The Sun.
London, England, 1849-02-17 00:00:00

EVEN ING,

assist the people of Ireland, because they had been mis-
governed for centuries. He admitted that public feelieg
m this country was opposed to the making of grants to
Ireland. England was exasperated, and justly so, at the
manner in which our assistance had been received.
Such language as " Take back your dirty money" could
not fail to sink deeply into the hearts of the people of
this country. He did not make his proposal for the
purpose of relieving the Irish landlords from the per-
formance of their just duties ; and no doubt
Ireland, as a whole, could repay our advances.
. A remarkable circular had recently been issued by the
Archbishop of Tustin to the people of Ireland, in which
, he called upon them in the midst of their distress to sub-
scribe money—for what did the House suppose ? Why,
to relieve the Pope from his present pecuniary difficul •
ties.—(A laugh). Now, he thought it might be all very
right fur Irishmen so to act, but then England ought
not to be made to pay for it. He thought his pro-
posal deserved the support of the House. . 11,
thought that her Majesty's Government would ac-
cede to it ; as, from the speech of the Noble Lord, he
gathered that he had some measure in contemplation by
which the property of Ireland at large should be made
to provide for the local distress of Ireland. He
trusted that Ireland would have the benefit of such a
measure, and that she would be placed in all respects
upon an equal footing with England. He hoped to
see the time when Ireland should enjoy every privilege
which we enjoyed ourselves. They were our fellow-
countrymen, and we ought to relieve them. He believed
that his proposal was one which combined humanity
with the requirements of the case, and in that conviction
he had brought it forward. The Noble Lord concluded
by moving, " That the 50,000/. to be issued out of the
' Consolidated Fund, for the purpose of affording relief to
certain distressed poor-law unions in Ireland, be ad-
vanced by way of loan, to be paid by means of a rate to
be levied on the whole of the unions in Ireland, except
the unions receiving such relief."
The Earl of ARUNDEL and SURREY would re-
mind the Noble Lord (Lord Dudley Stuart) wheti be
urged an objection to the Archbishop of Tuam's letter,
that the Pope had contributed money for the relief of
Ireland, and ho would further remind the Noble Lord
that his own advances for the benefit of Poland had not
escaped censure.—(A laugh.)
Lord DUDLEY STUART—I wish I could get' that
money back again.—(Laughter.)
Mr. BANKES wished briefly to state his reasons for
the vote he intended to give, because he had beard an ac-
cusation made by the Hon. Member for Limerick of
murder against those who voted in the same way, and be-
cause he had also heard something from the Chancellor
of the Exchequer that seemed to justify that accusation.
He and those Hon. Members who acted with him were
perfectly ready to accede to this vote if, the Government
had acceded to their amendment, stating that it was
given under peculiar circumstances, and binding the
House to that being the last vote of the kind. He could
not, however, vote for the !amendment now proposed by
his Noble Friend, because he considered it & false
pretence to speak of this as a loan, and that it was,
in fact, a grant which could never be repaid. He
could not agree with the Chancellor of the Exchequer,
when he said, that if the people of Ireland died be-
cause this grant was refused, the Government had
done their duty. He must deny that they had
done their duty. They had laid before the House state-
' merits of the distressed state of some parts of Ireland
which were known to them in October last, and in De-
cember was made that communication of Captain Ha-
milton, which stated that the people were starving.; and
yet Parliament was not called together, nor did the
Speech from the Throne commence with any notification
of an exigency of this nature.
Lord J. RUSSELL saidalthe resolution to which the
Hon. Member had just referred had contained a censure
on the Government for not doing that which no 'Other
Government had done, the present GOvernment having
done what previous Governments had done under simi-
lar circumstances, and no censure having ever been cast
upon those Governments. Of course, it was impossible
for them to consent to a vote of censure under such cir-
cumstances. He could not agree to the amendment of
his Noble Friend (Lord Dudley Stuart), because the
Government were of opinion that the present 50,0001.
ought to be given as a grant. The Hon. Gentleman
(Mr. Barflies) said that Parliament ought to have been
called together in November, but both himself and his
Right Honourable Friend (the Chancellor of the Ex-
chequer) had stated at the end of last August :that if
any circumstances of an extraordinary nature should
arise during the recess, they would grant relief in those
cases. The letter of Captain Hamilton was dated ou
the 22d of January, and it did not reach the Government
until the month of February. While he could not agree
with his Noble Friend that the 50,0001. ought to be the
subject of a special rate in Ireland, still at a future time
it would be for the consideration of the Government and
of that House whether such sums of money ought not to
be charged upon some Irish fund.—(Hear.) •
Sir W. BARRON warned the House that out of 130
unions in Ireland they would not have ten in a state to
support their poor if they persisted in the taxation of
districts which had nothing to do with the poor for whom
the money was destined.
Mr. REYNOLDS felt that his country had been gra-
tuitously insulted by Hon. Members who had opposed
this grant. He had heard the frigid and frozen political
economy of the Hon. Member for Montrose—a political
economy so frozen that it required a West Indian
climate to thaw it.—(Laughter.) That Hon. Member
had great compassion for the blacks, but none at all for
the Irish, to whom he talked of self-reliance. What he
(Mr. Reynolds) complained of was, that the present grant
was too small.—(A laugh.) It was a drop in the ocean,
and was only the forerunner of other grants.—(A laugh.)
Mr. PIGOTT rose to support the amendment of the
Noble Lord the Member for Marylebone, because he
believed, that while it relieved the starving people of
those unions in Ireland, it did justice to the people of
England. The people of this country were daily be-
coming more impatient of taxation, impatient of the
state of government in Ireland; there you had the sus-
pension-of the Habeas Corpus, the large army, and an
immense police force, and were now trying an experi-
ment of feeding the people by grants from the Consoli-
dated Fund, or in other words, from the pockets of the
industrious people of England. Mr. Pigott was opposed
to these continued grants as unjust towards this country.
At the same time, he would not be a party to with-
holding 50,0001. as a loan, and on that account he should
support the amendment of the Noble Lord, hoping that
her Majesty's Government would not long allow Ire-
land to remain in such a deplorable state.
The House then divided, when there appeared—
For the amendment ... ---
9
Against it 151'
Majority ••• •• ••• • —l4B
Another division then took place on the main question;
the numbers were— _ _ _

For the resolution 128
Against it 39
Maj ority ••• ••• —B9
The Inland Revenue Bill was read a third time and
passed.
The Elections and Polling (Ireland) Bill and the Elec •
tive Franchise (Ireland) Bill were brought in and read a
first time.

IRISH DEBT.
On the motion of Mr. MACGREGOR, the following
returns were ordered:— •

Of the number and amount of loans contracted on account
of Ireland from the period of the union until the Exchequer
of Ireland was united with that of Great Britain in the
year 1817 :
Of the amount (if any) which has been paid off, out of the
Irish revenue of the Irish debt due at the union, and of the
Irish debt which accrued afterwards, down to the union of
the Irish and British Exchequers:
Of the amount (if any) et the said debts which has been
paid from the Consolidated Fund since the union until the
year 1817 :
Of the total amount of funded and unfunded Irish debt,
including floating Exchequer-bills, which was funded iu
England from the date of the union until the union of the
wo Exchequers in 1817 :
Of the amount of loans contracted on account of Ireland
from the union of the two Exchequers in 1817 to the sth day
of January, 1849

--
Of the amount or any) of such loans as has been repaid,
distinguishing the amounts paid (if any) out of the Consoli-
dated revenue, and (if any) out of the revenue levied in
Ireland:

Of the gross revenue levied in Ireland each year, from the
sth day of January, 1818, to the sth iday of January, 1849,
distinguishing the expense of collection, and the other pay 7
ments out of the Irish revenue in its way to the Exchequer :
Of the total gross expenditure of Ireland for each year,
from the sth day of January, 1818, to the sth day of
January, 1849, distinguishing the amounts (if any) of repay-
ments of loans, of reducing the Irish debt (funded in Eng-
land or transferred to Ireland, the civil, military, naval, and
constabulary expenditures and interest paid on Irish debt
funded in England or transferred to Ireland, and which have
been each year paid out of the Consolidated revenue, and out
of the revenues collected in Ireland :
Of the amount (if any) which has been redeemed of the
Irish debt from the date of the union to the sth day of
January, 1849, distinguishing payments out of the Consoli-
dated Fund and out of the revenue levied in Ireland :
Of the total amount which remains unredeemed of the
Irish debt funded in England from the union to the sth day
of January, 1849:
Of the amount of Irish debt funded In England on the sth
day of January, 1849, and amount of interest payable
thereon out of the Consolidated Fund :
And, of the amount of Irish debt funded in Ireland on the
sth day of January, 1849, and the sources from which the
interest due thereon is paid.
The House adjourned at 20 minutes after Two o'clock
to Monday.

MR. BERKE'S " ANECDOTES OP THE ARISTO-
CRACY."—Among the many noble and distinguished families
whose archives\have furnished materials for this interesting
work are the following :—Percy, Vere, Hamilton, Russell,
Audley, Berkeley, Manners, Maxwell, Howard, Pelham,
Campbell, Pierrepoint, Norton, Musgrave, Primrose, Chandos,
Shirley, Hastings, Thynne, Hay, Cecil, King, Byron, Fraser,
Cheney, Butler, Churchill, Lennox, Stanley, Gunning, Rad-
clyffe, St. Leger, Gordon, Ponsonby, Cameron, Keith, Sey-
mour, Fox, Douglas, Clifford, Brandon, Lyndsay, Knollys,
Mohun, De Courcy, Ashworth, Bowes, Welby, Home, Wal-
pole, Wellesley, Poer, Fitzroy, Bolle, Montgomery, Lyster,
Lvttelton, Egerton, Scott, ihellusson, Hutchinson, Digby,
Ward, Astley,
,Stuart, Crawford, Bruce, Rokeby, Sackville,
Annesley, Lynch, Elwes, Parkyns, Cavendish, Boughton,
Compton Mathew, Villiers, Darrell, Bathurst, Honywood,
Mure, Compton,
Fitzgerald, Dudley, Baird, Drake, Mac-
kensie, &c. &c.
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