The Sun.
London, England, 1832-02-29 00:00:00

SPIRE r OF THE PUBLIC JOURNALS.

Surely the speech of the Duke of Wellington on
Monday evening is not to be taken as an index of
the policy by which his Grace would govern Ireland
in case of his return to power. Only conceive a
British statesman asserting gravely that the whole
of the existing agitation in Ireland on the tithe
question arises from the grant of a silk gown to Mr.
O'Connell !! We have heard before now that Ten-
terden steeple had caused the Goodwin Sands ; but
in the way of a sequitur, this vagary of his Grace
the Duke of Wellington about the Church out-soars
an hundred steeples. And does the Duke of Wel-
lington fancy that because the right of the Church
of Ireland to tithe is founded on the letter of the
law, the Government must therefore be blameable
for not enforcing the payment of that impost?
Does his Grace mean to pledge his word for the pos-
sibility of maintaining an institution from age to age,
merely because it is an institution ? Why, the penal
code against Catholics was as much protected by law
as is now the payment of -o Protestant clergy-
men. Yet who was it that gave the finisher to the
penal code, and defended the act as being one, not
of choice, but of dire necessity ? So Lord Grey
and his colleagues,—and indeed every man of the
lea,t common sense in the community,—admits
that the continuance of tithe is impossible, and that
if a thousand laws were made for its enforcement,
not one of them would be obeyed. When the
Noble Duke and other noble persons talk of the King,
being sworn to preserve " the interests of the
Church," what do they mean by the " interests" of
Church ? Is it the interest of the Church to demand
tithe froms the peasantry, and receive nothing but
execration ? Is it for the interest of the Church
to quote Acts of Parliament, and be met by an
appeal to arms ? The fact is, that laws may be
obsolete before they are repealed; and that any law
which would compel a whole nation to do what
it is determined not to do, must be executed, not by
writs or processes, but by armed soldiers.—Times.
The Earl of Aberdeen, who seems to consider
the Holy Alliance as being under his especial pro-
tection—who carefully guards the interests of that
despotic confederacy, from the Volga to the Tagus
—demands an explanation of the projected move-
ment of a French army towards the plains of
Italy. He says truly enough that the " farce of
nos-intervention has gone by, and that we shall
hear no more of it." But then his political jealousies
appear only to be excited by the Gallic violation
of that principle. He asks no question as to the
right of Austria to interfere in the internal quar-
rels of the people of the Italian States and their
rulers ;—yet, if the novel and loudly-proclaimed
principle of " non-intervention" is allowed to be
practically interpreted by any Power as mean-
ng " active interference," surely France has as
good a right to construe it in that sense as Aus-
tria. Ever since that term was introduced ir#o
the diplomacy of Europe, what have we had
but repeated violations of it ? The interference of
the " Five Powers" in the affairs of Belgium and
Holland followed close upon the first announcement
of the new political doctrine of non-intervention.
Then came the invasion of the " independent"

kingdom of Poland by the whole disposable force oi
Russia, followed by enormous carnage and the final

massacre of Warsaw, without the remonstrance of
France or England, or any other Power. Then the
A,sPrian invasion of Iraly, followed by some
slaughter in the field, but by more bloodshed on
the scaffold. Now we have both Austria and
France striving which shall show most assi-
duity in impressing upon the minds of the
miserable Italians that " non•intervention" means
nothing else than supporting the Papal brigands
in shooting and sabreing them for the love of the
Church, and through a most pious zeal for tran-
quillity and order I. Nor does Lord Aberdeen ask
any ex2laration respecting the intended intervention
of the " beloved" Ferdinand of Spain in the con-
test of two brothers for the Crown of Portugal—

not even although for some time past that champion
of " divine right" has been concentrating troops upon
the frontiers of Portugal, with the design of prac-
tising a more open and honest intervention in support
of I)on Miguel than Prussia did for the protection of
the beaten armies of the Czar in the Polish conflict.
Why is it that, amid all those violations of the prin-
ciple of non-intervention, Lord Aberdeen only ob-
jects to that of France ? Does he fear that the
armies of a free people, however unholy the mission
upon which they are sent, can never pitch their tents
within a land of slaves without carrying with them
some of that political malaria which makes the prin-
ciples of freedom contagious ?-2forning Herald.
The conspiracy to defeat the Reform Bill, which
we yesterday denounced, has been, we rejoice to
say, defeated. The motion of the 'Marqnis of Chan-
dos was rejected by a majority of 316 to 236, leav-
ing a majority of 80. We consider the representa-
tion of the metropolitan boroughs as of so much
importance in any scheme of efficient Reform, that
it would he difficult to persuade us that any one
man in the minority of 236 was a Reformer in his
heart, whatever his professions. 'We would, there-
fore, have the 236 names kept as much as possible
before the public, as men in whom little confidence
can be with safety reposed by the people. The
proposal of the Marquis of Chandos was, instead of
giving eight Members to the four metropolitan bo-
roughs, to give two additional 'Members to Middle-
sex, to add Marylehone to Westminster, Lam-
beth to Southwark, and Finsbury and the Tower
Hamlets to the city of London. His arguments
were not even plausible. One applied to all real
representation whatever, for we deem a borough-
menger nominee the real representative of his soli-
tary constituent, as much as the representative of a
populous place is of his constituency. " I cannot
help recollecting (said his Lordship) that when a
Member of the City, actuated no doubt by the most
honourable feelings, thought proper to vote accord-
ing to the dictates of his conscience, he was imme-
diately called to account by his constituents, and
overhauled, as I may say, for his conduct in Parlia-
ment, and told not to vote again in the same manner,
at the risk of losing their favour and his own seat."—
(Hear, hear.) Good Lord Chandos, do not consti-
ctents, whether single boroughmongers or bodies of
,eleetors, choose their representati yes, either because
they 'l44e their principles or like their money ?
When alaoroughmonger sells a seat at the fair market
price, the representative has an opinion of his own;
when he gives a seat, the representative votes ac-
cording to orders. Is it not notorious that the no-
minee who differs with his patron, must, if he wish
to avoid the reputation of dishonesty, immediately
take the Chiltern Hundreds ? The object of a
Reform in Parliament is to effect a conformity be-
tween the views of the constituency and the repre-
sentatives. The King, dissatisfied with the former
Parliament, appealed to the nation, and on the
great question of Parliamentary Reform every can-
didate was necessarily pledged one way or the
ether, If, after the election, representatives were
to be thoroughly independent of their constituents,
and free in all questions to take whatever side they
please, what is the use of representatives at all ?
tf there is to be no conformity between the views
of the constituency and the representative, the re-
presentative may be named for the constituency by
others, as well as by them. The very object of re-
presentation is to enable the people of an extended
empire to do by deputies what the inhabitants of a
single town can do by themselves. Many questions
cannot be anticipated ; many questions must be de-
cided without delay. In all such cases the repre-
sentative must act according to the best of his own
judgment ; and his constituents, if they believe him
conscientious, will make due allowance for views
and opinions which they may not share. But in
cases where the opinions of a constituency are well
known, to say that a representative should not be
pledged at his election to support them, or that he
ought not to be called to account for a departure
from his pledge, is to say in so many words that
there should be no community of views between the
people and those who represent them, and that the
people
should have no assurance that their interests
will be pretested by those whom they ssild 3 9

liament. This piece of aristocratical affectation of ti
independence of a constituency, is the more offen-
sive from its proceeding from those who lick the
hands of their borough patrons. It would be ridi-
culous, were it riot too mischievous to be ridiculous,
for there are weak men who have the folly to dis-
claim the having given pledges to their constituents,
and who think they show their independency by
avowing that they entered Parliament free and un-
shackled, as they phrase it. The Noble Marquis
was unable to show that on any principle recog-
nised as efficient in a scheme of Reform, the metro-
politan districts ought not to be represented. S'r
Edward Sugden acknowledged, that whether wealth
or population were taken as a criterion, the metro-
polis ought at least to have fifty Members. The
real objection to the metropolitan boroughs is, that
the representatives would be efficient, that they
would attend to the interests of their constituents,
instead of favouring the views of the enemies of the
people. "We shall, if we agree to this vote (said
the Noble Marquis), be placing these district bo-
roughs in the hands of individuals who will have
nothing but local interests to protect, and who
must necessarily have a strong leaning towards po-
pular questions, and that in a degree far too warm
to be consonant with the real interests of the coun-
try." Local interests ! nothing but local interests
to attend to ! But the interests of a nation are an
aggregate of local interests ; and of these local in-
terests, the interests of a place paying one-half of
the assessed taxes of all England, and containing a
share of the wealth of the empire out of all propor-
tion greater than corresponds to its large popula-
tion, are surely worth more attending to, than the
interests of a hundred such places as Buckingham.
The eight Members for the metropolitan boroughs
will no doubt represent feelings and opinions that
exist in the metropolis ; and, if it be said that these
feelings and opinions should not have representa-
tives in Parliament, this is striking at popular repre-
sentation altogether. What ! in a House of 652
Members, grumble at eight for four boroughs, con-
taining each three or four times more property—at
least paving three or four times more assessed
taxes—than any other town in the island ! The
Tory aristocracy must be amazingly afraid of popu-
lar representalioa. But, as was well observed by
Mr. Macaulay, " the fear was still more remarkable;
for the Noble Lord proposed to add two Members
to Middlesex; so that it might be said that the
Noble Lord feared six Members—a number not so
great as was returned by some individual Peers to
that House." Mr. Macaulay very happily exposed
the pride and the meanness conjoined, which in-
volved the only argument against the giving repre-
sentatives to the metropolitan boroughs :
"The only argument (said the Honourable and Learned
Gentleman; against giving representatives to the metropolitan
districts was, that the Members would be called to a very strict
account by their constituents ; that they would not speak their
own sense, but merely the fluctuating sense of those who sent
them as their representatives. But that argument applied as
strongly to the instances of Members returned by individuals.
He did not understand the grounds on which those who repre-
sented the submission of Members to be called to account by a
numerous constituency as a disgrace, thought it a point of
honour to submit to the same strictness of account in an indi-
vidual. He did not understand that spirit of honour that could
lick the heels of an Oligarchy, while it spurned at the wishes of
the people.—(Hear, hear.) He did not understand that point
of honour which made a man boast that he had gone out of
his seat because he had voted in a particular manner against the
wishes of one man, his patron, while he taunted another Mem-
ber for quitting his seat solely because he had offended 12,000
persons.—(Hear, hear.;"
The dread is the influence of the people, as if the
metropolis ought not to have influence in any Par-
liament, or as if it were possible to prevent its hav-
ing influence. " Even in Tutkey, in despotic Tur-
key," as Mr. Macaulay observed, " even there,
where raged the most absolute, the most unmiti-
gated despotism, the tyrant of Constantinople was
often forced to obey the will of the people living in
he neighbourhood of the Seraglio." One distinction
aken by Mr. Macaulay is well deserving the at-
ention of those violent men who wish to exasperate

the people, and who do not see how much their own
power and influence depends on the existence of
kindly feelings between themselves and the people.
" From all time," he said, "the city of London had
been of great importance in the struggles of party or
of the people ; and it has generally, by the force of
its power, decided these struggles ; but it would be
absurd to think of making a law to regulate a
power which was only to be directed when all law
was at an end. As long as the rule of law con-
tinued, the power of London would consist of
1,500,000 men, and of that power there was nothing
to deprive it. As long as regular Government ex-
isted, the metropolis was, in fact, weak ; but when
the course of regular Government was disturbed, the
metropolis possessed, and could employ, a vast and
overwhelming force.—(Hear.)" The Tories, who
are constantly seeking to produce confusion, cannot
be brought to understand that though they might not
be the only sufferers, the first effect of confusion
would be to destroy them. At a well-known period
in our history, when a weak King, trusting in his
Church and his Nobility, and setting at defiance his
people, the interruption of order in London pro-
duced results which, we trust, Noble Lords do not
wish to see repeated. In a tract published in 1648,
called " The Church's Eleventh Persecution," we
have, by a Zealot of the High Church side, a striking
picture of the manner in which the people of Lon-
don treated the House of Lords. " Mr. Pym (said
the writer) is sent into the city to make speeches
against obstructions in the body politic, that Refor-
mation could not go on till they were removed,
which soon raised the city in tumults to petition
the Parliament that the Bishops and Popish Lords
might be thrown out of the House of Peers, as the
only hinderers of reformation of religion, thereby
indeed to lessen the number of votes likeliest to op-
po-e the Puritan faction ; those tumults daily in-
creasing (upon the countenance they found from the
Parliament, where they were 1)14 to come like
men, that is with swords) by the rabble of por-
ters, and apprentices daily sent by their masters,
hut chiefly by their mistresses, with clubs and
swords, to cry for reformation at the Parlia-
ments' doors ; the faction in London having
also combined to shut up their shops for many days
together, and persuaded others to do the like, upon
some pretended fears ; but the truth was, to make
the poor people in and about the city a pretence to
mutiny for want of work, so heightened the faction
in the House of Commons that they sent up Mr.
Hollis to the House of Peers to demand the names
of the dissenting Lords, that so they might expose
them to the people's fury (as they posted the dis-
senting Members of the House of Commons in the
case of the Earl of Stafford); the ringleaders, who
led the route, were Dr. Burgess and Captain Ven,
who sent tickets by porters and emissaries to raise
these myrmidons ; who, with this confused army,
as,aulting the Bishop of Lincoln's house in West-
minster, had his brains dashed out with a stone from
the wall, and was buried at the collected charges
among the apprentices. The House of Peers, thus
drily assaulted without, and wanting no false bre-
thren within, was not likely to hold out any long
siege. Some Lords had their cloaks torn from their
backs at the Parliament doors, nor could the Bishops
or Popish Lords, as they called them, come to the
House without apparent hazard of their persons."
This is a sample of what people will do when the
bonds of law are dissolved. The idea of Mr.
Macaulay is both profound and happily expressed.
It will be seen that Lord Sandon, who, by the in-
fluence of the Government, threw out a genuine
Reformer in Liverpool, voted against the metropo-
litan districts.-3forning Chronicle.
The discussion of the Reform Bill was last night
very greatly impeded in the Commons by a motion
on the part of Alderman Thompson, which at any
other time would have been sensible and judicious,
but which, at the present moment, was very ill-
natured, or very ill-timed. It was a motion for the
reduction of the duty on soap and in lieu of it the
imposition of a duty on Russian tallow. Lord Al-
thorp is evidently inclined to give to the subject
his best consideration, and had due notice been given
of the motion, or had the motion been brought for-
ward at a proper period, there can be no doubt that
it would have met with thw most favourable *Wen-

Lion ; but no notice was given of it ; and what is
more, it was excessively ill-timed. We are most
anxious to see the duty on soap, and the duties on
all other articles of general consumption, either
totally repealed, or so reduced in amount, as to be
but partially felt by the poorer classes of society ;
but had it been in our power to have made a motion
on the subject, we should assuredly have refrained
from doing so at the present moment. Mr. Hunt
gave the Alderman a very respectable dressing on
the subject, which, we trust, will not be very spee-
dily either by him, or by his bit-and-bit
companions. The present is no time for play, and
nonsense—the Anti-Reform army is in the field, and
be who is not to be found in the ranks of the Re-
formers, must be set down as a deserter from them,
or an abettor of those who are united against them.—
Morning Advertiser.

The question of giving eight additional Members
to the metropolis was discussed in the House of
Commons last night, when this perhaps the most
of jectionable provision of the whole Bill was car-
carried by a majority of 316 to 236. The powerful
speech of Sir Robert Peel would hare set the matter
at rest in any assembly but one of pledged delegates.
Mr. Macaulay, adopting his usual method of pro-
pounding vague and general theories, which appear
plausible enough at first sight and therefore pass
for eloquence, but which will not bear a moment's
deliberate scrutiny, asserted, that the surest way
to guard against popular commotions in the me-
tropolis on political questions, was to give repre-
sentatives to the districts at present unrepresented;
and stated, as a general principle, that Parliamentary
representation, by affording a legitimate mode of
expression to the popular will, always acts as a
safety valve to discontent and excitement. Sir R.
Peel, in allusion to this argument, recalled the atten-
tion of the House from the theoretical speculations
and generalities of the Member for Caine to the
matter of fact, and proceeded to shew that practice,
so far from bearing out these dogmas, proved them
to be utterly fallacious. The Right Hon. Baronet,
with peculiar felicity, adduced the examples of Not-
tingham and Bristol, two places in which the right
of suffrage is on the most popular scale, yet to which
his Majesty's Government found it necessary to
send down two Special Commissions subsequently
to the introduction of the Reform Bill. Again, as
to the qualification, Sir R. Peel spewed that in many

provincial boroughs the total number of houses is
to the number of 101. houses as eight to one, in

others as six to one, in others four to one, and in
few less than two to ene. Thus for the most part
in the count!), the number of voters will be to the

number of householders in the proportion of only
one to three or four. Yet in each of the metro-
politan districts proposed to be enfranchised the
constituency will be more extensive than if an
universal suffrage of householders were e,tablished ;
in the metropolis, as Sir Robert Peel proved from
official returns, the number of voters will be ac•
tually greater than the number of householders !
This extraordinary result arises from the right
of voting which will be acquired by lodgers
paying ten pound a.year and upwards. But let
any man imagine for a moment the quality of
the constituency thus provided for the metro-
polis; the scores of thousands of the veriest
rabble which the King's Ministers would call
forth, for the purpose of choosing eight, or we
might more properly say with Sir Edward Sug-
den, twc.and-twenty Members of Parliament, who
tire to appear as the representatives of the fist
city in the empire. A man who pays so low a
rent as twenty pounds is exempted, as Sir E. Sug-
den observed, from the payment of the poor's rate,
and is not considered fit to have any voice in pa-
rochial matters ; yet, by this monstrous Reform Bill,
not only men of the above description, but men who
rent houses of 10/. value, nay those who are unable
to pay any rent at all, and therefore let out their
houses to lodgers who make up the rent for them,
are to exercise a right which will be equivalent to a
full and entire controul over all the wealth, talent, and
respectability of this great metropolis. Such is the
project which the Ministers and the adherents declare
to be an essential portion of the Reform measure.
The Marquis of Chandos opened the debate with
much ability, and justly argued that there is no neces-
sity whatever for giving additional representatives to
the meti.ropolis, because, on account of its being the
seat of Government, and the residence of so many
Members of the Legislature, its interests are never
disregarded, but, on the contrary, are always at-
tended to with peculiar care, even on matters com-
paratively trivial; witness the large attendance of
Members when St. Saviour's Church was recently

the subject of discussion. Under whatever point
of view we regard this project of metropolitan
boroughs, it appears the most dangerous, the most
unwarrantable, and withall the most unnecessary in•
novation that is contemplated by the Ministerial
scheme of Morm. Threats, of course, were held
forth last night against the House of Lords with re-
gard to this point; but if the Bill, which we can
scarcely believe, shall be suffered to pass the second
reading, the Radicals may be satisfied that the enfran-
chisement of the metropolitan suburbs will never be
sanctioned by the Upper House of Parliament.—
Morning Post.