The Sun.
London, England, 1848-08-10 00:00:00

UN, L'ONDON,. THURSDAY

lied the means, to a oertain extent, of carrying on their
c(Mit'rrtfrcial operations, but"lf-these'blockades in the Baltic
and at Buenos Ayres should be strictly enforced, the con-
sequences to our commercial interests will be most grievous,
and upon an occasion like this, when we are about to vote
money for the naval force of this country, I think we are
entitled to ask for an explanation, and I hope we shall
receive it.

Lord PALMERSTON—With regard to the first of the
two blockades to which the Hon. Member who had just sat
down has directed his observations, I am sure that both he
and the Huse will see that it was not a blockade which we

imposed, and therefore that we are not entitled to force it.
I should say, in the first place, that the original blockade
by the Danish fleet of the German ports was afterwards

relaxed to a great degree, and that, owing to the hopes

which prevailed that an armistice would be signed, that
blockade had nearly ceased. Accounts, however, have
since been 'received, that if the armistice is not signed
by the 15th instant the Danish Government. will feel
obliged to reimpose that blockade. Now, no one wil
deny the right. of Denmark .to impose this blockade as a
measure of Additional retaliation. The only functions,
therefore, which British ships of war would have to per-
form in the Baltic and North Sea would be to take
care that the blockade was enforced in conformity with
the law of nations, and we have tie best assurance that the
Danisb Government will do no more than what the law of
nations authorises, and therefore there is no necessity for
the presence of any of our ships of war on that coast. The
Hon. Member wishes to know what prospect there is of that
armistice being signed. It is not very safe, when so many
parties are concerned, to indulge in any predictions on the
future. but I still entertain hopes that the armistice may be
concluded. The main difficulty is that which I stated the
other day, in answer to a question, namely, the difficulty oc-
casioned in consequence of the Diet having ceased its func-
tions, and having transferred its authority to the Ad-
ministrator of the Empire, whose sanction to the armistice
it is considered mist be obtained. There are other matters
of minor detail which probably may be settled between the
parties, but, however, I am in great hopes that there is a fair
disposition on both sides to come to an armistice, and, if so,
I should hope that the material questions at issue will be put
in a train for an early and satisfactory adjustment. With
regard to the affairs of the Rio de la Plata, nobody regrets
more than I do that they. have been so long unsettled, and
perhaps it would not be prudent to indulge, at present, in
hopes of a satisfactory solution of that question. Every one
knows that we are not answerable for the original movement
which led to the pre.ent state of things there. The late
Government, in conjunction with. the Government of France,
entered into an undertaking which we lave been obliged to
take up, but for which we are nct responsible. The Hon.
Member said that six different envoys had been sent out to
conduct negotiations, but he has somewhat overcalculated the
number. Neither Mr. Mandeville nor Mr. Ouseley had been
sent out from this country for that purpose.i
Mr. DISRAELI—I did not say " sent out," but " em-
ployed."
Lord PALMERSTON—Mr. Hood was undoubtedly sent
out by the Earl of Aberdeen, .and his mission did not suc-
ceed. The reason was, that the two Governments had not

given, as it was intended to do, instructions to their respec-
tive agents. Lord Howden then went out, and his mission
did not succeed either, though without any blame being
imputable to Lord Howden. for no man could have shown
more discretion or judgment than he displayed. There was
unfortunately a difference of opinion between him and the
French representative on a question which was not pro-
vided for by their joint instructions, and that difference
ended in Lord Howden raising the British blockade, while
the French representative did not feel himself justified in
raising the French blockade., Captain Gore then went
out, and his mission cannot be said to have been altogether
unattended by success. Since his departure, however, the
French revolution has broken out, and a question has arisen
whether the, powers of the French representative have not
ceased, and whether they do not require to be confirmed.
With regard to the amount of the squadron employed, the
Admiralty will be able to state the exact figures, but I know
that the number of vessels engaged on that coast has been
diminished, in consequence of the hope which was enter-
tained that hostilities would altogether cease. There is no
doubt that there has been a great interruption to the
trade of this country in consequence of this blockade.'
There has, indeed, been an arrangement, though not a
very regular one, that merchant vessels, notwithstanding
the blockade, should be allowed to go to Buenos Ayres,
after paying import duty at Monte Video. At the same
time there is no doubt that grievous inconvenience has been
suffered by the trade of this country in consequence of the
blockade, and I can assure the Hon. Member and the House
that no effort will be spared on the part of her Majesty's
Government to bring this unfortunate transaction to an
honourable conclusion. I believe the Governments of Eng-
land and France are Loth agreed on the subject of termi-
nating the existing state of things as speedily as possible.
I should explain, however, that it does not form any part
of the arrangement between the two Governments to open
up, as the Hon. Member expressed it, any fresh communica-
tions with Paraguay, and I am afraid that, even if this were
done, any expectations that Paraguay would afford a great
and fruitful field for British commerce would be greatly dis-
appointed. The population of Paraguay is exceedingly small,
and their productions very small also. They want very little
of that which we can produce, and they have nothing to give
us in return, except some very bad bark. With regard to
the right of navigation, we are prepared to acquiesce, in
America, in that principle of public law which we maintain
in Europe—namely, that countries through which rivers pass
—if they be really rivers, and not arms of the sea—are en-
titled to command the navigation of those rivers; and that
if a river runs between two countries, it belongs to them to
make such regulations for its navigation as they may think
fit. It forms, therefore, no part of the arrangement between
England and France to interfere with any regulation made
with reference to the Parana and the Paraguay.
Mr. DISRAELI observed that the Noble Lord had named
five out of the six agents who had been employed to nego-
tiate, but he had not said a word about Mr. Southern, who
had just gone out to Buenos Ayres. The House would re-
collect that we were in a state of gu si war with General
Rosas, and that we were in possession of the fleet of the
Argentine Republic. The Noble Lord had omitted to in-
form the House what was the change in the prospects of our
commercial interests which had induced him to alter the
. .

course of diplomatic negotiation. The Noble Lord had said
that Paraguay had but a small population, and that our
trade with that country would be insignificant. The House
had also been informed that China, with a population of

350,000,000, was not likely to take much of our manu
factures, from which he drew the conclusion that it would
be as well not to relinquish idly our home and colonial
markets.
Lord PALMERSTON said, it was true that the fleet of
the Argentine Republic had been detained, but the squadron
was to be given up the moment matters were settled between
the contending parties in the River Plate. Notwithstanding
this,the intercourse between General Rosas and Lord How-
den had been of the most friendly description, and Mr.
Southern merely went out to replace the former negotiator.
With regard to the trade with China, he must remind the
Hon. Member that our trade with Shanghae was of great
importance, and of an increasing character.
Mr. URQUHART said the Noble Lord had omitted to
notice the other question of the Hon. Member for Bucking.
harnshire, as to the withdrawal of part of the squadron of
the power of Buenos Ayres.
Lord PALMERSTON said that that event took place
during the last Administration, but he believed the vessels
were taken chiefly from the coast ot Brazil.
Mr. URQU,IART said, the Committee were much in-
debted to the Hon. Member for Buckinghamshire for having
asked these questions about Denmark and Buenos Ayres.
With respect to the first, it appeared to him that we had not
prevented an evil that. was raging; and in the other case we
had caused an evil that was intolerable. That Denmark
was entitled to our protection there could be no doubt ;
but it was not given, and, if any danger arose to us from
the present conflict, he laid it to the charge of the Govern-
ment of this country in abstaining from a just and proper
exercise of its power. With respect to Buenos Ayres, we
had been guilty of acts of commission and offence. Since
1841 we had, in combination with France, been guilty of
criminal acts in the Rio de la Plata. The Noble Lord bad
justly said he was not responsible for the commencement
of those acts, but he. ( Mr. Urquhart) spoke not of those
who held the office, but ot the office or the Govern-
merit itself. He must, however, remind the Noble Lord,
that if he were not directly responsible for the offences
that had been committed, instructions from himself
were at the foundation of them. He would ask the Go-
vernment, whether they had submitted the transactions
that had taken place in Buenos Ayres to the law officers
of the Crown, and whether they had assented to them? The
Government had refused to say whether, in the event of a
contest in Sicily, they would employ the forces of the.coun-
try on the one side or the other. If they were going to in.
terfere in the affairs of Italy, as last year they did in Por-
tugal, then they would again expose this nation to the in-
famy of committing unlawful acts. He asserted, that, every
officer who drew his sword in a wrong cause, or obeyed an
order that was unlawful, was himself a criminal.—(" Oh,
oh 1") Such was the law of this country, and such was the
view taken by the Duke of York When he was Commander-
in-Chief. No order to shed blood could protect the man who
obeyed it unless there had been a proclamation of war. But
these ideas were not acted Upon, and the result was, that
the very idea of war was now associated with crime.—(" Oh,
oh 1") He called upon the House not to sanction estimates
that would enable the Government to act in regard to other
foreign countries as they had done in the case of Buenos
Ayres and Monte Video, and to prevent British officers
from being reduced to the position to which they had, seen
them brought through the illegal conduct of the Government.
Without a formal declaration of war they could not send
troops against a foreign power. He had received a letter
from General D'Aguilar, the officer who had commanded in
China, adverting to a statement which he was reported in the
Times of the 25th ult. to have made. that no just com-
parison could be draw n between the operations in Kafirland
and the operations in Canton, because in the one they were
according to superior orders, : but no such orders had been
given in the other. (The Hon. Gentleman then read the
letter of General D'Aguilar, which embodied a communica-
tion from Sir J. F. Davis, her Majesty's Plenipotentiary in
China, and Governor of Hong-Kong, stating that under the
circumstances he had come to the conclusion that there was
no other remedy but to proceed to Canton with a force and
demand redress on the spot, which, from the dispatches he
had received, seemed to be
,a course in accordance with the
feelings of her Majesty's Government; and such being the
case, General D'Aguilar would leave it to the candour of
the Hon. Gentleman to acquit him of acting without
orders. The Honourable Gentleman also read his reply,
in which it was stated that the Times report had
wholly mistaken the point.) He, did not mention Canton;
nor did he draw any distinction between the service in Ku.
firland and in China in respect of orders. What he said
was, that in the one case the forms of war had been ob-
served, and not in the other. His obseriations applied to
the whole series of transactions in China ; and he described
them as lawless and piratical from the beginning to the end,
and that, therefore, he could not allow any comparison to be
drawn between any officer employed in the one country and
any officer employed in the other. His doctrine. had been
confirmed by the decision of a court of law in 1842. A question
was raised as to the legality of the war in China, when the
judges unanimously decided that there had been no war, and
by that decision, therefore, they declared that the operations
in China did not amount to a legal war but to a piratical en-
terprise. He should vote against a farthing of public money
being granted for the present purpose, unless the Noble
Lord at the head of the Government should declare that
henceforward the naval force of the country should not be
employed abroad without warrant.
Lord INGESTRE observed, that the object of this vote
was to grant a sum of 122,000/. to make up a sum of which
part had been already voted, and on that question he con-
fessed lie did not expect to hear a dissertation on the law of
nations. Being sensible of the value of the time of the
House, and seeing the period of the evening as well as of the
session at which they had arrived, he felt he should best con •
suit his duty by making a very few remarks. He could not
concur in what had fallen from the First Minister of the Crown
as to the appointment of the Committee on navy estimates. It
would have been much better in the first instance to have
voted the supplies on the responsibility of Ministers ; and
thus the Committee might have sat to consider how they
should afterwards be granted. But it was ruled other-
, wise, and the Committee was oppoiAted. lie observed that