The Sun.
London, England, 1831-12-17 00:00:00

THE RUSSIAN LOAN.

Mr. HERRIES rose, in pursuance of a notice which he
gave last evening, for the production of certain papers which
were connected with the Russian loan. As, lswever, he
did not wish to interpose between the Übuse and the ptirpose
far which they had met so earlyl he would, in the expectation
that no objection would be made to his motion, very shortly ad-
'vest to the eircionstanets Which had given rise to it. He had
been much aStonisheit at the interpretation which had been last
hi ;ht ptituPtio treaties and Acts of Parliament, notwithstanding
`the dikOrallins and terms of the treaties were so distinct
ri,e'tlOred them scarcely possible to he misunderstood, There
SVi•re certain payments provided for, and certain tiontingencie-,
an:. notwithstanding those contingencies had occurred the law
officers had taken upon thensselves to advise the payments to be
made. There were two conventions, by virtue of which this
country was now paying a debt contracted by Russia, the first of
which contained an article binding Great Britain to pay,
Up m certain conditions, two slims of two millions and one million,
and by the 3d article England was boUnd to pay pant passe with
ilolland, such further charges as should be agreed upon by
the high contracting parties towards the final and satisfactory
settlement of the Low Countries, but not exceeding three mil-
lions, to be defrayed by way of loan. The next convention pro-
fessed m spring out of the first, by virtue of which England
Was to pay pars passu with Holland. It appeared from What
[ned last night that Holland had refused tO isay her share, and
hat of course put an end to the engagement on the part of
gland. The Right Iloholirable Gentleman said he would ab-
stain from calling for the iTillions given by the law officers of
the Crowns unless it ,htetld appear hereafter to be necessary. He
wished also to know to know to what amount this country was
t°llntailly t4a,,•, for, perhaps, the House would be surprised to
Near thitt tine sum would be at length nearer four minions
pan ts‘.';ee.—(Hear, hear, hear.) 'l'o this subject he pledged
nhi ",elf to call the earliest attention of the House after the
'r.olidays. The Right Honourable Gentleman then concluded
by moving that an humble address be presented to his Majesty,
praying that he will direct to be laid before the House copies of
the convention between Great Britain and the Netherlands,
dated 13th of Aug. 1814; of the convention between Great Bri-
tain, the Netherlands, and Russia, dated the 19th May, 1815; an
account of the sums paid up to the sth of January, 1831 ; an esti-
mate of what sum remained to be paid after that period, under
the convention of the 19th May, 1815, and copies of all warrants
&c. for the issues by the Treasury.
Sir ROBERT INGLIS seconded the motion.
Mr. HUNT said, he had risen to second the motion of the
Right Hon. Gentleman, but had been stopped. He had no doubt,
that he should be told by the. Press, and the hangers-on of his
Majesty's Ministry, that he was always ready to support any mo-
tion of the Tories. On this subject, however, he had not had the
slightest communication with any of the Tories, but when they
were disposed to look into subjects like the present, he should be
always ready to join them, for if they proceeded in this
way, he had not the slightest doubt, of soon seeing Tories and
radicals meeting together. Every measure against extorting
money from the pockets of the people had been passed by its con-
sequence, as it was stated, of the importance of the Reform Bill.
This measure, however, was now in good hands, and he had no
doubt something would speedily be done. The Right Honourable
Gentleman seemed to have some deliCacy in moving for the opi-
nions of the legal advisers of the Crown, but he (Mr. Hunt)
thought if the Right Hon. Gentleman had heard the taunts of the
Attorney-General last night, he would have no delicacy on
that point.
Lord ALTHORP bad not the least wish to oppose the motion
of the Right Hon. Gentleman ; but he would observe, that at
the'priVer period the conduct pursued by Ministers would be
full explained.
Sir It. VYVYAN could net agree with the Noble Lord who
had just sat down that this was not the proper period to ask for
explanations on this point. The present subject, to his mind, was
far more important than Reform in Parliament ; but if the House,
or the majority of the I-louse, were determined to overturn all the
regular modes of debate, and proceed by clamour with the Reform
11111, he had nothing further to say. He was exceedingly sorry
to observe that, during the greater part of the last session and
this, the Noble Lord at the head of the Foreign Department bad
het made his appearance in the House. It might he convenient
for him to do so, in consequence of the negociations that were
going on, or on account of fearing that the question might
be put to him, but he should have thought when a notice was on
the paper relative to foreign affairs, it was his duty to be there.
Had he been here, lie (Sir R. Vyvyan) had intended to put a dis.
tinct question to him, but as he was not here, he must address
himself to the Noble Lord opposite (Althorp). Although
in every State in Europe the protocol of the conference
held its London, and the treaty signed in London, not ratified,
had been explained and published in all the papers, and also
at the Hague, yet the British House of Commons were perfectly
uninformed of those matters in which the interests of the coun-
try were involved. He thought it would be well to consider
before the treaty mentioned its his Majesty's speech was ratified,
whether there were not certain articles in that treaty which
deserved re-consideration ; and whether, in case of its being
ratified as it now stood, there were not parties who would con-
sider it as waste paper.
Lord ALTHORP had understood it to be the intention of
the worthy Baronet to put some question to him, but lie did not
understand him to have done so. He begged, however, with re-
spect to the Hon. Baronet's speech, to decline entering into the
topics contained in it. With respect to the Worthy Baronet's
accusation against his Noble Friend at the head of the •Foreign
Department, he had not the smallest doubt that he did
not consider a discussion like the present would have been
entered into, and he (Lord Althorp) was, therefore, not at
all surprised that his '_noble Friend was not in his place ; but he
had no doubt that, had he been here, he would have followed
the same course which he (Lord Althorp) had done. The pro-
per time for the discussion of the treaty was when it was laid on
the table of the House, at which period Government would be
able to uphold the steps they had taken.
Mr. COURTENAY stated that it had been his intention to
put a question to the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs, re.
lative to Portugal, but as the subject would require a great deal
of detail, and as the Noble Secretary was not present, he should
now give notice, that very soon after the recess he should call
the attention of the House to the subject.
The motion was then agreed to.
Colonel EVANS gave notice of a motion for leave to bring its
a Bill to repeal the 59th of George lll.—the Foreign Enlist.
ment Act.