The Sun.
London, England, 1825-06-29 00:00:00

lured at Nagpore, that " the booty taken at 'Womb, Mahide House.; for though the lion. and Learned Oentleman stae a
pore, and Nagpore respectively, should belong to the divisions that the witnesses were at hand and ready to be examined, he
of the Deccan army engaged in the respective operations iu (Mr. Tremayne) believed that no order was actually made to
which. the same was captured ; " that no part of the booty that effect. Not being at all personally acquainted with Mr.
should be granted to the East India Company ; and that a Kenrick or his affairs, he dill not intend to address the House
grant of the•entire- spoil should be matte to trustees ""for-the on the subject of the petition, but had-felt it to be his duty, on
purpose of ascertaining and collecting the said booty, and for being applied to, to present it.
preparing a scheme for the distribution thereof, conformably to The petition was then-read. It set Forth that the petitioner
the principle above stated," and subject to the ultimate sanction had been taken by surprise' by 'the order made by this Ho-
of his Majesty. nourable House fete examining,a great oumber of witnesses on
That by his Majesty's warrant, bearing date 22d March, a certain charge brought against the petitioner by J. Franks;
1823, founded on and embodying the Treasury minute, a grant that the petitioner had not had sufficient notice of this order to
of the booty was made to his Grace the Duke of Wellington and enable bins to prepare suckinstructions for his Counsel as might
the Right Hon. Charles Arbuthnot, as trustees, for the pnr- enable them to cross-examine such witnesses ; and he prayed
es specfied in the minute. to be allowed further time for that purpose.
pos
That nondistribution of aoy part of the proceeds of the booty Mr. DENMAN was not sure that this petition would mate-
has'yei been made. rially alter the course which he had originally proposed toe:lke.
That your petitioner having a deep personal interest in the The substance of the charge to which
on it
the related,
preceding n and which
grant, and feeling a strong sympathy with his brother officers, was the subject of the paper he had it
• and with the soldiers who have served under him in circum- laid on the table, he had stated a fortnight ago. The wit-
stances of peculiar privation and danger, has made repeated ap- nesses which at the same time he expressed an intention of call-
plications to the general prize agent in England, Major Wood, ing were now in attendance, and ready to be examined. Now
anti to the law agent of the army, for information respecting lin regard to Mr. Kenrick's - wish for store time to instruct
the proceedings of the trustees, and more especially as to the his Counsel with a view to enable them to cross-examine
views taken by them of the large and complicated claims of the M those witnesses, he (lir. Denman) could have no objection to
army, in respect of booty seized by the civil servants of the its being complied with. He did not understand that the
East India Company, and as to the extent and manner in which House at to-morrow (this day), and he would therefore pro-
they have enforced or proposed to enforce such claims. But pose that those witnesses should attend on Thursday, by
your petitioner has found them entirely unable to afford him which time Mr. Kenrick would have had time enough to
any authentic information on these subjects; and he haslearned prepare himself. It had been intimated to him (Mr. Den-
with surprise and reeret, from the correspondence which has man), that in respect of the case of Franks, however, Mr.
passed- between the Trustees and Lieut.-Gen. Sir T: Ilislop, Kenrick would not be able for some time to prepare instruc-
that ever since October, 1823, all communication between them tions and to procure evidence to meet them, in which case
and the trustees has been refused by the latter and withheld, it was suggested that that matter must stard over till next
although your petitioner is wholly unable ,to discover in that Session. It did not to him, he confessed, seem necessary to
correepondence any adequate cause or reason whatever for this do any 'such thing. The witnesses were now i the spot,
sudden changes. of the conduct of the trustees, from that liberal and -might not be got together again hereafter without great
and satisfactory course which they appear originally to have difficulty, if at all. At any rate, they, might he examined,
been disposed to adopt. . • the charge might be gone into, ay.(' the answer would stand
'That your petitioner is painfully sensible of the vital in). over, for which Mr. Kenrick would have so :much the more
-- .. time- But in this, as in all other parts of the case, he de-
.

sired to say, that he felt himself entirely at the disposal of
the House. The papers were printed, and in .theilarals of
Hon. Alembers ; therefore the contents must be, by this time,
tolerably well known to Mr. Kenrick himself, and must have
so from the moment, - almost, that they were first printed.—
After the Petition- that had been presented from that Gentle-
man, he (Mr. Denman) certainly would not, as he had in-
tended, move to call in the witnesses in Franks's case now, but
he would move that-motion-on Thursday.
Mr. PEEL, admitting that this was a most grave end serious
question, did not mean to say much upon the expediency of that
House's proceeding to examine witnesses to the charge which
had been brought forward on the preceding evening, in the paper
introduced by the Hon. and Learned Gentleman. The accusa-
tion in this case involved two charges of the gravest kind ; but
at the same time they were such as might he tried by the men-
nary tribunals of the law ; and seeing that no proceedings -ap-
peared to have been taken in respect of them in any--of those
tribunals, -he (Mr. Peel) did think it-very doubtfunwhether the
House should hear witnesses to either charge. . If Air. Kenrick
had brought forward a charge of felony against Mr. Franks,
which was. unfounded, and of which Franks had been- acquitted,
the charge against Mr. Kenrick,- he presumed, would be one
of wanton and malicious prosecution. If Mr. Kenrick had pub-
lished a letter in a certain newspaper, containing a libel on
Franks, then there was also a charge of a malicious and •un-
lbunded libel against • Mr..Kenrick. In either case, however,
why not bring an action at common law ? In respect to the in.:
stitution of the proposed inquiry, he put it to the Hon. and
Learned Gentleman whether it was possible, with any degree of
justice to the Hausa, at large, and- to the course of public busi-
ness, to enter upon it in the way proposed ? He understood
that it was not till one o'clock .that afternoon that Air. Kenrick
knewany thing of this second charge being brought forward.
He had only had the interval, therefore, between one and four
o'clock for instructing Counsel, and no opPortunity at all for
getting witnesses, if he proposed to call any. It might be very
necessary that he should have time for that object, however, for'
' the purpose of .showing what the character of Franks was. Of
. that person's character he (Mr. Peel) knew nothing, except
from what appeared on the printed papers. It might be very
important to Mr. Kenrick -to show that the, character of -Franks
was such as to warrant the suspicions he seemed to have enter-
taieed against him. Sure he (Air. Peel) was, that if this in-
' quiry were now begun, they must go on and through with it ;
for he could not at all assent to that proposition of the
• Honourable and' Learned Gentleman to take the charge
against Mr. Kenrick first, and the. answer next Session. , Wag
it after that charge Should have been carried and circulated in
every direction, as the House well, knew it would be, espe-
cially in that part of the ccuntry where Mr. Kenrick resided—
was it possible that six months afterwards the House could
agree to take the answer of the individual to it ?—(ilear !)
The case-charged on. Franks's part against Mr. Kenrick was
one of great moral weight and responsibility, whatever might
be its legal complexion ; but he was still at a loss to know why
no steps had been taken in the ordinary course of - legal pro-
ceedings. Be considered that all these facts were well known
to the parties long ago ; but he did not suppose that the ion:
and Learned Gentleman was at all influenced by the circum-
stance of his having'been Counsel against. Mr. Kenrick in one
of the prosectitions that had been instituted against him ; yet
he certainly must have known of these facts souse time sinte
Most of them were known in October, 1E124 ; all of them before
the Ist of February, 1825; and yet the Hon. and- Learned Gen-
tleman, even, had allowed Mr. Kenrick to go to his circuit with
all these charges hanging about his neck. He hoped he had
now satisfied the House, and even the Fenn and Learned Gen-
tleman himself, of the impossibility of now going into this in-
quiry.—(Hear!)—The Address of that House to the Crown,
proving it to remove Mr. Kenrick from his situation as a Welch
Judge, would be of no avail ; unless there was an address also
to the sante effect from the Upper House, who would of course
previously institute an inquiry of their own, and examine evi-
dence themselves to the charges.—(H ear !)
Mr. DENMAN, observing from the general impression of
the House and so much of the statement of the Right Hon.
Gentleman as he had been able to collect, that it was not the
desire of lion. Gentlemen to proceed at present with Franks's
case, would feel it to be his duty mot to press it further now ;
(Hear !)—but he would certainly bring it forward next Session,
unless in the mean time circumstances should occur very tnae.
rially to change his view of the case ; otherwise he would then
introduce the subject in its present or some other shape, as
might appear to him to be most expedient. He would now take
the liberty of moving that the Committee on Cantor's petition
should resume its sitting.
W YNN thought the Hon. and Learned Member had
acted most properly in withdrawing his motion.
The motion was then withdrawn.
• Upon the Order of the Day for the House going into a Com-
mittee upon the petition of Martin Cantor,
Mr. DENAIAN said that has the Committee for which he
had moved,.•andao the. consideration of which belied thought it
his duty- to submit certain considerations, had resumed its
labours, he would -take the liberty of congratulating the Hon.
Members who composed it, upon their not coming toany pre-,
violls Resolution of applause or censure upon the conduct ofellr.
:Kenrick. They had, he thought, reason to rejoice in agreeing
not to enter into any other discussion concerning facts, which
.merely proved on -satisfactory evidence, before the papery were
printed and placed in the hands of them all.- They would now,
form theinjudgm•ent, not after a meager debate, nor influenced
by the eloquence of Counsel, but they would come to a decision
after nail and .mature deliberation. He would beg to make a
few remarks, upon the cross examination of the witness at their
Bar. lie did not allude to any of the answers, for they did not
require explanation n but -some of the questions were not, he
thought, equally clear. „Many inquiries were made of witness
as to the time and object of presenting his petition, and the sup,
port he received from those who thought thernselys interested.
For himself he would declare most absolutely, that he knew
nothing of the petition until it was put into his bands, and lie was
informed by a respectable friend' that it was intended to present'
it to the House. Ile admitted some of the facts were known to
him by what occurred at jhe Bar, -what he read in the News-
papers, and from affidavine made in the Court of King's Bench i
Under the circumstances he did not feel warranted n refusing
to resent the petition, which lie thought most-worthy of serious
attention. He presented the -petition concerning this Act in
conjunction with statements of much more insportance, -and of
which if the individual were guilty it would be impossible for
him to remain. in re high place of judicial trust. He. did not
bring forward this case alone ' • he'brought it forward with that
of Franks, so that he could not be met by the supposition
that he relied upon this insulated matter. He thought the
-entire. conduct of Mr. Kenrick, as a Magistrate, was liable
to much animadversion ; and here he felt in a peculiar situa-
tion from the nature of the audience which he had the
honour to address. The Menibers of that House were in fact
a special Jury of Magistrates performing their duties—he was
well aware with honour to themselves and utility to the coun-
try, but perhaps no: free from a certain degree of sympathy Or
persons holding the same office—who were of course the best
andges of the motives that may influence Magistrates, but also
tinctured by prejudices in their favour. Of the advantage to be
derived from this defence he did not wish to deprive AI r.Kenrick.
If the conduct of this individual as a Magistrate were general,
it should be departed from as such acts made a magistrate liable
to just reprehension, and deprived his character of that useful-
ness and respect which it ought to possess- The testimony of
Canfor at the Bar was said to be flippant and arrogant, but to
bring it into discredit it should be shaken in some important
point. The Learned Gentleman alluded to the comments made
upon the motives of Mr. Canfor, which he contended were ut-
terly immaterial. It was no wonder he should have appeared ner-
vous and agitated at the bar, being for the firstaime among per-

portance of stich nornmunica" don to the interests of the army,
and of the stranoe and embarrassing situation in which they
are placed while it is 'denied. Your petitioner has heard,
though, from the system of secrecy adopted, he cannot confi-
dently assert, that a sum of about 100,0001. has been realized
and admitted to be due to the captors, but your petitioner be-
lieve-. that such sum, though large in itself, is small, when
compared with the claims urged by the prize agents and the
prize committees on the spot, to the whole booty seized by the
exertions of the army, part of which has been appropriated to
the use of the Indian Government ; part restored without com-
pensation to the defeated enemy ; part perhaps lost, or frittered
away ; and part secured by the civil servants of the Company
under the very protection of the army by whom it was won.
That the anxiety of your petitioner is increased by a report
which is prevalent among the army, that several of the most
important heads of claim have been abandoned ; and that it has
been arranged to receive from the Directees a sum wholly ina-
dequate even to satisfy those which have been nominally ad-
mitted, though your petitioner is convinced that such an
arrangement -would not have been made, nor would the 'Direc-
tors have desired it, if liaise who can best understand and ex-
plain the cause of tile army had been allowed to share in the
discussions, and to bring the information, which they can com-
municate, to hear on the questions in issue And your petitioner
humbly submits that it never could be intended to exclude the
artny, by their agents, from all knowledge of.- proceedings in
which the bounty of the Crown has-given them the sole inte-
rest, and to .subject them to that uncertainty and sense of help-
lessness. which such exclusion after long disappointment and
- delay has cast upon them.
That your petitioner humbly submits not only that the
amount of the general- fend to be distributed will be greatly
lessened by the want of timely communication, but that with-
out such communieation it will be impossible to prepare a
satisfactory scheme of distribution of the funds 'Which may
remain according to die principle recognised in his 3lajesty's
warrant.
As the booty is to be appropriated respectively to the dial-
, siota of the Deccan army, engaged in the respective operations
in which it was captured, die scheme must, as your peti-
tioner apprehends, set forth the particular capturss in which.
the various portions of the army are respectively to share, as
well as direct the number of shares which the different ranks
of these portions are to receive. To prepare a scheme of this
na`ure, applicable to a most complicated series of operations,
width extended over a vast field of exertion, seems impossible,
wit'out constant reference to those who were on the spot,
and who have employed years in collecting and arranging
information applicable to the delicate questions which
may arise, and who have the- means of communicating
with the witnesses of . the - various exploits- ,to be
• rewarded. I our petitioner himself having served- both
- with the fourth and the reserve divisions, feels that his
own individual claims, and of the brave men whom he had the
honour and satisfaction to have under his immediate command,
are in peculiar danger of wanting due appreciation, from their
liability to be misundirstood or confounded by the trustees,
- however anxious they may be, and your petitioner doubts not
are, to do justice. And ydur petitioner, from his knowledge of
tne scene and the nature of the operations, is convinced that
from that cause the wise and just principle of distribution sb
clear 4 developed, and so strongly insisted do in his Majesty's
Warrant, must in many instances be defeated.
That your petitioner has been mainly induced to pray for the
. interposition of your Honourable Ilouse, by his knowledge of
the wants and the anxieties of the surviving portions of the army
in Engler I—he knows that many of its most active and meri-
torious ofi.:eers and soldiers have died since its termination, leav-
ing widows and orphans in circumstances calculated to excite
the strongest sympathy—and he is most anxious, not only
on his own behalf, but on behalf of his suffering comrades,
that their claims, if disallowed, should at least have the
privilege of a hearing—that information procured by the
labour of years should . not be' rendered useless—and that
their hopes, existed by the bounty of the Crown, long che-
rished and long delayed, should not be defeated at last by
any unfortunate misunderstanding with those who have been
appointed to watch over their interests and to assert their just
claims.
Your petitioner therefore humbly prays your Honourable
House to institute such inquiries, and to grant such relief in
the premises, as to your wisdom shall seem meet.
And your petitioner shall ever pray. &c.
BRITISH CLAIMS ON SPAIN.
Lord JOHN -RUSSELL, seeing the Right Hon. Secretary
• for 'Foreign Affairs in his place,- wished to ask a question on a
subject of great importance. lie hoped the Right lioneGen-
tle.man's reply would comprise such general information as he
might have it in his power to communicate upon 'the point.—
The Noble Lord then added, that he wanted -to know-what
progress had been made by that Commission which had been
established for the settiantent of claims by British subjects on
the Spanish Government? Perhaps the Right Hon. .Gentle-
man would state in his reply, what was the amount of the
claims which had been brought before the Commissioners e
and what was the amount of claims which fly Commissioners
nominated on the part of Spain had acceded to. —l.ll ear !) •
:Jr. CANNING in reply said, the amount of claims which
had, up to this time been broUght forward, was, he believed,
about 2,009,0901., but he by no means meant to pledge him-.
eelf that that would be the whole amount to be brought for-
ward. What had been the proportion of them that was al.:.
lowed, it was not tas we understood the Right Hon. Gentle-
man) in his power to inforin • the Noble Lord. .He did not
mean to deny that every possible impediment had been thrown
in the way of the Commission, by conduct on the part of Spain
which he could not describe as very becoming—(Hear, hear!),
—namely, by the constant changing of the Commissioners in
behalf of the Spanish Captors. On the part of the British Go-
vernment, every desire had been felt to make all possible pro-
gress in the objects of the Commission-with the- least possible
delay. It was proper to add, that unfortunately, even in
respect of what adjustments it had effected, money, the most
essential result of all, was still not forthcoming.—( Hear !)
Lord JOHN RUSSELL said a few words which were in-
audible in the gallery.
lelr. CANNING suggested that there was this difficulty in
the present instance. The cosmnission was established in virtae
of a certain convention that was entered into after some nego-
. dation. That convention grew out of inthreat of force on our
part. Where force was absolutely used, there was something
co quicken the progress of an investigation like this. But this
convention grew out, and was the consequence of orders that
were dispatched for the seizure of Spanish property, in conse-
quence of the negation of the British claims on Spain. When
it was recollected what the condition of Spain now waseit might
be inferred that it was extremely difficult to obtain the settle-
ment of any of those claims. The Noble Lord and the .House
might rest satisfied, that on the part of the British Govern-
ment no energy would be left unexerted to procure a-speedy ad-
justment of these claims on the one hand, and to effect any rea-
sonable compromise on the other.
COMBINATION LAWS.
Mr. lIUME presented a petition from several inhabitants
and artizans of Sheffield, in the county of York, against the
Combination Laws.

MR. KENRICE.
Mr. TREMAYNE rose to present a petition from Mr.
William Kenrick, in reference to a paper which had, upon the
preceding evening, or that morning rather, been laid upon the
table by the Hon. and Learned Member for Nottingham, in
reference to the case of a Mr. Franks. The petitioner stated
that he was takea by surprise by the order which the House
had th.ereupon made for examining witnesses in relation to that
charge ; and that therefore he was not prepared. Now he(Mr.
Tremayne) apprehended that this Gentleman was not correct
. as to the order which he supposed to have been made by the