The Sun.
London, England, 1860-06-12 00:00:00

'Under these circumstances, with great satisfaction, he would

withdraw his amendment. (Hear, hear.)
Mr. DISRAELI—I think, sir, that her Majesty's Go-
vernment have taken a wise and not undignified course to'

night. (Hear.) It was much better, under the circumstances
in which the house finds itself in regard to the progress of '
public business, that the Government should make up its '
mind to adopt the course now proposed rather than have
allowed the house to go into committee and have wasted
more valuable time without coming to any satisfactory re •
milt. The Government would only have prevented what
they will now find themselves able to do, -viz., carry on the
business of the house with more rapidity and with greater
unanimity on both sides. I would not have touched upon
the Reform Bill now about to, be withdrawn had not
the noble lord made some allusions to this side of the
house which cannot readily pass by. (Hear, hear.)
But I beg the noble lord and the house to recollect that if
this bill is withdrawn it is. not from any successful opposi-
tion, or any opposition of any kind—(oh, oh)—any op-
position of any :kind which has been offered to a real
bona fide amendment of tha.representation of the people.
(Laughter.) The bill has not succeeded because the Go-
vernment has this year been encumbered with an immense
mass of public business of a character which rendered it
impossible for any Government in the face of it to carry a
bill like the Reform Bill through the house; and, sir, as
there have been complaints on both sides of the house of
delay, I may be permitted to observe that the real cause of
the delay has been the Government undertaking matters of
such importance and encumbered with such details that it
became physically and morally impossible to carry the
measure which they have now so wisely withdrawn. Of
course, in the heat of debate, some imputations have been
dealt out on both sides ; but I am new saying that which I
take literally to be the state of the case, becam e I believe it
would have been impossible for the Government to have
carried on the business of the country had they persisted

with this measure. The Government had other engage-
ments which rendered the further progress of the bill im-
*possible. I shall not enter in detail into the policy of the
noble lord's bill ; but with reference to the principle laid
down by the noble lord, as to the necessity of the admission
of the working classes in some degree to the franchise, I
would remind the house that that has never been a subject
of controversy. What we have disputed has been the
means of carrying out that object ; and as far as I can read
the public opinion or follow thslcourse of intellectual inves-
tigation, I cannot help thinking that before the house is
again, called upon to consider this question, means more
satisfactory for settling the question will be found than what
I may be permitted to call the coarse and vulgar expedient
of the degradation of the franchise. (Opposition cheers.) I
would therefore say, on the part of the gentlemen on this
aide of the house; that while they see with perfect approba-
tion the course which the Government has taken with re-
gard to this measure, we also conceive that they acted in a
spirit of perfect honour and propriety to the house. We give
them credit for being actuated by a sincere desire for the
public welfare, and an anxiety for the public service, and I
can assure them that they may expect from this side of the
house every help and assistance in carrying on the public
business, and that consideration which is due to a Govern-
ment, and especially to the noble lord, who has sacrificed
much that was dear, and honourably dear, to many of its
members. (Hear, hear.) Before I sit down I have to ask the
indulgence of the house for a few moments, while I explain
a personal matter. If it merely concerned myself I should
not take this opportunity of alluding to it ; but it concerns
the feelings of another hon. member, and it concerns mat-
ters which are generally interesting to all members of this
house. The hon. member for Birmingham stated the other
night that .I had entered into a compact with some one on
his side of the house to introduce a Reform Bill something
like his own, that was to say one with under a £lO franchise.
The statement circulated very freely, but like others in
which I have been concerned, I did not think it necessary
to take any notice of it, but when the hon. member for Bir-
mingham was about to found an argument on it, I took the
liberty of interrupting him and infoaraing him that he la-
boured under a complete misapprehension. It appears that
the gentleman whose name had been mentioned, and who
was not in hisplace when I interrupted the hon. member,
was under the impression that I stated I had had no com-
munication whatever with him, and that the whole state-
ment was unfounded. I should be glad at all times to re-
move a false impression, and as this is probably the last time
we shall this year have anything about Parliamentary Re-
form (a laugh), I trust I shall be allowed a few moments
whilst I clear away this one, which intimately concerns the
relations between the individual who for the time being may
have the leadership of this house and its other members,
upon which ever side of the house they may sit. When I
was in that position it was often my duty, as well as plea-
sure, to be of service to gentlemen on both sides, and I see
a great many gentlemen on the benches opposite with whom
I have often been in communication, and I trust they will
admit that on all occasions they received from me every
possible courtesy. (Hear, hear.) Amonget others, I re.
ceived more than one visit in Downing-street from the gen-
tleman who now represents Sunderland. It was no secret
appointment ; he came to me on a subject of great impor-
tance, and I may say that he came to me because I was
leader of the house—that was the fact. I did what I could
for him in the matter respecting which ho came, which
was of the greatest importance, referring, as it did, to con-
traband of war, at a time when hostilities had just com-
menced between France and Austria. Now, it so hap-
pened that when he came a newspaper was lying on the
table which contained an official, that is to say an opposi-
tion official announcement, that a vete of want of confi-
dence was about to be proposed against her Majesty's Go-
. vernmeitt on the ground that they were thiowing o ver par-
liamentary reform, and should therefore be opposed by all
conscientious reformers. Well, the hon. member for Sun-
derland called my attention to this paragraph, and said that
for his part he did not agree with the proposed motion, nor
did he believe that a vote of want of confidence was one
that the house would agree to. He added that there were
a great many independent members on his side of the house
who did not approve of it any more than he did, and when
he spoke to me I cannot say that there was anything con-
fidential in our communications, but with just so much dis-
cretion as prevented their degenerating into gossip, I
replied to him, as I always speak to gentlemen every
night, in that spirit of free and candid intercourse
which I trust will always exist amongst mem
hers of this house, who will never forget that they are
not only members of parties, but also an assembly of gentle-
men ; and I said that if he meant there was to be a vote of
want of confidence because there was not to be a Reform
Bill that session, there might be, but that it was not our in-
tention finally to throw over the measure. On a subsequent
occasion the hon. member said to me, " I c m assure you
there is a feeling of great dissatisfaction on the part of a
great many members of the house ; and that if you can only
say that Government isnot going to throw over the measure,
but mean' to deal with it another time, such declaration
would have an exceedingly good effect." I replied that it
was totally impossible for me, or any Minister, to say, ex-
cept in Parliament, what was to be the policy of Govern-
ment—that the policy of Governmentmust be stated in my
place in Parliament ; but this I added, " You may depend
upon it we do not mean to bring forward another Reform
Bill this year ; nor are we going to reject the measure alto-
gether. We do not consider ourselves bound by the bill
which the house has rejected, but hope still to deal with
the question in a satisfactory manner, anti as you say many
members of the house want to be satisfied before they
vote want of confidence as to what is to be our course, you

may take it for granted that before the vote is come to I will

state what would be our course of policy, so that nobody
shall vote in ignorance." I believe that the hon. member
for Sunderland had confidence in what I stated, snd I can-
not understand what imputation could be cast on his hon-
our for wishing to have a clear understanding on so im-
portaut a subject. He was not the only Liberal member to
whom we were often indebted whilst in office for a candid
and liberal support. There can be no doubt but that he
texerted himself amongst his friends; and as to what
took place between him and me, it was only what may
take place between persons similarly situated every day.
I think that the conduct of the hon. member for
Sunderland was perfectly parliamentary, honourable, and
straightforward. I stated that in a letter, when he was
attacked last year ; but as the matter has now been brought
under the notice of Parliament, I thought I would take this
notice of it in my place. I take it for granted that the feel-
ing of the house in such matters is the same as my,own,
and that there is no desire to put a bar against frequent
communication between the leader of this house and the
members on either side.. They do not, I trust, mean to
sanction it as a rule that the leader of the house for the
time being is to treat all members who may be politically
opposed to him with the greatest reverence, or to look upon
the conduct of the hon. member for Sunderland as any-
thing bat proper and parliamentary. (Hear, hear.)
Mr. BRIGHT—The right hon. gentleman has referred
to a matter which he mentioned in his speech the other
night, but the right hon. gentleman will remember that I
did not introduce the topic for the purpose of attacking
either him or the hon. member for Sunderland. My object
waspaitmerely to show the right hon. gentleman that when his
suffrya_74's, in power they contemplated an extension of the
e by the admission of 500,000 new voters. I also said
it was understood that he had intimated to a gentleman on
this side of the house, that he was willing to go as far as the
bill we are new
righ7,fltssing. I merely wished to show how
consistent the
. only lament how gentleman was then, and I can
much lesshon, gentleman
consistent is his conduct this
year. But leaving matterh aside, which after all is not
of very great importer Ce ear)—the noble lord the mem-
ber for London has nusde ay(nsannouncement which possibly
has not taken the h01t.% by surprise, but which will be re-
ceived with very cliff. ent feelings in different quarters of
the house. Down 11, 'e, and el,
hope, it will be
received with deep re;; ret. (Loud, crieesreoi4 hear.) But
Ido net rise for the urpose of bleminmgetuhietefaor' noble lord for
rnhatving the course he has WI n, or the Govern
especiallyushies
con-
curred with him. I now that this house is the best
place in the world for getting through business°
when nearly half its/ members do not like the b
all. The right hon. I;entleman wishes it to be believed that
during during what occurrt fel in the last few weeks neither he nor
his friends offered a: ay opposition. That was a daring
statement, seeing vr:t it we have seen of late in this house.
(Cheers.) There h ; certainly been a great deal of adroit-
ness in the oppolildon; Some gentlemen opposite first