The Sun.
London, England, 1845-05-02 00:00:00

DIRECT NORTHERN RAILWAY.

Mr. L AROUCHERE asked the Lord A dvocate'to engage on
the part of the Government to introduce a short Bill either to
repeal or amend this clause. If the Lord Advocate would not
give such a promise, he ( Mr. Labouchere) should feel it to be
his duty to move that the Lords' amendments be taken into
consideration.
Mr. FLUME said the surreptitious manner in which this
clause had been introduced into the Bill had neither been ex-
plained by the Lord Advocate, nor by the Honourable
Member who had lately resumed his seat. If a clause
so important as to give to the sheriff of the county
the power of finding against any railway without appeal—if the
principle was found to be good for Scotland, why not extend it
to England also ?—( Hear.) But turnpike trusts were not the
only companies affected by railways. Canals were as much in-
jured as turnpikes. He submitted, therefore, that this Bill ought
to be withdrawn altogether and a new one brought in. They
could not strike out the Clause, and there remained therefore
only the other course. Under these circumstances, he should
move that these amendments be taken into consideration that
day six months.—( Hear, hear.)
Lord EBRINGTON had already unsuccessfully called the
attention of the House to the hardships under which the
trustees of the turnpike roads in England were labouring ; but
he was glad to perceive that the turnpike roads in Scotland
seemed to be better represented in her Majesty's Government
than the turnpike roads of England. lie thought that this was
far from a creditable case en the part of her Majesty's Govern-
ment after the treatment of the English creditors and trustees
of turnpike roads. The English representatives would recol-
lect the facility with which this clause passed.
Mr. CHRISTOPHER said that the question for the House
to consider was, how they could have an uniform system esta-
blished throughout the whole country. Having passed
through that and the other House of Parliament Bills
fur the consolidation of railways, if they introduced
a separate system wlth regard to the Scotch rail-
ways, he thought the greatest possible hardship would be
felt by those who had turnpike-roads in England. If this
Bill passed he hoped that her Majesty's Government
would extend it to England. —( Hear, hear.) On the
other hand, he should feel himself called upon to support the
amendment of the Hon. Gentleman opposite. He maintained
that an uniform system ought to be extended equally to all
parts of the country, unless some special reason was shown to
the contrary.
Mr. 11. DRUMMOND made some observations in opposi-
tion to the amendment, but they were totally inaudible in the
gallery.
Lord HOWICK said the case of England and the case of
Scotland were precisely the same. The case of Scotland was
this, as he understood :—The country gentlemen of Scotland
had advanced their money on the security of the turnpike trusts.
This was the case in the county with which he was
particularly connected. The western line of road in North-
umberland was defective, and the gentlemen of the country
were extremely anxious that it should be improved. Those
country gentlemen did not give their guarantee for the money,
but they d d the same thing—they lent their ownl money
upon the security of the turnpike trusts, and the tolls to be
levied on the improved road from Morpeth, through Woollen
into Scotland. That money so advanced remained un-
paid, and two railways had been projected from New-
castle to Berwick, and one or other of these would
certainly pass. In that case he doubted whether the
tolls on the improved turnpike road would even pay the expense
of collection. Those gentlemen had not petitioned the House
for a clause giving them compensation, and yet if they
travelled a little way into Scotland, they would
find that compensation was to be given there to persons simi-
larly situated to themselves. He trusted this would not
aa
be tolerated, and that this clause, which had been
smuggled umg mail
lecleoa thought
coaches,
info s
that
bh
theot Bill, would not be allowed to pass.
Hethe
faireri
n England
way
yd
would be, that the exemption
and Scotland, should be got
rid of.
Mr. EDWARD ELLICE conceived that this was an unfair
clause to be introduced, for it was well known that though
sheriffs, to whore decisions should be left, might not be
actually resident in those counties respecting which they
were to make their decisions, yet they might at the same time
possess such interest in those eounties as to make them
very desirous that good communication should be made
through those counties, when on the business of adjudicating
a compensation to the road trustees they might be
placed in the position of deciding in their own case.
He did not at the present time allude to the Sheriff
of Middlesex, but he thought that the case was such
as demanded the immediate attention of the House. The clause
had been jobbed into the Bill, and the only way was to throw
the Bill out to-night, and introduce another Bill without
the clause to-morrow. No obstruction would be offered to
the passage of the Bill through the House, and it might be
passed so speedily as to save all public incAivenience.
Mr. AGLIONBY could not refrain from expressing his sur-
prise that none of her Majesty's Government had risen to ex-
press their opinions on this Bill. If it had been a private
Bill, he should not have beet surprised, because he knew it
was the custom for the Government to express no opinion ; but
as this was their osvn Bill, and the House might have received
advantage from knowing the opinions of the Government, he
thought it was a great omission of duty that none of them hadirisen.
The plan proposed was, that the present Bill be laid aside and
a new Bill brought in by the Goyernment, but to this he had
great objections. A principle had been introduced into this
Bill of a very important nature, and he could see no reason why
the same principle should nut be introduced into the English
and Scotch railway Bills.
Mr. PRIN GLE said the Hon. Gentlemen opposite seemed
to have misunderstood the whole case; and as for the observation
of the Hon. Gentleman opposite (Mr. Aglionby) that this
principle ought to be introduced into English and Irish railway
Bills it was altogether erroneous, for the roads in Scotland
were formed on a totally different principle from what they
were in this country or in Ireland. In Scotland the public
roads must be kept in repair out of the tolls.
The LORD ADVOCATE said that when he introduced
the clause he did not think there was any objection to;it, and
no person obiected to it when it was proposed to the Com-
mittee. lie did not desire that the clause should pass
without discussion__( Hear)—and as the House was of opinion
that it ought to be discussed, he would not press the clause.—
(Hear hear.) He thought the best own he could then
,

Mr. EDWARD ELLICE brought up the report on the
Direct Northern Railway from the Select Committee.
Sir THOMAS ESAIONDE moved lhat the evidence taken
before the Committee on the Wexford Harbour Bill (Session,
18-13) be referred to the Committee on the Castle-hill
(Wexford) Docks Bill—Agreed to.
An Hos. MEmser, presented eight petitions in favour of
the Lincoln and Cambridge Railway Bill.
Sir C. LEMON presented two petitions in favour of the
Cornwall Railway Bill.
REGAL OF LORD ELLENBOROUGH.

-
Mr. ELLICE said he had been requested by the Hon.
Member for Montrose to postpone his motion to the 19th inst.
It was for copies of the correspondence between the Court of
Directors of the East India Company and the Board of Con-
trol, respecting the recal of Lord Ebenborough, the Governor-
General of India; an .l a copy of the minute of the Court
Directors recalling him.
GOVERNMENT OF NEW ZEALAND.

Mr. CHARLI.:.S BULLER said, in answer to a question
from Mr. Mope, that as he understood that the question
involved in the motion of which he had given notice was under
the cons deration of the Government, he would withdraw his
motion,

SCOTCH BANKING.
Mr. FOX MAULE wished to know when the second read-
,ng of the Scotch and Irish Banks Bill would be taken?
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said he
should give an answer on the morrow.
Mr. FOX MAULE said the second reading of the Scotch
Poor-law Bill was fixed for the first Wednesday. He thought
it would be better to postpone its consideration till after Whit-
Sunday.
The LORD-ADVOCATE was understood to assent to the
postponement.
ADMISSION TO THE UNIVERSITY CHAIRS IN

SCOTLAND.
Mr. RUTHERFORD, in rising to move the introduction
of a Bill to regulate the admission to the lay or secular chairs
of the Universities of Scotland said, that in ordet to put the
House into posses ion of his intentions in bringing forward this
measure, he should shortly call their attention to the two
Acts passed in 1709 and 1770 upon this subject. Bs those laws
it was enacted that no party should be capable of filling any
office in the Universities without having first taken the oaths
of allegiance and acknowledging and subscribing " the Confes-
sion of Faith," and, moreover, that they should sign &formula,
submitting themselves to the discipline of the Presbytery, Now,
that Act had never been enforc d in all the Universities, and
never universally enforced in any. In some of the Universities it
was enforced only in respect to the professors, and not to the
office bearers. In the University of Edinburgh, which was
perhaps not the oldest, although certainly the largest, and that
which had produced the most distinguished men, the law had
long been in abeyance, and it had never been enforced at all
against any lay professor. He now proposed to bring in a Bill
for the purpose of declaring that hereafter it should not be ne-
cessary for any lay or secular professor to sign the confession
or the formula. In that proposition he would leave untouched
the theological chairs, and apply the Act only to those which
were devoted to literature and science. He thought that
whilst it was necessary that those , ouths who were brought up
for the Established Church should be instructed in divinity
according to the rules of that Church, by teachers who were
bound to those rules, it was not necessary that the same re-
strictions should be applied to those other teachers who hsd
nothing to do with divinity. He should, in any circum-
stances, have thought it his duty to bring in this Bill ; but he
felt it the more imperative to do so now, when so
many of his countrymen had seceded from the Es-
tablished Church, and held it in dislike.—( Hear.)
The Hon. Member, whom we did not always clearly under-
stand, referred to some recent declaration of the professors of
the University of Edinburgh, signed by all, with one excep-
tion, to the effect that the restrictions ought to be done away
with. In the University of Aberdeen a majority of professors
in all the colleges except (we believe) Mareschal College had
come to the same decision. In Glasgow a majority hsd de-
clared themselves in the same way. He asked them for per-
mission to introduce this Bill, leaving, as he had said, all the
ecclesiastical professorships as they were. He asked this leave
in the name of a very large portion of his countrymen, and a
large portion of the teachers in the universities. He en-
treated the attention of the Right Hon. Baronet opposite to
this matter, which was at this moment of critical importance.
He very well recollected that, in the course of the discussion of
last year, the Right Honourable Baronet at the
head of the Government, and the other Right Honourable
Gentleman beside him ( Sir George Clerk), spoke of an
occurrence which had then recently taken place, and expressed
their confidence that a re-action was at hand. Hilt there had
been no re-action, and he stood there to say that those who had
separated from the Established Church were more determined
than ever to establish themselves.—( Hear, hear.) They had
shown a determination which no one who knew Scotland
would expect to subdue.—(Cheers.) They had already 700
t hurches—( Hear, hear)—and he would state one circumstance
of singular importance. It was known that those who belonged
to the Episcopal party in Scotland were amongst the wealthiest
land-owners, and they had long been desirous of getting up an
Episcopal college. But in the course of several years they had
been able to collect for that purpose no more than 18,04)0/.
Let the House contrast that with what had been done by those
who had separated from the Established Church.—( Hear,
hear.) It was proposed by some of the principals of that body
to found a college. But they thought it would be a hard thing
to draw for that purpose upon the general fund for building
churches and manses, and for the payment of the clergy. They
asked, were there not enough amongst them to subscribe 1,000/.
each? and in less than three weeks 20,000/. was subscribed from
twenty individuals, and if they had required it they could
have obtained any further sum.—( Hear, hear.) They were
not going to establish a university, but only a college for the
education of those intended for the Church. But if the pre-
sent restrictions were to be kept up in the universities, that
would cause the whole education of Scotland to become sec-
tarian.—( Hear, hear. ) The schools and the universities
would be (trained of all the Dissenting youth.—( Hear.) He
entreated the Right Hon. Baronet to consider well, and to
take counsel, that if he did not accept this Bill, the uni-
' versifies would be injured and the new college would flourish
on their ruins.—( Hear ) What objection could there be to
give legal effect to what had long been the universal pi actice ?
How was the law actually enforced? In several colleges the
rector, and in most a number of the professors had not signed
the tests. Of all these 13 were Presbyterian Dissenters, and
27 belonged to the Episcopalian persuasion. Of course it
would not be supposed that he did not speak with respect of the
persons who belonged to the Established Church in this
country—(Hear, hear)—but he would say that no one
who kne w the history of Scotland would deny
that these restrictions were directed from the first against
episcopacy.—( Hear, hear.) Yet the Right Hon. Baronets
opposite had been installed as rectors without signing the con-
fession or the formula.—( Hear, hear, and a laugh. ) When
therefore, he asked the House to rescind those restrictions, he
did not ask them to do any thing new, but to make that the law
which was already the practice. The law was still bad, and it
was lamentable to have a country under the working of a bad
law. As an instance, he would point out the case of Mr.
Brewster, a name not requiring, the addition of Doctor, who
had distinguished the College of St. An-trews ten times more
than the College could have distinguished him.l Dr. Brewster
having joined the party who had left the Church in the late
schism, the other professors having found this statute tried to
enforce the law against him. They were disappointed,
miserably disapp inted, for the law was found wanting in some
very plain machinery. The Bight Hon. Gentleman opposite,
the Secretary for the Home Department, would forgive him
for saying that the members of the Free Church
could not rely very much upon the generosity of their oppo-
nents. There was a man who held a high and prominent
situation in that grand movement which separated the Church,
and of all men concerned in that great event he was the most
moderate in counsel, and the most temperate in language—he
never uttered a word, or did a deed, that would give offence
to any individual. He held the theological chair in Edin-
burgh, and also the secretaryship of the private board, which
he might have kept ; that gentleman did not think it neces-
sary to tender his resis,nation of that appointment, which
however was taken from him. He would call that a vindic-
tive and harsh use of authority, and he would tell the Right
Hon. Gentleman opposite, that that one act of his rendered
conciliation more impassible than any act recorded in the his-
tor) of such transactions. These laws may be hereafter en-
forced in the same way as they do exist. He knew not that he
should enter into a discussion then about the propriety of the tests
in such cases ; he did not know whether the Right Hon.
Baronet wished to impose them with reference to the se-
cular chairs. In his view, it would be consistent, but de-
structive to their character. They would do infinite injury
to these establishments, if they were now to come forward
and limit the choice of the teachers, who belonged
to the Free Church, and were instructing their charges with
implicit confidence imposed in them. If they meant to try the
question he would ask what connexion had immense knowledge,
great proficiency, and the power to impart that knowledge to
others, to do with their religious opinions ?—( Hear, hear.)l In
England the matter was different, where all form partoa
domestic
family, as it were, in which religious discipline and
instruction go hand-in-hand with science. It may be advan-
tageous in the Universities in England ; it may be very right
that professors shoul,l be persons in connexion with the Esta-
blishment ; but how different was it in the Scotch Universities,
where there was nothing like that domestic habit or that
do-
mestic discipline, where the pupils went to hear the scientific
lectures and then returned home again. According to thee hAios-t
tory of the country the statute was inconsistent with the
of Union, which first introduced the principles of dissent—an
Act which was regarded last session, when a Bill was brought
in called Lord Aberdeen's Act. It was against the opinion in
law of Lords Cottenham, Campbell, and Brougham. That
appeal was disregarded, and he hoped they would disregard it
equally now. Was it no grievance that a very large party
and the majority of the country were precluded by law from
obtaining academical honours as teachers or professors in the
Colleges? Was it no grievance, was it no indignity, that
those who had devoted their whole life to study, should be
prevented from teaching anything because they disagreed
with certain tenets in religious matters? Now was a fair
opportunity to interfere—'or nevueroww_asorditsis,eelyst
from
would the Es
-
Es-
tahlished Church se strong as
other-
wise be involving in exclusion more than half of those who
were within that Church, and the great majority of the people
of Scotland. He would now ask for the repeal of that law,
and Pa leave to bring in a Dill for the purpose of repealing it.