The Sun.
London, England, 1844-03-08 00:00:00

THE SUN, LONDON, FRIDAY MORNING, MARCH 8, 1144,

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT.
11017 SE OF LORDS, March 7.
The Loan CHANCELLOR task his seat on the Woolsack
shortly after Five o'Clock.
Lord KENYON presented several petitions against the
anion of the sees of Bangor and Sr. Asaph.
The Bishop of HEREFORD presented several similar
petitions.
Lord PRUDHOE presented several petitions in favour of
the present corn-laws.
NEW HOUSES OF PARLIAMENT.
Lord BROUGHAM said he had net had an opportunity,
owing to the state of the weather, to go over the new Houses
of Parliament, and therefore he should i)odpone the question
of which he had given notice respecting them, to a future day.
Lord LILFORD postponed the presentation of a petition
from certain hand-loom weavers, to Monday the 18th of March.
DISSENTING CHAPELS.
The LORD CHANCELLOR laid on the table a Bill for
regulating suits relating to chapels and other property held by
per►ons dissenting from the Church of England. The object
of the Bill was to remove certain hardships under which Dis-
senters laboured with respect to their chapels and burial-

sessions were restricted within too narrow limits. Unless the
salary of the recorders were increased, they must riot be de-
barred from an opportunity of practising as barristers. lie
approved of the principle of the Bill, but reserved to himself a
right of dissenting from the details.
Leave was then given to brin, in the Bill.
BRAZIL.

Mr. M. GIBSON presented a petition from the Manchester
Chamber of Commerce, calling the attention of the House to
the precarious state of the trade of the country with the
13razils, in consequence of the restrictions upon commerce.
The petitioners prayed that the House would not rest satisfied
with anything short of the equalisation of the duties on foreign
and colonial produce.
Mr. EA BOUC H E RE then rose to move—" That an humble
address be presented to her Majesty, representing the great
importance to this country of the trade with the empire of the
Brazils, and humbly praying her Majesty to adopt such
measures as may appear best calculated to maintain
and improve the commercial relations between the United
Kingdom and the Brazds." He had undertaken to
invite the attention of the House to the consideration
of the present state and the future prospects of
the commercial relations of this country with the Brazils, and
though he was sensible how little able he was to do justice to
such a subject, yet no Member of that House, who was aware
of the magnitude of the question, or the immense anxiety of
the commercial classes to .cards it, would be prepared to say it
was improper for the consideration and deliberation of that
House. Upon many questions connected with this subject
he was relieved from the necessity of entering at any length,
because he could not conceive there could be any
difference of opinion among the Members on that subject. It
would not be necessary for him to prove, at any length, the
importance of the commercial relations of this country with
Brazil. If there was a country in the world bound to cultivate
relations of ami'y with this country, it was Brazil. Its
great extent, inferior to no part of the globe—its fertility—the
mighty rivers by which it was watered—its population, which
amounted to upwards of 7,ooo,ooo—the state and habits of
the population, producing an abundance of articles which
could not be produced in this country—its want of manufac-
tures and shipping—all these circumstances showed that Eng-
land and Brazil were two countries formed to have extensive
relations with each other. He would begin by stating to the
House what was the present state of this country with Brazil.
Our trade with Brazil was at present regulated by a commer-
cial treaty, concluded between the two countries in 1827. That
treaty was one eminently favourable to this country. The
Brazilians engaged to take our manufactures and produce under
this treaty at a maximum duty of 15 per cent. ad valorem.
We were free on the other hand to impose any
duties we pleased on the produce of Brazil, and he would state
to the House what were the duties this country had imposed
on the great staple articles of the produce of Brazil, in return
for the favourable terms on which they took our manufactures.
The exports of Brazil, according to the statistical accounts,
on which he could place most reliance, amounted annually to
7,200,000/. In the article of coffee, their exports amounted to
3,000,0001. sterling a-year. Sugar was the next in importance,
and the export of that article amounted to 1,200,0004 annually.
The remaining 3,000,0001. was made up from a variety of arti-
cles, such as cotton-wool, tobacco, hides, and gold ; but the
three most important articles were coffee, sugar, and cotton-
wool. Now with regard to sugar, we have placed a duty on
it which, in effect, is quite prohibitory, ant which was intended
to be prohibitory. It was a duty on the article of 300/. per
cent. ad valorem. On coffee they had placed a duty,
which, though not prohibitory, was still very heavy,
amounting to 2001. per cent. ad valorem. The only important
article which they let in from the Brazils on reasonable terms
was cotton-wool. This state of things had produced results
which could not astonish any one who had listened to the state-
ment he had just made, viz., that while we exported direct to
the Brazils a great amount of British produce, we imported
and introduced into the consumption of this country a very small
amount in value of the produce of Brazil in return. The value
of our export trade to Brazil was about two millions and a
half sterling a year—it had varied a little during the last two
years—last year it rallied a little, but he was sorry to say that
it was rather a struggling and declining trade than an increas-
ing one, for reasons to which he should presently advert,
but it was very considerable. In 1836 the export of English
manufactures to Brazil amounted to 3,000,000/. It had since
averaged rather above than under two millions and a half
annually, till the year 1842, when it fell to 1,756,000/.
In the last year, 1843, it had increased a little,
and it still amounted to 2,140,000/. annually. This
was the exact amount of our exports to the Brazils. The
Brazilian produce which was imported for consumption into
this country, was small in comparison, amounting to only be-
tween three and four hundred thousand pounds. This was
undoubtedly a very anomalous and unnatural state of things ;
and it obnoxiously exposed our merchants and manu-
facturers to very great disadvantages in competing
with those of other countries. The consequence of the existing
system was, that the merchants of this country were obliged
to resort to an indirect procedure. British ships carrying
out a cargo of British manufactures to the ports of Brazil,
could not find a cargo to bring back again. They were
therefore obliged to take their cargo of sugar, coffee, or what-
ever it might be, to some third country, competing on
the voyage with the ships of that country, which, as they were
returning home, possessed an advantage over them with respect
to the expense of navigation. They were obliged to return to
this country in ballast, after suffering every disadvantage in
their competition with the vessels of other countries. The
effect of this state of thing; was so obvious that he did not
think it necessary to cite documents at any length to illus-
trate it. There were, however, one or two statements, which
he would venture to read to the House. The first occurred in
the evidence of Mr. Moore, a respectable Brazilian merchant,
before the Import Duties' Committee. (The Right Hon. Gen-
tleman then read a portion of the evidence, referring to the
number of vessels which left Liverpool annually for Brazil.
It was stated that, in 1838, not one vessel returned
to this country from Brazil, which was not in ballast.)
He would read an extract from a petition lately presented to
the House by the shipowners and merchants of Liverpool.
They put this part of the subject in a forcible paint of view.—
( The Right Hon. Gentleman then read an extract from the
petition, which stated that 114 vessels went to the port of
Rio Janeiro for sugar, and that only 21 returned to
this country with a return cargo, and that this had a prejudicial
effect on the shipping interest of the country.) He hoped that
those who were in the habit of defending the shipping interest
of the country would take those facts into their consideration.
Of this he was sure, that no interest in the country would be
more benefited by a liberal system of commercial policy than
the shipping interest.—( Hear, hear.) That interest had
heretofore opposed a liberal commercial intercourse with
other nations, but they were now becoming alive
to the truth that there was no safety for them
except in the adoption of such a system as he
had endeavoured to describe. He might refer
to the effect which the present system had upon the rate of
exchange between the Brazils and this country. Any person
connected with the subject must see that, taking out cargoes
on one side, and returning empty on the other, must have a pre-
judicial effect on the rate of exchange between the two countries.
But notwithstanding the disadvantages under which this coun-
try laboured, the cheapness of their goods, and the intelli-
gence, and, above all, the high character which their great firms
had in foreign countries, would enable them to struggle on and
compete with others more favourably situated. But they were
pressed on by foreign rivals, by America, France, Switzerland,
He had accurate statistical
returns Germany.—(Hear,urnspublisied bythe Frenchhaer.)
Government, which he would
read to the House. They would show that while our com-
merce had not increased, the French commerce with
the Brazils had been growing in a very great ratio.
He found that in the year 1837 the exports from France ;to
Brazil were, in round numbers, twelve millions of francs. In
1840 they had grown to sixteen millions of francs. In 1841,
the last year to which his returns applied, the exports amounted
to twenty millions of francs. Now, let the House- compare that
statement with the diminished, or rather the stationary
state of our commerce with Brazil during the same period.
He would now read a statement of the imports into France
from the Brazils. In the year 1837, they amounted in round
numbers to 6,000,000 of francs. In 1810, they had fallen to
5,900,000 francs, but in the year 1841, they had grown
to nearly 8,000,000 of francs, the amount of imports being
7,993,000 of francs. He mentioned this to show that if they
wished to support our merchants and manufacturers, who were
engaged in an honourable competition with other countries in
the trade which they carried on with the empire of Brazil, they
ought to see that they did nothing which would subject those
manufacturers and merchants to greater disadvantages than they
at present laboured under. There was another point connected
with this part of the subject, to which he would for a moment
address himself. Ile had already stated to the House the
enormous duty that was placed on Brazilian produce imported
into this country for consumption. He held in his hand
returns, which he believed to be accurate, for he had
taken great pains to make them so.—( Cries of " Hear, hear.")
He had to return his thanks to the Right Hon. Gentleman
the President of the Board of Trade, from whom he had re-
ceived some very valuable returns. He had also been greatly
assisted by returns which had been published in some
of the newspapers, but more particularly in a
newspaper called the Economist. He had already
stated to the House the terms on which we received Brazilian
produce in this country. He would now state what were the
terms, compared with ours, on which other nations, our rivals
in the Brazilian trade, carried on their trading, and the
rate at which they received Brazilian produce for con-
sumption. The duty in England on Muscovado sugar
per cwt. was 635. In France the duty on Muscovado Sugar
was 2Cs. 6d. ; in Australia it was 13s. Bd.—( Hear.) In the
Zullverein,
.Germany, that great rival of ours in our trade
with Brazil, the duty was 15s. 4d. per cwt. on Muscovado sugar.
There was no country in the world which paid a higher duty
than this country. He would not be answerable for the
accuracy of all those figures, but, on the whole, he thought they
were correct. He had now endeavoured to lay before the House
the present state of their commercial relations with the
Brazils. With respect to the cotton manufacture, which,
although not an increasing one at present, was an important
branch of the it trade, as the Brazils afforded them a market for
cotton goods to the amount of, at least, one million-and-a-half
sterling; he thought there could be no doubt that they
were bound to protect their manufacturers in their honourable
pursuits, and to promote their interests by every possible
means. He would now come to the more important part of the
subject, he meant the future prospects of the trade with that
country, and he should say that that trade had now arrived
at a great crisis. The treaty of 1827 was about to expire,
and it would be for the Brazilians to renew it or not as they
might choose with us, or to go to any other nation.
Such being the existing state of things, it was not
surprising that great anxiety should be expressed
by the manufacturing interest of this country to know
what course would be pursued, and he there-
fore hoped that they would get some information
upon the subject from her Majesty's Government. He
believed that in Brazil many persons entertained enlightened
views in matters of trade, and would not feel disposed—even if
this country adopted a hostile course towards Brazil—to punish
themselves by following out a course adverse to their
own interests as well as those of England. Ile
hoped they would not do so—that they would not
attend to the doctrines he had often heard on the
other side of the House—that free trade was a good thing only
when there was reciprocity. —( Hear, hear.) He hoped they
would not attend to the doctrines of Colonel Torrens—
doctrines which he regretted to say were quoted
by the Right Hon. Baronet at the head of the Government,
that if a nation could not induce another nation to take its
goods on reasonable terms, the best course to follow was to shut
up its ports against that nation. These were doctrines which
he hoped the Brazilians would never adopt. lie desired to see
commercial relations by treaty renewed between this country and
Brazil. There were two sorts of treaty which, when not rightly
distinguished from each other, created not a little confusion.
One was that which we had with many countries, guaranteeing
the personal rights of merchants, and all things of that deserip-
tion—a species of treaty which he wished to see between this
country and every nation in the world. He would also be glad
to see introduced into our treaties with other nations what was
called the clause of the favoured nation, viz., that produce
coming from this country would be treated similarly to the like
produce coming:from any other country ; and he would like
to see our relations with Brazil placed on such a footing as this.
Although he should be glad to see the commercial relations
of this country with Brazil regulated by a treaty such as he
had described, there was another part of the subject to which
he attached greater importance. The only means by which
they could place the relations of this country with Brazil on
a safe and satisfactory footing, was by reducing the duties on
Brazilian commerce, so as to admit them upon fair and equal
terms.—(Hear, hear.) If they did that, there would not be
the slightest apprehension but that the trade of this country
with Brazil vvo-uld extend and flottrish,—( Hear, bear.) Above

grounds.
Lord BROUGHAM said he would not present a petition on
this subject to-morrow which had been intrusted to him, if it
was intended that this Bili should extend to Ireland.
The LORD CHANCELLOR said he should, on the second
reading of the Bill, state fully its objects, and he should then
propose that the Bill should be referred to a Select Committee.
Ile thought, therefore, that it would be better for the Noble
and Learned Lord to present his petition, and then move that
it be referred to the same Select Committee.
Lord BROUGHAM said he would take that course.
FEES TO CLERKS OF THE PEACE.
The Marquis of LANSDOWNE gave notice that he should,
to-morrow, move for a return of fees paid to clerks of the
peace, and to clerks in petty sessions, in England and Vales.
PRI% Y COUNCIL BILL.
Lord BROUGHAM gave notice that, to-morrow, he should
move the second reading of the Privy Council Bill, with a view
to its being referred to a Select Committee.
The House then adjourned.

HOUSE OF COMMONS, March 7.
The SPEAK ER took the Chair shortly before Four o'Clock.
Sir A. L. HAY presented a petition from Norwich against
the Norwich and Yarmouth Railway Bill.
GISBORNE brought in several Bills.
Mr. HARDY presented a petition against the Bradford and
Leeds Railway Bill.
Mr. F. MACKENZIE brought up the Report of the Corn-
nsittee on Private Bills.

Mr. TROTTER presented a petition against the Epsom and
South Western Railway Bill.
Mr. BRIGHT brought in the Rochdale Improvement Bill,
which was read a first and ordered to be read a second time.

Mr. M. GIBSON brought in the Sheffield Gas Bill.
Sir W. HEATHCOTE brought up the Report of the Com-
mittee on the Newport Gasßill.
Mr. ACL AND presented a petition from Bridgewater,
against certain clauses in the Great Western Railway Bill.
Sir H. DOUGLAS presented petitions against the Birken-
head Dock Bill ; also a petition in favour of the Leeds Rail-
way Bill.
Mr. SMYTHE brought in the South Eastern (Canter-
bury) Railway Bill, which was lead a first, and ordered to be
read a second time.

Lord WORSLEY presented a petition from an individual
against the Birkenheal Dock Bill.
Mr. DENNISTOUN presented a petition from the Lord
Provost, magistrates, and town council of the city of Glasgow,
praying that all laws might be repealed which require the sub-
scription of religious tests from professors in the Scottish
Universities; also, a petition from the Glasgow Emancipa-
tion Society, lamenting the continual increase of slavery and
the slave trade, stating their conviction that the only way of
putting an end to both is to produce sugar, &c., at a cheaper
rate-by free labour, and they therefore pray that every facility
may be given to the introduction of free labourers into the
colonies.

all things, they ought to take the present opportunity of put-
ting an end to the sugar monopoly.— (Hear, hear.) When
he said sugar monopoly, he was net using it in a vain sense,
but in a strict one. This sugar monopoly was a real one—it
was a principle whicla closed the ports of this country against
the coming in of any sugar at all. He believed
that no Member in that House, who was an advocate
fog protection, would defend such an act of injustice.
The late Government thought that after the great experiment
which had been so lately tried in the manumission of the nc-
genes in the West Indies,breathing time should be given to the
colonies to recover from the shock ; but the late Government
never contemplated the prolonged existence of the present
state of things. He would read for the House the declaration
of one of the leading members of that Government—he
alluded to the opinions of his late lamented friend Lord Syden-
ham. That Noble Lord said that it was a matter of great
importance that a proper state of relations should be established
between this country and Brazil, and he trusted that the atten-
tion of Parliament would be called to it in a very short time.
The present treaty (the treaty they existing) was only of a
temporary character. The exports of that colony were chiefly
confined to coffee and sugar ; and it was most desirable that
these exports should find an advantageous market in this coun-
try. The subject would be speedily forced upon the attention
of the Government. These were the opinions of the late
Government, and they were most anxious that the sugar duties
should be put upon a proper footing. He asked the House to
declare that they would not allow the Brazilian treaty to expire
without at least taking some step to bring their produce into this
country on more advantageous terms than they had formerly done.
With regard to the other branches of this important subject,
the sugar duties, he should advert to them very briefly and
very generally. If the Government adopted the pernicious
course of continuing those duties, they should have another
opportunity of discussing them. But still he felt theirimpor-
tance to be so great, that he must call the attention of the
House to the state of the trade at the present moment. When
his Hon. Friend the Member for Portsmouth moved his reso-
lution in 1841, it was resisted by the gentlemen opposite on
the grounds, first, that it would encourage slavery and the
slave trade ; and, next, that an adequate supply of sugar might
be expected from their own colonies. The amendment to his
Hon. Friend's motion was placed in very good hands —it was
moved by the Noble Lord ( Sandon) the Member for Liver-
pool. That Noble Lord not only made his statement in reply,
but he came down to the House provided with an estimate of
the quantity of sugar that might be expected from
the colonies. The estimate, coming Irom such a
quarter, excited great attention at the time.—( Hear. )
The Noble Lord said he expected that the great sources of
supply in future years would be the Mauritius and the East
Indies. He estimated that they would obtain from the Mauri-
tius 800,000 cwt. Now, in the year 1842, they received
689,000 cwt. ; in the year 1843, the supply fell to
477,000 cwt., little more than half the amount estimated.—
( Hear, hear.) The deficiency, with respect to the East Indies
had not been quite so great ; but still it was very considerable.
The Noble Lord estimated the supply at 1,400,000 cwt. In
1812, they received 940,000 cwt. Last year, they received
only 1,100,000 cwt. With regard to the supply from the
West Indies, through the Noble Lord had made an error
here also, it was an error of a different kind. He
promised them only 2,300,000 cwt., whereas they
had received, in each year, about 2,b00,000 cwt.
There was a deficiency in the supply last year under what had
been promised by the statement of the l'ob'e Lord, the Mem-
ber for Liverpool (Lord Sandon), of no less than 417,000
cwt.—( Cheers.) The House would recollect that the population
had increased during these years. Was it possible after this
to say that the people of this country were not suffering from a
restricted supply of sugar, and that the expectations held out to
them by the Hon. Gentlemen opposite, when they induced the
House not to accede to the Whig proposition of 1841, pr„ved
utterly fallacious.? He might be told that the prices of sugar
were not excessive during that time, but it roust be recollected
that that was merely relative.—( Hear, hear.) He was sure he
need not say that, in referring to the statement of his
Noble Friend, that he wished to hint that his Noble Friend
had any intention of deluding the House on this subject. He
was perfectly sure that his Noble Friend conceived that his
statement was accurate, and he had no doubt that he had con-
sulted persons of the highest authority on the subject id
Liverpool. He hail no doubt, also, that those gentlemen had
believed that the statement was accurate. Their expectations
had been disappointed. Then they had no inducement
to invest money in the cultivation of sugar in the West
Indies and the Mauritius, for whenever the question of
the sugar duties came before the House the Right Hon. Gen-
tleman the First Lord of the Treasury held out no language
to encourage, them in its cultivation ; although he said he
would not alter the sugar duties this year, he left the impres-
sion that he would be likely to do so next year, or at some very
short period.—( Hear, hear, and laughter.) Parties could not
be expected to invest money in the cultivation of sugar in the
West Indies under these circumstances. He (Mr. Labou-
chere) had been talking to a West India merchant on the sub-
ject, who told him that he had given directions to his agent
to be cautious to what amount he carried on his operations in
the cultivation of sugar. He believed the Government, and
the Hon. Gentlemen opposite who supported the Government,
would act better in plainly speaking their sentiments on the
subject.—( Cheers.) If they meant to uphold the sugar duties,
they ought to have stated that it was their intention to do so.
Let the Right Hon. Gentleman give a stout sugar pledge, as
he gave a stout corn pledge, which would give confidence to
speculators in the Mauritius and West Indies. After the ex-
perience which the Government now had, and after the hopes
which they held out to the House and to the country,
he, did not understand how they could reconcile it, and go on
in the same miserable course'which they had hitherto pursued,
which was so injurious both to the West Indian planters and
the consumers in this country. There was another subject to
which he would call the attention of the House. He would
state how the consumption had diminished in this country
between the years 1841 and 1843. He would now state to the
House what that consumption was. In 1841 this country con-
sumed 4,100,000 cwt, In the year 1843, which was the last
year for which they had any return, the consumption was, not-
withstanding the increase of population, only 4,082,000 cwt.,
which was au actual reduction in the quantity of sugar. Did
not this show that there was a stinted supply of sugar for the
consumption of the couutry ? He would ask the House to ad-
vert to what was the fact with regard to two other articles of
consumption during the sailer- years, 1841 and 1843. He
alluded to the articles of tea and coffee. The quantity of tea
supplied to the country in 1841 was 36,600,000 lbs. ; in 1843
40,300,000 lbs. The amount of coffee supplied to the country
in 1841 was 28,400,000 lbs., and in 1843 30,000,000 lbs. He,
therefore, would say that while there was no increase in the
consumption of sugar—nay, a small failure—the consumption of
tea and coffee had increased in the ratio stated. The only pros-
perous branch of the sugar trade was that which consisted in
bringing slave-grown sugar into this country, for the purpose
of refining it, then of exporting it.—( Laughter and cheers.)
It was even brought from their own West Indian Colonies.—
( Cheers.) This branch of trade had increased to an enormous
magnitude within these two years. In 1842 they imported
600,000 cwts. of slave-grown sugar, for the purpose of refining
it. In 1843 they imported 939,000 cwts., nearly a million of
lbs.; of slave-grown sugar, tor the pnrpose of refining.
'qr. GLADSTONE—Where is that return to befound?
Mr. LA BOUCH ERE—In the trade and navigation returns,
lately laid on the table of that House. He did not mean to say
that they rr-exported all the. sugar, but they imported it, and
it was that importation which gave all the encouragement to the
cultivation of slave-grown sugar.—(Hear, hear.) Thus, in
one single year, the amount of rough sugar in
bond increased from 600,000 to more than 900,000 lbs.
He now came to what he apprehended would be the only real
subject of difference between both sides of the House. He did
not believe that Gentlemen opposite would deny the immense
advantages of admitting foreign sugar into the consumption of
the. country. They would not deny the great benefit to be de-
rived from it by the shipping and trading interests. He be-
lieved it would, more than any other question, except the re-
peal of the corn-laws, add to the comforts of the great mass of
the people.—( Hear, hear.) But the great objection would be,
that they ought not to do anything which would encourage
slavery in the Brazils and other slave-growing countries. He
was not disposed to treat with disregard the feelings entertained
by the people of this country on the subject of slavery, but
really the more one looked into the case, the snore one was
surprised that any person could be found taking his stand on
such an objection as than—(ber, hear.) The Right Hon.
Gentleman told them that he was unwilling to renew the com-
mercial treaty with the Brazils, unless they could be induced
to make certain changes with regard to the internal state of
slavery in the Brazils. He apprehended that after the treaties
which were lately made for the suppression of the slave-trade,
nothing more remained to be done in that way. He, therefore,
thought the Right lion. Gentleman must have meant that the
Government would recommend to Parliament and the country
not to renew their commercial relations with the Brazils unless
the duty on British goods was reduced, so that both countries
would be placed on the same footing. He asked the House
to consider, in this, perhaps the last opportunity they would
have, before this great blow was struck at the commerce and
navigation of the country, whether they could—he would not
say as wise and prudent men, but as consistent and conscien-
tious men—keep the ground they now occupied.—(Cheers.)
He wished to see the people of England in a position to hold a
high tone towards foreign nations ; but he was afraid foreign
nations might turn round and say to them "it is impossible for
you to be sincere in your professions—this argument about
slavery is a mere pretext—(lm, hear)—and when you have
any advantage to gain, you have no scruples.—( Hear, hear, and
cheers.) It is easy and convenient enough to make us the
victims of your scruples when it suits your own interests, and
cry off on a question of humanity, when it is a question of
interest and protection."—( Cheers. ) How did the question
stand? Was sugar the only article with regard to which
they entertained those scruples ?—(Cries of " Hear, hear.")
Did they not import coffee to any extent through the produce
of slave labour? Nay more; in the alteration they made in the
tariff facilities were given for the introduction of coffee, the
produce of that labour ; and with regard to the bringing slaves
across the Atlantic into the Brazils, it made little difference
whether they cultivated coffee or sugar. The question then
resolved itself into this—that the cultivation of sugar was hard
and cruel upon the slaves, and they ought not to give encou-
ragement to its introduction into this country. That was the
language which Mr. Ellis held to the Brazilian Government,
and to 111. Ribeiro, when he came to this country. How was it
possible for Gentlemen opposite to hold such language, when
they gave such facilities, by their tariff, to the introduction of
foreign ones? Now mining was an operation far more cruel to
the slave, and more disgusting, than the cultivation of sugar.
He would say nothing about gold, which, he knew, would find
its way in spite of all impediments. But there was copper ore.
The case of copper ore was exactly the same as that
of coffee. It was imported into this country to bo
smelted in bond, and then r&-exported. Copper ore which
was to be consumed in this country was admitted at a
very low duty, and what was the effect? Here it was.
In 1841, before the tariff was introduced, the quantity of copper
ore imported for the consumption of the country amounted to
only 1,000 cwt. ; in 1842, after the tariff, it rose to 300,0141b5.,
and in 1843 it amounted to 1,085,0001b5. '1 he amount of revenue
derived from the duty—they were not ashamed to take money
—( Cheers and laughter)—was in 1841, only 56/. ; in 1842, it
was 15,0001. ; in 1843 it was 64,000/. He did not mean to say
that the Right Hon. Gentleman stimulated the trade to this
extent, because at the same time they were smelting copper
ore in bond. What he meant to show was, that they had de-
parted in the case of copper from that course they adopted with
regard to sugar. But this subject must not be considered
with regard to the Brazils alone. There was good reason to
suppose that the Spanish West India Islands of Cuba and
Porto Rico would follow the example of the Brazils.—( Hear,
hear.) He had now discharged his duty in bringing this sub-
ject before the House. He thought it was one of too much
importance to be shuffled off till the end of the session.—( Hear,
hear.) It was a question of the greatest importance to the
welfare of the commerce of the country, and it behoved Hon.
Gentlemen, especially, who represented manufacturing and
commercial intererests, to join with him in urging the Go-
vernment to adopt the only course which the safety and wel-
fare of the country dictated.--( Cheers.) But he appealed not
to them alone, but also to the conscientious convictions of those
who represented agricultural constituencies, who had as much
interest as any others on the subject.--( Hear, hear.) He
frequently heard them say that the agricultural and manufac-
turing interests waxed or waned together ; and he trusted they
would not aid the Government in inflicting this deadly blow
on the trade and manufactures of the country.—( Hear.)
But he confessed that he had some fears on the subject. They
had often heard the Right lion. Baronet opposite say, " What
interest can I have in supporting the West Indian Colonists
against the general sense of the country ?" He (Mr. Labou-
chere) was afraid that there was amongst the supporters of the
Right Hon. Barenet very great jealousy with respect
to a liberal commercial policy. They had heard lately
moat powerful denunciatious with respect to any attehipt to