The Sun.
London, England, 1863-04-28 00:00:00

years. And yet this was the steady trade for which the
hon. member for Carlisle (Mr. Putter) was going to ask for
a loan of £6,000,000 or £7,ooo,ooo—in reality a gift—
which he said would be repaid in one, two, or three years—
but of which sixpence would not be returned—to enable
employment to be given, and a supply of cotton to be ob-
tained. The hon. member boasted that there was no
trade which gave such heathy employment. The first
Sir Robert Peel, before a committee of the House of
Commons, gave the result of his 45 years' experience of the
co:ton trade in a different fashion. He said that its effects
on the rising generation were such as he could not contem-
plate without horror, and he being dead yet spoke; for the
first Sir Robert Peel's prophecies were now being fulfilled.
He (Mr. Ferrand) was anxious to say nothing which would
irritate the house. (Ironical cheers.) But he was pre pared
to read documents giving awful disclosures if the house
wished. (Cries of " read, read,") Sir James Kay Shuttle-
werth, when practising as a medical man in Manchester,
published a pamphlet. He (Mr. Ferranti) would not give the
worst of Lis statement. (Cheers.) But if he were tempted, he
would give even that. That pamphlet stated that more than
half the children died before they had completed their fifth
year. (Date, date) The date of the pamphlet was 1830.
(Ironical cheers.) Yes, this was cheered by members opposite
who opposed the Factory Bill. It was his (Mr. Ferrand's)
side of the house which rescued the operatives from :hat
fate. Mr. Rathbone G. egg, a large cotton manufacturer,
also said, in 1831, that the factory operative hadno time to
be wise, and that the trade, without interference, would
burst asunder the bonds of ami y which united men to one
another. This was the sate of Lancashire at the present
time. It had been well for the noble lord at the head of the
Government if, on returning from his visit to Scotland, he
had turned aside and visited Lancashire. He could have
told the members who sat on his side of the house that this
was no laughing matter. He (Mr. Perrand) had received
from 27 of the operatives an account of their feelings, and
would say that it would not be possible to keep one-half the
people of Lancashire on outdoor employment. The workmen
were willing to earn a day's payby a day's work, but would
not be treated as paupers. Then there was a large num-
ber of superior workmen who could not be expected to work
at such class of employment as cleaning out rivers and
canals; they wished to emigrate, and ought to have the
opportunity to go where they cculd get steady employment.
The hon, member for Carlisle (Mr. Potter) also made ano-
ther prorosition, that had there been no American out-
break there would have been only a temporary glut in the
markets ; and he ventured to predict that, after a year or
two, new supplies of cotton would be found, and cur ex-
ports would be forced into Indian districts as yet mare-
veiled, for the benefit of the English manufacturer and
labourer, provided that India was tolerably well governed
and kept quiet. He (Mr. Ferrand) was sure that the cotton
trade of Lancashire was responsible for the opening of the
trade of India and the sufferings which took place. The
hon. member for Birmingham (Mr. Bright) stated in 1850
that within the Indian territory a quantity of cotton was
grown equal to that in Lancashire, but seemed to forget
that this was consumed by the hand-loom weavers of India.
India hed no representative in that house in 1853, or it
would not have been thrown open to Lancashire; and it
was thrown open with frightful effects. Since 1858, when
it passed under the government of the Queen, the debt had
increased from 68 millions to 200 millions at the present
time. Sir Robert Peel felt in 1800 the miseries of the In-
dians, and moved for a committee to protect the natives
from wrong and secure them the fruits of their industry,
but Earl Grey's Government, in 1832, only thought, in
the person of Lord Auckland, the President of the Board of
Trade, to open India and secure a passage formerchandise.
Lord Auckland, in 1837, collected the army of the Indus
to open up untravelled parts, and the opening up of
them had been the history of the following years. To
carry out the Royal prcelaniation the late Mr. Wilson
was sent to India, with instructions to place 10 per cent.
import duty on Lancashire cotton goods, which had not
only an extraordinary effect in reviving the cotton trade
in India, but in pacifying the people of that country,
and mills were erected there for carrying on the cotton
trade. The Lancashire cotton manufacturers took the alarm,
and the consequence was that the import duty was reduced
to 5 per cent., the Secretary of State for India acceding the
same year to an outlay of 24 millions extra in India on rail-
ways, He condemned the injustice of the Manchester man-
ufacturers towards the people of India in depriving them of
the 10 per cent. import duty for the protection of their trade,
observing that if they could compete with America, with a
duty of 30 or 40 per cent., they might have allowed the poor
Indian hand-loom weavers the paltry protection of 10 per
cent. The hon, member for Carlisle, however, urged the
forcing of goods into India, and the destruction of the in-
habitants by thousands by the same kind of distress. He
considered her Majesty's word was pledged to India to pro-
tect the hand-loom weavers, and he warned the house against
a second rebellion in that country, which might lead to the
loss of that dependency. In regard to China, the effect of
our policy in that part of the world had been to engage us
in war 15 years out of 30 we had been there. For half the
30 years we had been burning, robbing, plundering, and
sacking different towns and cities in China, and the people
we had destroyed in countless thousands, and simply because
they would not suffer their hand-loom weaves to be des-
troyed in the same manner as ours had been. Hie firm
conviction was that we should bo driven out of China, and
possess no firmer hold of it than we had previous to our
going there. What, ho asked, were the manufacturers to
do under the resent state of affairs P It certainly was a
most extraordinary thing that the manufacturers should
come to that house for aid in their present difficulty, after
the way in which they set the opinions of that house at
defiance in 1842 and 1847, by declaring that they would be
subjected to no parliamentary or legislative control. The
hon. gentleman the member for Carlisle asked what Parlia-
ment had done ; but he scarcely knew what he meant, when
it was recollected that, during the last 30 years, Parliament
had done everything the cotton manufacturers required.
The hon, gentleman had described it as very little indeed,
but he (Mr. Ferrand) thought the hon. gentleman should
be the last man to make such a complaint, The hon. gen-
tleman then referred to the legislation that had taken place
since 1833 in favour of the manufacturers, observing that
they had extended their trade to the injury of India and
China, and had ruined an otherwise prosperous trade by
over-building mills, erecting machinery, over-trading, and
over-borrowing. One half of the mills had been built, and
the machinery erected, with borrowed capital—forgetting
the old principle of live and let live that was practised from
1770 to 1815. Had they acted otherwise, we should
not have heard of the dreadful distress that now pre-
vailed in the north, He advised the manufacturers to
consider and adopt an eight hours' factory bill for adults,
and a four hours' bill for children, as a means to enable
them to open more mills, allay the present distress, and pre-
vent its future recurrence, by limiting the amount of pro-
duction, and preventing the glut of the markets of the world.
The Lancashire operatives complained that by the Reform
Bill they had been deprived of the elective franchise, which
enabled them to return several members to the House of
Commons, and that since that period they had had no voice
in the representative system, and had therefore so much
greater claims on the indulgence and kindness of the house.
The operatives were taught to believe that the cotton trade

would never cease to be prosperous, and they were lured by
the most enormous falsehoods to go doivn to those districts
and seek employment there ; whereas We ;4;7 •re now blocked
out of the mills, and in the greatest in 4. and distress.
The prediction of the hon • member for Rochdale, that within
two months after the repeal of the corn laws wages would be
advanced, and that three masters would be bidding fcr the
services of two men, had not been verified. On Easter Mon-
day last 27 delegates from the manufacturing districts waited
upon him, and informed him that the labour of the factories
had seriously increased of lace, and was continually increas-
ing, owing to the improvements in machinery. When power-
looms were first introduced, it took one person to tend two
looms. Now one man tends three, with a helper, and some-
times four. The other work had increased in proportion,
and the result was that work equal to 12 hours a day was
got out of the operatives under the Ten Hours' Bill. The
wages of the spinner of Surat cotton had been reduced from
30 to 40 per cent., and in some cases as much as 60 per cent.
He referred to the excessive labour entailed upon the spin-
ners in factories, which, he said, made them old men at 40
years of age ; and said that the only place for cotton manu-
factures was India, and that he should be rejoiced to find
there were none in this country. The operatives of Lancashire
wished to fly from their distress, and had asked the house
to assist them to emigrate, in order that they might carry
out the doctrine laid down by the hen. member for Roch-
dale, that the labouring man had a right to take his labour
to the best market; in fact thy asked for free trade in
labour. They had, however, no means of going elsewhere
unless Parliament took pity on them, and they asked for
some kindness, some consideration from that house. They
had worked hard, and had done much to increase the pros.
perity of the country, and to produce that enormous amount
of accumulated wealth which the Chancellor of the Ex-
chequer alluded to on a former oe anion. The right hon.
gentleman on that occasion took only the golden side of the
question, but ho (Mr. Ferrand) had that night taken the
iron aide, and had shown the evils resulting from it. 'Why
send down a commission to ascertain the causes of the dis •

trees in Lancashire, when they knew that the cause of it
was their having blocked up the cotton mills ? But if they
sent a commission to Lancashire they must also send one to
Derbyshire, to Nottinghamshire, and to Scotland, where the
distress was even more frightful than it was in Lancashire.
The hon. raember for Carlisle said that perhaps within 12
months they would have cotton enough to set all the mills
at work. He, however, preferred to take the estimate of
the hon. member for Manchester, who bad expressed a fear
that some years must elapse before they could obtain their
accustomed supplies of the raw material. The hon. member
for Carlisle advocated the keeping the operatives at home,
while the member for Manchester had shown a noble spirit
in proclaiming himself the advocate of emigration. (Hear.)
In conclusion the hon. member expressed a hope that the
House of Commons would recognise the evil of women and
children being employed in factories, and that one result of
the famine would be a diminution in the number of mar-
ried women so employed. He could assure the noble lord at
the head of the Government that his conduct in affording
an opportunity for the discussion of this motion would
never be forgotten by the operatives of the-country. (Hear.)
Mr. POTTER moved as an amendment Od the motion
just proposed, to leave out from the first word "that" to
the end of the question, in order to add the words " en,

humble address be presented to her Majesty, praying that
she will be graciously pleased to appoint a Royal commis-
sion, to inquire into the present state of the cotton manu-
facturing districts, and to report on the best mode of reliev-
ing the distress e! isting therein," instead thereof. The
hon. member stated that the charitable funds collected for
the relief of the distress in the cotton manufacturing districts
had amounted to £2,000,000, while the amount contributed
by the ratepayers for the same purpose was £7:0,000. It
was apparent that in the coming year the contributions of
the charitable would fall far short of the assistance given to
the districts in the past year; and the question was, what
ought to be done? Of the total amount subscribed, some-
thing under £500,000 remained for distribution, while the
number of paupers to be relieved amounted to 470,000, of
whom 80,000 were able-bodied men. He was for placing
the burthen more upon tho property of the several districts ;
ar d with that view he would confer borrowing powers upon
the boards of guardians to enable them to raise money for
22 years. A sum of £1,700,000 might thus be very easily
raised. The central relief committee had recommended the
employment of the operatives upon public works ; well, he
asked for a Royal commission, in order to ascertain what
works might be undertaken, and likewise the public backs
upon whom the duty of superintending their execution
should be devolved. Ho warned the Goveinment against
temporising with the difficulty, for if they attempted to do
so it would become chronic. He believed that a sufficient

supply of cotton was only a question of time, and, therefore,
that no more serious qaestion could come before the House
of Commons than that of tiding over the difficulty and keep-
ing up the moral standard of the operatives. He regretted
exceedingly that the house had not acceded to the appeal of
the hon. member for Rochdale, and allowed the unions
to borrow on the security of their rates. He asked again
that that power should be given. The appoiL tment of
the commission which he proposed would do much within
the next five cr six weeks to relieve the apprehnsions
which had arisen, and on that ground he trust'd it would
be agreed to.
Mr. H. BAILLIE said that the time had now come when
it was the duty of the house to consider whether some mea-
sures could not be adopted for the reliefof the distress which
existed in the manufacturing districts. There was no doubt
that, at the commencement of next winter, the people would
have to depend entirely upon parochial rates. If they failed,
violence and outrage would probably ensue. The question
then arose, What were the other alternatives ? The first, in
his opinion, was Government aid and assistance to those
who wished to emigrate; and secondly, to find employment
for those who wanted to rem tin at home. The hon. gen-
tlemen referred to the assistance which had been given by
Government 25 years ago to the people on the north coasts
and islands of Scotlands, who had been reduced to distress
by taking the duty off barilla, and to the same assistance
given to the distressed weavers of the west of Scotland in
1820, who had been assisted to emigrate to Australia and
the Falkland Islands, old line-of-battle ships being fitted up
for the purpose. Such a course might again be adopted ;
and, if the unions paid for the clothing and food of the emi-
grants on the voyage, the expense would be little more than
the wear and tear of the old vessels that were now lying
idle in ordinary. The hon. member suggested also that the
proposed fortifications at the mouths of our commercial har-
bours, for which a sum of £500,000 had been voted, should
be made by the able-bodied men of Lancashire, at the full
wages of day labourers. He did not think there was any
necessity for the commission which the amendment pro-
posed, The Poor Law Board had a commissioner on the
spot, who reported every week on the state of the dis-
tricts. The Government, therefore, were fully aware of
what was going on, and further inquiry would only
create a delay which must be injurious to the working
classes. The Government, up to the present, had done
nothing. He did not blame them for that, as it was
the best course to pursue; but the time for inaction was
passed. There was a great calamity looming in the dis-
tance, and no time ought to be wasted in idle inquiries or
in seeking information which was already possessed. A
great responsibility would rest upon Ministers if they now
shrunk from their duty of providing for the safety and well-
being of the great body of the people. (Hear.)
Mr. VILLIERS said that he expected that the hon.
member who had brought forward this motion would have
made an attack upon the Government for neglecting their
duty. As that, however, had not been done, it had left him
but very little to say. With reference to the charge made
against himself with regard to pauper children, as far as he
recollected the circumstance referred to by the hon. member
opposite, it applied solely to the construction of an Act of
Parliament as to whether children who were in a state of
destitution should not be sent to the manufacturing districts,
where they might be employed. The hon. member through-
out his speech complained of the manufacturers; he had
complained of them formerly, and now that he returned to
the house he renewed the complaint, He did not under-
stand what course the hon member wished the Government
to take. Various suggestions were thrown out from time
to time, and he therefore thought the hon. member was
going to suggest how the Government were to employ the
operatives of Lancashire. The hon. member for D. vonport
proposed that Government should undertake to relieve the
distress in the cotton districts, and the hon. member for Car-
lisle was in favour of the Crown doing so, and he moved for
a Royal Commission. His own impression was that they
possessed all the information that was necessary, and if a
Royal Commission were issued to inquire it could not
add to the information they already possessed. The hon.
member for Carlisle seemed to think there was consider..
able ignorance on the part of the Government, and espe-
cially in the department of the Poor. law Board ; but
still he could not persuade himself that tilt), were de-
ficient in the information necessary to enable them to
come to a right conclusion. He did not know any cause
of depression which could be so easily traced to the one
simple cause; and he had never known one to which greater
publicity had been given, for there was not a fact or a de-
tail connected with the distress or the sufferings of the
people which was not made public. (Hear, hear.) He did
not think there was any doubt as to the cause of the dis-
tress, the extent of the distress, and the real remedy re-
quired. The number of persons engaged in the cotton trade
was above half a million ; and the sufferings of these 500,000
persons resulted from the simple cause that the raw mate-
rial upon which their industry depended could not be pro-
cured as formerly. There were upwards of 410,000 persons
dependent upon charity, and among these were 72,000 able
bodied men, for whom it was desired to find employment,
in order to rescue them from their degradation, and enable
them to earn the means of their own support. (Hear, hear.)
The hon. member for Devonport was in favour of the Go-

vernment taking charge of these 72,000 men, and defraying
the cost of their emigration. With regard to emigration, he

did not think it was the business of the Government to ad-
vance money for that purpose—(hear, hear)—nor did he
think the Government should oppose emigration. It was a
matter which should be left to the colonies, to the feeling
of the people, and to private and charitable enterprise. It
appeared to him to be a matter of doubtful policy, at a time
when every effort was being made to grow cotton to supply
the demand, to be sending the people away who could pro-
fitably work the machinery. He was, therefore, opposed to
any scheme requiring the Government to promote emigra-
tion. When th 3 hon. member for Devonport asked the Go-
vernment to assist the cotton operatives, he had not told
them that the people of Lancashire had exhausted all the
resources of their own county. The right hon. gentleman
then stated that from the first appearance of the distress
he had made it his duty to collect all the opinions he could
from practical men conversant with the manufacturing
districts, and he was happy to tell the house that the
memorandum he had received from an experienced engi-
neer acquainted with Lancashire conclusively proved that
the cotton operatives could be employed with great ad-
vantage in reclaiming waste lands, in making roads, in
drainage works, and a variety of useful labour. And the hon.
member for Cheshire (Mr. Tollemache) was at present em-
ploying a number of the cotton operatives in improving his
estate. Ile had obtained an equally satisfactory memoran-
dum from the brother of the hon. member for Leeds, who
was al% o practically acquainted with the wants and resources
of the cotton districts. The Central Committee in Manches-
ter had also made. various suggestions, showing how the
operatives could he usefully and profitably employed in a
variety of works in towns. Notwithstanding the ignorance
imputed to him by tho hon. member for Carlisle (Mr. Pot-
ter), he had secured information from men of intelligence
well acquainted with Lancashire. The reports under the
Local Improvements Act showed that 25 of the places which
had borrowed money under it had only partially executed
the works, and in 18 places nothing had been done. This
was because labour had been a few years ago so scarce in
the country. There was ample opportunity for extending
improvements. It appeared under these circumstances that
it would be a waste of time to direct a commission to go
down and inquire into the suit able class of works on which
to employ the workmen. With the view that the works
might be begun immediately, the Government had deter-
mined to request a gentleman employed under the Health
of Towns Act and the Local Improvements Act as civil en-
gineer to proceed at once with several other engineers to
these districts, and examine what works might bo com-
menced at once, what were the difficulties incident to enter-
ing upon them, and what was the number of men to be em-
ployed thereon. He thought that this inquiry would not
last more than three weeks, and the works could be then en-
tered on. About 70,000 men would be fully employed in
carrying out these works. He thought that the Govern..
ment were right in proceeding to action immediately, and
upon the report of gentlemen being received, which would
be very shortly, the workmen would be employed without
delay.
Colonel PAT TEN approved neither of the motion nor
the amendment. Emigration, to whatever extent it might
be carried, would only apply a very small measure of relief;
whilst a Royal commission would not afford more informa-
tion to the house than it already possessed, There was no
doubt that the resources at the command of the relief com-
mittees would not enable them to go on maintaining 400,000
people for any lengthened period, supposing the present
state of things to continue; in fact the balance in hand was
such as to require the immediate attention of the house and
the Government to the question how employment was to
be given to prevent their utter demoralisation. The total
amount of subscriptions, including £680,000 raised under
the poor law amounted to £2,735,000, of which there had
been expended £1,853,319; and the balance remaining to
the credit of the Central Fund, the Bridgewater House and
Liverpool Fttade, aAd ih the hands of the local committees,