The Sun.
London, England, 1842-07-06 00:00:00

that in consequence of the alterations in the tariff they would t Sir JAMES GRAHAM said it was his intentieS•
obtain a full equivalent for the imposition of the Income-tax. !as he had befoee stated in answer to a similar -
He-should like to know where the saving to the eonsumer was • gireetion, to brill; belbre the Honee a Bill antherising. ee•
to come from. 'The whole reduction of duties effected by the • h„i, mait,sty
to
tariff was 1,300,0001. How it was possible. under any Orem-
grnting of a grant a new el; ater to the College e:
Physician-. It -was • viso his' intention to advise., the
stances, that the loss of revenue on the one hand could he eqni-
new ,
and them, two charters would certainly be in operati°h
relent to 3.300,000/., the estimated amount of the propel.),
before the, next meeting of Parliament.
tax, he could not understand,—( Cheers.) With the exception charter to the College of Surgeons,
of timber they had not touched upon any of the great articles
Lord SAN )' T
of consumption. He thought it would be better to employ I eN wished to know if peerej would be Y.
their surplus revenue in such a manner as to increase the rre • given under these charters to grant degrees •
venue rather than to sink it entirely. It was curious when the Sir J. GRAHAM said it was not intended that such •
~,e•
duty on Canadian timber was reduced to nothing to hear the authority should he given, because that authority v;s
woLuoldrdbe.Tm.
IldlZ.olTiSnStEheLLp
Noble Lord complaining of the reduction of the duty un Baltic not wanted.
timber. If there were no necessity fur any duty on timber for
revenue, would the Noble Earl impose a duty on foreign timber ?
re'sv-eisnbtecd•hatroterk?no7
The Err' of MOUNTCASHEL—Yes.
Lord AIONTEAGLE—Then the Noble Earl would
• Sir J. GRAHAM would be prepared to state to the --
House the details when he introduced the Bill. t.
pose a duty on goad timber merely to force the people of
England to use bad —(Cheers.) That was not the way mr. Vi ART would ask the Right Hon. Gentleman
what change.,
in which colonies ought to be protected. The colonial whether the charter proposed would exempt the insti
timber trade was increasing, and had increased during the tion from the effect of the Medical Reform Bill, nett
last four years. It had been progressing. It was a great whether they would be exempt from the effects of the
mistake to imagine that protection was required for that Medical Reform Bill to be introduced next session ?
trade. There was a great difference between reducing the Sir JAMES GRAHAM said he must give the sat" •
duty on Canadian timber, and giving it away entirely. The answer as to the Noble Lord. He should move for leave
late Mr. Deacon Hume stated that by a good regulation of the , to bring its the Bill, and then it would be his duty to
timber trade a good million might be raised, without raising ,
the
fate to the House what the precise provisions of
the price to the consumer. They were therefore throwing
Bill were
away a million lavishly, and leaving the raw material of two of , _
the most important manufactures burdened. Were it acting Mr. 0 CON N ELT, 'visaed to know if the charter well
wisely to do this? They might have relieved wool and cotton. off et the CoLege to Pltysiciatis in Ireland ?
in the
With regard to wool, orders were given to France to be executed Sir J. G neenam's ane,er was inaudible
in consequence of the hedvy duty in this cruntry. On the extent gallery.
duties it gave away uselessly a largo amount of taxation which
might have been applied to the relief of the suffering manu-
facturers. He alluded to the speeches which had been made
elsewhere by the Minis.ers in defence of the tariff with the
highest admiration, for it was impossible to lay down the doc-
trines of free trade in a mere unqualified manners and the appli-
cation of those prinetples to the fullest extent would be ulti-
mately asked for. He would not ahude to the Corn.laws fur-
ther than to observe that the tariff provided for the duties on
every article except tea, grain, sugar, and molasses. Why
did it not provide for the duties on corn ? Beevuse the prince
ple of the Corn Bill was diametrically opposed to the principle
of the tariff. Why was not sugar dealt with ? It must be
dealt with at no distant titne, and must be dealt :sin'
by making a considerable reduction of the duty on
foreign sugar. ( Hear, hear.) He did not despair
of seeing the Government bringing forward a Sugar Bill at no
distant period.—(Hear, hear.) The origival tariff showed a
most curious exhibition of discriminatory duties; there were 128
articles, which were not produced in our colonies in which dis-
criminatory duties had been imposed. What could he more
absurd than the discriminatory duties which had been re-
teined—the deriminatory duty upon eggs for example? With
regard to the duty upin metals and ores, he rejoiced to think
that the measure he had introduced some time since had pre-
cluded this measure ot the Government. The coal duty as
originally proposed would have annihilated- the trade,
and even lessened as it was, he doubted the
policy of imposing such a duty. If it were imposed
for the purpose of employing foreign manufactures it would fail
in its object. That was not the way to deal with foreign ma-
nufactures. With respect to tobacco. he objected to the at-
tempt to raise a new interest by placing a discriminatory
duty upon East India tobacco. There was too much of
fondness for a discriminatory duty in the Bill to make it a
wise one—and it was not wise to open the field ot competition
against the artisan, while at the same time it did not give to
him a free trade in food. It was beginning legislation at the
wrong end ; as. however, the measure was an advance to-
wards right principles he should vote in favour of it.
Lord COLCHESTER supported the Bill merely as a classi-
fication of duties, and not as an approximation towards free trade.
'The discriminatory duties he considei ell the most valuable part
of the Bill. With regard to the duty on Canadian lima r, he
thought Canada had no right to complain. If the reduction of
the ditty on copper ores would do no injury to Corn eall, he
should rejoice to see it take place, as it would be of great be-
nefit to the shiptng interest.
The Earl of WON replied. His Noble Friend hail not
done justice to the proposed alteration in the timber duties.
If there were any duties that required revision on account of
their absurdity they were the timber duties—( Hear, hear)—
and if they omitted to make the necessary alterations no one
would be more severe upon them than his Noble Friend. The
greater part of the timber imported from New Brunswick was
in no respect inferior to the Baltic timber, and was much
cheaper. He thought the value of 'the reduction of the timber
duty to the consumer had been much undervalued. He thought
that their first consideration was to upheld the colonies. They
were connected with us by Wood—they were part of ourselves.
No Bill imposing a tax on British manufactures could be passed
without the Royal assent, and all Governors had received
elecial orders never to give the Royal assent to any such Bill.
He therefore thought they ought to give hem something in
return.

NEWCASTLE ELECTION.
The SPEAKER informed the House that the reel"
nizanees on the petition against the return of 3'11.'
f,-;olquhoun were tnilbi.ctionable.

ELECTION PROCEEDINGS.
Mr. €.IOCI I RAN E rose to explain something which lie
ly;:d sail the other evening whilst speaking on the sub:
j:•c-. 01 the 3rLlport Election. lie !tad tetver said thfa
he thought these matters should go before a Committee
at all. The facts were these : when Mr. W::
burten presented his petition to the House, he ("h..;
Cochrane) did beg that an early day might
that he might .1-tact- an opportunity of refuting'
tho pk-tition, which he did. Then, when the Right 11°'' ,
atrottet had agreed that that petition was to be referre,uol,l'
to a Committee. and the question came to be whether ~
should go before Mr. Roebuck's or another Committeeq
he (Mr. Cochrane) said, to save the time of the House,ill(
he thought it would be preferable. that it should go
fore idr. Roebuck's Committee, but he never t13.0(1
say that it should be referred to a Committee tiel4
all. He never did entertain the opinion that otst7.4ir
of bribery and corruption should go before a Committ`,'',',e'l
he thought rather that the matter should be fully ,
cussed in that House. He thought, too, after the avOilt
of the Hon. Member for Finsbury.' that he had s,
11(1,1t
between 31,000/. and 40,000/.- at heading, he coultllll,l
find much faith with him (Mr. Cochrane) if he admits"
that he had been guilty of bribery and couipronlis
(Cries of " Oh, oh,' and laughter.) One thßgii
ho would say, however, which was this, that 1)
appearing before the Committee, he (Mr. Coehrw,;la
should give up no documents whatever, and
answer no questions but such as he thought tit. s
congratulated the House upon one subject, and that ‘c,,3,
the perfect harmony which resulted from that Commit'
tee. The Hon. Member for Bath's kindness and cootie')
were really quite astonishing ; and he thought the
Member's character hitherto must have been very e%11.0,
ordinary, N V hen -Honourable Members felt it neeess'n;
to praise him so highly because he bad not 10,5
suited them.—(Hear, and a laugh.) The proceeov,
of the Committee were now closed, at least the 11°.a
Member for Bath had adjourned his Comtnittee
I Thursday, and lie announced Lis intention of conductil;
it in future on a different system. What that sYSIOO
would be, he (Mr. Cochrane) did not know. His ophlol.,s
was that justice could never be obtained by unjust mellc
and that an illegal means was always an unjust one•
begged to say that he should appear before the Cott:lie
tee, but that he should only answer what questions
thought kit.

POOR-LAW BILL. float
Captain PECHELL stated that reports were
all over the country that it was the intention w,
Government not to proceed with this Bill es it re,
stood. He wished to-know from the Right Hon. 13artn!".i
the Secretary of State for the Home Departatt6;
whether it was the intention of the Goverment to r,
ceed ith the Bill as it now tood ?
Sirw l JAMES GRAHAM said he had not heard 6:
reports to which the Hon. Member referred ; trt't/'''
other reports, it was entirely unfounded.
MESSAGE FROM THE LORDS. with
Messengers from the Lords appeared at the table
certain Bills from the House of Lords.
COMMITTEE OF SUPPLY—ADJOURNED
DEBATE.
Sir R. PEEL said he should propose that to-0,5
row the House shOuld resolve itself into a Corernitte,ebeTr
Supply, and that it should have precedence of the ce) did
Orders. He hoped that would answer the object 0' `a,
lion. Member, as they could then proceed nab din a'
journed debate on his motion. no
Mr. WALLACE was perfectly satisfied. He 11'1' at
individual wish on the subject, and the House might' -
as it thotteht proper.
LONDON BRIDGE APPROACHES BILL' ‘.6,5
On the motion of the Earl of LINCOLN this Bill
postpoted till to-morrow. vi))
CHARITABLE PAWN OFFICES (IRELAJ)i f
BILL.
Mr. GREENE brought up the Report on this Bill.
MINES AND COLLIERIES BILL. for
Lord ASHLEY said, he hoped the Hou. Me 5.10,4)
Bolton, who was the only person now in the way 01_?:00
Bill, would allow it to proceed. If it was allow•edv4lr
over this night, he did not know when he might I>r' r.
to bring it forward. He therefore earnestly and seOlid
put it to the Hon. Member whether he would be
enough to allow the Bill to go through its last stn,„? 0
Mr. AINS WORTH was sorry he could notigrie`:o
the request of the Noble Lord. He had prepay not
clause of which lie had given notice, and he • could r -
let the Bill pass without moving it
I °I/
Mr. LAMBTON thought if the House egret
such a course the Bill might be proceeded with. dig'
Lord HOWICK thought the Bill would be better
cuss=ed non than at a late hour of the night. de'
After some conversation Mr. AINSWORTH, in
ference to the general feeling of the House, AVithdre't', iic
objection, the third reading being a dropped order, eel of
taken after the other Orders of the Day were dispos
• BRIBERY AT ELECTIONS BILL. ,qeor
Lord J. RUSSELL moved that the following'.oo:
hers form the Select Committee on Bribery at Elec,ti;eeor
Lord J. Russell, Sir R. Peel,Viscount Sandon, Mr. t'"-,005
General, Mr. Solicitor General for Ireland, Sir 'l,,';`rie't
Wilde, Sir George Grey, Mr. Thesiger, Mr. vas,.
Mr. Charles Wood, Mr. Thomas Dutteombe, lepti
cattlay, Sir Robert Harry Inglis, Mr. Aglionll,
Sir Thomas Fremantle.—Agreed to.
COLONIAL PASSENGERS BILL. Or
Lord STANLEY 'moved the third reading of the
lonial Passengers Bill. 01
Mr. HAWES was surprised that the Noble lje
should have moved the third reading of this Bill' °°ld
had been promised by the Noble Lord that he s'
have ample notice of his doing so.
Lord STANLEY said the Bill had remained
posed for six months, except by the Hon. 3rleinh,e,it: la
that opposition was only on one clause of the •1311eeer:r
consequence of there not having been a House iajocr
day, and having lost a day-at this advanced peiep
the session, it-was impossible he could defer it loPb eis
Mr. HAWES coniplained that, notwithstandil,
promise, the Noble Lord had not given him notlep;be.,
was mistaken in supposing that he was the onlY„" sl,',
opposed to it ; there were several who object"' pToly
clau.,.ce, which, moreover, was the very one the
Lord himself opposed last year.
After some remarks from Mr. V. Smithy
O'Connell, and Lord J. Russell, till tit
Lord STANLEY postponed the third reading
morrow (Wednesday).
:BUILDINGS REGULATIONS Bait' vote
The Buildings Regulations (No. 2) Bill wet
t f
a Committee. TO)
MANCHESTER, BIRMINGHAM, AND 13op
~e
POLICE BILL. „, of
till
Sir J. GRAHAM posponed the second reawniiiil,
Manchester, Birmingham, and Bolton Police i
Thursday. WO . 10/
DEAN FOREST ECCLESIASTICAL - of t
On the motion for the further considerati° t
Doan Forest Ecclesiastical Bill, o'o3
Mr. HUME role and said that he thoughthere
present nas an improper time, when etr fadscl
a deSciency of 2,500,0001. in the revenue, Pt.,. repetot,
ing churches out of the public money, as w% -4-e4
in the measure be ore the House. lie c011.1.' belt
all motley derived from the Crown lands sh,"u, pre4o
pr.pr.ated to the public service ; and tnt'aioctii„,:,
would be a vote of the public money nte Pe:101.
if it were taken from the Customs or %tie prelloc'
These were the grounds of his opposition. lithe, It of
against - this improper application of 01.010'00
motley. He was not insensible to the' intr. 14tet5
providing public instruction, but he prows! All Liar
applying to
.one sect that which belonged
and all classes. , The Hon. Member concluded ). a of
,
the following resolutions.:— , the Weed I),
"1. That the revenue from the Crown lanai inanderrtspe
Dean is part of the revenue of the Crown lands tr in welling'
her Majesty to the public exchequer of the county 1. orf
and in consideration of the yearly sum of 3-4•s'e for he,reto'
granted by Parliament nut of the public revenn_
jesty's civil list, during her lifetime ; and that aWelerft7o 01
the revenue of her Majesty's Crownlands to "Svc reveille re'
or for any other purpose, is a charAe on the P .a from
the country equally as if the same memo. is pal
opto
venue of her Majesty's Excise or Customs.
That the revenues of the Church of EI.Ig bofo:ivo t,
by the Report of the Ecclesiastical Cominissionfo,s,
.toi,7,e or
[Souse, amounted to 3,811,507/. sterling, 1: ocl
3,&07,5011. net income, from lauds and titoc oper
Easter offer:ngs and fees. .„ e 77, art d otl'bee
"3. That, by the Act 6 and 7 Wm. I v •? ',;,,res an, ie t a
quent Act, it was enccted, that various 51?"_auctiori.,: and
offices in the Church should be abolished, anti re
cow
~ Rol
shou",,etv

Lord MONTEAGLE explained. He had not argued that
the timber duties should btt continued; on the contrary, he
wished all monopoly abolished.
Strangers were then ordered to withdraw, and the House
divided.
That the Bill,be read a second time :
Contents

Non-contents
Majority in favour of the second readatz —55
The House then adjourned at Half-past Ten o'Clock.

HOUSE OF COMMONS, July 5.

The SPEAKER took the Chair at lonr &Clock.
The Liverpod :Ind Manchester Railway Bill was read
a third time and pas,ed.
ATHLONE ELECTION.

The SPEAKER int.mned the House that the recog-
nizances on the netition against the return for Athlone,
of 5001. each, were unobjectionable.
CoIoneI•CONOLLY preiontect a lae:ition from a place
in Ireland, against time system of National Education in
Ireland. •

Mr. ORD presented a petition agaitist. the New Poor-
law Bill.

BIR,IIDIGHAM POLJCE.

Mr. MU N TYp- reLnivd a petition from the Mayor,
Aldermen, and. Burgesses of the borough of Birmingham,
against the Manchester. Birmingham, and Bolton Police
Amendment Bill.