The Sun.
London, England, 1848-02-15 00:00:00

TUESDAY EVENING, FEBRUARY 15. 1848.

proper principle in the House to lay down that there
should be municipal institutions for New Zealand.
Mr. AGLIONBY thanked the Noble Member for
Falkirk for the manner in which he had raised the pre-
sent discussion. He urged the necessity of no longer
withholding a good constitution from the colonists.
Settlers from these islands, they were fully competent to
exercise any constitutional rights which might be ex-
tended to them. He thought that the provisions of th,
present measure threw too much responsibility upon the
Governor of New Zealand. At least the first principles
of self-government for the colony ought to be laid down
by the Government at home, to be then, if you like, ap
plied by the local governor.
Sir R. PEEL had heard with the utmost satisfaction
that there was no material difference between Lord
Grey and Governor Grey on the subject, so fruitful of
peril, the settlement of the claims to land. It was in
witht
hennutgi rhet g
thatood f
mitohs towards tcheen
snuartei e
hs
ai nd tbheiesnr epsitps es
the highest degree essential that we should act
lle
dedt
on his Noble Friend the late Secretary for the Colonies,
in relation to his view of the construction of the treaty
of Waitangi. He considered that it would be better at
once and wholly to repeal bite constitution of 1846, ac
comp :vying that repeal with the clear statement that we
were prepared to give the colony a constitution based
upon sound constitutional principles, not, however, in
the meantime, being too explicit as to the exact detail,
of those principles, or too ostentatiously putting forward
an indiscriminate application of the English constitution.
It would be necessary to wait fur Governor Grey's
deliberate opinion upon each point before any decision
was formed by the Government at home. The Govern
ment would scarcely venture, he thought, to put as the
preamble to their suspending Bill the real reasons which
induced them to frame it. He recommended the adop-
tion of municipal institutions as the best medium o'
introducing a representative system of government
But the representative system recommended to Go-
vernor Grey was, that he was to choose the electors.
He (Sir R. Peel) believed Governor Grey to be above
the usual order of civil governers; but certainly the in
structions of the Ministry would give him the power of
making as large or as small a constituency as possible,
and though Governor Grey might not be disposed to
avail himself of that power, few civil governors could
resist the temptation. What he complained of waR, the
nature of the declarations made by the Government in
respect to New Zealand. Let the Government adopt
some qualification that was intelligible. It was said
that many of the young chiefs were men of great pride;
why not, therefore, give them an elective franchise upon
some uniform scale of qualification, and thus put an end
to the possibility of rousing a feeling of enmity towards
the Government on their part ? Such were the
views he entertained on the subject, and he asked
the House to put on record its desire to adopt free
institutions, and to teach the inhabitants of New
Zealand that they were to be put on a level as British
subjects with the settlers in that colony.
Mr. LABOUCHERE objected to the introduction of
municipal institutions in New Zealand, and adhered to
the plan proposed, of giving Governor Grey the power
of granting certificates for the purpose of constituting
electors. As to the question raised respecting the con-
stitution. he considered on the whole that it was ad-
visable to suspend the constitution, and not to abrogate
it entirely, as suggested. He did not believe that after
all the proofs of interest in the prosperity of New Zea-
land which the Parliament of England had displayed
there, could be so unfounded a jalousy entertained in
that colony with respect to the suspension of the consti•
tution as was imputed to the natives.
Capt. lIARRIS was at a loss to conceive whether the
proposed suspension for five years of the constitution
granted to New Zealand was for the purpose of enabling
the natives to qualify themselves for electors by learning
to read and write English in the interim. He believed
that municipal institutions were well adapted to the
colony, and he entreated the Government to repeal the
constitution, and if at a future period it might be thought
necessary to revive it in another form, he would then be
prepared to consider that question.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER ex-
plained the instructions issued by Earl Grey to Governor
Grey with respect to the certificates to be granted by
him qualifying natives for electors under the constitu-
tion of New Zealand.

Mr. DRUMMOND stigmatised the whole proceedings
of the Government towards the New Zealanders as a
series of oppression and injustice that inflicted the
greatest dishonour on them.
Mr. M. MILNES said his Hon. Friend who had just
sat down had totally mistaken the whole tone of the
treaty of Waitangi. He believed that there never had
been a fairer attempt to raise and improve a savage
people than that which had been made by the English
colonists in New Zealand.

After an attempt by Mr. BROTHERTON to adjourn
the debate,

Sir R. INGLIS said that Government claimed supre-
macy for the Crown in Now Zealand. Now supremacy
could only ariso from first discovery, conquest. or treaty.
If Government leant upon treaty, their treaty secured
the rights of the natives, He looked upon the treaty of
Waitangi as being as binding as the treaty of Utrecht ;
and until he learned that power was to be substituted
for right ho should consider all the natives of New
Zealand as well entitled to the benefits of their treaty
as if they had been the most civilised people in the
world.

Mr. lIUTT concurred in the greater part of the
speech of the Noble Lord (Lincoln); hut he begged to
express his hope that the constitution of so important a
colony as New Zealand would not be suspended for five
years. He did not think that the substitute offered to
the settlers would be considered by them as an equiva-
lent for their constitution, and therefore he trusted that
Government would at once set themselves about putting
the affairs of the colony in a train for the assumption of
popular rights.
Mr. SCOTT regretted that the treaty of Waitangi
had not been observed. In the matter of land sales he
trusted that the spirit of that treaty would be respected.
Another hardship connected with the sale of laud was
the rule by which the natives could only sell their land
to the Governor, whose maximum price to the settlers
was 20s. the acre. He did not approve of the suspen-
sion of the constitution for five years, and doubted whe-
ther it would not have been better to abrogate it alto-
gether, waiting for a fitting opportunity to establish a
new and suitable one.

Clauses 4 and 5 were agreed to, as were the remaining
clauses, and the House resumed.
_ MONTGOMERY ELECTION.

The SPEAKER read a letter from Mr. Pugh, stating
that he had been returned for Montgomery borough by
389 electors, and that the same number bad voted for
Mr. Cholmondeley, who had since informed him that he
did not intend to defend his seat.

On the motion of Sir R. PEEL it was ordered, in
conformity with the precedent in 11th George 111.,
when a double return was made for Scarborough, that
the Clerk of the Crown should attend the House to-
morrow (this day), and amend the return, by striking
out the name of the gentleman who did not wish to sit.
IMPEACHMENT OF LORD PALNIERSTON.

Toe CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER having
moved the order of the day for going into a Committee
of Supply, formally to take a vote upon Exchequer-bills,
Mr. URQUHART said that it was notorious that the
Government had used means to prevent the motion of
the Hon. Member for Youghal being brought on, and he
therefore would move the adjournment of the ouse.
Mr. W. S. O'BRIEN seconded the motion, because
he thought that injustice had been done the Hon.
Gentleman.
Lord D. STUART said, that if be felt as the Hon.
Member for Youghal, he would certainly persist in his
motion, but would not interrupt the public business.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said, if
the Hon. Gentleman would take the advice of the Noble
Lord behind him, Government would do their best to
keep him a House on a notice-day.— (Hear.) It was
desirable for the public interest that the vote he proposed
to take to-night should be taken, as a matter of form,
before the Noble Lord at the head of the Government
made his financial statement.
The O'GORMAN MAHON admitted that he had ex-
ercised all the power he possessed to induce Members to
retire on the occasion referred to—(Laughter)—for the
purpose of marking his disapproval of what he consi-
dered the factious course pursued by the Hon. and
Learned Member (Mr. Anstey),:who had brought for-
ward his motion in opposition to the expressed wish of
both sides of the House.—(Hear.)
Mr. ANSTEY said he had given the Government, in
the early part of the evening, every opportunity to
afford him the assurance that he should have an oppor-
tunity of bringing on his motion; but no such assurance
had been given. He and other Hon. Members had re-
mained all the evening, at great inconvenience, and he
was now asked to surrender the only advantage he had
been able to obtain. If the Right Hon. Gentleman
would name a day next week for the Committee of
Supply, and fix it at an early hour, he would accede to
the request now made; otherwise, he was quite ready to
proceed. It was perfectly notorious 4hat, on the former
evening, the Hon. and Noble Gentlemen who acted as
whippers-in to the Government had used their efforts to
count the House.—(Laughter.)
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said it
was desirable that the Hon. and Learned Gentleman
might take an early day—say that day fortnight—when
his motion would probably stand first, and Government
would do all in their power to secure him a House. As
to bringing the motion on when a Committee of Supply
was fixed, he would have just the same opportunity on
any future occasion of a Committee of Supply. No ad-
vantage could be gained to-night by bringing the
motion on at this late hour.

Mr. ANSTEY agreed to postpone his motion till the
day named by the Chancellor of the Exchequer, and
hoped that good faith would be kept with him.
Tho motion was then withdrawn, and the House went
into

COMMITTEE OF SUPPLY.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said the
vote he bad to proposovas the usual annual vote for the
payment of outstanding Exchequer bills.
The vote, the amount of which was 17,543,500 L, was
then agreed to.
The House resumed and then adjourned at a quarter
after one o'clock.

-- - -
RECRUITS FOR THE ARMY.--Irswlcil.—On
Tues-
day last, several fine young men, recruits of the 95th
regiment of foot left this town en route to join the depot
in Ireland. Among the rest were two countrymen, who
came a short distance to hear the lecture lately delivered
at the Town Hall, in this borough by Mr. Plummer, on
the Folly of the Sword. The account given by the lec-
turer of the enormous sums received by the Duke of
Wellington contrasted so strongly with the miserable
pittance of 101 a day which they were receiving 'us smri..
cultural labourers, that they instantly became desir"ous
tryil:g their fort.:nes.ip the tebtKi field, and observing
Sergeant Rontree, who is recruiting for the above corps,
in the room, offered themselves as candidates for a red
coat and were accepted.—Suffolk Chronick.