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London, England, 1822-05-16 00:00:00

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THURSDAY, MAY 16, 1822.

, -
J. Newport, and Mr. Littleton, the Petition was ordered to be
printed.

MISCELLANEOUS.
Mr. ELLISON presented a Petition from Newcastle-upon-
Tyne, praying for a repeal of the Leather tax.—Laid on the'
Table.

A similar Petition was received from Linlithgow, in Scot-
land.—Laid on the Table.
Sir C. MORGAN presented a Petition from the Sheriff,
Land-owners, and Gentry, of Monmouth Shire, praying for a
reduction of taxation, and retrenchment of sinecures. The pe-
tition stated the existence of great distress in the county ; but
the Hon. Member did not approve of the remedies proposed in
the netition.—Ordered to be printed.
Mr. LYTTLETON presented a Petition from an indivi-
dual of the name of Leicester, praying the attention of the
House to a discovery he had made, of the means of preventing
the accumulation of hydrogen gas in Coal Mines.,-Ordered to
be printed.
Lord BINNING presented a Petition from certain persons
in Scotland, praying for leave to bring its a Bill to enable them
to erect a National Monument in Seinland.-eßeferred to a
Select Committee.
TYTHE SYSTEM—IRELAND.
Mr. S. COOPER presented a Petition from the Sheriff, Ma-
gistrates, and Gentry of the county of Sligo, complaining of
the grievous,operation of the Tythe-laws in Ireland, and of an
attempt made by a Clergyman to introduce a tythe en Pota-
toes in that country, which had never before been subject to
one, with the sanction of the Bishop of the diocese.
Mr. ABERCROMBIE gave his support to the Petition.
The evil which was so eloquently set forth by Mr. Pitt, so long
back, existed at this day. An unfortunate wretch who had
an acre of potatoe land had to pay 61. or 71. rent for it, whilst
he was very ill paid as a labourer for his labour. It was to the
oppressions and exactions which the poor and indigent Irish
peasant suffered from the tythe-system, that the disturbances
and outrages which they all deplored took place. He hoped
that, in suppressing these insurrections, the hand of Justice
would be tempered with mercy. Of the effect of the tythe sys-
tem they might form some iuea from the confession or a cleri-
cal Magistrate on the Bench in Ireland, in a case that had
lately occurred. In this case, which occurred at Skibereen, in
Cork, a boy was put on his trial for resisting a distress levied
on his mastef's goods for tythes, when his master was absent
on his way to attempt an adjustment with the clergyman for his
arrears. Several Magistrates having investigated the case, the
clergyman, who was•on the Bench as judge in his own matter,
was called upon for his explanation. In the course of that he
stated that he had been fifteen years in the commission,
during which time he had issued six thousand processes to en-
force the payment of tythes from these poor and unfortunate
persons. He did not relate this to them, as judges in that
particular case, but he addressed the House of Commons to
interpose and prevent the introduction of such a. system into
other parts of Ireland than what it had already afflicted with its
scourge.
Sir JOHN NEWPORT said he'knew of a case in which a
poor peasant having taken some of the early crop out of his
potatoe-garden, for the daily food of his famishing family, it
was determined by the Ecclesiastical Court that that was taking
by several:, and he was doomed to pay his tythes by valuation.
It happened that the remainder of the crop were injured by the
season, and he had not therefore the benefit of it ; but, not-
withstanding this, he was forced to pay tythe according to
the valuation put upon the crop before it was injured. It
was well known that the peasant's potato-garden was his
principal means of support and he hoped the House would
interfere to prevent the extension of such a mode of taking
tythes. He did not envy the feelings of the man who could, at
such a time of distress and disturbance, come forward with
such a proposition.
Mr. GOULBURN could not refrain from joining in the
discussion which had arisen upon this Petition, in justice to the
parties accused. In the first place he must state, that the
clergyman complained of in the Petition had a legal right to
the claim he had put in to potatoe tythe ; and when he had
stated the particulars of the case referred to, it would be seen
whether the clergyman or the gentleman who originated the
opposition was most to blame. A gentleman livmg in the
County of Sligo had been in the habit of fanning 200 acres
of land, for which he paid as a composition for tythes, upon
wool and lambs, 81., or 101. a' year to the clergyman of the
parish. In the course of time this gentleman took 1,000 acres
under his particular care, but when the clergyman claimed an
enlarged payment for tythes, he refused to pay more than the
eight or ten pounds he had hitherto Paid, and maintained that
he was justified in refusing. It was in vain the clergyman re-
presented to him, that whilst the land was in the occupation of
his tenants he received tithes from it ; he appealed to his
candour to decide the justice of his claim, hut with no avail.
He was therefore obliged to have recourse to the law for the
recovery of' his just means of subsistence ; and in making his
declaration to the Court he was recommended by his legal
advisers to put in a claim for potato tithe, in order to cover
the expences of the suit, even were he successful. This, of
course, excited surprise; but the gentleman'in question finding
that he was not borne out in his resistance to pay the demand,
consented to settle it. The clergyman of course agreed to
this, but also claimed payment of the costs to which he had been
wrongfully put. This was resisted, and the case now rested
at that point. He was unwilling to come forward with any
circumstances of a nature to inflame the state of feeling on
this subject, but he could not consent to remain silent where
so much obloquy was heaped upon the wrong quarter, and he
was sure the House would see that whatever blame could be
attached to the clergyman, there was a considerable charge
of indiscretion against the gentleman and those who had
abetted him in his opposition to right. With regard to the
Bishop of the diocese, he had in no way been a party to the
matter; and he was happy to be able to state that a negocia-
tion was now on foot-to put a stop to the whole dispute. With
respect to what had been said by Hon. Gentlemen on the genees
ref subject, he thought it would be better for him at the pre-
sent moment to defer to a future period the observations he had
to make. But he,must guard the House against receiving any
ill impression against the Irish Clergy, on account of their
being engaged in numerous legal suits for the recovery of their
tythes. With the landlord before them, they stood in a situ-
ation of peculiar delicacy and difficulty. Coming after him,
he was most frequently obliged 'to abuse the alternative of in-
stituting suits, or abandoning his tythes. Whenever that sub-
ject came before the House, he trusted it would meet with the
most earnest and sober attention.—(Hear.)
Mr. HUME had hoped that long before this the Right Hon.
Gentleman opposite (Mr. Goulburn) would have stated what
it was the intention of his Majesty's Government to do on this
subject of Irish tythes. Day after day, however, he put off'
this statement, so much called for by the Howie and the whole
country. He was much surprised that the Irish Members had
suffered this momentous subject to remain dormant so long,
and he assured the Housellatit rather than allow it to go on so,
he would give his best attention to it, and bring forward a mo-
tion in the first week in shine.

Mr. SPRING RICE begged to recal the attention of the
House to the true nature of the Petition before them. It was
-a Petition, not from one individual, but from the whole county
of Sligo, complaining of the existence of a suit at law tending
to establish in that part of Ireland, the potato-tythe system,
which did not before exist there. From the statement of both
sides of the House they learned that there was a practice in
Ireland, of taxing the material article of potatoes betwixt the
hand and the lip; not upon its going to market, but that the
tythe proctor interposed betwixt the hand and lip of the grower
and consumer. They had also learnt that this practice was not
universal in that,country, and it remained for the House to de-
termine whether it would allow so odious a system to be spread
throughout the whok of Ireland. He assured his Honourable
Friend behind him, that it was not from remissness that himself
and his Hon. Friends had omitted' to call the attention of the
House to this important subject, but in fact that they had been
waiting in daily expectation of hearing his Majesty's Ministers
come forward with some proposition on the subject. He as-
sured them that he would rather that the tythe for potatoes was:
inflicted on the Protestant landlord than on the Catholic popu-
lation.—(Hear, hear !)—Those cheers from his Hon. Friends
neat him would set him and them right with the HOUSC,II3 to the
feelings with regard to the present state of their fellow-country-
men.

Mr. D. BROWNE considered the subject matter of this Pe-
tition sufficient for the House to legislate upon.
Mr. GOULBURN stated that he had a measure to submit
to-the House on the subject of the. Irish Tythe,system, which he
hoped to be able to bring forward in time to anticipate the Mo-
tion of the Hon. Member for Aberdeen.

Mr. PLUNKET said, that however mueh he was disposed
to join in deploring the grievous effects of the tythe system, as
it existed •in Ireland, he feared thatit would not be possible
to introduce a measure of remedy which should not affect the
right of property at large. He feared none could Le devised