The Sun.
London, England, 1846-03-20 00:00:00

one-fifEh of that amount went from the sharehoklers to
the lam'c.^'ners—. w s.e. ram) trat.'"th'r
from the capitalist to the landowner.- He had care; k0,.7
colLidered the subject himself, and he had consulted
with some others, well able to form an opinion upon it,
the result of which had been that he became more and
more confirmed in the accuracy of those opinions. In
one line of railway, where the expenditure had been
45,00 G/ per mile, the sum which went to the land-
owners was (as we understooi) 20,0001. In the Midland
Iltiln+ay, whe'e frrni 60,000/. to 70,000/. was expetidod,.
6 0,01 rro,n Anotio,r ;tini of

atesteeoel. wesed to pede lei royalties, timber, &c.
Then there might be a decrease of from two to three
millions in the poor-rates, in consequence of the employ-
ment which' the expenditure would give. Seven to nine
millions more would be given to labourers, who would
be profitably employed. There would thus be expended
fifty millions, which would go directly into the labour
market, or to those connected with the land through
which the railways would pass. About twenty years
ago from eighty to ninety millions were annually raised
from the taxation of the country, and surely they were
new in a better condition to bear a drain upon their re-
sources than they were then. The fourteen millions,
which was the amount of the expenditure of 1844, had
been expended ;- the sum of fifty millions, the amount ,tf
the bills for 1845. was in process of expenditure ; atid
from two hundred to three hundred miles of those lines
where he was director would be.opened in August, or
souse time hi autumn next. The whole of the capied
would thus come into operation, and he felt satisfied
that no emberrassinent would be felt as to the employ-
ment of any caeital which would be expended, provided it
was properly invested. That was the most important
matter which they ought to consider, rather than the
propriety of considering whether they should put a
limit to the power, the wealth, or the enterprise of this
country. He was quite satisfied that no alarm whatever
would be felt as to this expenditure. When they looked
.it the iacome which was; annually received from rail-
ways, he consittered that they would have less grounds
for' apprehension. That amount had been recently seve-
ral millions a year, or 140,0001. a week. The actual
sum at present was 120,0001; but he considered, from
the increasing prosperity, they might safely calculate on
the 20,0001. Then, as to the railways from which in-
come would be derivable during the present year, he
calculated the sum from eight to nine millions as the
gross receipts. All that he would impress upon them
was to select suitable lines, and not expend Inoir-y upon
those which would not tend to the public good. Under
all the circumstances, he would give a negative to the
motion of the Hon. Gentleman, for he did not see what
possible good the Committee, appointed, could do. He
contended that the House, from the information which
it had before it, was in a: position to legislate on all
railwey subjects; and he could not, thereore, see the
propriety of appointing a Committee. Had the Hon. Mem-
ber brought forward a Bill upon the subject instead of
proposing a Committee, he would have been prepared
to state definitely his views upon the subject, but as he
had not chosen to take that course he considered that
the appointment of a Committee was mere waste of time,
and could not tend to the public advantage. A Com-
mittee had formerly sat twenty-one days upon the
subject, and, after an examination of twenty-six wit-
nesses, a Bill was brought forward and passed the House
for the future regulation of railway business. He de-
precated, however, this constant interference with rail-
ways. The Hon. -Member fur Inverness had stated
nothing that they did not know well the last time they
legislated upon the subject; and, as the subject was then
settled by a compromise, he thought that for the
next seven years they would have had some security
for their interests.—(Laughter.) According to
a statement made in a railway paper, it appeared that
the sum of 67,283,000/. had been already expended on
railways. This was an immense amount of money to be
embarked in any enterprise, and he protested against
any Hon. Gentleman coming down to that House, after
such an amount had been expended, and speculating—
(Laughter)—upon its regulation. Now what was the
amount of interest which many of these lines had paid?
Nine of them paid less than 5 per cent., and four of
them paid from '5 to 6 per cent. The Hon. Gentle-
man surely would not think that sum too large. It did
not, therefore, become the lion. Member for Sheffield to
make such vague statements with reference to this ex-
penditure. And 6 of them paid riot more than 8 per cent.,
and the remaining 7 from 9 to 10 per cent. They might go
on with these alarms, as there were some gentlemen who
appeared to think that their property was never secure
unless the House was sitting—(Laughter)—but if the
Hon. Gentleman. instead of exciting these apprehensions,
weulti leave legislative suejects to more able hands, he
would consult his own ease and the interests of the pub-
lic for whom he expressed so much concern; at any rate
he should not interfere with what had been granted to
them by successive Acts of Parliament.
Mr. LABOUCHERE said that lie would, in the first
place, say a few words on the question proposed by the
Hon. Member for Inverness: The lion. Gentleman who
had just set Clown-seemed-to be of 'opinion thah'noanie
was so competent to view the subject one Who had
been extensively -engaged in the railway system. He
admitted that there ware circumstance-s in the present:-
system of railwayswhich required the seridtis considera
tion Of the Legislature. Gentlemen .1)0 said area they-
ought not to interfere with the good old English prin-
ciple of allowing capital to take its own way. - He ad-
mitted that that was a good principle, but • was there
nothing more than the employment of capital to be con-
sidered in this matter? They must take into their con-
sideration that the whole of the passengers and goods
traffic of the country was not left in the bands of two
or three companies. It was this that rendered the em-
ployment of capital in railways differtla from its ern-
ployment in other ways. The Ilon. Member for Sun-
derland had taunted his Hon. Friend (Mr. Morrison)
with nut having brought in a Bill, fasted of proposing
an inquiry. lie (Mr. Labouchere) thought his Hon.
Friend had exercised a sound discretion in taking the
course which he had adopted. The Hon. Member for
Sunderland (Mr. lluds,.n) had talked about a breach of
faith, but he (Mr. Labouchere) denied that there would
be any breach of faith in adopting the recommendations
of his lion. Friend. He should consider that any ad-
vantage to' the country would be too dearly bought
if purchased at the expense of the good faith of Parlia-
ment. To this motion be should give his most cordial
support. Before be sat down, however, he could not
help adverting to an incident which had occurred that
evening, and which showed the value of Parliament in-
terfering in these matters. The Hon. Member for
Guildford (Ur. Mangles), who was a director of the
London and Birmingham Company, had that evening
stated that that Company intended very much to reduce
their fares—in fact they intended to introduce a clause in
their Bills of this session greatly reduceig their present
fares. This showed how important it was for Parlia-
ment not entirely to leave these companies to themselves.
Mr. MANGLES explained he had stated that the
fares were about to be reduced ; but that course was not
about to be taken in consequence of the motion •of the
Hon. Member for Inverness, or in consequence of any
proceedings in Parliament.
Mr. LABOUCIIERE continued. He wished to say
a few words with respect to the subjset which had been
brought under consideration by the Hon. Member
for Sheffield, which was, whether it was desirable
to interfere in an extraordinary manner to check
the application of capital to railway enterprises
during the present session, to prevent any injurious re-
sult which such excess in the application of capital might
produce in the public interests. That was a grave ques-
tion indeed. When the question was brought before the
House some time ago, by the Right Hon. Gentleman the •
First Lord of the Treasury, he (Hr. Labouchere) ven-
tured at that time to express an opinion, that if any step
of so unusual a character were taken, it should be upon
the recommendation of her Majesty's Government, after
they had duly weighed- all the consequences of such a
step. On the appointment of that Committee on rail-
ways of which he had the honour of being a member,
the Right Hon. Gentleman (Sir R. Peel), and the Noble
Lord the Secretary for Ireland, led him into the ini-
pressidn that it was the intention of the Government to
propose some limitation. It was true that-the Govern-
ment laid before the Committee a classification of the
railway Bills of the present session. After looking at
that classification, lie confessed that it would be most
difficult to decide where the limitation should he placed.
As to the question of limitation, the Committee came
to the decision that it, would not become them to consi-
der it, unless it was brought before them by- the Go-
vernment.- After waiting for a month, the members of
the Government, who were on the Committee, told theta
that they had no intention of raising the question hi
the Committee. Ile was still of opinimi that a Commit-
tee, such as that suggested by the Hon. Member for
Sheffield, would be useless. The whole matter was one
which alone should be considered by the Government,
and ought to be brought forward by them.
Sir G. CLERIC- said the Right Hon. Gentleman had
given a correct description of the proceedings of the
Committee. The Government had originally intended
to adopt a plan nearly similar to that suggested by the
Hon. Member for Sheffield ; but when they found
that the number of plans deposited at the Board of
Trade had been reduced before the meeting, of Parlia-
ment by nearly, one-half, they did not think there was
then sufficient cause for interference. The number
originally was upwards of 800, hut they had been re-
duced to about 440, and these included Bills for amal-
gamation, and several Bills were for the same scheme.
The Classification Committee had comprised the whole
of the railways in fifty-six groups. He should give
support to the motion of the lion. Member for Inverness.
He did believo that the average amount of return did
not realise more than from five and a quarter to five and
a half per cent. upon the capital. But when this house
considered that the Most easy modes of cotnnaunica-
tiers in this country were likely to be carried to such an
extent as to supersede all other modes of communication,
it did becorge the duty of the Legislature to take the
matter seriously into consideration, with a view to se-
curity, the public every possible advantage.—(Hear,
hear.) In the year 1844 a Committee was appointed for
the purpose of making inquiries, into this subject, and,
after a most labisrieus inquiry, a Bill was brought into
this House for the purpose of limiting the powers of
railway companies ; and after a great deal of opposition
the Bill was carried. It would, however, be extremely
desirable, when a great number of railways should be
projected, that a strict inquiry should be made into the
actual amount of advantage vs high they would be likely
to confer upon the public. In speaking upon this mo-
tion, he (Sir G. Clerk) did not mean to say that he would
support all the views of the Honourable Member
for Inverness ; but he hoped he would. have an oppor
tunity of bringing the whole of the detsils of his motion
before the [louse ; and he felt assured that every facility
would he afforded him to do so by this House. But
when they saw the many attempts that had been mile
by companies to amalgamate with other companies, and
the determined opposition those companies had met
with from rival companies ; and when they considered
also the many advantages which the public would be
likely to derive by the amalgamation of other lines, in
order to bring a long line under oue msnagernent, then
the Gc4ernment Should take care that a commensurate