The Sun.
London, England, 1845-06-21 00:00:00

NEW ZEALAND.

TI-e following is a more full report of Sir Robert
Peel's speech than we were enabled to give in our
Morning Edition of yesterday :
Sir R. PEEL—Sir, it would be unfortunate if any diffe-
rences connected with party consideration, or any conflict that
may have been carried on between the Colonial Department
and the New Zealand Company, should divert our attention
from considerations of what is due to the interests of that
colony, which is the immediate object of our deliberation. I
willingly admit that the interests of that colony are recom-
mended to us by many considerations. When I look to the
extent of the colony, the line of the coast, the quantity of land
capable of cultivation and of improvement—when I look, above
all, to its position, and to the new importance it has acquired
by events that have been recently passing before us, by the
opening of the trade with China—l agree with the Noble
Lord, that there appears every probability, so far as we are
able to form a judgment, that this colony, if its interests be duly
regarded, and its welfare fostered, is destined to occupy a most
important station in the world. I agree with the Noble
Lord that its relation with this country is most
important. Surveying the whole of the unoccupied
portions of the globe, I know of no part of that globe
more calculated to afford a profitable outlay for the
capital and for the employment of the superabundant
population of this country. Every consideration, therefore,
I willingly admit, recommends to our cordial attention the
interests of that important colony. The question is, whe-
ther you will leave the continued charge of it in the hands
of the executive authority, or whether you will
to-night assume to the House of Commons the
function of determining its future government. New, what is
the course which her Majesty's Government has taken, under
circumstances which I admit to be somewhat critical? We
have disapproved of the conduct of Captain Fitzroy, the Go-
vernor of New Zealand, for whose personal character I enter-
tain the highest respect, and for the difficulties of whose posi-
tion I must make great allowance.—(Cheers.) Yet, we have
signified to him in the most formal and authoritative manner,
that his conduct in the administration of affairs in the colony
we did not approve of ; and then, though with great reluctance,
but in the performance of a necessary duty, we have removed
him from the post which he undertook exclusively from the
highest and purest motives.—(Loud cheers.) We have
shown, therefore, in the first instance, that we have no desire
to consult the interests and feelings of friends to the prejudice
of the public good.—(Loud cheers.) We have made an ap-
pointment, or contemplate the immediate appointment. of a
successor. The policy of that appointment has been questioned
by some, but I happen to possess the highest authority for the
judicious selection we have made. For the Noble Lord (Lord
John Russell) did himself select Captain Grey for the situation
which he now fills—that of Governor of South Australia.
But some other gentlemen tell us that he is not of high rank
enough. Why, as for these native chiefs of New Zealand, do
not Hon. Gentlemen believe that they attach much more im-
portance to the past success, the character, and the energy of
the man, than they do to the conventional rank which he may
happen to hold. He holds the rank of captain in the army ;
but he has been successful in rescuing a colony from difficul-
ties which were deemed to be very great by those who ap-
pointed him. The Noble Lord says he presumes we shall give
him instructions to enter into personal squabbles with Colonel
Wakefield; I must say I think that is a most unworthy sugges-
tion.—( Cheers.) We shall give him the assurance of entire
confidence; we shall entrust to him, so far as is con-
sistent with the Constitution and law of this country, an
unfettered discretion, laying down no doubt the general
principles by which we think he ought to be guided ;
in the difficulty of issuing instructions at such a dis-
tance, under the circunastanees in which that colony
is placed, the discretion he will have will be unfettered by any
particular instructions.—( Hear, hear.) Now, with respect to
the future government of this colony. Looking at its distance
and the great difficulty of issuing orders from this country for
its government, I for one am strongly inclined to think that
representative government is suited for its condition.—( Hear. )
It has not the objection which might apply in a penal colony.
You have rescued New Zealand, at any rate, from the evils
attending penal establishments. I speak only of the general
principle • I think there ought to be a form of government
constituted for New Zealand, in connexion with those who are
immediately interested in its local prosperity, assigning to them
a due weight and influence in the administration of affairs. In
short, I cannot think what assignable interest this country can
have in New Zealand, except in the promotion of its pros-
perity. Why, our connexion with depend upon it, must
depend altogether upon that connexion being a profitable one.
—(Hear, hear.) It is impossible, at the distance we are from
the country, that we can seek any advantage in a connexion,
with New Zealand, except that which may result from re-
ciprocal interest, and, above all, from the promotion of local
prosperity.—( Hear, hear. ) At the same time, it is impossible
not to see the great advantages of a representative govern-
ment. The Noble Lord says, that Auckland has been im-
properly selected as the seat of the executive Government. I
apprehend there were reasons for it at the time it was so
selected as the seat of the civil and military arrangements;
and the removal of the executive Government from Auckland
must depend not upon local or general considerations merely,
but upon what shall be most advantageous to the colony.—
( Hear, hear.) Considering the distance of the settlements
that are extended over the northern island, it would be no
easy matter now to apply the principle of a representative
government according to the construction we place upon it.
I believe that by far the best plan would be the formation of
municipal governments, with extensive powers of local
taxation, and powers of meeting all local demands to
be established in the first instance. In the opinion of Mr.
Burke the forms of representative government in North
America did grow directly out of those municipal institutions.
I do not think it would be wise to adopt the suggestion of the
New Zealand Company, to make a proprietary government
here. I believe the best form of government will be that the
Crown here should superintend the external regulations of
that country, and that the local executive government should
manage the internal affairs of the colony. Would you have
three authorities established? Would you have the Crown and
the Company, each exerciseing control over the local govern-
ment ? That is a system of goventuent so untried and so ano-
malous, that I cannot think that success would attend it.—
( Hear, hear.) With respect to the New Zealand Company,
I think it important that they should retain in full exercise
the powers committed to them with regard to settlement
and commerce. I believe that Company may be made a
useful instrument of government, not exercising any
control over the local government, but as a great
commercial Company, acting on enlightened principles,
and assisting the executive Government in devising means of
emigration and employment for the surplus population of this
country.—( Hear.) As to the question of revenue, it is very
difficult, at such a great distance, to do more than to lay down
general principles. But with all my respect for Capt. Fitzroy,
the abandonment of all revenue constitutes a serious mischief.
—( Hear.) The Customs regulations should be re-established,
if there is no other mode of raising a revenue less onerous to
the people of that country.—( Hear, hear.) The fact of their
having been abandoned does not constitute, in my mind, any
objection to their re-establishment.—(Hear, hear.) As I
said before, it would be unfortunate if our personal and party
conflicts prevented us from paying (Inc attention to the inter-
ests of that colony. If I wanted a motive for so treating those
interests, it would be furnished by sympathy for those who went
out thither expecting to find a prosperous home. Having said
this, I come to the particular motion of the Hon. Gentleman. I
come to that motion which was intended, according to the speech
of the Hon. Gentleman, to affix censure and condemnation on
my Noble Friend. I shall vote against the motion, because
the resolutions which the most competent judge of the affairs
of New Zealand, who has read more, and written more, with
respect to New Zealand than, I believe, any other man in ex-
istence—because those seventeen resolutions which he has pro-
posed have nothing better to encourage one to agree to them
than that they are admitted to be inapplicable to the state of
affairs in that colony. —( Hear, hear, and a laugh.) That
would be enough to make me determine to oppose them. Yes;
I admit there is one resolution which has a direct reference to
the case of New Zealand—that which declares that respect
should be paid to the treaty of Waitangi. Everybody says he
is ready to respect it ; but there is a great difference of opinion
as to the mode in which that treaty should be respected. —( A
laugh.) Bat the Hon. Gentleman intends his motion to be a
condemnation of any Noble Friend.—( Hear, bear.) Now, in
order that you may judge of the justice of these imputations
upon my Noble Friend, I want to recal your recollection to
the circumstances under which you were connected with New
Zealand at first. Your feelings then were very different.
There was a different impression on the public mind with
respect to colonial engagements eleven years ago, when your
relations with New Zealand began. In 1834 there had been a
strong feeling in Parliament and amongst the people of this
country, that England was justly chargeable with injustice in
its treatment of the aborigines. That was the prevaiiing feel-
ing in 1834. That public man, whose death has been sincerely
lamented by all who admire the devotion of great talents to the
cause of humanity—l mean Sir Fowell Buxton—in the year
1834 in this House moved an address to the Crown to this
effect—" That, deeply impressed with the duty of acting upon
the principles of justice and humanity in the intercourse, of this
country with the native inhabitants of its colonial settlements,
the House calls upon the crown to adopt different principles
from those heretofore acted upon in some of our colonial pos-
sessions." In 11136 a Committee was appointed at the instance
of that same Sir Fowell Buxton ; evidence was taken, and in
1837 a most full and able report was made. This is one obser-
vation in the report. The Committee say—" It might be pre-
sumed that the native inhabitants of any land had an incon-
trovertible right to their own soil—the plain and sacred
right which seems to have been understood in this coun-
try." In 1839 arose the question whether we should form
a new relation with New Zealand. Lord Normanby
was acting under the influence of that report. When
we say that Lord Normanby made an imprudent engage-
ment, that he wrote unwise dispatches, it is easy for
us to lay down those doctrines with regard to Lord Normanby
as you are now disposed to do with respect to the conduct of
Lord Stanley. But we do not remember what the public
feeling was in regard to our relation with the aborigines
which induced Lord Normanby in 1839 to act as he did. It
was under the influence of that feeling, in the spirit of which
the dispatches were written, that your relation with New Zea-
land was formed, and which now constitutes the difficulties
with which Lord Stanley has to contend. The first dispatch
which Lord Stanley wrote referred expressly—and I cite it as
a proof that what lam stating is correct—to the report of
your Select Committee, and your adoption of the principles of
that report, which had made a deep impression on the public
mind, with regard to the relations you should establish with
the aboriginal natives of any country in which you might
form a settlement. It is not the executive:Government,
but you who are responsible, then ; for you agreed to the ad-
dress to the Crown praying the Crown to protect the rights of
theaborigines ; you are responsible for the doctrines laid down
by the Committee.—( Hear.) Well, the question arose, shall
we establish a relation with New Zealand ; Lord Normanby
expressly referred to the report of the Committee.
Lord Normanby says:—" I have concurred with that Com-
mittee in thinking that the increase of national wealth and
power promised by the acquisition of New Zealand would be a
most inadequate compensation for the injury that must be in.
dieted on this kingdom itself by embarking in a measure essen-
tially unjust, and but too certainly fraught with calamity to a
numerous and inoffensive people, whose title to the soil and
sovereignty of New Zealand is indisputable, and has been so-
lemnly recognised by the British Government." You have
acknowledged New Zealand as a sovereign and independent
state. I think you were wrong in tint. —( Hear.) You acted
under impressions that were honourable and natural, but im-
pressions which induced you and the executive Government
to adopt a course not only calculated to weaken your authority,
but which was injurious to the natives themselves.—(Hear,
hear.) I think that it would have been infinitely better to
have commenced relations with New Zealand on the ground
of prior discovery than on the greund of cession on the part
of the chiefs. Ido not hesitate to say that the treaty
of Waitargi was most unwise for the natives themselves.
I think it would have been much better for us to have
asserted the right of sovereignty with the usual formalities,
rather than to have vteo accepted sovereignty by cession from
what took place in 1839—100 k to
the chiefs.
the instructions
wteore Ctoaptthaiin e
frHeootbs:o_n,,,
Nwehwo
Majesty's Zea lanci is independent, rhvoey
was to form the treaty,
The Queen, in common with her
. .
jects every intention to seti;c:ssiir, disclaims for herself and sub-
or to govern them as part of " the islands of New Zealand,
the dominions
unless with the free and intelligent consent of Great Britain,
pressed according to established the natives, ex-
Government have resolved to authorize to
obtained. The
aborigines for the recognition of herzeMY
aojeusty,straeoatth with the
the whole or any parts of those islands which the arm% over
willing to place under her Majesty's dominion." Ire, 3then,

. were instructions to Captain Hobson to accept a partial do-
minion from these chiefs ! Observe what Lord Normanby
says in his instructions to Captain Hobson. He says :
" These, however, are impediments to be gradually overcome
by the exercise, on your part, of mildness, justice, and perfect
sincerity in your intercourse with them (the natives. )
(Hear, hear.) You now profess to find that the mis ionaries
are inconvenient auxiliaries. What said Lord Normanby
to Captain Hobson ? He said,—" You will, I trust,
find powerful auxiliaries amongst the missionaries, who
have won and deserved the confidence of the people,
and among the older British residents, who have
studied their character and acquired their language."
—( Hear, Lear.) It is therefore rather hard to turn round
now, and after accepting the aid of the missionaries in esta-
blishing your authority, to denounce them as land-jobbers.—
(Hear, hear.) These methods obviated the dangers of the
acquisition of large tracts of country by mere land-jobbers; it
will be your duty to obtain by fair and equal contracts with the
natives the cession to the Crown of such waste lands as may
be progressively required for the occupation of settlers resort-
ing to New Zealand. There is, then, no claim here on the
part of the Crown to possession of the territory in consequence
of sovereignty, but Captain Hobson is merely directed to treat
with the natives, according as the wants of the settlers might
arise, for lands not actually enjoyed or occupied by them, but
for the waste lands of the islands, with the express admission
that those lands were of no value to the natives ; for Lord Nor-
manby proceeds:—" To the natives or their chiefs much of the
land of the country is of no actual use." Is it not clear
that Lord Normanby's instructions to Captain Hobson were to
take the lands, not by any prerogative of the Crown, but by
cession from the natives ? I now contrast the language you
hold now, with respect to these engagements, with the
language held then. The New Zealand Company state,
that with respect to these contracts they had always had
' serious doubts whether the treaty of Watonga, made with native
' savages, would be treated by lawyers otherwise than as a
praiseworthy device for amusing and pacifying savages. I be-
' lieve that there are a good many lawyers in the New Zealand
Company ; and this may be the language of lawyers ; and if
you hold this doctrine, you will vote for the resolutions of the
Hon. Gentleman, for they are founded on such a doctrine.—
(Hear, hear.) Jut what was the language of statesmen ? Was
' it that those engagements were a praiseworthy device for
' amusing and pacifying savages ?—( Hear.) The Noble Lord
opposite wrote to Captain Hobson as follows :—" Among the
many barbarous tribes with which our extended colonial em-
pire brings us into contact in different parts of the globe, there
are none whose claims on the protection of the British Crown
rests on grounds stronger than those of the New Zealanders.
They are not mere wanderers over an extended surface in search
of a precarious subsistence, nor tribes of hunters or of herds-
men, but a people among whom the arts of government have
made some progress ; who have established by their own customs
a division and appropriation of the soil ; who are not without
some measure of agricultural skill, and a certain subordina-
tion of ranks, with usages having the character and authority
of law. In addition to this, they have been formally recognised
by Great Britain as an independent State, and even in assuming
the dominion of the country this principle was acknowledged ;
for it is on the deliberate act and cession of the chiefs, on behalf
of the people at large, that our title rests." That was the
language held by statesmen. You must hear before you come
to the vote which the Hon. Gentleman asks you to adopt. Do
not transfer the responsibility to Lord Stanley. He is acting
in pursuance of your avowed intentions, and before you con-
demn you must hear the qualifications, reserves, and appre-
hensions with which the native chiefs entered into the treaty.
Observe what Captain Hobson says with respect to the forma-
tion of the treaty. He had appointed a levee to be held at the
house of Mr. Busby, at which the parties to this negotiation
were invited to be present. Captain Hobson says:—" Pre-
paratory to the meeting, I had appointed a levee to be held at
Mr. Busby's house, at eleven o'clock, to which I invited all the
principal European inhabitants, the members of the Chnrch
of England and Catholic missions, and ad the officers of this
ship, and was highly gratified to find that nearly every one
either here or in the neighbourhood favoured me with their
attendance I then read the treaty, a copy of
which I have the honour to inclose ; and in doing so, I dwelt
on each article, and offered a few remarks explanatory of
such passages as they might be supposed not to understand.
%Ir. H. Williams, of the Church Missionary Society, did me
the favour to interpret, and repeated in the native tongue,
sentence by sentence, all I said. When I bad finished read-
ing the treaty, I invited the chiefs to ask explanations on any
point they did not comprehend, and to make any observe •
tions or remarks on it they pleased. Twenty or thirty chiefs
addressed the meeting, five or six of whom opposed me with
great violence, and at one period with such effect,- and so
cleverly, that I began to apprehend an unfavourable impression
would be produced. Revewah, while addressing me, turned
to the chiefs and said, Send the man away; do not sign the
paper; if you do, you will be reduced to the condition of
slaves, and be obliged to break stones for the roads. Your land
will be taken from you, and sour dignity as chiefs will be de-
stroyed.' At the first pause Neni came forward and spoke with a
degree of natural eloquence that surprised all the Europeans,
and evidently turned aside the temporary feeling that had
been created. He first addressed himself to his own coun-
trymen, desiring them to reflect on their own condition, to re-
collect how much the character of the New Zealanders had
been exalted by their intercourse with Europeans, and how
impossible it was for them to govern themselves without fre-
quent wars and bloodshed; and he concluded his harangue by
strenuously advising them to receive us and to place confidence
in oar promises. He then turned to me and said, ' Yon must
be our father. You must not allow us to become slaves. You
must preserve our customs, and never permit our lands to be
wrested from us.' One or two other chiefs, who were favour-
able, followed him in the same strain, and one reproached a
noisy fellow named Kitigi, of the adverse party, with having
spoken rudely to me. Kitigi, stung by the remark, sprang for-
ward and shook me violently by the hand, and I received the
salute apparently with equal ardour. This occasioned amongst
the natives a general expression of applause, and a loud cheer
from the Europeans, in which the natives joined; and thus
the business of the meeting closed, further consideration of
the question being adjourned to Friday at 11 o'clock, leaving,
as I said, one clear day to reflect on my proposal." The conse-
quence was that the treaty was signed. These were the cir-
cumstances under which this inconvenient treaty was made ;
and I ask, will you commence your relations with the colony
by an abandonment of the obligations you have entered into ?
—( Hear, hear.) The Noble Lord said that he had been
charged with having formed a contract with the New Zealand
Company inconsistent with the treaty of Watonga. He was
particularly severe on those on this side of the House who had
preferred this charge against him ; but that was the very
charge that had been preferred against him within the last fort-
night by the New Zealand Company.—( Hear, hear.) It is
wrong, perhaps, to attribute to any particular writer the au-
thorship of a document signed by that Company ; but I think
it must have been written by the Hon. and Learned Gentleman
opposite (Mr. C. Buller). It states that it is impossible re-
concile the missionary system and that of the CompanyTthat
the missionaries and the Company proceeded on systems directly
opposed to each other, and that the treaty of Watonga was
based on the missionary principle, while Lord J. Russell
acted on the colonisation principle. The charge, there-
, fore, of acting inconsistently with the treaty of Wa-
tonga is not preferred by us, but by the Hon. and Learned
Gentleman who sits near the Noble Lord, and with whom the
Noble Lord says he is prepared to vote.—( Hear, hear.) Did
my Noble Friend (Lord Stanley) wish to act illiberally towards
the company ? His wish was, as the Company had not
established a claim to any land, or at least any sufficient
quantity of land, to assign to them all he could assign on a con-
ditional title, subject by other articles to a subsequent proving
of that title. With my Hon. Friend's impressions he could do
no more ; he said to the Company, " I will permit you
within certain limits to choose the land you require, on
the condition of a preferable claim being established
hereafter," the onus of establishing that claim being
thrown on the adverse party, and the right of pos-
session being given to this powerful Company. I leave
the House to judge if my Noble Friend can be justly
charged with harshness towards the Company. You may
censure him for his construction of the treaty of Watonga,
but it was a bow; fide and conscientious construction. He does
not admit the title of the natives to all the waste lands ; he ad-
mits an obligation on the part of the native chiefs to establish
their claim, but, unfortunately, no steps have been taken
towards doing it. The Noble Lord opposite speaks of the
registration as if it was like that of Yorkshire or Middlesex.
It is nothinr, of the sort. It is only to establish a valid title to
the land. But the real question is this—whether you think it
just, after the reference made to engagements entered into after
the instructions given by Lord Normsoby, and after the appro-
val of the Noble Lord opposite, you will now, by aairming these
resolutions, affix a censure on my Noble Friend, who has done
nothing mole, in my opinion, than maintain the honour
of the country, by respecting its engagements and carry-
ing into effect those opinions which, whatever may be the
doctrines you now hold, were the opinions of the House
of Commons ten years from this period. If the House of
Commons in contradiction to that course, and by a manifest
perversion of those doctrines maintained by the Committee on
the state of the aborigines, should now affirm that, the treaty
of Watonga enables the Crown to dispossess the chiefs of all
their land without full inquiry, you will lower the character of
the House in the estimation of all who respect fidelity to public
engagements.--(Laud cheers.) If you affix a censure on
my Noble Friend, you will pass a censure on one who
has not yielded to the influence of powerful parties, who
has not borne in mind that in this New 'Zealand Company
there are men high in character, and powerful in influence on
this side the House—who might have procured peace and re-
pose by yielding to applications from those powerful parties--
but who has thought it;his public duty, with a conscientious re-
gard to what is duc to the honour and good faith of this power-
ful country, to maintain inviolate the engagements which it had
contracted against the interests of the powerful and the strong,
but maintaining the guaranteed rights of the weak, the distant,
and the unprotected.—( Great cheering. )

PARLIAMENTARY BUSINESS.
FRIDAY, JUNE 21.

The following Bills were read a third time, and passel :
North Wales Railway.
North Woolwich Railway.
Eastern 'Union and Bury St. Edmund's Railway (No. 2).
Dundalk and Enniskillen Railway.
Waterford and Limerick Railway.
Glasgow, Paisley, Kilmarnock, and Ay: Railway (Cumnock
Branch).
Whitehaven and Furness Railway.

The Lords' Amendments to the following Bills were agreed
to :
Huddersfield and Sheffield Junction Railway.
Dunstable and London and Birmingham Railway.
Leeds and Bradford Railway Extension (Shipley to Coble).
Leeds, Dewsbury, and Manchester Railway.

The Epping Railway (No. 2) Bill was presented and read
a first time.

Cockermouth and Workington Railway Bill,—Report con-
sidered; amendments agreed to; clause offered, and amend-
ments proposed, and referred to the Select Committee on
Standing Orders.

Standing Orders Committee,—Resolutions reported ;
1. " That, in the case of the Great Southern and Western
Railway (Ireland) Bill, clause and amendment on considera-
tion of report, the clause for facilitating the collection of
dues' is of such a nature as may be entertained by the House,
if they shall think tit, provided the following proviso be
added Provided that nothing in this Act contained shall
give, or be construed to give, to the said body corporate any
such right of access or inspection, or any other right or pri-
vilege whatsoever, except for the purposes of collecting such
tolls as the said body corporate shall at the time of the pass-
ing of this Act be legally entitled to.'
" That the amendment to strike out the clause giving
power to vary tolls,' is of such a nature as may be enter-
tained by the -House, if they shall think fit."
2. "That in the case of the Londonderry and Coleraine
Railway Bill amendments on third reading, the amend-
ments are of such a nature as may be adopted by the House,
if they shall think fit, with the exception of those proposed
to clause 40, which ought not to be adopted by the House at
that stage."
3. " 'that. in the case of the Londonderry and Enniskillen
Railway Lill amendments on third reading, the amendments
are of such a nature as may be adopted by the House, if they
shall think fit."
Rep,,rt to tie on the table.

NOTICES GIVEN AT THE PRIVATE BILL OFFICE.
Edinburgh and Northern Railway,—Consideration of re-
port, Tuesday, June 24.
Epping Railway,—Second reaclirg, Monday, June .

Bristol and Gloucester Railway (No. 2) (Group YY.,—
Committee on Bill adjourned till Monday, June 23, at three.
Birmingham and Gloucester Railway (Worcester Branch
and Cheltenham Extensions) (Group F.),—Committee on
Bill. adjourned Lill Thursday, June 2G, at one.
Manchester South Junction and Altrincham Railway,—
Third reading, Monday, June 23.
Cornwall Railway,—Third reading, Monday, June 23.

L A.W INTELLIGENCE.
COURT OF QUEEN'S BENCH, June 19.
(Sittings at Nisi Prius, before Lord Chief Justice DENMAN.)