The Sun.
London, England, 1845-05-20 00:00:00

before Parliament with a firm determination of carrying
them through. Ho hoped the day was not far distant
when the endowment of the Roman Catholic Church
would take place, for all these measures led to it. He
found that this measure was proposed by Ministers who
were put in power to arrest the progess of a principle on
n'hieh they confessed they must govern Ireland. There
was one point on which he would make concession to the
opinions of those opposed to him, averse as they were
to the policy on which they ought to govern.
He did not think the experiment was disproportionate
to the object. He was obliged to admit that he could
not look upon the measure r.s a solitary measure. It
was not a solitary measure at the present moment. He
looked upon it in connexion with the excellent measure
for the increase of academical education for Ireland,
which was introduced the other night; and in connexion
with the promise given the other night of assimilating
the municipal franchise in Ireland with the municipal
franchise in England. Whatever might be his objections
to the details still he could not think that he could for
a moment bring these objections against a measure
which showed a policy of justice towards Ireland.
It seemed to him to be the duty of every friend to Ire-
land—of every person wishing justice to that country,
and of every person who wished to continue the con-
nexion between the two parts of the empire, to support
the measure which was now before them. That was
a policy to which he gave as strong and as unhesitating
a support, as if it were introduced by a Liberal Mi-
nistry, and as if the existence of that Ministry de-
pended on its support.—(Hear, and laughter.) If this
measure were rejected by them, they would discontent
the people of Ireland, and give them a just cause for
showing that the repeal of the union was the only
remedy fur the evils of the country. The claim of the
Irish people to have their religion upheld and respected
was just as great as that of the people
of England and Scotland to have theirs upheld,
and 36,0001. was a very small sum for that
purpose, considering that they had deprived them of
that endowment which their ancestors gave them for
the support of their hierarchy.—(Hear, hear.) Certain
speeches on both sides of the House resolved themselves
into this, that they could not support an endowment of a
church, because they adopted the voluntary principle,
and they ought not to give anything to any church
whatever. The application of the voluntary system in
the present instance was quite absurd, because they en-
dowed the Presbyterians and Unitarians in the north of
Ireland; but whatever be the religion of the rich they
gave them some of the public money, and it was only
when poor men came forward for the support of
their religion that they buttoned up their pockets.—
(Hear, an laughter.) That was a principle which was
both odious and ridiculous. It could not be just, for
they called upon the Catholics to pay all the Protestant
sects, and why not pay them something in return. The
arguments used were, that the doctrines of the Roman
Catholics were unsound, but though he was ready to
submit that many of their doctrines were erroneous, he
at the same time considered that the religious opinions of
every class of the community should be equallyrespected.
The existing repugnance to the Roman Catholic religion
was quite ungrounded. They used invariably to ground
their case on the assumption of a temporary expediency
to coerce the whale party in power to fall in with their
views. Their case was precisely similar to that which
was equally tenable for all parties. They considered if
a new policy to be pursued towards Ireland was the
means of their obtaining the reins of Government

they would be fully justified in following it
up.—(Hear, hear.) They thought if they could
place the Right Hon. Baronet in power, they could
make him the in*rument of their intentions. The pro-
posed measure was.of far too great importance to the in-
terests of Ireland to be lightly discussed. It was to the
mutual interest of all parties in the House to co-operate
one with the other ; and without that mutual union it
would be impossible to do justice to the long-neglected
claims of the Irish people. He had no great misgivings
as to the ultimate effect of giving satisfaction to Ireland;
but then it would require the energetic and united
efforts of all parties. Every step in the conduct of
their policy towards Ireland should be unanimous. He
considered if the Right Hon. Baronet at the head of the
Government were disheartened in the progress of the
policy at present pursued towards that country, a great
and glaring wrong would be perpetrated on the Irish
support,
nation; and the Right Hon. Gentleman might rely on his
Boiler's)e(vMereveryoecasionwhen a similarts not only on this,
measure to th but on
present
upp
should be proposed for the amelioration of Ireland.—
(Cheers.) Public opinion was more in favour of the
measure than was commonly thought. He would suggest
an idea which was more important than the Right Hon.
Baronet was willing to admit. He would inquire, now
that he had done so much for the Irish nation, what did
he propose to do hereafter ?—(Hear, hear.) A wise
lesson might be obtained from the satisfaction with which
the speech of the Right Hon. Baronet at the head of the
Home Department had been received, and it was a matter
of great congratulation for him. Good policy was now
being pursued towards Ireland, and it might be con-
sidered as the omen of better times hereafter. The
Catholic emancipation was not happily the last boon
which the people of Ireland were to obtain,
nor was it now intended, since they could no
longer exclude the Catholics as religionists, to debase
them as a political party. Lord Melbourne's Govern-
ment ho,l all that laid in its power towards amelio-
rating the condition of the Irish nati •on and the people
were satisfied that all that could
end it, wee th t; r L
be done had been done,
ton wtocn arßiNeif IW6mlOptice contideuce in the la unit
Lord's administration. Bad policy pursued towards a
country for whole centuries was not to be remedied by the
adoption of one solitary measure. The Irish people
w re naturally suspicious of the good faith of the present
Government, when they took into consideration the
treatment they had hitherto received from them: They
were doubtful what would be the result of the policy at
present pursued, but he would advise the Right Hon.
Baronet only to persevere in the course he had elected to
follow, and Irishmen would soon be satisfied of his
good intentions towards them. National feelings were
not always the less favourable because they were not
always noisily expressed. He was firmly of opinion
that the repeal of the Union, about which so much
noise had been heard, was the greatest enemy to the in-
terests of the people of ,Ireland. The question was one
of great importance and considerable intricacy; and, in
his opinion, the manner. in eihich it had been met was
the only means of obviating the danger which would
have resulted had it been less resolutely dealt with. The
Right Hon. Baronet had -been repeatedly taunted upon
the severity which he had exercised on that occasion;
but his conduct then, even if it had been reprehensible,
had now been amply compensated for by the boon which
.he had offered to the Irish people. Hon. Members
might discuss the question of the Oregon territory at
their leisure, but he would remind them that there were
many political Oregons in Ireland, the boundaries of
which had not yet been settled. And this wrong-
headed policy of curtailing and restricting the
rights of Ireland had been pursued for centuries.
Against that policy the Government of this country
would now contend only by following such a course as
the Right Hon. Baronet was pursuing.—(Hear, hear.)
He trusted that the Right Hon. Baronet would go on,
and he was sure that if he did so, he would secure to
this country the entire affections of the people of Ire-
land—(Cheers)—and render the connexion of Ireland
with this country a bond of strength, instead of a mark
of opprobrium and subjection.—(Hear.)
Sir V. BLAKE, at great length, supported the mea-
sure of the Government, whose policy he defended with
great warmth. But he was heard very imperfectly in-
deed, and many passages of his speech, which excited
great merriment in the House, were entirely lost to the
gallery. We understood him to conclude by recom-
mending the establishment of a second university in
Dublin, without interfering with the privileges of that
which now exists.
Lord INGESTRE rose simplyto give his vote for
this grant. He would frankly confess that if the vote
had come from the other side of the House that he should
have opposed it, because, he had seen, in their conduct
when on the Ministerial side of the House, a truckling to
public opinion which he should ever oppose. But the
contrary was.the case with the present M. istry. They
bad vindicated the supremacy of the law, and then they
proposed measures for the pacification of Ireland. He
had always been an advocate for what was called justice
to Ireland, and he had given a vote, though a silent one,
against the grant, for he felt thati
t was so small as to
enable the Roman Catholic priests to teach mischief
without any corresponding power to do good. He would
have preferred a modification
of the term, and would have
liked to have a definite period fixed for the grant.
Three years would certainly be too short a time for
tying the effect of the experiment, but five or seven
years might have been so. As, however, he had no
opportunity of availing himself of this advantage he
should vote for the grant as it stood on the motion.
N r. LAWSON moved the adjournment of the debate.
Mr. RE DINGTON opposed the adjournment.
Mr. LAWSON said that there were several gentlemen
who wished to address the House, and it was clearly
impossible to finish the debate that night. He had him-
self endeavoured to catch the Speaker's eye early in the
evening, and should desire to state his opinions, which
he could not do that night.
Lord MOSELEY opposed the adjournment
Sir R. INGLIS approved of the adjournment.
Mr. M. J. O'CONNELL thought the debate ought to
proceed for an hour or two yet.
Mr. lIINDLEY said that it was not fair to charge
the opponents of the measure with not having come for-
ward to express their opinions that evening, especially
after the extraordinary opinion advanced by the Hon.
Member for Honiton.
Sir R. PEEL would not oppose the adjournment, al-
though he thought it better to continue it for another
hour or two. If they were to do so he was convinced
that any Hon. Member who wished to address the
House would have a fair and patient hearing from a full
House. He (Sir R. Peel) would venture to predict that
from five till nine o'clock next evening the House would
be comparatively empty, and he thought that sufficient
time for the consideration of this question, which was to
be seen in the diminished agitation against the measure.
Lord INGESTRE said he was much surprised
at the statement of the Hon. Member for Wallingford
for he could not discover what connexion there was be.
tween his (Lord Ingestre's) speech and the question o
adjournment.

LUNATIC ASYLUMS.
Sir T. FREMANTLE, after a short discussion, in
which Messrs. Redingtan and Grogan took part, ob-
tained leave to bring in a Bill for establishing a central
asylum. for lunatics, and to amend the Act for the lunatic
asylums in Ireland, which was read a first time, and or-
dered to be read a second time this day week.
The other orders of the day were then disposed of,
the House adjourned at half-past twelve o'clock.

and

HOUSE OF LORDS, May 19.
The LORD CHANCELLOR took his seat on the Wool-
sack shortly after Five o'clock.
4‘ message from the Commons brought up several Bills.
Tile Exchequer-bills Bill was read a third time and
pftst&d.