The Sun.
London, England, 1862-03-19 00:00:00

THE SUN, LONDON, WEDNESDAY EVENING,

for regiment We line,
which was the cause of the diffe-
rent© alluded to by the hon. member.
EXPORTATION OF ENGLISH SALT TO THE

CONTINENT.
Mr. J. TOLLEMACHE asked the President of the
Board of Trade what steps had been taken by the Govern-
ment to put an end to the virtual prohibition against the
exportation of English salt into France ; and whether there
was a prospect of the trade in that article being placed, at
an early period, on a more favourable footing,in conformity
with the spirit of the French treaty ; whether instructions
had been given to: her Majesty's Minister at Brussels
to exorcise due vigilance in obtaining from the Belgian Go-

vernment the measure of justice of admitting British trade
to a full participation in any advantages granted to the
trade of any other country ; whether it is not the fact that
English vessels are still excluded from the conveyance of
salt to Belgian Ports, whilst France has acquired, under her
late treaty with Belgium, the right to carry salt to Belgian
Ports, in French vessels, and that:they alsoenjoy a discount
of seven per cent, on the duty of 275 francs per ton,
levied on French Marine Salt so imported into Belgium :
and, whether the Government had instructed Mr. Mallet,

of the Board of Trade, who is now at Berlin, to obtain per-
mission for the transit of salt through the len itory of the
ZollVorein, with bonding facilities in the Zollverein Ports
for salt, so as to enable this country to send that article up
the large rivers iliac) Poland rind nussia, which countries
are new, to tt great extent, supplied with Austrian salt.
Mr, M. GIBSON said that already there had been a
hope on the part of Government that the duty on Eng-
lish salt introduced into France would be reduced,
and he believed that the delay which had taken place
arose from it being considered necessary by the French
Government to make an inquiry into the duty on salt in
France as a preliminary. With regard to Belgium, the
Government of that State had not treated England

in the same way that she had done other countries
in reference to this article of import ; but from
remonstrances made by the Government of this
country, it was
.expected that the favoured nation clause
would be extended to England. No instructions had
been given to Mr. Mallet on the subject.
INSPECTORS OF SCHOOLS.

Mr. STANHOPE asked the Vice-President of the Com-
mitteee of Council of Education, if ho had endeavoured to
ascertain from those inspectors of schools who reported
of the schools inspected in 1860 that the follow-
ing subjects were taught excellently, well, or fairly,
.—reading in 89 per cent., writing in 90 per cent.,
arithmetic in 83 per cent.; whether they applied that
test to the merits of the teachers or of the scholars; and
whether if they applied it to the Scholars, they applied it to
the whole of the school or only to the upper classes.
Mr. LOWE said that the number of inspectors who re-
ported to the Privy Council was about 35, and it was not
expected from them that they should extend examination
to the length which was mentioned by the hon. member.
GRAND JURY LAWS (IRELAND).
_ _ _

Mr. BLAKE asked the Chief Secretary of Ireland

whether it was his intention to introduce a bill during the
present session for the reform of the grand jury laws in
Ireland ?
Sir R. PEEL said it was intended to introduce such a
bill, but not until after Easter.
EDUCATION, SCIENCE, AND ART.

Lord HENRY LENNOX moved—" That this house
was of opinion that, for the preparation of any estimates,
and for the expenditure of any monies voted in aid of the
British Museum, the National Gallery, and all other institu-
tions having for their object the promotion of education,science
and art, one Minister of the Crown should be responsible
to this house." He contended that this subject was one that
should receive the careful consideration of the house, who

were the keepers of the public purse. There had been a
great increase in the amount of money voted for the ob-
jects to which his motion referred during the last few years,
and in 1861-62 it was no less than £221,855. For the last
14 years the whole amount voted was £2,266,700,

and a considerable portion of this amount was
applied to purposes over which the house could exercise no
control. He contended that it was essential to the public
interest that such control should be vested in a body re.
sponsible to that house. He alluded to the British Museum
which he described as being in a crumbling condition,
the National Gallery, and other institutions, which
displayed a most unsatisfactory state of things, and showed
the necessity for their supervision by a body who would be
responsible for their acts. He went in detail through the
different commissions that had reported on this subject, to
show particularly that a reform in regard to the
British Museum was necessary. He contended also
that the British Museum was not conducted in
conformity with the expressed wishes of the house on pre-
vious occasions. In support of this statement, he adverted
to different debates which had taken place when the esti-
mates were under discussion. It had been said that they
ought not to interfere with the trustees of the institution,
but it was the first time that Parliament had been squeamish
about vested rights when public interest was concerned. He
analysed the constitution of the board of trustees, ex officio
and otherwise, to show that an alteration of a very sweep-
ing character should be introduced in order to render this
board efficient. With respect to the family trustees, he
said they were a must mysterious and anomalous body, for
they were appointed custodians of the property which the
ancestors or relatives had sold to the country. (Laughter.)
The remedy he proposed for the defects of system, misma-
nagement, and waste of public money in the administration
of these votes, was personal and individual responsibility.
Mr. GREGORY, in seconding the motion, observed that
there never was a time more apposite for considering this
subject. He maintained, adducing evidence in support of
the objection, that the whole system of trustee management
of the British Museum was faulty and inefficient. He sug-
gested a scheme for improving the organisation of the board
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said that
his noble friend who made this motion bad addressed the
house with great ability, and in a manner showing that ho
had applied his mind thoroughly to the subject. There was
much of matter in his speech in which the Government were
disposed to concur, as tending in the right direction towards
unity and efficiency in the national departments. He would
not ask the house to negative the motion, but he would
content himself with moving the-previous question. There
had been a discrepancy between the mover and seconder.
His noble friend, for instance, had assailed the constitution
of the National Gallery, while that institution was defended
by the hon. member for Galway. In 1859 the Government
said that new arrangements were about to be made in the
National Gallery, and in 1860 those new arrangements were
carried out. The discussion had turned greatly upon the
case of the British Museum, the observations made with
respect to which were fundamentally unjust. The charge
made of general mismanagement regarding the Museum
had not been proved. The fact that a commission had sat
upon it was no proof of mismanagement, but simply showed
that improvement was sought after. It was utterly impos-
sible for any man who united common sense with common
justice, to compare the state of the British Museum, as
it was at present, with what it had been thirty years
ago, and consider its expansion in the interim, and then
say, as had been said by his noble friend, that its mode of
management was a complete barrier to any improvement.
The reading-room of the Museum, erected within the last
six or seven years, reflected the highest credit upon the
trustees. It was a mistake to suppose that no one was re-
sponsible for the estimates of that and other national insti-
tutions ; because, although these estimates were submitted
by the right hen. gentleman the member for Cambridge—
the only case in,which estimates were moved by an inde-
pendent member—yet the Government were as much re-
sponsible for them as they were for those of any of the pub-
lic departments, and the house had never shown any dis-
position to reduce the estimates for the national buildings,
but on the contrary, had repeatedly endeavoured to increase
them by raising salaries. Three parts out of four of the
motion had already been realised, because education, science,
and art were already under a responsible minister. Moro
remained to bo done, but it would not be expedient to
achieve that end by a single stride, snore especially as that
single stride might cause inconvenience and tend to fetter
the judgment of the house in the course of its future pro-
ceedings. A plan had been initiated by the executive of the
British Museum, which involved the transfer of one of the
three great departments to the other side of the building,
and this plan would shortly be submitted to the house for
its consideration and adoption. On these grounds he hoped
the noble lord would not press his motion to a division. If
he should do so, it would be his (the Chancellor of the Ex-
chequer's) duty to meet it at once by moving the previous
question.
The question having been put,
Mr. CONINGHAM agreed with the noble lord that
there ought to be a Minister of the Crown responsible for
the administration of the grants to science and art, but he
could not admit the many fallacies which the noble lord had
uttered in the speech which he had just delivered to the
house. Instead of no control, he thought that house had
always had a complete control over the funds granted to
those institutions. He could not agree with the noble lord
that the inefficiency in the administration of these institu-
tions was to be attributed to the existence of boards of
trustees. With respect to the management of the National
Gallery, he believed that the new system was just the old
one under another name. Ministers were merely ex officio
trustees of the British Museum, and as such had only an
individual responsibility of which nothing was known,
When the hon. member referred to the South Kensington
Museum, he would remind him that the plan for the Exhi-
bition building had been the result of the Art School at
Kensington. Ho could not concur on the eulogy passed on
the National Gallery, and could not think that the late pur-
chases of pictures for the gallery were all satisfactory. It
was only by bringing public opinion to hear continually on
the subject that any real improvement could be hoped for.
Mr. BLAKE did not think it fair that a grant given for
the general purposes of art education should be expended
chiefly in the metropolis. In Ireland a school which he had
assisted in establishing went on well so long as it got the
Government grant, but it had been obliged to raise its fees,
so that instead of being an art school for mechanics it had
become one for the better classes. It was a complete mis-
take to make such schools self-supporting. He hoped the
motion of the noble lord would have the effect of drawing
attention to the matter.
!sir J. SHELLEY thanked the noble lord for bringing
the question forward. After the declaration of the Chan-
cellor of the Exchequer that some alteration would soon

take place, the noble lord ought to rest satisfied with having
called attention to the question, and not press the motion
to a division. The wore the evidence es to the South Ken-

sington Museum was considered, the more would the public
agree with the committee, that it had done, was doing, and
would do a great deal towards accomplishing the object for

which it had been established. (Hear, hear.)
Mr. DISRAELI agreed with the hon. baronet that his
noble friend would do wisely not to press his resolution to a
division. The circumstances under which the house was
asked to agree to a resolution should always be considered.
At that particular hour the house night arrive at results

that would lead to an impression that they did not sympa-

thise with the general views expressed by the noble lord.
His noble friend had brought the subject forward in a speech

of great ability, and had really grappled with all the points
of his case. He had no fault to find with the resohition of
his noble friend, because, though it affirmed a general prin-
ciple which the house might ultimately adopt, it pledged
the Government in no way to its details. After the speech
and amendment of the Chancellor of the Exchequer, his
noble friend would act impruiently if he risked a division.
An independent member ought to feel satisfied when a
Minister moves the previous question as an amendment to
his motion, for the previous question was in reality an
admission of the general justice of his case. (Hear,
hear.) Ho might state that in his own opinion the general
management of our institutions was not satisfactory,
though he could not agree in the reasons offered by his noble
friend for coming to that conclusion. His noble friend had
said with respect to the National Portrait Gallery that it
was evith difficulty he made his entrance ; that he found a
number of pictures hung in an obscure and dingy apart-
ment; and that he discoverel that the public had only been
admitted within the last year to inspect them. These were
all circumstances incident to a young institution. The
apartment was a temporary one, and had not been selected
by the trustees, of whom he was one. The trustees would
have been perfectly ready to have placed their pictures in a
magnificent gallery if the public had furnished them with
one. His opinion of the value of the gallery differed from
that of his noble friend, His noble friend had formed a false
estimate of its value, and had expected to be received in a
magnificent saloon, instead of in a dingy apartment, and as
it was not in a dingy apartment that a refined dilettante,
like his noble friend, could form an accurate estimate of pic-
tures. The institution in question was a wise and proper
one, and had been established in consequence of an address
to the Crown by both Houses of Parliament. The portraits
were in his opinion a most valuable and interesting collet •
tion. With respect to the National Gallery, he should say
nothing about the building. In his opinion it would be
advisable to devote the whole of the building to the Na-
tion Gallery. (Hear, hear.) Ho differed from the member
for Brighton with respect to the management of that gal-
lery. He recognised the right of the hon. member to speak
on the subject of art, and he could have wished that the
hon. member had confined his remarks to that subject.
(Hear, hear.) It was impossible for any man to occupy
the position of Sir C. Eastlake without being exposed to a
great deal of envious criticism. He looked upon Sir C.
• Eastlake as a man of most accomplished mind, and fully

qualified in every way for the position which he held.
It was not Sir C. Eastlake who was deficient in the
knowledge of art, but it was the people of this country.
It was in vain to conceal from ourselves that art had
never flourished, had never been appreciated except in
small communities. In this country the people were much
too busy—much too occupied with great affairs of the world
to pay much attention to art. We lived in a country whose
great men were engineers, and that was the reason why we
could not concentrate our thoughts and feelings on those
beautiful productions which had rendered Athens and Flo-
rence immortal. (Hear, hear.) He did not think, there
fore, that any change in the administration of our galleries
would lead to results more satisfactory than those which
had been accomplished. He admitted, nevertheless, that
whatever expenditure was necessary ought to be placed
under a responsible Minister of the Crown. He came to
the more important part of the subject—the management
of the British Museum—and on that point his views were
not in accordance with those of his noble friend. Anomaly
in governing bodies was not the exception in England, but
rather the rule. Accident had produced the original con-
stitution under which the British Museum existed. That
constitution had become modified and respected. He could
not trace to the anomalous character of that constitution
and management the highly unsatisfactory state of the Bri-
tish Museum. It was to be accounted for by the origin of
that great collection. It was the collection of a virtuoso,
and as time had advanced circumstances had proved that a
collection founded on that general character must be imper-
fect and unsatisfactory. Art, science, literature, nature, were
jealous mistresses that refused to live under the same roof,
and when we presented their various achievementsunder one
roof we were attempting to accomplish that which, whilst
it was desirable, was necessarily imperfect. Her Ma-
jesty's Government had adopted as their principle of action
that which he had always contended for—the division of
these great departments. The very moment we divided the
collections of art and learning, which now met under the
same roof, we should do justice to the increasing and irre-
sistible demands of natural science, and enrich those collec-
tions of art and those great libraries which we were now
almost prevented from enriching. It was in the management
of the collection, and not in the alteration of the governing
body, that we should find those improvements which the
country demanded. But if we adopted that course of divi-
sion there was no reason why we should not also adopt the
principle laid down in the resolution of his noble friend.
There was no reason why the whole matter should not be
placed under the direction of a responsible minister of the
Crown. The Chancellor of the Exchequer having recog-
nised so amply the justness of the principle contained in the
resolution, and having announced that in any future ar-
rangements the Government were ?prepared to adopt the
only principle that would lead to a satisfactory solution of
the difficulties that existed, he thought it would be unwise
for his noble friend to ask the house to come to any absolute
decision upon the resolution. (Cheers.)
Lord H. LENNOX then withdrew his resolution.
BRITISH MERCHANTS IN CHINA.

Mr. GREG S ON called at tention to the position of British
merchants in China, and moved a resolut ion, that due protec-
tion be afforded to them and their property in the treaty ports
of that empire. He read statements made by persons upon
whom he could, he said, depend of the character
of the Taepings, who, so far from being a na-
tional party, were represented to be a set of robbers and mur-
derers, land pirates, and marauders. All he asked was pro-
tection of the lives and property of our countrymen resident
in the cities named in treaty against the lawless violence of
these man.
Mr. J. TURNER, in seconding the motion, dwelt upon
the great value of the trade of Shanghai to Manchester.
Colonel SYKES concurred in the motion, denying, how-
ever, that a single proof had been furnished of a British
subject having been killed, or of British property having
been put in jeopardy, 1:5 the Taepings, to justify the panic
at Shanghai. He drew a favourable picture of the Tae -
pings, and protested against our interference.
Mr. LAYARD said the Government had endeavoured to
pursue a policy of strict forbearance and non-intervention
in China ; but in the present condition of the country this
policy was difficult. All the information the Government
had received tended to but one result,—that the party
called Taepings had no policy, and were totally unable to
establish a Government ; that they were a rabble rout of
marauders and plunderers. There had been a notion that
they were about to introduce the Christian religion, and
that the object of the movement was to restore the Chinese
dynasty; but this illusion had disappeared from all except
Colonel Sykes, and the devastation created by these bands
realised the descriptions given by writers of the horrors
perpetrated by the wild hordes that invaded Europe in the
early ages. Cultivation disappeared, cities, were deserted,
populations fearfully reduced, and in some places entirely
exterminated. Meanwhile a now Ministry had been or-
ganized at Pekin, and our Minister wrote that a great change
had taken place in the policy of the Imperial Court. A great
emporium of British trade was now threatened ; were wo
to stand by and see it destroyed ? It was not a question of
neutrality, but of humanity. The ,Taepings were deter-
mined to ruin Shanghai, and it would be criminal on our
part to allow it. Instructions had therefore been given for
its defence, and the Government had determined to protect
the other treaty ports.
Mr. J. WHITE approved the determination of tho Go-
vernment, though their past policy did not meet his appro-
bation. He thought that hereafter we might come to some
arrangement with the Taepings.
Mr. BUCHANAN said very serious apprehensions were
entertained in China from the progress of the Taepings, and
the determination of the Government would be highly satis-
factory.
Mr. MARSH gave particulars of the ill-treatment of the
Chinese in Australia.
Mr. GREGSON withdrew his resolution.
EMBANKMENT OF THE THAMES.

Mr. CONVPER;;;;temO;e for leave to bring in a bill
to provide for the embankment of the Thames. This was,
he said, one of the most urgent wants of the metropolis.
Great inconvenience was caused by the want of a free pas •
sage along the great thoroughfare which united the east and
west of London. Along that important line of communica-
tion there was such a constant flux and reflux of traffic be-
tween the city and west-end that at certain hours it was
almost impassable. Ludgate hill, Fleet •street, and the
Strand did not servo the purpose for which they were in-
tended. The great value of the property in those streets ren-
dered it impracticable to widen them. With the construc-
tion of another thoroughfare from east to west it was pro-
posed to combine the laying down of the low-level sewer, so
as to obviate the necessity of raising the pavement of Fled-
street and the Strand and endangering the houses by loosen-
ing their foundations, the improvement of the navigation
of the Thames, the embellishment of its shores and the
formation of a handsome and healthful promenade for the
citizens. One might have expected that Lcndon would
have taken a pride in the river which formed one of its
noblest features, and to which it owed in a great measure its
prosperity and
contrary, it had been neglected and abused. Paris made
supremacy over other cities. But, en the
the most of the Seine, St. Petersburg did not neglect the
Neva ; Stockholm, Florence, and other foreign cities had
greatly improved their rivers. Even the Liffey, which was
not to be compared for a moment with the Thames, had
adorned with a beautiful line of quays. But the people of
London used their river as a common sower for their drains,