The Sun.
London, England, 1846-02-10 00:00:00

TME S UN, LONDON,.

wished that his Noble Friend Aultlepostpone the dis-
CussiOn until the matter came foret'ethe House in a
more regular manner. 4: '• ,
Lord STOURTON said that he should feel him-
self wanting in his duty both to England and
Ireland if he did not express his entire and full concur-
rence with the measure proposed by Government for the
benefit of Ireland. The labour of 'lreland was now
about to be absorbed in resources which—and he said it
to the disgrace of this country—had been kept for 600
years in darkness. He would refer to the year 1817,
when it appeared that no less than 65,000 per •
sons passed through the fever hospitals of Dublin.
He hoped also to be allowed to express his concurrence
in the perfect truth of the report which emanated from
the House of Commons in the last session, in which the
absolute necessity was declared of bettering the condi-
tion of the Irish people. That statement was also made
ten years ago; and now that they had it in 'their power
to cement au union between the people ef England and
Ireland—cementing them in a manner that no repealer
could break—(Bear)—he called on them to act wisely and
boldly. He would wish to see the peasantry of Ireland
raised to a proper level ; and he should say it would be
a much more gratifying circumstance if the people were
less dependent upon land. Mr. Forster, in 1825. stated
that " the Irish must have land, as they depended on
it." .Now that was a most grievous circumstance.
Therefore he should say that their policy, their interest,
called on them to support the present measure ; and he
should shrink from his responsibility as a Member of
that House, if he did not advise them to combine and
endeavour to advance such a policy.—(Hear, hear.)
If they placed a police force in the stead of the military
force which it would be otherwise necessary to maintain
in the counties of Ireland, Government ought
to recommend that the quota of the expenses
should be borne by each county, or by each town-land
in which the police force might be required. He
thought, and the Commissioners were of opinion,
that
.this course might remedy the evil complained
of. But be thought it not only necessary that they should
patronise public works, but that they should
also give every assistence to agricultural improvement,
for this was not only required for the happiness of the
people at present, but for their future prosperity also.
He felt, as a resident landlord in Ireland, that this mea-
sure would be of great benefit to that country, and there-
fore he had no hesitation in saying it should have his con-
currence. There were some clauses in it he could not agree
to—he meant the compulsory and mandatory clauses, and
he trusted they would be modified. He had listened
to the speech of his Noble Friend opposite with
great attention; but he could not believe that
the distress anticipated by the Noble Lord in so
short a time as he had stated would take
place, at least in that part of the country, the north
of Ireland, where he resided; and if great distress were
apprehended in other parts of that country he trusted
that the Government would adopt such measures
as would tend to avert that calamity. With
regard to what had been said in reference to
the police force, he was ready to admit that that
was a most useful body ; but he could not but
ft el that the magistracy of the country had often been
put aside by the power which the Government held over
them ; and he also thought that some communication
ought to have been held with the magistracy before this
step had been taken tomalec that force a species of gem-
d annerie.The landed gentry of Ireland felt this neglects ery
much. They were anxious, as magistrates, to do their
duty, as they had hitherto, he believed, done; but they
thought they ought to have been consulted. He would,
as far as the present Bill was concerned, give it his sup-
port, and when it was in Committee he would
call their Lordships' attention to certain amend-
ments to several of the clauses, which he considered
• very objectionable, especially those proposing to take the
powers out of the hail& of the grand juries, who were
• made up of the resident gentry, and therefore those best
- calculated to know That ought to be done.
The Marquis of LANSDOWNE said there was no
differeuce of opinion as to the principle of Vie Bill,

which had his entire concurrence.—(Hear.) He had
no desire to prolong the- discussion raised by the
suggestion of the Noble Lord (Monteagle) respect-
ing the remission of the courity rates for the maintenance
of the constabulary force. He (the Marquis of Lans-
downe) believed that suggestion. first came from the
tneraLe:s of the Irish Landlord and Tenant Commission
as a most desirable arrangement, and that it should be
done upon the principle of equality. It was then recom-
mended irresr cave of other considerations but the relief
of Ireland, but now it was brought up as part of a general
measure of justice to the occupiers of land, in conse-
quence of the great and important scheme of improvement
submitted to Parliament for the relief of the country.
He held, as a general principle, that grants for public
works would be more beneficial than any other measure
that could be devised, as it would be always reminding
them of the services rendered by Parliament to that
country. He believed that the relief from the consta-
bulary tax would be greatly beneficial, and was a mea-
sure of great importance, but it was not the measure
that her Majesty's Government should adopt fur the
relief of a distressed country.
After a few words from Lord COTTENLIMtI,
Earl DEVON fully concurred in the course of policy
suggested by the Noble Lord who preceded him, as
it would have the effect of improving both the
moral and physical condition of the people of
Ire!and. There could be no second opinion as
to the necessity of the Bill before the House.
Lord MOUNTCASHEL said that the present cir •

curnstances of Ireland deserved every consid:ration. lie
had only arrived from that country within the last few
day s, and he could assure their Lordships that the wants
o. the peas.nttly were not in any th•gree exaggerated in
the south of Ireland. Want and famine were staring them
in the face. In a short time the poor-houses would be so
filled that there would be no room for applicants. What
was then to be done ? lie had been glad to see that every
endeavour had been made by Parliament to meet the
wants of the people, but he was informed that the
railway Bills would not be forward enough to give em-
ployment 0 the people. In his own neighbourhood po-
tatoes were selling at the prices usually received in the
months of June and July, and there watt every appearance

of their reaching a higher price. Ile happened to live in
a very peaceful neighbourhood, bat within the last fort-
night there had been very unpleasant symptoms exhi-
bited. Large bodies of men were going aboet armed,
and several murders had been committed. It was a
common declaration that in two months they would
have civil war. Ile might be allowed to
state one word with regard to a matter
which had, perhaps, no connexion with the present Bill,
but which had been moved by the Noble Lord who
brought it before them. It was the intention of the
Government, to bring forward another Drainage Bill.
That Bill was viewed with a great deal of apprehension.
The Noble Lord then proceeded to read extracts from
a letter he had received from some millers in the north
of Ireland, who expressed a hope that no measures would
be suffered to become law which would have an injurious
effect upon their propez ty; they alluded particularly to
the Drainage Act.
The Earl of ST. GERMANS expressed a hope that
no alteration would be math in the Bill now before the
House which would affect injuriously the present bur-
dens upon land.
Lord COTTENHAM said a few words in reply, which
were inaudible in the gallery.
Earl ST. GERMANS said that it was his intention
to move the committal of the Bill on Friday next.
Their Lordships then adjourned.

ill HOUSE OF COMMONS, Monday, Feb 9.
The SPEARER took the Chair at a few minutes before
Four o'clock. .

NEW MEMBERS.

Lcrd MOUPETH took the oaths and his seat for the
We.t Riding of Yorkshire. On the entrance 4)f the
Noble Lord, who- was introduced by Lord John. Russell
and Mr. Byng, he was greeted with loud cheers from all
sides of the House.

Mr. WCARTHY, who was introduced by Mr. O'Con-
nell and another Hon. Member, took the oaths and Lis
seat for the city of Cork.
THE AYSIIIRE AND GALLOWAY RAILWAY.
Sir J. Y. BULLER brought up the Report of Sub-
.
Commil tee No. 2, when
M,r. HODGSON said, that before the report was or-
dered to lie on the table, he. wished to make a few ob-
servations. Ile wished to put a question to the Attor-
ney-General on a point of law, but at the same time he
had no desire to impugn the judgMent of the Committee.
The objection which had been taken to the contract of
the Ayrshire Railway was, that the contract deed was
'invalid, inasmuch as two t;fthe trustees who were bound
to perform the covenants were also shareholders in the
Company. The Committee, when this objection was
urged, came to the resolution, that by standing order
No.. 40, the contract deed was invalid, and did not bind
the trustees to the performance of its covenants. It was
a Scottish Bill; and he thought that the objection which
had bi en raised could not consistently be maintained.
lie wished now to appeal to the opinion of the highest
constituted law officers in that House, whether or not
the fact of a certain number of trustees holding shares in
the Complay would render its ece.tract invalid ?
The ATTORNEY-GENERAL said, that under the
standing order which had been referred to by his Hon.
Friend all that was required was, that the parties sub-
scribing should bind themselves to the performance of
the subscription deed. It appeared from the facts of the
case that the trustees-were also shareholders, and agreed
to pay the amount of their subscriptions in common
with the other sibscribers ; and as trustees they a s)
covenanted to see the due performance of the contract,
so that in point of fact the covenanters were also
covenantees. lie was of opinion that the whole deed
was not invalid. The question was whether the sub-
scription deed was a compliance with the standing or,:er.
It was perfectly true that in a court of law no action
court
td
of hold,eq ibecause nov wouldparry cboeubl
bound
de himself, mtrel f,d
deed,
ina and
wH,isulodpbineicoubli pay the amount of his subscription.'u
undoubtedlygeto an
the ssdtraaniiti.alh‘iva.nahtgyethe standing order
had been complied with,
orders,
dahesee:sel: occurredabwd?ocualudseh a
theve
beenwith a respectcom pl toan
compliance
parties would have bee7ithn liable, if not in a court of law, at
all events in a court of equity.
Sir J. Y. BULLER said it would not become hi
alter the opinion expressed by the Att-arney-Gme:
rer ii, to discuss a point of law. He could
only say
that the decisions to which the Committee had come
were in ac.!ordance with the decisions of Sub-Commit-
tees of last year. lie thought, after the opinions which
had been expressed, betterthatthßeillto take the a
courset to pursuesual
would be to allow the
Si; ea fnedrirnegd
()trod e
rtsh, ecoSmtamnidtitnege
ast thbee
Ord,cott resres,,
Ca
on
md
mfoitrteeit
would, of course, act upon
expressed by the Attorney
_tGheenoeprainliaonndwhsaicnhctiho nude
dbebe)n,
gthueide House,forthe future.andsuch an opinion should be taken as a
Ir .ileckG toS tN°*lie an
' share
,comin
dno objectionEt
ec. that the Bill be
referred
CORN-LAWS.
Sir H. HALFORD presented a petition from the

town and county of Leicester, signed by 2,000 persons,.
engaged both as manufacturers and agriculturists. The
petitioners stated that they beard with alarm of the
scheme proposed by Government for the purpose of re-
ducing those duties which protected native manufactures
and agriculture, and they thought that the best means of
security consisted in affording every lacility for the de-
velopment of the produce 'of our own soil.—(Bear, hear.)
That security would be amply afforded under the exist-
ing corn-laws. The manufacturers stated that there
were documents before the House which would prove
the extremely low rate of wages at present existing in
a dist' ict where there were. more than 100,000 persons,
both manufacturers and agriculturists, mid the pro-
duce of which amounted. to 27500,000/. annually.
Mr. BAMPTON presented a petition in favour of the
measures 'of -commercial reform proposed by her Ma-
jesty's Government.
Mr. NORRIS presented apetition praying for a con-
tinuance of protection to agriculture.
Mr. R. YORKE presented a petition praying for a
total and immediate repeal of the corn• laws.
Mr. LIDDELL presented a petition, signed by up-
wards of ten thousand persons in the county of Durham,
against the proposed alteraion in the corn-laws.
Mr. M. CLARKE presented a petition in favour of
the repeal of the corn-laWs.
Lord DALMENY presented a petition of a similar
naturo.

An HON. MEMBER, whose name we could not learn,
presented a petition, signed by nine thousand of the in-
habitants of Sussex, against any alteration of the corn-
Jaws.

Sir J. C. lIOBHOUSE a resented a petition, very nu-
merously signed, in favour of the contemplated altera-
tion of the corn-laws..
Mr. MUN Z (Birmingham) presented a petition from
the merchants, traders, and other inhebitants of Bir-
mingham, complaining that none of the restrictions en
copper ore were about being removed by the Go-
vernment.
Mr. DUNCOMBE presented three petitions from
Dundee, the seat of the linen manufacturers, in favour
of free trade, which stated that they (the petitioners)
were net afraid of competing with the whole world, al-
though every restriction should be removed.
Lord MORPETH (who was, very loudly and gene-
rally cheered on rising) presented a petition from Wake-
field and Halifax, very numerously signed by merchants,
bankers, and others in Yorkshire, strongly expressing
their approbation of the Government measure respecting
the corn-laws.
Mr. FERRAND faid he should wish to ask the
Noble Lord a question. Ile should wish to learn
whether the signatures to these petitioners bad bean
the free and unbiassed act of the petitioners ?—(Cries of
" Order, crder.") He was prepared to prove that the
working men —(Order, order)—were obliged to turn into
the counting-houses of the large manufactories and sign
these petitions, before they received their weekly pay-
ments.—(Loud cries of " Order.")
The SPEAKER observed that the Hon. Menat:er
might put put a question, but the rule of the House did
not permit that he should make a speech.
Mr. FERRAND—WeII, then, he would put the
question—were these signatures of the kind that he
described ?
Lord MORPETH—He had only to say that, to the
best of his belief and. to the entirety of his convictions,
the signatures to the documents which he had pre-
santed were the free and unbiassed acts of the peti-
tioners.
Sir W. MOLES WORTH presented a petition from
the borouffi of Southwark, in favour of a total and im-
mediate repeal of the corn•laws.
The SPEAKER observed, that perhaps it might be
better fir the house to receive petitions on the corn-
laws after the order of the day had been gone into.
Mr. OWEN STANLEY gave notice that in the Com-
mittee on the corn and provision laws, he would move as
an amendment, a fixed duty of ss. on wheat, 2s. 61. on
barley, and 25. on oats, and so on in proportion.
Mr. M. MILNES g..va notice that, in Committee on
the resolution relating to the corn-laws he would move
the omission of all words after 1849.
Mr. S. CRAWFORD gave notice that he would call
the attention of the House to the propriety of extending
the power of poor-law guardians, so as to enable them to
grant out-door relief to the people of Ireland.
Mr. T. DUNCOMBE moved for a return of the
number of all persons who had removed from the agri-
cultural to the manufacturing districts, particularly in
Yorkshire, Lancashire, and Cheshire, in the years
1841, 1842, and'lB43.—Agreed to. . .
Lord Somerset, Lord Sandon, Sir George Grey, Mr.
Wilson Patten, and the O'Conor 1)on, who constitute
the Committee on Parliamentary Election Petitions, were
then sworn at the table.
Captain
,POLHILL gave notice of a motion, to the
effect that he would on a future day move that the dtity
to be paid on foreign corn for the next three 'years
should be given to the tenant-farmers,: who would
be injured by the measure of her Majesty's Ministers.
Dr. BOWRIING would ask whether any and what
measures had been taken by her Majesty's Government
to inquire into the character of the disease said to have
broken out at Roe Vista in consequence of communi-
cation with the Eclair ?
Sir G. CLERK said that such measures had been
taken as would meet the case.
NEW WRIT.
On the motion of Mr. YOUNG, a new writ was
ordered to be issued for the election of a knight of the
shire for the southern division of the county of Notting-
ham, in the room of the Earl of Lincoln, who has ac-
cepted the office of Secretary for Ireland.
FACTORY SCHOOLS.
Mr. BRIGHT wished to ask the Right Hon. Baronet
the Secretary of State for the Home Department re-
specting the proceedings of the factory inspectors. He
found from their report that Mr. Horner had given 1501.
to schools connected with the Established Church, and
30/. to schools belonging to the British Society of Dis-
senters ; while another inspector had given 2701. to
schools connected with the Established Church, and
to schaols not so connected. Now, it was the
intention of the Factories Act that the sums
appropriated by the Government for this purpose should
b 3 freely and equally divided amongst schools where
factory children were being educated ; and he wished
to know whether these grants were in future to be made
in accordance with the spirit of the Act ?
Sir JAMES GRAHAM (who spoke in so low a
tone of voice as to be scarcely audible in the gal.
lery) was understood to say that the funds appro-
priated by the Legislature for the benefit of fac-
tory schools would be divided eqaally, and without
favour to one sect or another. The inspectors had, he
thought, made the distribution referred to by the Hon.
Nlcinba in this spirit, fur most of the Catholic: schools
refused to receive aid from those fund=, while the British
schools had only taken the money at the request of the
inspector himself.
Sir R. H. INGLIS hoped he should not be deemed
wanting in courtesy to the Right Hon. Baronet
if he asked, without notice, whether the
sum to be apportioned to the several schools
was to depend upon the number of children educated in
the schools, or whether a certain sum was to be appor-
tioned to each, whatever the condition of that school
might be ; he thought this was important, and there-
fore he v. ished to ask whether the same sum VVPS to be
apportioned if the children educated were 50 or 100 in
the school—in fact, whether the sum given was to be in
proportion to the number in the school?
Sir JAMES GRAHAM was under the necessity
to give the same reply as he had just made to
the previous question. They had first to ascertain
the number of scholars, and the revenue of these
schools, and the relief would depend on those circum•
stances.