The Sun.
London, England, 1846-04-29 00:00:00

,A tiT 7-
- 4 " ti C()IVI 3,IITTEES.

(YES TER DA Y.)

GROUP VI.
ilk Committee met to-day at twelve o'clock. Sir J. C, ;lob.
house,, chairman.
Mr.
their Axneaws, for the promoter!, applied to the committee for
tlemea a athority to bring forward Captain Codrin Mn, one of the gen•
sent down by the Board of Trade to !pert as to the eligibility
of mai .ing the " Ine',l" a termini, and wise report Was favourable.
The Committee objected to this conr;,e,
z Mr. A/enemy. s then opened the case for the promoters of the
and ee and P_ erth line. This was an Act to alter and attend an Act
V.hict `race'• red the sanction of both Houses of Parliament, and en-
renal,„,ed,„,_
or
.8 "Dundee and Perth Railway Act," whereby a
Pose
---`r'4uY was incorporated by that name, for the pur-
Act. . ' rnak ng a railway from Dtindee to Perth. The
the ir et' last year gave the promoters power to make
declsi .ela a common termini for that and other lines, Subject to the
ittuto aof the Board of Trade. That Board sent down engineers,
iot 6
, sy reported favourably for making this place a station. Would
1..., 4 be too bad if, after being bound by the Committees of
.i,r_.,, / iession to act according to the Board of Trade,
h7376Y, should now be refused the benefit of such conditions. The
of vof almost constructed, and it was stopped last year at one side
0 e river till the reportof she Board of Trade was made known. The
..el 0: I came, and it wad highly favourable, it gave the promoters
Pea rs z t
the ogo on to the "Inch." The promoters, therefore, had at
Prele 8, ant power to go on to the "Inch"—true, not with
..„, "mach benefit as the powers of the present Bill, but
the
I thy had the power to go to that place. Without going to it,
~,,e' Bile Of last year wonid be wholly useless, and the o iy object of
the,,.n 4nlgniAr'?rein tabs Committee this year for that object was, to get tod
-more convenient mani.er, both to the Compan, an
!be', cublic. Thfst they should be allowed to go there was wholly
thcle Pendent of any evidence to be offered by the 'W-
n' lib'. The decision of the Edinburgh and Northerr
Cots
'alittee anr: the Committee on the Scottish central Railway wase
th:d. the oT, _.,
hcp ed the C"'..o' should be emied and that being the case, h
their mile:
.oirni.mittee bzfore whom he'then appeared would also give
fir'Tir a°
iller, civil engineer—l; engineer to the Dundee and Perth
Hof railway. Under the power of the Act of last sessionrassa they
b,' ,;", allowed to go up to the river Tay, which was tod berecparadd t
plans
""An'ee, to be approved of by the Admiralty. He had P
40 17 lest the wish of th.o Board of Trade. The alteration proposed by
the. Bill of this year ',could bring the goods' station nearer to the town
of p erth than if they were togo by the Craigie-park side of the Inch.

GHOITP XI.
10 rum
whit t transpired yesterday in Mr. IV. Smith O'Brien failing
to ttend th, i Committee, though the business to be transacted was
PCartponed Vil Thursday in consequence of the Bills not being in a lit
strte to pre ceed, the Chairman, Mr. Henley, accompanied by several
of she oth•.,r members, attended in his place to-day at one o'c'ock; In
~
'order to see if the refractory Member would upon second com'ldera-
tion sea th a prudence of yielding to the regulations of the house and
Bivc3 his services. The Honourable Chairman, "aith his col-
leagues, 'however, were doomed to disarn'-jaitment, for up
to two o'clock, when they again adjOunieil, no Mr. Smith
O'Brien made his appearance. In r
to execute the intention of the rules o !der to kill time and
big for Ile absent Member one hour r• the House, viz., the remain-
Chaln3lanw his colle&mes, oefore making their report— the
windoi.vs lacing stationed themselves at one of the
the river, a a
the PrOrMtSS of the stonem-r. • appeared to watch m ith great interest
4sons in the works low, and
the prog.:ese of the steant-I..eats, barges,engaged be
and other craft passing up
aild :doe rrt the' river. 'an-
hem a •
di ourned, h expired, the Hon.
with th; ..en the hour had Mem-
acrthe X louse this eve reporting
, , object, no doubt, ofthe absentee
- 4 , r.ing.

•
- •
~.• - GROUP XIV.
S u 41 ,•'.__.' -47
,__
narri
1-EASTEEN AND ncn ZS.
The con,
--P.Attee on this group of railways met to-day in Room No.
30 Ifre ~
• e- cot—Mr. Protheroe (chairman), Lord Erulyn, Mr. J.
CPC..2I, no,-.,,
and Mr. Grogan.
4";-,•• Yearon, the solicitor to the South-Eastern Railway, examined
Mr. ,tOcrcauart -First became solicitor to the company in 1833.
~.,.. or,,ject had then been formed by some of the directors of the
' * I?eut pith Railway. The company was at first called the London,
4)6iei , and Covtinental.Railway. ; The firstadvertisement appeared
ilft the local papexs in March, 1834, and the surveys were made be-
Ibre filai periddnind continued aftem'ards... Very considerable dirt'.
leuitY vas experienced in bringing the project to anything like matu-
.' nil", in consecimente of the nesly unanimous app sition of the land-
-I,llld Sr. on thesVUrse of the In.oposed line. The great difficulty was the
Pass age ,of the Aledway, P.. 3 the proposition of crossing it by Rochester
‘,IIIY, ge ,'vl as -•
not ,liste.,,,'ed to, and any attempt to cross it above the
...a-a, ge 'would be att,Jtided with works of the most formidable nature.
":I'l)gtrnieY also seas expected to offer the most decided opposition,
art:,irthe-e.bginPers "mere consequently desired to turn their attention
e to the westward. Geological difficulties were then experienced,
'.:';•-i4•14! I tile, shies of the line was directed as far west as Auchated. It
_.,4kan..ittl,.th. e line had been drawn as far west as Auchsted that
,Ve. of a combination was entertained. It was in October,
.. , . .4mt the idea was first entertained of combining Brighton
. , ti,.%.,...,...... .14ver by means of the Pale, and the company then changed its
.
. ' ----"•4'.kalth9ligh" ,t,n*nie-Vgillp We. The company was, ill
:•.44,:a.1"-qollll4llartuidento,llrerkiltsPlame. The first formal
... , . .
' finn• llea they It
.Sotith;East*.rlorkapany came out in July,
~,
- ' adr,;...i• - ...Ilea ttieS'lient before Pargagfent;lhe Brihton of the
----e
"as aban*agii,..and in. 183d,ilieBill was obtained. When
• .4P 'puree of the.tionth;Elistern rose .to 'tv.iiremium two other pro-
;.:l,B_,,td,..4lllld74;lppbsed it, One ,of these was a line from the
Ett
1,',-.,•""_"un'ltaihytry.to Gravesend, but it was thrown out. The orl-
- Of the•tothpany was to accommodate North Kent, and,
lion. enr rere.ries that they sustained the idea of that accommoda-
,•imaii7catz never abandoned. Mr. Vignoles's plan first assumed a
\sad th—f°'r9l in
1844. It was at first only to Chatham,
. 1 -
..,'" it -Was advanced-to Ramsgate. It was only in the present
ti?_
it: at Alse extension to Dover was proposed. He did not coa-
te any London terminus last year.
zrineYerMr. Sergeant WRANGLIAM—Captain Pringle, who was the en-
. to the company, in his examination before the committee
.1" 1836, states that he objected to that pa-t of the line running be-
tween grave.e,ad and Maidstone, as the chalk cuttings between
those points v,,ere very heavy. The principal landowning oppositi n
to the line v.-as between Gravesend and Folkestone. There was also
strcrag opposition between Gravesend and London. When they
th &
"'lade up their minds about the South-Eastern line, they considered
t the Gravesend line was out of the question.
The C7eLUAMAN here intimated that the Committee were of opinion
that the question of priority ought apt to be considered by them as a
• matter of material importance. It was a point that should unques-
tionably meet with due consideration, but it appeared to him that
the question of the respective merits of the two projects was of infl-
Wkily more importance, and was the point on which the Committee
bad more particularly to decide.
Witness in continuation--Cannot say whether Mr. Vignoles had a
!plan for a bridge over the Medway under the consideration of the
bridge wardens at the time that Mr. Stepheason proposed to cross
the river by a fe.rry. Is sure that the idea of the bridge did not ori-
ginate with ..Ir. Vignoles, and Mr. Cubitt had spoken of It eight
• Years ago. The original capital of the company was 1,400,0001.
The Coattnittee adjourned until one o'clock to-morrow.

GROUP XVI.
rARNIZADI AND ALTON BRANCH.
The 'consideration of this branch was resumed to-day by the Com-
Mine', of Group XVI • Sir Charles Douglas in the chair, with Lord
Po
ngton, Mr. Lockhart, and Mr. Blewitt present, when Mr.
Av ma called
Mr. Dronn, who testified to the advantage of having a station at
Alton. stating that it would bring the inhabitants seventeen miles
nearer than by the way of Winchester. He believed that the carrying
the line to Atresford would be difficult, and was not bkely to be effected.
The bulk of the people were decidedly in favour of the Alton Branch.
To Mr, LOCKHART, the witness said, that the turnpike-read was
as good as any in England. but it was bad for engineering difficul-
ties, there being a considerable rise to the summit of Windmill Hill,
Six miles one way, and four the other.
Mr. Horne stated that the traffic was much greater at Wigtleld
than at Farnborough, and the formation of this branch would bring
a great trade from Alton, which :s the busiest place t:le witness
knows for its size, and certainly the population was very con-
siderable.

Mr. Crowley, called by Mr. AUSTIN, confirmed his previous evi-
dence with respect to the advantages this line was likely
to produce. It would reduce the carriage of coals from 12s. 9d. to
Zs. 9d. per ton, and would increase the number of private inhabi•
tants, as Alton was situated in the most beautiful part of Hants, but
parties were prevepted from settling there by the dearness of fuel
sad the heavy cost of building materials. Sand cost, for instance, 20s.
waggon load; it might, with this line, be brought for 10s. There
'would be a saving often per cent. in lime, seven per cent. in paving-
stone, and five per cent. in timber from journeys
to In the
to London, too, each passenger would save nearly one half the ex-
pense ; and the population were so badly for conveyance that
p
many people were obliged to tee their ow off
gigs and other carriages.
The advantage was shown also in the circumstance of there being
upwards of 3,000 waggons loaded with agricultural produce, which en-
. tered Alton yearly, and if this line were made, the Alton breweries
plight be enlarged indefinitely, and would be' able to compete with
those in London. The proposed Direct Portsmouth branch to Go-
elalming would carry the inhabitants several miles round to the me-
tropolis, and then there would be great delay in the formation of that
line, even if the Bill for it were obtained, while by this line they
would obtain the accommodation in two years.
To Lord POLLINGTON—Mr. AUSTIN replied, that there were se-
Verret places of no more importance than Alton which had terminal
branches, and instanced the Ste ming, Horsham, and Bognor branches
of the Brighton line SS examples. The traffic on the line had
been increased fivefold since the opening of the Guildford branch.
Railway accommodation would be afforded to Godahning, but it
would be at great cost, that of making a line 19 miles long through
what appears to be quite an
Mr. Locke, the engineer, that the primary object of this
Line was to accommodate Alton, and was projected at the request of
the inhabitants of that town. The Farnham was a subsequent
thought, and occasioned by
f the country not being
at all contemplated in the first instance. Ie L had
abtlried the country to the
There was no south of the Hogsback, but found it impracticable.
and that from
com-
parison between the country from Farnham to lit
the latter place to Godalming, the latter districtobeitng exceedingly
hilly
11 lastw eys
teearrn,
and difficult. Reports ha i been made in Au
and in January of t is, in which the directors of the Sootift
ixeri?ject. He
Company had stated their intention of pursuing tae
gaesettr. and
took a survey of the ground through Alresford to
had liken sections of a line, he having originally designed
to Salisbury, but that had afterwards been Itered. This Alton a
would be .of great advantage to Alresford, but it would be difficult
for for rail Way purposes, as there would be a long gradient, or
one
' In. sixty, and a tunnel would be required. The prolongation to Win-
' 'theater would be of no advantage whatever; and if made must be
' for local purposes solely. He was acquainted with the Direet
Portinaouth line, and certainly conceived that it would not be an
alternative line, and that it would not give the same accommodation
to the country, the gradients being altogether different. He
believed that a railway could not be made at all between Alton and
Liphook, the country being so hilly that within three or four miles
out of Petersfield there was a difference of not less than four hun-
dred feet in the level. This branch took the natural valley of the
country, and was a natural branch of the South-Western line, and
Was likely to contribute to its prosperity.
The Cuareatas wished to be certain as to the continuation to Win-
chester, and he referred to the evidence previously given of the indis-
position of the inhabitants, to which Mr. Locke replied that he could not
say anything about the opposition 'nit certainly from the engineering
• character of the country, he never should recommend the directors
'to Make it the branch. He felt that he had in soma way implicated
- the directors, by having curve} ed the whole of the country, on a
lunch wider basis than was absolutely necessary. He had done this
from a desire to thoroughly know the country, and feared that to
had thereby created a prejudice against them ; but there was no in-
tention whatever to go to Winchester.
Sir C. DOUGLAS wished to be satisfied on this point.
Mr. AUSTIN wished to get Mr. Horne, the Chairman of the Com-
pany, but being unable to get him, so stated that he was authorised
to assure the Committee that there was no such intention, and en-
treated that that assurance should be placed on the record of the
report of the Committee.
. To Mr. LOCKHART—There was no separate estimate of the
Mit! of the line to Farnham, but he believed the land there
eras, if anything, cheaper than that flirther south
Mr. AUSTIN here put in a statement of the traffic respectively of
Farnham and Alton, by which it appeared that the nembn of
passengers for the former place was 87,000 annually, and the produce
in money 6,0001. ; of goods there were 21,000 tons, producing nearly
1,8001. From the latter the passengers were 94,000, the money
paid by them 8,7001. ; goods, 39,000 tons, and the produce in money
3,0001.

The room was cleared at this point, and on the re-admission of
strangers,
Sir CHARLES Denoras intimated that the Committee had as yet
„ come to no decision ; but that they were prepared to pass the pream-
ble on leaving out the words, " and Alton, in the county of South-
ampton."
Mr. Mix, Q-C., said that they were prepared to submit evidence
as to the traffic between Alton and
Farnham.
' 'Air. Herne was then called, who stated that he had been engaged
with
traffic thedepartmentdye Seuth-Westeni Company eight years, had been in the
years had been speciall
- years, and
addaring the last two or three
y enga
, with information on that eubjecf He supplying the directors
produced the estimates of
traffic, in which it appeared that the coach passengers paid 5,5321.,
and the motley obtained from private Vehicles was 9,2631. Os. 9d.
There were 4,368
e each
ls e, r
day,an d
andt h e
cFa ar run --
• borough station, the coach making one journeh-
ing, on an average, six passengers width, Per mile each,
'would give 605/. as. between Farnham and tGuddfo. rd, half-yearly.
There was a coach between London and Alresford oiAga.upanehday
' - and down another, the produce of which was 30'27
yearly In addition there was a coach between Alresford and althf-
% Farnborough station, which produced 6051. 3s. half-yearly. Thies
doubled gave the Income of the branch on the usual
rate. of
estimate. and made 3,025/. 15s. between Alton and Farnham for
coach passengers alone. This, he coneeived, a very low estimate.
To Mr. LocuicesT the witness replied that the baffle byivate
vehicles was taken by actual observations, made from October 20th
to November 2d, and in one or two stations begun on October 27th
and continued till November 9th. The observations were made close
to,the toll bar.
To Mr. HILL—The witness stated the mode in which the traffic
was taken, which was in the usual manner. The passengers between
.Alton and Farnham in private vehicles were on the average 84,472
""-- in the year, one-halt of which only he took for the railway. These
would produce, at I%d. per mile, with a distance of nine and a half
miles; 1,85 1. 9s. Between the Alton and Wachfleld station
there were 13,910 passengers, the half of whom would pay
for travelling nineteen Tulles 9631: Th. Id., making a total, including
the coach traffic, of 8,755/. 15s. Id. For parcels and mails there
' - 'would be about 400/. He assumed the number of parcels would be
40,000, and
The mercantile traffic was taken in the same way as that of private
vehicles, viz., observation, and without any of the increase usually
allowed for railway, giving to each horse only 15 cwt., though the
common weight was a ton, there was a tonnage of 12,688 of later-
' " chandise. Alton and its neighbourhood takes 10,000 tons, the revenue
l't*. from carrying which would be 1,187/. 10s. Of line, slate, and
ether similar articles, there were between 5,000 and 6,000 tens, nue about 600!. Live stock, &c., 405/. 16s. Bd. For carriages and
reve,.
horses, 160/., making a total 14,9151, 15s. 10d., that for the
whole of the branch being 24,023/. I Is. lld , leaving for the portion
between Farnham and Guildford 9,307/. 163. I Id. The observations
toel Docu corefull,y made, and the totimatce wore low; tla flab 94