The Sun.
London, England, 1845-05-01 00:00:00

ROMAN CATHOLICS RELIEF BILL.

On the motion that this Bill be read a second titre,
Sir JAMES GRAHAM said he trusted that the Ho-
nourable Member would consent to p stpone the
mot d reading of this Bill until after the Whitsun
belida3s. Tnere were several points in this Bill which were
at present under consideration by a Commission on a similar
Bill. Ike Commission upon that Bill had not yet made their
report to her Majesty's Government, and the Ministry were
anxious to obtain the benefit of this report before
they entered upon the consideration of this Bill.
He, therefore, trusted that the Hon. Gentleman would not
deprive him of the advantage of that report, but that he would
postpone the second reading until after that report had been
received.

Mr. WATSON said that he had not the slightest objection
to comply with the request of the Right Honourable
Baronet, provided no obstruction was offered by the
Govt rnment in consequence of that report to the pro-
gress of the Bill. It should be recrillected that this
Bill bad passed the Lords in the last session of Parliament.
He was fearful 'i.nat some obstruction might arise from the report
of the Coin Mission to which the Right Hon. Baronet had al-
luded, but as he was anxious for the principle of the Bill,
bewoul I prefer that it was read a second time to-night, and that
the discussion upon it should be taken when it came before the
Committee. He was not anxious about the time at which the
Bill was passed ; but as it might obviate some inconvenience,
he would rather that the second reading were taken
now than deferred to a future period, and the
more so as the r ord Chancel'or, during its progress through
the Lords last session, had termed it an imperfect measure, and
he OW not wish to subject it to the same imputation.
Sir JAMES GRAHAM said nothing was further from
the wish, of her Majesty's Government than to offer
arty obstruction to the progress of this Bill. But, as the report
of the Commission materially affected many of the details of
this measure, he thought it would be better to postpone it
until that report had been received, and name some day
after the Whitsun ht.lidays for brioging it before the Hens-,
the mote so as it referred not only to her Majesty's Roman Catho-
lic subjects in this country, but also tho.e in Scotland and Ireland.
He was sure the Hon. Gentleman would see on rt flection the
urgent necessity that at present existed for postponing the
second reading of this Bill.
Mr. WATSON consented not to press the second reading
on the present occasion, but he begged it to be diatinctly under-
sto id that after the Witsuntide recess he should take the
earb'st i,pportunity of moving the second reading of the The principle he wished to establish by the Bill was, that all
laws affecting persons so far as regarded their religion. should
be obliterated from the statute.b.ok.
Sir R. R. INGLIS said he should reserve what he had to
say upon the subject till a future occasion.
The second reading of the Bill was then postponed till
Wedaesday, the 2Eth of May.

ARRESTMENT OF WAGES.
Mr. DUNCOMBE said that he had intended to move the
second reading of the Arrestment of Wages (Scotland) Bill
this night, and he had hoped that it might be allowed to
through the remaining stages. The object ofsaitmweas
ri() - p
putass
the working classes in Scotland on the
with those in England and Ireland, and thurtirng
hiving them and their employers from a roost vexe;
times and oppressive system. He found that there
would be very great difficulties in the way of remov-
ing the arrestment of wages altogether, and he ob-
served that there were many conflicting opinions in Scotland
upon the subject He had seen several persons from
that country, and after the representations they had
made to him, and their desire that he should
make some modifications in the mea,ure, he was convinced of
the necessity for so doing. They proposed to forward a draft
of a Bil, which would meet the views of all parties, and he be-
lieved that they had_ communicated with the Lord- Advocate
on the matter. He (Mr. Duncombe) must say that,
considering the opinion entertained by them, they had taken a
fair and liberal view, and they appeared prepared to grant con-
cessions in order to „et some unanimity on the subject. The
Commissioners would have power to take into conAderation
the circumstances of the man, and of his family, and to decide
what portion of his wages should be retained and what given up.
H. did not know whether their views met those of the
LOrd•Adeocate, but as the Hon. and Learned Member
Asa satisfied, he wished to place all parties on an eguit-

able footing ; he should, therefore, wish to have this Bill
discharged, on condition that he should be allowed to introduce
a new Bill having reference to the same subject.
The LORD-ADVOCATE, who was almost altogether in-
audible in the gallery, was understood to express his approval
of the course pursued by the Hon. Gentleman. The subject
vas full of difficulties, but he should be glad to give the Hon.
Gentleman any assistance in his power.
Mr. FOX 01AULE was understood to say that great in-
convenience would result from disturbing the present system.
Sir JAMES GRAHAM spoke in a low tone of voice,
with his back to the gallery, so that it was extremely
difficult to collect even the gist of his observations. He
had taken great interest in this matter, and felt great
anxiety to remedy the evils which existed in the arreetment of
wages in Scotland. He had communicated with Sir William
Rae on the matter, who was disposed to favour considerable
alterations in the present system. Any interference with it was
likely to spread the pernicious truck custom, and any
stringent penalties for " trucking" would engender strong
opposition from every principal party in Scotland.
At the same time, he was not prepared to say that some plan
of legislation was not necessary and expedient upon this sub-
ject. As the law now stood, he was not prepared to say
with certainty what legislative measure would be introduced,
but he was quite sure the Government would give all the as-
sistance in their power to the promotion of the object the Hon.
Member had in view. _ _ _

equal to the charge from London to Trowbridge, but
by the formation of this railway the southern counties
would be opened up for the supply of wool, and a great
advantage would be obtained in speed, certainty, and cost.
The chief market for Trowbridge cloth was London, with
which the communication was at present expensive. The
coals used at Trowbridge were brought from Radstock, chiefly
by carts, though there was a canal communication to Ilford,
within a short distance of Trowbridge. The price of the best
Radstock coal at the pit was 10s. a ton, though he could not
speak precisely as to the price at Trowbridge; the rate at
Yeovil being about 20s. a ton. The price of the Warmin-
ster coal was about 15s. a ton. The price of the New-
castle coal at Salisbury was 345. to 365., and of the Somer-
setshire coal about 24s—the whole being carried by land.
To an inquiry by the Ca.uUMAN, Mr Saunders stated that
the coal at the pit's mouth charged at 108. was all round
coal, and if the Radstock coal could be delivered
at 18s., he believed that the Somersetshire coal
would beat the Newcastle coal out of the field,
though he could not state at present which of the two coals
had the preponderance in the Salisbury market, but from his
communication with several gentlemen at Bridport, Wey-
mouth, and other places, he believed that the Newcastle coal
would be preferred. He could not say what was the number
of pieces of woollen cloth made at Trowbridge, but it was
considerable.

Dlr. RUTHERFORD called the attention of the Lord-
Advocate to the law of arrestment as- it now stood, and said
that one of its defects was, that in many cases arrestments
were made which were illegal, and at the same time in-
effectual. _

Mr. Hemmings, solicitor of Weymouth, stated in reply to
the inquiries of Mr. Slyhead, that the chief import ports of
that coast were Bridport and Weymouth, from which the
only communication with the interior was by land carriage.
Great part of the goods was brought by sea, but the com.
munication by that means was very uncertain and tedious,
and that caused many goods to be brought by waggon during
winter. The town of Weymouth was largely supported by
visitors from the north, and as the retail trade of the town
was enhanced by this circumstance, the formation of the
railway would increase the number of visitors from the north,
and consequently the trade of the town would be largely in-
creased by this means. The town had lately lost the
Channel Islands packets, which had gone to Southampton,
and the expenditure of these packets was about 16,0001. a
year, and the inhabitants believed that those packets would
be restored if this railway were formed.
To an inquiry from the CHAIRMAN, Mr. Hemming stated
that the chief coal used in Weymouth was the Newcastle and
Radstock coal, with some coal from Wales.
A conversation then ensued respecting the proof of the pre-
amble, the result of which was that Mr. Greenwood and Mr.
Whateley, Q.C., stated that they did not abandon their op-
position, and it was agreed that the inquiry should be re-
sumed to-morrow.

Mr. T. DUNCOMBE asked if the Right Hon. Gentleman
opposite would ague to the suggestion of his Hon. Friend near
him, that there should be no arrestment of wages except upon
execution ? if the Lord Advocate would give the assurance that
he would take up the subject, he (Mr. Duncombe) would not
oppose the discharging of the order.
Sir G. CLERK was understood to assent, and the order
was then discharged.
On the order of the day for the second reading of the Canal
Companies' Tolls Bill and Canal Companies Carriers Bill being
read,
Sir JOSIAH GUEST objected to any delay of the reading.
Sir GEORGE CLERK. suggested that the objections
should be postponed till the third reading.
The Bills were then read a second time.

AUCTION DUTIES.
Captain PECHELL wished to know when the auction duties
were to be remitted ?

The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said that
it was impossible to remit the duties till the Bill had passed and
received the royal assent.

Mr. Vyvian was then called to certify to the capital and
shares of the Company, by whose evidence it appeared that
the capital proposed was 1,500,000/., with power to borrow
500,000/. more; the Scrip subscribed for was 1,152,3ni.; the
amount of deposit 57,615/. ; the number of, shareholder,
having no local interest 182, :who sTbsr;;Ded 196,400/. ; and
other subscribers were 150, with a ;Hare property of 955,900/.
Of these 117 were subscribers to the amount of 2,000/. and
upwards. .
•'

COMMON-LAW PROCESS BILL.
This Bill was read a first time. To be read a second time on
Monday week.
Petitions against the grant to Maynooth were presented by
Mr. Wilson Patten and Mr. Wakley ; and a petition in favour
of the grant by Lord Jocelyn.
The House then Adjourned at Six o'clock.

After receiving ',:ne evidence of Mr. Vyvian, the Committee
adjourned till iwelve o'clock to-morrow.

PARLIAMENTARY BUSINESS.
TUESDAY, APRIL 29.
NOTICES GIVEN AT THE PRIVATE BILL OFFICE.

SCOTTISH CENTRAL RAILWAY.
Group DD.

Blackburn, Burnley, Accrington, and Colne Extension
Railway,—Report, Thursday, May 1.
Eastern Union and Harwich Railway and Pier,—Com-
mittee on petition, adjourned till Friday, May 2.
Harwich and Eastera Counties Railway (No. 2),--Com..
mittee on petition, adjourned till Friday, May 2.
Leeds, Dewsbury, and Manchester Railway,—Committee
on Bill, adjourned till Friday, May 2, at twelve.
Trent Valley Railway,—Committee on Bill, adjourned till
Thursday, May 1, at eleven.
Belfast and Ballymena Railway,—Report, Thursday,
May 1.
Eastern Counties Railway (Ely and Wh ittlesea),—Report
Thursday, May 1.
Lynn and Ely Railway,—Committee on re-committed Bill,
Monday, May 5, at twelve.

On the re-assembling of the Committee this morning
Sir T. PHILLIrs then went on with his cross-examination
of Mr. Mitchell, and endeavoured to show that his calcula-
tions of the traffic were greatly exaggerated, and did not
furnish the Committee with a fair average of; he quantity of
goneral goods which might be expected along the proposed
line. The witness was questioned at considerable length on
the articles of passengers, •coals, lime, pig iron, cattle, and
goods generally; but the main features of his previous evi-
dence were not altered.

Mr. HOPE then called Mr. Daniel Kennedy, an extensive
cattle dealer. He stated that he purchased the principal
part of his cattle in Ross-shire, Perthshire, and Inverness-
shire, and usually disposed of them at Falkirk and the
Southern markets. The average number of cattle that
he drove in the course of a year amounted to 1,500 black
cattle, and 4,000 sheep. He was a larger dealer in black
cattle than any other drover in the county—but there were
several more extensive dealers in sheep than himself. He
was perfectly acquainted with the line of the proposed
Scottish Central Railway, as it was directly in the usual
route taken by drovers in bringing cattle from Perth, Rosa,
and Inverness, to the southern markets. If the line
were made he would send his own cattle by it in preference
to any of the present modes of conveyance, and from con-
versation he had had with other dealers he was persuaded
they would do the same. The time that would be saved by
transmitting cattle by railway would be full three days; and
they would also be less exhausted at the end of theirjourney,
and would sell to better advantage in the market.
This witness was cross-examined by Sir THOMAS PHILLIPS,
but nothing material was elicited.

RAILWAY COMMITTEES.

(YESTERDAY.)

Group G and G 2.
WILTS AND SOMERSET RAILWAY.

The Wilts and Somerset Railway was taken into conside-
ration before this Committee. The Hon. T. H. Liddell,
thairman. .

The line before the Committee was called the Wilts,
- - - - - -

omerset, and Weymouth Railway, the object of which was
tomake a railway from a point of the Great Western Rail-
way to Salisbury, thence to Weymouth, with branches to other
places in Wilts, Somerset, and Dorset, commencing in the
the parish of Corsham, near Chippenham, thence to Salis-
bury 36 miles, thence to Weymouth 75 miles, with a branch
to Bridport of 9 miles in length. The line would pass Frome,
Bradford, Trowbridge, and Yeovil, and the agricultural
towns of Devizes, Salisbury, Dorchester, and Warminster;
the seaport towns of Bridport, Weymouth, and the district
of Radstock. This line would form a communication between
the Southampton and Dorchester and ~he Bristol and Exeter
Railways. The estimated cost was 1,500,0001., or about
12,0001. a mile; the returns being 157,803/, and allowing
40 per cent. for working expenses, the gross amount
would leave a return of net income of 94,6821. The number
of the population likely to be benefited by it was 1,787,000.
Nine petitions had been presented against it, but three were
withdrawn. The line was opposed by the Somerset Coal
Canal Company, by the trustees of the Melksham Turnpike
Road Trustees. and by persons at Devizes, and by several
owners of property on the line.
Mr. Brunel, examined by Mr. AusTnT, stated that the line
passed through Corsham, Wilksham, Trowbridge, West-
bury, Warminster. Salisbury, Frome, Yeovil, Burton. Dor-
chester, and Weymouth. There was a branch from Melks-
ham to Devizes, one from Dorchester to Bridport, and one
from near Yeovil to Sherbourne, the total length being 129
miles. No repairing difficulties of any amount. There
were no tunnels, but there were several turnpike-
roads crossed by the line: the Shepton gradient on the line
was one in 44 but no gradient was of any considerable im-
portance. The only line at all likely to interfere with this
line was one now in course of construction from Salisbury to
Southampton.

Mr. Floahart, cattle-agent, was then called. His evi-
dence merely tended to corroborate Mr. Mitchell's statement
of traffic in cattle, as far as regards the neighbourhood of Perth.
Mr. COCKBURN proceeded to examine Mr. Errington,
civil engineer, as to the merits and mode of construction of
.the proposed line. He had conversed several times
with various noblemen and gentlemen, who owned
.land in the neighbourhood, and .all of them had ex-
pressed a favourable opinion of the scheme. He had
several times gone over the portion of the line ex-
tending from Stirling to Perth; and conjointly with Mr.
Locke, the eminent engineer, had surveyed the remaining
portion. The first terminus was proposed to be erected at
Perth, on the eastern extremity of a space called the South
Inch, of which place a portion of 5 acres would be required
for the station, and a further quantity of 20 acres would be
necessary for the line. The locus of the station had been
Pointed out by the Committee and members of the Town
Council. of Perth, and he considered they expressed the
general opinion of the inhabitants. The locality of the pro-
posed station was particularly adaptei for the pur-
poses of the railway, on account of its close ap-
proximation to the harbour • and it was intended
to lay down a line of rails from the station to
the quays to facilitate communication with the shipping.
The site of the terminus would combine very well with the
Scottish Midland station, and would form -a
good central
point for several lines to merge in. Some little disparity
would be experienced in bringing the station of the pro-
posed line f:om Perth to Dundee, but the obstacle could be
easilyarrang ed. The course which the Scottish Central Railway
would pursue in the line as at present laid out was to proceed
from Perth to Moncrief-hill, through which a tunnel would
be made of 990 yards in length, and no difficulty gould
be experienced in boring, owing to the extremely favourable
nature of the strata, which consisted for the most part of
sand-stone. The line would then follow the course of the
Allan, near to Auchterarder, thence passing close by Black-
burn, would touch Dumblane, near Allan-bridge, and pro-
ceed in that direction to Stirling, in the Midland district,
.where it would combine with the Edinburgh and Glasgow
Railway by two forks, one of which would traverse
the Bannockburn coal-fields. The whole length of the main
line was 45 miles, and the branch to Falkirk measured two
miles. The total length of the railway amounted
to rather mo
than 47 miles. The gradients were
all as fa"-arable as the hilly nature of the ground
through which the line passed would admit, and no engi-
nef.:::ing difficulties of a severe nature presented themselves.
The steepest of these gradients was lin 74. He had omitted
to mention one tunnel of 704 yards in length, which
passed through a park in the neighbourhood of Dumblane.
The tunnel would be excavated, solely to prevent any in-
jury arising to the park, which would happen if the works
were carried on on the surface. The estimated average ex-
pense of the construction of the line amounts to a total of
850,0001., for which sum the entire works are contracted to
be done, including every possible contingency, by Messrs.
Brassey, M‘lienzie, and Stephenson, the large contractors.
The earth works, including every sort of excavation, amounted
to 3.807,596 cubic yards, which would be worked at the ave-
rage price of 111 per yard. The Scottish Central Railway,
considered as a trunk 'line for opening up a communication
with the north and south of Scotland was highly desirable,
and was also the most direct and eligible line that could be
adopted. From its central position it offered every facility
for the construction of branch lines and ramifications.
Mr. Errington was submitted to a long cross-examination
by various Counsel, but the principal features of his evidence
remained unaltered.

The piincipal opposition to this line to-day was offered by
Mr. Wetherell, on behalf of Captain Williams, of Herringston
Holise, near Dorchester. It appeared, from inquiries by the
Chairman and Mr. Christopher, that the railway passed
at the distance of about 627 yards from the house. The
gradients varied from 1 in 45 to lin 79. Near the tunnel
which was intended to be made not far from this house, the
gradient was 1 in 54, but there was no gradient in the tun-
nel. Had the line been carried according to the line pro-
posal by the opposers of the railway, the injury to Captain
Williams's property would be greater than that likely to ac •
crue from the line laid down by himself, inasmuch as the line
would, in that case, pass over the roads which gave daily access
to the house, and, in his opinion, the railway could be no an-
noyance to Herringston House, as the line could not be seen at
300 yards from the house. The house itself was the old house,
which, by the inquiries of the counsel, had been io possession
of the family for 700 years; but, according to the opinion of
Mr. Brunel, it was like an old knife with a new blade av's,' a
new haft, and which, consequently, bad no claims for ;',ue con-
sideration of the Committee which should in
change their line. Captain Williams - ''.:ace them to
../as resident in
Ireland, and before the Committee co did
him it was necessary to deposit ..na communicate with
.l. plans with the clerks
of the peace. The house
an old house, but the chief
feature in the house was an ugly
one—it was an old ceiling
in the drawing-roor-
To an inquty
by the CHAIRMAN, it appeared that the
branch to
rilyevizes was to terminate at a station at the back
of the:tSear Inn, behind which there was a field some sixty
..,et lower than the market •place. It appeared that the
' station at this place had been made at the request of the
authorities at Devizes, but he did not think that this eleva,
Lion would be any material objection to the formation of the
station.

By the examination of Mr. GREENWOOD, who appeared for
the Somersetshire Canal Coal Company, it appeared that the
distance of the line from Bingley to Salisbury would be 83
miles, and to Bridport 73 miles. The length of the branch from
Melksham to Devizes would be 7 miles, and that to Radstock.
which was a circuitous branch, world be eight miles, the direct
road to the latter place being about seven miles. He expected to
meet the Seaborn coal a little below Yeovil which would be
brought to Weymouth, and his impression was that the
Somersetshire coal would be a great deal cheaper at the
pit's mouth than the Newcastle coal, and this coal
would, if the railway were formed, beat the New-
, castle coal out of the market. His reason for
this opinion was that the South 'Wales coal was
now brought into competition with the Newcastle coal, not
far from Weymouth, at the present time. To an inquiry by
the Chairman, it appeared that the public were likely to be
benefited by the competition of the Radstock and Somerset-
shire coal with the Newcastle coal, and it was Mr. Brunel's
opinion, that if the Radstock coal were a shilling cheaper, it
would supersede the Newcastle coal. Yeovil is the dividing
point, being a large town between the north-east and south-
west district of the county.
The price of the Radstock coal at the pit's mouth was about
Bs. a load, and the price of carriage, according to the inquiries
of Mr. Slyhead, would be about 11d. a ton. The Newcastle coal
which would be supplied to that district would be about 255. a
ton, while the price of the Radstock coal would be about 15s.
a ton. When the Melksham road is crossed, it would be in-
tercepted by the station, and it was a provision of the Railway
Clauses Consolidation Bill that all trains should slacken their
speed, on reaching a turnpike-road, to the rate of four miles
an hour.

Mr. HOPE then called Mr. Locke, the engineer, who
stated that he had heard nearly all the evidence which had
been tendered by Mr. Errington, and was prepared to concur
with him in every particular. The station at Perth
had been fixed on as the most eligible, without
reference to the Dundee line; but it was possible
for a general arrangement to be made, which would meet the
convenience of that line and others. The accommodation of
these lines would be a matter of after consideration, as the
Bills for the companies referred to had not yet come before
the Committee. In his opinion the best plan would be for
the station to be erected on the South Inch, as at present pro••
posed, and any future alteration or arrangement would be
a.matter of general discussion amongst the companies of the
different lines.

Mr. Locke underwent a long cross-examination, but
nothing further of material importance was elicited.
At the close of this witness's examination, the Committee
adjourned till twelve to-morrow.

Mr. SLYHEAD, who appeared for the Company, intimated,
that as the difference between the Company and Captain
Williams was likely to be arranged, he would ask Mr. Brunel
no questions on that point, but would, in the event of that
matter not being arranged, reserve his inquiries.
Colonel L. Phipps, an acting magistrate, living within
about five miles, of Devizes, which place he had been in the
habit of visiting as a magistrate and otherwise daily for
the last twenty-tive years. lie was one of the provisional
Committee, and was well acquainted with the spot where it
was proposed to make the termination of the railway, and
he thought it would be very inconvenient to make the ter-
minus of the railway. Since he came to London he had
seen a requisition, signed by a great number of the inhabi-
tants of the town of Devizes of the highest respectability,
who were opposed to the terminus as it was now proposed.
To a question by Mr. CHRISTOPHER, Colonel Phipps stated
that the market at Devizes was a pitch market, where the
farmers brought their corn in bulk and sold it on the spot,
and the town would be much affected by this railway.

Group C.
This Committee re-assembled to-day at three o'clock in
Room No. 11 ; Mr. Barneby in the chair.
HUDDERSFIELD AND SHE FIELD JUNCTION
RAILWAY.
This Bill was recommitted for the Committee to fix the
maximum rates of tolls and charges.
Mr. SAUNDERS, Secretary to the Great Western Railway,
in answer to the Chairman, said that it would not work to
the advantage of the public it the rates of charges were
fixed at too low a maximum, inasmuch as if the prices were
found not to pay, the companies generally would have to
refuse working their lines. This disadvantage would be felt
doubly where goods traffic was concerned.
At this stage of the proceedings the CHAIRMAN thought it
best not to open the case at all to-day, but to hear evidence
on the whole subject to-morrow.
The Committee adjourned till twelve to-morrow.

Group B.
The Committee re-assembled this morning at the usual
hour, and proceeded with the affirmative evidence in the case
of the

LEEDS AND WEST RIDING JUNCTION LINE.
Mr. Samuel Holland, of the firm of Samuel and Joseph
Holland, of Brighouse, said there was a considerable com-
munication carried on between Brighouse and Bradford, and
Brighouse and Leeds and Manchester. He thought the
West Riding Junction afforded mare accommodation to the
diArict than the West Yorkshire line.
ENGINEERING EVIDENCE.

. -
ranged that there was to be a m
At this point Mr. GREENWOOD
eienttiintabteedorteh:it
3ifiri.vaGsilaera:
it a
an engineer, and Mr. Brunel, throughrrwahaigcehd.the opposition
Captain Williams was likely to be a
In resumption of the examination of Colonel
Phipps p
prared that a considerable portion of the opponents of the
line were residents out of Devizes, and the terminus at the
Bear-yard was to be made in consequence of an understand-
standing entered into with the inhabitants of Devizes by Mr.
Brunel.
Col. 011ivier had been present at the meeting at which
this understanding was entered into, and the suggestion
with respect to the termination at the Bear-yard was
received unanimously, and he was not aware of any opposi-
tion to this proposition until lately—within the last week.
He was well acquainted with the site of the Bear- field, and
believed that the terminus at that place would be very incon-
venient, the road to it being an occupation road, and very
steep. In order to obviate this difficulty, they would have
to go a considerable distance round, and the base
of the hill was seventy feet at least below
the level of the summit. He conceived that a much
greater distance than 300 yards must be nne round to
obviate the steep ascent.
To the inquiries of Mr. GulasNwoot),.Cul. 011iVier stated
that the vale at the back of Dr. Brabant's' garden was 'a
very beautiful one, but the view of it was not Commanded
from the house, and therefore could not be affected by the
railway.
Mr. John Saunders, of Trowbridge, but who formerly re-
sided at Bradford, and carried on a considerable manufacture
these
of woollen cloth in that place. By the queries tf Mr.
Slvhead it appeared that the population of Trowbridge was
about 12,000, and of Bradford,h.
Thelo, o JO.
bulk
o f The
their staple 100 l ty
8- two towns was woollen clot
of
got
from London, and the charge of the carriage of wool from
Chippenhant, which was to the South of Trowbridge, was

Mr. Hawkahaw, a civil engineer, and the engineer of the
Manchester and Leeds and the Manchester and Bolton
Railway, was employed last year to lay out the West Riding
system of railway. The country through which it
passed was greatly undulating, and was thickly in-
habited over the whole district The country was an
extremely difficult one to carry a railway across, and under
any circumstances, or whatever route was taken, there must
be tunnels. He thought he had marked out the line
which would most benefit the public. He had struck
it out in branches. The first was the main line
from Leeds to Copley Mills ; the second from
Loumure to Bradford; the third from Loumore to Dews-
bury; and the fourth from Pickle-bridge to Brighouse. The
first branch would be 17 miles and 6 furlongs in length ; and
the greatest gradient would be lin 100. Upon that branch
they had five tunnels altogether, the total number of yards
in which was 4,207 ; and the length of arching on the
whole branch was 117 yards. The length of the second
branch was ten miles and four furlongs; it had one
tunnel 1,091 yards in length, and 220 yards of arching.
The severest gradient was one in seventy. The length
of the third line was two miles and three furlongs,
but there was no tunneL The severest gradient is one in
sibieravadennenthoy -
tunnel.othf r
the
TwThehe:t fourthcostyork
Yorkshire,
fhi
the
:eu was
es ttalci
Iro:en_oel
upmle,
dtii
competing
i6nc7,001
Company
pBga6t
nlh..
runningthe see°nd,
between 3 l 2,9L2e7e1d. s; andand
b. e r
of 1,138 yards, whale the in
length,
and altogether the ethe
the West Yorkshire than tunnels of 6,128 yards rdidge9,Bth64elre were five
fitsh-ee
governing gradient was 1 in 330,
and arching to the extent
works would be considerably heavier ou
Yorkshire had a line froman the
tunnels of 2,762 yards inen West Riding line. The West
Bradford to Dewsbury, with two
The West Yorkshire had no
*gtotus. e branch of the Wet* Riding
line tO Brighouse. The Bn

TUE SUN, LONDON, THURSDAY MORNING, MAY 1, 1845.

Junction placed Huddersfield and Bradford two-and-a-half
miles nearer to the main line. The arching of the Test
Riding was 337 yaqe) but the West and Yorkshire extended
to 1,138. The station at'Bradford would be at an elevation
above the ground, which he thought was an advantage, and
the same plan of raising goods which was adopted at Manchester
would be applied to the station at Bradford. At Halirak the
two stations possessed pretty much tlid same advantage, but
at Leeds the amount of advantage was decidedly in favour of
the West Riding Company. The inhabitants of the West
Riding complained that the route of the Manchester and
Leeds line was too long, and it was to reduce that route
that the Leeds Company had started the West Riding
scheme. The cost of the West Yorkshire line, estimated at
West Riding prices, would be 1,455,552/. The cost of the
West Riding would be 1,053,2771., thus showing that the
latter line would cost less by 3C0,000/., the interest of
which sum would supply locomotive power to the best
line in perpetuity. The West Riding fine would be
an expensive line. It would cost at least 34,000/ per mile.
It would have to compete with two railways and several
canals. There were no difficult curves on the line. The
total length of curve on the West Riding line would be 7
miles and 30 chains, and on the West Yorkshire 11 miles
and 10 chains.

The Witness was cross-examined at great length by Mr.
HILL, in the course of which he admitted that the curves of
the two lines were about equal, but his testimony relating to
the tunnelling of the two lines remained unshaken.
The cross• examination was not closed when the Committee
adjourned.

Group 0.
GRAND JUNCTION POTTERIES LINE.
The Committee met at twelve o'clock. Mr. Hawes,
Chairman.

Mr. APVeagh, engineer, called and examined—lle stated
that there were no engineering difficulties.
Joseph Locke, engineer examined—He stated that the line
from Bassford to Stoke was the best line that could be made
He did not think that a better line could be made. He
knew the country well. Hebelieved they had got the lowest
and best summit on their line, and the shortest tunnel.
He did not think any other line could be made cheaper.
The gradients on the line were not at all dangerous ; he did
not think it would be possible to make a line more conve-
nient for the inhabitants of the Potteries. If the Grand
Junction Company were not allowed to make a line from
Bassford to Stoke the inhabitants of the Potteries would lose
the great advantage of a line to the north-west. The Grand
Junction Company could convey the productsof the Potteries
cheaper than any other line. The inhabitants of the Pot-
teries were in favour of the line.
Cross-examined by Mr. MAcAuLAY—Does not recollect
that the inhabitants of the Potteries wished for a line to
Bassford. They wished for a line to Crewe. Witness consi-
dered thet a line to Bassford was the same thing as a line to
Crewe. The line by Bassford to Crewe was, in fact, ashorter
line than a line to Crewe direct, which would have to circle
Crewe Park. A shorter line than the line to Bassford might
be made, provided that expense was not an element taken
into consideration. The line to Bassford was the best line
with reference to convenience and expense.
Re-examined—Thinks that the Grand Junction Company
would be able to afford cheaper conveyance than any new
company. The potteries would be likely to lose the advan-
tages which the Grand Junction Company would be able to
afford them, if any other than their line were made. The
gradients on the proposed line arose out of the nature of the
ground. It would be better if the gradient of lin 100 were
1 in 200, but it would not present any serious obstacle.
Thinks that the line ought to be continued to Stafford. The
Trent Valley, he believed, covenanted to make, this con-
tinuation.

Captain Huish, Secretary to the Grand Junction Line, ex-
amined—He stated that in consequence of communications
with several influential inhabitants of the Potteries, the
Company sent engineers to survey tl:e Potteries district, for
the purpose of constructing a line. The engineers selected
the line known as the T line, but the inhabitants of the
Potteries, especially Mr. Ridgeway, objected to it. Mr.
Ridgeway's name was attached to the deed between -the
Trent Valley and the Grand Junction respecting the con-
struction of the line.

Further evidence in favour of the Grand :function Potte-
ries Line baring been heard, the Committee adjourned until
to-morrow.

THE TOTTENHAM AND FARRINGDON-STREET
EXTENSION RAILWAY.

This Bill was said in our Third Edition last night to be
thrown out by the Standing Orders Committee. This,
however, is not the case, the 13i11 is allowed to go om The
error originattd thittigh a raise rtinioilt raised in the passages
to the Committee-room, by some of the gentlemen whose in-
terests are compromised by the success of the promoters so far.
Sub-Committee No. 1.

The Committee re-assembled this day at twelve o'clock
in room No. 7 ; present Mr. Strutt, Chairman ; Mr. Villiers
Stuart, Mr. Brotherton, Mr. Cavendish, and Mr. Beckett.
The respective agents of the Bills set down for this Com-
mittee having conferred with the Chairman, It was agreed to
adjourn the following petitions for tilts !
The Goole and, Doncaster till to-morrow—the Midland
Railways Company (Birmingham)—Gloucester and Bris-
tol, and Gloucester Railway purchase, to Tuesday next--
Birmingham and Gloucester Railway Acts Amendments, to
Tuesday next—the Great Western Railway (Ireland)—Dub-
lin to Mullingar, till to-morrow.
The Committee proceeded with the adjourned inquiry into
the allegations in the petition against the
STAINES AND RICHMOND RAILWAY.

Several allegations of misdescription of property were
allowed.

Mr. Samuel Hughes, the civil engineer, of Duke- street,
Westminster, was called by Mr. Veuablos, to prove the mark-
ings on the plans and sections. Standing orders not com-
plied with in those instances.
A large number of allegations of a clerical nature were
sustained.

The next allegation possessing anything like interest was
that the promoters had not served notices on the owners of
a field at Staines, through which flows a portion of the River
Thames. . .

➢ir. ELLIOOMBE, foi the promoters, objected to the allega-
tion, on the ground that it was not sufficiently specific. He
considered the allegation should state who were the owners
of the River Thames. It was impossible to prove that no
notices had been served without naming who were the par-
ties that should be served.
Mr. VENADLEs submitted that the River Thames had con-
servators, and it was plain that they were in the light of
owners.

The CHAIRMAN ordered the room to be cleared, to enable
the Committee to consider the allegation.
After a short deliberation the parties were called in, and
informed by the CHAIRMAN that the standing orders in this
case had not been complied. with.
A few other trifling allegations were disposed of, and the
opposing petition having been gone through,
The CHAIRMAN said that he would report to the House
that the standing orders had not been complied with in se-
veral instances.

LONDON AND BRIGHTON RAILWAY (REIGATE
AND DORKING BRANCH).
This line of railway i 3 to be from Redhill station, through
Reigate, Buckland, Blechworth, and end at Dorking. It will
be seven miles in length, and is estimated to cost 109,7341.
Engineer, Mr. Vignoles.
Mr. Ellicombe appeared for the promoters of the Bill, and
Mr. Coates appeared on the petition of Mr. Stent, and also
another petition from the owners and occupiers of property
on the line, amongst whom is the agent to the Duke of
Norfolk.

Group V.
WEDNESDAY, SECOND DAY.
GRIMSBY AND SHEFFIELD JUNCTION LINE.
The Committee proceeded to business this day shortly
after twelve o'clock.
Mr. Henry Grantham was the first witness called. He
deposed that he resided near Brigg. Does not know that
Barton is an important town for fairs. Lincoln is more im•
portant and so is Castor. Barton is a fortnight market. I
never sent a head of cattle there. There are two fairs at
Castor certainly in the year. Would prefer the projected
line to the Ijull and Selby line for sending cattle to Castor,
because there is great inconvenience attending the shipping
of cattle at the ferry and unihipping them. Has sent cattle
to Wakefield. Is of opinion that the Gairtsborough line would
be a more convenient one than the Selby line to Wakefield.
Feeds about twenty beasts, and sells about 400 sheep per
annum.

The formal notices having been gone through,
Mr. COATES submitted the first allegation to the considera-
tion of the Committee, which was to the effect that the plan
and sections, as well as the Bill, deposited in the Private Bill-
office, contained powers for making two lines of railway,
whereas the notices served were only for one line.
Mr. ELLICOMBE maintained that the promoters asked fOr
powers to make one line of railway, and not two lines ; and it
was not to be supposed that they would attempt making
two lines.

The room was cleared, and, after a long deliberation, the
parties were called in and informed by
The CHAIRMAN that the Committee were of opinion the
standing orders had not been complied with.
A few trivial allegations were then sustained, after which
The CHAIRMAN said the standing orders were not com-
plied with in several instances.

LAW INTELLIGENCE.
COURT OF EXCHEQUER Anil 30.

TRIAL AT BAR.--THE GREAT DISTILLERY CASE.

THE ATTORNEY-GENERAL V. GEORGE SMITH.

The proceedings in this case were resumed at ten o'clock,
when

Mr. James Scott Smith was placed in the witness- box,
and 'examined by Mr. MARTIN—The rebuilding of the
rectifying-house was commenced in 1836, and finished in
1838. At that time it became necessary to uncover what is
called the blind pipe.
By the CHIEF BARON—The wall was finished in 1838.
By Mr. MARTIN—The pipe was exposed to view fur several
days. The foundation of the wall was a great deal lower
than the level of the pipe. Up to 1838 the water flowed
through the blind pipe and a connecting leaden pipe into the
rectifying-house. The leaden pipe was cut off at the build-
ing of the wall, as it was in the way of the builder.
By the CHIEF BARON—There was an opening about six
inches from the end of the blind pipe pointing towards the
rectifying-house wall, and to that opening the leaden pipe
was affixed. _
By Mr. MARTIN—After the wall was built, the opening
which exposed the blind pipe was filled up. - No water came
in that direction after 138. The connecting pipe was re-
moved in that year. The leaden pipe was continued
because it was supplied from the new pipes laid down in
1836. The wall was built solid where the orifice had formerly
been. The water, after the year 1838, was supplied by the
pipes laid down in 1836, and by the trough. On my solemn
oath I can say that not one drop of spirits was conveyed from
the one house to the other by that means, until the experi-
ment was made by the officers. It never entered our heads
that it could be done. I have, since 1813, personally super-
intended the business of the rectifying. house, and spirits
could not have been so introduced without my knowledge.
Spirits were since 1817 conveyed by waggon from the distil-
lery through its gates, along the public streets, and
then into the rectifying •house. The law requires that
the rectifier should give notice to the officer of Excise
that he has received so much spirit; the permit is required to
be shown them, and one bung cannot be opened without the
officer's permission. There is a complete check on the spirits
brought into the rectifying-house. The stock of spirits can
be taken at any time within six weeks. The examinations
of the officers are conducted with great severity, the mea-
surements in the casks being sometimes taken by a four-
gallons cask. I pointed out to the officers before the ground
was broken up the road by which the pipe used to commu-
nicate with the rectifying-house. The pipe is unfit to convey
spirits, because it would corrode, and thereby give such a
taste to the spirits that they would be unfit for sale. If I
wanted to convey spirits by a:iy pipes I . should have
them of tin, copper, or pewter, the latter is the best.
Iron would be quite unfit for the conveyance of spirits.
The iron pipe in the distillery-yard is not laid with a regular
descent, it is what is technically termed " swags," or not
laid at a proper current, so that if spirits had been sent
through it, and water had afterwards been run, the water
would not thoroughly remove the taste of the spirits. I
tasted the water some four days after the experiment made
by the officers, and found the taste of spit its very strong.
The water through this very pipe supplies the dwelling-
house, and while washing my hands I felt the smell of the
spirits very strong. I was not present when the water was
offered to the horses. Ido not know how many gallons of
water were mixed with the spirits in the vat 17. The spirit
could only be separated by its being re-distilled. It would
take about two tons of coal to do so: The additional expense
rtr gallon would depend upon the produce of the spirits.
There is water supplied through this pipe to the room of the
officers of Excise, in the distillery.
The CHIEF BARON—Oh, it is quite evident, from the plan
furnished by the Crown, that such is the case.
By Mr. MaarriN—The water to the rectifying-house was.'
from 1838 to 1844, supplied by this pipe. The men from the
rectifying-house used to go through the distillery for the
purpose of turning on the water. The same Excise officers
used to remain for a considerable time about the premises,
so that they would have ample opportunities of knowing the
men in both works. There are two engines on the premises,
one communicating with the rectifying-house by a shaft
through the wall. The pipe leading into the offices branches
off at about twenty-five feet distance on the main pipe, from
which it descends, and consequently if spirits were passed it
must have flown into that room.

Mr: James Torry—ls manager of the ferry at Hull. From
50,000 to 70,000 passengers cross the ferry every year, be-
sides about 350 horses, 450 carriage conveyances, 4,000 sheep,
and 600 tons-of merchandise. The present mode of convey-
ance through-the county of Lincoln front one town to an-
other, such as Market-Risin, Newholland, Castor, &c., was
either by mail or private conveyance. The proposed line
would greatly facilitate intercourse between those towns.
There were two coaches running between Nottingham and
Hull, but they were given up when the Hull and Selby line
opened, that having taken away all the passengers.
Several other witnesses were examined to the same effect,
and the whole of their testimony went to prove the necessity
that existed for such a line as that submitted for the con-
sideration of the Committee.

Lord Worsley deposed that there was a very strong
feeling in favour of the proposed line in Lincolnshire; he
never heard of a line that appeared to meet with such
universal approbation ; a great portion of the line would pass
through Lord Yarborough's property. Witness had upon
principle declined to take shares in any railway, as he was a
Member of Parliament.

Group E.
NEWCASTLE AND BERWICK RAILWAY.

Tile case of this line, which was opened yesterday, was
proceeded with to-day.
Mr. Wood, of Killingworth, was examined at considerable
length as to the position of the Newcastle and Berwick line
with respect to certain coal pits at present at work and pro-
jected, and the probability of the coals coming over that line
in preference to the Northumberland line, in the course of
which he entered into several statistical details quite unin-
teresting to the public.
After hearing further evidence in favour of the Newcastle
and Berwick Line, the Committee adjourned.

Group X.
The Committee, to whom the Bills contained in this group
have been referred, assembled in room No. 8 present, Lord
Courtenay, Chairman ; Mr. B. Wall, Mr. k‘Geacliv, Mr.
Darby, and Mr. P. Scrope.
As soon as the Committee assembled,
nitra;ittSeere togeant WRANG HAM directed the attention of the
Cothe inconvenience which the counsel and
agents were subjected to by the arrangements which were
in force respecting the admission of parties to the room. The
counsel were greatly incommoded by the pressure from be-
hind, and were, in consequence, unable properly to perform
their duties. In Mr. Stewart's Committee this inconvenience
had been felt, and a remedy had been applied.
The Cirainmas said the attention of the Committee had
been already drawn to this subject, and arrangements had
been made by Captain Gossett to remedy the evil com-
plained of.
LONDON AND YORK RAILWAY.
Mr. Sergeant WitascarAm then proceeded with his addres
in opening the case for the promoters of this railway. He
took a review of the report of the Board of Trade upon the
London and York scheme, and more particularly alluded to
tnat part of it which stated that the construction of the
proposed line would in its cost far exceed the esti -
mates of the engineer. He contended that the proposed
line would be constructed at as small a cost as
the opposing scheme, the Direct Northern. Should
this opposing line be constructed, it would not give
the public that accommodation which the line for which he
appeared would give. The estimate for the construction of
the London and York line was about six millions and a half,
and that sum would not be exceeded. The Board of Trade
in their report had contrasted the estimate for the construe
tion of the first 112 miles of the London and York line with
the :actual cost of the London and Birmingham line.
This was a most preposterous comparison, seeing that
when the London and Birmingham Railway was made,
was in its infancy, and, conse7
railway engineering
quentiv, the
--
cast of constructing a railway was far more
• •
than it was now, which could be shown by the evidence o
the most eminent engineers of the day. The advantage of
the London and York scheme over the Cambridge and Lin-
coln was that the former accommodated the large towns
whereas the latter placed them
by its trunk line,
at the end of branches. These branches involved
the necessity of many stoppages, whereby the advantages of
railway communication might be said to be shut out from
those persons residing at the end of the branches. The ad-
vantages which the London and York scheme presented were,
the means of shortening the distance between London and
York, giving a direct communication with London to all the
large towns, and giving accommodation to the whole of the
northern and eastern districts of the country.
The first witness called was Mr. S. Strong, who was exa-
mined by Mr. Sergeant. KINGLAKE—Witness resided at Barnet.
Was a farmer in the neighbourhood. The prosperity of the town
had greatly diminished since the old coach traffic had been
withdrawn, and since the London and Birmingham Railway
had been estaNished. The present price of coal there was
from 425. to 455. a ton. It was all brought by carts from
London. The district round Barnet was a hay-growing
district. The hay was all sent to London. The cost of
conveyance to London was 12s. a load of 18 cwt., being the
fourth of the value. He considered that the London and
York Railway, when made, would be a great advantage. It
would cause a saving of one-half in the carriage of hay. He
he counted himself; last Saturday, 187 carts containing hay
Mr. WELLS, who appeared for the Eastern Counties and straw, on their way to the London market. The district
suffered greatly by the want of a ready mode of bringing
manure from London. The cost of taking manure from Lon-
don to Barnet was 17s. a load.
Rail-
way Company, and certain opposing landowners, was about
to cross examine the witness, when
Mr. Sergeant KINGLAKE objected. He contended that
the Eastern Counties Company had no locus standi before
the Committee, inasmuch as no line connected with that
Company, was before the Committee.
Mr. AUSTIN contended that as the Eastern Counties
Railway was a competing line with the proposed London
and York line, they had a right to appear.
The Committee, after a quarter of an hour's deliberation,
decided that the Eastern Counties Company had a right to
appear.
The witness was then cross-examined by Mr. WELLS—
Never knew that the ha dealers received hay by the Mr-
mingham 'Railway, although Watford was a hay-growing
• I
district. The hay was sent in carts.
Mr. Cociimitx was about to cross examine the witness,
when—

Cross-examined by the Solomon-GENERAL—My brother
and myself are single men, and live together. The men
employed -in the manufacture are different in the one work
from the other, but the men employed to keep the machinery
in order are common to both. The horses and carts are
common to both of us. I believe there is no law against it.
In 1817 there were alterations made upon the premises. In
1814 the pipes were defective, and the iron pipe was laid
down instead. The leaden pipes in the rectifying-house
were connected with the iron pipe at the time it was laid
down. The still head prior to 1836 was supplied from a
branch from the main or leaden pipe which ran in front of the
still. The still head was supplied directly from branches as
they were erected. The connexion between the blind pipe
and leaden pipe was cut off in 1838. The trough has been
in existence for many years, and there is a pump required
for the purpose of forcing water to the still head, in the event
of the usual flow being discontinued. That pump has been
in existence since 1838 ; there used to be a handpump before.
There is a small cistern there, and there is a bell to give notice
when the water is low, so that the supply may be
put in at once. The trader is bound to make a declaration
of the strength of the total spirits, and the Excise officer
says that he has a means of testing the truth of that declara-
tion. I think it impracticable to convey spirits by this pipe,
because, before it could be done, it would be necessary to
stop the works, in order to do so. There would be a greater
loss than gain by this procedure. Wash would be affected
by the corroded pipes in the same way that spirits would. I
have used lime in rectifying, but not for some years. There
wasno lime discovered in vat 17. What was found there was a
sediment from the spirits. The duty on a gallon of spirits is
7s. 10d. ; and, therefore, on 700 gallons the amount would be
2601., or more. The present price of malt spirits is about
10s. 2d. a gallon, including duty. I decline saying what
the profit upon that may be, as it varies so much. I recol-
lect the officers on the premises about the 14th of October,
and having some conversation with them relating to the
water communication between the distillery and the rectify-
ing-house. I have no doubt that if they put impertinent
questions I might have told my brother of it. Ido not re-
member Cameron's saying, " Does not the water running
into :the troughs for the supply of the worm-tubs come
from Mr. George Smith's distillery." He asked me, pointing
to the wall between the rectifying-house and the distillery,
"Is there any other communication between the distillery and
the rectifying-house except this shoot." I answered," None."
I do not recollect saying that this mode of supplying the
rectifying-house with water was objectionable. Ido not re-
collect using the words " criminate myself." I recollect say-
ing something like this—that my father and myself called
upon the late Mr. Carr, solicitor to the Excise, and he per-
mitted us to use the pipe for gas and water supplied from the
distillery as before. Ido not recollect Cameron saying to
Frankish that he had asked me whether there was any other
communication with the distillery except the open trough.
The .Soraccron-GENERAL complained that his Learned
Friends who were engaged for the defence, and more parti-
cularly Mr. Watson, continually interrupted him in his cross-
examinations by their audible observations.
Mr. WArsost— If I had donelny duty, I should have in-
terrupted you much oftener.—(Laughter.)
Cross-examination continued:-::-When I said there was no
other communication, I think either Fankisk or Cameron
said we think there is another communication.

Mr. Kilcur„tliE objected.
Mr. Coulintixtq said he appeared for the Direct Northern
Railway
_Company.
Mr. RINGLAKE said the scheme had been thrown out by
the Standing Orders Committee, and, therefore, the scheme
was not
.before Parliament.
Mr. CocknutlN said this question liad.l:een o:i that
very day in the case of the Hull and Gainsborough line,
which had been re,ected on standing orders, the promoters of
which had applied to be allowed to appear against a rival
scheme. The opinion of the Speaker:had been taken on the
subject, and he had held thatthe
parties ought to be allowed
to appear.
The Committee again retired. During their absence Mr.
B. Denison, Mr. R. Yorke, and Mr. Christopher, members
of the Provisional Committee of the London and York Com-
pany entered the room, and on the return of the Committee
entered into conversation with them respecting the merits of
the line before them.
The CHAIRMAN said the Committee are of opinion that the
Direct Northern are to be let in.—(Great laughter.)
The Committee then adjourned.

Re•examined by Mr. MARTIN—I was introduced to the
officers by Mr. Drinkwater, and they, pointing to the direc-
tion of the trough, asked if there were any other communi-
cation than by that shoot. I said, " Nu," and then Cameron
or Frankish said, "I think there is." I said, "Point it out
then," and we went up to the top of the still-head, and
Cameron asked, "Where does this water flow from ?" I said,
" From the main." He asked again, " Does that not come
from the distillery ?" I said, " Yes," and tainted out the
direction in which the pipe ran.
The SOLICITOR-GENERAL objected to this mode of re-
examination.

The CHIEF BARON thought it would be bettxr if the whole
conversation were given, and then the Lea med Solicitor-
General be permitted to ask any question having reference
anyto part of that conversation.
Mr. F. KELLY was perfectly willing to accede. to this pro-
position.
Some 4scluielon then took place between 90 :Counsel On

both Sides and the Bench, as to whether, in re-examination,
it was competent to Mr. Martin to tinestion the witness as to
parts of a conversation not referred to in the cross-exa-
mination.

The COVRT decided that the re-examination night pro•
ceed as MI. thiiiitt *as conducting it, for if there was and•
direct matter of denial in the evidehht; the Rolicitor- General
could call witnesses to contradict.

Re-examination resumed—Witness did not hesitate to point
out the course of the pipe when the officers requested it.
Neither did he hesitate to allow the ground to be broken up
to expose that course. He could not recollect all the precise
words of the conversation. There were three officers, and
they were disputing the same questions in different ways, and
rblieating his answers in altered terms, so much, that he was
obliged to say repeatedly to them 3 " I will not allow you to
put words in my mouth—you misrepresent rne to mryself."
He observed to them that there was nothing illegal in sup-
plying the rectifying house with water from the distillery. He
told them that Mr. Carr, the Excise solicitor, had consented
to the pipe being laid down, and that the Act of Parliament
forbad only pipes for the transmission of worts, wash, or
spirits.

Here another long discussion arose as to whether a question
could be put relating to the date and circumstances of the
conversation with Mr. Carr referred to by witness in his
answer to the t fficers. The witness stated that it took place
in 1817, before the Act now in force had passed. But the
Court would not allow the answer to be received, deciding
that the question was irregular.

Mr. liIiLLY again claGed his right to put a question to
tin witness, as to the conversation with Mr. Carr.
The SOLICITOR-GENERAL again objected, and after a pro-
longed discussion,

The LORD CHIEF BARON said that it had already this day
been argued, discussed, and decided, that no question to the
witness as to the time, the place, the words, or even the
truth of the alleged conversation with the late Mr. Carr, was
admissible in this re-examination.

Mr. KELLY still pressed his argument with great perti-
nacity
and ingenuity.
Their Lordships consulted for some time, and we certainly
understood the Lord Chief Baron to express the opinion of
the Court in favour of the admissibility of the question in the
form last urged by Mr. Kelly, but the Learned Gentleman
then merely requested their Lordships to take a note of his
question. The jury then retired for refreshment.
Re-examination resumed—He pointed out to Frankish
and the other officers the direction of the pipe, and consented
to open the ground, but he could not tell on which occasion
he did so. Took a sample from the vat No. 17 before the ex-
periment was made, and found in it nothing but the sediment
always deposited in vessels which had held spirits and water
for a long time. To convey spirits through a pipe on the
principle of the syphon. it must be airtight. The pipe in
question was certainlynot so, nor intended to be. When the
alterations of the premises were made, in connexion with
the laying down of this pipe, every thing was done openly,
and in the Tresence of the Excise officers ;and of all persons
on the premises.

Mr. G. Whitehead, principal clerk in the rectifying-honSe
of Mr. James Scott• Smith, examined by Mr. WaTsox—Had
held the same situation twenty years.. Recollected the re-
building of the house in 1836. Previous to that the water
from the distillery was conveyed, partly by a trough along the
roof, and partly by a pipe under ground. This was
the case at the time when witness went to the establishment.
The pipe was altered in 1838. The cock was under ground,
where the under-ground spirit tubs were. There was a flap
or trap over it, to be lifted up by a ring. Thought it could
not escape the notice of an officer on surveying duty. There
never had been, to his knowledge, one drop of spirits passed
through the pipe to the reetifying-house before it was done
by the officers. Believed it to be utterly impossible that spi-
rits could be so passed without his knowing it. There were
sixty-eight gallons of spirits in the vat No. 17,
before the officers began. The day after the experiment was
made the water used for drinking in the counting-house and
messengers' room, supplied by the pipe, was remarkably
tainted with spirit. The taste was very remarkable. His
attention was first called to it by the messengers. After the
seizure was made stock was taken, and again in six weeks
afterwards, when there was found to be a decrease
of 48 gallons upon a stock of 40,000 gallons. In three
weeks afterwards stock was taken again, when a decrease of
twenty gallons was found. Those decreases took place
whilst the officers were in full possession of the premises.
The SOLICITOR-GENERAL objected to this line of examina-
tion having nothing to do with the case.
Mr. WATSON said he had all that he wanted. The ques-
tions were put in reference to what had been stated by the
Crown witnesses on the subject of decrease.
. Cross-examined by Mr. JARVIS—When the officers asked
hini where the water came from which was dripping into the
still-head,, he said he hardly knew. In fact he did know
that it came from the distillery, but not exactly from what
particular tank.
By the-Couar—What he meant by the answer he gave to
the officers was that he thought it better to give no dkinct
answer until he brought Mr. James Smith.
Mr. James Golding, examined by Mr. MARTIN—Had been
managing distiller in the Whitechapel distillery 28 years from
1807, that is down to 1835, when his engagement cersed.
The evidence of this witness was merely confirmatory of that
given by the two previous witnesses as to the great number
of years during which the rectifying-house had been supplied
with water from the distillery by .a.pipe-underground. That
pipe could not have existed without the knowledge of the
Excise officers. A great quantity of water was necessary in
a distilling or rectifying-house. A large supply was con-
veyed by pipes to every distillery he knew except in Ireland,
where some distilleries were built closed to a river side,
and the worm was placed in the river.—(A laugh. )
In 1826, Mr. Hetherington, the principal surveyor, who
was the chief officer under the Board, and the two officers
next to him in authority, Mr. Steele and Mr. Logie, made an
accurate survey of the premises, and the water communica-
tion was accurately examined by them.
The SOLICITOR-GENARAL objected to the mode of of exa
mination as irrelevant. .

.....
The CHIEF BARON said, that as the Excise witnesses for
the Crown had sworn that they knew nothing of the com-
munication, it was competent for the defendants to give evi-
dence that their superiors knew of it.
The SOLICITOR-GENERAL wished the Court once for all to
understand that he objected to any evidence of surveys before
1836.

Mr. KELLY was about to reply, when
The LORD CHIEF BARON said, Mr. Kelly, we are of opinion
that you are competent to give any evidence of this kind you
please. It will be for us to tell the jury whether it affects
the issue or not.

Mr. Baron PLATT—A great part of the evidence for the
Crown has been directed to establish the charge of conceal-
ment, and to show that the officers were ignorant of the com-
munication. It would be most unjust to prevent the de-
fendant from proving that there was no concealment, and the
Excise authorities were aware of the fact.

Examination resumed—Up to the time witness left the
employment all the officers surveying the premises were aware
of the communication. As to the question of taking charges,
the matter ,was so difficult, and the instrument so uncertain,
that the Act of Parliament allowed a variation of 25 per
cent, and in taking the charge upon the same back of wash,
no twa charges will be alike. The witness was going to ex-
plain the mysteries of brewing, distilling, and guaging, when
he was interrupted by the Court. "My Lord," said he, "if
my explanation is not material to the case it is material to
my character as a brewer, that when I am examined
upon such a question I should not make a fool of myself."
—(Great laughter in which their Lordships heartily joined.)
when the law was altered in 1825, and it was necessary to
have the dipping-rod fixed, a new receiver was made. The
hole first made in the cover for the rod did not satisfy him or
the Excise, and, consequently, a new hole was made by wit-
ness's order. The original hole was then covered by boards.
The cross-examination of this witness, although frequently
interrupted by objections and legal discussions, elicited nothing
material.
James Benny examined by Mr. WATSON—Has been
twenty-four years carpenter in Mr. Georg Smith's employ.
ment. Cut the hole fur the suction-pipe, which was at first
too small, and had to be enlarged.
John Elry had been foreman carpenter to Mr. Smith in
1825. Made the hole in the top of the receiver, which was
plugged up. Believed the plug produced to be the plug then
used: Nailed boards over the other hole. Could not swear
that the boards produced in Court were the same, but they
looked very like them.
Mr. Charles Allen Young—ls a back maker in High-street
in the Borough. In 1825 was in partnership with his father,
and made the receiver for Mr. Smith. Knew that a hole in
the cover to receive the dipping-rod was plugged up, and
another.made. Could not say that the plug now shown to
hint was the one used. Should think front its appearance
that it had been driven in very hard.
Cross-examined—Did not think that it had been so long
made as twenty years.
Re. examined—Could not swear to any opinion positively
on the subject.
The Court then adjourned at five o'clock to ten to .morrow.

POLICE INTELLIGENCE.
(YESTERDAY.)

MARLBOROUGH-STREET.

THE KNIFE AGAIN.—SERIOUS CHARGE OF STABBING
Elizabeth Meads, a tall, powerful female, about thirty-five
years of age, was charged with stabbing Robert Murray, a
well-known pugilist, with whom she was cohabiting.
William Howard, police•constable, No. 94, of the F divi-
sion stated, that between ten and eleven o'clock last night,
he was called into the Fishmongers'. Arms, public-house, in
West-street, Seven Dials, and found the man Murray there,
bleeding profusely from a wound •about au inch below the
collar- bone on the left side towards the shoulder. Having
received information that it had been inflicted by the pri-
soner, witness proceeded to her lodgings, and found her. A
sharp-pointed white-handled table-knife was lying on a
table in the room, and a portion of the blade was smeared
with blood. Witness asked her if she was the person who
had stabbed the man ? and she unhesitatingly replied that
she was. He then took her into custody, and conveyed her
to the station-house. The wounded man was removed to
Charing Cross-hospital, where he at present remains.
Mr. MALTBY asked the prisoner if she wished to say any-
thing ?—She replied that she had been living with Murray,
and passing as his wife for several years past. For the last
two days they had been on the drink together. Last night
after supper they went into the public-house, where they
quarrelled, and Murray struck her a severe blow on the eye,
on which, in her passion, she snatched up a knife that was
on the table before her, and made a stab at him. She was
now very sorry that she had injured him.
Mr. MALTBY said he should remand her until Tuesday
next.

GERMAN JOURNAL—Deutsche Londoner Zeitung.—
There has long been a French paper printed in London,
and it was matter of surprise that so numerous a body as
the Germans are, should not have a periodical devoted
to themselves. At last a very respectable stamped
paper, under the above title has been started and will
without doubt meet with due patronage. From the few
numbers which have already appeared it seems fully
conducted on the liberal principles promised when it
commenced, and this is ail more to be appreciated
when it is considered that there is no such freedom al,
lowed to the press in Germany as characterises it in
this country. There are able and impartial papers on
the political affa'rs of Germany, and the reports are re-
markably clear and particular in detail ; there is also an
ample space devoted to literature, science, and the fine
arts. It is a folio of to elve pages, and will not cnly be
a great acquisition to native-, but will be read by thosi
who have made this fashionable language their study,
with much advantage and instruction.

STATE or TRADE.—The yarn market continues
very firm ; but the spinners being generally engaged for
some weeks to come, very little business has been done
witnin the last few days. For goods, too, the market
is generally quiet, which may probably be accounted
for by the heavy buying of last. week. There is
however, a better demand for 27-inch printing
cloth ; the prices of which are steadier than they
were a fortnight ago.--.---ROCIIDALE FLANNEL MARKET,
MONDAY, APRIL.2B.—We have had rather more doing iu t he
flannel market to-day ; the demand has been better, but
prices have continued extremely low. The wool market re-,
maims eat; and prim a tationary..•Manchester Guardian.