The Sun.
London, England, 1860-06-23 00:00:00

sesseee--.
Squitabl. no.
wer which they were competent to administer
but
Corr wi.-
%ais they were not satisfied. The Common Law
u. -ems' sioners, in their second report, asked for all the
Aisrli.ction which it was proposed to confer by this bill ;
Ad the Legislature hitherto had only given them that
which they could fairly exercise. Parliament would now
lave to decide whether it would give them a jurisdiction
which it had denied them before, and whether it would in-
lerfesre with a jurisdiction which worked so admirably as
that of the courts of equity. In equity there was now no
delay; there were six courts, and but seven judges to decide
the cases which came before them ; and would Parliament
be doing well to take away the jurisdiction of these excel-
lent judges and give it to the common law judges, who
already complained that they had not time to perform their
present duties ? He was strongly induced to take their
lordships' opinion on the principle of the measure ; but, as
it was unusual to do so on a motion for referring the bill to
a select committee, he should on this occasion refrain from
pressing for a division.
Lord BROUGHAM concurred with his noble and learned
friend (Lord Lyndhurst) in thinking that, there being a
division of opinion between the common law and equity
judges, the proper way was to refer the bill to a select com-
mittee. The design of the bill was to extend still further the
equitable jurisdiction which the common law courts now
possessed. There could not be a greater mistake than to
suppose that a general fusion, as it was called, of law and
equity was possible in this country ; and any attempt to
effect such general fusion would only be productive of mis-
chief. But what the noble and learned lord on the woolsack
said was that in many instances a certain equitable juris-
diction had been given to the courts of common law, par-
ticularly of late years. Now, the principle of the present
bill, as he understood it, declared that where there was a
legal right, and where that right was sought to be obtained
in a court of common law, it was better that that court,
should be empowered to dealwith the whole subject matter,
and if in the course of the inquiry any equitable objection
should arise on one side or on the other, the parties should
not be put to the expense, delay, and vexation consequent
en being sent to a court of equity, but that the common law
court should have the power of dealing with the equitable
matter. His noble and learned friend who opposed the bill
stated three objections to the decision to which the common
law judges had come on the subject—namely, that the com-
mon law courts were overworked, that they had not the
proper machinery, and that they were not competent for the
purpose. From his noble and learned friend he appealed to
those judges themselves, who declared that in point of time
and labour they had no objection to the proposition now
made, that they had abundance of time and were not over-
worked, but were capable of taking this small fraction of
addition to their labours. He could not help referring those
who entertained objections to the proposed change in the
proceedings of the courts to that report of the Common Law
Commissioners, in which the history of amendments in
the law was traced with great accuracy, and where it
was shown how matters deemed at one time
wild and dangerous innovations had gradually, by
the improvement of men's knowledge on the sub-
ject, ,become the law of the land. As a remarkable proof
of this, he mentioned the changes effected in the law of evi-
dence, which had been found to work admirably, and to
contribute greatly to the efficient administration of justice.
Lord CHELMSFORD hoped that the bill would be very
much altered before it was passed into law. There ought,
in fad, to be two bills, and, notwithstanding the authority
of the common law judges, his objection to many parts of
the first portion of the measure was not in the slightest
degree lessened. He was bound to say, at the same time,
that the opinion of their lordships upon the principle of the
bill ought to have been tested when the motion was made
for the second reading. That stage had been allowed to pass
without opposition, and, inasmuch as there had been a
rather sharp encounter between the equity and common law
judges, it was impossible for theirlordships to make up their
minds on the subject without carefully considering the
statements and opinions on both sides. Of course, that
could not be done in the house itself. It would be infi-
nitely better to refer the matter to a select committee, and
when the bill came out of the committee their lordships
would be able to decide whether it should be passed into
law or not.
Lord KINGSDOWN said that the observations of the
Common Law Commissioners had not removed, or even in
the slightest degree effected, the strong objections which he
entertained to the present bill. The bill had two objects
entirely distinct, which should properly form the subject of
two measures, but which, unfortunately, had been united in
one. One portion of the bill gave what he believed was in
principle an entirely new jurisdiction of the courts of com-
mon law. The other was confined to amending the pro-
ceedings which properly belonged to those courts. To the
latter, if brought forward in a bill by itself there could be no
objection, but the case was very different with respect to the
former. If the bill was referred to a select committee, the
objections entertained by many noble lords to its first por-
tion, consisting of no fewer than 30 clauses, would continue
to exist in precisely the same force. The only difference
would be that those clauses, if the committee should not ap-
prove them, would be expunged ; or, if the committee
should approve them, they would be the subject of a hostile!
motion on the third reading of the bill. He could not helpl
looking with considerable apprehension to the, course about
to be taken. If the bill was referred to a select committee,
it must, of necessity, occupy some time in its consideration
there. It must occupy some further time in its discussion
in the house after it came out of the eommittee ; and, sup-
posing their lordships should ultimately give it a third read-
ing, at what period of the session was it likely to go down
to the other house ? What might be its fate there he would
not, of course, presume to say ; but at present, at all eventi,
the omens were not auspicious. The consequence would be
that we should lose, for this session at least, the whole of
the bill, the portion which was desirable as well as that to
which the strongest objections were entertained.
The LORD CHANCELLOR stated, in reply, that there
had not been a single observation made to show that any
one of the powers sought by the present bill might not be
safely conferred upon the courts of common law. The come
mon law judges believed that without these additional
powers they could not in a satisfactory manner administer
justice in their courts. He had no objection to • add to the
motion the words "and that the opinions of the learned
equity and common law judges be also referred to the seleft
committee." He proposed that the committee should coat-
sist of the same members as those who sat on the consolli-
dation of the criminal law.
The motion as amended, was then agreed to.
ENGLISH SHIPWRIGHTS AT CHERBOURG.
Viscount DUNGANNON said he had given notice o a
question with regard to the report that a large number of
English shipwrights were engaged for the dockyard at Cher-
bourg, at the rate of Bs. a day for eight hours' work, instead
of 6s. as the rate was here, for 10 hours' work. Since theca,
however, certain circumstances had occurred which rendered
it unnecessary for him to press for further information on
the subject from the First Lord of the Admiralty. One of
the workmen who had gone over to Cherbourg, tempted by
the prospect of abundant employment and high remunesa-
tion, appeared at the Thames Police-court three or fetur
days ago, and said he felt it his duty to state, for the se
of others, that he had been unable to procure employment
in France, had fallen into great distress and destituti n, and
had been sent home again by the kindness of the British
consul.
The Duke of SOMERSET said that he had received an-
other letter from the British consul at Cherbourg, stating
that no British subjects were employed in the dockyard
there. Some British shipwrights had gone over to Cher-
bourg in consequence of the statement which had appeared
in the English newspapers ; but not being able to obtain
work had fallen into a pitiable condition, and bitterly re-
pented their credulity. The consul had sent them home
again, and told them to warn their countrymen of the real
state of the ease. The highest wages given to shipwrights
at Cherbourg was 3f. a-day, or not quite 2s. 6d. for 12 hours'
works, as the workmen were not allowed to leave the dock-
yard to take their meals. Besides that, the consul informed
him that no additional shipwrights were required at Cher-
bourg. Some of those in the dockyard had lately been dis •
charged, rind the only vessel which was now being con-
structed there was a transport. (Hear, hear.)
-1.11.19111 t MILITIA AND CONSTABULARY.
The Alarquieot CLAN RI C ARDE, in moving for cm tain
returns with regard to the Irish Militia and Constabu-
lary, said it was a question deserving consideration
whether a large armed force, such as the police of Ireland,
ought not to tio brought under the operation of the Mutiny
Aete and enlisted for a certain length of time. At present
tb might quit the service, he believed, at the shortest
notice. He was anxious to know on what system the em-
bodiment and disembodiment of the militia was conducted.
He defied any ono to discover any unifurze principle which
regulated the proceedings of the War-office in this respect.
It was impossible to make a regiment of militia effective in
28 days' training, and it was therefore unadvisable to leave
any regiment too long in a disembodied state. If 20,000 or
25,000 were always kept embodied in rotation, and the staff
of the other regiments were) kept up, it was clear that.
within a certain number of years there would be a force of
100,000 upon which reliance could be placed on an emer
Kelley, and which would be kept up at a cost of only 2.1,000
c'T 3 )000 men. The noble marquis concluded by moving for
thefoliowi"
returns :—Return of the number of men as-
sembled for the last training. of each of the disembodied
regiments of Irish Militia, stating also the full amount of
the eetablishment of each
regiment n; ; also a returti
of the
M il
periodsitia have bat and a
respectively g which each of the regiments of Irish
October, 1854 embodied since the month of
and alsoreturn of the number of police-
men of the Irish constabularya
force who have resigned their
employment since the commencement
traoencement of the present year.
The motion was agreedOn the motion of the Duke of N •
)zßwicilAwsTaLsE;etande
aD uc h
thirdy
of Cornwall (Limitation of Actions
time ar.l passed.
The Councillors of Burgin,' and Burgesses (Scotland) Bill
passed through committee.
The Plea on Indictment Bill wentthrones committee.
The Fisheries (Scotland) Bill was read a third time and
passed.
Their lordships then adjourned.

HOUSE OF COMMONS.—(YESTERDAY.)
The SPY:AKER took the chair shortly.after 12 O'clock.
PRIVATE BUSINESS,
The-North British and Peebles and Jedburo.h Rail.