The Sun.
London, England, 1829-07-15 00:00:00

►LITION OF NEGI 0 SLAVERY.

(Concluded from our Paper of yesterday.)
Dr. EDWARDS was willing to admit that a pecu-
niary question would arise, but the whole benefit of
the Constitution was not to be sacrificed to that one
consideration. But the Rev. Gentleman also com-
plained, that if the slaves were not compelled, they
would not work beyond a mere sufficiency to pro-
cure existence; this might be so, but he would ask,
did the Rev. Gentleman himself, or did any one else
work beyond what they thought necessary for the
benefit of themselves and their families ? Before
the amendment proposed by the Rev. Gentleman
was submitted to the consideration of the meeting,
he would take the liberty of reading the original
Resolutions over again, and they would then per-
ceive that there was very little in them which even
the Rev. Gentleman himself could deny. Dr. Ed-
wards then proceeded to read over the different Re-
solutions,
and contended that it was impossible for
any one to gainsay their contents; if they were to 1
abandon the principles that these Resolutions em-
bodied, they must abandon all that was dear to
them, and give up the Constitution of their country.
He knew what the distressed state of the country
was, but he did not hesitate at once to say, that it
would: be better to pay a hundred millions to the
West India Planters, rather than lose the main fea-
ture of the Constitution—the liberty of the subject.
—(Applause.)
Colonel JONES was of opinion that the Resolu-
tions ought to be proposed seriatim, and it would
then be more distinctly seen to which part of the
proposition before the meeting the Rev. Gentleman
objected. He could not boast of being so long a
resident, or having so great a knowledge of the
slaves as the Rev. Gentleman did ; but as an old
soldier, and one accustomed to having command over
a body of men, he thought that he was able to form
some opinion of what effect absolute power had,
both on the commander and the commanded.—
(Hear, hear.)—But he had some actual experience
also with respect to slaves, for he had travelled al-
most from one end to the other of the United States,
and had seen how it operated in that country, which
was blessed with the best Government in the whole
world, as it was an improvement on the English,
and was entirely free from all the curses of the
feudal system. It was a Government which had
nothing to get rid of, and where the people had
only to become better educated to be without a
fault. The Christian Pastor who had addressed
them had told them that free labour was incompa-
tible with the nature of the negroes, and that such
was the effect of a tropical climate, as to make it ab-
solutely necessary to use coercion before they could
get men to work. He certainly never had been in
a tropical climate; but he had been at New Orleans,
Virginia, and South Carolina, where he believed
that it was quite as hot as anywhere in the West
Indies, with perhaps the exception of Demerara and
Dominique. In those places he had witnessed the
progress of free labour ; and he believed the fact to
be, that whatever difference there might be, did not
arise from climate, but from moral influence. In
New York in particular he had been remarkably
struck by the prosperous condition of the negro;
there the black man had been gradually advancing
in intellect, in property, and in self value; and it
had given him no little pain to see the negro there
looking down with contempt and with pity upon the
poor Irishmen who had been forced by the unhap-
piness prevalent in his own land to emigrate to Ame-
rica. The emancipation of the slave appeared to him
to be perfectly possible, if they could instil sense
and justice into the minds of the slave owners.—
That 1% as where the difficulty lay, and nor in the
moral or intellectual faculty of the negro. When he
was at Philadelphia he had been to hear a black
preacher in that city, and he honestly declared that
he had heard more eloquence and piety from him
than he could learn from Mr. Benson, Mr. Colburn,
or Mr. Anybody else who might be the fashionable
preacher about town. That great and good man,
the Abbe Gregoire, had incontestably shewn that
the mind of the negro was as capable of cultivation
as that of a white man; and he had no doubt, that
if the education was commenced with the infancy of

the black, he was capable of becoming quite as great
a man as even his Learned Friend, Mr. Brougham
himself. But while this was the state of things in
Sew York, it was very different in Kentucky, where
slavery still flourished. There the mind of the citi-
zen was debased in consequence, and a totally dif-
ferent series of sentiments prevailed. But he need
not confine himself alone to the United States. In
the Spanish Colonies in South America, the free
negroes, as might be seen by a reference to Mr.
Ward's statement, not only could work, but did
work ; and the planters, by the course they had pre-
viously adopted in freeing their slaves, had derived
the greatest advantage when those convulsions tool;
place, which subsequently shook the institutions of
the country so dreadfully. Instead of having the

negro opposed to him as an enemy, he was sup-
ported by him as a friend in the midst of his diffi-
p ulties,—(Applause.)—Hee perfectly agreed with
the Rev. Pastor, that it was impossible to put the
negro children into schools or hospitals. But what
:_sti that ? It followed as a matter of course, that the
inasins would retain the children for their use through
Olkir juvenile days, on exactly the same principle
that the masters here were glad to obtain ap-
preotbzea, because they found that a profit was
to oe made by them. The Reverend Pastor had
boasted to the Meeting that he had baptized eight
thousand negroes; but what of that again? Had
this baptising made freemen of them ?—(Applause.)
That they were Christians was good, bnt it became
die duty of the Statesman to add liberty to that
boon, because Christianity and freedom necessarily
went hand in hand. For himself he did not pretend
to any sanctity, because he was no saint, but a
sinner—(A laugh)—but he was, nevertheless, aware
that the sending wild and enthusiastic missionaries to
the West Indies was one of the worst things that
could have taken place, and bad materially retarded
the cause cf the negroes. This was necessarily the
case when they considered who the majority of the
*.lantern were—for the most part they were neces-
Scotchmen, and neceEsitous Irishmen, who
,had gone over there without money and without
,e,ducatio4, and could not afford to do other than
work their slaves to the uttermost.—(Hear, hear,
hear.)—There could be no doubt that on
the settlement of the question remuneration would
be necessary, because Parliament, in making slavery
the medium through which the estates were to be
cultivated, had necessarily brought the country into
that predicament. Under the present enormous
burthen of taxes, however, it would be impossible
fully to effect the relief of the negroes in that way,
and therefore there remained no way so effectual
for them to act upon as that of gradually complet-
ing their object by emancipating the children as they
were born. He was sure that no one in that Meet-
ing need be told how the possession of slaves neces-
sarily debased the slave-owners.—(Hear hear.)—lf
men, and even women, were to be found in America
sufficiently cruel to raise their hands against the
poor unoffending negro, how much more likely
it was that still greater cruelty was practised
towards the negroes in the Colonies, where the
check of a free Government was wanting ?
Every honest American confessed that the
continuance of the slave system was the foulest blot
that attached itself to their country; and as to reli-
gion, he had known some of the most devout psalm-
singers to be the least scrupulous in inflicting tor-
ture on the negroes under their dominion.—(Ap-
plause.)
Mr. Pows,ILL said that he had gathered from the
Rev. Gentleman's speech a reason why the whip
could not be abolished in the West Indies, which
he had till then long been looking for in vain. The
Rev. Gentleman had told them that the slaves had
such affection for their children, that they would
not suffer their children to be taken from them to
be placed in schools; therefore it was no wonder
that the whip now was necessary to repress their
discontent, when they found that their children
were even sold into other islands, and removed from

sight for ever.—(Hear, hear, hear.)—ln a Jamaica
newspaper, bearing date December, 1824., he found
an advertisement, describing Maria, a female slave,
branded on the shoulder with the letters G.R.;

and here again, he could well understand what must
be the feelings of a parent at having a daughter sub-
mitted to such an operation. But he did not wish
to rest his cause on the cruelty which the negro
underwent ; what he relied upon was, there prin•
ciple of slavery itself.—(Applause.)—One of the
arguments of their opponents was, that the slave
was as well off as the peasant of England. He did
not think that that was quite the case, for the Eng.
lish peasant was not separated from his child,
nor was the English peasant compelled to work
under the exhausting influence of a penetrating sun.
(Applause.)—But if the negro would not work,
there was a good reason for it—because no man
could take much pleasure in working when he saw
another reaping all the benefits of his labour. Ir,
therefore, became necessary to goad them on to in-
creased exertion, and hence the decrease of the
black population of the West India islands where
slavery existed, while in Hayti, where the popula-
tion was free, it had doubled in the course of twenty
years.—(Applause.)—He intreated them never to
confound the question of compensation with that of
emancipation ; for the former was one which rested
entirely with the Parliament, and with which the
slaves themselves had nothing at all to do : the
slaves had had no share in the transaction—no por-

tion of the profits, and therefore they could not be
called upon to make good the loss which the plan-
ters might sustain. But it was contended that
emancipation would be the means of giving rise
to turbulence : he did not believe that such
would be the case; bUt even if it should
so happen, Parliament would still have the power
to enact laws sufficiently strong to check all revolt.
Above all, he cautioned the Meeting never to trust
men in the possession of power with the giving of
it up, unless they obtained more than an equivalent
for it : as long as they trusted to the planters them-
selves, they might be sure to be put off with some
plausible story or another, but never would they
obtain the object for which they were so anxious.
The planters said, that they wished to raise the
negroes to their proper elevation, but it was no long
time ago that a clergyman was compelled to come
home for having administered the sacrament to a
negro at the same table with some of the white po-
pulation.—( Hear, hear.)—One of the most painful
circumstances connected with the case was, that the
minds of the best of men became hardened and con-
taminated by the evil which surrounded them—
(Applause)—and, whatever improvements might
take place, they never were safe from a relapse ;
therefore, however happy the negro might be made,
he would still say to the people of England, " Per-
sist in the cause till they are actually liberated, and
you see all the shackles of their bondage removed."
The CHAIRMAN then put the Amendment, which
was negatived by a considerable majority, and the
original Resolutions were subsequently carried by a
triumphant majority.
Mr. SINCLAIR CULLEN said, the observations of
the Rev. Gentleman were full of contradictions, and
the greatest mercy he could show him was to pass
him without a reply. He left him to reconcile to
his Christian duties that love of slavery which the
law forbade, which man detested, and which was
desecrated by religion. If the Duke of 'Wellington
could recently carry a certain great question, on
which the sense of the country was so much divided,
how easily could he carry the Question of Emanci-
pating from Slavery, when the intelligence, the
integrity of the country, would be with him ? He
trusted that the Meeting would persevere, in spite
of the opposition of those who hypocritically pre-
tended they were friends to Emancipation. Re-
ligion alone was a sufficient inducement to exertions
in favour of those who were suffering a thousand
miles off. In England public opinion and the pub-
lic press, were inducements to both public and
private morals. '1 he West Indians had no such
censors, and they had their morals and religion per-
verted by their interests in the existence of slavery.
If the children were emancipated, it would be the
interest of the proprietors to educate them. It had
been said that the law of England permitted slavery.
But he denied the assertion The law did not ac•

knowledge the legality, but only the existence, o
slavery. But a power in the West Indies vio-
lated the law, to the cruel oppression of thousands
of their fellow-subjects. Lord Talbot and Mr.
Yorke (Lord Hardwicke) had declared, in the teeth
of the law of England, that a slave coming to this
country was still a slave. Every lawyer had since
declared, that no man could be a slave within the
power of the Crown to protect him. He wished
the advocacy of slavery had come from any person
rather than from one of the vocation of the Rev.
Gentleman. He should now move a vote of thanks
to the Chairman for his conduct in Parliament on
this subject, and for his conduct in the Chair that
day. The merits of advocating Emancipation the
Chairman shared with many others; but he deserved
praise for the moral courage which enabled him to
support, against a clamorous House of Commons,
that principle in which all present concurred. Moral
courage was the greatest of qualities; and but for
those who had stood alone in support of freedom,
the liberty which England possessed would never
have been achieved, or would soon have left us. He
then proposed,
" That the thanks of this Meeting be given to Robert
Otway Cave, Esq., M.P., for his able conduct in the
Chair, and especially for his firmness in dividing alone
against his opponents, on the evening of the 4th of June
last, in the House of Commons, in support of a funda-
ment principle of the Constitution, never before dis-
puted, and expressed by him in the precise words of
Blackstone."
Mr. TOOKE seconded the Resolution. He
thought the public bound in gratitude to the Chair.
man for his manner of supporting this question in
Parliament. It might be true that the punishments
of the negroes were lessened, but they ought to have
been long ago abolished altogether. They were of
a piece with the knout, which had formerly been in-
flicted in Russia, and where a surgeon had been re-
quired to stand by to determine how far the punish-
ment might proceed without death actually ensuing.
He certainty looked forward with the greatest
anxiety to the time when the final emancipation of
the slaves should be completed, because he consi-
dered that when that should be accomplished, the
removal of the foulest blot and ulcer of the Consti-
tution would also be accomplished.—(Applause.)
The Resolution was then carried, only three hands
being held up against it.
After thanks were voted to the Chairman,
The Hon. CHAIRMAN said—ln rising to return
my thanks for the compliment you have been pleased
to pay me, and which far overbalances any little
ery ice I may have rendered by my humble exertions
in this great and sacred cause, I cannot dissolve this
meeting without first congratulating you and congra-
tulating the country, on the triumph of reason and
of justice we have this day heard and witnessed.
—(Applause.)—l perhaps may be excused for tres-
passing for a few moments, and in a very few words,
on the time of this meeting, whilst I assure them I
did not take up this question lightly or inconsider-
ately. It is about four years ago since I had an op-
portunity of witnessing the very strong feeling that
existed throughout the country among the advocates
for the abolition of slavery. I saw that in
this particular point men of all political party feel-
ing agreed to forget their political animosities, that
they might make common cause on this subject, look-
ing on slavery in any point of view as a disgrace to
a civilized country, and as utterly inconsistent with
the principles of Christianity, which are part and
parcel of the law of our land.—(Applause.)—lt
then struck me forcibly, and it has since often oc-
curred to me, to wonder that the cause so backed
and with such advocates out of Parliament, should
have made so little progress throughout the coun-
try as it has done, and not been more strongly
pressed on our Government. • I think I may safely
say, that since the political delays, (and I am happy
to observe that they have only been political delays),
from the time of that good man Wilberforce, that

this cause, in the opinion of those who are in favour
of the abolition of slavery, has rather retrograded
than advanced. Under this impression I did
feel myself bound in duty to take up this
particular point in the cause, namely, that
of abolishing the slavery of negro children,
as being one which the West Indians them-
selves formerly had sanctioned, as being one
requiring no compromise, and presenting the fewest
difficulties. The more I considered and the more 1
read on the subject, its vital importance, its consti-
tutional importance—its importance in every point
of view—more and more strongly pressed upon me :
the more I became convinced it was impossible that
it could be consistent in any way with Christianity,
with the principles of our Constitution, or the law
of our land. When I found this to be the case, I
was afraid that so good a cause—a cause so deserv-
ing, and, I may say, ultimately so sure of success—
might lose by being entrusted to so feeble an advo-
cate as myself; I therefore did make application to
a gentleman, whose name I shall not now mention,
because he is present, and there can: be no one here ig-
norant of what this cause owes to him—l did
ask him whether it would not be better to surrender
this constitutional question to the hands of Mr.
Buxton, he having, in subjects which he brought
forward three or four years ago, touched most
powerfully on this particular point. I was assured
by that Hon. Friend of mine, and by a still more
intimate friend of Mr. Buxton's, that his health un-
fortunately would not permit him to take up this or
any other point connected with the cause; I was
assured of it by himself also, for he stated in the
House of Commons that he was unable to prose-
cute a branch of the subject which he had given no-
tice of and brought forward some time before, in
consequence of the opinion of his physician, that it
would be at the risk of his life if he did so. I could
not, therefore, at a hazard so great impose such an
additional burthen on him, nor could I suppose that
this cause should be lost for want of an ad-
vocate ; and feeling before God and my coun-
try, that he who does his best does well,
I consented to take charge of the question,
and marched forward with a bolder step than I other-
wise should have done, believing what I advocated
was not only consistent with justice and humanity,
but dictated by the policy, expediency, and law of
the land.—(Great applause.)—l am most happy to
find now from certain and unequivocal proofs, that
the course I adopted was not wild or injudicious and
has not been disapproved of. I am not;in the:slightest
degree disheartened by the judgment passed on my
motion by the House of Commons, for I perfectly
well know that the House of Commons is in a
great measure composed themselves of Slavery
possessors—of what they call property, that is
dealers in their own fellow creatures, flesh and blood.
Moreover, I know that Parliament has frequently
changed in opinion within the last two or three
years upon many important questions—on one par-
ticularly, which I need not scarcely mention► is
Catholic Emancipation, on which I believe it
has voted three different ways within two or
three different years.—(l.oud applause.)—l have
only further to add, that until some better advocate be
found in this cause, at all times and all seasons, not
only this Meeting, but any person and every indi-
vidual who throughout the country may take an
interest in the subject, my humble, but most fervent
exertions, if they will only make allowances for all
deficiencies of ability in advocating the cause, shall
be at their command. Arid I cannot but congratu-

late this Meeting and the country on the Certain
anticipation I feel, that slavery cannot, in the present
state of the world, exist much longer. I know it to
be impossible to suppose that it can long exist, con-
trary as it is to the laws of God and man. 1 know
that if it were impossible to find scarcely a single
advocate either in or out of the House of Commons,
and the mutilated and wounded bodies of
the poor negroes were the only voices that could
speak their wrongs, still I say the cause must
ulti-
mately terminate favourably. It is a course of right
I opposed to nothing but brutal force ; and there will
always be some men in Parliament, there will at
least always be some men in the country, to whom
the love of liberty will be like a passion, and the
defenders of the wrongs of the weak against the
strong in a point the most repugnant to human na-
ture. I again return my most humble thanks for the
honour you have done me, and repeat my most con-
fident expectation that the cause we are now met
to support must ultimately succeed. This Meeting
I declare now to be dissolved.
The Meeting then at once dispersed.

FOREIGN INTELLIGENCE.

FRENCH PAPERS.

- ----.--- -
(From the Messager des Chan fires of Sunday-)
BERLIN, JUNE 30.—Direct accounts from the
Russian head-quarters have been received here.
They go much beyond the official bulletin in their
account of the complete rout of the Turks at
Shumla. Their resistance was terrible; the disad•
vantage of their position, the surprise at finding
themselves opposed to so considerable a force of the
enemy,—nothing, in short, could discourage them
a moment : no terms can express the bravery and
obstinacy of their defence. They did not give way
till it was impossible for them to resist any longer.
Notwithstanding the ravages which a ferocious
enemy has committed in the country, the invasion
of which he could not hinder, the Russian army is
perfectly well supplied with provisions. Every loss
is immediately repaired. All the roads leading from
southern Russia are covered with waggons, bring-
ing provision and ammunition for the army. The
spirit which animates the soldiers can only be com-
pared with that which they displayed in 1812. They
are full of warlike enthusiasm, and devotion to the
person of the Emperor.
Silistria is expected very soon to surrender. Well-
informed officers conceive that the occupation of
that fortress by the Russians will suffice to ter-
minate this year's campaign entirely in their favour,
and a third and a fourth would probably be unne-
cessary to induce the Turks to make peace. They
may be compelled to do so.
His Majesty the King of Prussia has again had
some fits of fever, but by the express order of his
Majesty the fetes at Court are not interrupted.
The King's daughter, the Empress of Russia, will
prolong her stay in our capital beyond the time
that we had hoped. Wherever she appears she is
received with the most affectionate marks of re-
spect, and the people take pleasure in showing to
her their affection-for the King her father.
Berlin has at this moment an appearance of gaiety
which surprises all travellers, who are equally struck
with the daily progress of the fine arts and the
highest branches of science. Such are the fruits of
peace and of an enlightened and paternal adminis-
tration.

(From the Journal du Commerce of Sunday.)
ITALY.—A letter from Rome says,—,, All the
inhabitants of Imola have been excommunicated,
anti they are consequently forbidden to partake of
the Holy Sacraments. I do not know whether that
of marriage is included. This proceeding against
the town of Imola is a result of the orders of the
Pope, who has resolved to punish the misdemeanour
committed upon the furniture and the hotel of M.
de Giustiniani, Archbishop of that town. All the
churches have been shut, and even the cathedral
is scarcely permitted to be open, but this is ex-
pressly stated to be only that ministers may be
found to console the sick and attend the dying.
Undoubtedly his Holiness expects much good from
this measure; but I begin to think that those are
in the right who say that we are not now in the
15th century. The people do not appear to be
very uneasy about this punishment. They see
their fields covered with the most promising harvest,
and, blessing Divine Providence, seem to wait
patiently for the moment when it shall be thought
fit to remove the interdict pronounced against them.
" The inhabitants of Romagna can no longer ob-
tain passports to go abroad; they are considered as
infected with the plague, both in politics and re-
ligion. The Pope, on ascending the pontifical

throne, would not include in his amnesty persons
guilty of political crimes: they were even positively
excluded from it. They were compared to assas-
sins, and declared unworthy of the papal clemency."