The Sun.
London, England, 1865-02-21 00:00:00

THE SUN, LONDON, TUESDAY EVENING, FEBRUARY 21, 1865.

popular assemblies of a nation which, whether rightly or
wrongly, does entertain, to a very great extent, hostile feel-
ings towards this country. (Hear.) I think her Majesty's
Government, in laying that paper before th 3 ht use, have
given to it a character far more important than if they had
left the subject to the universal knowle lge which exists of
the state of affairs, and had contented themselves with
silently and quietly taking the steps necessary to counteract
the danger which it is too plain her Majesty's Government
now apprehend. (Hear, hear.) I do not complain, nor never
have complained of the course of neutrality which her
Majesty's Government have pursued between the two con-
tending powers of North America. But, looking as Ido
with the utmost horror to the possibility of a war between
this country and the Federal States, or this country and the
United States—if such a reunion be possible—l must say I
think that her Majesty's Government have been slow to take
steps, with the symptoms of increasing dissatisfaction and
discontent which have been brought to their notice and of
increasing menace on the part of the United States—l say I
think they have been slow to make adequate preparations to
meet the danger, which now they confess to be one of a
real and substantial character. (Hear, hear.) There is one
point to which the noble earl adverted, but which I think
deserves more attention than he has given to it—l mean
our state of preparation at Halifax. What has taken place
with regard to that ? They state that up to the present
time thew has been an agreement by which an absolutely
insignificant naval force should be maintained at either
side. But just before the commencement of the season,
when it was impossible to take any decisive measures on our
Part, steps were taken by the Federal authorities in abso-
lute and direct violation of the conditions of the treaty. It
is true that the American Government have declared that
it was not their intention to violate the treaty beyond the
period when they found it absolutely necessary for their
own security. But they have taken upon themselves to
violate the treaty without previous notice to her Majesty's
Government. They have, in violence of the treaty, placed
vessels upon the lakes which menace the security of Canada,
and they have not given, so far as I am aware, any reasons
which might seem to render necessary the infraction of the
solemn conditions of the treaty. They simply contend that
this suspension of the treaty should not last longer than the
period of absolute necessity. But, at the same time, they
take steps which will enable them to carry on that period
of supposed necessity as long as they think fit, and after the
period of six months from notice of the suspension they will
be in a state of perfect liberty to place upon the lakes any
force theymay think proper, and her Majesty's Government,
as far as we know, have taken no measures to place themselves
in a similarstate of preparation. I ask her Majesty's Govern-
ment, do they take credit for having made preparations to
meet these difficulties ? God forbid they should prove to
be real difficulties ? God forbid they should be confirmed,
in point of fact ! But there are those threatening circum-
stances, these eventualities to be provided against. Her
Majesty's Government admit by the fact of coming down
to Parliament at the eleventh hour to ask for the means of
erecting fortifications to supply that which is an absolute
necessity—they admit, I say, that they see the danger, and
they say that that danger can only be successfully en-
countered by a large contribution on the part of the
Canadian Government and that of other provinces. But,
as Colonel Jervoise truly observes, men are not sufficient
without fortifications, and that fortifications for Montreal
and Quebec are objects of peremptory and pressing import-
ance. Connected with this subject there is one point of
great importance—namely, that the Americans should not,
in the event of a rupture, be permitted to have, in the
first instance, the command of the lakes. You now admit
the necessity of fortifications to which you never turned
your attention during the whole period that these unfor-
tuuate events have been going on, although you must have
known that in certain events the amicable relations be-
tween this country and the United States would be inter-
rupted. You have taken no steps up to the presentmoment
to provide the fortifications of which you now speak.
And even now, when we know there is a preponderating
American force on the lakes, I do not believe any measures
have been adopted to place a force on the lakes sufficient
to meet that danger. Although a rupture might take place
at any moment, I am not aware that any steps have been
taken to meet the danger by land, and none whatever have
been adopted to meet the danger which threatens you by
water, and which, as I say, may come upon you at any
moment. (Hear, hear.) As far as I understood the sketch
which the noble earl gave of the intentions of her Majesty's
Government, it is intended to ask Parliament for the sum
of X 200,000. I believe that is the estimate for the defences
of Quebec.
EarlDE GREY and RIPON—OnIy X 50,000 this year.
The Earl of DERBY—OnIy X 50,000 this year ! Then
I want to know from the noble earl when he thinks this
danger threatens us ? (Hear.) Is it imminent, or is it one
which may be apprehended in three or four years ? You
ask for X 50,000, and you say the whole will cost £200,000,
and the Canadian Government are to expend £400,000, or
£500,000 more on the fortifications of Montreal, which you
say are more urgent and more pressing than Quebec. And
then the noble earl astonishes us by telling us that seeing
this threatening aspect of affairs her Majesty's Govern-
meut are about to erect works which will cost £200,000,
but that they are going to ask for only £50,000. Ido not
know whether even X 50,000 will be asked for; perhaps it
may drop down to X 20,000, so that in the course of ten
years these fortifications, upon which they safety of the pro-
vince depends, may possibly be constructed. (Hear,
hear.) Whereas the danger, if danger there be, is
one which may be realised not in the course of years
but of months. (Hear, hear.) My lords, I deprecate as
much as any man can do the utterance of language which
could increase the exasperation or any ill-feeling which
may, or as I am afraid does, does prevail on the part of the
United States towards this country. But it is the part of
common prudence to'be prepared against a danger absolutely
and imminently threatening, and I must say that neither
in anything that her Majesty's Government have done, or,
as far as I understand, in what they propose to do, have
they taken adequate steps to meet that which they consider
to be a great and impending danger. I think it possible
that, in a pecuniary sense, the western provinces of Canada
are rather a drain upon our resources, but the influence of
this would not be felt if a large and powerful confederation
should be formed. If Canada were to manifest a desire to
take violent steps to separate from this country, I do not
think it would be desirable for the mother country—l do
not think it would be for our honour or interests—to en-
deavour to retain her in unwilling and reluctant associa-
tion with us ; but, so long as she is desirous of remaining
in union with us we are bound, by the ties both of duty
and of honour, to the utmost of our power, to second their
efforts ; because I thing that the possession of the naviga-
tion of the St. Lawrence, and the occupation of Newßrun-
swick and the rest of the seaboard of the America colonies
is, to a maritime country like this, of the utmost importance,
and is a question far too great to be considered merely as
one of money and of economy. (Hear.) Therefore I donot
think it unimportant whether this country remains con-
nected with Canada or not, and I say it would be a lasting
disgrace to this country—it would be an ignominy to which
I trust she would not submit—to allow that upon any pre-
text whatever these provinces should be suddenly, while
in a defenceless state, turned over to their own care, and
exposed to the possible invasion of a foreign country,whose
good-will we have endeavoured, however unsuccessfully,
to propitiate, if not by strict neutrality, at any rate by a
neutrality more favourable to the North than to the
South. I say that, under such circumstances, to allow that
colony to be wrested from us without putting fc7rth the full
strength of the empire to repel every attempt at invasion,
would be a gross and lasting disgrace and ignominy which.
I hope this country would never suffer. (Cheers.)
Earl GRANVILLE—I feel that this is not only an im-
portant question, but one which must be approached with
considerable delicacy. As to the complaints that the Go-
vernment have been guilty of indiscretion in laying this
report before Parliament, I do not see how it was possible
for Government to ask Parliament for money unless they
had placed before them the information contained in this
document. My noble friend the Secretary for War stated,
with great truth, that it was necessary to give some state-
ment of this sort to enable the Government of Canada to
make application to the Imperial Government. The noble
earl opposite says that if this great and sudden change of
in inquiryh
jct o
s
policy was to be adopted by her Majesty's Gove
eiat it
sdheouuly dthhaatvtehebreeehnesannbeeouunacenydsuinehthchae
Queen's
e hsSsPe be e'
eh. f If
the
timedefen peceos. 1 amsure
there
of Canada has
been
none of anxious
is
nopeer
who will deny that Canada is bound to take a part, and house
who a
some
considerable part, in providing the defence necessary to
protect herself from the attacks of a hostile force. What has
been the case ? The Government of Canada at one time de-
clined to do this. It is only recently that we have had
a Government with which we could deal on this subject,
and it was not until that Government came forward with
commendable public spirit—(hear, hear)—that we could
bring the subject under the notice of Parliament, and ask to a colony which formerly declined
them to grant money
proofs of
the
good
has been changed, and I rejoice in the
to put forth efforts to protect itself. This state of things
satisfactory to observe that
one of the clauses agreed upon
mother country.
It is very
by the delegates of the
feeling that now exists between the colony and the
• oes was to the effect
British North American Prom
that
the Impe
eria
that all engagements entered into w
can be m g
ore decisive as
ment. (Hear, hear.) Nothing fellow subjects in
Government should be assumed by the eneral G o vrn-
-1
showing the honourable feeling of our
North America. With reference to the limited naval
to be maintained by the two Governments respective y
force
on the lakes between Canada and the States, it was not
until November that we had received notice from the Ameri-
can Government of their desire to put an end to that
arrangement. Tha noble earl says there has been a very
great violation of the treaty. That was a very strong
of the treaty
ex-
pressiongof to use. The American Government may have
a rneevenuurteheuerttteharnupteythoeuglahktetsobehyaovneddtohneein maintaining
ratfonnandie
wisest and mostaluar stipulated naval
force, but they allege that they have committed no violation
re that in treating these questions the
course is to treat them with the
believe this would not diminish greatest calmness. (Hear.) I
aid to Canada in the minish our heartiness in sending
which may God ave possible
our
but terrible alternative--
being
engaged in war with
the United States. If, retaa
a parent, Canada should still wishge position of a child to
to re •
main connected

with us, and should hold herself prepared to take her full
share of the burden, I believe that the mother country will
stand by her, and I believe that a great country like Eng-
land ought to come forward in time of need to assist the
efforts of such a dependency. (Cheers.)
Lord LYT TEL TON thought that, from the complexion
which events had recently assumed on the American con-
tinent, it was evident that no time should be lost in put-
ting Canada into a proper state of defence. The danger
which threatened that country might be imminent, and he
did not think it could be maintained that £200,000 was an
extravagant sum for the mother country to contribute to-
wards placing the fortifications of the province on a proper
footing.
The Earl of MALMESBURY—I think that if the Go-
vernment are really in earnest in this matter, it must be
confessed that the sum proposed to be devoted for the
first year to the defence of Quebec is a most trumpery
one. I understand that it is proposed, in the first instance,
to make a grant of £200,000, but I fear that amount will be
feund quite inadequate, inasmuch as the works intended to
be executed ought to be completed in a short time. I under-
stand that the army is to be reduced, not by any large
number of men, but still to be reduced. It should be re-
membered that the military force specially needed in Canada
is infantry, and the Imperial Government ought to obtain
from the Colonial Government a guarantee to provide such
a force, for artillery, stores, and means of transport might
be readily furnished from the mother country. It is the
duty of the Government to be prepared for any emergency
that may arise if a sudden end shall be put to the war which
has for so many years raged in America. There seems to
have been an opinion widely prevalent that that war was
commenced to ensure the emancipation of the slaves, but I
think that delusion must have disappeared from the mind
of every man within the last three weeks. It is now admitted
that the contest is for independence on one side and for un-
divided dominion on the other. If the delusion did ever
exist, that at the conclusion of this war the Americans would
sit down quietly and disband their armies, it must by this
time have disappeared, for they have shown, indisputably,
an insatiable ambition for dominion, whether that desire
shall seek to develop itself in the acquisition of territory to
the south, to the north, to the east, or to the west.
The Earl of ELLENBOROUGH—I think it would be
well for her Majesty's Government to consider in what
position the Confederates would be now if they had acted
on the principle on which her Majesty's Government are
acting at this conjuncture. The Confederates did not suffer

themselves to be caught unprepared, as was at once shown
by the readiness with which they threw up fortifications
at Charleston, at Mobile, at Wilmington, and elsewhere.
If they had proceeded on the supposition that ample time
would be allowed them the Confederate generals would,
long before this, have been overwhelmed, and their armies
would have ceased to exist. We are in this position—that
if the people of Canada are really desirous to maintain their
connection with this country, as they seem to be, and if
they are willing to put forward their best efforts, we are
bound in honour to give them our assistance. (Hear,
hear.) I deeply lament the position in which we are placed.
I deprecate war with America as fatal to the best interests of
both countries, and incapable of producing the slightest
benefit—(hear, hear)—but we may be compelled by honour
to engage in these hostilities. But the Canadians must do
something more than merely express the desire of being
united with this country ; they must take steps that may
lead to the provision of a sufficient defensive force. Unless
they are prepared to come forward, as the inhabitants of
the Southern States have come forward, by the exertions
of every man among them in the defence of what is most
dear to them, not only their property, but the safety and
honour of their families will be endangered. Unless they
are prepared to go to that extent, though honour may
oblige us to assist them, real, effectual assistance it is im-
possible for us to give. Canada must be defended by Ca-
nadians. If this be not so we shall lose many of the noble
men we send out to their assistance, and the honour of this
country will also suffer in the destruction of the inadequate
force provided for the defence of Canada. These are my
feelings, and I hope they are shared by others. But this
danger, if it come, may come at any moment, for which we
might be preparing at this hour. I fear that nothing we
can do can avert this danger. There is no one in the
country who can see what may be its end, and I must
say it is to me almost incredible that the Government
should be satisfied with voting £50,000 for the purpose
of providing for one year one-fourth of the cost of the
defence of a place which must be the point of disembarka-
tion for our troops if war should ensue. This is no new
subject, at least as regards former Governments, even if it
should be so to the Government now in office. If her
Majesty's Ministers were to look through the records of
their several offices they would find—though I do not
know in what office—that from the year 1828 to the period
of his decease some records of the opinions of the Duke of
Wellington with respect to the defence of Canada. I recol-
lect a communication of the Duke of Wellington on that
subject so far back as 1828. I know that he thought very
deeply and strongly upon the subject, and I hope that when
the Government are preparing measures for the defence of
Canada they will not be satisfied with the report laid on the
table, but will consult the opinions recorded by the Duke
of Wellington. (Hear, hear.)
Earl RUSSELL—I regret very much that my noble
friend thought it requisite to bring on this discussion. The
Government are supposed to have brought forward a dis-
patch showing the weakness of Canada. Tie course her
Majesty's Government have taken is this—that, having to
provide a remedy for the weakness of Canada, they pro-
duced a dispatch showing what it was to which they pro-
posed to apply a remedy. This is a question of a vote of
money, of a considerable vote for the first year, which
may come to be a very large sum in future years. In order
to obtain the assent of the House of Commons to such a
proposal, it was necessary to show both the necessity and
that the remedy proposed to be applied should be efficient.
The noble earl opposite has complained very much of the
vote not being taken previously. The noble earl says two
things are to be considered—the one that Canada cannot
be defended without improved resources and improved for-
tifications, and the other that the people of Canada should
themselves contribute largely to defend their own soil from
invasion. If the Government had come forward three years
ago and had asked Parliament for a large vote, would not
the great body of the House of Commons have said, "What
have the Canadians done ? Have they organised a militia ?"
The answer would have been—" No." "Have they made
preparations, or are they disposed to make preparations to
join in their defence, and to contribute to the expense ?"
The answer would again have been in the negative. Could
we as a Government be expected to obtain a large vote
from the House of Commons under these circumstances?
(Hear, hear.) The noble lord says we ought quietly and
secretly to have made these preparations. What! have pro-
cured £200,000 quietly and silently! I do not know how
the First Lord of the Treasury could have got the money
quietly and silently, keeping it secret and not mentioning it.
I contend therefore that these charges are totally void of
any solid foundation. When my lamented friend Sir G.
Lewis was at the War-office he had the subject constantly
in his thoughts. The state of the position of Canada oc-
curred to him as it occurred to all who held office since this
Government was formed. Towards the end of the past year
a new spirit was displayed among the people of Canada, and
indifference gave place to devoted loyalty, and the strongest
desire was expressed to form a confederation. The utmost
readiness was also shown to furnish the means for fortifying
Canada and to raise 90,000 or 100,000 militiamen. When
this disposition appeared Government thought it their duty
to submit this measure to the House of Commons, and I
hope they will approve the grounds on which it is founded.
The noble earl censured the Government for proposing so
small a grant as £50,000, but the grounds of that proposal
will soon be fully laid before Parliament. I repeat that I
regard it as a matter to be lamented that my noble friend
should have brought the question forward at this time.
The Government, however, are entirely of opinion with
the noble earl opposite, that if the Canadians are ready to
stand by Canada this country is bound in honour to stand
by Canada—if they are ready to grant theii resources to
preserve their connection with Great Britain, we ought to
be ready to spend our resources to defend them, because
this .is a question not only of interest but of honour.
With regard to the statement of the noble earl (Malmes-
bury) that this was a war of conquest and for the abolition.
of slavery, I must say that for my part I have always
thought, and stated it as my opinion at the commencement
of the civil war, that this was a contest for empire. (Hear,
hear.) And just as I believe the contest which we carried
on in 1776, and continued until 1783, was a contest for
empire, and nothing else, so also I believe that in the
same manner as we acted then the United States have
acted now, and if our position were similar to theirs we
should have acted in a similar way as that in which the
American States have acted. Ido not wish to say anything
with regard to the question, which I must say the noble
earl opposite raised in no very impartial spirit, with-regard
to the attacks which, from time to time were made in the
American Congress, and in a more marked manner in the
American Senate, upon the conduct of this country ; but
this I may say, that whatever may be the intemperance of
certain orators in the Congress and Senate, and whatever
may be the unjust and extreme violence manifested by cer-
tain portions of the United States press, I cannot .think the
United States Government has been wanting in moderation
of conduct. But when the American Minister asks me, if
you were at war with any European power, and vessels
were to come out of New York and cruise against your
commerce, and burn your merchant vessels, would you,
the English people, submit to the matter exactly as our
Government have done ? I admit it is somewhat difficult
to answer the question ; for, though in point of law and in
point of reason the United States have nothing to say, yet
in point of feeling and in point of impression it is humiliat-
ing and provoking to them to consider that a friendly
nation and a neutral nation should have allowed to be fitted
out vessels in its ports to cruise against their ports and
vessels and to the injury to their commerce. (Hear, hear.)
It becomes us, as we see everything British to be right
and then consider what would be our conduct under
American to be wrong, that we should
• tances, and make some allowance for a
similiar arc
d in a most dreadful w .
ar Considering
people engage
nowand everything
think we could expect to act as they
have done. With
in our own country, I do not
the feelings which prevail
regard • e and not for the
this has been a war for empir
most fortunate aboli-
tioncircum-
of slavery, I think it is a
to the question of slavery, ough I admit that

stance, if it be nothing more, that the Congress of the
United States, by a majority of two-thirds, have agreed
that for ever slavery or enforced labour shall cease to be
part of the constitution of the United States, and that 'no
slavery shall hereafter be permitted under that constitu-
tion. (Cheers.) Ido not ask you to give the Congress any
praise or credit for that act ; but I confess that I rejoice
for the sake of the cause, for the sake of aquestion in which
this country at least in former years took a deep interest ;
for the sake of a subject which concerns the best interests
of mankind—l say that I rejoice that alaw for the abolition
of slavery has been passed by the Congress of the United
States of America, and that whether they once more be-
come an united people, or be a separate Northern nation,
there will be a great people, a mighty republic, in which
the stain of slavery shall cease to exist. (Cheers.)
The Earl of DERBY—With regard to thequestion of the
abolition of slavery which has been raised in this debate, I
may say that I should sincerely rejoice if the war should
lead to this result ; but I wish to call the attention of her
Majesty's Government to one part of the question of the
noble lord (Lyveden) to which no answer has been made,
and I wish to know whether her Majesty's Government
have taken or propose to take any steps in the face of the
preparations on the part of the American Government to
I assert a naval superiority on the lakes.

The Duke of SOMERSET said perhaps the noble earl
was aware that the notice from the American Government
to increase their armament on the lakes reached this coun-
try at the end of November, and that this increase would
take place at the end of six months from the notice being
given. At that time it was not possible for her Majesty's
Government to increase their vessels owing to the rivers
and canals being frozen over. He (the Duke of Somerset)
had been for the past two or three years in communication
with naval officers of experience on this subject, and when
the proper time came he would be prepared to state what
course her Majesty's Government would take on the sub-
ject. (Hear, hear.)
The Earl of LONGFORD called the attention of their
lordships to a matter of great importance in connection
with the defence of Canada—namely, the opening up the
main route between the Atlantic and Pacific on British ter-
ritory. This would cost more than £‘50,000, but had been
under the consideration of more than one Government.
The emigrants from Great Britain to the United States
amounted to 147,000, and to-British provinces only 30,000.
The utmost encouragement ought to be given to British
emigrants to go to Canada instead of a foreign country.

The Earl of HARROWBY said, it appeared from the re-
port of Col. Jervoise that £1,340,000 would be required for
the defences which he recommended ; and from the state-
ment of her Majesty's Government it would seem that only
£50,000 was to be voted this year. He would be glad to
know if this was the case.

Lord WHARNCLIFFE said £50,000 was a very small
sum to ask for at present, but would be glad to know if this
amount was to be concentrated on the fortifications of
Quebec, or to be dribbled away by being scattered over the
defence of the entire country. It would be necessary to
raise earthworks on the St. Lawrence at a sufficient dis-
tance from Quebec.

Earl DE GREY and RIPON said the amount to be
asked for would be spent on the fortifications of Quebec,
and would not be dribbled away in tie defences of Canada.
But with. respect to the vote to be a:: ed this year, though
noble lords complained that the sum asked for was a small
one, they must be aware that it would be impossible to
spend £200,000 in one year. The working season in
Canada, owing to the nature of the ctmate, was necessarily
short, and at the commencement the Government could not
spend so much on the works as they could with advantage
when they had made some progress. Thore was land, for
instance, to be purchased. The officers of the fortification
departments whom he had consulted thought that the sum
of £50,000 was as much as could be spent in the present
season, but that a greater proportion could be spent in a
subsequent year. The object was to erect works as rapidly
as was consistent with their permanent nature, and her
Majesty's Government could apply to Parliament for as
much as the scientific officers thought necessary.
Lord LYVEDEN said he did not agree with the opinion
expressed by the noble earl the secretary for Foreign
Affairs upon the policy of originating the discussion which
had arisen from this question. It was of importance to
have elicited the views of the noble lords who had taken
part in it, and if the noble earl had been in his(LordLyve-
den's) position it would have been the kind of discussion
which he would have been glad to provoke.
The subject then dropped.
The house adjourned at 10 minutes to 7 o'clock.

HOUSE OF COMMONS—LAST EVENING.
The SPEAKER took the chair at 4 o'clock.
PRIVATE BUSINESS.
The standing orders were declared to have been com-
plied with in the case of several private bills :
The following bills were read a second time :—Aberyst-
with and Welsh Coast Railway ; Afon Valley Railway ;
Bromley Gas ; Bury Saint Edmunds and Thetford Railway;
Cambrian Railways (Coast Extension) ; Carnarvon New
Water; Chesterfield, Newbold, and Dunstone Road ;
Clitheroe and West Riding Junction Railway; County
Antrim and Belfast Borough; Deal and Dover Railway ;
Fareham Gas; Glasgow and South Western Railway (City
of Glasgow Union); Glasgow (City) Union Railway ;
Goole, Keadby, and Haxey Junction Railway ; Great
Eastern (Additional Powers) ; Great Eastern Railway
(Bishop Stortford, erc. Railways ; Great Eastern Railway

eomer;ham to Ramsey); Hastings and St. Leonard's Gas

Heysham Railway aml_Pier ; Horseforth Water; Kidder•

minster, Stourport, and Bewdley Water; King's Lynn
Docks and Railway ; Kircudbrfght Railway ; Lancashire
and Yorkshire, Midland, and Leeds, Bradford, and
Halifax Junction Railways ; Lancashire and Yorkshire
Railway and Lancashire Union Railways Com-
panies; Lancashire and Yorkshire Railway; Luton
Water ; Mistley, Thorpe, and Walton Railway ;
Newcastle-upon2ryne Improvement ; North Eastern Rail-

way (Gilling, Helmsley, and Pickering Branch) ; North
Staffordshire Railway ; Ogmore Valley and Ely Valley
Extension Railway Companies ; Pontypool, Caerleon, and
Newport Railway ; Ross and Monmouth Railway ; Ross
Improvement ; St. Alban's Water ; St. John's Chapel (Port-
sea) ; Shrewsbury Bridges ; South Kensington New Road;
South Northumberland Railway ; South Wales and Great
Western Direct Railway; Southwark and Vauxhall
Water; Southmark Bridge "Transfer; Swansea Vale and
Neath and Breckon Junction Railway ; Tooting, Merton,
and Wimbledon Extension Railway ; Torquay Gas ;
Tyne Improvement ; West Worthing Improvement ; West
Yorkshire Railway ; Wimbledon Common ; Wolverhamp-
ton and Bridgnorth Railway ; and Wolverhampton and
. North Staffordshire Jnnction Railway.
Severel private bills were read a first. time.

Colonel WILSON moved the following new Standing
Order :—" All questions before committees on private bills
shall be decided by a majority of voices, and whenever the
voices are equal the question shall be decided in the
negative." He said that when the discussion
took place on this subject in the house the other
evening, the majority was in favour of the number of
members on committees being reduced to four instead of
three, and it was to give effect to the wishes of that majority
that he made the present motion, not having any private
feeling in the matter whatever. His object was to save
the time of hon. members, and to introduce the same prac-
tice that prevailed in the courts of law and the House of
Lords. The change which he proposed would be merely
an experiment, and, if found to be unsuccessful, the house
could revert to its original practice.
Mr. HODGSON opposed the motion.
Mr. ROBERTSON considered the change proposed ob-
jectionable, because it would diminish the responsibility of
the chairman.
Mr. A. MILLS agreed with the last speaker, and thought
the chairman should have a casting vote.
Mr. BRIGHT said that the motion, if agreed to, would
have the effect of neutralising the influence of the chairman
of the committee, who generally paid more attention to the
subject than his colleagues, and he would feel his respon-
sibility leis than he did before. That would be a great
loss to those who were engaged in promoting bills, which
they did at great trouble, and which, if they involvedjarge
schemes, might be supposed to be of public importance.
(Hear, hear.) He contended that it would be more desir-
able that, in the case of an equality of votes in a commit-
tee, the presumption was in favour of the bill.
Mr. M. GIBSON was opposed to an alteration from the
original number of five, and he agreed with hon. memberS
who thought the chairman should have a casting vote.

After some further discussion,
Col. W. PATTEN replied, and said there were 595
bills before the house this session, and the committee of
selection would have the greatest difficulty in securing the
attendance of hon. members.
The motion was negatived, and so were some others re-
lative to changes in the standing orders.
GRIEVANCES OF INDIAN OFFICERS.
Col. SYKES presented a petition on this subject, pray-
ing for a redress of grievances of which they have so long
complained.
THE DUTY OF FIRE INSURANCE.
Mr. NEWDEGATE presented a petition from the local
board of guardians in favour of a reduction of the duty on
fire insurances.
Several other petitions were presented to the same
effect.
COURTS, OFFICES, AND BUILDINGS.
Mr. POWELL:moved for a return of certain particulars
respecting present courts and offices proposed to be trans-
ferred to the Commissioners of Public Works and Build-
ings, or to become available for other public purposes in
accordance with the provisions of Courts of Justice Build-
ing Bill, 1865, and Courts of Justice Concentration (Site)
Bill, 1865, or either of them ; and of Buildings in the occu-
pation of legal departments to be hereafter accommodated
in the New Courts, in accordance with the provisions
of the said bills, or either of them ; the return to give in
separate columns the situation of each block of building
containing such courts, offices, and buildings ; and the
purpose to which each court, office, and building is now
assigned.—Ordered.
GOVERNOR OF WAKEFIELD GAOL.

Mr. NEATE gave notice of a motion on this subject.
THE LAW OF MARRIAGE.

Sir G. O'LOGHLEN asked if it was the intention of the
Government to introduce this session any measure to re-

gulate the law of marriage in the United Kingdom, or to
institute any inquiry with a view to future legislation ?
Sir G. GREY said that her Majesty's Government had
been applied to on the subject, whicbwould be referred to
a committee. _ • _ .

SPIRIT OF THE PUBLIC JOURNALS.

TIDIES.—Those who believe that Governments
have a natural tendency to extravagance, and run
after every new idea regardless of the cost, should
read the discussion which took place in the House of
Lords last night with respect to the defences of Ca-
nada. The form in which the subject presents itself
to the ordinary apprehension of Englishmen will
hardly prepare them for the criticisms of some of
the Peers on the alleged shortcomings of the Go-
vernment. When the public hear of Canadian de-
fences, they experience nothing but a feeling of
uneasiness and perplexity. They know that there
is a vast tract of territory on the other side of the

Atlantic, conterminous with an aggressive, menac-
ing, and now warlike Republic. They are aware
that it is subject to the Queen of Great Britain, and
that by the traditions of the Empire and by the law
of nations we are bound to defend it against every

aggressor, while it is liable to attack as often as we
fall into a quarrel ourselves. They also know, and
reflect with a feeling of mingled pride and embar-
rassment, that the people of these British American
Provinces are anxious to maintain their connexion

with the mother country ; that they are not unwil-
ling to take up arms in their own defence, and are,
on the other hand, fully confident that we shall on
every occasion of trouble to themselves rush with
fleets and armies to their help. The position of
these loyal fellow-subjects with respect to our own
people puzzles even practical politicians. They
give the United Kingdom their good wishes and
nothing more. They legislate for themselves, and
in so doing show little favour to Imperial interests.
In fact, the English trader stands in no better posi-
tion with regard to them than his rival of France or
America. With the United States, indeed, the
Provinces were, until the other day, connected by
treaty regulations, which brought the two countries
closer to each other commercially than either is to
England. Accordingly, when Canadian defences
are talked about the British public are not in a very
cheerful humour. People do not want to do any-
thing ungenerous ; they do not want to repudiate
obligations, or abandon those who have a claim
on their protection ; but there is, we must say, a
very deep feeling that the connexion between
the mother country and the colony ought not to
mean the expenditure of large sums by Eng-
land for the defence of territories three thousand
miles away from its shores. At the time of the
Trent affair a large force was despatched in the dead
of winter at a heavy cost to the national exchequer ;
but that was in a quarrel of our own, and though
the burden and the danger was not unfelt, the

public was willing to submit to them. But.greater
obligations than these may at any time be laid on
us through some local dispute, such as latelybrought
on Canada the threats of a Federal general. These

things make people reflect seriously on 'the military
liabilities which the country incurs by guaranteeing
the defence of the American provinces, and lead
them to desire the recognition of the principle that
on land at least the Canadians should undertake to
protect their own soil. Thus when Col. Jervois
makes his report, and tells the Government what
large sums are necessary for the fortification of the
chief places in Canada, the first question the public
asks itself is, whether Canada cannot do without
them, and the next whether, supposing this to be
impossible, Canada cannot construct them for her-
self. They are no trifles, indeed. Canada, though
with but a small population, has a long frontier ;
in fact, it may be described as being all frontier,
and as being vulnerable all over. There is hardly
a village or a farm in the country that is more
than a few days' march from some spot which may
be reached at once by a party of Federal soldiers.
Hence the magnitude of the works, which if executed
by the provinces will be a real financial burden to
them, and if taken in hand by us will add conside-
rably to our estimates for years to come. Colonel
Jervois says that he regards the works for the de-
fences of Montreal and Quebec as being of the most
pressing importance. The cost of those at Quebec
is to be £200,000, of those at Montreal at £443,000,
and the armaments at those places will cost about
£lOO,OOO. The works of fortification recom-
mended at Kingston, Toronto, and Hamilton will
cost about £500,000, and the armaments for those
places about £lOO,OOO. Thus on fortifications
for Canada alone it is purposed to expend
£1,343,000, which any one acquainted with the
history of such matters is well aware will extend
to at least a couple of millions. Now, of this sum
her Majesty's Government propose to supply
£2oo,ooo—the amount necessary for fortifying
Quebec. This is "an IMperial fortress ;" it was the
scene of one of the most celebrated of English
victories, and has so wide a reputation as one of the
strong places of the world that the national honour
is committed to maintaining it. We have no desire
to quarrel with the decision of the Government.
Whether the Canadian Government will really
spend half a million on fortifying Montreal, as Lord
De Grey expects, we very much doubt, for there is
great difference'between calling out Volunteers and
Militia at a time of excitement, and taxing the com-
munity to raise masses of earthworks and put guns
in position. If the fortification of Quebec by Eng-
land be looked upon as part of an arrangement be-
tween the mother country and the colony, then, we
suppose, we must submit and pay the. £200,000, or
whatever more the works may cost. But we cannot
affect to say that it will be done with any enthu-
siasm. To spend a large sum in raising works at
such a place, with the knowledge that they willin-
volve the necessity of keeping a garrison there, and
are quite as likely to lead to a great military disaster
as a successful defence ; to perpetuate the principle
that England is bound to hold the colony with her
own troops ; to encourage, as it were, by our ex-
ample, the expenditure by the colonists of great
sums which they can ill afford in a kind of defence
the strategical merits of which are very questionable,
are matters which are not undertaken very cheer-
fully. The country in general will think that the
Government is going quite far enough when it de-
votes £50,000 a year for four years for the construc-
tion of fortifications at Quebec, and we will venture
to say that when the War Department published
Colonel Jervois's report with a view to prepare Par-
liament for this vote it expected to be taxed with
extravagance and panic rather than illiberality or
carelessness. Last evening, however, in the House
of Lords, her Majesty's Ministers were soundly
rated for their negligence in not more efficiently
preparing for the defence of Canada against the
imminent Federal invasion. Lord Lyveden drew a
most melancholy picture. The Queen's troops and
the local troops together could'not defend the Pro-
vince. If it were attacked, they would have nothing
to do but to retreat to their ships, and it would be
fortunate if they reached them. Lord Derby re-
newed his warnings concerning the ill-feeling against
us which prevails in the Federal States, and insisted
that the £200,000 shall all be expended at once, so
as to put Canada in security from a danger which
may fall on it, not after years, but after months.
The Government, his lordship thinks, should also
take care of the fortifications of Toronto, and adopt
precautions to prevent the Americans from obtain-
ing a preponderating force on the Lakes. In short,
because North and South might by bringing their
differences to an end be enabled to attack Canada,
we must immediately set about the defence of a
frontier of 1,500 miles, spend no one knows how
much in earthworks and masonry, arm fort after
fort, and undergo all the burdeiis of preparing for
war with one of the most powerful nations in the
world. With due respect to the opinion of these
patriotic noblemen, we think that the country
should not be led away to any such extravagances.
We doubt very much the policy of these elaborate
and costly preparations for a contingency which
may never arrive—preparations which, in case it did
arrive, would certainly be found insufficient to meet
it. Of conrse it is the duty of an officer who is
sent to report on fortifications to give a scientific
acid professional opinion, dwelling simply on the
military aspects of the question. But the prior
inquiry, whether the fortifications are politically
desirable or economically expedient, is for Govern-
ments and Parliaments to decide, and we think there
are many reasons why our own Government should
neither press the House of Commons for large sums
on this account, nor take advantage of the present
excitement in Canada to urge on the colonists costly
schemes which the calmer judgment of a few years
hence may declare to have been both politically and
stragically mistakes. To construct ourselves and
make the Canadians construct fortifications at
Quebec and Montreal, and even on the exposed
shore of Toronto, only that at the approach of war
we might shut up our little army in these places as
a " nucleus" for the defence of Canada, is a work
which requires more reflection and should inspire
more doubts than it seems to have met with in the
House of Lords.
POST.-It would not be difficult to draw up a syl-
labus of the errors which the Federal Secretary of
State proposes to entertain with respect to the Go-
vernment and the people of this country. Mr.
Seward habitually leaps over facts to conclusions,
the fallacy of which he is not, in his present frame
of mind, able to discern. The despatch in which he
informed Mr. Adams it was manifest to him that
‘‘ the insurgents" were effectively represented both.
in Parliament and in our Press, while " the advo-
cates or defenders of the United States" were ex-
cluded from the conduct of public affairs, was, it is
true, written ten months since, and it is possible
that subsequent events have modified the opinions
it expressed. Be that, however, as it may, the Con-
federates will, we apprehend, think Mr. Seward has
exaggerated their influence. If they had obtained
the support of " a bold, vigorous, and effective party
in both Houses of - Parliament and in the British
Press," it is hardly likely that the Southern States
would be now waiting for a recognition of they in-

dependence. The naivete of the adn'lig-li'm that IS
included in the complaint addressed to'
for the,
is refreshing and suggestive. It is not eaLV
statesmen of despotically-governed countrie.i lin,:
derstand the action and power of public opt) .11`
England. Our Ministers are responsible to
:Mr. Adams
gislature and the nation, and are subject to the law.
iijr. Seward can do many things Lord Palmrston,
to Le-
woiLld not venture to attempt. A constitutional
monarchy cannot be compared with a Republic.
The Fea,-sral Secretary of State should perceiife.
that he has the advantage of us. But he scarcely
does justice w those who are "the advocates or
defenders of the :United States ; and it is to be re-
gretted that Mr. St:.lnley, who happens to be the
of a Minister, did net, while he was in America
son
" observing for himself Seward r
," set Mr. ight'
with his friends. The " persons who, howeveir
great their ability and worth," are dismisr
de-.
without a word of thanks, hale most reason to
precate the publication of this cisespa,teh. But wh.,el
Mr. Seward speaks of the forbearance of the Vlllre
States to England," he entirely mis
_apprehends
tier
policy of the English Government and the chara
of the English people. We have asked fm: fer‘
bearance, and we are not aware that we hgve
re-
ceived -any. This country is not accustomed towe
pend upon the generosity of other countries-
''
„
are responsible for all we have done, and an e
have failed to do. Her Majesty's Government 110.,.
endeavoured by every legal meams to prevent al,}?..
violation of the neutrality they determined to O.
serve ; and, so far from having shown an
ing and unyielding disposition" towards the Fat▪ e':
Government, they have, as Mr. Adanis well kw:ivy'
gone somewhat out of their way to meet the reprev;
sentations which have been made to them. The 110
officers of the Crown are not answerable f,:i!tr
failure of the prosecutions they undertooik-
Seward requires further information on :bat ',▪
rho
he can obtain it direct from his own agent.q. WeII
proceedings have, no doubt, been expensive ga that
as mortifying to the Federal Government ;
is eot our fault. We have fulfilled our obligatle,.,M.-
and the sense of having done our duty will sus'
beee
us. In truth, it is our forbearance that has
imposed upon ; but we can afford to let that Pat
1
Mr. Seward should, however, understand that a ;
proach addressed to the Queen's Government te
accepted and shared by the nation ; and if the st,L
of public feeling be such as he deplores, it is foeits;
to consider whether it is expedient to aggrav,. s,
impatience or to intensify its sympathy.
matter of right we should be found to be unyieere,
We cannot bate a jot of our independence. if
or
is no coercion of opinion in this country ; and '„re.
foreign policy is not loud and menacing, it re,..,0r of
sents principles that are ratified by 7eii to
nations, and which we are thoroughly pren„Thglf
maintain. Mr. Seward, it is plain, was excee,Thter
angry with France when he wfote to his the'
in England. We, however, had no hand Toe
subversion of the Mexican Republic. It is „ea„at ae°
tory to us to know that an international
has been abated, but the honour of the Tiber•
n;
belongs to the Emperor of the French. -1-`.ievea
fore, the Federal Secretary of State feels
on that score he can if he pleases write to tbe
but it is neither civil nor dignified to write 'l,
-col?
Imperial Government through us. We had Ilej-v-it
to do with the Mexican revolution than we ha- Oa
the secession. France, and France alone, destrolo,
the hope of annexation in that quarter. 111firo'lli
jealousy of the United States was, and is, ;' ter
out of the question. The Monroe doctrine
tainly understood in Europe, and there are,,, 1,00.
tunately, Powers on the Continent tha.,;„,40-I°'
adopted it upon a safe and petty scale. But x-":„'pro-
and France have not evinced any desire t°,"ging
priate American " notions ;" and, under 13,111 a
circumstances, it is impossible that they, e
jealous of the Federal States. On the
co
should all be glad to hear that the war vihi'
exhausting North and South alike was brOagf ttiat
an honest and honourable conclusion ; andL ninst,
be an offence to either of the belligerents, we deau
plead guilty to it. We may be wrong, but onevol
majority of people in this country see onlY cinita
to peace. Still, this is simply an opinion, overt
apart from our policy. Mr. Seward, noriog
while he publishes this correspondence char,gefctii
with provocations and injuries, is actually ter, an
by our neutrality on the Canadian frolli_ti- our
proceeding, it may be too confidently, 011 toe
antes he pretends to disregard and despise-