The Sun.
London, England, 1860-02-20 00:00:00

DEPUTATIONS- TO THE - C.HA N CELL OB
OF THE EXCHEQUER AND THE PRESIDENT
O.F THE .BOARD OF TRADE.
THE 'PAPER DUTY.
On Saturday a deputation -waited on the Chan-
cellor of the Exchequer, consisting of the following
gentlemen :—Mr. Puller, M.P., Mr. E. Baines,
M.P., Viscount Holmesdale, MX./ Mr. M. T.
Smith, M.P., Mr. Norris, M.P., Mr. Adam Black /
M.P., Baron Rothschild, M.P., Frank. Crossley/
M.P., Mr. Aspinall Turner, M.P., Messrs. Joynson,
Cowan, W. Spicer, Barlow, Saunders, Hall, -Wrig-
ley, Curtis, Longman, Evans,Hollingsworth, Bur-
bidge, Smith, Magnay, &c.
The object of the deputation may be gathered
from the following memorial which was handed to
the right hon. gentleman :
"That the materials from which paperlas hithertd been
manufactured are almost exclusively waste products, loch
as rags, and the refuse from the linen and cotton raanufac*-
tures ; although straw has also been employed for the com-
monest descriptions of paper.
" Thatnotwithstanding the long continued high price of
rags, both in this country and in America, and the large
reward offered for the discovery of any substitute for them
as a paper-making material, none has been discovered.
"That the discovery of any material so cheap as rags,
even at their present price, is in the highest degree impro-
bable, as any raw product sufficiently fibrous to b converted
into printing and writing paper, would also be applicable
for spinning and weaving, and would command a higher
price for such purposes.
" That the paper manufacturer is an exceptional position
as compared with all other manufacturers; the supply of his
raw material not being drawn from a common source to
which all nations have access, and not being dependent on
the demand, but on the extent of th© population and the
manufactures among which rags and refuse fibre can be col-
lected.
"That in all the countries of Western Europe, Holland,
Belgium, France, Spain, and Portugal, the export of rags
and other paper-making materials is strictly prohibited,
awl an artificial cheapness thus produced ; so that in those
countries rags are not more than half the price they are in
Britain, where the price is enhanced by the exportation to
America, in addition to the home consumption; in other
words, a rag which in England costs 3d. can be bought
for lid. in France, making a difference of 30 per cent. on
the manufactured article.
" That notwithstanding the import duty of Id. per pound
beyond the Excise duty which is now levied on foreign
paper, large quantities are being brought jute this country,
and keep down the price of paper, in the face of the late ad-
vance in do price of materials.
" That the admission into this country, duty free, of paper
manufactured in countries from which the export of rags is
prohibited, will expose the British paper manufacturers to
an unfair and ruinous competition, which can only result in
the complete extinction of a large portion of the manufac-
ture at home, at its transfer abroad, and, instead of the re-
peal of the paper duty giving an impulse to the manufac •
ture, thousands of families will be thrown out of employ-
ment.
"Your memorialists therefore respectively suggest, that
her Majesty's Government will be pleased sot to persevere
in proposing to the Legislature the reduction or abolition of
the present differential duty of one penny per pound on
foreign -paper and card-beards, except in the case of coun-
triesfrom which the free export of rags is permitted."
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER on enter-
ing the room said, he was well aware of the object
the deputation had in view, but he thought there
were two other departments of the Government to
which they might have more appropriately pre-
sented themselves. They wanted, as paper makers,
to be placed on a level with their Continental rivals.
This was a matter for negotiation with foreign go:-
vernments—a function which, he need not tell
them, did not belong to his department of the public
service. He did not hesitate to say, however, that
we wore now in a position highly, favourable for
making such representations to foreign Powers.
Mr. PULLER said, then the paper-makers had to
suggest to the right hon. gentleman (the Chancel-
lor of the Exchequer) that, supposing him to be at
. liberty, and not precluded by the treaty, he should
exercise his discretion in their favour, and not
admit foreign paper unless the foreigner took off
the duty, or rather the prohibition, on the export
of the raw material. (Cheers.) They said that
their profit did not exceed a farthing in the pound
• on the manufacture, and yet the cost of the raw
material here was just double what it was in
France. (Hear, hear.)
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said that
was a proposal that we should take our stand ex-
actly on the same ground we occupi...^±'2o years
ago, when all kinds of attempts were made to ne-
gotiate commercial treaties on that principle, every
one of which attempts, without an exception,
proved to be an egregious failure, and did nothing
but give a great deal of trouble and useless occu-
pation to various departments of the Government
until the system broke down. He was not dis-
agreeing as to the end they had in view—(Hear,
hear)—nor did he deny that the Government
should use all the exertion in their power to attain
it. He only wanted them to look at the mode of
proceeding in order to attain that end. There were
several countries besides France, of which the com-
plaint was made that they p-ohibited the export of
rags—namely, Belgium, Holland, Spain, and Por-
tugal. The deputation would, therefore, see the
difficulty of making that a matter of negotiation,
with conditions. Suppose France made a conces-
sion
or equivalent, other countries would get the
benefit of it under their most favoured nation
clause, without exception, having a right to the
admission of their commodities on the terms of the
most favoured nations, would be entitled, without
any equivalent or condition whatever, to what we
might be entitled to get only upon conditions.
Spain considered herself entitled under treaties—
though he would not give any opinion upon that—
to any privilege with regard to wines that was
given by us to France conditionally. He believed
that most favoured nation clauses were totally
incapable of being construed conditionally. They
were like the obligations sometimes imposed upon
railway companies, that they would charge equal
fares under equal circumstances. He, therefore,
thought that mode of proceeding would be attended
with hopeless difficulties, and be did not believe
the Government would consent to put the matter
upon such a footing.
Mr. COWAN said, the Chancellor of the Exche-
quer had intimated that his was not the depart-
ment to which the deputation should have applied.
As, however, the treaty was the act of the whole
Government, the deputation must look to the Go-
vernment to remedy any oversight that might have
occurred in the stipulation. 3 as to the paper duty.
He might remind the right hon. gentleman that,
when he was at the Board of Trade in 1842, he
did him (Mr. Cowan) the honour of granting him
an interview on the occasion of the revision of the
tariff. Previous to that time there was an imp ort
duty on rags from abroad of 265. per cwt. Br the
amended tariff of Sir R. Peel that duty was re-
duced to ss. per cwt., whereas the duty on woollen
- rags was ls. per cwt. He (Mr. Cowan) took the
liberty on that occasion to comment upon such a
glaring inequality. The right hon. gentleman
(Mr. Gladstone) promised to:consider the matter, and
the result was that when the tariff came out the
duty on woollen and linen rags was assimilated,
and a few years afterwards the duty was entirely
repealed. That was done on the great principle
that all valuable 'articles 'which entered into our
domestic manufactures should be obtained by the
manufacturer on the best possible terms. (Hear,
hear.) What they now-complained of was, that if
France and other countries continued to maintain
an impediment against the export of the raw mate-
rial, whereby the supply to this country would be
diminished—whether that impediment assumed the
shape of an absolute prohibition, or any other
form—it would be on all accounts most objec-
tionable—(hear)—and the Government ought to
do everything in their power to`'provide against
the continuance of such an injustice. The paper-
Makers in this country haknot only to compete
among themselves, but with all the rest of the world.
The facilities that now existed for the manufac-
ture in the colonies and foreign countries were so
great that he thought the manufacturers in this
country ought to be put on as favourable a footing
as possible. Adverting to the proposed abolition of
the Excise duty on paper, he said they had to thank
the right hon. gentleman for the near prospect of
being emancipated from the thraldom of his (Mr.
Cowan's) friend, Mr. Pressley. (A laugh.)
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said, it
_ would afford him addit;onal satisfaction if the Go-
vernment could obtain for the deputation the other
changes which they desired to see established.
Mr. CowAN said, anything more directly in the
teeth of the freedom of intercourse, social and com-
mercial, between the different countries of Europe
than the conti •
nuance of a prohibition of this kind
- he could not conceive, and great injustice would be
domestic done to our manufacture so long as it
was suffered to exist. (hear, hear.) He hoped the
Government would do i!, their power to put the
manufacturers of this country something like an
Villa! footin.; with those oilieroron
conntrieu as re-
teiTeri al.
garied eorntnand over the ral:77x
.I:QUER said he
The CHANCELLOR or the l
should be most happy if the Cove' mount could be
able to attain that end.
Mr. JOYNSON, Chairman of the Paiier-make
Association, also addressed the right hon. gentles:
man, but as he repeated the same arguments at a
with the President of the
subsequ:eit interview
Board of Trade we give his statement below.
The interview then terminated, and the depute.
tion immediately afterwards proceeded to the office
of the Board of Trade, where they had, by appoint-
ment, a conference with Mr. Milner Gibson, the
President of that department. Mr. Hutt, the re-
cently appointed Vice-President, was also present
on the occasion.
Mr. PULLER, M.P., addressing the President,
said the paper-makers found that in the resolu-
tions laid on the table of the House of Commons by
the Chancellor of the Exchequer paper was not