The Sun.
London, England, 1819-05-08 00:00:00

EtEcToits' OATH 131 LI.;

Wr. WILLIAMs rose to, m the second read-
ing of the Electors' Oath Bill, After every con-
sideration that ire had ken enabled-to give the
measure, he telt assured that his Bill Brent neither
to alter the mode by which Members were seated
in that House, to impair the rights of individuals,
nor to disturb any species of property. Its object
was solely, to make that illegal which was ac-
knowledged to be prima facie fraudulent, and to
extend to boroughs the same principle which" was
so salutary in the election of Representatives for
counties. It demanded that a legal consideration
should have been paid, and that the party
voting should have actually the freehold in
his possession. The fraudulent practice of split-
ting freeholds first took place in the reign of
Charles the Second, at the period ot, the Po-
psi' Plot, When the Presbyterians, inflamed with
deadly animosities against the Papiltsilotrodoced,
for political purposes, that practice. But its in-
troduction was considered by the highest autho-
rities of that day as illegal and unconstituujonal ;,
.and on a cause tried at Kings,am before the Lord.
Chief .I.ustice Pemberton, that Learned Judge de-
clared it to be a- practice contrary to the.princi-
pies of the common law, and subversive of the
purity and dignity of Parliamemmt. Ira-. the reign
•of James the 2d the practice was renewed, as a
Means to enable that Monarch to'effect his favou-
rite object of restoring Viipety.:. Thus it was that
the Iwo parties, with objects so, opposite, had re-,
course to the same fraud to accomplish their -re-
spective ends. The evil ,had so much noireesed,
that in one coonty, on' the eve of an election:
500 fictitious and fraudulent freeholders were!
made. The Act .of Antic elecekrd its progress,
and since the passing of the IDth of Gorge the
'41,. lie believed there was no instance ut any of
these occasions! and fraudulent votes being al
lowed at elections for coanties: Why, then,
should such a practice be tolerated for lioroughs ?
On Is hat principle could a distinction be made %
And yet no man Could deny that the practice ex-
isted in these places to a considerable extent.—
It might he said in answer, that it was open to
tire party complaining to prOve such votes fraudu-
lent before a Select Committee of that House.—
The Hon. Member theta proceeded to state cit-
comslances within his. own knowledge some years
ago, to prove that such,a mode of redress was
inefficient. With the greatest respect for the
House of Commons, the guardians of the liberty
of the people, he inust say that Election Com-
Mittees frequently came to a decision not conso-
nant to the law of the laud,. Was he wrong in
trying to get rid of such practices ? Was he
wrong in trying to establish as a principle, that
all ectm voted at rlect'ions shoohf have boon fide
votes ? The remedy which he Oroposed- was not
new. There was some approach to it in the
reign ot Anne, and there were two Acts of. Geo.
2d, which got rid of the evil as far as counties,
and towns which were counties in themselves;
were coocerped. His object was to extend the
operation of-those Acts to every borough in tire
lingdoin. Who would-Say that such a proposi-
slot) was adverse to the Cou?titutioti, or to the
principles of,law ? He knew that there were per-
, sons who, thonght that there was something
pe-
culiar in what were called burgage tenures, which
ought to exempt them from time operation of his
He really could not understand why• they
should be so, exempted. Why should Members of
Parliament he returned in any plaCe by illegal
means ? Let the Legislature, however, expressly.
declare that,and he should he Satisfied. For hien-
self, he thought those but-gage tenures the greatest
bit:wish in the Constitution, and subversive of
time rights of the people. It could not he expect-
ed, therefore, that with such an opiniou he
should introduce the exemption io thei Bill, but
it the Bill were allowed to go into a Committee,
and the sense of the Committee should appear' to
he in favoUr of taking the burgage tenures out of
the ooeratian of the trill, he kVOliii! not Oppose
Tu «.! oath that he proposed n'aS not a upv
one.. y the 25th of th.e King, an oath was pre-
scribed. of which that which he now proposed
was only an alteration. All that Ire trained was,
that the' oath should state distinctly in virtue of
whist right the individual taking it was abotri• to
vote. --At tire pre4nt poi-tient, when the public
nriod was so much agitated on the question of
Parliamentary Reform, he entreated the House to _
consider what a support and-what a, handle they
wOuld give, by, the rejection of such a measure, to
those who, under the pretence of Reform, wished
to overturn theCenratitution. _
Mr.D,GILBERT complimented the Hon. Member
on the bold and manly *manner in which he had
treated the subject, and which rendered it, on the
first view of the question, difficult to see what
objections there could be to the adoption of the
Bill. With respect to comities, the objei.t of the
Float. Gentleman had been long attained. There
vesre• some other parts of the Bill, to which he
(Mr. D. Gilbert )..had no objection ; but in at-
tack!ng the burgage [comes, he was endeavouring
to annihilate one of the most valuable parts of the
Constitution, and one which was indispeosihle to
its existence. lie (Mr. Gilhert) had always Coo,-
teoded, and always should contend, that time
House of CoMmons was an assembly, ,not
Bide--
gated by but virtually representing the people.—
It contained width' its walls advocates and de-
tenders of every class of the commtmity ; and it
was impossible that it could systematically act
against the interests of the people; but it was one
of its great merits that it was not a direct delege-
:tion front the people. It never was.So ; it never
ought to he so. If it were so, it could, never,
without ihe interference of nAlitary force, co-exist
with time other 6ranches of the State. Of that
fact he was as firmly convinced as of-any his ima-
gination could conceive. This had beefs evitmeed
in France, where an assemblage so deleeated
speedily overturned the Monarchy. Under. our
esent Constitot ion the country had long flotirish-
ed. If he understood from the Hon. Gentleman
that.he.would except the burgage tenures from
the operation of the Bill in the. Committee, he
(Mr,.Gillkert) as a matter of courtesy, would not
t, oppose the second reading, although he had otter

• . '
obitetions 16 the ineaenre ; Lot ;rthe. lion• fiflew,
tleman would not give Stich a pledge, he fOr lithe
self bound to take the sense of the 11,,n50 06
motion for the beco nil reading of the Bill. fit
Mr. WILLIAMS, itt'explauation repeateti ""be
he had before stated, namely, that, tl" 'ng 35 'd
to
xveC
did of bttrgage :enures, it coati no
tbai hi should himself exempt. ti3lko fro the 67,;
ratinti of the Bill, but that, if In WCOnonittee (14
sense of the Mouse should be averse to Hot 11,e
of the Bill, they rnight deal with as they thoog
proper.
Mr. BRAND maintainer!, that the systenl
Nomination was one of the greatest blots 0" ;
'Constitution. He .thought ; the liononr8;11t
Mover's proposition perfectly fair. Let the Ir,
go into a. Ci.miuitt,e,,and then let the floc' o.
'able Member for Bodinin propose to take the
mioation Boroughs out Of the operation of
Bill. Besides, it should be .considercd, that ag•.
provisions of the Bill were applicable 'to other .0
script ions. of franchise besides burgage tenures,:o
the correction of the irregularities atreod."t
which .he supposed the Honourable 60)Ae3F-jr,
opposite bad no Objection. It was, ii! lttLopt•
nion, the duty of the Muse. to go into a
mitiee ►
on the 13'01 as a declaration ot getterall'i?e:
and it would then be fOr. the Honourable.Gentiiii
man to point out what lie thought ought In be

exceptions. hv nd
Mr. COURTENAY contended, that it was for
means, clear that some of the defects existed
which the Bill professed to futuish a reine"rof
It was adubtfidto , him whether the sYstell'irlsr
occasionality was not at present provided ag'it-to
by law. TheHotionrable :Gentknoll; wi4le(,;/ a
provide, that no one should vote in .virW
en
freehold, unless lie could prove that he loa "ehe
iti possession of it for a certain time. l'''`.l.fire
apprehended, was already the h ; and
that on that subject the Bill' was unnecessary
re'
The question came to this.--,was the Lin4se l'„ge
pared to make that the law respecting' 1)44,0
tenures(, which syls3 the law respecting C0111'N;' 01;
and towns being counties in ihemselves
being so prepared, he.objected to the 13'11.4 il)e
gether ; for if any alteration were requisite
oaths, that might be made the subject se,P4a
rate measure.. On those gronnds lie motet!
Amendment; that the Bill be read a secood

that day six months. the
Mr. Serjeant ONsLow maintained, tb't
Hon. Mover of the Amendment had been l'ic();:a
sistent with himself, having first argued 041' Irs
Bill wits unnecessary, and then admitted that P°„'..
of it might be made the Subjectof a serrioe
11, a 0
sure. He (Mr. Ouslow) supported the $
the ground that it only called on the voters
give certain criteria, in order to afford the ale
of ascertaining whether or not the general
ciple of the. law against 'occasiooality bad b-
violated. . , ft
Mr. COURTENAY explained ; and atter ho
words from a Merober, whose name could out.'
learned-, the House divided--

For the Amendment ................ 19-7
4!1
4gaisist it -
Majority against the Bill
NEW rosT OFFICE.

oire(l

The CHANCELLOR of (he Excneeto-flt t"."
the Ordei of the Day for the HOuse zesolvi'rg
self into a Committee Of Slipply. of
Mr.- R. GORnoti observed, that the sug'i3'oi
2:38,0901. had already been expended in (leafc-;
a site for the New Post Office. lie was 3:it
that one•third of thiS $11(11 was to be -rep.
the City ; but to talk of its being renaitl 1-));;Ictt
c 'ity was a mere farce, as (he only WtO.
they colld repay it was (rout the Ditties °°
tend Wine, As to that part of the whici
a )
late' 10 the erecting of the building itself' he 'co.
des:rons that it should, be such as ,ivookl if' ,111,4
nonn to the metropolis. The Cotmnittee t' Nest
subject a few years ago had decided that 1;
way would be to obtain a competition or, Ful:el:
ftom various architects ; but thoogh it 113:
posiitively prOtitked bY the Chancellor of 11';"
elieT'ter, that there should be no jobbilig'',
matter, yet hitherto (here had not, as ht'
stood, been any 'competition of plans. V"i trilf
should propose was, that phns should be "r",„0-
exhibited at S,,mt-rset House, or any other„ctill°
veoient place. so that the opinion of the
might he taken upon them. bee",
Mr. LUSHINGT ,ON said, that there 114-
,no-johbiug in this case. He admitted that l'e
promised there should be a competition of
tects, But the business had not yet plmee-
„,,eo
ls
so far, andcoUld not till the interior arra9ges-diete
were. completed. As to these arrangements,' p. 14
were many individuals to be consulted, cable" •
occasioned the loss of time.' lot/
Mr. Alderman IVOOI3, said, the City of 1-'°,11,:t1)0
was clear 12,009/. a year out of 'locket t 0;,
trectioti of the new Post* Office, and the 9""
pence woold continue till it was concluded. -I, it,
'Sir J. Newpows,..wisiied to' know whetiroaltl
was intended by the Treasury that there
be a competition of plans? Alta 101;1
MH r. LUSINGTON said, the Treasury woul s ,(1001..
cart to take,the best plan, and that there.
he a competitsion. 001:
Mr. LONG lidiculettthe idea of taking ta"; po
opinion on an exhibition of plans; and ashe6•o
it would be possible to,,colleet the pub )Ilic 01 ,0
e
in that way ? %vetMr. croanoN said, if all the different plo 'o'.
exhibited to the public, it might pit:vent 'III
proper pldu from btilig selected,
.AII..MY ESTIMATES. 4e
ffc'tj:„
On the motion of Lord PAL:stzusToN, e to
then resolved into tl,e COmtnittee of St,iPP-;t
which the Army Estimates were refeiroli, ;„g to
Lord P;Lmstts'ro's then said,' that in "s""Ptbe
move llerhutions for voting
,the sums on
pt
Army Estimates, he did not think it "eCe55BCOlO'
encroach at any : on the time of the ~tee
length.niO' tn.
mittee, as the Report of thelFinance Co: so
W 4
relative to ilie Army WaS so Nil, and s°)
much into detail, that it left little for bins ?)gold.
on the subject. As to that Report, De sd
op
only say, (hat he was sure the Howe %volt', o,esC.
cur %s hit him in thinking that it did the g'ople'
credit to the industry And ability of the ill pos4
Lord who had been in the Chair. I,e tetlie
confine hirnself to a short comparative s" a 5
of the reduetions'on the Estimat CS of this ye otis
compared with those of the last. II) or`'i"

bow
of) t"6

etl w"1
ig as tic
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e t'l"
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qentic:
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sing ht;
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to 981
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id Co;
eale9
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11Pc't
iteire;§
is)g

f Par"n, nut of account the num •
troop'sTh°:; in India aad France,-there was a :nun-
this Year to the amount of 10,000 men.—
Ott" comparison of the total .numbers` of all de-
-triPti°ns of- 'troops in pay and under arms at
beginning of this year with •those • at the be-
t' Bening Of last year, there was a reduction
et
entY•six thousand men. So considerable a dimi-
we'ion io the number of men Might naturally
t`i the Committee to expect that there would be a
°Pottionate diminution of the expence. •It was,
:yr". to be recollected, that a great part of
farce was that which had, been stationed in
;;:nee, the eirences-.-of which were defrayed by
• e contributions from that count, y ; and, it ivai3
et° he expected, that on withdrawing _that part of
army and reducing it, the expellees to be de-
rr'Yed by this country would be materially in-
re's", on account of the half-pay to Officers
:Zei, enr4tA•ons to the men. •
The Finance Commit-
their Report, estimated that this Increased,
exPeuce would amotmt to 250,0001. It had,
t
ne‘‘,..
'eever, now turned out that this amount was
..d,
and that the increase would its fact
amount only to 88,0001. It was to be observed,
0
1s i
t n the total amount of the chat ge for the pte-
sent }rear, there was included a 3u1"..4 203,000 i.
seleu was entirely applicable to the expeoces of
‘,l4lents to be disbanded in the course of the
ii`4l.• The whole of this sum, however, would
jt" be a mere temporary expense, as part of
vv°°lll continue and evert increase after -the
seette"o• making all allowances on this
it trieht fairly be calculated that
the wh•sle ' of the .88,0001. would be ergd in
aulonnt nt the reductions which womulde take
1,3
Vole?' So that by. the,,redoction of forces on the
tr
}ear there would he a saving sufficient to
„„
ae
Co the increased expenses of half-pay, peo-
nss hod other similar allowances, which wo"ld
.
ieen;he doe io consequence of the reduction of
(;ei "Inv which had.heen stationed in France.—
:t view of the Whole, comparing this year with
ts;',l,st, there Was ao eduction in the amount of
e.-1-14stinsates to the .extent 0f,763,0001. On ac-
Ittlhut nt those who objected to the extent of pa-
11:',e'll4e in keeping up the army, -it was not tin-
e Ottani to show that theee bad been a- reduc-
sisi:,4, of the establishment to this extent. He
erlt."d
cllnow particularise the various classes. on
the reduction was made. In the first class,
e.i'ol included the actual army in. the country,
tettolt ns Staff, there was a diminution to the ex-
.
272,0001. 01 this saving 263;0001. was
U,sere used by reductions. On the Stall, however,
its was a small increa,e, 2,260 i, which arose
„sem Medical 1 t ailment. some years a o, a
theirs reduction had been made on this depatt-
;Le. and it was now but jtutie: to say, -that
11.41)6'50n at the head of that dep itiment Own
st 4-, expressed an opinion that the,e .rednctio ,s
°t Stratertha„ s•.'ss consistc to with t he e sigemoes
ey -`l`' service. Conti to his netuaos, how-
et
Government had judged is better to per-
if te 10 the r. then proposed, leaving
trop a Ilia Co nisn ato:H:g Officers on the various sta-
ttig, tO make representations on the subject; -in
4 supply of medical assisiance was not
• setsl,4,4l.licient, It was in'conseqoence of repre-
, ,-"llle°ns thus made, that the-asmall increase in
•kiesrtesent year was sr, easioned.' In the Barrack
der'ltnient there was an increase. of '40001., uu-
nfriltttee heads--‘l. Au increase . pay to the
tl s "ets • 2 half-pay to such as had' bee n re-
liatehalf-payleid ;'anil 3. ,q transfer ot•part of the stun whi.•ll
,I°l,lneily been supelied by Ireland. In ore!.
tS t.;
tfiere was a small reduction of -6001. I I:e
tlele)tices of the Valente``-Corps had been
ed to the extent of 1,8721., which was effected
tret4e Irish Establishment, deducting a small in-
itee4se for twat of Great lititain. On the whole
°t the first class,' therefore, there was a
'vlsriti" of 272,0001. 'On the 'second class,
11,4;:(1 Included the half-pay,' gratuities, &a. there
v."increase of 213,0001. In the third class,
ia'ie4ts i'"us ire ms stood thus :—For the Military-
-4 dimilltition of 2401. ; for the garrisons,
'"ea2,2591., occasioned ;by arrange-
Neet of •
for !educing some garrisons its
tiNorth.-Brie
! le', to the' full-pay, a diminu'tion of 5,3211. ;
"If-pay, an increase of 87;3591.; in the
nrif :Y of foreign troops, a diminution of 6,6001.
t,"e Chelsea;List, an increase of 121,0601.,
Mite'(h°wever, was not all an increased charge
77,(6,-,,Le4 increase on -that item being only
3,•400r.---iu the Military Asylum an increase of
6,2471's-in Widows'e Pensions,. an increase of
4104- ; tinder the 'head of Bounties and Pen-
le ‘es 411 increase of 6,7001 —superannuated al-
irateaties, an increase of 2,9651., which arose
thethe " reductions in the course of the year. On
'Oil Whole, there was an increase of 58,0001.
ef
IY. tviaile there was. a diminsition in the number
lie 1)"
to the extent of 9800. Before concludiug,
the I‘l..i,'lted to notice that part of the Report of
NI, 1 tldnce Committee which related to tiPe
‘laq' t"iss• 'The persons who were provided for
er this class were officers who had beets to the
er)3 service—the Widows and orphans of
4hate Who had fallen. When it was considered
tali these were the objects provided for, and the
OecasiCalied the increase were taken
tlet- v'ew, he WAR sure the House wool.: teel the
Ihlet of
providing for claims so just and hotinur•
rl
as to the other part of the expenditure
'Llte.' related to the •efficient- part of elle. army,
.ear with
compare the amount Of force in this
t iWith some' of -the previous teats since the
usi(l nt the war. tompsering the whole
laitilint of forces in the begioning of this year
r_',those in the beginning of 1817, 'bete was
Leeltuction of 41,°98 men, and- a saving of
41366M001. •; compared with the begitosing of
1,56 the diminution was 62,982 men and
1114,,u10001, in Money. The 'Noble Lord then
ebd his first Resolution:—That 258,7261. 11,
lane e granted to his Majesty for completing the
jn ttier jerinited for the Land Forces at Home and
'eC"l"oles (excelling; India), from Decent-
eel: 1818, ti, December 24, 1819.
zhe,,e "'el DAVIs thottaht that on the whole army.
127mcf"uld a reduction to the extent of
'ltirneejt• inelnding infantry and cavalry. The
4"
4re. , nf General Officers, he thought, might be
Y de .
ca eased. In the Staff there was this
tlint ireland, where there was a
-• ioree than • • was larger
C't-in England, 'stele. a
Ntatet gave notice'that when the Report WrtS
°P
be would move fur a reduction to the

. . .
extent of 120,000 Z, and would then enter iuto-de-
ulils, and show how it could be made.
Mr. flums expressed his.senSe of the merits of
the Army.- But he considered he had a duty to
perform, in the present situation of the country,'
to see tow tar the Army could be reducedeSo as
to preserve its efficiency. I< was l!is Opinion that
a teditction beyond
.that which the Noble Lord
now proposed could be safely- made. To prove
this, he referred ,to the. Report of the Fitianee
Committee. ,From the documents befoie the
House, it did not appear that. the're. would be such
a reduction as was mentioned by the. Noble Lord.
But the most melancholy prospect wast that the
Report stated the expence of the Amoy for
the. year 1820, which- it appeared would not
be one .hundred pounds less than that of this
year. He was some. when she House SPIV', the
total amount of the expenditure, that . they
would see the necessity of doing something.
in this matter. First of all he wished to call the
atteptiou of the' House to the stare of the. Mil-
itary College. They would scarcely believe that
there were four hundred students at :his College,
a number which, allowing four years' education,
ought to supply the army ,with 100 officers.yearly.
But what w:ts the fact ? During the last four
years, the College had only supplied in all 76
Officers, of whom 52 got -commissions by pur-
chase, and 24 without. At this rate each of these
Officers bad cost the country 11501. for their edu-
cation at the College. There was another point
to which he wished to call the particol.!r at-
tention of the Committee._ thiriog th'e last
four years Government bad made many re-
ductions, which, he had no doubt, gave them
much pain. But for what reason, while
these reductions were going on, and hundreds of
able officers of all ranks bad been put on hall-
pay, had about two hundred and seventy new
commissions been granted, thus throwing' so
many new annoitants on, the public, and doing
great injustice to those gallant officers who had
already served their country, and would be happy
to be employed again.) The Royal—Asylum was
another subject
,deserving attention : 36,0001. a
year was .there expended io bringing up young
children to capacitate them for soldiers.
Mr. BENNET objected to the amount of the
Estimates. There was nothing in the present
state of the country to make it necessary to sup-
port such a force Mahe kingdom as 29,523 men.
Net came 'edam'. What reason was there for
supportiOg in. that country such a force, as 20,671
men ? Was it known that the adininistratioo of
justice in Ireland was carried on with. the assist-
home the military—that all the gaols io that
country were guarded by soldiers, instead of turn-
keys ? Setting aside the constitutional question,
he could not but think that one of the means. of
dieting az reduction of the immense force io Ire-
land was by retnAying this abuse. He must also
call the aiteotion of the House to the mode of
distribution of the Waterloo prize money. It bad
beets dime in such a .way as to force in many
persons' who had no actual claim ; while others,
who were ugaged in protecting the fltoks and
baegaree of, the army., were excluded. Officers,
who at the time of the battle were on the sea—
WA,. instead of being in the. field, had been
lounging in St. James's-street, and had after-
wards travelled en bourgeois'in their chaises to
Paris,, had been admitted to a full share of'.this
pr'ize money, :front which the cebers, actively en-
gaged with the arniy; were excluded. Medical
Officers who bad acted in the field bad also. been
most unjustifiably excluded.
Sir A. Hors remarked on the objection which
had been made by the non. Gentleman (Mr.
Hume) to the grant for the Asylum. That Hon.
Gentleman would have the House discharge the
poor orphans who were now supported there.
Mr. Hums explained. The last thing which
he thought of ,proposing was discharging 'the
children.
Sir A. 11(7prt apologized. The Hon. Gentle-
man bad also objected to the vote for :he Military
College. It was said that each of the young offi-
cers, Voris that College, who had received Com-
missions Without purchase, had cost the Country
11501,, and this was made out by dividiug the
total amount of the expences of the College by
the number of these officers, and charging each of
them • with the amoont of.pne twenty fourth of
the total expenses. It was needless to remark on
the fallacy and absurdity of such a statement.
Btu the lion. Gentleman had wholly mistaken the
facts, for the number of officers educated at the
Military College, and now remaining unprovided
with commissions, was only sixteen.—(Wear,
hear !)
Sir iSAAC COFFIN said,- he had no objection
whatever to make to. the Army Estimates, and
hoped that equal liberality would be shoWn to the
service to which he belonged.
Lord PALMERSTON, in answer to some objec-
tintes which had been made to the number of men
in welt regiment, said, that it would be impolitic
to fill them up to the usual complement in a time
of peace. If that were done, and a war were.
to break out, the only means of • augmenting
our forces .would. be by raising new regiments ;
whichit watt obvious would he attended with
great delay and inconvenience : whereas by the
present regulasion, considerable addition con hl be
made to the army, by, filling up each regiment.—
He did not mean then to enter on' the subject of
tbe Irish Staff, as it was under the consideration
of Govetnmeur, and would be matter of future
dismssion. The Military College merited the sup-
Port of the country,• as it hell supOlied the army
with many able and meritorious officers. It was
well known how great an ioconvenience,, on the
breaking out of a war, it was not to have
scientific. officers—and scientific officers could
only be ()hulloed by experience or by instruction.
Such an establishment as the Military College was
'necessary to keep the army in a stare of efficiency;
tor, note ithstanding the gallantry of our officers,
witrout either that experience which.' war 'afford-
ed, or that instruction which it was the object of
(his College to give, they most yield to men of
superior. science. As to the extent of that este-
-I)lklinteut, it, was hoe .fotool that it turned out
more Cadets than could be provided is ithcomtnis-.
!,ions, mot the•shopou of_ the army .on its peace
estabiisiment. It that %vete the case hereafter,
‘here could be no hesitation in making a propo,r_
tionate !eduction in that Institution. Tile Hun.

Gentlenint) (Mr. Home) had said, that the half-

pay system required sui ions attentioA, and recom-
mended; as a. mt•as+tre of jostice and economy,
that the Conitoissions should be filled up troth that
list. He bad lint gone the length of saying, that
all commissions should ebe -so'fikled op. Many offi-
cers on half-pay, it was recollected, were those who

hall obtained commissions for raising corps, and

‘vho:.htial always beet) given to' understand that
they would be reduced and put on half-pay ; they
had, in fact, merely :oirchased in'that rmoner an
annuity for life. Yet the Commander-in-Chief had
always paid attention to the expediency of filling
up commissions out of the half7pay liSt, .and if the
half.pay,ofthe officers remOved from that .114 were
calculated-at 12 years purchase-money, 2,678,0001.
had been saved in that• way to the public. On.
the angmentatioo of thcl Army in 1815, there 1"14(1
been appointed to commissions 839!offieers from
that list, whose half-pay at twelve years purchase
Would have ;cost the public 226,0001. It was
said that the ComMander-in.Chief might, by pit-
ting ari officer on half-pay, grant an annuity with-
out the consent of Parliament. But this view of
the subject was not correct, as, mileas by exchange
with another officer on half-pay, no officer was
put on the, half-pay list except by the reduction of
his corps, which *as a matter of general ar-
rangement. As to the Military Asylum, the
object of it had met with general approba-
tion from all parts of the House. It was., ,in
fact, a charitable institution ; and there could not
be better objects of chat ir han those for whom
his establishment provided....-the Orphans ot Of-
ficers who had died in the service, or the Children
of. those, who, being ordered on foreign service,
were oniable'fo attend to their education. It was
said, that with a Peace Establishment such an in-
stiNtion was not necessary. Mitt how short a
time had elapsed, since we Wad a most numerous
army? There were now constantly more candi-
dates for admission frotn among the orphatis of
soldiers than could he taken in ;. but it peace con-
' tinned for some time, there might he ronm for
reduction. In reply to the observation respect-
ing the Waterloo grant, and the coMplaint that
the MediCal Staff at Brussels had no' share in it,
he stated, titer the rule was", that as this sum was
granted as prize-money to those who bad been
'engaged in the battle of Waterloo and the cap-
ture of Paris, those only who were engagpol
in battle, in the sieges of fortresses, or in
the capture of Palk, were to
,share. The
garrisons in the rear of, the, army at Ostend,
Brussels,- and other places, were, by this, rule,
excluded.- It often happened that those who
performed duties of great danger did not obtain
prize' money which was shared by pet soots svho had
undergone less difficulty or hazard. But this was
inherent in the nature of prize money. It was
necessary to draw a•distinet line somewhere ; and'
as to the Medical Officers at Brussels, though
they had pertormi'd a laborious and responsible
duty under very disadvantageous circumstances,
they could not be admitted to share unlesi the
whole of the troops in the rear, including a ye-
' teran battalion", which had two days before ar-
rived from England, had been admitted so share
also. lf,the care of the wounded of itself gave a
claim to prize !volley, the Medical Officers at
Deal (whither many of the wounded were re-
moved) would have a claim. Ile contended that
former years did not form a fair criterion as to
the amount of force required in the present year.
In the last year Sir W. Burroughs'had moved to
rednce 10,000 men, and a Noble Lord (Lord
Althorp) had proposed a reduction. of ,5000: men
only, yet in the present year 9,500 men had been
reduced.

General G.ASCOIGNIt thought the Medical Of&
cers at Brussels entitled to a share of the Water,
100 grant. lithe Noble Lord's rule, that
.chance,
not Merit, decided whO should share, held good
as to prize-money in general, it could not apply
to, a sum voted for meritorious service.. He com-
mended the conduct of the Commander•in-Chief
in filling tip of commissiops. In his own.regiment
five vacancies had occurred,- all of which were
filled np. by officers from half-pay.
Lord ALTIIOLIP called to mind, that when on a
former occasion he had proposed a reduction of
5000 men, it was not that he desired no greater
reduction, but because the House had previously
negatived.a 'motion for reducing 10,000 men. The
establisl.ment for England of 29,000 men seemed
to him enormous, especially at a time when only
two millions were applicable to the reduction of
our enormous debt. The force in Ireland, great
as it was, might he necessary, but that necessity
Was only created by the mis•government of that

country. •
After some explanations between Colonel DA-
VIS, Lord PALMERSTON, and-Mr. Hume, . .
Mr. BENNE,T icinesked that the Medical Staff at,
Lisbon, I.ladajos., Salamanca, Vittoria, had shared
in the prize-money-of the battles at which they
bad rlpt been present, and were conceived to ,be
justly entitled to it.
Sir R. WlLsoiv was of opinion the Medical Offi-
cers were entitled to'share—the army .always re-
garded their claims most favourably. He wished
know.howlu happened that officers were con-
tinued on the army list who had only temporary

rank
Lord PALMFRSTONT said, the medical officers in
question could not, according to any rule, be
admitted .withont.admitting all the British troops
in the Netherlands. The names. of officers who
had' temporary rank; were only continued on, the
army list as a matter of
,courtesy to them; tiny
received no pay.
Mt.'BuNtisT,said, the medical officers. at 'Lis,
hon had shared the prize7ruoiley of battles at.4o
leagues distance. Even Con►miss:3ties'
who were never near the battle of Waterloo, had
shared the grant froth which 'the medical men
were excludetL—The 'motion was agreed
The following sums were then, voted :-
152,5051. for General and Staff Officers,. and Officers of
Hospitals.
150,2281. for the Officers of the Public Departments 'of the
Army.
29,0351. for Medicines and Surgical Materials.
121,6681. for Volunteer Corps.
•
2-5,1731. fur the Royal Military College. •
175,6411. for pay of General Office's not being Colonels of
regiments: .
33,6581. for garrisons at home and abroad. •
-1270371. for full-pay of retired anti:unattached officers. .!
77(41611. fur half-pay and allowances to reduced otli:ers,
119,7501. for ditto for foreign corps, ••
42,8.191. jot, (:helaea Eioal ital.
1536 b tl. tut- Kiita&iiabiat ditto,

-1,173,-4&1: for out-pensi.niers of Chelsea and Kilmainharn.
„•f;08.21. f„,- the Rod Military Asylum.
101,1.221. f,r ‘l,, , i.; I 0 ..." i ' VC 111310115.
168,i221. for allowances in,the Compassionate List.
20,7321. for allowances to reduced Adjutants of.-Ldcat

ia
37,3371 for superannuation 41 official persons.
35,0001. on account of Excht two Tres.
[Many items could oat he heard, so as to report them with
any degree of acenracyj
Mr. ARBUTHNOT moved for Certain snots for
the supply of .the CoMmissariat, tUe Barracks.
and .the Miscellaneoo4 Services',,cOmprehendini;,
as usual, provision for the indwell-111re thß
Civil Establishments of our several Culoniesi.-
-..
All the Hon. Member's motions wire agreed to,
atter some desultory conversation upon time sub-
ject of the grants for 'Se ivfou n d land, New South
Vales, Ceylon, and Sierra Leone, in which Sir
J. Newport, the Chancellor of the' Lxclietitter
Messrs. Irvine, R. Gordon, and Sir W. De Cres-
plgny,,took parr.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER Moved
for a grant of eight millions to replace Exchequer
Bills funded in 1818.—Agreed to.
The House resumed, mist! the Report was or-
dered to be brought 'up on Monday,.
BANKItUPTCY,AMENDMENT BILL.
Mr. J. SMITH Moved the Order of the Day for
the further consideration Of the Bankruptcy
Amendment Bill. 'He then entered into smite of
the chief particulars of the Bill.
Altlet\Man WAITHMAN supported the Bill. lie
was proceeding into' a long 'detail,. wiry, -the
Worthy Alderman was interrupted by a continued
fit of roughing in the House.
CoURTENAY approved of the measure, and
assigned his reasons.
The Sottcrroa--GENERAL was favourable to
the Bill.
The Report was then ordered to be taken into
further consideration on Friday next, and to be
TOWN LAND FINES.