The Sun.
London, England, 1836-02-06 00:00:00

alliance with France, other nations might F(4s-te4 ' d
to take umbrage at our expressions, anCiiiisito._ 6 t,
ought to be avoided. At the same tiato '' / - d
to criticise or to quarrel with the terms•nt pi '''
A'
cause he thought it well . that the Mitkis -` ' - '
Vfl
should. know that the continuance ofA4 c
liance with a great and ' powerful neisAb ' Itik., ~
tv s
-
main features of our foreign policy.—;4 -• ;(41'14.- • ' o
separation had of late been made betty '
;tic;
very remarkable, and able, and powerful m hands
her destinies were at present placed. He (Lord F. Egerton)
was not one of those who was disposed to eulogize in them-
selves some of the measures which had been adopted by the
Goyeenment of France ; but he should be as little inclined,
without a full and due referonee to all the circumstances in
which that. Government was placed, to involve its leader in the
strong and, as it appeared to him, somewhat indiscreet cen-
sure which had been laviahed upon him elsewhere—( Hear)._
and by those very persons who, he believed, were the loudest
advocates for the maintenance of the connection which at
present existed between the two countries.--(Hear.) He
knew that Louis Philippe vias,seated on a throne surrounded
by bayonets : he knew that those win; were once first in the
ranks of periodical libellers had condemned the very semblance
of such measures as had been adopted in France ; but he asked
those gentlemen who were so zealous for the .alliance of that
country with England to pause before they paosed an indis-
criminate censure upon those measures, and tio consider for a
moment the circumstances tinder which they had been resorted
to.

He (Lord Francis Egerton) did not Presume to be suffi-
ciently informed with respect t& those circumstances to form
a decided judgment upon them ; but he had seen something
of the main features of the necessity under which they were
Lad recourse to, and at ,least he could draw this moral from
the events that had appeared before him—he could ask gen-
tlemen to 'consider that if such consequences had grown up
from what they would call, and what he did, not mean to dis-
pute, was a necessary and-omore than justifiable revolution in
the affairs of France, what could they expect from a revolu-
tion not justifiable in itself, nor called for by any exigency in
which the country was placed.—( Hear, hear.) It was in t hat
point of view he confessed that the measures he alluded to
presented to him an obstacle in the further cultivation of those

Friendly relations which he thought of such importance to our
political situation on the continent. These were no new doc-
trines of his own—they were the old and acknowledged doc-
trines of that party to which he (Lord F. Egerton) belonged;
and to which, in more fortunate days, the Noble Lord oppo-
site (Lord Palmerston) was himself attached ; they were the
doctrines acted on by Lord Castlereagh in the first Congress
after the war; when England entered into an alliance with
France and Austria, in opposition to Russia and other Powers
of the North. He (Lord F. E.) thought the alliance with
France on of the utmost value. With regard to that passage
Of the Speech which referred to the affairs of Spain, he must say
that were he called upon by any distinct motion to concur in
those peculiar expressions, which were not at the moment be-
fore him, he should feel some difficulty, not in expressing the
hope, but in concurring in the• expectation that the measures
which had been adopted by the Government of this country to
afford assistance to the Government of the Queen of. Spain,
were likely to effect a speedy termination of the sanguinary
contest in that country, which every man who heard him, as
.well as every man in England, must desire to see terminated.
(.1-faar, hear.) It might be, that the Noble Lord (Palmer-
ston) was in possession of information upon the subject, which
was not accessible to ordinary observers—it might be that re-
cent ,';snatches and recent accounts had furnished the Noble
Lord wit;! grounds for hope, which, as at present informed, he
(Lord Francis Egerton) confessed he could not himself en-
tertain. • Bui however that might be, he. (Lord Francis Eger-
ton) should not so far depart from the rules of practice which
he had always .43;,,served in that House, as to put any direct
question to the Noble Lord upon the point, standing as the
Noble Lord did in the peculiarly delicate situation in which
the Minister for Foreiisyn Affairs was always placed.—( Hear.)
He asked for no inforrui;tion, therefore, which the Noble Lord.
did not think proper, ot. his own accord, to lay before the
House ; but there was nothing that he was aware of
fore the country which could jive one reason to suppose that
' the steps which had been taken by the Government with
the view of terminating the war in Spain, had, as yet, suc-
ceeded in producing the slightest diminu.tion of the horrors of
the contest, or affording any reasonable hope that within a
short period the struggle would be terminated.—{ Hear.)
He (Lord Francis Egerton) should be glad to read his re-
cantation, if these views of events should justify him in doing
' so.—(Hear, hear.) He, for one, entertained no wish nor
desire to see a Government re-established in Spain which
should rest upon the violent Catholic party or upon the Inq,ni-
sition. But so rash had been the measures of those oppose d
to that system, and to that policy, that it was impossible.fm:
hilp, to look forward with hope or expectation to the period.
%%hen tranquillity should be restored in a country so dis-
tracted and torn by civil convulsions as,the Peninsula of Spain.
Upon these grounds, because he thought that passage in the
Speech from the Throne insincere and untrue—he did not
mean to use the terms offensively to those who-drew up the
Speech—it would certainly have been out of power,
the matter been brought before him in a separate or mox.e
specific form, to have given his assent to it.—(,Bear.) The
opinions which he had expressed with respect to French
politics might have some shades of difference from the:
opinions of those gentleman who had previously addressed'
the House upon the subject ; they were opinions, however,
which he honestly entertained, and which he had not hesitated

frankly to declare.—( Hear, hear.)
Lord PALMERSTON.—It is notznyintention to trespaas
upon the attention of the-. House for, more..than a very few
minutes ; but in consequence of the turn which the debate has
taken, I am anxious to offer a few words before the Address is
agreed to. I must begin by expressing my sincere regret that.
any Hon. Members should have thought it expedient—should
have thought it consistent with their sense of duty and with
their fcelings—to express the opinions they have done with re-
gard to those Members of the House who have so nobly, as I

contend, volunteered their services in the cause of the Queer'

of Spain.—( Hear, hear.) I regret that any Hon. Members
should have expressed opinions which I am convinced are so
utterly opposite to those of the people of this country—
( Hear)—and which are, in my opinion, founded upon so erro-
neous a view, and so defective a feeling upon the subject to
which they relate.—( Hear, hear.) I think that the Hon.
and Gallant Member for Westminster, who is now serving at
the head of a large body of our countrymen in Spain, deserves
well of his. country for having undertaken the service in which
he is engaged ; and I can assure the Hon. Member for Sand-
wich that the hopes, and feelings, and wishes, and prayers of a
great portion of the people of this country arc embarked in
the success of his cause. The Hon. Member for Sand-
wich, feeling, no doubt, and remembering how difficult it is
for a man to be a propheLin, his own country, and perhaps
diffident of his own powers to make himself an exception to
the rule, has started to-night as a prophet with respect to
foreign affairs.—( Laughter and cheers.) He has given us one
prophecy with regard to Spain, and another with re gad to
France.—( Hear, hear.) With regard to Spain, lie has told us
—and he pledged his sagacity, his knowledge of human na-
tut e, his foresight, and his wisdom—( Laughter and cheets)—
on the accuracy of the prophecy—that the cause of Don Ca..-los
will succeed, and that the 100,000 men who are now in arms,
as he tells us, will speedily replace Don Carlos—not replaeo
him by the by, for he never yet occupied the seat-,but will
speedily place Don Carlos on the throne of Spain.—( A
laugh.) With regard to France, he says--You weak and blind
Ministers of England, indulge not in idle fancies of friendship
cemented between England and France. The friendship
which at present exists, so far from being, as we hope, lasting
and firm, is destined, he tells, from the very nature of
things—from the deep-rooted feeling of animosit;
which
exists between the two countries, speedily to give way to sonic
dark and monstrous intrigue, which he paid me the com-
pliment to suppose I understood, but which, I confess,
understood not at the time lie was speaking, nor have beett
able to comprehend since.—(Laughter and cheers.) With
regard to his opinions on the subject of the French alliance,
I am content to leave them to the rebuke which they have re-
ceived from the admirable speech of the Noble Lord (Lord F.
Egerton) who sits next him—( Hear, hear)—and I must say
it was refreshino•* to me to hear the sentiments which that Noble
Lord expressed, in contrast with those which had fallen front
the Hon. Member for Sandwich.—( Cheers.) And this is
undoubtedly a remarkable circumstance; that amongst the
Hon. Gentlemen who sit on the opposite side off the House,
that although generally united, to oppose the Government, a
great diversity of opinion prevails amongst many of them upon
almost every question of foreign policy.—( Hear, hear.) There
is amongst them on domestic affairs almost every shade of
opinion, from those who profess to be for every description of
reform, to those who say they will make no alteration at all.
There is amongst them, upon foreign affairs, almost every
shade of opinion, from those who, like the Right Hon. Baronet
( Sir R. Peel) last night, and my Noble Friend this evening,
say they wish for an alliance with France—that they think
the alliance between the two nations consistent with the ho-
nour, and advantageous to the interests of
.England, and,
founded upon enlightened principles, likely to perpetuate
the peace of Europe—(hear, hear)—there is amongst them
every gradation of opinion, from those of these enlightened
men, down to those of the Honourable Member for Sandwich
—(laughter)—who seems to look with aversion even at the
slightest contact with our neighbour—who rejoices and de-
lights in our former wars and battles, and who tells us, with
an air of prophetic truth, that there are recollections which
will ever prevent an union between the two countries.—
( Laughter.) Events will prove whether he is right, and whether
we are wrong. But at least we have the satisfaction of thiuk-
ing that in anticipating the growing connection between
the two countries, and feeling a conviction that that connec-
tion is founded upon the best principles of hutean nature, the
c
most enlightened principles of public policy—at 14...a5t we have
the satisfaction of thinking, that in indulging in thatanii
anticipa-
tion, we have enjoyed a pleasure which I amsure it is wipos-
sible for the Hon. Member for Sandwich to feel when he
anticipates the disastrous separation between the two countries,
which is to be the result of the unknown and monstrous in-
trigue which he has so darkly shadowed out.—(Cheers.) Now
a few words with regard to the Spanish prophecy. The Hon.
Member gave us to understand that ho had in his pocket an
accurate return of the strength of Don Carlos's army. It
would of course be idle and ridiculous for me to dispute the
accuracy of that return. My Means of information are not
the same.as those enjoyed by the Hon. Member.—( Laughter. )
Don Carlos may have 100,000 men in arms. The Hou.
Member tells us 'that he has : therefore it is true, no doubt.
It may be true that the great mass of the people of Spain are
in favour of Don Carlos. The Hon. Member tells us that
they are ; therefore they are, no doubt.—( Hear' hear.) All
I can say is, that if the fact be so—if Don Carlos has a
great majority of the people with him, and if he has 100,000
men in arms, it is the strangest thing in the world that ho
should be still shut up in the mountains of Biscay.—( Cheers
and laughter.) How, with the 100,000 men in arms, the
whole population of the country in his favour, and the
. :4,000,000/. of money which we hear has very lately been