The Sun.
London, England, 1837-02-08 00:00:00

Words with great emphasis, and sat down amidst the most
enthusiastic cheering. ]
Mr. R. JACKSON rose amidst some confusion and loud
cries of " Order," from the Opposition benches. He said—l
rise, Sir, not by any means to oppose tho motion of
the Noble Lord, or to enter into any lengthened discussion
of the measure which he has introduced.—(Hear, hear.)
But I feel • it my duty, as one of the persons
who have been alluded by the Noble Lord, to justify the
point which I, though a humble individual, have taken,
In common with my Protestant fellow-countrymen, on the
occasion to which the Noble Lord refers.—( Hear.) But
before I proceed to that part of the subject which
consists in a justification of the proceedings of that great
ting, I think it a duty to call the attention of the House to
one or two of the other topics which the Noble Lord has
intioduced into his speech. I think the Noble Lord has
taken very esew ground on this occasion. I think that in all
l evious discussions of this question, it has • never occurred
to any Member of either House of Parliament
to discuss this question upon the ground which the Noble
ord has taken.—( Hear, hear, hear.) I mean his argu-
ent that the rejection of the 'Municipal Bill was an
ineaction of the Act of Union, and a departure from
the spirit in which the Emancipation Act was passed.
Really, Sir, I deny that there is any wain of solid ar-
gun ent in either of these statements. ( Hear, hear.)
Did the Noble Lord mean to say that the principle
of the Union was that there should be no dif.
fe:ence between the government of the two countries or
its laws ?—( Hear, hear, hear.) If he had read the
et of Union, he would have seen, by the Bth section of
tl at Act, that the laws of Ireland, as they existed before
11. e Union, should continue. Look at the White Boy
Act. Was there any necessity for anything like that
existing •in England ?—( Hear, hear.) What was the
spirit of the Act of Emancipation ? Could the Noble Lord
put his finger on any part of that Act which rendered it obli-
gatory to give to Ireland Municipal Reform.—(Cheers and
cries of " Hear, hear.") Perhaps the Noble Lord argued
that the spirit of the Emancipation Bill, and not the letter
rendered it necessary. In his ( Mr. Jackson's) opinion, the
spirit and the letter of the Act was in direct opposition to it.
The Noble Lord spoke of Lord Mulgrave's desire to do im-
partial justice, and he referred to three gentlemen who filled
the office of Attorney-General in that country. He (Ser-
geant Jackson) did not deny their respectability, but there
were others equally as respectable in their profession.
Lord J. RUSSELL did not mean to say that those gen-
tlemen were not as respectable as any others of the profession
--he adduced the fact to show t unanimity in the Govern-
Merit in Ireland was essential to the interests of the country.
Serjeant JACKSON did not misapprehend the Noble
Lord. The Noble Lord could not venture to say that
Mr. Blackburn° or Mr. Edward Pennefather would
for a moment hold' office under Lord Mulgrave's
Government, disgraced and degraded as it was.—( Hear.)
Let the House examine these innovations. The first was
Made by. Mr. O'Loghlen, when he was Attorney- General for
Ireland. The Noble Lord panegyrised the innovations ; but
he would tell the Noble Lord that they had produced conse-
quences the most disastrous. Reference had been made to
the -"
putting by," as it was called, of jurors on the part of the
Crown without assigning any cause. lie held it to be a ca-
lumny on the respectable individuals who from time to time
bad'filled the important office of Attorney-General in Ireland,
and who were connected with the criminal jurisprudence of
that country, to say that in the performance of their duties
they had been actuated by a difference in religious persuasions
to put by men from serving as jurors. He denied that men
were put by from serving as jurors merely because they were
Roman Catholics. Neither did he believe it bad been ever
the practice at any period to put by men offering themselves
as jurors because of their political opinions.—( Cries of " Oh,
oh I") He did not believe it.—( Opposition cheers, and re-
newed cries of " Oh 1" from the Ministerial benches.) But lie
Would mention a case to the Noble Lord in connection with
this subject, and let the people of England hear it, and say if
things had not arrived at a dreadful state in Ireland. A Protes-
tant in the Queen's County, whose name was Carter, and who
was a tenant of Lord Maryborough, proceeded to fence in a por-
tioti of land for which he paid rent, and to which he was en-
titled. In doing so he was set upon by some lawless persons in
the neighbourhood, and he and his sons were beaten. One
Was beaten to such a degree that he lost his senses, and to
this hour, he believed, was an inmate of a lunatic asylum.
The experiment of fencing in this land was repeated,
and the same party opposed it. They again beat the old man,
and they beat him to death. The case was brought on in the
shape of an indictment for murder ; a murder committed, he
believed, at noon-day. On the trial a man engaged in as-
sist:ng the parties in the outrage, was on the jury. What was
the result? No verdict was given. Another assize came
round, and the trial was brought on again. Who was empan-
telled cn the jury on that occasion ? There was to be no put..
ing by of jurors, and who was sworn on that jury ? A convict
—(Loud cries of " Hear, hear")—a man who had been tried
and convicted, and who underwent the sentence of the law for
an outrage of the same description. Did they expect a ver-
dict now? The foreman came out and told the judge that it
vas in vain to expect an agreement, though there was a ma-
'ority of Roman Catholics on the jury favourable to a convic-
lon. The judge took the jury to the bounds of the county;
they passed in triumph through the towns, the people hur-
rahing; and, having arrived at the boundary, the judge dis-
charged them, telling them that there was no safety for life
er property.—(Opposition cheers.) The case came down
a third time to trial, and the offenders obtained another
triumph. At length the mere were let out of gaol, some on
bail, some he believed without bail. Thus justice was com-
pletely baffled. His Majesty's subjects lost their lives, and
the laws were not vindicated. One of the men who had been
charged went, after these proceedings, and again levelled
the fences which Carter's family had raised. Similar cases
had occurred in the north-east and in the north-west of Ire-
land, and if the Noble Lord would indulge them with a Com-
mittee, he pledged himself, on behalf of himself and friends,
that he would not shrink as he bad termed it, from proving the
facts.—(Opposition cheers.) If the Noble Lord imagined
that all the outrages occurred between the Roman Catholics
and Protestants he was mistaken ; he would find that Roman
Catholics fought with Roman Catholics.—(Hear, from Lord
J. Russell). What then was meant by charging his party with
laving acted on the atrocious policy of divide et isnpera ?
Now, the Noble Lord, in making his calculation as to the
amount and quantity of crime committed in Ireland, forgot
a most material item—he forgot the business to be dis-
charged by the local prosecutions by the Attorney-General.
Now, he could tell the Noble Lord (perhaps the Noble
Lord was not aware of it) that one of the most fearful
chapters in the several calendars in Ireland was that very
chapter that included those feuds and fights at fairs. Those
Were now disposed of at the Quarter Sessions, instead of
beieg brought to the Assizes. This, then, would account
for a considerable falling off in the calendars.—( Hear.) Let
not, he would say, the Noble Lord suppose that such won-
derful changes had been brought about by the wonder-
working Lord Mulgrave.—( Hear, and cheers from the Op-
position Member.) They all knew perfectly well that a very
influential body of men were then at work in Ireland—they
all knew perfectly well the influence exercised by the Catho-
lic hierarchy and the Catholic priesthood—(hear, hear)—
they all knew, too, of the influence possessed by certain lay-
men, who said a great deal, and had prodigious influence over
the population—( Hear, hear)—they all knew that for certain
purposes, it was easy to produce a temporary calm.—(Hear,
Lear, hear, and cheers from the Opposition Members.) Oh 1
it was a beautiful argument—it was unanswerable quite—to
353', look to the calendars I See, just see, the effects of Lord
Mulgrave's administration in Ireland I See what a diminu-
tion of crime I Don't, oh pray don't disturb such an Admi-
nistration as that.—( Hear, hear, hear, and cheers.) But he
asked the House this question, wou!d not the same influ-
ence that could curb and check also at the proper season
set them loose ?—( Hear, and cheers. )- Had they not seen in-
stances of this ? Had they not even recently been told, if
certain changes had not taken place, that Ireland would be
made the scene for revolution and a bloody rebellion
( Hear, and loud cheers from Opposition Members.) But then
the Noble Lord rejoiced exeeedingly at the putting an end to
the Orange Society.—( Hear, from Ministerial Members.)
That, too, was another blessing that Lord Mulgrave had con-
ferred upon Ireland. Now he was astonished, with the facts
that were within the knowledge of the Noble Lord, that he
should have touched upon such a topic that night —that lie
should have even glanced at it ; for if there were one topic
more than another that could be made the subject of com-
plaint, it was the conduct of his Majesty's Government to
the Protestant population in Ireland, and particularly to
that part of it which had belonged to the Orange Society.
He complained of the conduct of his Majesty's Govern-
ment in reference to that body.—(Cries of " Bear, hear,"
from Opposition Members.) The Noble Lord told them that
the conduct of the leaders of the Orange body, at the time of
its dissolution, covered them with honour. No one could
differ from that opinion. Their leaders had acted in a manner
that was most beneficial and useful, and at once honourable to
themselves, in sanctioning the dissolution of the Orange body.
The complaint against the Orange institution was, not that it
was an illegal body ; it was objected to as an imperium in int-
perio, and it was dissolved. The least then that the Orange-
men could have expected was even-handed justice.—(Hear.)
The dissolution of that body took place—it did so on the mere
intimation of its being the wish of their Sovereign that they
onght to do so. By the simple expression of a desire, at the
senknfe wish of the Sovereign, the Orangemen agreed to a
dissolution of their body ; and immediately up spi ung, under
the eyes of his Majesty's Government in Ireland, another
body, the nee-' Roman Catholic Association.—( Hear, and loud
cheers from the Opposition Members.) It was not, it was
Said, a new Roman: Catholic Association. He knew that
there were Protestants, or those who called themselves Pro-
testants, in it. He knew there were, and more shame for
them.—( Hear, and cheers frosn the Oppositiou Members.) But
still he said that the new body was virtually a Roman Catholic
Association—it was a resuscitation of the old body.—( Cries
of " No, no," from some of the Irish Members.) Why, had
they not the chair of the old Catholic Association brought in
by the Hon. and Learned Gentleman (Mr. O'Connell)
ever the way ; and brought in too by him in triumph ? Had
they not in the new body all'the books, papers, and records of
the Catholic Association ?_(No, no, from Mr. O'Connell.)
Why, he ( Sergeant Jackson) could' produce a resolution to
effect that these documents should be transferred to the
new body. Did the Honourable and Learned Gentleman
deny that the Chair had been brought in in triumph by him-
self ?—( Hear, hear, from Mr. O'Connell.) Did the Hon.
*ad Learned Gentlemanl deny that the Chair was in the room
?—( Hear.)
Mr. O'CONNELL—Not in the least.
kr. Sergeant JACKSON said, thereehat looking at the Mr.
men who took an active part in the proeeeeines—those who
were the foremost in the ranks of that body—the designs they
professed and the acts they did, the new body virtually, though
slot in name, was an absolute revival of the Roman Catholic

Association. The body since then had taken a variety o
names. It was a volunteer society at one time, a registrationf
society at another; it assumed various names at different pe-
riods, but still they, would find the same men constituting the
self-same body. They were all the same, and now he hoped
they would give him leave to state a little of the operations of
that Ronan Catholic Association. Could it be denied that
such a body was at least inconvenient—that it was injurious—
that it was as much calculated to disturb the peace and good
order of society as the. Orange Association had been ?—( Cries
of " No, no," from Irish Members on the Ministerial benches.)
It was probable that those who exclaimed against the one could
not perceive the other to be a grievance. People could see
very well what bore against themselves—they could accu-
rately see whatever they thought was injurious to their own
interests, although they did not so clearly see that what they
themselves did was injurious to others.—(Hear.) What, then,
was this new Catholic Association ? He did not hesitate to
say (and he knew it to be the opinion of several eminent
lawyers), that if there were an illegal Society, it came, in his
opinion, within the Act of 1793, an Act that had been passed
to put down the old Catholic Association, at the time of the
first relaxation of the penal code. The Act of 1793 was only
in affirmance of the common law. Such was the opinion en-
tertained of it by eminent lawyers, and that by its means all
such Societies could be suppressed. Such he believed was the
opinion pronounced by Mr. Wolfe, afterwards Lord Kilwar-
den, by Mr. Chamberlain, and by that eminent lawyer, Sir
Matthew Smith, the Master of the Roils. Their opinions
certainly were, that all such Societies could be put down under
the Act then passed. But if it were not an illegal Society,
and supposing it did not come under the Convention Act, or
the common law, was it not the duty of his Majesty's Go-
vernment to bring in au Act that would put down such a
nuisance as that body was ?—( Hear, and cheers from the
Opposition Members.) Were not its objects illegal ? And
if they were to judge by its acts from day to day, he said it
was a standing permanent conspiracy against the existing
law of the land and the rights of his Maje..ty's subjects,
and particularly of the clergy in Ireland.--( Hear, hear, and
continued cheering from the Opposition Members.) That
Association met from day to day ; they canvassed every trails -
action in Church and State ; they prescribed the measures to
be adopted; they overhauled the Exe'cutive Government, and
they said who should and who should not be appointed ; they
arraigned the Lord Chancellor; they brought him to their bar
..—(Laughter) ; they condemned Lord Plunket for not being
sufficiently accommodating—for not cashiering one magistrate
and not appointing another at their dictation.—( Hear, hear,
and cheers.) But they did more—there were loans made by
them, and contributions wrung from his Majesty's subjects,
and which actually amounted to taxation. Oh but then it
was all voluntary !—( Cheers from the Opposition Members.)
It was all upon the voluntary principle. They who were
acquainted with Ireland knew how perfectly voluntary it was I
But what was the destination of those subscriptions ? What
the objects professed by that Association ? First of all, they
were told that " they must have municipal corporations fur
Ireland ;" that is, such as they prescribed ; secondly, " there
was not to be a mere appropriation clause in a Church Bill"
there was not to be a mere lopping off of redundancies, a
mere dispensing with all such things as were not necessary for
the purposes of the Church and the uses of religion—no; but
"there must be a total abolition of tithes."—( Hear, and
cheers.) This was declared by the Learned Gentleman (Mr.
O'Connell) when he launched his new Association on the 4th
of July, that being the time at which the body commenced its
existence. This was said by the Learned Gentleman, who
was the father, he might almost say grandfather, of that
Association, as he proposed some of his grandchildren as mem-
bers.—(Laughter.) That Learned Gentleman told them in
plain terms that " he never would be content while there was
the slightest inequality between the members of both Churches
in Ireland."--( Hear, hear, and cheers.) " Ought Ireland,"
he asked, " be tranquil while tithes were paid ?—( Hear, hear.)
It ought not to be tranquil, and I promise you it never will
while I live, and while ever a Protestant clergyman has a right
to receive anything from those who differ from him in persua-
sion. As long as thiicontinues Ireland never will be tranquil,
and I never will cease to agitate."—( Hear.) What more did
the Hon. and Learned Gentleman say.? " We must have an
organic change in the House of Lords."—( Hear, hear.)
We must have Parliaments shortened ; nay, more, we must
have vote by ballot."—( Hear, hear.) But then the Noble
Lord told that House, " Oh ! pass this Corporation Bill, and
ste what peace and tranquillity there will be in Ireland."—
( Hear, and cheers from the Opposition Members.) It was
curious to observe the manner in which the Noble Lord had
that night replied to a question put to him a sew evenings be-
fore. The Noble Lord did not like altogether to differ from
a Noble Lord (Viscount Melbourne) in another place, and he
did not like altogether to agree with him.—(Laughter.) It
would not be quite convenient to do the latter, or that ender-
ful support which the Minissry had in the House of Com-
mons—that wonderful majority in that House to which it
seemed they were all to submit—might be in danger, if the
Noble Lord had expressed an entire concurrence with the opi-
nion of Lord Melbourne.—( Hear, and cheers from the Op-
position.) Therefore it was that they heard from the Noble
Lord the curious answer given to a question some time since
put to him. He asked, were they not told, when tho Ca-
tholic Emancipation Bill passed in 1829, that there was then
to be an end to agitation—( Hear, hear)—that they were to
have nothing but peace and tranquillity—( Hear, hear)—and
were they not informed that the Roman Catholic bishops were
for ever to retire frona politics.--( Hear.) It was even said of
the Hon. and Learned Gentleman (Mr. O'Connell), of him
who was the prime mover in the arena of agitation, that he
was to withdraw from the toils and troubles of politics, and
fall back upon his profession, to become for the remainder of
his life a laborious special pleader, or a hard-working equity
draftsman.—( Cheers and laughter from the Opposition Mem-
bers.) How had the promises then made been now fulfilled ?
—Why, every Roman Catholic bishop in Ireland was a mem-
ber of that Association— ( Cheers)—and then they had the
Hon. and Learned Gentleman himself agitating to a degree
unparalleled, he (Mr. Sergeant Jackson) believed, even in his
lifer —( Hear.) He had stated the objects which the Roman
Catholic Association insisted on, What, then, were the
means they took to get rid of tithes ? A portion of the funds
of the Association were given to enable persons to carry on
litigation in the most unparalleled and vexatious manner, and
this to defeat the just claims of the clergy.—( Hear.) He said,
therefore, that, looking at the Association, and judging of it
by its acts, it did appear to him perfectly illegal ; and he
thought no lawyer could otherwise decide, when it was mani-
fest it promoted and fostered a conspiracy to deprive another
of his just rights. If there were no other test by which to judge
of that Association, this alone was sufficient to prove that it was
illegal ; it was a standing, permanent conspiracy against the
law of the land and the rights of the subject.—( Hear, hear, and
cheers from the Opposition Members.) Then what had they
done more in that Association. There was an organization
throughout the country. The lion. and Learned Member pro-
posed the appointment of " pacificators."—( Hear and laughter. )
The Hon. and Learned Gentleman had them under the old
system ; under the old regime they were designated church-
wardens, and they had certain functions to perform for the
Catholic Association. Those persons were not church.
wardens, such as they in that house might understand them
to be, persons who had any thing to do with churches
or chapels ; no, but they were to attend to the divers secular
objects for which the prime mover appointed them. Now,
however, instead of churchwardens, they were, forsooth, desig-
nated " pacificators." Now, let him remark if there were that
profound peace in Ireland—if there be so much of that boasted
tranquillity, what use was there for " pacificators ?"_( Hear,
and cheers from the Opposition Members.) Now what was
the use of these pacificators? They were told it was to bring
forward every man who could do so to register.—( Hear, from
Mr. O'Connell.) Another thing they had to do was to pro-
duce rent for the Association.—( Hear, and cheers from the O-
pposition. ) And he could now tell some of the fruits of their ex-
ertions at registration. He had a letter in that House (and
there was also a Member of Parliament to speak to the facts) as
to what was the manner of effecting the registration of voters
by these pacificators. He appealed to the Hon. Member for
Cavan, who could tell them what was the condition of his
county. There were now armed pat ties going through the
country, visiting houses; and examining the leases, to see whe-
ther those who held them could register—these persons fired
shots, and threatened destruction to those who did not go for-
ward and register.—( Hear.) He had other letters describing
the same facts, but he felt he should be treipassing to an un-
warrantable length upon the House if he were then to read those
documents. But this he told to the Noble Lord that if he
would only favour him with a Committee of Inquiry, he should
undertake, in conjunction with his Hon. and Noble Friends
who took part in the meeting referred to, to p-rove every one
of the allegations then put forward. —( Cheers from the Oppo-
sition.) But then the Noble Lord, forsooth, taunted them
by saying, that here they had let a whole week pass over, and
and they had not yet dared to bring forward one of the
charges they had made elsewhere. Why, they were not in I
so great a burry as the Noble Lord was in bringing forward
his Corporation Bill.—( Cheers from the Opposition Mem-
bers.) He could tell the Noble Lord it was not because they
were afraid—it was not because they were shrinking—it was
not because they had the slightest doubt of the accuracy of the
charges they had made.—( Hear.) He could tell the Noble Lord,
that there would be laid on the table of that House a petition
as respectably and as numerously signed as any petition that
had ever been presented to them. There would, too, be laid
on the table of the other House a petition as numerously and
as respectably signed as any petition ever yet presented to that
House ; and both these petitions would be found to complain
distinctly of his Majesty's Government in Ireland, and they
would also be prepared to prove every allegation that they
made.—( Hear, hear.) W ith respect to the Catholic Associ-
ation, he considered that upon that subject the Noble Lord
had come to a very " lame and impotent conclusion." It was
not in a negative way that his Majesty's Ministers were to be
chargeable as encouraging it. He charged them in the most
positive manner, he asserted distinctly, in giving to that Asso-
ciation their approbation and support.—( Cheers from the Op-
position members.) This appeared by the transferring of an
lion. and Learned Gentleman to the table of the Viceroy.—
( Loud cheers.) It appeared to be a matter of course.—
( Cheers from the Ministerial side of the House.) At the
same time the Hon. Geetlemen opposite need not cheer—he
would undertake to say, that if any Noble Lord or Hon. Gen-
tleman in office at a former period had invited from an Orange
lodge persons to dine, a general outcry would have been
raised against them.—( Hear.) Ile would now conic to a much
more grave matter. He asked the Noble Lord opposite
( Lord Morpeth) whether in his department there had not
been made an appointment to office in Ireland from amongst
the members of the Catholic Association ?—( Loud cheers
from the Tories. )Was it true what he had heard within a very
few days, that an Hon. Gentleman, a friend of his ( Mr. Ser-
geant Jackson's) whom he knew well, and he was certainly not
disposed to speak in any manlier derogatory to him : he was
a Roman Catholic barrister of the greatest respectability, and
of a character perfectly unexceptionable: he was also a mem
leer of the Roman Catholic Association—but was it, he would

ask, right of the Government to appoint him -to an -official
situation ? The individual to whom he alluded was Mr. Pigott,
who had been apy stinted to succeed Mr. Maziere Brady as law
adviser to the Secretary for Ireland.—( Loud cheers.)
Lord MORPETH—I will give the Hon. and Learned Ser-
geant's question an immediate answer. I do not know whether
the appointment has yet actually taken place; but it is cer-
tainly intended.--( Loud cheers from the Ministerial side of
the House. )
Mr. Sergeant JACK SON would not hesitate to say—
(Cries of " Order I" and some interruption)—he would not
hesitate to say, that though he respected the individual in his
private character, though he was a gentleman of high station
in his p.ofes:sion, he would say, with the very greatest respect
towards that individual, that it was utterly unbecoming—he
was going to say indecent—but it was an improper, a most im-
proper, proceeding on the part of his Majesty's Government
in Ireland to appoint a member of the Roman Catholic Asso-
ciation to an office of this sort.—( Loud cheers from the Oppo-
sition benches.) It was one of the most important offices con-
nected with the administration of the law, and with the peace
of the country. It was the department through which the
entire correspondence with the magistracy of Ireland passed.
If a collision took place in the assertion of a tithe claim—if a
call were made for the intervention of the constabulary—if a
call were made for the military, he was the person to be
consulted as to the propriety of the interference of either
the police or the military.—( Cheers.) Yes, they must con-
sult this very individual, and he would ask the Noble Lord
(Morpeth), particularly when he recollected that there
should be a perfect coincidence of opinion between Lord
Mulgrave and Lord Morpeth, and the Attorney-General and
the Solicitor-General, and, lastly, the law adviser of the
Crown---( Loud cheers)—there should be a perfect coin-
cidence of opinion—( Renewed cheers)--did the Noble Lord
(Morpeth) think that Lord Mulgrave was of opinion that it
was right and proper to obstruct the King's subjects, even
though they were Protestant Clergymen, in the recovery of
their rights ? ( Loud cheers.) Did the Noble Lord think
that Lord Mulgrave was of opinion that it was right and proper
to establish a fund for the purpose of rendering litigation
vexatious and intolerable to those wno maintained their legal
claims ? Did the Noble Lord himself concur in this opinion ?
He (Mr. Jackson) thought he had a right to say that these
were the opinions of the Learned Gentleman who would be
found to be the law adviser of the Government in all these
cases. That gentleman had subscribed to the fund that went
to the relief of Reilly, who was imprisoned for resisting the
claims of the Clergy. Did the Noble Lord think that the
Protestants of Ireland were fools, or that they could imagine
that they would have justice administered ? Did he think
they would imagine'ser expect justice when the very partisan
who had combined to resist. the legal claims of the Church was
de facto the most responsible Minister of the Crown ?—(Loud
cheers.) Let not the Noble Lord suppose that he (Mr.
Jackson) was a candidate for the office.—(A laugh.) The
world and its contents would not bribe him to take part .in the
administration of the affairs of Ireland under the present
Government.—(Loud cheers and laughter.) He assured
the house he had not the least desire that way. But there
was a first Sergeant—he ( Mr. Jackson) was only the second—
there was the first Sergeant, a gentleman who had never been
embroiled in politics, who was of tire utmost eminence—
he meant Mr. Richard Wilson Greene. There was not a
better lawyer or a man of more unexceptionable character—
he had kept aloof front politics and had never been in Parlia-
ment. This man was passed over. There was then the third
Sergeant, on whom that law appointment had been be-
stowed by Government—he meant Mr. Sergeant Ball.—
( Hear. )—He was naturally the person who might expect
promotion, and if Mr. Gre etc were passed over, Mr. Ba:I,
who was appointed Sergeant by the present Government,
was naturally the person who should be cal cd to fill the
office of Solicitor-General. Than Mr. 13,,11 no man was more
( min nt in his profession ; ha was of the first rank, and of
most unexceptionable charaCter.—( Loud cheers. )--He (Mr.
J..ckson) had never heard an allegation against him. He was
likewise a Roman Catholic, so that there could be no objec-
tion to him on that ground.—(Cheers.)—He would say so.
lemnly and sincerely, " God forbid that a Roman Catholic who
was fit for the office, and who was .of a respectable charac-
ter, should not be appointed to office just as soon as a Pro-
testant."—( Cheers.)—But he would again ask what was the
ordinary course of promotion ? Ho referred the question to
the Solicitor-General ; but the fact here was that Mr. Ball
was passed over, and Mr. Maziere Brady' a gentleman, he
would undertake to say, who had never addressed a jury as
a leading counsel, was made Solicitor-General. And why
was Mr. Brady passed over the heads of all the bar? It was
to make this vacancy for this member of the Roman Catholic
Association.—( Loud cheers from the Tories.) Was this all?
Did the appointment stop here? He would again ask the
Noble Lord (Morpeth) had he not caused the commission of
the peace to be issued to members, and prominent members,
of the association ?—(Cheers. ) They were told last Session
what he supposed was now forgotten, that nothing of influence,
no political views, should interfere with any appointment—that
every thing should be perfectly impartial. The impartiality,
he was sorry to say, was all on one side ; it was a sort of
Irish impartiality.—( A laugh.) He would now ask the
Noble Lord whether he thought that he (Mr. Jackson) would
be able to support his bill of indictment against the Govern-
ment ?—(Loud cheers from the Tories.) He would un-
detrake to show, as distinctly as arty case was ever proved,
tire abuse of the patronage and the prerogative
of the Crown.—( Loud cheers from the same quarter.)
Justice to Ireland I it was a mere outcry to swell the power of
oae individual. Oh I that they could enforce justice to Ire-
lend I They called for the reformation of corporations. He
wished they could reform one corporation that existed in Ire-
laud—he meant the Roman Catholic hierarchy.—( Hear.) It
was not a municipal corporation, but it arts to all intents and
purposes a perpetual succession independent and under self-
control, and it would never rest—they would find that it would
never rest satisfied till they had pulled down the English
Church in Ireland, building their own on its ruins, and abolish-
ing the Church altogether on that side of the Channel._
( Hear, hear, and a laughs from the Ministerial benches. )—But
he begged leave to ask, did the matter stop here ? Was it
only the magistrates of the rural districts that were assailed ?
He woted ask, had not a gentleman of the name of Tighe been
appointed to the place of Assistant Barrister ? Would the
Noble Lord do him the favour to answer this question ?
Lord MORPET lI—No such place has been vacant since

I left Ireland, and consequently no such appointment can have
taken place.
Mr. Sergeant JACK SON now begged leave to come to
another and more important matter. The Noble Lord oppo-
site ( Lord John Russell) had called them a miserable mono-
polising minority—( Loud cheers from the Ministerial benches),
and that a miserable monopolising minority made all these false
charges against the Governmeat.—( Renewed cheers from the
Ministerial benches.) They had charged his Majesty's Go-
vernment with an abuse of the privilege of mercy. Ho
pledged himself to establish the charge.—( Load cheers from
the Tories.) First of all, he would ask how were the Judges of
the country treated? He had heard them in that House assailed
in a most indecorous, he was going to say indecent, manner.
—( Hear, hear.) He had heard them arraigned—men of the
utmost eminence, and who were entitled to rank with the
judges of any law or of any country—he had heard them ar-
raigned because they had done their duty, by giving effect to
the process of the courts.—(Hear, hear, hear, and cheers.)
They had been called political partisans, and these charges
%era made by officers of the Crown ; and he had heard, and he
had seen with astonishment, the Ministers of the Crown seated
and hearing patiently, without one of them getting up to
vindicate the Judges of the land, and to shield them from
attack in their absence. Some of them even went so far as

to join in the attack.—( Hear, bear.) One of them was the
case of a riot of a very formidable description, in which Roman
Catholics and Protestants were both engaged, the Roman
Catholics being the aggressors.--(A cry from one of the
Ministerial benches "Of course.") He did not say of course.
Cheers.) He was stating the facts of the case, and he
would prove the facts as he stated them. He had the highest
authority for them, and he pledged himself to prove them.—
( Cheers.) The Roman Catholics were the aggressors ; an
indictment was preferred, and a cross indictment, so that both
parties were indicted ; they were indicted for riot, for an
aggravated assault, and for a common assault. The case
went to the Jury, and they convicted the Roman Catholics of
riot and aggravated assault, and convicted the Protestants
of a common assault, and that, too, of a very mitigated
nature. The Judge, who was the Chief Baron, sentenced
the Protestants to three months' imprisonment, and the Roman
Catholics to six months' imprisonment. It had always lwen
an established rule that in all cases the opinions of the
Judges should be asked before the Executive exercised
the prerogative of mercy. There was an established ferns,
which would be found lithographed in the Chief Secretary's
office. Was any inquiry made in this case of the Chief Baron ?
or was he asked to report the nature of the evidence on which
they were convicted, or the relative guilt of the parties ? No
such thing. He thought that an English House of Conmsons
would be astonished when he told them that the first intima-
tion that the Learned and eminent Judge had of the sentence
being dispensed with was from the publication of a newspaper.
—( Hear, hear.) He then saw a letter written by the lady of
Lord Mulgrave to the wife of one of the party, stating that
" she had conferred with Lord Mulgrave, and that he was of
opinion that as the guilt was the same, so ought the punish-
ment to be ;" and his Lordship had therefore directed that
when the Protestants were discharged the Roman Catholics
should be discharged at the same tine.—( A cry of " Oh, oh I"
from the Ministerial benches.) Did the Noble Lord opposite
mean to c mtradict this statement ? Would any gentleman com-
petent to contradict it do so ? Would any member of the Go-
vernment say that this was not the fact ? If they did he would
join issue, and tell them that he could prove the fact.—
( Cheers, and from Lord Morpeth—" It occurred last year.")
Last year I What did the Noble Lord mean by saying it oc-
curred last year? Was it according to the Noble Lord's rub)
of reasoning, that a thing wrong in itself became right be-
cause it was done last year ?—( A laugh.) lie had another
instance, which came from another tribunal. It was a matter
that took place at an election for Newry, where an elector was
kidnapped, and prevented from exorcising the elective fran-
chise. lie was made drunk, and before he could recover his
senses, he was conveyed ten miles out of town ; he was detained
fur a week, being conveyed from one barn to another, having
a sentry of five men over him by day and three by night. Hi,
wife and family were distracted, they Linked for him every
where ; an indictment was preferred against some of the kid-
napping party for assault and false imprisonment, the most
satisfactory conviction took place, there was not even an at-
tempt to deny the facts, they were admitted by the party, and
the Court of Quarter Sessions passed sentence of eight months
imprisonment. What was done then ? Was the Learned Bar-
rister called upon to report the facts of the case ? lie never
heard a word on the subject until he found that the prisoners
had been discharged.—( Hear.) Lord Mulgrave, as was well
known, set out on a tour—( A laugh)—what the object was he
did not know—probably popularity. lie knocked open sill the
prison-doors ; he went to a great number of the counties of