The Sun.
London, England, 1861-02-15 00:00:00

VAGRANCY, &c. (SCOTLAND).

of those who, in this country, sent out that portion of their
forces employed in China, nor on the part of those in the
Government of India, who contributed their propo • on very
materially towards the success of the operat ns of the
army and navy. The operations of the force were con-
ducted with the utmost possible skill, gallantr and intre-
pidity. I may say there was not a mistake made in the
whole course of those operations. (Hear, he a ) There was
no deficiency in any of the arrangements, tither of provid-
ing the force with all those things which were necessary in
transporting it from place to place, or in those naval and
military operations which it was called upon to perform.
(Hear, hear.) There was also, I am glad to say, the most
perfect harmony between the British and French forces.
(Hear, hear.) The difficulties were great, and they were
overcome with rapidity. The period, too, during which
they were accomplished was comparatively short, and what
they undertook they accomplished without a single check.
(Hear, hear.) It is well known that the war in China arose
in the refusal on the part of the Chinese Government to
ratify the treaty of Tien-tsin, which bad been concluded be-
tween the Earl of Elgin and that Government in the former
year. It became necessary to obtain the ratification of that
treaty, and the French and English Governments both
concurred in that necessity, and each sent their respective
forces to enforce the treaty. But both Governmentsresorted
in the first place to persuasion through their representatives
before they had recourse to extreme measures. They pro-
posed to the Chinese Government to reconsider its decision,
and to fulfil the obligations they had contracted ; and it was
not until it was evident that every effort of negotiation had
failed, and until it was evident that nothing but force would
obtain the ratification of the engagements of the treaty that
force was resorted to. It was at the beginning of May that
the force assembled at Hong Kong, and in the beginning of
June they left that port for their destination, which they
reached at the end of June. It was not, however, until the
26th of July that everything was ready. I believe that the
French suffered by shipwreck and tempest some loss of their
supplies, and it was necessary to wait until those losses were
made good. On the Ist of August the allied forces landed
at Peih-Tang, at the mouth of the river, an operation which
VMS performed with the greatest possible skill. The troops
had to wade through a great extent of mud, up to their knees,
before they could reach dry land ; and even when they got
there it wasfound that'there was a position which might have
been fortified. There came on the next day very heavy rains,
which rendered it impossible for them to advance and
attack those forts. It was very important indeed that those
forts should be taken. On their march from Peih-Tang
they met with forts, which proved to be an entrenched
Chinese camp, and on the 14th of August they.attacked
and took the position, and captured 400 guns, overcoming
at the same time all difficulties. On the 21st of August
they performed the most brilliant operations in the capture
of Chinese forts, and it was but justice due to the Chinese
to say that they defended themselves with great bravery.
Their position was strong and furnished with a great num-
ber of guns and stockades and palisades, and it was not
taken without the loss of a great number of men to the
allies, and the loss also on the part of the Chinese was very
great. On the 20th of August the yet unsurrendered places
were attacked by storm, and the forts surrendered. On the
6th of September the allied forces reached Tien-tsin—the
place where the treaty had been concluded—and when they
arrived there there were many attempts made by the Chi-
nese to induce the allies to enter into negotiations ; but it
was seen that their object was not to ratify the treaty, but
to gain time. On the 9th of September the representatives
of the allies advanced, and a place was marked out on which
the advanced portion of the allied forces was to encamp,
and arrangements were to be there made for concluding the
treaty ; but on Sept. 10, when our troops arrived there,
they found a vast force of Chinese established, and in far
greater numbers than the forces of the allies. At that time
Mr. Parkes and those associated with him went forward
for the purpose of demanding explanations on this change
of position. They were induced, evidently by treachery, to
confide in the Chinese, and were then made prisoners, and,
as is well known, those gentlemen were treated by the Chi-
nese—who should have afforded them protection, and in
whom they confided—it is well known they were treated
with the greatest injustice, and that the moat barbarous
cruelties ever known were inflicted upon them by the Chi-
nese. Well, it was on that occasion that the allies advanced
and performed the most brilliant operations, taking the
Chinese position; and it would be recollected that there were
on that occasion 20,000 Chinese in arms, who were routed
by our forces, and from whom, with our allies,we thentoek 75
guns. On the 21st the Chinese again attacked the allied
armies and they were again defeated-. The Tartar and
Chinese forces were superior in numbers, and they were
driven back with signal defeat, and lost on that occasion
43 guns. In the whole course of the operations the allied
troops took 500 or 600 pieces of cannon. (Hear, hear.) On
the 7th of October our allies advanced and occupied the
Emperor's Summer Palace, and on that occasion demands
were made to the Chinese authorities to deliver up imme-
diately the prisoners, and to surrender into the hands of
the allies one of the gates of Pekin. That demand was
enforced, and the result was that the Chinese agreed to
the treaty of Tien-Tsin, and those prisoners who were still
alive were given up to us. In the course of three days
those results were accomplished without any defeat, and
the result is that the treaty, with all its conditions and
promised advantages, is now likely to be carried out.
.(Hear, hear.) But there was one event which occurred,
and which nothing but the barbarous cruelties and atro-
cities that had been committed by the Chinese on the
prisoners could justify—l mean the destruction of the
Emperor's palace. It is well known—and I am not new
going to put the house to the pain of the relation—that the
most enormous cruelties that were ever inflicted upon men
were inflicted, as I stated, by the Chinese upon the unfor-
tunate men whom they so treacherously made prisoners.
I will not dwell upon those inhuman cruelties—cruelties
the most barbarous that ever were perpetrated by man. I
will not dwell upon the treachery—treachery in which was
exhibited much skill—by which the Chinese hoped to take
a much larger portion of the allied army, and also our
ambassadors—treachery unsurpassed, because there were
negotiations going on at the time for the ambassadors to
go to negotiate in Pekin. When those negotiations were
going on they demanded a right of escort of 1,000 men as .
a means of safety, and the Chinese seemed to comply, but
their proceedings were only part of a much larger plan
by which the Chinese Government might defeat the ob-
jects of the expedition. I will not dwell upon the state-
ment which the Chinese made when we asked them how
they had treated the prisoners, and what those of them who
survived stated when we asked them how they had been
treated by the Chinese. The first statement of the Chinese
was that they had been well treated. Nothing could be
more untrue—nothing more treacherous and barbarous than
the conduct of the Chinese, and the atrocities committed by
them ; but the conduct of the allied forces was such as
showed that such atrocities could not be committed on our
people with impunity. (Hear, hear.) It was necessary
that the Chinese should be made to suffer for such atrocities;
but at the same time, not in a similar spirit. Had Pekin
been stormed, every one might have reason to lament the
bloodshed that would ensue; and it was therefore thought
by General Grant--and I think justly thought—that the
atrocities committed by the Chinese authorities were not
inflicted by the will and desire of the Chinese people. An
hon, friend asked me if the French General agreed to the
course which we proposed to pursue on that occasion.
Well, then, I may say that the French General did not
agree; but the French forces advanced, and the General's
troops, as I have stated, took possession of and occupied the
Emperor's palace. But Lord Elgin stated that notwith-
standing that, the French General did not decline to take
any part in the operations in conjunction with our forces.
(Hear, hear.) On the contrary, he said it was his duty, and
I am happy to say that the allied forces operated together
successfully. (Hear, hear.) In the first place, then, I am
happy to say that our joint operations were successful ; and
in the next place, the lesson which we have taught the
Emperor of China and his people will not, I hope, be lost
upon them. In a commercial point of view, nothing can be
of greater importance than oar success in opening up that
great country not only in its ports, but in its rivers and inte-
rior, to the enterprise of the people of this country—(hear,
hear)—and in such a manner as will compensate for what
has occurred. Their great river, Yang •Tis-Kyang, is now
opened up to our shipping. (Hear, hear.) I have also
great satisfaction in finding that there were in the expedi-
tion officers of our army and navy who proved themselves,
by their great bravery and brilliant achievements worthy of
those who had gone before them, and who had left them
such glorious examples for imitation—(hear, hear, and
cheers)—and that they proved themselves in every way
worthy of the country that sent them out. (Cheers and
hear, hear.) Many gallant men have been lost in the ex-
pedition. We find among the many gallant officers the
name of Hope, who had already distinguished himself in
the Peninsular war. (Hear, hear.) We find also a name
which is so associated with those officers who bore the name
of Napier—(hear, hear)—a name which is distinguished in
our military and naval annals. I know not whether the
gallant officer to whom I allude is allied to those great men
whose names are distinguished in the history of our coun-
try, but I trust that the mention of his name, associated
with his valour, will be sufficieet toentitlehim to the thanks
of this house. (Hear, hear ) It would be trespassing too
long on the house were I to recount all the names of the
gallant officers who distinguished themselves on that occa-
sion ; their services are recorded in the annals of their coun-
try's greatness. (Hear, hear.) We have also the satisfac-
tion of knowing that in an expedition in a remote part of
the globe, accompanied by great difficulties, we have had
two great nations working side by side, fighting together
in one.common cause, and carrying out those operations in
the most perfect harmony and accord, and without any of
those dissensions too frequently found prevailing in the
operations of forces, whether naval or military, belonging to
different nations. (Hear, hear.) I trust it may be long
before the forces of England and France will go into action
in any other way than side by side, for the common interest
and for the common glory of the two countries, and for ob-
jects honourable alike to the oae and the other. (Hear, hear.)
I will not trespass longer on the attention of the house, but
move the resolutions which I have to propose, viz. :
" That the thanks of this house be given to Lieutenant-
General Sir Hope Grant, K.C.8., Vice-Admiral Sir James
Hope, K.C.8., Major-General Sir John Michell, K.C.8.,
Major-General Sir Robert Napier, K.C.8., Rear-Admiral
Lewis Tobias Jones, C. 8., for the distinguished skill, zeal,
and intrepidity with which they conducted the combined

In answerto Sir J. FERGUSSON,
The LORD-AIDVOCATE said that he had a bill in pro-
'station en these subjects, and he took that opportunity
of stating that b e was also prepared to introduce a bill
• en the question 4)f the fisheries in Scotland.

NEW WRIT.
Ou the meeon of Mr. BRAND a writ was ordered to be
lulled for the election of a member of Parliament in thus
place of ltit, John. Owen, Bart., deceased.
THE ARMY AND THE NAVY ENGAGED IN
rIIE CHINESE WAR.
• Lord PALIIILItSTON—I rise, sir, to perform one of the
most agreeable duties that can fall to the lot of a member
of this house, artd in doing that, I call upon the house also
to perform one cf those functions which must be most gra-
tifying to them, I mean to move that the thanks of this
house be given to a number of brave and gallant officers of
the army and navy who have performed brilliant and dis-
tinguished services under circumstances of great difficulty
and attended with great and remarkable success. (Hear,
hear.) The operations to which I refer took place in China
last year. They were, in the first place, performed by a corn.
paratively small force in one of the most distant parts of the
performed by a force which
globe. .They were was Perhaps.
be'ter equipped than any that ever left the shores of Woos
"V ether country. There was nothing wanting on the part

operations in the north of China, which terminated in the
capture of Pekin, whereby an honourable peace has been
obtained on the terms proposed by her Majesty and her
ally the Emperor of the French.
" That the thanks of this house be given to the officers of
the Army, Navy, and the Royal Marines, including her
Majesty's Indian forces; both Eutopdat and native, for the
energy and gallantry with which they executed the services
they were balled upon to ilerfori-ii.
"That this house doth acknowledge and highly approve
the gallantry, discipline, and uniform courage displayed
by the petty officers, non-commissioned officers, and men
of the Navy, Army, Royal Marines, and her Majesty's
Indian forces, European and native, and the c Drdial good
feeling which animated the united force, and that the same
be communicated to them by the commanders of the several
ships and corps, who are respectfully desii'ed to thank them
for their gallant and steadfast behaviour!'

them also, but with the exception that a creditor's assignee
was to audit their accounts, and were to collect all debts
over £lO, they remained in the same position. Debts under
£lO were in future to be got by the official assignees. He
believed that so stringent were the clauses of the bill, that
no person would be found to undertake the office of credi-
tor's assignee. There Were, no doubt, very many valuable
pioi-isiohb It this hill,
.bat he contended that, as it was the
principal measure of the sesga, it bight to be much more
comprehensive.
The ATTORNEY-GENERAL said that when, last
year, he brought in a bill which consolidated the old law,
with various suggestions and improvements, it was said
by hon, gentlemen, " What a huge production 1 It cannot
be understood of properly gone through." Well, the bill
he brought in this year embodied all that was new in the
old ; and: though it did not contain any portion of the old
law, yet it incorporated every suggestion involving the
alterations contained in the measure of last year. But inas-
much as he did in the last session say, with unnecessary
candour, that it could not be read or thoroughly understood,
and therefore not properly discussed, he thought it better
to insure its passing this session, by carefully extracting
from that measure all that was new, and so far from its
being less valuable, though not so voluminous, in his opi-
nion it was of greater value. (Hear.) At all events, if it
were not so, all he could say was, that he had thrown away
weeks and months of labour in vain. (Hear.) He did not
complain of the course pursued by the hon. and learned
member for Sheffield. The objections urged by the hon.
and learned members for Sheffield and Guildford were, in
fact, based upon an imperfect knowledge of the provisions
of the bill, or at best upon slender information. It had been
said, for instance, that this was an attorney's bill, but all
ho could say in reply was, that the bill had the approval of
the commercial body, and of none more than the consti-
tuency represented by the hon. and learned gentleman. It
was true that the custody and control of funds were en-
trusted to solicitors, under the superintendence of the offi-
cial assignees; but it was at the same time placed under
such regulations as would ensure the prompt payment into
the bank and the speedy distribution among the creditors
of the assets when collected. He would admit that there
were many parts of the bill which could be amended, and
when they got into committee he would invite the most
full and free discussion on the part of his hon. and learned
friends on both sides of the house, as well as of the mem-
bers connected with commerce. His great object was to
make the measure as effective as possible, and at the same
time to pass it without any unnecessary delay. He trusted
the house would agree to the second reading, and proceed
with the bill in detail as early as possible.
The bill was then read a second time, and ordered to be
committed on Monday next.
BANK OF ENGLAND PAYMENT BILL.
This bill was read a second time.
PAROCHIAL ASSESSMENTS BILL.
This bill was also read a seed a second time.
RED SEA AND INDIA TELEGRAPH COM-
PANY BILL.

Mr. PISEAELI—Sir, I have the honour accorded to
me to second the motion of the noble lord. The noble lord
has given such a clear and animated narrative of the suc-
cessful operations in China that it is unnecessary for me to
dwell upon them, and indeed it would be presumptuous for
me to do so. It is enough that we all feel that a great mili-
tary operation has been achieved with power and precision,
with indomitable bravery, and irresistible perseverance.
The army and navy of England have more than once ex-
pressed their conviction that one of their greatest rewards
is to receive the thanks of Parliament ; and I can say for
myself, and I hope for the house also, that we consider it
one of our greatest privileges to offer the expression of our
thanks and admiration for their achievements. (Hear,
hear.) Although on the events which have occurred in
China, it is impossible to refer to any of those great military
exploits, or to any of those immortal deeds which were ac
complished on those great fields, that posterity hereafter
will look to with varied feelings of wonder and admiration ;
yet, nevertheless, looked at in a military sense, and having
regard to military considerations, there is one view of the
case the importance of which cannot be overstated, and that
is, that in a remote part of the world, and in a strange
climate, we have found the health of our troops so admir-
ably preserved. (Cheers.) I attribute this to our now per-
fect organisation, applying all those discoveries and re-
sources of modern science to the maintenance of the health
and the equipment of our troops, which has been so long
desired and sought for. And if, as I believe, this is a cir-
cumstance not of an exceptional character, we have the
satisfaction of feeling that, so far as this subject is con-
cerned, we have already mitigated one of the miseries of
war. The noble lord has touched upon the singularity of
such great results having, in such a distant part of the
world, been achieved with so small a body of men, and at
such comparatively small sacrifice. Indeed, I think this is
a subject which well deserves the consideration of the house.
A handful of men, not, I believe, amounting to the number
who followed Zenophon, have waged war in a great coun-
try at nearly the remotest part of the globe, and have dic-
tated a peace in the ancient capital of a nation which num-
bers more than one .third of the whole population of the
world. (Cheers.) This is not the first occasion during the
last quarter of a century that mankind have been impressed
with the immense influenee which Europe is exercising over
the rest of the world. This is not the first occurrence of
great exploits which has proved the predominant power of
that part, f the globe in which it is onr happiness to exist.
(Hear.) But, Sir, there are other considerations connected
with this result which should not be, I think, absent from
our thoughts. At this moment, under'Providence, it is not
merely this quarter of the globe, but we may say it is Wes-
tern Europe that commands the world. (Cheers.) If that
power be so irresistible, if those means be so great, I think
we all should feel that the moral responsibility of their
exercise is proportionately increased in that' respect.
(Cheers.) Under these circumstances, that appears to me
a consideration which should not be lost to the councils
,of the Sovereign, and which may blend advantageously
even with the triumphant gratitude of Parliament. For the
distinguished zeal by which these operations have been con-
ducted, I Leg, sir, to second the resolutions. (Cheers.)
Mr. V. SCULLY said that he was not going to interfere
with the harmony of the vote of thanks which had just
been proposed ; but as he had placed a notice of motion on
the paper, he wished to call attention to the published
statements that the Emperor of China's Summer Palace
and its contents had been ruthlessly looted and destroyed
by the English and:French forces. From the blue book
on the affairs of China he could not make out whether this
wilful act of destruction had taken place with the consent
of the French Ambassador. The burning of the Emperor's
Summer Palace appeared to him to have been an act of
Vandalism and barbarism without precedent in ancient or
modern history. It was not the fact that the French ab-
stained from destroying the palace, because they had pre-
viously obtained their revenge by looting and gutting the
palace, and in confirmation of this view he read an extract
from a despatch written by a French general, which ap-
peared in the Moniteur of Jan. 2. He did not want to read
any homilies to the house or come forward as a humanita-
rian, but if Baron Gros had done what he (Mr. Scully)
complained of, then his acts would be criticised by the
noble mover of the resolution as inconsistent with civilisa-
tion and the advanced spirit of the age. There were plain
and obvious comments that might be made if he were dis-
posed to indulge in hostile criticism. He would merely say
non meus hie sermo—the language was that of Byron :
" Let Eratostratus and Elgin shine,
In many a branding page and burning line."
[Much merriment was here excited in consequence of the
hon. gentleman not being able to proceed with the quota-
tion.]
Well, he would finish with a quotation from a poet with
which ho was more familiar :

On the motion for the second reading of this bill,

Mr. WYLD said he understood it was the intention of
the Chancellor of the Exchequer to refer it to a select com-
mittee. He could not understand why that course should
be taken, but he hoped that if it were so referred the select
committee would have power to investigate all the facts
connected with the contract. If he was rightly informed,
the company meant, after saddling the country with a bur-
den equivalent to the interest of a million of Consols for 50
years, to abandon the undertaking altogether, and leave
their cables in the sea, useless either to this country or
India.

Mr. CONINGIIAM said he was not prepared to agree
to the line proposed for the Red Sea Telegraph; and it
would be monstrous to call upon the public to pay their
money for such a scheme. The country ought not to be
exposed to lose £Boo,oooby this scheme, which was marked
with fraud ; and he (Mr. Coningham) would, for one, if he
even stood alone, divide the house on the question.
Mr. CRAWFORD said his hon. friend (Mr. Coning-
ham) had stated that Mr. Gisborne had failed in his pre-
vious efforts ; but his hon. friend was not, in his opinion,
justified, however that might be, in his place in Parlia-
ment, in branding Mr. Gisborne with fraud. (Hear, hear.)
If his hon. friend thought so, he ought to rise and state in
a straightforward way what the nature of the imputed
fraud was. With respect to the failure of the Red Sea
Telegraph, he did not think that they would be able, by
ar y inquiry, to ascertain it satisfactorily. In his opinion,
tho science connected with the laying of deep-sea tele•,
graphs was not sufficiently developed when the Rea Sea
Telegraph was laid down as to ensure its success.
Mr. DISRAELI said it was desirable to shorten discus-
sions of this kind. With regard to what had taken place,
nothing he might say was ever better known than the terms
upon which the late Government entered into the contract,
and he believed the hon. gentleman who had just addressed
the house was well aware of that. But ho (Mr. Disraeli)
could say from his own experience that nothing was better
known to the members of this house than the impending
contract, and nothing was more known to the members of
the city of London or to the public. And although he
should not now touch upon the highest, or rather the
lowest depths of hypocrisy that marked some men's pro-
ceedings in the matter, still he must say now that this con-
tract was gone into with the full knowledge of the members
of the city of London. And looking at what had taken
place in India, had that contract not been entered into, it
was the intention of the late Government to have decided
that the contract would be taken up by the Government on
the part of the country, and he thought it was the duty of
any Government to carry such a proposition into effect
(Hear, hear.)
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER, was sorry
that the right hon. gentleman had by his observations
somewhat widened the sphere of the discussion. He would
not follow him in all his observations, but he might say
that the Government were, in his opinion, in the present
stage of the proceedings warranted in stepping in and
taking the matter up. Ho would not now enter into a dis-
cussion of what the expenditure had been, or what it might
be ; but he must say that much depended upon their keep-
ing perfect faith with the public and the company, and
their intention was to give effect as far as could be to the
contract. All these matters were legitimate subjects for
the cognisance of Parliament, but were entirely apart from
the consideration before them. Those persons who had in-
vested their money in this undertaking were not only entirely
dependent on the house giving effect to the arrangement that
had been made, but on their doing it with the utmost pos-
sible despatch. To mix this up with larger questions
would create the utmost possible dissatisfaction out of
doors, and would raise a suspicion that Parliament was
seeking for some occasion to elude the fulfilment of the
contract. He trusted that the bill would he allowed to
pass the second reading without a division. In principle
be entirely agreed with the remarks of Mr. Ayrton, If it
were thought desirable to examine into the matter to which
he had called attention, there was no indisposition on the
part of the Government to initiate or to promote that
examination. They ought to wait until they appointed a
committee. He did not agree with Mr. Disraeli that no
measure had been better understood by the members of tho
house than the bill of 1858.
The bill was then read a second time, and was ordered
to be referred to a select committee.

The next sun's ray shall melt away,
The tracks on the snow where the lalso lord came.
But none shall see the day
When the cloud shall pass away,
Which that dark hour left on England's fame."

(Laughter.)
Mr. WHITE entirely concurred in the resolutions vot-
ing the thanks of the house to the gallant officers engaged
in the Chinese expedition. (Hear.)
Sir T. ELPHINSTONE said it would be ungracious on
an occasion` like this to refuse a unanimous vote of thanks
to those engaged in the Chinese campaign. (Hear.)

Lord J. RUSSELL said the hon. member for Cork
seemed to think that the services of Irishmen were over-
looked in the motion, for that many of them would appear
in the accounts of the killed and wounded. No one could
doubt of that, but the motion included all British subjects
engaged in the struggle. (Hear.) The ambuscade into
which Europeans were entrapped on their way to Pekin
was of the most barbarous character. Men who were en-
gaged for the very purpose of bringing about a peace and
assisting in concluding a treaty, were surprised and treated
in such an inhuman manner that several of them lost their
lives. Lord Elgin considered in what way he should punish
a crime of that nature, and came to the conclusion that if
he demanded the Chinese authorities to give up the subor-
dinates who actually inflicted those barbarities on the cap-
tives, the parties really guilty would escape. (Hear.) Under
these circumstances, and with the concurrence of Sir H.
Grant, Lord Elgin decided on bringing the punishment
home to the Emperor of China by the destruction of his
palace. This course was the one most likely to produce a
great moral effect, not only on the Emperor himself, but
also on his subjects. The objections of Gen. Montauban to
this course was not that the punishment should not be in-
flicted, but that it might so inepire the Chinese with terror
that the execution of the treaty might be delayed. Events,
however, proved that Lord Elgin was correct, and that
owing to the course which he pursued much more favour-
able terms were obtained from the Chinese. (Hear.)
As to the families of those who had suffered, it had never
been usual to ask for indemnity in such cases. Tho gal-
lantry and good conduct of the army and navy on the occa-
sion wore beyond all praise—(hear)—and, so far from its
being true that the articles of the treaty were not known in
the south of China, there was a despatch from the consul
at Canton stating that the treaty was published there, that
trade had commenced in accordance with the tariff, and was
proceeding most satisfactorily.
The votes were then read and agreed to seriatim.
BANKRUPTCY AND INSOLVENCY BILL.

CONSOLIDATION OF THE CRIMINAL STATUTE

LAW.

The SOLICITOR-GENERAL moved to introduce the
following bills :—Bill to consolidate and amend the statute
laws of England and Ireland relating to offences against the
person ; bill to consolidate and amend the statute law of
England and Ireland relating to malicious injuries to pro-
perty; bill to consolidate and amend the statute law of
England and Ireland relating to larceny and other similar
offences; bill to consolidate and amend the statute law of
England and Ireland relating to indictable offences by
forgery; bill to consolidate and amend the statute law of
the United Kingdom against offences relating to the coin;
bill to consolidate and amend the statute law of England
and Ireland relating to accessories to and abettors of in-
dictable offences; bill to repeal certain enactments which
have been consolidated in several acts of the present session
relating to indictable offences and other matters. Towards
the close of last session the whole of those bills had come
down from the other house; they were read a second time,
but there was not opportunity to give them due consideration.
At the same time it was intimated that the bills would be
introduced in this house early this session. The bills were
seven in number, and their general object was to consoli-
date and assimilate the statute law in England, Scotland,
and Ireland, as it bore upon crime. One of those bills was
simply a bill to repeal other acts, and another related
merely to accessories and abettors. It was not proposed to
interfere in any way with the common law. but to deal only
with that which depended on statutes. As to the propriety
of the consolidation of the statute law generally, there was
but one opinion among those who had applied their minds
to the subject, however they might differ as to the means of
effecting this object. (Hear.) To attempt to consolidate the
common law would be to enter on very debateable ground.
Reference to the titles of the five bills would show that they
had a very wide application and effected a great reform. The
bulk of our criminal law for many years had been the crea-
ture of statute. As society advanced it was necessary
to enact punishments for fresh offences. It was proposed
by these bills not merely to consolidate, but to assimilate.
The house would probably think this a wise object; at the
same time there was such differences between the two
peoples of England and Ireland and their condition, that it
was impossible to attempt general assimilation. The first
steps necessary were consolidation and assimilation in the
statute book, and nest and nearly important came expurga-
tion. Then came the operations which were necessary to
place the statute book in a satisfactory condition. Consoli-
dation then being the first step, they must proceed with it
subject by subject. The statutes relating to crime were most
conveniently consolidated, so that the house must admit
that all the steps already taken had been in the right direc-
tion. Suppose the present bills to become law, they will
form part of the system of consolidation which was com-
menced by the late Sir R. Peel. Various commissions had
been issued on the subject. The first was in 1833—nearly
30 y ears ago ; and that commission issued three reports. 111
1837 a similar commission was appointed and published four
reports ; and in 1815 there was another commission, which
published four reports also. These commissioners were to
take note of the labours of their predecessors, and in 1849

On the motion for the second reading of this bill,

Mr. ROEBUCK said the introduction of this bill had
been the occasion for the most indiscriminate eulogy of it ;
but he would raise his voice against it. They were bid
that this bill was to settle the question, but it would not do
so. The Attorney-General complained of the present sys-
tem, that it was wanting in uniformity, that it was expen-
sive, and that the difference between insolvency and bank-
ruptcy was the opprobrium of the English law bn the sub-
ject. But what had he done in the present bill ? As to
the want of uniformity, arising from there being five dif-
ferent commissioners, each able to give a different decision,
the Attorney-General forgot to inform the house that there
was an appeal to the Lords Justices in any case where the
decision of the commissioner was questioned, and he pro •
posed to meet the case by appointing a chief judge in order
to settle the differences in these courts. But what could
the new judge do that the Lords Justices could not do ? It
would be simply an additional expense without being an ad-
ditional advantage. There were causes of expenditure in
these courts on which the Attorney-General had not put his
finger, viz., the fees which did not go to the officers of the
court, but which were paid into a fund in that court. In
no one particular would this bill diminish the expenses of
the courts, and as to the difference between bankruptcy and
insolvency, the bill did not touch it at all. The bill was an
objectionable alteration of the law without being a reform
of it; on the contrary, it made it more expensive, and
would benefit no one except the attorneys.
Mr. MOFFATT supported the bill, because it would de-
crease the expense, and greatly simplify and improve the
procedure.

Mr. BOVILL said that it would have been much better
to have introduced a pleasure which at once amended and
consolidated the law. There was the bill of last session,
which was admirably adapted for the purpose, and there
was also the bill of the member for Newcastle. He should
be sorry to appear to oppose the bill, but he regretted its
introduction in its present shape. He objected to the officers
being retained at their full salaries when their offices were
about to be abolished, and the country being saddled with
an enormous expenditure. The commissioners were to be
retained, and the messengers, vho were displaced by last
year's bill, were still to be retained. Indeed, the only dif-
ference in the constitution of the Bankruptcy Court from
what it now was consisted in the appointment of an addi-
tional commissioner, at a salary of /5,000 a-year. With
respect to the official assignees, he proposed to continue

anbther commission was issued, who were also to consider
the statute law. It appeared from this that between 1833
and 1819 there were four commissions issuing four reports.
Then came the Statute Law Commission of 1854, which was
of much wider scope, namely, to consider both the statute
and the criminal law. tills prepared by this commission
were introduced in 1856 into the Honse of Lords by Lord
Cranworth, but were lost in consequence of the advanced
period of the session. The present bills had been prepared
after a careful examination of all the previous reports and
rnedsitreg. In these bills they had attempted to carry out
the principle of assimilation much further than before.
Still there was a limit to that principle beyond which it was
inexpedient to go. He now came to the year 1859, and he
might say that this not being a party measnre, or adopted
exclusively byono or the other side of the house, it had been
taken up by the Government of Lord Derby with a vicsY of
extending the principle of assimilation still further than
had beenrecommended by the commissioners of 1857. Those
bills fell through ; but since that a gentleman, a member of
this house, Mr. Whiteside, had taken up and still further
amended the bills of Sir F. Kelly. The provisions of these
bills were 'trebly the same as those he now asked leave to
introduce, but they had undergone the closest scrutiny and
examination. It now became his duty to ask leave of the
house for their introduction. He wished further to say that,
as these bills were introduced originally in the House of
Lords, infliction of the punishment of death was proposed
in three cases only—viz., those of offences against the per-
son, murder, and poisoning with intent to murder. Clauses
were afterwards introduced by which the punishment of
death was to be inflicted in three other cases—those of at-
tempting life by blowing up houses with gunpowder, by
setting fire to houses, and by setting fire to ships. These
amendments ho had retained in the present bill. Another
question to which he wished to draw attention was the
punishment of whipping. The limit fixed by the former
bills for the infliction of this punishment was the age of 18.
These clauses he had left as they stood, and it would be
competent to any hon. member to take the opinion of the
house on the matter. The course he proposed to adopt was
to transfer all the bills to a select committee. The house

would probably be of opinion that the detailed labour of
going through all these bills could be better accomplished
in a select committee than in a committee of the whole

house. After all that had been done towards preparing for
this consolidation of the law the various measures intro.
duced during the last 30 years, it might not be too much to

ask the house, when the bills should have gone through the
select committee, not indeed to take them on trust, but to
look upon them with a confident persuasion that no mate-
rial change, or at all events no injurious change, was intro-
duced by them into the law of either England or of Ireland
or into its application or mode of administration. He con-
cluded by moving for leave to bring in the bill.
Mr. WMAHON said the house would readily acquiesce
in the suggestion to refer these bills to a select committee,
in which their provisions should be carefully examined, but

he thought the inquiry ought not to be confined to these six

or seven bills which constituted but a small and insufficient
measure, that would not reduce the bulk of the statutes, or
simplify the knowledge of the criminal law. The law of
England, Ireland, and Scotland should be assimilated toge-
ther, so as to have but one system of criminal law for the
whole United Kingdom. In Scotland especially the law was
in a barbarous condition ; there was no habeas corpus act
there, though a prisoner might demand his discharge after
150 days if the public prosecutor did not bring him to trial
within that time. The judges in Scotland claimed the
power of adapting the law, at their own discretion, to meet
any new offences ; and a man might be hanged in Scotland
by the odd man in a jury of 15. Now he did not see why
we should not have a perfect code for the United Kingdom
to be called the Victoria Code, showing how, from the time
when a man was taken into custody on a charge of commit-
ting any offence, to the time of his final acquittal or pun •
ishment, our law afforded every possible security that a re-
gard for truth and justice, and for the lives and liberties of
the Queen's subjects could require. We should be as proud
of such a code as another nation of its Napoleon Code,
which had produced such important effects in Europe.
Leave was then given to bring in the bills.
PARLIAMENTARY REPRESENTATION.
(ST. ALBANS AND SUDBURY.)

Sir G. C. LEWIS, in moving for leave to bring in a
bill to assign the seats forfeited by the disfranchisement
of the boroughs of St. Albans and Sudbury, said
that the bill which he was going to bring in was not a
large measure of reform—(a laugh)—yet, as it was a bill
that dealt with four seats in that house, it was a measure
of considerable importance, and would, he was sure, receive
the deliberate attention of members of that house. The bill
was founded upon the disfranchisement of the borough of
St. Albans, which took place in 1844, and of the borough
of Sudbury, which occurred in 1852. The reason why
these seats had not been previously dealt with was, that it
was deemed not desirable to do so until a Government
measure of Reform was introduced into that house. The
house was aware that last session a bill was introduced into
that house by the Government upon the subject of Reform,
which dealt with the four seats in question. That bill,
however, not receiving the sanction of the house, fell to the
ground. As the Government had determined not to bring
in any measure of Reform this session, he thought it was
desirable that a bill should be brought in which had for its
object the disposition of the four seats thus in abeyance.
He had no doubt that, when the bill went into committee,
a great many sugge:4i-ns would be made by hon. gentle-
men, recommending a different disposition of the seats
from that which the Government intended to propose ; but
ho had no doubt that the proposal of the Government
would be better than any that could be suggested. Of the
four vacant scats, he proposed to give two of them to
counties, as was proposed is the bill of last session—one
to the West Riding of Yorkshire and one to South Lan-
cashire. The population of the 'West Riding of York-
shire, unrepresented, amounted to 1,315,891 persons, and
that of South Lancashire to 1,507,000 persons. Ho pro-
posed that Chelsea and Kensington should be united
into one borough, and that they should have one seat
given to them. (Hear, hear.) To that proposition many
gentlemen would perhaps entertain objections. (Hear,
hear, from the Opposition.) Supposing that the metro-
polis had at present a sufficient number of members--
(hear, hear)—and that it was already sufficiently and
efficiently represented—(hear, hear)—they would pro-
bably say that the house ought to give the disposable seats
to some rural borough. (Hear, hear, from the Opposition.)
Well, that was a matter which was open for the considera-
tion of the house in committee, and the opinion of the house
might in that stage be taken upon the subject. (Hear, hear,
from the Ministerial benches.) .Nevertheless, he would be
prepared to recommend the arrangement which he now pro.
posed. The parish of Chelsea at the last census contained
a population of 56,558, and the parish of Kensington at
that time contained a population of 44,053. Both these
parishes had since very much increased in their population.
But it might be said that it could be proved, although
Chelsea and Kensington taken together form a large popu-
lation, London, of which they formed part, had already suf-
ficient members, and those parishes were already sufficiently
represented. Now let them see what was the population of
London at the present time. He had put himself in com-
munication with the Registrar-General, and supposing the
population to have increased in the same ratio within the
last ten years that it had in the ten years preceding, it
would be now 2,861,000. According to the last census the
entire population of Scotland was only 2,862,000, which
was rather less than what was now the statement of the
population of London. (Hear, hear.) Therefore, whether
they looked at the population of those two parishes taken
alone, or whether they looked at the population of the me-
tropolis, it was quite clear to his mind that they were en-
titled to a seat. (Hear, hear.) He therefore proposed to
give them one, and he proposed to give the other disposable
seat to the town of Birkenhead. It was not, on the one
hand, like Birmingham or Manchester, or other places he
might name, a great manufacturing district; but it was,
on the other hand, a place of great commercial and trading
enterprise. At the last census‘its population was 24,210,
but it had considerably increased since that time. That
was the population at the last census. It might be
said by those who took a different view on the subject,
that, " If you disfranchise St. Albans, you ought to assign
the vacant seats in the rural districts." (Hear, hear, from
the country gentlemen on the Opposition benches.) But
what were the populations of some of the towns ? Birken-
head had 24,000, Staleybridge 20,000, Burnley 20,000, and
Gravesend 16,000. That would be the principle upon which
some would lay down that the representation ought to be
given; but he could not help thinking that the recommen-
dation.which ho laid before the house was the preferable
one. These were the views of the Government, and he
hoped they would meet with the fair and reasonable consi-
deration to which they were entitled. (Hear.)
Mr. BENTINCK did not wish, at that late hour, to go
at any length into this question. But the right hon. baronet
had told them that the Government view of the subject was
most important. Now, ho (Mr. Bentinck) confessed that,
after having listened most attentively to the right hon. ba-
ronet, he was totally at a loss to understand the principles
upon which he proposed to dispose of the vacant seats. If
he understood the right hon. gentleman rightly, he based
his argument upon figures ; but he seemed to have totally
lost sight of the real merits of the case. Let them look at
the question, as one of figures, upon which he understood
the right hon. baronet to rest it. Now, he would undertake
to show the right hon. gentleman and the house, if he un-
dertook to rest his ease upon figures, that every disposable
seat—even if there were 130 or 140 disposable seats—ought
to be given to the rural counties in England. (Hear, hear,
from tins Opposition, and cries of " Oh, oh," from the Mi-
nisterial side of the house.) Hon. gentlemen might laugh
and cry " Oh," but he would undertake to prove what he
had just recommended, and he maintained that if they wore
to take figures as the standard to go by, and to calculate
upon, every disposable seat should be given to the rural
counties. He believed it was unnecessary for him to refer to
the right hon. baronet, who so ably distinguished himself in
finance, to prove to him that taxation and representation,
to which the right hon. baronet had referred, were con-
vertible terms. As a matter of perfect justice in a case
referring to the representation of the country, and in a
matter of figures, they were bound to deal with this ques-
tion in a spirit of perfect justice. The right hon. baronet
had given no sound reason for the course which he pro-
posed ; but ho (Mr. Bentinek) would ask the house to try
the question fairly, and not to deal with it upon the Pria.

ciples laid down by the right hon. gentleman. He must 'Now, ,v© certainly did not expect that any proposal we
enter his protest against the manner in which the Govern- might n take for the di
,t by an an is ,
g cribution of these four seats would
ment treated this question. It seemed to be assumed, when not be m, finite number of counter proposals.
the redistribution of seats was considered, that the country These four aged to English boroughs, and the
• seats bolo.
was nothing and the large towns everything. He had no natural arra asgement appears to be that they should be al-
objection to our commercial emporiums having their fair lotted to four ' Enali ,h constituencies. But we did not dis-
share of the representation, but he objected to their having guise from ou NOW a that the momentwe madethat proposal
a monopoly. we should have son le lien. gentleman from Scotland rising
Mr. STIRLING wished to urge upon the house the to say that the y out 7ht to be given to Scotland; and that
pesii ion of a constituency which he thought had peculiar members from Irela. ad would claim them for Ireland. We
claims to consideration. He meant the Universities of knew that we . dtould have, as we probably shall have, vari-
Scotland. The Universities of Oxford, Cambridge, and ous gentlemen . proposing a different arrangement for Eng-
Dublin were represented, while the Scottish Universities land. We kr .eve that what ever proposals we might make
did not possess that privilege. A few years ago it might counter prop mats would be urged against them. But lam
have been said that they did not possess a university con- myself oft he opinion that alien the house comes to consider
stituency, but three years ago the late Government had our plan, an id those counter proposals in committee, it will
remedied that defect, and introduced reforms which had debris that ti le arrangement made is as fair as any that can
proved, and would continue to prove a great boon to that be Reoposed agaii Ist it. It is quite true, that mere num-
country under the operation of the Scottish Universities bers ought n'pt to be the principle on which the representa.
Act. Though it had come into full play within the last fen of• this co.unti .e• is founded. The House of Commons
few months, they had now an .aggregate university consti- is the tgr eat legish Lave machine of the nation, and ought to
tueucy in Scotland of 3,301, a nueaber which was daily in- represent, not its . numbers alone, but all its various into •
creasing. The constituency of the University of Cambridge rests—(heaC, hear.) ; all its different intelligence, and all
was 4,5C6, that of the University of o.'ford 3,623, and that those elemenal that are essential to the proper action of the
of Dublin 1,780. The Scottish Universities therefore had great assembly; that is to direct its general policy and desti-
already a constituency about twice as large as Dublin, nies. (Hear, hear.) Well, I think the manner in which
nearly as large as Oxford, and he had not doubt it would we propeee to distribute these four seats is founded on that
be soon equal to the constituency of Cambridge. One of principle. The two plat ics disfranchised are comparatively
the great questions considered last year in connexion with small boroughs ; but we •do not propose to give these seats
the Reform Bill was how to give the intelligence of' the to two other comparatively small towns; we propose to
country a larger share in the representation without basing give two of them to two great counties, in which there are
the qualification on property to the extent hitherto done, both agricultural and -manufacturing interests—interests
By granting representation to the Scottish universities they that ought to have their t pinions represented in this house.
would to some extent enter upon a solution of that problem. We give ance'her member to a place of a different character
They would give the franchise to a number of educated —a large and Crowing seep art town, with interests different
young men, who would highly value the privilege, and who to those of the counties. The fourth seat we propose to
for some years might not possess the property qualification• give to a new bo.aough to be created out of a very increasing
They were at the same time net confined to any one class of and thriving part of the met,eopolis. Perhaps that which
the community, but fairly drawn from all classes. Ire in some degree excited the zees' and energy of the member
hoped the right hon. gentleman would give time to the for the Tower Hamlets against some hon. members who
public to consider this question in all its bearings, and the preceded him may have been the sounds—not articulate—
public Press the opportunity for fair comment ; and he that indicated an objection to any addition to the number
begged to state that, if no one else brought forward the of the metropelitam members. (Laul'hter.) That naturally
subject, he should feel it to be his duty to give the house excited some degree of warmth on the part of the hon. and
an opportunity of voting upon the propriety of the sugges- learned member for the Tower Hamlets. I think, how-
tion he had made. ever, that Kenning ton and Chelsea are very fit places to be
Mr. MAGUIRE complained that though the Govern- erected into boroughs. They include inte.rests that deserves
meat, in the bill of last year, gave two members to Scot- to be represented in this house, and Ido tea concur with
land and two to Ireland, they had now changed their mind those who think the proposal inexpedient because it will
and taken no notice of either. If the hon. member brought be an addition to the metropolitan members. (Hear.) I
forward a proposal in behalf of Scotland he should willingly feel a great respect for those members, and pay nu regard
support it. But he asked the right hon. gentleman why he to tla,e opinion that has excited the indignation of the hon.
threw Dublin and the county of Cork overboard, both of and learned gentleman. (Hear, hear.) Ido not intend to-
which were to have had an additional member by the bill of go furtha'r into this subject at present ; I think no case can
last year. The population of Cork was 600,000, that of be made jr an addition to the members of Scotland and
Dublin nearly 300,000 ; they were, if anything, larger than Ireland. We are dealingwithfourseats that belong to Eng-
they were last year, and he was at a loss to know on what land,that were forfeited in consequence of corruption. Wei
ground the right hon. gentleman and the Government had had to look round Vingland to find how we could best dispose,
changed their opinion and given the four members to two of them for the pubL*c advantage. We have disposed of them.
English boroughs and two English counties. He saw no by giving them to tal great a variety of interests as could be•
pressing reason for an addition to the number of metropoli- consulted in that small number of seats ; and when the
tan members. They were the most able—(a laugh)—the house comes to consider the plan, I think it will be of
most active—(hear, hear)—the most persevering, and the opinion that it is as reastanable as any proposal that can be
moat vigilant members in the house. (Hear, hear.) They set against it. (Cheers.)
possessed a fair share of eloquence and wisdom—(a laugh) Mr. KNIGHTLEY said the hon. member for the Tower
—and, in his opinion, the Government would have done Hamlets appeared to taunt the hon. member for West Nor-
better to adhere to its proposal of last year. Why should folk (Mr. Bentinek) with .having changed his opinion. The
Ireland have the cup which they had raised to her lip hon. and learned member must have been remiss in his,
dashed down in this manner ? Why should her hopes be attendance in the house. He had had the pleasure of hear-
balked ? ing the hon. member for West Norfolk speak often on this
Mr. AYRTON said that he should have been well con-
question, and he had always. heard him use the same argu-
tent to allow this miserable abortion of a bill to fall tale meats. The hon. gentleman denies that my hon. friend
born on the table of the house without a word but for ale made out a case for the counties. He was unwilling to go
observations of the hon. member for Norfolk. If they had into figures, but ho had an extract from the Census of 1857
great cause for dissatisfaction in the abandonment of reform :hat was very short, and he would read it. It showed that
on the part of the Government, they had cause for satin- the' representation of England and Wales under the Reform
faction that the hon. member for Norfolk entertained such Act was based on estimates of wealth and population, which
sound views on that question. He (Mr. Ayrton) had great gave to the counties property of the annual value of
hopes of gentlemen on the other side of the house. They £60,564288 ; inhabited houses, 2,053,998 ; population,
had become so enlightened that they might expect to obtain 10,495,930; the number of county members was 159. Its
from them what had been denied by the hollow friends of the boroughs and cities the annual value of property wag
Parliamentary Reform. It was delightful to hear the £42,898,217; the inhabited houses, 1,383,300; end the
hon. member for Norfolk say that representation and taxa- population, 7,431,679 ; the number of borough members was
tion should go together. The question was, what confi- 337. (Hear, hear.) We have never wished to maintain
dence this assertion would give to those who paid half the the present state of the county franchise; we have always
taxation, but were denied any voting power ? He was do- wished to place the county and borough franchise on as
lighted to hear the hon. member for Norfolk say that if equality in every rotated. (Cheers from the Opposition.)
justice were done in the redistribution of seats that at least That was what the late Government proposed to do.
100 seats should have to be given to the 'counties at the (Cheers.) They proposed to put the counties and the
expense of the boroughs. He admitted the truth of that boroughs on the same footing. But what did you do ?
observation. But what was justice ? If they proceeded (Renewed Opposition cheers.) You supported the resolu.-
upon numbers as the basis of representation, the counties tion of the noble member for the city of London (Lord J.
could not send members to the House of Commons until Russell), and refused to put them on the same footing.
the county representation was based on numbers. When (Cheers.) You destroyed the bill of the late Government,
the hon. member came down to the house with a Reform and now a very nice little Reform Bill you have got instead
Bill giving a vote to the adult millions living in the coma- of it. (Cheers from the Opposition.) We have always
ties beyond the limits of the boroughs he must he the last been ready to give a far lower franchise than the present,
to deny the right of representation to the counties. But if you would consent to place counties and boroughs on a
where was the Conservative who proposed to give that perfect equality. (Cheers.)
right to counties ?At present the franchise was enjoyed Sir G. LEWIS, in reply, said—There are some members
in counties by two or three thousand, while the adult in this house whose notions of Parliamentary reform are so
males might be counted by hundreds of thousands. He giga,sitic and colossal that any measure proposed to them is
ventured to say that if that principle were established the called a pitiful abortion. (Hear, hear.) The Reform Bill
hon. member for Norfolk would be able to overthrow a of last year was called a " pitiful abortion"—(laughter)--
large amount of political intrigue. (Hear, hear, from Mr. though Low it is termed revolutionary and destructive.
Bentinek.) The hon. member said Hear, hear,,, but The hon. n,-ember for the Tower Hamlets has thought fit
where was the bill ? (Laughter.) Why had not the Conser- to denominat.o the present bill a " miserable abortion," and
vative Government framed a bill in accordance with the seems to think I have been reduced to some kind of servile
wishes expressed by the hon. member on the present occa- duty in having' laid the measure before the house. Now,
sion ? Had they done so they would have immortalised the bill is ono that disposes of four seats at present vacant,
themselves, and would have received the support, not only and that are warL'ing to the integrity of the number of this
of a largo majority in that house, but of the nation at house. In 1853 the right hon. member for Bucks proposed
large, and would have come triumphantly out of the a measure precisely shelter to this " miserable abortion."
struggle. It was certainly gratifying to the metropolitan He asked leave to intros Luce a bill assigning the four vacant
members to be told that they were so singularly efficient, seats to the West Riding' of Yorkshire and the southern
but he objected to be improved out of his own estate. division of Lancashire, twa. to each. The plan was dis-
(Laughter.) He did not admit they were so efficient; at cussed, but on .a division way rejected—not on the ground
all events they had not that power of numbers which, un- that it vi as a " pitiful" measure, but because it was thought
fortunately, when questions of right were before the house, the Government vas not in a condition then to make any
prevailed far more than eloquence or advocacy on the part important proposition. There are two notices on the votes
of members. He did not admit the doctrine of numbers by which it is proposed to assign two of these seats to par-
being the basis of representation, and he regretted to find a titular places. It is possible that if the Government were
Minister of the Craven proposing a measure entirely on not to interpose there would be other motions on the sub-
that ground, for he did not consider it a fair or states- ject, as it is known that it is not the intention of the Go-
manlike mode of dealing with the question. If that dee- yam-tient to bring forward any general measure this see-
trine were affirmed the whole of the four seats ought to go sion. The consequence would be great confusion and
to Ireland ; but the constitution of the House of Commons inconvenience, and I hope therefore that the house will
had been settled on a different principle—one which was approve the course which we have taken as the most con-
well investigated at the time of the Union, and no addi- venient mode of dealing witl.e the question. (Hear.)
tional light could now be thrown upon it. He warned Irish Leave was then given to bring in the bill, which Was
members in their own interest not to attempt to disturb it. afterwards brought up and read a first time.
The boroughs included in the right hon. gentleman's pro- The house then adjourned athaff-past 12 o'clock.
gramme were two of the largest unenfranchised consti-
tuencies existing, and therefore had the first claim to repre-
sentation. He expressed no opinion upon the details of
the measure, but he for one protested against the attempt
of the Government to escape from the performance of their
great duty by presenting to the house this most trumpery
bill. If such a part were to be played as the representation
of this ridiculus mus of the great mountain of Reform, then
there was but one person qualified for the performance, and
that was the noble lord the member for the city of London.
It was evident that the Government had taken advantage
of the known good nature of the right hon. gentleman to do
the public work, and had imposed on him, he would not
say service, but this very ridiculous performance. The
right hon, gentleman always did his work well whatever it
might be—(hear, hear)—but he (Mr. Ayrton) hoped that
the house would not allow him to be made a convenience
of on the present occasion. (Cheers and laughter.) Ho
also hoped that the Liberal party would hold the Go-
vernment to the fulfilment of its duty, and not allow
them to escape from it by such a contrivance as this.
(Hear, hear.) They had taken office for one great purpose
and that purpose they were bound to carry out and it was
their duty to fulfil. They had confederated to displace a
former Government—(hear, hear)—and had succeeded,
because men thought that that Government would not ful-
fil conscientiously their duty. They had put that forward
as a ground on which they invited the Sovereign to change
her Ministers. Nay, more, they might be said to have
forced themselves on their Sovereign, usurping her great
prerogative, and in doing that they had been buoyed up by
the popular sympathy, accorded to them because they were
supposed to enter office in the performance of that duty;
but now that they had obtained office they seek to escape
under the hollow pretence that a bill full of deformities and
defects which they brought forward was subject to criticism,
and thus they availed themselves of its badness to be ab-
solved from their obligation and the performance of their
duty (Hear, hear.) Therefore, there never was such a
contrivance as this. The Government must learn that, as
every election takes place they would lose character and
credit in the country, and that if they did not face this
question manfully, they will sink step by step until they
slip out of office objects of universal contempt and scorn.
(Cheers.)
Lord PALMERSTON—Sir, we shall not be at all
swayed, as I can assure the hon. gentleman ; we are not at
all daunted by the magnificent philippic which he has just
delivered. (Hear.) It may be well for the hon. member
to misrepresent the conduct of the Government. But wo
do not propose this as the substitute for a general measure
of Reform. We stated, I think sufficiently, the reasons
why we do not think it our duty in this session to bring in
what is called a groat and comprehensive measure of
Reform. (Hear.) Those, I think, who remember the
course adopted last year by gentlemen on this side
of the house—(hear, hear, and laughter from the
Opposition)-.-as well as by those who sit opposite, can
never feel in their hearts, whatever they may
assume to feel, that the Government ought this session to
have called on the house to spend so many hours as were
spent last year, not in discussing, but in evading and shelv-
ing that measure—(cheers)—which was shelved as much
by the professed friends of reform as by its opponents.
(Laughter and cheers.) I therefore repudiate the whole of
the insinuti ins of the hon. and learned gentleman as totally
unfounded, and as in no degree affecting the standing and
character of her Majesty's Government. (Cheers.) "W e
have, upon mature deliberation, come to the conviction that
it would not have been for the public advantage far us to
have called upon Parliament in the present session to renew
any long discussions on a comprehensive measure of reform.
But we did think it our duty not to permit these four seats
to remain vacant any longer. The reason no arrangement
was proposed before is, thatfrom year to year it was thought
they might be included iii 'owe large and general ractistuv,

COUNTRY MARLYETS.

BIRMINGHAM—JAN. 14.
At this day's market there was sn increased supply of
wheat, and all qualities were firmly held for the currency
of this day se'nnight. Barley raVier cheaper. Oats unal-
tered. Beans quite as dear. Peas only find buyers in
limited parcels.

MANCIIESTER—PEn. 14.
The trade is rather inactive, without material change in
the value of any article. With the exception of flour, of
which the arrivals are to a fair extent, the imports from
abroad at Liverpool and Runcorn are on a much smaller
ream than of late. Our market this morning was thinly
attended, and was of an exceedingly inactive character.
Holders, however, were firm in requiring the currency of
this day week for all articles, which was realised in the
limited business transacted.