Star.
London, England, 1830-02-12 00:00:00

he would rather see that agitator in the house of Commons, as he
saw the hon. member for Clare. He would rather see him and hear
him as the representative of Birmingham, and meet him here,
where there was an opportunity of dispassionate examination, then
he should send out violent appeals to a country at present too testily
to art upon such representations. These were his reasons, in ad-
dition to what he had formerly stated, for praising the motion of
Inc honourable member for Bletchingley, and if that were lost, he
would take no further share in the business. The representation
would in no degree be improved by some alterations which had been
nonimended.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said that, if
he had remained silent longer than was necessary it was not
them any unwillingness to declare his opinion, but rather
hem the deference he was willing to show to his right honourable
ftiend, in order that, se he had been adverted to in the
course of the preceding discussion, he might have no oppor-
nmity of replying to the observations addressed to him. Ile
had also another motive for not pressing himself early on
the attention of the house, and that was, that this was not
%he occasion on which the disposal of the franchise was un.
der consideration, as the house had, on several occasions,
declared that the franchise must be transferred to the hun.
deed of Bametlaw ; and, as he had, on each of those area.
dims, supported the proposition of his honourable friend who eat
near him. lie begged distinctly to be understood that to-
night, as before, he should vote for the honourable member,
because the' course he recommended was most consonant to the
views he (the Chancellor of the Exchequer) entertained on the
questions of reform, and bribery and corruption. His right hon.
friend who had just sat down had thought the course he pursued
more consistent with precedent and the principles of the con.
eritittion. He told the house that it wan important that Leeds,
Rimiinghem, and Manchester, should each have members to re.
present them in parliament, and he too plainly indicated his inten-
sion, whew them measures should be submitted to the considers-
lion of the house, so far to depart from his aversion to reform—
(Hear, hear,) as to indicate a disposition to go a step further in
advance. If the honourable gentleman was sincerely desirous to
maintain this constitution of the House of Commons in its pre-
sent•condition be would do better to enlist himself under the
. banners of this*e who suppomed the course now recommended.—
He (the Chancellor of the Exchequer) had said that he was no re.
former. Hir principles were those which had been maintained by
many distinguished individuate that. constituted as it now wee, the
boom of commons surpassed in excellence any similar body in any
eountry ; and he felt alarm in making changes which would spoil
whit we pommeled without enriching us with other theoretical ed.
vantages. But though he was no reformer, he never resisted the
punishment of corruption, which he looked upon with disgust and
regret. He did not seek out canes of corruption with a view to
obtain reform, but in order to punish delinquency, and exempt the
general body of the house from obloquy. For the same reason that
he was induced to concur in the transfer from Grampound, he was
also induced in the case of Penryn to concur in the transfer to a
populous town. The country amend was so studded with
representative places that there was no space from which
new Totem could be drawn to infuse into the representation
new life and vigour. His Right llonourable Friend had taxed
the Government with inconsistency, because they had not
adopted in the case of Retford the rule which had been adopted in
the case of Grampound, and he had remarked on the absurdity of
sailing in the voters of the hundred lot him ask his right ho-
nourable friend how long it was since he had formed that opinion ?
In the case of Penryn his late right honourable friend Mr. Canning,
then the leader of the House of Commons, did not advance any step,
and, notwithstanding the inconvenience which had resulted from the
vicinity of other boroughs, declared his wish, instead of transfer-
ring the franchise, to infuse voters from the eircumjacent country.
Ills right honourable friend seemed to think that the great leading
interests were not represented. He, the Chancellor, would recall
his attention to Birmingham, the iron trade of which place was
amply represented, although the place itself was without particular
representatives. Ile should adhere to the vote he had before given,
because he conceived it to be a vote most in unison with the former
practice of Parliament.
Mr. CHARLES GRANT said that it was with great surprise
that he had heard the speech of his right hon. friend who had just
sat down. In the course of that speech his right honourable friend
had fallen into many inconsistencies. In a lofty tone he had com-
menced an attack on his right honourable friend near him (Mr. Hus.
kiloton). His right hon. friend near him had said that he thought
it the duty of government to watch the exigencies of the timer ; to
proceed in their course with caution and precision, and he had ex-
pressed his regret that the government had persisted in the course
they bad hitherto pursued. But the right honourable gentleman
had said, that for his part he took a defensive position, and that
he was cautious in his first step—(hear, hear). It so happened
that he ( Mr. Charles Grant) had seen the effect of these first steps
during the last fifteen years— (hear, hear). It so happened that
he knew what that language meant. He had heard the same lan-
guage with the same assumption of tone, and the same infiexibe and
invincible power of resistance for many years. What was the re-
sult ? It was but " a dragging on, from partial death to death."
'lt was not the cordial, generous concession to just and reasonable
measares ; it was not the noble concession which sprang from great
minds, anxious to defend the public cause, and anxious to look
at the public weal ; but it was the lingering, hesitating, half.
consenting, 11W-suspicious concession, which took away the
grace front what was given. The right honourable gentleman had
said that he had voted for the transfer to Leeds. What became,
theist of his strong assertion against the principle ? He (Mr. C.
Owass4) thought the honourable gentleman had been discussing the
minalple—he thought he had taken his stand on a rock from whence
im was not to be shaken—he thought he would not depart from the
principles of the British constitution—that he was too obdurate—
too inflexible—too careless of the opinion out of doors; but, no,
saitthis right honourable friend, I voted for the town of Leeds.
Ile had also expressed his readiness to give Penryn to Manchester.
Ms it not, then, trifling with the house to tell us that we should
stand la first steps ? Was it not a mockery of debate to insist on
Chip language, when we knew, from the records of parliament—from
what was passing around us, that at this moment the inclination of '
tseacttehonourable friend was, of two franchises, to give one to
r. The whole question then was abandoned.— (Hear,
Mar.) We had given up the constitution—we have opened the door
hail! these dreadful innovations. He appealed to this house whether
this was the manner is which a question of this Vest and important
WINN was to be dismissed?—{Hear.) His right honourable friend
waothen indignant with his honourable friend near him because
Me presumed to think that some portion of the present excitation
was. owing to the conduct of Government. At the tremen-
_ dons risk of the anger of hie honourable friend—(a laugh)
los.(Mr. Grant) must presume to concur in that opinion. There
woo an excitement such as never before existed in England. There
were and symptoms which must astonish any man. Was
it.possible for say man to observe how rapidly the force and
enterprise of this peat nation had increased, and what discon-
tent existed, without asking himself why was this great change ?
Why was it ? Because the government had shown a reluc-
Uwe to accede to what was reasonable. Refuse what is just,
god- you will drive the people to demand what is unjust.—
Wenhi they not be satisfied if you acceded to their just de-
nim& It was impossible to judge, final demands made in a
state of excitement, what would give satisfaction, if easily conceded.
He waaaware of the feeling which induced the people to dread inno-
vation--to dread any thing which should shake the long-settled ha-
his-and constitution which they were desirous to preserve. They
know that the only course was to correct errors and anomalies,
whkli.were known to exist, and at the same time they believed
joedy that, by a temperate adaptation of principles, you might pre.
sem the landmarks of the conaitution whilst you infused into it
new. vigour. This was the feeling of the people, although delay
,one. the part of the government had exasperated that feeling. lo
won instance the government bad not exercised any of the Bleed.
mate inflaaras to which illusion had beer. made. And what was
the resuls—vis. as to Penryn and Manchester ? That the house
IMO • dimmed that the. franchise of Penryn should be trans-
ibtsmitto Manchester. (Hear, hear.) He therefore acquitted the
Winn of any part of the culpability of goading on the people to de.
istantinore than what, they justly would have demanded, but it
whinolibi he the power of the house to satisfy the just demands
et the people, and to grant what was right and proper. (Hear.)
What le the spell of Boesiok. ? The people of England justly
feel shat-deers are demands which they are entitled to make, and
knowing that, b the osaseleations and temperate course of Mi.
vsrtwtttbey bog IRMO punned, these just demands might be
as, ems • beim ties %wee with their feelings properly
ensiled; and goreinovent tomtits/no with the hundred of -Rootage/.
His rightbon. foiend had said that Birmingham was very well re-
pethentrd. Waa it in this way that we were to argue the question
Iteliseolhe bathe, or wore we to appeal to the common muse and
coma the frothing of ovary IMO ? You tell me, continued the right
hew aehdossade influence. I tell you of a vast capital
ogre paw possessing property to the amount of
lliage Md. I show you enterprise, power,
liPlaii' Mlil esposity.rlenleee this against Baasetlaw, and leave the
kesakAo the sensor sense and conscience of every man. These
110,1,411111 opkiag be was dialogue to express; and he hoped that
li* the
would, at this time, do its deny. At CHARVIIMOR of the EXCHEQUER said that in one
Ranee his slobeliatoorsble Mend had miatsken the
Adria be had ndv He had stated that he had acted on titmooses."
' bo the traria precedent which Parliament bad
simetkosth precedent' was to transfer the franchise to
414111140114natoptda-easio wimp The hundred •was w small as rot
to otatilet ationadathrrect corassatetke.
• • figr sOLlAKEvigrassalliir orbits° to favour of refers. What
was 2g4inii It was nothiig but a re/townies of what was stolen
(fuel the People. Under whose influence was the hundred of Basset-