The Sun.
London, England, 1857-02-13 00:00:00

MOLDAVIA AND WALLACHIA.

Lord C. HAMILTON moved an address to her Ma-
jesty for a copy of the treaty concluded by his Majesty
the Emperor of Austria with the Sublime Porte, on the
14th of June, 1854, relative to the military occupation
of the above Principalities. He complained that owing
to long-established habit, unless her Majesty's name ap-
peared as one of the high contracting parties, no treaty,
however important it might be to the general state of
Europe, or however it might affect British interests, was
printed unless some member of that house went through
the process of moving an address for that purpose. It
was to that point he wished to call the attention of the
house, because treaties which were of much importance,
and in actual force, were not to be found in the library.
The object in making the motion was to get over a pre-
cedent which existed, according to which no treaty was
printed unless moved for a private member. The last
official statement of treaties was published in 1830, and
there was no more recent list in the library for members
to refer to. There were several other treaties which
ought to be printed for the convenience of members,
and he hoped the Government would give attention to
the subject.
Lord PALMERSTON—I suppose my noble friend
having made his statement, will hardly press his motion,
because the treaty to which he refers has been already
laid before Parliament. (A. laugh.) With regard to the
general question, I apprehend the case to be this—that
the Government lays before Parliament all treaties, it
being fitting that Parliament should kuow what engage-
ments the country has entered into ; but, with regard to
engagements entered into with other Powers between
themselves, we havA no official knowledge of such, and
therefore they are not laid before Parliament. If a par-
ticular treaty is concluded between two foreign Powers,
and it is thought to be one that by its nature bears in
some degree upon the policy of England, a member
moves for it, and application may be made for it to that
foreign Government, and it may then be had officially
and laid before Parliament. But what I apprehend my
noble friend to mean is that all European, or rather all
international, documents and engagements of general
interest should be collected and placed in the library.
Well, if it is thought fit to make arrangements for that
purpose, and assign a remuneration toa person responsible
for doing it, it might be useful to those gentlemen who
may wish to consult those documents. But that will ,e
a question for the house to determine,
sand my noble
friend is aware that there is now a periodical collection
made and printed for sale, containing all the documents,,
not merely of treaties, but every European document of
general interest, and made up in volumes for each year ;
and a very large number of volumes are now published.
This is a work of great labour and research. Those
documents are collected from all sources —foreign news-
papers, and the acts of foreign Governments—and it
takes a considerable time to collect them with accuracy.
With regard to the other question, if the house thinks it

worth while to charge any responsible person with the

duty of colho leg, for the use of members, all treaties
and documents of international operations, I do not ap-
prehend that the Government would be at all opposed
to such a step. (Hear, hear.)
Mr. DISRAELI—I think the house must feel obliged
to my noble friend (Lord C. Hamilton) for bringing the
matter before them. There is a want of many docu-
ments of international interest in our library, but I am
sure my noble friend meant no censure upon the gentle-
man who now manages the library, for I believe no
one could discharge that duty with more ability and ac-
curacy. (Hear, hear.) What my noble friend says is,
that the collection at the Foreign-office is made with
ample knowledge and proper research, and in every way
satisfactory, except one, and if our representations were
made to the Foreignoffice that there should be a little
more energy employed in the production of the valuable
collection of documents there, they should all have the
information which it was so desirable to possess. (Hear.)
The motion was then withdrawn.
BANK ACTS.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER rose to
move the appointment of the Committee on the Bank
Act. He said—l will trouble the house with a few
remarks relating to the nature of the committee I pro-
pose to appoint—namely, a Committee of Secresy. The
actual difference between an ordinary committee and a
committee of secresy is not, in fact, very wide. It is
competent for a select committee—and it often exercises
the power—to exclude the public during the reception
of evidence. All select committees exclude the public
during their deliberation., which constitute the only
part of their proceedings of which an authentic report
by a shorthand writer is not preserved. To a committee
of the sort I now propose it is not probable that the
public would be admitted during the examination of
witnesses; but a complete report of the evidence would
be taken, and the committee would have the power of
laying it on the table of the house. The only difference
between a select committee, not admitting the public
during the examination of witnesses, and a committee of
secresy is this—that it is the privilege of members not
belonging to the committee to be present at an ordinary
se ect committee, if they so think fit, while the public
are excluded. But, if the committee be a committee of
secresy then members unconnected with the committee
have not that privilege. Teat is the whole extent of the
difference. In looking through the series of committees
appointed to inquire into the Bank charter and te her
questions of a similar nature, I find it to have been the
invariable practice to constitute them, compaktees of
secresy. In 1819 the committee on the tipadiency of
the Bank resuming cash payments was a secret com-
mittee. In 1832 a secret committee was appointed
to inquire into the expediency of aenewing the Bank
charter. In 1836 the committee of joint-stock
banks was also secret, and the committee on com-
mercial distress in 1848 was likewise a committee
secresy. With respect to the arrangements between,this
Government and the Bank of England, there is nothing
which, as far as I am aware, inight:note. be
.published to
the whole world, and as far as Government is concerned
there is no reason to wish that any departure shout' take
place from the usual mode of examination in committee.
But the house mast be aware that, in a committee of
this sort, questions may arise affecting the credit of par-
ticular commercial establishments, with respect to which
it might not be desirable that any pUblicity should oc-
cur ; and that, I apprehend, is the prjncipal reason why
this course bas been invariably pur.ued with respect to
committees of this kind. Therefore I have thought it
desirable to adhere to what seems to have been the in-
variable practice, and I propose that this should be a
committee of secresy. With respect to the members of
the committee, it has been my study to propose as fair a
list of names as possible, and one which would insure a
complete and searching investigation of the matter re-
ferred to the committee. I think the house will admit
tbat there are scarcely any discussions so disagreeable
to the feelings as those which arise with respect to the
preference of one member to another for appointment on
a committee, and if the house should be of opinion that,
on the whole, the list I propose is a fair one, I trust
that, without going into the merits of other members, it
will be disposed to adopt the list I submit. Two gentle-
raen—the hon. members for Wallingford and Perthshire
(Mr. Malins and Mr. Stirling)—have intimated their
inability to serve on the committee, and I should there-
fore give notice of a motion to substitute two other
names instead of theirs. The right hon. gentleman con-
cluded by making the following motion :
"That the committee be a committee of secresy, and
do consist of 22 members—viz., the. Chancellor of the
'Exchequer, Mr. Disraeli, Sir J. Graham, Mr. Spooner,
Mr. Gladstone, Mr. G. A. Hamilton, Mr. Cardwell, Mr.
Wilson, Mr. Hildyard, Mr. Glyn, Mr. Beckett, Mr.
Hankey, Mr. Pollard-Urquhart, Mr. J. L. Ricardo, Sir
C. Wood, Mr, Cayley, Sir F. Baring, Mr. M. T. Smith,
Mr. Wilkinson, and Mr. Fergus."
Mr. PEACOCKE rose to protest against the fairness of
the proposed committee. Opinions upon this subject
were entertained by two schools, if he might call them
so, which were diametrically opposed to each other.
There was the school which wished to preserve the Bank
Act in its present integrity, and which had on its side
the high authority of Lord Overstone. There was the
school which wished to introduce considerable modifica-
tions in the act, and which had on its side the still higher
authority of Mr. Fullerton, Mr. Tooke, and Mr. Wilson.
The last-mentioned gentleman, indeed, had almost de-
luged the country with the variety of pamphlets, articles,
and publications which he had issued on this subject
during the last 14 years, On looking at the names that
composed the committee, he (Mr. Peacocke) found one
or two members of what he might call the Birmingham
school, and be found one or two of what he might call
the Overstone school. He found the names of come
members who, he believer', had not expressed any opinion
on this subject, if, indeed, they entertained any. But he
did not find a single member of what he might call
the school of economists which had the very high
authority of Messrs. Tooke, Fullerton; and Wil
son. He listened to a great
portion of the not very
lively or instructive debate on this subject theother
evening, and of the rtion of which he had not the
felicity of hearing, her ead a report the next day. He
found that during the whole of the debate there was but
one hon. gentleman who broached doctrinesatallwah,p-,
ap-
proaching to that school. The hon.
gentleman,
was the hon. member for Wick Burgh (Mr. ing),
spoke most ably, but his namr. Peacocke) might be
name was
he not on the commit-
tee. Perhaps, however(
told, as he had been remindedby
that the name of the
his right hon. friend
the member for Buckinghamshire,
hon. member for Westbury (Mr. James Wilson) was
but
be must take the liberty of
asking whether he was
a
Wilsouite—(laughter)—for he
was probably no mores Wilsonite than Wilkes Was. a
Wilkite. He (Mr. Peacooke) was rather inclined to be-
lieve that the hon. member for
disciples,Westbur andy h
was
he
inclined,
like Wilkes, to repudiate his
there-
fore begged to ask whetherhit was really his intention
to take his place upon •t
e committee, and, if be
should do so, whether he a ould do so as the author

nion
bulli
for tl
and
cial
the 1

Capital and Currency," or as the Secretary for the
iury ; because, with the single exception of the
arable gentleman him•elt, tiler,: was no represent,s•
,f the-5.0:1.6'A of which he Was- once the apostle,
iof which be (Mr. Peacocke) b,lieved he
o longer a disciple. (Laughter.) If there was one
;ion more than another to,which the attention of
rumittee ought to be directed it was that of coup
es. •On looking over the debate of the other
mg he found that that rubject was alluded to by
[.)ne gentleraan, viz., his hon. friend the member for
fness-shire. But that hon. gentleman's name was
the committee. There was another most impor-
oint. He believed that it was a very general opi-
hat it was the intention of the Bank Act that the
n in the is,•ne department should be exclusively
e purpose of securing the convertibility of the note,
at the hol er of the bank note should have a spe-
en upon it. Now, if the bank should break, was
elder of such a note to be paid pani passe with
_ .._. . . ~...

exeryi other credit or ? That the Chancellor of the Exche-
quer must admit was a very important question for the
consideration of the committee, but not one of those bon;
gentlemen whose names had been proposed had alluded to
it. And so he (Mr. Peacocke) was told that this was a fair
and Impartial committee for the purposes of inquiry.
He declined to propose any alteration of it. He
thou4ht that the play was amusing as it, stood, and he
did not wish to interfere with the performance or the
distribution of the parts in this most solemn comedy.
(Laukliter.)

Mr. DISRAELI begged to repeat the appeal which
he made the other evening to the Government, to intro-
duce;ai bill at once without the intervention.of a com-
mittee, as he thought that all the information that might
be needed could be furnished during the discussion of
the bill in its several stages in the house. The Govern-
ment'had matured their opinion on the subject, and be
thought it was most unadvisable to appoint a committee
to investigate a subject with respect to which the Go-
vernment was prepared to undertake, on its own respon-
sibility, the introduction of a bill. He (Mr. Disraeli)
was not disposed to divide the house upon the appoint-
ment of a committee unless be should receive more en-
couragement than he then anticipated. But there was
another point which was scarcely less important which
he would urge upon the Government, and that was the
expediency of not only changing the names, but reducing
the size of the committee, which was unwieldy. All the
opinions that ought to be represented might be repre-
sented by a committee exactly half the size. Why not
have a committee of 11, as they chose 11's at cricket I
(Laughter.)

The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said it
appeared to be the general wish of the house that a se-
lect cionomittee should be appointed on this subject, and
although he thought there was no necessity for one yet
he would yield to that desire. Even if he had deter-
ininad to introduce a bill in the first instance he believed
that the majority of the house would have referred it to
a select committee. There was a general expectation,
both within the house and out of doors, that the sub-
ject should undergo investigation before a com-
mittee. On referring to former committees upon
this subject he foui,d that they were generally
composed of 26 or 28. The last committee
was composed of 26. In proposing, therefore, a com-
mittee of 12, he did not choose an unreasonable num-
ber. The many application which had been made to
It m by hon. members desirous of being appointed on the
committee induced him to believe that it was the general
wish that the committee should be composed of at least
22 members.

Mr. HADFIELD complained of the absence from th•
list of evrry hon. gentlemen representing the manufac-
turing districts in the north of England.

Mr. TITE expressed his approval of an inquiry by a
select committee as a preliminary step to the introduc-
tion of a bill.

All the names preceding that of Mr. Pollard-Urquhart
having been put from the chair and agreed tJ,
Mr. GROGIN proposed the substitution of Mr.
Vance's name for that of Mr. Urquhart, on the ground
that the latter represented an agricultural, while the
former represented a mercantile. constituency.
After a few words from Mr. NEWDEGATE,
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER thought
that if was not the *first time that the hon. gentleman
had made a motion of a similar nature with respect to
his colleague ; and he also thought that his colleague
had made a similar motion with regard to himself.
(Laughter.) He himself would adhere to the names
which he had set aown, and, as among those names
were the name of the hon. member for the University of
Dublin, an accomplished financier, and of the hon.
member fur Westmeath, who had on previous occa•
sions exhibited considerable acquaintance with the sub-
ject, be did not think that Irish commercial interests
were not fairly represented.

Mr. VANCE disclaimed any intention of placing
himself in antagonism with the hon. member for
Ws itmeatb, but at the same time he begged, in reply to
the Chancellor of the Exchequer, to btate that he had
never proposed his colleague to serve on any committee,
and he hoped that his hon. colleague would now with-
draw his motion.

The motion was then withdrawn, and the remaining
names were agreed to.
The Commons Enclosure Bill and the Royal 'Marine
Forces Bill were read a second time.
The house adjourned at 12 o'clock.

Country Markets.

DERBY 3MITIIFIELD.-FElt. 10.

Our market was well supplied with fat beasts to-day,
with a full number of buyere, and high prices obtained
for every quality of beef, and most of the animals were
disposed of. There wore an average number of sheep,
which sold well. The supply of fat pigs was more plenti-
ful. The supply of fat aed store calves was larger.
The following were the quotations I—Beef, 6d to 60;
mutton, 74d to 8d ; lamb, —d to Od ; veal, 7d to 81 per
lb. ; pigs, ;Os Gcl to lls Od per score; rough fat, 5s 101 to 01
per 141 b. ; hides, 41d to 64d per lb ; calf-skins, 40 to bid
per lb. 7-_<

.Y 1
EDINBURGH GRAIN.—FEB. 11. j •
Large supplies of grain to-day. Sales were heavy, but,
prices much better.
Wheat, on the top, 16s Od up, and on the average Oa Sd
up. Barley, 64 down on the top, and 2s 7d up on the
average. Oats on the top 2s Od up—on the average
is 7d up. Beans on the top 2s down, and on the average
2d down.

AVERAGES PER IMPERIAL QUARTER.
Wheat £2 0 6 3-12th.
Do. new -12th.
Barley
Oats 1 6 0 4-12ths.
Beans