The Sun.
London, England, 1845-04-04 00:00:00

RAILWAYS.

The NOME EARL at the same time laid upon the
table of the House, by command of her Majesty, maps
relating to the proposed railway communications with
the northern districts of Ireland and Scotland, the re.
ports of the Board of Trade upon the scheme for supply-
ing Leeds and the West Riding of Yorkshire with rail-
way communications, upon the Portsmouth and South
Wales schemes, and upon the London and York and
South Wales projects.
The Duke of RICHMOND trusted that as the Court
of Quarter Sessions would be held next week the Railway
Clauses Consolidation Bill would not be pressed through
the House till the., following week. There were other
partieswit h interested in this Bill besides those connected
railways, and he hoped there would be no objection
DALII ITSIE had
to thee Earlcours of
fproposed.
Tho
these Bills more rapidly than was consistent to admit of
proper attention being paid to them
,nobudte,siraet
theto same
mpress
oiattmeuasetalbeeartsonsfetnahbeis rßeidlltharaata,
checkingto a
certain extent,
be thef or e P progressar li a •
tt
hi e ep, pof the numerous measures likelyto com
ment, connected with railway legislation.
BASTARDY BILL.
Lord STANLEY said—the fact of the quarter
sessions coming on next week iialuced him to hope
etitat
their Lordships would now sanction the second
reading
of another measure. It was a Bill for amending the
existing law of bastardy, for which no day had yet been
fixed for the second reading. The Bill would not,
to any extent, alter the spirit of the present
law, but it was introduced into Parliament for the pur-
pose of removing certain technical difficulties which
pedid the operation of the Act of last year.
After a few words from Lord CA3IPBELL and the
Duke of lticnmoND the Bill was read a second time,
and ordered to be committed to-morrow.

THE OREGON TERRITORY.

Lord CLARENI)ON gave notice that he would to-
morrow call attention to the question of the Oregon ter-
ritory.—Their Lordships then adjourned.

HOUSE OF COMMONS, April 3.
The SPEAKER took the Chair at Four o'clock.
MEDICAL REFORM.

Mr. MANGLES presented a petition from the whole
of the medical practitioners of Surrey against Sir James
Graham's Medical Reform Bill.
BIRKENHEAD DOCKS.

On the motion of Mr. TATTON EGERTON, the Bir-
kenhead Docks' Bill was read a third time and pa.sed.
EASTERN UNION RAILWAY EXTENSION.
Captain FITZMORRIS presented a petition from a
private individual against the Eastern Union Extension
Rail way.
Lord RENDLESIIAM presented a petition from Man-
chester against the Manchester and Salford Waterwoi ks
Bill.

The report of the Committee on the Birmingham and
StaffordAire Gas Bill was referred back to the Com-
mittee.

On the motion of Mr. SPOON ER, the report of the
Committee on the Thames Navigation Bill was further
considered, and read a second time.
MAYNOOTII.
Mr. DIVETT presented a petition from Exeter against
the increased grant to the Roman Catholic College of
Maynooth.

Sir
G. SMYTH presented numerous petitions from
parishes in the county of Essex also against the graut.
Mr. PLUMPTRE presented a great number of peti-
tions to the same effect from parishes in Kent, Bucking-
ham, Berkshire, York, and other counties.
THE BOA RD OF TRA DE—CROYDON RAILWAY.
Mr. DODD rose to move. according to notice, that
the report of the Board of Trade against the Bill in-
tended to be brought in by the Croydon Railway Com-
pany, to authorise the construction of a railway to A.h•
ford, be referred back to the Board of Trade for recon-
sideration.

The SPEAKER said, that before the Hon. Gentleman 1,
proceeded with his motion, the House should decide
whether that motion could come on during the
time of private business. This was the first
case of the kind that had occurred, and it was his (the
Speaker's) opinion, that the motion involved a question
as to the conduct of the Board of Trade in the discharze
of a public duty. He, therefore, thought that it should
be brought on at the time of public business.
Mr. HAWES trusted that the House would take this
matter into its serious consideration. With great
deferenre to the opinions advanced by the Speaker, be
(Mr. Hawes) conceived that., if they were acted upon, it
' would be imposing a very great restriction on the pro-
gress of private BiTh,. The repolt3 which the Beard of
Trade i-aa.tie, he understood, 7.-rn.-3 only for the information
of the House, and he should wish to know how these indi-
viduals could proceed with this Bill if they were not allowed
to question the accuracy and value of the Board which had
decided against them. If this opinion were acted upon
it was perfectly clear it would stop the further progress
of this Bill. He thought it would be i❑ his power
to show tint the decisions of the Board of Trade
were not entitled to the confidence of the House, and
under these circumstances he thought it better for the
House now to decide whether the Board of Trade should
thus he allowed efficiently to arrest the progress of pri-
vate Bills.

Lord G. SOMERSET, without entering into the
question of the principle sought to be established by the
lion. Member for Lambeth, certainly thought that this
was a most improper time for bringing the subject before
the notice of the House. It was quite true that if the
Hon. Member could get the House to support the
opinions lie had advanced it would be most desirable
that the question should be at once settled. But the
House should remember that the reports of the Board of
Trade were-nothing more than an opinion given upon cer-
tain schemes by a number of gentlemen ; and whether
these schemes were reported against or not, it was at the
option of the supporters to proceed with those schemes.
lle trusted that the matter would be allowed to go on in
the proper order, and that, therefore, the Hon. Member
would not proceed with his motion now. _ .

Lord HOWICK said that the House was placed in a
most anomalous position with regard to the Board of
Trade. lion. Members might recollect that during the la st
session it was decided that the reports made by the Board
of Trade should be referred to the Committees on the Bills
to which those reports had reference. But in this session
they had gone somewhat further. On the 4th of March
it 'was decided that when railway Bills and projects had
been reported on. these reports should be referred
to the single Committee, and under this re-
solution the Bill to which the Ilonourable
Member alluded, and the report upon that Bill
would go before the Committee appointed to examine
into the group of schemes of which that Bill formed a
portion ; and the Committee, therefore, in dealing with
the whole subject, would reject or approve in a great mea-
sure upon the report of the Board of Trade. He begged
to remind the House that the resolution by which these
schemes were referred to single Committees, was moved
by the Noble Lord (Lord Granville Somerset) and
agreed to by the House at the time of private business.
He thought it a great injustice to refuse a hearing to this
motion at the present time, for if the Hon. Member were
not allowed to bring it forward now, he might not be
enabled to do so for a very considerable time. In the
meantime, however, the private Committee might be
appointed ; it might proceed to the consideration of this
Bill, and to the report of the Board of Trade, which this
petition complained of. They ought, therefore, to be
given an opportunity of stating their ground of complaint
before the Committee was appointed. It would be folly
to refer the report back to the Board of Trade, because,
as the Noble Lord himseif admitted they had not time
even now to get through their own proper business.
Sir GEORGE CLERK said it was not his intention
to follow the Noble Lord in the course of reasoning he
had adopted. The question simply was, whether this matter
ought to be brought forward at the time of public business.
He would not go into the details ; but he should say
that the uniform practice of the House was, that railway
matters should be disposed of with the private business.
But this question did not fall within that rule. As it
touched the character of a public board, he did not
conceive that it should be heard with the private business.
Mr. LABOUCHERE confessed that he was inclined
to take the view of the Right Honourable Baronet
opposite, in preference to the opinion of the
Honourable Gentleman who sat beside him. He could
not help thinking that this resolution differed in
its nature from any that he recollected, and was sure
that it would take the House, some considerable time to
discuss it. It could not be considered or disposed of as
the private business of the House, as it effected the con-
duct of a public board, and would open the door to other
and perhaps more serious petitions. If it were true that
the Board of Trade had hastily and negligently
reported on this Bill, he thought that a discus-
sion on the matter in this House in this mode
would be perfectly unsatisfaCtory. He was of
opinion that the House would do well to adhere to those
rules which they had hitherto observed, and wished that
the House would dismiss the Bill.

Mr. DUNCOMBE did not coincide with the reasons
offered by the Hon. Gentleman who had just sat down,
for resisting the Bill. His complaint was that more peti-
tions could be presented to the House against the reports
of the Board of Trade ; but if there were petitions of
that description presented, it was the duty-of that House
to hear them, and it was right that they should be heard.
In fact the discussions upon this question had been the
cause of creating very great dissatisfaction in the public
mind against this department of the Board of Trade—
(" Hear, hear," from Colonel Sibthorp)—and that dis-
satisfaction would continue to increase if this inquiry
should not be gone into.—(Hear, bear.) But
the Right Honourable Gentleman opposite said,
"let the Committee decide upon this question ;" but
surely the Committee had quite enough to do already,
without imposing this additional duty upon them--
(Hear, hear)—but if it should be referred to them, see
the loss of time that would follow : there would be
counsel on the one hand, and counsel on the other,
and in fact there would he no end of the labour they
would have to perform.—(Hear, hear.) Then,
with regard to what had been said about not
allowing matters of this sort to interfere with
private business, surely the Right Hon. Gentleman
should recollect that their petitions had been allowed to
be presented and printed during private business ; and
therefore the time for bringing the subject forward
was the time during which private business was before
the House, in order to hear all just complaints and do
justice to those who had charges to make against the
public department of the Board of Trade.—(Hear.) If
those complaints were not to be brought forward now,
he would like to know when they would ?—at the close
of the session?—up stairs, when all the falsehoods put
forward on one side should have been heard 2—(Hear,
hear.) He would say that there were very grave and
serious accusations made against the railway depart.
ment of the Board of Trade, and he was aware that
they could be suppi:rted, and when they were heard it
would be found that very great injury had been done to
many persons connected with railroads ; and therefore
he did think that the proper time to hear those parties
was during the private business. On those grounds, he
begged to move that the Hon. Member for Maidstone be
now heard.—(Hear, hear.)
Mr. GISBORNE conceived that Hon. Gentlemen
opposite had got themselves into a great mess by the
manner in which they had conducted this proceeding.—
(Hear.) The present was only one of a great many cases
of this kind, and they were all owing to parties
having a duty entrusted to theta which they were in-
competent to deal with.—(Flear.) By referring these
complaints to a Select Committee who had already 23
independent railways to deal with, it would
be found that this addition to their labours could
not be satisractorily dolt with by them. His opi-
nion was that the case ought to be heard. The
Hon. Gentleman ought to be allowed to make his state-
ment, and should the report of the Board of Trade
afterwards prove unworthy of further notice, it would
be the duty of the House at once to cancel it.

Colonel-SIBTHORP would defy any body of gentle-
men, no matter however diligent they might be, to
come to a correct decision within six months of a vast
number of railway schemes, and he should, therefore,
support the motion of the Hon. Member for Finsbury.
Sir G. GREY said that he could not altogether coin-
cide in the opinion of the Iron. Member for Maidstone
(Mr. Dodd), and the position which he had taken.
Whatevtr might be the error committed by the Board of
Trade in their tactics, he believed their opinions to be
honestly adopted. Whatever decision the House
might come to on the case of the present petition, he
trusted that the object of the petitioners would not be
prejudiced thereby. It could hardly be expected the Board
could come to any sufficiently considered decision within
a month or six weeks. At the same time he must say
that the decision of the Board of Trade was not the de-
cision of the Ilouse of Commons, and he thought that
that decision, whether it militated against or was in
favour of any particular scheme, ought not to prevent
any discussion upon it when it came before a COMlnit.