The Sun.
London, England, 1846-03-28 00:00:00

METROPOLITAN IMPROVEUENTS.

Sir It. H. INGLIS inquired when the Bills for improving
the metropolis, and for making a p&rk at Battersea, like the
one at the east end of Londun, would be laid on the table. The
Right Hon. Baronet observed, that his only object was that the
Bill should be laid on the table ofttie House.
Sir ROBERT PEEL said that the Bills were already pre-
pared, and the (hafts had been printed. His Noble Friend had
gone to Ireland; and, as he took such great trouble in pre-
paring them, he wished the (hafts to be sent after him for his
revi!ion.

LOANS TO LANDED PROPRIETORS FOR THE
IMPROVEMENT OF PROPERTY.

Mr. ESCOTT wished to ask the First Lord of the Trea-
sury whether he was prepared to lay on the table of the House
that portion of his scheme for the improvement of land, where-
by it was intended to give loans to landed proprietors on proper
security ?
Sir R. PEEL said that the Government had been exces-
sively occupied, but he hoped by this day (Friday) week that
he would be able to lay that Bill upon the table of the House.

INFORMERS' (IRELAND.)
Mr. S. O'BRIEN said he would move for a return of the
total amount of money which had been paid for services, by the
Government, to a man named Robert Reilly, alias Robert
Alexander, alias William Roberts, alias Hugh who
had been sentenced to transportation at the last Tyrone assize-3.
lie would also move, on Tuesday next, a resolution to the effect
that several royal commissions had been instituted with a
view to the improvement of Ireland, and that these commis-
sions had laid before the Government a variety of sugges-
tions, not one of which had been acted upon.
PRIVATE BILLS.

Mr. HUME gave notice of his intention to call the atten-
tion of the House on Wednesday next to the adoption of means
by which the private bu-iness of the House might be lessened.
ADJOURNED DEBATE.—CORN-LAWS.

On the question being put that the order of the day be now
read,
Mr. COBDEN rose to present a petition from 114 tenants
on the Right Hon. Baronet's (the Secretary of State for
the Home Department) estate —6l'. Netherby, in Cum-
berland. The petitioners stated that they viewed
with satisfaction the measure of the Government, but they
would rather that the repeal had been total and immediate.--
( Hear, hear.) The petition was signed by twenty-seven
names, and he found that the rentals placed opposite these
names amounted in the aggregate to B,ooo'. He might
state, that on a former occasion, the Noble Lord, the Member
for Lynn, had presented a petition, which he said emanated
from 3,000 of the Netherby tenants. He (Mr. Cobden)
congratulated the Right Hon. Baronet on the fact, that some
of his tenantry entertained more rational opinions upon this
great question.
Sir JAMES GRAHAM then rose and said—l can assure
you, Sir, that I am very unwilling to protract to any fur-
ther length this debate, which the country generally, I be-
lieve, are as anxious to see brought to a termination
as i am by a decision in some way or other, be
that what it may.—( Hear, hear.) But not hav-
ing been able to secure an opportunity of addressing you
last evening until an hour so late that I could not then
think of trespassing upon the time of the House, while I was at
the same time extremely desirous that this discussion should
not terminate until I had made some reference to the discus-
sions and arguments that have been used by some Hon. Members
on this side of the House, I will now take this opportunity of
addressing the House.—( Hear, hear.) And I can assure the
House that in respect to what has fallen from one Hon. Mem-
ber upon a subject somewhat personal to myself, that I was
not cognisant of the occurrence he has stated with regard to
my tenantry. I can, however, assure the Hon. Member and
the House, that I have never, either directly or indirectly, in-
terfered with the expression of the opinions of my
tenantry upon- this question—( Hear, hear)—but on the
contrary, 1 have invariably left them to the full and free exer-
cise of their own opinions and judgment upon a question in
which I conceive they hal as deep an interest as myself.—
( Hear.) With thi !brief explanation upon this point, I shall
now proceed, with the permission of this House, to make some
allusion to the speech of the Noble Lord the Member
for Lynn. I shall first dispose of his peroration, and which I
must say was, like many of the other speeches delivered by
Hon. Members in opposition to her Majesty's Ministers from
this side the House, characterised almost entirely by a continual
outpouring of personal invective.—( Hear, hear.) I shall not,
in the course of my observations, indulge in a like strain of
severity upon the language in which their opinions were, I
believe, sincerely and honestly made. Neither shall I say—
for I could not say so with truth—that I do not
appreciate the grounds upon which other Hon. Members on
this side of the House differ from the Government, for amongst
them are several Hon. Members upon whom I have many
times relied, and never relied in vain.—( Hear, hear.) In
considering the public necessity which I. as a Minister of the
Crown,vrit conceived existed for this measure, I do say it was
Sir, Inain I felt that necessity urged upon the Government.
was prepared, and I am prepared, en public grounds,
regardless of all taunts and obloquy that may be attempted to
be heaped on 'me —I repeat, I arnprepared, from a sense of
public duty, to meet the present emergency by the main-
tenance of this measure, which, in my conscience, I be-
lieve
to
(Cheers.) Although, Sir, I may
be taunted
bew intleicinelarYnsisrency, yet steadily, firmly and fearlessly,
I hope t
o be able to discharge my duty ; and in persevering in
that course, I am consoled by this single reflection, that the
time is not far distant when the country gentlemen of
England will be satisfied that her Majesty's Minis-
ters now in office have not betrayed their interests,
but that, on the contrary, they will be reconciled to the fact,
that the interests of the great body of the community, whose
prosperity is more immediately the object of this measure, will
be materially benefited by this House giving its sanction to the
measure.—(Cheers.) I hope, Sir, to be allowed to advert to
some of the arguments of the Noble Lord the Member for Lynn.
The arguments adduced by the Noble Lord were the most
stringent and unanswerable of those urged by the opponents
of the sliding scale ; and I will, Sir, with the permission of
the House, advert to the first position taken up by the Noble
Lord. Speculating on the price of wheat, the Noble Lord,
with a view of forming an estimate of the prices of wheat
in this country and France, went through a most ex-
traordinary process of argument.—(Cries of " Hear; heir.")
Now, Sir, it appears to me that the great argument in favour

of the free importation of corn is, that in the present circum-
dthThreahel trade w
di
stances of this country it will supply a large number af the
population, who would otherwise find a difficulty in obtaining
from the land an adequate supply, especially as their number
is increasing. The effect of the measure will be to lower the
prices in this country, and to raise the prices on the Con-
tinent of Europe ; and it will therefore equalise the prices
beth here and abroad, We shall then obtain the object so
desirable ; for the people of England will have a security
I against the uncertain and extravagant rise of prices, and the
commercial interest will not only have free trade, but they
will have an opportunity of an interchange of coenmodities.
The prices of corn will rise in Europe, and the raising
of prices is no less an object to the manufacturer
than an • increased price for his own produce.
The Noble Lord, on proceeding to argue with reference to the
steadiness of prices, produced a table, which illustrates in a
more clear manner than any other table I have hitherto seen,
a fact whieh the enemies of the sliding scale regard
as inherent in our present system of corn-laws.
He has demonstrat( d very clearly in the table
which be has produced that the . great fluctuations
of prices on the continent depended mainly on the demand
from England. He adduced the table of fluctuations which
shows that the rise or fall of prices on the continent is in exact
proportion ro the demand from England. It would appear from
that document that the places most affected by these fluctua-
t tinny, are Hamburgh, Amsterdam; Dantzic, and Odessa—
mfher
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had we done ? So far as our present experience goes, we had
been, in fact, preventing the production of those crops of corn
which are necessary for the keeping up of a constant and steady
supply; and the reffect is, that we are teuding to con-
vert these corn-growing countries not only into com-
mercial rivals, but into actual enemies. This cannot
but act in preventing our obtaining those supplies which are
necessary to preserve an equality in the corn-market. In con-
sequence of the uncertainty which prevails among the agricul-
turists abroad, they never know at what rate their corn would
sell in the British market, and the supplies therefore are un-
certain and irregular. On the whole the conclusion is strong
that they can place no reliance whatever on the state of the
British market, and they therefore impose higher rates of duty on
our manufactures in order to realise the advantages which they
ought to reap
,from their corn trade, and thus despairing of
ever obtaining the advantage to which I allude, they are led
to measures which have the effect of depressing the whole in-
terests of the country. This then is one of the reasons which
indicate the cause of those fluctuations to which the Noble Lord
has alluded, and which have rendered the British markets so
uncertain that the supplies have been irregular, and, apart from
other considerations, offers me one of the greatest reasons why
the corn-laws should be altered. The Noble Lord has said,
and has laid great stress upon the point, that there has been
great evenness of price since the alteration of the law in 1828.
Why 1 have said repeatedly in this House, that I have always
considered that evenness and steadiness of price neither more
nor less than a nuisance, and so it is considered by the grow-
ers abroad. The Noble Lord considers that this evenness has
been a benefit, but what have been the real effects ? It is well
known, and I appeal to the oldest farmer for a confirmation of the
opinion that during the present year there has been no such
effect created. I believe that during the present year the
price of the best wheat in the home market has
varied from 565. to 725. a quarter, and that this
state of things is a constant stress upon the trade,
and a continued nuisance, and it is on account of this
imperfection in a portion of the sliding-scale that I believe it
ought to be altered. Then the Noble Lord has another ob-
jection which he says is occasioned by the importation
of foreign corn, in foreign instead of British ships.
Why, it is this very uncertainty of the sliding-scale which
prevented the merchants and the foreign growers from knowing
what the condition of the market would be on the arrival of
the cargo, and what the price would be at the
moment of its import which lost to British ships their charter-
age. The Noble Lord had stated that the corn trade should
he rendered as certain as possible, in order that when the
importation does take place, the British ships should
bring the foreign corn. The circumstances which I
have stated are the very reasons why foreign ships
obtain the cargoes, instead of British ships.—( Hear, hear. )
But, Sir, the Noble Lord then proceeded to state that the
farmers looked with dread and consternation at this measure.
The petition presented by the Hon. Gentleman the Member
for Stockport (Mr. Cobden) clearly shows that all the farmers
do not entertain such a dread. But the Hon. Member for
Huntingdon said that if this protective law were removed a
great deal of land must be thrown out of cultivation, and the Hon.
Gentleman, the Member for Cambridgeshire, said, as I under-
stood, that the panic in Cambridgeshire is so great that drainage
was suspended, and that agricultural improvement had suddenly
ceased. Now, Sir, I must beg to observe, that to the best of
my knowledge, the panic to which the Hon. Member for Cam-
bridge has referred, prevails much more within these walls than
amongst the farmers of this country. My inquiries do not
lead me to believe that either the landlords or the tenants, vt he
are not /exposed to the dangerous atmosphere of this House,
are affected by the panic to which those Hon. Gent,emen have
referred —( Hear, hear.) Now, I think that some Hon.
Gentleman stated in the course of this debate, that
a certain landlord in Somersetshire had offered to his tenants
to release them from their engagements, and sixty of those
tenants had refused that offer. Now, Sir, lat once admit that
that refusal on the part of the tenants is no sure criterion that
they are satisfied with the present measure—( Protectionist
cheers)—because the tenants having a large capital em-
barked in the land—( Hear, hear)—cannot suddenly with.
draw that capital without an immense sacrifice. But
having made that admission, I must contend, on the
other hand, that at the present moment we have no conclu-
sive evidence to show that the farmers generally are dissatis-
fied with this measure. Now, Sir, perhaps as this matter is of
great importance, and as I am sincerely of opinion that there is
no ground for the alarm entertained by any of the Hon.
Gentlemen on this side of the House, who sit below
the gangway, the House will allow me to sate
sonic facts that have come within my own knowledge.
I allude, Sir, to the farmers of East Lothian, in Scotland. I
have a letter in my hands from a Noble Friend of mine (Lord
Glenelg). The letter is dated February 21. He says, " I
have had an opportanity of learning the opinions of the farmers
of East Lothian and Berwickshire to a considerable extent. One
of the factors to a large proprietor in this neighbourhood
tells me that there is sot a farm in the country now to be let
but for which there are more and higher offers than have ever
been made, and that too by men of capital and skill. I
asked them (he says) how they accounted for that circum-
stance. His answer was that the corn question is now considered
to be settled, and that the prospects held out by Government
of getting their lands drained by a grant from the Treasury, in-
stead of having themselves to advance the money, has created a
general feelingof confidence throughout the country. A gentleman
who is a trustee of sonic property in the neighbourhood, has also
informed are that offers have been made for some of his farms
ten per cent. above the prices for which they at present let.
These are (be continues) facts which are worth more
than all the arguments adduced in favour of an altera-
tion of the corn-laws, coming as they do from
one of the greatest corn growers in this part of
the country." Now, Sir, allusion has been made to the
county of Gloucestershire. I will inform the House with re-
ference to the prevailing opinion upon the subject of the corn
laws, that Mr. Charterishas every chance of being returned as a
Member for that county upon the principle of an alteration
in the corn-laws. Then, Sir, I will allude to the Isle o f Ely,
in Cambridgeshire. It has been said that if the corn-
laws are repealed, the land will be thrown out
of cultivation, and the fens will revert to their primitive wild-
ness. Now, Sir, I hold in my hand a letter from a.very large
proprietor of land in that county, dated the first week of 111areh,
The letter stated that the writer had received a communication
from his agent at the Isle of Ely, stating that he had let two farms
to two intelligent men, a father and son, with ample capital,
at an increased rent of 126/. per annum. The agreement had
been entered into since the introduction of Sir R. Peel's mea-
sure, and he expressed his opinion, that facts like these were
worth more than Sgures, Now, Sir, that relates only to the rents
of land, but what has been its effect on the fee.simple value
of land. On the introduction of the measure now proposed, I
am told that several of the most eminent land- surveyors were
opposed to the alteration, but they have since altered their
opinion, and have expressed their surprise at the wonderful
effect the settlement of the corn question has had upon the
value of landed property. There is, for instance, an estate
in Essex, with which I am acquainted—and so is, I believe, a
Noble Lord opposite—which has been offered for sale for some
time past at thirty years' purchase. The rent of the property
was 630/., but for three years no offer was made for the pro-
perty— ( Hear,)—while in the last three weeks, however, an
offer had been made for the property which came up to its
value. This showed the effect the measure had had on the fee-
simple value of land, and yet it is said that the measure will
have a tendency to throw land out of cultivation. Now, with
respect to this alarm, are Honourable Members aware of the
desire which exists for inclosing land with a view to its
future cultivation. Last year we gave facilities for the in-
closing of lands, and let me just read the number of applica-
tions which have been received for leave to inclose waste lands.
In the month of September applications to the amount of
3,298 had been received. In October the number of acres
which were sought to be enclosed was 4,500. This
was under protection--extreme protection—and when there
was no expectation in the public mind that the Government
intended to propose any alteration with respect to corn.—
( Hear, hear.) But in the month of November, it was well
known to the public that her Majesty's Ministers proposed an
alteration of those laws. The applications in October to these
Commissioners were 4,578; in November, 7,847.—( Hear,
hear, and loud cheers.) In December they were 7,205;
in January, 5,600 ; and in February, 3,595 (Loud Opposie
tion cheers)—but in the first week in March there were
1,500 applications; and within the last fortnight applications
have come in from Yorkshire, each by permission of the Com-
missioners, to inclose a common of inferior land—very inferior
land—to the extent of 14,000 acres.—( Hear, hear.) Another
application has also come in from the same county for per-
mission to inclose 2,500 acres—that is to say within the last
fortnight ; two applications have come to the Inclosure
Commissioners to inclose 16,520 acres of common land,—
( Cheers.) Now, Sir, I must be permitted to call the attention of
the House to a Bill now in progress. It is a Bill for reclaim-
ing and inclosing land from the sea—to reclaim certain tracts
of land which form part of. the great estuary at Lynn.—
( Cheers and laughter.) This is not a question of growing
lands—it is not a question of inclosing waste land, but rather
the question of following the example of the Dutch, and car-
rying out the principle of . scooping counties out of the ocean
—( Hear, hear)—a most laudable and praiseworthy under-
taking. But what name is on the back of the Bill ?
The first name I find on the back of the Bill is that of Lord
George Bentinck.—(Loud cheers, and laughter.) The second
name that of Mr. Bagg, one of the Members for Norfolk.
This plan originated in 1846, when the plans of the Govern-
ment were well known to all parties.—(Hear, hear.)
Lord G. BEN TINCK—.No, no. It was projected in
November.
Sir J. GRAHAM—The capital invested is proposed to be
1,500,000/4; 200,0001. was proposed to be' borrowed:; and,
among the subscribers, the first name which I find is " William
George Frederick Cavendish Bentinck," commonly called
" Lord George Bentinck"—( Roars of laughter)—and among
the directors the first name I find is " William George Frede-
rick Cavendish Bentinck," commonly called " Lord George
Bentinck." That measure was contemplated in the last ses-
sion of Parliament, and inasmuch as it was the intentian of the
Crown to establish its claims to certain rights, there was a
negotiation entered upon between those parties and the Board
of Works, which negotiation had not, however, been brought
to a conclusion. But in the Bill before the House this year,
there was an admission of the rightsofthe Crown. The admission
is of a very remarkable kind. It is that in the contemplation
of such an immense outlay one per cent. should be paid to the
Crown • thus, on the large outlay of 500,0001., as stated in the
Bill, at least 5,000/. will revert to the Crown. Now, Sir, the
House will, perhaps, permit me to venture a question which
has been often put by the Noble Lord to my Right Hon. Friend
at the head of the Government. If the Noble Lord will allow
me, I will ask what is his estimate of the price of wheat—
(Laughter)—in the event of the Government measure being
passed?—(Continued Laughter.) Is it a matter of mere
chance that this speculation will repay its promoters? If not
a matter of chance, the Noble Lord will, perhaps, again allow
me to ask him, what is his estimate of the price of wheat, that
he has been induced to be a party to this undertaking? Now,
Sir, I will refer to the greater and more serious part of the
Noble Lord's statement, and the House will at once anticipate
that I allude to the state of Ireland. I heard last night, with
very great surprise, the statement of the Noble Lord, tint in