The Sun.
London, England, 1857-03-17 00:00:00

THE SUN, LONDON, TUESDAY EVENING, MARCH 17, 18:57.

irculo tion during the time of the Reformßill, in which lordships lordships will think that-at such a time as this we are
Xing Williatu the 4th is represented as tearing down i bound to utter a frank expression of our opinions ; that
~
certain papers bearing the words "Reform Bill"
up ,u ' we should be guilty of no electioneering mystery ; but
,
them, :Ind the words put into his ..kajssty,m a
mouth were that we shoul I openly state what our coarse has been
—"C In this be me ?" (Great laughter, and cheers.)
and
of mymyself to obloquy,
opinions
what our course will be. (Hear, bear.) In the
Your lordships will also remember a story of older date,
assertionl may expose
which tells the history of an unfortunate lady whose to calumny, and misrepresentation, as has before hap-
dress was somewhat unwarrantably interfered with in paned to me, and I hope I know bow to meet them ;
her sleep, and who, when she awoke, looked down on but lam sure at least of this—that no man can say that
lexpression my
ever shrank from the of political feel-
herself and exclaimed, " Sure, this can never be I."
(Lauf;•
hter ) lam sure that when the noble viscount ings—that I ever sank a principle for the esake of a poli-
sees s one of the cries that are attached to his name, he tical advantage, or that I ever deceived the trust re-
will
1 a bound to say, "This never can be me." (Hear, posed in. me.. by those friends who have honoured me
And Is ughter.) It is not a little remarkable that amongst with tle.tr political confidence. (Loud cheers.)
the va=rious watchwords which have been attached to the Earl GRANVILLE said that the noble earl had stated
name of the noble viscount there are three which I have with much emphasis on two occasions last week his
never heard associated with it. They are not unimpor- intention to call the attention of the house to the cir-
tent words, and have often been watchwords of the Libe-
ral party. I have not seen or heard the cries of "Pal-
o imslancee under which an appeal was about to be made
merston and Peace," "Palmerston and Retrenchment,"
to the country, and that in doing so on the second read-
" Palmerston and Reform." (Hear, hear, and cheers.) ing of the bill now before the house it appeared to him
Probably the noble viscount having been with me a sup- that the noble earl was taking a natural and proper
porter of the Reform Bill, thinks that constitutional re- course. Considering the assertions which had been put
form has gone far enough ; that reform was a question
forth by some of the noble lord's own supporters, it was
of the day, and it is quite consistent for any one who was
a supporter of the Reform Bill now to say, I will go no natural that the noble earl should make a statement
further. But peace and retrenchment are questions for which was calculatedto influence and as it were to afford
all times ; and I fear that if we have no peace, we shad a model for the electioneering addresses of kis party. The
have no retrenchment, and that we can have no aesocia- noble earl had now made that appeal, with every advan-
tion of peace with the name of Palmer:non. (Hear)
thee surroanding it which was calculated to produce the
Nov, my lords, I happened to see the other day in a
newspaper (The Sun), which warmly supports the noble greatest effect on the country. The noble earl bad said of
viecriunt and asserts his claims to the confidence of him, and some others of his colleagues, that they were
the country, a statement of the opinions to which mere cyphers, that they were " the appendages" of his
every man professing to be a Liberal ought to adhere. nsble friend (Lord Palmerston). He coal) assure the
It, ,Lid—" No man deserving the name of Liberal
noble earl that he did not feel any irritation en that
ought to wince while catechized upon each of these
subj eta :
ground, but he might ask the noble earl what the coon-
"s The Ballot ; try thought, and what he himself thought, of those
" The Extension of the Suffrage, and in particular whom he appended to himself during his Abort period of
Mr. Locke King's motion ; of ee as Prime Minister, and afterwards whether in his
" The Bank. Monopoly ;
unsuccessful attempt to form an administration, when
" Church Rates ;
he sought the co-operation of a noble colleague of his
e " Abolition of Purchase in the Army, and Promotion
by Merit ;
(Earl Granville's), not Lord Palmerston, whether be re-
" A graduated Income Tax." garded him as a cypher / If he did, it was probably as
The writer of the article objects, he says, upon principle the cypher added to the unit, giving to that unit ten
to f xicting pledges from candidates upon the busting,. ; times its value. (Hear.)
but these are the A B C of Liberalism, and no man
The Earl of DERBY—When he spoke of appendages
ought to hesitate for a single moment while being sate-
he had not referred to the noble earl or his noble col-
Weed upon them. I should like to see, for the amuse-
ment of the thing, the noble viscount, who is said to lesgue,
be at the head of a Liberal Government, just at the Eno- Earl GRANVILLE had then misunderstoodthe noble
meat that he is going through this catechism. (Hear.) earl, but he certainly thought the noble earl spoke of all
Tal,e the Ballot ! Why, there i 8 not a man in Eng-
the members of Lord Paimerston's Government except
lan I who so strongly ojsjects to the ba lot as the noble
that noble lord himself, as appendages and cyphers.
viscount. (Hear.) I should like to know what he would
have to say on the subject of Mr. Locke King's motion. ("No, no," from Lord Derby.) And he therefore felt
Justified
Then, as regards the Bank monopoly ; it is true that theustified in reminding the noble earl what he appeared to
Government has referred the question of the Bank Char- have forgotten—of how desirous he was, when endea-
ter to a select committee, but with a distinct intimation enuring to form a Government himself, to obtain their
that they contemplate, if any at all, the very least pos- assistance and co-operation. With the exception of these
sible, alteration in the condittrion of the Rank, and no- jokes, the whole tone of the noble earl's speech was so
thing whatever as regards the monopoly of banking. supplicatory, so apologetic and defensive, that it was quite
Thsn, as to Church rates, I believe the nett° viscount. obvious that he spoke under the consciousness that he was
on the losing side, and ho (Earl Granville), therefore
has expressed himself as strongly with rtgard to that.
reeling that ho was upon the winning side, might be ex-
question. Nor do I believe that he has pledged himself
to the abolition of purchase in the army ; but it ie is be i nosed, and certainly he could make no claim whatever to
magnanimity, if he abetained from making any observe-
ate owed that if the Government had come to such a de- magnanimity,
savouring of party bitterness or peloonal ani ter niration that they would have male some mention of
it. Teen, as to a graduated income tax, there is not mosity. (Hear, bear.) The noble earl in speaking of the
financial policy of the Government, and the bill then be-
ano who has given to it any decider: opinion, are that
',Lich has been given by the Government, one and all, fore their lordships, expressed his regret that they had
determined to deal with the income tax instead of I.?av-
ageinst a differential, that i 3 a graduated income tax. I
log it to be settled by the new Parliament. He wool.]
do out say that the Government have not supported mea-
rot say a word of what the country would have thought,
sure on these subjects, but in the sense of their being
- tests of liberalism there is not one of them but has met if, alter pl dging themselves as they had done to aben-
don the car vox, Ministers had left that matter as it
with opposition from the Government, so far as their
was, and pleaded such an excuse as that suggested by
owe views are concerned. There is hardly one of the:es
the nolle earl ; but he might be allowed to state one
mul jects with regard to which, in the event of their
thing, and that was, that if the bill had not been intro
being brought forward in the new Parliament, the Go-
verinnent will not be compelled, if they oppose them, to duce I and pressed through before the dissolution, the
country, whatever the decision of the next Parliament,
base recourse to a combination with that Conservative
must have been saddled with the war income tax, if not
port of which, in a moment of difficulty,
pasty which they no ,v abuse and viiify, but of the sup-
for :ix months, at all events for three months beyond
they are but
to glad to avail themselves. (Hear.) But r may be April next, when, accerding to the provisions of the bill
asked if the then under consideration, it would expire. The noble
noble viscount is so much of a Conservative,
earl, forgetting what was antecedent with regard to
wl.y not support him as a Conservative ? To that I repty,
in the fleet place, that Ido not know what are the present himself, and therefore more natural to have occurred to
opinions of the noble viscount ; secondly, that if he is a him, said that he had always indulged in a confident
Conservative, he is in a false position as the avowed bead hope :a I expectation that the income tax would be put
of he Liberal party; and lastly, that if the principles of an end to altogether at the end of a certain period of
th • noble viscount are Conservative, I have yet no confi-
years. If the noble earl had refreshed his memory by a
deuce that he will al nays support his own principles, or reference to his own previously expressed opinions upon
t that he will in the moment of danger baldly stand up in this question, he would have found that when ridiculing
defence of his own principles and opinions. (Gear) I Mr. Gladetone's budget in 1853, he said, in speaking of
fully acknowledge the high qualities of the noble viscount the proposition of maintaining certain duties in order
that the income tax might be taken off in 1860, " that
—no one is more alive to the charms of his conversation
e
or more willing to concede his readiness and resource, the noble lord (then at the head of the Goverr-
ment) or himself would live to see the day when that
and the adroitness with which he manages a popular a--
tax would be taken off he did not expect." (Cheers )
sembly ; but if I am asked whether I believe that he is
So that, whether the prophecy of the noble earl were
guided by fixed principlee, or that he is imbued with
these high principles wl'ich ought to characterise a Bii-
right or wrong, it was clear that he had not the same
th h min ~ter, Ido not think I can venture to say that f confident hope and expectation in 1853 of the early
can place confidence in the noble viscount. (Hear, hear.) expiration of the tax as he now stated. (Cheers.) The
noble earl then enumerated various topics of national
W hat has happened in this very sension ? On the intro-
duction of the budget we were told that it was indispene- policy, and, drawing his conclusions from the course
May necessary to the requirements of the revenue that which the Government had taken with regard to
id e dutigs on tea should be raised to ls. 7d, in the pound. them, said they were about to appeal to the country
An opposition to this impost was threatened, Mr. Glad- without any intelligible principle. Before saying
at me gave notice of an amendment to fix the duty at a word upon this part of the question, he might be
is 3 1., and Lord J. Russell gave notice of another to fix allowed' to ask their lordships whether they thought
it at ls. 41. What happened 3 In the face of the declara• there was any peculiar fitness in bringing such a charge
ti.m which had been made shortly before that it was bulls-
in the eloquent peroration with which, dealing with
p usably necessary to the revenue that the duty should
generalities in the widest possible manner, the noble earl
coseluded his speech, without giving them the slightest
be that which the Government proposed, the Chencellor
ef
the Exchequer, when threatened with a supposed combi-
information of what his own principles were ? (Hear,
hear.) When the noble earl talked of disunion he might
netion of parties, gave way on a point which he said was
absolutely essential to the public service. (Hear, hear ) retort that there were many amongst the noble earl's
But there is another and a more striking instance. If own supporters who did not feel any great confidence in
thers is one thing which more than another is the hie leadership, or any very accurate knowledge of his
b. arden duty of a Minister of the Crown with reference principles. (" Hear," and cheers.) The noble earl
to the exereise of that prerogative of the Crown, it is might say that he was not bound to explain beforehaed
t
that the advice which he gives to the Crown, in the die_ the principles upon which, if he were in office, he would
c
tr bution of honours emanating from the Crown, should carry on the government of the country; but they could
be given irrespective of Parliamentary influence. (Hear, not forget that the noble earl was once at the head of a
hear.) Ido not mean to express my opinion on the Government—fur a very short time it was true—(bear)
p irticular case to which I am about to allude, —but which he endeavoured to prolong by postponing
but it it is quite certain that the noble viscount, with to the very last moment the dissolution which he bad
promised as soon as he found himself in a minority in
the sanction of the noble baron opposite (Lord Panmure)
the house, and under circumstances not, as now, when
sent letters to Sir J. M'Nell and Cul. Tolled.), containing
a pecuniary gift, which, he raid, was the form of reward na large or great question of policy was agitating the
for their services which appeared to her Majesty's Go-
public mind ; but when a question of vital importance to
v inmost to be the fitting and appropriate one. The
the country was involved in the issue of the appeal to
the electoral body, and when the interests of a great
noble viscount was asked in the House of Commons if it
party were wrapped up in the result, he continued to sit
mete intended to confer any mark of honour emanating
there as first minister, showing the greatest pat once,
fr on the Crown on those gentlemen. Ho replied that ii
e
v- is not his intention—that their services were not of and, he must add, the greatest dexterity, in fencing the,
that nature which entitled them to receive such marks of question which was put to him, night alter night, wht-
teer he was going to tte country in favour of protection
honour, and it was not proposed to advise the Crown to
c safer on them such marks of honour. A notice of ine-
or of free trade. (Hear, hear.) The noble earl, he
Can on the subject was given, but befsre the motion was thought, was rot then the person who who was in a po-
b:ought on tt e question was repeated, and the noble gibes to accuse the Government of appealing to the
vi-count repeated his answer that he did not think it con.- country without having any defined principle of policy to
a:stent wits his duty to advise the Crown to confer any go uson. (Rear.) The noble earl twitted Ministers with
nark of honour on those gentlemen. When the motion I having in the division in the Commons, on Mr. Locke
vas brought on, it was opposed by the noble viscount ; King's bill, been found in the same lobby with the oppo-
bet there came a pressure upon him, and in a matter nents of that measure. He (E ,r 1 Granville) admitted
vs hich concerned the distribution of honours by the that that was an "unfortunate contingency"—(" hear,
hear," and laughter from the Opposition)—but if the
Cnown, he consented to give advice to the S:werti,tt
e hich 20 minty es before he said it was inconsistent whin house would allow him, he would explain that eircuni-
hi : duty to offer. Can I have confidence in a Minister stance in a few words. When the bill was
eeho so readily gives way to pressure ! And I suppose, lira introducer'', the Government, after duo deli.
be. ation, determine-i than. it should be supported, with
that if, r n that occasion, there had been a division, act'
the view of introducing such modifications in oat lit-
tle) Government, as was most probable, had been de-
tee as they thought would effect a useful and prudent
f ated, we should have heard of factious combinations ;
aid if so, it was owing to the pressure of a combination extensioa of the county franchise ; and it was only when
t ;at the noble viscount acted in a manner which he do. on a close examination of the bill itself, it was found to
be so drafted as not to admit of those amendments, and
c need to be inconsistent with the duty he owed to the
it was felt it would be a waste of the time of the house to
eii:iniity of the Crown. I have, my lords, trespassed
grievouFly on the time arid patience of '-the house—
oattlezing the second reading. ((Tear, hear.) But if
pt to amend it, that the Government decided upon
Selieers)—and I shall do so bur for a shot t time lin oe p
It lam asked whet is the course whieh I think itg,i • Lord Derby wi.died it to be inferred that because they
oable to 100 personal in the te. e-t Parliament by thoseL- could not Support the bill in question ill the shape in
with whims I have the honour to act, I say that it is which it wag presented to Parliament, that therefore
their boundLii duty to adhere to the;r own principles and they considered the reforms which had' been effected
their own opinions, irrespective of the Tete ers from which' final, and that the electoral system, as it at present stoo I,
th, y oene. If the•noble viscount—avoiding.aPdn was susceptil-de of no further improvement, he was wholly
nos organic changes in the great institetiens of the in error. 'ln that respect, as in all others, Lord Pel-
country—makes only such reforms in oar secal instittn rtierston'e Government lodged themselves to progressive
- _
L
ioni as are calculated to combine the exertions of all
improvement and reform in every department of the
lovers of their country, I can assure the noble viscount state. (Rear.) Then upon the subject of education,
abet from the Conservative party he will meetwithno the noble earl said that Lord Palmerston was prepared
factious opposition. He need drea.l GO unprinciplea to take any course that might suit their purposes at the
combinations against Lim ; but,,on the-hontrary, he will moment. To that charge he replied that the Govern-
fi nd us ready to assist him against all attempts at lia,ty ment had expressed their views clearly upon the educa-
tion question, on a bill brought forward by a member of
in iovatien, and ready to join cordially with him in pro-
meting the progress of those social improvements which the noble earl's own Government, and which he might
av odd afford abundant room for the labours of any
nii- be allowed to say, would, he believed, be most uuob
ei- -try. In everything which tends to the simplification )ectionab'e, and would have been the most useful, had it
and the revision of the law, or the better adaptation of passe I, that had been presented to Parliament.
Be that
our present system, and the better disposal of our convict ')vev!r as it might, the Government had shown them
i case steh of f
otthhee
r,
it Scotch
rag
a bill s
found in that h
impossible
p pulation ;in the betterprovieion of rneansfor correcting selvesi in no way indifferent to the subject ; but, as in the
c
tie steps of those who are on the verge of crime ; and inhouse, a and
obtainthe E ogl
thatish con bill
stiainlating the voluntary efforts of the country towards t
the establishment of a system of religious and moral edu• currenee of opinion which was necessary to pass a rnea-
they could posy it through
. . .•sure of that kind, and even if
cation in everything that may tend to the physical and
Periiainent, he believed, looking at the stronw objections
lie hell purification of the great mass of contagion whicl
entertained to any such msasure by a large prirtion of the
lie, !,eerrenting our towns and cities—the noll9 ViSCOtintl community,, that it would do harm rather than geed. But
I 1 enters ori such a career, will receive the aseilance
of the Conservativeparty, But if, sacrificing his own tee noble earl, when he said he was in favour of a large
of
ha •
ei... . , gives way before the advalc-s of undue
'n valaaa, I trust he will find the Conserve-lye further—and remembering ta , the noble earl's late
party stilt eunichitently numerous, and sufficiently Celonial S,cretery brought a bill into the house of
po eerie!, to save
in his own supporters, and able
to oppose to, them eimnie6rao Commons in one year. embodying a proposition tending
tteacifaet resistance as will pre-
veet him from itillictilhseerii to a system of r:1 gious education, and in 4`
veer
nt,z, a
ous injory en the country. bill whose tendency was to estalforli a system of pure)
J :en ea'istied that wh
secular instettetion • the mills earl ought to stat-e
seal to the interests of the aiitill 7 out l'farrilah, it i 3 CSSer:,
ane,stry the. the Conservative
Fia, iy sh.iu;4l ire numerous
tie of
all thei'e v.ll, which ‘,,r tl, t 7,, he approved. (hear, hunt,) And it,hen
th.+ slightest hesitation, that i
wit,riong. I say with"" 1 life hate President of the Boma'. of trade Oh. liatilee.
I rose up in the other hull +t attil laid his hands ktrelity
w, ee one.) l-anded to.gether by the'
v.,,,,iv0
opinio,
j,t to
which I
sot
;01,,,:ri, twof 049„ Gmsct. 1 "spin :ehr johil Pakingten's saliva :a and crushed the
in--to
lc
ui,.33, ai
4,110 1,:v0.,tn,i,,..,___
4:,•-4,rr.; ahact ~n,c3 i wipe, fateee let . dtlit the ricila earl ought to say wise.
oil
iitlitrd
n0',:,,u!,." :vat 1
file
w:t,„74:01
tclooly. a psifltipi..; i
}One or not that tees done with hie ranctioe and vette
tied; any sueh nui er must he fist] octed oe es.°), h-"4.31toll fettion. (lest ) The noble cail had et) 'ken Of inter-
op ftif)u aud nieecii I , find not On role' bee) ;M,ltmt!eity. t'f 1 honours weitli t.'e
;liren"(P'''i7° I:r t"
Crown
il 4.1"'Ili"
:rrainp,lto i
‘oo.o,otuers ~ r recritoriutte servree.e,
and the
for ii a combination to OVerthrOw a Government 14" d relating to the
for a a disorganised succ.uslion to their office,. it,l3, ; umbweiiiinanthe House of QaMinolle on the case of Sir J .
opinions may not be popular in the present eaY ; but I d Col. l'ulloch, had declared that for himself
have adhered to them for no inconsiderable period of My be founittPsauriti withi
'ahem he acted they Weald Malys
life. lam too old to change them now, and they will re- lof "'" . e . „porting caieting institutions. Was it proof
nt.in the Came te the end of nov life. I in'end to nen'
..,n- 'll
r _..,.0,,, eterrnieatlon that one of the to`oie earl' ' '
.
11 saglies almoet lea ree . r .. • 8 Pn"
tai-: tr, the re- -
- o,mest of my agility the inttitutiaee ti the ieese of a
Jaltilo e •. ..,0 a,teeit winch induced the
conetry ; I will port f *he Croy n 5..,, to interfere with the prerogative of
Iv; ill support the I .t le
' 'i-e of 04) Crov-1 '
prereg,, , ,
~,, .
,f.
th • on th et oceasi , ? (Rear) A great portion
your lorashipe' i; 'erechtlh? rights and inclepensfence cf ing e "bit' earl's l" see, -r.
eume- I- will -- e to foreign t,,,,hP . a embraced various topics relat-
petede, and a -II support Le rights (or the. alto re, In commenting
WI Ruppert f • venous epithet. upon which he used
~,,,
~Plot then -E3taliiistied he rtgate and the prp his
nous irte , Forne of which lie i 'ght possibly, had
nCieurela of which I have Fez william beer'inby his side 'all
een rt attaclied t ire e, have's :i(ireEde 1
ember. I desira to se? So numerous were taus© ee )aitti the
her ,s, ;IA places strengthened, ~it be cou'dPnot ti ,-.0 1 ~as see should be held firmlaynide hie: def,:cts repaired,
t;-1.111 Al, but he bedixevimciti et
iemory so far as to enumerate
the dictatorial,"
pcoale ; but / will never con oat tt me
off
ions of- the dlieg," " the uejustifieble:' " the feed-
er:or e from the fabric of the churochwithdraer a single
characterisoi the noble lorespirit of interference which
with filial revel once and affections o oil which I look he
The 0 i
instance .
.(palinerst et) were atnengst
trin t your lordships will pardon me (Hear, hear.) 1 them,
fil. ftl tn. y t: as
the noble earl adduced
k 0 1:,411C1 of my ewn Lehr.- •
„idi forobtrudiee
opnions. oil
you ,to just: y _lfb,, epithetsi.l ,-, that of Napl„. ier,),ff
with
retLeird 1,...) IN aples t len. ()reships need Lot be re: ' ' i
fere, an amenably which 1:' . We do not muse,
an7ertb'e to ceestituents. that; ono of the ablest and. most experienced members of
and 4e hut exorese cur weer, i,teezose,/ ; „,,,,theies3,
rh-,e ! that iwrete—uric svione Leucite:nue they all almired, and
do Lot incur the I.q .
..,,S responsionity ; ant) I .l-tal , , , .
ani sure your 4 'sy h I,t t: autbority they la re upon WIL.I re:l,ft,, even
•