The Sun.
London, England, 1857-06-19 00:00:00

HARBOUR EXAMINATION.

Mr. MACARTNEY moved for a copy of the re-
port made by the Admiralty upon the harbours of Port-
patrick and Donaghadee, lately examined by Captain
Vetch, R.N., with the estimate for improving the same
sufficiently to afford accommodation to vessels capable of
undertaking the carriage of mails between Scotland and
Ireland.--Agreed to.
SAVINGS BANKS.

Viscount GODERICH asked the Chancellor of the
Exchequer whether, in the event of the passing
of the Savings Banks Bill during the present session,
he would be willing to consent to the appointment of a
select committee next year to inquire into and consider
the whole state of the law relating to savings banks,
with a view to its consolidation and amendment?
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said that
in the event of the passing of the Savings Bank Bill this
session, he should be prepared next session to assent to
the appointment of a committee, having fur its object
the general consideration of the law with reference to
savings' banks, both as regarded their constitution and
the financial questions that had been raised by gentle-
men opposite, with a view to the reconsideration of the
statutary enactments for their consolidation.
Mr. HADFIELD inquired if he intended to persevere
with the bill this session ?
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said he
did but move the postponement of the order in reference
to the bill from Monday till Thursday next.
PUBLIC CHARITIES.

Mr. HA.RDCASTLE gave notice that on Monday
next he should move for leave to bring is a bill for the
incorporation of public charities.
SUPPLY.—ORGANISATION OF THE ARMY.
On Mr. FITZROY bringing up the report of the com-
mittee of supply,
Gan. PEEL called the attention of the house to por-
tions of the evidence taken before the Sebastopol Com-
mittee and the Chelsea Commission, showing the neces-
sity of defining the responsibility and duties of the vari-
ous departments. The gallant officer said that he
had given the subject his serious attention during the
past two years, and from having served both on
the Sebastopol Cmumittee and the Chelsea Commission,
he had had an opportunity of becoming thoroughly ac-
quainted with the subject, and he expressed an opinion
that the resin nausea of the suffering, &c., in the Crimea
were owing to a want of proper organisation. He called
attention to the subject in proper feeling and sympathy
towards the various departments of the army, from a
helief that if they really knew what their duties were,
they would efficiently discharge them. The gallant
officer then read copious extracts from the reports of the
Sebastopol committee, the et imean commission-

era, aid the Chelsea commissioners, in sup-
port of his statement, and said that he believed the
noble lord at the bead of the War Department,
with the Commander-in-Chief of the Forces, could,
without much difficulty, frame the required regulations,
which he (Gen. Peel) thought should be of a permanent
charawer, and not :subject to the capricious alterations
of any successive Secretary of War, who might or might
not be competent for the discharge of the duties of the
office. These regulations should also embrace a defini-
tion of the powers and responsibilities of the Secretary
for War.
Mr. E. ELLICE, senior, confirmed the opinions
expressed by the gallant officer, and concurred in his
suggestions. At presentthere was great hesitation on the

part of heads of departments to state where responsibility
rested, and he thought it would be more satisfactory to
this house and the country if s )me definite regulation
were laid down for the Government and the superin-
tendents of the different departments connected with
the army and navy. He doubted if the country would
consent to the continuance of the present amount
of estimates in time of peace—(hear, hear, and cheers)—
and he urged on the Government necessary caution in
reducing the estimates, so that an efficient staff might be
maintained, capable of being ea=ily expanded in a time
of war. He expressed an adverse opinion as to the
keeping up great camps like Aldershot, relative to the
probable effect on tl-ei country generally. He then called
attention to the great amounts that were passed yearly
for barracks, and he doubted if the house was at all ac-
quainted with their state, what they were used for and
where they were, and expressed an opinion that it would
have been better for the disciplineand morals of the army if
the men had been lodged in these barracks, instead of
being collected together in large camps. He and the
Government had the same object in view, that of main-
taining the efficiency of the army, but they appeared to
differ from the mode in which it could be attained.
He however thought the plan he suggested would have
been found to be the best. (Hear.) It was no doubt
painful to put aside old officers. They ought to be libe-
rally rewarded for their past services; but in considering
the state of the army and its future requirements he
thought these old officers should be plainly told that
they must make way for younger officers who should
not be found wanting in time of necessity.
Sir J. PAKINGTON thought the hon. and gallant
officer had done the country some service in calling the
attention of the house to this eubject, and he ex-
pressed a hope that her Majesty's Government
would be prepared to state to the house that the mili-
tary departments were really understood, and strictly
defined, so that should this country be again involved in
war the country should be effectually secured against a
repetition of the evils they all had so lately to de-
plore. He also considered that, first and foremost, the
power and duties of the Secretary of War should be
explicitly laid down.
Sir W. CODRINGTON said that out the duties of the
Secretary of War were more of a civil than military
character, he should say but little about them. He be-
lieved the object of its establishment was to carry out
unity of action in the various departments of the army.
The discipline of the army was lets to the Commander-
in-Chief, but he (Sir W. Codrington) believed
there would be some difficulty under the
present system to bring borne responsibility
to any person in authority in the army. He suggested
that the Secretary of War should be responsible for the
financial departments only of the army ' • and that as the
Commander-in-Chief had to deal with the discipline
of the army, he should be made responsible
for it, and to do that the rewards of the army should
be under his control. He considered the establishment
of camps of great benefit in instructing the soldier in his
duties.

Mr. HENLEY approved of the movement of the
Government officers, and hoped it would result in the
benefit of the army. Everything 'required by a soldier
should be obtained easily and rapidly, and if any delay
took place, easy of being pointed ont, and the party to
blame censured if necessary.
Sir J. TRELAWNEY referred to the formation of
officers, especially those on the staff in this and in fo-
reign countries. On the continent an officer had to pass
through various stages before he became a member of
the staff, which was not the case in this country.
He called attention to two or three technical mat-
ters in reference to officers' pay, and to the lax
manner in which officers acted in reference to the scl
deer's pocket-ledger, which was a book wherein he ought
to keep a proper account of the pay he bad received, so
that in time of war, if anything happened to the regi-
mental books, the production of his pocket-ledger, if
properly kept, was taken as proof of the pay due to him.
Lord PALMERSTON, in reference to barrack ac-
commodation, said that it. was scanty throughout the
coy,p laucnetr and
to erect i
tf
hi w a
et
ms
was necessary
where
thereto build them,
was
ample
stphaeceb
forest
exercising the soldiers, such as at Aldershot, which,
from its central position, would be found beneficial in
times of war. Tie admitted the importance of the
question before the house, and expressed an opinion
that the gallant-general (General Peel) was not accu-
rately acquainted with the facts connected with the sub
Jed.

After some further observations frdm Mr. Stafford,
Mr. Baillie, Capt. Vivian, Sir F. Smith, Mr. Newde-
gate, and others, the vote was confirmed.
THE ORDNANCE SURVEY. OF SCOTLAND.
On the next vote (151,7441.), for education and scien-
tific branches),
Sir D. ORREYS complained of the large expense
the coun&Y was put to for the survey of Scotland, which
was so minute, as to mark out the site of every garden-
walk and pump upon the various estates. Such maps
were perfectly unnecessary for any national purposes, and
were simply surveys of estates fur the advantage of the
private landowners at the country's expense. The sub-
ject had been brought forward on a former occasion, but
the Chancellor of the Exchequer got out of the difficulty
by referring it to a committee of nine members, of whom
eight were Scotch. (A. laugh.) Of course nothing was
(one, and as it was a question involving an expense of
God knows how many millions of money, he should move
that the survey of Eootland, on the scale of 2b inokep