The Sun.
London, England, 1819-02-03 00:00:00

kod that this was the only country in pe which
notes were not paid in gold. He denied the fact. No

111.4.p1e On the Continent liad.a circulating medium like 1 hat
of this country.—(Hear, hear, hear!)—ln France the pre-
cious metals were nut in such constant circulation (except
commercially) as had been supposed, and he knew of nu
country that had an advantage over this in its circulating
medium. Whenever the Right Howurable Gentleman
could make out that, by the state of the exchange, the
Bank could resume cash payments, not only consistently
with its own interests, but even at a reasonable sacri-
fice e•f its own profits to the greater interests of the pub-
lic, tilt,. lie would agree to the measure, provided that
it won!rl enable reproduction, and that faith were kept
syith tl,,•2ational creditor. But as to the proposal of the
Rig t Lion. Gentleman, he seemed to think that there was
n difti 2 ,'ty in t he` way of opening the hank; and another

'Nlepuher said that the plan of opening gradually was
injudicious. Now, he thought it injudicious only because the
state of the exchanges was such that all the cash was carried

to foreign tonntrit•s as soon as it was issued. In his opiniOn.

there was only one wise course to be pursued in opening the
Dank--and that was, first to fill the home market with a suf-

Ecient quantity of metallic currency, and not to open at once
without.ank substratum of specie. It was said, that at present
there was a difference of 7 per cent. between the Mint and
market price of gold. That was certainly true, and it was well
deserving of comsideration. NO merchant would iluy a yard
of cloth, or any past of our manufactures, while they could
niabethe importation 7 per cent. lower. This was obvious.
Our manufactures and other commodities now formed a ready
bec:inse they were competing with the price of gold.
In this state of thingq,, to opal the Bank would be to turn
it, not into the means of supplying the circulation of the
country, but to make it a market for the Exchange-broker,
where he might carry on his operations in trafficking in spe-
cie. But he could not consent to look at the Bank as if it

was an institution of no importance, and had no hold on the
country. ould not but look upon the Bank as having
materially assisted the country during the difficulties of the
war, and therefore as an object of respect and consequence
in the eyes of the nation. Why was the whole odium ut the
restriction to fall upon the Bank? Were they gainers by it
more than the other Bankers in the muntry ? True, the
difficulty now was the saute which operated last year. This
was shown by his Right Hon. Friend, and the arguments a,ll
statements of the Right Hon. Gentleman (Mr. T.) went to
show that these-difficulties not only continued but were in-

creased. But whatever were they defects of our paper system,
they were not to be compared to those which were incident
to the forced system of paper circulation which prevailed on
the Continent. Every Government in Europe was at this mo-
ment engaged on that problem which the House was now at-
tempting to solve—namely, how to get a metallic circulation.
But these Governments had taken up all the wild theories on
this subject, and the evil consequences were felt. They were
trying to effect their object by force, and were operating un-
naturally and violently to bring back a metallic currency.
The inconvenience of these mistaken proceedings would be
most severely felt in this county if cash payments were re-'
sunied during their continuance. The effect produced by
such operations in Continental States was not confined to the

particular comity), in which the measures were pursued, but
extended to the most distant of those'with whom they had

intercourse

A striking iostance of this might be mentioned

A loan of three millions in specie, which was bpened hi
Russia, "had such an effect in France (though so distant a
country), that the Bank of Paris, from the change thu's pro-
duced in the money market, was well nigh prevented from
making good its engagements to the holders of its notes.
In short, those experiments now going on in various Con-
tinental States- convulsed the ‘Riole system of exchanges
in Europe. Every one must recollect the over-ruling

necessity, which induced the change of system in 17.97.
That necessity was produced by the circumstances in
which the country was placed by the war. But it
must not be supposed that such difficulties were merely
incidental to a state of war. It was found that peace too
was not exempt from them, though there was certainly every
prospect that they would he only transitory. At present, the
rate of interest on the Continent was double the rate ill this
country. While that was the case, and while there was any
chance of procoring a tolerable security there, it must be
evident that the capitalists of this country would be desirous
of laying out their money where they got the highest re-
turn. At the same time, however, there were other causes

now operating to create a contrary current, and these, it was
probable, would, in time, produce a fundamental alteration
in the. rate of exchange, though that alteration must be
brought slowly and gradually. Till it took place, it was
in vain to think of removing the Restriction. But what
be complained of in the Right Honourable Gentleman
(Mr. Tierney), was his maintaining that we ought to per-
sist in resuming cash payments under whatever circumstan-
ces. Against such a doctrine he must enter his positive
protest. He must protest too against the notion that the
continuance of the restriction was a measure extorted by the
Bank, or a concession made to them because their interests
were so much concerned in it. It was not the Bank only that
was interested in the subject ; and he could see nothing in
the individual interests of the Directors of the Bank sufficient
to overcome that great feeling of national benefit, which must
actuate the-mind of every man who approached the considera-
tion of this most important question. It was a question to be
received without any political prejudices or feelings of per,
sonal interest; and he could assure the Rt. Hon. Gentleman
t hat/though he had on this occasion stated his sentiments on t he

general yuestion,w•ithout disguise, yet, if Ire had the honour to

be appointed a member Of the Committee, he would go into
it, divested of all Prejudices—he would even try to lay aside
and forget, if possible, all these sentiments—he would try to
go into the Committee with no other feeling than an anxious
desire to come at the truth—nor should he think it any
shame to change any of the opinions which he had this night
delivered„ if the Right Hon. Gentleman (Mr. Ties ney), or
tiny other, could persuade him that they were wrong.—(Hear,
hear, hear :)—ht the same time he trusted that the taunts
thrown out by the Right Hun. Gentleman about new Mem-
bers, could not prevent hint front thinking that the present
Parliament was so much composed of British materials—
(Hear, hear I)—that these taunts would have as little effect

on them and their constituents as they had on former oeca-,
sions. This was no new system with the Right Hon. Gentle-
man, and he could assure the new Members that they would
find it very often the tactics of the Right Hon. Gentleman,
when he could not persuade the House to agree with his opi-
nion, to try by sneers and taunts to throw ridicule upon their
o..i.n.—(llcar, hear, hear !)

Mr. B. I. COOPER. (Member for Gloucester) said, the
crew Members had been w frequently appealed to in the

course of the debate, that he, as one of their number, could
not remain quite passive on the occasion. It bad been said,
that the present occasion was likely to afford those Members
a field for distinguishing .themselves on the division. Ile
could not help thinking it very extraordinary that they should
look forward to a division upon a subject which promised
complete unanimity.=(A langh.)—Here was nd doubt about
the necessity of cash payments being resumed, when it could
be conveniently effected ; no doubt was entertained of the
propriety of instituting the most minute previous investiga-
tion; upon these points all parties seemed to agree. In his
mind, the only question upoli which Ilononrable Genthnuen
were at issue was the etiquette of going into that inquiry.—
The question would eventually solve itself into this, whether
the House would attach itself to the Motion of the Right
Honourable Gentleman (Mr. Tierney), or range itself. by the
Ann mltnent suggested by his Right Hon. Friend, the Chan-
cellor of the Exchequer. As a new Member, little able to
disentangle time embarrassments of complicated propositions,
he would give his vote for the Chancellor of the exchequer's:
Amendment, as being more precise.—(A Laugh.) -

Mr. MABERLEY—Having given a silent vote on the for-
mer occasion, when the Hon. Gentleman who had just left the
House (Mr. Tierney) brought forward this question, thought
it reiplisite to explain the grounds of his present opinions re-
specting it. In the year 1818 there were three reasons which
operated to carry the Restrictions, viz.—lst, Foreign Loans;
4d, The number of British travellers who were spending their
property in foreign countries ; and lastly, The badness of the
harvests. But now our'armies have come home our internal
affairs are going on prosperously. What then are the causes
which should continue the Restrictions? Whenvver the Bank
resumes cash payments the revenue must decrease ; the House
should therefore meet the means of guarding against the evil
of A defalcation in the revenue ; mid in order to do this, it ap-
peared to hint that some general system of taxaticn should be
resorted to.

Mr. BERNALL (a new Member) said, be entered this
House, as he hoped, with a little stuck of good sense and a
large share of honesty and independence He came this night
the .louse wiOunt any bias on this most important ques-
tion. He had listened very attentively to the speeches of the
Noble Lord and i he Chancellor of the Exchequer, and if front
them he had heard any thing in the least degree to remove
or change the impression produced on his mind by the Right
Hot. Gentlemen below him (Mr. Tierney), he would at least
have had the candour to confess it. But he beard no such
thing.

Mr. CANNING rose.—He said he could not help thinking
that all the arguments which had been adduced on either side
of the question were, at this stage of the business, quite pre-
mature. He would ask the House whether it were not a
titter period to deliberate upon these points when the House
should be in possession of the material information with which
the conclusions of the Committee would be able to furnish
them. He was unwilling to trespass long upon the attention
of the House; but some illusions which had been made im-
posed upon him a necessity of giving his opinions to the House
upon theanode which he thought most expedient for conduct-
ing the inquiry. If he understood rightly, this was the
only question upon which they were at issue; for the feel-
ing •seemed to be general, as to the merits of the case, every
party deploring the necessity of continuing the restrictions
on the Bauk, if such an event should happen. As for
himself, he bad ever but one wish, and ever viewed the
suiiject in one light. The restriction on the Bank was evi-
dently a departure from our monetary system, and he had
looked forward to the period when Cash Payments could be
resumed with an anxiety which did not fall short of the fer-
vency of its warmest advocates.—(Hear, hear, hear!)—He
would now state to the House what, perhaps, they would
evince some incredulity to receive; that when the question of
,continuing the restriction of Cash Payments, up to next July,
was agitated in that House, during the last Session, his Ma-
jesty's Ministers fondly hoped it would have been the last
time they would have occasion to submit to its consideratitm
that subject. Even in September and October, and so late as
November last, this hope was calculated upon. But since
that time, circumstances had happened, Which would again
impose upon them the necessity of proposing a renewal of
that measure, though they could not still abandon the expec-
tation that its duration would be very limited. He was
firmly of opinion, at the date of the renewal of the Restric-
tion Act, that the Bank would be opened at the time fixed;
and though subsequent affairs had not been so propitious
as he contemplated, he should still claim the credit of the
House fur his sincerity. It was now clear, that the Bank
could not resume, owing to' causes, the winding up of
which had been disclosed in time last year. Government,
w►lling that it should cease at as early a period as possible
in 1820, had first proposed it for January, and finally for
the March of that year, when it was expected Parliament
would be sitting, and it would receive its full discussion.—
But he could assure the House, that when a necessity
should exist for the measure it would be attended with the
fullest investigation. On the first night of this Session a
Right Honourable Gentleman had given an opinion upon a
subject in that House, which an event that happened next
day had an influence upon, and he should not
,be surprised if
Gentlemen at the other side wece ready to charge him with
inconsistency. This was a communication from the Bank,
which was a novelty in matters of finance, such a communi-
cation nut having taken place for 21 years; and perhaps they
might be charged with inconsistency for withholding this
communication from the House. "The Right Hon. Gentle-
man proceeded then► to argue that a Secret Committee
by b:ellot, though attended with reprehensible forms,
was the only mode useful to be adopted. He admitted
that it ought to embrace Members from fevery part -of
the House. A great multitude of pamphlets were afloat by
which the public mind was influenced, yet he thought that
House the only place where a right opinion was likely to be
formed of this question. These publications recommended
not a safe, but a, short way. He should never deny the prin-
elide upon which he acted, and he hoped the Right Hon..
Gentleman would not attribute to him any anxiety to
qualify. He had _reminded the House, of what he (Mr.
Canning) hail said on a former occasion, but he had not
told them how he had voted. He wished the Bank to re-
ttila Cash Payments, and he said so, but he did nut wish to
force open the doors of the bullion chamber. The Right
Hon. Gentleman, by hiss Motion that bight, wished to ex-
clude the Bank altogether.. The old way was to place time
world on the elephant, and the elephant o❑ the tortoise, but
l►e would place the world on the tortoise, and exclude the de-
!Arent. The Bank had now come forward for time first time in
twenty years, anti had made a voluntary communication to
Government, that they could not resume Cash Payments
‘vithin the period assigned by law. Timis was a new feature
in the transaction, and be should cute fur a Secret Committce

where information might be obtained, rather than for an
open Committee, which could do nothing. In 1816, the _Bank
had tried the experiment of partially resuming Cash Pa y-
merits. That effort on the part of the Bank Directors had
been hailed by the whole country, and he 'thought it, at the
time, the wisest and most - prudent plan they could adopt.'
But now be thought differently—experience had taught him
otherwise. By that partial resumption they had lost five
millions and a half—every body looked upon it at the moment
as the strongest evidence that the Bank was serious. Bnt it
failed,' not in cmsegnence of any fault of the Bank Direc-
tors. They bad done this with the /applause, not of Cato
alone, not of one sage, but of the whole world; yet it proved,
because the exchanges were against us, to be but so much

money thrown away. He should not vote for inquiry,
with a view to the Bank, but with a view to the pUblic ;
and he would vote for a secret inquiry, because the ele
ments of judgment would be found in it. The Right Hon.
Gentleman wished ,to have two Committees, perhaps—
one fur inquiry, and one to collect information, and then a
third, to report the progress of both !—(Hear, and laughter.)
The Right Honourable Gentleman Wished to exclude the
Bank altogether from his plan of inquiry: His conduct re-
minded him of the story of two theatres in one village, in
which Hamlet was played so frequently, that the inhabitants
at length got tired of it. One ingeniously then advertised to
perform the play with the omission of Hamlet.—(Laughter.)
He thought, if-the Right Hon. Gentleman bad been in that
village, he would have gone to the house where Hamlet was
omitted.—(Loud laughter.)

Mr. MANNING observed, that the question was one of great
national importance, in which the question of the Bank was
like a fly upon a wheel. If it was a question exclusively re--
garding the Bank, the House might name as short a period
as possible for returning to the old system ; but more caution
was required when it involved, as it unquestionably did, the
best interests .4 the country. The Bank had already lost five
or six millions of gold by the experiment of a partial opening,
and it was contended that the exchanges would have been
much more favourable, if increased issues bad not taken
place. He then entered into an examination of the returns,
but as he spoke from under the Gallery, and in a very low
tone of voice, we could not catch the particulars. We un-
derstood him, however, to draw this general inference front
the details, that the Bank, instead of increasing, had consi-
derably reduced-its issues. He denied :that the Bank had
offered any opinion to the House—it would have been pre-
tttnption in them to hare done so, the House being itself the
best judge of thetnea+uresthat ought to be adopted.

Mr. WIEN/FELL- remarked, that if the Hon. Gentleman
meant to contend that the Bank had considerably diminished
its issues during the last year, either the Han. Gentleman
was mistaken or the papers were incorrect, as he had made a
calculation that morning from the papers, by which it- ap-
peared that they were increased.
Mr. PLANNING explained. The Papers which would be
in a few days laid before the House' would shew the accuracy
of his statements.

Alderman HEYGATE drew a serious picture of our Na-
tional Finance. He wished to know what would become of
the country, if our affairs continued longer in the present
state of perplexity and alarm?
Mr. TIERNEY hoped that the House would indulge him
with its attention for a short time, while he felt himself call-
ed upon to reply to some remarks which had been advanced
by the Gentlemen 'on the opposite side. He could not help
observing that he had been dealt with unfairly; he had been
accused of saying every thing against the Bank of England.
Such an assertion was illiberal and erroneous in the extreme,
for-it was within the recollection of Gentlemen when he now
unequivocally affirmed, that he never had advanced one syl-
lable against the Bank of England. He felt Eerionsly far tile
awkward situation in which the Bank of England was, with
respect to the apparent necessity of continuing the restriction
from cash payments. He therefore sympathised with the
Bank; but while he confessed this alteration of his mind. he
found himself Imperiously called upon to discharge his duty
to the public. And, for acting agreeably to these nu-
pressions, he was r.bliged to encounter the reproach
and ridicule of the Gentlemen on the opposite side
of the House One Right Honourable Gentleman had
exercised his talents for jocularity and wit, at his expellee—
The Right Hon. Gent. thought that he had,nade a Irti:py al-
lusion to his (Mr. Tierney's) conduct, by comparing him to
the country manacrer, who, for the sake of novelty, attempted
to play the tragedy of Hamlet, by the omission of the part of
Hamlet himself. With every deference to the keenness of the
Right Honourable Gentleman's wit and sarcasm, lie could not
conceive the felicity of his adaptation. For the sake of va-
riety, they bad also been entertained with the 'fine (figure of
the fly upon the wheel ! This was no new invention of those
who endeavoured to make us laugh at our national calamities.
In regard to its connection with Government, the Bank of
England had been described as the fly upon the wheel of the
himself as the tly upon the wheel of the
former. But he w(aisisipiflayoepdinbioynrtelpiartesetlnite guinfigtrheewcohnalndeehlaliv,er
y
of
feaeltlilii),ei
on
frf;c:
ihlbgeaqi paunpeidrl
The House then divided, when there appeared—
For Mr. Vansittart's Amendment
Against it l6B •

Majority—. lO9
Adjourned at ONE O'CLOCK this morning.

From the LONDON GAZETTE of February 2.

Pavilion, Brighton, Jan, 30, 1819.

His Royal Highness the Prince Regent was this day pleased,
in the name and on the behalf of his Majesty, to confer the
honour of Knighthood upon William Webber Doveton, Esq.
late oft the Council of the Island of St. Helena, and Lieu-
tenant-Colonel of the St. Helena Volunteers.