The Sun.
London, England, 1831-03-16 00:00:00

they seldom received more than the half-pay of military
rank. His object in moving for the return was for he
purpose of ascertaining whether it could not admit of
some reduction, and he would not, therefore, trouble the
House further at present than by merely asking, whether
it was possible that they could have suffered from such a
course of imprudence and extravagance if they had pos-
sessed a Reformed Parliament?—(Cries of " Hear !"
from one side of the House—echoed by still louder
" Hears !" from the other.)—The Hon. Member then
moved for a return of the date of all diplomatic and con-
sular pensions, whether included, or not included, in the
return of civil and military, with the date of appoint-
ments and length of service of the several persons receiving
such pensions.
•

Lord ALTHORP did not object to the production of
' the return moved for by the lion. Member, but felt it
necessary to sap one or two words with respect to a mis-
ccnception into which he had fallen on the subject of
diplomatic pensions. The fact was, that persons who had
been in the diplomatic service did not receive any pensions,
but merely half-pay; and if it was admitted to be expe-
dient, as be believed it to he, that the country should pos-
sess a certain class of men educated in this service, and
who made it their profession, then he conceived that the
Government must retain some means of retaining them in
its service, and repaying them for the discharge of their
duties. He did not think the expences required for this
service could be well diminished, but it was for the House
to determine, and he believed the expences were in con-
formity with the resolutions already entered into on the
subject.

Mr. HUME said, that the Finance Committee of 1828
made a recommendation on the subject of these pensions,
and he should be glad to know from the Right Hon. Ger:.
tleman below him (Mr. Geulburn), whether it had betn
adhered to since that period by the Members of the late
Government? He was of opinion that the merits of the
diplomatists had been always much over-rated, and their
services much over-paid.

Mr. GOULBUIiN believed that the suggestions of the
Finance Committee in this matter had been uniformly at-
tended to. He did not propose to say much on the ques-
tion before the House at that moment; but this much he
would observe, that he did not think the sum we paid to
Ambassadors was too large, considering the expenses they
incurred.

Mr. LENNARD denied that the recommendation of
the Finance Committee had been attended to, for be found
that in the late Civil List, the pensions of this class were
set down at 46,0001., although the Committee restricted
them to 40,0001.

Mr. GOULBURN, in explanation, said, the cause of
this apparent difference wag, that the pensions were
46,0001., and the Government engaged not to exceed the
sum of 40,0001., and to allow them to descend to that
amount. The motion was then agreed to.
NEGLECT OF THE CALL OF THE HOUSE.
The Seijeant-at-Arms having announced that Mr. Ma-
berly was in custo ly for neglecting to attend the call of the
House.

Lord ALTHORP moved that the Hon. Member be dis-
charged on payment of his fees, and he Was discharged
accordingly.

UNION OF WICKLOW.
Mr. GRATTAN, in moving for a copy of the memo-
rial presented to the Lord Lieutenant, from the parishioners
of the union of Wicklow, adverted to the complaint, that
the Archbishop had made an improper statement with re-
spect to the valuation of the union, and observed, that
when the memorial was before the House, it would have
an opportunity of ascertaining with greater precision the
true merits of the case. The question was not one of
Catholic against Protestant, or Protestant against Catholic,
but one in which the whole Protestant Church of Ireland
were deeply interested.
Mr. SHAW defended the course pursued by the Arch-
bishop and his son, Archdeacon Magee, and reminded the
House that the two parishes, joined to the vicarage of
Wicklow, were not, together, worth 2001. a-year, and,
thererore, not fit to remain as separate livings. Instead
too of the union being worth 2,3001. a-year, as it had
been reported, Archdeacon 'Magee had offered his pa-
rishioners to compound for 1,5001. a•year, or to take one
shilling in the pound, although he was entitled to demand
two shillings. He denied, too, that the Archdeacon had
so many valuable preferments as some person represented,
for although he was Rector of St. John's, in Dublin, he
held that living purely because it gave him a voice in the
Chapter of Christ Church, and not on account of its
emoluments, which were very insignificant. He believed
that the memorialists were respectable men, and that they
had been deceived by a Curate, who laboured under some
feelings of disappointment ; but be regretted much that
the subject had been agitated at a moment when a regular
system was organised against tithes, and his regret was
increased by finding that men -who entertained na feeling
of hostility to the church, were yet in some degree sup-
porting the views of its enemies.

YNN regretted tke motion had been made, but
he also regretted the cause of it. He regretted that so
many livings had been united in the same person, and he
could not but express his surprise that the Hon. Member
should say livings worth 2001. were not sufficient to sup.
port a clergyman—good God, two hundred pounds a
year ! when he knew in his country numbers of clergy-
men who supported themselves with respectability, and
did the duty of large parishes for less thati one hundred
pounds a year. He also regretted this plurality of livings
on account of non-residence, as be held it of more im-
portance that the clergyman should reside, than if he paid
the whole of his income to others to do the duty.
Mr. O'CONNELL believed that the Archbishop had
done nothing illegal, but what had been done was a proof
of what might be done with legality under the present
system. This Archdeacon had the union of Wicklow,
the living of St. John's, and the Archdeaconry of Kil-
macduagh. Ilis revenues were large, and he could not
reside on all his livings, but it was admitted the duty could
be performed for 500/. instead of 1,500/., and would it
not be better to give the thousand pounds to a distressed
and impoverished people.
Mr. SHAW, in answer to the Secretary at War, said
that the livings were not together worth any thing like
200/. a year, and there was no church in either of the
! two small pa! ishes, so that if they were not joined to the
vicarage no divine service could be performed.
After a few words from Mr. GOULEURIC, Mr. GRAT-
TAN, and Mr. LEFROY,

Mr. HUME said, society in Ireland was torn to pieces
by the struggles of the clergy, not to do their religious
duties, but to scramble for money, money, money. No
wonder that troops were necessary in Ireland to keep the
people quiet. Irishmen must be less than men, which
they were not, if such conduct did not disgust them. He
trusted that the Church of Ireland would speedily be re-
modelled—that the emoluments of that Church would be
cut down to their proper limits, and that no member of it
would be allowed to have a shilling which he did not
deserve.

After a few words from Mr. S. Ricr, Mr. Wyss, and
O'CoNxon. DON, the motion was agreed to.
PRIVILEGES OF THE HOUSE.
On the motion of Mr. WYNN, and after a brief con-
versation in which Mr. Hughes. Hughes, Mr. S. Rice,
Mr. Hume, Mr. S. Wortley, and the Speaker partici-
pated, a Select Committee was appointed, " to consider
how far it may be expedient to relax the exercise of the
privileges of this House respecting the imposition of peen-
nitry penalties for offences."
The Report of the Committee on the Customs Duties
Act was brought up and agreed to, and a Bill founded on
the resolution was ordered to be brought iu.