The Sun.
London, England, 1848-08-17 00:00:00

THURSDA I' EVENING, AUGUST 17, 1848.

matter had not been laid on the table of the House, so
as to place the real facts of the easr, before the country
and before Europe, and to cast the blame ou the shoul-
ders really entitled to bear it.
Lord J. RUSSELL then moved that the Committee
report pro4rcss, and ask leave to sit again.
The House then resumed, the Chairman reported pro-
gress, and obtained leave to sit again at five o'clock.
The House then adjourned, at Half-past Three, until
Five o'clock.

The SPEAKErt rammed the Chair at Five o'clock.
SECULAR EDUCATION.

Dr. BOWRING presented a petition from a place near
Manchester, praying for a general system of secular
education, unaccompanied with the embarrassments of
public instruction.
CHARITABLE TRUSTS.

Mr. SPOONER, presented a petition from Warwick.
against the Charitable Trusts Bill.
AR 1Y REGULATIONS.

Sir DE LACY EVANS wished to ask the Right
lion. the Secretary-at-War whether officers who had
distinguished themselves in the army, but who had since
sold out, would be allowed to wear their uniforms upon
public occasions?

Mr. FOX MAULE said the privilege applied only to
majors and lieutenant-colones who had received the
honour of being made Knights Commanders of the
Bath, and its extension to other officers rested entirely
with her Maje3ty.
EDUCATION IN IRELAND.

Mr. GROGAN said, about ten years ago a con-
siderable sum of money was voted by the House for
the erection of colleges in Ireland, for the education of
the middle classes of that country. These colleges were
in a ♦ery forward state, and he believed some of them
would be opened early next year. Now it was obvious
that any improvement in the social condition of the
people would depend upon the education to be given in
these colleges, and the Noble Lord at the head of the
Government would readily understnnd the anxiety which
prevailed in Ireland to know the nature of the discipline
and system of education that would be pursued in these
colleges.

L,Trd JOHN RUSSELL said it was the opinion of
the Government that the object which Parliament had
in view in making a grant for those colleges would not
be accomplished unless they were open to Roman Ca-
tholics and Presbyterians, as well as to persons belong-
ing to the Established Church. At present, the statutes
were not considered altogether perfect, but they were
now under consideration, and as soon as they were
finally settled he should have no objection to lay them
before the House.

MESSAGE FROM TUE LORDS.
The House was informed that their Lordships have
agreed to the following Ballots Sus
pension—Walsall Improvement (No. 2), without amend-
went—Great :Western Railway (Loop Line from the
Birmingham and Oxford Junction Railway through
Leamington)—Great Western Railway (Birmingham
and Oxford Junction, &c., Railways Purchase)—Man-
cheater, Buxton, Matlock, and Midlands Junction Rail-
way (Deviation and Branch), with amendments.
SLAVE TRADE.

Mr. URQUHART rose to move, " That from the
correspondence laid upon the table of this House in re•
ference to the suppression of the slave trade in Mus
sultnun countries, it appears that her Majesty's servants
have adopted proceedings calculated to ag-
gravate the horrors of the traffic, and to
alienate from this country the 'good will of
the Governments and nations so interfered with."
It was the bounden duty of the Government, to the best
of its ability, to put an end to the traffic in slaves. Now,
he was prepared to show, in the words of his motion.
that " the proceedings of the Government had aggravated
the horrors of the traffic." The Hon. Gentleman, amid
a buzz of conversation which rendered his observations
almost inaudible, was understood to say that he made
this motion in consequence of the correspondence which
had been laid on the table during the previous week, and
he hoped to prove how very injurious and inefficient had
been all our diplomatic efforts for the suppression of the
slave trade in Turkey, Persia, and other Mussulman
countries. We had threatened them with confiscation,
and had even entered into discussions with their doctors
relative to their laws; and yet, he maintained, that with
all these vexatious proceedings the cause of slavery abo
lition had not advanced one jot. The Honourable
Member proceeded to read lengthy extracts from Lord
Ponsonby's dispatches, the purport of which was, that
notwithstanding all our negotiations, Turkey had re
fused to declare the slave trade piracy. - Also from
our diplomatic agent in Persia, to a similar effect.
He denied that any pledge had been given or any
promise made by Persia on the subject, not-
withstanding the assertions to the contrary by
Colonel Shiel and the Noble Lord, repeated in
the dispatches. Slavery was part of the law of
Persia and all Mahometan countries, and we had no
more right to interfere with it than they had to inter.
'fere with our internal affairs. The British Minister at
Persia had stated to the Persian Government that Tur-
key had made it unlawful to import African slaves, and
had made that a ground for demanding the fulfilment of
the alleged promise on the part of Persia, whereas, in
point of fact, Turkey had made no such law, as was
shown in another part of the dispatches. The only re-
sult he could draw from the papers on the table was
that the British Minister had used his best efforts to
pick a quarrel with Persia. The whole interference of
the Noble Lord was ill-timed, misplaced, injudicious,
and absurd, and was characterised by gross ignorance
of the internal arrangements and policy of those countries
to which he sought to dictate. The result of the Noble
Lord's policy was to force a quarrel on Persia, and drive
her into the arms of Russia. When the Persian Go-
vernment found that they could not obtain the friend-
ship of England, except on the conditioa of permitting
England to interfere in their internal institutions,
they would accept the quarrel, and seek the friend-
ship and protection of another country which they
could obtain at less cost—that country against which
in 1828 we entered into a protective treaty with Persia.
Mr. HUME having seconded the amendment,
Lord PALMERSTON observed that the difference
between himself and the Hon. Member on political mat-
ters, to which the Hon. Member had so often alluded,
was never more strongly marked than on the present oc-
casion. The Hon. Gentleman had spoken of the condi-
tion of domestic slavery in Oriental countries. He (Lord
Palmerston) was an enemy to slavery in any form—to
field slavery or domestic slavery ; and though there
might be a difference between the two as to the treatment
and condition of the slaves, the crimes by which they
were procured and brought to market were the same in
both cases ; and if the motives of humanity which led to
the opposition of domestic slavery were not so strong as
those which influenced ns in our endeavours to put a stop
to field slavery, they were in regard to both sufficient to
induce us by every means in our power to put an end to
the system. The Government, therefore, thought that
it was not an improper application of the moral influence
of England to endeavour to induce Mahometan as wallas
Christian countries to put an end to the practice of the
slave trade. The first country in which they made the
attempt, was Tunis, and the Bey of that country, yield-
ing to that influence, not only abolished the slave trade,
but the condition of slavery altogether in his dominion.
—(Hear, hear.) In that country at least that result
had followed from our interference, which the Hon.
Member said we could never hope for in Mahometan
countries.—(Cheers.) Then the Government addressed
themselves to the Sultan, and endeavoured to induce the
Government of Turkey to prevent the slave trade being
practised by their subjects, feeling that it was too much
to expect that they would put an end to the condition of
slavery. And after five months' exertions they did suc-
ceed in obtaining from the Sultan a firman prohibiting
the slave trade as carried on by the subjects of the Porte.
Ministers next directed their efforts to the Imaum of Mus-
cat, who was a great slave-trader, and by whose subjects
the slave trade was carried on in the most barbarous
manner, and they succeeded so far as to induce that so-
vereign to prohibit his subjects within certain limits from
carrying on that trade. Then they had treaties with
many of the Arab chiefs, by which they engaged not to
carry on the slave trade. Then came Persia. He was
glad the Hon. Member had quoted the dispatches of
Colonel Shiel on the subject, because the more those
dispatches were read the greater credit would be reflectd
on that gentleman, whose ability and seal in the per-
formance of his duties entitled him to the highest
praise.—(Hear, hear.) Colonel Shiel had laboured with
great assiduity to persuade the Persian Government to
follow the example of the Sultan, the Imaum of Muscat,
and the Arabian chiefs, and to prohibit the subjects of
the Shah from carrying on the slave trade in the Per-
sian Gulf. The Hon. Member said there was no pro-
mise on the part of Persia, but the dispatch to which
the Hon. Gentleman had referred clearly showed that
there was a distinct promise, and that the Persian Go-
vernment did make the engagement which Colonel
Sheil very properly claimed the performance of.—(llear
hear.) The Honourable Member said that her Ma-
jesty's Government had brought matters to that
point where there was no alternative left but for Persia
to accept the quarrel forced upon her, and throw herself
for protection into the hands of Russia. The Hon.
Member had built up an excelsa turris tubulata, and he
would have the undo altior asset cases.—(Hear, hear.)
But unfortunately for the case of the lion. Member,
notwithstanding his ingenious and elaborate argument
to show how impossible it was for Persia to do that
which her Majesty's representative had asked her to
do, she had actually done it--(Cheers and laughter)—
and if the Hon. Member had only taken the pains to
consult the documents produced before the Slave-trade
Committee, which were now, he believed, on the table
of the House, he would have seen, since the correspon-
dence the Hon. Member quoted fronal, that the Shah
had issued a firm= to prohibit his subjects from carry-
ing,
on the slave trade.—(Hear, hear.) With regard to
that part of the Hon. Member s speech which he
• in
had gone back to the operations against Herat, he
would only ask the House to remember the admission
the Hon. Member had himself made,_tahadtantgheer
t h Persianreat-
expedition against Herat was in effect
ened against our Indian empire.--(Hear.) That was
the ground of the proceedings of the_ British Govern-
ment at that time, and he was glad to have the con-
firmation of the Hon. Member so far That Government
were right in the view they then took.
After a few words from Mr. URQUHART, who
denied that the Noble Lord had fairly represented him,
Mr. HUME, though agreeing that Government were
justified in using all legitimate influence to put down the
slave trade in other countries, objected to the attempts
to effect the object by means such as those employed on
the coast of Africa, which, instead of effecting the object
in view, only added to the horrors of the traffic.
Sir R. 11. INGLIS reminded the Hon. Member that
during the fourteen years the African squadron had been
kept up, we had taken eighty ships, which, if not cap-
tured, would have conveyed 190,000 slaves to the Ame-
rican coast.
Lord J. RUSSELL observed that the subject to which
the Hon. Member for Montrose had adverted had been
the subject of inquiry before a Committee, and he would
easeaine the evidence to see if it wore possible to adopt

other measures better calculated to suppress the trade.
What he rose for was, however to express a hope that
the House would not now, on the 16th of August, enter
into any very long discussions, but that they would
allow the Committee of Supply to proceed with the con-
sideration of the remaining estimates.
Lord G. BENTINCK reminded his Hon. Friend (Sir
R. Inglis) that during the fourteen years to which he
referred, we had by our interference inflicted the most
aggravated sufferings on from 80,000 to 100,000 wretche‘l
beings. He gave credit to his Noble Friend (Lord J.
Russell) for being impressed with a most laudable hatred
of the slave trade ; but he thought he took an awkward
way of showing it when he gave practical encouragement
to slavery and the slave trade by the introduction of
slave-grown sugar.—(Protectionist cheers.)
The amendment was then put and negatived, and the
House resolved itself into Committcee.

On the vote that 72,5001. be granted for the salaries
and expenses of the department for Foreign Affairs,
Mr. BANICES renewed the discussion on the subject
of foreign affairs, demanding to know if hostile orders
had been given to the British fleet towards the Crown of
Naples ; and also demanding inquiry as to our present
relations with the Court of Spain, but imputing no blame
to Sir li. Bulwer, and admitting that ho did not exceed
the authority with which he was invested.
Mr. MACGREGOR drew attention to the case of
Colonel Bristow's expulsion from Spain; and asked for
explanation thereon; at the same time he readily ad-
mitted, with the Noble Lord, the great inconvenience of
discussing such matters at that period of the session.
Sir D. L. EVANS fully concurred in the last remark,
and expressed his regret that the present session should
have been so remarkable for such discussions. In fact,
two continental powers could not have the least dispute
without inducing some Hon. Gentlemen of that House
to call upon the Government for intervention, while
other Hon. Gentlemen demanded that there should he no
intervention. The course now pursued regarding Spain
and Portugal was not new, but similar to that adopted
by this country for fifty years past. And again he must
say that he utterly deprecated discussion on such sub-
jects pending any negotiation.
Mr. HUME said it was true that for the last fifty years
our policy had been that of intervention, and that policy
he objected to. His opinion was that they ought to
adhere to the principle and pledge of the Hon. and
Gallant Gentleman's party as propounded by Lord Grey
of non-intervention, peace, economy, reform, and re-
trenchment. He had waited with great anxiety to see
what case had been made out by Sototneyor against Sir
11. Bulwer, and he found that he had made out no case.
Sir H. Bulwer had been well supported in this House
by the Noble Lord at the head of the Foreign-office,
and he ought to have been as well defended by the Noble
Lord's colleagues in the ether House of Parliament,
where the attacks of Lord Stanley had been permitted
to pass unanswered.
Sir D. L. EVANS denied that he had ever recom-
mended intervention; he had simply stated that inter-
vention was not a new policy, but one which had been
pursued by almost every Administration.
Mr. P. HOWARD said it was undeniable that by the
intervention of this country last year, a period had been
put to a very fierce and bloody civil war in Portugal,
and the Constitution of that country had been restored
to its legitimate and ordinary form, and ho trusted the
. question between Austria and the Pontifical States would
not be lost sight of or disregarded in any of those pacific
measures of advice and intervention which were mutually
adopted between the Government of France and the
Crown of England.
Mr. URQUHART denied the accuracy of an asser-
tion which had been made in the course of the present
discussion, to the effect that the Duke of Wellington
had recommended intervention on the part of this country
in the affairs of Spain.
Mr. B. OSBORNE contended that the intervention of
England in the affairs of Portugal had certainly not
given free institutions to that country, but had entailed
an expense upon England the items of which figured
conspicuously in the estimates. As to the Spanish affair,
he did not think the House was now in a position to
discuss it. He then referred in terms of eulogium to
the very able speech of the Honourable Member for
Buckinghamshire (Mr. Disraeli) of whom it might be
truly said—Piihil tetigit quod non ornavit.—(Cheers.) The
Noble Lord the Secretary for Foreign Affairs had, how-
ever, gone far to allay any feelings of alarm and
perturbation which might exist in the public mind by a
speech in which
,the elevated views of the philanthropist
had been conveyed in the dignified language of the
statesman. Parliament would separate with a much
better heart after listening to that speech, from the as-
surances which it held out that peace would be pro-
' served.—(Cheers.) He (Mr. Osborne) avowed that it
had been his intention to vote that the proposed grant of
2,0001. to Lord Minto be disallowed, but, after hearing
the speech of the Noble Lord, his views had been com-
pletely altered, and if the peace of Europe had been
maintained so cheaply, he should offer no opposition.
Lord PALMERSTON said he could hardly avoid offer-
ing a few words in reply to the Hon. and Learned Mem-
ber for the county of Dorset. In the first place he had to
remark that it had always been the policy of the Govern-
ment of this country in all former times of her history to
consider that the interests of Great Britain sere deeply
concerned in the transactions which took place in other
countries, and every Administration had felt it to be its duty
to look to those interests and to take such measures as
might be necessary to secure their protection either by
negotiations—or, if negotiations failed, by other me-
thods.—(Hear, hear.) In the early part of this debate,
the Hon. Members for Inverness and Buckinghamshire
had bestowed much argument on answering a speech
wade by him (Lord Palmerston) a considerable time
ago, and in replying also to a dispatch he had written to
Isturitz, arid which had been laid upon the table of
the House. He, however, should not occupy the time of
the House by pointing out the total failure of both Hon.
Members in answering either the speech or the dispatch,
but he should be content to leave both to be compared
with the speeches this day delivered by the two Hon.
Members. But he (Lord Palmerston) felt it due to Sir
Henry Bulwer to notice three charges which had been
brought forward by the Hon. Member for Inverness-.
shire (Mr. H. Baillie) as the grounds which he thought
justified the Spanish Government in demanding.
his recall—and, if not recalled, in sending him
away from Madrid. The first charge was that
Sir H. Bulwer had permitted conspirators to as-
semble at his residence. This charge was contrary
to fact, was totally unfounded and untrue. Sir H.
Bulwer did no such thing—he had denied it in the most
distinct and positive terms—there was not even the
shadow of a proof adduced' to support it, and he (Lord
Palmerston) reiterated that the assertion was untrue,
and was totally and entirely without the shadow of a
foundation.--(Hear, hear.) The Hon. Member had
wholly misunderstood the argument which he (Lord
Palmerston) had used in the dispatch bearing upon this
question. In that dispatch he had stated that in a
country.like Spain, where there had been from thirty to
forty changes of government in the space of eight or ten
years, it was impossible fur any Foreign Minister to
avoid personal intercourse with individuals who were
opposedAii
with
Minister
swt
ehr
ot o
ciao
nlhn g
could
nhoatodvs ebbrtelntemnbei nt or
is
n dooroffi h
official
againstoteoemr .mt
buonAii
communication
adftioivori
nedi
individual
a member of the Spanish Government the day before,
because the next he was out of office and in opposition
to the administration of his successors.—(Hear,
hear.) It was impossible that the representative at,
Madrid of this or of any other nation could
smo of
ernneotgi
nou
In: a
tuthene he iast
isooc i al
day.
nswtebh pintercoursewerasso
nt
the
eoaap srpgno
argument
opposed
de tont
tob
contained
tibne t
Gh ebvhearbit
ni
n
his dispatch.—(Hear, hear.) The other charge made
against Sir H. Bulwer was that he had harboured per-
sons who had conspired against the Spanish Government,
and who were in a state of concealment from the pur-
suit of justice. Sir H. Bulwer,to that accusation had stated
that acting upon the universal practice of all the ,foreign
Ministers at the Court of Madrid, he had received for a
temporary refuge an individual who admitted that he had
been
concerned in the insurrection, or rather in the at-
tempt at an insurrection, and some others who bad been
suspected, and as it afterwards appeared unjustly sus-
pected, of having taken part in those proceedings; but
Sir H. Bulwer alleged that as the practice was ac-
knowledged and admitted in Madrid, it would have
been disgraceful in him to have refused a temporary
asylum to these individuals; and he (Lord Palmers-
ton) thought that his having done this presented no
just ground on which the Spanish Government had a
right to ask for his recall or to send him away.—
(Hear, hear.) The third and last charge made against
Sir H. Bulwer was, that he had given no refutation
to the accusation of having contributed money for the
purpose of getting up the Madrid insurrection. Why
that ridiculous and trumpery charge had been refuted
by General Pezuela, who bad the command of the
Spanish forces at the time; and he (Lord Palmerston)
trusted it was not necessary for him to assure the House
that there existed not the slightest ground for that ridi-
culous and absurd imputation.—(Hear, hear.) It had
been said that it was a great pity that her Majesty's
Government had not allowed Count Mirasol to retract
these charges. Count Mirasol preferred no charges, but
only came as a witness. But ample time had been
afforded to Me Isturitz to retract them, and no attempt
was made either to retract or press them. He therefore
wholly dismissed that matter. It had, however, been
asked, what was the present state of the relations of this
country with Spain? His reply was, that the present
state of the relations with Spain stood thus—the diplo-
matic intercourse between the two countries was sus-
pended. Further it had been inquired, what means a
British merchant resident in Spain, and who had
suffered wrong from the Government there had to ob-
tain a redressal of those wrongs? The reply was, that
in every part of Spain this oountry had consular officers,
whose duty it would be to make applications to the Go-
vernment on behalf of the British merchant, and if
those applications were not attended to there were other
measures which the Government would adopt to secure
attention to representations of the character alluded to.
—(Hear, hear.) Another Hon. Member wanted to know
how this country stood now with reference to its treaties
with Spain. Those treaties were not in any degree
affected by the suspension of diplomatic relations be-
tween the two countries ; and though it was not his
(Lord Palmerston's) province to answer hypothetical ques-
tions, ho would not hesitate to state that if any applica-
tion was made by Spain to this country to carry out the
treaties, it would then be for Majesty's Government to
consider whether the claim made was good, and to give
the Spanish Government an answer accordingly. Ile
would also go as far as to say that the quadruple treaty
hadbeencontracted for very particular circumstances, and
that it was not very likely that at present any question
would arise to which the provisions of that treaty could
be applied. Again, it had been asked what good had been
effected by the Government having mixed itself
b
affairs of Spain and Portugal, and what bene
fi
must be tfrom the quadruple treaty ? h y► it a tip
d a cicnr u the
ed
remem-
bered that the very signing that treaty
dreadful civil war in Portugal—led
onceto consenting to
Don Miguel, and to Don Carlos tphuets auti rreenuddertooaf
at
Reuse to this country beyond na
quit Spain. This was all aceor.tnpltishoefdtbweitpheonut
aanndy einxk-

with which the treaty was signed.—(Hear, hear.) As
to the transactions last year in Portugal, there a civil
-,...ar, which threatened to be of long duration, had been
put an end to; and though he did not pretend to say that
everything there had since gone on exactly as her Ma-
jc.,ty's Government had a right to expect, yet at all
events peace had been maintained in Portugal, v'hile all
Europe had been convulsed. He was not willing further
to detain the House on these matters; he had given
such answers as he felt himself at liberty to supply, and
he hoped the House would think he had done as much
as was consistent with his duty.—(Hear.)
Mr. BANKES thought that one of the Noble Lord's
replies furnished one ground against a portion of the
vote now before the Committee, for the Noble Lord had
shown that this country could go on as well with only
consuls to represent her abroad as she could with the
more costly representatives—ambassadors.
Lord G. BENTINCK said that though this was the
16th day of August he should offer no apology for pre-
senting a few observations on the foreign policy of this
country, especially as the vote under consideration was
to defray the expenses of the Foreign-office. He appre-
hended that no more fitting or constitutional occasion
for commenting upon the foreign policy of the nation
could be selected. Though the Hon. and Gallant Mem-
ber for Westminster (Sir D. L. Evans) had read Hon.
Members a lecture, and had denounced the discretion of
those who ventured observations on foreign policy, he
presumed they were not to be restricted to the internal
concerns of the country, and forbidden to go beyond the
affair of Kennington-common, but had a right to exer-
cise the special duty of keeping a watch on a department
which entailed upon the country so very large an ex-
penditure.---(Hear, hear.) Ho could wall remember how
in former days the Hon. and Gallant Member had been
accustomed to declare against " the despots of the- north
of Europe," when ho himself was about to set out on a
sort of buccaneering expedition to Spain; but now he
would debar others from uttering a word on the subject
of the foreign relations of this kingdom. Moore, some
twenty years ago, had written,
As bees on flowers alighting cease their hum.
So, when in places sitting, Whig, grew durrib.
. _ .

And he (Lord G. Bentinek) thought that the Hon. and
Gallant Member sought to realise the poet's stanza.—
' (Hear, hear, and a laugh.) But he (Lord G. Bentmck)
wanted to know whether the request made by Austria
for the mediation of this country had not been made so
far back as ten weeks ago, at a time wheh the Austrian
Government was in its hour of need and difficulty—
when the whole of Europe was in combustion—when
the Emperor had been driven from his own capital and
forced to Innspruck—when the veteran General
Hadetzky had been driven with his troops from Milan?
Was not this the precise time when the good offices and
mediation of Great Britain were sued for by the
Austrian Government, and refused by the Noble
Lord opposite (Lord Palmerston)? He wanted also
to know whether the mediation asked for on that
occasion had not been demanded, first by Baron Kohler,
and after wards by Count Dietrichstein, who suc-
ceeded him ; or whether the request had come
from the Germanic Diet at Frankfort ? These ques-
tions he should like to have answered before the vote for
the Foreign-office was agreed to. Was the request made
before or after the Noble Lord had announced that he
had determined to join with France in the mediation ?
because if the Noble Lord had refused his friendly
offices of mediation in the time of Austria's need and
difficulty, the Noble Lord had no right to claim his pri-
vilege to interfere now that Austria by her own intrinsic
efforts had vindicated her rights and her authority, and
had driven her rash and saucy invader from Lombardy
into his own country. The Emperor of Austria might
now truly say to this country, " I have myself vindicated
my own rights and authority—l will not now admit you
into tho arbitration to which you were invited, but in
which ten weeks ago you refused to take part." The
King of Sardinia having thought fit to invade the'
dominions of the Emperor of Austria, the latter had
a tight to chastise the invader, and all the laws of
nations and war forbade interference between them. The
Hon. Member for Middlesex (Mr. Osborne) had stated
that he did not intend to oppose the veto of 2,0001. to
defray the expenses of Lord Minto's mission, on the
principle that as the Noble Lord had preserved peace he
was cheap at any price.—(Laughter.) Now he (Lord
G. Bentinck) was totally at a loss to discover of what
use Lord Minto had been in preserving peace; on the
contrary, it appeared to him that the Noble Lord had
done much to provoke the rebellion among the subjects
of the King of Sicily.—(Hear, hear.) His Hon. Friend
the Member for the county of Bucks (Mr. Disraeli) had
desired to know what had been the instructions given by
her Majesty's Government to the Queen's navy acting
in the Mediterranean, and the Noble Lord had refused to
answer that question. His Hon. Friend had not in-
quired as to future instructions, but with reference to
past instructions, and what had been the acts done by the
authority of the British Government in the dispute be-
tween the King of the Two Sicilies and his rebellious
subjects. This was a question he had a right to
ittle and to have answered. It had been commonly
reported that while the countries were thrown
into confusion by the sudden and unexpected rising
of the people, and when the latter succeeded in over-
powering the King's forces in Sicily—and when the King
of Naples, recovering from his astonishment, had pre-
pared an army of 30,000 men, which would have over-
powered the insurgents, the British men-of-war, under
Sir William Parker, appeared in the Bay of Naples, and
a message was sent by the Bulldog steamer to inform the
King's forces that if they proceeded, as they had in-
tended, to bombard Palermo, and to reduce the insur-
gents to obedience, they would be opposed by the forces
of the Queen of England.—(llear, hear.) This was a
point upon which he trusted the House and country
would receive some clear, distinct, and unequivocal in-
formation from the Government. He (Lord G. Ben-
thick) could not refrain from expressing his surprise
that a member of a Whig Government, inheriting
the powers the Whigs originally obtained upon their
professions of non-intervention, reform, and retrench-
ment, should -take credit to himself for the events
which had taken place in Portugal. Why there the
constitution . had been superseded—all those who
had fought the battle of freedom and the constitu-
tion in the course of the last year had been excluded
altogether from power—which they would have main-
tained but for the interference of the Whig Govern-
ment of this country in favour of the Queen of Portugal.
—(Hear, hear.) With respect to the relations of this
country with France, his lion. Friend (Mr. Disraeli)
so far from condemning an alliance with France, had ap-
pealed to the times of Elizabeth, of Cromwell, and of
Walpole, as those in which this country had sought and
cherished an alliance with France. He had not repu-
diated the French alliance, but had maintained that we
ought not to pander to the restlessness of any revolu-
tionary republic, by sacrificing our friends and violating
treaties. solely to prevent France from making an un-
just aggression. Ho (Lord G. Bentinek) admired ;.as
much as any one the efforts of France to procure for
herself liberty; but it was no insult to tell her that she
was impotent for the purposes of aggression, though
omnipotent to repel enemies from her own terri-
tory.—(Hear, hear.) It had been truly stated that
her exchequer was in no condition for making foreign
war, and could not afford to send 100,000 men to
Italy, thereby uniting Russia, Prussia, and Austria
against her. Ile hoped the day would never come when
this Government might justly be characterised, as it
had been by Sotorunyor, as haughty to the humble, and
humble to the haughty. He hoped we would in no way
discourage the established Governments with which we
were friendly, from any fear that France in her restless-
'
ne,s would disturb the peace of Europe. The way to
be friendly with France was to tell her that she would
be powerless in a war of aggression, but all-powerful
against any assault on her rights, in thedefence of which
England would be found ready to unite with her.
The CHAIRMAN was about to put the vote, when
Mr. URQUHART hoped the Noble Lord opposite
(Lord Palmerston) would answer the question which had
been put, at an earlier period of the debate, as to the
circumstances which had led to the proposed mediation
in the north of Italy being undertaken.
Viscount PALMERSTON said that when the first
overture was made on the part of the British Govern-
ment, it was merely an offer to mediate, and he hoped
the House would not overlook the distinction between
the office of an umpire or arbitrator, in which character
this mediation had been spokenlof by some Hon. Mem-
bers, and that of a simple mediator employing his good
offices.—(Hear, hear.) Hon. Gentlemen had talked of
the arbitration of England, and of England and France
acting as umpires; but that was not their character.
The first request to this Government to employ its good
offices with a view to restore peace in Northern Italy
had been made by Baron Hummilauer, who had
been sent over by the Austrian Government specially
for that purpose. That offer was not declined.
There was a difference between the two Govern-
ments as to the terms on which the British Govern-
ment thought they could enter into the mediation with
a fair prospect of success. An offer was made to mediate
upon certain bases which the British Government thought
at that time likely to be attended with success, and
nothing further ensued in consequence. The last com-
munication by which the Austrian Government ex-
pressed their desire to have the good offices of England,
not the arbitration but the friendly offices of England,
with a view to the restoration of peace in Northern
Italy, had been made by Baron Wessellberg, the
Austrian Minister for Foreign Affairs; it was dated 9th
of August, and had been presented to him (Lord
Palmerston) a few days ago, by the Austrian Charg6
d'Affaires in this country.
Sir J. WALSH wished for some information as to the
instructions which had been given to Sir W. Parker
with respect to the course to be taken by the squadron
in the Mediterranean. Had the Government thought
proper to declare war against any European state, it
would have been incumbent on them to come down to
the House with a message, stating the fact, and asking
for the co-operation of the House incarrying on the
war. If instructions had been given to
Admiral Parker
to interfere in a hostile manner against the King
r
of Naples, in the event of that S9vore taking any
steps to suppress the revolt in Sicily, such a
course would distinctly amount to an act of war against
the Neapolitan State—(Hear, hear)—and Ministers
would not be justified in taking such a step, and at the
same time declining all information on the subject when
asked. At this moment there was no conceivable differ-
ence between the position of Sicily and Ireland, except
that Naples was a weak state, and England a strong one.
If it went out to the world that the King of Naples had
been precluded, by threats from this country, from ad opt li
-
ing a course which ho had a perfect right to take, a great
stain would rest on this country..

—Lord G. BENTINCK asked-whether he was to under-
stand that the Foreign Minister of the Emperor of Aus-
tria had been authorised by the Emperor, our ally, to
treat with Englati'd in this matter, or had he been treat-
ing on some other authority? Also, whether the reason
wby the mediation sought by Austria from England had
nut been agreed to, was that England made it a sine qua
non that Austria should resign a large portion of those
territories which, by the treaty of Paris, she was entitled
to claim?