The Sun.
London, England, 1844-06-04 00:00:00

eafatiaez, . „ •••• .
'etessi .* 5 °rl4ll----he really did not think that much very little knowledge of the interior of the country; and
Ile 41'ef-' could be placed_ on.. those. certificates. it was therefore impossible to say whether the
gezeeet" not think they would be any better growth Of sugar in that country was produced '
than the aiainst the sugar of Cuba or Brazil by free labour or not ; but in Java, Manilla, -
coeetr eY were at the time of the war between this and China they had sugar the produce of free
Ivo steuY and France, when it was a notorious fact that labour. The Noble Lord then adverted to topics that
theirs ggied our goods into foreign countries, and they always raised a cheer in that House ; he said, why net
hest Into ours, by-iiiens of forged certificates. Those sold the sugar of Brazil to Russia, and bring in ex-
ta,ae;_inainted with the sugar trade did not seem to change-for it same of the, produce of that-country. A
44,142, same confidence in these certificates as the great deal had been said about cotton, tobacco, and
t ' " ri'°o Baronet—those gentlemen seemed to have coffee. Now, with respect to those articles, none of them
thleYeilitetle less apprehension in 1844 than in 1841, when could be fairly said or considered to be the perpetuation
was „erential duty of twelve, instead or ten shillings, of the slave trade. The cultivation of coffee could be
gtQatlT°sed by the Government of that day. The carried on by free labour where sugar could not. If the
.a.f 0 Jection to any change of duty then was, that the motion of the Noble Lord was adopted, the result would
a fair e4sPeriment of the abolition of slavery had not had be the extension of sugar cultivation, and also the ex-
free I,,L,rlal—that it was necessary to ascertain whether tension of slavery. The effect of the present plan, he
s, cue could supply the place of slave labour. Had believed, would be principally visible in the sugar of
Nee ; Progress been made in the experiment of free Java and Manilla ; the plan would operate as a positive
than labour in 1844, that they were not afraid of a premium on the extension of the cultivation of free
fie egaet The same differential duty thought sufficient sugar in those countries. An encouragement would be
Plied tovarallanilla, and the United States, should be ap- given to their sugar in the first place ; but, in the second
,Ilibiaa.„`"anha and the Brazils. He thought that a pro- place, it would tell with permanent effect on the rise in
in 18 e Linty of 635., as it ought to have been abolished the value of free labour sugar generally, on account of
give ill' ought to be abolished now ; and he would its increased admissibility. With respect to the ex-
Dot ee- reasons. The supply of sugar from 1831 had tent .to which it might stimulate the cultivation-
the
een such, he believed, as to enable the people of of sugar in the East Indies, he believed they knew too
tleeeli_untry to consume it to anything like the extent little of the resources of that country to form any esti-
-18,31C,°111(1 under other circumstances have done. In mate upon the point ; its immense productive powers
Ike ef's,32, and 1833, there was an average consump- were as yet undeveloped. But, altogether, he did not
whole 'rota lelbs. to 201b5., of sugar per head on the anticipate that the increased quantity of sugar that
rage ,P"Pulation, whilst in subsequent years the eve- would be brought into this country, in consequence of
heeteatl become so low as 171bs , and even 161bs. per this alteration, would exceed 20,000 tons, and this
of
re-juhis. reason alone seemed very. powerful in favour quantity subtracted from the general markets of the
410 re mon of the duties. In 1843 there was little world would not, he thought, much tend to raise the
Itiee than 171bs. of sugar per head consumed, whilst in general price of the article. The Noble Lord had dwelt
(Rev th a smaller population, there. were 191bs.— upon the probable fraudulent introduction of sugar from
fully in ear.) The consumption of tea had wonder- America ; but he thought there was not much danger of
Niturucrp ..,
aseit since the commencement of the present this being the case. The American, grower was not
Coed, .hut sugar had not increased in Proportion, subjected to any duty in his own country ; but, if he
si spi;?rlng the increase of population, the consumption sent his sugar to this country, he bad to pay his duty.
treat cits and beer had rather diminished among the Again,- the price of sugar in New York had been for. the
crease elposuraing classes, whilst in tea and coffee the in- last few years about thirty-five shillings, and in this
411801" ad been very great. The consumption of coffee lountry it had been less ; it would not, therefore, be the
Net - was 7,851 0001bs • in 1841, 27,298,3221b5. The interest of the American to send his sugar from New
36 111Ptio ' . ' '
„ )675 „„ 11 of tea in 1801 was 20;227,0001b5.; in 1841, Orleans to Liverpool, instead of from
.New Orleans to
'3eaerOlbs. In sugar, the consumption, in 1831, was New York. Again, there was no class in America that
tirse, ,Mhs• ; in 1841, 4,657,0001b5. . There was three did not clamour for protection. In this country some
pared p amount of coffee consumed in 1841, as corn- were indifferent to it, and some were opposed ; but
qsaawlth 1831, -whilst the increase in the-consumption in America all were anxious for it. And this was
lotion re had been so trifling. The increase in the popu- also a great political question. The bond of the Ame-
keipe:uring this period had been from Bto 14. The .rican Union was not so close or so strong as not to be
fed' ;-eent of Indian labour in the Mauritius had been affected by the result of this question on the slave
eeeete. had been found successful ; and there had not states. The great mass of the sugar consumed in Arne-
‘boer :4, same objection to the introduction of such rice was grown in the state of Louisiana, and he thought
Oerite-s,°rolerler. Lord Auckland, who was formerly op- that 'nothing was so improbable as that America, while '
I'4:lit be now that, underproper restrictions, it recognising the high protective principle, would allow
' t tee r,"° successful. The Noble Lord (the Secretary this single state to become the victim, for the sake of
Africa Colonies) had made some relaxations concerning introducing the principle of free trade in the single ar- !
farthe a labour, and he did not think they could go much tide of sugar. The Noble Lord had said that the Go- ,
°ltett',,,in, that respect. A reduction of the sugar duties verament shouldhave givengreater encouragement to the '
Ikty '"' oe made ; but it should be effected on the ordi- introduction of free labour in the West Indies ;he did not •
kti CnoiPles by which trade was generally governed, understand. that the Noble Lord had charged the !
• cone should not, merely for the sake of bolstering up Government with any neglect or want of vigilance as
tles;isteney of some of the members of the Cabinet, to.the introduction of such labour. He conceded that 1
°tile i rom the long-established policy of commerce, not the West Indies were suffering under an accumulation of '
try... j 1 this; but in every other great commercial coun- disadvantages, and that, for the most part, the planters
fieeear, hear.) ' His Hon. Friends behind him were had been losers. He knew estates that, in the year 1840,
'4',4 e"r of placing all duties on sugar on a level with when England was paying what might be called famine I
411) a, our own colonial sugar,- but he (Lord J. Rus- prices for their sugar, left their owners minus to a con- !
1' lat °ald not
duty
quite so far. In a new state of things siderable amount. He did not deny that the position i
tondo no duty had been imposed, it might be safe of the West Indies was one of very great difficulty
8
aght ° ; but, under existing circumstances, he He could only say that the question should be considered
t' N. a differential duty should be made in favour with a view to the interest of the West Indies on the '
ikte,a,(l.lvn colonies. After some explanation as to the one hand, and the circumstances of this country on the
sa, ',3'he had not given earlier notice of the motion, other. He would say that it was not in the power of the
l'tititopes-iaont to make, the Noble Lord laid the following: Legislature of this country to bring the cultivation of
~ toy ae n before the House :—" That, instead of the the colony into a sound state, even if the duty on sugar :
ee9tlQ,:v ,Payable on brown mad Muscavado sugar, the was maintained for twenty years.—(Cheers.) It must
riirteee °J. any foreign country be admitted at a duty of be brought about by the introduction of new labourers,
p. on. shillings per cwt." He believed the Right an altered system of maintaining them, and the substi-
hqstiotientienaan sufficiently possessed the confidence of tution of responsible resident proprietors or tenants for
,4t, a, 'e toenable.him to carry almost any proposition ; absentee proprietors.—(Hear, hear.) That the West
tliN erfetretheeless, he should feel it his duty to take the Indies had a crisis to pass through he had no doubt, and
e'tile be House upon his proposal. Free competition all they-could expect from the British Legislature was
trade .De the rule. Unrestricted competition to aid them as much as they could. That aid they now
Opla i! Lord Grenville stated, was the straight and Proposed to lend them. They proposecrto lay a tax of
illeadfirae of wisdom. The Right Hon. Baronet had 10s. 6d. per cwt. on foreign free-grown sugar,, excluding '
ever tie admitted the truth of this doctrine, and when- sugar from slave countries. That was a duty of 50 per
Mort
raltered our policy, whether we advanced in a pent. on the value of the
.commodity. But if they had
,the y°, a wide step, it should be in this direction. to deal with the West Indies alone, he would not be a
to the proposal of his Right Hon. Friend.. 'After
lelose tianted duties for revenue, why then they should party
lilt, te eln; but as for legislating where to buy and to the changes which took place in other-countries—after
the tariff of 1842, and the other .eliapges which have
(, tee Public themselves were th best judges of that
54'l e
taken place '
carpets alt that if they were to prescribe, in what - thought
teree t, the people should trade, it would inevitably Government would. be... open. to the imputation
0:- I,l° industry and impair the wealth of the coun- of showing -undue favour to a particular class
sa 4. hat remark was not needless; for there had at were they to -put a duty Of 10 per cent. on foreign
terseese been issued papers offering' premiums from sugar, the growth of free labour, as a protection to sugar
li44Ss aus4ally supporting the Government, for' the best grown in the West Indies.—(Hear, hear.) The West
Indite_ had suffered most severely by ihe Act of Emanci-
te6lee enoyerotection for the agricultural interest.—(Tbe
vtlie i;', then read an extract from a speech delivered nation, but that interest was treated with some eonside-
L',4 at di' th of February, 1783, by Lord Shelbitrne! who raiiiirt when it-got a protection equal to 50 per cent. The
,rd re at time a Minister of the'Crewn. That Noble Noble Lord said that they did
,pot_ establish perfect con- •
t 7 pa,, Probated monopoly as being always injurious j- sistency in their legislation on this matter. His answer
1- trad:llting rivalry, which was the greatest - stimulus was that it was better to apply a good principle when it. ,
11:1)1.42 and the most important instrument of human was practic'able, and alsolhat the proposition of the Go-
te'teeeTient. No nation was more bound to oppose vernment woulelstand.in a favourable light as contrasted
more
tly than this country, which stood as it were be- with the proposition •of --the Noble Lord. It was not .
Zt(ts cave old world and the new, and which having onlyeaconsistent in an extreme degree, but. in a manner
op a,Pti.tal, more trade, and more resources, than any incapable.of tolerable explanation, that they should go
teethe i°n• on earth, should meet its rivals on any part to considerable expense in employing, it naval force on
4 gt°l3'', content with fair - competition, and the cdasteerArriba,*bilt even shed blood for the purpose
telleisteec4l„ing more.) Such was the -opinion of of capturing slave-vessels going to the Brazils, and at
t 4 wQ is et_the Crown sixty years ago—(Cheers)— the saine*.:tipie• give a, voluntary stimulous to the slave
it, era) ",ad not advanced much since.—(Renewed trade .by encouraging ahe.growth of slave-grown sugar.
stettN, jhey were creating- a 'new monopoly of is, There a wase•ahereforeaa •great practical difference be-
le the 'lnd, in which' they declared to various nations tween thCineliltraecif the. Government and the proposi-
-4 tell'llse weld, that they would not trade with thel. tion of the. Noble-Lordeas would be tested to-morrow
te ore eeY disapproved of their institutions. It was but by the prieeeor-Brazilian or Cuba sugar, if that proposi-
tieed4l,e since that the proposition of free trade was tion were carried. The Noble Lord had charged them
et %4re
41)Y but a few votes in America. If this coins- with hypocrisy. -- That-.-wase:eue of the worst charges
tae I), ,;° set the example .to other nations•it would that could be made against any men, because
),,M the ullowed.—(llear,. hear.) But whilst we sue- it waseone_ of the worst rces.—(year, hear.) He
pi.,lj,st tee sYstem of protective and prohibitory duties would•-not deny it, because . Free it would not be the ,
ta;',,gtlets Yr excluded the corn and the timber and other less if
.heedeniedie and; if it were not he was sure the
al th of those nations how could we lecture the in country- and posterity -would -do them justice. They
poll ~the
of an enlightened commercial co_uyl-have noTers9nal.-mti.t...i'ves in this matter, and
Ail` 41 ‘'U'ear, hear.) He (Lord J. Russell) had lately their ..VieWs were in accordance with those of Dr. '
Ois, ettter from the Secretar of State for Forel n Lushington, Sir F. Beeeone Mr. Clarkson, and Mr.
lit)t.tl a.? the Minister of ca
German State-, Which co - Stir leg opipions.. were, entitled to so much on
OoNve,eeture upon free trade which could have ve y sideratum on -the. subject. It was-true they woeld.ex-
. tettlte eTht coming from the authority which mai - elude •the-produce of slave labour of every description;
ha'tPt tri%structive dillies here.—(l-lear, hear.) Let s hutahecause.they admitted ather..articles, the produce of
Os 41te Principles for ourselves; and w7hen oth r slave labour, it was practically no reason why they
Ile 444 b °old see that England had taken a wise our e .:.'iliould admit slave-grown sew. Looking to the in-
lv
&t, tam einefitgd by it, they would not be slow to follo teresCrirethe Vest India colonies, the necessities of the
kllk4 Of 1),.e• , If so, we should see men in authorify in- country; and the discouragement
.of the slave trade, he
dudes' Uevising schemes for applying schemes to thought' the measure of the. Government the best that
tiOt Rear more destructive, employing their talents w could be .devised, and he left it with confidence to the
ti'Lle it'im'at so as to make peace more beneficial, and judgment of the House of Commons.—(Cheers.)
Q. Q.L°lle brotherhood all the nations of the world.. -Mr. LABOUCHERE commenced by defending himself
(e.t''', tele ADSTONE would' not imitate the Nob e • and the late Government from the charge of inconsistency
!isesl.)efor wander into topics unconnected with the su - which was brought against .them,- for which he need
't ettoeseee,the Committee. He would not go into t e only refer to the emphatic declaration of the late
Ite'ta' Plain"ron, and wend, and corn. He thought th t 1,. 7Sydenham, who,Tvhen Presidealt of the Beard of
,
tie tees that the Noble Lord was induced -to intr - 41940,;_deelared.lhateither at-or 'before the termination
kLal, es,iie _subjects by the poverty of his objections- o of the treaty with the Brazils, it would be the duty of
is 1 tete of the Chancellor of the Exchequer. T e the House to consider the question of the sugar duties,
N. . la
11) tAry ,' would find that the letter of the Forei foreign and domestic. He` (Mr. Labouchere) adhered
•Peb,,,Ntisa ") the Prussian Ministry Was founded upo to that declaration; when he was. Waited on in Liver-.
tie 70, ec:lts contained in an article in the Edinbur z pool by persons connected with- the West. Indies. And
of Z'Ale eleell was supposed to have the approbation f with regard to the consistency of the present Govern-
-1,4 pave ee °rd himself.' It would be, indeed, a matt r ment, he must say, if he felt any resentment towards
t'ift ;9 tpitiv,sure upon the Government ,if they adher them for the handle theymade of the West India interest
Sear eat ti he Measures whiCh they thOught, under ye to turn out the late Administration, he was amply re-
tgalt the instances, necessary in 1841. -In the latt r venged by.. seeing the Ministers of, this great commercial
41„,,,, which est Indies were going through an exper -' country-in the-face of that country and the whole world
•qtit sheep rendered it imperative that the Gover - compelled to make such a proposition to the House as
tins ttaa.fin take no step to enibarras those cOlonie . they enow made, and to defend it by' such: argu-
\teeNee7e Years had passed since the experime t Ments. as he' had heard.—(Dear, hear.) That it
'''e, Gott and although the difficulties of the coloni was a novel and unprecedented' proposition no person
ite,eattpeeatalt.eoeeether passed over, yet it had -be could deny, and, the arguments used in support of the
i ' thc,.‘iltita 'flat the permanent maintenance of t measure were in perfect harmony with it, for they were
'''ito -ler se-4n the present ' principle' was not necessary totally-novel and unprecedented likewise: The question
,
aye,,tetail
crt. The Right .Hon-Gentleman then wedt was ,one of such vastimportance in every respect that a
eta
•m a (/' the different va,lues of sugars (Muscovad settlement of it was of first-rate consequence. And it
4°Petlel! 'Jayae6nod) in the, West India Islands, in Cuba, was because this measure was fraught with uncertainty
given' was ioenteoding that if the duty on all unrefined and. was rotten- in principle, because it'was not a final
Lams e Qab ue 345. per cent. an advantage would be settlement of the question, that- he -objected to it.
kl 4ara a' whieh produced and -exported as unre- Ire Would Suppose, for the sake of argument, that no
• °l° et teee!nieerior to real Muscovado. ' The-Noble Lord door would •be ••opened te fraud by the measure ; but
1:84)
ktea,;;,l to °taunt the Government with want of admitting that, .he was prepared. to :.maintain that they
1.1.°1), t'd, la4u,r he had himself, in the period between incurred a positive and a certain evil fei the sake of a
:PS, and pri):l-langed his own 'opinious o' n this queS- 'benefit. of a very substantial nature. TOlsegin with the
a the it'd that ''', of sugar had in last year, considerably ,evils which would be inflicted by this. measure,.. the G0a,94144W.
a,94144W. etartse was a good reason for an alteration vernmezt might say that they were right in doing those
'F liaagave a he rise had been nearly 3s. per cwt., and- things for a moral object ; but no man would contend
e‘itirl'e°Dieeeen greater if it had not been'for the pre- that 'it was
,right 'to denounce, by their commercial
11'4 sP:ither,,T. that the law .would be altered this year. policy, such great countries as the Brazils—the West
ql)liae,`ne e„`;:e're, into consideration the increasing de- India Islands, which- were • some of their most valuable
t,: ea,QeteiVitrY to consume those articles which hold castemers.—(Hear, hear.)
evils .person would-say that
Peell „eine/It
wen luxuries and necessaries, he thought the they ought to hazard such except on the most sub-
,le le'ltaata-enld .have been wrong if• they 'had not stantial and positive grounds.—(Hear, hear.)
.In the
15 a' et°°le Lg" of the increase, of price to alter the law. first place it was impossible to deny what the evil com-
I 8 ed„, ord pr t . . •
ta, 41 -of ° ested against the. introduction of a -plained .of by their merchapts who. traded with the
L ,ar,
~ tile. ll)rohibitory and distinctive duties. But Brazils was. It was this, that . they could not procure
4taa.e.4'l, the°tl?l° Lord, in the ease of the. duties upon direct .returns for the goods ' which they exported to
te: tile 'flese e4l Was. necessary to make a distinction Brazils.-(Hear, hear.) To continuo such a state of
pol: N. 51) whakates which encouraged the slave trade things was a great evil ; but it was more—they raised.
a ,at, att`e Lora had nothing to do with slavery. But up,hostile feelings in those countries against them, which
till; 414-itl Raja, ,Was-pleased to be witty' on another must be fraught, with fatal conseqUences. It
-would lead
tee lee'n ire, ',.),_` Right Hon. Friend was introduc- to hostile commercial legislation against them. True, if
.le-,;N1,r,--rs,ntla, the custom-house, erecting Pulpits in these countries consulted reason only they. would not
teliule leereof , and making ' the land-waiters legislate on such absurd grounds ; but men were actuated
IsPori i'' Wealtlti' slavery doctrines.. Perhaps the by resentment as much as by reason, and they would
trt,-„'ter,(into th' aaeY, that theyeshould. not introduce feel that an affront was put upon them by this country,-
Ist,„;a the ter-,pate
n sniPs of War, and ereet
preachers;-ulis upon and their legislation would be directed accordingly.
it )31,144411\i obiolnl_ ake their captains bit in Nay more, he really believed that this principle of non-
-41,1, .etty ors of urd had made our captains of men-of- interference with these countries. would arm the feelings
teiea
~saffeet
‘aanti-slavery doctrines, and preachers to of those countriestagainststhem everal day more and
that vv-4 4 11r‘ . the slavers in their passage between more, to prevent the effects of that influence which he
btaft43 in aeil, The le' °llk eon, 'he policy of the present Govern- hoped this country would exercise everywhere in behalf
hu to 4 r3r, fora 'enance with that steadily,pursued in of the negroes, which would be a source of greater
tht:l4l 411,-)P!,y fi,evdery
•ong time past. It was impossi- calamity to them than this paltry measure of excluding
4t,,Sate 41- s. ,„, rules to the varyin character of_ slave-grown sugar would do them any good. He agreed
1.4"1tY tr Jav-La" Noble Lord began by alluding to with the Right Hon. Gentleman who had just sat,down,
-te,ll:aed bat the ' and objected that there could be no that they must guard themselves against overrating the
Ivlli``' th .7 slave Pr,°duce of that island would not be value of the change of duty, for that
.no great influx of
ease ch - at the auour. But he (Nir. Glad lone) be- 'forein-it sugar could be expected. illsstateinent was as-
IlalWhelleeuld reenlyaba,s a sate of society ,in Ja.va low as 207000 tons. Everything of this sort was ma
-Its f teved r the 'e him to ascertain with ' doubt vti,ue ; and he (Mr- Lahouchere) would be inclined
and
.ree, that „,,, Produce was slave-grown or not.. .to put it highr. But it was important when they came to.
ar`Lt.it wenat rent
+v was made out that laZour in Java, considerahis question, to find how far the measure of the_
Itea;attit;;Paid a: ','as paid in proportion to the produce, .Government would
.tend to .discourage sugar the'produce
ass', th taboo " -has
rat
1.4 to: state
,)ri, so fareaof a certain number of. dayl,-,of slave labour. In his opinion that, discourege-nent would
qa i Pelle,. thin . 3 regarded .the occupatiori, , amount to a shade, or rather the shadov la shade.
Itally thea, 4 to heir In Java was this, that, no man' The Right Hon. ,or
admitted that-o . the free-
the the 1 the stags hour, -.
a .. lands against his rani- but if' lit'l labour 'stoma. produced in the East wee less than. 20,000
believeda h eOf th- L'e4 cultivate6 '
e wan lags i ita Such was' univer 1 lons. If that came to England, the _s. urphis would be
Geld Ind' he, -a. free t n Java, and if a party cultivate_ sxported to Germany and other countries, and the Ice.
Qrert,.!hl a4ver, that quit it when he pleased. lii lof free-labour sugar in London and Liverpool, wouh be
I.lreshlt ista,tieeser the Geo, it
.a was the duty of those who : governed by its price in those countries. The
.Right
ays,,P:, that tr the ia'"nment to have a certain nom • i Hon: Gentleman admitted that thig was- true in the'
,:tii, lit that ;ere wagnd ;he ought, however, to say, main ; but then he said there would still be a shade 'of,
~ilauld
not
heltrs)lllvory
waasdnorno estic species .of slavery in ailvantftge in favour of free-labout sugar. .Airalait really,
s-ta 11 s'e th ''`) far w upon the point of death. fra shade of advaatage Allot alley; were .15repared ,tca
wilt
13,e e diencul .as regarded this country, h ' incur eo 'Many evils ?—(Hear, hear.) He ehOught etven
'ill tlie'tl th'ls adverted ki,lloAjliord had raise 4 a shade was too strong an expression. He believed that
- 0104- w ibis . 'I;
the trade between that a ton of Manilla sugar and a ton of Cuba sugar would,
tell seT.ed on not with merchants, but after this Bill had passed, be found very nearly of the
" and they had therefore but - same value. The consequence would be, that the moment