The Sun.
London, England, 1801-11-04 00:00:00

PRELIMINARY TREATY..

Lord HAWKESBURY moved the Order of the
Day, for the consideration pf the Preliminary Treaty
between Great Britain and the French Republic.-
Mr. T. GRENVILLE observed that the House
were not in possession of those Official Documents
which appeared to be necessary relative to the
Treaties entered,into by Portugal with other Powers,
which would enable them to form a correa judg-
ment relative to that Article of the Preliminary
Treaty which guaranteed the Integrity of Portugal,
the latter having been understood :to arise -out- of
certain Treaties of which Oia‘klotkss were officially
ignorant.

The SPEAKER suggested the question wag
merely the reading the Older of the Day.
Lord HAWKE4BURY said, His Majesty's Mi.
nisters were not in possession of those official do
cuments alluded to by the Honourable Gentleman/-
and therefore they, could not be laid before the
House. But he conceived he had given every tTe-
cessary information relative to that subjea on a
preceding ;evening," in answer to a question of an
Hon. Gentleman (Mr. GREY), when he expressly
stated tl►at the Integrity of Portugal was guaranteed
as it remained after the Treaty of Badajoz, t the
exclUsion of all. Treaties made subsequent to' that

period.
Mr. T. GRENVILLE said, he did not wish to
trouble the House unnecesiar4, but he really did'
not know any thing "about the Treaty of Badajoz,
which he had never seen, and which he believe& had
never been published in.this.Country. •
Lord HAWKESBORY repeated 1% hat he s9,irl an
a former evening.relative to the Cessions made by
Portugal,: in the Treaty of Badajoz. •
Mr.T..GRENVILLE said, he had'understS
that such was• the information given by the Nob
Lord, but 'still the House remained ignorant of
whole contents of the Treaty of Badajoz.
Mi. GREY said, it seemed. extradratil.lry,
the Article of the Preliminary Treaty 'ided to,
shoUld be understood to. take for its basis, :. !cal
between Portugal and, France which had n,„
ratified. It appeared, however, that ivlint—ers
were ignorant at the time of signing the Prelimi-
nary Treaty of another Treaty made betwao
France and-Portugali subsequent to the Treaty of
Badajoz. It remained.however, to he seer, w'
ther France would consent to cancel the latter, and

Substitute in its place a Treaty which they had re-
fused to ratify.
Lord HAIVICESBURY said, it was' 'understood'
between the Parties at the time the Prelimitlaty
Treaty was signed.
The Order of the Day being then read for takin
the Treaty into consideration,
Sir EDMUND -11^ ARTOPP rose. lie felt deep'.
ly, he said, the great importance of the stibjc& novt.
under discussion, and hoped for the indu,lAence of
the House, upon which he should. not long tres-'
pass., Before however he ' proceeded to move
the Address he was about to moves he
say a few words relative to an event which NI.
been received with the utmost approbation aro'
aprplause by a large majority, of the Country ; an
event which promised a speedy .termination; of a
.War ;the; most :bloody and the most,. expensive is
whickthis Country had ever been eng.:o.d. A War'
howeVer, .in which .we _had, Truth andb Justice
our side, and which had. been. supported; .recognized
and confirmed by the Parliarnein and the Pepele)
with a dignity, a zeal, and ati unanimity unexanTea
in the Annals of tlie oss..guntry. In the conduct of
,the War His.M4ljClty'li:!Millihteri had 1,4'4: ic:.itliot
objects ill stiewrsrto,defend* the Coil sr}, In 0
of., the, destructive ,dodzi;
~,I.lesl champions of,Libeety, subv.e.r.;'ve .if ?..•:.igio°
end, of Social.:Orkie.r-;, and' ,secontllV,•
inordinate andqvision;trY vi--)1"t1" ir.
irs
attempts to gr-sis • it, t.ac
prose ion i t these„ol)j-6t, ii,t .
Lentive to Use formation at
and it was sincerely to be witift., ,
could have been .formed swot :the rn(l,
of reciprocal and real interest, willn,ut
by ambition or 4ny' meaner .t. ,
regretted, however, that these Allikr.cet, I!.t
and that we had, tp lament the disappoin me nt IvI,,LP
arose.frem -the want of that support wh:ch ()ugh; 4°,
have., been, conceded by ,those equally iniere,tea,
11:rith ,ourselves in the prosecution of the
'the .War. With resped to 'the•firht of the, ol)1:.16
of the War, it liad,.been
.completely attained ---'ll'
Laves, flicHooour, and Dignity ofEritain, had h,
preserved against all attacks arising from a dis":'
g4ni-411-g spirit._ Great -Britainpreserved her cqoP
Laws,
,spite of the machinations of those svh(4
sole endeavours were aimed .at their destruttiyi'"
and the safety of the .People and of the Conctitul
insured.. - In the -other object of the War we
failed.. We' had not. been able to prevent For;
friant
.adding,t,erritory,to territory, 'and Acqui6ii°
to-acquisition. The,Alliances which we had 1101.;,
ed, diappointetl our expectations, and whilst 'll° 1
Allies displayed an eagerness to acquire ,the ley(A i
_of ambition, England displayed poblc twiecti
nimity, 'and a perfed freedom from the slighte,s;
A,
shade'of :rapacity or injustiee.in the Terms svlll
she had .offered to the Enemy. Ndthing had ber,
asked but what was the fair price of Peace. Alt
however some Gentlemen might think the 'At
ought to be carried on, for the purpose of cestoril
the antient Monarchy of France, he would .05v
those, or arty Gentleman, for what useful purr;
the War could,now he continued ? were
DQ
to be obtained, when the most powerful Stte.s,i„a
the Continent had failed in curbing :tile a"; 111.
of France and for what object of sound poi"cY
the War now be continued, when Efiglitau ic:e?
it 'in -her power to, make a safe and honourable l'ea,,est
—Peace had accordingly been made, and GI 0,,
Briiain had displayed magnanimity highly, h
0%
nourable to herself—in maintaining the integrity
her Allies, and bartering a part of her aCquisiti°,:i,
in return for their security—whilst those ac id
tions she had retained, were those the best ealctic
for her interests and her commerce. Upon
whole,' he had no hesitation in declaring his tijta
nion, that the Treaty was highly honourable ore
Great Britain,—that it was calculated to awls.her interests and increase her prosperity. 1-16
eluded by moving the Address. •
Mr. LEE said, he rose to second the IVlotion4iis,
the Hon. Baronet. Define entering into
cussion of the Preliminary Articles, he wif3rtA
say a few words relative to the precise objet ° ijaq
War. It had been maintained by some, chit
he A°
object of the War was the Restoration of t • cc
cient Monarchy of France. Had such realiyill
'P
o
the objet} of the 'War, it would have met
marked and entire disapprobation, conceiviol ot
no State had any right whatever to intcrfere
Internal Politics of another; and a War hal.'ng aria
o,llous
an obje&. in view, must necessarily be
unjust. He expressly denied, however,Great
was the obji.:tt of :the War betoscen
Complet‘
tin arid .Flancc. It was a War of, of self"
aigression on the part Of France, aPL"
that Vrci.,

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cesl
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upon the C
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thus carrie
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defer4C on the part of Britain. By the Treaty •
entered into between Germany and Prussia,
against Fraince, it was evident that the object of
the War carried on by them against that Country,
a as for the purpose of imrsing a Government upon
France. Had England so far forgot its own inter-
ests as to join this Confederacy; such War could
not have-been supported. So far, however, from
this, it was well known that England carefully ab-
stafned from interfering in the politics of France,
and it is equally well known that she reduced still
farther her Peace Establishment in the year 1792,
during the whole of which year the number of Sea-
-I:hlen employed in her Navy was only ts,ooo, and
the Army was reduced to 16,000, making in the
w,,,h01e a total of only 3i,000 men employed in both
"-Navy and Army, whilst the Taxes were at the same
Ihne reduced. It was e. ident, therefore, that Eng.
;and had no idea whatever of joining the Coalition,
or ihtertering ip the Politics of France. The con.
duet of France however towards Great-Britain
iearly proved it was her intention to
forcerovoke
hostilities on the part tif the latter, and her to
,a combat she had continually endeavoured to avoid.
was it not well known, that the French Nation
towed, throughout all Europe, the seeds of Sedition
and Insurrettion ? Could it he forgotten that they
received Addresses from various Seditious Societies
England, whose avowed objed was to establish
The French upon the- ruins of the British Constitu-
-lido ? But it was the objeCt of France to provoke
Britain to hostilities. It could not fora moment be
doubted, that the War entered into by Britain was
a War of self-defence in:opposition to the aggres-
,sions of France. The latter Country, by open force,
and by propagating JacObinism in the respedive
Countries round her, was enabled to make repeat-
ed conquests in spite of all ‘pposition. Great Bri.
t"in than finding the inutility of opposing France •
Upon the Continent, determined to attack her Colo- •
r'ies; and render the War entirely Naval. The suc.
cess attending her exploits were too -well known to
ue repeated, for never before were such a series of
brilliant successes gained in any War. This War,
thus carried on, with reiterated successes, had at
length been terminated by the Treaty now before
the House. The territories gained by that Treaty -
Would he highly advantageous to the Commerce of
Great Britain. Ceylon was of the highest import_
ante to the trade of the East Indies, and was the
source of the monopoly of the Cinnamon trade,
Whilst Trinidad was equally valUable and advan.
tiered
in the West Indies. It was to be remem.
been
that three different efforts at Pacification had
ueen made "by Great Britain, who therefore could
tot any time be charged with an indisposition to
• He'now called on those Gentlemen who ad-
th•
or supported the Treaty at Lisle, and opposed
e Present, to shew wherein the superiority of the
Tr•
eaty
of Lisle consisted, and why the present
reaty was of
entitled to equal support, when the
between
of bdth was Peace, , and when the difference
l'etween them was slight and trivial ? The Cape of
Cod Hope was, by the Treaty at Lisle, to be
ceded. to Great Britain, and by the present Treaty
to. be made: a' F:ee Port, that was the whole differ.
once. The question was, had we gained the objet;
vie had in view, and preserved our Honour and our
Ltegrity ? He saw no end to War, if Parties were
not to give up on either side some point of a Treatyb
‘Vere those Gentlemen who opposed the War pre.
pared to say that we should have re-kindled the
i"nt of War, because we would not consent to
I 1 C
I.;‘ke the ape of Good Hope a Neutral Port
Nt.
ere they prepared to say that the Terms, as they
tvere before the House, ought to have been refused,
444 the War continued ? Surely the supporters of
lit Treaty at Lisle must approve the present. The
security for the permanence of the Treaty had been
-Sue)tioned, but he .knew of no better security than
the mutual interests of the Parties. He remem.
°ered having heard it related of an Emperor of Mo.
Ic'eco,,who, when advised he was about to break a
reaty by some ad he was about to commit, said,
only adhere to Treaties so long as they agree
kith my interest." He was much inclined to think
the
.4 coarse language of the Moorish Chieftain would
Ply very forcibly to. the more polished Courts of
utope. The mutual interests of the Parties would,
he Conceived, forcibly operate in the present instance
.give security to the Provisions of the Treaty.—
"Pon the whole he thought it the best Peace that
finder all the circumstances could be obtained.
Lord GRENFILLE LEVESON said, the Hon.
Gentleman had observed, that all those who sup_
Ported the Treaty at Lisle must, approve the pre-
-11"t• In answer to this he would say, .that the pe-
riod at which Lord MALMESBURY was sent to
was a period of unexampled calamity to this
Country. y The Bank had just stopped payment ;
the British Navy at home was in a state of Mu-
tiny, whilst there was reason to fear every British
Settlement. was -stained by alts of Mutiny. The
Funds were so low, that it was thought almost
impossible to raise the Supplies. Ireland, though
11,ot in a state of adual Rebellion, was approximat-
ing nearer and nearer to that state every day—,
Mien we had no Fleet adequate to cope with the
enemy in the North Seas, and the French were
tr'inpletely masters of the Mediterranean, whilst
tt the period of the present Treaty public credit
as reinstated, Ireland was secured to us by
the
I Union ; commerce was increasing, and the
rirish Navy were not only in an excellent state
tc
discipline, but every where vidorious and
shttimphant. Had he not then a right to consider
Tim as two completely distina periods ? By the
pert at Lisle we were to. retain the Cape, with
ot•
Places ; and now, at a period of infinitely greater
esCo Perity, we had given up Minorca, Malta, the
Nteial superiority of Egypt and other places
of
'nfeiior note. So far from. guaranteeing the in-
Jrity of Portugal before the War, we had only
Vr"ranteed its integrity after a part of it had been
eiblY taken by-conquest. He had no hesitation
TrsaYing
e the terms were worse than those of
.the
Ivii'ttY of Lisle,-and that from all the circumstances
lie 'Ch appeared, they might have been- made better.
prr::_as not prepared however to. vote against the
; be be,lieved better terms might have been
. . _
; but...the. 'treaty gave Peace, and that had
4used
co, a general sensation .of joy throughout - the
'MITI, _
le".tiad,--seen amongst his Constituents,
'vas perfottly 'convinced the Country rejoiced at

it. He could not however. consent to: add to it the
epithets of gloricius and honourable.
Lord HAWKESBURY said, he rose at this early
hour to state to the House his reasons why, under
all the circumstances of Europe, and of the world,
His Majesty's Ministers had been induced to ad-
vise His Majesty to assent to the Preliminaries of
Peace now before the House. His Lordship said,
he could not help differing considerably from his
Noble Friend, who had just preceded him in this
Debate, and who had compared the present Preli-
minaries with the terms of the Negotiation at Lisle,
who had stated the circumstances to be very dif-
ferent at the two periods, as they certainly were,
and of which he should shortly take notice.—
What did his Noble Friend 'Compare upon this oc-
casion ? Why, be compared the Ultimatum of the
present Ministers with the Projet of Lord GREN-
VILLE ; now he would ask his Noble Friend, if he
meant to say that the first Projet of any Minister
in time of War, endeavouring to negotiate for a
Peace, was either the same in reality, or was ever
expcled to be the same as the Terms on'which he
was really willing to conclude a Peace ? Did that
at any time happen to be the case in any Nego-
tiation for a Peace ? Did his Noble Friend mean
to say, that Lord GRENV ILL E would not himself,
when he sent this Projet to Lisle, have been glad
to assent to Terms of a very different kind, pro-
vided he were assured he could have 'obtained
Peace ? Most unquestionably he would, and yet his
Noble Friend had set that. Negotiation against the
present Preliminaries, as if there was no real dif-
ference between them. Upon the question of
Terms, he should advert presently, 'but he should,
for the present, proceed to other topics. Upon the
question of Peace, generally, he wished to make
but a very few observations. After nine years
War, and after zoo Millions had been added to our
National Debt ; after the loss, of so much blood and
treasure ; after such unexampled exertion, in so
many arid such various ways, by which the People
of this Country had distinguished themselveS ; and
after we had been left alone, as it were, in the con-
test—to say, that under such circumstances, Peace
was 'not desirable, he apprehended was an assertion
that few persons would be disposed to make, nor
did he conceive how it was possible that any one
could say so. Having said this, he thotight 'it ne-
cessary to guard against a possible misapprehension,
for which purpose he begged to disclaim the plea of
Peace being made under any sentiment, feeling, or
apprehension of any over-ruling Necessity. On the
contrary, he believed most firmly, that the re-
sources of this Country are still most consider-
able, that its power is great, and that its situ-
ation now is such as its People have reason to
be proud of. It was under these circumstances,
and with this impression on their minds, that His'
Majesty's Ministers had advised His Majesty to
agree to the Terms of Peace specified in the Preli-
minaries now before the House. It was on this
ground, and on thiS ground only, that he wished
the Preliminaries of Peace to be examined. To say
that the Peace was not liable to any objeaion what--
ever, was what he should not hazard ; he knew of
nothing that was of that charaCter in this life. It
was not a thing to be eispeaed in the present con-
dition of the World ; but what he alledged was,
and that he did with confidence., that under all the
present circumstances of Europe, and of the greater
part of the World, it was a Peace which it was
wise on the part of this Country to agree to ; and
(if better Terms could not be obtained) His Ma--
jesty's Ministers would in his opinion, be highly
censurable for rejecting. There might be objeaions
started against this Peace perhaps, or there might be
a difference of opinion on account, or on the ground
of the present Government of France, and on the
present state of the Continent of Europe. Others
might disapprove of the Peace on its own ground.
With respect to the first of these objetiions, he
should trouble the House but very shortly indeed.
It was hardly necessary for him to remind the
House that this question was, properly speaking,
discussed last year, and Peace was then stated to be
a mere question of Terms : that proposition' was
denied by nobody, either in the House of Commons
or in any other quarter.—Still, although this was
so then stated, and so admitted, he really believed
that the objeaions which persons now had to the
Peace, were objeaions that rather went to the Go-
vernrnent of Frarke, than the Terms of the Peace.
There were also, perhaps, some who might know
how to make a distinaion between negotiating and
making Peace—who might think it wise to nego-
tiate, and not wise to make Peace. He thought it
necessary to-say a few words on this part of the sub-
jee:t, and in considering it, he was led to take no-
tice of the assertion, that this was a War under-
taken on our part with a view .of destroying the
Republic of France—of establishing the antient
Monarchy of France. He protested against that
ever having been the °Nett of the War, on the
part of this Country. He considered this War as a
wise and just one on out part. When' it commenced
between France and the other Powers, Austria and
Prussia, this Country remained neutral, and pro.'
perly so, in his opinion. He always thought that
this Country was forced by France into this War,
by a determination to propagate certain opinions by
the sword, and which opinions had a dire& tendency
to the subversion of all order in society, and were
particularly hostile to the Constitution under which
we have the' happiness to live—by promoting,
in an extraordinary degree, Sedition and a spirit
of Discontent in this Country,—a practice avow-
ed even by some of the Constituted Authorities
of France, and carried openly into effect by a cor-
respondence with certain Societies in this Country.
Such condua on the part of France forced this
Country into the War : it was a war, therefore,
which we could not have avoided and 'be true to
ourselves. This had always been his opinion,—an
opinion
but little disputed in reality in this Country,
and he believed not at all diSputed now here, and
perhaps as little disputed in France. It had been
said, that in this War there was a convulsion in
human affairs; that men's minds were turned ; that
certain principles would for a time flourish and bear
every thing before them like a torrent, which it was
in the power of no man, or any set of men, to stop.
He did not say that this torrent could
,be
,entirely
stopped, but he did say that this Country stemmed
that torrent, and resisted it until it bad changed its

direaion, and even altered its charaaer. We had
been able to continue our exertions until the storm
had in some degree subsided ; having done this, the
objea of the War must be allowed to be in,a great
degree answered. No man could look at France
at present without being convinced that the opi-
nions, sentiments, and feelings of the people of that
Country were most materially altered from what
they were under their furious system of interference
with all the Constituted Authorities of the rest of
Europe ; we had gained much of our object in this
War. Did he therefore say there remained no evil
to be apprehended ? Certainly he did not—but the
evils of 1801 were not comparable to the evils of
1793. Danger might still exist, but it was a dan-
ger, taken at the worst, of a- very different nature
from that which threatened us at the commence-
ment of the War. The danger was a danger aris-
ing from principles ; the danger now, was only
a danger of power. He did not, however,
mean to estimate our present danger lightly,
for he certainly did feel that the modern evils of
Peace are not the same as ancient ones ; and this was
not an opinion which he had taken up on the sud-
den, but was one which he had thought of and re_
fleeted on a great deal, and he had not seen any rea-
son for changing it ; how that Clanger arose, he
should hint at presently. There were two ways-in
Which to view the question, both of which involved
considerations of wisdom and prudence. First,
whether it would be expedient for us to continue
the War, even if we had the power to commence
a third Coalition of the Powers of Europe ? Now
upon this point, although it was one on which he
believed there was some difference of opinion, he
freely confessed, that after all the Treasure spent on
two Coalitions, and the efforts of them had failed
(from no fault however imputable to this, Country,
but from causes he would not stop by the way to
inquire), he should not under the present state of
affairs in Europe, be for trying the effect of a third.
There might be those who entertained a different
opinion.—He would ask them what was the chance
of forming that Coalition a third time with any hope
of success ? But he apprehended there would be an
end of this point, if it was clear that the different
Powers who had formed the two former Coalitions
did not feel disposed to make a third. Now
he 'could alledge, that there was not one of these
Powers disposed to make that third Coalition.—
That Austria, great as her power still was, and
it certainly was very great, had no such disposi-
tion. That the policy of Prussia was still the same
as' that which had guided its proceedings for a con-
siderable time past ; and that Russia was as little
disposed to form this Coalition, as she had been for
some time to enter into such Coalition. The other
way .of viewing this part of the subject, was-that
of our continuing the contest, without any such
Coalition. He would then ask, what was the
prospea of such a course ? What was there
to be gained for us ? Nothing valuable at least—
then why should . the War be continued ?-
- There were two ways in which this last question
might be considered—by inquiring what harm
France could.do to us, and what harm we could do
to France ? With regard to the first, there was
no person in that House, he believed, less afraid
than himself, of the power of France to hurt us ;
none, who had less apprehension than himself of
an Invasion of this Country, not meaning to say
we should be absolutely careless of such a.threat,
nor to undervalue the preparation to meet it, but
speaking pf the thing itself, as an event reckoned
on by the Enemy. But passing that by as a thing
deserving no serious apprehension, he would
ask, where was the part of the world (if we must
continue to fight) in which we could affect France ?
All her possessions, that were of more value
than the expence would be of taking them,
were in our power. already. Then, he would ask,
Why continue the War ?. This was not all the ob-
jedion to the continuance of the 'War, under the pre-
sent condition of things. We know it had been for
some time the policy of France to attack the diffe-
rent weak Powers of the Continent, and thereby to
force us into, concessions to her, in order to procure
to those Powers a restitution of what they had lost.
.He would ask, Could we save those weak Powers
of the Continent from these incursions ? No, we
could not ; it was obvious we could not. Then,
he would ask, Was it justice in us to continue the
War, when we knew the effea it must have on the
different weak States of Europe ? We had made great
exertions and great efforts, the objects of which had,
in some measure, failed ; from what causes it was un-
necessary now to consider ; suffice it, for the present,
that the fault was not ours. But if we had not been
able to accomplish all we wished—if we could not
save all, we should_ save some part of Europe, and,
in that sense, even with a view to the state of the
Continent, the Peace was a wise and a prudent
measure to be adopted. So much for two proposi-
tions, namely, whether there was a chance of a
third Coalition ? And if there was not) what was to
be expected by our continuing the contest alone ?
He came now to a third proposition, which was
that which embraced the question of the Peace it-
self : its own Terms, he meant, the circumstances
'under which it was agreed to, and the whole of its
Conditions,, and every thing which contributed to
the formation of its charader. There were in this
subjed, as indeed there 'were in every subjed of this
nature, three main or leading considerations. First,
the Time when. 2d; The Tone in which. 3d. 'The
Terms whereon it was concluded ; and however im.
portant the last might be, which he could not under-
value, yet he would say a few words on the pre-
ceding heads before he came to the latter, and he
did this the more readily, from feeling that on our
part it was a War in which we had always preferred
security to aggrandizement—First, then, he would
observe, that the time in which the Peace was made
was most favourable to this Country, in a point of
view which embraced a large policy.—Peace should,
if possible, be made when the Enemy are impressed
with your power, and when yoiryourselves are coisfi-
dent of your strength—when ycu yourselves feel
that you have been eminently successful.—lf ever
there can be a moment in which a great Nation
ought to withhold its demands, and prudence
prescribes that they should not be pushed to
an extreme point, it is the moment of victory,
because nothing can shew magnanimity better
than moderation in the hour of triumph. He

did not say this with a view of sheltering
himself; he admitted that this eliserYatiore of his
was liable to an objection, which was, that if the
dote was so advantageous, why were not the terms
better ? but he owned he saw the tern's in a view
that was far from meriting • any. censure on those
who had advised the conclusion of them, for. rea-
sons which he should assign presently. The second
Proposition he had premised to discuss, was the
tone of the Peace, and this was a point which ap-
peared to him well worth considering. It was, in
his opinion, important that Peace should be made in
a tone of dignity and independence ; that nothing
humiliating should appear, bat that the true Honour
and Character of the Nation should be adequately
supported. He need not remind the House of the
Tone of the Negotiation at• Lisle he thought also
that little need tie said to that Mousse to prOve
that the Treaty of Peace was made on our
part in the tone of an Independent Nation ;
made in every way consistently with the honour and
feeling of the Nation. The third -point he pro-
posed was, that of the Terms ; but. before the
House judged of this, he should solicit permission
to say a few words by way of ineroduaion to it.
There were several disadvantages that Government
laboured under in making this Peace. The first
was one which he believed every body had oliserved
who had paid any attention to the detail of politi_
cal events for some years past : he meant, the tone
of many of the Public Prints, which had bccosne
distinguished for under- valning the Resources of
this Country, and exaggerating those of the Coon-
try with which we were contending ; setting little,
value on our own acquisitions, and estimating ltigh-
ly every one gained by our opponent ; a situation
in which no Government, but that of this Country,
ever stood, and in which this Country itself- never
stood preVious to this War : but so it was., and
there was a disadvantage arising out of it in conclud-
ing terms of Peace. Another disadvantage in dlsGn§s-
ing the terms was, the Negotiation at Lisle that
Negotiatiod(withouf intending to say any thing
against the propriety of it) he would say, did put
His Majesty's present Ministers under extreme dif-
ficulty, in negotiating the terms of the present
Peace. He did not say, that what past there was
not matter of necessity, but he did say, that it was
a point which must aired any subsequent Negotia-
tion. He did not mean to say, that if France had
been drivennto. its ancient frontier, or within its
ancient limits, That the Negotiation at Lisle would
have had much eirea on the subsequent Negotia-
tion, because a different policy would have obtain-
edofor the objeas and views of France. must have
been more moderate ; but he meant to submit
to the House, that in the present condition of
things,`the Negotiation at Lide must. have given
something of a colour to ail subsequeot Negotia-
tions. Having said this by way of introduEtiOn
to the Terms,. he was led to consider the Terms
themselves. The first thing to be considered in
discussing the Terms was, that of good faith on
our part towards our Allies, because our Honour
was concerned in that point : Nov, upon this, he
certainly was prepared to contend, that there was
its this contest, at the conclusion of the Prelithina-
ries, but one Power whom this Country ,was bound,
in strictness of good faith, to stipulate for, and
that was the Ottoman Porte ; that although every
feeling of generosity made it desirable that we
should stipulate for others, yet, in point of real
good faith, we were bound to none of them except
the Ottoman Porte ; for when Powers had not held
themselves bound to us, whatever might.be their
engagements, we could not be held- bound to
them. Naples desired to be released from her
engagement, and to make a separate Peace, to
refuse to receive our Men of War, and to receive
those of our Enemy—a measure which not only.
absolved us from all Good Faith in the continuation
of our care for its integrity, but would haiie.justi-
fied a Declaration of War on our part against that
Power. They admitted a French force, for the put
pose of attacking ours and that of our Allies in our
Expediaion to Egypt ; and yet we did stipulate for
that Power. With roped to Portugal, they stood
in the same predicament before these Preliminaries
were settled : they desired to be allowed to exclude
our vessels and to admit our Enemies ; they conclud-
ed the Treaty of Badajoz, and the Spanish Govern-
ment ratified that Treaty, but the .. French Govern
ment ref-used to do so, and increased their demands,
and afterwards we agreed that no further demands
should be made. Now, with regard to the Otto..
man Port e, that Power stood to the last, and there..
fore we were bound to them to observe Good Faith
in stridoess ; and we did so, for we obtained for
them Pcoce without any sacrifice whatever. We
had obtained for them that which they .could not
have obtained for themselves ; a Declaration for
the Maintenance and Integrity of their Domi-
nions; we had- obtained the renunciation of
France to the possession of the seven Ex-Venetian
Islands also. -It therefore stood thus, that for the
Ottoman Porte, the only Power for which we were
bound in good faith, we had obtained, not only all
that we were hound to obtain, but also all they
ever asked or wished us to obtain. There were
two other Powers to be taken notice of irr this part
of these :Preliminaries, those of the Prince of
Orange and the King. of Sardinia. He knew of
no stria obligation that we were under to stipulate
'for the Prince of Orange : it was perlealy true,
that in 1787 we made a. Treaty for the joint gua-
rantee of the Power of the Stadtholder: it was
true also, that every effort was made that could
with propriety be made by this Country, to prevent
the Prince of Orange being driven. from that
Country, and, that an effort was made by the Go-
vernment of this Country, after that Prince was
driven away, to restore him to that Country, which,
if it bad succeeded, would have been much to our
satislaftion. Prussia, however, did not co-operats
with us in that effort, and that it failed of succes
was no fault of ours, nor would any one say there
.was any obligation on out part to do so much as we
did in that respect. It was true also, that this very
subjea was in discussion, but His Mioysty'sMi-
nisters were given to understand, not, only from
the French Government, but irons the Prince of
Orange hirrnelf, that the discussionof that suhjeti
was to be renewed with France and that l'ti,nce.
With respell to Sardinia, we were not bound to
treat tor him. In 1795 that Monarch, matte Leace

with France, and gave tip his frontier to France,
with which he afterwards formed an Alliance to
assert, therefore, after' this, that we were bound
by any good faith -to stip,ulate on behalf of Sardi-
nia, _was what, he did not - expea to hear from
any. body.—The next, point vva,s- the question
of Acquisition; and the. Noble -i_!ord who spoke
last` seeine.cl to think that a Countty, in set-
rling,the Terms of Peace, could 'not grasp at too
uch, especially when its efforts were generally
iceessful And brilliant,, as unquestionably ours had
been, to .Which opinion, I,oraship.said, 'he could
not
,agrce, for it was an opinion entertained by
.that a Country, when rich and powerful,
would.) if it be wise, look a good deal 'at., its Do-
minions before it -endeavoured .to enlarge them. He
did not mean to say,- that we were io a situation,,
or that my country ever vas in a situation, in
tv;iicli it vas impossible to conceive any alteration
in its Citcumstances..that coold be of use to it, or
better its cOmlition ; he believed that had never yet
been the lot of 'any' con-lominity on earth ; but he
meant to say, than a Country sueli as ,ours, rich
and pmverful,:.would.„ 'if wise, look a good deal
about. it,
.before it extended its Dominions,.
for . the sake of mere extension, and Mould
look- at that 'extension in others, Willt some
doubts of its advantages_ in some cases. He did
not mean that, France' had not increased in pOwer
ley an extension of Territory,' but de did mean to
.sily, that France had nht increased in power in pro-
portion to the acquisition of its :territory.
was riot giving his own opinion merely when .he
Slid this, het the opinion of others bette,e qualified
to form it than he pretended to 1)e-7—the opinion, in-
indeed, of Some of the'nißt eminent men in France
he tire,CUld state many of them; it ';,vas stated alreadY
by DumourieF and Carnot, that it was the true in-
terest of France not to go beyond the Rhinefor a
Boundary, The same principle,llis Lordship said,
he applied to , Colonial PosSessains. He did not
mean to say, that Colonies were no/ in many cases
valuable ; he knew we had many of very great valve
‘eurselvea; but he believed that many set upon Colo_
nies in general a higher value than they were Worth.
It indeed "trade-with them which constituted
their value, and those who did'not feel the truth-of
this as.ertion, would do Welt to relic& upon the loss
Thirteen Colonies Of-America to us, a loss which .
it rind been predicted would be th.": "Abwnfal'of this
Empire, and yet it had been followed by a vast
crease of our Commerce.:L—all this, he observed for
the pc.-pose only of saying, that to take Colonies,
merely as such, to be wealth to'
_a state,without
looking into them, was, .in his- apprehension, a
very fallacious mde of forming a judginenr.-1-lav_
ing said this, he would now make a' few remarks
on a sql),if:ft which had been thought by many of
the most essential consequence in- the whole circle
of the l'relirainaries, he meant-de, Cape of Good
v./as a subjeA on which he . knew he
.had the,rnisfortPrie to differ from 'soine• flhose
for whom he bad the highest respe& ; his Astpitii-
on, hoWver, had trot been formed without con-
sultation With many persons of great experience
and strength-of judvent, and, not without 'gent
consideration on This part ; from all which he was
prepared to say, that he not set on the Cape of
Good Hope so high
.a value, as a Colon to'us,. as
sortie Gentlemen of very goolunderstanding, be ad-
/flitted, did: He did not think it a place to ba
looked upon with jealousy, as to the eared its being
a Tice Port would have upon our East-India Trade,
while we had Bombay ' and TrincOmale.-- As to
Minorca, he conceived it to be no acquisition at all,
as the History of former Wars
,wou'..d shew, for it
was lost evcry War if we had not, and gained every
War if we had, a superior Fleet in the Maiiterra.
num.- With re'speato Malta, he certainly did. admit,
that frOM it's situation:, and various advantages, be-
..

ing
almost impregnabc; it would give 'to this
Country 'considerable Political Power in the Me,
diterranean ; but in a commercial view, and
with ' regard to the. wealth of a' State, hie did not
consider it so important as others might. As to
the Tri4e of the Levant, is was a.Subjeta on which
he must beg leave 'to say a few words. He asked
the House to look alittlev at it, and see what it was.
The Whole Trade of this Country'in British Ma-
nufaaures to the Levant, even in this Watr, had ne
ver exceeded t ti,0601, out of 24. milliotv. With
respea to supplying other Countries with the pro-
duce of-the-Levant, it was observable that' the Trade
of the South of Europe was 'in the hands of 'the
Southern SiateS. ,As to that of the Nulth of Eu.
rope, that had been in the hands of the .Dutch, al-
thoutth ihev had no-Port in the Mediterranean, and
vve had a Pori at Minorca." How -eatne this to
*happen ? Because 'the Dutch were wisir than we
had, been in this particular Trade. The policy
of this Country had been, to prohibit Ships
coming from the Levant with a foul Bill of
Health, Without quarantine : the consequence of '
which was, in all cases, a loss of seirne months
in time, and a very considerable expencit of lOading
and unlOading the cargo, which applied to all un
enumerated articles, as well as to those which tv.ere
specified, being all under one .prohibition.-=-The
Dutch 'having applied their regulation 3, to this
Trade differently, had taken much of the goods
into the Ports of Holland, and they lad been en-
:;bled to under-Sell us in the
,Northern parts-of Eu-
rope in the articles of .the'Levant- Tra(le. This de-
fed in ouepraElice in this Trade, W-an taken notice
two years ago, and then it was thought expedi-
'ent to alter the then sUbsisting regulations, and to
bring mach of the cargoes of these ships direly
Vamp to the Ports of this Cotintry, having lazaret_
tos
.properly erected.--He stated these • points, to
Spew that the Trade of the Levant' was an inconsi_
derable abject, and that no Port to secure it is ne,
'eessary, for that-the Dutch had enjoyed •the ad-
. Vantage of it for a long whileralthough they had no
Port in the 'Mediterranean; and' that the wisest
policy we could folloW in this respea was that
Which was held out to us ,as an example by the
. Mich. Having thus touched-on these points, he
sbauld wish to say a few' words on the Possessions
yvhich We'retained, Ceylon and Trinidada, and he
Would venture to alledge, that there was:no disin-
terested man who had•anY knowledge to qualify him
forming an opinion upon the'matter, who 'would.
- Nit say; -that the possesston of these places =a3 e);-
'ireMely aeiiribie to di, They were the two great
N,aval Stations in the East and West—that of .Coy_
ioti was of great importance to 'the security'Ofour

dominions,' as in the whole of the pastern Coast of .
India in our possession, there was-not another such
Port in which a ship could safely anchor during the
Monsoons ; it was. the Key to the Indian Archipelago,
an island in itself of great and important value, and
•we ought to bear in usind the necessity of our possess- ,
ing such a place, and without which, the insecurity
which must 'attend our Indian Empire—He did say,
that under these birciimstan:est the possession of ,
such a; place as • Ceylon was valuable beyond any
thing ease this Country could have chosen for itself
in India, 'With respea to Trinidada, some idea
would be formed of its value, upon refleaing it was ‘;
the only Island-perhaps in that-part of the wolld
-in which a Fleet can anchor with safety during the
hurricane months and from the power which it
will give us in time of War, every person looking
at it in a large point of view, would, as an Eng.
lishmao, prefer if to any other Possession in that part
of the-Globe. Now, with all these considerations,
and in this view of the Peace, whiCh preserved allthe
ancient Possessions of this Country entire, and not
only so, • but also increased in wealth, and in the
means of acquiring more by the addition :of these
important and :valuable Possessionst he would ask.
--any impartial man to look at this Peace, and to give:
his opinion upon it fairly, without applying to it'
the epithet gloriaus, a word with which- he did not
wish to-have-)any thing to do ; he had heard of the
word being applied to War, but not to Peace. He
would ask, however, any impartial man, whether
such a Peace Was not honourable ? Gentlemen might
sq, it was not wise, nor sti advantageousas we had
a right to.eXped; or Gentlemen might say, if thpy
pleased, that by the continuance of the War, we
Might have procured a better Peace ; hut to say that
we had kept all we had before the commencement of
the War,. and that we had added two very valuable
Possessions, the one in the Eastern, the other
in The Western parr of the globe, and thervto say
that the Peace was not 'honourable, was to make
use of words contrary to their-common meaning;--
he desired and wished no more than that this. Peace
might be compared with any Peace since the, Revo-
lution. There had been .five Treaties, . that of
Resirick,: Utrecht, Aix-la-Chapelle, Paris, and
Versailles. In two of those Treaties the status
quaNwas the foundation, those of.Reswick and Aix-

la-Chapelle ; but with regard to the last, we lost
most'considerably by the loss -of America ; we made
also considerable concessions to Spain by the Treaty
pf Utrecht. Now,.. looking at all these things,
we had a right to say, that comparing the •pre-
sent with former Treaties, the Terms were .much
in our favour.. By, this Treaty,. as .far as • the
consideration of bur ...Navy went, and success
in nifferent parts' of the world, we were .•iw.the
highest degree of,pow•er. ever known to any Na-',
tion; bnt it mustalso be allowed that the French
had obtained great successes on the-Continent. If ac„.
.quisitions :were the objea, '.what had taken place
could certainly not astonish any body, nor did he
see.what objeaion could
,be started against thiS
Country on that account ;-,but ht. was prepared to
that with. regard ta- one,. that:)it, real advan-
tage, and,the other,,ovhich is acqUisition, and tak-
ing even both oftbeiniras.:they regarded this Coun-
try and Er.anee singly; .we had reason-to be abun.:
_dantly satisfied with this Issace,. Utrecht, what
did we acquire ? litcrally,.nothing: As to Minorca
and Gibraltar,.he did not wish to under-value them,
particularly the last, which-Certainly was the most
brilliant feather. of this Country; yet looking at them

,as possessions in. themselves, or as ancient sources of
wealth; neither of them was superior to what we had
now gained. With regard to the Treaty of Paris, the
extent of Tetritory was more considerable, Canada
and Florida being given up ; but .if we considered
their value fairly- in themselves, and their conse-
quences, we r should not think they were greater
than what were given in this ease. As to the fai-
lures which had taken 14ace on the Continent, we
had nothing to do with them ; but he would. ask
fairly, whether any Peace which was concluded be-
tween this Country and any Nation, since the Re..

volution, was as advantageous as the presept alto-
gether to us in a national view k We hadanore.acqui-
sition by it than any, except two, since the Revolu.
t ion ; bat.he had already stated that the acquisition of
Territory, alone was not the ()Ned of Peace. He
had already stated also, that, the comparison between
these Preliminaries of Peace and the Negotiation at
Lisle was' unfair ; because the one was only _the
first Projet, the other the Ultimatum of Govern-
ment:, but he was ready to confess, that:he was un-
able to see the consistency of any person- who could
have signed the Negotiation at Lisle, and who could
not. have signed the Preliminaries now. before the
House. There was no ground for the Negotiation
with France at that time, ,which was not also ap-
plicable to the present Preliminaries. Here the
Noble Lord touched on the parts in - .which the
difference between the two was, considerably
in -favour of the per ient terms, -when compared
with .circumstances as they stood at the Nego-
tiation at . Lisle. We had nothing then to
pulate on the nut of the Turks ; besides, we had
since then added: too millions .to our Debt, so that
the whole considered,: there was no comparison, cx.
'cept greatly to the advantage of the Peace, betweeo '
the Negotiation at Lisle and the present Prelimina.
ries.' 'But in stating the Terms of this Peace, he
was aware of an answer that might, and most pro-
bably. would be made, and that was, the increase of
the-power. of France on the Cominent, which ought
to be considered in the 'general arrangements for a
Peace. Now, with regard to the Power of France,
no man regretted it more sincerely than he did.—
. However, other Powers on the Continen had increas-
ed inpower also, Russia and Prussia had much increas-
ed in power by the Partition of Poland : Austria had
also acquired great additional strength ; and these
were considerations which should Accompany our
thoughts Upon the acquisitions of France upon the
Continent, There was another point, which should
accompany our apprehensions on. the extensionof the
Territories of France, which was, that of the di-
minution of our Wealth, and that by which States
obtained Wealth, Commerce.; and be believed if
this part of the subjed was considered fairly, and if
we remembered 'to what the great wealth and power
. of Great Britain was 'owing, we should make our
minds at ease, after a little reflection upon that sub-
-jed--we should fold, our-power, increased in a propoi-
tion Pally equal. to any of the Powers of the Continent.
He knew thete'Was a difference of
.opinibn as to 4.1 e.

question how fat the Commerce of this Country de.
pended on the War, and whit we ought to restore
at the time of Peace. -He • would take a view of
the state of the ease, as if the Commerce arising
out of the acquisition we had made were Oat of the.
question, and confine' his statement to the Com-
merce we had from those Possession, we had pre.
vions to the War, and compare their pre)duce at two
periods—the Peace before the War, and thatof 'the
War. By a Paper which he held in his hand, at
appeared that the value of Exports of British Plan-
tation for three years preceding this War, was
b i Be, 3091. For three yearsof this War, 3,01,9=1.
Colonial prodoce for the same time for Peace,
3,877,0001. During War, sooteoool.—East In-
dia Iniporp for three years of Peace, 3,183,0001.
.For the same period of War, s,l7,:csol.—mports
to.Arcerica, three years of Peace, 3,69410001. For
the same period of War, ,232,(scsol,—Briiiash Ma-
nufa6ureS, &c. to our Colonies for6re.e years
of Peace, 747,0001. War in the same period,
1,224,0001..-- British Eurotas, See. i,535„0001.
War, z, t 45,2001. .
[Such we understood the Statement read by his Lordship ;
but we are not sure thif we heard, i•
CorieMyLbeint much
interrupted by noise in the Gallery it this time. j,
The linble Lord .then penceeded to observe, that
the House may see from this Statement hose; the case
stood with reference to .our Possessions .before -the
War : he observed, also, that while: we. increased
our Commerce in this War, that of France had,•ditni-
nished, and was reducese now .almost to' .nothing.
If we were to consider, the increase of the Terri-
tory of France, we must
.set against that .tote in-
crease of our Commerce. and the reduaion of theirs,.
arid whoever took a view of. the relative situation of
the two Countries in that way, would see that. real
Britain had abundapt reason to rejoice. Npr, was:
this all : there was a very important point remain:
ing, and that , was, the comparative state .of the
two Navies.. The Navy of this. Country,
.at the
commencement of this War in February .1793
was 13'5 Sail of the Line, and 133 Frigates.--=lit
Odober 1801, .Great Britain had ioz Sail of -the
Line, and 2v7 Frigates. trance had at the corri.
mencement of this War, that is, the same period, in.
February 1793, 8o Ships of the Line and st 4
gates. At this moment, exclusive of Ships built
since the War, and destroyed lsy us, thts have.
only 39 Sail of the Line, and 34 frigates, 11i4
Lordship said, he saw nothing for us to fear froth
this .coinparative statement. It might be said,
that the. Navy of France could be enlarged.- He
did not say that if France was not prevented by
diversions on the Continent, they would . not pay
attention to that subject ; but then Gentlemen
would .take this into Consideration First, the nuns:
ber of years it must take to rebuild their' shioS-io
the place of those we have destroyed, iin order to
put themselves into the
.situatiOn in which 'chi),
were.at the commencement of the War.—Secondly,
what was likely to be the state of our Navy.at that
periOd ; and if this Peace was called a respite for some
years, he should be contented to take ii for a
feiv years, and then to take the Chance of
War, if it should so happen. 'But there was still
another consideration, jtif,was not only a tedisins
thing for the French toje,build their ships, but
,they had another process which was still. more tedi-
ous, that was the making of senmen—that they
could not do. without a great deal of Trade, and
which.would take a long- time to- accornp-lish,; and
Gentlemen would remember still .further, that our
Commercial as well as our Ro'al Navy, had 'been
much increased during the present War, svhile. the
Commercial Navy of France had: been completely
destroyed.—His Lordship saitt, lie would not
undertake to state what the Navy of Great Bri-
tain would be ;—what;exertions we shall ' Make
in the course of eight or nine years e but this he
was convinced of, that if we shall haire to renew
the contest, we -shall renew it to advantage, and
every one would be the more of that opinion, when
he considered the operation of the Sinking Fund so
wisely adopted to reduce,our debt,--If any diversion
should happen to France on the Continent, and we
should happen to be engaged in War with 'that
Power, we might have-a chance of profiting by it
but of that he knew there was no chance now, and
this was One of the reasons for concluding a Peace
at this period. Ile should say. but a very few word's
more. These were two ways of putting this Peace
to any unprejudiced person !..-First, whether he
really thought that a Peace could have been obtained
on more honourable. terms ? For honourable he had
proved them to be to treat Biitain.—Secondly, to
ask him to place himself in the. situation in which
His Majesty's Servants were called to this great
work, and then to ask him whether he would have
believed them, or any body else who might have
'told him then, that such an event would be
brought about, as this Peace had been ?—There
was another point remaining, the Convention
with Russia, a great and poWerfal Empire, and
a friendship was 'established between
.us and that
Country, and an end was 'put to the Northein Cons
federacy against us.—He did not undertake to say,
that all this was brought about by any extraordinary
wisdom in Ministers—we were indebted'east un-
doubtedly to Providence ; great events, 'had . hap_
pened, and such as, he knew, no human .wisdom
could accomplish; all that he claimed on behalf of
himself and his Colleagues was, that they had availed
thetnselies of circumstances as they arose, and had
not let a moment pass by in vain. Accordingly,
they could say to the Sailors and the Soldiers of this
Country, "You have not been called upon to shed
your blood in vain ; for no Vietory which' has hapr
Fried, in our favour, that was not accompanied
by a tone of moderation"—[a great cr.), of " Hear I
Hear !" in' which the voice of Mr. Fox "was
emphatically distinguished.]--His Lordship Con-
cluded with observing, that this Country.
.had
come out of this tremendous contest ; the most tre-
mendous •the world ever knew—rwe had come out
of it with great power, great resources, and high
reputation, in a way that was honourable and glo-
rious to ourselves, and serviceable to the world.
Mr. T. GRENVILLE said, lie considered it • as
unfair to class all those who opposed the present
Treaty, amongst those who wished to continue the
War until
"the Ancient. Monarchy was re-establiish-
ed ; at the same time, he could not agree to 'the
broad and general principle, as it had been stated in
the course of the Debate, that one State had no right
to interfere in' the political concerns -of another: He
had no doubt; the Treaty had caused much joy in the

Xiegdom, bet ho told not consent tb lei a Peo.Ptt•
'when he thought they were threatened with danger_
or destrudioo. declared he.had no hostility to•
wards His Majesty's MiniSterset he believed there
were persons amongst them who were entitled 1.8
the respect of the Country, but he would not be de-
barred on that actouitt from stating his opinion of
any measure which be thought likely to be produe.
tive of evil consequences. He thought it high tin",
to oppose them when they slipped dawn from that
.conrse of dignified and proper conduft which the/
ought -to pursue. l-le would tell the Noble Lora
that the Negotiation bad been carried on in a 104
tone, which he thought tended to 'the ruin of tit
Country. It had been said, the .War had been 'a WO
of aggression-on the part of France, and self-defence
_on the:part of Britain. T--lie always considered it :s
a War undertaken to obtain Inclemnity .atld Sect;'
rity,, and he thought the present Ministers h2d &I"
tained the Indemnity and Security, :and then throv''
them .away, thereby infliaing,a serious injury urc'
the country.. He considered the Treaty as ineor-
sistent• with the honour and interest of the Natieci
and should therefore.-give it his decided negative.
Lord CAS'TLEREACH, said, that upon a
jed of such importance, he could not reconcile it to
his feelings to give a silent vote ; "he would there'
fore, with the permission of the House, shortly state
his reasons for concurring in, the Motion before tbe
House. The first question that presented itself
the consideration of the House was, whether, takirit
.every.ciretnstance itTto consideration, it would t'
consistent- with sound policy for England to hae
- . ,
continued the War ? He considered this tit
fo
have been entered into on the part .of Great Britain
purely for tlee:,pgrpose of d.efe.nee, .and though, in '4l
respeets, the.-War .had not ,ansWered to our wishesi
yet Great -Britain had the honour of having ii4e i/
throughout the .whole of this eventful contest, in tP.
-mostdisinterested mariner: she had not only poollic
forth her biocd and treasure in defence of her et:
independence and.Constitution,,..but she had offetc' •
to Europe the means of preservation. Fetes caws
which it was unnecessary to state, the Confederaclti
of Powers upon the Continent was dissolved, geed
therefore it became necessary fOr Great Britain, eith=er
to carry on the .War alone against Frances or to nioll'e
Peace with that State, if it could be done upon term!
consistent With the-safety and independence of th':
Count;y. In deciding upon the question of the safe;`
of this Country by the Peace, it Would be vl;4'.:
to deny that Vrance had attained a degree of pawl
which .could . not but create uneasiness in the atific
ofevery thinking man. It was absurd, to contend
Great Britain, with a Navy all-powerful as it 'C'lst
could affect France upon the Continent, unless 4555 t;
ed by,aConfederacy of Continental States; we vvg!,'
therefore under the necessity, as he had bear,
stated,' of continuing the contest without the h°P
of making any serious impression upon- France, 6f
eonclncling.a Peace upon fair and equitable
-His Lordship then.entered, at considerable lengt'l
into an examination,of ,the Preliminaries, which„':;
,contended ,were: as, favourable as we could loop
.in the, present
.state of Europe ; and that by the'''
Great Britain had-riot only maintained her own .!cii
enrity,, but had",with that generLsity and g004r,f4):,.
which eillvtays,marked her condo stipulatedlW'''
. integrity of her Allies.
[We lam'ent eNtremely, that thp.great length of the DlCrtcif
in both Houses prevents us from'gying
sni veryWeelfent Speech, or into 'those of alie Me,.."1`30
7 whiAblisAvud : we ,hope, however, to resume the ycw
~To-inorrosy.] . r f 014
. Lord T.EigrLE said he completely disapproved of
Terms oftlie-Pei;ce, although lie knew that at preterit
popular in the'Country. The pressure which the pcoole!,,
for seine time past train the .scarcity of provisions,-liadbf
dpubtedly made then), receive this PcaCe with joy in the bt to
instance,. bilt he was attaid they would in time have Teas/it
lament it. It was' with' the sincerest regret that he state re
as his sincere opinion, -that His Majesty's Ministers, in t 4
ing this Peace,
,had signed the ruin of the Country. ICC
had placed it in a state of depression from which it cou """
lu
rise, and had placed France upon a pinnacle from which
could with ease trample upon and demolish us.
Mr. EA; 4S spoke decidedly in favour of the Terrns'oa
Mr. PITT, in a Speech of uncommon eloquence and 'pot
of argument, defended the Peace.--He was followed by
'
lox, wbo also expre*d his approbation cube l'ears..,o4
.4ord.roz.A...yroivg said a few words, Which we
distinctly hear; we believe, in favour of the Motion. on
2W,'. WINDHAM said, he was unable, from indispos`:"o
to otter his sentiments to the HOuse ; .hut nothing •°2,'fc%i
had heard had induced him to alter the opinion he bad 0
expressed of the Peace.
Dr. LAWRENCE disapproved of the Peace, Y 1 W'r •
'considered as dangerous to this Country. :
,The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said, 11,e , ,
not mean to have troubled the House, after the wry fu"V.
cussion which the subject bad undergone, but fromv"ol4
'observations which fell from the Hon. Gentleman who -ipte,
last. FL: then entered into' a very able vindication or.di•
Conduct of His Majesty's Ministers, in signing the Prell"
ries of Peace.
Mr. WINDHAM and Dr. L4WRENCE explained.
Atter a few words from Mr. W ILBERFORCL,
were ordered to withdraw ; but a division did not take
p' alt
The Motion was agreed to, and the House adjourned at
past Three in the Morning till this day.

THE SUN.

soLi.m jLUIS DICS.2.I,Lsvm AuDsA. ?

LONDON, NOVEMBER 4. IS°l_,'

WE last night received Paris Papers to the
3ci
ult. The exchange of the Ratifications of the '.1'";lo
of Peace between the French Republic and Poring
took place at Madrid on the 19th of oCtober. ti
Admiral CORNWALL IS, with the Channel •
arrived at Torbay on Sunday morning.
11°11
The PRINCE 010 RANGE arrived at Yarnu-utoy
Monday night, and intended embarking this
on hoard the Diana Packet, for the Continent.
Two Harnburgh Mails remain due. „-,041
The French General MoftEmr arrived in
yesterday, accompanied by an Interpreter. ,f,
DOVER, Nov. 3.—Marquis CoaxwAY-I.ls,bfr
rived at the York-House Inn about ten last 11'6'0,
accompanied by Lord BROOM, Colonel 'llia
HALES, Colonel NIGHTINGALE, Mr. SINGLEIht
and Mr. MOOR ; and this morning,
o'clock, his Lordship and Suite sailed in the '3 ,cry
Passage-vessel, for Calais. The weather was s
fine, and what little wind there was: fa '„o ju a h one
It is supposed his Lordship reached Calais about
o'clock this afternoon. soon after,eibift

London:. Printed by D. •NVIVILLLAN (of BfamiGo
Covent-Garden); and Publisticd by Wtt.LIA:4I ~iO,
Sck IPPE (of florse-ferry-road, Westminster)) t
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