The Sun.
London, England, 1835-08-18 00:00:00

GERMAN CONFEDERATION.

Mr. ROBINSON, in rising to bring forward the Motion of
which he had given notice, relative to the German Commercial
Confederation, would detain the House as short a time as possible.
Some few years ago a confederation of such a nature was formed
that he thought would be so detrimental to the interests of
the commerce, and of the trade of the country, that, as a mer-
chant, he would have felt himself wanting in his duty had he
not brought the question before the House in the present session.
Prussia had already got so many States to join in the confede-
racy, as to amount to millions of souls, and extending over
an extent of 182,000 German miles. She had also reserved to
herself a power to increase the duties to such amount as she,
pleased.—(Lear, hear.) This was too great a power
—for the uniform Tariff was to be collected upon the
frontiers of the union. It was well known to the Noble Lord that
under the guise of commercial relations Prussia was aiming a
blow at this country—she was alarmed at our intimate alli-
ance with France, Spain, and Portugal, and not daring to show
a hostile feeling against such an alliance, she took these insi-
dious but sure means to accomplish her purpose. She was
evidently trying to force us to abolish our Corn Laws and
Timber Duties.—( Loud cheers from several Hon. Members.)
Would it not be better to make an advantageous bargain with
Prussia before shebecame so strong as to do that she bad in view?
Let the House consider the course they were pursuing. When
Prussia saw that she had succeeded in getting us to relax our
timber duties, she would then look for a repeal of the
Corn Laws.—( Hear, hear, hear.) He only wished that
-during the recess the Noble Lord (Palmerston) would turn
his attention to this subject, and see that we got some
equivalent for altering our timber duties and corn laws.
Ho bad intended to move for a copy of the Prussia Tariff, but the
Noble Lord might say it was not within his scope to produce it.
He knew very well what it was ; it abolished all internal duties
in the States of the Union, to have one Custom-house, and that
this should be the Prussian tariff both present and
future. If this system were carried into effect,
the consequence would be that the only trade we should carry
on with the German Union would be by means of smuggling.
Although he should be sorry to say the Government of Prussia
was not in accordance with the Government of this country,
he should be sorry to see her commercial transactions under the
direction of Russia. He would make commercial treaties with
States of reciprocal advantage to all the States. He was
afraid, in consequence of what had been stated by the
Noble Lord, that it had gone forth abroad that the
country was determined to pursue that course which had
been miscalled free trade. All he wished was, to press upon
the Government the necessity of doing every thing in their
power to preserve the commerce of the country. He was
anxious to obtain from the Noble Lord some explanation as
to the course intended to be pursued by the Government.
After a few observations respecting the commercial treaty
with Portugal, which were very indistinctly heard in the gal-
lery, the Hon. Gentleman concluded by proposing that a copy
of the commercial treaty between Prussia and the other con-
federate States of Germany be laid on the table.
Viscount PALMERSTON did not intend to -cast any
blame on the lion. Gentleman for calling the attention of
Parliament to the subject. It was natural, taking so warm
an interest as he did in commercial affairs, and so deeply
interested in them as he was, that he should be in some
degree anxious on this subject. He could assure the lion.
Gentleman that the Government had not been insensible to
the proceedings of Prussia, but had anxiously looked to see
how far the conduct of that State was likely to be preju-
, dieieleo the interests of this country. This, however, was
not the first commercial union that had existed between the
German States. Many years ago such a confederation
c:iisted le!wten -the northern • StO:q of Germany, and also

one between the southern States. The system on whim
ilieSe confederations *ere founded was, that there should be one
system of Custom-house fegtilations for all the States. That
was, that the goods which had paid ddty on entering into one of
these countries should not be charged with other ddties do being
taken into another of the States. They naturally adopted a sys-
tem of this kind for the purpose of commercial convenience. He
could not see that it followed from the mere existence of these
confederations, that it originated in a spirit of political hos-
tility to this country, or even of commercial hostility. The
country bad no right, on general principles, to object to such
unions of States. He repeated, England had no right to step
out of the ordinary course of proceeding in consequence of the
existence of these compacts between indepenient States. The
Hon. Gentleman said that one of the objects of Prussia, in
entering into this confederacy with other States, was to com-
pel this country to alter and relax the prohibitory duties against
foreign corn and timber. Whatever might be the motives of
Prussia, this certainly could not operate on the other German
States so as to induce them to join in the union, for they did
not export corn or timber. He did not believe that the pre-
sent arrangement had been productive of any advantage to the
manufacturers of Prussia. Possibly, however, the manufac-
turers of Saxony benefited by it ; but Prussia, so far from
being a gainer, was a considerable loser. With respect to the
course to be adopted, he would only observe that matters were
not sufficiently ripe to take any decided steps. He was at
present unable to say what had been the effect of these ar-
rangements on English commerce, or what steps it might be
expedient to take. In all these matters, he need hardly say,
that the promotion of what appeared to be the best interests of
the country would be the guide he should pursue. He was
satisfied that the strict adoption of the principle of reciprocity
would be found to be the best course that could be pursued.
With respect to the negociations with Portugal, it was only
necessary for him to observe, that the subject would occupy the
anxious ttention of his Right Hon. Friend the President of
the Bo- of Trade and himself.
Mr. . F. YOUNG recommended that negociations
should be opened with each country separately with regard to
its trade. Those who expected that England would be made
the workshop cf the world by forcing free trade on other na-
tians, would find themselves egregiously deceived. He was
glad that his Hon. Friend had brought forward the subject ;
but the reply of the Noble Lord had been any thing but
satisfactory.
After a few observatiens from Mr. EWA RT, which were
not heard in the Gallery,
Sir J. R. RE ID said that he entirely concurred with his
Hon. Friend the Member for Worcester in the view he had
taken of the subject, and thought that it deserved the serious
attention of the Legislature and the Government.
Mr. P. THOM SON did not see that because foreigners

pursued an unwise system, we should persist in a system
equally unwise. It appeared to him that it would be very
inexpedient for this country to purchase its commodities at a
dearer market; because the country in which they could be ob-
tained cheaper would nct adopt our .more liberal principles of
commerce ; such .a course as that must have the effect of
weak:ming the resources of our own industry, and depriving us
of the means of competing with other countries in the mar Lets
for manufactured articles.—( Hear, hear.)
After a few weeds from Mr. A. CflA PM ;N,
Mr. ROBINSON consented to withdraw his motion.
THAMES TUNNEL.

M. WALTER said he wished to ask the Right Hon. Gen-
;eman a question relative to a motion of his which had stood

upon the paper foe several days past. What he desired to
know was, whether the Right Hon. Gentleman would under-
take that no further sum should be advanced by his Majesty's
Government towards the Thames Tunnel undertaking till
next session. If the Right Hon. Gentleman would enter
into such an understanding with him, he would defer his me-
till next session ; but—if the Right Hon. Gentleman declined
the arrangement he proposed—he should feel it to be his duty
to make his motion to-ntorroT, by way of amendment, upon
the motion for taking into consideration the Orders of the Day.

The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER, said it rvis
quite impossible for him to accede to chat the Hon. Gentle-
man had just proposed. To allow the circumstance of a mo-
tion having been merely entered upon the order-book, there

having been no discussion upon it by which the sense of the
House could be arrived at, to interrupt the progrus of the
public business, which would be to establish the principle that
any motion of which only notice had been given might inter-
fere with the most important business of the country. He
might engage to this extent—that due care should be taken
that there should be no further grant without such a satisfac-
tory Report having been laid before him, with regard to the
expenditure which had taken place, as well as to the course
which was to be pursued in future, as would enable
him to justify whatever proceeding he might recommend.—
(Hear, hear.) He was aware that this was a matter which
required great consideration. The amount to be granted
was a large sum of money ; and the Honourable

Member might be sure that no one could have a stronger per-
sonal interest than himself in seeing that the money was not
expended improperly, or that the grant was not made in a
manner such as would not enable him to present to Parliament
a satisfactory statement on the subject. He was prepared to
say, with regard to the motion, that he would be the last in the
world to resist it, if it could be shown that there existed any
ground for a Parliamentary inquiry. He was quite willing
that any acts of his, or of the Government, should be made
the subject of investigation; but if the motion were only to
inquire into the circumstances under which an Act of Parlia-
ment had been passed, that appeared to him not to be such an
object as would warrant the House in granting an investiga-
tion.—( Hear, hear.)
Mr. WALTER then gave notice, " That to=morrow, on
the Order of the Day being moved, be should make his
motion."

The SPEAKER threw out, as a suggestion, the great de-
lay it would occasion to the business of the Session, if amend-
ments were proposed on the Order of the Day being moved.
MUNICIPAL CORPORATIONS (IRELAND) BILL.
Lord M 0 R PETH moved the third reading of the Munici-
pal Corporations ( Ireland) Bill.
Mr. SINCLAIR objected to the Bill, which he described
as an unwarrantable concession to the Hon. and Learned
Member for Dublin. They might as well enact that the
mayor and other corporate officers should march out of the towns
ropes round their necks, and lay their keys at the Hon.
and Learned Gentleman's feet.—(Cries of " Oh, oh.") He
was glad that there existed another assembly to which measures
of this description must be submitted..—( Order, order.) Being
much attached to the Protestant religion, he could not consent

to any measure that he considered adverse to its interest. fie
knew that it was fruitless to oppose the Bill on the present
occasion ; therefore he should content himself with entering his
protest against, it.
Mr. O' CON NE LL said he bad heard that in Scotland there
existed a hallucination of the mind called second sight. It
appeared to him that the Hon. Gentleman opposite must be
labouring under some such hallucination. His imagination
seemed to run away with him—he beheld a giant in every wind-
mill. The Bill did not relate to religion ; its good quality
was, that it did not inquire into creeds ; and every body who
lived under a municipal government exercised his share in its
appointment. The Bill was admirably adapted to the present
state of Society in. Ireland. It gave to the people the prac-
tical power of interfering with their own concerns.—( Hear,
hear, hear.) That there were great abuses in the Corporations
could not be denied. And if the Hon. Gentleman connected
the Protestant religion with the Corporations, he connected it
with those abuses. He, instead of being its friend, was the
greatest enemy of the Protestant religion who connected it
with the peculations and abuses which prevailed in the distri-
bution of the corporate funds. Abuse was inseparable from
monopoly ; the moment a man was made a monopolist, he was
made a rogue.—( Hear, and a laugh.) As to the poor, the
only power of which the Bill would deprive them, was the
power of selling their votes once in seven years. The lion.
Gentleman opposite surely would not connect that with the in-
terests of the Protestant religion. The further progress of
the Bill had been alluded to by the Hon. Gentleman ; but he
must say that he was not apprehensive of any attempt being
made to create a property qualification for common-councilmen,
because that would more effectually exclude the present Cor-
porators than any other provision. In one guild in Ireland,
consisting of thirty, there were eighteen out of the number
who had passed through the Insolvent Debtors' Court. Ile
would give them one example of the exclusive bodies in
Ireland :—ln Cork, 300 individuals governed a population
consisting of 120,000, and had at their command a revenue
amounting to 70,0001. a-year.

Mr. KIRK protested against the measure.
After a few words from Dr. BALDWIN and Mr. BORTHWICK,

Mr. SINCLAIR explained. He said he bad nut connected
the Protestant religion with the corporate abuses ; he admit-
ted the existence of abuses, but contended that this measure
did not remove them in the best way.
The Bill was read a third time and passed.
CERTIORARI BILL.

On the motion of Lord MORPETH, this Bill was read
a second time. _ _ _

The Hull Merchant Seamen's Fund Bill was read a third
time and pa'ssed.
CONSTABULARY FORCE (IRELAND).
On the motion of Lord MORPIi',TH, this Bill was com-
mitted, and resolutions for granting the salaries and expenses
were agreed to.
CLERK OF THE CROWN BILL.

This Bill, on the motion of the CHANCELLOR of the
EXCHEQUER, was read a second time.
Several Bills were then forwarded a stage.
QUALIFICATION OF MEMBERS BILL.

Mr. HUME moved the further consideration of the Re-
port of this Bill, and said that its object was to extend the
same principle upon this subject •to England, Ireland, and
Scotland. The absurdity of a pecuniary qualification, still
more of one of a landed nature, was evident ; some of the
worst scamps in the country were men of property. Its in-
utility was also equally obvious, from the eva.,ions which were
constantly practised of the existing law. He hoped that his
Majesty's 'Ministers would support the measure, and remove
50011 a mockery from our Statute-book. Even if the House
were disposed to keep up the qualification, they ought surely
to extend it to all kinds of property, net confine 'it simply, to
landed property.
Lord JOHN RUSSELL agreed fully that the present
system of qualification was oftentimes injurious, but was not
prepared at once to say that at this period of the session, and
in the present State of the House, so many Members being
absent who might be desirous to take part in the discussion
of the subject, they ought at once to pass such a measure as
the present, doing away with all qualification whatsoever—
or even a measure admitting a qualification of other kinds of
Property. • He should, therefore, wish that the proposed Bill
should not proceed fi,rtta
After a few words.from Colonel SILITHORP,
Mr. EWART said that he ccutsiderod the principle of the
Bill a sound one.
Mr. WARBURTON was -glad that the Noble Lord aid

,ot oppose the principle of the measure, and hoped that his
llits
Friend," would comprise in it some provision abo-
ifor declaration required of Members
a
for the description which he was
the
bound to give in or his qualificati:Zl at the time of election.
Fhir7tri'im nle
necess..
of election, an ,
Mr. ROBINSON was not willing to übe.ndon all pecuniary
qualification.
Mr. BERNAL said that it was impossible to retain the
present law upon this subject for ten years longer.
Sir R. INGLIS observed that many of the se-called eva-
sions of the existing. law were not practically such.
Mr. O'CONNELL supported the principle of the Bill, as
did also Mr. PEASE and Mr. MARK PHILIPS.
Mr. HUME then withdrew the Bill, stating that he had in
nowise altered his opinion on the principle of it.

LIGHT HOUSES BILL.
Mr. FIUME moved the withdrawal of this Bill for the pre-
Sent session.
After a short conversation the motion was agreed to.

SHERIFFS (IRELAND) BILL.
On the motion of Mr. O'LOGHLEN, the House resolved
itself into Committee on this Bill.
Mr. WARBURTON proposed an amendment, to the ef-
fect (as we understood) that " The Chief Remembrancer and
Second Remembrancer in the Court of Chancery in Ireland
should not be allowed to.have a seat in that House."
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER observed
that there was an Act already in existence, by which he be-
lieved that the object of the amendment of the Hon. Member
for Bridport would be answered.
Mr. O'CONNELL expressed himself favourable to tie
principle of excluding judicial functionaries from seats in
that House, but was opposed to legislating against an in-
dividual.
After some further discussion, the Committee divided:—
For the Amendment
Against it
Majority
The Bill then went through the Committee, and the House
having resumed, the Report was ordered to be received to-
morrow.