The Sun.
London, England, 1839-07-02 00:00:00

Lord BROUGHAM said that no doubt they
were placed in a difficult state of affairs.
For his part be was against the principle of the
Bill. He had protested, and still did protest against
the principle of the measure. However, as something
decisive must be done, he should vote for the second
reading of the Bill. And he would advise his Noble
Friend to state his objections to those clauses which he
opposed specifically to-morrow in the Committee. The
Noble Marquis had stated the objects of the measure
he brought forward in a very able and becoming speech.
He (Lord B.) was opposed to the principle of sus-
pending any Constitution, whether it were the Consti-
tution of .Tamaiea or of Canada ; but the objection of
the Noble Earl seemed to be entirely of an insular cha-
racter, for he did not care about the violation of the
Constitution of Canada, although he would not hear of
the violation of that of Jamaica. This, however, might
be accounted for by the fact of his Lordship being a
Jamaica man.—(Laughter.) He would advise his
Noble Friend to reserve his objections for the Com-
mittee.
The Duke of WELLINGTON said he was
placed in a singular position in this House, having op-
posed the Bill for the Emancipation of the Negroes,
and he believed he divided the House upon it. But
from that day to this he had done all in his power to
assist their Lordships in carrying the measure into
execution, since their Lordships had passed the measure
notwitstanding his opposition, though he confessed it
always gave him great pain to vote with the Noble
Lord opposite. It was his opinion, however, that the
House of Assembly should be conciliated by the Impe-
rial Parliament instead of being opposed by them. He
had no knowledge whatever of the measure which caused
the existing difference between the House of Assembly
and the Government. He thought the House of As-
sembly should have been treated with greater attention
and couresy, but he thought at the same time that the
House of Assembly had acted wrong in refusing to per-
form their duties. He confess the speech of the Noble
Marquis had filled him with great doubt, for it said in
as many words, that it was his intention to destroy the
House of Assembly. (Hear, hear.) He should,
though with great pain, vote for the second reading.
Property could not exist•there or anywhere else with-
out a certain degree of political power, and they might
depend upon it that if they destroyed the House of
Assembly of that island they must withdraw the white
population.—(Hear, hear.) Ile wished the Bill to go
into Committee, in order that it might receive those
ant, nthnents which would make it palatable to the
Heusi: of Assembly. It was the duty of those who
were high in authority to conciliate—( Hear, hear)—
to give the House of Assembly a chance of acting as
they wished by. treating them with civility and kindness.
He was sorry that his Noble Friend had moved the
second reading of the Bill this day three months, be-
cause he wished the House to go into Committee on
the 1111, to consider its clauses, and make those amend-
ments which their Lordships might think proper, with
the view of sending it to the other House in such a
shape that it might eventually go out to the island of
Jamaica with the hope and prospect of success.
Lord GLENELG wished briefly to explain to the
Noble Duke the course pursued with respect to the
Prisons Bill. During the years 1836 and 1837 the
greatest complaints were made by Lord Sligo and Sir
Lionel Smith respecting the abuses which prevailed
in the workhouses and the goals in Jamaica, and also
the discontinuance of certain allowances and various
other particulars : but the most galling and revolting of
ell were abuses in the workhouses and goals. The
House of Assembly were called on by Lord Sligo and
Sir Lionel Smith to investigate the subject, and it was
pressed on the House during 1836 and 1837, and
finally brought before this House in 1888. The Noble
and Learned Lord near him (Brougham) in the course
of his eloquent speech on the subject of slavery, ad-
verted to these abuses, alluding particularly to the
workhouse system, and he established beyond doubt
that it was the duty of Parliament to interfere and put
a stop to these atrocities.—(Hear, hear.) He (Lord
G.) was called on to state what the Government were
prepared to do on that evening, and he said he could
not but admit that the time was at length arrived
when Parliament might interpose in its strength and
majesty to repress atrocities equally revolting to policy,
to justice, and to the common feelings of humanity.—
(Hoar, hear.) As the House of Assembly had not
remedied these, he (Lord G.) said that he was prepared
to bring in a Bill for the express purpose of remedying
all these abuses, and especially those in the prisons and
workhouses of Jamaica.—(Hear, hear.) A tem-
porary Abolition Act was passed. but a per-
menent measure was necessary, and he (Lord Glenelg)
said that he would bring it in as soon as the Report of
Captain Pringle should be made. He (Lord G.) be.
lieved the Abolition Act and the Prison Act to be es-
sentially the same. if the Abolition Act was a justis
Liable act, on the same ground was the Prison Act—
(Hear, hear)—and this House, in acceding to the tem-
porary Act, recognised the principle of the Prisons '
Bill. The Noble Lord opposite said that an Act of
1834 was passed by the House of Assembly.—(Hear,
hear.) That Act, in its general regulations, was unex-
ceptionable ; but it had one fatal sin—it had the para-
lysis of non-execution—(Hear, hear)—and he stated
to the Governor his general approbation of the princi-
ples of the Act, but pointed out the defect. To return
to the temporary Act—the Abolition Amendment Act
passed early last Session, and in that Act there were
some powerful and stringent enactments respecting
persons. The Prisons Bill only made permanent that
which the temporary Act kid made for a time, and
therefore it could not fairly be said that the Prisons
Bid was passed rapidly through the House, without its
knowledge and sanction, for he brought it in in pursu-
ance of the pledge which he had given to the House,
and it was passed without observation, except from
one Noble Lord opposite._( Hear, hear.) He merely
wished to set their Lordships- right as to the
opinion that it was a new measure, passed without the
apprOprabation of the House, and in ignorance. It
had hccn said that the Bill was promulgated in the
West Indies in a very peculiar manner, but he should
Suppose that it was proclaimed in the usual manner, for
in the debates, some of which were as warm as the tro-
pical climate could supply—(A laugh)—he did not see
any complaint of the want of courtesy on the part of the
local Government. He had felt it his duty to make
these observations merely to set the House right with
respect
to the proceedings which had taken place on
the Prisons Bill.
Earl ST. VINCENT said that the Noble Lord
had waited for the Report of Captain Pringle before he
had introduced the Prisons Bill. It appeared most un-
questionable that these prisons were not to be recor-
structed until he had made his Report, and this offered
some justification of what the Noble Lord had set forth
as to the neglect of the House of Assembly in regard to
the correction of these evils. He was very ready to
admit that the prisons in that country were not calcu-
lated for the state of society which was about to com-
mence, but how many prisons were there in this country
which had been in a most disgraceful state up to a very
recent period. The Noble Lord was not justified in
inflicting so strong a stigma as he had upon the House
of Assembly of Jamaica. The principle of the Bill was
bad. lie had a strong objection to interfering with
estehrshed rights, more especially when a few kind
words would have sufficed to have induced the Assem-
bly to resume their functions. It was not his intention
to divide the House against the secoad reading of the
Bill, but he thought that the second clause was most
objectionable. With regard to the Prisons Bill, one
fact was most extraordinary, that although it was a
Tax Bill, it should receive the initiative in their Lord-
ships' House ; and the other House, which was so jea-
lous of its own privileges, should not show any attention
to it.

Lord GLENELG explained.
The Earl of HARE WOOD would not press his
amendment to a division ; but at the same time, he
would state that if the objectionable clauses, more par-
ticularly' the second clause, were not remodelled in
Committee, he should certainly oppose it ; but he trusted
that it would come out of Committee in such a state as
would not force on him the necessity of opposing it.
Viscount MELBOURNE under those circum-
stances, thought it would be more expedient to defer
the debate, at the same time, he must say, that he
thought the Noble Duke had, in his observations,
treated his Noble Friend with great injustice. He
could not perceive any thing like the violence, the in-
justice, or the insult which the Noble Duke had at-
tributed to the speech of his Noble Friend. He
had not expressed any anxiety that the House of As-
sembly Lhould be suspended ; but could his Noble
Friend with any consistency express any anxiety that
the House of Assembly should continue to exercise its
functions?—(Hear, hear.) The present measure had
been forced upon the Government by the con-
duct of Parliament ; it was a course of action that
they were of opinion would not be successful, and he
was of opinion that they would ultimately be obliged to
adopt that measure which they had now rejected. But
the experiment should have a full and fair trial, and if
the house of Assembly should, which he did not expect,
be disposed to resume their functions, and to perform
their duties, they would find every disposition on
the part; of the Government to do all that might
induce them to continue in their prudent course, to
c irry out the great measure of negro emancipation ; but
the course to be pursued must be determined by the
conduct of the Assembly itself, which, he trusted, would
do justice to itself, to the country, and to the colony.
The Ni:oble Lord under the gallery had expressed his
surprise that the House of Commons should have passed
the Prison Bills of last year without observation. He
was surprised that the objection had not struck the
Noble Lord himself last year.
Earl BT. VINCENT—I was not in the House.
Viscount MELBOURNE—If the Noble Lord does
not attend to his Parliamentary duties, he was not
answerable for that. But the Noble Duke thought
that Bill was an usurpation on the House of Assem-
bly. How was it that this did not strike him last year ?
The Noble Duke was attending to the be siness of the
House to the end of the ,Session, and he was extremely
surprised that Can that occasion he had not stated his
c,iiiiitoh on the subject. He would reserve what ho