The Sun.
London, England, 1859-07-25 00:00:00

THE SUN, LONDON, MONDAY EVENING, JULY 25, 1859.

GREAT WESTERN RAILWAY.
CHEAP EXCURSION to BATH and BRISTOL—On
Saturday, July 30th, a Train will leave the Paddington Sta-
tion at 6 40 p.m., returning on Monday, August Ist, from
Bristol at 5 30 p.m., and Bath at 6 p.m. Fares there and
back : Bristol, 14s. and 7s ; Bath, 12s and 68.

aREAT WESTERN RAILWAY.
to CHEAP EXCURSION to OXFORD, HUNGER-
FORIV&c. On Sunday, July 31, a Train will leave Pad-
dingto at 745 a.m., for Reading, Theale, Aldermaston,
Woolhampton, Thatcham, Newbury, Kintbury, and Hunger-
ford (Fares, ss. (Id., 45., and 35.) ; Pangbourne, Goring, Wal-
lingtord-road, Didcot, Culham, Abingdon, and Oxford (Fares,
68. Gd., 55.. and 45.), returning the same evening from Oxford
at 7 o'clock, and intermediate Stations as per handbills.

GREAT WESTERN RAILWAY.
Notice is Hereby Given, That the next HALF-
YEARLY GENERAL MEETING of the Proprietors of this
Company will be held, pursuant to Act of Parliament, in Lon-
don, at the Paddington Station, on FRIDAY, the 12th day
of August next, for the general purposes of business ;
And for the appointment of an Auditor in the place of
Richard Atkinson, Esq., who has notified his intention to re-
tire from that office.
The chair will be taken at One o'clock precisely.
SHELBURNE, Chairman.
BARRINGTON, Deputy-Chairman.
The transfer books will be closed on the 28th July instant,
and will not be opened until after the said Half-yearly Gene-
ral Meeting on the 12th August.
London Terminus, Paddington,
22d July, 1859.

LONDON & SOUTH-WESTERN RAILWAY.
To ADVERTISING AGENTS, &c. The Directors
are prepared to receive tenders from parties willing to agree
for the use of the Surface of the ROAD ARCHES on the
Metropolitan Extension of this Railway, from the Bridge
over the Wandsworth-road, to that over Westminster-bridge-
road, for the purpose of exhibiting advertisements and pla-
cards, subject to conditions, the particulars of which may be
obtained upon application to the undersigned, on and after
the 30th Inst., who will receive Tenders up to Wednesday, the
10th August, 1859.—8 y Order. • L. CROMBIE, Secy.
Waterloo-bridge Station, July 23, 1859.

INTERNATIONAL LIFE ASSURANCE
SOCIETY, /42, Strand, London.

July 11, 1859.
Notice is Hereby Given, That the half-yearly interest on
the capital stock of the Society, at the rate of Five per Cent.
per annum, to 30th June last is now due, and in course of
payment at the Society's office, between the hours of 1$ and 3.
EDMOND S. SYMES, Chairman.
142, Strand, London, W.C.

THE LONDON.—The attention of Gentlemen
is especially drawn to the advantages offered in these
elegant and spacious Saloons, which fulfil all the require-
ments of a West-end club of the most aristocratic and exclu-
sive character.

Won trouve dans la Salle de Lecture non seulement les
meilleurs journeaux Anglais, macs aussi Allemand, Francais,
et Beige.

F. SAWYER, Proprietor, 191, Fleet-street.

THE LONDON.—S AW Y E R'S famous
LONDON DINNER, consisting* of two soups, two
fish, two entrees, oints, two sweets, cheese, and salad, at a
fixed charge of 2s. fid. (attendance, 3d.), is served from Two
till Eight in the spacious Saloon.
In the Coffee-room, Dinners from thejoint, with vegetables,
cheese, and salad, ls. 6d. (attendance 3d.), and soup, fish, en-
trées, &c., a la carte, are served from One till Nine o'clock.
Ladies' Private Rooms and Dining Saloons. Spacious and
well-ventilated Wine, Coffee, and Smoking Saloon.
An extensive and carefully selected stock of Rhenish, Mo-
selle, and other Wines, imported expressly for the London
Dinner. Open on Sundays from Four till
.Nine..

F. SAWYER, Proprietor, 191, Fleet-street

THE COMMERCIAL, 73, Cheapside.—This
Establishment Js now RE-OPENED, under the nvi-
nagement of Mr. R. Glover, from the London, Fleet-street.
Dinner off the Joint, in the Coffee-room, with Veeetables,
Bread and Cheese, Sze., Is. (id. The Commercial Dinner of
Soup, Fish, Entrées, Joints, Sweets, and Cheese, 2s. ad,
Ladies' Dining-room, with Female Attendant. Smoking
Saloon, The bast of everything at prices to suit the temper
of the times.

VINEGAR. Patronised by her Majesty's
Government.—CONDY'S PATENT PURE COIVCEN
TRATED 3TALT VlNEGAR.—Families, by using this de-
licious Vinegar, insure purity, and effect a saving of 50 per
cent. See Report of Dr. Letheby, City Officer of Health ;Dr
Hassall, of the " Lancet" Commission, and others. Sold by

the Trade, in bottles labelled and ealisuled. Whalesale, 63,
Kin c* William-street, London-bridge, E.C.—Six Quart Sample
sent free to any Railway for 3s. 6d.

ORNAMENTS for the Drawing-room, Library,
and Dining-room, consisting of a new and elegant
assortment of VASES, Figures, Groups, Candlesticks, Obe-
lisks. Tnkstands, beautiful inlaid Tables, Paperweights, &c.,
in Italian Alabaster, Marble, Bronze, Derbyshire Spar, &c.
Imported and manufactured by JAMES TENNANT, Mine-
ralogist to her Majesty, 149, Strand, London, W.C.
Mr. Tennant arranges elementary collections of SHELLS,
MINERALS, and FOSSILS, which will greatly facilitate the
interesting study of MINERALOGY, CONCHOLOGY, and
GEOLOGY, at 2,5, 10, 20, 50, to 100 guineas each.
PRACTICAL INSTRUCTION in GEOLOGY and MINE-
RALOGY is given by Mr. TENNANT, at 149, Strand.

ference for either. Under these circumstances, my
.Lords feel it to be impossible for them to give any
pledge at the present moment of recommending to
Parliament an advance of public money, either by
way of loan or grant for the purposes of Galway
harbour. At the same time my Lords would wish
to assure the memorialists of the deep tinterest
which they feel in this or any other undertaking
promoted by Irish enterprise, and considered likely
to benefit Ireland ; and the present inevitable post-
ponement of any decision must hot be taken as in-
dicating any indisposition on the part of her
Majesty's Government
,to give the application as
early and as favourable a consideration as circum-
stances will admit of.

" i am, Sir, your obedient servant,
" GEORGE ALEXANDER HAMILTON.
" To the Rev. Peter Daly, Imperial
- Hotel, Dublin.

COOLIE AND CHINESE IMMIGRATION
TO THE WEST INDIES.

A deputation from the British and Foreign Anti-
Slavery Society on this subject was received by the
Duke of Newcastle at the Colonial-office on Satur-
day last at 1 o'clock. The deputation was intro-
duced by Lord Brougham, and consisted of the fol-
lowing gentlemen, viz. :—Mr. E. Baines, M.P., Mr.

F. Crossley, M.P., Revs. Dr. Carlile, H. Richard,
Dr. Burns, W. G. Barrett, W. Owen, Dr. Hodgkin,
Dr. N. Shaw, Mr. Consul M‘Leod , and Messrs. J.
Candler, S. Sturge, T. Harvey, Geo. Thompson, S.
Bourne, W. Janson, W. Allen, J. Jowitt, jun., F.
W. Chesson, Jos. Cooper, J. R. Birchett, Josiah
Forster, E. Miles, T. Norton, Thos. Clark, J. H.
Gladstone, A. K. Isbister, R. Forster;J. Fitzgerald,
and L. A. Chamerovzow.

Mr. CHAMEROVZOW, secretary to he society, said
that the memorial which it was 10th,t, y to read to
his Grace was passed at a public meeting held on
the 13th cf this month, Lord Brougham in the
chair, when a resolution was also passed that his
lordship should sign the memorial on behalf of the
meeting and of the Fritish ind Foreign Anti-Sla-
very Society, which originated it.
Mr. CHAMEROVZOW then read the memorial.

Lord BROUGHAM said he need not enter further

into the subject than to remind his Grace of what
passed in the House of Lords both last session and
this. The object was inqu:ry, because there were
many things asserted by one side and denied by
the other, and until there was an investigation it
was impossible to tell on which side the truth lay.
For his part he had no doubt on which side it lay;
but there was no way of convincing the world but
by inquiry. They might be right only to a certain
extent, and inquiry might modify their opinions.
An incident had occurred at the late meeting which
had not been mentioned in the papers. A gentleman
suppoSed to, be adverse to the opinions of the
meeting wished to be heard, and there was a dispo-
sition not to hear him ; but he, as chairman, in-
sisted on his being heard respectfully, the more so
that he differed from the meeting; and the result
was that he was not only attentively, but even
kindly heard. The gentleman's statement was a very
clear one, and Mr. Chamerovzow answered it; that
fact showed that they were disposed to hear both
sides. As to the mode of proceeding, the memorial
asked for a committee; but he feared there was no
time for it. A week or ten days would not suffice
for this inquiry, and his grace should therefore con-
sider whether there was not another course to take,
such as by a commission.
The Duke of NEWCASTLE said that before refer-
ring to the proposal for a commission perhaps he
would be allowed to make a few remarks on the
memorial, though he did not wish either to contra-
dict its statements or to express an opinion in a
dogmatic spirit, but rather with a view to elicit
truth. He thought they were misled in some of their
representations. With respect to the number of im-
migrants being unlimited, they would find, upon
inquiry, that was not so, but that the number was
regulated by the governors of the different colonies.
If the fact were as stated, it was an irregularity of
which he should be glad to be informed. As regarded
Africans, they were, he thought, entirely mistaken ;
practically the importation of Africans to the Bri-
tish colonies had entirely ceased for some years.
The statement of the immigration of the Chinese
at the public expense was also incorrect ; it was at
the expense of the parties interested. Lord
Brougham the other day stated very coraectly in
the House of Lords that it wa3 partly at the ex-
pense of the labourers, whose labour was interfered
with by the immigration ; but he had seen a few
days ago a curious statement from one of the colo-
nies—Jamaica, he believed—that there the opera-
tion had been a very singular one. The greater
proportion of the emancipated slaves in Jamaica,
preferring to keep a piece of ground of their own
and grow vegetables, found au additional market
for their produce by the introduction of these immi-
grants, and among a great portion of them a feel-
ing that it was beneficial was beginning to grow
up. As to the mortality, that
was muchy, there
greater was n
toh denyingan
be if proper care was taken • but he did not think
they had a right to charge ;hese isolated instances
in some ships it ough t t o
against the system. We had precisely the same
difficulty to contend with in the emigration of
labourers from this country, which had been at-
tended with almost as fearful a loss of life as had
attended the immigration into the colonies. He
thought they w iuld find that the mortality upon
an average did not Exceed 5 or 6 per cent. on board
the ships, and the amount was not so much in the
islands. As to the disproportion between the sexes,
that was a most important point, and required
further correction ; but in many of the ships which
had gone out of late the proportion would be some-
thing like eight to ten. He did not mean that that
was like the proportion of the whole, but only that
the evil was in progress of correction. There was
another very important charge, that those immi-
grants received no moral or spiritual instruction.
If that was the case practically it was certainly not
so legislatively,.and so far as the information of the
office went a very different state of things ought to
exist. He knew that ordinances had been sent out
instituting schools for those immigrants, and, if
they had been dead letters, there was a very strong
argument indeed for the suppression of the system.
That her Majesty's Government could hardly re-
monstrate with other Powers was an argument
that ,would hardly hold good, for surely there
was a great difference • between the immigration
of labourers into the British colonies and into
slave colonies such as Cuba. He was not aware
that the charge against British ships was correct,
but, if so, it had nothing to do with the British
colonies or the system, thought it might be a matter
for the interference of the Legislature to stop it.
The introduction of labourers, however, into free
states and slave states could not be compared, be-
cause in the latter they must necessarily become
slaves, and can never return, whereas from our
states they certainly do return, and the regulations
by which they are returnable have been rigidly
enforced. As to the question of inquiry, it would be
impossible to have a committee at this period of the
session, but, apart from that, he had great doubts
as to the utility of inquiry by a committee. It would
be impossible to bring over the governors of colo-
nies, while still more important would be the evi-
dence of some of the planters themselves, who would
not come, or, if they did, it would be at Very great
expense and inconvenience, which would not be
justifiable if the information could be-obtained in
any other way. We had a great deal of information
already. Nothing was concealed from Parliament,
and the Emigration Commissioners, he knew from
his own personal knowledge; were most anxious to
prevent any abuse in connection with the scheme.
We had, then, very considerable power of supervi-
sion and an immense amount of information, which
was annually laid before Parliament, but if further
inquiry were necessary he thought it would be far
better that it should take place by a commission.
But what he thought would answer every purpose
still better was, if some of the gentlemen present
would assist him in drawing up questions which
would be sent out, and he would undertake that
they would be answered by persons of authority in
the colonies, and they could also be sent to other
persons to whom it might be thought proper to send
them.

Mr CHAMEROVZOW, on the part of the deputa-
tion, replied that it would be seen from the enact-
ments that the number of Indians, Chinese, and Af-
ricans was unlimited. These enactments did not de-
fine the number to be introduced, but left it to the
discretion of the Governors; therefore, practically
there was no limitation, inasmuch as the governor,
with the consent of the planters, might introduce
as many as he thought proper. With reference to
Africans not being imported, there, he believed,
his grace was in error, for reference to the Jamaica
Bill would show that there was a clause in it by
which Africans were permitted to be imported.
The Duke of NEWCASTLE said what he meant was
that no Africans had been introduced. He would
not undertake to say that it was not authorised by
the Act, but he would state positively that for five
imported.
Mr. six years none had been •
Mr. CIIAHEROVZOW said that 300 Africans had

I been introduced two years,ago upon the captureof
the ship Arab; but the objection of the society was
that African immigration was thrown open to our
colonies while the Government strenuously opposed
it on the part of the Emperor of the French. Chi-
nese had been introdncedinto British Guiana, while
the expense was defrayed only to a certain extent by
the planters, as appeared from the proceedings of
the Court of Policy, the planters having to pay two
thirds and the public one-third. With regard to
Jamaica, £30,000, or one-eighth of the entire re-
venue, was absorbed in the interest on the guaran-
teed loan and the sinking fund for immigration
purposes, out of a debt of £913,000, £400,003, or
nearly one-half, had been incurred for immigration.
And as the labouring coloured population was as
24 to 1 of the white, they had to pay largely towards
defraying the amount of the sinking fund and the
burden of the debt. The bulk of the coffee produced
in Jamaica was grown by the people who were for-
merly staves ; a great part of the sugar and other
commodities were also grown by them, and so far
from its being correct that they were not taxed for
this immigration, 12 per cent. of their small income
was taken from them. Supposing them to be em-
ployed every day at ls. a-day, it was as though
the planter put his hand into the pocket of those
people and took away £2 out of the £l6 which
they earned. With regard to the mortality in the
immigratiOn from China, it varied from 17 to 60

per cent. So long as immigration was perfectly
' free, as from China to California, the mortality was
' almost nothing. But in China it was the slave
trade in disguise, as appeared from the published
statements of Sir John Bowring. With regard to
the mortality in the islands, it was stated to be 35
per cent. in five years by Sir E. B. Lytton, while
the society set it down as 50 per cent. ; but even
admiting the statement of Sir E. B. Lytton to be
correct, it would be found that Coolie labour was
more destructive to life than the slave labour of
Cuba. With regard to the proportion of the sexes,
his grace was right to a certain extent ; it was true,
he believed, with regard to Mauritius, but he would
refer to the blue-book to show that it was not true
as regarded our West India colonies. It appeared,
too, from a discussion in the Court of Policy that
the Governor stated that unless the proportion
were corrected he would not permit the continuance
of the immigration. He did not see how, so long
as our Government sanctioned a system of fraud
and violence, we could remonstrate with the French
Government for attempting to carry out a similar
system. With regard to the mode of inquiry; it had
appeared to the committee that it would be a very
desirable thing to have the evidence of many pe! sons
now in this country, such as Lord Elgin and Sir John
Bowring, and that much good might be done, even
though the committee sat but a short time. But he
had not the slightest faith in a commission sent out
to the West Indies unless one member of it should
b appointed by the Government, another by the
slavery party, and another by the society. It had
been found almost impossible to obtain accurate in-
formation, so that unless the commission was armed
with extraordinary powers he could scarcely hope
much good would result from it. But with respect
to the suggestion of his Grace, he thought it de-
serving of their best consideration, because, if they
could obtain replies, they would be put into the
position of ;,btaining what they wanted, which was
a fair and impartial inquiry.
Mr. J. COOPER called his Grace's attention to the
fact which he had ascertained, that the freight and
passage-money of Coolies from India to Cuba were
frequently insured in British ships.
The Duke of NEWCASTLE desired that Mr. Cooper
would send him some facts, though the matter did
not properly concern the Colonial-office, nor had he
any power over the Government of Cuba.
Mr. J. COOPER also said it was believed that it
was to the introduction of the 500 Africans into
the Mauritius in 1856 that the origin of that
French scheme which was so much regretted in
this country Was owing.
Dr. HODGKIN said that the mortality which took
place in the ships and when the labourers arrived
did not represent the whole; a very great deal of
it took place before they left their own country.
He had been informed by a gentleman who had re-
sided in China that parts of the rivers were ren-
dered offensive by the number of the bodies of these
poor creatures. That was so lately as the year
before last. With regard to the Chinese, at least,
he had heard that it was almost impossible to ob-
tain a proportionate number of women. With re-
gard to the immigration from the West, Coast of
Africa, the experiment had been carried.out as far
as it could, and the Liberians complained bitterly
of the attempt to obtain free labourers from that
interesting past of the country.
Mr. T. H. GLADSTONE could bear testimony
with respect to British ships being employed in
taking labourers to Cuba, for he was in that island
two years ago. In 1.856 British ships were fre-
quently seen entering the ports with those labourers
on board; but the ships principally employed were
American. He could also speak as to the length of
service obtained from the negro population and the
Coolies. The slaves did not live on an average
longer than ten ,years after being set upon full
work, b,ut with the Coolies and Chinese the dUra-
ticm of life was still less. Almost the entire of
those introduced ten years ago were now dead.
Again, as to the disparity of the sexes in Cuba, he
did not see a single Cainese woman there, while he
saw, perhaps, some thousand Chinese men.

The Duke of NEWCASTLE said that he had al-
luded to the Indians. He was quite aware of the
fact as regarded the Chinese.
Mr. GLADSTONE made inquiries as to what had
induced them to come to the West Indies, and some
of them said that they were told they would go to
a country where there were rivers of gold. A Cali-
fornia was pictured to them. All this referred
simply to Cuba.
Mr. G. THOMPSON said that, from what he had
had heard, it was likely that the Coolies in India
were duped in a similar manner. Two years ago,
when in Calcutta, he had some conversation, with
respect to the mode of obtaining men from the
country above Calcutta, with a person who had
some years before been engaged in shipping Coolies,
and who had made some £17,000 by the trade. He
employed persons to bring them to town and keep
them there, and had also a profit on the kit which
the Coolie took with him. The impression left
upon his mind by what lie had heard was that the
Coolie was totally incapable of understanding the
nature of the contract which he was invited to
make. He knew nothing of geography—even the
Brahmin knew nothing of geograph; ; ke knew
nothing of the value of the money of the country to
which he was going ; knew nothing of the distance,
nor of the nature of the labour he would have to
perform. It was represeuted to him that many of
them when brought down to Calcutta, got some
idea of the matter, and, if in consequence they
manifested any disinclination to go, then substitutes
were found to pass the emigration agent and
answer all the questions, and subsequently, by
some manoeuvre, the real men were shipped. This
personation was carried on by the same individuals
as long as it was considered safe, and then new
substitutes were found. It was, therefore; neces-
sary to have such supervision at the place of ship-
ment as would prevent this practice. Then, when
the Coolie reached our colonies he had no one to
communicate with him, and many of them became
subject to the most frightful diseases, of which we
had no idea, arising from that mental state to which
they were reduced.

Mr. J. FORSTER, a a member of the Anti-Slav-
ery Society, must observe that he was a little shaken
at seeing the memorial so much called in question
by the Duke of Newcastle, but if the case was
made out with regard to the 500 Africans ad-
mitted into the Mauritius it would be acknow-
ledged that the committee was borne out. The
committee, the Duke of Newcastle, and the Govern-
ment stood pledged in heart to the fair carrying
out of the abolition of the slave trade in the West
Indies. It was their moral duty with reference to
the liberated Africans, their clients as he might
call them, to see whether their interests were suffi-
ciently protected by the admission of the Coolies ;
also, whether the plea of want of labour was fairly
and adequgtely made out,; and whether the whole
system, if fairly and candidly investigated, could in
a moral point of view be justified.
It was then agreed that Lord Brougham should
communicate with his Grace before the session was
over with respect to drawing out questions, and the
deputation withdrew.

Having retired to the-waiting-room,
Lord BROUGHAM said, that he should give to his
Grace the names of some 14 or 15 gentlemen now
in this country who were prepared to tender im-
portant evidence, and 'recommended his Grace to
appoint some person to receive it, with a view to
putting his Grace in possession of the information
which they might otherwise, from circumstances, be
unable to give at a future time.
It was moved by Dr. OARLILE, seconded by Mr.
G. THOMPSON, and carried unanimously, that the
secretary to the society should make a commutnica-
don to the Duke of Newcastle to that effect.
The proceedings then terminated.