The Sun.
London, England, 1853-06-10 00:00:00

western Provinces the cases tried were 431 to 679 ; 5i per
cent. were decided by European judges, and 94 by natives;
27 per cent, of the native judges' decisions were reversed
on appeal, and 79 per cent. of the European judges' deci-
sions. He believed, even if the plan of the Government
succeeded to their utmost desire, that, after all, they would
only still be imitating the policy of a Metternich and a
Radetzky in Lombardy; and that they would find them-
selves in the end ruling over a few handsful of Englishmen
and natives, instead of over a great and united population.
Surely that was not a state of society which it was desir-
able to contemplate. Rather ought it not to be the ob-
ject of the British Government to maintain in India some-
thing like that kind of spirit of competition which diver-
tt Chh
ee Colonel
tins eve o
hand, b
sjofiled our England at home? In the eloquent language of
Sykes,aniodfldathinneatlGinoodnvieaornfasment plan was carried out,
mtShi
ear n
fTtahwt
ao
alms
consequences
pursuingM on ro ei, n wotfrhi
attithn
eg
country,
systemfgre oro fmv s e
or na
India,tmhtheeß e tsßo
rtohdhifateeideir
describedeGclidaao vlte,;a7t.
the strength of the English Government
Indiaam s n among theghert e
enjoynPe°
extend to the lives and ez:ntamlenndtianenaabaledb
jecittstao
degree of protection which was enjoyed by no native
power ; but that all those advantages were by the sacrifice of national independence charac-
terorrcaser asp
eacntd,
since
twhateverha nativesremained
f
pl et
hoeffrsueiltf;
occupation
of their labour and pursue their diff
in tranquillity, but they could aspire to beyondnothinogeeup a
mere animal state, for they could not look forward to any
share in the military or civil government of their country.
(Hear, hear.) Now he would ask the house was there an
example within the whole range of conquest in which the
natives of the country were so excluded from power as in
the case of the people of India? (Hear, hear.) The point,
however, which he wished specially to press upon the house
was the manner in which the company had distributed its
patronage, because that was the only subject upon which
they exercised an absolute and unlimited discretion, and
because on the manner in which they had performed their
duty in this respect they could base their only claim to a
renewal of confidence from the people of England. He
believed, however, that he had shown that the company
had exercised its vast prerogatives in the precise manner
most calculated to benefit their own immediate family con-
nections—(hear, hear)—and in the manner least calculated
either .to economise the resources of the country, or to
strengthen the social system of native India. He had
shown—firstly, bytheirabolition of the clause in the charter
which prescribed that there should be competition for
writerships, and, secondly, by their systematic exclusion
of natives from office—that they had deliberately betrayed
the trust which had been reposed in them by the Parlia-
ment of 1833, and broken the engagement on which they
had permitted the right hon. member for Edinburgh (Mr.
Macaulay) to ask for a renewal of their last lease of power.
It was said, however, that the privileges of the direCtors
were to be limited by this bill. But., surely, it was not
enough to withdraw the mere possession of patronage which
had been manifestly so misapplied. Surely, it would be
intolerable that the administration of the humblest village
in India should be left to the discretion of men who had
shown themselves incapable of distributing a few writer-
ships in the course of each year without yielding to a
melancholy and humiliating temptation. (Hear, hear.)
He objected to the bill of the right hon. gentleman, be-
cause it seemed to him most strongly to combine the con-
tradictory disadvantages of precipitation and delay—(hear,
hear)—because it continued a system of double govern-
ment, and multiplied checks, while it neutralised respon-
sibility. But, most of all, he opposed the measure because
it continued the East India Company as the permanent
organ of Government for that country. But still, no
matter whether the share of influence to be retained by
the company was great or small, he was convinced its con-
tinuance could only tend to retard progress, foster nepo-
tism, and impede the elevation of the native race into a
community of which England and Englishmen could have
any reason to be proud. (Hear, hear.)
Mr. T. BARING said that his excuse for rising to tres-
pass upon the attention of the house would be that it was
his wish not to detain them for any long time, for he felt
that he had not the power which the hon. and learned gen-
tleman opposite (Mr. Blackett) seemed to think requisite to
enable one to speak upon such a subject, namely, " to swell
the soul and fire the imagination." As, however, it hap-
pened that he occupied the post of chairman of the com-
mittee which was sitting upon Indian affairs, he felt it his
duty to offer some observations to the house. In the first
place, then, he would state that though the very last
petition presented to that committee prayed that legisla-
tion might be delayed, he himself was most anxious that
no such hesitation should take place. He rejoiced, there-
fore, to see the bill introduced, although he must confess
ho had doubts as to the policy of some of its provisions ;
those doubts, however, would undergo discussion at a
later stage, either to be removed, or to be confirmed and
strengthened. But because the committee was still sitting
Parliament was to adjourn its decision upon this question
seemed to him a conclusion wholly unjustified by the cir-
cumstances of the case. He certainly admitted that it
would have been desirable that the committee had bees
appointed at an earlier period—(hear, hear)—that it had
been nominated the year previously ; but still every hon.
gentleman was well aware that the present enactment dealt
only in a limited manner with the question of India, and
that while the house was now called upon to legislate in
regard of the machinery of government, the committee ,
continued to inquire into all those points which affected
the development of the resources of that country. (Hear,
hear.) It seemed to him, therefore, that, not only would
it be unnecessary to delay legislation, but likewise that
the committee had a duty to perform in continuing
their investigation, in order to show the merchants
of England what was the nature of the evidence brought
before them, and to manifest to the people of India
the anxiety of the House of Commons to examine into
their condition and government. He confessed it was
evident to him that if they weakened the power of govern-
ment in India by postponing the settlement of this ques-
tion for another year—(hear, hoar)—by, as it were,
hanging up authority in aboyanco—by advertising for a
new government—by calling upon England and India to
agitate alike for the next two or three years—that they
would be inflicting an injury upon India, the effects of
which no good government in after years could rectify.
And let him add, he knew of no greater curse to a country
than that its inhabitants should know that the form
of government under which they lived was condemned
even by those who had bestowed it on them. But he
would impress upon the house, and snore particularly
upon the gentleman who had just sat down, that there was
a very great difference in saying that we support the pro-
position of the Government as the one best calculated to
give India a good Government, and that we support it
because it is a plan which is only to last as long as it will
be found applicable to that country ; because, in fact, the
final settlement is still left within the control of Parlia-
ment. (Hear, hoar.) Nothing could be more injurious to
India than to say that they would postpone legislation
until the year the committee gave in their report. Next
year it was stated they were to be occupied with a mea-
sure for the reform of Parliament ; and, if he was not very
much mistaken, he had once heard the hon. member for
Manchester allege as a reason for an immediate change in
tho whole government of India, that in the year 1853
they would be in the midst of the hurricane of a reform
bill. What would be the consequence of delay? Why
neither would stability bo given to the reform which con-
fessedly ought to be forthwith introduced—credit at home
would be diminished, and our power and influence abroad
would be weakened. (Hear.) But it was said everything
was tranquil in India, and, therefore, postponement was
safe ; but he would ask was that a reason why legislation
should be delayed to a snore convenient season ? For
himself he believed that such was the disposition of the
200,000,000 inhabitants of India towards rule, and so un-
doubted was the fidelity of those 200,000 soldiers com-
posing our armies there, that there was no danger of any
commotion to be apprehended. (Hear, hear.) But surely,
it was not because their fidelity was unshaken, and be-
cause their attachment to us still persisted, that we should
hesitate to bestow upon them the best government which
was in our power. (Hear.) Ho would, therefore, cheer-
fully support the introduction of the measure of the Go,
vernment ; firstly, because he felt that Parliament was
bound to proceed with legislation at once, but mainly and
principally because it preserved the double form of go-
vernment. (Cheers.) The hon. gentleman who had last
addressed the house had contended against the idea
that the difficulties which the government had to meet
in legislating properly for India were at all of an ano-
malous character ; and he referred to Spain and Portugal,
and pointed to how they had governed largo and distant
dependencies. He (Mr. Baring), however, rejoiced to
say that there was this difference in the cases referred to.
In the one the unfortunate native inhabitants were de-
graded, exterminated, and expatriated ; while under our
government of India, with all its defects, the people
had every security for their lives and property—they
were saved from all the horrors of internal dissension
and foreign attack. (Loud cries of hear, hear.) Therefore
he maintained, in the first place, that the present form of
government, if its existence could be made compatible with
the good government of India, was the administrative ma-
chiney which they ought to. endeavour to support. He had
no wish whatever to see that government in the hands of
the Crown—(hear, hear)—in the hands of the Crown no
longer controlled and independent of any other governing
power ; not in the hands of the Crown as they had seen
the colonies and our distant possessions. He wished to see
the power exercised by a body subservient to the will of
the country, because he could not imagine how the general
policy of India could be separated from that of England.
And he must say, that if they did not maintain an inde-
pendent check upon the acts of the Crown of England, that
they would see that, for some party purpose, for some
ephemeral and momentary party triumph, the security of
India and its government would often be made a secondary
object. (Hear, hear.) He had no wish to retard—on the
contrary, it was his desire to promote by every means, the
education and the advancement, social as well as physical,
of the native population ; but he must say, looking as far
as he could into the mystery of the future, lie could see no
prospect of the native population administering their own
government with advantage to the security of their country
from foreign aggression, or to the promotion of union
amongst themselves. Regarding each other with a jealousy
often amounting to hatred--distracted as they were by dif-
ferences amongst themselves, if once they were separated
from British rule their union against foreign aggression
would be perfectly impracticable. On the other hand, lie
believed, that if the plan which had been suggested of go-
verning India only through the agency of those who lied
been resident in India, were adopted our permanent rule
in that country would be completely jeopardised. (Hear,
hear.) Therefore, as a friend of India he wished to see the
government of India continued as it was, the company still
maintaining its power, subject, as hitherto, to the great
moral control of a body of men who were perfectly inde-
pendent of the influence of the minister of the day, and
who would be able to defeat any attempt to make India a
battle-field for parties. (Hear.) And let them look to
what had occurred in the colonies—in Jamaica, in Ceylon
—throughout our whole West India colonies, at the Cape
and in Australia ; and would ary one calmly say, regard-
ing our great party struggles, that the government of those
distant dependencies has not been bandied about from side
capo
usweer
in of the
his
to side—kept flying like a shuttlecock in the air, as long as
the controversy served any party purpose ? (Loud crieshEeangrli,
shheardraa' e haddim of
diminish in desire
Itoadiseea, thebe
heart he believed that by extending its influence the glory
of the British nation and the interests of civilisation and
freedom were advanced all over the world.
But he would say give to India that form f(Hear, hear.)
which might best serve to protect England o government
and that only could be done by keepingfrom herself—
vortex of party politics. He did not
India out of the
broached by the hon, member f agree with the opiniot
or
night. He could not conceive a Manchester the other
• for India than one Composed of worse form. of government
sident in that tonal/ r
~„ }serous, who had been re-
. Kr; "4' "33.4 L'41117 or forty years. • •
v.ou. e lion. member mist allow ato

correct him. I quite coincide in his opinion that it would
be impossible to govern India by such a council.
Mr. T. BARING was most happy; then, to find that
bankers and brewers were not quite such bad legislators
after all—(laughter)—and that it was agreed that there
would not be much wisdom in forming any administration
from a particular class—be they lawyers or merchants.
(Hear.) Nor could he assure the hon. member that he
would be disposed to make an exception to the rule even
where the parties were disciples of the Manchester School.
(Laughter.) He believed that the council to be formed
ought to embrace within it men perfectly acquainted with
the state of affairs in England, and all the bearings of
English society, as well as those well versed in the details
of Indian matters. Neither did he believe that the mode
of election was as objectionable as was imagined. On the
contrary, he maintained that there was this advantage
attendant upon the present system, that it tended by the
notoriety given to each candidate to uphold the integrity
of the Directory. (Hear.) He was not one of those who
pretended that in many respects our government of India
had disappointed expectatipn. He believed there had
been unnecessary delay in prbviding a code of law for that
country, and that public works had been too much re-
tarded. But hon. gentlemen must bear in mind that the
Court of Directors were not always responsible for those
evils. They had had wars in India, and they could not
say that these wars had always been undertaken by the
e v desire
ern
t
of
etnhe company,
weretto
b e
diverted,
or tha t , if
that
b
their influencetese
wars
wouldwi t with b e
the
g
happenof l less
tfrequentere
e oh cacdu r r
been e nc ei
o.
di(vleaualri Perhapsnsta
neeso it
fpamtroighot.
hada patron-
ago o beingbeen a b
exercised;u sed
as t ial l ,moann the wtoh op]. er,odt ho ae
et pa a
body
roodnya goef
public servants, of which this or any other country might
be proud. (Hear, hear.) And let him ask the honourable
gentleman opposite (Mr. Blackett) to suppose that some
enlightened natives of 'lndia came over, could they not
point to us, and say, " See, your judgments are not
infallible ; for your verdicts are always in accordance
with evidence. (Hear.) Nor do your legal reforms date
from a very ancient period. Behold the anomaly of a con-
stitution which permits a veto that is never used—that
grants a negative power which is never brought to bear."
And yet, though all that was true, were they to be pre-
cluded from introducing changes into the administration
of their affairs. (Hear, hear.) Much as he differed from
the honourable member for Manchester, upon one point at
all events he agreed with him, and that was, that this was
not a question between Manchester and Eases—that it was
no party question to be made the football of contention in
this house. (Hear, hear.) Much as he had learned from
his attendance on the committee of inquiry, one thing in
particular he had learned, and that was, the great import-
ance of caution in our changes with regard to India—(hear,
hear)—the great necessity of proclaiming that they would
not falter in giving the best form of government within
their reach to India, but, above all, the necessity— the
imperative necessity of preserving this great question se-
parated from the influence of party strife and the blasting
triumphs of party objects and party discussion. (Loud
cries of hear, hear.)
Sir H. MADDOCK said he was convinced that it would
be more advisable to postpone legislation at least until
next year than to pass such a measure as the right hon.
gentleman had proposed. While he was in communication
with the British Association when he was last in India, in
reference to the appointment of a fit person as their agent
in Calcutta to promote their views, ho satisfied himself
upon this point—that there was no expectation amongst
the intelligent part of the community that there would be
another act passed for India during the present session.
He would not, however, make any objection to the intro-
duction of the bill proposed, although he entertained some
strong objections to many of its provisions. He was de-
cidedly opposed to the system of a double government. If
it were the desire of the house to get rid of frequent dis-
cussions upon the question, the proposition of a double
government would no doubt have the effect of attaining
that object. He confessed that so far the measure pro-
posed contained many improvements upon the former
system. He did not consider it to be just or proper that
India should continue to be governed in the name of the
East India Company. The witnesses who were examined
before the committee on India were unanimously of
opinion that justice should be hereafter administered di-
rectly in the name of the Crown. It was true that the
military servants of the East India Company received their
commission from the Crown, but this was done only for
the sake of convenience, in order to fix their relative rank,
when serving in the field or at court martial, with the offi-
cers of the Queen's army. Since the institution of the
order of the Bath, only two members of the civil service
were thought worthy of the consideration of the Crown.
The existence of the East India Company was for many
years a mystery to the people of India. Bat the veil had
been lately removed from their eyes, and they were now to
be told that for the future they were to be held in subjec-
tion by the East India Company. For a period of 70 years
the coin in India was impressed with the name of the King
of Delhi. In 1815, when he went to India; the seal of the
Governor-General had an inscription on it in Hindostanee
language, " Slave of the King." That system had long
ceased to be the case. The tables were now turned, and the
King of Delhi was considered at present in the light of a
mere pensioner. He thought it was high time that the
Crown should be directly represented in India. He asked
how could the fidelity of the troops be relied on when they
were told that they owed subjection to a power which was
not really in existence ? He perceived it was proposed to
name a new Legislative Council in Calcutta, and to give a
great number of members to the council. He doubted much
whether there would be sufficient business to occupy much
of the time of those officers. But perhaps it was in the con-
templation of the right hon, gentleman that many of those
officers should 'exercise other duties. There was, however,
one omission which he hoped would be supplied by the right
hon. gentleman. There had been no allusion made in the
employment in the Legislative Council of any of the natives
of the country. (Hear.) He could have no hesitation in
saying that, if there was any position in which they could
place the most distinguished of the nati*ee vith advantage,
it was one in which they would have to legislate for their
fellow-countrymen.
Mr. DANBY SEYMOUR said he thought it must be
evident to all persons that sufficient care was not taken of
the interests of India by the Government of this country.
Ho considered that the committee appointed to inquire into
the affairs of India were very partially selected. Of the
39 members who formed that committee, 3/ of them were
connected with her Majesty's Government and the East
India Company. There were, therefore, only eight inde-
pendent members upon the committee. They had already
heard what the opinions of the chairman were upon the
subject. It was utterly useless to bring any witnesses
before such a committee. So extraordinary had been the
conduct of the Government in respect to this committee,
that though they had last year finished the question, as far
as the Home Government was concerned, it was this year
re-opened by the right hon. baronet the President of the
Board of Control himself; notwithstanding which, the
right hon. gentleman proposes to bring in his bill before
the evidence taken by the committee was reported to the
house, and in the hands of hon. members. (Hear.) He
asked whether the commonest railway bill would be treated
with such disrespect? He (Mr. D. S.) had had the advan-
tage of passing some two or three a ears in the Russian-
Asiatic possessions, both under the old system of govern-
ment and when a new system was introduced by one of'
the most able administrators that had ever lived. He
could assure the house that that new system of government
had increased in a great degree Russian influence through-
out the whole of Asia, and had been crowned with the
greatest success. When he was in that country the 50
different nations of the Caucasus were treated nearly in the
same manner as the British Government had continued to
treat our possessions in India. For some time the whole
possessions of Russia rested upon a volcano, which every
moment threatened to explode and to overwhelm. During
the year before he had gone to India, there were such con-
spiracies organised that the natives were prepared to assas-
sinate the whole of the Russian authorities. About a
week before the appointed time for the revolt, information
of the existence of such conspiracies had arrived from St.
Petersburgh, and measures were immediately taken to
meet the threatened danger. he had the great advantage
of seeing the old system completely changed, and the most
enlightened policy carried out in its stead. That policy
had proved eminently successful, and he heard the natives
express the greatest satisfaction with it. The natives,
therefore, generally felt that they had more to hope from
Russian policy than English. In the Russian possessions
every one had equal privileges, and at the present time one
of the most distinguished generals upon whom Russia re-
lied with confidence was an Armenian—a man of a nation
that our Government would not permit to hold an ensign's
commission. The Armenian might enter the Russian
civil service, and might aspire to the highest dignity in
the State. There was no difference made in respect to
creed, colour, or caste—everything was thrown open to
the natives, and the utmost satisfaction was felt by
them. Could they doubt that when the time came to
choose between those two nations, which would each go
on extending their boundaries until at last the empires
touched, which would be successful ? He could not con-
ceive at the present time a more important subject than
this. Ho must say that he had never heard such a conti-
nuation of misrepresentation from beginning to end, as he
had heard in the speeches of the right hon. gentlemen the
President of the Board of Control and the hon. member for
Huntingdon (Mr. F. Baring). He hoped that the people
would study the subject for themselves, and not permit
themselves to receive the false impressions which those
speeches were so well calculated to convey. The 'Whig
policy of 1839 was not one which brought success or glory
to this country ; it was an eminent failure, and yet it ap-
peared that this was the policy that was now to bo con-
tinued. In reply to the taunt of the hon. member for
Honiton (Sir J. W. Hogg), that the opponents to the policy
had not examined the papers before Parliament or the evi-

dence given before the committee, he (Mr. S.) would say,
first, that the evidence had been taken before a partial
committee, and was not, therefore, worth anything. The
inquiry was looked upon in India as a mere mockery, and
was designated as such by the Indian papers. He would
quote an extract from the history of the Affghan war, by
Mr. Kaye, for the purpose of showing how those powers
entrusted to the East India Company had been exercised.
Was it not a notorious fact that in the papers which had
been received from India everything that told against the
case of the East India Company and our Government was
cut out and suppressed ? (Hear, hear.) Why, the whole
India government was a myswntetaary
thereof thent,
o e iniquity.oanrrasi
knew that such a personage had existed as Post Mahammed.
dnegree considered
i They
mostff ereeyn im-
portant.
ealnlisl
In his time Russia and England were nearly going to war.
to be favourable to the
p oTnhoret
tt
njut.apositionhsoirinof
A.
Amiff Burnes gwh
aa ns itva ta
aa ns
disposed
English cause, and when the Russian embassy came to
Cabool he was not well received by it. Does Mahornmed's
and Sir Alexander Rtumes's letters were transmitted to the those government of England, and in
letters everything
that told against the case of the Indian Government was
actually cut out. He would read lir Kaye's observations
upon this subject. It was only by a 'letter. that was dis-
covered after Sir Alexander Barnes'sß death, which was sent
to this country by his father, who was indignant at the
way in which his son had been treated by the Government,
that the real facts became known Now here were the
othbeseErvaaatjionsof
_Mr. Kaye on the known,
historian of
b India Company? [The hon. member then quoted
Mr. Kaye's testimony, to the effect that a lie had been
Palmed upon the world by the governor of 1839 and the
Court of Directors, who on that occasion bore false wit-
ness against their neighbours, Poet Mohammed and Capt.
Burnes.] That was the reason he (Mr. Seymour) put no
faith in any of the documents furnished by the East India
Company and the Board of Control. Turning to other
misrepresentations of the hon. member forHonit
nons,iene
red
at the hon. member for Manchester on the case of
I)arugo
re-
gard to the police of India, that hon. member had
agreed that a single
and the police. He (Mr. Seymour)
case should not he taken as indicative of 4
with such
the state of Be n.
gal ; but the petition which had been treated
of Control, and which had been
presented under the auspices of three most respectable
contempt by the Board
told a different story. The hon. member for
d that the administration of justice in
India was perfect, The petition stated the contrary. It
uonitoli gentlemen,
hs4
declare