The Sun.
London, England, 1821-05-31 00:00:00

MR. OWEN'S PLAN

The Marquess of LANsnowN presented a Pc-
titiou from the county .of-Lanark in favour of Mr.
'o:Veil's "'Jan, and observed, that it was signed by
very large proportion of the property of the
County, and by a majority of the IVlng-istrates.
:Ms Lordship abstained from offering, any opinion
en the subject himself, as he had not examined it
•with sufficient care to pronounce how far it was
practicable.---The - petition was ordered to be laid
on the table. •
IRISH LAW COURTS REGULATION BILL.

The Earl of DONOUGHMORE on rising to move

to r• Papers connected with thelrish liaw Courts
egnla t on Bill, expressed his s,urprise that a
;•tai..3.are .which went to. alter the adm.:ol3tration

pithy law in Ireland, should have been intro-
• duced into that House without any remark or ex-
. planation. • It was brought in on the Ist of the
..jitidnth, but it was not until three weeks after
that it was taken under the proteCion of the
Secretary of State, and avowed as a ministerial
measure.. He complained that no documen6 had
beep placed in their Lordships' hands, and -that
.i'the Bill had remained 21 days in the House be-
b-re the Reports of the Commissioners Were laid
-before them. A Petition was presented against
the Bill by the Attornies of Ireland, who de-
,precated it as injurious to themselves and to
their clients. Petitions were also presented by
tiro. other persons of the name of Evans, com-
plaining of fhe infringement of their patent rights
bj. the Bill, and a fourth Petition from a person
of the name of Ciancey. All these requested
to be heard against it by evidence at the .Bar,
• ar.d he hoped the Bill would not be so precipitated
as to exclude them from that advantage. The
Commissioners, out of whose Report the mea-
t-are had grown,. were, he• confessed, a most re-
spectable set of men ; but they were not appointed

to alter the law, nor were their recommendations

.binding upon Parliament. The House ought to
hare before them the opinions of the Judges of
the Courts of Law before they proceeded to le-

_ .
• slate, and he hoped the Noble Secretary of
'state (Lord Sidmouth) would treat their Lord-
ships m ith so much respect as to produce them
before he moved for the second reading. The
Eill was intended to take away fees altogether,

and to ray the officers of the Courts by salaries
. a"one. Bat the same regulation was not to be
e.cterd‘ d.to the Courtof Equity. It was difficult
to say why, and he was unwilling to suppose

that it might be because the Judges of the
Law Courts had no representative in that House,
while he Judge of the Court of Equity had, in
the i e son of the Noble Lord on the Woolsack.
But the Chancery Bill, another measure still be-
fore Parliament, empowered the Lord Chancel-
. for and the Master of the Rolls to increase or di-

Dainish the fees of their officers. lie objected to
the doing away of the old practice of lees, tot to
-the putting down of extortion,for wherever there
extortion, the Court itself had a power to
punish it. Even if improper fees had grown up,
'--Asfider the connivance of the Jud,res which was a
7-I*ft—he would scarcely suppose, Parliament. had
a power to petition for their removal. He hoped
that the great officers would be liberally compen-
sated, if the Bill should pass, but an estimate
einuld be laid before Parliament, and an account
of the slate in which each office was at the time
that the persons came in, of the increase in its
amoluments;Aind of the manner in which that in-
crease hid taken .place. His Lordship next al-

laded to the additional Stamp Act for Ireland,
which would impose a great additional charge
upon that country, and lamented that Ireland
bad not a Mr. Hume in the other House to watch
over such proceedings. After some further obser-
vations, he concluded with moving for copies of
ouch communications as may have passed between
the Right Honourable Charles Grant and the
Judges of the Courts of Law, with respect to the
abolition of fees.
. Lord SIDMOUTU said, he would not be guilty
of the irregularity of following the Noble Lord
itt his observations upon the two Bills, which
were not under the consideration of the House.
The Noble Lord bad stated that the Trish Courts
Regulation Bill was a violent attack upon the ad-
ministration of justice in Ireland, but the object

°fit was to limit- and describe by salaries 'the
-charges which at present, in the shape of fees,
were indefinite, exorbitant, enormous, and dis-
graceful -to Ireland. Even if there had been. go
Rfports from the Commissioner'S, there:to-as enough
A4*, -Induce their Lordships to recognise the prin-
ciple of the Bill: The Noble Cord had said
th:,- re was•an intention to pass the-Bill without

explanation, but he had only postponed the ex-
planation in consequence of the absence of a
N.oble Friend,and reserved himself for the secand
re'ading, which lie now gave notice that he would
move on Friciiy, The Papers just moved for
would, he hoped, be ready by t;int time, but he
could not suppose. it possible that their Lordships
would think it necessary to wait for them, and
defer the progress of a measure of such import-
ance to suitors in the Irish Courts.

The Earl of LisiErttniK, instead of complaining
of the indifference shown In that House to the
affairs of Ireland, begged leave to return his
thiinks to his Majesty's Ministers for the con-
stant'attention which they had paid to the af-
fairs and interests of his country, and, pp.rticula'r-
ly to the present measures, which, he contended,
were both proper and necessary. With respect
to the petitions to which his Noble Friend had
alluded, they bad been sent by those innocent
lambs, whose conduct had created a necessity for
the present measures, and who held their situa-
tions under his Majesty's pleasure, instead of
enjoying in them a freehold estate. As to the
estimate on which the amount of the proposed
salaries had been fixed, it had been made on an
average of seven' years' receipt, not of extrava-
giint, but of legal fees, no fee being called legal

that had been imposed within the last twenty
years.

Lord DONOUGHMORE rose to explain.—He
said, what he complained of was, that the per-
sons who petitioned the House had no oppor-
tunity of having their claims heard before either
House of Parliament. lie asked the Noble Se-
cretary Of State; why he had not, before this
time, corrected the gross abuseS which he now so
much complained of ?
The Marquess of LANSDOIN N felt that there
was a very strong necessity for passing this Bill;
for it was most desirable, in the instances in ques-
tion, to substitute salaries for fees. The Reports
on the table contained abundant evidence to
show the necessity of correcting the gross abuses
that prevailed in Ireland, where the population
of the country had been exposed to a system of
plunder in the Courts of Law disgraceful to the
country where they were permitted to exist ; and
it would be unpardonable in the Legislature not
to extend protection to the suitors in Irish Courts
against the abuses that had long and systemati-
cally been practised there. He felt that it was
the duty of that House to do this effectually,and
that in the next stage of. the Bill there ought to
be a full attendance of their Lordships.
Lord DONOUGHAIO RE again explained. He said
his complaint was, that the House had not the
Report immediately applicable to this Bill.
The Marquess of LANS D 0 WN said the Reports
already on the table sufficiently satisfied him as
to ,the necessity of the measure.
The Motion, thus amended, Was agreed to,
and the second reading of the Bill fixed for Fri-,
day next.—Adjourned to Friday.