The Sun.
London, England, 1862-02-12 00:00:00

SUGAR, &c.

Mr. MOFFAT r moved for returns relative to the im-
portation of sugar and other articles of foreign and colonial

produce.

APPLICATION OF MONEY VOTED BY PARLIA•
MENT.

Lord R. MONTAGU repeated the notice which he gave
yesterday for the appointment of a committee to whom
should be referred the consideration of all sums of money
voted for public purposes by the house, in order to secure
the proper application of the same.
THE COMMERCIAL TREATY WITH BELGIUM.
Mr. FORSTER gate notice that on going into commit-
tee of supply, he would ask the Under-Secretary of State
for Foreign Affairs whether any new commercial treaty had
been concluded with Belgium ?
PUBLIC EXPENDITURE.

Mr. WILLIAMS gave notice that on Tuesday, the
18th inst., he would ask whether it was the intention of
Government to introduce any bill on the recommendation
of the committee on the subject of public expenditure in
1866.

POOR LAW (IRELAND).
Sir R. PEEL gave notice that on Friday next he would
move for leave to bring in a bill to amend the law relating
to the relief of the poor in Ireland.
THE MURDER OF MR. WINCOTT.

Mr. LEWIS asked the Secretary of State for the Home
Department, whether his attention had been directed to the
recent murder of Mr. Wincott, in South-street, Manches-
ter-square, and to the investigation consequent thereon at
the Marylebone Police Court on Wednesday, the sth Feb-
ruary ; and, if so, whether he intended to make any
inquiry into the reasons which induced the presiding
magistrate to sentence three of the men aiding and abetting
in the murder to the punishment of six weeks' and one
month's imprisonment respectively ?
Sir G. GREY said he knew nothing of the matter re-
lating to the murder of Mr. Wincott, except from what he
saw in the newspapers, but he supposed the magistrate
before whom the parties accused were brought did not con-
sider he was justified in committing more than one of them
on the charge of wilful murder. However,
as he was informed the coroner's jury who investigated the
case had returned their verdict, the persons accused
would have to be tried, and under the circumstances he
thought it would be most improper, for obvious reasons, to
say anything calculated to prejudice this case.
CANDIDATES FOR CIVIL SERVICE (INDIA.)
Mr. STACPOOLE asked the Secretary of State for India
whether it was considered necessary that the successful:can-
didates for Civil Service (India), residing in Ireland and
Scotland, should be required, as heretofore, to remain seve-
ral weeks in London, or to return thither from their re-
spective places of abode, to be inspected by a medical prac-
titioner in London ?
Sir C. WOOD said that it was thought necessary that
the existing practice should be adhered to, and the candi-
dates for appointments in India were paid very liberally
for their expensas.
BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE.

Mr. WHITE moved that, so soon as the estimates are
ready, one night in each week be given to their considera-
tion ; motions on going into committee of supply being on
that day not permitted, except by express permission of the
house. The hon. member entered at some length into de-
tails to show the necessity for an alteration in the present
mode of conducting the business of the house. Since 1835
the estimates for the army had doubled, and the naval and
civil service had trebled. He did not wish to interfere with
the right of ample discussion on matters which private
members might deem expedient to bring forward; but he
contended that the alteration he proposed would not in the
slightest degree curtail the means of such discussion.
Having laid down the position that the house was entitled
to a greater control over public expenditure than it pos-
sessed under the existing system, he urged some additional
arguments in support of his motion.
_ _ _

Mr. EWART seconded the motion, and considered that
the alteration suggested would effect the object proposed.
Whatever contributed to the despatch of business in that
house must be a public advantage.
Sir G. GREY said that although he voted against the
resolution brought forward last session on the subject, and
which embodied the views of the hon. member (Mr. White),
he agreed to the present motion in substance. He thought
that when motions for the discussion of the public estimates
stood on the paper, the Speaker should leave the chair with-
out any subject being brought forward, as at present on the
motion for that purpose. At the same time exceptions
might be made, and therefore any rule such as that pro-
posed by the motion of the hon. member (Mr. White) ought
not to be adhered to invariably. He repeated that he ob-
jected to the form of the motion, which would not practi-
cally secure what the hon. member desired, but with some
modification it should have his support. (Hear, hear.)
Mr. PAULL objected to any alteration in the existing
practice on constitutional grounds, the theory of the con-
stitution being that grievances should be discussed before
public money was voted. He drew attention to the fact
hat the subject was considered before four committees,
but none of them had recommended the alteration proposed
by the hon. member for Brighton (Mr. White).
Mr. WILLIAMS supported the motion. He contended
that, according to the present practice, the interest of the
public was sacrificed, the time which should be devoted to
the consideration of public expenditure being too frequently
consumed in the discussion of subjects of a private
character, and in many instances of interest only to
the priva'e members who brought them forward.
The fact was, that these motions of private business very
frequently occupied the greater part of the evening, and
votes involving millions of expenditure were agreed to
when the house was worn out, and perhaps only 20 mem-
bers present. (Hear.) He suggested also that the esti-
mates should be brought forward at an early period of the
session, and an early hour of the evening, which would
secure their full discussion.

THE ANSWER OF HER MAJESTY TO THE
ADDRESS.

Lord PROBY, the Comptroller to the Royal Household,
brought up the reply of her Most Gracious Majesty to the
Address voted by the house, which was as follows :—" I
thank you sincerely for your loyal and dutiful Address, and
especially for ycur expression of condolence in the loss I
have sustained."
_ THE BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE.
_The debate on this subject was resumed.
Mr.Mr . BAILLIE opposed the motion.
WALPOLE said that the hon. member who pro-
posed the motion apologised for doing so, but when the
motion was supported by the approving cheers of so many
hon. genbtoleir
ilaheed was quite sure that that apology, in-
stead of
ought rather to be offered by those
who opposed the rajoeetdeito'n. Entertaining as he did a strong 1
opinion on the subado,
the wished the house to be a little on
its guard before it
of proceeding which wPuecildany motion affecting their course
Which
in the least degree diminish that
check and control
the unofficial members of the
house ought to have over
the .executive government.
(Hear.) That was the main r
Hot tdhe written, but the un-
that which had always been,etasm Why he would preserve
written and prescriptive law
of that house—
namely, that on all occasions trat'hezetlilrseaaaGovernnent desired
to have money the unofficial
raniet,
to submit
be entitled to
submit any point
put any question to the Gove
revance which
überatlee from the
which required an answer, to suggest
demanded a remedy, and to obtain someusaY
Government with respect to those matters
matters
being mittee granted the money which would enable theethem-
znent to bring the session to a close without anch Govern_being attended to. (Hear.) He quite agreed with t
member who seconded the motion, and also with the rill.
hon. bar, net the Secretary of State for the Home Depagrtt-
ment, that they would ensure greater certainty and regula-
rity in their proceedings by going at once into committee
of supply. That was the only advantage they would gain
by the adoption of such a course ; but what would they
lose ? (Hear.) If they went at once into committee of
supply, the first estimates taken would be those on the
army and navy. The estimates, then, for the great ser-
vices of the country they would be asked to go into com-
mittee upon without any previous discussion whatever.
(clear, hear.) If they went into committee at five o'clock
without any previous discussion upon those estimates, he i