The Sun.
London, England, 1854-08-11 00:00:00

tion of the new organisation of the war department as
would show that security had been taken for its effi-
ciency, economy, and especially for its responsibility,
all responsibility being now much divided.. He would
not carry this question, which had been so often dis-
cussed both in and out of Parliament, further, but he
he would say, that although war was declared in
March, it was not till May that the public was aware
that any change was to take place in the war department.
He wished next to state his regret that the blockades of
the enemy's country were not so effective as to injure
their trade and commerce to such an extent as might
have been expected from the great armaments which had
been sent out. He could not understand why the
blockade of the White Sea and Archangel was not en-
tered into till the first of August. A great part of the
commerce of Russia had its outlet in the ports of that
sea. • The Baltic blockade, though commenced somewhat
late, was certainly not without effect. The operations
of Russia in that sea had been entirely stopped, and the
revenue to be derived from customs duties in her sea-
ports there had been suspended. That was undoubtedly
no slight operation or advantage. But though the trade
of Russia in that sea had been stopped, yet there were.
great facilities for carrying-it on still open-in the lower
part of that empire; and although much bad been done
by the blockade to stop the revenue of the Government
of Russia, yet it had not been so effectual with regard to
the trade of the people of Russia. He stated that as a
fact which could not be denied, and as a proof of it he
would state that the prices of B,ussisn produce had not
been sensibly raised in our, markets' since February
last. He admitted that prices„so that time were
not peace prices ; but if prices of Russian produce
had not sensibly risen since then in this country,
it showed that the supply had not been stopped.
More than that ; as regarded the produce of the
countries on the Blapic Sea, it was a fact within
his own knowledge that the articles of produce from that
part of Russia were now at lower prices in the markets
of London than they were two months ago. It was a
fact within his own knowledge that a contract for the
supply of linseed from the Sea of Azoff, was atalo wer rate
than was charged two months ago. If that was so, not-
withstanding the despatches of any admirals or any cap-
tains, there could not bean effectual blockade of the Black
Sea. He male these remarks with a view to the future,
for he could see no visible end of the war till you b
the war and the losses the war carried with
it to bearrought on
the people of Russia. It was a mistake to say that there
was no public opinion in Russia. There was a public
opinion, and one which was much dreaded by the Go-
vernment. It was a public opinion which was not often
or easily roused ; when it was roused, it acted in a man-
ner at which the Government was much frightened.
(Hear, and a laugh.) He would now approach another
topic, and be would frankly say that he thought there
had been remissness on the part of the Government.
He alluded to the much vexed question of the supply of
gun-boats. It was no answer to say that unprofes-
sional people were not qualified to give an opinion on a
subject about which they could' know nothing; for there
were facts connected with it which were easily to be dealt
with by the rules of common sense, and any person exer-
cising his common sense was able to judge of them.
There were two great facts that could not be denied.
Firstly, that neither of the fleets, arid especially the Baltic
fleet, were supplied with steam gunboats, by which he
meant vessels drawing four or five feet of water, and car-
rying heavy armaments. There was also another fact
which could not be denied, and that was that if the fleets
had been supplied with such gunboats they would have
been eminently useful. However questions on that sub-
ject might have been met by taunts and ridicule, it had
never been denied that the fleets had not been supplied
with gunboats, or that such gunboats would have been
eminently useful. Let him recall to their lordships' re-
collection what had occurred the other day in the recon-
naissance before Bomarsund (where he hoped our ships
were at this moment triumphant) by the ships of the
squadron employed in that service. The statement he
was about to make was made on the highest authority.
The squadron consisted of four large 60-gun screw ships,
the Valorous and another steam frigate. At five in the
morning the vessels weighed and stood in for Bomar-
sund. At a quarter to six the Valorous signalled that
she was aground, and she remained aground till a quar-
ter to ten. At three o'clock another went aground, and
it was some time before they were got off. Now, had
there been vessels ahead of light draft of water, all this
would have been prevented ; and if such vessels had been
armed with heavy guns, it would have been easy with the
assistance of the squadron to have shelled the fort. (The
noble marquis proceeded to referto the range of long guns
and bombs, but in so low a tone that only an occasional
word reached the gallery.) Mortars and bombs would
carry and had been worked efficiently at a distance of 5,000
yards, and it was common sense that in a war of bombard-
ment which this was, if you had twenty or thirty vessels
armed with long guns and bombs carrying shot and shell
to that distance, in the long run no stone walls could
stand against them. They all knew that in the Morea,
in the war against Ibrahim Paella., the forts and castles
were shelled and the works destroyed by our mortars
and long guns, while our own vessels were kept wholly
out of range of the enemies' gulps, and not a man was
lost ; and was it not evident that in a sea abounding
with shoals, with numerous rivers debouching into it,
that vessels of a light draught of water, and carrying
beavy armaments, must be of the greatest possible ad-
vantage to the fleet? But it had been said tauntingly
in answer, why don't you who talk so much about these
vessels show us how we are to build vessels which will
carry such heavy armaments, and at the same time draw
so little water as to allow of their being used in shallows
and rivers ? This argument, lam aware, has been ad-
vanced by persons of professional knowledge, who bring
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the weight of their authority to bear against those who
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at
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at
the reavteeryefd ascending
and the rain6vfde
theseth ey
boats weremerchandise
eh the
withn d rivers,
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about 16 miles an hour. When the
there, why were they to be told neidyt i nwtge
an
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build boats to carry a little
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told that such boats would not be
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little less water than those win
elehtohaittanhbee
to navigate the
had alluded to navigated the bean of San Francisco
which was 80 miles in extent, and yvehe there a very heavy sea running. An armament where was often
of two long
heavy guns, such as he proposed, would not weigh more
than 12 tons, including carriages and t
they found vessels drawing between 3 oarek4hfse,etand when
upwards of 100 tons, there could s urely be real carrying
laffirrcyullntg
in the case. He had referred to this to inc beta
ho in the
other house there had been producelby an honand
gallant officer connected with the Government, letters
and extracts from despatches of the admirals command-
ing our fleets in the Baltic, which it would have been
extremely painful to hear or read, if it could be sup-
did the üblic believe, that
posed thatthe
despatches. Buti he did not believe, nor
p "Sr Charles Napier wrote
enemy was
home to the Government that the fortress of the
impregnable, and that with the fine fleet
he had under his command he was
able to do com-
paratively nothing. The public believed, and he be-
lieved, that in these letters and despatches Sir Charles
Napier pointed out that there were particular points in
which the fleet was deficient, and that he
applied to have
those deficiencies supplied, explaining
at the same time
that the reason the fleet was not enabled to act as hi
wished it to act, was that he had not the appliances
which he considered necessary, and for which he asked. He said nothing of the indiscretion of making Such state-
ments publicly in Parliament,
teutit he referred to the
matter because, in some respec , ustified his again
intruding upon their lordships' attention upon
this sub-
ject. Then, with respect to theinalliances and confede-
racies to which he had referred his notice of !
motion
as having been entered intobetween her Majesty's
Government and other Governments. lie hoped his
noble friend would not think him particularly curious,
when he said that be thought before Parliament rose
they ought to have before them a copy of the treaty, to
which he had alluded on a previous occasion, entered
into between Austria and the Porte: That treaty was
concluded on the 14th June, he believed, at Constanti-
nople,
pies& He believed it was notorious
under our auspices.
that the Turkish Government were reluctant to allow an
Austrian army to enter the Danubian provinces, and it
was a matter of fact—it was known to them officially—.
that the Servian Government protested against the occu-
pation of Servia by an Austrian force. They had the
document in which that protest was embodied on the
table, and an admirable document it was—well worth
their lordships' attention. It was notorious that there
were many reasons why the Turkish Government should
not be anxious to allow an Austrian occupation of the
principalities,
anxious she might be to have the
assistance of however
that great military power in carrying on
the war. But the question was, did Austria by this
occupation assist Turkey in carrying on the war ? That
was the point on which he
wished to obtain information
from his noble'friend. He wanted to know what were
the words upon which the Government relied, that Aus-
tria, would co-operate not for, her own objects merely,
but for our objects, in the war in which we were en-
gaged, and that she would not take up a position which
would render her arbitress, as far as the principalities
were concerned, of the issue of the war. There was
something strange in the language of the treaty, and
the manner of carrying out. It was signed on the
14th of June, and up to this moment, so far as they
knew, no Austrian soldier had crossed into Wallachia.
He begged to be understood as throwing no blame upon
Austria in this respect. She had a perfect right togpur-
sue her own policy. Sbe was .
doubtless had 'great- objects in view. He would only
say that he hoped these objects were honest ; but she
had a perfect.rightto conceal her policy if she thought
fit. The question for their lordships, hoyf (nor, was,

what was to be our policy—how far we were wise in
agreeing to the treaty, and what was the security
we had that it would be carried out ? In the first place
Austria, engaged by that treaty to endeavour, by all
means in her power, to obtain the evacuation of the
Danubian Principalities by the Russian forces, and if ne-
cessary to empty force to compel that evacuation ; and
she engaged also to restore the Principalities as soon as
a treaty of peace should have been concluded securing
the integrity of the Turkish empire. Austria might, in
concert with Prussia, have the utmost possible induce-
ments for desiring that the Czar should withdraw his
troops. When Russia refused to obey the summons to
evacuate he should have thought that Austria would
have moved at once. But she had not done so, and the
nuestion was—Why had she not ! It appeared to him
that her conduct could only be explained by the suppo-
sition that she had in view her own particular objects.
His belief was that Austria would not move until Russia
had moved, and that we should never get Austria to
co-operate cordially with us in our objects as our ally
in this war. It would he observed that this power
to enter the Principalities was given to Austria
under this treaty, without any declaration of war
being necessary on her part against Russia. The
probability was that she would not allow any of her
soldiers to combat the forces of Russia. She would
enter the Principalities, but only to place her forces
between a retreating army and the victor, and main-
tain by means of a powerful army an armed neutrality,
or if she pleased an armed intervention. What security
had they that this would not be the course 'of Austria ?
They must consider what were the objects of Austria.
It was no triumph of our diplomacy if she now entered
and occupied those provinces, though he admitted that
her assistance would be very valuable if it could be de-
pended upon. But was it to promote our objects that
she interfered to stop the advance of the Turkish army ?
No such thing ; but the occupation of the Principalities
was as much an object to Austria as to Turkey. He
did not mean an object of possession ; but what he
meant was this, that if Russia took permanent posses-
sion of the Principalities, the injury to Germany, and
to the Austrian army in particular, which would result
from the occupation by the Czar of both banks of the
Danube, would be far greater than the injury to Turkey.
True, the result in one case would be that the Ottoman
empire would lose a portion of its territory ; but in a
military point of view, and commercially in a still
greater degree, Germany would be infinitely more in-
jured. Here, then, they had an explanation of the
object that Austria had in view, in desiring that
Russia should not possess the Principalities ; and, as
she could not view with indifference the entrance
of an allied army into them, no wonder that she
evinced a readiness to occupy them. herself the
mure especially as she could do so and maintain an
armed intervention without being in hostility to any
country. For the cause of the war, or the injustice of
Russian aggression against Turkey, he believed she cared
nothing. The claims of the Czar he believed were wholly
untenable ;' but when the war began his avowed object
was not the possession of the Principalities, but entire
power over all the Christian subjects of the " sick man"
in the first instance, that he might be evoked hereafter
to take possession of the "sick man's" house. That was
the protection that Russia claimed over Turkey, and
when we entered into the struggle our object was not
the mere evacuation of the Principalities by Russia, but
to secure, in the first instance, the independence and, in-
tegrity of the Ottoman empire; and, in the second, to
secure the peace of Europa by preventing the recurrence
of similar acts of a,geression for the future. Such were
the objects of the people of both England and France,
and such were the objects which bad been declared by
the ministers of both countries. The war in which we
were engaged was, he believed, generally admitted to be
a war of civilisation against barbarism. It was a war in
which the interests of all Europe were involved, and
could not terminate until we obtained material guaran-
tees that the Czar would never again advance similar
claims. (Hear.) Austria, however, had never taken
this view of the case. All she did by the treaty of Con-
stantinople was to provide that, supposing the Principa-
lities evacuated, peace should be treated for on the basis
of the status quo, and if these conditions were refused,
then he feared we should be brought into conflict with
the German Powers. Should such be the result, seeing.
that we had justice on our side, and that we were en-
gaged in supporting the cause of civilisation against bar-
barism—in the defence of a weak power against the un-
justifiable aggression of a strong neighbour—he was not
afraid to say that if those powers should be found leagued
against England and France they would fail. We might
safely look for assistance against the dishonesty of the
Governments hi the feelings of the people. We had
suffered much from this alliance. At the commence-
ment of the war it had been the means of preventing
Omer Pacha from facing the then comparatively insig-
nificant army of Gortschakoff, which, according to the
opinion of Omer Pacha himself, must have been defeated
by the overwhelming force which he could have brought
to bear against it. Then, from the same cause, the de-
claration of war by England and France was delayed,
and a further advantage given to Russia. Every per-
son who had seen the Turkish army had described it as
one of the finest in Europe. It was stated that the sol-
diers, for patriotism, courage, and endurance, were
worthy to comp: to with those with whom they were
now combined. But it was found that the weak point
of the Turkish army was in its officers. The weak point
being known it might have been remedied. Officers
were to be had of the right sort, men who knew the
country, and who were capable in every respect ; but,
out of respect to the German powers, the Sultan was not
permitted to employ them, and for a considerable time,
arid that time one when vigorous action was of the
greatest importance, he was obliged to decline the ser-
vices of European officers. Such was the result of the
Austrian alliance up to this time. He knew not on
what grounds the Government relied on the cordial co-
operation of Austria now—not on Austrian subjects
merely, but on the subjects of civilised Europe, and
therefore it was that he hoped that his noble friend
would, before the close of the session, be enabled to lay
before the house such correspondence and communica-
tions as would explain the grounds which the Government
had for relying upon Austrian good faith. Referring to the
blockade of the Russian ports in the Euxine, the noble lord
said that he had not thought it rightto sayanything in the
way of blame, nor did he wish to allude to the dashing
exploit performed the other day by the Russian steamer
Vladimir, in sailing out of Sebastopol, eluding the vigi-
lance of the whole of our fleet, and capturing a number
of Turkish transports. He did not impute blame to Ad-
miral Dundas ; for he trusted he would have a good ex•
cure to give in the fact that the whole of the force at his
disposal was engaged in another and an important duty
—the expedition of which they had heard. He looked
to the sending forth of that expedition with great hopes,
for he was convinced, from the experience of the officers
in command of the allied forces, that they would not
undertake an expedition which they had not reasonable
grounds for believing would be successful. He believed
that the expedition was a necessary one, and if it were
attended with risk and with delay, he for one should not
be ready to quarrel with it on that account. He was
aware that great objects could not be obtained without
great delay and great risk. He bad no doubt that every-
thing would be done that could be done by the gallant
officers who commanded it, and by the naval and mili-
tary forces who composed it, and for his own part he
was extremely happy to hear that the expedition had
been undertaken. (Cheers.) He repeated his hope that
on the points to which he had referred some information
would be furnished by the Government ; and after apo-
logising to their lordships for detaining them at such
length, he concluded by moving, in accordance with his
notice of motion, "for further information respecting the
war, and the alliances and confederacies entered into."
The Earl of CLA.RENDON—My lords, my noble
friend began his speech by a somewhat elaborate de-
fence of the course he has thought it his duty to take
this session, and as it has generally been my duty to
reply to his speeches, I hope he will permit me to say
that I have never made any of those charges which he
has now refuted—that I have never impugned his mo-
tives or complained of the perfect consistency of his
conduct from the first day of the session until now
almost the last, in allowing no opportunity to pass
of marking his want of confidence in her Majesty's
Government in respect to the war, and the manner in
which we have carried it on. (Hear.) My noble friend
need not have instituted a parallel between Mr. Pitt
and himself—(hear, hear, and is laugh)—as to the manner
in which he exercised his privilege and his duty as a
member of your lordships' house, inasmuch as his con-
duct in this respect has, as far as I am aware, never
been impugned. (Hear.) If, however, I ever had any
disposition to impugn his conduct or question his discre-
tion, I think it would be to-night, when the first hour
of his speech has been occupied in detailing facts,
which, if true, it would be most precious for the enemy
to know, but to which, as neither myself nor my noble
friend near me, the noble duke (Newcastle) possess any
knowledge of there, I am quite unable to reply to h
as I could wish. (Hear.)
The Marquis of CLANRTCARDE here made an
observation, denying that he had entered into such
details.
The Earl of CLARENDON—
referred to the want of mortars andlerosimy Noble friend
gun.boats,
inefficiency which, o
f
he says, exists, and to what he calls the
the fleet.
The Marquis of CLANRICARDE again inter-
rupted, but the remark he made was not heard in
the gallery.
The Earl of CLARENDON—With regard to that
part of the case brought forward by my noble friend to
which I shall more particularly address myself-- the
treaty between Austria and
the Porte—lshave to express
my regret that I have not, as I ought to have done, laid
a copy of that document upon the table. The last time
my noble friend spoke of the_ matter I referred to the
copy in
andfound that it was a mere
the Foreign-office,
rough draft, having upon it a number of marginal notes;
it turned out also that it was then unsigned, and was not
in that complete shape in which I could lay it before.
your lordships.
But my noble friend must have been per-
fectly cognisant of all the stipulations of that treaty, for
it had been published in the Constantinople Gazette,
and reprinted in various other newspapers. As respects
the treaty itself, I do not think it merits the stric-
tures my noble friend has passed upon it_; and with
regard to its having been agreed to by the Porte at the
mitigation of the English Governpaeut, all can say io,

that Lord Stratford, our ambassador at Constantinople,
had been instructed to support a treaty between Austria
and Turkey founded upon the understanding which bad
been come to between Austria and the Governments of
France and England, and that, in consequence, the
Porte agreed to it. Your lordships are aware that not
many months ago the Austrian Government entered
into an engagement with her Majesty's Government and
with the Government of France, that on no considera-
tion would it enter upon the occupation of any portion
of the Ottoman territory without the consent of the
Porte. Austria declared that only for the purpose of
putting down an insurrection in favour of Russia in Ser-
via, or the invasion of Servia by a Russian military force,
would she interfere to occupy that territory ; and al-
though my noble friend has rjerred to the protest of
the Servian Government, he must not rely too implicitly
on that, for if it had not been for fear of coercion,an
insurrection in favour of Russia would long since have
taken place in Servia. Austria also undertook to sup-
press by her troops if necessary any insurrection pro-
moted by Russia in Montenegro, and she told us that
in the event of war with Russia it might be necessary
to occupy the principalities ; but that she would not do
so without previously obtaining the consent of, and only
under a solemn agreement with, the Porte. These were
the conditions upon which the treaty between Austria
and the Porte was to be based. That treaty was com-
municated to us about the same day that it was signed.
We knew nothing of it before that. No instructions,
therefore, were sent out to our ambassador upon the
subject. Lord Stratford, however, undoubtedly did
recommend that the Porte should agree to such a
treaty, and her Majesty's Geverument approved of
the advice he gave ; and if Lord Stratford recommended
the adoption of the treaty, he did so because he saw
that in the preamble and in the articles it was closely
connected with the proceedings that had taken place
at 'Vienna between the representatives of France
and England and the other allies of the Porte,
and in accordance with the terms of the protocol, and
that it contained nothing to fetter the free action of the
Sultan, or to prevent his taking what measures he
pleased, either by himself or in council with his allies,
for the occupation of the Principalities, or the with-
drawal of the Russian forces. As soon, however, as
we knew the substance of the convention our language
to Austria was that the occupation by her of any part
of the Ottoman territory was a matter of extreme deli-
cacy, and that great care must be taken that every step
was taken and everything done in the name of the Sul-
tan and on his behalf, and that whatever measures were
adopted in reference to such occupation must be of a
temporary character. (Hear, hear.) 'When, at the
end of June, Russia was about to occupy Bucharest, and
it was known at Vienna that the Russian general was
about to carry away the archives, inhabitants, and na-
tional militia of Wallachia, there was apprehension that
anarchy would prevail in the province, because the
troops were not then in a position to cross the Danube.
The Austrian Government immediately communicated
with ours, and sent a staff officer of Baron Hess's to the
head-quarters of Marshal St. Arnaud and Lord Raglan,
in order to announce that they intended to occupy a
portion of Wallachia, in the name of the Sultan, with a
view to the restoration of order, although they could
not enter the country as a belligerent, because they had
not received from Russia an answer to their demand,
nor were they aware whether that power had received
it. While speaking of this demand which was addressed
by Austria to Russia, I may mention that it was not
couched exactly in the tone which my noble friend de-
scribes, nor would the answer of Russia exactly tally
with his description either as to matter or date. It was
in the beginning of June that the Austrian note was
addressed to the Russian Government, stating the evils
that arose to Austria and Germany generally, from the
occupation of the principalities, and requiring their im-
mediate evacuation. The answer of the Russian Go-
vernment was not an insolent rejection of that demand,
but was, on the contrary, an offer to adhere to the three
principal points of the protocol of Vienna. I merely
mention these circumstances because my noble friend
was evidently misinformed respecting them. My lords,
the language we addressed to Austria was to this effect.
When we heard the announcement that her forces were
about to enter the Principalities, we said that, if Aus-
tria was going into Wallachia after it had been eva-
cuated by the Russians, for the purpose of proceeding
thence to Moldavia to drive them out of that province,
then, in our opinion, the convention would have been
faithfully fulfilled, but that if she were merely going
there to occupy the provinces on their being evacuated
by the Russians, then we said she would not be war-
ranted in doing so, unless with the consent and at the
express desire of the Porte. The reply to the Austrian
Government was that they only entered in order to pre-
vent anarchy, and to re-establish order in the name,
and on behalt of the Sultan, and that they could not
enter as belligerents because they had not declared war,
but that being once there, they would resist by force
any attempt at returning on the part of the Russians.
(Hear, hear.) The Porte replied to the application of
' Austria by appointing imperial commissioners to go to
the provinces to arrange all these matters op the part of
the Sultan, and to institute a judicial inquiry into the
conduct which had been pursued by the hospodars on
the arrival of the RussiAn troops, and it was to depend
upon the result of that inquiry whether or not the
hospodars were to be reinstated in their authority.
We then communicated to the Austrian and Turlaish
Governments our entire satisfaction at the appoint-
ment of the imperial commissioners. We now know that
the Principalities are about to be evacuated, at least Wal-
lachia, because by the last accounts Prince Gortschakoff
appears to have taken affectionate leave of the boyards,
baying first burnt and destroyed everything in their
country. (Hear.) This fortunate result is certainly due
to the presence of the allied troops at Varna, and to
the bravery of the Turks, but it is principally to be
taken as a result of the position which Austria has taken
up. It is now some time since we received information
that the Austrian army was being concentrated in the
Bukowina and North Transylvania, and that their posi-
tion was so threatening that they would not be able to
maintain themselves in Moldavia or Wallachia, and that
it was only yesterday we were informed that Prince
Gortschakoff had received orders to evacuate both pro-
vinces. (Cheers.) lam not, my lords, going to enter into
an elaborate defence of the conduct of Anstria, or to pre-
tend to explain the motives that may have influenced
the policy of that country, but I certainly see no reason
to retract any opinion I may have expressed, that she
would be impelled at once by her honour, her dignity,
and her interest, to act in such a manner as would justify
the expectations of this country. (Hear.) I entirely
agree with my noble friend that Austria, as an indepen-
dent power, has a right to pursue her owe policy in her
own way, and that we have no right to complain if she
does so. With respect to any sacrifices we may have
made, I entirely deny that our policy or operations have
depended upon Austria, or have been influenced by her.
She may not have been as rapid in her movements as we
could desire, but her army was not ready, and to equip
and bring into the field an army of 300,000 was a work
of some time and considerable expense. As my noble
friend says, the policy of Austria must be guided by her
own interests, as is that of England and France, and let
me remind the house that her interests are more com-
plicated and antagonistic than those of either of the
latter powers. Our views and objects, I have not the
least hesitation in repeating, and I have the more satis-
faction in repeating them, because I know that to a very
great extent they are'shared by Austria—are, that the
designs of Russia upon Turkey, her violation of some
treaties, and misinterpretation of others, are danger-
ous to the tranquility of Europe. (Hear, and cheers.)
We consider that the constantly increasing armaments
of a despotic power have created a prestige and an in-
fluence for Russia in countries which neither has a right

to reach, and we consider that prestige and that in-
fluence to be dangerous to the independence of Europe
and the progress of civilisation. (Loud cheers.) Why,
my lords, at this moment Russia defies England and
France and Turkey in arms, and the public opinion of
the world besides, and I say that the nation that can do
that, or believes it can do it, possesses a power that can-
not be exercised with safety to other
powers, particu-
larly when exercised in the present case in furtherance
of unjust pretensions. I say that if such a power is
reality it must be curtailed, and if itisadellubsieoln iievtemthuastt
be dispelled. (Loud cheers.)My lords,
andon e owfi
lt h
rewarde s e resultsth e d Nivsiil
nl
tere followst
o from
d efforts
t thes
of
Englandpresent war,and
France. (Continued cheering.) Ido not say this be-
cause England and France' have not deep and abiding
interests in sustaining those principles of the mainten-
ance of which peace is the first and most indispensable
condition, but I say that when two great commercial
and maritime nations like England and France, having
first exhausted every effort for the maintenance of peace,
engage in a contest which may be long, and which
be 'costly, pledging themselves to derive no advantage
u
from its results—l say that such a disinterested course
of conduct is a guarantee to Europe of our intentions,rse
and I rejoice that it is reserved for our time and for England and France, to enter into such an engagement,
and thus to offer an example worthy of the age, and of
surrounding nations. (Cheers.) In bringing our
w e have
our armiese
aboveall
the a
annodt
ha
aedetsthtoe the
sbaelanreafiganiannsetial, com enemy
and,
political, difficulties to contend with
as Aaus, t
ra s aTmh ee
difficulties
of Austria are principally of a German cha-
racter ; and, therefore, I do not think we ought to blame
her for not advancing until she had herself safe, both
flank and frontier. I believe she has fullysucceeded in
that object, and I have great satisfaction in stating to
your lordships that within the last 36 hours, and conse-
quently since the evacuation of the Principalities was
known at Vienna, notes have been exchanged between her
Majesty's government and that of Austria, which will show
that Austria has as little intention as ourselves of re-
turning to the status quo, (Cheers.) I will, just before
Isit down, say a few words in reply to my noble friend's
observations respecting the measures we have taken and
the position in which we now stand. In the first place,
I beg your lordships to recollect that on the 29th March
war was declared ; a little more than four months since,
and that at that time it was the universal belief—and
when I say that, I do not speak merely of her Majesty's
Government, but of the most able and experienced mi-
litary officers of England and France—that Russia me-
ditated war with a view to further aggression. Nobody
believed that with the great forces she had concentrated
on the north of the Danube—with all the efforts she was
making, and the vast supplied She had accumulated—

she did not intend to`mareh southward. We, although
giving full credit to the known bravery of the Turks,.
could not bring ourselves to believe that they would be
able to resist the great numerical superiority and dis-
cipline of the Russian troops, commanded as they were
by able generals, while the only general whose name was
known on the side of the Turks was Omer Pacha, who
had not then the opportunities 4e has since no nobly
used in establishing his reputation. So much were we
and the French Government convinced of this, that
General Burgoyne and an experienced French engineer
officer were sent to Constantinople in order to devise
means of defending that city and the Dardanelles ; and
so much importance was attached to that measure, and
so entirely was the campaign connected with it, that
the departure of St. Arnaud and Lord Raglan was de•
layed in order that they might have personal interviews
with the officers who had been despatched on that spe-
cific service. • The allied army went to Gallipoli, where
ngorepaiet, works were thrown u
vring
then
necessity
y of up,
defending
to e
gtheparodnasntaenntesi-
fully in view. On their arrival they were received with
enthusiasm, and their presence imparted new courage
and vigour to the Turks. Subsequently the comman-
ders of the two armies went to Varna to ;meet Omer
Pacha ; who entreated that a large number of the allied
forces might come to that place, knowing the moral
effect that their presence would have on his own troops.
The Russians made every exertion to take Silistria be-
fore their arrival. The fortress had been heroically de-
fended, but the arrival of the troops was most useful.
The Russians evacuated the Dobrudsha, and recrossed •
the Danube ; thus putting an end to all Southern move-
-1 menu on their part, and making defensive war a ques-
tion no longer to be thought of or alluded to. In con- '
sequence of these events, our armies are now free, and
probablyowibbettuthaeoevrinteeectwnrpblockadedl Buoeobslsesoitconsider
tittgnrdibil ocrtdeemlehnuri
wasaeyptahwev mtunaaehtgtonoacasoabdnto have
recollectedl
ugi
aceornpsesu fmttntrri ,
ttdi
countries, ea‘te,shner
aoneptrc
fleets
edoeoindaedfewhaet:ttehpsti
srao,thee
hnanoarwwmdflles
and
dtcei
ihdsstepf htihlehyendiooppno. important operations
I Iseureefauerl:
success has
thatnlont
uwogds brw:suoast
useless,
uponi nrol tansrett
revenue
refusesuyenaaantdtlluet swdertrade,
andya neeredne:
I say that it is not an unimportant result that our ships
traverse every sea as free from danger as if there was a
universal peace. The consequence, then, of the Russian
ships being blocked up is, that our trade is flourishing
My noble friend should also remember that while loii;
ships are prosecuting their traffic in perfect safety, the
cruses Russian trade is nearly
enextinct. lam not able to quote
pri like my noble frid, who can state the terms on
which Russian productions are brought to this country.
All I know is, that they cannot come through the Bal-
tic ; and with respect to what comes by way of Memel,
I understand that the prices of tallow coming over land
is from 101. to 20/. a ton—a price at which I cannot
conceive that much business can be done. My noble
friend knows as well as I do that the trade of Russia
is usually carried on with English capital, which is
themne necessary
market.ryforc Allollect thating her ehras now entirelyproduction ceasedsandbringingand
the industry of that country has been consequently para-
lysed, while the want of markets has deprived the Rus-
sian proprietor of the means on which he depended to
meet his numerous heavy expenses. Now, I know that
these are not very heroic results, but I feel that they
will do what my noble friend has pointed out as being
desirable—they will create more pressure on all classes
in Russia and produce a more profound impression than
even if Sebastopol and Helsingfors had fallen for the
gratification of our national ambition and military ardour.
(Hear, hear.) We know that in order to maintain her-
self in this war, and over the vast territory which she
occueise, Russia has been obliged to maintain and in•
crease vast armies in Bulgaria, Livonia, Finland, Po-
land, the Danube, Circassia, and the Crimea. We know
what has been the enormous loss of life, and the im-
mense number of conscripts it has taken to fill up the
vacancies caused by death. I cannot state the exact
number ; but we have seen " ukases" coming out, by
which two, five, and even seven per cent. of their serfs
have been taken from the proprietors ; and when we
remember that the price of a serf is put down at not
less than 601., what a tax these levies must be, not
only upon the revenues of the proprietors but on their
capital. (Hear. hear.) They must tend to eroduce a
deep impression on those classes who are not favourable
to the war, whose fanaticism has not been raised, and
who cannot be persuaded to believe that their religion
is in danger. (Hear, hear.) Your lordships will also
bear in mind that, owing to the perfidy of the Greek
Government, an insurrection was got up in the pro-
vinces of Turkey at the instigation of Russia. It pro-
mised to be most formidable to the Porte, but owing
to the energy and determination of the English and
French Governments, the insurgents have laid down
their arms, peace has been restored, and I believe
there are better prospects of tranquillity in those mis-
guided countries than ever there were before. It is a
pleasure to me also to be able to add, that the effect
of these events has been only to confirm the good
understanding between the two armies, and to sent
the cordial relations which had before existed between .
the trio Governments. The Emperor of Russia no longer
thinks that the people of this country are all for peaoe, •
and enervated against war, , or that the alliance between
Eng-Mild-AM Franca is a rope of sand. The illusion also
that Russia is superior to all other nations in military
power, and in the success of her diplomacy has been com-
pletely dispelled. These, my lords, are after all no con-
temptible results. (Hear, hear.) I have already said it
would be usele=s to detail the conditions on which we
shall be willing to make peace ; but we aro all of the
isame opinion, namely, that the object with which we
make war is to obtain a just, honourable, and, as far as
human foresight can ensure it, a lasting peace, and we
believe that no peace can be just, honourable, or likely
to be lasting, that does not secure the indepeildnice and
integrity of the Turkish empire, that does not make that
empire a part of the general system of European policy,
and that does not secure it from menace, from invasion,
and from danger. My lords, in order to secure those
objects, we desire to have the co-operation of other go-
vernments ; but we do not depend upon that co-opera-
tion. France and England will not relax their efforts
under any circumstances. We rely on our own re-
sources and the justice of our cause, and although we
are ready to negotiate for peace, we shall never do so,
unless with those conditions attached which we believe
to be just, and which the whole of Europe is interested
in maintaining. (Cheers.)

The Marquis of CLANRICARDE, in reply, quoted
a note of the Austrian Government to show that it did
not demand the immediate evacuation of the Principali-
ties, but merely that the integrity of the Ottoman em-
pire should be respected. His noble friend had inti-
mated that he (Lord Clanricarde) had given information
which would be useful to the enemy. It was a wonder,
seeing that his noble friend was so sore on that point,
that he had not alluded to certain letters which had been
read in the other house, and which really did give infor-
mation to the enemy. He (Lord Clanricarde) had given
no information except that during eleven hours in which
our ships had been cruising before Bomarsund, one ship
or another was constantly aground. All that he had
stated had appeared in the public papers, or had tran-
spired in discussions in the other house of Parliament.
All, he believed, that was new to the Government was
that ships were built in America, drawing only three or
font feet of water, carrying 180 tons, going at the rate
he had described, and thus admirably calculated for the
the navigationiofo rmoot theinformation
he
Ba
hadlti cg iwaters.veb That htahtowtaasotohte wholewos o
con-
stantlythr
mentionedown ut
whenever
whatthey
independent
d be of
woul members of
Parliament
service t
would
otlhec of
o n nt
servicery , that o
thethe ney wereom y! only stating that
which d be
The motion was then agreed to.
POOR KNIGHTS OF WINDSOR.
The Earl of ALBEMARLE moved for copy of the
correspondence which has taken place relative to the
charities of the Military Order of St. George and the
military Gateate rknights
, either between
Windsorthe
a nodf
Cthse.
mpiitsusi s, in the interval
i;eCrommiseioners,or twtbheeeeecern theetary otth hof N
e said eoo
v.,
1852, and the sth of April, 1854; and also copy of such
memorials, petitions, and letters addressed to the said
commissioners by the lay clerks of Windsor, the gover-
nors of. the Military Knights of Windsor, the Military
Knights of Windsor, or either of them, and the agent
of the said knights, as referred to in page 834 in the ap-
teperensn,tdidoi
axnt
eoodff
6tbhtrhei
nfiAgripsntrgiri
,et
the
leoBrsttlob.fj e
et
Hht
bsCelfaootrrhdees
Parliament
IsiCtaaomtmeern
thi ses iaroi nal
7--
in the ensuing session.
The house adjourned at 10 minutes to 8 o'clock.

HOUSE OF COMMONS—(YESTERDAY.)
The SPEAKER took the chair at three o'clock.
IRISH FAIRS AND MARKETS.
Sir J. YOUNG, in reply to Sir D. NORREYS, stated
ghat next session he should bring in a bill to regulate
Fairs and markets in Ireland.

IRISH JURIES.
Sir D. NORREYS asked the right hon. baronet whe-
ther he intended next session to bring in a bill to relieve
the grand juries of Ireland from the management of the
fiscal affairs of counties, and to place these affairs under
the control of boards elected by the unions ?
Sir J. YOUNG could give no assurance on the point.
Sir D. NORREYS gave notice that early next session
he should bring in a bill on the subject.

I COMMISSIONERS OF EXCISE.

In reply to Mr. J. G. PHILLIMORE,
Mr. WILSON stated that Mr- Benham, the late
Secretary of the Ordnance, was at present a commis-
sioner of excise in England.
TESTAMENTARY JURISDICTION BILL.

In reply to Mr. HADFIELD,
Mr. SIDNEY HERBERT said if the Government
could succeed in putting the Testamentary Jurisdiction
Bill into such a shape as to be generally acceptable to
all parties, they would revise it next session.
LORDS' AMENDMENTS.
The Lords' Amendments to the Militia (No. 2) Bill,
and the Militia (Scotland) Bill were considered and
agreed to.

RQYAL FREE HOSPITAL.
oowfnLowrads
agreed to,
to, ir
STUART,iz.:LheAdfodlrleoswaifnor
copy g
of any report made by Mr. Bodkin, the counsel
who
attended the inquest on the body of Alfred Rich-
ardson, on behalf of the Home-office, and of the notes
taken by him during the inquest.
address O n th
teo theti o mCrown
ROYAL COMMISSION.
Mr. PtTLMAN, the Yeoman Usher of the Black Red,
appeared at the table, and summoned the house to at-
tend at the bar of the House of Lords, to hear the. Royal assent given by commission to several acts agreed
on by both houses, for which see Lords' report.
The SPEAKER, on his return, announced the names a
the bills.
The bonze then adjourned until throe o'alook
11101 TOW.