The Sun.
London, England, 1822-02-02 00:00:00

•
let any man count the number of agricultural la
bourers, and multiply that number by the calcp-
• •
lated sum which he had mentioned, and he would
find that :t. would amount to an immense-sum.--
The Noble Lord proceeded to deprecate the idea
so often broached, that the funded Was opposed
to the landed proprietor ; it was nonsense' to
Suppose it ; their interests were united they
were bound up together, and they.must stand or
fall together. After some further observations,
he observed, that he should now propose to them
a Petition, to be presented to Parliament. In
this Petition he did not point out the reduction
of any particular tax ; •let the responsibility of
doing that rest where It should do, with the Go-
-
verument ; the prayer of the Petition was simply
a .mitigation of taxation.,--(Hear, hear 1)--Ills
Lordship concluded by expressing a hope, that
every Gentleman in the country would unite
upon this occasion, for he did not hesitate to de;
Clare, that without their united exertions, the
country must he ruined.—(Cheers.) .
-The following Petition was then read
" The Humble Petition of the undersigned Owners and Occu-
piers of Land in the-County of Bells,
" STlEwETar—That• your Petitioners are suffering Under the
most intense and unparalleled -distress. Your Petitioners ab-;
stain from an enumeration of the several causes which have, as
they conceive, brought them to their present condition ; but they
cannot but remind your Honourable House, that after the va-
rious fluctuations of prices which they have experienced, the
circulating medium has been..fioally settled upon: a system
which bears severely against the Agricultural interests of the
country. ,
" Your Petitioners submit to your Honourable House, that
the direct effect of the system thus adopted has been the virtual
increase of that taxation under which•they have long and pi-
tienty laboured ; araconvinced, as they are, that a general re-
duction of the.prices of all articles used and consumed by la-
bourers in Agriculture, in some degree corresponding to the re-
duced prices of the products of the soil, would contribute' to
their relief, they cannot but entertain a confident expectation
that your Honourable House will take into its immediate con-
sideration the expediency of adopting some plan of reduced
taxation, which shallrelieve the population of the country from
those taxes which more immediately affect the price•of labour,
arid which, consequently, raise to an oppressiVe degree the costs
of cultivation. . • •
" Your Petitioners beg te assure your Honourable House,
that, unless adequate and immediate relief be afforded to the
Owners and Occupiers of Land, they cannot but contemplate
the total destruction of their property, being convinced that
the rights by which they hold this property, are as just, as sa-
cred, as any that can be given by statutory pledges to other inte-
rests in the State, your Petitioners'confide in the justice and
equity of your Honourable House;toaffOrd them equal securrtY
and protection. Your Petitioners therefore pray that the press
sure of their taxation may be mitigated, and that they may re.
ceive that relief to which they cohtider• themselvei so justly
entitled.
" 'And your Petitioners, &c.",
. Mr. KIMPTON seconded the Petition. •
Mr. FORDHAM said, the cause of the distresses under which
they laboured was easily discernible. Government, while they
lowered the price of corn, still kept taking the same stun of
money from their pockets. He had in his possession dime:
assents to prove that this was the case. He intended to con-
clude by moving a Resolution expressive of their distress' and
. calling for a repeal of the duties on malte salt, beer,- leather,
'soap and candles. This would afford relief to the lan'dholder,
and was at the same time the best means of restraining the,
lavish, profligate, and unnecessary expenditure of the country—.
(Cheers.)—He had in his possession an account of the poor's
rates and other taxes levied upon several parishes in the three
adjoining counties. In one parish the poor's rates was in 1792,
3741., last year it was 17861., and this year it was likely to be
greater still. If they looked to the poor's rates they wouldfind
them increase in proportion to other taxes. In several parishes
the poor'S rate had increased fourfold, and the other taxes in the
same proportion. In the parish of Asnwell the poor's-rates
were less, and the lands better managed than in many others.
In 1792, the poor's mte in that parish was 391. Bs. 10d. ; in,
1821 it was 691. Us. 4d. Let them look to the increase of the
Malt Tax. In 1792 it was 66,4001. ;in 1821 it was four rnil2
home In 1792 the parish of Ashwell paid 1101. 7s. for malt e
this was the value of 132 quarters of barley ; they now paid
'6371. for malt, which. was the price of 764 quarters of barley.
Here was a differente if, the quantity to be received to pay for
the necessary quantity of malt. He would neat allude to the
Salt Tax ; there were 900 persons in the parish of Ashwell ;
they paid for salt last year 1291. (all sold in sixpence worths).
Was not this enough to rouse any set of men—(Hear, hear,
hear !) ?--They paid for soap 361. ; for candles 241. ; in all
the articles together the parish of Ashwell, alone paid eight
hundred and twenty-six pounds ; to pay which 991 quarters of
barley must be raised by the farmer, without including, one •
shilling of rent, one shilling of labour, or of the incidental ex-
pences of the farmer. In fact, the farmer was obliged at pre-
sent to sell four or five quarters of barley to obtain one quarter
of malt. But let them look at the price of the article when
brewed—a farmer must sell ten or eleven quarters of barley
to purchase the produce of one quarter in porter. Was it
to be wondered at after this that the money went so quickly out
of their pockets? The poors' rates also bore almost exclu-
sively upon land. The farmer paid five millions a year,. while
all the other bodies paid only two millions between them.—
(Hear, hear, hear !) —But why talk of reductions ?—when they
last year asked for a reduction of Bs.• per quarter, in the Malt
duty, ,they were tauntingly, told that it would not exceed a
penny in a pot of porter, and therefore that it could be of no use.
What wonder'svas it that they were ruined, when they found
that wheat was lower now than itavaa in 1792 (it was then 50s.
it was now 43.5.) while our taxes
,had inereasediour-fold since
that period ? Let them look for a moment to the meaner in which
the money was spent. In 1792 our armyeamottnted to 86,000
men, and were supported at an expence of 2,300,0001. In 1821
the numbers were 240,000, and the expellee was 8,900,0001.—
(Hear !)—Here they had three times the number •of men, and
four times the expence. In 1792. the whole staff of the army
cost 22,0001. In 1821 the expellees of the Commander in Chief
alone amounted to 15,0001. ; this was for one single individual,
who had a salary of 16 guineas a. day, which office was before
discharged for 9 guineas a day. He should like to see the Duke
of York supported like a Prince, but surely that could be done
at a less exptmite than 50,0001. or 60,0001. a year. Why, the
parish of Ashwell, consisting of farmers and labourers, went
on for a year to get a living, daring which time; the Chancd-
lor of the Exchequer employed every device in his power to
squeeze 10001. a year out of them ; and the sum did not last the.
Duke of York more than five days.—(Cheers.)—slle would ask'
if this was a proper state of things?—(No, no !)—ln fact, there
were fifty parishes like Ashwell, all toiling night and day to
pay their one thousand pounds a year each, and the Duke of
York swallowed it all.—(Loud laughing.)—Hs would ask
whether a portion of this expense might not be saved ?—He
found also that they had no less than 10,040 Half-pay Officers.
--These consisted of men who had fought the battles of their
country, and had earned a portion of those honours corifele-
red on the Duke of Wellington. Of these man only 303 had
been taken into active service during the last six years, while,
during that period, 2,553 young sons. of• Gentlemen had•been „
put over the heads of those brave veterans, and this at an ex- I V NT should
be cut for dryin
g,jest when it is
1 I pence of 4,0901. a week for the last fouryears—(Shame,ssame.) in flower, and on a fine day ; for, if cut in damp
—Was this not a proof of lavish and profligate 'expenditure—
(Applause)? --The next item he could not explain, though p weather, the. leaves will turn black. It should
haps some other Gentleman. might;—he found that the yeo- be tied in small bunches, and dried in a•shady
Imanry cavalry of the county (among' whoin he had many fnends) place out of the wind ; but to retain its natural vir-
cost the country no less than 5001. a day---(llear, hear !)—he
should like to know what the officers received ; he never could. tue more effectually, it has been found better to
find that the privateS received a single farthing —(Loud laugh- place the mint in a' screen and to dry it. quickly
marry of that county—to who was an annual char
did ge
.it gof
—F or his 170:0001his partite d. for the yens
i before a fire, so that it may be powdered 'and. irn-
m ?d
not know that the privates were the only volunteers in the corps flied iately put into glass bottles, and kept well
—(Laughing.)—He next came to the places and pensions of stopped. Parsley, thyme, sage, and other herbs,
Sir T. I,laitland, brother to Lord 'Lauderdale ; he had 10001. a
year since 1812, for services rendered in Ceylon; he had 50001. retain their full fragrance when thus prepared
a year as Governor of Malta, to- which place. he only went and are by this mode secured from dust,
,and
once in two years ; he had 10001. 'as Lord High Commissioner always ready to the hand of the cook.
of the lonian Islands, and 40001. for staff expellees; Here
one man had 15,0001. a year, the produce of fifteen industrious
parishes, Such as Ashwell, and he spent it all abroad-7(Heer, The funeral of th elate Duchess of Si'. ALBAN'S
ear, hear !)—Who' could for a moment believe that 24900 reached Lincoln. on Tuesday forenoon
from Lon-
soldiers were necessary to keep down the patient, suffering peo-
ple of this country? but it was said tisat they were troublesome, don. The hearse was hung round with escutch-,
that they wanted to reduce the expenditure of the country-- eons, and attended by mourning coaches, in one of
It was true, they did; aed perhaps for doing so they might
which fwas the usual 'solemn emblem of deceased
be taunted as they were before by. Sir Isaac 'Coffin, who
told them they had better go home and fill their dung carts; this quality, the.coroiret of her Grace, borne on a velvet
'was an observation which that Gentleman; who had received cushion : plumes and other sable honours closed
so much of the
in
public money, dared not to have Made any melancholy'
procession. The body lay in state
where else but l'arliament—(Hear, hear, heal. !)--With re-
the
spent to the Army, Lord Grenville. said, in 1815,. that any all. Tuesday at the White Hart Inn above-hill,
aclvoeete the support of such a Military
, and proceeded thence for Redbourn:on Wednes—•
..eaurn the Constitution :th s• ,
Establishment must intend to
was said by a man who Nee not a :',7lical—(A laugh).— • ea) ~ bleat Tom sent out his doleful sound in
-Let them now look to the navy. In 1792, the ie.
st the the forenoon half-minutely, and the hells of the
r;o
are,
country 2,000,0001. in 1821 it cost the country 6,500,0b01. , oilier cLurches in LincOln knolled as the proc6.
had:how a number of ships greater then the-whole world could easioed.
bring against us, and yet we went an buildins. What would
.I slon .

. .
that meeting think of a man who set about getting cars, wag.
1 Bons, and Plotigha made this year, because it was possible that
he. mighthave a farm in 7 or 19 years time ?---(baughaug.)--,
Such was the case with our Ministers' at present, - they built
ships now because it was not impossible that they might be
• Volved'in a war at some future period.-(Laughing.)—When
. during the War we had 120,000 seamen, we had seven Lords
of the Admiralty, and perhaps it was proper that we should
have that number; -but at present, that we had only' 19,000
seamen, how many Lords of tne Admiralty had we ? Oh, seveu
still. There was a First Lord of the Admiralty at -5,0001 a
year, and six others at 1,0001. a year; there,was a Secretary to
the Admiralty at 3,0001. a year, and a second Secretary at 1,500
a-yaar ; there was a Clerk at 1,1001. a year, and in addition to
this they had all houses to live in and other perquisites. What
were all these men wanted for? They were:not Wanted for the
Navy—they e'ere not wanted for the Admiralty-;•but they were
wanted in the Houie of Coinmons•—(Cheers).—They were
wanted to vote for any tax, however oppressive, for- any
Gaggibg Bill, however infamous—(Cheers.)--.-lii fact, half the
public money was spent in upholding. offices which gave Mini-
sters pbwer and patronage. Ile next adverted to the Colonies,
the farms which we held off and seldom visited.. • The Cape of
Good Hope, which, under the Government of the Dutch, sup-
ported itself, cost this country, in. 1821, for the Governor of
that Colony 10,0001. a year, with a Colonial Secretary 3,5001.,
au Assistant Secretary 1,5001.; and a Private Secretary at 5001. 4
there were alsia thirteen constables at XOOl. and, he found-that
they also had a Chancellor the ExcheqUer there (laughter),
and he had alsohia snug 2,0001. a year and upwards. In addition
to all this, he found that the infamous spy, Oliver, who had de-.
ludedandgoaded the people into, partial rebellion--that even .
that wretch was provided, at the Cape of Good Hope, with a sa-
lary of 3901. a year -4Shame, shame !—The Worthy,Gentleman
next adverted to India, and observed, that lie found the,persens
connected•with.that country were usually found in the ranks
of Ministers. The Honourable Gentleman next commented
upon • a Still remaining Army—an Army in 'the' 'HOLM. of
Commons. He found that there were there fifty-taro • Mem-
bers, who received 162,0001. a year —(a person in the crowd
oc for doing what ?")—I answer. for voting thick and thin with
Ministers. He appealed to those Members around him, whether
it was not a fact, that these ministerial hocks were obliged to
attend nightly in their places, and whether, if they went out to
dinner, a runper -was not kept in readiness to call 'them back in
the event of an expected division of the House--(laughing) ?
and yet this was the system they were not to touch ! If any at-
tempt was made to point out such grievances the ceywasaa" yoti
Mean to 'overturn the Constitution ;" and thii was said by a
set of men who had been - using their best endeavours to over-
turn it for the last thirty -years. The Honourable Gentleman, •
alluding to the praiseworthy exertions of Mr.-Hume, observed,
that that Gentleman divided. the .Housi 72 times'last yea: on
motions for retrenchment (he was sorry he did not see the named
of their County Menibers oftener in the divisions) I After a few
other observations' he concluded by moving a Resolutionapray-
ing a repeal of the duties on Malts leather, salt, beer, soap, and
candles.
Mr. ALSTON supported the Resolution.
Lord. DACRE. asked; if the Resolution was meant as an
amendment to his petition.?
Mr. FoRDHA:te replied in the affirmative. •
Mr. W. LAMB, M.P. for the County, in allusion to what
had been said with respect to the -County Members, Observed,
that he never did, nor ever would, act contrary to his judg-
ment, whatever might be the wishes and feelings of his constitu-
ents. He accounted'for his absence from Parliament by stating,
that he had been ill in the country for a considerable time last
year. He declared himself an advocate for economy and re;
trenchment, though he .On, several occasions disapproved of Mr.
flume's motions, because, however industrious, laborious, and
persevering, he thought that Gentleman, he could not help oh
--
serving that there.was much in the tone, spirit, and temper of
his opposition, of which he (Nlr. Lamb) disapproved.--ASoma-,
disappaobation; Mixed with applause.)—Soine obseriationa had
been made respecting the yeomanry. He had been a 'Captain
of yeomanry for sonic time, and though he had new reaignecl,
he had no 'objection to give any Gentleman who. called upon
him a full account of the whole of the expences of his trocna
'from the period of his joining to his quitting
,it. • -He should
always study the interests of his constituents; - but if in 'duty to
himself he felt it necessary 'to vote against them, he hoped,
they would do him the justice to believe, that he acted from a,
conscientious feeling that he was doing his dutYlo-the country.'
—(Applause)—He declared himself an advocate for economy;
and retrenchment, as far as either was praCticable, and he.
thought" that the best way of 'obtaining it was by -a temperate,
but firm application to Parliament. He had heard much about
the national debt ; he hoped that there was not in that county a
. man who Would break faith with 'the public creditor. He had
been no advocate of' the-war, but whatever his opinions were,
he knew that it was a severe struggle for those engaged in it,
as well as for the country. But whatever he might have
thought, he felt himself bound to bear his proportion of the bur-
dens which it imposed on the country, no matter to what situa-
tion in sociefy Suctiburdens might reduce hini.—(Cheera.)
Viscount URAWBOURNE said he did not wish now to enter
into the constitution of the House of Commons, as it waatotally,
unconnected with the subject, but he would ask, whether, if all
the present Members were turned out, and a new sit elected
upon an amended principle, corn would rise one shilling in
' price.? —(A: paraon in the crowd—" Perhaps not immediately,
but it is likely that taxes would be reduced.")—le would be a
difficult thing to reddee Our establishnients ; and even if
a few thousands were taken down bete and there they would
foiind toe trifling to 'afford relief—(Hisses.)—They .would
not, he was sure, make in the aggregate 500;01.301. The Noble
Lord made some further observations, but the noise in the Hall
prevented' his being heard.
.51r..FonDitan (brother to the gentleman of thatharne whq
moved the Resolution) condemned•theeenduct othlr. Lamb in
refusing to goes far as Mr. Hume in favour .of.retrenchinint. •
Mr. LAMB begged 'the gentleman's pardon. He said he.
could not'aiways support :Mr, Hume's motions, but' it did not •
follow that lie might not go further than that gentleman in
• - •
some instances.. •

Mr. Fonntran proceeded to point -out, at considerable
length, the necessity -of redUction. Ministers, public officers
of all descriptions, ought to have their salaries, reduced one-halt;
He would reduce rents, tithes, taxes, nay even the interest of
the debt, one half, and for this simple reason, that the produce
of the land had been reduced one-half. He concluded lay pro-
posing a Resolution in faVotir of Parliamentary Reform.
Sir Joux SEBILIGIIT defended his conduct in Parliament,
and declared, that however'hikbly he respected his constituents?
;me would never consent to-go to Parliament fettered in his opi-
nions. He was proud to be their Representative, but he would
never be their Delegate.—(Cheers, and sonie'disapprobation.)
Mr. Po explained.
Lord DAcnE, in speaking upon the AmeriAnient, observed,
that he had abstained from Parliamentary Reform upOn
-occasion, because he was anxious to preserve the. unanimity, if,
possible. His opinions upon-Reform had not changed. When.
!the proper opportunity offered, he should be found ready to give
is sound constitutional Reform his zealous, support.-(Cheers.)

. -
Mr. E. KINCi FORDIJAM (not either of the Gentlemen al-
ready mentioned) recommended the witlidrawino of4he
'don, unless the Meeting were likely to be unanimous upon it.
The Resolution, 'specifying: the Taxes to he'Re-pealed, and
that for Reform, were then withdrawn. • .
The Marquess of SALisnußi• expressed his belief that the
proposed Petition would. be of no avail ; be. should not, how,
ever; oppose it, as it held outhope of relief to the Gentlemen
aronnd,him. - • ,

Lord Dacre's Petition was then put, and earned unanimously.
The Rev. Mr. NEW COMB!!! niade a fe"W'obseriratiOns... After
which the meeting was dissolved at Four o'Clock.