The Sun.
London, England, 1836-06-01 00:00:00

XEDNESDAY. JUNE 1, 18:_

[ll4 E SUN, 1-CONDO

reret4 in I.nArkin. t settlement of the Tithe question,
xin; it up with th tion of education. But had the
teolNillif Irelatrolittaty i:, nto doubt. the readiness of'Par,
Lament to uppriate a stun fiu• such a purpose ? Had
hey shown any disposition to give large and liberal
-rants out of the public purse ?—( Hear, hear.) Ha be-
lieved no lion. Member of that 'douse, not even the Hon.
Member for Middlesex, would refuse 50,000/. for the pur-
poses of national education rather than screw it out of the
revenue of the Church of Ireland. The Irish tithe-payer> had,
he feared, an interest in avoiding the payment altogether,
t hrongh the agency of turbule.nee and disorder.—( Opposit ion
cheers.) It might ba their object to keep up the excitement
—to excite the deluded peasantry to resistance, which
such a course—he asked them whether they woold (mite in
keeping alive that excitement by postpaning the settlement
of the Tithe question. The only question that affected the
Tithe-payers was merely as to the amount they were to pay
It was a fallacy and a delusion which he was sure his Noble
Friend would not lend himself to keep up—it was ..t fallacy
to say that the tithe-payer would benefit one farthing
whether the Church were plundered of 50,0001. or 3,0001.
But between the Church and the State the matter was dif-
ferent ; it was undoubtedly the interest of the State that the
Ministers of her religion, who are now in such difilculties as to
justify what had been said ,of the Church—that it was a
Missionary Church on the outposts of Protestantism.—
(('beers.) It was the duty of the State to see that gen-
tiemen of education should be induced to enter into the
ministrp—it was the duty of the State to place them in
such a situation as to leave them to support their families
(for our "Church did not enjoin celibacy), free from
anxiety and care—to- exe:cise hospitality—to deal out
charity with a liberal hand—(Loud cheers and " Oh,
oh")—as they were mmg the few, and in some places the
only resident genfemen. It was for 'the best interests of
the State that the Ministers of tne Church should be kept
as fee from luxurious affluence as from sordid poverty. If'
any one doubted his readiness to effect both objects, he asked
them only to hear him to an end of his address, they would
be convinced of their error. In this case the State had an
interest both, in the amount and the distribution of the re-
venues of the Chinch. Some thought the State had a pecu-
niary interest. He contended that it had not ; but no one
will say but that that interest was very insignificant compared
to the other interest. The question of amount and distribu-
tion had been dealt with in the Church Temporalities Act.
With regard to the amount it proceeded upon the principle
of there being large deficiencies in some parts and extensive
superfluities in others, which justified the measures they had
taken ; -that Bill relieved the people of Ireland so far as
was consistent with the rights and maintenance of the
Church. He never thought that the maintenance of the
Church should be impaired—the main and permanent
object which he had in view was to reduce here, for the
purpose of ' augmenting there.—( Hear.) He had never
cut down for the pleasure of cutting down alone—
(Hear)—he had cut down in one place merely for
the purpose of beneficially applying surplus elsewhere.
In the first place, with regard to amount, it was pro-
posed to reduce no less than ten bishoprics by that
Bill ; it was also proposed to relieve the people
of Ireland frOm the payment of a tax for the maintenance
of their own clergy to no less an amount than 60,000/.
per annum.---( Hear.) The owner of Bishop leases were
enabled to acquire a permanent possession of that of
which they had only a leasehold before.—(Hear.) There
was also provided by the Bill the augmentation of
benefices, the erection of - churches, and the erection also
of glebe houses when required. Such were the objects which
they bad sought to obtain by the reductions they proposed,
in varioui matters in the revenues of the Church of Ire-
land. Now tbe first reduction was the one he had al-
ready stated—of the abolition of a certain number
of Bishoprics. The next in amount was the tax imposed
after the termination of existing interests in two
other Bishoprics. There was also a graduated tax hn-
• posed on all benefices beyond a certain amount—the
object of that tax was not to produce a. complete and
general equality among all livings, but to take a large portion
from those who could better spare it, and apply the surplus to
I (LEFT SPEAKING.)

His Majesty's birthday was celebrated on Saturday
at Paris, by a splendid fete champetre, given by Lord and Lady
Granville, in the hotel of the British embassy. The company
commenced arriving at three o'clock p.m., and by five there
were near 1,800 persons assembled. Dancing was to have
taken place on the magnificent lawn in the garden, which was
supplied accordingly with what was required for the accommo-
dation of the company; but the coolness of the temperature
drove the dancers into the ball-room. At six o'clock a dinner,
called a &leaner, was served on a multiplicity of tables, laid
out in the State dining-room and different other rooms. At
eight more company arrived, and dancing was resumed, and
kept up until midnight, when the music ceased, and the com-
pany began to take their departure.
INCENDIARISM.—Monday evening the inhabitants
of Aston•le-Walls were aroused from their slumbers by a cry of
fire, which was found to proceed from the farmyard of Mr. G.
Bliss. A straw rick at the back of the premises was first oh--
served in flames, which speedily communicated to the barns,
stables, hovels, cowhouses, &c. ; the whole, with, other out-
buildings, were entirely destroyed. Great exertions were used
to prevent the spreading of the flames to the dairies and
dwelling-house, and pigsties were pulled down to destroy the
communication, notwithstanding which they several times
caught fire, as well as some buildings in an adjoining farm-
yard, and were as often extinguished with but little damage.
No doubt is entertained that it was the work of an incendiary.
Although at the distance of nine miles from the scene of de-
vastation, the flames were distinctly seen at Banbury. The
damage is estimated at about 4001.
THE LATE DISCOVERY OF GOLD.—At an in-
quest which was held on Saturday, at Great Stanmore, Mr.
Stirling, the Coroner, was applied to by Giffkins and Elliott,
the coachman and gardener of the Rev. Mr. Chauvell, the
Rector of the parish, for the gold which they were the fortu-
nate finders of in March last, under the very singular circum-
stances that came out during a lengthened inquiry at the time,
and which was laid before the public. It will be remembered,
that the result of such was, that a part of the money was
awarded to the Crown, as treasure trove ; but the gold found
by Giffkins and Elliot, amounting to near 5001., was not con-
sidered by the jury as coming within the meaning of the Act,
and consequently it became the property of the finders. Mr.
Stirling, who has had charge of the last-named sum since the
inquest, has within the last two days communicated with Mr.
Maule, Solicitor to the Treasury, and received an answer from
that gentleman, to the effect, that the Crown had waved all
claim to the gold; and in reply to the application made by the
two men for the money, said they should receive it forthwith.
Since the inquest, about 15 or 16 more pieces of foreign gold
coin, similar to the former, have been found—the result .of
unwearied search made on and about the spot by the
inhabitants.

EXCUSE FOR A Ho L I DAY.—The Winchester
(American) Republican has the following neat article:--
`• Our office has not been cleaned for two years. In order to
begin the year like .civilized people, we have determined to
have a general cleaning, to wash and scrub the faces of our
types, and to put- a fresh. shirt on our devil, &c. In conse-
quence of these doings, and to allow all hands a chance of
keeping Christmas, we have issued only a half sheet this week."
The Knightsbridge-barracks, which for nearly 200
years have been appropriated for the accommodation of the
three regiments of Foot Guards, are at length to be abolished.
Four companies of the Coldstream Guards, lately quartered
there, marched yesterday to the barracks at St. John's
Wood ; one to St. George's barracks,. Charing-cross ; and
the remainder of the troops (consisting chiefly of recruits) are
ordered to Croydon. It is stated that Lord Grosvenor, the
ground landlord, intends to convert the site of the barracks and
some other adjacent property into a fashionable square.
THE AGE OF CHIVALRY NOT QUITE GONE.
—The town of New Ross has published a challenge, offering
a bet of 100/. that a handsomer lady will be found therein than
in any other town in Ireland. A young gentleman hiss left
his name at our office., who not only accepts the above offer,
but has authorised us to propose the following :—He is the re-
presentative of nine. He proposes to bet, on the part of him-
self and friends, two hundred pounds to ono ; he will only
take one street in Newry (Hill. street) ; he will allow his op--
ponents to 'take the whole town of New Ross; and he undei-
takcei to select out of this street three ladies, the least beauti-
ful of whom will be to the Wexfordians like the " lily among
thorns," or any other of the thousand and one similics that
have been said and sung in celebrating the beauty of lovely
woman. —Newry Telegraph.
A very melancholy accident occurred on Thursday
last, on one of the Earl of Lonsdale's pits near Distington.
The pit had lately been sunk to coal, and the quantity of water
produced being very great, all draw operations had been sus-
: spencied to allow the water to be n off by the pumps. No
fire or other noxious damp had ever been observed, a strong
current of air being. always found at the foot of the shelt when
the men were employed there, On Thursday the engine had been
stopped to allow some necessary repairs, and a man called
Leeson was auspended for several hours in the pit, about 20
feet froth the surface, repairing the tackle-folds of the pumps,
when about four o'clock ha was heard to moan, and a man
named John Stainton, looking hastily down, observing that
Leeson had tainted, immediately slid down the rope to assist
him. George Patterson; the engineer, who bad charge of
the repairs, happening to reach the place at the same time,
instantly followed him, but had not descended so far as Lee-
son, when both he and Stainton lost hold of the rope and were
precipitated down the shaft. Leeson was then drawn up by
the rope (being so tied in the loop, that although insensible,
he could not fall), it being evident that the shaft had suddenly
become charged with choke damp (carbonic acid gas). It
required several hours to displace the choke chimp sufficiently li
to allow persons to descend, and the last body was not reco-
vered until four o'clock the next morning. Inquests were held
during the day, and verdicts of " Accidental Death" re-
turned.—Carlisle Journal.
BRICKLAYERS' STRIKE.---Most of the building
operations in this town have been at a stand during the week,
in consequence of' the builders refusing to accede to a demand
for increase of wages. The demand notified by the men to
their employers, on leaving work on Saturday, was four
and sixpence a day, instead of four shillings, the previous
price of labour. The hodmen, and other subalterns of the
brick and lime fraternity, have joined the strike ; these latter
demanding threepence per diem additional to their previous
wages.—Sheffield Mercury,

IMP ERI AL PARLIAMENT.

HO USE OF COMMON .S, MAI, 31.

The SP2AKErt took the Chair at the usual hour

On the motion of M. HUME, the Metropolitan Suspen-
sion Bridge Committee had leave to report until the 13th of
Jane, on the ground of many of its members being on other
Committees.
_ _ _

On the motion of Mr. P. M..STE WART the Liverpool
Fire and Life Assurance Company Bill was read a second
time.

Mr. HOPE moved the third reading of the Gloucester
Water Bill. Read a third time and passed.
Mr. CLAY presented a petition from the Tower Hamlets.
praying for an improvement in the manner of recovering small
debts.

Mr. C. B CIL IsE presented a petition to the same effect
from certain inhabitants of Westminster.
Referred to the Committee.
On the motion of Mr. SANDFORD the Parret Naviga-
tion Bill was read a third time, and passed.
Sir A. LEITH HAY presented several petitions on the
subject of the statute labour in Scotland ; and one praying
that the House would take measures for securing the right of
exporting cured haddocks to Russia.
Captain BERKELEY presented a petition from Glow.
cester, praying for the abolition of Church-rates.
Mr. ROBINSON presented a petition from a public Meet-
ing held at Worcester, where there was no dissension—
(Hear, hear)—praying that Ireland might have the same
municipal institutions as other parts of the country.
Ho fully agreed in the prayer of the petition, and was sure
every honest Reformer in the kingdom would do all in his
power to obtain for Ireland the same measure of Reform as
England and Scotland.
Mr. BARRY presented several petitions from places in the
county of Cork, praying for the same measure of Corporation
Reform as England and Scotland, and praying for the ex-
tinction of Tithes.

Mr. H. GRATTAN presented petitions from places in
Meath, against tithes ; and from Antrim, in favour of the Irish
Spirit Bill ; and one from Meath, praying the House not to
pass any Bill for Municipal Reform of less magnitude tlnin
those for Scotland and England.
Mr. HOWARD presented a petition from the Council of
Carlisle, praying the House to give Ireland the same equal
rights as England and Scotland. He thought these institu-
tions a part of the old Constitution, and was glad to see the
spirit shewn by the English Corporations on this subject.
Mr. THORNLEY presented a pet ion from Wolverhamp-
ton, praying for the equalization and 'duction of the duties on
Sugar.
Mr. HUME presented a petition from the Guardians of the
Poor of St. Luke's, Middlesex, complaining of the amount they
had to pay to the county-rate, and praying that the rates of
the county might be transferred to responsible hands. . One
from the county of Argyle, complaining of the statute labour,
and one from Mr. Haydon, on the subjeel of the arts, and
praying that due encouragement might V given to native
talent. The Honourable Member gave notice that to-
morrow he would move for the appointment of a Select Com-
mittee to consider the state of the coal trade, and he would also
move for certain returns connected with the subject of cor-
poral punishment.
Sir WILLIAM GEARY and Mr. HODGES presented
petitions in favour of the South Eastern Railway Bill.
Mr. HUME wished to correct a mistake which he had been
led to make in his evidence before the Military Commission.
He had stated that a native in India had been sentenced to
1,900 lashes, of which 1,250 were inflicted. He had the
official returns, and found only 650 were inflicted. He felt
obliged to the House for allowing him to correct the error.
The ATTORNEY-GENERAL presented a petition from
Et'•'nburgh, agreed to at a public meeting, and signed in a few
hours by 12,000 persons, praying that Ireland might enjoy the
same blessings of Municipal Government which Scotland did.
Mr. BERNAL presented a petition from the inhabitants of
Rochester, Stroud, and its neighbourhood, in favour of the first
Irish Municipal Reform Bill.
MIDLAND COUNTIgS RAILWAY.

Mr. J. PARKER presented a petition from Sheffield
against the Midland Counties Railway Bill.
IRISH MUNICIPAL BILL.

Mr. POTTER presented a petition from Wigan, praying
the House to reject the Lords amendments to the Irish Muni-
cipal Bill.
LONDON AND CROYDON RAILWAY.

On the Order of the Day being read, this Bill was post-
ponedUNTlES' RAILWAY.
untmillhis day week.
DLAND CO

On the Order of the Day for the further consideration of
the Report on this Bill,
Sir R. FE RGUS SON moved the omission of several
clauses. He did not oppose the whole Bill ; but as the road was
diverted from its original course to benefit certain collieries, he
felt it his duty to propose an amendment to those clauses of the
Bill.

After a short conversation as to the propriety of recommit-
ting or postponing the Bill, the Hon. Member moved that the
Bill be recommitted.

The Earl of LINCOLN said that the Committee had
endeavoured as far as possible to make their Report in con-
formity with the wishes of all parties.
Sir R. FERGUSSON withdrew his motion for recom-
mittal, and the Bill was read a second time.

LONDON AND DOyER(§OUTEI EASTERN)

RAILWAY.

An HON. MEMBER, whose name we could not learn, moved
the further consideration of the report of the Committee on
this Bill.

Lord MA HON rose to oppose this Bill, not from any private
interest that he had in opposition to it, but from a strong
sense of public duty. He opposed the Bill on two grounds—
first, because there was already a full and efficient means for the
conveyance of goods ; and secondly, because this railroad could
only be of advantage in time of peace. He ought to add,
that as far as regarded the opinions of the owners of property
along the line, they were not in favour of the present Bill.
He had stated his objections to the Bill at an early period,
and it could not -now be said that the House was taken
by surprise. Looking at the fact that if a war broke
out, all the contemplated advantages would be annihilated—
looking to the vast amount of capital to be embarked in
the speculation—looking to the circumstance that only a
minority of the landed proprietors on the proposed, line were
favourable to the measure—and looking at the narrow divisions
in the Committee, he felt himself justified in calling upon the
House for further delay. In his opinion, it would be ruin
to those who had embarked their capital in it. The
amount that would be required, was not less than one
million and a half, and he thought that the House should
pause before it sanctioned so enormous an outlay.—( Hear.)
The question of delay was as nothing when compared with
the mischief and danger which would result from the prema-
ture adoption of an injudicious line. The Noble Lord con-
cluded by moving that the report be taken into further consi-
deration that day six months.
Mr. O'CONNELL must protest against the time of the
House being taken up in discussing the merits of rail-
ways, which have already been fully considered in a
Committee up stairs. The Noble Lord was defeated
in the Committee, and now he came to the House, and asked
them to reverse the decision of the Gentlemen who had all
the facts before them. The Noble Lord also called upon the
House to protect the poor people wbo bad subscribed a million
and a half for this railroad. Were they lunatics, that they
could not protect themselves? It was a most strange mode of
reasoning which the Noble Lord had adopted ; because
there was water communication to Dover by the Thames, there
could not be any occasion far a railroad there. Now
that was the first time he had heard that the Thames went to
Dover—that was new to him; however, even if true, it was not
-a good reason againat the present Bill. He must protest
against this waste of the time of the House.
Mr. BE RNA L said his Hon. and Learned Friend had a
very ore rotunda manner of disposing of matters, but he hoped
the House would not be led away with it.—( Hear, hear,
hear.) The House had a duty to perform ; they
were bound to enquire into the feasibility of every scheme
which was presented to them. This was one which he
felt convinced would never be carried into effect ; or if so that
it must be a dead loss to the proprietors. If Hon. Gentlemen
would look at the report, they would find that there were four
tunnels required on the line, one of them nearly a mile long ; now
to make one with such odds against it was ridiculous. Besides,
this railway avoided all the great towns in Kent, which
should have the advantage of any road which went through the
county., He thought it was not an unreasonable thing to pro-
pose that the further consideration should be postponed for
some period of time. He thought also the House was doing
wisely, honourably, and justifiably, in warning the people out
of doors against a project like the present Bill.

Mr. O'ONNELI4.. observed thirt the Hon. Member utterly
wronged him, if he thought he had any interest in this or any
other railway.
Mr. BERNAL sail that he had not intended, nor did he
state, that the- Hon. and Learned Member had any interest in
the Railway.
After a few words from Mr. hector, Mr. Richards, and Mr.
Hodges in support of the Bill ; and from Mr. Plumptre and
Mr. S. Lushington in support of the amendment,

The House divided, when the numbers were—
For the report
Fur the amendment 34
Majority
The reports on the Merthyr and Cardiff Railway Bill, the
London and Cambridge Railway Bill, and the .Eastern Coun-
ties Railway Bill were reconsidered.
PRINCE PQLIGNAC.

Mr. T. DUNCOMBE—In rising to invite the House to
concur in an address to the Throne, having for its object " To
beseech his Majesty to use his good offices with his ally the
King of the French, for the liberation of Prince Polignac
and other exiled Ministers of France," was too well aware
of the delicacy and the numerous difficulties that surrounded
the question n,ot to feel sensible how greatly he stood in need
of the indulgence of the House, while he stated as briefly as
he was able the grounds upon which he thought England
might offer her mediation without offence, and France accept
that mediation without compromising either her dignity or her
independence.—(Hear, hear.) When the House looked
back to the political career and the past lives of these misguided
men, he hoped that in advocating their release he should stand
acquitted of being actuated by any party motiVPs,' Ar biased by
any political prejudices in their favour,—( Hear.) He stood
there to recommend their release on higher grounds—he asked
for it in the name of even-handed justice and humanity. The
Hon. Member said he might be asked what right did we
possess to interfere with the domestic policy or the internal ar-
rangements of another country, or what precedents there were
that could be adduced in support of his proposition ? With
regard to the right that we might have to interfere with the in-
ternal policy of another country, he must say that he thought
such a question came rather too late ; it was true non-inter-
vention had been their precept, but how far it had been their

practice—( Hear, hearhe might safely leave either to Spain
to answer, France to alustrate, or the House of Bourbon to
acknowledge. It was now nearly six years since the British
public heard with admiration and •delight of the glories of
July and the triumphs of the barricades—when the citizens of
Paris rose almost as one man, and proclaimed that '•.the will
of the people" was the only legitimate title to the Throne.
The successful struggle made by the French nation upon that
occasion caused an excitement here which he thotigilt those
who witnessed it would not easily forget. lii short, from that
day England seemed to feel that the liberties of France must
thenceforth rest upon the same foundation as her own. But
when this excitement began to subside, and the trial of the
Ministers to commence, Englishmen began sriously to reflect
upon what description of Constitittion that was which would
make the servants of a monarch deposed, of a power that had
ceased to exist, responsible to those who were profiting- by
the change. They had then to learn in what new charter
this' double responsibility could be found, whereby a King
could be superseded and his Ministers impeached. Many
then began to suspect that either the advantages of that
eventful revolution bad been exaggerated, or the punish.
ment of its authors was ungenerous and unjust.—( Hear.)
However, the trial proceeded, and whether that trial had
been a legal or an illegal one—whether the tribunal before
which Prince Polignac was arraigned had or had not b,!en
legally constituted—he would not pretend to decide ; suffice
it to say, that the Ministers of Charles the Tenth had been
condemned, and were then in the dungeons of Ham, suffering
for having only attempted that which their more fortunate
successors had been able to accomplish with a severity and at
force which he should leave to other and wanner admirers of
this Citizen King's reign to palliate and explain.—( Hear.)
For the credit of France he wished most sincerely that she
had listened to the counsel of a Noble Lord upon this sub-
ject. He alluded to a speech of Lord Grey, made by him in
the other House of Parliament a short time previous to the
trial. That Noble Lord had said, " I am far from wishing
by any observations of mine to interfere unbecomingly in the
affairs of a neighbouring country; but I believe I may say,
that there is not a friend of liberty in Europe who would nut
feel gratified if 'he could see mercy extended to criminals who
may be thought by some least to deserve it ; and that the re.
volution so nobly accomplished might be freed from any pro-
ceedings which can have the appearance of being dictated
by motives and feelings of vengeance."—(Loud cheerina•.)
He would ask any man (let his politics be what they might)
to point out, unless vengeance were his object, what was to
be gained by this imprisonment? And here the Hon. Mem-
ber would wish to take the opportunity of stating, that when
he alluded to the subject on a former evening, he did so with-
out any communication, direct or indirect, with the prisoners
themselves, and the only communication that had since been
made to him was a letter which he received shortly after-
wards from the Princess Polignac, expressive of the gratitude.
of the prisoners at the kind mariner in which the mention of
their misfortunes had been received. by the enlightened assem-
bly which he addressed. Mr. Duncombe then read the fol-
lowing letter :--.

Ham, March 4, 1836.
" Dear Sir—Those alone who have experienced severe af-
fliction can understand how more than consolatory, how grati-
fying it is to learn that friends still remain who are not indiffe-
rent to our appalling misfortunes. It was under these impres-
sions that I perused your generous speech in favour of the pri-
soners at Ham, and learned the flattering attention with which
it was listened to by an English_ assembly. Receive, Sir, on
this occasion, my best acknowledgments ; they will, however,
be inefficient when compared with the secret satisfaction your
own conscience must afford you for having made a courageous
effort in behalf of those who linger in confinement. It is,
doubtless to the remembrance of having, in days of prospe-
rity, contributed on various occasions, to many philanthropic
acts, both on behalf of his own countrymen and of foreign-
ers, that Prince Polignac owes that serenity of mind which has
contributed to -support him in adversity, and with which he
now waits the further decrees of Providence.

" Allow me to subscribe myself, dear Sir,
" Yours truly,
" LA PSSE. DE POLIGNIrC."

" To T. Duncombe, Esq., M. P."
This letter was written by the Princess, Prince Polignac being
sentenced to civil death, not having been allowed to communi-
cate with any one. The House was, no doubt, well aware that
the fortress of Ham was situated in the most unhealthy part
of France, in the midst of marshes and morasses ; but to re-
main at large within the fortress seemed to have been thought
too lenient a punishment; for within the fortress a small prison
bad been where these unfortunate men were confined
almost in secret, without any means of exercise, excepting
upon an elevated terrace, about thirty paces in length, and
surrounded by stagnant water. At certain hours in the day a
few persons were allowed to see them, but at five o'clock they
were committed to the dungeons, where they dine alone, and
after that hour, under no circumstances of domestic affliction
or of sickness, is any friend or relation allowed to visit them
to interrupt the cheerless solitude of their cells. He would
ask if persecution like this could be necessary to the ends of
national justice ? Did it not savour rather of revenge Be-
fore he sat down the Hon. Member begged to observe that
there were precedents for this motion. Similar addresses had
been moved in that House in 1794 and 1796, by Mr. Fitz-
patrick, for the liberation of General Lafayette and other
Frenchmen confined in the prisons of our ally the King of
Prussia. He (Mr. Duncombe) had adopted the form of that
motion—a motion, too, which had been warmly supported by
all the leading Whigs of that day (as he hoped his would, 13e
by those of the present time), that motion had been sr;pported
by the present Earl Grey, by Mr. Whitbread, !fir: Wilber-
force, Mr. Sheridan, and Mr. Fox ; and Mr. Fox, when
speaking in support of it, said The customs of civilized na-
tions presented no obstacle to our interposition. In the case
of Sir Charles Asgill, applications were made by this country
to a Court with which we were then at war. The good offices
of the Queen of France were solicited, granted, and proved,
effectual, and America, the ally of France, yielded to an inter-
position in behalf of humanity." The Hon. Gentleman, in con-
clusion, then moved the following Address—" Humbly to
submit to his Majesty the propriety of his Majesty using his
good offices with his ally the King of the French for the li.
beration of the Prince de Polignac and Messrs. de Peyronnet,
Chantelauze, and Guernon de Ranville."—( Loud cheers.)
Captain BERKELEY seconded the motion.
Mr. P. HOWARD trusted the motion would receive the
sympathy of men of all parties in that House,
Mr. WARD was inclined to vote for this motion, as far as
mere motives of humanity were concerned ; but he did not
think it at all prudent for this House to interfere between
great political offenders and the country which had con-
demned them. He did not wish to speak needlessly nor
harshly of the crime for which they had been condemned, but
he must say, that in his mind, it was one of the deepest poli-
tical die. Prince Polignac played for the highest stake fur
which a subject could play—to be absolute Minister of an ab-
solute Sovereign, with the risk, in the event of a defeat,....,i
incurring hardships even greater than thase to which they
were exposed ; and when the Flat] ie recollected the nuimber of
lives sacrificed in the struggle that took place h consequence
of the advice which Knee Polignac volunteore4 to his Sove-
reign, it might be doubted whether a miter degree of pu-
nishment had been inflicted upon him and his associates, than
was requisite for the safety of their persons ; nor must it be
altogether lost sight of, that the hardships of which they now
complained were a commutation of a much severer sentence.
Sir IL INGLIS believed the people of England would
learn with very peculiar satisfaction that the King of the French
had been advised by his own Ministers to concede the point
now at issue.

Lord PALMERSTON sald—speaking for himself, and lie
might undertake to say also for his colleagues, nothing would
give his Majesty's Government more sincere pleasure than to
learn that the Government of France had thought it expedient
to advise the King of the French to exercise his prerogative
of pardon towards the persons who were the objects of this
motion. Such an act on the part of the King of the French
would, he knew, meet with the approba.tiee, and excite the
satisfaction of all persons, not only in this country, but gene-
rally throughout Europe, beeause, speaking individually on
this matter, he could not conceive, whatever might have
been the political offence for which Prince Pelignae and his
associates were condemned, that there now existed any neces-
sity for continuing a punishment so severe and so long endured,
or that it was at all consistent with the generous and high-
minded feelings which so peculiarly distinguished the French
nation, to continue a punishment after it ceased to be neces-
sary for the purpose of example, and when any fear of a repe-
tition of the crime was out of the question. A generous
oblivion would under such circumstances be far more conso-
nant to their feelings.—( Hear.) But however becoming it
might be for the 'Hon. Member who entertained principles
known to be peculiarly favourable to the lillerty of the subject
to stand forward as he did on the present occasion as the
advocate of mercy, yet he was sure the House would be of
opinion that notbinix pallid be so inexpedient, or so dangerous
in its tendenoy, as for a British,House of Commons to address
the King of England to interfere in a matter connected with
the domestic concerns of another eountry.—( Hear, hear.)
He apprehended no precedents could be found for any such
step. In the case alluded to, General Lafayette, and a cer-
tain number of persons with him, quitted the French army
with an intention of proceeding to Holland, and were made
prisoners of war by some outposts of the Austrian army.
They were prisoners of war, therefore, and the Hon. Mem-
ber's speech on the occasion alluded to said exnrossly that he
supported the motion, because General Lafayette was not a
subject either of the
.King of Prussia or the Emperor of
Austria, nor had he violated any law to which he was sub-
ject, and, therefore, as a mere prisoner of war. England
being art ally in that war, had a right to mediate on his behalf ;
hut here was a case where the subjects of another country
committed what was adjudged by a competent tribunal in that
country to be a crime of a very grave nature, and who were
now suffering the mitigated punishment awarded to them by
such competent tribunal. Indeed, even with a view to the
object which the Hon. Gentleman himself proposed, it would
be most wise and politic not to press this motion. The French
people, though generous and chivalrous, were highly sensitive
as to their national honour; and though likely to be swayed by
the expression of the opinion of the Members of a free assembly
in a friendly country, yet, should that assembly proceed one
step further, and do anything which might appear like dicta-
tion or interference, their pride would most likely be raised,
and the effect preduced tie directly the reverse of that intended.
He therefore begged his Hon. Friend to content himself With
having elicited from the House expressions of entire sympathy
and concurrence in sentiments which did him much honour.
Mr. R. PLUNKETT wished to assure the Hon. Nl'ember
for Finsbury that there were several Members on that (the
Opposition) side of the House, who, though not professors of
liberalism, were quite ready and desirous to vote for so truly
liberal a motion as that which he had made,
Mr. C. FE RGUSSON said it appeared to him that the
opinions expressed by the 11jgi,k .ofd (Paitnerston) was much
more likely to effect the olliect which they all seemed to have
in Yi,9lv the %93. roMe4 to be Vi*etz,

L should give a similar vote to ti's
Lord JOHN
Noble Friend the Secretary for Foreign Affairs,
aifor these •
larSSIFL
reasons stated by him. Whatever his sympathies
-
unfortunate prisoners, he thought it was not proper TO inter
trehlOcu gwhits ,h moreover eod voen; ,e s thatt ic concerns
s present G anotherol.ern Government
justice
ou', anal
anb:7,u
was disposed to consider this question in a spirit oe's,
humanity.--( Hear, hear.) It happened to him to be in
after the Revolution of 1830, and when the
naotupiranr
aufti.evr aas
very
popular—an opinion, too, which was very
volution which cost so much blood and so many lives, that the
Ministers x
who advised the course which Charles X. a
were amenable to capital punishment on the scaffuld e .nip'
pored to be asked by persons nearly connected with Prince_
Pulignac and his associates, to ascertain' what was likely to
be the issue of their trial. He certainly could not pretend
c.
to have any influence with persons with whom he was
quainted in France to prevail on them to alter their intuit-
tion, but he had sufficient influence with the Ministers and the
Court to ascertain what their sentiments were for the satisfac-
tion of those who inquired; and he knew that the enlightened
Sovereign who now ruled over the French people, and the
Ministers then his advisers, contemplated with horror the
idea of any capital punishment being inflicted ; and that all
their influence with the Chambers would be used to prevent
their coining to any decision by which the lives of these
viduals might be affected. He took care to convey this inF.nr-
oration to those who were so anxious on the subject ; 'out it
was stated to him that, if even that should he done, and The
Chambers were to decide that the lives of the ex-Ministers
were to be spared, it was feared that a popular insurrection
might arise—that the National Guard might be fcrced, or
might
allow itself to be forced, on the prisoners being taken
to or from the Chamber ; and that those whom clue Chan .ber
bad spared would be sacrificed to the fu7--y
and the ven.g.tance
of a sanguinary mob. It was his c.-ate at that time to he inti-
mate, and it was an intirno...,y
with pride and satif:„tio„, which he should always, confess
with General Lafayette—(Hear,
hear)—who then commanded the National Guard. He wrote
to him to solicit an interview, and the General did him the
honour to visit him. He stated to the General the danger
apprehended with respect to the lives of the prisoners then on
their trial. The General certainly stated it as his decided.
opinion, and asked him if that would not have been the op-,
nions of Englishmen, at least in former times, that the offerx*
which the Ministers had committed was art offence punishable
with death; but went on to say that as a question of hu-nanity
he never would promote -or be a party consenting to the pu-
nishment of death being inflicted; and when he put co him the
question, " May there not be some danger that the National
Guard may be forced, and violence committed ea the persons
of the prisoners?" the General answered, with great emotion,
"No that must not be—that shall not be !"—( Hear. ). Such '
was the answer of General Lafayette, a brave and honest
man, a republican undoubtedly in his opinions, but a sincere:
and humane man. He would ask, therefore, the Hon. Mem-
ber for Drogheda whether, such having been the opinions off
the Court, the Ministers, the Chambers, and the Commanders...
in-Chief of the National Guards, and their sincerity havi
been fully borne out by their subsequent conduct, whether an
imputation of cruelty, especially considering the provocnt'.on of
the recent revolution, could justly rest upon a nation of whom
the King at present reigning over it, and Gen. La',ayettc,
now no more, were the most distihguished ornaments ? He
did not agree with the motion now before the House:, for the
reasons stated by his Noble Friend ; and he would. aid, that
if it had been proper to interfere in cases of this description,
there were other occasions of persons condemned in former
days, and who had suffered a long and grievous imprisonment,
not because they had been parties to ordonttanees, but because
in truth they were too sincere friends te, liberty. He should
vote therefore against the motion if pressed to a divisions but
begged to state that he syinpatUsed entirely with what ap-
peared to be the prevalent feeP,ng of the House on the subject.
Sir E. COD RINGTOI:`.; was in Paris' at the same time
with the Noble Lord, anti could fully confirm his observations.
Mr. G. PRICE will-lady complimented the Hon. Member
for Finsbury for the trimmer in which he had brought the sub-
ject forward.
Mr. A. TREVOR could not help saying that, let the'
offence of the prisoners be what it might, justice had been sa-
tified by the punishment which they had already received.
Mr. POULTER thought that the most appropri'ate oston-
sible ground on which the prisoners could he reletaed by the
Government would be a demonstration by that gouse, (pehich
was esteemed by the countries of the Continent to oe the
great defender of the principles of liberty), of its desire te see
the further prosecution of the punishment awarded to Prince
Polianac and his companions remitted. He therefore
put it
to the House whether dais motion of the Hon. Member for
Finsbury should not l:Je acceded to ?
Dr. LUSHINCiTON said, the interference of that House
would be eakolated especially to excite the jealousy of a -na-
tion like tire French, nor was there any deTence for a co-arse
of:proceeding which-proposed to violate the, laws of natior.s, by
inducing the interference of the Legislature of one courary in
the internal administration of the other. His hope was that
the expression which on the present occasion had been made
of the feelings of that House on. the subject would not be lost
on the mass of the French pf.:ople.
Mr. W. ROCHE thooght that a direct interference would
be highly impolitic on the part of that House ; but that, on
the other hand, the universal and unanimous expression of
feeling which the subject had called forth on this occasion
wonild'prove most beneficial to the prisoners.
Mr. T. DUNCOMBE should beg leave to withdraw his
motion. He could not do so, however, without expressing his
gratitude for the sympathy in the object of the motion which.
had been shown from all parts of the House.
BUSINESS OF. THE HOUSE.
Lord J. RUSSELL took that opportunity of saying that
as there was an impression that the debate on the Irish Church
Bill, fixed for to-morrow, was likely to last more than one day,
he proposed to make a different arrangement with respect to
the Irish Municipal Bill. He did not, that being the ease, in-
tend to bring forward that measure on Thursday. On Friday
his Right Hon. Friend the Chancellor of the Exchequer was.
to bring forward the question of the Stamp Act ; on Mondaw
he (Lord J. Russell) proposed to bring on the Bill for
Registration of Births and Marriages ; and he there(.ore
proposed to postpone the Irish Municipal Bill until Thtersday
week.
Mr. W. S. O'BRIEN appealed to. the Noble L.ird whe-
ther the House would be acting properly 10Y the people of
Ireland in keeping them so long in Faspens;e as was now
proposed?
Mr. IIU?,IE conjured the Noble Lord not to delay the con-
sideration of the amendmr.ints sent down from the other House,
and to postpone any measure, be it what it might, whether the
Stamp Act or the 1;i11 for the Registration of Births and Mar-
riages, for all were of inferior importance to that measure
which so l'auch interested the Irish people.
T• An. HON. MEMBER—There is .no question before the
.louse.-( Hear.)
Mr. HUME—Then, Sir, I ask you why you permitted the
Hon. Member for Limerick to address the House ?
The SPEAKER—The Hon. Member is perfectly justified
in asking me that question, but I am sure be and the House
will at once see that there is a material difference between
allowing an Hon. Member personally interested in the matter
communicated to the House by the Noble Lord, arid allowing
that which is stated as a matter of convenience to be made the
subject of general discussion.—( Hear, hear.)
On the motion of Mr. W. S. O'BRIEN, leave was given'
to bring in a Bill to regulate the medical eharities.supported
by county assessments in Ireland.
Mr. HUTT moved for a return of the number of ships'
reports that required amendment during the two years ending
the sth of January, 1836 ; the date of each ship's arrival, and
the date at which the amended report was completed, stating
the nature of the error in each case.
After some observations from Mr. F. Baring, Mr. Ewart,
Mr. Hume, Mr. Robinson, Mr. Thorneley, and one or two
other Hon. Members, the motion was agreed to.
NAVAL AND MILITARY PROMOTIONS.
Mr. BANNERMAN rose to call the attention of the
House to the situation in which many officers of various ranks,
belonging both to his Majesty's land and sea forces, were now
placed, and whose length of service seemed to entitle them to
the consideration of Parliament and the country. It was not
his intention to bring forward individuai cases of hardship, but'
to treat the subject of promotion genes ally ; and, in the outset,
he hogged distinctly to state that lie brought his motion for-
ward without -the sanction of his' Majesty's Government.
There were in the navy no -fewer than 78 captains of thirty
years' standing. Most of their were between sixty and seventy
years of age, and although they might not according to the rules
and regulations of the service be fit for effective service, still
there was no good reason that he could see why the addi-
tional half-pay which superior rank would give them, should
be withheld from them. The complaint which prevailed in
the navy in reference to the subject of promotion, also existed
in the army, and therefore the same observations which ap-
plied to the one service would also apply to the other. He
thought flint the senior officers of both navy and army were
fully entitled to the additional pay which promotion to the
rank they ought to hold would give them ; and as this could
be done for 20,0001. or 25,0001. in the navy, and a similar
sum in the army, he submitted that this act of tardy justice
should be done to them, especially as the amount would be
reduced at least one half in the course of two or three years.
The lion. Member concluded by moving for a return of the
number of flag-officers, captains, and commanders, who had.
died since the Ist of January, 1831, and the corresponding,
saving which had been effected in the amount of pay ; and also
a return of the number of officers, of a similar rank, who hod
been appointed since 1831, together with the increase which&
their pay had occasioned.
After an observation from Mr. HusrE,
- -

Mr. B. HOY rose to support the motion. The hr..rdAip
upon officers of the army from the want of adequate promotion
was4nuch greater now than formerly, for there were now no
battaliims into which an Qfficer could retire upon full pay.
By an order made in 1830 no officer was
.entitled to retire
upon half-pay until such time as the expense of that branch
of the public expenditure should he reduced from 140,0001. to
4mt)o/. He could not see any reason why the officers of
either service should not be held as much entitled to conside-
ration as the services of the officers engsged in a civil capt-
city. Now, let them, for example, tP2iie the case of an adju-
tant-general thirty years in the se* vice, whose pay was 600 L
a-year. Upon his retirement, he would be entitled to a re-
tiring pension of 14e,1. a-year, whilst a clerk in the civil sec,-
vice, receiving the like salary, would be after the same perio a
of service, entitled to a reting allowance Of 450 L a-year. With
respect to the slowness of promotion in the navy, ho 'could
mention the case of an officer in the navy who was forty years
in the service, and who had been thirty-four times 'engaged.
His last service was on the coast of Africa, and he bad returned
home with health impaired; and had been subjected to law-
suits in consequence of circumstances that had occurred in the
execution of the command that he held under the Crown. Yet
this individual, notwithstanding that long period of service,
was still in the rank of Commander.
Lord HOWICK felt, in common, 'with other Hen. Mem..