The Sun.
London, England, 1819-12-15 00:00:00

t means of embarrassing them in the first insfence'
and to defend which the maxims that must be
laid down were any but those which ought to ge
vern them in the important work of legislatiou.
Mr. TianNitv remit ked, that there %vete but
few instances in which he could approve of thd
conduct of the Noble Lord, but he most entireli
approved of the temper with which the prestOE
-.notion had been met.--(Hear'.)—For the Hood
and for the Country he felt himself called upon t''
thank the Noble Lord for what he-had done. Ha
rejoiced that the means were to be affordetl-P
them of refitting the calumnies oat of doors, which
represented them as fixed, tinder all circumstance,
to make no alteration in the present'Systeth: 'Oe
only objection made' by the •Noble Lord to 41°
plan 'of Isis Noble Friend was', that, if adisisted iA
ail cases where 'a 'Borough was 'disfratichiied, tio;
franchise must be transferred to some popdo3°•
place, where a number of fieelsolders Must
in commaiii with those houselinkteia who' hatlO.,
forfeited their votes by corruption. There wool°
certainly be something anomalous in this, but the
evil would be temporary, sis the householder's tigiA,
would not, like the freeholder's estate, descend
from father to son, and in a few years that to
which the Noble Lord objected must be Moll,
done away. This was the only real objectiouo
the Noble Lord. He (Lord.C.) bad said that 1$
disapproved of the adoption of an abstract systeide
For Isis part he differed front the Noble-Lord'9.°
this point, and thought this would lie 'agreet-10'
vantage. He, however, would waive this quell:
tion, and come to the point at once, as it was
object to get from Ministers all the Partials-tented
Reform lie could, anti feel really grateful for stif
thing that they would concede towards iniproSing
the present system. He understood, then, that al
Noble Lurd opposite had said, it his Noble Fried°
would withdraw his present motion, and bri4
in a Bill to disfranchise the Borough of Graff'
pound, and give the elective franehise taken ffso
it to some populous place, that he would not or,
pose (he_ did not mean to hold the 'Noble LW:
pledged to the particular provisions of the Bill.
the introduction of such measure. His Nol!
Friend then had first to bring in Isis Bill, and el'
'terwards 'it would only be for the House to cad'
• sidee in what way the two Members should bt
disposed of—whether they should be given to tad
adjacent district, or transferred to some distant Pe
pulous place. He knew not what might be IV
decision of his Noble Friend, but be would advi°,
that the Members should not be given to tovr
county, but to some populous town. This, ti.
thought, was the principle which ought to be act'
ed upon. If it were intended to erect a new House
'of Commons on the model of that now existing'
consisting of the representation of borough''
cities, and counties, he would ask it the first ob.:
ject would not be to ascertain where there
the greatest population—where the greatest 5C
1h
nso lly-
colation of property I Could any man da
that this would he the object Time and circterd'
stances had changed the character of many placed'
and transferred their population to other district.'
so that some of those that formerly had a right l°
send Members to Parliament, ought not to cod;
timle to enjoy that privilege. In such cases, 11
thought the elective franchise might well be (es
moved from these depopulated Boroughs,
Leedi, Halifax, or other large and populet
towns. .He was sure such a change svn-ho
be hailed with great satisfaction by 11! '
people, 'as an auspicious omen of the dispnij(
tion of that House a the Government.
was on this principle that the Noble Lord, eel
under Mr. Pitt, at the time of the Union svi
Ireland, had chalked out what was thought
very wise plan for arranging the represented;
of the Sister Kingdom, in which county ref4o
actuation was made greatly to predominate 014/
that of cities and boroughs. All that was 1100
necessary for Isis Noble Friend to do, WO hi
bring in a 'Bill to disfranchise Gratnpound, and
would then propose to him that the two Merobt#
should be transtetred to the town of Leeds. 0
his Noble-Friend would take his advice, he sv"100
not lose one moment in closing with the I4od
Lord opposite, ou the concessions which he 1.14
offered to make. This was the best
,proceePo
which he had witnessed for the last two or Oil
months, and he hoped that before long the 6.11)1i
course would be pursued with' respect to otll
boroughs, and the result, he was certain, W 0
be highly beneficial to the country. el
Lord Lord CASTLEREAGH, in explanation, .repe°
that he should not object to the Bill being hro"gel
in. Though he objected to the remedy roe%)
by die Noble Lot d being applied to Cornwell ell
the present instance, he did not pledge
that he would in no instance approve of its e°oo,
lion. He declined pledging himself to ,Dy
street system. The Noble Lord could 1)64011
his Bill, told if his view of the subject shonic‘fil I
different from that of the Noble Lord, lie' (";011
Castlereagh) could move what he thought
sary as an amendment. He wished to effg 1)i
Reform in the Borough of Grampomid,
was desirous of keeping clear of theories
might involve dangerous consequences. viii
Mr. W. WY NH spoke, but • horn the °di'.
which prevailed in the House, was nearly illssolif
ble in the gallery. He was understood 10 le°
that the general question would be better discoisiid
when the merits of the particular case on
the measure was to he founded came belnreoo
House, and he therefore declined entering

it at large on the present occasion.
Mr. litAKe stated, that, with the permissitlolo
the House, he would shortly notice his rC,+Jbli
for opposing all the Resolutions of the
Loid ; at the s.inie time he would not disltqviii
harmony which now so happily subsisted bot;.'oo'
the Noble Lord and the Right Hon. Gei
(Mr. Tierney) by giving a negative to the roll
cidar point upon which they agreed. He14111)01;
eti that ibis spit it did not commeuee soi"e
sooner, as he was sore, if it had .done sOl'tp
Right Hon. Gentleman would have' tolvg`i-jecoirl
House and the Country muck time and 411frioti.
He received %vitt' every. respect the propos"' 40.;
the Noble Lord, because there w,,,s no WI
tion, especially on the present subject. `III lit”: 11
House would not feel disposed to receive
any. Member of the ilouse of Russell ; `11,',011`1:
feeling Wits increased in consequence Of ilk:
mode r aand talent with which tr-pti'''
Lord brought forward his motion. 14'