The Sun.
London, England, 1854-12-13 00:00:00

THE SUN, LONDON, WEDNESDAY EVENING DECEMBER 13

1 because I do feel that if it were true there was any say, that when General Estcourt wrote to inform me of the
1 thing like cold, systematic, heartless indifference mani- loss of the Prince, he said, "We 'have lost at one swoop all
fested by any department of the• army, a • bove all by the that your foresight, or the foresight of your office had
pro-
medical department, to whose care the wounded are viOod;" but it so happened that Lord Raglan and the Quer-
especially (intruded; it would produce a bad feeling in ter-master had applied for clothing, and the answer was, all
the minds cf the peofile.of this country, and destroy that has been ordered, a great part is finished, a great part is at
confidence in the administration of the aruiy, which has sea ; and the letter of Lord Raglan asking for supplies was
of lite years been engendered. Let me say one word with forestalled by the supplies sent. I believe there is a ,great
regard to the general hospital of Scutari. I will frankly inisappechension with regard to the manner in which the
admit I know no subject which has caused me so much troops should be clothed. I have a letter from a gentleman
anxiety as this, the distance from the scene of action being who knows well the climate of the Crimea, who says " Don't
such that although you may send out medical stores you believe the statements as to average temperature ; follow the
cannot insure. their immediate applicetion. I will now custom of the country—clothe them in skins, not woollens."
state what I believe to be the truth. 'We have been told Then an officer who has had great experience in Arctic
that at one time ttere was not such a thing as a pound of searches caine to me and said, "Have nothing to do with
lint fur an hospital containing two thoesand men. That skins—stick to woollens." (Laughter.) I thought it safest
statement created the greatest horror, in this country, and to take the advice of both, and I hope that before long every
the greatest indignation was expressed against those who man may have his change, not only of skins, but of woollens.
had had charge of this hospital. I have accounts from I am not speaking of changes of the uniforms ; that is a
medical men, which I will not read, to the effect that never matter of course. But besides that we have got for every
for ono moment was there any deficiency of lint or of any- man a sealskin cap coming well round the face and ears.
thing else. At the time when the army, left 'Varna the We have for every man leggings which lie can draw over the
-general hospital was there. An order was given that the trousers, and a loose coat, and under that he can wear along
stores there should be sent down to Scutari. That order, with it a waistcoat of tweed lined with hareskin, and rabbit-
nanisi the hurry and bustle of departure, was never exe- skin, and astskin. (Laughter.) A great coat, not of the
carted. The principal stores remained at Varna. But it usual pattern, but of the Canada. pattern. We have got
so happened that therei wero sufficient to meet the diffi- some boots called the Canada boots' and we have, besides
culty of the moment. There never was positively a deft- that, a coat made from sheepskin. Government" felt with
ciency of these things ; but one was apprehended. Um regard to then r, that time was everything. To huildehuts
der these circumstances the medical officers accepted a to send mot was a process far from meeting the emergency.
loan from the Turkish government of linen' lint, and In the inelanwhile we telegraphed to Lord Westmoreland and
other materials. A large proportion of the stores which to Lord Stratford. Lord Stratford sent a gentleman to pro-
were sent from home was not unloselo.l, because when the cure Austrian butte, constrtected in that country; he also took
ship arrive 1 there was such a pressing for reinforce- measures to procure other's Inoue Malta and Constantinople.
month as would admit of nu delay. There was no positive I trust, therefore, that they got an immediate supply, and if
his
deficiency, I say, thistle!' one Wee apprehended. I will we send huts, I hope that our huts w:11 lie its luxuries, as ad-
tell you one evil which did arise. There had been ongen- ditions to what are already there. (Cheers.) I have given
tiered during peace aea albratis SYSteln of check and this point hi detail, which is rather yai.ariseino to the house,
counttsr-check, The purveyor required all manner of but it must be fecelieeted what is the charge against us. The
forms to be observed bt'fOre he Whield isauo stores on the charge is a heartless neglect of on: duty, and inehTerenee to
recieleition of deo Medical efticers. 'Media wee likewise at the comforts of what I believe to b's the bravest army that
the head of the whole establishment an officer, not a ever existed. Ido not believe that any action was ever more
medical man, who, though he devoted himself indefrati. brifilaut id pellet of attack than that of Alma. Ido not be-
gebly to the performance of his duties, was not of a rank lieve that you ever hail Sri instance of such signal selereliance
to ensure co-operation from those Pliteed under his autho- and confidence as the resisfowee. to the charge of cavalry by 1
rity, or from the Turkish officials. I was uot, therefore, the 93d Highlenders. The reearticat disdained to alter its for-
by any moins setisied with this establishment.
with station, but every man remained as he stood two deep, and
plenty of stores, no one semis to have known where to lay when the Poreeial cavalry approached, the Russian horsemen
his hand uaon them, and the stores could never be ob- would not flee the encounter but fled. Then, et Inkerman,
alined with that rapidity which is necessary in hospitals et the commencement of the battle tee troops were surprised
The moment we heard complaints wa sent oaf
A ceramic- as they were at the battle of Talavera—a battle which had
sion of inquiry, and iii, a private letter, received from one been prepared for weeks. I believe that so far back as the
whose stains if it were mentioned would show the house 24th of October, it hail been arranged at a council of war,
that he was indisposed to criticise, it was observed that. -immense efforts bed boon made to bring men and cannon to
sufficient allowance had not been made for the difficulties the Crimea for 109 miles and more. Not oulw every cart and
of the case, curl that it was impossible to prevent con- bullock, but, they tel me, that every carriage and horse was
fusion from attending the sudden influx of a thousand emp'.oyed to bring up the army post; and even at the last day
wounded men. As to the lady who went out from this the army was moral at the rate of 4e miles a day, a feat which
country to superintend the nurses, I receive, not only I believe is unparalleled in history. Everything was made to
' from reeadeal emu, but from others who have observed her depend ou that stroke. The Emperor was assured that the
conduct, testimony which is, iu fact, the highest praise thing was certain, and after the battle wane back the men
that can be bestowed on any human being. 1 now return who had been keeping their lonely watch, who lied heard the
to the clatter° made by the right hon. gentleman against ial s tolling in the town, and the mermur of then at mass
the Government. Let me first say, with regard to the Feet night, no tionbt, the religious ceremonies of tee church
reinforcements, that I have here a letter from Sir Henry hail been used to Invest the attack with a inure sacrwl
Ward stating that, in a letter which he hail received character, anal appeals \owe made to the patriotism of
from Admiral Boxer, dated the 4th of last month, it was these men: In the morning, emend by the mist, these.
,leclered that 20,0a0 English and French had passed through ,olumns broke in oa our men, some of whom were
the Boephorus to reinforce the Allies. I have shown that tetuelly returning from the trenches, where they had
the total number of lima sent out froar the first is 51,000 spent' the night, and who were compelled to go back
odd ; and I ask, in what first year of any previous war in withorit fool, and I know not how many hours 8,000
which England his been engaged hasshe ever sent out such men iritestocel the attack. The eight hon. baronet brings it
an army as this? (Hear, hoer.) It may be said, and with as an accusation that ahem \two oily 3,000 meneas if the
truth, that we have no reserve. The right hon. gentleman
whole araiy consisted of 8,000 nice, mid as if a commander's
said he would some day ask the owestiou why, we over went
whole business was not to concentrate his force in masses
to Sebastopol at all. I will tell him why. We knew that where the enemy was weak. Well, eight thousand: Hagfish
that fortress was the stronghold of Russia in the Black soldiers stood there for hours, beating back column sifter
Sea. (Hear, hear.) I admit that the enterprise was one column bm'oeght tip one after another, and hurling them into
of great hazed ; but next year it would have been impos the -ravines up weasel they lead ascended. Ido not believe
ruble. Round about that mighty fortress was rising, almost that in the history of any battle, however illustrious, you
Jay by day, further chains of forts ; and if it be not de- will find an instance of an assault Meg successfully resisted I
stroyed or taken in this campaign it can never be destroyed under circumstances so adverse, for so long A 1;0°1101, and of
or taken. I remember hearing, last session, of a gentleman such Immense loss. That was a soldier's battle. Thare you ,
in the City saying, "The war ought to be carriedou with the saw the character of the English soldier. The mon stood by
atmost vigour and determination, but at the same time no risk their regimental officers, but it was a battle of the soldiers
must be run." (Laughter.) If that view could be re- standing in ranks. (Cheers.) I rejoice in the numbers of
alissel, we should have a golden age of war as well as of letaers from soldiers that have appeared in the papers. I re-
peace. I admit that there is hasard, but I say we ought joice that the people of Englared should know of what mate-
to strike with vigeur while the place is valuable, and if we rials their armies are composed, I ask you to look at the
succeed we shalt liars destroyed the power of Russia in army in which the office of JudgesAdvecate is a sinecure.
the south. I hope the right, hon. gentleman (Sir J. Pak (Cheers.)
I ask you to read the letters of Me se men marked
ington) is satisfied with that answer, which is the only one by a simple piety—men writing to their wives, saying that
I can give him. Last Session many hon. gentlemen in this they have boon preserved in answer to the prayers of their
house spoke of the war in language which almost filled me children. I Say/ as letter from a soldier at Inkermann, in
with superstitious fears, on account of its arrogance and which he says, as mailing the- quality of the officers, that
presumption. We did not enter upon this expedition in eight officers were laid in one grave, and that there was not
that spirit—(hear, hear)—and we have felt that our a 'dry eye. See these men showing all these gentle qualifica-
greatest difficulty is that of having to creates an army tions, men who have shown mercy to the vanquished, render
and maintain it simultaneously. See the difficulties we circumstances of horrid provocation; and yet, as Sir William
have had to encounter. We have no compulsory service Napier says, speaking of one of the Peninsular battles when
whatever in t nglancl eleopt ceuiterfilery nereice for home
'the British iofitatry is attacked by overpowering numbers
lefence. We have to trust, therefore, entirely to vo- then it is that you ales with what strength and majesty they
lunteers. Ton qliinet create an army as other govern- fight. There is one side of that picture which has been alluded
meats can by the Rieke Of a pen. You must get the to by the eight look. baronet, anei I admit the foil justice of
men who are willing to &Mire VIA nit the other hand the melancholy:lots we have sustained in the death of General
when these men do come you leave got 4 Material Cathcart. No man vale ware valued than hes he had qualifi-
which no conseriptioe in the Weald firer oroduced.
cations of the highest order, arid his death is a pub-6010as which
(Cheers.) YOU hare Olen; net dragged frem, their reluctant cannot eeisilo be replaced. But it is indOed to the credit Of Errg-
homes against their *ale, aita mini ve.,,,foi iliits,dits, to be land tie see net iiitly the devotion and the courage with which
forced into scenes of blood and horror to which they were these generals eXpesed themselves, but also it is impossible not
averse. You have got men animated with the highest be strnek, SO reading the mantes of those who have fallen
spirit, men youngand adventurousz actuated by the highest with the numbee Wed litre gone from it sense of duty, and
ambition, and our ranks are filled by men echo can never who have shown in this caniyaiji/ hors- little oven the posses-
say that any one of the hardships to which they Wore ex- sion of wealth and luxuiTeau impale the 4itritofniglish gen-
'<seed has boon forced upon them by a tyrannical Govern- tlemen and of the English people from the lowest to highest
ment. Well, you liav'ti had this diffichilty, ha you have rauk. 1 lament as much as the right hon. gentleman the losses
had another: you have had fur scull° time at large emigre- which roe have sustained. I cannot look round without
time from this country. You have had an emigration go- knowing that thole are here the parents of some of those gat-
ing on from Ireland especially, which has dried up the lant men Who have so cheerfully laid down their lives in the
sources of population i you have had at the same time service of their doiintry: But Argland has suffered greater
great activity in siomnierde and Mannfacture. The recruit- losses in fernier battle, like Talavera and Albuera, where
erg sergeant has had to ccuripete egahret that; and when I 4,800 men fell ; while in thew) engagements, from beginning
took back to war thneS, and see what *ere the Weems to end, less than 1,500 men have perished by the sword. The
taken to get men, add that with all their efforts they could largest loss has been by disease—a loss more dishearterflher to
inly raise twenty-fotir thousand Men in oho year ;and
the artily than loss in battle, and carrying with it less of
when I look at what has been done this year, a year not glover. There have died in hospital from disease and from
expired, and see that, indluding what has been raised for wounds in thd Whole campaign 2,782, of whom about 150
,he East India COmpany; We liar e, by free enlistment, had have died from we :twig ; Balled in battle, 1,350 ; total loss,
time to our standard something like 4ii3OCKI men, I say 4,l32—which is much less than the elaggeratecl statements
:hat Ido leek with °Mifideride tee the angineritetida of that I have seen. And let me speak of the assistance which
cur army. -*e mare getting rated, no* &Aar than theY are limit lieou given by our allies. It is -delightful to ciro men,
wanted, but we are getting ?eon V4ry Cadt,.,and drllliug them placed id smasiti a "osition, entertaining* for each other &fah
•eady for service. Lord Hardinge has made this'teplatithi, regpeCi• tit' gt4,lit§h army cheered with a hearty cheer the
,s that he ill net afidsv: a man to go out till he is thoroughly adVoinee of General' Boaquet's division when it came to the
practised in the laic of thd Midie. It has been the fashion to relief of dtif s'init't,efed do•feterette, fled I believe the charge in
lepreeiate the services of Lord Gaildidice, 1 have served Lord which the French and Mif users , got mired together was a
Hardinge as commander-111'01dd, and I haVe derv*/ ethers as good type of the union which binds the bvfo nations together.
commaudeis-sn:eleet, and I have been able to ge 'What :tee (Cheers.) They say that each army is gal/Stress qUalifications
Lord Ilardhiiicl tileuff;
•tinct lofovierg Octet: irelinislaridcs. of fiord the other, that we are acquiring the dash of thelFreneb,
very great difficulty. if you Look at Lie etif4fd tit ti Vic- arid tat the Weench are acquiring the firmness of the Eng/hale
cee•es which our army has achieved in the Crimea, I thirft: f tieliefe that the effect on the people of both countries is
this will strike every man, that, next after the indomitable far greater than Sioeid 'hale been produced by any diplomacy
courage of the men,. comes the skill with which they use their however skilful!, or by self tfeaty. I ask those who are
veapons, and thud glilierieritt sef thtf reArns placed in their desponding, and who are the perreara perhaps who were, so
'sands. If it had not teen fa Lad HaralingZ / eld !toile- valiant two months ago, to reflect what veag rile condition of
tieve that you would have had a division armed sfith that Miiiie Enticing at the commencement of this wet' seact what
rifle. •I do not mean that it Wei Lord Hardinge that gefit it *a 111, ofeelone wars. In previous wars we fieki sill•
them oat, but .I Mean that Lord Harolinee, when he was at ailed Who' I)+l'4 n'or' money, and were not always trite'
air Charles Napiei to the Wed el4y eif hid life:
the Ordnance, infueea nevi life ititd that department, and to their engagettielistie brit new we hare an alliance with the
;illation was, that no Seleier
threw aside 014 prejtidicei entertained eats Wei Latch a man as most military nation on the fan'd cif the earth, formerly our
Hardinge fereed tire ArlieW'clie &I'd rivals and once our enemies, and which it now bound to us, I
solutes
hide idtd,thd Yere;ia, !While Ilig iii- Wives by firm friendship. We have placed public opinion
practised in the Minie. What is the opinion of the army Ik' eateriplictilselofiOtti Isea ports completely sealed, her flag not
gledrild vd scut bait 41,0 vo,iig not in Dirinie o'd oat!' tide, we have placed Russia id *state of
not so much the rise df the eicapdri brit file coil:V.7m.°
to the use of that weapon ? Why, Sir George Cathcart's divi- daring to etre* itgeif in any part of the Black Son formerly '
sion in action at inkerman, when the saw other men fall, her own. This is the effect Of the first campaign,' and I ask
seised their Minie rifles and threw away their muskets. It is you to point out in the history of tae lend any campaign in
of the which you can point out such result. (Gheers.) I ask
men that is gained, clod the result ies that indeed df firing at these who assert that Government have omitted to do all that
random as iu old battles (and I think I have teed ea mile- if Wag' their business to do, and committed everything they
able td
Lions that Only. one
theo soldier use his Weapon with the same facility asi d gamier ri-dci sent °sits this army which has never met the enemy ghat in OW eecin effaco yen- gee' Oiigbi not to des nt2(l I ask them how this army was organised
relish
ex-
beeper haudlee his fowling-piece, and with the distinct in- cept for victory?' f say the military poWer of England stands
teution of making every 'Shot tell. well, I say, we have higher than ft (Wei did, and if you think that you ought to
had this army to drill .td Ming and to dead out. Men are trust us with these poifere do Kr Diet the country is deter-
coming in rapidly.
, We than be egthwhele a large re-' mined, at all laurels and at all cods, tied the army of Lord
serve at the Crimsa,
;aid last year, that we put out (kir Wilda' taiiii Sind 16ft
thid i hdf,te h viill ndt' lee: sand; as Wag Raglan shall be supported. (Cheers.) If the Ifooec of Com-
ought to hay.e._s_en,,to_u,,.t,..a
nsitxs.moWnthhast
ago,
h,,,;:d ti.long does not answer to that feeling of the country, the
0 who'll tile Heinge Of Octane:am must take the consequences. We are
stave actually sent tit five, or six it on vigorously. TO olefati that which is the object of all
faoVreeshmeeaurtd
ogfenftolueim. en say they engaged ist A wikr We hieve entered reluctantly ;we must carry
thine now they cou'ld have done war—peace—you must gong:riff it t and I say no exertions
rrievgei mo
re. Could theYl fel the tint Ogee? how should be spared to enable us by the vigoato of our operations
long does it take to make a soldier I But the regiirietf hare to attain those ends. I say, furthers as far at the Govelt-
been sent out. Some of these re iments came from foreign meat it carwerned, if you think that Government is to be en-
service, but were skeleton reeimegnts more fitted for garri- trusted with tfietW powers, you must enable them to carry mi
yt
son duty than atthiag • else. They' had to be reformed.. honestly the will of the/ nation, that the noblest army that
But some of theSe regimentsvette positively not in England. ever left our shores shall Life the means of a perfect
the Duke of Newcastle seat fdi then! flee 'm eattada and from triumph. (Loud cheers.)
India. Arid When pant sly this fered ccihld have Wen sent Mr. LAYARD said they had before them the etternative of
out three months ago, it did not dilit these Menthe agd. Avoiding all reference to what had taken place with feference
And when you say you should have sent out battaliong, you .14 the War, or to see what could be done for the future, sad
could net create men out of nothin You must first get suppdrt the Government in carrying it out with the greatest
men, you must then drill the men and form them into vigour. With regard to the conduct of the Government, his
soldiers, or else the reputation of our arms would be feelings, as he believed was the case with almost every
lessened by sending m ___
ite 'who are insufficient for their other member in the house, word conflicting. Either ho
duty. (Hear, hear.)
Well, sir, I hope the house will must forgot all that had occurred in the management of the
think that the Government has not been neglectful in present war, and place confidence in the Government for the
the matter of reinforcements and that, at any rate, future, without any reference to their policy—past, present,
if it has not done that which' no ' Government could do, or future—or, on the other hand, ho ought to warn the came-
everything which they Wished, yet that without the material try against those calamities which might he in store far it, and
in their hands they have done utmost. And again I point out those neglects which had occurred, and thereby ob-
repeat, look back to the expeditions in which the Govern- fain, if possible, from her Majesty's ministers such an expres-
(tient has been engaged, look at the expedition of 1793, at sien of opinion as might warrant him in placing confidence in
the Duke of York's, and at Sir Ralph Abercrombie's, look at them for the future. There could bo no doubt that at the
the numbers then sent and are them with the arm sent esent moment her Majesty's Government were making
compare
out now. But, th it is been every effort to take the great fortress of Sebastopol, and he
en, -
posed to privations, that they have been made to fight battles gave the Government great credit for desiring to do all in
of the most sanguinary description, which could have been their power to effect that object. But he believed the capture
avoided by foresight at home. No foresight at home could of Sebastopol, however gigantic that undertaking might be,
have strengthened the army more than it has been strength- was but the first link in the chain—the first step in the great
ened. It is true that sanguinary battles Shave been fought, war in which we wore now engaged. He believed that very
but in firmer times England never went into a war but she shortly we should have to choose between a peace which might_
came out of her first campaign with her reputation none of be disgraceful and utterly inconsistent with the sacrifices of
she best ; but I want to know whether at any period of our blood and treasure which we had made, and a struggle which,
history Our military character stood so high as it does now ? with respect to its magnitude and results, had perhaps never
(Cheers.) I want to know what the effect of public opinion
equalled been in the history of the world. (Cheers.) Such
in Europe has been on the manner in which our battalions being his convictions, he could not help saying that after what
have conducted themselves in this war. I want to know what had passed he did not feel that confidence in her Majesty's
has been the effect of public opinion in Russia—what has been Government which he wished he could feel. If he couid be-
the effect on their own army? The critics, who say
•that our here that the mismanagement that had occurred was merely
men are exposed unnecessarily to sanguinary battles that the result of inexperience, and that for the future wo might
Alma ought to have been turned instead of being taken' are hope for better things, ho would still place confidence in the
persons who, I think, omit never have studied the ma' of Government ; but he believed that that mismanagement was
the country on which they have expended their criticipsm, to be attributed to the want of a definite policy. (Hear.)
'r they would have seen that the ground to the right He believed, moreover, that it was impossible for a Govern-
ef the Russians in that action was' so steep and iliac- mont composed as the present was to have a definite policy.
cessible that it was not worth the attention of the (Hear.) How could a definite policy be expected from a
Russian commander ; and if the " military critics . • twhich included representatives of all thepolitieal par-
who cabinet
a representative of the Holy
hav9 attacked the reputation of Lord Raglan for not turning ties in this country—from
the position had reflected for one moment, they would have Alliance down to a representative of the extreme of Liberal-
seen
that probably the commanderpf the Russians could have ism. (Cheers,) It was impossible to expect anything but a
desired nothing better than to find the fleet, and the English half-and-half policy from a cabinet so composed ; but a halt;
and the preneil army, separated, and his own army gt d and-half policy and half-and-half measures would not do.
botweeu the shis and those armies. So likewise it has been What had taken place during the last two years in reference to
alleged against Lord Raglan that be ought to have assaulted this question 7 During that period he had repeatedly entice-
Sebastopol after the battle of Alma. Sir, Ido not know that voured to warn the Government and the country upon the
we who sit here are very good judges of that. (Hear.) I subject ; but the same appeal was made to him over and over
u
know that very eminent military men view such an I r again as was made by the right hon. gentleman (Mr. S. Hers
taking as a hazard that could not be justified. Talk of lead- bert) that night —namely, that the appearance of dissension
Mg flesh and blood against batteries, but would you hare on this ' question should be avoided
---• that they should
taken these men against a town in which it was impossible sibleto show themselves to be a united nation. wWe admit our
say at that moment hoe, many of Prince Menschikoff's
errors," said the Government. " Have confidence in us, and
was still in it, of which the strength was not then knaownrmy. we will endeavour to bring the question to it satisfactory set-
Such a proceeding might have exposed them to be massacred Cement." (Hear, and laughter.) That Confidence had been
in detail. I believe that eminent men who had command of given by the House of Commons almost without debate. At
that army knew better than those who say they
e are com- the close of the last session he (Mr. Layard) ventured to warn
potent, and give an opinion in their own . chambers- tho Government of the dangerous calamities which were
of military affairs: Now, sir, is it true as asserted likely to betel our army in the East. Again- a-similar appeal
by . the right honourable baronet that we took no was -made to him ; but he asked whether that was states-
precaution with regard to warns clothing ? Why manship ? If the only policy pursued by the Government
the warm clothing of which unfortunately a large portion was was to yield to a pressure from without, then any men whom
lost in the Prince, and let me say, when I speak of that ship, you might meet between Westminster Hall and Charing-cross
the loss has been greatly exaggerated as to the value. The' )
Would be equally capable with the present Ministers to admin.
cargo has been said to have been worth half a million. I ister the affairs of the country. He believed that our allies,
understand it .did not cost more than 180'0001e No doubt the French, had almost 'taken the initiative in every m
ofovethe
-
it was a heavy loss, but another ship immediately succeeded meat appertaining to the present war. Tire Emperor
it, and I had a letter,' two or three clays ago, from an officer French, his Foreign Minister, and our representative at Paris,
on the shot, who informed nee that Captain Wetheraw, who were entitled to great praise in reference to this wartivihnetoomer.
had. been deputed by Lord Raglan to go to Constantinople to Government had only mismanaged it. .
t Before
not believe
procure articles of clothing, had executed his commission mencement of the war her Majesty's Minis ers . .
a war. It was almost impossi ebl to
with such success that it had more than compensated for the that there would be
t
loss of the Prince. (Cheers.) But, moreover, 1 AID. happy tn , bring themselves t° the. c°l4vi"-ion -- that a great questien had
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