The Sun.
London, England, 1857-01-06 00:00:00

To-day being fixed for the further investigation of
the charges against Mr. Surr Edward Pack Barber, the
secretary to this institution, the defendant appeared
before Sir R. W. Carden and Alderman Humphrey, at
Guildhall. There were four separate charges of obtain-
ing under false pretences one barrel of porter of Messrs.
Manners and Wells, one sack of flour of Messrs. Pons-
ford and Co., of the City Flour Mills ; one barrel of
porter of Messrs. Hoare and Co., and one barrel of
biscuits of Messrs. Huntley and Palmer, of Reading,
with intent to defraud those firms.
Mr. Sleigh, instructed by Mr. Buchanan, appeared
for the prosecution, and Mr. Joyce appeared for the
defence.
It will be recollected that the proceedings of the last
examination terminated with a speech from Mr. Joyce,
on the part of the defence, in which he said he should be
able to show that the case against Mr. Barber was one
of the most flimsy character. To-day the learned gen-
tleman commenced the investigation by detailing the
nature of the evidenc'e he intended to call.
The first witness called was Mr. Charles Horsley,
of Staple-inn, who said—l am attorney for Mr. Barber.
I have known him for about two years. lam a sub-
scriber to this institution. After the place had been
opened I became a subscriber. I have visited the in-
stitution. The arrangements were quite to my satis-
faction. In consequence of some difficulty in getting
evidence in this case, I visited the institution on the
28th Dec. last, yesterday week. Mr. Barber, his wife,
and brother, were present. I went with them on to
the platform in the middle of the dining hall. The
place was then filled with destitute poor old women.
Mr. Barber asked if any persons were there who
bad received the Christmas dinner and beer of
1855. He desired those who were there (if any) to
stand up. A number rose simultaneously. Mr. Barber
spoke to several of them, and my attention was called
by him to the girls Ayres and Daly, who were sitting
close to my left hand. Upon something which had
passed, and which I did not know, I was asked by Mr.
Barber to speak to them. Daly was sitting next to
Ayres. Ayres said she bad-had her dinner and beer on
a Christmas-day, 1855. Daly said the same, and, she
added, it was given to them out of yellow mugs. I then
desired them to wait till all the women had left the inmti-
tution who had not received beer. They did so. Subse-
quently I spoke to several other females up stairs.
Mr. Sleigh, who was absent when the case commenced.
at this point entered the Court, and the evidence that
had been taken was read over. Mr. Sleigh otj.!cted to
that part of Mr. Horsley's evidence respecting two wo-
men being received.
Sir R. Carden said that a serious charge had been
made by witnesses on a former occasion, and this evidence
was to contradict that statement.
Mr. Martin read the words of the statute.
Mr. Sleigh still objected to the reception of the evi-
dence.

Sir R. Carden said a licence ought to be given in this
case, as a very serious charge had been made. His ob-
ject was to have a full and impartial inquiry.
Mr. Joyce maintained that he bad a right to offer thep
evidence.

At length it was agreed that the evidence should be
read. At the termination of the reading of the evidence,
Mr. Horsley proceeded as follows :—Mr. Barber went
upstairs with me. In consequence of certain reasons
I determined not to make any further examination then,
but I went again to the institution yesterday at three
o'clock, and on being told that the girl Ayres was there
I saw her. She said—
Mr. Sleigh objected to this mode of proceeding. Here
is a statement about to be made in contradiction to what
she bad stated when she was examined for the prosecu-
tion. The girl had been abducted by the Barber party.
Mr. Martin said if the staterent related to the matter
in issue the statement could be read.
It was flaally arranged that Ayres's statement should
be described by the witness 3. Mr. Horsley said it
stated she wad in Farringdon-market on Monday, the
to.h inA., after she had slept at Playhouse-yard. She
there met, two girls named Gunn and Bailey, They
asked if they would go to Mrs. Barber and beg her
pardon for having taken the false eatli about
the half-crown and pair of baot4. She said
she would as she was led into it by a man named
" floppie" Pettit. It was mere!y through the induce-
ment of Pettit and Daly that she had swore that slie had
offered to her half-a-crown and a pair of boots, She
said Elie❑ Daly said she had had beer, but fho meant to
swear she had not. That Pettir, aud Bailey both said
to her it was better to have hall-a-crown a day every
time they went up for Mr. Potter, than to give evidence
fer Mr. Barber. The statement concluded with the
assertion that it was in consequence of the persuasion of
these two partie3 that she had told Mr. Potter what she
had done.
Mr. Sleigh (to Mr. Horsley)—Have you teen Ellen
Daly.

Mr. Horsley—No.
Mr. Sleigh here made an application t 3 the magistrate
to order au of tleer ut the court to see if Ayres w:►a in
the vicinity of the court, and that she did not leave with-
out permission.
The girl was brought in, and ordered not to leave
without leave.
Mr. Sleigh (to Mr. Horsley) —You are a member of
the finance committee ?
Mr. Tiorsley—Yes.
Mr. Sleigh— What was Mr. Barber ?
Mr. Horsley—He wag the director under the com-
mittee of managers. He way not the manager of the
society. It was his duty t.) take charge of the stores so
far as they were under his control, but the flour and
biscuits were under the control of the matron. Such
articles were always taken to the matron's room and
locked up.
Mr. Sleigh —Was the duties of Mr. Barber laid down
in any book ?
Mr. Horsley—l believe so. I was never present at
any meeting at which he was re-elected or re-appointed,
.1 do not know anything of his original appointment.
Mr. Sleigh—Have you the book of the institution in
Court
Mr. Joyce—The book is here. You can see it, but
it is not intended to put it in evidence.
Mr. Sleigh took the book, and was about to show it
to his client, when it was objected to his seeing it.
Mr. Joyce—l do not object to your seeing it, but I
object to its being examined by your client.
Mr. Sleigh returned the book, and said he did not
wonder that the books were objected to be examined.
The learned counsel was about to examine the witness
relative to the action for slander which was pending,
when

Mr. Young objected, and
Mr. Horsley said, with great emphasis, " I decline to
answer anything which is not strictly evidence."
Mr. Sleigh—Oh, tbat comes well from a member of
the finance committee of this philanthropic institution.
(Laughter.)
The witness wag further examined at great length
upon the way in which the examination of the girls
alluded to was taken down, but nothing material was
elicited.
Sir R. Carden—Was there any regular financial re-
port made to the committee ?
Mr. Horsley—None has been issued this year.
Sir R. Carden—Have you ever seen a financial report ?
Mr. Horsley—I have seen one in manuscript, but I
never saw one printed. I have only been connected
with the institution for about a year.
Sir R. Carden—Do you know whether Mr. Barber
has received his yearly salary ?
Mr. Horsley—Nu.
Sir R. Carden—As one of the Finance Committee,
yoavught to know.

Mr. Horsley—l believe the institution is deeply in
debt to Mr. Barber.

The witness then stood down.
Mr. Sleigh said the girl to which Mr. Joyce had alluded
to, viz , Daly, was now in court, and he proposed that
the worthy alderman should re-eeamine the girl, without
either himself or Mr. Joyce interforieg, but it was ar-
ranged that this course should be adopted at a future
stage of the proceedings.
Mary Ann Gunn was next called. She said—l have
no home. I slept in Gray's-inn-lane Union last night.
I knew the Samaritan Inetitution before 1855, and I
have received relief from it up to the present time. I
remember being at the institution on Christmas-day,
1855. I got in at half-past 1. I had beer, potatoes—
Sir R. Carden—You did not begin with the beer, did
you ? (Laughter.)
Witness—No ; I had meat, pudding, and bread. All
present had the same. I did not dine there this year.
On the 29th of last month I was there, and I heard Mr.
Barber tell those' wha were present at the dinner of 1855
to stand up. TWo gentlemen were with him. Mr.
Horsley, Mr. Barber's brother, and Mrs.
Barber were the persons. About ten persons
stood up. He said to ins " Did you have beer ?" Ayrei
and Daly said they had had: beer. I did not hear an
thing more, y-
as I nad to leave the room. On the 31st
of
last month I slept again at Playhouse-yard. I saw
Ayres and Daly there. On Friday, the 2d Jan., I saw
them again at Playhouse-yard. That was the day they
bad given their evidence. I asked Ayres how Mr. Bar-
ber bad gotten on. She said the evidence was such as
it would floor 'em. Daly said Mr. Potter had taken
her to his house, and had given her food, and would
continue to do so until the case was settled, and that
would pay her better than going for Mr. Barber. I