The Sun.
London, England, 1836-03-10 00:00:00

CHURCH REFORM.

York, and it was further recommended that until the existing
Chapters were reduced, no election should take place. It was
also recommended that the residence of the Dean should be for
nine months, and that of the Canons for three months.
—( Hear, hear.) He wiseed also to call their Lordship's
attention to a further recommendation, viz., that these bene-
fices should be limited according to the wants of the popula-
tion ; but this was reserved for further consideration. It was
impossible at once to lay down any general rule upon the subject;
they must, necessarily, be guided in their considerations by a
reference to local circumstances. Their Lordships were aware
of the course taken by the late Administration with respect to
a prebendal stall of Westminster—it was annexed to the parish
Church of St. Margaret—and as there was one vacant at pre-
sent the same course would be taken with respect to it. It was
intended to annex it to a parish in a part of the City, in which
they were now placed, and he could state that he had
received the recommendation of his Majesty to apply it
in this way, and he was sure that his Majesty was as
anxious as any man to carry into effect a salutary and
useful reformation in the Church.—( Hear, hear, hear. )
There was another circumstance of considerable importance
which he wished to state. It was desirable that those benefices
should be bestowed on those whose qualifications were
proved by a certain period of service.—(Loud cheers.)
It was therefore recommended that no person should receive
the appointment of Dean, Archdeacon, or Canon, until he
had been six years in Priest's orders.—( Hear, hear.)
With respect to the other minor canonships, &c., it was
recommended that they should be abolished ; and it was also
recommended that all sinecure livings should be suppressed, and
that the revenues arising out of them should be
appropriated in other parishes to the cure of souls.
The next great subject in the Bill was what had often been be-
fore their Lordships, and upon which it would be perfectly un-
necessary upon that occasion for him to trouble their Lordships
with any general reasonings—he meant the subject of non-re-
sidence and pluralities. The same evils which had met them
before met them on this occasion—the great poverty
and penury of many of the benefices prevented the Com-
mittee (as they said) doing that which they would otherwise
be inclined to do, namely, to recommend the immediate dis-
continuance of all pluralities ; but they were of opinion that
means should be taken to diminish them as much as possible,
and for that purpose they recommended the prin-
ciple of holding benefices and pluralities should in future
be regulated with respect to distance and value. They were
of opinion that no benefices should be held together that
were at the distance of more than ten miles asunder ; and with
respect to value that no benefice of a greater value than
5001. should be held in plurality with any other benefice, except
in cases when the small value of a neighbouring benefice might
make it expedient that they should be united. That was
what the Commissioners had stated. With respect to
non-residents, he (Lord M.) did not mean to depart
from the principle of the law as it at present stood, bat they
did propose to make further provisions for enforcing residences
by diminishing the number of pluralities and non-residents.
The Bill had been prepared by the Commissioners for carry-
ing into effect this purpose, and it would speedily be sub-
mitted to their Lordships' consideration. He had now stated
the principal recommendations contained in the Report, and
he begged leave to declare his entire concurrence in the whole
of them. They were at once temperate and efficacious, at once
reforming and Conservative, calculated to preserve the character
and efficiency of the Church, while at the same time they would
remove any stumbling blocks which might in any manner
have rendered it the object of- attack, and, therefore, he re-
commended it to their Lordships as being calculated to in-
crease efficiency for those holy purposes • for which
it had been established.—(Loud and continued cheering. )
The Archbishop of CANTERBURY expressed his great
satisfaction at the subject having been introduced by his
Majesty's Government, because it was really impossible
that such a measure would be carried through the House
without the full approbation and effective and hearty
support of the Government.—( Hear, hear, hear.) He
believed that this measure would be very beneficial
to the Church. He had long been aware that some strong
and vigorous measures for the correction of abuses that had
crept into the Church, and for the removal of those anomalies
that had long interfered with its efficacy, were necessary.
When Sir Robert Peel retired from office, the proceed-
ings of the Commission were for a while supended, but
as soon as the Noble Viscount had taken office, he had
called upon him (the Archbishop of Canterbury), and
expressed his readiness to continue the Commission with
only wish such changes in the official members of that Com-
mission as the change in the Administration rendered neces-
sary. The Noble Viscount stated that it was his desire
that the Commission should proceed on the same views
and principles as those on which it had been originally formed,
and on which thsy bad proceeded, and had been favoured with
constant attendance of the Ministers of the time. That Com-
mission had continued to receive the same assistance from his
present Majesty's Ministers since the time the Commission had
been received—the Noble Viscount and the members of the
Government having been frequently present, and lent every as-
sistance; and he (the. Archbishop of Canterbury) was happy
to be able to confirm the statement of the Noble Viscount as
to the unanimity which prevailed ; and whenever any material
difference took place, it had been settled not by any unwilling
compromise or unjust concession, but from a fair consideration
of the facts of the case, and the special reasons upon which
the matter turned. That was really the state of the case,
and he believed there never was a Commission appointed for so
important a purpose, on which so much unanimity prevailed.
He should freely confess, in justice to himself, that had he
not believed this Commission to Le founded on Conser-
vative principles, he should never be a member of it.—(Hear,
hear.) When he said Conservative principles, he meant
that the Ecclesiastical Establishment should be maintained
in all its integrity. He believed that a smaller number of
bishopricks than at present existed would not be suffi-
cient to discharge the Episcopal functions. There were
other reasons which 'induced him to undertake the duties of
that Commission, particularly when he heard several persons,
for whom he entertained a high respect, express an opinion op-
posed to the holding of commendams by the Bishops of smaller
secs. He saw that there existed no other means than those
proposed by the report for increasing the revenues of the
smaller bishopricks, for, he feared, they could not ob-
tain any from the public.---( Cries. of " Hear, hear.") An
appeal to them was out of the question, and there only
remained the plan of taking from the larger sees some portion
of those revenues which in latter times had greatly increased,
and thus adding to the smaller ones. Another matter was the main-
tenance of the Cathedral. establishments, the-Deans, Chapters.
With respect to the upholding of-Deans and Chapters, he
was of opinion that they ought to ,be continued.—(Hear,
hear.) The appointments were very useful to the Church,
as rewards to clergymen of distinguished merit. He
was still of opinion that they might be preserved
and yet a large surplus obtained for the uses of parishes where,
from the immense population contained in some of those in
the Metropolis, and northern and midland counties, the Church
of England was almost as a shadow. He felt quite certain that
no one could say that the surplus could have been applied to
a better object tban in filling up the great want felt in such
parishes. Where the produce of the tithe was taken from
the officiating Minister, and wastgiven to another who
perhaps might not be properly called a • drone,
for he might be officiating somewhere else. It seemed to him,
that it carried its condemnation in its very name. One word
as to the equalization of bishopricks--that question had never
been under the consideration of the eommisssioners ; it was
one of those wild projects which would at once have been
scouted by them. Upon the: subject of residence he appre-
hended there would be very little difference of opinion.—
( Hear.) The very principle of the Chnrch ought to be,
that a clergymam should certainly reside upon his benefice.
It would, however, be totally impossible to carry the principle
into effect in the present state of the Church, but they ought
to come as near to the principle of having a clergyman ressd-
ing wherever there was a congregation of the Church of England
The general feeling against pluralities was so great that he
thought some restrictions were necessary ; and in a Bill
which he introduced last year, he bad introduced a clause to
do away with them in some degree. He wished to say a few
words upon the objects which the Commissioners had in
view when they made their Report. Their only object was
to advance the pure religion of the country through the Estab-
lished Church; He disclaimed any other motive than the good
of the Church—they had looked to no temporary expediency,
to fix wavering friends. His full persuasion was, that if the
recommendation of the Commissioners was carried into ef-
fect, it would be greatly beneficial to the Church itself.
By applying revenues that had hitherto been given to
literary institutions to parochial revenues, trinfhemeepeprngreoripevnaairstamietoit
good would be effected.—( Hear, hear, hear.) He be-
lieved it would be found -that the clergy of the Church
England were
rawydeiernef
ponri
eo
the
eiannfde
educationr
eoarm toi n anygoi t
hHo
ot
ehs
eehrlovcphleoads
were
s oeo
°ol
wouldhEe rn gc
themselves for the sacred duty of the Ministry. There was
another point which had been the occasion of great scandal
to religion—that was the unworthy conduct of some Members
of the establishment. Hitherto; these powers vested in the
Church to punish those who transgressed its rules was very
insufficient, and he trusted some arrangement would be made
although the Report did not allude to them, to prevent these
scandals. To those who might appear dissatified with these
arrangements and reductions, he would only say, let them
look at the state of the Church, and see if its interests would
not be promoted, and much public good effected by the re-
commendations of this Commission.—(Hear, hear.)
The Report was then ordered to be printed.
SPANISH AFFAIRS.
The Marquis of LONDONDERRY asked if any an-
swer was obtained to the letter addressed to the Spanish Go-
vernment, respecting the twenty-seven prisoners taken by them.
Lord MELBOURNE said of course if there was any an-
swer, it would be laid before the House.
The Marquis of LONDONDERY said he would bring the
subject before the House on Monday.
After the presentation of some petitions, the House ad-
journed to Friday.

Lord MELBOURNE had it in command from his Ma-
jesty, to lay before their Lordships the Second Report
of the Commissioners appointed to inquire into the state
of the Established Church in England and Wales, with re-
gard to its claims, its duties, and its revenues. In perform-
ing that duty it. gave him great pleasure to state to their
Lordships, that that report had been unanimously agreed
to, that it Are the signature of all the Commissioners,
and that although there might have been upon such a subject
some differences of opinion, there was no-material difference or
discrepancy among the Commissioners upon that subject. It
perhaps might be necessary, considering the magnitude of this
subject—its great importance, and the great interest it natu-
rally excites—it might not be inconvenient to point out the parti-
cular recommendations which the report made to their Lord-
ships. In doing so, he should be probably exceedingly
imperfect; but he had the satisfaction of speaking in the pre-
sence of those who were much more intimately acquainted
with the subject, and who would be able to correct any error
or supply any deficiency discovered in the short sketch he was
about to make to them. Their Lordships were aware this was
the second Report presented to them on this subject—that the
first was the Report of Commissioners who had been appointed
under the late Administration, and they had divided the subject
into the three branches of territory, revenue, and patronage.
Ecclesiastical patronage was a most delicate subject. It was
one of much intricacy, and it was distinctly reserved for fur-
ther consideration. The last report recommended that there
should be such a new division of the dioceses of England and
Wales as they thought would put an end to the inequality which
at present prevailed. In some of the dioceses the duties were
so extensive as to be out of human power to perform; while
in others there were not duties enough. In the former Report
they had recommended that the dioceses of Bristol and Llandaff
should be consolidated. They had many objections urged
against that plan, and as they appeared to them to be weighty,
they had altered the plan, and now recommended that Bristol
and its suburbs should be added to the diocese of Bath
aad Wells, while the remainder of the diocese should
be/added to thei bishopric of Gloucester.—( Hear.) This
arrangement would make some alteration necessary in the dis-

tribuilon of the districts of Glamorgan and Brecon. The
Report also recommended that, as soon as it could be found
quite convenient, the diocese of Sodor and Man should
be joined to that of Carlisle.—( Hear, hear, hear.)
It further went on to say that there should, be a reduction
made from the revenues of the larger and more opulent sees,
for the purpose of increasing the revenues of those who were
less amply provided for.—( Hear, hear.) They did not
recommend that there should be a perfect equality in all
dioceses ; in his opinion a perfect equality would be most
contrary to the best interests of the Church, would be contrary
to our form of government, and to the state of society in which
we were now placed. —( Hear.) He thought there should be no
income which should be open to a charge of being grossly ample ;
while, on the other hand, there should be none which would
not sufficiently provide for its holder. The present estimated
value of the See of Canterbury was seventeen thousand pounds ;
they proposed that it should now'be fixed at fifteen thousand
pounds annually.—( Ipar.) The see of London was now

This would give a fund of 25,5001., which, together with the
sum of 2,300/. taken from the bishopric of Ely, would leave a
total of 30,b00i. to be divided [among the other bishoprics,
giving an income to them varying from 4,000/. to 5,000/. per
annum. The sums apportioned to the different Bishoprics had
not yet been determined. With respect to the Bishoprics
of Bath and Wells, Norwich and Salisbury, no alteration was
proposed. Their Lordships would see that the greatest
amount had been taken from the Bishopric of Durham ; and
the relson of that was, the recommendation of the Commis-
sioners that the temporal and secular jurisdiction hitherto
vested in the Bishopric of Durham should be here-
after separated from the ecclesiastical functions. When
these temporal and secular functions were taken away,
there would, naturally, be taken away a great portion
of the expense hitherto attending that Bishopric, such
for instance as the. reception of the Judges, and so on. It
was also intended that in future the Bishop should have
nothing further to do with Durham Castle,. that his only resi-
dence should be Bishop Auckland, and the Castle was to be
appropriated to the use of the University that had lately been
established in that part of the country. The same recom-
mendation with respect to the separation of the civil and
religious duties had also been made with respect to the
Archbishopric of York, and the Bishopric of Ely, when
that arrangement n ould be carried into effect.--( Hear.)
The next important subject to which the attention of the Go-
vernment had been directed by the terms of the Commission,
was the state of the Collegiate and Cathedral Churches in
England and Wales, and looking to those great Lstitu-
tions, it was natural for his Majesty's Government to
advert to that which their Lordships would be well acquainted
with, viz., the extremely reduced state of a great number
of the benefices of the country. Such a reduced state
had great effect upon the character of the Clorgy and
the interests they would take in religion. The situation
they ought to hold was sunk materially, and they were ex-
posed to temptations which they otherwise would not be.
The Report of the Commissioners further stated, that in order
to give increased efficiency to the establishment, it was indis-
pensable to improve the condition of many benefices, where
the population was of a very considerable amount, and to
make adequate provision for the religious instruction of
an increasing population. The Report entered into details to
show the state of such benefices, but it was unnecessary for
him to repeat them. The report went on to state that there
were benefices in the Church of two kinds—some old
and some new.—( Hear.) Those they called " old" which
existed before the time of Henry VIII.. ; and those new,
which arose about the time of the Reformation, and under
the reign of that monarch.—(Hear.) In the old there
were minor canons, who had no duties to perform, except
occasionally preaching a sermon or two upon visitations.
These preferments were not resident, and it was recom-
mended to suppress them altogether—of course upon the
determination of present interests--that the proceeds of them
should be paid into the fund mentioned, and applied to the
purposes be had already stated. It was proposed to abo-
lish them, with the exception of some cases in which
they might be preserved merely as titles of dignity,
and as a means of rewarding distinguished merit in the
Church. With respect to these'churches both old and new,
it was recommended that hereafter for the service of ca-
thedrals there should be in each one dean and four canons
.—one of the. latter to be attached to the arehdeaconry of
the diocese, for the purpose of giving employment to those
officers, whose duties were most useful, most necessary, and
most extensive, and who had hitherto been left with very in-
adequate remuneration. It was recommended that the Chapters
in the new churches should consist of a Dean and four Canons
which was the number at present existing in the Cathedral of

A very fine specimen of the Crested Grebe, was
shot on the Derwent Lake (March 1), by Mr. Atkinson, of
Keswick, after a most arduous chase for nearly four hours (du-
ring which time it never attempted to fly), and affording a so-
litary instance of the crested grebe ever having been known to
visit this neighbourhood. Specimens of this bird are not
easily procured, as the rapidity with which they dive renders
the shooting of them extremely difficult.

Nearly one-third of the small town of Maligny, in
the Yonne, was destroyed by fire on the night of the 25th ult.,
audit is said that no fewer than sixty-three persons lost their
lives. It has not been ascertained whether the disaster was
occasionedby accident or malevolence.

TUE SUN, LONDON, THURSDAY, MARCH 10, 185(.

SPIRIT OF THE PUBLIC JOURNALS.

The Tories, by universal admission, cut a most
wretched figure in the debate of Monday and Tuesday.
There was not even a decently clever speech made by
any one of their number. When they had allowed that
the Irish Corporations, as they now exist, were so
corrupt that a change became absolutely necessary,
they deprived themselves of all ground of opposition
to the Ministerial measure. The blustering of Sir
James Graham about " unconditional surrender," and
the lawless spirit of Catholic dominion" would have
' been intelligible if the-Right Hon. Baronet had boldly
come to the conclusion that Catholics ought not to be
placed on a footing of equality with Protestants ;
and that if the)/ should refuse to submit to be slaves,
the resources of England and Scotland must be ex-
pended in attempting a second conquest of Ireland, to
be attended with fresh confiscations of. Catholic pro-
perty, and revival of tae penal laws. While alluding to
this strange speech of the Right Hon. ex-Radical,
we must entreat the forgiveness of our readers
for a reference, in a leader of yesterday, to the
Orange Portfolio, No. 8, for a proof of the estima-
tion in which he was formerly held by his pre-
sent allies. This Portfolio, No. 8, was stated to be
in another part of the paper ; but owing to an acci-
dent it did not appear yesterday, but it will be found
in our columns of this day. The only intelligible
ground assigned by the Right Hon. Baronet, by Lord
Stanley, and Sir Robert Peel, and the whole fry of
Tories, for refusing to the inhabitants of the towns of
Ireland the same Corporate Reform which had been
conceded, first to Scotland and next to England, was
that the majority of the Irish are Roman Catholics.
A great deal, indeed, of laborious effort was displayed
in endeavouring to prove the proposition, which no one
ever disputed, that the situation of Ireland was not in
every respect the same as that of England, as if it
were necessary in legislating for a country to show that
the circumstances of the people of every part of it are
exactly the same. The Scotch Highlanders and the
Welsh do not in every particular resemble the Cock-
neys ; but because the Highlanders have not yet
attained the conviction that breeches are better than
kilts, is that a good reason why the good
people of Inverness ought to be deprived of
the benefit of local administration ? It is an un-

"1.. a v •
disputed axiom in politics, that Administrations under 1
which the people are suffered to elect and to control
those who have the management of their local affairs,
are of the utmost advantage to a nation, and one of the
firmest foundations of liberty. There can be no greater
evil in any country than an undue extension of cen-
tralization, which opens a door to all manner of abuses ;
but, in the case of a union of three kingdoms, the be-
stowing local administrations on two of them, and with-
holding them from the third, is either an assumption
that the latter is in a state of subjection to the former,
or that what is generally beneficial would, from pecu-
liar circumstances, be mischievous when applied to the
third kingdom. The Tories durst not maintain that
the people of Ireland ought- to be the slaves of the
English and Scotch, and they utterly failed in showing
that there were any circumstances in the condition of
Ireland which would . prevent that which would
be beneficial in the other countries from being
beneficial in the sister kingdom. Justice having, by
the confession of the Tories themselves, been
poisoned at its source, the Irish have often
been driven to combinations in self-defence; but
because oppression has produced in Ireland the
effects which it every Where produces, is that a reason
for withholding from its inhabitants a healing measure ?
Because a man may have suffered from an insufficient
diet, is that a reason for refusing to allow him to re-
cruit his forces by a more generous diet ? But the To-
ries, in the eloquent language of Mr. O'Connell, not
only suffered the nuisances of a corrupt administration
of justice to exist undisturbed, but wished them to be-
come still more offensive— If Municipal Corporations
were in themselves of a mischievous tendency—if men
became worse by being suffered to have the manage-
ment and control of their own affairs—tben there
might be some reason for forcing
.an _offensive des-
potism on the Irish. But of all means for improving
the character of a people, none, by universal admis-
sion, arc so efficacious as the allowing them to partici-
pate in local administrations. In short, the Tories are
a day too late. When the claims of the Catholics were
conceded in 1829, the Legislature threw down all bar-
riers between them and the rest of their fellow-citizens.
A Protestant has no right to any privilege or fran-
chise to which the Catholic has not an equal
right. It is the knowledge of this which has
given so evasive and furtive a character to all the
speeches of the Tories. They durst not say.
" The Irish are Catholics—therefore let us oppress
them but they could assign no better reason. The
cause of Irish Corporation Reform is gained. We do
not allude merely to the majority in the Commons of
64. We allude to the utter inability of the Tories to
assign any reasons which the Peers, however desirous
of withholding the measure, could, in the face of the
country, avail themselves of as a justification of such a
course. As to the argument derived from the supposed
disaffection of the Catholics, we. have a short but satis-
factory answer to it. The Catholics are strong solely
from the justice of their cause. Be they seven or nine
millionS, the people of England and Scotland, if forced
to the arbitrement of the sword by the unjust preten-
sions of the Catholics, would not hesitate a moment
as to the course they should take. When a limb
is in such a state that it cannot be healed, a
man submits to amputation. But no sane man
thinks of cutting off a limb without necessity,
merely to show that he can do so. To deny
justice to the Irish on the ground that if we are
just they might abuse their power—to fill them with
discontent and disaffection—to fill them with heart-
burnings and animosities—to strive to goad them to
insurrection, because if they should lose their patience,
we might be able to coerce them—is the most incon-
ceivable of all weaknesses. The process of coercing.
the Irish may be necessary, but it must always be rui-
nous to ourselves, and it ought not to be thought of
till the last extremity.- Let us give to the Irish what
all liberal men, whether Protestants or Catholics think
they are entitled to receive ; and if the effect do not
correspond to our anticipations, we shall then, strong
in our cause, strong in the union of all good men, em-
brace the course which ought always to be reserved for
the last extremity. We can afford to be just because
we are strong ; but we are only strong because we are
just. Injustice towards the Irish would deprive us of
what would nerve our arm in a good and holy cause.
Let us hear no more, then, of denying equality of
rights to the Catholics, because Catholics are not to
be trusted.—Morning Chronicle.