The Sun.
London, England, 1842-05-25 00:00:00

CARRIAGES.

The Earl of RIPON said that a Noble and Learned
Lord opposite had put a question to him a few evenings
ago, to which he was not at the time able to give an
answer. The question was whether the practice of
locking the doors on both sides of railway carriages,
which was attended with such disastrous consequences
on the railway near Pd is, pevailed upon the railways
in this country. He (Lord Ripon) had made inquiries,
and he found that, with .the exception of the Great
Western Railway, there were no Railway Directors who
locked the carriages on both sides, although some of
them did lock a door on one side, leaving the other un-
locked. Feeling that thiS was a most dangerous practice,
and that it migh t lead to the moat deplorable consequences,
as in the recent accident in France, he (Lord IL) referred
to the Inspector-General of Railways, inquiring whether
the practice was necessary, ,or what was the object of it ?
To this that gentleman answered that it was a most dan-
gerous
and unnecessary practiee, and ought to be dis-
continued. Accordingly he (the Earl of Ripon) wrote
to the Directors of the Railway recommending that the
practice should be discontinued. This was the utmost
interference the laws at present allowed the Government
to make ; but he had reason to believe that the sug-
gestion would be acted upon.
Lord CAMPBELL was sure that the House and the
country would receive the communication of the \oble
Earl with satisfaction, even though his Noble and
Learned Friend on the Woolsack, had travelled several
hundreds of miles on railways, without accident, or thu
apprehension of danger.
BRISTOL AND GLOUCESTER RAILWAY BILL.
This Bill was read a second time.
TIIE TARIFF.

Earl HARDWICKE presented several petitions from
some places in Cambridgeshire a°ainst that portion of
the tariff which related to the duties on canary, carra-
way, and mustard seed: •
DUTY- ON CATTLE.
The Duke of RICHIAO,ND presented petitions from
Kiri:llllcliael, and other places in Banff, praying
the House not to pass the tariff without giving. proper
protection to the agricultural interests, more particularly
as referred to the importation of live stock. He very
much•regrettkil that his Noble Friend had not paid some
attention to what he stated yesterday, and on previous
occasions; relative to the agricultural interests ; he viewed
with a great deal of anxiety the great changes which had
been made in the tariff, inasmuch as the proposed
alterations could not be of benefit to, but must
very much injure the agriculturists. He was sure that
farmers did not wish for their own aggrandisement
at the expense of other classes of the community ; but
he was
,afraid that this running from one extreme to
another would cause the lowering of wages to a great
extent, and that much misery and distress must neces-
sarily be entailed on that very valuable class of people,
the agricultural laboureri.
The Earl of RIPON said he was of opinion that the
proposed alteration in the tariff would not at all affect
the interests of the agriculturists either one way
or the other. He spoke on this subject from a
very considerable experience in the matter. He
remembered at the time when the market was
about to be opened to the admission of cattle from
Ireland, great fears were entertained by his constituents,
and representations to that effect were made to him ; he
did not apprehend anything from it himself, and he told
them so at the time, and the result had proved that he
was correct in his ideas. His reason for making this
alteration in the tariff was because it was impossible
to maintain a prohibition upon any principle that
could be understood.—(Hear, hear.) it was considered
necessary, looking at the . daily increasing population,
that some means should be taken to prevent food from
rising too high, without inflicting great injury on the
agriculturists. Then the quarters whence cattle could
be exported to England were only two, viz. a portion of
the kingdom of Denmark.(the Duchy of Holstein), and
a portion of the kingdom of Holland. In France, and
in the German League, comprising a population of
2600,000, meat was imported because it had arisen to so
high &price; when, therefore, it was considered that there
would be 91,030,000 of people, all competiting to obtain
this small quantity of cattle which could be expected

front these two places which he had mentioned, he cer-
tainly did- not think that the effect would be very great;
he thought the difference in the price would be very
small, and certainly it would not affect the agriculturists.
The Duke of RICHMOND said he was opposed to all
}inhibitions, but he should like to know on what ground
this alteration had been proposed. His Noble Friend said
that. he did not think the proposed alteration would make
meat much cheaper. IVby then should this panic be
raised throughout the whole country, if no good were to
result from it ? He knew that in many parts of the
country considerable reductions had been made in the
wages of labourers, in consequence of the alterations in
the Tariff and the Corn-laws ; and yet they
were told that this change, which had been so
much relied on, would do them no good at all.
Although he knew that his opinions were of little weight,
he thought it his duty to state his views ; and after the,
division'which took place in another place, he would re-
commend the farmers nor; to despair, but to reconcile
themselves to the belief that there was no danger.
Earl FITZ\VILLIAM did not think it was his
province to attempt to reconcile the different parts of the
tariff with one another. But he must say that he heard
with great satisfaction the speech of the Noble Earl op-
posite, and also that of the Noble Duke (Richmond),
who both disclaimed being the advocates of prohibition,
although, in his judgment, what they, called protection
was in reality prohibition. Indeed, it -win protection
only so far as it was prohibition. He was glad to find it
acknoWledged that the farmers had not much to appre-
hend from the reduction of the price of corn, and if that
%ere true as to corn, it was true, a fortiori, of cattle. It
was known that France did not produce enough for her
own consumption, and imported both corn and cattle.
But what did the French graziers do ? They had the
address to obtain what they called "protection " against
the competition of German cattle. Now mark the recoil
in this case. The effect was to shut out French produce
almost entirely from Germany. He repeated that it
gave him great satisfaction to hear the Noble Lords dis-
claim the doctrine of prohibition.

The Duke of RIO-1110ND said he had never been
an advocate for prohibition, nor for more protection than
was necessary for the English farmer, so long as he was
subjected to taxation from which the farmers of other
countries were exempt.
Lord KINNAIRD agreed with his Noble Friend (the
Earl Fitzwilliam) in his satisfaction at hearing the Noble
Lord opposite, and the Noble Duke on the cross-
benches, disclaim the advocacy of prohibitory duties.
Indeed, after what he had just heard, he did not despair
to see the Noble Earl opposite bringing in a Bill to
repeal the Corn-laws altogether.—(Hear, hear, and
much laughter.) In fact, it would not be long before it
would become indispensable to do something of the kind,
for corn was rising up to 80s., and in two or three weeks
it would reach the price that would bring the duty down
to ls. 'ln the meantime the distress of the people was
so great that her Majesty had been advised to have a
begging letter read in the churches for their relief.

The Earl of RIPON was understood to say he knew
nothing about it.
Lord KINNARD had beard it read in a church in
Yorkshire. It was strange that her Majesty's Ministers
should know nothing about it. However, as there were
various opinions as to the existence and extent of the
distress—some going so far as even to deny that there
was any diStress at all, and the Queen declaring that it
was most piteous and extensive—and as that House did
very little business, except passing bad laws and throw-
ing out good ones—he gave notice that on Thursday
week he would move for a Select Committee to inquire
as to the causes and extent of the distress of the people.
The Duke of RICHMOND said he was much surprised
at what his Noble Friend had said ; he remarked that
the only good of this house was in throwing out good
measures and passing bad ones.—(Hear, and laughter.)
He would only refer to one more remark which had
fallen from his Noble Friend. He had heard of the
Scotch farmers not being the best in the world, but he
certainly was not aware that they malted their barley
before.—(Laughter.) He (the Duke of Richmond) was
prepared to vindicate the character of their Lordships'
House, and he did think it would be well if the Noble
Lord would turn his attention a little more to agricul-
tural pursuits before he spoke upon the subject.
Lord KINNAIRD explained.
PROPERTY TAX.

The Duke of RICHMOND presented a petition from
the farmers of a place in the county of Ross, praying
that their profits should not be calculated from the
amount of rent which they paid, in arriving at their in-
come for the purposes of the property-tax.
Earl FITZWILLIAM said he thought the amount
of rent paid by the farmers was a very poor criterion by
which to calculate their profits. With regard to wages
falling, to which a Noble Lord had referred a short time
ago, he did not think that was owing to the alteration in
the Corn-laws, but rather to the present state of the ma-
nufactures of the country.
TURNPIKE ROADS (IRELAND) BILL.
On the motion of Lord REDESDALE this Bill was
read a second time.

THE QUEEN'S BEGGING LETTER.
Lord KINNAIRD gave notice that he should move
for a copy of the letter to which he had before referred.
The Duke of WELLINGTON said he thought the
Noble Lord had better be certain that a letter had been
written before he moved for it.—(Laughter.)
Lord COLBORNE said he had heard the letter read
in chapel last Sunday.
The Duke of WELLINGTON said, Very well, he
had no objection to the Noble Lord moving for any let-
ter he pleased.
Lord4KINNAIRD then gave notice that he should
move for the production of the letter on Thursday next.
Their Lordships then adjourned.

HOUSE OF C(551.1104N5, May 24.
The SPEAKER took the Chair at Five minutes to Four
o'C luck.

INCOME TAN.
Mr. LOCI HART presented a petition from the I►;-
eorpnrated Trades' Society of Glasgow in favour of the
Property-tax, and expressing approbation of the measure
of the Government.
FAVERSHAM NAVIGATION BILL.
_ _

The Faversham Navigation Bill was read a third time,
and passed.

HAI)DINGTON ROADS BILL.

Mr. SCARLETT brought up the Report on the Had
dington Roads Bill.

Mr. H. JOHNSON opposed the reception of the Re-
port, and moved that it be taken into consideration that
day six months.
Sir THOMAS HEPBURN supported the Bill.
Mr. MACKENZIE objected to the measure.
After a short discussion, strangers were ordered to
withdraw, and the House divided, when the numbers
were—

For the motion

Against it

• Majority against the motion
LEEDS IMPROVEMENT BILL.
Mr. BECKETT moved—" That the Select Committee
on Petitions for Private Bills, to whom the petition pray-
ing that additional provision may be made in :he Leeds
Improvement Bill (presented on the 20th of May) is re-
ferred, have leave to sit and proceed on Thursday next."
After a few words from Mr. tsc URT, the motion
was agreed to.
LIVERPOOL IMPROVEMENT BILL.
This Bill was read a third time.
STOCKTON AND HARTLEPOOL RAILWAY

-38

BILL.
This Bill was read a second time.
BRIGHTON ELECTION.
The SPEAKER stated to the House that the examiner
of recognizances had reported that the sureties entered
into for the prosecution of the petition, complaining of an
undue return for the borough of Brighton, were unob-
jectionable.

NOTICES OF MOTION.
Colonel WYNDHAM gaVe notice that, in Committee
on the Parish Constables Bill, he should move, on clause
6 being proposed, that schoolmaSters be exempted from
serving as parish constables ; and on clause 7, that
gamekeepers be disqualified from serving as parish con-
stables. The Hon. Member also gave notice that in the
Committee on the Poor-law Amendment Bill, he should
move that clause 6, enacting the dissolution of the Gil-
bert Unions, without the consent' of the Guardians, be
expunged.—(Cheers.) • • -• • - •
' Viscount MAHON gave notice that, on Thursday the '
od of June. he should call the attention of the House to:
the statements contained in the petition which he had.
presented yesterday, on the state of the law regulating.
dramatic entertainments. He begged to move that the
petition of Douglas Jerrold, Esq., james Sheridan
Knowles, Esq., and others, presented on the 23d May, be
printed with the Votes.—Agreed to,
ELECTION COMMITTEES.
The NOBLE LORD also gave notice that, in the event
of any motion • being made to renew the Act for the
trial of Controverted Elections, which would expire at
the end of the present Session, he should take the sense
of the House on the propriety of those tribunals being
composed of Members of Perl iamen heering.)
Sir JOHN WALSH said that he should move that
it be an instruction to the Committee appointed to
consider of the compromises alleged to have taken place
with regard to the petitions presented against the returns
for Nottingham, Harwich, Penryn and Falmouth, Lewes,
and Reading, and also of the bribery alleged to have
taken place at those elections ; that they do inquire only
if such compromises had been entered into.
NEW WRIT FOR MEATH.

_ .
Mr. O'CONNELL said that he had to inform the
House that he had been elected to serve in Parliament
for the county of Cork, and also for the county of Meath.
He made his election to serve for the county of Cork ;
and he therefore moved that the Speaker do issuehis writ
for a fresh election for the county of Meath.—Agreed to.
DUTIES ON VEGETABLES.
Mr. G. PALMER gave notice that on the discussion
of the tariff he should move, that it is not expedient to
alter the rates of duties at present payable on the im-
portation of foreign vegetables; and that it is unjust in
point of principle, to take that protection from those
articles of British produce which was aczorded to other
articles.,

BOROUGH OF SOUTHAMPTON.
Mr. MACKINNON gave notice, that on Thursday
next he should move that a new writ be issued for the
borough of Southampton.
AFFAIRS OF INDIA.
Sir R. PEEL said that an Hon. Friend of his, the
Member for Inverness-shire, had given notice that on
Thursday next he should move for the production of
certain official information in reference to the affairs of
the North West of India. In the present state of oiii-
cisl information as to the affairs of Afghanistan, he
(Sir Robert Peel) was not prepared to promise
the papers required, and he could not help expressing a
hope that his lion. Friend would, on public grounds,
consent to postpone the discussion.
Mr. IL J. BAILLIE made some brief observation,
which was perfectly inaudible in the gallery.
CAPTAIN ELLIOT.
Sir R. PEEL said, the Hon. Member for Montrose had
sometime since put a question to him respecting the nth-.