The Sun.
London, England, 1849-07-20 00:00:00

IMPERIAL PARLIAMEN T.

HOUSE OF LORDS, July 19.
STATE OF THE STEAM NAVY.
Earl TALBOT, in moving for returns relative to the
state of the navy, called the attention of their Lord-
ships to the correspondence which had recently ap-
peared in the newspapers and bad taken place between
Admiral Napier and the Duke of Portland, in which
that gallant officer enters into the question of the
efficiency of the steam navy of this country. He dal
not wish to go into the merits of that correspondence,
but, as a question of so much importance had bean
raised, he was anxious to sfford the Government an op-
portunity of setting it at rest by stating whether the
steam navy of the country is, or is not, sufficient for the
service of the country. The gallant Admiral stated that
there are three steam-frigates in the English navy; and
that there are twenty frigates of that description in the
French navy; but he did net think the gallant Admiral
adduced any strong proof in support of that assertion.
The gabaet Admiral stated in the most positive terms
that wo had only three vessels carrying guns on the main-
deck propelled by steam. On looking at the Nary List
he found that the gallant Admiral bed altogether omitted
one class of ships, namely, the screw ships, which would
prove of very great efficiency and use; so much so, that
he had little doubt that in the course of a few years the
screw system would be applied to all sailing vessels, and
then we should no longer have paddle-wheel vessels
going into action with guns on their main deck. He
(Earl Talbot) should not have mooted this question, had
it not been passed over in the other House, where the
Admiralty was more immediately represented than in
their Lordships' House, and whero it could have
been more properly discussed. But deeming it of great
importance, ho had drawn up a list of returns, which he
had submitted to the Board of Admiralty, and to which
he had received the assent of that Board ; but, on re-
consideration he had thought it advisable to move only
the two first, in order that the others might hereafter be
somewhat modified. The returns for which he now
moved wero

" 1. Number and description of each war-steamer in
commission, showing tonnage, horse-power, and arma-
ment, quantity of coal each is capable of carrying under
hatches, consumption of coal per diem when under full
steam, distinguiihing screw from paddle-wheel ships.
" 2. Similar return of war-steamers either advanced, in
ordinary, or under repair."

if these returns should be made, their Lordships would
possess an official record, showing the extent of the steam
force of the country. He believed that a vast waste of the
public money had taken place in the construction of
steamers, principally owing to the want of a scientific
board of construction, to whom the construction of vessels
might be re tared. Such a board would be able to judge,
not only as to the form of the vessel, but as to the adap-
tation of their machinery, end all the other points con-
nected with their construction. Hitherto there had been
no harmony between the constructor of the ship and the
maker of the engine, and the consequence was that a
great number of alterations had taken place at an enor•
mous expense. He would not trouble their L 'rdships
with the names of the ships which had been so mis-
managed, because it wculd occupy too much time;
but he could not help referring to one ship which the
gallant Admiral had constructed. The Sidon was
by no means a perfect ship; and, with all respect for
the gallant Admiral, he should have been surprised
if he could have been the means of constructing a perfect
man of war. He had been told that the Sidon was ex-
cessively cranky, and that the least thing made her heel
over in the most extraordinary way. In the returns
which he intended to move for at a future day would 13,3
included the merchant steamers which could be made
available for a case of emergency. He believed that in
the contracts entered into with the large steam compa-
nies, who received grants for carrying the mails, a clause
was inserted compelling the proprietors to construct
their vessels in such a way as to be able, in case of ne-
cessity, to carry heavy ordnance. Ho thought that
would be a very useful return to lay before the House.
The Gallant Admiral stated that be had seen the French
steamers, and made a report to the Admiralty on that
subject. It was his (Earl Talbot's) intention to move for
a copy of that report, in order that their Lordships and
the country might be able to judge of the extent of the
French force. He was far from wishing to create any-
thing like jealousy between the two countries; but ho
thought no one could deny, considering the insular posi-
tion of this country, that she was entitled to have a force
at least equally efficient with that of France, He held
in his hand a statem( nt of the ships in commission in the
English and French navies, taken from our own Navy
List, and from the Journal de la Marine in France, and
the statement of the President of the French Republic,
The following was tl:e result:—

LINE OF BATTLE SHIPS IN COMMISSION.
ENGLISH. FRENCH.
No. Gun:. 1 No. Guns.
.12
Fligates.
382 1 7
CorvLttes.
293 1 17 .
300 1 21 .

9 ...

13

61 Totals
STEAM
First Clas,,, above
No. Horse-pr.
26
Two of which, from 800 to
560 horse-pr. carry guns
on main-deck.

438

55 Totals
NAv Y.

220 horse-power.
• --

From 200 horse-p
No. Horse pr.
43

No. Horse pr.
22
Tcn of which, from 600 to
450 horse-pr. carry guns
on main-deck.
,over downwards.

Horse-pr.
36

69 Totals 15,071 15S Totals
Screw Steamer:.
No. Horse-pr. l No. Horse-pr.
9
RESERVED FORCE Nt.T IN COMMISSION.
Lino of Battle Ships.
5 ready for commission. President of French
20 advanced. I Repub. says there
are

Frigates and Corvet
11 (but several advanced)
STEAM RESERVE.
Ready.
Horse-pr.
6 Screw-vessels... 2,320
27 Paddle-steamers 6,688
Nearly
Horse•pr.
4 Screw-vcssels... 1,520
6 Paddle-steamers 2,150

Steam-frigates - 10

)loady.

43 Total ~. 12,678

Corvettes
Small vessels

Totals

Ho believed that statement to bens nearly accurate 50
possible, and was perfectly certain that this country
possessed a steam force sufficient to cope with any
that
it might meet. He trusted, however, that in future
means would be taken to correct the evils complained of,
and that our steamers would no longer be in any case
the laughingestock of the world ; for this country Pet' •
sessed every facility for buildieg the finest steamers in
the world, and equipping them in a proper wanner.
Whilst on the subject of naval matters, he should like
to obtain a return of the number of classes into which
ships are divided ? Ti'e present system was produc-
tive of the greatest possible confusion. For instance, if
one ship was disabled, or lost a particular spar, there
was sometimes considerable difficulty in procuring
another, and the consequence was, great delay in ths
public service. This arose from a want of classifica-
tion. A maximum ought to be established, showing
what a fiest-rate ought to be—her number of
guns, and the amount of her tonnage. The same
ought to be done ve.th respect to the other classes.
The navy would be much more efficient, if re-
duced to five or six elssses ; for then the apses of one
class world be a substitute for those of a different class,
according to the size of the vessel. The Noble Earl then
adverted to the circular issued to the dockyards by Mr.
Ward, the late Secretary to the Admiralty, relative to
the system of education to be pursued there. He (Earl
Talbot) thought the present system capable of groat
improvement, and believed that nothing had been more
detrimental to the service than the abolition of the School
of Naval Architecture. At a future day he intended to
move for a return of the number of m, n discharged from
the dockyard since February, 1847. Tin. same systeett
was now going on which obtained in 1832 and 1333, end
which he considered the very reverse of economical.
Having made those remtrks, he would only say in con-
c'usion, that he felt perfectly confident that our steam'
navy if called upon would be able to maintain the chae
racier of the country. Although France might pow",
greater facilities than formerly for the transport et
troops, it :.hould be remembered that the means of re'
slating them had been equally facilitated. It certainly
behoved this country to be watchful, but he had no fear
of the result, particularly as he trusted our steam boate
would shortly be placed on a proper and more efficient
footing. He (mild not sit down without reminding the
Government of certain
.powera and inventions which
would secure the country not only against all the
steamers of France but of Europe; and he thought the.)
were very remiss in not securing them for the benefit or
the country. The Noble Earl concluded by moving for
the two returns above given.
The Earl of MINTO did not intend to follow the Noble
Earl through his observations on the subject of the steal
navy. Had ho been aware of the nature of the return'
required by the Noble Earl, he would have obtained such
Laura:teflon tom the Admiralty as would have enabled
him to give a more satisfactory answer than he now bad
it in his power to do. He perfectly agreed with the Noble
Earl in the belief that whenever the state of the n 24
might be looked into it would afford the most entire sr'
tisfection and security to the country. So far as his own
knowledge of the navy went, it certainly was of a WO
better description than might be inferred from certain
remarks which had been made, and ho saw nothing in.
them deserving the designation of the " laughing stock
of the world." Wi.h regard to the motives of the Noble
Earl in moving for the return to counteract the repro'
sentations which had proceeded from a very distinguisbea
and gallant officer, he (the Earl of Minto) was sorry to
s.iy he had not had sufficient leisure to enable him to
look into that correspondecce; but he might be per-
mitted to express his regret *at an officer of rank and
standing of the gallant Admiral theuld have thought it
advisable to carry on a cerrpespondenes and controversy
of that nature.—(Hear, hear.) It could be attended With
no public advantage whatever, might prove very detri-
mental to the public service, and was a practice which
ought to be us much as possible discountenanced. 0°
understood there was no objection to the two first re-
turns, and, therefore, woeld agree to them. He trustee/
however, that before the Noble Eatl moved for the re'
maining returns he would give sufficient notice, in order
that he (the Earl of Minto) might have the opportunity
of communicating with the Admiralty on the subject;
The returns were then ordered.

SEWERS ACTS AMENDMENT BILL.
On the motion of the Earl of ST. GERMANS, thia
Bill went through Committee.
SEQUESTRATORS' REMEDIES BILL.
This Bill was read a third time, on the motion of the
Earl of HARROWBY, and was passed.
Their Lordships then adjourned.