The Sun.
London, England, 1809-04-28 00:00:00

SALE OF OFFICES.

. The Order of, the Day for, going into. at Corn
Mittee on the Office Sale ProVention Bill being read,
lid FOLKSTONE said, that in consequence of a
motion which his Hon. Friend (Mr, COrwen) bad .
given notice of, he did not mean to introduee the
clause into this Bill, which he originally intended.
Mr. HORNER, at Nellie length, stated the
.autho-*,
rides which since the Act of Edward VI. on that
subjeal, had all concurred on the neces-ity of abelish7
ing_the sale of places in the administration of the
law. In the reign of George a' Committee, at
the suggestion of Parliament itself, and, in the year
1797, a Committee of Finance, recommended, be
said, to the House of Commons, that these offices
shoUld not be allowed to be saleable. How it hap-
pened that all these authorities had been disregarded,
and the eicention yet existed, he colzld not possibly
say. There was a voluminotis body of suggestions
on this head, which like many others on the table
lof that House, were inefficiently made. It was not
his intention at this period to introduce into the pre-
'sent Bill any thing.upon the subjea. In his opinion
it shouldbe.Made a subject of distinct consideration.
Something might arise out of the third report of the
present Finance Committee, or at a further WV
the present SesSion, which may be. favourable to-the
object he bad in view.. It was some time since, he
said, he suggested that there ought to be no delay in
makitig the salary of the Puisne Judges more ade-,
qavate to their •situatiOns tban it was ;• wby this had
not been carried into etre& be-could not imagioe.
The CHANCELLOR' of the EXCHECCULti kne,v of
no sut.je& more deserving of,consideration than that'
on. which the, Honeurable Gmileman bad spoken.
But it should not be entered upon too hastily;, it
should be•atiended with pres jou, inquiry.. As every
thing -*as to be done prospectively, it should be done
with all possible circumspe&ion, lie had himself,
t' in the course of last Session, submitted to the' House
an increase of salary to the Mine Jiidges, and, to
the Welsh Judic Imre: It was-his intention to' have
brought' it forward, and to- extend it to the Chief
Justice, Corm-non Pleas, and the Chief Baron of the
Exchequer. He did not think it necessary to bring
it forward at an earlier 'period, as the principle ‘Vas.
so cle'ar, and the operation so simple, thajt could
produce neither a length of discUSsion; or aey diffi-
otihy of determination. He was happy, from what
had dropped from the Noble Lord (Folkstonel, thst-
by common consent the present Bill wasconilned to
those ribiecli only which it had originally in blew.
Though he would be sorry that the consideration of
those offices which were saleable in' the law depart-'
meet, shotild be postponed for 'such a' period' as
twelve months, if the postponement operated Upon
the proper administration of jUstice, yet. he could
not nee tiny Inc°. iliCh would arise groin
,COntinuing the present system another year. It Wris
clear that justice would be as duly administered as
ever.- The Chief Juitice Would not possibly appoint
an unfit officer in his Court, without subjecting
himself to the severe criticism of the, other Justices.
He was indeed surprised that the exception shiciuld
exist as it did, but there was no harm to be appre-
hended from continuing it anther year.
Mr. 'TnouNTos said, that by different reports,
it appeared the sinecure places dispowd of in this
way would amount to 50,0001. which would form
a handsome fund for the remuneration of the Judges.
Mr. Raiz said a few words ou the inaccuracy of
these reports.

Mr. W. WYNNE was of opinion', that not only
the interest of the Judges should' be attended to in
this Bill, but that of all other persons possessing the
right,of disposing of places.
The House having gone into a Corntnittee,on tho
Bill,

The CHANCRLLOR of the -EXCIIMUER introduced
a new preamble,' which was Intended to obviate any
inconvenieneies arising front a rvference to the for-
mer A6t.

The CHAIRMAN then read one of the clauses.
which was objthed to by Lord Folkstone, who pio-
posed, that instead of the words " some offices,"
the words " all offices in all parts of his Majesty's
dominions," should be inserted.

I/ •
The CHANCELLOR of tbe.Excitscausit ob' eted to
Jq
this generalizing 'amendment, as "it' would take in
even the office' of Clerk to the Bank, and in fa& ail
offices under private patronages.
Mr. MAxWata, wished that the operation of the
Bill should extend to the offices in the disposal.of
Keeper of the Signet for Scotland, Sheriff's Clerk-
ships, and many others.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER .obiervvd,
that the Bill was extended to Scotland and Ireland,
and the offices consequently therein. There was
in the gill, a clause 'excepting its opera ion to
ail offices legally saleable•betoro the Bill was made,
If certain offices were not legally saleable, they were
of course included in the Act. If they were legally
saleable, it would be injustice to the persons holding
them not to except them.
Mr. floaNErt concurred with his Noble Friend on
the propriety of generalization. This statuita did
nut includeln itcoperations, he said, the principal
situations which may be disposed of; the words
were " all offices under the superintendance and
contpul." This he begged leave to say only ope.
rated on the inferior, without any provision as fo
the superior ottitei,
The CHANCELLOR of the Excitarausa`conceived
that the several departments necessarily included the
principal office,as well as the several deputations of
that .office.

Lord FoLKsToNE said, that all the-arguments of
the might lion. Gentleman evinced the necessity of
general woras in preference to those which were
mentioned in the fidl.

The Clause was then read as originally worded.
Lord ISlri.-coN and Lord itt4,I{,STONE I'ere

offs that :the*eslsrotia.,-cif the -Bill, sinliticl'iiitiod
to the disposal-of offices by the Government of
India. -•! ••• •
.Mr.. Mom,. declared, that twenty years expe-
rience had convinced, that the administration of
public affairs in rndia wai mote pore and disfnlettite'd
than in any other part of the United Empiie. There
were not`any offices but those in the Supreme Court
of-ludieature, coulth possibly come within
the purview of the. 13111.
The ATTOINE7 and •Sot.tcrma GPNCItALS' Main-
tained the jastice; in ease it should be deemed e±xpe-
client to extend' the tiroVisions of the Bill V).fridia;
as- propose 4 by the Noble Lord, to enact, that4he.
oparaticin-Of, the Bill should not take place until a
sufficient time had been given for .the 1101 to be'
~pl,lblished in frolia.
',Eiffel' a short !discussion, in.which Mr. Yorke,
Mr.. S. 13nurite, • Lord Castlereagh, and Mr. Horner
participated, the Chancellor of the Exchequer ,tatert,
that-her would consider the subjell, and piePare.a
.Clansc rd meet the ideas of tie Noble Lotits;-
-Lind Fou‘sroNa, for the purpose of-facilitating
t he .obtAining of evidence, proposed an amendment to
the clause,, by which' An ottenee against the Bill was
constituted a rniidenteationr. The amendment went
to inflict a it•ttalty of 2001. to be granted to the in-
former. He liken the subsequent intention of pro-
posing that the informer, if implicated in the trans-
atilion, should be' itidemnified,,. tit giv'ltvg informa-
tion. '

, The en ANcgtLott of the 'Ex-cart:wait obiittved,
that the effect of the proposition, tirade the.NO-
ble Lord, dean:led-into effiM, might frequently be
to put
,An,inforiiner, who had obtainr,i opliiiice- by
cirfrupt.rneanb 10,p03;estion Of etoi.-afiCl;fectire him
in the office a ,so .Obtained..

'Lord ‘'vitiSdrew his aineniinitnt
,the'clause extending-the permlties of to those
who gave ny.c.)rt• tts4n !lie regulated price tpr Conitilis-
:4iohs in Ow
General tho'aght it tlnn&eisafy,*,"..the're
was already iiiinishment the uhrtc m
.the °dice of the dirnmander in Ch'ier.
S. ...rAhfriti("E' said, that it v.a well known
that more tharl the iegi.tWed
was frequently ;6406, in spits the Aiming repi-•
Jptious. He thought Gentlemen yvtlobild purchased,
at that high rate ought to be 411owgd to Sell again at
the same rte they bonght.
Mr. ELLtsbil- protested against'fbit; ifs -rem-
sating those who had committettabraFh of a known
law, and taken more than'what thelciectated
letnnly upon their lionourthey did take.
Mr. W. SMITIt re Petted that such a pra&ice had
existed, and that Officers were inihe habits of malt-
ing these declarations without considering them as
dishononrahle.:fae,thought the only way to obviata,
these clandegine bargains, for more than the tegulat-:
cd price was to ralSe U.

Mr. Hrtskisson, the Chancellor of the .Exchequer,.
Mr. -Rose, and Mr. H. Thornton, conibaired this
Opinion, and !uppored the clause, which Was
agreed to. ~ . . .
.!*ri,e,renasining el:tures were then•gone,:through,
fl mill the Chancellor of the Exchequer brought up an
additioYial inflitiing a fine upon. persons ad-
': virtisin•g;, or. procuring 'the advertisement for any
office, &c., for the sate, &c. of places; the penalty
to, be not .more than SOUL nor less than 501. • An-
ni her cht&s., mitring the keeping of" such office for
tlip sale of pluces, &c. a inisklemeanour.
The ItepOrt W 35 ordered to be received on Mon-
day ~next.:•
The Report of the Comnfittee of Supply was
hrought up by Alr.Whartou,' and the Irish Egtiniates
voted last night agreed.to.
The other Olden; of the were then disPlased
of, and the House adjourned at Half past Eleven
o'clock.

,red

Lit()rs,..who sigried bikteeftifteite. st
.
lion the Spanish, Revolution fouill
went to Mradtiif rorthe'purpo"ie of raisinl;Vcfatment,
in the service of -Ferdinand VII. On 1114 Atly. RIPTt: •
he experienced much personal civility frorrift
Moore. • ',The rapid advance of the Prench
him, however, to retire. with-the British: eintialsy,4'.
Fie.had. no introduOion whatever to .Mr. ,irytAr
either from Lord Castlereaglipr, any of bis:Nl,J4estitl
He was a stranger- to Mr,. Ficre. itO -
I)4d nut ioeen dir.ee,dayg in his. society is.rtr:!
the accidental circualstanee alone- of Mr. kttle.4
Ittio;.ving .that- 4e was rel.-W*44lg to the Bri(oll'.A4thY
that he was inde:Acci fur bring employ.ed..to•coor..:
vey his,,clispatchts to. Sir, 4'unn ond‘,l4.
43,r1 Grey's proclaiming. hich, in tlet.;. :Jce
nation, and of the Monarch, v,hOse'
he bears, a man of infamous cimrader,•4 114110 r, ►
spy,-. an
.assassin, a :usurer, and a fraudulent:bank'
,•
rupt. Colonel De Chantilly is how sWi it, the
army in Portugal; rec,-iving ,
these charges, be imilf s4prily be
.ei.pected I.ere
Inert thew.
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