The Sun.
London, England, 1869-05-12 00:00:00

102 103

flhitl) FDL'

.NOTIGh.

'he Third Edition of " The Su 3" of last Evening wa:,
published in time for delivery in town at 7.15 p.m.

SUN OFFICE, 7 O'CLOCK.

L'ISKEARD ELECT lON.-(THIS DA K)

CLOSE OF TILE POLL.

Horstnan ...
Lycett ...

.. 368
.. 285

IMPERIAL 2ABL I A EN

lIOUSE OF COMMONS.—THIS DAY.
The SPEAKER took the chair at 12 o'clock.

'TIE PERMISSIVE BILL.

A great number of petitions were presented from all
mrts of the country iu favour of this bill.
Mr. LOCKS and Mr. GIUYES presented petitions fro►:
Icensed victuallers in London and Liverpool against the

Sir W. LAWSON, in moving the second rca ling of this
bill, said he wal not going to snow that drinking Wit
on the deci-ease, hut he thought tluit many would agree
with him that it was still the great source of pauperism
and crime, and that alone would form a good
basis to proceed upon. What was wanted by
a great many persons was a trial of the per-
missive system, because where it had blon volun-,
tarily tiled it, had invariably given the greatest
satisfaction. There was a largo utimlier of per-

sons engaged in the trade of selling drink, and whose
direct intereA it was to sell the greatost amount

possible, but it was not with those persons that he
found fault, but the law under which they carriel
on their trade. The bill lie had the honour to move the"
second reading was not for the improving of the licensing
laws, because he did not believe in these laws ; but the
great object of his measure was to allow the ma
jority of the inhabitatats of any particular place
to put a veto on the lictnsieg of the magistrates.
The principle of the bill was not new, because they had
already tried it with respect to public libraries, in which it
had given the greatest satisfaction, and he merely asked
that the system might be tried with respect to the sale of
driek. (Hear, hear.) It had been clearly demonstrated that
where there were ,no public-houses in a place there was
an entire absence of drunkenness; and Saltaire, in Bess-
borough, showed how well the system worked. He hoped
the house would permit his bill to receive a second read-
ing, because its object was a good and benevolent one, and
ono that had the improvement of the people as its great
object.

Mr. BAZLEY seconded the motion. He thought the
best results would follow the adoption of the bill, even if
they only diverted a portion of the money now annually
spent in intoxicating drinks. It was estimated at least
£100,000,000 was spent in drink ; but if they could only
save one half of that sum and build improved dwellings for
the poor, what an impetus would be given to trade. He
did not believe it was at all possible to make people sober
by act of Parliament ; but he did believe that it was in the
power of Parliament to diminish drunkenness to a very
great extent, and a great improvement in the condition of
the working classes would be the resu:t of the passing of
the bill.

Col. JERVIS moved that the bill be read a second time
that day six months. He believed the bill to be totally against
tLe:grneral feeling of the country, and with respect to peti-
tions that had been presented in its favour they were not
to be relied on to a great extent, becausa circulars had
been sent round stating that all persons above the age of
sixteen could sign the petition. The bill was altogether
useless, because if persons made up their minds to get in-
toxicated no legislative measures could Ireveut it. He
thought the bill of the member for West Ezsex might be
of some advantage, as it affect, d the licensing system; and
if there happen to be people who c in not keep from drinking
to excess, he thought the most sensible mode of dealing
with those persons would be to treat them as they are
treated in America, namely, as lunatics. (Hear, hear.)
Mr. O. MORGAN supported the bill ; he thought on
the whole it was calculated to do a great deal of good, and
therefore he hoped the house would give its assent to the
second reading.
Mr. CAWLEY, whilst he rejoiced at the great number
of petitions that had been presented in favour of the bill,
regretted that he could not support the bill, because he did
not believe the entire nation would accept it. He did not
tb nk it at all practicable, and he could nor become a
party to the turmoil that would ensue supposing the bill

passed.
lir. FORESTER said, speaking individually, ho could
not support the bill, becau-se it was really neither a small
measure nor mild bill as it had been called by the hon.
baronet who introduced it. lie thought they would do
bai•tn instead of good, and they went in advance of public
opinivn, and he certainly could not gite his assent to a
measure that gave actual power of prohibition to any par-
ticular pertiuu of the people. lie thought it was quite
possible to do something to improve the Gover..meut
licensing law, and he thought a measure might be so
framed giving ratepayers the right to r. pre: to the
magistrates that no further licenses should 13,.) granted,
and the magistrate should decide iu accorda►.ce with that-
representation, but iu order that the bill might nut be
considered a prohibitory one he would give au appeal
from the decision of the magistrate.

Viscount SANDUN urged upin the Government the
necessity of speedily tAking the whole subject of lice using
into their ear ly consideration. lie believed it to be fully
admitted that drunkenness was decreasing, and the great

meetings of the societies of the working classes annually
held at the Crystal Pahico, and uther p!aces, were now
almost free from drunkennet.s.

Mr. LEATIUM said he could not support the bill,

although he could not refrain from complimenting the zeal
that had characterized the actions of the hon. baronet who
introduced the bill and forcing a consideration of the sub-
ject on the attention of the house. lie agreed with the
hon. member for Bradford in the view he had taken in the
matter. lie voted against the hon. baronet wi►h much

regret.
Mr. SCHOFIELD and Hr. D.tLWAT supported the bill.
Mr. WALTER advised the Lou. baronet to leave the
whole question in the hands of the Government, because
it was impossible for them any longer to delay dealing with
the whole of the licensing question. Ile holy concurred
with the object the hon. baronet had at heart.
Capt. COBETT opposed the bill, as it was a specimen of
exceptional legislation.
Mr. JACOB BRIGHT, alth.eugh he was not in favour
of the bdi as it at present stood, yet he should vote in
favour of the second reading. During the whole of the
observations that had taken place not one person had
wholly given his adly:sion to the bill. Ile thought au
autouchnont iu the licensing law was lcudly culled for, and
he hoped the Government would take the subject up in
earnest. The fact was they %%anted a revolutionary bill
- (hear, hear)—aul experience showed him that the more
revolutionary a bill was the more likely was it to pass.
The hon. gentlemen opposite had found that the case with
the Reform bill, and on his side of the house it was illus-
trated by the bill on the Irish Church.
Lord C. HAMILTON supported the bill.
Mr. BRUCE said it was desirable that everything pos-
sible should be done to restrict drunkenness, and he could
assure the house that the Government intended to deal
honestly with the subject next session. (Hear, hear.) He
did not say in the spirit of the hon. baronet who had brought
the subject forward, because that was going too far. He ob-
jected to the bill of the hon. baronet because it would, if
adopted, lead to great and frequent disturbances,
and also bring a reaction. (Hear, hear.) The bill pro-
posed to give the power of prohibiting the sale of

liquor in certain places in the event of two-thirds
of the ratepayers dedding that such was necessary. But
he thought that if the number of persons, not ratepayers,
were added to those that were, the two-thirds would not
represent ►he majority. (Hear, hear.) He thought it was
quite possible to improve the law with respect to regulating
public houses, and also with respect to their continuing
open at a time when the honest requirements of the public
did not require. (Hear, hear.) Those subjects could
be well treated by Parliament, but to pass such
a sweeping bill as that now proposed would be
a grave mistake. He hoped, after the intimation he had
made that the Government intended to deal with the mat-
ter of drunkenness, the house would agree with hlm in
thinking it unadvisable to read the bill a second time.
Mr. Graves, Mr. M‘Laren, and other hon. members
having made a few observations on the bill,
The house divided, when there appeared—
For the second reading
Against it
Majority against the bill --106
The orders of the day having been disposed of, the
house adjourned.

THE NORTH OF SCOTLAND.—WICK, Saturday.—
We have had a week of exceedingly cold weather, with in-
tense frosts in the mornings. The distant hills of Suther-
land on the one side, and of Orkney on the other, are
covered with snow, and yesterday morning snow fell to the
depth of three inches on the Ord. Grass and oat briards are
suffering greatly in consequence.
CRYSTAL PALACE.—One Shilling Day.—Mon -
day, May 10.—Admissions by season tickets. 1,768; ditto
on payment, 1,642; total visitors, 3,405.
THE TEA TRADE.—May 10.—The deliveries in
London estimated for the week were 1,02,362 lb , which
is an increase of 109,844 lb., compared with sbe previous
statement.
DUNVILLE and, Co., Belfast, are the largest
holders of Whisky in the world. Their Old Irish Wh
toisky
French
is re
commended by the medical profession in preference
Brandy. Supplied in casks and cases for home use or exporta
tion. Quotations on application to Messrs. Dunialle and Co.,
Belfast; cr 4, Beaufort-lovill.ings,Straud, Loudon, W.O
Tertiseniern. 1