The Sun.
London, England, 1842-03-08 00:00:00

it was not a general practice to send the prisoner to such
houses.
The Jury found the prisoner " Guilty," but strongly recom-
mended him to mercy on account of the very improper employ.
ment assigned to him by the prosecutor.
The prisoner was again indicted for stealing a quantity of
linen of the value of 401., the property of the same prosecutor,
and the Jury a second time returned a verdict of " Guilty,"
but still adhered to their former recommendation and obser-
va ions.
The Recorder deferred passing sentence.

AUSTRALIAN AN D NEW Z EA•

LAND EMIGRATION AND LAND FUND.

An Adjourned Meeting of the members of this Society
was held last night at their offices, 455, Strand, for the pur-
pose of taking into consideration the measure about to be intro-
duced into Parliament liyLord Stanley, with respect to the
sale of Colonial Lands.

Mr. Pim took the Chair, and stated the object of the meet-
ing. He understood that Mr. Walker had some old despatches
to submit to the meeting, in which was a pledge to appropriate
the sale of Colonial lands to the purposes of emigration.
Mr. WALKER said he had such despatches in his possession,
but he had not got them with him. They were dated, June,
1831, and they contained a pledge that the produce of the sale
of Colonial lands should be appropriated to emigration.
Mr. KINNAIRD wished to put a question io Mr. Walker,
whether that pledge had been made pubic ?
Mr. WALKER said it was not made public at the time, but
it was afterwards ; and the inhabitants of the Colonies placed
implicit confidence in that pledge.
A GENTEMAN said that Sir George Gibbs hail denied this
two years aso in council.
Mr. WALKER said that Sir George Gibbs had denied it,
but he afterwards became so convinced of appropriating that
fund to emigration, that he stated it in Council to be his
belief that the fund ought not to be appropriated to any other
purpose.
A GENTLEMAN suggested that it would be desirable to
coincide with Lord Stanley in his views, with respect to this
fund, for he believed that Lord Stanley was a man of talent,
and hid the interest of the colonies at heart. He, ther-fore,
thought that if they coincided in the measure, they would tie
the Government to apply half the produce of the sale to emi-
gration which was their own proposal ; they could go for the
other afterwards.
Mr. Hinton said their object was to go hand in hand with
Lord Stanley, but they wished to alter his scheme.
A GENTLEMAN said he thought they were frightening
themselves more than there was any occasion for, for he be-
lieved that the object of Lord Stanley was to apply not less than
one half of the proceeds to emigration, and out of the other
half would come the expenses of survey, making roads, building
bridges, &c., and the residue of that half to be applied to that
object.
The CHAIRMAN said if this was their object theycould have
no objection to it. After some further discussion on the motion
of Mr. Hinton, a COmmittee was formed for the purpose of
drawing up a memorial to Lord Stanley, expressive of their
views on the measure he is about to introduce to Parliament,
and to wait upon his Lordship with it.
The Meeting was then adjourned to Wednesday week, when
the memorial will be submitted to the Meeting previous to
presentation.

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT.
HOUSE OF LORDS, March 7.

The LORD CHANCELLOR took his seat on the Wool-
sack shortly before Five o'Clock.
Lord REDESD ALE presented a petition from
Newry, praying that wheat might be admitted
in preference to foreign flour. The Noble Earl
also presented a petition from Wigan, praying
that the provisions of the Act relative to licensed vic-
tuallers in London, preventing them from opening
their house before one o'clock on Sundays, or of
serving persons under a certain age, might be ex-
tended to the rural districts.
LOAN SOCIETIES BILL.

The NOBLE EARL moved the second reading of
the Loan Societies Bill. _ _

Lord CAMPBELL trusted that the provisions of
the. Bill would be extended to Scotland.
Lord REDESDALE said if there was any
objection to the second reading, the better course
would be for him to postpone the second reading to a
future day.
The second reading was then postponed.
PRESBYTERIAN MARRIAGES.

Lord CAMPBELL presented petitions from several
parts of Scotland, graying that the Bill with respect
to the marriages of Dissenters, might be a declaratory
Bill.

The LORD CHANCELLOR gave notice of his
intention, on Friday next, to move for the appoint-
ment of a Committee to consider the law relative to
marriages in Ireland, with a view to make such altera-
tions as might be necessary.
Lord CAMPBELL said, that all the petitions
which he had presented were in favour of the
Bill being made a declaratory and not an enact-
ing Act. He would take that opportunity of
putting a question to the Noble and Learned
Lord in reference to the subjects which had been
alluded to in her Majesty's most gracious Speech
from the Throne on the 3d February. In that Speech
her Majesty was pleased to say that measures
would be introduced to amend the Bankruptcy
Laws, and to effect improvement in the Eccle-
siastical Courts. It was now the 7th of March,
and no mention of either of those subjects had yet
been made in either House of Parliament by any Mem-
ber of her Majesty's Government. He begged to ask
whether any measure was in contemplation.
The LORD CHANCELLOR said that he would
introduce a measure on the subject of the Bankrupt
Laws on Monday next ; and that a Bill in reference
to the Ecclesiastical ul

Ement-luttertreaftorthe 0,-
E respect to the Marriage Act he. would -move the
second reading of the Bill on Thursday next, when it
would be the proper time to discuss the principle.
Numerous petitions, praying for an alteration of
the law respecting mixed marriages in Ireland, were
presented by Lord BROUGHAM and the Marquis of
CLANRICARDE, from places in the counties of Down,
Tyrone, Armagh, and Londonderry.
The Bishop of LONDON presented a petition
from Southwark (as we understood), praying for the
interference of Parliament for the prevention of burial
grounds being formed in populous places.
Lord MELBOURNE presented a petition from a
place in Ireland relative to Presbyterian mixed mar-.
riages.

ALGIERS.
The Marquis of CLANRICARDE sald he wished
to put a question to the Noble Earl, the Secretary of
State for Foreign Affairs, upon a matter of consider-
; importance. There had appeared in the newspa-
,
pers of Paris and of this country reports of a conver-
sation which had taken place between the French
Ambassador and the Noble Earl relating to the oc-
cupation of Algiers by the French. He was
aware that it was best to refrain from expressing any
opinion or sentiment respecting this transaction, in
of der to avoid the possibility of giving offence in any
quarter. • No person could be more desirous than
himself that the best possible understanding should
exist between this nation and the French people,
and no person could be more alive to the danger and in-
convenience that would arise to both countries and to
Europe in general, from even the slightest tem-
porary estrangement. But as between individuals,
so between Governments, a good understanding
should always be maintained with respect to the
matter, he thought it was best to ascertain the fact,
because it was a matter of much importance.
and had been made public in the press ; • and
he wished to know whether it was true that
her Majesty's Government had permitted this country
to be committed, as had been stated by the papers
He had heard two different versions of the conversation.
He would not quote the words attributed to the No-
ble Earl, but it had been reported by the press
of this country, that the first Minister of
the Crown had stated that there was no
difference in the two expressions. True, the
Right Honourable Baronet at the head f the
Government did say that there was no substantial
difference between the two versions, but from this
opinion he (the Noble Marquis) had the mis-
fortune to differ. He considered there was a
very wide and important difference between
the two versions.—(Hear, hear.) The first version
led to the impression that the Noble Earl, in conversa-
tion witll the French Ambassador, rather avoided
going into the subject of Algiers, and de-
clined; on the part of his Government, ex-
pressing any feeling or opinion under existing cir-
cumstances ; but the other version made the
Noble Earl give, on the part of Great Britain, a posi-
tive and direct acquiescence to the permanent occupa-
tion and assumption of sovereignty by France in Al-
giers, and the country overrun by the French. He
(the Noble Marquis) thought it not at all likely
that the Queen's Minister could have so com-
mitted the Government and the country to
such a step without first communicating with
Parliament.—(Hear, hear.) The question, there-
fore, which he had to put to the Noble Earl was, whe-
ther, on the part of her Majesty's Government, he
had had any communication with the French Ambas-
sador about the government and sovereignty of Al-
giers, and the territory occupied by the French ?
The Earl of ABERDEEN said the Noble Marquis
had been good enough to give him notice of his inten-
tion, and therefore he (Lord Aberdeen) was now fully
prepared with an answer. The Noble Marquis might
recollect what ha (Lord Aberdeen) said at the time
of the expedition against Algiers, for he believed
the Noble Marquis then asked for some expla-
nation of the negotiations that took place on
this subject between the French and the British
Governments. In 1833 he (Lord Aberdeen) in
consequence of what took place elsewhere, was under
the necessity of moving for papers connected with
this subject; and the Noble Earl then at the head of
her Majesty's Government, not only had no objection
to the production of the papers, but said that
he was satisfied with the course he (Lord Aber-
deen) had taken. ,From that time to the pre-
sent he (Lord. Aberdeen) had remained silent on
this subject. When het Majesty called upon him to
take office again he felt that his opinion on this
subject would be regarded with some importance
by the French Government, considering the part he
took when he held office before. He felt he had
but one course to pursue, that whatever he might have
done if he were recalled to office in 1831, that coming
into office in 1841, after ten years' silence, it was ne-

cessary to deviate from the course taken Witktreference
to this subject by preceding Governments, the was,
retaining all the opinions he had before expreSsed, to
say nothing about it. The conversation alluded
to by the Noble Marquis was quite incidental,
arising out of a conference of a confiden-
tial and friendly nature. • He had no doubt
that M. St. Aulaire was perfectly convinced
that he made an accurate version of his (Lord Aber-
deen's) remarks to the French Government, and he
was glad to have this opportunity of declaring, that
he never had dealt with a more honourable,
high-minded man than the French Ambassa-
dor—(Hear, hear)—and it was a fortunate
thing for both countries that France was so repre-
sented.--(Hear, hear.) But when he (Lord Aber-
deen) saw in the Moniteur the report of this conver-
sation, as given in the Chamber of Deputies by
M. Guizot, he saw that M. St. Aulaire had fallen
involuntarily into an erroneous version of the con-
versation, and therefore he (Lord Aberdeen) hastened
to rectify it, as would be seen by the despatch he
wrote to the British Ambassador in Paris.
The despatch was dated January 28, and
ran thus :—" My Lord, I beg leave to
direct your attention to a report in the Moniteur
of a speech delivered in the Chamber of Depu-
ties by M. Guizot, on the 20th. On that occa-
sion his. Excellency read an account of a con-
versation that had taken place been M. St. Aulaire
and myself in relation to the French possessions in
Africa, and which the former transmitted to
the French Ministry: In this narrative the
Count de St. Aulaire says, I began by
asserting the security of our African
possessions as of the last importance, which must not
be allowed to give way to any consideration,
and Lord Aberdeen, after listening attentively,
said, ' I am very glad to be able to explain distinctly
on this point. I wag Minister in 1830. If you go
back to that time I have much to say ; but taking af-
fairs as they are in 1841, and the state in which things
have been left by preceding Cabinets, I look
at your possession as a fait accompli, and
I have no further observation to make.'
This quotation, purporting to be the account of
the Count de St. Aulaire, with the exception of the
last sentence, is correct. I never said that I had no
objection to make to the establishment of the French
in Algiers, but that I had no observations to make on
the subject, and that it was my inNntion to be
silent." The context showed that such was his
(Lord Aberdeen's) view, and that decision he
had come to after mature reflection. He (Lord
Aberdeen) felt that after ten years, any objection at
the present moment, would have been MiSplaced.
The course which it would have been impossible for
him to have adopted then, was now entirely consistent
with propriety. It did not follow, if any objection
was not expressed that it was not entertained. He
had explained to the French Ambassador the misre-
presentation which he had fallen into, and the erroneous
statement which he had made in consequence.
With respect to Lord Cowley, that Noble Lord had
fulfilled his instructions upon the subjent, and there
the matter rested. He (Lord 'Aberdeen) was not
aware that he had any further explanation to give
on the subject. He would then lay the despatch on
the table of their Lordships' House.
THE ADMIRALTY. _
- - - -

Lord MINTO wished to call their Lordships' at-
tention to a matter personal to himself. He was not
insensible to the great inconvenience of referring the
House to any matter that- might have passed in the other
House of Parliament, but there were occasions on which
it would be highly improper to allow unseemly ex-
pressions to go forth without some explanation ; and
when he should have read to their Lordships the pas-
sage from a newspaper to which he alluded, he thought
their Lordships would feel with him that the
present was such an occasion. The passage to
which he was about to refer purported to be a
eeport of the speech of a Gallant Officer in
the other House of Parliement. The object of that
Gallant Officer at the time was to recommend to the
notice of the House what he (Lord M.) must beg leave
) call a rather fanciful scheme for the Naval
Administration. The Gallant Officer to whom
he alluded, in pointing out, in the course of
his speech, the incompetency of civilians
to fill the situation of First Lord of the Admiralty, made
the following observation " When the late First Lord
of the Admiralty came into power he was in general
extremely ignorant ; but after he had been there a
little time he began to fancy that he was a thorough
sailor." But it was to what followed that he (LordMinto)
wished particularly to call their Lordships' attention.
" After he had been at the Admiralty for some time,
he began to assume a great deal more power, than he
ever ought to have assumed." Now there was a
distinct charge. But the Report proceeded :—" He had
al ways understood there was a divided responsibility
in the Board of Admiralty; but the late First Lord
acted against the express desire of every other
Lord. Amongst other things a scheme was proposed
to reduce the complement of men by one-eighth; and
that was assented to by every one of the Naval Lords.
'lle result was communicated to Lord Minto who put the
(.12sux2aeilt Alta Ilk iniketTinird w!s
~
returned to the Board, when it turned out that Lord
Minto had taken upon himself to reduce the number of
men not by one-eighth but by one-fifth." Now before he
(Lord Minto) went further, he would endeavour, in
a few words—confining himself to the charge—to
make their Lordships, if possible, understand what
actually did take place on the occasion alluded
to. He wonld not enter into the controversy
as to the peace and war complements.
lie believed it to be a question of circumstances. In
a time of profound peace, he thought that it might
be wise to have a large number of ships afloat with
a smaller complement of men than would be required
in time of war. But when the state of our foreign
relations 'was at all menacing, it was necessary
to increase the complement : and he thought that
the present First Lord of the Admiralty was perfectly
right in putting on the full complement of men, in all
:hips in foreign stations. He had said that he beg-
!red leave to call their Lordships' attention to the
large against himselfpersonally ; which was that a cer-
tain complement was recommended to him by the other
Lords of the Admiralty, and he took upon himself to
adopt a different scale. The full war complement was
determined by the recommendation of a Commission,
end was understood to rest upon that recommendation.
the opinions of this Commission were held to deter-
'nine what were the complement of ships. The peace
stablishments were sometimes reduced and some-
:imes increased, and of late years considerable reduc
;ions had been made. He rather thought that tinder
iir. James Graham and Lord Auckland some reduc-

tions were made in the peace complements. Such was
:he state of things when he came to the Admiralty.
There was then a sufficient complement to certain
„lasses of ships. Many descriptions of ships had been
ntroduced into the service since that state of comple-
:lents had been considered necessary. Since that

time a new and more power-iiil armament
:lad been considered necessary. All this seemed
to regard a revision of the complement of
the ships, and accordingly, in the autumn,
persons were employed on the subject, many schemes
vere produced, and at length, after they thought suffi-
ient progress had been made, a meeting of the Board
vas called, at which the attendance of Sir T. Hastings
,nd the Surveyor-General was required, and after sitting
iometime a complement was devised which was
'sought a full war complement, and to that arrange-
ient, as far as he recollected, h 3 thought that Capt.
3erkeley was a party. And that scale of complements
vas the one he left when he retired from the Admiralty.
,'hen, with respect to the question of peace complements.
Jnder the old system, the complement had been reduced
me-eighth. A scale was suggested by which it was
'reposed to take one-fifth or one-sixth. Mr Wood drew

up a minute on the'subject, and brought it to the Board.
It described the principle on which they should proceed
with respect to war complements and peace complements,
Ind in that statement he most cordially concurred.
that minute was brought forward and approved of by
ill the members of the Board, and yet this was the one
.vhich he was supposed to have put in his pocket, and
'hanged for an entirely new plan. He said at the time,
that it was a question requiring much investigation, and
that he was bound to see that the professional zeal and
7re:indices:of naval officers did not run away with them
and induce them to recommend a wanton expenditure.
He did what he thought was his duty, namely, he con-
sulted the two senior Naval Lords, both flag officers, and
11e ir de
men in whose opinions he had the fullest confidence.
They went into the question minutely, and he stated to
thhee
mustthat b
ei t
bbeing
boundseon
tiernetliyr elbyy
a t
professionalc is o n question,.
They
found that the principle of the plan was
totally inapplicable, that to establish any one proportion,
between the peace and war complements of every de-
scription of ships would be productive of all sorts of con-
fusion, and, in short, though it might look well upon
!)aper, yet it was in fact arrant nonsense. After much
liscussion a scale of the peace establishment was agreed
m by Sir C. Adams and Sir W. Parker, and he (Lord
%(into) fully concurred with them. It was considerably
ess than the scale recommended, but it was made with

their entire concurrence. As to Captain Berkeley not
having been consulted, that was not his fault, as that
Gallant Officer was out of town. lie trusted that the
statement he had made was sufficient to acquit him of
having acted on his own authority, and not on the
judgment of the Board. He would proceed to the next
subject of complaint against him; as an evidence of his
undue assumption of authority, it had been stated " he"
(Sir C. Napier) " had read in a Levant paper, that Sir
Stopford had received private orders from Lord
Minto to proceed off Candia; there to wait for further
orders; was it right there should be such an assumption
of authority?" Even supposing the circumstances had
been, as there stated, he should not think that he had in-
curred any reproach. The First Lord of the Admiralty
being in the Cabinet, was, necessarily, in most confiden-
tial communication with the Commanders-in-Chief of
the naval forces. At the time referred to,' the commu-
nications with the Commander-in-Chief in the Mediter-
ranean were Of the most delicate nature, and he believed
that notwithltanding, in this instance, But in fifty
others, he had intimated to that officer the wish of
the Government, though not in the shape of an order, ,

Courts was in
_preparation, r,i!
'of the Secretary of State. Wit