The Sun.
London, England, 1846-08-20 00:00:00

MILITARY FLOGGING.

Yesterday afternoon, a meeting was held at Easter
Hall, in order to consider the best means of obtain:4MA
the abolition of the system of inilitary torture now prac.
tised in the army; Thomas Wakley, Esq., M.P., in the :
chair. •
The meeting was very numerously And respectably at-
tended, and before the arrival of the. chairman on the
platform, a number of soldiers of the Gunadier Guards,
who entered the Hall, were vociferously cheered.
Mr. lYsiane said, the gratification he derived from,
being befo:e the meeting and presiding on such an occa-
sion, was greeter, they could readily believe him, than
he was able to. express, because that was an occasion
which was honot
arable to the humane feelings of the tia-
tion—it was one h
~hich was honourable to human nature-,.
and it was peculiar) v gratifying in consequence of a re-
cent oc.currence. Th. , bond of union which cemented
that meett.n on that c. wasion was sympathy for their
g
suffering fellow-creatures:- They believed the.t acts of
injustice and cruelty were perpetrated in the name of
a ud, entertaining that belief,
what was called discipline,
they were there to express thei.'opinion in die en t from ii.
If the authorities who had so do,-Ig advocated that system
of cruelty with reference to the army and the navy, had
but duly reflected on what might hart been done by a .'pore
humane 'system of treatment, in all probability tat
meeting would not have been then a: sembled; but Oa
authorities seemed to have forgotten that those who took-
situations in the army and navy, when _they took their
offices, did not cease to be human beings, .and were ani-
mated by human sentiments. If they believed, for
example, that the soldier and the sailor possessed the
same feeliegs which they themselves entertained,
and could be actuated by the same motives, they would
not for so long a period have consented and have desired
to inflict upon them a rtnishment now not .employed
even upon the brute creatio:t. In the present advance-
ment of knowledge, and the in:kprovement of m oral feel-
ings, this savage system of punishment was givi "ig way,
and was made to yield to the force of moral k
which an improved system of education had produced on
this country. But there were officers who consts,ltly
exclaimed that no discipline could be maintained in t
army unless the power of inflicting the lash were re-'
tained, and unless that infliction every now and then
took place; but when they were asked if they did not
believe that if another system were adopted—a system of
rewards instead of a system of punishment—it would
serve the same end—they had not replied to it; they had
no w. ay of argument; but they turned upon their heels
and exclaimed that they did not believe in the efficiency
of such a system, and that they rejoiced in having than
atrocious power in their hands—the power of inflicting:
punishment upon their fellow-creatures, who were cer-•
tainly equally as L'onourable with themselves—(Loud
cheers)—equally as ;ust, and equally as sensitive as
themselves. The voice of the British nation had been
raised against this atroe:ous cruelty. It was branded
and stigmatised—it was eeCdemned, hated, and despised,
from one extremity of the kio.gdo.vn to the other. Who
was there,he would ask who dare to say that such iniquity
should continue? The voice of ,the public would be
omnipotent in this cause, as it had ;leen in every other
cause in which it had been recently expressed—(lna-
mense cheering)—and he felt assured` . that the day of
flogging, if it had not ceased, was, at alLeeents, near the
approach of its termination. The nretence had
hitherto been raised, in consequence of igno •
ranee or otherwise, That there was nO danger
to human life in flogging; but experience—u•ot only
recent experience—but experience of remote times--
had proved indisputably that it was not only danger 080
to life, but that it had killed—and killed again anca
again ; and he was sorry to be compelled to express the
opinion that it had heen em'orced with the knowledge
that it had been fatal to human life. From circumstances
which he was unable to explain, that circumstance had
been kept back from public consiti:-Tation. Now, how-
ever, it was universally known, and in.' longer could it
be said, when an unfortunate soldier or ,sailor was sen-
tenced to have his back lashed with thu t infernal ma-
chine, the cat-'o-nine-tails, that the infliction could be
made withont danger to human life. Why, they were
told that a surgeon should examine the body of the un-
fortunate culprit before his punishment was ;nflicted,
and that he should determine what amount of suffering a
fellow-creature should be enabled to bear before life s'ns
in danger. For such a statement to be made in a civilisetl
country was in itself a miracle. Good God, let them!
only conceive that a man should be required to test
beforehand the capabilities of endurance of a human
beiug—that he should gauge the strength of the human
body—that he should be required to ascertain by the
application of his scientific skill what 'mount of suffer-
ing, what quantity of pain could be endured by a fellow
creature before his life was put in dang,r. It was an
insult to the profession to which he bad the
honour to belong.—(lmmense cheering.) If he were
in the army, whatever might be his prosvet of
degradation—punishment—poverty—or deprivation--
his answer would be, that he world not be'
answerable for the consequences of one single lash.—
(Enthusiastic applause.) He wnuld—when the unhappy
being under the lash had received one—he would tell
the commanding officer, standing by, in as stern a voice
as he could, that he would not be answerable for the
second. Oh, there was something in :it which ways in
itself so disgusting, and so repulsive, than it was difficult
' to speak about it with common feeling or patience.
would ask, did the soldier, when he became such, did he"
eease to be a citizen—did he cease to enjoy the civil'
rights which other men possessed ? They were suffi-
ciently ready to land the soldier when they believed that
he had protected them from danger. The soldier who
risked his life in their cause and for very bad pay—
(Cheers)—who was kept in a state of constant suffering
—who was under his general, colonel-major, captain,
lieutenant, ensign, sergeant, and coporal ; and if he,
did not appear a very humble man, and extremely sub-
missive before ell peroone, ho .t..pcame a marked man,
and it was indicated to him that before long the farrier
should become his intimate acquaintailce. Yes, even if
a poor fellow in a mistake were to call ok'tt to his superior
officer " hallo," the chances were that in'a few days he
would find himself with a scored back; be would flail

hat he had been lacerated and torn, and that his Irie

had been endangered. Now was it believed, or could
be believed by persons in authority, that the Englishl
people would endure such a state of things?—(Cries of '
" Never, never.") Now that their minds were directed
to the subject, and had become acquainted with all these
cruelties—now that the fiat of public opinion had been
launched against it—those who admitted it to continue
would be marked and stigmatised as being as
bad as the system itself. But for a moment, leaving out;
the question of the physical suffering, and the danger to
the physical constitution, were they to forget 17hat were
its effects, and what might be its influence on tbe moral'
condition of the man ? Why, they might increase the
number of lashes, if that were only concerned ; (hit let
them picture to themselves an unfortunate man brought
inside a square, before hundreds of comrades ; he saw'
before him the halberts, or a ladder nailed to the side of
a house ; he had to strip or be stripped, and to walk to
the ladder or the halberts, and there to be tied hand and
loot, with his limbs stretched to their utmost extent,
in
order that he might not exhibit what was the amount of
agony and suffering he endured. He said, let them pic—
ture to themselves a man placed on that rack of 1846—
(Loud cheers)—for he called it what it well deserved to
be called—it was a rack ; and tell him did they send
from that place a man with an unbroken spirit, or an un-
,ubdued mind—a man who did not feel himself degraded

down to the lowest point of human degradation 7l Tell.
him if that man afterwards was ever likely to be a good.'

soldier, or to raise his head as an honest and independent
man ?—(Cheers.) He questioned if the moral degrada-
tion were not worse even than the physical punishment ;
and he questioned whether its effects on all that was
valuable in a man, were not calculated to hinder bins
from being a good member of sociey, to make him a
good soldier, a good brother, or a good friend. And was
not this effect infinitely worse than the ci,:nger to his life,
or the torture of th,, physical infliction ? and if that were
the case, how could the punishment he justified? 4,end for
what offences was this punishment ittflietQd?
ay
twi ootu al
dcqnuoati militarytaittetedmwpitthtotnhaeme t but
teoede
ir,e
aamn ds
tat t;ecreestonrhelvicitiz
bhaidiecvoemtehattti hii: kwnasowlientfligicetedindurocd
for
s the
einato.ts,ithtrink
trifling end
antdo
pardonable Qffenees—for the most partfolgabte I,ff flees
their leilow-ereatures had suffered this horribl,- end un-
endurable torture. But returning to the phi t,ical. con-
stitution—was there any person in that fleeting so jri-
experienced as not to know that the most trifling wound
would sometimes occasion death—a wound that occa-
sioned the most trifling inconvenience, end that only for
a moment, and, as tar as the individual sufferil,g was
concerned, did not require any &sec- priori of medical:
treatment? There were peculiarities in certain consti-
tutions which rendered woends dangerous. and no skill
or sagacity of the surgeon could discover 111( m. A
slight scratch of the sk,n might produce crysipe;,es and
death; a trifling injury to the extremity of the linger
might produce lock jaw and death; the cutting of ts-
nail too closely to the skin had frequently produocd,
death; and the cutting of a corn too closely had also)
produced death; but it was laid down as a rule that;
lacerating, cutting, scoring, 'minding, and mincing the•
back of a human being would not produce death ; and.
some even spoke of it as not a disagreeable operation..
He must confess he should lika to see it tried on the
' backs of those parties; and, further—medically speak,.
ing—it was his opinion that they richly deserved the
operation.—(Cheers.) But, to make an `other appeal to the
English public, why were the autho,7ities unjust to
the officers? and he wished to speak of then" as favour-
ably as possible, but, in his opinion, that witch was
beneficial to the men ought to be applied to the oscers•
—(Cheers.) It was a great injustice to withhold it ii;"
them.—(Cheers and laughter.) If the practice were 01
good for discipline, and so effectual for the promotion of
pure morals, then the young officers had reason to com-
plain that they had not had the benefit of it. From
what he had heard, it would occasionally be advan-
tageous to them; and in any case they should have that
themselves which they advocated with reference tin
their men. If it were good for the in. it a ould be good
for the officers. If it ought to be applied to .• the men,'*
were not the officers men.—(A voice—" No, acme of
them are boys.") He always heard the expression
"officers and men," and never "officers and privates.l'
If it were good for the men it was good for the officer*
unless the officers would wish to indicate that they were
not men ; and he must say that, if they continued the
practice of flogging, they were men who certainly would
not be much admired. He heard it stated, only a few
days since, in argument, in a different place, that the
chances were that the men would shoot their officers in
battle if this punishment were not retained, and even in
a less degree occasionally used. What did they think
of the privates ? Did they think that a private had such
a peculiarity of human feeling that he was a man likely
to shoot his officers if his officers did not flog him. There
was something so curious in the logic of that argument
that he had failed to comprehend it. In his own prac-
tice, during life, he had found that if he treated men
as they ought to be treated—if he treated them as beings
possessing the same feelings us himself—having the
IMMO origin—and being ell owed With the qualities Ix*

collar to human nature, they had been pleased and at-
tache] to him. If they were to try kindly treatment
generous treatment—rewards for good conduct, the
most agreeable results would be produced. On the
other hand, if men were treated as brutes, or something
worse—if no confidence were reposed in them—if they
were treated as individuals not possessed of those qua-
lities or sentiments which actuated human beings—such
treatment invariably begot moroseness and a savage
disposition ; and such was precisely the feeling which
was to be expected. They could, in fact, feel nothing
but contempt towards the perpetrators of such cruel
practices, which were • against all justice. That which
the meeting wished to promote was that a new system
should be adopted in the army, and that instead of the
present cruelty of government, they ought to have an-
other of a different nature ; and that instead of giving
to the officers the power of punishing their men, they
should give them the power of pleasing them, and
rendering them good and efficient servants to the nation.
The English public were fully aware of the arduous
duties of a soldier, to what dangers he was exposed.
They knew that his life was but a short one, and that
during that life he was but ill paid for the services to his
country. Such a meeting as the present one, actuated
only by a desire to render a service to these whom they
believed to ee subjected to an unjust punishment, must
speak in a voice of thunder to the nation. He had al-
ready explained the moral effects of the punishment,
and its physical results were notorious. It ought not,
therefore, to exist, even in its present mitigated form.
It had dwindled from 1,000 and 1,500 to 50 lashes, and
even that endangered the life. The 150 lashes inflicted
upon that unfortunate man, whose death had been the
cause of their meeting there, was the application of
upwards of 1,200 knots of the thong upon his skin.
Let them look at the application et a thong with only
one knot upon a horse, and they could not be such de-
mons as to continue the punishment.—(Cheers.) The
date of the warrant under which he suffered was the
26th of April, and he was nut punished until the sth of
June. He would not have adverted to the circumstance,
but for the unjust attacks which had been made against
him (Mr. Wakley).—(Cheers.) He thought that, after
these attacks, he was justified in doing so.—(Cheers.)
The tribunal under which these uefertunate men were
tried, was self-constituted. and the acquittals were there-
fore not one in thirty. It was not, however, his object
to attack individuals, but a system which he believed to
be injurious to the army and navy, and was a disgrace
to a Christian country.—(Cheers.) It was against the
system that they should direct all their hostility, and in
doing so, they attacked, and furiously too, the indivi-
duals by whom it was upheld. They, who upheld it
knew the horror and the danger of the system, ant':
when the voice of the people was raised against the
system, where was the Government who, whatever
might be the feeling in other quarters, would dare to
oppose the national will? Every lean in Enelend, how-
ever poor, was ready to contribute his mire to the relief
of the soldier, because he felt that they were his
brothers—(Cheers)—and, leaving out of the question
national pride and national glory, the poor man felt
that the nation was insulted by the continuance of the
practice. A letter was that day pultlished in the Times.
signed V, stating that the writer ha 1 been thirty-six
years in the army, and was then in command of a regi-
ment, and could confidently speak from experience that
the discipline of the army: could be maintained with-
out such a brutal punishment. He had seen men
flayed alive.—(Great sensation.) He had seen a man
receive seven hundred lashes at once ; the last
two hundred were given while the man was in
a state of insensibility, and apparently dead, and for
ought he could know, dead in reality.—(Hisses.) He
Loped that there would be very little more war.—
(Cheers.) He had not the least objection to plenty of
soldiers and sailors in times of peace. War was a system
of national flogging, and as he did not like to see the
backs of soldiers mutilated, he hoped there would be
no occasion for mutilating them- in tutees of war.—
(Cheers.) He knew there were many regiments in
which a case of flogging had not occurred for the last
twenty years.—(Cheers.) Yet, curious enough, the re-
turns of those regiments hail been refused in that very
curious House, the House of Commons. He supposed
that they wished to withhold from the officers and the
exi that credit which was justly due to them—(Cheers)
—and the parties who refused those returns might
perhaps think that it would operate prejudicially to the
character of those regiments' where the practice of
flagging was kept up.—(Cheers.) (A voice—" Move
for a return.") He should like to know why such prin
ciples should not be acted upon in all the regiments.
He did net think those regiments were commanded by
what is called ‘• stern officers," but by officers who con-
sidered and treated the men as human-beings.—(Cheers.)
With these remarks he would conclude all he had to say
upon the subject, entreating those present to hear all
partie,,, and if there should be any difference of
opinion, then let them not give rise to angry feelings.
It' they could not sustain their case by argument it was
riot sustainable at all. If the meeting considered that
they adopted the right course by their present pro-
ceedings he hoped that this would prove a good be-
ginning, and that they would go on and continue the
work till they were completely triumphant.—(Cheers.)
The Hon. Member then reed a letter from T. Collett,
Esq., M.P. for Athlone, as follows :
'• Dear Sir—Will ; on be kind enough to hand the en-
closed draft for five guineas to John Mathewson. as
testimonial of my approbation of the honest -and inde-
pendent manner in which he gave his evidence upon the
late inquest at Hountlow.—Yours. faithfully,

" JOHN COLLETT."
The lion. Chairman then went on to say that he had
heard Mathewson upon a former occasion, and from the
manner in which he gave his evidence, he felt that he
could not but believe his testimony.—(Cheers ) He had
never acted, and he never would act, upon the principle
that a man, because he was rich, was to be b..lieved upon
his oath, and that a man, because he was peer, was
not to be believed. It should not be forgotten that a
private, of the name of Cook, had been singled out from
among the regiment, and in the face of his
comrades was told that he was all but guilty
of perjury, when he gave his evidence upon the
late inquest at Hounslow. He really thought that those
two unfortunate men, Mathewson and Cooke, should be
released from their services.—(Laud cheers.) He did
not like to advert te any circumstance which had trans.
pired upon that oecasiore but there was an anecdote of
poor Mathewson which he would relate. There wes
some testisnony betwr-en Mathewson and the command-
ing officer, and the latter had witnesses to support what
he stated, and Mathewson had none. Mathewson stated
with the utmost naiveté, " It is very true, there was
this interview, but I will take care when I have a pri
vate interview with the commander I will have a wit-
ness too."—(Laughter and cheers.) The Chairman then
read a leter from Luke Hansard, inclosing a cheque for
201. in favour of the objects of ire society.—(Cheers.)
A series of resolutions, as follows, were then read by
the Chairman
That the practice r f Ecourging and lacerating the
bodies of soldiers and sailers, with the cat-o'-nine-tails,
is at once cruel and disgusting, and a disgrace to the
British nation."— (Cheers.)
"That the constitutional danger of maintaining a
standing army in time of peace is exactly proportioned
to the extent to which the surlier loses the character and
feelings of a citiz n."—(Cheers.)
"That in the deliberately formed opinion of this
meeting the will of the, British nation has decreed that
the practice of flegeing in the British army and navy
shalt, at once and fer ever, be abolished."—(Cheers.)
"That it is now naiversaly known and admitted that
a sentence of flogging may prove to be a sentence of
death, and that thug a c..pltal punishment has Seen, and
might agein be, inflicted for a trifling, insignificant, and
even a r hallos' offence."—(Cheere)
" That as subititattis for floggings, degradations,
and savage punishments, this meeting earnestly and
fervently recommends the adoption, by the Government
and the commander-in-chief, of short periods of enlist-
ment, and rewards and promotions for good conduct, in
the firm belief that the adoption of a benignant and
generous behaviour towards soldiers and sailors, would
beget in them a spirit of honourable bearing, and high
moral sentiments ; and that to allege that the means of
bestowing rewards in the army and navy for good con-
duct would not be cheerfully granted by the pcop`e of
this country, is a gross libel on the generosity and judg-
ment of the British nation."—(Cheery:.)
F. LENTHALL, Esq., would not be guilty of the gross
impertinence, after the able speech they hal heard from
their chairman, of detaining them at env length. IL--
considered that the time was come when this barbarous
and disgusting treatment should cease The present
mode of punishment he did not consider as calculated to
operate in a beneficial manner; it was calculated t'
create a feeling of moroseness and revengee--(A
Voice—" Move, and cut it short.") lle would adept 1
the hint which had [yen thrown out, and would th __ere
fore move the resolutions which hid just now been read.
Mr. G. THOMPSON, in seconding the resolutions, said
that it was not his intention to have addressed the
meeting upon the present oeeasioe; he should, therefore,
content himself with simply seconding the reseltitain.
lie did not adopt that course out of any disrespecr, to the
purposes of the present meeting, but there were those
present whom they might never have an opportunity of
hearing again, and it would be an act of injustice in him
to detain the meeting from that pleasure.—(Cheers.)
In answer to a uestion put to the Chairman, he
stated, that in law White received but one punishment
for the offence.
Dr. CARLISLE wished to ask a question of the Chair-
man, and could not help, at the same time, alluding to
his manly conduct in another capacity. The question,
which he wished to be distinctly understood, was with
reference io the statement made by the Hon. Chairman.
He wished to know whether the warrant for the trial of
White had been signed a considerable time before the
offence was committed ? He also wished to know why
the Hon. Chairman, in his capacity of coroner, had not,
as was usual with him, issued his warrant for the appre-
hension of those persons who had inflicted the lashes
which the jury had stated had caused the death of private
White?
Mr. IVAKLEY Said, that with reference to the warrant,
he had stated that it was dated on the 26th April, and
• the crime was committed in June. Such was the stars
of the law, with respect to the second question, he
would state, that if a verdict of wilful murder had been
returned by the jury, he would unhesitatingly have
issu id his warrant the apprAensi,,,n of the parties
concerned.--(Loud cheers.)
Mr. BRIDGEMAN, M.P.. aid that he ones comtna,nded
a body of grenadiers, arid up n one occasion he called
his men together, and said that he had the power to flog.
but he was determined not to use it; he had ro)t done so
upon any 'occasion, and he wished to know why, in the
Lace of these facts, flogeing in the army collet not be

abolished ? Ile hoped that the degrading system of
flogging would soon be retnov,d, and th a every elector
r t,shold press upon their candidates the necessity of their
—• voting tor its abolition.—(Loud cheers.)
Mr. JOHNSON NEIL, now of the bar, but late of the
navy, nextaddressed the meeting, and said- he was OA
to see a a deterniimrl Ftani. being male against a
item which be h,l all his lira datestc(l,
.