The Sun.
London, England, 1827-12-08 00:00:00

Mr. WILLIAM RICHIE was called to the Chair:

Mr. W. QRIFFITII, of Deptford-bridge, rose and
said, that the business for which the Vestry had been
called having been disposed of, he begged to call
the attention of the Meeting to a subject he con-
sideked one of th►e utmost 61361:lance to tte paiishi and
required their particular attention. He only regretted
that the task of bringing it before :their notice had
not fallen into better bands, but he trusted that the
Chairman would conceive his conduct consistent,
and that of a gentleman. Mr: Griffith begged
leave to read the copy of a letter he had sent to the
authorities then present, intimating that he should,
on this occasion, attend and bring forward the im-
portant Subject. (Read, read.) Mr. G. then read
the following letter, which was sent to the Officers
and Governors of the Parish on Wednesday morning
last :

GENTLEMEN—As there is a Vestry called for next Fri-
day evening, I think it is a.duty I owe to you to inform
you of my intention (if I am not prevented from attending)
to put certain questions relative to your discontinuing the
payment for the maintenance of the child that was found
drowned. It is a subject of the highest importance to the
parish that the, same should be investigated, in older, if
possible, to allay that feeling of dissatisfaction which is so
very prevalent in consequence of what transpired on the
inquest. I hope this notification will not be construed in
the least personal, or in any other view, than thatof wish-
ing to afford you an opportunity of giving a public expla-
nation of the real facts of the case.

I am, Gentlemen, yours, &c.
W. GRIFFITH.

Mr. GRIFFITH. then continued, and observed,
that his object in writing the above letter was to
prepare the Governors to meet the question, and
thereby enable them to answer it fully. He would
frankly acknowledge that those gentlemen who fill
the office of Governors and Overseers of the poor,
had an important and difficult task to perform, and
he felt satisfied that the gentlemen in the present
legislation had 'acquired great discrimination in mat-
ters connected with their official duties; but he
would assert that, in his opinion, that discrimination
had not been used in the case of the unfortunate
woman Mary Ann Dale. It was well known, that
whenever a female was found to be pregnant of an
illegitimate child, it is the duty of the officers of the
parish to cause her to affiliate that child to its-
reputed father, and by law the parish could commit
her to the House of Correction—(No, no, from
several voices.) He understood it.was the law; but
this he knew of his own knowledge, that if a woman
swears a child to a man, and in the event of his not
being able to indemnify the parish froth its burthen,
the parish can commit him to prison till he finds the
required sureties. In the present instance the woman
had never been called upon to swear the-child, but
she declared to the parish officers who lie actually
was; a negociation takes plan between him and the
parish, and he pays a-certain sum of money to the
officers to assist in its maintenance. The poor wo-
man, after she was delivered of the unfortunate de-
ceased, was allowed, for the first two years of its
life, two shillings per week, at the expiration of
which time its grandmother took him under liercare,
and for the last two years and three quarters the
weekly allowance was reduced .to eighteen pence,
„which she was clearly-entitled th—and if what
the, unhappy woman asserted upon the Inquest
was true, he had no hesitation whatever in as-
serting that she had been treated with the
greatest injustice. He did not entirely grOund his
opinion upon what he had read in the newspapers,
which have for some time teemed with reflections
upon the parish; but lie had taken great pains in
-eliciting facts which were uncontrovertible, and he
would now lay them before the Meeting.
j,„" On Tuesday week, the 13th of November, antecedent
to Friday the 23d, on the evening of which the child was
drowned, Elizabeth Dale left her place. On the next day
(Wednesday) she took the child to the workhouse to be
admitted, which was refused. On the next evening
(Thursday) the grandmother, hearing that her daughter
was lodging at Mrs. Allen's, in Thames-street, and she
having arrears due to her of 28s. from her daughter,
went with another woman, named M'Cann, taking the
child with her, and left it there. Mrs. M'Cann stated to
Mrs. Allen that the grandmother could not afford to keep
it, nor could she, and as its mother, Elizabeth Dale, was
there, she must take the child. At this time, a Mrs.
Hewson was present, who resides at No. 2, Davenport-
place, Thames-street, assisting Mrs. Allen in her washing,
and who is the woman who first identified the child as being
that of Eliz. Dale, and though confined by the constable in
the first instance, was by some mistake not examined at the
inquest. She states, that as the mother appeared to be
unwilling to take the child, she said, Poor little fellow,
if nobody will keep him I will ;' and after some other con-
versation the child was shout to go, the mother said
(pushing the dear little fellow) go along then,' and he
was then taken away by Mrs. Hewson 'a little boy and girl.
During the evening, Elizabeth Dale said to Mrs. Allen and
Hewson she was married, and that she did not want her
husband to know that she had got a child. On therFriday
morning, Nov. 16, Mrs. Hewson went to Mrs. Allen's,
and proposed to its mother to take the child, to provide for
it in board, lodging, and washing, at four shillings a week;
or if she would find hint in food, she would lodge him for a
shilling a week. The mother said she could not afford to
pay it, and the child must go to the poor-house. The poor
boy remained with Mrs. Hewson till the Wednesday morn%
ing following, when she sent the child back to its mother
at llrs. Allen's, owing to the tide coming into her
house, and not being able to keep him ; at the same
time knowing the mother was going to, leave that
evening, without any person knowing where she was going.
During the time the hey was at Mrs. Hewson's, his mo-
ther supplied him with food. In the evening of this day
Elisabeth Dale Ica Mr. Allen's house, without taking the
poor child her; but she cams for him on the Thurs-
day evening, and proceeded, it appears, to one Johnson, or
.Theinneon, a sailor, in Leek's-court, opposite the Church,
' and wanted to leave the child with them. The family
said, ' though they had often fed the dear child when it was
almost starving at its grandmother's, still they bad it net in
their power to do so any longer—besidec, they had no
bedding.' The brutal mother replied, ' Then let hint lay '
on the door, or any where else.' They said, ' No, dear
child, that he shall not; if we have no convenience for
him to sleep, he shall not lay on the floor.' The mother
then took the child away. In all instances when any of
the parties persuaded her to take the child to the officers,
she said it was of no use, they had taken off the allow-
ance, and would not take hint into the workhouse."
These facts, said Mr. GRIFFITHS, I have elicited.
He then adverted, in strong terms, to the neglect pur-
sued by the parish officers, in not explaining, at
the moment, the assertion made by the unhappy
woman upon the Coroner's Inquest that the pay-
ments bad been withheld from her, and
that they
had refused to take the child into the house,—if
they had, it would have prevented their exposure,
and the disgrace that must inevitably fall upon
them unless the matter is fully answered. fhe fact
of the payment of her weekly allowance having been
withheld from her by the parish officers of Green-
wich has been echoed far and near, and the country
cried with it. A person, a friend of his, living at j
Greenwich, met a gentleman in London, and he im-
mediately said, " I say, why, what have
your of-
fivers been at, they have got themselves into sad dis-
grace ?" There was evidently great culpability'some I
where, and it was their duty to explain and do away
with the imputation tinder which they now laid, and
he considered he was deserving the thanks of the
Vestry, in instituting the inquiry, as it gave them I
an opportunity of doing so. As a father, and a pa-
rishioner, he should have had no peace in his
_mind I
had he not brought it4forward. It would not rest
here, unless it was fully expinined, " The sUbject

will be brought before i<fie Grand Jury at Maidstone,
and you will hear what they *in say to yon."
Mr. ORIFPITH they read a paragraph from two
Sunday papers which tended to show that the parigi
had acted very unjustly in withholding the payment
of the weekly allowance &dm' the woman.

A voice eiclainied—" That is lttgi like the news-
papM.l?
Al Cientleman WWI. laid the statement against
the parish itidst certainly requiret; pn answer.—
(Certaiply, certainly; ficati all parts.)
Mr% GRIFFITH, in continuation; repeated, that he
thought the parish officers ought to be protrcl in his
having brought the subject tapoit the carpet." lie
had been told that the woman applied ell Wednes-
day, the 21st November, at the Committee-room, 10
have the child admitted into the house, stating,
that,she was now married and that her husband did
not kti6w she had ,a child, and it was for the peace
and comfort of lioth that she wished it to be taken in,
Tim CHAIRMAN.—Pray, Il t Griffithi were you
present present at the Committee-room, and heard all this

Mr. GRIFFITH admitted he was not, he was told
it for troth. That on the application being made,
she was told to pioduce her certificate of marriage,
and then her child woithlbli titkett into the poor-
house.. The poor woman then r'en't away, and
knowing she had told a gross falsehood, we afraid
to apply again—but next morning she applied to Mr.
Bassett, the Assistant-overseer, for her weekly
stipend, *hen he told her he had received order., not
to pay her till she firtiduced her certificate. She
then hawked the child about front dire to the other,
but could get no one to take it. See what tI ditua.

tion she Was in--money she bad none—she was
driven to extremity; she dared not see the gentle-
men again, having told them she was married and
was not. If it is proved that the ls. 6d. was with-
held from her, I Mean to allege that it was an act of
great initatite towards the woman, and an act which
I should regret much should it ever be established
in this or any other parish. In addition to the
charges he had made, he thought it highly impro-
per that the officers of the parish who had refused
to allow for, and take the child into the poor-house,
should sit as Jurors on the body, and return averdict
against the mother. Mr. Griffith concluded his
speech, by hoping that the parish authorities would
give that explanation that would destroy the ob-
loquy that had been cast upon them.—(Applause.)
Mr. FIELD said, that at the time the woman made

the assertion that her money had been stopped, it
would have been inquired into, had not a gentleman
present (one of the officers) said that the money had
been paid to her up to that time.
Mr. KAIMELL now rose, and silence having been
obtained, he addressed the meeting as follows :
" Mr. Chairman, having been present at the meet-
ing when the application was made by the unhappy
woman Dale, 1 am perhaps as well acquainted with
the real facts of the case as any one present. I will,
with your leave, give the gentleman an answer,and

one Which I hope will satisfy his mind, as well as
that of all our fellow-parishioners and the pitiblic at
large, that no undue or improper severity was exer-
cised towards the unfortunate woman in question,
taking all the circumstances of the case into fair
consideration. As, far as my recollection goes,
and I believe I am tolerably correct , upon it,
the application, and the observations made upon
it by the Committee, occurred in this manner:--
Elizabeth Dale entered the room with the chi ld, and
said, " Gentlemen, I am come, and want to put the
child into the house." Answer was made, "My
good woman you are receiving Is. 6d. a week the
child, therefore we cannot - think of taking it into
the house; you are a strong healthy woman, and
able to support it; •we shall continue the ls. 6d.,
and you must do your part towards keeping it."--
She then said, "I am married now, and my husband
will not let me keep the child, and therefore I must
put him into the house." An observation was then
made that she then appeared far advanced in preg-
nancy, to which she replied, that she was pregnant
by a young man named. Ankinson, who had since
married he_,r three months ago, and that she lodged
at No. 6, Roan-street, and that she expected to be
confined in December. It was then repeated that
the child could not be taken into the house; that if
she was married, as 'the stated, the husband had
better attend, in order to some arrangement being
made with him, or, at all events, that when she ap-
plied to Mr. Bassett, on the following Monday, for
the Is. 6d., as usual, she, should then pro-
duce her certificate of her marriage, that the
Committee might be perfectly satisfied that
she really was married. I have it from Mr. Bassett
(who is here to answer if called upon), that she did
apply on the Monday as usual; that on his asking
her, ‘ Where is the certificate ?" her answer was,
" I have not brought it, and I don't know what right
or what business the Committee .have with it."
Mr. Bassett then, as I presume he was in duty
bound to do, says, " then I cannot pay you the
ls. 6d. till you have been before the Committee
again on Wednesday." On Wednesday she did not
attend, and on Saturday the child was found
drowned. I therefore contend that there was no
stoppage of the money, and I have my private notes
taken at the time to prove no such thing was in-
tended or thought of. That: the payment- was
suspended from the Monday to the Wednesday we
will not attempt to deny; but we think every rea-
sonable man .will go with us in saying, that
Mr. Bassett acted perfectly right in doing
as he did. Thus far, Sir, 1 have spoken
to the more immediate facts ; but I feel

justify
theto public.j ourselves
and
rawenfcdr
aoi anurref
rcoomnLawadcdt
upon by the constable, stating that he should put the
ofienialgllteillefeewyllep::,olirds more. When called
names of the parish officers on the list for the Jury,
I told him I thought it would be injudicious so to do,
it being a parish case, but that I should feel it my
duty to attend the inquest, in case the Coroner
should require an answer to any questions—and I
did attend. An observation fell from one of the
gentlemen of the Jury, which I thought would
lead to some questions being asked of the parish
officers ; and I then said to that gentleman (Mr.
Morris), who sat immediately before me, -" We are
Igt havelitttiousancircyquumessttaionici.::
as the public papers have stated that the parish of-
ficers did not attempt to explain before the Coroner
prepared
thought toit
rightgive ta o n
mention answer
why they had refused the woman the parish allow-
ance: I conceive, Sir, (but I may be in error), they
had no right to interfere, unless called upon by the
e
Coroner ; and having stated this much to one of the
jury, !that gentleman was certainly quite competent
to acquaint the Coroner with our presence, had he
required any evidence from us. I tun sorry, Sir, to
take up so much of your time, but I must make an
au observation or two more. Gentlemen will bear
in mind that we have in our official capacity of officers
and governors, to legislate for a two-fold interest—
the parish and the pauper—equally bound to support
the interest of one as the other. Such at least, Sir,
jtuursmnt
hbeep certainaetntpt
entirely
reeiilryl-1
arc the principles on which I am desirous of acting;
ify
ust
but if the refusal of relief (putting it in the strongest
loci
fisgienalliiletsi)st
useless for
crotschieievi
go and sit there, if they are
destroying a child, there is an end, in my opinion,
not to use their discretion in certain cases which
come before them. In the case now before us, there
was certainly a temporary suspension of the weekly
allowance—but for what purpose ? Why, to compel
ft base woman, :An was suspected, (and it appears
justly so) of being about to burden the parish with
another illegitimate child, it was to compel her by
the most likely means, to bring that document which
(had her tale been true) she could easily have done
that very day, to convince the committee that she
was married, and if married, the husband could then
sh
have been called up, and probably some terms made
ltipleaell trnein ans yl
legislation,
nsnen:llfstottreoe
with him, which would have been more advan-
tageous to the parish than taking the child
into the house. And
I will further ask you,
is the bold and hardened harlot to come
before you with the same claim that the
forlorn widow, the worn-out labourer, the helpless

orphan is entitled to ? is the wanton stiumpett
who, year after year, presents you with an additional
burthen, the result of her illicit intercourse—is this
shaMeless character, I may, to come before you witla
the Orrie Clain] that those, the legitimate claiments
on the pool hews, .are entitled to ? No; if they
were not sometimes repulsed,
they would gladly
avail themselves of your pe ;
asylum ul to deposit
there their hapless offspring, and for what ? that
freed frefir the incumbrance, they might return to
the path of Virtue 'and gain' an honest livelihood?
No. lam sorry id see, from the short experience
I have had in parochial Affairs, it is too often, to re-
turn to the same unhallowed course, again to revel
in foul prostitution, and again, as the natural results
of such practices, to come before yow, and say I
want to swear another child to its father. He
trusted that he had explained the matter to the sa-
tisfaction of the parishioners and to the public at
large."—(lmmense applause followed Mr. ksd well's
,speech.)
As soon as silence could be obtained,
M. BENNETT rose.---He would ask, were the
officers warranted in asking who was the father-
of the child, and whether_ they were warranted in
asking for the certificate, which was very easy
for her to produce. He considered they had a right.
He could but confess his opinion, that it was a pity
that this question should be brought forward now
when the unhappy woman was about to be tried:
He would wish it to be distinctly understood, that
the money never was stopped from her. The days
of payment for illegitimate children are Mondays,
and when she applied, the was told to call on Wed-
nesday, when she would have had it, had she but
have called, but she nevet did. He could say a deal
more, but he thought it highly improper when the
woman was almost upon her trial for her life. He
considered the parish officers had acted properly on
the occasion. He thanked Mr. Griffith most heartily.
for having brought the subject forward, as it had
given the officers an opportunity of clearing their
characters.

Mr. GRIFFITH replied, observing that he felt great
gratifteation in his mind in hearing that .Mr. Bennett
and his colleagues had not ordered the money to he
stopped, and he did not hesitate now to declare,
after the explanation that had taken place, that had
be been in the same situation, he should have acted
similarly ; but he really thought Mr. Bamett ought
not to have suspended the payment from Monday to
Wednesday, without orders from the Committee ;
besides, Mr. Moze declared on the inquest the money
was paid up to that period.
Mr. MozE denied having said so. He said it had
not ben stopped. . .

Mr. Gittiirrit, in continuation, said, he hailed
with pleasure the explanation that had been given,
and he hoped it would be promulgated, through the
means of the Press, all over the kingdom.
The CHAIRMAN moved a vote of thanks to. Mr.
Griffith, for his conduct in causing the inquiry, which
was seconded by Mr. BENNETT, and was folloWed
.by applause.
Many of the gentlemen spoke in the highest terms
of the humane conduct of Mr. Bassett, the assistant
overseer.

At about half-past nine the meeting separated,
highly gratified at its issue.

WINDSOR, DEC. 7:—His MAJESTY left the
Royal Lodge this afternoon at two o'clock, accompanied by
the LORD STEWARD, in his pony phaeton, for a drive in
the Great Park. Nis MAJESTY took an airing yesterday
for upwards of two boars, and visited Virginia lirattr and
Sandpit Gate. To-morrow the Kists is expected to in-
spect the improvements at the Castle.
His MAJESTY will arrive. at St. James's.
Palace on Thursday next, in order to hold a Council, and
receive the Recorder's Report.
The Duke and Duchess of CLARENCE came
to town yesterday morning from their seat in Bushy Park.
His Royal Highness was busily engaged throughout tke
whole of the day transacting official business at the Ad-
miralty.

The Duchess of CLARENCE, accompanied by
the Princess EMILIE of CAROLATH and Prince HOORNLOHE
LAUGENBOURG, visited the Princess FitODORI3, at the
apartments of her Royal mother, the Duchess of Karts, in
the King's Palace at Kensington, for the purpose of con-
gratulating the Princess on the return of her Natal Day.
The Royal Party afterwards partook of a Ddeune.
the evening the Duchess of KENT gave u Grand Dinner in
honour of the Day to several Members of the Royal Family,
and a select party of persons of distinction, who were in-
vited on the occasion.

Prince LEOPOLD came to town yesterday from
his seat at Claremont.
The Princess AUGUSTA took an airing yes-
terday in her carriage and four, end paid a visit to the
Princess Sarnia, at her apartments in the King's Palace
at Kensington.
The Duke of CLARENCE dined with the
Princess Auousra on Thursday, at her residence at the
King's Palace, St. Jantes'e.
Prince LinvEN had a Dinner Party on Thurs-
day, at Ashhnrnham House, Dover-street. Among whom
were—The Marquis and Marehionosa PALAIELLA, Count
and Countess MUNSTER, Count Omura, Mr. DE BEL-
LEHI', Mr. FALCE, and Mr. ROTH.
The Countess of ESSEX had a Card Party yes-
terday evening, at her house in Hill-street, Berkeley-square.
Lord MOUNTCHARLES is appointed to attend
Don Minim., in his passage to, and during his residence
at, this Court.
His Royal Highness the LORD HIGH AD-
MIRAL ban appointed Lieutenants to his Majesty's steam-
reasele. The following Officers have received their com-
missions for the undermentioned vesaela—Lieutenant T.
BULLOCK, Ik) the Echo; Lieut. G. J. HAY, to the Meteor ;
GEORGE EVANS, to the Lightning.
FASHIONABLE ARRIVALS.—The Marquis
of Bath, at his residence in Grosversor-aqvisre, from a long
tour ; Viscount Duegarvon, in Hertford-street, Irons Ox-
ford; Lord Wharneliffe and Mr. Stuart Wortley, ix Cur-
ton-street, May-fair, from Yorkshirs; Lord and Lady
Grenville, at their house in Charles-street, Berkeley-square,
from their seat, Dropmore, MIA, ; Honourable Thomas
n
i vsiPstlimlG:!uor,ritrin.rastio. seirv:vAtaii;i3Andigue allmbdegArliufsPlAn;l'rsatar.tha:tsiilana.lsjosCldnili.idaisSg3pl1Captain
ConstruetcaicoaispP truniouiss;rpsAt,jo°CParfaisluintan:;nn-rCidka:scHe rirannill'leßelilivsi n'rlaletiCemilfnf
rPa,ol:lroGddlinray.l'kl-it'sfie Charles
-street,
thimte:ai 'rt.
o:l:ffliiPrnorTmilmß:c :Ile rc.itß.:*Di iksortpferfmr:lltoaettea:rpttal;:
amolibieterthaßllia;fr,Hßo.nzion.raiiiiilepalai..mel Stuart Worn]
sfarilr.. ;R:faßjasorhAleitgkho,t,
ini pAilcbc7inle-street, fr t .Y:'
in
May-
Colonel Cavendish, at Burlington House, fromCe
Canterbury;
e rhur
Paris;y
fßroorutuelh ep
iicornaida
ilin
yl.r fromen Paris
tidt s.
...;.
Mrs. and Miss Whitmarsh, ,
fromr.atrceeptr,n
wfrnfiz
Sussex; Prince Esterhasy, fiasco the Cottage of the King,
at Chandos House; Sir Andrew Barnard, in St. James's--
street, from Windsor; Mr. and Mrs. Ricketts, in Harley-
street, from Paris; the Honourable T. Fiennes, at the
Royal Hotel, St. James's-street, from Yorkshire ; Wick-
ham Martin, E . at ditto, from Hants ; J. Ames, Esq. Es
ditto, from his seat in Bedfordshire; Capt. Fitzelarentv,
at ditto, fronts the Mediterranean ; Frederick Williams, sq.
at Fenton's Hotel, St. James's
-street, from Brighton.
DEPARTURES.--The Duke of Devonshire,
Major Henry Murray, for Portsmouth ; Major and Mrs.
for Cowdray Hall, in. Sussex, the meat of Mr. Poyntz ;
Fraser, for Bath ; Alajor and Mrs. Bristow, for Bath ;
Captain Drake, for Pertains Barracks; Lord and Lady
King and Miss King, from their house in Dover-street,
for their seat, Ockham, Surrey ; Lord Yarborough, from
the Isle of Wight, fur his seat in Lincolnshire; Sir Roger
them to clear the
and Lady Greeley, for Lulworth Castle ; Captain l3rymer,
from the Royal Hotel, for his seat in Leieeetershire ; :tr.
and Mrs. Shand, from ditto, for Paris; J. Molloy, E.,.
tebaysedothberys tuhregiringiMportanity, they e
from ditto, on a tour ; Capt. Caldx4ell, from ditto, on a tottr.
BUN MOT.—At the close of the Concert, et
,w,evrheefno,lloawsval
Wakefield, on Friday evening last, two persons entered for
the purpose of removing the seats preparatory to the ball ;
it.lo'ocym
el hired, 4, the forums," at the sawn, time lirtin themll-
Ilp and carrying them, away. A gentleman, whi!st waif
his carriage, turned to a friend and asked him, " F
theseinf; r
porters were like newly elected members of 7ly
parliament?"
This strange question he hail himself to R
answer, " Because
they took their oaths and.
seats together.".—Leeds Jo-
teiliyencer.