The Sun.
London, England, 1861-07-17 00:00:00

constitution of the Legislative Council. The act of 1853'
expressly used that term, but in this bill these words were
never used, the members who were to assist the Governor-
General in deliberative or legislative councils were called
"additional members," and they were to be appointed by
him. Then the noble earl said that there was nothing said
about publicity in the bill. The reason for that was that
the Government had come to the conclusion that it was

best to leave to the Governor-General the power of deter-
mining not only the rules and regulations by which the pro-
ceedings of the council would be guided, but also to what
extent they should be published. It was also argued that
the Governor-General might meet the same opposition from
the new members of the council ; but he could hardly be-
lieve that would be the case when it was considered that the
members who now exhibited that opposition were ex officio
members of council, whereas in the proposed councils alarge
proportion of the members would be appointed by the Go-
vernor-General, and he could not imagine that they would
combine to obstruct his policy, unless there was a grave
necessity for doing so. There would always be the Gover-
nor-General himself, and five official members of council,
and the Commander-in-Chief, while the additional mem-
bers would be appointed by the Governor-General from
such classes as were likely to give influence to the decision!
of the council. The alterations proposed by the bill,
if
adopted, would, in fact, raise up in India a great Council
of ncil
of State, apart from the Executive Government; and if
was constituted as proposed, one of two things would
happen, either the members of that council would be
selected from classes of little weight, and so the office fall
into disuetude, or it might be composed of persons of
weight and influence, who systematically set themselves
in opposition, and then all the evils of the present system
would be aggravated and extended. On the twofold
ground, that the bill made as little alteration as possible
in the existing law—that it was approved
of by the Gover-
nor-General, and by persons of experience in Indian admi-
nistration as an efficient remedy for the defects which had
rendered its introduction necessary, he hoped that their
lordships would not agree to the amendments of the noble
earl.
The Earl of ELLENBOROUGH said he heartily ap-
proved of the amendments suggested by the noble earl. So
far from being an innovation, they were merely a restora-
tion of the old and the only popular Government in India.
They would enable the Governor .General to do by his own
authority all that it was proposed to allow him to do with
the advice and assistance of his council. For his own part
he should have no apprehension of a Council of State, com-
posed in the way proposed, interfering in any way with the
action of the Governor-General in administrative matters.
It was the only way in which a large body of natives could
ever be introduced to a participation in the governing
power of the country, and he held that such a large intro-
duction of natives was absolutely necessary. (Hear.) He
asked the house to look at the peril in which we stood.
There was now a spirit of deep hostility existing between
the natives and Europeans. The Englishmen in India
were to be counted by units as against thousands of na-
tives ; and he believed that nothing would more gratify the
people of the country than to admit them to participate in
the duties of such a Council of State. On the other hand,
he had already stated the strong objections he entertained
to the council as proposed by this bill, and he now entreated
their lordships to remember that they were legislating for
India, not for the people of this country, and it was an im-
perative duty to consider the feelings and interests of the
people of India, and not those of the people of this country.
The Duke of ARGYLL defended the clause, and said
that the arguments of his noble friend had not been
answered by the noble earl opposite, with respect to the
amendments proposed by the noble earl (Earl Grey) ; they
were wholly inconsistent with the objects and the other
provisions of the bill ; and if they were agreed to, the bill
would have to be withdrawn and totally remodelled, so as
to make it a different measure altogether from what it now
was. The noble duke proceeded to justify the provision for
giving publicity to the proceedings of the council under
certain regulations, and pointed out the advantages which
had resulted from giving publicity to the financial state-
ments of Mr. Wilson and Mr. Laing. The noble duke at
some length went on to combat other objections which had
been urged against the clause.
Lord DENMAN having said a few words,
The clause was agreed to, as were also clauses up to 22
inclusive, with verbal amendments.
On clause 23 being proposed, which went to give the Go-
vernor. General power to make an edict the force of law for
a limited period,
The Earl of ELLENBOROUGH opposed the clause,
and did not think it safe to give such power to any man
whatever. He therefore proposed, as an amendment, that
in cases of emergency the Governor-General should have
the power, in council. of giving an ordinance the force of
law, and the power also of overruling the opinions of the
council in the same manner as he had at present of over-
ruling their opinions for any other purpose.
Earl DE GREY and RIPON thought the power pro-
posed by the noble earl a novel one, viz., to give the coun-
cil, in cases of emergency, power to deliberate on what
should be done. Her Majesty's Government were of opinion
it was better to leave it—as it always had been lett—to the
Governor-General himself, acting on his own responsibility.
The clause was agreed to.
Clauses 24 to 49 were agreed to.
On clause 50 being proposed, providing a substitute for
the Governor-General in case of a vacancy,
Lord ELLENBOROUGH thought it would be much
better to leave the law as it had been for 87 years, which
invested the powers of the Governor-General, in case of a
vacancy, in the senior member of the council. The present
clause proposed to transfer it to the Governor of Madras.
Earl DE GREY had not been able to consider the clause
sufficiently so as to give the noble earl an answer. He
would, however, do so ; and on the bringing up of the re-
port would, if possible, accede to his suggestions.
The clause was then agreed to, as well as the remaining,
and the house resumed.
The report was ordered to be brought up on Friday next.
The Attorneys and Solicitors (Ireland), and the Piers
and Harbours Bills, were read a second time.
The Chatham Dockyard Enlargement Bill went through
committee.
The County Surveyors (Ireland) Bill, and the Industrial
Schools Bill were read a second time.
The London Coal and Wine Dues Continuance Bill went
through committee.
The Harbours Bill, and the Metropolitan Police Forcb
Pensions Bill were, after some amendments, read a third
time and passed.
Their lordships then adjourned.