The Sun.
London, England, 1844-02-17 00:00:00

the Protestant Mayor of Wexford heading a procession to the
mass-house. He (Mrs D'lsraeli) mentioned that to show that
the position that was always assumed in that House, viz., that
the present state of feeling in Ireland was the consequence of
the Protestant connection, was one of error. It was not so, but
it was the consequence of Puritanism—it was the consequence
of that system which had been destroyed in this country, and
which the people had been all banded together to support:
With respect to the rebellion of 1641, which was a rebellion
not against the Monarch but against the Parliament, it led to
the establishment of the Government upon an essentially na-
tional character—it led to the formation of the Convention of
Kilkenny, which was in the habit of entering into
treaties with the King of England. One of those trea-
ties, that for the settlement of the Government of
Ireland, was executed with that Convention by Lord
Glamorgan, afterwards the celebrated Marquis of Worcester.
The secret articles of the treaty were, that the Roman
Catholics should enjoy the same privileges which they had
enjoyed at the beginning of the war, and both churches
should be recognised as being perfectly equal. Those were
the secret articles of the treaty of Glamors-an, which was
ratified by Charles I. It was not, therefore, a necessary
quality of Toryism that the Tory party should entertain feel-
ings of towards Ireland.—( Hear, hear.) The Tory
party did not invent the penal code. It was necessary to keep
this in view. Hon. Gentlemen on his side of the House
should not consider that a feeling of antipathy to Ireland was
an heir-loom in their political creed.—( Hear, hear.) The
party opposite could be as little considered the favourers of
free trade as the natural allies of the Irish people.—( A laugh. )
The Noble Lord (Palmerston) laughed, but he begged to
remind him it was not the Tory party who introduced the
penal code, nor what was called puritanical episcopacy into
that country.—( Hear, hear.) From the moment that was in-
troduced the pure Protestant Church lost all influence over
the island.—(Hear, hear.) The Hon. Gentleman then re-
ferred to the vete he gave last session, and acknowledged that
he was a party man, and considered it the duty of a
Member of that House to become a party man ; but
one of the conditions of becoming a party man
was that they should have a leader, and a leader who was pre.
pared to lead.—(Cheers from the Opposition.) He had a
sincere respect for the Right Hon. Baronet, which he believed,
he would acknowledge, and he should be sorry to make any
animadversions upon him ; but when the Right Hon. Gentle-
man used that celebrated aphorism, that Ireland would be his
chief difficulty, he was one who had no alarm that it would
prove so. He did not believe that Ireland would be the chief
difficulty of the Right Hon. Gentleman, because he believed
that a Minister having great power, and possessing a large
majority, would use them to settle the Irish question.—.
( Cheers from the Opposition.) There was a silence, which
ha rejoiced at, for two years with regard to that question, and
lie was glad they were not called on to give any opinion upon
it; but when the question was forced upon their attention, and
when the Right lion. Gentleman took no part in leading pub-
lic opinion, he could not help thinking that the force of cir-
cumstances had dissolved the party tie on the question of Ire-
land.—( Hear, hear.) One of the greatest admissions ever
made its his time was that Ireland was not a party question.—.
( Hear, hear.) Ireland was in a state of turbulence and com-
motion, and his impression was, that it was the duty of the
Minister to repress turbulence and to ly his mind to put an
end to the causes which produced it.-(Hear, hear.) It was
said that it was impossible to repress it sooner, that
they should wait till a certain quantity of sedition
was realised—( Loud laughter)—and if the Government
had remained quiet for nineteen months, he should be silent.
Ile now came to the question, and all he wanted to do was to
place his own con luct in an intelligible light ; in doing so he
felt lie should be fighting the battle of every Member of the
House. Ho had been taunted with manifesting a new-born
zeal for Ireland. The imputation was not a very heavy one ;
zeal of any kind was such a rare quality, that in this age and
country, the imputation of feeling a new-born zeal was not an
overwhelming one. He wished the Right Hon. Baronet was
equally regenerated.—( Laughter. ) He heard much of the
evil of not giving Ireland identical institutions with England.
Now he always thought that the great cause of the misery of
that country was its having identical institutions with Ireland
forced upon it. What good had Ireland derived from the
juries, the benches of magistrates, like those of England, that
had been forced upon it? The Governmeut in Ireland ought
to be centralised, with a strong administration. He had never
changed his principles on this or any other subject ; they were
the natural principles of the democracy of this country.--
( Hear, hear, and cries of " On, oh.") They were not the
principles hich would have supported the despotism of
Cromwell, but they were the principles described in the
writings of great, and practised by eminent, men.
The Honourable Gentlemen opposite also had principles ;
their principles were distinct and intelligible. He gave the
Whigs credit for entertaining them—their principles had pro-
duced great men, and perhaps great deeds—they were the
principles of the landed aristocracy. Whether there was not
some happy via media between W higgisin and Toryism, he
did not know ; but he had no idea of the Tory party being
pointed out as the tyrants and confiscators of Ireland—as the
men who had invented the penal code; when, on the contrary,
it was the leader of the Tories who, when the Parliament
obliged the people to take the oath of supremacy to the King,
allowed any Irishman to be recusant. Could they have a better
guarantee for justice to Ireland than that granted by Charles
1., and supported by the sanction and advise of Arch-
bishop Laud? If they could only forget two centuries of
political conduct for which the Tory party was not
responsible, they might settle the Irish question with kindness
to the iris!' people. Mr. Pitt—the Tory Minister—
proposed measures which, had they been carried, would have
saved them from the miserable position they now occupied.
The Catholic Church question would have been settled long
ere this ; and he believed it would still be settled at a very
early period on principles analogous to those conceived by the
, great statesmen of 1636. He believed that no one specific
measure would do any good for Ireland; they must reconstruct
the social system of that country; they must begin by organis-
ing a complete and strong executive. If the Noble Lord came
forward with such a comprehensive plan he would sup-
port him at any sacrifice, though he might have to place
Isis seat again at the disposal of his constituent!.
He remembered that he represented the oldest Tory consti-
tuency in the kingdom, and that he inherited good Tory prin-
ciples, and last year, when he supported the tariff of the
Right Hon. Baronet, he went down and explained English
history to his constitnency—(Great laughter)—and he could
assure the House they took the most enlightened views of the
subject. In 1832, when the Right lion. Baronet's party was
smashed—when it was said that he could never revive—that
lie was a doomed man—nothing could have been more difficult
than to re-construct his party. He had not only to do that,
but to remove the prejudices of many eminent persons; and
there he sat, with the Right Hon. Secretaries of State at his
side—who were among those whose prejudices he had to re-
move—( Loud cheers from the Opposition, and laughter)—and
he succeeded in removing them.—( Laughter.) They were
colleagues, of whom lie might be proud ; and it was an encou-
raging example. He thought it was not more difficult to settle
Ireland than to re-construct the Tory party after a revolution.
It was not more difficult to remove the prejudices of those who
had thought but little on the question, than to remove the pre-
judices of those who had thought a great deal.—( Hear, hear. )
He must protest against the new system of government, which
seemed to be the substitution of the mere fulfilment of the
duties of office for true administration. What were all these
Reform Associations—Anti-Corn-law Leagues—Repeal Asso•
ciatioris? They were merely the consequence of the people
taking the Government of the country into their own
hands.—( Hear, hear.) The publie mind, among a free
people—no one in authority took the lead of them—they
coalesced, and very often carried their crude opinions into
effect. if the Government would not lead the people, the people
would drive the Government.—( Cheers.) lie could not vote
for the motion of the Noble Lord, because he did not see that
he promised more than her Majesty's Ministers. He wished to
hear some mall say that the Irish question should be settled.
Ile had been told that this was a physical question—and again
that it was a spiritual
is question. There was great distress among
the people, great dtress amonghe middle classes, and some-
times there was a talk of foreign interference among the
Papists. The only way in which you can inform yourselves
upon these matters, and come to a wise opinion upon them, is
to look around you upon the great features of society, and see
upon what principles Government is established. And having
done this—having cast your eyes over other countries and
upon he
ulatiot
formed an honest opinion 4 m—anttlsi encombrpiarirge to
t
Ireland the same unimpassioned spirit as you have
done to the wello -beingon of
of another country.—( Cheers. )
itr with what
hiei see the
p p Ireland,
itself receives from the soil, and you shall find
that country more thickly peopled in proportion than is China
at the present day. Such is the quantity of food which this
country affords to its own population, and that too of a quality
the lowest that can be conceived.--(Cheers.) So that the
Hear
Irish population has not what every other population of the
globe—not excepting even the Poles have, he meant a resort
in
oopultioina
ffaame; , hear.) And in the midst of
this thus left to misery and want, there is a
thed e
o cases e p
Church which does not belong to the people, and a territorial
aristocracy, the major part of which is resident in Paris—and
to remedy all these the weakest Executive in the world.-
-( Hear, hear.) What would they say of any other country
in which there were such things as these'?.—(Cheers.) They
might say that did such things as these exist in another
country there could only be one remedy, and that must be
found its revolution. But they could not indulge in revolution in
Ireland, and why ? Because of their connection with a more
powerful neighbour. England then, by its connection, was put
in this odious position that an English Ministry has to do all
peaceably and quietly for that country, which in any other
country could only be hoped for by a revolution. It was quite
evident that they must have an Executive in Ireland, which
bore an irnediate relation to the aristocracy. But that Execu-
tive could not improve Ireland by mere Acts of Parliament.
'The moment they had an equality in the two Churches, then
they might hope for order in Ireland, and when order came,
famine would gradually disappear, and prosperity gradually
come. But this would not be rapid. NN hat mattered that ?
Fifty years was nothing in the history of a country. The Right
lion. Baronet, Sir Robert Peel, might do much to lay the
foundation of this, and he hoped would do so. But he did
not think the effect would be created by the Hon. Member for
Belfast (Mr. E. Tennant), or, as he supposed on a former
occasion, by the King of France. lie looked for this to a
power much more influential. He looked to that power which
was not only more intelligent, but more benignant.—(Cries of
" Young England.") No, he did not mean young England ;
( Laughter)—but he meant that power which stated that any
question that could not bear discussion was doomed.—( Hear. )
Mr. WARD then rose to addres the House. Some parts of
of the Honourable Gentleman's speech he would not attempt
to discuss.—( Hear, hear.) He would not attempt to touch
that which was unintelligible.—( Hear.) lie could not, for
the life of him, see how the lion. Member could expect the
settlement of this Irish question, after the speeches that had
been made on the subject, without some conciliation.—(Hear,
The Hon. Member had talked much of the course
that had been pursued in Ireland. lie had attempted to de-
scribe much of its history, and had talked of rebellion
there; at that rebellionn
why he ought to have known t to
which he referred related only to three provinces.—(Hear,)
He was thrown back necessarily,
Nothing would be done, for
inevitably thrown back, on
the motion of his Noble Friend.
from the moment the Right Hon. Gentleman obtained the
support of his agricultural friends, however good the motion
might be, however strong the arguments, however great the
grievance, there was a foregone conclusion_, a result perfectly
orma
certain, as as far as that House was concern f
ed.
pact had been signed, sealed, and delivered, by whichl they
n
( the Opposition) had been delivered over
to the Government
Members for two or three years. But lion. must not shrink
from avowing their opinions because they were unpopular.
There was another and a higher tribunal.—public opinion, and
it was the duty of the representatives o of the people to keep
Parliament.—(Bear,
these things continually before the eyes f
Bear.) It was a very remarkable fact in the present debate
that if words were things (as Lord Byron said), and if they
could credit the ono-half of what lion. Members on the other
and the lio.n. Member for
side of the House said, there was hardly any difference between
Hon. Members on both sides of the Douse. An lion. Mem-
ber who spoke early in the debate,
for Waterford, on the necessity of restoring tranquillity to
the University of Dublin, fully concurred srit.h the Hon. Member
Ireland, and pursuing a mild and conciliatory course of policy
towards Ireland. The Right Honourable Baronet the
Secretary of State for the Home Department ex-
pressed his disapprobation of holding Ireland by mi-
litary occupation, and said he should prefer governing
the people through their affections. But he (Mr. Ward) had
much rather deal with parties than phrases ; and when he
looked to the present state of things in that country, and when
lie remembered the declarations of the Hight Hon. Baronet,
lie mgg. M duced tq belieye that
sit long Ireland w4s tleatimal, fora
lied undefined, a
the present party continva in