The Sun.
London, England, 1849-06-25 00:00:00

THIRD READINGS.

The following Bills were read a third time and passed:
Lancaster and Preston Junction Railway Acts
Amendment (Powers to alter Tolls, and for appoint-
ment of Officers).
Taff Vale Railway (Extension in Merthyr Tydfil).
Tyne River Conservancy.
Williams's Estate.
CONSIDERATION OF REPORTS.

The following REpprts were considered and agreed to:
Airdrie Police and Municipal Bill.
Flimwell Vent to Hastings Turnpike Road Bill.
PETITIONS.

The Sheriffs of London and Middlesex appeared at
the bar and presented a petition from the Lord Mayor,
Aldermen, and Corporation of the City of London in
favour of the B Lnkruptcy Bill ; also a petition against
the Marriage Bill.
Mr. LAW presented a petition from the Irish Society
against the Leasehold Tenure of Lands (Ireland) Bill,
and praying to be heard by counsel at the bar of the
House.
Mr. DEEDES presented petitions from Bromley and
other places against trading in seduction and prosti-
tution.

Mr. W. DROWN presented a petition from Manches-
ter in favour of the Bankruptcy Bill.

Mr. HALE presented a petition from Gloucester
against the Attorney's certificate duty.
Mr. ALEXANDER HASTIE presented a petition
from Glasgow against the Marriage Bill.
Mr. CARDWELL presented a ;petition from Liver-
pool, suggesting a clause to be inserted into the Bank-
ruptcy Bill, with respect to the arrest of debtors.
Mr. H. BROWN presented a petition from Stirling
in favour"of the Health of Towns (Scotland) Bill.
COLLIERY EXPLOSION AT ST. HELEN'S.

WYLD begged to ask the Secretary of State if
he had received any official intelligence respecting the
explosion of a coal mine at St. Helen's, which happened
a day or two ago?
Sir GEORGE GREY said he had not received any
intelligence, official or otherwise, of any accident of that
kind at St. Helen's, though ho bad heard of the cir-
cumstance.
Mr. WYLD then asked (as we understood) if the
Right Hon. L'aronet would have any objection to lay on
the table of the House the official correspondence re-
specting the explosion at Hebburn.
Sir GEORGE GREY said he would shortly lay the
papers on the table of the House.
PETITION OF MR. HERCULES HARRIS.

Mr. ANSTEY presented a petition from Mr. Hercules
Harris, a member of the Irish bar, who stated he was
counsel for the plaintiff in a late action of replevin. The
action had reference to the recovery of a poor-rate; and
the petitioner complained that, having prepared a plea
questioning the legality of the rate for which the distress
vas levied, the' Judges of the Court of Common Pleas
in Dublin refused to allow the plea to be argued.
INC UMBERED ESTATES (IRELAND) BILL.

Mr. OSBORNE asked the Noble Lord at the head of
the Government if he had any objection to state to the
House who were the three Commi,sioners whom he pro-
posed to appoint under the Incumbered Estates (Ireland)
Bill?

Lord JOHN RUSSELL hoped to be able to do so
before the session closed.
• THE IRISH CHURCH.

Mr. ROCHE wished to ask the Hon. Member for
Montrose a question relative to two motions on the
paper for the 10th of July. His Hon. Friend, the
Member for Middlesex, had a motion on the parer refer-
ring tosthe Ii ish Church; and his Hon. Friend, the Mem
ber for Montrose, had a motion on the paper before that
relating to British Guiana. Now the question he wished
to ask the Hon. Member was, whether he would give
way in favour of the motion for an inquiry into the state
of the Irish Church.
Mr. HUME said no man was more anxious that the
question of the Irish Church should be speedily disposed
of than he was, but it must be remembered that the
Government of British Guiana was at a stand-still, and
he therefore could not give way, unless Government
would give him a day for his own motion.
Mr. REYNOLDS suggested that the Hun. Member
could bring, his motion on to-morrow.
Mr. HeME could not do that; but he would discharge
his notice, acd bring the motion forward on going into
Supply.
Lord JOHN RUSSELL saN it must not be sup-
posed that he was a party to this arrangement.
The SPEAKER, remarked that it would be irregular
to discharge the notice then.
The subject then dropred.
TRANSPORTATION (IRELAND) BILL.

On the motion tor the third reading of this Bill,

Mr. NAPIER. said he should✓not take up the

time of the House with any lengthened observations a
this stsge of the Bill, but he was bound to protest again
this exposi facto mode of ;fistattng in cases of coo
victed criminals. It was decidedly unconstitutional
11., thought the measure most uncalled fur and unconsti

:utional,— and he should therefore oppoze the third

reading.

Co!Lel RAWDON also opposed the third reading
of 'the 1311, and trusted that the House would never
sanction a measure containing such provisions.
Mr. SPOONER said it was his intention to vote
against the Bill. The question involved in it was a
great constitutional one, and it was to his mind
an infraction of the constitution to bring, in
any Bill to enact an ex post facto law, and
which, besides, would have the effect of aggravating
instead of mitigating the punishment of the persons at
whom it was aimed. He complained that no necessity
had been shown for such a measure. It was true doubts
had arisen in the highest legal quarters with respect to
the right of the Crown to transport these parties; but where
doubts existed in such grave cases it was customary to
give the accused the benefit of them.—(Dear, hear.)
The Attorney-General, ho believed, had failed to show
sufficient cause why the House should pass this measure.
Sir GEORGE GREY said, that ac far as he could see
both the Honourable Gentleman who had just spoken
had arrived at the conclusion that the case was so
clear that there was no need of discussion about
it. The Honourable Gentleman had said that

this Bill had come before the House sanctioned by
the opinions of the high judicial authorities of the land,
but he assured the House that no hesitation had existed
in the minds of these authorities; but as there were
said to be doubts existing on the subject, they had ad-
vised that such a Bill should be introduced. He must
remind the House again that the position in which these
parties stood was that of men 'whose lives were forfeited
to the laws of the country. It is only at this moment by
the mercy of the Crown that they are at present able to
petition. He must say that it was quite a mistake to
say that this Bill was intended as an aggravation of
punishment.
Mr. FEARGUS O'CONNOR said he quite agreed
with the regret which had been expressed by
an . lion. Cieutleuran that co much extraneous
matter bad been introduced into this debate.

lie had refrained from mingling in this debate
as he did from all Irish debates. He thought it would
be better if this matter were confined entirely to the
Gentleman who had managed the measure.
Mr. SEIARMAN CRAWFORD wished to separate
the matter from Ireland and Irish Members, and

to argue it on constitutional grounds.—(Hear, hear.)
The tact was that the House had untertaken to interpose
between the prisoners and the courts of law. He would
appeal to those Members who were in the habit of sup-
porting the rights of the Crown. He would appeal to
the Hon. Member for Sheffield; and this appeal he
might safely make, as although he was largely interested
in Ireland, he represented a large constituency which
was purely British, and he trusted that it would be re-
sponded to rightly.—(Loud cries of "Divide, divide.")
Mr. REYNOLDS said, that as this was the last time
when he should have an opportunity of speaking upon
this question, as this was the last means that could be
adopted before this measure passed into law, as this was
the last act of the drama, he was, he confessed, surprised
at the endeavours which were made to prevent one Irish
Member from speaking. He was anxious to say that in
voting against this Bill they were not voting against an
act of mercy. The contrary was the case. So long as
the prisoners were to be confined within the realm less
ground of complaint would remain, but such was not
likely to be the case. Did the Chancellor of
the Exchequer ever attempt to put the expenses
of this prosecution on the debit side of
the account he would be a little more careful of in-
curring any further. He had no hesitation in saying
that the attempt of the Government to put down five
men had not cost less than a million of the public
money.—(Hear, hear.) Why, had they not been
obliged to keep upwards of 30,000 troops in the
country. That body of men had cost upwards of half
a million, and it was proved that the army had cost more
than it did two years before. Taking those with the
cost of the constabulary, and the other necessary ex-
penses, it would appear that he had not been guilty
of any great exaggeration in making this
statement. Having stated this much on this the last op-
portunity of opposing the Bill he should offer no further
opposition to it, and content himself with simply record-
ing his vote.
The House then divided, when there appeared—
For the amendment ... 27
Against it ... ... 159
Majority ... ... —132

Mr. ANSTEY moved as an amendment, at line 15, of
page 1, to omit the word " transportation," and insert
" imprisonment during the Queen's pleasure or banish-
ment." There could be no doubt that transportation
was a worse punishment than death itself. He
would not inquire how far confinement during the
Queen's pleasure fell short of that; a few years or a few
months might determine it, but by a large con-
struction it might extend to the natural life of
those unfortunate gentlemen. The Bishop of Tasmania
stated in his report, for which he received the thanks of
Earl Grey, that although the system of punishment now
followed in Van Dieman's Land was superior to any that
bad preceded it, yet it had given rise to abominable
practices, and that nothing but a commission of
inquiry from England, with full powers of in-
quiry, would ever bring them entirely to light.
The Honourable Gentleman said " the most disgust-
ing crimes that ever stained the character of man
were perpetrated in the prisoners' barracks at Ho-
bart Town without the least possible way of
preventing them." Pass this Bill, and it would be im-
possible for the House not to consign Mr. Smith O'Brien
to that infamous confinement. The system was one of uni-
formity of punishment, though of equality it was not; and
the Right Hon. Gentleman the Secretary of State for
the Home Department dared not make an exceptions in
(himilsr.oAn
ntalateeyir)
parroripvoasle, d nbeycehsissaarimlyenwd
mereents utebj
favoura of any one convict, from the system in which
amendment to substitute imprisonmensteuebt's duringtituiitee
lithee hopQ aeede utiase
Hploena.,nrbaerfeotr
a trran‘spvo.rmtateiloe
aydifference between Irish,
more, that the latter
ns
wo rf hr ) life.id
not consider that there .vason English, and American rebels—
should be rewarded.
The ATTORNEY-GENERAL opposed the motion.
These persons having been convicted of high treason, and.
the Government wishing to act leniently towards them,
and a doubt existing as to whether the Government had
the power or not to do so, the Government wished to
remove it; but the Hon. and Learned Gentleman wished
the Covernment to adopt two courses with respect to
persons who had thus been committed of high
treason, namely, either to hang or to imprison
them. Now the argument was so absurd that
lie was sure it would not avail with that
House. The Government merely wished to assimilate
the Irish to the English law in this respect; and he
trusted the Howe would do nothing to restrict the pre-
rogative of mercy.
Mr. LAWLESS enquired what might be done by the
Government after these parties bad been transported ?
The ATTORNEY. GENERAL replied that it would
be most improper to answer the question.—(Bear.)
After so,re observations from Dr. POWER and Mr.
DICKSON, strangers were ordered to withdraw, and the
House divided, when there appeared—
-

For the amendment
.Ag.linst it
Majority against it
The amendment was accordingly lust.