The Sun.
London, England, 1853-02-19 00:00:00

the house at greater length—he would be happy to point
~,bsthing out or give any explanation to the committee
ulat might be required. He now begged to put into the
hands of the Chairman the following vote :-
45,500 men to be employed in the sea service, 1854.
12,500 Royal marines, and 2,000 boys.
Mr. IMAM assented to the vote, and hoped to see the
. next naval estimates in a more improved condition.
Sir T. D. ACLAND said he too was an advocate for a '
wise economy, but he hoped his right hon. friend the mem-
ber for Carlisle would remember there could be no such
,economy if the efficiency of the service were neglected.
Mr. A. STAFFORD said that in reference to the pro-
Posed reduction in the hydrographical department, he had
to state that he entirely agreed with the right hon. baronet
41,0 n that point.
Government W. WILLIAMS said he could not blame the
vovernment for the increase which had been made in the
naval estimates for the present year, because public opinion
"d been distinctly pronounced in favour of such a mea-
sure,
Captain SCOBELL should insist that the improvements
In steam added as much to the defence of England as they
could facilitate the operations of an invading force. He
'Warned the authorities how they increased the jealousy of
'33.0 French nation by collecting a Channel fleet at a time
thatulylyhaasennsnle,looo. nra. t;eioan
r, had not a single line-of-battle ship in the
hear.) The annual cost of a 90-gun ship
so that the fleet of 14 or 15 line-of-battle
ehih
Ps, referred to by the late Chancellor of the Exchequer,
;tvould cost close on 800,001)1. a year. (Hear, hear.) He
!hither begged to suggest that all vessels in lutist.° should
be built by contract, and he had no doubt they would ex-
cel those built in the dockyards.
Admiral W A LCOTT thought it better that no step
should be taken until the report of the committee sitting
on the question of " manning the navy" should be made.
• Sir J. WALMSLEY wished to know whether it was the
Intention of the Admiralty to place the port of Liverpool
321 a better state of defence than that in which it was at
the present day ? He thought the better defence of that
Port Was a subject to which the attention of her Majesty's
Government ought to be seriously directed.
Sir J. GRAHAM said he had to observe, in answer to
the
question which had been just put to him, that the
question of the defence of Liverpool was one which had
not been altogether overlooked. by her Majesty's Govern-
ment. A steamer of war had been ordered to go to that
Port already, and measures would betaken in the course of
the summer if necessary, to provide for its defence. He
Would now venture to say a few words in answer to some
cbservations that had' been made in the course of that dis-
tessibm The great pressure upon him that evening had
feet with respect to the saving he had endeavoured to ef-
hear)—and he therefore had to defend again
tr_le reductions he had proposed to make. They had cer-
tainly Placed the expense at th e lowest possible amount
.Ps)llsistent with efficiency ; but at the
,same -time he be-
lieved that the important point of efficiency had not been
neglected by them. It had been said that these had been
1110 reduction of dockyards, but the fact was, as appeared
the
a report of the committee which had inquired into
subject, that the numbers of men in the dockyards had
been reduced from 13,000 to 9,600. With regard to the
?xercise of political influence in promotion at the dockyards,
Ile had to state that the rule in those establishments at
present was, that when a man had once been admitted into
them, nothing but his own misconduct should prevent his
Ziuquent promotion. His noble friend the member for
"doh, in the year 1848, when the employment of his
Political influence in effecting promotions had been cen-
sured had given a most solemn assurance on the part of
e Government that such an abuse should no longer be
tontinued. He (Sir J. Graham) agreed in the opinion
Which he had heard expressed by some persons, that if they
Were
the
have another Reform 1.411 the good of the service
happiness of the men employed in the dockyards,
is well as in the Post-office and revenue departments,
"bid render it desirable that, while they continued in the
service of the Crown, their franchise should be suspended.
a-s could undertake to say that, in the distribution of the
patronage at his disposal, political influences should not be
allowed to prevail. He knew well the difficulty of carry-
ins out that pledge, for the pressure on the Admiralty au-
thorities was extreme ; but his duty was a sacred one, and
to the best of his ability he would endeavour honestly to
discharge irrespective of all charge it, irresp
outward considerations.
ie should tell the house that, having considered matters
111 connection with the navy since his return to the office he
had left 20 years ago, he had found that so much had been
'Oho by his right hon. friend the member for Portsmouth,
that tlhaat he should be deceiving the house if he were to state
he hoped to be able to effect any very considerable
.re-
duction in the naval expenditure. There was at present an
Increase in the number of men, and that of course rendered
necessary an increase in the whole of the estimates. He
should tell the house that, notwithstanding the hardships
which poor sailors underwent in the service, out of the
number of seamen which the house had ordered, not less
than one-half had been volunteers. He thought that cir-
hllinstance told favourably in favour of the officers, and
Shelved that when in command of ships they did not in
Leneiral abuse their authority. Everythina had been done
check that abuse of authority, and hebhoped that the
measures taken for the purpose had been attended with
success. In the present year an increase had been recom-
p°ended, as he had already stated, in the American naval
rem, and the American authorities had justified that in-
crease by a reference to the increased activity and enter-
whichV the hurry of the times exacted from the navy.
were the views of the American Government—such
;ere the views of the British Government. It was not in
spirit of rivalry to any other power—it was not in any
spirit of hostility to any other power—that these votes
Were asked for • and he was confident the committee would
give their assent to them. (Hoar, hear.)
The vote was then agreed to, as were also a vote for
1'736236/. for the wages of seamen and marines, and
Tf;,4261. for victualling.
le e uRAIRMAN then reported
-ave 8.. progress, and asked
1.11 e.?, it again.
ase uface of Examiner (Court of Chancery) Bill was read
c°lltl t,'
M
Oa the mhe.
olotion that the house at its rising adjourn till
lir.
avP
whether -,4-.POLE wished to ask the noble lord opposite
apectin;t"he bring on his resolution on Thursday ro-
e oaths taken by members, and if the discussion on
the nrev•
for ID I°lll3 motion of the right hon. baronet the member
roitwich should last till a late hour? •
Lord J. RUSSELL said if he could bring on his resolu-
tion respecting the oaths, and with reference to Jewish
disabilities, before eleven o'clock on Thursday night, he
should do so. If not, he should postpone his motion to
Rome other day. The noble lord then moved to discharge
Mr. Wilson from further attendance on Ithe ndian terri-
tories committee; and that the following members be added
thereto :—Lord J. Russell, Sir C. Wood, Sir G. Grey, Sir
addock, Mr. C. Fortescue, Mr. Cardwell, Mr. J. Elliot,
and Mr. Lowe.—Agreed to.
The noble lord then obtained leave. to bring in a bill for
carrying into effect the treaty with the republic of New
Granada for the suppression of the slave trade.
On the motion of Sir J. SHELLEY, Alderman Cubitt
' vas appointed to be a member of the select committee on
the coal dues.
The house then adjourned at half-past one till Monday.