The Sun.
London, England, 1860-04-16 00:00:00

THE FRENCH CHAMBERS.

There has been a debate in the Corps Legialatif
on foreign affairs which lasted three days. The oc-
casion was the discussion of the bill for reducing
the contingent of recruits of the class 1859 from
the number originally fixed, 140,000, to 100,000.
Viscount LEMERCIER (one of the three deputies,
the others being M. Keller and M. de Cuverville,
who were lately severely reflected on by the
Minister of the Interior for having in a letter in
favour of the Pope stated that the existing uncer-
tainty was calculated to separate all sincere Catho•
lies from the Emperor and his dynasty) opened the
discussion. He said that the bill being presented
as a consequence of the peace it was the
right of the Chamber to consider what were
the probabilities of peace being maintained. If
peace were so certain as the government would have
it thought 80,000 men would in his opinion and
that of his friends be a sufficient contingent. He
and two of his colleagues had been treated in an
official document as if they were guilty of some-
thing like high treason, because they had respect-
fully acquainted the Emperor with the alarm they
felt at the perilous position of the Holy Father.
Going back to the time of the assassination of
Count Rossi he contended that the excesses
of the revolution had alone prevented the Pope
from granting reforms. He and other Catholics
had relied with confidence upon the promises
Of the Government contained in the speech of
the President of the Council of State on April 30,
1859, and in the circular of the Minister of 1'111)4
Worship of May 2, confirmed as they were by
the Emperor's proclamation of May 4, stating that
he " was not going to Italy to break down the
power of the Holy Father, whom he had replaced
upon his throne." In spite of misgivings enter-
tained by many from the terms of the Milan pro-
clamation, the entry of Prince Napoleon into the
duchies, the presence of French vessels in Ancona,
the intrigues of MM. Pepo)i and Cipriani, and the
evacuation of the Romagnas, he personally had felt
his confidence revive when he saw the preliminaries
of Villafranca and the peace of Zurich. But the
appearance of the pamphlet, "The Pope and the
Congress," seemed to him to be the starting point
of a serious change in the policy of the French
Government, and he would now ask as a question
strictly appertaining to the matter in debate, namely,
the recruiting contingent of the army, whether that.
change was conducive to peace 1' He was of
opinion that by speaking firmly to Piedmont it
would have been very easy to bring the Romagnols
to their duty 'without having recourse to force. The
triumphant progress of the Pope through this part
of his dominions three years ago was for him a
sufficient proof of the real feelings of the people.
He argued at great length that the whole question
of the temporal power of the Pope,which was neces-
sary to his spiritual authority, was involved in the
subtraction of the Romagnas from his sceptre, and
contended that when France gave up Lombardy,
which she had conquered, to the King of Sardinia,
the stipulations of Villafranca ought to have been
made synallagmatie. Until the President of the
Council of State should have given satisfactory ex-
planations, he could not feel satisfied that peace was
assured, and he should reserve his vote.
M. MONIER DE LA SIZERANNE, while resigned
to the narrow nature of the mandate which he had
accepted as a representative of the people, could not
help expressing a regret that the Corps Legislat if
had not more power in the state, and only hoped
that the Government, which had taken upon itself
the sole responsibility for the foreign and domestic
policy of France, would always be prudent and
moderate.
M. Guyon Dclalain, the Count de la Tour, and
M. Morin spoke with few reserves in favour of
the bill.
M. JULES FAVRE, in proposing to speak his whole
mind upon a question involving the honour and
perhaps the fortunes of France, was aware that he
might be thought to transgress the very narrow
limits which the existing constitution assigned to
members of the chamber. A glorious campaign
had been suddenly interrupted on the banks of the
Mincio by an unexpected peace. He had said just
a year ago that the only rational and justifiable
object for undertaking the war was the emancipa-
tion of Italy. The Emperor's proclamation of May 3
had adopted his views in this respect. But it
must be confessed that his Majesty's grand pro-
gramme was not at first particularly well received.
The partisans of Italy in France were then few.
The vulgar opinion that Italy was a fickle, frivolous,
and unmanageable nation was but too prevalent.
It was feared that France was only undertaking
a Quixotic and sterile work. But the Italians by
their abnegatiqn and patriotism had nobly re-
' fated their detractors. Ever since the fall of the
Roman empire, Italy had been the battlefield on
which France and Germany were continually fight-
ing, as if it had been the purpose of God to reserve
this chastisement to Italy for having held the world
in servitude during many centuries. To prolong
this servitude was the supposed interest of France
in the middle ages. But at this 'day the grandeur
. and independence of France would be best pro-
moted by the emancipation of Italy. That object
had been in part accomplished. Ile, for one, so
far from dreading to see Italy a great and power-
ful nation, would rejoice if it were possible that the
whole triangle of which the Mediterranean was the
centre should be united in a free and intelligent
confederation extending from the Atlantic to the
Adriatic. Such a power need not alarm Europe,
and -would inaugurate t►u era of prosperity the
limits of which it was iinpossible to foresee. After
expressing an opinion that Austria, when defeated
in every battle and crouching behind her walla,
might easily have been driven out of Italy alto-
gether according to the Emperor's programme, M.
J. Faere, in continuation, said that. nothing of the
sort had happened. As the will of a single indivi-
dual sufficed to declare war, so the will of that indi-
vidual sufficed to load victory with chains, and to
leave unfinished a work in which he had asso-
ciated the dignity and interests of the country.
He felt it a duty to imp.ress upon France the fact
that she had put herself into the hands of a master.
The peace of Villafransa had left every important
question undecided. It had added to the difficulties
sf Piedmont while somewhat enlarging her ter-
ritory, and, on the other hand, while humiliating
Austria, it had. consolidated her power, since
itl recognised the rightful sovereignty of Austria

marched with a firm ;al; towards unity uvdrr the.
banner of Victor Emmanuel, and in the success of
this movement the honour of France was engaged.
France could not !J'o back without dishonour. Ho
would submit this tlil.Annia. -Either the war of l8::9
was justifiable, and then the Austrian domination
in Italy was not ; or the Austrian domination was
legitimate, and then the war entered into by
was impious and agairnt the law of na-
tions. France was not a nation which could :;it
down contented under the imputation of having
failed to fulfil her promises. The events w hick
had been accomplished in Northern Italy ought
logically to extend to the centre, including }tonic.
His own opinion.was that the Emperor had made
up his mind to sec au end of the Pope's tc:nr,r3l
power. Much had been said of the vacillation of
the French Government on this question, but he
thought that there had been no inconsistency except
in point of form. He did not deny that efforts had
been made to replace the Romagnas under the
"paternal yoke" of the Pope, but he thought that
the head of the State was perfectly resigned from the
first to the failure of these attempts. For him the
pamphlet, "The Pope and the Congress," which
surprised the world at the end of 1859, showed the
real intentions of the Emperor in this regard. lie
attached little importance to the agitation in favor
of the Pope fomented by a small party in the country
He considered the Papacy as the moat detestable of
'Governments, becanieirtitihere•was no guaran-
tee for the governed, and because the prince pre-
tending to be the representative of God regarded
all opposition to his authority as sacrilegous. After
an animated criticism upon the history of Papal
government from the earliest times, in the course
of which he referred to the frequent modifications
of the territories of the Holy See for the purpose of
showing the futility of the pretext that its posses-
sions were more inviolable than those of any other
Power, he protested against the argument that be-
cause a French army was now at Rome France was
bound to maintain the temporal power against all
comers. If so, logic would require that a French
army should re-conquer the Romagnas, and re-estab-
lish a detested rule with fire and sword. He had heard
with pain a member of the chamberapplaud a Fr cock
general for having placed his sword at the disposition
of the Holy See. He (M. Jules Favre) was sure that
this approbation would not be echoed by the old
friends of the general in question, who were es
much surprised as afflicted at thestep he had taken.
He had observed with painful astonishment the
affirmative nod of the head by which the President
of the Council of State had signified that this gene-
ral had received the necessary permission for an
officer to accept foreign service without losing his
quality as a Frenchman. This fact being now official
he asked what was the meaning of it ? Either
GeneralLamoriciere's mission would be a ridiculous
failure, or, putting himself at the head of German,
Hungarian, and Swiss mercenaries in the Pope's
pay, he would march upon Bologna, and attempt
to reconquer the Romagnas, at the risk of meeting
not only a Piedmontese army, but the very French
soldiers whom he had more than once led to vic-
tory. He (M. J. Favre) called for categorical ex-
planations of a policy which he characterised as
turnabout and contradictory— (une politique de
de dementis et de volteface inacceptable pour le
pays). [ln all probability the illonitertr, which
habitually burkcs opposition speeches, has hero
suppressed substantial parts of M. Jules Fa V re's
observations.]
The PRESIDENT (Count de Morny) hero said that
the Chamber would certainly do him the justice to
admit that he had allowed M. J. Favre the fullest
latitude to express his opinions; but it was not to
be permitted that he should forget the respect due
to the Sovereign. M. J. Favre had reproached the
Emperor with that which was his best title to the
admiration of the country, namely, his moderation
in the hour of victory, and his constant solicitude
for the interests of France.

M. JULES FAY RE,while respecting the President's
opinion, insisted upon his right to criticise the policy,
w hien ruled the destinies of the country, to call to
mind broken promises, and to ask that light should
be thrown upon the situation. He would call
upon the organs of Government for explanations,
if they had any to give. He was well aware that
the President of th Council of State, exalted as
was his position, could only- appear before the Corps
Legislatif as the organ of ideas not his own. Under
Constitutional G wernments Ministers might some-
times speak their own opinions, but it was not so
with regard to the representatives of power at
present. He trusted that what he had said might
sink deep into the heart of Frenchmen, so that the
nation might be alive to tke fact that in giving up
its rights it became the sport of every caprice.
M. GRANIER, DE CASSAGNIC (the editor of the
Pays) made a speech approving in all points the
Emperor's policy, past, present, and to come.
M. BAROCHE, the President of the Council of
State, after applauding the speech of M. Granier de
Cassagnac, said he could not longer remain silent m
presence of the numerous and severe criticisms wit
which the policy of Government had been visited,
He taunted the Government of 1848, the members
of which were among M. J. Favre's friends, with
having done nothing for Italy, and insisted upon
the superiority of a regime based upon
the policy of
upon univeral suf-
Nfrriaiterraabnoevae
tallh others.
President of the Council of State
e
Explain
said that th'e Emperor saw in Europe more dangers
and complications than were generally known,
special perils in Italy, and that not wishing to have
the revolution for an auxiliary, he preferred to mo-
dify his programme "at least ostensibly." (This
latter expression will probably be noted Vienna.)
Apologising for tihieeb contended,
oaenna ktdei
initgdheaddto,wiGnnool,f the Emperor's
promise that Italy should be free from the Alps to
not h et
bAodrt cd,ohwen staoi dt
htelitna
rwe
ar
rdds
Ipe
sosl iotifcianl ltye r
ne
haded
honestly intended to preserve the
Govconclusion,ernments
must n
ut
6tt
thecwire ucEmi nns opt ate trtoere inflexible,s
temporal power of the Pope in its integrity, but
that he was in no way responsible for the successful
insurrection in the Romagnas.
Viscount LEMERCIEn
Pope ainterrupnd the Congress."
ting) referred to
the famous pamphlet, "The
M. BAROCHE declined to recognise that pamphlet
as an official document which he was bound to de-
fend. He did not hesitate, however, to say that
he entirely agreed with all that the pamphlet said
on the subject of the temporal power.
In answer to various interpellations,
M. BAnoenE positively refused to say what
might be the eventual course taken by the French
Government in regard to Rome. The French army
would not be withdrawn until the Holy Father felt
sufficiently confident in his own forces to do without
it. He would not say whether, under any circum-
stances, the French Government would guarantee
to the Pope any part of his possessions. Guaran-
tees, he remarked, implied reciprocity, and if the
Roman Government persisted in repudiating the
advice tendered to grant reforms, how Ewald it ask
for a guarantee ? [From this statement some may
perhaps infer that if the Pope will be guided by
the Emperor a guarantee may possibly
be given.]
The debate was brought to a conclusion yester-
day, the GoVernment proposition being carried by
238 against 8.