The Sun.
London, England, 1842-06-14 00:00:00

'‘`.."t4e}-thrrn

uUt or employment a great number of
'is %vim would-not be able to turn to any other business.
114r.,GLALSTONE raid the Government proposition
14,d been-made without any regard to the local eireum-
stutes of the island a :Forth.% It was founded upon
4recthe supply- of an article in- great demand, and
"us made with rekrenee to the amount of proteilion
"illy required by British interests. 'I he ariide upon
lvhieh the-duty was levied was in the rudest possible
rent :
; it was the block of stone as thrown out of the
earth, before any smoothing or dressing had been applied
it.. Tile duty of 2s. per ton was equivalent -to ten per
cent. ad valorem. • The Hen. Gentleman opposite asked 1
for mere than the parties themselves.
11r. FIUME said the question was one afi'ecting the
proprietors. He had understocd,in the first instance,
that the (overarm at intended to pro'. ose a duty of Is.
PiT. ton,- and he iv as.srrprised to find that they had made it Qs.

M -GI kES"-ON- •
r• -1 • e Leta atad that the proposition was that
that stone erthewn should he duty free ; if in blocks or
}oared, the duty should be 2s. ; cad if hewn, 10s.; in-
stead of 2
0s . . which was the present duty.
a.l-Ir. J. I% BARES,-after a few observations, withdrew
his ntot len. .
GL:
schedule 17 being put, relating to coffee, cocoa,
ten and tol.ecco .g
Lind -110\'''I;`K rose to make the motion, of which
he,t.- . ' -
~. 'aft given notice, that the duty on foreign coffee
;'111.310d be
_reduced from Sd. to 7d. per rowel. The
at,e consumption of toffee bed inert ase d of late years,
tl a
•.e.sueply from the colonies bi hag iitauffieient, the
tictis,equence WIIS that fereign coffee at a Lieber rate of
e '
13 entered largely into consumption. The difference
the amount of duty- payable on British and foreign
• ewe was a bounty to the growers in the colunies. The
ilkirt H
.n- en. Gentleman proposed a duty of 4d. on coke
ace- le6lree, and-of Bd. on foreign coffee. Ile held in his
:,' it statement that Jamaica ceffee of the new Cr.,l)
fic'e 1.'11,,(!)-1, -"11.41; at it price varying.ilrom 112 s. to I Iss.
ee4ii`-"we a hile Cuba coffee of a simian. description was
lei bond at from 78s. to SBs., the difference being
Ottie e
ee, ted on the British consumer ; that nits to say, lb-
ee''Xt eofTee wit.s•Made to pay a, duty of 100 per cent `on
„7 \ alue of the article, ana a differential duty as coma
tut4e,t-•' with colonial coffee. of 50 per cent. But
w•ltb. retard to coffee of an inferior description, the case
Ne'lts worse. A corespondent of his told him that he pur-
eo444Bl.- Domingo coffee in bond at 345. sd. the cwt.,
ceite British:coffee Of the same description brought from
7,5. to 70s. Now--the Government imposed- a duty of
,i-'. 41. on the coffee at 345. 5d., thus levying an amount
t 23° per cent, on the value of the crock, and a. differ-
ential, duty of 115 per cent. (Hear, hear.) .- For what
lit'as this amount of duty levied '.?lt could not be said that
b was for the purpose of discouraging the :lava:evade,
i'cause umeh of the euffae came ft tbe .Eastern-lhemis-
Iner
t e and Hayti, with which, if the desire to put a step
-!'ille have trade was real, it would be neressaryate en-
e°s, ur4ge friendly relations. It eculd not be said that it
4 4 for the interest of their colonies, bee use it was evi-
071ft from the concessions of her Majesty's Government,
iseattli'i,;his enormous protection was
.not always to be
„n ea:anted, and no time was more favourable for reduce
gee-e- -61 the duty than the present. Another
a.e..._:eef this great protection was, that it gave
'l4:`'' kTnatUral stimulus to the growth of cof-
xilieeYY•7. which the colonists would .themselves
a=lb' lb did not believe that the reduction of
.Id.
teta-maJuld be resisted on the ground of its reducing
thi rt"vtalte. The total quantity of coffee consumed in
i.f cannitry was 28i million pounds, and the reduction
teta Ide Ni
time prposed, would amount to 180,0001.;
'lieuthe reduo oft the revenue would only take place
smaller quantity. namely, on 10,849,0001 b., the pro-
eee of foreign countries, and would amount to only
,iiee•r4)s lie was persuaded that the increased censump-
0WP44(1 compensate to the revenue for a reduction of
10i,-„ut.Y. Besides, under the present system, an adul-
a anen in coffee took place t, pa
very great extent. It
;I:llcareel that the annual consumption of coffee amounted
es;-,?2,00011)., tied with that was mixed up no less than
rsenlb. Of chicory and other substances. For his pert
Aaj.„;t-111 - have wished to have r«luced the duty upcn
4:l,tigt comae to 6d., and upon British coffee to 3d. Belt,
Aujetts apprehensive that that plan would meet, with too
lerg . °PPosition, on the. ground of the less to the
aesei-u• • Under these circumstances he now proposed
laa
ction •of one penny er pound apen foreign coffee.
.vv-ittisbi :,11.1(1. move, therefore,e that the blank be filled-tip
.:,
whir',ti, instead of Bd. , -
.
CLADsTONE; . said,- that ' he did -not- ftleatv:ktikl
-oth:d, that the duties to'be-levied- upen.eoffee-bfititthr
Ciney'r the Products of tropical climates, were recon-
vete-,le with the ordinary principles of trade. . The Gc-
to di„ei tlid notpropose-te add in, any way, Eiut rather :
eekelultsh the protectlon at 'present - given to BritishT
tee.tiai cuff
e,
e The question arose, w by., was ilicepsole
eetelea kept up-.substantialln and, bp would,mily, asit..the,
(,bs'lerilittee to follow up the- principle-ewhich-they lad
it .. 'led fu tither articles ol' our conmerc, eenefleouslit
in:" pen 'Sible fur -Una Gverione4 6 :-ItkilUf§t.,lll6:ternis.
teas et:lllPiler.cial fre_aty- with the crupire"Ofeßratil:''lhat
the ",,, e blijectitin which was made to •t of
Dart,' üb,l.e. Lords. •Wli jell,- WO UItIFIWWW:Pg44II2I '
sq t ee- perk¢4 - " a alga el a-e - '', s eran-a-ee
the r' iIUAIE %veiz-g lad that ilteXink.,o4.otAlgtn*%i:Pfir
4141'11.'1"W met:sure ipon, such , ground, Ivbielk-coo:
i 1,,,,;- its'eharacter:- But lie believed the, How Gentles,
143. "48 Placing the consumer's in-a-worse-position:than,
.141t1(i-re in berore Be,-;des. in alit* oflffiriancial-diffi-r:
tzt:Z z"e. waS about. to' 'take froth' the ethisumerfotire-
sk,, ur the Exchequer, and four-pence rnoiv,fpr the-
ofinen the: colonists. Cheap coffee amid cheap
inabea.r would have the - tendency to encourage sober
T-174, ~4,ll,negst the people, and to fill the Exchequer. .
dal l''' PEEL did not altogether exclude the question
!feret::-.r3' from this question: But then it was to be re-
Pleee JO, that although the cultivation of coffee took
.:flip: it) slave labo-4, yet it was also much lighter than
.44 le t'ti sl!gar.. - roll also felt the force of the argument
1)1,,e ,t
4`le Ine of: eeaas a` substitute for Spirits ; and
te,llvt pbserve that the amount of duty. which he pro
.IV2ltt TC" Ipts- than what Was proposed in 1840 by the
lif:Cee l'unoura.ble Gentleman opposite. The proposal
;hit ra,telion. Gentleman was the difference of sd. per lb..
tiilei-;at"e Government. was 4d. In dwelling on the
'lktat er'e of dealing with the cheapest markets, they
Piril.,,`"leallAr that they were not dealing with philoso-
r)Sed b Ile hoped, therefore, that the present duty pre-
' ed; ''''ttllilneurt 1‘
i ai• 7 tcv 'st
Government
concessions ,
kv.,,ntri.s.
I,‘froura,outlhde nßortazhielsaol;
• e,, ee,e,ei
... equia a.en •
ileity'• 13. ILA:WES said that wherever there was a
'"itlt,ti:"ding, there the duties *ere quite unsettled.
:ret they could hope, tO influence foreign countries
Itrit the principles of free trade ; though they might
'taw, ILd the principles of philosophers, they had
.111eee,7('Illee the principles of practical men.
callae K, mite-
present an enormous quantity of coffee, so
the re' e°ll4tned in this country, which did not appear in
liii.th alone at all, chicory and other things being mixed
Ishele genuine article. There were largo esta-
nle,e 4,t4 in London for the express purpose of
'.(411,1141 t'llg, coffee. The effect of lowering_ the duty
~,1/41111t eto abolish, to a great extent, the practice of
s"L tZer4et.iult... He did not believe that the reduction from
Vie would be a benefit totthe consumer ;he thought
- eel ,
.1t54,t. 3r parties benefited would be those engaged in the
r'eb 141 trade. ,
11") v RlNGsaid ho thought they ought to set an
rt. :pl, . ...,. ,
4C140, '0 „France,
pionowering the duty on French pro-
I‘i-t4 ',l' 11l hisloy, such a curse if followed out,
thor,'esN'eet t( tree and otherthan caonuntrtilcesa,fv:souNlld.hidcho :
0414 Lu -benefit this
'lte've,aed for that etountryose
Purpose.-(Hear,
hear.)
°t* ,1.1."'• T. 1324.R.1NG ..Pwuortfld s.upport the proposition
.14 b '
tlulqrn :N° le kriend in preference to that of the
~..4„, went.
th kt'VII L
-q. No , - lERS would support the proposition of
44ste • ‘4e le iel h
t -.liar "-, because it recognised the principle of li
'lts() IN the duty. He could ilot understand the
tio,4tS,4l.7rth-° Government in maintaining this differential
,t °n
for the purpose- of negotiation. Now he
utS at L'e hest mode of negotiation was to reduce the
le, a t• he
and Set agood example to other countries.
btlitlr "WICK said before they went to a division he
opticut help expressing his satisfaction at th prospect
i,, tein",)rrnous differential duty which now existed
e_l' the ,F Illaintained. With respect to retaining the duty
igetseriroesent for the purpose of arriving at an amicable
,ialtee 11, he thought with the Hon. Member for
4...' leed 'taunt this system was bad in itself, and not likely
he CoanY practical good.
•• . 11,Irrittee then divided, when there appeared,
, se `-'l' the amendment
'ikla.i ri:ll,tainst it
till'Larni) slt against Lord Ho wick's proposition -33
141ist I 4.N1)0N rose to move that the stock of nae
elvarene Leeoffee in bord, as well as that on the way,
'l%t, shall -arrive on or before the Ist day of August
1,1,,,e,4,13,51:11 be
-adnaitted at the same differential duty that
1:- the d
ith between it and British Plantation coffee ; Viz.,
•as 4) 'tY en British plantation coffee be reduced from
34 - 4d• 1)(T lb
ei ontn ail, a tin! duty on-the naturaliSed coffee now
,gust nekt, shall be
43' of At, u tbat which shall arrive on or before the Ist
Ilt duff reduced from 9d., the pre-.
, h, to 7d. ~, • •
)4 v . (7.1-4.11) ,
~p(
vr i ie.
ell-Thl'e fil'eci t: 81 UNE attributed the present depression
Wes, net -raue, not to the proposed alteration in the
tilpl'4 ill rs.the enormous quantity which had been im7
tb t` es "9, when the coffee duties and a few ether
1_11314e. ere'e, slogled out to be sub'ected to the effect of
-•''ril 1 1" eh • 4 think
li -tad angc• He did not that the Noble
te4,llsecleevillsasclee. out Sufficient grounds for the proposition
natl,lnfesi
e.eu , the inconvenience whic4 certain parties
4..`,., ii , ci.,_,'4.?uld be the result of their own over specu-
elilit eatsuucal- e),ri the one hand the price of coffee did fall,
ef;tt,r,iithlioseNlNl,er for
mute . eulated 2d a pound, on the other hand the
l'ikae Ni°ll would' *
tbheesfoalmuunclpiriinceer.eased as to recom-
Isiii-11.0 ae, ebielCLii: supported. the moed proposition
at_olo. ord the Member for Liverpool (Lord
tf -l) -
h . . . .
''oble t 'T
Ar aa °r(l'sapnrcloplkorsirt.ioni.. PHiLIPS
also
supported
t1444,;'41151F
nese, yeeldiv, ethought that though the risk run in this
tar-,A.;the ideals was for their own profit, yet that
ei vies cire I"ne and the revenue had benefited by it. He
tili whie,
„Avielit lion. Baronet would grant the conces-
Li. he tsuan i e (Alr. Hume) thought ought to be limited
e„1411.11,, the t,:,)/..et,11e passing of the Act, which should esta-
',tele !mt.. That Point the Hon. Baronet might
Ikli. •
qiit ~i'lliuilNG
litte.--.)ured -(0-, could not understand the distinction
eeesvpley te e
eue raised in the present case. That did
eie'4%;. to b'', th other articles fur which protection was
V-sleeiltl6.,-foe hee)(T11111etle The present parties had had
, eleet .- years that it was the intention of Goa
on It
least.° make an alteration in the duties on coffee,
uavg,.,t;
4:ll.lllith,ere!ithait the circuitous voyages ought to
3'si.k.4-.4913E.Ria ? la. , therefore, no right to complain.
1%.
.11413-titioa- I EEL said that the parties had had two
oi)er .., e neotiee that a change in the duties on coffee
tC.:l'"ili ' Et
. ennside ration- of Parliament. Instead of
4,ii,,,lll4..;.eisictertehusade
, „it. ee..,T,la !yea of that, an unfair advantage had been
nett drawn up,
ealtlne're_sif,. lax manner in which the Act of Parliament
Ind speculations (he
iVte RhiCrs of coffee arch term) had been carried on
"11,9?,13:tp1e1,,-- - • I, e, ..1:ley had no Just cause, there-
. - 77 - 4,eillOrs in
stone and timber bad had

After a few words from Mr. COBDEN and Mr.
1-lAwEs, the Committee divided, when there appeared,
For Lord Sandon's Resolution
Against it
—64

Mtlj,rity
The ork.inel preposition we§ then agreed to.
The duties on cocea, and chocolate were agreed to as
proposed.
On the question that the duty en tea of 2s. Id. per lb.
should be continued,
Mr. LI.NI);.;;EY thought there ought to be a reduction
in the duty, end trusted that the Eight Hon. Baronet
would hold out seine hopes that •so desirable a reduction
should be uffl:cted.

(-3.ir R. FEEL said b( fore he made any promise on the
sulject he should like to see the affairs of China settled.
—(A laugh.)
Mr. I INDLEY regrt ttcd the inequality of the bear
in, of this tax. on the poor and the rich.
'Mr. MANGLES was a five trader in tea as well as
every other commodity.
After a few observations from Sir R. PEEL, the item
was.agreed to, as were also the other items in schedule 17.
In schedule 18, on -the question that -corks squared for
rounding should pay 16s. the cwt.,
Mr. T. I)UNCOMBE proposed, pursuant to notice,
that the duty should be reduced from sd. the pound to
Is. the ton, and that that duty, as well as the duty upon
corks, should come into immediate operation. The Hon.
Gentleman said he thought that the cork-cutters of this
country were entitled to the protection and consideration
of the House; and he hoped the Government would not
refuse to accede to the proposal he had ventured to sug-

best.

Mr. GLADSTONE laid that an unprotected and in-
dustrious class, such ES the cork-cutters of this country,
were no doubt- entitled to the kindness and considera-
tion of the House. He did not,- however, think that
any good reason could be shown why that trade in par-
ticular shOuld be exempted -from the operation of the
peinuiples carried out in the new tariff. -Corks were
now twice: as dear -in this country as in France,
and were,: moreover, of a -very inferior quality.
The effect of the amendment would be -to take off all
protection from those who were employed in the labour
of cutting the cork into squares, and they were one-half
of the number altogether engaged in the trade of cork
cutting.—(Hear, - hear.) Those employed in rounding
corks from the square were already largely protected.
Mr. F._ BARING supported the amendment. The
principal argument of the Hon. Gentleman was, that it
would act unfairly towards One part of the trade, and
what they asked for was a fair time to abandon it.

Mr. 13UNCOMBE explained. it appeared to be
thought that there were two parties engaged in the
trade ; there were two branches of its squaring -and
rounding, but it was frequently done by the same indivi-
dual, and they wished that Corks squared for rounding
should be admitted on the same terms as cork in the
rough. He denied that be had asked 'for more than the
trade . demanded themselves, as was proved by the peti-
tion he had presented on the subject. The difference
being so small on one side and the other, he hoped the
Governmentfrould concede the point, or he should be
obliged to divide the Committee upon it.
Mr. B. WOOD trusted that gentlemen on his side
or the House_ would- support the amendment, on the
principle that its -tendency was to reduce the price of the
artielG on whiA ground they had supported the rest
Of the tariff. • ••

The Coh.mittee then divided, when there appeared,—
Fur the amendment
Fqr the reselutien

137

210jority against the amendment ...-56
_Dr. BOWRING then proposed in schedule No. 18,
stratyou hats and plaiting, an ad. valorem duty of 20
per eent.instead of the duty of Bs. 6d. per lb. on straw
hats, arid-7s. 611. per lb: on straw plaiting. He thought
-the.Right-Hon: Baronet was bound by the principles,
behadi professed iu reference to free-trade, to ac-
ce'ile to his proposal.
GLADSTONE Air. said there was no description of
. .
"tabour Whit* yas so friendless and unprotected, or et:-
*ply, without the power of defending itself, as the maim-
'facttre of straw plait ; and he thought they were bound
to retain.a certain amount of protection.
-The gallery was then cleared for a division, but none
• tools lace,. and the original question was agreed to. •
'The, items to spirits and strong waters, exclusive,
',.i,yOre agreed . - -
" the items spirit's and strong waters,
Dr. BOWRING said he hardly hoped to he able to.
,inelace the Eight Hon. Baronet to forego this duty, but
really it was very high. It was calculated to increase.
smuggling, and to demoralize the people. He wished
the Right. Hon. Baronet would.act up to his declaration,
and hold out. the right hand of fellowship to France.
- Sir R.,ITEL said the French Government was aware
of the disposition of the English Government to renew
the negotiations for a reduction of duties for a reciprocal
advantage.
• The item was then agreed to.
Dr. BOWEING moved that, as they had row got
through all the questionsof itapoitation, the Chairman
do report progress.
.. Sir It. PEEL had no objection to accede to the motion,
on the understanding that the article of coils be brought
under the consideration of the Committee at five o'clock
this day.
The House then resumed, and the Chairman reported
progress,- and obtained leave to sit again.
Mr. GLADSTONE said that when the House would
go into Committee this day at five o'clock, he should
take the opportunity of stating to the Committee what
had taken place respecting the measurement of timber
in reference to the timber _duties. Inquiry had been in-
stituted among the revenue officers as to the amount of
inconvenience to be apprehended from a total change in
the system of measuring deals, battens, &c. ; and it had
been thought advisable to allow importers the option
either to have the duty, charged by the cubic contents, or
by enumeration. For that purpose a scale had been
framed which corresponded very much with what had
been proposed by the timber trade themselves. lie.gave no-
tice then, that when the House went into Committee this
evening, he should move the insertion of a scale in
schedule 5, at the proper place, which should give to
importers the option of charging the duty by cubic mea-
surement, or by enumeration ; only they would under-
stand, that in no case would the option be attended by
any saving in duty to them.
Mr. HUME regretted that the Government made this
alteration.

➢ir. WALLACE was always sorry that a concession
was made, as the country would be of opinion that the
Government was either overreached or cajoled. He had
no interest in the matter, but he believed the concession
was one which ought not be made. There was no neces-
sity for the Right Hon. Gentleman, with his majority of
120 or 130, to have made this concession. He was sure
it was a bad example.
Sir R. PEEL thought it would, indeed, be a bad
example ; if because, as the Hon. Gentleman said he
had a majority of 120 or 130, he refused to make a
concession.—(Hear.) But it was no concession ; the
mode of measureineut was adopted in consequence of
the representations of the most experienced Custom
House officers on the subject.

no auth noticerTmithil:Cy had just as dtbauctrnigtrtrr-TTATE-7EDITIONS of " THE- SUN;" in the CITI'I
exp«-t-no change in the duties on those articles as the 1% FR. JOSEPH THOMAS, of No. I,.FlNCll-
holders of coin* Lad With respect to the commodities in ivAL LANE, CORN HILL, has made arrangements -by.
which they trade d. The holders of c:ffee should be dealt which the Public and the Trade may be supplied with a - •
with on the same i rinciple that was applied to other
' THIRD EDITION of " THE SUN
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here to that general principle, and he believed it his duty , And Subsequent Editions when Published.
to do so. lie would accordingly vote in favour of the i The THIRD EDITION of " THE SUN" contains the
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Mr. KEMBLE had intended to oppose the original ' up •to SEVEN O'CLOCK, and all other important in-
proposition of the Noble Lord, hut he regretted that the formation accessible to that hour.
Government should find itself obliged to oppose the me- -
dified proposition. He certainly should support the latter.
Lord SANDON said he had not intended originally
to divide the Committee on his proposition ; but after
what he had heard he felt himself compelled to press his
amendment to a division

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