The Sun.
London, England, 1845-06-07 00:00:00

ISLE OF MAN.

Dr. BOWRING gave notice that on Monday next he should
inquire of the Right Hon. Baronet the Secretary of State for
the Home Department, whether he had received any informa-
tion that a person named Scurry had been arrested and impri-
soned in Castle Rushin, in the Isle of Man ; and whether be
proposed to adopt any measures to prevent delays taking place
in the administration of justice in the Chancery Court of that
island?

COMMITTEE OF SUPPLY.
The order of the day for the House resolvin itself into
Committee of Supply was read for the purpose of being post-
poned to Monday next.
NOTICES OF MOTION. _ _

Mr. B. ESCOTT gave notice that on the order of the day
being read for the House going into Committee of Supply,
he should move for copies of the correspondence which had
taken place between the Court of Directors of the East India
Company and Lieutenant Morris, on the subject of that officer's
alleged ill ai dismissal from the Company's service.
SYRIA. _ _

Dr. BOWRING postponed the question of which he had
given notice, on the subject of Syria, to Tuesday next.
SALMON FISHERIES BILL.

7
The Salmon Fisheries Bill was committed pro forma, and
ordered to be re-committed on Wednesday week.
JUSTICES' CLERKS BILL.

On the motipn of Sir J. GRAHAM, the Committee on the
Justices' Clerks and Clerks of the Peace Bill was postponed to
this day week.

LUNATIC BILLS.

Lord ASHLEY then rose to move for leave to bring in two
Bills for the regulation of the ogre and treatment of insane
persons in England and Wales. The Noble Lord, who spoke
in such a low tone of voice as to be frequently altogether in-
audible, was understood to say that he felt it necessary to preface
his moires by a few preliminary observations. He proposed to
repeal all the existing Acts, and to substitute for them other
measures, containing those alterations and amend-
ments which time had rendered necessary. In
order to prevent misconception, he would at once
distinctly state that his measure related to England and Wales,
and not to either Scotland or Ireland. He should be glad if
they did--(" Hear, hear," from Mr. Fox Nlaule)—for he was
sure that there was not one civilised spot in Europe in which
lunatic paupers were in so degraded a condition as in Scotland.
He proposed dividing the lunatic asylums of this country into
classes. Under the old act of Geo. HI., no power was given
of discharging officers or patients who might have become sane,
and no return was kept of the state of the asylums. Great
amendments had been made in that Act. Since last year
the opinion which he had expressed that great abuses prevailed
in those asylums, had been confirmed by experience. No
doubt, great abuses did prevail, and would prevail, in such
institutions ; arid, although they could not wholly remove those
evils, they might go much further than they had hitherto gone.
Io the first place, he should propose the establishment of a per-
manent Commission, by which they would secure the entire
and exclusive services of persons conversant with the condi-
tion of lunatics. By appointing such a commission they
would do a great deal more for the proper management of those
asylums than any other steps which they could take. He proposed
to place lunatic hospitals under the same r•gulations as county
asylums, with provisions for the proper security of pauper lunatics.
They would likewise take powers for the commissioners to
authorise the admission of friends of lunatics into lunatic asy-
lums. They should likewise enforce true returns of
all single patients ; and a private Committee would
be appointed to visit the houses in which single
patients were confined; and he might just remark that
this precision wAs quite in conformity with the French law.
They would li iso take the power, which did not exist at
present, but which experience had proved to be necessary,
namely, a power enabling the Lord Chancellor to protect the
property of lunatics, against whom commissions might
be issued. These were the provisions and amend-
ments contained in the Metropolitan Act. The second
Bill which he should have the honour to propose
to the House was founded upon the report of last year, and re-
lated to the treatment of county lunatics ; and he
thought that he would not have much difficulty in
persuading tho House to pass the Bill. He would
not repeat at length the evidence which he had
read last year. Rut he would touch generally upon some of
the leading points. There were forty counties in England,
and there were but sixteen county asylu.iis, and of these several
were in a most discreditable condition. In the sixteen asylum
there was one which had eight hundred patients. One had
six hundred lunatics, another had five hundred, and several had
more than three hundred. It was found, also, that most of
the patients were incurable, and that a preference was given
always to recent cases. In consequence of the deficiency of
county asylums, lunatics were placed in the union workhouses.
In Redruth workhouse there were forty lunatics. In Birming-
ham there were seventy-one, and in the workhouses of England
avid Wales there was a total of 1,339 lunatics, who were
under no sort of care whatever.—(Cries of " Hear, hear.")
Let them now take the condition of the pauper lunatics in the
borough of Dartmouth, and they were not in any degree better
circumstanced than the cases he had already referred to. It
had been proved that the magistrate I had notthe n-
visited
the asylum there for above a year. n 1 co
dition of that asylum was again reported, and the state
of the paupers in that year was as bad as in former times.
Again, within the last six years, their condition had been made
known, and it was found so wretched that a commuaication had
to be made by the board to the magistrates of the county.
Many lunatic asylums, he was happy to say, exhibited an
honourable exception, but others were altogether intolerable,
and how could it be otherwise when paupers were taken in,
and
zbut an inadequate pittance paid for their support.—
Hear, hear.) If such were the case, it was but a
nmecoresary consequence that they should not be allowed
than a mere
asubthsistence. He would now refer to the
borough of Ty e u and read t
from the reportiedo the House an extract
there. The relativeor t? the condition of the paupers
• ar .joto.blee d then referred to the case of
in roof of the dreadful state
of fllt and Jones, in
of the lunatics there.
With respect to the ament:en,t d he proposed to introduce he
would briefly refer to thewould propose to convert the
Aet from a voluntary into a eompuleory one, and that every
Bounty where no asylum, rescnt existed should be obliged
to provide one. fie would') assimilate
rc the practice to the
system which existed in France with rtiitothese unfortunate
creatures. In that country there was no :tail district which had not its
asylum. Coanties where an asylum at pTr:eentenexerisatled should
rutles for
euitelvith those where there was none.
the regulation of the asylum should he submittedg the
Secretary of State for his approval ; and all lunaticos
living in the house, should be periodically visited.
The The Noble Lord then referred to the regulations
which related to the pauper lunatics, and proceeded
to carament on the other provisions of his Bill. The
Noble Lord proceeded to cite a number of returns, to
show that the existing asylums were wholly insufficient to ac-
commodate the patients of the country, and the consequence
was, he said, that :many hundreds of lunatics became
been
incurable, who would_
they been properly treated in .`he first instance. He also
easily recovered had
quoted the opinion of Dr. Winslow, to show that in nine
cases out of ten lunatics were easily' recovered, if
th,ree
they were subjected to proper treatment
months after the appearance of the disore;ir.
He knew this was an exceedingly dry and uninteresting sub
ject, but he would not detain the House very long with them—
he would merely give a few detaits. The Asylum at Hanwell
bed coat 106,000/., or at the rate of 160/. per
head, for every patient it contained. The Surre y
Asylum cost 86,000 L, or, at a cost per head equally
large, and so on with the others. Now, it was his opinion,

and that of his colleagues, that they could substantiate the
case he would lay before the House upon this question. His
opinion was that an asylum that would cost at the
rate of 80/. per head would be sufficient for the very best
asylum that the country could require, including every
comfort and convenience for the patients. In fact
there had been a great error committed in the
construction of these asylums. He admitted that there should
be a distinction made between the treatment of chronic and re-
cent cases. The former required good clothing, a great deal
of air and exercise, and, above all, continued occupation in
the open air; but they did not require the same food and me-
dical care that recent cases did. Now, the proportion of
changes that he would propose were these :—There were
12,500 pauper lunatics in England and Wales, requiring care
and maintenance at the public expense ; deduct from that 10
per cent. for incurable cases, 6 per cent. for chronic cases,
and the remainder, or 40 per cent., would be what he would
call recent cases. The gross expense to the country for the
asylums for recent cases would then be 80,0001. ; that was to
say, for the chronic cases 50/. per head, or a total of 16,0001.
The violent or epileptic cases he would class amongst the recent
cases. The accommodation of 300 of those would cost
30,330/, and it would be proposed to levy this sum at the rate
of 600/. per annum off the county as a county rate.
This rate of charge was much lower than the present
rate, for the eleven county asylums now in this
country cost at the rate of 1701. per bead.
The expense entailed on the country under the present sys-
tem was very great, and, calculating the average lives of lu-
natics at ten years, which was considerably below the average,
they cost 9601. each. By the plan which he proposed they
would save in the county of Middlesex—and that was a fair
average—they would save an annual expense of 30,0001.
Under one course of treatment the cures were 70 per cent.,
with 30 incurable. Under another—that is, in the workhouses--
the cures were no more than 6 per cent, with 94 incurable cases.
The objects of these Bills was to provide for proper treatment
for pauper lunatics. From the time of the Reformation to
their own day the contrary course had been pursued with re-
gard to them, and whipping, chains, and dungeons were
the means taken to reclaim them. The honour of
a different state of things certainly belonged to
the Commissioners, and it was to them they were indebted for
a better arrangement of their lunatic asylums. But for the hu-
mane discovery whereby the revolting treatment originally
adopted had been discontinued, they were mainly, if not exclu-
sively, indebted to the ennobling researches of Pinelle. That
eminent physician had considered the subject in its broadest
view—he contemplated the relief of forty sufferers, and began
by unchaining twelve. He first liberated an English officer,
who had been confined for fourteen years, and whose existence
had been almost forgotten. He tended this wretched inmate.
whose keepers were afraid even to approach him. One he had
killed a short time previously. Yet Pinelle proposed to un-
chain him, on the condition that he would permit himself to
be restrained, by a strait waistcoat. The man scarce
comprehended, could not believe the terms, but his
limbs, after being fettered fourteen years, were li-
berated, and he obeyed the mandate mechanically. Sub-
sequently another inmate was freed, and in both cases with
eqpal success—( Hear, hear)—and eventually fifty-three were
similarly treated. That was a manly act--( Hear, hear)—and
would to God that all the rivalry between this and the French
nation was in emulating such noble deeds, in seeking the wel-
fare of mankind, and, by mutual harmony, keeping the world in
peace !—(Hear, hear.) For the introduction of that humane
principle into England they were chiefly indebted to the Society
of Friends and the family of the Dukes. Samuel Duke, the
brother of the eminent William Duke, was still alive, and
prosecuting his humane inquiries for the benefit of mankind.
He had gained the approbation of all the eminent physicians
in this country and in America. The treatment which he re-
commended was one of kindness. There was, in his opinion,
the greatest propensity on the part of the subordinate officers to
resort to coercive treatment. It afforded a vent for the gratifi-
cation of their pride, ignorance, and all the lowest passions. It
was absolutely necessary, therefore, that a system based upon a
more mild and rational treatment should be introduced. It was
their duty and their interest, too, to deliberate well on the
means which were best calculated to be applied to the treat-
ment of insanity. There they were to-day sitting in delibera-
tion, in the full possession of their senses, and to-morrow they
might be the victims of this awful calamity. It was
well known what slight causes often led to the de-
thronement of reason. Fever, reverse of fortune, domestic
calamity, and other causes of far less importance, often caused
this misfortune. The most exalted talents and the noblest
minds were frequently prostrated in a moment, and nothing
remained but the sad and silent reflection how frail was the
tenure by which man held one of the greatest blessings which
he enjoyed. It was in this spirit, therefore, that he called upon
the House to accept his propositions. The Noble Lord con-
cluded by moving for leave to bring in his Bill, and sat down
loudly cheered.
Messengers from the Lords brought up the Calico Print-
works Bill, and the Railway Clauses Consolidated Bill.
The debate was then proceeded with.
Sir J. GRAHAM said he rose with sincere satisfaction to
second the motion of his Noble Friend.--( Hear, and
cheers.) The House would remember the speech which
his Noble Friend made on this subject towards
the close of last session. That speech made upon him ( Sir
James Graham), in common with every Member who had
heard it, the deepest impression. He (Sir James Graham)
gave the House and his Noble Friend on that occasion an as-
surance on the part of the Government that it was impossible
any longer to neglect this subject. So important, so touch-
ing, and connected with the feelings—some of the most pain-
ful feelings, at the same time most humane feelings of our
common nature. He wished he could have devoted more
time to this subject, but he had had the satisfaction of receiv-
ing the most cordial assistance of his Noble Friend. With
reference to Ireland, his Right Hon. Friend the Secretary
for Ireland had already introduced a Bill upon this
subject. He had the satisfaction of stating that
the measure whieh his Noble Friend now sought to introduce
had been most carefully considered by her Majesty's Govern-
ment. It had come under the consideration of the Lord
Chancellor. A very large portion of this matter was con-
nected with the case of pauper lunatics in England and Wales.
That portion of the subject had been considered by the Poor-
law Commissioners in connexion with himself, and the pro-
visions now sought to be introduced with reference to pauper
lunatics met with their entire concurrence. With reference
to the subject generally, he also in common with his colleagues
had considered this Bill. He did not say that there were not
some of the details which in discussion might be altered with
advantage ; but, generally speaking, the Government gave this
' measure their most cordial support. He was deeply
indebted to his Noble Friend for the assistance which he had
received from him. He was more happy, indeed, to act in con-
cert with the Noble Lord than to lead the way. It would
be impertinent in him, after the able and impressive speech
which had been delivered by the Noble Lord on the subject,
to waste the time of the House by going into details which
could be more advantageously discussed in the progress of the
Bill through the House. At the same time, there were some
important matters to which he wished to allude—he meant
constant and official visitation by responsible officers.
,He
said last year, and he wcs now of the same opinion, that pri-
vate asylums—where there was frequently only one patient—
might to be placed under supervision, and even frequent visita-
tion.—( Hear, hear.) Facts had come to his knowledge, and
subsequent inquiry had led him to come to the conclusion that
such a step was necessary. Then, again, he was quite satis-
fied that some provision must be made for establishments for
patients—be would not say incurable—but of those whose in-
sanity bad assumed an aggravated form, as distinguished from
those whose insanity was but of recent occurrence. It was
impossible to resist the evidence brought forward by the Noble
Lord as to the way in which the charitable in-
stitutions of this country were crowded by incurable patients.
Then with reference to the saving of expense. He thought
that ample provision should be made, where it was possible, to
secure the placing of those whose case was hopeless under as
little restraint as possible.—( Hear, hear.) He knew of no
better object to which the rich could devote their superfluities
than this.—(Hear, hear.) The Noble Lord had said that the
treatment of the disease had been slow ; but, though slow, it
had been progressive. He complimented the Hon. Baronet
the Member for Denbighshire (Sir W. W. Wynn), for his
labours in connexion with the subject before the House. He
(Sir J. Graham) certainly thought that the time had arrived
when what had been so long submissive should now be com-
pulsory, and that means should be taken by law to provide for
the proper maintenance of lunatics. He had, therefore, the
greatest pleasure in seconding, on the part of the Government,
the measure brought forward by the Noble Lord.
Lord CLEMENTS said he had listened with great pleasure
to the speech of the Noble Lord by whom the measure had
been introduced. He would wish to know from the Right
Hon. Gentleman the Secretary of State what was the Bill to
be introduced for Ireland. It was restrictive and insufficient,
and the whole matter had been left entirely in the hands of Sir
Thomas Fremantle. He had conversed with the Chancellor of
Ireland, whom he was bound to say had exerted himself in a
most praiseworthy manner in behalf of the unfortunate lunatics
in that country. The exertions of that Nobleman had been
attended with the most successful results, and great praise was
due to him, but he should wish that a definite measure should
be brought forward for the indigent lunatics of Ireland. Ac-
cording to the present plan, it was customary to confine pauper
lunatics in the common gaol, and this plan levied a great extra
expenditure on the country. He wished to know what was
the definite plan intended for Ireland, for his own part, he did
not place much confidence in the judgment of the Vice-
Regent ; .as far as the measure related to England, it should
have his support.
Mr. FOX MAULE thought that the time was fully arrived
for the passing of such a measure as the present.
He had listened with great attention to the speech
of the Noble Lord, it had established for him the character
of a philanthropist, not on mere party grounds, but on a broad
and liberal basis. He would however suggest that inquiries
should be made into the state of management of lunatic asy-
lums generally. Scotland required considerable supervision
in the management of its lunatic asylums, and he would un-
hesitatingly say that there was not a single lunatic asylum in
Scotland, which would be compelled to receive a single pauper,
as the institutions were all managed on the voluntary principle,
and he would suggest to the Government that Commissioners
should be appointed to investigate and report upon the whole
matter as it was conducted in Scotland, so that the Govern-
ment might at once come to a conclusion, whatever might be
the objection on the score of expense. He considered it as
fair and only an act of justice that Scotland as well as England
should participate in the benefits to result from such an inquiry.
The LORD ADVOCATE expressed his dissatisfaction at
the present method of treating lunatics in Scotland. He had
for some time past been endeavouring to obtain some informa-
tion of the state of lunatics there ; and only on that morning
he had met with two gentlemen, who had proposed to him '
the establishment of a lunatic asylum on broad and unre-
stricted principles, but before he moved for any inquiry in the
matter, he would wait the result of the measure of the Noble
Lord as far as it would affect Scotland.
Sir G. STRICKLAND animadverted on the insufficient
protection afforded to pauper lunatics in Yorkshire, with the
exception of the West Riding. He was convinced it was not
in the power of any single individual to make an effectual
movement in the matter. It must commence with the House
of Commons, and the present measure would be found to be the
most beneficial measure that could be proposed.
Mr. BROTHERTON spoke as to the crowded state of some
lunatic asylums, and proposed that in no case should the
patients be allowed to exceed three hundred. He approved
generally of the plan of the Noble Lord, but
would wish that persons who were not exactly
in a pauperised condition, such as mechanics, artisans, and
others, should also have some institution to take refuge in, so
that their friends, who were for the most part only capable of
supporting themselves, should not be burdened with them.
After a few words from Mr. HENLEY and Mr. WYNN,
The question was put from the chair that the Bill be
brought in, which was carried.

COMMI (-TEE OF PRIVILEGES.
Mr. WYNN regretted to say, that in consequence of the
large number of papers which the Committee of Privileges had
been obliged to collect, and the searches they had found it
necessary to make, they would not be able to lay before the
House any report in sufficient time for it to be taken inte con-
sideration, as it had been intended, on Monday next. It
would lead him into too long a detail if he were to state all the
difficulties which the Committee had met with. What he had
to propose was, that the debate, which now stood adjourned to
Monday next, should be further adjourned to Monday week.
The order of the day was then discharged, and the debate
SLAVE-TRADE.
_
adjourned to next .111
THonEda

Mr. FORSTER gave notice that, on Tuesday next, he
would ask the Right lion: Baronet at the head of her Majesty's
Government whether there were any documents in the posses-
sjon of tho Government confirmatory of a participation, directly