The Sun.
London, England, 1845-06-04 00:00:00

on the Crown, and would support the moth
Friend (Mr. Hume).
s • ;
Mr. P. HOWARD supported the motion, and attichhht data •
case of Sir H. Pottinger was one which might be taken out
of the hands of the general rule, without giving rise to any dan-
gerous results, and it would be much more satisfactory if this
vote appeared to come spontaneously from the Government
without atiy interference on his (Sir H. Pottinger's) part.
Mr. HUME then made a few observations in reply.
The motion was then agreed to, nemine contradicente.
BURDENS ON LAND.
Mr. WARD then rose to move the fallowing( motion, of
which he had some time given notice ;—For " a Select Com-
mittee to inquire whether there are any peculiar burdens
specially affecting the landed interest of this country, or any
peculiar exemptions enjoyed by that interest, and to ascertain
their nature and extent." If it were not for the aspect of then
House, which foreboded its premature dissolution, he thought
he might congratulate himself on the success of two motions
originating on that side of the House on which he sat. He had
generally been deserted when he brought forward any
agricultural question, by the agricultural Members of
that House and the Agricultural Protection Society,
but he thought, when they had no thirty-nine Members
to protect them, and when they saw that, eventually,
his motion most be brought forward, he should be sure of
their attention. The policy of the Government had yet a
butcreast
such
great deal to do, although they had done much which had
d ab
being
beneficial
fi
thee ielcaisnefl,uwenhcaet on the
agconditionrumentsofhatdhethpee7nleet;
for going further ?—( Hear, hear.) He (Mr. Ward) did not
appeal to principles which they on that side of the House
had, a priori, put forth, but to principles advanced by the
Government itself. It was true that the Government had, by
its tariff, taken off the duties on upwards of six hundred
articles, but they had left them on those articles which were
most important for the comfort and happiness of the pecule of
this country. He might be told that they on that s(P of
the House were always talking and riot doing. Why, in
his opinion talking was doing, and they were obliged to talk
for the sake of the character of the Right Hon. Baronet oppo-
site.—( A laugh.) His Hon. Friend the Member for Stock-
port was, in his opinion, as much a member of the Cabinet as
if he had a seat in it.—( Laughter.) His suggestions had, in
many instances, been acted upon, and even the Right Hon.
Baronet had admitted that his Hon. Friend, aided by high and
important sentiments and motives, had rendered important ser-
vices to the country.—( Hear, hear.) That proved that his
Hon. Friend was right, though the House voted against him.
—( Hear, hear.) He (Mr. Ward) believed that one of the
most important services he had rendered was the course that
he had pursued with respect to the Imports Committee. In
England land legislated for itself, which, he believed, was not
the case in any other part of Europe. In Austria and France the
monarch legislated for it. He was sorry to say that the
history of protection during the last session had been most
lamentable and laughable.—( Wear, hear.) It was known that
the Chancellor of the Exchequer would have a large surplus
this year, and the landlords of this country had shown a firm
determination to have a large slice of it.—(Laughter.) They
cried out continually against the policy of the Government,
and it had bees declared at Hertford that as much as six
millions had been taken by it from the agriculturists of the
country. One gentleman, at a meeting there, alluding to the
course that had been pursued by the Government, had, in the
words of the poet, said—
" That keen were their pangs ; but 'twas keener far to feel,
They'd nursed the pinion that impelled the steel."
—( Laughter.) The Hon. Member proceeded to refer to a
meeting which had lately been held in Essex on the subject of
agriculture. The Tower of Babel was nothing to this meeting
in point of unanimity. The parties who had attended this
meeting did not know by whom they had been called and for
what they had been called. Was it not time to have done with
those sort of meetings? After all, the one question only had to
be considered, and that was, bad the land any peculiar burdens?
If it had, let them grant the Committee which he then sought.
What was the use of postponing it for another session? They
could not do so beyond that time, it must come at last. Was
there stability in the present system? Could Hon. Gentlemen
opposite depend upon the continuance of the present corn.
laws ? Why, principles opposed to those of protec-
tion were gaining ground every day on the opposite
side of the House. The Noble Lord the Member for
Pontefract had lately said that he, as a landlord, did not fear a
repeal of the corn-laws. What was it that justified the con-
tinuance of the corn-laws? If anything, it must be peculiar
burdens upon agriculture. Where were those burdens?
Point them out—this was all he asked. Lord Abinger, when
Mr. Scarlet, said that land paid all the rates of the country,
or at least in the ratio of four to one. The Hon. Member
for Norfolk had said the land paid all the poor-rates, and the
Hon. Member for Somersetahire paid'one-half of the income-
tax. If all this were true, why not have a Committee before
which the truth of these statements could be probed? He
found, upon reference to the returns, that the land paid
1,323,3231. to the income-tax, while the trades and professions
paid 1,466,0001., being a difference of 143,0001., or that
amount paid by trades and professions above the amount paid
from land. The Hon. Member then read from the reports
of the Poor-law Commissioners, to show that the land bad
gradually fallen off in the last twenty years in its
contribution to the poor-rates, while the amount
from other sources had largely increased.—(Hear, hear.)
He would inquire why every householder in London should
pay the poor-rates, the window-taxes, the police-rates, and
other taxes, when it was proposed to amerce them in a Con-
solidation Fund Bill. Before you can do this a police magis-
tracy must be established under the inspection of the Secretary
of State for the Home Department. But, supposing there
might be some little disparity in the result of the Committee's
deliberations to which he trusted the present matter might be
referred. He then alluded generally to the duties paid on
horses, horses let out for hire, sheep-dogs, and other matters
connected with the agricultural interest, and showed that the
reduction on the duties from 1816 to 1834 amounted to
34,000,0001. Now he would inquire, where were the duties
on land? Taking every manufacturing district, including the
iron and the cotton localities, it appeared that
they were creating produce without having any tax placed on
their industry. If the balance were struck, with land in one
scale for a duty on corn, the balance would be vastly in favour
of the public.—( Hear.) Agriculture cannot at present find a
single individual to advoca'e its exclusive interests, and any
man placed in office on the Board of Trade alto a short interval
invariably came out as a free trader.—( Hear.) If the Mike of
Newcastle should write another letter on the matter of free-
trade with a view to ulterior advancement, he was just as likely
to be elected the Pope as Premier.—(A laugh.) The Right
Hon. Baronet had stated his opinion generally, he meant to per-
severe in the determination of producing free-trade, though he
should lose the support of his agricultural friends, and he (Mr.
Ward) could not see why the Right Honourable Gentleman
should object to his motion. The party of the Right Hon.
Baronet came forward and requested his party to assist them
in cheapening clothes, food, and other articles connected with
the comfort of the public, and why should not the Right Hon.
Gentleman come forward and assist him in the attempt to
equalise commercial duties? He was perfectly confident as to
the result of his motion, and even if his hopes should be disap-
pointed, he would leave the decision to the country.
The question was then put from the Chair.
Mr. SIDNEY HERBERT complimented the Honourable
Member who had just sat down for the good humour
he had shown in bringing forward his motion. He held
that his argument, that the agricultural interest of this
country possessed advantages over other countries, could not.
be maintained, as there were burdens on the proprietors of
land in this country which did not exist in any other. The
manufacturing districts were now in a state of great prosperity,
and there was a greater demand for hands than could be satis-
fied. With respect to emigration from those districts, he con-
sidered that the poor-rates were heavy, because, when em-
ployment was scarce, they would rather avail themselves of
those rates for awhile than emigrate. After glancing at other
topics in the Hon. Gentleman's speech, he said he deprecated
the repeated discussion of subjects of no practical utility, and
which, after all, were speculative, and on which the majority
of the House had formed their opinion, especially to the ex-
clusion
of subjects of great importance to the country. The
debate on the resolutions submitted to the House by the Noble
Lord the Member for the City of London had, he thought,
given an ample opportunity for the discussion of the subject in-
volved in the motion of the Hon. Gentleman. He considered
that the motion would not lead to any useful result, and trusted
that the House would not adopt it. In addition to this, be did
not think it was the proper moment to take up the time of the
House by having a Committee sitting on propositions on which
the House had formed its opinion ; and when the agricultural
interest had not the slightest wish to have an
to
of the measures
proposed by her Majesty's Government modified,
Theyi had n
apprehension, if they would onlygive them fair play.
dmatter
investing their capital in improving their land, and as a
of course employing additional labourers, and endeavouring to
overcome the difficulties under which they were labouring.
Mr. COBDEN considered that the Hon. Gentleman who
had just sat down had not given a very distinct opinion on the
questions which had been submitted to the House by the Hon.
Gentleman the Member for Sheffield (Mr. Ward). He had
never listened
for half-an-hour to a speech eo difficult of
comprehension. The question before that House was whether
tithes were not a burden on both the landlord and the farmer,
and whether the landowners contributed more to the support
of the poorer classes than other portions of the community.
With respect to a statement made by the Hon. Member for
Essex, in reference to Messrs. Storr and Mortimer, to show
the difference in the poor-rates paid by landowners and manu-
facturers, he begged to say that if the manufacturers did not pay
poor-rates on their capital, neither did the farmers. Now he
could not tell whether the Right Hon. Gentleman who spoke
last maintained the highway and county-rate were burdens
upon land or not. Let him, however, go and make inquiries
amongst shopkeepers about the local taxotion imposed on that
class of tradesmen, and he (Mr. Cobden) would venture to predict
the amount of taxation imposed on them would be found to be
not very considerably less than that imposed on landlords, far.
mers, and landholders. —(Hear, hear.) But even if the land-
holder paid all the poor-rates of the country, he did not believe
their so-called protection, however much it might be increased,
would be of any benefit to them, because it was an obstacle to
trade. It impeded the progress of commerce, and did more
harm to the agricultural interest than all the taxes and local
burdens put together.—( Hear.) How then could this sort of pro-
tection be a compensation for the peculiar exclusive or pecuniary
burdens the landowner had to sustain? He was glad therefore
to see that every day they were coming not only on hist, but on
the other side of the House, to a better understanding en this
subject, and the farmer and the manufacturer were beginning
to feel that they had one common interest in putting an end to
this baneful system of protection. Hen. Members were fond
of quoting Mr. M'Culloch on this subject. Now, for
his own part, he was prepared to assert that Mr.
M'Culloch had never added a single new idea upon
political economy. His statistical information was
certainly valuable, but his works upon political economy were
merely commentaries on Adam Smith, and, like the corn.
mentators on Shakspcare, rendered that obscure which bad been
clear before.
Mr. NEWDEG AT E denied that protection was either the
bane er curse of agriculture, and expressed a hope that Go-
vernment would not withdraw its remaining support from that
interest. Tithes, he thought, were an exclusive burden upon
land, and, taking all the other burdens on land together, be
estimated them at twelve millions per annum. It was clear,
therefore, that if they removed the present meagre protection
afforded to agriculture, it would be quite impossible for either
the landlord or tenant to contribute his share to make up this
amount of taxation. They thought that this country should
be independent of foreign countries. They did not wish to see
the food of this country made a matter of exchange or specu-
lation. He did not wish to delay the House, but he made
these few observations because the Hon. Member for Shef-
field gave them some individual instances of particular hard-
ship. He thought it his duty, on that account, to submit
those few statements to the notice of the House.—(Cheers.
Mr. V. SMITH sold that he regretted that the Secretary
at-War had refused this Committee. He was of opinion that
the burdens on land, and other descriptions of property, were
pretty equally balanced. When the Right Hon. Gentleman
the Secretary-at-War spoke of the returns of the Commis-
sioners which were laid on the table of the House, he forgot
that there was a more favourable report made, which was
quite unattended to. Did any man know the amount of taxa-
tion in the country ? The general taxation was found to be
fifteen millions, and the local taxation was ten millions, so that
the local taxation was two-
thirds of the general taxation. He
believed that the rate-payers were perfectly ignorant of the
reasons why they paid rates, but they paid it on account of the
manner in which it was imposed upon them. The Right Hon.
Gentleman then enumerated the different rates which were
made. Could, he would ask, anybody imagine greater confu-
sion than arose from different rates made for similar
results ?—( Hear, bear.) The greater part of the out..

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