The Sun.
London, England, 1813-12-04 00:00:00

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT.

HOUSE OF I.oltDs, Eau)Ay, Mc, 3.
In the Appeal, " Andrew v. Min-dodo," judgment was post-
poised Monday.
In an Appeal from the .Conrt of Session in Seotland, "'Duff
v. the. Magistrates ant the Town Council of InverneA.," Sir
Samuel Romilly and Mr. Wetherell were.heard for
patient, and Mr. Adam and Mr. Grant for the Respondents. '
7--Judgment on Monday. •
'ln an i‘ppeal from the Court of Chancery in Ireland,
*" Hone V. Davies and others," Sir Samuel Itoinitiv and Mr.
Hart were heard for the •appellent.—Further h'eailtig oh
.Moticl.!.y.' • -,
The New South Wales. Debts hill
.was read a third time and ,
passed.
The Madder Duties. Bill, the •Exelletutr Bills Bill, the Lo-
cal
Militia Bill, and the Scuts Salt Bill, passed through Com-
mittees, and were reported. -
The Mutiny Bill, the Sugar Bill, the Wateh and Ward Bill,
the Militia Amendment Bill, and st Road Bill, were broiticht
up from the CounnOns by Me. Imshingteu, Mr, Lyttletun, 111111
other Members, and read a licit time.
Mr. Kingston front. the India House, presented a Res-olu-
tion of the Court of Directors, fur granting 40001. to the fa- •
mily of the late Major-Generai Agnew, which was ordered to
lie on the tabis.
UNSOLIrIiNT'DEBTORS. •
Lord Ettimnottouon's temporary Insolvent Bill was read
a third time and passed,rAdjourtsed till Monday. , •

HOUSIi:OP COMMONS.
A Petition from the Debtors confined' in York 0141, was
presenti'd by Mr. Ito and ordered to tie on=the
On the motion of Sir W. Guam, the London Militia )44
lt
was committed, and the Report "was ordered to he brought'up
on Monday.
Mr. Kingston, from the Ea-qt Indiallonse, presented at the
'barn Copy of the Resotidbit' of the Directors, granting a cer-
tain sum (40001. as we understood) to the family of the late
General Agnew.
The New Brandy Duty Bill was read a wand time and'
committed tot to-morrow.
The Militia Volunteer Amemlanent
and the Watch and
Wad Bill were read a third tine and passed.
INSOLVENT DEBTORS' BILL,
Mr. LOCKIIART Said, that as the original Birl, to
amend which this had been passed by the other

!louse, Lad, in the last session,' been, surrere4 to
go thiough this•-i-louse without any discussion,
0" even comment, for-the purpose of liberating a
lai.ge bony of Unfortunate persons. confined for
dent, he thought it ncresSary now to call the at-
tention -of the llou,q to a few observations
which he wished to 11::11,c On the principle of the
in.ginal Thtit principle went to operate an
extensive alteration io the established law of the
land, Os it related todebtor and,credi tor ; and it woulq
benecessary to onsider what would be the effect of
.the Bill. The crowded state of our gaols had,
front time to time, for many years past, made
it necessary to pastemporary iwolvent Bills, fur
the purpose or clearing them, though the legisla=
.titre were always convinced of the evil tendency
of them, The principle of the original bill, which
Was to continue for four years,' was to provide a
Oermatient law for the liberation of persons con-
fined for debt ; that Act had been found.defeetive,
but the amenthnent bad rennived all the objections
to it. He thought the Legislature ought to mo-
dify:the law, as r it now stands on this sub-
jeer. The' crowded state of our gaols had
been frequently attributed to • the obduracy of
creditors ; but, he could not believe that to
be the case. He thought it Was more owing
to-the e,:travagance and prolligacy'of debtors. If
the legislature relaxed too melt, it would give en-
couragement to the thoughtless, the extravagw.t,'
and 'profligate, to the great injury of the fair cre-,:
ditor, and to the morals -of the country. By this'
Bill debtors were to he liberated after three
Aonths4,sonfinement. Ile thought the term not
long entnigh,. It would hold out a temptation,to
the young and itiexperieneed,;. and much more to
those of bad. principles, to obtain as much pro-
perty as possible by running in debt, and then free
themselveS; by an imprisonment of such short du-
ration.‘. Another objection was, that the creditor
had now power to come before a commissioner mid
give up all his property, as Wai the case of the cessio
banornin in Scotland, on the principle of which this'
bill was said to be founded. The debtor had
,time
• power of liberating himself at the end of three
months if he chtise; hut if he possessed a freehold
or leasehold landed estate, an annuity, and various
tither kinds of property, he might stay in a. jail,
and live upon it as he thought 14, the cre-
ditor %vas left to console himself with the ti ldititin
of heavy costs to the loss of his original debt.—
lle thought, also, there should be a difference
in the period of conenement between those who
immediately 'suffered, odgment, and those who
by every species of' delq ,vhich the law id-
lowed, putt- their creditors to all possible ex-
pense, and frequently Made the costs rise to
five • times the' amount of •the debt. Another
objection,was, that the Bill was too great a de
viation from the law at present established, and
would, he feared, be
,productive of the curtail-
ment of Credit, which, to persons carrying on va-
rious small branches of. trade, would be a serious
' grievance.
.Another °hive:ion was, there was a
clause in the. Bill which said, that-no person con-
fined for damages in eases of criin. con. or other
it:a/kiwis injury, should have the benefit of the.
Act, unless confined five months. What was the
construction to be put On the expression malicious
injury ? It 'Might, perhaps, be extended to all
.liain4of fraud ; anti if that slicald he the constroc-
-tion,.persous might commit all those with impu-
nity, excqt imprisonment for five month 3. After
mentioning several other cases of hardship, he'
said the 13i11, in his opinion, %teat too fair; but
as he did not mean to oppose its progress, he
hoped the subject would be debated in future ses-
sions of the present Parliament. It wits only by
freqneat discussions, and by Gentlemen of abilities
lending their aid, that this Bill could he made a
valuable permanent part of our code of laws, and
productive of real benefit to the comMunity. , -
Sir S. koratt.LY said, that great part of what
had fallen from the Honourable; and Learned Gen-
tleni.in did not apply to this Bill, which had [teen
passed for a particular purpose of ha...n[lll4y, and
which it was desirable should be passed as soon
as• possible. There was no doubt taut sZnne fur-
titer- vrovisons ,would be made. :Many. poiuts
petitioned by the Honourable, Gentleman cer-
tainly deserved the attention of the Hoose, and
he hoped a Bill or Bills would hereafter be
brought forward to correct and amend tho.se defects
'in the law. lie alluded particularly. to
'which was suffered to take place, to the grd'
'of the creditor, by the allowance'cif writs o i•
where no error lay, but which caused many months
delay, merely to obtain so much money in the
shape of fees.. Thlt part of the law ought un-
questionably to ipe umended and he saw uo vett-
'son why real and other species of landed e3tates
should not be made liable to the payment of debts.
So convinced was he of the propriety and justice
of this, that he was determined, woo alto— the
recess, to move for leave to bring in a Bill to that
effect. : •

The 13111 was then read n second time, and or-
dered to be ennunitted to-morrow.,
coIrtIITTEE 'OF' SUPPLY.

The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER moved,
that the estimates on the table be referred to the
Committee of Supply. Ordered.
The.; House then 'vent into the Committee, in
which

Lord l'',l.mF.us•rox said, that as he meant only
to move for stuns on account, he should postpone
troubling the HouSe.with any detail till after the
,reeess, i-Ic then moved the several items which
make up the 6,000,000/. already agreed to by the
Committee, on neCount, for the ordinary service of:
the year lBl4l,whieli were severally read and agreed
to. He then moved, that a suit nOt eXeeetiMg
3,000,0001. be granted to his Majesty, on account,
for the extraordinary service far the same year,
which was agreed to.

LACE ritAME BILL

The order or tho day being refl(L for the House
to go into "'Committee oil t►►e Lace Fr.ut►e Bill,

The ATTORNEY-GENERAL rose to state to the
House, previous to the Speaker'l-kaving the chhir,
the outline of what was proposed by the altera-
tions intended to be made an the Committee. He
then-recapitulated the reasons which weighed with
the Legislature to pass the original Bill, and the
good effects it had priAuced, viz. the entire quell-
ing of the disturbances. If,- by the terror of the
law, men' could be made to keep the peace, it
might be' desirable to continue so harmless aaa
experiment for a short titp. Great objects us,

hiy.f.Yever, ,bdeo made td eontillte El.e il.! •
natty Of death, by an linnoutable
friend of his (Sir S. Romilly), and several
A•hosc opinions t t. C deserving of every atten:;.;n,
he-nieant, when:the ihtise was in the i2olawittee,
to prOpose that the punishment of deAth ~h;ml,l
cease, and.th:tt
,it should he transportation for li 'et
instead of I 1 years at the most, or seven years at
the least, as in the 28th of the King and
:her, that a power should be given to the'Judqd
to lessen the punishment according to his disere.,
thm, lle should also propose a clause tO put
prthccutors iu Ihe.sante state as in ail other CfißCs
for felony, lie concluded by moving, that it bd
an in Arlietion to the said Goltttuittee to alter an 1
amenfl the said :Act.-7-Ordered.
Sir'S. llomtt.LY said, he thought it would be
better 'to drop the present Bill"elltirelyl and bring
in another Bill with the proposed ena4lmeots.
The House then went into the Committee, and
after sonic conversation, the further bon,iideratiou
of the Report lvas fixed for Monday next.
Mr. Lot !Ain' postponed his notice at a motion resprrt,.
ins. Insolvent Debiors, till Friday next. • '
.1 'Message (roil; the Lords inNrthed• the tionse of their
.Lordships Concurrence to the NewSouilt Wales llebtots ;
and that their Lordships had ps.ssed a Bill fur the s2eedy
charge. 01 the !nsolvent DebtorS of England, to nhich they'
desired the k onentrenee of ,that

The mil then read a tirszt tine, and ordered to lie read
a second time to-mtL•row.—Adjtiurned.

OLD BAILEY.

F9itt;•E It r

Yesterday John Drew May, late a bill broker 'hi
the city, was indicted for forging, altering, end
publishing as true, a navy bill, drawn by the Cow
inissioners; for 7.31: 'l3s. 'which was. altered
to 17321. by.adding the firir figure of-one thereto,
with intent to'defrand the cernmissioners of the
Navy Board. This case occupied 'nearly the whole
day, but the facts lie in a very narrow compas• .
'Me. Ford, clerk at the Victualling Office, proved
that the bill was drawn under his inspection, and
was made payable at nine months to a Mr. Kings-
forth, for value received. Witness delivered it •to
Elliot and Co. ngent3 to Mr. Kint.sforth, and he
proved the"signateres- of .the ComuJisiioners..ne
bill was traced through different hands 'until ,it
found its way to the prisoner On the Ist of July,
when it bore its real value, 7321. The prisoner
personally presented the bill altered to 1732/. to
Bruce and Warren, bill-brokers, to get it dis.
counted. The bill was discounted' at the house of
Bruce, Simpson and Co. bankers The prisoner
was proved to have received money for thehill,
part of which lie paid into his bankers. The bill at
length found its %Amy back to the drawer,when
the alteration was discovered. It was next proved
that the Ptisoaer's clerk (Lathey), his brattier in
law, was high in his confidence, and that he had
cheques with theprisoner's signature not filled .up,
and in the prisoner's absence he was accustomed
to fill them up. Some. stress was laid on this err.
eirmstance by the prisoner's Counsel to shew the
probability of Lathery having made the alteration
in the bill.

'the prisoner being asked, if he hkd.any obser-
vations to ;nuke, addressed the Jury with miteh
feeling, observing, 'C that hot Only his,life, but,
what was infinitely !dearer to him than life, his
character and honest fame., Was 'now' in their
hands. He was one of. eight children, and hail
received a -liberal atra-cirtrous -cdneation:; and, till
the moment of this accusation, had lived with cre-
dit and reputation. lie was coa..-erit that his life
should he forfeited, if any nun could say' he had
-been wronged by hint. He [mud been breil to hit,'ii-
nesS, had ii wife and three children, and 'atter the
labour of the day, was wont to seek domestic
in the boSoin of his family. Was it.probahle, that
a man so circumstanced would have c,ommitted the
crime of Which be wits accused, and bring ihame
•and misery on those who were netiveyt and de:trest
to his heart ? There %vas ucr ,proof-that he had
forged .the hill—none that he had'uttered it know-
ing it to be forged ; the case rested upon mere
suspicio, and upon such suyTicion any num might
be pliiced at that bar. He bud reposed tiulimited
confidence in,his clerk, 'slid hacl left blank cheiptes
with him to fill Atp. 'lli* clink was. now inyond
his mach ; not, if he were not, could he be
'obliged to anawer any queition that might crimi-
nate, himself. Should the Jury entertain airy
doubts in his case, the Judge would tell' them,
that heuthe pri,oner, should have the benefit of
those doubts. He made no compliant Oil the sub-
ject of the prosecution..—none Of the manner in
which' it had been conducted ; and he Was certain
that the public. prosecutor, having discharged his
ditty, would be the first to 'rejoice at his tte-
quittal."

. .
The Judges in.srtniraing• up, observed, that it
could he of no advantage io Lackey to .alter t.he
bill, Ile, it appeared, was not to be f(juuti,
it was proved, that the bill was left iii Hi,. i-
soner's hands in its original state,. and that it'had
beenaltered 'whilst in his posseission„
The Jury retited,nearly three hours, and return,
eel a verdict,

Harry GrillithY'wo indicted for disposing of a
forged Bank note, with intent to defraud the Go-
vernor and Company of the Bank of England.-t-
The principal witness against the prisoner was, as
Mr. GURNEY described him, a very bad character,
of the mune of Wurnain, who had lately left Wor-
cester' gaol, and he was entitled to credit as
far as his testimony wits corroborates! by
.cabers.
This witness stated, that he had been employed by
Avery and another otlicer to detect the prisoner.-.-
Witiw,s was acquainted with a man under
sentence Of death in Novgate, who recommended
him to the prisoner to purchase forged netts.--,
Witness first met Griffiths on the I thlt of July in
Carey-street,, and he introduced itiMself by inquir-
ing about this prisoner and Newgate, and he
.01'-
ler:tett to lanicut such a eiretunstance, as he want-
ed some screens (forged noteS). The prisoner
immediately offered to supply him, and Ho ap-
pointment was made to meet the next day for that
purpose. The officers •Itunished witness with a
marked. IL note, and- on the following day tai
bought two forged flutes Of the prisoner for ten
shillings each. 'On. seeing the. prisoner again the
next day, he did not like the iwte witness gave
him, and returned it, and got n pound's worth of
silver. On cross-examination by Mr. ADOLPH US,
the witness prevaricated much, and stewed
self the character M. GURNEY fiad exhibited him.
The Jury retired for half an hour, and acquitted
the F'tioner.