The Sun.
London, England, 1848-06-02 00:00:00

evidence before the House were sufficient to justify
what he thought the issuing of this writ, at this time,
would amount to—namely, the indefinite suspension of
the writ altogether.—(Hear.) In his opinion, the case of
Derby was very different to that of Yarmouth.—(Hear.)
He admitted that an inquiry, and a most searching one
too, ought to be instituted into all these cases of cor-
ruption, but at the time he voted for the postponement
of the writ, he did not anticipate that issuing the
writ would be delayed for an indefinite period,
namely, until the Bill of the lion. Member for the
Flint boroughs had passed. There did not appear to him
to be any prospect of that Bill passing in the present
session; and looking at the fact that there were 1,800
uncorrupted 101. householders in this borough, ho really
thought the issuing of the writ ought no longer to be
delayed.
Mr. RICE wished to ask the Right Hon. Baronet
whether, supposing the writ were issued, he would still
consent to the state of the borough being inquired into?
Sir G. GREY said he had not the slightest objec-
tion to the inquiry, and although they consented to the
issuing of the writ, Derby might still be included in the
schedule of the Bill.

The Earl of LINCOLN said it would be perfectly
easy to retain Derby in the schedule, but what could
possibly be the use of the inquiry after the writ was
issued. The Committee had reported to them that gross
corruption had prevailed not only at the last but at pre-
vious elections for the borough, and ho certainly
could not sea how they could now issue this
writ with any degree of consistency. The Right
Hon. Baronet said the writ ought not to be delayed
till the Bill passed, because there was every prospect of
the Bill not being got through this session. Let them
issue this writ, and ho was quite sure it would not,
for no destinction could be drawn between
Derby and Yarmouth, and if they issued one writ, they
must issue the whole of them. If that ultimately turned
out to be the case, it would have been much better had
they never stopped the writ, for the public would then
conclude that the House had been insincere in all the
protestations it had made upon the subject.—(Hear.)
Sir J. HANMER felt convinced, after what had
fallen from the Right Hon. Baronet, that if they issued
this writ he should experience great difficulty in pre-
vailing upon the Horse to bring forward his Bill.
He earnestly entreated the Hon. Member for Lambeth
not to persevere with his amendment, but to make it a
substantive motion on another occasion. That day was
altogether an unfortunate one for the House to come to
a resolution to issue a writ for the borough of Derby,
which undoubtedly every person would acknow-
ledgo was a great and important town. They
ought to teach all those great and important
places that a greater responsibility rested upon theta in
consequence of their importance to prevent and put
down corruption at elections, and that if they were found
guilty of corruption they were not to be treated more
leniently than other places. He did not see how he could,
consistently wiUs all his declarations in that House, con-
sent to the issuing of this writ, and therefore, as far as
regarded the diverse course taken by Honourable
Members with :respect to the issuing of writs for places
where Members had been unseated for bribery, he held
himself altogether guiltless, because he had objected to
the issuing or every one of them. He held in
his hand a petition which had been printed in the
votes for an extension of the franchise, and the preven-
tion of bribery at elections, and he trusted Honourable
Members would give it their serious consideration.
If Hon. Memb srs thought that the spreading opinions
as regarded the prevention of corruption were only enter-
tained by Chartists, and me❑ of extreme political
views, ho could assure them they were ♦ery much
mistaken.—(Hear, hear.) He had introduced a Bill into
the House with the view of putting an end to bribery,
and if it were :.7airly met by lion. Members, it would
soon be in a state to go forward to the other House. He
did not wish to detain the House any longer, and would
merely conclude• by expressing his decided opinion
against the issuing of the writ.

—Mr. GOULBI3 AN said, if they refused the writ on
.•
the grounds staled, that they would soon have many of
the large towns of the country unrepresented. He had
as great a horror of bribery and corruption as any man;
but he considered that the bribery complained of
could be as well. inquired into after a new election as
during the suspor.sion of the writ, and considering that
no good would wise from the refusal to issue the writ, he
should support the motion. But it the House was inclined
to refuse to issue the writ, he thought they should insti-
tute an immediate: inquiry. However, he could not be a
party to suspenthng writs for an indefinite period, and
for an undefined purpose.
Mr. MUNTZ .said he was not easily astonished, but he
really was astonished at the speech of the Right Hon.
Baronet Sir G. Grey, for from it it appeared that the
Government intended to throw their shield over such
proceedings as those that took place at Derby.
He cottld tell them that such a reform as this would not
be received by the people. He was ready to suspend
the writ for a definite purpose, but recollecting that
those who were bribed were freemen, and that
it would be a difficult matter to draw the line
of demarcation, he considered that the borough
ought to be punished, and should there-
fore, oppose the motion. The House should bear
in mind that there was a growing feeling out of doors
that the majority of the seats in that House were pur-
chased.

Colonel SIBTIIORP supported the issuing of the writ.
Strangers were then ordered to withdraw, and the
House divided, when there appeared—
For issuing the writ 136
Against it
Majority against issuing the writ -17
The issuing of the writ was consequently postponed.
The announcement of this result was received with
loud cheers.

SPANISH AFFAIRS.
In answer to a series of questions from Mr. BAILLIE
(whieh were not heard in the gallery owing to the con-
fusion caused by Members leaving the House),
Viscount PALMERSTON said—l have to state in
the first place, that the Spanish Minister, Isturita, some
time ago, announced to me the arrival of Count do
Mirasol in London, for the purpose of giving explana-
tions and statements with regard to recent transactions
at Madrid. My reply to that was, that whatever com-
munications the Government of Spain wished to make
upon those matters to her Majesty's Government, I
should be quite ready to receive from the official and
accredited organ of the Queen of Spain in this country
—(Hear)—but that I thought it my duty to decline
entering into any communications with the Count do
Mirasol.—(Hear, hear.) I also stated that considering
the nature and character of the events to which these
communications were to relate, I thought it desirable,
at all events, in the first place, that those communica-
tions should be made in writing. I have received
some communications from the Spanish Minister; upon
those subjects lam in communication with him at the
present moment; but I do not feel it my duty at present
to state anything upon those matters to the House.
Whenever those communications are brought to a close,
probably I may feel it my duty to lay the correspondence
on the table of the House; but of course it is not for me
to say on what day, or at what time, that will be.
Mr. BANK ES wished to ask the Noble Lord whether
he would next day move that the House should go into
Committee of Supply, in ordr to give him (Mr. Makes)
the opportunity of bringing on his motion on the Spanish
question?
Lord J. RUSSELL said, if the resolutions on the
navigation-laws were agreed to and reported that night,
and the Bill founded thereon brought in, he should pro-
pose to go into Committee of Supply the next day; if
not, he should propose to go into Committee next
day, with a view of considering these resolutions, and
in that case, should take the Committee of Supply on
Monday.
COPPER DUTIES.

Mr. WYLD inquired if it was true that ships laden
with foreign copper, which had recently arrived, had
been allowed to discharge their cargoes on payment of
the is. duty proposed by the Bill now passing through
the House. _ _

Mr. LABOUCHERE said it would prevent much in-
convenience if notice was always given of questions of
this nature. He had no knowledge of the matter beyond
the general practice which had always obtained in all
cases of remission of duty—namely, that as soon as the
House had affirmed the resolution for a remission of any
duty, parties were allowed to enter their goods at the
lower rate, giving a bond for the payment of the dif-
ference, should the House not finally sanction the reduc-
tion. He had no reason to believe that a different course
had been pursued with regard to copper.
Mr. WYLD said he must complain of this course.—
(Order, order.) He would move the adjournment of the
House to be in order. He suspected, from the unusually
large importations of foreign copper which had recently
been made, that the parties must have received some
intimation of what the Government were about to do;
whereby a serious loss had been entailed on the copper
miners of this country.
WEST INDIA COLONIES.
In answer to Mr. HOME,

Lord JOHN RUSSELL said that on the 15th or 16th
of the present month some member of the Government
would be prepared to state the course which was meant
to be pursued with regard to the West India colonies.
NAVIGATION-LAWS—ADJOURNED DEBATE.

Mr. J. WILSON craved the indulgence of the House
in reference to some observations which he had made on
Monday. On that occasion he had referred to a letter
from Rio Janeiro, stating that several British ships were
lying there unable to obtain cargoes, and to a corrobo-
rative statement which had been subsequently posted at
Lloyd's. The Hon. Gentleman opposite, the chairman
of Lloyd's (Ir. G. Robinson), had said that was alto-
gether untrue.
Mr. G. ROBINSON—I said that it was absolutely
untrue. _ _

Mr. WILSON wished to afford the Honourable Gen-
tleman the opportunity of stating whether his words re•
ferred to the fact of such a document having been
posted at Lloyd's, as the House apparently un-
derstood him, or whether he referred to the fact of the
vessels lying unemployed at Rio Janeiro. From several
letters which he (Mr. Wilson) had since re-
ceived, some from members at Lloyd's, he found it was
matter of perfect notoriety to the secretaries and officials
of that establishment, and to half a dozen leading houses
in London, that such a notice had been posted; for they
had read it there. The gentleman who had originally
supplied him with the information from Rio Janeiro was
a supporter of the navigation-laws, but ho was desirous
that a fact like that should be known. In consequence
of the denial of the Hon. Gentleman (Mr. G. Robinson)
his informant had written to him again, repeating the
statement, and referring to the secretaries and officials
of Lloyd's. The words in the original letter from Rio
Janeiro were exactly what he (Mr. Wilson) had stated.
The statement posted in Lloyd's was not from that let-
ter, but from one addressed to Messrs. John Robinson
and Suns, ajhighly respectable house; and it was exactly
confirmatory of the other statement. He hoped the Hon.
Gentleman (Mr. Robinson) would now state whether he
meant to deny the accuracy of the information from Rio