The Sun.
London, England, 1848-02-18 00:00:00

kind, for they could only be consulted on questions of
law arising on the proceedings of the house in its
-- legislative or judicial character. As to the fears of the
Right Rev. Prelate, he would say that all the, Bill wr.s
intended to accomplish was to place the law clearly and
undoubtedly on the footing on which the Right Rey.
Prelate stated it now rested, and to make it lawful fur
her Majesty to appoint an ambassador to the Court of
Rome should she so think fit, on the advice of her re-
sponsible Ministers.—(Hear, hear.)
The Duke of RICHMOND said he was prepared to
vote against the second reading of this Bill, for in his
opinion there never had been a time less fitting than the
present to make any further concession to the Roman
Catholics. This measure would be considered a con-
cession by the Roman Catholics of Ireland, who, with
their priests, had already taught this country the lesson,
that the more that was given the more they demanded;
the greater the concession the more ungrateful they
were for what wss done for them He entirely con-
, curred with his Noble Friend who had moved that this
Bill be read a second time thie day six months; nt the
same time he asked his Noble Friend not to divide the
Rouse on this occasion, because it was clear from the
state of the House the Government had a majority pre-
sent, and a division showing that majority might in-
crease the alarm throughout the country. lie felt that
this measure ought not to pass—he entered his protest
against it, and though he was willing to go into Corn
mittee for the amendment of the Noble Duke (Duke of
Wellington), and for that prohibiting any ecclesiatic
being received as an ambassador from the Court of
Rome, nothing would induce him to go one step further
witk the Bill.—(Hear, hear.)
The Earl of ELDON said, as yet he had not beard a
tingle valid reason why this Bill even as amended ha the
manner proposed should pass into a law. lie admitted
the importance of the measure, but thought, at least, it
Ought to be postponed until the next session of Par-
liament, in order that time might be afforded for a
distinct surrender by the Pope of the claim made by his
predecessors of a right to interfere with the temporal
rights of the Sovereign of this realm. This surrender
the country had a right to expect to be made, and, with
these views, if the question went to a division, he should
give his vote against the second reading of the Bill.
The Earl of ST. GERMANS thought the vast num-
bers of Roman Catholics who were to be found in every
part of the British dominions certainly did render it
most expedient that every facility should be given to the
Government to hold communications with the Pope,
whom they acknowledged as their head. He hesitated
not to say, that if such relations as it was the object of
.• s this Bill to establish had existed years ago, we should
not have heard so much of the violent conduct of certain
parties recently in Ireland. It was impossible for cases
. , not to arise in some part of her Majesty's dominions, in
' e reference to Roman Catholics, hi which a consultation
with the Pope on behalf the British Government would
have a most beneficial effect on the peace and security
of these realms. He did not at all participate in
the apprehensions of the Noble Lord (Lord Stank)).
Those apprehensions, in his opinion, were perfectly idle
and chimerical. It was competent to the Pope to send
.attY number of missionaries, Jesuits or others, members
of religious orders, to this country at the present time.
lie knew perfectly well that there were many such in this
Country at the present time, The agents of Rome were
e . 2-busily engaged in this country, but if the chief agent
s-• . Were regularly appointed an ambassador to the British
• .."Court, there would then be less danger than there was
. at present, because all his acts would be more closely
. watched and better known.—(Hear, hear.) Other Pro-
: netestafat countries had long ago taken the step proposed
Y,' ' ..by this Bill. It should be recollected that this was not
`n l'!no a Bill to compel her Majesty to hold communication
''A''.l: '''e,'Ovith Rome ; if at any time it should be found expedient
es ee_
.Iti.
,e en 'to cut off such communication, it would be perfectly
lienl.coin-
a,tent to her Majesty to do so on the reasonable repro-
!:',. g.ittistitions of the British Government.—(Hear, hear.)
'n'',---. "Their Lordillipe might be aware that a gentleman
~. professing the Roman Catholic religion (Mr. More
' O'Ferrall) had been recently appointed Governor
' Cf Malta, and it appeared that some differences
existed between the Roman Catholic Bishop of that
island and the Government. Now, their Lordships
, must perceive the great advantage which would arise to
. her Majesty being allowed to hold direct communica-
tions with the Pope on the subject of those differences.
. The Pope, on being appealed to by the British Govern-
meat, might interfere for the purpose of requiring the
subordinate bishop to accede to the wishes of the British
Government.—(Hear, hear.) He trusted that their
Lordships would withanction the introduction of tan
ecclesiastic clauseregard to the exclusion of an
Courtfcclesiaetic from the office of ambassador from the
of Rome, because the proposition was most mon-
strous.—(llear, hear.) None of the other Courts to
which Rome sent a representative required any such
stipulation. With regard to what had fallen from the
Noble Earl, as to upholding in all its integrity the su-
retaaey of her Majesty, he heartily concurred therein,
Ind would be prepared to support any clause that
might be deemed necessary for preserving it to the
fullest extent.—(Cheers.)
_ , Lord REDESDALE did not think it desirable to enter
:tr present into a discussion of the proposed amendment
lis_th r.rse Noble Earl as to the exclusion of ecclesiastics.
"e ope hadenn esee supreme authority in this country
!1.1 temporal as well as spirituel matters, and it behoved
their Lordships to watch the efforts of Rune with ex-
treme jealousy. Before the Bill was allowed to pass this
country ought to receive an assurance that the temporal
li,,Uotherity to which he alluded was no longer claimed 1.33 r
~ 'be- For the purpose of abolishing any pretensions
of that sort, he had prepared a clause which he should
noose in Committee. It was to the following effect:—
, •
_Provided always, and be it enacted, that it shall not
ar,
ab_
.clloawful for her Majesty to receive any such Ambas-
Envooffir,yceExtraordinary, Minister Plenipotentiary,
_t. other
until the Court of Rome shall have
deelared that it doth not claim, and distinctly disown,
anY temporal or civil jurisdiction, power, superiority, or
pre-eminence direct or indirect, within this realm.'
The Marquis of LANSI)OWNE replied. With refe-
rence to what had fallen from the Noble Duke opposite
(thee Duke of Richmond) he begged to say that this Bill
offered no concession to the Pope. It was a concession
to expediency, to state necessity ; it would afford facili-
ties to this country to defend and assert its best inte-
rests—(heer, hear)—and that was the ground on which
it was recommended to the Legislature. Let it not go
forth!to the public that this measure made any conces-
°ion to the Roman Catholics. With regard to the ex-
. nressions of the Noble Lord (Lord Stanley) in reference
to Lord Minto's mission to Rome, he was also anxious to
say that there was not one act connected with that mis-
-B,l'nn, no one letter or instruction given to the Earl of
f'finto, no one act done by the Earl of Minto, which he
t_11:) Marquis of Lansdowne) was not prepared to defend,
and which he was not prepared to state had been done for
the advantage and interests of the country, and which,
ci,..lt were to be done again he should not be prepared to
inen(ilear.) That very mission, so dwelt apon by the
tlble Lord, to his (the Marquis of Lansdowne's) mind,
,e "Domed the best, the strongest, and the most unanswer-
"tueel e that could be selected for illustrating the paramount
411,..aa11y of this Bill.—(Cheers.) By Earl Minto's pre-
in;" ill Switzerland a horrid civil war, which might have
meted the whole of Europe, was prevented.
liked STANLEY—That has nothing to do with this
eTite Marquis of LANSDOWNE contended that it had
. erence
lotred 'to the very object for which the Bill had been
13140 need. The Right Rev. Prelate near him (the
els") of Winchester) said the Government were
pli,hsnY enabled to do that which they sought to accorn-
nethevY this Bill, and therefore the measure was alto-
di r ueneces Th w s however, this important
seuev necessary. ere; a ,
do
Which
'Qn to be drawn, that the Government sought to
Which an open and avowed manner, and by means
that
which was now effected secretly, indirectly,
an rcuitousl —Li ar hear.) The mission of Earl
.‘ullt° had beenY. ( e ' Lord
ker., referred to. That Noble was
• tad red to Switzerland, he was accredited to Florence
tloeenae now accredited to Naples. In passing from
deli nn co to Naples, he certainly did, but not without
his :V., pass some time at Rome, and the necessity of
the cling there without a distinct mission was one of
nfouidstrengest reasons for passing a measure which
ken, enable us to enter into direct and explicit diplo-
hea..,e°rnmunication with the Court of Rome.—(Hear,
down (')11 these grounds, he (the Marquis of Lana-
Becob.,/ hoped their Lordships would consent to the
ent. n reading of the Bill. If their Lordships should
t,,,rtent,t to the second reading he should fix to-mor-
tho `'rriday) forgoing into Compeittee, and he
nght aft
or "in !l* the time that had already been afforded
a da.,. daringafter
the measure that would not be too early
The.). ---(llear.)
meat Duke -Duke of NEWCASTLE withdrew his amend-
oru,r,,anbd the Bill was then read a second time, and
nnt,,vt to be committed to-morrow (this day).
tt Lordships then adjourned.

Th ei
IIIOUSE OF COM N
MOS, Feb. 17.
Poure 0
cock. ?I'EAKER took the Chair a few minutes before

Sir J.. MARLOW ELECTION.
tiitte PAKINGTON reported from theCorn-
certme appointed to try the merits of the petition of
electors of the borough of Great Marlow
40jost the return of 11,.0
lr. Thomas Price Williams
thrlitti ti e,tritehlesergowoontlioeNmvelo‘.haa
ox, that they had decided
been duly elected.
lti THE WINDOW DUTIES. _
iteho petition IACGREGOR presented a from
th!tasters in Glasgow, praying for the repeal of
I,olvindow duties.
to thrd ALFRED PAGET presented a petition
I.,',ptne effect from Lichfield.
IS
rE DEFENCES OF THE COUNTRY.
akcai lIROTHERTON presented several petitions
Si any increase in our war establishments.
fron,"'„uar petitions were presented by 111 r. Wyld,
by NI 430oirnin ; by Dr. Bowring • by Mr. Bouverie ;
lead Cobden, from the West Riding of Yorkshire,
other places ' • and by Mr. Osborne, from Staines.
HEALTII OF TOWNS.
turtyo; LUSFEILD presented a petition from the
tll,aad aldermen of Bradford in favour of this

JEWISH DISABILITIES BILL.
to' 110\VRING presented several petitions in
Or." this Bill.
frotxlmilar petitions were presented by Mr. Cowan,
castle;balkeith
; by an Hon. Member, from New-
and bY another lion. Member, from Portarlington ;
by Lord A. Paget (3), from Lichfield.
.A.II.I:2,„°RNEYS' CERTIFICATE DUTY.four
tolkito 4..LuDG-r-41'S presented a petition from
An As' Praying. for the real of this duty.
In.
truer of presented a considerable nu
.51
de to the same effect, from solicitors It
tv,j),,,3l_eldt ]Sdarliet Drayton,. Hereford, Govor
'4"4431 and other placels.