The Sun.
London, England, 1835-09-01 00:00:00

ianguage only as would have proved palateable to a majority
unju-st
of this Ho
tha use Nothing could be more dangerous or more
n to attempt to limit counselln the choice of that
,
eon
...se, or in the use of those expressions,
consider, it for the interest of their cliental() take tir to advance.
alley
alk; but havine.
~ might, if they which they Might
pleased, have refusta to hear counsel at
P permitted them to appear at their bar,
A
held it to h'e indisputable (and in this assertion he ieeas sa-
tisfied he would be supported by every member ti the profes-
il3n) that no counsel would exercise the privilege of pleading
if interruptions were permitted, or if it were allowed n the
tribunal before whom he was suffered to plead, en accusations,
too, affecting judicial rigt
they should be bound o
hts, to delineate the exact course which
pursue.—(Hear, hear.) There
had bee; he need scarcely tell the Noble Lord, former
Periods at which bills of
pains and penalties were brought
before the House of Lords,- and at which the NOble
Lord must admit that it would have been exceedingly
difficult to have such a course as that which he had appeared
to recommend adopted. It was only consistent with the main-
lierianee of that principle of free discussion which was inter-
the en, with the privileges attached to all our institutions, and
absence of which was, in point of fact, the establishment of
a censorship, that the counsel who were allowed to plead with
respect to this measure at the bar of the
House of Lords should
oebe ad mitted a free choice of the topics which they might think
xpedient to introduce, and that the language in which they
fieereyed their opinions should be as uncontrolled as passible.
Hear, hear.) Let him intreat the Noble Lord, and the
ajority of that House, to set against any language which
it.poarttheto the
counsel might have used, the fact, that in deference m great
wishes of the House of Commons, many Members
°f the other House of Parliament waived individual objections
prinei:sl; and that notwithstanding the amendments with
-eSPect to many of the details of the measure, two great
control of the Bill were sanctioned, namely, popular
Irs.over the council, and their annual jlectionsa..
he•ewatas ) It was hardly' necessary, then, for the Noble
°rd. to have made any apologies for the concessions which
rwieileliiipligestoof make, when he bore in mind that these two
popular control and annual election had
9een confirmed by the House of Lords. d that
tue Noble Lord and the House of anionsCo should feel a
stra -__ •
neer inclination to regard in a favenrable light those amend-
(theMswic had been made by the Lords, and from which they
E. liottae of Commons) might, abstractedly speaking, be
r",ned to dissent, when they reflected that the Houae or
i° wsa habituated to take a different view of charters--
a remeal cheers from the Ministerial side)—yes, he re.
l'eatted, habituated to take a different view of charters
uatkind:ested rights, had relinquished those motives by which,
_s. r ordinary circumstances, they were actuated, from a
'de sir ant
establish, not only a good system of municipal
governthoent, but a system founded on such principles as
a Y thought the House of Commons would be likely to
-fsP,Tre•—(Hear, hear.) In estimating the amount of con-
that
'°.n be could nevr forget that. it was an impossibility
that
it Houses Houses should agree in every particular, and
et it leas , •
notning but intolerance and tyranny to deny
prateet her the power of recording a sound and deli.
e judo power
on the measures which were v. omitted to
„,„ir,eonaideration.—(Hear, hear.) It was but acting in
rocaa-kPilahee with the true dictates of wisdom for each House to
five such concessions as might be granted without the s.acri.
co of principle, and for both ',.0 join in the pursuit of that
t 0
attsrase which might lead to 'ale utmost mitigation of evil, and
Laeolue attainment of the greatest amount of good.—( Hear,
greari)est If we cannot effect that
.obje.ct, we must use our
not let
~Possible efforts to accomplish it ; but, above all, do
be right "s act on the presumptuous principle that we must
ietoloro and all others wrong, which was the foundation of
.ell '
ciple Ilea---(Cheers.) So much as to the general prin-
Letaa° the amendments which were made by the House of
ill the There was nothing, he was bound to admit, either
vthent et
:elle or temper of the Noble Lord's speech or in
(nightsobpositions which he laid down, o. r in those which he
suPposed afterwards to submit, which should pre-
amend e House of Lords from carefully reconsidering the
Re aellleats which they had introduced into this measure.
440Z:tilt to assert his own right of private judgment; but
I,houla 'ha" agreed to the amendments of the Lords or not, he
f
ueeisicas— ready and willing to consider them as the effect o Pare -51harrived at by a large majority of the other House of
Kell as a"t' He would then proceed to express his opinion as
PeSP,Is -„„",! coeld with respect to the more important pro.-
deeatia„"ineh the Noble Lord bad submitted for their eons!.
whieC" The first was with reference to the amendment
he shoal directed the selection of aldermen for life. He believed
altera,d most effectually (if he could do' anything towards
arrao""an) Promote the possibility of a perfectly honourable
dealt' gatnent on this subject by expressing clearly and deci-
fere il his own opinions on this amendment: As he said be-
or lee should with equal boldness express his concurrence in,
Noir objections to, the yiewe.which had been taken by the.
tato
._a Lord. On that principle, then, he did not hem der e) say that he did not consider the introduction of al-
ahor:e,n for life an improvement to the Bill.—Oluch
if n from both sides.) He felt bound further to say that
ti that„Proposal were made in the House, strong as his objec-
aa°,ns were to many parts of the Bill he did not think he could
did ° sueported such an amendment.—(Loud cheers.) He
lgri not believe that the selection of a certain number of exist-
. aldermen, to be elected by the existing councillors
I.l.;isting at least in some cases), and constituting them by
woolacieart of the new council, to the amount of one-fourth,
it a nuPly a distrust, without conveying any security ; and
leotPord'eared to him that' it would place those aldermen so se-
veil th for life in a permanent minority, and would counter-
secure'e° advantages of character and station which would
4 fo their return as members of the council, if placed upon
tile °ting with the rest of the community, but which, under
144°Posed arrangement, would be more than counterba-
tile eland rendered completely nugatory by the fact. that
the ermen were forced into the corporate body without
eag"nsent of the community whose affairs they were to ma-
-1.°.-.°7-(Chaera.) It seemed to him also, that the placing
anions ILe those aldermen to be selected by the existing councils
featn°l!gst the new bodies, was an act which was not in con-
'eaa laTtY with the general provisions of this measure..—( Cheer!. )
the" 'NobleoLord did not propose to do away altogether with
intended
,h..Zedents made by the House of Lords, but .
3.:0:11, certain number of the council should be elected for six
of ah-f-an alteration which, as it coincided with. the principle
the il Present amendment, was, in his opinion, one which
seeet "se of Lards ought to agree to.—( Cheers.). With re-
Nobleto the town-clerks, the amendment respecting whom the
lt kard seemed to consider of the greatest importance, he
axer°,b;latt to p • his disagreement from the opinions.
so fael.-;e" IV the Noble Lord. The Noble Lord was obliged
thert; ,e admit their vested interest in their office as to grant
Lordlllpn for the loss of it.
s la,
`°‘'"' i tHN RUSSELL was understood to say, that the
ta'mLyea-iefrr'osoilvere to receive compensation only in case of their
Sir R , office,
so reta•r; 'LEE L resumed—Yes, but was it not infinitely better.
to too 1 -mtel'a individual who was able to perform the duties
'a rem° ea-a, and t blige him to fulfil those duties, than
iTt,,lsl4v ail"elni for othoe purpose of making room for anothe!
a'' u° raid Sallie amount of salary would in all proobfahbits-
-81 eatioa wa' while the town-clerk who was deprived
of
a:tl)l..,:iitisatio'n%granted a considerable sum in the shape
the
He might refer to
y not --(Hear hear, hear.)
tai,llt:nority- ;p°. aI y of ;he. Noble Lora. but to the unanimous.
is poin.
..arliament, in confirmation of his opinion on
Wean, i '
,„ .•(:i lately as the year 1832, subsequently totethne.
aiy, ref n. rarliament, when a measure for the most ex .
nad 414:01 'no in the corporations of Scotland were introduced,iietnlea
B°l'e was fgh many of the principles on which t Pres, minded were more extensive than those of the
ta nt Bin
knowledge of
-e ,s, , Yet Probably from a provident
..
..
th.. watch eharacter, and the consequent conviction that
Perir;!l;zld infinitely prefer paying the existing clerk fors
tattoo Pig the duties of his office, to giving him comaaln:
plae_, for his remm al from it and putting another. in his
._
the eiiil%. h 0
should be paid the same salary, Parliament paid_
of 4 s' and merited compliment to the people of Scotland
Ow. Pr.essly providing that it would be lawful forthe town-
ration nho held office at the time the Bill came into ope-
he'o' , to continue to hold it ad vitant ant culpum.—( Hear,
apere-a. Ile came. not' to the third point in the Noble Lord's
jasti 1, and that \vas with respect to the nomination of the
it, pc.e,s• He considered the amendment of the House of Lords
advaln particular part of the Bill,. as one attended with great
teens As they sent the Bill from the House of Corn-
....eis these justices were Prrvesed to be invested by the
foroln %lib certain local jurisdiction, but that the candidates
,0 the office should be selected and nominated by the Town-
sai°,lll• It was argued that this practice was in conformity
arioeithet. ancient and' continued practice of Corporations, by
ta(4 he justices were always chosen and appointed ; but
0i...a. who took this view of the subject forget that by the an-
ii:nt; practice the magistrates were really es officio, for the
oar rs which constituted the Corporations were granted by
eat Croton, and under these charters they were enabled to
feria: Viejo, Ly the appointment of they
and by con-
Ilia, f on hem judicial functions.—( Hear, hear.) By this
Poweao,wQver, as it pa.ssed the Commons, the council was em-
lCsownw to present a certain number of individuals to the
ice .I.i, and to confine the Crown in its selection to the por-
lett),
,' 'an]. they had chosen. A most invidious task was thus
aliaird on the Crown, of rejecting a certain number of those
tli,
u'n'ted
.for appointment. He thought, therefore, that
%Pa, •res.tricted choice which was now altswed to the Crown
it, that preferable ; and that they might depend upon.
alto , a,t where responsibility devolved at all, it was infi-
rest
u better that it should be undivided than that it should
ws
ato "11 tw
a o separate parties. He must say, then, that it
tilos arse which was more respectful to the Crown, and
that°,likely to ensure a judicious selection of magistrates,
lie..itntu,e choice should be perfectly free, and not restricted to a
er,e,i`q number nominated ba, the town-council.—( Hear.) He
are; °gyred it quite right that the management of, and controul
iah,.; tocal affairs Should be entrusted to those chosen by the
anoalottants ; but it did not necessarily follow that justice
eientn be better administered by those who owed their appoint-
eaa,, ro the men, on whose rights and property they were
aestaua la adjudicate. This power was, in his opinion, propery
eeesvi; in the Crown, which was constitutionally and justly
tliai .acted the fountain of all justice. With respect to the
proas'_°,n of the towns into wards, he saw no objection to the
in of caf the Noble Lord on this head, by which the King
1114 barn'l was empowered to sanction the award of the revis-
at,
t},sri.sters. He considered it truly desirable that in matters
teacii , important nature a power to amend or alter decisions
elerl'_
,I,l_.revising bairisters, who might he frequently young
Ralnt°:_, little practical knowledge on such subjects, should be
adhe,on to the King in Council. The Noble Lord proposed to
that
)ato the principle of qualification, though by what mode
reserieellnailile should be carried into operation he intended. to
of I,ooo7ntil to-morrow, lie apprehended that the qualification
°f the ' large places, and 3001, in small places for members
Baca( council, a, .
, Wollia be agreed to. With respect to that qua-
to becorl which was proposed, by making those only eligible
TLenbers of the tow:a-cow-leil who holonged to the