The Sun.
London, England, 1825-05-10 00:00:00

Protestant parish, town, and almOst etil the landholders of that
county. fie had (the Noble Marquis said) many more such
petitions to present to the ,House, but should. etnly mov2 the
reading of the present..—Read, and laid on the table of the
House.
The same Noble. Marquis presented a similar petition from
the County of Limerick, which the. Earl.of LIMERICK said
contained the names of the_great majority of that County, as to
wealth anti respectability.
A petition was presented hy the above Noble Marquis from
five-sixths of the population of Queen's, County. in Iraand, in
favour of the Catholic Claims.
Earl GREY presented a petition from the Attornies_arid
Barristers of Neweastle.upon.Tyne, which lie recommened
td their Lordships, on -account of the:character and intelli-
Cence of the petitioners, who also were in favour of the Catholic
laims.
The LORD CHANCELLOR, though be differed from the
prayer of the petitioners, was willing to bear testimony to, their
character and weight.
Earl GREY presented another petition from the Roman Ca.
tholics of the town and neighbourhood of Blackburn, in the
County Palatine-of Lancaster, in favour of the Catholiolteliel
Bill. He expressed his •opinion while presenting this last, peti-
tion, that the Catholic Claims could-not be deferred to another
Session, without danger to the country. . •
- Lord fi 0 LLANDliresented *Petition &um rks 0)4:jolt Cor-
poration of the town and county of Nottingham, ,of which he
had the honour of being Recorder, who prayed-their Lordships
to entertain the Catholic Relief Bill it would be recollected
that the people of Nottingham had always been distinguished
for their zeal in favour of civil and religious: liberty. They were
now persuaded that restrictions on the Roman Catholics- were
no longer necessary, and, therefore, they petitioned in favour
of the pending 13111..
The same Noble Baron then presented two- similar petitions
—one from the Unitarians of Brighton, and another from
the Protestant Dissenters,- meeting in Sonth.place, Finsbury.
The ,Earl of FORTESCUE presented a petition from the
Inhabitants of Kingsbridge, praying for the more speedy reco.
very of Small Debts. •
The Earl of DONOUGHMORE presented a petition from
the Landholders of the County of Cork, praying for relief by
pecuniary loans.
The Earl of IIAREWOOD presented a petition front the
Manufacturers of Sheffield,. praying for the enactment of the
Equitable Loan Bank Companl's Bill. •
• THE SLA% E TRADE. •

to deelare-garn LI property, and einecondly, -td tallow; is
posed of like any other: property: • Vhere. were, nittartnietoi
provisions which he shOuld beprepated .teaubstrit, to thvieleotiti,'s.
ships, if they should allow the, Bill to go into s-1-:i,,,,19:0•01,441.1
the present leases fell 'lite. it would be .eierto.rnake saeaSkee
ments hereafter, accommodated to 'the .etningolof
pmet for which he shoal& provide was, dottAtme
{tar o:u iltciti~ -
se game without a licence, and that the owner of gatnseabingell •
atfix such makes. as wouldecnable'hiektoleseertain'tistietti4.llid
person disposing of it had :wine by•it iris lesealoninnete Ale"
was not prepared to say that this . was the. very best .tutitatk.e'el.
that could be propoSede but- certain he .was-;hat soheethiti4
should be done to obviate the many evili.-arisiagetuteafittieppte- • t
sent (lame Laws. The Nob/eLord concluded by "u2fivi*iotlat
the Bill be read a second time.
The Earl of NVESTAIORLANH eopodscd• (fie•• IneetOti• '4
When a measure like this, affecting the rights atid.privilieestieof
so many of the King's subjects was proposed." it regitireil 5 •
eeriotte consideration. The preservation of in' sectieigtet
so highly cultivated as this, was an object of. high- inispOAsereteeek
4fthe Ikloble "Lord (Deere) proceeded with' themeasure..heiratif%
find himself involved in much contaadictiini-and. absetediti
This measure was introduced under the preteict of poptilAsh)
favour, and of Supporting popular...site/hie r whoever extitisittid:
the Bill, would find in to be the .mostrdespotie act thateseretie/
was framed; and that, in fact, its principles were the eatitt-'
as" those. from ixhielt 'Abe horror's esfstfig Preach terblietUte.
were partly drawn. Its tendency was to- betteliteenen
tenslve landed property, and.to deprive_ othericleae-eltr
every species of rural amusement. It went to deelara-feieth'
rtaturce to he private, property.' It took from• the, thr*.ilf
the Manor the rights he now pcksessed,, giving him' such'eie•f.
he ought not to possiii.' • Whit privileges it granted tii'A.
Small proprietor were.quite usetess,: because he could not ptir-
eue game beyond the limits of his own property. -IteWat teiSeee
he might set snares on his land, butoo More.• Tlleill;ord,L44,
s-e-Ould consider, in the next place 4 how it interfered, with tetra&
arnuiements, such as hunting, (*tinge. *7-hawking. -The.
game might be pursued from a man's own lands' into thoeeeStr
another ; but then, if the person pursuing it could not prove it
to be the very saute lie had started, he might he seized, AO
taken before a Alagistrate. The ineasurie Would have the effect
of turning every largo proprietor of garne.trito a piSulterer, and
every sportsman into'a robber. lie was not disposed to deny. 4
the great evil arising from poaching; and should be as ready ae
any man to concur in such measures as might be likely to lessale z
the mischief. The present,. however, was not, as it appeared
to him, a measure of that description. It could never have the
effect of impressing on the minds of the people that fel et rraNt:ct
were private property, or that the same moral guilt attached ne:
the stealing of game as to that of any other article. 'Hitherto..
he had always thought that the (lame Laws were ooneidered
tending, in ,a great degree, to preserve the peace of the,countrye '
by taking it out of the power of all classes of the people-Ate--
possess arms. They. made. it impossible, the a general arrnittg
to take place, if a disposition prevailed to disturb the '-pettee:
the country. .By this Bill every man might possess-iriiis. li
admitted that the Bill of Rights allowed this privilege to-all-fete t
Majesty's subjects,. but then it was a privilege tif-wlaiclithey
had no inducement to avail themselves very generally. -Thar
would not be the case if the present Bill should pass into ts fair.
The Noble Earl concluded by moving, that the Bill, be read a
second time that day eiir months. . • • .
Lord iIIALMESIIURY opposed the Bill. He did net recoil=
lest in the-course of .hie Parliametary experience that any di Se.
tinguished stateSman proposed a change of the present:systems-,
of Game Laws as a measure of great public importanee. .Ctrie-7
great benefit arising from
.them swas their tendency se, indivee
(ienltemen to reside for e considerable part• f. die yea!' on their"
kestates. This he looked upon as so greet and imporeanfeitteede-
vantage, that he should'. he very unwillingeo incur the risk
losing. it for a contingent good. The-Nettle, Lord stated
ous grounds of:Oppoeition to: the 114; 'but spoke is,...sso
tone of voice AS to be inaudible below the bar: • .
_ Lord DARNLEY supported the Bill-. The evil of poaclls
ing bed gone so fat that something mast be dose .to put-a ittoite''
.to it. lie did not think the measure. if adopted; could haves •
. the effect. of reveritioge gentlemen from residing- on- their
.estates. They might still retain their rights over the gkme
sport AS they Lut/sheen .hitherto accustomed to doe He-sa we-tee
..renson why tenants should not-beallowed to pay part of 1.11t4ei.:,
tent by the Ole of game. fwre eciuld be no use in-rondo-tat
the present
.syeterii. of lbws, which were lush itu ai ly. violated ;attic:es-
. tended to spread immorality and crime, by theeeezteptiitiorettesiet
.held out to violate them. - . , .•
. Lord CALTHQRPE spoke in faveur, of the Bilk-eft Seek
impossible by any description to -.exaggeite--the mass of
among. from- the Game:Laws... -Their 'effect wa4_ttt..prevent:ttii
sale of game. Even though they ,might have.been adapted Ais.4
the state of'the country-in former nines, when the great htilkSer
.property consisted of land, they were wor.sealrin useless at Pfe`sl''''
vent, ,when -there- existed' a 'large 'class society. Whe istis
amassed consideyable, wealth by manufactures eind CommerFei!:.•
-atia who possessed the means of purchasing every. ltzpieerY
sept gaine-; 'that they-could nest legally enjoy :iccOrrtiio.e• to the
T present system. ..he Bill, if liaised "into a law See.'
terfere with the spores of cohntergentlemen. 'Even if it did..
. evils of the present sysectinSwere -so great,' that-he ill :enact-be'.
willing to make very great sactifievs to lessen, them-ewstarint 6e4..es
. g-ree. constituted ea :hut "House. was, it-would --he
ungracious in_t them to reject ench a measure, as thiseeeelleaeefiee
L,

Viscount CLIFDEN presented a petition from the inhabit-
ants of New Sarum.'who prayed for measures to complete the
Abolition of Negro Slavery. Not having said any thing upon
this subject; he-wished to be indulged in saying a very few
words,. Evidence was not to be taken from the unhappy Blacks,
and they were denied all measures to raise them in the estima-
tion of humanity. He hoped, that finally,,theday would come
when this unhappy race would be quite emancipated from their
galling chains. If, indeed, their Lordships and the other House
of Parliament, had not the boldness to speak out, and put down
the mahpractices of other countries, all they had-hitherto done
amounted to nothing atall. •
Earl GROSVENOR was glad that. his Noble Friend had
called the attention of their Lordships
.to this subject. It was
impossible-for their Lordships not to see that Foreign Courts
were not in earnest inputting down the Slate 'Trade, but that
we must trust-to ourselves for the-abolition-Of it. He called on
his • Majesty's Ministers to tall upon Parliament to, inter-
fere, and cause the voice of the country to be distinctly heard
throughout the world.

IRELAND. •
The Earl of RADNOR thought that -some measures would
have been- taken -with •regard to Ireland, as he was disappointttl
with the situation in which that countrY was left,at the tlifise of
last Session. He proposed, on this day fortnight, to bring the
question before the House. • • •
The Ear] of LIVERPOOL here wished the Noble Lord se-
riously to consider the propriety of bringing such a mothin, in
.any shape' before the House. He understood- that the Bill-
brought in last Session, viith regard to 'lreland, had. answered
itr object most completely t and not only so, but that it had
operated without_ those inconveniences wbich.'were expected to:
attend it: He hopecli- both for this and other :reasons; that the.
Noble Lord would reconsider his motion, and .of 11 is,
turbing the course of the Bill.
The Earl "of LIME RICK could not:help :concurring with •
the Noble Lord at,the head of his Majesty'S Government. He
trusted that his Noble Friend would refrain front diSturbing the
.Bill. •
Viscount CLIFDEN found that the operation of the Bill had
brought. Catholics and Protestants to agree much beiter than
Protestants and Churchmen were agreed. here for it was a
question here, whether the church. bells- should toll at a Dissen-
ter's death. •
The Earl of R Almon here observed; that if the present Bill
were allowed to go on, doing nothing, he should Certainly take
an opportunity of speaking of the enormities which ha& been
produced by the. Bill.
MESSAGE FROM THE QO3I3IONS. . •
air. DUNDAS and others brought up' the Irish Court of
Chancery Bill, the Chelsea Pensioners' Bill, the Gosport Chapel
Bill, and the Newbury and Bolton Improvement Bills, which.
were afterwards read a first time.

,ortI.SUFFIELD support' e 1 the Bill: , Ile had liste!!ect it- ''.-
Mr. :John II yarn; from the Equitable Loan Bank Company, ; tentively to the arguments advanced by the No.tble Lortla'whO4' -•
presented certain papers, pursuant to an order of the Houwe. ' mote opposed. to the hill,' but hp a nothingi-to• inda...Z.V;•
Upon the. Motion of . the Earl, of SHAFTESBURY. the -him to change hie opinion that the'. present systeto.'ONiatin:,s
Cheltenham 'Water Works Bill, the Chester Oaf Lights',Bill. Luis which were -a , moat-. prolific' sourer -ofs-erime; .art&, tifei;i- • •
- -.,--• .
'and several Road Bills, were read a third time, pasted,--and ;
soopresai,‘, in their operation On a .-large and alins.b.-;‘
1,
_Ass of society: With respect- Cu the ownerahipot --the GertilV., %.
sent to the Commons. - - '.. - - -
• '-- • YALE OF OAM E. • , '
: game not to lie on the lord of the. soil. aTal-'thia-'140.1,-
i he would -imp-there was :no law which declared theilrreperty nt' • .
Lard DA CRE, ill rising tomove the second reading of the
Bill for legaliging the sale, of .game; observed,, that he ought, chid nothing more- than „retnsWe. lair 110tIbt‘wwlisitti:miitit h.i64.,
perhaps, to apologize to their Lordship for not- moving for existed as to the Ccithillo4 I,:i w..right .iif the...lrd-of ttteas.o44,-
more-information. to be laid before them ; but from the analysis to • that property which was ' now -shackle-II by itiljac satitt."*--
impolitic laws. He agreed with the Neble :and ,Learneit Li,lref4,..
c Ithe laws upon the subject, and from other considerations, their
Lordships would see the- impolicy and injustice of- the law on the 117oolsaek, that it .was rather- unfair that kietitlemenqoP
as it at present stood. He could not help expressing his •
small property should turn almost all their lands into preservit.
strong and decided opinion, • that the happiness, morals,. bathe thottghtthose Gentlemen might preservt• 'lairfair pllfr%
,:
habits, and even existence .of 'the - agricultural 'population lion of amusement without having recourse to laws tentling'to ,
of this country, were involved in the operation of these. laws. the demoralization of the great portion of the -eonununity:'-ife--*
if their Lordships would look into the state of the law, as-it
.thoUght every man entitled to. three things,-first, aright tolcill:,' -.
originally stood, with respect to game, they -could come to no game on his own property ; secondly, •a right' tty transfer that.
other conclusion than that the latter had anciently belonged so
the proprietor of the land ; -and, therefore, the present Bill privilege to others ; and, thirdly, a right-to apply hia. pe,_rsottitlN
pro-property to purchase Stich a. privilege. :. Having, -stated -tlnk -,
thposed to return to
ught the ancient e
some declaratory law, i law. If 'it even were n
oth order wise, opinions, and having never heard any arguinent-suflicierit.
eir' Lordships o to.makto
put an end to those heart-burninga and jealousies which set man - .convince- him- : that 'they were efrontouS,' h 6 certairily shOuld•
support the present Bill, or any measure. which, might htive'ihei.
against man, and despoiled the lair surface of the land. Ile
c # ect of altering the Present system ot,•Gaine I.ao
the, opinion of Lord Kenyon, who stated the opinion. of Coke • Lord DA RNLEI. .. 7 . -!-- '-'-:i ,`•
might refer to the authority' of Lord Coke on this subject, with. '
expl '. ' : - - •,' -- -. : ' -
their Lordshipi then di ained.
vided.on the amendment. - 7: .-
upon an action of troves, in which Lord Kenyon said, that if
• Contents . - - ::. , f.:o - • ' ..
the former were not good law. they knew where to-apply for
-.-. 23
better ! that is, meaning that they might move fora new trial
at law. The preamble of the Statute of Henry VII, stated, as The Bill w ',Majority - - - ---15 ::
as- accordingly • rejected,.' and their ,LOrdithipa'ad=l'
its foundation, that persons. with small livings were' in the . Not contents '- . - - ..
Mourned at Nine o'clock.
l
habit of destroying game, to the great injury of the sports of' -
persons of property,- and the destruction of their interests, It -
game ought not to he the property of the possessor
was rather impossible, he thought, after these authorities, to
multiplied
to the disadvantage of the
that some measure was
conceived
contend, that
of the freehold. But in proportion tothe alienation of land; it
small appeasedthat
proprietorsla oaf
:tor a
nd e m
necessary to mitigate this evil, if it were imPotssible*torernetly it.
By lutehxecexdisetid ronigln the
a 7 rightsallth f
eoPerBnal property of the country
was .enjoyirig the luxUry 'of game.
fixed, and,suLli anio: le7ireveete,iothnop,reomduiscceldlieorns
If their Lordships should allow the fiill to go into a Committee,
he trusted he would be able to convince them that, within ..no
very long period after its having passed into a law, the virlae of
g declared property,
otthceoinzritaiteredi
agtwhaahelwlmoehli:n;a7dri:s,pslroedeffvtt'lr ieneoecil,o'lillwneleear
vnerrd;rcso,nttlritr
et/ tbsibeio
an at of
property cif
which was riot 1 40 muttons aterl7
dish one i tat toprrilelnia:stynteht.eamninNau.we. 4 nWtarsysn
mg a year,
the law, as it now stood, declarer that the 0 ners of that property
cannot legally have in their poasesition a hare or
ty
criminal, to whichno
a partridge. It
MO a notorious fact, that the average of Persons convicted fee
poaching was not less than between eleven_ and tit'teen huritlred
noceßsary :consequence
a few.years back, used. not to
a year. - When acts were by law rendered
nmmumstlbetuarlipiintactirceanztotifrcarillmy
ea.ttacihneodn-, -leicourtty
With which he was
acquainted, and in which the game was preserved with. peculiar
Nuw:naffi:an,
Ty preserves, :thy-
Poaching;
ncaccure,ptyhemobilti.si
took up as Many
rhasns of the Sessions,i
ar or five ours. .
In tin
days, in consequencvie of
llihve;set.i.'necrrceanaoet
- adjoining county,
•-'l3ort inquiry it
wallthe that step to general crime
utinality and depravity • ,
of manner -Tothe pr -
. _
,ese -
bwruilnc.el stir ffetal ;red St
ruts sti7pnotTcahBinsr: 4114413 rd
nt 'System of
Game Laws he; attributed natal .ot •that warming
,increase ,of
crime. which no person could deny.bad: taken place. ..what,
he should consider a remeay for those evils would ,e,
o first

HOUSE OF COMMONS,
tii
r. JOH NA ON., from the Office. of ,the,Chief Se-..,retarfifk,
Ireland, presentbd papers in compliance with the Order of. tt
House, containing &computation of .the number .of forty.4.Bh4-_
ling freeholders in Ireland.—Laid on the table.
Lord STANLEY presented petitionsfrorn the tn:Wl3,a,nd neigh-
bourhood of Liverpool, against the Liverpool Docks }till:.-.Re..
ferred to.the Committee on, the said Bill. .

PORTABLE GAS, , •
The Portable Gas Bill was read u secoed time, anti rs:i!. to si
Committee up stairs. -
General GASCOYNE:presented. pctitiop,from. „Nfanchester..
in favour of the Liverpool and Manchester
ferred to the Committee on the said Bill. -
SWRONALIi FERGuSON presented petiticrn from the,Sea.
men of the Port of London, praying that sornetftbern might .
be allowed to give evidence before the Com rnittee opon e:C9ro-
hination Laws. They stated that, they were for
amicable adjustment of ;he differences betweat,them:and
Mitsters.-,-Iteferredlollie said ConaMittee• .. • '
The Honourable Al EltnAn. also presented a, petition from, --
a Parish in the County of Fife, praying that-an, inquiry
be instituted into the case of. Robert .G0ur1u,..,--Laid oat 34
table.
Sir M. W. litimEx ,presented a petitiNUNAtmattho
tants of Newcastle-upon-Tyne, in favotir of the Bill reJadVii,~G
Cruelty:to Ataituals.— Laid on she le. ' ; 4
COM.BI N A TION .YAWS, y •t,
Mr. I-ICEHOUSE presented. a,poution from . the: kpqrative
Sawyers -of:London and Westminster, prayin&tsOF atmirica
before the Committee on the Combination Laws.
A similar voitis,n was presented frort the JoktrosirikoV;34.
stAkiers. pf
_London.
Alderman.Tu Qat Rs° rr..preeented wtition from cer-
tain Sawyers and Shipwrights of the River Thames, complain-