The Sun.
London, England, 1832-05-18 00:00:00

LONDON, FRIDAY EVENING, MAY 18, 1832.

SECOND EDITION.

SUN OFFICE, Six o'Clock.

M PERM L LIA NI ENT

THIS EVENING.

HOUSE OF COMMONS.

Owing to a call of the House the gallery was not opened
until Half-past Five o'clock, and upon our admission, we
found that a question was before the House relative (as we
understood) to the non-attendance of some of the Members.

On the question being put,
Mr. HUME said that he would he sorry to put
any Members to any inconvenience beyond what
was necessary ; but he should be obliged to
enforce the motion, unless something was then stated
that would render it unnecessary. He would therefore
ask the Noble Lord (Althorp.) whether any arrange-
ments had yet been made, for the purpose of
satisfying the country respecting the Reform Bill.
Lord ALTHORP then rose, and the buz and noise atten-
dant on a very crowded House instantly subsided into a
deathlike silence. He said I rise, Sir, to give the House a
statement in accordance with thewish of the Hon. 11Ietnber.

I beg to state that since I was last in this House his Majesty's
Ministers have received such security for the passing of
she Reform Bill as appears to them most sati,factory—
(lmmense chpers)—and that therefore we shall continue
to hold our offices as hitherto.—(Loud and lonz cheering.)

Lord MILTON under the circumstances, and for
the statements which the House has just heard, I beg
leave to state, for the information of many to whom
my intentions were not communicated, that after the
assurance we have just heard, it is no lonzer my intention
to submit to :the House the address which I had intended
to move.—(Hear, hear, anti cheers.)

(LEFT SITTING.)

THIRD EDITION.

SUN OFFICE, Seven o'Clock.

Sir ROBERT PEEL rose amidst loud and deafening
cheers. The Hon. Baronet observed, that he was not aware
of the intention of the Noble Lord to make any intima-
tion to the House of the nature he had just done; but as a
man deeply interested in the prosperity of the country,
and anxiously and ardently wishing for the termination
of the present state of affairs, that, had the Noble Lord not
made the announcement be had done, he should have felt

it his duty to have called upon him for some explanation
on the subject, and he should have entreated the Noble
Lord, not without notice, not without giving an
opportunity for mature deliberation, to put the
House in possession of how Ministers stood with
his Majesty. He had, however, been precluded
from performing that duty by the communication
which the Noble Lord had just made.—(Loud cheers.)
He trusted, however, that the House would permit him, as
the crisis was peculiar, to make a few explanations as to
himself. He trusted, however, the House would not grudge
him a few minutes while he stated the grounds
on which he had formed the decision he did.
On Wednesday last a communication was made to him by
a Noble Friend of his, for whom, notwithstanding- all the
calumnious assertions gone forth--(Tremendous cheers)—
he was proud to avow the sincerest admiration
for his talents and esteem for his character,
(he meant Lord Lyndhurst) who informed him,
not that be had had a communication from his Majesty
to form a new Administration, but that his Majesty bad
selected him for having filled the office of Lord Chancellor,
and, as being a judicial character, for the purpose
of conferring with him on the state of the country. That
Noble Lord had inquired of him whether he considered
it to be in his power to enter into the service of the King
at the present moment, stating, at the same time, that the
King, by the resignation of his late Ministers, bad been
deprived of carrying his declaration into effect of carry-
ing the Reform Bill. He must admit that it cer-
tainly was then notified to him, and he was bound
in honour to state it, that the only other person
with whom any conference hail been had was his Grace
the Duke of Wellington, and that that Noble Personage
had determined to assist his Majesty, wishing for
no office, but who would have accepted office if cir-
cumstances required it, or, if not, he was willing to assist
the King, with his services, without taking any office,
although no communication of that sort was ever made to
him (Sir Robert), yet as he saw no advantage in reserve
at that moment, he must state thnt he certainly did
understand from the question that was put to him, that
the tendency of the inquiry of Lord Lyndhurst was, whe-
ther he was willing to accept the office, which, in po-
litical life, was supposed to he the highest in the State.

(Cheers.) It certainly was not notified to him, and he was
b .und in justice to the King to confine the declarations
which had been made by the Noble Friend that the accept-
ance of office must be upon the clear understanding that
his Majesty's declarations with respect to Reform should be
fulfilled—(Loud cheering on the Ministerial Benches)—
that the acceptance of that office must be upon the condi-
tion of his introducing an extensive measure of Re-
__.

form.—(Cheers.) Hi; reply to Lord Lyndhurst, he
admitted, was made at the impulse of the
mom. nt, but it was done under those impulses
of feeling which it was utterly impossible for him
to control, and for which he trusted the House would
give him credit. His reply to Lord Lyndhurst was,
that it was utterly impossible for him to accept
office on the condition of proposing such a measure of
Reform—that as from the course he (Sir Robert) had
hitherto adopted with respect to the Reform Bill, it was
utterly impossible for him to accept office, understand-
ing, as he did, that the phrase " extensive Reform,'
meant the adoption of the leading provisions of the
Bill as it now stood. He had always considered
the Bill fraught with injustice, both in its prin-
ciple and in its details, and he had before expressed
his determination to oppose it to the last. How
therefore, he would ask the House, could be, with justice
to himself or to his Majesty, have accepted the office of a
mediator, when he was the very person, from his
own peculiar feelings upon the subject, who would be most
lixely to put an end to all mediation.—(Mach cheering.)
The ground, therefore, on which he vindicated the
course he had taken, was the peculiar situation in which be
stood. He did not call in question the motives of
others ; he held those motives in the highest respect.
He had nu doubt they had acted from the most disinte-
rested motives, but it was from a sense of honour,
from a sense of the situation in which he stood, and from
the peculiar situation in which he was placed, he had
thought it his duty to give a direct refusal to take office.
Upon the Catholic Question he had given advice to his
Majesty, but upon the pret.ent question, had he t 'ken
offic,, he must haue introduced into that House a measure
upon which he had recorded his opinions:as strongly against.
He could not have done so without lowering himself in the
esteem both of himself and his friends. He felt that it
would not be for the public advantage, nor for the cha-
racter of public men, bad he accepted office upon such
terms —',Cheers.) (Left speaking.)

HOUSE OF LORDS.
EDUCATION IN IRELAND.
The Duke of BUCCLEUCH and Lord ELDON presented
petitions from Dalkieth, and certain Protestants of Man-
chester, against the new plan of Education in Ireland.

rom the Opposition.) He felt that it might be necessary
for him to say a few words in explanation of the visa
which he had taken of the question of Reform, and of
the course which it was his intention to pursue—(Hear.
hear, hear)—in the further proceedings upon it.
When the former Bill of Reform was before their Lord-
Ihips in th,' last Session of Parliament, he was necessarily
prevented from attending in his place in the Hour.
by the interference of various dioc. san duties which
be had to discharge in Yorkshire, at that particular
time, duties which hail ever appeared to him paramount in
importance to any other duties which might attach to a
Bishop in his legislative capacity, where neither the interests
of religion, nor the rights and duties of the clergy, are the
immediate subjects under the consideration of Parliament.
Had he been present at that period he should have given
his vote for the second reading of that Bill, and simply on
this principle, that it was a Bill which, applying directly
and especially to the constitution of the House of Com-
mons, had been sent up to their Lordships by a very
large majoriry of that House, which had the preponde-
rance of public opinion and public feeling in its favour, and
the object of which was avowedly sanctioned by the Crown.
He said, then, that he should have voted for the second
eading of that Bill, on the plain principle that the provi-
sions of any Bill so introduced into that House, annd so
advocated of it, were entitled to the fullest consideration
of their Lordships.--(Hear, hear, hear.) On the
very same ground and on the very same reason he gave his
vote for the second reading of the present Bill, with a
firm and sincere purpose of afterwards supporting in Com-
mittee its three essential principles of enfranchisement
disfranchisement and an extension of the suffrage. Not-
withstanding the order in which he had enumerated
these principles, he was not the less prepared to
support to the fullest extent the principle of dis-
franchisement, but he had ever considered that enfran-
chisement was the true and proper ground on which to
rest disfranchisetne. It was his opinion th it enfranchise-
ment should precede disfranchisement, and had, conse-
quently, the other night supported the proposition of the
Noble Baron (Lyndhurst), not at all anticipating—
(" Hear," from Lord Grey)—the effect of the decision on
that point. For he was well assured that the Noble Earl,
and he alone, could conduct this difficult business.—
( Hear.) Of the propriety of a very exrensive enfranchise-
ment, the intercourse which for 24 years he had continually
kept up with the great manufacturing towns in the West
Riding of York, afforded him abundant proofs. He re-
ferred principally to those of Leeds, Bradford Halifax, and
Huddersfield. He had received (their Lordships would be
sorry to hear) a letter from the Lord Mayor of York, ac-
quainting him that he had found it necessary to call
in the aid of the military to protect his (the Arch-
bishop's) house and property, at Bishopsthorpe,
from the assaults of a mob that had assembled evidently
for the purpose of destructson. Through the exertions,
however, used, little mischief had been done. But yester-
day morning military were stationed in his house and
stables.

The Duke of RUTLAND had hastened to the decla-
rations which had been made last night by a Noble Duke
Wellington), and by a Noble and Learned Baron, who im-
mediately succeeded his Grace, with feelings of deep
gratitude that the Gracious Prince who sat upon the
Throne had acted with so much firmness in resisting the
unconstitutional advice which had been tendered to him.
He also felt the greatest admiration of the conduct of the
Noble Duke for the course which despite the unmeasured
bloquy of an ungrateful country, he had pursued.
The Earl of HARWOOD was anxious to ask a ques-
tion of the Noble Earl opposite, whether the negotiations
which were being conducted yesterday, had been brought
to a termination, and whether Ministers were to continue
in office.

Earl GREY—It has been always my desire, my Lords,
as far as pos•it,le, to every proper question, to furnish the
infurmatiun.that is required, and more especially when

those questions are put in that courteous manner by
which the question of the Noble Earl has been charac-
terised. My Lords, I certainly, if that question had not been
put, should have been prepared to state to your Lordships
this day the result, I will not say of " negotiations," I am
not aware that that word was fitly used, but of the
communication which since his Grace, the Duke of Wel-

line ton, gave up the commission with which he was
intrusted, to form a new Administration, has passvd beg
tween his Majesty and me. My Lords, I have now the
satisfaction of informing you that that communication has
been qrought to this result, that in consequence of his
Majesty's desire of having the Reform Bill carried, and in
consequence ot my seeing now those grounds of confident
expect ,tion—(loud and continued cheers)—who enable
me to consider that pledge that I gave yesterday
to the House of not continuing in the Administration
unless I had, what appeared to me, a sufficient se-
curity for passing the Reform Bill now on your
table, unimpaired in its principle and essential
provisions ;—in consequence, I say, of finding myself now
enabled to state that such is my confident expectation—
(Cheers)—and having received his Majesty's commands
graciously expressed to that effect, his Majesty's
present Ministers continue in their present office.
My Lords, I shall not advert to any thing on this oc-
casion unpleasant that has passed. I have felt in common
with the Right Rev. Prelate, who has expressed himself
on this occasion, d, ep regret at much that has
been said ; but I think I may with considerable
confidence throw myself on your Lordships to say whether
I personally have done any thing to provoke it—(Cries
of Hear, hear)—nay, whether when exposed to a
series of personal attacks, and such, as I believe,
have not been usual in this House, I have done
any thing not characterised by proper feeling
if that was necessary to indicate my own character, and
the situation I held. To these occurrences, then, regret-
ting deeply as I do, I shall not recur. I trust that the pro-
ceedings of this measure will he conducted with calmness.
I fee' the necessity that it should be conducted with calm-
ness, to avoid furnishing any materials for an increa,e
of that irritation which unfortunately hrs attended
its progress.—(Hear.) I feel also the urgent necessity
of speedily passing this measure, in order that the
country may he restored to that quiet and content which
are necessary for its pence and prosperity.—(Loud cheers.)
To these objects my efforts shall be directed with the same
spirit and feeling which have characterised my conduct.
And I trust we may look forward to a speedy period when
this question shall be settled, when all these agitations shall
have subsided, when there shall be increased contentment,
and with that, all those means of prosperity which this coun-
try has shall be enjoyed, and for which there wants only poll-
sicat Reform, to bring to them full maturity.—(Cheers.)
My Lords, having stated this, as I believe there is no mo-
tion before the House, I now give notice that on Monday
next I shall move that this House resolve itself into a
Committee on the Reform Biil.—(Great applause.)
The Earl of HAREWOOD having heard the Noble
Lord's reply, should now take this opportunity
of stating what course that he should think
it proper fur him to adopt in the Committee. He hat;
not consulted with any Noble Lord. He was connected
with no party, He stood there to think and act for him-
self, as he had ever done on all critical points.—
As the House had been told yesterday that the continuance
i❑ office of Ministers dependdd on the power they might ob-
tain for carrying the Reform Bill, of course that was tube un-
derstood as a power to be obtained from the creation of
Peers, or from the individual pleasure of Noble Lords on
the Opposition side of the House withdrawing their future
opposition to it. Their Lordships had been informed that
Ministers were now virtually in possession of that power ;
and this was the situation in which the House now stood.
If exercise of the King's prerogative was to take
place, there would be an end to the independence
of the House of Lords—an end to the independence
it' not to the existence of the Crown, and undoubtedly an
end to the liberty of the subject.—(Loud cheers o❑
the Opposition side.) The question for him (Earl of H.)
therefore to consider was, whether he was now to add his
mite, which was calculated to overturn for ever the
independence and power of the House of Lords. He had
opposed the second reading of the Bill, because he thought it
too extensive. He had opposed it in the committee onthe
same principle, but he would now withhold further opposi-
tion to the Bill for the express reason of preventing a greater
calamity were the opposition persisted in. Though be took
this line of conduct, it was to be understood that he
took it by sheer compulsion ; and even in adopting
this course, he thought that lie might bid farewell to
the freedom of debate in the House of Lords, as he did
not apprehend he would ever again be able to utter
one indepedendent word there. Let those who had
been instrumental in bringing this affliction on tie:
country, be responsible for their acts to the nation
then the nation came to its proper senses, and he
really did nut think that the nation could be

(PRICE 71).)

restored to its proper senses while the Bill continued be-
'ore the Ho:lse. Under such circumstances he did not
intend to do any thins further to impede: the pre-
;rem of the measure.
The Earl of WINCHELSEI re could not give his
assent to a Bill which would ove.,..rn the balance of the
Constitution. He rose principally to call the attention of
the Noble Earl to the different malignant face and treason-
tide articles, which had appeared in the leading
journals during the last four days, and particularly those
on the character of the Queen.
The LORI) CHANCELLOR said that it would
very ill become them, sitting as criminal judges, wbo
might be caled upon to decide upon the supposed
libels to which the Noble Earl deferred to decide upon
their prosecution.
The Earl of WINCHILSEA replied, that these cases
were not likely to come before their Lordships. He did
not want any one to tell him what was treason.
(LEFT SPEAIING.

THE LONDON GAZETTE

THIS EVENING.

WAR-OFFICE, MAY 18, 1832.
24 Regiment of Dragoons—Lieut. St. Vincent W. Ricketts to
be Adjutant, vice Somerville, who resigns the Adjutancy only,
dated May 18, 1932.
9th Regiment of Light Dragoons—Lieut. B. Broadhead, from
the 80th Foot, to be Lieutenant, vice Fullerton, who exchanges,
May 18.
16th Light Dragoons—Assistant-Surgeon J. S. Chapman, from
the 31st Foot, to be Assistant-Surgeon, vice Murray, who ex-
changes, Nov. 10.
Ist or Grenadier Regiment of Foot Guards—A. W. F. Somer-
set, Esq., Page of Honour to his Majesty, to be Ensign and
Lieutenant, without purchase; StaMAssistant-Surgeon F. C.
Huthwaite to be Assistant-Surgeon, vice Wright. promoted,
May 18.
Ist Regiment of Foot—Lieut. C. Lewis to be Captain, without
purchase, vice Macdonald, deceased; Ensign H. A. Kerr to be
Lieutenant, vice Lewis; M. Carter, Gent. to be Ensign, vice
Kerr, May 18.
24 Foot—Capt. C. F. Holmes, from the 20th Foot, to be Cap-
tain, vice the Hon. F. Cavendish, who exchanges, Nov. 21.
13th Foot—Lieut. R. Pattison to be Captain, without purchase,
vice Aitken, deceased; Ensign J. H. Fenwick to be Lieutenant,
vice Pattison, Oct. 30; S. J. C. Irving, Gent. to be Ensign, vice
Eenwick, May 18.
20th Foot—Capt. the Hon. F. Cavendish. from the 2cl Foot, to
be Captain, vice Holmes, who exchanges.
31st Foot--Assistaut-Surgeon Denis Murray, from the 16th
Dragoons, to be Assistant-Surgeon, vice Chapman, who PX-
Cilangcs. May 10.
39th Foot—Lieutenant Hon. J. Sinclair, from the half-pay, to
be Lieutenant, vice Champ, appointed to the 63d Foot. May 18.
40th Foot—Ensign Ferdinand White, to be Lieutenant, with-
out purchase, vice Queade, deceased. May 10. Hugh Thomas
Bowen' Gent. to be Ensign, vice White, May 18.
49th Foot—Ensign W. C. Rochfort to be Lieutenant, without
purchase, vice Henderson. deceased, Oct. 13; J. Ramsey, Gent.
to be Ensign, vice Rochfort, May N.
55th Foot—Lieut. G. Goodall to be Captain, without purchase,
vice Elligood, deceased, May 18; Ensign C. B. Daubeney to be
Lieutenant, without purchase, vice Boys, promoted, Aug. 9;
Ensign F. J. Dixon to be Lieutenant, by purchase, vice Cary,
promoted, Jan. 6; Ensign J. B. Rose, from the 50th Foot, to be
Lieutenant, without purchase, vice oodall, May 18.
634 Foot—Lieutenant W. T. N. Champ, from the 39 foot, to
be Lieutentant, vice F. Thorold, who retires upon half-pay,
May 18.
75th Foot—R. P. Puleston, gent., to be Ensign, by purchase,
vice Ryle, who retires, May 18.
79th Foot—Lieut. T Crombte to be Captain, by purchase, vice
Brown, promoted; Ensign W. L. Scobell to be Lieutenant, by
purchase, vice Cronahie ; W. C. Maxwell, gent., to be Ensign,
by purchase, vice Scobell, May 18.
80th Foot.—Licut. R. E. Fullerton, from the 9th Light Dra-
goons, to be Lieutenant,vice Broadhead, who exchanges. MaylB.
98th Foot.—Ensign J. M'Cabe to be Lieuteuant, without pur-
chase, vice Adye, deceased. Feb. 3.
UNATTACHED.
Capt. J. Dudgeon Brown, from the 79th Foot, to be Major of
Infantry, by purchase. May 18.

DECLARATIONS OF INSOLVENCY.
JOHN MORGAN, High-street, Kensington, poulterer.
JOHN WORSELDINE and WILLIAM THOMAS, Castle.
yard, Castle-street, Holborn, carpenters.
BANKRUPTCIES SUPERSEDED.
ROBERT THOMAS, Glyn, Glomorganshire, cattle-dealer.
JOHN SP RINGETT, Linton, Kent, cattle-de der.
EVERARD ESAM, Thame, Oxfordshire, draper.

BANKRUPTS.
JAMES TAYLOR, High Holborn, stationer.
JOSEPH GRIFFIN, Holborn, laceman.
WILLIAM DUNBAR, Rosemary Branch Cottages, New
North-road, hemp-merchant.
EUGENE DEVI N, Liverpool, music-seller.
JOHN CALVERT, Liverpool, slate-merchant.
ROBERT ASHBURNEIt, Liverpool, haberdasher.
SAMUEL JOHN COWLEN, Brodwell-near-the-Sea, Essex,
beer-seller.
WILLIAM MOLD, Walsall, Staffordshire, saddlers'-iron-
monger.
THOMAS BROOKES, Hereford, hotel-keeper.
JOHN MORRELL, Boroughbridge, Yorkshire, victualler.
ELIZABETH SUMMERS, Bangor, linen-draper.
THOMAS WILLIAMS, Inchbrook Mills, Avening, Glouces-
tershire, clothier.
JOHN MEERS, Birmingham, gun-maker.
JAMES ROSE, Didsbury, Lancashire, victualler.
RICHARD KAY and JOHN NUTFALL, Bury, Lancashire,
pacer-manufacturers.

FOURTH EDITION
S UN-OFFICE, Half-past EIGHT.

HOUSE OF LORDS.
(Concluded from our Third Edition.)
The:E al of WINCHELSEA said that he could not give
his assent to a Bill which would overturn the balance
between the three powers of the State. His conduct in
that House had never been influenced by private party, or
factious feelings, but he had to the hest of this judgment done
that which would most promote the welfare of the country ;
but if the independence of this House was to be de-
stroyed, it seemed of little consequence to him whether
it was by overawing them with threats, or by such
a creation of Peers as would make this House
a packed Jury, as much a rotten borough as
any of the decayed places the Noble Earl was
about to destroy. When the delusion which now
existed, and which had been encouraged by the most
profligate Press which had ever disgraced a free; country
was dispelled, as it soon would be, the country would see
how grossly it bad been imposed upon by the pro-
moters of this measure. He would now, however,
since the Noble Earl was at the head of the Govern-
ment, address him in his private character as an English
citizen—a character which be (Lord Wiochelsea)
hoped still to be proud to hear. The Noble Earl, now
that be was a Minister of the Crown, was bound to stand
forward to protect the Sovereign from the most malignant
false, treacherous, and treasonable accusations which ever
degraded a free country, and which had appeared in
the leading Journals during the last three or four days.
He had no doubt that the time of the Noble Earl had
been too busily occupied during that p3riod for him to
read the daily papers, either on one side or the other ; but
I call upon him to cast his eyes over those malignant, false,
and unprincipled attacks which have been levelled against
our gracious Queen, who fur her many virtues was justly en-
titled to the respect of every friend of virtue.
The LORD CHANCELLOR said, that considering
the feelings under which the Noble Earl addressed the
House, it was, perhaps, natural that he should forget this
peculiar functions of their Lordships in respect to the
subject matter referred to. He, as well as a Noble Lord
who spoke last night, had called upan the Government to
institute prosecutions for certain libels, or supposed libels,
which had appeared in the Daily Press. He cautiously
used the word " suppose," for if that advice were complied
with, they might have to sit as criminal judges upon the
very question of whether these publications were libels or
not? He considered it so grossly contrary to their Lordships
functions as Judges, previously to moot the question of

whether such supposed oft-ncesshuuld be prosecuted or not.

Lord WHARNCLIFFE asked was" there no use
in the House of Lords being a deliberative
assembly ? And why therefore was their voles
to be overpowered by a large creation of Peers.
The blow was struck—the power of the State was placed
in the House of Commons—the Lords were no longer free
—arid it remained to be seen whether the Monarchy would
not materially be affected. The occasion on which the
advice was given to the King, which was refused, was one
of mere pretence. He denied that the question on which
Ministers were defeated touched any of the principles iit
the Bill. The agitation in the country was produced by
the Noble Earl himself. He must know the real position
in which that House was placed before he took the line he
nail been called on to take.
The Earl of CARNARVON wished to know what
would be the situation of the House on Monday next,
after the repeated menaces which had been held out,
he hid a right to vote thus. could they in
Commmittee without materially affecting the principle,
after the details of the Bill ? Was it the Noble Earl's in.
tentien to allow the House to go thro' Committee temperately
and fairly ? Would he propose to his Majesty to interp, se
such a creation of Press as would deprive the
House of the power to come to any practicable decision ?
E.rl GREY said that tire calmness and temporateness of
toe Committee depended much more upon the conduct of
the Opposition than on hie (E irl Grey's). As to the

HOUSE OF COMMONS.

Sir ROBERT PEEL'S speech concluded from our
Third Edition.—Though the English Bill was out of
that House, and into the other House of Parliament, the
Scotch and Irish Bills still remained for consideration in
r hat House, and it must have fallen to hint, as part of his
duty, to have taken them under his charge. Hi; objection
to the Irish Bill was so strong that he never could have
Hone so ; the reason would have entirely precluded
that : it was perfectlylimpossible for him to accept office,
in order to carry that Bill. He had refused vffice at the
expense of a temporary a .partition from that min in the
country, who, though he had taken a different course on
this question, he most admired—he meant the Duke of
Wellington. It had been announced that he bad been
influenced by a lurking suspicion that any Government
which could now be formed would be unable to stand, at d
that upon the ruins of it he might step in and seize the
reins of Government. He considered that this required
no denial at his hand ; but if there was one man in tha t
House who wished for explanation, be could soon satisfy
him that there was no earthly foundation for such a charge.
The declaration of the Duke (of Wellington) in the House
of Lords, lilbesiglrt, that there had been a temporary
cessation of politica friendship between them, was enough
to convinceithe House that there could be no smilicus
wish of his, but what could have been gratified.—(Hear.)
Lord ALTHORP, for one, had never imputed improper
or unworthy motives to the Hon. Baronet, and lie be-
lieved that no one in that House gave credence to the ress
ports to which the Hon. Baronet had alluded.
Mr. BARING rose to speak, but the noise occasioned by
Members leaving the House was so great that his first sen-
tences were lost. He felt satisfaction in hiring the explana-
tion given by the Noble Lord opo,:;tr, not only faa•
the sake of the country, but also for the share which he
hid had in the transactions of the few Ls; days. In the
few words he was about to offer, he would cautiously at.
stain from making one allusion which would provoke m e
word of further observation upon that explan.tion ; but
lie felt that if he sat still aster the explanati,ta offerei by
his Hun. Friend (Sir R. Peel), he would be lihble to have
some of the attacks which were now so ;As:wholly thrown
about, stuck upon him. He could answer for the •ruth
of the statement made by his Hon. Friend is to the mo-
tives which had actuated him in the transactions of the
!sat few days, he having expressed them ;n artist the
same words to him when he applied to him to take ffi..e.
Supposing the King was to admit it was his (fury to take
such measures as would insure the passinz of th. Bill. was
that a reason why a Minister should avail himself
of the occasion to force other circurestaocvs uo
Majesty, to which, as a Monarch of this country, he could
never submit ? His Majesty would say, because I con-
sider that this Bill should be passed, shall I ti ere:ore
submit to a circumstance which I conscientiously cannot
think ought to have been allowed ?_(Cheers.) Such had
been the case, and it was in such a case the Duke of
Wellington was called on by his Majesty. Could
that Noble Duke, then, seeing his Kitig in such
circurnstinces, say to kiln, No, I have talcen such steps
upon this measure, which you say must rass—l stand in
such a position upon this question, having protest. d against
it, that I can render you no assistance. He (Mr. B) MAR
convinced that no man in the country would Mieve that
he, in the manner in which he had acted, had taken a
straight forward view of the subject under the circum-
stances. When the Duke applied to him (Mrß. ) the first word
that he said to him were, that be telt ail the d fficul:ies
the case, but he would be ashamed to crawl about tl.e
metropolis, if he had not gone immediately to the King
and rendered him all the assistance that ayes in his power.
Sir R. VIVYAN said the situation in which the Duke
of Wellington had been placed was one of great diffia
Either the Bill was to pass, if the Duke of Wel-
lington got into office, or it was to pass under
the present Ministers by swamping the House of
Lords with a creation of Peers—(Hear)—aud the Duke
of Wellington, when called upon by his Majesty to
form an Administration, had been unable to do so,
consequently he pursued the only course which an
honourable man would do. The Hon. Baronet, at con-
siderable length, justified the conduct of the Duke of
Wellington and Sir Robert Peel, deprecated the Re-
form Bill, and asserted that the advice to create Peers to
carry it was an act of treason.
. .

Mr. GORDON attributed the present ttverish +tate of
the public mind to the Ministers, and characterized tl:e
public meetings as meetings held for and at tl:e instance of
persons whose object was rebellion, and wham he di scribed
as incendiaries. He particularly adverted to the lan-
guage of the Honourable Member for Mu;diesel.,
the recent meeting at St. John's Wood. He also spoke
in strong terms of the language which some Menwers
were in the habit of indulging in inside the Hoube, and
which he said were addressed to those without.
Mr. HUME, at considerable length, admitted using th•
language imputed to him, and repeated it, iu order to
give the Hon. Member an opportunity, if he wis::ed it,
of having the words taken down. He contended that it.
was strictly constitutional, and such as he would always
use when he found the occasion required it. is to the

public meetings and Political Unions, he justified them
strictly legil and highly useful, aA he dared the Hon.
Member to show any one attempt at riot or disorder. It
wet true that there was a strong feeling in the country,
but who had mated it ? It was excited by the attempt
jtuosearytotoh the liberties
pposedbyl of the
egaland p
conseotipm‘le—n
ti.aai acttrhich they
means.
(Later STEMICIN•.

IMPERIAL PARLIAMLNT.

ROUSE OF LORDS, MAr 17.
(Concluded from our Paper of yrst.!r iay.)
MINISTERIAL ARRANGEMENTS.

Lord LYNDHURST said—ltly Lorde, I am anxious to
explain ray part in these transactions. I feel that it is a
duty I owe to my Sovereign—a duty I owe to the country
—a duty I owe to your Lordships' House—and, if your
Lordship. will permit me to say so, a duty which I owe to
myself.—(Hear, hear, hear.) Ott the day when hi, Ma-
jesty accepted the resignations of his late Knisttra, he
was graciously pleased to desire me to attend him at St.
Jamesle.

The Earl of SUFFOLK here interrupted the Noble
Lord, and although vehemently called on by a great num-
ber of Noble Lords to resume Isis seat, persisted in his
attempt to address the House. He said he rose to speAk
to order. He had suffered the Noble L.,rd to proceed
until he tamed an Hon. Member of the other House. He
might have been content with designating him u the Hon.
Member for Westminster, but it was most disorderly to
name him.

It was decided that Lord Lyndhurst was perfectly is
order.

Lord LYNDHURST resumed—The Noble Lord who
stated I was out of order, and who ',Rs r.) inter-
rupt me, has only proved that he kartw nor'ing of the
orders of this House. Idu n:t say that filr Bur-
dett has made use of such expreesienr. I do nor believe
he can have made use of such expressions. I ant not re-
plying to what he said ; lam replying to 'hat has been
put into his mouth by that caluentliatit:o
(Cheers. ) He is reported to have crated ttoo I acted
inconsistently with my duty as r Judge of the Lat.!. I
ray, that if he asserted this, he must, ttlii,q it at the
best, be ignorant of the Consti!utiuu 4)! th,t c,untry.
—(Cheers.) He ought to know, that, as a Mem.,er
of the Privy Council, I am hound, by virtre of my
office, to give advice to my Sovereign if he requires
it.—(Loud cheers.) More than this, he ought to
know, if he knows anything of the Constitution, that I
have taken an oath to this effect—(Cheers); and more, he
ought to know, that, as a Judee, I art bound to volunteer
sty advice to his Majesty, it I consider my courts of pro-
ceeding inimical to the safety of the Crown—(Cheers):
so that if the Hon. Baronet made the assertion which is
attributed to him, he has shown himself perfect y ignorant
of the Constitution.—(Cheers). My Lord.., excuse me if I
go one step tartt er—( Hear, hear, hear!) He has charged
me, as a Judge, with being the leader of a violeot and
virulent party in your Lordships' House.--(Corers.) Talk
of order—talk of the irr-gulariry of naming Member., of
another House, when here you have a Member of Parliament
boldly asserting that your Lordshivs ore entertaining and
nurturing in your bosom a violent and virulent faction--
(Loud cheers). Whether there is o: is cot such a faction
in this House not stay to inquire; 1 wish to have no
motives imputed to me; 1 impute none to ether men—
( Hear, hear, hear.) I will only ray chat I never aspired
to such aposition as leader of a oisrty; it is alike foreign
to my inclinations and to my habits. I here nother the.
disposition nor the leisure for such i plops.
S,ne rho
Noble Earl became a Minister of the Crowe, I Fare seldom
I bare taken no pa, Is its proceed-
oeurstgea;ged in any pvlvirli
Reform Bill was intreciuma, I did wire
opinion* QM the aneuattre were "Cause last,ot .gea,dwreldhd.e
ant he
Atev r
ef Hoare;

alai; since, in a Utter to sly Noble and Learned Friend,
written from Warwick, when I heard the first Reform Bill
was brought forward; and if these were my honest
opinions (and who will question it I thought that
the tendency of this measure was to destroy the Sove-
reignty and the Contoitution, Wag it not my duty, as
a Judge of the land, as a Privy Councillor, as •a
Member of ',nine Lordships' House, with all my power to
oppose it ?--(Cheers.) If this measure had originated
with, and was supported by my earliest and meeleValukt
friends—hy the very friends of my bosom—l would have
acted in the same way.—(Cheers.) So much for my
conduct and the attacks upon me. For the rest, the Re-
formers are triumphant--the barriers are broken down—
the waters are out—who can predict their course, or tell
the (levitation they will occasion ?—(Loud cheers.) I
h pe, however, my anticipations may prove unfounded,
and that the eehntry will not be ruined by the measure
which has h—tn auctioned by the Noble Earl —(Cheers.)
trl GRTLY ti d, it is not my intention to do or say
anything which can add to the irritation which prevail,
Therefore I shall carefully abstain from saying anything
which might call into question the personal conduct of
anybody. It was for them to judge what their duty re-
quired, and to what extent they were called on by their
duty to make sacrifices of their former opinions, and even
to contradict by practice their former declarations.—
(Hear, hear.) All this was for them to consider—all
this might have been required.—(Cheers.) I, however,
impute so improper motives to any man.—(Cheers.)
But, on an occasion of this kind, what I expected was a
temoet ate explanation from the Noble Lord ; but instead
of this we have had a violent inveceive against the mea-
sure. Again have we heard the Reform arraiened as re-
volutionary—(Great cheering)—and as ten Ting to de-
siroy the Constitution.—(Continued cheering.) This
we have heat d repeated by the Noble and Learned Lord.
We have been'ar-aigned, too, for our conduct in giving ad-
vice to his Majesty which, it is said, if followed, would prove
fatal to the independence and character of this House.
E,fore I enter upon a consideration of these charges, let
me ask if a course of conduct might not be persevered in
which would be scarcely less dangerous to the indepen-
dence of this House? Might not a course be persevered
in which would hying this House into conflict with the
other House of Parliament, and with the prevailing sense
of the people?—(Cheers.) And might not this expose
th House to far greater dangers than that course which
we propose to pursue ?—(Cheers.) But laying this aside
for the moment—first, as to Reform in Parliament, I have
an often explained the grounds and motives on which it
was proposed, that it would he a mere waste of time again
to enter at any length into similar statements.—(Cheers.)
The epiuions I expressed on the subject are no new
opinions. I have lone been convinced of the necessity of
Reform, to place the Constitution upon a sound, perma-
nent, and safe foundation.—(Cheers.)—Looking at the
situation of the country, I thought the measure could no
ioager safely he deferred without danger.—(Cheers.)
When, therefore, the Noble Duke's administration resigned,
when, according to the new construction, they left the So-
vereign alone—(Hear, and liughter)—when I was called
on to assist his Majesty in forming a new administration,
1 adhered to those opinions upon the Subject which I had
se•erted out of office, and from which, for the purpose of
obtaining office, I certainly would not have departed or
ahendoned—(Cheers)—and I accordingly made it a condi-
tion of my accepting power, that I should have the liberty
of proposing a measure of Reform to Parliament.—
(Cheers.) This was acceded to, and it then became my
.:city to consider the extent of the measure; and I deter-
mined that the best and safest course to pursue was to
bring in a measure of such extent as would give satisfac-
tion to the country—(Cheers)—and which would be not
only consistent with, but conducive to the safety of the
constitution. It was on this principle I brought in the
R 11 ; hut the Noble and Learned Lord considers it revolu-
tionary, and therefore feels it his duty to oppose it—(Cheers)
I do not quarrel with his opinions ; all I can state is, that
my opinions on the subject differ as widely from his as it is
possible for difference to extend. I do not complain of
the opposition made by the Noble Lord; but I do complain
of the manner in which it was conducted, in not confining
itself to the subject, but branching out into direct personal
attacks, which I feel myself called on to disclaim as indig-
nantly as the Noble and Learned Lord did those matters
imputed to him.—(Cheers.) It is not necessary to go
into this long-disputed question of Reform The Bill,
when it was brought forward, received the general appro-
itation of the country, such as no former measure had ever
yet commanded. I should like to know if it had not
some effect in controlling public opinion, and quieting
that agit ttion which resistance to the measure raised.
I should like to know how it is that even the
greatest enemies to Reform now acknowledge that
some Reform is necessary—that they no longer op-
pose it, and at last confess that it must also be an exten-
sive Reform.—(Cheers.) I think, then, I was justified in
bringing in a measure consistent with those principles
I have maintained through life; and if it had been suffered
to pass, as it ought to pass, I have no doubt it would
have given universal satisfaction throughout the country.
This Bill met with a formidable opposition. It passed
the House of Commons, after an appeal to the country,
by a triumphant majority. Most unfortunately it was re-
jected by this House.—(Cheers.) Another Bill, as efficient
as this, the Noble Duke says, was brought in ; but that it
is more dangerous I dispute and deny. It had the good for-
tune to receive the sanction of its principles by a majority
your Lordships on the second reading. I now cosine to
-.he point which conduced to the present state of
affairs. I had hoped that it would pass the Committee
without such a change as would render it impossible for
me to consent to its being sent down to the other House.
But on the very first clause, a motion was made, the re-
sult of which was described as trifling and unimportant;
hut, in my opinion it proved such a disposition in this
House, and was essentially of such injury to the Bill, that
I felt 1 should not be justified in going tarther, in deluding
the people with a prospect of success which was never to
be attained, and in continuing, by the discussions in the
Committee, that irritation throughout the country which
it is so necessary to allay.—(Cheers.) It was then fur
me to consider which of the two courses I would pursue—
whether I would abandon the Bill altogether, or whether I
would recommend that measure to his Majesty which
could alone enab!e the Government to go on with the Bill.
We adopted the latter alternative, and did propose to his
Majesty that advice which the Noble Duke has arraigned
so severely.—(Cheers.) In the course of his observations,
the 2.:0h1e Duke stated that this had been acted on as a
threat. I am not sensible that I ant liable to that impu-
tation. Pressed and goaded as I was upon the subject, I
do not think I breathed a syllable on it excepting once.
:t was to state that I felt as strongly as most Noble Lords
the objections to a measure of the description alluded to,
unless in such a case of necessity as would justify the con-
stitutional exercise of the prerogative of the Crown to pre-
v nt, a collision between the two Houses of Parliament.
That w 's the precise situation in which we were placed ;
we had either to recommend this measure with all the
risk of consequences, or suffer this House to come into
collision with the public opinion and the other House of
Parliament—(Cheers)—a collision to which, if this
House were unwise enough to commit itself, it is not easy
to suppose that it can be victorious.—(Hear, hear.)
Tie Noble Duke, in referring to his Majesty's speech
from the throne in June, asked who could have thought a
measure of this kind would have been proposed.--
(Load cheers.) That passage in the speech related to a
me ,sure of Reform—and I contend that the measure of
Reform before your Lordships does possess the qualities
there prescribed for it. It will tend to remove abuses—
to give additional vigour and strength to the Constitution,
and restore the confidence of the people in their represen-
tatives." This, then, was the situation in which we were
placed. We were under the uecessity of offering the ad-
vice to csesoe as many new Peers as would carry the mea-
sure of Reform through this house unmutilated in any of
its essential provisions, or resign our offices. Now I say
that under these circumstances, the advice to create new
Peers was required. The Noble and Learned Lord says it
was not constitutional ; but I say it was constitutional,
and I can refer him to books of authority on that subject,
in which it is distinctly asserted, that one of the uses of
vesting the prerogative of creating new Peers in the Crown
is to prevent the possibility of the recurrence of those
evils which must otherwise result from a permanent colli-
sion between the two Houses of Parliament; and this
danger was rendered imminent by the opposition made to
the Reform Bill by the Noble Lords on the other side of
the House. And I ask, what would be the consequences
if we were to suppose that such a prerogative did not exist?
or could not be constitutionally exercised ? The Commons
had a control over the power of the Crown by the privi-
lege, in extreme cases, of refusing the supplies ; and the
Crown had, by means of this House, a control against
the effects of violent and rash proceedings on the part
nt the Commons. But if a majority of this House
was to have the power, whenever they pleased, of op-
posing the declared and decided wishes both of the Crown
and the people, without any means of modifying that
power, then this country would be placed entirely under the
the influence of an uncontrollable Oligarchy. I say that,
is a majority of this House should have the power of act-
ing adversely to the Crown and the Commons, and was
determined to exercise that power without being liable to
check or control, the Constitution is altered, and the Go-
vernment of this country is not a limited Monarchy, but
an 0116archy.—(Hear, Lear.) On these grounds we ten-
dered that advice to his 31..jesty, which we were well

iustified by the spirit and by the letter of the Constitution
;n tendering ; nay, more which, under the circum
-tances, it was our imperative duty to tender—(Hear,
hear)—considering the consequences that were likely ti'
result from the failure of the measure. But then it wa•
a rid that the Ministers had, by their resignation, left hi.
Alrijesty alone, and this was said as if there had been
something invidious and envious in this conduct of Mini-
stars. I would ask in what this conduct differs from any
other resignation? The Ministers offered that advice to
his Majesty which they thought themselves called upon to
offer in the situation in which they were placed. His Ma-
jesty was pleased to refuse compliance with that advice,
and then the Ministers most respectfully tendered their
resignations, being the only course which remained for
them to follow, if they were prepared to act as honest and
independent men.—(Hear, hear.) They did not, there-
fore, leave his Majesty alone, or abandon him in any invi-
dious or ungenerous sent of the word, but merely acted
in the manner that was due to their character and honour
as honest and independent men. I believe that the Noble
Duke himself, on reflection, will be convinced that there
was no want on our part of respectful duty to his Majesty ;
and that there was nothing extraordinary in our resigna-
tion, considering the circumstances in which we were
placed ; and that we have deserved no reproaches for our
audacious or ungracious abandonment of his Majesty. If
we could have been guilty of an invidious or ungracious
proceeding toward.. his Majesty, or any want of duty with
respect to him, we must hive been the most ungrateful of
men ; for never did men owe more to a Sovereign for the
uniform kindness, condescension, and confidence with
which were treated by his Majesty ; and 201 to the attacks
to which the Noble Duke alludes, as having been made
on his Majesty in the public press, all I can say is, that
I had no concern whatever in these attacks, and that
neither the Noble Duke nor any other Peer in this Hous-
could ba more distressed at them than I was.—(Hear,
hear.) I have always proclaimed, and now du in the most
public manner proclaim, that I have always firmly believed,
and do firmly believe, that his Majesty was actuated by
the very best motives on this as on every other occasion.
--(Hear, hear, from all parts of the House.) Ido not
think it necessary for me to say any more on the present
occasion, for I suppose nobody will expect that I should
disclose what has passed confidentially between his Majesty
and myself, without having first distinctly obtained his
Majesty's consent and permission; and it ought always
to be recollected that it was contrary to the principles
and the practice of the Constitution to arraign the
personal conduct of the Sovereign. This much I thought
it my duty to say, in vindication of his Majesty, to whom
I must ever remain bound in gratitude for the kindness
and confidence with which he has been pleased always to
treat me; for the present, it is not fitting that I should
make any communication as to what has passed between
his Majesty and myself, beyond what I before stated. I
before stated that I was again in communication with his
Majesty, because I thought that as to that particular, and
as to the views which I myself entertained, there ought to
be no concealment from this House. But I cannot state
at this moment that this communication between his Ma.
jesty and myself has been attended wit's any result. All
I can state is, that I still continue to be of opinion that
full effect ought to be given to the Bill of Reform now
on your Lordships' Table, and that it ought to be passed
unmutilated and unimpaired in all its main principles and
essential provisions.—( Hear, hear! from the Ministerial
side.)

The Earl of MANSFIELD—It might perhaps be more
proper for him to take another opportunity of addressing
their Lordships, on this subject, yet he was anxious now
to say a few words. He had endeavoured to form the
best opinion, and to act in the best manner that he could
in regard to this measure of Reform ; aed however little
worth his opinion might he supposed by some to be, he
had formed his opinion, and from that he was not disposed
to swerve. Nor did he see any reason to retract it. But
he had observed a statement in the public papers, that
the Noble and Illustrious Duke near him had invited him
to take office, and that he had declined it ; and he had
also observed a statement that his Majesty bad invited him
to take office along with the Duke of Wellington, and
that he bad replied that he had had enough of the Duke
of Wellington. Of these statements I can only say that
they are false, and that the latter is not only false, but
grossly insulting to his Majesty. In the audience which I
had of his Majesty, there were only two persons pre-
sent; and it was insulting to his Majesty to say
that any account, and particularly so very incorrect an ac-
count, should have been given of what had passed at that
interview. He thought it his duty to state this much, in
regard to the interview that he had with his Majesty.
With regard to the speech of the Noble and Illustrious
Duke near him, that must have made a due impression.
No doubt the Noble Duke was placed in a painful situation,
and every one must applaud the explanation which the
Noble Duke had given, whether to concur with him in the
course which he had felt himself constrained to adopt or
not. It was no doubt painful to him to do anything that
might delay the settlement of the Government, considering
the situation in which his Majesty was placed. The
calumnies that had been published against the Noble Duke
could only impose on the credulous and ignorant, although
it appeared strange that they should not have been dis-
credited and discountenanced by some persons, who must
have known that they were unfounded. As for himself,
whenever he opposed the measure of the Noble Duke or
any other Minister, he had acted entirely on public
grounds, and regarded no one, far lees the Noble Duke,
with envy or personal hostility.—(Hear, hear.) This was
what he thought due to own sense of honour, honesty, and
independence. He would submit his own judgment, im-
plicitly to no one, and neither feelings of friendship nor
any other motive would prevent him from stating his free
and unbiassed opinion, or acting as an honest and inde-
pendent Member of Parliament. But he would not do
justice to his own feelings if lie refrained from publicly
proclaiming, in however inadequate tet tns, his ad-
miration of the patriotic and disinterested conduct of
the Noble Duke.—(Loud cheering on the Opposition
side.) He was more bound than almost any other to
say this much in favour of the Noble Duke, although
he could not concur with the Noble Duke in the extent
of concession to which the Noble Duke, from the best and
purest of motives, appeared disposed to go. In that ex-
tent of concession he himself certainly could not join the
Noble Duke, although he was aware that a majority of
their Lordships' House would probably be disposed to go
that length. But the matter of the greatest importance
was to see what took place in the course of this business.
His Majesty found himself placed in a painful situation,
and sent for the Noble Duke, who, when so called upon,
could not refuse to comply with the invitation. But the
Noble Duke did not propose that he himself should take
office, but, on the contrary, persuaded his Majesty to take
others into his councils.—( Hear, hear.) Did that show
any eagerness after place ?—(Hear, hear.) The Noble
Earl opposite could not deny but that Ministers had left his
Majesty in a painful and distressing predicament ; but he
said that Ministers were placed in circumstances in which
they could not act otherwise—and what were these cir-
cumstances ? On Monday, the House had proceeded to
discuss the clauses of the Bill in Committee, and that was
the occasion for proposing such alterations and amend-
ments as might he deemed requisite. It was, indeed, a
tei tin argument for the second reading, that alterations
and amendments might be proposed in the Committee.
That was the proper time for proposing alterations and
amendments, and for making such alterations they hail the
example of the Noble Earl himself, who had made an al-
teration, and that not an unimportant one, in his measure.
It was proposed, that in the discussion of the clauses, pre-
ference should be given to the enfranchising part of the
Bill. He thought that this was not of sufficient im-
portance to justify the opposition which Ministers
had made to it, and he said so at the time.--
The Noble Earl had explained the reason why he
thought otherwise, and yet this was somewhat strange,
when it was considered that a colleague of the Noble Earl
(Lord Althorp) had said in another place, that it
was a matter of indifference whether they began first with
the enfranchising or disfranchising clauses.—(Hear.)
Now he had always understood that it was perfecly fair
in the Committee to propose alterations and amendments,
even if they should go to the disfigurement of the mea-
sure; but the Noble Esrl, it appeared, would admit of no
alteration, and so he thought proper to object to the trans-
position of the clauses. Now he should have thought that
the most natural proceeding was to begin with the en-
franchising clauses, and that the first consideration ought
to be, not that Old Sarum had Members, but that Man•
cheater had none. That was naturally the first grievance
to be considered ; and after having settled what places
ought to be enfranchised, and what additional 'Members
(if any) ought to be given to Scotland, they might then
have gone on to consider how far the disfranchisement
ought to be carried, in order not to add to the actual num-
ber of the present House of Commons. No good reason
was assigned for refusing to adopt this course. The mat.
ter was of no serious import ince, and the opposition of
Ministers appeared rather unaccountable. The reason
which was avowed could hardly be the true one, and it
was natural, therefore to look for some other reason.
Whit, then, was the reason? Was it that the Ministers
themselves began to be apprehensive of the consequences
of the Irish Reform Bill ?—(Hear, hear.) Perhaps they
themselves began to be afraid of the consequences of that
hill, and of the flames and insurrections which their orders
had raised in our West India Colonies.--(Hear, hear,
on the Opposition side.) Perhaps they begin to feel

heir unatnesa for and to be anxlnua to get rid of
•heir places, and therefore they had resolved to give advice
vhich they could hardly expect that his Majesty would
Billow, and then, the advice having been rejected, they
esigned. The Noble Earl denied that he had used any
:hreat of the creation of peers, in order to induce their
Lordships to adopt this meiesure in its full extent, but
something of that nature had been circulated by per-
aen supposed to he connected with Ministers. The Noble
Earl said that he mentioned the subject only once, but
•hen the Noble Earl could hardly deny but that frequent
'allusion had been made to it—a circumstance which ex-
cited but little attention, since it was supposed that it was
scarcely possible that such advice would be offered, or that,
if offered, it would be complied with. But that advice, it
appeared, had been given, and the Noble Earl said, that to
have followed it would have been a proper exercise of the
royal prerogative. Now, it had been stated by a Nol.le
Baron (Lord Ellenhorough) that he would go the length of
leaving in force the three great provisions of the Bill—the
enfranchisement, disfranchisement, and 101. qualification,
and, therefore, there appeared no good reason why Minis-
ters should have objected to the consideration of the enfran-
chising clauses in the first instance. Where then was the
necessity, even on their own views, for giving such advice,
or for such an exercise of the prerogative? They said
they had no other alternative. But there was another
alternative. The present House of Commons had been
elected before the measure of Roform now on their Lord-
ships' table had been submitted to Parliament, and at the
time of the election, the public in general could not have
been aware of its provisions. Why, then, did they not
resort to the expedient of again appealing to the country,
and ascertaining the opinion of the public as to the pro-
visions of the measure as amended by the present Bill ?
The Noble Earl said, that if the Crown were not to exer-
cise this prerogative of creating Peers, the country would
be ruled by an oligarchy ; but he (Lord Mansfield) s iid,
that if the Ministers of the Crown should have the
power of thus neutralizing their Lordships' House by
the creation of Peers, the country would then, at all
events, be ruled by an oligarchy.—(Herr, hear, on the
Opposition side.) What number of Peers Ministers pro-
posed to have created was unknown to him ; but there
could be no doubt that, to accomplish their object, the
number must be very considerable. For his own part, he
had no intention to oppose the proper exercise of the
Royal prerogative; but he did most strenuously oppose
the abuse of that prerogative. There were many who
were, no doubt, well qualified to enter that House, and to
be advanced to the dignity of the Peerage ; but where
could the Noble Earl find the requisite number who would
be ready to prostitute themselves so completely to part)
purposes, as to enter the House on such terms as these ?
( Hear, hear, on the Opposition side.) He recollected
when the Noble and Illustrious Duke near him re-
turned from Spain, and produced his patents at once for all
the honors in the power of the Crown to bestow, so that
the Officer of the House was fatigued with reading them.
Who was there that saw this spectacle that did not feel his
heart heat high at the thought that there was a man in
the country that well deserved to be so rewarded, and
who did not feel how happy were that country and that
Sovereign which had the power so to reward such emi-
nent services ? But what must be the feelings of persons
coming here and presenting the patents given them under
such advice as the Ministers had tendered ; and what
must be the feelings anti reflections of those who might
witness such a spectacle? They would not have to show
any recorded services to justify their advancement, and
could only point to the mero niotu of the Crown ; and
then, with what feelings could they attest before their
Maker they would faithfully perform their duty as I'eers
of Parliament ? Only consider of seeing them insert-
ing
their names in the roll of that House, contaminated,
as it would be, by such an association, and consigning
themselves to infamy, which was generally much more
permanent and lasting than fame. From the disgrace of
limb an association, it was the object of the Noble Duke
to extricate this House, and the attempt was a noble one,
even though it might fail. When the Noble Duke bad
come to think that matters had been brought to such a pass
that some measure of Reform was almost inevitable, lie,
instead of seeking office for himself, persuaded his Majesty
to give office to others, whom the Noble Duke thought he
could conscientiously support. It had become a fashion
with some to ascribe to those on his aide of the House, an
eagerness for office. But had not others sometimes
evinced an eagerness for office ? When the Noble Duke
brought forward the Catholic Question, there was a great
clamour among the members of a certain party about Ilse
hardship of their measures being taken out of their hands,
and brought forward while any others were in office. It
was true that they had then supported the measure, and
why should they not now support a Reform, although the
measure should be under the management of others? The
Noble Duke said that he bad found it impossible to form
an Administration, and yet he had handsomely given their
due weed of praise to those who could not conscientiously
agree with him, and all must regard the Noble Duke's
1 conduct throughout the whole proceeding with the high-
est admiration.—(Cheers on the Opposition side.) It
must be confessed on all hands, that the Nob'e Duke acted
from the best and the purest motives. It was matter of
high merit in hint that he had acted as he had done,
til:hougla he failed of success. The praise due to him was
not the less on that account, and he found it difficult for
him to express his admiration of the Noble Duke in ade-
quate terms. In appreciating the merits of the Noble
Duke, they must look to the character of his conduct,
and not to the result.—(Loud cheering.) The Noble
Earl opposite might have been induced to give the fatal
advice by the excitement of the moment, from wounded
pride, and such frailties as were incident to human
nature ; but, for his own part, he, in the interview
which he had with his Majesty, had stated that his Ma-
jesty ought to pause before he resorted to the expedient. of
creating such a number of Peers as would destroy the in-
dependence of that House.—(Cheers on the Opposition
side.) He !lid not know how the present crisis was to ter-
minate, hut lie hoped it would not end in the creation of
Peers. This was merely a pretext in order to mortify
such of their Lordships as were unwilling to support the
Ministerial measure to its fullest extent. He might call
upon Ministers to take a warning from history, and re-
member the fall of two Ministers in France, who had
acted upon the principle which the Ministers appeared
now disposed to follow. He felt no personal hostility to
Ministers, however strongly he might disapprove of their
measures. He had much rather that they should remain
in office than have the successors which the success of
their measures would bring into office. If they succeeded
in carrying them into effect in their full extent, their suc-
cessors would be taken—to borrow a phrase from our
neighbours—from the extreme gauche. Such persons
must inevitably succeed, and then consider whether the
consequences would not be revolutionary. In his opinion
such must be the inevitable consequences ; and it was for
that reason that he thought himself bound by every means
in his power to oppose these measures.—(Cheers on the
Opposition side.)
The Earl of WINCHILSEA—He felt himself called
upon to take this opportunity of addressing a few words
to their Lordship, since he might not long have the power
of addressing them as an independent Member of that
House. And, in the first pl ice, he must express his
warmest feelings of gratitude
,to his Majesty for having
spurned with the utmost scorn the advice which, if it bad
been followed, must have led to the destruction of the in-
dependence of their Lordships' House; and to this he must
add, that he looked on the conduct of Ministers, in giv-
ing that advice, with the utmost scorn and indignation.
He must say, however, that he felt the most lively joy at
the conduct of one of the Ministers (query—the Duke of
Richmond ?), who was reported to have dissented from
the proposition to tender such pernicious advice. As for
the Noble Earl opposite, although he did not mean to im-
pute to him any improper motives, yet the fact appeared
to be certain, that he had placed his Majesty in a most
unparalleled situation. The Noble Earl, as his excuse, had
referred to the division in the Committee on Monday. But
lie did not think that could have been considered as a
fft heorer
np in
hneotthheerr pt
hl sec ee
nhadfra
ndiehsci
mriinbge doi
rt
matter of importance, when he knew that the Noble Earl's
as colleague
a ni att e(rLoofr di
indifference
disfranchising thieves should be first discussed. But more
particularly when a Noble Baron (Ellenboreuels) had said
that he would concede the disiranchieement in
schedule A,
the eniranchising clauses and the 10/. qualification clause,'
he had thought it would be seen whether Ministers would
be satisfied with an ample measure of Reform. He
then thought that it could be a matter of no serious
moment whether the enfranchising or the disfranchising
clauses were first considered, and when he found the
Ministers so keenly opposing a proposition which sig-
nified so little, he did begin to think that their ob-
ject might be to have a pretence for creating Peers. He
did say, that the line of conduct pursued by Ministers had
a direct tendency to degrade, disgrace, and destroy that
House. The advice which they tendered to his Majesty
was the most insulting and most daring that ever bad
been offered by a subject to his Sovereign.—(Cheering
on the Opposition side.) What other consequence could
fellow than that, if that advice had been acted upon, there
would be an end of that House as an independent branch
of the Legislature ? If the Noble Earl had felt what was
due to the House, he would never have offered such ad-
vice to his Majesty. But he most highly appreciated
the Noble and disinterested conduct of the Noble Duke
who sat near him ; and he had no doubt but that he. and
his friends bad acted from the purest and most bondur-

able motives. lie rrgardel the itGlittitiet of the Noble
Duke with the highest admiration, and there was no sa-
crifice consistent with a due respect to his own character
ind honour that he himself would not have made, if he
had beer. called upon by his Majesty as the Noble Duke
had been. lie called upon those who valued their cha-
racters more than they did their lives to treat with scorn
and contempt the motives held out to them to sacrifice
the former.

The Marquess of LONDONDERRY, after adverting
to the Address to his Majesty from the town of B-lfast,
and reading several passage+ from that address, begged to
ask the Noble Earl opposite if their Lordship+ were to ad-
dress him as Minister—if they were to understand that
the advice which he bad tendered to his Majesty had been
accepted or rejected ? . . _ .

Earl GREY repeated, that the communication which
he had received from his Majesty, had not yet led to any
conclusive result. More than that he did not feel himself
called upon to say. In fact, he had on Tuesday stated
all that he could now state. A charge had that evening
been made against him by a Noble Lord, as if he had
been guilty, as a Minister, of most improper conduct in
tendering his resignation to his Sovereign. He was not
aware, however, that in so doing be had done more than
many Ministers before him. But it was asserted that be
had taken this step when he was aware that no other Ad-
ministration could be formed. Wbat reason however,
was there, for supposing that no other Administration
could be formed ; their Lordships having been told over
and over again by Noble Lords opposite, that they were
the most fit persons to form a Ministry ? If his Majesty
were !eft alone on this occasion, it was in consequence of
the advice of the Noble Lords opposite, and not in conse-
quence of his (Lord Grey's) advice, or that of his friends.
'Phis, however, he would distinctly state to the Noble
Marquess, that unless he (Lord Grey) could be assured of
the means of carrying the Reformat Bill in a perfectly effi-
cient state, he would not remain in office.

The LORD CHANCELLOR rose to say one word,
simply in addition to what had fallen from his Noble
Friend, and which he was sure his Noble Friend would
have said if he had borne it in mind. Not only was it a
condition that the Bill should be carried in its efficient
state, but also that it should be carried with every rea-
sonable despatch that was consistent with a due consideration
of its provisions.
The Earl of HADDINGTON did not wish to prolong
the debate, or the irritation which existed on the subject.
But he must protest against the statements which had been
wade by the Noble Earl opposite. There was nothing in
the conduct of that House, on the recent occasion, which
would possibly justify the advice which that Noble Earl
hid given to his Majesty. There was nothing in
the conduct of that House, from the moment at which the
Reform Bill had been introduced into it until the present
moment, which could justify a Constitutional Minister in
adopting such a revolutionary measure as that which had
been adopted by the Noble Earl--a measure which went
to stultify the voice, and annihilate the just influence of that
House, and which he most conscientiously believed tended
to lay the foundation of the ruin of the Monarchy.—(Hear,
hear, t ear ) The conduct of the Noble Duke on
that side of the House had been calved in question.
In his (Lord Haddington's) opinion, the manner in which
that Noble Duke had obeyed the voice of his So-
vereign did him the highest honour. He had never keen
one of that Noble Duke's partisans ; on the contrary, he
had frequently opposed him. But, feeling as he did on
the conduct which that Noble Duke had recently pur-
sued, he should be guilty of a gross dereliction of duty if
he did not declare in the face of their Lordships and of
the public, that, notwithstanding the obloquy which it
had been attempted to heap upon the Noble Duke, that
Noble Duke had deserved well of his country.—(Hear,
hear, hear.) There were principles which, generally
speaking, ought to be considered of universal application ;
but would any man say that there might not be times and
circumstances, the urgency of which should at least ren-
der the application of those principles a doubtful matter?
Ought not men to look at the result of any course of pro-
ceeding which they adopted ? A man might, in deference
to necessity, give up that to which, in ordinary times, he
would have tenaciously adhered. It was so with the Re-
form Bill. The adoption of it in its fullest extent would
he fatal to Monarchy; but would the Noble Duke have
done his duty to the Monarchy had he left it to the full
operation of the Bill, and bad he not proposed such a mo-
dification as would render it less noxious ? By so doing
the Noble Duke had taken the course the least prejudicial
to the interests of the Monarchy, and for so doing the No-
ble Duke should have his support.
The Earl of CARNARVON did not rise to praise the
Noble Duke, for his conduct was above all praise. The
Noble Lords opposite had assumed that the object of their
Administration was external tranquillity. Now the re-
sult proved that no Ministers ever were more la mentably
deficient in obtaining the object at which they aimed.--
The fact was, that they had been poking the fire of public
discontent, and putting on fresh coals, and now they ex-
claimed that it was too hot.—(A laugh.) A more vio-
lent and cruel duresse than they had attempted to impose
upon their Sovereign could not be imagined. Their ex-
cuse was, that they were anxicus to prevent a collision be-
tween the two Houses of Parliament. That, however,
was not their object. They endeavoured to press this re-
volutionary measure on a reluctant, honest, and con.
scientious Sovereign; not because there was a collision
between the two Houses of Parliament, but because in
their fretful anticipations they conceived it possible that
some time or other there might he. If he were a suspi-
cious man, he would say that they had hurried on the vio-
lent course which they had pursued, because they knew
that if they had given time for the introduction of the
measure which it w is intended on his (Lord Carnarvon's)
side of the House to propose, all their votes must fail to
produce any collision between the two Houses.—(Hear,
hear.) They could not have induced even a Reformed
House of Commons to come to such a collision. A col-
lision ! Could that point have been made a matter
of collision which the other }louse of Parliament had
avowedly viewed as a matter of indifference ? But
even if the alterations which might have been made
in the Committee had affected the efficiency of the
gill (the probability of which he denied), the Noble
Lord knew very well that no act of the Committee
was definitive. Why not, therefore, wait until the
decision of the House upon the Report of the Com-
mittee, before the advice was given to the Crown to exer-
cise its prerogative? Why? But because, in that case,
neither the House of Commons nor the country would
have had the means of knowing what the amendments
were which it was proposed to introduce into the Bill ;
and because it would have been impossible to keep alive
the agitation which it was their great object to promote.
To ask the Sovereign not only to make five, or six, or
twenty Peers, but to promise to make as many more as
Ministers might think necessary, was nothing less thin to
ask him to put the Crown in Commission, and to make
the Noble Earl opposite the First Commissioner.—(Neer,
heir, hear.) They who professed to abolish corrupt
boroughs, were anxious to make the whole House of
Lords a corrupt proprietary borough in the hands of the
Lord Protector of the realm.—(Hear, hear, hear.) The
question was reduced to this.—Was his Majesty, or the
Noble Earl, to be at the head of the State? He repeated
that if an opportunity had been afforded for hearing the
propositions which his side of the House had intended to
bring forward, the public agitation would, at least, have
been suspended. He did not impute to the Noble Earl any
wish to deceive the Sovereign ; but, in the whole history of
the country, could any other Minister be found who would
have made such a proposition as that which had been made
by the Noble Earl ? When his Majesty, himself a Reformer,
wished, probably,to modify the mea -ure, and to try what con-
ciliation would do before, by the exercise of his Royal pre-
rogative, he violated the independence of one of the
llouses of Parliament, he was abandoned by his Ministers;
leadnd trhere theved Noble
his
Earl o
communicatione n pl i ne d thatwith
itrhrei itr Lo
ca
io n r. d h ps
He
Irtigegaert,l
htoeaarsk )_te
whhetNiieoe Earl,rblsucii who
a cool, once(iel wawa
einsWulhtigh—ad
eLv:eibi sliel'ae"ef un off
t or e'
sinceheerted a k ebtnhya Br
e from time
ittlsrives whitish
et
Minister
lb
iln t
e osfetrh the e Cromwell
Houseoi trhdeerr
e House
odf C‘ othoa:f
-t
!)nons?--( Hear, hear.) If the demand of the Noble Earl
had been by violence extorted from the Sovereign, more
feature,
u rea,ni,e,wusbpieapwero., whichuld have been removed from their Lord-
ships' Table. From that time their functions as an in-
dependent part of the British Constitution would have
ceased;and they would have been delivered over to a
power armed with the whip of a slaveelttt
rougof h driver.nloi
et e
ni Tns
ehi
its
oNfo
theb
main e
Earl, in telling their Lordships that they might have
altered
oatid p nhtes: l aheohibited them from tnak-
tiv'loi P
i g t slightest alteration whatever in the measure. If
t s
eiNel'te ibltehheaEd Bill
hadarglonint
e beyond
dh
succeeded in depriving the House of
Lords of their ancient prerogatives, it was evident that he
c iuld not have dared to stop there. Having quitted the
path of right for that of error, he must have proceeded to
,rime. There was no halting. The end must have been
revolution. The Noble Earl must in his career have re-
sembled Robespierre.—(A laugh.) Noble Lords might
iAtigh, but he must be a bold man who would say what a
itionth's continuance of the desperate course on which the
Earl had entered might not have produced. On that sub-
j:et he would refer to the history of Europe fur the last
forty years, every page of which contained a most useful
lesson. He had already trespassed upon their Lordships'
attention at much greater length than he had intended;

and Its would, alaarators, now molly shove that the 014,
or t tking into consideration the Reform Bill in Committee
,e discharged.
Earl MULGRAVE expressed his astonishment at the
,bservations which had fallen from the Noble Earl, who
certainly, under all the circumstances of the case, had
thrown out a most injudicious sarcasm against his Noble
Friend, in observing that he bad once been a Whig. It
the Noble Duke opposite had resumed the reins of Govern-
ment, and had, notorious anti-Reformer as he was, pro-
posed the adoption of the Reform Bill, he (Lord Mul-
grave) would never have shrunk from the duty of express-
ing, day after day, his opinion of such indefensible con-
duct. He was happy, however, to observe, from the state
of the benches on the other side of the House, that No-
ble Lords did not see much probability of such an oc-
currence.

admiree re Atil:terqaudeders oessf
oSfAtLhleSßNUohßleYEcaoruildoniuotiossusfficly
e),iewnths
had waited till the Noble Duke (Wellington) left the
House—(Cries of " No" from the Ministerialists and
cheers from the Opposition)—who had waited, he repeated,
till the Noble Duke left the House before he commenced
an attack which he (Lord Salisbury) had no hesitation in
pronouncing one of the most unfair, urjust, and uncour-
teous attacks ever made by one Peer against another in
that House.—(Hear.) The Noble Lord had made no at-
tack--he did not even mention the name of the Noble
Duke until after his Noble Friend left the House, and then
it was he made that attack to which be (Lord Salisbury)
did not think it worth his while to reply.—(A laugh from
the Ministerialists, and Hear ! from the Opposition.) The
statement that Noble Dake bad made reflected as much ho-
nour on him as it did disgrace on those pretended friends of
the Monarchy who had dared to insult their Sovereign,
—(Hear)--by offering him ' advice which he did not
scruple to pronounce highly treasonable, and one which,
in other and better times, would have been instantly fol-
lowed by the impeachment of those who tendered it.—
(Hear, and a laugh.) The time might yet come when
they would be called to the bar of the House to answer for
that advice ; but at all events, he bad the consolation of
knowing that history would mark them as the destroyers
of their country.—(Hear.) He did not ascribe motives,
that would be disorderly—(Hear, and a laugh)—but he
knew that those who had done their best endeavours to
ruin their country, would go down with disgrace to pos.
terity.—(Hear, hear.)
The Marquess of CLANRICARDE contended that the
Noble Duke (Wellington) had not left the House at the
time his Noble Friend (Mulgrave) began to speak, and he
certainly believed that the Noble Duke would have stopped
to hear his Noble Friend's observations. He (Clanri-
ricarde) confessed it was with some surprise he heard the
debate, on an occasion of this kind, turned into an attack
on his Majesty's Ministers, who were, it was well known,
placed at that moment in a situation so peculiarly embar-
rassing. He did not intend to say one word in disparage_
went of the character of the Noble Duke, nor would he,
on his aide, impute motives ; but this ho might say, that
the debate of that evening, and
,the whole character of
the proceedings, tended much and most unfortunately to
lower the character of public men in the eyes of the
country.—(Hear, hear.) No one could, however, stand
higher than the Noble Earl now again at the head of the
Government. He had accepted office and held it with
the unabated confidence of his Sovereign. He bad retired
from it honoured by the praises of the country, and with
no other opponents than those who had declared themselves
unable to maintain possession of their places, because their
measures were so impolitic that they had rendered them-
selves obnoxious to their country.—(Hear, hear.)
The Earl of Al ULGRAVE denied that he had spoken
of the Noble Duke is the manner described by the Noble
Marquess. He had, in truth, cautiously abstained from
doing so, for two reasons—one, because the Noble Duke
was not in his place, and the other, because the Noble
Duke had not succeeded in his attempts to form a Ministry.
It was too much, however, for the Noble Marquess to put
forth the doctrine, that one Peer of Parliament was not to
express his opinion., because another pleased to leave the
House when the clock showed the arrival of some particu-
lar hour, which rendered it inconvenient for him to stay.
The Nl,rquess of SALISBURY had gained quite
enough when he heard from the Noble Earl (Mulgrave)
an admission that he spoke of the Noble Duke in his ab-
sence, and after he saw him leave the House.—(Hear.)
With respect to the Noble Earl's opinions of the conduct
of that Noble Duke, he (Lord S.) was quite prepared to
go into a discussion on that question whenever the Noble
Earl pleased.
The Earl of CARNARVON, in explanation, said, that
all his observations referred to the creation of Peers, and to
nothing else. With respect to what had been reported of
his disclosures on the subject of the new Ministry, and his
declaration that it was forming, but not formed, he had
only to say, that he had no connexion with that forma-
tion ; but having given notice of his intention to proceed
with the Reform Bill, he had felt it his duty, in the mean-
time, to ascertain what was the situation of affairs. He
applied, therefore, to a Noble Friend of his, whom he
knew to possess information on the subject, and from him
he learned that which he had stated to the House, and
which had guided him with reference to the notice he had
given in the House.—(Hear.)
Earl DE LA WARRE had not intended to address their
Lordships on this subject opposite, but he could not permit
the observations of a Noble Earl to pass unnoticed. That
Noble Lord had ventured to assert, that the only consola-
tion of the Noble Duke was to be found in the cheers of
the friends who surrounded him.—(Hear.) If this were
true, he (Lord De La Warre) would blush for his country.
—(Hear, hear.) Happily, however, it was not so, and
veryat so ct,
h, tide fii
ffNdeer,,nebtnl
ett
.hEa
ot tdHI eeoappr u,p bobsl
bear.)
cat
e:
rfeeling on the
s
when the delusion and mystification of the present hour
sbpuaubstieeddc tnwowaonyu:ol dtbievbewes
)but Het
haitst rhie-
might say, that the whole tendency of all their movements
from the hour they accepted office, was to delude and
mystify the people of this country. He trusted in God,
however, that the hour was not distant when these de-
lusions would pass away, and the motives of the Noble
Duke be fully appreciated. It was his honest and con-
scientious opinion, and he was proud and happy to avow
it, that the Noble Duke had, in the last two days, shown a
more pure and perfect devotion to his Sovereign and to his
country, than he had heretofore displayed on the
much-talked of plains of Waterloo.—(Hear, hear,
hear.) He should not attempt to give expressions to his
feelings on the nature of the calumnies which had been
propagated with so much industry ; but if those feelings
were not prevalent iii the breast of every respectable and
thinking man throughout the empire, he should blush for
his country.—(Hear.) This consolation they bad in what
he might justly call the present agony of the State—that
there remained one man among them, who, capable of
setting aside all personal views of rising superior to all per-
sonal aggrandisement, dared to obey the command of his
Sovereign, and to endeavour to rescue the Government
front the hands of those who wished to destroy the inde-
pendence of that House, because a majority of its Members
had exhibited in the exercise of their undoubted privileges
a disposition to condemn some of the clauses of the Re-
form Bill, in an order different from that of the Com-
mons. There were men, be regretted to say, who had
dared to advise their Sovoreign to make such an addition
of Members to that House as would totally destroy its in-
dependence, because they had refused to acknowledge the
perfection of their measures, and to vote without examina-
tion for the Bill, the whole Bill, and nothing but the Bill.
(Hear, hear.) It was to check these men, in obedience
to the command of his Sovereign, that the Noble Duke
thought no sacrifices too great, and, in defiance of all the
insinuations that bad been thrown out against that Noble
Duke, he would say of the course he had adopted—
.. Virtus repulse nescia sordithe
Intaminatia fulget honoribus."—(Hear.)
The Earl of RODEN could not let that opportunity
pass without repealing his opinion, thit the Reform Bib
would be the destruction of the country, and ultimately
tear the crown from the head of the Sovereign. To the
Bill, therefore, he thought it but candid to declare, he
would give all the opposition in his power, and notwith
standing all that had been said, he would never believe
that a son of George the Third could be brought to con-
sent to a measure which would swamp the House of Peers
at the request of any Minister, no matter by whom sup-
ported.—( Hear, )
The Order of the Day for the further consideration of
the Bill in Committee was then discharged, and their
Lordships adjourned at Half-past Eight o'clock.