The Sun.
London, England, 1845-05-27 00:00:00

AND CARLISLE RAILWAYS.

On the re-assembling of the Committee this mornig, at twelve
o'clock, the business was commenced by

Mr. HILDYARD calling Mr. Murray, the provost of Paisley. He
said that Paisley was the principal and most thickly-populated
town in Renfrewshire. The population of Paisley, including the
adjacent villages, amounted to 60,000. There were 79 steam en.
gines employed in the public works to the extent of 681-horse
power. The shawls that were manufactured were principally sent
tor disposal to London, Manchester, and Ireland, but the
greater part were transmitted to London. Shawls were a spe-
cies of manufacture which, from their delicate texture
and liability to damage, required great dispatch in their
transit, and every order that was received was usually
accompanied by a direction that the greatest possible expedition
be used. The value of the shawls that were annually manufactured
amounted to 1,800,000/. There was a very extensive trade carried
on between Paisley and Bradford and the western and midland dis-
tricts of England. The railway communication to Greenock and
Port Glasgow diverged to Paisley ; and of the two competing lines
before the Committee, and that which in his opinion would most
conduce to advance the interests of Paisley, was the Dumfries line.
He knew nothing about the engineering evidence with regard to
the proposed line. The general feeling in Renfrewshire was de-
cidedly in favour of the line. A petition had been presented from
the people of Paisley, which was signed by its most influential and
respectable inhabitants.

On cross-examinatlon, Mr. Murray admitted that as far as tho
northern districts were concerned, the Caledonian line possessed
greater advantages than the other.

The CHAIRMAN said that the plan which the counsel was pursu-
ing, in so minutely inquiring into points of merely local import-
ance, was unnecessary to the interests of the line. He could under-
stand statistical details and maps, and from the consideration of
thcb. , and upon general principles, the decision of the Committee
would be founded.

Mr. Anderson, the next witness, said—He had made up the
traffic tables, and had submitted them when prepared to the in-
spection of the different individuals from whom he had obtained
the data on which they were constructed, and they had expressed
their approval of them. He had abstracted and classified the mate-
rials, and the result showed they had been correctly brought out.
Mr. Horne, land valuer at Clackmannan, stated the value of the
land to be taken for the purposes of the railway, amounted to
102,603/. The quality of the soil generally, along the line, would
be greatly improved if a sufficient drainage were made. He had
no doubt the value of the land through which the Dumfries line
would pass would be increased 30 or 40 per cent. He did not consider
that the Caledonian line, from its levels being in some instances
1,000 feet above the level of the sea, would much benefit the soil of
the country through which it would pass.
Mr. Laurie gave concurrent testimony to the last witness.
Sir THOMAS PHILLIPS then called Mr. Miller, civil engineer—
He stated that in 1840 he was instructed to survey and report on
the construction of the best line between Carlisle and Glasgow, and
on that occasion he was assisted by Mr. Locke. Several other lines
were in contemplation about the same period, but of those only
the two schemes now before the Committee bad been persevered in.
The opinion which he then formed of the favourable nature
of the Nithsdale line had been subsequently confirmed;
and in the appendix to his fourth report he had
stated his reasons in vindication of that opinion. At the period
at which Mr. Locke formed his judgment, the severest gradient
on the line was 1 in 113, but since that tine an east coast line
had been made. Mr. Miller considered that the East Coast line
would command the traffic between London and Edinburgh, as the
gradients on that line were very favourable; and a very consider-
able speed in the transmission of goods could be obtained. If
the traveller from the south to Edinburgh went by the
East Coast line, it would be the most convenient
for him. The distance between London and Edinburgh by the
East Coast Railway is 389 miles, and by the Caledonian the dis.
tance is about 400 miles. He was of opinion, that on the subject
of carrying the line northward from Carlisle, there were several
important points to be kept in view, especially as regarded the
communication with the west of Scotland, and from
the Lancashire districts to Scotland and the coast of
Ireland. The terminus at Carlisle was conveniently situated
to form a coalition with the terminii of the different railways
there, and would communicate with all the lines radiating from
Carlisle on every side. The distance to Dumfries by the Niths.
dale line was very much shorter than by the Caledonian Railway,
and was, in every respect, more convenient. The country between
Carlisle and Dumfries is generally flat and easy. From Dumfries the
line begins to ascend the valley of the Nith, and here the works
would be tolerably light. There were several villages in the
valley, and the soil was rich in agricultural produce—it formed part
of the estates of the Duke of Marlborough, and the line would pass
for 22 miles through his property. The summit of the line was
attained at a point between Kirkconnel and Old Cumnock. At
New Cumnock the railway passes through the large mineral field
belonging to Lord Bute, and it was very important that the
highest level was situated near it, as the mineral produce could be
conveyed in either direction. The distance between Carlisle and
New Cunnock was 91 miles. The only gradient on the line
steeper than 1 in 176 was one coming from Kilmarnock, three
miles in length, and consisting of one in a hundred ; and it was
proposed to have a constant engine stationed there, The gradients
were all very conveniently situated along the line. The
highest elevation was attained at Cumnock, where the
railway would be carried at six hundred feet above the
level of the sea. There would be two tunnels on the line, one
of which was near Kilmarnock, of 660 yards in length ; and an-
other at Drumlanrig, to avoid injuring the estate of the Duke of
Buccleuch, of 1,500 yards long. The character of the strata
through which the tunnels worked was very easy, as the soil con-
sisted for the most part of red sand •stone. The stations at
Paisley, Glasgow, and Greenock, were all very conve-
niently situated. The levels of the line to Glasgow were
all of a favourable nature ; and it was intended to carry the rail.
way into the heart of that city, through the medium of the Glas.
gow Junction line. He was of opinion that as far as the com-
mercial, agricultural, and mineral interests of the counties through
which the Dumfries line would pass, were concerned, it was far
preferable to the Caledonian. The Hawick line was carried thirty.
two miles through the property of the Duke of Buccleuch, who
approved of the scheme. The estimated expense of the railway
was 1,200,0001., and the working expenses were calculated at
33 1.3 per cent on the gross receipts.
Mr. Miller admitted, on his cross-examination, that there were
two gradients on the Hawick line of 1 in 75 and 1 in 90.

In the course of the cross-examination a messenger from the
Commons announced that the Speaker was at prayers, and the Com.
mittee adjourned till half.past eleven to-morrow.

Group Q.

The Committee on this Group,—composed of Mr. Sotheron
(Chairman), Mr. T. Pusey, Mr. Escott, Sir E. Colebrooke, and
Lord Duncan, sat to-day on the

NORTH WALES RAILWAY.

Our readers will recollect that the consideration of this railway
was adjourned to enable the engineer, Sir J. Rennie, to give some
additional evidence.

Mr. CALVERT, on behalf of the promoters, stated that the opposi-
tion of Mr. Wynn was withdrawn, on consideration of a special
agreement having been entered Into by the Company not to take
his land without consent, and also to extend the line from Bargin
and Caernarvon to Port Dynllaen.
A further opposition, however, was offered by Mr. Whalley, a
coalowner in the district, in consequence, as he stated, of the Directors
of the Company having made arrangements with him, and then
having offered equal advantages to another coalowner, although he
held an incumbrance on a large property through which the rail-
way passes, to the extent of 40,0001; but this opposition was ulti.
mately abandoned. The preamble was then allowed to be proved,
and the Committee went through the clauses of the bill, when
some discussion ensued on the rates of toll, which were decided to
be 3d., 2d. , and I id. per mile for fir,t, second, and third-class pas-
sengers. These alterations having been made, the report was
agreed to, and ordered to be made to the House.

Group V.
SHEFFIELD AND CHESTERFIELD.

This line was taken into consideration this morning by the
Committee.

The opponents consisted of their Graces the Dukes of Norfolk
and Devonshire, with other landowners and lessees on the line.
The promoters were assisted by Mr. Baines, Q.C., Mr. Wrang-
ham, Q.C., Mr. Alexander, Q.C., and Mr. Adams ; the opponents
by Mr. Austin, Q.C., Mr. Talbot, Q.C., Mr. E. James, and other
Counsel.

Mr. Bailees, Q.C., opened the case for the promoters by pointing
out the importance of Sheffield as of the very first consequence in
the scale of British manufacturing towns, and particularly the im-
mense quantity of ceal and iron which entered into the production
of their staple manufactures. These minerals were to be found in
abundance in the immediate neighbourhood, but for want of accom.
modation the town of Sheffield could not avail themselves of them.
The town, Hon Members might be aware, had not less than
120,000 inhabitants, all more or less dependent upon the hardware
manufacture, and it was in order to give facility to that very manu-
facturer that this railway was sought to be constructed. The
Learned Counsel then entered into a history of the railway com-
munication which had been accorded to the town of Sheffield since
the year 1835, and contended that that communication was alto-
gether inadequate to the wants of the town or the necessities of its
manufactures. With respect to the complaints of the several peti-
tioners, he thought that they would be found in their most serious
aspect to involve only questions of compensation, difficulties cer-
tainly the most easy to be overcome, when once the necessity for the
railway project had been proved to the satisfaction of the Com-
mittee. The line was intended to be a double line—the distance
12 miles or a little better—and the capital 100,000 or at the rate of
33,000/. a mile, a price which would sufficiently prove that the
promoters had taken the engineering difficulties fully into con.
sideration. The Learned Counsel then concluded by declaring that
the feeling of the country was in favour of the line; and he trusted
that when the Committee should hear the evidence he had to adduce
they would be of opinion that this was one of those railways which
the trade of the country imperatively called for.
Edward Rangeley, coal agent, Whittington, parish of Derby—
Was lessee of certain coal-fields, and the proposed line would
pass through them. The witness mentioned the great majority of
the coal-fields in his neighbourhood. The line would be con.
tiguous to all of them. The coal was of a valuable character, and
would be just suited to the trade of Sheffield. Their only mode
of conveyance now was by horse and cart, but if these lines were
made, it would be wrought to a four-fold extent. They had also
an abundance of iron-stone, which only wanted an easy transit to
be worked to a very great extent. _ _ _

Cross-examined by Mr. JouNsox—Dronfield, the end of the
coalfield nearest Sheffield, was six miles from Sheffield. It
abounded in ironstone, and there was a great demand for It in the
latter town.

The witness was cross-examined by Mr. JAMES—There was a
considerable delay on the present railway from Sheffield to Chester.
field, which he thought would be obviated if the proposed line were
constructed.

By the Comsurreg—The coach fares were lower from Sheffield
to Chesterfield than the railway charges were. _

Samuel Lucas, owner of certain coal lands at Dronfleld—Had
converting coal on his property, and used it himself. But very
little of it had been used. He made between two hundred and three
tees of coke every week, which was tent principally to
Sheffield. He ihnuld be glad to see the railway vetted, tla 4
would give in impetus-to the coal and iron workings brottfield.
The coal would extend for forty-five square miles in the direction
of Ctietterfleld, He should say there were 10,000 acres in th•
Dronfield dittri9t.
The Committee then adjourned till ten o'clock to-morrow.