The Sun.
London, England, 1853-04-23 00:00:00

[ PRICE SD.

(the Bishop of Exeter) admitted that ; but they were
combined, and necessary to each other. It was a duty
pointed out by God that every state should sustain reli-
gion by endowments and temporal provision. The noble
earl assented to that, and in so assenting he did no more
than was done by the British Constitution, which directed
that there should be an established and endowed Church
in this country. By the coronation oath, the sove-
reign was bound to maintain the church not only in
England, but also in her territories, to maintain the
rights and possessions of religion. Were they now to
be told that religion and endowment were not only not
the same, but not necessarily connected ? He did not
'wan to say that religion could not exist without en-
d,)winent, but he would say that no religion could be
adequately sustained in any country without a tem-
perate provision The noble duke had referred to what
he called the triumphant answer given to an argument
of his (the Bishop of Exeter) by a right rev. friend of
his. He was, however, in the position of Englishmen
who never knew when they were beaten. The act of
sacrilege to which he alluded was not that lands had
been given in Canada by George the Third to the Roman
Catholics. That was spoliation, and it was inconsistent
with the royal oath ; but it was not sacrilege. But to
thisof and Godhb lwouldal tn
they
e y applywocontinue
l it d
bteo
seculartt
oa k e
say
anything
pthuartbs purposes
e s
guilty of sacrilege, a sin not only awfully denounced but
awfully punished. The right rev. prelate concluded by
moving that the bill be read a second'time that day six
o from
the was
passingtthe
esacrilege,
service
o f

months.
Lord LYTTELTON said the question their lordships
were discussing was one of considerable importance be-
' cause if involved the principle of colonial freedom, and
he must therefore beg permission to say a few words.
It was difficult to ascertain from the imperfect record of
the debates what really were the intentions of the
framers of the act of 1791, but whatever they were,
there could be no dispute about the fact that those in-
tentions were disappointed. Still the matter which the
bill embraced was one which was very properly confined
to the governing power of the colony, as had been done
in the case of the West Indies and the Australian co-
lonies. The most tenable objection which had been
urged against the bill was that which insisted that the
act of 1840 was to be considered as a final measure, but
their lordships should remember that no legislation was
final which was not accepted by the people, or which
failed to accomplish the purpose for which it was in-
tended. Well, then, the act of 1840 had failed—the

people of Canada had refused to accept it, and there-
fore it was impossible to treat the act as final. As for
the cry which had been raised about offending the loyal
party of Canada, he could not for a moment allow that
to stand in the way of passing the bill. Formerly there
might have been good reason for recognising a distinc-
tion amongst the Canadian public, but that necessity
no longer existed. Canada was now united, and must
be treated as a whole, and since he knew no other organ
through which the colony could speak but its Legislative
Assembly, he was bound to take it for granted that the
loyal portion of the population were rather favourable
than otherwise to the measure. On the whole, then, he
thought that if they acceded to the wish of the opposi-
tion it would be nothing less than a retrogressive move-
ment, and he for one should advise their lordships to
pass the second reading of this bill.
Lord St. LEONARDS insisted that the present state
of the clergy reserves had been incorrectly stated both
by the noble duke opposite and the Under Secretary for
the Colonies in another place. This statement was di-
rectly Contrary to the law and facts of the case, and it
would be necessary for him to detain their lordships for
a short time while he stated the exact position of the
question as it stood at the moment. The first act that
related to the ecclesiastical endowments of Canada was
passed in 1774, and by that act it was provided, that
while on the one hand the Roman Catholic clergy should
be entitled to collect their accustomed dues and tithes
from the occupiers of land who professed their own re-
ligion, so on the other the Protestant clergy should be
permitted to have the control and disposition of their
own tithes. The right so conferred upon the Roman
Catholic Church bad never since been disturbed ; but in
1791 another act was passed, which distinctly gave
the Canadian Legislature power to deal with the
rev e
to certainnuesofbotl l
st
trheePrireotitt which Protestant
ih the
ande Catholicaet set
cleroguyt,
subject
at length. It was provided by this act that neither
the tithes of the Protestants, nor those of the Ro-
man Catholics should be touched without the consent
of the Crown. Nay, the act went further even than that,
for by section 42 it was provided that in the event of
the local legislature wishing to pass a bill disposing or
dealing in any way with the clergy reserves, an address
should be presented to the governor setting forth what
the contents of the bill were, and praying him to for-
ward it to the Crown, in order that it might be laid be-
fore the Imperial Legislature, and sanctioned by them
in the first instance. So that in point of fact, as their

lordships would perceive, this section not only gave the
Imperial Parliament power[over the local Legislature,
but also a control over the veto of the Crown. Under

(the provisions of this act the provincial Legislature suc-
ceeded in abolishing tithes altogether, and if their lord-
ships consented now to place these reserves in tl.eir
power, what was to prevent their doing the same
with regard to them ? But to resume the history of the
case. In 1827, an act was passed, directing a sale of not
exceeding a fourth of the clergy reserves, and the pro-
ceeds were to be devoted to the promotion of public
worship and Christianity, but in 1839 the Legislature
passed another act, but as the Government refused to
adopt it, the act fell to the ground. The next year,
however, in 1840, another bill passed, by which it was
provided that the whole of the clergy reserves which had
been set apart by the early act for the promotion of Pro-
testantism should be distributed in the following pro-
portions—namely, a fourth to the Protestant Church, a
fourth to the Scotch Church, and the rest to be divided
amongst the other denominations. The Government
was anxious to give effect to the arrangement, but the
question arose whether the Canadian Parliament had
power to pass such a measure. The judges to whom the
point was referred, decided that they had not, and the
aid of the Imperial Legislature was called in. Now, if
ever there was a solemn compact with a large branch of
the Protestant clergy, it was that of 1840 in regard to
this measure. (Hear, hear.) When that compact was
made it was thought that the funds arising from the re-
serves so appropriated, would not be sufficient to provide
for the very moderate stipends of the Episcopal and
Scotch clergy in Canada, and the Imperial Parliament
gave its guarantee to make good the deficiency out of
the consolidated fund. As this bill was the first intro-
duced that guarantee was withdrawn, and it was urged
that it was a matter of no importance—but was it no
additional security to have the guarantee of the Imperial
Parliament ? And was it now to be said that a compact
so entered into and so guaranteed on the faith of the
Parliament of this country was not binding ? The noble
duke on a former evening had stated that the Clergy
Reserves Act had no connexion with the Act of Union,
the 42d section of which, by a curious coincidence, was
similar to the 42d section of the act of 1791. in so far as
it required that any act of the colonial Legislature re-
lating to the ecclesiastical establishments should lie on

the table of both houses of the Imperial Parliament a
certain number of days before it could receive the royal
assent. The noble duke was mistaken, for though power
was given by that act to deal with the reserves, the con-
trol of the Imperial Parliament provided in the Act of
Union was distinctly reserved. One of the obligations
of the Crown in respect to the reserves, which under the
act of 1840 were to be maintained, was the payment of
1,6001. a year to the Roman Catholic clergy, in conside-
ration of their having been deprived of certain tithes.
He (Lord St. Leonard's) knew of no tithes which the
Roman Catholic clergy ever had, except such as they
had gained by the act of 1774, which gave them the
tithes of their co-religionists, but none of the Protestant
tithes. But they have been told by the Under-Secretary
for the Colonies, in the other house, that while the obli-
gations of the Imperial Legislature to the Protestant
clergy were to be abondoned, the obligations to the
Roman Catholic clergy were to be maintained. He was
not prepared, any more than the Government, to sweep
away the rights of the Roman Catholic clergy, but he
must deny the position put forward by the supporters of
this bill, that the Protestant clergy were placed under it
on the same footing as the Roman Catholic clergy. Un-
der the bill, if it passed, the Canadian Legislature
would have full power to deal with the Protest-
ant endowment, whereas they could not touch the
Roman Catholic endowments without the bill for that
purpose being submitted to the imperial Parliament.
Those, however, who were so anxious to preservation
of the Roman Catholic endowments and the Roman
Catholic tithes must not be surprised if the Ca-
nadian Legislature, having tasted the first fruits of
power in respect to ecclesiastical property, claimed the
right to appropriate the Roman Catholic portion oftia
i
property, as well as that which belonged to the Protes-
tants. He contended that the local legislature had no
right to the reserves, inasmuch as they had never formed
part of the colonial revenues, and if the clergy were to
Crown.
It deprived of them they ought to go back to the
It was said that this concession would tend to perpetuate
the connexion with the mother country ; but one of the
first elements of permanent union between two countries
was mutual respect, and if the mother country yielded
rights of which she was the depository, the respect of
the colony would soon be withdrawn, and the effect
would be to weaken rather than strengthen the bonds of
union. This proposition was to take from the Protestant
churches of England end Scotland that property
had been solemnly and definitely settled in their which
favour,
and to hand it over to those who had no shadow of right
to it ; to such an act of spoliation he trusted their lord-
ships would not assent,
The Bishop of NORWICH thought the bill before the
house was a measure of justice by this country to
Canada, and he should give his vote in favour of it, feel-
ing that he was taking the course most calculated to sup-
port the interests of the church in Canada. Whatever
might be the result of thismeasure on the Church of
Canada, he could not think
responsible for it, because they their lordships would be
owed a duty to the Legis-
lature of Canada, who had been been taught to believe that
with them rested the settlementth of this long vexed ques-
tion. Whilst he thought is measure to be just, yet, if
the Canadian Parliament should secularise the clergy
reserves and alienate the property altogether from the
church, he considered that the Church of Canada would
have no inequitable claim to compensation from the
Government of this oountrb (Hear, hear.)