The Sun.
London, England, 1828-01-30 00:00:00

HOUSE OF COMMONS.

The Gallery was opened at half-past one o'clock
this day, and in a few minutes every seat was oc-
cupied. There has not been the slightest alteration
made in the appearance or decorations of the House
during the Recess. The Speaker entered the House
precisely at two o'clock, and took his place at the
-table. At this period there were about forty mem-
bers present.
Soon after Sir T. Tyrwhit, the Usher of the
Black Rod, appeared, and in the name of the Lords
Commissioners appointed by his Majesty, requested
the attendance of this House in the House of Lords.
The Speaker, accompanied by all the Members
present, then proceeded to the House of Lords,
where the King's speech was read by Commission.
The Speaker returned, and took the Chair pre-
cisely at four o'clock.
The SPEAKER then acquainted the House,
that in pursuance of the Act of Parliament, since the
last Session lie had directed warrants to be issued
for electing new Members for the City of Car-
lisle, vacant by the death of Sir P. Musgrave ; for
the Borough of Yarmouth, in the room of Lord
Binning, now Lord Melross ; for the Borough of
Seaford, in the room of the Right Hon. George
Canning, deceased ; for the County of Lanark,
in the room of Lord Archibald Hamilton, deceased;
for the Borough of Maldon, in the room of the
Hon. George Winn, deceased, and for the County
of Cork, in the room of Lord Ennismore, deceased.
A number of new Members were then called to
the table, and sworn.

REFORM IN THE LAW COURTS.
Mr. BROUGHAM gave notice that on the 7th
February he would move for an inquiry into the
state of the law in this country, and the administra-
tion of justice in the different Courts, with a view
to a reform of the abuses which have crept in by

COURT OF CUANCERY.
Mr. M. ANGELO TAYLOR gave notice, that
on the 30th of next month, he would move for cer-
tain returns respecting the Court of Chancery, pre-
vious to a general motion on the subject. •

NEW WRITS.
Mr. PLANTA moved for writs for Harwich, in
the room of Mr. Herries, who had accepted the
office of Chancellor and Treasurer of his Majesty's
Mint; for Liverpool, in the room of Mr. Huskisson,
one of his Majesty's Principal Secretaries of State; for
the University of Oxford, in the room of Mr. Peel,
one of his Majesty'z Principal Secretaries of State.
For the County of Inverness, in the room of the
Right Hon. Charles Grant, President of the Board
of Trade.
For the City of Armagh, in the room of the
Right Hon. i.--lenry Goulburn, Chancellor of the
Exchequer.
For the County of Monmouth, in the room of
the Right Hon. Granville Somerset, one of the
Commissioners of the Treasury.
Ver the Borough of Ennis, in the room of Mr.
Franklem.; Lewis, Vice President of the Board of
Trade.
For the Borough of f:'.faselmere, in the room of
Sir J. Becket, the Advocate General,
For the Borough of Ashfield, in thi room
of Mr. Sturges Bourne, Chief Commissioi:e;.•
of the Wooda and Forests, and for the Borough of
Lynn, in the ,ro.orn of Lord Wm. Bentinck, who has
accepted the Chiltern Hundreds.
Writs were also moved for the Borough of Wey-
mouth, in the room of the Right Hon. Thomas Wal
lace, called to the House of Peers, by the title of
Lord Wallace.
For the Borough of Rippon, in the room of Sir
Launcelot Shadsvell, who has accepted the office of
Vice-Chancellor.
And, for the county of Durham, in the room of
Mr.
I..arribton now Lord Durham.
Z.,QIIOUGH OF PENRYN.
Lord 30111 i itl ESEP. gave notice that on
Thursday next he would move fo:s. !e4ye.to bring in
a bill to disfranchise the borough of Peniyn, ar,d,
transfer the franchise to Manchester.

cOnPORATION AND TEST ACTS.
Lord JOHN RUSSELL gave notice that on the
21st of February he v.'3.ald. move for leave to bring
in a bill for the repeal of the Corporation and Test
Acts. (Loud cheers.)
THE ADDRESS.

The Speech was then read from the Chair, for
Which see our paper a yesterday.
Mr. JENKINSON rose to move the Address.

lie came forward under very considerable difficulty
and embarrassment, arising from reflections pressing
on his mind on the state of his noble brother. That
noblemen had held a situation of the first eminence
in the country, from which, unfortunately, he had
been removed by a circumstance that it was impossi•
ble for him (Mr..J.) to allude to without the most pain-
ful feelings. The devotion and attachment of Lord
Liverpool to the welfare of his country, had no doubt
contributed to effect the overthrow of those faculties
which had so long been exerted with beneficial effect
to the service of his King and country.—(Hear.)—
He (Mr. Jenkinson) oppressed as he was by these
considerations, felt himself bound to advert to
another loss which the nation had sustained in the
death of a Statesman and Minister whose eloquence
had often been heard within those walls, and
for whom he entertained most profound admira-
tion. With respect to the form r, it was to
him a very delicate subject; but confident that that
Nobleman had acquired, by his long and meritorious
services, the respect and esteem of his colleagues,
and the country, he could not raisin from offering
his imperfect regret to his great merits. He had
introduced this mention of his poor brother, because he was
aware that his name possessed deserved weight in that
House, and because he was anxious to communicate his
brother's sentiments upon a subject highly important; and
interesting at this time to the country at large.—( Hear.)—
There was another subject to which he could not but
advert upon this occasion—he meant the death of that
great and eloquent statesman the late Mr. Canning, whose
splendid powers had frequently elicited the admiration of
that House, and who had gained much of the confidence of
Lord Liverpool. Lord Liverpool had often expressed his
great admiration of the talents of that lamented statesman.
Their early recollections and their close and intimate friend-
ship bound them together. He (Mr. J.) never could for-
get the many eloquent displays with which that distin-
guished man had often delighted and surprised the Members
of that House.—(Hear.)—Having now disposed of two
great persons, for he might, he thought, be allowed to call
his brother a great man,—(Hear)—and in fairness, no one
would dispute the application of such an epithet to the late
Mr. Canning,—he could not bat allude to the Administra-
tion which had been lately formed.—(Hear.) Indeed, the
consideration of that subject was naturally suggested by the
mention of his brother's name, as the present Administra-
tion embodied the sentiments and principles which had for
such a long period characterized his brother's Government.
—(Hear.) Under this view of the matter, he trusted that
the House would not consider that lie had, in the allusion

to his brother, trespassed too far upon their attention.—
(Hear, bear.) He had done so, actuated by those feelings
of affection which might be supposed to animate a bro-
ther's breast; he conceived himself doubly called upon to
do so, from his respect to this House, and the country at
large, who were no doubt anxious to ascertain the senti-
ments and feelings expressed by his brother regarding the
present state of affairs.—(Hear.) With the general for-
mation of the Administration, for the return of whose
members writs had been this day moved, Lord Liverpool's
sentiments mainly accorded.—(hear.)—He considered it
as one embodying all the true interests and real feelings
of the country. if it did not contain the names of
all those to whom Lord Liverpool was dearly attached,
it contained the name of a man to whom be was long
attached, whom he had been the first to introduce to
this House and the management of public. affairs, and
who long enjoyed his undivided confidence. Need he
(Mr. Jenkinson) say that he meant the late Member
for Oxford (Mr. Peel), who now again filled the same
situation in his Majesty's councils as when first introdu-
ced there by Lord Liverpool? Mr. Peel was then,
as he is now, Secretary of State for the home De-
partment,. and never were there two men between whom
more unbounded confidence and unanimity existed upon
every practical subject, than Lord .Liverpool and Mr.
Pesl.—(Hear, hear. )--With the knowledge of that fact, he
(Mr. Jenkinson) presumed he was not wrong in supposing,
what, indeed, be had every reason for supposing—that Lord
I.iverpool approved of the great body of the existing Admi-
nistration.—(Hear, hear. )--Upon this particular and im-
portant point, he (Mr. Jenkinson) could speak with cons-
dence.—(Hear. )—He now begged leave to inform the
(louse, and he made the statement upon the authority of his
Lordship, that the present Administration had Lord Liver-
pool's entire approval—his perfect approbation.—(Hear.)
[Here the Honourable Member paused for a moment
to give vent to his feelings.] He then proceeded.
In coining forward as be did upon this occasion,
he thought it right to say, that it was his own proposi-
tion to move the Address ; and before coming to the im-
mediate question, he would beg it to be understood,
that he had sedulously guarded himself against say-
ing any thing which might he hurtful to the feelings
of those who, perhaps, might differ from him in opi-
nion. The Speech itself embraced hut few topics;
but those were at this moment of the utmost im-
portance to the country. With respect to the
troubles of Greece and the Greek Islands, it was
quite manifest—as he thought—that they could not con-
tinue long without some interposition from the nations
of Europe. The Address, however, which he had the
honour of moving, would pledge the house to nothing but
a grateful acknowledgement for the assurances of our
continued peace and happiness as well as national prosperity,
which the Speech itself held forth. With regard to the
Battle of Navarin, he thought that the discussion and en-
quiry, which would necessarily follow, :must, at
least, have the effect of setting the propriety or
impropriety of that matter at rest. On one point, 'how-
ever, he thought there could he no difference of opinion.
Though personally known to and acquainted with the
Gallant Officer by whom the action was conducted,
he hoped he would not be accused of partiality, when he
gave it as his opinion that a more gallant achievement was
not on record. With respect to the recall of the troops
from Portugal, he thought there could be no discussion,
because the treaties of Brazil and Mexico could only be
used as circumstances required. The next subject of im-
portance to which be should refer was, the state of
the revenue, and before putting the Address he begged to
impress on the House that this country possessed resources
fully equal to the supposed difficulty of her situation.
He had therefore the stongest confidence that the Go-
vernment would be enabled to sustain the national
character unimpaired. It was the greatest honour of one
of the greatest Ministers England ever possessed,
Sir Robert Walpole, that lie had restored the
country after long and ruinous wars, in which she had been
engaged. They were not equal perhaps to the wars of
Buonaparte, nor did he mean to undervalue the
glory of Mr. Pitt, by the comparison. He was con-
fident that, though the pressure of the late wars had
weakened the resources of the country, yet that they
would be productive of the greatest prosperity. To
accomplish this be thought that nothing but feelings of
conciliation between the agricultural, commercial, and
trading interests were necessary. He hoped that concilia-
tion would be the leading principle with all parties, as
it would most directly tend to alleviate the distresses of the
people. With these sentiments he should conclude, by
merely saying, that if any thing bad passed his lips which
would entitle him to ridicule or contempt, he hoped he
wou:d be excused, as his only motive in coining forward
on this occasion was to express his sentiments, and
to declare that he thought the course recommended
was the most adviseable and expedient, under all circum-
stances. The Hon. Member concluded by moving the
Address.
The SPEAKER put the question, by whom the motion
was seconded ?
Mr. R. GRANT—I rise, Mr. Speaker, for that pur-
pose. I know not whether lam required to notice all the
topics treated in the Speech of his Majesty, lout I certainly
do not feel it necessary at this time, point by point, to go
over them. There are, indeed, some to which, as a matter
of expediency, at this moment it may not be proper to ad-
vert ; the absence of most of the prin&pal 'Members of his
Majesty's Government seems to me by no means to take
from the House the right, or to abridge the right,
of fully
discussing, or even filially concluding any topics liable to
debate ; but at the same time, it would be inconvenient
and unsatisfactory to attempt to pursue to a conclusion
questions intimately connected with disputable measures
io the absence of those whose duty it is to sustain
those measures,—(Hear, hear, hear.)—For this reason,
therefore, without imputing the slightest degree of
blame to the Honourable Mover, I may be permitted
to pass over one or two points to which be has ad-
verted. I perfectly agree in the doctrine, not ex-
pressed but distinctly implied, iu the speech of the
Honourable Member, and which always ought to be the
doctrine of Parli.,/,:nent, that no Ministry ought to be form-
ed, or ought to be presumed to enjoy the confidence of the
Crown, or ought to presume to ask the confidence of Par-
liament, not prepared to face all the topics intro-
duced by the flon.Gentieraan:,—(Hear, hear, hear.) The
period of the absence of the chief Members of that Nioistry
does not seem to me precisely the time for entering upon
such a discussion. Ido not thus mean at all to question
time individual act of the Hon. Mover; he has a perfect
right to state the grounds on which bethinks tit to support
this, or to oppose that Government
; and if it were pos-
sible for criticism to attack any part of his speech, sure I
am that criticism would be disarmed by the diffidence of
his manner, and by the amiable infusion of fraternal af-

fection.—(Hear, hear.) The most gracious Speech of his
Majesty dwelfs at some length on the pacific state 01
Europe, and in the main it is M o state of perfect and con-
tinued tranquillity : at the same time it points out two
exceptions that there are, or at least might have been, to
this picture of unrelieved repose. One is a case un-
doubtedly of the deepest interest; but, from the very
terms of the Speech we gather that it has become
source only of joyful recollection. In the other we
are still kept in a state of anxious, but I trust neither
painful nor fearful suspense; the one affects the
Western and the other the Eastern side of Europe—
Portugal and Greece. About twelve months have now I
elapsed since our troops disembarked on the shores
of the Peninsula, for the defence of a portion of it, and in
fulfilment of solemn treaties, in which Portugal was dis-
tinguished as the ancient and faithful ally of Great Britain.
Such were the motives which dictated the necessity of the
expedition. Regarding the faith of treaties, Great Britain
was called upon to preserve national independence in that
kingdom, with which her interests had always been strongly
and closely connected. Portugal was also ennobled as a
distinguished Ally by former recollections of worthy ser-
vice, and to afford her assistance in extremity could not
fail to be a measure of extreme popularity. Objections;
however, did exist—not on the score of injustice or
impropriety, but that the plan was calculated to throw ad-
ditional burdens on the partially exhausted resources of this
country. I see one Hon. Member now in his place who
enforced this paint with singular effect. He urged, if I
remember rightly, that although the enterprise was in-
dispensable, there was some danger lest it should lead
to alarming results. It was possible that it might kindle
a war of opinion, the consequences of which might be in-
calculably disastrous. But I find in the King's Speech
that which must at once allay all apprehension. We are
told that our troops are upon the point of returning to our
shores; having achieved the object for which they were
despatched by the influence of their presence, they are about
to revisit their native land, crowned with victory—neither
the less grateful, nor the less glorious, because it has been
bloodless.—(Hear, hear.) Whatever might be the differ-
ence of opinion on the outset of the expedition—some sup-
porting, because it was recommended by justice and policy,
and others resisting it, because it might tend to disastrous
and almost unforeseen results—s.ssuredly the conclusion
of the enterprize must lead to a general and united
opinion in its favour. Not a syllable was even breathed
against its justice, and all classes may now join in
one feeling of hearty congratulation. The soil of
Portugal has been protected from invasion, the Trea-
sury of Great Britain has been undrained, and the
sword of Great Britain has been returned unstained
into its scabbard.—(Hear, hear.)—Another point closely
connected with what I have already said, will tend
also to combine the opinions of the House and the coml•
try-1 allude to a matter which was formerly made very
prominent in the debates on this question—that we did
not undertake this expedition for purposes of conquest and
aggrandizement.—(Hear, hear.)—l should be most glad
to see the Government of Portugal established upon any
thing like our own British freedom of principle, and it
will always be a subject of rejoicing to me, to see the pros..
perity of that country raising her to the rank of the fore-
most of our Allies---(Hear, hear)---and when the day
should have arrived when Portugal would be able to look
up from her difficulties, it would be impossible for any
one to contemplate the advantages secured to her, without
remembering the great Statesman from whom they had
arisen—(Loud cries of hear, hear)—that it was he who
had first introduced her just claim before the Parliament
of this country, and that on those claims he might be said
to have expended his dying efforts.—(Hear, hear, beer.)—
Whatever subjects of difference there might have hereto-
fore been between that great man and the members of the
present Ministry, I am sure that now there is towards his
memory but one feeling of affectionate regard, and of sin-
cere regret—(hear, hear)—and though it has pleased Al-
mighty Providence to remove him whose counsels pro-
jected the measure, and whose animated eloquence mar-
shalled us—if I may be allowed to use the expression—
in the right course, yet I feel no hesitation in saying,
that history will unite him with the page which shall
record the deliverance of Portugal ; and will inscribe
that event and his name on the same imperishable
column, whirls his genius has raised and his spirit has fos-
tered. Terra munita non turribus sed tropceis.—(Loud
and continued cheering followed the brilliant tribute to
the memory of Mr. Canning pronounced by the Ho-
nourable Gentleman ; but of which from the low and
solemn tone in which it was delivered, and the crowded state
of the gallery, we are able to give only the above faint
outline.) Quitting the topic of Portugal, there are some
others to which I must be allowed to refer ; and, in the
first place, I must beg leave to remark, on that part of his
Majesty's Speech which refers tothe present state of affairs
between Greece and the Ottoman Porte. It has, no doubt,
been observed by this House, that his Majesty's Speech is,
on this subject, confined merely to certain facts which are
already before us. In the exposition of the views of Go-
, vernment on this question, there are certain points on
which I entertain little doubt that we shall all be unani-
I'mous. There can be no question that the quarrel between
the two States has given rise to a most sanguinary contest
between the parties interested, and has been carried to such
an extent as to involve almost all the shores of the Medi-
terranean in the consequences, and to disturb the peace of
the countries more immediately in the vicinity of the seat
of war. lam most willing to believe that the Allied
Powers, who have interfered in this question, are impelled
by their anxiety to establish a system of affairs on a just
and equitable foundation; and, as far as these points go,
1 think that the House will not hesitate in agreeing with
me. But, further than this, we can scarcely with safety pro-
ceed ; for, as we have no authentic documents relative to the
last proceedings which have taken place lying on our
table, I do not see how we can well enter into the ques-
tion of what has been proper, and of what has been impro-
per in the course pursued—(Hear, hear.) The House will,
no doubt, observe, that the Address, which I have the
honour to second, follows the same line as that which I
have been laying down. It contents itself with thanking
his Majesty for the communication which he has afforded
us, and for the general statement of the views entertained
by him ; but, after this, it goes no farther, and in no way
pledges the House to any opinion. There is one point
connected with this question, however, on which I wish to
add a word, though I am ready to admit that silence, ge-
nerally speaking, would at present be preferable, as I do
not deem the question yet ripe for agisation. The point on
which I would speak, certainly presents to me a degree of
difficulty which 1 cannot help feeling—little as it appears
to affect others. If it be asked generally to state whether,
under any circumstances, it is either proper or consistent,
or fair, for foreign nations to interfere—and not merely to
interfere, but to interfere coercively between two
States at war with each other, I am free to con-
fess that the question is replete with difficulties. I be-
lieve it must be admitted that all writers on the subject
have laid down non-interference as the general rule; and in
a question so important as the present we must look in every
direction, not that I mean to say that there are to be no
exceptions to this general rule, but they must be confined
to cases so special and peculiar, that on the face of them
the peculiarity must be discernible. If, then, when only
one single nation is concerned in the interference, the matter
requires such caution, it must be doubly hazardous when
the affair is undertaken by a confederacy, for, however
single-hearted any one of the nations may be in its pur-
pcses, it cannot answer for the designs of the others ; neither
can it in the nature of things be sure that the same wisdom
the same good faith, and the same moderation, are actuat-
ing
the intentions of its Allies. But though all this
makes it unsafe to interfere, there certainly have been
1 and may be cases where it would not only be our
principle but even our duty to interfere between two
belligerents : for, as in England, it had never been a
question, that a nation, under certain circumstances, had
a right to revolt; it would be the grossest of absurdities to
suppose that its Allies were to be deprived of the right of
aiding them in their exertions. We ourselves had, in
former times, lent armed assistance to Holland when she
was oppressed, and which she still remembered with grati-
tude ; and at another period we had received front the
same country succour and support.—(Hear, hear.)---1
trust that the House will pardon me for having detained
it so long on this subject ; but as I could not fail to
he sensible to the deep importance attached to it, I
was most anxious that what I had to say on the matter
should not be misunderstood ; and if I have declined
giving any distant opinion on certain points connected
with 014 topic, I have done so, not because I wished to
shrink from it, but from the circumstance of the whole
facts of the case not being before the House, and because I
(lid not feel myself at liberty to decide without the fullest
information and deliberation. There is another reason
also, Sir, why I should wish to be very cautious, and
that is, because we learn from his Majesty's Speech that
there is still a hope that the negotiations between the parties
will go on, and effect a compromise without resorting
to extreme measures. If this should turn out to be the
case, the House will do well to be cautious how it comes
to any expression of opinion on this point, previous to
the question being settled. Certainly any collected ex-
pression of opinion, and possibly even an individual opinion,
might, at the present epoch, be hazardous, and incur the
chance of disturbing that amicability—the restoration of
st (deli every one must be anxiously desirous to witness. I
do not intend to trouble the House with minute remarks
on all the topics which are touched upon in the Speech

from the Throne ; but there is one which I roust allude for
a minute before I sit down—l mean that point which refers
to the internal state of the country. In mentioning this,
I do not intend to enter into the question to the extent te•
which it has already occupied the House at previous Ses-
sions, and will, no doubt, again, in the course of its labo-
rious researches. I allude to it only for the sake of mak-
ing the single observation that his Majesty's Speech,
when touching on this question, instead of launch.
ing itito a florid and animated description of the be-
nefits which the country has derived from certaiu
arrangements, instead of indulging in glowing and
brilliant colours, it has adopted the more digni-
fied style of reminding the House, that though some im-
provement has taken place, much yet remains to be done,
and it then proceeds to call them to an honest and la-
borious discharge of the duty which the country has um.
posed upon them. There are certain evils, however,
under which the country is suffering, to which I
doubt whether it is in the power of the Legisla-
ture to apply a direct remedy—l mean the evils of depres-
sion which are still affecting the productive classes of Eng-
land. This is the subject which is pressed upon oar at-
tention, and we therefore can have no objection to pledge
ourselves to the prosecution of the inquiry, how far the
public expenditure may be reduced consistently with the
necessary demands and expenses of the country, and in
what degree we may he able to improve the internal con-
dition of the people. With respect to the consuming and
manufacturing claws, to which the Speech has alluded,
believe that the cause, or one of the chief causes of the
depression under which they are suffering, is far removed be-
yond the control of the House. (Hear.) I am afraid, that
we mast not be sanguine enough to hope that the improve•-•
ment of their condition will be very rapid ; and I cannot
help feeling a great doubt how Parliament, with all its
boasted omnipotence, will be able to accelerate so desirable.
an event to any great degree.—(Hear, hear, bear.)—This,
however, so far from furnishing any excuse for remissness
on our parts, should, on the contrary, furnish the strongest
motives for our activity. Whatever our success may be
likely to be, let us at all events do our best, so that at least
the country may see, and we ourselves feel, that all has been.
done by us that could be done towards an earnest, energetic,
and determined discharge of our duty—(Hear, hear)—and
though on some occasions the spirit of the people of Eng-
land is wayward and difficult to be controuled,- yet I, for
my own part, have sufficient faith in the good sense and
candour of that people, to believe, that when they see Par-
liament exerting itself for their benefit, they will afford it r.
firm co-operation and assistance. By pursuing, therefore,
the course pointed out to us by the Crown, we shall be dis-
charging our duty to theca and to ourselves; and, assuredly,
if we may judge from the tenor of the Speech which we
have beard this night, we may conclude, that in promoting
the happiness of the people, we shall most effectually be
promoting one of the most earnest objects of his Majesty's
wishes.—( Hear.)
Mr. BROUGHAM agreed entirely with the observations
that had fallen from the two Hon. Members opposite, while
at the same time he claimed on behalf of himself and other
Members of the House a most unquestionable right of
entering into every part of his Majesty's Speech. It was
very well to say that Ministers were not here, and
therefore that they ought to postpone the discussion of the
measures in which they were interested. It was very well
to say so, and to act so, but it was a very different
thing for the Hon. Mover and Seconder of the Address,
after giving this prudent and proper advice, to proceed to
a discussion of those very measures on which they depre-
cated ail discussion, and to proceed to enter largely iuto an
explanation of all those points which it was most expedient
to postpone. It was a very different thing when the
Honourable Mover and Seconder only postponed giving
their opinions on those points on which there was no
difference of opinion, and only adverted to those
topics on which t. sere was the greatest difference of opinion.
No doubt the lion. Gentlemen had a right to give
their opinions on those subjects, and all that
he (Mr. Brougham) complained of was, -that
in giving their own opinion, they should call upon
every one else to bold his peace. The Hon. Mover not
content with giving his own plenary approbation to the
Ministry lately formed, brought down to that House a spe-
cies of message from a Noble Relative, whose health
he (Mr. B.) rejoiced unfeignedly to hear was so much re-
covered, for he had understood that that Noble Lord's
health was in such a situation that he did not know nor
could not attend to any thing that was passing. He was
glad now to learn from the authority of his Noble Relative
that his information was correct. But this did not pre-
vent him from protesting against the Noble Lord, or
any other Noble Lord's, sending down a message to
this house. Was it because the Noble Lord
was a member of every government but the last, within,
twenty years past? Was it because the Noble Lord %yea!
suspected by his friends, and was considered an inoffensive
man by his enemies—was it because he was peculiarly fair
and candid towards his political opponent, that he
should take upon himself to send down a mes-
sage to this Llouse, by his honourable relative to
the effect that be (Lord Liverpool) was fully persuaded
that there never:was a better Administration than that which
had been just formed ? Doubtless the Noble Lord approved
of the omissions— those omissions which had astounded
the public—the Ministry met with his complete ap-
proval, and therefore he approved of the omission of
his ancient and honourable colleague, whose name had
been so long associated with his own, that they were
like Castor and Pollux, in this nether world—(Laughter,
and hear !)—The one was never heard without the other.
He (Mr. Brougham), never heard of any measure, nor any
political movement within the last twenty years, to which
both those Noble Lords were not parties. He was
struck with surprise therefore he confessed, but with
still more satisfaction than surprise, when he heard
of Lord Liverpool's approval of this omission.
(Laughter.) Notwithstanding all that had
fallen from the Honourable Mover and Seconder, he
(Mr.B.) would not be drawn away into an unnecessary
discussion, notwithstanding all the temptations that had
been thrown out. It would be inexpedient and un-
fair to enter into any general discussion ; but there were
some topics touched on by the Hon. Mover and Seconder,
and seme of the terms of the King's Speech and the
Address, which he could not refrain from remarking on.
He wished that those who perused the Speech, lied consi-
dered to whom it was addressed, and by whom it was—if
not to be discussed—at least to be considered, and
that they had avoided sonic expressions calculated more
than those contained in any speech he had ever
heard, to commit those who from delicacy and expe-
diency were desirous not to vote against it. One part of the
Speech lie must dissent from and protest against, in the
full and firm conviction, that his dissent and protest would
be re-echoed by that House, and throughout the country.
lie alluded to the manner in which the late glorious, bril-
liant,. and immortal achievement was alluded to. In Ins
Majesty's Speech, that glorious event was referred to and
talked of in the language of lamentation. It.was the first
time in the course of his (Mr. Brougham's) experience,
that he had ever heard of a Ministry taking
an early, un-
heard of, uncalled for, improper, and unfair opportunity of
complaining of a glorious victory. But there were sonic
unfortunately who fought the battles of freemen, but who
trembled like slaves; some who acted gloriously but
• repented bitterly ; some who when they promoted the
cause of freedom in the West thought it expedient to
extend the reign of slavery in the East, and thus plucking
from their brow the laurels planted cypress in its place.—
He hailed it as an evil omen that the Speech referred to
the late battle in the terms in which it did. He feared he
should not be able to give his
.confidence to those who de-
signated the battle of Navarro "an untoward event."
He did not say the present Ministry was unworthy of public
confidence, what he complained of was, that the. Hon. Mover
and Seconder should say you must not discuss certain matters
in the absence of Mr. Huskisson and Mr. Grant, and yet
the advisers of the Crown put in the mouths of their Sove-
reign an attack upon Mr. Huskisson and Mr. Grant,
and Mr. Grant's brother came down to second art Address
lauding this Speech, containing the attack on Mr. Grant
and Mr. Huskisson. But perhaps it might be said that-it
was no attack upon those gentlemen. But if so, then, at
least, it was an attack on the gallant officer who had con-
ducted the fleets, and who was likewise absent---(Hear,
hear, hear)—who had fought and bled in the action of
which they were ashamed, and to the glory of which they
had applied the phrase of " untoward. -_(hear, hear,
hear.)—Out of this dilemma, my Lord Field-Marshal
Duke of Wellington, there is no getting.—(Cheers.)—All
your battles, be they ever so bold—all your victories, ,be
they ever so nimble--Cannot get you out of it; either you
m
are throwing odium on Mr. Grant and Mr. Huskisson,
your predecessors in office, and setting up the brothel- of
the former to echo an Address in which his policy i 8
blamed
to
° v d esnled planned
;orl
dare say, that of course it
will be said there was no blame whatever meant--ynu
ea
andle thoset
the measure escape,
while
he that fought the battle and led our ships on to victory is
to be held up as the object of blame; and after haying
been covered with honours on all sides, his conduct is to
be stigmatised as " untoward"—(Cheering)--thus throw •
ing in the shade those honours which are only less
signal than the trophies he has won for his country. I
do wish, Sir, in the most holy sentiment of heart, that
peace may be restored between Greece and the Porte ;
I do wish that the present threatening extremities
may pass away without war and bloodshed being
their accompaniments; I know the danger that; will

With all
rintyhaonte
inparttheor;esuernopet
depressed
all
dt
statee o h le
of 2e4l'
aprairstes from
deamn ;nno
our Revenue and Pinance,s, war, of all things, ought to be in hand
avoided by this country; yet, with all these feelings of
an rPle
--oichh I
anxiety pressing on y mind,; do not hesitate to declare, have to,
that I would rather see war brought upon us, than consent that he
tutional
ro the stigmatizing of the late naval action by such terms as
Tniea military hear.)—Though
modear.)T in 1
,o; s
should appear to be condemnatory of the motives that n°,,t the
urgedati
si
aci
tti
000 the
n .
°n'
s
constituted, represented as it is by thepotent t
the cannot
Government viewrn mewnt with
ile ; to
Noble Duke at the 11,
head of the Army in the other House, and by the Noble; • bear's as
Lord, the Secretary at War, in this ; nor hear, in silent '
acquiescence, the disapprobation and lamentations ex— f' the, '
pressed with regard to the battle of Navarin, in that. pas- ar, the
sage of the Speech to which I have adverted ; 'nor setvith-
It is un
out alarm the way in which our " ancient and faithful bated
it
Ally," the religious and liberal Emperor •of the Turks; uttlmat
is spoken of by the head of the Protestant interest in quarter
this Ad
this country—by '}tie brother, I had almost said, on
the Throne; I do trust that these things, which I de-
the exe,
plore, are not an earnest of our return to that system ria•
of foreign policy--I 11;i11 say of bad foreign policy__ protest
which, for so many years, perverted the course of arms--
our foreign relations, and which I had fain hoped was on the
utterly extinguished by the brilliant talent and glorious here t
success attending that wiser, more humane, more liberal, against
be
and more truly English system, restored under the super- ,
intendence of that Right Hon. Gentleman (the late Mr. 'lesinchY gz
Canning), whose name I can hardly permit myself to speak, the Pa'
after, the eloquent tribute paid to his transcendent merits be filler
and pre-eminent services by my Hon. Friend who seconded Sir
the Address. I had fain hoped that his great talents and ton of
,public. services—of inestimable worth, though they called late M
forth against him that torrent of vile abuse to which he fell Iran
a premature sacrifice—l had fain hoped, I repeat, that though
those services, and the splendid success which had attended their
them, had prevented for ever the return of that short-
Yorke
sighted,.narrow-minded, and ill-omened system of foreign rorde
policy which did, for a time, prevail under other councils- ks d
I trust that this system will not be revived ; that we shall “Ta
no longer dread the name which, as Englishmen, we laadt eatila,ra
under that system, acquired throughout Europe; that
we shall no longer be ashamed, as we then were, of appear
all that is best in our own institutions, when brought thus wti
into contrast with those of the ancient and legitimate but
slavish and despotic Monarchies of the Continent. I trust luster'
• that the people of England will not have the misfortune W public
see an interregnum of that foreign policy which has bee ed to
• restored during the last three or four years, since the re- YL.ear I
.turn of Mr. Canning to office. I trust that this country th'
will still be the refuge and solace of all persecuted freemen, aaxial
and not of the tyrants wino persecute them. I trust, that the Nr
,if .freemen venture to these shores, they will not find that (A let
they come only to be betrayed and delivered over to their Ka.rtie
pursuers. I hope that it may not again be with us as it 'ling,
was once said to be, that wherever there was any abuse of prevai
power—wherever there was any course of misgovernment P. G:
,--wherever there was any system of cruelty and fraud in of his
force against the liberty and happiness of the human race tratio:
they to whom the oppressive Government belonged, awl Naval
by whom its powers were administered, never looked is Hon.
vain to England for sympathy and support.—(Hear, hear.) .as
cot
I am alarmed, I confess, at the kindness with which the discre
Turks are mentioned—the pleasing satisfaction with which hones
our ancient alliance with that Power is dwelt on in the heads
I same passage in which his Majesty's Speech laments the The 1
battle of Navarin, and designates that victory as an ss unto. to
ward event." This passage, I must say, leads me to entertain pawe
some fears which I shall rejoice to find unfounded. Though I has o.
have abstained from a single remark either upon the Go' "Inc
vernrnent or its measures, yet I will take it on myself t° (Mut
state—as I can do in perfect honesty and sincerity, and a' not E
I feel bound to do in performance of my duty as a Member Welli
of this House—that, he the Government composed °I reaao
tl
whomsoever it may, be the causes assigned to account f°l by
Ai
the changes that have lately taken place whatever they maY:
as long as I find certain men forming part and parcel o any I
that Government, and as long as I know, if lam to kno° the
it, that hopes are raised and promises made that a certain (Rent
course of policy will be followed ; as long as I think I cal was
rely on the fulfilment of these pledges, in the adoption o the
wise, salutary, -and liberal measures for the purpose of of ' crest
fectually retrenching further expenditure--(Hear, hear to th
and of carrying further the improvements begun in cool(
whole of our domestic polity ; and as long as I know, ' ; treqte
I am to know it—and whether I am, this . Speech f litic
the first time makes me greatly doubt--that we she Blind
adhere to our owntruly English and honest system rtime,
foreign policy, and not return to that which is so hag, it lb'
that
supplanted—l shall, looking not to the men at all,
true
the Government composed of those with whom I am cot,
silent
nected privately or as a party man—or be it composed '
spo
those with whom I am unconnected, and to whom, as
party man, lam opposed—if these be their measures, the ougl
shall receive my support; and that not a languid or feet fere
support, but as hearty, as sincere, and as active a suppof it
as if I still sat on that (the Ministerial) side of the HO they
and as if I was in close connection with those from whoalater
the measures emanated. (Hear, hear, hear.) I cannot'
was
that
down without saying a few words as to one part of the Ail
rasagements of the new Government, to which I confess fals°
for one am old-fashioned enough to feel very strong
~°r, that
jections. I wholly disapprove of the Commander-in-Cho they
of the Army being placed at the head of the Civil Cover'. But
merit of the country. No man can value more highly r cow
illustrious services ; no man could be more grateful for the! to c
victories at the time when they were atchioved ; and oft: put
party men generally were rather disposed to lament thc,o, 0 flee'
some even to regard them as " untoward events," I °I bus;
amongst the first in this House to exult in them, and Use
urge and promote the measures for replenishing the ) the
sources placed at the Noble Duke's disposal. But to 1 refs
that Gallant Field Marshal placed, as Prime Minister] . • I)"
this country, at the head of the Finances—invested, rte,i eat
is understood, with all the patronage of the Crown, and be s sent
key
almost alone the depository of the free and full confidl
Al;
of his Sovereign ! The Noble Duke has not only
bin
patronage of the Army and the Church, And most of
due
other patronage of the State, but to him also is intro'.
WOI
the delicate and west important function of having °:
her
stant access to the ear of Isis Royal Master—(Hear,
—What is to compensate the country for the violatioot
constitutional principles, in this extraordinary accumuls s the
of power in the heads of an individual ? We are told, er die
true, of the great vigour he Flews in council, and that' ing
talents are not confined to war. It may be so ; jade' sac
have no doubt it is so ; but the objection remains that t
a soldier, and a successful soldier too—=strengthened
built up in his eminence by a reputation purely mill
and still exercising the office of Commander-in-Chief 01
Army. When last Sessions I heard him make that Si''
in which he hail the modesty and candour to declare,
he knew himself incapable of speaking before their IA
ships as the First Minister of the country ought t°l
able to speak, he expressed himself with so ill
clearness and propriety that I thought I had never
a better speaker,—(Hear, hear,)—nor one more "'
to the occasion. He convinced the House that it,
less his want of capacity for debate that disqurte
him for a leading Minister than because his e 0
ence was military and not civil. But it is no cool
satin to me to tell me; that when the Noble Duke 01
his great and gallant front in his negotiations with F
Powers, they will be awed. Unhappily, the same ti
will remind them also of his former connection with }
worst, most on-English, most despotic, and most 1/1
military system of foreign policy by which this, or
other country, was ever disgraced and degraded. It
compensation to me to hear, as I do hear it said, the
new First Alinister of State intends to tarn over 0i
leaf, and take into his own hands all the patronage °'
Crown ; so that no Court favourite--no Peer, however
his dignity—indeed, no Minister, is to share it with hit
That will be no compensation to me; this House WI,/
it none—none at all, I am sure--(Hear)—nor
country consider it any compensation. According to tll
of the Constitution, to recommend persons to r•
high offices in the Army, Navy, State, or Church,
privilege of any friend or other person who has acs
the Minister of the Crown, but on him -alone rest
responsibility of the appointment. That any indiirifi
exalted rank and powerful connexions, and having
influence in the country, should be excluded from 144
mending any individuals whom he might wish to
by promotion in the State, the Church, the Army, av
Navy, Ido not understand, on Constitutional gr°
nor why the Court, as it is called, or the Nobility,'
band and foot, and deprived of the power
be bound,
has hitherto been used by every
Duke, Marquis, or
having two boroughs in his gift. This is not my 14
of the Constitution. The Minister I hold, is anstrt
for the disposal of the patronage ; because whoever
mends, be appoints, and be therefore is alone eel
I care not who recommends the appointment, who
belong to the Court, or to the Howe of Lords or Coo°l
or to neither : I have a responsible Minister ; if he i°,l;
~.he
is answerable for what he has done. Constitutl°Ogi
then, I care nothing at all about the mode in who!
patronage is used, whether directly by the Mino,o
through him by those who surround him. It is 00,,
!sensation to this House, or the country, how th.e,o
Duke may proceed in this respect.- Compensare„"e
public have a right to expect ; but I see none. I,‘"th
be said, however, that I erns inclined to exaggerate. '
no fear of slavery being introduced into thie countrgt
sword. It would take a stronger man than the
Wellington, though he be at once Pritse Miojlc
Commander- in-Chief of the Army ; and though, t.'cr
the army, he should have the Mitre, and to that tr)

an}
Ne
• eid
hat

nit

G,
'p

,

!.10;fi I; .44
ti
Y4fl

II

.1

• d
3

1
41'441 9, 1
4% •
4-, I

1‘.464.

~u~~

44.4 bid
4400
4'9,44,1

,

~'

1 all the other : Seal. I will make him a present of them all ; and yet
sensed
state of with all these powers heaped upon him, let him, sword
s, ought to be • in hand, come out against the Constitution, and the
ese feelings of ' People would net only beat him, but laugh at him. 1
ate to declare, • have too good an opinion of his good sense to oppose
s than consent ; that he entertains or harbours the thought of an unconsti-
, such terms as ; , tutional attack on the- liberties of the people. These are-
motives that .1
.not the times when the soldier only is abroad. Somebody
'not view with of more importance has risen, who has reduced the sole
Government is dier to nothing, even if he were ten thousand times more
e Duke at the patent than he is. In the nineteenth century, a new power
by the Noble ears away. The schoolmaster is abroad.—(liear, hear.)
hear, in silent ---I will trust more to him, armed with his primer, than
ientations ex- ta, the soldier with his bayonet.—(Hear, hear.)---1 am
,in that pas r far, . ar, therefore, from feeling any fear as to this appointment.
; 'nor seAvith. • 1 !t is unconstitutional iu principle, and much to be repro-
it and faithful f bated in every point of view ; hut as to any immediate ar
of the Turks, 1• ultimate danger of open violence, that certainly is not the
nt interest in S quarter from which I dread it. In giving my assent to
mast said, on i this Address, let it be understood, then, that Ido so with
which I de- i the exception of the passage relative to the battle of Nava-
o that system i rin. Of that passage I wholly disapprove ; and I utterly
•eig, policy
...... t Protect against it on the part of my gallant countrymen in
he course of ! arms--on the part of the late Government—and especially
in hoped was ' on the part of Mr. Huskisson and Mr. Grant, who are not
at and glorious . here to defend themselves.—(Hear, hear.)—l protest
!, more liberal, i against it also on the part of this House, who will thus
ader the super- ' be induced to vote an Address they do not approve as it
(the late Mr. they gave it their entire and cordial approbation; and on
iyself to Speak, the part of the country, who, lam morally certain, will
cendant merits be filled with astonishment and disgust.
I who seconded Sir JOSEPH YORKE considered that some explana-
eat talents and Con of the circumstances attending the dissolution of the
ugh they called late Ministry was necessary. The Hon. and Learned Gen-
to which he fell tleraan had made a long speech without touching the point,
, I repeat, that though he had promised to shut their mouths and shorten
h had attended their‘y sitting when he began.—(A laugh.)—He (Sir J.
of that short- • . "ire) trusted, therefore, that the House would not se
item of foreign ate without hearing some observations from the Noble'
other councils. '-' Lord (Palmerston), who, in the absence of Messrs. Hus- •
;teat we shall t "'sari and Grant, could probably give the House some
hmen, we bad, explanation how it was that this great battalion of Whigs
Europe ; that aid Tories had been broken up so suddenly on the martial
then were, of appearance of the new Premier. Could it he necessary to
when brought the welfare of Great Britain that the Government should
thus be shifted from hand to hand, because one set of Mi-
-1 legitimate but
Linents I trust Waters after another could not agree in their councils? Were
,public men so selfish, that no Minister could be obtain-
s misfortune to •
which has been r ~.-. ed to conduct public affairs, because they were every
3, since the re- . year becoming more difficult? He was afraid too many
of them had sold the country for a mess of pottage,
at this country 1.
asking for one job or another.—(A laugh.) He hoped
ecuted freemen, , ,
.•the Noble Lord, who, he observed, had a paper in his hand
I trust, that
ill not find that (A laugh), would show, by some reason, why men of all
i over to their
Parties should not be united in the Administration? No.
ra
e with us as it thing, Ire was sorry to say, but the most illiberal feelings
vas any abused Prevailed. He had observed that his Hon. Friend (Mr.
misgovernment B. Grant), in shifting his sentiments through the cullender
;y and fraud in of his speech, had given all the grain to the late Adminis-
the human race tration, and thrown all the offensive matter on the battle of
it belonged, ao'l Navarin._(Mere laughing.) He could not agree with his
never looked is lion. Friend as to the sketch lie had drawn of the Turks,
(Hear, hear.) as contrasted with the Greeks. Both of them had some
--
with which the discrepancies of character. The Turk was generally an
ton with which honest man, but he was sometimes apt to take off people's
In-elt on in the heads, when they said more than he liked.—(Laughter.)—
ch laments the The Gallant Officer concluded by expressing his obligations
•ry as an " unto- to iris Hon. and Learned Friend (Mr. Brougham) for his
Ime to entertain Pawerful speech. My lion. and Learned Friend, said he,
ended. Though I has only to rise, and shake his thunder, and the Treasury
✓ upon the Go' Bench is laid prostrate. Even I myself sat trembling.—
it on myself to (Much laughing.) The Noble Lord (Palmerston) will
sincerity, and af not find it more easy to get out of the scrape than Marshal
ty as a Member Wellington himself; but he must give the House some
nt composed 01 reason for the harlequinade that has been played off upon us
d to account for by this change of places.
Latever they inaY‘' Mr. BANKES did not mean to address the House at
Lrt and parcel o any length on this occasion, but he felt it inaposssible on
if I am to knob the first day of the session not to notice some of the topics
ale that a certain mentioned in the speech. It appeared to him that there
as I think I cal, was an almost unqualified regret throughout the countr•y at
L the adoption e the disastrous affair of Navarin,—an affair which had
le purpose of ef, created dismay and astonishment. Those who had agreed
ss..(Hus, hear; to the treaty, were placed in a dilemma from which they
Its begun in tt could not extricate themselves, because the necessary con-
ag as I know, ' . sequence of that treaty, which he conceived to be impo-
this • Speech f' litic and unjust, was the deplorable event to which he had
—that we she alluded.—(Hear.)—There would, he knew, arrive other
ronest system ! times and opportunities for arguing this point ; but when
rich is so Lapps' it, formed so prominent a part of his Majesty's speech, when
men at all,
tuat speech seemed in some degree to countenance the
whom I am cos transaction, he could not suffer the topic to he passed by in
eit composed' silence. The Learned Gentleman (Mr. Brougham) had
1 to whom, as
spoken of the foreign policy which this Government
'
it measures, 0,"
ought to adopt. Was it, then, British policy to inter-
languid or fed' fere in the internal affairs of other countries? Was
active a supper it net contrary to the law of nations ? And had
ids of the Hon"
they not, by the treaty into which they had entered, vio-
:hose from who',
lated that law? The Learned Gentleman argued that this
ar.) I cannot
' was a contest for liberty. He (Mr. Bankes) contended
roe part of the si,
sl to that it was no sach thing. The treaty was founded on a
which I confect, ,40.941 false pretence,—the pretence of liberty and religion. But
el very strong . js! '.
that pretence was not subsequently brought forward, and
=ander-in-OP they were told that the intention was to put down piracies.
the Civil Govet4* .-L ii s, But was it necessary for Great Britain, the greatest naval
e more highly Vilt,atss country under the sun,—was it, he askal, necessary for her
grateful for di" 4ketts. to call to her assistance two other powers, to check and
•
roved ;
and „1.4. is, put down a system of piracy ? Was it necessary that a
~ lament the,n, j^- fleet of 16 sail of the line should be employed in such a
i events," I t business? It was absurd and ridiculous to make such an
t in them, and .. •-. assertion. In his view of the case, the entire subject,
denishing the f.... the treaty, and every thing connected with it, should be
out!. But to ' referred to a Committee. It would not, perhaps, be pro-
'rime Minister - per that such an inquiry should he public. He should be
a—invested, si glad to know in what situation this country stood at pre-
Crown, and be, sent, and whether we were at war or at peace with Tur-
aid full confide',
key ? As to the gallant officer who had behaved so honour-
has not onl ! ably at Navarin, he had nothing whatever to say against
y
him. He had only to lament that that meritorious indivi-
and most of
i also is intro' dual had beep engaged in an attack on an ancient ally. It
in of having r' would, however, be right that the House should know
er—(Hear, 110, hereafter, what powers and directions were given to him
'or the violatioS ori that disastrous occasion. There were some points in
nary accumulaS the speech of the Hon. Gentleman who seconded the Ad-
We are told, i ; • dress, in which he entirely concurred. He was exceed-
ncil, and that 7,,,....- ingly glad that the expedition to Portugal was at au end ;
v be 30 j ind ''lt'
pelt,
and he trusted that they would not, in future, encourage
remains that any interference with the internal affairs of foreign nations.
=strengthened He could not but deprecate, in the strongest and most de-
n purely mili ‘•.?.. . sided terms, every thing connected with that treaty, which
ler-in-Chief of • 1,1:4;,.. had produced hostilities against an ancient ally.
make that S • Lord ALTHORP regretted that some Hon. Gentlemen
ur to declare, near him had been betrayed so far into discussion upon
ufore their A points, ins to which, however he might eventually agree
atry ought tel in principle with them, he thought discussion at the mo-
f with so relent premature. He agreed with his Hon. and Learned
I had never 13 Friend (Mr. Brougham)--as far as he was informed of all
one more P' the circumstances—that the battle of Navarin was a neees•
[louse that it, sery consequence of the Treaty signed at London. Ile
that disquis agreed, too, most fully, in the protest of his Hon. and
cause his e$ Learned Friend against those expressions in the Speech
t it is no cosi from the Throne which seemed to cast censure upon the
ioble Duke 8 Gallant Admiral who commanded at Navarin. With re-
tions with Foo' aped to the Treaty of London itself, undoubtedly he at
ly, the same 'I present felt considerable doubts both as to it policy and its
anection with Justice. But still he could not bring himself to give so de-
and most ' ~ ..,,. ceded an opinion as his Hon. Friend near hir, (Mr.
. '
rich this, or, ~,.,' . Bankes) had done. He would rather first hear the expla-
egraded. It ° '19"r1: ' nations of those who were responsible for the Treaty, and
•ar it said, the •,:."*".4: not, in their absence, prejudge the question ; and therefore
the present)
to
over 0, '`t`lr' he wished that the subject for bad been avoi-
.s I,soli ded. For that, which the same Hon. Member had said as to
e patronage u
'err, however the affairs of Portugal, he felt the same satisfaction which
the Hon. Member ex
are it with Id Pressad at the termination of the Por-
his House sail tuguese question ; but his satisfaction arose from a very
ar)—nor Wil, different cause. He was glad to hear that the British
ecording to lit troops were about to leave the country ; but he was glad
to hoar this, because be believed that they had been enti
persons to 'rely
or Church, successful in the object for which they were employed.—
who has ace` ‘l2 England was bound by treaty to prevent any interference
m-alone re .' of foreign powers with Portugal. He would not, on that
t any indivis' evening, enter into any discussion of a further question
and having which had been brought forward—the merits or credit of
luded from the new Administration. He should not conceal his short
sht wish to opinion on the subject: it was one upon which he enter-
er tained considerable apprehension. He felt no confidence
the Army,
whatever in the present Administration ; but he would not
titutional gr°,
Ire Nobility, °, state his reasons for that want of confidence until the par-
if the power tics who composed it were present in their places. Under
Marquis, or these circa stances it would not be necessary for him (the
i is not nay 14 Noble Lord) to occupy the attention of the House any
old, is ans 4, longer ; but he distinctly added his protest to that of his
ise whoever • Hon. and Learned Friend near him, against that part of
s alone realSif} the Royal Speech which cast censure upon the conduct of
ntment, wbe i the Officer who had commanded at Navarin.
or COO& Lord PALNIERSTON agreed that it would be inexpe-
ter ; if he i9,4;', . dient to enter at present into length upon many subjects
Constituti,,o, which had been started in the course of the present even-
mode in whir,.
„in., ing ; but there were one or two points among the observe-
y the Minv,o, ,t,iii tions which had fallen from the Hon. Gentleman on the
im. It is tlit) '• -*tst. other side which his duty to the House would, not otios
e ' id! , •
try, how Os 0a • s • him to pilSl, unnoticed. 'The Hon. and Learned Member
tea o
Compensa tier ,win
~ - on the opposite bench (Mr. Brougham), who had part-
! none. I,‘ si parti-
cularly taken objection to the Address, seemed to think it
;xaggerate. 1 5„.."- objectionable, because it contained certain expressions,
this countrirlo ,VIASS- amounting to disapprobation, of a late important occur-
than the til 1 ss, sti' recce. Now he could not but think that it woulal have been
rime Mioi?,e ~ ' a great fault on the part of the Administration, if they hair
d though, n5,,,r . ' . omitted to touch, in the Royal Speech, upon a topic of so
dto that tP ' much public interest. And he was ready to admit that it

A

vald have been improper in the mover or seconder to '
call upon the House to sanction any Address, which
would have committed the Hons.., upon any question
of national or general importance. But surely a very
little of that critical examination which no man was more
capable than the, Honourable and Learned Gentleman op-
posite of employing, would convince both him, and the
Honourable Members who voted with him, that there was
nothing in the present address which committed the House
to any policy at all. The address only thanked his Ma-
jesty for the communication which he had been pleased to
make, and did not commit the parties who supported it
upon any circumstance whatever. The Hon. and Learned
Gentleman had a peculiar pleasantry and humour in his
attacks, which made there amusing even to those at whom
they were most particularly pointed ; but he certainly had
not displayed good taste in the manner in which he had
been pleased on that evening to advert to the military cha-
racter of his Grace the Duke of Wellington. The claims
which that Noble and Gallant puke had established to the
gratitude of this country, stood upon a basis too firm to
be shaken by any taunts or censures from individuals.
But there was one question upon which he was glad to be
able to relieve the alarms of the Hon. and Learned Gentle-
man himself : the military office formerly held by his
Grace would not be united to the political. The Noble
Duke had tendered to the King his resignation of the office
of Commander-in-Chief, at the same time when he had
accepted that of First Lord of the Treasury ; and although
no successor to the post was yet appointed, the House
might consider the resignation as accepted—the Duke of
Wellington would cease to be Commander-in-Chief from
the present time. Therefore, it was to be hoped that
the fears of the Honourable and Learned Gentleman
would cease : his apprehensions of the dangerous con-
sequences of military patronage, civil patronage, and
church patronage, being united in one individual ; what-
ever danger there might be i❑ such an event, the
House might be assured it was not going to occur.
Another objection taken by the Hon. and Learned Gen-
tleman to the present Prime Minister was, that his habits
and experience had been military, and not civil. But the
Hon. Gentleman himself had admitted, that in the speech
in which the Noble Duke, with an honourable modesty,

had disclaimed the possession of talents such as should qua.
lily him for the first situation in the country—that the
very terms and manner in which that disclaimer was made,
showed that the modesty of the speaker far underrated his
own capacities. And surely the personal knowledge of
the Honourable and Learned Gentleman himself must
sufficiently instruct him that the whole of the Duke of
Wellington's experience had not been confined to the
army. The House at least would know that there had
been scarcely an important transaction in Europe for
the last fifteen years in which the Duke, at home or
abroad, had not directly borne a part. Therefore,
the Honourable and Learned Member could not surely
recollect what had actually been the case, when lie
spoke of the service and experience of the Duke of
Wellington as having been entirely military. The Hon.
and Learned Gentleman, however, was pleased to state,
that lie, for once, should prove a better tactician than the
Duke ; and that he had got him into a dilemma, from
which it was impossible for him to escape. Now he
(Lord Palmerston) denied the existence of any dilemma;
there was no dilemma at all. The Honourable and
Learned Member said, that the Speech pronounced a con-
demnatii )n upon the battle of Navarin. He (Lord Pal-
merston) asserted that it did not do so; that it censured or
condemned nothing. It contained no censure upon the
treats, which had produced the battle, nor any blame of the
Admiral who had commanded in it. The Speech said that
the battle was " unexpected ;" and certainly there could be
no doubt it had been so. Because, although some collision
might have been expected, yet the affair of Navarin arose
in a wa.y which could not be expected. It had arisen out
of a combination of circumstances which could not be fore-
seen ; and therefore it must have been a collision entirely
unexpected by the Government. He thought it impossible
that his Majesty could be advised to allude to a battle
taking place under such circumstances, without regret,—a
battle, speaking without the smallest condemnation of it,
which had nevertheless taken place between his fleets, and
the fleets of a country with which we were not at war, but
with which indeed we were absolutely on terms of alliance.
The expressions used had not been meant as any reflection
upon the conduct of the Admiral commanding, and could
not fairly be so construed. The honours sent out to the
Gallant Admiral were a sufficient proof of this ; those testi-
monies alone proved that his skill and gallantry were
sufficiently appreciated. The Gallant Officer still con-..
tinned in his situation of high and important trust. Did,
Honourable Members believe that this could be the case,
if the Government felt it fit that any censure should be
passed upon him? No censure was meant, nor was any
expressed, and therefore the dilemma into which the Hon.
and Learned Member proposed to involve the Duke of
Wellington, was wholly without existence. The Hon. and
Learned Member's apprehensions were not confined either
to the treatment of the victors in the late engagement, or
the combination of power in the person of the Duke of
Wellington. He feared for the general and internal wel-
fare of the state, and trusted that the new Ministry
were not going back into that system of home or com-
mercial policy, which he believed to be adverse to the
interest of the country. Nothing could be more rills •
chievoul or more improper than to declare beforehand
what were the intentions of any Administration ; but
when the House found the same Member at the head
of Foreign Affairs who had held that situation in the
ministry of Mr. Canning, the Hon. Member for Liver-
pool continuing to be Minister of the Colonial Depart-
ment; and the present President of the Board of Trade
still charged with the direction of the commercial system,
there was no reason surely to anticipate that any of
these persons would depart from the principles upon
which they had already conducted their offices, and
which had met, almost universally, with approbation and
support. He said only—" judge of the Government by
its measures," not by any description from indivi-
duals of what those measures really were to be.—
It was according to the course only which it actually and
effectively pursued, that the new Government asked the ap-
probation of the House or the confidence of the country.
To pass Irons the opposition of the Hon. and Learned
Member on the other side, the Hon. Member for Corfe
Castle inquired, whether we were at war or at peace with
Turkey ? Certainly we were not at war with Turkey.
Our Ambassador had quitted Constantinople ; but no
change had taken place in our policy. Therefore, in fact,
we were still at peace. With respect to our situation with
Greece, he would merely say, that the treaty and protocol
were before the House, but it was not intended by Ministers
at present to found any motion upon them. It would be
remembered that the negotiations connected with the treaty
were not yet ended. There was no reason to believe that
they would be ended, otherwise than to the advantage of
the country ; but it was possible that discussion might ope-
rate to the prejudice of their conclusion. If, subject to this
consideration, therefore, it was thought advisable to bring
forward any motion, Ministers would be prepared to meet
it; but none would originate at present with themselves.
One other observation of the Hon. Member for Corfe
Castle he could not pass without notice—he alluded to that
which had been said on the subject of the affairs of Par-
tugal. The Hon. Member had stated and repeated, that
the British expedition had been sent to Portugal in order to
interfere with the internal arrangements o.ychat country.—
He denied this : he said that the expedition had been sent
out to fulfil the treaty of this country, by defending Por-
tugal from external attack. lie did not mean to say but
that Le was gratified by the course which affairs had taken
in Portugal. It was satisfactory to see that country with
something like a representative form of government,—
satisfactory, although it were only because be believed
that our relations with every state were made more
firm and safe by the admission of the people generally
to some share in government, or at least by giving
the public voice its power of full expression. The
Noble Lord sat down by stating, that he had now
done his duty, by replying to a few observations which
had fallen from Honourable Members on the other
side, and to which he thought some answer was neces-
sary. For himself, he would observe that rule which
had already been too far broken for general convenience
during the present evening ; he had deprecated discussion,
and he would not occupy the time of the House by indul-
ging in it.
Mr. BROUGHAM said, that one word in explanation,
however far he had gone in discussion. was necessary. The
Noble Lord opposite had endeavoured to make it appear
that he had held lightly the military reputation of the Duke
of Wellington. Now he asked every member of the House,
without exception, whether the words which he had used
had been not only entirely free from any such construction,
but whether they did not bear an entirely opposite construc-
tion ? He entirely agreed in the Noble Lord's proposition, that
what he said could not matter to the Duke of Wellington.
All Europe was aware of the Noble Duke's talents and de-
serts, hut it would matter considerably to him, if he should
be supposed so utterly foolish as to have uttered any senti-
ments but those of respect and gratitude to the Duke fur
the military services which he had performed to this coun-
try. Did not the Noble Lord himself recollect his (Mr.
gone out of his way to remind the
Brougham) having
House that he himself; in that House, over and over again,
when those persons with whom he was connected by party
had been disposed to hang back, had absolutely urged the
Government to place larger means at the disposal of the
Duke of Wellington? What he had said on the present

evening itlrA in dratving the line between the positions of a
Finance Minister and a Commander-in-Chief. If saying
that the Duke of Wellington was not qualified to be a
Finance Minister was attacking his military reputation,
those who took it to be so gave an original meaning to
words, and one which, in the ordinary usage of society,
they would not bear.
Lord JOHN RUSSELL defended his Hun. and Learned
Friend near him (Mr. Brougham) from the imputation of
the Noble Lord opposite (Lord Palmerston), and protested,
for the general benefit of the House, against a style, in af-
fairs of business, which dealt less in argument than in de-
clamation. lie (Lord J. Russell) recollected, that when
the Duke of Wellington, in the last Session, had proposed
a clause extremely inconvenient to the interests of the coun-
try, relative to the warehousing of foreign corn--when that
clause was afterwards commented upon, and objected to by
several Members, it was said,—how can gentlemen possi-
bly make an objection to this clause, when they remember
that this very day is the 18th of June, the anniversary of
the day on which the Duke of Wellington gained the battle
of Waterloo ? Now he felt great thanks were due to the
Duke for having gained the battle of Waterloo, but, neverthe-
less, the clause about the corn was a very injurious one to the
country ; and he protested against the practice hereafter,
that, whenever the Duke of Wellington should propose any
very objectionable operation, or make any financial blunder,
as a Prime Minister, that the House should be met with a
reference to his military services. The Duke of Welling-
ton having placed himself in a civil capacity, must submit
to he judged of in that capacity. He (Lord J. Russell)
could not help thinking that those very habits of command
which had been most befitting the Noble Duke in his mili-
tary station, and to which much of his success probably had
been owing, were likely to prove most objectionable and
dangerous in the situation of the first Minister of a free
country. Neither was he entirely satisfied by the state-
ment which the Noble Lord opposite had made on the sub-
ject of the command of the army. He must know how
that situation was intended to be filled, before he should be
convinced that some part of the patronage of it would not
still remain at the disposal of the Duke of Wellington in
his new capacity. He admitted that it was fair to wait
for the measures of the Ministry before the House decided
upon its character. He saw symptoms of danger in the
formation of the Government, but he would not make up
his mind definitively until he saw it act. There was one
point which would come under its consideration, and which
he would just mention, not less on account of its vital
importance, than because it had not been noticed by any
of the Hon. Members who had spoken before him—be
meant the condition of Ireland. No Government should
have his support, which did not adopt measures to improve
the situation of that country. On the point again of the
affair of Navarin, be regretted the phrases used in the
Speech. He was bound to take the meaning of the words
from the account of the Noble Lord opposite (Lord Pal-
merrton) ; but certainly, if they were not meant to inti-
mate that the Gallant Admiral who fought that battle had
fought it without instruction and unadvisedly, they were
the most unlucky words for their real purpose that could
possibly have been chosen. For himself, he believed the
battle to have been a glorious victory, and a necessary con-
sequence of the treaty of London ; and moreover, as honest
a victory as had ever been gained from the beginning of
the world. With respect to the affairs of Portugal, he
congratulated the House upon the termination of that affair,
and of the probable restoration to peace and security of
our ancient ally. This last expression put him in mind
of a rather ludicrous mistake which was commonly made
in discussing the affairs of Turkey. Turkey was spoken
of constantly as " our ancient ally." Now the fact was,
that there had never been any alliance between Turkey and
this country prior to 1799 ; and it was not twenty years
since, Mr. Arbuthnot had been compelled to fly privately
from Constantinople, from the fear that his personal safety
would be endangered by a violation of the ordinary rights
of Ambassadors.
Mr. CALCRAFT rejoiced to hear the Noble Lord's
(Lord Palmerston's) explanations of the phrases in the
Speech. He had always thought it impossible that they
should be meant to bear the construction which some of
his Hon. Friends hail put upon them.
Lord NORMANBY declared that he had no confidence
whatever in the present Government.
Lord PALMERSTON then moved that the House
should adjourn till Thursday next.
The House accordingly adjourned at 20 minutes past
seven o'clock.