The Sun.
London, England, 1860-02-04 00:00:00

TILE B.ILLOT.


A meeting of the council of the Ballot Society
was held yesterday afternoon at the Whittington
Club, Arundel-street, Strand, in order to coder
the following notice of motion, given by Mr..T.AL
Duncombe, M.P. :—" Gloucester and V Wakefield
Elections—Bill to make provision that at all future
elections of members to serve in Parliament for tile
boroughs of Gloucester and Wakefield the electors
thereof give their vote by ballot."
There were present—Mr. Berkeley, M.P.; Mx.
T. S. Duncombe, M.P.; Mr. Lawson, M.P. ; Mr.
Sergeant Gaselee, Mr. E. C. Whitehurst, Mr. S.
White, Mr. Russell, Mr. S. Nodes, Mr. C. H. Elt,
Mr. H. Gridley, Mr. M. Marsden, Mr. W. Wilke,
Mr. J. Bontems, and other supporters of the move-
ment. _ . _

Mr. WHITEHURST, having taken the chair, stated
the object for which the meeting had been convened,
and read a letter from General Thompson regret-
ting that he could net attend. He then went on to
say, in reference to Mr. Duncombe's motion, that
when Mr. Bonham-Carter brought forward a simi-
lar motion the council of the society had not consi-
dered it expedient to give it their support. Mr.
Duncombe's motion in 1854 was similarly received ;
but societies, like individuals, grew wiser in pro-
cess of time, and the council now believed that the
cause of the ballot would be promoted by support.
ing Mr. Duncombe's motion. He had seen a gen-
tleman concerned as one of Mr. Leatham's agents
in the Wakefield election, who said that if the bal-
lot had existed in that town not a dozen men would
have been bribed. It had been considered proper to
call the council together on that occasion, in order
that they might co-operate; and he would invite
them freely to discuss the question.
' Mr. GRIDLEY, the defeated candidate for Bever-
ley, said as he was the last " eel that had been
skinned," he would make a few remarks. The pre-
sent was a very favourable time for the motion to
be brought before the house, but he would suggest
an alteration in the terms—viz., that the ballot
should be introduced for the next election only.
He conceived the object of the motion was
merely to test the efficacy of +he ballot, and Par-
liament might be disposed to allow it a trial at one
borough, for which 'purpose one election would
suffice. The ballot would hove the effect of pre-
venting bribery, and he could speak to the truth of
the statement of Mr. Leatham's agent—the class of
people assailable by bribery were in so low a condi-
tion, both pecuniarly and morally, that they re-
quired watching to the poll to give their votes, and
so keen and wide awake that they would not poll
until they received the money. He was disposed
to say that if the ballot did not put an end to
bribery, at all events it would prevent intimida-
tion. (Hear, hear.) If it had existed last Tues-
day in Beverley he had no hesitation in saying he
should have represented Beverley at that moment
in spite of bribery. He could bear testimony to
the fact that bribery became a matter of necessity
—(hear)—and ready as any one might be to get a
seat in Parliament, to go down to meet such a sys-
tem of bribery and intimidation require.l him to
have the Bank of England behind him to meet with
any chance of success.
Mr. WHITE was gratified at the manner in which
the case had been detailed, which showed in an
eminent degree the necessity and efficiency of the
ballot. They were much indebted to Mr. Dun-
combe for the part he had taken in the matter.
Public attention was rivet ted on the cases of Glou-
cester and Wakefield. The moral feeling of the
country had been outraged, and Mr. Du ncombe was
acting in a proper spirit by seizing on the occasion
and appropriating it to the common cause. He
thought the suggestion made by Mr. Gridley should
be left to Mr. Duncombe's discretion. The House
of Commons might submit to a tentative measure
while they objected to a principle. He then moved—

"That the motion, of which Mr. Buncombe M,P., has
given notice, is entitled to all possible support; and this
council resolves that it will use every exertion in its power
to aid Mr. Buncombe, and respectfully solicits the mem-
bers of Parliament who are favourable to the ballot to give
the motion their cordial and united support."
Mr. BERKELEY, M.P., seconded the motion. He
doubted the prudence of changing the terms of the
motion, as kuggested by Air. Gridley. Supposing
that Mr. Duncombe's Bill was carried, that Bill
would embrace every constituency, though applied
only to Glocester and Wakefield. He thought it
probable that Mr. Buncombe would wish to see the
bill they (the council) had prepared, with a view of
presentation at an early period.
Mr. BUNCOMBE, M.P., said his motion was not
intended to interfere with Mr. Berkeley's Bill; they
would do the same thing as was done with the
Jewish Emancipation Bill, which was done some-
what ungraciously ; but they attained their object,
and, if unattainable by other means, they might
eventually get the ballot by carrying partial mea-
sures. With reference to the suggestion that had
been made to limit the period of operation of
the bill, it was perfectly competent to propose to
limit it to 10 years, and then to continue it, if found
to work well. He was disposed to think he should
be successful in getting the bill in if they could get
the church-rate question, which stood for the same
day, over on that day. No doubt the Government
and the Tories would coalesce against him, but in
spite of this he thought he should succeed.
Mr. Sergeant GASELEE considered the measure
a most suicidal one. If the bill extended over a
period of 10 years he supposed they would have to
wait that time in order to see how it operated. (No,
no.) He had a great objection to the measure. Why
wait 10 years ? Everybodywould say, " Don't
bring in any bill ; wait until this experiment has
been tried." He hoped instead of giving them the
advantages of the ballot, the Government would
stop the writs for Wakefield, Gloeester, and Bever-
ley for 10 years, and show that the finger of scorn
was pointed at them. Why give benefits to
towns that had disgraced themselves ? It was
either a punishment or a benefit; if a benefit, why
should these towns have an advantage over others ?
if a punishment, why stigmatise the ballot
as such ? Again, they wanted all their forces
to support their own bill, and the House of
Commons would not like to have two discus-
sions. He strongly urged them not to have a par-
tial ballot, but to go for the whole bill and nothing
but the bill. If they were to dilute their strength,
people were so much against it that if the motion
was carried he believed it would put back the cause
of the ballot for 10 years.
Mr. BERKELEY said, in reference to the ballot
being considered as a punishment, he thought the
proper light to view it in was the same way in which
vaccination for the smallpox was regarded.
The CHAIRMAN did not consider it would have
the effect of stopping the agitation.
Mr. ELT was afraid he should have stood alone,
but he entertained the same view as Mr. Gaselee.
Would these two places be the best to try the expe-
riment of the ballot—places so corrupt that nothing
could be done with them ? The ballot could not
make head against corruption in small places.
The resolution having been carried,
After some further discussion, Mr. MARSDEN
moved—

" That a circular, signed by Mr. T. Duncombe,
and Mr. Berkeley, M.P., as chairman of the society, be
issued to the Parliamentary supporters of the ballot, re-
questing them to meet and support Mr. Duncombe's
motion."

Mr. NODES seconded the motion, which having
been carried, a vote of thanks was passed to the
chairman, and the meeting separated.

THIS DAY'S SHIPPING.

LONDON, Feb. 4.—Wind this day at noon, W.S.W.;
moderate breeze and cloudy.
PORTSMOUTH, Feb. 3.—Wind, N.N.E. Arrived—
Vicenta, from Cuba for Bremen, with foreyard sprunt.
Sailed—H.M.'s steamer Alacrity, for Portland. Off port—
Gertrude, fron► London, for Calcutta—Agnes, from Lon-
don for Jamaica—Victoria, from London for New York.
PLYMOUTH, Feb. 3.—Sailed—Morayshire, for Shanghai
--Pollonia, for Barcelona—Neptune, for Lisbon.
NEWPORT, Feb. 3.—Wind, N.E.—Arrived—Autocrat,
from Liverpool for New Orleans.

---
(BY ELECTRIC TELEGRAPH.)
SOUTIIAMPTON, Saturday Morning.

Wilter-
Wind N W.
,la il n
steamer,A
Arrive d—Union, from Aberdeen ; Alliance, steamer,
from Havre ; Atalanta, steamer, from Jersey;
force, from Shields • uebec packet, from Cicely ;
Haw-
thornsaileadn_dßlalpanhgoanth'dla:do:ifirofnori
CSuarnddieffrl;anuda;vrje
Ar-
mand, from Carentan; Rapid, from Alexandria.
for Havre; Dispatch, steamer, for Jersey.
LIVEI IPOOL, Saturday 14/1 '
orning.

Wind W. N.W.
Arrived, Feb. 3—Sea Snake, from Iquique.
-Sailed—Criteria, for St. Michael's ; Neve, for Gibraltar
and Cadiz; Jeanette Melaine, for Ostend ; M. A. Duffus,
for Marseilles ; Warrior, for Jersey ; Alfred, for Gibraltar.
del hip. Arrived, Feb. 4.
Vigo, screw steamer, from Phila-
p

(BY SUBMARINE AND BRITISH TELEGRAEII.)
Wind, W.; GRAVESEND, Saturday Morning.
tide, near high water; weather fine.
Arrived, Feb. 3.—ltosa, from Guernsey; Gunner, from
Alkmader ; Cosmopolitan, from Hamburg.
Arrived, Feb. 4—Rhine, steamer, from Antwerp ; Bel-
gium, steamer, from Ostend.
Sailed, Feb. 4—Adler, for Bremen; Pollux, for Ham-
burg.

DEAL, Saturday Morning.

Wind N., fine.
Anchored—Mignionnette, from London for Berbice.
Passed—Arrow, from St. Michael's for Hull; Conelune,
barque, from Peru for London (in tow) ; Victorine Am-
brose and Isabella, brig, from west for north.
Sailed—Stirlingshire, Sarah Newman, Memore, City of
Benares and Foam.

The Spaniards have established at the custom-
house of the port of Martin an hospital for the re-
ception of the sick and wounded of the army of
operations. The engineers are also erecting forti-
fications near the same spot.

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT.

HOUSE OF LORDS--(YESTERDAY.)
The LORD CHANCELLOR took his seat on the woolsack
St five o'clock.

CHURCH RATES.
Viscount DUNGANNON presented petitions from
iikopshire and Berkshire against the abolition of church
btse.

MARRIAGE LAW.
The NOBLE VISCOUNT also gave notice that on the 24th
bast. he should present a petition frein
Aylesbury, signed
th aby 300 women, against legalising the marriage wi
de-
ceased wife's sister.
CHURCH RATES.
The Earl of DERBY presented a petition from South
Devon in favour of church rates.
Viscount DUNGANNON presented the petition of
Which he had given notice, from places in the diocese of St.
Asaph. The petitioners prayed their lordships to be very
careful how they gave their sanction to any bill calculated
to abolish the payment of church-rates.
ENDOWED SCHOOLS.
Lord BROUGHAM presented !petitions from Penrhyn
wad other places against the exclusion of Dissenters from
trust funds of endowed schools.
The Earl of CARNARVON drew the attention of their
lordships to a difference in the bill introduced this session
and the one brought in last year. At the first blush the
present bill appeared precisely the same ' • but a great dif-
ference, on a close examination, was to be found in the 7th
clause. Under these circumstances, he trusted the noble
and learned lord would not proceed with the second reading
of the bill, which was fixed for Tuesday next.
Lord CRANWORTH said he introduced the bill on the
first day of the session, and it was perfectly true there was
a difference in the 7th clause, and it was for the house to
say whether that alteration was agreeable. He could not
consent to any postponement.
Lord CHELMSFORD thought the best course to pursue
was to postpone the consideration of the bill until the
House of Commons, which had already had the subject
trader consideration, had expressed a decided opinion on the
point.
Earl GRANVILLE could not understand that any in-
convenience would arise in proceeding with this bill on the
day originally named.
Lord REDESDALE said there had been no time for
those interested in the question t• express any opinion on
the proposed bill. At present it was not known whether
either party would accept the measure.
The Marquis of BATH was in favour of postponing the
second reading of the bill.
The LORD CHANCELLOR thought, as there ap-
peared a feeling in favour of postponing the second reading,
his noble friend would consent to postpone proceeding with
the bill until Thursday next.
Lord CRANWORTH said he should be prepared
on the second reading, to state the reasons for the impor-
tant alterations he made in the seventh clause. As a
more attractive subject stood for discussion on Tuesday
next, he would consent to postpone the second reading
until Thursday.
ST. GEORGE'S IN THE EAST.
Lord EBURY gave notice that on Friday next he should
present a petition from the parishioners of St. George's in
the East relative to the disturbances that had for some time
past taken place in the church of that parish.

LAW OF PROPERTY.
This bill was read a third time and passed.
CHINA.
Earl GREY presented a petition agreed to at a public
meeting, praying their lordships would do all in their
power to prevent this country from entering into
a war with China by which an important source of revenue
would be cut off, and for which there was no assignable
object or reason.
Their lordships then adjourned.

HOUSE OF COMMONS—(YESTERDAY.)
The SPEAKER took the chair at four o'clock.
NEW MEMBERS.

Mr. WALKER took the oaths and his seat for Beverley,
and Mr. DENT for Scarborough.

PRIVATE BUSINESS.
The standing orders were declared to have been complied
with in the case of several railway and other bills.

GLOUCESTER AND WAKEFIELD ELECTIONS.
Mr. BRISTOW moved for an address for a return of the
expenses of, and incident to, the commissions recently exe-
cuted for inquiring into the Gloucester and Wakefield elec-
tions.—Agreed to.
THE LAW OF SETTLEMENT AND REMOVAL.
Mr. KEKEWICH asked the President of the Poor Law
Board, whether it was his intention to move for the re-ap-
pointment of the select committee on the irremovable poor,
with the view of proposing an alteration in the laws of set-
tlement and removal, during the present session?
Mr. VILLIERS said it was intended to renew the com-
mittee in question.