The Sun.
London, England, 1849-01-09 00:00:00

THE NEW CITY PRISON.

Yesterday a meeting took place at the Dispensary
in Aldersgate-street, for the purpose of discussing the
propriety of erecting the New City Prison at Hollo-
way, at an expense of 80,0001.
Sir P. Laurie (the Alderman of the ward) took the
chair. There were very few of the inhabitants pre-
sent, which fact was accounted for by some members
of the ward upon the ground that no general notice
had been given, and by others that the ward placed
so much reliance upon the representatives of the
citizens of London in the Court of Common Council
ar to render ,any interference on the part of a par-
ticular district quite unnecessary.
Sir PETER said, that Mr. Alcock had on St.
Thomas's-day intimated his intention to bring for-
ward the subject, and as the Bth of January was the
most convenient day according to the engagements of
those principally concerned, that time was ap-
pointed. He thought it but candid to the meeting
to state that he was not an advocate for the erec-

tion of a prison out of the City, particularly at
so enormous an expense as 80,0001., and without any
arrangement as to the system or discipline to be
adopted within it. He was the more disposed to
oppose such a project, as he saw the Government
were as expeditiously as they could pulling down all
the evidences which they had raised in the Millbank
Penitentiary in favour of the cell system, and he
could not refuse his concurrence in the argument of
Mr. Lambert Jones, who added to the many other
objections the opinion that if the prison at Holloway
were built, paid magistrates would be substituted for
the aldermen. It was pretty well known, too, that
a prison estimate seldom corresponded with its actual
cost, and he thought it very probable that before the
building was finished the amount would reach
100,000/.—(Hear, hear.) They must be prepared,
too, upon opening the new asylum, for he would not
call it a prison, for an overwhelming influx of paupers
from all parts of the country, the comforts of a gaol
being, in accordance with the philanthropic arrange-
ments of the present day, much superior to those of
a workhouse—a circumstance to which the authorities
of the city of London could bear unquestionable
testimony upon the most painful experience.—(Hear,
hear.) Sir P. Laurie then drew the attention of the
meeting to the progress of the extravagant plan acted
upon in Clerkenwell, at the Detention Prison, which
exhibited a picture of 52 officers attending upon 121
prisoners ; and mentioned several other instances in
which the affectionate prison system, founded upon a
most mistaken principle, encouraged instead of
diminishing crime.—(Hear, hear.)
Mr. ALCOCK differed with Sir Peter Laurie upon
many subjects, but certainly agreed with him upon
the important question of building a new prison at
Holloway at the enormous expense of 80,0001. It
was, he considered, not only important that the
pockets of the citizens of London should be protected
from an unnecessary expense, but it was important
that the outcasts of society should not meet with
care and attention and sympathy in gaol, while
the poor honest man was obliged to encounter
the comparative rigours of a workhouse.—(llear,
hear.) He lamented the fact, but so it was, that
when a poor fellow who could charge his misery
to nothing but misfortune appeared amongst the
victims of starvation, he was passed by with an ex-
pression of common-place pity, while the perpetrator
of a murder or some other desperate offence mono-
polized the sympathies and favour of the public, and
all seemed to vie with each other in showing him the
way to Heaven if they could not succeed in keeping
him amongst them upon earth.—(A laugh.) Was
that, he would ask, the way to suppress crime ?
(Hear, hear.) The more he looked back upon our

toref,Athers the more he condemned the morbidphilan-
thropy which interfered at the present day to prevent
the punishment of crime. The day was gone by
when bread and water was one of the wholesome
penalties to which thieves and robbers were
subjected, and soup, and gruel, and meat, with a
mixture of compassion proportioned to the heinous-
ness of the offence, were substituted. No wonder
that the unfortunate inmates of the workhouses
preferred the gaols, and at last adopted the
means of accomplishing the exchange by becoming
the confederates of wretches who were sure to meet
with kinder treatment.---(Hear, hear.) Mr. Alcock
next adverted to the system which he supposed was
meant to be introduced into the new prison. By the
solitary system, the law, as well as all policy and
humanity, was violated, and human beings, instead of
being made good members of society once more, were
prevented for ever from becoming members of society
at all, if insanity was a disqualification.—(Hear.)
Such a process never had been heard of even in the
history of the wretches to Whom the rack and the
screw and other damnable instruments of cruelty had
been applied. No, it never entered into the imagina-
tion of the inflictors of punishment to deprive their
victims of reason.

Mr. Deputy GODSON said there was no intention of
introducing the solitary system. The separate system
wass,"a different course of treatment, and protected the
inexperienced criminal from fatal contamination.
Mr. WOOD (Common Cuuncilman)—The fact is

no system has been agreed upon yet.
Sir P. LAURIE—Ay, I complain of that as most
absurd. The idea of building a prison at a cost o:
80,000/. without knowing anything about the disci.
pline to be introduced is most monstrous.
Mr. ALCOCK proceeded at considerable length to
oppose the erection of the prison at Holloway, and
contended that the corporation could raise within the
City a prison of sufficient dimensions at a moderate
expense to suit every purpose. lie concluded by,
moving a resolution to the effect that they should in-
struct their representatives to advocate the postpone-
ment of the erection of the new prison until the ques-
tion should undergo further consideration.
Mr. NORRIS, in an able speech, seconded the motion.
Mr. GonsoN opposed the resolution, and said that
he differed from the proposer and seconder almost in
toto. The question had been before the corporation
between nine and ten years, and the whole plan had
at last been concocted between them and the Govern-
meet.—(Hear, hear.) It was well known to the
members of the two Courts that the Court of Alder-
men had been pressed by the Administration to de-
termine upon the erection of a new gaol, with the
only alternative of losing the control of Nowgate
altogether.
Sir P. LAURIH said he knew of nothing of the kind.
Mr. GODSON said, that no one who was not a very
inattentive observer of what passed in the corporation
could be ignorant of the actual threats of the Govern-
ment in the event of any further delay, and he read a
long list of corporation notices and resolutions upon
the subject, which were conclusive of the existence of
the long-continued negotiation. He thought it would
be most inconsistent in a handful of the inhabitants
of the ward to advise any additional delay in the
erection of a prison, to which measure the united
committees of the two branches of the corporation
had consented, especially after considerable expense
had already been incurred in draining the siitoenai
sinking a well for the general accommoofdtalte
cost
(hear, hear.) He read various estimateis 1
of a prison of adequate dimensions 12_ the city of
London, from which it appeared t sluch an object
less sum teen
could not be accomplished for
from 214,0001. ,to 289,0001., and aafter several other
observations, he concluded by saying that the motion
I had his hearty disapproval.—(hear, hear.)
Mr. STACEY (Common Councilman) intimated that
he should wait for the further discussion which he