The Sun.
London, England, 1835-08-03 00:00:00

MARLBOROUGH-STREET.

The Rev. J. Wood and. Dr. G. Wood, of 34, Halfmoon-
street, Piccadilly, were brought before Mr. Dyer, on a peace-
warrant, obtained by Mr. Thomas Nelson Waterfield, who
made oath that he believed it was the intention of the defend-
ants to send his brother, Mr. Charles Waterfield, a challenge
to fight a duel, and thereby to cause him to commit a breach
of the peace.
The Rev. J. Wood having declared that he was ignorant of
the reason why he had been taken into custody,
Mr. DYER read the charge in the warrant to him.
Mr. Thomas Waterfield—l swear that the words used by
the defendant could have no other construction than that a duel
was contemplated. The words used were that he (the Rev.
Mr. Wood) would expose my brother at a public office, and
that he had no doubt my brother would take advantage of his
assurance, or of law, but he should not care for either. He
also asked me for my brother's direction, and when I declined
to give it, a gentleman called at my house,, on the part of the
Rev. Mr. Wood, with a message.
. . .

Mr. DrEs.--Was this message what is understood in com.
mon parlance, according to your belief, to be of a hostile cha
racier? Mr. Water&ld—lt was.

Mr. DYER—Now, Mr. Wood, before you explain this mat-
ter, I don't want you to enter unnecessarily into family dis-
putes ; and perhaps the matter might be cut short if you
would give your word that you will not do any thing which
may tend to a breach of the peace.
The Rev. Mr. Wood—lt -is very unpleasant to be brought
here ?-o answer a charge of which I am quite ignorant. I
don't thinl.92at what has occurred could have justified the
a little warm in my temper, and at-
present steps. f
tempts have been made to get me to send a letter which
might be construed in a hostile sense, so that I might be
brought before a magistrate ; but nothing of the sort has
taken place.
Mr. DYER—You have no intention of committing a breach
of the peace, Dr. Wood ? Dr. Wood—Certainly not. I
should think as soon of sending a challenge to Mr. Waterfield
as to a cabman.

Mr. Thomas Waterfield—That is language any thing but
conciliatory.
Mr. DYER—I think the whole matter may be easily arranged.
An explanation has been given, and the intention denied, so
that I do not see how I can hold either party to bail.
Mr. DYER, having received a promise from both defendants
that no breach of the peace should occur, discharged the
warrant.

PRICES OF CANALS, DOCK STOCKS,

ASSURANCE COMPANIES, &c. &c. &c.

LONDON, FRIDAY, JULY 31.

. .
Number Divlfiend Pace
of per CANALS, per
Shares. Annum. Paid. Share.
1,7E0 61 per cent. Aslitoll and Oldham....Average 97s 18s. sh. 160
1,482 6/. Ashby de.! ..touch .........Average 113/. sh. 05
1,260 Basingstoke • WO/. sh. 51
1.005 5/. Brecknock and AbeNavenny ..... l5O .sh P 5
4,0045 h. 121. 10s. Birmingham, 1 share 171. 10s. 248
400.1 Ditto and Liverpool Junct....!1,01. sh. all pd
COO ...... ... Bridgewater and Taunton —.1061 4h. all pd 64
400 N. Chelmer and Blackwater ICV sh. 102
500 421. Coventry (001. di.
DOCKS.
21" 8i }3p. c. Commercial ....... .. ....... ..........100/. sh. ( 0
1,0050 h
198,6611.
3,238,3104 21. ss. p. ct. London
Ditto Bonds lO3

1,380,0001. 51. per et. West India Stock 1)5
2,'_o i 3/. 6s. 4d. Bristol ........- ........... Average 14 il. Iva. sh.
68,324/. 5/. per cent. Ditto Notes, various amounts ll6
1.152,752 3 p-r ci nt. St. Katharine Stock 70
500,003 ti per cent. Ditto Bonds lO4l
200,000 , per cent. Ditto Bonds for 10 yea rs lo.'
Shoreham Harbour 2571
BRIDGES.
„600 1/. Hammersmith 5Ol. sh. 23
7,231 Southwark, Old Av. t3l. 2s. Sd. sh. 21
1,710 14 155. Ditto, New, of 71 per cent 5Ol. sh. 15
5,000 . • Waterloo lOO4 '.h. 21
5,000 11. 2s. Ditto, Old Annuities of 84 6O/. pd 25
5,000 llis. :kl. Ditto, New Ditto of 71 401. pd 22
60,0001. LI. per cent. I itto 80nd5........-- ........... . ... .„ - - ... ... 118
0,000 I/. Vauxhall Average 704 lbs. 3d. sh. 221
ASSURANCE CO3IPANIES.
2,000 31 10s Albion 5004 sh. 50/. pd 761
50,000 15 and Alliance, British & Foreign 1004 sh. 10/. pd 111
rdcsesr. it .}
50,000 6 per cent. Ditto, Marine 1001. sh. 5/. sd 51
21,000 F. per sh. Atlas
1,20015 h. 41. Birmingham Fire .....2501. sh. 551.1x1 105
20,000 4/. per cent. British Fire ... 250/. sh. 501. pd 40
12,000 ft per cent. British Commercial 501. sh. 5/. pd 61
5,000 51. per cent. Clerical, Medical, &c. Life... 1004 sh. 2/10s lid 31
4,000 2/ 105 County WO/. sh. 10/. pd 42
6,000 ss. Eagle 50/. sh. 51. pd 51
200 i:per cent.
nd 30/ ~,,,.} Economic Life lOOO/. sh. 2504 pd 315
2,271 51/. per cent. European Lite 'XI/. sh. all pd 22
50,000 2s. Ditto, New "01. sh. 21. pd 11
1,000,000/. 71. per ct. Globe • .... Mock 133
20,000 IL Guardian 1001. sh. 201. pd :341
C Fire 5 ct 7
4°." [Life Bp p cc. j Hope ............501. sha 51.. pd 6;
2,400 5/. 7a. lid. Imperial Fire 5001. sh. 50/. pd 117
7,500 9s. Imperial Life 100/. sh. 10/. pd i I
5/. per cent. Indemnity Marine 1.01. sh. 8/. pd 12
2,020 31 lOs Ke ~t Fire 50/. sh. all pd 92
10,- 00 ifs. Law Life 100/. sh. 101, pd 26
3,900 1/. London, Fire 251. sli. 12/. 10s pd 2:li
31 00) 1/. I.ondeii. Ship •)51. sh. Lt. 10s. pd 231
3.,0 /0 :/. per cent. Palladium Life 501. sh. 21. pd t 18.
251,001 Is. 6,1. I 'rotei.tor File • 'O4 sh. 21. pd 1184 I'd
2,500 11. Provident Life llOl. sii. 11. pd 101
100,000 ss. Rock Life 20/. sh. :.1. pd r../ his.
08:.,2-X1 51. per ceut. Royal Exchange Sto k... 1r45

Sun
50,C00 4 per cent United King oin Life '2l. pd 212 s tki
JOINT STOCK BANKS

5,000 ......... AtPtrala• is 404 sh. 261. pd 32
10,1110 10 per cent. Rank of Birmingham 5, 1. sh. 104 pd 12,1
10,000 10 per cent. Birmingham Bank 5Ol. sh. 51. pd 12
18,000 2 per cent. I.ondon and Westminster...loo/ sh, 154 pd 124
3,000
2.5,1100 6 per cent. Liverpool M. sh. 101. . d 1 I
20,000 7 per cent. Provimild 'lank of Ireland-100/ A. 251 pd 47
10,000 National Pr,viacial Log. lOOl. sn. .254 pd ....1
10,000 10 per cent. Gloucestershire 501. ,h. 5/. pd 11
6,000
WATER WORKS.
. ___ ..... _. .

4,800
4,431
4,500
2,600

38
I,soo
6,4 86
1,000
R, 00
1,360

Aso
2,000
2,300

2,000
2,1'41
1,500
5,100

0,000
i,500
too

14,000
4,000
1:',0(10

2,1100
10,064)
6,0 0

Birmingham ---
951. sh. 251 pd 27
5/. East London lOO/. sh. Itl2j
21 10; ttr lid Junction Average 41/ 13s. 4d. sh. 51
2/. Kent 100/. sh. 4flat7
Jul. Li vet pool Bootle 2201. sh. 300
2110 s New River London Bridge Water Annu ties 58
1/. Manchester and Salford
4 per cent. SotitlOLonflon lOO/ sh. 85
31. West 31i.ldlesex ....Average 03/. 12s. pd. sh. 18
1111 s York Building Co. Lessee Prop 1001. sh. 34
IRON RAILWAYS.
Cheltenham 1004 sh. 73
Clarence lOOl. rh. 115)1 pc! 45
12s. Forest of Dean 5O/. p:1 27
(hand Junction 1001. sh 301. p 54
I lurtlepool 104)!. sh. 100/ pil 80
I.eeds and Selby lt 0 sh. 100
...... ... Leicester and Swannington -.5,1. sh all pa 51
it p:., cent. Liverpool and Manchester...loo/.sh. 100/. pd
Ditto Quarter Shares • 51. tiff
London and tirevnwich 2Ol. sh. 1:i/. ixi IS
London and Birmingham ...100/. sh. 354 p 1 5Si
...... ... London ane S utharrititfin Wl. sh. 11. p.l 5
Preston and Wigan .... 2Ol. pd 2
Durha•ii Junction lOOl. sh. 104 ix! 10 pm
MINES.
Albion Copper 51. sh. 2/. pd
Alien 15!. sh. 10!. 10s. pd Ili
... ..... Anglo Itlexivitt, iss. Si. ptu....100/. sh, all pd
Ilftto Sutiscripiton 'l5/. pd 6
Ibil nos .., 150/. sh all pd
Brazilian Inip. iss. 5/. pm 351. sh. 20/ IA
llacanbas riz Comes United 25/ sh 2111. pJ V
DiT to St. John 15,1 Hey. ..... 2Ol. sh. 711. pd
Cam Branca .V. pd
Candonga . 5l. IA
Bolivur Copy,: Company "01. sh. 20/. pd
I)it o Scrip .. "1 pd
British Copper ..51 sh. 3;/. pal ei
Colin:ilium, iss. Ll. pin. 551 sh. 5-141. lid
English l2/ I. s. pd
General Mining Association...2o/. sh. 151. pd
Mexican Cornpariy 10 1. sh 41(1. pc!
Pokierou Consols II)!. sh 8/. pfl
Real del Monte, Unregistered
Ditto Loan Notes l5O/. pd
United Mexican, iss. 2 pm ...AM sh. all pd 4
Ditto Subscription "1. pd
Ditto-NeW.Serip 5/ pd (1
Union cold, iss. 21. 56. pm ...2211. sh. W. pd 221
West Cork 501. 61t. 25/. pd
LITERARY INSTITUTIONS.
London, with Bronze Ticket 750 t. sit. 21
Lon& it University IOU!. sh. all pd 27
Busse!, 05gs. sh. 8
King's College 1001. pd 411
31ISCELLA NEOUS.

0,0(

6,000
t,,500
-0
N,OOO
6,155
2,009

30,000

5.( 00

s

,0,0;0 les. Australian Agricultural....lo,/. sh. VV. pd
1,030 11. Auction Mart 50/. ,h. 354
RAO ..... —.. Brit.sh American Land Company sq. pd bi
10,000 61 per cent. C 411313 Company 1001. sh. 20/, pd 3
200,000 5/. per cent. Upper Canada Loan
City Bonds, 4 per cent lO2l
15,000 1/. per cent. 4;cricral Steam Nav:gation ...151. sh. 121. pd
1:1. per cent. Hudson's Bay Stock 230
2,000 1/. London Coin. Sale Itoom Av. 751. sh. 18
2,754 4/. per e. nt. Reversionary Interest 50c...100/ sh. 10t1. pd 120

LIST OF SCOTTISH COMPANIES' PRICES,
JULY 1, 183.
BANKS.
1,500,00 N. Si. p. et. Ban': of .cotl.itid B3!. 6s. 841. sh. all pd 2021 p. c
2,000,0001. 54 p. ct. Royal of Scotland 100/. sh. all pd 1,0/.
500.000/. ti p. ct. British Linen Company lOW. sh. 411 pd 2401.
3,000,0001. V/. p. ct. Coir.mercial .. 5OOl. sh. 1001. ix! 1.01.
5,000,000/. 5 p. ct National lOOl. sh. 101. pd 141 10s
2,00 ,0001. 244 p. ct. Glasgow Union 2504 sh. 501. pd 60/.
4,000,000/. 6p. ct. Western of Scotland 2OOI. sh 301. pd 33/.
INSURANCE COMPANIES
250,000511 sp. et. Stottish Union .201. sh. 11. pd 19a
7,500 sp. et. Hercules 100/. sh. 10/. i d 111.
100,000 sp. ct. Insurance Co. of Scotland....lol. sh. all pd 710 s
50,000 6p. et. North British 2OOl sh. 10/. pd 151.
1,000 sp. et. Caledonian Fire 100/. sh. 10/. pd 131
5,000 6p. et. Edinburgh I.ife 1001. sh. 10/. pd 141.
100,000 4p. ct. %Vest of Scotland lO/. ix] 9/.
MISCELLANEOUs
4,910 Edin. and Glas Un. Cana1...501. sh. all pd 8110,
Ditto Allocated .. ".. . - .... . 94/. At all pd 60/.
5,400 5 per cent. Edinb. Joint Stock Wa ............ sh. all pd 331
Carron Iron Company 250/. sh, all pd 450/.
2,001>h. 15 per cent. Shotts Iron Founuery 501. sh. 3-/. pd 181.
10,000 3 per cent. Edinburgh & Leith Glass 204 sh. 161. pd rl.
4,500 lOper rent. Edinburgh Coal Gas '25/. sh. all psi 65/.
4,450 10 per cent. Glasgow Gas
730. 6 per cent. Leith Coal Gas .204 sh. ail pd 33/. j
.._ .. ... .

1,t:00 5 ivr cent. Edinburgh and Mean hallway...sol. eh. 75/.
3,000 10s. per sh. Equitable Loan Company sh. 91. pd 10/.

PA RLIAMENTARY PROCEED IN iS.

ROUSE OF COMMONS.

NOTICES of MOTIONS and ORDERS of the DAY, which

now stand in the Order Book for the Present Week. •
MONDAY, AUGUST 3.-03NDERS OF THE DAY.
1. Turnpike Acts Continuance. Bill—Second reading.
2. Public Roads (Ireland) Bill—Second reading.
3. Polls at Elections Bill—Third reading. •
4. Bankrupts' Estates Bill—Third reading.
5. Thomas Moore Keith—Adjourned Debate.
6. Ecclesiastical Revenues Bill---Second reading,
7. Sheriffs' Declaration Bill—Thlra reading.
8. Sun)ly (13th July)—Postponed Resolu,ions to be considered.
9. Glasgow Univers►ty Bill—Committee.
10. Church of Ireland Bill—Committee.
11. Election Expenses Bill—Further consideration of Report..
12. Qualification of Members Bill—Further consideration of Report
13. Lighthouses Bill—Second reading.
14. Music and Dancing Licenses Bill—Committee.
la.
Supply—Committee.
16. Ways and Means—Committee.
17. Prisons Regulation Bill—Committee.
13. Clandestine Marriages (Ireland) Bill—Report.
19. Landed Securities (Ireland) Bill—Committee.
20. Imprisonment for Debt Bill—Report.
21. Ecclesiastical Courts Bill—Second reading.
22. Stafford Disfranchisement Bill—Third reading.

`4.

Yet this was a power which was supposed td be called for by the
public voice. file right of voting was settled some three or four
years ago, after a very full discussion from men of all parties--
yet it was thought proper, under this most specious Bill,
to take away the power of voting froin—to take away
the Parliamentary franchise from—freemen, unless they were
enrolled in a particular way. By this Act, the rights were
taken from every apprentice and every minor. What had they
done to deserve this ? In this age, was it not more likely that they
might be reached by the schoolmaster who was now roaming
abroad, and become the fit depositaries of such a privilege. That
right of voting was taken away without the slightest shadow of
reason. He did not there mean to say that it was his opinion, but
it was the openly avowed, and general opinion of many out of that
House, that the Bill was brought forward for the mere purpose of con-
ferring political power on a particular party, and that the Bill is a
mere pretence or cloak for carrying such intention into effect. If any
one thought it his duty to answer such objections anti 'suspicions,
he would be bound to explain how it was that this 11th clause was
still in the Bill. There were many minors who were not appren-
tices, whose fathers were dead, but whose undoubted rights descended
to their children. These children, without any protector, were
robbed by this Bill of that which was theirs, as undoubtedly as it
were the estates of their Lordships. This Bill bore too much ana-
logy to others of a public nature. It seemed to be the modern
policy of England to protect the rights of the rich, while those of
the poor are trodden under foot. He was sorry to see that such
was now the course taken by those in power ; lit he relied on their
Lordships to protect these poor persons from the tyranny of the
House of Commons. He looked in vain for any clause to protect
the rights of infants. Who was to act for them ? Who was to pro-
tect from spoliation the rights of those who were not able to speak
for themselves ? Who was to protect the rights of lunatics, of tau-
pers, or persons who were resident in remote districts ? It ap-
peared from the language of the Act, as he read it, that there u-as
no protection for any one of these—their rights were abso-
lutely and conclusively gone. He saw among their Lordships
at least two Noble Lords, who being entitled to extensive manors,
were entitled to receive toll from all persons who were not bur-
gesses in the toWns within the circuit of their estates—towns which,
in most cases, had been erected and formed by the bounty of their
ancestors, and which, in many cases, derived every portion of their
property from the ancestors of those Noble Individuals. Every burgess
would, under this new institution, be exempted from the payment of
toll to the owners of these manors, inasmuch as they were not bodies
corporate. He would never cease, if he were with the eye of a law-
yer to go through every line of this clause. He would occupy more
than two entire days, and he could assure their Lordships that there
was a Chancery suit in every line.—(A laugh.) And in the pre-
sent state of the Court of Chancery, where two Judges did the bu-
siness of three, that was not very eminently desirable.
Lord BROUGHAM—The whole appeal business was done by
this House by volunteers.
Mr. KNIGHT alluded to the Court of Chancery.
Lord BRO UG HA NI—I know that, but it should be recollected
that the Lord Chancellor used to be compelled to sit in this House.
Mr. KNIGHT, after an observation which we did not catch,
proceeded to state, that this Bill was a compound of
dishonesty, folly, and spoliation from the beginning to
the end. He had drawn their Lordships' attention to some
of the clauses of this Bill, but not to the most objectionable. He
had drawn their attention to some of them with a view to aid their
Lordships' observations; but he must submit that this Bill was one
of which amendment was impossible—that it was a B:11 which, if
submitted to the ordinary process which Bills requiring alteration
were subjected, would come out of the Committee to which it
might be subjected, as changed as one of the old Corporations
put into this kettle would come out in the shape of a New Town
Council after the operation was performed. He believed that the
Bill created much individual spoliation—much interference
with personal privilege, freehold office, freehold estate, personal
character, personal situation, and the well-being of the community
throughout the greater portion of the country, and it changed every
habit and custom of society. lie had collected from the public
sources of information, that the dose that was to be administered
to the boroughs of Ireland was prefaced with a narrative totally
different from that of the present Bill, for what reason he did not
know, but probably because the Irish would not bear the words
neglect and abuse which were used in the English Bill which had
been carried through the House of Commons upon the allegation,
and belief of the allegation, of neglect and abuse ; and if the House
should think fit to strike out of the principle of the Bill those words,
" neglect and abuse," not only no longer would it be the Bill the
House of Commons had sent up, but it would be a Bill de-
prived of the solid ground and representation of facts of which
those who acted in the Commons must have been supposed
to be in possession of. Much had been said in another place about
Oxford and Aldborough, but neither of those places were contained
in the present Bill; they were left in the mystery of iniquity in
which they were found by the representations of the Report.
In the reign of Edward the Third two statutes were passed, for
the purpose of correcting the Reports of Commissioners of
Corporate Inquiry. Any of their Lordships would naturally
be startled at a notice, of inquiry into the amount of their
charities and properties. None would wish to live under a
Government which would sanction such enquiries, for none would
wish to have their private affairs brought before the public. That
eminent and illustrious Lawyer,Lord Coke, had said ofCommissions,
that those of new invention were against the law until they had the
sanction of an Act of Parliament, and that they required a warrant of
law, and the allowance of courts of justice to legalize them. In the
12th volume of the same learned authority with respect to Com-
missions of Enquiry, it was decided that they were illegal, inasmuch
they were only to inquire and not to adjudicate, and because it did
not come within the statute of the sth of Elizabeth. Such was the
opinion of that great lawyer on the subject of Commissions of
Inquiry.
Lord BROUGHAM—Do you, Mr. Knight, take it that Lord
Coke alludes not to inquiries into crime, but inquiries into right?
Mr. KNIGHT—Yes, my Lord. The principle of what he states
applies to all cases.
Lord BROUGHAM—But the King may issue a Commission,
appointing Commissioners with judicial authority.
Mr. KNIGHT resumed—lt appeared to him that the principle ex-
tended to all inquiries which might tend to injure a man in cha-
racter or interest. There were other instances which he would
cite. They took place in the reign of a Monarch not conspicuous
for his attaahment to the rights and kitivileges of the people of
England—of a Monarch who was not very remarkable for his
love of the Protestant Bench of Bishops—he was a man of an
amiable disposition in private life, but whose public acts it was
impossible to defend. He then quoted a long passage from
Jones's History, and Hallam's Life of James the Second.. He
would then quote the opinions of a man who was one imbued with
illiberal sentiments—he meant the late Charles James Fox. The
King first attacked the Charter of London, and then those
of all the other corporations in the kingdom, which were
either forfeited, or forced to surrender by a species of vio-
lence. He had two important points in view ;—the first
was, that in every large assemblage of the people, the Crown
should have its agents, and, in the next, should he nd it necees-
sary to dissolve his Parliament, he might have, by their influence,
a great majority of representatives returned in his favour. The
corporations did not stir till too late. He trusted their Lordships
would not receive their assistance till it was too late. Of late
there had been many Commissioners appointed to inquire into
and report upon the functions and practice of the King's Courts of
Law—they had acted, and had even taken upon themselves the
power of administering an oath,
Lord BROUGHAM observed that since 1683 there had been
150 Commissions issued, and from 1715 there bad been 53,
Mr. KNIGHT was aware of that ; but, with all due deference,
and with a great distrust of his own opinion, that he had cause
to doubt upon the matter. Could they prosecute for perjury,
or if a witness refused to attend, could they compel him ?
They might be ordered to attend, but be would venture to
assert that a charge of perjury, if these witnesses took a false
oath before these Commissioners, could not be legally sus-
, tamed. Commissions that had previously issued, applied to
purelypublic subjects; and if a great name, which he found in counec-
tion with these Cemrnissions—if an illustrious Earl of that House had
been asked to put the Great Seal to this Commission—toinquire into
the property, demeanor, and conduct of Corporations—would he
have put the Great Seal to a Commission such as he had described?
He believed he would not. These Corporations were liable
to be inquired into by two of the Courts of the country--
by the Court of King's Bench and the Court of Chancery.
In these Courts all deflections from their charters were inquired into
—all irregularities of election, all t'alsadministration was cognisable
and liable to correction, but the King had never yet taken this cur-
r(ction—this inquiry into his own hands. Those who had advised
his Majesty to interfere with these Corporations, had advised him
le an infraction of the law and the constitution of this country.
He had as much right, and lawful power and legitimate authority
as if he had isssued a Commission of enquiry to enquire into the
private estates and muniments of any of their Lordships. He
wished to call their Lordships' attention to the Commission under
which these Commissioners had acted respecting Corporations.
These Corporations were no more subject to' legal control in the
disposition of their property, than was any of their Lordships in the
fee-simple of his estate. Unless this inquiry was meant to
vex, torment, and persecute the community, no otherwise was this
Commission legal—then, and then only, might it not be made a
subject of impeachment to those who had advised it—then, and not
otherwise, might those who had acted under this illegal authority
be protected—then might not these Commissioners be criminally i n-
dieted for having gone through the country exercising authority under
this commission. By the Commission,autherity was given to the coma
missioners to ransack every document in the custody of these Corpo
:at MEM, or their officers- The Commissioners acting under this Com•
mission, haddoubtless the best advice that those-who assisted the Cam.

missioners could give them. And that being so, what had taken
place ? Why, in every instance where their authority had
been resisted they had given way--the giant died with a pebble.--
( A laugh.) Was that, he would ask, a right state of things—was
it right to have a Commission issuing from the Crown, sealed
with the Great Seal of England, that any of his Majesty's sub-
jects might treat with contempt and scorn? Under the authority
of the Commission the Commissioners had dispersed themselves
throughout the kingdom, with the exception of Mr. Blackburn,
the Chief Commissioner, who appeared to have had the se-
dentary employment of sitting at the seat of tribute, and
there receiving those contributions which his emissaries might
send him. Now what course had the Commissioners taken?
Why, in many places of great importance there had been only
the attendance of one Commissioner, so that their Lordships might
take it that wherever the Commissioners had arrived at any eon-
fclusion it was, in some instances, the judgment of only one, and in
no case of more than two Commissioners. The House of Com-
mons had been asked to give credit to certain witnesses as to
acts they had stated. Now, how had the evidence given by those
witnesses been stated by the Commissioners ? In some instances they
had not even given the names of the witnesses, or their answers to
the questions put to them ; all, therefore, the House knew was,
that in the opinion of Mr. Long in one place, and of others
in others, that so and so was the' result of the evidence which
they had heard. Would a cat be condemned for stealing
milk upon such evidence ?—( A laugh.) And yet it was
upon evidence of this description that the estates, the offices,
and the rights of millions of his Majesty's subjects were to be taknn
from them.

Lord LYNDHURST—Does it appear by the appendix, or any
other document, that the witnesses were examined upon oath?
Mr. KNIGHT—Yes, my Lord, the word oath is used.
Lord LYNDHURST—Are the names of the witnesses to the
statement ?
Mr. KNIGHT said that such was the case, only in a
few instances, in the greater number they were not.
He hoped the time would never come when political or religious
opinions would be a bar to the performance of public duties ; but
it was rather singular that the inquiry in the present instance was
confided to persons, the great majority of whom entertained politi-
cal opinions strongly opposed to those of the Corporations whose of •
fairs they were appointed to investigate. The Learned Gentleman
then referred to the appointment of W. Parkes, Esq., as Secretary
and Solicitor to the Commission. He believed Mr. P. was a respect-
able man, so far as private character was concerned, and that he was
in business exteosively in Birmingham, Whether Mr, Parkes had
distinguished himself as secretary to another society, he (Mr.
Knight) knew not.--(A laugh.) But this Commission, with such
a secretary, went up and down through the country—hissed and
hooted here, rejected there—received in one place, and embraced
in another—and sent in the Report on which the present Bill
was founded.—(Laughter.) He would next refer to Mr. Hogg,

who had made a separate Report to the other Commissioners.
After writing several letters to the Home Office, at the expiration
of two months Mr. Hoge- received an answer frern Mr. Phillips,
Sccretary to Lord- John 'Russell, stating that his (Mr. Hogg's)
separate Report would be forwarded to his Lordship in a few :lays ;
and in a subsequent letter Mr. Phillips stated that Lord John Rus-
sell had some doubts whether he should forward the separate
Report of Mr. Hogg to his Majesty. He knew not vvhether
any of these Commissioners had taken an oath to dis-
charge the duties of his office faithfully and zealously, but
he believed they had not, and this, no matter what was the
character of the individuals employed, was most important and in-
dispensable. From the instructions placed in his (Mr. Knight's)
hands, both by parties and solicitors—but to which, no more than
the Commission, would he ask for credit until their Lordships had
heard it—but from the instructions placed in his hands, he was pre-
pared to shew that the conduct of those Commissioners in many in-
stances which could be given in evidence and substantiated, was al-
together injudicial, glaringly partial, grossly oppressive, and admit-
ting the statements on one side while they refused those on the other:
He was instructed that they had been guilty of conduct of the most
scandalous and disgraceful nature—he hoped that the statements he
was instructed to make could net be proved, but he was instructed
that there were parties now in town who would prove such cases
at the Bar. The Learned Gentleman then referred to the case of
Berwick, where he said the Commissioner had put down
the property of the freemen and corporation, as rated to poor, at
only 7,000/. while that of non-freemen was set down at 16,0001.,
and that for the purpose of showing that the wealthy part
of the inhabitants did not join the Corporation. Now he
was instructed that the fact was just the other way—just
vice versa—the Town Clerk was in town, and would prove the fact
at the Bar of the House. The Learned Counsel then referred to
some other cases of abuse, which he said was but a small sample of
that contained in the Report. He would not wade through this
scandal upon the name of evidence, by which the feelings
of thousands were wounded—their property taken from them.
The Commissioners went to Arundel, a borough that ought to be
pure, if any were ; and they state there that neither party heard
the evidence given by the other. This, he was informed, was
incorrect, for the truth was, the Commissioners stated to those
who had attacked and impugned the Corporations, all they had heard,
but they stated nothing to the other party. The Learned Counsel
then proceeded to read the statements of the Commissioners
at some length. With respect to Leicester the state-
ments in the Report of the Commissioners stated one
thing, and the statement given him by the Town Clerk
another. So with respect to Sutton Goldfield—in fact there were
numberless other cases which he could bring to the attention of
their Lordships, but he would refrain from doing so, being fully
aware that it would be a waste of their Lordships'. time.
The argument of the Commissioners was, that because some mis-
management and impropriety bad occurred in some boroughs, four
thousand public functionaries-were to be disgraced and deposed.
The Learned Gentleman then adverted to the report of the town of
Cacrmarthen. It was there stated that the town was governed
merely for political purposes ; yet, when he turned to the poll, he'
found 157 burgesses voted for the e orporation candidate, while 108
voted against them. He would go no further with these cases—but
as a counsel he was bound to say that there was no confidence
in these gentlemen. He spoke of them in their public -chae
racter. If their Lordships would act upon the Report they must
see and examine the evidence—they must see the witnesses them-
selves, and judge of their demeanour. He demanded as a
right that his clients should have the power of meeting such evi-
dence by evidence of their own, before their freeholds, &c. were
taken away. The Learned Gentleman then proceeded to read
extracts from the Report of the Commissioners, to show that
no neglect or abuse had been proved against the freemen.
There was but one of the Corporations for which he appeared,
that would object to a restrained power; the calumniated
Corporations of England had never been subjected to that
restraint, but the Corporations he represented had no
desire to prevent a reasonable infusion of the popular voice,
if it should be thought useful or required_provided it
-was done by a temperate and just, and not unfriendly hand. '
They desired nothing but not to be reformed by those who have sworn
their extirpation. He trusted, however, their Lordships would pause
before they acceded to the principle of making Magistrates to be
elected annually, and by that means making the enjoyment of office
by any men subservient to the will of their bitterest enemies.
It appeared to him that if there was any foundation for even half
the observations that Sir Charles ' Wetherell and himself
had offered to their Lordships, it was impossible for him
to suppose that if the Bill was subjected to the scrutiny of a
Committee, one-fiftieth part of it would remain, and it must of
of necessity fall to the ground. He appeared at their Lordships'
bar in behalf the freemen who would be deprived throughout the
country of that which he now claimed for them—their inheritance;
which was as much an estate of which they had rightful possession,
and which they were entitled to leave to their posterity to be by
them enjoyed and used justly and lawfully for - their own private
purposes, as were the private estates of their Lordships. He ap-
peared in behalf of those rights, and in resistance of the principle
contained in this Bill ofinvasion and spoliation, on the old tyrant's
plea of expediency, which would equally apply itself to the privileges
and possessions of every rank of society in the same was. All well-
ordered Governments consisted of individuals who had the,posses-
sion of certain privileges; The privilege of the freemen was one ;
the privilege of the peerage was another. They were different
members of the same community, each in his different grade useful,
and contributing to the harmony of the whole. There did not
exist the principle of expediency on which they could deprive the
freeman of his privilege, and which might not with equal Justice be
applied to the Peerage. Introduce the principle, and they both
must fall—introduce the principle, and they were gone—introduce
the principle, and no longer would there be safety for rank, or pro-
perty, or privilege. Therefore, as Counsel for the parties, he im-
plored their Lordships not to proceed further in this Bill. By pro-
ceeding they would recognize its principle ; by undertaking its im-
provement—by allowing that it was susceptible of alteration—they
would he admitting the principle of general and wholesale disfran-
chisement, on that notion of expediency, which, if allowed to pre-
vail, would put an end to the laws of 700 years, and destroy the
distinction they had maintained between the Peer, the peasant, and
the burgher. In the words of the poet—
" Illa dies atratuque

Ducct r uinam."
On that day when their -Lordships admitted the principle of arbi•
trarily depriving the lowest Member of the State of his privileges,
the House of Peers might view the privileges of themselves as de.
stroyed. To finish his quotation from the same author—
" supremum
Carpere itur comites parati."
Sir C. WETHERELL said that in the course of his speech he
had stated that he should claim to be allowed to produce such evi-
dence at their Lordships' bar as he thought proper to negative the
preamble of this Bill, and he now appeared in form to submit
that claim to their Lordships' consideration, being prepared with
evidence.
Lord BROUGHAM said it appeared to him that the course now
pursued by the Learned Gentleman was irregular. He had already
submitted his claim to their Lordships, and he supported it with
his usual ability. Indeed, both the Learned Gentlemen who had
been heard had submitted the same claim. The Learned Gentle-
man could not move their Lordships. If first one Learned Gen-
tleman was to be heard for six hours, and he were to be followed
by another Learned Gentleman for six hours more, and then the
first were to be allowed to begin again, it was obvious that there
would be no end to the speeches of Counsel. Their Lordships
had determined to hear two Counsel ; the two Learned Gentlemen
at the bar had been heard, and the claim was made by both of
them.—( Hear.)
Sir C. WETHERELL had no wish to address their Lordships on
the subject further, if it was admitted that he had made the claim.
Lord LYNDHURST said, what he understood the Learned
Gentleman to say was—that he was prepared now with the
evidence.
The Earl of FALMOUTH (we believe) suggested that the
more convenient course would be for their Lordships to adjourn till
Monday.
The question that
_Counsel be ordered to withdraw was then
agreed to.
The Earl of WINCHILSEA said, out of regard to the honour
of their Lordships—.
The SPEAKER interrupted the Noble Lord, and ordered the
witlidiawal of the counsel.

The Earl of WINCHILSEA again rose. He said he trusted
that the Noble Lord opposite, out of regard to the honour of their
Lordships, and out of regard to his own public honour and charac-
ter, as well as that of his colleagues, would well weigh, between
this and Monday, the course he meant to pursue. Never did this.
House stand in such a situation as that in which it was now placed's
and if, after what they had heard delivered at that bar, there wa
one particle of honour left in this House, England might still be
what she had been—a great and' respected nation.—(Opposition
cheers.) He would ask, was there any man who had heard that
most powerful appeal at their Lordships' bar, who could put his
hand on his heart and say—if they were to pass this Bill—
which struck at every prerogative of the Crown—and at the
just rights and privileges of the people—that such a course was
not to gratify the most democratic spirit that ever disgraced the
the country.—(Much Opposition cheering.) Of this Bill—
which had been allowed to come up to their Lordships'
House, he would say—in God's name let them resist it now—
( Cheers)—let them resist it at once, and follow the advice which
had been given them by Counsel—let a Parliamentary Commission
be issued—let them proceed on constitutional grounds—(Cheers)—
and he would give to the proceedings his best consideration and the
warmest support us his power,, They. ulight_rest arlured that they
could not take away the privileges of any body of men—privileges
which were of as much value to them in their station as were those
possessed by their Lordships, without incurring a danger, the mere
contemplation of which would make him tremble ; he was confident
that the most feat ful consequences would result, not only to this
House, but to the whole empire —( Hear, hear.) The least that
could be said of those who had sanctioned this measure was, that
they had adopted it inconsiderately, having been betrayed by those
who had been employed. He did, then, implore the Noble Viscount
to consider well the course he would pursue. They were placed in
a difficulty from which if they endeavoured to escape in the wrong
direction, they would bring ruin on this happy land. So great was
his apprehension, that he would give up all he possessed to see their
Lordships placed In a different situation—to see them relieved from
a Bill which he held to be grounded on the most atrocious attacks
on the property and liberties of the country.—( Opposition cheers. )
LORD MELBOURNE—I can tell the Noble Earl at once the
course which I intend to pursue. Two counsel having been heard
at your Lordship? bar, on the principle of the Bill, according to
the wish of many Noble Lords in this House, I beg to say that I
will now move that the further consideration of the measure be
adjourned, and on Monday next I shall move that this House do re-
solve itself into a Committee on the Bill.—(Cheers.)
The Earl of WINCHILSEA—Then, my Lords, I hereby give
notice, that on Monday next I will move, as an amendment to the
motion of the Noble Viscount, that an Address be presented to the
Crown, praying his Majesty to order that there be laid before your
Lordships any further instruction given to the Commissioners,
other than those contained in the public documents which have al-
ready been laid upon your Lordships' table. I beg also to say that
I shall divide your Lordship? House on that question.—(Cheers.)
The Noble Earl concluded with his notice of motion.
The Duke of NEWCA STLE asked whether the Noble Viscount
did not mean to hear the offered evidence ?

Lord MELBOURNE—Certainly not.
The Duke of NEWCASTLE--.-. 1141 he understand the Noble Vis-
count rightly in supposinlig, that he meant to refuse to allow evi-
dence to he given 7
Lord MELBOURNE—( Hear, hear)—l have no hesitation in
saying that I shall not consent to evidence being called.—( Cheers. )
The Duke of NEWCASTLE then proceeded to address their
.Lordships; but he did so with somuch hesitation and apparent em-
barrassment, that all our efforts to understand more than some de-
tailed sentences which he uttered, were completely baffled. What
we could collect was, that he had no hesitation in declaring that.
the Noble Viscount, if he refgad tn hear evidence, would pursue
a course of ccinduet that was directly opposed to every constitu-
tional principle that should govein a peer, a man, or a British sub-
ject. If the Noble Viscount and his friends meant that the rights
of the people should be taken from them by a measure so extraor-
dinary, so arbitrary, and so revolutionary—if the Noble Viscount
meant io require that this House should thus vote away the rights
of his fellow-subjects—he did say that the course was so atrocious,
as regarded the rights, liberties, and privileges of his fellow-eiti-

zous, that those Ministers of the King who sanctioned it would•be
liable to impeachement—(Loud cries of " Hear, hear"); and if no
other person was willing to come forward to impeach them, be
himself would do it.—( Renewed cries of " Hear, hear."

Lard BROUGII AM— I beg to suzgest to the Noble Duke that
it is a very un,ommon course for a judge—one of them who are to
try my Noble Friend here—to begin by being a party to the prose-
cution.—( Hear, hear.) That practice, surely, is not to be found
amongst the ancient rules or usages of British subjects —( A laugh.)
My Noble Friend must be impeached—if impeached at all—by the
Commons of England, and the Noble Duke will be called upon 0
sit as a judge; any one of the Commons may move my Noble
Friend's impeachment, and when he came to take his trial, I, as I
well as the Noble Duke, shall have to decide as to the charge.
shall do my best when that occasion arrives to act with perfect im-
partiality, and I hope I shall be able to subdue all private feeling---
( 4 laugh)—and show that I have been governed by as strict a love
of justice, as one of the Learned Gentlemen in the course•of his
speech gave me credit for having exhibited during the period when
I sat in the Court of Chancery, of which I shall say more at another
time.

The Earl of FALMOUTH said, as thay had not always under-
stood the course of these proceedings, he wished to know whether
they should not be at liberty to move that evidence be heard at the
bar on Monday next.—( Hear, hear.) He had no doubt on the
subject ; but he thought it better be made quite clear.
The Duke of CUMBERLAND—My Lords, Ido not rise to pro-
long the debate; on the contrary, my object is to ask your Lord-
ships whether, it having become so hot, it would not be wise to ad-
journ? I think we are not in a state this evening to come to
quiet an.l-tetnperate determination. I would move then that yell'
Lordships should now adjourn till Monday, and between now ar4
then the House will have time to cool.
Lord BROUGHAM agreed in the illustrious Duke's suggestion,
though not for the same reason. There must first, however, be an
adjournment of the question, and there were then some orders of
the day to be proceeded with.

The Duke of CUMBERLAND said they were matters of mere
form. All he wished was to put an end to the present debate.
Lord BROUGHAM—I was going to say that I had not been
sensibL, of any remarkable heat.
Lord LYNDHURST asked a question relative to the evidence
which had been taken by the Commissioners. There had been al
aggregate Report, and a great number of particular Reports, and
he begged to ask the Noble Viscount whether, besides the evidence
given in the aggregate Report, which was taken as its foundation,
he would consent to lay upon the table of their Lordship? House
the evidence on which each particular Report was founded.
Lord MELBOURNE did not think that the documents Cl' isted in such a shape as to enable him to produce them to the;t
Lo7dships.
The motion for the adjournnient of the debate was then
agreed to.
The Duke of NEWCASTLE preSented a petition from the bur-
gesses of Nottingham against the Municipal Corporations Bill. 118
said that he had frequently been represented as a personal tyrant,
disregarding the rights of others, and deserving to be knocked 01
the head ; but the poor had now their rights and privileges threat'
ened by the very party who had so stigmatized him, while he was
ready to come forward and defend them to the utmost of his
power. The Noble Duke having read the petition at length, cots'
eluded by declaring before God and his country, that he would tee'
sist to the utmost any arbitrary power which might contemplate an
encroachment on their civil rights, whether it was exercised by the
King, the Parliament, or the people.
The petition was laid on the table.—Adjourned. .