The Sun.
London, England, 1835-03-18 00:00:00

tleman then moved for leave to bring in a Bill for the relief of
persons dissenting from the Church of England, in regard to
the celebration of marriage.
Mr. WILK S felt bound, on the part of the Protestant
Dissenters, to thank the Right Hon. Baronet for the tone and
manner in which he had brought the subject forward, and pro-
posed to effect a change in a matter which every member of
the church must feel to be of the deepest importance, and
highly objectionable as regarded the ministers of the church.
The early and strict attention given to the subject by the
Right Hon. Baronet, added much to the feeling of obligation
which he, on the part of the Dissenters, entertained. All the
body to which he alluded would deeply feel, that notwithstand-
ing the immense variety of objects which must necessarily
have occupied the attention of the Right Hon. Gentleman,
that, unsolicited by them, he had come forward with a view of
making arrangements in matters which had been so long com-
plained of by them as grievances.—( Cheers.) He should not
do justice to his feelings towards his Parliamentary friends, to
whom the Dissenters were under such deep obligations for
their exertions to get rid of the Test and Corporation
Act, which were felt by them not merely as a conscien-
tious, but as a great political degradation, if he did not take
the opportunity of thanking them for the measures brought
forward last year, and above all, for that on the subject of
Dissenters' marriages, which was withdrawn for the pur-
pose of being remodelled in the interval between the last ses-
sion and the present, and also for other measures for the re-
lief of the Dissenters, which he knew it was intended to bring
forward. He had no doubt that arrangements would have
been made of a satisfactory nature, both as regarded a general
civil registration and the removal of the Church-rates, and
also other measures which would relieve the Dissenters from

grievances under which they had long had reason to complain.
With respect to the present measure it was impossible to deny
that the Right Honourable Gentleman had taken a very calm
and considerate view of the subject, as well as a candid re-,
view of the measures that had been brought forward during
the last ten or twelve years for removing the conscientious ob-
jections which Dissenters felt, to that which was now
the legal form of marriage in this country. Measures had
been brought forward for the attainment of this ob-
ject by many of the warm and steadfast friends of Dis-
senters, and above all, by the Noble Lord, Lord
J. Russell. There were objections, however, against
the Bill of the Noble Lord, which it was found diffi-
cult to overcome, above all, as regarded the publication
of bans, and also connected with the registration. The Dis-
senters would have been extremely glad to have accepted the
boon offered them; but it was owing to the objections that
were raised, both by those who objected to the measure, as
well as those upon whom it was to confer a benefit, that it
was withdrawn. The measure of the Right Hon. Gentleman
obviated many of the objections that were raised against the

Noble Lord's Bill, but still it was liable to many Objections.
He was anxious to do full justice to the Right Hon. Gentle-
man, but he should be guilty of unfairness, if he did not at once
state that he was sure the measure would not be perfectly sa-
tisfactory to all classes of Dissenters. He was satisfied that
many would object that Dissenters' marriages were only to
be regarded as a civil contract, and not also as a religious
contract.

An HON. MEMBER believed that circumstance would give
the greatest satisfaction to the Dissenters.
Mr. WILK S said that_ all the Dissenters required was per-
fect social equality and equal rights with other of his Majesty's
subjects, obtainable in as nearly as possible the same way.
They had no wish to subvert the Church Establishment, nor
would they accept of the revenues of the Church, if offered to
them, for the maintenance of their ministers. If the Right
Hon. Baronet had taken them back to the state of the law that
existed before the passing of the Marriage Act, he would have
given general satisfaction. There would have been no com-
plaints if he had gone back to the old law of England—to that
which was now the law of France, and as well of the greater
part of the civilized world. Many of the Dissenters would
consider that the present measure would draw an invidious
distinction between members of the Establishment and them-
selves. It would be imagined by many that the Dissenters
were to be married in a different way, and were not to
have the religious ceremony, because they did not belong
to the Church—( Oh !oh !)—or because they were persons
of degraded intellect.—(oh, oh !) This would be ar-
gued by some of the Dissenters, when they were told that
marriage with them was only to be a civil contract. He
wished to have an uniform system for all classes. There would
also be some difficulties as regarded the Dissenters going be-
fore Magistrates to enter into this contract. He believed
that one-third of the Magistrates of England were ministers
of the Established Church. It would be a great hardship to
compel Dissenters to go before these Magistrates for the pur-
pose of being married, and, in point of fact, would be no re-
lief whatever. It would not be the substance, but merely the
shadow, of advantage. It would he attended with great prac-
tical inconvenience to make the Dissenters attend before the
clergyman of the parish when acting as a Magistrate. He
was convinced that the feelings excited in the minds of Dis-
senters, by adopting this course, would be of such a nature
as to be almost insuperable. He was afraid, from the
experience they had hitherto had of parish clergymen,
that they would not be found in this respect, more than in
others, adequate public Magistrates. He was convinced
that the only satisfactory
registration that could be
adopted was a general civil register of births, marriages,
and deaths. If they had suc an institution, the offi-
cial agent to enter the registration would be neither Ma-
gistrate nor clergyman. All that would then be required was
a simple form of registration, not only for Dissenters,
but for all classes of his Majesty's subjects.—( Hear.) He
was glad that the Right Hon. Gentleman had introduced the
Bill, which he was sore manifested the favourable regard which
he entertained towards the Dissenters, and which required his
acknowledgments on their part. He was satisfied that the
measure was liable to some objections which he had stated;
but he would gladly co-operate with the Right Hon. Gentle-
man in his desire to promote such a good understanding as
would lead to a satisfactory settlement of the question. In
conclusion he was most anxious to lessen the feelings of
asperity which he deplored existed between Churchmen
and Dissenters, and to promote a stronger feeling of mu-
tual benevolence.

Lord JOHN RUSSELL colld not let the question be put
without making a few observations on what had fallen from the
Right Hon. Baronet. In the first place he would allude to
the Bill which was brought in last year, and which turned out
to be unsatisfactory to those whom it was intended to relieve.
A great many objections were raised against it, some of which
he thought were well founded, while others were, in his
opinion, captious ; but such were their nature that, altogether,
he found it impossible to proceed with the Bill ; be, therefore,
withdrew it. The field, therefore, was entirely open to the
Right Hon. Gentleman • and he felt bound to say, that
the spirit in which the Right Hon. Gentleman had proposed
his measure was of the most liberal kind—(cheers)—and which
he (Lord J: Russell) trusted would always prevail in the fu-
ture discussions on this measure, and which would be found
more advantageous in legislating on this subject, than by
pursuing the course which had hitherto been followed. He
admitted the value of many of the suggestions of the Right
Hon. Baronet ; but he thought it would be going too far if he
then attempted to follow him into the details of the measure
which he had brought forward. He wished, in the first place,
that the Bill should go forth to the world, and should be fairly
considered by the Protestant Dissenters ; and he hoped, when
they had done so, that they would fairly and openly state their
opinions on the subject. If they objected to it, that they
would state their objections in such a reasonable manner as to
entitle them to the serious consideration of the House, and not
meet it in a spirit of opposition, but in such a way that their just
wishes could be best satisfied. Therefore, throwing aside, for
the present, the details of the measure of the Right Hon. Gen-
tleman, he thought that he was right in taking the opportunity of
declaring that the great obstacle that he found to the success
of the measures he had brought forward for the relief of the
Dissenters was, that they considered the measures of relief
themselves as the remains of the system which they felt so
strongly during the continuation of the Test and Corporation
Acts, and as tending, in some degree, to degrade them. That
these measures, intended to remove difficulties under which
they laboured, had in them something insulting and degrading :
such opinions, however natural, they were in no way justified
in entertaining. He deeply regretted the feeling which ex-
isted between the members of the Establishment and Dissen-
ters, and was most anxious to remove it. With this view, he
confessed, before the introduction of the Bill of last year, his
feeling was, that the first object of the Legislature was
to form a system of general civil registration ; that the
registry both of members of the Church and of Dis-
senters should be purely of a civil nature; that all should
come equally under one head ; and that all should
merge in one civil, not ecclesiastical register. This was
not a scheme of the Government to which he belonged,
but it was a plan which he had intended to bring into
Parliament on his own responsibility.—( Hear, hear.) He
was the more convinced of the propriety of this course
from the consideration he had given to it; and he was sa-
tisfied that it was the most efficient plan that could be
carried into effect, and that all attempts at a change in the
law as regarded the present subject would be found de-
fective until it was adopted. In saying this,_ he begged to
repeat that 'the Government to which he belonged did not
feel called upon to bring forward a measure on the subject ;
therefore he could not be supposed to blame that of the
Right Hon. Gentleman for not having proposed such an
extensive measure. With respect to the present measure,
he could not say whether it would give satisfaction or not ;
but at any rate it was brought forward in such a spirit of
liberality and justice to all classes of his Majesty's subjects,
that at least so far it ought to give satisfaction.
Dr. LUSHINGTON, before he made any general obser-
vations on the measure, wished to ask whether, on signing the
contract before the magistrate, the parties had to make any
declaration as to their religious opinions ? If there were no
necessity for signing such a paper, the messure would be full
and ample, and might be made to include all classes of his Ma-
jesty's subjects.
Sir R. PEEL said that the parties, on presenting them-
selves before a magistrate, would have to take an oath and sign
a declaration to the effect, " I, A B, of the parish of C D,
in the county of E F, not being a member of the Established
Church of Great- Britain or Ireland"—( He had stated in his
opening speech that he did not intend to alter the law as re-
garded the members of the Establishment, but only as affected
those who objected to be married by the present law)—
" dwelling in the Parish of —, and being of the full age
of twenty-one, and, not knowing any lawful impediment to
my marriage," &c., and so on in the form now used in marriage
licences.

Dr. LUSHINGTON regretted that the form did not go
further, so as to admit all classes of his Majesty's subjects.
He was convinced that if the Right Hon. Baronet had adopted
the principle of his Noble Friend's Bill, he would have found
the difficulties inextricable, and the result would have been
that he would have given satisfaction to no party.—( Hear.)
When he declared that he gave his cordial approbation to the