The Sun.
London, England, 1846-07-18 00:00:00

Mr. LABOUCHERE said no subject in connexion with
Ireland gave him so much consolation as the fact, that the
people of Ireland, under the national system of education, were
enjoying a blessing which many more favoured countries did
not possess. It was destroying prejudice, and gave him the best
hopes as regarded the future. He rose merely to do away with
any impression that the Government were in the least degree
indifferent to the national system of education.
Sir R. H. INGLIS merely wished to impress on the mind
of the Noble Lord that he ought, in justice to those connected
with the Church of Ireland, to give them a grant for education
in such a nto le as they could receive it.
Mr. HENLEY briefly supported the views of the Hon.
Member for Oxford.
The vote was then agreed to.
Tiro next item proposed was 5,3811., for the metropolitan
and provincial schools of design.
Atter a few observations from Mr. Ewart, Lord George
Manners, and Mr. Hume,
Dr. WWII ING thought there should be a more efficient
system of registration Than at present, and that there ought to
be a tribunal to decide reg-arding the right of designs. Such a
tribunal might be composed of manufacturers and workmen.
Tribunals of this kind were found of great efficacy in France.
Mr. P. BORTH WICK was opposed to any such tribunals
as those named.
. Mr. J. HEATHCOAT would like to know what those
tribunals spoken of as being in France were, and what were
the caper ses attending on them, before ho supported such an
institution. Something, however, ought to be done in regard
to the regulation of designs.
Mr. HENLEY said that he was astonished that, after
the extraordinary powers which were granted three or four
years ago to carry out the law about designs, they were com-
pelled, after all their beautiful new systems of legislation, to
resort to the Court of Chancery. All their fine French courts
and tribunals would turn out to be mere moonshine.
The vote was then agreed to.
On the item of 2,006/. to support certain professors at Cam-
bridge and Oxford,
Mr. WILLIAMS briefly objected to the high salaries re-
ceived by the professors for very trifling duties.
Sir R. H. INGLIS defended the vote. The sum was not
one-fourth of what was annually granted to the University of
London.— (Hear, hear.) The professors at the University of
Glasgow and the College of Belfast were quite as liberally paid
as those at Oxford or Cambridge. The Hon. Gentleman (Mr.
Williams) had admitted that he had not. very strong ob-
jections to the grant, and he (Sir R. H. Inglis) therefore
hoped that the House would consent to the grant.--( Hear. )
Mr. DICKINSON opposed the grant, and said that the
Universities received quite sufficient for their support from
other sources, than grants from the public treasury.
The vote was then agreed to.
The following votes were then agreed to without ob-
servation :-4,5261. to the University of London, 7,4801. to the
Ceottash Universities, 300/. to the Royal Irish Academy,
3001. to the Royal Hibernian Academy, 6,0824 to the Royal
Dublin Society.
On the vote of 2,6001. to the Royal Belfast Academy,
Mr. HUME wished to know why there had been an increase
of 500/. on the grant of last year.
Sir J. GRAHAM explained the reason of the increase of
the salaries and number of the professors. As the greater
portion of the people of the north of Ireland professed the
Presbyterian religion, which was supported by the State, it
was thought but just that increased means should be given
to the professors to instruct the young men of Ulster in the
principles of religion and science.
Lord J. MANNERS would be glad if the Right Hon.
Baronet would inform the Committe whether there had
been any correspondence between the Government and the
synod et Ulster on the subject of the professors' salaries ?
Sir J. GRAHAM said that there had been such a com-
munication, and it would probably be produced to-morrow, in
pursuance of the motion of the Hon. Member for Montrose.
Air. LABOUCHERE thought that the Hon. Member for
Montrose would not derive any advantage by postponing this
vote till the production of the correspondence.
Mr. HUME understood that the authorities of the college
had not asked for the increase, and the Right Hon. Baronet
ought not therefore to have made it, as it was the public
money. The Right Hon. Baronet might give 5001. out of his
own pocket if he pleased, but he had no right to give away the
public money in that manner. The Right Hon. Gentleman
had given no explanation whatever for giving the increase, and
under all the circumstances he would oppose it.
Sir J. GRAHAM said that he had stated the grounds why
the increase was made. A deputation had been specially sent
over from the synod of Ulster, consisting of the moderator
and three of the principal Presbyterian clergymen of the north
of Ireland, and it was upon their representations that the in-
crease was made. This, however, was a question of policy and
equity, and it remained for the present Government to take
whatever course they pleased on the matter, but he had stated
the circumstances which induced the late Government to make
the increase on the former allowance.
Mr. WILLIAMS thought that the people of this country
had enough to do with their money, besides giving it away to
parties who had not asked for it. There were other institu-
tions in far greater need of Government assistance, and in the
exercise of their generosity they shouid rather look to them.
Mr. LABOUCHERE had considerable difficulty to come to
a decision in the case, as he did riot know fully the circum-
stances under which it was made. It might be right to in-
crease the salary of the divinity professors of the institution,
but he thought sufficient grounds should be shown for that pur-
pose. As the vote, however, had been brought forward by
the late Government, who had examined the matter carefully,
he would not change it ; but next year, when the estimates
came on, should he not consider it warranted by the circum-
stances of the case, he would withhold the increase.
Mr. HENLEY thought that this was one of the fruits of
the grant to Maynooth. He did not mean to give any opinion
on the justice of the case, but he thought it might be in-
structive to know whether the overture came from the Govern-
nent or the increase was applied for by the College. As no
principle, however, was involved, he would not oppose the

grant.
. Mr. HUME said after what had fallen from the Right Hon.
Gentleman, the Secretary for Ireland, he would not press his
amendment to a division.
BRITISH MUSEUM.

On the sum of 45,4941., for the new building of the British
Museum,
Mr. HUME asked when it was likely that the alterations
would be completed?
Sir R. INGLIS thought that the whole of the buildings
would be completed within three years.
The vote was then agreed to.
A vote of 3,390/. was proposed to defray the expenses of the
National Gallery.
Mr P. BORTH WICK objected to an item in the estimate
of 600/. for the purchase of a portrait of Hans Holbein. The
country s'aould not he called upon to pay for the blunder of a
public officer. He should divide the House upon the question.
Colonel. SIBTEIORP said this was the first time he had en-
tered the House since the late Ministry had resigned, and he
really did not know where he was—•( Laughter)—he could not
I make out the position of the parties.—(Laughter. )
With reference to the picture to which the Ho-
nourable Member for Evesham had alluded, he did
not know who painted it, and he did not care.
—(Renewed laughter.) He for one would be glad to give
his vote to pull down the whole building, and sell the old ma-
terials for what they would fetch. Look at the building, and
see the display of water works outside, with a lot of dead dogs
and dead cats round it—(Laughter)—smellinc, most offensively,
rendering die water-works at once the laughing-stock to the
people of this country and foreigners, who were allowed to see
them by the kind permission of the Metropolitan Police.—
(Laughter.) He should like to see the vote stopped at once,
and let them have a gallery worthy of the country, and not
such a buildino as at present existed, fit only for a blackhole for
the confinement of convicts.—(Laughter. )
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER must confess
that the picture was not worth the money, and the purchase of
it at that price was merely a blunder, to which public bodies
were frequently subject.
Sir J. GRA/ lAM said that both the Right Honourable
Member for T amworth and himself were trustees of the
National Gallery, and were both responsible, in some measure,
for the blunder VI hie., had been made. The picture was not,
as the Hon. Member for Evesham had stated it to be, a very
bad one. It was certainly a high price to pay for it; it was
admitted by all that it was not a Holbein, but at the same
time it was not c,on sidered to be a bad one, and the late Go-
vernment thought that they had better come to Parliament
and ask for the moz ‘ey for the purchase, than to take an Hon.
Member's advice, at Id go to law upon the subject.—( Laughter. )
Mr. HENLEY thought that they should not quarrel too
much with the trust ees of this institution because they had
been taken in once.

After a few words from Mr. PETER BORTHWICK, who
said he was sent thore, to guard the public purse, and he would
not be mealy-mouthecl upon this question,
Sir JAMES GR A HAM said that arrangements had been
made to have the op
in ion of competent judges on future pur-
chases, which would j 7revent any such blunders in future.
Sir DE LACY E VANS said he was aware Government
had in hand many new buildings, and he would not at present
propose a new gallery. But in taking into consideration the
improvement of the metropolis, he thought they ought to put
themselves in communi cation with eminent architects, with the
view to providing some thing worthy of the country at a future
time.—The vote was th eu agreed to.
_ _

A vote of 10,9111., for the Museum of Economic Geology,
and geological survey.
Mr. HUME certainly wished to know what had been done
in the last year.
After a few words fronr. Mr. HOPE, the vote was agreed to.

A vote of 5,032/., for Wientific objects was also agieed to.
A vote of 2,0001., .for Botanical Gardens in Dublin, was
agreed to.
A vote of 3,0701., to defray the expenses of the eiyil estab-
lishment in Prince Edward''s Island, was agreed to.
and Ireland having been r eacl,
A vote of 4,0491., for a situilar purpose in the island of Ber-
muda, was also agreed to.
A vote of 400/., for the expenses of lighthouses on Sable
Island, was agreed to.
A vote of 11,5001., for civil establishments in St. Helena,
.Was agreed to.
A vote of 7,219/., for civil. establishments in Western Austra.
Ha
was agreed to.
of 2 965/ for the charges and expenses of Port Es-
sington, was then proposed.
A vote ,
3,4101., Bahama Islands.
13,680/., Establishment Wei ;tern Coast of Africa.
After a few words from Mr. HOPE,
Air. HUME said that :he cordially supported this vote,
and begged to call the attention of the Government
to the advantages of this port as a centre of communication by
the overland route between this country and Australia, and
hoped the Government would .take some steps to carry out that
project.
The vote was agreed to.

A vote of 4,7.5 ck for the charges of the establishments on
the Falkland Island was proposed and agreed to.
A vote of 30,0001., to defray the charges of civil establish-
ments in New Zealand was proposed.
After a few words from Mr. WILLIAMS and Mr. HOPE,
Mr. HUME said he did not know whether this money was
for military expenses or on account of paper credit issued by
the Government. IL e wished to know if there was any thing
like a correct stability when a man was appointed Governor,
and whether Governor Fitzroy had arrived, and had rendered
an account. He did not lay any blame to him, for he
believed when he was appointed that he would make a good
governor.
Lord JOHN RUSSELL gave Governor Fitzroy all credit
for having acted on good faith, and with the best intentions,
but he had failed, and had been recalled by the Government
which had appointed him, and he (Lord J. Russell) thought
that enough had been done in the matter.--(Hear, hear.)
After a short discussion on the general policy of General
Fitzroy, the vote was agreed to.
was then voted for the expenses of Heligoland, and
also 18,394/. for the salaries of the governors and deputy-gover-
nors of the West Indian colonies.

On 11,3531. -beingPrOPOseCCfor the expenses of the eccle.
siastical establishments of the North American colonies,
Mr. WiLLIANIS objected to the item of 3,000/. for mis-
sionaries there ; to cast country did they belong ?
Mr. HOPE having: explained,
Mr. HUME also offered some opposition to the vote.
WILLJAMS called on the Government to withdraw
, 'pal portion
uappvoerrtyed,nithdei vote.a was
allowed this vote' altogether: .
Mr. DICAENSON
toundianti the pritie Aiv tilire.cpa.,lH22VßA,:titollp soaiidi,u,t,„Abas+
of the population being Catholic; he was only allowed 751. per
annum, whilst the Protestant bish'P was allowed 2,000/. He