The Sun.
London, England, 1854-02-06 00:00:00

EXPLORATION OF THE INTERIOR OF

AUSTRALIA.

DEPUTATION TO THE DUKE OF NEWCASTLE.

On Saturday a deputation of gentlemen, representing
a committee of merchants of the city of London—formed
for the purpose of assisting the Royal Geographical So-
ciety in its efforts to procure an expedition to explore
the vast field of the interior of the Australian continent
still undeveloped, and extending beyond the limits of
English colonisation—had an interview with his Grace
the Duke of Newcastle, at the Colonial-office, with the
view to tender their advice and co-operation on the sub-
ject to the Government, under whose auspices, and at
whose expense, the proposed undertaking is about to be
forthwith carried into execution. The deputation con-
sisted of Mr. G. Moffatt, M.P., Mr. S. Gregson, M.P.,
Mr. John Gladstone, M.P., Mr. W. J. Lindsay, Mr.
J. D. Powles, Mr. J. G. Frith, Mr. J. W. Maclaren,
Mr. G. Palmer Ball, and Mr. Thomas Allen. Sir James
Duke, M.P., had also been appointed a member of it,
but he was unavoidably absent.
The party having been introduced to the noble duke
by Mr. Moffatt.
Mr. LINDSAY, addressing his grace, said most of the
members of the deputation were interested in the ex-
ploration of Australia, and they were exceedingly grati-
fied to see that the Royal Geographical Society had re-
commended the Government to set on foot an expedi-
tion to explore the interior of that continent, and that
the Government had given them a grant of 2,5001. for
that purpose, with a promise of increasing it to 3,5001.,
if necessary. Under those circumstances, a committee
of merchants of the city of London, now represented
by the deputation, had been formed to aid the Royal
, Geographical Society in this enterprise, and, thinking it
desirable that the society should have at least a fund of
5,0001. for carrying it on, that committee had agreed to
raise among themselves an additional sum of 1,500/. in
aid of the 3,5001. given by the Government. They had
not long formed themselves into a committee, however,
when they were gratified to learn that the Government
considered the subject of such great importance as to
justify them ifi taking it into their own hands, and pro-
secuting it at the public expense. On ascertaining that
fact, the committee met together and passed a reso-
lution, thanking the Government for the liberal spirit
it had manifested ; and the deputation now waited
upon his grace to offer their practical services to the
Government in carrying on the expedition, in whatever
way they might be made available. The subject was
one in which, as merchants, they took a very deep inte-
rest, and most of the gentlemen now present had been
influenced in a great measure to support the proposed
expedition in the way they had done from the high
opinion they had formed of Mr. Haug, with whom they
had been in repeated communication, and who had for
many months devoted a great portion of his time to the
subject under consideration, and had, in many respects,
displayed very great energy and capacity for such an
enterprise. They were of course aware, as men of busi-
ness, that, as the Government had themselves taken the
matter in hand, they might feel some reluctance to en-
trust the expedition to a foreigner ; at the same time, as
Mr. Haug had devoted so much time to acquiring know-
ledge of this particular character, they were induced to
hope that the Government would give him some position
in the expedition which would be worthy of his ac-
ceptance. His grace was no doubt aware that, of the
whole of the coast on the Gulf of Carpentaria very
little was known, and that Albert River, one of the
most promising of the colony, was practically un-
explored. They therefore ventured to suggest that the
expedition should also undertake the survey of the
coast, so as to ascertain the sources of the principal
rivers, but more especially those of the Victoria and
Albert, which it was believed had their origin in moun-
tain ranges never yet explored by European footsteps.
The expedition might then endeavour to strike through
the interior of the country and find its way to Adelaide.
The deputation thought that if this could be effected, a
passage might be formed across the country, by which
the shortest and most direct communication to Australia
could be obtained by way of India. The Albert River
had been explored to the extent of 140 miles, and the
navigation for the first 50 miles was so clear that frigates
and the largest merchant vessels could make their way
good to that distance. The deputation had rewon to
suppose that this important river took its origin in a
great range of mountains in the interior, from which
other rivers also sprang. If, however, the expedition
should find it impossible, from any cause now unknown,
to penetrate the interior of the country, they could then
strike in the direction of the supposed head of the Albert
River. In any case the expedition would be traced with
the utmost anxiety by those who had a deep interest in
all that related to the undeveloped resources of that rich,
important, and extended colony.
The Duke of NEWCASTLE, addressing the deputation,
said—l am rather sorry that although I had fixed the
day for receiving the deputation purposely rather late
after receiving your letter, in the hope of seeing Captain
Stokes, I have not been able to have an interview with
that gentleman. The deputation will be aware that it
is my intention to offer the conduct of the proposed ex-
pedition to Capt. Stokes. I have, before doing so, made
inquiries of all persons connected with these matters, and
who were likely to afford me the best advice on such a
subject, and I find among them a great concurrence of
opinion that, upon the whole, Captain Stokes is as fit a
man—not to speak in the superlative degree—as can be
found for the purpose of conducting such an enterprise.
I therefore requested Captain Stokes to call upon me,
but owing to some accident the letter, which should
have reached him ten days ago, was not received by him
until very lately ; but he has written this morning, pro-
posing to call upon me on Monday next, at the Colonial-
office, on the subject. With reference to the expense of the
expedition, the proposal originated with the Royal Geo-
graphical Society. A deputation from that body called
upon me at the Colonial-office at the close of last summer
(towards the end of July), and stated their belief that
the sum first named would be sufficient for the purpose
in view. After looking a little into the matter myself,
however, I became pretty well convinced that it would
not be adequate to carry on the expedition in a manner
that would be satisfactory to the country, or worthy of
a great national undertaking. (Hear.) The Royal
Geographical Society subsequently discovered that
themselves, and applied for an additional 1,000/., which
would have made a sum of 3,5001. If the matter had
gone on in that way, I have no doubt the Treasury would
have at once advanced that further sum, and the expe-
dition would have probably been placed under the su-
perintendence of Mr. Haug. But it occurred to me that
it would be, upon the whole, more satisfactory if the
Government took it upon themselves, so that we might
be responsible for the outlay to the public, and carry
out the expedition upon a scale of which the nation
might be proud, and which, at the same time, would
develope the great resources of the country in a manner
more efficient and complete than I believe could be done
by individual exertion, unsupported by the resources of
the Government at home, or of that in the colony itself.
I therefore communicated with the Royal Geographical
Society on the subject, feeling it was due to them to
do so, and they readily assented, and said they highly
approved of the alteration in the scheme. I then in-
formed them that the course I proposed to take was that
having nominated the individual to take the superinten-
dence of the expedition, I would call on him to lay be-
fore me a complete plan in detail of the course, for ex-
ample, he intended to pursue, the point he proposed to
start from, the assistance he would require, the proba-
ble time it would take, and an estimate of the expense
so far as he could render it. Then, after communicating
with those most competent to advise him, that he should
also lay before me the names of those gentlemen whom
he should select to accompany him. I thought it best
to make him responsible for the nomination of those
whom he should desire to accompany him, after having
taken into counsel such gentlemen as he might think the
best able to advise him ; for example, Sir Roderick Mur-
chison and Sir Henry de la, Beche as to the choice of a
geologist, and Sir William Hooker as to the selection of
a botanist. After having laid before me such a general
plan as I have indicated, I would then decide whether
it would be desirable that the expedition should start at
once, with recommendations to the governor of the
colony for co-operation, or whether, looking to the
period of the year at which we have arrived, it
might be advisable to postpone the starting of the ex-
pedition, and communicate at once with the governors of
the colony on the subject before its departure. All this
I desire to leave undecided until I have a general report
from Captain Stokes. With respect to Mr. Hang, I
have no disposition to pass over that gentleman, or to
deprive him of that fair share of this undertaking to
which he is clearly entitled from the energy he has shown,
and the interest he has taken in the subject. I saw him
a short time ago—indeed he was the first person I com-
municated with after determining to take the matter up
on the part of the Government—and I explained to him
the reasons why I felt, in the altered circumstances, ii
should not be able to place the matter entirely undertof his
direction. I did not rest that so much on the f
his being a foreigner, but on the feeling w
naturally exist in the public mind that therheieh would
are manythemselves
eminent men who have already distinguishedr
by explorations in Australia, and who a
well acquainted with the conducting
n of are, practically,
undertakings
of this nature ; and I said it would . be desirable that
one of them should be placed at the heandofevseur emi-
nent such an
expedition, and not a gentleman who, ow
his talents and =wearying his energies, had
never been in the country, and would on that account
have himself much to learn. He quite entered into
that view, and I told him I should certainly feel it
due to him, when I placed the matter in the hands of
another gentleman—alluding to Captain Stokes--to say
that I wished him to form part of the expedition, and to
be placed in such a position upon it as would fairly
meet his expectations, and as his merits might entitle
him to occupy. I should hope there would be no per-
sonal feeling of jealousy in the matter, because you will
see that it would be destructive of an undertaking of this
kind. I have, however, nothing to lead me to suppose
that there would be any such feeling. With regard to
yourselves, I can only say I am extremely obliged to
you for the offer of assistance. I think in matters of
this kind there are many cases in which it would be
more advisable to leave them in the hands of individuals
rather than in those of the Government ; but in this in-
stance there are peculiar circumstances which induce the
Government to take the responsibility of it upon them-
selves. Of this, however, I am
quite sure, that it
would be less effective and less valuable were it not for
the assistance and co-operation of those who have in-
terested themselves in the subject ; and if in any Way
we can take you into council or assistance, so far as I
am concerned, I can only say I shall be obliged to you
for your aid or advice.
Mr. FRITH asked whether it would not be possible to
make the expedition instrumental in procuring a marine
survey of a portion of the coast ?
The Duke of Newcaseee—l wish to see Capt. Stokes
larel can answer that question. He has not yet sup-
plied the-Admiralty with the details of his operations.
I should be sorry to hamper this internal exploration by

trammelling it with a marine survey, because the two
things need not go together, This is a subject, however,
on which I wish for inforination; but if we vere to say,
we should carry on simultaneously a survey of the coast
and a survey of the interior, and that the two expedi-
tions shouln meet at the same time, we should merely
hamper the interior survey. But as I say, upon all these
subjects I should really wish for practical advice. I can•
not be supposed capable of forming a correct judgment
on them all; but I think it is very desirable to have one
centre of communication in the first instance. If Cap t.
Stokes should undertake the command of the expedition.
I should say to him, as he had already explored a great
deal of the coast, the Government hoped he would put
himself into communication with all the persons who
took an interest in the subject, and make up his mind
as to the best course to pursue before he went. It would
be desirable to get the best opinions we can before de-
termining the details.
Mr. LINDSAY said he felt gratified at the frank and
unreserved manner in which his grace had stated the in-
tentions of the government. There was one point, how-
ever, to which he wished to advert. Even if the expe-
dition was confined entirely to a survey of the interior,
in case :hey failed of getting through the country, they
would require to have some place to fall back upon.
The Duke of NEWCASTLE—Very probably ; but that
would be a completely subservient object. These are
really all matters of detail. I do not wish to say the
two things could not go on together ; but I think the
great object to look to is the internal examination of
the country, and that any survey of the coast, however
important in itself, should be made subservient to that.
Mr. MOFFATT, M.P., bore testimony to the services
of Mr. Haug, which he stated had been fully investigated
by the committee. They feared, however, that he might
have been overlooked ; but after what the noble duke
had said with reference to him, they were quite willing
to leave the matter in the hands of the Government.
Mr. GREGSON, said, that should the expenses
of the expedition be considerably increased, the mer-
chants by whom the deputation was represented hoped
that tact would be no object in the consideration of the
matter.

The Duke of
.NEWCASTLE said, with reference to
that, he bad abstained from any further communication
with the Treasury until the plan was matured. When
that plan was thoroughly matured he should then go to
the Treasury ; and he felt confident, from the commu-
nications he had already had with them, that there would
be no disposition to act with anything like parsimony
in the matter. On the contrary, he believed the Trea-
sury was quite disposed to encourage it most liberally.
He wished, however, to reserve himself on the question
of expense entirely until the plan was matured. How
far it might be desirable to ask the merchants to assist
with money or advice and co-operation was a matter for
future consideration, and also how far it might be
desirable to call upon the Colonial Governments to con-
tribute a portion of the expense, or only to give their
co-operation.

Mr. MACLAREN observed from his knowledge of colo-
nial feeling nothing could be more popular in Australia
than an expedition of this kind. It would be impossible
to overrate its importance to the colony as well as to
the mother country.

The Duke of NEWCASTLE—I am glad to know that
what is right and useful is also popular. My interest in
it, however, is not because it is popular, but because it
is highly useful, and of great national importance.
Mr. MACLAREN said he felt persuaded, from the libe-
ral manner in which the Australian colonies had sub-
scribed 30,000 E. towards improved postal communica-
tion, and other sums towards expeditions similar to that
now proposed, they would liberally subscribe to this, if
applied to for the purpose.
The Duke of NEWCASTLE said that Mr. Maclaren's
suggestion was a matter of detail ; but that, from what
he knew of the Government of the Australian colonies,
he believed they would support an expedition of the kind
in a prompt and liberal spirit.
Mr. LINDSAY thanked the noble duke for the attention
he had paid to the subject, and assured him that if the
Government should require funds to carry on the explor-
ation in a more extended and effective manner, they
might rely upon receiving pecuniary assistance from the
merchants of London.

The deputation then thanked the noble duke, and
withdrew.

CONTINENTAL TELEGRAPHS AND
THEIR CONNECTION WITH AFRICA, &c.

It is a fortunate thing for commerce and the inter-
course of communities that the electric wires have been
found even more indispensable to Governments than to
the children of Governments. The vox popali might
have demanded telegraphic facilities until it had
grown hoarse, and yet never have obtained them ; for
continental enlightenment, with the brilliant exceptions
of France and Sardinia, never would have proved ade-
quate to the appreciation of this modern science, nor to
the wonders worked by it. But the necessity of the
Government became the opportunity of the people ; and,
as we shall see, wonderfully has that opportunity been
improved, and wonderfully and beneficially has it ope-
rated within its peculiar district. The moving cause
thus explained, the rapid and universal ramification of
this method of intercommunication, and the wiry em-
brace which has encircled and is encircling Denmark,
Holland, Russia, Austria, Prussia, the union of Belgium,
France, Switzerland, Italy, Spain, and even Africa, be-
comes more easily appreciable; and it is with France, Sar-
dinia, and Africa,!and even with Gibraltar, Malta, India,
and the antipodes that this notice has to do.
Had we spoken, only a year since, of the lines laid
down on the Continent, we should have been confined to
a few detached portions, severed frontiers, or counties
and districts—we should have found the southern Liver-
pool of France, Marseilles, still resorting to the old Sema-
phore to make known its wants, and continually " inter-
romps par le Brouillard," a stereotype phrase, which will
be familiar to all our commercial and especiallyto our Indian
readers. This state of things has passed away. The French
Government has extended its lines to Marseilles for the
Mediterranean, to Bayonne for Spain, and to Chambery
for Sardinia. Sardinia takes up the communication at
Chambery, and continues it to Genoa, and from Genoa
lines are now erecting at Spezzia. At Spezzia the Me-
diterranean cable will take up the link, and extend it
under the sea to Corsica, across Corsica under
the Straits of Bonifacio, over the island of Sardinia,
and again under the sea, from Cape Suelada
to Cape Rosas in Africa. By a decree, bearing
date the 15th ult., the French Government threw
open its African lines to the public. Thus far do we
run upon certain ground, and after having explained the
present advancement of portions of the preceding works
we will pass on to the possible fortune of telegraphic in-
tercourse. The Sardinian Government has promised to
complete the line from Genoa to Spezzia before May
next, and thus to connect, in one chain of telegraphic
communication, the northernmost point of Scotland with
the southernmost point of Piedmont.
The Mediterranean Telegraph Company have already
advertised for tenders to lay down their cable from
Spezzia to Corsica, and from Corsica to Sardinia across
the Straits of Bonifacio, and the vessels were to be ready
to receive the cable, consisting of 18 iron and copper
wires, on or before the Ist of May next. The remaining
portion of cable, from Cape Suelada to Cape Rosas,
was to be finished and laid down by August, thus com-
pleting our connection with Africa this year. Two hun-
dred men of pith and sinew have been digging and delv-
ing in the islands of Corsica and Sardinia ever since the
beginning of September, 1853, so that the moment the
cables are laid down, they may be connected instanta-
neously to the land wires, and signals passed from
Africa to the European continent. All this work has
been done by contracts taken, and materials already
purchased within the limits of the capital, so
that the company should be secured from liability be-
yond its subscribed stock. Any loss falling upon the
contractors. The bane of continental undertakings, the
supineness of the people rendered it necessary for the
French and Sardinian ;governments to guarantee respec-
tively 4 per cent. upon 180,000/., the other 5 per cent.
upon 120,0001., for fifty years from the moment ofopen-
ing, up to which time the shareholders receive 4 per
cent., the total capital amounting to 300,0001, Ope-
rations thus traced to Africa, and the wires connected
to the Algerian lines of the French Government, we
find that signals will be parsed to the westernmost and
easternmost points of the Algerian territory ; having
reached thus far, we perceive that new lines are pro-
jected beyond these points, and with very important
ohbjects. The French Government providing for Algeria,
te company commences again. From the westerumost
point of Algeria, then, it is proposed to carry an under-
ground line through Morocco and Tangiers to Gibraltar.
The English Government, doubtless, would
(supporat
Fterloegrnratphhe
is projectedeasternmost ptioiriaoitul,?hf
TAtli7ireisiiaa,nd
Tssuurcibpitl(e)alrirlati7naecJa.lillexandria, with a branch to Cairo, and Suez,
the main line to continue to Beyrout, Damascus, Aleppo,
Bagdad, Bussora, and along
the Indian lines at Hyderabll7 A submarine cable is
the„„ Persian Gulf, joining
also proposed from Tunis to Malta. Were this system
now in operation, its importance to Government in the
present crisis would be incalcalable, for the wires would
connect England and France with their naval stations
in the Mediterranean, with-Egypt, Turkey, and India,
all countries favourably disposed to us, and against the
extension of Russian power. We could flash every
movement of the Emperor's forces, from the eastern-
most portion of his line of operations to Downing-street
and the Tuileries, an I direct our fleets and armies to take
positions in the Mediterranean, or elsewhere, or provide
reinforcements at a moment's notice. Who knows, but
that war, should it unfortunately ensue, will be the
cause of the provision of these very means of communi-
cation.

THE MAIL PACKETS.—SOUTHAMPTON SUNDAY.—The
General Screw Company's steam ship Bosphorus, Capt.
Douglas, left yesterday for Australia with twelve pas-
sengers, about 10,000/, value in jewellery, and a very
full cargo. She had also taken a very heavy mail, con-
sisting of 206 bags. The Peninsular mails for the month
will be despatched in the Peninsular and Oriental Com-
pany's steam-ship Tagus, on the 7th, Madrid on the
17th, and Iberia on the 27th. The heavy portion of the
India and China mails left yesterday in the above com-
pany's steam-ship Indus, C'aptain Moresby. She had
on board 60 passengers, 285 boxes of specie, value
79,100/. for India and China, and 12,0001. for Malta and
Alexandria, and a very full cargo. The Colombo or
Euxine is appointed to take out the India mail of the
20th. The former is the ship selected, should her re-
pairs have been effected by that time. The Tagus, Capt.
Joy, will take the Peninsular mail of the 7th instant,
the Madrid on the 17th, and the Iberia on the 27th.
The Euxine will leave on the 27th, with ship letter bags,
cargo, &c,, for Constantinople.
RUSSIAN PRODUCE.—The markets for Russian pro
duce on Saturday were considerably affected by the
prospects of the Emperor being compelled to succumb.
Tallow experienced a decline of 30s. per ton.