The Sun.
London, England, 1862-12-16 00:00:00

THE TICKET OF LEAVE SYSTEM

t--

DEPUTATION OF TIIE LORD MAYOR AND CITY
MAGISTRATES TO THE HOME SECRETARY.
Yesterday at two o'clock a deputation of magis-
trates of the City of London, headed by the Lord
Mayor, had an interview by appointment with
Sir George Grey at the Home Office, in re-
ference to the existing state of the law ap-
plicable to the class of hardened criminals
and its administration. Besides the Lori
Mayor, the deputation was composed of Mr. Alder-
man Humphery, Mr. Alderman Sidney, M.P., Mr.
Alderman Lawrence, Mr. Alderman and Sheriff
Lawrence, Mr. Alderman Phillips, Mr. Alderman
Abbiss, Mr. Alderman Gibbons, Mr. Tyrrell, the
remembrancer of the Corporation of London, and
Mr. Woodthorpe, the town clerk.
At the interview yesterday Mr. Bruce, recently
appointed Under Secretary of State, was present.
The LORD MAYOR said his brethren of the Court
of Aldermen had thought it high time to ask for
such an interview, having regard to the lamentable
increase of crime. They had latterly been at great
expense in reconstructing the prison of Newgate,
and had built within the last few years a gaol at
Holloway, which, on its completion, was supposed
to be far in excess of the actual need, but both those
prisons were now inconveniently crowded. The
ticket of-leave system resulted from time to time in
bringing many old offenders back upon the metro-
polis—a class of men who, being well known to the
police, and branded, so to speak, but few or no op-
portunities of obtaining honest employment, even
if they desired it, and were therefore driven to re-
sort to their old habits for subsistence. All at-
tempts to reform criminals of the hardened class,
and to punish them at the same time, had ever been
beset with difficulty, and the magistrates of the
City of London were now of opinion, after all the
experience of past years, that the only way of con'
trolling this criminal element, and of ensuring the
public safety, is by a recurrence to the old system
of transportation, though that may be attended with
some difficulty, inasmuch as the parts of the world
open to the reception of the criminal population are
not so many or so obvious as 30 or 40 years ago,
Next to the great object to be obtained—public
safety—the question became very much one as re'
garded the expense which the criminal class en-
tailed on the country, and on that ground also he
thought the balance of opinion was in favour of
well-devised system of transportation. That Wa°
the principal object the deputation had in vier/1
and they had thought it possible the Government
would like to have their hands strengthened by en
expression of opinion en the part of the mar
steates of the City of London on this vital question.
Sir GEORGE GREY said no doubt we at home Were,
now buffering from the evil of which some 01
the colonies complained when we transported our
criminals there. He had determined some time age
to appoint a commission, composed of members ,
both houses of parliament, to inquire into the opera
Lion of recent acts of parliament on penal servitude'
and especially as to the manner in which sentence°
passed under their authority were carried into effect'
He thought an inquiry so conducted would elicit
great deal of valuable information, and result in
suggestions which would tend greatly to improve
the present system. He had therefore given dir'
Lions for a commission which would probably be
issued on Tuesday next.
Mr. Alderman HIIMPHERY remarked upon the
evils arising from a want of uniformity of sentence'
some magistrates awarding six months' imprison'
ment, and others two for the same species of offence'
Sir G. GREY said that arose from having a variety
e
of persons to administer the law. He himself tike
been bantered in the House of Commons as to th°
disparity of some of the decisions by the magistrate°
of the City of London, and he had had occasion!
call the attention of the metropolitan police magi
trates to the same inconvenience. Under the
Criminal Justice Act they seemed to deal with
offenders who ought rather to be committed
trial. As to the tickets of leave, they were colon
in the first instance. When it became necessary tiu
restrict transportation the act of 180 was passed'
and all sentences of transportation under 14 years
were abolished. Then the ticket-of-leave was in.
troduced into England.
Mr. Alderman LAWRENCE said the great
culty with respect to ticket-of-leave men was thl
l. 1;
Perhaps every member of the deputation wea'
habil'
some way connected with trade, yet, prO
.00
none of them would take a ticket-of-leave men
their service if they knew it. Such men, therefel,
inevitably became desperate, and returned to tbelh
old associates and habits.
Sir G. GREY said that feeling would ,gist
towards criminals of that class whether they c!..ve,
Jut of prison in Sept., say, with a ticket-of-
orle' in Jan., when their services expired.
e eoln'
The LORD MAYOR was glad to hear thet de,
mission was about to be issued ; but what the 00
putation wanted to express most emphatically
that in their opinion the only practicable rent the
for the present state of things was a return
system of transportation in some form or other•ot
Sir G. GREY said it was quite useless to attreoula
to transport men under short sentences; it "ocee
not be done ; and the great majority of eenteo6
were short. That was one evil the governeaenlllo.
to contend with, because even before tranBPuotto
tion was abolished it was a common practice inonif
send abroad short-sentence men. They conic' lord
send abroad men physically able to undergo
bee
labour ; those that were otherwise were sent of et
Mr. Alderman PHILLIPS asked whether'
and above the commission about to be issuel,;ll
thing could be done to appease the public mina tee
Sir G. GREY replied that he had instructeie of
metropolitan police to report upon every c:.
joy
alleged violence which had been related in th
lie newspa[ers and had not come under the evb°oo
sane° of the police courts, and the result lintloill
that a great number of these reports were toe
without foundation. One of their own City 01004
five officers had recently exposed the utter feleei.oitt.
of a story of that kind which was bruited edueof
He (Sir G. Grey) did not, however, intend t 0
that there Wesan extraordinary t°uoh
cases at the present time, and the governraefe had
taken means to prevent their recurrence- '7lOOO
had a number of persons apprehended in one._ astir
and had caused inquiry to be made into their ever,
cedents as far as they were known. Few, h°
were recognised as ticket-of-leave men, but P-o
were known to have undergone
penal sentence "
eot
some period er other. at le 0
Mr. Alderman LAWRENCE thought that
oent t
convicts under penal servitude should be
tee
prisons abroad, for under the present er ',rep%
criminal's punishment inspired him with ne
t l3er,
of terror.
Sir G. GREY said many of them were iflguirf
muda, and that that woul tbe a subject of the
With this ended the interview ended,
deputation took their leave.

METROPOLITAN BENEFIT SOCIETIBS' Ataldbull':
—The Committee and Friends of this Institution Os- IR
aFtrtirdadinnerat the George and Blue Boar,
andunder
ivi
rt
.h
J.
Tp r. es i
Slaterd enc y
Friday,
Metropolitanlmoy 1 toasts disposed
F,T, .bTSch. Aeuy.
affordingn:in d edpt
iha
ee
and in a 1
He hoped now their troubles were at an end, for t' genes
tt:
resting-place
ote.aegtienagt
that Benefit
difficulties
it
f orw Societies'as o
Friendlyhefs atestablished
of,bwe Officiatingin:: rirlyskeesseolVdeci vice-
helicl:er, CI:::
ai
t:::::: tee9.l:;:c 11 3 31
be
1 oey! e1:11:0 :of:
bequest made by a departed lady had enable 4,
the
ol''
payoff the mortgage debt—put the building i° ocl ira
Pond-road, Kingsland-gate, into thorough benefitreair' of "'-f
inmates.
t 7,0 0 oTabse an
toast
m,asreEndowmentresponded
dFund o Ibbyr
3,t hi
re. o)7 e °
1ie137 sr_
the inmates, who briefly thanked the supporters of tb°e, 00
'urn and the Committee for the comforts enjoyed there,
the provision made for the inmates. Mr. Saris, great
eg- 0
tary, then proposed "The Friendly Sodeties of
,„ oa
pro, 0 svp
Britain," and touching upon their origin,
present position, concluded by thanking those branePootireilf
11:ters DI
had supported the asylum. The toast being duly
was responded to for the Odd Fellow and Fere
iirotiarl
Messrs. Lellerby, Morrell, Hampton, Knowles, Pro 001
and Coxhead. Other toasts fullowed--" The P°°°,edge''
Subscribers to the Asylum," by Air. Slater, ackno_":01,00
by the Chairman, Air. Gawthorp, and Mr. rastield A to of
Committee of the Asylum and Officers," resporidcoota:
Mr. Lockhart, Treasurer ; " The Visitors," bY )Ird
‘" ores
son, &c., and some excellent vocal music enlivene
genial meeting.