The Sun.
London, England, 1844-07-13 00:00:00

THE SUN, LONDON, SATURDAY EVENING, JULY 13, 1644.

, country, that the great defence of the British empire is not
neglected by its rulers. At home indeed the exhibition is in
no danger of being productive of anything but good : with
us it is proverbial that "strong men begin no brawls," for it
is the Englishman's instinct always to repose upon the
consciousness of strength and superiority, not to exer-
cise them. We are confident that the first conclusion
drawn by nine-tenths of the readers of the article
referred to has been something like this—Well,
thank Heaven, there is little danger of war with any Euro-
ropean power for another thirty years. It is only when the
safety of his country, or its honour, seems to be in doubt,
that the Englishman is uneasy or irritable. Nor are we
very apt to take alarm upon slight grounds. When,
four years ago, M. Thiers took occasion to pick a
quarrel with us, and took measures for placing about
one million and a quarter of men under arms, the
most perfect calm and good humour prevailed in Eng-
land—and even now we contemplate without the least dis-
satisfaction, a French standing army of 600,000 men ;—not
certainly underrating the military efficiency of the gallant
people who so lately overran the continent of Europe, but
confident in the good sense of its intelligent classes, that
they will not allow the resources of their country to be
again squandered in conquests that must be, from the
nature of things, but temporary, and therefore useless. The
truth is, that we have long ceased to regard our neighbours
as natural enemies, how haruly soever some of them may
occasionally speak of us. On the other hand, we feel
that we are natural allies in the most sacred of all
worldly services, the service of civilisation and
liberty. In this service each country has received from
Providence its peculiar mission, explained in its special
capabilities—France to protect the liberty and the civilisa-
tion of Europe, by her numerous and high-spirited popula-
tion ; but England on the other side may say to her neigh-
bour—

" Non Him imperium pelagi scevumque tridentem,
Sed mihi sorte datum."
England claims by her commerce, her naval power, and her
innate love of freedom, to emancipate and to civilise
through gentle means the ruder portion of the human
race. It is impossible to overrate the blessing to the
whole of mankind of the entente cordiale between
England and France, at which some of the incen-
diary party in Paris affect to be so indignant,
and about which our English incendiaries are so
facetious. This entente cordiale, however, can long subsist
only between equals treating each other as equals ; and cer-
tainly it will be most secure in each of the parties knowing the
actual amount of its own and of the other's power. Such
knowledge is, however, best communicated by such
pacific expositions as that we copy to-day. Sir
Charles Napier, we know, thinks differently from us ; he
would prove the power of England by a huge squadron in
the Mediterranean, just at the moment when it might by
accident fall into hostile collision with the ships of France,
and at the time when it would certainly inflame the war-
fever and strengthen the war-party in the neighbouring
kingdom. At a late meeting of the Chamber of De-
puties, a false suggestion that the British Govern-
ment had done that very thing which Lord Minto
and Sir Charles Napier insisted upon its doing, namely, had
sent a commanding fleet to Morocco, was made the ground
of grave accusation against M. Guizot. The French Foreign
Minister was happily enabled to assert• the falsehood of the
suggestion, and thus the prudence of the British Govern-
ment gave to the wise Minister of the good and wise French
King the power of defeating the anti-English party in
France. These may seem slight matters, but, slight as they
inay appear, the peace and happiness of the world and
the lives of millions depend upon them. It is true that the
Governments of the rival nations have little trouble to keep
from quarrelling the English people, who are too conscious of
their strength to be jealous; and too just and prudent to
think of war upon other grounds. But all the vigilance of
the Governments of both countries is required to withhold
from the perverse war party in France pretexts for exciting ,
their too inflammable population.

WILL of LORD RODNEY.—The will of the Right
Hon. Lord Rodney, late of Berrington Hall, Hereford, has
just been proved by the Right Hon. and Right Rev. Spencer
Baron Rodney and the lion. W. P. Rodney, the brothers of
the deceased. The will is too voluminous (upwards ofeixteen
sheets) to admit of giving anything like an abstract. He
gives to his brothers respectively 4001. and 1001. each ; to
his neices, godson, and butler, 1001. each; to his servants,
one year's wages (if they have been in his service five
years). ' The bulk of his property seems to be left
amongst various branches of his family; and in be-
queathing relics, &c, to friends and others, as tokens of his
esteem, he particularly mentions " four brass ealmone,
taken by my grandfather from the Spaniards," which have
long been objects of peculiar interest at Berrington Hall.
He expresses a strong desire to be buried either at " Somer-
set, Hereford, Southampton, or Kensal Green Cemetery,"
but leaves the choice to his executors. The funeral he
directs to be strictly private, and his coffin "to be carried on
men's shoulders." The will is dated September, 1843, and
the personal property is sworn under 12,0001.
PLUNDER OF Henry Os-
borne was finally examined before Major Allen, J. C. Strode
and J. Borer, Esqrs., the sitting magistrates at Brighton, on
Thursday, on a charge of procuring by fraudulent represen-
tations, a considerable number of copies of the Sussex Ad-
vertiser. It was elicited, in the course of the examination,
that in October, 1843, Mr. Bacon, proprietor of the Sussex
Advertiser, received a letter from James Osborne, Edward-
street, Brighton, requesting to be employed as a news-agent,
with a quire of the papers weekly. The papers were accord-
ingly sent for several weeks, but no remittance following, in-
quiries were instituted, and the prisoner was found to have
left Edward- street. Shortly after this Mr. Bacon received
mother letter, from "James Horsfield, jun., Albion-street,
Brighton," for four papers weekly, which were supplied.
Again no remittance followed, and further inquiries led to the
discovery of an extensive system of newspaper robbery, and
the prisoner's apprehension. Proof was given that these let-
ters, and various others found in his house, in both names,
and all requesting a supply of newspapers, were in the pri-
soner's handwriting. He had distributed his favours with
strict impartiality, for during the fortnight he has been in
custody, copies of nearly every paper in the kingdom, Lon-
don and provincial, have arrived, forming in the aggregate,
as many as would fill a bushel. His plan was, to go himself,
or send his children, to the post-office for the papers in a
variety of names, and then to sell them at 2d. or 3d. per lb.
After deliberating a short time, the magistrates remanded
the prisoner, in order to give time for the preparation of the
depositions ; and he was then committed for trial at the next
sessions

HONEST TRADE.—No less than ninety-one indi-
viduals were fined in different sums on Tuesday last, at Wol-
verhampton, before H. Hill and G. Briscoe, Esqrs., for de-
fective weights, unstamped weights and measures, and unjust
scales. A sad deficiency in the balance of social honesty.
The steam-engine and the schoolmaster may be up and
abroad ; but slow going, "according to Cocker," really looks
better than this.—Ten Towns Messenger..
_ _

A field of peas, seven acres, called the " Nimble
Taylor," at Bemerton, adjoining Fisherton Anger, belonging
to Mr. m. Cottlo, of the former place, has been cut and
carried this fortnight. Both wheat and barley in the neigh-
bourhood of Salisbury are looking exceedingly well, and
promise an excellent crop, and also an early harvest.— Sher-
bor ne Journal, July 11.
The late William Stephenson, Esq., of Stamford,
has secured by deed, for building a church in Deeping Fen,
Lincolnshire, 4,000/. ; for keeping it in repair, 11001. ; for
income for the minister, 5,0001.; total, 9,200/.—Doncaster
Gazette.
IMPEIttALPARLIAMENT.

HOUSE OF LORDS, July 12.
Several petitions were presented against tho Dis
senters' Chapels Bill.
DISSENTERS' CHAPELS BILL.

The Marquis of LANSDOWNkpre;;Ted petitions
from various places in favour of the Commons Amend-
ments to the Dissenters' Chapels Bill.

Noble Friend's notice, that he intended to enter into the
question of the Sinde territory, but he thought that his
inquiry would relate solely to the question of the Pun-
jeub. He (the Earl of Ripon), however, would advert
the whole of the topics which had been introduced by the
Noble Marquis. His Noble Friend had said thatle spoke
entirely upon public rumour as to certain operations
that were going on. Now, public rumour in this in-
stance, as was generally the case, had greatly exagge-
rated the truth. The rumour it appeared was, that an
army of 80,000 men was collecting in the Punjaub for
the purpose of invading and conquering that country.
He could tell his Noble Friend that this rumour was en-
tirely without foundation. He knew of no army being
in existence in that part of the world, except that which
was under the command of Sir C. Napier. With respect
to our military force in the north-west, it was right,
perhaps, that be should rake a few remarks. It was
perfectly well-known that within the last few years it
had been deemed indispensably necessary that a large
portion of the military force in the Presidency of Bengal
should be concentrated in the north-west provinces.
Everybody who was at all acquainted with India knew
that that portion of our territory was most liable to
sudden attack. It was, therefore, indispensably neces-
sary at all times that it should be an object of care, and
it would be obvious to everybody who considered for a
moment the actual condition of the Punjaub, that that
part of our territory ought not to be left without ade-
quate means of self-protection, particularly when it was
recollected that that country immediately joined the
Sutlej. It would be recollected, too, that the affairs of
the Lahore settlement were administered by an ind.pen-
dent chief, who ruled remarkably well. That country
was now very flourishing, and cultivation, he understood,
had greatly extended ; and this very circumstance was
likely to prove a temptation to depredators. He said,
therefore, that they were bound, in good faith to the
Sikhs, and by principles of public policy and justice, to
take care that our position in that quarter was secure.
With this object, a force was maintained there by Lord
Ellenborough and the Indian Government, and he (the
Earl of Ripon) could assure the House that neither the
authorities in India nor at home had any wish or desire
to obtain one inch of territory in that country. Their
views were essentially pacific. Nobody could say, under
the circumstances in which that country was placed, how
soon it might be necessary to defend ourselves. or at least
to defend those for whose defence the British army
was supported. He trusted, however, that he had said
sufficient to allay the fears his Noble Friend entertained.
With respect to Sinde, his Noble Friend asked if he
(the Earl of Ripon) had heard the rumour that it was
intended to extend our territory still further beyond the
banks of the Indus. He had never heard of such inten-
tion having been entertained, and he could say that no
such intention was entertained—(Hear, hear)—either by
means of negotiation or anything else. It was perfectly
true that in the neighbourhood of Shikarpore incursions
had recently been made by an armed body, and there
could be no doubt that they had committed great cruel-
ties. But the number was small, and he trusted that
measures had been taken to prevent a recurrence of such
a misfortune, and that means had been adopted by which
the inhabitants would be protected, and confidence estab-
lished for the future. The last question his Noble
Friend had put to him was whether her Majesty's
Government would be prepared to lay before Parliament
before the end of the session, detailed information as to
the state of affairs in Sinde, especially with respect to
the revenue, and the power of meeting the expenditure
of the country. Ile (the Earl of Ripon) was not pre-
pared to give his Noble Friend that assurance, although
her Majesty's Government were certainly desirous of
giving every information they could upon the subject.
But, he certainly was not prepared to say that they
were in a condition to lay the information asked for on
the table of the House. The Noble Marquis must
recollect the position of this country with respect to
Sinde. Holding that country so recently, it would be
premature to communicate any information respecting
it, which, after all, might be imperfect, and, if imper-
fect not valuable. With respect to the revenue, he could
only say that it had not equalled the expenditure, but
then it must be remembered that they had been called
upon to administer a perfectly new system, that was to
say, a new system so far as conducting the affairs of
that country upon just and reasonable principles was
concerned, and in doing this they were obliged to incur
considerable expense. Sickness had occurred; but it had
occurred as much amongst the natives as others, and, from
all he had heard, there was no reason to expect that
that sickness would be of constant recurrence. There
were very few parts of India in which, from time to
time, sickness which was fearfully destructive did not
occur. He believed he had now noticed the whole of
the topics touched upon by the Noble Marquis.
BANK CHARTER.•
The Earl of RIPON then rose to move the order of
the day for going into Committee on the Bank Charter
Bill; and in doing so he said he would briefly explain
the grounds upon which this measure had been sub-
mitted to Parliament; and in doing this it would not be
necessary for him to detain their Lordships at any
length in discussing the principles of currency and
banking, as that subject had frequently been under con-
sideration in their Lordships' House. It was, however,
necessary for him to state to their Lordships, in the first
instance, how it happened that this question was brought
before them in the present year. In the last Charter
Act provision was made that the Bank Charter might
extend to the year 1855, but that after the expiration of
the first ten years it might be competent to Parliament,
after giving notice, to revise the regulations of that Act,
if circumstances should occur to require it. It was quite
clear, therefore, that Parliament, at the time they passed
the last Act in 1833, did not consider that the provisions
of that Act were so complete or so perfect as entirely to
meet the object intended, and they no doubt considered
that grounds might arise, after experience had been ob-
tained, for the recommendation of the provisions of this
Act. The provisions of the law were, that notice should
be given at the expiration of ten years if it should be
thought expedient to make any change; but in case no
such notice should be given, then the charter was to con-
tinue for the full 21 years. When the period, therefore,
arrived, it was competent for the Government to recon-
sider this question. They felt that there were many con-
siderations which rendered it desirable that some step
should be taken for the purpose of more completely car-
rying out the principles upon which the Act of 1819 was
framed. When the last Act was proposed, many opi-
nions were expressed in favour of a system still more ex-
clusive in its character, as regarded the power of the
Bank of England, than that Act was expected to be.
Many persons expressed an opinion—amongst whom
fdßonitatfnu)l
was his Noble Friend, then Chancellor of the Exchequer
(Lord Spencer)—in favour of one bank of issue in the
country. Many persons went the length of saying that
Government itself ought to be the bank of issue. But
this opinion did not appear to have been generally enter-
thought this would have
policy, if it would not
have been a dangerous one. He thought there were con-
stitutional objections to it. He doubted very much whe-
ther, if the Government had that power, it would really
measure of E
veryarl o
have the power of practically controlling the currency so
much as this theory would suppose. He thought that
there would be great risk in the Government proceeding
from time to time to relax the screw upon the pressure
of a supposed expes di
ency- That view of the subject,
therefore, having been rejected before, was certainly not
adopted by her Majesty's present Government. But
they certainly did think that, looking particularly to the
effect of the law both here and throughout the country,
they did think it was desirable that the Bank of England
should become, not the sole—because, theoretically
speaking, it would be so--but the main instrument for
issuing paper, of creating a paper currency, and provid
ing for the wants of the country. It appeared, and expe-
rience confirmed it, that the principle upon which the Act
of 1819 was based, was not that of trusting everything to
the convertibility of paper into gold, for it did not ap-
pear that that simple principle had the effect of prevent-
ing injurious fluctuation, as was shown in 1825, when
the stock of bullion in the Bank of England was almost
exhausted, and the credit of the Bank was only saved
by the sudden arrival at Dover of a quantity of sove
reigns from the Continent. The Government felt that
it was indispensably necessary that something should be
done to prevent the tremendous evil of fluctuation. It
appeared to them that the only safe rule upon which
they could rely was the foreign exchanges. If they
were against us, the gold must go out. The present
measure was intended to prevent the evil of fluctuation,
and he believed that it had, met with general approba-
tion in all parts of the country. The plan of the mea-
sure was, in fact, to limit the circulation of the Bank of
England in the first place, and to limit the circulation
of the country banks in the second. The limitation of
the Bank of England they proposed to effect in this way
—that they should be at liberty to issue notes to the
amount of the securities which they held, and is exact
proportion to the bullion they might have in their
coffers. In order to effect this the Bank would be di-
vided into two branches—one the bank of issue and the
other the bank of deposit. The amount of issue, in the
first place, would be fourteen millions. It was quite ob-
vious that the sum of fourteen millions would be a very
inadequate provision for the wants of the country ; and,
therefore, it was provided that the Bank of England
should be obliged to issue notes fur all gold bullion that
might be brought to them for that purpose. Their
Lordships would see how this stood at the pre-
sent moment. At the present moment the actual
issue of the Bank did not exceed twenty-four millions,
so that if this scheme were now in force the actual issue
would be fourteen millions on securities and seven millions
upon bullion. But the bullion which they now held was
very nearly, if not quite, sixteen millions, so that their
Lordships would see that, so far from limiting them to
21,000,0001., they might, if they thought proper, extend
that issue to 30,000,000/. ; but he did not mean to say
that it would be desirable for them to do so. This mea-
sure proposed to limit the issue of country banks, but
there was nothing to prevent a country bank—supposing
it now issued notes of its own—to prevent it from giving
up the privilege, and taking to the notes-- of the Bank of
England. The country bank circulation would, there-
fore, pro tanto, be diminished, and power would be given
to the Bank to issue another number of notes on securi-
ties, equal to about two-thirds of the paper that should
be displaced. With respect to country banks, it was
proposed to restrain new banks from issuing paper. He
believed that no scheme could have been devised which,
would not have had some prejudicial effect, and he be-
lieved that the limitation which had now been taken was
just and reasonable, and would answer the purpose for
which it was designed. The actual amount of currency
which might be in circulation under the provisions of this
Bill was about eight millions and a half, on an average
of three months. There were provisions in the Bill
for securing periodical returns of the issues, and these
returns would be made monthly. This he considered a
very important part of the measure. He had now stated
the general provisions of this Bill. The Government
had been anxious to introduce as little of novelty as
possible. They might have raised a question as to
whether the standard should be gold or silver, and pro-
posed various alterations which would have been palat-
able in some quarters; but they did not think it would
bave been expedient to introduce novelties in this melt-

sure. The more he reflected on the subject, the more
convinced was he that all that was wanted was to give
full and beneficial effect to the Act of 1819, and to secure
that certainty which it was the object of this Bill to
attain. Under these circumstances, he trusted their
Lordships would be prepared to go into Committee on
the Bill.
Lord MONTEAGLE said he did not rise for the
purpose of opposing this Bill; on the contrary, it was
founded on principles which he had advocated on former
occasions. He thought the Government deserved in-
finite credit for the manner in which they had carried
forward this measure. What was more striking even
than the courage of undertaking to legislate on such a
question was the peculiar skill with which, by a con-
cession here and an arrangement there, without any
material deviation from the principle on which this Bill
was founded, a measure of this description and mag-
nitude had been proposed and carried through Parlia-
ment with the least amount of opposition ever offerei, he
believed, to a measure of that nature. Nor could he help
alluding to those high authorities from whom chiefly this
measure had proceeded.—(Hear, hear.) He referred not
to any Parliamentary authorities, except s:) far as those
authorities were to be found in evidence before the other
House of Parliament ; but he alluded more els ,eially to
the calm, sound, and practical attention which had been
given to this subject by such men as Mr. Loyd and
others who had devoted their minds to this question.—
(Hear, hear.) Whilst, however, he concurred in the
general principles of this measure, there were some parts
of it to which he could not give his consent. The Bill
had been properly called a complement to the Act of
1819. There was in this country a class of persons who
objected to it on that very account, and who, for that rea-
son, considered it likely to be productive of evil conse-
quences. It was unnecessary for him to go at length
into the discussion of the point of difference, but he
thought no one could hesitate to say that, after the
events which occurred in 1797, and which were con-
tinued till the restoration of cash payments, it was the
absolute duty of thi Legislature to restore the coin to
the state in which it had previously been. He knew it
was said, "Aye, it was right to restore a standard, but,
in restoring the ancient standard of the country, you
inflicted a great wrong on the mass of the community."
If they were to restore a standard at all, he conceived
that they were limited to the ancient standard.—(Hear,
hear.) They heard persons say, " What an injustice
you inflict on the whole community by compelling
them to pay in gold coin, at the Mint price,
debts contracted in paper, subject to a depre-
ciated currency." What an extraordinary fallacy was
there in that statement.—(Hear, hear.) Did not every
one whe had considere4 the subject, know that although
those debts might have been contracted in a depreciated
currency, they were so contracted subject to the obliga-
tion of paying in the full standard at the period subse-
quent to the restoration. There was no standard to
which they could honestly revert, except the ancient
one. Before he quitted this part of the subject, he could
not help saying, in reply to those who were against re-
striction, on account or its pressure upon the productive
classes, that there never was a grosser delusion than the
supposition that the productive classes of this country
were interested in a continued depreciation of the stan-
d trd. The natural effect was a rise of prices.—(Hear.)
Ultimately, indeed, there might be a rise in wages, but
it followed, at a long and painful interval, the rise of
prices. In a depreciated currency they had an evil of
the most portentous magnitude to all, but the evil
pressed more severely on the labouring classes than upon
any other class in the community. On this subject, as
on many others, they had of late made very considerable
progress ; and they were enabled to discuss it with the
aid of experience. Experience had shown that many
remedies hitherto relied upon were altogether valueless.
Between the year 1832 and the present time, the cur-
rency ofthiscountry had not been managed in away which
was satisfactory to the public, safe to the Bank, or con-
ducive to the interest of the labouring classes. They were
now called upon to consider a new proposition; and they
would be rash indeed, if they were to predicate the re-
sult. The experiment was one which the Government
deserved credit for making, for it was based on autho-
rity which fully justified its proposal ; but looking to
the peculiar circumstances of the country, the state of
the manufacturing interests, and its dependence on fo-
reign markets, and other matters, he could not agree
with his Noble Friend that they were, by passing this
Bill, laying the foundation of a perfectly safe and satis-
f ctory state of things. But if, after the passing of this
Bill, there should still be periods of pressure and diffi-
culty in this country, he protested against the supposition
that they were all to be attributed to the work-
ing of this measure.—(Hear, hear.) Now, a great
deal of controversy had been carried on in reference
to the principles upon which this Bill was founded.
They were told by some that it was perfectly absurd to
imagine that any issue of promissory notes payable on
demand could act upon the exchanges, or upon prices?
provided the paper was convertible, and that, therefore,
the mechanism of this Bill was altogether unnecessary.
He could not, he confessed, adopt this theory. Would
any man tell him that the doubling of the quantity of
gold in the country would not have an effect upon prices.
If that were the case, surely the effect with regard to
paper would be the same, if that paper were convertible
into gold. But this Bill was founded on the very oppo-
site theory, viz., that by regulating the paper currency
—the promissory notes payable on demand—they regu-
lated all. He doubted whether there were not
other things besides promissory notes and metallic
coin which acted upon the currency. He believed that
bills of exchange and Bank cheques acted upon the cur-
rency—he believed that every ingenious commercial
contrivance adapted for economising prices acted upon
the currency. He wished to call the attention of the
House to one branch of this species of currency, which
was so entirely identical with promissory notes payable
on demand, that it struck him as matter of surprise,
that it should have been altogether omitted from the
Bill. If it were right to regulate and restrain the
issue of promissory notes payable on demand, he
would like to hear how the Noble Earl would discri-
minate between an accepted post-bill at three or seven
circulation
missory
sight ,
wa
ictche pat e dg be
general
feorrael i
in leftdnr stet
eßn at k
a,
nadn da p up tr
ni n.
note payable on demand. He felt
some anxiety on this subject, lest through
an omission the provisions of the Bill should be ren-
dered a dead letter. The first symptom of weakness in
the Irish banks was the substitution of bank post bills
for promissory notes, to such an extent that the former
constituted one-third of the whole circulation. The Bill
seemed to him to proceed too much on the fallacy that,
by regulating promissory notes, they did everything
that was required. The great merit of the measure was,
he conceived, its approximation to a single issue. The
first effect of a restriction on the part of the Bank of
England would be to raise the value of money; but
that would induce other banks to issue more
money, because the profit would be increased. On this
point the Bank of England had been just as much to
blame hitherto as the country banks. They had seen
its discounts increase just at the time, and almost in the
ratio, in which its bnllion was diminishing. In 1839 the
amount of bullion was 8,300,000/. ; in IR4O it fell to
4,200,0001. The discounts in 1839 were 3,700,000/.; and
in 1840, when the bullion had diminished nearly one-
half, the discounts had increased to 6,200,0001—(Hear.)
Mr. Horsley Palmer himself admitted the fact) that,
at the period when the amount of bullion was diminish-
ing, and the pressure was most felt in the market, the
greatest demand was made on the Bank for accommoda •
lion. If the principle of the Bill was a good one, he did not
think the proper means had been chosen for carrying it
into effect. It had been his fate to be Chancellor of
the Exchequer at a time of great pressure, and he had
had no greater difficulty in his office than was occasioned
by his interference with the issues. He should un-
doubtedly prefer to see the separation of banks of issue
more completely carried out. The Noble Lord then
read an extract from a speech of Mr. Huskinson's, of
which the purport was, that the withdrawal of bank-
notes from circulation increased the pressure in a
monetary crisis, instead of diminishing it. He would
next draw the attention of their Lordships to the fact
that the harvests had considerable influence upon the
currency. He was very well pleased to see that in this
Bill some consideration was given to that view, and
that the depreciation of the silver standard was not
overlooked. Gold was increasing much in quantity, and
on the other hand, silver was becoming so scarce, that it
might have a preference as a standard—if scarcity was
to be the condition of a standard, then gold. There
was one consequence of the Bill which he could not un-
derstand, namely, that if the Bank and the Government
should agree to increase the issues, the Government
should go shares in the profits. He was strongly op-
posed to any such arrangement. It would be small
comfort to a man who found his means of purchasing
necessaries curtailed by this Act, that it was a symboli-
cal system.—(Hear, hear, and a laugh.) The Noble
Lord concluded by thanking their Lordships for their
indulgent hearing, and assuring them that he had not
trespassed upon them from any motive of personal ambi-
tion or mere vanity.
Lord ASHBURTON was saved some trouble by the
speech of his Noble Friend who had just sat down. He
must, however, dissent from the statements of his Noble
Friend, that the principles of banking were less under-
stood in former times than now. It was of the highest
importance to the morality of the people to
maintain a regard for the public credit. Every
one who recollected the difficulty which the country
had in returning to a metallic currency, would see
the fallacy of the Noble Lord's dogmas, which were de-
livered in a tone of authority such as to lead to the in-
ference that all other persons were idiots except his Noble
Friend himself. The period of paper money extended
over the years from 1797 to 1810, which was said to be
a return to the standard abandoned in 1797. But silver
was formerly the established legal tender of the country.
Any man might take silver to the Mint to be coined.
The Duke of WELLINGTON—OnIy up to a certain
sum.

Lord ASHBURTON begged the Noble Mike's par-
don ; that was precisely the mistake that was generally
entertained. In 1774, the Act of Parliament first limited

silver as a legal tender to 25/. ; but that only applied to
the worn and depreciated coin of the realm. Any debt
might be paid in silver at the usual rate of ss. 2d per
ounce. They had lately seen a similar principle in
operation in the rejection of payments in gold, if the
coins were beneath the proper weight. The
Act of 1774 was renewed in 1776, and again
in 1783, when it was lost sight of, and was
not again revived till 1786. But in 1798, there was
a real prohibition applied to payments in silver ; the
issue of silver from the Mint was also stopped, on ac-
count of an alleged temporary reduction in the price of
silver, and it was feared by Lord Liverpool that silver
was becoming the substitute for gold The reasons given
by Lord Liverpool for this opinion were very unsatisfac-
tory. He said that a rich nation ought to have a rich
and valuable standard, as if a man six feet in height was
to be measured by a different standard from the man of
five feet!—(Hear, hear.) Against this he placed the
authority of Mr. Locke, who says that " Gold not the
common money of the world, nor is it fit to be so." He
would IiOW come to the restomtion oral° 4tanclArd—to tipit

which was the old standard of England, that was to say, the
standard as taken before 1798, and More the tampering
with the currency, either by the Act of 1797, or by
Lord Liverpool. There might possibly be some degree
of equity, on a return to a state of peace, in making
some allowance for the altered condition of money ; but
at all events, it was unnecessary to determine on screw-
ing the standard up, till the debtor was made to pay the
creditor more than he was liable to in the year in which
the Bank Restriction Act was passed. He Contended
that the debtor was entitled to acquit himself according
to the ancient standard, either in one metal or the other.
If they had left him alone, and merely passed an Act
allowing the country to go back to the standard that
then existed, the consequence would have been this—
that if he had owed the Noble Lord 100/. at that time,
and the debt had continued up to the present moment,
he could, according to the present price of silver, have
acquitted that debt for 91/. 16s. Bd. This was a
proof that the return to cash payments did screw
up the standard. If there was any case in which,
there should be a statute of limitation, it should be on
the subject of the currency ; they might as well go back
to the times of William 111. or Elizabeth, as go back
thirty years. On the question of a silver currency, he
should state what had happened during periods of great
difficulty and panic, su .h as the year from 1825 to 1826,
known as the great bubble year. He perfectly concur
red with the opinion expressed by Mr. Huskisson at that
time, that the inability of the Bank of England to right
itself in such difficult periods was greatly increased by
the inability of the Bank to use one of the precious
metals, that one being the circulation of all the rest
of the world. When bills were taken up in I'aris, Ham-
burgh, and Amsterdam, they were paid in silver. But
the Bank of England having acquired that silver, was
compelled to go and purchase gold with it,' in order to
make the settlement; and the relation between these two
metals, produced great differences in that which
it was necessary to keep the most steady,, the
unit of value, the pound sterling, which, in this
country, was composed of gold and paper, and
every kind of circulation. He alluded to the great
fluctuations in the business of the Bank of England,
that sometimes threw out money abundantly, and then
held it in by a check, discounting at 2i per cent. at
one time, and at 6 per cent. at another, and con-
tended that it was useless to insist on the philosophical
argument that the difference between gold and silver
was sometimes as little as 1 per cent. The consequenCe
of the discussion on this subject which he had with Mr.
Iluskisson was the evidence which he (Lord .Ashburton)
gave before the Committee, to the general tenor of
which he still adhered. He still thought the authority
of Mr. Huskisson was quite equal to that of Lord
Liverpool, and he stated that, to make the pound
sterling fixed in value was a great mistake. There
was an outcry in the • country against paper
currency ; but, in a commercial nation, having
such vast commercial dealings, having such an
immense debt, that all the coin and all the bullion of
the world collected together would not pay it off—it
was necessary to deal largely by paper credit in various
shapes. The great object, undoubtedly, was to take care-
that that paper answered the purpose for which it was
issued; that what it promised to do should be honestly
and exactly done, and that those promises to pay should
be met punctually. But the basis on which they were
issued ought to be made as broad as it could be. In-
stead of taking one standard—a fanciful one, though
philosophically it might seem more certain-7they im-
mensely increased the difficulties of a difficult period, as
the whole, rested on an insufficient basis. What had
been done in the cases of the several crises which the
country had undergone, and of which they hal great
varieties? The• moat formidable, was that of 1825 to
1826. There was another in, the. year 1837-1838,
in consequence of the derangement of affairs !in Ame-
rica. In the case of the panic of 1825 and 1826, it was
very well known that the Bank was almost reduced to
its last sovereign. It was just enabled to say that it did
not refuse any payment. But he remembered that on
one occasion the officials of the Bank were anxiously
watching the clock to ascertain if they had five minutes more
to provide for. Mr. Richards, the Governor of the Bank,
stated himself that they were likely to be run dry ; yet,
during the whole of that time the hank had silver in its
possession, and was at that moment in treaty with Mr.
Rothschild to exchange that silver into gold, in which
the Bank was to make its payments. That silver Mr.
Rothschild was enabled to put into circulation abroad ;
and it was stated in evidence before the House of Com-
mons that the financier made somewhere about 100,0001.
by his patriotic exertions in helping the Bank of
Eng
18land out of its difficulties. (Hear, hear.)
In 36 and 1837, what was the condition of the Bank?
It was saved from failing by the Bank of France. Now,
if they had sustained two such crises in times of pro-
found peace, what difficulties might they not expect if
they should ever be plunged again into a state of war ?
That consideration induced him to state his belief, that
two years of an expensive war could not be gone
through without returning to the measures adopted in
1797. It should be remembered that, throughout the
rest of the world, both gold and silver were convertible
into each other, and were both equally available for the
purposes of circulation, without the consequence, of one
driving the other out of it. Throughout the whole of
the Continent, the two metals were found circula-
ting in harmony with each other ; but if he
were compelled to make a choice of one of the
two he should prefer silver. He should take it on the
broad principle, that it was most important to be in con-
formity, in the matter of currency, with the rest of the
world. It was a great desideratum to have the broadest
possible base for the currency of the country. He should
trouble their Lordships no longer on that question, but
should confine himself to three words on the new prin-
ciple established by the Bank Charter Act. He agreed
with his Noble Friend, that the first part of this Bill—
separating the Bank into two departments—was wholly
useless in operation. It might be a harmless, regulae
tion, but, in fact, it was a mere delusion on patties not
acquainted with the practical management of the Bank.
The present issue of the Bank and the management of
the debt were divided into half ft dozen depart-
ments, all distinct from each other, and whatever Act
was passed it would be the same. The Bill stated
that the Bank should only issue 14,000,000/. on its own
account, and then to the extent of its bullion. The Go-
vernment provision of the Act was the limitation of the
circulation, and it contemplated the gradual stopping of
all the issues of the country banks. Now, if that limita-
tion was desirable, he acknowledged that the thing was
well, and carefully, and judiciously done. The Bill had
certainly conciliated, the country bankers, as it had se-
cured them a monopoly, of business for the present. If
they acknowledged the thing to be right in itself, he
must admit that it could not have been more cleverly
managed. With regard to the check on the,-issue of the
Bank of England, undoubtedly the Bank had occasion-
ally been a great offender in the matter of its issues ;
but he apprehended, after all, that this Bill was an ex-
periment, and its working might not turn out so perfect
as was expected. The limitation of the Bank of Eng-
land was, first' to 14,000,000/ on its own paper,
and then it might issue to the amount of its specie.
That specie amounted to something like 16,000,0001,
which, with the 14,000,0001. of circulation it was
allowed, would bring the whole amount of its possible
circulation to about 30,000,0001—the real issue of the
Bank being between 20,000,0001. and 21,000,0001. Thus
the law would have no immediate operation at all. The
Bank had a large margin of 9,000,000/ or 10,000,0001,
which would prevent the restriction from having any
immediate effect. The cheek on the Bank might
operate as some check on the exportation of gold;
but, for the borne circulation, the Bank might be
drained of every• sovereign without a pound going
out of the country. At the end of 18,26, what took
place ? It was then proved that the demand for gold
might arise from circumstances which could not be cor-
rected by the reduction of the issues. Saturday,
the 17th of December, 1825, was the critical day
to the Bank of England to which be had referred.
The lowest return the Bank of England made of its cir-
culation was about 10,000,000/ The difficUlty cor-
rected itself before the Monday morning following, but
the relief was entirely owing to Mr. Rothschild. From
the 10th of December to the 17th they increased the
circulation from 18,000,000/ to 24,000,000/, from the
17th to the 24th they further increase 4 it to 25,206,0001.,
and on the 31st ofDecember, the last day of the year,
they had increased it tq 0,709,000/ They bad un-
doubtedly begun, like timid men, who stood in awe of
the responsibility which they were incurring, but they
went on boldly, and that issue of bank notes saved the
circulation of the country. Mr. Tooke, 'who was a phi-
losopher of the same schwa with Mr. Lloyd—
The Marquis of CLAWRICARDE—No, no ; he is
quite opposed to him.
Lord ASHBUR TON was happy to have such an
authority on his side. Mr. Tooke had stated that that
was a bold measure, but a most` successful one. One
word as to the effects of the corn -laws on the circulation.
Whatever might be the system of corn-laws, if, after
depending for two or three seasons on the home supply,
we should, in consequence of the bad harvest, be com-
pelled to import corn suddenly and largely from abroad,
there would undoubtedly be a large demand for bullion,
and they must run this risk under any system of aorn-
laws. One word as to the indiscretion which was charged
againsit country bankers ; He believed that those who
thought to manage the issues by the Bill would find it a
more difficult job than they expected. The greet
reproach which was made against Mr. Stuckey
and the country bankers was, that they issued
their notes without reference to the foreign exchangses.
He had known Mr. Stackey many years. He was a
most intelligent man, and perfectly understood what he
was about, lie thought the framers of this Bill deceived
themselves in reproaching the bankers with inattention
to the foreign exchanges. The slightest fraction—a
difference of one-eighth per cent. might cause gold to go
out of the country, and the same difference might occa-
sion it to come back. If the country bankers folloived
these minute fluctuations they would be grossly mis-
taken in their calculations. Their issues must be
guided by the state of their neighbourhood. He looked
at this Bill as no party matter. He believed it was
originally a Whig scheme, and he had voted pretty
steadily with his friends while he was, with them. But
in all matters relating to the trade or 'commerce of the
country, he had honestly considered the pro
positions, and voted without any view to party
interests. In thn event of country banks sus
pending their issues the Bank of England
might increase its issues in proportion._ and the prodt
of such issues were to go to the Government ; but how
that profit-was to be calculated, he confessed he was at a
loss to understand. The Government might be trusted
with poWer to check the increase in the circulation, but
they ought not to be under the temptation, or to have
the power of extending it. In time of war, Government
was always pressing the Bank for advances. In 1797 it
was not the Bank which got itself 'into difficulties, but it
was the Government prZesing the Bank. That pressure
from then-easury was fatal to the independence of the Bank.
11 was never safe to give the Government an extending
power over the issues of the Bank. This was a great
experiment. It had been favourably received by the
p44lic, and he 11%10 it would be sucoessi3/411.

• n
_ fr
The Bar], of RADNOR had, in 1819, opposed Vio
turn to the old standard, but having the stan_
_....dura be
fixed, and having gone through all the etinerwe ff
thought it would be foolish to depart from it noetio
they were to have a joint standard of gold (and, sicofl
every debtor would pay in the cheapest coin. 1f.r.me...011
pay a debt of 1001. by 96L ss. he would do so. it :taw
in fact, be giving every debtor an opportunity of coeditor
his creditor, and the effect would be' that the ere so;
would take precautions to defend himself by Ylereato.
the rate of interest. In France there was no joint s
dard. The standard there was silver. • meeJ
Lord ASHBURTON—GoId can always be Pr°'
at an agio. jig°
The Earl of RADNOR said that proved that s 0,
was the standard, because if you wanted gold you 4:a
buy it. It was absurd for us to have a different still
ars
from all other countries, and he had never besrao;r
good reason for having the standard a gold one. .otiof
great object of the Bill was to limit the circulet!
paper. Now, according to his 'view, it was unirl',l 0
limit the circulation—it was unwise to entrust any old
son with the power of doing so. The country .lil
always provide for itself the amount of circuletlutio;
wanted, and no more; and it was an act of ptesuul. PO
—he did not use the word in an offensive sense--0 b,;
person to attempt to limit the circulation. A:great' to
in he believed, an unfounded alarm, existed in soqc
of the country lest the circulation should be s°
nished as to increase the price of corn. He thous
•
feet convertibility would give perfect security 7 hhat
more paper would be issued than was.required,
i.° re
the moment any depreciation took place, it would vie3d
turned to the issuers. lie did not think thlt the ,to
of England and th 6 country bankers
.were acheusblevid
the reproach of having Ito nec es loeteiv's'
their circulation. That increase had, in 110/
instances, arisen from circumstances over
they had no control, and if they had fallen into
errors, and suffered from them, they were the
likely to fall into them again. These difficulties
t,
mainly arisen from the corn laws, because vvheuerese;l
large importation of corn took place under the PAS.
system, an immense quantity of bullion had to beer
ported to pay for it, thus affecting the course of thecir
changes. The Bank was then obliged to control /0 ert
culation, until prices were so reduced that goods 'jar,
exported instead of coin. Now if articles of Ill!eo
such as wine and silk, had to be imported,;the r'soff
price would lessen the demand, but quite the ant,.
was the case with regard to corn, because the dues
was the more necessary it was to have it, and the to/1514
necessity there was to send out gold. Me. Jones
,•';'01
had fully explained this fact in his recent paniphie"old
the subject. The Noble Lord had said that such °pot
be the case under any system of corn-laws. But suPifir
they had no system of corn-laws, but an entire
trade. Would not that, by making corn a regulates'
title of trade, remedy the evil. The fact VS 010
they were attempting .to introduce a sliding of
for currency as well as for coin, and he thought that 01,1
measure would on'y increase their difficulties. Itsba°lo'
be recollected that, in general, there was a large sal,i,irt
of deposits in the Bank. Now, when money .was
in value, these depositors 'would demand their derTeo
of course in bullion, which would still more incressehid
difficulties of the Bank. This was one of the leise'l
of attempting to do that by legislation which had he.so
left alone. If they provided that no one should It'tY
notes without their being convertible into gold
option of the holders, they would obviate every tp
cnity, and do all that was required. The Noble '
e,
concluded by eulogising the Scottish banking al-ft(r•
which had given the greatest satisfaction, and been'
ductive of immense benefit. hosl
Lord ASHBURTON explained. His argument 3;01
the corn-laws was this. He contended' that tke,re;bee
be times when we must be taken by surprise, and "el
an unexpectedly large demand for foreign corn
o'9o
arise, which would require a considerable effort tc'e,
the demand for bullion which would arise in censegt
no state of the law could obviate that, unless they e°
govern the seasons. If, for instance, we had pv",,,-110,
sufficient for our own consumption for three or fourcet)
and then had a bad harvest, a crisis, such as the O"
which he had alluded, would arise.
The Bill then passed through Con:tettee
The Sudbury Disfranchisement Bill wase.ead a see
time.
The Bills on the table were then forwarded a st4l'
and the House adjourned.

HOUSE OF COMMONS, July 12.
The SPEAKER took the Chair at Four o'clock., t.
Mr. PLUMPTRE presented two petitions !„%130
better observance of tl* Lord's-day, also a pet'
favour of church extenston.
Mr. GROGAN presented a petition respecting
Irish jury list.
tbel/
Mr. ESCOTT presented a petition from the Sneo,
Division of Hants, in favour of the existing corn-la
Viscount PALMERSTON presented a petition #
the engravers of London in favour of art-unionstitio
complaining of the neglect with which a former Pe
presented by them had been treated.
GREAT SOUTHERN AND WESTERN RAIL
(IRELAND) BILL.
On the motion for further proceeding with t
on the third reading,
Colonel RAWDON complained that there scio
°5O
clause in the Bill which interfered with the vested I.;
of Colonel Fitzgibbon. He moved that this clans
expunged.
Lord ELIOT said the clause only applied W "Jot
deposited in the Court of Chancery by this r--I',l
company under the standing orders of that Reuse.
°veil
fees of Colonel Fitzgibbon were only taken upon ter,oo
paid into the Court of Chancery by suitors in the '
rbi
and therefore he (Lord Eliot) apprehended that
clause ought to stand. ye
After a few words from Lord G. Somerset, fp
Eliot, and the Solicitor-General, the amendment o)
withdrawn, and the Bill was read a third tigi"„
passed.

GREENWICH PARIi.
esiDl
Mr. AGLIONBY said he had a petition to pr-
which he trusted would receive the attention 0f 1
Noble Lord at the head of the Woods and Forests'lii
was signed by a number of persons residing, or
.11111,
property close to Greenwich Park, and the "41101; which materially depended upon the view into that
ill'
tiful locality. The petitioners stated that they
.1% „
ro
not have presumed to approach the House upon oi°
subject if public benefit was not concerned in it to r
,1 as great an extent as private interest. The
liarbir3P one means or another, had been constantly dirnio6 4
and they prayed that a stop might at once be put to
further encroachments,

-LAW.
Mr. FERRAN]) presented five petitions from tolit;
ships in the West Riding of- Yorkshire against
poor-law,

NOTICE OF MOTION.
Mr. WAWN gave notice that, on Monday netlllll should put a question to the First. Lord of the Achei
to ascertain (as we understood the lion. Gentled 0)
t)
whether English ships were manned with a streak
equal to that of ships in the Russian navy.
LAND-TAX RETURNS. „Id
Dr. BOWRING moved for *certain returns contt'c
with the hind-tax.—Agreed to.
MAYNOOTH GRANT. Of
Sir G. CLERK gave notice that he should ink
mittee of Supply, this day week, move the ethicoiois
grant for this college. • .
Mr. BRIGHT moved for returns of the number
-ecr
murders and attempts at murder which had boll f if
witted in the county of Tipperary ; the number i
dictments which had been preferred on those chat, ' the number of true bills which had been retuened vied,
grand jury, and the results ; showing the numberedacquittals and convictions, and the punishments in
&ring the last ten years.—Agreed to.
SALARY TO THE CHAIRMAN OF THE 319
DLESEX SESSIONS. oefr
Sir C. NAPIER wished to ask the Right Hon.
..04
tleman, the Secretary of State for the Home Depart,'" iir
if it was his intention during the present session led
iroduce a Bill giving a salary to the Chairman °f
Middlesex Sections.
cd
Sir JAMES GRAHAM said he had a e 4
the the subject of the administration of criminal juste es. .
the county of Middlesex ; and in the Bill there ', to
provision for the appointment of -a paid magistrat
preside over the administration of criminal justice.
. tlii
Mr. M. GIBSON wishedZ to put a question tee
Right Hon. Baronet at the head of her Mair,ity'sv'
vernment upon a matter of some itnportanc,e Infvf, tion had reached this country that the Brazilian G°ltl)e
ment had prepared a new tariff for -,,taopti„ after to
10th of November next, proposing, a much higho4l
of duty on articles of British mAn'afacture than elpS'
at present. He wished to ke0,,,.
Baronet whether he had•re,aeon to believe that babe
tariff would be adopted tr,td was already b,
Brsazirilinan.
PGEoEveLrnmsarat.from the Rightn eh
prepared
,
papers a statemea that he had seen in the Pllw
Eon. Member.,to the Immediately upon seeing it, he allhe:
'',, to the effect of that made bilieci
titer -.Puist“,.gn.office for the purpose of knowing 10,0
such Information had been received, and he es 0
I.,een htformed that it had not. Perhaps by the
tte
mail he might be prepared to give some answer t°
question.
tlig
Mr. MILNER GIBSON, wished to know whee,,,,,etifteil
Government had had any correspondence with tire vtoo
Government relative to the importation of jr agar 'of
Java, and whether they had any objection to 14 ,
correspondence before the House.
noer
weSreirinße.ePrrEesEpLeedsaeeideetwhiatth htheer
DAtliatliee:,s G over- -veil,
the subject, and also upon the ti
4.ttierential duties ;dee
he was not in a condition to Pl.ace that corresPe°
a '. Government bi,'
before the House.
LAW OF F:,ETTLEMENT. 4, WA'
Mr. LIDDELL wished to know from the Right oft"
Gentlemau the Seere`,ary of State for the Home Pea til°
rnent, whether he 'was prepared with a Bill to aweli i
law of settlemer_a this session. ore
Sir J. GR :IIIAM said that a Bill had been Preil 0°
on the subject, which was ready for introduction'o
v%,.e0
would a4lt leave to bring in the Bill during the Pr
ea
and it could be considered during the re
ACCIDENT AT BOLTON. h o'l'.
Mr. FERRAND wished to know from the Rigiitepsr-;
Gentleman, the Secretary of State for the Home •'''„E tb;
ment, whether he would buy the evidence takelo-leer"
coroner's inquest, in the case of the persons W" killed at Bolton, on the table of the House. t
übjec;
Sir J. GRAHAM said he had considered the s, tits
to which the Hon. Member adverted. He observed Tbg
the verdict of the jury was one of manslaughter.
sire'
notes taken would he transmitted to the Judge el e t, ill
before whom•the case would ultimately come, s°:11;o0e_
point of fact, he doubted of the possibility of th,_
Si
h° .
to compel a result of this description. He muss.!el be
did not think it consistent with the ends of justw,;eea
ffeorreththee
judge
ey
swhaeselpduht
eonlaihdisetnritahle, tthaahtletheef notest, sqluese' i
and made matter of debate there.—(Hear.)