The Sun.
London, England, 1842-03-24 00:00:00

Coat a person possessed of real income should be
'somewhat greater amount than those whose racemeswieede ttee
, , f
___
tarto o:e., .
tuating. He supposed that such an amendmentto_l4lol.37_..*,.
plan would not be consistent with the views of the e Tglat__Ati,T;
Baronet, but he must say that such an amenelmente7et,t`..7:l„
away eith a considerable portion of the unpopularitY tna.rl"4' I.'
attach to every such measure. The Right Hoe. lialarTn'enti4l
calculated, from the class in Schedule D., am
..... q ,
1,200,000/. ; if it were consistent with the Yr,_e-1.4.
the Right Honourable Baronet to tax this . tl4"‘,
.: 1.
wto per cent. instead of three, it would noi.
deduction .of one-third Irons the estimate, or about- fiTurt vsn
He thought it not impossible to make up that differiet's noe.
some other source. He might point out some artieles
tesess,.,.. ,
tariff, the change in which ne could not see. the nee
nlisi_eetre
being followed up. lie could not see that so much &dee t...tied,,
~
would attend the change in the timber duties as was
.enllsiSou,„,
The reduction on timber was calculated at 600,00 i
eto
ee tehisee
of an amendment had been put on the loaner to ' -_,Z eaer.re
class from the tax altogether, but this would not be e.inotou.ii
„,
—( [Tear, hear. ) There was no reason whY larg_ee t eisere t
made through the medium of trade should be exesel),, Apo
than real property ; but a difference might fairly beeeruestrt,
aoa,,
occasion had arisen when great exertion was 'l,, easuceieed,s
Gentlemen opposite had not shown that they eosn'o'c 0f wale.;
the necessary resources without resorting to
tier) which had been repudiated by that Houtshee. in
, eine be thou-141'
no alternative but to adopt the present rrineipie,
e. eHeereees.
the country would submit to such a plan for a time.—(Hear.
, te., As ,
He trusted that, in three years, they she
,ssl. the saXe!
situation that could justify them in taking u
that it thee
He could only say that his belief and opinion set to fun.eue
tae was an unpopular one, thee unpopularite "ge and whor
the shoulders of those who caused the,deficieu l'..t prisOet.
nitre could slees
having lett it, were not now prepared to assist to:a epees
opponents, and not on the blioultieri of, time Who
souring to remove ir.--(Cheers..) to 'the
• • listened ' eft
Mr. TENNISON D'E Y N CtJURT had+ too stel
opinions of the Hon. Gentleman who had jus.t i'•l'4 eity !slf
great pleasure. lie quite agreed with him, that ' neeple• .
necessey for the imposition of the tat existed, 1.136 Loa 404
this coun:ry would to a man strive to beer a fairlualesefet,te
in (peke to ;seep up public credit, and meet tb°•°7stete.t. oft
country. But he did not believe that the ga lie. nth
for the tax exited. He thought it flip ito 'llinergoo
an income tax aiene, because it was e '4l die ”1:100•
from a property tax, because it pressed tint /tight. 1,
productive interests of the country. The , hut SOP
Baronet had said there was no reseuree . t;•Goveny
a tax ; but he thought that if the measures of the t, ,peelssitt
went were carried they would go tee to remove t
to 'vitas!,'
he,
which existed—( Hear, hear )—and while they were ~,
would object to any other taxes. They were ei.,'',4,l'
recourse to that which should be reserved fur a tle4 .ste te e
.ounn• eatesti
and wind' would give an impression to foreign'
to, g t, 40
they were exhausted. That appeared to him one uf- b,51..„04
objections to the tax. He was surprised at the If• ea thero
lion. Member for the count. Limerick. It apPear,ilin , i
,
the tax did not press upon his country he would e bear.r ,
assist in fixing it on the people of England.--(,r. Of 0,
English Members on his (Mr. T. D'Eyneoures/•: bee li.e
is°
House hed never taken that course with respect to otrte ~..t
Member's country—( Hear, hear)—and the Hon. 01 , . 17,
might rest assured that no example he could seerthe,..elarete li
nature would induce them to follow it. A tie 44 net
speech of the Hon. Member for Berkshire, wile had 44
down, he (Mr. T. J'Eyncourt) was not surprised at .100.0e*
adopted by the Right Hon. Gentleman in imposing f'lleiets's
his followers.—(Opposition cheers.) Ex UllO diSCCN Pei .1' r
(Loud cheers.) He was satisfied that if Hortottra;e 1,
tlemen opposite would open their mouths and glve,ste, st.„_eee
their real opinions, that the greater part of War iieL-
be found to express opinions of a nat.islibet,'"l
to those which had been expressed by the lien.
Berkshire.--(Cheers.) He (Mr. I'. D'EYDetLeet/ se;
the high and honourable feelings entertained by,e'riols' •',.
Gentlemen opposite, anti he could not ' briag hinseueetein.
that they would lend themselves to class legislation ;01,
ture—(Cheers)—that they would press unduly nerfiretisi
I.
dustry of this country to sustain the landed and the •.pt
than interests.—( Hear, hear.) It was his (Mr. • fr' . ~,
court's) intention at the proper time to move a
and
I,
reduction in the tax to be paid by the trades aye '' ees,
di:if
sions of the country.—(Cheers.) If a man laid ont....taer
in trade, the more hazardous the speculation the gr't7,o 0
the gains. The more hazardous the speculatiou, t
_kr
were the gains expected, because this capital was 'tee 9''`him in the shape of income; but the whole cotineja
break down before it was completed, and teen it wale(b
0
tore of capital, and not the nature of • roes n'e't -r
hear.) It the interest on capital was 20ifeets
the tax would amount to one-sixth, and if to -.T..41" vo
it would be one-third ; and he should there:oT:d aft)
that instead of 7d. in the cases of trades and profession7'o.loA
be 2d. in the pound, which was somewhere about eel
of what was proposed. The Right Hon. Gentleman'
that no resources were left to the country but this onpe:
the Right Hon. Gentleman had admitted that the li.trif:sio 4
the late Government, had they been adopted, woulo eise
r li
dered the income tax unnecessary.
Sir R. PEEL dissented. • for,the
Mr. T. D'EYNCOURT, then, would say it 0 '
Hon. Gentleman.—(Laughter.) Hou. Gentletneniu.
did not perhaps hear that admission; but it was qu't 'ilt,
from the statement of the Right Hon. Baronet, leeier4
1
course had been adopted, there would have then .000-1
small deficiency. He thought thin could be made oat ll l'
The Right Hon. Baronet expected one million Wl' ~.--,4
4
corn; now under the Bs. duty he might have reas . ,
petted two millions, and this would have prevented tbe.s, 0;
to a property tax. They must recollect that twig:l'l)4)i,
lions of taxes had been repealed since the war ; 2,1%44
T. D'Eyncourt) thought that, out of that twentYes'Atscitd,
taxes, there surely..was one to make up the gush --the Self
one million, without resorting to that impost ulT°a°, eet0•00
facturing and trading interest of the country. '''7l,osll,io
the Right Renewable Baronet that he had reeel sesTtist
from his (Mr. Tennyson D'Eyncourt's) constituentsvol too
stated that in consequence of their knownpolitical fee Cc
would be placed in a very awkward position with reeraue:oo
collectors of the income tax. He was quite certain ose
siderations could not be imputed to the Right Hot. itt.
but that the tax would bring the taxpayer under, cp::, aoj,
of the Government to a considerable extent, he had tryeto;et
He must say that the Right Hon. Baronet had posri,„o,,-,0
ficient time for consideration of this income tab' tee teeei
.s)of.talobaite Hioiu.see dsthdonuoidt permit the :Init. proeropml eeoe
meetings
nthgsis rewt:Pf:sawen. ;
and state their views of the subjeet; and he thent4 P. , I'd
respecting the proposal. the Right Hon. ibl°"-etoueet :
said truly, that according to the forms of Bole ttie rif
would have ample opportunity for consideration nnelpeseettoo
lions were passed. That was perfectly true, but he '
than he (Mr. T. D'Eyncourt) did, that after tu" :sties
division upon that question, the Hon. Gentleinelloaje ~
their votes affirmative of that resolution, walk' i's „,,, f
inconvenient to ive a vote afterwards against tO be ';;, y
had before recorded; but they would, on the central' 'Srsd
4
to justify that vote, whatever was said against ititeitiffr
thought this was a reason why time should Yet bee
consider those resolutions, especially considering ',,,,,,.
40
of the Right Hon. Baronet, for which he did not Or
ti
before he made his statement, and he thought Well/
to the country not to give a little more time than tittigi
before the first vote was given on the subject. 1,_,..1a7,04r,
this, he didhope the Right Hon. Baronet would 010" It,
give a little further time, and he hoped that here"' ti eV
not be considered inconsistent if Hon. Gentlest 00,
changed their votes. He hoped the flight IlldisetV
would consider this, and he hoped he would int., rolreili
relaxation with regard to mercantile and professie 0 ea'ets
that he would consider the effect it would bate° (1141;M!
nations—the inquisitorial nature of that tax. no ~,'
D'Eyncourt) could assure him he should give " eiiiir
orpositii n. ring *ll 1/$9l
Sir J. It. REID said, that so far from sgre-
arteerost
Hon. Gentlen.an who had just sat down, as to fitilliti, 11°,„
being given to consider this subject, he trusted the
~,lIIP . VI
Baronet would take the sense of the House that RiZ eiser
(Sir J. R. Reid) did not hesitate to declare that Uoglsief
general opinion of the mercantile interest of the erlai Sit ll'
the business of the country was impeded bye uiesir,„.o.i.tli'
lieuse.—( Hear, hear.) With that feeling h„,-`O,
It;"1,
Reid) could not follow the example set by the nod i,,,,,dri
man, in going into discussion upon that great net el°,'„tf,, ,
question, but he must he permited to say, tha be wee'•,'' i
he disliked paying such a tax, still at the same tinted/rse !
hesitate to declaie, that under the existieg circl; etsliit ,
which the country was placed, and considering ti di „10)
ho should, though reluctantly, pay his quota.--(l••Qued lict
on the Oppositioe benches.) He felt himself IT° tbo ter
what he considered a fair and just compliment tot, tbib, •
Member for Limerick, who had so fairly spoken °ton)
ject, and he (Sir J. R. Reid) would have been l'epten''
tified to have seen his example followed by otb'l er.) be
tlemen on the same side of the House.—(Hear, b 00114.1111
lie (Sir J. R. Reid) was a party man to a certain %eels re
not deny, but at the same -time he was indePre ecne°llo
Right Hon. Baronet. He was connected with 01,,,e' orty• tio
interest, and although part of the Right Hen. '1;o Sao(•r
was objected to, still he did not hesitate to (lee •ptott kie,,
connected with that interest, that it was the 011' tinVe
majority of the commercial interest that the o°loo4 1,,,
Baronet had taken was one which would carry him, use ;eire
through all the difficulties with which. 11..atiste irl
rounded. He had been set down as a iat bilesslo
but he didand
bneoltief,hweasist,atiehat to declare tWoe. sielses i
the Right pot; 'ooo.e
ought not to flinch, and he looped be would it Ili et,
iseespre to (
trusted that, in the course of three years Ot..— not
. tele se
found hardly necessary to continue the fait w"I-3t
,de_hts/fi
then discussing.—( Hear, loan ) He would- "(essitskrAttrt;s
house longer, for be was a man of businest—ea 1046:#4. :
therefore he would come to the point.— (Rene be 111.10.4 e
He would vdte with the Right lion. Baronet,
.) . Os tie
;bred
what they may.Lotid ironical ebeq:bt. 'Ol4l
rimed him to put the question— to the test that l'jessilf trV
tiered that they had lost a great deal of time unste 00 AO
question had been discussed over and over again' ere Il,cf figi
the country was languishing in consequence, Ord a n e
'af ' s
that they would finish the question that night' • tsiesl '/ S
stake his existence that all counected with the .tl4 rd;
. Mr. WART) A;sßthDe said the
it.
country would have ne reason to complain. hot J. 016 '
chasent;latlivne.
nt:e.ssed the House had made, two most imp of the 000,.
li
a large bheidsYtoseitb Ope
vial interest of the country he shoiii't Pay te;:b„, theinoo essi„:
reluctance—(lA2lghter)---and, secont.sYs ' -4. this" iitliter!
first
• eng at G
reasonable probableey of the tax terrninae Hon Ise
tioned.—(Loud cries ief " No, no.") flu:, it AOW . ,tO
oG?entlenaan whoa,
to
I,
had said three or four yeare—that he hoped s , ,jott .
more than three or four years. re' (1)- i iit°
Sir J. R. REID rose, amidst Joud cries 0 `.. ..,tiel
~
explain, but his gave way. . WI- 4
or, :-...' el
Mr. WARD—It certainly struck upon my ....,
foer years. a a are PfPfite
Sir .1. R. REID—The Hon. Member's e r._
of
ferent from other people's.—( Laughter, anelifelieb 0,446
Mr. WARD said perhaps he had not ea_ - e wc.piete., r.)
quently este ibed to Hon. Gentlemen on th .I'r itte,',. !a
( Laughter.) Under any circumstances tn:anoess_yre
Baronet would have the support of Gentlest,
great Ip'etnloef.l
this was the rationale of this taxation.
benAtrhe 8... .?.,P;00,1
Gentlemen opposite would have gladly ta. 0(000 :por
' i that tne 04 k 4
as it was, if they could have fin-teem %
_eau 1 _
the slidhig scale was to be obtained at there
tjee:.tatesi !lid
tax. He had had the pleasure of hearine.x lttonitha aey 5,
who were vehemently opposed to himss
mode 'of orieup,
Cully believed that there was a better
the incre 00,
same result as that sought by ths —Bo aro ,e
ciency in the revenue. There had ben
.oa.?..,bee „A::
against this proposal, in which he was boundtta
_74ooteor7eiti
at all concur. The first. was, that the incmneso. I ;II
but he (Mr. Ward) did not consider it
etheVaho,
,: ,
oi
It was a tax arising out of necessity, wh
ees, white?
arose from war or net. Another argumen tit' _putsieedli, lit'
4.tr
countries must think ed. this tax, and thatworrt., ,11. of 1
national character in the estimation of the i'Ltuitte....s, fr
Consider that argument worthy of the
_ire iientb
,)
Hoose.—( Hear, hcar.) Foreign countries.mwe
..a. tri
a direct system of taxation, and many of then 1..,:;;;I„ litrit
portion Of their revenues by direct taxatioem
oraTt,usT ,
did knew but little of our indirect systw They ,r to
they did not approve of what they did kne .._ ,1-4ipetrd.49
that system was unjust, and they had long lensTieseLeeb*:ej
tern of dire. t taxation. As the Hon menitefifto,,,,,,
stated, if they taxed property, they taxed th
.Vt_ireeipie jppt,
labour was employed; and they were tin,..'
I He ,101'-'i; ' 074 11/4,
the working easses.—(Hear, hear. )tn." h0:;•11,
that this system was a great encourageinto,. . ,It,
dulent pretences and irregular management t_epotteeee,
taxed a man's expenses, they did not tax his
_ifZegeety-
i
country they did more, they did not tax his °1..,,i. Jeli
they not only taxed his trojoyronts,' htttit_lley ‘0,..'