The Sun.
London, England, 1854-02-01 00:00:00

E SUN, LONDON, WEDNE'S'DAY EVENING, FEBRUARY 1, 1854.

Prince so near the throne ; but, recollect, lam now speak-
ing in defence of one who has been injured by anony-
mous slander—(hear, hear)—and this is the first opportu-
nity on which he has authorised any communication to be
made in reply to those slanders. (Hear, hear.) His Royal
Highness, therefore, continued in this position, giving
advice to her Majesty when it was expedient to do so, and
stating to her his opinion when he thought assistance was
necessary, but the most constitutional deference was paid
to the advice of the Ministers—(hear, hear)—and be it ob-
served, that though it may have been the case during the
reigg of the House of Hanover that Ministers may have been
obliged to resign because they could not agree to something
which the Sovereign proposed, or because they were willing
to propose advice that was not acceptable to the Sovereign,
the administrations of the Queen have always ceased in con-
sequence of a vote of this house. (Cheers.) Well, sir, during
my administration there occurred a case in which his Royal
Highness had to consider his position, and to determine
what he should do with respect to a proposal that was made.
(Hear.) I had some correspondence with the Duke of Wel-
lington at a time when the office of adjutant-general was
vacant. The Duke of Wellington went to Windsor, and be
there informed Prince Albert that it was his opinion that it
would be of great advantage to the army if after his death
his Royal Highness were placed by her Majesty in the po-
sition of Commander-in-Chief. His grace said that he had
thought much upon it—that all his feelings and wishes
were for the good administration of the army—that the
army peculiarly belonged to the Crown—and that he did
not think its interest would in any way be so well cared
for, as by Prince Albert consenting to be his successor.
(Hear, hear.) He said he wished to have a decision upon
the subject, because he would make such arrangements
with respect to the office of adjutant-general and other
offices at the Horse Guards as would give his Royal High-
ness all the assistance that he could give him. (Hear,
hear.) Prince Albert could not but feel that it was a very
great compliment to be told by the Duke of Wellington
that he was a fit person to succeed him in the command of
the army, but after some reflection he informed the Duke
of Wellington that he considered` that his place was to be
always Dear the Queen—(cheers)—that he thought he ought
to identify himself with the Queen— with her position and
with her interests—and that he would depart from that po-
sition if he had any separate office of his own, snore espe-
cially an office of the importance of Commander-in-Chief,
and thereby became responsible for other duties, and for
the exercise of other powers beyond those which her Ma-
jesty had to exercise or perform. (Hear, hear.) Imme-
diately after having given that answer, I had the honour
of an interview with his Royal Highness, when he read
the letter he had written to the duke, and it appeared to
me, and I immediately expressed my opinion, that his
Royal Highness had judged most rightly—(hear, hear),—
t hco commander-in-chief; me m
reasons—thoseand er - n- chi ef ;
which
ish
and that he had exactly viewed his own position. (Hear.)
I think there were other reasons why his Royal Highness
shouldqut
unnecessary
take th et
o efiaof
state
his Royal Highness himself stated were quite sufficient, and
they showed that, while he considered that he ought not to
be commander-in-chief, he likewise considered that, when-
ever he could be of any aid or assistance to the Queen—
whatever difficulty she might feel—whatever decision she
might have come to—he was bound to give the whole of
his intelligence, and zeal, and wisdom to the considera-
tion of that question. (Hear, hear.) I regret that there
should be charges made against his Royal Highness.
(Cheers.) Many of them are too frivolous to notice ; many
of them are mere stories, which disappear the next
day; but having explained now the general constitutional
position of the Prince—a position of the greatest import-
ance—l shall mention with regard to two different branches
of the public service the sort of charges that have been
made. (Hear, hear.) With respect to the army, in par-
ticular, it has been said that his Royal Highness is in the
habit of constantly interfering. Now, I would say that
when the Duke of Wellington acquiesced in the decision
of the Prince, he said at the same time that as it was not
likely that the Queen would again personally enter into
details of the military service, he hoped his Royal High-
ness would always give his attention to anything that af-
fected the state and efficiency of the army. This his Royal
Highness has done with regard to any general question
which he thought affected that state and efficiency. (Hear,
hear, hear.) With regard to the ordinary business of the
Horse Guards, he has never in any way interfered ; with
respect to patronage, he has never at all interfered—(hear,
hear)—and I think the house will agree that, having had
this request from the Duke of Wellington, and seeing that
it was not likely that her Majesty would attend to those
points which the Kings, her predecessors, had attended to, ,
it is but right that his Royal Highness, with respect to
general questions that might effect the army, should pay
attention to those, questions. (Hear, hear.) Sir, it so
happens that a short time ago a circumstance occurred
which was so perverted that I must take the liberty of
stating what were the real facts of the case. The adjutant-
general and quarter-master-general are appointed by the
Sovereign, and not by the commander-in-chief. But the
Sovereign, as it may be supposed, usually takes the advice
of the commander-in-chief in making those appointments.
A difference of opinion occurred between Lord Hardinge
and Sir George Brown with respect to the weight that the
soldier should carry, and with regard to other points of
military detail and arrangement. Sir George Brown, whose
correspondence has been shown to me by Lord Hardinge,
wrote a letter in exceedingly suitable terms' saying that as
there was a considerable difference between Lord Hardinge
and himself, and as his own opinion, formed upon what he
had heard from the Duke of Wellington, was unshaken,
he thought it was better that he should resign the office
of adjutant-general, and he, therefore, begged Lord Har-
dinge to place his resignation before the Queen. Now,it
has been represented that this resignation was somehow
produced by the interference of Prince Albert. That story
is totally false. It arose entirely from the difference of
opinion I have stated. Lord Hardinge immediately laid
Sir George BroWn's resignation before her Majesty, and
recommended that Sir George Cathcart should be appointed
the successor to Sir George Brown, as he considered him a
very distinguished officer, and of an age that would enable
him to perform actively the duties of that situation. Her
Majesty acquiesced in the advice that Lord Hardinge gave,
but she said she hoped that General Wetherell, who was
next in that office of adjutant-general to Sir George Brown,
would meet with every consideration from Lord Hardinge.
Now, it should be mentioned that General Wetherell
was the son of one who was in constant attendance upon
the Duke of Kent, and I am sure that the house will
not think it wrong that her Majesty—recollecting the
services of General Wetherell's father to her father—
should wish that eivery consideration and kindness should
be shown to that distinguished officer. Lord Har- •
dingo said that he was quite ready to pay every conside-
ration to the merits of General Wetherell, that he
thought very highly of them himself, that he performed
his duties in Canada very well, but that he (Lord Har-
dinge) did not think be wouf.l be so efficient an adjutant-
general as Sir George Cathcar:; ; that he was, however,
quite ready to propose some inethOd by which it should be
shown that no disapprobation was sh.
ewn towards General
Wetherell. Upon this an equerry of .her Majesty, who
was likewise in attendance upon his Roya.l Highness, came
to London to express to General Wethere,ll the Queen's
sense of his services, and that it was not frofq any slight
to him that she had taken the advice of Lord: Hardinge.
General Wetherell, as might be expected, expressed his
grateful sense of this mark of her Majesty's condescension
and kindness, and made no complaint of the appointment
which was made to the office of adjutant-general. ... re-
gently, however, it was said that General Brown bad bee.:l
spoken to by Lord Hardinge, and had said—but perhaps I
had better read the letter in which this assertion is con-
tained :

nected with a measure for checking bribery, corruption,
and intimidation ; end let me observe in what spirit I shall
consider this large measure, which has been so long pro-
mised, and which is now about to be produced. It is, in
my opinion, most unwise, especially at the present time, to
introduce any measure of Parliamentary reform. Under any
circumstances, I should perhaps be disposed to rest upon
the grea't measure of 1832—which, however, I think was
in many instances most unjust in its arrangements with re-
gard to the influence of the party that was opposed to the
Government which introduced it. But the remedial
agency of time has remedied a great deal of that injustice,
and I should be disposed to place against the advantages of
an equitable arrangement of the claims of that party for
redress, the immense advantages of tampering with the
constitution, and of perpetually disturbing that which,
above all, ought to be hallowed by prescription. But if
that famous bill—the whole bill, and nothing but the bill
—is again to be brought before us, and placed on that
table for execution by those who were its prime projectors,
and who sailed into power and authority on the heady
current of its agitation, then I shall analyse the parties of
which this house and the country is composed, with th%
view of attempting to effect an adjustment among the
various classes in the,couutry and their representatives in
this house. (Cheers.) I have taken occasion before to
point out to the house, when a large measure of Parliamen-
tary reform we's proposed by the hon. member for Mont-
rose, the extraordinary injustice with which the landed
proprietors of the country have been treated with respect
to the representation in the house, and all classes connec-
ted with the land. I have placed before the house statis-
tics of property and population, and I have shown that the
greatest anomalies brought forward by hon. gentlemen op-
posite in a thoughtless vein are equalled—nay, they are
not equalled, but they are infinitely surpassed—if you ap-
ply these principles and test by these dogmas -- the
arrangements for the representation of the inhabitants of
the counties of England in the Commons House of Parlia-
ment. We have lately had some important returns ordered
by the late Government, and I am not now going into de-
tails with reference to them. They only illustrate, by
fresh and still more striking evidence, the principles which
I have placed before the house with reference to this sub-
ject, and the facts which I have before stated. But this is
not to be denied—that at the present moment more than
one half the population of the country is represented in the
House of Commons by a body of 160 or 170 county mem-
bers,
while a population of more than 72 millions are re-
presented by nearly 400 gentlemen, who are called bo-
rough members. So much for the facts at the present
moment. These are not considerations which would have
induced us, especially at the present moment, to come for-
ward and ask for Parliamentary reform, though we
think that great injustice has been done us by the present
arrangement. You appeal to the passions, and you
dwell upon the importance of what you call the large towns
while the fact is that there aro vast populations, still larger
than the largest towns whichare represented onlyin a most
imperfect manner, and who have not nearly the number of
members which, according to your principles, they are en-
titled to. When we come to this large measure—when we
come to this bold proposition, as we have been informed,
of disfranchisement—when we have to add them to that
horde of forfeited seats which the noble lord has been so
long and so sedulously accumulating—we shall come for-
ward not with clamour—not with that organised arrange-
ment which is brought into play whenever anything is de-
manded by what are called the large towns, but we shall
come down to the House of Commons and appeal to facts
—we shall appeal to principles—we shall ask you to do us
justice, but remembering at the same time that if you
award to us that which we supplicate you to grant us, you
will at the same time add strength and reverence to the
constitution of England. (Cheers.)
Lord J. RUSSELL—Sir, the Government have no rea- I
son to complain of the manner in which the Speeeh from
the Throne and the Address this evening have been treated
by the house. On the contrary, I have to thank the house
in the name of the Government for the general spirit of
moderation which prevailed in the way in which hon.
members have declared, with respect to the great Eastern
question, on which opinions are so divided, that they are
ready to wait to consult the papers which have been laid
upon the table of the house, and that not till they have
examined them will they b 3 prepared to give their judg-
ment upon them. If there was anything in the beginning
of the debate which may have been considered to criticise
the policy of the Government, I am quite leady to rest the
answer to those observations on .the speech of the hon.
baronet the member for Tamworth, who spoke with great
eloquence and ability on our foreign relations. (Cheers.)
The right hon. gentleman who has just sat down has made
some philological observations on the Speech from the
Throne, rather than found fault with the policy which it
embodies. Of that policy I have only to say that I think
it has been carried on with a view to preserve, if possible,
the blessings of peace for England and the world, and that
it has been directed, in any event, either in a peaceful or
in a warlike termination of our negotiations, to preserving
the honour and interests of this kingdom. That honour
and those interests would not have been preserved if, when
we saw the aggressions of Russia on her unoffending neigh-
bour, we refrained from lifting up our voice in her support,
and by demonstrating that, if necessary, we were ready to
take other means to prevent the success of what appeared to
us to be an unprincipled and an unjust invasion. The
right hon. gentleman has alluded to the terms, of the
Vienna note. That note, as I stated in the former session,
was framed not by the English Government, but by the
Government of the Emperor of the French. Some addi-
tions and alterations were made to it by the Austrian Go-
vernment, and we accepted the note as a means which we
hoped would prove for the benefit of Turkey and conci-
liate her claims with those pretensions which the Emperor
of Russia had put footh. It is quits true, I readily ad
mit, that when that note arrived at Constantinople, and
when the Turkish Government showed that, not in the
plain sense, not in the sense affixed to it by the re-
presentatives of the four Powers, but in the sense that
might be affixed to it by her hostile and jealous neighbour,
the note might infringe upon her independence, wo had
then no hesitation in recommending the modifications pro-
posed by the Turkish Government to the con dderation of
the Emperor of Russia. The answer that was made, above
all the explanaiions that were given by Count Nesselrode
as to the sense in which the Vienna note was understood
by the Government of St. Petersburg, proved not only
that the Government of Russia was not prepared to recede
from any of its pretensions, but that to its unprincipled
and unjust aggression it added something which I cannot
desienate otherwise than fraudulent in the manner in
which it pursued its policy. (Loud and long-continued
cheers.) I should be misleading the house if I were to ex-
press any confident expectation that the offer now made
will be acceded to by the Emperor of Russia. But this I
may say in reference to the remark of the right hon. gen-
tleman that he hoped there was nothing contrary to the
integrity and independence of Turkey in the terms pro-
posed—that the terms now proposed are terms agreed to
by the representatives of the four Powers and of the
Turkish Government, and that the Turkish Minister for
Foreign Affairs himself framed and signed the note in
which the propositions were conveyed; so that in advising
the Government of St. Petersburg to accept that note, we
cannot suppose that we are in any way trenching upon the
integrity or the ihdependence of Turkey. (Cheers.) I
think it is very obvious from the terms of the Speech that
whilst the British Government is most anxious, if possible
to effect a pacific settlement of the question, we are not
disposed- to let the Government of Russia so far take ad-
vantage of the time' that may elapse as that, while she is
making waxlike preparations, when the end of the negotia-
tions should arrive, we should be found totally unpre-
pared. (Hear.) I know no injury—I see, on the contrary,
very great advantage—in protracted negotiations, as long
as there is a hope that peace may be the result,: if we
do not allow the consequence to follow that an advantage
may be gained by Russia during that time, which an ear-
lier termination of the negotiations would prevent. (Hear,
hear.) When the papers are laid upon the table, I shall
have no objection, on any motion that may be made, or
discussion that may arise, to go fully into these questions.
(Hear.) One thing I may say—that, considering the posi-
tion of Russia in regard to Turkey, and the frontier which
divides them, and that England and France have taken the
most active part in opposing the designs of Russia, we have
thought that it would be an immense advantage in every
point of view, if Austria and Prussia would combine with
us for the purpose of preventing a war from ensuing in
consequence of the aggression that has been made by
Russia. Our endeavours in that respect have not been
fruitless. There has been a protocol signed by the Micis-
ters of the Four Powers, in which they all declare that it
is a satisfaction to them to be able to announce that no di-
minution of the integrity of the Turkish empire will ensue
from the war that now exists between Russia and her
neighbour. (Cheers.) Tbat declaration, no doubt, is not
complete, that declaration does not fully meet the views
of the Government of Great Britain • but still it is a great
advantage that, so far as we can, we shall act together : and'
when the Government of Austria shall perceive war is
at length near, that the negotiations in which she has
willingly taken part will not be successful in inducing the
Emperor of Russia to desist from his efforts, and that no-
thing but bolder measures and a stronger tone would
duce him to do so—l say I have great hopes that the Go-
vernment of Austria, seeing her own interest—an interest
much greater than that of England and France on this
question—(hear. hear)—seeing likewise that the interest of
Europe is involved in the settlement of this question—will,
with the Government of Prussia, act generally with us,
and I have no doubt of the immediate result. (Hear,
hear.) I say, considering all these things, that our time
has not been lost in our efforts for conciliation, and in
doing everything that we could consistently for our honour
and interest for that purpose, and in endeavouring to per-
suade the Government of Austria to take what we think a
more enlightened and more successful course. (Hear.)
In the course of the debate there have been remarks made
upon various subjects—upon some foreign subjects by the
right honourable gentleman opposite ; upon some domestic
subjects by others—which have been omitted in the
Speech. I quite agree in the importance of the treaty
to which the right honourable gentlemen refers, and
I have had the honour to present this evening, by
command of her Majesty, papers connected with that'
treaty. (Hear, hear.) But really considering the import-
ance of some of the principal topics touched upon, there
were so many topics contained in the Speech that unless
the right hon. gentleman would recommend us to depart
from all former precedents, and to frame the Royal Speech
of the levgth of the message of the President of the United
States (a laugh)—we should not be able to include all the
various topics to be referred to. (Hear.) A most impor-
tant subject has been mentioned by the right hon. baronet
the member for Tamworth—the subject of education ; and
the hon. member for Montrose has also spoken on that sub-
ject. There is not one, I believe, more anxious to see a
good system of education extended and established in this
country than lam myself. But it is necessary to consider
the means by which that object may be accomplished.
With regard to one part of this great subject, taken as a
whole—namely, the question of the English universities—
we have taken that subject into consideration, and I hope
that during the course of the month of February—in the
middle or towards the end of it—we shall introduce a mea-
sure for the improvement and reform of the University of
Oxford. (Hear, hear.) With respect to another depart-
mentwritmhoeeeursosshuuoombs
should
mletaihsethui
wiersaaeuwnisrtdieriaselwtl subject, namely, education in Scotland, my
right hon, friend the Lord Advocate has prepared a bill on
t
we
iatnleei
introduce
hegoivadt
evtuinoese finallyteetoit
it. Now,
csa
introduce
etNei
oa
hwp,
eriopwvwbr
oeotdfghuorlorer( fiese
srwsbpaoyetef
he
sayt
respect
hrte
eo t Go-
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merous
any-
things
respecting them. The right hon. gentleman has
spoken of the question of reform in Parliament, and be
seemed partly to agree and partly to disagree with his hon.
friend the member for Liverpool. The hon. member for
Liverpool told us that Mr. Pitt, in the year 1793, declared
that he was no supporter of a measure of Parliamentary
reform in consequence of the war to which the country was
engaged. Now, however great may be the authority re-
ferred to, for my part I had much rather that Mr. Pitt had
at that, time roframod from catering into the war, and pro:

ceeded with the Parliamentary reform. (Cheers.) But I
do not think the precedent is applicable to the present
time: If it were so, indeed, it would be no slight post-
ponement of the question of reform, because that reform.
which Mr. Pitt postponed in 1793 was not adopted by Par-
liament until nearly forty years afterwards, and I certainly
cannot consent to postpone reform for that length of time.
(Hear, hear.) But, sir, it is to be considered whether the
excuse was a good or a bad one. What Mr. Pitt was
engaged in resisting, or counteracting, was the spirit of
republicanism and democracy, and he thought it unwise
to allow that spirit to display itself by supporting any
measure of Parliamentary reform. (Hear, hear.) That was,
in fact, the tendency, spirit, and object of his war. At pre-
sent we are in a totally different position. Whatever
complaint we may have to make of the Emperor of Russia,
it is not that which Mr. Pitt made, namely, that he is
engaged in supporting the pestilent doctrines of democracy
abroad. (Hear, hear.) We cannot say that the Emperor
of Russia has issued any decree of fraternisation by which
he hopes to support republicanism. (Hear, hear.) There
is, therefore, no likeness between the cases, but I own, for
my part, I do not agree in the cogency of the argument,
even without the precedent which my hon. friend (if, he
will allow me so to call him) the hon. member for Liver-
pool has used. It does not appear to me that this is at
:al an unfit or improper time for introducing the ques-
tion of Parliamentary reform. (Hear.) I know to those
who do not like the measure a fit time is always wanting.
Mr. Wyndham, who was a great master of illustration and
delusion, when a measure was introduced in a time of
public quiet and peace, said, "You are like the man in the
Spectator, who had every symptom of the gout except the
pain (laughter) ; you are going to deal with a disease that
causes you no inconvenience." Times changed, and there
was a vast deal of commotion, and agitation, and excite-
ment, and Mr. Wyndham still opposed reform, saying
" Surely you will not repair your house in the hunting.
season." (Laughter.) On both occasions he was ready
with an illustration, and so it is with many of those who
now say that this is not the time to introduce a measure
of Parliamentary reform. I cannot but refer to a pledge
which 1. gave on this subject in the year 1848, a time evi-
dently when a great democratic revolution was flying
through Europe. I thought when the honourable member
for Montrose then proposed a measure of reform that it was
not advisable to introduce a measure of that kind at that
period. I said " Although I cannot concur with your pro-
posal at this time, or with the exact grounds of your pro-
posal at any time, yet my opinion is that when this fit has
passed away, and when Europe shall be tranquil, so far as
regards those democratic movements, that will be the time
to consider further improvements in our representative
system." I cannot think that there is any danger in discus-
sing the question of reform during the excitement of a
foreign war, but the time that really is dangerous for such
a discussion is the time of great popular excitement and dis-
sension at home. (Hear.) It is said there is no feeling on
the subject—that there is a complete apathy about reform.
If that be the case, is it not the proper time to discuss the
question of reform? (Hear.) Lest in the course of war
there should be times and periods of distress, when the
people should become excited, and large meetings should
be assembled in every town, partly crying out for more
wages and cheaper food, and partly crying out for an in-
crease of political power—is it not wise to forestall any
demand of that sort? (Hear.) Supposing we have the
calamity of war, and have with it the necessity for in-
creasing the public burdens, is it not a fitting time to en-
large the privileges of the people
twat the
are imposing.
upon them fresh taxes (hear), so that the House of Com-
mons, in imposing taxes upon the people, may, as far as
possible, impose them upon those who have elected them ?
(Hear.) When the bill shall be introduced, the right hon.
gentleman opposite will have an opportunity of making
his criticisms upon its character. I own the right hon.
gentleman somewhat surprised me. After saying that
it was unwise to introduce a reform bill at the present
time, he ended by suggesting that perhaps he should
have a reform bill of his own. (Laughter.) If that is in-
troduced, I shall listen to the right honourable gentleman's
proposal, and see if we can borrow anything from the stile
—(a laugh)—which he has no doubt given to his bill.
(Hear, hear.) I remember about two years ago, when the
right hon. gentleman held the office of Chancellor of the
Exchequer, he spoke then of the expediency and propriety
of giving the franchise to the working men. (Hear, hear.)
That was his doctrine at that time, and we shall see when
this bill is introduced whether he has departed from or
maintained that doctrine. (Hear.) After having stated
generally the views which I entertain with regard to the
several topics of the Address, I have to call the attention
of the house to a subject of very great importance, but one
in speaking of which I hope I may not overpass the bounds
of due discretion. (Hear, hear.) I rejoice that I have
not been wrong in supposing that no member of this house
would in any way adopt or countenance the calumnies
that have been spread abroad with respect ,to a royal per-
sonage—(loud cries of hear, hear, and cheers) the
Prince Consort. (Hear, hear.) And, sir, if those calum-
nies were like ordinary calumnies, I might be disposed to
leave them without notice to
pass away in the course of
time; but they affect so much the highest interest of the
State, and there has been so much of honest delusion, as
well as of violent calumny, that I do feel it is necessary to
make some statement with regard to the position of that
illustrious Prince. (Hear, hear.) I may just say, that
ference on the part of his Royal Highness, it is generally
while the charge is generally one of unconstitutional inter-
admitted—admitted throughout the country, and by all
parties, that there never was a Sovereign who has acted
more strictly than her Majesty in the spirit of the consti-
tution and in the exercise of her high prerogative. (Loud
cheers.) Her Majesty has accepted the Ministers whom
she found were approved of by the House of Commons,
and she has given them her whole and entire confidence.
(Hear, hear.) On her accession she found Lord Melbourne
Prime Minister, and he had her entire confidence. (Hear,
hear.) Lord Melbourne was succeeded by Sir Robert Peel,
and Sir Robert Peel had the entire confidence of her Ma-
jesty. (Hear, hear.) It was my destiny to succeed Sir
Robert Peel, and during more than five years, in which I
held the honourable position which I then held, I can
say most truly that I received from her Majesty every
support—(cheers)—and every mark of confidence that a
Minister could expect. (Cheers.) I cannot but express
towards her Majesty my gratitude for the kindness with
which I was treated, and for the attention with which all
my representations were listened to by her Majesty.
(Cheers.) Well, then, is it not strange that it should be
said—is it not incredible that her Majesty, during a great
part of that time, should have her consort by her side, and
that while the whole of the conduct of her Government
has been most constitutional, it should be possible that the
Prince Consort during that time should have been acting
in an unconstitutional manner. (Hear, hear.) There is
something absurd and contradictory on the face of it—
(cheers)—but I do feel it is necessary, owing to the honest
delusion which I have said has prevailed, to enter—some-
what into what is the position (not much defined in any
of the law books or by precedents) of a. Prince Consort in
this country. (Hear, hear.) When her Majesty came to
the throne, being then only eighteen years of age, and of
course inexperienced, Lord Melbourne considered what it
became him to do when her Majesty was pleased to say
that he should continue in the post of First Lord of the
Treasury. (Hear, hear.) It seemed to Lord Melbourne
that it was his duty to advise her Majesty on all subjects
with regard to matters of domestic interest— with regard
to the arrangements of the palace, as well as to perform
the ordinary duties of Prime Minister. (Hear, hear.)
But, doubtful as to whether he had come to a right opi-
nion, he resorted for advice to the highest authority he
could obtain ; he went to the Duke of Wellington.
(Cheers) The Duke of Wellington entirely agreed with
him, and said that if he held the office of Prime Minister,
he would take exactly the course that Lord Melbourne had
pointed out. (Cheers.) Three years after her Majesty's
accession her Majesty espoused Prince Albert, the present
Prince Consort. The position in which Prince Albert
should stand was likewise a matter for'consideration. He
was, as the house knows, naturalised by Parliament, and
naturalised in such a manner that he could be a member
of the Privy Council. (Hear.) Some doubts have been
stated on this subject, but anybody who looks into the
subject will see that he was not only enabled but
fully authorised to sit in the Privy Council. (Hear, hear.)
Lord Melbourne asked me what was my opinion as to the
course that should be pursued with respectto the despatches
that should arrive, and all the secret communications of the
Minister ; I said that I had no doubt whatever that her
Majesty should communicate them as she thouglat fit to
the Prince-Consort—(cheers)—and that I did not think, in
his relation to her Majesty, it would be fair to have any
concealment on the subject. (Loud cries of hear, hear,
and cheers.) I am not sure from recollection, and do not
very distinctly recollect, whether Lord Melbourne at that
time mentioned the subject, but I am sure that Lord Mel-
bourne and I thought it our duty to advise that that
should be the conduct with regard to public despatches
and communications. (Hear.) I think that any other ad-
vice would be foolish and unbecoming. (Cheers.) It could
not but happen that the Prince, after his marriage, should
discuss public events with her Majeety—(hear, hear)—and
that he should only gather his information from the news-
papers or public statements, while her Majesty- had all
the despatches and official information before her, would not
only be an absurdity, but it would be impracticable.
(Cheers.' Well, then, sir, such being the position of the
Prince, it is quite evident that there is no truth whatever
in the colour which has been attempted to be placed upon.
his Royal Highness's relation to her Majesty in this re-
spect, on nt he statement that Lord Melbourne constitu-
tionally
affairs,
debarredan d
thatthe Princesiritbert Peel was the first person
o from a knowledge of those
ho introduced the practice. (Hear, hear.) Why, sir, I
believe it is true, that in Sir Robert Peel's time, it first
happened that his Royal Highness was present during the
interview with Ministers, but the house will at once see,
that if his Royal Highness, according to the advice of Lord
going on, and
was
the Ministers had
iswheitdh nhostrhMinagjebsteyond the principle
Melbourne,knew
e iasntrwell
uvicaatssi
ohnieurifnomtroma
jteehdset oycfl
closet
thattwh when
etnwas
taking place, his
y, was merely a con-
y theirhesntie communicationshn ao de,beaenbeen
a odsotpateh d •
(Hear, hear.) If the Prince had not
been present when the Ministers were with h3r Majesty,
her Majesty would have communicated with him. That
would be a circuitous report of what the Ministers had
said, and would be a less convenient mode of proceeding
than if his Royal Highness had been present ; for in the one
ease, as in the other, his Royal Highness having, I need
hardly say, the intellect—(cheers)--the information, and
(Hear, hear.) I am now
the general knowledge—(hear, hear)—which belong to him,
it would bare been quite impossible that her Majesty
iwroopuoldrtannootehtahvaet spoken
vld
storiseh.ins on every matter of great
speaking generally of their relations, without any refer-
ence to the constitutional relations which subsist between
1 the Sovereign and her Ministers, because, as I have stated
at the commencement, there has never been any com-
plaint that those relations have not been properly recog-
nised. (Hear, hear.) It was Lord Melbourne and I who
advised it, and we thought we were acting entirely and in
the spirit of the constitution in giving
that advice, that
his Royal Highness should be fully informed with respect
to all that had passed. (Hear, hear.) But did Lord Mel-
bourne consider that there was no advantage in her Ma-
jesty taking that counsel. (Hear, hear.) Be it remembered
that he had taken 'upon himself on her accession, during
the youth of the Queen, to give her advice upon Burin
the
At the time that Sir Robert Peel assumed the reins
of September, 1841 and on
of Government her . Majesty eel
as
already mar-
ythegar Lord Melbourne wrote in
those terms to her Majesty— " Lord Melbourne cannot
ritheediat was
Augusti n the bn
thaten
satisfy himself without again stating to your Majesty in
writing, what he had the honour of saying to your Majesty
respecting his Royal Highness the Prince. Lord Melbourne
has formed the highest opinion of his Royal Highness's
judgment, temper, and discretion, and he cannot but feel
a great consolation and security in the reflection, that he
leaves your Majesty in a situation in which your Majesty
has the inestimable advantage of such advice and assist-
ance. Lord Melbourne feels certain that your Majesty
cannot do better than to have recourse to it when it is
needed, and to rely upon it with confidence." That was
the opinion which Lord Melbourne had formed of
who
his
Royal Highness's ability, and I may say that
could form
no one
had any intercourse with his Royal Highness
any other opinions (hear, hear)—but must appreciate the
judgment and the ability of this arniable prince. I should
be sorry, without necessity, to refer to 049 affairs of a

" Great Stanhope-street, Jan. 20.
" Lord Hardinge presents his compliments to Sir George
Brown, and requests his attention to an article in the
Morning Advertiser of the 18th of January, which des-
ciibes ' Sir George Brown as having onlone occasion replied
with great emphasis to Lord Hardinge that he was aware
that he had sworn allegian,ce to her Majesty, but that he
could not recognise the authority of the Prince in any
matter connected with his office at the Horse Guards.'
Lord Hardinge desires to be informed whether, in the
transaction of the official business of the Adjutant-Gene-
ral's department, any such conversation as that described
ever took place between them ?"
The reply to this letter was as follows :
" 61, Eaton-square, Jan. 20.
" Sir George Brown presents his compliments to Lord
Hardinge, and in reply to his note this moment received,
begs to assure his lordship thathe has no recollection what-
ever of ever having received orders from him as emanating
from Prince Albert, and that consequently he never could
have expressed himself in the terms he is represented to
have done in the article extracted from the Morning Ad-
vertiser, transmitted with his lordship's note."
With regard to the other statements respecting the Horse
Guards, the same contradiction could be given if it were
worth while. I believe I have described accurately the state
of the case, and of the relations which do exist between
Prince Albert and the commander-in-chief. When the
Duke of Wellington was commander-in-chief, .these com-
munications were frequent. They have been less frequent
of late, but they all relate to the general efficiency of the
army. There is another subject, with respect to which a
specific assertion was likewise made. It was said that upon
questions of foreign policy, and more especially upon that
Eastern question which at present absorbs to so great a de-
gree the attention of the country, Prince Albert had taken
a course to thwart the advice of her Majesty's responsible
Ministers, and that in the attempt so to thwart their ad-
vice he was in the habit of writing to foreign ministors on
these subjects. Now, on that point I will read the
following letter from the Earl of Westmoreland :
" TO THE EDITOR OF THE MORNING ADVERTISER.
" Sir—my attention has been called this day to a para-
graph in the Morning Advertiser of the 14th inst., which
states That if these noblemen (Lord Stratford de Red-
cliffe and Lord Westmoreland) were called on to state what
has passed in writing between an illustrious personage
and themselves, relative to the Eastern question, and to
produce the correspondence, we have no doubt that disclo-
sures would be made which would startle the people of
England from their propriety.
" I lose no time in informing you that there is not the
slightest foundation for the supposition therein contained.
I have not had any communication, directly or indirectly,
with the ' illustrious personage' alluded to since I first
came to Vienna. I never received a letter from toe P
containing one word upon politics, public men, or public
affairs. The only letters with which his Royal Highness
has honoured me have related to matters of art and bene-
volence.
" I feel satisfied that you will take an early opportunity
of giving publicity to this contradiction of the report cir-
culated in your paper. " Your obedient servant,
"Vienna, Jan. 22, 1854." " WESTMORELAND."
Thus, whenever these allegations took a specific shape, it is
obvious they could be at once contradicted, and that a
manner the most decided. His Royal Highness has never
been in the habit of corresponding with foreign ministers.
There was one instance, and I believe one only, in which it
happened that a minister at a foreign Court wrote to him,
undesired and unrequested by him, and his Royal High-
ness immediately sent the letter to the Secretary of State
for Foreign Affairs, and desired to know what answer be
advised him to return. With respect to the Court of St.
Petersburg, I believe that the only communications that
have passed 'have been on matters of ordinary courtesy
and civility, and that is some ti me since that took place.
On another occasion, when a near relation of her Majesty,
being the representative of Austria at the Court of St.
Petersburg, was afflicted by a dangerous illness, Sir
Hamilton Seymour, our Minister at that Court, wrote
repeated accounts from day to day of the health of that
relation. I have thus gone through these various allega-
gations quite as far as it is proper and becoming that
I should do so. I need hardly appeal to this house to
consider, but I hope that the country. will consider,
whatder,
must be the position of the Prince as relates
to her Majesty. We have had two female sovereigns be-
fore, both of whose reigns were great and glorious in En-
glish history. Queen Elizabeth, no doubt, feeling that she
would not like to divide her power, and that her mind and
her fortitude and her ambition were fully equal to the
conduct of all the affairs of this realm, never married
as the house knows. Queen Anne Was married to a prince
of no very distinguished intelligence, and we all know that
while the policy of Marlborough prevailed great victories
were gained; but that, owing to a change of iniltienee at

the palace, to one lady supplanting another, these victories
gave place to the convention of Utrecht. Her present
Majesty is in a different position to either of these sove-
reigns. Her Majesty is married to a prince of singular
attainments, and their domestic life is as good an example
to all the Queen's subjects as her constitutional conduct is
a model for all sovereigns. (Cheers.) Would any man
believe me if I were to say that, while thus united, the
Queen never consulted with the Prince Consort—whose
eminent qualifications I have described—with respect to
affairs that nearly interest her Majesty, that interest her
fortunes, and the fortunes of her crown, the welfare of
her people, the happiness of her interior life, and her rela-
tions with many of those who are dear to her? No one
would believe me if I made such an assertion. I say, then,
that 1 hope in future there will be no delusion upon the sub-
ject. There is no harm in telling the whole truth withregard
to this matter; in saying that her Majesty andthe Prince are
inseparablyunited, and that with regard to public counsels
as with regard to private affairs, they have no greater com-
fort than to communicate with one another. (Hear, hear.)
And when the people of this country, always just in the
end, have reflected upon these matters, I think that the
result of these calumnies, base ai they are, and of these
delusions; blind as they have been, will be to attach the
people of this country still more strongly to the Queen of
these realms, and to give a firmer and. a stronger founda-
tion to the throne. (Loud cheers.)
Mr. WALPOLE—Sir, I am sure that the house and the
country are indebted to the noble lord for the manly,
henourable, and able m anner in which he has vindicated

she PrinCe Consort from charges as calumnious and, in my
)pinion, as extravagant as ever were urged against any man.
It would be presumption in me to add much to the state-
ment of the noble lord ; for, with regard to the specific

charges brought against that illstrioua personage, they are
disposed of completely ; and, with regard to the constitu-
tional position occupied by his Royal Highness, I have no
hesitation in saying publicly what I have often before ex-
pressed in private with reference to these calumnies—that I
conceive there is, according to the constitution, not only no
reason why every public and private matter should not be
communicated to the Prince Consort by the Queen, but
that it would be contrary to all good feeling to suppose
that such communications should not take place. The
only point which I wish to add to the statement of the
noble lord is this ;—the noble lord has assured the house
that her Majesty the Queen has, according to the constitu-
tion, invariably reposed the utmost confidence in the
ministers of her choice, beginning with Lord Melbourne,
going on with Sir R. Peel, and ending with himself. I
hope I may be allowed to supply the only omission in the
noble lord's statement. On my honour, I positively assert,
on behalf of Lord Derby and his colleagues, that the same
confidence was as frankly and as fully confided to them by
h.er Majesty. I will add no more on this point, because
the noble lord has so completely disposed of the whole of
this case. I will not be supposed to flatter the Prince ;
but still less will I, from fear of stating what I believe
to be the troth, detract one iota from the high and just
praise which the noble lord has given to the consort of
the Queen, whose intelligence, capacity, and conduct since
he has been in this country, entitle him to every possible
respect and esteem from all her Majesty's subjects. (Hear.)
Having disposed of that part of the speech of the noblelord,
perhaps the house will allow me to recall its attention to the
commencing passages of his speech. The part of his speech
to which I refer related to our foreign policy. In these
passages the noble lord has to my mind supplied a great
omission, which would otherwise have been remarked upon
in the country, with respect to certain matters connected
with Russia and Turkey. In the first place he has assured
the house, and I think it will be satisfactory to the coun-
try to hear the assurance, that the last efforts at negotia-
tion which have been going on between this country and
foreign powers have now brought the matter to an unani-
mous expression of opinion on the part of the four great
powers, and as I understood the noble lord, with the assent
of Turkey. (Hear.) I conclude he refers to what is called
the collective note, which, to my mind, whatever may be
my opinion of the former parts of-the transaction, has put
the matter on a proper basis—the vindication of the inde-
pendence and integrity of Turkey. Another satisfactory
part of the noble lord's speech appeared to me that in
which he supplied an omission in the Speech from the
Throne. I mean the passage in which he referred to the
disposition of the other powers. I understand from his
statement, that we may now expect, if not as certain, at
least as possible, that the Emperor of Austria and the King of
Prussia are concurring or likely to concur, with France and
England in the views they take on this question. That
also was a communication which I was glad to hear from
the noble lord. The noble lord made a third observation
equally important, though I cannot agree with him on the
conclusions which he drew from it. He told us that he
thought it was not only not detrimental, but that it was
advantageous to this country and to Europe to protract
negotiations as long as possible, if by these protracted ne-
gotiations peace could be secured, and the interests of the
parties were not in the meantime impaired. I hope the
noble lord will forgive me for reminding him, in connection
with this part of his speech, that it was while former nego-
tiations were goinon that the Pruth was crossed, in order
to obtain " a material guarantee for peace"—a new term, I
believe, in European diplomacy. And we should not shut
our eyes to the fact, that it was while these negotiations
were proceeding that the principalities have been occupied,
that contributions have been levied, and that martial law
has been proclaimed there. Now I agree with the noble lord
that negotiations should be continued so long as there is a
chance of peace being preserved, consistently with the
security due to Turkey. And I hope that negotiations will
not be continued if no better protection can be secured to
Turkey than she has met with in the occupation of the
principalities and the disaster of Sinope. (Hear, hear.)
And now, sir, I cannot refrain from making a passing ob-
servation with reference to the remarks which fell from
the noble lord on the subject of the Reform Bill. My right
hon. friend (Mr. Disraeli) pointed out to the noble lord the
extreme inconvenience of discussing a measure of this kind
which may give rise to great difference of opinion while
we should be endeavouring to unite every person in this
country, hand and heart, to stand by an ally unjustly at-
tacked, and to prevent any furl her injustice being wrought
against Turkey. I think the observation of my hon. friend
was a just one ; but at any rate I hope that the noble lord,
on proposing his Reform Bill, will take the advice given
him by my hon. friend in a previous observation—that be
will not confound electoral purification with Parliamen-
tary reform or the reconstruction of the Commons House
of Parliament ; and that in the bill to be introduced care
will be taken not to give to any class in this country an
undue share of the representation. In my opinion, the
noble lord has hazarded a great deal in introducing this
Reform Bill ; and I should have thought it would have
been safer, notwithstanding the pledges which the Minis-
ters of the Crown have given to propose some reform,
not to have proposed it in the present state of
affairs. And I must say that I have considerable
doubts, and always lia.Ve entertained considerable doubts,
as to whether any further reform in the representation
of the people is either desired, .or is likely to be bene-
ficial. Nay, more, I will go on and say that if you pro-
pose a reform bill, you must prove two propositions before
you can expect the Parliament of this country to adopt it.
One is, that you do not make any unnecessary changes,
and that you do not make any unless you are convinces
that there are grievances and abuses which cannot be re-
dressed without a material alteration in the constitution of
,:he State. The second proposition is, that when you make
tha,+, representative alteration, you do not by the change
introuluce greater evils than those that yon propose to re-
form. lut as I have already said, Ido not wish to anti-
cipate the discussion of this question. lam sure that
when it is laic: on the table of the house, it will have the
consideration wb:ich it deserves; but I frankly own that
I neither think the time convenient for the proposition of
such a measure, nor I think that the measure itself is
at all required. I must sb.
v that I doubt very much whe-
ther the constitution of the Cs
ommons House of Parliament
will be improved by further tai.-IPering with the distribu-
tion of the franchise. (Hear, heal •)
The Address was then agreed to.
The SPEAKER informed the house ti: at he had received
from the Parliamentary agent a communication, stating
that the petition against the return of the present members
for the borough of Liverpool would not be further pro-
ceeded with.
The house then adjourned at ten minutes before eleven
o'clock.

THE MURDER AT ACTON.

VERDICT OF THE JURY.

Yesterday Mr. Wakely resumed, at the Goldsmiths'
Arms, East Acton, the thrice adjourned inquiry touching
the death of Richard Medhurst, aged 14, who was
found murdered in a ditch in Friar's-lane. The facts
of this barbarous case are so fresh upon tha public mind
that they need no recapitulation. The inquiry was
adjourned on the last occasion, in order that the coroner
might apply to the Secretary of State for the production
before the jury of a person named Wildbore, who
had been arrested, charged with the murder ; but in
consequence of the subsequent acquittal of that person by
the police court, the coroner did not consider it necessary
to apply to Lord Palmerston. It being expected that Mr.
Wildbore would appear before the coroner yesterday,
much excitement prevailed in the neighbourhood, and a
number of persons collected outside the Goldsmiths' Arms,
in the expectation of catching a glimpse of him. On the
re-assembling of the jury, the summoning officer having,
in %nswer to the coroner, said there was no fresh
, evidence forthcoming, the coroner, after making
same cursory remarks as to the extraordinary nature
of the case, proceeded to charge the jury. He said
he felt that it would be useless to adjourn again, as,
although he considered the guilty parties would be
eventually discovered, yet that would not be in all probabi-
lity for some time to come. He hoped, in conclusion,
that the police would use their utmost endeavours to dis-
cover the guilty parties, for it was a fearful and frightful
thing for the public to feel that their childreend could
13 not
some
go abroad without being kidnapped and us for 0111
abominable purposes.
Sergeant Earthy said the police were using their utmost
ersons.
en
The Coroner remarked that he wasthe sure perpetrators
of the diabolical deed would not long escape the punish,
ment which their crime demanded.
The jury then retired, and after a brief consultation,
.
returned a verdict of " Murder against some person
or persons unknown."
resented himself on behalf of
After the verdict had been recorded, Mr. Fairman,
,btohrnatehde down
soli-
citor, of Bishop Stortford, P
said that his cliegnatinwstashision
Mr.Wildbore, and
groundless charge brought a
by the _
confined to a bed of illness, and was therefore wholly un-
able to attend the inquiry, although he vast most anxious
to
anxious
to have done •
so But if the coroner ui
wo d adourn the
investigation, Mr. Wildbore would be enabledj to attend
on a future day.
The Coroner said that not a tittle of evidence i
IVir."Virild.bore had been adduced before Vmplicating
He thought
that the police ought sot to be too hasty in making an ar-
rest, where the evidence was so alight
against the accused.
The jury fully acquiesced in the coroner's observations ;
after which the witnesses ' were bound over in the usual
recognizances to ap •if
pealrequired to prosecute in the
matter, and the inquiry terminated.

SCHOOLS FOR DESTITUTE AND CRIMINAL CHILDREN.—
A memorial has been presented to Viscount Palmerston
by a number of inhabitants of Hull, urging the necessity
for immediate legislation to provide at the public ex-
pense, in all populous districts, industrial and reforma-
tory establishments, where all destitute and neglected
children shall be educated and trained in useful habits,
and where in a separate ward or establishment, and un-
der classification, those convicted of crime may he like-
wise trained until of an age to earn their own subsist-
ence, the parents of all such children in the meantime
being liable for the expenses incurred.
The Duko and Duchess of Roxburgh have arrived at
the Clarendon Hotel, Bond-street, from Brighton. Lord
and Lady Falmouth have also arrived at the Clarendon,
from Mereworth Castle, Maidstone. ' •