The Sun.
London, England, 1838-02-14 00:00:00

said that it would be no disadvantag. to Gre-at Britain it
France Pozsessed even the entire coast of Africa, ease to to')basty a conclusion. H.! hail jealou=s jealou of France ;he
wished, on the contrary, that not only the country,. but the
people, sheuld be cordially nnited with England. But
~.he
ccu!d not help hearing in mind that France had not the same
value for the blessings of commerce as England--that sue
was at present an essentially military nation—and that even
the snows of Russia bed not beer` able to cool her wsrlike
ardour. However, he trusted that Francelwould give up the
idea of further conquest in Africa, and turn her attention to
the arts of peace and civilisation.
Mr. M ACKINNON seconded the motion, in which, how-
ever, he only agreed so far, that Parliament should i.ave an
opportunity of receiving a decided explanation from the
Government respecting the occupetion of Algiers. The
Honourable Gentleman then went into a history of Alg,iers
from 1783—i t s populatim, policy, mode of Government and
warfare with England and France, the greater part of which
was imperfectly heard in the Gallery. Three separate
arguments had been urged against permittiniz the French
to continue their occupaeion—Fi:et, the dangers to aeiee
if they extended their conquests eastwaed- to Egypt,
aed subsequently to British India. Secondly, the dan-
gers likely to result to English commerce in the event, of
a war, by the issutg of letters of marque from Algiers by
France. Thirdly, the extension of conqte-43s westward
and southward, to Morocco and Senegal. ThC "geond ohjec-
tion WAS the only one that deserved an answer, but he thought
that. •Aith the confessed superiority of 13e!tish seantaa4hie, and
the change which the introduction of steam-ships had Cfau3cd
in naval warfare, no danger need be apprehended, for Eng-
land could by their aid blockade Algiers now as easily as be-
fore.—(Laughter.) If there was any danger likely to arise
0 British commerce in the Mediterranean it was from the pro-
ceedings of Russia, who had in a vast number of instances
violated the stipulations of the treaty for the suppression of
piracy. He hoped that the Noble Lorl would give the papers
referred to, and thereby enable the House to judg=e fairly of

the merits of the question.
Lord PALMERSTON said it was not his iatention to
oppose the motion of his Hoe. Friend for papers relative to the
--ration of Algiers, presuming that he referred to the car-
°e- --.
- which had oeeurred in IS3O, immediately File
respondence . ' 'e that event, anti which had been laid
vious and subsequent
,( Laughter.) These papers
..e. .;s,
before the other House le 3-ne : andte he thought that
hal net yet been laid before this :use-.. '..
eroduction.—( A
it had every right to be stratitied by then
laugh.) The Hon. Gentleman who spoke fast had gze at
considerable length into the eulject, and had viewed it in a
variety of suppositious aspects. He must state his differ-
ence of opinion from him on the subject of the Porte's right
of dominion in Algiers, previous to its occupation. The rights
of the Porte were somewhat differently viewed by England
and France, but decidedly admitted by Austria and others.
The Home would see by the papers the pledges given by
France ; and, of course, would form its own opinion of the
way in which those pledges had been kept by her.—( Hear,
hear.) As to the fear of French conquest on the other parts
of the coast of Africa, we had similar satisfactory assurances—
( Laughter)—that France had no hostile or encroaching des
signs, either on the States of Tunis or Morocco. Ho fully
' coucurrecl in one sentiment that had fallen from Lis lion.
12r1%... "d—that the people of this country did not feel such a
•
desire for military glory as the people of France, and that
.
this country was theeefere net Lkelt, to rush into an unprovoked
..
ear.—(Cheers.)
*.ei from Mr. MACKINNON
After a few words in explanatith.
and Lord PALMERSTON,
Lord NIAHON said that it would, perhaps. .'.se satisfactory
if the Noble Lord would inform the House of the comt,..inica-
tion to which he referred.
Lord PALMERSTON said that the assurances, and some
other of the communications, were made within the lest twelve
months, but the dates of some of the despatches he would rather
not give.
The motion was then put from the Chair, and agreed to
THE GLASGOW COTTON SPINNERS.
Mr. WAKLEY said, that before he made the motion which
was on the paper, he should take the liberty of t resenting to
the House a number of petitions which had been entrusted to
him, and which had reference to the case of the Glasgow
Cotton-spinners. The first was from the inhabitants of Dews-
bury, in the West Riding of Yorkshire, unanimously and re.
spectably signed, and praying for an inquiry into the case of
the cotton-spinners, and also for a mitigation of their sentence.
He also had other petitions from Johnstone, from Kingston-
on- Hull, from Brighton, from this bookbinders of London,
from the carpenters and joiners of Glasgow, from a Society of
Operatives assembled in York, and from Rotherham : which
all prayed for inquiry into the case, and a mitigation of the
sentence, and some of which, in addition, desired an inquiry
into the nature and character of Unions ; and some of which
also expressed the belief of the petitioners that the charges
preferred were unfounded. He also had a petition from the
Working Men's Association of Bristol, in which there was a
' peculiar proposition, which was, that in the event of his ( Mr.
Wakley's) motion being negatived, and the amendment of
Mr. O'Connell adopted, for the institution of an inquiry into
the subject of Unions and Combinations, the Committee which
should be appointed should consist half of Members of this
House and half of working men.—( A laugh.) The propo-
sition was a novel one, and he bad no hesitation in saying that
such an inquiry would give very great satisfaction to the
working classes.
Mr. FIELDEN presented a petition from Edinburgh, and
a petition from Glasgow, also praying fur an inquiry into the
case of the cotton-spinners, and a mitigation of their sentence.
Mr. WAKLEY then rose and said that he believed that
there was no subject which could have been brought forward
in that House which was so unpalatable as that to which his
motion Lad reference; but he trusted that the character of tho
House would not suffer in the eyes of the country from the
fact cf there being only one 'individual who was prepared to
Crone forward and argue a question which was regarded with a
feeling of hostility by all Hon. Members.--( Cries of " no,
no.") If the opinion intended to be conveyed by this expree-
sion of " no" really existed, he was glad of it; but he must say
thai the public mind was most firmly disposed to entertain a
feeling of predjudice against the unfortunate cotton-spinners
of Glasgow. Nor was this prejudice the effect only of recent
;disclosures; for at the time of summoning the jury many of
.those who were called upon to act had written to the officer
requesting that they might be exempted, and declaring their
belief that, from the prejudice which then existed, they would
be unable to give an impartial verdict in the case, al-
though they would be sworn to give such a verdict
only as would bo warranted by the evidence which
should be adduced before them. From the very moment of
the assassination of the unfortunate man Smith in Glasgow,
the press and the authorities of the place had striven tea cast a
prejudice on the Cotton-spinners, aed to point them out as
the persons by whom the murder was committed ; for after
the death of the unfortunate man, certainly in a most de-
plorable manlier, a proclamation was issued, offering a re-
ward of 600 guineas to any one who should give such ii,f ,r-
-mation and evidence as would lead to the apprehension and
conviction of the offenders-4 Hear, hear)—and also at the
same time declaring that there was every reason to be-
lieve that the cotton-spinners had committed the murder.
Thus, at the very outset, the parties were prejudged, and
the formation of a conviction was induced in the public
mind that the assassination was, in truth, the act and
deed of the Union of Cotton spinners. Now, what was
ths history of the case? Ira the year 1536' the working men
in Glasgow, the cotton-spinners, considered that they were
under-paid ; and he believed that it would be admitted by
Honourable Members that they were entitled, in conse-
quence, not only to enter into a consideration of the
subject, but also to combine to protect themselves. It was
on the 22d of July last that Smith was shot, as lie was
returning home between eleven and twelve o'clock, and
it was on the following Wednesday that the proclamation
was issued. On the 3d of August the Sheriff of Glasgow,
with a posse of constables, visited the Committee of
the cotton-spinners, and they seized eighteen persons,
and took possession, in addition, of all the papers and
documents found in the room. Tho individuals seized were
all consigned to a gaol, and from that time until the 10th of
October the public prosecutors, it was to be supposed,. were
engaged in collecting evidence agaiest tleem. Their trial,
however, was postponed from- time to time, and the indict-
ment which was at first delivered to the egents of the pri.
senors was withdrawn, and a second served, through which
it would have been imagined that it was impossible fur the
prisoners to have escaped, and the trial at length, after
various further postponement, at length in the first week in
January carne on. The Lord Advocate was public prosecu-
tor, and was therefore present at the vial, and he was glad
to sec him now in his seat, because he would be able to give a
distinct account of all the transactions which had passed iii
Court under his own notice ; but the House, in receiving those
statement s from the Learned Lord, must not forget the cha-
racter in which he appeared at the trial, and could not expect
that he could entirely divest himself of the feeling which lie
must have entertained there ; the posnion in at-Bich be was
placed being that of Counsel for the Crowe, and, in fact,
he being in that House in the some capacity, ant to
defend hiss own conduct, and that of the individuals who
had acted under his advice. He (Mr. Wakley) was un-
acquainted with the nature of law proceedings in Scotland,
and he was much rejoiced et it, if the proceedings in this case
were to he taken as a sample of the manner in which they
were carried on. But it was said that the law was so made
that large flies should escape, while the little insects should be
caught is the meshes of the net set fornitsm. This appeared
to have been the case in the present instance ; but it was ex-.
traordinary how the prisoners had es :aped the full punishment
of the law. The indictment contained twelve counts, on three
only of which had the prisoners been found guilty, notwith-
standing at the trial the witnesses had been allowed to state
facts connected with meetings which had taken place years
befule, at a time when none of the piiso.iers were more than
six or seven yews of age, and with which the witnesses
themselves were acquainted only by hearsay ; but such a
mode of trial was utterly inconsi,nent with justice. In
the indictment there was a count for vitriol-throning, a
count for arson or fire-raising, a count for murder, and
others which alleged crimes to have been committed,
of which, if the prisoners had been guiity, they might
certainly have been thought the- vilest culprits who
were ever brought into a court of justice. The first count was
that the prisoners agreed to use intireidethm, molestation, and
threats to spinness, and deter them from takieg works the eee
cond was, that the tteard committee and the prisoners ..greed
to set upon the spinners, and assault and molest the new hands
employed; the third count was to the same effect, and alleged
the molestation and assaults to have been on the return from
work of the spinnere; the fourth count alleged that the pri-
soners and others had censpired to act fire to Messrs. Hussey';
factory, and hired a pereoe to do so, to whom they offered a
reward of 201. to complete the act, by Ctimwing a packet of
1 combustibles into the yarn-room. The fifth count wee 014
the prisoners and others appointed a secret select committee,
who were hired to send threatening letters to employers, and

to set fire to a cotton-mill, and forcibly to invade the dwelling-
house of a spinner, end to commit assaults on spinners, and to
shoot and murder a spinner, and thatthese acts were done and
comreisted. The sixth, seventh, eighth, ninth, tenth cod eleventh
counts set cut fee various acts alleged to have been committed
:n the fifth court, and the twelfth count alleged the murder of
John S.rith. These men, thin, who were thus so grievously
and foully calumniated, were only convicted of a conspiracy to
raise wages and also for assault, for which this meet acvere sen-
tence was passed en them. He should now proceed to call
the attention of the House to what was said by the judge who
summed up the evidi nee and sassed sentence en the prisoners.
With regsrd to the charge of murder, it was most emphati-
cally stated that if the evidence of Christie wee not believed,
the erisoners roust be acquitted. It was also eteeed ihat the
chase against the Fuer prissiest s or hiring Maclean was defi-
cient in proof, With reaper: to the charge of murder against
Kielce:* himself. he cave no further opinion than by seying
that, if they ier believ the alibi witnesses, Maclean could not
be the murslerer, With rsspect to the threatening letters, he
add, " As to the charge against. Mecneil writing a:ld sendieg
the threa'enieg letter to Mr. Arthur, it was not proved." Al
though, there the judge said that the charges could not be
believe,' as to the murder and threatening letter, ho inti-
meted to the jury, at the conclusion of the etireriiing up,
that with regded 'te the charge of threatening letters, the
jury would judge from what quarter they could come, but
fsem nergons halting the most liyele intereet in the Associa-
tient, and so with regard to the attempt at fire-raising ; and
iii such elwervatlons on tten.s. ersii of the judge were malted the
spleen or; jeitieft hi i'.cotla.o4. Ageie, on Messing sentence
on the prisoners, the Lord Jestice Clerk said, " It is for
the purpose of deterring etiners from persisting in their evil
courses, and of bringing that part of the community with
which yen are connected back into a state of order," 4c. Lord
Mackenzie said, " We most keep in view the distinction be-
tween the crime preyed, awl that which wee ehergesi end pot
proven." He (Me. Wekley) could lot help saying that it
was a remarkable thing that a judge should make such ob-
see sr:Aloes. It was in fact passing sentence for a crime of
rel3ch they bad not been found guilty ; they had poi been
found guilty of munder of wrieieenthreatening letters, but the
language of the judge was to ihe effect that they were guilty.
Lprci Moncrieff said that the inlictrnent need two ilietinct
instances of intimidation and assault on.the pert of the guard
committee. In the irst indictment the two assaults he had
alluded tp were not mentioned. He should like to brow
under what statute or what taw a misdemeanour Of the kind
these persons had been found guilty of could be punished with
„c.„ yeetes' transportation. An Hon. Gentleman below hiss
said by the common Is l issali hp (Mr, Waklyv) contended
that the common lax of England "did not admit of such a
punishment for a simple misdemeanour. In 1825 the Legis-
lature passed an Act fur the repel 0 the combination laws.
In one of the sections of this Act it was stated that "combina-
tions of workmen had taken place in England, Scotland,
and Ireland, often to a great extent, to raise and keep up
their wages, to regulate their hours of working, and to
impose restrictions on the masters respecting apprentices or
others whom they may think proper to employ, end that the
laws have not hitherto been effectual to prevent such com-
binations ; that it was expedient that the atatute laws that
interfere in these particulars between masters and workmen
should be repealed, and also that the common law under
which a peaceable meeting of masters or workmen nay be
prosecuted as a conspiracy should he altered." The common
low had not been acted upon since the appointment of the
Committee in the year before the act was passed. Of that
Committee ii;s Hon. Friend the Member for Kilkenny—to
whom the working classes, for his indefatigable and aisle exer-
tions in their behalf, must ever owe a debt of gratitude--was
Chairman, and drew up a most able report on the subject, to
he Legged to direct the attention of the House. He
ewbeeiicu' ee, actors cue to the Act he had just referred to, that the
combination at .71...`isiorf was illegal. There might be certain
acts committed ny certain. oersons connected with the combi-
the highest legal autho-
rity
.
n a ti ofno
.w.
sayinghic h were
that illegal
t. h
e c ;routom n ihnen lit
But, even in cases of illegal combination what Ms the punish-
ment under this Act ? In one of the sections of it it was
i:jud s itself nut illegal.
enacted, " that after the passing of this Act any person found
guilty of violence towards any person or persons or property,
or by threats or intimidation forcing, or endeavouring to
o
f.. roe, any workman or journeyman to depart from his hiring
leave his work, or preventing or endeavouring to prevent
any person not being hired or employed
from accepting,
by threats or intimidation, any work or hire, shall be im-
prisoned and kept to hard labour for a period not
-
exceeding three calendar months." He might be told that
this Act did not extend to Scotland. He would ask why it
did not ? It appeared, however, that the usual clause for this
purpose was not in the Act, and the common law was revived
with regard to Scotland. If any parties in England were
found guilty of the charges these persons were found guilty
of, and which was called conspiracy in Scotland, they would
be liable to only three months' imprisonment ; but in Scot-
land they would, it appeared, be liable to have a sentence of
transportation for seven ]ears passed on them. Seeing the
nature of the evidence adduced on the trial, what he then in-
tended to call for was a full inquiry into the nature of the Cot-
ton-spinning Association. He did not intend to propose the
two resolutions which he had given notice of, but should confine
himself to the first of them.—(llear.) Ile intended to do so,
because he thought tlsat it would be more prudent to with- ,
draw his second resolution' relying as lie did on the friendly
feelings of Members, and even on the good feelings of those
who, even if they had committed errors in their proceedings,
had done so from ignorance. He brought no charges against
the Executive Government—he brought no charges against
the Lord Advocate, or against the other legal advisers of the
Crown ; for he believed that if be had been situated
as they were situated, and with the nature of the state-
ments laid before them, he should have acted in the
same way that they had. It was, indeed,
impossible
that they should not pay some attention to the repre-
sentations made as to the circumstances alleged, to be
_ire-me Ms°e
attendant on the proceedings of the Cotton A, i -rthero, it
dation. After the alarming statements made to
was the duty of the Government to make the most rigoreeonues
search and investigation into the alleged proceedings. T
question, however, was, whether the feelings and ima,gto a-
liens of the authorities had not been axeited by
the sup.
posed proceedings of this association, and whether a more
severe punishment bad not been passed on these men than the
circumstances of the case required ? He, therefore, on these
grounds, made no charge against the Executive Government;
from
but he asked, lie implored, them not to send these menthe country until the whole case had been fully investigated.
When a case was before a court of law, it often
happened
that the matter turned upon seine technicality. If the case
was alluded to in the House, it was instantly nice with the
objection, from gentlemen on one side of the House or the
other, that there was no precedent. He did not think that
it always happened that a court of justice was
the
had
favourable place for investigating such charges as
been brought forward with respect to this association ;
but before a Committee of that House the whole
matter most
would be investigated in the fairest and moat favourable
the g
manner. Ile would ask whether the House or
country
would gain anything by sendin these men out
of England?
If they awarded the punishment which was imposed by the
statute, they could not award more than three months' intri"
soament to these men ; but according to the law authorities on
the other side of the Tweed, the offence was to be punished
with seven years' transportation. A few
years ago the siz
Dorchester labourers were, in the opinion of many Members
of that House, most properly sent out of the country for hav-
ing taken an illegal oath; but was there then a single Member
in the House who was not convinced that these men were mosthardly and severely punished, on being-,convicted under the
57th of Geo. 111. cf taking an illegals oeth ? That was the
only breach cf the law of which those men were guilty, and
for which they were sent out of the country. The sentence
on those men had been rescinded, and one of them had re-
turned to this country, but the oth r five men had not been
heeled of. Ile warned th '*thin
o House against acting in a g
, lik- a spirit of hostility tothe workin'
millions of Englishmen.
Such a course could not but be attended with the greatest
danger, and he would tell Honourable Gentlemen opp
feelings of tilel
not to suepose that they could lon uphold the Conservative
institutions of the country when tlie fee
against them. lie begged the House to recollect that the
werenGt
represented
i, spreadi
that amongsti,uuse
and indeed
working classes were not the ignorant body that they were
people were
formerly said to be, but that knowledge and intelligence
peculiar quelificition which' prevented the working men front
sending any of their own class
into. that House, and in ad-
dition to th it, the franchise mindeeTliita.htelyarhgaed body
created weea
ex-
cluded the larger portion 'of? ttieven by the Reform Bill ,
Hear, hear, hear,'
from the Opposition benches ) Honourableni.("Gentlemen op-
posite cheered, but were they, when they
appeared to think
with him that the Reform Bill was not a perfect or sufficient
mcasure, prepared to go further—would they support a propo-
sition for Universal Suffrage? Ho was sure that the result
would be that the working millions in this country would force
their demands on the attention of the Honse until their just
claims were heard
with surreal. The Hon. and Learned
Member for Dublin had given notice of an amendment to his
motion. The lion. and Learned Gentleman saidtlia
favcurable to inquiry. This was all that the memberst he
w"
of the
Trades' Unions demanded ; they said that they were
anxious for the fullest investigation, so that they
r might
most
have an opportunity of removing the imputations wlichi
been cast on their characters. In consequence of what had
taken place in the sister island, his Hon. and Learned
Friend made an attempt to disabuse the public mind—( it
sse
Air,
hear)—of the working classes as to certain transactionsconnconnected
connected with the combinations, and as to tomeunfortunate
oil'.cts they had had on the trade of Dublin ; in consequence
of this he was charged with being hostile to the interests of
the w racing classes, and an attempt was made to excite the
fs clings of the people against him. lie (Mr. Whidey) be-
Foved that the charge was without foundation, and that nothing
of the kind was true—indeed his whole life was an answerto
t.e charge.—( Hear, hear.) Whether the House agreed to
the inquisy on his motion or on that of hie Honourable and
Learned Friend was immaterial ; all that he required was that
the inquiry should be full anti complete, an I that the unfortu-
nate
men who had been convicted in Scotland should be
re-
tained in this country until the investigation
was at an end.
Because the combination laws had been repealed, Honourable
Gentlemen thought that the working men acted improperly if
they made any provision for a future time out of thir w-ckl
wage-, ~.p far from this, he thought that the working ma):1
deserved credit for making provision out of his wages, to--
apply
it when the day of e ant came ; and it was quite immaterial
adi etlier this was done by union amongst the werkin' classes
or otherwise. Indeed it was e question with him whetherg th
law should not do a little more than it did at present fur the
protection of the interests of the working classes. The fact
was, that there was nothing but combinations amongst the rich
from one end of the country to the other.—( Hear, hear.) He
had no hesitetion in saving tleatehere was a trade union in that
House. The landed proprietiire in tl4l House PO4 ft tBl u ed the
.... ..