The Sun.
London, England, 1869-03-25 00:00:00

METROPOLITAN GOSSIP.— Wednesday.

The fourth and concluding night's debate on the Irish
Church was not ushered in by any of the excitement which

had characterised the three previous evenings.

Few

strangers were to he witnessed in the lobbies, and fewer
_ _

still assembled in Westminster Hall. It was felt on all
sides that the question was exhausted, and that the only
thing for speculation was as to the exact majority by which
the bill would pass a second reading. Inside the House
members sat listlessly on their seats during the whole of
Mr. Walpole's speech, for that gentleman—even

when in his best form—does not captivate either

side with his eloquence.

His tone was sonorous and

grave, and he did not once raise himself out of the dead

level of dullness which he had chosen. Sir Henry
Bulwer received a hearty welcome from the Liberals, and
if his voice was not so weak he would have made one of
the best second-rate speeches on the Government side of
the House. It was not until he had nearly concluded
that those in the galleries could distinctly hear
what he was saying. For three hours— from seven
to ten—the House was comparatively empty, but at that
hour members began to arrive in quick succession, as it

was generally understood that Mr. Gathorne Hardy would

rise before eleven. When Mr. Moore-who was constantly
interrupted with cries of " 'Vide, 'vide " from the Con-
servatives—sat down, the late Home Secretary began to
sum up the case on behalf of the Opposition. This
was the signal for a chorus of cheers from the
defenders of the Church, which were again and
►gain repeated during the whole of the right hon.
gentleman's speech. During the time he was
speaking the House presented a brilliant spec-
tacle,

The Conservative benches were numerous

enough to hold all the members of the Opposition, but the
Liberals were obliged to find seats in the galleries, which

soon became overcrowded. Even at such a late hour the

Peers', Speaker's and Strangers' Galleries were packed,
everybody appearing to feel the deepest interest in the

debate. It was one o'clock before Mr. Gladstone cora-

menced to reply. He appeared to be greatly excited,
which, however, did not prevent the free utterance of his

remarks. In dealing with Sir Roundel' Palmer's argu-
ments he was tender and respectful, but when he took up the

different points advanced by the Opposition, he warmed
to his work, and delivered himself of some bitter sar•
casms. Exactly at twenty minutes past two the tremen-
dous cheers which greeted the conclusion of his speech

announced to the members who were in the refreshment
- -

and smoking-rooms that the hour of the division bad
arrived. 'ln a very few seconds the question was put,
amid cheers and counter-cheers ; but although the Con-
servatives attempted to drown the voices of their oppo-
nents, it was evident on which side the largest body of
sound lay. Then came the division. The Conservatives
had all emerged from the House in five minutes, but it took
nearly double that time before the Liberal benches were
empty. In a short time the Noes had all been counted, and a
whisper ran round the House that they numbered 250.
It was 'not, however, until ten minutes to three that all
the Ministerialists had voted, and then the excitement
was at boiling beat. The tellers having taken their posi-
tion at the table, Mr. Wyn began to read the numbers.
He commenced, "Ayes to the right, three hundred
and -," when, no doubt through excitement, he stam-
mered a little, which prevented his proceeding for about a
second, but which appeared to be a considerable length of
time, judging by the impatience manifested. He
recovered himself, however, almost instantly, and
continued, " sixty-eight. Noes to the left, two
hundred and fifty." Immediately he bad concluded the
Liberals set up a tremendous shout, which was again and
again repeated. The Conservatives sat cowed and dumb,
and did not appear to realise the overwhelming defeat.
For fully five minutes did the Liberals continue cheering,
but not a single answer was heard from the Opposition.
The scene in New Palace-yard, as Big Ben boomed forth
the hour of three, reminded one of Regent-street in the
height of the season, but in a quarter of an hour stillness
once more reigned supreme in the Senate House of West-
minster.

And now how will the bill fare in its subsequent stages.
One hundred and eighteen is a very handsome majority.
Few Ministers of late years have had such a splendid
following as that. Is it conceivable that it can be frittered
baewcaayveisnancdomtmeai-trtoeoem?
plarctiaensnpoterhbelieve
buitt.
11T8ltertehawill is
a substantial fact—which any number of tea-parties,
which all Adullamy will scarcely be able to overcome.
Moreover, Mr. Gladstone is so strong that he
can afford to make concessions should any consider-
able section of his followers desire any, and should
the concessions they ask seem to him reasonable. A
Minister at the head of a weak party must rigidly repress
the smallest symptom of disaffection ; but a Minister in
Mr. Gladstone'. position can be magnanimous and de-
bonnair. Judging from present appearances, however,
the Premier is not at all likely to yield the point
upon which one of the sharpest discussions will take
place—the compensation to Maynooth. He pointed
out very forcibly last night how small was the
""" "E the riven to the great majority of the
Irish people compared With .:,,en to the small
minority. Mr. Aytoun means to press the mawa-
shape of an instruction to the committee, and it is said
that he has obtained the co-operation of some number of
Scotch members and English Nonconformists. I doubt if
they will compensate for the defection of the High Church
Conservatives, who view Mr. Spofforth's intrigue between
the No-Popery Liberals and the Opposition with extreme
dislike. Another point which report says is to be raised
in committee is the purchase of the tithe-rent charge by
the landlords. But this is scarcely a party question, and
is not likely to afford the Conservatives a point of attack.
The limitation of private endowments to the year 1660
will afford room for some interesting historical informa-
tion, but to scarcely more than that. Then comes the
question, What will the Lords do? As I have mentioned
before, the bishops, advised chiefly by the Bishop of
Oxford, contemplate abstaining from a division on the
second reading of the bill, should any take place, and it is
believed that the majority of them have, after consultation,
recommended that course. This, of course, will not pre-
vent them from " amending" the bill in committee.
Should the right rev, bench decide upon this line of action,
it will amount to something more than the withdrawal of
some two dozen votes from the Opposition ; it will lead
the lay peers to consider if this would not be the wisest
course for them also. " Surely," they may argue, "if the
bishops do not feel themselves called upon to put them-
selves in antagonism to the nation upon a matter which
so closely concerns them, we, whom it much less deeply
interests, may be excused from adopting a course which
will place us in such an invidious and even perilous
position."
There has been a rumour during the week that Earl
Spencer bad resigned the Irish Viceroyalty, and political
speculators have been busy at work suggesting reasons for
this action. Conservatives, of course, supposed that his
lordship had left his colleagues because he disapproved of
the liberation of the Fenians. It turns out that the whole
story is a canard incubated and hatched by the Irish Times,
whereof Colonel Knox, the unseated Conservative member
for Sligo, is the proprietor. I have reason to know, however,
that the Countess Spencer, who is one of the queens of
fashion in London, is disgusted at the small attendance
at her Drawing-rooms. Of course the slight is not a per-
sonal one, but is a political demonstration on the part of
the Dublin aristocracy, who are, for the most part, Tory
and Protestant to the backbone, and who resent with the
utmost bitterness the loss of the political and religious
ascendancy which they have so long enjoyed.
While the Irish Church is the prominent question of the
day, there is another, far more important, which is being
quietly pushed forward by able and energetic men who'
know what they are about, and have no intention of being
put off by any number of unfavourable answers, by any
amount of cold shoulder. The licensing question will,
before the seventh decade of this century is out, attain
the foremost place among the great political problems of
the day. Your readers are aware that several deputations
have waited upon Mr. Gladstone, Mr. Bruce, and other
members of the Government with reference to this matter,
and that the Government has given them no hope of
dealing with it, at all events for the present. Mean-
while some prominent M.P.'s are I-negotiating with a
view to bringing the question before Parliament in a
practical shape. Yesterday morning a deputation consist-
ing of the following M.P.'s—Mr. Baines, Lord Sandon, Mr.
Bazley, Mr. Jacob Bright, Mr. Samuel Morley, Mr.
Villiers, Mr. Pease, Mr. Candlish, together with Arch-
bishop Manning, and other gentlemen waited upon Sir
George Grey, in order to induce the ex-Home Secretary
to bring in a measure for closing public-houses on the
Sunday. The matter was thoroughly discussed, and it
was decided that another meeting should be held after the
Easter holidays. Should Sir George Grey decline to
undertake the task, Mr. Villiers will, not improbably, be
induced to do so. Not having been taken into the Cabinet
he has plenty of time on his hands just now. I need hardly
add that when Manchester, Liverpool, Leeds, and Bristol
unite, the subject which they take in hand is not likely to
be allowed to drop.
The splendid new joint-stock palace in Pall Mall, called
the Junior Carlton Club, is all but finished, and will be
opened on April 20. Unfortunately for the members,
they have to leaye their present temporary premises in
Regent-street next Wednesday, so that for twenty days
they will be without a local hp,bitation, and that,: too,
during just the most active period of the club season;
The new building towers above gill the rest in Pall Mall,
and is really a very fine structure. The Carlton, not
wishing to be altogether outshone by its own &and, is
repainting and furbishing just now.
Private letters from India give some details respecting
the new Viceroy. There could scarcely be a greater con-