The Sun.
London, England, 1860-08-18 00:00:00

SUPPLY.

The house then went into committee of.supply.
On the vote of £10,750 for the suppression of the slave
trade,

Mr. DANBY SEYMOUR moved that this vote be re-
duced £1,300, the amount of the judge arbitrator and
registrar at Savannah.
Some discussion ensued, but the amendment was with-
drawn, and the vote was agreed to.

On the vote of .E 158,229 to complete the sum of £262,229
for consular establishments,
Mr. WILLIAMS took exception to some of
the items as being most manecessary. For in-
stance, there was £l,OOO a year paid to the con-
sul at St. Petersburgh, although there was no
trade between this country and that city. £350
was paid the consul at Frankfort, with which this country
ha.d'ino traffic, and where there was a very large ambassa-
dorial establishment which had very little to do. They
had also a consul at Brest, with which also they had no
trade. He would not move any amendment, but content
himself with drawing the attention of the house to the
subject.

Mr• LAING contended that the Government, in regard
to consular appointments, had acted with judgment and
economy. The Government adopted the principle laid
down by the select committee on-this subject, but they did
not push that principle too far by incurring the expendi-
ture that carrying it out fully would have involved.

The vote was agreed to.
On the vote of £23,320 for the establishments in China,
Japan, and Siam,
Mr. WHITE called attention to the expenses for consul-
ships at Yungchow, Chinsiang, and Swatow. The consuls
in those places were to have been appointed on the ratifica-
tion of the treaty of Tien-tsin, but that treaty had not yet
been ratified. He believed at Swatow they were content
to have a consul sent there, but in the other places they
could not have consulships until the result of the
Chinese war became known. Had Lord Elgin done
what he was urged to do by every one practically
acquainted with China, the war never would have b'en
rendered necessary. The East India and Chinese Asso •
ciation impressed on Lord Elgin the necessity of staying at
China until he had finished the work for which he went
out. Had he followed that advice an immense expenditure
of money and loss of life would have been spared. If
that distinguished admiral, now a member of this house
(Sir M. Seymour), had the prestige of aristocratic rank,
power might have been conferred on him to arrange affairs
in China, and, from the sagacity and justice he had pre-
viously exhibited, he would in all probability have been
successful.

Mr. LAING said that it could not be expected that he
would on the present occasion enter into the question of
general policy which had been raised. The estimate was
prepared on the supposition that the treaty would come
into operation, and the occurrences which had taken place
were totally unexpected. At any moment an announce-
ment might arrive to the effect that the treaty had been
ratified, and therefore it was necessary that this estimate
should be provided.
Mr. AYRTON said he was very muck disposed to con-
cur in the admirable observations of the right hon. member
for Brighton (Mr. White). He wished to know what ar-
rangements had been made as to the expenditure of the
envoys who were actually in China at present.
Mr. 'WILLIAMS said that if Mr. Bruce was the person
who was now receiving a salary of £B,OOO, he thought as a
matter of mere common justice that that sum ought to be
rejected. To call Mr. Bruce's conduct a blunder and in-
solence, would be very faintly characterising it.
Sir G. C. LEWIS vindicated the conduct of Lord Elgin
and Mr. Bruce. There was no ground whatever for any
censure on Lord Elgin for his return, and Mr. Bruce acted
according to the spirit if not the letter of his instructions.
After some further discussion,
Mr. AYRTON moved that the salary of Mr. Bruce
should be reduced £l,OOO.
The house divided, and the numbers were— .
For the amendment 32
Against
Majority —4
The vote was then agreed to.
Several small votes were agreed to, and the house sus-
pended sitting at four o'clock.

The house resumed at six o'clock.
RESIDENT MAGISTRATES.

Colonel FRENCH moved that the house at its rising
should adjourn to Monday next, in order to ask the Chief
Secretary for Ireland if the report was correct that the
_ _

Lord Lieutenant of Ireland had transferred to the Inspector-
General of Constabulary the appointment of one-third of
the resident magistrates to be selected by him from the force
under his command; and if so, whether he could state the
grounds on which such a change of system had been made ;
and further to inquire whether any reports showing the ne-
cessity of such a proceeding, or any communications from
the Lord Lieutenant to the Home •office respecting it have
been made, and were to be laid before Parliament. The hon.
gentleman added that he considered it highly objectionable
that magistrates should be selected from the police force,
whose avocations rendered them unfit for the exercise of
judicial functions. He understood that Sir H. Brownrigg
was to retire on full pension, and to be made a resident ma-

gistrate, and that Col. Wood, an Englishman, was to be

placed at the head of the Irish constabulary. He had no
fault to find with Col. Wood, but he complained that Eng-
lishmen were brought over to Ireland to fill the highest
offices in that country.
Mr. SCULLY seconded the motion, and said that he en-
tirely concurred in the opinion of his hon. friend ; but he
believed the system was entirely owing to the *ant of spirit
in Ireland itself. The Lord Lieutenant was an Englishman,
and the Chief Secretary for Ireland was an Englishman ;
and how could it be expected that they would act other-
wise than on the principle on which they were selected
themselves ? He complained that the Irish members were
badly treated, that the English press were indifferent, and
the Irish press hostile to them. He wished to know from
the Chief Secretary whether it was intended to appoint a
paid resident Roman Catholic commissioner of national
education in Ireland ?

Mr. OSBORNE said that the question of his hon,
friend (Colonel French) was one of no slight importance,

The present constitution of the Irish police force was

anything but satisfactory. He did net want to say a word
against the claims and position of Col. Wood, who was a
distinguished and meritorious officer. He did not object to
the man, but he did object to the system of giving the police
force more and more every day the character of a military
body. They were now neither entirely soldiers nor police,
and therefore as a detective force they were one of the worst
going. Did any one ever hear of their detecting crime be-
forehand ? (Laughter.) Did any ever hear of their detect-
ing a plot beforehand ? He hoped his hon. friend would
next session move for a commission to inquire into the
working of the whole system. The real governor of Ireland
was not the Lord Lieutenant, but the Secretary for Ireland
in that house. That was not a satisfactory state of things
for Ireland, and he hoped his hon. and gallant friend would
next session go into the whole question of the police in Ire-
land.

Mr. CARDWELL said, with regard to the selection of
resident magistrates, before 1836 they were selected from
the police force ; but that act invested the power of selection
in the hands of the Lord Lieutenant. In every third vacancy
since the Lord Lieutenant came into office he had consulted
Sir H. Brownrigg, the head of the constabulary force ; and
the gentlemen selected were gentlemen who had served as
county inspectors, and were of a rank of life to make them
proper persons to fill the situation, and also had been sub-
jected to a competitive examination. With respect to Col.
Wood, he (Mr. Cardwell) believed no better selection could
be made ; he had been previously personally unknown to
the Lord Lieutenant and himself (Mr. Cardwell).
Mr. OSBORNE—Why, he was quartermaster-general.
Mr. CARDWELL proceeded to say—Colonel Wood was
selected solely on the ground of efficiency, and his services
were well known to the Lord Lieutenant and himself. With
regard to Sir H. Brownrigg, and the charge to which his
hon. and gallant friend (Colonel French) had alluded, he
could only say the hon. and gallant colonel must either have
access to sources of information which were wholly closed
to him (Mr. Cardwell), or else he had had his information
from somebody who was not accurately informed. He had
seen Sir H. Brownrigg a few days ago, and he had then no
intention whatever of vacating the position which he had
so long and efficiently occupied. With regard to the ques-
tion of the hon. member for Cork (Mr. Scully) he could
state there was no intention of adding. a second paid com-
missioner in addition to Mr. M'Donnell, who had so ably
discharged the duty of paid commissioner to the Board of
Education in Ireland.

Lord FE RM OY thought his right hon. friend (Mr. Card-
well) had not acted wisely in not adhering to the old plan of
selecting the police magistrates from the whole body of un-
paid magistrates. With regard to Colonel Wood, as a mili•
tall' man he was perfectly worthy of any promotion in his
crvni service, but the constabulary of Ireland was not his own