The Sun.
London, England, 1846-04-25 00:00:00

people out of doors the greater necessity for the carrying of
this measure.—(Cheers.) And the only thing that can pos-
sibly be substituted for the proposition of the Right Hon.
Baronet will be the immediate repeal of the corn-law instead.—
of the three years' delay which he has proposedber
(Cheers.) And when I hesr the Noble Lord, the
for Lynn (Lord G. Bentinck), talking in the way in which
he does, with all that unconsciousness in using argumhte.nt: that
have been often refuted, which must arise from aviog
given his attention exclusively to other subjectsfor the
last twenty years—( Hear, hear, and laughter)—and which
has made him wholly unscquaintei with public measures.—
( Continued laughter.) When I hear him talking that way,
and when I hear him boasting of being backed by 240 of
en the
gentlemen he
gentlemen of England—when I hear them cheering
talks that way—why, when I see such a grievous and e •
ridi-
culous delusion existing in the minds of Honourable Gentlemen
in this House, and stating that that delusion is the public
opinion on this subject—l do feel anxious that if it were pos-
sible the Right Hon. Baronet could appeal to the country—
(Cneers, and counter-cheers from the protectionists)—with-
out any great inconvenience to the trade of the country—
(Laughter from the protectionists)—without any ineone
venience to the private business of this House, I do say that 1
feel anxious that you should appeal to the country on this
question. (Loud cheers.) The country will
of the
such an example of Honourable Gentlemen o
country party as they do not anticipate.—(Loud cheers )
t
The proposition of the Hon. Gentleman is to open the ports
fer Ireland. Now, has he considered the practicals effectshut oinf
opening the ports for Ireland, leaving the p
England?—(Cheers.) Has he not givetnoui be
brought in by
the details of a
measure which he has in preparation
himself and the Noble Lord opposite, th e Member
t p forr ev
eLn yt o
then?
I suppose then he will have some contrivanceintroduction of provisions from Ireland into England.—
'
(Hear, he r.) Because,not prepared with some plan
~
of this sort, seeing that ifw we have is
have no custom-houses between
the two islands, there is no possible means of preventing the
free circulation of American corn by substituting American
provisions for Irish provisions brought into this country. The
Noble Lord has told U 3 that in Ireland what is wanted is
money, and not provisions, and I have beard the assertion
often repeated both by the Noble Lord and some of his sup-
porters who sat around him. Now, if I understand the state
of things in Ireland rightly, there is a positive deficiency in
the necessaries of life ; and has there not been a partial. if not
a total failure, of the potato crop, which forms the staple food
of millions of the people of Ireland ? I presume there is no one
here bold enough to deny that proposition. How, then, will
money supply a deficiency of food ? If the people of Ireland
had gold in equal proportion to their perishing potatoes, it
would not supply them with food. Oh, but, it is said, you
have plenty of corn, had you money to purchase it ; and be-
cause you hare net that money, this corn is being sent to
England. Now, do I understand the Hon.' Member rightly ?
Has he a proposition for stopping that corn being sent to Eng-
land ? If he has, what are the millions of people. who depend
upon the 10,000,000 of Irish provisions, which the Noble
Lord the Member for Lynn says annually come from Ire-
land, to do for their food ? The Honourable Member
foe Limerick leaves the people of England out of the ques-
tion altogether, am; is endeavouring to stop the pro-
press of the measure of the Right Honourable iareiet.
He is trying, by a compact with the Noble
Lord the
Member
erner
for Lynn, to have a bread-tax upon the peopleEngland,ht
while he opens the ports for Ireland. But will notdetain the
House by c,oir g into arcuments to show that Ireland, as well
a. England, v.ould be benefited by a repeal of the corn-laws.
Whenever I wanted a stronger appeal than another to make to
the people of England, I produce the greatest effect when I
instance the case of Ireland. You say yourselves that those
people are living upon water-tresses, sea-weed, and turnip-tops,
and is not this sufficient to prove that the corn-laws have been a
curse rather than a benefit to them? I agree with my Hon.
Friend the Member for the county of Cork, that the repeal of
the corn-laws will have the effect of extending manafactures in
Ireland. They had the best possible proof of this.
Establish free-trade in corn, and you open a trade
across the Atlantic, with the United States of
America. A people with these advantages must be idle
indeed not to avail themselves of it. 'Fite Irish people, how-
ever, are not idle, they are enterprising, and will avail them-
selves, if the opportunity is given them, of the natural advan-
tages and facilities which their country presents for extending
their commerce and manufacture. Manufactures will spring
up on the west coast of Ireland beside those splendid streams
which abound there, if you only enable them to purchase
their corn from America, and to open an unrestricted trade
across the Atlantic. I feel most anxious not to trespass upon
the time of the House now. I have intruded but seldom in
this debate, for I am anxious not to be a party to any proceed-
ing that may delay the progress either of the Coercion Bill or
the oven •laws. I deeply regret, indeed, that these two measures
should come intocompetition with each other, and I am quite
sure that the people of England are vexed and distressed at it.
During the recess I was called upon repeatedly to held great
public meetings in Manchester, and in London, in order to re-
monstrate upen the delay occasioned by this debate, but the
question 1 asked myself was, Who shall we remon,trate with ?"
I did not know who to blame, nor do I now ; I can't Warne the
Government, because if I were disposed to do so, I see they are
already blamed so much that I cannot add to the load the
weight of my censure. Then again, I have no right to blame
the Members for Ireland, for it is not for me to judge as to the
extent to which they deem it to be their duty to oppose the first
reading of this Bill. I leave them to be the sole judges, be-
cause I should claim the same right myself, of the course and
policy which they ought to adept. I deeply regret, never-
theless, that this obstruction has taken place. And I trust
that Honourable Gentlemen, coming from Ireland, will, at all
events, ask the co-operation of Gentlemen on their
own side of the House, wito are quite as near
in alliance with them in endeavouring to get good fur Ire-
land as the Noble Lord opposite. 'I ney ought to blame and
dispense censure upon the Liberal 'Members of the House, in
the hope of seeking and obtaining the confidence of Hon. Gen.
tlemen opposite ; and, at all events, I hope that on this side of
the House we may manage to preserve good humour. I do
not despair that on another evening after this we shall be able
to advance towards the corn-law question, in which seriously
Ireland is more deeply interested than in anything else.
Mr. W. MILES was quite ignorant of any compact exist-
ing between the Hon. Member for Limerick and the party
which was so ably heady by the Noble Lord the Member for
Lynn.He believed, according to the customary rules and cour-
tesy, the Hon. Member for Limerick gave his Noble Friend
notice of his intention to put the question he has propounded
this evening, and that was the only compact, if compact it
could ha called, which existed between the Hon. Member and
the protectionist party. He had nothing whatever to do with
the long speech which the Hon. Member for Limerick had
made in putting his question ; but, of course, he and his
party were pledged by the answer given by his Noble Friend.
It would he remembered, that on the first night of the
debate on the corn-laws, he stated to the Government that they
were ready to throw open the ports, if it were necessary to re-
lieve the suffering of the Irish people, and they were now ready
to take that step, if the Government required them. He was
not sorry that this short debate had taken place, for it enabled
all parties in that House to express their sympathy for Ireland,
and it was gratifying to see that all aides were desirous of doing
something to relieve the suffering of Ireland. Irish Members
would always find the party to which he belonged acting with
tnpathy for Ireland, as far as it was possible for them to de
so, and they were now desirous of taking the first step towards
the social improvement of Ireland, namely, improving the lesser
orders of society. That was not the time for entering upon
the question of the corn-laws, but he was happy indeed that the
debate hid taken place, because it would show the House and
the country that however they might differ upon some point
they were desirous of seeing some improvement introdaced into
the sister kingdom.
Mr. SMITH O'BRIEN said he wished to ask a question
of the Right Hon. Baronet the First Lord of the Treasury.
Sir R. PEEL—I can anticipate the question the Hon. Mem-
ber wished to put to me, and I will answer it without hesita-
tion. I apprehend the question to be whether lam prepared
to accept his proposition to repeal Lk. corn-laws in respect to
Ireland for the period of three months? I say at once lam not
prepared to agree to it.
Mr. S. O'BRIEN was about to make an explanation, but
being called to order he resumed his seat.
Mr. B. DISR AELl—Before we go into a division upon the
question before the House, I cannot help reverting to some of
the observations made by the Hon. Gentleman the Member
for Stockport. He has treated us with a definition which
public men have often indulged in, and has threatened us wish
the public indignation, and held up to us the horrors of public
reprobation. He has imitated many great examples by not
shrinking from defining and using a particular term for
the purpose of menacing the Legislature.—( Hear. )
There is a celebrated definition of the same term
connected to ith three individuals who met in a street (not a
street in Stockport. )—( freer, and Laughter.) We are told,
without the slightest exception, that the people of England are
p.er-ons who live in towns; I think that definition, fur I made
a note of it at the time, was loudly cheered by a gentleman,
the expression of whose opinion—ot whose feeling!, !Ludt al cv:iys
make a great impression on this House and on :he country.
The Rtight Hon. Gentleman, the first Minister of the Cross n,
the moment the Hon. Member for Stockport, held up what
11 e called, the' country party to the indignation of the people,
Indulged in aloud cheer, The moment the country party were
t.,,hreweried with the' indignation of the people, the Right Hon.
Baronet the First Minister oi f England cheers most lustily ;
tranedelie, it
(11:arneimtioeumbeorf w
remembered, tlla,atttheti threat was followed by a
The people were defined to e people consisted of.
towns, and this definition moefbte withr% nes veryliving
lo uind
cheer from the first Minister
of " No, no.") Yes, I • • Ine C"wn. —,ies
repeat it ; immediately after the '
nition of the term people the Right lion. Gentleman cheered,c
which struck me at the time as rather strange, remembering as
I did that the cheer came from the same Right Hon. individual
who was once so fond of being at the head of the country
,uta,
tlensen of England. Ihe moment the Hen. Gentleman the
Member for Stockport defined the people as being persons
living in towns, and attempted, as he had often dote before, to
control public opinion, by holding out a threat of public indie-
nation, saying that this sentiment of indignation would arise
from the people, who, in a most worthy and frank manlier, he
defined to be persons who lived in towns, the Prime Minister of
England immediately cheered and accepted that definition.
Sir ROBERT PEEL —I totally deny it.— ( Tremendous
cheering.)
Mr. B. DISRAELI—Sir, if the Right Hon. Baronet
totally denies it—if he means to say any thine I have stated is
false, of course I cease.—(clear, hear.) The lion. Member
then sat down.
On the question being put for reading the order of the day
for resuming the adjourned deb to on the Coercion 13111,
Mr. MAURICE O'CONNELL moved that the House do
now adjourn.—( Cries of "Oh, oh.")
A`r. aMITH O'BRIEN said he had now an opportunity of
giving that explanation, which ti.e Ifouse had just refused
to hear. Last Saturday, from Tapers which he had received
from Ireland, he found taae the distress and suffering there had
become so frighten that it was imperatively net estiry that
some decisive step should be taken to alleviate it. He, there-
fore, wrote the letter to which he had already alluded to the
Noble Lord the Member fur Lynn, without consulting any of
the Irish Members, who in truth were nut aware of his inten-
tion till after the letter had been sent.
Mr. NEWDEGATE said he wished to know whether he
was right in thinking that the Right Hon. Baronet at the
heal of Ninjesty's Government a few minutes ago declared
Shrews-
bury, was false sserletht of his lion. Friend, the Member for s
se
Sir
not.
R°"•11T PEEL—Certainly I believe the
words I used were, <,
man says I cheesel tt,taly deny it." The Hen. GelV_lee
man the Member for Stockport,
expression of the Hon. Gentle-
dietat'ek;:ort, namely, that persons in
towns heel a right to
o,utlerntao,tthe cannery party, and thus I
accepted the Hon.
's c?nstruction of the word
" people." Arvin, I say, I:,:),it..onta,r‘.ly. deny
Gentlemen the Member for it. The Hor.
Hon. Li entil:eirnf ei,Af • shbeu Shrewsbury thinkshad
I said an} thing that the H
said was false. I said nothing of the kiln)oei.o—goi(r,enc,fuu.rdicheers.) t
Mr. NE WDEGATE begged to a
understood the Ri mss- s
ght Hon. Baronet, but certainly the
pression upon his mind was that the Right Hon. Baronet
cheered the definition of the Hon. Member for Stockport.
Mr. PETER 13ORTHWICK it wasesidenteherewas a
misapprehension of the meaning of the Right Hon. Baronet,
hot he regretted the Right Hon. Baronet did not rise to ex.
plain at the time his lion. Friend the Member for Shrewsbury
renewed his seat. (Cries of " Oh, ob•")
Major M ACNANIA RA thought the Right Hon. Gentleman
at the head of her Majesty's Government had already suffi-
ciently explained. He was not responsible for the speech of
the Hon. Gentleman the Member for Stockport, or any other
Hon. Member, but if he were, that was not the piece to call
upon him to explain it,—(Laughter,)

Lord GEORGE BENTINCK was not in the House when 1
the Hon. Member for Stockport made his observations ; but \
there certainly was an impression amongst Hon. Members near
him that the Right Hon. Baronst cheered a particular expres- i
sion. His Hon. Friend was, therefore, justified in the remarks !
he had made, but the Right Hon. Baronet having stated that
they were labouring under an erroneous impression, this dis- 1
claimer must be takan as perfectly satisfactory.—( Hear, hear.) 1
Mr. H. IHNDE said, he certainly thought the Right Hon.
Baronet cheered the definition, and he rose simultaneousi!
with his Hon. Friend the Member for Shrewsbury to protest
against what he considered very improper conduct.— (Oh, oh.)
from Sir h JAMES
isNoble G
Friend R A
the iesmaihoe, r tfloiartLyanftner,
itw what fallen
hvaedry fallenliA
Al
subject. But as he (Sir J. Graham)
inex-
pedient and unnecessary to prolong hadthe adaitscntleTtOtilo uhpisonuitglihist
Hon. Friend at the head of the Government, he
perhaps was the
person most capable of giving an
opinion upon this matter.
hard to call to account a
He must say that it was somewhat
particular cheer of any man.b rHfenrhascitwneair,mpolrytc,haenedredhethie,avdearygraebel(e
speech of the lion. Member
in many of thelleseenetrimtaieennltys
dwidhiechheetrh, eandHhone.,Gasenn,t)ltenaniarne
had expressed.
that his Right Hon. Friend did not cheer the declaration that
whatever might be the opinion of that House with respect to
the passing of the measure for the freer importation of corn
into this country, whatever was the opinion of the represen-
tatives of the people, the people themselves had settled ihe
question long ago. He had certainly demurred from the defi-
nition of the Hon. Member for Stockport, that the inhabi'ants
of the towns constituted the people of this country. He dif-
fered from that definition when he heard it, and he was quite
sure that his Right Hon. Friend abstained from cheering then.
The Hon. Member for Shrewsbury was labouring under a
great mistake if he supposed that the Right Hon. Baronet at
the head of the Government had used any term which was in
the least degree inconsistent with the rules of that House in
positively denying the accuracy cf the lion. Member's impres-
sion. He had used no term imputing falsehood. He had I
1
stated distinaly and firmly that he totally denied it. Surely
that was not inconsistent with the rules of the Hou_e when
an erroneous statement had been made.

Mr. MILES begged to corroborate what had fallen from
the Right Hon. Gentleman. He (Mr. Miles) was looking at
the Right Hon. Baronet at the head of the Government at the
time this matter occurred, and he noticed that the Right Hon.
Baronet did not cheer.
Mr. J. S. WORTLEY also corroborated the statement.

Mr. BROTHERT ON said his impression was that the
Right Hon. Gentleman did not cheer. He thought the
Hon. Member for Shrewsbury had grossly perverted the
whole matter.
Mr. CORBA.LLY said Le was lookir.g at the Right Hon.
Baronet at the time, and he could state that the Right
Hon. Baronet did not cheer.
Sir R. PEEL—I totally dissent from the principle. I
do not recognise any right in any class of the people—any
sort of right to dictate to the country. Why then should I
cheer ?

Mr. COBDEN—The language which was used by the
Hon. Member for Shremsbury is now adopted by the 'light
lion. Gentleman. I never said that the towns could dictate
to the country. In speaking of the people, I spike of the
majority of the people ; and I apprehend that the majority
of the people of these Islands live in towns. I by no means
wish to say that they should dictate to the country, but in
all constitutional countries, I apprehend, than the majority
governs.

Mr. DISRAELI said he had never anticipated any dis-
cussion upon the subject. Of course he had been mistaken,
The Hon. Member for Stockport had made a speech, and in
the course of that speech he ( Mr. Disraeli) had been given
to understand that the Right Hon. Baronet had cheered a
certain sentiment. He had been told by an Hon. Member
that the Right lion. Baronet the First Lord of the Treasury
had cheered that sentiment in the most decided manner. He
(Mr. Disraeli) said, " Are you sure of it ?" and he replied
" I have not the slightest doubt of it." Now, so assured, he
(Mr. Disraeli) had a perfect right in debate to refar to such
a matter. Had such a cheer been given by him (Mr. Dis-
raeli) it would certainly have been immediately laid hold of
by the Hon. Baronet. He was therefore surprised at the man-
ner in which the lion. Baronet denied his (Mr. Disraeli's)
assertion ; and he was under the impression that the Right
Hon. Baronet intended to be offensive in the matter. Under
these circumstances he (Mr. Disraeli) of course immediately sat
down. He was perfectly satisfied now that the Right Hon. Gen-
tleman, did not cheer, and therefore he (Mr. Disraeli) had la-
boured under an erroneous impression.—( Cheers. )
Sir R. PEEL—I take it for granted that there is an end to
this personal matter. Of course if a Member in my situation
cheer any sentiment, any gentleman is at liberty to comment
upon it. But the Hon. Member for Shrewsbury took this
definition as mine.
Mr. DISRAELI—In consequence of the cheer.
Sir R. PEEL—In consequence of the cheer, and upon that
I immediately rose, and said I totally deny it.
Mr. M. O'CONNELL then withdrew his motion for the
adjournment of the House.
THE ADJOURNED DEBATE.

At ten minutes to ten o'clock the order of the day for re-
suming the adjourned debate was read.
Mr. °J. O'CONNELL said he was sorry, after the scene of
recrimination which they had witnessed, to re-open the war.
In addressing himself to the subject before the House he would
first of all turn his attention to the speech of the Honourable
Member for Stroud (Mr. P. Scrope). In the course
of that speech the Honourable Member had used
what he (Mr. O'Connell) could only designate as
unchristian doctrines. The Honourable Member said that
the only way of relieving Ireland was by establishicg
a poor-law like the English one ; and the Hon. Member went
on to say that the present system of charity in Ireland was ex-
travagant and useless. Ireland was not in a state to admit of a
poor-law. What would they do with the labourer if they
made his condition equally good as that of the independent
labourer, whose struggle was such a life and death one that it
requiTed a large amount of moral energy to engage
or persevere in it. There was one thing he defied then
to do, and that was, to make the condition of the labourer
under any system affording relief, worse than that of the inde-
pendent labourer.--( Hear, hear.) He would wish to say, with
respect to the observation of the Noble Lord the Member for
Lynn (Lord G. Bentinck), that the Members who advocated a
repeal of the Union, repudiated the idea of a dismemberment of
the empire. The Irish Members had been done great injustice
to by the supposition that they advocated a repeal of the corn-
law in the hopes of benefiting by a side wind the object which
they had in contemplation. But lie assured the House that they
would not stain their cause by being guilty of impeding the
cheapening of the bread to the famished people—( Cheers)
and with reference to the charge which had been made
against them of delaying, the progress of the measure ; but the
charge did not rest with then—it rested with those who could
dispense with the Coercion Bill. They could not give a
facility for a Bill which was fraught with unmitigated evil to
the country. English Members, and the writers fur the Eng-
lish press, talked to them of public opinion ; but they gave
proof of a f4regone conclusion—namely, that tey had no roe
gard for public opinion in Ireland. That opinion never en-
tered into their consideration. But the time was come, if the
two countries were to go on together, there should be due
regard paid to that public opinion.—( Cries of " Hear,
hear.") The people of England were not enlight-
ened as to the re..l condition of the Irish people.
He would address himself now to the subject at present under
the consideration of the House, and he would do so with a
deep sense of his inability to deal with it, and, what he felt
more acutely, with a disheartening sense of the effect of any
entreaties or address he would make there. This was no ques-
tion of mere coercion fur a particular emergency. Whether
they mi2ht think it or not—whether they might will it or not
—in spite of themselves, the whole question of international
relations—the whole question of the mu'ual position of the
two countries must come under review. Why did he say so?
There they were in the seventh century of the connexion of
the two countries, and whatever might be the impression in this
country on the subject, it could not he denied that it was re-
garded in Ireland with iron hatred. During that lengthened
period he could not light upon a time—he could not lay his
hands upon:a single spot, where the relations of the two coun-
tries presented any other aspect but that of the direst and
most continued oppression. There they were in the 46th year of
the Union—a Union accomplished by treachery and fraud—a
union accomplished when the country was in a state of corn-
Vete prostration ; and year after year they were going on in a
geometrical progression, the whole country falling into the
most indescribable and increasing misery, approaching occa-
sionally to famine and pestilence. Their minds were so occu-
pied, and properly occupied he would admit, with English mat-
ters, for it was natural that it should be so, that they could
not see the state of Ireland as it really was. Ireland was not
now in the condition she was in some time since. She was
then weak, powerless, and disregarded, she was now fax
growing into importance and power. The people were bandesi
together as a people were never banded before, animated with
the spirit of one man, an „I determined to redrew.; themselves
their grievances, if they were not redressed. They were tried
in the tire of affliction, and they were so schooled by systematic
ospression, that he should mock that House if he did not say
that they were utterly disinclined and detached from this coun-
try. He believed it to be fur the advantage of both countries
hat the connexion should continue, but it would net, he

feared, continue, unless their policy was changed. Firmly as
the people of Ireland were attached to the repeal—and that
attachment was as strong as their attachment to life—their desire
was to preserve the ebrinexion between the t ro countries.
This connexion was the best mode, he sincerely believed, of
advancingE their mutual interests, but he inu-t also say that
tyrannical as
.nngleanntde's.strength would never be secure if Ireland was dis-
Nnileur:tacbiengthc,ase.Rousseitan
of the
.mumst,
riliaer,chn,nda
barrier would be created by thisi union which weh i :huts
is,lea np
powers of the
world, would not be able to o
would ask., was this Bill brought in?
At what period, he
at a time when the country was res. Itd. was brought forward
genre of successes in war—at resounding with the intelli-
they were going to confer benefitsomentF also, whin
was the time when Ireland was threatenedon England—such
By this course of proceeding they wereawalC with
coercion.
the recol-
lectie.ns that a period of success for Ermlanednwinags
press:on for Ireland, anti that no concession of one
of
op-
rish rigLts
might be expected unless England was '
beset with difficult}
awaken.
and danger. These were dangerous considerations to
, Their object should rather be to blot out the
past, and to avoid all reminiscences of the b memory
of
the
bygone e history of
; the two countries ; but instead of that they
what they
, blamed them for doing in the Conciliation llall " andrefresliee
the recollection of the oppressions and afflictions, which li
e-
lind had undergone since she had the
misfortune of being
connected with England. Never were le ore
easily conciliated than the Irish people were ;
word even, or a promise, or the sound of :
promise. would have conciliated them ; but he would tell them
' that neither a word, nor a promise, nor the sound ora promise,
would cor.ciliate them now. They have had too long experi-
ence of the conduct of this country to place any dependence in
mere professions; for what word was ever kept, what promise
was not broken, and what hopes held out were ever anything
else hut empty delusions? It was an ungrateful moment,
therefore, to attempt to inflict fresh tyranny upon Ireland. He
was much struck with an article he had recently read in the
Mee/ rer newspaper (which was said to be a Government
paper) connected with the successes which had lately,att, rider!
their arms in India ; aid he would take the liberty of reading
the passage for the put pose of connecting better the remark•
he had to make upon it.—( The Hon. Member here read the
pa-sage, which stated that a large number of the Irish soldiers
who were at present in India, under Sir Hugh Gough, hac
subscribed a large amount of money fur the relief of their
suffering countrymen at home, and had handed it
to Sir Hugh Cough for remittance to li eland.
They went to the field of battle after doing as this paper stated.
Suppusing„ then, they were informed of w Eat was preparine
for their unfortunate country supposing they were told that a
Coercion Bill was preparing for the further relief of their
would have been their feelings then?
—(Hear, w hat
starving countrymen,
hear.) Would they have turned their backs uyon
NI they wntrA have gone on—they would have
the enemy ? —O, _
have wrung victory from a b ild
shed their blood—they would
They were not the men who
and daring enemy.—( Cheers. )
would then turn their
stared them in the face. When the remnant of their force, how-
ever, came back, they would hear of what was doing for their
country while they were fighting the battles of England.—
(Hear, hear.) They would be told this—they would be told
that their fathers, 'oho had left their wretched homes
to seek the priest for their dying mothers, to
have
the consolation of religon given thcm on their
dying bed ___-.olear ,
)—they would be told, that while en-
deavouring toseek this conselation, they were seized and trans-
ported under the humane powers of an English law, termed a
Coercion ill, and not unjustl so termed. '
—(Hear, hear. ,
' Wttat mustß be their feelin
lingo then? He would be told in that

House, that this would not be the case—that an exception
---
would be made in such cases. Little, ire eed, were they in
that House acquainted with the power of the minions of the
law—of the subordinates, the police in that country. Such
results, indeed, would not take place, if the justice of the Mem-
bers of that House was properly carried out.—( Hear, hear. )
And those who knew the police of that country were ni t
ignorant of the means to which they would resort for the grati-
fication of their revengeful spirit. The little police of Ireland
I were ever ready to follow up any man in that country
who would attempt to give expression to his feel-
I ines ; and it was well known that those subordinates of the law
looked upon themselves as dignified by the little brief authority
with which they were invested ; and they looked for the
marked respect of the unfortunate people—(Hear, hear)—in
1 fact they expected that every man should be ready at all times
to take off their ha's to those petty tyrants who were promoted
for acts which very often tended but to the gratification of their
own passions. He would appeal to the Irish Members of that
House, if such was not the character of the Irish police, and if
every word of what he had stated in reference to them was not
true?—( Hear, hear. ) He believed that the word of the Irish
Members was worth something upon that head, and yet throe
policemen were to have the practical carrying out of this vile
measure. This then would be the situation of the unfortunate
peasantry of Ireland under the present Bill. He would
speak to many other of the dangerous results of
this measure, but he would also speak to the (larger
which would accrue to this country from the effect of the pre-
sent policy of the English Government towards Ireland. They
might think themselves safe, but he would warn them that they
were on the blink of a dangerous precipice. It was a giddy
height, and they looked down upon danger, and it may be
ruin, though in the distance ; but that danger to the connexion
of both countries was not the loss certain.—( Hear, hear. )
They might not think so, but he felt bound in his conscience
to warn them, and he now did so, that this subject was a
most dangerous one to this country.—(Hear, hear.) As a
proof that he was nut overrating the matt, r, he found that the
probability of a war was occupying the attention and judgment
of the military men of this country. He found that the mili-
tary engineers, in their anxiety on this question, were
looking at the geographical position of Ireland, and
made, accordingly, observations upon her coast and harbour.
in the event of a foreign war. Would they allow
Ireland to remain in this state—would they allow her to be at
the mercy of such a Bill as the present, while they were hurl-
ing defiance at their foreign enemies? Well, they might do
so ; but they were mistaken if they wrapped themselves in the
mantle of security, for they were anything but safe, under
such a state of things in that country.—(Hear, hear.) To
prove to the House that this danger was not unlikely, he felt
bound to rest an extract from a journal of vet, high authority
—he meant the United Service Gazette. ('l: he Hen. Member
read at some length to the effect that, in case of a war between
England and any other country, many of the harbours on the
coast of Ireland were accessible to the ships of the enemy, and
recommending that the attention of the Government
should be directed to the defence of those places.) The
Honourable Member continued—When France attempted
a partial invasion of Ireland, General Massena was told that
he could never think of conquering England by such an act of
warfare; but the General replied, that he did not think of
conquering England by such a step, but he was certain that
a successful stand in Ireland would have ruined England, and
that his intention was not to conquer but to ruin her. England,
however, says, we are able to fight the world, and put down
Ireland too. She might be able to do so, but it was not a very
Christian-like boasts-(11nm hear.) She had been so vic-
torious in battle, that she might not only fancy herself still the
favourite of fortune, but she might in reality be so. He trusted
she would long continue so—(Cheers)—but if she were able to
fight the world and put down Ireland, what scenes of blood
would not be shed—what ruin to her manufacturers—
what ruin to her mercantile interests, would not follow
en the heels of such a victory. (Hear, hear.)
With what feelings would this country contemplate so fearful
a result.—( Hear, hear.) The Irish Members in that House
felt that they were bound to oppose this Bill, that they were
charged by the other side of the House with causing unne-
cessary and unwarrantable delay in the passing of such a mea-
sure. Instead, however, of this opposition being unnecessary
and unwarranted, it was an opposition asked for by the ob-
noxious powers contained in it ; and they would be acting con-
trary to the trust reposed in them, and contrary to the dic-
tates and convictions of their own conscience. The Noble
Lord (alorpeth) who stated that, notwithstanding he would
oppose this measure in its future stages, he felt bound to
support its first reading. He (Mr. O'Connell) was really at
a loss to account for this—he really could not find the logic
of it.—( Laughter.) With respect to the Noble Lord who
Introduced this Bill, he found it stated in the papers,
purporting to have reported the speech of that
Noble Lord, sentiments which he could not agree with. This
Bill was introduced by Lord St. Germans, who was sponsor to
it. Now he would oppose this Bill, if for no other reason
than because it had been stated by the late Secretary of
State for Ireland.— ( Loud laughter. ) He recollected when
this i,oble Lord came to Ireland in his official capacity, he teas
talked of as a moderate man ; but the Irish people had un-
fortunate reasons to know the contrary. He was a man smeoth
in speech, but one of fatal contradiction in action. Ile told
the Irish people that Sir Robert Peel's policy towards Ireland
should be wise and moderate, that he would endeavour to pro-
mote the interests of Ireland by developing her re-
seurces, and by combining wisdom with moderation
in every measure affecting that country, and by trying to do
justice to all. And yet, here was this " moderate" man now
introducing a Bill which was calculated to trample on the few
remaining liberties of the Irish people. This moderate man
went to Ireland ; and what was his first act ? Let him (Mr.
J. O'Connell) point to the election of Dublin, at which the
Noble Lord the Member for Yorkshire was a candidate. In
that case the grossest injustice had been practised. The sheriff
had appointed a creature of his as overseer of a most important
booth, and in which that creature gave every opposition to the
Liberal voters. Appeals were made to the moderation and
the candour and the justice of this moderate man ; and yet
what did he do ? He gave no. answer whatever ; he went
away, left Dublin, and left the whole affair in the hands of Mr.
Breasten, and that was the first slip of this moderate man.—
(Hear, hear.) The next act of this moderate man was to ap-
point to judicial situations on the Bench men who had made
themselves remarkable even in this House by their vehement
opposition to any measure of liberal tendency for Ireland. His
next step was that of the dismissal of the liberal magistrates.
The Hon. Member then called attention to the circumstances
connected with the proclamation that had been issued for the
prevention of the ,meeting that was intended to have been
held at Clontarf. lie would contend for it that
that proceeding was one, if not of cold-blooded cruelty, at
least one of cold-blooded heedlessness. And the excuse for
suddenly issuing that proclamation was, that there had not
been time to correct it. He would say that anything more
mocking than this excuse he had never heard. Let the House
look to the conduct of Lord St. Germans, who was a party to
the appointment of O'Driscoll to the magistracy of the county
of Galway, the man who had been dismissed, and was unwor-
thy to be again appointed. The Lord St. Germans was a
party to th appointment of Lord Lucan to the Lord-Lieute-
nancy of Mayo. Lord Lucan was the man who rescinded the
order for allowing the Sisters of Charity to visit the prisons
and hospitals. These ladies had denied themselves every
comfort and luxury of life, and consented to live in po-
verty, to benefit their fellow-creatures. They faced
for that purpose disease and death in their most
terrible forms, and exposed themselves without fear
to contagion. That order—he said so in no sectarian
spirit—that order would have been respected in every man's
heart, and Lord Lucan refused in the most contemptuous man.
nor what would not have been refused its the most Anti-
Catholic part of this country. The Protestants themselves
were so convinced of the utility of these foundations that they
had instituted some of them themselves, and yet Lord Lucan
was rewarded by the Lord-Lieutenancy of Mayo. Throughout
the three or four years that they had the misfortune of having
Lord Lucan as secretary, he sacrificed all his feelings to parti-
zanship. He yielded all his feelings to party purposes, and
supported the Government in all their harsh measures, and
yet that man came forward—as it has been reported in the
newspapers—and spoke feelingly of the crime of Ireland, and
how he felt grieved at the measures of repression which the
Government felt compelled to apply. 'What were hie last words?
That the Government regretted to interfere with the rights of
property to such an extent, but they had no remedy. 01
course they could not do so, as long as the law remained on the
statute-book, but they could remove the law and introduce
measures to make the landlords respect the rights of property
in the tenant, as much as the House respected the rights of
property in the landlord, There were Hon. Gentlemen
in that House who had been such as to call for
a consideration of the measures they had proposed. With
regard to the Right lion. Baronet the Secretary for the Home
Department, he (Mr. J. O'Connell) referred to him, because
he had not remedied his former acts, but he had declared his
repentance of them. His expressions seemed to hold out hope
for Ireland, and to promise that some measures of good for
Ireland should be adopted. His sentiments seemed to come
mere from his heart this year, but he was contravening his ow:
declarations in bringing forward the present Bill. His former
conduct towards the people of Ireland remained bitterly im-
pressed on their memories, and anxious as they were to accept
words of conciliation, yet they must call on him not to leave
them with mere words, but to show by his acts that he felt a
sincere repentance, and conceived a new line of policy better
adapted to the wants of the county. With regard to the
Right Hon. Gentleman the First Lord of the Treasury, he had
not given them these assurances ; he had not held out the same
language. It might be the difference of temperament, that he
tray not willing to express those feelings, but kept them
within his own breast. Still the omission was im-
portant, because it related to the offence charged against
him. If the Right Hon. Gentleman would recall to his
memory his conduct towards Ireland, he would find that it
began by an unjust and tyrannical persecution of the press.
tie would remember that during his Secretaryship in Ireland,
the Orange system obtained an organization of the most flourish-
ing and permanent description, and that had been attributed to
' him. Ile (Mr. J. ('Connell) did not charge the Right Hon.
Baronet with it, because he (the Right Hon. Gentleman)
peevoeiriyleyoolunlrgelagnend
was anxious as he was willing to believe he stood well with the
of
smainly to his fostering that the
—but
property, arid who was of Pro-
testantthe'o rang , persuasion,m a
n.
The
Rightas soon
ii ason h.
system obtained the ascendency in Ireland ; so much so, that
eGceanintleen(i)fanagheawdaosn"l:ecrnerlanl Oacscaar-t
ses
cmmpmiw%z‘olii,eaeenthayaahcalsssituruut,
diehrhrrileeeistngff:go:idriearra:
sjuiontsh,shotiwonuses,ymreppartehseynttoewd atrhdesseweroosprionitchipilses,
party as
wasthe
and bad,
super •abundance of loyalty. There was one think)
certain, namely, that throughout his life in Ireland, he had beets
leagued with those who were constantly and strongly opposed
to the rights of the people of Ireland, and went with all th • e err
the
ribeoet thehmi
mi enietbringingiaodps:ur,progress
ghef eroet
ff,li :ne
reliefp
poo, of rho
people
of
ccvdmalleect
nddnoehttiehliahrtii liifia,gmme, dena,tialvtio.
tattdeooipchipueng,
effaced
hio, sho:t,:eesfiaa,iosei
uti
relent
ikenefflnaghe en: unflinchingly,iiyrie3dwte,t:::aturrnhi tnniedo:t..nttei
possess,ion restrictions
oor n a
Catholic
andseries l
alwaysi ofc
liberty y
(ah
ss:
his opinion fully against the freedom of his fellow-subjects.
ef Ireland, of the opposition he had made to them while there.
His conduct since then, whether in or out of olive, was not
calculated to improve the impression.—( Ilear, hear.) No one
was more ready than he was to urge the Whigs forward
the
he gave
that
party
peg, leo flreland in
then, and h
1 ti3a.i
t He :
old and isolated
recollected
facts
cagheaient
cheers
which
raksd rip and presented with all the dramatict effect
and illustration of which he was capable, to serve his purpose;
warping and misleadicg the judgment of his hearers to effect
that end. The two Right Hon. Baroneta opposite had also
done their Lest to violate
people
the electoral rights of the o
'-
f
Ireland, assisted by' Lord Stanley, isi support of which attempt
they attributed perjury and bribery, arid every other viee
them. The people of Ireland recollected all these deeds, ' oanto'
knew that, ever since they came into power,
their object had been to give ascendancy t,',
the party that is inimical to the rights and
privileges of the great body of Irishmen. That while they
had, Janus like, one face of liberality to the people of England,
they presented another of injustice, and tyranny, and cruelty
to the people of Ireland. These were the men who were
to administer this law with the assistance of their suhordi-
rates. Was it any wonder, then, that the representatives of
measure titan that, it be
no other objections to the
it would
Ireland opposed the measure? For himself, if there were
rdministered by
ne-
cessary, lie would strenuously oppose its passing into a law. '
such parties, even admitting that was ,
He now came to the measure itself, He would ask, had the
Government fairly tried the powers already in their hands?
Had those powers been fairly tried ? If they bad been, and
failed, however much he might be overwhelmed at the sense
of the hideous crimes committed by his countrymen, he would
feel that he could not resist the granting of new powers.