The Sun.
London, England, 1816-05-16 00:00:00

SAVINGS BANKci.

Mr. Rost: brought up the Savings Banks Bill,
Which was read a first time. Mr. Bose then said,
he wished to state very generally its objects, as. it
had excited great public attention both in Great
Britain and Ireland, hut without going into de-
tails. The Bill authorized Bodies to enrol them-
Selves for the purpose of institutiog Banks for
:Savings. It authorized the Officers of these
societies to make rules and regulations ; rind that
Tie instruments should be enrolled at the SQS.
s hilt it. gave no.no wee to the Sessions to alter
or controls! them. It was neeessat y:
kind of registry. It allowed the societies to ap-
point their own officers, and those whit had money
in trust were to give security : but they were to
have uo protection respecting money not in their
sands, as it was essential to prevent persons from
lending it out on any private security. In the
friendly societies, souse persons had got in whose
-"object was to procure loans. There was a proviso
that no depositor should be prevented front his
claim to his par6chial relief : otherwise labouring
then would be averse to entering these societies,
as it was possible overseers might refuse them relief.
These were the chief points of the Bill. 1-le bll
a
been asked to • include the charitable loans, 'of

which he warmly approved, in this Bill. "He
kneW bow useful they had been. in small sums at
Bath anti Edinburgh ; but it had appeared to him
'better to make this Bill pure and simple. He
• wished it to be printed, and lie over
,for a fort-
night for general consideration. He moved the
second reading for Friday next.
Sir Newpoar said, that no 'place would be
more benefited by the Bill than Ireland ; but' be
hoped some measure would be adopted by which
inoiley, when at a certain amount, should be
vested in public securities in the Bank of England-
or Trelimit.
Mr. 11,03 E had no wish to hasten the Bill. Or-
, tlererl.to be read a 2d time on Friday. and printed.
CommitCees were allowed to meet to.
morrow.

The second reading of the Gaol Fees Abolition
13ill was ordered tor Friday. The Alalt Duty Bill
Was read a third time and passed. A Petition was
-.received from the distillers of Cork. Colonel 4ir
WooD postponed his motion till Monday.
FILBNCII CONTRIBUTIONS.

„t 9„ „1111
no-
been paid to this country by the _French Govern-
trot ut, un lllTlOttlit that was well worthy the atten-
tion of Parliament, as it was not less than the
auto of 6,000,0001, But the main question was,
whether that sutn, or a suns still larger, was a
droit of the Crown, might be dealt with as per-
sonal income, anti was' to be left entirely to the
disposal of the Sovereign. Should that be the
Case, then at the end of a protracted war, the
Sovereign wo4dd have a source of revenue inde-
liendent of Pat Hauteur, and contrary to all former
usage.—Nune could deny that such a question was
iiiiportant, and affecting the vital interests of the
Uoustftotion, as such a doctrine tended to coun-
teract the authority of Parliament, and to remove
the tothrarks of the Coastitutioo. The grounds
of 'such it eLtito ought Jo be called for, and what-
-ever might be the result, it was the duty of a
:NleMber of Parlifitneot to bring the question be-
tore the Utilise.. M the observations he meant to
offer, he should try to be short nor should he
load the quieitut with legal quotatifwg, unfit for
such all assembly as that House, but Should he
gutted by the great roles of the Coostitution, and
of justice. lie hoped he should not be told that
it uo statute was violated, that the doctrine was
vd el! founded. As there n ere many offences that
were no breach of a statute, so there were many
offences agaiost • the Constitution that was no
breach of any positive law. lie should be per.
"fedi), dispavionate, anti AO impute
no tlrli-
bcrate breach of the Coustitution, but only a pro-
ceeding that ought to he guarded against in fa-
titre. The-King of France had engaged to pay a
certain sum to the army of occupation, and it bad
seen stated by Ministers, that no vote of Parlia-
inent would be called for to provide for the charge
f these troops. Bat that was a most extraordi-
Lary proceeding, considering the coustitutional
guards against a standing military force: one of
which was peculiar to the House of-Commotk.as
all Money Bilk must originate itt that House,
But as far us the arniy in Prance was concern-
ed, Ministers had proposed to se; aside that Con•
tffittit imial principle, and lustend, alga% the revolu-
tion, of substituting right for Might, to substitute
Plight for right. That ground, however, had
beets afterwards abandoned ley Ministers, and a
vote had been submitted to the House. The
charge of the army in three years would exceed
the whole of the sum to be paid by France as an
'lndemnity, and at all events there would not be
a balance or more than half a million to this mut-
The treaty
.professed to indemnify Great
Britain, and no erplanation was.atforded why that
indemnity was to be reduced to half n -million,
though fur Onions had been promised for pay
nod indemnity.
,Of that he complained, as it was
a there contingency, if there would be any*ttr7
pins to Opitt Britain. One million four hundred
tli:Htsand pounds was to be paid for the hardiest
rif !fie 'Alit Upon Great gritain ; and that tutri
k)Bre !teen acceptedhy the Whist) Govern.
cithet to hi, paid to the soldiefs, or to be
.13,t front tits

I Dell Lc4.l,g :lofted f 1

.
.•
bribe reasons for the payment, it would seen
that there %VaS tut eugagement lit Iconour to oay it
to 'the troops.
.If that was the 'can. !lieu there
wits a novelty of a very alarloing hilt" 4 dona-
tion trotu foreign Princes to British troops ; ;old
a principle of gra kit& of a most dolgert"ls
ten-
dency was established loon a lit iris') army to those
.ftneigo Princes. Bat it might be said, the Urown
might dispose of the money in any other way;
and then it would tall under the general question,
and must be defended as a donative to the army
from -the British Crown ; which would form a
most alarming precedent, not that he meant in the
smallest degr,ee to detract from the glorious servi-
ces of tilt:oh-my, but only wished the reward to
be given by the Crowu and by Parliament. The
question for consideration was, if these sums paid
by France were at the disposal of the Crown as
the droits of the Admiralty woe claimed to be,
and to be applied to private enjoyment us private
property. lie by elo mimeos wished to cu,:tail the
proper splendour of the Crown, or to withhold the
means of munificence and bounty. If the means
were inadequate, they should • be increased, but
not at the expenee of the right of the 1-louse of
Commons, and the liberties of the country. The
Chancellor of the Exchequer had Claimed the
whole as droits of the Crown ; and be as a Mi-
nister of Finance, and as a hiwyer of great ex-
perience, was honied to much respect. Upon
him it was incumbent to state' the grounds of
his new opinion sylmielt hail never been advaoced
nroleisional ..nevialtv ni 160
.ussertion had not beep made in the warmth. of
hate., An act of ownership had taken place on
the part of the CroWn, nod part of the money haul
been applied.hr a manner, that, hoWever in itself
commemlable, formed, no part of tlie public ser-
vice. A letter, dated Dec: 26, 181:4 had' been
seta from .the Board of Treasury to the,Commis.•
sary•iu Chief, directiog that- the sum of 200,000
7franes should be applied out of the money paid
by France, to defray the eXpence of, a Monument
to thetardinal of Yorke.. fled that sum been
paid from a prienteiincome it would, have, been
much to be praised, but the. public money should
,not have been applied to paying such funeral ha-
' pours. TO such a procedure, as at best ambigu-
ous, and, in fact, a libel on the Revolution, he felt
the ;twit strenuous objection. It seemed (men;
tatiously to imply that helWas entitled to Royal
linours, because he was descended from a fatuity
that had once been Royal, but which had ceased
to be so by au act of justice.. Ile (Sir .1, M.) as
disposed to treat him as a Prince from courtesy
and compassion, but not as having any claim to
the Royal dignity. The money epithet' to trans-
port, the works of art might be for a public object,
hut that could not be .the disclose alluded to.
Though the slim was small, yet the principle was
the same, and it part ". might be applied, so milieu
the whole. He must protest against such an ap-
plication, till he was convinced by argument, or
silenced by the decision of a
,majority of that
[louse. He saw,no grouted for such a claim, and
the onus lay upon those who pat it forward. The
constitutional principle was, that the Crown was
dependent upon the House of Coiumons for the
money necessary to supply the various calls of
Government, and that principle was the great se.
entity of public freedom. Should such an appli-
-4 it, 4 dift...oP.tpUte-MllM„b,Pje-"
It might he said that Miuisters were responsible;
but that responsibility would depend either open
the power being legal, or the necessity obvious.—
James 11. in his owu life, lately published, had
thrown most light upon the subject of
.his bro-
ther's connexions with France, and complained
that the King lied beet) induced by the Duchess
of Portsmouth to settle upon her 10,0001. aunt*.
ally, out of that French fund, which was his only
security against the tyranny of Parliament. This
power, claimed by the Crown, would be a temp-
tation to conclude .infamotei treaties, in conse-
quence of money to be paid by a foreign power.;
and the question in future might be an auction of
colonies, anti a sale of territory. , Half a million
might be demanded for Martinique, and 400,0001.
for Guadeloupe. Such a potter was more Onto it
mere -liability to abuse ; there could be ,nu Use
in vesting such a' power in the Crown, unless •it
was already possessed of it, and could only' lead
to midget similar to that in the time of Civrles
11. The indemnity on the pert of the French
Government, was partly 'pecuniary, and partly
territorial, on the policy of which he should give
no opinion ; but it was clear that money Was the
price of territory, tool the case bore a strong re-
semblance, though circuitously, to the sale of
Dunkirk, in the time of Cloaks 11. CoMpetnia-
dun for a national loss, ought nut to depend upon
the sole will of the Sovereign, and those Morbid
paid the Income Tax, should have their burthens
alleviated by means of the compensation paid by
France. Those who held the affirmative, as to
the right,of the Crown, were boom! to Prove that
right; but the authorities to that purpose must
•be subsequent to the Revolution, as no previous
case would- probably apply to that before the
House. In 1714, when the House of- Co
lillllol4
was supposed to be unfavourable to the principles
of the Revolution, a fOlitil of the assieuto contract
hatl•heen claimed by the Crown; when the ['unite
of Commons on June 9, 1714, voted an Address
that it should be applied to discharge the debts•of
the Nation. The rumour had beim, that the mo-
ney was to have been vested In trustees, and these
trustees were to have been Lord Bolinbroke and
Mr. Marshatn, in whose names it was to have
been vested. for the tae of the Queen. The same
Address also requested that • the revenue of Mi-
norca, and the rents of certain houses in Gibral-
tar,. should be applied in the same way. An an-
ewer was returned on the 24th,- and stated that
the fourth of the assiento contract hadbeen grew•
ed to the South • Sea Company, her Majesty eons
ceiving.thet to encourage trade, want the best way
to discharge the debt. of the country, and that
the revenue of Minorca, and the rents of the
hoases in Gibraltar, should be applied In the mans
ner
.she thought more fit, fur the public serviceAtte
A division had taken plane, tart; the tellers
were, Lord Doliobroke amid Mr. Pulteney, as
the Ministry (tile Whigs) (thieved to- the
money. having been granted without the eon-
Sint of Parliament. The terra then employed
Wes, that' the noose acquiesces' in time dis-
posal of the &Ironies ; turd that as stroueytiroveti

the question of right, as if the House had refused
to acquiesce. On the 15th of January, 1;63,
abovv, four years after the passing of the Civil List
Act, a Message I'Vont the Crown tame- down --Ao
the !louse, st4tinl.t, that a prOposat had been
made. by the Fre'n'elt King on the subject the
maintetiance of prisoners of war. ,On the 21“ an
Address of Thanks ivas voted by the House, who
expressed their opinion, that the proposal of 11,kc
French King should be accepted. On the `22d of
March, a copy of the Convention was sent down
to the House, by which 600,0001. ss as accepted,
instead of 1,100,0001. that had tit first been de,
!minded. This communication was accompanied
by o certificate,from Lord Barrington, Auditor of
the Exchequer, that the money had been paid in-
to the Exchequer. That fact was importani.--
The Message had been brought down by .Mr.
Grenville, then Chancellor of the Exchequer;
and front the opinion of Parliament being aiked
and taken, and the money being paid into the
E:Zehequer, it was self-evident it had beeu re-
'garded as the property of the public. No Mi-
nister could, have brought down such a Message
respecting- the private property of the Crown.--
IPIt 411 W 45, 'now made to withhold the
.army tram 'the controul of Parliament, and the
statements on the subject of the money paid by
France could hardly be understood. 'rile terri-
tory possessed by the East India Ciimpany had been
vested in the ,Company by the King and Parlia-
ment, for a certein sum of money but no pre-
torotiot) had ever been started that that money be-
Carne perSollal propel.. r_:.,
only for the use of the poirlie. The usage in the
present case must be from good times, must be
Publitly known, and sarictioatid by legitimate
•an-
thoritV It must, not be at like that of .ship-
,money, nor like the sale of Dunkirk, nor like a
decision that had ever taken place in the case of.
general warrants. He could-mot say that he would
rejoice it proved.to be in error; but, on the con-
trary,. should lament that a practice so incompit7
tible with the spirit of liberty, was 'sanctioned by-
.tht! principles of the Coustitntion. The Hon.
Oeutletinin concluded by moving six resolutions :
lit, Thin it appeared that the suns of 700,0001. sterling
bad been paid by Fratlee to thin country in lieu of the reve-
nue-uf the conquered provinces ;—ldly, That it appeared,
that by the Treaty the share which fell to Cireat Britain, of
the contributions, was 5,000,0001. ,•—;idly, That the sum was
inadequate to the real charge of usaintaining the pettish
troops in France;---Ithly, That the sutu of 1,400,000 i.
given'as a donation by the Foreign Powers to the British
Army, which the Crown was to be considered as aTrustee;
stbly.That certain sums had been paid to ,assist in defr4yiug
the charge of transporting the works of art front Paris to
Route, and for erecting a monument to the late Cardinal
Yorke;--Gthly, That the application of such motley, without
the privity of Parliatuent, did not appear to be warranted by
the usages of the Realm, nor the principles of the Consti-
tution.

[For the Co►►tinnation of the Debate lee the last page.]

ENTAILS.
AftlilVtD-...lGuernsey and Jerrey. 1)')E-1 Holland, 1 Dub-
lin, r Waterford.

PRICE OF STOCKS

THIS IMY At rWELVF. o'CLOCE.

Bank gtock, ......eddi I India Bonds, ... par
:i ',Er Ced.ltc(l. tOti 61 1 Exch. Bills, .. fs. Jas. par
0 per t. rut. c0n5....... 0144 chwiium, • •
.1 pvr Celits, 75i j Ditto for 14:quit:tit, . , teff 1:1
5 per Cunt. N. Anti-921i 9J C.:uni. Ivr ik4?.:4,1kiit,..... tiiii i
liiinh 1.. Awn.. ... . l;. 7.16 th.

. .
:)sitinutvs afivr U.l gvesiing, attcr