The Sun.
London, England, 1844-02-16 00:00:00

THE SUN, LONDON, FRIDA_Y EVI4:NI NG-, FEBRUARY 16, 1844.

LORD DUNDONALD'S INVENTIONS.
Lord BROUGUIAAI postponed the motion, of which hr had
given notice, respecting the petition presented by Lord Dun-
donald.
Lord AIINTO took that opportunity of bearing testimony
to the value of one of the inventions of the Noble Lord—an
improvement in the application of steam machinery to ve,,sels
)f war. It had been subjected to a trial of four or five years,
and the experiment had been highly satisfactory, both as to
its operation and durability.
POOR•LAW UNIONS.
The Bishop of EXETER gave notice that he should
to-morrow move for a Select Committee to consider the expe-
diency of making some provision for religious worship and
spiritual
,instruction in the poor-law union houses both in
England and Wales.

• TURNPIKE TRUSTS.
The Duke of WELLINGTON gave notice of the inten-
tion of the Government. to introduce a Bill, in the course of
the present session, on the subject of Turnpike Trusts. All the
Reports on the subject not having been received, the Bill could
not be introduced immediately.
STATE OF IRELAND.—ADJOURNED DEBATE.
On the motion for resuming the adjourned debate,
Earl FORTESCUE rose, and said that he understood a
statement had been made in another place which affected
him personally, and also the character of the Go-
vernment, at whose head he was in Ireland. A
person high in office had stated that, within three
months before the late Government went out of office, seven
stipendiary magistrates had been appointed in addition to the
existing establishment of stipendiary magistrates in Ireland.
Before he proceeded further, he begged to inform their Lord-
ships that he alone was responsible for those appointments.
The Government with which he had been connected had no-
thing to do with them. On reference to the official documents,
he found it was perfectly correct that seven new appointments
were made between the 15th of June and the 28th of August,
184!. It was not, however, true that these appointments
were made in addition to the existing number of stipendiary
magistrates. During the time he had mentioned three
vacancies occurred, and those vacancies were tilled up. That
left four out of the seven. Of those four, one was appointed
in the city of Armagh, at the earnest request of Lord Goeford,
in consequence of a dreadful murder that was committed in the
neighbourhood. Another was sent to Tralee, in consequence of
disputes continually occurring, which terminated in riots amongst
the fishermen in the neighbourhood. Another was appointed
to a wild coast district in Donegal, in consequence of
disturbances having taken place between the people and
the revenue police. He did not exactly recollect why
the other was appointed, but he knew that the appoint-
ment was made under equally urgent circumstances.
As these were the facts of the case, he trusted that this would
be a sufficient answer to the statement made in another place.
He would now turn to the immediate subject under discussion.
He could not agree with those who said that this motion of his
Noble Friend was ill-timed. No one could doubt its
importance—and its importance, he conceived, was a
sufficient justification for its full and immediate consideration.
He stated that much of the excitement of the people arose from
the attempts made to restrict the franchise. But for those
attempts, these great meetings would not, in all probability,
have been held. lie cited the large amount of the repeal rent,
during the last year, compared with former years, as a proof
of the great 'discontent of the people. He felt bound
to render a due meed of praise to Mr. O'Connell for the
manly stand which he made against the propagation of
the doctrines which were endeavoured to be spread through-
out Ireland by the Chartists. During the time when he
(Earl Fortescue) was Lord-Lieutenant, the amount of
the repeal rent was scarcely more than 2001. for each week,
but during the administration of the present Government, it
had risen to nearly 2,0001. Mr. O'Connell had refused to accept
the highest situation which had been offered to him, but in the
instance of his son's appointment, he (Earl Fortescue)
would say that Mr. O'Connell never made the slightest
application. On the subject of the Irish Church
he thought that there could be but one opinion.
After some further observations, which were quite inaudible,
the Noble Lord concluded, as we understood him, by a wish
that the present discussions might tend to the benefit and
welfare of Ireland. As he sat down, some Noble Lord moved
that the House proceed to the Orderof the Day.—(Laughter. )
Lord HADDINGTON said the Noble Lord complained
of a statement that had been made elsewhere, of the dismissal
of the stipendiary magistrates in Ireland. It had been stated
that the Government removed ten of them, and it was in
order to• defend the Government from that charge that the
statement was made. The number of stipendiary magistrates
in the early part of 1841 was 59, and between June and the
28th of August, that being the day on which the Noble
Viscount opposite (Lord Melbourne) left office, seven
additional magistrates were appointed. As soon as the
present Government came into office, those seven were I

'removed, reducing the number again to fifty-nine, that
being the number for which the House of Commons had given
a vote. At present there were sixty, being one more stipendiary
magistrate than in 1839, 1840, and up to the 15th June, 1841.
He did not think therefore that her Majesty's present Govern-
sent were liable to the imputations which had been at-

-...
tempted to be cast upon them of setting aside stipendiary ma-
gistrates for party purposes. Since the time when the present
Government came into office four vacancies had taken place,
and tbose vacancies had been filled up by the appointment of
four of those gentlemen who had been appointed by the late
Government. He had nothing particular to say against the
motion at present before their Lordships, he could not, how-
ever, say so much for the speech of his Noble Friend who in-
troduced the motioitio It was filled with invective and reerimi-

nation. He would wish to know for what they were to
quarrel ? Why, one was the subject of the Catholic Clergy.
But this was an.old subject which had been mooted long since.
What he thought still vias, that the Noble Marquis might
have selected a more opportune time for bringing this matter
before the consideration of their Lordships and the public.
This alleged grievance had been brought before Parliament in
the year 1805, on which occasion he (the Earl of Haddington)
voted along with the Whigs ; for against the Whigs he had
no aniftlus when they brought forward measures such as he
might conincide in. His Noble Friend beside him, (the Duke
of Wellington) had wisely omitted to annex conditions to the
Catholic Emancipation Act.
The Marquis of NORMANBY—Does the Noble Lord for-
get the abolition of the franchise of the forty-shilling free-
hoJaers ?

The Earl of HADDINGTON—The Noble Lord was right.
He did think that the introduction of any proprosition for
the payment of Roman Catholic clergy would be most impo-
litic at the present time, inasmuch as it would not be aecceptesl
by that body. Many propositions had been made with respect
to the Established Church in Ireland, by Noble Lords oppo-
site, but he (the Earl of Haddington) thought the question
was, whether they would recognise the Church on the volun-
tary principle in that country, or whether the whole Church
Establishment should be abolished. He thought the proposi-
tion of the Noble Marquis was a perfect chimera, as the
Noble Lord the President of the Council had shown to the
satisfaction of their Lordships. According to the Act of
Union, the Church as by law established was part and parcel of
the law of the land. His Noble Friend had announced that
it was not the intention of her Majesty's Government to sanc-
tion in the slightest degree any
measure which could degrade or
destroy the Protestant Church in Ireland ; but, at the same
time, he (the Earl of Haddington) thought such a determina-
tion was quite consistent with the adoption of a course of legis-
lation which would render a full measure of civil and religious
rights to the Roman Catholics. If the agitators of Ireland,
for their own purposes, excited the passions of the people,
under pretence of obtaining their rights, it
was for them to
prove that there was ample room to conciliate that
people by the adoption of liberal measures.—( Hear. )
The defects in the registration system could not be imputed to
the Government, since they had announced their intention of
bringing in a Bill to remedy the evils which had arisen from
an interpretation of the Act which had the effect of diminish-
ing the number of Irish voters. He denied the imputation
that justice was not fairly administered. He.defended the ju-
dicial appointments of the Government. Were men to be ,ex-
eluded from the bench, because
at some time in their lives,
they had made speeches distasteful to the Catholic Hier-
archy ? That charge came with a very had grace from
the Noble Marquis,
€ • who, unless he was belied, offered
the situation of .Master of the Rolls to Mr. O'Con-
nell.—(" Hear, hear," from the Marquis of Norman 4. )
As to the monster meetings, it was said that the most manly
course would have been to have prevented them at first. He
said that the Government thought they would wear themselves
out ; the Government was not so foolish as to imagine any
such thing. The Government did not prevent the first meet-
ings ; but they took a course by which the people—who saw
what passed in Parliament threegh the papers—were warned
of the consequences of attending such meetings. As to the
dismissal of the magistrates for attending repeal meetings, the
Government was perfectly justified in doing it. No man who
attended such a meeting could be depended on for putting down
excesses that might arise from excitement on other occasions.
With regard to the Clontarf meetine, he contended that the
proclamation against it was issued' quite in sufficient time.
That meeting was called together by a sort of military procla-
mation, which rendered it absolutely necessary for the
dduse
l
Govern-
ment to interfere. He admitted that Mr. O'Connell
every effort to preserve the peace, and not the slightestdisorder
t
occurred. But the alarming part of the subject was this—
that this—
that one man should have such influence asthat
when
he said peace there was peace ; what might
sequence if it suited him to say
rar
Marquis opposite (the Marq in Irelani had
uis of lanride) compleined
,
of the manner io which the persons
been brought to justice. He complained of their being
C
war'
T be
he heNo con.
ble
great risk
in
of blood was incurred by the Government
the manner in
Their
which they had proclaimed the Clontarf meeting.
Dublin,
arraigned for conspiracy,' and said they ought to have been
tried for sedition. The Noble Lord also said that
Lordships would recollect that Clontarf was near to
where a large military force was stationed. But suppose they
had proclaimed illul!aghmast, Tara, or Clifden meetings.
There would then have been risk of bloodshed indeed, inas-

much as the military force stationed at those places was ex-
tremely small, as compared with the vast numbers attending
the meeting. Suppese those meetings had been proclaimed,
and the people attending those meetings had refused to obey
the proclamation, what would have been said then by Noble
Lords opposite? Would it not have been said that Peterloo
had been revived, and that the meetings had been put down
which were being held for a perfectly legal purpose ? The
Government had not prosecuted the traversers in Ireland be-
cause the object they had in view was unlawful, but because
their means for attaining that object were illegal. The means
they adopted were intimidation—intimidation of Parliament
and the Government. He (Lord Haddington) therefore
trusted that the Government stood vindicated before their
Lordships, as he was sure they stood vindicated before the
people of England, for what thoy had done. They had done
all they could to maintain the peace and tranquillity
of Ireland. They had succeeded—succeeded, too, by means
of the ordinary and unaided law of the land.—( Cheers.)
It had been said in another place that his Noble Friend on the
Woolsack had been appointed to his office on account of his
hostility to Ireland. He (Lord Haddington) must say, that
he had never read any accusation with more indignation in
the whole course of his life.—( Hear, hear.) The attack
upon his Noble and Learned Friend was a most foul calumny.
—( Hear, hear.) Na one who knew his Noble and Learned
Friend could ever accuse him of being the enemy of, or hostile
to, any human creature. He had never known a man loss
liable to such a gross imputation, or who had more generosity
in his nature. He (Lord Hiddington) begged pardon for
thus speaking' in the presence of his Noble - and Learned
Friend, but he had a right to feel that this was not only an
imputation upon the motives of Sir Robert Peel, but upon the
whole Government.—(Cheers.) He thought that the person
who said that her Majesty's Ministers had appointed her Lord
high Chancellor to his situation on account of his hostility to
the people of Ireland, was not, by such a course, doing that
which was likely to allay the excitement at present existing.
—( Hear, hear.) They were not accustomed to hear impute-
tations of this kind, and he was sure they must all have heard
of it with deep regret. He was quite certain that it ought to
be regretted by him who made it, for language of this kind
was little likely to heal the wounds of Ireland. In conclusion,
he begged to say that nothing would be left undone by her Ma-
jesty's Government to tranquillise and conciliate the people of
Ireland
The Marquis of CLANRICARDE explained. When he
said the parties who had lately been tried in Ireland ought to
have been tried for sedition, he did not say that seditious lan-
guage had been used, but that it was stated that seditious lan-
guage had been usedat the meetings held in Ireland last year.
The parties using such language, if they lad used such lan-
guage, ought to have been prosecuted at the time.
Earl FORTESCUE explained.
Lord MONTEAGLE then rose to address the House. The
question of stipendiary magistrates formed bitt a mall part of

' the question. At the same time he felt that his Noble Friend,
the late Lord-Lieutenant, had increased the confidence of Ire-
land by the course that he had pursued, and in that course he
was fully vindicated. For himself, he was most anxious to
render every justice to the terms of the motion that had
been proposed by the Noble Marquis, but, in doing so, he was
most anxious to see that justice was done on each side.
Could it be said that Ireland was in the same state that it for-
merly had been ?—( Hear, hear.) Certainly net. It had hi-
therto, under the late Administration, been in a state of per-
fect tranquillity and peace. What was its condition now ? Far,
far, different.—( Hear, hear.) He concurred with the mea-
sures that had been adopted cn the part of the Government,—
( Hear, hear.) He complained not of the forcess that had been
employed in Ireland ; but while he did so he was compelled to
state that by the proceedings that had been taken, some,
if nit a little injury, had been effected in Ireland
The Government had taken a great step, but if they were
disposed to act upon the terms of conciliation, they, in his
opinion, ought to have adopted a different course. Had they
by the principles which they had pursued succeeded in govern-
ing Ireland effectually, or in keeping her people quiet? Cer-
tainly not.—( Hear, hear.) And what was the inference to be
drawn ? Why, that the Government—the present existing Go-
vernment—had nut the confidence of the rich people ; they had
not the confidence of the Irish Catholics. It might be true
that they wished to govern Ireland on the principles of justice,
but to do so they must adopt a very different course to that
which they had pursued.—( Hear, hear.) The fact was, that
the present Ministers had not the confidence of the people of
Ireland, and the evidence of the last ten years had proved
that assertion. What had been done with respect to the Muni-
cipal Bill? Had not the proceedings upon that measure given
the greatest dissatisfaction to the people of Ireland? Was not
that dissatisfaction one that ought to have been expressed? By
that Bill they had given to England, and to Scotland, certain
civil rights, but they had considered that Ireland was unworthy
of such a concession.—( Hear, hear.) In fact, they had given
to Ireland what he must call a bar to civil rights, and in the
renewal of certain laws they had forgotten Ireland altogether.
Then, with respect to education, what had been the course that
had been pursued towards Ireland ? One that he must confess
was of little credit to the Government. He did not wish to
undervalue the votes that have been given by Hon. Members,
in the other House of Parliament, but he thought, notwith-
standing all they had attempted to do, they had proved them-
selves greatly backward in the cause of the education of the
people of Ireland. Then, with respect to the proseeutions that
had taken place in Ireland, was it to be said, for one moment,
that those prosecutions were conducted in a manner becoming
a great Government? In that prosecution the Catholic reli-
gion—the priests had in a great measure bean held up to scorn
—their principles had been attacked, and the political franc-
chise and the rights of the people had been considered as no-
thing.—( Hear.) Much had been said against Mr. O'Con-
nell—much had been also asserted about the offers of prefer-
ment that had been made to him by the late Government. It
was true that they had offered him the Mastership of the Rolls.
He ( Lord Monteagle) regretted sincerely that that offer had
not been accepted by Mr. O'Connell. In discussing this
question, he should wish it to be understood distinctly that he
was not in the most remote manner defending the agitation in
that country. It had been his lot, during the administration
of Earl de Grey, to meet Mr. O'Connell face to face and
answer him upon the subject of the repeal of the legisla-
tive union, and upon that occasion he did net shrink from the
inquiry, nor would he do so now ; but still at the same time he
thought it would be most unjust if he, availing himself of this
privileges in that place as a Peer, were to attack a
person who had no opportunity or power of reply.
He believed it was pretty well understood that he
owed but little gratitude to Mr. O'Connell—( Hear,
hear, and laughter)—but still that should not in the slightest
degree influence him, and his only motive in stating what he
had just now done, was to show that he was actuated by no
private bias. Upon the occasion of the appointment of three
gentlemen of the highest honour and character—namely, Mr.
Sheil, Mr. Wyse, and Mr. More O'Ferrall—Mr. M'Neil and
the party with whom he was identified, made use of the most
insulting observations with respect to the religious persuasion
of those gentlemen. When such language was used by a
great political party, it in some degree justified the violent ex-
pression from the other party. The great question at issue was,
whether the Irish people had or had not confidence in the pre-
sent Goiter-lit-nerd ? and if they had not, to seek out the cause.
He should state that he attached no culpability to the Govern-
ment for the institution of the State trials ; because he thought
that when a great body of persons openly avowed their inten-
tion by particular means, whether legal or other, to effect a
political purpose, and in carrying that out assumed a system of
military organisation, it was the bounden duty of the Govern-
ment to interfere. With respect to the proclamation which
had been issued before the Clontarf meeting, he should say
the assertion that the Government had kept this proclamation
back for any sinister motive, or for the purpose of putting
down the meeting by force, was erroneous; but still ke thought
it very unfortunate that a proclamation to Put down
a meeting appointed for Sunday had been only issued
at three o'clock on the Saturday, the more particularly as
the people were coming from various and distant parts of the
country. Lord de Grey only arrived in Ireland on Friday, and
the proclamation was issued on Saturday. Ile (Lord lliont-
eagle) thought this was a lack of decision en the part of the
members composing her Majesty's Government, and he would
ask was this the manner in which such a measure should have
been adopted ? Why, he should ask, had not the Government,
through the medium of some of its organs amongst the press,
caused an intimation to be given to the people of the intention
to suppress this meeting at an earlier period—in fact at the
moment it was first determined upon ? Again, he thought it
most unfortunate for the Government, that the sheet of the
jury list, which had been so frequently referred to, and caused so
much excitement, had been lost. He thought it was most
essential for the interests and peace of Ireland, that there
should be an amalgamation of all parties in that country. With
respect to the Landlord and Tenant Commission, he was fully
aware of the many difficulties by which it was surrounded ;
but ho was, at the same time, convinced that the Commis-
sioners was bound to turn their attention to the
social condition of the people of Ireland , and he
thought that no subject was of more importance than that of
affording instruction to the people in agricultural science, in-
asmuch as a highly industrious class of persons were unable to
make available the resources of the country. He also thought
it most advisable that a State provision should be afforded to
the Roman Catholic clergy; and also that the College of May-
nooth should be placed upon a higher footing, for by these
means, and these alone,they would insure the admission of higher
class persons to the ministry of that Church.
The Duke of WELLINGTON then rose, but gave way to
The Earl of RIPON, who said, that after the speeches made
on the other side of the House, hardly any explanation was
necessary of the conduct of ;he Government. The Noble Lord
who had just sat down was evidently satisfied botk with the
past conduct of the Government, and with the measures they
intended to propose. His (the Earl of Ripon's) Noble Friesni
in introducing this motion remarked, that it was not at all sur-
prising that the people of Irelaud should not place confidence
in her Majesty s Ministers. The ground upon which he
made this remark was, that while there were three Scotehmen
in the Cabinet, he could not discover a single Irishman with
the exception of his Noble Friend near him (the Duke of
Wellington) ! It was rather singular that when Lord Grey's
Government was in power, the Noble Marquis
did not discover that such a Government e,ould not
possess the confidence of the Irish people, for there
was no Irishman in that Cabinet.—(Hear, hear.) The
appointment of a noble relative of his (Lord Ripon) had been
alluded to, as one not calculated to give satisfaction to the
people of Ireland. There was one question upon which his
noble relative (I.ord de Grey) had ever entertained the
strongest opinion, in which he had differed from his political
friends, and differed from his family, and that was the Catholic
question. He (Earl Ripon) said that was prima facia
proof of his Noble relative being calculated to conciliate the
Irish people. His Noble Friend, in supporting the Catholic
claims, had not popularity in view, for the question at that
time was not a popular one in that House. Ne, he
acted upon a principle of justice, and gave those claims
his hearty support. He therefore thought that her
Majesty's Government had properly chosen him as
a biti
the
peen enerc.ss t
ani
Ten Chief
likely
dhere fair
w to
s si
Secretary,
rnitdi
division
hs administeriaeosnn the
well
eltfl
with
oonrpvoe
wsnrpinneomenwt government
between
hiso%hf, e
ei
slnrf
Nobleee
el
the
hinnedFg
feelings
Lord
heonaar
dddn
o
e
bltsfßioraeaai Lieutenant
mebosrnanoleeydisttoLihoiieatrihftdeterminationrithate soneaynoNi nmeadani
nntppblot
and Mr,
eto,eAaa
RelativeianCeirntoi h.
mnd
impassiblei
gsese f
ein retneither
iheite Secretary.c(aahxhdnEt.ttrheaerjarveldbaederu for
Jackson
eeTephondenonehnntenhco:
amoi
appointments
ratwnvculffi would
opinions
piucsootihdnte
aidsi
that
eithera with we w undertaketeo aar
ftsenfiA
thl treahhimrsne:
Ireland. There was no doubt that Mr. Baron Lefroy had
strong political opinions. He had often expressed those opinions
in Parliament. He (Earl Ripon) did not say whether
those opinions were right or wrong, he disagreed with may of
them, but ho believed that Mr. Baron Lefroy wits a fair and
honest man, uncorrupted, and perfectly incmruphble. file was
a man whose justice on the bench nobody had ever ventured to
impugn. Was it to be said that because a wan had entertained
strong political opinions that, therefore, be ought not to be
appointed to a seat on the judicial bench? What then was the
objection made to Mr. Sergeant Jackson ? Why, that he was
a great opponent to the national education sehenae. Were
they come to such a pass that a man's opiniorea were
to be a bar to his advancement; in his profession.?
Why this was nothing but proscription if such a principle wbre
to obtain. Mr. Sergeant Jackson had, it appeared, made an
excellent judge, and yet exception was taken to his appotnt-
ment. This exception, too, was taken by those who supported
that party who had offered the Chief Judgeship to one who
had lately been placed in an unenviable position. Then with
respect to the elevation of Mr. Holt Waring, to which so
much objection had been offered. Their Lordships would re-
collect the time when Parliament came to strong resolutions on
the subject of the Orange Societies. The moment the wishes
of Parliament were expressed that those institutions should
be dissolved there was not a man to be found
in Ireland more earnest, or more zealous, amongst
those over whom they exercised influence than Mr. Holt
Waring was with those with whom he possessed any influence
to induce them to abandon at once all such institutions. He
(the Earl of Ripon) thought that this was quite sufficient to
wipe away all recollection of his connection with such institu-
tions. He thought he had said sufficient for the refutation of
the charge which had been brought against his noble relative
of maladministration of his office. He would turn to the sub-
ely,
ject to which the Noble Marquis had referred
dsDtahiDublin,
b lldsioenhant,
eta
whichrrtl
determination
ei
hardly
taoh,
knownnam
the late trials in Ireland. He thought that with respect to
this matter, the speech of his Noble Friend, who
had spoken last, was a complete acquittal of the
Government. He had said that the Government
had done right in not acting before they had done, and in
taking steps when they did. Here, thee, were two of the
charges against the Government got rid of. But his Noble
Friend complained of the number of days that elapsed between
the time the Government became aware of the proclamation
that issued from the Corn Exchange, with respect to the re-
peal cavalry, and the issuing the proclamation. His Noble
Friend, to show what he considered was delay on the part of
the Government, referred to the course Mr. Canning adopted
respecting an expedition to Portugal. It was per-
ntfheiente tuhreuved,aya as
received
followingth e Noble
th Le intelligenceo rtdroohpasd
wereos stated, te dr,e
Friday,a
ready
yat
t Mr.
andem bCaar
onkn-.
o
The Noble Lord forgot that all these arrangements were made
in London, to be acted upon in London. But the eattsimheoenaordfcesoittmdhheee:
o
be-
I beg your pardon, that
dfstpohoir
rffarTei sesnhert esnehLhnteicGniel Aaadotroi:tq'ntneuor
trials.rhi tnsnhamede oye t-n t time.Nbe' 'e'onaesßar atclisltitieffAhdfeoarNuredpnßlobtrynee lef—jaonnnr
came firms your Noble Colleague.
The Earl of RIPON—Yes, but that will not do. It was
said the Attorney-General was not known out of the law-courts
in Ireland.

Lord CAMPBELL—Your Noble Colleague said that he
had not heard of his name.

The Earl of RIPON said it was not to be a reproach to the
Government that they did not know all at once w hat were the
legal qualifications of all the gentlemen of the Irish bar. The
idea was absurd. Why, Mr. Whiteside, one of the counsel for
the traversers, in whom the traversers must have placed the
most implicit confidence, inasmuch as that gentleman was a
Conservative in politics ; he, in his speech to the jury, stated
that the speech of the Attorney-General was characterised by
great fairness and talent.
Lord CAMPBELL—That is a lawyer's compliment.
The Earl of RIPON—The Noble and Learned Lord says
that is a lawyer's compliment.
The LORD CHANCELLOR—Yes, they oftep compliment
upon talent, but not upon fairaela.—( Laughter.)

The Earl of RIPON continued—A great deal had been
said about the missing sheet, containing the names of special
jurors. Why, the person who actually lost, or nsislaid, that
sheet, was a Roman Catholic.—( Hear, hear.) Yet the loss
of the sheet was brought, not certainly as a direct charge
against the Government, but as a matter of grave suspicion.
He had said more than he intended when he rose to address
their Lordships. He was happy to find that the measures
which her Majesty's Government intended to pursue had met
with the approbation of Noble Lords opposite. He would not
pretend to say what would be the result of those measures, but
at present no opposition had been expressed with respect to
them, but, on the contrary, they had met with the approbation
of all parties. He anticipated the most salutary results.
After the Noble Earl sat down there was a pause of some
minutes; there was a general expectation that either Lord
Campbell, the Lord Chancellor, or Lord Brougham, would
have risen, but no manifestation of such an intention was made
by either of them. Lord Brougham and Lord Camp-
bell were both in the House ; but the Lord Chan-
cellor was absent ; and the Earl of Shaftesbury,
occupied the Woolsaek. The pause still continuing, and no
Noble Lord rising to speak, while the Noble mover of the re-
solution also remained silent, the House grew impatient, and
there were loud cries of " Question" and " Divide." At this
moment a Noble Lord conveyed an intimation to the Marquis
of Normanby that the Lord Chancellor did not intend to speak
upon the question at all.
The House still being impatient,
The Earl of SHAFTESBURY put the question.
The Marquis of NORMANBY then rose to reply on his
motion. He said, as he had understood that the Noble and
Learned Lord en the Woolsack intended to address the House,
as it was very natural be should wish to do, he had waited for
some minutes, in order that he might have an opportunity of
doing so. But he had received an intimation from a Noble
Lord near him, that it was not the intention of the
Noble and Learned Lord to address any observations
to the House. lie, therefore, now rose to make such observa-
tions in reply as might appear necessary, in answer to the
speeches that had been made on the other side. Before ho did
even this, he would make one general observation with respect
to some remarks that had been made on the doubtful natnre
of the motion. The Noble Lord at the head of
the Admiralty had described the motion as so in-
definite that he could not conceive but that he
had some previous interest in framing it in such a
shape. He assured them that the present motion was the only
one he ever intended to make. It was true that it was founded
Upon general principles—principles that might be adopted by
many Noble Lords who did not agree with him in politics, and
that it was framed differently from the motion made in the
other House of Parliament. But it was so framed, because it
was not usual to move their Lordships to go into a commission
of the whole House.
The LORD CHANCELLOR, having entered the House
while the Noble Marquis was speaking, here interrupted him
by saying, " Now, can I address the House now ?"
The Marquis of NORMANBY—ReaIIy, my Lords, after
the intimation made to me that the Noble and Learned Lord
did not intend to speak, and not having risen to reply till I re-
ceived that intimation, I think it strange that the Noble and
Learned Lord should ask me if he could address your Lord-
ships now. Having waited for some minutes to give him an
opportunity of speaking, and his Lordship not having risen, I
am not much informed of the usages of your Lordships' House,
if he has now any means of addressing you. The Noble and
Learned Lord cannot address your Lordships now ; my Noble
Friends around me will bear me out in saying that it was with
the utmost unwillingness I rose to reply ; and now when I am
explaining the purport of my motion, the Noble and Learned
Lord asks me, " Now, can I address the House now ?"
A NOBLE Loan—The Lord Chancellor can speak.
The Marquis of NORMANBY (with great warmth)—lle
cannot speak now ; and I can only say if he does do so, it will
be taking a most unfair advantage of me.--( Hear, hear, and
Oh, oh.) I waited till an intimation was conveyed to me by a
Noble Friend that the Noble Lord would not speak, and ,then,
exercising the privilege of every mover of a motion, I am now
addressing your Lordships. If the Noble and Learned Lord
wishes to make any remarks on the question, it is in his power
to do it ; and if a majority of your Lordships bear him out in
it, I will say it will be a most unheard-of proceeding.—( This
was said with great energy, the Noble Marquis evidently being
much excited. )
Lord KENYON rose to order. The right the Noble Mar-
quis claimed was by no means an invariable one ; it was not an
invariable rule that a Noble Lord could:not make a speech on the
question after the mover of a resolution had replied. But if
the Noble Marquis understood that the Noble and Learned
Lord did not mean to speak, he must confess he had a right to
feel disappointed.
The Marquis of NORMANBY—I do not think the Noble
Lord has spoken to order.
Lord BROUGHAM—It is to order.—(Hear, hear, and
cheers.) My Noble and Learned Friend has not heard any
argument.
The Earl of RADNOR called the Noble and Learned Lord
to order.—(Cheering. Hear, hear, and great laughter.)
Lord BROUGHAM—I speak to order. I entirely agree
with the Noble and Learned Baron who spoke from
the cross benches (Kenyon). There is no rule of
your Lordships' House that gives a natural right to the maker
of a motion to close tile debate, and if we do not oppose this
new doctrine, it will have to be met hereafter, when it may
not be so convenient. The courtesy of the House—contrary
to the rule and order which prohibits two speeches from one
Noble Lord during one debate, gives a reply to the mover of a
resolution. But if I have heard it once, I have heard it a
hundred times, that members of your Lordship's House have
spoken after the reply. I have myself been replied to by half
a dozen of your Lordships after a reply.
The LORD CHANCELLOR rose, and in a voice that be-
trayed the excitement under which he spoke, said—My Lords,
I wish to explain my position. I have been in my Court from
ten o'clock this morning till nearly four ; I have sat here from
five o'clock till nine, awaiting the return of the
Noble Earl (Shaftesbury) ; the Noble Earl having
arrived, I quitted the Woolsack only for five
minutes, and during that period the question was put, and the
Noble Marquis rose to reply.—( Hear, hear.) I have no desire
whatever to address your Lordships ; the only reason why I
should have wished to address a few words to your Lordships
was that they might be explanatory of my own conduct, in con-
sequence of the imputations that have been cast on me.
(Hear, hear.) But I have been so nobly, so warmly, so heartily,
defended by my Noble Friends—(Loud cheers)—that I shall
never regret the accusations made against me. I have waited
till this late hour in the evening, expecting that some of my
Noble and Learned Friends would have risen for the purpose of
giving their opinions on the subject, intending to reply to them.
As they have not done so, my Lords, I am quite satisfied with
the decisive and triumphant arguments put forward by my
Noble Friends, in opposition to the charges made by the Noble
Marquis.—( Loud cheers. )
The Marquis of NORMANBY said he was glad the Noble
and Learned Lord had stated the grounds on which he wished
to have addressed the House. The facts of the case were, that
a message was brought him by a Noble Lord, that the Noble
and Learned Lord would not speak. The Noble Earl on the
Woolsack (Shaftesbury) then insisting that the question should
be put, he rose to reply.
The LORD CHANCELLOR—I did not intend to reply,
except in answer to my Noble and Learned Friends.—( Hear,
hear.) (His Lordship here began to put the question to the
House, as if for immediate division.)
The Marquis of NORMAN BY (with great energy)—My
Lords, I appeal even to those most opposed to me in politics, to
say if ever there was a more unfair proceeding.—( Hear, hear,
and cheers, from the Opposition.) I was addressing your
Lordships, having first insisted on my right to do so. I then
gave way, because the Noble and Learned Lord seemed to wish
to defend himself. I sat down to give him (an opportunity of
doing so, and he then puts the question.—( Hear.)
The LORD CHANCELLOR—I beg to set the Noble
Marquis right. I said I did not wish to defend myself; on
the contrary, I said I did not intend to do so, considering it
unnecessary, after the admirable defence made by my Noble
Friends.—( Cheers. )
The Marquis of NORMANBY then proceeded with the
reply on his motion, which had been so long interrupted. With
respect to this motion, remarks had been thrown out to the
effect that it was couched in terms less strong than was at
first intended. He had framed it according to the usage of
their Lordships' House. It was a motion for an inquiry into
the state of Ireland, with a view to restore confidence in
the Government to the people of that country. He
thought that every measure calculated to restore this con-
fidence was worthy of their consideration and inquiry. He
adverted first to the state of the Church in Ireland as a cause
of dissatisfaction. As a first. step to remove this feeling, they
ought to elevate the character of the Catholic priests, and re-
move the disqualifications which the Emancipation Act inflicted
on the Catholic prelates. The discontent caused by the re-
striction of the franchise he eharged directly on the Govern
ment ; a new arrangement of the representation of Ireland, as it
was settled by Lord Castlereagh at the union, was rendered
necessary by the Reform Bill in Ireland, which disturbed the
relative proportions of the representation of the two countries,
He charged the Government with a general ignorance of the
present state of Ireland; with the exception of the illustrious
Duke, not one of the Government had any knowledge of that
country; he had noticed the exception that was made of
Sir R. Peel; he was there only in other days.—( A Noble
Lord, " Goulburn !") He defended what he had
said of the appointment of Lord Eliot, and re-
peated his charge of a disregard of public opinion
in the appointments of Baron Lefroy and Sergeant
Jackson to judicial situations. These appointments, the giving
all their clerical patronage to the most violent opponents of the
national education system, and the selection of the Attorney-
General, all proved that. ignorance of the state of public feel-
ing in Ireland of which he complained. He passed rapidly over
the circumstances connected with the proclamation against the
repeal meetings, stat ing that the Government was as much bound
to notice the first of them as the last, and affirming that the
preservation of the peace wasmainly owing to the exertions of
Mr. O'Connell himself, from whom they had the least right to
expect assistance. He was told that the motion was ill-timed;
whenever there was more than usual interest felt by the people
in the conduct of the Government, this was always the plea ;
it was the old answer. But he believed that one of the likeliest
means of restoring tranquillity to Ireland would be to adopt the
resolution. He denied that it was brought forward from any
wish to embarrass the Government; though he should not
have been deterred from doing what he considered to be his
duty by the fear of embarrassing it. Having replied to the as-
sertion made by Lord Roden, that they were then " reaping
the fruit of the wholesale discharge of the gaols" made during
his Government of Ireland, by showing that he remitted fewer
sentences than the Lord-Lieutenant of 1823, and having justified
his dismissal of Colonel Verner from the magistracy, (another
of the charges made against him) for giving as a toast the
" Battle of the Diamond," he proceeded to notice some of the
observations made by another Noble Lord (Howden) in the
course of his speech. He hesitated, however, to allude to them
in the absence of the Noble Lord, who was not in his place.--
( Cries of "Go on, go on.") The Noble Marquis still pausing
on account of the ahsence of the Noble Lord—
The LORD CHANCELLOR said—Speak of him, and
he'll appear.—(Great laughter. )
The Marquis of NORMAN BY then proceeded to notice the
speech of the Noble Lord he had alluded to, (while he was
commencing, Lord Howden entered the House from the
library, whence he had been summoned.) He repeated that
he had listened with great pleasure to the speech of the Noble
Lord, which, from its manner, was a very agreeable one. But
he had observed that nothing was more favourably received
than a very sharp thing said by any person against those with
hom he was supposed, to some extent, to agree.—( Hear. )
The Noble Lord said that the motion was brought on with a
particular object; be did not state what that object was. He
(the Marquis of Normanby) certainly would not attribute any
particular object to his Noble Friend, in making that remark.
Surely it was hardly worth the svhde of his Noble Friend, in
the remarks which he thought it his duty to make, to rake up
the old story of Mr. O'Connell about the old hat. That was
a story told somewhere about ten years ago, and it was intended
to apply to Earl Grey's Administration. Why it should be
used by the Noble Lord (Howden), of whose support that Go-
vernment, and other Liberal Governments, had had the benefit
in their policy towards Ireland, it was for the Noble Lord rather
than for him (Lord Normanby) to explain. Allusion had been
made to his (Lord Normanby's) conduct in respect to the
offer of the Mastership of the Rolls to Mr. O'Connell. He
(Lord Normanby) begged to say, that he had never for one
moment regretted making that offer. The only regret he had
ever experienced in reference to the matter was, that that
Honourable and Learned Member had thought fit to decline
accepting it. He most sincerely thought, that if Mr. O'Con-
nell had accepted that appointment, it would have been one
I-1
of the very best things that could happenedpossibly.ahaviLzwnthat
for
0
the prospective prosperity of Ireland.
wpold bean alluded d to, he would

have brought down to the House a document in
reference to the subject, being a letter he had
addressed at the time to the late lamented /11r. Drummond,
and which being found amongst his papers by his widow, had
been kindly forwarded to him a few days back. In that letter
would have been found, in the fullest terms, the reasons on
which he justified the offer that had been made, and the wide
distinction which he had drawn, and ever should draw, between
promoting a strong political partisan to a seat on the criminal
and a seat on the equity bench.--( Hear, hear.) He had to
express to the House the regret of a Noble and Gallant Friend
of his, the Marquis of Anglesea, at not having it in his power
to address the House upon this subject. The Noble Mamie
had been down on the last evening of the discussion,
and in the early part of the present, with the
intention of addressing the House, and nothing
but the extreme suffering which he was enduring
would have hindered him from so doing. His Noble Friend
had, however, desired him (Lord Normanby) to express his
cordial concurrence in the motion then before the House, and
his approval of those measures of justice and conciliation which
it was the wish of Noble Lords on that side of the House to see
proposed and agreed to by Parliament.—( Hear, hear.) Before
he sat down he wished to say one word as to the office of
Lord-Lieutenant of Ireland. There were persons—good and
sincere friends of Ireland—who were anxious to see the im-
mediate abolition of this office. He confessed that he was
not amongst this class. lie certainly looked upon that
office as an anomalous one, but he looked to
its abolition as the conciliating and crowning glory of those re-
medial measures which he still hoped to see enacted for Ire-
land.—( Hear, hear.) But it was his opinion that they begin
at the wrong end who wished to remove that office at present.
On looking back, he could not but admit the great prsctieal
benefit which had arisen from the office. When he turned to
the years which Lord Wellesley had passed there, he could not
do otherwise than recollect with grateful satisfaction how his
Viceroyalty had prepared the public mind for the relaxation
of all those restrictive laws which had subsequently been ob-
tained. And no one could doubt that during the Irish admi-
nistration of his Noble Friend behind him (Earl Fortescue)
that country had made rapid strides in the progress of civili-
sation.—( Bear.) In concluding the remarks he had thought
it his duty to make, he wished ho could en-
tertain any doubt as to the vote to which their Lord-
ships would come. As to what would ultimately be
the result of the legislation for Ireland, any ono who would
look back to the history of his own times—unless, indeed, there
should be an outbreak or civil war, the ultimate consequences
of which, even to the victor, not only in character, but in every
other respect, could only be conceived with horror—any one,
he said, who would look back to the last twenty years could
easily foresee. There must, and there would be, concessions
of a large and a comprehensive character.—(Cheers.) The
question was only one of time.—(Hear.) But these suspicions
might now, as 'before, be so long postponed by the ob-
stinacy and perverseness of that House and the Government,
that they, as in too many instances, by their tardiness, would lose
all their grace, and much of their good ; but he felt certain that
concession, and ample, liberal concession, must be the result—
( Hear, hear.) I say (concluded the Noble Lord) that upon
us, at this: side of the House, devolves the duty to induce the
people of Ireland to have patience, to bear meekly for a little
while, and not to give up hope, for, of the ultimate results we
have, and can have, no doubt ; but upon you, and you alone
(pointing to the Treasury Benches), rests the responsibility and
the consequences of delay.—( Cheers. )
Lord BROUGHAM—My Lords—(Cries of " Divide, di.
vide")-1 shall not detain your Lordship's more than a few
moments.—( Great uproar and cries of " No, no," " Divide,
divide.") My Lords, I only wish to say one word, one
word to your Lordships on the extraordinary, the
_very extra-
ordinary position in which we are placed. When a motion
was made the other night for an adjournment of this debate, I
opposed it. I opposed it, my Lords, because I thought it was
not desired by your Lordships, because I thought it unneces-
sary, totally unnecessary, since the debate could have been
easily closed that night. But I was told " No." I was told it
could not be closed, and I was further told that a Noble Lord,
to hear whom I would at any time make any sacrifice
whatever, wished to address your Lordships, and there-
fore, my Lords, I withdrew my opposition at once, and
very cheerfully consented to the adjournment. But my Noble
and Learned Friend (Lord Campbell) who moved the adjourn-
ment, who urged the adjournment, to whom Lyielded the ad.
journment, and who ought to have opened the debate this even-
ing, why, that Noble and Learned Lord has not spoken at
all ; but I don't mean to complain of that---( Shouts of laughter)
—there is in that no ground of complaint—(Great confusion
and peals of laughter)—but 1 merely wished to call your Lord-
ships attention to the extraordinary position we are
in, and to the fact that the debate might just as well
have been brought to a close on the other evening as on this.
—( Great laughter, amidst which Lord Brougham resumed his
seat on the Woolsack, which he had occupied nearly all the
evening. )
Lard CAMPBELL rose, somewhat excited, and, amidst
great uproar, and loud cries of " Divide. "—Nothing, my Lords,
said he, can be more irregular or more improper than the pro-
ceeding just adopted by the Noble and Learned Lord.--.
(Laughter.) But, my Lords, there is nothing at all sur-
prising in this—nothing surprising in anything the Noble and
Learned Lord does, for all his proceedings in this House are one
tissue of irregularities.—( Laughter.) I moved the adjourn.
ment, my Lords, because I thought the Noble and Learned
Lord would have addressed you, and it was, my intention to
have followed him in the debate.—(Laughter.) I cannot be
very much blamed for supposing that the Noble and Learned
Lord intended to address you, at least once in the course of the
debate—(Great laughter)—for I am sure (and I am under
your Lordships' correction in stating it) that this is the very
first debate, upon any subject whatever, that has taken place in
your Lordships' House, since the Noble and Learned Lord had
the honour of a seat in it, on which he has not
addressed you— (Cheers and laughter)—and I believe it will
be in your Lordships' recollection, as it is in my own, that upon
one occasion the Noble and Learned Lord spoke no less than
seven times.—(Shouts of laughter and great uproar.) What
I thought, too, my Lords, was, that the Noble and Learned
Lord on the oolsack would have addressed your Lordships, for
there was a msst serious charge advanced against the Govern-
ment for their conduct in the recent legal proceedings in
another place, and I naturally thought he would be
anxious to meet that charge, and to answer it, and if
passible repel it.—( Hear, hear.) But, my Lords, he has
neither spoken by himself, nor by his counsel.—(Greet
cheering and laughter.) He allows judgment to go by what
lawyers call nil dicet. I hope, my Lords, this will be some
excuse for me in your Lordships' eyes, for having moved this
adjournment.—(Laughter.) The Noble and Learned Lord
says he is not sorry that I have not spoken, and I believe him ;
but he may depend upon it, I will not remain silent, for
whenever he may choose to address your Lordships, he may
rest assured I will follow him—(Laughter)—and ' will
not fail to remind him of his departure—his entire and extra-
ordinary departure—from those principles, the advocacy and
support of which made him once the pride acd glory, nut only
of his own country. but of the world —(Great sensation)—of
those grand principles, for the triumph of which he onoe so
nobly battled with friends, whom it seems now to be his sole
aim to oppose.—( Great uproar.)

Lord :BROUGHAM ( with some warmth)—My Lords,
I have been charged with irregularities. A charge, my
Lords, more grossly untrue—(A burst of laughter)—more
grossly untrue, my Lords—( Continued laughter)—more grossly
unfounded, in point of fact, than that charge, it has never hap-
pened to me to hear, in the whole course of my life, even from
the Noble and Learned Lord who has so rashly ventured to asl-
vance it.—(Uproar, and cries of " Divide, divide.") My
Lords, I have a right, a perfect right, to address myself to your
Lordships on this debate now or whenever I like to do so.—
(Laughter.) The rule of Parliament, my Lords, the rule
of both the Houses constituting the 'Parliament of
this country, and I have sat a longer time—a far
longer time, my Lords, in both of them, than the Noble and
Learned Lord who assumes to know so much more about them

—( Great laughter)—is that every Meitiber has a right to
speak, and I have not spoken in the course of this debate. I
have a right to speak whenever I think proper—either !before
the Noble Marquis (Normanby) rose to reply, or after he had
resumed his seat—for it is by courtesy alone that a Member is
allowed to reply—( Hear, hear)—and now that he has replied,
I have a right to speak to the whole question, if, as I have said,
my Lords, I may think it right or expedient that I should do
so.—(Laughter.) That is ray undoubted privilege, my Lords,
and one which no taunts of ignorant—(Great uproar)—which,
I say, no taunts of ignorant new Nembers of Parliament, who
do not know even the A 13 C of the rules and privileges of this
House—who show a degree of ignorance which I had thought
it impossible for any person to display—no taunts whatever,
especially when used by such persons as these, shall deprive me
of my privileges as a Peer of Parliament.—(Cheers, and loud
laughter.) But, my Lords, I ought perhaps to confess that, in
now a second time addresing your Lordships, I am guilty
of irregulsrity.—( Shouts of laughter.) But is this an irre-
gularity without excuse, or without example in this Mouse,
my Lords? Is it not the rule—a very wise and useful rule
doubtless, my Lords—(Laughter)—of both Houses of Parliament,
to waive the strict interpretation of their laws if an individual
Member is unexpectedly charged with an offence, and to extend
to him every indulgence and facility for justification ?—(Hear,
hear.) And happy and rejoiced—most happy and most re-
joiced am I to find, my Lords, that for the first time in this
House the vile and false charge that I have changed my prin-
ciples, deserted my early opinions, and fallen away from my
friends, has been brought fairly forward against me—that those
with whom I have acted as a party man for so many years—to
me with no great advantage that I know of—(Laughter)—to
their own great advantage, it may be said also—to whom I was a
faithful, truthful, thoughtful, consistent, and unflinching sup-
porter—(Great. uproar)—that because I was compelled to
change my relations with them, when they ceased to hold those
opinions which for so great a length of time we had been ac-
customed to hold in common—as I have again and again had to
demonstrate in their presence, without a shadow of a pretext
for such change of opinion from any one of them—( Great
laughter and slight cheers)—happy am Ito find that this vile
and false charge is promised at last to be distinctly brought
against me. 1 defy, my Lords, any one of them
to substantiate the slightest change or inconsistency in me—
(Uproar)—and t will give them the opportunity of doing so,
depend upon it, now that they have selected the most powerful,
experienced, judicious, and discreet Lord as the only champion
whom they could call out of their ranks to bring against rae.—
(Uproar.) Yes, my Lords, if I can devise the means. and I
think I can do so, I will give to him, their counsel—( A Laugh)
an opportunity to bring his charges against me ; and I will
defy him and them to bring forward any one particular case in
which I have changed my opinions, or that I have abandoned any
principle that I have ever once maintained.—( Laughter.) The
challenge, my Lord, is a large and comprehensive one, and
the defiance is the same; but I throw out that defiance, with
the most perfect certainty that in the contest I must pre-
vail.—(Great uproar throughout the House.)

Lord CAMPBELL again rose, amid great noise, laughter,
and cries of " Divide," " Adjourn." He said—The House
need not be alarmed, for I will not detain it one moment.
Whenever my Noble and Learned Friend—(Cries of " Oh,
oh")—for such I will continue to call him, gives me
an opportunity of entering upon these topics when
a proper opportunity is offered me for going into them,
let him be assured I will not refuse, nor shrink from, the re-
sponsibility of maintaining, and of proving, everything that I
have stated.—( Loud cheers.) It may happen, perhaps, that
some others have changed, but whether he (Lord Brougham)
or they, is not now the proper time to decide.--( Hear, bear. )
When the opportunity, promised by the Noble and Learned
Lord is offered to me, I beg to assure him and the House, that
I certainly will not shrink from going into the question, and
maintaining the position I have taken up.—( Cheers. )
The LORD CHANCELLOR—My Lords, before your
Lordships proceed to a division, I have one observation to
make.--( Hear, hear.) It has been said that a grave charge
was brought in the course of this debato against the Govern-
ment in respect of certain law proceedings which have been in-
stituted against certain parties in another place. My Lords, I
have never heard such charge made, 'and, therefore, there is
nothing that I have felt myself called upon to notice.ein this
discussion. Such charges as were brought by the N_Ol,Ll
Mar-
quis (Nermanby) against her Majesty's Government for their
most satis•
administration of justice in Ireland, I consideer w
factorily answered by my NefobtleheFFirieeanrddseth
Council and the President
cellent speeches.--( Hear, •
) our Or ips, bat hal a
qFLor that
dh . reason, and
_.being
uest fwTurP President
idne
t htdet of
d r Clottnh y-e
faebeslenctaalltedth eupomnomtoent
addresswhei ue atr)h,
in respect to. legal points in the
recent trials, I should certainly have been read
conductcharges beefetnhme adTehautp
explanation I have to give.
t o
The House
iosn theus
ohuesme.then divided, when there appeared•—
Contents present
Proxies ~,, I, limits. 39

.%4

I

Not Contents present .. 79
Prox'es _
- - —175

-.-
Majority against the Motion ...... —97
The motion was consequently lost.
Their Lordships then aljourned till to-morrow.

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London: Longman, Brown, Green, and Longmans.

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