The Sun.
London, England, 1848-05-09 00:00:00

n •cesary. The :ionourable Member for West Surrey
had asked what possible connexion there could be be-
tween t) phus and crime. He replied that the state of
things in the dwellings of :he working classes was such
that fever and disease were engendered—the labouring
man was thereby rendered unable to pursue his honest
avocations. Distress and want came, and was followed
by theft and crime as the only means of subsistence.
This was shown in the report of Dr. Neil Arnott to be
the ease in Glasgow, and here he must remark that he
regretted Scotland was not included in the provisions of
the Bill.
The LORD ADVOCA TE—There will be a separate
Bill for Scotland.
Lord ASHLEY rejoiced to hear that announcement.
The connexion betNeen disease and crime was shown in
the communications of Dr. Niel Arnott at Glasgow, by
the reports of Mr. Francis Cooper, the surgeon of Senth-
anapton, and by those of the Rev. Mr. Clay, the chapleiti
Of the Preston House of Car 7ection, to all of which he
invited the attention of the Hon. Member (Mr. Dram-
• 1,411 4 Again he (Lord Ashley), from the examination
had personally made, had not the slightest doubt
that far more than one-half of the habits of int•.xication
which disgrace large towns arose from the satii-
tare' condition in which the people were at pr. feat
compelled to live, and further, he would join his Noble
Friend the Member for Plymouth (Lord Ebringtoti) in
.'43'ing that all attempts a:-the education of the people
were vain so hew- as they were left in their present
sanitary condition. He (Lord Ashley) could add, in
reference to the ranged schools, that the c'aildren, in
returning to their miserable homes, unlearnt in me hour
more than it had taken weeks to teach them. He trusted
the House would allow the Bill to go into Committee,
Making what amendments they thought proper, thereby.
taking one great step towards placing these poor people
the proper level of humanity—(Cheere.)
Alr• MUNTZ did not oppose the Bill going into
Committee; he was quite aware that something needed
doing; but there were many improvements which he
• should like to see in the Bill. He doubted whether any
Lord wtarYho d lastmbeaasure would etlect so much as the Noble
spoken was so sanguine as to expect
tyls'Tei it. Centralisation was the great objection to this
Isla. The large towns had their local governments; and
if other
l'ave thiPlaces had not, why should the corporate towns
I.,Qt s vast additional machinery thrust upon them?
the Bill give the right of electing inspectors to the
rate-payers, who must bear the charge ; otherwise the
been andth naost efficient men would refuse to act, as had
Man Y
e case in the board of guardians at Birmingham.
people expected too much from such a measure as
this ; the needle-
pointers would never live to above 40
years if they resided in the most healthful place in the
of human
and there were other trades little less destructive
great interest in
"man life' believed the medical officers had a
nee
f Weroev,etor•stating the case, in order to prove
local bod
• these officer,:er their own employment. The salaries of
doubted wYhwe°thi be fixed by Government. What
proved as to re er
the least t onlid submit to such dictation as this ? He
the present measure could be soim-
nder it acceptable to the nation ; perhaps
a nAeit:„..l3,l.,B.sTtlev‘vould be to withdraw it and introduce
into nr
to:
cuipoitnesneitte ART said that before theadHeorustsaeadwtebnet
by e:1111V ought thoroughly
wtoasu
to
be
guided.
h the Committee.
belii:gPnrieb.ciples of centralisation, for instance, so far from
the subject;
to this Bill, would euin any measure on
subject; and he hoped hat the Noble Lord who had
introduced the Bill would be led to entertain this view.
311,Lwa,s. most objectionable that any three men in London
_ 'cud be invested with power to overrule all the local
thoritiea in the kingdom. The power given to the
Privy Council of realing Local Acts relating to drain-
age was
also highly objectionable. These were the two
points which prevented the House going into Commit-
tee on the Bill ' • and it was, therefore, too much for the
Noble Lord (Morpeth) to charge those who insisted on
these points with as intention to obstruct the public
business- He (Mr. Stewart) should think it most
Unfair to be called an opponent of the Public
• health Bill ; early in the session, he had made
an offer to the Noble Lord who conducted the Bill
to discuss its provisions in private ; and some inter-
' views had taken place, but they had split on the two
points he had alluded to. He believed Mr. Chadwick to
• be an industrious and meritorious individual ; and much
turned on the degree of credence to be attached to
hie evidence. He had collected evidence on eleven points,
all directed to the expediency of a central authority, and
the inefficiency of local authority. One question asked
how far there were individuals in any town in
Great Britain fit to be entrusted with sanitary work, or
with imposing and collecting rates; and the answers were
given in a report of the sub-committee of the Health of
Towns Association.
Viscount MORPETH— I think I ought to say that,
to the best of my belief, Mr. Chadwick has had no con-
tern whatever with that publication.
Mr. STEWART believed the Noble Lord would find
he was a little mistaken in that matter ; for he had re-
eeiyed the pamphlet from a Government officer, who had
sent it to him to convince him of his error in opposing
centralisation. The answers to those question in 49
• towns out of 50 were " None"—in effect, that in those
towns, even in the City of London itself, there was not
• a single individual fit to be entrusted with sanitary work,
or with the imposing and collecting of rates for the
purpose.—(Laughter.) This was too absurd for argu-
ment. It could not be supposed that the people of
England would ever submit to the extraordinary
- powers proposed to be given to the central board and to
the Privy Council. All private Acts were to be placed
at the mercy of this board, and commissioners, lie un-
derstood, had already been appointed to make inquiry
• as to the operation of these Acts. He approved of such
inquiry, but decidedly objected to the centralisation to
which it was proposed to lead. Let Government con-
sent to modify the objectionable centralisation clauses,
• and the House would go into Committee forthwith.
• The Hon. Member for Oxfordshire (Mr. Henley) had
very properly suggested that the Bill should be modelled
on the Inclosure Act of 1845 ; and against this no argu-
ment whatever had been offered. Unless some sueh
• modification were consented to, it would be impossible
for the Bill to get through Committee in six months.—
(Laughter.) The Noble. Lord the Member for Falkirk
(Lord Lincoln), who was thoroughly master of the
• subject, had given notice of an amendment by the
omission of the fourth and fifth clauses ; and
this would in a great measure destroy the centralis-
ing
Powers, for the rest of the Bill would then become
almost nugatory. He hoped the Government would
not be greedy of patronage, but would consent to the
- new Powers being exercised by some existing authority.
As the Bill stood, the central board, and the host of in-
sPectors and sub-inspectors throughout the country,
. would be appointed by the Government; this had created
strong feeling of repugnance amongst the local autho•
Cities of every town in the kingdom, who were de-
' . pouncing the Government for having contrived, out of
Irish famine, to create 10,000 pieces of patronage—
" the Noble Lord the Member for Lynn (Lord G. Ben•
Tiisck) declared the number was 16,000.—(Laughter.)
be Bill created an immense amount of patronage, to
thoesxercised, if not by the Government directly, by
who had imposed on them by their representations.
liTtihnteejlew which he entertained was this, that ea
sufficient
their number of respectable persons would be found in all
iti7Llebiotants.
large towns who would be willing to adopt ade-
quate
measures for the preservation of the health of the
fshouldHe would not object to a temporary con-
avour ard to see the measure set in motion, but they
not supersede the local authorities. He was in
" a. Proper measure, but they should know before
they went
goina tot into Committee on what principle they were
_ou_ proceed, otherwise they would fall into the
namec ct ntusion that they did last year.—(Hear, hear.)
he
41n PECHELL admitted that the Government
asobvj°"ed
_th_e as far as they could to meet the views of
objectors to the measure. He admitted also that a
raFo of this kind was necessary, but the principle of
ligation which was enforced in the Bill rendered
guite obnoxious to the people of the country.—(Hear,
ten.hear,) He thought they should be careful before they
k out of the hands of the people the administration or their local affairs. He would, however, vote for
going into Committee, but only with a view of paring
as the Noble Lord the Member for Bath said, the talons. 3f this formidable tieer.—(Laughter.) In Committee ,1 Ile would resist all attempts to place the local boards
under the authority of the central commission.—(Hear.)
Mr. W. MILES thought that the Government
w giving to the central board more authority than wear necessary to carry out the Bill. He considered
Os> present Bill to be a great improvement on the measure.
of last year, and he would be prepared to vote for going
into Committee, if the Noble Lord opposite adopted the reasonable suggestion of the Hon. Member for Ox-
fordeliire. 'He thofight die Goveenmetit' were wrong in
not including the metropolis in the Bill, because all the
facts showed that the mortality in the metropolis was
far greater than in other parts of the country, and, con-
sequently, stood in greater need of such a measure. He
hoped some Member of the Government would give an
explanation of the construction of the central board of
po,mmissioners, and in the meantime he would suspend
his
littidgrnent as to the measure.
eILE.WDEGATE said that the Bill would entirely
super%
be very all local boards, and in that respect it would
objectionable. The object which the Govern-
ment speeoenweearst(o)chtabve in view was to centralise the whole
of the
powers in the handse provin commissioners and to place those
board. That bodywoaf the of the central
local officers to any
hoped, to have the power of appointing
exater which might be deemed fit.—
(Divide.) He
seerever, that the Noble Lord
htooptehdefor s
(Morpeth) would not
di:aodexercise the powers sought
for under the Buiell
vantage of the local boards.
—(Divide.)
assurance from the Go-
vernment that such extraordinary powers as were con-
ferred by the Bill would not he accepted by them.
Mr. WYLD, amidst great
confusion, and cries of—
utlehat his constituents
" Divide," was understood to sa
central board was
approved of the Bill in so Mr 2
a and in their view
calculated to counteract local jobbing,
, though there
he entirely concurred. The large
were favourable to the measure as a whole, the people
were parts of it which were objectionable.
The gallery was then about to be cleared for a divi-
sion, when
Mr. URQUHART withdrew his amendment—
upon the House went into Committee on the Bill7her--
The preamble was postponed. Clause 1 being pro.
posed,
Mr. BANKES objected to the exclusion of London
from the provisions of the Bill. The metropolis con-
: tamed gas works, chemical works, and other manufac-
totheeegeuerating noxious vapours, which rendered sani-
tary regOlations more necessary than in any other
Part or the kingdom.—((-Tear, hear.) He need not
to_farther than__lliecOilPgS__garaglk to prove the
truth of his assertion. In Westminster School the
master was ill ; several of the scholars had been
Iked ; the Dean of Westminster was also affected—
end,when such a state of things was going on,
to ex
t. ei ude the metropolitan districts from the operation
udhe St Bill was a line of policy which he could not under.
. eer „
zo called upon the Noble Lord to produce a

measure intended for the whole nation; or, at all events,
to begin with London, where the necessity for sanitary
regulations was most seriously felt. It was the fact.
without attributing for a mo►uen: undue attention on
the part of the Noble Lord to the interests of his con
s:ituents, that the interests and wishes of London were
more immediately attended to in that House than those
of any other town in the kingdom. This was not right.
If London was to be excluded on account of the antiquity
of its corporation, there were many other towns in the
kingdom which might put in a similar plea. He moved
that all the words which went to exclude London and
Westminster from the Bill be omitted.
Lord MORPETH was free to admit that the exclu-
sion of the metropolis was the main detect of the Bill.—
(Hear, hear.) But when it was remembered that there
were a hundred local Acts referring to the metropolis,
it would not be wondered at that it had been found
necessary to exclude it from the present Bill. He also
regretted the exclusion of Ireland and Scotland; but
his belief was that the sanitary condition of both
those countries would be better advanced by separate
rneastr.es than by incorporating them in one vast and un-
manageable Bill. The question was whether this mea-
sure was a boon to the districts contemplated or not. If
it was a boon, the exclusion of the metropolis was no
reason for depriving other cities of the advantages in-
tended.—(Hear, hear.) He trusted that he should soon
be able to undertake the case of the metropolis, and he
congratulated himself with the prospect of having for en
able assistant the Hon. Member for Dorsetshire.
Colonel SIBTHORP objected to the Bill in toto. He
looked upon it as a Government job, concocted for the
purpose of providing places for some of the lean and
nungry followers of the Noble Lord and his colleagues.
However, if the Noble Lord would consent to include the
cities of London and Westminster it would remove one
of his main objections to the Bill.
Lord MORPETH said he had already given his
reasons for not includif-g London.
Colonel SIBTHORP—Then I am delighted to oppose
ou.—(A laugh).
The Marquis ofGR ANBYstrongly objected to the exclu-
sion of the metropolitan districts; but further, the Bill
was objectionable on acconnt of the odious and un-
English principle of centralisation which it contained.
Mr. NEWDEGATE said that the Noble Lord had
mentioned the one hundred local Acts of London as a
reason for excluding it from the Bill. He (Mr. Newde-
gate) wished to know how many country local Acts
would this Bill place at. the mercy of Government?
Lord MORPETH admitted that there was an immense
number of local Acts scattered over the country. It was
the fact of the 100 local Acts being in a lump that con-
stituted the difficulty in the case of London.
Mr. HUDSON said that every town in England was
opposed to the centralising principle of the Bill. He
had just returned from the ancient city of York,
where the most determined opposition had been re-
solved on. He did not see why all the wisdom of Eng-
lish corporate bodies should be supposed to centre in
the city of London. What they complained of in York
was, that the corporation had no power to insist on
efficient drainage.—(Hear, hear.) He said "Hear, hear"
too. That was a reason for giving the necessary
power to the corporation, but not for centralisation.
The principle of government in this country was that
taxation and representation should go together, and he
and almost all the towns in the country objected to
giving powers to any central body to tax them. He hoped
the Noble Lord would abandon that part of the Bill
which placed the towns under the control of the central
board of London, and he might depend upon it that the
towns would themselves, if the necessary power was given
to them, do all that was required..
Lord J. RUSSELL remarked that nine-tenths of the
Bill was taken up in giving those powers to local bodies
which the Hon. Gentleman wished for. It was true that
one part of the Bill referred to the establishment of a
central board.—(Hear, hear.) But he thought it far
better that the attention of the Committee should be
directed to the question whether the plan proposed by the
Government, or that of the Noble Lord the Member for
Falkirk, should be preferred, rather than to discussing
the question of centralisation, &c.
Mr. BROTHERTON supported the Bill. The Hon.
Member for Sunderland had admitted that the corpora-
tion of York, which had a local Act, had not the power
necessary for ensuring sanitary improvement ; if so, in
what position must those towns be which had no powers
under local Acts ?
After a few words from Mr. HUME and Mr. BANYES,
The Committee divided, when their appeared—
For the retention of the words 240
For the amendment
Majority --169
Mr. URQUHART had presented a petition, signed
by all the medical men of Stafford, and a large number
of the inhabitants of the borough, against the Bill, and
he claimed, ozi:the part of his constituents, the same ex-
ception Government had admitted inthe case of London.
He would move that Stafford be exempted.
Colonel SIBTHORP said that the Hon. Gentleman
claimed an exemption in favour of Stafford ; he for his
part demanded an exemption in favour of Lincoln.
If the House was so anxious about cleaning, let them
set to work and scour the Treasury bench ; they
would find the job dirty to their heart's content
(Laughter.) He warmly vindicated the purity of the
city of Lincoln; he had represented it for more than
twenty years by the unbcught suffrages of its inha-
bitants, and he asserted fur it as full a right to be left
to its own cleansing care as the city of London or the
city of Westminster, which the Noble Lord was intimi-
dated into exempting from the operation of his so crude
and mischievous a measure. The whole thing was a
miserable, sneaking, dirty job, got up as a mode of
feeding a pack of poverty-stricken Ministerial depen-
dents, who had no resource but the pockets of the people.
Viscount INGESTRE had a perfect knowledge of
Stafford, and he might almost say of all its population,
an.l he could bear his testimony that he knew no place
which, morally or physically, required a more thorough
cleansing.—(Laughter.)
Mr. URQUHART withdrew his amendment.
Clause 1 was then agreed to.
The CHAIRMAN reported progress, and obtained
leave to sit again on Thursday.
The House adjourned at a Quarter to One o'clock.

- - ---
REPUBLICAN FRANCE.—We observe that a work
by Dr. Millengen is announced for publication, in which
he records his recollections of the first French Revola•
tion. As the Doctor resided in Paris during that period,
under very peculiar circumstances, and lived in the same
house with the Deputies Albittes—the personal friends
and associates of Robespierre—ho must have had con-
stant opportunities of making himself acquainted with
the many fearful occurrences of the time, and his per-
sonal acquaintance with the parties must therefore ren-
der his narrative more interesting than those of his-
torians who merely write from hearsay, and are more or
less prejudiced in their opinions. We understand that
Dr. Millengen's account of Robespierre differs widely
from the description given of him by M. Lamartine, in
his " History of the Girondins."

TULIP Sliow.—Mr. Groom's annual display of
tulips commenced yesterday at his establishment at
Clapham. rise. The day being as splendid as a summer
sun could make it, several visitors of distinoton accepted
the invitation to the private view, for such it was. The,
tulips again exhibited abundant proof of Mr. Groom
skilful management of these dainty and evanescent pro-
ductions of nature. The bed was filled with the finest
specimens, many of them of' the choicest class, and a
perspective glance up the middle of the tent disclosed a
surface of nodding flowers, strangely and capriciously
variegated—a floral ensemble, inded, of singular rich-
ness and variety. We do not profess to belong to the
tulipomaniacs, and care little for the rarity which is so
much prized, in preference to the graceful combinations
of colour which characterise the common garden species,
but there is a style in the tulip, let it be marked as it
will, which always commands respect. It is the stateliest
and most dignified of flowers, and holds up its head in a
sort of vainglorious stiffness that seems to repel intimacy.
The conditions which are laid down as the credentials
of perfection in the opinion of tulip amateurs are re-
ligiously complied with by Mr. Groom, and we hays the
straight stem, the capacious and well-formed bell, the
broad edge, the well defined and delicately feathered
stripe, and the velvetty cheek, in almost all the cases
submitted for inspection.
ROYAL ITALIAN OPERA, COVENT- GARDiN.—The
Queen and his Royal Highness Prince Albert honoured
the Royal Italian Opera with their presence on Saturday
evening. In attendance on her Majesty and Prince
Albert were the Marchioness of Douro, Lady Caroline
Cocks, the Hon. Miss Paget, Lord Byron, Colonel Grey,
Captain Gordon, and Mrs. Ormsby Gore. There were
also present—the Duke and Duchess of Montrose, and
Lady Ernest Bruce, the Duke and Duchess of Northum-
berland, the Duke and Duchess of Bedford, the Marquis
) w Earlr ora Endssex Countess
Johnstone
Titchfield, Earl Sidney, Earl and Countess of Eetin-
ci, a
p ofnsAltonoerleLl Sir the JCo
ho
nu n
at ensds
Lady Walsh, the Countess of Jersey and Lady
Clementina Villiers, Viscount Templetown, Viscount
Nevill, Viscount Cantilupe, isc
Exmouth, Viscount Villiers, Landuntc Morpeth, Viscount
Caroline Capel and
party, Lord Lascelles Lord Suffield, Lord and Lady
Carrington and the Hon. Miss Cotton, Lord Ilothani,
g
Lord and Lady Southampton, Lord and Lady Duna von, Lady Ebrington, Lady Joddrell, Lady Park
Lady Shelley, Lady Doraville, Lady Scutt, Lady Motrc'
flan, Lady Flint, Miss Burdett Coutta, Lady Beauvale
and Sir John and Lady Campbell, Baron and Baroness
Goldsmid, Hon. J. Fortescue, Hon. B. Lyon, Hon. G.
Milles, Hon. F. Scarlett, lion. Mr. and Mrs. Upton,
Hon. Mr. Harbord, Hon. Mrs. Murray, Mrs. Boyle,
Hun. Mrs. Charles Stanley, Hon. Mr. and Mrs. Spencer
Ponsonby, Hon. Lady Butler, Sir 11. Webb, Sir W.
Fremantle, Sir Robert Cullum, Sir W. Ball, Baron
and Baroness Rothschild, Sir Charles Marshall, Mrs.
Locke, Mrs. henry Bainsbridge, the Miss Byrnes, the
Miss Temple Bowdiens, the Miss Richards, Mrs.
Charles Mills and the Miss Mills, Major-Gen. I'.
Campbell, ILA., Colonel B. Knox, M.P., Col. Wingfield,
Col. Wane, Major and Mrs. Gage, Capt. Cuddy, Capt.
Lloyd, T. Baring. Esq., M.P., Mr. Collett, M.P.. Mr.
Morris, M.P., H. B. Baring, M.P., Mr. Gregory, M.P.,
H. T. Hope, Esq., M.r., &c. &c.
DOVER HARBOUR IMPROVEMENTS.—We have it
on good authority that the deepening of this harbour
will be commenced very shortly. The entrance is also
to be widened. A channel, six feet deep at low spring
tides, it is understood is to be cut from the entrance
right up to the Cross Wall • so that with this and the
widening of the mouth of the harbour, our steamers
will be able to enter at all states of the tide ; and almost
in all weather when
This will be
the greatest impro they
can put to sea. -
as it
will
revnelment our old harbour ever under-
went,( er the spacious accommodation we
already possess inside
Jouena/. perfectly available.—Canterbury
We have reason to believe
•
that a special reporter
was dispatched to Ireland subordinately to Mr. Hodge
Friday's mail-boat, to act
ge.'s, in taking notes of the
seditious speeches at the
ere carious public meetings held
in Dublin and else h
Jairsed. the provinces.--Liverpool