The Sun.
London, England, 1846-06-26 00:00:00

their Coercion Bill in the House of Lords ; to that assertion no
answer has as yet been submitted.— (Hear, hear.) An entire
month elapsed before the Bill was brought forward, and you
cannot say that your Bill was not ready—it consists of no more
than three pages.—( Hear, hear.) And when that Bill came
down from the House you did not suggest any good reasons
why it should not have passed before your Corn Bill. The
Irish ports were opened for the importation of Indian corn ;
you ought to have given a protection for life before you took
protection from corn. But there exists no necessity for the
Bill ; and if you examine the statements made by the Hon.
Baronet, you must see that there has been no case made. In
the Queen's speech it was stated that of late the crime of as-
sassination has been of frequent perpetration ; and when the
Right Hon. Baronet the Home Secretary introduced the mea-
sure, he stated distinctly that the disturbances were confined
to five counties, and by a few ruffians in those counties, and
that the mass of the people were untainted. The Right Hon.
Baronet further said that in those counties which were tainted
the crimes were committed by bands of ruffians, but that the
number of persons in those lands were insignificant when com-
pared with the great body of the people. He then went
on to say that the effect of the Bill would be
to punish the districts where crime occurred by causing
them to maintain the force requisite to maintain order; and
now I ask, has a case been made out for this Bill—have any
substantial facts been put forward to show you that a Bill of
this kind, which is to last three years, should receive your con-
sent—and has a case been made out for the original conclusion
of this Bill, which, when it was first introduced, was intended
to be imposed everlastingly upon Ireland, and to be incorpo-
rated with the instituticus of the country ?—(Cheers. ) I turn
now to the speech made by the Noble Lord the Secretary for
Ireland. That speech consisted in a catalogue of the offences—and
I am not disposed to dispute the accuracy of the statement of the
Noble Lord but he d.d not point out the efficacy of the
remedy, nor had it been attempted to show how this measure
would prevent crime in Ireland. How is it that nocturnal
coercion will prevent diurnal outrage ? if you cage the owls,
what is to become of the falcons ?—( Loud cheers.) The Noble
Lord said that the Arms Bill had completely failed. When
that statement was made, the Secretary for the Home Depart-
ment signified by his look that he thought that the Noble Lord
had come in a state of nature from the woods and forests—

(Laughter and cheers)—and that he stood in need of the finely
wrought integuments of the mind which are so abundantly
supplied in the Home-office.—(Cheers.) But the admission is
one of the utmost importance. We cannot but recollect the fierce
contentions of party which took place upon this very Arms' Bill,
and if you look at Hansard you will find that two or three
volumes are occupied with it. You then conceived that we
were then influenced by factious motives. We rest our
present predictions on the truth of our former vaticinatious.
You ask, what is to be done ? You say that the measure is
indispensible, and you have undertaken to show that a great
part of these evils can be cured by the force of this law. The
Crown Solicitor for the county of Tipperary, does not reside
in the county. He has the whole province of Leinster in the
range of his professional employment. He goes down twice a
year to the sessions and remains a few days. He is utterly
ignorant of the locality—he is utterly ignorant of the character
of the witnesses—utterly ignorant of the characters of the
defendants—so that it is impossible that he should know
anything of the parties.—( Hear, bear.) The cases are
given to the counsel to the Crown ; and of the counsel
to the Crown I say nothing more than this—that the counsel
employed by the prisoner are generally superior, incomparably
superior ; and the Hon. Gentleman the Recorder for the City
of Dublin will admit that what I now say is perfectly true.
But I can give a stronger proof that I am right in the view
I take of the case. You have, again and again, referred to the
evidence of Mr. Cahill, and the Noble Lord the Secretary to
the Lord-Lieutenant has referred to Mr. Cahill twice. The
Prime Minister has referred to his evidence, and the Hon.
Secretary for the Home Departmen has, no doubt, read his
evidence. Mr. Cahill, at the commencement of his
examination, said—and you must admit the import-
ance of its bearing on this question You are
aware that in Tipperary there is a court called the Court of
Assize. The president of this court is Mr. Leigh Howley ; in
consideration of his services the office was given to him. Mr.
Leigh Howley is assisted by Mr. Cahill ' • and what has been
the result? The face of the county of Tipperary in which
crime was prevalent, and which was the scene of so much
bloodshed, has been materially changed. Mr. Cahill was exa-
mined on that point, and in his evidence he said that these
facts had been considerably reduced. The superior administra-
tion of the laws had created a disposition of confidence
amongst the people. If there be any truth in his evidence, I
think that it affords a strong proof that this is not
a measure which we should resort to as we are about to do.
There are other and political considerations connected with
this important question, which you ought not to dismiss from
your mnds—namely, the effect that this measure will have in
stimulating political agitation ; a remedy for which you have
wished so much, and which you have taken such small pains
to find. Never hasten this measure, but give the measure its
due weight. You ought to consider with the deepest attention,
the fact, that in any measure intended for Ireland, there
never was such great caution indispensable—( Hear,
hear.) The repeal of the corn-laws in Ireland
ought to make you beware how you administer to the popular
excitement.—(" Hear," from the Ministerial benches.) Let
me be permitted to explain myself. There are in Ireland two
great parties in the constitution—the proprietors of the soil and
those who till it. Neither of these parties want intelligence;
their powers are developed. These two parties are both affected
by this measure ; the interest of the one party, and the passions
of the other. lam one of those who think that the repeal of
the corn-law will ultimately be a benefit to Ireland, because I
am confident that what is for the prosperity of one country
must be for the prosperity of another. Ido not think that the
measure is overvalued, but such is not the impression of the
Protestant gentry of Ireland. They conceive that you do them
wrong. They think that you have begun an attack on them,
by depriving them of their market, and putting them on a foot-
ing with Holland and Belgium, and relaxing one of the laws of
the country. I admit that they err in their judgment to a great
extent, but at the same time you must remember that the
Right Hon. Baronet wished the repeal of the corn-laws would
have a certain effect upon Ireland, and at the same time he has
relieved Ireland from the payment of 200,000/., which was
pressing on her manufactures, thereby admitting that a
certain encumbrance will be the effect of this Bill. Many an
old Cromwellian, long bending under the burdens of his mort-
gages, will now fall under the burden as soon as the repeal
of the corn-laws comes into operation. It seems to
me to be in some degree impolitic on your part that you will
by this measure excite the alarm of that class of men on whom
you have hitherto relied for support, and that you should also,
at the same time, administer to the excitement of the popular
party. The Secretary-at-War used, when speaking on this
subject, the words " dismemberment of. the empire," and my
Hon. Friend the Member for Kilkenny, who was fired by the
spark, remonstrated with him on the subject. My Hon. Friend
has no intention of dismembering the empire. My Hon.
Friend said that in his opinion, the repeal of the Union was
calculated to produce that result. If that be the case, and
the dismemberment of the empire will be the result of the
repeal of the Union, you would be including both countries
in one common ruin. Is it not the consummation of
impolicy on our part to furnish those champions
of repeal, with an opportunity to impose on Ireland a law
which no Minister was sufficiently adventurous to impose upon
the country for the purl uses of protection. No English
Minister would have ventured to impose such a law on this
country. No English Minister would have imposed such a law
upon South Lancashire, where the same state of things has
existed. Was it suggested to impose such a law on South
Lancashire when, in 1319, the six Acts were fruPd,
and when large bodies of men were disciplined Jith
a view to military organization. Look afterwards in the year
1830, to the state of Kent, and five other counties in the
south of England, and at the system of incendiarism which
then prevailed. Was any such measure attempted to be im-
posed as that on which the Government are now resolved?
On a measure of this kind the Secretary for the Home De-
partment, then Mr. Peel, would have made out with Parlia-
mentary definitions, the necessity for forwarding a measure of
this kind, and might have described the various reasons
alluding to the crimes which had occurred in England
as an inducement to pass the "English Conservation Bill."
No such measure was ever adopted with respect to Wales.
You did not adopt any measure of this kind in Wales. You
acted on the honourable principle, on which the incorporation
of Wales with England is founded, and which Mr. Burke, in
a speech which he made, praised as an immortal paction.
Why is it that we are considered unworthy of the privileges of
Englishmen ? Are we less entitled to the rights of British
subjects ? I am afraid to tell the truth, that you are in-
fluenced by the spirit of your ancient masterdom. It
appears to me to be the great fault of English
statesmen, that they ought to observe that a vast change
has taken place in the character of the Irish people, for in this
case the Union has contributed much to he education of the

people. Again, and again, I refer to the progress of education
in Ireland. You have given a high price for their education,
but you ought to have looked at its results. Perhaps, you
imagined that the education of the people of Ireland could not
be attended by any important political consequer ce. You
were mistaken, for you will find in their cabins, books con-
taining narrative; and passages of sublime morality, and
catechisms of the fortunes and history of the country.
It appears to me that there is no occasion for the passing of this
Bill. I call upon you to reject the Bill, because there is no
evidence of its necessity. There is no proof that the Bill will
obtain its purpose—there is no sort of evidence to show that
the Bill will be more snccessful than those which have pre-
ceded it. As there is no necessity for the further abolition of
that great principle on which the union rests, and because
there is an intention to avail themselves of that union for the
purpose of inflicting on the Irish people that against which the
Irish empire remonstrates, I, for one, shall vote against the
Bill.
The SOLICITOR-GENERAL said he would not attempt
to follow the Right Hon. Gentlemau through his very discur-
sive speech, but he would attempt to show to the House that
the present measure was called for in Ireland for the protection
of the lives and property of the peaceably disposed. (The Hon.
Member from this moment was perfectly inaudible in the gal-
lery for above a quarter of an hour.) Measures of this descrip-
tion had proved successful before, and he, for one, could not
see why this one should not do so. In 1835 the number of
crimes committed in Ireland was 8,000, and the consequence
was, the Legislature passed a Coercion Bill. It proved effi-
cacious, and in 1837 the number of crimes had fallen to 6,000.
A motion was then made to repeal the Act, but its working
had proved so satisfactory-that only three Members could be
found to support it. The Bill eventually ceased to be opera-
tive, and since that time crime had progressively increased;
indeed, in 1845, it had reached 8,025 more even than in 1835.
Could any executive in this state of things sit still without at-
tempting to apply a remedy—and what better remedy, he asked
could they find than that which was dietated by experience?—
(Hear, hear.) Another reason which rendered it imperatively
necessary for them to make an effort to apply a remedy was
that in no country in the world did the number of crimes corn-
mittesl bear such a disproportion to the number of offenders
brought to justice as in Ireland,—(Hear, hear.) In disturbed
districts, out of 1,185 crimes committed last year, only 54 of
the perpetrators were brought to justice. (Hear, hear. )
Not less than 1,000 outrages had taken place in five counties in
Ireland within the period of five months, and surely in such a
state of things the inhabitants of Ireland—the industrious and
suffering inhabitants—were
entitled to protection. The
Learned Solicitor-General then r'ad a list ofcritm es committed
in that country for five months in 1845, and he
in 1846, defining the particular character of each
offen samec
ep;e rbi oudt
such was the confusion at the bar, the occasional cries of
" Divide, divide," and other noises, that the spea k 's state
ment could not be heard in the gallery. The Hon. and
Learned Gentleman resumed, amidst great confusion and loud
cries of " Divide, divide," by declaring that he conscientiously
believed this measure to be imperatively called for. Pie should
give it his cordial support.
The Marquis of CH ANDOS said it was his intention to
have given a silent vote upon that occasion, but had he done so
he might have been liable to the imputation of assenting to the
language and invectives which had been so frequently used in
the course of the debate.—( Hear, hear.) With regard to the
reasons which had induced him to support the Bill, he had
but little difficulty in finding the most ample grounds for the
vote he was about to give in the speech of the Noble Lord the
Secretary for Ireland. The statements which the Noble Lord
made had since been confirmed by reports and returns which
no one had attempted to disprove ; and seeing that the exist-
ing law was not sufficient for the maintenance and security of
life and property in Ireland, he had no hesitation in placing the
powers of this Bill at the disposal of her Majesty's Government.
—( Hear, hear.) It had been urged by some lion. Gentle-
men that the minority ought to give way to the opinions of the
majority, but he would, for one, never yield to the opinion of
tl.e majority when he found it was not suyperted by argument
or conviction—(Cries of " Hear, hear.' )As to the quest