The Sun.
London, England, 1861-06-21 00:00:00

LLEFT SITTING.]

HOUSE OF COMMONS—(THIS DAY.)
The SPEAKER took the chair at twelve o'clock.
PRIVATE BUSINESS.
The Birmingham Improvement Bill and the Great
Southern and Western of Ireland (capital) Bill were read a

third time and passed.
Several other private bills were advanced a stage.
THE HARBOURS BILL—RAMSGATE.

On the house going into committee on this bill,
Mr. M. GIBSON said it would be convenient if he were
to make a short statement with respect to Ramsgate har-
bour. Nothing could be further from the intentions of the
Government than proceeding with any steps relative b
Ramsgate harbour under the provisions of this bill; he
was therefore perfectly willing to agree to the omission of
all portions of the bill touching that harbour. (Hear, hear.)
When it was proposed to seek any power to deal
with the harbour the parties would have to come openly
and freely to Parliament, and he could assure the house
that there would be no anticipation of a decision of Parlia-
ment by her Majesty's Government. (Hear, hear.)
The house then went into committee.

On clause 7,
Mr. MILLER moved to add to the clause the following
words :—" With the exception of the said dues leviable by
tne Trinity corpornit... .t filo port of Leith. where such
dues shall cease to be levied as sorm as provision shall have
been made by sufficient accumulated funds for all annuities,
pensions, and obligations which have been lawfully granted,
or in which a vested interest, absolute or contingent, has
been lawfully created before the 15th day of March, 1861."
The hon. gentleman stated that such great objectionhad been
felt at the manner in which the Trinity Corporation dis-
posed of its funds that the people of Leith resisted the pay-
ment of the tax by force. The result was that the corpora-
tion was obliged to procure an Act of Parliament, which
was granted them for 20 years. The period happened to
expire about this time ; the community of Leith were
anxious that their case should be an exception to the gene-
ral arrangement which the Board of Trade had made with
the Trinity Corporation. The clause was drawn up on
liberal terms, and he hoped it would be agreed to.
Mr. GIBSON resisted the proposal, which, after a short
discussion, was withdrawn.
The clause was agreed to.
Clauses 8 and 9 were also agreed to.

On clause 10,
Mr. LINDSAY proposed to substitute " 1867" for 1872.
Ihe first duty of the house was to koep down taxation, and
they would be neglecting their duty if they allowed the
parties to receive half a million of compensation before they
were entitled to it.

Mr. HORSFALL said it was a fallacy to suppose that
anything was given to any parties which was not already
theirs by right. _ _ _

Mr. BEAUMONT said the differential dues levied at
Newcastle were secured not only by Acts of Parliament,
but by grants made centuries ago, and he could see no
ground for stopping them without compensation. Ten years
was a very moderate period to fix for that purpose.
After a few words from Mr. HODGSON and Mr. DUNLOP,
Mr. Alderman SALOMON said his constituency were
only interested in this question as taxpayers, and he should
therefore support the bill, as it would relieve several bur-
dens that now pressed very heavily on the shipping trade.
If the house delayed the passing of the bill it would only
increase the claim for compensation. The real question for
them to decide was, was ten years a sufficient time for that
purpose. He thought that it was, ariil he also thought that
the Government deserved great praise for the great consi-
deration that had been given both to taxpayers and tax

receivers.
Colonel FRENCH was against compensation being given
at all.
Mr. BUCHANAN thought the compromise of the hon.
member for Sunderland was a very liberal one, and ought
to be accepted.
Mr. LINDSAY said he should be neglecting his duty
and also the interest of those industrious persons who had
sent him to Parliament if he did not take the sense of the
house on his amendment.
After a few words from Sir F. GOLDSMID,
The house then divided, when there appeared •
For the amendment 2B
Against l2B

Ilajority

The amendment was consequently negatived.
Mr. CAVE then proposed that the following worts be
added at the end of the clause :—" Provided, that in the
case of any body of proprietors paying a dividend to share-
holders out of the profits made by them, or of any company
paying a like dividend, or of any private individual entitled
by reason of a private proprietary right, adequate compen-
sation shall be made in such manner as may be determined
by arbitration or otherwise." He urged the necessity of
making this amendment, and said that at Shoreham a large
sum of money had been laid out in the improvement of the
harbour on the strength of receiving the dues. He ap-
proved generally of the bill, and the 'addition he proposed
was only what was required as a matter of justice.

(Anuses up to z 1 were Lv.
In reply to Mr. DELDES,

Mr. M. GIBSON said he hoped the hon. gentleman
would not press his amendment. He did not think that
any special reason existed in favour of Shoreham, and
therefore he thought they ought to come in to the 10 years
compensation.

The amendmentwaswithdrawn,audthe clause was agreed

Mr. M. GIBSON said all the clauses giving the right
to transfer Ramsgate Harbour to any company, railway or
otherwise, had been withdrawn. The funds transferred to
Government from Ramsgate would be used for the benefi
of the harbour.

Mr. MOFFATT thought that the management of
Ramsgate harbour by the trustees had been highly effec-
tive.
Mr. MITCHELL was of a different opinion.
Mr. LIDDELL said with respect to the economy of the
trustees of Ramsgate Harbour, it had been stated that the