The Sun.
London, England, 1832-03-13 00:00:00

IRISH EDUCATION.

The Archbishop of ARMAGH presented three peti-
tions from various parts of Ireland against the new plan
of national education. They were signed not only
by Protestant dissenters, but by. Members of the Church
Establishment. The Right Rev. Prelate was of opinion
t".;at no plan of religious education could be effectual which
authorised the Scriptures, or portions of them, to be with-
held from the children.

Earl of ELDON, in rising to bring forward the motion of
which he had given notice, said—it might be the opinion of
many of their lordships that he would have acted with more
discretion if he bad taken no notice of the imputations
which had been cast upon his character in another place;
however, it was not in accordance with his feelings
to be silent, and he hoped he would be able to lay such
facts before their Lordships as would make them
accede to the motion with which he intended to con-
clude.—(Hear.) He had served his King for upwards
of forty years, and during that long time he had
acted so as to satisfy his own conscience. He had
never coveted the place of Chancellor—he could assure their
Lordships opposite, that he had never thought of any thing
higher than the office of the Chief Justiceship of the Com-
mon Pleas, where he would have been content to have
remained during his life; but he had found it im-
possible to attain his wish, consistent with the duty which
he owed to his Sovereign. He had been charged with
making the high office of Chancellor subservient to the
making provision for his family—this he totally denied—
he had been accused of making no less than six places
for his son. II; never made use of the appointment with
which he was charged. There were two reversionary
places which he was solicited by his late Sovereign
Giorge 111. to take them for himself, but he had de-
clined, and the papers which he meant to move for,
would prove that he had taken them for his son,
at the express solicitation of his King. The appointments
were not wade when he became Chancellor, but some
time in the year 1805, after he had been in office
four years. Neither of these offices had yet become vacant,
nor did he consider them of any value further than as
being a mark of his Majesty's favour. In the year 1813
it was the pleasure of Parliament to create the office
of Vice Chancellor. On the creation of that office,
had, he, Lord Eldon, he would ask consulted his
own interest ? The fixed salary of the Lord
Chancellor was five thousand pounds per annum,
and immediately after the creation of the Vice Chancery-
ship, he (Lord E.) gave up 2,5001. a-year out of the 5,000/.
This he had done from 1813 until 1827, when he quitted
office. More tban that, for the sante number of years he
bad given up upwards of 1,8001. a.year in order to in-
crease the salaries of persons connected with the Bankrupt
office. Lord Lauderdale held an office for three lives, the
last life expiring in 1818 or 1819. He (Lord Eldon) was
pressed by several persons to fill up the office, which he
refused to du). Notwithstanding this, be had been held out
day by day, as being influenced by nothing but the love of
lucre. With respect to the offices which he had given
his son, three-fourths of the benefit of those offices
he never could enjoy, and with respect to the rest, the
emoluments to be derived from them would never
reimburse him for that expenditure which his father had
been at, for the purpose of establishing the offices to which
he had alluded. If he bore not an unspotted character
in the country, it was not his fault—be had done
every thing to acquire one. He begged pardon of the
House for having detained them so long on a subject personal
to himself. A slur, however, had been passed on his cha-
racter, which be was anxious to remove. He trusted there-
fore the House would indulge him by granting his request,
that the returns made to the House of Commons in 1822,
with respect to the Lord Chancellor's emoluments, he
communicated to the House. It it bad been found that
he had acted properly during the time he was
Chancellor, he trusted the House would rescue him
from the imputations that had been cast upon his charac.
ter. (The Noble Earl throughout this speech was heard
hut imperfectly below the bar.)
The Marquis of CLANRICARDE found in the journals
of the day a speech attributed to the Right Hon. G.
Dawson, consisting entirely of an attack upon his Noble
and Learned Friend ; and the chief complaint of the Right
Hon. Gentleman seemed to be, that Lord Plunkett and
his family annually absorbed 27,850/. of the public
money. His Noble and Learned Friend was, in the first
place, accused of being Lord Chancellor of Ireland, and re-
ceiving the salary of that office. The Noble and Learned
Lord was next charged with having appointed his son,
Mr. P. Plunket, to the situations of purse-bearer, with a
salary of 8001., and of secretary of bankruptcy, with a
salary of 9001. It was true, and it was certainly very
extraordinary, that Lord Plunket did make his son purse-
bearer, and secretary of bankruptcy; but it was utterly
untrue that the emoluments of those places were of the
amount described, It had also been stated, that that
gentleman received as counsel to the chief remembrancer
350/. a-year ; whereas there was no salary attached to the
office ; the income, which seldom exceeded 1001., solely
depending on fees paid for actual. work done. Mr. D.
Plunket was described as drawing 1,5001. as prothono-
tary df the Common Pleas, and 1001. as examiner of the
Common Pleas. He believed he was right in Saying that
this place of examiner was not in existence at all. The
two offices had been consolidated, and the amount
of money received by Mr. D. Plunket was 1,3801.,
instead of 1,5001. Then followed a list of clerks
and assistants, whom the Commissioners of Inquiry
into Courts of Justice in Ireland had declared
to be necessary; and though not one of them
had been appointed by Mr. D. Plunket, yet the whole of
their incomes was put down as money drawn from the
public by the Plunket family. It was strange how the
Right Hon. Gentleman could have so misrepresented the
facts of the Hon. John Plunket's emoluments, for Mr.
Kemmis, the Right Hon. Gentleman's own brother-in-
law, could have informed him that it was he that enjoyed
the emoluments which the Right Hon. Gentleman would
persuade the public were possessed by Mr. John Plunket.
—(Hear.) A still more flagrant misrepresentation was
the assertion of the Right lion. Gentleman, with reference
to Mr. Al‘Causland. The Right lion. Gentleman stated
that that gentleman, the brother-in-law of Lord Plunket,
was in the receipt of 1,5001. per annum of the public
money, all owing to the abused patronage of the Lord
Chancellor. Their Lordships, perhaps, would be surprised
to learn that Mr. M'Causland did not recive a single shil-
ling of the public money, nor derive any official emoln-
ment through Lord Plunket whatever—(Hear)—and that
the item thus, with artful malevolence, placed to the debit
side of l.ord Plunket's public character, was nothing less
actually than an estimate of the possible profits of the
house of M'Causland and Company, the solicitors.—Hear.)
And so the mere accident of a relative of Lord Plunket's
deriving a
good income from his profession, is represented
to the public as an abuse of official patronage by that Noble
and Learned Lord.—(Hear, hear.) Was there ever such
a flagrant instance of party spleen and party misrepresen-
tation Then let them consider the other items
—that charging Lord Plunket with having bestowed the
deanery
of Down, worth 1,2001. a-year, upon his son
Thomas, and the vicarage of Bray, worth 8001. a-year,
upon his son Edward. But why was it artfully left out
that Mr. John Plunkett gave up a very profitable living
which he had held for eleven years with exemplary dili-
gence, on his promotiou,—conduct not exactly parrallel to
that of the holder of a much richer deanery,—that of St.
Patrick, held by a Gentleman who also held a large living
in Kilkenny, Then Mr. E. -Plunket's emoluments wereaot fully 400/. a-year, and he besides held but half the
living of Bray, the other half being held by. his co-curate,
under thi late vicar. And yet these Rev. Geutlemen were
represented
as revelling in the public money. Indeed, Mr.

(PRICE 7D.)

Dawson's doctrine on this head was somewhat strange ;
for he spoke of the emoluments of the Rev. Messrs. Plun-
ket as so much misappropriation of " public property."
So, then, he has discovered that church property is public
property—he, who is no radical, nor dissenter, has found
out that this " public property" should be interfere-] with
for the public advantage..—(Hear.) To such lengths did
the Right Hon. Gentleman's seal, against two clergyman
whose only crime was their being the sons of Lord Plun-
ket, lead his disinterested and benevolent spirit f The
Right Hon. Gentleman forgot, besides, that these revellers
in the public funds were in the exercise of these spoliating
functions some two years ago, under an administration
which had the incalculable advantage of the Right Hon.
Gentleman's own services. Then Lord Plunket had
been denounced a " political judge," and as having
thrown on the shoulders of the Irish Master of the
Rolls duties which ought to have been discharged by
himself; while the facts, the very reverse, that
a single case had been heard, or, indeed, accord-
ing to the construction of the two Courts in Ireland,
could be heard in the Rolls Court which belonged to the
Chancellor's immediate jurisdiction—(Hear, hear)--and
but one appeal had been made from the Irish Court of
Chancery to that House since Lord Plunket's accession to
office. Then, besides being a political Judge, Lord Plun-
ket had been held up as a " venal politician," who was
'spending his time here in Parliament which ought to be
devoted to the suitors in his Court. Lord Plunket had
been called over here in 1825, to afford the aid of his in-
valunble services in carrying that great measure of reli.
pious liberty with which his fame is imperishably and
gloriously associated—(Cheers)— and perhaps devolved on
others duties which ought to have been discharged by
himself ; but Jais stay here was a great patriotic sacrifice
on the shrine of the country's weal, for besides his other
inconveniences, he had to pay a fine of 4001. for not go-
ing his circuit.—(Hear, hear.) Was this the conduct of a
venal politician? If recrimination were his cue, bow easily
miglt he state facts—not wholly unfounded assertions—
in which two great Right Honourable names might not
appear models of disinterested patriotism? But he would
not imitate the bad example.—( Hear, hear.) It would
be impertinent in him to attempt the vindication of the
high character of Lord Plunket. It belonged to the his-
tory of his country, and would be written in her most
golden letters among the mighty men whose eloquence and
patriotism, and above all whose labours in the cause of
religious liberty, shed a lustre on their native land.—
(Cheers.) If that Learned Lord was a man who was the
mere mouthpiece of the virulence of a party,—if be was a
man who had changed his opinions on a most important
question at the mere beck of an influential relation,—if his
views had a reference to self, no matter how exposed to
conniving at corruption,—if he was a man wholly in-
debted for his public station to the accident of an acci-
dent, lie would not have been singled out, as he had been,
for the base insinuations of the little-minded, the bigoted,
and the malev )lent.—(Loud cries of " Hear.")

The Marquis of LONDONDERRY felt himself called
upon to offer one or two remarks, were it only to show
that he had not been frightened " out of his propriety" by
what had been addressed to him a few evenings since by
the Learned Lord opposite.—(" Hear," and a laugh.) He
could assure the Learned Lord that every angry feeling to-
wards him had vanished from his mind, and that the
sparks of temper, if he might so express himself, which he
might have then hastily manifested, had wholly disap-
peared with the collision which had elicited them.—
(Cheers ) He felt that he w:,s only performing an act of
public duty in seeking from the Learned Lord for informa-
tion relative to a transaction on which the House of Com-
mons, after a minute discussion, had, a Few evenings pre-
vious, pronounced a very emphatic opinion,—leaving the
Learned Lord, though zealously supported by Ministers,
with a bare majority of four.—(Hear.) He would still
press for that information, and trusted that if the Learned
Lord would not produce it himself, he would not object
to his (Lord Londonderry's) moving for it.

Earl GREY was sure that his Learned Friend would
have no objection to the production of any documents
which it would be consistent with the usages of that
House to produce ; but he doubted very much whether
the information sought for by the Noble Marquis fell
within the scope of those usages. He had listened with
great satisfaction to the statement of the Noble Marquis
(Clanricarde), and was sure their Lordships would agree
with him that it furnished a triumphant refutation to in.
sinuations which were propagated with rancorous assi-
duity, and a malevolent perseverance only to be equalled
by their falsehood.—(Loud cries of " Hear.") There
was one fact connected with the Noble Marqu s's state-
ment, which having come under his own knowledge, he
thought it but right to mention—he alluded to the ap-
po;ntment of the Hon. Thomas Plunket to the Deanery of
Down. It was true that that Rev. Gentleman had given
up a very considerable living on his appointment; but it
was equally true, that his promotion bad been wholly, ur.-
solicited by himself or his Noble and Learned parent--
(hear),—and that the appointment was the free gift of
his Majesty, after due inquiry as to hie fitness for the office.

The Duke of WELLINGTON was always disposed to
deprecate allusions by their Lordships to statements made
elsewhere, as likely to lead to mischievous inconvenience,
but felt that his Learned Friend (Eldon) was justified in
the course he had pursued that evening. His Learned
Friend had been attacked for having, in the exercise of
the patronage of his office, not overlooked the interests of
his own family. To be sure he did nor, and ought not.—
(Hear, hear.) If he did, he would only be departing
from the practice of all his predecessors.—(Hear.) Let
him remind their Lordships, that for at least a century and
a half back the Lord Chancellor and other Judges had in-
variably dispensed the patronage attached to their offices
in favour of their own immediate relations.—(Hear.) So
that his Learned Friend, in providing for his own family
as well as he could, was only acting according to the uni-
form and acknowledged practice of all his predecessors.—
(Hear.) The fact was, that the office of Lord Chancellor
would he very inadequately remunerated, unless the indi-
dual filling it possessed the means of providing for his
family; 'and he believed it would be found out ere long,
that with this inadequate remuneration, and what with
their stripping off so much of the Chancellor's patronage,
an.l what with surrendering up so much of his bankruptcy
fees, that the remuneration would be so inadequate to the
labour and change of habits, that few eminent gentlemen
at the bar would be disposed to accept of it..--(Hear,
hear.) For the same reason that he justified his Learned
Friend, he would say that the Learned Lord (Plunket)
opposite was justified in the exercise of his official pa-
tronage. That Learned Lord had a large family, and was
perfectly right in placing them in those situations to which
their abilities and pretensions were adequate.—(Hear,
hear.) The only blame would be, if he placed them in
situations to which their abilities were not equal; and
that bad not been insinuated in the course of the discus-
sion.—(Hear.) He agreed with the Noble Earl (Grey)
in hoping that that would be the last they should hear of
this senseless outcry against public men for not having
overlooked the ties of blood and nature in disposing of the
patronage of office.—(Hear, hear.)
Lord PLUNKET begged leave to assure the Learned
Earl (Eldon) that he never on any occasion gave utterance
to an expression at all reflecting upon the Learned Earl's
exercise of his official patronage, and that so far as he un-
derstood the reference to the Learned Lord's family made
in the other House of Parliament, it was by no means in-
tended to criminate the Learned Eirl, but merely to ex-
culpate him (Lord Plunket). He could also assure the
Noble Marquis (Londonderry), that he believed him in
all sincerity and truth when he stated he had dismissed
from his mind all angry recollections of the passage at
arms between them a few evenings since, and that he on
the other hand entertained not a particle of toward-
the Noble Marquis, and should regret if, in the heat of a
reply to what he conceived a most unjust attack, he had
given utterance to an expression likely to ruble the calm
serenity of the Noble Marquis's understanding.—(Hear.)
With these declarations he would take his sear, but • that
there were one or two points which only he himself, as the
person most interested, could well explain, with reference
to the attack which had been directed against him else-
where. It had been stated that he was a " political Judge'
—as one, therefore, in the sense of the calumniator, who
prostituted his judicial functions for the mere purposes of
party. Now the expression " political Judge" was one of
great ambiguity, meaning anything or nothing, according
to the immediate object of the person using it. If it mean
01 be believed was intended in the speech he was alluding
to, that he was a man who carried his political opinion,
with him to the judgment-seat, he need not observe that
no conduct could be more unjustifiable, more base, o.
more unworthy._( Hear.) He would confidently appear
to every candid man who knew him, whether he bad eve.
permitted himself to be biassed by feelings of party or po--

*'loos when discharging his duties as a judge. In hull,
vhen he approached the judicial seat, he knew not what
p arty or politica were.—(Bear, bear.) He had but one
hrject, one pursuit, one recollection—the administering
;impartial justice.—(Hear, bear.) But he took pride in
saying that in becoming &judge, he did not, therefore, rea e
o be a politician ; and that he felt a proud satisfaciion in
-tating his opinions on political euljects when called upon
by the executive. It so happened, that the political Opi-
nions he then held were those he had advocated throughout
his public life. He did not mean this by way of reproach
on those who had best pr ived their consistent devotion to
the public good by changing their line of policy ; nor did
he hold it up as a very rare circumstance, but merely as mat-
ter of honourable gratification that his early opinions were
those which his mature judgment approved of.—(Hear.)
It was stated elsewhere that he had absented himself frees
his court whale terms, and that the Master of the Rolls
was consequently compelled to do his business as well as
his own. A simple statement of facts would show the
total falsity of the assertion. The Noble and Learned Lord
here entered into a statement, from which it appeired that
he was appointed Lord Chancellor of Ireland in December,
1830 ; that he commenced his sittings in the ensuing •
January ; that a very great mass of arrear of business was
left to be disposed of, except at the express instance of the
suitors, in order to be more prepared at the next term.—
(Hear, heir.) The interval between Hilary and Easter
terms he spent in Parliament, and having bear constantly
engaged during Easter and Trinity terms in hie court, roa
three days before the termination of the lase-earned term,
with not a single cause undisposed of, except one or two,
which, as in the former instance; he consented to pestpene
at the instance of the suitors themselves.—(Hear.) He
might, if he thought fit, have devoted the four months of
the ensuing long vacation to his domestic affairs : but, in.,
stead of doing so, he devoted them to the service of the pub-
lic in that house, returning in time to his court when he sari
during Michaelmas term. This broualit him to the last
Hilary term, during which he had been charged of totally al. ,
senting himself, and of leaving the business to be ilischarged
by the Mabee of the Rolls. By an arrangament which he
had made with the bar, he commenced his November sit-
tings a couple of days before the usual period, by which
means, and by sittiug every day from the commencement
of Hilary term, he succeeded in disposing of every cause set
down for hearing in his court,—( Hear, heart—) so as to
be able to rise four or five days before the term was over.—
(Hear.) These four or five drys lie, in point of fact, spent
in Dublin, having literally nothing to do in the Court of
Chancery, so that he might consistently- with his judicial
duties, have taken his seat here a week sooner than I.c did.
And was this spending his time in Parliament to the in-
jury of the suitors in the Court of Chancery?—(Cheers.)
With respect to the assertion that the Master of the Rolls
was necessitated to assist him in disporrieg of his own
arrears, he begged leave to state that the Master of the
Rolls never heard a case not belonging to Ilia own
immediate jurisdiction, except one, and that was a case in
which he (Lord Plunkett) happened to have been origi-
nally employed as counsel, and therefore feat a delicacy to
sit upon as judge.—( Hear, hear.) At his special request;
and for that especial reason, the cause was heard by the
Master of the Rolls. He trusted this unvarnished state-
ment of facts would be felt to be a complete refutation of
all the calumnious assertions which had been directed
against his official couduct.—(Cheers.) Atter the
manly declaration of the Noble Duke (Wellington,) he
did not feel it necessary to vindicate at length his having
appointed his owu relatives to the situation connected
with the Court of Chancery. The papers be had moved
for a former evening would show that he had acted pre-
cisely as his predecessors bad done. Lord Manners dis-
possessed the former officer, and appointed his brother-in-
law as his secretary ; Sir Anthony Hart dispossessed that
gentleman and appointed a friend of his own ; he (Lord
Plunket) dispossessed that last appointment, and appointed
his nephew, Mr. M'Causland, a young man of great pro-
mise, who was most assiduous in the performance of the
duties of his office.—(Hear.) On his making that ap-
pointment, Sir A. Hart, who fully recognised his right to
do so, recommended him to retain the services of Mr.
Long, his secretary. A negotiation was accordingly en-
tered into, and Mr. Long's services were reained at a sa-
lary of 5001., to be paid out of the ahowance of Mr.
M'Causland, with the title, at his own request, of "joint
secretary."--(Hear.) It had been represented that he
(Lord Plunliet) had made a double appointment, of course,
with a double extension of patronage. But what was the
fact That he had: only made one appoinment of two
persons, with 2,5001. a year between them, while the
emolutnents of the former single secretary had been 3,000/.
a year.—(Hear, hear.) There was another point which
had been trumpeted forth in the newspapers, and to
which he would draw their Lordships' attention. It had
been said that a brother-in-law of his had appointed to a
living of 1,2001. a year, at his (Lord Plunket's) re-
commendation ; and again, what was the fact in this in-
stance ? Supposing, however, that this was the case,
it had nothing whatever to do with the charges made
against him. However, the fact was simply this
—that this gentleman, Mr. Oliver M'Causland, was
now eighty years of age, that he had been for forty
years a clergyman in the diocess of Derry, and
that the late Bishop, his old friend and schoolfellow, had
appointed him to a living, and that with that appointment
he (Lord Plunket) had as little to do as any of their Lord-
ships.—(Hear, hear.) A Noble Marquis (Londonderry)
had alluded to certain fees taken by his (Lord Plunket's)
secretaries, and had, no doubt, unintentionally, represented
them as fees going to himself. With these fees he had
nothing whatever to do. They were those accustomed to
be taken, and belonging heretofore to the Secretary, the
Trainhearer, and Pursebearer., The Noble Marquis bad.
said that it was represented as a hardship that these should
be paid by Magistrates ; but the only question was, we; e
these fees legal or not, and if so the Lord Chancellor could
not remedy the hardship were any suffered. But the mo-
ment he (Lord Plorrket) heard that there was the slightest
question of their legality, he ordered an inquiry to be
made into the subject. A case was laid before the At-
torney-General, who was of opinion that the fees could
not be legally demanded, but thought that compensation
for them would be made by the Lords of the Treasury.
He (Lord Plunket), however, thought that if the fees
were not legal, there ought not to be any compensation for
them, and he had at once given peremptory orders to re-
turn them.

After a few words from the Marquis of CLANRICARDE,
which were inaudible,

The LORD CHANCELLOR should then say, that in
the communications which had taken place with respect to
compensation for offices affected by the late alqTations in
the law, nothing could he more liberal, as well as more
correct, than the conduct pursued by the Noble and
Learned Earl (Eldon) and those connected with him.
The Noble and Learned Chanceilor for Ireland had made
such a statement to their Lordships, as carried conviction
with it to those who had heard him ; but it was necessary
that he (the Lord Chancellor) should remind Noble
Lords, who did not take part in the legal business of the
House, of what his Noble Friend had omitted—namely,
that his Noble Friend, in the cases of appeal and review
which came before that House in the last report, gave an
assistance of his labour and talent which was invaluable.
The motion of the Earl of ELDON was then put, viz.—
" That there be laid before the House a return of all the
offices held by the Hon. W. H. J. Scott, distinguishing
those in possession from those in reversion, with an ac-
count of their emoluments respectively for the last three
Sears."--Agreed to.