The Sun.
London, England, 1831-08-17 00:00:00

NEW WRIT.

Lord STORMONT moved that a writ might issue far
the election of a Member for the borough of Armagh.

Sir G. CLERK called the attention of the House to
a subject deeply affecting the privi:egee of Parliament.
He alluded to the delay which had taken place in returning
the writ issued for the election of Members for the borough of
Great Grimsby. The writ had been issued on the 2d inst.
and the election was completed on the 10th; and yet,
although the two gentlemen elected came ta town on Friday
to take the oaths and their seats, and had attended for that
purpose on Saturday, yesterday, and to-day, it appeared that
no return hid been made by the Sheriff. Ile was certain
that the House would agree with him that there was no
question to which they ought to look with greater jealousy
than that the number of Members should be complete,
and for that purpose various Acts had been passed. But with
regard to the returning officers being compelled to make im-
mediate returns to writs, the Inv was considerably re-
lazed. He conceived it a great breach of the privi-
leges of the House, if a returning officer delayed making
a return one hour after the election. Upon enquiring, lie
found that the last occasion on which the House took
notice of the delay in the return of a writ was in the
year 1806, when the Sheriff of the city of Water-
ford neglected to return a Member. On that occa-
sion the Deputy Cie' le of the Crown had been or-
dered to attend the House, and to state whether any re-
turn had been made from the Sheriff. The Hon. Baronet
should adopt that course and moved accordingly.
Lord ALTHORP agreed with the Right Hon. B ironet
that it was not merely the duty of the House to see that
its Members were complete, but still more its duty to
prevent any trick.—(Hear, hear.)
The Clerk of the Crown-office, having attended at the bar,
was examined, and stated that no return had been made
up to this morning front Great Grimsby.
Sir G. CLERK should follow up the course pursued in
the Waterford case, by moving that the Sheriff of Lin-
colnshire and the returning officer for Great Grimsby
be ordered to attend the bar of the House on Friday next.
After a few words from Lord ALTHORP, Sir THOMAS
FREEHA HTLE, and Sir Joust WROTTESLEY, the question
was agreed to.
Mr. KENNEDY begged leave to ask the Lord
Advocate a question relating to some occurrences,
which, on the 12th of July last, had agitated that
part of the country with which he was connected,
he meant the county of Ayr. The disturbances to
which he alluded had been the cause of much alarm ;
lives had been lost, and certain persons had been in-
dicted for their participation in them.--(Hear, hear.)
It was rumoured that interferences unknown to the law
had been made in behalf of one about to be tried for his
life, by a distinguished individual unconnected with that part
of the county where the events took place, and he was
ment desirous that a satisfactory answer should be given.
The LORD ADVOCATE Said, in respect to general
rumour, and as far as the precise information which he
had received was concerned, the Hon. Member was
correct. Such an interference had taken place, and he
had directed immediate inquiries as to the accuracy and
extent of it to he made, but he had yet received no posi-
tive answer.

Mr. lIUME postponed his motion respecting the
Bishopric of Derry for one week. He did not oish to in-
terfere with the progress of the Reform Bill, and hoped
no advantage would be taken of this postponement for
filling up the office to which his motion referred.
The flox. MameEn then moved for an account of ad-
vances made out of the Consolidated Fund, by the promo-
tion of Exchequer Bills, for the carrying on public works in
Ireland.

Lord ALTIIORP moved the order of elre day for the
House resolving into a Committee on the Reform Bill.
Lord VALLETORT request& some explanation on the
subject of France. In doing so, he thought he did a favour to
Ministers. He knew their desire was for peace,
but peace, desirable as it was, might be too dear
a price for the compromise of a nation's honour. The
transaction to which he alluded was, that the French
Government had, since their attack upon Lisbon, taken pos-
session and expressed a determination to keep all Portuguese
ships that were lying in the Tagus, except two
schooners, at the time of the attack. If the information
he had received was correct, and if Government could give
no more satisfactcry explanation of it than had been
given by France, he would say that the fleet of
Sir Edward Codrington might have been employed
much more for the honour and interest of the country than
in laying at anchor in the Downs, or cruising in the Scheldt
to crush the efforts of Holland. He trusted some satisfac-
tory answer woti'd be given.
Lord PALMERSTON said, as to facts the N,,ble Lord
tvas correctly informed. All the Portuguese ships of war
were considered as spoils of war. They were taken, and
the line. of-battle ships were given up, it appearing on
investigation that they had not taken any part or share
in the action. If an opportunity were granted him, and
if a charge were made that hit Majesty's Ministers had not
duly supported the honour of the country, or fulfilled the
obligation imposed upon them by duty, he would defend
their conduct, to the satisfaction he was sure of the country,
and,to the credit of Ministers.

Mr. COMITENAY wished to ask the Noble Lord
whether, if a war of aggression was made upon our ally,
Portugal, it was nut one in which this country would be
bound to interfere?

Lord PALMERSTON should certainly decline to an-
swer any such question. If there was any Hon. Member
who thought that in matters connected with foreign policy
the Government had not done their duty, let that Hon.
Member submit such a question to the House; and when-
ever it was brought forward he would undertake to say
that the Gm'ernment would be able, as well as willing, to
defend their conduct.

Mr. COURTENAY should take. an early opportunity
for that purpose.

REFORM.
The order of the day for the House resolving itself into
a Committee on the Reform Bill was then real.
hlr. PAGET called the attention of the Noble Lord
opposite to the manner in which the Bill was now printed.
He was understood to state that some clauses were in-
serted which ought not to have been there. He also made
some observation upon the 18th clause of the Bill, but,
owing to the confusion which prevailed in the House, his
remarks did not reach the gallery.
Lord ALTHORP's answer was also inaudible.

Mr. PAGET then referred to other clauses of the Bill,
which, he said, gave the Commissioners a discretion as to
the incorporation of parts of parishes. That discretion
would, in some cases, operate disadvantageously. There
was the borough of Leicester for instance, in which parts
of certain parishes were within the present limits of the
borough, but the whole of these parishes had long been
comprised within the town. Now he wished to know
from the Noble Lord, whether it was the intention of Go-
vernment to confine the precincts of the borough to those
within which the borough now existed, or whether they
intended to include other parts of the town?
Lord ALTHORP had answered several times, that

where a part of the parish came into the centre of the
town, the whole of the parish was to he taken into its limits.

Mr. WARBURTON feared that the it4th clause would
not give the Commissioners the power to carry the Noble
Lord's intentions into effect.
MAntiMiSSION OF SLAVES.

Lord ALTHORP was about to move that the House do
resolve itself into a Committee on the Reform Bill, when
Mr. BRISCOE said, he wished to put a question to
the Noble Lord respecting the manumission of slaves. A
short time since he bad asked the Noble Lord whether
orders had not been sent out to emancipate the slaves in the
colonies belonging to the Crown, when the Noble Lord, to
his surprise, answered him in the negative. By merely
changing the form of his question, he believed he should
obtain an answer in the affirmative; and he trusted he
should, for such an answer would beshailed with delight
throughout the Empire. He now wished to ask the Noble
Lord, whether orders had not been sent out to the Crown
colonies to emancipate those slaves that belonged to, and
were part of the property of the Crown ?
Lord ALTHORP had certainly been surpri,ed at the
question put on the former occasion by the lion. Gentle-
man, because it was impo.sible that any such orders could
have been given. With re,pect to the question as it was
now put, he answered that such orders had been sent out.

' that an humble address be presented to his Majesty, pray-
' ing that he would lay before the House, as early as pending
negotiations would permit, information showing how far
neutrality had been observed or violated during the pre
sent war by States bordering on Poland, and especially by
Prussia. Also with reference to the passage of bodies of
troops near the neutral frontiers—the supply of provi-
sions. arms, aminun;tion, or aid of any kind, or the free
transit of merchandiv, &c.
Lord PALMERSTON said that he could not concur in
the motion, and did not intend to follow the Hon. and
Gallant Member through the discussion into which he had
entered, of the various transactions within the last few
months connected with the unfortunate war between Rus-
sia and Poland. He was sure that the House would believe
that the Government of this country could not have wit-
nessed that contest without the deepest tegret, and that it
would 1),2 most satisfactory to than to see it terminated.—
(Hear, hear.) At the same time he w..s convinced the
House would feel that, if he entered into a discussion of
the merits of the cause of the two parties—of the circum-
stances out of which the war had arisen—of the conduct
of other nations in reference to that contest—he should be
widely departing from that line which it was his duty as a
Minister of the Crown to observe.—(Cheers.) The mo-
tion in its present form (lid not require the production of
papers : the fitness of laying them before Parliament was
made to depend upon a contingency, and he suggested to
the Hon. and Gallant Member that he might wait until
the period arrived when the documents could be produced
without injury to pending negotiation'. He trusted that
the House and the Hon. and Gallant Member would not
think that he was wanting in respect to either, if, without
going into details, he simply entreated that the motion
should be negatived, without requiring him to enter at a'l
into the question.—(Hear.)
Mr. HUME was unwilling to prolong the discussion,
but he trusted that the Noble Lord would not refuse to

satisfy the just expectations of thole who took a strong
. . .

interest in the war between Poland and Russia. The Noble
Lord would not deny that the five Great Powers at the
Congress of Vienna (always ready enough to maintain other
engagements) bound themselves by treaty to maintain the
rights and privileg sof the Poles. The Poles were placed
under the protection of the States of Europe, and on that
ground the British Government ought to show that they
had a disposition at least to consider their claims. Ile
(Mr. Hume) was sorry that this country had been a party
to the stipulations at the Congress of Vienna ; but as Mi-
nisters had taken such a strong interest in the affairs of
Holland and Belgium, it became them to take care that
the liberty of the Poles was equally secured. He would
not require the Noble Lord to disclose anything that would
interfere with the progress and success of measures he
was willing to believe the British Cabinet had adopted,
but he had hoped that the Noble Lord would declare his
intention to maintain the treaties n gociated by Lord Cas-
tlereagh in 1815. The proceedings of that Noble Lord
on that occasion slid him more honour than perhaps any
' other act of his life. To him the Poles were mainly in-
debted for the stipulations to secure them a Constitution
distinct from that of Russia He had expected that the
Noble Lord would have admitted the rights of the Poke,
and that they were entitled at our hands to as touch jus-
tice as we had endeavoured to secure for Belgium or Hol
land. He had, therefore, heard with great regret the
'Meagre, or rather the no answer of the Noble Lord. He
was sorry that more had not been said ; and sure Le Wile,
that what 11;1,1 been said did not maintain the honour and
character of England towards Poland. He begged to
enter his protest against such partiality as the British Go-
vernment seemed in this instance disposed to show. A
nation nobly struggling for its liberties was entitled to the
benefit of latitude of construction, and the weight and in-
fluence of Great Britain ought to have been thrs,wn into
the scale. A. far as had come to his knowledge, not one
of the great Powers had shown the least sympathy, or
hail taken measures for maintaining good faith towards
Poland. No individual in the three kingdoms could be
less anxious than he was to drive Ministers into a war,
but he contended that an equal measure of justice was
due to the Poles as to the Dutch and Belgians.
Lord PALMERSTON added, that he hoped that noth-
ing he had said, and nothing he had omitted to say,
would lead any man to supposes that the British Govern-
ment had forgotten any obligations imposed upon them by
treaties, or that they were not prepared to fulfil those
treaties.

Mr. DOMINIC BROWN (who had seconded the
amendment) maid, that he had felt the utmost indignatio❑
at the apathy with which the House had listened to the
statement and motion of the Hon. and Gallant Member.
He had hoped to have witnessed more sympathy, and he
should not have seconded the proposition hsd any other
Member come forward. fie had full confidence in the
Administration of- Earl Grey, the friend and disciple of
Char:es James Fox, the champion of liberty all over the
world ; and he had no doubt, therefore, that justice would
be done to the unhappy and oppressed Pole. lie hoped
that the Hon. and Gallant Member would withdraw his
amendment, and not press it to a division.

Colonel EVANS was proceeding to remark that he had
done his duty, however the House might think fit to ne-
glect ita duty, when he was called to order by
The SPEAKER, who remarked, that the Hon. and
Gallant Memher was doubly out of order—first, because
he had not confined himself to explanation ; and secondly,
because he had no right to say that the rest of the House
did not do its duty.
Mr. O'CONNELL was of opinion that this was not

the precise tnotrwrit when a question of such a kind could
be properly introduced. He believed, however, that the
sentiment in favour of a gallant and struggling people w,,s
warm and general : it was tkie anxious desire of all that
they should be able to destroy the foul and grinding de-
spotismto which they had i*en too long subject, and that
the Poles should triumph over their enemies.
Colonel EVANS added, that when he was interrupted,
he was only about to say, that the apathy of the House
might possibly arise !rout the cold and feeble manner in
which he had brought forward the subject.
Tho question was put on the amendment, and it was
negatived.
REPRESENTATIVES FOR THE COLONIES.

On the question that the House resolve itself into a
Committee on the Reform Bill,
Mr. HUME rose to move an instruction to the Com-
mittee, to take into consideration the fitness of allowing
Members to he returned to Parliament from the colonies.
He admitted that his proposition was novel ; but the fact
was not to be disputed that British India, containing
a population of eighty or ninety millions, and other
great colonies, were not duly represented in the House
of Commons. The question, however, was, in his
view, well worthy consideration ; but he was willing
to allow that such settlements as had legislative
bodies of their own ought not to be allowed so many
Members as colonies that were regulated solely by a
Governor acting under the King in Council. He contended
that much of the misgovernment of our possessions abroad
bad arisen from their feelings and interests not having been
adequately understood and explained in Parliament by
those immediately concerned. He knew that some few
representatives of colonial interests had hitherto found
their way into Parliament ; but it was to be recollected
that the Reform Bill would effectually exclude them, and
hence the necessity for a separate prevision. lie by no
means wished to add to the Members of the House ; but
the Reform Bill now in progress through the Committee
would lessen the number of the Members by thirty-two,
and those he proposed to give the colonies would be con-
siderably less than that. Although there were many gentle-
men anxious to preserve the relative number of the English
Members, yet he was sure that not one of them would
desire to exclude the colonies from the representation. The
manner in which he wished to distribute among the colonies
their new representation was—to British India four Mem-
bers—to what he should call the Crown colonies, eight
Members—to British America, three—to the West India
Islands, four. The four representatives' of British India
hiproposed to distribute in this manner :.—Calcutta should
return one Member, Madras one, Bombay one, and Sinca-
pore, Malacca, and Prince of Wales's Island, one. The
Crown colonies were especially in need of the representa-
tion which he was desirous to give them, because they had
riot even the advantage of a domestic legislature, but were
wholly suhject, in taxation and legislation, to the Governor,
whose only guides were the Orders in Council issued by
the Government at home. To them he wished to give
eight Members in the following distribution:—To Deme-
rara, Essequibo, and Berbiee, one Member, to the Cape of
Good Hope one, to Ceylon one, to the Mauritius one, to
Australia one, to Malta one, to Gibraltar one, and to New-
foundland (as we understood) one. To British North Ame-
rica be would give three Members, to Upper and Lower
Canada each one Member, to Nova Scotia, New Brunswick,
Prince Edward's Island, and the Bermudas, one Member.
The four representatives to the West Indian islands he
would distribute thus :—He would give one Member to
Jamaica and the Babamas ; one to Barbadoes, St. Vincent's,
aGnrde no:le a
t, ao
pn d o
FnTi
no bag i
ca, o
Montserrat, one to
lirn
ehvl d and S
s,
St. Christopher, t Lu ei a
Tortola, and Antigua. Although that number of colo-
nial representatives might appear at first to be very large,
yet he did not think it would he considered so, when
compared with the maga;.tuee of
the interests to be repre-
sented. In British North America there were 911,000
freemen. The amount of the exports from this country
thither was annually two millions and a half sterling ; and I
our imports from thence amounting to 1,100,000/. 'f he