The Sun.
London, England, 1848-08-17 00:00:00

THE SUN,

man wishes to know what were the objects which my I
Noble Friend had to keep in view; what wes the
purpose for which this uncalled-for interference, so
he seems to imagine it, was to take plaee. Sir, the
interference was not uncalled for; my Noble Friend
was to obtrude his advice upon nobody; he was,
I if wished for, and if asked to do so, to give such counsel
as he could, and to endeavour to remove such difficulties
as might be pointed out to him. That was the purpose
for which he went to those courts ; and that was the
purpose which he successfully accomplished. My Noble
Friend, on the one hand, pointed out to the Govern-
ments that they might trust their people, that they need
not fear to confer upon them those constitutional institu
tions which it was the object of their subjects to receive;
he pointed out, on the other hand, to those who were
most ardent in desiring reform, that they would best at
tam those national objects which they leeitimately en-
deavoured to pursue by placing confidence in their
Governments, and by not urging them too rapidly to
change long-established institutions. At Turin and at
Florence my Noble Friend was eminently successful ; and
the proof of that is, that great and important changes were
made in the institutions of those two states without
any convulsion disturbing the public tranquillity, and
without any interruption of that harmony between the
subject and the Sovereign which we felt that it was so
desirable to maintain. My Noble Friend's progress
was, I should say, almost an ovation—(Hear, and a
laugh)—wherever he went he was received with acclama-
tions by the inhabitants—at every Court he was received
with open arms by the Government. At Rome his
labours were directed to the same object ; at Rome his
labours were attended with the same success.—(Hear.)
My Noble Friend, when he left this country, had no
mission to go to the Court of Naples ; we had received
no communication from Naples asking for our aid ; we
(lid not presume to offer that which was nut solicited.
But when my Noble Friend was at Rome, a communi-
cation was made to me by the Neapolitan Minister at
this Court, that the Sovereign of Naples would take it as
a compliment if my Noble Friend pursued his journey
from Rome to Naples. My answer was, " He will go if
he is invited ; he has no instructions to go there,
but if he receives an invitation through the Queen's
Charge d'Affairs at Naples, it will be his duty, as it
will be his pleasure, to attend to it ;" and, in conse-
quence, credentials were sent to him, to be made use of
it that occasion should occur. During the unfortunate
differences which broke out between the King of Napes
and his Sicilian subjects, both the King on the one hand,
and his Sicilian subjects on the other, asked for the me-
diation and intervention of British diplomacy, to endea-
vour to arrange and settle their disputes ; Lord Minto
was invited from Rome to go to Naples ; to Naples he
accordingly went, and he employed himself with great
diligence and with the :utmost seal in endeavouring to
bring about a reconciliation between the King of Naples
and his Sicilian subjects, upon conditions which would
maintain the Crown of the two countries upon one and j
the same head. I shall not go now—it would not be
fitting that I should—into minute detail of the circum-
stances which characterised those negotiations, nor shall j.
I advert to more than one event which tended to render
them unsuccessful ; but, at the critical period when
those negotiations were almost brought to a satisfactory
conclusion, there arrived at Palermo the news of the !
revolution at Paris ; and I think the House may easily -
conceive that the announcement of an event of that ins
portance must have considerable influence upon the
minds of men. That led to difficulties on the one side,
which were not met by concessions on the other, and the
result was, that on the one hand the people of Sicily de-
clined any longer to acknowledge the King of Naples as
their sovereign ; and the King of Naples, on his part,
declined to confer the crown of Sicily on one of his sons,
to whom that crown was offered. The Hon. Gentleman
adverted to the part which her Majesty's Government
has taken in the subsequent proceedings of the Sicilians,
with a view to elect another prince to be their sove-
reign ; that choice, made by the Sicilians, was
purely and entirely spontaneous ; theychose the
prince to whom an offer has since been made entirely
on their own judgment of what would in their opinion
be best for the interests of their country. It is imma-
terial whether that opinion coincided with the opinion
of her Majesty's Government or not; at the time when
that choice was made it was made entirely from their
own impulse, and as the result of their own judgment.
Undoubtedly her Majesty's Government, accepting as
they do facts and events, have signified that they would
be prepared to acknowledge tho sovereign whom the
Sicilians might choose, when that sovereign should be
actually in possession of the territories to which the voice
of the people might call him.—(Hear, hear.) The lion.
Gentleman wants to know what is the intention of her
Majesty's Government in regard to the employment of
the naval force of this country now stationed in the
Mediterranean, in respect to any expedition which the
Government of Naples may fit out and send forth.
I am sorry I can only follow in the steps of my Noble
Friend sitting near me and of my Noble Friend in the
other House, and say that it is!not the practice in this
country—nor do I think it would be expedient with re-
ference to the public interest to establish the practice—
to announce what are the intentions of the Government
with regard to events which are taking place on the con-
tinent of Europe.—(Hear, hear.) Whatever our course
may be, we are prepared to defend and justify it—it will
he for the House to determine whether or not we have
acted properly. Thus much I think I may state with
regard to the policy which the Government pursued
in respect to the affairs of Italy, as connected
with the mission of my Noble Friend Lord
Minto—
that that mission was founded on the most disinter-
ested motives—that the motives which led to that
mission had in them nothing that wits sordid, or base, or
selfish, or ungenerous, and that the only British interest
which could be served by that mission was the interest
which England, as a great power, has in persevering
peace in other countries, and of assisting, when invited
to do so, in forwarding the progress of civilization and
improvement, and in promoting the happiness and well-
being of the world.—(Hear, hear) The Hon. Gentle-
man has adverted to more recent events which have
taken place in the north of Italy, and has expressed an
opinion that the mediation which this country has en-
gaged in, with respect to the present state of affairs in
that part of Italy, in conjunction with France, is a media-
tion savouring of the nature of un impertinent interference,
without object and incapable of leading to any result. I
can only say that the mediation in question is not the re-
sult of any spontaneous and intrusive desire of this country
to meddle in, matters with which we have no concern,
but, on the contrary, is the result of the earnest en-
treaties and applications made to us by all the parties
directly or indirectly concerned in the transaction,
(hear, hear.) It is the result of wishes expressed both
at the beginning and the end by Austria.—(Hear, hear.)
I say it is the result of wishes expressed by Austria at
the outset of the Italian troubles and repeated not three
daysGove
rangato
e;
nitt
oi
fs
st
ahe rd
iraetsau l
ant (d)t
bwymthhees
pexpressed I
tbayi y
:t hi et
is the result of wishes expressed by the Government of
France—(Hear, hear)—and I must say, that if, in
answer to all these wishes so expressed, we had obsti-
rwsae shouldtelyand doggedly refused
eed
the our
censure mediation,whtlehthtihnek
Honourable Member conceives himself entitled to throw
upon us for the course which we have pursued. The
Government of Austria at the beginning, as I have said,
asked for our good offices, and, as lately as the 9th of
August, at Frankfort, and on the kith of August here,
that Government renewed the expression of its desire
that we should take part in the settldment of these
affairs. On the other hand, the Government of France
was urgently entreated by the opponents of Austria to
interpose military assistance in aid of the Italian cause.
The Hon. Gentleman says that France has no right to
intermeddle in the quarrel. That is the question which,
perhaps, it is useless for us to discuss here. Whatever
may be the views entertained as to the expediency, po-
licy, and justice of one country interposing in a war
waging between other countries, yet, in point of strict
right, I apprehend there can be no question that where
two nations are at war it is competent to a third party
to take which side he pleases, if he choose to engage
in the contest. I will not enter into any discussion
as to the circumstances under which the war between
Sardinia and Austria began. The Hon. Member
conceives that it was part of the functions of Lord Minto
to prevent Austria from attacking Sardinia in the
course of last year. That was no part of Lord Minto's
mission. It was part of his Lordship's mission to in-
duce the Sardinian Government to abstain from hostili-
ties against Austria, which, at that time, the Austrian
Government apprehended, although under circumstances
totally different from those under which the Sardinian
army subsequently took the field. At that time there
was no revolt at Milan, and Austria was in undisturbed
possession of the whole of her Italian provinces ; but
the Austrian Government having professed to entertain
apprehensions of the hostile intentions of the King of
Sardinia, the British Government did urge that mo-
narch to abstain from the attempts which he was alleged
to have in contemplation. When the late military
events took place in the north of Italy, the Government
of France was urgently requested to afford instant
military aid to the Italian cause. The Hon. Gentleman
who maintains that it is, and ought to be, and has been,
subject only to partial exceptions, the standing rule for
this country to be on a footing of intimate friendship
and general co-operation with France—the Hon. Gen-
tleman, who believes that to be the policy of England,
has been rather unfortunate in the manner in which, as
far as he is Concerned, he endeavoured to give effect to
the community of good feeling between the two
countries.—(Hear, hear, and laughter.) I fully admit
the soundness of the Honourable Member's doctrine
however I may lament the practice by which he endea-
vours to carry it into effect—(A laugh)—and therefore
I wish myself to forget, and I hope-that the French na-
tion may forget, if possible, those parts of the Hon.
Gentleman's speech which I think were not calculated
to promote union and cordiality between France and this
country; for if the Hon. Gentleman had intended, as I
am sure he did not, to rouse the bitter jealousy of a
great nation, and, by wounding its pride, to dare it to do,
and thus to produce the very result which he professes
toh° d
think injurious to the great interests of Europe and
ecaanulseroonf coivfinlisztaitoinonal, haenicmouosldittnesotrnhoarevebtiltirteorwninto
the
ingre-
dients, more poisonous drugs, than he infused into his
sspweeerchinudpeotnatlthwihsaot ctchaesiolnio—n (Cmheemerbse.)r
halswsitl
be-
cause I will not run theieh ris.le of pointing !.ttneodt, an
sharply the h
those who think with him still more
Hon. Gentlemanw is much mistaken, and
shaft he has au
in
s bilsenrcrhoer,di;f
they
yt
fancy that there is
of
take
eFpraarrace tin wanhyich mhosti
le operation which the Govern-
mentanytng in the present condition
and people of th)at coeusntriyt mimapyobsseibdleesirfoour her to
desirous
ofem-
ak
ebrarrokrintghainn.
--to(sCuphpeeorsee. that recent events have disarmed
theth
heroeoccasions,
a right
legions
sons, handfova oft
eurtuhFneri
taAendlcpesG, There could not be a more fatal
aetnhsthe cannot now pour
Government
sheuua
asanddone on former
determine on placing her in a position
of
hehostility
u 1 d
t 0-
wards any Power beyond those limits.—(Cheers.)
Letbus
not the House imagine, then, that any vain phantom
created uneasiness and alarm on the part of tho Govern,

ment. I confess that we did feel that any interference
by arms on the part of France in the affairs of Italy
would be pregnant with all those dangers which the Hon.
Gentleman has not shadowed out, but graphically (1- -
scribed in all their magnitude ; for instance, the Hon.
Gentleman said that if France should send an army into
Italy she must also send another to the Rhine—that if
Germany took the field against France, Russia would
follow in her footsteps. What would that be but an
universal European war—a conflagration extendindfrom
one end of Europe to the other, and involving in its
destructive consequences the most disastrous results
to humanity and the progress of civilization ?—(Cries
of " Hear, hear.") But when the French Govern-
ment said to us, " We are pressed to interfere by
arms in the cause of Italy, but we do not wish to involve
our country in a war—we are willing to endeavour to
settle matters by mediation if you will assist us—it must
be a, joint effort; that will remove all ground of jealousy,
for no one can suppose that England entertains hostile
views with respect to Austria; whatever France and
England do in conjunction must be a work of peace;
it must have the termination of hostilities for its object
—upon these grounds we hope you will interfere con
jointly with us, and, at least until we obtain your an-
swer, we will suspend our decision as to the adoption of
other measures;"—l say, that when the British Govern-
ment was addressed in this manner it would have been
most blameable if it had not acted immediately in ac-
cordance with the suggestion of France. Those are the
motives which led us to enter into a joint negotiation
with France. The principle upon which we have acted
is the principle of maintaining the peace of Europe.—
(Hear.) The policy and means by which the end is to
be attained resolve themselves into questions of detail
which I feel it my duty to refuse to snake public at this
moment.—(Hear, hear.) The Hon. Gentleman taunted
the British Government with the co-operation which has
at different times taken place between England and
France, and he included within the sweeping range of his
artillery, not only our camp, but that of which I see the
Right Hon. Leader opposite. The flon. Gentleman
taunted us, in the first place, with our interference in the
case of Belgium and Holland, the result of which, he
said, was the despoiling of an allied sovereign of his un-
doubted rights. Those who have directed their attention
to that case know that the principle on which we acted
with respect to it was laid down by our predecessors,
under whose administration the conferences were already
established which we afterwards conducted during along
but ultimately successful negotiation, and our inter-
ference originally took place at the request of the sove-
reign whose rights the lion. Gentleman says were set
aside in consequence of that interference. It was at the
request of the King of the Netherlands that the Govern-
ment of the Duke of Wellington, in connexion with the
rest of the five European powers, undertook con-
ferences and negotiations, and established an armi
stice between the contending parties, which issued
in the result alluded to. The Hon. Gentleman says,
that the alliance of England and France ought to be
the result of events, and that we ought not to
invent occasions and create circumstances for it.
I quite agree with him; but when, I ask, were
occasions invented, and opportunities unnecessarily
created ? Is it at the present moment ? Did we
create the mighty convulsion which is agitating
Europe from one end to the other ? Did we invent the
occasion which has led to the common action of England
and France? We have acted in this matter in the
earnest and anxious hope that the good understanding
and action of France and England may prevent the dis-
turbance of the present time from extending from inter•
nal conflict to external war,—in the anxious hope that
we may continue to preserve that peace which, with the
most trifling exceptions, has lasted, I may say, for up-
wards of thirty years, but which has certainly, during
the last fifteen years, been peculiarly maintained by the
good understanding which has prevailed between the
Governments of England and France.—(Hear, hear.)
For this object we shall be happy to combine with the
French Government in endeavouring to extinguish the
first sparks of war, wherever they may show themselves,
and thus to prevent a conflagration spreading through-
out Europe. Notwithstanding the Hon. Gentleman's
sneers, then, I think that this is conduct of which
any Government of England may justly feel proud.
As to the particular incidents which the Honourable
Gentleman passed over in rapid suecessiou, they
are all explicable on the general principle to
which I have referred. The Honourable Gentleman is
not correct in his history of some of the events to which
he alluded—the expedition to Ancona, for instance,
which he conceived to be the result of a violent inter-
ference on the part of the two Governments. The Go-
vernment of France of that day, at least, was not a
Jacobinical Government—it was not the Government
which had imported the razrias of Africa into the streets
of Paris, but the Government of that Sovereign whose
wisdom and moderation the Hon. Gentleman had praised
in the highest terms. It is gratifying to find that, in
spite of the great events which have disturbed the fabric
of society in France—which have altered the Govern-
ment of that country, and which have brought into
power in that country men wholly different from those
who have of late years wielded the powers of Govern-
ment there—in spite of those events, which might have
been expected to produce great changes in the national
feeling and policy of France, there still exists on the part
of those who govern France, and I am happy to say on
the part of the majority of the French nation also, a
frank, loyal,honest, and enlighteneddesire that the policy
of France may find itself in unison with the policy of
this country.—(Hear, hear.) I must also say that
the events of the last few months show the extraordinary
progress which civilization and enlightenment have
made in Europe during the last half-century.—(Hear,
hear.) The same events which have lately occurred on
the continent would, it they had taken place 50 years
ago, have involved the whole of Europe in a war of the
bitterest nature and of long duration. Now, however,
we see, that although in almost every country of Europe
events of the most fundamental character have occurred,
there still exists in the minds of the majority of men
an enlightened and sincere desire for the preservation of
external peace. It
.is consoling to observe the tone and
temper of those who are the organs of the French nation
in the present Cabinet. Instead of turning the people
loose, as was done at the earlier part of their former re-
volution, to occupy themselves with the affairs of other
countries, they are now bent on restoring and main-
taining order, and being so occupied, I think they do
not deserve the taunting sneers which the lion. Gentle-
man has applied to them.—(Cheers.) The French
Government is anxiously, wisely, earnestly, and cour-
rageously employed in establishing order, it is working
for the prosperity of the French nation and consolidating
o
France
anonecsciate,t conductaisoic
nnt
sincere,
t.doeseo_r:(e,
it
and
ehei
adror honour
aoodhruaertpahtrt
the preservation
tAo the
honourables m
the liberties of that country, and I think such a course
who are engaged
in it, whatever may have been their previous opinions or
a
g a
of f hn
loeun
theh world, so 'long will the efforts which they make be
purposes.—
(Hear, hear.) It is impossible that two nations
like
England and France should unite together for any pur-
poses which cannot be avowed 'in the face of all man-
kind. The purpose for which they
gether is one of that description; andalretnruoswt aicntihng to-
their efforts may be successful. I trust that the heaven
nl
influence of these two great nations, co-operating form the
purpose of promoting the happiness and tranquillity of
mankind, may be successful. At all events, our efforts
will he steadily and zealously directed to that end, and
whether we succeed or fail, I am persuaded that the de-
liberate judgment of Parliament and the unanimous
opinion of the country will be, that we have acted right
in 'staking the endeavour.—(Cheers.)
Mr. H. BAILLIE considered that the discussion had
not been in vain if it had been productive of no other re-
sult than that of calling attention to the foreign affairs
of the country. For the Noble Lord the Foreign Secre-
gelapneadceaodf
was, it now appeared; not satisfied with utterly
nary rs to make a satisfactory ar-
rangement in the instance of Spaind r us,a , and
ions from one end of
rendering the name of England o
t he was about to try his
the Peninsula to the other,
hand in the affairs of Italy, and embark England in the
chaotic sea of trouble that existed in that country. Under
these circumstances the House was justified in asking
the Noble Lord, as regards Spain, whether the friendly
relations that previously existed between both countries
should be renewed; and whether England was still con•
sidered to be bound by the quadruple treaty, which
had never 'answered its purpose, but which, on the
contrary, had served as a constant pretext for interfe-
rence on the part of England and France in the affairs of
the Peninsula. The Noble Lord had told the
House that the object of the Treaty of the
Quadruple Alliance was to assist the establish-
ment of liberal governments in Spain and Por-
tugal. But had it accomplished that object? On the
contrary, was not the most violent, arbitrary, and illegal
Government that ever existed established in those coun-
tries? Taking the case of Portugal last year—the state
of that country was brought before Parliament by the
Hon. Member for Montrose, when the Queen of that
country asked the assistance of England under its provi-
sions against her own subjects. There was, indeed a new
Cortes assemhled, and the Cabralists were nominally
excluded, but the tools of the Cabralists were there, and
did the work of oppression effectually. In Spain there
;ore three parties—the Carlist party, the moderado
party, and the progressist party, of which the Carlist
party was the strongest, numbering among its ranks the
majority of the nobility and all the clergy, and nearly all
the rural peasantry. lie assimilated
the Carlist party to
the Tory party in England, the moderado to the Whig,
and the progressist to the radical. The progressist
party
had for a while been kept in
power by the Influence and
money of England, but when these were withdrawn the
moderado
t e
moderado party came into office, which they had retained
ever since. It was said by the p re •
Ge-
neral Narvaez was a mere madman; but
tshes had
that
cient method in his madness to Put down adsuffi-
cient
insurrec-
tion and to keep in effectual check thatpro-
gressist party which the Noble Lord had taken
under his charge. He contended that the in-
terference of the British Government in the affairs of
Spain had been productive of the establishment there of
a more grinding and oppressive tyranny than had ever
before prevailed there. In reference to the circums
stances which led to a cessation of diplomatic inter-
course between this country and Spain, he certainly
considered that the Spanish Government had acted with
very great indiscretion; but on the other hand, the
charges which'they brought against our Minister at the
Court of Madrid, and which our Government had re-
fused to entertain, were of, a most grave character. Sir
Henry Bulwer himself did not deny one of the very
gravest of these charges, that of having received into
his house the progressist leaders who had been con-
spiring against the de facto Government of Spain, a
course which clearly rendered him liable, under the law
" of nations, to the expulsion to which he had been stab-
jected. Suppose the parallel case of the Spanish Am-
bassador here receiving, fostering, and encouraging
Messrs. Mitchel, O'Brien, Duffy, &c.: would not the
English Government have thought itself distinctly ;,11s.
tified in at once directing the Spanish Minister so sills-
conducting himself to quit this country within four and-
twenty lio.urs? Ile regretted that the evidence D. this