The Sun.
London, England, 1827-03-30 00:00:00

law which tended to the relief of the poor. The first in-
quiry should be into the state of the law on this point.

The Earl of ENNISKILLEN . knew that there was no
Noble Lord who was a greater friend to Ireland than the
Noble Earl; but he thought a great deal of mischief might
be done by proposiieg to introduce Poor Laws into Ireland.
It would excite hopes among the people which could never
be gratified. The poverty of the people in Ireland was
caused by a succession of bad crops, by an over-population,
and by the non-residence of the Ittideti proprietors.
Lord REDFSDALE stated, that in the neighbourhood
of Dublin there were collections made at the Churches for
the poor, and by that means they were relieved. The
whole body of the people were in such a state of poverty,
that what they could contribute was not much, and they
were unable to relieve one another. He was afraid,
however, that were a system of Poor Laws introduced,
it would destroy ail industry among the people. The
best mode of relieving the poor of Ireland, would be to
introduce a better system of farming, to abolish small farms,
and have a body of farmers like those of England. If
there were such a body of men, there would be more em-
ployment, and not so much misery in Ireland. But to have
them several things were necessary. The farmers must
have capital, and they must be intelligent, for it was
rather to the skill of the superintendents of the labourers
to which he looked, than to the labourers themselves.
When small farmers cultivated land themselves, they
grudged every shilling laid out for labour, and their land
was never properly tilled. In most eases, where the
Poor Rates were excessive, they were made so either by
manufactories being established in the neighbourhood, or
by the land being divided, as in some parts of Sussex, into
small portions. Wherever the farms were large, the
labourers were better off than where the farms were
small. He did not wish to see compulsory relief for the
peer introduced into Ireland, as that would destroy in-
dustry ; and after a better system of cultivation was in-
troduced, probably the best mode of administering relief
would be by voluntary contributions. In Scotland this
was the general practice, but in some places compulsory
rates had been introduced, and they had been followed,
he understood, by unfavourable consequences. Connected
with this subject, he must remind their Lordships of the
Corn Laws. At present the English market was open to
Irish corn, and cultivation, had been much extended in that
country by the exclusion of foreign corn. He hoped,
therefore, that their Lordships would remember, whenever
the subject of the Corn Laws came before them the
bearings of these laws on the cultivation and prosperity of
Ireland.

Lord ELLENBOROUGH, like the Noble Lord wko
introduced the subject, and like other Noble Lords, depre-
cated the introduction of the Poor Law system into Ire-
land. The Noble Lord who had spoken first insisted on
the necessity of doing something ; but he entreated their
Lordships to take care, if they consented to make any com-
pulsory regulations, that they were not led further than
they intended. Let their Lordships recollect how the
English Poor Laws had been twisted from their original
form, and consider, if a compulsory system were intro-
duced into Ireland, if it would not be twisted in the same
manner. Some inquiries had already been made on this
subject, and he was of opinion, that organizing a system
of voluntary collection and distribution, as had been re-
commended by the Committee of Sit?, was the only safe
course. He entreated their Lordships, before they begat
with any compulsory enactments, to consider where they
meant to stop.

The Earl of DARNLEY explained, that he had not
taken kis information from newspapers, but from authority
on which he could depend. He expressed some doubt as
to the effect of large sums, hut was quite sure such a sys-
tem could not give immediate relief. He had no intention
of proposing any compulsory laws, but in the present state
of Ireland the subject urgently required the consideration of
their Lordships.
The Earl of BELMORE meant only to make an obser-
vation on a single point. Though there was no Statute
Law in Ireland for the relief of the Poor, there was a Com-
mon Law, which was stronger than Statute law. There
was also a common right, which was considered so by the
pauper, and acknowledged to be so by those who never
failed to give them relief.—(Hear, hear.)—lf a law were
to make it compulsory to provide for the poor, that law
would diminish the means of providing for those now in
existence.