The Sun.
London, England, 1849-07-12 00:00:00

had slluded the certificates of masters and mates of yes-
gels might be withdrawn by the magistrates of this
juriediction, who would at any time be liatle to actions
for their proceedings, and the regulations would prove
harsh in the extreme to the seaman. These
certificates ought. to be withdrawn fur any case of
desertion. He was quite ready to bear his share in
eemtnendation of the British seaman, and no one could
be more anxious that those merits should be duly recoe-
nised and rewarded.—(Hear, hear.) None could think
more highly or his qualities and capability for his work.
'1 hose qualities and that capability had long been proved;
but yet if the re were any deficiencies which it lay in
their power to remove in order to render that capability
the greater, it wee unquestionably their duty to remove
them—(hear, hear)—and in doing so it wes their
duty altogether to di.regard the clamour that might be
raised respecting the rights of the British seaman. He
did not wish to say more, but there was one other remark
which he felt compelled to make. The Right Hon. Gentle-
man, his speech on the Bill for the repeal of the na-
vigation-laws bad observed that that measure was not
intended to inflict an injury but to confer a benefit. In
this he perfectly concurred; and he did not feel that they
were in any way retracing their steps; but the question
was whether this Bill was quite adequate to all its ob-
jects, reed whether a larger, more comprehensive, and
more effective measure might not have been introduced.
—(Hear.) For his own part he was free to confess that
he thought there might have been. He thought that
the principle which had been adopted with respect to the
masters and the mates of vessels ought also to be
adopted with respect to manning the mercantile marine.
They had emancipated the shipowner, they had emanci-
pated the shipbuilder, they had destroyed the monopoly
of both, and why not destroy also the monopoly of the
seaman.—(Hear, hear.) The principle which they bad
applied to the shipbuilder and the shipowner, which had
to a certain extent been applied to the masters and mates
of vessels, was equally applicable to the 'seamen. He was
convinced that the system of compulsory examination
would do good, great good, but still not all the good
that might be accomplished. They might go further,
and give to the seamen who man our ships the same
facilities which the masters and shipowners enjoyed,
and allow them to seek empletyment wherever it might
be beneficial tor their interests.—(Hear, hear.) It was
a very remarkable and significant fact that curing the
last year not less than 14,000 of our seamen had
deserted the merchant service. It was plainly
evident, then, that that service did not pos-
sess any very great or peculiar attractions.
and no unnecessary scruples need be entertained
respecting the introduction of rules by which its regula-
tion might be improved.—(Hear, hear.) They had
adopted the principle of building their ships and carry-
ing their goods in the best manner and at the lowest cost.
Why should they not carry out this principle to the
manning of those ships, and let the shipowner] procure
his crews and make his arrangements with any set of
men with whom he might choose to engage.-(Hear.)
That principle / could not, might not be adopted
this session, but he must say that the next should not,
ought not to pass without some Bill grounded upon it
being carried through Parliament. He did not wish in any
way to depreciate the present Bill of the Right Hon.
Gentleman, or in any way to disparage his motives or
his endeavours to improve the condition of our mercan-
tile marine, but he could nut help saying that the Bill
would have been better if the principle to which he al-
luded had been embodied in its provisions.
Sir: G. CLERK thought the Bill which the Right
Hon. Gentleman proposed to introduce was one
whch, from the reduction of the light dues
that it would effect, was likely to be or
great immediate benefit to the mercantile community.
The Right Hon. Gentleman had asked for leave to intro-
duce a Bill, which he bad stated he wished to pass this
session. As; Member for Dever: he must protest against
a measure which so nearly affected the interests of his
constituents being taken at so late a period of the session.
The Right Hon. Gentleman had stated that the measure
of Lord St thnham had been defeated by local interests.
tic only mentioned this to prove that local interests did
exist. He thought he had a tight to complain of the
late period of the session. It would have been just
as easy to bring on the meatura on the 12th
of February as on the 12th of July. The alterations
too which were proposed were very objectionaehe and
injurious too to the pilots; and from what he had seen
there was no such great excess of remuneration paid to
them that it was necessary: those at the Cinque Ports had
about 1101. per annum, and the others about 1201. He must
ask too with regard to the examination of masters and
mates, did the Right Hon. Gentleman imagine that the
American Minister, or the American captains, would
submit to this. He thought that not only the Ameri-
cans but also all the foreign Ministers would complain.
Till a full opportunity had been afforded the country for
considering the Bill, he hoped it would not be persevered
in; but, at all events, if it were, it would meet with his
most decided opposition.—(Hear, hear.)
Mr. T. M. 'GIBSON observed that a pilot question
never could be brought before ,Parliament without it
always being thought necessary to introduce a clause
to this effect : " Provided always that nothing in this
Bill contained shall effect the rights and privileges of the
Cinque-pot ts." There was always a reservation of that
sort conveyed in an intimation that thee might do what
they liked without interfering with the Cinque Ports.
Now it so happened that the Cinque Ports were the great
grievances, they formed the subject of all the complaint.
and if they left them out of the Bill, it would be like the
play of Hamlet with the part of Hamlet left out.— (Hear,
and a laugh.) The speech which they had just heard
was not the speech of the Right Hon. Baronet the late
Vice-President of the Board of Trade, but the speech of
the Hon. Member for Dever, and certainly the speech
induced him to think of his Right Hon. Friend's scheme,
for certainly he did not collect from his Right Hon.
Friend's observation that he intended to grapple %%WI
the Cinque Ports in a manner that would become him
as a Minister of the Crown. From the speech
of the Honourable Member for Dover—(A. laugh)—
it appeared otherwiee. Now this was not a question
effecting the rights of a large body of individuals; and
though there might have been a time when the ne-
cessities of the country required that large and ex-
clusive privileges should be conferred on the Cinque
Ports, that time had long since gassed away,
and instead of those privileges being a public convenience
they were a public nuisance; he therefore called upon
the Right Honourable Baronet the President of the
Board of Trade to deal with these cinque ports with a
bold hand. He did not believe • that the dis-
tinguished person who was- at the head of
them would throw any obstacle in the way
of improvement, if proper representations were made to
them.—(Hear, hear.) With regard to the pilot system
itself, it worked in this way: when ships do not want a
pilot he is forced upon them, and %Len they do want a
pilot they cannot get one, and for this simple reason,
that they secured to the pilot a certainty of employ-
ment and income in fine weather, which induced him to
take no trouble, and go to sea in bed weather. If they
often
often thesk of South
secured en income to him in fine weather, it was not
likely that he would run the risk abd danger, and incur
that
verytf n o n
lan t
h a() i
the wear and tear by going to sea in rough weather,
cahnadrgteheofcaonpsieloqtuiennficeue
was,
weather, Foreland, vessels which were compelled to submit to the
be-
ing lost through the:neglect of the pilot to go to sea in
rough weather. With regard to the Trinity Corporatiun,
he was ore of those who had never joined in a tilt
against them, because the evil of the light dues had
been occasioned by the acts of the Crown and the Legis-
lature.—(Dear, hear.)
Mr. CARDWELL said if he understood the state•
meat of the Right Honourable Gentleman opposite,
he had brought three questions before them upon
which he proposed to take the opinion of the House.
The first of these was to give an important relief to the
mercantile marine, and as that measure was not to
be disposed of in the present session, he should say
nothing against it then.. With regard to the second
question of pilotage, the Right Honourable Gentleman
proposed to bring in a Bill which he is anxious
to pass in the present session of Parliament. It
was merely of a permissive nature, to enable those
parties who had the control of the pilotage to make
certain remissions in regard to taking pilots where it
would be expedient; and, at the first view, it certainly
did appear a reasonable proposal, which he was not
then prepared to obj et to.—(Cries of "Hear, hear.")
At the same time, however, he thought the Right
Hon. Gentleman the Member for Manchester would feel
with him, that it was but reasonable that those parties
whom it would affect should have time to consider its
provisions, and he should, therefore, defer any observa-
tions upon the subject till the second reading, when he
would hare had an opportunity of communicating with
the parties interested in the Bill.—(Hear, hear.) With
regard to the third and by far the most important sub-
ject, the Right Hon. Gentleman bad proposed a course
which must be eminently satisfactory to the House. He
proposed to lay before them in detail a comprehensive
scheme with regard to the mercantile marine,
and having done so he proposed to give the country a
fall opportunity of considering the measure before any
opinion of the House could be asked for. He would,
therefore, be no party to raising any objection to this Bill
at the present moment, nor did he think any of those
obstacles suggested by the Right Hon. Gentleman
would be thrown in his way. Ile promised the Right
Hon. Gentleman to give his most deliberate attention to
the proposition, and in the communication which it would
be his duty to hold with those parties whose interests
are most affected by it, he would endeavour to
arrive at a solution of the question which it
is the Right Honourable Gentleman's desire to attain,
namely, the best means of raising the condition of the
masters, the seamen of the mercantile marine, and of
promoting the social advantage and welfare of that
class of the community. He had before him a statement
of the existing law of the subject, which, did time
permit, he should be glad to detail to the House;
but, at all events, this he must be allowed
to say, that the existing law gave a much larger control
over the sailors of the mercantile marine than would be
supposed by those who has listened to the statement of
the Right lion. Gentleman.—(Hear, hear.)
Mr. LABOUCUERE said, it now being three o'clock
I ho trusted the Committee would at once agree to the
resolution, and postpone its consideration till the
second reading of the Bill. Some doubt had been raised
as to whether the Trinity House bad the power to carry
out the arrangement in reference to the light dues, but
ho had consulted with parties competent to give the best
oninion on the subject, and they entertain not
the least doubt upon the matter—indeed, in
the case of Scotland, some years ago, a remission
was actually made in the same manner that he now pro•
posed, namely, in conjunction Kith the Privy Council.—
(Bear, hear.) He trusted that the Committee would now
agree to the resolution, and he would fix the second
reading for some day next week.
Captain HARRIS gave the Right Hon. Gentleman
great credit for the measure he had brought before the
House, which no doubt had been dictated by a desire to
benefit the mercantile marine ; but there was one
point which be, bad heard with extreme regret, and