The Sun.
London, England, 1860-06-19 00:00:00

CHURCH RATES.

A number of petitions against the abolition of Church-
rates were presented.
SECOND READINGS.

Lord REDESDALE moved the following resolution,
viz. :—That this house will not read any bill a second time
after Tuesday the 17th of July, except bills of aid and sup-
ply, or any bill in relation to which the house shall have
resolved, before the second reading is moved, that the cir-
cumstances which render legislation on the sub-
ject of the same expedient are either of such
_recent occurrence or real urgency as to render
the immediate consideration of the same necessary.
The noble lord thought it would be of great convenience if
the resolution was agreed to, and he should be very glad to
hear from the noble earl opposite that the 17th July would
be convenient to Government.
Earl GRANVILLE said he should offer no objection to
the resolution of the noble lord. His lordship made some
further observations, but in a tone of voice quite inaudible
in the gallery.
The resolution was agreed to.

Lord BROUGHAM said be wished to put a question to
the Lord President (Earl Granville), but was met with
loud cries of " Order of the day."
Lord REDESDALE rose to order; it was of the greatest
importance that their lordships should adhere strictly to
the rules of the house. The noble and learned lord was
clearly out of order in putting the question.
Earl GRANVILLE said the noble lord had given him
notice of his intention to put the question, and he was
ready to give him the answer. The noble lord, however,
would have ample opportunity of putting the question pre-
sently.
Lord BROUGHAM said it was in the power of any peer
at any time to put a question to the Government by moving
the adjournment of the house. Tint was the rule, and he
could insist on putting his questionby making that motion.
_However he would put his question presently.
CONDITION OF CATHEDRALS.

Lord LYTTLETON asked her Majesty's Government
if they intended to bring in anymeasurefounded on the re-
port of the commission for inquiry into the condition of
cathedral and collegiate churches (1852), or the report of the
se!ect committee of the House of Lords for inquiry into
the deficiency of means of spiritual instruction and of
places :of divine worship in the metropolis and populous
places.

The Duke of NEWCASTLE said the recommendations
of the commission would nearly necessitate a new eccle-
siastical code. He did not think, that being the case, that
the noble lord could expect him at the present time, the
18th of June, they would legislate upon the question. The
noble lord wished to know whether there was any hope
of anything beiag done next session ; he could not, how-
ever, give him any promise that any steps would be taken
then. With respect to the latter part of the question, the
recommendations of the commissioners had been introduced
into a measure at present before the other house, and a
short bill bearing on the subject had also been introduced
by the Home Secretary.
ECCLESIASTICAL COURTS (IRELAND) BILL.
This bill passed through committee.
CHURCH TEMPORALITIES (IRELAND) ACTS
AMENDMENT BILL.
This bill passed through committee.
HIGHLAND ROADS AND BRIDGES BILL.
Earl GRANVILLE moved the committal of this bill, but

Lord REDESDALE moved, as an amendment, that their
lordships would resolve themselves into a committee upon
it that day three months; and after some conversation,
The debate was adjourned.
INFANTS MARRIAGE ACT AMENDMENT.
This bill was read a second time.
THE INDIAN ARMY.

The Marquis of CLANRICARDE moved for a return
of the number of local European regiments in each of the
Presidencies of British India, and the total amount of that
force on the Ist Jan., 1855,1856, 1857, 1858, 1859, and 1860,
and also a return of the number of regiments and the total
amount of force of the Queen's army in the same Presi-
dencies at the same periods.
The Earl of ELLENBOROUGH thought it right to
draw the attention of the noble earl (Lord Granville) to a
subject of very great importance, which, from the silence
that had been maintained about it, he was afraid had
escaped the attention of the Government. One of the'reu-
sons assigned for the proposed amalgamation of her Ma-
jesty's army and the local one was, that it would be most
desirable if all the regiments in India were from time to
time sent to this country. Now that was a proposal which
it would be impossible to carry into effect; because Par-
liament was bound by its own solemn pledge, given
within the last two years in the Indian Government Act,
that it would never impose compulsory service upon any
body of men in the service whatever. The company's army
was transferred to the Crown subject to the same cenditions
as those under which it had been held by the company.
The-men were to be transferred from the local to the Queen's
service within the same territorial limits only as if they had
continued in the service of the company. If, therefore,
Parliament were to give its sanction to their being sent to
England, it could only be done by their being discharged
and by their choosing to be reattested ; and it would be
about as dangerous to allow them the option as it would be
to let the b;rd loose in the hope that it would fly in again
at the window. The country had lost the services of 10,000
men last year ; and if the same process were gone through
again, it was quite possible that they might lose 16,000
more. The proposed amalgamation could not in fact b 8
carried out until after the expiration of the existing term of
service, which in the case of the men would last ten years,
and in the case of the officers for the whole of their lives.
(Hear, hear.)

Earl GRANVILLE was understood to say that the sub-
ject had not escaped the attention of the Government; but
another opportunity would be offered for discussing the
whole subject.

Viscount HARDINGE wished to 11'101V whether when
an officer had been placed upon the staff corps he would
remain on it for the rest of his life, or whether he might be
remanded to his regiment?
Earl GRANVILLE suggested that the question of the
staff corps might. also be discussed on another occasion.
The returns were then ordered.
THE KINGDOM OF NAPLES.

Lord BROUGIIAM said the experience of that evening
had taught him that in order to put questions to the Go-
vernment on any subject, however urgent or important, it
would be necessary on every occasion to give notice of them
and have them printed amongst the orders of the day.
(Hear, hear) Such a course would be very inconvenient,
and would often give rise to long and unnecessary discus-
sions ; for he had observed that when questions were asked
without notice, they were at once answered, and there was
an end to them ; but that when notice was given they
almost invariably led to debates. (No, no.) The question
he wished now to put arose from an impression which had
prevailed both at Paris and in London, and which had
crested considerable apprehension—namely, that the French
Government had either sent or were preparing to send a
very considerable force—that was to say, a military force,
for like ourselves they had ships there already—to the south
of Italy. That statement had naturally excited considerable
anxiety and alarm, in which, he confessed he did not him-
self share. He did not for one moment believe that it was
true ; but if it were true, he felt perfectly confident that
the force could not be sent for the purpose of interposing
between the people and the King of Naples—as he might
now happily be called, and not the King of the Two
Sicilies. (Cheers.) It was utterly impossible that it could
be for the purpose of protecting the King against his sub-
jects in Sicily, and he would fain hope against his subjects
on'the mainland. He felt sure that the force could not be
intended for any interference in the dispute, as he might
call it, between the King and his subjects in Naples, or for
the restoration of his tyranny in the island of Sicily. Of
course if such a scheme were in contemplation her Majesty's
Government must have received notice of it ; and he re-
joiced therefore to think that he was about to hear from his
noble friend a statement to the effect that the rumour was
Fl),lndless. He rejoiced, however, not because he should
had any fears for the liberties of Sicily even if such an
assuhat if could not have been given; but because he felt
there had been any interference by France with Sar-
dinia or with the Pope,
tPope, or with the Sicilians, there might
have been
dea ge
vu?ltlie peace of Europe.
lord had
Earl GRAIa
regretted that the noble and learned
been put to any
ment of his queation, inconvenience by the postpone-
At the same time he would see that
there was a little difference between giving no notice at all
and giving a printed
shnotice.ed t It was most desirable that the
noble lord, when he
or
a question, should write
him a note the day before,
atc least in the course of the
morning, and that not for the
convenience of members of
the Cabinet merely, but for the oconnvevnienrhee!ic.e of the public.
ceadnionllord's question
If, for example, he had answered the
when he had first risen to put
only
havesaid thalthhaeve stated
his own opinion—he could onl
nient had received no such information, and that the_ state-
ment referred to was inconsistent with the declarations of
the Emperor of the French, who had always stated his
pp_
Hey to be the same as our own, that of non-interference.
He (the noble earl) had since, however, had an opportunity
of communicating with his noble friend the Secretary for
Foreign Affeirs ; and he was now enabled to say that there

was no foundation in the statement that a military force
had been sent to Italy by the French. They had ships of
war there, no doubt, and we also had ships of war there,
their object being for the protection of the French and Eng-
lish interests ; but there was no foundation what ever in the
statement that a military force had been sen ; and he be-
lieved that there was no truth in the report that it was in-
tended
to send one. (Hear, hear.)
The Earl of ELLENBOROUGH rem rled that he be-
lieved there was as little truth in the rumour of the French
Government being about to send troops to the south of Italy
as there was in the rumour that the British Government
were going to send troops to Castellamare.
Earl GRANVILLE said he believed that no interference
whatever with the Sicilians was contemplated.
Lord BROUGHAM said he hoped there would be not
only no interference but no disturbance of the tranquillity
which now prevailed in all parts of Italy except the south
and east. Sicily was already free, and the ether parts of
Italy nearly so, from the tyranny under which they had so
long suffered.
Their lordships then adjourned.

HOUSE OF COMMONS.—(YESTERDAY.)
The SPEAKER took the chair at 4 o'clock.
PRIVATE BUSINESS.

The Lords' amendments to the London, Brighton, and
South Coast Railway (Croydon to Balham Hill) Bill were
considered and agreed to, and the bill was ordered for third

reading.

The following bills were read a third time and passed:—
Epsom and Leatherhead Railway, Galway Harbour, Hun-
gerford-market and Charing-cross-bridge Companies, Lin-
coln's-inn ; London, Chatham, and Dover Railway (Capi-
tal) ; and London, Chatham, and Dover Railway (Metro-
politan Extensions).
The following bills were considered and ordered for third
reading :--Egham and Woking Railway, Dublin and
Drogheda Railway, London Railway Depot and Store-
houses, Morayshire Railway, North British Railway (Sta-
tions, &c.), and Caithness Roads.