The Sun.
London, England, 1813-06-02 00:00:00

conduct with that now pursued by him. Ile
.%ould not allow that the whole merit of the
changes made in India belonged to the Govern-
ment. The- Company were justly entitled to a
share of it. `Acne could be no such saving on
teas as 1,500,000/. The Americans, it was true,
sold cheaper, but their teas were not so good.
The teas of the 6ompany were sold by auction,
Of course the price did nok depend upon them.
Mr. MARRYAT explained. The Company might
set up the teas at their ow(i prices, and people
then must either purchase or go without them.
Air. PEELE said, he was glad that no son of
his was in the House at the time. such severe lan-
guage had been used on •the' preceding, night
against British traders,. lest it might discourage
Clem .from embarking in that which he always
considered an honourable calling. With respect
to the China track, it was the intention of Mr.
Pitt and Lord. Melville that it should be in some
measure thrown open, but a cry was raised which
prevented their wishes from being carried into
effect. It was strange that what British Mer-'
chants were deprived of, should be given to the
Americans.

Mr. CHARLES GRANT said, that the language
he had employed referred to British traders, io,t
to British merchants. He would ask whether it,
Was fair or liberal to remtl that language after he
Ink(' explained it.
Mr. It. PEELI said, lie had not heard the ex-
' planation, otherwise he would not now have al-
luded to the words that had been employed.
Mr. R.. THORNTON said, that the present-ones-
, tion was very different from that 'which had been
discussed last night. Ile hoped the House would
not, without serious reflection, put down a Com-
pany which yielded to the country a revenue of
4,000,0001. annually. It was asserted that the
trade was not profitable-the trade, however, an-.
steered all the purposes both of the public and of
the Company. When they recollected the deli.-
eate nature.of the Chinese Government, and how
much that trade depended upon the Government,
they would not risk it by any change in the mode
of carrying it on. In the time of Queen 14.1iba-
beth, the beverage both of the rich and of the
poor was of a very inferior kind. By the exer-
tioos of the Company; a pleasing substitute had
been introduced in the article of Tea. lit 166,4,
211 b. of Tea were purchased' by the Company,.
and presented to'Charles 11, The use 'hf it was
unknown until that time; The. competition so
much spoken of would, when obtained, have the
effect of making the public pay a highei price
than they at present paid; and for as worse article.
By the management of the Company, their know-
ledge and experience, they were' enabled 'to sup-
ply the country better and cheaper than it was
:possiblit for it "to be supplied' by private mer-
chants. The• Company could allays obtain the
best tatimmodities, as the best were regularly sub-
mitted to their choice, and the Americans, of
whom so ninchivas said; could only obtain whatthe Company rejected. The credit of the Corn-.
so great in China, that the people of
that 3f.::ll.itts country had the "muse perfect confi-
dence in them. A proof of this was furnished by
the circumstance of the mark of the 'Company
giving' the people of China entire confidence in
any article which bore it. Ile then'set forth the
evils which might result from attempting to open
the trade to China, contended that to endanger
so valttable a trade, would he an act of political
madness ; and concluded, expressing his corm
keil9ll, that the present system' was best* for
the, consumer, for the East India CoMpany and
thesotintry.
Mr. PROTHEROE said, the case of the East India
Company was only supported by arguments which
went to de,,,,,rittle the English character. The
ntemopolv: of the China trade ought only to be
given as a pecuniary bonus, or its a commeicial
privilege for services performed 'to the country.--
If given as a boon for public services, 'the conduct
of Ministers would be. less extraordinary, but it
'Was not disposed of, and it was as ungraciously
and ungratefully received by the East India Coln.,
any, as it was lavishly andliselessly bestowed.—
The Trader's Who e'tme forward to- petition Par-
liament on the subject, those envious and unrea-
sonable traders as they had 'been called, did not
come fOrWiard to assert the right to which Eng-
lish merchants might lay claim to be allowed to
trade with all the world. They did
,not come for.;
w,tird to interfere with the aerangement proposed
by Government. These delegate's Were sent pre-
bared for'concession,to the East India Company,
ut instructed to express a hope that such, con-
cession would he materidly limited as to tinte.---e
Ile,hoped that the. proposed concession to the
li;ast India Company would not he made.
LiOrd CASTLERAGII put it, to the Committee
Whether or not it would be best to disctiss. pro-
, . ,
speetively the various points connected with tnts
great.
subject, in the present stage of their pro-
eerdings.‘ The 'present Resolution could not be
brought to bear on the donation of the Charter,
rt w4s thcreforp for those who had any p_t'opooi-
titrta
fcrolfor on this suoject, to Consider
,what mo-
trent, would he the fittest for bringing it fOrward.
I:be best. opportunity, for that and other general'
auwadrne.sik, he thought would be afforded when,
the report w';‘A hrought up. If the Committee
Avert.; with hint of opinion, that that'viould ho the
fltteg opportutiity, it might be well not tri take
up the time with these topics, in the present in-:
stance, that they 'might, with the least possible
dclay., go to tin next Resolution.
PONSONTY opposed the principle of the pre,
sent Resolution, as he could not conceive what
re on could exist for giviijg the, monopoly of the
Ti.ade to the. East India Company. To
errant it for a short time, might be less office-
tt enable; than to grant it for a longlon pciioit ;
but he could see no reason for gritnting it at
en. The,COmmittee could not employ theii time
better than ire discussing this subject. „Those,
'Who defended the Resolutiou,.ought to. stale
to
the.llotoc on what grounds' such a concession
T C 1 the 17.',witi India Company ivas prolur)sed, lic
objected to treat it that which ought to be
e-eauteneueed till. therefore differed frOm
tic Noble I its to thelnode whiell it would
pi opor for the Yicruse to adopt, thinking, as be
that this sitbject ought now to be looked

into, turd that it shoirld tint be suffered to have the
sanction of the Committee for one single hour,.
Sir JoitN NEwrotet. was decidedly against any
compromise On this subject. The advocates
for the East India Coinpauy, after stating the
dangers to be apprehended front attempting to
increase our commerce with the Hindoos and
with the people of China, which arguments,
he thought, were proved to be fallacious,
had now turned round, and told the
that it a competition with the East.lndia Compa-;
ny were allowed, the__ consequence won'tf be, a
higher price would be paid in this country for a
worse article. 1f this .were to result from compe-
tition, it would be a result he had never read of,
as floWing from competition in any country before,
Tbis new doctrine could not be received, for it it
were; he /bought there was, nothing, however
monstrous, which. they would not he toady to
swallow. The profits 61 the China trade were re-
presented to be necessary to enable the Compa-
ny to srmstiaiui their losses in the trade to India.—
They would hare it believed that they could get:
goods of the Chinese cheaper than any 'body else
and that others could get no teahut that which the
East India Company thought proper to reject. Such,
they wished to make it appear, was their influence
in that quarter, that the Emperor of ChliA3, 1101V-
ever haughty to odiers,. had no difficulty in bow-
ing down to the Emperor of the East. That proud
Emperor, who was so unbending to the Sovereigns
of Europe (with the exception of time East India
Company), was made to bow down to the will
and pleasure of the traders of Leadenball street.
The lionoorable Gentleman, speaking of the ad-
vance Which had taken place in the duties since
the pausing of the Com Mutation Act, hail stated
them to be increased from twelve and a half ,p,:•r
cent, to 96 per cent. ; yet this, said he, for the 'ne-
' netit of the State, we bear, anti bear it .patienily'.
Now he wished to know who was meant iy
who bore the burthens of the State
On WhoM were these duties imposed) .can the
people of England, for by them they were paid ;
and for this the E ist India Company took credit
to themselves for bearing the. burthens of the
State patiently. The, imperial style which they
were in the habit of using led:them into strange
errors. .:They seentid to forget that it might
chance to be canvassed by aa Imperial Parliament,
If the arguments of the adVocates.Of the. East In-
dia ottipatty were admitted, they made not for
the renewal of their Charter, but,for perpetuating
their power. The benefits eonterred.ori the pen:-
pie of India, he contended, tame front Parliament
more than from the Company. The vices of the
system had frequently attracted the notice of
that House; and more than once that. Charter,.
Which they now prayed to have renewed, had fur 7
nished an obstacle to effectual interference. How.
ever desirable it might hare been formerly for the
trade to the East Indies to .be carried on by an
united Company, the iiecessity for this had died
away, and with it the monopoly ought to vanish.
He saw no more reason for carrying on this trade
through the. =ditto' of the .East India Company
than there was for forming companies to carry on
the trade to time Baltic or to the Levant.
illl.. BARING had
,never thought it could he
doubted, that•to carry on the trade to China, a
monopoly was absolutely necessary. ,The charac-
ter of China itself, at political anomaly, was: futli-
dent to make this clear, and he WWI., SA:IA-kit it
hopoasible for the trade to be carried on as
advantageously by private individual . at it was by
a Company. He thought it desirable to give' the
East India' Company fair and liberal terms. In
giving them the' monopoly of the China trade,
they gave them that which tyits of great 'value,
and from which contiderable revenue might be de-
rived. He must think that, there must he some
mismanagement in the Government of India, as
it was thought necessary to give them the China
trade, to remunerate them for carrying it ou. If
they had not this to give, he .supposed they
would be obliged to give half a million or a mil-

•
lion a year to pay for its, Government, If this
were the case, he doubted" whether India was
Worth keeping„ It
,ought, to he put on-'such a
footing that it would pay itselt, or it was not
worth having„
Mr. PANSONBY thought those
.who were for
limiting the duration Of the China Trude to 10
years,were as much against the principle of giv-
ing.the monopoly to the East India Company as
he, was, or why did they propose to limit it to
ten years, while they granted the other part of
the Charter for twenty ? Their ohjection to the
principle was the same, but these Gentlemen wish-
ed to elfeet a compromise between . the Company
and the Government. When it was said that most
of the reforms which laid taken place were sug-:
gested in India, he would say that the E.Lit
Company of former days had opposed 'them as
`much as they could( and he would ask, what
treatment bad that good man Sir P.,Franeis ex-
perienced for giving those s„itggestions on which
Fox, Mr.littrke, and the other great men of
that day, had afterwards acted i The GoVerninent
of China Was anomajops ; but he had never heard,
that a. plutons. Character was, that it would only
triode with Monopolists., This might he its' cha-
racter but then how came they to..bear.with the
America as 1 There vverc no companies Of mOOO
polists in America., yet certain it Nen., the Alieri,
calls carried on a grey 'trade with China. the
Act of I 7 03, a dkidend of 10 per cent. Jas se-
cured on F..ast India stock: lithe China trade were
taken from the Company, it might be that the holders
of it would not feel themselves quite secure. 'For
this, it might he thought, it wasthe interest of the
conntry to gi‘ e them the monopoly of the (lona
trade. The East India Company:clang to the yore-
sent system in no inconsiderable degree, on :le-
eottut of the patronage it gave them, Aaielt en
ailed them to provide for their coaueetious., It
was natural for them to cling to it oil this aceount`,.
,but it was uot Parliament, ,on this ttecount, to
suffer it to continue. It was said a change wott;rl
cause a defalcation ia the revenue, but he hail ne-
Ver been aceustorned to look for a falling off in
,reitenite from an'exteosiob .Sonte,of the
witnesses had, moreover,, stated, that Precautions
could be taken that would avert the apprehetided
evil. He should- be glad to heat. why the mono-
poly of the • China Trade was to be contintted to

•
1111101',11 Printe+l THOMA' WOOll,. of Nn. Strand ; l'ili.tis
At the Suu OITIcu,No. 112 Straild, Aluvrtisvileit‘, Orders