The Sun.
London, England, 1842-05-13 00:00:00

HOPS.

The Earl of WINCHIL SEA presented a petition
from 'Maidstone, praying for an alteration in the bas-
tardy clauses in tlid Poor-laws ; also a petition from
Kent against the reduction in the duty on foreign
hops. The petitioners stated that the reduction con-
templated by the Government of 21. per ton would
ruin their trade. He was happy to say that it was
not the intention of her Majesty's Government to pro-
pose so low a duty as 21., for if they did so it would
entirely annihilate the trade in this country.
Earl FITZWILL TAM said that, supposing the
reduction in the duty on hops would injure tho
trade, the land would remain capable of being
turned to any other purpose. Now, what he
wanted to draw the attention of the House and. the
Noble Earl to, was another point. The other night a
conversation arose respecting the employment of per-
sons in mines. His Noble Friend then expressed great
anxiety concerning the morals of that part of the
population, which he said was seriously injured
by the employment of females and children in those
mines. N ow, as his Noble Friend was so exceed

ingly desirous of protecting the morals of the inhabi-
tants in the manufacturing districts, he would recom-
mend the Noble Earl to look a little more to the
morals of the persons in the districts with which he
was more immediately connected. He (the Earl of
Fitzwilliam) would turn his attention to what
occurred in the grounds during the time of hop-
picking.—(Loud laughter.) If he would look to
the females there, it would be more useful than his
turning his attention to those who delved in the
bowels of the earth.
The LORD CHANCELLOR—They went from
London.—(Laughter.)
Earl FITZWILLIAM—Yes; they went from
London to corrupt the fine morals of the districts with
which the Noble Earl was connected. Now, surely
the Noble Earl oughtto endeavour to prevail upon the
Government, to which he gave his support, to put an im-
port duty upon those articles which were hroughtdown
from London into those very pure places, lest they
should corrupt the morals of the females, and it
might perchance be of the males—(A laugh)—in the
very pure districts of Kent and Sussex.
The Earl of WINCHILSEA said the injury in-
flicted by takinc, away the protection from the hop-
grower would note' affect the hop-groweronly but would
be very detrimental to the agricultural interest. There
were thousands of acres of wood-land in the county
of Kent, which would be utterly valueless if it were
not for the hop-gardens. He himself sold about 125
acres of wood- land yearly. It was cut down and
used for poles for the hop gardens. If the hop gardens
were destroyed he should not sell more than 35 acres,
for ash poles, and elm poles, and all these poles
were of no use except for the hop-gardens. Now
that would be a great loss to the labouring classes
who were employed in these wood-lands. Great
numbers of labourers were likewise employed in the
cultivation of the hop-gardens; it was true in some
districts they had induced an artificial increase in the
population, and if the duty was taken off foreign hops,
they would all be in a state of distress. The Noble Earl
had recommended him to look to the morals of the
population in his own immediate neighbourhood. He
begged to state that there was no district in which he
had not established schools capable of affording edu-
cation for the whole of the population. All he asked
was, that the hop-grower should have a fair protec-
tion, such as was given to other classes.
Earl FITZWILLIAM said that it appeared then
that the protection was to be continued, not so much
for the sake of the hops, as for the sake of the wood-lands.

The Earl of `NICK LOW rose to order. If Noble
Lords made speeches on the presentation of petitions
iu this manner, they would never he able to get through
the business.

Earl FITZWILLIAM would move that the House
do adjourn, and thus put himself in order. If the
Noble Earl opposite had always interfered when any
thing disorderly had occurred—whenever any conver-
sation had taken place across the table, on the
presentations of petitions, he would have bowed
with submission to the Noble Earl's interference. In
moving that the House do now adjourn, he should make
one one or two observations on what had fallen from the
Noble Earl on the subject of these woods ; it appeared
that they were to protect the hops, not for the sake of
the hops, but for the sake of the growers of the wood
—where woods became less valuable, it was customary
to destroy them, and he had no doubt the Noble Earl
had himself been a great destroyer of woods ; so in the
case of woods cultivated for the sake of hops, if they
became less valuable they might be destroyed, and
that should be the case instead of protecting the hops
for the sake of the woods. He would beg to direct
the attention of the House to the alteration about to
he made in the duties on foreign timber, which he
apprehended would have more effect in deteriorating
the value of woods—and he did not regret that, be-
cause he thought timber ought to be cheap—than any
alteration in the hop duties would have in diminish-
ing the value of woods grown in the counties of
Kent and Sussex. He had some knowledge of
the woods there—some of them might he cultivated
for the purpose of hop-poles, but he thought by far
the greater part was the natural produce of the coun-
try. He begged to move that the House do now
adjourn.—(Laughter.)
The question was then put, and after a few words
from the Earl of WINCHILSEA, in explanation,
Earl FITZWILLIAM said, with regard to the
employment of females in mines, he did not run into
such extravagant opinions as he had seen expressed.
The condition of those employed was influenced by
the width of the coal seams; perhaps it might
be desirable to prohibit the .employment of children
in mines, but the necessity of employing children
arose from the thinness of the seams. If Noble
Lords would read the Report with any knowledge of
mining, they would see that the employment of children
was almost entirely confined to the thin seams of the
coal-mines of the West Riding of Yorkshire and
Lancashire.

The Earl of WICKLOW rose to explain that
he meant no disrespect to' the Noble Lord, when
he called him to order ' • it was caused by
the Noble Lord's irregularity ; if they were
to take the House collectively, there were no
three Members of it who were guilty of so much
irregularity as the Noble Lord. On a recent occa-
sion he had made no less than five speeches on a sin-
gle petition.
Lord REDESDALE said, in the discussion the
other night, the Noble Lord had himself got up in his
place and observed, that he hoped a new rule would
be established, in order that the proceedings might be
more orderly.
Earl FITZWILLIAM—Make a rule.

Lord REDESDALE—The Noble Lord said, make
a rule. There was a rule already in existence, which
was for general purposes sufficiently strict, but unques-
tionably that rule might be abused. He thought
that when a Noble Lord was called to order he
should bow to the call, and not put himself in order,
by moving an adjournment, thus evading the rule of
the House, and causing great inconvenience.
The LORD CHANCELLOR then put the mo-
tion for an adjournment, which was negatived without
a division.