The Sun.
London, England, 1820-07-17 00:00:00

BE It DUtIE.S.

.
MINUTES Of 'EVIDENCE relativelo the TIMBER TRADE,
• r
taken before the SELECT COMMITTEE of therHOUSEa
of LORDS, appointed to inquire into the.Meaus Of extend,:
ing add securing the FOREIGN TRADE
.of the COUN-
TRY, and to Repert to the House.
(Centinuedliom our Paper of Thuisdoy
Die Sab4ati 3° junii 1.820.
The Marquess of LA.Nspowri,E hi-the Chair.
•Order of Adjenrpraent. read.
EnwAnn SOLLY, Esq.-is called in, and ex.a.,
mined as follows
:What business have; you heett.prineipally engaged in?
In the Timber Trade.
in any: particular Branch of the Timber Trade
Not in any particular Branch-, I was formerly established
at Dantzic,and my principal Trade was,in the'Eaportation of
Tiinher ftir the use of his Majesty Navy, but -generally in the
.Export of Timber.
Can-.you state.to the 'Connnitter, in Abe Vessels of what.
Country the Timber in which you were concerned was prinei-
,
pally imported to this Canntry?
Mistime of peace principally in British treitels.; in time of
vvar,principally in Prussian.
Can yerii state in whit description of vessels the Timber
front the Nutili is piincipally imported at present?
Principally iu British vessels.
Can auu,ha m arty opitrion, whether, in the event of an in-
creased Impartation of •Iloilier from the Northern Ports, tali-
. ing place is consequence of a remission ol.linty, or any other
,cause, that increased Importation would take place in British
'or in vessels of other Cnnittries-t
I- have no Doubt that 'ant iircrectsed Importation would take
plocejir British vessels.
State the grounds of that opinion ?
I was formerly a considerable Owner of Prussian Ships,
arid therefore I had- a good deal of experience in Prdssian
:Shipping, and I can safely say that Pros-mu strips cannot
compete-with English ships in time of Peace; the English
ships are navigated cheaper thao Prussian-ships; the ,Prussian
,vessels are more heavily nrasteti ar'd rigged, and require a
.greater eomplement of men, whilst the Eitilisb slip is manned i
irrostfy,by apprentices; the English ships require less ballast ;
the economy of shipping is better understood and practised;
.ibereis gr enter activity of the Captain and crew ; they are
insured in clubs, niurd, the rate of insurance in Clulis is, on the
aim age, Five per cent., while the Prussian ships cannot get
the same insurance done for twele;.what I Wail by Clubs is,
that thei ireserre tosearrother ; and its to the outfits the provi-
sions and 01 her necessaries for the ship, both have their choice
where they a ill lay in their stuck, whether in a Prussian nt an
Engl:•lt Port; if provisions are cheaper in the Prussian Port,
the English Captain lass its Iris stock of provisions there., and
to make the advantage sure to the English :ship, the duty in
tire Prussian ship is' at the rate of fifteen per cent. oli the
Blight; it is Bs. ad:. per load•higlier in a Prussian ship than
in an English ship; •the charges of all kinds, even the ballast,
is charged higher to a Prussian ship than to an English ship.
Your answer i 5 Confined to a comparison between the cases
of Prussia and skips at Etiglisli built; can you offer any opi-
nion with in/slit-cut() a comparison between Biitish ships arid i
the vessels ut other Northern Powers?
I cannot speak from experience, but I am of opinion that
British Alias -geocraliy can sail cheaper than those of any
other Natian, except.ttiat the ship untterials of British ships
are taxed so much higher; for the duty on the materials
for Ship-building is about one hundred per cent. of the
cost; that is a ground why the Ships of salter Nations way sir
:SOllle.CaSeS comrete with the English.
Do you conceive that any reurision of Duties upon the Im-
port of Timber Irons tire Northern Ports, would have the
effect of at all materially diminishing the cost of British-
built arid freight ?
Very considerably.
Can you state what portion of the Timber used in-building
British veasels is composed of Timber from the Nortlatru
Poi ts ?
I eanuta state the exact proportion, but that it used to be
very cunsider:Able in what are called North Country-built
Ships, namely, Sunderland, Newcastle, Whitley, aunt so inn.
1)o-you conceive that it is less now tiOin it was formerly,
in consequence of tire increase of Duties which has taken
place of late-years?
I conceive ahat the use of Prussian Timber for Ship-build-
ing has aeei:easeti, and that if the Duty was lowered, the con-
sumption would increase considerably: I have heard it even
asserted, that if there se, rtr no Duties upon the Ship mate-
rials imported from abroad, English Ship-truilelyrsgotild build
Ships :even fur Exportation, evert to sell them to whet Coun-
tries; that they won'd sinew the same superiority of skill in
that branch of ruanufacture -that our matinfacturers do in
every fiber.
Can you state in what Manner the Bilis, drawn for pay.
.meats for Timber unspotted into' this Country from the
Non t 'sera Ports are prineipally liquidated?
They are principally pureliased by tire frrreign Importers
of English Colonial produce and Nlairufaetures, to pay for
such Colonial produce and ManufaCtures.
Can you state, from any experience of your own, whether,
besides the amount of British manufactures which is iMport-
ed Oirectly into the Northern Ports, any considerable portion
finds its way into the sonsosoption of the Northern States- by
means of the German Fairs?
I know that the amount is very considerable, particularly
of manufactured
,goods, which are carried by the way of Ham-
burgh to Leipsie, and from the Leipsie Fair, where they are
putelsaseel by Itussian and Polish Merchants; they sire taken
Ito the confines of Hungary, even to the Southern yrovinces
of Russia • hot,one'of the principal places tv which 'they.are
taken-61;1.04, a place which is the Pivot from whence ma-
nufactures formerly were smaggled Unto Russia, Austria.
arid4he surrounding conat ries ; but since the 18th of
'May 1818, the importation 'of all kinds of British Manufac•
tures is permitted into Pruzsia at a low duty, .particularly upon
the filter kinds of manufactures, and such manufactures are
brought direct to Berlin; when I knyw Berlin first, no kinds
of Euglisb Mannfacture were permitted to he imported, and
we could hardly find any thing, of English Manufacture in the
shops; but at the present there are shops where we may have
almost any thing of English Manufacture, whether of Bir-
mingham, Sheffield, or Manchester, but the exact amount in
value I cannot state; I mu convinced that it is very con--
siderable.
Are you of opinion that a considerable increase in the con-
.sutoption of British Manufactures in the Northern Countries
would take place, were circumstances to lead to an increased
importation of Timber fioni the Northern 13(0.S ?
I am convinced that t hat part of the Continent owes a con-
siderable sum of money at this present moment to England
for manufactured goods arid Colonial produce already re-
ceived; and ttrat it is difficult to and returns to this Country
to pay for it.
You mean then that in tine first instance an increased inns
privations of -*limber from the Northern Ports would facilitate
the payment of debts dire to this Country ?
: . Yes ; and the next consequence Would be an increase of our
exportation to the Coatinent.
Can you state, from your experience of Prussian commerce,
,whether any quantity of Prussian manufactures is exparted to
the Asiatic Countries through the Russian Dominions ?
-have always heard that there had been a considerable
quarrtity exported, but that there had been periods when,
from political and other causes, the export has not been coil-
sideratp.
Of what description were those Commodities chiefly
The description I hare referred to were of the coarse
Woollen Manufattitre.
Can you state whether, at this moment, such goods arc
subject to any dray in their passage through the Russian Uo
?
iiILOW, it has been the subject of negneiation between the
two Governments, the Russian and the Pritssian, but I Cannot
speak certainly to the isreseirt state of the trade; I believe
the Russian Government has facilitated it.
Dir yott know the difference inn the transit duty through
Russia between Prussian arid British Cloths ?
I our not acquainted with that. . •
You have mentioned that the ship-building, and particu-
larly the buildin,' of the Northern ports, would be affected
by an increased import. of-Timber front the Baltic ; -what
proportion of those ships do yra.conceive are constructed of
Fir or,any other Timber imported from the North of Europe
1 conceive that foreign ship Timber has beets used in al-
most every ship built in the Northern Ports; the proportion
I cannot speak to exactly.
What parts of such ships are usually constructed of fo-
rrien Timber ?
The Oak plank used in the ship, and the Fir plank used
for her decks..
Of what species is the Timber chiefly imported from
Prussia ?
Principally Oak Plank, Fir Timber, Fir Deals, and' Oak
Staves, are imported in considerable quantity.
Explain what you mean by Oak Staves ?
There are variaus descriptions
,t 4 Oak Staves what are
'called'Prpe Staves, Brandy States, and Hogshead Sthes 1

oive o 40-,Lt its'els of. the States i 5 fur the porter cash; for
the porter which is shipped ft out this country to Prosiia.
What arc the uses of the 'Alter species of Staves ?
_thic,:considerible,use islu'r water casks, fur beer WWI%
f6r every description of casks. according to the' quality an
size, the 414/Mr/utilities for dour casks.
You.have said that Since the duties were raised uppn
tic Timber the-censutoptiou in ship-buildin, in the .""11!.
was muchsuialler than forpierly; can yuu State what tot",
terial has bten Substituted fur the Hattie Tiniber, so ferner'
iy used..?
'conceive that ship-built:lit* generally loki decreased, btlt.
wiiere.a substititelns,been used it has been American.
Have you 4tlywri Anieritan deals niedlor the decks of an?
Tess el shuiit in the, Norttr

1 hare not had expel ienecof that.
Do yoO me/tn-British American S

Yes, British „American.
Do_ydu attribute the diminution of British ship-huildint
tartly to the high ditties ?
Nut solely to that, but it must naturally interfere with lb.
English Ship Owners' capahility of cumpetitieu in the carry'
ing Trade.
'Has nut Abe. price of Baffle Timber fallen considerabl
sinc'e the prate ?
Yet it has, and so has the prite of shipping.
Has nut Alit numbri• Of vessels employeA in the trangport
service dining the war, but since itischarged, occasioned
grcatAttantitrof shipping over and above the actual
demand ?-
;lt.certainly bas ; but we bare had wale years of Peacel
giving time for the diminution of that ttuuther, fur !her!
mast in thOti rears of Peace have been a number of sllie
decayed and last.
-Du you Ilium, whether Oak stares ate inipurted from Nardi
America

Yes, ilia), are.
Do you consider theca equal in quality to those that WO
from the North of Europe!

They.are Floiestcemeti so.
Are they applicable to the same purposes ?
They have been applied so.
In what resvcct do you consider them inferior to those than
come froth the Baltic ? •
I wouldrat btu-, with your Lordships' permission, refer tho
rotation to be answered by some Merchant in the' trade.
Are they nut lower in Market price ?
They can be afforded lower because tlf the'high duty open
the Pi ussian Staves. . . ;
What are the other foreign _countries from whence Stave:
arc imported, exclusive sit Sweden, Norway, 'twists, a°
Prussia ?
The only di het' place that licraiw of, is Ha-minuet. 1
Staves that are manufactured Silesia, mid some rafts.'
PruSsia, are ;alien hy.the inland navigation to ll.iluburgl"
and trum.l-!arnhurgh_t hey are shipped to this country.
Can you state what proportion the duty hears to the vas".
of any of .the descriptions of ?
The present price of Fie Timber ui Memel is about is'•
a. 0
load, and the duty upon that Timber is 3is.-tis-; sothat7.-
very nearly three times the value of the TimLer.
What is the cost of freight and insurance hum Memel 04-
per toed ?
The freight varies, bnt about 'VS. per load is. 6r hat r
• the average. 'l'he rate 4if iosnralicc at present 1 tintlerstat,
is 15s. per cent. per 1001.; that is, per c(nt.
(.;an you •state:the.yate.of insurance p. r load ?
•It would,be about 2d. to 21d. per load. " rid
The duty on deals, except' wiii,re (hey are of one inch a t
a half in thickness, licing the sante whetherinplaolis of
feet lon or 20' feet longoittat objection would •tuctc be '°
graduated duty in proportion to the length?

None in the. World." -
Where do the ll,als ol'infedot length% chit* come froip

I- atet,n6t.aware that,they.coine exclusively from aiey parl'r
Do the British Ships which sail to the Baltic for Tioilt:l
usually bring out with theaw-kt cargo of I'ledllGX or Nlatiut,t,
tures ?
. :111.ey.do- the ,majority go out in ballast; beca76l.
one Ship loaded with Colonial produce and nianufactur
goods will pay for seventy- loaded. with Timber; of coLi!tri
that ineest depend upon the size of Sh.ipgoing out wt d
the ManufaCtures; but there has been ate instauce •of uci
Ship talting out a cargo of that yalite.
•Is not the nutithei Of British Ships going out with' Ca re°
ip.conceivahly.jrmalllWyroportion to the wt le unlit/err
The Ships that bring Timber from the Baltic to Liverr..,
all.go:hack laden principally with salt. I never Locw .
stance of it Ship going in ballast from Liverpool. a, a ,-
. They always curry entgoes of salt Front LiterpoOl
(To'lle continued.)

MELANCHOLY DEATII.--Saturday an Ingg,k.,,;,t
was hes Id at the London Hospitsl, before NVl.:,,t)ra'o.
WIN, Esq., Coroner? on • the body: of ,
Kennedy; aged 45. appeared 'that the t1.e1,5
ceased lodged in a room on die two pair of staiji 0
floor of a house in Redgate-cOhrt, Minories.
Was stikikta Q tw-prary fits of dersngeinerat;4
.cf.ne of which, while sitting at dinner with 03
,wife ou Frid.ay.last, he suddenly iumpel 11111.4r6
to the -window, and thrust'himself out. Ing'"'
rem- instantly to. prevent his falling,. and catigi.n
some r
him by the. skirt of his coat and held biro
St'
soe time, but no person coming to her a-s 1(1
ance, and he being a Corpulent man, her ti°of
gave limy, and he fell into the street, a 11;:ightoa
'thirty feet. He was taken up with his head 10
limbs dreadfully mangled, and carried to ,t
hospital, Where he expired.in a few minutes. ~,e
• diet..
.-“ That 'the deceased's death was cauo,
by his own act, in throwing himself out `ate
of
pair stairs window, being at the time in a
:mental derangement."
wit:ft
MiLANCII CIL ACClDENT.—.Saturdav
as Mr. John Heron, a respectable inhabittitiliiis
Harrow, was riding down liownshire-hill' ,ni.
horse, which was a high spietnd young ii"' 91:a.1
took fright at some' hing,.and gallapped_ off at
'speed.
Mr. Heron not being sufficiently °11.04,
guard , was thrown off, and one of his feet sti
ing in the stirrup, he was dragged along the ri°,7o;
considerable distance, whilst the horse kePt
ing him.. When taken up, he was speechleSs an
sensible, He was carried into the Masons' Ad De
where he expired before Surgical aid Coil
procured.

-• ninnis, •
At,
On Friday last, at Chatham, Mra.Dickens, of a 'ntictr
On the 10th inst. Mrs. Geo. Robertson, 23, Albany
'Edinburgh, of a son.

• . 'O
MARRIED. r cell° 10f
On the-11th inst. at Paris, at the hotel of his .-I„htia
the British Ambassador, by the Rev...E. Forster, 10,133b4,01.
the•Enibassy, Janies Green., his MajestY oar,
General for the Morra, to Frances Dorothea, secono Peev
to of John Larkin,, F 4 of Clare-house, h u •ti Kent, a°
„, se, ciet
to the lA., Sir Charles Style, Bart. rep 0
On Thursday last, at St, George's, Hanover-AO ;py
fain James Ttnaiiison,. R.N. to Fratiees Ehza, s°
Op
Major Geoige Beat,e, It.iL4. • to.
• On Satuiday,• the ifith inst. B Hepworth; r-.54° ret-
eldest daughter 9f julip Risuon, Esq. of Berners-tr
;At/
DIED. . Mist '
.On Saturday, the Bth inst.; at the Moat, Kent; dbtl
only daughter of the late Thomas Selby, Esq• 70 04
A few days sitter, at Toreross, Devonshire, agesiotSi-
Henry Souiluite, Esq.,-forwes ly of Bueltlaiid-toUt-' • tor
of Stohe-Fleiping, in the County of Devon- •„, Rosir‘lT''
. On the 12th inst., at- -Benton, Hants, A. V. a irs
.}:49•, aged 77, •
00 "
On the 14th inst., in Montague-street, 0-01 f
the 29th year of her age, Louisa, the wi.-
.:ourtenay, Esq., Barrister at Law. ' /.10110c.
Op Satin-day last, Nary, the wife of. BenraMin
• Westmorland-plate, eitr-road. tl3"'A
At his house,' litpornhill, neas.l,a. ssieade, Sco , of
7th inst. William Swanston, Esq. late of .St. BittSciaatitel
At Edinburgh, on tip; tit h inst. Ail .eldest
James MoncreilT Esq. 4,roertte. - • •
•• _9, << •,
LONDON: Printed hyJ. B. CARST MRS,
hli of ht' !;I'7
Ormond-street, Queen-square; and. 40°'
SCRIPPS, „of Na. 7, South l‘lalton-street, .
Office, No. 112, Strand ; .4\0000111e"
Letters, &c, (post-paitl) must be addreord,

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