The Sun.
London, England, 1844-11-18 00:00:00

OURT OF SEWER

the payment should be delayed, it would be a good and
valid amendment.
Mr. LESLIE—The Chairman was going to put to the
Court that the sum of 2,0001. be paid to Messrs. Ben-
nett, and his amendment was to delay that order until
certain investigations were made. The delay would be only
till to-morrow, or a dty or two longer. He (Mr. Leslie)
had no wish to resist payments fur work really done.
The CHAIRMAN was still of opinion that it could not
be entertained, and reused to put it to the Court.
The order to pay Messrs. Bennett the amount in ques-
tion was then carried, and signed by six Commissioners.
A further sum of 950/. to Mr. Thomas Cubitt, on ac-
count of works in part of the King's Scholars' Pond
Sewer, was then oartored ; as also a sum of 41. ss. to
Mr. J. Fluin.
Mr. Hertzlett, the chief clerk, then read, a letter which
he had received during the discussion from Mr. Jenkins,
the second clerk of the works, praying leave to resign his
situation.
Captain BAGUE would wish to have Mr. Jenkins called
into Court to know his motives for resigning. He (Capt.
Bague) had learned out of doors that that officer had
been goaded into this course by. an Hon. Commissioner.
The CHAIRMAN thought it would be derogatory to the
character of that Court to call upon any officer to ex-
plain his motives for throwing up his situation.
After some discussion as to " the right" of any Com-
missioner or Commissioners " to goad" the officers at
the Court, it was finally put to the vote, and carried,
that Mr. Jenkins should be called in, and that gentle-
man was accordingly introduced. His own letter, and
the resolutions of the Court were then read, and to
questions from Captain Bague as to his motives for re-
signing, Mr. Jenkins replied, with great naivete, that he
had got a better situation, and had accepted it.
Mr. LESLIE had not replied to the remarks which had
been made 1 y Hon. Commissioners, but now that they
had had Mr. Jenkins's answer, he would ask those Hon.
Commissioners if they had meant him (Mr. Leslie) as
the person who had goaded that gentleman on to resign.
The question was unanswered, and the subject dropped.
A letter was then read from the Holborn and Finsbury
Commission, expressing its satisfaction at the resolution
come to by the Court of Sewers for Westminster re-
specting the depth of sewerage on the new line from
Long-acre to St. Giles's.
Mr. WILLOUGHBY moved that a resolution should be
placed on their minutes, disclaiming the inference that
seemed to be drawn by the neighbouring Commission,
namely, that that Court, in consenting to the increased
depth of sewer, had only a desire to consult the interest
of that Commission, without any regard to the wants of
the ratepayers in Westminster. He was the more
anxious that the Court should express such a resolution,
lest the concession should be urged as a precedent at
any future time.
MT. BEECH seconded it, and the resolution was ordered
to be entered on the minutes.

The CHAIRMAN then directed attention to the neces-
sity of taking some measures for the immediate re-con-
struction of the defective parts of the Ranelagh sewer in
Gloucester-road, Paddington, which had been already
ordered, under the superintendence of Messrs. Tite and
Rennie. He had hoped that contractors would have
been named by that time, but as the parties had declined
to accept the works, it appeared to him that that Court
should direct Mr. Jay, the contractor on the eastern and
western divisions, to proceed with the sewer, under the
supervision of those gentlemen. If the matter were fur-
ther deferred, at least a delay of a month would take
place, and rather than such should be, he thought they
might with great propriety make the offer to Mr. Jay.
A letter was read from that gentleman, offering to do
the works in the remaining districts at the seise rate that
he did the eastern and western.

Mr. LESLIE thought that the letter was read in the
wrong place. It ought to have been reserved until the
subject of the contracts on the Ranelagh and Counters'
Creek was taken into consideration. The letter of Mr.
Jay had reference to the districts, and not to the parti-
cular work in the Gloucester-road.

Mr. GUTCH said that the property on the line of
sewer was greatly injured in consequence of the delay
in re-constructing it.
Mr. WILLOUGHBY was, under the circumstances of
the case, disposed to adopt the plan suggested by the
Chairman. _ _

Mr. BAYLIS had heard that there was a report in one
of the newspapers, that the state of the Counters' Creek
sewer was exceedingly dangerous, the body of a man
being found in one part of it, and a carriage and horses
in another.

The CHAIRMAN supposed that the report had arisen
from a person having incautiously driven a gig into it.
It was determined to re •consider the subject after dis-
posing of the question of contracts for the districts.
The CHAIRMAN having introduced that subject, and
Mr. Hertzlett having again read the letter from the con-
tractor, Mr. Jay,
Mr. LESLIE rose for the purpose of proposing that that
Court should adopt the plan pursued by the Holborn and

HOLBORN DIVISION.

. .0..
t., ,-, 0 ,tz ,:$ ri 0;
.2 w .4 ...1
ti
PLACES. 2 t., 4 Highest and Lowest Tenders. 4' -di ° t%) ''' Side entrance. ''-' '4 ii •.1
L. gi 0 tz. f3B.G. rz I Total.
'4l E.° 44 E cr) ;Li ci, cn i r. 4
_ -
_______
x s. d. Ft. In. £. s. d. .£ s. d. .Z. s. d.l s. d.
great Russell-street and Mu- / 9 1,230 0 0
scum-street
Kentish-town-road and Grafton- ii - - 4,915 0 0
place 12,881 0 0 Cotsworth. ' 3,465 .•• 5 12 20 26 0 2,881 0 0 Tunnelled. 2,881 0 0 16 7i
443 0 0
Hatton -garden 7 319 0 0 Green. ••• 400 none None. 618 0 319 0 0 None. 319 00 15 11i
Chancery-lane
'''' •"' - :8 , 938 810 Hill.
(Contribution 350/. by Inn) i
4,250 0 0 ... 1,320 1 and 1 lowered 10 12 19 0 933 810 121 7 2 1,054 16 0 15 111
;
New-road and Seymour-street 7 3,188 0 0 Ward and Son. 2,750 600 3 8 22 24 0 3,188 0 0 104 0 7 3,292 0 7 19 71
Charlotte-street and Bedford- 10 1,330 9 0
• square .. 800 0 0 Cooper. ... 1,380 2 2 8 16 6 800 0 0 219 2 802 19 2 11 8
„ 142 0 0
King's-road, Gray's Inn
Ferdinand-street
( lls. 6d. per foot contribution) 1 392 0 0 Mutter. •••' 786 1 1 2 12 0 392 16 2 None. 392 16 2 10 0
FINSBURY DIVISION. .
Macclesfield-street South t 8 535 0 0
460 0 0 Ward. •••• 700 1 2 10 12 0 474 0 0 None. 74 0 0 13 4 Battle-bridge and Holloway-
-12 2,230 0 0
road
11.24623 120 60 Wood and Probatt 300 2,200 2 6 2 16 0 1,246 12 6 None. 1,246 12 6 9ni
,8
Collier-street, Pentonville ...... 13
973 12 0 Medworth. ...
1,391 0 0 1,480 2 8 8 17 0 973 12 0 50 6 3 1,023 18 3 13 10
Hall terrace and Windsor-place 12 6,97 6 9 Medworth. ••• 4,683 0 0 1,150 1 31612 0 697 6 9 None. 697 6912 1
Pitfield-street 7 3,190 0 0 Bennett. 3,440 1,490 0 0 580 3 53018 0 3,190 0 0 ••• 3,806 4718 6
Great Cambridge-street ......
A 960 0 0 •. • 1 6 0 14 0 1,059 10 0 None. 1,059 10 0 13
.2i
High-street, Islington
566 0 0 230 1 3 10 18 0 771 0 0 76 16 11 847 16 11 19 8
Parkfield street, Islington
384 0 0 James. •• 640 1 3 015 0 384 0 0 116 7 385 16 0 12 0
Battle-bridge and Holloway- , 275 0 0 1
" 211 0 0 Threadgo d. •••
road 340 1 0 2 15 0 211 0 0 None. 211 0 0 12 5
~ 290 0 0
Baker's-row I " 250 0 0 Johnson. •••
300 1 2 4 16 0 250 0 0 21 7 6 271 7 6 18 1
..--____
Brick-lane
,____ --- -
12,185 i 15,531 31 81 1181 I 21,224 6 9

115,531
) 12,185
£27,716 -
mpinning

" Uncle]

Id. ._-. 1

£21,224 6s. 9
00 feet of old Sewer.

[ss. aid.

L. per foot

To a question from Mr. Barry Baldwin, M.P.,
Mr. LESLIE said that Mr. Roe, the surveyor to the
Court of Sewers for Holborn and Finsbury, drew the
plans, &c., and furnished an estimate of the expenses of
any projected new work to that Court. A very important
work, 28 feet deep, part of which was to go under the New
River, was estimated for by Mr. Roe. When the tenders
came in, however, none of them were within 3001. or 400/.
of Mr. Roe's estimate. The Court said, "Mr. Roe, your
estimate must be wrong. None of them can do the
work for what you say. How is that ?" Mr. Roe re-
plied, " Gentlemen, I cannot help that ; but the work
can and will be done for that if you order it, and make
the contractor for the division, who is bound to do so,
supply you with materials and labour, and so forth."
Well, then, Mr. Roe completed that work at 1001. less than
his own estimate. Let them, then, observe the advantages
of that plan. They had correct details before they
began the work they had plenty of time to
consider what they were to do and having
agreed on a thoroughly digested plan, it was open to the
whole community to propose for the work in question.
He (Mr. Leslie) was quite charmed with their specifi-
cations. He had them beside him, but would not tire
the Court any further. Let their surveyors in like
manner give detailed plans, and an estimate of the ex-
penses in each work. He would make no observation
then upon their late contractors, but when he saw the
Messrs. Bennett tendering some seven or eight times for
works in the Holborn and Finsbury district, although
only accepted twice, it proved to him, that if, as had been
said in this Court, they had ever burned their fingers,
they seemed very anxious again to return to the same fire.
The CHAIRMAN hoped that Mr. Leslie would conclude
with a resolution.

Hon. Commissioner; and why
then, he asked, should they
again renew that discussion ? Then with respect to the disposed
two districts already f, it ' was out of the power
0
of the Court to adopt the motion put on the table by the
Hon. Commissioner. Let them wait a year to give the
system lately adopted a fair trial, and he would then be
as ready as any Hon. Commissioner to try further improve-
ments ; but he could not consent to overturn all that
they had so lately created. Any further discussion of
the matter tben would only have the effect of distracting
the Court, and wasting the public time. The reason
why contractors did not come to that Court was simply
because they were afraid that some Hon. Commissioner
might come down, and take from them the very marrow
of their contract.—(Cries of " No, no," and " Hear,
hear.") lie said, yes, those gentlemen were afraid,
and with good reason—he did not blame thern—th•At
the Court would play them a trick, and they said,
" When you pretend to give us a whole district, you
only give us the dirty part of it. They had, he re-
peated, come to a decision on the subject of Mr. Leslie's
Jay'sens Proffer e r b e accepted.
Commis Ls tiv neer motion, and although three contractors had been already
tn and
dn .
Learnedst'
rl
scared, he was glad to find that Mr. Jay was not, and
would take that from which the others shrunk in dis-
may. lie had not been an advocate for the plans wthhiecm
a inh
had been lately adopted, but having been oncelladopted,
con-
cluded fairt
MAr. GI:7cl"
It was seconded by them °
he
trial.h yn a
memoving Theof Hon. common
Mr. B. BAI,DWIN, M.P., would endeavour very suc-
cinctly to reply to the Learned Commissioner (Mr. Wil-
loughby). The Hon. and Learned Commissioner had
said that it was out of the power of the Court to make
any alteration.
thought the
Mr. WILIAM/EBY 11011. Commissioner
mistaken. He did not say " power." ,
Mr. BARRY BALDWIN had taken down the words. The
next thing was as regarded time. He thought that time was
most opportune, for the form of the sewer had no-
thing to do with the Hon. Commissioner's (Leslie's)
resolution. The form was nothing ; the
contract could
still be entered into in the manner desired by the lion.
Gentleman. He proposed that he should merely take
the work in the block instead of piecemeal. He pro-
posed that details should be placed on the table, and
that contractors for the works should view them. The
Hon. and Learned Commissioner said r
" -,et us go on
for one year." He (Mr. Barry Baldwin) was a
young
member of that Court, but, as far as he could see, the
thing had been gone on with too long already
on the old
system.—(Hear, hear) _ Delays were dangerous,
and it
might be said at the end of : that one year, " Oh, let us
go on for another year, ' and so they "
wout. never attain
If agentleman •
nears •r to perfection.
hous e he would not contract for its being done piecemeal;
he vi ould contract with some one to build it out for a
certi tin sum, and so they might do there.—(Hear, hear.)
He 'thought that the very best time for the Hon. Gen-
tleman's motion. He (Mr. Baldwin) had never spoken
to the lion. Commissioner (Mr. Leslie) on the subject
before, but his resolution did certainly appear to him
feasible and worthy.of support, an he should support it
therefore. They might depend onet, they would always
find men—respectable men, too—ever ready to accept
their matracts if they only gave them a fair and reason-
able remunerating IT)fit, and that could be done as well
in the block as by piecemeal. Let them adopt the plan
proposed at least in one division, and see how it did there.
, might be new, but if it promised
The syst nii to be of
use to th e rate-payers they should try it.
Mr. REECE quite agreed with the propositions so ably
laid d 0,..,„ by 1115 learned friend Mr. Willoughby,
vt , .

Mr. LESLIE, after a few words; concluded with a reso-
lution to the effect, that all works in the Ranelagh and
Counters' Creek district, excepting small day jobs, should
be carefully estimated, with prepared plans and sections,
including every expense, such as side entrances, gullies,
&c., and that all works done should be the subject of
particular contract, invited by public advertisement.
The Hon. F. BYNG seconded the motion. He with
pleasure supported a resolution which would throw open
their works to general competition. He was very glad
to find himself in a position to sign his name to the pro-
position of the Hon. Commissioner.
Mr. WlLLouGiinv, while giving the propounder of the
motion credit for the industry he had evinced in bring-
ing such a mass of evidence before them, could not yet
help thinking that that evidence had been brought for-
ward at the wrong time. He felt sure that a shrewd
man like the lion. Commissioner must be aware that the
end and aim of all talk was to come to some conclusion,
but that seemed to be another instance of the faculty which
the Ilon. Commissioner seemed to possess in such a great
degree, namely, the bringing of a proposition forward
at the wrong moment. The lion. Commissioner tried
to show that by adopting the Holborn and Finsbury plan of
contracting for their works that Court would derive a
certain benefit, and that a beneficial result would also
accrue to the rate-payers. But the Court had come to a
conclusion upon the subject before that day. It had
altered the form of sewers after a long discussion. It
had already received public tenders, and already dis-
posed of two of the districts. The Court, therefore,
ought to give the system it had so very lately adopted
a fair trial. Let them not then occupy the time of the
Court by again considering that which had been so full
discussed before. Not long ago when Mr. White s
motion for an alteration in the form of sewer was before
them, the subject of adopting the egg shape, as in the Hol-
born and Einabury district, had been fully suggested by the