The Sun.
London, England, 1849-02-08 00:00:00

LATES IN THE COLONIES.

Sir R. H. INGLIS in the course of the Last session of
Parliament had given notice that early in the present
session he should move for a copy of the correspondence
which had passed between the Lord-Lieutenant of Ire-
land and Earl Grey, Secretary for the Colonies,
respecting the rank of the Roman Catholic Prelates
in the colonies of Great Britain. The motion
to which he had to call the attention of the
House wits that a humble address be presented to her
Majesty, praying that copies of the correspondence
which had passed between the Lord-Lieutenant of Ire-
land and Earl Grey, the Secretary for the Colonies
should be laid on the table of that House. Whether the
matter deserved regret, or not he wished to speak with
the greatest possible respect of the Earl of Clarendon,
but regret he could not help for that nobleman
having spoken in a way which he, at least, conceived to
be most ucadvisable. He wished to speak of the Earl
of Clarendon with the utmost respect—a respect which ho
had well earned by his conduct in Ireland, but yet not-
es ithstanding his great respect for that high functionary
he could not but say that he was totally at a loss
to understand on what principles he had acted
in the matter which he had brought under the
consideration of the House. It was well under-
stood that the Roman Catholic prelates in Ireland
were, according to the Act of Parliament, to take rank
next after the prelates of the same denomination in the
Protestant Church. This he could well understand, but
on what grounds the Lord-Lieutenant had in-
terfered on e the subject of persons not at all
under his jurisdiction he could not comprehend.
So far from that, the word bishop was never mentioned
in the course of the whole Act. It was most remarkable
that there should be such a stretch of imagination as to
assume that there was oue single word in that Act of
Parliament in which such an allegation was found.—
(Hear, hear.) The fact was, that the Lord-Lieutenant
and the Noble Lord the Secretary for the Colonies
had never read one word of this Act of Parliament, or
had forgot if they had. They assume that the Gazette
' had followed the Act of Parliament. The Gazette did
announce that certain persons should be commissioners
in a certain order, but it did not imply that the persons
so named should take rank according to the order in
which their names appeared. These matters must be
considered matters which a wise man would not much
care about, viz., questions of precedence. In point of
tact, a man did not take rank in civil life according to
his mere position in the rate-book. The real au-
thority which a man derived was the rank which
he derived from his principles, his talents,
end his virtues. His (Sir R. Inglis's) objection
was not even to the person recognised as an Archbishop
or Bishop of the Church of Rome having such a rank
as her own communion might be willing to concede to
them ; his complaint was, that the Lord-Lieutenant of
Ireland had suggested, and the Secretary of the Colonial
Department had adopted, the principle of transfer-
ring from the Queen what property belonged to her
Majesty as the fountain of honour, but which had no
existence whatever in the dispatch of the Secretary of
State. The Secretary of State did not invoke her
Majesty's aid on the occasion. He (Sir Robert Inglis)
felt in the presence of the Attorney and Solicitor-
Goner al, that even between herself, if her sign
manual had been prefixed to any order of the
kind, he doubted whether the Queen herself
could have given the precedence which was now
claimed by the Secretary of State. lie believed no rank
could be assigned by the Queen to the disparagement of
the rank assigned to an individul by an Act of Parlia-
ment or by long usage. It was beyond the competence
of the Crown to create an order, for example, between a
Viscount and an Earl. If that was so, it was as much
without the competence of the Crown to create an order
which should take precedence between a Bishop of our
Church and a Viscount. And that which induced him
most especially to cell the attention of the House
to this subject was, that this recognition of
authority at this time was a recognition of autho-
rity which this country had for three centuries
invariably repudiated and disowned. It was the recog-
nition of authority in the see of Rome of placing in her
Majesty's dominions without her Majesty's authority
a class of individuals in matters of pre-
cedence above that of the Queen's own subjects.
lie contended that the Imperial Crown of England being
held by a communicant of the Protestant Church, that
wherever her Majesty exercisied her dominion, that
Church must be considered as established.—(Hear,
eo
hear. Ile contended also that the efforts of all
gahntd to hebe thought a
miniature
tor thate r
ought to be directed not for emigration, but for colo-
nization,
hear.)
ishco
lonell
and that those who went out to those Colonies
ought
ought to enjoy the same privileges with respect
to spiritual consolation which
they would
have
done if they had been at home. It appeared
s
to him to be an unwarrantable
Lieutenant of Irelando makeutfiegstion of the Lord
proposition
done to the Noble Earl the Colonist SecreaeYlle wished
had
to know whether the Government adopted the letter or
not; if they did adopt the letter and said it was not the
tfct of Lord Grey, but that of the Cabinet, then
he wished to know whether they had her Majesty's
sanction for it. If, on the other hand, they told
him that there was no such dispatch from the
Lord-Lieutenant of Ireland to Earl Grey, then
he ventured to think whatever blame might be
removed from the Lord-Lieutenant of Ireland,
was cast with double force upon the Noble Earl
the Secretary of State for the Colonies. From
the communications be had received he believed
great blame attached to the Noble Earl ; he had thrown
new elements into the colonies, and especially
at Sydney, for there he had carried out his object
at th expense of one of the greatest bishops that had
ever been sent out to the colonies. The Hon. Baronet
concluded by moving an humble address to her Majesty,
for a copy of the letter or memorial of the Lord Lieu-
tenant of Ireland to Earl Grey on the subject of the
rank of persons mentioned as Prelates of the Roman
Catholic Church in Ireland, to which communication the
Earl Grey adverted in his Circular De patch of the 20th
day of November, 1847.
Mr. BANKS seconded the motion.
Lord J. RUSSELL was understood to say that there
was nothing in the dispatch appertaining to the rank to
be held by Roman Catholic archbishops •
that, th •
therefore,
no geed could result from
agreeing to
such a memorial
The Bequest memorial, because no return could be made io it.
Act certainly did not give title
to
any
to Roman Catholic Prelates, but the Archbishops and
s
Bishops, were generally
designated by the titles of
" Most Reverend," "Right Re vered " and "Your
Grace." Lord Grey thought that
what was done
in Ireland, might very properly be followed in the
colonies. The matter, however, did not appear to him
to be a question of any great importance, and he could
cot conceive that there was any neceseity for the House
to take any proceedings with reference to it —Uzi
ear,

hear.) The only reply he could give, therefore, lo the
Hon. Member for Ox.tord was, that no such letter existed
in the Colcnial-(,ffice. •
_ .

Mr. GOULBURN said it was complained that
the Roman Catholic Church had placed an Arch-
bishop where the Protestant Church had only a bishop.
—(lean) The consequence of the letter referred to
was to give a priority to the Roman Catholics, instead of
the Protestant Church; and it was further complained
that the Legislature had laid down a rule which sanc-
tioned such aproceeding.

Mr. JOHN O'CONNELL said that it was surprising
that the Hon. Baronet, who evidently recognised
the position of the several sects in Scotland, and
who had distinctly stated that the Bishops
should be addressed by the titles of the several sees,
which they held should feel any difficulty in giving to
the Roman Catholic bishops of Ireland the dignity to
which they were especially entitled. Ile would beg to
assure the House that the Roman Catholic prelates felt
it to be no compliment to be addressed after the
name of the sfie over which they preside.
Archbishop Murray, like many of his countrymen,
looked very lightly, he could assure the House, upon
the privilege of being called Archbishop Murray of
Dublin, and the claims of the Roman Catholic Bishopi
in the Colonies rested on too strong grounds
to be denied. He regretted that the Noble
Lord at the head of the Treasury bad thrown any slight
upon them for according to a bull of Pius IX.; those
prelates only asked for precedence according to their
appointment, and it did seem strange to him that if the
primate of this country had power to appoint bishops in
the colonies, the head of the Roman Church should be
denied the privilege of appointing his own suffragans in
Ireland. The Roman Catholic was the ancient Church,
and therefore they who differed from her were the
Dissenters.
Lord J. RUSSELL said that the Hon. Gentleman
had quite misunderstood him, for he had said just the
reverse. He had always acknowledged the claims of the
ancient Roman Catholic Church, and was very far
from speaking of its members as Disseaters.
Mr. PLUMPTRE wished to ask the Noble Lord
whether he was right in the apprehension that the
Roman Catholic Bishop at Sidney took precedence of
the Bishop who was appointed by the Anglican Church?
A complaint had already been made respecting this in-
fraction of the rights of the Church, especially as it was
understood to have taken place with his Lordship's
sanction.

Lord J. RUSSELL did not think that countenance to
any such report had emanated from him. He had in
fact never said anything respecting precedence between
the Protestant and Roman Catholic Bishops at Sidney.
A complaint had been made through the proper
officials certainly, and the dress which the Roman
Catholic Archbishop wore had been shown him, but the
only answer which he could make was that he
did not at all know he could interfere with the kind. Of
dress which the Roman Catholic Archbishop chose to
wear in his own church.

Sir R. INGLIS wished, in the first instance, to set
himself right with the Hon. Member near him (Mr. J.
O'Connell). He had stated that there was no word in
the Act of Parliament which justified the application of
the word " person" as au enfranchisement from its
penalties ; but in speaking of the Roman Catholic
hierarchy he never intended to use it in an offensive or
degrading sense. He was only anxious, so far as the
Bishop of Sydney was concerned that the term " Me
tropolitan" should be properly defined. If the answer
to the address was " Nil" he should be satisfied.