The Sun.
London, England, 1846-08-01 00:00:00

republic ! Abhor and stigmatise the sword ! No—for it
scourged the Dutch. He had learnt its power, and that it
was the right of nations to govern themselves, while he stood
upon the ramparts of Antwerp where liberty was rightly
appreciated, and its possession was purchased by an effu-
sion of noble and generous blood. Abhor and stigmatise the
sword ! No.

Mr. Joan{ O'CoNssgi,f, rose to order. He had several times
checked his desire, which he felt to be strong, of interrupting
the eloquent speaker during the latter portion of his speech,
because he had said to himself that although these were dan-
gerous doctrines, which should not even bespoken in that as-
sembly, that he would perhaps qualify or modify his senti-
ments. He did not think that he was wrong in saying, that
instead of modifying his expressions, he had increased them
in vigour and violence.—(Cheers.) It was to him a source
of the deepest annoyance that he was obliged to interrupt
him, but at the same time the deepest conviction upon his
soul was, that such language was not safe.—(Cheers.) He
feared that the time had come when the teat should be aye
or no.—•(Cheers.) The expression of such sentiments coming
from so gifted and talented an individual was the more dan-
gerous. He thought that the time had come to the point—
yes or no? He could act upon the point of form that the
man who denied assent to the resolutions adopted on Mon-
day week was ipso facto no longer a member, but he did not
wish to press a point of form upon so serious and sad an oc-
casion ; but for the safety of the Association, if there was a
doubt about it.—(A voice—There is no doubt)—the better
way would be to put the question.—(Cheers.) It was sug-
gested that the resolutions put in that Association should be
maintained. He was in a puzzle how to act, but there was
no puzzle about this, that the language just uttered by Mr.
Meagher could not be safely listened to by the Association—
(Cheers)—and that the sentiments which he had avowed
were sentiments directly and diametrically opposed to the
sentiments of the founder of the Association; there-
fore, either he or Mr. Meagher should cease to be a
member of that Association. If the meeting were opposed
to him (Mr. John O'Connell), he would leave the Associa-
tion; but the time had come whenStither he or Mr. Meagher
should cease to be connected with it, for he could not con-
tinue in the same Association with him after the utterance
of such sentiments.

Captain BZODEILCK—Nor can I remain any longer.—
(Cheers.)
Mr. STEELE—Nor I.—(Loud cheers.)
Mr. SMITH O'BRIEN then rose and said—l am afraid that
the alternative presented to us is of such a nature as neces-
sarily to compel a termination of this discussion, but I can-
not allow the meeting to separate without expressing my
opinion of the course that has been pursued towards Mr.
Meagher in his fair and legitimate argument.— (Cheers, and
confusion.) We have been invited here for the purpose of
deliberately considering whether any gentleman can con-
tinue a member who entertains the opinion that there are
occasions on which nations must of necessity have recourse
to arms for liberty. Mr. Meagher'advocates peaceful means,
but neither he nor I consider, when invited to discuss a
question, that we are not at liberty to state our opinions in
vindication of the sentiments that have been arraigned.—
(Cheers and confusion.) You should well consider this, for
this day produces an event in history. You are charged
with never giving fair play to an adversary. You are
charged with being slaves to any despot who holds the reins.
—(Loud cries of " No, no," and confusion.) It is not my
opinion, and I should designate as a traitor the man that said
so ; but are you going to justify that opinion by putting
down a man who is dispassionately discussing a question to
which he has been invited? If the discussion is to terminate,
I shall have the satisfaction of having recorded my protest
against the manner in which Mr. Meagher has been put down
by Mr. John O'Connell.—(Cheers.)
Mr. J. O'CONNELL—The question is not, as Mr. O'Brien
states, whether a young man shall be put down, but the real
question is, shall a young man put down the Association—
(Cheers)—for I do declare pit is my firm conviction that his
language was most dangerous. We have not invited this
discussion—it has arisen accidentally. There were certain
resolutions on the books, which were based on the opinions
of the founder of the Association. If gentlemen entertained
different opinions let them drive him out from amongst them.
—(Loud cheers, and cries of " O'Connell for ever.") The
question was, would the Association stand by those resolu-
tions or adopt another leader?
Great cheering, accompanied by groans and hisses, fol-
lowed this declaration, and a scene of the utmost confusion
ensued, during which Mr. Smith O'Brien, accompanied by
Mr. Meagher, Mr. Mitchell, and all the members of the
" Yong Ireland" party present, left the hall. Their depar-
ture was the signal for an enthusiatic burst of applause
from the supporters of Mr. O'Connell, which was, how-
ever, immediately suppressed by that gentleman. When
silence was somewhat restored,
Mr. JOHN O'CONNELL said—lt is no source of joy to me
that we have witnessed this departure. There cannot be a
feeling of triumph—there cannot be one single pleasurable
feeling in my heart at witnessing the loss to the Association
of such a man as Smith O'Brien—at witnessing the depar-
ture of those excellent men from amongst us. I know the
country will deplore it, and I know the country will hold
me blameless when it believes that I would rather give my
life's blood than risk the loss of such a man, and the
men who went with him. This is not a time to speak ;
it is a time to weep. Let us, then, retire from
this hall to mourn over the loss we have sustained.
Let us not think of meeting till Monday next, when
I hope Mr. O'Connell will be here to try to repair
the breach that has inevitably occurred. But I do im-
plore those kind friends who have cheered me to-day to
use no angry word—no term of insult or reproach towards
the men who have now left us. Conciliation and peace are
our mottoes, even with our enemies. Should it not be so
with our friends? We deplore their loss, but we will not
increase the bitterness of our hearts by using towards them
one single term of reproach, or exhibiting any feeling of
triumph.

Mr. J. A. O'NEILL then addressed the meeting, deploring
the course pursued by Mr. O'Brian and his friends, and
eulogising Mr. O'Connell's conduct ; after which he was
called to the chair, and a vote of thanks passed to the Lord
Mayor. _ _

The meeting then (at six o'clock) adjourned until Monday
next.

LAW INTELLIGENCE.
COURT OF CHANCERY, August 1.
The Lord Chancellor sat in the Old Hall, Lincoln's Inr,
to-day.

DAMER V. LORD PORTARLIXOTO.N.

The LORD CHANCELLOR gave judgment in this case to-
day, staying all proceedings in the cause upon the payment
by the defendants of the plaintiff's claim and costs.
His Loupsmr then proceeded to hear unopposed lunatic
petitions.

VICE CHANCERY COURT, Angus' 1.
His Honour the Vice-Chancellor of England heard unop-
posed petitions, short causes, and cause petitions to-day,
This was the last day of his Honour sitting.
(Before Vice-Chancellor `Visit. u.)
ATTORNEY GENERAL V. MURDOCH.

His Iloxotfu gave judgment this morning in one of those
many cases arising out of the late secession from the Kirk
of Scotland, which has left a large number of the chapels in
dispute as to which party they shall belong to. The Vice.
Chancellor said the question in this case was, what were the
trusts under which the meeting-house had been left, called
the Low Meeting-house, in the town of Berwick-upon-
Tweed. The plantiffs said that it ought to be used as a place
of worship only, according to the rules, practice, and dis-
cipline of the Kirk of Scotland, and asked the Court to do
that which would have the effect of providing that no one
should teach and preach in that meeting-house, except a
licentiate of the Kirk of Scotland. He said, supposing that
made out, the case would resemble one which had already
been before the court, the Attorney-General v. Welsh. He
had no special affection for that case, but till he heard the
principles applied in that case invalidated, or some-
thing to make him change his opinion, the Court
must continue to be guided by the same principles.
Supposing a person, a Presbyterian, in connexion with
the Kirk of Scotland, should build and endow a place of wor-
ship, to be used according to the rules and discipline of that
Kirk, and having determined that the same should be per-
petuated for all time coming, should take the means most
proper for the purpose, should direct trustees to hold the
meeting-house as a place of worship, according to the rules
of the Kirk of Scotland ; what the Court in that case would
do would be to make the Kirk of Scotland the model, as
was done in the case of the Attorney. General v. Welsh, and
also to provide that the minister should be one who would
uphold the rules, the discipline, and doctrines of the Kirk of
Scotland. Whether the minister should be a licentiate of
that Kirk was not the question here ; but it was clear that
he could not be a man who avowedly dissented from her
rules, Fier discipline, and her doctrines. A stricter question,
however, might be considered here, namely—whether a man
could be a minister in such a meeting-house who openly
avowed opinions contrary to the Kirk. In the case of the
Attorney. General v. Welsh, he had, with a view to that
question, endeavoured to find out what difference of doctrine
or discipline existed between the Kirk of Scotland and the
non-intrusionists. He confessed he had no difficulty in
seeing how those who held the belief of apostolical succession
might be consistently opposed to any interference from the
civil power, but he could not understand the consistency of
any such opposition from those who recognised a local
church government in spiritual matters. From all the
documents which he had been able to consult, and which

could throw any light on the subject, he was of opinion thai
the Kirk of Scotland and the Free Church differed, and that

no trustee of a chapel established according to the rules of
the Kirk, having seceded, could fill the pulpit and order
the worship in accordance with the Free Church. But
another argument was urged in defence, namely, that the
Church of Scotland, as it existed in 1835, prior to the dis-
ruption, and the Free Church subsequent to it, were identical
in opinion—an argument which his Honour could not re-
concile with the decisions of Chief Justice Tindal and
other eminent judges. The Auchterarder case showed
that the rules and doctrines of the Church of
Scotland were; that case introduced nothing new, the deci-
sion upon it was merely declaratory. The Vice-Chancellor
said he made 'this remark in case the present litigation
should unhappily be continued, in order that parties might
bring their case forward in such a shape as would lead him
to review the principles laid down in the case of the Attor-
ney-General v. Welsh. Having assumed up to this point
that the trust was that the meetinghouse should be used
according to the rules of the Kirk of Scotland, he came now
to inquire how this stood. There was a deed of 1766, but
the established custom seemed to prove that the trust was
such as the information alleged. The first minister, John
Turnev, was a licentiate of the Church of Scotland; there
existed some doubt as to one of his successors on this head,
hut from 1719 onwards all appeared to have been ministers
in connexion with the Church of Scotland. The deed of
1766 had been raised in argument in the defence.
Now, if the trust was a trust for any Protestant
Dissenters, the effect of that would be, that a licen-
tiate of the Church of Scotland might have been
consistently a minister of the Low Meeting-house.
But the deed of 1766 was not the foundation of the trust,
and custom was opposed to it. Herein this case differed from
that one to which he had alluded, that the original deed of
trust had not been proved. His Honour said, in cases like
the present, coming before Lord Eldon upon int( rlocutary
applications, that Judge frequently put them in a train of
adjudication which enabled him to express his opinion at an
earlier stage. But Lord Cottenham strongly disapproved of
this mode, as giving a priority to cases of a certuin kind
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trust on which the meeting-house was held had been com-
pletely proved, but, looking to what had been done in the
case of the Attorney-General v. Welsh, and to the fact that
Mr. Murdoch held the opinions of the nen-intrusion party,
he ordered that Mr. Muidoch should be restrained from
teaching or preaching in the Low Meeting-house, in Ber-
wick-on-Tweed, otherwise than in conformity to the doc-
trines, discipline, and practice of the Church of Scotland,
and that the plaintiffs should be at liberty to apply to the
Court in case Mr. Murdoch should in any manner depart
from the doctrines, discipline, and practice of that church.

PIGEON FLYING MATClL—Thursday a pigeon flying
match, between birds belonging to Messrs. Baker and
Collyer, amateur fanciers, at Brixton, was decided, for 5/.
The starting place MIS Gravesend, and the pigeon belonging
to the former flew the diatitucel mg% in 34 itliAutfol Mad
WO al atittribi