The Sun.
London, England, 1859-03-22 00:00:00

relations. (Hear hear.) It is for the Ministers of the Crown
if we come to a vote adverse to their measure, to take the
course which they maythink most advisable. If thcy :should
think proper to recommend the Crown to dissolve Parlia-
ment, in order to subMit this question to the people at large,
I for one should not be afraid of that appeal. (Cheers.) Let
them hold this bill up on every hustings in England, and
await the response which will be made: (Hear, hear.) But
if agitation should thereby be increased—if a general chic-
tion should give rise to demands which now have not beek

thought of by popular bodies, upon the Government and
not upon us will rest theresponsibility. (Cheers.) As to the
danger of a foreign wor, I see with surprise in print and
elsewhere that the presence of Lord Malmesbury at the Fo-
reign-office is a security for peace. (Laughter.) Now, I
have never behaved unfairly towards Lord Malmesbury,
and when he took office last year, and on a former occasion,
I was disposed to look with favour on many of his proceed-
ings. I leave differed as to his conduct recently respecting
Portugal ; still, making no charge against Lord Malmes-
bury, when I hear that his presence at the Foreign-office is
a security for peace I wonder who will be the dupes of any
such assertion. (Hear, and a laugh.) Well, then, when
no arguments can be advanced to overthrow the reasons
given by the two right hon.. gentlemen who have seceded
from office, and the reasons given over and over again at
public meeting's against the proposals in this bill, it is said
as a last resource that I must have some party or personal
object in view--(Ministerial cries of "Hear," and counter
cheers)—and that accusation comes amongst others from a
person from whom I should have expected more charity, if
not more candour. (Hear, hear.) But, Sir, it is my duty
not to attend to such charges, but to pursue the course
which I think best adapted for the welfare of the country.
(Hear, hear.) It cannot be denied that for many years I
have taken a deep interest in this question. (Hear, hear.)
Very long ago—so long ago, lam sorry to say, as the year
1819—I was occupied in this house in a laborious and irk-
some investigation into the bribery and corruption which
prevailed in the borough of Grampound, with the view of
disfranchising that borough and of conferring members on
Leeds, which at that time had no representation, and I ven-
tured even to propose that the £lO householders of Leeds
should be entitled to votes, a proposition which, as ray hon.
friend the member for Birmingham reminds me, excited
great alarm at that time, as much alarm as is now created
by the proposal to give the franchise to householders below
£lO. From that time to the present I have constantly taken
the deepest interest in this question, and have promoted all
measures which 3 thought tended to the free, fair, and pure
representation of the people in Parliament. (Hear, hear.) I
am bound to take that course—l may be allowed, I may be
privileged to do so by my deep convictions on the subject. I
have the satisfaction of knowing that the act in the passing
of which I took part in 1831 and 1832 has been productive,
not of those calamitous consequences which were predicted
by our opponents, but of great benefits--benefits obtained
not through bloodshed, not through civil war, but by peace-
able and tranquil discussion, and by the legitimate influence
of public opinion. (Hear.) Since that time slavery has
been abolished; we have had the question of tithes, Nv hich
was a vexatious question between the clergy and their pa..
rishioners, amicably arranged ; we have had free Munici-
pal corporations established; there has been a great reduc-
tion in the duties on Customs and in those Excise duties
which pressed heavily on the masses ; Protection has been
given up, and Free Trade sanctioned by Parliament. These
and many other benefits have flowed from the reformed
Parliament, which we were told would be so fruitful in
calamity and disaster, and which was to take the crown off
the King's head and shake the balance of the State: (Hear,
hear.) Sir, entertaining these convictions, seeing what has
been done, I cannot view without alarm the proposition
which is now before the house. I have endeavoured to call
the attention of the house to two of the main demerits of
this bill. If it should continue on the table of the house,

the measure ought to be discussed in every shape until at
length, if not immediately, it is totally rejected. (Hear,
hear.) I shall take this course, careless of any imputations
which may be cast upon me. (Cheers) With regard to
this great question of reform, I may ray that I defended it
when I was young, and I will not desert it now that I am
old. (Loud cheers.)
Lord STANLEY, who was loudly cheered on rising,
said—ln the month of April, 1835, a resolution was moved
by a noble lord, then and now a distinguished member of
this hou'se, t., the effect " That no settlement of the Irish
tithe question would be satisfactory that did not appropriate
to the purposes of general education any surplus which may
remain after providing for the wants of the Irish church."
(Cheers.) That resolution was brought forward with the
view of defeating a measure about to be introduced by the
Government of the day. It succeeded in its object. It
drove the Government from office. It placed the mover
and his political friends in the possession of power,
and, having served that purpose, the principle which
had been so triumphantly asserted by a majority of the

House of Commons was suffered at once to fall into abey-
ance. (Cheers, and cries of " No, no.") It never was
affirmed, and although nearly a quarter of a century has
since elapsed no practical action whatsoever has followed
upon its adoption. (Cheers.) Now, sir, I do not allude
to this historic incident of which the noble lord the member
for the City of London was the hero—(hear, hear)—with the
view of throwing any discredit upon him. He acted, I
have no doubt—as statesmen in this country generally
act —in con.forrnity with the political exigenciea of
the day, and I refer to the circumstance which I
have just mentioned, because I am da3irous of cautianinz
the members of this house—and, above all, the liberal
members—that to reject a moderate measure of reform does
not necessarily insure the passing of one of a more ex-
tended character. (Cheers.) It is well to remember that in
politics a lost opportunity does not always recur—(cheers)
—and although those whose sole object is the triumph of a.
party may be, anxious to see this bill thrown out, without
even considering what the result, so far as reform is con-
cerned, may be, yelndependent and moderate men, in
whatever part of the house they may sit, will, I feel per-
suaded, think twice before they reject an opportunity of
dealing with this great question, inure favourable in many
respects than any which hereafter is likely to be afforded.
(Cheers.) There has, I believe, never been a time when
within the House of Commons great public questions were
discussed with less acrimony, and with less regard to per-
sonal and party interests than has for the last few
years been the case. (Hear, hear.) There never was a
period when the extreme views of political parties were
more strongly discountenanced than at present. Europe
is at peace. No other great question besides that of reform
forces itself upon the attention of Parliament. There is
little distress in the country, and no discontent. These aie
all circumstances which, in my opinion, this house would
do well seriously to consider before it decides upon sanc-
tioning a resolution which, if carried, will lead to thisprac-
tical result, that no legislation on the subject of reform
can take place during the present session. (Hear, hear.)
In saying this, I am well aware that there may be those
who do not desire to see this question settled, who think
the time is not ripe for large changes, and who despise
all changes which are not large. They know that in
the present temper of Parliament and of the country whit
is called a large measure of reform could not pass, and they
are not inclined to accept any measure which does not
meet their views in that respect. [At this point in the
noble lord's speech some interruption was caused and some
laughter excited by the circumstancq that the cry of
a child (understood to be Lord John's son) was heard
to proceed from the ladies' gallery. The interruption
lasted, however, but for a few moments, and the noble
lord continued.] To such politicians as those to whore I
was alluding there is nothing more distasteful than the
fact that every political party stands pledged to reform.
They know that popular passions can be roused only by
decided opposition to popular demands, and they do not like
concession, because in it they see security against agitation.
(Hear.) That, however, is nut a Conservative policy—
(cheers)—nor do I believe it can be described as a liberal
policy in the true sense of that word, while it is likely to
prove, if successful, fraught with danger to the public
peace. If it fails—as, in the present temper of public
opinion, will probably be the case—it can only had to an
indefinite postponement of an important question of politi-
cal improvement, and to a waste of the public time. (Hear,
hear.) I cannot, under these circumstances, think the prin-
ciple which it involves is one to which this house is
likely to give its assent. I assume, indeed, that it is
the general feeling and wish of the house that some
measure of reform should, during the present session, be
passed into a law. The noble lord who has 'just spoken, it
is true, has asked—although I must say he merely adverted
to the subject in passine•—whatbusiness thepresent Ministry
have to bring in a Reform Bill. The answer to that ques-
tion is the plain and the obvious one that if it be a political
necessity that such a measure should be passed--if it be for
the interests of the country that it should be no longer
postponed—then it becomes the duty of those who happen
for the time being to be charged with the conduct of the
Administration not to shrink from introducing and doing
their utmost to pass such a measure. (Hear.) And, apart
from that consideration, I say that if we find any class which
is excluded from the franchise, which is in consequence dis-
satisfied, and which we think may wisely and safely be en-
trusted with it, the admission of such a class to its exercise is
not only a wise but a Conservative policy in the best and truest
sense of the word. (Cheers.) But we are asked if it be pos-
sible that those who are now charged with the duty of con-
ducting the Government of the country are sincere in their
endeavours to effect a settlement of this question? My reply
is, that I know of nothing in their antecedents which could
justifytho impression that the contrary is the case. (Cheers.)
I appeal in support of that view not to professions, but to
acts. Eight years have elapsed since this subject was
brought under the notice of Parliament subsequent to 1832.
In the year 18.51 a reform bill was framed. In 1852 it was
brought into this house, and immediately afterwards disap-
peared altogether. (Hear, hear.) In 1854 the same course.
was adopted, and with the same result. It is only under the
auspices of the present Government, therefore, after eight
years of promises premeditately made and evaded that an
issue upon this great question is about to be taken, and that
you aro asked to give a vote on the second reading of a Re-
form Bill. (Cheers.) Ido not think it necessary to deal
with the charges of inconsistency and insincerity by which
our efforts in this direction are assailed. [Lord J. Russell
was understood to intimate that he had made no such
charges.] I have heard them from other quarters, and it is
difficult, in dealing with topics of this nature, to refrain
from alluding to objections which have been urged against
the passing of the present measure, although they may not
j have been put forward in the speech to which we have ust
listened. But what the noble lord did say was, that the Go-
vernment were in a minority in this house, and were there-
fore not in a position to deal with a question of this import-
ance. (Hear, hear.) Now, it seems to me to be a very difficult
thing indeed to know what at the present clay is meant by
saying that a Government has not a majority in this house.
(Cheers.) The state of things which has prevailed during the
last few years has tended—and I do not complain that it is so—
to cause Government in this countryto rely less and less upon
pledged and unqualified supporters, and more -and more
upon the Character of the measures which they bring for-
ward. (Cheers.) The political features of our day, there-
' - fare satisfactorily dispose, in my opinion, of the doctrine
• that the present Ministry have no right to deal with this
question of reform. (Hear, hear.) Well, that being so,
what, let me ask, are the objections which the noble lord
and others urge against the bill? The principal.objections
urged against the bill are that it excludes the working
classes from its operation, inasmuch as it retains the
borough franchise at £lO ; that it does not deal compre-
hensively with the case of the small boroughs, that it re-
stores outvoters in boroughs, by doing away with the obli-
gation to reside ; and that it establishes identity of fran-
chise in town and country by transferring prospectively the
freeholders in boroughs to the borough from the county.
But before entering on these questions I must remark on
the manner in which the opposition of the noble lord to
this bill is conducted. The object of the resolution is ob-
viously to prevent the house from expressing an opinion as