The Sun.
London, England, 1861-07-25 00:00:00

THE SUNA LONDQN, ITHWISDAY EVENING, JULY 25, 1861.

THIRD EDITION.

SUN OFFICE, Seven o'clock.

THE LATE FATAL ENCOUNTER IN
NORTHUMBE.RLAND-STREET.

ADJOURNED INQTJEST.—(THIS DAY.)
The coroner's inquiry into the circumstances attending
the death of William John. Roberts, lately occupying apart-
ments in Northumberland-street, Strand, was resumed this
morning in the board-room of Charing-cross Hospital be-
fore Mr. St. Clair Bedford, the coroner for the city of West-
minster.

Mr. Humphreys attended on the part of Major Murray,
and Mr. Sleigh for the family of the late Mr. Roberts.
Mr. P. Lamb said—l have offices at 16, Northumber-
land-street, on the second floor. T knew the deceased very
well. I was last there about eight or ten months since.
The rooms were then in perfect order. On Friday, July
12, I heard the report of fire-arms. After a couple of minutes
I heard another report. I had often heard these reports
before during the last 12 months. Shortly after the reports
I heard very strange noises, as if some person was striking
a wool mattress. About two minutes after a client came
in, and then I heard the cry of " Murder I" I opened the
door and went downstairs. The back door of Mr. Roberts'
apartments was open. I met young Mr. Roberts on the
stairs. He cried out, " Oh, Mr. Lamb, some one has been
and murdered my father." He asked me whether I would
go in and see him. I said I would rather not, and stood on
the landing. I saw Mr. Roberts taken away, and then I
went in. I went towards the windows and saw two pistols
—one in a case and one on the ground. I took the one off
the ground and examined it, and then placed it on the
table. I then picked up a smaller pistol, but it did not ap-
pear to have been recently discharged.
Mr. Humphreys—You have stated that you heard
strange noises a short time after the report of the fire-arms.
Had you ever heard such noises before ?
Witness—No.
The Coroner—Did you hear any scuffling ?
Witness—No.
Dr. Canton recalled.
Mr. Humphreys—When you made the remark, on the
examination of Major Murray, as to the mark on the back
of the neck, will you state what you said, and whether
Major Murray made any reply.
Dr. Canton—l remarked upon seeing his neck, "Here's
a circular mark," and Murray replied immediately, " Ah,
that's where he put the muzzle of the pistol."
Mr. Sleigh—Might not the pistol have been discharged
when he was on the ground as well as when he was sitting
in a chair. _ _ _

Dr. Canton—l don't think that is consistent with the
mark of the ball. I think when he was shot he must have
been passive and unprepared.
Mr. Sleigh—lf he had been stunned or rendered insen-
sible, might not that appearance have been produced ?
Dr. Canton—Yes, it might.
Mr. Sleigh—Have you examined the matter on the razor?
Dr. Canton—No ; I've not been asked to do so:
Inspector Mackenzie recalled.
Mr. Humphreys—Was there any portion of the statement
of Mr. Roberts made to you which you omitted to state
when you were before examined ?
Inspector Mackenzie—Yes ; I omitted to state one ques-
tion I asked Mr. Roberts. I asked him if there had been
any altercation between him and Major Murray, and he
said there had not. That was at the time when Mr.
Roberts was describing the scene that occurred in the room.
A conversation also took place between himself and Major
Murray on the evening of the death of Mr. Roberts. Shortly
after the death of Mr. Roberts, Dr. Canton, myself, and Mr.
Durkin, and witness, went to Major Murray's room.
Dr. Canton, addressing him, said a person in whom they
had taken some interest had gone on from bad to worse.
Major Murray said, who do you mean, and the reply
was " Mr. Roberts." Dr. Canton then told him that he was
dead, and Major Murray exclaimed, " Dead, by Jove ; is
he ?" The Major then said, " I've nothing to reflect upon
about the death of the man—he was no man." The Major
then asked whether Mr. Roberts had seen a clergyman
with regard to his future prospects. Mr. Durkin said he
had, as the clergyman had been sent for. The Major then
asked whether Mr. Roberts had made any statement, and
he replied that he had made a statement to him.
A number of questions were put to the witness to ascer-
tain whether young Roberts had ever previous to yesterday
stated that his father knew Major Murray, and the answers
were to the effect that he had not.
William Roberts recalled—l did not see the contents of
the letters I posted to Major Murray. They were sealed
up. I don't remember that one of them was addressed to
the Army and Navy Club. I don't recollect where either
of them were addressed. I only recollect that one of the
letters had Major Murray on it and some address. I have
been to Liverpool. It was about three months ago, as near
as I can say. I can't recollect whether it was in February.
It might have been in March. I did not go alone ; a youth
went with me. His name is Watson. He is about my
own age. I had no particular business to transact in Liver-
pool. It was for the purpose of going abroad. I had
£4O with me. I took it out of the bank where
I bad put my savings. It was the Camberwell and Dul-
wich Savings'-bank. It is in the Camberwell-road, near
St. Giles's Church. I drew the £4O out of the bank. I
did not take another £4O with me. I made no arrange-
ment as to the ship I was to go to. My father followed me
the next morning. He did not bring me back ; he asked
me to return, and I did. While I was at Liverpool I lived
at an hotel. It was kept by a perion named Smith. I
don't recollect the name of the hotel.
Mr. Humphreys—Upon your oath, did you not collect
that £4O and run away with it ?
Witness—l went away with it. I did not collect it before
doing so. I drew it from the savings'-bank, where I had
put it myself.
By Mr. Sleigh—l have never been accused by my father
of anything dishonourable, or anything to be ashamed of.
The money was the accumulation of my own savings. My
father told me that Major and Mrs. Murray and himself
had dined together. I have never said I dined with them.
By Mr. Humphreys—l think my father said it was at the
Grosvenor Hotel, but I don't recollect.
By a Juror—When I was at the bedside of Major Murray
I knew it was he.
By the Coroner—No one told me when I came to the
hospital that it was Major Murray.
Miss Emily Clarence Parsons—l am unmarried. I have
known Mr. Roberts for some years, and was at Northum-
berland-street about ten weeks ago. The last time' I was
in the rooms was on Saturday last. The rooms were ge-
nerally untidy. The place was generally dusty. I used not
to pay much attention to the place when I went, as it was
always business that took me there. Generally there were
a great many papers lying about the room.
By Mr. Humphreys—l called upon Mr. Roberts for the
purpose of borrowing money. He received articles from
me which I don't think it necessary further to mention.
Anne Maria Moody—l reside at Elm-lodge, Talbot-road,
Tottenham. I am unmarried. I knew the deceased for
the last thiee or four years. I have often been at his rooms
in Northumberland-street. I was last there on the Wed-
nesday before the occurrence. The rooms were always
untidy—papers strewn all over the floor. Mr.
Roberts always threw his papers on the ground. I know
Major Murray. [The witness here burst out crying.' I
never saw the deceased and Major Murray in company
together. lam quite certain they never spoke together.
Major Murrayknew the deceased by sight, but not to speak
to him. I am certain he did not. The deceased knew Major
Murray, but he did not know deceased. About two years
since the Major and I were walking down past the Horse
Guards ; we passed Westminster Abbey, down Victoria-
street, and on to the new Railway Bridge at Pimlico.
We walked along by Eccleston-square, and then to the water
side, and I saw them raise some of the ironwork. We re-
turned the same way, and at Charing-cross the Major put
me into an Atlas omnibus. It would be about four o'clock.
About a week after that I went to deceased on business,
and he Said to me, so you can;walk:about town with gentle-
men who don't choose to offer you their arm." I replied
that I had walked with no one who was ashamed to offer
me their arm, and that if he had seen me with any body it
was the Major. He then said that he had seen me
with a gentleman go down past the Horse Guards ;
that he watched us to the corner of the Abbey ;
that he then saw me go into a house (meaning one of the
four Gothic houses there) by the side of the Abbey. He
then took a cab, and remained in it until we came back
again. As we were crossing the road by the new hotel he
said he saw us, and that he allowed us to pass him. He
got out of the cab, followed us to Charing-cross, and there
saw the Major put me into an omnibus: He then followed
the Major to 33, Harley-street. He never entered the
house described. He lost sight of us at the turning
of the Abbey. I am certain deceased knew the
Major, as he had told me he had watched him
about to Harley-street and to Holles-street. I
am certain no correspondence was ever carried on between
Major Murray and deceased ; I am perfectly certain of that.
1 don't know the name of Grey at all ; I never heard that
deceased assumed that name. I never heard deceased ex-
press exactly what could be called ill feeling against the
Major. I never heard him make any threat against him.
I have heard the deceased say that he had pistols, and he
might use them if I annoyed him.
Coroner—What feeling did deceased express for Major
Murray ?
Witness—No ill feeling. He never spoke to me much
about him.
Coroner—Had ho any object in getting Major Murray
out of the way ?
Witness—Oh, yes.
Coroner—What ?
Witness—He wanted me.
Coroner—Did you ever hear him express any wish to get
rid of Major Murray ?
Witness—No.
Coroner—Did Major Murray reside at your address ?
Witness—Yes, on and off, at different times.
Coroner—l shall now leave you to tell the jury anything
you may know of importance that you think relative to this
affair.
Witness--About five or six weeks ago deceased sent me
down a letter askipg we to call at his dace on business About

the Grosvenor Hotel, as he heard that they wanted money.
Mr. Sleigh—Have you that letter ?
Witness—No. Knowing that the company wanted
money, and that the Major held a great many shares, I
went down the next day. He asked if they wanted the
money, and I told him they did, and the sum was about
£40,000 or £50,000. He said that was a capital thing, and
he thought he knew a client who had that amount of money
and wished to sink it. I asked him who it was, and he told
me it was Mr. R. Anstruther. I told him I thought some
one was going to advance the money. A week after that I
went down to him and told him the money would not be
required. [The witness here became hysterical, but in a few
minutes she recovered and proceeded.] I went down to de- '
ceased and told him I thought they had obtained the money,
and at the same time I said, " I hoped he had not men-
tioned the subject to Mr. Anstruther, as it might have
raised his hopes." "Oh," he said, "if you are not certain
about it I may as well see Mr. Anstruther." He then
asked me if I would stay in his chambers while he went
for a time table. I waited five minutes and he returned
with the book. He then looked at the time the boats left
Boulogne for Folkestone. He said they were too late and
too early for the baronet to cross. He appeared so im-
patient to see Mr. Anstruther, that he said he would have
gone that very day had he been well enough to take the jour-
ney. Before leaving he said to me, " I met the Major yester-
day." I said, "Did you. Where did you see him ?" He said,
" I had just got too late for the boat, as it was starting from
London-bridge, and I waited with him till the next boat
arrived. We both went up in the same boat together, and
got out at Hungerford-market. The Major walked up in
front of him to the Strand, and there he lost sight of him.
Ho asked me if that was the usual way the Major came to
town. I told him he always came up by boat, but returned
by the train. The deceased asked me to let him know
whether they had got the money. I said, " You ought to
go to the secretary." He said, " Oh, no, that won't do,
because he would get the credit of advancing the money ;
and if Idoit I ought to get it." I then said, " Why don't
you go to the board ?" He then said, "If I were to write
to the Major and ask him to come to my chambers, he
would come." I replied," It would be better to write to him,
and he then would get an answer." The deceased asked
me if it would not be better to go go the Club and see
the Major. I begged of him not to do so, as it might
appear as if the Major had private business. I advised him
to write, telling him he would get an answer by return of
post. He then asked me if the Major had ever taken me
out. I said he had not, but that we were going the follow-
ing Monday to see Blondin. The Major did not know
of my visits to Mr. Roberts. Mr. Roberts did not tell me
that he had spoken to the Major on the boat. On the Wed-
nesday before the occurrence I had occasion to go to de-
ceased at his chambers. He asked me again about the
money. I said I really did not know for certain, but 1
thought they had got it. He then said, "Oh, I've seen
Anstruther," and he named the day I was to call again. I
don't recollect what day I was to call. I was about to leave,
and he said "What a hurry you are in ; can't you stay a little
friend"while ?. ''
He
e replied,th en
said,' N Is
saw
wm
ygoing
and
the Major, withto par a visit to a
your little child and nurse, at the Palace." I said, " I
don't think it could be the nurse you saw ; where on earth
were you
sitting ?" and he described the form we were
sitting on near the terrace. The description he gave was
correct. I then said, " How was it I did not see you;
surely I must have seen you if you had been as close to us
glasses ?" He
run away when
saasidy,ou“
Osahy,noor; wasyou rllliettolkeinehgildthrheaudghjatshat
the nurse ran after it." When I heard that he had been
watching the Major I Mt annoyed, and I said to him,
" What could have induced you to go doyen to the Palace
the day I went ?" He said, as far as my recollection serves
me, "My wife and sisters went ;" that he took tickets for
the reserved seats, thinking that "all of you were likely to be
me to remain out-
when the next
tshideer.e,B"
eafnorde thlat
leitftwohulimd bheebeatstkeredfomr e
meeting of the board took place) and whether
it would be at the same time as before ? 1
told him I did not know, as the Major vas in town so
frequently ; but I thought there would be a meeting beforo
the week expired. He asked me when he should see me
again, and I told him I did not know.
Coroner—Does anything else occur to you?
Witness—No ; nothing.
By Mr. Sleigh—l have known Mr. Roberts for three or
four years.
years.
Mr. known Major Murray between seven
and eight
Mr. Sleigh—May I ask you if you have always been
living by the name of Moody ?
Witness—No, in his name.
Mr. Sleigh—How long have you gone by the name of
Murray ?

Witness—Since I've known the Major.
Mr. Sleigh—When did you adopt the name of Murray?
Witness—Five or six years ago.
Mr. Sleigh—You have never been married ?
Witness (crying)—No.
Mr. Sleigh—When did you first go to live at Elm Lodge ?
Witness—Last May twelvemonths.
Mr. Sleigh—Was it taken by you or Major Murray?
Witness —Major Murray.
Mr. Sleigh—Were you in the habit of frequently calling
on deceased ?
Witness—Yes.
Mr. Sleigh—Did he know you were living with Major
Murray ?
Witness—Yes.
Mr. Sleigh—Did you conceal your visits to Mr. Roberts
from Major Murray ?
Witness—Yes.
Mr. Sleigh—Were your visits to Mr. Roberts of a busi-
ness or of an intimate nature ?
Witness—Of a business nature; never of an intimate
nature. I never was on intimate terms with him. The
reason of the fear was that he would make known to the
Major that I had been there for money and it would
have highly displeased the Major, that I had taken that
course rather than ask him for the money. When first I
went to him it was on business, but not latterly. He held
such awe over me that I was always fearful to displease
him, fearing that he might make my home unhappy.
Mr. Sleigh—What was the nature of your business with
the deceased ?
Witness—About four years ago I went to borrow money.
It was small in amount—£ls; but the bill I had to give
was for £2O. I never owed more than £2O at one time. I
have read the whole of the proceedings relative to
this matter that have appeared in the newspapers.
I never was later in Northumberland-street than six
or seven o'clock in the evening. My visits never
exceeded an hour. Sly first acquaintance arose from the
circumstance of calling upon Mr. Roberts for the loan of
£l5. There is no settlement by any person on me. The
reason of my second visit to Roberts was to tell him that I
should only be able to pay the interest. It was about two
months after I had the money. I told him at the end of
three months I would not be able to pay him all, but that
I would pay him the interest ; it was to be £5. He
said I need not trouble myself about it, and that if I
would be his he would forgive me all. I replied
I hat I came there to pay him honourably, and that
I hoped he would treat me in the same manner. The
reason I told Roberts to write to the Major was, that
as I knew him to be so fond of money I felt he would not
neverattempt tor
received
ved anything
presents about
my transactions with him.
from
Roberts, neither has my
little girl. I never mentioned to the Major where I thought
it was likely he could get money. (Mr. Sleigh was very
pressing on the point, but nothing contradictory was
elicited.)
Mr Humphreys—Mr,
By - introducedßoberts 'has many times
wished me to be to his wife. I refused him, and
doing. When I left home I went
Murra and I
to live with Major Y± have lived with him from
that time to the present as his ae. It:was in consequence
of an illness that I went t
tl of
borrow money of Roberts.
Major Murray was frequen
some
_rtotya kome for a month together.
After my confinement
alie bills became due, which I
did not want Major Murray
Mr.Kn
confidential friend of mine, al lady,
oiloobfzrtn:lheitfiwrsatstlnnee7ll-
gave him reasons for so
sequence of this that I went
to hear Spurgeon. i
That
told all my affairs.person told me she
to whom I
lentamoney, and she gave me Roberts's
when he knew I was
acceptance for £2O -
at three months,
address. I gave my to
and received £l5. I have been the Crystal Palace two
heardkn ew ofa
person him through
w h o
going. He once gave me
sur .se
went with a friend, and to raY. Pri saw Roberts and
his wife and children sitting the next seat. Roberts
but
wished me to go to Scotland,l refused to
do so. I have seen Roberts at Tottenham.
or three times, and he met ma ettiehkereet
After I had been there two or three months
I went into the village on business, and was returning
home when I thought I saw hini in a Ransom cab. I
to a shop.
looked behind, and saw him go P. He was out
in an instant and into the cab again. J. went straight home.
The cab went in an opposite direction: After I had been
home a little while I felt certain_ it._ was Roberts, and
being anxious about it I thoughi_ had. better go to
town and see if it was him, and if I.tound it was to beg of
him to desist following me. I did. not find him there,
and as I was coming down stairs Rleart_s_camekushing up
stairs, and said that he had just ha h after me. He
said nobody seemed to know me,
and t at it was too bad of
me not to give him any address, for he would never lose
sight of nae. Major Murray had always treated me in the
most noble-hearted manner that man Could do. His
disposition was amiability itself. Roberts knew that
I loved and idolized the Major, and that was
the hold he had on me. I would never have been
at the beck and call of Roberts if it had not been
for that hold he had on me—my fear that he would tell
Major Murray that I had been to his office to borrow money.
Major Murray had been most generous to me, and the rea-
son I did not like to tell Major Murray that I was slightly
in debt was, that he had several calls upon him and did
not wish to appear to be in want of money. I did not like
to seem to encroach upon Major Murray's noble generosity
by asking him for extra money.
By Mr. Sleigh—Mr. Roberts introduced me to his wife
at the Surrey Gardens.
By the Coroner—l never dined with Major Murray in
presence of Mr. and Mrs. Roberts.
The witness, who gave her evidence in the most straight-
foriard manner, then retired, amidst the suppressed ap
louse of .the court, after having been upwards of three
hours under examination.
The proceedings were then adjourned for half an hour.
On the reassembling of the jury some letters addressed by
Mrs. Murray to the deceased were read. They were
couched in affectionate terms, and frequently adverted to
the happy days they had spent together. Letters of a simi-
lar character from Roberts to Mrs. Murray were read, in
which he spoke of his " absurd folly," and which also con-
tained expressions of love for her.
Mr. Painter, surgeon, of Brydges-street, said—l have re-
ceived a razor, a shirt, one towel, and two pairs of socks,
with marks upon them. The marks on the wearing appa-
rel are bl9od, The OA brown 0,11004c0 94 ate rag had

the appearance of blood. I took portions of it and placed
them on slides of glass in various solutions, and
examined them under the microscope this morn-
ing. No evidence of blood globules was discern-
ible. It was a substance on the razor not soluble in
water. Professor Taylor also agrees with me that the marks
on the razor were not those of blood.
Mrs. Murray (recalled)—The letter placed in my hand I
should think was written about two years and a half ago.
I had known Mr. Roberts at that time for 12 months.
About 10 months after he made the dishonourable proposal
to me. The letter was written from St. John's-wood, and
transmitted to Roberts through the post. He always ap-
peared to mistrust me. By that I mean that he always ap-
peared mistrustful ; that in the event of my wanting any
recreation I should prefer asking others to asking him.
The expressions of love in the letter were mere
craft. He had sent presents to the child, and I was
obliged to accept them through fear, though I would
much rather have refused them. Roberts had often said to
me, "If you would only say dear& to me I should be
satisfied ; for you are so cold to me, whilst you speak kindly
and warmly to others." For this reason I did write
" dear," but I was in debt to him, and I was in fear of his
exposing the circumstance that I had borrowed money of
him. Ido not disguise the fact that I wrote the ten ler ex-
pressions in the letter to please him. I never cared for him
at all. I was actually afraid of him.
By Mr. Humphreys —I was always in fear of Roberts, as
he was constantly asking me to go off with him.
The jury then proceeded to one of the upper wards of the
institution, when
Major Murray was examined.
On the oath being tendered him, he repeated audibly
"So help me God." He said—l live at 33, Holies-street,
and at Tottenham. I have sold out of the army. I was a
Major in the 10th Hussars. I know a little of what has
passed about this matter.
The Coroner having explained to Major Murray his
position.
The Major replied that he understood the position, and
he had nothing to keep or disguise. On Friday morn-
ing, the 12th, 1 left London-bridge by the penny boat
for Hungerford. I left London-bridge about half-past
eleven; as I was going down the righthand side of the mar-
ket a man came up to me from behind on my left hand side
and said, I believe lam speaking to Major Murray. I said
yes, that is my name, and he then said I believe you are a
director of the Grosvenor Hotel Company. I said yes, and
pray who are you ? He said his name was Grey. I never
saw the man before. I asked him how he knew me, and
he said from seeing me at the public meetings of the cam-
pany. I asked him if he was a shareholder. He said no;
but he had a client who had a large. sum of money to lend,
and as he understood the company wanted money, his
client was anxious to get the investment. I said I have no
power in the matter, as lam only one of 10. But if you
give me your name and address, I'm going to the offices
this morning, and I will there mention what you wish. He
said that would do, but he would feel greatly obliged if I
would go to his office for a minute, as he had a few
other questions to put. I asked him where his
office was, and he said close round the corner. I then re-
peated to him that I was but one of ten, and that any ques-
tion I answered I did so without implying any zesponsi-
'bility on the company. He said he understood that
perfectly, but he would like to get an insight into what we
required. He then said, there's one thing I wish to ask
you at once, and that is, do the directors give any person
security in addition to the security of the building ? I said
—Decidedly not. Beyond our individual stakes in the
concern we give no security • mine is a heavy one. He
said—l know you are one of the largest shareholders in
the company. I told him there were several gentlemen had
as much as I had in shares, but I believed I was
correct in saying lam one of the largest shareholders. By
this time we had got to his office or house, and •he asked
me to walk up, and showed me into a back room, and
pointing to a chair told me to be seated. I had never been
in that house before. I took a seat, and he then said,
" Would you excuse me one moment," and left the room.
I sat in front of the table facing the window, with my back
nearly to the folding doors, which were shut. When he
left the room I took a look, and thought it appeared to be
the most extraordinary place I had- ever seen. Torn up
paper, broken bottles, and other things, lying about in all
directions. He then came in and took a seat in front of
me, and took a pen in his hand and said, " I should be glad
to know what interest you would give. I said I was not is
a position to say; I would hear what his client would
take. He said—Oh, then the offer is to come from us. I
said, certainly not, for under any circumstances we should
not give more than 5 per cent. He said that would do very
well; and I then asked him for his card of address. He
said, immediately. He got up, went to a square sort of desk,
and began rummaging about the papers. I thought he was
looking for his card-case and took no notice of what he was
doing. Presently I felt a slight touch on the head, a report
of a pistol, and fell off the chair on to the floor. I felt per-
fectly paralysed. I could not move my hands or feet—my
head alone was perfectly clear. When he fired the pisto
I think heleat the room, but can't be certain of that. After
a little I felt returning life in my left arm. I was just
rising myself up on my arm when I heard a door open, and
he came in. He walked up behind me, fired a pistol into
my right temple, and I dropped back on the carpet, and
blood came out in a regular torrent. He knelt down over
me, for I could feel his breath, and watched to see if I was
dead. I pretended to be so. I felt life coming back, and I
felt a tingling all over my body. I knew if I could get on
my feet I should be able to make a fight for it. After
he knelt behind me for a short time he got up and
walked away. I then opened my eyes and looked, and saw
a pair of tongs a few inches from my hand. Feeling that
my strength had returned to me, and that there was the
whole length of the room between us, I seized the tongs
and sprung to my feet. He was then tending at the win-
dow. Hearing me get up, he turned round and faced me.
I rushed at him, and made a blow at him, which did not
take effect. I seized the tongs by the middle, and made a
dash into his chest and face, and knocked him over on his
back. As soon as he was on his back I got upon his chest
and tried to smash his head with the tongs, but he got hold
of them with both hands. I struggled for some time, but
finding he was as strong as I was I could not do it, so I
looked round to see if there was anything shorter I could
hit him with. Close to my right I saw a large black bottle,
which I took in my right hand, and seeing that he had
hold of the tongs, I hit him with the bottle right in the
middle of the forehead, which broke the bottle all to pieces.
That made him quiver all over, but it was not sufficient, so
I got hold of a metal vase, which I threw at him but missed
him. Then, as there was nothing else at hand, I set to
work to get the mastery of the tongs, which he was hold-
ing all this time. He was lying on his back close under the
window, After several strong wrench es and a good struggle
I got the tongs. As I got them I fell back, but was on my
legs in an instant again. By that time he was rising into
a sitting position, which gave me a fair, full blow at his
head with the tongs, which I gave him with all my might
and main. I repeated it three or four times. He had his head
down to avoid tine blow, and I then struck him across the back.
In order to disable his hands I hit over the wrists. I then
thought he was disabled, and tried to get out, but I found
the door locked. I was coming through the folding doors
when I met him coming towards me. I stepped back to get
the full swing of the tangs, and I struck him a blow on the
head, and he fell forward as if he was dead. Ho lay between
the two rooms. I took up his feet, and pushed them into
the front room, shut the door, and went to the window,
where I saw two men, whom I told I was being murdered
and asked to come to my assistance. I had one leg out on
the widow sill. They called out they would come if I
opened the door. At first I was inclined to do so, but
then I thought that for men who had heard pistol shots,
and to take no notice, they might be in league with the
murderer, so I did not choose to trust them. As I heard
tisem coming up I looked through the window to see my
best means of escape. I first tried to get down a square
wooden pipe, but found I had not strength to do so. I
then hung on the window silllwith my hands, put my feet
ou :the window frame beloiv, and took my measure
for a spring upon two wicker baskets below. I
succeeded in getting on to them and clambered over
the wall of the next house, went through the passage and
got into the street. I saw a policeman standing on the op-
posite side of the street, and told him to go in and take
charge of a man who had been attempting to murder
me, bent he said that he could not. He said he
was watching the house, but would send for assist-
ance. A gentleman then came up, and he told
me I was badly wounded, and that I had better get surgical
aid. I Was taken to a chesnut shop in Hungerford-market,
and from there I came here. No angry words passed be.
tween us before the encounter. I have not the wildest
notion as to what could have been his motive.
1 never htd a conversation with the man, good, bad,
or indifferent. I did not know there was such a man in
existence.
By Mr. Humphreys—lt was an ordinary kind of chair.
I don't recollect anyone taking held of my coat. I don't
think I lost mach blood from my wounds. I think what
I did lose brought life back to me. I recollect in the early
part of this year receiving an anonymous letter. I burnt
it. I showed it to a gentleman named Thomas. It reflected
on the character of another man, and offered to give me in-
formation. As it was anonymous I put it in the fire. I
think it wanted me to meet the writer near some archway
about Spring-gardens. The person mentioned was one of
the directors of the Grosvenor Hotel Company. I received
the letter at the Aresy and Navy Club.
By Mr. Sleigh—l never saw Mr. Roberts at the Grosve-
nor Hotel. I never heard or knew anything about Roberts
before his decease. What I have heard about this matter
has been communicated to me by my friends. The con-
versation was carried on while I stood, the remainder took
place as we were going to the house. I did not hesi-
tate to accompany Roberts. Northumberland-street
is a very respectable street, and I did not dream
of an attempt on my life at 12 o'clock in the
day. The only question he asked me while we were at the
table was about the interest for the loan. I did not scream
out when I was shot. I never tried my voice ; and when
you, sir, have to fight for your life I advise you to
fight in silence, and not to lose your power in talking.
It is the first time that I ever was engaged in such at
murderous encounter. When I threw the metal vase at
him, Roberts said—" That won't do Master Will
When I hit him with the tongs he said—" Give me fair
play." The first actual blow I gave him was from the
bottle. I pushed him down, if -you call that striking,
while he had hold of the tongs. The tongs were broken
by the blows I dealt Roberts. During the encfoun. ter I made no
alarm, and all he said was, give me air play. Mrs.
Murray knew the fact that the company wished to raise a
loan. I only used one bottle in the struggle.
By Mr. Humphreys—l had had conversation with Mrs.
Murray about the Hotel Company. I used to talk to her
about the business when I got home. I bsed to make ob-
servations as to how our loan was getting on, whether
favourable or otherwise.
Mr. Humphreys—Then what you did was simply to pre-
serve your own life ?
Major Murray—What I did I did to preserve my life.
If I had not got the better of him I was a dead man for
certain. I felt my only hope was in getting the better of
him.

Mr. J. T. Dark—l am secretary of the Grosvenor Hotel
Company. Major Murray is one of the directors, of which
there are 10. I never saw the deceased present at any of
our meetings. Major Murray had no power of negotiating
a loan. No director has any power to do so.
By Mr. Sleigh—l never saw the deceased before. I saw
him when the jury viewed his body, but I am confident
Roberts was never present at a board meeting. No one but
the directors were present on those occasions.
Reginald Dudley—l am a medical student at the hospital.
I was at the bedside of Major Murray when young Mr.
Roberts said he had never seen him before. I head
Major Murray distinctly say to the young man, "have you
ever seen me before," and he replied, "never." The major
asked him whether he knew that his father had, and he said
no, not to his knowledge.
Mr. Hobson, Mr. Hoskins, Mr. Day, and Mr. Stevens,
medical students of the hospital, stated they were round the
bed of Major Murray when he was:first brought. They
each heard young Mr. Roberts deny all knowledge of Major
Murray.
Mrs. Roberts widow of the deceased, said—On the day of
the occurrence f met my son William on the stairs of 16,
Northumberland-street. He told me Major Murray had
inflicted the injuries on his father, and that
he had seen him before. I was taken to
Major gurray's bedside iA the hospital. I said What