The Sun.
London, England, 1846-04-24 00:00:00

however unequal to the occasion, admited that something was
required ; and he could not conceive that Government, however
anxious-to free industry, or facilitate the application of capital,
had acted as well as a neighbouring country, who had not the
character either in the amount of its capital, or the character
sf its labour, that this country had. He might name France,
:or instance, where complaints had been made of the great
Lela: which had taken place in the granting of railway projects,
though he believed no complaint was now made. And while
no complaint was made of the tardiness of France, there-
was great complaint respecting the swiftness of interference in
England. In France, he admitted, they were benefited
in this respect by the Government, but in England they were
not so benefited.—(Hear, hear.) The Government were now
seeking to interfere with capital and labour. In fact, to carry
out the principle of protection, while on other questions they
professed themselves against all such inteference with the ap-
plication of capital or the employment of labour.—(Hear,
sear.) Every Member in that House, unless he is a holder of
railway shares, feels the necessity of protection here. Her
Majesty's Government on this question, however, seemed to
have no settled opinion. In two years, they had twice changed
he qualification on Railway Bills, showing that they enter-
tained no definite opinion as to the course which should be
taken. He quite agreed with the Hon. Member for Finsbury
in the expression of opinion which he had made, and which was
generally entertained in the country, that the deposit of 51,
per cent., or double that amount, in compliance with the
standing orders, was equally inefficacious. How little had the
Government done to meet this state of things, having com-
menced in wavering and uncertainty, and having twice changed
the qualification. The qualification made eighteen months
ago was changed to what was considered one more stringent,
and now they sought to revert back to the former. This proved
that the Government was totally inefficient, and was c hargable
with the loss and ruin which had occurred.---( Hear, hear. )
His Noble Friend (Lord G. Bentinck) had referred to the
circum.tances of the Right Hon. Baronet raising the first sod
of the Trent Valley Railway. That took place only in last
October, at the very time that the railway mania was at its
height.—( Loud cries of " Hear, hear.") What Minister
did so? The Chief Minister of the Crown himself—a
great Finance Minister was the party who did so at the time
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Right Hon. Baronet, in investing himself with the railway
paraphernalia, and giving effect to the occasion on which he
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his possession which, as he had not intended to alludetotre
subject that night, he had not brought with him. The
Honourable Member for Finsbury may have seen the
same results of the Trent Valley performance. He
(Mr. Disraeli) had in his possession railway pro-
spectuses containing extracts from the speech of the
Prime Alinisier delivered on that occasion.—( Hear, hear. )
At the height of the mania they had thus the First Minister of
the Crown giving an impetus—an unnatural impetus to the rail-
way speculations.—( Hear, hear.) He remembered words
spoken by the Right Hon. Baronet—he would not quote Han-
sard, for that was not admissible now, but his memory would
serve him—in which he said, that the people of Manchester or
Liverpool would not submit to be carried round ten or twelve
miles about by existing lines, but that they would have direct
ones. This was in March, 1845, and in October, 1845, they
found the Right Hon. Baronet raising the first sod of the Trent
Valley Railway.—( Hear, hear.) He could not acquit the
Right Hon. Baronet of fostering and encouraging the railway
mania; neitherthe House nor the country could do so. —(Hear,
near.) They ( the protectionists) were never allowed to refer
to the prosperity of the country as arising from good harvests;
the Ministers took credit to themselves for the fact. Who so
ready as the First Lord of the Treasury or the Secretary for the
Home Department to take credit for the diminution of distress
and national adversity? But while he (Mr. Disraeli) was ready
to give the Government credit for all they had done, they did
at the same time suppose that the harvests had something to
do with that prosperity ; and that when money was plentiful
and the country flourishing it was not necessary to refer it all
to a Ministry. The present appears to be the catastrophe of a
great bubble.—( Great cheers.) Although they had greater
experience than any country in Europe ; although their moral
tone would stand a favourable comparison with any other na-
tion, it was their degrading fate periodically to manifest an
inordinate desire for wealth, flying with that object into any
mad speculation, however much it might produce national in-
jury, entail private ruin, and lead to public disgrace.—(Loud
cries of " Hear, hear.") It was the duty of the Government
to guard tne tone of the public mind, and to watch and
direct the public fortunes.—(Hear, hear.) But the system
which had hitherto gained such favour, that of leaving
everything to take care of itself, to follow its own
course, whatever might be the effect on the condition of the
people or the interests of the country—this system was the
fashionable system of political economy, which, however
lauded, in his opinion led only to ruin and degradation.—(Hear,
hear.) However, after what had been said on other questions
in reference to this principle, he asked them how they could,
in agreement with it, come forward and ask for that interfer-
ence with the investment and application of capital and labour
which the adoption of the resolutions implied? Why depart
from that course which had been so much lauded in reference
to other questions? So long as the people were employed—so
long as they were employed by these railways—by the Trent
Valley railway and others of its class—so long as the people
were so employed, the Ministry expected that they would sym-
pathise with the philanthropic Government.—( Cheers.) But
now the thing was found out I The senators were discovered
to be stags— (Laughter and cheers)—and the people were
looking up the losses they had sacrificed at the shrine of
philosophy. They were beginning to find out that
it was all humbug.—( Laughter.) They were now
discovering that after all they must fall back on the old system.
—( Cheers ) Honourable Members had often charged the
party with which he was connected with unnecessarily delay-
int, the business of the country.—(Cheers.) Honourable
Members then seemed to forget the saying of one of the
greatest men of modern times—the saying of Frederick the
Great, " That he who gained time, gained everything." They
had opposed the measures of the Government, because they did
not consider that they were advantageous to the country.
They had opposed the Right Hon. Baronet's measures—he
who cut the first sad of the Trent Valley Railway.—(Cheers
and laughter.) They opposed a minister whi) knew that he
had a great opportunity of doing his country good, and who
neglected it. But now they had to discuss this question in
sober sadness—(Hear)—and when they calculated what the
resources of the country were, when they contemplated its in-
creasing population, and the inadequate means of employment
provided for them, the Government ought to be forced to look
to its essential resources; to legislate on comprehensive and
practical principles, instead of visionary theories, which had in
too many instances assimilated to the practice of the com-
panies under their consideration.
Mr. WARD explained.
Mr. BRIGHT wished to trouble the House with one or two
observations, after the remarks which hao been made by the
Hon. Member for Shrewsbury. He had, in the whole of his
speech, endeavoured to show that the Government were incon-
sistent in bringing in these resolutions, and in their general
policy with regard to this subject. But he (Mr. Bright) con-
sidered that the arguments of the Hon. Member were altoge-
ther founded upon error. If he understood the resolutions
aright, they were not proposed for the purpose of interferkg
with vested capital, but to enable parties to withdraw from
proceedings which would he unprofitable to themselves and
disastrous to the country.—( Hear, hear.) The Noble Lord
and the Hon. Member who had last spoken had, he thought,
adopted an ingenious course—more particularly ingenious as
they were each recognised as the head of a great and patriotic
party.—(Cheers.) They used to be loud in praises of the
Ministry, and it was only lately that they had withdrawn their
support. It was only since Ministers had brought in their
measure for the abolition of the corn-laws that they had found
out that they were unworthy of confidence.—(Cries of
" Hear, hear.") Now, he believed that the real cause of
the speculation in railways was that they had had
many years of depression, which had been followed by years of
prosperity, and they were adopting the old adage of making
hay while the sun shone. They wished to make in one year
the profits that ought to have extended over three. He had
every confidence that this measure would produce a steadiness
in the money market to which they had for some time been un •
accustomed. He believed that these fluctuations were bad, and
the Government had therefore reason to endeavour to put an
end to them. If he (Mr. Bright) recollected aright, when he
first came to that House, the Noble Lord, the Member for
Lynn, only sat in his seat for the purpose of observing the
progress of a Bill introduced to defend certain parties who
were engaged in a mad speculation, dangerous in the extreme,
and contrary to the letter of the law.— (Cheers, and a laugh.)
He considered, therefore, that the Noble Lord was not the
man to set himself up as an authority on any matter connected
with speculation;or gambling.
The SPEAKER then read the resolutions proposed by Sir
R. Peel, which were agreed to.
Mr. T. DUNCOMBE then moved the resolutions which
will be found in his speech.
On the 10th resolution being read,
Sir G. CLERK said he did not see how the amount of the
liabilities of companies could be ascertained.
Mr. DUNCOMBE said he would be sorry to admit any
-unjust details in any statement of the affairs of a company; all
he required was that there should be laid before the Committee
an estimate, stating the amount of money in hand, and the
liabilities of the company, which every company ought to be
aware of. Suppose the case of a shareholder; before he will enter
into an engagement, he will naturally say to the committee
of management, what money have you in hand? Why, we
have so much, will be the answer. Well, then, his neat ques-
tion would be, what are the liabilities of the company ?
Surely the committee should be able to give some estimate of
their amount, and be able to say what persons were those who
had claims upon them.
Mr. HODGSON said he should vote against the resolution,
as he was quite positive that the company would be utterly un-
able to give anything like an accurate estimate, and an inac-
curate might lead to more evils than none at all.
Mr. HUDSON said that, from his experience, he could
state that it would be impossible for any company to give an
estimate of their liabilities ; nor did he think such an estimate
would tend to any useful purpose. How could it be possible
to tell the amount of a solicitor's or engineer's bill ? The only
thing which could be given would be the amount of money
paid and actually received.—( Hear. )
I Mr. DUNCOMBE said he would adopt the suggestion of
the Hon. Member, and alter the resolution to a statement of
the money in hand, and a statement of the liabilities incurred.
Mr. W. R. COLLETT observed that expenses. were two-
fold those incurred, and those prospective ; and an adjourn-
ment of the case might increase the latter most materially.
Colonel SIBTHORP said he would enter his protest against
the Government doing that at the eleventh hour which they
should have done at the first.
After a few words from Sir G. CLERK,
Mr. W. R. COLLETT said that he considered the resolu-
tion was most inquisitorial ; and after the many sufferings
which provisional committee-men had already experienced, he
thought it somewhat unjust.—( Hear, hear.) He did not
know what the public could have to do with either the
names or the amount subscribed by the provisional
committee-men, and as many of them had come forwarded, in
the hope of benefiting not themselves, but the towns, cities,
villages or counties with which they were connected, it was too
bad to hold them up now to the world as parties unworthy of
the confidence of their fellow men. The Hon. Member for
Finsbury, he had no doubt whatever, was actuated by none
other but honest motives, but he put it to the Hon. Gentleman
whether, after the severe suffering, provisional committee-men
hail encountered, it was fair to publish their names in the man-
ner proposed by this resolution.—( Hear, hear. )
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER apprehended
that the Hon. Member for Finsbury did not require the names,
but only the amounts subscribed collectively by the provisional
committee.
Mr. DUNCOMBE said that was allhe wanted.
The resolution was then agreed to, as was also No. 9.
On No. 10 being proposed.
herds
it was Hot rig o
" and of the liabilities" on the ground that b
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Mr. WARBURTON was understood to object to the.
ask old established companies to disclose theirliailwte
struck
After a short discussion the objectionable words
out, and the resolution, as amended, agreed
On No. 10 being proposed, .
d establish d e talicompes,
apply to the Bills promote 3
would not
all, but merely certified that they
Mr. WARBURTON said this resoblution in its presen m
for they paid no deposits at
had sufficient funds in hand to enable them to carry out the
proposed undertaking.
Mr. HUDSON said the Hon. Gentleman was quite right.
Many companies were seeking for powers to construct works in
accordance with the provisions of their existing Act of Parlia•