The Sun.
London, England, 1849-06-16 00:00:00

THE SUN LONDON, SATURDAY EVENING,

Gentlemen who were qualified to assist the House in 1 is not to be allowed to coma into operation, you then say
coming to a proper decision on this important question, I there is to be no compensation to sufferers in Lower
but who were absent from the House last night. It ap- 1 Canada for rebellion losses.—(Hear, hear.) And what
peered even now, although the debate was exhausted, is the amount of tha'? Why, as one Gentleman said, it
that the House had come to the consideration of this is net that you would fear there being compensation for
subject without the grounds for an accurate considera- rebels, but that there would be compensation for French
tion of it.—(" Divide.") The Noble Lord (Lord J. Canadians.—(Hear, hear.) And I ask you, what will
Russell) told the House that it was not intended under be the feeling among all the French Canadians if they
this Act to compensate rebels, and Lord Elgin (upon are to be told there may be compensation to sufferers in
whose talents and character the 'Hon. Member proceeded Upper Canada, because they are of English descent, but
to pass a warm eulogium) declared that in his opinion there shall be no compensation to sufferers in Lower Ca-
the measure was not intended to compensate rebels. If nada because they are of French descent?—(llear, hear,
these opinions were conclusive as to the intention of the and No, no.) I must ask this House whether that will
Act, and how it would ultimately work, then he would not be the interpretation that will be put upon it in the
agree with those who said this was not an imperial, but province?—(Hear.) Let me again urge upon this House,
a local question. But if it were true, as the Attorney- that we are not now considering, as some gentlemen
General had told the House, that it .was impossible that seem to think, with respect to a Bill in Committee in this
instructions issued to Commissioners should narrow the House, with regard to which we can deal as we please,
scope and intent of .an Act of Parliament, what became You may find some definition which satisfies your own
of the assurance of the Noble Lord that, by the instruc- minds, by which rebels may be excluded, and none but
Lions that would be given, he would rectify any doubts loyal men would have compensation; but, however loge.
that might be entertained on this subject?—(Hear.) nious you may think that definition, however just you
It was most important that they should have the as- may think it, you cannot force it up3n the Assembly in
surance of the Government that no precipitate consent Canada—(Hear, hear)—you cannot persuade them that
should be given to the Act—(Hear)—and, believing that it is a just definition, that it is a definition upon which
a case had been made out for delay, although he did not you can act.—(Hear, hear.) The Right Hon. Gentle-
think the amendment of the Right Hon. Gentleman man alio spoke last said he had the highest respect for
(Mr. Herries) well drawn up or well worded fbr its the unsullied honour of Lord Elgin, and should be sorry
purpose, yet, considering that it did not pledge the Go- to do anything that implied a doubt of it. Lord Elgin
vernment to disallow the Act—(Hear)—and, further, says plainly and publicly that it is not the intention of
that a vote against it would be regarded as an imMedi- this Act to compensate rebels, and that if it had been, he,
ate decision on the part of the Government in favour of as the head of the Government, never would have con-
the Bill, he had made up his mind, although not with- sented to it. I think that if thin amendment were carried
out some difficulty and reluctance, to support the it would be an avowal that you did not believe that de-
amendment.—(Loud cheers.) claration of Lord Elgin—(Bear)—that you put no faith
Lord J. RUSSELL—As I have not addressed the in those words of the Noble Lord ; that you believed it
was a falsehood that he pronounced—(Hear, hear)—and
House since the amendment was moved, and as I only
that li? had no intention of acting upon that declaration.
answered a question last night with respect to the ad-
—(Cries of " Hear, hear," and "No, no !") At all events,
journment, I must ask the House to permit me, not to for my part, believing in the unsullied honour of the
enter upon any lengthened argument of this question, Earl of Elgin,—believing that the Legislative Assembly
which has been already sufficiently examined, but to call and Council of Canada, together with the Earl of Elgin,
attention to two or three points which ought to be borne form a sufficient Legislature for Canada, and that, in the
in mind by the House on going to a division. But before present instance, they have considered the interests of
I state anything with respect to the main question I Canada in such a manner as not to trench upon or impair
think it right to take some notice of allegations which the honour of the Crown of this country—l think the
have been made chiefly by the Hon. Member for Brid-
best way in which I can support the character of the
port (Mr. Cochrane), but also by others, affecting the Earl of Elgin—in which I can support responsible go-
character of persons holding office in Canada. Ido not vernment—in which I can support the due legislative
independence of the Assembly in Canada, is to give my
think it is right that assertions should be made affecting
the character of persons filling those situations, without vote against the amendment of the Right Hon. Gentle-
proof and without any ground for those allegations.— man—(Hear, hear)—as one that would seriously im-
p Hair the connexion between this country and that noble
(Hear, hear.) The Hon. Member for Bridport stated
that Mr. Lafontaine and Mr. Baldwin were persons who province—(ear, hear)—as one that would seriously en-
were notoriously guilty of treason, and that they danger our future relations with every colony in which
were avowed and confessed rebels. Now, with respect to representative institutions are established.—(Cheers.)
Mr. Lafontaine, at the time of the insurrection at Canada The House then divided, when there appeared—
For. Mr. Herries' resolution .... .... 150
he was in this country. It is true that a warrant was
Against it .. - 291
issued against him, but it is also true that he returned
to Canada, and that no proof was ever given of his par-
ticipation in the insurrection and rising.—(Hear.) With
to.
The report of the Committee of Supply was then
respect to Mr. Baldwin, I have never heard of any charge agreed
whatever made against him. The second reading of the Railways Abandonment
Mr. B. COCHRANE.—Was not a reward of 500/ Bill was, after some conversation, postponed till Monday,
The Assaults (Ireland) Bill, and the Ecclesiastical
offered for Mr. Lafontaine ?
Lord JOHN RUSSELL.—No; I never heard of it. Jurisdiction Bill, went through Committee.
Let me observe, further, that the Hon. Gentleman stated andT he report on the Loan Societies Bill was considered
to the House, or wished' to convey the impression, that The consideration
to.
Reliefe consideration of the amendments to the Clergy
lately, for the first time, Mr. Lafontaine and Mr. Bald-
win war© honoured by the confidence of the Queen's mßill was postponed till Monday.
HINDLEY. moved the second reading of the Sun-
Representative in Canada, and that they now hold office day Trading
for the first time. Now, in November, 1842, it appears, 'ir vsnia(A.Myetropolis) Bill.
Bill, from St.
Leenparreds,enstheedrepdeittiethio,n
as
nidn
sft.avAolumr , ofL i
mthee.
by.the London Gazette, that Mr. Lafontaine was ap-
pointed Attorney-General, and that Mr. Baldwin was
B. WALL objected to the Bill being proceeded
appointed Solicitor General at the same time. At that
with house.
xf r
a.
t that late hour (a quarter past 1). He believed
time Lord Stanley was Secretary of State for the Colo-
tuheann. but for the circumstance that the name of the
nits.—(Cheers.) Whatever, then, may have been the
for Salford (Mr. Brotherton), who ought
imputations which the Honourable Gentleman has
to have Memberbeen in bed long ago— (Laughter)—was on the
thought it necessary to produce for the purposes of
back of the Bill, that Hon. Gentleman would not have
the present debate, Lord Stanley must no doubt
allowed it to be pressed at such a period of the evetain.
have been satisfied of the incorrectness and falsehood
of those imputations, and must have been per-
suaded that those men whom he recommended to r. BROTHERTON could not conceive what right
hold the highest offices in Canada were loyal men, to thewithHon. Member had to throw any reflection upon him
whom those offices could safely be entrusted.—(Cheers.) thathereference to this Bill.—(A. laugh.) The fact was
And now with regard to the main question upon which to . had advised his Hon. Friend (Mr. Hindle not
the House has to decide, and upon which I really think and
npeirfstst in moving the second reading at that late hour,
the Right Hon. Gentleman who spoke last has not suffi- dhe had had an opportunity he would have objected
ciently reflected—that question—and I wish to state it toh the Bill being now proceeded with. He (Mr. Bro-
perfectly fairly—is this: there having been passed Bills t erton) would not allow Members to think they could
bully him.—(Latinh ter.)
and Acts for the indemnity of persons who had suffered
rebellion losses in Upper Canada, there has now been Mr. HINDLEY said, he was afraid he must consent
to be bullied, and, under the circumstances, he would
passed an Act for the indemnity of persons in Lower postpone the second reeling.
Canada, and the question is, whether the representative The second reading was accordingly postponed to
of the Crown, having consented to those former Acts, Monday.
and the Ministers of the Crown never having advised the Mr. BAINES obtained leave to bring in a Bill "to
disallowance of those Acts—there is such a difference continuo for a limited period, the Act of last session for
between those Acts and the present Act as to make it charging the maintenance of certain poor persons in
right—and not only right but necessary, on the part of unions in England and Wales upon the common fund, and
the advisers of the Crown, to stop the present Act by a
disallowance. The Right Hon. Gentleman (Sir R. Peel) to make certain amendments in the laws for the relief of
rPreEeeanCdelliindgEe.rLi
nLgHtehhoetphpeodruegv
hat
provisions
eptnhl
see 0
fpt time would
-law
Bill
hlßdeofaebrr
Board
appeared to me to found his argument on the fact that
theat
hffeo afforded Captainn for od'
between the former Acts and the present Act there was
not any essential difference, except that there were more
restrictions in the present Act than in those former Acts.
I listened with attention to the Hon. Member for Buck- were now pursuing the same course their predecessors
inghamshire (Mr. Disraeli) to discover in what manner had taken, and he felt bound to express his disapproba-
tion of their conduct.
he would answer that argument, and how he would show
that the Act now under consideration differed from the The Bill was afterwards brought in and was read a
first time.
former Acts, and that the honour of the Crown was in-
volved in its disallowance. But upon :that point the On the motion of the CHANCELLOR of the EX-
CHEQUER (in the absence of Lord J. Russell) the
Hon. Gentleman made no argument whatever. He following Members were appointed the Select Commit-
gave the House, as an illustration of the evils that Leo on the Exclusion of Strangers :—Sir James Graham,
might result from it, an hereditary history of certain Mr. Disraeli, Mr. Goulburn, Sir George Grey, Mr.
persons who had been guilty of high treason—as if
the purpose of this Act was to confer upon persons who Henley, Sir John Hobhouse, Mr. Hume, Mr. John
O'Connell, and Mr. Bernal,
had been guilty of rebellion in Canada an indemnity for
such rebellion. It may be possible that persons who had Mr. ROEBUCK moved for a Select Committee to in-
been guilty of rebellion may receive compensation under quire into and ascertain the amount of Debts due from
this Act, and so far that may be deemed an argument Foreign Governments and States to the Government
and individuals of this country.—Agreed to.
against the measure; that, however; is the utmost which
can be made of it. But to say that this is
,ein Act pro- The Transportation (Ireland) Bill (which had been
brought down from the House of Lords) was read a
posed expressly for the benefit of those who have been first time, and was ordered to be read a second time on
guilty of rebellion is to confound two things which are Monde
totally and essentially opposed to each other.—(Cheers.) Mr. REYNOLDS said, if he had been aware before
I readily admit that it might be possible for an Act to the question was put that it was for the first reading of
be passed in Canada which it would be necessary for the this Bill he would have opposed the motion.
advisers of the Crown to refuse to sanction and to dis- Sir G. GREY observed, that it was usual to read all
allow. If this had been an Act of compensation to those Bills brought d ,
own from the other House a first time
persons who were sent to Bermuda, for the losses which without discussion, in order that they might be printed
they had sustained in consequence of their having been The Houk adjourned at Twenty Minutes to Two.
so sent to that island, that would have been an Act to
which the Crown could not have given its assent. Ido
not push the responsibility of the Government to the ex-
treme of saying that every Act passed by the Canadian
Legislature ought to be assented to by the Imperial. G-
overnment. But when no positive allegation is made that
these individuals were rebels, I do not feel that I should
be justified in giving advice to the Crown to disallow
this Act, that advice being founded solely upon vague
suspicion of which no proof can be given.—(Cheers.)
The Right Hon. Gentleman who began this debate to-
night (Dr. Nicholl) endeavoured to show that certain
persons who had been guilty of rebellion had received
compensation under the former Act. I believe it is
quite certain that two or three persons at least, who had
been outlawed and afterwards pardoned, did receive com-
pensation under that Act. It may be said that it was
given upon some other grounds than that of a loss of
goods; it may be alleged to have been for furnishing
necessaries to, and succouring her Majesty's troops ;
but I think it would have been an evasion of the
spirit of the Act if compensation had been given on
such grounds. Well, then, if those who have
taken these grounds have utterly failed to show that
there is any real difference between this Act and the
former Act, except that this Act is more restrictive
than the other, inasmuch as no compensation can be
given under this Act, except for losses which were
inflicted unjustly, unnecessarily, and wantonly—if the
destruction of the buildings of the rebels who were firing
on the Queen's troops would not entitle the parties to
compensation under this Act—if, finally, the House has
no good reason to suppose that rebels would receive
compensation under the Act, I ask what it is that it is
now proposed to do ?—(hear, hear.) Is it that which
the Right Honourable Gentleman who spoke last has
suggested, namely, that you should wait ? Nothing of
the kind. What is proposed to you is, that the Royal
assent should not be given to this Act of the Canadian
Legislature—which,:indeed, is not the phrase applicable
to the purpose, but which I have no doubt means that
this Act ought not to go into operation, and there.
fore should be disallowed by the Crown. Because, be
it remarked, that such is the constitution of Canada
—and I mention this as showing what the intention of
the framers of that constitution was—that if no step
whatever should be taken by the advisers of the
Crown, and if this Act should not be disallowed by
the Crown within two years—then the Act would be
in full operation, and be as valid as if it had received
the assent of the Crown. That, I repeat, shows that
the intention of the Legislature in framing that consti-
tutionefrxoimst
e ea
nt l
ofunlessA otActs.
h.e
Ns
Crownoo m e
what
shouldh i s
notth e extraordinaryha em we
amendment
reasontdh mheenl
dt
thesewtha was
colonialasths
which has been proposed by w,
Righta
It is, that the Canadian the Hon. Gentleman?
Act should be altered in such
way as my Right HMemberNorth-
ampton Hon. Friend the for a
has truly alleged—that of making it g
with the Act as framed by the Canadian Legislature,
not
ature
but as it would have been framed if the minority had
prevailed.—(Hear, hear.) Now, I ask the Right Hon.
Gentleman who spoke last, and who is going to vote for
this amendment, how does he imagine that intention is
to be carried into effect? You say, you, the majority of
the House of Commons, differ from the majority of the
Legislative Assembly in Canada, and agree with the mi-
nority, and that you will give such advice to the Crown
that the Crown shall be obliged to disallow the present
Act, and any Act which does not conform with the inten-
tions of the minority of the Legislative Assembly in Ca-
nada. Why, does any one suppose that the Canadian Go-
vernment, that Lord Elgin or any of his present advisers,
could bring a Bill into the Canadian Assembly to carry
out those purposes of the minority?—(Hear, hear.)
Would they not consider, that with such flimsy reasons
as have been given, to reverse the decision to which they
have come, to say that the 44 who voted against the
amendment shall t.ave their opinion overturned, and the
28 their opinion carried—would they not consider that
with such reasons as have been given in this House it
would be an utter subversion of their legislative power?
—(Hear, hear.) Why, then, what do you say? You
are going to propose, in effect, that there having been
compensation and indemnity voted by the Legislature of
Canada for the sufferers in Upper Canadl, there shall bo
no compensation and indemnity for the sufferers in
Lower Canada?—(Cries of " Hear, hear," and " No.")
That •is the question.—(Hear, ear h. )
You say that
you would agree to it only upon such conditions. I
suppose
you are not going to introduce a Bill into
this House to smake the people of Canada pay money
upon your own conditions—(Hear,
hear)—the only
of carrying such a measure would be by proposing
it in the Canadian Assembly; and I think I have shown
conceive you that there is no chance of such a measure being
proposed there.—(Hear, hear.) I cannot
man of the slightest spirit or honour who belongs to
that majority introducing such a measure—e ar)
and if there is to be no Bill of that kind, and this Bill

THE PAVILION AT BRIGHTON.--n 0 Commissioners
of Brighton yesterday held a special meeting to receive
the report of the committee appointed in consequence of
the projected sale of the Pavilion, &c. A statement was
made by the clerk of the commissioners relative to a
copy of the Bill for the sale of the Pavilion about to be
laid before Parliament, which bad been received from
Mr. Milne, of the Woods and Forests; and after some
discussion resolutions were passed to the effect that it
would be highly injurious to the town of Brighton to
suffer the lawn and pleasure-grounds of the Pavilion to
be built over. A resolution was also passed directing
the report and statement of facts connected with the
Pavilion to be printed, and the plans lithographed, to be
circulated amongst the inhabitants previously to calling
a town meeting on the subject.
THE BRITANNIA BRIDGE.—The 19th inst. is the
day fixed for mooring the first of the stupendous
tubes which will form the Britannia-bridge to
the piers proposed for their reception. The work
of mooring these enormous iron structures will be
much more arduous than was that of placing the
Conway tubes, as they are much larger, and the
difficulties to be overcome are considerably greater. The
Carnarvon Herald, in a notice of the forthcoming event,
says, " The tubes are eight in number, four of which,
smaller than the rest, are to be seeen in course of construc-
tion, on scaffolding of great strength, occupying the spaces
between the land towers and the inland abutments, which
are 230 feet apart, at either extremity of the bridge ; two
tubes being placed parallel to each other forming the road-
way to and fro. The four larger ones are placed together
on stages reaching into the river, and covering a long
distance along the Carnarvonshire shore, each mea-
suring 472 feet in length, and weighing 1,800 tons.
Three piers of masonry of stupendous dimensions,
the highest of which rises on the Britannia Rock in the
middle of the straits some 230 feet, being about
seventy feet higher than the arch hollowed out for the
reception of the tubes, stand towering over the
foaming waters. The traveller is also attracted by the
collossal sculpture of four monster lions, which dis-
tinguish the entrance to the tubes, two at each end,
couched on the summit of lofty pedestals. They con-
tain about 8,000 cubic feet of limestone. Near to the
stage on which the tubes are erected are eight pontoons,
two of iron and the others of wood, ready for floating
the first tube to its resting place between the pillars.
This has just been completed. The piles on which it
was built have been removed, and it now rests on two
walls of masonry, erected at either end, affording suffi-
cient room for placing the immense pontoons beneath.
Its strength has been tested with satisfactory results.
Coils of rope cable, which will be used to guide the
tube when afloat, by means of strong capstans fixed on
the shore, have been brought to the spot, and
experiments are being daily made by the parties
on whom the responsibitity of removal rests
to insure success. The ponderous hydraulic machinery
for raising the tube to its proper elevation is being
placed in the archway of the towers, and the prepare-
tians in every department are carried on with great
earnestness. The length of the bridge, when completed,
will exceed a quarter of a mile."

EXTRAORDINARY FREAK.—Last evening two sol-
diers landed at BlAckfriars Pier from a Woolwich
steamer, but endeavoured to evade payment. A dispute
arising between them and the pierman, one of the sol•
Biers struck the piermen very stoutly with a stick, for
which assault he was given into the custody of a police-
man, On their way to the station-house, however, be
made his escape, pursued by the policeman. The sol-
dier, named Baxter, of the Royal Horse Guards (Blue),
ran into a tobacconist's shop in Tudor-street, and
ascended the first floor, from the window of which he
precipitated himself into the street, and, falling heavily
upon the pavement, was so seriously injured as to render
it necessary to convey him to St. Bartholomew's Hos-
pital.

BATHS AND WASHHOUSES.—From the statement
which was submitted yesterday at the general meeting of
the north-west district of London in George-street,
Euston-square, it appears that since the opening of the
baths and washhouses in August, t 846, 315,355 persons
have been bathers, and that the linen of 537,460 poff
prsons has bsen washed and dried, &c., upon the pre-
mises. The department established in January, 1848,
for supplying the poor with pails .and brushes, and lime
and disinfecting preparations, for •the whitewashing and
purifying their apartments, has been very useful; sinc,e
the opening of it 2,762 apartments, consisting of rooms,
staircases, areas, &e., have been. lime-washed, cleansed,
and disinfected, and great advantege has been conferred
on the general community by- the means afforded of
avoiding and resisting the attack: of disease.
ILLICIT DISTILLATION.—James-Bank and William
Johnson were yesterday fined, by the Court of Inland
illicit Revenue, 2001. for working an, still.