The Sun.
London, England, 1841-03-01 00:00:00

Mr. BROTHERTON presented a petition from
tl .e Board of Guardians of the Silford Union against
tl a Poor•law Amendment Bill.
Sir J. Y. BULLER presented petitions from Exe-
ter and various other places in favour of Lord Mor-
peth's Bill for the registration of voters in Ireland, and
against the Bill introduced by Lord Stanley.
Mr. ROUND presented petitions from Essex against
the Poor-law Amendment Bill.
Lord MORPETH presented petitions from parishes
in Londonderry, Antrim, and Down, in favour of Lord
Morpeth's Registration Bill.
Mr. BLAKE presented similar petitions from Gal-
way.
Mr. W. EVANS presented a petition from a parish
in Derby, in favour of Church Extension.
Mr. G. W. WOODS presented three petitions from
Kendal, in favour of the Copyright of Designs Bill.
Mr. W ALLACE presented a petition from Green-
ock, praying that molasses in bond may be permitted to
be refined ir.to sugar. Also a petition from the same
place, stating the opinion of the petitioners, that Cie
House had been paying a great deal tao much attention
to Church maters of late, and suggesting that their time
would be more profitably employed by considering the
best means to build the Navy cheaply, and man it well.
Major M‘NAM ARA presented a petition from the
Grand Jury of the county of Clare, in favour of the
Irish Drainage Bill ; also a petition from some place in
the county of Galway, in favour of Lord Morpeth's Re-
gistration Bill and against Lord Stanley's.
Mr. BINGHAM BARING presented a petition
from some place in Staffordshire, praying for the exclu-
sion of Roman Catholics from Parliament.
Mr. I'. DUNCOMBE presented a petition, signed
by upwards of 2,000 of the inhabitants of the borough
of Finsbury, against the New Poor-law Bill ; also a
petition from an individual named Bagster, residing at
Hereford, stating that he had watched the operation of
the Poor-law Act, and that the cruelty and expense
entailed by it were almost beyond endurance ; that
the rates in Here foid had in conseqnence been raised
from 4s. 6d. to 9s. 7d. ; that robbery and incendiarism
had increased in consequence ; that many of the poor
rather starve than go into a workhouse, and that if it
were continued, the lower classes would he completely
alienated from their superiors, and praying that the 8.11
for its continuance might not pass into a law.
Mr. H. DRUMMOND presented a petition from
the Presbytery of Eigle praying for the better obser-
vance of the Sunday.
MANCHESTER AND LEEDS RAILWAY.

how long the discussions on going into Committee of
Supply and the debate on the estimates might occupy
the time of the House. It was likewise to be con-
sidered that it would be very inconvenient to fix the
Committee for a Bill of the nature referred
to for some day on which it could not be conveniently
brought forward, inconsequence of the estimates not
having been previously introduced. It would likewise,
continued the Noble Lord, be very inconvenient to
many Members to be summoned to a very full attend.
ance immediately preceding Easter, when very few
would be disposed to attend the House, and when any
debate in Committee could only lead to further
postponement. These are considerations affecting
the general business of the House as relates to the
present Bill ; but there are other considerations relating
to the Bill itself. If I were to consider merely the di.
vision which had taken place on Friday morning last,
and the 296 Members who were present to vote against
the second reading of my Noble Friend's all, I should
be disposed to consider, were I to look to that
circumstance alone, that the measure was one
which could not in its subsequent stages obtain the
assent of the House. But the discussion on that
second reading would lead me to a very different con-
clusion. There were several Members who in stating
their determination to vote against the second reading
of the Bill did not dissent from what I considered the
general principle on which it is founded, against its being
advisable to endeavour to fix the franchise for Ireland
by some clear and simple method, and at the same
time to amend the registration laws in that country.
The Duke of Wellington and Lord Lyndhurst bad
both stated in the House of Peers that they considered
the rating test the best possible test of qualification
under the Municipal Corporations' Act. I think, there-
fore, that it would likewise form the best criterion
of the test of the right of voting for Mem-
bers of Parliament. With respect, therefore, to the
adoption of this general principle, I see no rea-
son to delay the further consideration of this Bill ; but
in order to fix the amount of the franchise, it is desir-
able that there should be, before the House proceeds
to further deliberation, further information as to the
valuation.—(Cheers and laughter from the Opposition.)
I am surprised at the feeling and sentiment which this
announcement seems to create in Hon. Gentlemen op-
posite, beceuse I nee on the benches opposite several Hon.
Gentlemen who spoke during the late discussion, aid
who made it the gist of their argument that before they
could agree to the 101. test it was absolutely necessary
that they should have further information as to the
valuation. Therefore, when I stated that I proposed
to gratify the appetite for inormation, I cannot but be
surprised at the manner in which that announcement
was received.—(Loud cheers from the Ministerial
benches.) However that might be, I think in
common with my Honourable Friend, the Secre-
tary for Ireland, that it would be desirable that
we should endeavour to obtain some further information
as to the manner in which the valuations had been made,
so as to ascertain, at least to a great extent, the propor-
tion per cent, which the valuation bears to the real valor.
I do not think it will be necessary to defer the Bill to
any very long time to obtain this valuation. But I
think likee Le that it is of the utmost importance
that the House should come to a calm and deliberate
consideration of the subject. I think that the forcing
on the part of the Government the assent of the House
to that peculiar qualification which they think best, or
on the other side a peremptory and abrupt rejection of
it, would be equally impel tic, and with regard to a Bill
like this, concerning the whale interest of Ireland,
whoever bears the blame of prelonging in I, eland
unnecessarily the state of excitement which at present
exists there, would be deeply responsible to Ireland
and the country. I do not therefore propose to
delay the proceeding with this Bill beyond the
period when it can be fully considered. It is
of importance that it should go into Committee in
sufficient time for the Bill to pass this Session.
I should propose therefore to take the discussion in
Committee in the first week after the Easter holidays
—(Murmurs on the Conservative side, and Ministe•
rial cheers)—and I propose that the Order of the
Day be now read, for the purpose of its being postponed,
and I should propose to postpone it tell Friday, tl:e
23d.—(Renewed murmurs.) I see the Right Hon.
Geatleman, the Member for Montgomery, and some
others, seem to think that an unreasonable postpone-
ment, but my own opinion is, that to force on the dis-
cussion of this question without due consideration would
disappoint the reclines of the country.—(Hear, hear.)
Lord STANLEY immediately rose, and said—Sir,
I must confess that I share 1 irgely in the surprise—
(Tremendous cheering)—which has been expressed by
my Hon. Friends around and behind me, at the propo-
sition which has been made by the Noble Lord, and the
course which it is intendel to pursue on the part of the
Government.—(Renewed -cheering.) Not that, we do
not think—ter we have avowed it and declared it—
that the information on which the Noble Lord in-
tended to proceed with his Bill was so meagre and so
inconclusive as to be wholly insufficient for the founds.
tion of a measure of such importance—(Cheers)—nest
that we do not think that the information, so far as it
went in its meagreness it Fe f, would tend to destroy
the principle and the propositions of the Bill of the
Noble Lord ; but I at least do fe el astonishment that
upon a subject of this immense importance, when
the Noble Lord himself presses upon us the
importance of the gi e gest consideration, fie
greatest deliberation, and the greatest caution, at
the commencete eat of the Session, and before arty
notice had been given from any quarter, her 1113jesty's
Government should have ventured to submit to the
consideration of the HoUse a detailed proposal for a
measure of this extent, involving such interests, ex-
citing such hopes and anxieties, and t at at the
expiration of one fortnight from that time, her Majesty's
Government should comedown to the House and tell you
that the information they had given you is all the infor-
mation they themselves possessed.---(An ironical cry of
tt Hear, hear," from the Ministerial benches.) Is it
not all the information they possess ?—(Loud cheering
on the Tory side of the House.) Sir, I assume that
the Government in giving us the information they have
furnished would give us all that it was in their power to
furnish.—( Hear, hear.) If they have not, they have
deluded and deceived the House—(Loud cheers)—
in calling upon Parliament to sanction a measure not
only upon evidence confessedly imperfect, but upon evi-
dence more imperfect than it was in their power to
afford.—(Cheers.) But I assume they have co more
evidence, and than I say, for a Government after talk-
ing about the caution and deliberation necessary to be
observed upon a measure of this sort, it does
seem to me the height of rashness t bring forward
such a question, and to submit it in the form of a pro-
position, to be supported by the Government upon in-
formation which they now tell you they feel to be in-
sufficient to guide the decision or to sanction the vote
of this House.—(Cheers.) I came down, naturally
expecting that the Noble Lord having admitted, and
having contended almost as strenuously as I did
for the removal of the evils involved in the sys-
tem of registration, 'but feeling that there were
still greater evils thea that system of registration, natnely,
the uncertainty of the law, and if there was greater evil
than that, it was the restriction of the franchhe, I
naturally concluded that the Noble Lord, having
the recess to consider this matter, having con-
sulted with his colleagues, and having brought
forward a Bill which had received the sanction of the
Cabinet, and was a Government measure, would be pre-
pared to vindicate and defend the propositions they had
avowed and put forth as the foundation, as the princi-
ple, and, as the Right Hon. Gentleman the Secretary
at War said, the very essence of the measure.—(Cheers.)
And Sir, I must not permit the Noble Lord to take
the notice he has done of the statements made on this
side of the House without pointing out the difference
in those statements. He tells us that it is admitted
that the Poor-law valuation is a desirable test of the
franchise. Now I tell the Noble Lord that in the sense
in which it is so used by the other side of the House it
will be no such thing.—(Cheers.) Because the basis of
his Bill is excluding altogether the test of the 10/.
profit which was the basis and foundation of tho mea-
sure which that day ten years, the Noble Lord sub-
mitted
to the consideration of Parliament. —(Cheers. )
The Noble Lord in his Bill, excludes from it alto-
gether the value of the test of rating, and
he put in its place that gratification which
any pauper may acquire. As a test of the
nett annual value of the property, the difference
between which and the rent paid in the beneficial
interest, a rate subjecting the party to taxation, is a
valuable check, It is important to limit the value
of the franchise held, but unless the amount paid
for holding was combined, it was no real test.
came down prepared to give the Noble Lord a
nth:t i
e give
Nobleev , e
ttandto
e
N
e Lord shall
rdhas
so
pursuedi t no w notwithstanding the
preparedcours
whoihehlo
ILaorardasndoetiscireoutshacts
anyon geonien,gwibnetno
13rituliamlli be perfectly ready to meet the Noble Lord,
a whenint
Committee
misypen intention
those.
et ol a u
ra
sk e h
of
relative to the 5/. rating f anch Ise in counotifets,tehaendseStnhsileel
r
stol.thaokuesettieoldtenof the Committee
infranchisetowns, an and it is my intention
reading elauses I have stated to the Nobleothose two
upon
dth
I should take would mainly depend on the courserteakcoeunrbsye
the Noble Lord. I give the Noble Lord credit for
his ingenuity—(Cheers)—in thisloreigapt e lateostsponement,
thereby placing his Bill and n
period of the Session as to cause the
a
to be defeated by the mere lapse of time
Sir, I do not hesitate to say that I entertain great
suspicion as to the motive which has induced the Noble
Lord to take this step—(Cheers from the Opposition
benches)—and at the same time the Noble Lord, in
taking this course, is well aware of the disadvantages
we
to which
to
when
press ht forwardeh
the Noble
sNubojbeet
thes
rwould inform the House
most plausibly that he has had the second reading of his
eby endeavouring to compel
second reading of my Bill at a
Bid sanctioned by a small majority, and that he is
waiting for further information at the earliest period to
be laid before him. (Hear.) Sir, I see the inge
ouiti of the Noble Lord's course of proceed.

Mr. GREENE brought up a report from the Pri-
vate Bills' Committee, stating that the petitioners for the
Manchester and Leeds Railway Bill had not complied
with the standing orders.
Ordered to be referred to the Committee on Stand-
ing Orde7s.
The HON. UENTLEMAN also brought up a report,
stating that th'e petitioners for Vie West Durham Rail-
way Bill had complied with ac standing orders.—
Leave was given to bring in the Bill, which was read a
first time.

Oa the motion of Sir J. P. B. CHICHESTER
the Barnstaple Road Bill was read a second time.
Mr. WYSE presented a petition from the county of
Waterford in favour of Lord llorpcth's Registration
Bill.

Lord F. EGERTON presented a petition from
3,500 inhabitants of the Borough of Salford i❑ favour
of Lord Stanley's Registration Bill.
Mr. Alderman THOMPSON presented a petition
from John Joseph Stockdale complaining of the treat-
ment which he bad experienced from the House, and
praying that his case might be t then into consideration ;
also from an indivieeal of the name of Hughes, Georgo-
yard, Lombard street, complaining, that he bad been
overcharged in the window tax ; also from the county
of Glamorgan a7,ainst the New Poor-law Bill.

Sir R. BATESON presented a petition from the
cow ty of Londonderry in favour of Lord Stanley's Re-
gisti a:ion ail, and against that brought in by the Go-
vernment.

Mr. E. ROCHE presentld a petition against Lord
Stanley's Registration al', and in favour of Lord Mor-
pc th'e, signed by 2,664 t e sons in the county of Cork.
Sir R. H. INGLIS presented petitions from pa-
rishes in the counties of Bedford and St ,fford in fa-
vour of Church Extension.
IRISH REGISTRATION BILL.

Colonel RA WDON presented petitions from places
in the county of Down in favour of the B!11 brought
in by Lord Morpeth, and against that of Lord Stanley.
Colonel WESTENRA presented retitions from the
King's County in favour of Lord Morpeth's, and
against Lord Stanley's Bill.
An lioN. MEMBER prevented a petition from a
place in the county of Surrey against the encouragement
of idolatry in the East Indic?.

Mr. BROTHERTON presented a petition in fa-
vour of the extension of the Copyright Designs Bill.
Mr. O'CONNELL presented nineteen petitions
from several places in Ireluad, praying the House to
adopt the 811 introduced for the' extension of the
registration, and to reject the Bill for its extinction.
Mr. M. PHILIPS presented thirty-five petitions
against the extension of the Copyright Designs Bill.
Mr. H. GRATTAN presented petitions from the
county of Danegal, in favour of the Government mea-
sure for Irish Registration. The Hon. Gentleman
stated ore of the petitions was from four individuals
who complaired they had been forced to sign a petition
in favour of Lord Stanley's Bill by the Magistrates, who
did not disclore to them the nature of the petition ;
one of the petitioners stated, " I never would
have signed the petition above a'luded to
had 1 known the purport of' it, and I thaught no gen-
tleman would have so deceived me." Another said
" When I refused to sign, the Magistrate said be would
write to my landlord, and not only against Ire but any
one the who should refuse ;" and another said advan-
tage had been taken of a loan of money that had been
lent him to induce him to sign the petition. The Hon.
Member raid he had abstained presenting the petition
until he had been twice applied to to do so.
Mr. LABOUCHERE presented a petition from
Messrs. Dugdale and Co., calico-printers, Manchester,
in favour of the Bill for the Extension of Copyright De-
signs.

Mr. HODGES presented a similar petition from Kent.
Sir E. PEEL presented a petition from a place in
Stafford hire in favour of Church Extension.

Mr. SONIERS presented a petition from Sligo in
favour of the Government Registration Bill.

Mr. HAWES prciented a petition from Cambridge
against the power of the Poor-law Commissioners to
compel the appoirAment of Episcopal Chaplains to the
unions.

Sir G. SINCLAIR presented petitions from Scot-
land, praying for the abolition of Church Patronage
in that country.
CANTERBURY ELECTION.

Thu SPEAKER informed the House that one of the
sureties on the Canterbury petition was unobjectionable.

POOR LAWS.

Lord ELIOT gave notice that in Committee on
the Poor-law Bd', he should move a clause that the
landlords of tenemeLti rated under 5/. should be rated
to the Poor-laws instead of the occupiers, and certain
other clauses.

Sir E. KNATCH BULL begged to ask the Noble
Lord the Secretary for the Colonies, whether it was his
intention to bring on the Poor-law Continuance Bill on
Monday next, on which day it was fixed in the order
book. If it was not me ant to bring it on on that day,
it would be convenient if the Noble Lord would state
what day it would be discussed ?
Sir J. RUSSELL did not propose to bring it on on
that day, but he would on Friday or Monday next state
on what day he would proceed with the Bill. The Noble
Lord was proceeding to address the House on another
subject, when he was interrupted by—
Sir JAS. GRAHAM, who said it would be more
convenient if the Noble Lord would answer a question
which he meant to put to him in the first instance.
The House would recollect that in the year 1839
his lion. and Learned Friend the Member for the Uni-
versity of Oxford, and an Hon. and Learned Gentleman,
the Member for the city of Oxford asked the Noble
Lord whether it was the intention of the Government
to grant any pension to Lieutenant M'Cormick, of the
Royal Navy ; and the Noble Lord stated that the Go.
vernment had come to no resolution on the subject.
Now he found, by the Navy Estimates, which were
about to be referred to a Committee of Supply
that night, that a
pension had been granted to Lieute-
nant M'Cormick for wounds received in the servic:.
He wished to ask the Noble Lord what partieulir ser-
vice was it in which the wounds were received for
which the pension was granted, what was the date of
the Order in Council granting it, and whether be had
any objection to lay a copy of it on the table of the
House ?
Lord JOHN RUSSELL said that ho would answer
the questions of the Right Honourable Gentleman as h
precisely as e could. The services on account
of which Lieutenant M'Cormick had been recom-
mended for a pension to the Lords of the Admiralty
were performed by him hnder the command of the
superior Colonial authorities, in the capture of the
Caroline.—(Hear, hear.) That recommendation had
been made to the Lords of the Admiralty at the com-
mencement of the last year. With regard to the Order
in Council, be was not sure of the date, but he would
have no objection to lay it before the House.
REGISTRATION OF VOTERS (IRELAND.)
Lord JOHN RUSSELL then rose, and said—He
was about to state the intentions of her Majesty's Go-
vernment with respect to the Bill of his Noble
, Friend the Chief Secretary for Ireland. He
had thought that subject required some further
consideration, and he was not prepared on the night
of the last division to state the intentions of the Go-
vernment. As the matter was one of so much import-
ance the House would allow him to explain in a few
words the reasons for the motion which he was going
to make to the House. The first consideration related
to the general business of the House ; and on the t
subject he bad considered that they were non
arrived at the first day of March, and that the esti-
mates had not been yet voted, nor had the House gone
into a Committee of Supply. It wus impossible to sit)

THE SUN, LONDON, MONDAY, MARCH 1, 1841

ing ; and seeing the ingenuity of that course of
proceeding, and giving the Noble Lord notice
of the opposition, which I mean to give to the two !e W-
ing principles of his Bill. I will not, under the sur-
prise which this course taken by the Government has
caused to me, as it has to my Henouroble Friends
around me, I will not bind myself abselutely to any day
for the discussion on the second reading of my
Bill. This I will do. I will -postpone the or-
der from this dey to the 24th of March, and
within ten days from the 24th of March, I will
give to the Noble Lord a distinct declaration, whether,
upon full consideration of all the circumstances, it is or
is not my intention on. that day to press forward the se-
cond reading of my 13111.—(Loud cheers.)
On the motion of the NOBLE Loan the Order of
the Day for the second reading of the Irish Registration
Bill was then read, for the purpose of its being post-
poned till the 24th of March.
Lard J. RUSSELL having moved the Order of the
Day for going jute Committee of Supply,
Mr. HUME begged to move for the return of which
he had given notice, and which he thought the more
important, seeing that it was intended to move for a very
large additional force in the course of the evening. The
Hon. Member then moved for " An Address to her
Majesty, that she will be graciously pleased to direct
that there be laid before this House, copies or extracts
of the Correspandence between the Secretary of State
for the Foreign Department and the Governments of
France, Austria, Prussia, Russia, and Turkey, since
1838, respecting the Pacha of Egypt, and the interfe-
rence with the province of Syria."
POST•OFFICE.
Mr. GGULBURN begged to ask a question with
reference to some accounts which bad been lately pre-
sented of the net produce of the Post-office revenue for
the last six or seven years. It would be necessary
to make a short stitement in oreler to render
it intelligible to the House. By a return
presented of the net amount of Post-office revenue
it would appear that tl e amount was 447,000/.
which, as compared with the revenue of the P‘ist-
office for the previous year exhibited a defi-
ciency of 1,200,000/. He had reason to apprehend
that that presented altogether a fallacious view of the
matter, under the . new system, of the Post-office
revenue, and the question he wished to ask the Right
Hon. Gentleman was, whether that view of the subject
was correct in connection with the statement he was
about to make. Of that 447,000/. which had been
paid into the Exchequer a considerable portion was
the revenue derived from official correspondence,
and that, having been vcted by the House, via., in fact,
not a receipt of revenue, but merely a payment on
the one side, and a receipt on the other. T 1 ey
had on the table the month's offici.l corresponder cc,
which amounted to 16,0001., and it would therefore be
evident to the House that 'the official correspondence
fur twelve months woe 1•1 amount to nearly 200,000/.,
which roust be deducted with 470,000/. return as
post-office revenue. But there was another great item
of deduction to be made. It appeared that on the
Ist of January, 1840, the unpaid balance in the hands
of the two collectors of revenue amounted to little short
of 200,000/., and it was quite clear that the balance
in the hands, under the new system, must be
as nothing compared with the former balances
and therefore a further deduction on account of these
unpaid balances must be mad-. Having made these
two deductions, the result would be that instead of
447,000/., the balance to the public credit would be
li:tle more than 40,000/. pr 50,000/.—(Hear, hear.)
He wisher', then, to ask the Right Hon. Gentleman
whether that was not a correct statement of the case,
and whether the statement which he (Mr. Goulburn)
made as to the loss sustained was not as the law
stated it?

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The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQNER said
that if the Right Hon. Gentleman had waited for tho
course of a day or two, he would have had that in-
formation he was so anxious to obtain. The 11:611t.
Honourable Gentleman was perfectly correct in sep-
posing thtt the Exchequer returns included all
the posting of official as well as private documents.
With respect to the amount 200,000/. st c!e l by the
Right Hon. Gentleman opposite, as paid for official
posting under the new system, the sum was not so great.
The Right Hon. Gentleman here proceeded to detail
the difference in the amount of postage paid for official
documents under the new system ; but he spoke in a
tone so indistinct that he was quite inaudible in the
gsllery.
SUPPLY--NAVY ESTIMATES.

Mr. MORE O'FERRALL moved the. Order of
the Day for going into Committee of Supply on the
Navy Estimates for 1841-2.
On the motion that the Speaker do leave the Chair,
Mr. HUME said it was his intention to have sub-
mitted some resolutions respecting the deficient
state of the revenue, as compared with
the expenditure, but he thought it would
be better to hear what the Government
had to say to warrant so large an increase as was now
runtimod in the expanckitura of the. n.vg undor the
circumstances in which were placed. (Cries of
"'Hear, hear.") It was perfectly we'l known that for
the last four years the revenue had been deficient as
regarded the expenditure, in round numbers, four
millions sterling. The returns made on the mo'ion of
the Hon. Member for Harwich, showed the
irregular manner in which this deficiency had been pro-
vided for. But the point to which he (Mr. H.) wished
the attention of the House should be direct d was
that their estimates exceeded by threo and a half mil-
lions those of 1836. They had gone on gradually
increasing them since that time, notwithstanding
tle distressed state of the country.—(Hear.) The
revenue up to April Bth was exactly 283,000/. less this
year than it was last year, notwithstanding the increased
taxation. One of these things must consequently
follow, either the new taxation had failed or some mis-
take had taken place with regard to the accounts
brought up. It was not possible to believe
that in the whole Customs Department
and the whole Excise department, with an addition
of five per cent., and with an addition of ten per cent.
on the assessed taxes, there should be a di fieency this
yell. of 283,0001. He thought the Government ought to
provide some way of supplying the deficiency, and not
to go on adding loan after loan, in order to provide for
this great expenditure. It appeared to him the
House ought to consider if there was any necessity
for continuing this large expenditure at the pre-
sent moment. We _had secured what the Noble
Lord and his colleagues bad gone so madly
madly about in Syria, for a great part of this expense
had been incurred there, and they had been told by
the Queen's Speech their object was attained. If so
clearly there ought to be a decrease in our expenditure,
instead of which there was a considerable increase to
be voted for our naval and military force. He had
as he had said brought down some resolutions to
submit to the House, but it had been suggested
to him it would be better to hear the Govern-
ment statement, and then to print his reselati
and take the sense of the House upon them.
He was determined to submit his propositions to the
House, unless he heard to-night some very satisractory
reason to the contrary.

The House then went into Committee, when
Mr. MORE O'FEItRALL rose to propose the
Navy Estimates for the ensuing year. Before, how-
ever, he went into these estimates he would
state the balance sheet of the year ending the
31st of March, 1640. The excess' of expenditure
(or that year was 29,694/. This was the first vet e
for which he had to move ; and it was right that he
should state to the Committee the circumstances which
rendered that vote necessary. (The Hon. Member was
Leird with difficulty amidst the noise of Members moving
from their places and the cries for " Divide." Mr. Hume
calid out, 1 wish the Right Hon. Gent'em:tn wort .1
speak up—we can't hear a word.—(Hear.) Mr. O'Fer-
rall proceeded—Previous to the year 1832, the
balances of former years were left in the Exchequer
and were applied by the Admiralty to such purposes
as the Lords Commissioners thought proper, and occa-
sionally they were made available for such emergencies
as occurred last year. That was considered a
great abuse ; and was strongly condemned by the Right
Honourable Baronet the Member for Pembroke, inas-
much as the Admir&ty took upon themselves to ape!)
the money voted by Parliament to purposes differeet
from those for which the were designed. When the
Right Honourable Bar net was made First Lord
of the Admiralty he applied himself to re
medy the abuse, and the Act of 1832, the
Ist and 2nd William IV. e. 40 was passed, in
the 3rd section of which it
month of November to the auditors, that
provided that
setthe balance sheet of each year should be in the
h
upon it what comment they thought
did not provide for the disposal of the unappropri-
tafitt. they
But mightthe make
Act.
unappropri-
ated balance ; and it became a subject of
arrangement between the Treasury and the Admiralty.
If any improper expense had been incurred by the Ad-
miralty, they could be be brought to account for it by
the House, and he was ready to defend their conduct os
that head. The first vote was for a sum of 29,694/.
excess of expenditure for the year ending the
3 lst of March, 1840. That balance on a sum
of 5,000,000/, would not, ho thought, be considered
a large one, especially as it was impossible for any one
to calculate precisely the extent of such an
expenditure. The second item would he a
supplemental vote for the sum of 161,5001
He should observe, that in August, September, and Oc-
tober last, great exertions were made in all our dock-
yards, seamen were taken from all the maritime towns and
ships were sent to
every
edquarter
it was of
impossible the orl
to
foresee from day to day what might occur.
wd.
Other Governments had increased their armaments.
The Government, finding that this was the case, was
fleet wee increased, transports were obliged
to be taken up for the conveyance of
reinforcementsincrease
toti ourcolonies,
lepricee The Alediterranran
set Vice had been performed with aa
nit d theexcess wohvoelre
theof et lsitatt.
mates amounting only to 161,900/. He therefore hoped
that the Government would not be considered to have

acted improperly. He now came to the estimates of
the present year, and he fe3l under considerable
difficulty in approaching the subject, as he wai
about to ask the Committee for a large increase,
if he did not recollect that for the last six
)eare, whenever the Navy Estimates had been
brought forward, the Government had been blimel for
not asking enough.—(Hear, hear.) The Govern-
ment had not been influenced by those attacks to
ask for more than they thought was required—neither
would they be prevented from asking for a large
increase, where they thought it might be necessary. In
bringing forward the estimates he shall cautiously
abstain from the introduction of any topics which
did not properly belong to the Estimates, believing as
he did that the question of the Navy Estimates should
be discussed without anything like party feeling,
as a question which was interesting to all men of
all pasties throughout the nation.—(Loud cheers.)

(LEFT SPEAKING.)

TATTERSA LL'6-THI `'EKING.

0 '
HALF-PAST SIX
O'CLOCK.
THE DERBY.

18 to agst Rosalia—taken
16 to agst Coronation—taken
20 to 1 agst Eringo—taken
4 to 1 agst Scott's lot—offered
30 to 1 agst Wellington
33 to 1 ag,t Str Hans
35 to 1 agst Mongclian—taken
20 to 1 agst Soult
25 to 1 ag,t Ralph
30 to 1 agst Wahab
50 to 1 agst Joachin—taken
50 to 1 rg.t Nob—taken
50 to 1 ags: Ermengsrdis—tsken
50 to 1 agst Belgrade—taken
50 to I agst Danotev a —tAken
2000 to 40 Pgst Knigh sbridge
25 to 1 agst Whistle—taken
20 to 1 agst Palwreon—taken
23 ti 1 vv. CarAdoc--taken
500 (Yen Coronation and Palrernan aga Rosalie and
Cameleon—taken
1000 to 15 agst Filehley
2000 to 40 agst M raing Star—taken

COAL MARKET.--(THIS

last market day, .C 7.

s. e.
P.nitop Windsor' . 37 6
lanlield M00r....
Tan tied Moor Butes l7 ti
Willlngton A 9
Wylain
Walls End Ferric e and Co :2l ti
Wslls End Clennell
walla End .;osfo th
Walls frut Heaton
Walls End Hilda ..... .......• 21 U
Walls End Hotspur • 0 0
Walls End Killinsworth :1 3

ACCIDENT ON THE GREAT WESTERN RAIL-
WAY.-An accident tf a fa•cl nature, ari!ing from cue -
sive carelessness en the part of the unfortutia'e deceaFel,
occurred at the Steventon station, to a man upwarqs cf
sixty years of age, on till afternoon of Thursday let, who
was knocked down (as he was inca.itiously cros!ing the
li•te) by the half past four o'clock train from Wocton
Bassett to Paddington. The poor ftllow, who get his
living by selling fruit, WAS struck by a projecting portion of
the engine on the 11,1td, and his death nau,t have been in-
gtntaneous ; for, upon his re3e'ving immediate assistance,
life was found to be extinct, arising from a stvei.e wound
on head. But very few• drops of blood oozed from the
wound. It should be observe.' that there is a footpath
which crosses 1112 lines at the place where the accident oc-
curred, where the Company's men arc stationed to endea-
vour to prevent accidents occurring through the careless-
ness of the public.
_ _

STRANGE BRIDEGROOM.—A couple I)resented
themselves before ti,e eurtve of Wrexham Church on the
morning of Tuesday last, to be joined together in the holy
bonds of matrimony. The service hal proceeded to that
part ( f the ceremany nhlre the minister calls upon the
bridcgriom to say Pfter him, " 1, A. B. take thee, C. D.,
to be my wedded wife," when the man, instead of re-
peating the words, said, " I well, I'll have her."
The minister remonstrated With him, and told him
to repeat the exact words after him, as above m:n
tioned. The man, however, peristed in his manner
of reply, and saio, " I !Null, I'll have her." Tha clLrk,
thinking he had some impediment in his speech, whispered
to him softly to repeat the words aft r the Curate, but
without effect. The man conri,rued t) reply as before;
and the Curate, who said he was an obs'iiate fellow, re-
fused to proceed with the ccromony. The parties came
from Church unmarried. The man is a potter, and lives
in the Walks, Wrexham,—Carnarvon Herald.
PUBLIC INCOME AND EXPENDITURE.—A re-
turn has been male to the House of Commons, showing
the total net income and expenditure of the Ur ited King.
dom for the last four years, from which it appears that the
excess of expenditure over income amounted in 1837 to
655,7601, in 1838 to 315,2281., in 1839 to 1,512,7921.,
and in 1840 to 1,593,970/. ; making a total of 4,107,7501

POLICE INTELLIGENCE.

GUILDHALL.

CtionctuitATEs.--This Ra; a casr.„ which stood by
spe;.:ialadjournmeat for boring on Saturd Ay, Oursuant to
summonses which hAd been issued undr the statute
531 George 111., cap. 127, entill:d "An Au for the
bLtter regulatiqn of the Ecclesiastical Courts of Eng-
hnd ; and for the more easy recovery of Church miff."
Mr. Teague appeared for the parish, Mr. Edwards for
the appcilintF, via., M. Heath and Mr. Crooks,
householders in Fetter-lane, in the parish of Si. Dan•
star's in tlsc West.

Mr. Sloan, one of the Churchwardeas of the parish,
tAted that he had made a demand of 18g. for church-
rates, of M-. Crooks and Mr. Heath, and payment
was refused. The rate was made as far back as the
12th of June, 1839.

By Mr. Edwards.—We have collected part of the
rate. The collector having made his demand, I made
mice afterwards, and produced the resolution of the
Vestry, which gave me authority.
Sir P. LAURIE wished to know why the rate was
objected to as to its validity ?
Mr. Edwards considered that certain moneys and es-
tates had inea left fur the proper repair of the church,
and that such donations and bequests had been applied
to other purposes—purposes contrary to the testamen-
tary grant ; hence, he contended, that in point of law,
no legal claim could be made upon his clients. It was
said by the respectable gentlemen to whom he was op-
posed—" We have granted annuities upon the funds
you allude to," but that was no answer.
Sir PETER LAURIE—We must have evidence before
we can proceed any further.
Mr. Sloan said he was born in the parish 59 years
ago, and had had something to do wi.h the manage-
ment of its affairs during the last four or five years.
Mr. Edwards (int2rposing)-1 gave Mr. Teague no-
tice to produce certain books, but he has not ; there-
fore. I am entitled to give secondary evidence.
Mr. Teague—Mr. Edwards requires books and do-
cuments so Er back as 1808. We do not produce
them, and we act undee the advice of a learned civihan.
Sir PETER LAURIE thought that the opinion of the
most learned doctors could have no weight as the matter
at present stood. Sir P. Laurie wished to know whe-
ther the appellants went to church, a-rd were seat-
holders ?—Mr. Churchwarden Sloan—Cert rinly not,
your worship.
Mr. Edwards—My clients are Churchmen in the
strict sense of the word. They do not, however, go to
this Church on account of the bickering. there have
been.—(Skame.)
Mr. Seeley, a respectable inhabitant said that he
understood from what he had heard that the resist-
ance of payment arose from the notion of a misappro-
priation of funds.
Mr. Elwards—Certainly. _ _ .

Mr. Seeley—Then we have no objection to go to the
Ecclesiastical Court, to show how wu haYQ disposed of
those funds.

After some further conversation, the Magistrates
(Sir Peter Laurie and Sir Chapman Marshall) confirmed
the rate.

The case of Mr. Crooks, the other appcd:a!lt, was
called on, and the same adjudication made without
observation by solicior on either side.
Mr. Edwards then gave notice that he should g:va
notice to the Magistrates who had heard the case of
his intention to apply to the Court of Queen's Bench
for an order, but would leave the other party to apply
to the Spritual Court, if they thought fit.
Here the matter (mica for the present.