The Sun.
London, England, 1838-05-30 00:00:00

TillE SUN, IiONDM-4, TI

make any further obsorvations on that sulijoet, but that he woull
s y that tie question ef a Peor-law for Ireland ocgi;t to be tetra:tell:et
disconneried from the Municipal Corporation question. The attempts
made fir the settlement of tithes ought to be of as conciliatory a nature
as possible, the people of Ireland having arrived at the conviction that to
a Church to which they did not belong they were not bound to contri.
bute. When they talked of giving equal municipal corporate rights to
Ireland with those enjoyed by England and Scotland, he would beg of
them to recollect that the Irish people well knew that the people of
Scotland did not contribute to the support of a church to which they slid
not belong, that the people of England slid not contribute to the support
ofa church to which they did not belong, but that the people of Ireland
were compelled to do so.—(Hear, hear.) Let them legislate, therefore,
not in the spirit of a dominant church, nor in a spirit of exultation
that the faith which they believed to he Orthodox had jurisdiction
over those who differed from it ; let them nut legislate in that
spirit, but rather on the principles on which the Municipal Cor-
poration question had been already settled in England. and Scot.
land. Let the Irish people have institutions in common with
Eogland and Scotland, for they elaim7A not any portion of
the Church revenues of England or of Se:Aland fir the support of the
Church to which they belonged. The Municipal Corporations act ay_
peered to him to be a subject to be considered principally as a matter of
detail. With regard to the regulations proposed to be made, he had a
strong objection to !hair attaching to the qualification for the franchise
the payment of the poor rate.. The poor rate was never levied acernal.
lag to the value of the property, but only upon the half or the
third of the value. Ile trusted that no difficulty would now arise
in this respect, but could not help fearing that they would so proceed
as to " keep the word of promise ta the ear and break it to the hope."
The ifie,la Hon. Baronet relied on the evidence taken in !elation to the
_
franchise be the fictitious votes Committee, but that did not apply to the
town franchise. There ceuld be no better test of the valus, of a
hence than the real paid for a number of years. Ile was exceedingly
glad that the Right Hen. Baronet, who was the representative of a
great party, no longer alleged that the people of Ireland were ut.tit
to be eetrusted with corporate institutions. He did not accuse the
Right Honourable Baronet himself of having ever used words to
.that effect, but his acts were an indication of his having entertained
that o:Mtion. He rejoiced, however, that Ireland was no Linger to be
insulted by being legislated for in that spirit, and that the period of con.
ciliation Raving at length arrived, their rights were ce needed in emir-
toms and friendly terms. Let them have a care that. in the subse.
qeent proceedings, all this exhibition of concession was not discordant
to be a mere deception— t splendid humbug—a well.paieted delusion.
The I lonourable and Learned Gentleman then referred to the Corpora.
tion of Dublin, where the right to be adtnitted freemen was net denied
to the Roman Catholics, but where there existed no le el means of en-
forcing it. He hoped that such a state of things as this would be Eno-
.vided against in the proje led Bil: ; he trusted, also, that a public exa-
mination of the Corporation rtecoun's would be allowed, an.l t hat the
treasurer of the city of Dublin would be compelled to open an account
at the Bank of Ireland, whet e parties would be ready to give receipts cn
,the payment of the local taxes. He wished for Ireland Ind the sams
franchise as existed in Engrlnd ; lie wished en id: laity s f franclii •
,and an identity m.ant, not that the franchise should be exactly I
same, but rather that, in the poorer country, it should be 1 '
in amoant than in the rich country. At present the franehi
was practical y twice its great in the poo; countrv, as it tit
rich. There was in this the feregoee conclusion that they would nol
co itide in the people of Ireland, which appeared to be the result of reli*
pious prejudices and of an Lc:conger:l ility ef political sentiments. Thig
i coning, h ;wever, lie trusted had commenced thecoeciliatien which had
.seen so lon I promised. He, p rhaps, lied met it with noire susp:eieti.
than the event woull justify, and lie should, indeed, be elad if it turned'
out that his appreliensioos were groundless; but those who: ad suffered
by years of false promis:s— and they were a care that this country had
suffi rel by fa'se promises for cent ut ieS, by excited hopes which turned
out to be mere delusions—people who had been thus deceived and dis-
, app. inted might be vac:tied if they were neither very sanguine nor are-
. dulous. All they asked for were equal advantages with this country :
they ticsii.e.l no more. What had been suggested with re.erence to the
Tithe crestion might possibly meet the existing difficu:ties; he could
not, however, promise, though he hoped, that tranquillity would follow.
In conclusion, he implored them, +Nal, refeietice to both the Tithe and
the Municipal Corporation (plea ions, to act generously towards the
people of Ireland, and he was convincea that if
.they did so the Irish
people would no: tail to meet them with equal gene.-osity.— (Cheers.)
Mr. F. SHA W was glad to observe the tone of the present discos.
sion. lie was disposed to concur in the arraneement if the value of the
franchi.e were fairly estimated, but he thought that care ought to be
t tken to prevent what was is troth only a 5/ franchise, being adopted
for a fienchise of IC/. He laelievol that there was no desire to raise the
fiarichise. NVitit reference to the tithe question, he begged to say that •
the clergy and his own constituents considered it already Fe• tied by the
act of the Noble Lord. He. was of opinion that the landlords of Le-
land were entitled to scene deductions of the tithe. The settle:neat of
the queston fairly between the landed and the Church interest was
ono of great elelicaey awl importance ; but, nevertheless, he thought
that a settlement might be effected. The question of appropriation he
cutiaidered had been abandoned.--(Cries of " No, no." from
Mr. Ward.) He did not say that all the Honourable Gentlemen opposite
thi.ited
Government.—;lots
abandoned blot. hneo.t)vastrit,i,opeeinritzityb act
oit n
shiatde
„bet ettiht.tatic,leot:iled,prloty.
t
hear)—of coutse Hon. Geotletnen might retain their' opi-
p. iat ion principle was excluded from the settlement of the Irish question.
—(Hear,
Man ; but unless he believed the principle of appropriatio:: excluded from
the settlement of the tithe qoestion, he never would consent to this ineo.
stmt,—(Hear ) That was all they demanded; that w..a all they had a
right:to demand. The Rieht Hots. Gentleman voncludel with express-
ing his gratification at the prospect ofa final and satisfactory adjustment
of these various important questions.
Lord JOHN RussEr.r. said that he did not mean to go further,
after the appointment of the Committee, than to move it should report
pre press, and ask leave to sit again en an early day. The flight Hon.
Gentleman had touched on the appropriation in a way which rendered
it necessary for him (Lord John Russell: to say a few words in explana.
than of what he had already endeavoured to state to the House. With
reference to his opinions on this particular subject, he had not thought
it necessary to go it:to that evenina, as he had stated them very fully
on the motion of the Hon. Member fur Devon ; it would be sufficient
for him now to state that he fully adhered to the opinions he had re.
peatedly declared on this point.—(Hear.) His reason for not having
weposed such a clause in the present 8.11 was simply that he had con-
sidered he could not carry such a principle into a law, and that he should
under existing circumstances, fail in passing a measure of which such
a Principle formed part.—(Hear, hear.) 'Had he conceived he stood
any cha :cc of carry itg that principle he should have proposed it, and did
he think he stood any chance of carrying it now he would propose it to.
morrow—)Hear, hear).—but he considered he should have acted most
unjustifiably had he attempted to press it forward now. As to whether
this was the final and satisfactory measure described by the Right Hon.
Gentleman opposite, this would depend on the working of the Bill—,
(Hear, hear.) The Right Han. Gentleman had his oainion on this sub-
ject, and he (Lord John Russell) had his. He could only repeat that
his sole reason fur not introducing an appropriation elation_ into the pre.
s.nt Bill, was that he had been most anxious not to do anything which
night prevent the accomplishment of what was in itself a very consider.

;A? good.— (Hear, hoar.)
Mr. WA RD said, th:it entortaining the opinions which it was well_
known he did on this question of :igpropriatlon, yet, could he suppose
fur a moment that such a propo,al as that which tad been dtid
before the House that night could be the basis of a " final and

satisractory settlement," he should be as ready as any one
to wave any peculiar predil.2ctions of his own in favour of a
particuLr course of action; but he did not conceive any final
settlement cou'd'be founded on the basis proposed. The House was
bond to guard itself against being held pledged to any compromise
which should end in giving a new title to the Irish clergy, which shou:d

operate as a guarantee that their title should remain in future unques:

tiorwtt by Parliament.—(bear, !war.) The Hon. Member concluded
with stating that he should, at some sts,e of this ne_ociation, take the
seme of tl:e Ilouse on this principle, even if he stood alone; and he

should do it by way of an instruction t; the Committee.— ( [lest. hear.)
ic
Lord CLEMENTs ajmred to the manlier in which the great Irish
questions had been clubbed together, more part ularly
considering the
p,riod of the ,ession.

Mr. S. O'BRIEN as an Irish Member begged to thank the Right
Hon. Baronet for the tone of cone; iiat ion he had adopt rd —( Hear, hear.)
The compromise proposed was one which Government could accede to
without the slightest diminution of honour.—(Hear, hear.)
Mr. SI. A NEI" was glad to find that at length a better spirit had en.
tered into their councils—(dear, hear)—.2 int that those party bickerings
on both sides of the House, which had so disgusted all the sober men in
the country who were watching the progress of legisl dion in that I rouse,
were now likely to be banished from their deliberations on these im-
portant subjects. Ile begged most heartily to 'thank the Right lion.
Baronet for the course he had taken r.)
After a few wards from Mr. C. HINDIEY,
The House went into Committee on the Bill, pro forma.
On the motion of Lord J. RUSSELL, the Chairman reported pro-
gr,,s, and obtained leare to s:t again on Friday.
EXCIIEQUER BILLS BILL.
This Bill was read a third time and passed.
The other Orders of the Day were thea disposed of, and the House
adj, urned at half-past nine.

,
y a majority, variously stated at three, four, and
five, the General Assembly has confirmed the decision of the Presby.
tery of Paisley, and of the Synod of GI sgow and Ayr ; thus prosentiag
the tra..slation of the nee, J. Mac,au„;Lta:t to Edinburgh.
Oil Wednesday night week an accident of the most
appaling description happened near Hexl.am. Two young men, one a
son of Mr. David Flintoff, of Newc.istle, and the other a son of Mr.
John Ridley, glove manufacturer, were amusing themselves with shoot-
ing swallows, when poor Flit:toff rec,ived the whole contents of one of
Ridley's charges in his under jaw; his mouth, teeth, &e., were literally
blown away, and he is now lying with scarcely any hope of his recovery.
Ridley was sl shocked at the catastraphe, that after telling his mother
in tlistress, " I have !;ilke.t PlM:oft'," immediately fled. No ill.will ex.
isted between the youths.—Carlisle Pia••;.d.
A miner in \Veardale, who had an execution issued
against him, for s::-ne time prevented the admission of the bailiff's. They
having gained entrance one morning, he with the greatest sangfroid
requested them to be seated, at the same time putting the poker into the
fire, and keeping them in conversation till such time as it was heated,
He then seized the poker, and thrusting it upon the top of a barrel,
swore he would blow them to atoms. The bailiffs, imagining it con-
tained a quantity of blasting powder, iinmediately rarCoff; and not even
like Lot's wife, did they cast a look behind them, till they were fairly
out of danger, -much to the amusement and gratification of the miner,
as the cask contained only a quantity of sand.—Sunderland licro!d.
HORTICULTURAL SOCIETY.—The first exhi-
bition of this Society for the present year took pace on Saturday after-
noon, at their delightful gardens at Chiswick. There wi.s a reciter.-he d,sphy of exotics, embracing cacti, azaleas, seedling dryendris, and other
quaky beout'fui and rare plai.ts, but with regard to the numbers of the
specimens of the several kinds exhibited they were perhaps fewer than
h
seldom isbtrtrulitaers:ejctle.si'lotraelt sth.oalgailsoii ai point of beauty the l' have been
paucity Of specimens of fruit, but
this may perhaps be owing to the severity of the weather, atld the same
observation is equally applicable to the flowers. The day being fine
attracted great numbers of fashionables to the gardens, ;ha a
auent three
o'clock' they were as crowded and as gay as we ever runibein Len to have
witnessed them on any previous occasion.
f,,it.a:bslilt33llrtts
oft iirileies:gt.ow,N,vs .i the very fl :urishing p.11(141.111 of the etook occasion to congratula
thete
tpresent,
and oilo 41os-110440 ill an exceedingly
glass-trade. We, however, regret to state, that this important branch
manufactures(o!tf,ptrheessedstate.
o. ot
this
ithis i ; districte
r, t
bottle-housesii
I,ave been laid in ; as also one at Shields, and two others at ?,weenie.
: ire_
sent engaged in writing the lives of the great
an event witi,h must be severely felt by the numerous workmen and
their families.—Sunderland HeYcld,
Three of our most eminent living Poets tire it
dramitists of the age of
El zabeth nod James the First. Campbell has luilic:ously i
fell a-leep by the
svieeled the
the life of Shak:pea.e. ; s;uthey, those of Beanmont and Fletcher ; and I
'began licking the.
Bigry Cornwall, Ben..lohnon, . , .. ,
aer 1 esyiztr,n
A north countryman retorting twin a ntsigtibouring
rfaoiard, Istadvn ga
npda I taa kpeitgt toobei
being
e,,et:
drunk, n man's mouth; the la' ter feeling the salute, but mistaking the
4,l2iifmnt, roared out, .` Wha's hissin' me Lino? 'Sc see what it is to be 7
iydl I;ket amani; the latses f' 3.t.raoeft.j.dohton It;
VICIANS A.I4D .13fACKPt-14RPS•—fii a libel suit
. ..
tried the ether day et Perth the Statirlir declared that the term " black.
giant" was not actionable, as it was generally used by tLe vulgar with-
out refli'etion, and without any intention to cast a stain up in a person',‘
character, and it meant one of the 42,1 Regiment, who were all black_'
guards, but amongst whom there were many gentlemen, He „!,o d.•.'
Ltded lm-.t. (i.onases cculd not be rua,veiel Sot' tn... .ist, the.tes
`1 .'il!?it`b:" inasmuch asithat ont ; fka merty a terth biropect . , i
' ': ;" i' : i 4 ..‘7O. ' - r - ' r. "-•-