The Sun.
London, England, 1865-03-16 00:00:00

NEWCASTLE-ON-TYNE, WEDNESDAY.

The conference between the delegates from the
Ironworkers' Association and the Masters' Com-
mittee was held yesterday afternoon, in the offices
of Messrs. Losh, Wilson, and Bell, Grey-street, in
this town. Mr. C. M. Palmer presided. The fol-
lowing employers were present at the meeting :
Mr. C. M. Palmer, Jarrow Ironworks ; Mr. W. H.
F. Bolckow, Middlesborough-on-Tees ; Mr. Thos.
Vaughan,Witton-park ; Mr. Firmstone (one of the
partners in the new limited liability company who
have recently purchased Messrs. Bolckow and
Vaughan's works) ; Mr. J. Hutchinson, Skerne
Ironworks, Darlington ; Mr. W. R. Innes Hopkins,
Tees-side Ironworks ; Mr. Thomas Bell and Mr.
Henry Bell (Losh, Wilson, and Bell), Walker ; Mr.
David Dale, Darlington ; and Mr. George Dyson,
Weardale Ironworks, Spennymoor.
The workmen were represented by Mr. John Kane,
President of the Gateshead Council of the National
Amalgamated Association of Ironworkers ; Mr. G.
G. Thomas, from Bolckow and Vaughan's works,
Middlesborough ; Mr. William Rollins, Tees-side
Ironworks, Middlesborough; Mr. Henry Gilmore,
Albert-hill Works, Darlington ; Mr. John M'Kay,
Skerne Works, Darlington ; Mr. James Croft,
Witton-park Works ; Mr. John M'lver, Consett ;
Mr. Thomas Brown, Black-hill ; Mr. Oliver Duff ell,
Jarrow ; and Mr. John Campbell, Walker.
Mr. PALMER, in opening the business, hoped that
nothing would be said to cause irritation, because
he believed it was the desire of all parties that the
question should be settled. (Hear, hear.) The
masters felt that they had been placed in their pre-
sent position by no fault of their own, and they
would be prepared to receive and hear anything
that the deputation from the men might have to say,
with a view of considering it. They would then
report it to a general meeting of the ironmasters,
which would be called, provided the overtures—
which the Masters' Committee were only deputed
to receive—were such as to give some prospect
of settling the matter. The executive of the work-
men's unions felt now that they had committed
an error, inasmuch as they had since con-
demned what they at one time supported, and
they were now wishful to recall the recommen-
dation which they passed' compelling the men
in North Staffordshire to abandon their work and
not submit to a reduction of wages. All parties,
whoever, believed thata reduction ought to be sub-
mitted to, considering the depressed state of the
iron trade and the reduction in the price of iron. He
was sure that the propositions which the men would
make would be fairly considered.

Mr. SANE wished the masters to understand that
he did not attend that meeting as the mouthpiece of
the delegates, but as one desirous of promoting the
reconciliation, or, if necessary, to defend the reputa-
tion of the Gateshead Executive, which, he thought,
had been unjustly assailed. So far as the northern
executive was concerned, they had nothing at all to
do with bringing the men of North Staffordshire out.
They were brought out without the knowledge of
the executive, who held a conference at Sheffield
during the Christmas holidays. At that conference
a resolution was passed accepting the proposed re-
duction, because those present knew the depressed
state of the iron-market and the scarcity of
orders. The following week a delegate meeting was
held at Brierley-hill, at which the Northern Execu-
tive was not represented. That meeting considered
the Northern Executive had no right to take the
steps they had done. Hence they passed a resolu-
tion, and wrote to inform the body in the north of
the fact that they had determined not to accept the
reduction. That was the first intimation the Gates-
head Executive had of the resolution. The majority
of the men were against the movement. The con-
ferenceßrier hill
ieya_tSheffield had broken up, and then the
people had resolved to resist the reduc-
tion against the wishes of the executive. The Iron-
workers' Association had certain rules by which
they work in concert--Gateshead and Brierley-hill.
He had protested against the resistance, and he
mwreoettientgo
ofß rideerlelegya to call -
hill
afatsekrinthgethoneme which
it another
resolved to strike, but they refused to do so, on the
ground that it would be expensive. What, there-
fore, could the Gateshead Executive do under the
circumstances ? They had works under their control
in North Staffordshire, and they did not mind what
went before the world. The masters were banded
together for the purpose of looking to their own in-
terests, so were the men ; and in that respect it was
a fair battle. So far back as the 10th of January a
telegram was sent from the Gateshead Executive
against the strike, and another afterwards saying he
(Mr. Kane) would go over to Staffordshire to try
and induce the men to go to work. After thatthere
were resolutions passed that he should go over, be-
cause their rules distinctly embodied laws by which
the two executives were bound together in one united
course of action. But a difficulty arose in respect to
North Staffordshire, because it was in two divisions
—part in the Gattshead and part in the Brierley-
jurisdiction. He then wrote to Staffordshire, asking
them to call another delegate meeting at Brierley-
hill ; but he was told in reply that such a course
would be too expensive. Then came a meeting
at Gateshead, and at that meeting all the corre-
spondence on the subject was laid before the dele-
gates present, some of whom were prepared to speak
on the subject that day. Mr. Sambrooke gave a
true statement of the position of the strike, and he
was followed by Mr. Thomas and others, all of
whom advised the men to go to work. A resolution
was adopted to the effect that in the opinion of the
meeting the men be ordered to resume work, inas-
much as their strike was illegal, unjust, and uncon-
stitutional. con-
iititutional. After that resolution it wag agreed that

a deputation should be sent to South Staffordshire,
and Mr. Duffell and himself was appointed for that
purpose. They urged on the Council the propriety
of endeavouring to come to a settlement, but fruit-
lessly, and the deputation left them for home, to
chalk out their own course. When the deputation
got home they sent another telegram to North
Staffordshire ; but the officers said they could not
get the delegates together before the Saturday fol-
lowing, when the men refused to go to work. Such
was, in a condensed form, the real substance of the
whole matter as far as the Gateshead Executive was
concerned.

Mr. PALMER said the northern masters gave notice
along with the rest of the trade throughout England
of a reduction. They said that in all their districts
the reduction had been found just and right, and it
was accepted by the men. But it was afterwards
agreed between the two executives of the men that
those on strike should separate the North Stafford-
shire men between the two executives. The result
was that the men struck, and he had with him a
letter signed by Mr. Kane, and dated the 28th of
January, in which he said :
" That a delegate meeting was held at Brierley-
hill, and a resolution was passed to the effect that
the men of North Staffordshire resist the reduction.
The Council of Brierley-hill called their number of
North Staffordshire men out on strike, and acting
in concert with our friends at Brierley-hill, and
seeing the necessity of such, we immediately in-
structed the men of Hanley and district to come out
also to the number of 450."

The ironmasters resisted the men, and would not
give the advance which the men sought, and which,
in fact, the state of trade would not permit. They
resisted for some seven or eight weeks, and then
they found that large.sums of money were subscribed
from Gateshead and Brierley-hill towards the main-
tenance of the men out. The masters of Stafford-
shire therefore came over to those of the North of
England, and said the latter were acting in concert
with the men, and were supporting indirectly those
on strike by contributing through the workmen to
a fund to enable the men on strike to fight the
masters. The masters of North Staffordshire asked
the northern employers to come forward and sup-
port them in putting an end to the strike. They
said the South Staffordshire masters had agreed to
shut their works a week before if such a step were
thought necessary in the North of England. Before
closing the works in the North of England, a meet-
ing of the masters' association in this district was
called, and they invited deputations of masters from
North and South Staffordshire to attend, so as to
inquire of them the then state of affairs before taking
the extreme measure of closing their works. He
(Mr. Palmer) put questions to the Staffordshire
masters to this effect :—Notwithstanding the reso-
lutions passed by the executive, or whatever the
union was called, condemning in toto the resistance
of the men, had money been sent over ? Because
he conceived that some mode of settling the dispute
might have been devised if the support had been
withdrawn from the men on strike. The masters
said Mr. Kane had gone over to Staffordshire and
had taken money with him for the support of the
men ; and he had been mobbed because he had not
taken enough.
Mr. BANE—I took no money at all after the resolutions
were passed.

Mr.Friutzß—Having put out the notice dated the 28th
of January, and the people in the northern part of the union
continuing to subscribe, there was nothing for the masters
to do but to act up to the notice they had posted at their
works. The masters had been driven into their united
action simply from the men having in many instances united
in a most oppressive manner. Unless masters were left to
control the force they employed, it was impossible to con-
duct trade successfully.
Mr. KANE said there was a difference between the two
combinations. The masters' steam engines ate no food,
but the men's stomachs still required it in a lock-out or a
strike. Hence, if all that had been read was correct, as
soon as the movement assumed its present form its aspect
was changed. The statement that because he did not take
sufficient money to North Staffordshire to tide over the
lock-out his life was jeopardized was not correct. It was
known that he had £260 ready the week previous, and that
this had been stopped by order of the executive ; yet, in
spite of that determination a resolution was passed in oppo-
sition to the executive. If the latter thus had no control
over the men, how could it be expected that they could
force the men to work ? They had withheld their funds
from them, and withheld them still. For the purpose of
preventing the strike or of bringing it to a conclusion, he
had visited Yorkshire and Staffordshire and had gone to
Tunstall in the latter county, and no doubt they had seen
the result. On that occasion he took no money with him
for the men. It was the 21st on which he didn't [pay the
men, and it was a week previously to that time that the
money was put up and,"paid.
Mr. DALE said that what the masters and what the public
must really understand was that the Gateshead Executive
did really call out the men in North Staffordshire, and had
since supported them ; but the Executive now desired to
withdraw that support, and had withdrawn it. That in
itself evidenced that, whatever their connection with
Brierley-hill was at the outset, they had felt themselves
entitled to withdraw their support. That was apparently
all that they had to say to the masters. He accepted the
statement of Mr. Kane, that the original policy of the North
Staffordshire men was against the judgment of the execu-
tive. However they might disapprove it now, they were
active parties to it in calling the men out and subsequently
supporting them.
Mr. DUFFELL said he was at the North Stafford meeting,
and, granting that the Northern Executive participated in
the meeting, they had afterwards wished for a meeting of
delegates to prevent the turn-out. The meeting of the
delegatei condemned the North Staffordshire affair in tote,
and he and Mr. Kane were appointed to go to North Staf-
fordshire to persuade the men to go to work, inasmuch as
it was unjust to disobey the orders of the executive. When
ho came back from the south he attended the executive
meeting, and there it was stated that the disaffected men
should have no more money from the north, and if they did
not go to work the executive did not consider themselves
responsible for the actions of the men on strike. The exe-
cutive of the north could wash their hands of the affair,
and they had decided that they would pay up the men for
the time they had lost up to the passing of the resolution
on the 11th discountenancing the strike, and that resolu-
tion had been strictly adhered to.

Mr. HoExiss—lt Boerne that at this moment the North
Staffordshire men are receiving pay from somewhere.
Mr. KANE—There is not a penny going from the North
of England for their support to my knowledge, nor will
there any go.

Mr. DUFFELL—They have.a fund of £6OO of their own.
They have private funds to last for many a long week yet.
Mr. PALMER said the discussion had shown that the mas-
ters of North Staffordshire had a proper claim upon the
masters of the north for some assistance as long as support
went to the men on strike from the north. But when the
delegates present declared that support was entirely with-
drawn, and that they had separated themselves entirely
from the southern district, he thought that fact might lead
to some proposals or overtures.

The delegates pledged themselves through Mr. Kane
that the North Staffordshire men would not get a single
shilling of support from the Gateshead Executive after the
period the executive ordered them to go in to work, the
masters' committee retired to consider the matter, and
after about three-quarters of an hour's absence they re-
turned, and
Mr. PALMER said the committee felt that they were not
empowered to deal with the matter at present, and it would
be requisite for them to call a meeting of the trade gene-
rally. He might say, however, that the committee felt
that the delegates had made proposals for the solution of
the difficulty tending to an amicable conclusion of the
strike, but they also thought that any settlement of it ought
to comprise the South Staffordshire people. They also
thought that the unjust proceedings of the men in North
Staffordshire had arisen to a great extent from the men in
that locality who called them out ; and the committee
wished to impress upon the delegates to call on the executive
of the Brierley-hill Union to get the same declaration from
South Staffordshire that they (the Gateshead Executive)
were prepared to give.
The masters' committee subsequently announced that a
meeting of the North of England and Staffordshire masters
would be held at York on Friday, to which representatives
fmm the Gateshead and Brierley -hill Executive were invited
to be present, with some distinct proposition from the men
to put an end to the strike in North Staffordshire.
Mr. Dux then said that what had been expressed that
day might afford a solution of the difficulty; but that, as
the action between them had been joint, and as the action
between the masters of the North of England and those of
Staffordshire had been joint also, they, therefore, proposed
to call a meeting, to be attended by South Staffordshire
masters, on as early a day as possible, but giving sufficient
time to the Executive of Gateshead to put themselves into
communication with the Executive of Brierley-hill, in order
that they might put into shape some proposition to enable
both districts to start simultaneously ; but whether the
propositions would be entertained by the meeting it was
not for them as a small committee to say; therefore, it was
necessary to postpone the meeting and take the sense of
the masters on the subject.
Mr. DUFFELL hoped they would not be long in starting,
as there were several of the men going off for other places
and other lands. Some of the men from his difitrict had
gone to America.
After some further conversation the meeting dispersed.

LONDON.
4. meeting of the delegates from the Trades' Seeietio of

London was held last evening at the Sussex Hotel, Bon-
verie-street, Fleet-street, to consider the beSt means to be
adopted to aid their brethren in the iron trades successfully
to resist what is stated in the circular to be " one of the
most stupendous attacks ever yet made by combined capital
on labour." A deputation from the Brierley-hill Executive
Council of the National Association of Ironworkers, and a
deputation from the Millmen's Association were present.
There were present in the body of the room upwards of
150, chiefly delegates.
Mr. G. PorrEu having been called to the chair, after ex-
plaining the object of the meeting, observed that capital
and labour were combating with each other in the iron
trade. On the one side capital, with its unlimited wealth

its unbounded influence, and its immense resources, was
standing in array against labour, while on the other side
labour, which had been seeking fair remuneration for its
services, stood by willing to see what the employers meant
by this present lock-out. The men believed the masters
were actuated by a principle which sought not only a re-
duction of wages) but the destruction of all combination on
the part of the working men. For a proof of this assertion
he had only to refor to their own organ, the Mining Journal,
which clearly stated that to be the fact. The thisiernment
of the country had given the working men.thch3ilvr ilege of
and the liberty of combining togetherforthe protedtion of
labour. The ironmasters said it mattered not to theta what the
Government had done; they did not approve these combina-
tions, and would therefore use all the means in their power
to destroy them. The men said they combined not to in-
jure others, but to benefit themselves and maintain their
own social and political position. The masters did not agree
with this, and the Times of that day said that the men had
brought this combination of the masters into existence—
that they were originators of combinations. But he be-
lieved it could be proved that the masters had had their secret
combinations before the men adopted the principle. Mr.
Potter then stated the various steps that had ultimately led
to the present lock-out. On the 31st of December, 1864, the
masters gave notice to the puddlers of intending to reduce
their wages is. per ton and the millmen 10 per cent. A
deputation of workmen waited on the masters and ex-
pressed their willingness to accept half the reduction, or 6d.
per ton to the puddlers and 5 per cent. on the wages of the
millmen. But the employers treated the proposition with
contempt and indignation, and told the men that they must
submit to the terms they had themselves proposed. The
delegate of South Staffordshire said they would submit to
the reduction, but the delegate of North Staffordshire•said
he did not think their men would submit; and it was then
agreed that the North Staffordshire men should cease work,
while the South Staffordshire men submitted to the reduc-
tion. That was a legitimate movement, and the men had
a right to come to that decision. Well, the masters of
North Staffordshire, finding they had lost their men, ap-
pealed to the masters in other parts of the country, saying
that if they did not interfere the demands of the men must
be conceded. The ironmasters then held a meeting, at
which it was determined that if the North Staffordshire
men did not return to work a lock-out should take place.
A fortnight's notice was then served upon the men, and
the South Staffordshire men then made every possible
effort to avert such a step, and requested the North Staf-
fordshire men to resume work, and told them that if they
did not their allowance from the funds would be stopped.
But the men of North Staffordshire said they would not
return. These efforts on the part of the South Stafford-
shire men it was supposed would be satisfactory to the mas-
ters, but instead of that the masters gave the men no credit
for what they had done, and expressed their determination
to carry the lock-out into effect. This act on the part of the
masters was most unwarrantable and unjust—nay, more, he
believed the iron masters were guilty of an illegal con-
spiracy, and that if the Legislature did its duty it would at
once institute an inquiry into their proceedings. There
was nothing on record which could possibly justify the mas-
ters in resorting to these measures. But it was done, and

110 masters had thought fit to place themselves on

this basis. They told the men that they believed secret
support would be given to the men on strike, and they had
therefore made up their minds to bring the question to an
issue, and that issue was the destruction of all trade societies.
The present struggle must continue if the masters persist
in the lock-out. How was it possible for the men of South
Staffordshire to compel the men of North Staffordshire to
resume their work? They had done their utmost to conciliate
the masters. They were prepared to meet the masters and
discuss the question, but the masters would never seek an
interview with the men. If the masters had placed confi-
dence in the men he was persuaded that an arrangement
might have been come to, and the lock-out have been
avoided. The present position of the men, therefore, in the
iron trade rested entirely with the ironmasters themselves.
The working men did not grudge the advantages which
capital enjoyed, but they fairly claimed a share of those ad-
vantages to which their labour so largely contributed. If,
however, it should become a serious contest between capital
and labour, the working classes would have nothing to fear.
They could with ease cross the Atlantic and find a home in
the world, and where ample remuneration could be obtained
for their labotir. But the working men did' not desire to
enter into a combat with capital. They never advocated
strikes. He had never recommended a strike. But whenever
a case of tyranny on 'the part of the masters occurred, then
ho had ever been ready to come to the rescue. Still he had

no abiding faith in strikes. The time had come when their
disputes ought to be settled by conciliation. Let the masters
meet the men. Why should they stand aloof ? Such meet-
ings had taken place in the building trade, and why not in

the iron trade ? He would guarantee that if the masters
would meet the men, in nine cases out of ten there would
be no necesssity for a strike. But the masters refused to
adopt this conciliatory course, hence the necessity of the
working men putting themselves on a proper basis before
the world. Let it, then, go forth that all they asked was
a fair share of the profits derived from capital and labour
combined.

Mr. IIowELL, a member of the Council of Operative
Bricklayersu.asked by what authority the present meeting
had been convened. It had not been called together by the
Trades' Council, and was therefore an illegal and irrespon-
sible meeting.
A great deal of angry discussion ensued, and there was
much noise and confusion, but finally it was agreed that
the meeting, though it might have been informally called
together, should be considered legal for the purpose of
hearing the deputations from the North of England. It was '
afterwards stated that the meeting was actually summoned
by the editor of the Beehive newspaper, which is the chief
organ of the trades' unions.
Mr. ATKIN'S, the president of Brierley-hill National Asso-
ciation of Ironworkers,srrkeme whollyuotunh dee
r.
inadequate
t aliaodtdnehdaattu•ehdas addressed
et
eei
ironworkers
.outpswhureoipvrpmakoteet
themi
receivedn initiated .
said the association to which he belonged was at the present
alin de
' momentaf
ot t timeher underw
labour h e n a,s, thevdaa
r
their wives and famiiies. Their union had grown up gra-
dually, and the association had enrolled upwards of 5,000
members; but he believed that the real object of the masters
was to crush the association. One of them had declared as
much to a working man who had waited upon him as a
member of a deputation. Ho said, " Your trades' unions
will soon go to tho four winds, and then we will put the,
screw on you."
Mr. lloasoN, one of the deputation from Briorley-hill,
said that the men considered the lock-out by the ironmasters
to be one of the most unjust acts that had ever been taken
against any body of workmen. The masters had stated that
they were as firm as a rock in their determination to resort,
to a lock-out unless the mon of North Staffordshire re-
turned to their work ; but how could the men of South
Staffordshire bring this about ? They had endeavoured
to do so, but without avail. It was true they had con-
tributed to support the North Staffordshire men as long
as their funds lasted, but when the lock-out came they
needed those funds themselves, and now they came to
solicit the sympathy of the metropolitan trades
unions. The conspiracy of the masters will only have the'
effect of cementing the men more firmly together.
Mr. DAVIS, the treasurer of the Brierly-hill Association,
said that prior to the trade having a union the paddlers
were paid by a sliding scale, which was found to work
oppressively, and the original object of the union was to
destroy the sliding scale. By it the men were sometimes
reduced to a rate of wages so low as to be altogether in-
adequate to their support. Itut the masters wished to
maintain the sliding scale, and hence the " lock-out," be-

cause the men would not submit to it. It had been pro-
posed that they should puddle bars in South Staffordshire

and send them to North Staffordshire ; but that they,
would never do. They were quite willing to wait the issue
of the " lock-out." Meanwhile, they were glad to see the
faces of their fellow-workmen in London, and to receive
from them a cheer on their way.
The CHAIRmAN then read a letter which he had received,
from a Mr. Kane, the treasurer of the Gateshead Executive
of the Trades Council,
in which ho stated that they had:
of 4,000 of their members locked out, ranging from:
Sheffield to Newcastle-on-Tyne: It also stated that the,
delegates from each large work in the north had had a
lengthened interview with the ironmasters on Tuesday,
and that the meeting had been adjourned till Friday next,
(to-morrow) at the Railway Hotel, York. The writer
added that should the "lock-out" continue it would require
the assistance of every true unionist.
Mr. BIDDDLESTON, one of the deputation from the mill-
men, said that he represented a body of men who were iron-
workers, but nevertheless a distinct body from those who
designated themselves puddlers. The millmen had nothing
to do with the present struggle, still they were sufferers in
consequence of the " lock-out,"beca,use their -work was so
closely connected with that of the puddlers that anything
which affected the interests of the ono in an almost equal
degree affected that of the other. _ .

Mr. LAUGHTON, also a deputy from the Millmen's Asso-
ciation, said that the wages of tlie millmen were guided by,
those of the puddlers, and hence the latter had the ympa-
!hies of the former in their present struggle. There were
in his association upwards of 1,800 members suffering from
the lock-out of the puddlers.
Mr. CONOLLY then moved the following resolution :

'• That this meetingofdeTegatesf;m the London Trade?
Societies having heard the statements made by,the deputa-,
tion from the Executive Council of the National Associa-
tion of Ironworks, and from the Millmen's Association, is
of opinion that the efforts made by the council and delegates
of the ironworkers to avert the threatened lock-out was
amply sufficient to have satisfied the Ironmasters' Associa-
tions, and all that they ought in indigo to have roquirocl

from the men ; and that a general lock-out in the face of
those efforts is unwarrantable, unjust. and deserving of the
strong condemnation of all classes."

He contended that the iron workmen in South Staffordshire
had done everything consistent with common sense. When
the men of North Staffordshire refused to return to their
work the South Staffordshire men took off their supplies ;
what more could the masters expect from them ? It would
be the fault of the masters if this disastrous lock-out should
continue.

Mr. OSBORN seconded the resolution, and entreated the
masters to withdraw the obnoxious notice, and allow the
men of South Staffordshire to go to work. But if they
should refuse to do this, the time would come when it would
be too late to attempt to retrieve their error in seeking to
coerce the free working men of England.
The meeting was then addressed by Mr. GEO. PHIPPS,
from North Staffordshire, who said that the men had not
come out on strike upon their own responsibility, but that
they had the sanction of the Executive Council of the
Trades Union of their district. lse described the men to
be in a state of groat distress in consequence of the two
Executive Councils having withdrawn all assistance. There
were 496 men in his lock-out, to whom £B6O had been paid
for nine weeks, and then the allowances had stopped.

A MEMBER—What was the effect of that ?
Mr. niters—lt made the men more determined.
The resolution was put and carried unanimously.
It was then moved by Mr. GouLE, and seconded by Mr.
LISTER :

" That the magnitude of this aggression of combined
capital upon labour, evidently made not so much from the
local strike in North Staffordshire as from a desire on the
part of the ironmasters to destroy the combinations of the
men, calls for a corresponding amount of resistance on the
part of the trades' societies, and that this meeting, there-
fore, recommends every trade society throughout the king-
dom to at once vote, without waiting for any formal depu-
tation, a sum of money from their funds, also to place a
weekly levy on their members; the amounts thus voted
and raised to be sent as early as possible to the Executive
Councils of the men so unjustly locked out, and to the
North Staffordshire men on strike."

The resolution was unanimously agreed to.
A resolution to the effect that the meeting, having heard
the reports from the North and South Staffordshire dele-
gates, do strongly recommend a reconciliation between the
two districts, was unanimously adopted.
The meeting was then adjourned till Wed nesday next.