The Sun.
London, England, 1849-05-25 00:00:00

in that colony, and such a rule in law he considered
it was the duty of the present Government to introduce
rather than leave it to any private Member. Next ho
would call the attention of the House to Canada a few
years past, and see what the feelings of the people there
are. The French /Canadians evinced a desire to be
united to the United States, and if they had
persevered, with the assistance of those States, the Bri-
tish Government would be overpowered, and their mo-
tive for this wish was a determination to have a legisla-
tive assembly for themselves. The measure was at first
opposed, but when driven to necessity, as in all cases,
they then passed a measure for that purpose, for the
United States boasted that they would extend their ter-
ritories in that direction, and that the French Canadians
would be under their own laws; the Upper Canadians as
they were then, and the Lower Canadians, would be
similarly legislated for as Lousiana. He, therefore,
strongly recommended the Government to adopt some
certain rule, for that colony was by no means like New
Zealand, which was far remote, and he apprehended that
if such a measure were not immediately adopted that the
Canadians would, before long, throw themselves on the
United States. If resistance he offered by the British
Government, it would be only by ear—war if you
please—but it would be a most disastrous war—Canada
must be independent, and when she does rebel
it will be only to become one of the United States.
For that reason he wished to prevent such dangerous
consequences, and therefore hoped that by some pre.
determined rule they would make that colony think it-
self proud in being the offspring and friends of England,
fur if such were not dorie, America would possess the
Sr. Lawrence, and would extend its dominions to the
Pole. It was not by half measures, or petty measures,
or by Colonial Office red tape proceedings, but by far
sighted and statesmanlike policy. He considered that
much good, and no mischief whatever would emanate
from his plan, for it would confederate those States
north of the Oregon, which the United States would,
ere long, take possession of, and thus it would endear
those people to the interests and glory of England. He
had been told that his plan was preparing a way for the
independence of, Canada; but to that he should say that it
was better to anticipate such an event, for he knew that the
time was not far distant when such an occurrence was
likely to take place. His plan was not that she should be
separated by war, but be united by ties of amity and
affection, which he considered to be the strongest bonds
between the mother country and her colonies. He
would also have the boundaries defined between the
United States and British America, and have a Gover-
nor- General appointed by the British Government, but
no one else. He would next have the Canadas divided
into separate states, and empower each state to send its
representative member to their Legislative Assembly, in
the same manner as the United States. Thus when the
people of that country find that though colonies, they
have been invested with the authority of a nation, though
without their own army or navy, they would feel all the
d:gnity and honour of a confederated body, and by this
means be able to compete in every way with the United
States. Thus will they and their children feel indepen-
dent, happy, and proud of England, and be always pre-
pared to lend her the arm of strength, if required, in-
stead of being forced, as they at present were, and sub-
ject to humiliation, shame, and difficulties. It was on
that account that he begged the House to allow him to '
lay before them that law which he felt fully assured
would tend materially to the interest and advantage of
this great country.—(Hear, hear.)
Mr. WYLD seconded the motion. •
• Mr. HAWES said that his Hon. Friend (Mr. Roe-
buck) had, with his usual characteristic frankness and
straightforwardness, already explained his views on that
subjectlay a very powerful and' comprehensive work? and
hart thus given the public and the House a fair opportu-
nity. of carefully examining "into' all the 'details of his
plan. He did net, therefore, approach that subject as
on ordinary occasions, because, if he had.proposed. to in-
troduce a Bill without lotting the House know what it
was, he should not be prepared to admit it under any
circumstances ; but, as he (Mr. Roebuck) had given
them the opportunity of knowing it in all its details, he
ccnsidered that he was not bound to sheev his reasons.
for opposing its introduction. The House was aware
that Government was determined that, in the event of a
Bill being introduced, if not going to a second reatiing,
it was better to deal with it as they would when read a
second time, and for that reason he opposed the intro-
duction of the Bill, and wished to give his reasons for
acting so. He concurred with the Honourable Gen-
tleman in considering that the highest function
of a statesman was to consider for, and sup-
prt, the colonial empire that we possess; but
ho did not at all think that this country had been in
any way a source of humiliation or disgrace, or the
cause of a status of inferiority of our colonies. He felt
happy to agree with the Hon. Gentleman in reference to
North America, South Africa, New Zealand, and Aus-
tralia, for he did not propose to alter the Government's
administration of empire, but to limit their actions here-
after by the introduction of a mere perfect system, and
to maintain the power and authority of the Crown over
those colonies. He also proposes, in opposition to the
opinions of some llon. Members, to maintain, to protect,
and to increase our colonial settlements; and to that he
adds, that wherever large colonies exist they should be
divided into provinces, and be governed by a confederate
government of their own. He again proposes that a
Governor should be appointed by the Imperial Government
for those colonies, and in those opinions he is in perfect
harmony with those that already exist among the members
of her Majesty's Government. He also agrees with him,
that it should be the object of all Colonial Ministers to
facilitate as much as possible colonial legislation. But
he proposes that his Bill shall enable any parties to make
applications for settlements, and that the Colonial
Secretary should be imperatively called to act on their
appliearion.
Mr. IZOEBUCK—It was only when it was determined
that colonies should be formed, that settlements would be
imperatively called for.

Mr. HAWES—The same obstructions would exist
then as now, and thus many colonies would be lost be-
fore that resolution could be attended to. He would
ask, how were the expenses of the settlement to be met
—the making of the survey, and the various expenses
incidental to a settlement ? As regarded their North
American colonies, he thought the plan proposed by his
Honourable and Learned Friend involved insuperable
difficulties. As regarded Canada, the land was under

,he control of the Legislature of Canada, and yet his
ion. and Learned Friend wished this country to have

the power to authorise settlements. Nothing he thought
could be worse than to permit such imperial interference.
His Honourable Friend had stated that population had
increased much faster in the United States than it had
done in Canada, and he had produced a map, which he
(hlr. Hawes) must say was of a delusive character. In
that map he had run the boundary of Canada up to the
North Pole; but surely he could not mean to propose
that settlements would be made up to that point. But
his Hon. and Learned Friend was in error when he said

that the population in Canada was small. He admitted
that his Hon. Friend had proposed a large and compre-
hensive scheme, but it was one which could be fairly
opposed on its merits, and on that ground he would
meet it. As to the statement about the increase
of population in the United States, ho would
,tato that in the year 1776 the population of the
United States was three millions, and nt the same time
the population of Canada was 200,000. The present
population of the United States amounted to 23 millions,

being an increase since 1776 of scarcely fourfold, while
in Canada the population was about two million•, being
an increase during the same period of tenfold.—(Hear.)
By that test he had a right to say that the English sys-
tem was as good as that of the United States, and that
there had been a more rapid increase of population in
the Canadas than there had been in the United States.
lie was not going to justify the acts of past colonial ad-
ministrations. It misgovernment prevails-d for a long
time in Canada, it must of course have retarded its pro-

gross. But there was now an increase of wealth anti of
population, which ought rather to cull forth praise than
language of strong condemnation. His lion. Friend 1,
seemed to think that the system of America would work '
well with this country; but he (Mr. Hawes) had
no hesitation in saying that it would not, and that
its application would involve, among other things,
the repeal of the union with the Canadas. The Hu-
son's Bay Company, for instance, bad a charter, and, as
he stood up for the independence of the colonies, he
would not consent to any interference on the part of the
Crown, without the consent of the colonies. With refe-
rence to New Zealand, his Hon. and Learned Friend had
expended some sarcasm regarding the new constitution,
which had, he said, been proposed one day, and aban-
doned another. Now, the Governor of that colony ob-
jected to that constitution, because it gave exclusive
power to a small body of Europeans over a large body
of natives. Native rights had been recognised, and he
hoped that the difficulties arising out of the laud ques-
tion in that country, had been brought to a close.—
(Hear, hear.) But they could not have settlements in
that country; and it would be in the highest degree,
improper, as reg arded Canada, to give assent to a Bill
which would interfere with the powers of the co-
lonial legislature. He would now come to the
Cape of Good Hope. They had there a large and power-
ful race of men. He would take Natal, and if they
attempted a settlement there they would at once be
brought into hostile collision. In New South Wales
they had a Legislative Council that was elected, and the
colony was governed according to the views of the ma-
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,erceta
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e
self-government. Why, the answer was, that they had
self-government already.—(Hear.) He (Mr. Hawes)
would maintain that, in Canada, so long as the Crown
exercised the power it now exercised, and while it had
a legislative body, and the people elected it, that it
possessed as complete a system of self-government as
any colony could have.—(Hear, hear.) He would now
state that it was his intention before the holidays to an-
nounce a measure which Government meant to bring
forward to give local government to Australia. It was
intended to submit a plan to unite all those distant colo-
tiles, leaving them at the same time separate local govern-
talents, bat giving them a General Assembly for general
governmene His objections to the measure proposed
by his Hon. and Learned Friend were of a practical cha-
racter, and of great importance, and were not to be got over
by any alteration in the details. He thought it was more
important to populate and centre capital in the colonies
thy possessed than unnecessarily to increase them.
lie had, in the outset, alluded to the difficulties of pro-
viding the money, and he would ask how were they
to provide for a settlement if it did not succeed ?
They could not leave people to starve ; and he
believed there was not one colony which had been
successful without direct as,istance. England had to
send Australia half a million, and since then South
Australia had increased in wealth and prosperity, and
was one of their most valuable colonies. It was a great
mistake to suppose that their colonies had not made
great progress in wealth, in freedom, in security, and all