The Sun.
London, England, 1836-02-20 00:00:00

HOUSE OF COMMONS, FEBRUARY 19.

The SPEAKER took the Chair at the usual hour, when Mr.
HORSMAN was introduced by the Lord Advocate and Mr.
Stuart. He took the oaths and his seat for Cockermouth.
LONDON AND BRIGHTON RAILWAY.
Captain A ',SAGER presented a petitio'n for leave to bring
in a Bill to form a direct line of Railway from London to
Brighton, according to the plan proposed by Sir John Rennie
—Referred to the Standing Order Committee.
DURHAM HARBOUR BILL.

Sir F. FRENCH moved the second reading of this Bill.
Mr. PEASE stated that he should object to this Bill aho-
gether, as his constituents had informed him it was of no use
whatever.—The Bill was then read a second time. .
LONDON GRAND JUNCTION RAILWAY.
Mr. 0. GORE brought up the Report of the Standing
Order Committee on the petition with reference to this Railway,
and leave was given to bring in the Bill.
,ST. PANCRAS PARISH.
Sir S. WHALLEY brought up the Report of the Commit-
tee upon the St. Pancras Paving Bill, and obtained leave to
bring in a Bill.
BRIGHTON-RAIL-ROAD.

Captain PECHELL presented a petition from acme place
in Sussex, in favour of the Brighten rail-road.
GLASGOW WATERWORKS.

. Mr. OSWALD brought up the Report of the Committee
on this Bill.

DUBLIN AND KILKENNY RAILROAD

Mr RUTHVEN presented a petition from Dublin in fa-
vour of a railroad from Dublin to Kilkenny.
COURT OF REQUESTS.

Mr. HUMS presented a petition from certain inhabitants
of Westminster, praying the House to pass a Bill to amend
the Court of Requests.
Mr. PEASE presented a petition from certain inhabitants
of Durham in favor of the Durham Railway Bill.
Mr. WILKS presented a petition in favor of the Holborn
Improvement Bill.
Mr. CLAY presented a petition respecting Collier Dock.
Several Hon. Members presented petitions respecting rail-
ways, but they were completely inaudible in the gallery.
SHEFFIELD AND BIRMINGHAM RAILWAY.

Sir G. STRICKLAND presented a petition praying for
leave to amend the Sheffield and Birmingham Railway Act.
MR. BUCKINGHAM'S CLAIMS.

Sir JOHN HOBHOUSE presented a petition film the
East India Company, praying to be heard at the bar against
Mr. Buckingham's claims.
Mr. HUME presented a petition from Nottingham in fa-
vour of the Bill for compensating Mr. Buckingham far the losses
he sustained in India by the harsh conduct of the Government.
Also cne to the same effect from Norwich, signed by the
Mayor, many of the Council, &c.
Petitions to the same effect were presented by Col. Thomp-
son, from Portsmouth, by Mr. Parker from Sheffield, signed by
1,300 persons of all politics, and by Mr. D. W. Harvey from
Portsea.
EDINBURGH AND LEITH RAILWAY.
The ATTORNEY-GENERAL presented a petition for
leave to bring in a Bill to make a Railway from Edinburgh to
Leith.

Sir HENRY PARNELL presented a petition for leave to
bring in a Bill to light the town of Dundee with gas.
Petitions were presented by Mr. Barnard, Lord Arthur
Hill, Mr. Lefroy, Sir Wm. Molesworlh, Sir M. W. Ridley,
and some other Hon. Members, but from the noise prevailing in
the body of the House, we were unable to catch their purport.
LIVERPOOL DOCKS.

Lord SANDON presented a petition from Liverpool, pray-
ing
for leave to bring in a Bill relative to the Docks of that
town (as we understood the Noble Lord.)
Mr. EWART made an observation against the principle of
the Bill.
Lord SANDON did not expect that any discussion would
have taken place on the presentation of a petition for a private
Bill, and he believed such a course was almost without prece-
dent. As another opportunity would be afforded for discussion,
he should not follow the example of the Hon. Member opposite.
Sir J. Y. BULLER brought up the Report of the Stand-
ing Orders Committee on the Seaham Harbour Petition.
Leave given to bring in a Bill.
Mr. G. F. YOUNG presented a petition praying for leave
to bring in a Bill for constructing a new market at White-
chapel.
On the motion of Mr. EVIIIIT, the Committee on the Pri-
soners' Counsel Bill were empowered to send for persons, pa-
pers, and records.
NEWSPAPER STAMP DUTY.
Mr. HUME presented a numerously signed petition
from a place in the county of Norfolk, praying for the
total repeal of the Stamp Duty on Newspapers. As
this was the first opportunity he had of alluding to the subject,
he begged leave to say that he trusted Government would feel
themselves enabled to remove the duty entirely. —( Hear.)
One reason for supporting it was this, viz. ; that notwithstand-
ing the increased activity to put down unstamped publications,
their number had annually increased, and also the number of
persons who had been punished for selling them. The result was,
that those who paid the tax were defrauded of half their profits,
and many persons were now conducting papers at a very con-
siderable loss, in consequence of being anxious to act up to
what the law. required, while other publications were pub-
lished unstamped, by which the legal trade was much da-
maged.—( Hear, hear.) Was it not also proved by expe-
rience how hopeless it was to expect anything to be done
by imprisoning those persons? The presses had been seized--
individuals had been imprisoned for six months, and fines of
6001. had been imposed, but all would not put an end to the pub-
lication of unstamped papers; on the contrary, if the Govern-
ment had been obliged to propose the suspension of the collection
of tithes, because they were unpopular, it became them, after
the great proofs they had had of the impossibility of put-
ting down unstamped publications, to propose the total
repeal of those stamps.—( Hear. ) The returns laid on the
table showed that from the 24th of March, 1834, to
the 7th of September, 1835, there had been 218 prosecutions
for selling unstamped newspapers ; and the total number of pro-
secutions since 1831 was 729 ; they had also confined the per-
sons prosecuted for more or less periods from seven days to
*ix months, attended with fines. When he stated that all
they could do was not able to correct this, but on the con-
trary had tended to increase it, it was hardly necesasry to say
that the tax ought to be taken off.—( Cries of " Hear, hear.")
Major BE AUCLERK supported the prayer of the peti-
tion, and expressed a hope that his Majesty's Government
would carry their feelings into execution, and give up this most
shameful tax. There were many Acts which fettered the
press, prevented the circulation of knowledge, and he hoped
to see them all repealed.
The petition was laid on the table.
CLERKS OF ASSIZE.
Mr. HUME moved for a return of the names of all cle; ks
of Assize, the amount of salary they receive, and by whom
they were appointed.

RESIGNATION OF LORD SIDMOUTH'S PENSION.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER moved
for a copy of the Treasurer's minute to carry into effect
the offer of Lord Sidthouth to resign his pension of 3,000/.
He was anxious to take the earliest opportunity of bringing this
subject before the House, and he did so in consequence of a
letter received by the head of the Government from Lord
Sidmouth, in which he begged to resign the pension of 3,0001.
which he received for the duties he had performed as Speaker
of that House. The day before yesterday that Noble Lord
(Melbourne) received the following letter
My Lord—l request the favour of you to lay before Par-
liament the resignation of my pension of 3,000/. a year, granted
to me by his late Majesty, George the Fourth.
" SIDMOUTH."
It was his duty, in making this communication, to say that
Lord Sidmouth had acted in a manner most praiseworthy, and
which entitled him to the best thanks of the House.—( Cheers)
Mr. HUME—This information was most satisfactory.—
(Loud laughter.) He hoped every other individual who re-
ceived pensions that were not required, would do the same.
—( Hear, hear.) He could not let the opportunity pass
without mentioning with high respect the name of the Noble
Lord who first set the example, he meant Lord Camden.—
(Loud cheers.) That was the most disinterested Act that
had taken place since he had been in public life. He be-
lieved the amount thus given up was 250,0001.—(L0ud
cheers.) Notwithstanding this, instead of giving him credit,
observations had been made on his conduct, and his example
called a bad one.—(A laugh.) He (Mr. Hume) considered
it an excellent example ; and, like him, he considered that
the resignation of Lord Sidmouth's pension did that Noble
Lord the greatest credit.—( Cheers. )
Sir E. CODRINGTON said a gentleman named Mars-
den, who was entitled, on his retirement from the office held by
him, to a pension of 1,500/. per annum, had relinquished it
on a principle of conscience, that he should not receive money
when he performed no service in return.
RAILWAYS.
A petition having been presented on the subject of a Rail-
way Bill,
Colonel SIBTHORP said he considered railways a delu-
sion upon the public, and only iplculated to fill the pockets of
attorneys and engineers.—(Laughter.) As he passed into
the House he found the lobbies crowded with persons anxious
to forward such Bills ; and in point of fact they pushed
them in without giving Honourable Members an opportunity
of examining their provisions. He was laid hold of by
the attorneys and engineers of whom he spoke, pressing
him to look at their plans, but he was determined to give them
every opposition in every stage. He could not leave his bed
in the morning without being besieged by such persons—
( A laugh)—but, though he was told the Railways
would benefit his property, he should nevertheless oppose
them, as he had never allowed private interests to stand in the
way of his public duty. He gave notice, therefore, of his in-
tention to move, whenever a Railway Bill came before the
House, that the Company should no be at liberty to sell a single
share until the works would be completed.—( Hear. )
He thought them a dangerous system of gambling, and
he should obstrUct their progress in every possible manner.
PAPER DUTY.
Lord F. EGERTON gave notice that he would, on Fri-
day next, present a petition from certain paper manufacturers,
praying for a reduction of duty on that commodity.
TURNPIKE TRUSTS.
The Hon. F. MAUL E rose to move the second reading of
a Bill for the Consolidation of Turnpike Trusts in England.
The Hon. Member entered into a detailed statement, show-
ing the expense which the present system entailed on the
public. The system was so bad, that if Parliament did not
interfere, it would go on from bad to worse, until at length
public communication would be put an end to altogether.
The chief evil of the present system arose from the irrespon-
sibility of trustees--( Hear, hear, hear)—the want of some
public mode of inspecting the accounts, and the want of
a proper check in the hands of the local authorities,
upon the officers employed in the execution of the powers of
the trust. There was also a system of jobbery carried on to an
extent of which the public was not aware. He would
just mention one in illustration of the system. There
was a certain trust the manner of which he should not
mention (nor was it necessary for his purpose), in which cue
of the trui,tees died insolvent, with a balance of 1,500/. in his
hands. No security had been taken from this trustee, although
the Act oPParliament expressly required it. A return had b.-en
made, signed by the Chairman of the Board of Trustees, and I ow
did the House think this 1,500/. was accounted for? Why the
item was clearly omitted altogether in the statement of the
Board. Several other instances might be adduced to show
the evils of the existing system, and the • object of the
present Bill was to remedy this defect.---( Hear, hear.)
"The course proposed was to establish a Board of Commis-
sioners, to consist of the Home Secretary, the Post-master-
General, the Commissioners of Woods and Forests, and six
other individuals named by the Treasury, in whom
the public have• confidence, and who are acquainted
with the local trusts. It had been asserted that the object of
the present Bill was to increase the patronage of Govern-
ment; but the best answer to this charge was the fact that
a single salary was not to be given under the Bill. The great
object of the Bill was to consolidate particular existing trusts.
The Turnpike Trusts will be managed much better on a large
scale than in their present circumscribed one. He trusted,
therefore, the House would agree to the Bill being read a
second time, and sent to a Committee up stairs—bearing al-
ways in mind the vast advantages it would confer upon the
entire country, and the tendency it had to remove the burdens
under which the agricultural and rural population laboured.
The Bill was then read a second time.
On the motion that it be referred to a Committee up stairs,
Sir JAMES G RAH AM dissented from the proposition of
the Hon. Member with respect to the advantage likely to ac-
crue from the present Bill. Whether consolidation or not was
expedient, depended on the terms of the consolidation.—
The Hon. Member did not approve of central management,
and yet Clauses 17 and 19 of the Bill recognized the principle
of central management. He had all the advantage of the re-
cess, and of his official information to bring forward the mea-
sure which he now admitted to be very defective, and
having obtained far it a second reading, he proposed
that it be sent to a Committee up stairs. He ( Sir James Gra-
ham) thought the measure should have been founded on a re-
port of a select Committee; the inquiry should have preceded the
introduction of the measure. If a full inquiry had been gone
into in all its details, and a recommendation in shape of a se•
ries of resolutions submitted to the House, a Bill might then
have been introduced. If ever there was a principle which should
be enforced by the House, it was that of the enquiry preceding
the introduction of the measure. It would have been much
better if this matter had been submitted to a Committee of the
whole House. He suggested to the Hon, Member to with-
draw his Bill, and move for a Committee of Inquiry.
11r. HUME did not see anything contradictory to the prin-
ciple that had been stated to the House, that a general
controul over the roads would be beneficial to the
country.--( Hear, hear.) The Bill had been referred
to a Committee up stairs merely to save the time of the
House, and any Honourable Members taking an interest
in the measure, could make any suggestion they thought
proper. No man could doubt that a large portion of the pub-
lic money was lost. But a few years ago they had no con-
troul whatever, and it was asserted they had no right to call
for the production of accounts.—( Hear, hear, hear.) When
he (Mr. Hume) had called for a return, it had led to great
alarm, and very curious disclosures. The Kensington trust
had a debt of 5,0001., and their income was 14,000/. per an-
num, and a balance f 6,000/. remained for five or six years in
the hands of the Treasurer. When the Chairman was exa-
mined, it turned out that there were no accounts at all ;
that he was the cashier, and held this large sum in his hands,
paying five per cent. interest for the debt. There were
many other instances of the same sort.—( Hear, hear.)
Reform was just as necessary in the country as in
the metropolis, for he supposed they were just as honest in
the country as in London. The Turnpike Trusts were a great
nuisance to the country.—(Laughter.) He was the advocate
of good roads, but bad ones were a waste of the public money.
He did hope there would be no objection to this Bill going
into Committee.
Lord G. SOMERSET begged the House not to take the
character of all country trusts from the description given by
the Hon. Member of the metropolitan ones.—(Hear,
hear.) He Would suggest that the Bill be sent to a
Committee up stairs, where the clauses acknowledged to
be bad might lie struck out: the Bill would then be printed,
and would come before the House in a better shape from its
consideration. He had no objection to the union of trusts ;
but he had a great objection to the manner in which
it was proposed to do so.
Mr. GUEST was perfectly sure that there were many
trusts in the country where jobbing was carried on as well as
in London. A measure on the subject was absolutely neces-
sary.—( Hear. )
Sir M. W. RIDLEY agreed with the Hon. Gentleman
opposite—there were many trusts in the country which were
much abused. The clause for the consolidation of the
funds of the Trusts was most obnoxious, and he trusted
it would be struck out.—( Hear, hear.) By it the burden
of the debt of one trust would be thrown upon another. The
poor trusts would be supported by the richer ones.
After a few words from Mr. ntexismost and Mr. HAWES,
Mr. F. MAULE said that he moved the second reading of
bill merely with a view of going into a Committee pro forma.
He would adjourn all further proceedings in the matter till
after Easter.
Lord G. SOMERSET said that if it were understood that
they were going into Committee pro forma, be it so; he had
no objection to that course.
The bill was then read a second time.
NEW HOUSE OF COMMONS.
Mr. HALL wished to know, previous to his making the
motion of which he had given notice, whether it was the inten-
tion of his Majesty's Government to permit the unsuccessful
plans to be exhibited with the successful ones,
Mr. S. RICE could not give any answer to the Hon.
Member's inquiry. He hoped the Committee would be able
to meet next week.
Mr. HALL said he would be obliged to persevere in his
motion.
Mr. HAWES seconded the motion. He felt most grateful
for the promise given by the Chancellor of the Exchequer
that night, and under all the circumstances he would givo his
cordial support to the motion.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER made a
few observations, after which the motion was withdrawn.
RUSSIA.
Lord D. STUART rose pursuant to the notice he had
difficulties,a In
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given to call the attention of the House to the policy pursued
pbyecßuluiasrsi
which prevailed of the interest, not to say the enthusiasm, with
which he viewed all subjects connected with the subjugation of
Poland. He begged therefore to state at the outset that he
viewed this question not merely as connected with that unfor