The Sun.
London, England, 1846-08-17 00:00:00

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SUN OFFICE, Seven o' Clock.

RAILWAY COMMITTEES.
(THIS DAY.)

SOUSE OF LORDS.
MANCHESTER AND SOUT-lIAMPTON.
The Committee to whom this Bill had been referred, con-
sisting of Lord Monteagle (Chairma,a), Lord Foley, Lord
Churchill, and Lord Sondes, met, tbfes morning, at 11 o'clock,
in Room A.
Mr. Sergeant Wrangham, with whom were Mr. Gurney,
Mr. James, Mr., James, Mr. -Wheeler, and Mr. Cripps, ap-
peared for the promoters of the Bill; Mr. Talbot, M. Rick-
ards, and Sir. Thomas Phillippa for the Great Western, We.
South Wee ,tern, and the landowners.
Mr. Sergeant WRANGIIAM proceeded to open the ewe on
the part of the promoters. He said the line would be 88
miles i n length, and that it would cost, in round *nnenbers,
1,0001J001., and was intended to afford direct rallevsey corn-
muni.cation from Manchester in the north to S( int'aampton
in the south. He could start from Southampton. at a point
on the quay which offered great few ilities for
loading and unloading, and would take nearly a.•direct course
north, passing through Andover, Marlboroeegn, Swindon,
Cirencester, and even to Cheltenham, where, set a place called
Swindon, it would form a junction with t).ze, Gloucester and
Birmingham, and pass on to the north of, the existing lines.
The cost per mile would be between 17,04',/. and 18,0001., and
they had no engineering, difficulties to, contend with except
at the Cotteswold Hills, which woutd. have to bei tunnelled ;
but the difficulties at, this point were only of the ordinary
character. The who'ee district se,nth of Swindon, which was
traversed by the lint, was, at the 'present moment, lamentably
deficient of rreilway communication, and, in fact,
a great portion or the counties of Hampshire, Wittshire and
Inirsetshire, rAust also be considered as being shut out from
that railwrey communication which other districts now pos-
sessed. 'Persons in the north, who carried on an extensive
trade wrath every portion of the empire, had had 'their opera-
twns crippled, and their means of extending their com-
mere:4ll transactions cut away from them, owing to the want
of 'direct railway communication with this district. It was
true a portion of the district had water corzenunication
Afforded to it by the Andover canal, from iAndover to
the sea, which had lingered for years, and " iinge•etigly lived,"
affording no great accommodation to the distriee, and certainly
with no great profit to those who had erW'earked their pro-
perty in the undertaking. They intendeA to use this canal
by an agreement with its proprietors ',or the purpose of this
railway which would obviate Uwe, necessity of interfering
with residential or other peeler ,ty along the line, and also
save the promoters conside.ral-.,je expense. The line would
reduce the price of coals to 'lnc whole district traversed, and
convey to the north for ',manufacture clay from Poole, and
sand from the Isle of ight till transmitted into glass, in
addition to large (IP-entities of goods for exportation. By
the existing railevey communication the distance from Chel-
tenham to SVenlon was forty-four miles, which the
Manchester r nd Southampton would reduce to twenty-nine
miles, eiy,ting a saving of fifteen miles. The distance
was not. Ile only objection, for even if the recommendation
of Parffanient was carried nut, there would still be a break of
gauge at Cheltenham. To show the necessity of such a rail-
wtver, he might state that the Great Western had in the pre-
er-nt session proposed a line from Oxford to Cheltenham
'which had been unsuccessful. But they had not abandoned
their intention of ultimately obtaining the sanction of Par-
liament to the line. So great was the objection to that
route that many persons preferred using coaches and their
own private vehicles in order to get to Swindon and Ciren-
cester. A great portion of the district was agricultural, in
which there were a number of sheep fairs; but the
case of the Peterborough line, which ran through an
agricultural district, and yielded an ample revenue, set
the question at rest, that agricultural districts could sup-
port railways. Great quantities of cattle and sheep were
sent to the north, which would go by the line if it were made.
They were, now driven as far as Gloucester, and there placed
on the reedway. Salt would be brought from Droitwich for
agricultural purposes. The only means of obtaining goods
by ree:twayfrom the north was by the London and Birnaing-
hane, then by cart to Nine Elms, and by the South-Western
Or.. to Southampton, involving a circuit of ninety miles. The
`Great Western had obtained permission to make a line from
Oxford to Rugby, but that route would be fifteen miles longer
than the Manchester and Touthampton, besides a break of
gauge at Rugby, but if an intermediate gauge was laid down
then there would be a break of gauge either at Oxford or
Basingstoke. Another line, from Birmingham to the north
of Banbury, passed this sessions, reduced the distance from
19 to 14 miles. After referring to the local distribution of
the shares of the Company, to the importance of Southamp-
ton as the southern outlet to southern Europe, and, in fact,
to the whole world, to the expression of feeling in favour of
the line by the inhabitants of the towns it was to traverse—
(a petition from Manchester in favour of it having been
signed by persons representing one-fourth of the entire as-
seusment of the town)—he concluded by calling on the Com-
enittee to pass the preamble of the Bill. He then objected to
the appearance of the Great Western, on the ground that the
line only passed under that line; that they only interfered with
a small strip of land, and not with the works or property of
the Great Western. They held a statutory title to the land,
but then they had obtained it for the purpose of a railway,
arid that gave them no authority to come there in the guize
of landowners to delay the investigation, and to put them to
unnecessary expense.
Mr. TALBOT replied, and held that the Great Western
had an undoubted right to appear in opposition.
Mr. Sergeant WRANGHAM was heard in reply, and the
room was cleared.
On the re-admission of parties,
The CHAIRMAN said, the Committee had considered the
point raised, and hail come unanimously to the opinion that
the Great Western Company should be heard on the point,
but only so far as their interests might be affected by the
crossing of the proposed line below the Great Western at
Swindon, and with respect to any damage likely to result
from such crossing. The chairman added, that this would
not touch upon the right of other landowners to appear there
against the project.
Witnesses were then called.
Mr. W. C. Somers, an extensive ironmonger at Millbrook,
immediately adjacent to Southampton, detailed the advan-
tages which the line would confer on him individually, in
extending his trade and preventing delay in the transmission
of the goods he used and sold.
Mr. Edwards, collector of the port of Southampton, was
examined at great length and cross-examined. His evidence
generally went to show that the salvation of Southampton
depended on the construction of the line, that it would be
14 t(, miles shorter than any authorised route, would obviate
the necessary breaks of gauge in other lines, and would, in
short, create a considerable traffic. Goods landed at South-
ampton might be warehoused in Manchester within 24 hours.
The imports would be materially increased from all parts of
the world. The existing route to the north, as compared
with the Manchester and Southampton was as 282 to 212,
thus effecting a saving of 70 miles.
The CHAIRMAN said, he imagined it would not be con-
tended on the other side that this line would not increase
the traffic. What they contended was, that the advantages
it proposed to afford could be obtained by other hues running
north and south. There could be no question that a direct
communication with the north would be advantageous.
Mr. TALBOT had no hesitation in admitting that a direct
line to Manchester was required ; but then the question arose
whether there was traffic enough to justify the construction
of a new line, eighty-eight miles in length.
Mr. JAMES said if that was the ground of his Learned
Friend's opposition, the promoters would be compelled to
enter into detail as to the traffic.
The witness havinggiven further evidence in favour of the
sine, Mr. Sturge, corn merchant of Gloucester, Mr. George,
general merchant Romsey, and Mr. S. Payne, dealer
in earthenware and glass at Southampton, who all gave
evidence in favour of the line. The last witness said he
had some goods forwarded from Staffordshire on
the 27th of October, which reached Bristol on the
21st of November, but they did not reach Southampton
until the 27th of November following. He paid 7001. per
annum now for carriage, half of which he considered he
should save by the proposed line.—Adjourned till to-morrow.

PILBROW'S ATMOSPHERIC RAIL-
WAY AND CANAL PROPULSION COMPANY.
—(THIS DAY.)
An adjourned general meeting of the proprietors in this
Company took place this day, at the London Tavern, for the
purpose of receiving a report of a Committee, appointed at. a
former meeting.—J. Jones, Esq., in the chair.
The state of the affairs in this Company id most
unsatisfactory. It appeared from a report, which
they refuse to publish at the present time, that
the officials of the Company have been guilty of
frauds in issuing an immense number of shares without
baying been so authorised to do by the directors. A Mr.
Collins, a former secretary of the Company, is charged
'with having sold between eight and nine thousand shares for
'his own immediate benefit, he never having placed the sum
received in lieu of the shares to the credit of the Ccmpany.
It appeared also that a cheque for 5004 was given to a
Captain Britten for "rigging " the market. The directors
raid themselves ten guineas a day for their attendance,
which money they have since returned. The directors
allege that the frauds have arisen in consequence of their
misplaced confidence In their officials. Shares have been issued
without the names of the holders being filled up ; and it is
asserted that they were offered for sale at any price the pur-
chaser might fix upon at Mr. Lamond's, the sharebroker.
The Earl of Besborough awl the Earl of sex being among
the directors, have offered 1,0001. each to assist the share-
holders.

The report was adopted, and the meeting was adjourned to
this day three weeks for the purpose of a comniunication
-being opened between the directors and the shareholders,
with the view to a final and amicable adjustment of the
affairs of the Company.
It appears that the Company was not registered, as it
should have been under the Joint Stock Act ; and that even
all the shares recognised by the directors were issued and
paid up upon before the registration took place. The affairs
of the Company present one mass of inextricable confusion.

THE LATE DESTRUCTIVE HAIL
STORIL—MEETING THIS DAY.
A public meet'
Bishvgate-street, for'
mg was held to-day, at the London Tavern,
the purpose of devising the best means
to alleviate the distress, preserve from utter ruin, the flo-
rists and nurserymen who suffered so severely from the
violence of the late storm. and
His Royal Higiiness the Duke of CAMBRIDGE took
the chair, and said tphpatlateioappeared
htat id before the meeting in
consequence of an application
been made to him
from some gentlemen connected with Horticultural So-
ciety to assist in relieving
the gardeners and nurserymen
of the metropolis and the
severely visited by the late stornis.whl have been so
;
all the gentlemen whom he had then believed that
the honour
self for those
'aidfess all felt the same sympathy with
experiencinghiw the
unfortunate individuals who were now
greatest calamity, which was induced, not from
gence on their own parts, but a visitation ofProvidenLenegli-
which, of course, they could have no control.—(Hear, l'iel7;*
lie believed there was no more deserving or hard_
working class in the community than those whom
they bad assembled to assist. He could bear testimony to
`what :he asserted from personal observation in his own
neighbourhood. Those resident in the neighbourhood of
Stockwell,: Clapham, and Brixton, were the chief suf-
ferera,:and it appeared from the report of the South
London Horticultural Society that the losses sustained by
by those engaged in horticultural trade there amounted to
no less a sum than 18,0001. He had the satisfaction to state
that the room in which they were then assembled had been
given them gratis for the present occasion, and an offer had
been made by the proprietors of the Commercial Hall of the
use of their establishment, either for a floricultural show
or for any other purpose calculated to promote
the object of the ptesent meeting.—(Hear, hear. )
'A subscription had also been commenced, and Dr. Laydeen, 1
idly-Tv-44w ;woo ,ugable to attend, had forwarded 10/. 10s. Mr.
IrarClaj,, a LOmbard-street, had also sent them 51.55., and
r''l"- he only rope..d that they might have the satisfaction of
•A .
/ .
~.., / being able, is a considerable degree, to =eller* the
• _ . 4.
icil•- . . --5.., I
.3-7---::=-1.. . , ~,,
'-••••-t- - • - - - • • ..
.

distresses of those poor person P.—(Hear, hear, and cheering.)
Mr. J. ALLNUT stated that, 3,000 squares of glass had been
broken in his conservatory, and proposed the following reso-
lution :—" That the severe losses which the nurserymen,
florists, and gardeners in Me neighbourhood of the metropolis
have sustained, in conseepence of the dreadful hailstorm on
the Ist day of August i•sstant, call for our warmest sympathy,
and demand all our efraorts to alleviate the distress occasioned
thereby."
Mr. lurk r. said lie would not detain the meeting, but
second the resolutian, in which he fully concurred.
The resolution, was then put from the chair and carried
unanimously.

Mr. Cools„ Of the firm of Truman and Cook, proposed the
next resolution—" That a public subscription be now com-
menced., and a fund raised for the relief of the sufferers."
Mr. STALDON seconded the resolution, which was passed
uno:dimously.
Mr. JAMES COOK, of Manning-lane, was appointed Trea-
surer, and Messrs. Barclay and Company, Coutts and Com-
pany, Cocks and Biddulph, Jones, Lloydd, and Company,
' Young and Son, to receive subscriptions.
Several subscriptions were then awarded, among which
were twenty guineas from the Duke of Cambridge; ten
guineas from the Lord Mayor; Barclay and Co., five guineas.
A committee was then appointed to carry out the objects
of the meeting, and a vote of thanks having been passed to
the Chairman, the meeting separated.

TATTERSALL'S-TiHfS EVENING.

EBOR HANDICAP.
4 to 1 agst Bourton
10 to 1 agst Druid:
9 to 2 agst Laura—taken
ST. LEGER.
11 to 2 agst Pyrrhus the First
11 to 2 agst Sir Talton Sykes
10 to 1 agst Grimston
10 to 1 agst lago
10 to 1 agst Traverser
12 to 1 agst Fancy Boy
10 to 1 agst Brocardo—taken
13 to 1 agst Sting
30 to 1 agst Poynton
30 to 1 agct Mount Callan
YOSKSIIIRE STAKES.
2 to 1 on the field

SIX O'CLOCK.

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT.

(THIS DAY.)

HOUSE OF COMMONS.

APPOINTMENT OF MR. THOMAS GORDON.
Lord GEORGE BENTINCR (in continuation from
our Afternoon Edition) said—lt was a disgrace to the
magistrates of Lancashire to have such a man on the same
roll as themselves. He wished, therefore, to know from
the Noble Lord at the head of the Government whe-
ther this Mr. Gorton, of Lancashire, was the gentleman
who had, a few years ago, been convicted of having de-
frauded the Excise.
Lord J. RUSSELL said that he believed the Noble
Lord had correctly stated that Mr. Gordon, who
had recently been placed upon the roll of Lancashire
magistrates by the Chancellor of the Duchy was the
person who had been convicted, in 1831, of a fraud on the
Excise. But Lord Campbell, the present Chancellor of
Lancaster, finding that such a person had been ap-
pointed to the commission of the peace, had a corre-
spondence on the subject, which he (Lord J.
Russell) had not yet seen, but of which that
Noble Lord had communicated to him the result.
Lord Campbell stated that Mr. Gordon had been placed
upon the commission of the peace without any solici-
tation of his own ; and he (Lord Campbell), therefore,
thought that it would not be right to inflict upon him the
stigma of removing him immediately from the commis-
sion of the peace, because it might then seem to him
that he had been nominated to the magistracy merely
for the purpose of disgracing him. It was,
therefore, suggested to Mr. Gordon that he should
not attempt to qualify himself as a magistrate. lie (Lord
John Russell) had not, as he had already stated, seen
the correspondence; but when he had seen it he would
make a further statement to the House as to what was
intended to be done on this subject.
Lord GRANVILLE SOMERSET detailed the cir-
cumstancesconnectedwith the appointment of Mr. Gordon
to the magisterial bench. An error had certainly
been committed in the selection of Mr.
Gordon, but he could assure the House that
that selection was not prompted by an impure motive.
A deputation of gentlemen originally waited upon him
before the selection, representing that, in consequence of
deaths, failures, &c., the magistrates of Lancashire had
become inadequate in point of number to the perform-
ance of their duties; they presented a list of such gentle-
men as they considered fit to be appointed to the
magistracy, and amongst those was the name of
Mr. Gordon. Nov, it had always been his custom,
whilst Chancellor of Duchy of Lancaster, to inquire
into the character of such as he nominated to the magis-
tracy, but, owing to an accident, he had not been able, in
this instance to institute an inquiry into the cir-
cumstanees and character of M. Gordon. It had
been represented to him that Mr. Gordon bad
for many years occupied a very high and re-
spectable position in the neighbourhood in
which he resided. In consequence, however, of
a communication from one of the Honourable
Members for Manchester, he made full inquiries
into the character of Mr. Gordon, and the re-
sult was a series of communications between
himself, Mr. Gordon, and other individuals. To ascer-
tain the truth of the charge as to the alleged fraud on
the Excise, he (Lord G. Somerset) wrote to the Excise
officers, and was fully informed of the suit that had been
commenced against Mr. Gordon a few years ago, for
having forged a Government stamp and defrauded the
Excise. The inquiry into the charges against
Mr. Gordon were in progress when he (Lord
Granville Somerset) tendered to her Majesty
his seals of office, and he considered that the Noble Lord
(Lord Campbell), who had succeeded him in office, would
act on this subject in a manner that would be satisfactory
to all parties. That was the explanation which he had
to make. He could assure them that it had been re-
presented to him that Mr. Gordon. was a gentleman
of the highest respectability, and he (Lord Granville
Somerset) did not in this matter consider himself to
have been guilty of anything more than an error, of
which any person might in similar circumstances have
been guilty.
The House having resolved itself into Committee on
the Public Works (Ireland) Bill,
DISTRESS IN IRELAND.

Lord JOHN RUSSELL rose, and said that he took
that opportunity of calling the attention of the House to
the present state of distress in Ireland, and in doing so he
should consider it his duty to refer to what had been done
at the end of last year, and during the spring of'
this year by the former Government on the subject
of the failure of the patoto crop, and whatever
sorrow he might feel in having to bring the sub-
ject of the present state of the potato crop in Ire-
land before the House, yet he should endeavour
in doing po to avoid any discussion which might give rise
to any party division or excite any controversy on the
subject. The Committee would recollect that towards the
end of thelast year considerable alarm was felt with regard
to the state of the potato crop in Ireland and some parts
of Scotland. He thought that it was unnecessary to
state that that arose from the unforeseen failure, to a very
great degree—and to a greater degree than on usual
occasions of failure in the harvest of a country or ap-
prehended scarcity. And he would state three circum-
stances which he thought were calculated to inspire the
Government and the public at large with very
considerable apprehension upon that subject. And
one of those circumstances was, that potatoes being ono
of the chief and the lowest kind of food, the failure in
the crop of potatoes, which was the chief article of
nourishment of the great mass of the people, there was
no kind of food of a cheaper or lower description to
which the population could have resorted for support.
Such was the distinction between a country, the popula-
tion of which chiefly fed upon potatoes, and
other countries, the population of which
chiefly fed upon wheat, a higher description
of food. Another circumstance which was to be ob-
served was, that the disease in the potatoes was to a
great degree unknown; none could tell to what extent
it had been carried, or how great the loss
of the crop would eventually turn out to be
If the crop were wheat or barley, failures would be seen
in some six weeks or two months before harvest time, '

and a calculation could be made by which one
might ascertain what was the amount of the
deficiency in the quantity of the crop, and how much of
that description of food might be required from other
countries for the supply of the people. The third cir-
cumstance which he would mention was one which
was connected with the others which he had stated,
and that was, that a great proportion of the people
of Ireland were in a state verging upon desti-
tution—in a state of very great poverty and
suffering. That had been ascertained and stated
repeatedly in statistics and documentlswhichhadbeen
laid before Parliament. The report of the Commissioners
inquiry—the report of the Land
them that o n
Commission,oor -overlwa which
oufn the
presided—theLothrodeDeoesvoos—nalltold
re-
portthe
greater
at
the the
Commission
proportion
people of Ireland lived in a
state of extreme poverty ;
re-
ceive wages which enabled them to fact,
payhe
that, in they
for
rid nut
thnefood
which they required. They received
se wagesofa very low
only during
a portion of the year, and those
amount, and during a considerable portion of the
year they were fed upon potatoes of a very inferior
kind. Those reports informed them that, in the first
place, there was a great number of what were called con.
acre farmers, who rented a plot of land conjointly with
others ; above them was another class, who, although
they were called a higher class of farmers, were
yet very little above those he had just named.
There was also another and a lower class, who were
maintained by the funds brought forward for the relief
of the country. These three circumstances were calcu-
lated to induce the Government of this country to look
with very considerable alarm at the prospect before them.
Ile was not adverting then to any other measures which
the Government thought it necessary to take. They took
measures which, in his opinion, were directly applicable
to these evils. The first measure they took, as he found
by a minute cr letter of the Treasury of the 9th of
December, was to order a quantity of Indian corn to be
procured by the house of liaring and n the ports
of this country, or from foreign countries. Co.,'With respect
to this measure, it was to be observed that it was very
wisely, and likewise, he might say, with very great good
fortune contrived that this for a long time kept a secret
both here and in Ireland. The arrival of that supply was not
known at the time when it came. No expectations were held
out, and therefore none were raised by its arrival, and
it had much less injurious ef re
it mightts in
hale athuarbindgmetheurt
Oar trade of the countrythan

had been expected. Another measure to which the Go-
vernment had recourse was to grant donations in aid of
subscriptions. There were subscriptions collected in
Ireland to a very large amount, and many of
them from some of the very poor amongst the farmers.
These subscriptions thus received amounted to the sum
of 100,0001. Another measure which the Government
took at the commencement of this session was, to pro-
pose that there should be public works prosecuted by
certain powers, and the authorities of the Irish county
sessions should be empowered to make such works, pro-
vided that one•half of the expense of such works
which - might be advanced was to be repaid,
and that the other half should be defrayed
by grants from the Treasury. Another measure, which
was proposed and carried in this House, was, that by a
general presentment for the purposes of these public
works should all be repaid within the usual time. Now
the amount, the general amount in money of all these
measures, was stated in a book which had been presented
to that House, and which was called " A Correspondence
relative to the Measures of Relief of the Distress occa-
sioned by the Failure of the Potato Crop in Ireland." The
first item in the book was for the purchase of Indian
corn and oatmeal, of which the expense amounted to
185,4321.; the second was for sums issued in donations
in aid, and was 67,9111.; the third was for works autho-
rised to be executed under'the Act 9th Victoria, chap. 1,
for the relief of distress in Ireland, and was to the
extent of 452,7271.; the fourth item was a sum authorised
to bo advanced under the 9th Vic , and which amounted
to 133,5361. The sth, 6th, and 7th items were smaller
sums, which were empowered to be applied in cases of
great err ergratsy. These, with the amount taken by the
Board of Works, altogether amounted to 852,4811., and
the amount to be repaid of that was 494,8511. The sum
which had been granted and expended without the ex-
pectation or intention of repayment was 3. 57,630/.
With regard to the evils which this large
expense was intended to prevent, and with
regard to the fund itself, there was a great deal of in-
formation which any Member of that House might find
by reading the voluminous correspondence which had
just been presented to the House. With regard to
the evils in the country, it would be found, as
might have been expected from what he bad
already said, that the amount of the evil was
d fferently calculate 1 at different times, and in fact
had not been as yet completely ascertained. In the
first accounts they could find it was stated that if they
took the four provinces of Ireland the deterioration of
the potato crop was about one-fourth. It was afterwards
said by Colonel M Gregor that it was estimated at
about one-eighth, and it was subsequently stated by
other authorities that it amounted to one-half of
the whole crop. These sort of matters it was,
of course, difficult to ascertain, but what he thought
they might well believe, and which was already ascer-
tained from the reports, was, that there was a very great
failure in the potato crop, and it was extremely destruc-
tive to the crop in 1845. The disease was not one pecu-
liar to Ireland or Scotland last year—it was a disease
known in various parts of the continent of Europe
and elsewhere, and in various parts of America.
He had before him the first statements made in 1845 by
direction of the colonists of the United States, and also
other statements made in answer to the orders of the
authorities here, from which it appeared to be a disease
known for some years in America ; it was called the
" rust." It first appeared in 1835, and in consequence of
it a considerable portion of the potato crop was lost ;
and in 1845 it became of a more virulent and destructive
nature than was ever known before. Thus far it was
ascertained that with respect to the measures which
were then taken, and of which he had been speaking,
their effect in Ireland had been exceedingly beneficial.
They were confirmed in that belief from the various ac-
counts of the effect produced by the different mea-
sures to which he had alluded, and which showed
that places where the people were entirely deprived of
food and employment, employment and food were
afforded, and in other places where the people were
almost driven to desperation, and in a state prepared for
an outbreak—where there was danger to the tran-
quillity of the country, and a feeling of discontent—that
feeling was changed into one of satisfaction and
pleasure. Ono of the letters to which he had
alluded, was a letter from Mr. Russell
with regard to the state of the county of Clare ; he stated
that with regard to that county there were a greater
number of persons employed than any other county in
Ireland—that the operations of the Board of Works,
considering the materials on which they had to operate,
were progressing 'satisfactorily, and that not a single
case of starvation had occurredin the county; and, in fact,
that the people were never so well provided for as they were
this season. There were very few cases of fever—fewer,
in fact, than had been known for many years. That in-
formation was obtained from the Roman Catholic clergy-
men. The next letter was an abstract return of the
number of persons employed by the Board of Works,
and that number amounted to no less than 102,135.
With regard to that which he had first mentioned—the
measures of Government for providing Indian corn—that
measure seemed to have affored very considerable relief.
But it was to be observed that these measures of Go-
vernment, providing additional food, were doubly bene-
ficial in their effects. The ewe would have been very
serious in Ireland had not these measures been taken ;
and there had been food provided which could be sold at
a very reasonable rate. It had been sold in various places,
as the papers would show, at 101. per ton, and by retail at
a, penny per pound. One pound of this Indian corn
was sufficient food for a strong labouring man for a day.
So that Id, per day would provide enough sustenance
for a day. With respect to the donations, they did bring
out a very large amount of subscriptions. He alluded
to those made by all classes of persons in Ire-
land to be applied to the relief of the distress.
Of course, he would not enter on the invidious
question of whether there were individuals who ought
to have contributed who had not done so ; but he must
say, that from the accounts which had been received he
found that every person who was able bad contributed
to these subscriptions. With regard to persons of large
property, who undertook works for the employment of
the people, and which they managed out of their own
resources, and of which, of course, no account
had been received, or could be given to the public, al-
though they materially contributed to the relief of the
people—with regard to these works, and the sums ad-
vanced in cases of great emergency, there had been, as
he had just shown, the greatest relief afforded by them
but it was impossible for any Government or Legis-
lature endeavouring to meet these alarming
cases of distress, taking for the period of the
year from December to the coming in of the
harvest in August, and the employment of the people on
that harvest—it was impossible to preserve them, as
they had been preserved, from any deficiency of food
afford to them due employment and preserve
the peace of the country— and at the same
time afford that satisfaction which must be
afforded from the knowledge that the Government of
the Legislature of the United Kingdom had been so far
from indifferent to their sufferings, that it had been eager
to supply their necessities—it was impossible to produce
these great results without some very serious
concomitant evils.—(llear, hear.) In the first place,
with respect to the supply of Indian corn
in the emergency which he had alluded to, and in the
cases which they had before them, it was prudent,
and it also was best suited to that emergency ; but if it
were to be considered as establishing a principle for the
Government of this country to apply the resources of
the Treasury for the purchase of food in foreign countries,
and that food were afterwards to be sold by
retail at a low rate, it was evident that all trade would
be disturbed, and those supplies which should be
naturally a portion of the commerce of this country,
would be applied for the relief of the people of Ireland.
—(Cheers.) Likewise that portion of the local trade in
Ireland which referred to the supply of districts would
be injured, and the Government would find itself
charged with that duty most impossible to perform
adequately, to supply with food a whole people; so
likewise with regard to public works, for which ad-
vances and grants were made. Although they were
in themseves beneficial, yet their effects were in
a certain degree injurious, for those people
who were employed in ordinary works, and
received abundant pay, went to these public works
in preference to the others, and thus the ordinary
operations of industry were disturbed.--(Hear, hear,
from Lord G. Bentinck.) In a letter from Col. Jones,
in page 333, he says—" That from a partial inspection
of some works in the progress of construction, it was
found that they had been put a stop to, and that some of
the great public works for the Shannon drainage were
without workmen, and that those men obtaining is. 6d. per
day at these private works preferred 9d. on public works.
In many instances, a number of persons were sent to
those works who ought not to have been sent at all, by
gentlemen distributing tickets without proper inquiry,
and the consequence was, that those who httherto had
been accustomed to come to England and Scotland to
assist in taking in the harvest, found that work in Ire
land for them at their very doors, sufficient to provide
t fact
acg
tea i
in in.
letterp Ladylto the
tm
eo S
eynmMt
Governmentor .
consequencesn
givendsT had
re y
for their maintenance. They abandoned all idea of the
harvest in England and Scotland, and the harvest
operations in the north of England suffered materially,
in consequence of this, and a great deal of the food of
the country was lost from there not being sufficient
°thins
e
were
b llinevitabledaily
works..
Theofromn accounts the
largeth e whichemploymentinjurious
ceiving from the south of Ireland, and various other
counties, all concur in representing the disease as far
more fearful than in the preceding year. The accounts
eon i i ia
public
remarked
thisuponwa
s
contained in the newspapers from various correspondents
are also of the same alarming nature. It had, there-
fore, become the duty of the Government to consider
in what manner they should propose to Parliament to
make provision for some employment to the labouring
classes of Ireland, and at the same time leaving, as he
trusted Parliament would leave, such a discretion in the
hands of the Government, as any emergency might
render necessary in their opinion, and giving an account
of those measures to Parliament at a future time.
It had appeared to the Government that while there
should be public works, and those public works should
be undertaken under due control, that they should not
defray the cost of those works from any Parliamentary
grant, but that they should be defrayed from a loan to be
repaid by the counties. He would, therefore, propose to
introduce a Bill by which the Lord-Lieutenant should have
power upon representation made to him to summon a
barony session, of a county session, for works of relief.
When this session should be assembled they would be
empowered and required to order such public works as
might be necessary for theenaployment of the people and
for relief : the choice of those works to be lett to them,
and the execution of the works to be superintended by the
officers of the Board of Works. The choice of the works
will not, however, be left so entirely to them, as that the
approbation of the Government shall not first be requi-
site and necessary before such works can be com-
menced. It was proposed in the Bill that advances should
be made from the Treasury for the purposes of

such work when so approved, and those ad-
vances were to be repaid in ten years, and
should be at an interest of not less than three. and-
a-half per cent. With reference to the mode of repay-
ment of these advances, the levy will not be made ac-
cording to the valuation of the county sessions, but ac-
cording to the poor rates' assessment ; and by that means
the burden would not fall so heavily on the poorer
classes.—(Cheers.) In very poor districts, however,
this system would not be practicable, and he proposed
that a grant of 50,000/. should be taken. for the purpose
of giving employment in such districts, the works to be
undertaken by the Government; but hose works must
be works which are of public utility, and this grantwould
not be applicable to any district except such as were
not able to undertake the expense of such works.
This was not an unusual mode ; there was a case men-
tioned in the papers which lay upon the table of the
House of a precisely similar nature, and in which a
larger amount was given by Government than was usual
on occasions of public works. The Act of I Victoria,
sec. 21, contained similar provisions. He also proposed that
commissariat officers should be stationed in various parts
of Ireland corresponding with the Chief Commissariat
officer in Dublin, and informing him from time to time
as to the state and supply of food in various parts of the
country, and generally with reference to the distress of
the country. With reference to the supply of food, the
Government did not propose to interfere with the re-
gular trade by which Indian corn and other grain food
could be brought into that country. He proposed to
leave the trade as much, at liberty as possible.
He believed that the markets would be best supplied
without the interference of Government. There might
be particular cases in which, as in 1836 or in 1839, a
a' pp), of fi.0.1 was necesary to be introduced by the Go-
vernment ; and circumstrnces might also a: ise from the
inaccessible nature of the country in which it would not
be possible for the merchants to introduce that article.
In such places commissariat officers will be appointed
to furnish the supplies of food. He did not
propose to interfere either with the wholesale or retail
trade.—(Cheers.) With reference to the relidf commit-
mittee the Government would take care to avoid those
errors into which the late Government had fallen into,
and guided by the experience they had received, he
hoped to be able to meet effectively the serious distress
of the country, and he hoped to avoid those evils which
had arisen from members of the relief committee giving
tickets to persons who did not require such
relief. The officers to be employed would be the com-
missariat officers, and any others whom it might be
found necessary to employ would be also paid by the
Government. In stating this, he was bound to state that
the correspondence which bad been laid upon the table
of the House, and everything which he had heard from
private sources, showed that there never was a work
undertaken with more zeal and intelligence tban the re-
lief of the distress of the people of that country last year.
All the persons employed by the Government, whether
you spoke of Sir E. Bryan, the chief officer of the com-
missariat, or Colonel Jones and the officers of the
Board of Works, or the local persons employed, or,
generally speaking, the members of the relief com-
mittee, all evinced the utmost desire to give all their
attention to the relief of the existing distress, and also to
endeavour, as much as possible, to afford every light
to Government, by which this relief might be carried
on in an efficient manner. Having said this, he should
propose to the Committee, first, to vote a sum of money
to defray the expenses lately incurred—to direct further
advances from the Exchequer—and, lastly, to vote a
grant of 50,000/. for the promotion of public works in
Ireland, in those poorer districts to Which he had alluded.
He considered that the present was a special case,
calling for prompt attention, he considered that of a
great proportion of the people of Ireland to whom po-
tatoes had been almost the only food, that the poverty
of millions in that country and the last obscurity and
dreadful ravages of this disease in an article which has
been for some time almost their only food. lie did,
therefore, think it incumbent upon the Government
and upon the Parliament to take extraordinary measures
for the relief of that distress, and he trusted that there
would be at least one counterbalancing advantage attend-
ing this distress—that it would show the poorest among
the people of Ireland that the Government of this
country were not insensible to the claims which they
had upon us as the Parliament of the United King-
dom—(Cheers)—and show that the whole credit
and means of the people of this country should
be used, as it was their bounden duty to use them,
and as they would be used where they can to avert
famine, and to maintain the people of that country, and.,
lastly, to take advantage of this state of unfortunate dis-
ease to establish public works which might hereafter be
of permanent utility to the country; he hoped, therefore,
that some counterbalancing advantages might arise
among those many misfortunes which must attend this
state of things. He need not detain the Committee any
longer. He could assure the Committee and the House
that he considered that his predecessors in office had
shown a laudable anxiety to meet those evils. The
remedies which they applied were remedies suited to the
occasion' and he would endeavour to imitate the spirit
in which they acted, and take advantage of the expe-
rience which they had gained, and also endeavour to
correct those errors which were certain to attend so
unusual a state of things. He should, therefore, conclude
by moving that a grant of 175,000/. should be voted for
the payment of Exchequer-bills, and also that a further
sum of 50,0001. should be voted to defray the expense
of public works in the poor districts of Ireland.
In answer to a question put by Mr. HUME,
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said that
it was not the intention of the Government to import any
food into the country ; and read two letters which he
had received from merchants upon the subject, in which
it was hoped the Government would not interfere with
the operations of commerce, and that the supply of Ire-
land might now be safely left to the merchants, and that
if it were so, they would be able to sell India corn at the
rate of ld. per pound.
Mr. D. BROWNE thought that the speech of the
Noble Lord at the head of the Government was calcu•
lated to inspire a feeling of confidence in the Govern-
ment. He had received a number of letters from the
county which he had the honour to represent (Mayo) con-
taining the most fearful details of the presentcondition and
the future prospects of the people of that country. The
speech of the Noble Lord was ominous of much-good to
the country, and he hoped that the people would infer
that the intentions of the present Government were to
advocate a system of generous policy for that coun-
try. The late Government had deserved great credit
for the course they had taken last year
when the distress was so great in the country.
He trusted that the attention of the Government would
be called to the necessity of doing something to put an
end to the people of Ireland devoting themselves solely
to agricultural pursuits, and that some inducements
would be held out to them to consider manufactures.
He thought the law of landlord and tenant in that
country ought to be altered, and other improvements
made, or a repeal of the union granted.
Mr. wuzams thought that the distresses of the
people of Ireland should not be relieved by taxation on
the people of England, but of the landlords of Ireland.
He considered that a well-digested system of poor-laws
in that country would be productive of great benefit.
Mr. LABOUCHERE defended the proposal of the
Noble Lord at the head of the Government, and stated
that that proposal required the landlords of Ireland to!
bear the burdens of that country; but, in order that they
might do so effectually, the Government offered them
the assistance stated by his Noble Friend at the head of
the Government. The state of Ireland at present was so
extraordinary, that it required extraordinary measures
to meet them. He believed that the course pursued by
the late Government, in sending meal to Ireland, was,
under the circumstances, a most wise one. The
Corn Bill was not then passed, and the trade in
corn was not then free. The case was different
now, and he believed it would be most unwise on the
part of the Government now to make themselves mer-
chants, and in that character supply the people with
meal. It was impossible to see what was going on in
Ireland now, and not come to the conclusion that
it would be impolitic on the part of the
Government to interfere with either the pro-
vision or the labour-market of a country.
He trusted that by rendering it the interest as well as the
duty of the landed proprietors of Ireland to employ the
poor of that country they should have provided an effec •
rive and wholesome remedy for the anticipated distress.
Lord LINCOLN complained of the manner in which
the Right Hon. Gentleman wile had just addressed the
House had alluded to the measures of the late Govern-
ment. Had they or the officers employed under them
been guilty of such a dereliction of duty as that alleged
by the Right Hon. Gentleman they would have deserved
the condemnation rather than the praise of the Noble
Lord who had introduced this subject to the House.—
(Hear.) But he was happy to say the charge was ground-
less, and he believed the conduct and policy ofSir R. Ralph
was opposed by everybody on both sides of the House.
The Right Hon. Gentleman had stated that the grossest
abuses had existed in the administration of the affairs of
the Board of Works, but he could give the assertion the
most unqualified denial.—(Hear, hear.) 110 by no
peens denied that abuses did exist, because it was im-
possible to prevent them, but they had not existed to
one-fifth part of the extent alleged by the Rignt Hon.
Gentleman. The Right Han. Gentleman had said the
effect of the measures of the late Government was to
demoralize the habits of the labouring population of
Ireland. Well, if they had, all that he could say was,
that the present Government was most unwisely follow-
ing the footsteps of the predecessors in office. He
was glad, however, to see that no English Member had
yet risen to object to what the Noble Lord had pro-
prosed.—(Hear, hear.) Not even the most rigorous
economist of the public purse, the Hon. Member for
Coventry, had objected to it, and he was glad of it, be-
cause it would go over to the sister country that no
matter what Government might be in power, the
poor of that country would be as much cared for
as the poor of England.—(Hear, hear, and cheers.)
Under the operation of the provisions adopted by the
late Government a most 'beneficial trade had been
created in Indian meal ; a trade which was now likely
to be permanent. But though this trade had been
created and fostered by the late Government, he did not •
think that the present Government should continue to
be traders in the sense the former one had been; and he
fully agreed with the course that was now proposed to
be taken. Under the circumstances, so satisfied was he
with what the Noble Lord had stated, that he (Lord
Lincoln) would not ask him any questions as to the
details of the course ho intended to pursue, but would
rest satisfied with the exalanations he had given in his
speech. He must, however, before sitting down, bear
his testimony to what the Noble Lord had stated re-
specting the praiseworthy manner in which the officers
employed under the Government bad carried cut their
arduous and difficult duties. No body of men could
have acted in a more becoming manner, and hoped they
would be continued in any future effort to be made to
meet the exigencies of the people of Ireland.
Mr. LABOUCHERE explained that in the observa-
tions he bad made, he did not fora mement intend to

i impugn or underrate the policy and measures adopted
by the late Government, but he only rose to point
out the danger and difficulties that surrounded the fol-
lowing out of such a policy beyond meeting the urgent
necessities of the case under which they then acted.
Mr. HENLEY said that after the statement of the
Right Hon. Gentleman the Chief Secretary for Ireland it
was impossible to infer whether the measure now pro-
posedwas to bo temporary or not. America had already
for four years suffered from a failure in the potato crop,
and the potato disease there had not yet disappeared.
In Ireland the people had already suffered two years
from the potato disease; there was no probability of that
disease being yet extinguished ; and he was afraid that
in future years further relief would have to be sought
on behalf of the people of that country by the British
Government. This proposal would show the Irish people
that the Government and people were more favourably
disposed to them than they got credit for. He hoped
that more permanent measures would be taken in the
ensuing session for the relief of the Irish people.
Sir D. NORREYS wished that the Legielature of this
country would in future sessions bring forward such
measures for the permanent relief of Ireland as .would
remove from the people of that country the necessity of
coming to the British Legislature in the character of
supplicants.—(Hear, hear.) Ireland had mines of the
most extensive and valuable description—it had rivers
peculiarly adapted for commerce—and yet, in cerise
quence of the Legislature not looking to the subject of
the improvement of Ireland in a proper light, all those
natural resources of wealth and comfort were allowed to
lie waste and useless.—(Hear, hear.)
Mr. HUME said he was pleased to hear that the land-
lords of Ireland were prepared to provide fur the neces-
sities of the people of that country as far as possible, by
the encouragement of public works.—(Hear,- hear.) The
measures of relief hitherto granted to Ireland by the
Government had most signally failed in their object. The
Irish people were as willing as Englishmen. or Scotchmen
to work, and he therefore would ask whence came the
poverty of Ireland? It owed its origin to the misrule of
that country.—(Hear, hear.) As long as England in-
flicted poverty ou Ireland by their misgovernment and
oppression, they had a right to pay for their tyranny
and oppression. The Government was bound to assist
the country gentlemen of Ireland in giving employment
to the people. Let the present grand jury system, as
well as all other pernicious civil institutions, be at once
abolished, and then there would be hope for the people
of Ireland. It would then arrive at the peaceable, happy,
and contented condition of England and Scotland.
Let every law that was fit and applicable to England be
extended to Ireland, and then they would hear very
little of " distress in Ireland."—(Hear, hear.)
Mr. M. MILNES said tbat all elemosynary grants of
this kind established very bad and corrupting principles.
He perfectly concurred with the Hon. Member for Mon-
trose, that it was at once the duty of the English Legis-
lature to place Ireland on a footing similar to England
and Scotland in respect of its laws. He believed that if
the landlords of Ireland were assisted by the Legislature,
in improving their estates, they would be conferring in-
eaculable good upon the people of that country. The
people of England were undoubtedly willing to make
great sacrifices for the relief of their Irish brethren ;
but they must, nevertheless, tell the landlords of Ireland,
that it was their duty to conduct themselves, towards
their dependents, in the same manner as did the country
gentlemen of England. The landlords of Ireland must
retrench their luxuries, and devote themselves to the
improvement of their country.
Sir C. FERGUSON said he considered, that they
should make the electoral divisions of unions responsible
for the sums recommended to be laid out in them. He
thought this the only means of regulating the expendi-
ture of the money in a way to be apvantageous to the
people. It would not be well to entrust its expenditure to
the Poor-law Unions, on account of the difficulty of electing
Guardians. The Board of Works of Ireland had shown
themselves utterly incompetent to properly manage the
works entrusted to them. He imagined they had done
their best, and as a proof of this he must quote this
passage from tneir report:—" Many works were com-
menced without necessity," and again that the sums they
had paid for labour were inconsistent with the amount of
labour which they had received in return.—(Hear.)
He thought it was most unfair to make statements
against the landed proprietors of Ireland, without
giving proper data in support of them. The Noble
Lord (Lord Lincoln) had made use of two anony-
mous statements which he thought most unfair,
unless those statements could be fully substantiated.
Mr. B. ESCOTT had no doubt that the intentions
both of the present and the late Government were for
the future prosperity of Ireland, and the only question
for the House to consider was, the manner in which those
intentions were proposed to be carried out.—(Hear.)
Now, were there not ordinary means for carrying them
without having recourse to especial enactments ?
which was unprecedented in the political history of the
country.—(Hear, hear.) Did the Noble Lord ever hear,
or could he point out an instance in the history of this
or any other country, where restrictions were placed
on the importation of provision in a time of
famine or scarcity ?—(Loud cries of "bear, hear.")
He said this was a very serious matter. Suppose the
Noble Lord the Member for Lynn were put into power,
why, the first course he would take would be to rein-
state the old law on the importation of corn. 'There
were still heavy duties on beans, peas, and
rye—all important elements in food. Surely, he
said, the Noble Lord at the head of the
Government would not continue these duties
at a time like the present—a time of starvation. Sup-
pose a hundred persons should die of starvation during
the recess, what, he asked, would the House, what
would the public, say of the Noble Lord and the Go-
vernment ? They would immediately ask why they
had not retuooed those duties from the statute-
book. The distress was not confined to Ire-
land. He had had a communication that
morning : he would not trouble the House
with it, but the potatoe crop, according to that letter,
had failed in various quarters. What, then, would be
said if the people of England were pressed to the verge
of starvation it not to starvation entirely ? The late
Secretary for Ireland when he moved to introduce
Indian meal into Ireland was in these circumstances,
and it was prohibited altogether ; and the
Honourable Member for Wolverhampton the other
n'ght was in the same absurdity as the Right Hon.
Baronet pointed out before, when he remarked that
Indian meal was at the same duty as barley ,• but that
being removed peas were in the same absurdity. He
hoped the Noble Lord would not continue that state of
things, especially during a time of starvation.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said it
was with the greatest satisfaction that he had heard the
speech of the Hon. Gentleman opposite, and particularly
that of the Hon. Member for Mallow. It was satisfactory
to the Government to hear that it was the intention of
the Irish landlords to co-operate heartily with the Go-
vernment in the promotion of public works in Ireland.
The present Government were much indebted to the
wisdom of the late Government, for the present mea-
sure. The late Government had had the experience of
eight or ten months in providing for the distress in Ire-
land, and it would be absurd to say that
in the course of that time, they did not
propound measures of great improvement, which must
naturally have suggested themselves to those officers
whom the Government had appointed to make a full
inquiry into the condition of Ireland, and if there
were any excellence in the present measure it was
owing in a great degree to the praiseworthy exertions
and wisdom of the late Government. He
could not agree with the Honourable Member be-
hind him that the measures of the late Government
for the relief of Ireland, had turned out to be failures.—
(Heyr, hear.) By the evidence in the blue book which
then lay on the table of the House, it was
t a a many a n:e•
a partsro a
no d f
n theo
t
proved that had it not been for those very
measures the people of Ireland would have been
measures
subjected to the greatest distress.—(Hear, hear.)
liciandstiurdrycnsothtoef etxh existence
hesitatesten
Government,
of
to
say
sayt
hhe people was owing to
only was the existence but the peace of those people
to be attributed to the same praiseworthy exertions.—
(Hear, hear.) And with regard to the food which bad
been introduced into that country by the Government,
he believed it had caused a new state of things
in that country, If Honourable Gentlemen read the
public papers, they would find that, in consequence of
the Indian corn that was continuously being poured into
the countrp, the country had received an incalculable
amount of good. Indian corn was cheaper and' more
nutritious food than potatoes; it was much cheaper than
oats, and he confessed that he was sanguine in the ex-
pectation that the substitution of Indian corn for potatoes
would produce a complete revolution in the social con-
dition of the people of Ireland.—(Hear, hear.)
The Hon. Gentleman, also, was heard very indistinctly
during the whole course of his address. He proceeded
to say, that ho should be extremely sorry if he antici-
pated that the measures of the late Government, and
the measures proposed by the present Government
were intended to be permanently :established
in Ireland. - Those measures, in a great measure,
arose of the failure of the potatoe crop, and the conse-
quent distress of the people. THE state of things was
temporary, and had been and must therefore be met by
temporary measures. The Hon. Baronet opposite (Sir
R. Ferguson) complained of the way in which the Board
of Works was managed. The operations of that
Board in Ireland were in the course of last year
greatly increased, and without any lengthy notice,
and were taken for the purpose of relieving
the people of Ireland &cm the pressure of distress,
caused by the failure of the potato crop, to ensure the
supply of food, and next the employment of the people,
by putting into their pockets the wages of their labour.
In this way the people of England had paid half the ex-
pense of these works. They were not, in all cases, works
absolutely necessary at the time they were undertaken,
but adopted as a commendable mode of relieving the
people by employing them and by paying them in that
way for their labour; and there was a distinct order
issued by the Treasury, that the proposed works to be
ardof ee
Works,eessity
undertaken were not to be commenced without the
existence of distress, and not to be carried be
yond that period. The works were, as he had
said, undertaken hastily, when, in many cases it
was utterly impossible to know their exact extent.
:
or cost, He trusted that they might profit by the ex-
should arise. They were carried on under the superin-
ionb teaadi tnbetydh they were under propel
the
a
similaroß
wtpeehnriidceehnn
wee
atoshf e oya iceguarantee that
superintendence.
After a few words from Mr. M. GORE,
The vote was then agreed to.
The other votes were then agreed to without obse TVA-
tfon, and the House resumed.
The report was ordered to be brought up to-morrow.
(LEFT SITTING.)

HOUSE OF LORDS.
The Earl of SHAFTESBURY took his seat on the Wool-
sack at rive Q'clqck.

Messengers from the Commons brought up several
Bills, praying their Lordships' concurrence.
L( rd FAVERSHAM presented a petition from the
West Riding of Yorkshire, praying for the repeal of the
Poor law Amendment Act.
LUNATIC ASYLUMS BILL.

On the motion of the Marquis of CLANRICARDE,
this Bill was read a first time.
MAYNOOTH.

Lord REDESDALE, in pursuance of the notice which
he had given the other day, wish respect to this College,
he felt bound to make a few observations respecting it,
and on the report of the visitors. He would remind
their Lordships of the arguments made use of for the
additional grant to that institution. That grant was
not very popular with a large portion of the people,
and one of the reasons by which their objections were
was, that all the reasons for the improvement of the re-
sidents there were backed by the assertion, that instead
of an insufficient visitation, there would be a complete
inquiry into the whole of the proceedings of the esta-
blishment, that he was sorry to say that the report
of the last visitation was most meagre and unsatis-
factory, and very contradictory in itself, This report
stated, that on the visitors calling for the presence of
the minutes, that 19 superiors and professors, 522
students, one professor absent on leave, and 11 students
absent from sickness, but he found from the books of
the College that there were only 512 students on the
books instead of 522, and only eight on the sick list
instead often, as stated in the report. Now with respect
to the professors, there was a grant of 6,0001. additional,
but only 4,5004 had been used, allowing a very sufficient
margin for any contingency, yet nothing whatever was
said of the absent professor, who or what he
was. Then with regard to the students, it ap-
pears that. there were 262 iu the first class, and 241
in the second. With respect to the first class, there was
an allowance of 201., of which nothing whatever was
said. The same was the case with regard to the Dun-
boyne students. It was also stated, that the number of
these students had been increased from fourteen to
twenty. Why, the number of this class was ahvays
twenty, and was so stated its the Act of Parliament.
Then, with regard to accommodation, it appeared that
that there 552, with a room each to themselves.
There were twenty-nine apartments where there were
three in a room, twenty-nine where there four, and one
where there were six. And, considering the early age
at which these students are admitted—sixteen or seven.
teen years of age—it did not seem to be so objection-
able to put several into a room as it would have been if
they were older. It appeared, also, that 200 of the free
students had been taken off from their own expenses.
Iu fact, the whole of the report was meagre in the ex-
treme. The visitors appear to have passed through
the rooms, and that was all, but as for any care for
an improvement in the state of education that was a
matter entirely overlooked, and unless some measures
were taken for acting up to the principle for which the
grant had been made the country would to very dissatis-
fied with the grant which they had authorised. He did
not think a six hours visitation was sufficient for such an
institution as the present.
Toe Marquis of LANSDOWNE said, that in the
absence of the two Noble Lords who were appointed
as visitors to the institution, he could not pretend to
reconcile the discrepancies pointed out by the Noble
Lord. He thought that it was very probable that
the alteration of the Government of Ireland
and of the visitors would be called more closely to the
subject, in consequence of the observations of the Noble
Lord. He was happy to see, by a statement in the re-
port—which his Noble Friend had overlooked—that a
great improvement had taken place in the course of edu-
cation, and that a more liberal system of education had
taken the place of the former one.
Lord STRANGFOItD pointed out some further dis-
crepancies in the report.
After a few words from the Marquis of LANSDOWNE
and Lord REDESDALE, the subject dropped.
SHANNON NAVIGATION BILL.
The Marquis of CLANRICARDE said that he did
net think it desirable to proceed further with this Bill
during the present session.

The Bill was accordingly withdrawn.
The Bishop of OXFORD presented a petition from
the magistrates of Oxford, complaining of the establish-
ment of beer shops, of refuges to the worst of
characters.