The Sun.
London, England, 1845-02-05 00:00:00

anything humiliating or disgraceful to either country,
he would say look to their whole policy, and say if any
concession had been asked upon the one hand or offered
on the other, which would not have been asked and con-
ceded if the circumstances had been reversed. He wished
the Noble Lord would, on some opportunity, take the
sense of the House on the question, whether the course
which had been adopted was not the most consistent
with sound policy, and dictated by wisdom. As lie had
said before, the Government had indulged in no boast at
the close of last session. They had taken credit only
for having acted with justice and moderation.—(Hear.)
They had applied the terms to the conduct of both coun-
tries, and in that there was no arrogance. The House
would judge whether the statements made with respect
to the state of the country—the improvement of trade—
the continuance of tranquillity—and the absence cif poli-
tical anxiety in Great Britain at least, were net justified
by facts which were an indication of that prosperity
upon which her Majesty congratulated Parliament. He
should shortly have measures of great importance, when
it would be for the House to decide whether the honour
and interest of the country had been neglected and its
condition deteriorated—or, that her Majesty's present
Government were worthy of that confidence from the
House, without which no Ministry could subsist.
Lord J. RUSSELL wished to explain what he had
said upon a subject of so much importance to this
country and to France as the case of Mr. Pritchard. He
hid given no opinion as to whether the reparation given
was sufficient or not. Her Majesty's Government wero
satisfied, and he was, therefore, satisfied that the repara-
tion was sufficient. What he had said was, that when two
Governments were on amicable terms and the best un-
derstanding, the question ought to have been settled
without delay, and the chance of a rupture between the
two countries have been prevented.
Sir C. NAPIER, who was for some time inaudible
from the noise in the House, expressed his thanks to the
Noble Lord for having brought the case of Mr. Prit-
chard before the House. M. Guizot himself had ad-
mitted that the case of Mr. Pritchard was the case of
humanity and justice. The Noble Lord at the head of
• Foreign Affairs had demanded a great deal, but nothing
had been yielded to his demands. If a British officer had
behaved to a French subject, under the same circum-
stances, in the manner in a which a French officer had, in
this case, behaved to a British subject, he had no hesi-
tation in saying that, upon a court-martial, be would
have lost his commission. He would ask the Right Hon.
Baronet why it was that all this had taken place ?
Where was the British Admiral ? Why was he not at
Otaheite to prevent all these eccentricities ? Why was
there only a small ketch to represent this nation, when
the French had a large force ?—(Hear.) The only
excuse for the very slight reparation which had been
made was, that the present Government had reduced the
navy to so low a state that we dare net show a bold face
to the French Government, and tell them that we would
not allow such things to proceed. Why, at tt.e very
moment when this was going on, there was only one
three-decker at Plymouth, and only an 80 gun ship at
Portsmouth, ready for service ; while the French had
steam-boats which would have enabled them to bring
over ten thousand men on the very next day after the
English Ambassador should have left Paris, to destroy
the dockyard of Portsmouth or Plymouth. He was ex-
ceedingly glad to find that the eyes of the Government
were at last opening in reference to this matter. It was
his belief that when they had a large navy, there would
be no more insults, no more eccentricities, and no more
aggressions ; and he did hope, therefore, that means
would be adopted to render it thoroughly efficient.
Mr. PLUMTRE said he should not have troubled the
House with a single word, but for the announcement
made with respect to the late President of the Board of
Trade. With regard to the announcement made by the
Right Hon. Baronet, he must say that to him that ex-
planation was almost unintelligible, and quite unsatisfac-
tory.—(Hear, hear.) With regard to the announcement
that it was his fixed determination, without any condi-
tion, to make further concessions to the Roman Catholics,
though he was quite ready to allow that the Right Hon.
Gentleman intimated, at the close of the last session,
that he intended to make further grants, he was very
much deceived, if the announcement made by the Right
Hon. Gentleman that evening would not create a very
considerable sensation.—(Hear, from the Opposition.)
He was quite satisfied that such a sensation would be
excited ; and certainly, continuing to feel as he had ever
done upon this subject, he should not consider it his
duty to attempt to repress such a sensation. He deeply
regretted that the Right Hon. Gentleman felt himself
justified in making the announcement which he had
made to the House and to the country that night. He
felt very sorry that he had not—if he might so speak—
learnt that the course of concession taken by him before
was an ineffectual course.—(lronical cries of " Hear,
hear.") It was too plain that concessions had only led
to further concessions. Concession had ever been the
fruitful parent of demand. That it would be so in
this present case, he was perfectly satisfied, while any-
thing remained to be demanded.—(flear, and cheers
from the Opposition.) The course proposed by the
Right Hon. Gentleman was one not only highly unsatis-
factory to himself, but he felt persuaded that it would
also be extremely unsatisfactory to a very large proportion
of the community of this country.
Mr. WYSE said that when the Right Hon. Baronet,
at the close of last session, intimated his intention with
reference to the subject of Roman Catholic education,
neither he (Mr. Wyse), nor those who acted with him,
considered that he was promising a concession to the
Catholic population of Ireland. He stated that the posi-
tion of things in that country, with reference to eccle-
siastical affairs, and academical education, imperatively
demanded an improvement and extension of the means
of instruction. Maynooth had been very carefully dis-
tinguished by the Right Hon. Baronet, from other in-
etitutions. That was an ecclesiastical establishment in-
tended for the education of the Catholic priesthood in
Ireland, and as effectual for that purpose as any institu-
tion in any country in Europe. The Right Hon. Baronet
had stated in emphatic language that the religion and
political principles of the institution in Maynooth had
been already to a certain extent recognised. The ob-
servation that if ever so small a sum were granted, it
was as effectual an admission of the necessity of such
an institution as if the largest grants had been offered
by this country. That was an obvious and common
sense view of the question. It was not a financial ques-
tion, but a question of high moral policy, and as such
it should be treated. He believed that ecclesiastical
education in Ireland could only be managed beneficially
by leaving it in the hands of the Catholics themselves,
in purely ecclesiastical establishments, otherwise they
would neutralise and negative the benefits which
they professed themselves anxious to confer.—
(Hear, hear.) It would be premature in him
to offsr any lengthened remarks at that stage of the
matter. But he hoped that means would be taken for
giving any institution which might be established the
highest moral character, and that its professors would
save not only a religious, but an intellectual eminence
and dignity in the country, which would ensure for the I
institution general respect. With reference to the ex-
tension of academical instruction in a secular sense, that
was a subject that would demand the closest attention.
He could not infer from the word " academical" whether
it wero the intention of the Right Hen. Baronet to em-
brace by his measures schools immediately coming in
point of order between the elementary schools and the
university, or whether lie meant to confine himself to
university education alone; but thus much he must say
in limine, that if a mixed system should be found neces-
sary, it would be extremely desirable not only to pre-
vent the religious opinions of Oatholics from being tam-
pered with, but also to avoid wounding the sensibilities
of other portions of the community. He believed
that the success of the measure would in a
great .degree depend on the observance of these
particulars. One question of very great importance in
connection with thisisubject was that of re-forming and
• opening the University of Dublin.—(Hear, hear.) Re-
serving those unquestionable rights which the Protestant
clergy had to an efficient education of their own church,
he did not see why the people of Ireland generally
should not have the benefit of an institution so largely
endowed.—(Hear, hear.) He would reserve all further
remarks on the subject until the propositions of the
Right Hon. Baronet had been laid before the House.
3fr. BELLEW said he cordially rejoiced that since
they last met one great source of the amelioration of Ire-
land had arisen in the projected railways in differeut
parts of that country. He rejoiced at this, not so much
because capital would thus be dispersed, as because
habits of industry and peace would be generated and en-
couraged. The benefit would be not in the mere expendi-
tureof the moment,but in the permanently improved habits
which might be confidently anticipated. In connection
with this point, he had the strongest hope that the re-
port of the Landlord and Tenant Commi sion would
prove very beneficial to Ireland. He had always be-
lieved that in appointing that commission her Majesty's
Government had been actuated not by a desire to
divert public attention, but to secure practical results.
The question involved was one, in comparison with
which all others seemed unimportant ; and this very
attempt to improve the existing state of things deserved
the gratitude of the country. With regard to the
Charitable Bequests Bill, he had resided in Ireland for
the last five months, and had never witnessed anything
late universal opposition to the measure. Great un-
fairness and misrepresentation were resorted to by its
oPnehents while numbers who took part in this
agitation, he did not hesitate to say, opposed the mea-
sure,
s btcano_t_se..mtich on account of its substantial demerits,
acceptabere twnahwere unwilling ling to consider any measure
There had been an immense from the present Government.
.11 deal of misrepresentation
in Ireland res
round of all theg this Bill.It had gone the
larleland, that the clergy
wotildno longer have control ovine eir congregations, and
that the ancient acts plreeestsinytirrupe:rßoman Catholics,
which were repealed
be again re-
enacted this. No doubt there were me eee to.
itinjurious and
unnecessary provisions in the Bill, but it
thought, quite so bad as some people had
repwreaess nnotedt,
in
Ireland. He trusted, therefore, her Majesty's Govern-
ment, in bringing measures forward to improve the post'
- tion of the Roman Catholic clergy, would bear in mind
the danger to which they bad exposed themselves in
supporting the principle of this Bill. Another objection
the people of Ireland had to the Bill was, that although
the Commission consisted of good men, still the Right
Hon. Baronet had the power at any moment to dismiss
them. Now, no man in that House believed that such
would be the case, but what bad occurred during the
trial of Mr. O'Connell, would fully justify the doubts
and apprehensions of the Irish people. When they re-
collected the early promotion of Mr. Sergeant
Jackson, Mr. Sergeant Lefroy, and Mr. O'Brien,
when they recollected the Arms' Bill and the
spy• system among the police—when they recol-
lected the dismissal of the repeal magistracy—when
ted all these things, they could not be sur-
tkeydregaltlec there was great
a want of confidence in the
legislation of the Right Hon. Baronet.—(Hear, hear.)
But still it might be said, that a great change was about
to take place with regard to Ireland,
_ and he most sin-
cerely bored that sue h would be the case. He believed
that the light lion. Baronet for the last two years bad