The Sun.
London, England, 1836-02-17 00:00:00

could create surprise in the mind of any impartial person, it
would be that, after having neglected all the ordinary courte-
sies between Members, he should have had the almost incom-
prehensible presumption—( Roars of laughter)—to address
his first communication to Mr. O'Connell, who, how-
ever, cannot but feel flattered that Mr. Hardy should
send him his compliments."—(Tremendous roars of laughter. )
Sir, I trust, if I am to judge at all by the confidence the Hon.
and Learned Member has displayed, that it will afford him sa-
tisfaction that I have sent my compliments.—( Great laughter.)
Sir, I trust that this evening the objections which were made
the first night will not be repeated, namely, that
it was a mock solemnity—(" Hear," and loud cheers)—a
designation which was given by the Hon. and Leal-tied Gentle-
man himself, not with perfect consistency, I think, because he
thought it a case for inquiry ; and how a case of mock solem-
nity should occupy the attention of the House—if it was fairly
a case for inquiry—howlit could be a mock solemnity the Hon.
and Learned Member must explain.—( Great cheering.) If
it was a case of mock solemnity, something had passed since
Thursday which had taken that title from it. Steps had been
taken by two Honourable Members, which had given
to this question a solemnity that it never had before.—
(Cheers.) I have had an opportunity of conversing
with the Hon. Member for Ipswich, who at that time treated
this question very lightly, and who stated, to show what Isis
feelings were upon the subject, that it was his intention to
move for an account of all the transactions and agreements
between all the Members of the House.—(Great laughter.)
Whether upon second consideration he found that such an in-
quiry would not suit all purposes I know not—(Great
laughter)—but, from considering it a case of no importance,
it became in his estimation of such magnitude and interest,
that he moved for hearing it at the bar of the House—( Cheers).
Another Hon. Member had presented a most extraordinary
petition, which I have only seen in the votes of the House, and
which petition appears to me to proceed upon grounds the
most extraneous with respect to this matter—( Great cheer-
ing)—it is presented in the name of a gentleman named Vigors,
who complains of imputations against himself in the two pe-
titions on the table of the House. The petition from Bath
never mentions his name—( Great cheering)—and in the one
from Carlow it is merely mentioned in two places—(Great
laughter from the Ministerial side of the House)—and
yet the petition is presented by the Honourable Member for
Liskeard, complaining of illegal, unconstitutional, and corrupt
conduct on the part of the petitioners. Sir, I don't know any-
thing in either of those petitions that complained of anything
like illegal, unconstitutional, or corrupt conduct on the part of
that gentleman.—(Loud cheers.) It appears that my mo-
tion will be attended with some good effect; for unless my
motion had been made, and this enquiry called for, 249
families and 316 widows and orphans—(Great laughter)—
would never have had their wants brought before the House.
—( Great laughter, and cries of " hear, hear," from Mr.
O'Connell.) The Hon. and Learned Member calls, " Hear,
hear." I ask him where he was when it is stated
that within the last few years circumstances alluded to in
that petition took place.—( Great cheering from the opposition. )
Why is it that the circumstances of these poor families, and
the orphans and widows, are so connected with this case? Why
is it that they have only now come out, when it is stated in
this petition that they have been persecuted for years
( Cheers.) Sir, having got rid of these preliminary observa-
tions, which I have no pleasure in making, I will now pro-
ceed to lay the case which I have to do before the House ;
and I assure you, Sir, that it lays in a very narrow compass.
It appears; Sir, that or. the 27th of May, a Committee ‘vhieh
was then sitting upon a petition against the election for
the county of Carlow, declared the election of -Vigors and
Raphael void. On the 28th May— only the very next day,
and of course before the people of Carlow could be consulted
on the matter, the Hon. and Learned Member for Dublin
called upon Mr. Raphael, and asked him to be a candidate fur
Carlow, at the same telling him that the expense would n.it
exceed 2,0001. On the 29th of May, only two days after tle:
seats were declared void, the Hon. and Learned Gentleman
again called upon Mr. Raphael, and not seeing him wrote him
as follows :

" 9, Clarg,es-street, May 29, 1835

"My dear Sir,—l remained at home, at some inconvenience,
until after the hour I mentioned. I was sorry I did not re-
main longer, as you called shortly after ; but as you left no
letter or other indication of acceding to my proposal, I take
for granted that you decline my offer—be it so. I only add
my belief that you will never again meet so safe a speculation.
I am quite sure I never shall hear of one.
" I have the honour to be, my dear Sir,
Your very faithful,
" DANIEL O'CONNELL.

" Alexander Raphael, Esq."
Sir, that reminds me of what was quai;.tly said by one of our
poets—( Loud cries of " Oh, oli," and laughter)—of what was
said by one of our early poets, " The thing for sale, calls forth
the seller's praise"—( Laughter)—and certainly, if it had been
wanted to puff one of the scats for Carlow, nothing could have
been better than the expression used by the Honourable and
Learned Member, when he assures his Friend that it
is so safe a speculation—(Laughter)—and that it would be
some time before he might have another so safe to offer.
It would seem, Sir, that the Hon. and Learned Gentleman
was very anxious that Carlow should have so distinguished a
Representative from his earnestness in the cause. In conse-
quence of that note a meeting took place on the Ist of June, at
which.a note was written and delivered to Mr. Raphael.
" 9, Clarges-street, June 1, 1935.
-1

" My dear Sir,—You having acceded to the terms proposed
to you for the election of the county of Carlow—viz., you are
to pay before nomination I,oool.,—say 1,0001., and a like sum
after being returned—the first to be paid absolutely and en-
tirely for being nominated, the second to be paid only in the
event of your having been returned, I hereby undertake to
guarantee and save you harmless from any and every other
expense whatsoever, whether of agents, carriages, counsel,
petition against the return, or of any other description, and I
make this guarantee in the fullest sense of the honourable
engagement that ybu should not possibly be required to pay
one shilling more in any event, or upon any contingency what-
soever. " I am, my dear Sir, your very faithful,
"A. Raphael, Esq." " DANIEL O'CONNELL."
A bargain was thus entered into between the Hon. and
Learned Member for Dublin and Mr. Raphael, and I ask his
Majesty's Attorney-General to state, if he will favour us,
whether he ever witnessed a more complete bargain and sale.
—( Cries of " Oh," and great cheering.) What was the
subject matter of it ? A scat in Parliament.—( Hear,
hear, hear.) If it bad been a bargain for a horse
nobody can doubt that it would be enforceable in a Court of
law, but it is not enforceable in a Court of law, because it
would be known it was a bargain fur a seat in parliament.
( Loud cheers from the Opposition.) Will any man tell me
that Mr. Raphael would have sat as representative of Carlow
if it had not been for thu 2,000/. ?—( Cheers. ) Will any man
tell me that Mr. Raphael would have been recommended by the
Learned and Hon. Member for Dublin, if it had not been for
the 2,oool.—(Renewed cheering from the Tories.) What more
is wanted for abargain ?—( Laughter and cheers.) If it be neces-
sary to show to what money the Hon. and Learned Member for
Dublin attached so much importance, I beg the attention of the
House to the note that was written by the Hon. and Learned
Member to Mr. Raphael subsequently, in which he asks over
and over again for the 1,000/. [The Hon. and Learned
Member here read the letter of the 4th of June. The Hon.
and Learned Member read "promises" for "prospects,"
which excited some laughter. ) lam somewhat shortsighted.
(Great laughter from the Ministerial side.) Now as the bargain
was made on the Ist of June, and this note was written on the
4th, it could not have been Mr. Raphael's prospects that were
so bright. The recommendation of the Hon. and Learned
Member had not arrived in Carlow,and whose prospects,therefore,
they were, I cannot divine.—( Loud cheers from the Opposition. )
The Hon. Gentleman here referred to the letter of the Bth of
June, and continued—Now, Sir, this is the bargain of which I
complain._( Hear, from Mr. O'Connell.) And when I
began the case, as I thought I was entitled to do the other
evening, I was called to order, because, as you said, the only
question before the Chair was, the petition should be on the table.
I was stating that from these circumstances I did not draw the
linference that sheer money went into the pocket of the Hon.
and Learned Gentleman.—( Hear, hear.) The House must
have observed what use has been made of that admission—and

they must see that, though I am but a little man—( Hear,
hear)—when I accuse, I am considered of great importance
when I come to acquit.—(Cheers from the Opposition.)
But, Sir, I was going on to state, that, although
in the event of a contest and petition, no money would remain
in the hands of the Hon. and Learned Gentleman, yet in
case the one had not been proceeded with, or the other pro-
secuted, a considerable sum must have been left unexpended.
There are some men to whom the gratification of their ambi-
tion is a matter of much greater consequence than any
amount of cash ; and if this feeling, so dear to his
heart, were gratified by adding to the number of those
who would be of his party in this House, Iv e may easily ac-
count for the anxious inquiries after Mr. Hamilton.—( Cheers
from the opposition.) But, Sir, when I recollect that the pe-
tition had been abandoned by the Hon. and Learned Gentle-
man, as appears from the statement in the newspapers on the
second or the third day of the sitting of the Committee,
and when I remind this Honourable House that the
county of Carlow is a small one, with scarce as many voters
as there are in the borough which I represent, I must believe
that the contest could not be expensive. And, I ask, what
would have been the case if there had been no contest or peti-
tion—seeing that there was paid 1,0001. for the nomination
alone? That nomination, according to the Hon. and Learned
Gentleman, was to be followed, not by an easy victory, but by
the shadow of a contest. We must recollect the difference be-
tween the cost of nomination, and the 1,0001. received for it.
I find it is part of the bargain that he shall not be called upon
for one shilling more ; but I do not find that it is part of the
bargain he shall have any returned.—( Hear, hear.) These
are the circumstances of the case. They lie in a very narrow
compass, and I have seen no defence of them, except in a
public paper; and certainly it would seem that, in the Editor's
estimation, the Hon. and Learned Member stands high ; and
also in the pet:l,4n that was presented last night, it is stated
that nothing nore common than an arrangement of that
kind—indeed it is stated that what has happened_" that the
money transactions alluded to in the said petitions were, as
your petitioner avers, and is advised, strictly legal, constitutional
and honourable ; that the great majority of your Honourable
House is accustomed to make similar money arrengements—
( Hear, hear)---in respect to their seats in the Commons'
Honse of Parliament." And, Sir, it is stated in the paper to
whichoae
candidate l have alluded,
should
lt gis m
the
e peonrse
eand
commonth
at hn tan that
this
instance, Mr. Vigors had reputation and popularity, in the
benefit of which Mr. Raphael was to participate. Has an
Hon: Member, who offers himself to his constituents, any
right to sell his reputation? Can he go to a friend and say,
you pay the expenses, and I will give you half my popularity
and half my reputation ?—( Hear.) I cannot understand that
any such bargain is legal. If it be, this will be the first time
I have ever heard of it, and I cannot understand that any per-

son who calls himself an agent in such a bargain, especially
if that agent be a Member of this Honourable House, can
attempt to support any bargain of that description.—(Cries
of " Hear, hear.") I cannot call the Honourable and Learn-
ed Gentleman an agent—l wonder that he condescends to
call himself an agent—because I never heard of an agent who
undertook to be responsible—" I hereby undertake to
guarantee and save you harmless from any and every other
expense whatsoever, whether of agents, carriages, counsel,
petition against the return, or of any other descrip-
-1 tion."—l do not know how a person who enters
into such a bargain can be called an agent—( Hear)—
I should rather think that Mr. Vigors, the petitioner of last
night, was the agent of the Hon. and Learned Member at
Carlow, rather than that the Hon. and Learned Member was
the agent of Mr. Vigors in London.—( Hear, hear, hear.)
The consequence is, that the Hon. and Learned Member no-
minates and puts in both Members for the county of Carlow,
Mr. Vigors, his personal friend, and Mr. Raphael, his friend,
as contractor. It is of very little consequence what sort of a
representative the people of Carlow are to get. They never
saw his face—they never saw anything of him but his Address,
though of this nothing belonged to him but his name.
—( Hear, and laughter.) If a man happens to possess
moral influence, he has no right to dispose of it for money.
A writ had been lately issued for a certain place, in conse-
quence of a Noble Lord's elevation to the other House—what
would be thought, I ask, of a Noble Lord, who has
great influence in this place, if he made such a bargain—
if he made such a bargain as this ? There are many consti-
tuencies in this country who would be glad to receive the
recommendation of an Honourable Baronet of great in-
fluence ; but what I put to the House is—if that Honourable
Baronet said to a candidate, " I have great influence
in this borough or county, and I will ensure your return if
you give me 1,000/. now, and another 1,0001. after your
return."—( Hear, hear.) If such a thing as this had taken
place, and if it had transpired, what would be thought of it
by the supporters of the Honourable and Learned Gen-
tleman ? Would not his conduct form the subject of their
strongest animadversion, mid would not the Honourable
and Learned Gentleman hiiCaself discharge some of those
arrows at him, which he is in the habit of flinging at
every leading Member who differs from him ? The question
is, what was to be done with this money ?—what was to pre-
vent the Hon. and Learned Gentleman from applying
it as he thought proper ?—what was to prevent him putting
it into his own pocket for his own personal aggrandizement ?
It appears therefore hardly necessary that I should enter
upon the circumstances subsequently stated, and which had
been in the hands of every Hon. Member of this House. Was
there no Irish patriot who would stand forward to fight the battles
of the people of Carlow, and spend two thousand pounds in
legal expenses to vindicate their rights, and to do justice to
Ireland ?"—( Laughter and cheers.) It appears that there was
a Gentleman who did make enquiries, a Gentleman whose
manly and straightforward conduct I have often admired in
this House—l mean Mr. Feargus O'Connor.—(Cheers.)
He
had inquired after it, for one passage runs thus—" It is not my
fault that Mr. Feargus O'Connor called upon you—refer him
and every body else to me—( Great laughter and cheering)—
I want part of the 1,000/. to send over."—(Laughter.)—And
on the same day the Hon. and Learned Member wrote the
following note to Mr. Hamilton :
" Sir—l beg you will hand my son, Mr. John O'Connell, the
1,000/. placed with you by Mr. Raphael for my use. My son
will give you a voucher for it.
" I have the honour to be, Sir, your obedient Servant,
"DANIEL -O'CONNELL."
It was on these grounds that I made the observations
relative to the Hon. Member for Youghal, as it appeared to
me that he should have known, before he went for the money,
to what purpose it was to be applied. But if this inquiry goes
on, it will be for the Committee to inquire into all the
circumstances.—(Cheers from both sides of the House.)
I do'nt know that it is necessary for me to make any further
observations with respect to the transaction. I have laid them
before the House, as I felt it my duty to do, and if the Hon.
Member can get rid of them either by at gument or evidence,
no man will rejoice more at it than myself, and the Hon. and
Learned Member ought to feel grateful to me. I shall only
make one more observation with respect to what fell
from the Honourable and Learned Member for Tipperary
on 'Thursday night.—(Hear, hear.) That Honourable and
Learned Member for a purpose which was but too evident—to
excite the prejudices of Hon. Members on that side the House
—choose to represent me, as put forward by the Conservatives.
No.") Sir, I happen to have a gentleman sitting behind
the Treasury Benches at this moment, to whom I mentioned
my intention two months ago, and if any Hon. Member
near me heard me mention it to him within the last month,
let him come forward and stamp me as a villain.—(Cheers.)
The Hon. Member for Tipperary, for the purpose of preju-
dice, puts me forward as a leader of the Conservatives.—
( Loud cheers.) I am not of the Monboddo Creed of
politics.—(Great laughter.) I know nothing of joints
anatomically or politically ; but I came into this House a free
and independent man, determined to act upon the principles
so beautifully expressed by the Noble Lord opposite, when he
introduced the Reform Bill. That is the ground on which I am
anxious to take my stand ; and if that be, to be a Conserva-
tive, I openly avow myself one.—(Cheers.) With respect to
bribery and corruption, I call on the Honourable Member
for Tipperary, and his friends on that side, to say if I ever
flinched when they were inquiring into those cases. But
I wish to be consistent.—(Great cheering.) And I cannot
understand those Gentlemen, who, after having hunted over a
small isolated place, lose their scent, and are paralized when
they find a wholesale dealer in the material.—( Great cheers. )
These Gentlemen call themselves Radicals, and mo-
nopolize the name of Liberals.—( Cheering.) Liberals,
indeed ! I know enough of such Liberals, as to
have nothing to do with men who will strain at a gnat and
swallow a camel.—( Loud and long continued cheerine-.)
The Hon. and Learned Gentleman then moved that a Select
Committee be appointed to enquire into the circumstances at-
tending the traffic and agreement between Daniel O'Connell
and Alexander Raphael, touching the nomination and return of
Alexander Raphael for the county of Carlow, and to report the
minutes of evidence, with their observations thereon.
Mr. O'CONNE L rose, and said—Sir, my first obser.
vation is, that the resolution proposed is exceedingly paltry ; it
does not extend the inquiry to the extent which I challenge
and demand. With that observation, Sir, I leave that
part of the case. My next observation applies to the com-
mencement of the Hon. and Learned Gentleman's speech. He
prefaced the speech, by saying that I was furnished with a
copy of the Petition before he was. Now, Sir, that is a fact
which I utterly deny.—(Cheers.) I utterly deny it, and
yet when he stated that as a fact, he Ras cheered by four-
fifths of the Gentlemen opposite, thereby showing a
partiality at which I am not surprised—( Hear, hear)
—for I believe that they have not even hypocrisy enough
to deny, that they are willing and anxious to have an oppor-
tunity of condemning me. Sir, when I heard that cheer
it put me in mind of an anecdote which was once
told me by the present Lord Chief Justice Bushe,
after the rebellion of 1798. I had it from his own bps. He was
engaged as counsel for a man at the Wexford Assizes, who was
charged with murdering a man named James White. The
trial came on after the Act of Amnesty had been passed, which
exempted all except those guilty of murder. The case was
tried before Baron Smith, the father of the present
Baron Smith. Two witnesses swore positively that they
saw James White killed. Mr. Bushe the Counsel for
the prisoner, asked only to call one witness. The witness
was the murdered man, who swore that he was alive and well.
—(Loud laughter.) The case went to the Jury, and the
Jury returned a verdict of guilty. " Guilty," said his Lord-
ship, "why, the man's alive." " Very true, my Lord ; but,
that's all the Indemnity Act," said the foreman of the Jury,
"he stole my best grey mare that I have hunted fifty
miles many a day, and I'll hang him for that, as I can't
hang him for the murder." ( Cheers and laughter.) This
was described to me by the present Chief Justice of Ire-
land as a literal fact. Now, when I heard the cheers of the
Hon. Gentlemen opposite to-night, I thought that I, like the
prisoner at Wexford, was to be convicted of one offence be-
cause I had committed another; that I was to be convicted of
corruption because I had put down Toryism.—( Cheers. )
That is my real crime. It is not that a man was returned at
the trifling expense of 2,0001. for a contested county election,
but that seeing Toryism, as the gray horse, again riding rough
shod over Ireland, I forgot every passion and prejudice of my own
—forgot all my own wrongs—( Oh, oh I and cheers)—and threw
the whole of my influence in the country in opposition to the
Tories.—(Cheers.) Yes, my offence is, that I put myself
forward as an instrument to support the present Government,
and to keep the Tories where they now are, and I trust always
will be.—( Cheers.) I call upon the House then to look upon
this matter, not as a mock solemnity, although I certainly
cannot help thinking that there is something of mockery in it,
but as a matter of grave and serious consideration. The Hon.
and Learned Member for Bradford (Mr. Hardy) heard me
the other evening, when I stated that I knew an individual
who declared that he (Mr. Hardy) had expended upwards of
7,000/. in his own election.—(Hear hear.) The Hon. and
Learned Gentleman heard me spe;k of that election. He
heard me repeat the statement I had heard. Yet neither on
the former evening, nor in the course of his speech to-night,
has he said one word in contradiction of it.—(Hear, hear.)
Oh, then, I know what his mock solemity is.—(Cheers.) Oh,
then, I know what his straining at a gnat and swallowing a
camel means.—(Loud cheers.) For mark, his party was ac-
cused of purchasing votes at from 3/. to 201. a piece.
An Hots. Mame—Not at the last election.
Mr. O'CONNELL.—Oh ! no, not at the last election.
Votes came otherwise at the last election.—( Hear, hear.) No
one but the Hon. and Learned Member himself knows what
were the costs and expences of the last election.—( Hear,
hear.). But I come to the question. There is not a man in
this House or out of it who does not know that this is a party
attack ;—( Cheers)—that it is the attack of a party who have
used the press, and bribed the press to assail me ;—( Cheers)—
that very press, amongst others, which belongs in a great mea-
sure to a Member of this House, and who himself expended
30,000/. or 40,000/. in his election for an English county.—
( Cheers.) I shall, perhaps, revert to this part of the subject
again before I sit down, for I do hope that this case will be
a useful one. I know what the amount of hypocrisy in this
House is. I know how many of those who affect to see a
mote in the eye of his neighbours, will still allow the beam to
remain in their own.—( Hear, hear.) I have often been the
instrument, by means of my enemies, of effecting much public
good ; and I fancy that such will be the result of the present
inquiry, which ought to be extensive and searching, and not a
miserable, paltry, pitiful investigation, which the Hon. and
Learned Member for Bradford conscientiously limits to a par-
ticular transaction.—( Hear, bear.) Instead of being confined
to such nari ow and contemptible grounds, the inquiry ought to
extend to the whole of the late general elections.—( Oh ! and
cheers.) We have sage doctors among us, men learned in the
forms and technicalities of the House, who, no doubt, would op-
pose such a proposition ; but I dare you to the contest. If you
ask for inquiry at all, I hope you are prepared to make it exten-