The Sun.
London, England, 1846-02-18 00:00:00

TELE SU,N, .t,ONDON,, WEDNiESDA YEyENING, _FEBRUAR_Y 18, 1846,

just sat down, was scarcely intelligible, at least to him.—( Hear,
hear.) He (the Noble Lord) had written a letter to his con-
stituents, and from that letter he (Captain Layard) was led to
believe that the Noble Lord would have supported the measure.
The Noble Lord, the Member for Liverpool, had also made a
speech the other night in favour of the position of Hon. Gen-
tlemen opposite, and yet he had said that he would vote in
support of the present measure. He was sorry not to
sec the Hon. Member for Oxford (Sir R. H. Inglis) in
hit place, who claimed the speech of the Noble Lord as his
own, and he (Captain Layard) thought he had every right
to it.—(Cheers.) Now, he must say, that the conduct of the
Noble Lord reminded him of a circumstance which had oc-
curred some years ago, at Nottingham. There was a man
there who had a vote, and a certain Hon. and Gallant Member
if he were present could confirm the statement which ha was
about to make. That man, for the vote he had given at an
election there, was promoted to a choristership at Canterbury,
but when he came to sing he could not sing at all.—(Hear,
hear, and laughter.) So it might be said of certain Hon.
Members on the other side of the House :
A singing man, he could not sing,
No need to thank his patron's bounty;
Excuse me, sir, I cannot sing,
My voice is in another county.
—(Laughter.) He was delighted to find that the Right Hon.
Gentleman the Secretary for the Colonies, in spite of the
caustic speech which had been delivered by the Hon. Member
for Shrewsbury, was determined to vote in support of free..
trade.—( Hear, hear.) And what was the charge—th'e
grievous charge—that that Hon. Member had also brought
against the Right Hon. Baronet now at the head of her
Majesty's Government? Why it was this—that he sacrificed
party feelings for the good, for the glory, and for the happiness
of his country. —( Great cheering from the Opposition.) An
Hon. Gentleman on the other side of :he House had also said
that rotten potatoes formed a rotten argument.—( Hear,
hear, and laughter.) But what would that Honourable
Member say, in answer to the distressing statements
which had been laid before the HoMe that night
by the Hon. and Learned Member for Cork (Mr. O'Connell).
He had not intended to refer to this subject in consequence of
those statements. He would beg the House to conser those
statements most attentively, for they depicted suffering of the
most awful and grievous description, which was brought about
by the "rotten potatoes" alluded to by the Hon. Member in so
unmerciful and inconsiderate a manner. He held in his band a
pamphlet which went to show that agriculture was benefited
by protection,and that it was a just measure. Now, he thought
with the celebrated expression of Mr. Cobden, that the system
.of protection was one of mutual plunder between the farmers
and their landlords—( Hear' hear)—and he had not heard
one argument from Honourable Gentlemen opposite showing
that such was not the case.—( Opposition cheers.) He could
understand the reason why so little money was spent in agri-
culture—it was because of the uncertainty that at present
prevailed with regard to the corn-laws. Hon. Gentlemen on
the opposite side of the House had said that they preferred im-
mediate repeal to the present proposal of her Majesty's
• Government. Well, then, the (tight Hon. Bart. at the head
of the Government had last night expressed his perfect wil-
lingness to accede to their wishes.—(Cheers and laughter.)
Tney had now, therefore, an opportunity of obtaining their
desires.—( Hear, hear.) They would certainly have a num-
ber of supporters on their own side of the Home, and certainly
a very great number on his (Captain Layard's) own
side of the House.—( Great cheering and laughter.)
He ever had confidence in his political readers, and he had
every reason to continue his suppor tto their measures. They
had never betrayed hi:el.—( f-lear, hear.) He believed that
these leaders had ever acted rightly. He could safely say that
he had always the greatest reliance upon the Noble Lord
the Member for the City of London, and particularly
when he made that startling expression some time
ago, that " protection was the bane of agriculture."
He (Captain Layard) wished to ask Hon. Gentlemen opposite
how they could justly charge that Noble Lord with a sudden
change of his opinions upon the free- trade question, when he
had uttered such a sentiment as the above years ago?—
(Cheers.) For the reasons then that he (Captain Layard)
had stated, he should be happy to give the Right
Honourable Baronet at the head of the Govern-
ment his humble support. He believed that the present
measure was for the benefit of the country ; he believed that
that Right Hon. Gentleman had made the greatest sacrifice
that any man could make for the good of his country.—
( Cheers.) He must say that be both honoured and admired
him for the sacrifice which he had made —(Cheers)—and he
never in his life had given his vote with so much happiness and
so much contentment as he should upon this occasion.—
( Hear, hear.) Believing that it was for the good of the coun.

I . lasting benefit. He could even conceive of such a course being
taken by her Majesty's Government, and after the speech of the
Right Hon. Baronet on the previous night, the possibility of
adopting such a course could not be disputed. if the Right
Hon. Gentleman had announced before the meeting of Parlia-
ment his long-cherished idea of throwing open the ports, and
have told us he was no longer prepared to steer the ship the
same course as he had hitherto done, the feelings on this matter
in the country and in this House would be very different from
what they now were. He (Lord John Manners) had paid great
attention throughout these debates to hear a reason assigned by
the Government for the course they had chosen to take. The
Right Hon. Baronet had last night expressed his satisfac-
tion at the result of his measure of 1845, but he would ask what
confidence could this country have in a Government who
adopted a course which contradicted all their former acts ? It
would not do for the Right Hon. Baronet to plead that he was
placed in such a difficult position by divisions in the Cabinet
that he was compelled to adopt the course which he
had litigated. If the Right Honourable Gentleman was
in earnest—if he really thought that the danger and
diffienity was so pressing—even now he might open the
ports, and let in the corn till the danger had disappeared.
Why, what a lumbering bitch ! what a lumbering task ! the
Government takes upon itself. How long did they expect to
be occupied in carrying this great experiment, which affected
nearly every interest in the country, through Parliament?
With their commissions of inquiry into the burdens upon
land, with their commissions of inquiry into the probable
effects of this great commercial revolution upon the colonies;
with their commissions of inquiries into its effects ,upon the
finances of the country, and with that able, bitter, resolute,
and unswerving hostility which they had excited against their
proposal, what chance, he asked the Government, was there
of this.measure being immediately passed through Parliament?
Now one word upon the subject of guarantees. ' He had shoWn
how unfair the Right Hon. Baronet had acted in presuming
that a guarantee would have been requ'red from him in re•
specs of the opening of the ports, and he now told the Hon.
Baronet that he d;d not think any man in England would
ever again ask the Right Hon. Baronet for a guarantee upon
the corn-laws, or anything else.—( Hear, hear, and laughter.)
And he was sure that those gentlemen who thought protection
to native industry was deeply rooted in the affections of the
people, and closely allied with the interests of the country,
would in future rely upon the good judgment, the good sense,
the:deterrninatiOn, and the courage of the English people,
rather than upon the promises of the Right Hon. Baronet.
He for one could not but complain of a spirit of straightfor-
wardness which was exhibited in the arguments and the tone
of the Right Hon. Baronet. It was exceedingly amusing to
see how the Right Hon. Baronet disposed of any partiCular
course of action which his opponents might think proper to•
adopt. For instance, the Right Hon. Baronet said, if the BOIL
Member for Bristol had taken upon himself td propose a want
of confidence in the Ministry, er to propose a direct declaration
in favour of native industry, or, in short, if he had takers any
other course than that which he did, the Right Hon. Baronet
would have understood this mode of action, and been prepared
to meet it accordingly.—( Hear, and laughter.) Nothing, in his •
opinion, could be more unfair than this mode of di'posing of the
arguments of opponents ; and although he was not bold enough
to take upon himself the task of advising Hon. Members, he
would say this much for the Hon. Member for Bristol, that

had he adopted any other course than the one he did, the
Right Flon. Baronet would have disposed of him with very
much the same argument. And after the revolutionary senti-
ments of the Right Hon. Baronet,: he thought both the
Hon. NI ember for Bristol and the Hon. Member for Newcastle-
upon-Tyne might be excused for withholding their support
from the Right Hon. Baronet and his Government. Now the
Right Hon. Baronet alluded to the probable effects which the
passing of this measure would have upon foreign countries.
Russia, he said, would be shaken by it.
An HON. MEMBER—No; he said Prussia would be shaken.

Lord J. MANNERS resu ed—Rassia would be shaken,
the Right Hon. Baronet said, by the passing of this measure ;
but when it was remembered that such a measure was all that
Prussia wanted with this country, he did not think the pass-
ing of it was the surest way of inducing her to alter her
commercial policy. Passing from Prussia to France, the
Right Hon. Baronet made a statement still more unsatisfactory,
because he admitted that the aristocracy of France were op-
posed to free trade; but against this he placed the fact that the
intelligence public opinion of France waS directly in
favour of freedom of trade. Let him, however, ask the
Right Hon. Baronet who it was that led this intelligent public
opinion? He believed Arago, Thiers, Louis, and Berryer,
were men who led public opinion in France, but who were
far from entertaining views in favour of free trade, but on the
contrary, were favourable to protection to native industry. Be
now came to another branch of the Right Hon. Baronet's ar-
guments, and he hoped it would .not be inferred from what
might fall from him upon this part of the subject that he wished
to deal lightly with the calamity which had lately fallen upon
Ireland. He must, however, be permitted to say, that when
the Right Hon. Baronet argued that a failure in the potato
crop in 1845 was a justification for a total repeal of the corn-
laws in 1849, the Right Hon. Baronet left his reason un-
convinced though he might have excited his sympathies in his
behalf. The Right Hon. Baronet prefaced his introduction of
this measure by a melancholy statement and touching
appeal to the feelings of the House, and whilst by
this means he had almost safely lodged the corner-stone
of his new principles, he dashed it to atoms with the
argumentative reasoning with which he followed up his melan-
choly oration ; for after making a touching appeal to them to
,ive the people of Ireland cheap bread, he went on to state that
ne did not expect the repeal of the corn-laws would reduce the
mice of agricultural produce, and his Right Hon. Friend the
Secretary of War, in improving upon this text, said he did not
-HA the English farmer would be exposed to foreign competi-
tion. He maintained, then, that after the great proposal the
Government had made to the present Parliament, and the
~weeping and tremendous revolution whith they wished toeffect
• hroughout the whole commercial system of the country, he
felt himself peifectly justified in voting for the amendment of
his Hon. Friend the Member for Shropshire for an appeal to the
eonstituencies of England. He might be told that an appeal to the
constituency of Newars would be sufficient for his purpose,
hut his answer to this was that he did not wish to appeal to
he electors of Newark, but to the constituencies of the coun-
try. Now, having said thus much, be must be allowed to ex-
press an opinion that the proposal of the Government was not
the best that could have been made. It could not be called
Free trade, and he doulated even if it could be called a scheme
of free importation, for on theame hand they reserved protec.
don to a great number of manufactured articles, and on the
other they maintained, the prohibition against the growing of
tobacco, and that enormous burden the malt-tax—for what-
ever might be said in its favour, it must be still allowed that
the malt-tax was, to a great extent, a large burden upon
lam!. It did seem to him, with all deference to the Hon. Gentle-
men who entertained strong views on both sides of the question,
that if the corn, the produce corn of the British colonies, and
Indian corn, had been proposed to be admitted duty free, and
other foreign corn at a moderate fixed duty, it would have

try—believing that every country would follow the bright
example which the Right Hon. Baronet had set them—( Hear,
hear)—believing, as he did, that it would strengthen and bind
in a link of unity and peace, which we must all desire and hope
for, the nations of the earth, he would give the proposal his
most hearty support.—(Cheers.)
Mr. G. PALMER said, be did not hope by anythincr he
might utter to add any new argument in the discussion of this
question ; but he felt himself bound to express his opinions in
discharge of the duty which he owed to the individuals whom
he represented in that House. Those individuals were
most anxious to know the result of the delibera-
tions of the House on this question, believing, as

they did, that on the result of those deliberations
depended their future prosperity or distress.—(Hear, hear.)
It was scarcely necessary to inform that House of the state of
excitement in the country on this question. They had seen
that numerous meetings had been held in different parts of the
country—almost in every county—to denounce the free-trade
measurea of the Government, and they were almost all unani-
mous in their concemnation of the present measure.—( Cheers
from the protectionists.) For the purpose of showing the
quickness of the Right Hon. Baronet's change in favour of free-
trade, he would beg the indulgence of the House
whilst he quoted Hansard for a few moments.—(Hear. )
In the year 1844, the Right Hon. Baronet at the head of her
Majesty's Government, in opposing the motion of the Hon.
Member for Wolverhampton (Mr. Villiers), avowed himself an
advocate for
.protection, on the grourd of the peculiar burden
on land, and that that was a subject which he could not deal
with upon abstract principles, without regard to all the other
interests of the class. Upon these grounds he therefore gave
his unqualified opposition to the motion.. It was by thus acting,
that he (Sir R. Peel) led many persons to imagine that he did
nut contemplate a change in a law which was settled only two
years before. He (Mr. Palmer) hail attended many meetings
in the country, and the general feeling was one of alarm at the
consequences likely to ensue from the adoption of this measure.
The question which was asked throughout the country
was, what grounds are there for the change proposed by
her Majesty's Government ? He had listened to a large por-
tion of the debate, but he had not heard any substantial
reason brought forward ley the Government to account for
this change, excepting that melancholy statement of the
failure of the potato crop in Ireland. He could not hear the
statement made by the Right Hon. Baronet last evening
without feeling gr.'at alarm and anxiety. He did, not think,
however, that the measures proposed were calculated to
remedy this grievous evil. The necessity of opening the ports
had been urged, but he did not think even that measure
would have alleviated the distress, unless the persons who
were. suffering under the calamity had the means of obtaining
the corn thus introduced. But he would not have
objected to any Bill of Indemnity which it might
have been necessary to have passed in this House, on account
of the suspension by Order in Council of the existing corn-
laws.—( Hear, hear.) He was not sufficiently versed in Par-
liamentary matters to know, however, that it was a necessary
consequence that the corn-laws should be totally repealed in
consequence of a temporary suspension of the measure. He ,
remembered that the late Mr. Canning suspended that law,
and orders were given in Council for the admission of 5,000
quarters of wheat. A Bill of Indemnity was given to him,
but he (Mr. Canning) never thought of coming down
to the House and saying that he considered it
necessary to repeal the corn-law in consequence of that
temporary suspension. ( Hear, hear,) The principle of
protection seems now to be abandoned by the Government,
but they have given us no good reason for changing their
minds on the subject. He was however prepared still to
adhere to that principle. It was no new system; it had been
the policy of England for upwards of a century. He had read
in " The Lives of the Lord Chancellors" (a work written by
Lord Campbell) of Lord Chancellor Morton, who lived in the
reign of Henry VII., who considered that in a time of scarcity
corn should not be allowed to be sent out of the country. This
he believed was the earliest case on record. It is
under this system of protection the country has
arisen to its present proud position. Mr. Huskisson
said that the produce of the country should be protected—he
cared not how cheap corn was—and he said that in order to
ensure a continuance of the supply of cheap corn, we must
ensure to the corn producer an adequate anlount of pro'ec-
tion. He (Mr. Palmer) did not agree in the demand which
had been made upon the Goyeriiment for a compensation; he
did not look at the question in that light. The principle of
protection is in itself either right or wrong.—( Hear, hear. )
If it is right, let us maintain it ; if wrong, the continuance
of the principle is wrong, u,,ju,t, and unfair, and we have no
right to grant compensation for the removal of that which we
admit to be unjust. That would be giving a premium to injustice.
The Right Honourable Baronet states that he has afforded ad-
vila
Her
t.ao4, ehi
that he
lteyh eilalyta landed
adatniwnehtgeeurnievesavt
equivalent.—(
he
e. thea(daHbaeonal ohpneoarortf.u)nt
tToysheoafltaoowwnas
s
their
tiirn g the
opinion,f farmers
ae
nr sd onth
at e
w.s subject, eacl
also
that
his notnpi
no
In.
oemo f them s
h e consi-
deredsaid
before,t
he considered it was a measureon that he was not
coarseca e d
eo
fn
his t
scpoeneecuhr in,a f
oTr
n_th The r 101 int
;ht Hon.
sr. td Baronet,tit in the
alter-
ation he had then made had been prqductivea ofe no the
imit
n ratherthe
e pricewa s anfbeennettititt:
,t°maeltatP:'alnieds'othnerecoinaltrnanodeeitdieas.indruNeraitrhisee
thought there were many other reasons why the rise in the
price of cattle had occurred, besides its being caused by a re-
duction on import duties. He thought the Right Hon. Baro-
net could not take particular credit to himself for raising thOse
prices. Even admitting that those benefits had occurred in
consequ2nce cif the measure that he had introduced, he
(Mr. Palmer) thought it was a good argument for
not meddling pry more.—(Cheers..) He believed that the
constant meddling with those laws had occasioned more dis-
treis amongst the agricultural community than any ether pro.
ceeding whatsoever. It was not until about the present timehat the farmers, in consequence of the alterations made in
those laws in the 'year 1842, were recovering'from the losses
which the agitation of that measure caused. The labourers were
much better employed, general prosperity was experienced by
all parties in the country, just at the period when the Right
Hon. Baronet brought forward his proposition, which turned
the scale in a contrary direction.--(Loud 'cheers.) He
could, from his own personal experience, state that there
was a great stagnation in the markets of his own country. No
miller would buy any large quantity of wheat at present, but,
to use a common expression, was purchasing from band to
mouth. The price may be as high now (he did not mean to
say it was not), but there was no business doing in the market
since that measure was announced. He knew per-
fectly well that it made a difference of 75., or
Bs., or 10s. to the mechanic, there being no trade
carrying on. Therefore he said it was a most unfortunate time
to bring forward such a measure. He (Mr. Palmer) should
like to ask anybody who took a fair view of the farmers' condi-
tion
whether there was not greater improvement, more capital,
and more skill, now used by them, than there was twenty years
ago—whether the general cultivation of their land was not much
better than it was then—and, taking a full view j of
the question, he could not believe that protection was
a bane to agriculture. He (Mr. Palmer) considered that they
ought to make themselves as independent of foreign supply as
possible. These were arguments which were supported with
great ability at one time in that House by some who had since
thought fit to change their minds. He would venture to read
a short passage to the House from the speech. of
the Right Honourable Baronet the Secretary for
the House Department, on the subject of depending me
foreign nations for the supply of corn. The Right Hon. Ba-
ronet said, " It appeared to him.that the state, and power, and
majesty of great Britain would be bumbled by their depending
on foreign countries, and was like placing this country in a
state of siege. When the supply was withdrawn, and there
were many countries which would be glad to place us in
that position, what then should we do ?" That
was the opinion of the Right Hon. Baronet (Sir J.
Graham) in the year 1830, on the question of our rendering
this country dependent on foreign nations for our supplies.
The Right Hon. Baronet at the head of her Majesty's Go-
vernment says, a deficient harvest may involve them
in difficulties. If further calamities should arise then
they • may lose their independence, for restrictive
duties were no security against a famine. The House
would consider that those were goad authorities who
bad speken such language. A great deal had been said on the

laced the trade on a basis satisfactory to the commercial
interests of the country, and would have bound, by ties of
mutual interests, the vast colonial empire to tue British Con-
stitution, whilst at the same time i., would have afforded a safe
security against the unnecessary fears of the farmer. He did
not stand alone in this opinion, for he found a fixed duty of
ss. adiocated by the Messrs. Ferguson and Taylor, of Man-
chester, in a document, it must be remembered, which was not
the production of the Central Protection SJeiety, nor the pro-
duction of the supporter of any fixed duty, but it emanated from
parties deeply interested in the prosperity of Manchester
and Englsh manufactures. Al:hough he could not say that
he entertained some of the fears which some of his Hon.

Friends did with respect to free-trade, or participate in the
hopes which some Hon. Members anticipated would be realised
from it, he did most earnestly and heartily deprecate any
such harsh -or hasty interference with the great commercial
interests of the country, or with the system of protection
under which trade and manufactures bad made melt gigantic
and almost Miraculous strides' and" under which agriculture
has made such vast strides that if the people of their own
country were not, foreigners were perfectly astounded at it, as
that now proposed by her Majesty's Government. He depre-
cated, too, the dictatorial tone adopted by the Right Hon.
Baronet tewardi some of his supporters, which, in his opinion,
only served to aleinate t! e sympathies and the confidence of
those great classes to which, in times of danger and distress, the
Sovereigns of this country have ever looked, nor looked in vain,
for a ready obsdienee to the lawi, and unflinching bravery,
and uncompromising fidelity.—( Cheers. ). For these reasons
he, for one, neither feared nor hoped much from free
trade, but was, nevertheless, anxious to have this great question
settled to the satisfaction of all parties, gave his most hearty
and determined vote in favour of an appeal to the country ; and
his most resolute and determined opposition to the pro-
posal that this House do resolve itself into a Committee for
the purpose Of considering the corn-laws, with a view to their
repeal.—( Cheers. )
Capt. LAYA RD said, whatever might be the feelings which
bad been expressed by the [lon. Gentleman who sat below the
gangway, he thought, after the eloquent and truly argumenta-
tivethe
o
tc(,Government.
e,tei
r:speechn,uongtf,dueerhist wthtai
veh,oveni
accs.bh:utldihinkineteerol7Ryftrenjbholutnetttei.H,
objection
tui
td,toeh.Bdeta4ei rtrneohdgna
conducive
ogit
nntrhatedniiatnemdl
greatly
eat
Committeel
measure
rtaetdin.
ioveifa gntiihh,cnitees.,
th, • interests of agriculture ; and Nshil•st expressing
/Anion, he must be allowed to say, that he shouldt
be always sorry to see the commercial, or any other
interested, benefited by the loss of another.—( Hear, hear.)
Within the last six months a great alteration had taken place
in the feelings of the country with respect to this question.
The feeling of that House had also changed upon this great
question, and that change had been in favour of free trade.
The best men on both sides of the House had declared them-
selves in favour of the present measure.—(Cheers.) He
would ask Hon. Gentlemen on the opposite side of the House,
who were in favour of what was called “protection to native
industry," where were their champions of protection now ?
( Hear, hear, and laughter.) Those champtuns ,who had led
tiv'm in their battle fee protection dare not now stand up in
defence of their hollow and unjust cause, either out of doors or
in that Hotise. —( Hear, hear.) The present measure
was one which should and must be carriettwilla.out any longer
delay. He (Captain Layard) had heard the arguments of
Hon. Gentlemen on the other side of the House since the com-
mencement of this debate, and he must confess that they con-
tained in them no new feature; be had heard them all over, and
over again years ago. The Right Hon. Baronet at the head
if the Government had last night taken the wind out of all
their sails —( Laughter.) Hon. Gentlemen on the other, s'de
of the-House had told the House that the land would go out of
cultivation if the measure were passed.—(" Hear, hear,"-from
the protectionists.) He begged to refer those Hon. Members
to the meeting which was recently held at Goatacre.—
(Laugliter from the protectionists, and cheers from the
Opposition.) At that meeting the agricultural labourers and
farmers of that district said unanimously that they
did not believe that one acre would go out of cultivation in the
event of" the corn-laws being abolished.—(Cheers from the
Opposition.) Of course, not the least particle of land would
go out of cultivation ; and he really believed that there was not
a man in that House, nor in the country, who conscientiously
believed that the land would be left uncultivated.

An Hon. MEMBER on the Opposition benches—l cannot
believe it.—( Hear, hear. )

Captain tAY tiliD continued to observe that the Right
Hon. Gentleman the Secretary at War had theothernight made
a free-trade speech, and that he most heartily congratu'ated
that Right Hon. Gentleman on the speech which he had made.
He was sure that he was possessed of talents, and that he
would rise in the estimation, of the country. But the Right
Hon. Gentleman had said that the corn-law of 1815 was a
great mistake and a great error.—( ',Tear, hear.) He (Capt.
Layard) would go further, and say that it was no less than a
great and grievous crime.—(Cheers.) He believed that by
that measure not only the agricultural but the manufacturing
interests of this country were greatly injured.—( Hear, hear. )
He believed that it was a fearful crime, because the misery of
the people was greatly enhanced by that unjust law. The House
had been told by Hon. Gentlemen opposite 'that England
had risen to great prosperity under the operation of the corn-
laws; they talked of great and glorious England under the
corn law. He knew, and they all knew, that England was a
great and glorious country, but he denied that the corn-law
made her great and glorious.—(Cheers from the Opposition
Members.) Looking at the Right Hon. Baronet at the head
cf her Majesty's Government, he seemed in his (Captain
Layard's) eyes to be a' free-trader.—(Hear, hear.) But he
had been the leader of Hoe. Gentlemen opposite. His
opinions on the corn-laws had however become changed The
(I,ffieulties under which the country was labouring had made
him a free-traier. The difficulties under which England
_

hhoured consisted of the present corn-saws, and he maintained
that England Was great and glorious, not because of, but in
spite of the corn-laws.,.( Cheers.) The-Noble Lord vibe had

subject of labour, and he thought that. it was one of the a party, and this was not very surprising, considering the great
greatest proofs that the question now agitating the public mind changes which had taken place in the principles of public men.
I was a labourer's and a farmer's question; by the fact that al- f Indeed; they should of necessity be in that position. They
I
, most in every part of the country they would find very few of the were now disagreeing amongst themselves. 'I hey *ere with-
I landed interest present at those meetings, which were entirely out any settled kind of action ; and though they were midis-
-1 composed of tenant-farmers, who feel that their interests are alone ciplined and nnofficered, they were still undrsfria •ed. —( Cheers )
involved in that question. The landlord was opulent, and it What theybelieved to be the cause of the good Ind the just, was
s
would not make any material difference to him!; but the one from which they would not become dissenters ; and, with
tenant bound to a farm, from which he could not escape, was God's help, they would be loyal and true to the end. His Right
placed in a very different position. Of the expenses attendant Hon. Friend had, he conceived, taken undue steps in reference
on the cultivation of a farm, and the sums to be paid, the rent to the failure of the potato crop in Ireland. He (Mr. Shaw)
was by no means the principal feature.—( Protectionist cheers.) had already stated that he would approach that question with
A difference of 10s. in the price of wheat would make a dif- great caution, for he was willing to admit its importance.
ferenee of one-half of his rent. Now, he did not mean to He was ready to admit that the time of periodical distress
say that he was a very intelligent man, but he thought, was approaching in Ireland; but he would contend for it that
while they were getting only an average price for corn, the statements upon the subject of the failure of the potato
that a measure ought not to be introduced which would crop had been greatly exaggerated. He had visited various
make a difference of one-half his rent—( Hear, hear)— counties in Ireland, and he had received communications from
but he did mean to state that if there was a rise in corn, there persons in the provision trade, such as contractors for supply-
was alio an addition to the wages of the labourer.—(" Hear, ing the gaols and workhouses, and other public institutions,
hear," from the Opposition.) And so, when -the price of with this article of ford. He had also carefully watched the
corn fell, in the same proportion did a reduction take place state of the markets ; and the result of all these measures of
in the wages of the agriculturists.—(Loud cheering.) procuring information on this subject tended to show that
When corn was low, as it was in the years 1822 and there would undoubtedly be a deficiency of the potato
1835—corn then averaging at 395. the bushel—the price of crop in some parts of Ireland, but that in a great
labour fell, and it had ever been his experience that the pecu- majority of districts the crop would be an average
niary difficulties of the farmer produced the worst results upon crop, and that much of the deficiency complained
the agriculturist, who appeared never to derive any advantage of had been owing to a glutting of the market upon
from the cheapness of bread, though it might reasonably be sup- the first rumours of the supposed famine.—( Hear.) He did
posed otherwios. The Right Hon. Baronet, the Secretary of not mean to dwell at any further length upon this topic;
State for the Home Department, did not always entertain and he would leave it now by expressing the satisfac-
the same opinion with respect to wages as he did Lion he felt at having observed the encouragement given,
then ; he was not going to blame that change, to the employment of the labouring classes in Ireland
for he believed that it arose from sincere conviction—( Hear, this session, by the temporary expedient for meeting this tern-
hear)—but he was going to quote from a speech delivered in porary evil. He knew it would be a waste of time to dwell
1839 by the Right Hen. Baronet, for the purpose of strength- upon it now, but he thought he was warranted in saying
ening the case which he ( Mr. Palmer) was endeavouring to that it was a subject of wonder to many that his Right
place before the House. The Right Hon. Baronet asked, Honourable Friend could have recommended such mea-
whenlereVes'oddressing the parties who advocated a repeal of sures without a more mature consideration of the pro-
the corn-law,* What was their object—was it to raise the price bability of a worse state of things than they had any
of corn ? If it was, he would tell them that they would also real reason to apprehend. It was only the other day he
raise the price of wages. Was it their object not to raise the had heard the Bight Hon. Baronet, the Secretary of State for
price of corn ?—if they des red a low rate of corn, he would the Home Department. state, in answer to a question from
tell them at once that they also desired to produce a low rate the Hon. Member for Rochdale, in reference to that clause in
of wages."_( Hear, hear, and cheers.) These were the opi- the Poor-relief Act affording out-door relief, that he was de-
pions of the Right Hon. Baronet in 1839. He considered at cidedly adverse-to any alteration in the established system.—
that period that diminished protection would throw large ( Hear, -hear.) This certainly did not accord with the lately
quantities of land out of cultivation, and he (Mr. Palmer) avowed principle of the Right Hon. Baronet; and he did
was not to be blamed if, in 1846, he adhered to the lesson think that the impetus that had of late been given to employ-
which he had learned from the Right Hon. Baronet then. ment in this country by the railways, had been very unfairly
—( Hear, hear.) He had already trespassed much too long kept out of view by her Majesty's Government. There
on the attention of the House, much longer than was, no doubt, a great deal that was plausible in the Govern-
he had intended, ba cause he felt that the question had been so ment plans. But he begged to remind the Right Hon. Baronet
long, so ably, and so successfully argued---(Cheers) —that that Hon. Members on that side of the House were not quite
he could add nothing to it. For his own part, so unlearned as he seemed to think in the doctrines of Adam
having no such convictions forced upon his mind as were Smith.—( Hear, hear.) They all knew that those doctrines
forced upon the Hon. Baronet, and entertaining an opinion were very fine, and would be very fair and reasonable if they
both of the justice and the expediency of maintaining the same could persuade other countries to adopt them also. But they
amount of protection to agriculture and the other branches of should take into consideration the national debt, the corn-
native industry as had been maintained heretofore, he could Peered interests, and the very many other peculiar circum-
see no sufficient reason for the change now proposed to be stances of this country, its well-being, and its.-prosperity, in
carried into law, and the Right Hon. Baronet must, therefore, considerir g this measure.—(Cheers. )
excuse him if he declined to follow him in the path in which "A thousand years scarce serve to form a state,
he wished to lead him.—(Cheers.) They had been told by An hour may lay it in the dust."—( Cheers.)
the Secretary at War (Mr. Sidney Herbert) that this was a From whom had they so frequently and profitably learned
golden opportunity for settling the present question with these lessons of practical wisdom, as from those very men who
honour—( Hear, hear)—but he did not see how any question would now have untaught them all ? The speech of his
could be settled with honour when it was to be done at the ex- Right Hon. Friend, delivered the other night, was in fact a
pence of political honesty.—(Loud cheers.) He had repre- free-trade speech, unqualified by any of those exceptions which
sented his constituents for many years, and he did not he had been so strenuous a supporter of for the last
believe that he ever was asked to give a single pledge as to few years. It was not upon the ground of the petitio
his course of conduct in that House. But he considered that principii that he had put these measures for-
there was an implied understanding that he should endeavour ward, nor had they been suggested by an anxious
to maintain the law as it then existed, and he considered such anticipation of the state of things in Ireland, which had been
implication equally binding in honour as any pledge that he so much dwelt upon. It did appear to him (Mr. S.) that,
could personally give, and it should never be said that he for the last thirty years, the Right Hon. Gentleman appeared
deserted the interests of those who had sent him to that to think he had been wrong, and that it was only within the
House.— ( Hear, bear.) last four weeks he had been set right by the speeches of the
Sir CHARLES NAPIER had hoped that, after the elo- Anti Xorn-law League.—( Cheers. ) He (Mr. S.) regretted
quent and unanswerable speech of the Right Hon. Baronet that he had not the eloquence or the arguments of his Right
at the head of the Government, that Hon. Gentlemen oppo- Hon. Friend to enable him to dwell upon the subject as he
site would have seen the propriety of bringing the present could wish, for if he had he would endeavour to exhibit to the
debate to a conclusion.—(Cheers and laughter.) He could House in its proper position the fact that the words of the
not see what purpose they had in view by prolonging it.— Right Hon. Gentleman upon this measure, upon former occa-
( Laughter.) The great complaint which Hon. Gentlemen lions, were now in the actual process of being eaten at that table.
had to the Right Hon. Baronet was, that he proposed to —(Cheers.) The Right Hon. Baronet the Secretary for the
bring in a new corn. law, which he had done in consequence Home Department (Sir J. Graham) had tried to gulp all his
of the failure of the potato crop in Ireland. He (Sir C. at one swallow.—( Cheers.) But that was too much even for
Napier) did not see why the lion. Gentlemen should have the stomach of the Right Hon. Baronet--( Cheers and laughter)
expressed such indignation at the change of mind which such a —and it quite overcame the nerves and gravity of the House.
course exhibited on the part of the Right Hon. Baronet. —( Cheers.) No, it would not do for the Right Hon. Baronet
He was not the only person, however, against whom this (Sir J. Graham) now to talk of " abrogating his inheritance"
indignation should have been evinced.—( Cheers. ) The rather than wring his wealth from the poverty of the poor
Right Hon. Baronet the Secretary for the Home Department man. Was that, then, what the Right Hon. Baronet was
had shown a similar change of mind.--( Cheers and laughter.) doing for the last thirty years of his life? That assumption
The Right Hon. Secretary at War had followed in the wake was really the begging of the whole question.—(Hear, hear.)
of the two Noble Baronets.—(Roars of laughter.) The Did the Right Hon. Baronet think that even the poor rustic
Chancellor of the Exchequer had expressed a similar opinion, labourer was so simple as to be taken in by that statement—
and other Hon. Gentlemen on the same side of the House. recollecting who it was that, as it were only the other day,' so
He wondered that Hon. Gentlemen did not tax that (the poetically described—
Opposition) side of the House with having changed their minds " The breezy call of incense-breathing morn,"
alio. They had shown a change quite as great as that ex- as compared with the " sad sound of the factory bell," and
hibited by the Right Hen. Baronet.—(Laughter.) Did they drew the pathetic contrast between "the blooming garden
imagine they were to follow the example of country gentlemen and the foul garret,"—" the innocent walk of the country
who ploughed the same horses now as they did twenty or thirty Sabbath, and the debauchery, the sorrows, and the sins of
years ago.—(Roars of laughter.) Did not the Right Hon. the crowded manufactory"—(Cheers)—who spoke of "sinking
Gentleman explain that so early as the let of November last hearts and rebelling hands;" and asked where were the
he proposed to open the ports and the only support which such a moralists that they did not lift their voices against those fearful
proposition had in the Cabinet was from three of his colleagues ? consequences ?—( Hear.) Ave, but where was the moralist
The Right Hon. Baronet then resigned. The Noble Lord now, when the Right Hon. Baronet was himself proposing to
( Lord John Russell) was then called to the helm of Whit s, and perpetrate a cruelty which he then described as " far mere
the Noble -Lord also failed to construct a Government.— atrocious than sending the Poles to Siberia ?"—(Cheers. ) The
(Cheers and laughter.) He (Sir Charles Napier) rejoiced House might depend upon it that those changes of opinion
that the Noble Lord had failed.—(Laughter.) The Noble by the Members of her Majesty's Government would be
Lord had done so in an uncertainty as to how many of the Hon. appreciated as they deserved, and traced to their true source.
Gentlemen opposite would have come over to his opinions, and But, to pass from those six-months' converts to those who were
under the circumstances he was perfectly justified not converts as many days, he would first come to what ape
in declining to undertake the Government.—( Hear, hear.) peered to him to be the most inexplicable and unexplained part
The Noble Lord the Member for Newark asked why the Right of the question—he meant the colleagues of the Right Hon.
Hon. Baronet did not open the ports now. Had this been Gentleman, who first raised an alarm by retiring from office be-
the case, and had the Right Hon. Baronet proposed the im- cause they disapproved of the measure introduced, and then, in
mediate opening of the ports, he would have met with the six or eight days subsequently, turned round. —( Cheers.) It
same reproaches, and the same complaints would have followed. was contended that they were all honourable men.
—( Hear, bear.) He (Sir C. Napier) thought that the Right He knew the majority of them, arid he believed
Hon. Baronet was perfectly right in the course he had adopted such to be decidedly true ; but that was not
under the circumstances. He believed the Right Hon. Ba- enough, for the public had a right to require
ronet would much sooner have the immediate repeal of the every explanation for the acts of public men.
corn-laws thin that they should be protracted for three years But these gentlemen had set the very worst precedent; as a de-
longer, but he sincerely believed that the Right Hon. Baronet parture from sound principles to meet particular cases of emer-
had gone as far as he could go.—(Cheers and laughter.) gency was invariably adopted by bad men for their own pur-
But if they (the Opposition side of the House) poses.—( Hear, hear.) He asserted that it was not alone for
fell into the trap which the Hononrable Gentlemen their own country's sake that the principles of their public men
opposite had laid for them, with respect to the should be fully intelligible; they should be intelligible to the
immediate opening of the ports, they would defeat the measure men of all other countries—they should not alone be suited for
entirely.—( Hear, hear.) He therefore hoped and trusted the present age, but for history also.—( Hear, hear.) There-
that they would abide by the proposition of the Hon. Baronet, fore, while he did not throw the slightest aspersion on the private
though it might not reach the full limit of their desires.—, character of any gentleman, he should say that the conduct of
( Hear, hear.) The Noble Lord, the Member for Newark, many Honourable Members remained to be explained, and
also proposed, that before they concurred in the measures he believed the public of that country, and the discriminating
which had been proposed, that they should appeal to the coon- public of every other country, would consider their conduct as
try. Now he (Sir C. Napier) would ask, was that a time to an evidence of imbecility of mind, and as a political tergiver-
make such an appeal, when Ireland was in a state of starve- sation unprecedented in English annals.—(Loud cheers.)
tion—when the public tranquillity was in imminent danger of Would not France draw a striking contrast between the consis-
being disturbed ? Ard Hon. Gentlemen opposite knew- that' tency and firmness of her first. Minister—whose object was to
such a state of things really existed ?—( Cheers, and cries of consolidate the power and extend the empire of his Sovereign—
" No, no.") The consequence which would follow the carry- as compared with the opposite qualities exhibited by the Right
ing out of the proposition of the Noble Lord would be, that Hon. Baronet at the head of her Majesty's Ministry?—(Hear,
matters would become still worse.—( Cheers..) The Noble Lord bear.) And, looking to their relations with America, they might
was the most extraordinary man that ever he had heard speak flatter themselves with the notion that by the enactment of mes-
on the subject.—(Roars of laughter.) The Noble Lord had sures of a free-trade nature, they could bribe her to peace,
always heen a sliding-scale nobleman—(Laughter)--but now the but was the present the moment that the Ministry should
Noble Lord proposed to accept a fixed duty.—( Hear, hear.) select to display their want of spirit, and their crouching with-
The Noble Lord, therefore, was as much in fault as the Right drawal before the pressure of blustering and clamour?-( Hear,
Hon. Baronet. , The Hon. Baronet was influenced in his hear.) He firmly believed that the present Ministry would
change of mind by a regard for the public welfare, but the be handed down to posterity as the greatest political cowards
Noble Lord was influenced by self-interested motives and from that ever held the reins of Government.—(Protectionist
a desire to keep his rents higher.—( Cheers, and cries of " Oh, cheers.) The Right. Hon. Baronet the Secretary of State for
oh.") He would tell the House what he 'believed to be the the Home Department not only spoke with all the zeal of a
truth—(Uproar)—and he was of opinion that there would not political neophyte, but also acted as one ; and he (Mr. Shaw)
have been such an opposition to the measure of could put no other construction on the speech of the Right
the Right Ron. Baronet if they were not impressed Honourable Gentleman but that, for the sake of peace
with the idea that the effect would be to cause a reduction in and order, he had discarded the support of a great party
their rents.—(Cheers, and cries of " Oh, oh.") It was not his which comprised the rank, the wealth, ay, and he would say,
desire to press hardly on Hon. Gentlemen opposite. ,He con- whatever Hon. Gentlemen opposite might think, the intent-
sidereil, however, that there were certain feelings which some- genre of the country.—(Oh, oh, and protectionist cheers.)
times crept into the human heart, which
.blinded it to a sense Yes, for the sake of saving them and the country from ruin,
of justice, and prevented it from asserting those principles of the Right Hon. Baronet threw himself and the Government
truth which, under other circumstances, it would at once adopt. into the hands of the Anti-Corn-law League and the Repeal
The Right Hon. Baronet, in his speech of last night, adverted Association of Dublin.—(Cheers and counter cheers.) But
to what had fallen from the Hon. Member for Northampton; the lesson would not be lost in Ireland. He had observed, that
and he had very properly animadverted upon it. Now if, in- Mr. Smith O'Brien, a gentleman for whom he entertained in
stead of making long speeches on the other side of the House, private the highest respect, though he differed with him in
Hon. Members were to give long leases, their tenants would politics, had pointed out the present concession as an
not suffer half so much, even according to their own argu- harbinger of ultimate success for the Repeal Association.
merits,hear
.) asl f ttheyhe
they
otherwise
to
would from this measure.....( Hear, He was an enthusiastic gentleman, and would profit by the
go down into Scotland, they would concession. He should declare that, if in two years hence he
see the improvements in agriculture there. They would see should see Sir Robert Peel, under the pressure of agitation,
them thrashing corn there by steam, instead of by men and introduce some modified plan for a repeal of the Legislative
horses. It might appear strangely singular to Honour- Union, he would not be so much astonished as if any man
able Members far a sailor like him to give them had told him, two years since, that he should witness
such advice, but he was a farmer himself. It was the introduction of a measure like the present.—
true he was a farmer upon a small scale—so much the worse (Cheers.) The measure would have a most dangerous
for him.—(Laughter.) He took a farm about two years ago effect, and would be a further inducement to the
of forty acres, and he wished he' could have afforded to take repealers of Ireland to persevere in their determination.
more.—(Continued laughter.) It was now fourteen years in When he heard his Hon. Friend last night threaten those
cultivation, and, up to the time he had taken it, it had produced gentlemen representing the agricultural interest to give them
nothing. His predecessors could grow nothing, the soil was total repeal, he thought it was not very worthy of the Right
a barren one, and in fact truly unfortunate All who had taken Hon. Baronet, arid he did think that it showed his instability
it up had most signally failed. He had not been on it above and his infirmity as a public man. Tile Noble Lord the Member
a year before he had lost 1001. clear money.—( Laughter. ) for London had spoken of his party the other night, and
His next door neighbour was ap or fellow, but he was a good gloried in he share they had in bringing for ward this mea-
fellow ; ho had no money, but he managed to live very sure. He (Mr. Shaw) owned, that when he heard
well. He (the Honourable Baronet) said to 'him, the Member for London state the means that been adopted
Well, old fellow"—.(Laughter)—he said toi him, in order to carry this measure he thought that the Noble Lord
Well, old fellow, how ait you get on—you have no money ? 'tit spoke in bitter irony. —( Cheers from the Ministerial benches.)
true, you have but a wife and a pony—how is it you manage to Let what would result from the measure—either failure or sue-
do so well ?" I said, " I have money, and have spent it on my cess—let it bring either weal or woe to the interest of this
land, and yet can produce nothing but a loss."—(Laughter.) country, neither honour nor glory would ever be associated
" Well, Sir," said he, '"'my advice to you is, to dig up all your with the means that had been adopted to bring it about.—
ditches, and then to go eighteen inches with your plough, and (Cheers from the Ministerial side.) It was well known to
then sow your seed." He had followed this advice, and he men of every system of politics that this proposed measure had
grew the next year eleven acres of oats all gond and marketable. given a shock to public feeling and confidence which raver-
Now, by following this advice—by making all those improve- berated through every portion of the Queen's empire, and bad
ments, of all this farrow land he had but fourteen acres which injured all confidence in the Government. When the Noble,
did not produce an abundant crop. On mach of this farrow Lord, the Member for London, spoke of the satisfaction.he felt
land, he could assure the House, that he had grown in the measure, he must have felt well satisfied to look at that
the. heads of many 'of the side of the pow, to see their broken ranks—to see the Right
Ho
,had. no doubt that he would be he had effected the overthrow of the Noble Lord, now corn-
'the 'P"teetivdinterests of the Honourable Baronet, with the very weapon with 'which
other
gabrolewtvoeteghroesw, one thing after tho other till at last he would mitting a sort of political suicide—(Cheers from the Minis-
grow which theland would produce corn, and terial side)—to see the man who had formerly commanded
p side
Membersdeaos
fh e large"
iado
uv
os
House.
.as t
olgie
with such improvement, instead of Lord to uphold
this would be the result of an improved. system of agriculture. the House, and driven the Noble Lord from his position, now
If Hon. Members who Blade such an outcry against the in- supplicating the Noble Lord for support._( Hear, hear.) He
Oh !"
roads of agriculture, would but get down their ditches, and sow (the Right Hon;Baronet) was humbly supplicating the Noble
the existence of his Government.—("
speeches, they would do well, and the result from the Opposition.) Well, then, those gentlemen who cried
ter favourable gain. He hadtaken I I at least deny that the Government of the
would be no but a y up " Oh, oh, cou tno
discussion—he thought a new course Baronet existed on the sufferance of the Noble
a new part in this was Right Hon.
Id t k had
he o fiewhat thatparty was years
been worn quite Lord. When he thought of
very necessary, as t
mthaekirincgortnhoisne
laocnegord accordance
threadbare, an
one alte • •
d he thought,Hon. Members would appreciate ago, when the Right Honourable Baronet was at its
would be, that they would vote for the measure before the now, he could not help declaring that be was sorry
Shell IA
a:Vildooswwaitndhfatltrahtt,ehienbiard much of that party f that his political life had lasted until he had seen that day.
that the result head, and contrasted its then position with what it was
the present mea- He considered the course adopted by the Right Hon.,
tHh
oe:lsre. course..
.(
-"ling, Baronet, or, as he trusted he might still call him, his Right
sure, he would
that much of that ruinous.—(Loud laughter from all parts
although he must confess party feeling had Hon Friend, to be
necbheeecrlas!)medwfhoratheivmersehlifs, v(tr,.ashstarwic.tosoen.se. of
given way. those with whom he had of the House.) He entirely acquitted him of any motive
for years acted had left alternative, either to besides the o
Cheers
eaenedn,laeugthehiktmeern.
verify his opinion in unison •
keep silence, or to
Cheers.)
Hon. Baronet's pinion
The measure before the House was one of all others which might be *of the Right political conduct, he
would du great and incalculable, injury to Ireland. The never thought that he was actuated by any but a good feeling.
debate hail taken a new turn. The Hon. and Gallant He would conclude by addressing to the Right Honourable
Member had introduced that change in the debate. Baronet the words which, many years ago, on a
• Many of those who had risen on the subject had said they similar occasion, he (the Right Honourable Baro-
would vote for the measure, but many of those who had also net) had addressed to the Member for London—" You wish to
risen said they would vote against the motion. The Noble induce us to follow principles in which there are nothing but
Lord the Member for Liverpool said that the measure, though varying counsels—divided colleagues—statements of facts that
he would not vote against it, if it should be carried, would cannot be reconciled—arguments leading to opposite conchs-
disappoint those who had brought it forward, and placed such sions. We cannot surrender our judgment to throw down the
reliance on its results,. and he (the Hon. Member) was of protection now existing. as a security to agriculture, to try in
opinion that it would disappoint the public generally. He thought an agricultural lottery, in the vain hope of drawing out a prize."
Right Hon. Baronet at the head of her Majesty's Ministry —(lmmense cheering.)
had no right to say that the Noble Lord (Lord Ashley), who Mr. BRIGHT said that the lion. Member who had just
had resigned his seat, was in favour of the measure, because he resumed his seat, and other Members on the protectionist side,
had so resigned, instead of voting for the measure. Thelllons should have learned by heart the speeches delivered by the
Member for. Liverpool, who had said that the measure would Right Hon. Baronet and the Right Hon. the Home Secretary.
be of the greatest injury to the interests of —(. Oh, oh," from the Ministerial side.) If these speeches
this country was animadverted upon in the speech of had been correctly committed to memory, some two Members
the Right lion. Baronet, who held it as a right that those who might have delivered them to the House, and have saved much
held opinions contrary to the Right Hon. Baronet, had a right time and trouble, and a good deal of repetition. He had hoped
to express themselves to that effect on that question, without that when the Honourable Member for Bristol moved the
being subject to attack. The Noble Lord the Member for the amendment the principle of protection was about to be discussed.
West Riding of Yorkshire bad said, that those who had advo- The question really to be considered was the repeal of the corn.
mica the protective interests in that House were broken up as laws and not the party Twills on the opposite side of the
b)s
übgp
tyue dk on.
eg e
:nand

House. They were very much mistaken if they supposed
that the great 'body of the people cared anything about
the quarrels of the Conservative party. He had listened
to nearly every speech on that side of the House that had
been made in support of protection, and he, instead
of entering into their party disputes, would direct his ateentien
to the arguments that had been brought forward in its favour.
The Hon. and Learned Member for the University of Dublin's
(Mr. Shaw's) speech was entirely directed to the party quarrel
at issue, and therefore he (Mr. Bright) did not intend to
answer it. —(lronical cheers from the Conservative benches )
If he was not mistaken, the question of protection was the real
question before the House, and therefore he would pass on to the
speeches of those who attempted to grapple with it. The
Hon. Member for Bristol (Mr. P. Miles), who introduced
the question, said that the farmers would not be content to
' sell cheap corn and buy dear sugar ; and the Hon. Member
for Wiltshire deeared that it would be unfair for the colonies
to be protected at a heavy expense to British agri-
culture. The Hon. Member said he could not interfere to
give protection to the planter or the colonist, if Parliament
withdrew protection from British grain. In that principle he
(Mr. Bright) agreed. He admitted its truth, and he sincerely
hoped that the same principle would be extended to all.—( Hear,
hear.) He would say it was not just to protect sugar, if it was
withdrawn from corn; and on the same grounds he hoped that
Hon. Gentlemen would see that if any interest or trade in the
country was unprotected, while corn was protected, it was
equally unjust to that particular trade or interest. Hon. Mem-
bers could not deny that. He must say this as the represen-
tative, if so he might term himself, of one of the largest trades
in the country, to which no Member proposed the protection of
the House, and a trade that did not require it. Since he came
into that House a proposition had been made to remove all
impediments in the way of exporting machinery, and he was
glad to say that every Member in that House, as well, he be-
lieved, as every one connected with that trade out of the
House, supported that motion. Last year the 10 per cent. im-
posed on the exportation of cotton yarns was repealed, and
every one
.connected with the trade in the House voted for
the
proposition. Not only the Membde in the House con-
nected with the cotton trade gave their votes in support of the
repeal, but out of the House it was supported by nearly all in-
terested in that pursuit. But he would not take cotton, or
woollen, or silk, but he would come at once to the real
question to be considered—the policy of a protective
duty on corn—(Cries of " Hear, hear ")—and on which
lion. Members on the Opposition side had talked as if they
knew so much. He was walking past the offices of the protec-
tion party in Bond-street the other day, and he must say the
place seemed seedy and forlorn:—(Loud laughter.)_ There
was not the slightest appearance of business there. He saw a
large brass plate on the door, on which was engraved in large
letters " The Central Society for the Protection of Agricul-
culture and Native Industry." And what, he would ask, was
that industry which it was proposed to protect? He recol-
lected in 1842, when his Hon. Friend the Member for Stock-
pert (Mr. Cobden) proposed that if the protection of the
landed interest was agreed to, that it should also
be to raise and keep permanent the rate of
wages.—( Hear, hear.) What answer was given to that
proposition? Honourable Members said that they could not
understand how that proposition could be agreed to on princi-
ples of political economy. If wages could not be
settled by Act of Parliament, was it nut equally opposed
to the laws of political economy, and equally absurd to pass a
law to raise the produce of the landlord's estates ? He would
beg the Hon. Member to give a clear and satisfactory answer
to this point. That Hon. Member professed to understand
the question, and he (Mr. Bright) believed that the Hon.
Gentleman was a reader of the Economist newspaper. If he
said so, and professed to know the principle which regulates
trade and commerce, he (Mr. Bright) could not understand
how he could reconcile those principles with the speech which
he had made the other night. That speech was skilfully con-
structed, but it was nothing more, and did not deal fairly and
comprehensively with the question before the House. Let him
look at the increase of population—consider the limited extent
of these two islands, with a population of 27,000,000, and
which was increasing at a great rate, a million and a half hav-
ing been added since the corn-law of 1842 was passed—
let him consider this, and see how he could
reconcile it with the principles of political economy.
They would, if they dared, shut out foreign produce altogether
from this country; and he believed that many of their sup.
porters sighed for a law that would do so.—( Cries of " Oh,
oh.") Well, then, they would prohibit it to the point at which
it would be safe to stop,—to the point of starvation
What mattered it how much distress might be felt by the
labourer in Wiltshire or the weaver in Lincolnshire, if high
prices for wheat could be safely maintained ? Up to that point,
then, they wished to prohibit the importation of foreign corn,
although they well knew that, with the increasing population,
there would be a greater difficulty in supplying them with
home-grown corn. But the landlords probably argued that the
increased demand for food would involve an increased amount of
rent for the land.—(Hear, hear.) Was this protection to the
labourer or to the farmer ? They said, yes, or they would not
thus struggle to maintain it. lie (Mr. Bright) had heard a
clergyman of the Church of England say that the labourers'
protection was the poor-lase.—( Hear, hear.) The poor-law
was as much a protection to clergymen as to the labourer, for
the reduced clergyman like the labourer could fall back upon the
workhouse. In what condition was the land under the existing
system of protection? He (Mr. Bright) would tell them it
was badly cultivated in most parts of the country. There was
scarcely a parish in which there were not more labourers than
could and employment. They found one labourer competing
with another—they found a fierceness of competition that was
destroying them, yet that House had never passed a law regu-
lating- the wages of labour. The Honourable Member
for Wiltshire, the senior Member (Mr. Bennet) he expected,
come time ago, at a meeting held in his own county, made a
long speech to the farmers, and made one of the most extra-
ordinary statements that ever had been made in the bearing
of his fellow men. He was reviewing the state of agriculture
in that very happy county, and he was lamenting his misfor-
tune in being born to the possession of some thousand
acres. He said that if he had the happiness to come into the
world again, he knew no condition which he should choose with
so much alacrity and contentment as the condition of the agri •
cultural labourer. Well, he did feel some delicacy—(lronical
cheers and laughter).—in saying, that this remark
might imply a doubt as to the wisdom of the Ho-
nouable Member's choice. But he certainly ought to know
the condition of the labourer ; he lived among them, and
therefore was qualified to form an opinion on the subject. Bu'
he (Mr. Bright) would rather have the opinion of the
labourer; and he would still confine the 1-1, n. Gentleman to
his own county of Wilts. They had heard of a meeting at
Goatacre.—( Hear.) Some Hon. Member had stated that
this meeting was got up by the League.—(Cheers, and laughter. )
Hon. Gentlemen opposite were so convinced of the omnipresence:
of the League, that he, perhaps, need not affirm that the League
had nothing to do with it. But they had a later meeting of
labourers at Bremhill, and a certain labourer, Job Senning,
took the chair. He did not know whether he was a prize la-
bourer or not. But Job said, " I be protected, but I be
starved." It was not in Wiltshire alone that misery existed.
An lion. Friend had put into his hand a paper, drawn up by a
respectable person in the town of Tiverton. The paper gave the
condition of 28 families, the number of children, and the
wages which they earned for a week. What were these wages ?
:seven shillings. Men with wives, and flue, six, or seven
children—living in miserable huts, paying high rents, and
obliged to pay oust of their scanty means a high price for
winter fuel—and all this out of seven shillings a week. Now,
he should like to ask the Hon. Member for Northamptonshire,
who boasted that the labourer could earn 125., if this was the
protection that they gave to the labourers?—( Ilear)—and if it
was, whether it was commensurate with the benefits which the
landlords had been reaping for the last thirty years.—( Cheers.)
The Hon. Member spoke of the condition of the coachmakers.
Would the Hon. Member go down to Southampton, and ask
Mr. Andrews, the celebrated coachmaker, what the state
of trade at that time was ? He would find that he was building
coaches for all the countries of Europe. He (Mr. Bright)
would not insult his countrymen, as Hon. Members opposite
did, by declaring that they were behind their rivals on the
Continent in anything requiring fine taste and execution.
Why even foreigners acknowledge the superiority of the English
workman in all the branches of manufacture. But these gen-
tlemen affirmed that the tradesman was behind the artisan of
France, as their labourers were behind the serfs of Poland.
lion. Members had expressed great horror of coming evils if
these corn-laws should be abolished. There were different
sorts of inundation. Ho had heard of inundation of water,
but now agricultural gentlemen . were alarmed
at a threatened inundation of • ' Corn.—( Hear, hear. )
Those who had travelled abroad must know there was nothing
in the climate, nothing in the land, which was likely to com-
pete successfully with the agriculture of this country. What
could be more certain than that they grew for every acre of
land in England a larger quantity of corn than was grown
upon an acre in any other country in the world. Mr. Web-
ster, in a speech in the United States, gave a statement of the
number of acres grown in this country, and the number of
quarters per acre, and he pointed to England as exceeding
America, and he exhorted his countrymen to en-
deavour to equal this country. If they grew more
acres than any other country in the world,, another
thing was just as sure, and that was that the labourer got a
smaller portion for his share than in any other country in the
world.—( Cries of " No, no.") Why if the prices were so much
higher in this country, as they said they were, and if wages
an _
if
were seven shillings per week in some of the countries, d
their acres of land grew nearly twice as much
possibly
sssiabniey
other acres in the world, he would ask how was
for them to come to any other conclusion
than. that the
labourer reaped their fields, but got a smaller port ion of the
r p oduee for his subsistence than in any other country in the
world ! Let them look to their advantages. They had a
larger supply of manure than was found in any other country
they had far better agricultural implements thes
had them at a much cheaper rate they had far
better roads than they found anywhere else —and
they had markets so much better that hardly any com-
parison could be drawn. True it was that protection had da-
maged them. It was not foreign competition that they need
fear. They had protected the tanner into a state of decripi-
tude, and now, when a stimulus was offered to them, they
trembled for the consequences that might ensue.—( Hear. )
Let them take the county of Cheshire. There was
,a high aristocracy there and a very poor tenantry. There was
land of at least an average quality most wretchedly cultivated,
and there would be a mass of pauperism in Cheshire equalling
the south-weetern counties, if it were not for the proximity to
Lancashire, in which county the labourer found refuge. It
was not the soil of Cheshire that made the farmer poor—
it was not the climate—it was the Legislature.
of that House which destroyed the vitality of agriculture.
In the course of this debate, nothing had been said upon the
subject of mortgages. The Hon. Member for Berkshire said,
that he did not ask for protection—if the law was not a good
law, let it be abolished, and if the principle
were unsound let
it be abandoned. The late Paymaster of the Forces it was
who first talked about mortgages, and they need
not be surprised if the people in the country
used that argument which had been put into their mouths.
But he would discuss this question solely with reference to the
peculiar interest to the landowner. The lion. Member for
Berkehire spoke of burdens—he spoke of poor-rates. Now
lie (:11r. Bright) thought he could show that [lon. Gentleman
that the capital of the tenant-farmer of this country
paid no poor-rates whatever.—( Hear, hear.) They
complained that he (Mr. Bright) did not pay rates upon ma-
chinery in his mills. They said that stock in trade should be
rated to the poor -rate. But if that argument were applied to
him, it must be applied to the agriculturist also. How did
this woek ? The Hon. Member for Berkshire, he would say,
had some thousands with which to cultivate his land. Ile paid
nothing in the shape of poor-rate upon his household furniture,
or the produce in his barns—his growing crops—upon his ma-
nure, upon his cattle, or upon any kind of stock or implement
he might have. He did not pay a single farthing for poor-
rates until the time when a permanent improvement in the soil
had taken place, and same portion of the tenant's capital had
become incorporated with the land. Now if lie (Mr. Bright)
was to fay upon his machinery and his cotton, it was quite
clear that the tenant mast pay poor-rates upon the stock he
had mentioned. They had better say nothing, . therefore,
about the poor-rates.
Mr. PALMER—I did not allude to the poor-rates.
Mr. BRIG HT—I think the Hon. Gentleman tid.,,_
_on.
Mr. PALMER—I quoted from a speech of the did.
Mr. Hon.
Baronet.
Mr. BRIGHT-tWell then theret was
thanotherbu rbdtternd
of
fi
game.v ieh
had not been mentioned,
There svere two sons of oftiaiendDutik:emi
who had 'spoken in the debtatee,
against the proposition_
_orfl. the
Noble Duke paid 9 I
wßhuot lawnedrei in
about
tt
to house,vote
Government. In 1844, that
for game damage on 309
acres of land. Now he' asked how Honourable Members
could
come to that liouso, when for their own aztzse.