The Sun.
London, England, 1849-07-14 00:00:00

THE LEIGH PEERAGE.

The ATTORNEY-tiENERAL thought it was hits
duty to call the attention of the House to a petition
which had just been presented. It appeared that the
petitioner was undergoing an isnprisonment for libel, and
a: the libel was repeated in the petition, he apprehended
it could not be received.
Mr. OS Belt N E said the petition had been forwarded
to him by the Hun. Member for Finsbury. No doub•
the petitioner was in gaol, but from the tenor of the peti-
tion he thought he was better qualified fur a lunatic
asylum.—(Hear, arid a lough )
PILOTAGE BILL.
_

Sir GEORGE CLERK— said the second reading
of the Pilotage Bill had been fixed for Monday
next ; but as it had riot yet been printed
sufficient opportunity would not be afforded
to parties interested in the measure to consider its pro-
visions if it were read a second time so early.
Mr. STAFFORD wished the Noble Lord at the head
of the Government. at the same time that he answered
the former question, to state what his intentions were as
regarded the Australian Colonies Bill.•
Lord JOHN RUSSELL said, with regard to
the first question, the second reading of the Bill
had not yet been fixed. With regard to' the second
question, he proposed that the House should meet on
Thursday morning at twelve o'clock, to consider the Bill
referred to. He might take that opportunity of stating
that as an arangement had been made for bringing on
the Ordnance Estimates on Monday, he should be com-
pelled to postpone the consideration of the Lords'
amendments to the Incumbered Estates (Ireland) Bill
till twelve o'clock on Tuesday morning.
Mr. MONSELL trusted the Noble Lord would recon-
sider the morning sitting on Tuesday, as there was a
most important question coming on the same eve: jug.
Lord JOHN RUSSELL was afraid he could not do so,
FISCAL RELATIONS OF GREAT BRITAIN
AND IRELAND.

On the question that the Speaker leave the Chair for
he House going into a Committee of Supply,
Mr. JOHN O'CONNELL rose to move for a Select
Committee to inquire into the fiscal relations between
Great Britain arid Ireland. He believed that the
result of the labours of such a Committee would
tend to disabuse the public mind of the mistake
that this country had absolutely been lavish in its
grants of money to In land, and that Ireland had
only added ingratitude to want of punctuality in re-
paying the advances so Lberally made to her.
He believed it would b 3 proved by the labours of such
a Committee that Ireland, whatever money she
had received, had to the utmost of her
power paid back, and with greater punctuality,
considering the state of her resources, that
had been the case with many of our cols
vies towards the mother country. Ht
warned the House against the dangerous ex-
periment of endeavouring to impose fresh taxation or.
Ireland, which would only be atien.led with the result
which had attend-d similar experiments, namely, the
total failure of a pruducive result se far as the increas-
of the revenue was concerned. Taking the united grog=
revenue of the two countries at 56,000,000 L, the exchAv.
taxation paid by Great Britain did not amours:
to inure of that sum than 13 000.0001 , with the excsptiet.
of the differential duty on spirits between the tw,_
c.,untries. The Hon. Gentleman then said the Act te
Union had been violated. At the time of the Unitn,
though the Goveines, nt which effected that measure
were prepared to go far, will it was too much even to
the men of that time tai amalgamate the debt of b
nations. By the 7th section of that Act, the Exchequer
of both countries was not to be consolidated, except upon
conditions therein laid down. It was not contemplated
by that Act that Irelard should pay taxes in the seize
proportion as England, until she was equally able to pay
them. He contended that Ireland during the forty-nine
sears since the Union had been unjustly made !.able to
sixty-four millions, which site had no right to pay. Thi
Iri'h peopn3 were now impoverished, and if the Imperial
Legislature were obliged to assist them, it was only at.
let of retributive justice. He contended that Irelan?
had not been shown any favour in the way of loans or
grants since the Union, but he should call the attentiot
of the House to the relief from taxation granted to
both countries. England, since the Union, ban
51,236,000/ of taxes remitted, while Ireland had bu;
2,000.000/. The imposition of taxation in England ass
40,000.0001., while it was 5i millions in Ireland. Thu,
the relief to Great Britain exceeded the amount of
taxation by 11,000,000, while that to Ireland was litie
more than one•hall of the amount imposed. Then then
were 19,446,000/. of assessed taxes taken off in England,
in Ireland' but 600 000/. Then, as to the loans and
grants made to both countries up to 1847, he found then..
was advanced to England for public works 7,176.000/
of which 2,000,000/. were unrepaid, and, according to the
returns down to 1842, there were 15 millions advanced, o
which six millions were paid. Then there was advanced
>9lt3ir
0110101G.;allaenr),,
'10.6r0R0:010ajli p; a 1 afocre st4h,e6ool3,roiotiOs/h. ;
compensation to Scotland for the union, 260,000/. lit
Aftirustelu'em,N
round by the finance account of 1845 that nine millions
and sixty-seven thousand pounds were advanced to Ire
land, of which upwards of seven were repaid, while
England out of an advanca of fifteen millions only pair
six. Ireland, no doubt, owed 1,000,000 for the ereetint,
et* workhouses, contracted during the last ten years. and
England, with all her boasted wealth and resources,
owed 800,0001. since 1835. Then there was the great
absentee drain, and the payment of mortgages, which
was enough to ruin any country in the world. The Hon.
Gentleman, at'l,-er calling on the Government to take the
matter into their serious consideration, concluded by
submitting his motion to the House.
Celonee DUNNE seconded it.
The CHANCELLOR of tho EXCHEQUER did not
think it was necessary for him to follow the lion. Gen-
tleman through all his statements, near was the appoint-
ment of the Select Committee applied for necessary.
inasmuch as the returns moved for from time to time
gave all the information which could be obtained. He
could not, however, allow the statements of the Hon.
Gentleman to go forth uneontrad'cted, and he could M-
oire him at the same time, that any further returns
.vhich should be moved for, and which would have the
-tr cc of eluci.,l3tiNg the subjot, would be granted, be
au.e it was his wish that the real nature of the case
'hould be fairly and fully explained. Whatever com-
plaints Ireland had to make of the legislation of the
Imperial Legislature, most assuredly she could not COED
plain of unjust taxation, inasmuch as the returns moved
;or by the Hon. Member for Glasgow showed that at no
ierio I was her income canal to her expenditure. The
return did- nor show exactly the amount of the income;
tt was below the actual sum, but so was it in a far gre tter
1:-gree in giving the expenditure. The Hon Gentleman
,e id the proposition ought to be 15 to 2; but. in point
it Not. England paid forty-eight millions, while Ireland
eoly paid four, which was far below that amount. Ire•
mini never even peel the interest on her own debt; and
!t was only when the consolidation of the Exchequer
.00k place, in 1817, that her income was equal to the
xeenditare. Now, the Hon. Gentleman forgot that
eteland paid no porti of the charge for the navy.
,thich protected the trade of the Milted Kingdom and
he celoeies, although she enjoyed all the adventeges.
Mr. J. O'CONNELL. admitted that Ireland did not
pay her portion for the navy, but her unaccredited taxa-
...ion would amount to more than that sum, and they were
:resides deprived in Ireland of naval duckyards or eats
blishments.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER would
ay that the Hon. Gentleman was not justified in saying
that Ireland was unfairly taxed, and he should therefore
resist the motion.
he returns
athiaat
aa
tCootamilmyicttoeoet
rwaansy nseecrelssa-
Major BLA.CKALL thought the Chancellor of the
F:xch'focirtiehre hriemadsetitif
,row that of his Hon. Friend. He thought it ought at once
to be settled whether Ireland paid her fair proportion or
not; if she did, let them not be taunted as they had been
by English Membsrs, and if not, let further taxation be
imposed. Certainly, if his Hon. Friend divided the
House, he should vote for his motion.
Mr. FAG \N also supported the motion, and con..
tended that Ireland, at the present moment, paid more
clan her fair proportion, according to the terms of the
Union. The principle of the Union was that both coun-
ries should pay according to their means, and Lord
Castlereagh fixed the proportion of Leland at 2-17ths.
Whatever might hive been the power of Ireland to con-
.eihute Mere the Union she completely lost that power
tiler the Union. It would have been better if the Ex-
chequers of the two countries had never been united,
:or since that cons lidation Ireland had centritm-ed
'fore than her fair shire of the revenue of the empire,
and that accounted for much of its povs;rty and distress.
Mr. FRENcir said he ropy sllouPlat the Honourable