The Sun.
London, England, 1853-07-23 00:00:00

reference was made to our advancing intelligence, but sister-in-law as a sister. There would be no alteration as to
he entirely denied that anything like perfection had been husband and wife ; they paid no duty on succession now.
reached in our financial legislation. The law was about The Earl of HARROWBY was opposed to the bill. If
identical with one brought in at the time of the Norman
the balance was fairly struck at the present moment, any
man who gave a fair and candid opinion would admit that
Conquest. Persons were then employed by the Crown to the land contributed more than its fair proportion to the
ascertain the value of all lands, and tax them accordingly ; burdens of the country. One of the effects of the bill would
the principle of this measure was precisely the same. The be to make a man a slave to his lawyer, and involve him in
eatr expen than the tax itself. All te diculties the old law had been abolished in 1664; and now, after a lapse gre on the land would presshmore severely on
of two centuries, it was proposed to re-enact one founded
smallwr inflict rose
proprietors than large ones ; and he really did think,
on the same wide principles—a proposal which he must looking at the evils which must arise from the measure,
characterise as absurd, cowardly, and unjust. The whole that it had been most hastily undertaken. It was a tax
principle of a tax upon successions was as absurd and cow-
against which no great classes could remonstrate, and it
ardly as it certainly was unfair and unjust ; and his first washos muche
th safer t o ttss x classeseid thatno cold
know
whetherremonstrate
feeling was one of astonishment that such a proposition as i support could no
any of the amendments to be proposed, but he
that of the Government should have proceeded from the disapproved of the principle of the measure.
present Chancellor of the Exchequer. He could not accord The Earl of DERBY said that in answer to the appeal
Lim
micth
lhad been made to him, it would be impossible for
to Mr. Gladstone much financial experience indeed,
hich he
the right honourable gentleman himself would not lay might move maLoonoothLtable thes specific Pf
h throughcbffe'dmenls w • committee.
claim to it—but he did concede to him, as everybody must The bill had only belerongideelive red that morning, and they
do, that high moral character which he had always main- ihid had very little time to consider more than the main
principle. He could not, therefore, say that he would
tamed, both by his example and precept. If his books
I lay on the table amendments which iiglit be found neces-
e true expression of the right hon. gentleman's
sary, or not, in. the discussion of the clauses ; but he might
mwinred,aand contained a true description of his feelings,
the one great object he must have in view must be the ad-
state that ole amendment which he should move would be
vanceinent and the maintenance of a high moral standard `
on the second i
clause, and the effect of it would be to make
in all matters influenced by public opinion. But he had .).1
the application of the bill saving to the interests of all ex-
nevertheless founded all his financial policy upon specula-
isting settlements. He should also move a clause for limit-
;
tions on some of the worst passions of human nature. His in; the operation of the bill to 5 years.
'
measures speculated upon the selfishness of human nature.
she bill was then read a second '
He proposed schemes that would not immediately injure The Land Revenues Bill was read time a
third time andmsed.
those who sat in Parliament, but the effects of which would
P Th- Colonial Church Regulation Bill was reported, with
fall upon persons not in a position to defend themselves. In
his plan for the conversion of stock he began by attempting amendments, and ordered to be read a third time on 3fon-
to frighten people who had money in the funds into the
da7fneir lordships adjourned at 20 minutes to 10 o'clock.
idea that the conversion of the Three per Cents. was almost
a matter of certainty, whereas the most distinguished prac-
tical financial authorities living would have told him that
such an event was nearly impossible. But the right hon.
gentleman's object was to work on the bad passions of our
nature, and upon an egotistical desire to sacrifice others for
our own benefit. A succession duty was not likely to touch
their lordships themselves ; for most of them, as well as the
members of the other house, had probably inherited as much
as they expected to get ; and it was a most immoral thing
to saddle posterity with demands they ought to pay them-
selves. He had said this was a tax cowardly in its principle.
Its authors in 1796, like the right hon. gentleman, thought
they should only have to face one man at a time. Each
successor paid the tax and then disappeared; so that they
could never get up any public feeling to bear upon the
minister of the day. His (Lord Malmesbury's) notion of a
good tax was that it should, year by year, bring an in-
creasing amount to the Exchequer. They might certainly
say that the amount derived from this impost would in-
crease, as the prosperity and property of the country in-
creased ; but he thought that the effect would turn out to
be quite the contrary ; for it would depreciate the value
of property, and prevent the accumulation of wealth.
But just look at the moral consequences that would
ensue. Of course the Chancellor of the Exchequer's
only care was to get as much money, and as quietly
as possible. To be sure his bill would make all men
patriots ; for every man would die for his country,
and his successor would " bleed" for its good. (Laughter.)
Of course, if a man disinherited his son, and left his pro-
perty to his servant, he would be so much the more a
patriot, because then the country would get ten per cent.
instead of one. The bill would hardly square, it was
true, with recent legislation for promoting the public
health • because it was obvious that those periodical
mortalities, the recurrence of which the appointment of
the Board of Health had been designed to check, would
be a sort of harvest for the right honourable gentle-
man. From these sickly seasons the right honourable gen-
tleman would have derived much additional profit, and
by that means would be enabled to present many more
brilliant budgets. (Laughter.) But only think what
would be the effect of the measure upon the Chancellor of
the Exchequer's social position. The Chancellor of the Ex-
chequer was never a very popular character—(laughter)—
but inasmuch as a great deal of the taxation had hitherto
been indirect, and as even the direct taxation was not at all
to be compared for injustice and oppression to this—the
right hon. gentleman, for the time being, had been pretty
well received in society. (Laughter.) But what would
his position be now ? He would be a sort of vulture soar-
ing over society and inviting for the harvest of death.
(Laughter.) He would be the heir of every man's pro-
perty ; and every man would hold his property under the
Crown who had formerly held it independently. (Hear.)
Under such such a state of things, he could hardly conceive
the right hon. gentleman approaching even his colleagues,
and asking, even in the most conventional manner, after
his health. (Great laughter.) He (Lord Malmesbury)
was perhaps wrong in jesting upon a subject of such
importance. The proposal to base the calculation of a
man's life interest upon a set of tables was manifestly ab-
surd. It might indeed be fair if everybody were placed
in exactly the same circumstances—if everybody died at
70—if every one married at 25, and had a son exactly nine
months after his wedding. (A laugh.) The chances of
life of a man 50 years of age might be much greater than
those of one at 21, but the latter would, nevertheless, have
to pay much more. They did not do so at the insurance
offices. If a noble lord wished to insure his life a doctor
would be called in to see him ; his pulse would be felt, a
stethescope would be applied to his chest, and inquiries
would be made as to his former mode of life. If there
was any blot he must pay for it ; and if his life was a bad
one it would be refused altogether. (Hear, hear.) Again,
they were going to apply the same rule to the whole com-
munity ; but would it be fair to use the same scale in the
case of one of their lordships' eldest sons and a military
officer succeeding at the same age to property in the time
of war? Or to apply the same rule to one of their lord-
ships' sons, and to those persons who followed trades and
professions that were notoriously unhealthy? (Hear.)
Nothing could be more obviously unjust and unfair than to
take a mere arithmetical calculation of the value of lives.
(Cheers.) The bill had been proposed as a compensation
—the phrase had been used in another place—for the in-
come tax, which they were told was to be abolished at the
end of seven years. Of the two, however, he considered
the tax on successions by far the most unbearable ; and
he protested that, although he did not expect to in-
herit anything beyond what he had already received,
lie would rather pay income tax to the end of his life than
agree to the imposition of this unjust tax upon his sue 3S-
sors. (Cheers.) The income tax was, at all events, a
charge upon property they had enjoyed ; but the succes-
sion tax was a charge upon property which they had hardly
received and might probably never get. (Hear.) It was,
indeed, argued that the bill was necessary to remove the
injustice of charging legacy duty upon personal and excus-
ing real property ; but it was injustice. A more states-
man-like act would have been to have removed the tax
altogether. (Hear.) He believed that the present Govern.
ment could have done so, although it was not in the power
of that to which he had himself belonged, for the events
that had taken place previous to their accession to office,
bound them to diminish taxation in a certain direction.
It was a point of honour with them to do so—they at-
tempted it, and they failed. They felt bound to diminish
the malt tax, in order to relieve a large portion of the
community, who had been unfairly treated, and of course
they could not afford to repeal half the malt tax and to
abolish the probate duties. When Mr. Disraeli alluded to
the subject in the other house and admitted that it was an
unjust tax, he did not mean to say that it was unjust be-
cause real property was not taxed like personal property.
(Hear.) What he really did mean to say was that the tax
was in its very nature inherently unjust, and that he had
considered it—as he (Lord Malmesbury) knew that he had
seriously done—with the view to see whether it could be
abolished or whether it could not. Not the least absurd
and unjust part of the bill was the graduated scale of con-
sanguinity duties. Of course, a minister's chief idea would
be, what would make the tax easiest to pass, and what
would diminish the number of its opponents. Hence the
graduations. Otherwise it was impossible to see why the
succession from a father to a son should be charged one per
cent., and that from brother to brother three per cent.,
especially as, generally speaking, a brother succeed-
ing to a brother would enjoy the property a much shorter
time than a son succeeding to his father. The case of na-
tural children was also peculiarly hard. It was true that
the bar which the heralds placed on a man's shield did
not place one in his advancement, and that many men who
had attained to the highest eminence hal been in that un-
fortunate position. Still it was a most unworthy thing on
the part of the Legislature to add an additional mark, to
point out the victims of the faults and crimes of their
parents. (Hear, hear.) The real secrets of the graduated
scale was to buy off the opposition of the largest class of
inheritors. The number of persons who paid ten per cent.
was of course very much less than those who paid the
smaller percentages ' • and yet the amount received was
more than all the rest. (Hear, hear.) The noble lord the
President of the Council had told them that they must ac-
cept the bill in order to maintain the popularity of the
aristocracy ; but there was a large class of property to be
exempt. Me was glad of that ; but surely if there was
anything in the noble lord's argument the church ought to
be brought within the operations of the bill. (Hear.) The
noble earl concluded by giving notice that he should move
amendments exempting title deeds from production, and
timber from taxation. Take the case of a person inheriting
timber from a tenth cousin and paying ten per cent. It
must be borne in mind that this timber already paid an
income tax of 3 per cent., making in all a tax of 13 per
per cent. Now the highest duty on Baltic timber was only
9 per cent., while Canada timber paid only a nominal duty
of a shilling, and staves were entirely free. The effect,
then of the bill would be to impose a tax upon the home-
grown article greater than the highest foreign duty, and
in some cases five times as much. Even as a financial
operation the proposal was not creditable. (Hear, hear.)
The bill was one of pains and penalties ; and it was one
that would keep open the ledger with the Government till
the grave closed over the person in possession. (Hear.)
Earl GRANVILLE said the noble earl had taken the
noble duke to task for having indulged in a disquisitionupon
different budgets : and then he went off in a comparison of
the rival budgets of Mr. Gladstone
lavished
Disraeli. The
strongest possible epithets had been and
on the bill ;
but he did not expect to hear the terms Osurd and cowardly
applied to it. As to the objectionwhich had been taken to
the tables, of course it was impossible to avoid cases of
hardship ; but it should be remarked that, in cases of per-
sonal property, the tax was charged upon the whole value.
The proposal of the Government, therefore, was a mitiga-
tion of the law. So with respect to the' consanguinity
tables, the question was rather to
proportion theamoun t
of the tax to the degree of expectancy ; and if they
lowered the 10 per cent., they must increase the lower
percentages. With regard to natural children, their po-
sition had been fixed by the law, and could not be
altered in an incidental manner by a bill like this. If the
present bill were rejected, it would take away from the
Government the power of giving the great relief to the
people at large which the budget proposed to give. As to
the objection that there would be a difficulty in getting a
remission of duty where it might be properly claimed, he
contended it was only imaginary ; and there need be no
unnecessary exposure, for those parts of the deeds which
did not refer to the particular question might be sealed up
from the observation of the commissioners. Then with
regard to timber, if they admitted the principle that pro-
perty must pay a tax on succession, would any one contend
that timber was not property ? It was clearly property ;
and on no principle of justice could they exempt it from the
tax they levied on all other sorts of property. He hoped
the noble earl would lay on the table the amendments
which he intended to propose, as he was sure he did not
wish to take the Government, or the house, by surprise.
Lord ST. LEONARDS did not wish to continue the dis-
cussion, because lie should have several amendments to
move in committee. He wished, however, to know
whe-
ther he was right in supposing the noble earl opposite
to
have said that brothers-in-law and sisters-in-law weretobe
exonerated ? He also wished to know whether there was
to be any alteration as to husband and wife
The LORD CHANCELLOR said his noble friend did
not put it quite so high as he might have done. He stated
that by the present bill a son-in-law or daughter-in-law
would stand in the same position as a son or a daughter.
His noble friend might have put it higher ; a brother-in-
law would stand in the same position as a brother, and a

HOUSE OF COMMONS—(YESTERDAY.)
The SPEAKER took the chair at 12 o'clock.
PRIVATE BUSINESS.
Pemberton Leigh's Estate Bill was read a third time
and passed.
The Galway Harbour Bill was considered, and ordered
to be read a third time.
Ward Jackson's Estate Bill was read a second time,
and ordered to be committed.
DOCKYARD APPOINTMENTS. _

Lord SEYMOUR brought up the report upon Dock-
yard Appointments, which was ordered to be printed.

LETTER CARRIERS.
Lord R. GROSVENOR presented a petition from
the Metropolitan letter carriers, praying the house to
take their condition into consideration, with a view to
increasing their salaries.
TENANT COMPENSATION (IRELAND) BILL.
The house then went into committee on this bill, coin-
mencing with clause 9.
Clause 9 was agreed to.
On clause 10, which provides that an evicted tenant
shall have power to recover compensation from the land-
lord for improvements which he has registered,
Colonel GREVILLE moved an amendment, to insert
the word " wilful," to provide that the eviction should
be for wilful neglect.
After considerable discussion, the committee divided,
and the numbers were—
For the amendment ... 67
Against it B5
Majority —lB
The clause was then agreed to, as were also clauses
11, 12, and 13.
On clause 14,
Mr. GROGAN proposed an amendment to limit the
time of compensation to ten years.
The committee then divided—
For the amendment 42
Against it B7
Majority 45
Lord C. HAMILTON moved the insertion of words
to limit the sum of compensation to four years of the
annual rent of the building.
The house then divided, when there appeared--
For the amendment
Against it 77
Majority —2s
Sir J. WALSH should feel it his duty to divide the
committee upon the clause, because it was objectionable
in principle, and could not be improved by any modifi-
cation. He considered the effect of it would be to in-
crease litigation between landlord and tenant in Ireland,
and to neutralise all the good which might be produced
by the bill.
Mr. CONOLLY believed that the bill had been drawn
up in order to set class against class in Ireland. Who,
he asked, would purchase property in that country if it
was subject to such restrictions ?
Mr. DRUMMOND said the very reason the bill was
introduced was that the tenant and landlord in Ireland
were at variance. He considered this clause was the
very essence of the bill. It was as good as could be
drawn up to meet an unfortunate state of things, and he
should give it his support.
After some further discussion the committee divided
on the clause, when there appeared—
For the clause......
Against it 44
Majority --59
The clause was then agreed to.
The remaining clauses and schedules were then agreed
to after a desultory conversation, in the course of which
Mr. Napier was complimented for the ability and energy
he had displayed in regard to the bill, both in the select
committee and in the committee of the whole house.
Mr. V. SCULLY moved the insertion of the follow-
ing clause after clause 16 :—" Any judgment or decree
obtained under this act, in respect of compensation for
improvements executed by any tenant who has been
evicted from, or put out of, possession of his holding,
shall be the first charge thereon ; and, in default of pay-
ment within the time limited by the court in that be-
half, shall entitle the tenant to go forthwith into actual
possession, or into receipt of the rents and profits of
such holding as mortgagee thereof, and to continue in
possession or receipt until fully paid off; with interest
and costs."
The committee divided, and the clause was rejected by
a majority of 91— the numbers being 25 and 116.
The house then resumed, and the bill was ordered to
be reported on Monday.
CAVAN ELECTION.
The SPEAKER intimated that be had been informed
that it was not intended to proceed with the petition
against the return for the borough of Cavan.
PILOTAGE BILL.
The house then went into committee on this bill.
Mr. CARDWELL explained that the Government
had made arrangements, founded on the calculations of
an actuary, to give every person dependent upon the
fund of the Cinque Port pilots, the same benefit that be
would have had if the fund had not been abolished. The
Government proposed to transfer the trust to the Trinity
House, to be administered by them in the same way as
heretofore, subject to the control of the Board of Trade.
He considered this was a just and equitable settlement
of a complicated question.
Mr. JAS. MACGREGOR objected to the proposal of
the Government, on the ground that it would have the
effect of diminishing the amount which these pilots were
now entitled to on superannuation, from 501. to about
301. a-year. They were a most meritorious body of
men, and he considered they were well entitled to the
indulgence of the committee.
Mr. HENLEY was of opinion that so meritorious a
body should be dealt with liberally.
Clauses 1,2, 3,4, 5,6, and 7 were agreed to.
It being four o'clock, the house adjourned.
The house resumed at six o'clock.
mANcEKGIRNONOSNOLJZed theIERS
Secretary-at-WarINANTIG.Mr.
whether
Antiguathat ordersrheacdr
übi
te efno stshu
ee dvirb by
tt hlen
dmi
ai iretagiyi
mai tuetlll.taossraictmoierrosneigcnstt the negro population of the island, in place
of enlisting African blacks as heretofore ; and, in case the
system of recruiting from island negroes was necessary for
the good of the service, whether permission could be grant-
ed to enlisted men at the proper season to assist the hands
on the various estates in taking in the crops?
Mr. S. HERBERT replied, that orders such as the hon.
member spoke of had not been issued, but that the change
which they were supposed to have effected had taken place
from other causes. It was accounted for by the fact that
there were not the same number of African blacks as here-
tofore, coupled with the circumstance that there had
sprung up a willingneu to enlist on the part of the popula-
tion of the West India Islands. As regarded the second
question, orders had been issued that furloughs should be
granted to the men at harvest time, and so there would be
as little abstraction of native labour as possible.
INCOME TAX ON IRISH DIVIDENDS.
In reply to Mr. BLAND,
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER was not
cognisant of any legal difference between the case of the
stockowner in England and Ireland. He had not had any
opportunity of ascertaining what deductions had been
made by the governor and directors of the Bank of Ireland,
but had not the smallest doubt that they had been in-
structed by the Commissioners of Inland Revenue to de-
duct income tax for the half year. That was in strict con-
formity both with the practice and the law ; and if it were
not, the house at this very time would have been passing
an income tax for six years and a half instead of for seven;
for whether they did or did not levy it in to June, 1853,
they could not in June, 1860.
FAIRS IN IRELAND.
Mr. BUTT asked the Chief Secretary for Ireland what
proceedings had been taken by the commissionertefin-
quiry into fairs and markets in Ireland, appointed pointed thee
u
warrant of the 29th of September, 1852; when
had yet made any report ; and whether their rerrt
made, together with the evidence taken by then,i, 'wordd
be communicated to the house ; and whether it was in-
tended to introduce any measure on the subject in tne pre-
sent session?
Sir J. YOUNG said the report would be printed in a
few days.
DISMISSAL OF JUDGES OF THE SUDDER
reply to lifxr.TOTWAY,gsahaeidhqtauhaeasuttoihotenthhadoeni
Sir C. WOOD,
on a previous oceasionouujegtehhlietnedngroowautinssdwaytatntat,
this subject, simply
having made
hreiamdsetlhfeapcyaupaeninter He might
the causes of dismissal in both
cases, he h&tl coma to the conclusion that it would not,
tend to raise the character of the Sudder Court, if he re-
stored these two judtegleesth(alteropgeetnshdwelblieuenhpcolhin.e
hhAaisds regarded the
suspension of Mr. Luard, i
possible as yet to say
t, "ins impossible
rmeadadieneasgssiannsdt
awhillaittymtuostsubbes tdanntei
parsons in high office at Bombay.
COURSE' 3F PUBLIC BUSINESS.
Mr. DISRAELI said it would be desirable to know
what the noble lord intended to be the course of public
business ?
Lord 3. RUSSELL had intended to explain this on
moving the adjournment of the house till Monday. The
Government had not allowed bills to be brought in, an
he hoped hon. members would not press measures of their
own requiring so much consideration as to render it un-
likely that they would be passed this session. There WA
•
one bill—the Education Bill—with reference to which no
had been asked a question more than once; he bad no
to state that he was exceedingly anxious Ito Pen