The Sun.
London, England, 1848-05-17 00:00:00

•••••••• ILI.'

COURT CIRCULAR.
Ms Loyal Highness the Prince of Prussia visited the
Queen yesterday, and remained to luncheon with her
Majesty and Prince Albert._
Their Royal Highnesses the Prince of Wales, the
Princeiss Royal, and the Princess Alice, took a carriage
drive yesterday.
Th'.ir Royal Highnesses Prince Alfred, the Princess
Helena, and the Princess Louisa, took airings in the
pleasure grounds of the Palace yesterday.
Her Majesty and Prince Albert, accompanied by the
Prince of Prussia, left Buckingham Palace at half-past
four o'clock yesterday afternoon for the East India
Docks, for the purpose of inspecting the Chinese Junk.
The Prince of Wales and the Princess Royal accompa-
nied. her Majesty and her Royal Consort. The royal
suite followed in another carriage and four, and consisted
of the Countess of Cleveland (Lady in Waiting), Lord
Alfred Paget (Clerk Marshal), Colonel the Hon. Charles
Grey (Equerry in Waiting), and Captain the Hon.
Alexander Gordon (Equerry in Waiting to Prince
Albert). After inspecting the Chinese Junk, the august
party drove to Victoria Park, and returned to Bucking-
ham Palace at a quarter before eight o'clock.

Her Royal Highness the Duchess of Kent, attended
by Lady. Augusta Bruce, honoured the performance at
her Majesty's Theatre with her presence yesterday
evening.
Her Majesty the Queen Dowager, her Royal Highness
the Duchess Bernhard of Saxe Weimar, Prince Edward
and the Princesses Anne and Ameba of Saxe Weimar,
visited her Royal Highness the Duchess of Kent yes-
terday, at her residence. Clarence House, St. James's.
A Cabinet Council was held yesterday afternoon, at
the Foreign-office. It was attended by all the Ministers
in town. The Council sat two hours.
Mr. Horatio Waddington, Barrister-at-Law, has suc-
ceeded Mr. S. Mark Phillipps as Under-Secretary of
State for the Home Department, and transacted business
yesterday, at the Home-office.
Mr. G. Cornewall Lewis, M.P., has succeeded Sir
Denis Le Marchant, Bart., as the. Parliamentary Under-
Secretary of State for the Home Department.
A. deputation on the subject of the Audit of Railway
Accounts Bill, consisting of Mr. George Hudson, M.P.,
Mr. George Carr Glyn, M.P., Mr. Charles Russell, Mr.
William Chaplin, M.P., Mr. D. Waddington, M.P., Mr.
William Jackson, M.P., Mr. S. M. Peto, M.P., Mr.
William Marshall, M.P., the Hon. R.- Dutton, Sir John
Simpson, Mr. James M'Gregor, the Hon. Charles
Howard, M.P., Sir Isaac Morley, and other gentlemen
representing large railway interests, had an interview
yesterday with Lord John Russell and the Right Hon.
g. Labouchere, at the official residence of the Noble
Lord, in Downing-street.
The Governor of the Bank of England had an inter-
view with the Chancellor of the Exchequer yesterday.
A deputation of the Council of Direction of the Sur-
veyors' Association consisting of Messrs. Cloutt, Dray-
son, Richardson, Wood, and Baker, had an interview
with Viscount Morpeth yesterday. at the office of her
Majesty's Commissioners of Woods and Forests, in
Whitehall-place.
Dr. Paris had an interview with Sir George Grey yes-
terday, at the Home-office, to present the Annual Report
from the National Vaccine Establishment.
Mr. Brown, Sir Thomas Birch, and Mr. Cardwell, with
a Deptitartidn from the Liverpool Operative Porters had
an interview with the Right Hon. H. Laboucbere, yes-
terday. at the office of the Board of Trade.
Dispatches were sent off yesterday evening from the
Colonial-office for the Governors of the West India
Colonies. Dispatches were also sent off last evening
from the Colonial-office for the Governor of Gibraltar.

TO THE SECRETARY OF THE
BRADFORD REFORM ASSOCIATION.
Sir,—Ou Monday the 15th the House went into
Committee on the Navigation-laws. The President
of the Board of Trade announced the proposals of the
Government ; which were, to leave as they are the
parts relating to the Coasting Trade and Fisheries,
and the manning of British, vessels, but remove the
restrictions on the purchase and employment of
foreign-built ships, and the conveyance of goods to
and from foreign countries, both here, and in the
colonies at their option. ,
A country which has put- down the monopoly of
the landowners, is not likely to tolerate the monopoly
of the shipovvners ; and therefore the Navigation-law.
may be considered as doomed. A truth once found
out, is lost no more ; and nothing can sweep the
existiog generation of the knowledge, that all mono-
polies are to enable somebody to sell dearer, and that
the amount of any difference of price thus accom-
plished, falls on the community in the shape of a
stupid loss, such as would arise from blunting the
edge of razors that more barbers might be employed
in shaving.
The thing of importance to know and spread the
knowledge of, is that it is you at Bradford who are
to pay for being shaved with the blunt razor, and that
this is all that comes of it. -If there were a halfpenny-
-worth of good to arise to the working classes or any-
body else in the aggregate, you might bear the ope-
ration patiently. But is there any need to tell you,
that if you pay fur more barbers, you pay for fewer
of somebody ease ; that consequently to call
it encouraging the working classes, is a
blunder or a fraud; ti.at the working classes
are fir too well informed to give into the fraud
without being paid for it, and therefore none but
those who stand in the position of the barbers, open
their !ins in behalf of it; and that on the whole, it is
fast growing into a stale device, which people will be
laughed at who start in sane men's company.
But, for all that, you had better stir in your own
business when you can. The opponents, though
outnumbered, are wonderfully tenacious of their plan;
and on Monday two divisions, of 62 against their 26,
and 63 against 26, were not sufficient to drive them
from their post of obstruction.
On Tuesday Mr. Horsman moved for an inquiry
into the state of the Cathedrals and Collegiate
Churches. These are a peculiarly sore part of the
ecclesiastical establishment, and the sooner anything
can be done to render them more conducive to the
services of the Church and the spiritual instruction of
the people, the better.
Mr. Urquhart called the attention of the House to
the relations of this country with Russia. In his war
with Lord Palmerston's diplomacy, he found time to
diverge to the correspondence in Spain. There has
been much useless talk on this last subject. Everybody
likes intervention, when they like the object; and the
contrary. It is difficult to prove, that the British
Minister's advice to Spain was not the soundest and
wisest it was possible to give. It would be interest-
ing to know what would have.been said, if the advice
had been the contrary way. Surely, though Minis-
ters may not always satisfy everybody, there is a
debt of gratitude owing to them in these latter times,
for having chosen the better part when the road was
open to them to have done so much mischief by an
opposite course.
I am, Sir, your very obedient servant,
T. PERRONET THOMPSON.
Blackheath, London, May 17, 1348.

PARLIAMENTARY BUSINESS.
(From the Votes and Proceenings of the house of Commons.)
TUESDAY, MAY 16.
STANDING ORDERS COMMITTEE.
The following Resolutions were reported from the above
Committee :-
1. That in the case of the Marchester, Sheffield, and
Lincolnshire Railway (Humber Ferries Improvement at
Hull and New Holland. &c.) petition for additional Pro-
vision, the standing orders onglit to be dispensed with :
• That the parties be permitted to introduce such addi-
tional Provision, if the Committee on the Bill shall
think fit.
2. That in the case of the Hulme and Eccles Road
petition, for extending the time for reading the Bill
second time, the standing orders ought to be dispensed
with:—That the parties be permitted to read their Bill
a second time on Monday, the 22d instant.—Resolutions
agreed to.

COLOMBIAN MINING ASSOCIATION.—Monday an
adjourned meeting of this company was held at the
offices in Austin-triars—J. D. Poe les, E-q., i❑ the chair
—for the purpose of confirming a resolution passed or.
the 6th of April for the dissolution of the company.
The resolution was agreed to eueniwounly. It appeared
that the liabilities were, in round numbers, 12,652 L, and
that the assets in England were about 2,6001., besides
assets in New Grana•ia. The directors were authorized
to realize the assets of the company as soon as possible.

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT.
HOUSE OF LORDS, May 16.
ALIEN BILL.
. _ The Marquis of LANDSDOWNE moved that the
uommons' amendments to the Alien Bill be agreed to.
The Earl of ELLENBOROUGH expressed his sur-
PriEe that the Noble Marquis had not explained what
the amendments were, and complained generally of the
• Bill, and_
me-V:1 CAMPBELL defended the Commons'
v• and said thei Bill would not inflict anyharadeshhdip-
on well-
si,,AAoreigners.
Lord
which had been inserted
complained of the power of bail
inserted in the Bill by the Commons,
and disapproved of other amendments which they had
made in the 4th and sth clauses, which contradicted
materially each other, and weakened the effect of the
Bill. The introduction of n clause permitting the ac-
cured parties to be
heard
in lacd by counsel and have witnesses
rtiotis
uz form of a trial to the pro-
;
. seeding—would lead to
ruinous
pense, and defeat the
successful working of the meas
Such an object had
been repudiated by their Lordships when the Bill was
• before them.
Earl FITZWILLIAM hoped that it world never be
found necessary to carry the provision: of the Bill into
very erous
idan active operation, as it would have
effect upon the friendly relations of l
foreign nations, which it was the professed wish of
with
foreign wthihs
country to maintain unimpaired_.
The Marquis of .LANSDOVVNE said that if the
Noble Earl had bestowed a few hours attendance
the House during the time the Bill was in progre,:pr
would have better understood its purport than he seemed
to do; but so indifferent was the Noble Earl to the tne:
-
• sure, that he-never once was present whilst it was
under
Ponsideration. The only purpose which the Bill sought
to attain was to guard this country, as far as it could, be
guarded, against revolutionary attempts which might he
levelled against the constitution and the inititutions of
ifaigland. He thought that the people of England &t-
-eamed to be guarded against nob sttempta, and it RUA

THE

deemed by the Government that the Bill before the
House would tend to give them that security. No one
throughout this country had complained of the Bill ; on
the contrary, it was highly approved of. There was no
reason for foreign powers to complain of an Act of
Parliament which gave to England for a year or two
those means of securing herself against the machina-
tions of foreigners which they themselves permanently
possessed.
Lord REDESDALE objected to the powers granted
to two justices of the peace—powers greater than were
to be possessed under the Bill by the Secretary of State
or a Judge. These powers were conferred by the addi-
tional clauses, and he agreed with the Noble Earl in
objecting to them.
Earl GREY defended the fifth clause, which was
essential to prevent an alien from being imprisoned for
an indefinite period upon suspicion of being engaged in
treasonable practices.
The Earl of ELLENBOROUGH persisted in his
objection to the clause added to the Bill.
The amendments were then agreed to.
POOR-HOUSES (IRELAND) BILL.

The Earl of DEVON moved the second reading of

this Bill.
Lord MONTEAGLE gave notice that in the Com-
mittee he should propose an amendment restraining the
power of giving agricultural employment under the Bill
to young persons who might be in the workhouses.
The Marquis of LANSDOWNE entirely concurred
in the view taken by his Noble Friend. The Govern-
ment would be prepared to introduce a provision similar
to that announced by him. The object of the Bill was
to improve agricultural science, and to afford the young
persons in workhouses opportunities for learning.
The Earl of DEVON concurred in the view taken by
the Noble Lords on both sides of the House.
The Earl of MOUNTCASHEL waive moreuite sure
whether it would not be desirable to give land to
the workhouses than to restrict its qutity.
The Bill was then read a second time.
Their Lordships adjourned at Half-past Seven o'clock.

- -------esow---
16.
CATHED
HOUSE OF O
ANDF
CCOOLMLE
F. rbelv ri
0.
eIIsIIINVASTEMCaIydIUdRCHES.
were
larishes • but that number
en
e th continuation
p)a
tprreoncze ee f
tthoes adyei ---a n
richestand 130 f wereth es
euvn.de
reer
and chapter of Lincoln 96 p t
°toßBlBM.loANthe(ri
Of these, 8 produced
had since been cut down to 27.
laboutoLp2esroal.n;ne6re,
.froomflesoola.rtsoe 2tohoel.
disposed of by the chapter among themselves. Of the
27, only 11 had resident clergymen, and in 9 ethers the
clergymen had other duties to perform. He had re-
ceived a letter from a clergyman in Lincolnshire, stating
that the churches in the patronage of the dean and chap-
ter were almost without an exception in a forlorn and
wretched condition ; the churches were falling and the
people degraded morally
ahtlghoaeuedamdnrioedyetnahicteneahrtal ee:
neldldtdehhcefeit,xruipa,
:el lnwaysd•
and,
ii
ndstau,insirt
a.dcre
ra. trmolheefaet
Ittoyteanhr neaes
cathedralaefromln deroaft
otheriotnh ep in
property peterhgr
country teyymmwetanaons
clergyman who did not deplore the present system.
But what was the state of the churches in the city of
Lincoln itself ? Formerly there were 52 churches,
now reduced to 13, the patronage of which was divided
among the members of the chapter. These could
- scarcely be called churches, for they were miserable,
decayed, dilapidated buildings, such as could not be
found in any district under the control of a cathedral
chapter. Here, as in Canterbury, the churches were so
served and the incumbents ill paid. Those 13 churches
in Lincoln were held by 10 incumbents, of whom six
have other clerical duties independent of those of their
parishes. The highest stipend was 1501., and there was
one as low as 681. per annum; but the income of the
clergy of the whole of them was 1,4441. a year, or less
than the income of one member of the chapter.—(Hear.)
With respect to the provision made for the congrega-
tions, he had a return of all the attendances at the estab-
lished churches and all the dissenting chapels in the
city of Lincoln on last Sunday. He found that of the
13 churches nine only were opened for morning service,
three for afternoon service, and seven for evening ser-
vice, and in all of them only 19 services were performed.
There were present at the morning services, 1.013;
at the afternoon, 175; and at the evening, 1,075—
making a total of 2,263, out of a population of 13,000,
inhabitants. On the same day the attendance at the
dissenting chapels were as follows :—in the morning,
2,565 ; and in the evening, 3,102 ; making a total of
6;667 in ten dissenting chapels, which had twenty-one
services. The greatest number attending the churches
was 1,075, whilst the greatest number attending the
chapels was 3,100, being three to one. He therefore
4sked again could these things be heard without feel-
ings of sorrow and shame, and would it be wise or just
to permit such a state of things to exist ?—(Hear.). lie
end no return of the attendance at the cathedral, but he
Ihad a document to which he must draw the particular
attention of the House, because it gave a better insight
into the services at the cathedral than could be gained

-rom any statistical return. He had in his hand adocu-
ment, certainly the most extraordinary ever issued to a
religious and Christian public. He wished that the
worst which could be said of the attendants at cathedrals
were that they were indifferent or altogether heartless.
But he would give the House a description of the attend-
ants at the cathedral service of Lincoln, written by no
less an authority than the Dean, and addressed to the
vergers, stall-keepers, and other officers of the cathedral,
these words:—" Whereas complaints have bean made
to me from several quarters, and I have likewise myself
observed that persons are placed in the stalls, or most
distinguished :places of the cathedral who do not come
within the rules of our church discipline, which bupposes

~very one to be seated according to his rank, quality,
and station—(Hear, hear, and laughter)—whence arise
the abuses of—first, a total disregard of the rubrics, such
persons often remaining in a sitting posture during the
whole of the service, neither standing nor kneeling at the
appointed periods—often, no doubt, from ignorance ;
secondly, a system of talking, laughing, and jesting
during the service, to the anno3ance of their devouter
neighbours, with such attitudes, gestures, and postures
is would be unbecoming even in private houses ; and
whereas, on remonstrance with some of these persons,
they have declared their intePtion to resist all attempts
to reduce them to better order, I hereby require and

order you—first, to exercise your best judgment
and discretion, aided by whatever knowledge of
the persons you may possess, to admit no
person whatever to the stalls who does not bear,
or appear to you to bear the character of a gentleman."
—(Laughter.) The document went on to recommend
that all persons should be forcibly removed from the
stalls who persisted in their ill behaviour after being
remonstrated with. Under the circumstances it was no
doubt very proper on the part of the Dean to issue such
a document; but what a picture did it present of the
serviees of our cathedrals.—(Hear, hear.) In the memo-
rial to which be had already alluded, from the Dean
and Chapter of Lincoln, they stated that their regular
attendance upon the choral services of the church securod
to the public the full preservation of the most beautiful
' and striking solemnities of Christian worship, together
with the must substantial comforts of daily prayer and
thanksgiving. How did that contrast with the the order
just read? That was an order more fitted for those
who infested a public-house or a playhouse than for
the attenders of a Christian church.—(Hear, hear.)
And it was that of which the public had so much
right to complain. It was wrong and unjust to say
that there was any want of sympathy with these
establishments, or that on the part of the public
there was any want of acknowledgment of what had
been owing to them in times pist, or was due to
them in times present. Cathedral stalls were an object
of attachment to Englishmen; still more the magnificent
Cathedral services. But for the abuses attached to them,
there were few persons who would not feel for them all
that veneration which could possibly be felt by the most
devout attender on these public services—few who would
not say, with one of their greatest admirers—
" Yet do these structures of our fathers' age
Shame the weak efforts of art's later page—
Say, whence the skill these darker times possess'd?
In those true days men gave to God their best."
He had also returns of the Sunday attendance at the
cathedrals, but did not think it necessary to go into
them, or to detain the House much longer. But it
.ould be a great mistake to suppose that the influence '
of the chapter was confined to the cathedral city; from
the property in the neighoourhood, the parishes under
theiro patronage and the preferments to which they ap-
p"nett, it was obvious the chapters must exercise very
grettt_i_estuence, in every sense of the word, in the
tils
",et around. He had a return of seventy-five
paiishes within ten or twelve miles of London, al-
most every one of which had been personally visited,
and regarding which
minute details,- he was furnished with the most
l_eowtould give the House a mere sum•
teary of the result
parishes, there were this inquiry. In the whole 75
only 30 resident incumbents and 12
resident curates; and only clergymen of any kind
vweidt h at
th er Lincoln,
lehndlrna 1
were resident m their
eoirghstocmaeseosththeer
either in conse-
greuseindoeent clergymenof
connexion
officiated on the
cause. In 22 cases the minister
t parish. Of
were held by
Sundays lived in some more or less od'
parsonage-
house, 75 livings, 44 were held in plurality,
(Hear,
non-resident ministers, 42 were without
house, and 60 had only one service in thaellaiPyu.nti
hear.):Let it not be said that these cases,of
of the
itand
non-residence. were provided for by Act or
for he had details to show that many of thetas werentirt
had
de
tAct;aken that
plac ien
sincesom e cthasee s appointmentspassing
Act ; that in others, licenses for non-residence
invi ia tpluralityicn of
had been granted ; and that in other cases, the
diocesan might have compelled the Luilding of
parsonage • house and residence, but had not done so.
So much had this evil struck the Bishop of London
himself, that some time ago he had published a very ad-
mirable-charge on that subject, in which he said:---‘,
I
am determined to enforce the provisions of the Act. I
am satisfied that no single cause has contributed more
to the prevalence of dissent in this diocese than the too
frequent practice of having only one service on the Sun-
day. When the parishioners see that a resident clergy-
man, having the care of a single church, opens it only
once on the Lord's day, the impression naturally made
on their minds is,:.that he is more desirous of consulting
his own ease than of promoting their spiritual welfare,
and that they should be disposed to turn to any teacher
who professed to supply diem with the spiritual food
for which they hunger." Ho was very sorry to find
that experience did not show that direction to have been
acted 0s; for it was impossible to conceive any district
in a state of greater aeglect than that immediately
around the parishes be had referred to. He
would now direct attention to the state of the clergy
themselves. He could show their poverty, their
privations, their sufferings; he could show
cases that
had occurred since he began to institute`l2. •
where it would not be too much to say that the clergy
had actually died from starvation;
he could show from ,
the letters of gentlemen of the
highest character re-
sident in thosedistricts, that there harrowing
tale
than
the $
=amp of those clergy. In-

SUN, LONDON,

stead of that, he preferred placing the matter in another
point of view; he would show the labours they under-
took, the exertions they made—the manner in which one
portion of the clergy neglected their duty, while another
eplearsfsorszeteddmaosrfeoltlohwans
;_thniTr
hseharere.
rector
rOeonf a
roif thehieivilnagttienr
my neighbourhood (it was sixteen miles off) had taken
his family to the waterside. He sent his groom to me
to know if I could take his duty at half-past ten o'clock
next Sunday morning. I said no: I was engaged at
that hour, but that I would take it at twelve o'clock."
There being no one else at band, twelve o'clock was
fixed accordingly, and the distant parishioners of this
rich rector, who came to church at the usual hours,
found to their surprise that they would have to wait an
hour and three-quarters before the service commenced.
At half past seven o'clock in the morning the clergyman
who had been applied to left home on his pony to do duty
at his own church, which was sixteen miles away.
The service began at ten ; he got through it as quickly
as possible, gave a short sermon, and then galloped off
to the church of the rich rector, where, by dint of hard
riding, he arrived just in time to do duty there, at
twenty minutes after twelve. Here he got through the
service again as rapidly as possible, and then galloped
away other fifteen miles across the country to do duty
for another incumbent, who was ill. The service there
was at
teattn miles back,- arrivinghreeheaentthr lateoaght ahethis w
duty, and then gal-
loped parish
church, where a small congregation was waiting anxious
to know whether a parson was coming to give them a
service or not. It was easy to suppose the state of
fatigue in which this clergyman must have returned
home late at night.—(Hear, hear.) This he did on
eight successive Sundays in the dog-day's.—(hear.)
But he stated that he had even done harder work
than that. He said—" One day when Mr. M., who
is very fond of shooting, had gone to the moors, in
the month of August, and his neighbour, Mr. C.,
.had gone to the lakes, in consequence of the death
of his brother, one of these gentlemen sent to me to
ask me to take his duty. I replied that it was impos-
sible. Master, sir (said his groom, who brought the
message), will be very sorry to hear that, for he is sadly
confused.' I said, ' Well, then, tell him if he will send
me one of his hunters to meet me at Lincoln, I will try to
take the service for him at six in the evening.'" It was
agreed upon that the matter should be so arranged.
On the Sunday the clergyman started on his pony and
rode to his first parish, 15 miles off, where his service
was at halt-past ten. He had two parishes of his own;
the second was two miles from the first; but he managed
to take the service there at one. The parish of Mr. C.,
fur whom he had also to do duty, was not tar off, and he
managed to arrive there in time for the service at half-
past three. " Then," he continued, " I rode as hard as
I could gallop to Lincoln, where I found a splendid mare
waiting. I shut up my ow.. pony in the stable, and gal-
loped 10 miles to Mr. M.'s parish, which I reached at
six. 'This I continued to do for three Sundays in the
month of August; and to make matters worse, on
one of those I was overtaken and drenched by an
autumnal thunderstorm."—(Cries of " Hear, hear.")
That was one case out of many, proving the hard
labours to which these poor clergy were exposed. In
the memorial to which he had already referred, the
chapter' expressed great alarm at any innovation, and
referred to their past exertions in the cause of education
re-
ligious religious
establishments,
improvement,
an d their
their g
en e
rat superintendence
influenceot roen-
the state of the city; and they added, " We fear there is
moving abroad a mischievous disposition to magnify. at
our expense, the pastoral office and ministerial duties of
those who are invidiously called the working clergy."—
(Hear, hear.) This was no invidious phrase, but one
which had originated in the distinction between those
poor clergymen who did the work, and the rich who re-
ceived large salaries and emoluments, paying pittances to
those by whom the work was done.—(Hear, hear.)
To show how little had been done in these districts,
in the way boasted of, he might state, that, out of
4,5001. a year received by the Ecclesiastical Com-
missioners from the benefices of this diocese, only
4901. had been laid out; and that out of 376 poor
livings, they had only augmented 72. There were
innumerable cases of destitution which had been very
grievously neglected. Into these it was unnecessary to
enter, or to go into the cases of other cathedrals; the
two he had ad iuced were sufficient to establish the po-
sition with which he set out. He could show in others
the evils arising from the system of letting church pro
perty, whereby everything like improvement was put an
end to.—(Hear.) He could show cases of chapter li-
braries containing rare and magnificent books,
which anywhere else it would be a privilege to
look into, but of which the last catalogue had been made
in the last century. There were instances of persons
wanting to visit these storehouses of knowledge, when
none of the chapter knew who had the key, and where
the lock was so rusty that the key would nut turn and
the door could not be opened; and in one case, the party
who had charge of the library key had complained of
the great annoyance caused by a clergyman constantly
coming to consult books.—(Hear, hear.) These me-
morialists claimed to be the promoters of education;
but he could show that they abused their trust as trus-
tees of grammar schools, as much as they did in the
chapter; he could show lands and estates made away with;
he could show—by letters to clergymen from the chapter
themselves, who had become careless by long impunity
—proposals as to managing the affairs of their churches
which were perfectly scandalous. But in all these abuses
nothing appeared to him so flagrant as the regulation
which had been imposed by Act of Parliament directing
that all the patronage vested in these chapters should be
given to themselves, and precluding them from bestow-
ing any portion of their preferments on deserving clergy-
men in their neighbourhood. If there was one thing
more than another which should have been encouraged
by the Legislature it was the seeking out of deserving
clergymen for the bestowal of preferments; but instead
of that, Parliament compelled the chapters to divide
those preferments amongst themselves, and forbade their
being bestowed on others. They were to be given in
the first instance to the members of the chapter, then to
the minor canons, then they might be given to the
master of the grammar-school; and if within six months
they were not given to any of the three the patronage
lapsed to the bishop. He had heard a reason as-
signed for this regulation which he would not now state;
but if it were true, nothing could pronounce a stronger
sentence of condemnation on the characters and pro-
ceedings of these parties. The Honourable and Learned
Gentleman then referred to two petitions which he had
presented from Wokingham and Carlisle (which have
been printed with the votee), and read part of their con-
tents. He had now stated all he thought necessary to
bring before the House. The two chapters he had re-
ferred to were a fair sample of the rest. He would now
ask the House whether it was possible or right to allow
these things to continue? There were many exemplary
individuals amongst the members of these chapters ;. tie
did not blame them, bet the system and the law ; and
he wished to enforce a change in the law by appealing
to the good sense and conscientious feelings of the
Legislature. It these things were allowed to continue,
in a very short period the evil must get ahead of us.
There was nut one of the cathedral cities in England in
which the Dissenters did not show a greater proportion
to the Establishment than in almost any other part of
the country.—(Hear, hear.) Thanking the House tor
having listened to him so long and so patiently, he
would now move, " That an humble address be pre-
sented to her Majesty, praying that she will be gra-
ciously pleased to direct an inquiry to be made into the
state of our cathedrals and collegiate churches, with a
view of ascertaining whether they may not be rendered
more conducive to the services of the Church, and the
spiritual instruction of the people."
Lord R. GROSVENOR said he rose to second the
motion, in the absence of his Noble Friend the Member
ror Bath. Ile was most dearly attached to the Esta-
blished Church; but feeling it the best means of dissemi-
nating the doctrines of the religion he professed, and,
believing that, despite some deformities, the great
majority of the people were sincerely attached to it, he
was most anxious that it should be freed from the abuses
alluded to. He earnestly desired its extension; but how
could this be effected, either by public or private means,
so long as pluralities and non-residence were suffered to
exist, and its revenues were misapplied?—(Hear, hear.)
Without committing himself to every statement of his
Hon. Friend, he begged to thank him for having brought
forward this motion, by which he must have created
many enemies, although actuated doubtless by the purest
motives. The time and attention he had bestowed in
procuring his details must have been most considerable.
If only a tithe of what he had stated were true a com-
plete case for inquiry had been made out.—(Elear,
hear.) He (Lord R. Grosvenor) knew enough of the
cathedral establishments to be convinced that such an
inquiry would be attended with the greatest possible
benefit.—(Hear, hear.)
Sir R. INGLIS teared that the Hon. and Learned
Member (Mr. Horsman) had overrated the intelligence
of the majority of the House, in assuming that they were
acquainted with the origin and nature of our cathedral
establishments. For himself, he must confess to a very
imperfect knowledge on this matter. But this question
was not of so much importance as the inquiry what were
the objects and duties of our cathedral establishments at
the present day. In alluding to the metropolitical
cathedral of Canterbury, the Hon. and Learned Gentle-
man had given a statement of the attendance there of
persons officially connected with the cathedral; and this
was stated to be twenty-three, rather a• considerable
proportion. As to the general attendance, it should al-
ways be,burne in mind that cathedrals were not parish
churches; they were not designed as places of worship
fbturrom.as large a number as their area would contain,
coeu,.ltl
ern
rather eorf toon
r exhibitsystem
of
worship,ott model of tthoe w h
ipuritywhich
the an d
wholeex -
I et v t u r Pr
e indecorum on the other. superstiftuiroindshoend
theno equal, removed alike
seen statements which gave theet
dances much higher hand,h
number
r.
But
uot andf
he
aftersf r ihadm
twhoeuyl de
aort: course
Fo r
instance,eary
thanmatehraiadll been stated; and they
on the materially
aonneurthaecy2defNtohvia., ffe r e
October,n t periods
6 2 ; on
himselft e 2fi th
rlest2n.thr
nodWfi
iolsthoe; ithout pledging
much to be relied on as the other, to w, hieehthought it as
implicit cre-
dence ought not to be attached. But a more se
con-
sideration than the number of attendances aterieathles:ras
was this. He could not but fear, notwithstanding the
disclaimer of the Hon. and Learned Gentleman, that the
tendency of his motion must be to cast an imputation on
the cathedral system generally, which he alleged tended
to the decay and the extinction of religion. This reminded
him of a dissenting minister who declared that ; the
Church destroyed more souls than it saved. How this
could be said of a Church founded upon the pure doc-
trines of the Reformers, and cemented by the blood of
martyrs, and boasting of prelates the most pious and en-
lightened, he could not conceive. Against such sentiments
he must protest as wholly unjust. A minor point dwelt on
by the Hod. and Learned Gentleman was, the income of
the members of chapters. At Canterbury, he said,
.the
livings of the dean and canons amounted to 8,0001., and
the livings in their gift to 9,2001. ;
• in all, 17,0004 But
he had failed to ahoy that this sum went wholly to the ,

members of the chapter; and the public conviction was
that such was not the case. But if the law were not
violated, was it fitting that the state of the Church of
England should be subjected to these perpetual aiscus-
sions year after year? Within the last 14 or 15 years
the question of the income of the cathedral clergy had
been taken up and fully examined, and a legislative
measure had been passed relative thereto. It was said
there were numerous clergy whose income was con-
siderably less than that of the canons; but why not make
the same objections against the gradation of rank and
income in all civil and laical professions arising from the
necessary inequality of condition? Such gradation he
believed to be on the whole beneficial, though he was far
from wishing that the incomes of the poorer clergy
should be so low. He would not pull down the high,
but elevate the low. He should as soon think •f
opleof
aEstighlfantdakattingd
taking the ingtchoemmesof
amongstthe aristocracy
thep(,
the incomes of the hierarchy of the Church to aug •
mnda.intlatintehde
of London was to be taken away,
that in this respect there was no difference between
ment those of
Colfeargny;othilereki
the
pprooopreerrty
d
as good a right to seise that of
Churchtincome
oopu f rl
dot ph
hee
ar
vßt )e•
isp
shusn
o
the corporation of London. The Hon. and Learned
Gentleman said that with the exception of St. Martin's,
which was the mother church of England, the incomes
of the incumbents of the other let livings in the neigh-
bourhood of the cathedral of Canterbury were very
small. He (Sir R. Inglis) regretted that; but what
had it to do with the dean and chapter of Canterbury?
They were not bound to raise the incomes of the
churches in their neighbourhood any more than those
at a greater distance. The Hon. and Learned Gentle-
man brought it as an accusation against the dean and
chapter that a population of only 4,700 attended the 16
churches in the neighbourhood of Canterbury, while
4,800 persons attended dissenting chapels. He wished
that all persons were members of the Church of England;
but the fact that there were 4,,300 persons attending
dissenting chapels in Canterbury did not justify an
attack upon the dean and chapter. The Hon. and
Learned Gentleman also said that the number of
official persons who attended daily service at Christ-
church, in Oxford, was 15, and that but 18 not officials
attended. He thought the Hon. and Learned Gentleman
must have been very much misinformed in that re-
spect, because he could say frien his own experience
that the cathedral of Christchurce was most numerously
attended. Every place was occupied, and the congrega-
tion was as attentive as in any parish church in England.
—(Hear, hear.) He could also state that the cathedral
body there charged the tithes with 3601. a year, for the
purpose of augmenting the livings of the poorer clergy,
and one of the colleges sacrificed 200/. a year for the
purpose of increasing one of the small vicarages. The
Hun. and LearnecCGentleman, however, directed his
attack chiefly against the cathedral of Lincoln, and said
that in the year 1831 an income of 6,9801. was divided
amongst tour individuals—the dean, the sub-dean, chan-
cellor, and precentor. He could not say why the llon.
and Learned Gentleman should select the income of
1831 rather than the income of 1848 ; but in the first
place he would remark that no rerson had a right to
make an inquiry respecting the income of another,
whether lay or clerical, unless he asked for an increase.
He might say, however, without breach of privilege, that
the income of one of those individuals was 1,5001. ; and
he would ask the House whether that was too large a
sum for a person filling one of the higher stations in
the Church ? But he received 1,5001. for the first
year only. The second year he received but 1,1001., and
this, the third year, his income was 8001. only, out of
which he had to pay 2001. for the building of a house.
The Hon. and Learned Gentleman then went on to
Carlisle Cathedral, in respect to which the Hon. and
Learned Gentleman's colleague (Mr. Aglionby) took
every opportunity of asking the Right Hon. Gentleman
the Secretary of State when he would introduce his Bill
for the compulsory enfranchisement of copyholds. That
Hon. and Learned Gentleman held a beneficial lease
under the dean and chapter of Carlisle, which he wished
to convert into a more beneficial freehold.—(" Bear,
hear," from Mr Aglionby.) The Hon. and Learned
Gentleman quoted from a celebrated petition, which
stated that the dean and chapter of Carlisle had an in-
come of 20,0001. a year in ono county, the fact being
that their revenue from the three counties of Northum-
berland, Cumberland, and Weetinoreland, was 17,0001.,
of which they received only 3,3001., the other Hon.
and Learned Member for Cockermouth, and other
lawyers, receiving the difference. The petitioners,
however, told their own story, and they left
it to be inferred that the dean and chapter received all
the money. They stated that the dean and chapter re-
ceived 2,000/. from the parishes of Wetheral and War-
wick, the actual income which they received being only
350/. He could not see why the dean and chapter
should be called on in their character of lay impropria-
tors to supply the spiritual destitution of those places
out of an income of 350/., whilst others were receiving
the difference. The amount received by each canon of
the cathedral of Carlisle was 5301., which could not be
considered too much for those who occupied a pre-emi-
nent position in the Church. He hoped he never would
so far forget the principles on which he always acted as
to be unmindful of the spiritual destitution of the coun-
try. lie felt now as strongly as ever the national as
well as personal duty of promoting the instruction of
those who were ignorant ; but, as he stated on a
former occasion, and as all subsequent inquiry con-
vinced him, than. could not be done ley individuals. It
could not be done by the plan of the Right lion
Baronet. What could be done by that plan had
been done, but the spiritual destitution of the people
was not dimini-hed. He agreed in the expression of
the Noble Lord that civil and social prudence, as well as
the religious duty, called upon them to provide for the
instruction of those who were spiritually destitute.
There was no better guarantee for the permanence of
their institutions, and the rights of property, than that
the people should be religious and educated. How
were these to be invent(' to them ? All their exer-
tions, and al the exertions of the Dissenters, had failed
to overtake the amount of destitution which prevailed.
They should not look to an altered distribution of the
church revenues, which had already been carried as far
as it could be carried, or to any other extrinsic means,
but to national aid; and the nation would tail in its duty
if; while it provided at the public expense for all the
other interests of the country, it, neglected and disre-
garded that which he believed to be the most vital and
essential of all.—(Hear, hear.)
Mr. AGLIONBY said that the Hon. 'Baronet had
made a most uncalled-for and unreasonable allusion to
him personally, and he could not conceive what had
caused him to do so; for, although he cordially sup-
ported the proposition of his Hon. Colleague, which he
hoped would excite that attention in the House which he
knew it excited throughout the country, he never said
anything to justify the Hon. Baronet in alluding to him
as he had done. It was true that he had asked the Right
Hon. Baronet the Secretary of State when he would
taring in his Bill for making compulsory the enfranchise-
ment of copyholds, and he would continue to do so again
and again till that odious custom was abolished. It was
true that he was a leaseholder under the dean and
chapter, but that had nothing to do with the question
before the House. He did not think that the dean and
chapter of Carlisle had a right to tax skill, capital,
and labour, and to reap where it never sowed. The Hon.
Baronet alluded to a petition which had been presented
to the House this session. He thought the dean
and chapter had reason to say of the Hon. Baronet,
"Save me from my friends." He did not wish to
, cast opprobrium on individuals. What he found fault
with was the system. Now, the petition which the
Hon. Baronet alluded to contained statements, some of
which he himself knew to be true, and the others he
believed to be true. The Hon. and Learned Gentleman
here read several of the statements in the petition, to the
effect that the duties were performed by curates, who
received only 201. a year, and in many instances smaller
sums; that there was no resident incumbent, and that the
parochial house was in a ruinous state; that two of the
largest and most populous parishes, including the city of
Carlisle, were served by curates, to whom the dean and
chapter only gave 51. a year; that the incumbent of ano-
ther of the parochial curacies died in a workhouse. He
thought it was a shame and a scandal that such a state
of things should be suffered to exist, whether by lay or
clerical irnpropriators.—(Elear, hear.) When seven out
of the nine persons who were connected with the dean
and chapter of Carlisle were the sons of archbishops or
bishops, it was apt to create a suspicion, however wor-
thy the individual might be, that matters were not
fairly managed.—(Hear, hear.) The petitioners stated
at the end of the petition that they had no reason to
believe the other cathedral churches were better ma-
naged, and he (Mr. Aglionby) concurred in that opi-
nien.—(Elear, hear.)
Col. SIBTHORP defended the clergy of Lincoln from
the attack of the Hon. and Learned Gentleman. lie
of the Hon. Member
would be found to be frivolous, _
vexatious, and un-
was sure that they would not object to inquiry ; and if
one Herr to take place, the charges
founded. He had two relatives connected with the
church in Lincoln, and he should like to know whether
he alluded to either of them. He did not know of a hat
the subject, and he
any.—(Order.) He felt strongly on
s he dd, when the
thought he was justified in speaking a
f Lin ol t
religion the Hon. Gentleman was, or whether he was of
Honourable Gentleman accused the clergy _ c most
conduct which, if they
disgraceful to them.
Mr. HORSMAN said he br
• ought no charges against
were guilty of it, would be most
individuals. What he comrlained of was the system,
was
,
Col. SIIITHORP said the living of Washingboro
one of those which was included in the limits of ten
miles around Lincoln, and if that did not give him a
right to complain, he did not know what did.
Mr. W. E. GLADSTONE quite agreed with the Hon.
Mover, that his motion had in no
way been based upon
Thequestion had
been based, and very properly
personal assault or individual attack.
based, on the operation
it. The question being, whether
himself about to treat
the state of the law was one which required
he face of it he thought the
and administration of the law, and in that view he was
ment, he admitted that on t
old
without alteration. That law brokedup
its tefficiency. It
cathe-
dral system, and very much reduce
months out of
law was not one which ought to be lefthpeermanently
bound the canons to residence for three
every twelve, but it left the definition of that residence
very doubtful, and it left other matters in a very ques-
tionable position, which it would be most desirable to
have settled. He confessed for his own part that ho
it should be the
Everything connected with learning.
motes nd the Act
duty of the cathedral dignitaries to pro
m way that ca-
should like greatly to see the system reconsidered.
Was very defective in not insisting
oftheological
neente conducive to the promotion
ing. He should be glad to see some of the stalls appro-
priated distinctly to educational purposes, whilst others
lions should do something to render cathedral establish
were made available to the furtherance of the parochial
ministry, In the case of the former, permanent resi-
dence would be required, and the holders of the stalls
should have no otter preferment. In the latter case
(the stalls held by persons haVil3g °large of large