The Sun.
London, England, 1836-04-28 00:00:00

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quite true that the professional body never put their ticman's duty as a Minister of the Crown not to-----''-ai, ......
less informed fellow_eitizcns on their guard when the Bill was fair and partial selection of taxes to be rernittedint,—„e an -
in its progress through parliament. He woald speak of this that all classes were benefited in the reductions '-4 tellß"
tax only as a very grave and stringent one, which all classes held about to effect. —THear, hear.) It was a currieh h:Sfl
stance, but it was the fac't, that in the reduction °11:f ei 414
as odious and oppressive—one which must be got rid of in ac_
cordance with the wish„ of all classes, whether Churchmen which had taken place in this country during the last taxat. •
or Dissenters ; but if it must be kept on for a time, he had no no great or substantial relief (as was shown by the
five
ye toi,
difficulty in saying that those who had hitherto paid it must turns dated the 17th of March, 1836) had been atioevr,elalk:B)
now be relieved from it, and those who had contrived to escape agricultural interest. From 1831 to 1835, the amas'eq to rh"
from it be forced to pay it entirely, until, at the least, they had duction of taxation was 891,000/. ; but when the v-4t
°it':
paid to the same amount as their brethren. He would sane- examine how much of this remission was of taxes "' jakttle t-r,..
tion a Bill to throw the whole of this odious tax on the directly on the land, the House would be surprised waAeg heti,:
learned profession of Edinburgh for five or seven years, or that the whole amount was only half a million.—( Fite" giseov;
until they had paid as much as those who presently suffer under He found amongst these reductions the duty on til ear' hearer
it;
and he would like to know what valid objections that rich, a certain extent, no doubt, was borne by the land,es'il,l"ich to
numerous, and learned body would make to so just a proposi- amounted to 33,0001. That on fire insurance witha ,-,„tthiek-
tion. In accordance with your advice, Sir, and the feeling agricultural property amounted to 30,0001. The tarvPact t -
manifested by the House, he would not enter further at pre- dows and houses was also repealed ; but he - " wii°
sent into this case, but merely bring up the petitions of Mr. House, that though that was a general reduction Till tell tih;
Councillor Russell, now in the common jail of Edinburgh, ficial to the country, and of which he was, at the tr Ihbeae-
and that of nearly seven hundred of the inhabitants of Perth, proposed, a warm advocate, it conferred a benefit notrn s- W4'
who sympathised with that gentleman, and who prayed that on the agriculturists as on the inhabitants of towns. 0- thins
the tax in question be abolished, as every other detrimental whole, he thought the Chancellor of the Exchequer On tht
to piety and morality must do. low, that with respect to taxes which had hitherto be n-seal.
Lord J. RUSSELL said, difficulties had stood in the way off, a rather partial reduction (to say the least of it) le,a-‘, taken
epni°3sfst'ss Bhe-ttlell
of the borough commissioners which had delayed the report of made. The duty on printed cottons had been
thetak
the Church commissioners ; and he had been informed that a or entirely for the benefit of the the manufacturing pa,. 801e1,
report had been drawn up by the latter, which was ready to be country. But the Chancellor of the Exchequer m 1,4.14 the
presented, but that a question had subsequently arisen as to that the taxes which had been taken off were benefieiV say,
the expediency of presenting a report regarding Edinburgh agriculturists, because those on whom they immediate) al
the only, when even that was not complete ;it was suggested that contributed to the charges on the land. Now let tied
it ought to be delayed until that portion of the subject had take the fact, that not half a million of taxes whichQp,°llBo
been thoroughly investigated. The Commissioners were fur. immediately on land had been remitted ; and then look pressed
nished with the number of persons attending the churches, but number of general and direct taxes to which the la 4t the
not with the amount of funds applicable to them, and the subjected.—( Hear, hear, hear.) Let them look nd ajaa
Commissioners had applied to him for his opinion, to which he expenses of the county rates, which were very consideraiti the
replied that as they must be much better judges of the matter not at present diminished by any material amount. Th e allti
than he could be, it would be fit for them to adopt some deci- vernment certainly last year afforded the agriculturist s° 'a•
sion of their own ; he had added, however, that according to partial relief by the payment of 100,000/, for
their original instructions, if they were not prepared to make of felons ; but he quite concurred in the opinlilo.hnicthhatthethaee;tei°4ll
a report on part of the subject, it would be proper for them to expense of these prosecutions should be taken dr, and elv, note
make a report, stating the grounds for not doing so. The should be made a national charge on the country. (Tat it
Commissioners had not yet taken either course, and he had hear.) In the malt tax and assessed taxes,
not received either a partial report or a statement why a turists had to pay, he regretted that neither the presogleat
partial report had not been made.—( Hear, hear.) He quite the Government by which it was preceded had thought 11`)
agreed in what had been generally stated, that it was expe- to make the slightest reduction. The question of the
rlO- relle.:.
dient some settlemeat of the question immediately before the tax was one upon which he did not feel justified in
t 1.441
House should be made; but difficulties had been created, not The [louse on of Commons had decided it, and he only
adetl.ung,
by the Government, but by events which had happened long to it for a moment for the purpose of repeating his
(Tirted
ago ; notwithstanding those difficulties, if only what was rea- from the course which was taken in refusing agnculturiat: the
, he
sonable were considered, a settlement, he thought, might be relief which on this question they demanded.—(Hear
made, but it would not be at all easy to frame any settlement The Noble Lord then adverted to a Committee appoiate,„ .)
in which all parties would concur.—( Hear.) the House of Lords in 1824 on the subject of county rat 4by
es .
Sir W. RAE gave notice, that if in the course of a fort- highway rates, and read from their report an extract to the ea.'4
night nothing were done, he would bring the subject again be- that it was clearly established by the evidence brought befor fleet
fore the House. Committee that the landed interests were not compensa,_e the
After a few words from Mr. Pringle, Mr. A. Johnston, the any corresponding reductions in taxation for the fixed
ni`ed by
Attorney-General, and Mr. Hope Johnstone, the petition was payments to which they were liable ; that, whilst their 15,.°teY
laid upon the table. able returns had decreased, their burdens had been au `--e'ata
COURTS OF EQUITY. that improvements and the facilities of internal grnented

improvements in..-- ___. _ cornmunicat•-;
were national objects of importance, the expenses of wil.°4
should be borne by the community generally, that the exisohleh
of the highway rate was 421,5041., of which 388,440/. fe'ese
the land, and only 33,3061. was borne by the holders of of
property. In 1834, he had submitted a motion very simii:'er
the present, namely, that in any reductions which should to
effected relief should not be withheld from the landed interest
and the Minister of that day having opposed it, a division t(;,:;,;
place, when the numbers were—against the proposition
n:
and in favour of it 204. So that the Government then had Os,
a majority of two.---( Hear, hear.) In the present House but
Commons, and with a large return which had been made q
Hon. Gentlemen who at that time, and since, professed th tf
attachment to the landed interest, he could not but beliee'r
that he should have the satisfaction not only of hearing
thei°o
professions, but of seeing those professions established by
theirr
votes, and that those who declared themselves to be
the
assertion friends on the hustings would prove the truth of
tse
assertion by their acts in that House.—( Hear, hear.) Thel'e
had heard rumours within the last few days (it was not for hith3r
to say whether or not they were correct) of the probability -
their appearing again before their constituents. if et
should be the case, he, for one, would certainly feel mot!'t
gratified if he were enabled to call on his constituents for
renewal of their confidence on the ground that he had cony
tributed towards attaining some relief for them, particular)
when he should feel convinced that in having acted as e
should have done he would not have hampered the intentio,..!
of Government with regard to the reductions which they pr7s
posed.—( Hear, hear.) With regard to the question of corns
laws the Committee had made an allusion to it in their re_
port, nor did he think they were called on to do so ; but there
were Hon. Gentlemen in that House whose opinion it was
that the landed interest had, by these laws, a monopoly, and
that we were inclined to say that we wished solely to relieve
ourselves, and not our neighbour. He begged distinctly and
publicly to deny this assertion, and to represent the opinion of
the agriculturists in its true light when he stated their wish tobe not to look for any monopoly whatever, but to require a
fair remuneration for their labour, and an equal participa..
tion in the benefits to be derived from reduction of taxa.
tion.—( Hear, hear.) If Hon. Members read the evidence
of the Committee, they would see not only that the e,.
pital of the farmer was diminished, but that, in many in.
stances, the landlord made a reduction in his rent, and yet was
not able to save his tenant. He knew that in this instance
he would be asked why he did not propose any specific se_
medy for agricultural distress ?—( Hear, hear.) He eers
tainly did not think he was called on to do so (although
he entertained an opinion on the subject which he hoped to
prove to the satisfaction of the Committee when they were
about to make their report), when he merely claimed for the
farmer his due, just, and fair proportion of the relief which was
promised to the community.—( Hear, hear.) The Noble
Lord concluded by moving a resolution to the effect, that in the
application of any surplus to the revision of taxation or other.
wise, due regard should be had to the necessity of affording
proportionate relief to the agricultural interest.
Mr. W. DUNCOMBE seconded the motion. If the
Right Hon. Gentleman the Chancellor of the Exchequer be.
lieved that in repealing the stamp duty on newspapers he was
conferring a benefit on a great portion of the community, if he
was certain that he had not unnecessarily yielded to clamour( Hear, hear, and a laugh)—if he believed that measure would
be the means of affording substantial relief to the public, he
did not blame him for submitting, but he only put in the claim
of the agriculturists as entitled to some share in the remission
of taxes which was contemplated by Government.—(Hear.)
With .espect to the duty on newspapers, he had heard that in
this metropolis all the papers might be read on payment of 2d.
at certain coffee-shops and reading-rooms. There was no
doubt but equal facility was afforded in other great towns for
reading the public papers; and if that were so, it might not be
unfairly assumed that the public had already sufficiently eas
access to the information contained in the public journals. But
whether that were so or not, he thought the House would do
well to that if any surplus were found to exist, some portion of
it at least should be applied to the relief of the agricultural in.
terest.—( Hear, hear.)
The question having been put,
Lord J. RUSSELL said that he rose to object to the
motion just made by the Noble Lord. The distress of the
agricultural class had not only been shown by the presenta.
tion of petitions on that and previous evenings ; but it was
noticed in the King's Speech, and before the Noble could
could make the motion which he intended to make for a Com,
mittee, a declaration was made on his (Lord John Russell's)
part that he was ready to enter into the fullest inquiry on this
subject. The Committee appointed had made no report, and
was far from completing the evidence to be brought before it.
Therefore the Noble Lord was not quite justified in alluding
to extracts and drawing deductions from part of the Report
which had been printed, because there could be no fair deci_
sion as to the cause and extent of agricultural distress until
the whole of the evidence was heard, and the Committee had
considered that evidence, and submitted their conclusions to
the House.—(Hear, hear, hear.) On this ground he eon..
sidered the motion premature. He said premature, the
more especially when every opportunity was given to the
Noble Lord and the witnesses who entertained the same opis
nions with him, in order that their evidence might be
heard. The question involved in the motion of the Noble
Lord, namely, the extent of distress, was a question which
remained still to be considered, on which evidence was to be
taken and witnesses heard ; and he said decidedly that the
House could come to no adequate decision until witnesses had
been heard with respect to other parts of the country of a diffe..
rent description and position from those upon which the wit,
nesses already examined had given their evidence. Then with
regard to the immediate motion of the Noble Lord. As far
as that question did not depend on any inauiry before the Agri..
cultural Committee, but as a general question which the
Noble Lord wished to bring forward, he thought the better
course with respect to it, as with respect to others of the same
kind was to hear the reductions to be proposed by his Right
Hot,. Friend the Chancellor of the Exchequer—and then...,
should those reductions not appear to have been well consi..
dered—should they propose to relieve those parts of the coun.
try which were not the most distressed, or to afford a stimulus
to industry in regard to those branches of trade which were
not most in want of a stimulus, it would be time enough for
those Hon. Members who represented the various interests of
the country thereby aggrieved to state to his Right Hon.
Hear, hear.)
Friend that he had been mistaken in his selection, and that the
relief which he proposed ought to be applied to other taxes and
to other parties than those to which he contemplated applying.
it. Such being the case, be thought it would be unwise, he
thought it would be premature in the House to declare in
the first instance, and before they had heard the statement
of his Right Hon. Friend, that one particular interest, namely,
five year:
the agricultural interest, ought to be the one to which, in pre_
ference to all others, relief should be applied.—(
very lit.
Had the Noble Lord pointed out that there was some partial
tax, some especial burden, pressing so heavily on the agrieul..
tural interest, that before listening to any other complaint the
Government was bound to give relief in respect to it, he (Lord
John Russell) might perhaps have admitted that there was
some justice in the statement the House had that eveni:s
heard ; but inasmuch as the Noble Lord had as far as 5
l'essi..
ble abstained from making any such statement, he did not feel that he or his Majesty's Government was at the present
moment called upon to deliberate upon it.—(Hear.) The
Noble Lord complained that although within, the last
upwards of eight millions of taxes had been repealed,
tle relief had been thereby given to the agricultural interest;
but had he in his calculation thought proper to take in the
year preceding that from which the return he read was dated°,
he would have been able to state to the House that upcul
the demand of a very considerable body of its members;
whom Lord Althorp was the leader, the then Governrnetoif
had reduced the tax upon beer, and removed completely tht
remaining duties upon leather. Now he (Lord John Russelle • maintained that the beer tax was a tax which pressed upon th)
agricultural interest more especially than any other. At the
time the reduction to which he alluded was agreed e
upon,

Mr. O'CONNELL referred to a Bill in progress through
Parliament for reforming Courts of Equity, and asked whe-
ther it was intended to introduce a clause to prevent a practice
inconsistent with common sense, viz., that a judge should hear
and decide an appeal in the House of Lords against one of
his own decrees ?
The ATTORNEY-GENERAL said that even if he were
acquainted with them, it would be irregular for him to disclose
the enactments of a measure in the other House of Parliament.
He would go so far as to say that he disapproved of the prac-
tice alluded to, where an appeal was merely made from the
Lord Chancellor to the Lord Chancellor—ab eodein ad eundem,
but the Lord Chancellor often only assisted.
Mr. O'CONNELL did riot refer to cases where the Lord
Chancellor only assisted in the same way that a judge, who
had tried a case at Nisi Prius, aided the other judges in
Banco, on a question of new trial. His question was limited
to a judge even volunteering to sit on an appeal from himself,
when it was possible that a suspicion of his motives might be
excited.