The Sun.
London, England, 1844-02-19 00:00:00

S [IN, LONDON; Id OND A Y ] VEN Iwo, PlilBR :A, IA44

and truckle to France and America.—(Hear, hear.)
The Right Hon. Baronet did not read aright the
the spirit which now prevailed in Ireland. He would
do well to consider that spirit. It was a spirit which
had before now been seen in England and Scotland.
It was a spirit similar to that with which Scotchmen
secured the independence of their country ; it was a
spirit like that which Lord Chatham said
he rejoiced to see in America ; and let him
tell the Right Honourable Baronet it ". was a
spirit which great men sympathised with, which good
men inculcated—a spirit which the boldest and 'then
wisest statesman would do well to consider, and which
the boldest minister might not be ashamed
to tremble at. Notwithstanding, the vaunting
of the Right Honourable Baronet, there was
no man in the whole empire at this moment who had
so much cause for alarm as the Right Hon. Baronet.
To whom had the Right Hon. Baronet delegated the
government of Ireland ? They were told by the Right
Hon. Baronet the other night of the commotion which
was created in the Home-office by the Clontarf procla-
mation. They were told that an attempt had been
made to wrest by force the executive from the hands
of the Government. They were told that on that occa-
sion the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland, the Lord Chancellor,
and the Attorney and Solicitor-General were sum-
moned to the Home-office, and that they remained
four days in debate. The only man who was not sum-
moned to that important Council, was the Prime
Minister of England. (Some observations were
passed across the table, ' which did not reach the
gallery.) He .must say that he saw many causes of
alarm in the present state of affairs in Ireland, and these
causes of alarm were not at all lessened by the
manner in which they were treated by the Govern-
ment. It seemed to him to be a case on which no per-
son could reflect seriously without alarm. He did not
mean to enter into any of those queions connected
with Ireland which were fit subjects of inquiry. He
would only say on that occasion that he thought, among
the many causes of complaint which the Irish
people had, one of the greatest, as well as the
most frequently urged, was the want of sym-
pathy among English Members for Irish grievances.
Every evil which had ever been felt by Ireland was
in some degree owing either to English bigotry
or Eeglish dislike. We had hitherto denied all the
claims of justice till now—justice and self-interest
were combined. This was no longer an Irish
question. He believed that if the prosecution
which had recently been conducted in Ireland
had been conducted in the sane manner against

_,he Chartists, there would have been a sensation from
one end of England to the other, and • that
business of that House would 'have been stopped
until the injustice had been redressed. The
course of justice should be as dear to them on Irish as
on English soil.—(Hear, hear.) He believed that
the unity and iniegrity of the empire were
at stake. The eyes of Europe were upon
them. He would read to the House the opinion
of a writer, whose authority on such subjects stood ex-
ceedingly high. The Honourable Member then read an
extract from an author, whose name was inaudible ;
in which, after a statement of the position of Ireland,
it was said that, unless in time England permitted some
small inroads to be made upon her tyranny, the result
would be fatal to English greatness. Such was
the opinion of a writer, who was as impartial as he
was enlightened, and he hoped that the warning thus
given would not be heard in vain.
Mr. SIDNEY HERBERT said that as an Irish pro-
prietor, taking a very deep interest in the welfare
of that country, he must express his regret at the tone
and manner in which this question had been sub.
mitted.—(Cries of " Hear, hear.") He did hope,
when he saw the announcement of this discussion in
the paper, proceeding, as it did from a Noble Lord, for
whose statesmanlike qualities no man in that House
entertained more sincere respect than himself,
that Ireland would not again be made the battle-
field of party.(Hear, hear.) If he had conceived
that the course proposed by the Noble Lord was
calculated to benefit Ireland, no party ties or personal
predilections would have prevented him from stating the
opinions which he entertained.—(Hear, hear.) Now
before he proceeded further he thought he might con-
gratulate gentlemen on that side of the House that the
charges for which the Government bad been
arraigned were - admitted to be unfounded.—
(Hear, hear.) The Noble Lord, the Member for Sun-
derland,' with that abstinence of party spirit which
charaeterised him, admitted that they had not been
established ; and the Right Hon. Buronet, the Member
fur Devonport, had also acquitted the Government.
But he found that, in the speech of thelgoble Lord, there
was a sentence which showed that, even in the Noble
Lord's opinion, the circumstances in which Ireland was
placed, it was necessary that something should be done to
assert the majesty of the law.—(Hear, hear.) He
thought that was a great admission, coming from a
party which inculpated the Government, and had not
when in power made itself very remarkable for its
power of enforcing the majesty of the law.—(Cheers.)
The Noble Lord had proceeded to attack the Govern-
ment for their conduct in the disposition of their patron-
age. Now he (Mr. H.) must admit that there was no
great enthusiasm in Ireland in favour of the Govern-
ment.—(Laughtcr.) But they must look to what
was the nature of popularly in Ireland.
There was nothing easier for a Government
than to attain popularity in Ireland. They had only to
throw themselves unreservedly into the hands of one or
other of the extreme parties, and they would be sup-
ported by the shouts of exultation on the one side, and
by the silence of terror on the other. Such popularity
was inconsistent with his notion of an impartial
Government.—(Hear, hear.) The Government of
Lord Normanby had no pretensions to the title of
impartial.—(Tory cheers.) That Government obtained
popularity by giving up everything to one party solely li
and exslusively.—(Hear, hear, from the Ministerial
benches.) He would now come to the question of the
Noble Lord's proposition. The motion of the Noble
Lord was in itself very large and comprehensive,
but the suggestions which he threw out for
the amelioration of the grievances to be inquired into
were exceedingly small. All that he proposed to do
was to make a new appropriation of the revenues of the
Church, and what the Noble Lord considered a more
impartial distribution of the patronage of the Crown.
The Noble Lord acknowledged that his hopes for the
pacification of Ireland, as far as they depended on his
measures, were unfounded, as he admitted these mea-
sures to be impossible. Now he (Mr. S. Herbert) en-
tertained an opinion that the Roman Catholic clergy
ought to be endowed. He entertained that opinion,
because he was anxious to see them placed in
a situation above the necessity of taking part
in political agitation. He believed that in many
parts of Ireland where an indisposition had been mani-
fested on the part of the priests to join political agita-
tion, it had been difficult for them to obtain their dues.
He believed that the people had themselves protested
against the amount of those dues, and the necessity of
political agitation had been superadded to religiousin-
fluence, in order to obtain them. This was a
lamentable thing, as the Catholic religion was one
always allied with the maintenance of peace
and order. Again, he wished to see the clergy
takefi from a higher class of men than those who were
now found in it. The Noble Lord had said it was better
that they should be taken from the lower order of society,
but he differed from that opinion when he saw the little
respect paid to the clergy when they were of a rank only
a little above the peasantry. After all, the Government
proposed much more than the Noble Lord opposite—
they proposed a more comprehensive plan and greater
changes. He did not include, of course, the pro-
posals of those gentlemen who supported the Noble Lord.
There was one point—he meant education—to which
almost mere than any other conceivaßle means he looked
foa the amelioration of the condition of the Irish
people. The Irish peasant came over to this
country in the harvest, where he saw men of
his condition enjoy all the comforts and happiness
of a highly civilized nation, and he went back to Ireland
at the close of the harvest time with no feelings of dissa-
tisfaction, for the Irish peasantry, above all others, were
remarkable for their gratitude ; but he went back
to Ireland an unchanged man, without exhibiting any
desire to adopt the improvements and the advantages
of those which he had witnessed in England. To what
could that be attributed but to the want of education.
He would recommend the adoption of measures to put
an end to that state of things, and he would
have the Protestant and the Roman Catholic
of Ireland put upon a footing of the most
perfect equality. It was by such means they would
ultimately effect the amelioration of the condition of
that unhappy country. He did not think, as some
others seemed to be of opinion, that nothing would
satisfy the Roman Catholics but the. spolia-
tion of the Church Establishment. That Esta-
blishment did not press upon the Roman Catholics
for it was supported chiefly by the Protestant landlords.
There was another point to which he wished to refer.
It appeared to him that of all the symptoms he had
seen since he had the honour of a seat in that House,
from which he could augur a better state of things for
Ireland, it was the tone they had adopted in the present
debate—he meant the tone of kindness and good feeling
in which every Hon. gentleman who had spoken on that
side of the House had referred to his Roman Catholic
fellow countrymen. He believed he spoke their senti-
ments as well as he did his own, when he said
they were willing and anxious earnestly, and at
once, to co-operate in effecting the improvement
and amelioration of their common country. He made
these observations by reason of the interest
he took in the subject, and looking with anxiety to the
proposal which the Government meant to make, lie was
prepared to give their measures not the equivocal assent
or lukewarm vote of one in office, but conscientiously to
give them his warm, earnest, and hearty, approbation.
Mr. SMYTHE said that he rose for the purpose of
explaining a sentiment in a speech which be made last
year. It had been said that he wished to see Ireland
governed in the spirit of O'Connell. Such a sentiment
was never expressed by him. He said the very reverse
What he said was, that while he disliked both extremes.
he preferred seeing Ireland governed in the spirit of
O'Connell, rather than that of Cromwell ; but he disliked
both extremes—persecution and prosecution on one hand,
and undue truckling to the Roman Catholics onthe other,
He could not give his vote on this occasion without ex-
pressing a hope that the Government would come for-
ward with some well-timed measures—such as the
settling of the relations between landlord and tenant,
which, if brought forward in a spirit like that which
animated the concluding remarks of the Mon.
Gentleman who had just sat down, would renew
the link which should subsist between the people of
Ireland and the Conservative party. He hoped the Go-
vernment intended to move and bring forward this and
other measures, and if they did so he did not despair of
seeing the Irish people once more looking to them for
sympathy, and not preposnessed apipst Opp;
Mr, JOHN 01CONN.ELL said that the Catholics of
Ireland were satisfied with their priesthood, whom they

loved and revered, and who were worthy of their love f
and reverence.—(Hear, hear.) He challenged them
to shew any priesthood so pure in every act, so
devoted to their religious duties, such admirable
minist6rs of religion. The Hon. Gentleman said that
the Catholic religion was a monarchical religion. In his
opinion, it would be more correct to designate the reli-
gion to which the Hon. Gentleman belonged as a mo-
narchical religion, beCause the Sovereign was at the head
of it. They accounted it one of the proofs of the divine
origin of their religion, that it perfectly adapted itself to
every phase and state of society which existed. It was
under the fostering care of that religion that Belgium was
working out a spirit of rational liberty, and they looked to
it as the religion which would supply the elements of
order against the wild outpouring of irregular liberty
in North America. It was that religion which rests ain-
ed the people of Ireland under excitement, and enabled
them patiently tobear distress and poverty. It was that
religion which instilled into these sentiments of liberty
which he trusted would ere long have fruit in the
prosperity and legislative independence of the country.
He had not risen with the intention of answering the
Hon. Gentleman on the other side. He had risen as
one of those who in an early part of the debate had
been styled convicted conspirators.—(Cheers.) He did
not acknowledge the justice of that designation unless

it could be— considered as a conspiracy for
men to labour to their utmost to discharge
the duty which they owed to their country.—(Cheers.)
which was the next in importance to that which they
owed to their God.—(Loud cheers.) As one of those
convicted conspirators, he rose to speak, perhaps, his
last words in that House—to make his parting declara-
tion before he returned to Ireland, to meet and
to incur the vengeance of the Right Hon.
Gentlemen opposite.—(Cheers.) He said to incur their
vengeance, for he should continue to exert him-
self with as little ability perhaps, but with more ar-
dour and zeal than ever, to incur their vengeance, by
exerting himself in the cause of his country.—(Cheers.)
He did not rise for the purpose of offering any apology,
or urging anything in palliation of that for which he,
amongst others, had had the honour of having been con-
victed. If he urged anything on that point, it would
only be to call upon every man in Ireland, who had not
yet joined the repeal movement, to act as he (Mr. J.
O'Connell) and his companions had done—(Cheers)—
to devote their liberty, their property, and if necessary
their lives, as he and his compani ms had done and were
ready to do—to restore legislative independence
(LEFT SPEAKING')

THE ATTORNEY-GENERAL FOR
IRELAND.

The Right Hon. Gentleman is in the unexampled po-
sition, that he holds one of the highest offices in the
State through commisseration and sufferance. His Par-
liamentary friends defend him not. They offer merely
the apology that he anticipated that a set would be
made upon him, and though he was resolved to be
governable he broke out at length into lawlessness.
The-more he anticipated the less he is excusable, on the
grounds of rashness. No body but himself observed
that there was a particular call upon his valour, but
when the call was made, he could not pretend that it
was unexpected, and he was the less excusable for any
extravagance is the course he thought proper to' adopt.
The storm having come on, it passed away with an in-
noxiousness to him almost miraculous. If Fitzgibbon
played his cards as some persons say he should have
done, the grand State prosecutions could have been de-
stroyed at his stage of the proceedings. One can well
imagine the effect of taking the infuriated Attorney •
General at his word; and repairing to a distant spot to
give the " satisfaction" denianded. From this peril he
has escaped, and he has had to deal with a most indul-
gent Bench, though in the progress of this trial a gentle-
man had been brought under the animadversion of the
Court merely for a want of due courtesy to the High
Sheriff. One comfort the Right Hon. Gentleman has,
and it is no small one in these bad times, that the Pre-
mier has proclaimed in Parliament that the Government
has not contemplated, and does not contemplate his dis-
missal. There is, in this respect, also the comfort to the
people, that while the Right Hon. Gentleman remains in
office he must be a damaging adjunct to the Tory Go-
vernment.

The Judges of the Queen's Bench are greatly blamed
in London on account of this affair of the Attorney-
General. The chief responsibility in the matter lay with
the head of the Court, and if the needful had not been
done he was of Bourse principally in fault. It was ob-
served that the member of the Court who was most for-
ward in urging on an assertion of its authority was
Justice Perrin. There was, however, on the whole such
a failure as to provoke amongst our neighbours even the
humiliating sentiment of derision. The Times has ob-
served, with characteristic insolence, that the Court did
its best to facilitate an accommodation for the " jontle-
men." One thing should be remembered, when all
others are forgotten, relative to this unique business,
that the principal official parties obnoxious to blame are
persons pushed into their station by Tory appointment.
Mr. Smith is Sir Robert Peel's Attorney-General, and
Mr. Pennefather, who was so sympathising, or (more
correctly speaking) who was bewildered a manager
for the " jontlemen," was his Chief Justice.—Dublin
Pilot.

INSTITUTION OF CIVIL ENGI-
NEERS—TUESDAY.
(GEORGE RENNIE, Esq., in the Chair.)

A paper was read byMr. J. Grantham, describing a series
of experiments on an iron vessel called the " Liverpool
:::erew." This boat was 65 feet long, 12 feet 6 inches
beam, and had 3 feet 9 inches draught of water ; she
was propelled by two high pressure oscillating engines,
with cylinders 13 inches in diameter, and 18 inches
stroke ; the pressure of the' steam in the boiler varied
from 501bs. to 601bs. the square inch, and it was cut off
at one-fourth of the length of the stroke, working the
remainder by expansion ; the nominal power Has 20
horses, but it did not really exceed 181 horses. The
cylinders were placed diagonally, with 'both the piston
rods working upon the same crank, the driving shaft
being beneath the cylinders, and running direct to the
propellers, without the intervention of either gearing or
bands.

The screw propeller was enlarged three times, and at
last was left at 5 feet 4 inches diameter, by 20 inches in
length ; it was set out with a pitch expanding from 10
to 11 feet, on Woodcroft's plan; it was made of wrought
iron, with four short arms with broad shovel ends, whose
united area was 16 square feet, 13 feet only of it being
immersed, as some portion of the arms was constantly
above the water ; the angle of the centre of the float
was 45 deg. The speed of the propeller was generally
95 revolutions per minute.
With these dimensions the speed attained was de-
scribed as 101 statute miles per hour. The amount of
" slip" of the screw. in the water, as ascertained by
Massey's log, was stated not to exceed five per cent.
Several experiments were detailed, which showed that
there was not more tendency to "list," or to turn round
by the action of the screw than with the paddle-wheels,
and the vessel was stated to have excelled all the other
steamers of the port of Liverpool in towing out vessels
in a rough sea.
Designs were submitted on this principle for a steam
frigate, and for large steamers working with oscillating
cylinders direct upon the main shaft.
In the discussion which ensued, the various forms and
modifications of screw propellers and their relative
merits, were very ably treated by a number of speakers.
Mr. Rennie gave a sketch of the introduction of a
kind of screw used by Mr. S. Brown with his gas engine,
which was tried on the Thames ; the more successful
attempt of Mr. Smith, and the building of the Archi-
medes and other vessels. He mentioned also the claims
of Mr. Sauvage, of Boulogne, to the invention, and his
being recently rewarded by the King of the French. Mr.
Rennie entered largely into the theory of the forms of the
propellers, and in this he was followed by Mr. Farey, Mr.
Galloway, Mr. Samuda, and others ; and M. Normand,
of Havre, who is celebrated for giving such superior
forms to the vessels built by him, gave a slight sketch of
the Napoleon French frigate, in which he eulogised the
engines constructed by Mr. Barnes, and the general re-
sult obtained with the vessel; but it appeared that the
speed was not superior to what had been obtained with
paddle-wheels.
A model 'was exhibited, by permission of Sir 11. T.
de la 'Mae, from the Museum of Economic Geology,
showing all the kinds of valves used in pumps for drain-
ing the Cornish mines, and the merits and defects of the
various kinds were very ably explained and commented
upon by Mr. Jordan, under whose directions the model
was constructed. Mr. J. Taylor gave an historical
sketch of the introduction of the various improvements,
the causes which had led to them, and the effects they
produced. The length of the discussion upon the screw
propeller left so little time for the subject of the valves,
that it was announced to be renewed at the next meet-
ing, Tuesday, Feb. 20.

EXTRAORDINARY REVRLATION OF A MURDER COM-
MITTED IN IRELAND ELEVEN YEARS AGO.-1-NORTHAMI,
TON, FEn. 15.—A curious revelation has been made by one
of the soldiers of the 83d Regiment, at present stationed at
our barracks, by which the perpetrators of one of those cruel
and dastardly murders which we are constantly reading of in
the Irish papers, are likely to be discovered and brought to
punishment. The man's deposition was taken before J. Mar-
shall, Esq., one of our borough Magistrates, yesterday, but
as the parties are still at large, the examination was strictly
a private one, From what I can gather, the murder in ques-
tion was committed in the year 1832. The witness was then
a boy about 12 years of age, and was with others in the field
gathering blackberries, when he observed four men, whom
he knew, and whose naives, I understand, he mentions, run
across the fields towards the high road. They were armed.
Shortly after the witness heard a cry of " Murder" proceed-
ing from the road, and then two strangers passed him and
his companions, as if coming from the direction of the
Cry. He asked them what the cry was about? but the only
reply they made was to tell him to go about his business.
When the witness got upon the road, he saw the four men
he had first seen in the fields standing over another man
whom they had on the ground, and were beating. Soon
afterwards the murdered man was brought home by the
police. The witness told the circumstance to his father at
the time, who desired him to hold his tongue about it, and
beat him. It appeais that the unfortunate victim had made
himself unpspular by taking a quantity of land which had
previously been let in small holdings, and he was therefore
waylaid on his return from market, and murdered. The
party who saw the murder committed, mentioned the parti-
culars shortly afterwards to a Roman Catholic priest residing
thew Secretary et thaer y
man o f State,state s andthemurderto the
to have been committed.
in the neighbourhood, but, thanks to that gentleman's con.
scienciousness, the subject has remained a mystery up to the
present time. I understand that copies of the depositions
magistrates
sbtreaetnesiblthae district
rde6 to
in

A RARE VISITOR.--A few days since, Captain
Searson, of this town, shot., on the banks of the river Trent,
a rare visiter, from_ the Arctic regions, called the Dusky
Grebe. It is beautifully marked, and being a novelty so far
south, was placed in the hands of Mr. Reid, of this town flip
preservation.—PQAMkr Gaxcttg.
stop tfie press to announce that
the hills surrounding Nenagh are at this moment (eight
o'clock, Tue4day evening) all illuminated:—Nenagh Guard*,

HER MAJESTY'S THEATRE.
(Abridged from the Post.)
We trust the lessee has framed his programme with
more than his ordinary acumen and sincerity of purpose.
During the past season we found he had suddenly
brought her Majesty's Theatre to that degree of splen-
dour it ought always to have possessed, and in which it
had, until his time, been lamentably deficient ; and we
thought it but fair to yield him that measure of applause,
without which lessees, no more than virtuosi, can brilli-
antly enact their parts ; still under present circum-
stances, we must watch his progress with a jealous eye.
The theatre must fill. Apart' the daily increasing taste
for music—particularly vocal and dramatic—there are
numberless incentives to attend ber Majesty's Theatre.
It is the rendezvous of the aristocracy, of all those who
shine in society—of all the literary and tasteful men who
throng to the great metropolis, as well as of all foreign-
ers of distinction visiting this country. By appearing
there, the gay members of society proclaim their ar-
rival—ascertain who amongst their friends is in town—
receive their visits and combine their movements in the
career of pleasure. When a Court mourning, or any other
untoward public event, stops for a time the current of
pleasures, the Opera is still the never-failing resource.
Here for the first time the aristocracy of wealth meets
on an equal footing the aristocracy of lineage, whose ranks
it may ultimately recruit ; and here likewise the pro-
vincial visitors in their hasty railroad trips to town have
an opportunity of seeing at one glance the distinguished
characters who are the subjects of conversation in the
most distant parts of the land. And here, it is said,
also "that in the snug causeries or a box are laid the
foundations of more marriages than in the contest with
fair rivals in the turmoil and exhausting amusements of
crowded routs and balls." -
We, who. entertain our warmest allegiance to Euterpe,
must regard the vocal troupe most vigilantly—for, as to
the ballet, we are destined to be overwhelmed by the
enthusiasm of the followers of Terpsichore. No doubt
the ballet will make the fortune of the florists, and the
stage be impassable from the showers of bouquets.
Stephan, Carlotta Grisi, Cerito, Fanny Elssler, and
Taglioni herself, are announced, independent of another
Florentine ballerina of rising fame, Mademoiselle Frasi.
The Germans, the French, the Swedes, the Italians,
each have their fair representative, whilst John Bull is to
play the part of Paris to these rival goddesses. It must
be confessed that there is great piquancy in this union
or succession of talents. The public had abundant op-
portunity of observing last year how varied are the
sources of effect in this art, which has only lately attained
so high a degree of perfection, concealing all effort,
and combining grace with poetry. The new ballet of
Esmeralda is destined to set off the peculiar style of Car-
lotta Grisi, so well suited to the heroine of Victor Hugo.
The chef d'oeuvre of the Mmented Princess Marie of
Orleans' chisel, the beautiful statute of Jeanne d'Arc at
Versailles, has suggested another ballet, and a character
well adapted to the pure style and remarkable mimic
powers of Elssler, for " Fanny Elssler est la qrace sans
mechancete," as was once. said by that admirable critic,
M. de Stendhal—so devoted to the stage that he wrote
his best works at the back of his box at La Scala, to the
sound of music.
So far as we can at present judge by the lessee's pro-
gramme of the fast approaching Opera season, the most
hypercritical will be satisfied. We trust the finished
picture will be worthy of the boldness of the outline—
all will depend on the taste and feeling of the executive.
The lessee should not relax in endeavours that are sure
to be rewarded, for, independent of other extraneous at-
tractions, this year are expected visits from many of the
most illustrious and several august personages of the
Continent, not excepting Louis Philippe, and they are
sure to draw to her Majesty's Theatre those numberless
spectators who are attracted as much by the wonders
before as behind the scenery. Considering art as our
paramount object, we shall still not be unmindful of this
prevailing curiosity, and from time to time we shall in-
dicate the habitual places of the distinguished sub-
scribers to her Majesty's Theatre, to guide and gratify
the casual observer, and at the same time record the
support given to that splendid establishment by those
who are its principal attraction and ornament.