The Sun.
London, England, 1846-02-28 00:00:00

(Cheers.) The Hon. Member has made a very extraordinary '
statement with respect to Mr. Wilson—a statement which he
has been afraid to make in a court of justice.
Mr. FER RAND—isio, no.
Mr. BRIGHT—Does the Hon. Member recollect that he
once charged Mr. Wilson and Mr. Rawson, at a meeting held
at Liverpool, which he himself addressed, as being present at a
meeting at which a proposition was made for committing the
frightful crime of assassination ? Does he recollect that Mr.
Rawson wrote to the solicitors of the Hon. Member to ascer-
tain if he (Mr. Ferrand) was prepared to stand by the state-
ments he had made. The Hon. Member stated that he was
prepared to stand by theth, as reported in tine lifornins Post
newspaper. Mr. RaVlson's solicitor, Mr. Tolson, of Bradford,
wrote to the Hon. Member's solicitor, stating that it was Mr.
Rawson's intention to bring an action for defamation, and asking
whether the Hon. Member would give, in addition that the
statement of the Morning Post was the one which he was pre-
pared to stand by, in order to obviate the inconvenience of pro-
secuting the newspaper, and the Hon. Member intimated that
Ise would agree to give a guarantee to the proprietor of the
Morning Post to save him harmless from the effect of an
action. When Mr. Wilson and Mr. Rawson wrote to the
Morning Post, the proprietors of that newspaper stated
that they ought not to be prosecuted because they had merely
reported in their columns the speech of the Hon. Member for
Knaresborough (Mr. Ferrand), and that he had not given
them the guarantee that he had stated.—(Cheers.) Every
particle of that statement was as untrue as anything ever ut-
tered by any Hon. Member, or by any one on the face of the
earth. It would have been proved untrue in a court of jus-
tice, but the Hon. Member durst not go into it. With respect
to the charges which the Hon. Member has brought against
Lee --
rL'. FERRAND interrupted the Hon. Member by inquir-
ing why Mr. Wilson and Mr. Rawson did not proceed with
their action ?
Mr. I3RIG HT—I will state why the prosecution was not
followed. The Anti-Corn-law League appealed to the public
through the means of general discussion. —( Cheers, and cries
of " Oh, oh.") They would scorn, every man of them. to
go into a court of justice against an editor who, in the
fulfilment of a great and meritorious duty to the public in
general, publishes in his columns good and, I must say, bad
speeches also—( Hoar, hear)—for he had inserted the
speech of the Honourable Member in which these
unfounded statements were made. The Hon. Member
had referred to the condition of the people of the towns of
Rochdale and Bolton, and had intimated his opinion that they
were in a sad and miserable condition. Now, he did not want
any certificate from the Hon. Member for the feeling of the
people of those towns, for the people of Rochdale were well
acquainted with any small merits which he might possess ;
they knew him intimately, and with regard to the Hon. Mem-
ber for Knaresborough, he would venture to assert that Roch-
dale was the last place in the county where the Hon. Gentle-
man would be received with cordiality. The Hon. Gentleman
must have come recollection of the reception which he met
with the last time he wade is appearance there, and he thought
that the present statement was quite as unfounded as those
which had appeared in the newspaper to which he had refer-
red ; and he would go further, and assert, if he might be
allowed to use language which was found upon the journals of
the House, and would say that the statement of the Hon.
Member was calumnious, and absurd, and unfounded altogether.
—( Loud cheers from the League benches.)
Dr. BOWRING thought that he was called upon to say a
few words respecting the statement made the other night by
the Hon. Member for Knaresborough, and they should be a
very few words. The Hon. Gentleman complained that he
had not risen to answer him the moment be had sat down ; the
fact was that he was unable to reply at that time, for he was
not present at the termination of the Hon. Member's speech.
The Hon. Member had, in the course of his observations,
used expressions which intimated that the labouring portion
of the community of Bolton and its immediate neighbourhood
were badly clad, badly fed, and badly housed, and were con-
tent with any accommodation. In connexion with these
assertions he had used the name of Mr. Henry Ashworth,
and had stated that that gentleman had been the instrument
of introductng a large portion of the inhabitants from the
agricultural population; he had further, its connexion with
this transaction, employed a term in the highest degree
offensive—he had called this a cold-blooded act. Now he
wished to disconnect the name of Mr. Ashworth from any
such term ; and he would take the liberty of referring to the
Noble Lord the Member for Newark (Lord John Manners), who
was intimately acquainted with the condition of the whole
population of the town, and was perfectly compe-
tent to form a correct judgment upon it. He
knew the condition of the people who were all dependent
upon him. And he was quite willing to leave the whole
case in the hands of the Noble Lord, and to let the truth of
his statement be tested with that of the Hon. Member.

Mr. ROEBUCK, who was extremely inaudible in the
commencement of his remark, and was understood to observe,
that he considered he was justified by all the rules of that
House in presuming that an Hon. Member, who had occu-
pied the last two hours and a half of the debate, in a very
fierce attack on Hen. Members at that side of the House, and
on persons out of it, would in mere fairness have been 'in his
place to hear the answer to be made to his vituperation.—
( Hear, hear.) He would not say one word of the attack
the Hon. Gentleman had made upon him for his failure in
life. But he would say in all his misfortunes, it had never
been his fate to have a body of gentlemen assembled in
England to declare that which he had stated to have been afalse-
hood and a calumny. There was a resolution now remaining
on the books of the House which would descend to posterity—
that a Member of that House had been guilty
of an infamous calumny on two other Members.
—(Hear, hear.) The Hon. Member said that he founded his
belief on a resolution passed by certain persons in the town of
Rochdale. But he (Mr. Roebuck) believed the resolution of
the House of Commons, which was just to the same effect.—
(Cheers.) The Hon. Member never denied—he had never
answered it ; and as long as it remained on the books of that
House the Hon. Gentleman was welcom • to make whatever
statement he wished. He (Mr. Roebuck) was perfectly
satisfied so that such statement was afterwards weighed in the
balance of the good sense of the House. That was his (Mr.
Roebuck's) answer.—(Hear, hear.) One word as regarded
what had been said by the Hon. Baronet (Sir R. Inglis) op-
posite. He stated that he heard him (Mr. Roebuck) employ
personalities in that House. Why, if he did use them, or if he
made charges against Hon. Gentlemen, he succeeded in
proving them—( Hear, hear)—and if such could be termed a
personality, why so could an indictment.—(Hear, hear.) fie
charged Hen. Members with corrupt practices, and he proved
his charge.—(" No, no," from a Gentleman opposite.) He
appealed to the resolution of the Committee, who, without a
division, fully convicted Hon. Gentlemen, and, amongst the
rest, the Hon. Member who cried " No."—( Hear. )
Mr. DISRAELI should say he was one of those who very
much regretted that his Hon. Friend the Member for Knares-
borough should think it his duty to make an attack on mem-
bers of the agricultural body ; and he should say
that he (Mr. Disraeli) differed with the Honour-
able Gentleman in his views en that subject.—( Hear.)
He had often remonstrated with him on the subject ' • but he
should say this, that his Hon. Friend the Member for Knares-
borough was prepared to say the same outside the walls of that
House that he said within them.—(Hear, hear.) Such was
his Hon. Friend's conviction, and he believed that he 'slits
merely fulfilling his duty in acting as he did.—( firer, hear.)
Now, that being the case, he (Mr. Disraeli) could not see,
from the way in which the Hon. Meraber for Knaresborough
acted, how he had done anything to call for the marked ex-
pression of disapprobation at the ands of that House.—( Hear,
hear.) Now, with regard to the name of another gentleman,
Mr. George Wilson, chairman of the Ant i- Coin-law League,
be (Mr. Disraeli) had a few words to say. He believed Mr.
Wilson to be a very good sort of pers on —( Hear)—and, no
doubt, when better known was better liked.—( Hear, and a
laugh). He believed that for a series of years, he was an
agitator, and had expressed his opinions on public men and
measures with little reserve ; and he was surprised that that
gentleman, or his representatives, should think fit to show their
thin skin on the present occasion.—( Hear, hear, and a
laugh). Now, as to the resolutions of committees, and
such stories, he (Mr. D'lsraeli) did not want to listen to them,
because he was as prejudiced on one side as his Hon. Friend
was on the other. —( Hear, hear.) As regarded Mr. Ash-
worth, he should ssy that he knew sufficient of his family to
bear testimony that it was one which was not alone a credit but
an honour to the country.---( Loud cries of " Hear, hear," from
both sides of the House. ) Was it desirable that everybody
in that House should be of the opinion, or that Hen. Members
having different prejudices should not express them. He
really however thought that his Hon. Friend the Member for
Knaresborough had the best of the argument.—( Cheers.)
He (Mr. Disraeli) deprecated attacks on absent individuals,
who were, perhaps, as worthy men as any in the country._
(Cheers from the Liberals)—but still he thought that his Hon.
Friend had substantiated his position in the view he had
taken.—( Cheers.) The Hon. Member for Durham, for the
city of Durham, had made a confused statement with respect
to an accusation which had been urged against his Hon. Friend
because he had accused certain Members of the Anti-Corn law
League of being assassins. He would not take it on himself to
decide whether the Members of the Anti-Corn-law League
should have prosecuted his Hon_ Friend or the newspapers,
but this he did know, that he had heard the members
of the Anti-Corn-law League accused of tieing
assassins by a most distinguished individual in that House—
(Tremendous cheering)—who they were very ready to support
on that occasion.—( Continued cheering.) Why not prosecute
the Right Hon. Baronet?—( Laughter and reiterated cheering.)
Why not at once strike at the monarch of the wood, instead of
preying upon the smaller deer ?—( Cheers.) If they wished
to vindicate their characters from the stigma of being assassins,
they could always have ample opportunity, by referring to the
pages of Hansard; and as he had no doubt that the Right Hon.
Gentleman would give a guarantee to his solicitor to defend the
action, they might prosecute him immediately.—( Shouts of
laughter.) He th fight that too much had seen made by the
Hon. and Learned Member for Bath of a resolution come to by
the House some two years ago, with regard to his Hen Friend. i
—( Hear, hear.) He (Mr. Disraeli) had thought that the
most ridiculous resolution the House had ever arrived at.—
( Hear, hear.) He believed that the Right Hon. Baronet was
very averse to bringing it before the; House. The Right Hon.
Gentleman hail himself a natural sense for humour, and he
did all he could to prevent these proceedings.—(Hear, hear.)
He stated that he had no desire to go on, but the whole had
originated in the quarter of the House in which everything
disagreeable always originated, namely, with the Hon. and
Learned Member for Bath.—( Cheers and laughter.) And
when the Honourable and Learned Member described,
with that dramatic effect which was so worthy of
a minor theatre— ( Roars of laughter)—the horrible
consequences of that resolution (Loud laughter)
and declared that his Hon. Friend had uttered a calumnious
statement, he ought to have looked to the Hon. and Learned
Member for Cork (Mr. O'Connell) who had been placed in a
somewhat similar predicament. He (Mr. Disraeli) was in
the House at the time, and he understood that some statements
of the Hon. and Learned Member were supposed to calum-
niate certain Members of the! House, and he ( Mr. Disraeli)
believed that he was reproved by the predecessor of the Right
Hon. Gentleman, who tilled the Speaker's chair. He would
not make a point of that resolution ; he would leave his Hon.
Friend and the Hon. and Learned Member for Bath to deal
with it as they liked.—( Laughter.) But if his Hon. Friend
would only follow his (Mr. Disraeli's) example, never to abuse
any one—( Roars of laughter, which continued for several
seconds j—if he did se he (Mr. Ferrand) would never be put
in the position in which he had been repeatedly and unjustly
placed.—( Hear, hear.) The Hon. and Learned Member for
Bath, who talked so much of gentlemanly proceedings, and
referred to the resolution formerly passed, should apply those
observations and that resolution to his own case, lie said that
he never spoke with unnecessary acerbity, or acted in a per-
sonal and unbecoming manner. This was not the fact. It
was not the first time that he had violated the rules of the
House and offended gentlemanly manners. He (Mr. Disraeli)
knew not of one case, but of repeated instances, in which he
tribqte corrupt intentions
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(the Hon. and Learned Gentleman) had accused himself (Mr.
Disraeli) of the most improper and corrupt motives. Various
have been the occasions on which the Hon. and Learned
Member would immediately get up and impute motives and at-
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Ahis speeches—.(Laughter and cheers.)
and Learned Gentleman says that he has never
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