The Sun.
London, England, 1846-04-29 00:00:00

COMMONS ENCLOSURE BILL,

The Commons Enclosure Bill was read a second time.

Their Lordships then adjourned till Thursday.

HOUSE OF COMMONS, April 23.
The SPEAKER. took the Chair at Four o'clock.
BRIDPORT ELECTION.

The Clerk of the Crown appeared at the table to amend the
return for the borough of Bridport, by inserting the name of
Mr. John Romilly for that of Mr. Baillie Cochrane.
Mr. 110311 LLY then took the oaths and his seat.
Mr. GEORGE HOPE moved that the Committee, of
which he was chairman, should have leave to proceed with the
Bills in their Group No. 4, without requiring their com-
pliance with the resolutions proposed by the Hon. Member for
Finsbury.
Sir G. CLERK said he was not prepared at present to
accede to the motion, and proposed that the discussion should
be ajourned till twelve o'clock to••morrow.
Mr. HOPE objected to the discussion being adjourned to
another day, on account of the expenses it would entail on the
promoters of the different lines comprised in Group 4.
After a few words from Sir A. Leith Hay, Mr. Greene, and
Mr. Gisborne,
Mr. HOPE consented to withdraw his motion.
SECOND READINGS.
The following Bills were read a second time, and ordered to
be committed, viz. :
Charing-cross Bridge, and Frilford (Berks) Inclosure.
REPORTS.

The following reports were brought up, the amendments and
alterations agreed to, and the Bills ordered to be engrossed,
viz.:—

Ashburton, Newton, and South Devon Railway.
Glasgow, Garnkirk, and Coatbridge Railway Extension.
Edinburgh. Leith, and Granton Railway Amendment..
Glasgow, Paisley, and Greenock Railway ( Harbour Branch).
Colehester, Stour Valley, and Halstead Railway.
Great Grimsby and Sheffield Junction Railway Extenson
(No. ).
Great Grimsby and Sheffield Junction Railway Extension
(No. 3).
Harwich and Eastern Counties Junction Railway and Pier.
Edinburgh and Northern Railway (Pettycur and Perth Har-
bour Branches an ,t Deviations).
North British Railway (Hawick Branches).
Eastern Union Railway ( Ardleigh to Colchester).
THIRD READINGS.
The following Bills were read a third time and passed, viz.
Taunton Gas.
Eastern Union and Hadleigh Junction Railway.
Maldon, Witham, and Braintree Railway.
GOLLON INCLOSURE BILL.
Sir JOHN W ALSII moved the second reading of this Bill.
Gollon was a piece of land which would be greatly benefited by
being inclosed. The cottagers and other occupants of the
place had been opposed to the inclosure, but were now satis-
fied that if the lands were inclosed their condition would be im-
proved.
___

Lord WORSLEY opposed the second reading, on the ground
that the cottagers had exercised the right of common for up-
wards of 60 years, and their rights ought not to be done away
with. He had given notice of his intention of opposing the
Bill, so that the attention of the Government might be drawn
to it, the Bill being in opposition to the resolutions and
principles of the general Act passed last session of Parliament.
If the present Bill was carried, the provisions of that Act would
be done away with as far as the inclosure was concerned.
He assured them that he only opposed the Bill on public
grounds.

After a few words from Mr. ESTCOURT and Mr. M.
SUTTON,

Colonel WOOD hoped that some amendments would be in-
troduced into the Bill in reference to the principality of Wales,
for if not the whole of the principality would be thrown into
confusion.
Mr. M. PHILIPS was of opinion that a vast amount of
good would follow from this Bill, and it would also, no doubts
be desirable to remedy the defect with regard to Wales.
Mr. AGLIONBY was of opinion that this Bill, though a
private one, had now attained the importance of a public one,
and therefore he would say a word or two upon it. It was de •
sirable to have a special clause inserted in the general Act.
He did not oppose the Bill before the House. He wished to
have the expenditure in such cases materially reduced.
The Bill was then read a second time.
Major BERESFORD presented a petition against the
Cornish Coast Railway.

Another HON. hIEMBER presented a petition against the
Yeovil and Dorchester Railway.
Mr. W. PATTEN moved—" That it be an instruction to
the several Committees on Railway Groups, that in all instances
in which railway companies propose to take powers of amalga-
mation with other companies, either by sale, purchase,
lease, or otherwise, the rates and charges of such com-
panies be revised, and a new maximum imposed ; and that
they specially report any circumstance which may have in-
duced them to allow such maximum to exceed the minimum
of rates and tolls actually charged and received by the respec-
tive companies at any previous period ;—that they also append
to their report a schedule, containing, under the various heads
of traffic, the minimum of rates and tolls previously received,
and the maximum which it is proposed to allow the companies
to take under their Bill.
STANDING ORDERS' COMMITTEE.

Mr. ESTCOURT brought up the report from .hisCoyn-
rnittee, In which it was stated that on the St. A lban s Railway
the Bristol, Manchester, Birmingham, and the
Birming-
ham and Gloucester Extension
several Rills.
brought down
Railway Bills,
Messengers from the Lords
the standing
orders had not been complied r ith.
LORD HARDINGE AND LORD GOUGH.
FROM HER MAJESTY.
thSir R. PE EL appeared bar of the House with a Mes-
sage-as follows :—" Her Ma-
jesty,The SPEAKER
into consideration the great and brilliant
taking
froinAhleErSsSlaAieGstrEye.d
tahte Message
services performed
herby Henry Viscount isFceourneets, HaanrddinGgeo,veLrnieour:
Lieu-
tenant-General of
General of India, in the course of the rec nt hostilities
which have taken place on the banks of the Sutlej and in
the Punjaub, is desirous to confer some signal mark of her
favour for those and other distinguished merits of the said
Henry Viscount Hardinge, upon him and the two next surviv-
ing heirs of his body ; and she recommends to her faithful
Commons the adoption of such measures as shall be necessary
to accomplish that object."
Sir R. PEEL then brought up the following Message, which
was read by
The SPEAKER—" Her Majesty, taking into consideration
the great and brilliant services of Hugh Lord Gough, Lieu-
tenant-General of her Majesty's Forces and Commander
of the East India Company's forces in India, in the course
of the recent hostilities which have taken place on the
banks of the Sutlej and in the Punjaub, being desirous to con-
fer some signal mark of her favour for these and other distin-
guished merits of the said Hugh Lord Gough, to him and the
two next surviving heirs male of his body, recommends to her
faithful Commons the adoption of such measures as shall be
necessary to accomplish that object."
On the motion of Sir R. PEEL, her Majesty's most gracious
Messages were ordered to be taken into consideratism on Mon-
day next.

MR.' SMITH OBRIEN.
Mr. ESTCOURT brought up a report from the Committee
on Group I I of Railway Bills.
The Clerk read the report, which stated that at one o'clock
this day the Members comprising the Committee on Group
11 of Railway Bills were present in the Committee-room, and
that Mr. Smith O'Brien did not attend within one hour, the
time appointed.
The SPEAKER called on Mr. Smith O'Brien.
Mr. SMITH O'BRIEN rose and said—Sir, I presume that
the object of this House, in calling upon me, is to give me an
opportunity of making an explanation to this House. I
feel obliged for this opportunity, but I have already stated
my views and intentions fully and finally in the correspondence
.which has passed between myself and the Committee of Se-
lection. I do not think it necessary to add anything to the
matters contained in those letters, nor am I desirous of with.

drawing anything from the substance contained in those letters.
The Hon. Member here withdrew.
Mr. ESTCOURT said that he wished to state the grounds
on which he should ask the t upp,irt of the House to a motion
which he should make, and to state to the House that, con-
sidering those circumstances, and the motion he was about
to make, this ells the most painful duty he ever had to perform.
He thought he would be justified in the eyes of the House in
making that statement, for so long as he held the situation which
he then held, which has been since the Committee of Selection
had been instituted by that House, this was the first and only
time he had ever been called on to perform a duty similar
to the present one. On the 12th of February last that House
framed certain resolutions, and amongst them was one to the
effect that the Committee of selection should form certa n
Committees of inquiry into the merits of railway Bills.
The Committee of Selection by a resolution of this House
were ordered to give ample notice to those Members whom
they might choose to select, which notice was not to be less
than fourteen days. The Committee accordingly thought
it would be expedient to frame such a resolution, that
they might be able to give the notice required, and
before the Easter recess it was given to the Hon. Gentleman,
who was one of those selected. He received notice that on the
27th of the present month his attendance would be expected
so early as the 3d of April ; on that day he wrote
a letter to me, as Chairman of the Committee, and
in it he enclosed a copy of another letter, whick
was addressed to me, when a similar summons was
received by the Hon. Member; and the reason given for so
doing was that he (Mr. Estcourt) might, by referring to it,
know his reasons for refusing to comply with the
summons, stating that he had not seen any reasons
since. That letter was written to change his opinions.
He received that letter on the 3d of April ; that was on a
Friday. The first sitting of Committees of Selection was not
until the Tuesday following, the 6th of April, and, of course,
he could take no measures on receipt of this letter
until he had an opportunity of submitting the same
to his colleagues the Members of the Committee of Selection.
On the 6th of April this Committee met, and then he (Mr.
Estcourt; laid I ,efore them the letter with the inclosures received
from the Hon. Member. The Committee of Selection found that
the Hon. Member objected to serve on Committees having no
relation to Ireland. And they also found that the Hon. Mem-
ber stated his reason for so objecting. He (Mr. Estcourt)
believed that he could not better put the House in
possession of the grounds on which the Committee had acted
than by reading part of the correspondence which had taken
place between himself and the Honourable Member.
But first he would draw the attentian of the House
to that particular part of the Honourable Member's
letter on which the Committee had acted. The Hon. Member
said that as long as he continued to serve in that House as:one
of the Irish Representatives he would not omit Ireland
was placed upon a footing of political equality with
England think of devoting his time to the business of
this country. Then he went on to say that he had no
wish to interfere with the affairs of England or Scotland
unless those affairs were in some way connected with his
own country. And he added, that he had abstained
while in that House from voting on questions of a merely local
nature from the same motives. The Committee of Selection
had instructed him again to write to the Hon. Member, stating
that no reason had been assigned which was in their opinion
sufficient to justify them in absolving the Hon. Member from
those duties which were imposed upon other Hon. Members.
He did write to the Hon. Member, informing him that the
Committee could not recognise such an excuse, and they would
not, therefore, be justified in exempting him from the perform-
ance of the duties which commenced on the 27th of April.
An addition was made to the letter, to the effect that the
Committee would be happy to make any arrangement to delay
the Hon. Member's attendance till a later period, if it would
be any accommodation to him to do so. That letter
he sent to the Honourable Member the next day.
and on the following day he received an acknow-
ledgement from the Honourable Member, in which the
Hon. Member stated that his objection to serving on these
Committees was founded on the relation which at
present existed between his own country and Great
Britain, and was in no way connected with his
personal convenience. The Hon. Member, therefore, stated
that his former communicatioa announced his final determina-
tion. He ( Mr. Estcourt) had not an opportunity of lay-
ing that letter before the Committee of Selection
till after the recess, and then the Committee felt a
sufficient excuse had not been given to justify the
non-attendance of the Honourable Member, and they
placed his name on the Committee appointed to consider
the merits of the Bills comprised in Group No. 11. In ac-
cordance with the resolutions of the House, Hon. Members were
required to make a declaration that they were not in any way
interested in the Bills referred to them ; but the lion. Member
for Limerick neglected to make this declaration, and on Friday'
last he (Mr. Estcourt) reported this fact to the House, in accord-
ance with a resolution agreed to by the Committee of Selection.
Nothing further had transpired after that. He (Mr. Estcourt),
had regretted that the Hon. Gentleman, since that last letteste
had made no communication to the Committee of Seloctim,,
and he had not attended the Committee yesterday. He then
found that it was his duty to make that motion, that the lion.
Gentleman should attend the House to-day. That motion
was founded on the sixteenth resolution of the 12th February
last. His next step was to make this determination known to
the Hon. Gentleman yesterday. He was, however, disap-
pointed of his attendance, and he was consequently now com-
pelled to report to the House the resolution to which the Hon.
Gentleman had come, in order that•the House might express
their opinion respecting it. The notice of the previous deter-
mination of the House had been duly sent; he was therefore
compelled to bring the matter before them on the present occa-
sion, stating, firstly, the fact of the Hon. Gentleman's net at-
tending the Committee yesterday ; next, his not attending the
Committee to-day, after the order of the House had been made
known to him ; and lastly, his not attending on the House to-
day. Hon. Gentlemen were aware that he (Mr. Estcourt) was
not in the habit of frequently intruding:upon them —( Cheers)
but he must take this opportunity of assuring them that he and
the other members of the Committee of Selection were deeply
sensible of the readiness with which their services were rendered,
not only on the ordinary Committees of Private Bills, when,
their assistance was not compelled, but also on the more are
duous occasions, when their attendance was considered irel.is-
pensable. He could assure them that those services were
duly appreciated both by the country and the House. It
should be recollected that these Committees were only tern-
rosary, to indure throughout the session of Parliament, and
there was therefore the less excuse for any Hon. Member
throwing the labour which he ought to bear upon the shoul-
ders of others. This resolution of the 12th of February
would compel the Committee of Selection to the unpleasant
duty of calling upon other persons to do his duty. He could
not sit down without taking that opportunity of repelling the
charge that the Members of that House had not done their
duty.—(Loud cheers.) He could bear his testimony that the
Irish Members had cheerfully, kindly and ably discharged the
duties intrusted to them, and he would especially refer to the
Hon. Member for Cork—(Hear, hear, and cheers)—who had
discharged his duties in reference to the Committees with
great readiness and extraordinary ability ; and presented its,
his case an example worthy of imitation.—( Hear, hear.) lie
must now make the motion, which it became his duty to
make, and he was sorry that it should have fallen to his lot to
do so. He now begged to move, " That William Smith
O'Brien, Esq., having disobeyed the order of of the House, in
refusing to attend as one of the Committee upon the merits Of
the line of railways comprised in Group 11, is guilty of a con-
tempt of the House."
The ATTORNEY. GENERAL seconded the motion.
Mr. 'O'CONNE LL was sure the House would give him the
credit of believing him when he stated that he would not rise
to advocate the line of conduct adopted by Mr. Smith
O'Brien on the present occasion, if that gentleman intended
the slightest disrespect to the House. He was quite sure that
the Hon. Member had acted from the strongest feelings of
what he conceived to be his duty, and he would not lightly de-
part from it. The House ought to pause before they took any
steps on this matter; and there were two grounds on which
they should give it the fullest consideration. The first was,
whether the Act of Union gave the British House of Commons
any authority such as that claimed over Irish Members. There
was no common law jurisdiction applicable to the case since
1793. The other point which he would impress upon the
House was with reference to the Committee of Selection. Of
course, he was not disposed—he was never less disposed than at.
the present moment—to say anything derogatory to that Com-
mittee. Before the 12th of February last, ne stringent measure
of that House had been adopted to compel the attendance of
Members of that House upon Committees. Up to that time
the attendance was voluntary, and, in many instances, it was
still voluntary. Now the question was, whether the violation
of a power delegated to a Committee was punishable as con-
tempt. The House had not the jurisdiction of the common lay/
to compel the attendance of Members. The only power was
statutory, and :hat statute was the 6th of Henry VIII., by
which it was enacted that a Member of the House should be
required to attend. If there had been a common law juris-
diction, that statute would have been totally unnecessary.
The penalty mentioned in the statute of Henry wonld certainly
not operate now, as it was the loss of the absent Member's
wages.—( Laughter.) If there had been a violation of any
rule, it was one adopted by a Committee which had been
appointed by the House, and could not be considered a con-
tempt towards the House. He hoped, therefore, that the House
would pause before they decided upon the motion which had been
submitted to them.
The ATTORNEY-GENERAL said, he very deeply re-
gretted that this question had arisen, but it was absolutely ne-
cessary that the House should come to a decision, and he
thought, under the circumstances in which they were placed,
by the determination which had been expressed by the Hon.
Member for Limerick, that there was no other course for them
to take, but to adopt the resolution which had been proposed
with very great. regret by his lion. Friend the Member for Oxe
ford. That question now assumed a much more serious
roen. t
oa and Learnednsider w
whether
character then when it originally arose, because it was nor
connected with the important considerations which had been
tbheer
they shortly
for
wereac docirtrk.e. si snet drerrhtfo:
interfere
with
:Houseethntoht
eboynnltyoh
net
to consider the further important question
fused his obedience to the orders of the n Memberow who
submittedh ad re'
t 0
House, but they
the Hon. and Learned Member for Cork.
'scers
House, who were beyond
the House by
dependent authority
the House over the other !Members. Whether there were riot a •
sent a communication to them
portion of the Members of that
it conetol who had an In'
order which
szibijcelei thneobt distinctbe r . from,rh' e
Hon.the
Member authority
I,
a. sl
belonged. Let
LweitthththeeHouse refusinghis obedience to any
compelled his attendance on Committees on all
local interests of the country to
consider for one moment
in what position it was with respect to the general question
then before it. In the month of February, 1846, it was con'
sidered necessary, in consequence of the pressure of business
arising out of the number of applications for railway Bills'
that this Howe should come to a resolution by which Com-
mittees might be formed of all those Members who had bee°
chosen by the C •
Committee of Selection, which was itself estab-
lished by a resolution of the House in 1839. The House
should not forget that in the resolution it had passed, every
Member of that House was supposed virtually to have giver)
his consent to their adoption, and the Hon. Member for
Limerick was as much a party to that resolution a' any oche'
Member from England or Scotland. The Hon. Member
that time tone no objection, as he might have done, but sub-
witted to their resolution, which was passed for the convenience
of the House, and which bound him as well as every Member
of that House. The Hon. Member had been chosen by t„, "-
Committee of Selection to attend on a particular greeli
of railway Bills, and he referred the Committee
in a letter which he sent to them, to a former letter a last
session, in which—he having been chosen to serve on a
,
private Bill—ha refused to attend, for reasons which he tn't.
•
gave, and which reasons were fully incorporated in the letter
addressed to the Committee this session. There were parts
of that letter which it became imperative on the House to con"
cider, because they were the foundation of the reasons on which
the objection of the lion. Member depended. The tr,ch
Member stated that he would express these opinions, nlßl
had arisen from a long formed conviction, that a British Par-
liament
lge of was not compitent, through want of knowledge
people, or cant of inclination, to legislate wisely for Irelann•
ter,
( Cheers from the Opposition.) So that the Hon. DI e th°
a Member of the Imperial Legislature, anxious to advance
interests of every part of the empire, declares that we
are in-
competent to perform our duty, and declares that Irish
lation ought to
.be confined to Irish Members alone, and _9s.
fuses to join with us, grounding his reasons on the. as-
sertion sertion that none but the representatives of the 1120
Lesion should legislate for Ireland. Now, if it
Limerick
competent for the Honourable Member for Isireex
for its
to decline attending on any Committee, which has not
11 cn object some local interest of Ireland, it would be cqua

petent for every Member to refuse to serve on a Commttee.
which was not immediately connected with his own locaility
'Well then the Hon. Gentleman puts his case entirely on this
ground. He does not say it is inconvenient for him to attend
trat he i.n .tpeortunity of attending at sem,.
time, but he distinctly gives the Committee to understarn
that he will not serve on any Committee unless connected with
Irish affairs. What then was the House to do under these cir-
cumstances ? Suppose that the Hon. Member had defied the
House, and said he would serve on no Committee
whatsoever, it is perfectly clear what the decision of
the House would be. But the answer of the lion.
Gentleman came to the same thing. It was considered
for the advantage of the public that he should be selected
to perform a particular duty, and it would be admitted that the
Committee of Selection had performed its duty carefully and
forbearingly towards the different Members. The lousy
having by its resolution entrusted to the Committee of Selec-
tion the power of choosing Members for the different servic.-s,
the question would be, whether the House was or was not to sup-
port the act of its Committee Now what did the Hon. and
Learned Member for York say in answer to the charge against
the Hon. Member for Limerick, of neglecting his duty in this
respect—of having disobeyed the order of the House, and there-
fore of being guilty of contempt. The Hon. and Learned
Member for Cork said that there was no intentional disrespect
on the part of the Hon. and Learned Member for Limerick.
He said that he had a strong impression of the validity of hi,
objection, and that he was, therefore, justified in actirg as he
had done, and the Hon. and Learned Member for Cork called
on the House to pause before it came to any resolution ex-
pressive of its determination to vindicate its authority' againsi
the Hon. Member for Limerick. Now, in the first place.
could the House believe that the Hon. Member for Limerick
was not perfectly aware that he was a Member of the Honse of
Commons, and that that House represented the whole empire;
was he not perfectly aware of the resolution on the 12th of
February, 1846; was he not perfectly aware that he was not.
to all intents and nurposes, a party to that resolution ; and
was the Hon. Member for Limerick ignorant that i . t was his
duty, as a Member of that House, to obey
.its orders ?
But the Hon. and Learned Member for Cork saul that they
must pause—that they must be careful of taking any steps
on this occasion ; and the Hon. and Learned Member sug-
gested that they might not hove power to interfere in the
manner proposed to be proceeded in as against the Hon. and
Learned Member for Limerick for a breach of the orders of the
House. He was astonished that the Hon. and Learned Mem-
ber for Cork should advance these arguments; for, in the first
place, that was a power invested in the House by the Act of
Union ; and, in the next place, there was a new power which
was exercised by the Committee of Selection—powers of a
stringent character, which, until this year, had never been
given them. Was the Hen. and Learned Member for Cork
not aware that, by the third article of the Act of Union, it
was enacted that the said United Kingdom was represented in
one and the same Parliament, to be styled the Par-
liament of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland?
By the Act of Union a certain number of Irish Members, who
formed part of the House of Commons in Ireland, became
merged with the existing House of Commons. Now he
thought the Hon. and Learned Member for Cork would not
dispute this proposition, that immediately after these Member,
were incorported with the English House of Commons, they
became subject to all the liabilities which a 11Tember of the
House was exposed to previous to the Act of Union. He was
really at a loss to understand what the Hon. and Learned
Member meant by saying that they had no statutable power
given to them to proceed to extremities azainst refractory
Members. Now he had always understood that public bodies
and functionaries like the House of Commons, to whom im-
portant trusts were commttted, might enforce the obedience of
their Members when it was necessary for the due performance
of their functions. He did not mean to say, however, that
this power was expressly conferred on them by any Act of
the Legislature, or by any other authority than that of the
House itself; but a body like the House of Commons would
be perfectly powerless and perfectly helpless without
it had the right of enforcing obedience from its
Members. It was clear, therefore, that they wanted
no Act of the Legislature to confer this poser
upon themselves. The House had to discharge high
and important duties to the country, and, in the performance
of those duties, it was necessary to delegate to its Members
certain minor duties to be performed on their part, and without
this power it was impossible the business of the House could
be conducted. If this power did not exist, and Members
were allowed to refuse obedience to the orders of the House,
there would be a stop put to all the proceedings of the inferior
House of Parliament. The Hon. and Learned Member for
Cork had also stated, that the Committee of Selection had
powers given to it which were more stringent than the
powers previously given to a Committee of the House ; but it
mug!: be remembered, that the House in its wisdom thought
proper to give these powers to the Committee of Selection.
He felt it impossible to get over the necessity which was evi
dent, in order to perform these duties, without delegating those
powers to the Committee of Selection. The Hon. Member for
Limerick had refused obedience to that authority which he had
himself been a party to recognise. He had done this delibe-
rately ; there was no inadvertence. He in his place in that
House had refrained from endeavouring to excuse himself. He
positively refused to furnish any certificate to the Committee of
Selection of his inability, but had exhibited a persevering re-
sistance to the authority of the House. Under the circum-
stances, he (the Solicitor-General) thought there was no other
course to pursue than adopt the resolution of the Hon. Mem-
iber for Oxford. He was the last to be the advocate of severe
measures against any individual, especially an Hon. Member of
that House ; but he could not see there was any other course
to pursue, for it was impossible for the House to support its
authority if it were to be resisted, as it now was, by the Hon.
Member for Limerick. He repeated, then, that he saw no
other course in this instance, than to take measures, which, he
regretted to say, might prove eventually severe in their conse-
quences to that Hon. Gentleman, and to approve of the reso-
lution which the House was now called upon to adopt. He
certainly should support the resolution.

Mr. E. B. ROaHE could not help feeling that the House
should not have entered upon this subject at this particular
moment. He felt this regret, because he saw that it appeared
to him that if these measures were carried out, he and the
friends who acted with him would be compelled to approve of
the whole of the conduct of the Hon. Member for Limerick, and
very possibly, at last, he and his friends would be compelled to
take measures which would have the effect of very seriously
impeding the business of that House. He regretted it far
another reason ; for, if it were carried out, there would arise a
strong feeling is Ireland, that it savoured—it might be perhaps
too strong a word to say—of persecution—( Oh, oh)—that this
House were visiting the Hon. Gentleman with enmity—at any
„rate, with hostility—for the course of conduct which he had
;thought it his duty to pursue in Ireland.—(Oh, oh.) He re-
gretted the House should adopt such a course, and he felt it
to be his duty to warn it of the result which would attend it.
House had certainly the power of doing a great deal of
m.sch 4ef in connexion with this matter—( Oh, oh, and laughter)
—but tie the House had the power to punish any Member
for non-a 4tendance at Railway Committees, he advised
it to pave before it exercised such a power.
Every one who had sat upon a railway committee must have
felt the conviction, after having attended the business of that
Committee, and gone into the various matters of detail, that it
would be utterly impossible for any Hon. Member, after hav-
ing his attention occupied the whole day in affairs brought be•
fore the Committee, to come down to that House and give his
deliberate attention to measures of public advantage to the
country that claimed his attention. If no other good arose out
of this question than to turn the attention of Hon. Members to
the mode in which Hon. Members conducted the private busi-
ness of the House, it would he a great advantage. He would
ask, what would the result be if the resolution against his Hon.
Friend the Member for Limerick was carried into effect? The

great majority of the people of Ireland were with that Hon.
Member, and if the resolution were carried against him, the
Inostile feelings of the Irish people would be raised against this
House, as being unfit to make laws for Ireland. How do they
propose to mend the matter? Why by withdrawing from this
House by force the Honourble Member for Limerick.
Did they think the Irish people would have greater
confidence in the wisdom of that House when
they
found that one of their representatives was forcibly re-
strained from attending to their interests in the House,
and
compelled to eat a bad mutton-chops in the purlieus of that
House? They would be doing a vast injury to the b
interests of Ireland. They intended to order his Hon. Friend
to attend at the bar of the House ; the resolution they were
now deliberating upon would then be read, and finally he
would
be placed in the custody of the Sergeant-at-Arms. He found,
however, from the motion paper that his Hon. Friend had a
series e-)f resolutions to propose which would open up the whole
state of Ireland. That was a subject upon which he thought
the Hon. Gentleman ought to have an opportunity of expres-
sing his opinion. His Hon. and Learned Friend( Mr. O'Connell )
had a motion on the paper that the representation of the county
of Cork should be increased by two additional members. Would
it not be unfair that the people of Limerick should be deprived
of expressing their opinion on this matter, by being deprived
of the assistance of their representative ? Another subject of
great importance was, that the Hon. Member for Limerick
would be prevented giving his vote en Friday next, to prevent
the passing of the Coercion Bill. But above all, and more than
all, if the House pursued the proposed course they would exas-
perate the minds of the people of Ireland. He would hope the
House would not persist in the eourse. Let them seek to gain
the hearts of the shish people not by an union, but by kindness
and generous feeling. A question of that kind was of far
more importance than questions of the rules of that House.
Mr. WARBURTON wished to express his strong disap-
proval, in the most stringent terms, of the conduct of the Hen.
Alember for Limerick, in the contempt he had shown for the
rules of that House. It was proposed that the Hon. Gentle-
man should be committed to the custody of the Serjeant-at•
Arms, and eventually he might find himself committed to the
Tower. He disapproved of the course it was proposed to be
taken. He did not dispute the authority of the House, but he
did not think it was a matter of expediency to carry that power
into effect. If for every foolish reason given by Hon. Members
of the House not to serve upon Committees, the House were to
order them into custody, he did not know how many foolish
Members would seek such unenviable notoriety. The real
question stoost—what did they propose to gain by following up
the rules of the house ? and secondly, what would they lose if the
rules of the House were not followed up ? What did they gain
by forcibly compe ging a Member to sit as a member of Com-
mittee ? Why he would enter the Committee-room, he would
take his seat, but he would pay no attention to the business be-
fore the Committee, because he was there against his will. If a
Member should say he did not wish to be on any Committee,
was that Member a likely person to attend to the business of
the Committee? H e did not see that any good was likely to
result
from forcing any Member to attend on a Committee. The
g pee
coivuersea
sheproposed was, that if any Member should choose to
iat reason for i2ot attending on a Committee, that
they, according to their wish, should not be compelled to at-
tend, but that the Specialt Committee should be directed to re-
port to the House he
o inon-attendance of such Members, with
their special reasons
fore not attending. He did not know
what would be the r
of such a is.port of the non-
attendance of are Ist: Member ; but he felt satisfied
that if the Select committeethoowtere to report the non-attendance
of an English Member without
some special reason, he would
not be again electied to repres
aoet his iis constituents in Parlia-
ment. He should move as
aindment, that W. Smith
O'Brien, Esq., and any other
memberof this House, who in
shall
the course of the present sessiontorefubsee telesmerpvteedupooon
might claim Committees appointed,
special grounds ; and that it be anniensatbruction to the Select
aonfeesuch Mem-
Committee to refsort to the House th
ber, and the special grounds for such non-attendance
Mr. Mr. BROII-IERTON having seconded the amendment,
which was read from the chair,
Mr. J. O'CONNELL said he differedl from the Hun- Mem-
ber entirely Its to the epithets he app led to the Hon. Member
for Limerick. He had spoken of his reasons
of Irelandas being foolish;
smell)
be (Mr. O'Co ell) thought that the peopleapprove of his conduct; they would consider that he'
.had
adwboeuelnd
acting with a sriew to meet the wishes of his constituents. lie
differed also in another particular from an Hon. Member. He
(Mr. J. O'Connell) had been a member of a Committee for the
last fortnight, arirl there was every probability of his continuing
so for three months longer. He considered that he was aroost
unwilling me min r of the Committee, but he thought that he
could at least take the credit, without assuming too much, of
saying that he bud not neglected the business of the Committee,
although he ss ma in attendance very much against his inclina-
tion. He did Tim think that the Right Hon. Gentleman. the
Attorney-Gisnerrol, had fairly met the argment of the Ron.
Gentleman the Wernher for Cork. The especial statute for
compelling the attendance of English Members had not been
extended to the Irish Members, and that objection had not
been satisfaet Drily disposed of. The Hon. Gentleman then
alluded to the Union, and said that Ireland was not a consent-
•
'ug Party to it, and concluded by urging the adoption of the