The Sun.
London, England, 1839-08-21 00:00:00

tliE MIN, LONDON, WEbNESDAY, AOGeSi" .11', 18-A6'.

abet machionry the Hon, Member reontempla'W in
I
to give the ihmte-payers Some control over the funds, but
Ili'd syst'em as one which the House must approve oft
more esrecially at a time when the rates were insreasing,
and further demands were being constantly waste upon the
aate.payers. He hoped the House would allow the Bill
to be brought in.
Mr. El UM E replied. the principle of representation
and taxation which he contended fer was recognized in
NO USE OF COMMONS.
every municipal Corporation in the kingdom, and the
(Continued from our First Edition:) object of the all was to extend that principle to coonties.
Mr. HUME was sorry that the facilities of open Joint- There were some objections urged on former occasions
stock Banking was to be kept from Ireland for another with regard to the fr, quent elections of the Cmincils, and
year.
the appointment of auditors, which he had remedied in
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said he the present Bill, and all be wanted was th at time
had adopted the proposition which was made to him at the !should be gismo for properly &mussing its merits.
beginoing of the contest, which tams to reserve the whole Ilis hoped the Eal would not he °permed, several hail been
discussion of the flouter till next Session. Th 13.. ink ot introduced within the last moat', for the mere purpose of
Leland had acted in the most handsome naintom upon the being printed, and why his bill should not he so, he did not
present occasion, and had, as fir as possible, done all in know. If it their power to forward the resent arrangement.
was objected to, of course he mum subind. as
p Ile was in the then state, of the House, it would be worse than
as great a friend of free banking, with the siuole exception useless to take a division, but he hoped the Bill would be
of making money, as any one presi nt, but II m
aooweo to emetuate ti,, ougeout eversdourity.
he objected to the free issuing of paper money. , Mr. T. PARK ER was in duty bound to oppose the
It had been stated to the flout:, awl undoobt diy that Bill. ta the county aim %%Hell lie was connected the
statement made a great imp''ession on the Elitist,. that A accounts were made tom veiny, and the county was in
gentleman who had moved the nomination of the Hon and general satisfied with them. He must oppose the intro-
Learned Memher for Dublin, had been f xcluded from an duction of the Bill.
office which he had a right to hold, on account ot his poli- Me. G RIM SDITC H said the title of the Bill, ought to
tical charricter. The facts were these, and the House be a Bill to establish ceuoty confmion.—( A I iugh ) Ile
would see how contrary. these facts were to the im• would give every opposition to the B, lin his power.
pression that was created.-- ( Hear, hear.) There was The motion was then negatived without a division.
in Dublin a Mr. Robert Rowe, the Secrets y of the Chamber of Commerce. a Mr. HUME then rose to move for it copy of any con-
gentleman ot the highest possi- tract or agreement entered into by the Board of Admiralty,
ble acquirements, one of the best political ceconomists be or any other department of her 31,jestn's Government,
(the Chancellor of the Exchequer) had ever had the good respectine
fortune to meet with, and who was the author of sever the convemtece of the mails to the West Indies
petitions to that House, particularly on the move al and America; stating whether the same has been agreed
Y laws. to by private contract or sublic tender; and stating, also,
He was a gentleman standing so high in the city of Dub. the terms or cfrws made by merchants of Bristol or other
lin, that more than once the Representation of that city parties for the sail contract.
was tendered for his acceptance; but he declined receiving Mrr C. WOOD said the only reason why he should
it. He died, and his elder brother was appointed a Directorof object to the motion was, that it would be impossible for
the Bank of Ireland. It was impossible, by the rules of min to comply with it. He was ready, however, to make
the Batik, for two brothers to be members of the Corpora an explanation ; and, as that would probably answer the
tion, and therefore there had been no exclusion of Mr. purpose of the Hon. Gentleman, he would do so at once.
Rowe the younger by reason of his politics.—( Hear, The first contract in point of time was the one for the con-
hear.) These were the facts as he had stated them, and veyance of mails to Halifax. The Government certainly
he trusted that statement was perfectly satisfactory to the had called for a public tender for the performance of that
House.—( Hear, bear.)
service. The lowest tender fur the performance of that ser-
Mr. D. O'CALLAGHAN believed that the Ho. vice once a month, and that was a very unsatisfactory tender
nourable and Learned Member fur Dahlia (who was with regard to the mode of carrying it out, was 45 000/.
not present) was perfectly aware that he had been a year, but the Government had entered into an engage-
led into error, and would have corrected the mistake ment with an individual for the performance of the service
last night, had he not been told by an Honourable once a fortnight at 50,0001. ; so that, at an increase of
Member that it was scarcely worth while mentioning it 5,000/. they would get twice the service done, including a
again to the House.
communication with the St. Lawrence arid a conveyance
The Bill was then read a second time, and ordered to from Halifax to Boston. In consequence of some further
be committed to-morrow.
DUKE OF MARLBOROUGH'S PENSION.
engagement, an additional expense was rendered necessary
by the employment of another vessel. They had contracted
On the Order of the Day being read for bringing up for the conveyance of mails to Halifax once a rtd fortni • t.,.. , the Report on this Biil,
for the conveyance of mails from New Brunswick to Quebec
Mr. WA KL EY said he hoped some one in the House once a fortnight as long as the river was open and the couvey-
would divide with him against bringing up the Report. ance of mails from Halifax to Bath for the suni of 60,000/.
He did think that on principle a more objectionable mea- a year; so that, at an increase of 15,0001., they had more
sure could not have been submitted to the House.— than twice the service done, for which the lowest - tender
( Hear, hear.) The Honourable Member for Kilkenny was put in, in this country, which was 45,0001.—( Hear.)
had already offered a fruitless opposition to the Bill. With regard to the conveyance of mails to the West
This Bill ought to have a dill: rent title. It should be en- Indies, no contract had been entered into. It was dune
titled " A Bill for increasing the Pension of the Duke of by private tender. His conviction was that neither in
Marlborough by 3751. a year." If such a title were adopted North America nor the West Indies would it be worth
it would be understood by the public ; but the public would while for any one to undertake the service who had not,
have great difficulty in comprehending why a Duke was from their interest in the colonies, a much farther interest
relieved on this occasion, when if a person of less conse- in the performance of the service than the mere sum paid
quence came before the House for redress he would find by the Government. A number of gentlemen deeply in-
none. But being a Duke, of course he bad an ample terested in the welfare of the West India colonies, had
number of supporters in the House, and got a gentleman come forward and offered to perform certain services
to argue his case with such great ability, that lie induced for 240,0001., and this had been agreed to. He
the Right Hon. Gentleman—he had nearly said the Noble would not detail the services performed. At present
Lord—(Laughter)—to bring in this Bal. The Right there was a communication by sailing vessels twice a month
Hon. Gentleman had now a great sympathy with Dukes, to the \Vest Indies,
and once a month to Mexico. The
because he was about to he associated with them.—( Con- communication with the West Indies
was, them fore, sins
tinned laughter. )—He (Mr. Wakley) had no such sym- Perfect, and the inter-colonial communicatihn was ex.
pathy, and he looked at the case with reference to the ceedingly bad. With all the foreign islands there was no
merits of the question and not to the situation of the par- communication at all. There was no communication be-
Ocular individual who claimed redress He wanted to tweeri IL-Nano:dr and the English islands, and the conse-
know if the Duke had performed any public services which quence was that if the Governor of It induras %visited to
entitled him to the consideration ot the House. He might write to the Governor of Jernmea, the letter must come
have voted as Hon. Gentlemen had wished on sundry occa- round by England If specie was wanted to be sent from
sions in the Upper House, hut it would be paying dear for Mexico to the, W ,st Indies there was no mode of doing it
his votes to give him and all who cane after him 375/ a except by sending a ship of war for that purpose ; no:. tvas
yeur for what he had done in this respect. H p.m did the there any communicatioo to he depended Mimi between
House deal with the poor under the Poo"-law Amendinew ihe West lodies and the United St rtes of America.
Act ? How did it treat the Chelsea pensioners, who had These d.ficiericies would now ha suopliA in the following
no person to represent their interest in this House? But manner: two steamers of 400 horse lawyer each would cross
a Duke, having considerable faintly interest,came here and the Atlantic every forth' ht to the W'st Indies, Tram these
found relief. 'rho fituic could show its sympithy in that or inch steamers of a similar power would go to the riff-
case, but it could show none with reference to the poor of ferent islands, steamers would likewise proceed to the (la-
the country. He therefore rrryved that that the Report be ferent colonies of Guiana. Deinerara, and Berbice, to the
received this day three months.
Caraccas, to Panama, to Honduras, to the Havanna, to
Mr. BROTH ERTO N seconded the amendment. Vera Cruz, and the south-western parts of the United
Strangers were then imeler to withdraw, but-- States. In addition to this, steamers would proceed from
Mr. HUME rose and said, before strangers withdrew, the Havanna to New York and Halifax. Time number of
he wished to state his entire concurrence in the views steamers to be employed would amount to fourteen, and
of his Honourable Friend. He had opposed the Bill by this means a fortnightly communication would be
on a former occasion, and although he had had a opened between this . country and the whole of the
seconder, he had not had the good fortune to have any West Indies, the northern part of South America,
supporters finding the opinion of the House to he the southern parts of the United States, Mexico,
entirely against him, he thought it necessary to offer and the western coast of the South Americas Continent.
any opposition on the present occasion, having already This would be carried into effect early in the summer of
recorded his opinion on the subject, but if any other 1841, which was as soon as the necessary arrangement;
Member wished to divide, he would not withhold his sup. could be effected. With respect to the terms, the more lie
port from him. It had been argued that the Duke of looked at them the more was he satisfied with the arrange-
Marlborough was entitled to the 5,0001. a year Parliament meets that had been entered into—more particularly when
had originally allotted to hint; according to that argument, he considered the enormous expense of providing these
this Bill would not place him in the situation he ought to boats, and of sending out coals from this country. Ile
be in. Parliament thought tit to tax his pension, first 4s. could assure tho Hoene that no propositions had been made
in the pound, and then again Is, 6d. in the pound; the to the Government by any party. it was true the terms of
latter deduction amounted to 375/. and he considered the this arrangement had been made for ten years, as persons
present Bill in the light of a grant for that amount, for he could not enter into any contract for a less term, but it had
held that at the present moment the Duke of Marlborough been made an article in the contract, that if, during the ten
was no more entitled to this than if he had never bad it, years, any great improvements should be made in steam
and such was the opinion of the Treasury in the year 1811, navigation, the Government should have the benefit of them.
who had made a deduction for the two preceding years, Mr. HUME wished to ask if any prospectus had been
from the pension, thus carrying the intention of the Par- issued setting forth the duties to be performed, and .calling
liament into effect. He entirely agreed with his Hon, for tenders, and also whether the Hon. Gentleman was able
Friend, that if any person in humble circumstances had to state if the parties were now-in a condition to carry their
applied for this relief, he would not have obtained it so agreement into effect, or if it would not be necessary even
easily as the Noble Duke had. He agreed with the Hon. now to form a company for that purpose.
Bart. the Member for Oxford that the whole of the pension Mr. C. WOOD was understood to say that no pro-
ought to have been retained, if any was retained. spectuses had been issued ; he had no hope of a better '
fie objected to it on another ground, that it ought to have tender: considering, too, that the partici would have to
been brought in earlier. He could not see why the present build at least fourteen steam-vessels of 400 horse power, •
Duke of Marlborough should receive more than his father it could not be expected that they would be able to corn-
did. mence for some months.
Mr. AG LIONBY as a member of the Committee, The SOLICITOR GENERAL said the subject was
felt bound to state that the Hun, Member for Finsbury had of the deepest interest to his constituents—(l'2am hear)
completely mistaken the course adopted by that Committee. —and there were one or two points to which he
In that Committee the question whether the claimant was wished to call the attention of his Elm Friend. He
a Peer or the meanest subject in the realm, was not could not claim on behalf of those whom he had the honor
taken into consideration. The Hon. Member was entirely to represent, that the consideration of their interests
in error as to the votes of that House, which had never de- should weigh with the Government or with the House, to
nied the right of the Duke to the Is. 6,1. duty. When he induce them to forego the advantages of steam, if steam
went into the Committee, from all that he had heard in were (as he believed it was) more expeditious for the
that House, he had a bias in his mind against the claims of transmission of correspondence than sailing vessels. But
die Noble Duke, hut, after the arguments that were ad- even on this point he begged to be recollected that the
duced before that Committee, and the further evidence that packet service, being a branch of our naval establishment, •
bad been brought forward, his opinion was entirely changed, presented a laudable object of ambition to those desirous of
and he now believed that the Duke hail a just and equit- entering the navy, and who might otherwise be unemployed,
thus was
able claim to be relieved from the Is. 6d. duty, but his
and answered
opinion, with respect to the 4s. duty remained the same it a mirscry for Mitish seameo,
ends which would not be effected by a contract system.—
He hoped, therefore, the Bill would meet with the unani. ( Hear, hear.) Supposing, however, that the Government
mous concurrence of the House, because the recommenda- had taken an unalterable resolve, he yet would especially
tion of the Committee had on every point been unanimous. entreat them, they might believe with no ill will he did so
He must say that it was not fair of the Hon. Member for
_se( A laugh)—to make the change with the least possible
Finnbury to put the question en the ground of the claims of injury to a port which hail been for a hundred and
the Duke of Marlborough, because it hal never been fifty years the port of communication across the Atlantic
brought forward or snip mted in the Committee on such
--f liar, hear)—with the least possible injury to the
grounds.
—he would not say ve.ste I rights—but the v datable
Mr. BROTIdERTON said whatever defence was at- jaterestc, of those who hid tali out large capital,
tempted to be made there was no doubt the Bill would be employed il extensive- establishments at Falmouth.—
an increase of the pension of the Duke of .\I mrlbarough- ( Hear, hear.) And what he suggested was, that it should
who had for 30 veers acquiesced in it. If any of the rela- be mile a part of the dintract—as to a certain extent he
tions of sailors or soldiers applied for pensions after such a 'rusted ho might say it hal been —that the establishinent
period they were told it was too lam—.he books were must to some degree b ? fixed at Fnlmouth. He said
closed. Why should not the same principle be applicable this. b niuse he -believed it was admitted, that, there
to all ? was no port in the United K:ngdom from which
Captain PE CHP, LL had supported the Bill in all its vessels could start more 1 a,.vatitageousl ii for the
previous stages, mid lie was disposed to support it now. stations across the Atlantic, as Falmouth, there heind no
Mr. P. HOWARD supported the Bill. wind with which vessels would not sail there. Another
S rangers were then ordered to withdraw, and the House conaideration, in which the public, the tended pohlio espe
divided, when there appeared. cially, were interested, was this : —Toe letters that came
For bringing up the Report ..
Against it 5 the greatest proportion—the greatest proportion came
Majority
The report was then brought up. the letters were taken in at soon i of the western ports, they
COUNTY COUNCILS BI L L.—A DJO UR NE D would be delayed. Unless, therefore, these packets were
DEBATE. bound by their co atract to take in letters at the extreme
Mr. HUME moved the 0 -der of the D.ty for the re- ports, there would be great delay. What he was now stating.
sumption of the adjourned debate on this Bill. was not chimerical, for during the last three or four weeks
The Grier of the Day having been read, no leas than three packets had been delayed 67 hours in
Mr. S ANFO RD regretted that Ilia lion. Friend per- consequences of not being stationed at Falmouth. lie
slated in introducing the Bill. The only object he could trusted, in conclusion, that the sense of the House would
have in view was, that it should be. circulated during the be manifested in favour of his i view of the case, in ordev
prorogation( ; e but this was done after the last Session, and that his Right Hon. Friend might see the propriety of
the public opinion was strongly against it. The
adopting it, which it was his belief he was inclined to do.
principle of the Bill was nearly the same, and the Mr. F. BARING hoped the House would express no
machinery was of so cumbrous a nature, that opinion with respect to the propriety of placing the packet
it would be attended with the greatest inconvenience station at Falmouth, or elsewhere. If he was in the situa.
He imagined that it was the wish of the Hon. Member to tion of his Hon. Friend, standing ap in that House as
give superintendence to the rate-payers, and in this desire the advocate of his constituents, he should advocate
he concurred; but the plan proposed was so burdensome, the station being at Portsmoush. The Treasury were de-
that it must necessarily fail in attaining its object. If the termined to fix upon that place for a packet station
Hon. Member had introduced the measure earlier in the which was most beneficial to the public service, and
Session it might hove been fully discussed. He could as. not to consider the interests of
re any parti in rticular.
sure the Hon. Member that the feeling of the country was He had great gratification in flectinges pa
that while his
against the measure. It would be necessary to travel great I Right Hon. Friend was at the head of the Tre story, the
distances, and to go to considerable expense to exercise the I Government, in conjunction with the Admiralty, had been
getting tired ' able to confer the greatest advantages upon the commerce
franch;se under this measure, and people were
of going these distances to veto.
of the country with the world by the increased facilities it
Mr. EWA RT thought as the Hon. Member for Somer- had afforded to trade. During the last few years a weekly
setshire approved of the principle of the Bill, he ought to communication by steam had been established with Gibraltar
vote with the Hon, Member for Kilkenny. If the machinery ......a fornightly communication with the Baltic—a for
was complex it could be amended in Committee, and the communication with Corfu and the Grecian Islands—a steam
Hon. Gentleman, as a country gentleman, was one of the communication between England and India—a fortnightly
best fitted for the purpose of suggesting these amendments. communication between England and North America, and
It was asked, how could it be possible for the country now they had secured, by that last arrangement, a fort.
gentlemen to taavel thirty or forty miles to do the duty. nightly steam communication between the West Indies,
But they travelled quite enough as it was. And such Mexico, and that country, which was of great importance
bounds existed in France, when in fnct they were the only in the present state of their Colonial possessions.—( Hear,
means of teaching the French the advantages of a repast- hear.) He could nut but believe that these arningernents
tentative system. Seeing that the principle of the measure would be productive efgreat ultimate benefit to the commerce
gentleman a s
was admitted, it was unfair to reject the Bill on details, of the country, arid whatever expense might be incurred in
particularly
t,lie
ought
tetio rheequriorseidly
to were as any obtaining them, the benefit would far surpass that expense.
Country
Itir. FRE SHFI E LD was glad the Hon. Member for
reasona r. P. .10 WA RI) thought the proposition a very I Kilkenny had brought the subject before the House, mid
ble one. At Present, measures affecting counties Ihe was most anxious to see the contract or quasi contract
were much longer lacing understood than in to..vns. i laid before Parliament. He doubted much whether the
measure should be introduced. by Gentlemen who had ob- 1 encreahe
Sir C. BURRELL-comMiered it, extraordinary that this 1 strong feeling that was stated to exist on the subject of
to communicationby steam, 14
d facilities • • • . 1• ti
jetted to the Chancellor of the Exchequer's bringing for- I ever found its way to a Government (Am., except
ward the Irish Bank Bill, on account of the lateness of the i through the medium of some great names appe_a,rh
Session. Taking the whole c'
yif Irehills'ulsica)nn cPicied ethe Nill: oi9g
tion, he felt it to be his dot •in a piospectusi and suggesting the wide
,fifl,l
bar for Somertetshire divided on t . . into
"s
a ' 'f.- enter prize, awl enormous sdvaiit,wes that would
A.
biro. the subject, to vote with , aecrue to the public from thin aeaptioo of their pans.
the public, as
Captain PEC hIE L L hoped the Bill
' Was it tart of the contract that the Comoany was to have
to have that which was generally
for the information of would be printed . a charter—tvere.
they
to be clog d &el that
the timo had now • thouelit in old times a upon trade—did e— i
arrived when they were anxioua to have Some sort of form'
part of the e ,ntrict ? It must ; for the contract
control over the money that was raised from
.them •
could not be carried into effect with mu it. 1-1! was most
The principle had been recognized in the Bill which had anxious to see the quasi contract. is omaer to know whe.
been introduced on a former occasion, and there could he ; ther proper nrraneeinents had been m hlewchla respect to
eo reasonable objection to its introduction.
„
lie knew-run ' the -..1•0f FP:i"Lr' I, was not a quostion of Falmouth,
pa:. 7 ,(. ,

SECOND EDITION.

SUN OFFICE, Seven a' Cleir.
IMPERIAL PA LI A AIENT.
(THIS EVENING.)

I except so. fir As it wits the interests of that port were
conneetcd with the interests of the public. But every
presumption was in favour of Falmouth. It was in pos-
session of the trade and had been for a century, and he
! challenged a public inquiry into the capbailities of
Falmouth as compared With any other port. If there
ev63 to he an alteration in the point of departure,
I it might to be after a full ievest:gatien of the subject, and
heating evidence pro and con. Every information ought
to be given on the su'iject ; and it ougbt not to be, made to
depend on the activity of any Honourable i',leniber in
getting official information. Ile did not know whht in-
formation the Honourable Member for Kilkenny
might have on the subject, but in the Falmouth Pocket
there was a report of a meeting of merchants at Bristol, at
evhieli it was resolved that an offer should be made to the
Covert me to - convey th? mails to and from the
Wk st In.lies for 100 0001. les; than had been cff end
by the London Company, which was understood to be
240,00U1 Ir appeared to have er eited areat aston-shment
that so precipitate a step should have been taken by the
Golernment, and that the country at large should not
have been informed of their intention. He was ~urprisixt
that a contract should have taken place without the public I
Fbeingmure:plylateietd,
pilteako
s vic wasasitruatici,e to
in
obid against each other.
p
no re.seri why it s'iould not b • retained ese reed it to the Admiralty, and he saw
rticvdatebyhands, aed the
Government tra
the Gov, r.i.
ment, who ought eertaiely to be able to perform the duties
as cheaply as any c.,mpley, zF any alteration was to be
made in psrt of departure, an opportunity ought to be
given for examing into the reasons for such charges.
Lord ELLIOT was ready to concede that the public
interests ought to be the object which the Government
had in view, but the vaitt: of Falmouth had never been
underrated, and if the establishment there should be de
stroyed, we might, in the event of a war, find ourselves in
a situation of great diffieulty.—( Hear, hear.) He
thought the substitution •of steam for sailing vessels
was a great advantage, and the question was
whether the Government had secured this in the most
elf lent and economical manner. It appeared that a
Company of merchants at Bristol were ready to undertake
the arrangement on more economical terms; and he also
understood that a sum had been offered for the bargain,
which had been struck with the Government. It was
proposed that the packets should take their departure twice
a month. That was at the same period as the sailing
packets, and therefore the transmission of letters would
not be Omer. than at present. But this Company was to
have a monopoly for ten years, at 249,0001. a year ;
'set that, whatever improvement might be made, the
expense' to the country would be exactly the same.
There ,was also
.another consideration, great incouvenience
would accrue td Merehant`e'
desirous of shipping specie to
this. couatryiebbeause.ir was well known that merchants
preferred shippingeSpecie on hoard a man-of-war to en-
trusting. to . private • individuals ; 'therefore the merchants
would be entirely in the hands of this Company, or would
'be obliged to.wait, for the accidental arrival of a mats-of-
war. The services of a very great number of offic.rs and sea-
men would be:dispensed with, and that was a matter worthy
of. serious consideration, more especially as to the expense,
because all these officers would have to be placed upon
half-payeor provided for by some other method. It was
also a matter-of the utmost consequence, that they should
consider whether they would not by this plan be destroy.
in;; the nursery for the navy. He agreed with the Hon.
Member fur Falmouth in opinion that the Government
had by no nteans establish a case.
Mr. AGLIONBY was anxious to know whether the
Secretary to the Admiralty intended to grant this return

fully resisted the plantation of ministers therein by lay-
' patrons; with the names of the ministers so rejected.
th RettArn of the names of parishes in Scotland which
hav,e attempted, unsuccessfully, under thAt Act, to resist
the plantation of ministers therein by lay-patrons ; with
the names of the ministers thus intruded into these parishes.
'5. Copy of the Rules under which the Government
Chure:t patronage in Scotland has been bestowed since the
passing of, or under, the aforesaid Veto Act ; especially
tt e mode' in which intimation is given to the parishioners,
that they shall be at liberty to reject the Government no-
minee, should such appointment be contrary to their
wishes, the time allowed for expressing their dissent, the
form prescribed for expressing it, the party to whom it
must be expressed or delivered; also the rule of proceed-
ing by Government after such dissent has been expressed'
and a new appointment has become necessary."
give the reasons which his Honour_
but not being able to
able Friend doulArss would be able to urge for these re-
turns, if the G,wernment objected he would not persist.
The LORD ADVOCATE said he must object to the
whole of them.
Mr. HUME then withdrew the motion."'

or not.
Mr. C. WOOD—Certainly not.
Mr. AGLIONBY underitood as much, and therefore
the groundwork of the argument of the Hon. Member was
cut away. It was said to be impossible to grant these
returns. He should like to know in what the impossibili y
coie.isted. If any contract was in existence it could be pro-
duced, and it no such contract existed it was easy to state so.
If no offers is id been made, where was the difficulty of
stating so? It had been stated by the Hon. Member for
Periren, that an of had been mule to carry the mails
,f,ohrel(o3oo,voeoroatnen
t. av,e.arNleosswt,hbains
would be a saving of one mil-
the sum agreed to be given b)
lion in the ten years, which was worthy of consideration.
There had been ro public notification either by advertise.
merit or otherwise to the mercantile irtertst, until the
meal- ace;dentally transpired—(Mr. F. Baring—lt was
in the newspapers)—but n very short time ago.—( Mr.
F. Boal r:rneg
bad-- Tim.);,oe
been
ff o
oni t hy„a.
did not
ought to ought to have befoee the country was committed
which
therethen
that
to a ten year's bargain, and to a sum of money much less
than a hich, he believed, even for a shorter period, would
have been sufficie.t.
Lord ELIO r said the Falmouth Dlautation, who had
waited on :he Treasury, not only were previously ignorant
of any such contract being in c mtemplation, but left the
Chancellor of the Exchequer equally in the dark.
Mr. C. WOOD thought his lion. Friend the Member
for Cockermouth would not have listened to what he had
stated, which was distinctly, first, that the contract was
just as he had represented it to the House; next,
that it was a private, and. not a public, tender ; and,
thirdly, that no other offer bad been made. With respect
to the question of the lionoit.able Member opposite (Mr.
Freshfield), all he had to say was that the Government
had reserved to themselves the right of naming the port
from which the vessels were to start.—( Hear, bear.) With
respect to the complaint that the arrangement had been
effected by private contract, he would observe that in every
instance where public tenders had been invited by the
Government they bad generally failed, and had always suc-
ceeded in making much better terms by private contract.
As an instance of that, when it was .proposed to carry the
mail to Rotterdam, public tenderi were asked for, and only
once was received, and that of such a character that the
Government felt bound to decline it- So with respect to
Cadiz, Liverpool, Dublin. end Halifax—all of which cases
the Government had made much better terms of private
contract. He believed that the present bargain was en
extremely good one for the Government and the public.
It remained for the House to say whether, under all the
circumstances, the bargain was a fair one or not.
After a few words from Mr. WILLIS,
Captain PECHELL said the lion. Gentleman had
objected to giving a copy of the contract for the convey-
ance of the West India Mails, on the ground of its being
incomplete, but no such objection could apply .to
the contract with Halifax, because in a Nova Scotia
paper he had seen a vote of thanks to the agent,
Mr. Kinnaird, on the ground of his having • made
so good a bargain with the English Government,
lie thought that great caution should be used with respect
to the doing away with the establishment at Falmouth, as
it had always been a most excellent nursery fer our seamen.
He begged to ask, too, how the mail was to be carried from
Halifax to Boston.
Mr. C. WOOD -.-Bv steam.
Captain PE CHEL L--That was so far satisfactory ;
but it was very important to know what the means of com-
munication were to be between England and our frontier
Colony of Bermuda. He trusted these questions would be
answered to the satisfectiono of the House and the country.
Mr. J. PALNIER thought the Government could nut
be too open in their dealings with respect to all matters of
contract, and deprecated the encouragement of steam
vessels, which he considered destroyed nurseries for sea-
men.

Admiral ADAM said that the steamers would carry as
many seamen at the packets used to do. Bat he would ask,
w:,,s it n:nting for this country to have an immense force
of:,!eam-vcs,cls. s ) tit if a war were to breall.uoo-
morrow we could at once arm and man them for the pur-
pose of protecting our commerce, hot only in the Channel
hut all aver the world.—([f,ar. ) 11, knew there were
at ;present a groat many obj,ctions to steam•vesels, but
tune and exp! rience would overcome them.

Mr. HUME wished, b •ftre the questiqn was disposed
of, to m=ike one or two ob;eruations. lie admitted thAt
he had been ignorant of the facts stated by the Hon. Gen-
tleman ( Mr. ‘Vood), but he did not think the Admiralty
or the G-ni,roment had the power of winding this country
to contracts for ten years. Hitherto there had always
been an annual vote for the expellees of the packets.
He would venture to say that never hal there been
2,400,030/. disposed of by one branch of the Government
without the knowledge of Rirliameut. This appeared to
him to b:e a m ist monstrous prvosition. He trusted the
Government would pause before they placed themselves in
a siitaltion from which they could not retire, for he was
quite sure Parhameat would not sanction a thing of this
sort being done privately. It they had power to dispose
Of this
,sum, why .shoulA they -not have the power to
dispose of 20.000,000/. ?--4 Hear, bear.) If they were
able to make a C-mtract of this nature for ten years
why not for 50? In fact they iri:z.ht bini down the whole
expenditure of the country.—(H ,ar, hear.) If there
wai any objection to the form of the mcstion he xould alter
it in any way which might be punted out.

Mr. F. HARING said the -returns would not answer the 1
purpose of the Hon. Member; he bad better move for the
whole of the correspondence. The Government had been
repeatedly urged by parties in that House to perform this
service by contract, arid the moment they do so their powers
are doubted. This struck him as most extraordinary; it
was of great importance that this question should be settled
both out of fairness to the Government and to the parties
interested. The Hon. Gentleman had better give not;ce
friendly
yn tot ae
question of power, plan for executing
these d
of a motion for suspending' the contracts at once.
Mr. HUME said that would be hardly fair towards
him —he
iheasdbayl always
contract,
been
andf as
rin
the Attorney• General was the proper person to apply to,
h
he hhd no wish to move for thn correspondence, but he
would advise the Government to pause.
Mr. C. WOOD s Lid it would be impossible to give the
Hon. Gentleman more information on the subject than he
had already given him. If next Session he chose to move
for every scrap of paper connected with the subject he
should have no objection to furnish him with them.
Mr. HUME said that his only object was that the in .
formation relating to this subject should be in possession of
the country. .

Mr. FRE SHFIE LD W 35 anxious to see the correspon-
rdeel'Ta7thien:gmmtlootriteohneeswePxaeqcisittaihinleygnasityn:yrteccm:dm.
tPola.ints from
the colonies
EXCHEQUER BILLS.
On the matiln of Mr. HUME'there was ordered a
" Return of the several Fundings of Exehequer Bills since
the year 1797, stating the amount of Exchequer Bills
funded at each time, the terms on which the same were
maiket on the day
Chancellor of the
converted into Stock ; stating also the price or premium at
time
amountof
tlp nooftices
bad been requested.
Exchever Bills
o'atlV'''hntildicwnehthiol'elucgteithulsregt tartlEeni e;sdx icosnn:::.aetltiqi;n:teti'tr'rvheaaesß qtsll.lvii4tl:ibsievulte:det the Exchequertthhee iven,
CHURCH OF 'SCOTLAND. _
by his Hon.
Mr. HUME said he
Frierti, the Member for Greenock, to move for_.
1. Copy of the Veto Act of. the General Assembly of
Seethnd ; or the. document winch is so called.
- 2. A copy of the roll of tterso in each parish of .Scot-
land, entitled. under that Act, to exercise the veto ; or a
return, r,lityring the number of perons in each parish of
Scotland, entitfpd, Lawlor that Act, to exercise the veto.
3. R.e.turn_of the names of, parishes ie Sernißnd, who,
sinco tn.! introiaction of, and unds-,1 that Apt, have success,

,Mr. AG LIONBY gave notice that he should to mor-
row call the attention of the Reuse to the Second R-port
of Committee on P:ivate Baminess, and move resolu-
tion; Lunde(' on that Report. It WAS his intention also to
that certain returns relative to the Six Clerks and
Ma::tr's office, which had been entered on the 18:h of
July, should be laid on thr table.