The Sun.
London, England, 1829-05-26 00:00:00

METROPOLIS POLICE BILL.

Mr. Secretary PEEL moved the third reading of
the Metropolis Police Bill.
Mr. C. PELHAM opposed it very briefly.
The Bill was then a third time.
Mr. PEEL proposed a clause, by way of rider,
making provision in case of the misnomer of parishes.
Mr. BRIGHT said, that after what he had
ready said on this subject io the course of the even-
ing, and after witnessing the spirit in which the
House had received it, he should not further oppose
the progress of the Bill.
The clause was then added to the Bill, and it was
passed, and ordered to the Lords.
BUCKINGHAM PALACE.

Lord LOWTHLR moved that the House go
into Committee on the Land Revenue Bill.
Colonel DAVIES felt called upon to make some
remarks before the Speaker left the Chair, and to
bring some serious charges against a well•known in-

dividual, much mixed up with matters treated of in ' quarter. He trusted that after this explanation the House
the Bill, It was a. measure of revenue, and of con- would not refuse going into a Committee.
siderable interest end importance to the public, as it i Colonel DAVIES thought that a. sufficient ease for in-
gave to the Lords of the Treasury the power of ap-
quiry had been made out.
plying almost indefinitely the produce of the Crown Mr. HUSKISSON should feel most happy to f.cilitate
lands to the construction of Buckin ham Palae,
any inquiry into matters which bad taken place whilst he
g ~
had had the honour of holding th • office of Chief Commis-
while in another Clause the Commiisioneis of sinner Forests. of Woods and Wth respect to Mr. Nash;
Woe& and Forests were authorized to sell all the he believed that there was no man less capable of being
Cro ait estates. Although this power was after- ' actuated by selfish or unworthy motives in the discharge
wards limited, yet he, should think it right to pro- 1 of his public duty. With regard to the change in the value
pose an Amendment, that the Crown Lands and : of property in a short time, they had only to look to the
Leases should only be disposed of by public auction. 1 increased value of the property of the Duke of Portland,
Great frauds and malversations had formerly been i my Lord Grosvenor, and Duke of Bedford, in the last 30
committed in that department by the negligence of or 40 years.
the predecessors of the Noble Lord ( Lowther)— 1 The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER concurred
i most fully in this opinion.
against whom, however, not the slightest imputation Sir J. YORKE thought it rather singular, that when a
could he brought—and whose talents and activity üblic alien was accused, he invariably received from those
would doubtless render essential services to the Fii office over him the best possible character.country. He (Colonel Davies) objected espe- Mr. J. WOOD said, of Mr. Nash h knew nothing,
cially to that part of the Bill which related to but he was satisfied that the charges against hitn could not
Buckingham Palace, of the expence of which rest where they were, and that his character demanded
he held an estimate in his hand. That estimate they should be strictly investigated. The estimated ex•
shewed, that originally the repair of the Palace pence of what had been already done, was 496,1691. But
was to cost 252,0001., and it was to be made into a from what they knew already of Mr. Nash's estimates, he
comfort tole residence for the King when he occa-
thought it was much more likely that it would be 696,000/.
sionally came to town from Windsor, as if for a
How, indeed, could they expect a result different from that
which took place in the case of Windsor Castle? It ap-
wealthy Nobleman. Front one expence to another poearied by a return laid on the table of that House, that up
that estimate now rose to not less than 496,001)1,
to 1828
Cassstulern
while 44a5ie,000/.
remainedhad been expended on
el
estimate ve l67fo,orofou/r.
1,. to and the Appendix to the Report of the Committee
detailed many most extravagant items. One of these be paid in addition; while the whole
was the marble arch, the sculpture for which was not ture, and for additional apartments, required a sum,
included in the original estimate of 16,000/., which making in all 214,0001. in addition to the original grant;
Mr. Nash, the individual against whom he had to and it was his firm belief, that if they did not look well
bring three distinct charges, had stated that it would to the estimates, a further sum of 100,0001. would be re-
cost. What did the House imagine was to be the (prised next year. In speaking of the expenses incurred
royal palaces, he thought it worth while to revert to a
expenee of the sculpture only for this arch? 34,0004 for
Before the Committee, Mr. Nash had been strongly return ordered to be printed on the 19th of last July.
Ws was a return of the Four and a Half per cent. duties,
pressed as- to the total amount, but he constantly tiliveeGntihralftarhducties, the droits of the Admiralty, and other
evaded the question, and did not say one word about we'rnt.ed
it,ln thehe
fmouhnisdt
inof it, however,d and
'the sculpture; which, added to the estimated original .where'the leastt el:ano
fA Appendix n
Crowni x an
expence of
.16,000/., would make the arch cost the account of the sumsP received on accout
public no less than 50,000/. This, too, at a time from the sale of spices in the Molusca Islands. The amount
When it was admitted that the most rigid economy was 140,000 t. ; and in the account of its expenditure, there
was necessary, and when it was professed to be 01. was au item to which he thought few Members of that
served. He (Colonel Davies) did not pretend to House would object—namely, 32,0001. to the Distressed
any knowledge of architecture, but when he was told Spanish Refugees resident in this country. But then followed
that this triumphal erection was so ornamental, he the fitting-up of the new State Rooms in St. James's
could not help reflecting that the time might come 51,2181. ; for the Royal Lodge, Windsor Pack,
when it would be otherwise. At present its " original P14a,1a919.e6,1. ; and for the Pavillion Stables at Brighton,
(htheaart,
thesehear !)—and the most curious part of the
brightness" might contrast with the free-stone of the matter was, were omitted
money 'tti.d titosbdehbereonnght
palace, but when it put on " the customary suit of so- forward in 1826 an 7, sums
omathawt
lemn black" worn by public buildings in our smoky pended three years before it was accounted for. Unless
atmosphere, nobody would he able to tell whether something was done, he was satisfied, indeed, that one or
it was constructed of marble or Portland stone. It two hundred thousand pounds would still be required fur
must be in the recollection of those who had been furniture, in addition to all that was expended on the
Members of the Committee, that . Mr. Nash took building ; and that, before the Monarch could he settled
great credit to himself, and mentioned with exults- in Buckingham House, the country will have expended
tion, that he had sent out for Carrara marble, and one million upon it erections. The Hon. Member con-
that he should in that article only effect a saving to eluded by saying, that neither his Majesty nor his Govern-
mentcould hope to have faithful servants around them,
the public of 9,000/. He added, that he had shewn unless it
Jwal\s,Efism Proeundthtesyt-ed told the truth.; (Hear, hear.)
Air. o
specimens to the principal importers of marble, and against
i absence;altstthe
nd expressedatatacksonAlr
that they had admitted that they could not supply it Nash and Mr. Edwards in
under twenty-five thousand or twenty-six thousand a hope that the Hon. Member for Worcester
W(Colonel
pounds. A very few days after he had made this Davies) would feel it his duty, after the attack he had
assertion, which was published in the Newspapers, a made on the character of those gentlemen, to carry the
letter appeared from one of the houses to which Mr. matter further, and move that the Attorney-General be
Nash -had stated that he sheaved the marble, ex- ordered to prosecute them for a conspiracy to injure and
pressing astonishment that Mr. Nash had used its deteriorate the public property.
name, as he had never consulted any of its partners, 11r. A. BARING, as one of the Commissioners ap-
pointed to superintend the expenditure at Windsor Castle,
who had no notion that such a statement was to be felt himself called upon to make one or two observations
u
made. Then as to the commission to be allowed upon the charges brought against them by the Hon. Mem-
to the architect. Mr. Nash, upon what principle her for Preston (Mr. NA ood. ) That Hun. Member corn-
he (Colonel Davies) was at a loss to conjecture, plained of the expenditure exceeding the estimate. Be
was allowed by Government five per cent. ; and admitted it had done so, and no one who knew anything
when he was asked by the Committee whether about the state of that edifice could he surprised at the
that was the usual allowance, he admitted that fact Whether, if it was the question now that Windsor
he had received only three per cent. from the Board Castle should be restored at such an expence, Parliament
of Works. In answer to other questions, he stated would give its consent, lie could not say ; but when it was
that he had been allowed in-some instances three, determined to restore that truly national edifice, time Com-,
Minis- missioners found there was scarcely a sound wall in it—
and in others five per cent. ; that he had in three or
four years received a sum of 24,000/., being more that when they attempted to pull a door apart for the pur-
than 6,000/. a year, the salary of a Cabinet rnosedoofwrne airs the whole building was in danger of coin-.
they,Pand,were, therefore, in fact, undercessityofCastle.
to be had upon laying out the gardens, furnishing from the apartments being uncommonly splendid, the Com-
the railings and other matters, which furnished ad- missioners had visited them lately, and he, as one of them,
ditional ground of extravagance. It was a fact, that could say, that although handsoine and well adapted to
if they wished to, have a public functionary dis- their several purposes, there were many Noblemen in
charge his duty well, they must pay him well. But this kingdom quite 38 well lodged as the Sovereign.
here they gave to this gentleman an interest in ex- There were circumstances connected with the present
pending the public money, for the more he spent the question, and admitted, which, as a matter of business,
certainly displayed a very improper arrangement.—(Hear,
more he gained. In page 47 of the Report, it ap-
lateaoru.)n—tedWtloteftherdthe proceedingsi under that arrangement
pears he was asked if the Board of Works had no wassa tainleot
lisearstquot.f.stitton,a burteilite
oversightconfssed
controul over the plans which he furnished, and his hem thought it,. to
answer was " none whatever." Upon being further that the personn-who stylist the adviser of theg Treasury or
questioned, he stated that his plaits were submitted the Government—he might perhaps add of the Sovereign
to to the King, approved of by the King, and signed himself, should be permitted to be a jobber afterwards
by the King, and that such plans obtained the in the way he had heard described. If Mr. Nash was
counter-signature of the First Minister of State; acting in these matters on the part of Government, and
but according to the evidence given in page 72 of allowed a commission for his trouble, he should have no-
the Report, it appeared that Mr. Nash was in
thing to do with any part of the arrangement.—(Hear.)—
the habit of regularly going on with his plans From all he had heard of Mr. Nash, he believed him in-
capable of a dishonest action ; but as a man who had
without even waiting for the signature of
the Minister. According to his statement, there proved an improvident manager of the public money, and
who
had, to the specimens which they possessed of his
was already an expense of 496,0001., and yet this task, proved a most unfortunate architect' he thought the
was not all which the country was to be called upon Government ought not to have had anything to do with hims
to pay; there were two fountains to be made, there Mr. BANKES thought the repairs of Windsor Castle
were iron railings to be laid down, without saying a so essential to the dignity of the Crown and of the coun-
single word about the furniture; so that if the pub- try, that even if be had known the exact amount of the
lic were not called upon to advance six hundred expense to be incurred, he, for one, could not have objected
thousand pounds for this purpose, they might think to it. With respect, however, to Buckingham-house, the
case had been completely reversed ; and in his opinion the
themselves well off. But even this was not all ;
House
fist et
usesrvasd, neie wasltativitl 2ons.ci o
falseo pretences.—(llea.r, hear.)
)
there were charges for improvements in Hyde-park T
and Constitution-hill, which he considered altogether
unwarranted ; which, with bridges, the gat e ( which lie there had been expended a sum with.in 4,010m0wl it seemed
haif a
million. With regard to the sum of 34,000/. for sculp-
thought highly to the architect's credit), and some ture of an arch, he should like to know by whose order
other matters, amounted to 34,982/. In this latter that expense was incurred ?—at whose suggestion it was
ease, however, Mr. Nash was not employed, and the designed? In his opinion, there was not a man who saw
consequence was, that he dug a reservoir for water so
immediately behind it, that the gate was of no use
iatn)buotthue'rouplltaleseayttlitant tihne at
hrceh
fronttnie h to
fb be placede b ehtut edrt in
except to look at. Having said thus much with re-
setae, and therefore forming by its marble a most disagree-
able contrast. He asked, was any man bold enough to say
spect to Mr. Nash, he would now proceed to more grave
that the Palace would not he better without it, except per-
and serious charges against hint. But first, he must pre-
mise that he had never seen or had any communication haps the architect, who had thus chosen to build ants otlirm-e
purse.
with that Gentleman, and therefore he could not be sup-
structiou to his view? The Hon. Member then referred
posed to entertain any hostile feeling towards him ; he felt to the late wings of the Palace, which he described as
reseoremblthei ng barns,
Committee ad observed that Mr.
admitted they were ass Nsh,
ugly h
wen lg._
it his duty, however, to accuse him of fraud upon the public f
He had already observed upon the inexpediency of ,
n
allowing the Commissioners of Woomls and Forests to let public thought them, and that they had disappointed his
expectations. He was asked if he could correct the tie-
out the public lands in that competition. This was evi-
The character of the architect, to be sure, was
dent in respect to what took place with reference to Regent-
feet? and he said yes, at an expense of 25,000/. for each
street ; but there was still a stronger case to be found in wing'
the rebuilding of Suffolk-sitreet, Pall-mast East. On that depreciated, but then the value of the ooremission to the
occasion an application was made by a person named Ed- architect was enhanced.—(Hear, heea.)..--The old wings
wards for a lease of a portion of the land, and the applies- were pulled down; the new ones were erected, and Mr.
Nash had his commisaion oirnini,:itneheoettii:baucioinilndosine,icitgusueonpp,epe:t(ht:hi:ifips untildlniinndgg,
tiOn in writing was at that moment in the hands of the
Commissioners of Woods and Forests. Soon after Alr. down, and the rebuilding of this part of the palace,
Nash stafed that Mr. Edwards was not in possession of
fault(ll e a (Hear, htehairs,
instance a r
ing fault with bad)— had, indeed,
in building at any time after-
funds sufficient to carry on the building, and that he (Mr.
Nash) would himself complete the work ; thus obtaining
possession of the land at least 500 per cent. under its value. wards.—(A laugh.)—lf the House would turn to pages
His charges against Mr. Nash did not rest here. lie 47 and 49 of the evidence annexed to the Report of the
found that Mr. Nash had valued the lands taken by the Committee to which he had been adverting, they would
proprietors of the Regent's Canal, and these lands were find by Mr. Nash's evidence that there was no person re-
valued at from 2601. to 360/. per acre, and he had granted sponsible for the manner in which the money was ex-
to him, at various times, different plots of ground in the pended. Mr. Nash, it appeared, to.mk his orders from ea.
same quarter at the same rate, while in the vicinity of the individual who was undoubtedly well fitted by '„is taste
Regent's Park, the London University had paid 4,5001. and judgment to give those orders —but, whether justified
per acre for their land. Taking all these facts together, he constitutionally in doing so, he (Mr. Entices) would not
thought they formed such a ground of charge as required pretend to say. Ho weds then turned over to the Lords of
investigation. The Hon. Member concluded by moving the Treasury, by whom he was referred for payraent to
the Commissioners of Woods and Forests, who hail no con,
the appointment of a Comtnittee to inquire into the Ex- the
4,ovtietterettlorere,extruetnduintu;ete
toy
meansoplmsi
opposite
imputed any
11 e blameit e
iiry
i,tqloi
!,: theidrasirliesiih;tuAut: Hon.i.bnlaeesy ,faGilirele)nl;ltbeoymatiPihnue
penditure of building Buckinghatn-boose, as well as the
mode adopted in letting crown Lands?
ittou attloenfov lead e ever duneexpenditure,e i
.tt..
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said it
was not his intention upon that occasion to enter law the public as an eneletoan '
details.over which the Hon. Member had gone, but he (A loud laugyhg.)—But what was the expedient to WI:114
could not help observing, that by the Act of 1825 the
stl,rdedßhieghntrolullodnp.
rGopssesetlemaainnnnoitw proposed to, sesoci?, - lie
Commissioners of Woods and Forests were empowered to
Alit of what benefit would
lti than again be in the situation
andh that if that limit were excee4d,, he would
apply their funds for the purpose of building and repairing
ttheatHheore
The
statei the cese ?.
entd.itEuarne.kes)Hkenievwzel
Royal Palaces. There certainly was a limit to this ex-
wliich it steoolet:ltsperweseeutlit. He I'll
penditure, which might be seen by the estimate on th!
portion sr,f (ac eatinii4e ; and
futusae
table. The Hon. Member for Worcester had attached the Weil how to oontroul the future expenditure.
character of Mr. Nash, and 4,1 carried his charges over a to put upon the trans.ction a math of the disilperobo-A
nember of years. 41ow it was impossible that lie could of the House, by deducting
defend the character and conduct of Mr. Nash so far back if there should be any esktrateaga,nce, Iv hoped the
as 1816 ; but there was a point upon which he felt that House would tionen -of.l • lag duty some t„ os .,,,,..3 .. uuty to the
he could do that gentleman ample justice, di inasini it as it public, • '--
came under his own observation. It had reached him that i Lq oc-7.
ALTHORP wished to know if the estimate ef
a person named Edwards had applied for a pOrtioil of the 6
4fiseooo/. did or did not include the 200,000/. from the
ground upon which Suffolk-street was to tae built; Mr. French claims? In his opinion the wltole Inceeeding had
Nash bad himself valued the land; but it became known been a most wasteful eat pend t t.tire a .
the public money.
to the Commissioners of Woods and Forests that Edwards The Hon 31% .
ein er fur PArattEutire was experienced in the
was privately connected with Mr. Nash. Another person, forms of .
named Shaw,- was called in to valise the property; and be able the
ll9\lt4attd
he
(Lord Althorp) hoped he might
upon that validation it was that Mr. Nash took it thorn ''
• sculpture of the arch.
Edwards, If ti
-"Ile Wai: any blame in this transaction itl e to prevent the expenditure of the 34,0001. for tile
Mr. HUAIE begged to obsetve, thrst be, for one did not
, , certainly ought not to atiacli'to Mr. Nash, but to another blame Mr. or in '
Nash, . other person but the Lords of the

Treasury. They wen the titdpahle parths, aid thei
were responsible for the extravagant expence witch ha I
been incurred. . . •
. , • -
Mr. PROTHEROE thought Mr:'. Nast had been hardly
dealt With. Had the Right Han.- Gentleniatt„Toilad. any
.of his Majesty's Ministers, ever seen tthe-Palan-? He be-
lieved Mr. Nash boasted that none'of them had seen it.
He (Mr. Protheroe) had seen the Palace, and he much
distrusted that it could be completed for tho estimate now
framed. Not a room was plastered. Many of the doors
had received only one coat of paint. No floors were laid
down. The ceilings were but half finished ; and non? of
the gilding had been executed. Then there was the fur-
niture, of which no notice had been taken. All tlu se
things convinced him that the expendittne would be greater
than w. 14 at present anticipated.

Mr. BANKES said, that when the Bill came b •fore
the Committee, he would move the deduction of 32,4501.
from the sum proposed, in order to mark the sense which
the House entertained of the proceeding.
Mr. R. COLBORNE was no greater admirer of Buck-
ingham Palace than any other Hon. Member ; but he
thought it too late to interfere.
The House then resolved itself into the Committee on
the Bill.

The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER—With
respect to Buckingham Palace, it was begun in 1825,
after considerable discussion in the House on its propriety ;
a debate took place on the situation, and it was deter-
mined that it should be where it was. The responsibiiity,
therefore, was slfared by the House. It was true that the
original estimate was only 250,0001., but that estimate
had within it a variety of exceptions ; a number of charges
were not includes in it. The etch had been complained
of. Right or wrong, it formed a part of the original
plan. The marble for it haring been procured, and tl.e
workmanship commenced, the question was, whether the
expence ineurrt d was to be thrown away? The sculpture
was in a great measure completed. One side of the arch
was raised. To leave it in its present state would be to
leave a deformity, disgraceful to all parties. Taking the
arch as an individual building, he did not by any means
consider it discreditable either to those by whom it had
been designed or by whom it had been executed. The
Hon. Member for Evesham doubted whether he (the
Chancellor of the Exchequer) had ever seen the Palace.
He had, however, gone over it but a very short time ►tgo ;
and although no part was finished, he could not allow that
it was so very far from comp•etion as the Hon. Member
for Evesham supposed. Although the floors were not-laid,
most of them were ready, as well as the window-frames;
and the plaster was all prepared, although not applied.
The Hon. Member for Horsham had asked him what it
was intended to do respecting the road through the Bird-
cage-walk? He could assure the Hon. Member that he only
did justice to his Majesty's disposition in what had fa!len
from him on that point. Of that fart the opening of the
gardens in the middle of the park afforded a striking proof.
The same disposition which had thus induced his Majesty to
consult the comfort of the middle classes would also govern
him with respect to the accommodation of the higher ;
and although the proposed buildings were postponer),
on account of the expence, it was still intended to open a
road to the Houses of Parliament through Storev's-gate--
of course subject to those regulations of the Parks, which
permitted only private carriages to pass by it. As to the
gates of the bridge at Kensington-gardens, he was really
I unable at present to give any information on the subject.
After a few further observations the Right Hon. Gent.
moved an Introduction in the first clause of the Bill to ti e
following effect :—" Provided, that the sum to be applied
under this Bill shall not exceed the sum of 150,000/. over•
and above the sum specified in the preceding Acts."
Mr. BANKES proposed, as an Amendment to the
Chancellor of the Exchequer's Resolution, that the esti-
mate be reduced by 34,4501., which brought the estimate
to 115,550/.
Mr. ARBUTHNOT wished, before the Committee
divided, to make an observation in, answer to a remark
which fell from the Hon. Member for Horsham respecting
Mr. Nash's having an interest in some of the houses now •
building on the site of Carlton House. The facts of the
case were, that a house had been built for the Hon. Bart.
at the southeast corner of the gardens, which would have
been isolated had not Mr. Nash most liberally come for-
ward and offered to build at his • own expence, and dispose
of to any purchasers at cost pace, five houses in a :111-4
with that which he had before mentioned. A great num-
ber of persons: had applied for houses on the other side, but
there was an unwillingness to take houses in the situation•
of those now building by Mr. Nash. He thOught th4t
great credit was due to Mr. Nash for haying acted with so
much liberality.
Mr. POULETT THOMPSON rose to ask the Chan-
cellor of the Exchequer whether he would pledge himself
that the vote of 496,0001. would be sufficient-to complete
the building, and that the House should not be_ called
upon hereafter to Squander fresh sums of the public money
away on this Palace ?

The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER would not
give the Hon. Member a positive pledge; but he (the
Chancellor of the Exchequer) had no doubt in his owt,
mind but that the present estimate would be amply suffi-
cient to complete the work.
Colonel DAVIES made a few observations, which. were
inaudible in the gallery.

11Ir. WOOD thought that it was an insult to the House
to be called upon to vote large sums of money for the.,e
new palaces withsut having any pledge that no more would
be called for to complete them. He wished to ask the
Noble Lord (Lord Lowther) opposite, whether it was the
intention of the Boaid of Works to have a passage opened
from the end of Waterloo-place into St. James's-park ? if
such a passage was in contemplation, he suggested that it
would be desirable to open it as soon ae possible. Ho
could not refrain, now he was on his legs, from alluding
to the present dangerous state of the State Paper-o Dice, in
Great George-street, which almost threatened is fxlldoFt'tt
on the passengers.

The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said, that
a sum of money had been voted by the House fee the pur-
pose of providing a State Paper Office, and tho time it
was understood that the Sessions House, Dar Westminster-
hall, would be purchased for that purraiie ; but the Magis-
tastes had reiuirea such an exorbitant sum for this building
(which would also require to have some money laid out upink
it) that the treaty was put an end to, and the Goverir:i„,
determined to provide a building for the purpos' e.isewhere.
With respect to the wooden budding
iu 7: estminiter-hall,
he could only say that it would. sil-atly be removed, as a
place was now being PW.P4',d for the reception of the
public pap ,rs, 84('''11-`')Dt7.ined therein.
After 1 f"W w's:rds from Mr. S. WORTLEY, strangers
were micro' to withdraw, and the House divided, when
there P7epeared for Mr. Bankes's Amendment,

Noes 9l
Ayes 6l
Majority against the Atneniment —3O
The original motion of the Chancellor of the Excheluer
was then put anti agreed to without a division.
The House then resumed, and the Report was ordered
to be presented this day.
The other 01 ders of the Day were then disposed of,- and
the House adjourned at Half-past Two o'clock. •,