The Sun.
London, England, 1813-05-14 00:00:00

clauses of the• Right Hon,
_Gentleman (Mr, Cam
icing). In hi,4 opinion theitight Hon,Gentletnat\.
(Mr. Grattan)• had taken a discreecand sop iitkviey
of the ineasure lee had to peopbse.. • At fIYSI the.
Right Hon. Gentleman hati,seemed disposed to
proceed liy a much more general repeal than lie
bad now followed,out in his. Bill. In, departing
from this course he had strewn his, usual, ability,
for it' he had pursued his other plan. be (Lorii. C.)
could not have consented to revoke all. the Acts of
Parliainent implicated, which could not have been
done without agitating the mind of, the country./
wai, thefefore that he,so much approved.of the
wiser-course taken by, the Right
_Hon. Gentleman,
to see what objects the Catholics had in view; and
what could be granted consistent with the fit se-.
cfirities for Church and,State, He agreed that we
Ought to give all' we could, and ask no securities
but such as the Catholics would notoriously grant.
It mustbe• Observed, that by admitting. time Catho-
lics f.to the . Legislature (one of the greatest , ad, .
vantages- of this measure) -they not only admitto ate,l
'them to their .contmon rights, but also
power in the Protestant Church, in so far as the.
Church was inseparably connected with the State.
In return for this, we ought to be permitted as
great a privilege in regard_to their foreign hierar-
chy, anti as a cournerpoise:for the authority thus
given, and a security against encroachment. For
this purpose the Right 'Hon, Gentleman had de-
vised the genkral security of oaths, He felt, no
distrust of the oath of a Catholic, hut on the con-
trary thought it entitled to the . highest confi-
dence, since itwas their regard to its. sanctity alone
which impeded their progress to .political power.
But he' objected to this species of security, not
only as applied to Catholics, hat to Protestents.
'Po meet all dangers. ,by barriers of oaths, shewed'
great poverty of legislation, and want of knowledge
of human nature. It was only by • estimating
indl acting upon the prejudices of mankiud, they .
could be- enabled to draw out a-desirable re-
sult, He wads, hostile to oaths, generally as a se-
curity, and mote especially in a political Inea •
sure. where separate interests .were concerned,—
With respect to the oaths, themselves, 'he found
no fault with.them : set far as they could he .rens
dered binding and conclusive, the Right Hen,
Gentleman: bad ,; succeeded with those lie, he'd
;framed ; but he opposed, himself to the,generak
principle of placing 'all their reliance in any case
on' oaths at all. Upon another point, he begged
leave to suggest a doubt as to the propriety of the
measure, and to inquire whether the Right. lion,
Gentleman had not , here gone a little beyond the
bounds, of prudence, Ile alluded to the repeal
generally ofancient oath 4 and Jests. If Dissen-
ters were excluded: by,thcexistence of these,AetS,
• nothing could justify their
,continuance; ,but as
they 'were admitted, by an annual Bill of in-
deinnificatiOn, -he thought the seine. course
might be adOpted . towards. lie
This would inure, worthy of the Right ,Ho-:
nourable Gentleman's prudence, than by a revo-
' 'cation of the test laws to agitate the public mind.
With .respect to the general. power of the Papal.
See; produced by
,causes not appareut, be could
entirely concede to the principle of a Right Hen.
Gentleman '(Mr. Cenninu) in the clause be had
produced; and which might be takett ,as part of
the Bill. Though he differed from the Right Ho-
tnntrahle, Gentleman on some pthiCular. points
that .respected the,foreign relations of the Cacho-,
lics, yet he thought that they 'must, come to an
understanding on that subject. •On the subject of,
the disposal of.hishopries in the Roman Catholic
Church in this eountry, it was not "his intention
to claim on the part.of
,the Crown any direct no-'
minatiorts. His Views on that subject included not
merely the appoiamcnt Of but a distinct
temporal interest which4m Cat Folic Clergy could
not fail to have with,the See of Rome, and which it
, was necessary to counterbalance. 'The means by
wh this, was.to be effected would be, by butane-
lag their interests in the sovereignty of the kingdOM
egaitsis, that- which.they had with the See of Romer;
9h the subject of the appointment of Copunis.
'stoners to approve of ,the election of Homan. Ca.-
, AtiOlie Bishops, as op•dered by one of the clauses
-proposed ..by the Right; Hon. GentleMati,, he
thought tttt. the' .Right Honourable Gentleman
could not) but feel unwilling to impose' upon
Ahese person the 'exereiSeof'fituctions, the dis-
charge of which. could not :in ruby cases, be
otherwise.than most, ungrateful and unpleasant..--
-By the'clattse of the Right Bon. Gentleman, theSe
Commissioners, were. Oiled Upon to exercise their
authority in approving or dislipproving of persons
:elected as .Bishops.. n . these cases, in which the
:•.,Commissioners would be calk upon in ciniScienee
..-to disapprove Of the persons,,they Were Obliged to
intlict upon him the, disability exercising-the
episcopal duties, and, of course, Would either ba-
nish him from. thelingdom, or deprive him of the
means:of subsistence, The, effect
-,would 'necessarily
be, that the ex creiscof the duties of Commissioners,
would fall into disuse, from the unpleasant nataire•
of their functions, and these necessary antics
would not be executed hat in cases of gleritx nO-
toriety.- lie had, not. made these 'statements with
the intention of combating- the principle upori
which the )tight Hon.'Gentleman had proceeded;
it was the mode and not the-priuciple to which he
objected. His objeesion to the mode consisted
cimicity in this; that he conceived. that it would he
better gone by the known laws of the Constitu-
tion than by the means suggested by the Right
Hon, Gentleman, The clause propoSed by' the
Right lion. tientleinan gave so great a discretion
to a power not known to' the Constitution ; and
went to give a power to persons, Whick, if
they were disposed to abuse, . might do it in
such way as to be dangerous to Ale' country.
Adverting to the second clause proposed 'by the
Right Hon. Gentleman, he. doubted whether be'
perfectly understood his view,„„ Ile conceived it
to,be framed with air view of; protecting the State
against, any acts whicli,Might mix temporal with
.spiritual power. lie thought that the:-clause was
deficient in that it did-not
_profess to submit the
instrument itself, ,which ought to be examined,
but therely, ordered that a copy of the instrument
shoidd be submitted to the inspection of the State,.
if the: catholic% wished ti.i.inspire confidence in
the Protestai;ts', it did not, behove: Ahem' to give
imperfect security when it was in their poster to