The Sun.
London, England, 1822-05-07 00:00:00

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not even take a right measure without destroying all its advan-
tages by the manner in which they carried it intei execUtion.—
With respect to the other measures proposed he conceived_that
they were completely inadequate to their object, as well as defi-
cient in sound policy. It was objectionable in principle to the
highest degree that any attempt should be made on the part of
the Government to raise the price of corn in the market by a sum
of money levied from the people •in the shape of taxes ; and
still more so, when the author of the measure did not himself
seem'to entertain any sanguine expectations of its success.—
To any alteration in the Corn Laws he had a great objection.
That proposed could have no possible effect on the. present
distress, brid must be intended to meet some contingency which
might never occur ; and, if it should occur, the measure would
prove inadequate to its object. Yet their Lordships were called
upon to legislate suddenly upon the means of regulating the.
.subsistence of the country, thus creating the greatest ofall evils,
an -uncertainty in the laws relative to that most interesting sub-
ject. He had the same objection to the new,regulation respect-
ing Country Banks, avhereby Joint Stock Companies would be
formed as in Scotland. His objection lay to legislating on the
spur of the occasion without any possibility of producing pre-
sent relief, to introducing anew system, and affecting the per-
manent interests of the country by the extension of the' Bank
Charter for ten additional years. Was it not most extraordi-
nary that, whilst in all their speeches his Majesty's Ministers
had been arraigning the conduct of the Bank, complaining of
the reduction of its issues, and representing it as one of the
great causes of distress, they should be about committing td
that Corporation for ten years longer the same Controlling power
over the circulation of the country? On a former occasion
the Noble Earl had said that the subject required and should
have the deepest attention on the part of the House, and yet
he now proposed, without any consideration at all, to extend
that very monopolyl The Noble Earl concluded by repeating
that he did not abandon his notice altogether, but suspended it
for the present.
The Earl of LIVERPOOL admitted that, at the time when
the Noble Earl had questioned him on the subject, he had said
that his Majesty's Ministers had no further measures in con-
templation ; but he had only that which was the fact" at that
period. With respect to the measures since introduced; and
now pending in the other House of Parliament, he agreed with
the Noble 'Earl in one point, that neither they, nor any other,
could supply a remedy to the present distresses of agriculture.
But it did not follow that, prospectively, it was impossible
or improper to ameliorate that defective state of law. The
Noble Earl charged Ministers with inconsistency, for having
introduced a measure of reduction, after having aiserted that
the reduction of -the taxes would produce no relief. But had he
(Lord L.) or had any member of his Majesty's Government
ever objected to any reductions which would be consistent
with public faith, and with what was due to the Sinking Fund?
If such reductions could be made, they had the full approba-
tion of Ministers, as desirable to the general interests of the
country, but not as measures of present relief to agricultuie ;
unless indeed there were any branches which bore principally
or exclusiYely upon agriculture. But if, as he contended, it
was true that the general scale of Government taxation bore
less on the agricultural interest than any other, it would expe-'1
rience but little relief from their reduction. He laid an emphasis
on the expression Government taxes, because he knew that
there were others in the shape of the poor rates, which might
bear particularly on agriculture. All the others-bore on the com-
munity at large, and although their diminution would yield ge-
neral relief to the country, the agricultural interest would benefit
but little, because only in common with, and perhaps in a still
smaller ratio than the rest. Was it just to charge his Majesty's
inisters with an indisposition to diminish tire taxes ? What
was the object of the reduction of the Five per Cents. but a
reduction of taxation pro tonto :1 And when that measure had
been introduced, had it not been announced as the forerunner
of others calculated to reduce the National Debt in a manner
consistent with public faith ? The Noble Earl objected to the
measure in progress through the other House, relative to what
be called. Dead Money; but, be (Lord Liverpool) would be
ready when the question should be before thelrouse, to go into
the most minute discussion, and to prove that it' was not only
no violation of the principle of the Sinking Fund, but that it
would not have the effect of retarding the liquidation of the
National Debt one single hour. It was a different arrange-
ment, advantageous to the country by the present relief which
it would produce, and not disadvantageous, as imposing no
burthen on posterity. He'said this with a reference to the pro-
priety of keeping up the Sinking Fund. He understood per-
fectly well those Noble Lords who said, let us get rid of the
Sinking Fund and make it a foundation for 'relief, but he was
of opinion that the loss to the country would far surpass the
relief. Thinking it, therefore, necessary to maintain a Sinking
Fund, he felt convinced that‘the proposed measure would prove
the cheapest and most convenient mode of affording relief, con-
sistently with its existence. He was surprised at the objections
which the Noble Earl had urged against the measure relative
to the general circulation of the country ; for if they applied
to the first part, they could hardly stand good against the se-
cond ; and if they stood against the second, they were not ap-
plicable to the first. By law as it now stood, the. Bank had a
complete monopoly over all other banks, except those which
did not consist of more than six partners. This monopoly was
founded on a contract which could not be broken, except on
grounds of gross misconduct. It was thought advantageous
and proper to the country at large, within a certain distance
from the metropolis, to allow the unrestrained faulty of
banking. This was obtained, on the condition that the mo-
nopoly of the Bank in the metropolis should be extended
from 1833 to 1843. Ire was ready to admit that he would
have preferred procuring the advantage of banking to the coun-
try without that concession ; but that was not in his power, nor
in that of Parliament itself. The Bank might have kept them
to the terms of the Charter till 1833 ; the only question to be
decided, therefore, was, whether the benefit obtained was not
equal to the concession which had-been made ? Joint Stock
Companies might certainly be formed in the country in conse-
quence of the proposed arrangement, but that was not the con-
sideration which had actuated his Majesty's Ministers. The
object which they had in view was the destruction of that mo-
nopoly which the Bank had so long enjoyed. It also became
an important question whether the law permitting the issuing of
Bank-notes, which was to expire in three years, should be con-
tinued or not ? The measure was similar to that which had been
adopted last year in Ireland, for opening a free competition in
the general system of banking; a system which had so long
and so beneficially existed in Scotland, that when the greatest
crash took place in England, the Scotch Banks rode safely
through the storm, and scarcely one bankruptcy had ever taken
place amongst the Scottish Joint Stock Companies. As to the
measure itself, it could only be adopted, he should repeat, with
the consent of the Bank, who had a veto upon it, and the only
question was, whether the relaxation of the monopoly of that
Corporation over the country was not worth its continuance for
ten additional years in the metropolis ?
The Marquis of LANSDOWN only rose to advert to'one
topic, on which he intended to make a motion, which he had
no doubt the Noble Earl opposite would not oppose. He
agreed with that Noble Earl, that the question was one of
amount and of value. The existing contract with the Bank
imposed a restriction on free banking ; it became necessary to
re-purchase the right thus restricted, and the consideration was,
whether a greater price had been given than the value of the
object. The same measure had been adopted last year, at his
own pressing solicitations, with respect to Ireland, where it
had done, and would do, much good ; but it did not follow
that it would have the same importance and results in a coun-
try where capital abounded. He did not believe that the Bank
of England would issue one note more or less for the extension
which was to be granted, and it might be made a question
whether, it would be wise to renew its monopoly in the metro-
polis for ten years, at no other price than the freedom of bank-
ing in the country, instead of the great sacrifices which used to
be required from that establishment for renewals of its charter,
either in the shape of a sum which would go at once to the re-
lief of the country; or in that of a loan on better terms than
could have otherwise been obtained. In. order to enable the
House to form a just opinion on the subject, he should move
for a copy of the Correspondence which had taken place be-
tween his Majesty's Government and the Governor and Com-
pany of the Bank of England, relative to the extension of their
Charter.

Earl GREY, in explanation, maintained that Country
Bankers were at present in no want' of any measure like that
proposed, their credit being fully and firmly established. As
to the Bank of England, he would only say that it was driving
a most hard and extravagant bargain with a weak and depen-
dant 'A dm imstration.

The Earl of LIVERPOOL also in explanatiOn stated, that
a geneial impression prevailed, that if the Act which per-
mitted the issuing of one pound notes were allowed to expire at
the end of three years, the circulation would be much reduced,
.and.the public distress much_ augmented. It was out of this
consideration that the present measure had arisen. Whether

TUESDAY, MAY 7, 1822.

the extension was worth the additional ten - years was the only
question.'

Lord KING agreed with his Noble Friend (Earl Grey) that
the whole was an ..extravagant bargain, and that high terms
were demanded by the Bank.. He.then contended, that if the
Poor Rates chiefly affected the Agricultural Interest, they were
themselves affected and angniented by the increase of the NaL
tional Debt. , _

• Lord SUFFIELDread some papers giving a comparative
view of the amount of the Poor Rates and- of that of the Na-
tional Debt during several-years, in order to skew how the
former were acted upon and augmented by the latter.
The Earl of LIVERPOOL wished that Noble Lord would
extend his comparative view to the amount of the National
Debt and of the Poor Rates during the twolast years.
Lord HOLLAND should thank the Noble Earl to tell him
how it came to pass that money taken from the community to
pay the rich did not impoverish them, whilst that taken to pay
the poor did ?-:-(A laugh). -
The motion was' then agreed to, and the House adjourned.