Star.
London, England, 1830-05-12 00:00:00

LORD LIZOTINANT 01 IRELAND.

Mr. HUME said that one of the great evils of Ireland was that
the immense sums expended in Ireland had been applied not to the
promotion of trade or industry, but to foment and encourage party
spirit, welsh was the tame of that country. It was well known that
Ireland could be made a source of strength to the empire, if proper
encouragement and activity were given to her internal resources I
and he was sure that, with proper economy, a sufficient sum could
be deducted from the Irish expenditure to enable the people of that
country to obtain full employment ; for his part he had always
thought that the office of Lora Lieutenant was a source of great
mischief in Ireland. whilst the expense of the office and its accompa-
niments was a burden to the country at large. The continuance of
that office was, he thought, inconsistent with the principles of the
Union, by which the countries were combined into one; but instead
of Ireland being made an integral part of the kingdom, she was
treated and governed as a colony, with a colonial government, which
invariably created abuses ; experience chewed that delegated power
was invariably abused. What he wished to see was a perfect assi-
milation of all English and Irish institutions; but the reverse of
this bad been the practice both before and after the passing of the
Union. (Hear.) He was sure that there had been tarts made
to assimilate the laws of both countries, but not to any great ex-
tant, all the evils ofixdonial governments had been felt by Ireland,
with this separating Menace, that one party there was supported
to oppress the other. In mole this, he would mention that, out of
11,110 Aloes held in Ireland, there were little more than SOO held by
Catholics, who formed the bulk of the people. The lint best step
to blend the two countries was the withdrawal of the Lord
Lieutenant, and the sooner It was done the better. He could
not see why Ireland should not be governed as Scotland was. It
was, be thought, a degradation to bighorns to be thus treated as •
colony. The practices and of what be would call the
colonial government of would never be issued from
a British Cabinet, nor would they be sanctiseed by Parlia.
mint. He did not charge the lasi Liseemeret of Ireland; their
conduct was the inevitable result tit the system which they were
called upon to uphold. All tbs pmts min Ireland had been
for a long time eupported on the they were net/nary,
but now that they were almost si amdemmeed with Seglish offices,
their inutility was proved. The espimlllem of a *laid governor
might be a bmat to a few little pent INN but it was an injury
to the ceimatinity at large; and the :of the Lord Liente.
mat bad the der of deterring E and Walloon
hem relates In Dublin. The of that cranny would be
bemelsed=ve einseal of the le while he alluded. His
was the erases at Wills; forward the sub-
)sot le thente the beet IMO diet VW* 1111 miens to pursue.
He that mewed am humble Address be pessinled to his Ma.
leatY• MAW diat his ilejesty would be pleased I. onside: wise-
tba dos dies et Leek Lisatiesat could not be abashed with ad-
vantage to Ireland mad die Riegiin
Lord F. L. GOWER,. is the
st
the Nodes, said, it the hat.number was acquainted with peppiest that coma-
try (bawd), lie id set hie diet *peel to them which
he sow made. He (Lied F. L. Gower) was enable to diosever
the *hay which the hes. member bad angel to exist shot
rocoul2 lade ha
whisk ter.
-the LeiisL siamert. Be could Nis* ha et seardesose,
at beet tinting_ the Vico-royalty of the het tend pesenstors Lira-
tarot. WIS Para to what the hes. umber bed
in the sivegesubm et the aseseiseles of the Meade et In=
(Lord
eta hi Freesievainzemigined (hat est se a mesh' roses kw the re-
sidencehied.es, ds that
a sieecturs he bier wilemisy to the able and meiiiio
ordain ot the Amer whib be Moir was in race. They hod plisszt;
to de, is caniiisring the bed nude droned% the ware elf that
~try, in attending to Add :estreerweime, sad fa cerressal-

eating with the English government. The hon. member had not
ustif lios
made out a sufficient case to j the house in abolishing the ice
of lord lieutentant. It would be I lad to say that Ireland would
derive advantage from the withdraw of the court of a %%nifty,
when that country was represented as suffering from the union ot
the two countries. He did not agtec with the hon. member that tb
higher classes would be more likely to flock into Dublin, and take
up their residence there, If the court of the lord lieutenant were
withdrawn. He was certain that such an assertion would not gam
concurrence among the more respectable classes in Ireland, for there
was no ground for saying that respectable families kept aloof from
Dublin through jealousy of the circle which surrounded the lord
lieutenant. The noble lord concluded by opposing the motion.
Mr. S. RICE contended that the principle on which the local
government of Ireland:acted, was to create an inner circle, who
governed in every respect, tet was free from responsibility. There
was a continual change of secretaries of opposite political prin.
ciples, which rendered it impossible to establish any permanent
system of government; for as soon as a secretary beesnic ac-
quainted with the laws and customs of the country, and began to
take an interest in it, he was removed. The boo. gentleman
hers enumerated the several sec ttaries who bad succeeded each
other for seven years. The general impression In Ireland was that
the nation' coterie which surrounded the castle, and who from ex.
perience were acquainted with every thing in that country, ruled
Ireland, not the Lord Lieutenant, or his secretary ; and for this con.
elusion there were ample grounds. He had no desire to divest
monarchy of its splendour,but be did not agree with the noble
load that the morals or lie politics of the people of Irelmd
were much improved by the establishment of the viceregal court
in Dublin. He did not think that Dublin would suffer much
from the removal of that court. Did the city of Edinburgh re.
quire a court to promote its prosperity ? (Hear, hear, hear.)
Dublin was now becoming a commercial city ; and much as he vs.
bled (gage the Fourth, he would prefer one steam-boat to a ship.
load of Lords Lieutenant. The lion. member here took a view of
the relation which existed between the Courts of Law and the Lord
Lieutenant. He for one deprecated the intercourse which existed
between them. He did not mean to object to the exercise of the
prerogative of mercy by the Lord Lieutenant ; his objection to the
relation between the Judges and the Irish Court was founded on
other grounds. The hon. member concluded by supporting the
motion, as, in his opinion, the better mode of promoting the eel.
fare of Ireland.

Mr. G. MOORE denied that there was an advancement in thc
commercial prosperity of Dublin, as stated by the hon. member (Mr.
Hume.) He was of opinion that the prosperity of Dublin had beer
on the decline since the period of the Union ; and if so, how much
more should it decline by the removal of the vice-regal establishment.
Sir H. PARNELL considered the existence of the office of Lord
Lieutenant in Dublin one cause of the decline of commerce in that
city. The hon. baronet then proceeded to compare the aimim;
law of Ireland with that of Scotland, with a view to show how in
Scotland these laws worked well without a viceroy, and that, if put
on the same footing in Ireland, would have the same effect. Ilk
thought that the abolition of this office would be popular in Ireland,
and being satisfied that it would redound to the benefit of that
country, he would support the motion.
Lord OXMANTOWN was opposed to the motion. He never
heard any person in Ireland speaking of the subject who did not ex.
press his hostility against the abolition of that office. In opposing
the motion of the hon. member for Abetdeen, he begged to say the
he was not opposed to retrenchment in the expenditure of that office,
and in =sequence of the healing measure of last year he thought
that a retrenchment should be made in the military expenditure of
that country. (Hear.)
Lord ALTHORP was satisfied that it would be a most desirable
object for the government of England and for Ireland to abolish
that office. There was no more reason for having a separate Go.
vernment in Ireland, than in one of the northern English counties,
for the communication was nearly as easy. He did not see that the
abolition of that office would increase absenteeism. He thought
that the aristocracy and gentry of Ireland would form a circle in
Dublin, as those of Scotland did in Edinburgh. He would lease
the pecuniary consideration out of the question ; if he thought that
the removal of that court would prejudice that country, no regard
for economy would induce him to vote for the abolition of that
office.

Sir G. MURRAY agreed with the noble secretary for Ireland, that
the member for Montrose had not made out a sufficient case for the
removal of the office of Lord Lieutenant. He denied that there was
any coterie connected with the office, which ruled the affairs of In.
land. There might be cues in which the Viceroy differed from the
English Government. But this Government must be weak, if it did
not remove the Lord Lieutenant immediately ; for the subordinates
should agree, or submit to the directions of the superior, or there
could be no confidence or good order. The right lion. baronet thea
alluded to the observations of the hoa. member for Montrose, respect.
big the colonies, observing that there was very little foundation for
most of the assertions of the hon. member respecting these colonies.
The right hon. member concluded by expressing his hostility to the
motion.

Mr. O'CONNELL was sure that it had never been understood
in Ireland that this motion would be seriously persevered in. If it
had been so understood, there would be petitions front every part of
the country against it. It was bad policy in legislation to oppose
the feelings of the people. The government of Ireland would have
influence over factions which lords lieutenant of counties could not
have; misery in Dublin was extreme. It would astonish inemben
of this house if they were made acquainted with the real state of the
people of that country.
Mr. BROWNLOW heard no sufficient answer to the argumenu
of the hon. member for Montrose' to persuade him that his office
should be upheld. The people of Ireland had experienced too much
of lord lieutenants to be pre- possessed in favour of that court. lie
thought that the house was bound to press the immediate abolitior
of that office.

Lord CASTLEREAGH opposed the motion.
Mr. JEPHSON was favourable to the motion before the house.

Sir J. YORK) was anxious that Ireland should be governed as
an integral portion of the empire, and therefore he was for having
the office of lord lieutenant abolished.

The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER contended, it
reply to his honourable friend, the member for Limerick, that tht
funalons of the Lord Lieutenant were not performed by subordinate
individuals; but, even if they were, bow, be would ask, would the
thing be improved by changing the system in the way proposed
The House ought to consider the feelings of the people. of Ireland
on this subj,ct, and then they might judge if the House, from all
that had been said by the Irish members, both for and against the
isotion, were decidedly hostile to the removal of the Lord Lieu.
tenant.

Mr. HUME replied.
The House then divided, when the number were
For the motion
Against it 229
Majority against the modem--
Sir J. GRAHAM postponed his motion for an account of toe
salaries, fees, &c. held and enjoyed by each of the members of his
majesty'a privy council being laid before the house.
Mr. ROBINSON brought forward his motion for a committee to
inquire into the state of the island of Newfoundland. The trade of
this island was of great importance. In the year 1827, 851 vessels
entered into its ports. The fish caught there was sent to England,
to Naples, to Tuscany, to Spain, to Portugal, and to the West
Indies, so that all these countries were interested in the welfare
of this Island. lie contended that the fisheries ought to be sup.
ported and encouraged. The hon. gentleman concluded by moving
that a Select Committee be appointed to inquire into the state of
the Island of Newfoundland.
Sir G. MURRAY said it would be for him to ask whether the
hon. member had made out a case to call upon the house to ap-
point this Committee. He submitted be bad not.
After some discussion, in which Messrs. Bernal, Labouchere.
Ponsonby, Hume, Sir 0. Murray, and Robinson, took part, the
house divided. The numbers were.—
For the Motion
Against it. B2
Majority against the motion...
Mr. BROUGHAM asked the right hon. gentleman whether the
bill brought into the other house by the Lord Chancellor for the re-
'deka of the Court of Chancery, bad been for a second time
The CHA NCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER had not ever:Cat
of the report.
Lord TULLAMORE moved that a committee be appointed to
inqttheinto a grant of 18,0001. for extending the Royal Canal in
Ireland to Wily
Mr. A. DAWIION and Lord F. GOWER opposed the motion,
which was ultimately negatived without a division.
The other Orders of the Day were then disposed of, and the
House adjourned at Three o'Clock.

Mr. SY KES has postponed, till June 2, his motion for
a Select Committee oa the Soap and Candle Duties, and
the frauds sad difficulties attending the collection-of the
same ; and, as to the practicability of levying the various
duties on timber and den' imported from the Baltic by an
equitable standard.
The Earl of Belfast had a grand dinner party on Sun-
day, at his house in Arlington-street; among whom were
PAWS and Princess Esterhuy, the French and Portu-
gueu Ambassadors, the Duke of Wellington, Due de
Caul, the Marquis sail Marchioness of Salisbury, the
Earl and Countess of Glengall, Earl Dudley, Lord and
lady Waloughby, Mr. and Mrs. Arbuthnot; and in the
esaalne, her ladyship ealertained a numerous and elo-
ped lesensbbio of the "!taut ton."

.ff,
t

NOTICE TO CORRESPONDENTS.
The notice of Master Bol=a's performance shall appear to-
morrow.

THE KING.

We lament exceedingly that the Bulletin presented
to our readers this day, should have disappointed our
hopes as to any improvement in His MAJESTY'S health.
" WINDSOR CASTLE, MAT 12, 1830.
" The KING has passed a disturbed night. His MA-
nsrfs symptoms continue the same.

(Signed)

K HENRY HALFORD.

" MATTHEW J. TIERNEY."

The lamented illness of his MAJESTY continues to ex-
cite great interest at Paris ; and, as usual, various com-
ments are made with regard to the probabilities of the
future. Among others, the Debate of Saturday quotes
an article from the Gazette de France, in which it
IS gravely stated, that the hesitation manifested by
Prince LEOPOLD, in going to Greece, arises from the
probability of his being called on to form part of a
Regency ! This subject is so freely canvassed in several
Paris journals, that the writers must have heard some
Idle reports on the subject from this side the channel.
Although we tan easily imagine that those who
compose the Court of England, are not more exempt from
the intrigues usual at certain periods than their neigh-
bours, still we trust the time is far distant when a re-
ioney shall be rendered necessary. With respect to
Prince LEOPOLD, should any insurmountable obstacle be
o:Tosed to his final assumption of the proffered sove-
reignty, it is most desirable for the interests of Greece,
and the peace of Europe, that the Greek question should
I,ir settled without delay—as, in the present uncertain
.tate of things, there is no saying how soon that country
may become a bone of fearful contention among riv'l
pretenders.

Mr. HUM E'S motion last night in the House of Com-
mons, with a view to the abolition of the Vice-royalty of
Ireland, was negatived by a majority of only 229 to
15.—The strength of this minority, and the ground
taken by its opponents, who objected not to the principle,
Lit merely to the time, plainly indicate the accomplish-
ment of Mr. HUT ME's object as not very remote. That
the Vice-royalty is the only feather remaining in the
'Pleadid plume worn by Dublin, when the capital of an
Independent kingdom, and that it should be now stripped
fur ever of that feather, may afford cause of complaint to
the inhabitants of that city ; but this being admitted,
The next question arising is this :—Should not the in-
terests of Dublin give way to the interests of the
..untry at large?--We do not mean to argue from the
abuse of the office to Its disuse : to contend that office
has been frequently made a draw-farm on which some
lean and sickly nobleman may fatten and repose ; and
that it has a tendency to maintain party spirit and excite
tLose feelings of rancour and hostility, the existence of
%Welt all the friends of the country must deplore. No!
We object to the office as part of that colonial system which
aas virtually abolished I.y the Union, and has ever since
"nbsieted in direct violation of that measure. A sepa-
rate legislature—a local Parliament, required a local Via-
n't• the Union relieved him from his labours. From
that moment " Othello's occupation was gone." Ire-
land, baying thus betcr.:e part and parcel of the an-
Pre—the only shadow of ground.—the only Pretence

for the continuance of the office—was the separation
of the two countries by the sea, and the consequent
difficulty and delays in the communication ; but even
that excuse no longer exists. The.steam-boat, as has
been justly observed, now forms a flying bridge between
England and Ireland ; space and time have, to a cer
tain extent, yielded to the improved facilities in travel-
ling ; and for every purpose of Government, every part
of Ireland is as conveniently situated, not only as Scot-
land, but as even the north of England. Upon
a recent occasion of disturbances in Lancashire, re-
quiring the immediate presence of a military force, it was
from Ireland, and not from the interior of the country, the
troops were called. If the presence of one Nobleman of
rank and fortune in Dublin add so much to its splendor,
how much more dignity and splendour would be conferred
upon the country by the appointment of Lords Lieu-
tenants of counties as in England ? This is a
post of great honour and importance, and there
are thirty-two counties in Ireland ! The appoint-
ment would increase the resident aristocracy, and the
country, under the eyes and superintendence of so many
guardians, would be as safe as when under only one, and
that one a stranger in Ireland, cooped up in the castle of
Dublin, unless he should happen to take it into his bead
to visit the mountains of the county of Wicklow, or the
Lake of Killarney. The full benefits of the Union have
too long been withheld, unjustly withheld, from Ireland :
they have been doled out slowly, and with a niggardly
hand. A better, and more liberal spirit, towards that coun-
try, is beginning to show itself; and we trust its friends
will not have long cause to complain that the object
of the Union has not been fully attained. That object
was not alone to unite the two countries in name, but to
blend them into one complete and perfect whole : to
give to Ireland all that was good in the English system ;
to consolidate the interests of both countries, and
assimilate them to each other.

The affair of Terceira, lately discussed, we believe,
for the third time, in the House of Commons, is one of
the points in the foreign policy of the Duke of WEL-
LINGTON, which has our decided disapprobation. No
repetition of approving votes in that assembly could
reconcile us to it, and we apprehend the public are not
of a different opinion. They want not cases from writers
upon international law, to enable them to come to a con-
elusion upon that question. It is only necessary to
consult common sense, and look at the character of the
transaction. It must be allowed to be, on the face of it,
a harsh and ungracious proceeding, justifiable only upon
the ground of propriety, or even necessity. The ques-
tion, therefore, resolves itself into this—do any such
grounds exist in the present cue ?—Had the Por-
tuguese emigrants been ordered out of the king-
dom, and had Don MIG GEL complained that
they were not more severely visited, would it not
have been competent to the Duke of WELLINGTON to
say " I proposed to deprive them of the greatest conso-
lation that men in their unfortunate situation could enjoy
the society of each other—to disperse them over the
country—and thus place them, as it were, in solitary
confinement; but they demurred to their sentence, and I
hatino right to prevent their departure." Would this have
been an unsatisfactory answer, and would Don biro um-
have been able to reply ? " No, you should have guarded
against any possible consequence of their departure that
might offend me, or affect my usurpation. You should
have sent out your men-of-war to dodge them over the
ocean, and you should have sunk, burned, and destroyed
them when they attempted to land in Terceira, an island
in the possession of her whom you and the other Powers
of Europe have recognized its rightful sovereign—
and in not having done so you have committed
a breach of neutrality for which I demand repara-
tion."—Such a remonstrance on the part of the
usurper is palpably absurd. It is idle to suppose that he
should have made such an extravagant demand upon a
purely neutral State, or that any Power in Europe could
have considered him as having sustained an injury of which
he would have a right to complain. If then this view of
the case be correct, the force resorted to against the Por-
tuguese emigrants at Terceira was not required by neces-
sity or a strict regard for neutral rights. It can only be
considered an officious act, done with a view to conciliate
the usurper, an act inconsistent with neutrality, which
means a state of perfect indifference, and unworthy of a
great, generous, and high-minded nation.

- -
Although, as will be seen by the Proclamation of Ge-
neral Nue, the dispute between Venesuela and New
Granada, continues to wear a very gloomy aspect, we
still hope that there is patriotism enough left among the
civil and military leaders of Columbia, to prevent any
effusion of blood. Our hopes on this subject are greatly
strengthened by the report of the Li NEIL ATON'S having
invited PAEZ to a personal interview, at Merida.
—BoLtv A>< boa, by this overture, given a new
proof of his disposition to conciliate, as well as of his
dislike to bring matters to an extremity, that must
prove fatal to the general interests of the Republic.—
We also look to the meeting of the Commissioners ap-
pointed to discuss the great question at issue, with a con-
fident hops that the result may be favourable. The in-
dividuals named by the central government could not have
been better chosen. General SUCRE is one of the most
meritorious officers of the republic. The Bishop of
SANTA MANTUA, is also distinguished for patriotism
and moderation ; while M. GARCIA DEL Rio, whose
admirable letters, published in the coluinmeLtbk)our-
nal, are alone sufficient to establish his fame as a most
able statesman, cannot fail to produce a great effect on
those who would separate the two states, and thus demolish
a fabric which it has cost so many terrible sacrifices to
raise. If, contrary to our anxious hopes, the sword should
be drawn, we do not for a moment doubt the issue. The
tutelary hero of Columbia has a most painful task to per-
form ; but the eyes of &rope are upon him, and be will
net be insensible to the glory of wresting his country out

of dakbasis of a domatiefactios, Air Win al;eady
saved %from a Amiga yoke.

4/4"stir,.. AN.
- -
Alf- • •••
• PIi__CATOS t • • •

LONDON.
-..-
WEDNESDAY, MAY 12.