The Sun.
London, England, 1825-04-14 00:00:00

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THURSDAY. E.VF.iNING- APRIL 14, 1825.

SEVENPENCV.

. .
press hi3.argtirrimits infavoter..of.lib.h.alty, at:Ei Meeting of the
preeholders, and he 'tiotfered for It. He was precluded from all
[ preferment in const,quence of that step,: .alot indeed by ti.e
'Learned and Re vcr aird-1;ord ho no* octiiPiid the Vlecest: of
Exeter,.for,..in his own, heart and conscience, be i(Lord
belieie that Rev. Lori incapable incapable ot' exerCisinf his authority
itt such lift unworthy Way. The Ault dhly Wirli ii
present much higher in the Church, but. the -Gnrate 4.-414r-
ton Povey had remained where he then .Suffcr.ing as
'he'didlor the opinion- he then e.ute'rtaiuedineegard to li.e-
--Violin claims, still he'petitioned orrtheit behalf.- 'And now that
111 e (I.ol.'d4lniland) was upon the great subject of petitior.ing the.
lickise. 'he must deny 'that his Noble Friends.ever'had refused
to'the Clergy,' in common -with others, the distiot' tight onto-
proaChing their Lordships with their , sentiments on certain
paints; but, on the other hand, he would deny that it wait u,:-
becoming or irnprOper to'netice their:vie of wellpetitioners,' or
;even to animadvert on the Statements they made. In prof:onion
to the learning of
.such ..petitioncrs, and in Constquence of the
' station they held,' it WaS the more necessary to examine the
reasonings and statements•Whicti proceeded from 'them [,;'
upon this stibject he rr u.st observe, that a fulitier,antl arn tr'p,yitY
Would rt[arsity whether by design or not, ranthrougu.a.!
'ltieif petitions: -,:fle'refefied, in saying thiS,*tielhat abase of the
liberty and power, as connected with this greaCC.it,il
question, [in conveying to in-tiger minds .rotiOnS. qiiiie dgnmint
from their..natural use. - if he understood it, was
not merely the protecting of - men's property, With the- etii4y-
. men tof personal freedom—nor did religious liberty,. be thoiq t,
Consist in the free exercise of one's own religion, by perrnissint,,
of any set of men "7/Weyer. Such a specks -of liberty 'as the
law might be enjoyed under an arbitrary-government,;, but
thii was not that lib4ty known only to truly.free Goverriti4e.ets,
and which constituted the essence ot- them. This new4litkik
sOrt of, liberty, was rather the shadow of liberty than li*kty
itself, which, in certain late petitions, had 4equ•kalleti;,;:not
artfully, as it appeared to him, political power." the iiitiPtat,-
olligy of such petitions lad figared, . most falsely, that the
object of the Catholics was
[supremacy--a transfer of power
which nobody had asked ;: for they only had
_risked what every
One riotworshiping the Virgin, or invoking Saints, Was alteruly
in possession of. There were cases, he would allow, in .whkii
it might be advisable and necessary to curtail both civil And
religioui liberty : but it was idle mockery to tell those excluded
front both,' that their • Lordships ivere • friendly to them,
therefore, the Clergy were disposedto encroach on. the sactvd
right of petitioning, by what some conceived to be an abuse of
[ that right, they lutist expect their petitions' to be noticed and
[ canvassed by Nob/e. lards. .
[..
The petition (from the WY. John Pike Jones, Curate' of
North .Povey) :wal then read, and laid oPoir the ' table of the
House.

The Bishop of EXETER, inexOlamition, said that he never
should have used the word proscribed, in reference to those pe-
titioners, whose prayer it- was peculiarly lti.4 ditty to present to
the House,, had not the expression been authorised, by the sar-
casms dealt out, agzinst them. There were many witys of dis-
couraging petitioners, short of . rejecting theta ; -but lie be-
lieved and' trusted that- the Clergy would, never be. ch..terrl'd
from petitioning by such methods as- bad lately been re-
sorted to in disfavour -of. them. -He rather thought, on the
contrary, that the opposition of scme Nuble• Lords on ti
other, side, partaking more of zeal than discretion, would
create more such petitions than they zither had expected tur
wished.
LOrd KING observed, that he'was arse -the Clergy Ware
proscribing the Catholics, but they certainly were not proscrib-
ing themselves. *
The Bishop of L kNDAIT could not consider the present
quvstion in the light which some Noble Lords viewed' it, mertly
as ft Cilia question., or matter of policy, amitiothivig more.
cording to his conception of the •point, it was, eminently th,t
question which mast concerned the Established Church, atml
upon Which its Clergy :were in duly. bound to 'Petition- 'thel.•
'Lordships. Ariten,, however, the propel*, .titto
ctriie,, it- would 0444 e. -difficult to silt tv, ho.di on civil and.
religious rounde; that the Clergy were taking the only step
which it behoved thtto to take at this crisis. The petition
he had to present was from the Ari;lnloacon. and f-Aergy
of the Diocese of Oxford, who were candid in their state-
ments, and, he hoped it hardly need be added; respectful
iu their knguage. But if every such petition, when &rend
to t 4 is House, was regularly so be assailed, end subjecttd-;to
•n elaborate discussion, it would be rather hard upon the
Clergy. • -
The petition- was read, and laid upon the table cif the House.
The Bishop. of CII EsT.E it rose to present ,a petition from
, the Clergy of Manchester, which was (the Rev. I:istiop said)
Signed by 41-Clergymen. On movi:T, the readii:-, cf this De_
tition, he observed, that he could not, afterwhat had passed, but
express his satisfaction at finding that the petitions of the Clervy
had at length found their level. He had also-to congratubite
the. House upon the admission matte by a Noble' Lord+Oppnsite
anti station that even such
Ce...nw;a.rsse'ionwir.in.gßtuott,hliheaisrtiojw.:
nion, the distinction drawn by dm Noble Baron,.with.respect
to liberty and power, was like restriction and punishment— even
that Noble Baron wind admit that curtailment and restrictians
on the liberty of the sul.,;cct might happen to be_proper. Wes
it not possible, then, that a bbtly of pcoOe inigh'tholei such ot4-
nions as rendered them not proper to be admitted to condu th ct e
-business of' the &ate. Whenever the opinions of any Sewaf
persona were inimical to the civil peitty they were -unlit to be
entrusted with the civil power. The question was,.ultimately,
this--whether the Roman Catholics should be admitted to rule
their brethren and fellow-subjects ? This evil might, or might
not, be-proximate, but, if further concessions were again to Lw
made, it was among those contingencies from the effect of whirl
it was:proper to guard. With respect to the Clergy, it coi4ld
not be asserted, with even the appcarahce of candidfaith, tlytt
in their petitions they, had dictated.to their Lordships the pr.f-
else course it becapie.the- Route-to. adopt ; but they certrad7v
had 'stated their opinions.-opinions which, concerned theist ritst-
much'individualiy as professionallyi and froin:' which it wits
impossible for such characters, to tl'irink rilthout a derelithon
from the duty they owed. both to Church and State. •

PA iti,I,A.AIENT,

HOUSE OF LORDS, APRIL 13.

Parliament having adjOurned on the 3lst of March last,
over East.i, their Lordships met again this morning rt ten
o'clock, when prayers bz:ing te4d by the Bishop of Gloucester,
the House proceeded to business.

The LORD DEPUTY now called for the Appeal .of fleslop
RaWson and -others," brou,;ht Writt of Error from the
-Coup of King's Bench,. Wt:staiirlster, which judgment was
zitirmed with 120/. costs.

Tiumbull v. Tawse," ,from. the Court of Session was oiler.
wards heard outs being partly ti:lrd before Easter ; but th 6
judo Went teas deferred.
ame v. Cunningharne"• was re_
t,,mtd and 'continued', and the further h:aring was appointed
air 'Friday next..

•APPELLATE PEllll9.—Lrd Howard of Effiingham, Lord
Delaware, and the Earl Kingston.
Lord OIFFORD res,e exactly at four o'dock, and at'twenty
i;ast the Lord Chancellor entered the House.

• 'Mr. 'Ludlow, from the Harbour Master's Port •of ..Ijandon
Offiee,s.presenteda.naccount of the number of ships which had
moored in that Port during a certain rwhiber of 1:-.,nrs,- inpur-
suance of. an Order of this fiou.e..
ANTI-CATHOLIC PETITIONERS.

. _
Lord HOLLAND, in explanaion, said, the questiQn
nott h?ther the Catholics should obtain rule over us, but.2#l-
- we would permit them to rule.thenrsi4vei. liis inearint
might .be illustrated. .bY a poet, though not of Much -autlitkrlt,
,
but Iyho maintained that the man whose.freedom hid hy,
•ferance, and at the another,.wa3 never free. 2

Lord ROLLS presented a petition •frorn-the Inhabitants of
Great Torrington, in Devonshire, who prayed,. that. the. hill
pending in the other House, for the,rernoysl of the Rorritia Ca._
tholic Disabilities, might nu•._ in the event of its coming up to
this „House' be suffered by their Lordships to pass into a. Law.
Read, ardlaid upon the t: ble, • .
~ • ~ , .
The Pislion of EXETER said, that he- had to present three
,
FEtitiOTIS on Ell'e gattle subject, not, llov.-,-,Ver. from the Clergy,
I,ut ;r n'. ott!,:r inhabitant: of his D o?S'.'. The first,Petitiou
vas fru,n the Parish of Kemwin, in Cornwall.; the. second
was. &on, the:Pa-o*h of St. Lawrence, in the City of Exeter i
and the other was from. the Parish of Norton Bi",ihOp,iii".the
County of Devon. He had also a petition fromthe ilrehk4a..
cony'of TOtnew in his o*rn Diocese, which was agreed, to with
only one dissentient voice,, when an amendment had heert,pro..
pcised‘to be'rriade, which was not adopted, 'late 13;ter.pOtitio
n
was-liberal' in' *Cranium, and respectful in langUage.- With
reg,aitt to its tendency:, it would he found that the 'etitioners
subjects it, ~t important to their pe-
did 'not presume to' offer, much less to. obtrude, their. advice;
but, at Ole tattie time, they 'elairned.for themselves' the, privilege
i)cifi;3it:rttiii-t.ltiieoir
s°,PannitginslotTie aeptaintarice with whose bearins
might be iis.sumed on their part. g
.
Cord KING ronarked, that the Archdeacen, Whose ~;;•nature
A bleat-van i .. ~
the petition 'hore,hati been 1-!‘n .
he lately resigned his seat in the Corporation, , , ,
th.:,,;, insan,e he had not been Misinformed. The -Areh-
The Bishop of :EXETER could assure the Noble ParOn,
that in
oflice, and he
sat' in a corporate eapr.city, oh'
itt-'‘'l"nsatitretilse'whiett related to his family interests '''
deacon:,
accont4 0 A .
d that
(Itisho of Exeter) could. assure the Noble ,-,
).t,, IteVerend 13rotheir°rmhaedriince. rosi„,:nnerayO
P Baron that he was
glad of it.
than ~,,,,,in he never had known a worthier 'b
deacon. • or 'better
... .
'.
Lord ROLLE added his testimony
man.. • , ,
• •
took occasion to at' veri
Lord HOLLAND
.. 8 , t to the petition just
• ' ted to their Lordship ITOM t.lll Archdeamir _ .
Presen r, 1 • d and Reverend Lord (Natio Y
in the
l)inceseot the ,e,irrie of Exeter),
the only that their I '
prayer of whoSeClergy. /40rXs.iips wound
teese ' •
refuse to the Catholic subje.
of tfPierivileges which they and
others had long enjoyed bY vq...so hadr c:ivilelaini. The same
Learned and Reverend 1.,,0rd, in presenting his last'
as if th
etition ,rfoke of the Cier.Y .• he' in
were proscribed peti..'
P ' '' , i d Holland's) side of the moi , ,
tieners by. h is k por
.ise , but the'
, now to preient, c'arne' •
huinble petition lielau p 1 from an indivi-;
ailed pro,,,-1
dual who might indeed be•c , 1 et petitioner, hince,'
in;ed LO.-2'-
00101.01 a Curate, he had pres... .
In
pnetition their Lordships
on a subject of a civil nature, andstoodopposition tO the very'
North l'urzy,• in the county
great nr.ijority of his
cast~
'l'°hfeDPeevilini°;!) 17141 tuoryi
ne°.nt fht
u. the
ventured
i. Itao'
(.:irate
uee bith:c:_f-tl:

The Ei,lnyr) of CIIESTER then pri.nnted a petition from
the Clergy, .10.:;-if,:;%tes. and other Inhabitants of the town of
Bolton-le.lllcor,, in :he County Palatine of Lancaster, •prayir-g
that no further ccnceloll3 might be grunted to the Roman Ca-
= -

Lord KENYON presented a pecition,. to the-s:iiie eff:ct. fiom
Elockington, to Shrop;thire.
The 'Bishop of .111.01.7CESTER Piespr.ted-petitions to -C:e
same effect, from the Clergy of several rurril'Deanerics in his
Diocese. , •

Lord KING said,- that the per:;ons wham those peti-
tions came, seemed to rnaintairi •Ole e..aracter "given of them by
Lortl43larendon, who had s-aiti,—he did .not remember the ex-
act words,-----that of all person: could read' and write- die
clergy were -the worst -.at• gig'' y advice. 'ln thfi!trc4nt cast,
they came forward to advise Parliament not Ito -do tie 6t(
possible' goi3d at the least possible expence,. What yyt,uld 41;e
King of Prassia say, if- his Lutheran clergy" wer'S 'perpetually
.giving, him advice, hoW he sheithl deal with' his,CXtholic sub-
jects,--if they wero to, tell h:m he ought:trot-to alb-14 hem to
the enjoyment of avirrighrs.? He thought the King of Prussia
'Would 'sdy, "'Gentlemen, mind your...spititii'lll Con-err,s. Are
You ministers of •peace,-who•thus-endeavour • to- ptorocte dis-
cord r. In fact, the King of Prussialtoukl not afoul to be-
intolerant, and he did riot think this Goverrunent could afford it
shy lotiger. • • • '•• - •

l:Che.hishop of GLOCESTER'replied,• that 'the Clergy had
a rig.ht to present petitions, and would always come forward.
boldly and manfully to state, their. opinions in SO• ."4
castie observations which niiiht be thrown cut 'againq
e of any sv., -
If the Noble Lord had arbitrary power,. he .would, perk. s?,
deal with the clergy as he supposed the King of Prussia would,
and' instead of receiving thetropinions, WoUld tell them thfy
'were improper persons to give any opinion.' • '
THE EQUITABLE LOAN BILL.
. The Earl 'of LAUDERDALE presented a petition against
the Equitable Loan Bill .from..the' pawnbrokers of London,
Westmuister, and the hOrough of. Southwark. tie afterwards
presented petitions from almost every parish in the metiopolis
and'its.envtrons. On presenting the tirst petition„, he_ said that
thi petitioners had applied 'to the other House 'of 'PArltairient, in
the hope of preventing the passing of this Bill; and had offerttl
tp prove that the Equitable Loan Company was an .illegal asso-
ciation under the 6th Geo: 6014116111 y the Bubble
Act, but' that they were prevented frein'previrig•the'allegatioh's
in their petition by their Cornmitte to whom. the big 'Was refer.
red. That Committee, the petitioners stated; consisted chiefly
ef directors and proprietors of the said company —Adjournesl/