The Sun.
London, England, 1846-06-09 00:00:00

RAILWAY COMMITTEES,
(iESTERDAY.)

HOUSE OF LORDS.
GROUP I.
IMPORTAN T DECISION.
LONDON AND YORK (TEE EASTERN
COUNTIES).
(Continued from our Afternoon Edition of yesterday.)
The CHAIRMAN said—l have to request your attention to the case
of the landowners on the line. There is the case of the Archbishop
of York, where you interfere with his property. I think you should
have clauses to meet his objections to the present interference with
his property.
Lord ITlviAN—There is also the case of Mr. Chapman. I think
something must be done for the landowners.
Mr. Sergeant KINGLAKE said that he had to inform their Lordships
that clauses which met with the approval of the landowners had been
drawn up.
The clauses of the Bill were then proceeded with, and after some
amendments they were agreed to.
The following Bills, being unopposed, were called on and
agreed to :
The Ycrk and North Midland Railway (widening and enlarge-
ment), the Sheffield and Lincolnshire Extension Railway, and the
Ely and Huntingdon (Bedford Extension).
The Committee said that they would report to the House, if pos-
sible, that evening, and pray to be discharged.
The Committee then adjourned to four o'clock on Thursday, when
they will meetpro forma, if discharged from farther attendance,
and if not, to select the first Bill to be heard out of the following in
the group :
The Sheffield and Lincolnshire Junction Railway; the Doncaster,
Wakefield, and Leeds Railway ; the Manchester and Lincoln Untioe;
Railway, and Chesterfield and Gainsborough Canal ; the Muncnd Ely
hes
Midland, and Great Grimsby Junction Railway ; the Lynn
(Extension to March) ; the Lynn and Ely (Extension to SP and the
) ;
the Wisbeach, St. Ives, and Cambridge Junction Railway ;
Stamford and Spalding Railway.

HOUSE OF CONIAIONS.
GROUP 11.
CORNWALL AZIAVILY.
The Committee met as usual ; Viscount 3torpeth in the chair.
The witnesses examined this day were, Sir Charles Napier, M.P.,
Mr. Harrison, Mr. Ramsden, Mr. Walker, the Admiralty engineer,
Mr. 3lainewright, and Mr. Taylor. The evidence was almost en-
tirely confined to the effect which the railway would have upon the
navigation of the Ilamoaze. The bridge proposed to be constructed
over the river would be 70 feet in height. It was considered that the
trains crossing the Hamoaze by means of a steam ferry would be
a great inconvenience to the navy, and of the river, if not altoge-
ther impracticable.
The Committee then adjourned,

GROUP XIII.
AYRSHIRE AND
(Continued from our Afternoon Edition of yesterday.)l
This line, which is proposed to run from a point on the Solway
Firth, near to Kirkcudbright, through New Galloway, Carspbairn,
and Dalmellington, to the port of Ayr, was then proceeded with.
There are several petitioning landowners against the Bill, and the
Glasgow and Belfast Union Company also opposes the project, on the
ground that it competes with their line at the Ayr termination.
Mr. Sergeant Beßasis and Mr. Calvert appeared for the pe-
titioners.

Mr. PATTEN opened the c-se on behalf of the promoters. He
stated that the line was fifty-eight miles in length, and was proposed
to connect the Solway Firth at Balcarry Bay with the Firth of Clyde
at Ayr, so as to open up one of the best mineral districts in
Scotland.

Mr. Williamson, mining engineer, deposed as to the mineral field
along the route of the line. It was called the Dalmellington Coal-
Field, and commenced at Patna. It abounded id coal, limestone,
and ironstone. The line passed seven miles through the field.
There were large quantities of blackband ironstone, which in many
places rose to the surface. The railway would lae of great service
in affording outlets to the minerals.
The Committee adjourned tin to-morrow at twelve o'clock.

(MOUT' XVII.
MANCHESTER AND SOUTHAMPTON, AND
SOUTH—WESTERN (ROVISET AND =MD..
BRIDGE BRANCH).
The Committee met this morning, at twelve o'clock ; the Hon.
E. Yorke in the chair.
The first witness called was Mr. Joseph Clarke, snperintendent of
ateam•-vessels, plying between the Isle of Wight and Portsmouth and
Southampton, who stated that 14,980 persons passed to and fro an-
nually ; 12,480 between Southampton and Havre, and 129,400 annu-
ally, who embarked and disembarked at the Royal I'icr. Direct
communication between Southampton and Cheltenham was much
Wanted.

Mr. W. Squire, merchant and shipowner in the Isle of Wight,
stated that the glass manufactories of Birmingham were supplied
with sand from the Isle of Wight, which was now shipped at Yar-
mouth, in the Isle of Wight, and sent round the coast to Gloucester,
from whence it was transmitted to its destination by canal; but it
was attended with great delay 3 and inconveniences. The demand
for sand had increased in consequence of the reduction of the duty
upon glass. One of these complaints emanated from Mr.
P. Harris, one of the largest glass rnanufacturtrs in Europe,
who stated that he had 300 of his workpeople unemployed, in conse-
quence of the irregular supply of the commodity, whom he said he
should be compelled to discharge if he did not get a supply imme-
diately.
Mr. P. Harris, glass manufacturer, at Islington, near Birmingham,
corroborated the statement of the last witness. The sand from the
Isle of Wight was of a superior quality. Continuous communication
without break of gauge with the north would be most advantageous.

Mr J. George, grocer at Romsey, had sugar from London which
came round the coast. The Manchester and Southampton would be
of more advantage than the Romsey and Redbridge Railway, as it
opens up direct communication in addition to the north.
Mr. G. Powell, ironfounder, Andover, considered that the proposed
line would save bins 1/. in the conveyance of his goods. The pre-
sent delays and expense of transit prohibited the extension of his
business. He should save ss. per ton in the transit of timber. Con-
sumed about 400 tons in the course of the year, 300 tons of which
he obtained from Wa;es, and the remainder from Scotland. By the
line proposed he should be able to compete more successfully with
other manufacturers.

Mr. J. Rawlings, an estate agent in Wilts, detailed at great length
the advantages which the line would confer on all the districts it
would traverse.

The Committee adjourned until 12 to morrow.

GROUP XVIII.
EXETER (GREAT WESTERN).
(Continued from our Afternoon Edition of yesterday.)

J. W. Buller, Esq., late M.P. for Exeter, and Mr. Drummond, of
Exeter, gave evidence in favour of the line; also regarding the
western traffic.

Mr. Mitchell, M.P. for Bridport, and Mr. Wells, magistrate of
Bridport, gave evidence in favour of the line.
The Committee then adjourned.

GROUP XX.

This Committee met at twelve o'clock this morning, in Room 31 ;
Mr. Sotheron in the chair.

LONDON, HOITNSLOW, AND WESTERN.

The examination of witnesses on the p•irt of the petitioners against
the Bill was proceeded with.
The first two witnesses examined were market-gardeners, who
gave their opinion that the proposed line would be of little or no use
to their business, and that it would be used by very few gardeners.
The COMMITTEE expressed their opinion that any further evidence
on this point would be superfluous. _ _ .

Mr. Nelson, a solicitor, and one of the petitioners, was then called,
and spoke to the injury this line would do to certain property be-
longing to him at Putney. As laid down the line would pass through
his house, and even using the extreme limits of deviation the line
would pass close to the wall. It would also do great injury to the
property of Lady Shelley and others.
Mr. Salter, clerk to the Hammersmith vestry, gave evidence as to
a meeting of the Hammersmith vestry, at which a resolution con-
demnatory of this line wis passed almost unanimously. An amend-
ment was proposed, but only 27 members voted, and of these 9 were
for, and 18 against the amendment.
Mr Hughes. a salesman, in Covent-garden market, gave evidence
against the MU.

Mr. Warren, a land surveyor, was then called, and said that he
had made an estimate of the cost of the land proposed to be taken
by this line, which he raid would not be less than 104,720/.
The Rev. Mr. Baker, the rector of Fulham ; Mr. ranter, con-
tractor ; Mr. Charles Lloyd, farmer, and other witnesses, gave ge-
dence against the Bill.

Mr. Key, secretary and manager of the Fulham Omnibus Association,
stated that he had held that situation about thirteen months. There
were nineteen omnibuses belonging to the Association, and all the om-
nibuses goin3 to and fro between Fulham and London were included
In this number. Each of these omnibuses made twenty-nine journeys
per week—four on every week day, and three on Sundays ; 560,149
Passengers were carried by these omnibuses in the course of the week,
being, on an anverage, twenty-one passengers per journey. The
omnibus fare was but sixp,nce the whole way; it would be much
snore by the railway, and the saving of time would not be very
great. Not mom than one-fifth of the existing traffic would go by
lila railway.

Mr. Turrel, secretary to the Hammersmith Omnibus Association,
gave similar evidence to that of Mr. Key.
Mr. Hughes, civil engineer, was then called, and gave evidence
against the Bill, showing how, by a deviation (not within their
limits), a line much superior, in his opinion, to the Hounslow and
Western, might be made. It would be shorter by one mile, and
would inflict much less residential damage.
Mr. Garling,la survvyor, gave evidence as to the manner in which
the line would pass through certain private property, and more
especially as to the injury to the property'ot a Miss Anderton, which
he said would be rendered almost useless by the line pi:m[llg through
it in the manner proposed.

As it was then intimated that there was one more witness to be
called, but he was not now present,
The Committee, after some diseussion, rose at half-past three
o'clock, and adjoraned till Wednesday (to-morrow being the Queen's
birth-day), wi,h the under,tandin4 that they would not sit on
Thursday, bet; on rising on Wednesday would adjourn till t riday.

GROUP XXIV.
ELY AND BURY.

The. Committee on this line re-assembled at one o'clock, Mr. Gran-
Ville Vernon in the chair, when
Mr. S. Valentine, the engineer of the line, gave the general en-

Sineering evidence,which showed the gradients to be exceedingly easy,

.and the earthworks small. The - estimates for the works are
180,2371., and for land 49,7631. ; making a total of 230,0001. for the
whole of the expense.
To Mr. HOLMES the witness replied that he had been instructed to
lay out such a line as would effect a through traffic, but Lynn was
not a primary consideration in this line. An endeavour was made
to show that the proposed communication between Weedon and
IC anabridge would satisfy the requirements of the district. The line
would run, like the Eastern Counties Extension, for a mile over fen, the
height of the embankment for which would he 14 feet, which he pro-
Posed to lay down on the surface, without digging out to form a bottom.
The width of the embankment at the bottom would be 86 feet, the
width at the top and the slope 1% to 1. There was another
;point at 13 mite% 3 feet,
longs where there was bog, but the depth of it
fee had net astertalnaedievot conceiving it necessary, as he proposed to
'carry the line on
There was fenny land, but nothing
that truly could be ca:lea
depth beof. He had bored in several places
tO ascertain the
proposed to erect bridges. g, an bog, but only where he
w"etabankinent there was no ne-
cessity to do this, as the country
;land
thfreomat c onelaotf
any etni,de
ri:;7l„:.rree he had
to the other. He intended to builds bei,uPerften,a 7t
'bored, and found the depth to be 914 feet, au,dhad
no impediment. Ha pro..
other place. There was a bog 23 feet in depth et
third furlong, but that he thought was
posed to cross the Ooze at Ely, behind the Eastern comm..
station, and
very near the spot where the Eastern Union pro
'cross it. The whole length of the line would be 23 miles 5 furlongslrchair
and 50 links, and taking the whole length of the line the side cut-
tings' u
be crossed at a level. The rail-
waya
would be 81,298 yards, the total cuttings 432,133 yards. They
crossed 33 roads, of which 31
would
of theth
the
inhabitants
railway.
was crossed at Sonham at the expresstsaddeosuirs desire
on
by a bridge. There were to be eight
'Where is a special agreement between the
latter Eastern
should Count have
Railway
and the Lynn and Ely Company that the tle
tree use of the station of the former and a Mile of the
fourrailway
gratuitously. It was proposed to cross the Sark
times between Mildenhall and Bury, the distance being eleven
stiles, but these crossings would be within six miles. 11e proposed
Ito obviate the flood water by timber viaducts. The bridges would
the twenty feet span, while the bridles at present in existence were
only twelve feet.

kr. Rastrick, the eminent engineer, confirmed the whole of the
evidence of Mr. V dentine, the enigneer of the line, especially with
respect to the soundness of the line in the fenny district, and the
needlessness for boring, except for the foundations of brick or stone
bridges.
•

Mr. Allan Ransom, a machine maker, especially of agricultural im-
plements, at Ipswich, testified to the dock accommodation of that
town, and also as to the extent of the trade with Holland, and the
advantage this line would be of in opening the communication with
Lincolnshire and the western counties. The distance from Ilarwich
to Rotterdam was 145 macs, while the latter place was
248 miles from London. Harwich is a harbour of refuge,
:and the only one between the Thames and the Humber.
Taking the whole district into considerat.on, for all the general
parposes of business, although the populations on both lines were
pretty equal, the Bury and Ely line would give the best accommo-
dation. But, considering Newmarket as an important place, he
thought that the Ipswich and Bury would afford the best accommo-
dation, and Mildenhall was not a place of sufficient Importance to
justify the withdrawal of the line from the best districts. So tar as
Lynn was concerned, the same benefits would arise as would occur
Ito Ipswich. The Ipswich and Bury line was shorter, and would be
fnearer both to Newmarket and Cambridge ; and he could see no ld-
wantages to be derived from the Ely and Bury line which were
not
.conferred by the Ipswich line.

To Mr. ItORTOWICK, the Witness replied that he employed about
740 men, of whom somewhat less than one-half were engaged in the
manufacture of agricultural implements, the rest were occupied in
the making heavy machinery, but the trade is restricted for the
want of railway accommodation.

To Mr. BAGELLY the witness replied, that nine tenths of their iron
was brought from Newport, which came by water to Ipswich. All
the produte of Holland, or intended for that country, which came
from or was Intended to go to the south-east of England, would doubt-
less go through London ; but that which may be intended for the
interior and to the west would go by Harwich, especially tha oats,
iereafter be imported from Poland and carried
N e and to that neighbourhood.
tion, Mr. Ransom stated, that although it had
been' batettded^ o go to Newmarket, yet that branch had been
abandowled tti fa our of the Checterfleld and Cambridge line.
The wituesS then cross-examined as to tha raspective advan-
WOG Of thO Se 1 ports, which Mr. Ransom pre in favour of Ips-

wlch ; and to which Mr. O'Malley replied that the tonnage on goods
was rated in the port dues according to the size of the vessels in which
they were carried, varying from id. per ton to Is. 6d. on vessels of
500 tons. _ _

After some observations from the CHAIRMAN, Mr. O'Malley was
proceeding, when the time for breaking up arrived, and the Com-
mittee adjourned till twelve o'clock to-ir orrow.

GROUP XXXIX.
OLDHAM DISTRICT.

The Committee assembled to-day at twelve o'clock, Mr. Dlvett in
the chair, when
Mr. Clayton gave evidence as to the relative utility of the exten-
sion of the Manchester line, called the Oldham and Manchester, or
as it was otherwise called the Birkenhead line. The evidence
adduced in the early part of the day went
tiv from the
that the Oldham District lines were the most advaritagsehoeuws,
partly from their opening the coal-fields better,
circumstance of there being two termini, one at the east
other at the west end of Oldham, while the Birkenhead line proposed
cultivation lrge
p-ecad and the
only
ytailway were obtained.
one,oh
land on
h Is
Broadbenthitencled to:tt
obses i theg
h te ehentrherot
brought
itioltv
if the facilities likely to be afforded by this rhed,
and elicited the
Mr. Sergeant INTRA:IOIIam cross-examih t
and t a meetings had been
`and respect to the termini, it
traffic on the Blrkelitthseafdavolurine.,
held in Oldham insould reachhhayvetthoe Ia bothc h
es t
ebryt
that
tnhdi ,
tLha
eneedd
sa
York-
shire Cunomri
el
appeared that they
was now being
dfeurnnteht town. And with respect to coals,
pany to go under
the price of house-fire coal was generally about 10s. a ton
The witness conceived
at Oldham.
coal was not likely to supersede the Oldham coal, because
he w was aware that the cartageghh hee
usualwbaseli believed
time
es seven
fe nltvirn eightsit to
sometimes miles
three-
quarters.
rfoe Manchesterre e-
athdeon
witness replied that he conceived the Yorkshire
wastqhi e;
rro r
sla railways a
Fya
n- so were
hour,tr
he
e
coal would
ti
nothingnaccoko otennnesgeeoingrooueft
edotnphacteShre atapodifdnol
thebeta,ahb- owereit
stoppagesidiraeofncofwatrri
ioei
nutimiwdneaanelyttat-hreoiorsufebgattihdea
there, been,accommodation.s hdistricta r shareholder
that
rial
me
at
couldogs hu hegt though tea
ydh
iex
y
lines met. lle was generally acquainted with the trade of the dis-
trict, but
Wright,ioul
could speak to no details.
Deputy-Chairman of the line, was examined
and cross-examined at great length, and stated that the Man-
chester and Leeds Company took one-half of the capital
in the company by whom the line was to be worked,
and to whom it was to be leased at a certain rate of per tentage.
By a clause in the Bill a power was to be given to sell the line
altogether, but the right of voting in the Leeds and Manchester
Company was only one vote for two shares, while the Oldham Dis-
trict Company was one vote for one share ; and there was another
clause—on which the point of amalgamation -the present
established Company were prevented from voting at all.
There could be no question as to the superiority of the convenience
of the two termini instead of one. These lines would so open up the
communication with Rochdale, Bolton, and all the surrounding
districts. As respects coals, he believed that the consumption of
coal for house purposes was about equal to that used for 'team-
engines. lle himself was a cotton-spinner, had three steam-
engines, and consumed about 1,000 cwt. In the cotton man-facture
there were 80 steam-engines, with an aggregate of 2,795 horse-
power ; the number of hands employed were 14,20, and the quan-
tity of coals consumed was about 99,944 tons ; the quantity of cotton
and worsted made was about 42,804,0801b5. There had been a great
number of Paris velvet hats made of cotton at Oldham, a business
which might be very largely increased.
Mr. Platt, a partner in the machine manufacturing firm of Platt
and Co., of Oldham, stated that they employed more than 980
hands, that they received more than 5,500 tons of pig iron, and 2.30
tons of bar iron. They consumed 900 tans of coke, and sent to the
several places around machinery to the value of 165,1481., makiag a
tonnage of 15,000 tons ; of this quantity, insufficient as the railway
accommodation might be, goods to the worth of 81,0001. were even
now sent by railway, and there was a general desire among
those whom they supplied to have the goods sent by railway. The
witness testified to the necessity of further accommodation, and to the
dies itisfaction of the public in Oldham with the management of the
Leeds and Manchester line.
Mr. Schofield, a timber merchant, stated that it cost more to bring
timber from the wood- growing district of Masborough, near Sheffield,
than it did to bring it from Dundee and London, until the Sheffield
Railway was opened.
The announcement of the Speaker being at prayers was made, and
the Committee adjourned till twelve o'clock to-morrow.

GROUP XLVI.
The following Bills are comprised in this new group, 'viz.:—
Newcastle and Darlington Junction and Tyne Dock.
Newcastle-upon-Tyne, Edinburgh, and Direct Glasgow Junction.
Wear Dock Railway.
Newcastle and Berwick.

Newcastle and Carlisle Extension

Newcastle and Darlington, Durham and Sunderland, and Wear-
mouth Dock Purchase and Branches.
Northumberland and Lancashire Junction.

The Committee assembled at a few minutes to two o'clock in
room 13 ; present Mr. Bramstona (chairman), and the other Mem-
bers.

The list having been read through, it appeared that the parties
roinoting the Wear Dock Railway, and the Nortimmberland and
ancashire Railway, had abandoned these Bills.

NEWCASTLE AND DARLINGTON, DUR-
HAM AND SUNDERLAND, AND WEAR—
MOUTH DOCX A, PURCHASE BRANCHES.
Precedence was given to this Bill, and, the formal business having
been gone through,
Mr. HILDYARD, counsel for the promoters said, that the object
of this Bill was to construct branches to a railway called
the Newcastle and Darlington, which Bill had received the
sanction of Parliament in 1842. The advantages of that
line were admitted, and their object was now to improve it still
further. He would call the attention of the Committee to the im-
portance of the objects sought by the promoters of the Bill before
them. At the first branch off Sunderland there was a population
of sixty thousand persons, who were provided with the
requisite accommodation. A Bill for the improvement of the docks
south of the Wear had received already the sanction of Parliament
this year. The present mode by which the people of Sunder-
land went southward was most inconvenient, because in
effecting that object they had to go northward, which
would be obviated by the proposed branch, the esti-
mate for which was 178,0001. Tne only opposition offered to the
Bill was, with respect to the last branch, namely, from Iletton to
Fenchurch, and that by a party through whose property the line did
not pass. It appeared that there was a tram-road on the line, which
had been constructed for the purpose of conveying coals, and which
traversed their property. The party petitioning complained that as this
rant-road was in the neighbourhood of his property, the same would
be injuriously effected by the railway if any diversion of the traffic
from the tram road should ensue, as he was paid a certain sum by
the parties who had constructed this tram road. He trusted that
under these circumstances the Committee would not entertain for a
moment this petition. It was a fact that Parliamentary Committees
had not allowed compensation to canal companies for injury
done to their property in this way. If it should so happen that any
portion of the petitioner's property was invaded by this railway
liberal compensation would be given. The other branches would
yield great accommodation to the district through which they would
pass, and a further accommodation would be afforded to Durham.
lie trusted, in conclusion, that, without trespassing at any consider-
able length on the time of the Committee, that he should obtain his

Mr. Harrison (engineer of the line), was then examined as to the
advantages of the line, to which he bore testimony.
Mr. H. Nicholson, of Newcastle, engineer, corroborated Mr. Har-
rison's statement as far as regarded his neighbourhood.
Mr. Hynde, M.P., was also examined, and stated that the line
would be very beneficial to Newcastle.
After hearing some observations from counsel In support of the
petition against the Bill,

The CoMmittee decided that the preamble of the Bill was proved,
with the exception of the branch from Fenchurch to Hetton.
The Committee then adjourned.

GROUP LIII.

SHROPSHIRE UNION AND CANAL (CHES-

TER TO WOLVERHAMPTON).

(Continued from our Afternoon Edition of yesterday.)

In his cross-examination, Mr. Provis said—His instructions from
Mr. Stephenson were to bring this line into Wolverhampton on the
same level with the Shrewsbury and Birmingham, and not the Ox-
ford, Worcester, and Wolverhampton Railway Company. Supposing
that the last-named railway entered Wolverhampton on the narrow
gauge, as an engineer he should certainly consider any new scheme
of railway entering the same town incomplete if it did not enter on
the same level, if Parliament sanctioned no other line.

Mr. Robert Stephenson said he had been employed by this Company
as consulting engineer, and he recommended the present scheme. He
had duly considered all other schemes before he came to the decision
that the present was the most likely to confer the greatest benefit
on the construction and at the least expense. This line would
afford the best levels, and it was, certainly, beyond all
question, the best that could be made between Birkenhead
and Staffordshire. The importance of the heavy mineral traffic that
would flow upon this line could not be overrated, and this line
would decidedly be superior to the Grand Junction Company's line
in that respect. That line was better calculated for passenger
traffic, and if this line were sanctioned he was of opinion that the
result would be that heavy traffic would pass along it whilst the
light traffic would be carried by the Grand Junction Company. This
line was not mixed up with the competing systems in any way.
Cross-examined—He did not look upon the line as a rival of the
Grand Junction scheme. It was the desire of the Shropshire Com-
pany to convert their bankrupt canal into a railway, and so benefit
themselves as well as the public. This line, however, would no
doubt compete with the Grand Junction. The object of this company
in laying down this line was to form the best means of railway com-
munication between Birmingham and Ireland, and he now believed
that it wou'd prove to be so, if formed. Ile was of opinion that rail-
ways would eventually have the elY^ct of drying up all the canals in
the kingdom. The line would take Wolverhampton at a high level, and
after a most minute and frequent examination of the subject, he
was of opinion that a hi ,h level would Ye decidedly the best for the
people of Wolverhampton. By adopting a high level he was enabled
to carry the line into the heart of the town. 'Had a low level teen
selected, he should have been prevented from doing so by the canals,
&c. So convinced was he of the desirableness of railways having
elevated stations, that he was at present going to some expense for
the purpose of devising how every railway might enter towns at
high levels, which would have the effect of accelerating the trains at
starting.

Re-examined—lie advised the company not to carry their line at
present into the town of Wolverhampton until some arrangement
could be made with the other schemes.

Mr. LAING said that the Company's other engineer, Mr. Cubitt, was
at that moment giving evidence before the Committee that had to
decide on the London and York scheme.

The Hon. CHAIRMAN said that they had heard sufficient engineer-
ing evidence, nor would it be necessary to hear the evidence of an-
other gentleman—the manager of the Birmingham and Gloucester
Canal—who was absent on a previous day, and who would give fur-
ther evidence as to the effect which the construction of railways had
on canals. _ _

Mr. Stee then gave traffic evidence,
Mr. Sergeant KINGLASE here asked whether it was the intention
of the Committee to sit to-morrow ?

The Hon. CHAIRMAN, after consulting with his colleagues, said,
yes, I think we'll sit to-morrow ; we have have had so many holi-
days of late, that unless we proceed pretty rapidly we shall not finish
our business in proper time.
_ _ _ _ _

_ .
Mr. Sergeant KINGLAKE—I merely asked for the convenience of
the witnesses.
Mr. Pare was then called to speak as to the traffic ; after which
Mr. Cowan was called, and proved that the amount of shares sub-
scribed for was 149,2501., and the amount deposited 313,4251.
Mr. Rouse having given his evidence,
Mr. Lama said that this closed the promoters' case.
Mr. Sergeant KINGLARE then proceeded to address the Committee
against this scheme, and on behalf of the Worcester and Stafford-
shire Junction Canal Company. He complained that Mr. Austin
and those Learned Counsel who were with him had most
prudently endeavoured to keep back from the Committee the im-
portance of this subject. He was not surprised to hear Mr. Austin
and Mr. Stephenson say that the canals of this country must be dried
up to give place to railways. But he contended that the public were
vlat,al.ll.oinnterested in preserving those canals for the purpose of keep-
inga etzetntheastamrievatilrgewhTichhatmounstfaexict,swt
was the
trhaeiliwntaeynstiomnidofctahneaLlsegtexs-
ediattri°us .
Learned Friend -
instances the Legislature had no doubt
rtnrvMmien of isolated canals into railways, and his
canals. But that was no isolated believe that the present . At% had attempted to make the Committee
as simple as the cases of those
municatiou between the great
canal, for it was the water coin-
just
had been used from the time Ofelitty of London and Liverpool, and
intervening. It could not be erect merely
for the use of the districts
tween Wolverhampton and Liverpool, merely as a commanication be-
opinion that the present was a great
link
odt., ife the Committee were of
I. ondon and Liverpool, were they prepared ';'ohthteunication between
the great accommodation which this canal had decdreedtlie public of
since its opening ? He doubted whether the Legislaturethe would
sanction the " drying up" of this railway. From what had already
place before a Select Committee of the House of Com taken
e would flied that this matter was -
mons, this Committee
I Th t not as
ted by Mr. Aust n. a Select Committee
trifling as represented
had decided that the public should not, except in very few instances
esent canal communication in England.
indeed, be deprived of the present
For
hadmade these bargained when the different
that advantage the u .
remarks, he refer red
railway Acts had passed. p
liaving
the Committee to the second report of the select Committee ap-
pointed to consider the subject of railway and canal amalgamation,
&c. Before that Committee sat it became known that the cenversion
of this canal into a railway was proposed. The Committee, after
hearing evidence on the subjeet, came to the conclusion
that the present competition t'etween railways and canals had been
the means ofredncing the cost of traffic one-seventh.
The lion. CHAIRMAN—That is only in some cases ; it is not general.
Mstated r. Sergeant KINGLAKE—Of course : the that
Committee
there were instances which had come to their knowledge in which
,
this had been the result. The Committee also stated in their report
that it was obviously of importance that Parliament should not lightly
sanction any arrangement which would deprive the public of the ad•
vantage afforded by the rivalry at present existing between railways
and canals. They also stated that they had come to the general con-
clusion that a most searching inquiry should be made into the merits
of each case before Parliament sanctioned the conversion of canals
into, or their amalgamation with, railways. This subject was not,
therefore, one of the amount of profit which it had produced to its
proprietors, as represented by his Learned Friends ; there
was a question of far higher importance than that,
and that was the interest of the public in the exist-
ence of competition at present existing between railways and
canals. The canal was established for the purpose of giving the
public an independent line of water communication in the districts of
Birmingham, Wolverhampton, Shrewsbury, and other important
places. The evidence given before the Select Committee to which
he had alluded went no further than this, that an isolated canal,
which did not form any important link of communication be-
tween different parts of the kingdom, might. with benefit to
the public and the proprietors, amalgamate with, or be converted 1
into a railway. But this was no isolated canal ; it formed a most
Important link of communication between London and Liverpool.
Mr. Stephenson was in error when he said that canals could not sue • 1
cessfully compete with ail r ways. Mr. Scott had given evidence to
that elect before the Select Committee, and pat gentleman was in.