The Sun.
London, England, 1846-01-30 00:00:00

towns, who got up those schemes for their own private pur-
poses ; at the same time be would say it would be better to have
the millions squanderedaway in these railways in England, than
in speculations in Russia.
The Duke of MONTROSE said it was very necessary that
a Committee should be appointed to consider the best means to
adopt with respect to the number of projects now before the
country, in order that they might consider whether it was in-
cumbent that the large amonnt of capital which might be re-
quired to construct them should be expended or not. He was,
however, of opinion, that great inconvenience would arise unless
the course proposed by the Committee for the adoption of Par-
liment was known at an early day. They must recollect that
the deposits would have to be paid to the Accountant-General
in a very short time, and that very soon after that period, those
projects, who had complied with this order, must be submitted
to the Standing Orders Committee, and unless the Committee
reported on the subject before the time of paying the deposits,
they would prevent a great number of schemes from paying
their deposits at all, so that great inconvenience would result
from the money being locked up. And then, again, if the
Committee were obliged to report in a hurried manner great
difficulty could not fail to arise on acocunt of its being impes-
s ble to decide on the immense mass of Bills which would be
submitted to them, notwithstanding the facilities which the
Government would give to them for the purpose of facilitating
their labours. Then he could not understand the principle on
which the Government could recommend that some schemes
should be entertained and others objected to—what railways
would be required in some parts of the country, and which
scheme out of the many projected in the same district
should be selected. It was true there could not be much doubt
in determining on a project traversing a district suffering from
the present inefficient means of communication ; but it was,
possible, on account of the variety of interests to be consulted,
and the difficulty in deciding justly on them all, that a railway
got up by attorneys and persons of no property or in-
fluence, might be selected instead of one in which landed pro-
prietors and others, whose interests would be materially affected,
and which had the advantage and recommendation of being
bona fide. He only mentioned these things to show the diffi-
culties with which the consideration of the subject was sur-
rounded, and the great necessity of taking measures to give all
the railways of a bona fide character mature and serious consi-
deration.

Earl GREY entirely concurred in the propriety of appoint-
ing this Committee, but he hoped that they would not be con-
sidered as pledging themselves to the very novel principle of
limiting the amount of capital which Parliament chose to con-
sider the country could afford for the construction of railways.
The more he heard that principle explained and discussed the
more doubtful did it become. It appeared to him that what
Parliament ought to do was to see that the parties applying for
power to make a railway really had the capital which they pro-
fessed to have. Next, that the capital was sufficient for the
object in view, and that the object, if attained, would be bene-
ficial to the public. _ _

Lord REbESDALE—That should be the first inquiry.
Earl GREY—That should be the first consideration. Then
they should inquire whether the prepared works would inter-
fere unnecessarily or injuriously with private property. If
those inquiries were answered satisfactorily, for his part, he did
not see that it was right for Parliament to interfere further.
Those parties who subscribed the capital were the best judges
as to whether that capital ought to be invested in railways or
not. In his opinion, Parliament would be stepping beyond its
proper functions if it attempted to decide hose much capital
the nation ought to devote to the construction of railwa s.
That which affected private interests must at the same time
affect the interests of the public. It could not be shown that
the projectors were in a position, with a sufficient capital and
full means, to carry forward their work, then Parliament could
interfere and stop their proceeding further. It would
only remain for the Legislature to refuse Parlia-
mentary powers, where such power ought to be refused.
It would lead to no useful conclusion, if they gave these mat-
ters only a hasty and artificial consideration. He had felt it
necessary to make these remarks, in order that it might not be
supposed that, in giving his concurrence to the appointment of
this Committee, he meant to recognise the justice of one of
the principles that that Committee intended to carry out. He
considered it desirable that the Committee should look closely
into the means by which they proposed to diminish the expense
of the proceedings, and the great labour which must be im-
posed upon these Committees. There had been a suggestion
thrown out last year, and he considered it a very good one, and
he was anxious that their Lordships should take it into their
consideration. In the separate Committees during the last
year, it happened that, where there were competing lines, one
of them was sanctioned by the Committee of the other House,
and the rival line was sanctioned by the Committee of that
House. Thus both were lost to the parties, and great expense
was incurred. Now, he should like to know whether they
could net have a joint Committee, acting for both Houses.
This would certainly diminish the labour thrown on each indi-
dual Member of that House, and he thought it possible that
every technical difficulty could be got rid of.
Lord ASH BUR'I ON thought that considerable difficulty
would be found in ascertaining which schemes had a sufficient
capital, for all they had before them was a list of names, all
of whom, from A, B, and C downwards, got their scrip, and
went into the market for the purpose of selling it at a premium.
It would, in his opinion, be absolutely impossible to tell whe-
ther each scheme had a sufficiency of capital to carry it out.
Lord MONTEAGLE said that they could not effect the ob-
ject desired by the Noble Earl as long as the House of Com-
mons dealt with railways and with money bills. It was ut-
terly imeo=sible that their Lordships could overtake the busi-
ness which would come before them. Their Lordships would
recollect the late period at which the majority of these Bills
came before them. In March, April, and May, II railway
Bills came up to their Lordships' House from the House of
Commons ; in June, 81 ; and in July, 25 ; so that they had
generally to deal with private business at a time when the pub-
lic business before their Lordships was the most pressing. The
House of Commons had the exclusive right of dealing with the
taxation of the country, and God forbid that the House of
Lords should ever interfere with this branch of the legislature.
It was upon this principle that a railway measure could net
come before their Lordships before it had been before the
House of Commons, because it was looked upon in the light of
a money Hear.) But, in his opinion, this rule applied
to railway Bills was most prepostdrous; and, from personal
communications he had had with several Members of the
HeUse of Commons, he knew that many men of the greatest
experience were disposed to take the same view of the matter.
Formerly a certain class of criminal measures were treated a•
money Bills ; but the absurdity of the rule was afterwards
found out, and it was no sooner discovered than it was aban-
doned. Under these circumstances, then, he would suggest
hat, in the existing state of the people of Ireland in relation
to food, the labours of Parliament should, as far as it WAS rea-.
senable
and just, be directed to the encouragement of ra;.',-way
measures.

Lord BROUGHAM—They should be cast into the balance.
Lord MONTEAGLE—Just so; and for that purpose, he
would suggest for the consideration of Government, and others
whose duty it would be to consider the matter, the propriety, if
not the necessity, of dividing equally the railway business of the
session between the two Houses of Parliament.—( Hear, hear.)
Lord REDESDALE said, after all, the question to be con-
sidered was this—could the Legislature get through 650 Bills
in the course of one session. For his part, he thought it
was absolutely impossible, and therefore he thought the House
was adopting a very proper eotrse in appointing a Committee
to consider the subject. if they hadltpursued the old system,
the good and bad schemes would be jostelling each other to get
into the Committee first, and at the end of the session it would
be disagreeably discovered that same of the Bills which were of
the utmost importance had failed in getting through Committee.
He wished to say a few words upon a remark which fell from
the Noble Lord, with reference to the opinion which he stated
the public had entertained of the Committees of that House
—that they were not a fair Committee. He did not think any-
thing that he had heard could induce him to be of that opinion.
—( Hear, hear.) Committees of that House are, in their
very nature, uncertain, as all other tribunals are. As far as
he knew, the Committees had acted according to what they
considered the merits.nf the case. and in no instance had any
feeling of private interest, or any other motive, been allowed
to influence their decision.

The Earl of KINNAIRD said that he meant that they
were not Competent judges..-=that they had not sufficient infor-
mation before them to enable them to come to a just decision.
He looked upon the Committees of that House with the great-
est respect. He had heard eminent leading counsel say, with
reference to matters brought before them, " That will do for
the Cornmong—it will not do for the Lords."

_. _.
Earl DALHOUSIE then moved the appointment of the
Committee.

Lord BROUGHAM considered that every member of the
Committee should solemnly promise not to open his mouth
with reference to the decisions likely to be come to by the
Committee.
The Duke of WELLINGTON asked if the Noble Lord
would like it to be a Secret Committee ?
Earl ELLENBOROUGH thought that there was no neces-
sity for making it a Secret Committee. He was sure that no
Noble Lord would allow any information to come from him.
Earl DALHOUSIE stated that. the Committee would pre-
sent their reports to the House as soon as they had come to a
decision. •
Their Lordships then adjourned until Monday next.

HOUSE OF COMMONS, Thitrsday, Jan. 29.
The SPEAKER took the Chair a few minutes before
four o'clock.

Petitions were presented for leave to bring in the fol-
lowing railway Bills, viz.:—The Colchester and Stour
Valley ; Manchester, Matlock, and Midland ; Man
chester and Southampton ; North Junction ; several
extensions of the York and North Midland Railway ;
Cheltenham and Oxford ; Newport Pagnell ; London
and Birmingham (St. Albans, and other branches, in-
cluding the Rugby and Stamford Extension) ; the
London, Hounslow, and Great Western Junction ;
Great Western and Uxbridge ; and the Manchester,
Sheffield, and Rotherham.

A petition was presented from the trustees of the
Woodstock-road, praying to be heard by counsel against
the Bury St. Edmund's Railway Bill.
Mr. ALLIX presented a petition from the inhabitants
of the Isle of Ely against any alteration in the prezent
corn -laws.
Several petitions were presented in favour of Lord
Ashley's Ten Hours' Bill.
Mr. T. DUNCOMIIE presented a petition from the
inhabitants of the West Riding of Yorkshire, praying
the House to pass into a law the Ten Hours' Bill. The
lion. ilember also presented a petition from the inhabi-
tants of Reading against any increase in the Parliamen-
tary grant for the services of the army and navy, and
against the embodiment of the militia.
Sir R. H. INGLIS moved for a return of the duties
received in the last financial year on each of the several
articles enumerated in the resolution moved, on the 27th
of January, 1846, by the Right Hon. Baronet Sir R. Peel.
THE GAME-LAWS.
Mr. BRIGHT gave notice that, on Monday next, be
would move the re-appointment of the Committee on
the game-laws.

ADJOURNMENT OF THE HOUSE.—THE
MILITIA.
Sir ROBERT PEEL said that, as his Right Hon.
Friend had given notice of his intention to move that the
House at its rising do adjourn till Monday, he would
now move, therefore, that the House at its rising do ad-
journ till Monday next.
On the question being put from the Chair,
Mr. THOMAS DUNCOMBE rose to ask a question
respecting tho embotlimeut of the militia. The
country had been led to understand that an embodi-
ment of the militia would take place on an early day,
and great excitement and alarm in consequence pre-
vailed as to the • manner in which, and time when, this
raising of the force would take place. Clubs were form
ing to And substitutes for those who might be climax),
and, in many instances, associations of persons were
forming to protect parties in offering passive resistance
to the service. What he wantkd to ki!ow,was, whether
an early embodiment of the militia was to take
place, and whether it was to VI raiide under the
pres nt law, or that a new one was to be intrudue d ?
If a Bill was be iiittoducili. he hoped it wiaild be done
on IPA early day, and not when the session was advanced,
so that the whole question mitt4lit be fully considered.
Sir J. GRAHAM said that it was the intention of the