The Sun.
London, England, 1810-04-17 00:00:00

PROCLAMATION,

, Heaclttrters, Gibraltar, March 22, 1819.-
'4 His Excellency,the Gommander in Chief is
pleased to direa that, comMencing with the sth Of.
next month, all Persons of the folloWing descrip
tion, shag be obliged to wear a tin badge on their
breast, or tome conspicious "part of their dress,
describing the nature of their employment,
and which will be furnished them, gratis, at the
Secretary'S office, on receivjpg their ;licenses, viz.
hawkers, porters; ferrymen; bum boatmen, lighter-
men; fisheirneri, trilekruea,- and eZters. All foreign-
ers, employed in the King's workswilt be_reciUired to
wear similar badges; anti the different guard§ will have
stria orders to apprehend any personpf the above de-
scription, who may attempt to pass auy of the,
gates, or whom they may see employed without
their proper badges.
" Any person found wearing one of these banges,
who is not duly licenced, and any perien ateinpting
to counterfeit them, will be treated as a spy; and
proceeded againit with the utmost severity.
. (By command) "R. WRIGHT, A. Sec.'s

" GIBRALTAR, MARCH t7.-.The following is an
account of the effeas of the storm on the night of
the 7th inst. We most sincerely • congratulate our
readers on its consequences having been so littlp in-
jurious to the commercial. interests 'of the place, and
on there haying been ncr lives laet. The gale cathe
on during the night of the 3d, mad continued in-
creasing to violence till 8 or g at night (matte 7th,
when-a beaVy squall at •S. NV, occasioned nearly.
all the ships in the bay to drive, or-part their cables :
several- were dismasted by falling foul of other vet-
sels, and twenty-two were driven on the beach at
Lanavort, where many of them will be lost. Among
the most valuable are the 'English brig Charl4tte,
from Rio Janiero to this place, with bark and sugar,
part of the 'cargo 'saved, vessel condemned, and the
Nancy, belonging to this port, bound•toMalta,
a general cargo, great part of which 'is saved, the
vessel bilged; the English brig Dragon,-Sicilian pol-
acre Felicild, American schooners Nimble and Sea-
gull will be got off.

Several of the floating stores belonging to the
merchants of-the garrison are driven on the beach;
where they remain without injury, and will be got
off the next spring-tide. . 1,
The POrtugueze ship Victoria, and .the Spanish
shjp Amelia, from- Alicant to London, with w 001.,,
struck in four and a half fathoms water; the for-
mer' received' no injury, 'the latter unshipped ..her
rudder; and .has continued to leak ever "since we
understand she will be discharged and hove down.

We have received Dutch Papers tp:,the loth inst'
from witich'We.haye made the foll Owing extra 141
tr. 6.7-!--Their Majesties set off yes-
terday from. St. Cloud far Compiegne.' •
" On- the 4th,• the Heralds at 4rtns threw among
the people, in the -principal squares and streets, a
nimbur of the gold and silver medals struck in com-
memoration of their- Majesties' marriage.
" A letter from Antwerp, of the 7th, says, that
the Duke of Reggio, alter taking pos,ession
territories to be rc:cltd to France, will trankfer his
head-quarters to Ilamburgh, where he will Assume
the'command of the troops to be 3iafiOned in Hano..:
Ver and the l-lans.e towns.

The following is the answer of his Imperial
Majesty to the address to the Depbtatioti from the
Senate of Ita;), : Gentlemen, Deputies.Of the Se-'
nate of our Kingdom of Italy---43ur people of Italy
,know how :flu,:h we love them. As soon as possi-
ble the ..Ernoress and my-self will 'peribrially, in our
-good cities of Milan, Venice, and Bologna, give our
people of Italy. fresh pledges of our affection.' To
the deputies of- the Legislative Bodies, husaid : "The
' wishes you express towards us are highly gratifying.
You will speedily return •to your respective depart-
ments. Tell them that the Empress, as a 'good
mother Qf this great people, participates in all our
feelings forithem: We and she can enjoy no hap-
piness, except in so far as we are assured of the love
of the French people.'
" HAARLEM, APRIL 10.,-.-The English ship 'of
war the cuckoo, Lieut. PADDON, Commander, came
ashore at calantzoog, in the night of the 4th. The
whole of the crew were saved, and surrendered
themselves prisoners to some troops detached from
• Amsterdam: The vessel was full of water; and
supposed to be a complete wreck; The wind was
W,S.W, when she struck. Lieut. PADDON was se-
verely bruised at the time of her, striking.
" According to advic.:s.from Munich, of the 30th,
the`-Tyrol, continued in a state of complete tranquil-
lity vand numbers of young men were offering
I themselves as volunteers for the Bavarian army."

There was no Court of Aldermen Held to-day';
but the Lord Mayor oideredihe price of Bread to
be contititted at is. 3i f. per quartern.

IMPERIAL L'ARLIAMEM;.

I:I6UE Oi.P.El2lth;

MONDAY, APRIL 16.

Mr. Bronghain w s further heard en the Rox-
burgh Appeal, in far,opr of ;the Lad!) Essex ker.—
To tie beard again to-tnorrow.

The Lots' "Militia 'Amendment Thli went throughi
the Committee, and was reported with otit any
amendment - , - - • . . •

CATHOLIC QUESTION'. .
.. The Earl of•DGNOUGLIMORI3 gave notice; that on,
the 2lst of !mkt month he should submit 4 mo-..
(ion, to.theit Lordships, grounded out the Petitions
which had been presented from -the boat' of the
triat Catholics. - • .

• CLERGY.
Lord HARROWBY presented some additional
turns respecting .the Livings of the.elergy..
Lord. HOLLAMD wished • for a more general view
of the situation bf the, Clergy than cutild be de-
duced from the'Returns already made.
Lord flAtittownv did not think, that in his view
of the subject it. would be necessary to lay be-
fore the,House-a: fuller Return than that which he
had moved for would' convey. As to the amount
of the -sum to be ,grantecl, for the relief required;
that was•a question which must originate in the (Alec
,House.

Lord HOLLAND persevered in the opinion, that'
when. the question of the Church Ekiablishment
cattle before the House,
~the more general the
turn, the better. He was well aware that any sum
to be granied on the occasion must or:ginaie in the
other House.

The motion of Lord LAUpERRALE respedincr the.
Standing Order, 'as affecting the Scotch Estates 15111,;
was agreed to. Adjourned till to-morrow.

HOUSE OF COMMONS.

MONDAY, APRIL I'6.

,A new ,Writ was` ord,red to • be 'issued the
Borough•of St. Germain's, in the room of Jos:
Sid. Yorke, Esq. who has Accepted the Cl3iltei ii
Hundreds.

On-the motion of AV—O'HARA, the Irish G)ro.,
ners' Bill was read a secoi d time, and referred to a
Committee of the whole House.

On the motion Sir H. MONTGOMERY, the Irish
Post Road Bill was .read a third- time, and passed.
Mr. •
PRENDERGASTpOSINhed his motion relative
to the Expedition to the Island of Macao to the: Bth
of

The LORD' ADVOCATE• for SCOTLAND brought in a
Bill-for regulating the wude orextraOing Decrees in
.the Court& of-Session in -Scotland, which was read a
first time, and'orderedjo . be read •a second lime on
the.. Ist- of May; lie also brought in a 13111 for re-
gulating the mode, of extracting Decrees in the
Court of Admiraly, and Commissariat Courts iq
Scotland. It was read a first time, and ordered for
a second reading on the 3d of May.
Mr. Ross moved, that- the Estimates of the
British Museum, 1 8 10, be laid befote the House.—
Ordered. •A person from the British Museum pre-
sented the Accounts of 1809.—Ordered to
.he on
the table.

On the motion a Mr. Rosa, the House went
into a Committee, to consider the Bill for the itu-
portation of Sugar and Coffee from Guadaloupe.
.:After some conversation between Mr. Baring,
.Mr.,Rose, Sir T. Turtop.' Mr.. Mirryatt, and Mr.
Barham, the Resolutions were agreed- to, and the-re.-
poit was ordered to, be received to-morrow.
Mr. BRAND gave notice that he would after the
recess, bring forward a motion rotative to the Repre-
sentation in,.Parliamenr..

..The Innkeepers' Bill, was read a third time and
Ossed.

PARLIAMENTARY REPORTS.
Mr.-IV-m.l,n rose, and in strong terms lamented
the malty instances of disiesPeet to the House, and
breaches of Privilege which had lately occurred.—
He. felt and, acknowledged the necessity of the ~
Public being acquainted with every thing which
passed ..in that House; the 'deprivation of, such
an advantage he -would never advocate, inasmuch
as it -is highly benefited the -Public-; but on the
subject of this communication be felt two things to
be absolutely nechsary, without whiCh it would de-
generate into an evil—First; that there should be a
respeCtful decency due to the HoUse ; the second, au -
impartiality and accuracy in: the detail-of what oc-
curs. Without the first the dignity of the House
would be continually insulted; the consequences re.
suiting from 'the want of the second would
,be most
mischievous. He alluded to the reports in a public.
Paper. On the 11th of this month the Paper alluded
to had reported the spe!ch of an Hon. Baronet, in
whigh several parts were pointed out obviously for
ridicule, besides - many evident mis-statements ; he
did lICIt mention this through any persdnal motive,
or ton. account of
~the high respect he tell: for the
Hon. Baronet, but on accoUnt, of the House. He
also complained that a combiaation had been.eirtered
into-not.to give the • speeches of two flight Ho:r.'
Gentleinen in the newspapers, because it was s.nd
they spoke with disrespect of those Gentlemen.. lie
would not now submit any motion, btit as someof t hose
persons HOW- heard him; he hoped his observation,
would prove a sufficient warning; it not, he would
consider it hiS imperious duty to the House-to resort
to such measures as. Would vindicaie its privi-
leges. .

Mr. TIERNEY said, he bad not taken any notice
whatever of ,the subject alluded to by the Hula.
Mt:11)1)er. •

Sir S. RomiLLY postponed the farther considera-
tion of the Report of the Privately Steeling Bill (which
stood for to-morrow) to Tuesday next.

1011 N GALE TO,NES.-
,
Sir S. ROMILLY rose, pursuant to -his notice, to
move that John Gale Jones be discharged froth
Newgato ; his opitaion ou the impropriety Qt 1.1.4

o -nmitment rerna;ned unalterable; to the eonsi-
‘ e;•ationot this heazlid no,t now ityetal,to call,theat-
tention of the House, his anolion rested- on the situ-
-Or:ground of the punishment.nowirifiicletYbeing
sufficiently severe. When a .motion fot a similar.,
WaS brought forward on the,' 2th of last
month, seVerll then.deelared they. would have ae-
a:rded, had it not been .on Or,. plea of his being.
imprisoned illegally 5 waving, howeyer,-. that plea,
nothing he intenued pying now „would
_deprive
him of a•-single- vote all he would urge would be,
that the pu.)ishment was sufficient. 1-1 e should be
extt:etriely•gladit he had an opportunity of explain-
shine things, and erog soiree
.argunients
•which had b-en adyniticed in the b.-hate on this

,subjed ; for the present lfe would not. " I should
be sorry," said the ll6a, Baronet; " for the sake of
any thing Ns'hiCh may codcern .rnysejl, to risk the
sacrifice of the liberty of another for a single doy.-
I-le could. not cont•eive what oppitiou could be
made to his motion;
.he certainly believed it was
hitherto the pra6tice.. of the House not to listen
any application in behalf of an offending, person,
unless that individual had previously presented a pe-
tition expressive of sorrow and contritibn for his of-.
fence. This he believed to be the usual,, but was
not sure if it was the invariable mode of yroceeding.
-What he should advance Won't', be nothing but his
sense of justice, and hc bered the House to re=
collea that maxim, " 'that the administration of

justice should be teMpered, with mercy." He
believed it not to be irr:ompatible. with the pri-
vileges -of the House that 'big individual was not'
released sooner ;• still he could not well justify
this right. Butcan thiS, or any other tritaunal, as-
Slime the power of domineering over the- minds of
others..; can it imperiously ,call on "them to abjure
their errors.? On - what 'Principle this right was.
maintained' he could not -imagine; but he would
say that tribunals,' whkh in- any -times have pro-
ceeded thus to extort opiniot'i's`; eventually hive Made
. hypocrites and not converts. He requested the
House to.call• to its recolleelion- the papers which
have beer. laid before it. - If an individuallias con-
tended that the Constitution' is -but' d Sitnple mo-
narchy, and that the Houses-of Parlianient arc but
emanations from it; which may 'be taken aw-y
without injury to Che retnainder k and the:.,ll-6ese
thinksjt to be the greatest degradation which can be
inflicted on an- individual, to "make- him .retract
opinions,"and to be the instrurneni of his own. hn=
miliation; if then, an individual has but the semi=
merits and feelings of a mafi; what.severer punish-
ment can he endore than,an avowal-of the false-
hobd of-his sentiments,. With respea to the'doc-
trine of petitions, being nnacquainted with the laws.
of the House, lie. would not say any thing-3, but he
recolle6ted in,former times the contrition, for an, ot-
fence was not only expressed at the Bar, but on the
knees. Siach be "believed to be the custom till
within'the last half century, since the case of .Alex-
ander Murray, this was not enforced. In 'an elec-
lion for Cornwall took the offender nor only
pressed bissorro'w at the bar, but before the. ledge
at Assize ; but no recent instance of. severity appears.
He entreated,the House to consider the punishment
it had inflitted'rbn this person, now confined nearly
two mom lis in the common gaol. of Newga(e ;. three
weeks he had suffered for breach of refusal, and

,now almost five weeks for refusing to compy with-
petition,ng the Hotise ; and is conceived not
only to be ati offence, but also of greater Magnitude
than the first. If the House does not take this into
consideration, at last, throgli'fortne of :rnipd, he
may Confess sentiments which he dries net feel in
.heart. Suppose that an inctivi(!ual hears that

opinions ha% e been advanced which he conceives to
be without foundation. ;Suppose that he thinks this
'House has no legal -power to commit to prison, and
it from, mistaken quotations and authorities, as a Bri-
tish Subject, he thinks it has no right to do so, he
Would-a,k any Gentleman 'Of tnieration, is his offence

•
Of such 'a magnitude as to sanaionlrs languishing
in confinement till this HOuse .has no longer power
to retain him ? Suppose he thinks that were he to •
tetrad from the obduracy of his sentiments he should..
commit: a sin against the Constitution, he would
ask if for Such an offence he should be puniShed with
•such immense severity? Can it .be supposed that the.
severe decree shall not be withdrawn till an individnd
who obtains his subcistence in a Detiati rtg Society oys:
his ‘homage-to the House of r2ownOrrs He there.
fore would move, "That John Gale Jones be brought -
to-morrow to the bar of the House,. in order to; be
discharged,"
SeCtetary RYDER said, that.it was not his in-
tention to detain the House any time ; he could not
however,,rcfrairr from Making- someohservations oa -
'what.had fallen from the Learned, Gentleman.. He
had stated every thing clearly. If the `person- had
been called to the bar, for the sole - purpoSe of re- •
ceiving his- expressions of: contrition ; 11. cne
vanced speculative. arguments,. and it had been...

ordered that he should not be released until he had

retraaed those opinions, then, all which had been
said by the Hon. Gentleman would have been appli-
cable ; but the question was simply, whether •the
time.of departure should be regulated by a stria
observance of a rule ?—namely, until a petitlou ex-
. • pressive of sorrow,.had beet) presented; and, in (a&,
• nothing More was required than whit had been al7
• ready stated-at the bar. Another circumstance he
- unchrstood was, that' an Hon. Gentleman whom he
did not now ace in his pace, had aaually been ap7
plied to some time ago, to present a petition from
Gale Jones. He would not now be in the situation
of a prisoner if he had 'thought fit ma petition a Month
ago. He was not called'.ori to ackncy.vledge the
justice of his punishment, but to express sorrow- for
hiS ofFence. But now he seems to set the House at
definice, and to hold himself out as a
,proof of its
having abed wrong ; for these reasons he should
oppose the motion.
Lord ARCH: 1-IAMLTON
:was of opinion -that if
the sentiments which had. just been heard were
agreed to, the distrust which 'subsists between -this.
House and the Public would be much aggravated.
Thu House should recollect. every circumstance of
the present question :—Gale Jones had been the au-.
thor of a publication which did not tend to insult
the dignity -of, the House, but was an offence
against Mr. York, yet -a breach of privilege tias
voted. He now felt some satistaaion that the
question was stript of every thing which could be
,_objeeed to it. He thought it rather extraordinary
that an Hun. Gereleinau (Mr. 'Yorke)• should, biing
•,forward a complaint Of what respeaed merely hitu7
sett, iisa.proot of contempt 4w,ainst the..Houso. it

wasjon occasion of an intiu!ry which excited.the,
greatust public atten!ion,' and which related to the
finest eSped•itionithat ever left this country. -With
respai to the merits of this circumstance, he agreed
with his Learnt:id Friend; and had it in contempla-
tion to make a inOt'on relative to The Hon.
Gentleman said, that .the ut,ual mode was to peti—t
tion for discharge. This discharge he stood here to
.demand; the principles on wh,ich it is refust-dcannyt
be too soon annulled. Tice Vitvtleges of !he Heine
are 4elicateiy tsutsceptible indeed,. when ,it is con-
tended that a decision of that House admits of: no
redresS, and no :i.pp!al. Hewould not let't he sub-
jest pass• without ot-clarino. his-opinioti on the'imwer
of the House, "cointeaed° as .it _was with the clues...
tion ; in.extremes be conceived. it to be 'vet), initt-
rious ;-When a hi-each of Privilege is v, ted, punish-
ment necessarily follows ; but it thiS House; or any
other Court, is gully of irregularity it may suffer
in the opinion "of the people: •Ljause ofCom-
mons possesses great pow,rer; :the exertion of Whial
might: not; hOweVer, .be prudent but : alien 'a
House, which possesses the confidence of ,the'peo7
pie, and evinces the sieates(li::-(insixpotlal. talknts,
cannot maintain its 'dignity, unles it tYJssesses the
power of enforcing its orders, whatever its powkis
may be, the Whole are exercised for the people." The
PUnishMent he conceived to be sufficient ; he:hoped
the House would not stand on the 'putittilio of ae-
kn,frwledgment, and make folly and obstinacy' the
groundS of its jiidgtnent.
Mr: FULLER said,- the ciestion in his mind was;

whether the cum wad ptinit;herlor not.

If he was, then it was
-hard to call on him.:' Make
; any apology to the priyileges of 11,0 a...
went were xvhatthe Public did not us defstand,
ther were they unde, stood .by the Spealisr. The
firstthing the Heuse should do, should he todefin6
its privileges, He Would put 6se Where a nervous
Chairman. of Qui-1J m t tee caked Upon a Speaker;
and Made a complaint against a Member, who was
obligee to Withdraw, and" who was tried, in, his ab
seuce, and. afterwards,Co4ned • by order :of, the
House, which occa,ioned
:much misery, to himself,
and probably the death of one of his tinnily, He
Would conclude by observing, _that if 'a. certain re
primand was; not ocpunged, from theJournalc., thougtv
it might go down to posterity,- it Could not injure
the individual, whoSe charaCier stood so high with
the Public as the person to whom he allutled.
' .Lord FoxsTONr, rose to contradia the assertion
of-J. G. Jenes having applied to a Member. to pre-
sent a petition.-;4le, alluded to the case .6f Drake,
iii behalf .of. whom he bad • presented. a petition to
the House; his case was, being committed for pre-
varieation, and telling a story of a Member, then
de,--I!tred .to beialsel it afterwards came out to be
true, yet V still rt-maiiied in ,Newgate, though the
only grounds on which he had been confined proved
to be false. To the'present qUestion he conceived
this circumstance to be applicable:
Mc. CVRWEN was- of opinion- thit it "world be
more honourable and consistent with the-dignity of
the Houie, if it could be done without infringing.
that dignity, to consent chit: Mr. Jones Should be dis-
charged.. He should be one of the last persons to
stand up fur the discharge of. Mr. Jones, were it not
tint when that person was at the Barlie,had admit-
ted the privileges of the House,confessed that he had
iufriozed th-, oe.privileges, andthrew. 'himself ripen
the House for mercy. The Right Hon. Gentleman
(Mr. .Ryder) had-stated,..tnat there was no prece-
dent for the discharge of any person committed ip

gaol by this Hotise' ithotit petition. Admitting the
truth of the Right-Honourable • Gentleman's: state-
ments, till there might, arrive times when the ne
cessity for Making such a precedent :night. be urged.
He thought the time .wa3 .now arrived when the
House were a-,lled upon to make it. Justice' de
m3nded that the punistitneut
,which Mr. Jones so
long endured should not be prbloraged. Withres.;
pea to what had been stated by an ,kion.-Ilaronet
formerly, that .this House had not a leg to stand
on, he. (.Mr. C.) mu-,t contend that sach poSltioh
was false,; but at the same tune,, though he,-con
denmed the Hon. Baronet for promulgating.. such
do rings, he must say, that his opinion was, that
the House did not possess that high deg,ce of confi.-
dence which, . as .one of the .braoches, of the 1./.?gisla-
bare,. it ought to pOssess.- 13y steadily looking danger
in the face .we might -avoid it. Toe.se were not,
times to turn a deaf ear to the complaints of-- the
people. For his part, he really believe,i that the
great bulkiof toe nation Was attached to the Govern-
ivitiingly make great SaerifiLs iu
support of it ; but it was impossible for any nialviA ho
kiie.w what was passing in the country not to be
aivare that the people were greatly disSatiStied, and
that they required a-reform in the representation.-..--
He would only apre.ll to the Iron. Gentleman (Mr.
Wilberforce), as the ;epresentative of 50,009 elec-
tors, -whether such- tva not the faCt, ? Whether
the anxiety whieh.he generally expressed ,when the
rights and liberties of the sUbjeCt -were.involved, was
not a convincing proof that the'peOple were dis.satis-
fied ? He (Mr.e.),.was, however, against- every
wild or chimerical idea of reform; he ‘V.shed to in-
fuse into the House the great landed indeiendent in-
terest, such as were nut dependent on a Minister.—
.It,was that !3lipcio of prodigality, in,bestowingm ho
nours, pensions; and places of emoluent upon per-
sons not meriting them, which he condemned and
deplored, which were serious evils, and the 'causes of
discontents. He wished to renew those old times
when no doubt existed in the country.as to the ho-
nour Of Parliament,—when there wa, no such thing

. .
as erimination and recrimination bandied about from
one side of the House to the other, but when .both
sides consulted their own dignity and the welfare, of
the nation. It was the spirit of accusation and recri-
mination which had done- more to induce the erv,
that there was uo public virtue to be found among
our Stataimen, though he did not coincide 'in that-
opinion ; for, he believed, there was still much vir-
tue to be found in public men. The Hon. Gentle-
man- having Made some further observations upon
theie topics; conclirded with expressing his de-
termination to vote for the discharge of. Mr. G.
Jones. • ,

Sir. THOMAS TuRTON declared that he exptEied

Ministers would. ',have been contented.
,with sup-
porting the privileges of tl:e douse to the extent
of satisfying' its dignity, and that. beyond that-t,hey
would not, have desired the House to go. Had
not the unfortunate man by his long itnprison-.
ment suffered punishment adequate to his ()deuce,
and would it dot be cocsistent ti;e. c!iT.ity of
thu House to put an end. to it.? • 'MLA w4s

tore of 'his 'offence ? why, what had been often
cemniitted and • passed unnoticed for years. The.,
offenchs Was certainly a gross breath of the privilegea-
of -that Hoes' s, and 'Mr- jones had acknowledged
SoenuctS.' Was not then the dignity of the House
satisfied, Whit that -acktiowledgnient ?h- The Hon.
-Bareset they 'alluded to the case, of 'General Cla-
2vering, "who in his opinion had not been guilty of
prevaSication, and who'conSeqUeOle-,asiit the pre
sent case, refused t&petitien, and contended that the
House ought skew its justice, by liberating Mr.
.Jotres, es, ho had suffeted enough.
The MASTER' of the ROLLS thought there were
twb qeestiens which required the consideration of.
the. House. First; whether the individual now the.
'subject of 'debate had suffered' for, his offence a
measure of punishment commensurate .with i hat
offence, and secondly, whether • that being the case,
tliere was or was not to beefoued on the Journals of
the 'House any forni 'or lira iiiee a Q n pen which
.would operate as a bar to 'his discharge.? To speak
of the latter point; the Learned' Gentlemah .Con-
fesSech thal ,he 'wished' he -was "much better ac-
quaieted with thehistOry of that practice than he
seeas,hlle. wished to be informed whether`thera was
hany established isrder to be found against the. dis-
charge 'of a • ee• seri under circumstances like 'Me.'
Jones, or 'whether there was ahy uniform a.sage so
as to justify the refeied to discharge bans ' He' was•
unwitting to look at • the established usages, because,
presuenptien was in their fat our, but he-could
-pot think ,t they should, be so far supperted-as to-lead
1.0 Plain stash Peheahle injustice. Inc the present casts,
when it wasetated that Mr. 'Jones could not be dise.
chided until 'he-had petitioned, and when, .on the
other hand, it had been also stated that he had made a
confession of his .offence, he must own that he .was
not prepakedlo' tollostr in any inquiry into all those
ti consequences which it had been stated might arise in
ehe event of Mr.: Jones not being dischaigede The
Right Hon. Seeretary had stated, that ilexes not ne-
cessary, in the petition, • to make an ackreee legtnent
of the offence. 'Now tae would wish to pus a question
:to'the Chair on that point, to know whether that
was the established, usage, because, its that ceses his
votewOuld be'governed by it. For the sake of the
argument he would suppose it was. With respett
to petitioning, tee sentences of this, House were fore
an indefinite time_;" the prisoner might, present a
petition et au early period.efter his commitment, in
order to prodece an
,early disch'arge, and he .very
naturally .throws into that petition those expressions
of 'sorrow which he conceives will indace the House
to, cotnply with the. prayer. Thus the practice of
petitioning may have been introduced to obtain ediss
charge sooner than otherwise the House would be dish
posed to agree to. Hewes very loth to break in upon
those usages, at d at .the same thne very loth togo to
all the consequences which they might entail: tbr it
might go to this extent.. Persons might be commuted
at different periods of the Session for the sinew sort Of
offence. A person- might be committed "at the corns
menceenent of the Sessioneand 'not choosing to petis.
don, and the House not being .disposed to relax its
usage, 'the person may remain the Whole- of-the%
Ses-
sion in prison e another person, for asireitereffetree;
within three or lour days of the close of the'Session,
might be coMmited, and petition; and then- be (hie.-
. charged,, One, therefore; lies in prison sax er.seven
months, and the other, because-he/chooses to. pee
thion, is liberated its three of four days. There was
this diaereeee, theat, in. ibe seeeasere punish-
, meet,. and 'all (LT:extent (supposing it to buso) on
the iliezige of -Were e quessioes to be
put to him '(WlitsMaster of the:Rolls), .`„` 1)() you
think this 111,L1 has .suffered- ail the .punishment
which the offence demands,?".. I should answer,
I think he has.", ,Ithlsas been Said, tight follow
' up the punishMent f r a longer period. Why pu-
, niSli a Man, pot-for what he hasbeen foetid guilty
of; of a cridie on which no sentence: had been- pas-
sed, but for the offence of 'ssisstinecy, an offence
which is. not to Ue found in the caialN,tie of offences
cognizable by
,this House. He is to be punished
for something which this Houss, requires him to do,
bet Wl.ich hr. objefts to. This' was a, species of
puniilopent which is ,certainly unknown - to. the
• erireinal jurisprudence of the country. What slid
irsignify to the House his confessions of sorrow ?
What. it he should,
.under the idea of regaining his
liberty*, bring e forced confession ? Was any thing
gain:ed by keeping hint, in the- event of his refusal
so to do, three or lour Months loneer in prison ?
Wei. any thing gained by the confessiOti ? Were
• the privileges of the kr3llS:3 so mech in danger, that
they wanted the mighty aid of Gaieebeses's Petition
. to support then). If he should be discharged; apd
fotind'atia ri 'offending, might not he, by the. s tine
authothy, be again Likens up. and punished ? The
LearnetteGentleinint was of opinion, that the 'mere
abstaioing from petitiening ought not to weigh. with
(he House in detaining JoneS its prison beyond the
present time. The corisettience of petitioning was
admitted.. by most prisoners; becafite in -so doing
'they were sure lb obtain their release. If the House
• thought the punishment already endured was staf-;
ficient, he thought they ought to discharge
Were he to be asked in this 'case to what period
*Jones should be confined, whether a montle,esix
weeks, or two. months, he .should say in all con-
science two mOntlni was punishment enetiglih; and
being Of that opinion, shotild vote for his 'discharge.
He was not actuated in giving such a vote- by mu-
tiveS of fear ; nor, on the other hand, was he to do
an aQ of injusetceenerely to shew hi,s courage; ell
he desired the House to consider' with him, was-
.
how they ought to administer sebstantlei justice,
and that was to be administered instils case by dids'
charging Mr;Jortee.
The SPEAK EA conceived, that 'as he-had been al-
-1 hided to, it might be -the pleasure- of the House'
that he eliould' state the course 'of proceeding in
cases' like the present. He would state what he
had Learnt from. the Journals of Parliament as to
he praQice of the HoUse.' The course generally
persUed differed in respect to corrimitmeets to the
custody of the Serjeaut at Arms and iogaol: In:
the instance of commitment 'to the Serjeant's'
custody, petitions prep-u etoryrt dirlettie, was the
preence in some cases; and iii' Others the per-1
son in custody has been dis Charged :on elate-
ments made to the
.HouSe. ~The Members of a
corismittee, , before whom,
,perhaps, the person
committed, a wiinesshact refused. to give evidences,
and conducted hensell in an nit ecomune way;. but
beieg'senSible of his error, hits apologieed to the
Committee, 'and they have ieterceded ‘k ith the
Htiase, by sta.ine that lre hid Lleporte'd lernselr pso
-

perly. there was a case of this kind of a rzi tf
the name of `Alcock, a year or two back, he • '4l-
- and Was discharged the same night. In the
, case of Peter Stuart, the primer, three or four years.
back; who wai sent for a breach of • privilege to the
custody of the Serjeant, and having petitioned,
discharged. 'Viola respectto commitments to goo!,
the general course was, not to releas. without ,pet!
tiOn.
,Be did tot fihd. any rule to the crintrarl
the practice appeared uniform. 'As to.the sort--
petition, it was in many` cases various, as the peti_.-
tioners some instances thought the:best mode to
Adopt for their enlargement, but the petiti,,ng i". •
variably. acknowledged that the party pelitioniog
bad otlended against the privileges of the House'
It wasllot required that• the petition-r shotild_r
itro the. particulars of that offence, but merely t""tt
he should :express his sorrow • for it. These were
the modes or proceeding and practice of the Ho°s
so far as he had been enabled to ascertain from the
Journalt..•
• •
The CHANCELLoR of-the Excirmuna was 0.-
tlidt Cie tuitorni- practice of the House. had b,=e"
as stated-by the Speaker so c• •rredly—t hat witbres:
peel to persons committed to gaol; they.mta,t'l'''
titiou, before the House could .entertain the • claes;
tion of discharging them. The que-:tion wgs not
whether a petition must be presented, but wbet'
there were in this case circumstances, and whether
the times were such as to induce the House to thin!*:
that they would act wisely in depart ieg from the
'
form practice. The Right Hon. Gentleman cetu
see nothing either in the caie or in the times to
thy hithin thinking that the prs•lit was tie peli°
in which it was absolutely expedent to make -a i
parture from the established usage. The L'irnfd
Gentleman, Mho brought forward the motioA
Made use of a great deal of what he. considered or";
gurnent, to induce the HonSe to agree wi Ii hung
He. had partrcolarly- argued a;,alnst what he &en'
the injustice•ofeallingon persons ti.) re: ant any the°,
retical or hereticalopinions winch they tni,Jit• ha' rf
held. Against all those arguments, I
imust bi I:-
state that there' were.' no-"theoreticat'oPiniotts.wl'it
could be giver) up I the. Aid hot. make `iisuch call, Ail teat was7desiied was, that in riot
forin..ll4r. Jones should do that Which he had do
alrevOy, ands hch he ought to ed before he can
entitled to bedtscharged. Having confessed
t e•erro rks,
on what principle.i.4 it nowpretgliciedohas
'to retif;Bt.ii repeat saiementatie- acknowleu
Inept •which, When at. the Bar he. No vivantart..
made? NV,ts it bec:aus:r he found it to be II
UnitOrm praccice of the House? he not v4lo:"i'„e
• t b ir, say "J have erred, and I ;brow myself on t
mercy of this assembly." • Was it too 'touch
• require that he should- --now -do----that—b., ..
Y74tti
.wincii 'he ten-rd—air clotiriCeball'Y
question is, whether: he should -be kept it) I
Son, failing to comply -with the fOrnis of the Hot
•
With respect to that, he ,rnust stp that his acknt 0•1;..
tn ent was an answer- to those tot e men who
sideted that .his refusal
was- perhaps the effe6,' ,•
some workings of conscience. His answer 414 #
)11.
proof that he now dealt. Icontanacionaiy by :11
House, by refusing to confirm that which-his!
science permitted him :to aeknowleg",e whdt? loft'
brbeght to the bar. It was, in short, nothing
con,iiniapc, a that contempt -and ciontuli
and mat 4; all the difference in the case. 11 ,
month pas_t_Aif.
,Jones, :had- been told, thatit
deported Ilintse:f properly, .and petitioned, hen
be dischaiged the next day. In any case 0.
not:
might he said on the duration of runts!nncot ; • 0,9
in the present, when the party had ill,' 01;u" -',OO
relieving himself, by coming to the House
usual form, the House were, on his refusal to
ply with' toe form, obliged look 'at 'tile .S11(-.
and ascribe it fo its tour causecontumacy•
• respeCt so the caves of General Ga. ering,• •`,lB-ji-
.Santion and' Ijrake, those were crises
ern, for they had stated something El-e, aod
quently must in their pe!;tioes admit it ; bt.l' llr
•,.
,V)ties had in the first instance admitted MIS
and w,as•now.desireS-fZienfbody that admissi" ;"
the petition, which he 'refused to do. t'!'►
I •
I. I
any thing either•in the times or .. the cases
should make it necessary tOr the.,House to
from the usual fortns ? Were the riv.ms, the "P-t:t..l=
leges,.and the laws of the House to be clips ? „it
ii becoMe necessary to diminish them ?
-Hon. Gentleman agreed with his 'Learned- 'of
'that if the refusal to liberate. Jones was so tit
injusnee,' it ought not to be persevered iii ;
was not so. 'ln hiS opinion, the subinission
offender ttiar.lera:,principal ingredient ha the di.sclOrb-5 •
•The Hobse would • see with what .temper p,;.•
disposed to resist. the forms,Of the House ; a -
ing no reason to induce the. House to. deparr•Wte
. its forms, the Right Hun. Gentleman shotil4
-against the motion. ' • " •
Mr. WHITBREAD was disposed to think fa'Or ~tt1,1:..,
House in continuing the imprisonment
would belt-eating him with great and cruelr.4o-A.--
tire, and be ptinishing with a degree of s
e
v
erit
y,
,v,
exceeding. his offence.-;—The Right. Hun- *iv:
man had been guilty of great injustive to •••I•6n'°„t"...
putting his offence on the -shone ground as- 111',:;:5-'
fence of a person prevaricating at the 'Bar, ther'-'7he
no analogy 'between the cases. Mr.W; !read ;rr
.onfessiOn of,Jones at the 13. r, and insistad
• after" tiie man had acknowledged the offell'c-6'
House ooglit not to have acted so cruegy_in
him to prison ;it :was an nndne exercise. of"; 1
power which they exercised.--,Th Jr,e Right, )''')
G.:ritlerain 'had said Jones hadretused to petiti6ll,
pr.'"bletil,nB:sokredio.dweedclowith:at rliVg-11)17thaddittiheVfloluiVO
,any thing of him with resped 'to the 'coursti,j:
meant •to-- pdrsoe?.•How was it possible I,7nrany
ti
'man being to kno:.; that a second contriti on-4cli3
pected by • the-House? Was -it fair to. s3l,oos'
any reasonahle bf:ings would expect such a procce';,.
fog ? the Right:Hun. Gentleman, iip the 'flt,"
spirit of intolerance, says—" No, I will apt be.c°i36''
tent with, his once having expressed Co atai5i09'.1.4,,,,-
shall again come before the House, repeat his we',
and prove that he • has not • changed opioioll,i;ri
The Hon. Gentleman was glad to kno vt.ntliC
Hon. Gentleman's articles Of faith, W ►41;01
these: what he says ;oshe true ylsterdar „..so
Come forward to-day and' voila for
..-agal°'
suppose'Such a thing a, a reform. ttion t° ";011--
-place, and that a man ilia not believe in tranlobsr cf
:Cation, and that man was called before is C°P. o•
Inquisition, who committed forhim Ws W3ll-
f nth ;:.hot that. afterwards, either fro
or men, he had changed his opiti 4)"