The Sun.
London, England, 1819-12-22 00:00:00

ROYAL BURGH' OF SCOTLAND.

Lord A. flamtvros: then rose to malse his mo-
tion relative to the Scotch Burghs. He regretted
the absence of a Noble Lord intimately acquainted
Ivith the subject, but he did not _regret it as much
11 he othersvise should have reason to do, as he
briderrood that Ministers did not mean to offer
1411 Y opposition to his motion. lie did not intend
Io make. any alteration in the Committee, but
wished it to-remain as it 'was constituted last
?ear, except with regard- to one individual, who
tad slated that he could not attend. The Noble
'Lord then proceeded to say,- that the result of the
Inquiry of 'last Session had been such as to con-
6rus the statements which had been made of the
t:ross and 'flagitious abuses which occurred in the
Burghs of Scotlan&-,-the principle of self-
tiection which prevailed in those Burghs was the
treat source of the evil. The Noble Lord then
; *,intlicated himself' from the charge of seeking for
4:ttliamentary Reform by the inquiry proposed.
41e said, if any change in the Representation were
In follow from it, it must be‘collaterally, and not
directly. He staled, that three of the most pot.
'Mous towns in Scotland, namely—Edinburgh,
Aberdeen. and Inverness—were in Ft ,state of
4ankruptcy, and outlet- sentence of disfranchise-
-11'"Il• He concluded by moving for the re-ap-
?ointment of a Select Committee, to take into
"nsideration the several petitions which bad been
Presented to the House last Session, on the sub-
tet of the Royal Burghs, and to report to the
loese t het eupon.
DUNDAS denied that the towns specified.hy
Ole Noble Lord were in a state of bankruptcy,‘lsnd
"ntended against the probability of his being able
!rt prove the extent of his charges relative to abuses
'1) the Royal Burghs.
Lord CASTLRREAGII said, that as there was no
Alifferenee of opinioo regarding the appointment
44, f the .Committee, he hoped no difficulties would
be started ; and be assured the Noble Lord that
;Here was on his side of the House every disposi-
'lon to assist -in theingoiry.
Mr. J. P. ,GRANT ,roc amidst ies of question,
.1;;Id said that the Hon. Gentleman opposite (Mr,
41„ %Indus) had, by his own account, provesl that he
•.11s got into a place where he ought not to be.
Mr. FOTtBES argued to spew that Abet deen was
!)°t in a bankrupt state. He said that it was pay-
14g 4 per cent. on all its debts ; that it gave good
security for what it now owed, anti that the ere•
Aitors would be very much disappointed if they
Were to he paid off.—(Much laughter.)—The
??on.
Member then read an extract of a rep,irt
r°lll a manufacturer and Magistrate to the Board
°f Directors, in confirmation of his statements as
to the flourishing s:ate of the trade and maaufac-
lures of the town of Abet deen.

Lord A. HAMILTON Said, 'that it bad been star-
ad to the House that the inquiries entered into
the Committee of last Session had cost the
`louse 20001.; be wished to state that the ex-
Pence amounied to but half that stint.
the motion was then put and carried.
CHELSEA PENSIONERS.
Lord NUGENT rose to• move, pursuant to his
"tice, for a Return of Alen liable to be struck uti

,• • - • • • -• • .
the Chelsea 'Pension :41St, by the -2rociamation of
rile 28th of October, 1819, distinguishing those.
who bad enlisted for seven yea'rs, utote`r the 46th
of the King, and who, when the lime Of their ser-
vice expired, became 'entitled tinder that Act to a
pension, in consideration of their wounds. The
Noble Lord said, th;at his object in moving for
Om's,- papers was, to move hit- leave to brit'eg in a
Bill t., extend the provisionS of the Act of the
46th of the King to the Chelsea PenSionerS, who
having been entitled to pensions, i'vere,itrider the
proclamation, to be.deprived of them. The pro-
clamatiOn said, that if those persons did not coin-
ply With its direction, they would be deprived of
their pensions ; but he could we see by what right
pe'rsons who had get ved the full period of time for
Which they enlisted, should be deprived of their
,pensions. If a soldier, who entered the service for
a limited time, should leave the service at its ex-
piration, could he be treated as a deserter ? cer-
tainly not ; and the case was prteiiely the same
With the soldier who claimed his pension under the
Act of the 46th of the King. He entered for a
particular period, under the faith that when that
time expired he might leave the service, and if he
received a ,youtul, that he would be entitled to a
pension. The Ac' was plain,, anti the regulations
founded On it could not admit of a different con-
struction. The Noble Lord said, that not only the
Act, but the speeches made WI all sides of the
litms, when the Bill was pending before them,
gave it that constrtiction. The Noble Lord (Cas-
tlereagh) and t' ,e Bight Gentteman,;he
silent of the Board of Con.rol, gave the 13:11 the
same coAstruction ; they opposed the Bill, oo the
ground that it would deprive the Crown of the
power to takeaway pension Sal pleasure, and tended
to make soldiers independent of the Crown. Mr.
Windham at time argued strongly that the faith
of P,irliament was tile foundation of the service, end
then once piolged that it ought to be kept lurid).
late. Lithe Act bete was not a word to give power
to the Cro,n to withdraw the pensions in case of
the pensioner not. attending On fresh service, ex-
cepting.those pensioners who had enlisted for life,
or for a term of years which Elan not expired.
The Noble Lord said, it was not necessary for
him to enlarge on time sacred duty of keeping in-
violate the public faith with soldiers ; it was a
profession with which the point of honour should
he most especially obsersvd, and with respect to
which a departure from the principle of good
faith might be attended with the most latal con-
sequences.—Tice wounded soldier had a high claim
on the tenderness and gratitude of his country.
He hoped the Noble Lord would not oppose the
too ion-.-=-01, it he did so, that he was right in
doing SO tinder the .law and the military regula-
tions, as well as by the debates which .took place
when the law was passed.
Lord l'aLmaksTost said, he had no hesitation
to say, that the late orders which had been issoed
wet e' borne out by the military regulations. The
Bill of Mr, Windham gavt certain pensions, sob-
ittt, however, to the subsequent regulations of
the Crown. The soldier, subject to those regu-
lations, bad a legal right to his pension, but not
an indefeasible right. The third section was the
one on which the question turned ; that section
stated, that every soldier should be entitled to
his discharge at the expireizion of his service,
subject to the regulations of Majesty, leaving
the King the power to fix the time, and the
nature of the wounds which would entitle an
individual to a pension. Before the Act no
man could receive his pension, vvbatetree
might be his claims, unless lie produced the
recommendation of his Commanding Officer. The
object of Mr. Windhant's Act was to do away
the necessity of that recommendation, and to
make the claim of the soldier sufficient, inde-
pendent of the recommendation of his C.,mmande
lug Officer. It remained to the Crown to de-
cide what period of service might entitle the sol-
dier to his pension, what rate of pension be
should receive, and on what terms the pension
should be held. 'r be authority of Mr. Windhatn
went to prove that the. Bill did not intend to give
to the soldier an indefeasible right to his pension.
The regulations which were drawn up in the Octo-
ber following, by Gen. Fitzpatrick, did not put it
in that point of -view. Li ere the Noble Lord
entered at some length into the military regu-
lations, front which lie argued!, that the pen-
sioner was bound to serve the full three periods,
amounting to twenty-one years ; at d thA it was
clear, if lie refused to serve when called on, he
forfeited his pension. Such, he said, was the
clear meaning of the military 'regniatityn3. It
was, lie said, peeposteroos to suppose, that able
men in the prime of life, receiving pensions,
should not be liabie to serve their country when
called" on ; end as for those who received pen-
sions on the ground of services, they bad no
claim on the gratitude of the country ; with
respect to them, it was a case of bargain
and sale. There were 75,000 out-pensioners,
many of whom were not fit for service, but many
of them were ; and it was too monstrous to be
maintained, thlt they who were supported by the.
resources of the :ornery should not be liable to
service. tie said that similar Proclamations were
wade in 18)9 and 1813, and no -notice was taken
of them. He
.was sorry that the question was
then raised by the Noble Lord, because at
present there was enough to agitate the public
mind.

[Here a Message from-the Lords %vas announced.
The Message .informed the House, that their Lord-
ships had agreed to the amendments mdde by the
Commons to the Misdemeanours Bill, and to the
COtron Factory Bill, and had passed the Seditious
Meetings Bill with certain amendments ; to which
they desired the concurrence of the House.]
'flue Message having been read, the debate was
resumed.

Lord ALTHORP contended, that the Crown had
no right to call on a man to serve, or to give up
his pension, who had completed the period, whe-
the' of seven, foutteen, or t‘venty.one years, for
which he had enlisted. But even were there any
doubt on the subject, lie maintained that that
doubt ought to be interprt•eted in favour of the
soldier.

Mr. C. LoNG argued at considerable length in
support of the opinions of his Noble Friend (Lord
Palute►ston), and opposed the n►o;ion, as calcu-
lated to make an injurious impression on the pub-
lic mind.

nr. J. P. GRANT adverted to tite Act and the
regulations Int:tutted thereon, and maintained that
the words " ‘COmpleted their period of service "
referred, not to the completiOn of thea,three lnll
pe'riods of service, hut merel.y to the contpletitil,
Of the period of service, whether of Sei,en; of
fourteen, or of twenty-one yers, for whieli the
soldier had enlisted.

Nit. CALCRAFT WaS very much inclined tc t)e
of the same opinion, althong,h he admitted that
he entertained greater doubts wish respect 16
the precise meaning of the ‘vords of the Act,,
than when he came down if; the Fionse, and be
Much regrerlcd that tiwy were not more intel-
lible.—The Motion was then negatived wiihOnt
. , ,