The Sun.
London, England, 1848-08-26 00:00:00

POOR REMOVAL BILL.

This Bill passed through Committee.
POOR-LAW UNION CHARGES BILL.
....

On the motion of the Marquis of LANSDO*NE,
this Bill was read a third time and passed.
After a short conversation, the other Bills on the table
were forwarded a stage, and their Lordships adjourned.

HOUSE OF COMMONS, August 25.
DIPLOMATIC RELATIONS WITH ROME BILL.
(Continued from our Afternoon Edition of yesterday.)
After a short discussion, in which Mr. Blackstone,
Mr. Goring, Mr. Newdegate, Mr. Sheil, Mr. Keogh,
Mr. P. Howard, and other Members took part,
Lord J. RUSSELL trusted that the Hon. Member (Mr.
Anstey) would withdraw his amendment, and take
the sense of the House on the amendment proposed by
the Noble Lord, the Member for Arundel (Lord
Arundel and Surrey). If the amendment of the Hon.
and Learned Gentleman were adopted, no person except
an ecclesiastic could be sent to this country as the am-
bassador from Rome.

Mr. C. ANSTEY felt bound to divide the House
upon his amendment.
A further lengthened discussion then took place, in
which Mr. Heald, Mr. Irquhart, and several other
Hon. Members took part.
Mr. C. ANSTEY withdrew his amendment, and then
proposed to exempt from the operation of the clause
envoys sent on special missions, so that it might be com-
petent to the Pope to send ecclesiastics on special mis-
sions.

Lord JOHN RUSSELL thought it would be better
to adopt the clause as sent from the House of Lords
than to adopt the proposition of the Honourable and
Learned Member.
Mr. ANSTEY said he would not press the amendment
to a division.
Strangers were then ordered to withdraw, and the
Committee divided upon the question that clause 2 stand
part of the Bill, when there appeared—
For the clause 79
Against it 22
Majority in favour of the clause
Tho second clause was then agreed to.
On the third clause being proposed,
Mr. C. PEARSON moved to insert in the second
line of the third clause, after the words " that nothing
herein contained," the words following—" shall autho-
rise any intercourse or communion with the See and
Church of Rowe upon ecclesiastical and spiritual matters
now forbidden by law."
Strangers were then ordered to withdraw, and the
Rollie divided, when there appeared—
For the amendment
Against it 65
Majority against the amendment —36
The amendment was consequently lost.
On our re-admission to the gallery we found
Mr. ANSTEY on his legs, proposing to leave out
certain words in the clause relative to the maintenance
of the supremacy of the Crown in all matters eccle-
siastical and civil. He would merely wove this amend-
ment, not intending to divide upon it.
After a short discussion the amendment was nega-
tived without a division, and the House divided upon the
question that the clause he rejected altogether, when
there appeared—
For the clause 77

Against it
Majority in favour of the clause
The clause was then agreed to, as was also the pre-
amble, and the report was ordered to be received to-
morrow.

POST-HORSES LICENSES (IRELAND) BILL.
The report on this Bill was agreed to, and the Bill
ordered to be read a third time to-morrow.
POSTAGE ON NEWSPAPERS (CHANNEL
ISLANDS) BILL.
The report on this Bill was received and agreed to.
TRANSFER OF LANDED PROPERTY
(IRELAND) BILL.
This Bill was read a third time and passed.
LOCAL ACTS BILL.

This Bill was read a third time and passed.
FEVER (IRELAND) BILL.
This Bill was read a third time and passed.
TAXING-MASTERS, COURT OF CHANCERY
(IRELAND) BILL.
This Bill was ordered to be committed to-morrow.
SLAVE TRADE (EQUATOR) BILL.
This Bill went through Committee, and was ordered
to be read a third time on Monday, at twelve o'clock.
SLAVE TRADE (MUSCAT) BILL.
The Committee on this Bill was postponed to Mon-
day, at twelve o'clock.
DUBLIN POLICE BILL.

The third reading of this Bill was postponed until
after the other orders of the day were disposed of.
WEST INDIA COLONIES.
The Committee on this Bill was postponed until after
the other orders of the day wero disposed of.
TAXING-MASTERS, COURT OF CHANCERY
(IRELAND) SALARIES, &c., BILL.
The Committee on this Bill was postponed until after
the other orders of the day were disposed of.
ROYAL MILITARY ASYLUM BILL.
The second reading of this Bill was postponed until
after the other orders of the day were disposed of.
The House then adjourned shortly after Four to Six
o'clock.

The House resumed at Six o'clock.
PETITIONS.

Captain PECHELL presented a petition from an
engineer, stating that he could devise a remedy for the
present distress of the country, and praying the House
not to separate until they had examined him upon the
subject. . _

Mr. WAKLEY presented a petition agreed to at a
Chartist meeting, complaining of the treatment of the
Chartists who had been committed to prison. The peti-
tioners reminded the House that had the same justice
been dealt out to political offenders a few years back,
many of her Majesty's Ministers would have undergone
the same treatment.

Mr. HUME presented a petition from certain India
proprietors, in favour of the claims of the heir of the
late Raja of Sattara.

- NEW WRIT FOR LEICESTER.
Mr. HUME, in moving that Mr. Speaker do issue his
warrant to the Clerk of the Crown to make out a new
writ for the electing of two burgesses to sit in this pre-
sent Parliament for the borough of Leicester, in the
room of Sir Joshua Walmsley and Richard Gardner,
Esqrs., whose election has been determined to be void,
complained of the Corrupt Practices at Elections Bill
having been thrown out in the other House after so
much time had been spent upon the subject in the House
of Commons. The grounds upon which it had been re-
jected—that it would create a new tribunal for trying
these cases—was altogether fallacious. With respect to
Leicester, it was not worse than the other boroughs, and
as there was now no chance of inquiry, he thought it
right that the writ should be no longer suspended.
some
Mr. PACKE was sorry that there was not to bother he
special inquiry as to this particular borough, f
lieved it to be as bad, if not worse, than anyo ooies
of
anyr
rough. lie had intended to move ?
during
parties at
e e
bbe
-- o
correspondence which took place,
of
c Leicester and the
K ibworth, in the countyfrcthe months of
June and July last, between
nntmKei ut
of a foot messenger for carrying Postmaster-General, relative. to
-11 ' u, in consequence of
worth and Market Harboroug Fleettehres b eatpwpeoei
the explanation which Lord ; the Noble ave to his llon.
Friend and Colleague a few evenings ago, he would not
concurred w amithtime the Noblemust Lord that
that be completel n y
press that motio_ ;at the se he observe,
the Government were fully right and ought to dispense
their patronage amongst their friends rather than
amongst those who. differed from them ; but, if the di-
visions in this session were looked to, it would be found
that he (Mr. Packe) and his Friends around him had
been oftener supporters of the Government than the late
Hon. Member for Leicester.—(A laugh.) The non.
Member then read a letter from an individual who
stated that hundreds of the electors of Leicester were
ready to vote for him who paid them best, and concluded
by reiterating his regret that no inquiry was
l to take
ace.

Mr. FREWEN said, that Leicester was notoriously
corrupt, and had been su for a long period of time. In
fact, the electors were so accustomed to be paid for their
votes in hard cash that they could not get out of the
habit.—(A laugh.) As the Bill had been withdrawn
he really thought it was incumbent on the Government
to cause some inquiry to be made into this case.
The motion was then agreed to.
Mr. CHRISTY gave notice that early next session
he would move for an address to her Majesty, that no
grant of Vancouver's Island, or any privilege should be
made to the Hudson's Buy Company until a report had
been made to the House of the conduct of that company.
THE CHARTIST PRISONERS.

Mr. WAKLEY, after presenting a petition from s
man whose name we did not hear, complaining of the
treatment to which the Chartist prisoners lately con-
victed as misdemeanants at the Old Bailey were sutjected
to at the House of Correction, said he had presented upon
a former occasion a petition of the same kind. ,he pe-
titioners stated their belief that the Secretary for the
Home Department had issued special orders for the
coercive treatment of the prisoners in the House. of Cor-
rection, and they thought it quite useless to petition the
home-office on the subject, and consequently now ap-
pealed to that House. lie ( 51r.Wakley)believed that the
satement was altogether unfounded, and in his opinion no-
thing could be more unreasonable or uhjust, than to enter-
tain such a belief with regard to the conduct of the Right
Hon. Gentleman.—(Hear, hear.) Whatever his poli-
tics might be, yet with reference to these offenders he
(Mr. Wakley) believed that the Right Hon. Gentleman
was utterly incapable of doing that which he was said
to have done; and, seeing the Hon. Member for Maid-
stone in his place, who was one of the visiting magis-
trates of the prison, he begged leave to inquire whether
there was any truth in the allegations of the petition
that special instructions had been issued from the Home-
office for the treatment of these prisoners with undue
or unreasonable severity; whether instructions had been
issued from the Home-office for treating them as felons;
whether, in fact, the statements in the petition were ge-
nerally correct; and also to state what was the actual
condition of the prisoners, and whether at the present
moment they were making any complaints to the visit-
ing justices as to the treatment they received?
Sir G. GREY said, before he answered the question of
the Hon. Gentleman, he might be allowed to advert to
that part of the petition which had reference to himself.
Ho should, however, state that although the petition was
written in the plural number, it was signed by one indi-
vidual only, as the chairman of a meeting, without any
reference to a meeting in that petition.
Mr. WAKLEY said it was agreed to at a public
meeting.

Sir G. GREY—With respect, however, to himself, as
having sent special instructions for the treatment of these
prisoners, he begged to give his most unqualified con•
tradiction to that statement.—(Hear.) He had no power
to give any such special instructions, and the magistrates
wculd not be performing their duty if they observed
them. The prisoners were classed by the magistrates,
subject to the approval of the Secretary of State, under
Act of Parliament, and he had no authority to alter
those regulations. As to another statement in the peti-
tion, that it was useless to address the Home-office, he
could state that that was not the fact, for two of the
prisoners had addressed him, and he had referred it to
the justices, with an intimation that every statement
that was made by the prisoners should have every rea-
sonable consideration.

Mr. G. DODD could fully corroborate the statement
of the Right Hon. Baronet the Secretary of State for the
Home Department, that he had not interfered in any way
with the regulations of the House of Correction. The
memorials sent to the Home-office by two of the Chartist
prisoners were referred to the visiting magistrates by the
Right Hon. Baronet, who had stated to him that he hoped
no unnecessary restrictions would be imposed. The sen-
tences on the prisoners implied that they were to be sub•
jected to certain rules framed for all houses of correction
when Lord Normanby was in office, and had not since
been departed from. The questions put by the Hon.
Member tor Finsbury showed that considerable misre-
presentation had gone abroad with respect to the five
Chartist prisoners now undergoing sentence of imprison-
ment. As a visiting magistrate he had seen these per-
sons each week, and they all expressed themselves grate-
ful to the magistrates, and more particularly to the
Governor, Lieutenant Tracy, for the lenient manner in
which the regulations had been carried out. It was said
that the prisoners' hair had been cut close immediately
on their entering the prison. This was not the case.
Ernest Jones's hair was cut about a week after his en-
trance at his own request, and by the advice of the sur-
geon, owing to the weakness of his eyes. The others
were cropped about the same time, except Vernon's,
whose hair was not cut for a fortnight, and they not after
the Dover crop, but trimmed in the same manner as any
gentleman in the House would have had his done.—(A
laugh.) The prisoners all stated they had no complaint
to make with respect to their food. The dietary of the
House was a loaf of white bread weighing
nearly a pound and a half with a pint of cocoa
for breakfast, and a similar loaf and a pint of
gruel at supper. Four days in the week they bad
for dinner six ounces of meat and eight ounces of
potatoes, making on these days thirty-three ounces of
solid food; on the other three days, a pint and a half of
good soup in lieu of meat. Fussell and Sharpe both
slid, that if every working man lived nearly as well
there would not be discontent in the country. They
were permitted to have books sent them (subject to the
approval of the chaplain), and when he called that morn-
ing Vernon was:reading a scientific book, and Jones
working a mathematical problem.—(A laugh.) In
fact, every indulgence had been given. Vernon stated
to the governor that he was accustomed to take baths,
and the governor imtnediutely ordered he should have
them two or three times a week. The sentence upon
the prisoners made it requisite they should be put in
prison dross, and everything furnished to them was
new. The dress they wore was that of misdemeanants,
blue, different from that of felons, which was of grey
cloth with a number on the shoulder. He hoped he
had given such explanation respecting their treatment as
would satisfy the House; and if the Hon. Member for
Finsbury wished for more information he should be
happy to give it.—(Hear.)
THE CONVICT MITCHEL.
Mr. ROBINSON wished to put to the Government
some questions with respect to the treatment of the con-
vict Mitchel. He was induced to do so because it had
been communicated to him that Mitchel was not treated
as a convict, but, to use the expression of his informant,
who was a resident in Bermuda, rather as a state pri-
soner. He was also informed through other sources
that the convict was allowed the use of two rooms, with
a servant to wait upon him, that he was not subjected
to any kind of labour, that he wore no distinctive dress,
and that his position was better than that of many
officers in her Majesty's service in that island. Before,
however, he put the question he would say, he had no
wish to press harshly upon that unhappy individual,
far from it ; but his object was to ascertain, what
was so important to the public, whether the law of
this country was fairly, justly, and impartially adminis-
tered.—(Hear, hear.) The first question he would put
was to the Gallant Admiral opposite, with reference to
the treatment of Mitchel on board the Scourge. It was
stated that he messed with the officers on going to Ber-
muda, but he (Mr. Robinson) was unwilling to believe
it. He could not think it possible, but it was publicly
stated, and believed at Bermuda, and it was important
it should be contradicted, for the honour of the naval
service and the character of the Gallant Admiral. The
question he wished to put to the Right Hon. Gentleman
the Home Secretary was, whether any orders had been
given with respect to the treatment of Mitchel at Ber-
muda, and whether any communication had been made
to the Secretary of State by the authorities at Bermuda
as to the manner in which that individual had been
treated?

Sir G. GREY believed ho could answer both the ques-
tions of the Hon. Gentleman, as far as any information
was in the possession of the Government. With respect to
the first, he could say that no such information had
reached the Government, and he was certain from infor-
mation he did possess, and from the nature of the in-
structions addressed to the captain of the ship in which
Mitchel was removed, that it was not correct. The Hon.
Gentleman would remark that Mitchel was not sent to
Bermuda in an ordinary convict ship, but in a man-of-
war. Special instructions were given to the captain
from the Admiralty, directing him to take every precau-
tion for the security of the prisoner, at the same time,
while the vessel was at sea, as the prisoner was stated
by the surgeon of the gaol to be in delicate health, to
select a cabin for his confinement, placing a sentry at
the door, where his meals were to be taken. He must,
therefore, utterly disbelieve the statement to whie",
the Honourable Gentleman referred. A letter was
also written by the SecrientiabrrtymheaoftheS4tatthe
o j
utl-ye,
Governor of Bermuda, after calling his attention to the
case of the prisoner, and to the report of the surgeon
Spike Island as to thelhealth of
kind of labour for which he was wit'
• of the
ment had received no information corroborative
of
to the treatment
Hon. Gentleman's statement as
information they did t.risoner.,
Mit-
chel at Bermuda. The only
pos-
sess was contained in a dispatch dated
superin-
tendent stated it as his opinionthelungs,
and that he
that Mitchel was suffer-
ing from a chronic affection of
received on board the Tenedos
in which the Governor Said, that the medTichael Ganodvetrnhe
had caused him to b
hospital-ship.
from
thatme
thGe information
Te)n eTenedos
to was
ano received
thor
convicthe
George rhgeed
beenrey presumed
sooh
to that
preventthe
kind of hard labour, as convicts usually
beingh a had been
put removedt
o nsy hiSren Since
of
f the hulk; but
convict'si

were
D.
NORREYS said that in consequenes of the
statement
S made by the Noble Lord (Lord J. Russell)
that the Government proposed taking upon itself the re-
sponsibility of relieving the distress in Ireland, should
Occasion require it, he should best discharge his duty
by withdrawing his motion, which stood on the paper
for that night.

MESSAGE FROM THE LORDS.
The House was informed that their
Lordships had
agreed to the following Bills:—Stock in Trade Ex-
emption—Out Pensioners—parochial Debt and Audit—
Fisheries (Ireland), without amendment—and to amend-
ments made to Payment of Debts out of Real Estate,
without amendment—Edinburgh and Glasgow and Edin-
burgh and Bathgate Railway Companies Amendment—
Boroughs Incorporation—Farmers Estate Society (Ire-
land), with amendments.

BRIBERY AT ELECTIONS.
Mr. lIIJME gave notice, that as soon as Parliament
met next session he should move a resolution to the
effect that, whenever bribery was proved to have been
committed at an election for Members of Parliament,
the House would order that both the persons giving, and
the persons receiving the bribes, be prosecuted by her
Majesty's Attorney-General.