The Sun.
London, England, 1849-02-06 00:00:00

ment.s contemplated by the Commission. It was most
desirable that the doubt which now existed on this subject
should be removed as pedily as possible; and he warned
the Chancellor of the Exchequer, who was on Wed-
nesday to propose a vote for the relief of distress in
Connaught, that if the Government did not take care
they would have to propos a similar grant next year for
the people of Munster. There was a vast emigration
going on from the South of Ireland, consisting not of the
lower classos, but of capitalists—thus leaving the poor
unassisted, and whose support must devolve upon the
Government of the country, unless means were devised
to give them reproductive employment.
Mr. GRATTAN did not think the speech of the Right
Hon. Baronet would give satisfaction to Ireland. The
avowal that it was not the intention of the Government
to abandon the idea of affording support to the able.
bodied at once destroyed all hope that any scheme that
the Committee might devise would be productive of be-
nefit. It had been attempted by the Red Republicans in
Paris, and had totally failed. He would not ask whether
the Right Hon. Baronet was a Red Republican; but he,
at least, was trying the same system in Ireland, where it
would not only fail, but would place the country in such
a situation ns to render it impossible for any proprietor
to reside in at all. He begged to correct an error into
which an lion. Member had fallen in stating that he
(Mr. Grattan) was not an advocate fur any poor-law.
On the contrary, some years ago, he, in conjunction with
his brother and Sir R. Musgrave, brought in a Bill on
that very subject.

Sir G. GREY explained. He had said that although
he thought it desirable to institute an inquiry into the
present working of the poor-law in Ireland, yet it was
not the intention of the Government to retrace their
stens and fall back to the minimum amount of relief
under the poor-law of 1846.
Mr. S. CRAWFORD maintained that the great
cause of all the evils in Ireland was want of employ-
ment, end that that employment would be instantly
given if the occupiers of laud were put in a position to
be assured that for the labour they employed they
would receive a just remuneration.
Mr. ST. GEORGE said, at present persons possessing
holdings at 41., and under, were exempt from paying
poor-rates. He objected to this, and believed that it
woul I be more advantageous to Ireland, if all persons
holding lands were required to pay their quota.
SCROPE hoped the Right Hon. Baronet, the
Secretary for Ireland would take care that the Com-
mittee should be supplied with those statistical facts
relative to the condition of the population, the tenancy
and other important particulars in reference to the cir-
cumstances of Ireland, for which:he had moved returns,
so as to enable them to resolve the question that would
be brought before them.
Sir W. SOMERVILLE did not think it possible that
Government could furnish all the details for which the
Hon. Member had moved a return, but he could assure
that Hon. Member that every return he could command
calculated to throw light upon the subject submitted to
the Committee he should feel great pleasure in producing.
The motion was then agreed to.
TROOPS EMPLOYED IN IRELAND.
Mr. GRATTAN the❑ moved for returns of the num-
ber of troops of the line or other forces employed in the
insurrection in Ireland, as mentioned in her Majesty's
Speech from the Throne; together with list anti names
of the killed and wounded, and the number and descrip-
tion of forces engaged on both sides; also, the amount
of expenses and costs in sending troops from Great
Britain to Ireland, and in moving the several regiments
and other armed forces in various parts of Ireland, on the
occasion of the said alleged insurrection.
Mr. F. MAULE hardly knew what it was his Hon.
Friend was desirous of obtaining. If he wished to know
the number of troops employed in Ireland during the
months of July, August, and September, when a dis-
turbance was apprehended, he (Mr. F. Maule) had no
objection to furnish him with a return. But it was per-
fectly well known to all the world that, from the precau-
tions taken by the Government in Ireland, from the
judgment displayed by the officers in command, and
from the excellent conduct of the troops, no collision
took place between the military and the people; and,
therefore, no returns could be made, either of the killed
and wounded, or the number and description of the forces
employed on both sides. With reference to the expense
of removing the troops from this country on that occa-
sion, the costs were defrayed out of the current votes of
the House without any extraordinary vote for that pur-
pose, and as the making of the return would be attended
with a vast degree of trouble, and would after all afford
no valuable information to the House, he must ask to be
excused from putting the country to the expense of fur-
nishing it.
Mr. GRATTAN consented that the motion should be
withdrawn, and it was withdrawn accordingly.
On the motion of Mr. GRATTAN, the following re-
turns was ordered:—Return of the number andnames of
persons arrested under the suspension of the Habeas
Corpus Act i❑ Ireland, and for what alleged acts or
offences, the length of imprisonment, and it let out on
bail, or otherwise.