The Sun.
London, England, 1849-05-22 00:00:00

eend uPwards. But there was a surplus of 1.711,909/.
44et them mark that! In 1843 the public expend_wre
amounted to 58,000,00:1—(Shame, shette)—end the
.excess of expenditure over revenue—spending more
:uan they got—vias 3,ooo,oool.—(Shame.) Yet the
th_terest of the debt had been reduced the mean time.
What else had they got ? Au iecume-tax of 550,000,000.
Which had been laid on on false pretences—(Laughter and
blear, _ ear, hear")—tor they were told at S: et that it would
only be put on fur three years.—(Hear, bear.) He re-
peated that the tax had been laid on on false pretences,
is the time of peace. But the tax was opposed by the
present Government—(Hear)—and when they came into
office the y turned round and coolly prepared t t increase
e tax to 51. per cent. last year—(Laughter)---and if
they had not put their hands into their pockets, and
finding.,_ a deficit, instructed their Members to speak out,
In would have had an increase of the ieceme-tax.
-La 1830 the estimate for the army and navy, ordnance,
and miscellaneous, which nobody could explain, anti
p_obody get at—(Laughter)—was 17,500,00e1.—(Hear.)
But what did miscellaneous estimates conaist of ? Such
things as a gate to Buckingham Palace. 60,000/.—(Cries
ofe "Shame ") and 6001. for taking a Bishop to
Jamaica.—(Great laughter.) He assured them, that
though he and others sat as the comptrollers of the
public purse, it would be the greatest absurdity to tell
t°ent that though they represented public opinion, that
they did controul that expenditure.—(Laughter.) Hew-
ever, when the new Whig Government came in they
felt that they must reduce the expenditure,
And it was reduced to 14,000 000/. But what
did it rise to in 1848 ? Why, they could
scarcely believe that it had increased 9,000,0001.
(Shamo, shame)—and the present estimate was
231315,8521.—(Shame.) Compare that with the expen-
diture of 1830.—(Horrible.) But the truth was
blame,—(Hear, hear.) They got frightened at the
state of the Continent, and kept up large war establish
nients. But the Government said "We are retrenching,
flaw," and they began by reducing the number
of poor clerks, who had, perhaps, wives and families
-they caught the small flies and allowed the
Leviathans to break through. They had saved a few
thousands by reducing the number of clerks; but if they
Were sincere in what they did they must begin at the
heads of the departments. Then, with respect to their
diplomatic expenses, it was enormous, but no one bad a
Chance of being employed in the service unless he were
connected with the Lord Tom Noddy family—(Laugh-
ter)—no man whose name was either Smith,
Jenkins, or who possessed the patronymic of
liuggins,—(Laughter.) It would be next to im-
possible to send a man with such a name to
foreign Court. The diplomatic establishment costs
180,000/e • and what did they get ? The work
could be done for much less.—(Hear.) For upwards of
D year they had had no ambassadar at Madrid, who had
received 6,5004 a year. He was a very amiable man,
but he was withdrawn ; and it was notorious that
their affairs were going on there much better because
they had no diplomatic interference, and saved at the
same time 6,soo2—(Cheers)—but it they must have
ambassadors let the Smiths, the Jetikinses, and the Bugs -
Rinses have a chance now—they, he thought, would
be satisfied to do the work for 1,000/. a year.—(Herr )
The Prime Minister might come down to the House
and say he had reduced the number of the Horse
Guards, saying, " See what I have dune I
have taken off some of the dead weights."
Why, the Horse Guards cost 190,0001. Why,
the present Commander in-Chief received $,7001.
a year, aith perquisites, whilst Lurd Amersham, when
Command er-in-Chiet; received only 1.000/.—(llear,
hear.) And with respect to the perquisites, they were
as much looked after as a cook looked after the
Perquisites she possessed in the suet —(Laughter.)
To keep up all these taxations great appeals had been
made to the warlike propensities of this country.—
(Hear, hear.) A clever writer had said, in reviewing
the history of the British Constitution, that it had
occurred to him that if taxes were raised for this purpose
it Would appear that war was made to raise taxes, and
But
taxes levied to carry on war.—(Hear, hear.)
sout then they were told they had got an empire (and he
could not but laugh at the' assertion) on which the sun
never set.—e,Hear, beer.) He had olten puzzled himself'
to know what was that to working men.—(Cheers and
laughter.) ,What was the remedy? To him it was clear.
They might go on bothering about financial reform
and all that, but it would be no use, they must reform the
House of Commons.—(Cheers.) He was astonished
that the 40s. franchise had not been made use of by the
people.—(Cheers,) He was astonished that it had not
been taken out of the dust in which it had been lying for
centuries. Wby, he would ask, did not the 40s. freeholders
register for counties?—(Hear, hear.) He trusted, it they
did, they would give him the benefit of their votes. He
trusted that he had given them a useful hint.—(Cheers.)
Its was sorry to say he could not remain long with them
that day, because he was going to give an earnest
of his feeling in voting for the repeal
of the sept-enial Act, that was going to
be brought forward that evening in the douse of Com-
mons by Mr. C. T. D'Eyncourt.—(Hear, hear.) He
trusted that this would have the effect of setting him
right with many of his constituents.—(Hear, hear.)
With respect to this subject many might
say that they were good reformers, but this was
not the proper time to bting such suhjects
forward. He could not conceive a time more suitable
than the present for making further advances.—(Hear,
hear.) The people of this country had shown they
were attached to the institutions under which they
lived—they had been peaceful in times far from
prosperous.—(Cheers.) He thought it was evident
to all that the time for advancing was when the waters
were not out.—(Cheers.) He felt no doubt if they per-
severed that justice and reason, on which their cause
Was based, would ensure their success.—(Loud cheers.)
Mr. CLARKE, a Chartist, was ready and willing to co-
operate with this association; but he could not avoid
expressing his regret that many of the Liberal Mem-
bers had not stn.-ported the mi thin of Mr.
Drummond, for a Committee of inquiry into the
taxation of the country, though they might have differed
With that Hon. Gentleman's speech. The Chartists
hitherto had been in antagonism with the middle
classes, but in this instance he could promise thew
no such hostility would be met with. T. o
long bad the working classes been neglected, and he
was afraid they were still doomed to disappointment.
since this association did not propose to abolleh property
qualification. If Buggies was fit ti go to France as an
ambassador, why surely be was qualified to represent
them in Parliament. In Scotland there was no pr. pity
qualifieati. n re quirt d, and as Scotland was as respect-
ably and well repres' nted as was England, he could
not see why the same principle should not be adopted
13 ,3' this association. He would advise those two Me m•
hers who had spoken, if they wished to show their sin-
cerity, to take good care to place themselves in oppceit ion
to the Ministers on all occcasiens. Out of doors they
, jr,eenguised no distinction between Whigs and Teries—
: them they were all alike—part and parcel ce one
bfkreat taxing machine, who were in the habit of putting
I,""eir hands into other people's pockets.—(Haar,
-ear.) With union among themselves they
might, as had been said by Mr. Osborne, ensure the en-
tire success of their cause.—(liear, hear.)
Mr. JOSEPH STURGE said he was an old
reformer, who had arrived at the time
of life when he thought he might re
tire.—(Hear, bear.) But alth, ugh he had not been
in public life lately, he could not refuse the request of
the Chairman to attend the meeting, and to speak a
word on behalf of his working friends, and to give
teem a word of advice. About ten years ago
y would recollect that a great populer m vement for
reform was branded by every odium—that physical force
Principles were associated with the name of Charti-t. Now
as a member of the Peace Society, he would sae that
one of the objects which he had in advocating the prin-
ciple of the Charter was to show that they ,rid
not in any way connect themselves with the
physical force advocates. They might as well condemn
Christianity for the evils of the Church Establishment,
and for the horrors of the Inquisition, as condemn
those great principles which ought to be
the right of every man, because some
were mad enough to resort to physical hem ;
for he thought that the right of every man to choose
those who were to make laws which he was bound to
obey was founded on great Christian principles.
(Cries of " Hear, hear.") It was often said that they
should have measures and not men, and he would now
say that they ought to have honest and good men to
carry out their great cause, for the people had
often been deceived and deserted by their leaders
in times of extraordinary difficulty.—(Hear, hear.)
He had known the Chairman for some years, and he
could assure the meeting that he would not deceive
them.—(Cheers.) The Hon. Gentleman concluded by
expressing his opinion that until. they ootained universalsuffrage they would not be able to attain the objects
Which they had in view.—(Cheers.)
Mr. Puthumone next addressed the meeting. He com-
plimented Mr. Clarke upon the sensible and excellent
mariner in which he had spoken. Those who spoke 11c.
he did could not fail to command the attention of all
People of sense and patriotism; but whilst he agreed
with
him in much be had said, he could not fbrbear mentu
s-
ing that whilst he had complimented Mr. Osborne upon
the tenor of his speech, he had not himself spokenH
in
that
„ apirit.—(Cries of "No, no," and cheers.) ow-
iy;ers all he wished was that each man might have e
°PPortunity of stating. his views, however oppo.sed
er'Y tnight be to that of others.—(Cheers) The object
iclathe association was to obtain the suffrage for no less
whin )712,676 of the pet ple, to give the people that
numbehr
they did not at present possess•, but es that
er Was drawn from the census of 1841, that
numbersu was no doubt much below the mark.—(Hear.)
andre4Y, such a boon as this was worth struggling toe;
tituY ought, therefore, to combine together. iii order
remove the galling burdens which pressed so
morese must
than the lovers of order to do se.
suffrage
remark that those who were not ter universal
_unrage did not question the right of ovary inoivieuel
in free country, it it was for their advantage and they
ca Were not sullied by any crime, to give their votes. The
se did not turn upon a question of right, but a ques-
tion of expediency.—(Hear.) It was from the se who did
not know their rights, or how to use them, that the op-
pressors of the community had obtained their power.—
(Cheers.) Let them look around and see the re-
volutions that were taking place in Europe. What
Were these revolutions ? They were, he believed.
the throes of humanity and reasen.—(('berrs.) ifs
did not share in the opinion that bad been ex} re aced in
certain asse mblit s.— (Cheers.) '1 here was a wish to
Put down attempts at dimming nationality; Let
them look to Hungary and Fitly es a !root of
that, and then turn to France, who, to her dis-
grace, had refused to return to the Mali eel
Assembly her truly patriotic sin. (Chters,
and cries of " Shame' )—a man w hie only is PiNene wee
since, had the whole nation at% 13;5 Jet t—(Cheers)—aed
who
did not hesitate to place his life in jeopardy to secure
the liberties of France.—(Cheers.)

The CHAIRI:AN then put the first resolu. ion, ombody-
ing rdso tnt,z.tmeodulent.

The rcio'..ition, sirnP.nded prcp9sed, was then put
from ti-,e chair. and carried unluiraously.

Ar.r.Vt.ILLIASIS moved the second resoluiion, as follows__
" That, in the opinion of thia meeting, the enpendi-
tore of the state is characterised by an extravagance
the most reprehensible ; that to sustain this reeklesas
waste an enormous amount of taxation is required,
which, as now levied, presses most unequally upon
the different sections of the commonity; tnat so large
a proportion of the taxes is imposed upon the neces-
saries of life, that no economy nor self denial on
the part of the poor man can enable him to escape
from those burthena ; that the effects of such a
system are not only cruel, arbitrary, and pernicious
towards the industrious classes, but aro calculated
to produce that wide-spread demoralization and those
flagrant crimes which are the offspring of poverty and
dis:regs; and that, therefore, the whole framework of
taxation should be so altered as to adjust its burt hens to
the respective means of those who are to bear
them. The Honourable Gentleman went into some statis-
tics to illustrate the present onjiel system of taxation.
the taxation of last year was 57,000,000 L, to which were
to be added 23,000,0001. for local rates, making together
80.000,000/. smiling taken from the pockets of the indus-
trious classes. They we re told that the Reform Bi.l would
lessen taxation, but instead of its doing so theburcie ns had
increas. d by 4.000,000/., while the national debt had
been augmented by 40,000,0001., of which 11,000,000/.
had been added since Lard John Russell had come
into office. So much, then, for this taxation, v. hich
was levied upon the people to pay pensions which
slice the Reform Bill had increased from 4,100,000/. to
7,100,000/. Now let him tell them how these texas were
raised; on articles of consumption, such as tea, soap,
coffee; on tea worth Bd. a pound the same tax was im-
posed as on tea worth ss. a pound, and such was the
case in reference to other articles of consumption.
Then the tax upon beer was just double its coat, or 100
per cent.—(Hear, hear.) What was the tax upon cham-
pagne and claret? 15 per cent. against the 100 per cent.
ea. beer. Therefore, again the poor man paid seven
times more on the average than the rich man. Take,
again, the case of tobacco, a hich was esteemed by so many
working man as a luxury. The tobacco consumed by
the poor man was a orth about 3d per lb., but the duty
was 3s. 2d. per lb., or 1,200 per cent., in the shape of duty.
Now, whet did they think was the duty on the fine
cigars consumed by gentlemen—only seventy-five per
cent—(llear, hear)—so ithat the duty on the poor mat's
tobacco aas fifteen times as much as the duty upon the
gentlem-n's chars.—(Laughter.) Such was a specimen
of the system of the taxation of the people. Then,
again, the stamp duties paid by the pour was un-
fortunately greater in proportion than those paid
by the rich.—(Hear, hear) Notwithstanding the
pressure of taxation upon every class of the
community, Lord John Russell had the assurance ;to
eta: d up anti state, in reply to the motion of Mr.
Hume, which was not unlike the objects of this associa-
tion. that the middle classes were content with the ex-
heing state of things; that they neither wanted Mr.
Hutne's proposed retorm, nor did the working classes
want the Charter.—(L,ughter)—they v. ere all content,
they were all satisfied with the way iu which they were
dealt vvito by the oligarchy that ruled them. Sir R.
Peel said, w hen he introduced the income-tax, in 1842,
I can give conclusive proofs that you have arrived at
the limits of taxation on the articles of
.cousumption
of the working classes."—(Hear, hear.) Now a man o'
the sagacity of Sir Robert Peel knew as well
us any man how he could extract the last shilling from
the working classes. The statement was disputed. Sir
Robert Peel defended it; he said they had put five per
cent. on, which should have realised 1,800,000, but it
had realised nothing, showing that the working classes
could pay no more.—(Cheers.) '1 hen the profits and
conditions of the:middle classes were deteriorating. and the
working classes were deteriorating also. Amos g the
classes who produced all the w. alth and all the luxuries
enjoyed by the tax, rs—(Cheers)—last year 3,500,000
received treliet in England and Wales, and 100,000 we-re
sent to prisons for crimes of various degrees. Now Sir J.
Graham utte red a remarkable prophecy in his remarkable
pamphlet, published thirty years ago, which at the
present moment was very striking. He said, " When-
ever the country presents the spectacle of millions
wanting bread, teen would the people sweep away
toles, pensions, and honours."—(Prolonged cheering.)
Now, what was the r.medy for these evils? If Ray
man expected any material reduction of taxation without
Parliamentary reform, he imposed a great de-
lusion upon himself.—(Cheers.) It was contrary to
alt experience. Look even at the proceedings of the
presei.t session. Mr. Cobden, upon a motion for the re-
ducion of only ten millions of taxation, without any
definite period being specified, had only 84 votes;
and Mr. Hume, who proposed a small reduction in our
huge standing army, had only forty gentlemen to sup-
port him. He would only trespass upon them for one
moment longer, to say that they only sought to accents
plish that which Lord J. Russell promised when he intro-
duced the Reform Bill into the House. Lord Junn said
I propose by this Bill that the people shall send to the
Commons House of Parliament their real repre-
sentatives, to deliberate on their wants, to consult on
their interests, to consider their grievances, to hold the
purse shit gs of the nation, to lay the foundation for sa-
lutary changes in the well-being and comforts of the
people, and that laws shall not be passed for the benefit
of classes by men roused from their slumbers
at twelve o'clock at night to vote for what.
they know not.— (Great laughter and cheers.)
Now, he hoped whets Lord John Russell saw the report
of the meetiag in the public Dress, that he would lose no
time in senoing a subscription to qualify him a member
of the association.—(Loud laughter.) They wanted no
more than that, and with less they would not be content.
—(Loud cheers.)
. _

.asr. SAMUEL bIonLEY said, as one belonging to
the middle.classes he was glad in having an opportunity
of identifying himself with that movement, which be be-
lieved had mucn to do with the happiness of a great
mass of the working people.—(Cheers ) He was con-
nected with a house in the City which employed con •
sidembly more than 2,000 men, and he was prepared to
state that when loud was cheapest wages were invariably
highest. During the late period of distress he thought
the working classes had conducted themselves admirably,
and he thought if they continued to do so,:and united
together, that the higher classes would no longer be able
to stand against them.—(Cheers.) He thought they were
entitled to tru.tr heartiest and strongest congratulation.
He telt glad that ho had had an opportunity of giving
his must hearty adhesion to this movement, and endea-
vouring to prevail upon every one to give their support
to it.—(Cheers.) He believed that if the association
pursued its cc urse with vigour and energy all the electors
tur the counties of Engle d would be secured to it, and
afford tlicir grit aid ,n carrying out their great object.
Dr. LONGSTAFF then came forward to support the re-
solution. Taxation was the beginning, the middle, and
the end of all conversations. With respt ct to politics,
:he present House of Commons,•• instead of considering
how they should lighten the burl hills of taxation on the
working classes, had done all they could to fix taxation
upon them, and to remove it from themselves.—(Cheers.)
Direct taxation was not popular; why? because he
believed it was not properly understood.—(Cheers.)
With respect to indirect taxation, that occurred
in the Excise and Customs, and it was through
them that the Government had put their hands
into the pockects of the people.—(Loud cheers.)
He maintained that direct taxation was the
proper taxation to be placed upon the people.—(Cheers.)
When the tax :gatherer came for the taxes upon his
horses and carriages, and so on, he knew what be was
paying to the State.—(Cheers.) He would put it to the
meeting whether this country would have tolerated the
tax upon tea it it had be( n honestly collected at the
grocer's shop door.—(Cheers.) So much for the Cum-
tome.—(Cheers.) He would Low advert to the Excise.
He was prepared to maintain that the Excise regulations
advanced the price of soap by 21d. a pound. They in•
terkred with the operations of the manufactures, and it
was high time that the system was changed. How was
that change to be brought about ? Why, iu this simple
manner, by securing a change in the Parliamentary
representation, and he had'lhr refore great pleasure in
supportong thia ussociatioa.—(Hear, hear.)
Mr. WILSON said the work:ng classes had been com-
plimented for their goodness, but when he remembered
that in the last year a million of people died of absolute
starvation, it ..id seem to him that as the working classes
had evinced very little a)mp.tny tor the sufferings ot
Ireland, they were not deserving of compiiment.—
(Oh, oh.)

Mr. LAWRENCE HEY WORTH, M.l'., also spoke in favor
of dirt ct taxation. At present 35,000,000/. were ex-
torted from the pockets of the poor man, and, of course,
tie was therefore obliged to consume less of the articles
of consumption, so reducing the productive powers of the
country. A system ot direct taxation would remove alt
this evil, and he hoped shortly to ace it adepied.—(Elear.)
He admired the universal suffrage which existed in
France, and he theught the peace of the country and
the fi. mness of the government at that moment solely
dcpended upon it.—(Cheers.) But what had France
done on the score of economy ? Nothing.—(hear.)
With divot taxation, however, much might have
been ticeowpiisheo in that respect.—( Hear, hear.) Sup-
posing there was a direct tax of 10 per cent. in this
country. would not the nobility—some ot whom had
300,0001. a year—teel some reluctance in pa3itig their
quota to the tax-gatherer? (Hear, hear.) And
if they complained would not the working
cla-ses complain also ? Would not the working
man inquire into the way in which his money was ex-
perni(d by the State?—(Cheers.) ad they think there
wculd be any sin( cures? No, sir, es-try man would be a
watch•deg upon the acts of the Government.—((;beers.)
Direct taxation recommend, d itself in every light.—
(Hear, Lear.) Then with respect to h
univerysilbl
hag; , lie lied advccateacludit
itever
an since 'universal
e to
expessien ut was
51"."—(11"r' h•tulr g the men of England for
universal sutti tige,
u:ti,t)- inevitably be conceded to
than.—(Cherry.) lle lucked 111,01Ithose who taxed
without his having a voice in Parliament, as no-
thing but thieves,—(Laud cheers.)
The CHAIRMAN then apologised for the absence
of 111 r. G(otge Thompson, who was prevented ad-
dressing the meeting in consequence of having
to attend his duties in the House of Commons. Mr.
Roebuck had expressed his intention of being present,
tut no doubt, some unavoidable circumstance had pre-
y( nted him. He might assure the meeting, however,
that none was more sound upon the question at issue
than Mr. It.et;tielc.—(Loud cheers.)
The resolution was then put to the meeting, and car-
ried Nit!, great Eh
Mr. D. WIRE propo,(d the third reso!ution—
": 'I hat in tb' pinion of this meeeting the COMECIOt
House ot Pat tian.ent, as at l resent constituted, represents
neither th, pi potation, the pieperty, nor the ineustry of
the eout,tri ; that the election of its Mt tubers has in nu-
nit roue anus been the reAt It of bribe ry and corrup
non—(Cheer)—coercion and intimidation;—(Cheers)
—that the Electoral distributions present the men-
strous anomaly of a few hundred voters in some districts

returning as many Members as several thousand coneti-
tueat. in °thee districts; that the Reform Act has totally
failed to realize the expectations of the country or to
harmonise with the spirit of the nee—Wear,
hear)—
and that therefore a lirge exe nsiou of the frenclie-e, a
complete independence in its exercise by means of the
ballot—(Cheers)--s more equel apportionment of re-
presentatives to population—(Hear, hear)—and the
I limitation of Parliament to three years—(Hear, hear)—
become not only measures of common justice, but also
of prudence tied satety."—(Loud cheers.)
That cheer, he thought, would do instead of a speech.—
(No, no.) The resolution deduced a consequence, and
pointed to a remedy. Was it a fact that the House of
Commons, as at present constituted, represented the
population, the property, or the intelligence of the
country?—(No.) Ile had only to look to the Umbers
who made up that body, and the investigations of commit-
tees to deduce that the House of Commons did not do so.
Look at Harwich. Why Harwich, with its 120 electors,
returned two Members, whilst the Tower Hernias, with
a populution of 24,000, returned no greater number.
Harwich and a number of other similar places should
be put in schedule A. What was the result of ha sing such
plat es as Harwich? That the electors were in timidated,
te cause they were bribed and coerced. Like Sudbury,
it had been a place of corruption from the beginning--
it fairly stunk in the nostrils—(Laughter)--it was all
over corruption.—(Laughter.) This shewed there must
he an t quitablo division of electoral districts, in order
to obtain a tair representation of the House of
Commons.—(Cheers.) Eighty-six Members were sent
to Parliament by a less number of voters than the con-
stituency of the Tower Hamlets, and the se who were
sent to Parliament by such constituencies did not repro
sent the people, but their own intereets.—(Cheers.)
Hence it was that the Whigs sought t' le support of
those who represented pocket boroughs and their own
interests; and if they looked at those iyho either got
places fur themselves or their families, they would
find that they consisted of this class.--(Hear, hear.)
Lord John Russell, he thought, would not even deny that
the Reform Bill had failed. For the present de.ective
state of representation there was no I •emedy but the
better apportionment of electoral di visions; if this
were done such constituencies could not be
bribed, intimidated, or coerced.. They had
received an excellent lecture upon political
economy from Mr. Williams, who he,.l on all occasions
supported Mr. Hume, when in the 'House, and whom
he hoped soon to see there again.--'(Loud cheers.) He
had told them that the poor paid in taxes seventy-
five per cent. more than the rich.. Ought it to be
endured, that those who were 1, rot able should be
subjected to such a burden, whilst the wealthier
classes were comparatively unta:ead?—(Loud cheers.)
The reason was apparent—it was in the present system
of election. Let them reform their Parliament—
' (Cheers)—extend their suffrage, equalise their electoral
districts, and they would soon get financial reform.—
(Cheers.) He was glad to see that the people were now
beginning to be alive to the fact that direct taxation was
better than indirect taxation. Who, he would ask, ought
to have the most interest in the Legislature? W by,
the men who paid the most to the tax. He did not see
many bankers, if any, preselot—(Cheers)—but they
would come; when they found the ettive triumphant—
(Cheers)—and then they would say, see what we have
done.—(Cheers.) The poor man, under the present
system, paid 75 per cent. in taxation, while the rich
banker paid only 15. (Cheers, and cries of
" Shame.") If direct taxation was adopted,
when the grocer asked for the half-crown
and the 9d. which was to be paid as a tax upon sugar and
he would naturally be asked what it was for, and he
would say for the exigencies of the state, and the party
that was to be taxed would say, the exigencies of the
state! What do you mean by that? Do you mean to
carry on an unjust war to put down the rising liberties
.4' the people—(Cheers)--by the exigencies ot the state?
Did they mean the keeping up an army to put down the
people. Exigencies of the state! did they mean Lady
A., who lived in Hampton Palace, and who could not pay
taxes, and was exempt from them?—(Cheers.) They
would soon provide for the exigencies of the state if they
did two things—put down the spirit of war, disband their
army and dismiss their navy.—(Cheers.) He was glad
that the Reform Association was to embrace all classes,
the Whig and Tory. Sir R. Peel had made a declaration
that he could never get over, namely, that they had
taxed the people to the utmost verge of endurance.
—(Cheers.) He knew that that was true, and let them
take care to make him know it was so.—(Cheers.) No
doubt the Whigs would one day turn round and assist
them. Lord John Russell, when he felt the cold side of
opposition, he would again become the leader of the
people. Let there be no disunion. Let them depend
upon themselves in unity. If the Chartists would
join the association they would be aiding
their own cause. True, the Chartists went
beyond this association, but was a man who was going
100 miles beyond Bath to refuse to ride in another car-
riage because he only went as far as Bath? The error
of the Chartists was that they had fallen into bad com-
pany, and there physical, instead of a moral force, had
been preached. Let them now feel as he felt, and they
would abandon their ill advisers and join this association.
Prue, it did not say that there should be universal suf-
I rage, but it did not say there should not. It defined exactly
what was practical now, and he invited the Chartists to
take this proposal as an instalnient of their own plan.
There was an old adage, that short reckonings made very
good friends.—(Hear, hear.) They, therefore, asked to
limit Parliament to three years, in order that constitu-
ents might be better acqu inted with their representa-
tives, and the representatives have their virtue kept
fresh by the necessity of accounting constantly to their
constituents.—(Cheers.) Ile was rejoiced at the meeting
because he saw in it the beginning of that movement
which ought to have commenced and continued long ego,
and he assured them, that it they made their motto,
" Union among yourselves," they might bid defiance to
.11 who opposed them.—(Loud cheers.)
Mr. REYNOLDS, of weekly journal notoriety, next ad•
dressed the meeting. He maintained that every individual
who performed the duties and bore the burdens of a
citizen had a right to be represented in the House of
Commons. It was said that property was the real qua
lificatien; and the aristocracy—and there was no more
despicable aristocracy than that which they had in
England, half of them having obtained their landed
possessions by spoliation, being descended from the
Normans, and the other half by the prostitution of
their ancestors in the time of Charles IL—said that no
man ought to have a vote unless he had a stake in the'
country. Now he thought that a labouring man who
had a salary of 13s. or 303. a week had as much stake in
the country as the Duke of Sutherland, who had
an income of 200.0001. or 300,0001. a year, because
if the Duke, and similar in his situation, disliked
their country, they could collect their money together
and go elsewhere. But the working man could not du
that.—(Cheers.) He was known as an ultra-republicau
—(Cheers)—and had represented 20,000 of the work-
ing classes of Derby in the Convention.—(Cheers.) His
works had circulated more that, those of others.—(A
cry of " More shame to say so," hisses and groans, and
counter cheers.) With respect- to Lamartine, he was
not a representative of the people, because he had de-
serted their cause.—(No, no! and Yes!) He could not
see how the ballet could be styled un- English,
and unfair, when it was u-ed in all the West-end clubs,
yet a member who adopted it in his club went down to
the Mouse and denied the same right to the people. It
was adopted in the army, and even Lord Cardigan would
not use it unless he was shielded by the ballot-box. The
proper apportionment of representetioneto the population
was obviously based ou the principles of common sense.
lie thought that the duration of Parliament should be
limited to three years, on the principle that short reckon-
ings made long friends. He maintained that the earth
belonged to those who were upon it, and that all ought
to be satisfied before any one was allowed to live in idle-
ness.—(Cheers.) He was convinced that such reforms
as were contemplated by this association could alone
save this country trom destruction.

The CHAIRMIN, in putting the resolutions, deprecated
the terms used by Air. Reynolds in calling the aristo
cracy infamous. The resolution was then put and de-
clared to be carried unanimously.
Thanks were then voted to the Chairman amid loud
acclamations, who shortly responded, and the meeting
broke up at a late hour.

EMPE RIAL PARLIAMENT.

(THIS EVENING.)

HOUSE OF LORDS.

Their Lordships assembled at Five o'clock.
The Apprehension of Deserters (Portugal) Bill passed
through committee.
The Small Debts (Scotland) Bill was read a third
time, and passed.
Lord REDESDALE presented a petition from certain
of the clergy of the Established Church against the lay
impropriatien of the tithes.
AFFAIRS 01? TEE RIVER PLATE.
The Eat! ot HARROW BY asked whether any ar-
rangement h.:d been entered into with Cr. neral Roses
with regard to the affairs of the River Plate, whether
the account of such arrangement which had appeared in
the newspap, rs was true, and whether her Majesty's
Government had ratified such arrangement?
The Marquis of .LANSDOWNE said that a negotia-
tion was pending, and was not yet concluded, but he
hoped it would lead to a satisfactory result.
(I cons' quence of the loud time in which conversation
was carried ou by a group of persona at the foot of the
Throne, the answer of the Noble Marquis was almost
inaudible.)
The Earl of ABERDEEN said that if the arrange-
ment took place upon the bases which he had proposed
it would be satisfactory. He had heard that modifica-
tions wire to be introduced, but he would state that no
arrang. tuunt Should be entertained which did not tic-
know,«lge the itid, pendence of the state of Monte Video,
which had been gnat dby this country.
'the Ma: qui* ot LANSDOWNE made a few observe-
tio,s which were completely inaudible,
SOUTH-WESTERN AND GREAT WESTERN
RAILWAYS.
Lord BROUGHAM. said that the directors of these
railways had stated that the sum of 85,0001. had been
paid to the Government on account of these railways
with regard to certain branches leading to Windsor.
tie wished to know whether any account had been ren-
dered of this money, for it was stated that there was
no neord of receipt by the Government.
Th, Earl of CARLISLE said that he had cenducted
the ingot taione ell the part of the Government with re•
g.. 1,1 to the passage of these lines through Windsor ;
that hu had appeared before the Committees of both
Houses of Parliament, and b-een ex:.mined during the
pasting of that Bill, and that the whole history of the
trabst,etion appeared in the preamble of the Bill.
LardBROUGHAM—Was the sum mentioned?
The Earl of CARLISLE—Either iu the preamble or
the cl ruses.
The Duke of CLEVELAND considered the Great
Western Company had been hardly used.

The so,leet. then dro toed.
EPISCOPAL C gURCI-T, SCOTLAND,

Lor.! BROUGHANt
.uresent,'d a peti,,.ion from the.
Episcopalians of Sc:Alan 1, and in so doing, he would
utstaio from staling his opinion either in favour
or against the petit:oll( ra; but it would be no de-
parture from the rule, if he enpressAl his opinion
with regard to those who may have conducted them
selves rashly in anun-Christian, or illegal manner.
The petitioners used the Liturgy of the Church of
England which none had a right to alter.
In Scotland these members of the Church of England
were Sectaries and Dissenters. There were other Secta-
ries in Scotland who had taken it into their beads that
they were logy; Sectaries than the petitioners. The peti-
tioners sul;;cribed to the Thirty.nine Articles, and used
without alteration the Liturgy of the Church of Eng-
land. Not so the other; they used a Liturgy different,
and in the use of that Liturgy the petitioners would not
concur, because it contained matter to which they could
not agree.

(LEFT SPEAKING.)

HOUSE OF COMMONS.

The SPEAKER took the ChuTraiFi;eminute3 before
Four o'clock.

LORD DUDLEY STUART.

Mr. wuoIiTSON movui th it Curcl Dudley Stuart
b• allowed to alts nd and vote in the Committee on Group
19 of Opposed Private Bills, in respect of the Bill for
which he "as added to that Committee, notwithstanding
the clerk of the Committee of Selection has not received
from him the prescribed form of declarivion, wish his
signature attached. provided he delivers in such declara-
ation forthwith.—Agr, ed to.

PETITIONS.
Mr. ANDERSON presented a petition from a place
in Scotlat,d, praytng for a reform in the parochial system
eduction in Scotland.
Mr. OSBORNE presented a petition from St. Luke's,
Middlesex, in fav,ur of th,. appointment of a Committee
to inquire into the assessment of the metropolitan police.
Mr. C. LUSHINGTON presented a petition frou St.
George's, Westminster, against the projected removal of
Smithfield Market; and coocluding by moving that the
petition be referred to the
Market.—Agreed to. Committee en Smithfield

Mr. POR rAL presented a petition from
Hampshire,
complaining of agricultural distress in that county.
Mr. MILNER GIBSON presented a petition from
Manchester, complaining that when clergyawn got into
the Church they could not get out of it again—(Laughter)
''
—and praying that clergymen sect.ding from the E.tab-
lished Church might have the full benefit cf tho Tolera-
tion Acr.

Laird DUDLEY STUART presented a petition from
St. Pancras, praying for a reform in Parliament.
Mr. I'. SCR° YE presented a petition from a society of
working men in London, in favour of home colonization.
Sir JOEIN DucKwoirra presented a petition
from Exeter ag-inst any alteration in the law of marriage.
Mr. OS iIORNE presented a petition from John
B) rne. a policeman in the D division, complaining that
had been dismissed the service without sufficient
reAson.

Mr. VILLIERS presented a petition from Wolver-
hampton against tiny alteration in the Parliamentary
Oaths Bill.

SECRIIt
for South
EoNn,DLroYseStOoCal,EkTtlhEeSm' BeilbLheLr.
Wiltshire whether the Bill on Friendly Societies, which
Mr. P.
he had introduced, will have the effect which is appre-
hended in some parts of the country, of depriving all
societies of the management of their own affairs, and of
taking possession of their funds for the use of the Go-
vernment. _ _ _ _ _

Mr. SOTHERON said the Bill he bad introduced re-
lating to Friendly Suci Mies had for its object to enable
members of those sucieties to ascertain for themselves
ttieir real coudttien.