The Sun.
London, England, 1821-02-06 00:00:00

MANUFACTURES.

Earl GREY had now to present a Petition of a
different nature, and which, if the qUarter from
whence it came, and the sentiments which it
contained were considered, was entitled to the
deepest attention. It was from the Manufac-
turers, Traders, and Inhabitants of the town of
Birmingham, and had been voted at a meeting.
held last August, and most numerously and re-
spectably.attended. Ile was sorry to say that it
was at variance with those statements which, on
the first day of the Session, the House had heard
from the Noble Earl opposite, that considerable
improvement had taken place in the state of our
manufactures. lle saw the Noble Earl preparing
to refer to the King's Speech, in which some ex-
ceptions had been .made to that general state-
, meat. Undoubtedly Birmingham was one of,
those exceptions, for the Petitioners stated that
the master manufacturers were not able to em-
ploy the-mannfacturing population for more than
three or four days in the week, and that the rest
of the time they were obliged to seek their sub-
.sistence from parish relief. This was a state-
ment of a most distressing nature, and of the
truth of which it was impossible to entertain
the slightest doubt. For when the distress .had
pressed most heavily last year, a Committee had
been appointed in the town of ,Birmingham to
inquire into its causes and extent. The N embers
of the Committee had examined the different
parts of the town, and submitted certain ques-
tions to individuals capable of throwing light
upon the subject. • From the information. thus
collected, it. appeared that a diminution of one-
third Inzd taken place in the general consumption
of the necessaries of life, beer, meat, and even
bread ; and that even this diminished consump-
tion was in a great measure supported by credit.
The Report of a Mr. Ryan, employed by that
Committee, stated that there was a falling off of
one or two thirds in the trade of publicans, and
that amongst butchers it e: as still worse : that.
those people who had. been accustomed to take
good joints, -were now only able to buy morsels:
that there was a great demand for neats' livers
and for two-penny and three-penny worth of
meat at a time. The consumption of bread was
equally diminished. All this was'most afflicting.

Ilad, the inquiry been carried five years back, a
doubt might have arisen whether that distress had
not been occasioned by the sudden cessation of the
great demand occasioned by the war. But the in.;
quiry went only two years back, not extending
beyond 1818, when the country I.:1d been at peace
for a considerable time. The distress which it had
found to exist could not therefore be considered
a the effect of the transition from war to peace.
The present Petition had been voted, as he. had
already stated, in the month-of August last. Af-
ter hearing 'the consolatory statements of the
Noble Earl opposite,. he (Lord Grey) had hoped
that the Town of Birmingham had shared in the
improvement said to have taken place, in our ma-
nufactures. ile,had therefore thought it neces-
sary to inquire how the matter stood, before he
submitted the Petition to t_helJonse. The—an-
swer to his inquiries hati-be*Vitdt.tbortgh there
was 'some increased demand, it was,ustially the
case at that time of the year, and inconsequence
•of speculations in -South
.America,
.the general
distress was rather on- the increase: The depre-
ciation in iron articles was not less than 20Yor 25
per cent. ; in brass, from 5 to 15 ; in. spoons,
locks, and plated articles, 5 ; and in spades,
from 15 to 20 per-cent. In the poor rates there

had been some diminution, not in consequence of
a less number of individuals to be relieved, but
because the price of provisions was lower. But
the difficulty of collecting them had considerably
increased. The arrears on the poor rates for the

last year amounted to 10,090/.,which exceeded
all former arrears. In 1816, the first year after
the war, they had only been 6,5161., and they
had never risen before the present melancholy in-
stance higher than 7,5681. Such was the dis-
tressing situation of that most important district
of the country. What improvements might have
taken place in other quarters he knew not,-but
he doubted their existence ; the, more so, as the
present Petitioners stated, that according to the
information which they had been able to collect,
the other manufacturing districts bad suffered in

the same .degree with themselves. In Lanca-
shire it was possible, that from the low price of
provisions, and an increased demand, some im-
provement had- been felt, but the general state of
manufactures wr;s reduced rather than improved.
In the laSt year there had been a considerable
diminution of manufacturing capital. - But his
doubts were, not founded only on the state of
the manufacturing branches, they also rested on
that of the agricultural interest, which had deep-
ly suffered. The trade of the country -had as-
sumed a totally different character. Exporta-
tions. were now made, not in consequence of
demands ,from abroad;
...lait:ifrom ..specula-
tions at home. Goods ivere sent Where
it was• thought probable they might find
a market. The whole trade was in an unnatural
state; exhibiting at one time a, degree of morbid
excitement, and at another time one of despon-
dency and laugour,' occasioned .by something
which rendered investigation necessary. • The

Noble Earl opposite had attributed the existing
distress to an increase of productionr and had
urged the diminution of prices, as a proof of his
assertion. lie (Lord G.) much doubted the fact.
He admitted that the harvest had been abundant.
last year, but not that there had been an increase
of production. Farmers, on the contrary, were
not able to cultivate their lands as well as for-
merly. Cultivation, in fact, diminished every day,
and was likely to continue to grow worse. By the
last Gazette, it appeared that the price of corn
was only 545. or 555., or 7s. per bushel. Under
the present great weight of taxation, how would
it be possible for farmers to pay the demands
which existed upon them ? The Noble Earl,
when distress had become so general, bad first
ascribed it to the sudden transition from war to
peace ; then to the depressed state of the Ame-
rican market : though, in , another House, the
Chancellor of the Exchequer had attributed it
to a more probable cause, the return to cash pay-
ments. In fact, some shift or other had always
been resorted to for the purpose of disguising the
truth. He (Lord Grey) could not doubt that
the principal cause of that distress was the im-
mense load of taxation, aggravated by the state
of the circulation, as the endeavour to restore
cash payments operated as an addition of twenty-
five7per cent. to the taxes. Nnether the country
could continue to bear such pressure became every
day more problematical ; but it was a subject
to which Parliament could no longer shut its
eyes, unless it wished to wait till it should burst
upon its consideration with irresistible vio-
lence. To anticipate such a time, the Peti-
tioners prayed that the House would be pleased
to take the subject into its _ most serious conside-
ration, and to institute an inquiry into the causes
of national distress. After stating this he, should
say why he should not move for the institution
of such an inquiry.. First, the state of, his
health made it impossible that he should under-
go the confinement which such an inquiry
would require, -though be should be glad
to give his support and assistance to any
investigation which might be proposed by
other_ Noble Peers on the subject. Second-
ly, though he admitted that such iniquities
were not beyond the powers of Parliament,
he had seen that if they were not undertaken
by Government itself, they seldom pro-
duced much good. This was strongly exem-
plified by the result of the Committee appointed
last year,- on the motion of a Noble Friend of his
(the Marquis of Lansdowne) to inquire into the
state of our foreian trade. After a laborous in-
vestigation, the Committee had only been able to
make up its mind on one single point, and had
recommended an alteration in the timber trade.
lie did not apprehend that much more would be

effected this year,.aa-he understood, that it would
be necessary to wait for the report of another
Committee, by whom the subject had not yet
been investigated. He therefore doubted whether,
unless the government of the country, with all
the means of information which. it possessed,
should come down to propose and undertake an
inclUiry, any investigation commenced in -another
quarter could prove efi-e ca
H
ve- and beneficial.—
aving stated that he would not. propose such
an inquiry, he should now only move that' the
Petition be read. . .
he Petition having been read,
The Earl of LAYER:POOL rose to make a few
observations, chiefly on the remarks with which
the Noble Earl had prefaced his motion. With
respect to the Petition, he could have no objec-
tion to its being laid before the House, or, refer-
red to the Committee on Fr:reign Trade, :he "
re-
vival of which a Noble -Marquis opposite had
stated his intention of proposing. He wished
first to correct an involuntary misconception into
which the Noble Earl had fallen, respecting one
part of his Majesty's Speech. The greatest care
had been taken so to word that Speech as to pre-
vent the posSibility of its being understood to
assert that all our commercial zultnanufacturing_
interests had improved. The paragraph in ques-
tion said—" I have great pleasure in being able
to acquaint you, that a considerable improve-
ment lias taken place in several of the most-im-
portant branches of our commerce and manufac-
tures, and that in many of the manufacturing dis-
tricts the distresses which prevailed at the com-
mencement of the last Session of Parliament have
greatly abated." But, in another paragraph of
the Speech, the following words had been intro-
duced—" Amidst the distress which still presses
upon a large portion of my subjects." It was,
therefore, a complete misapprehension to suppose
that the Speech did not admit the existence of
great distress in the manufacturing districts of
the country. He, (Lord L.) even thought that'
on the first night of the Session lie had stated
that the town of Birmingham was one where con-
siderable distress existed, in consequence of the ab-
sence of improvement in that branch of trade to
which it was particularly devoted. But notwith-
standing this exception, the improvement in other
branches was real. It had. been considerable in a
most important one, the cotton trade. The • last.
accounts from Lancashire and Scotland esta-
blished that gratifying fact, and stated, not only
that more men were employed, but that the de-
mand for cotton in the port of Liverpool had
greatly increased. As to the question raised by
the Noble Earl with. respect to the state of agri-
culture, this was not the time . for discussing the
subject. But distress could not: be fairly attri-
buted to one single ,cause, when it. was clear that
it must proceed from many. With respect to
his.assertion on the first day of the Session, that
one of the causes which operated with othera to
distress agriculture in the United Kingdom, was
a great increase of production, on Cluit was it
founded ? On a fact, which he believed had not
occurred before during the last fifty years.; that
since the month of February, ISI 9, there had been
no foreign corn introduced into the country for.
home consumption. He knew that the fact had
been disputed, and that it had been imagined
that the warehousing system might lead to the
secret introduction of foreign corn. But he also
knew that the subject had been thoroughly inves-
tigated in another place last year, by a person
who entertained strong prejudices on that. point,
and who, at the end of the inquiry, was fully sa-
tisfied that no secret introduction of foreign corn
took place. The country had, therefore, been
two whole years without any importation of fo-
reign corn, and-though the Noble Earl had been
right in saying that the harvest had proved
abundant, yet it was more soin the northern,
than in the southern parts of the kingdom. The
fact was, that two years had elapsed, without
foreign importation, therefore afforded a strong
presumption, that maincrease of production.-had
taken place at home. It'had been supposed that -
an augmented importation from Ireland might
have produced that effect ; but if, that were the
case, it was still an increased production in the
United Kingdom. With respect to that part of
the country with which he was best acquainted,
he knew that during the .war, when the Conti-
nent - Was closed to our• trade, large districts, of
land bad been brought under the plough, which
had never been ploughed before, and from which
it was then-intended to raise only a few crops.—
But they had been kept in the same condition,
and had thus added to agricultural distress. For
the Noble Earl could not deny that the poor
land thus forced into cultivation and bringing
forth at a greater expence had occasioned an un-
natural and excessive 'increase of production. As
to the weight of taxation, neither the HOuse nor
the country should forget that since the return
from war to peace- it had been diminished to
the amount of not less than fifteen or sixteen
millions annually. The IS Earl said that a
return to cash payments was.one of the causes of
the present distress. It might certainly operate
to some extent, but it was a measure which had
not been adopted blindly., It had been support-
ed even by the .arguments of those who
had objected to the war, and it only occasioned
a temporary inconvenience, which it was neces-
sary should be' borne. That the distress expe-
rienced Went to the extent stated by the Peti-
tioners, be was not inclined to believe. II eshould
not, however, on the present occasion, enter more
deeply into the subject. Ile had no objection to
the Petition being referred to the Committee. on
foreign trade, and if 4ny remedy or cure could
be advised, it would be the duty of Parliament to
consider it.with attention. lie hoped, however,

The Marquis of Lthcsbow:in rose i:i conse-
quence of some expressions contained in the.-Peti-
tion now before the House, and some observations
which had 'fallen from the two'Noble. Earls by
whom he had been preceded. He should how-
ever begin'by declaring his firm conviction,. that
the clwaete,K;of the persOns from whorl the Peti-
tioii proceeded, and the means of infortiation
which they possessed, combinej• to entitle it to
the most serious attention. The 'expressions to.
which lie had alluded referred Co' the Committee
on Foreign Trade, for which be -had moved last
Session. When he had made that tmition, he
had stated that, in order to be efreaive, the re-
searches of the Conunittee'should be confined to
our foreign trade; but that whilst he considered
it the duty , both of Parliament and of his Ma-
jesty's Government to engage in that inquiry, he
should not object to any other Which might
be connected with the subject. When the Noble
Earl opposite said, that the present 'Petitit,n
might be referred to the Committee ate Foreign.
Trade, he (the Marquess of -L.) could not for-
bear thin•king that it was -More connected with
the state of the home trade of the country.--
The Noble Earl had stated, that the existing dis-
tress was not equally diffused amongst a'A
branches of trade, fn this opinion he entirely ccsn-
curred. It was most satisfactory to know, that
in the important branch of cotton trade the ex-
ports from Liverpool, and 'from Mai\chester,
through Liverpool, had of late considerably in-
creased. , lie had not seen the' document in the
possession of the Noble Earl (Lord 'Liverpool),
but he had received private information frcha
those places, which confirmed the statement that
a considerable,:improvement4had taken place.
Trade might therefore be represented to be.in
those quarters, and to a certain extent, in a flea rich-
hip- condition. But its, profits were extreinely low.
The capitals employed did noftolerive '.the profits
to--which they were entitled ; and capitalists were
only in the situation of persons deriving some
slender profits from a trade which two years ago
did not produce any. I.t was. the effect of that
necessity' to which persons, who had engaged
-ltecge capitals in any. particular tleglQ, were vis-
duced, of taking a profit of only two or three per
cent., because it was not in their power to trans-
fer their capitals to other branches. This Was
the present prosperity of their trade. The Noble
Earl opposite had attributed the existing distres,4
to an increase of production ; but more probable
causes might be assigned. i t would, indeed,. be
very singular if after referriag to our corn inii,o4-ts
informer years, during a state of war, the country
should suddenly be found after a peace to have,
become an exporting, instead of an importing
country. Was it not More probable ri lien the
distresses of the people were considered, that it
was to a diminished consumption that the llouse
were to lock for the increase of production which
appeared to have taken place,? And not only to
a diminished consumption, but to the consump-
tion of inferior articles? It had been our con-
stant effort for many years to drive the lower
classes to consume inferior' articles, and the at-

tempt had at length succeeded. A great portion
of the population who hitherto lived on corn DOW
subsisted on potatoes. Was not this a more plo-
bable reason than that which attributed to the

cultivation of poor lands, an effect which, during
'2O years, it.had not produced ? As to the cali of
the petitioners for an inquiry . into cause
and remedy of their distresses, he could have
no objection to such an investigation, ex-
ccp.t the difference which existed :between
their situation and that of bur foreign trade. For
the latter might be extended by - the removal of
restrictions and duties, but the difficulties. which
affected.our home consumption were not within
the reach of the same remedy or the investigation
of, an. ordinary Committee. The best 'mode
would be for his Majesty's 'Government to insti-
tute an inquiry in the first, place, and for indivi-
duals to originate various measures in Parliament.
He felt convinced that the present distress ought
in a great measure to be ascribed to tin: country
living a longtime on its capital and being now
brought to a condition of living on its revenue ;
with a degree of taxation which that revenue was
unable to pay, and which was aggravated. by the
necessary atid too long deferred return to raslt
payments. A measure which could only be
.e.tfected. by principles and means which, -adding
to a taxation already existing td an amount
greater than in any other 'country in the world,
clogged and hampered all the means which tha
country possessed of adapting itself to the new
state of things. If he was right in 10s opinion, it
was not to a Committee that the country qlould
look, for a remedy, but to a determination; on the
part of its Government to reduce the public ex-
penditureby every means at its disposal, and
above all, by a determination on the part of Par-
liament.norlo allow any partial intereqs, how=
ever. pow-erful, to interfere with those broad prin-
ciplesof trade,. by which alone new commerce
could be created, new capital called into ac-
tion, and those impediments removed, which in
this, as in other countries, put a check, to commei--
cial prosperity. Much were it to be ciciAyd, that
those great Sovereigns of the world, asuntibled at

coppan or Layhach, instead of devising plans
to violate the independence of nations, and
establish a system of arbitrary despotism on the
Continent, should_only meet to remove the im-
politic restrictions still fastened on European
Commerce,,and thus do more to effect that which
they Professed to
.be their object, the tranquilli-
2atiou of the world, which rested on the pros-
perity of trade, than by any military menace
Iyhich they might adopt. Much .towards the
nttainmentof that-great.objeet.might be accom-
plished by the Government of this country, by
the,-removal of ths yostrictions existing on foreign
ttade ; and he trusted more to. their -efforts and
to the suggestions of iadisiduals to promote trade
at home and abroad, than to the . labours of a
Committee. Should; however, the present Pe-
tition be referred to the Committee on Foreign
Trade, far from opposing the inquiry, though he
-might not be able to take an active,part in it, he
rhotild give it his most sincere-sapport.
InriCAL-rnoRPE could skate, from his personal
knowledge, that the individuals who had signed'
the present .Petition were incapable of putting
their names to -any facts of which .they did not
1.. ao w the reality, and that they possessed the
most complete means of information. He could
not help hoping, as far as the Fofeign Trade was
concerned, that the Committee which sat last
and which was about to be revived, would
sit:nze to the country all attainable advantages.
e was therefore glad that the Noble Earl who
had presented the Petition had not moved for a
new_ Committee, which Might have the effect::of
tlistracting the labours of the old. Yet, he•felt
desirous that some Committee of the nature pro-
posed by the Petitioners shotild be appointed in
that or the other house. lie hoped that the
public wish, expressed in both Houses by num-
berless Petitions, would induce his Majesty'sMi—
risters to sanction the appointment of such a Com-
mittee to investigate the causes of the existing
distress, or at Last to afford an opportunity of
ascertaining what were the circumstances which
affected agriculture.

1"e;r,

The Petition was laid on the table, and the
irou.,e adjourned.

HOUSE OF COMMONS, FEB.S.

On the motion of Mr. CURWEN, it war's ordered,
That an. Account be laid on. the table, of. the
quantity of Tallow imported, and the amount of
Duty thereon, from the sth of January, 1820, to
the sth of January, -182.1.
A similar Account was ordered of the nun*r of Quarters
of Foreign Oats for the same period.
• A similar Account was ordered of the amount of Duties le-
viei on Agricultural Horses, from the sth of April, 1819, to
the sth of April, 1820.
Mr. JAMES gave notice of a motion for the 19th instant,
relative to the employment of Military Force at the Election
for Carlisle. _ _ .

WILLIAM LEMON presented a Petition from the
Freeholders and oiher loyal Inhabitants of Bodmin, in the
County of'Cornwall, praying for the restoration of the Queen's
name to the Liturgy.
Mr. D. GILDEIIT thought himself called upon to state
that an Address to ;the King of a ditTerent nature froni the
rosent Petition, and -signed by the principal andmost of the
respectable Inhabitants of the borough of Bodmin, had been
presented to his Majesty. He did not wish to interfere with
tne right of individuals to speak their sentiments,—they had
e6771-' their duty, and he had, done his in making this state-

Sir 'WILLIAM LEMON - observed, that he had nietelv
rlene his duty in presenting the Petition—it vots the Pt7t:_titn of
the uncierzigned individuals.—Ordered to be printed.
_ The Hor.ouratle Aleinbcr., also pro.s.,:nted a similar Petition
frog the Parish of Bodrnin..

Sir W. LEMONmoved for an account of all Tin exported
from, and also all imported into Great Britain, from the sth of
January, 1820, to the sth of January, 1821.—Ordered.
Mr. J. STUART presented a Petition from the Royal Burgh
of -Wigtoun,praying for the restoration of her Majesty's name
in the' Liturgy—Ordered to be printed.
Colonel PALMER presented a Petition from Bath, praying
for a Constitutional Reform in Parliament,-nod for the restora-
tion of the Queen's name to the Liturgy, and the full restitu-
tion of all her rigbts,--Ordered to be printed.
NORTH-WEST PASSAGE.

Sir GEORGE CLERK brought up a Bill, entitled " A.
Bill for amending the, Longitude Act," which was read a first,
and crcier.sd to be read a second time to-morrow.
Nir. BENNETT moved for an Account of the number of
Criminal Info'rmations filed by the present A,ltorney-General.
0:-•'ered. _ _

Mr. CHET WYND rnovEo for an Accourt of the 'amount of
the r-ims paid by the Treasurers of the difnrent Counties of
:England and Wales towards the maintenance and passing .of
Vagrants to their homes for the last three years: The Hon.
Gentleman- gave notice, that when the Papers were produced,
]in should make a motion on this subject, tending either to do
awry altugether zhe present system, or greatly to ameliorate it:
He believed the amount was nearly 14.10,0091. annually.

Lax. Alderman WOOD hoped the City of London would be
eTernnted from tlie necessity of sending in these accounts.
This was agreed to and the Papers ordered accOrdingly.
Lord NUCti.:NT presented a Petition from the Town of Lei-
crater ATICI its vicinity; signi-.11 by upwards of 4000 individuals,
pr.a-fing the restoration of tse Qucen's name to the Liturgy,
and to all her legal ri,-;hts—elso for an inquiry into the Milan
L'-mmistion—Ordered to be printed.