The Sun.
London, England, 1844-07-13 00:00:00

COURSE OF EXCH.

Noble Friend's notice, that he intended to enter into the
question of the Sinde-territory, but he thought that his
inquiry would relate solely to the question of the Pun-
jaub. He (the Earl of Ripon), however, would advert
the whole of the topics which had been introduced by the
Noble Marquis. His Noble Friend had said thatlie spoke
entirely upon public rumour as to certain operations
that were going on. Now, public rumour in this in-
stance, as was generally the case, had greatly exagge-
rated the truth. The rumour it appeared was, that an
army of 80,000 men was collecting in the Punjaub for
the purpose of invading and conquering that country.
He could tell his Noble Friend that this rumour was en-
tirely without foundation. He knew of no army being
in existence in that part of the world, except that which
was under the command of Sir C. Napier. With respect
to our military force in the north-west, it was right,
perhaps, that he should make a few remarks. It was
perfectly well-known that within the last few years it
had been deemed indispensably necessary that a large
portion of the military force in the Presidency of Bengal
should be concentrated in the north-west provinces.
Everybody who was at all acquainted with India knew
that that portion of our territory was most liable to
sudden attack. It was, therefore, indispensably neces-
sary at all times that it should be an object of care, and
it would be obvious to everybody who considered for a
moment the actual condition of the Punjaub, that, that
part of our territory ought not to be left without ade-
quate means'of self-protection, particularly when it was
recollected that that country immediately joined the
Sutlej. It would be recollected, too, that the affairs of
the Lahore settlement were administered by an indepen-
dent chief, who ruled remarkably well. That country
was now very flourishing, and cultivation, he understood,
had greatly extended ; and this very circumstance was
likely to prove a temptation to depredators. He said,
therefore, that they were bound, in good faith to the
Sikhs, and by principles of public policy and justice, to
take care that our position in that quarter was secure.
With this object, a force was maintained there by Lord
Ellenborough and the Indian Government, and he (the
Earl of Ripon) could assure, the House that neither the
authorities in India nor at home had any wish or desire
to obtain one inch of territory in that country. Their
views were essentially pacific. Nobody could say, under
the circumstances in which that country was placed, how
soon it might be necessary to defend ourselves. or at least
to defend those for whose defence the British army
was supported. He trusted, however, that he had said
sufficient to allay the fears his Noble Friend entertained.
With respect to Sinde, his Noble Friend asked if he
(the Earl of Ripon) had heard the rumour that it was
intended to extend our territory still further beyond the
banks of the ,Indus. He had never heard of such inten-
tion having been entertained, and he could say that no
such intention was entertained—(Hear, hear)—either by
means of negotiation or anything else. It was perfectly
true that in the neighbourhood of Shikarpore incursions
had recently, been made by an armed body, and there
could be no doubt that they had committed great cruel-
ties. But the number was small, and he trusted that
measures had been taken to prevent a recurrence of such
a misfortune, and that means had been adopted by which
the inhabitants would be protected, and confidence estab-
lished for the future. The last question his Noble
Friend had put to him was whether her Majesty's
Government would be prepared to lay before Parliament
before the end of the session, detailed information as to
the state of affairs in Sinde, especially with respect to
the revenue, and the power of meeting the expenditure
of the country. He (the Earl of Ripon) was not pre-
pared to give his Noble Friend that assurance, although
her Majesty's Government were certainly desirous of
giving every information they could upon the subject.
But, he certainly was not prepared to say that they
were in a condition to lay the information asked for on
the table of the House. The Noble Marquis must
recollect the positron of this country with respect to
Sinde. Holding that country so recently, it would be
.premature to communicate any information respecting
it, which, after all, might be imperfect, and, if imper-
fect not valuable. With respect to the revenue, he could
only say that it had not equalled the expenditure, but
then it must be remembered that they had been called
upon to administer a perfectly new system, that was to
say, s new system so far as conducting the affairs of
that country upon just and reasonable principles was
concerned, and in doing this they were obliged to incur
considerable expense. Sickness had occurred; but it had
occurred as much amongst the natives as others, and, from
all he had heard, there was no reason to expect that
that sickness would be of constant recurrence. There
were very few parts of India in which, from time to
time, sickness which was fearfully destructive did not
occur. He believed he had now noticed the whole of
the topics touched upon by the Noble Marquis.
BANK CHARTER
The Earl of RIPON then rose to move the order of
the day for going into Committee on the Bank Charter
Bill; and in doing so he said he would briefly explain
the grounds upon which this measure had been sub-
mitted to Parliament; and in doing this it would not be
necessary 'for him to detain their Lordships at any
length in discussing the principles of currency and
banking, as that subject had frequently been under con-
sideration in their Lordships' House. It was, however,
necessary for him to state to their Lordships, in the first
instance how it happened that this question was brought
before them in the present year. In the last Charter
Act provision was made that the Bank Charter might
extend to the year-1855, but that after'the expiration of
the first ten years it might be competent to Parliament,
after giving notice, to revise the regulations of that Act,
if circumstances should occur to require it. It was quite
clear, therefore, that Parliament, at the time they passed
the last Act in 1833, did not consider that the provisions
of that Act were so complete or so perfect as entirely to
meet the object intended, and they no doubt considered
that grounds might arise, after experience had been ob-
tained, for the recommendation of the provisions of this
Act. The provisions of the law were, that notice should
be given at the expiration of ten years if it should be
thought expedient to make any change; but in case no
such notice should be given, then the charter was to con-
tinue for the full 21 years. When the period, therefore,
arrived, it was competent for the Government to recon-
sider this question. They felt that there were many con-
siderations which rendered it desirable that some step
should be taken for the purpose of more completely car-
rying out the principles upon which the Act of 1819 was
framed. When the last Act was proposed, many opi-
nions were expressed in favour of a system still more ex-
clusive in its character, as regarded the power of the
Bank of England,' than that Act was expected to be.
Many persons expressed an opinion—amongst whom
was his Noble Friend, then Chancellor of the Exchequer
(Lord Spencer)—in favour of one bank of issue in the
country. Many persons went the length of saying that
Government itself ought to be the bank of issue. But
this opinion did not appear to have been generally enter-
tained. He (the Earl of Rip.-in) thought this would have
been a measure of very doubtful policy, if it would not
have been a dangerous one. He thought there were con-
stitutional objections to it. He doubted very much whe-
ther, if the Government had that power, it would really
have the power of practically controlling the currency so
much as this theory would suppose. le thought that
there would be great risk in the Government proceeding
from time to time to relax the screw upon the pressure
of a supposed expediency. That view of the subject,
therefore, having been rejected before, was certainly not
adopted by her Majesty's present Government. But
they certainly did think that, looking particularly to the
effect of the law both here and throughout the country,
they did think it was desirable that the Bank of England
should become, not the sole_because, theoretically
speaking, it would be so—but the main instrument for
issuinging for the wants of the country,
It appeared, and expe
rie neeeopnapfiermr,
confirmed
df
ictr,etahtaintg a paper currency, and provid
the
principle upon which the Act
of 1519 was based, was not that of trusting everything to
the convertibility of paper into gold, for it did not ap-
pear that that simple principle had the effect of prevent-
ing injurious fluctuation, as was shown in 1825, when
the stock of bullion in the Bank of England was almost
exhausted, and the credit of the Bank was only saved
by the sudden arrival at Dover of a quantity of sove
reigns from the Continent. The Government felt that
it was indispensably necessary that something should be
done to prevent the tremendous evil of fluctuation. It
appeared to them that the only safe rule upon which
they could rely was the foreign exchanges. If they
were against us, the gold must go out. The present
measure was intended to prevent the evil of fluctuation,
and he believed that it had met with general approba
tion in all parts of the country. The plan of the mea-
sure was, in fact, to limit the circulation of the Bank of
England in the first place, and to limit the circulation
of the country banks in the second. The limitation of
the Bank of England tHey proposed to effect in this way
—that they should be at liberty to issue notes to the
amount of the securities which they held, and in exact
proportion to the bullion they might have in their
coffers. In order to effect this the Bank would be di-
vided into two branches—one the bank of issue and the
other the bank of deposit. The amount of issue, in the
first place, would be fourteen millions. It was quite ob-
vious that the sum of fourteen millions would be a very
inadequate provision for the wants of the country ; and,
therefore, it was
provided that the Bank of England
should be obliged to issue notes for all gold bullion that
might be brought to them for that purpose. Their
Lordships would see how this stood at the pre-
sent moment. At the present moment the actual
issue of the Bank did not exceed twenty-four millionS,
so that if this scheme were now in force the actual issue
would be fourteen millions on securities and seven millions
upon bullion. But the bullion which they now held was
very nearly, if not quite, sixteen millions, so that their
Lordships would see that, so far from limiting them to
21,000,0001., they might, if they thought proper, extend
that issue to 30,000,000/. ; but he did not mean to say
that it would be desirable for them to do so. This mea-
sure proposed to limit the issue of country banks, but
there was nothing to prevent a country bank—supposing
it now issued notes of its own—to prevent it from giving
up the privilege, and taking to the notes of the Bank of
England. The country bank circulation would, there.
fore, pro tanto, be duninished, and power would be given
to the Bank to issue another number of notes on securi-
ties, equal to about two-thirds of the paper that should
be displaced. With respect to country banks, it was
proposed to restrain new banks from issuing paper. He
believed that no scheme could have been devised which
would not have had some prejudicial effect, and he be-
lieved that the limitation which had now been taken was
just and reasonable, and would answer the purpose for
which it was designed. The actual amount of currency
which might be in circulation under the provisions of this
Bill- was about eight millions and a half, on an average
of three • mouths. There were provisions in the Bill
for securing periodical returns of the issues, and these
returns would be made monthly. This he considered a
very important part of the measure. He had now stated
the- general provisions of this Bill. The Government
414 teen tq iateod
lice 9s little of nevelty as
possible, "'they alight have raised a question as to
whether the standard should iie gold or silver, and pro-
posed various alterations which would have been palat.
able in sotto quarters; but they did not think it would
have been expedient to introduce novelties in this moo

Amsterdam CF. 12 5
Ditto, at sight l2 3
Rotterdam 2U. 12 5i
Antwerp 25 90
Hamburgh M.B. 13 13
Altona l3 13);
Paris, 3 days' sight 25 60
Ditto, 3 months 25 85
Marseilles
Bourdeaux 25. 90
Frankfort on Maine l2ll
Petersburgh, 3Us 37
Berlin
Vienna, effec. 11. 3 M 953
Trieste, ditto
Madrid 37

Cadiz
Bilbao 36

Barcelona 36

Seville —

POLICE INTELLIGENCE.
(YESTERDAY.)
MANSION-HOUSE.

A boy named George Hayward, who has been some
time pretending to be deaf and dumb, and by means of
those begging a,ccoMplishments levying contributions on
the public, was brought befOre the Lord Mayor, charged
with having stolen a milk ewer, in Charlotte's coffee-
house, Bucklerabury.
The prisoner, it appeared, went into the house and
signified to the waiter that he wanted assistance. A
boy in the service of Mr. Pontin, the proprietor, observed
him slip a milk ewer under his coat, and quit the pre-
mises, and immediately followed him and caused him to
be taken into custody.

The prisoner said he had been obliged to resort to the
way of supporting himself described, by sheer necessity,
and that he could not resist the temptation to take the
property as it lay so conveniently at his hand.
The LORD MAYOR—You have been in prison before?
The prisoner—Yes, my Lord, I know where it is well.
The LORD MAYOR—Have you not been whipped ?
The prisoner—Aye, right well whipped, please your
Lordship.
The policeman, in whose custody the prisoner was in-
troduced to the Lord Mayor, said the boy, while ex-
citing compassion for his apparent defects, was in the
habit of cribbing anything that fell in his way, and ex-
ercised a great deal of ingenuity in the pursuit.
The prisoner—Upon my honour I have been driven
to this by want. The fact is, I did not know where to
(Yet a meal.
The LORD MAYOR—You say you have been whipped
and imprisoned? The prisoner—Certainly I have, your
Lordship.
The LORD MAYOR—I find that you are of the worst
sort, and I am assured that you are incorrigible.
The prisoner—l shall not do this any more if you let
me go but this once, my Lord. I do assure you, upon
my honour, I'll turn honest.—(A laugh.)
The LORD MAYOR—I shall not trust you. You shall
go to prison for three months, and be whipped once a
week, so that you shall retain a sharp recollection of
being brought before me.
The prisoner began to roar when be heard the Lord
Mayor talk of whipping, and declared that, if his Lord•
ship would only pardon him that one offence, he would
never attempt to play deaf and dumb again, but talk
like other boys, and get his bread honestly.
He was then committed to prison, with hard labour, for
the space of three months ; and while he remained in
the cage, he gave to the whole house good reason to be-
lieve that he had effectually recovered the use of the
organ of speech.
A man, named Samuels, was charged with having
called a person, with whom he had hadsome dealings, a
thief and a swindler, and with having accused him of
having made false entries in his master's books.
The defendant admitted that he had heard the com-
plainant was no better than a thief, and that he had
made false returns for the purpose of benefiting himself.

_
The Loan MAYOR—Have you convicted the com-
plaint of theft, or any of the offences with which you
have charged him ? Defendant—No.; but I can prove
the truth of all I have said. .-

The LORD MAYOR—Have you ever punished him ?
Defendant—No ; but he deserves to be punished.
The LORD MAYOR—If you believe him t.► be guilty of
such offences, you must show his guilt in the proper way
in a court of justice. You must not use such language.
I hold you to bail to keep the peace towards him for
thiee calendar months.
CLERKENWELL.

.Henry Hutchins, an ivory turner, residing in Ray-
street, Clerkenwell, was charged with bigamy.
Three women, who, it was alleged, were his wives,
were present, but it turned out that he had been mar-
ried only to two. The females seemed to regard one an-
other with the keenest feelings of jealousy and the pri-
soner with the bitterest dislike.

Mr. COMBE said it would be desirable to prove the
second marriage in the first instance.
The second wife, Euphemia Mitchell, a black-eyed,
gipsey-looking damsel, aged 23, deposed that she had
been married to the prisoner on the Ist of August, 1842,
in St. Dunstan's Church Stepney. The witness pro-
duced the. certificate of the first marriage:

Mr. CoMBE—He represented himself as a bachelor,
did he ? Second wife—Oh, no ; he told me he was a
married man.

Mr. COMBE—Then why did you marry him?
First wife—Yes, that is the quostion.
Second wife—l married him because be was sepe-
rated from his first; who, he said, would never trouble
him.

The solicitor for the prisoner cross-examined her as to
the reason of the prisoner deserting her ; but she said
she ran away from him because he treated her in so
brutal a manner.

Prisoner—That is a lie. Second wife—lt is the truth,
You know you half starved me.

The person represented as the third wife here stood
forward, and was the very picture of famine. She said
nothing, but her appearance spoke volumes.
The second wife added that she left the prisoner two
months ago, in consequence of his wicked conduct ; and
she had no sooner left him, than he took up with the
third woman, with whom he has since cohabited.
The first wife, Hannah Hutchins, was then examined,
She said that she was married to the prisoner on the
2Gth'ofJune, 1831, in the Church of St. Mary's, Isling-
ton. " They had five children, and lived, for many years
after their marriage, in destitution. Four of their chil-
dren died ; one only survived, who was eleven years old,
and who lived with the prisoner. He deserted her about
four years ago, after treating her with cruelty. She
gave the prisoner into custody at twelve o'clock on the
previous night in the house of his wife or paramour.

Mr. Costn-E—Why'did you give him into custody ? First
wife—Because he is continually persecuting me. When-
ever I get a little work to do he' goes to the place, and
speaks so vilely of me to my employQrs, that I am dis-
charged, at once.
Prisoner—You are a disgrace to your sex.
The woman produced the certificate of the first mar-
riage, and admitted, on her cross-examination, that she
was cohabiting with another man, in Chapel-street,
Islington, who treated her kindly, and the prisoner
forced their only child upon her continually, but
she was unable to support him. She wished to be pro-
tected from the prisoner's violence.
Prisoner (excitedly)L-You are a vile, spiteful,
wretched woman.

Police-constable, Tate, 136 G, proved the prisoner's
arrest, who was remanded for further evidence of a
formal nature, Mr. COMBE intimating that he would
send him for trial. _ _

• The three women then left the Court, seemingly re.
joiced at the prisoner's incarceration.

DINNER TO LEONARD HORNER, ESQ.—This gen-
tleman was on F iday entertained at a public dinner in the
British Hotel, Edinburgh, as the founder of the School of
Arts. Upwards of 100 gentlemen sat down to dinner. The
Right Hon. the Lord Provost occupied the chair, supported
by Lords Murray, Cockburn, Ivory, and Cunninghatne ;
Archdeacon Williams, the Rev. Mr. Bennie, Mr. Maitland,
advocate, Sir Wm. Newbigging, Professor Pillans, Drs. Trail,
Maclagan, Allen, Thompson, and Alison; David Milne, Esq.,
advocate ; A. Rutherfunl, Esq., M.P., &c.. Professor Wilson
officiated as croupier. The customary loyal and patriotic
toasts having been given, the chairman, in a neat and appro-
priate speech, proposed " The health of Mr. Horner," which
was responded to, and the cheering which succeeded _having
subsided, Mr. Horner returned thanks, and gave "The Rev.
Mr. Bennie, President of the School of Arts, the Directors,
and Prosperity to the Institution." Mr. Bennie having re-
.turged thanks, the croupier gave "The Advancement of the
Moral and lutOectual Condition of the Working Classes,"
which he prefaced by a few introductory remarks in his well-
known eloquent and graphic styie. yarions after toasts sue •
etede4 cpprtected with literature, art, science, 4e. and the
company separatO about eleven o'clock.

LOCHIEL.—This Chief and Lady Vere Cameron,
visited Lochaber lately, and made a considerable stay 41
his noble mansion of Achnacarry. None of the " Sliochd
Dimino Du" we= left unvisited by the worthy Chief
and his amiable lady, who are emivared to the clan Ca-
meron, no less by the association of ancient dusi than
by the usbanity and kindness of the present representa-
dye of " bravg Lochi6l."--Pkwerness Courier.

THE SUN, LONDON, SAPTJRDAy EVENING, JITLY 13, 1644.

sure. The more he reflected on the subject, the more
convinced was he that all that was wanted was to give
full and beneficial effect to the Act of 1819, and to secure
that certainty which it was the object of this Bill ta
attain. Under these circumstances, he trusted their
Lordships would be prepared to go into Committee on
the Bill.
Lord MONTEAGLF, said he did not rise for the
founded
tdhveoccoantetdraoryn-,fiotritivlaesr
on
iprinciplese t u g which
BehilelGo o
had
a
Government deserved in-
finite credit for the manner in which they had carried
occasions.r l desl of
t opposingthought
t th o
forward this measure. What was more striking even
than the courage of undertaking to legislate on such a
question was the peculiar skill with which, by a con-
cession here and an arrangement there, without any
material deviation from the principle on which this B:11
was founded, a measure of this description and mag-
nitude had been proposed and carried through Parlia-
ment with the least amount of opposition ever offere 1, he
believed, to a measure of that nature. Nor could he help
alluding to those high authorities from whom chiefly this
measure had proceeded.—(Hear, hear.) He referred not
to any Parliamentary authorities, except so far as those
authorities were to be found in evidence before the other
House of Parliament ; but he alluded more especially to
the calm, sound, and practical attention which had been
given to this subject by such man as Mr. Loyd and
others who had devoted their minds to this question.—
(Hear, hear.) Whilst, however, he concurred in the
general principles of this measure, there were some parts
of it to which he could not give his consent. The Bill
had been properly called a complement to the Act of
1819. There was in this country a class of persons who
objected to it on that very account, and who, for that rea-
son, considered it likely to be productive of evil conse-
quences. It was unnecessary for him to go at length,
into the discussion of the point of difference, but he
thought no one could hesitate to say that, after the
events which occurred in 1797, and which were con-
tinued till the restoration of cash payments, it was the
absolute duty of the Legislature to restore the coin to
the state in which it had previously been. He knew it
was said, "Aye, it was right to restore a standard, but,
in restoring the ancient standard of the country, you
inflicted a great wrong on the mass of the community.
If they were to restore a standard at all, he conceived
that they were limited to the ancient standard.—(Hear,
hear.) They heard 'persons say, " What an injustice
you inflict on the whole community by compelling
them to pay in gold coin, at the Mint price,
debts contracted in paper, subject to a depre-
ciated currency."' What an extraordinary fallacy was
there in that statement.—(Hear, hear.) Did not every
one who had considered the subject, know that although
those debts might hare been contracted in a depreciated
currency, they were so contracted subject to the obliga-
tion of paying in the full standard at the period subse-
quent to the restoration. There was no standard to
which they could honesty revert, except the ancient
one. Before he quitted this part of the subject, he could
not help saying, in reply to those who were against re-
striction, on account of its pressure upon the productive
classes, that there never was a grosser delusion than'the
supposition that the productive classes of this country
were interested in a continued depreciation of the stan-
dard. The natural effect was a rise of prices.—(Hear.)
Ultimately, indeed, there might be a rise in wages, but
it followed, at a long and painful interval, the rise of
prices. In a depreciated currency they had an evil of
the most portentous magnitude to all, but the evil
pressed more severely on the labouring classes than upon
any other class in the community. On this subject, as
on many others, they had of late made very considerable
progress ; and they were enabled to discuss it with the
aid of experience. Experience had shown that many
remedies hitherto relied upon were altogether valueless.
Between the year 1832 and the present time, the cur-
rency of thiscountry had not been managed in a way which
was satisfactory to the public, safe to the Bank, or con-
ducive to the interest of the labouring classes. They were
now called upon to consider a new proposition; and they
would be rash indeed, if they were to predicate the re-
sult. The experiment was one which the. Government
deserved credit for making, for it was based on autho-
rity which fully justified its proposal ; but looking to
the peculiar circumstances of the country, the state of
the manufacturing interests, and its dependence on fo-
reign markets, and other matters, he could not agree
with his Noble Friend that they were, by passing this
Bill, laying the foundation of a perfectly safe and satis-
factory state of things. But if,. after the passing of this
Bill, there should still be periods.. of pressure 'turd diffi-
culty in this country, he protested against the supposition
that they were all to be attributed to the wark-
ing of this measure.•—(Hear, hear.) , Now; a great
deal of controverejsduldw,been carried, on in reference
to the principles upeneswhich this Bill was founded.
They were told by some that it was perfectly absurd to
imagine that any issue of promissory notes payable on
demand could act upon the exchanges, or upon prices?
provided 'the paper was convertible, and that, therefore,
the mechanism of this Bill was altogether unnecessary.
He could not, he confessed, adopt this theory. Would
any man tell him that the doubling of the quantity of
gold in the country would not have an effect upon prices.
If that were the case, surely the effect with regard to
paper would be the same, if that paper were convertible
into gold. But this Bill was founded.on the very oppo-
site theory, viz., that by regulating the paper currency
—the promissory notes payable on demand—they regu-
lated • all. He doubted whether there were not
other things besides promissory notes and metallic
coin which acted upOn the currency. He believed that
bills of exchange and Bank cheques acted upon the cur-
rency—he believed that every ingenious commercial
contrivance adapted for economising prices acted upon
the currency. He wished to call the attention of the
House,' to one branch of this species of currency, which
was so entirely identical with promissory notes payable
on demand, that it struck him as matter of surprise,
that it should have been altogether omitted from the
Bill. If it were right to regulate and restrain the
issue of promissory notes payable on demand, he
would like to hear how the Noble Earl would discri-
minate between an accepted post-bill at three or seven
days' sight, accepted before it left the Bank, and put in
circulation with a general indorsement, and a pro-
missory note payable on demand. Ile felt
some anxiety on this subject, lest through
an omission the provisions of the Bill should be ren-
dered a dead letter. The first symptom of weakness in
the Irish banks was the substitution of bank post bills
for promissory notes, to such an extent that the former
constituted one-third of the whole circulation. The Bill
seemed to him to proceed too much on the fallacy that,
by regulating promissory notes, they did everything
that was required. The great merit of the measure was,
he conceived, its approximation to a single issue. The
first effect of a restriction on the part of the Bank of
England would be to raise the value of money; but
that would induce other banks to issue more
money, because the profit would be increased. On this
point the Bank of England had been just as much to
blame hitherto as the country banks. They had seen
its discounts increase just at the time, and almost in the
ratio, in which its bullion was diminishing. In 1839 the
amount of bullion was 8,300,000/. ; in 1840 it • tell 'to
4,200,0001. The discounts in 1839 were 3,700,0001.;-and
in 1840, when the bullion had diminished nearly one-
half, the discounts had increased to 6,200,0001—',11ear )
Mr. Horsley Palmer himself admitted the fa.A' that,
at the period when the amount of bullion was diminish-
ing, and the pressure was most felt in the market, the
greatest demand was made on the Bank for accommoda
Lion. If the principle of the Bill was a good one, he did not
think the proper means had been chosen for carrying it
into effect. It had been his fate to be Chancellor of
the Exchequer at a time of great pressure, and he had
had no greater difficultT in his office than was occasioned
by his interference with the issues. lie should un-
doubtedly prefer to see the separation of banks of issue
more completely carried out. The Noble Lord then
read an extract from a speech of Mr. Huskinson's, of
which' the purport 'was, that the withdrawal of bank-
notes from circulation increased the pressure in a
monetary crisis, instead of diminishing it. He would
next draw the attention of their Lordships to the fact
that the harvests had considerable influence upon the
currency. He was very well pleased to see that in this
Bill some consideration was given to that view, and
that the depreciation of the silver standard was not
overlooked. Gold was increasing much in quantity, and
on the other hand, silver was becoming so scarce, that it
might have a preference as a standard—if scarcity was
to be the condition of a standard, then gold. There
:vas one consequence of the Bill which he c mld not un-
derstand, namely, that if the Bank and the Government
should agree t increase the issues, the Government
should go shares in the profits. He was strongly op-
posed to any such arrangement. It would be small
comfort to a man who found his means of purchasing
necessaries curtailed by this Act, that it was a symboli-
cal system.—(Hear, hear, and a laugh.) The Noble
Lord concluded by thanking their Lordships for their
indulgent hearing, and assuring them that he had not
trespassed upon them from any motive of personal ambi-
tion or mere vanity.
Lord ASHBURTON was saved some trouble by the
speech of his Noble Friend who had just sat down. He
must, however, dissent from the statements of' his Noble
Friend, that the principles of banking were less under-
stood in former times than now. It was of the highest
importance to the morality of the people ~to
maintain a regard for the public credit. Every
one who' recollected the difficulty which the country
had in' returning to a metallic currency, would see
the fallacy of the Noble Lord's dogmas, which were de-
livered in a tone of authority such as to lead to the in-
ference that all other persons were idiots except his Noble
Friend himself. The period of paper money extended
over the years from 1797 to 1810, which was said to be
a return to the standard abandoned in 1797. But silver
was formerly the established legal tender of the country.
Any man might take silver to the Mint to be coined.
The Duke of WELLINGTON—OnIy up to a certain
sum.

Lord ASHBURTON begged the Noble Duke's par=
don ; that was precisely the mistake that was generally
entertained. In 1774, the Act of Parliament first limited;
silver as a legal tender to 251. ; but that only applied to
the worn and depreciated coin of the realm. Any debt
might be paid in silver at the usual rate of 51. 2d per
ounce. They had lately seen a similar principle in
operation in the rejection of payments in gold, if the
coins were beneath the proper weight. 'l'ht
Act of 1774 was renewed in 1776, and again
in 1783, when it was lost sight of, and was
not again revived till 1786. But in 1798, there was
a real prohibition applied to payments in silver ; the
issue of silver from the Mint was also stopped, on ac-
count of an alleged temporary reduction in the price of
silver, and it was feared by Lord Liverpool that silver.
was becoming the substitute for gold. The reasons given
by Lord Liverpool for this opinion were very unsatisfac-
tory. He said that a rich nation ought to have a rich
and valuable standard, as if a man six feet in height was
to be measured by a different standard from the man of.
five feetl--(Hear, hear.) Against this he placed the'
authority of Mr. Locke, who says that " GOld is not the
Common money of the world, nor is it fit to be so." He
would now come to therestoration of the standard—to that

which was the old standard of England, that was to say, the
standard as taken before 1798, and before the tampering
with the currency, either by the Act of 1797, or by
Lord Liverpool. There might possibly be some degree
of equity, on n return to a state of peace, in making
some allowance for theealtered condition of money,.;. but
et ail events, it was unnecessary to determine on screw-
ing the standard up, till the debtor was made to pay the
creditor more than he was liable to in the year in which
the B ink Restriction Act was passed. He contended
that the debtor was entitled to acquit himself according
to the ancient standard, either in one metal or the other.
If they had left him alone, and merely passed an Act
allowing the country to go back to the standard that
then existed, the consequence would have been this—
that if he had owed the Noble Lord 100/. at that time,
and the debt had continued up to the present moment,
he could, according to the present price of silver, have
acquitted that debt for 91/.. 16s. Bd. This was a
proof that the return to cash payments did screw
up the standard. If there was any case in which
there should be a statute of limitation, it should be on
the subject of the currency ; they might as well go back
to the times of William 111. or Elizabeth, as go back
thirty years. On the question of a silver currency, he
should state what had happened, during periods of great
difficulty and panic, su:h as the year from 1825 to 1826,
known as the great bubble year. He perfectly concur•
red with the opinion expressed by Mr. Huskisson at that
time, that the inability of the Bank of England to right
itself in such difficult periods was greatly • increased by
the inability of the Bank to use one of the precious
metals, that' one being the circulation of all the rest
of the world. When bills were taken up in Paris, Ham-
burgh, and Amsterdam, they were paid in silver. But
the Bank of England having acquired that silver, was
compelled to go and purchase gold 'With it, =in order to
Make the settlement; and the relation between these two
metals, produced great differences in that which
it was necessary to keep the most steady, the
unit of value, the pound sterling, which, in this
country, was composed of gold and paper, and
every kind of circulation. He alluded to the great
fluctuations in the business of the Bank of England,
that sometimes threw out money abundantly, and then
held it in by a check, discounting at 2 per cent. at
one time, and at 6 per Cent. 'at another, and con-
tended that it was useless to insist on the philosophical
argument that the difference between gold and silver
was sometimes as little as 1 per cent. The consequence
of the discussion on this subject which he had with Mr.
Huskisson was the evidence which he (Lord Ashburton)
gave before the Committee, to the general tenor - of
which he still adhered. He still thought the authority
of Mr. Huskisson was quite equal to that of Lord
Liverpool, and he stated that, to make the pound
sterling fixed in value was a great mistake. There
was an outcry in the country against paper
currency ; but, in a commercial nation, having
such vast commercial dealings, having such an
immense debt, that all the coin and all the bullion of
the world collected together would not pay it off—it
was necessary to deal largely by paper credit in various
shapes. The great object, undoubtedly, was to take care
that that paper answered the purpose for which it was
issued; that what it promised to do should be honestly
and exactly done, and that those promises to pay should
be met punctually. 'But the basis on which they were
issued ought to be made as broad as it could be. In
stead of taking one standard—a fanciful one, though
philosophically it might" seem more certain—they ins-
muscly increased the difficulties of a difficult period, as
the whole rested on an insufficient basis. What had
been done in the cases of the several crises' which the
country had undergone, and of which they had great
varieties? The most formidable, was that of 1825 to
1826. . There was another in the year 1837-1838,
in consequence of the derangement of affairs in Ame-
rica. In the case of the panic of 1825 and 1826, it was
very well known that the Bank was almost reduced to
its last sovereign. It was just enabled to say that it did
not refuse any payment. But he remembered that on
one occasion the officials of the Bank were anxiously
watching theclock to ascertain if they had five minutes more
to provide for. Mr. Richards, the Governor of the Bank,
stated himself that they were likely to be run dry ; yet,-
during the whole of that time the Bank had silver in its
possession, and was at that moment in treaty with Mr.
Rothschild to exchange that silver into gold, in which
the Bank was to make its payments. That silver Mr.
Rothschild was enabled to put into circulation abroad ;
and it was stated in evidence before the House of Com-
mons that the financier made somewhere about 100,000/.
by his patriotic exertions in helping the Bank of
England out of its difficulties. (Hear, hear.)
In 1836 and 1837, what was the condition of the Bank ?
It was saved from failing by the Bank of France. Now,
if they had. sustained two such crises in times of pro-
found peace, what difficulties might they not expect if
they should ever be plunged again into a state' of war
That consideration induced him to state his belief, that
two years of an expensive war could •not be gone
through without 'returning to the measures adopted in
1797. It should be remembered that, throughout the
rest of the world, both gold and silver were convertible
into each other, and were both equally available for the
purposes of circulation, without the consequence of One
driving the other out of it. Throughout the whole of
the Continent, the two metals were found circula-
ting in harmony with each other but, if lie
were compelled to make a choice of one
,of the
two he should prefer silver. He should take it on the
broad principle, that it was most important to be in con-
formity, in the matter of currency, with the rest of the
world. It was a great desideratum to have the broadest
possible base for the currency of the country. He should
trouble their Lordships no longer on that question, but
should confine hiniself to three words on the 'new prin-
ciple established bythe Bank Charter Act. He 'agreed
with big Noble Friend,'that the first part of this Bill—
separating the Bank into two departments—was wholly
useless in operation. It might be la harmless regtild.--
lion, but in fact, it was a. mere delusion on parties not
acquainted_ with the practical management or the Bank.
The present issue of the Bank and the management' of
the debt were divided into half a dozen depart-
ments, all distinct from each other, and whatever Act
was passed it would be the same. The Bill stated
that the Bank should only issue 14,000,000/. on its Oen
account, and then to the extent of its bullion. The Go;
vernment provision of the Act was the limitation of 'the
circulation, and it.conteMplated the gradual stopping of
all the issues of the country banks. Now, if that limita-
tion was desirable, he acknowledged that the thing was
well, and carefully, and judiciously done. The Bill had
certainly conciliated the country bankers, as it had se-
cured them a monopoly of business for the present. If
they acknowledged the thing 'to be right in itself; he
must admit that it could not have been more cleverly
managed. With regard to the check on the lime of ithe
Bank of , Eneiand undoubtedly -the' Bank had occasion-
allye been a great offender in the matter of its issues ;
but be apprehended, after all, that this Bill was an ex-
periment, and its working might not turn out so perfect
as was expected. The limitation of the Bank of 'Eng_
land was, first to 14,000,000/. on its own paper,
and then it 'might issue"to the amount of its specie.
That specie amounted to something like 16,000,000/,
which, with the 14,000,0001. of circulation it was
allowed, would bring the whole amount of its possible
circulation to about 30,000,0001.—the real issue of the
Bank being between 20.000,000/. and 21,000,000/. Thus
the law 'would have no immediate operation at all. The
Bank had a large margin of 9,000,000/ or 10,000,000/,
which would prevent the restriction from having any
immediate effect. The check on the Bank might
operate as some' check on the exportation of gold;
but, for the home circulation, the Bank might be
drained of every sovereign without a poUnd going
out of the country. At the 'end of 1825, what took
plaCe It was then proved that the demand for gold
might arise from circumstances which could not be cor-
;meted by the reduCtiOn of the issues. Saturday,
the 17th of December, 1825, was the critical day
to the Bank- of England to which he had referred.
The lowest return the Bank of England made of its cir-
eulation was about 10,000,0001. The difficulty cor-
rected itself before the Monday morning following, but
the relief was entirely owing to Mr. Rothschild: From
the l Oth 'of December to the 17th they increased the
circulation from 18,000,000/. to 24,000,0001:, from the
17th to the 24Vhthey•filethe-r increased it to 25,206,000!.,
and on the 31st of December, the last day of the year,
they had- increased it to 25,709,0001. They had tn-
doubtedly begun, like timid men, who stood in awe of
the responsibility which they were incurring, but they
went on boldly, and that issue of bank notes saved the
cii.culation of the country. Mr. Tooke, who was a phi-
loscipher of the.same school with Mr. Lloyd—
`The Miirquis CLANRICARDE—No, no ;he is
quite opposed to him: •
Lord ASHBUR TON was happy to have such an
authority on his side. Mr. Tooke had stated that that
was a bold measure, but a most, successful one. One
word as to the effects of the born dews on the circulation.
Whatever 'might be the system of corn-laws, if, after
depending for two or three seasons on the home supply,
We' should, in consequence of 'the bad harvest, be com-
pelled to-import corn suddenly and largely from abroad,
there woUld-undmibtedly be a large demand for bullion,
awl they must run this risk under any system acorn-
laws. One word as to the indiscretion which was charged
against country bankers ; He believed that those who
thought to miinage the issues by the Bill would find it a
More difficult job than they expected. The great
reproach which was 'made against Mr. 'Stuckey
arid the country bankers was
.that they issued
their notes without reference to the 'foreign exchanges.
He had' known Mr. Stuckey many years. He was a
most intelligent man, and ,perfectly understood what he
was about. He thought the framers of this Bill deceived
themselves in reproaching the beakers with inattention
to the foreign exchanges. The slightest fraction—a
difference of one-eighth per cent. might cause gold to go
out of the'country,'and the same difference might occa-
sion it to Come back. If the country bankers followed
these minute fluctuations they would be grossly mis-
taken in their calculations. Their issues must be
guide) by the state of their neighbourhood. ' He looked
.at this Bill as no party matter. lie believed it was
originally a Whig scheme, and 'he had voted pretty
steadily with his friends while he was with' them. But
in all matters relating to the trade or commerce of the
country, he had honestly considered the pro-
positions, and voted without any view to party
interests. In the event of country banks sus-
pending their issues the Bank of England
might increase its issues in proportion, and the profit
of such issues were to go to the Government ; but how
that profit was to be calculated, he confessed he was at a
loss to understand. The Government might be trusted
with power to check the increase in the circulation, but
they ought not to be under the temptation, or to have
the power of extending it. In time of war, Government
Was always pressing the Bank for advances. In 1797 it
was•not the Bank which got itself into difficulties, but it
'was the Government pressing the Bank. That pressure
from the Treasury was fatal to the independence of the Bank..
it was never safeito give the Government •an extending-
power over the issues of the Bank. e.This wassea great
experiment. It had been favourably received by the i
public, and he hoped it would be successful.

I The Earl of RADNOR had, in 1819, oppoied the re:
turn to the old standard, but having the standard n°,_`'
fixed, and having gone through all the suffering, If
thought it would be foolish to depart from it now•
they were to have a joint standard of gold and silre,d
every debtor would pay in the cheapest coin. If he Ow
pay a debt of 1001. by 961. ss. he would do so. It "
in fact, be giving every debtor an opportunity of
his creditor, and the effect would be that the creditor
would take precautions to defend himself by increasis"
w
the rate of interest. In France there was no joint start
.dard. The standard there was silver.
Lord ASHBURTON—GoId can always be proare
at an agio.
The Earl of RADNOR said that proved that silver
t
was the standard, because if you wanted gold you std
buy it. It was absurd for us to have a different stands
from all other countries, and he had never heard onle
good reason for having the standard a gold one. Oafgreat object of the Bill was to limit the circulation °0
paper. Now, according to his view, it was unwise e,
limit the circulation—it was unwise to entrust anY Pell
son with the power of doing so. The country Iv°u.
always provide for itself the amount of circulation It
wanted, and no more; and it was an act of presunoPtic,
—he did not use the word in an offensive sense—in
person to attempt to limit the circulation. A great, but'
he believed, an unfounded alarm, existed in many Paris
of the country lest the circulation should be so digu"
nished as to increase the price of corn. He thought Pcro
feet convertibility would give perfect security that
more paper would be issued than was required, because,
the moment any depreciation took place, it would be rek
turned to the issuers. He did not think that the null
of England and the country bankers were amenable
the reproach of having unnecessarily Increa- .t
their circulation. That increase had, in 113,°,1,
instances, arisen from circumstances over
they had no control, and if they had fallen into On--
errors, and suffered from them, they were the lel
likely to fall into them agaiu. These difficulties he,
mainly arisen from the corn laws, because whenevert
large importation of corn took place under the presea.
system, an immense quantity of bullion had to be
ported to pay for it, thus affecting the course of the e.
changes. The Bank was then obliged to control its c'o
culation, until prices were so reduced that goods wet
'„
exported instead of coin. Now if articles of luxur
such as wine and silk, had to be imported, the rise le
price would lessen the demand, but quite the control?,
was the case with regard to corn, because the dearer P
was the more necessary it was to have it, and the lu°r,ej
necessity there was to send out gold. Mr. Jones 1,0,,„
had fully explained this fact in his recent pamphlet:lJ
the subject. The Noble Lord had said that such No". 4,
be the case under any system of corn-laws. But supP°,
they had no system of corn-laws, but an entire free
trade. Would not tha't, by making corn a regular ~s,t
title of trade, remedy the evil. The fact was t"„it,
they were attempting to introduce a sliding
for currency as well as for coin,-and lie thought that
measure would only increase their difficulties. It sh"ent
be recollected that, in general, there was a large 01°1!
of deposits in the Bank. Now, when money was risl!',°,
in value, these depositors would demand their dep"%,
of course in bullion, which would still more increase! f;
difficnities of the Bank. This was:'`one of the miichlei,
of attempting to do that by legislation which had best;
left alone. If they provided that no one should isstke
notes without their being convertible into gold ati,f6,
option of the holders, they would obviate every "',,rl
culty, and do all that was required. The Noble ;.:0,
concluded by eulogising the Scottish banking sYsi'o.
which had given the greatest satisfaction, and been P'
duct LiveLive of immense benefit.
Lord ASHBURTON explained. His argument ab°llo
the corn-laws was this. He contended that there Vire
be times when we must be taken by surprise, and why,l
an unexpectedly largo demand for foreign corn 01ti
arise, which would require a considerable effort to roe,,,the demand for bullion which would arise in consequell„ciJ
no state of the law could obviate that, unless they c°"6l
govern the seasons. If, for instance, we had produce,
sufficient for our own consumption for three or fourr4i,i
and then had a bad harvest, a crisis, such as the one
which he had alluded, would arise.

The Bill then passed throuh Committee.
The Sudbury Disfranchisement Bill was read a sec°.
time.
stag'
The Bills on the table were then forwarded a
and the House adjourned.

HOUSE OF COMMONS, July 12.
The SPEAKER took the Chair at Four o'clock. ijit
Mr. PLUMPTRE presented two petitions for
better observance of the Lord's-day, also a petition
favour of church extension.

Ur. GROGAN presented a petition respecting PI
Irish jury list.
Mr. ESCOTT presented a petition from the Soother
°
Division of Hants, in favour of the existing corn-10,56'0)
Viscount PALMERSTON presented a petition Ird.'d
the engravers of London in favour of art-uninas,;tioo
complaininc, of the neglect with which a former PO
billy them had een treated. GREAT SOUTHERNb AND WESTERN RAIL tk
(IRELAND) BILL.
On thq motion for further proceeding with this
on the third reading,
Colonel RAWDON complained that there 1115hts
clause in the Bill which interfered with the vested r'g be
of Colonel Fitzgibbon. He moved that this clause
expunged.
noi'd
Lord ELIOT said the clause only applied to
deposited in the Court of Chancery by this "i";;l
company under the standing orders of that House.
fees of Colonel Fitzgibbon were only taken upon te,°liirt,
.paid into the Court of Chancery by suitors in the uclilie
and therefore he (Lord Eliot) apprehended that
clause ought to stand.
After a
_few words from Lord G. Somerset. 0.0
Eliot, and the Solicitor-General, the amendmentJ
withdrawn, and the Bill was read a third time
passed.

GREENWICH PARK. sang
Mr. AGLIONBY said he had a petition to plo
which he trusted would receive the attention 0- 11
Noble Lord at the head of. the Woods and Eorests%.oc
was signed by a number of persons residing, or 114'3
property close to Greenwich Park, and the valueor
which materially depended upon the view into that 13ci
tiful locality. The petitioners stated that they
not have presumed to approach the House upon, de
subject if public benefit was not concerned in it to 2- by
as great an extent as private interest. The Park" W,
one means or another, had been constantly diniin's'
and they prayed that a stop might at once be L' pu
further encroachments.

R-LAW. 7 '
Mr. FERRAND presented five petitions from to tba
ships in 'the West Riding of Yorkshire 'against
poor-law.

NOTICE OF MOTION. t.VbE
Mr. WAWN gave notice that, on Monday 05,,
should put a question to the First Lord of the Ada';"-,10
to ascertain (as we understood the Hon. Geotle'figth
whether English ships were manned with a itre
equal to that of ships in the Russian navy.
LAND-TAX RETURNS. • ,tej
Dr. BOWRING moved for certain returns coon('
with the land-tax.—Agreed to.

MAYN'OOTH GRANT. Cofir
Sir G. CLERK gave notice that he should in
tio
mittee of Supply, this day week, move the eau°
grant fur this college. r of
Mr. BRIGHT moved for returns of the ntunbe.oo'
murders and attempts at murder which had been
witted in the county of Tipperary ; the number ° o;
dictments which had been preferred on those chnr!ilic,
the number of true bills which had been returned by of
grand jury, and the results ; showing the nulnigoe°
acquittals and convictions, and the punishments in'"
during the last ten years.—Agreed to. Ily
SALARY TO THE CHAIRMAN OF THE
DLESEX SESSIONS.
Sir C. NAPIER wished to ask the Right Hon. eptt
tleman, the Secretary of State for the Home Depart el'
if it was his intention during the present session the
troduce a Bill giving a salary to the Chairman
Middlesex Sessions. no
Sir JAMES GRAHAM said he had a ineasufe, iii
the subject of the administration of criminal jus'e-9
the county of Middlesex ; and in the Bill there
provision for the appointment of a paid, magistrel
preside over the administration of criminal justice.
BRAZIL. tha
Mr. M. GIBSON wished to put a question W6iv
Right Hon. Baronet at the head of her Majesty'sroe'
vernment upon a matter of some importance. In erre
tion had reached this country that the Brazilian Gcsy
tha
ment had prepared a new tariff for adoption aft
10th of November next, proposing a much higlicr..tel
of duty on articles of British manufacture than esiiinO'
at present. He wished to know from the Bight
rit.
Baronet whether he had reason to believe that 91.1,-tV
tariff would be adopted and was already prepared
Brazilian Government,
ablic
Sir R. PEEL said that he had seen in the I)hei
papers a statement to the effect of that made by t
lie"
Hon. Member. Immediately upon seeing it, he Woe;
to the Foreign- office for the purpose of knowing `lO4
ther such information had been received, and he lid
been informed that it had not. Perhaps by the the,
mail he might be prepared to give some answer 1°
question.
t
Mr. MILNER GIBSON, wished to know whetl;)etritel
Government had had any correspondence with the I frog'
Government relative to the importation of sugar
Java, and whether they had any objection to 13/ 6
correspondence before the House.
fa"
Sir R. PEEL said that her Majesty's Govern pop
were in correspondence with the Dutch Government hot
the subject, and also upon the differential dutiel ;doe'
he was not in a Condition to place that currespo°
before the House.

LAW OF SETTLEME`TT. ion
. Mr. LIDDELL wished to 'know from the To°l4 orr
Gentleman the Secretary of State for the HomePej tbe
ment, whether he was prepared with a Bill to no°
law of settlement this session. AreL
Sir J. GRAHAM said that a Bill had been p
on the. Subject, Which was ready for introdueti°''e.
leave.to bring in the Bill during the P
• session, and it could be considered during the reC'.
. • • ACCIDENT AT BOLTON. 00:
Mr. FERRAND wished to know frOm the Rig,""epart,;
•Gentleman,the Secretary of State for the Holne t"-
•ment,-whether he would lay the evider-1,,e taken awere
coroner's inquest, in the case of th persons
killed at Bolton, on the table 011ie House. ,ibject
Sir J. GRAHAM said 11-t had considered the
to which the Hon. Member adverted. He observe V,
the verdict of the jury was one of' manslaughtef:Assip;
notes taken would be transmitted to the Judge °f 010,
before whomthe case would ultimately come, sf 00'210
point of fact, he doubted of the possibility of ti'i,
ss,„o,
to compel a result of this description. He must. C,
did not.thinic it consistent with the ends of jus.ls
fore the party was pUt.onhis trial, thattle 11°t,, OOP'
for -th'ei ;jag° shouldibe laid on the tallie,laf,,the
and made matter of debate there.—(Hear.)

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