The Sun.
London, England, 1854-06-27 00:00:00

:.

-toreernesing the Danube, for the siege of gilistria, for the
establishment of magazines, for passing Shumla, and for
every contingency of a march to the other aide of the Bal.
. . leans, were definitively laid down and discussed in St. Pe-
tersburg and other large towns, in the month of December.
It was even said that a suggestion, what was to be done
if the Russian forces met 30,000 or 40,000 English and
French troops upon or immediately behind the Balkans,
was, on account of the language of the English Govern-
ment, treated as so incredible and impossible that it never
- entered into the-calculation of probable hypotheses. It
was impossible the Government of this country should not
have been aware of these things; and he asked was it right
. or proper, having this information in his posiession, for
, the noble earl to hold out hopes ot peace in the month of
February, and to neglect preparations for war, certainly
• until that month, if not until Meech ? Perhaps some day
it would be ascertained when the preparations for war tôm-
inenced. Of course he could have no- access to official in
; but things would creep out,•because subordi-
nates would not labour very hard without taking some
- little credit to themselves (and God knows they had not
much else to get) for any exertions which they might make
on particular occasions for the service of the Government.
Therefore, he saw every reason to believe that no instruc-
tions were given by the Cabinet to the Minister of War_
until quite the end of February, if not the beginning of
March. When the noble Earl took credit for being the
first to make preparations, he told them those preparations
.
ought to have been made in the months of November a
December. There could have been no harm
in
nrmedit fur
proattrations, and then, instead of having to take
furnishing a few gun-boats in a few days, the fleets would
have been supplied with gun-boats, which any sailor could
havtetold them were necessary to make the fleet
been
eetefficient
for attack in the Baltic, the troops would have .
trans-
ported at half the expense, and properprepalanratrednsatwtoherulid
have been made for receiving them when they
destination. Looking at the general colour of affairs, it was
impossible not to perceive that there was considerable dif- 1
ferenceeof opinion in the Cabinet. The language of the
noble earl was not only in contrast with that orthe Secre-
tary for Foreign Affairs, but with the tone taken in the
earlypart
of the year bytnembers of the Government in
another place ; and "of aestale of things must shake the
confidence of the country in the measures which were to
be taken. (Hear.) He would next observe upon a mat-
ter which, though a personal matter, was of very great
national importance. The Cabinet considered it ne-
ceseary to divide the department of the Secretary of
State for War and the Colonies, for the sake of greater
efficiency. The head of the Cabinet was, of course, re-
sponsible for the personal composition of the Cabinet. He
could assure the noble duke who filled the 'dilation of War
Minister that he meant not the slightest disrespect to him
in canvassing the policy of that arrangement. He couli
. not doubt the noble duke would carry to the discharge of
those duties the same • powers of application, the
same impartial uprightness, and the same sober and tem-
perate judgment which he had displayed in other offices of
public trust. But, upon Such an occasion as that in which
the nation was placed, and in which the noble earl at the
head of the Government had lately to act, he did say, no
party favour, no favour to a section of a party, no per-
sonal favour to any man or set of men ought to have
weighed in the decision. He did not say only such favour
had weighed in that decision, but he did say there was
one man in the country whom the voice of all parties and
all classes in the country pointed out as the most proper
and fittest man to be Minister of War. He need hardly
say he meant Lord Palmerston. A rare conjunction of
circumstances had granted to him long experience in mili-
tary administration, and at the same time great knowledge
of foreign affairs, and even foreign armies, beyond any
other man in this country. His talents, and the power
and vigour with which he administered any department,
were well known ; and he did say to retain Lord Palmer-
ston at the Home-office (and they had no reason to beli ere
any proposition was made to induce him to undertake the
post for which the whole country thought him the
best qualified) was to neglect an opportunity of adding
very great strength and efficiency, not only to the
Cabinet, but to the councils and resources of the
country. (Hear, hear.) The Parliamentary position
of the Government was one not only unprecedented, but a
position to suggest the gravest apprehensions in the minds
of all men who knew anything of public affairs. Let their
lordships consider for a moment what that position was !
The present Parliament was elected about two years ago,
in the midst of a very hot party contest. He thought, in
round numbers, they might say the decidely Conservative
' party returned about 300 members. The Liberal adhe-
rents of the Government, previously in office, returned
-about the same number. - Those who might be considered
th,e followers of the late Sir Robert Peel numbered per-
haps 20 or 30. There were, besides, a certain number who
might be considered neutral members. The result was
that by a combination the Conservative Government was
overthrown, and the new Government took office with a
following of 320 or 330 members. But, of course, in the
ranks of the supporters of the noble lords opposite were a
considerable number of gentlemen, who, though they pre-
ferred his Government to any other, were ready to sup-
port any Government which they thought sufficiently Con-
servative to secure the maintenance of the great institutions
of this country, and therefore were not indisposed to sup-
port the Government of the noble earl (the Earl of Aber-
deen). The Government last year were at the head of a
party of about 400 members. What was the state of the
Government this year ? They were unable to carry almost
any one important measure. (Hear, hear.) That was a
very serious consideration ; and when he asked to what
that was owing, he wished not to be told it was owing to
the Reform Bill, and. the abolition of those close boroughs
upon which a Minister could conveniently count, because
since the Reform Bill there had been Ministers of different
shades, and of decidedly different complexions, and they had
been able, the same as before the Reform Bill, to exert
sufficient influence to carry on the business of the Crown
in Parliament. Besides, if it were true there was great
difficulty in riaidiging a reformed Parliament, how could
auy Minister• so served-the Crown make that assertion,
• and, at the same time, propose any further reform?
(Hear, hear.) He voted for reform, and he said that re-
form had no such effect as to disable the servants of the
Crown having sufficient influence in Parliament to carry
measures which they thought the exigencies of the
time required. Did the constitution of the Government
itself afford any explanation ? Was there a want of
ability in the members of the Government sitting in the
other house ? He need hardly sly anything of the ability
and character as a statesman of Lord John Russell, who
was respected by all men and followed by many, and
whose ability no man doubted, whose parliamentary ex-
perience was as great practically as any man's. Was he
unaided on the Treasury beach ? On one side sat the
noble lord he had just named, Lord Palmerston, indis-
putably the most copular -man in or out of Parliament ;
and, on the other, Mr. Gladstone, perhaps the most acute
logician, in either house, who had shown his powers this
year by almost provine black white and that two and two
make
five. (A laugh. There were many other men dis-
tinguished for their a miniatrative abilities, and he asked,
with this combination of men, eminent for their parlia-
mentary experience and administrative powers, at the head
of a great party, how was it that Government was day
after day defeated, and day after day had to withdraw
measures which it could not carry for want of sufficient
support ? lie attributed it fairly to the First Lord of the
• Treasury, Who had invited this discussion. (Hear, hear,
and a laugh.) - He thought that it was because neither the
Houses of Parliament nor the country had confidence in
him in the exigency and emergency in which they were at
present placed. He did, not think, and it was his firm
belief the country did not think, his counsels had been
. , salutary either for averting war, or for preparing to in :et
it. -In attacking the public career of the noble earl, he
. - hoped lie should tw) understood as not saying a word incon-- eistent With perfect, personal respect for htu, or teat could
offend the most seasi,ive feelings of those who enjoyed the
noble earl's intimacy, and entertained for him the greatest
respect and esteem. The noble earl said, and he was sure
said sincerely, that he was actuated by a love ot peace, and
his endeavours had been directed to preserve peace. Bat he
said those endeavours had been maldirected for peace. He
slid not doubt the sincerity with which the noble earl was
impelled to make those efforts, but the line he took in
other matters was a line calculated to bring on, as lee (the
Mirquis of Clanricarde) thought it did bring on, more
than one great disorder, revolution, and trouble in
Europe. He said the presence of the noble earl at the coun-
cil table was the cause that they were now engaged in war.
- (Hear, hear.) He had never altered the opinion which he
expressed when these unhappy transactions were first dis-
-cussed, and if such was his opinion then, it had been greatly
confirmed by subsequent events. It appeared to him that
if a clear and honest course had been taken by the Govern-
_, . sinenttwelve or fifteen months ago, there never would have
been a war. Every day proved it. From day to day the
noble earl had acknowledged in terms the power of Russia.
He seemed to think it hopeless to struggle against it, and, ar
i
one had said, it -would hrevo been better to have left- Tur-
key to its fate, and not gone to war at all. Having then
the misfortune to attribute to the noble earl the present war,
the backwardness in entering upon it, the enormous, inor-
dinate and perfectly useless expense entailed on the coun-
try by the neglect of preparations—attributing these things
to the noble earl, he for one did not think it was advan-
tageous to the country that he should continue to be. its
Minister, either to prosecute the war, or to superintend
negotiations for peace, of which the accounts to-day gave
no very cheering prospect. He anticipated he should be
told, because ho had been told before, that, strongly enter-
taining those opinions, he ought to move an address to the
Crown to remove the noble earl, or a direct vote of want
of confidence. That was a very common response for a
Minister to make to a speech which he could not answer ;
but be was quite free to admit it was very difficult for him _ to meet that objection. He knew he ought to make that
motion if he saw his ay afterwards • but in the humble
. " 'Position-in which he stood, he did not' think it wise or ad-
l'auteieetts to make such a motion. Therefore, be had not
la _eesedp before what he had expressed tn-night, but he
- ceased
HOUSE OF COMMONS—(YESTERDAY.)
tlie Zuk_resse,(l it to-night, because he was called upon by
revert tosT47otiar g.given by the noble earl that he would The SPE.t.KER took the chair at 4 o'clock.
with respect to the speechthat he would explain his views PRIVATE BUSINESS.
war, i ,he had made with respect to the The Lords' Amendments to the Hull Cemetery Bill were
ant., viutuatigare important, with respect to the considered and agreed to.
peace whiqb
circumstancerehe tbPortba.
be negotiated. Under these The York, Newcastle, and Berwic'e, York and North
puerile, so wanting inghis dshould not be so uncandid, so Midland, and Leeds Northern Railway Companies Amal•
which he conscientiously 1, as te hesitate to say that gamation Bill, was read a third time, after a protest
advantage of this eoeiltry
,the ad, that it was not for the against the measure from Mr. Digby Seymour.
to be the chief adviser of the -- '?9.1,7010 earl should continue The following bills were considered and ordered to be
tit's Crewn, -
Lord BEAUMONT admir.Dercilread a third time :—British Guarantee Association (N 0.2) ;
noble earl (the Earl of Aberdeee):',wereeral courage of the North Metropolitan Railway; Paisley Waterworks (No. 2) ;
uriono to Cop when hetoundhis Potteries, Biddulph, and Congleton Railway; Rhymney
speech Was likely to be inj
the first opportunity of explaueng_tbrgeengh,s.oin hand, took Railwey ; West London and Crystal Palace Railway ;
mieht think it a humiliating position for a Prime Dlokpersons Westminster Terminus Railway.
Minister
to explain—the language he had used,soing out oe les wa PETITIONS.
to create the opportunity for so doing. He, therefore - Petitions were presented by Mr. V. SCULLY, from Kan-
should avoid everything which partook of a personal ..„2. tnrk, in favour of the Servants' Compensation Bill ; by
ratter, (Hear.) But he was bound to. say, thong's ees'ern. , Mr. W. PATTEN, signed by a - very large number of
speech much better man the oriejee, I ectlkeereneehrulTcoof dhiffeurentdienominations, in favour of closing
• sidered the amended
pnbac-houses on Sundays ; by Mr. V. SMITH from Ket-
. and -tho Ugh .it had removed many
t still he felt, from •
, a_licl one from Norttratup;:)u in favour of the abolition of
Which the first speech had created, ye painful. imP,reua a ' terielre, in favor of admitting Dissenters to the universities,
recollection of certain passages connected with other events,
Mit _ rates -y —r MITCHELL e e from Bridport, against
Peslice Bill, *au( one in favour of eosin public-
that altogether a more satisfactory answer might have 1:-...7-a
"ii' ?titles! e oslSopu,ndacvs ; by Mr. 0. GORE, from Wrockwar-
_ given. The• reason for saying that was, that in the co .::s i
ilbymtlierfiße:ffrs,,!'ncni.gil
LALI3oR.I rno
f.
the'
Xs z,raniAtu
Etßii,e
from new
beer shops on Sundays ;
of his observations the noble earl made some re.reeers
. which conveyed to him the impression that what was stated by Mr. C.
elsewhere had-serne truth. in it. He seldom placed much Police Bill ;
1341" College, agejeat the clause_onninctericißlirael.l by the hen.
was read at length
- reliante on what was stated in tbe public: press, end espe-
co on the motionw
ci,illy in the paper to wttich he was about to allude, nor member for Plymouth eels:
Palmer into ketoe
should he hare thought of alluding to it if the noble earl Oxford University Bill; Whi,", I
by the Clerk at rightihe
.11ad:not given seine importance to that paper by maeing hon. gentleman,
: (14Aatreus froinit on a former occasion. Ile found in the tablo. _
ED OCCUPATION OF .
a.„ . 'Riper stipmaied to represent the opinions of the noble earl le'e MO LTR
ELBA. BY AU S-
.,
seArk TRIAN TROOPSefieite (the Earl of Derby) the following statement :--
e , .., s. • .
Lord J. RUSSELL, in reply to is Highness Prince Metternich, at the sPecial and per- ,
a (mettle b m
nal request of his Imperial Majesty the Emperor of Au,- ro - • I that no conununicat'o i had bll Y• --r-
-k/TWAI, said
een made to
." ,• , .has embodied in a State paper his view of the arrange' relating to a proposed cccepeese„ b
Government
.' - 1 Is which, in the present condition of affairs, may con- trian troops of the island of Elba.
. ee to ' a
1,4,.. -_ ~ ~. _ just and honourable peace.' We have reason to
ALLOWANCE TO CLERGYMEN ATTENDING 011
L..
~ bell ve tyst these views have been communicated, although SOLDIERS.
. not fficially, to the .Earl of Aberdeen • and that little
i
the Secretary at War, whether
~ '' il t prevails. from, • ' '' ' " have Mr. COGAN asked previous communications that
7;1-`. • , •
to clergymen for spiritual attendance .0,1
,•:to en place, that they Will be substantially adopted by the the allowance •
1..,.."' " nglish Minister:, -
118 connected with that the statement soldiers in barracks at home had been fixed by an order
..,1: -'76f the poble earl that he was aware Princi Metternich was from the War-office, issued on the 31st day of March lasi, ,
at the present moment guide, hethe E 1 giving to the Presbyterian clergymen abent' C 6 coimcils of mperor upon a sca e
n Catholic clergymen one-
;:tv.:i7...a-rx,,,,res,7,,fid it induce:l.lam to think certatu, coiniZtßi; thoe-fonrths., and to the Tana
,-
•
-- n clergymen of--
-.‘-'c4t'‘'4ll 4 a WU-14CW ebeiracter bad taken. place, In lialfthe amdwat of remuneration given.-to
-

~~..,
:~:~

- - -
tent this'-country was likely to pussellia
Which it was stated to what
were to show his
terms
in,.an.ldetmo
mwdbea;tifeart-
this moment the Emperor of Rue.
If there w s any
inclination to negotiate fonr
thispe
paper, and if the noble
ground for the assertion i.
etternich was gaidine the
councils of Austria, he then consideredt there was serious
earl knew, as he stated, Prince M
ry might be already com-
promisedcause for alarm that this
of its Minister, and that however
Turks, the peace to which they would have to look for-
tamed by Russia at' the hands of the
great the dbeyfesaotmseusact.
was entitled
ward would ntootexbepeeotf. tHhaethocpheadra, chteefrorwehthicehdethhiasteceoluoantz
the nobleearl further explanation
thelan asatattiroeny of
to
speech with regardfurithth t
agi wouldnhis
leeand the history of that period. He owned,
' Athdaitiapnaossp
when he heard the statement of the noble earl the other
nieht, he was astonished at what he believed to be the
noble
earl's misapprehension of the position of the parties
at
hetime, and what appeared to him to be an incorrect
statement of facts. He certainly did understand the noble
earl to say that the treaty of Adrianople gave no territorial
accession to Russia—that it did not give in any way more
than Russia was entitled to demand. With regard to ter-
ritorial accession, they knew that in Europe Russia ob-
tained a most important though not very extensive addi-
tion on that occasion; but in Asia, but for that accession
of territory, the whole of Georgia and Azerbijan would
have been in the bands of the Turks. Russia obtained the
greater part of an important pachalic by possession of a
fortress which commanded the high road, and was the key
and passage to that portion of the Russian states ; and it
was only in consequence of the impregnable character of
that fortress that, early in the commencement of the pre-
sent war, the Turks did not take entire possession of Tiflis.
Russia obtained also command of the Black Sea, and was
able to establish stations by which to maintain troops,
and to carry on a bloody struggle with the independent,
inhabitants of Circassia. The noble earl might lightly esti-
mate those advantages, but he was surprised that, under
the circumstances in which the country stood, he should
consider Russia made no better terms than in her position
she was entitled to expect, because the noble earl must
know, upon various Russian arittdritreT,'Mit- at thatemo-
meut peace was everything to Russia, that a fortnight's
delay would not have left a single Russian alive south of
the Balkan, and that the campaign must then have been re-
commenced. Hethoughtopinionscomingfrom the noble earl
which tended to lower the character of the Turks, and at
the same time to raise the character of the Russians for
moderation and honourable conduct in moments of triumph
were calculated to injure the cause of peace. He trusted
the declarations of the noble earl would do away with the
unfavourable impression his speech had generally made,
and that havine adopted a new and improved course he
would pursue it with as much warmth as he had apparently
pursued the previous one. He would refrain from any
remarks on the personal conduct of the noble earl, as he rose
merely to draw his attention to a point upon which he
hoped to hear some explanation.
The Earl of ABERDEEN said—The noble earl has ad-
dressed a question to me, which I am perfectly ready to
answer, and I hope to be able to answer. satisfactorily. I
observed the paragraph in the paper which he has quoted,
and I admired its ingenuity, because, my former acquaint-
ance and friendship with Prince Metternich having been
known, it was a very good notion to throw out the idea
that I was engaged in negotiations with him in the sense
which was endeavoured to be implied by the writer of that
article. Therefore I thought it very ingenious. But I can
only say this—that what the Emperor of Austria may have
done in consulting an old and valued servant, and I hope
he may have consulted him, but whether he has or not, I
am perfectly ignorant. (Hear.) My noble and learned
friend mentioned Prince Metternich the other night with
praise, and I took up the same strain. I have seen it
tre-
ported in some paper, that the Emperor was about to take
the advice of Prince Metternich, and that he has done so
the paragraph alluded to, is I hope, in that part correct.
Whether it be so or not I cannot say. All I know is, as
far as I am concerned, there is just the same amount of
truth in it as in all the other imputations against me, which
I have the happiness of seeing day after day—namely, not
a single syllable. (Cheers.) It so happens that since I have
been in office, intimate as I formerly was with Prince
Metternich, neither directly nor indirectly have I had any
communication with him for the last year and a half until
a few days ago, when a lady friend df mine-told nacfs-h6 eras
writing to Prirce Metternich, and I said, " Pray, make my
best remembrances to him." (Cheers and laughter.)
Lord BROUGHAM did not wish to enter into a discus-
sion of the great numberofsubjects which had been alluded
to in the course of the debate. The noble marquis would
forgive, and he was sure the house would pardon, him if he
declined entering upon the very comprehensive field of in-
quiry which he had opened, but he wished to revert toone
word in the noble marquis's very able and eloquent speech.
That small word used by the noble marquis was, that the
noble earl had "explained away " the statements ha had
made on the previous evening. He (Lord Brougham) cer-
tainly had listened to the former speech ofhis noble friend
with that attention which the importance of the subject and
his high position demanded, and he had also listened with
equal attention to the speech which the noble earl had just
made. He was not prepared to say that in the statements
of the noble earl thateveningthere had been anything said
which could be called either retractiqg or explaining away
anything in the former speech which had been so greatly
misapprehended and misrepresented. He certainly felt
highlysatisfied with the speech of that evening, not on ac-
count of the details into which it entered, but more espe-
cially on account of that with which he began, and that
with whichlthe noble mil had conoluded, avowing that the
noble earl the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs had
truly spoken his -sentimetits on the occasion, and that after
all the pains which he had taken—and for which their lord-
ships and the country ought to feel grateful—to avoid the
necessity of war, yet that once entered upon the contest, it
should be no fault of his that it was not conducted with
perfect determination and vigour. As for what the noble
earl had said of the treaty of Adrianople, he purposely de-
clined going intothat question, except simply to state that
he thought the noble earl had not, with his usual acuteness,
perceived the very great difference between the present,
state of things and those which existed when' be produc-
tion of this despatch was first refused. It was first asked
for in FeUmary—it was granted towards the end of
June; and in the interval there had arisen the unhappy
circumstance that we were at war with the Emperor
Nicholas. The production of that despatch at a time
wh'en we were at peace with that sovereign would have
been most injudicious, even most huitfal,. but in the pre-
sent state of things it could produce no finch evil. He
entirely agreed with those who felt apprehensive of entering
at the present moment-in the present posture, of affairs,
aye, and in the present posture of our foreign relations—
into anything like a discussion or minute examination, he
would almost say of any discussion or examination at all,
of what it would be expedient to lay down hereafter, when
the time far negotiation should happily arrive, as the basis
of that negotiation. All must depend upon the state of
affairs at that time, and it would be a monstrous and inju-
rious policy, fraught with serious inconvenience anti min-
chief, if they were now to discuss hypothetically what
might or might not be fit terms to accept. It was of incal-
culable importance that, by the blessing of Providence and
the marvellous efforts of the Ottoman armies, the successes
which had been achieved had been effected by the Tiirks
themselves, and before their allies had even time to inter-
fere or give their aid by coming to their assistance. His
apprehensions, he confessed, were for the period when he
should hear that a movement had been made by the enemy
for quitting the. Principalities and to return to his own ter-
ritory. He could not help fearing that there might arise
embarrassment to us and to our ally France—that great
embarrassment of France having probably made some con-
cession to Austria, and Austria then calling upon us to
enter into negotiations—of that he had more dread than of
the war itself. (Hear, hear.) Because, if we were drawn
into negotiations, the. long series of diplomatic acts and
protocols might be continued, with all the resources of
Russian diplomacy, dragging us, perhaps, through the
whole summer and autumn, to the time when the Black
Sea and the Baltic would be in very different circumstances
from those in which they happily now were. He trusted
witted nhoybal e
ye
tahrli n ,
ntg ha th
ehhw e
ha that theopinion expressed the other night, and now repeated
b th e
been Western
drone Powers
a t
vi
wereen nnotr coo.nßer-
lin, -
lin, would be shared by our great, magnanimous, and most
honourably ally- France. He had no distrust of Austria
he
should say nothing of Prussia; he bad perfect confi-
dence in the wisdom and sage councils of the advisers of the
Emperor of Austria, and in the character of the young Em-
peror himself; but certainly a proposition was supposed
to have been made by Austria to the Czar which, if it
were to lead to those negotiations, it -Would be for the
Western Powers to say whether they should bear a part
in them or not, and if they were to bear a part in them,
he trusted that a certain time—and that not a very long
time -would be fixed, within which those negotiations
mast terminate or cease, and'there the War be prosecuted
with energy as before. (Hear, hear.) It was out of the
power of her Majesty's Government, or of any one else, to
prognosticate what would be the result of the present war.
It must depend, not upon ourselves alone, but upon others.
He did not mean the Eastern powers, but our ally,
France. This, however, he would venture to hope, that
that perfect cordiality which happily had prevailed be-
tween this country and France up to the present time
would still continue, and that they should go on together
as they had gone on from the beginning until peace was
obtained, coupled with guarantees against the repetition,
at a more opportune moment, of conduct which all must
condemn. Those guarantees would, he trusted, be such as
should afford security against future aggression, and of
such a nature as should entitle us to call the result of our
negotiations and of our campaign by the name of " peace,"
for without such guarantee it would only be a semblance
of peace, or, at best, little better than an armed truce.
The other orders of the day having been disposed of,
their lordships adjourned.