The Sun.
London, England, 1849-03-20 00:00:00

But the best mode for a Government to lay money by
was to leave it to fructify in the pockets of the people
by diminishing taxation.—(hear, hear.) Therefore, he
proposed to withdraw the troops from the lonian Islands
and to exempt the States from any further contributions
on account of military protection; for so doing they
would bless that House, and, by so doing, that Rouse
might reduce 3,000 men. Next ho propose a reduction
in the military force at the Cape of Good Hope: the
year before last that force consisted of nine regi-
ments; last year it consisted of six regiments, in
all above 5,000 men, including a colonial corps, but
exclusive of artillery and engineers. He doubted
whether such a force, including artillery, &c., could be
maintained at the Cape for less than 500,0001. a year.
He acknowledged at once that if the British empire in
South Africa was to be maintained according to the
boundaries fixed by Sir H. Smith, and those boundaries
were to be protected against the incursions of savages,
then ere long twice 5,000 soldiers and an annual expen-
diture of 1,000,0001. sterlinn, would be required. But
he proposed to withdraw the British troops; to let the
Boers take care of themselves; to let the colonists ma-
nsgo their own affairs; and merely to keep a garrison of

1,000 men at Cape Town. He warned the House that
if they did not follow his advice they would have, in ad-
dition to the ordinary military expenditure of about half
a million a year, to vote every few years a few millions
on account of Kafir and Zoolah wars. He therefore
proposed to make a reduction of 4,000 men in the mili-
tary force of the Cape of Good Hope.—(Hear, hear.)
Next, with regard to Ceylon. At present the military
force in that colony amounted to 4,000 men, including
colonial corps. A portion of the expense of that force
had been defrayed by the colony—a burden they
were anxious to transfer to the Imperial Treasury.
Without doubt, if that colony continued to be adminis-
tered as it had been by the Colonial-office, 4,000 troops
were not too many to keep down the natives; and this
country must make up its mind to pay the whole ex-
pense of those troops. Now, he must reluctantly confess
that, after the signal failure of so distinguished and en-
lightened a statesman as the present Secretary of State
for the Colonies, there could be no hope that Ceylon
would ever be well governed by the Colonial-office. He
therefore proposed to transfer it, and the payment of the
troops, to the East India Company; and by so doing he
would give the means of reducing the vote before the
House by another 4,000 men.—(Hear, hear.) Thus
by withdrawing 3,000 men from the lonian Islands,
4,000 from the Cape, and transfering the 4,000 men
of Ceylon to the East India Company. he would effect
a reduction in the force on the military stations to the
amount of 11,000 men. Next, with regard to the
commercial colonies. He agreed with his Hon. Friend
the Member for Montrose. in asking where was the use
of 9,000 men in North America, 6,000 of whom were in
the Canadas ? These troops cost the country about
700,0001. a year. Now, since the establishment of re-
sponsible government the Canadas had become virtually
independent. It seemed to him to be as absurd to pay
for troops in the virtually independent colony of Canada
as it would be to pay the military establishments of the
independent colony of the United States.—(Hear, bear.)
He should propose, however, for the present to keep
garrisons at Quebec and Halifax, and would therefore
merely propose a reduction of 5,000 in the military
force of the North American colonies.—(Hear.) Of the
West Indies, which contained 6,000 troops, he should say
nothing at present. He had proposed last year to reduce
the force in those colonies by 3,000 men ; and he still
held the opinion that such a reduction ought to be
made. Lastly, in Australia and New Zealand there
were about 5,000 troops. Not one soldier was required
in Australia, except on account of convicts. There was
literally no one to fight with. It might be true that, in
consequence of Colonial-office mismanagement, troops
might for some time longer be required in New Zea-
land ; and on this account chiefly he should propose to
leave 3,000 men in the Australian colonies.—(Hear,
hear.) Thus he believed that, without any detriment to
the real interests of the empire, the force in the colo-
nies might be reduced from 42,000 men to less than
22,000, with a saving to the empire in military expen-
diture alone of above 1,000,0004 a year. If this reduction
were made in the force on foreign stations, then, as the
number of troops to be retained would be much dimi-
nished, the question might be entertained of reducing
the military force at home. He would not trouble
the House with inquiring at present to what extent
that force might then be reduced, but he would con-
clude with saying that, for the reasons which ho had
stated, he would cordially vote for the motion of his
Hon. Friend.
Mr. W. S. CRAWFORD would not go into the ques-
tion respecting the reduction of troops in the colonies;
but he would support the motion of his Hon. Friend the
Member for Montrose, on the ground that the number
of troops at present maintained in the United Kingdom
was unnecessary and improper. He understood the
Secretary at War to say that 52,000 men were required
to protect the United Kingdom. In his (Mr. Crawford's)
view, it was inconsistent with a free constitution that a
standing army of that extent should be maintained to
keep in subjection a free people. It seemed to him a
proof of misgovernment.—( Hear.) If they extended the
franchise and pursued a system of just legislation, then
the army might be reduced, but all efforts in that direc-
tion would be vain till the people regarded the Govern-
ment not as their oppressors, but as their friends.
Mr. COBDEN said he had been delighted to hear the
tendency of the remarks of Honourable Members
during the discussion, and by the constant allusions
which had been made to the colonies, for he believed
they were the pivot on which the whole system of re
trenchment turned. The Right Hon. Gentleman the
Secretary-at-War had alluded to something he (Slr. Cob-
den) had stated on a former occasion with respect so our
troops in Canada. What ho said ‘vos, that before the
rebellion in that colony we had only 4,000 men there, but
that they had been augmented on the breaking cut of the
rebellion, and, as had occurred in all similar cases, had
not since been reduced. Their numbers were just
double now of what they had been before the rebellion,
and that was a sufficient argument to show that in all
cases where an augmentation of our establishment took
place by sea or by land, we never went back to
the numbers before the augmentation became neces-
sary. They were told that the troops were required on
account of our domestic condition. He must confess he
had heard with very great regret the remarks of the
Right llon. Gentleman the Secretary-at• War, with
respect to the necessity of keeping troops at home for
the purpose of keeping down the people. That was the
first time such an object had ever been avowed by any
member of any Government, for it had hitherto been
always denied that
_troops were kept to repress the
people.—(oh, oh.) It was a very alarming and melan-
choly state of things that it should be avowed in 1849
that we kept up a large force to keep down the people
of England—Englishmen, who had been always
considered peculiarly suited for self-government here or
abroad, and who had always claimed the principle of
being governed by the civil power.—(Cries of " Oh,oh!")
The Right Honourable Gentleman distinctly avowed
that object. He said it was for the purpose of keeping
peace among the people. Some remarks had been made
as to the state of the manufacturing towns. He
admitted that the mayors and magistrates of some
large towns had sent for some troops last year, but there
must be some fault in the system when such a rein-
forcement to the civil power was called for. He
thought, on behalf of the middle classes, that those who
were responsible for the government of the country
should introduce some large measure with respect to the
working classes, to bring the two into harmony, and that
they should, by bringing the latter within the pale of
the constitution, take away the disaffection and discon-
tent which induced the necessity for employing troops.
With respect to the immediate vote before the House, it
must be borne in mind that troops had become really
much more efficient than they had been a few years
ago. A great authority—General Gordon—stated to
the Committee of 1844 that one thousand
men could be sent from London to Manchester
in nine hours, and would arrive there fresh as when they
started; whereas, before the introduction of railways,
they would have taken 17 days for the journey, and
would have arrived fatigued and exhausted. Though he
did not admit the necessity of repressing the people by
armed men, railways had given tenfold force to their
military establishments, and if they were necessary the
number of men might bo reduced, and yet the same
amount of force be available. Ho maintained, however,
that in large or small towns peace might be maintained
by the civil power, if Government would sanction a
mode by which an organized body—not of military or of
national guards—but of special constables, could be al-
ways in readiness to assist the magistrates. Why not
imitate America? New York was larger than Liverpool,
and yet there were neither soldiers nor barracks there,
and the peace was kept by the police. There was a
fluctuating population of English, Irish, and foreigners,
and he contended that what could be done at New
York with Englishmen could bo done with English-
men at home. The Honourable Member for West
Surrey (Mr. Drummond) had made some remarks which
he would not have referred to but that they might pro-
duce ill feelings elsewhere. The Hon. Member had
called the French tigers and monkeys, fit for exhibition
in the Zoological Gardens. Perhaps the French might
not know that the Hon. Gentleman was a privileged
Member of the House, and that he was so fickle in his
aversions and likings that they might find him next
week calling them doves and lambs. The Right Hon.
Gentleman the Secretary at War referred to the state of
the continent as a reason for a large standing army.
lie would admit, if the Right Hon. Gentleman pleased,
that the French and the other continental :nations were
going to fight with each other. But that was not the
question for us to consider with respect to our forces.
What we had to ask was, if anybody was coming to fight
with us? Was there a symptom or a tendency of such
a disposition on the continent? Such being the case,
and having no enemy he knew of to dread, he thought
there was no necessity for keeping up a larger military
establishment than had been found necessary in 1835 and
1836.
Lord JOHN RUSSELL—The Hen. Gentleman, the
Member for the West Riding, who has just spoken, has
mentioned two points with respect to the estimates, the
first with respect to the forces in Canada; the second
with respect to the forces in this country. As regards
our forces in Canada, it may be quite true that they are
nearly double as great in amount as they were previous
thouttilembreakingthatout owfhtehne
trlita•bteirleiobnelliinon in
Canada, I could not help being somewhat uneasy ofn mod
count of the smallnese of the force we had sbtaiisoanveed
note well
with very great intrepidity; the rebels werea there.—(Hear,
organized, and certainly did not make sue re-
sistance as had been expected ; and by skill of
hear.) Those forces, however,
our commanders and by the bravery of our troops,
that
1r broke ko province;out
the rebellion was happily put down ; but I should
be very sorry, well disposed as Canada is at pre-
sent, to see any great diminution of the forces sta-
tioned in that country.—(Hear, hear.) As to other of
our colonies, certainly there may be some in which re-
efotrocatimine
oinurthcaelonauimesbeirs
thinlyttht me
less Om it was in 1835,--(3ettr, bear.) The nest point
odfueotuiorntrmooaYps b;ebniutadle