wages of the la-
jodieieus, and hope. they will be fully anal effectually executed.
'bonier• had • been reduced: For' his ownpart, he had been
:We also pre=ume it unnecessaryfor us to. urge ,upon you. the. 'obliged
latterly to reduce the ' wages of his workmen,
necessity of your remaining in town, with other friends, until
and that redaction would still go on, unless some
these efforts have been fairly fried; don't let Peel's party
potent remedy were applied. If the Premier would, however,
exult over another " early' separation," but remain firm, reso-
only hold out some hope of a modification of the Corn-laws, lie
lute, viol seem determined not to return until something be
could treble his busines3.--eillear, hear.) The wages now
dune to alleviate the distress and calamities that await us. were not half what they were in 1825. In the town of Stroud
The House ef Commons, it seems, dia not think it wo. th
one-third of the shops were closed. Cottage Property
their while to muster sufficiently numerous to enable business
had become utterly valueless, vast numbers or them were
to proceed (on
.alonslay lest) when the distress of the country
untenanted.—(Hear, hear.) The pool-rates were increasing,
was to be taken into consideration ; snake them feel this in all
and everything was getting worse. Such was the state of the
the wets you can invent, and make them understand that yen
far-famed golden valley, and if this state of things continued,
are for having. ocular demonstration of their attendance in the
the most dreadful consequences would be the result. Since
House, to vote the supplies. the meeting of the present Conference, he had heard three
Our grocers, and other shopkeepers, are about to have a
Conference respecting their prospects. Something will be done, .or.efeur things prohseed, which hitherto would only be feasi-
Di in some parts of
but whether a man from their own body will be sent up to country. Their highly-gifted Secretary,
of whom Lord Brougham had said that he was the most
town, or their wishes wirl be communicated to you, I am un-
eloquent man in England, had proposed that they should
able at present to say, but no doubt shall have semething for
allow their furniture to be taken by the tax-;tar
you :ou this subject in my next. Accept ley best wishes on
therer. That might do very well in some parts, but
behalf of self and friends, and remain yours.
Todmorden, July 7, 1842. he thought it would not be palatable in others.
With respect to closing the manufactories, that proceeding
We beg, to acknowledge the receipt of your letter. of }ester-
would fall on the country, and the different localities. That
day, and take the first opportunity of informing you that it is
would not do, for, he was convinced, that were the factories
the opinion of all here, that the Conference have acted wisely
once closed, many of them would never open again. Many
in deferring their departure, se a little agitation in London is
persons would be glad to close their factories. If he (Mr.
likely to have a greater effect on the Government than if pro.
Lewis) could do so he would. He hail heard one project from
reeding from the country. The shopkeepers hero are now may-
a gentleman there that he did not think would result in good.
ing, and though slew, we think they will do something at last,
as they must feel the distress more severely every week. It would take twelve months to carry out, and they might be
•
It is.the wish of your friends that you should not return at all in their graves before that time.—( Hear, bear.) They
never could go through the winter.
the time you mentioned, but join in keeping up the agitation in
A DELEG TE Wat is that project?
town some time longer. In all probability you may be re-
Mr. LesvtAs—The gentleman
.read it from a paper ; it was
limd by wine other person's attendance when the shopkeepers
have Cdmpleted their:arrangements. -•• a great variety of practices combined in one. Another gen-
Ihs.l•lstioe,AirselLawitos, of- Kendal,' was. then called tleman was for going to the bar of the House of Commons and
demanding an interview. That was impossible. They well
, upon ~py,tlw, , Chairman, , and . proueeded. to • address the
knew how they were treated in February last. Then; with
neeeekn,g.,
...Oen ;he died. left borne at.the (warmer-Icemen!' ;respect to an interview with the Premier, they all 'saw with
of Ineleseeelt,ta:.esler, to represene tire:pewit of -Kendal, what cold-blooded apathy they were received by him. -They
andlShe , sesminpre; ugricaltural 4ietteets, he, felt that could expect nothing from him. 'they received all that
heiVti-e •Ce keng lit; Ais'eliarge a very sldernq anti it yore was expected. He (Mr. Lewis) stood at Ids elbow
enelhaisllol4`titil!'`llle't'lentsty of fro' place witioli called all ' the time, and he trembled so much that lie
ri oii4liltielifY frig tire' liiihrie asyniliathy than the town Of made him (Mr. Lewis) fancy he was an old man.—(Laughter )
Kkin'ilal: i7phiii4,?lnightlii' oilier places in which the die- He (Mr. Lewis) had heard a most splend d speech in time
.. . - House. itof Lords last evening, and he observed the listlessness with
treas•W:ee sitill'ereater; but the town of leendel eehibittel
e - which was listeped to. Many Brohrips were there, amongst
ttsie /with:wit:ye that, fur tire last six years; the progress
whom was the Archbishop of Canterbury. There was nothing
oil'. the annihilation of its trade had been so .ex to be derived from this or from the other House. They would
teriskeeepetileyraeso gentle, so gradual, so progressive, never do any thing until they (the Deputation) made common
thitte,!,..1)11...-494.' 'been- just "Pt alive in the l'o'on" [-i•ause with the Chartists.—( Great cheering.) The moment
of .4to- unforiOnate inhabitants. With this hope they t they did that the Whigs and the Tories would join. 'they would
had:heen,itultte-ed to
,linger in the. precincte of the town ' unite within seven dais. They would then have their enemy
w itli. sql-fiatiotiditil,i, 'Written in their faces, while they fairly before them. they would then obtain their object as
wel'et.'''inkaiig"line after another into the workhouse.— they did with respect to the Reform Bill.—( Hear, hear.) If
(Ilehr,li('ar.) The town presented the strange condition there had been two sections then, that question would never
'
have been carried. He doubted if the country was not worse
its .e
of bOnglin-the'sitetne state with regard to the number of
off now than before that measure. Without the Charter they
ikettlationetiseitt the year 1841. The census of 1841
would do nothing; at all ought to include the Ex-
steteWedjten ineclease., of - only' 137 souls as compared with
tension of the Suffrage and Vote by Ballot. Now, his project
thuceneuwol--1-831; and that had happened in what had was to unite as early as possible. He thoUght that lecturers
beep one of the Most prosperous of our manufacturing ought to go round London, as the people in London were ex-
towretee '1:1-o condition of the unfortunate inhabitants tremely ignorant on this subject. Hi: project, also, was to send
wasecalmeleted to make the hardest heart bleed—nay, fur Mr. Sturge, to town, that they might at once create a union
even that of Sir 11. Peel, and if he had witnessed it, ho which would bear all before it.—( Hear, hear.) The whole
cria‘bi: rioter : hese made the speech he had delivered district was in the deepest distress. •
lasiThighe in 'the House of Commons.—(hear, hear.) Mr. DANIELS, of alarylebone, said some complaints had
Ilr; thought that the sight of this distress would melt a been made respecting the metropolitan parishes not having
come forward to assist in the present movement. New he
heart of stone, and it wee because he was, surrounded by
the''glitter of the nobility, by splendid buildings, b, could state that he had seen several persons at the
Conference besides himself from the parishes of Marylebone
masses of wealth, that he could not realise to his eyes and St. Pancras, and had endeavoured on several occasions
theeecenee of destitution and gradual death which to obtain a hearing, in order to express their concurrence ii;
theyeespocially, those who were ministers ut' the Gospel, the objects of the League. He belonged to an Association in
weee_ecompelled. day by day to behold. Ile was nut illarylebone, which was formed by Mr. Sydney Smith, and
going to detain the meeting with any statistical details; the object of which was to secure the bees against the
thee Report he had condensed before he came, which injuries which were inflicted upon them by the drones.—
weuld be put Into the press without the meeting being troubled (Hear, hear). There is an altered state of things in this
with its details. But he hadnointed out that one peculiar fact country. Formerly it was the custom of Ministers to do all in
in their ease was, that owing to the gradual operation of the their power to promote the prosperity of trade ; now they
Cern-slaws thehsopulation of Kendal had been emigrating to knew the Government only as an instrument of exaction.—
ether eowns or other countries in search of that employment ( Hear, hear). They had heard much of the truck system.
which they could not receive at home, or were sinking into a . Why, what were the Corn-laws but the great truck system,
premature grave. They had the same population now as !key whereby the landlord compelled the people to deal at his own
haalerf years ago, but they had lost much of their independence, shop? A person in his parish, who was regarded as
much of their manly spirit, much of their capital upon which a religious man, had said to him, that if there was not wheat
one-fourth of their population had been feeding enough the people should seek other food, such as beans, peas,
( Hear, hear.) 'the amount paid in wages in Kendal had and oats. He believed that if they did that they would soon
- diminished by 18,560 a. and this was considered so complete an have an agricultural society endeavouring to prove the nu-
under-statement, that if it were fixed at 20,0001. the amount tritious property of the bark of trees.—(Hear, .hear. hear.)
of the d, crease would be nearer the truth. In lieu of this, the. He would read to the meeting a statement, which would show
working classes only received, at the hands of the Poor-law the increase of pauperism and distress in the parish of Mary-
Guardians, the sum of 1,1221., which left them less to
.spend lehone. (The Hon. Delega e then read the statement.)
on clothes arid rental, by 14,738/a' What was' the influence of Now what was all this for? The farmers did not want pro-
thiS•on the agricultural district surrounding Kendal? ' It de- ttction. sHe knew many farmers, and their eyes were begin-
pended on supplying Manchester, Liverpool, ' Bolton, and Obi. to be opened to the true state of the case. They knew
other places mis h.agrictiltural produce, especially eggs,' butter, that' they did not need. protection. Lord Leicester, Lord Spen-
and poultry: From the diminution in ' the amount of wages cer, Lord Kinnaird, Lord Radnor, and other landowners,
paid' ;to -the operatives, the sale of these articles had had distinctly stated that they required no pro-
greatly decreased ; butter was quite a drug in the market, tection.—( Hear, hear.) Those who desired .a repeal
and could not be sold at Bd. a lb. Did' not the poor farmer, of the Corn-laws, were desirous of holding out the right hand
whose rent did not fluctuate, suffer by this state of things ? of fellowship to the farmer. If they bore enmity to any, it
When hi's produce was depreciated 30 per cent- in value., would was only to those oho increased the rent of the farmer fur the
his landlord return him 30 per cent. of his rent ? No; he • oppression of the country.—( Cheers.) There were many who
would make a great favour of returning perhaps five per eent.,• adeecatectfor an extension of the suffrage. So did he ; but he
and lee lauded in the newspapers for his bedeiolence. This 'thought they would not advocate that cause the worse for having
wag •the effect of the depression in- the egriculturat districts; theirbellieSfull.—(Cheers. ) He,however, thought an Extension
which hid first been made rich by the rise -of 'mantifaatures. .of the Suffrage without the Ballot would be worse than use-
If the Means by which these mechanics lived were taken aWaye .lessee Thousands in the borough of Marylebone had ceased to
the.eeits of the Corn•laws must ultimately fall'On 'the landlords register, on account of the oppression to which they had been '
• theyneeves. But it was a melancholy reduction to exposed, and he was of opinion that it would be of no use to ex-
think that-in the ,meantime, the greatest suffering fell aeon tend the suffrage 'without, at the same time, extending protec.
those who, by their teases, were in their landlord;,' poWer and. tion to the voter.—( Cheers.) Why, Sir James Graham had,
bound. to'continue on their estatesawhether; fotaeill cirlioe:' -in 1835, stated that if the Corn-laws should be repealed, the
The -aceounti -from .an parts of the%eountey' codflerne this' •landlords . would .not be able to pay the mortgages. Were the
statement, and it was their firm belief that the price of corn people to be taxed in order that the landlords might dishonestly
conld•not rise,much higher, without causing a'netional convul- 'retain possession of that which was net their' own?—( Cheers. )
sion. -- He. -believed -that' in the manufacturing districts they It they were not the rightful owners of the land, let them give
were on the verge of disturbanees which would not be'repressed it up, and let the rightful owners take possession. —(Loud
wept by shedding' blood, beceuse 'the obstinacy of their go- cheers.) He was'himself a pawnbroker,• and had had oppor-
vernors led the (unities of seeing the. dreedfel .etate of distress existing. A
n). to look onehese things with calm 'amid unruffled
eyes, and they would employ the force in their hands, the police poor creature had pawned, her bed,' and afterwards sold the
and soldiery-of the country, tee repress tumult, rather than ticket; she had.previously disposed of her mattress, and then
takeether means to prevent it. In Parliament they. diseo- she burned her bedstead;' and when asked why she had done
vexed that they must wait the progress of events—the Minis- so, she replied it was to prevent the landlord from getting
tors said their measures had not been sufficiently tried—it was it; and we were nearly in the same state. We should soon
evident that :hey were to wait till the country was raised to the be obliged to burn the bedstead to prevent the landlords getting
utmost pitch of deputation, and not till it had shown itself in it. He wished other places would take example by Maryle-
a manner not to be mistaken, would any new consideration be bone ; there, in order to prevent a Tory from getting in, they
given to these laws, to whir k they all attributed.their present had sunk their private differences, and placed the two men be-
distress. Sir R. Peel had ad'lin repeated les belief that much fore the constituency, balloted for them, and had, in anise-
of the local distress arose in
the increase of machinery ; quence, returned two Liberals. While the Government were
but what caused this restless invention of machinery ? It was splitting farthings they should not be splitting straws. Let
to evade that heavy and costly element of production in manu- them unite, and then they must secure the repeal of this
factures which the Corn-laws created ;it was to evade the em • iniquitous law.—( Cheers.)
.
ployment of human labour, which the Corn-laws made so SMITH said that before he addressed them on
costly. The Corn-laws compelled them to pay one-third more the measures winfeh ouagshetxptorebssei adopted, he begged to remind
oexpressionsn utteredexpressions
f mere in
indtihveiduCaolnopfeirneinonce.,
them that n
would be loooliCiedoapothne
lot.their food than other nations, and from this cause arose the
The country looked
upon them as the representatives of the
restless invention of machinery, to take the employment
and.
.considered that the opinions were the expression
out of the hands of men, to .which they we
com-
(Pieftee' opinion of those represented. 'I he country looked to
polled. by Sir Robert Peel's own laws the dreadful
1.11/11/4 impious Corn-laws.' Sir Robert Peel had taken a re-
great cause which they had undertaken. It had been sag-
aiew,efsthe prices of coen,since 1815, asking that as they were them to exercise prudence and wisdom in the conduct of the
ested that their agitation was not on a sufficiently broad
high in 1815,10 w in 1833 and 18:35, and were now high
basis ; they were toad that they should join with it the
• afiatnsrliew. 'the Corn-laws could be said to be the cause of the g
depreciatfon of wages ? In 1615, the Continent had beensuffrage.
ravaged, by a quarter of a century of war, smut it was impos. movement. That question had frequently been 'gravely dis-
sibte that it could compete with
tale Ade manufactures, whatever
neither to the right nor to the left, but to keep this agitation
was the ❑rice of fod here.
. But theyi had since had another quarter of century
a of before the country. independent of any other—(Cheers)—and
peace; o . which the Continent had taken advantage, and even at the expen.e of any other.—(Cheers.) The joining'
w'erd now •martuittetnring for themselves.—( [Tear, hear.) it with the movement for the extension of the suffrage worths
Sii li,' Peal asked host it Was, if this distressexisted to the ex- be rather ruining its basis. The representation was a creature
tent stated, that our exports ha I inceeased? Why, he could of civilisation ; but was that so broad a question as the question
at
answer the Right Hon.'H e
-net. We had sent our:mm.llou- whether man should have food—whether man should live by his
tures abroad at random, to :alm est every part of the world, industry? With regard to the extension of the suffiarse, he had
almost without a chance of diepoeing of them, because there his own opinions, and, as an individual, lie would be happy to
sno means of disposing of theM at home, in conseqnence of join in any well-considered movement for the eaten.
all the earnings of the operatives being absorbed by the high sion of the suffrage, but he could not consent to join
• price( Of provisions. And even jet 'Airmen countries our mann- the holy cause in which they were engaged for the re.
factures were forced into the market under the 'disadvantage peal of the Corn-laws with any other cause whatever.
' of- our being compelled to dispose of them at twelve months' I if they hadexhautted every expedient, and had made no pro
-
credit, with perhaps a risk of not being paid at a„.
II Be. }tress in the public mind, if they had not advanced at all in the
sides,. our expert, principally consisted of articletein a state agitation of the great question, then he would say it wartime
nearly as raw as when they were imported, ITrrlittle-labour tusay that human nature had reversed its ordinary impulse's,
hiving been expended on them. It -.was chiefly 'yarns that and. with however great regret, he would say that the country
were largely exported. It was said. that those who wished to which was incapable of. listening to appeals such as their§ seas
have the Corn-laws repealed considered them as the sole , not worth isaving—that there was ao constitutional change