The Sun.
London, England, 1839-11-22 00:00:00

IiVENING EDITION.

mour, by sending somebody to look into our concerns ;
but it is an idle resolution of the House of Commons,
and a vain and foolish attempt by the Government of
Great Britain. Nothing will be done ; they will not re-
ceive your corn or timber. Don't waste your time, then
in fruitless negociation." Now how are these people to
be answered ? Do you mean that the present state of
things shall continue ?--(" No, no.") With these facts,
so obvious, so palpable, so irresistible, it does seem to me
that ye ought not to lose this occasion of making a
strong and energetic appeal--an appeal which I be-
lieve will represent the interests of the whole commu-
nity—(Hear)—and, in my experience of human
.
affikrs, he who has truth in his hand, and energy in
his heart, never fails to accomplish the object and to
reach the end of his efforts.—(Loud applause.) Dr.
Bowring resumed his seat, having spoken upwards of
an hour.

Mr. HOLLAND HOOLE, said, that, in consequence of
Lis having the honour to be the vice-president of the
Chamber, it had devolved upon him to propose a vote
of thanks to Dr. Bowring, for the very eloquent ad-
dress and communication which they had just received.
He would only occupy two or three minutes in ad-
verting to this suFect, which so deeply interested
their attention, and involved their interest. He ought
to state to them, that there had been very great neg-
lect on the part of the Government of this country, in
not attending to this subject at a much earlier period.
—( Hear)—for this subject had been brought before
them in 1833, to which fact he could bear his
personal testimony. In April, 1883, he was in London,
with Mr. Kirkman Finlay, and the late Mr. John
Douglas ; and while in their company, and engaged
with them in the transaction of certain business, in
which they were mutually interested, he (Mr. Hook)
received a letter from one of the most intelligent and
rsspectable merchants in Germany—a letter which was
now before him—announcing the great progress then
making in the attempt by Prussia to form this League,
and to extend it to all tile surrounding states of Ger-
many. He laid that letter before his colleagues ; and
Mr. K. Finlay, with his usual shrewdness, said, " That
is a very imiportant communication ; I think you had better
go with it at once to the Board of Trade, and call the
immediate attention of the Government to it." Ac-
cordingly they All three went to the Board of Trade,
and laid the letter before them, and Mr. Finlay urged
upon them the necessity of paying attention to it. Tney
were received, he must say, with very considerable
indifference ; and the result was, that little or nothing
had been done. He should not have ventured to ad-
vert to this fact, but for one particular circumstance.
Last year Mr. Douglas, being iriManchester, sent him
a note, saving he wished to see him. They had had
almost naintercourse since April, 1833 ; and when he
(Mr. Hook) went to Mr. Douglas's office, he said—
' " Mr. Hook, do you remember receiving'a letter from
your commercial friend at Hamburg, which we laid be-
fore the Board of Trade, and the indifference with
which we were received ?" He answered that he did ;
and Mr. Douglas added, " You see, all that was fore-
told has come to pass ; and what between the Prussian
League and our Corn-laws, our trade is in a state of
ruin." He (Mr. Iloole) thought, therefore, that it was
due to those who saw what was coming upon them, and
the progress that was making in this exclusive system,
to show, that that subject had long ago been taken up
with all the energy they could command. He con
eluded by moving with pleasure—
" That the grateful thanks of the Chamber be pre-
sented to Dr. Bowring, for the promptitude with which
he accepted the invitation of the Directors, and for the
interesting and valuable communication which he has
now made to this meeting."

Mr. LEOPOLD REISS-said he had great pleasure in
secoodin,? the vote of thanks to Dr. Bowring for the
very valuable and interesting communication he had
made to the Chamber. He (Mr. Reiss) had been en-
gaged all his life in the export of British manufactures
to the countries comprised within:the German League ;
and he could bear ample testimony to the very great
diminution, if not destruction, of this trade. The on'y
articles, in his experience, that were still imported into
these countries, were worsted goods, manufactured in
the neighbourhood of Bradford ; but the other Bri-
tish manufactures which found their way to those
countries were very inconsiderable, consisting of a
few articles of peculiar and difficult manufacture.
The difficulty of which, however, he had not the
least doubt that the German manufactures would
overcome in a very short time.—(Hear.) So little
was it possible to pay the high duties that were
levied on British manufactures by the Prussian
tariff, that, in the house in which he was a partner they
were obliged, when this tariff came into force, to return
a large quantity of British goods from Germany to this
country, which they had been in the habit of selling
with great facility,—a circumstance attended with great
loss ; as there was not only the expense incurred of
sending them to Germany and back, but also, being
goods provided expressly for the German trade, they
had to be disposed of in this country at a great sacrifice.
If they wanted further proof of the effects of this com-
mercial union, let them look at the German houses
which had been in the habit of buying British manu-
factured goods. What were they doing now ? They
would see many of them consigning their goods to
foreign markets, or forming establishments there; others
were agents, to buy goods for any country from which
they could get orders ; even some might be seen getting
goods up for English home consumption—(Hear)—
while others were connected with the spinning, or manu-
facturing, or printing Cif cottons, so that, instead of
being purchasers, they were now producers. And yet
he would repeat, that if matters were placed on a more
favourable system, Germany would still consume vast
quantities of British goods. He could further add,
that British goods were imported, not only by the German
merchants,but by the consumers themselves. The German
trade offered to us another advantage, which should not be
lost sight of. It was not liable to those disastrous fluc-
tuations toovhich many of our important commercial
relations with other countries were subject.—(Hear,
hear.) There were in Germany a number of wealthy
merchants ready to take up the trade at any moment.
He wished, therefore, that this long-neglected subject,
now that it had attracted the attention of the British
commercial community, should not be allowed to rest
till it was settled on such a liberal and permanent prin-
ciple as would, doubtless, prove mutually beneficial to
both England and Germany.—( Loud applause.)
The CHAIRMAN, in putting the resolution, said it
would perhaps be agreeable to gentlemen present to give
some expression to their sentiments in reference to the
interesting communication given by Dr. Bowring. He
had assured them, from the highest authority, that they
now had the means of negotiating a commercial inter-
course with Germany ; and as they were assembled,
he,tls-Ought that they would not wish to separate with-
out expressing some opinion upon that communication.
Dr. Bowring would be very happy to hear any facts
which any gentleman present might be able to furnish
upon the trade of Germany. They had already heard
some interesting ones from Mr. Reiss, and other gentle-
men present might be able to afford more. The reso-
lution was then put from the chair, and passed unani-
mously with loud applause.
Dr. BtwaiNo, in acknowledging the vote, said, in
thanking you for this great mark of your kindnesss,
and assuring you how delighted I shall be in being en-
abled to give expression to your opinion, I may add,
that I forgot to state, that I am at this moment en-
gaged in writing for the Government a report, which I
believe it is inteit4eill to publish, in which I shall collect
in greater detai , d in a more regular and precise
manner than it is possible to do in an extemporaneous
speech, a 'limber of interesting facts bearing upon this
great quesiron. I have brought from Germany various
specimens of the state of their manufacturing industry,
wjaich I dare say will have some interest for gentlemen
Prfeat, as they will show on what exceedingly cheap
conditions goods are there produced, and what the sort
of rivalry is with which you are now competing.

Mr. Alderman COBDEN said he had a resolution,
which he thought it expedient to offer to the chamber,
expressive of a general feeling of interest in the trade
with Germany.—He believed there would also be an-
ther resolution submitted to the meeting expressive of
its approval of the general principles of free trade. He
Would move—

" That this meeting having heard with the deepest
interest the able address just delivered by Dr. Bowring,
upon the subjeot of our commercial relations to the
States composing the German League, earnestly invites
public attention to the incontrovertible evidence thus
afforded, that the Governments and people of Germany
are desirous of exchanging their productions for the
commoditios of this country ; proving from undoubted
I authority, that we are prevented solely by our own re-
strictive laws from embracing the manifold advantages
thus offered to us. Whilst this meeting is of opinion
that the welfare of both the capitalists and labourers
composing the manufacturing community imperatively
calls for the removal of all legislative restraints upon
the trade of the country, and earnestly desires the abo-
lition or modification of theimport duties on the pro-
ductions of Germany ; and that a liberal commercial
intercourse may be established with a people, whose in-
poe;:eualitar Britain.'ly adapt
s.itutions, common oriqin, and character,.
them to become the friends and of
He need scarcely trouble them with any remarks after
the address they had heard from Dr. Bowring but it
any gentlemen present felt that the evidence. which Dr.
Bowring had presented,
.necessarily restriceted. as it had
been by the almost official character of his position,
was at all deficient,—that there was still wan wanting some
evidence in addition to his, that the Germans were
anxious to trade with us, and were willing to modify their
tariff the moment we modified ours,-110 heldl in his
hand that evidence. In Mr. Poulett Thomson 'a speech
upon Mr. Villiers's motion respecting the repeal of the
' Corn-laws, in which he broke through the usual tram-
mels of office, and, much to his honour, brought from the
board of trade, and read to the House of Commons a
letter which he had received from Mr. Macgregor, who
Lite Dr. Bowring had been sent to Germany—Mr.
Thomson, in that speech, said,—
" But some time ago, a gentleman, Mr. M'Gregor, was
sent to Germany, to inquire into the condition of the I
German League ; and I have with me letters I have
received from him, bearing on the subject now before

the House, and which I will read. This is dated in
1836 :—.

" lam perpetually told, that England must reduce
her own tariff before she can reasonably expect Ger-
many to do so.'
" And in reply to Mr. Nl‘Gregor, the Foreign Minis-
ter for Wurtemburg thus expresses himself :
" lam opposed to anything like particular protec-
tions given to any branch of industry, being convinced
that such protection is a general tax on the community.
We have few articles besides coarse linens and natural
produce, as corn, and cattle, and probably some of she
wool which we send by the Neckar and Rhine to Hol-
land, that would find their way to your markets at re-
duced duties ; but settle the preliminaries of a commer-
cial treaty with Prussia, and I presume there will not
be much difficulty in Wurtemburg adhering to it.'
" I will read another extract in relation to our com-
merce with Prussia :
" M. Kuchne, the Prussian Commissionary, is a gen-
tleman of intelligent views, and seems fully to compre-
hend the importance of a commercial treaty with Eng-
land, but argues our Corn-laws are the supreme ob-
stacle. He is at the same time said to be the most
slilful Member of the Congress."
" And again

,6; Baron Smit, the Wurtembur,g Minister at the Ba-
varian Court, the protector of the Germanic Union,
tells me, that he can discover no objection whatever in
meeting the views of foreign states, to a reasonable
extent, in reducing the high duties in the Germanic
tariff, provided that such states will act with something
like reciprocity towards Germany ; but he also contends
that the British tariff ranges much higher than the
German tariff, as 20 to 30 per cent., compared to 10
per cent., and on linens, and every article from Ger-
many, as wood, corn, and some other natural produce,
much higher."
" On the 14th July, M. Kuchne said :
" If any arrangement be entered into, you must begin
at Berlin, and a reduction of your corn duties to a fixed
rate must be preliminary to any understanding as to a
reduction on our part of duties on your commodities. I
alluded to the proposed reduction of the duty on timber,
and such as would probably be made on some other
ar-
ticles, as linens, Nuremberg wares, mineral water, &c. ;
but he took his stand upon corn, saying the other re-
ductions were but of little consequence.' "
So you see (continued Mr. Cobden) that, probably for
the first time in the history of our commercial legisla-
tion, the country has been fairly appealed to ; and these
facts almost from official authority, have been submitted
to the knowledge of the commercial community. But I
don't think that these evidences were required to prove
to us, that Prussia or Germany in general would be
anxious to trade with us. It is quite as much to her
interest to trade with us, as it is to our interest to trade
with her. Of the twenty-six millions, nearly of people
comprised within the German league, Dr. Bowring will
bear me out in saying, that seventeen millions are almost
purely interested in agriculture alone. Their Govern-
ment is not under the sway of a powerful aristocracy.
The feudal system is no more in Germany ; their
Governments, though nominally despotic, are under the
enlightened influence of an educated people ; and it is
their interests and will be their practice, to adopt liberal
commercial relations with you the moment that you
will permit them. Then, it appears to me, that as to
what Dr. Bowring has said, as to the feelings on the
part of Germans, that we cannot trade with them ; that
we are in the hands of a power that will not suffer us to

trade with them, and that, therefore, they will not tr
with us ; this is a most humiliating position for such
a community as that of England, which is looked
on with some respect abroad ; and it does become a
question, whether we shall not increase that humilia-
tion, unless we take some decided steps, and show a
degree of self-respect that shall justify the nations of
the Continent in saying, " This is not a nation that
will continue to deal-with us unjustly." Now, the re-
peal of the Corn-laws would be easier now than pro-
bably at any past time, or than is likely in future.
Singularly enough, the evils of the Corn-laws are mani-
festing themselves in every possible phase of mischiev-
ousness and complexity. You :have now for the first
time the great capitalists, the merchants, and the ma-
nufacturers of the country, all severely afflicted by this
one great evil ; you have the banking establishments,
and even the great Bank of the country, induced to
turn the battering-ram of their power against this evil ;
for they too are most :seriously afflicted by it. Then
the shop-keepers in the rural districts, after two years
of short crops and corn at 70s. a quarter, although
they still trade with you for fustians and cottons, can
only sell two-thirds of what they could when wheat
was 503. a quarter. They are beginning to feel, for the
first time, that the Corn-laws are robbing them ; and
I believe, I may say that Government is in favour of
the repeal of the Corn-laws, and that if they saw the
people in favour of that, Government would commit
themselves to a decided step. Such being your po-
sition, having the Government, the capitalists, the banks,
and the shop-keeping classes with you ; having now, to
a great degree, the labouring classes with you, for I
saw only yesterday, by the papers, that the whole of
the trades of Sheffield had had a meeting, and had de-
termined on the adoption of the question of the repeal
of the Corn-laws in the Trades Unions, setting it aside
from politics, and making it a question which the
trades should agitate till they obtained the repeal.
You have with you every class but the landlord class,
and their deluded slaves the larmers. Then, it appears
to me, that the course is clear, and that it behoves these

capitalists, and more particularly the manufacturers,
to make some efforts to inform the public opinion, to
take the lead in this great question, to marshal all
these forces for the next meeting of Parliament. How
has every social change, how has every religious
change, been accomplished, but by the parties appeal-
ing to the public intelligence, and by agitating for a
public expression of opinion ? What gained the penny
postage, the first-fruits of which are this day an-
nounced? It was accomplished, not by sitting still, and
quietly wishing for it, but by a number of men stepping
out, spending their money, giving their time, agi-
tating the community, and thus inducing a million of
signatures. And think you, that the repeal of the
Corn-laws will be carried by our sitting still at home,
and lamenting over its evils ? I appeal to you as a
matter of duty, as well as of interest ; not as a matter
of politics, for we know no political parties here—
( Hear, hear)—and I believe that, on the Exchange,
Tory, Whig, and Radical get the same prices for their
yarns. I appeal to you, as fathers of families, and I
ask you, if what Dr. Bowring has told us be true—that
unless our Corn-laws are modified, instead of our sending
60,000 or 70,000 cwt. of twist to Germany (half our
whole export of twist), that market will be shut for
ever against this country—what will be the position of
your families and your dependents ? It becomes you,
therefore, to make a present sacrifice—to subscribe from
your remaining funds for the agitation of a repeal of the
Corn-laws ; and, unless you do that, you are deserving
the ruin which the Corn-laws will bring upon you.
Mr. Alderman ROBERTS seconded the motion, which
passed unanimously.
THOMAS BAZLEY, jun., Esq., Boroughreeve of Sal-
ford, said—Mr. President, I have great pleasure in pro-
posing for your adoption the following resolution, which
is peculiarly in accordance with my own feelings and
opinions :
" That this meeting regards the present as the pro-
per occasion for reiterating its adherence to the opinion
so often declared by this Chamber, that the prosperity,
peace, and happiness of the people of this and other
nations can be alone promoted by the adoption of those
just principles of trade, which shall secure to all the
right of a free interchange of their respective produc-
tions ; and this meeting, on behalf of the great commu-
nity whose interests it represents, feels especially called
upon to declare its disapprobation of all those restric-
tive laws which, whether intended for the protection of
the manufacturing or agricultural classes, must, in so
far as they are operative, be injurious to the rest of the
nation, unjust to the world at large, and in direct hosti-
lity to the beneficent designs of Providence."
You have been pleased to appeal to me as the chief
municipal officer of the adjoining town, and perhaps
you will permit me to state, in my official capacity, that
if I entertain any fear for the safety and security of
persons and property within my jurisdiction—my ap-
prehensions are entirely founded upon our commer-
cial embarrassments, and upon the consequent depri-
vation to the poor of labour and of food. Sir, I feel
that I have the honour of speaking of the inhabitants
of a borough, loyal to their sovereign and obedient to
our laws, and on whose good sense I rely to prevent
disturbance in any extremity ; and on their behalf, I
would, as a conservator of peace and order, pray our
Legislature to give efficiency to the civil power by en-
abling the industrious freely to exchange their produc-
tions for the requisite comforts of life whenever they
can obtain them. I prefer, however, taking the liberty,
Sir, of addressingyou in support of this motion, in my
more appropriate character of a cotton-spinner ; and
as such, I will state those facts which the nature of
my business enables me to substantiate. On several
occasions, said Mr. Bazley, when, for the purpose of
making mechanical alterations and improvements in our
spinning machinery, we have caused inquiries to be
made respecting men who had previously offered their
services, we have learned that the talented artists in
question had taken their labour and skill to foreign
markets. Only yesterday, Sir, a competitor of celebrity
informed me, that he had very recently obtained a sample
of No. 230's cotton yarn, spun upon the Continent, of a
quality equal to his own. Sir, should I be asked if
our labour may not be taken to foreign markets, and
if cotton yarns may not be spun in other countries, most
certainly would I say yes ; but Sir, allow me to state my
humble opinion, that if we may accept in return for our
manufactures, such productions as other countries can
give us, we then could profitably employ our labour at
home, and render it the interest of our present distant
opponents to minister to our wants, whilst we supply
We theirs. have not too many shoulders in the land
to share in the burthens of the State. We have not
too many consumers and customers at home, that
we need drive our industrious workmen far away.
In my hand, Sir, I hold a letter from a friend, who, un-
able to combat difficulties at home, having lost his patri-
in a spinning concern, has been obliged to leave
mony

Mr. SAMUEL STOCKS congratulated the meeting on
the very able, moderate, and correct observations made
by his friend, Mr. Gardiner, because he agreed with
him, that this measure was considered out of doors to
be in the hands of a political party, and that certain
Members, very influential in their position, kept away
from that room on such grounds. He had asked a
friend to come with him, and the reply was, " No ;
you have become a political party, and I'll have no-
thing in the world to do with you." It was no matter
whether they as free traders grappled with certain
questions—men would be Tories or Whigs, whether
we would let them or not ; and some would be Radi-
cals, and others Chartists. But in this cause he agreed
with Mr. Gardner, they ought to be united one and
all. It was known that his (Mr. Stock's) trade
was intimately connected with foreigners ; he believed
that the products of more than 3,000 looms passed
through his hands every week, for foreign markets ex-
clusively ; and upon the common grounds of justice
he claimed for the people with whom he was connected,
the workpeople,
an equal right to protection by the
authority of the State with those who were connected
with the agricultural interests. The only interest these
workpeople had in the agricultural interests of the
country was to be their customers and they were good
customers because they got good wages ; but if a
stranger could read such speeches as that of the Duke
of Buckingham, the other day, he would naturally
conclude that all who were in any way connected with
the land, literally and positively fed and supported the
entire community of England, Scotland, and Ireland.
the Corn-laws to re-
mainplrfospurciehty waenrde
wthiesdcoamse,orwaellocwoiunlgd conceive the great
fact. The fact is that a very large proportion of the
country is maintained by the manufacturers, who fur-
nish to the extent of from 50 to 60 millions a year of

Extract of a letter from Sunderland, dated 16th
Nov. :—" The visit of the Duke of Sussex and the
Earl of Durham to this place has caused great ceiaster_
nation amongst the Tories ; the principal one, bow-
ever, tried hard to laugh away his feelings by marching
first in the procession, and then begging to be intro-
duced to the exalted men he had so leng abused. Every
body was disgusted, and the City Alderman's cause
grows weaker every day."