The Sun.
London, England, 1866-05-30 00:00:00

IMPERIAL FABLIAIYIENT

HOUSE OF COMNIONS—Tnis DAY.
The SPEAKER took the chair at 12 o'clock.
PRIVATE BUSINESS.

The following were read a third time and passed :=The
Economic Telegraph Company and Severn Junction

Railway.

ELECTIVE FRANCHISE BILL.
Mr. CLAY moved the second reading of this bill, the
object of which was to confer the elective franchise upon
all persons of full age, and who were capable of under-
going an educational test in reading, writing, and arith-
metic.

The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said ho
must oppose the motion, and in doing so he thought
that course was much better to pursue than to follow tho
course which was in fashion elsewhere, to pick certain
portions of the bill and show that it fell short of the object
intended. If he thought that all the conditions of an
educational test could always be obtained, he should not
object to it ; or if a test of that description could be formed
on extreme simplicity, he should not so much object;
but to take, for instance, the test of writing a
signature, why it was patent that the signatures
of some of the most highly-educated of our men
were illegible. He objected to the bill because there was
no presumptive or prima facie ground for it, and also be-
-eause it proceeded upon the principle of universal suf-
frage. Of course it was desirable that education should
become universal, yet -that time had not yet arrived in
England. He thought it moro desirable that the father
of a family should receive the elective franchise rather
than that privilege should b 3 conferred upon a young
man just fresh from school. The right honourable
gentleman proposed that these should undergo
a test of writing from dictation and elementary arithmetic.
Such a test was much more severe than was required by
the Civil Service Commission from those who applied for

clerkship; and it was just ono of those things which broke
down more applicants thau anything else he could men-
tion. (Hear, hear.) Then, with respect to the arithmetical
test—with addition, subscraction, and multiplication there
would, ho apprehended, be no difficulty ; but he should
like to know how,many labourers in this country could
pass an examination in division of money—(hear, hear);
but, flying at higher game, ho should like to know
how many members of that house could undergo success-
fully such an examination. He should like to know how
many members could take a given uneven large sum of
money
and divide it by £2 13s. Bd. (Laughter, and cries of
,‘ Oh, oh.") He did not mean to say that there were not
some members who could perform the operation, but the
majority ho contended in that house—
Lord R. MONTAGU said that no division could be
worked out with such figures. (Loud laughter.)
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said one
illustration was worth a thousand arguments—(loud
laughter)—and yet the noble lord opposite was ono of the
financial authorities in that house. (Loud laughter.) He
was fully alive to the high intentions of the right hon.
gentleman who had introduced the bill ; the Government
had no fear of the £7 franchise, but the qualification pro-
posed by the bill now under discussion was of a nature
that would produce nothing but failure. It was quite
true that where some men saw daylight, another saw
nothing but darkness, and giving the highest motives to
the hon. gentleman, he thought the bill would act directly
the reverse of the object intended, and therefore he
should move that the bill be read a second time that day
six months.
Lord R. MONTAGU said he did not rise to complain
of the extremely conservative tone of the speech, but to
express his hope that when the bill was read a second
time, it would be referred to a certain committee as
a complement of the Reform Bill. He felt certain
that there were many highly and respectable and
intelligent men who never could hope to
test
was elective franchise without an educational
than
was adopted. If the test proposed was more sero
then
the test adopted by the Civil Service Commissioners,
the Exchequer, he
he
ito
was thoughtrem thated testthe wasbet altogetherter.
Nv With
ha
respectfarce, andto thethe sooneratit
metical problem of the Chancellor offmby
t money,
contended that you could divide by sa
otut
that opi-
nion. Professor de Morgan would bear him
regarded to the electoral
nion. The only chum that
hishad
fellow-citizens,
leo
w knowledge,c
itiz:ns,
fhroawlichtoisegwivaesainvtoeltleigfeonrcte•h:e,ilf2nhheel::l!:tfuhe elective franchise,
then in his opinion he had
billq u e
rw,
so, ualnddb be
he
should amalgamatedvote
withan d
the thereforechan hecChancellor
for the second reading.
ostfetdhtehEa that the
had heard
nothing from
Sir J.
Chancellor of the Exchequer that ought to deter the
the
Mr. EpWAAKßlTNsGuip,pooNrtesaditdhehboill.
house from considering the bill in the fullest manner, be_
cause it appeared to him to contain materials which evi-
dently might lead to the settlement of the vexed question
of reform. lie doubted whether, if the bill was rejected,
tho house would be so submissive to the will of the Govern-
ment that they would continuo their sittings until October.
He could not, entertaining the sentiments that he did,
consent to vote against the principle laid down in the bill,
but in giving his vote in its favour he reserved to himself
the right of objecting to many of its provisions in com-
mittee.
Mr. GOSCHEN said he was much gratified bythe speech
of the right hon. baronet who had just sat down, because
he admitted the one qualification that was required in the
working class to entitle them to the franchise was fitness. It

Ips
hon. gentlemen intend to vote for this bill as a supplemental
measure to the Reform Bill introduced by the Government,
they would be but acting precisely as they had on 'Mon.
day night, namely, throwing every obstacle in the way of
the passing of a measure they had declared ought not to
Ireceive the assent of Parliament. Ile did not know how
hon. gentlemen opposite had given their consent to the
bill, especially as they had not called for statistics, whiCh
were invariably required by the honourable member fur
Stamford. (Hear, hear.) The bill was in principle
one of universal suffrage, whilst in principle it would ad-
mit but very few to the privilege it sought to confer. It
appeared to him that the bill was supported by the oppo-
site side of the house merely to obstruct the measure in-
troduced by the Government, and not with any real desire
to extend the suffrage in the manner it proposed. •
Mr. B. MOPE said he should vote for the bill in the
might
tbeiceraefpeerrradfecttn aannd
imcommale)iueltaeterceufonirmi;lit
,vhi hopec
ht hwa ta
si t t
om
pi
bill
under the guidance of the Chancellor of the Exchequer.
Mr. DENMAN objected to the bill, because by the test
proposed a larger number of working men would lie ad-
mitted to the exercise of the elective franchise than was
desirable. He thought an educational test altogether
mistake when it was proposed to adopt it in political
matters.
Mr. WHITESIDE admitted that the principle of an edu-
tioual franchise was Conservative. He affirmed that it
was preferable to confer the right of voting upon persons,
even without property, who reached a certain 'standard of
education rather than to give the franchise to persons who
were not so intelligent although they were possessed of a
certain amount of property. The hoe. and learned member
quoted from the writings of Mr. Mill as showing that the
latter was in favour of an educational test, which would
leave the suffrage in the bands of the best of the working
classes. But the hon. member for Westminster proposed
to give the franchise to ladies ; ho recommended him to
withdraw that proposal in his next election. The ladies
would turn out all the Radicals and put in Conserva-
tives, and he therefore warned him what would
take place. (Laughter.) Ile did not want to swamp the
middle classes, for ho believed that if a preponderating
power was put in the hands of the lower claSses the coun-
try would go to ruin. He meant this as a supplemehtary
measure to make up for the *ant of property by the pos-
session of intelligence. The Chancellor of the Duchy of
Lancaster complained that they had no statistic; but he
(Mr. Whiteside) did not know what statistics he could
want.
Mr. BRIGHT was unable to see the righteousness of the
principle or the possibiiityot theadvantageouspractice with
regard to any measure of the kind. Those who looked at
his (Mr. Bright's) opinions and did him any justice, would
Consider him one of the most conservative peliticianiof his
times. (Laughter.) He differed from those who satopposito
in
n many things, and, among other; in this, that he was
uunwthing to depart from the constitution of the county
y de to
r a circumstances, where where such circumstances did not
appear be absolutely necessary for the public good. To speak of a reading
considering this
wci
pue inand writing qualification was almost
acted !'
for Drileublin UniversitKe h question. The hon. member
highly cultured
had just sat down was no doubt
but
(Mr. Bright) was of opinion that if
the Government had
pon the principles of the
Universities there had been
kingdoea during the last hunrecrarchy
been comparable to tho anarchy thTtetawrsoutlhdahtawould, haveie
in any European
d
amongst us. (Applause.) The clergy generallyly 43erie.evawi
well
learned, but many of them knew very little of politics,
and were not so much fitted to vote for a member of ,
Par-
liament as others who had npa received so good an educa-
tion. To take away the franchise from fathers because edu-
ation was net so general in their youthful days, and give
it to their sons would be a great insult to a great body of
the working classes. He was for standing on the old donsti-
tution, of the country. He thought our forefathers were right
when they entrusted the representation of the kingdom to
Leads of families. Holding to that opinion, he should
oppose any of these fancy franchises,
which were depar-
tures from the ancient constitution. He had no sympathy
with the opinions of those literary gentlemen outside who
they
had the London weekly papers, and who, because
had a smattering of two dead languages, talked of culture,
and said that the great body of the working classes should
be excluded from the franchise. If he might be allowed to
give a word of advice to gentlemen who sat on the oppo-
site side of the house, ho would ask them if it would not
be better, instead of vacillating as they did, and showing
a great enthusiasm for an extension of the franchise one
day, and opposing reform on the next, that they should
adhere to the ancient lino of the constitution, and if
they found it serviceable to admit any number, great or
small, to the possession of the franchise that they Should
travel on the same road that their forefathers had travelled
—lt road which was adequate for all the purposes of the
most complete and satisfactory representation—a read
which he would undertake to Say the working men looked
to for the emancipation which they claimed, and not to
any fanciful proposition. (Loud cheers).
Lord CRANBORNE said the Government w
their best to remedy bill ould
on Monday night,
increase corruption, which they did
but they had another objection to the
bill—that it would give power to ignorance, and they
were now doing their best to remedy that also. He
u ged tho house to accept the bill of the hon. member for
Hull as a most valuable corrective to the measure of the
Government.

The ATTORNEY-GENERAL said the conduct of the
Opposition called to his mind the words which they had
often heard—organised hypocrisy. (Cheers.) He deprecated
amplicating the reform question by sending the bill before
the house to committee, and tendered his thanks to tho
hon. member for Birmingham for the great public service
he had done by disclaiming the advocacy of the extreme
and revolutionary measures which had been so frequently
attributed to him.

Mr. ADDERLEY adverted to lite principle of the mea-
sure saying that no argument had been adduced against it
except on points of detail.
Mr. LOCKE was at a loss to know how two things tend-
ing in the same direction could be a check upon one another.
He thought the hon. member who had just sat down had
treated the hon. member for Birmingham unfairly, for ho
was not aware that tho hon. member for Birminghatu had
ever expressed an opinion at variance with that to which he
had given utterance today. He objected to the bill because
it was not to apply to committees. If it was necessary to
increase intelligence in cities and boroughs, iz fortiori, it
was necessary to increase the intelligence of the counties.
In fact, he thought the bill was more necessary for the
counties than any other part of her Afajest,T's dominions.
(Laughter.) And what• would be the result'if this bill be-
came law over the country. The noble lord the member for
Stamford—and he was not the only one who would do so—
would get together a class of young men and teach them u
wthaenythshoofutlhdeucnoduesrusttuaenndcytlraernigthhotsyowf
otuhledcohnasyteittu:sit
to a certain point. It would not be at all necey thatp
d'Ori 'Dv
ro
ut hl
d
be this—they would have to go to the examination well
crammed with their reading., writing, and arithmetic, and
then the noble lord would let them loose upon the commu-
nity for the rest of their lives. What class of voters would
that be. The Opposition had been very philosophical, but
he wanted them to CO3M down to the region of common
sense, which taught them to vote as they thought. He
was opposed to this bill, which he characterised as a
new-fangled scheme, on grounds similar to those ex-
pressed by the hon. member for Birmingham.
Sir S. NORTHCOTE said one of the most remarkable
conjunctions that had occurred during the debate was that
of the Attorney-General and the hon. member for Bir-
mingham. (Hear, hear.) The two members were
uow in perfect accord, and he thought , such
a coincidence was peculiar. With respect to the
elective franchise, he thought that whatever they
intended to do it was best to do that effectually, and at
once. lie thought if it was the opinion of the house that
the franchise was to be lowered below £lO, then it would be
desirable to go down at onco to household suffrage, but
such a proceeding he should always most strenuously op-
pose.

Mr. AcLAN and Mr. M. CHAmnEns opposed the bill.
The latter hon. gentleman was addressing the house
when, at a quarter to six, the debate terminated, in accor-
dance with the standing orders of the house
The other orders of the day were disposed of, and the
house adjourned.