The Sun.
London, England, 1821-03-20 00:00:00

applied ?—The timber from the north of Europe almost exclusively to good build-
ings : of late years American timber has almost superseded the use of northern
timber, in contract and slight buildings.
VV hat do you conceive, as far as your trade is concerned, to be the proportion of
that inferior timber which is applied to inferior purposes, to that of the better de-
scription of timber which is applied to the better purposes ?—The market has been
so operated upon oflate years, that it is hardly possible to answer the question.
Are there any purposes for which the inferior kind of timber brought from Ame-
rica answers as well as the superior kind from the north of Europe ?—For inferior
purposes certainly, and for some superior purposes even better.
Can you state at all the extent or magnitude of those purposes in which it answers
as well or better ?—The consumption of London for packing cases; for mouldings,
' not merely mouldings for rooms, but for cast iron work and a variety of purposes,
its magnitude and width gives it a great advantage over the smaller and narrower
timber of the Baltic and Norway.
Also for the purposes of ships' masts ?—I am not much in that line.
Would it answer for scaffolding ?—No, I apprehend it would not answer for
that; it is too short; I mean brittle.
What proportion of the consumption of the timber that is used in this country
do you conceive to be applied to those inferior purposes ?—The price of the last
year has so operated, that I should think three-fourths, but I speak merely from
conjecture; my consumption is principally for the larger description, and for
better buildings; but I should say, speaking generally, that three-fourths used the
last year have been American.
What proportion does that wood, applicable to those purposes, and for which it
is as good or better than northern timber, bear to the general consumption and im-
port of the country ?—A fourth or a fifth I should say; I speak with reference to
the consumption of London and its neighbourhood.
Do you conceive that if the timber from the North and the timber from Ame-
rica can be brought into the market at the same expense for those purposes, the
American timber would still have the preference ?—I think it would, for those
special purposes.
Can you state what effect the imposition of "the high duties produced upon your
trade?—lt filled our pockets in the first instance, and of late years has emptied
them.

Be so good as to explain in what way this happened ?—Our stocks in band were
increased in value by the addition of the duty, and subsequently they have fallen
again, by the introduction of American timber, which is without duty, which has
brought northern produce in some measure below its proper or natural level.
What effect was produced on your trade by the imposition of the high duties?
—Probably it introduced one moiety of American produce; to other timber-mer-
chants it must have done a great deal more.
Did it, in the same proportion, reduce your import of timber from the North?
—Unquestionably.
Do you apprehend that the same effect has taken place generally in the trade,
that took place in your particular business?—l believe to a much larger extent
with others than with ourselves.
State the reason.—Because our demands are principally for the best buildings,
and the best purposes,
What effect do you apprehend would now be produced by an alteration or re-
duction of the duties on the timber from the north of Europe ?—I think, generally
speaking, a very beneficial effect to the public in general.
In what way?—Timber would not be applied improperly, that is, American
timber would not be used where it ought not, as it now is.
Do you apprehend that it would be likely to produce a great increase of the
import from the northern ports of Europe?.—l have not a doubt of it.
Do you believe that the effect of the imposition of duties has been to force out
of consumption a great deal of the timber from the north of Europe, which ought
to be applied to the better purposes of the country ?—I am quite sure of it.
Do you believe that the consequence of that has been to make the buildings,
and other things to which it is applied, less solid and less durable than they would
otherwise have been?— Unquestionably.
You have stated, that the present duties on Baltic timber have forced a great
deal of it out of consumption; do you know in what proportion the consumption
of Baltic timber in this country has been roduced?—No; excepting looking at
the tables; the general public tables.
Have you looked, since you gave your evidence in the House of Lords, at the
official returns, printed in the Appendix to their Report?-1 have.
Have you not found, by those returns, that the imports from the Baltic, so far
from having diminished, as you stated, within the two last years, have very much
increased ?—I do not think that is the fact.
In your evidence before the Committee of the House of Lords, you were asked,
" Whether the sale of Baltic timber has continued to diminish within the last two
or three years ;" to which you replied, '• Certainly ; when I spoke before, I spoke
of the quantity altogether; the American has superseded the Baltic timber, the
price is so much lower:" Have you read the official returns of the quantities of
timber imported from the Baltic, and do you not find the result to be, that so far
from having diminished within the last two years, they have considerably in-
creased ?—The price was so low, it might,,in bulk, have caused a greater con-
sumption ; in value certainly not.
In your answer here, you say you speak of the quantity altogether?—So I do
still.

The official returns are as to quantity, not as to price; has not the quantity in-
creased from all the northern powers of Europe, instead of diminishing ?—As far as
my knowledge goes, I am satisfied it must be quite the contrary; and I am sure
those tables must be constructed on some principle of taking either an eight-feet
deal as a twenty-feet deal, or the bulk in someway that they must be quite irregular.
Do you not find, that the quantity of fir timber from Norway, imported in the
year 1816 was 10,239 load; in 1817, 15,501 load; in 1818, 26,257 load; and
in 1819, 24,759 load?—I am quite sure then, that it must be the entering up of
cargoes for the duty, and not the importation of them in the port of London.
You speak of your knowledge with respect to your own trade, and the trade in
the port of London?—l speak of my own knowledge principally; of what I my-1
self am concerned in; I cannot speak generally, because I do not know generally.
Has not the price of timber from North America fallen, as well as the price of
timber from the Baltic?—lt has.

Would not that tend to encourage the additional consumption of Baltic timber,
in the same proportion as that of timber from North America ?—I am not quite
sure of that.

Has not the fall of price produced by the competition between timber from those
different parts of the world, been advantageous to the public ?—I have no doubt to
the consumer, excepting as before stated that it has caused the introduction of
American timber to improper purposes.

Is not that the fault or -want of judgment of the parties applying it?—People
are often deceived ; you may have to pay so much a foot for timber which you sup-
pose to be Baltic timber, when in fact it is American; and it is covered up, and
you know no better.

Would any builder or surveyor of respectability impose in that manner upon gen-
tlemen who employed him ?-1t is impossible almost to detect it ; who is to watch
every stick of timber put into a building ? it can be detected by experiment ; but if
1 were to produce the specimens, they would not be known in the first instance.
Is it not the duty of professional gentlemen to see that proper timber is employ-
ed ?—They are not always employed; and it would be impossible when the timber
is converted in the carpenter's yard, for them to know that improper timber has
been employed; when it is in the roof of a building they cannot see that each in-
dividual stick is Baltic timber.

You have stated in your evidence before the Lords, that you have scarcely ever
known a ship built of. Norway timber to have the dry rot ?—I have.

Have you seen the Danish sloop of war the Little Belt, which has lately been
broken up at Battersea ?—I have not ; but she I believe was not Norway built;
she was Danish.

Do not the Danes use Norway timber in the construction of their vessels ?—I
believe not ; very little timber is imported from Norway to Copenhagen.
From whence do they bring their timber to Copenhagen ?—Principally from the
Baltic.

As you state Canada timber and American timber generally to be peculiarly
subject to the dry rot, may not that arise in a great measure from its being floated
down the rivers both in deals and in timber, and shipped in that state in the heat of
an American summer, and in that heated state crossing the Atlantic in the hold of
the ship ?—I believe that the first principles of that vegetation are acquired from
that circumstance.

You would consider deals which have been floated down previous to being shipped,
more liable to infection than timber ?—Nearly equally so, for the bulk of timber
generally in an American ship, gives it an equal degree of sweating : 1 have seen
two cargoes of pitch pine timber affected to the heart with dry rot as they were
discharged from the ship; that is now seven or eight years ago.
May not that have happened from the timbers having been decayed before it
was cut, in some instances ?-2-I think otherwise, and indeed I learnt otherwise on
making an inquiry, that it was the length of the period it remained from capture
.or some circumstances ; it remained above a twelvemonth heated in the ship.
Do you recollect any instances in which timber has remained a considerable
time on board ships coming from the North ?—I do.

Have you observed the same effects ?—Yes, I have; but not to an equal extent.
Is the effect of the confinement of timber during a long voyage frequently inju-
sious to the timber ? I have no question of that, when it has been taken in with
moisture; moisture is, I am satisfied, the principal cause of dry rot.
Ave you of opinion, that the pine of the north of Europe is in general better sea-
soned before it is shipped than the pine of North America? lam very much in-

clined to think it is ; but I have no positive knowledge, excepting in Norway, where
I have been, and seen the circumstances of its being shipped.
Judging from the relative appearance of the timber of the north of Europe and
of America, when landed here, would you be of that opinion generally, that the one
was better seasoned than the other before shipping? I have no doubt as to the
Norway timber, because I have known it, but I am not so sure about that parti-
cularly at Memel; I think from thence it has come greener, deals especially.
Is not the timber of Memel in general much better squared than the timber of
the North American Colonies? Certainly.
Therefore, is there not reason to suppose, that the inferior part of the timber,
which might more immediately introduce decay, is taken away in the squaring?
It comes with very little sap, which more readily holds the moisture.
Then are you of opinion, that if the timber of America was equally well squared
and cleaned, it would be less subject to decay? Ido not think that has much to do
with it, because the pine has very little sap.

Have you been long acquainted with yellow pine as an article of importation to
this country? Yes, I have.
For what number of years? Twelve or fourteen at least. .
Have you during that period had occasion to know yellow pine used for the or-
dinary purposes of house building, where it was not particularly exposed to damp,
or shut closely up? Yes, I have.
In such circumstances, have you found it durable and lasting, or subject to pre-
mature decay? Twelve years is a very limited period indeed for the decay of
timber, but I certainly have observed its failure. It generally comes cleaner than

the Baltic timber; but where the knots appear, the knot of the white spruce gets
loose, and of the yellow pine it appears through the paint, notwithstanding all the