The Sun.
London, England, 1846-02-06 00:00:00

NEW WRIT.

Lord RENDLESIIAM moved for a new writ fur
the election of a knight of the shire for the Eastern
Division of the county of Suffolk, in the room of Lord
Henniker, who had accepted the stewardship of the
Chiltern Hundreds.—Agreed to.
I?: A ILWAY BUSINESS.

Lord GRANVILLE SOMERSET called the atten
tion of the House to the resolutions of the Select Corn
mitten appointed to inquire as to the best mode
of facilitating the railway business before the House.
The first resolution was to the effect, that a portion of
the railway Bills should be allowed to commence in the
House of Lords ; and that in the case of all
Bills thus commencing in the House of Lords
this House should not insist on their usual pri-
vilege with regard to the clauses fixing and
regulating the toll rates in such Bills. The
Committee also considered it necessary, in order to give
increased means of employment to the people of
Ireland, that facilities should be given fur the
early introduction of Irish railway Bills. Now,
in order to facilitate the passing of those mea-
sures, this proceeding was recommended, and therefore
he trusted the House would not hesitate to adopt the
report. Ho did not know that it was necessary for him
to make any further observations upon the subject. He
begged leave to move the adoption of the report.
111 r. F. FRENCH—The resolutions proposed by the
Noble Lord were of such a nature as to affect two classes
of Bills, viz., all Irish Bills, and all such other Bills as
were in the position of that of the London and York.
The Noble Lord had recommended that all Bills thus
circumstanced should go at once before the House of
Lords; but this, he contended, would be a most inconve-
nient course for the Irish Bills. And here he must observe,
that he could—not so the necessity for announcing with
such a flourish of trumpets that the Irish Bills had been
peculiarly favoured ; at least he, for one, was at a less
to see that they were in any way favoured heyond the
English Bills.—(Hear.) Indeed Le could show pretty
deafly that there was no substantial benefit whatever
conferred on the Irish Bills by this arrangement.
He found, in going through these resolutions, that if
the Committee report that the standing orders have
not been complied with, the Bill is referred to the Stand-
ing Orders Committee. Now this was most unjust. lie
contended that they should be allowed to do so, as they thus
put the opposing parties to renewed expense, just as if
they had not made out their case. There was one
faciiity for the passing of Irish railway bills which could
have been recommended, but which had been unnoticed
by both Houses. There was a difference in the practice
of the House of Commons and the House of Lords; in
the former, in Irish bills it was only necessary to prove
the service of the proper notices by an affidavit, sworn
before a judge or an assistant barrister. In the House
of Lords, however, it was necessary to. bring over every
person who had served these notices, in order to prove
them, and sometimes between 60 and 70 persons were
brought to London in order to follow out that rule. Now
if the practice of the House of Commons was adopted, a
very material saving would be made.
Mr. BERNAL was not prepared to give
any preference to Irish schemes until he saw the
justice of such a preference, for when they con-
sidered the number of English schemes at pre-
sent, and the mystery that was everywhere prevalent as
to their ultimate success, they would see that. such a
preferedce was contrary to justice. He behaved that it
was known that the amount of deposits irrespective
of Irish or Scotch schemes, but merely on
English ones, was about eleven millions and a
half. The report recommending such a 'preference
would assuredly disappoint the public. Ile did not think
that Ireland and Scotland would jump at this preference
as a great boon, for they knew that if the English rail-
ways were first attended to it would cause an influx of
Irish navigators, who would be well employed. He did
not think that a railway running to the southern part,
or any other part, of Ireland would be any remedy for
the destitution that prevailed -there. He also thought
that the Noble Lord on the Committee might be pre-
pared to come to this House with some scheme which
would alter the enormous expense attendant on these
railway schemes, and some better way of disposing of
them. Would it be believed that in the present year
they were so little able to cope with the difficulties of
these schemes. These inquiries might be as well con-
ducted by means of some commission appointed to take
these matters into consideration.
The O'CONNOR DON wished to make a few obser-
vations in answer to what had fallen from the lion. Gen-
tleman who had just sat down. The Committee who
drew up tho present report, considered that it would
be most advisable to give employment to the people
of Ireland during the months of the coming
summer, when it was feared they would suffer most from

the failure of the potato° crop-, viz., the monthscom-
mencing with March and terminating with August.
Under those circumstances they recommended
in their report, that for the purpose of giving
employment to the Irish poor during those
months precedence should be given to the Irish
railway Bills, and that they should be introduced in the
first instance into the House of Lords. The Hon. Gen-
tleman who had last spoke seemed to• say that it would
be no be no benefit to the Irish that preference
should be given to the Irish Railway Bills for this
reason that the Irish poor could obtain employment in
the formation of the English railways. Now he (the
O'Connor Don) for his own part felt that it would he
much better to give the Irish labourers employment in
Ireland, inasmuch they could then share with their
families the products of their labour.—(Hear, hear.)
notwithstanding the statements that had been made with
respect to the potato crop in Ireland, he could essure
the House that in the county of Sligo especially the
blight on potatoes had been almost universal.
Mr. AG LIONBY opposed the adoption of the report.
He perfectly agreed with the objects which the Com-
mittee had in view, but he could not consider how those
views could be carried into effect by compelling Irish
railway business to commence in the House of Lords,
ho thought it more desirable that they should
be allowed the option of commencing in the House of
Commons if they were quite ready so to do.
Sir GEOiZGE CLERK did not know of any impe-
diment which would be thrown in the way of Irish rail-
ways, by compelling them to commence in the House of
Lords. On the contrary, he thought mucch benefit would
be the result. In the case of two competing companies
one might commence in this House, and the other might
be brought forward in the House of Lords. The Com-

mittee Of this House might sanction one of the
schemes, and the House of Lords would possibly
consider the other company as deserving of support,
the consequence would necessarily be, that instead
of facilities being afforded, the whole concern would
be brought to a staud still, and one House would say to
the other you must not pass this Bill until you have
sent it to us, in ordor to decide upon its merits as to
the other competing line.
Mr. AGLIONBY—Suppose there should be no com-
peting line ?
Sir G. CLERK did not consider even in that
case that any substantial iojustico would be
inflicted upon these Bills. There were standing orders
of both Rouses which must be complied with, prior to
obtaining their powers. He did not therefore consider
that any possible inconvenience could arise from the
adoption of the course suggested by the Select Committee.
He believed it was the intention ;of his Hon. Friend the
President of the Board of Trade, to introduce resolu-
tions which would have the effect of doing away with
any standing order that would be productive of inconve-
nience to the public business ; and this he believed
would have the effect of obviating the difficulties appre-
hended by the Honourable Members for Cockermouth
and Roscommon. Owing to the peculiar position of
Ireland, the Government were anxious that every facility
should be given to the passing of all Irish Railway Bills,
with a view to giving the labouring population of that
country
namely, in the months of June and July next ; and ho
employment when it would be most wanted,
did believe that doing so would confer one of the greatest
benefits upon that country.— (Hear, hear.)
Mr. ROSS said it would be well ithat. all Bills not
having to encounter competition should be at once sent
to the House of Lords.
Mr. GREEN said that those Bills which should have
been declared to have complied with the Standing Orders
it was recommended should be sent at once to the House
of Lords, and that would greatly facilitate the business.
Mr. W. COLLETT said that he did not think that
the benefits supposed to follow the passing of the Irish
Bills would be realised, because such Bills as shold not
have passed before June or July could not be
brought into operation for soine months after.
He considered that the Government ought to take some
means for expediting the Bills which had once been
reported to have fulfilled the standing orders.
The SPEAKER having then read some extracts from
the report,
Mr. E. B. DENISON said that it would be
a very hard case should they rescind the order
of the 7th
July last, and it was right that he
should call their attention to what that resolution was. It
provided that Bills which had passed the ordeal of this
House should be entitled to go into thQ House of Lords j us t

as they stood. Meaning those Bills which had passed the
Standing Orders Committee. Now that was the case of
the Portsmouth group, and the London and York. Would it
not be very hard indeed if these companies, after having
gone to such enormoua expence should be
precluded now, and have to commence de novo.
With regard to the London and York line, there were
other lines to compete with it, and the House of Lords
would have to take these schemes into consideration.
There was the Direct Northern Railway, and also the
Cambridge line, which would decidedly take up a good
deal of time in getting through. He considered that if
the Committee would act more impartially, it would be
beneficial to the interests of railways generally.
Mr. WARD said that at the close of last session there
were great complaints with regard to the ,time occupied
in the discussion on railway Bills. There were several
parties who had been for eighty days
_before the Com-
mittee of the House of Commons who were never heard,
and who were afterwards told that their place of refuge
was the House of Lords. That was a position in
which a Committee, although acting im partially, eould not
avoid placing them. The question was not with regard
to the intereste of a particular company, but it was a
question as to what decision the legislature could come
to as to which line was the best, and it was fit, just and
proper, and wise, that the House of Lords should have
an opportunity f mature consideration on that subject.
Mr. E. DENISON said that the scheme referred to
by the preceding speaker was not a new one, and there-
fore the arguments made use of on the present occasion
against the measure did not apply.
Lord G. SOMEHSET did not consider that the
House would be committing any injustice by adopting
the report. After a f,w further remarks from the Noble
Lord, which were inaudible in the gallery,
Sir H. W. BARRON said it was quite impossible
that any railroad, the bill for which might be passed
during the present session, could give employment to
the Irish people for several months to come. He did
not say this from any opposition to the measure, but
merely for the purpose of undeceiving the House on
this subject. He hoped the House would not
depend too much upon the present project, as likely to
be of great advantage to the people of Ireland. Sup-
posing a Bill for a railway had passed buth Houses, and
received the royal assent, he need not tell the House that
notices must be issued for calls, and those
calli must be made in the first place ; in the
next place they must get p6ssession of the line, which
all would know was a task of no ordinary difficulty.—
After that it was necessary to advertise and enter into
contracts. All these things would occupy a'great deal of
time, and the House would be very much deluded if they
they thought that they would be giving early employment
to the Irish poor. He could assure the House that it
would be August or September next before any new
railroad could be commenced in Ireland.
After a few words from Mr. W. COLLETT and Mr.
FonsTER, which were inaudible in thereporters' gallery,
The SPEAKER put the motion, which was agreed to.