The Sun.
London, England, 1848-09-28 00:00:00

THE CHARTIST TRIALS.

CENTRAL CRIMINAL COURT.
OLD COURT.
TRIAL OF CUFFEY, FAY, AND LACY.

(Continued from our Afternoon Edition of yesterday.)
Davis was recalled, and said he was at the meeting on
the 14th of August, at the Orange Tree.
The ATTORNEY-GENERAL proposed to put the state-
ment written by Superintendent Masks into the witness'
hands. _ _ _ _ . _ _

4-Mc:BALLANTINE objected to its being put into his
hands. There was no precedent for such a course, and
he trusted it would never be made one. What guaran-
tee was there that the statement was accurately taken
down? Evidence of this important kind should be
wholly free from suspicion.
Mr. PARRY followed on the same side.
The ATTORNEY'•GENERAL contended that the evi-
dence was admissible, and cited cases in support of his
view.

Mr. Justice WILLIAMS was of opinion that the evi-
dence was admissible, but considered that owing to the
' witness having been in court during the greater part of
the discussion, the placing of the document in the wit-
ness's hands to refresh his memory would not be satis-
factory.
The ATTORNEY-GENERAL said, then he would exa-
mine the witness without showing him the paper. No
doubt that would be more satisfactory to his Lordship.
Mr. Justice WILLIAMS thought it would.
The examination of the witness was then resumed. He
said, I recollect being at the Lord Denman on the day
before the intended rising. Twenty-eight or thirty per-
sons were present. Richie was among them, and a per-
son named Johnson (Powell, the approver) was likewise
present. Mullins was chairman at that meeting, and he
and Brewster, Cuffey, Payne, and Lacy, went out as a
sub-committee. They all returned in about three-
quarters of an hour except Lacy, and Mullins said
they had come to the conclusion to have an outbreak
on the following evening, and that he himself would take
the Seven-dials district, and Payne, Brewster, and Bar-
rett were to lead three other divisions. Tri-coloured
bands were distributed for the leaders, and witness had
two given to him, one for himself and another for a de-
legate who could not attend. The witness they pro-
ceeded to give a detail of what occurred at this meeting.
corroborating the evidence of the approver. He deposed
that Richie was to command the " luminaries, as
the fire men were termed, who were to meet
at the Orange Tree on the 16th, and that
the pass-word by which he was to know them was
" justice." He also said that a person, who was one of
the bail of Ernest Jones, was also ipresent at the meet-
ing of the 15th. He was likewise present at a previous
meeting, when Mullins proposed that each delegate
should provide men, who were willing to fire houses, or
do anything of that kind that might be required of them;
and Cuffey at the same meeting remarked that " it was
' no use mincing the matter, for all their necks were in
danger, and they might as well speak out plainly." He
only knew Johnson by that name, and he had no idea
that he was communicating with the police until he read
an account of his examination at the police-court. He
had no idea before then that he was a spy, and he was
the last man he should have suspected. He said that
at another meeting some person who was a stranger to
him represented that the Irish brigade had all provided
themselves with muskets and several rounds of ball-car
tridges, and they were ready to act in any manner in
co-operation with the Chartists. The " visionary pre-
sident " referred to by the witness Powell, he said, he
understood, was in reality intended to be a person named
Churchill, then residing in France, and all the Chartists
in each locality were to pay a farthing a week each for
his support.
The ATTORNEY-GENERAL here asked the witness
whether at any of the meetings it was proposed that
men should go round the town at night, and see what
force the Government had at its disposal?

Mr. BALLANTINE objected to the question. It was
like asking the witness whether the prisoners were
guilty of high treason.
Mr. PARRY—It was a scandalous question.
The ATTORNEY-GENERAL said the Learned Counsel
had no right to make such an observation. In the course
of a long examination like the present it was impos-
sible always to keep within the strict rules of evidence.
The witness then proceeded to state that Mullins told
him they intended to erect barricades from the Seven-
dials down Drury-lane to St. Mary's Church, in the
Strand, and he showed him a plan with the barricades
erected upon it. He also said that Temple-bar would
make a good barricade, and then they were to go down
to the water-side and make sure of Chaplain and
Horne's premises. Another party was to go into the
City and to take possession of St. Paul's Church.—(A
laugh.) The witness said that he attended the meetings
as a delegate from Greenwich, and was acknowledged in
that capacity. He said that he knew Dowling as the
secretary of the Davis Club, and he knew that he was
a Confederate, and Payne, Mullins, and Brewster, were
specially appointed to draw up plans for attacking the
police and the soldiers.
Cross-examined by Mr. BALLANTINE—I was not a
Chartist, but merely joined them for the purpose of ob-
taining information. I wished to ingratiate myself with
these people on-purpose that I might betray them. I
b
was not employed as a spy by any one, but I created
myself a spy. I had no object of emolument, but merely
desired to protect life and property. I wished to retire
from the business several times, but the superintendent
and inspector of police would not let me. I did n)t
expect to be paid any more remuneration than will
make up for the loss of trade I have sustained. The
Government have not made me any promise of re-
muneration. In the last few weeks the people at
Greenwich have suspected me of being a spy, and I have
lost my trade in consequence of it. I was not examined
before a magistrate, and I am sure the prisoners would
have no means of knowing what I was going to say. I
came here to-day as a voluntary witness. I applied to
be examined, and I was not summoned or aubmined. I
have been asked to appear as a witness, but I refused.
I came forward in consequence of what I read in the
newspaper of the cross-examination of Powell, and see-
ing that he made rather a bad figure, and knowing
that such charges could not be brought against me, I
thought I would come forward and give evidence of the
truth. I thought the jury would not believe him on his
oath.

Mr. BALLANTINE—Perhaps, after reading what you
did of him, you would not yourself believe him on his
oath? Witness—l should in this matter, because 1 know
he spoke the truth.
Cross-examination continued—l used to carry loaded
pistols for my own protection. I never got up any
meeting myself. I communicated with the inspector of
police this morning, and asked his advice whether I
should come up or not, and by his advice I did so.
By the ATTORNEY •GENERAL—The paper I saw was
the Morning Advertiser. I read the cross-examination
of Powell, and I immediately communicated with the
police. Before I read
_the paper I had no intention to
give evidence.
Charles Baldwinson deposed that he was a class-leader
of the Lambeth Chartist locality, which held its meet-
ings at the Chartist-hall, Webber-street. He deposed
that ho was present at the meeting on the 15th, and that
the proposition was made for the rising to take place on
the following day, and witness and the other class-
leaders were told they wore to bring their men armed
the following night, and those who had not got arms
were to be told where they would get arms. They were
to meet first at the Peacock, and then they were to go to
the Broadway, Westminster, 'where they were to meet
the Dean-street !locality. He was also told that there
were to be three other divisions assembled at different
parts of the town. At eight orlock in the evening of the,
16th:he went to the Peacock, and found Morgan, Conway,
Pedlar, Winshare, and Chester there, and Pedlar pro •
duced some coloured ribbons for the delegates to wear
on their arms, so that their men might know them. Ho
also produced some gunpowder, and made cartridges
with. it. Witness had a pistol with him, and Pedler gave
h
tphrroeceeemdeindute to s
afterthe Angel,the
un a cartridge to charge it with. In consequence of
something the landlady said they left the Peacock, and
inleVree bbe r s tre. e t,an d about
apprehended them. Hy e gotadded, th thethat
hpe had given camein and
infor-
mation to the police about three o'clock in the afternoon
of the 16th.
Vll
r°sB.-eUrnilled'lle gay 9 no idortuation to the