The Sun.
London, England, 1839-07-30 00:00:00

CRIME IN IRELAND

Lord BROUGHAM said that as some doubt
seemed to have been entertained as to whether he
should proceed next Tuesday or not with the motion of
motionly should refer, about
he had now no
hesitation
which he had given notice, he thought it right now to state
that, upon considering tile matt2r, and after having con-
versed with a numberofNobl4eoLoorrdssouppeagneis o
t,afn. dthtlendlitncg
tla..
p hcsirtlea't\o:si that he should undoubtedly bring
foingi o
n Tuesday next. He also wished
orrvttvatt
r h
o e:
hisehi i‘ncvno

I attestqd by Adam Elliott, tie Missionary who had
converted, and the signatures specified the names, resi-
dences, and callings of each of the persons signing, and

stances of the age, and time had, by increasing the
intelligence, and consequently increasing the excitement
nd aspirations of that class of people, made it quit(
impossible that they should remain in the condition in
which they had previously subsisted without danger.
If any one suspected him of revolutionary principles,
or of rashness in adopting this motion, he would appeal
to the whole course of his life, to his known principles
0f loyalty, to the situations of trust be had held
ender the Crown, to his time of life and disposition, to
protect him from so injurious a suspicion. In conse-
quence of the great difficulties connected with the con-
sideration of this. question, he had selected this
period of the Session for making his motion, and al-
though it might appear paradoxical, yet he would avow
it was not his expectation—it was not his wish that the
measure should be carried into a law and completed
this Session. His main object was to call the atten
tion of the House to the subject, and his desire would
be accomplished if he were permitted to lay the Bill
on the table of • the House, and have it
printed for future consideration. He proposed to
confine the operation of the measure in the first
instance England, because he thong lit it could be
tried with greater safety in that part of the United
Kingdom. He hoped that would be a sufficient excuse
to those Gentlemen who represented Scotland and Ire-
iaad for his not extending it to their countries. lie
would now state the object and details of his proposed
measure. His first object was that the people should
be enabled to livid meetings without riots, tumult,
and disorder, and tending to secure to those who
were not qualified by property to vote in the
election of Members of Parliament—not a right, of vot-
ing—not Universal Suffrage, nor Household Suffrage,
hut something which he hoped would satisfy the public
and produce that good, looked for by sonic, from more
extensive and sweeping measures, namely, an influence
in the election of Members of Parliament. The tight
of petition and the right of meeting to frame pe-
titions, was already established and recognised as
an undoubted part of the most valuable rights of
the people. So late as Lord George Gordon's
riots there was an attempt by the then Chief Justice
of the Court of King's Bench to put a restriction on
the right of petitioning, and of assembling for the pur-
pose of petitioning, resting on the antiquated statute of
the 13th of Charles 11. But it was unneccessary
him (Sir Charles)' to state how that attempt
was met by that House, and in particular
by Mr. Dinning. The practice of petitioning and
meeting had since universally prevailed, and no
lirn't whatever could be put to the number of per-
sons who might meet for the purpose of petitioning,
or who might sign the petition they wished to present.
What he wished to propose was, tnat instead of meet-
ings occasionally taking place in a disorderly and tu-
multuous manner, there should be stated periods at
which it would be known the people would assemble ;
that there should
me
o be stated
that is places,atn i anadonesuocfh sub..
divisions of
should there be overwhelming numbers or sects
as were likely to lead to confusion or tumult.
It had been said recently by the Secretary of State tor.
the Home Department that although the right of meet-
ing was unquestioned there existed considerable doubt
an illegal meeting.
nleogaoln:crriterion nothing well
demarcation separating'legal from an
defined,
The
eo
flsa•
nta
otwlconstitutedains
etiol there
red ewma
illegal matting, if it were held lor the purpose of peti-
tioning, and the Only way of deciding. was to infer from
the conduct pursued by the
reallyrdw
intentionseecries decision
parties what their intentions
couldthere.npsaurct hie sa qbfrueoemrsittitoltenheediune before a Jury for
tthhee
hoet
difficulty c)uldty in d ebduutetinlge
mischief was that instead of heir).* drawennbyucatJ;ury after
due deliberations, these deductions had to -be drawn on
the spot, in a moment, and by persons not always the
best qualified for the exercise of a cool judgment. Fre"'
these circumstances it must be admitted that this right
valuable as it was, had occasionally produced mischief

HOUSE OF COMMONS, JULY 29. .
SHANNON NAVIGATION.
Mr. ELLIS wished to ask a quest;on of the Chan-
dis°tinictltyheg
cellor of the Exchequer with respect to the Shan-
non Navigation
non
abvreinngointigceupofthheis Re-
portdtermination to take the sense of the House ow
the third reading, and he was promised papers on the
subject, but a course had been taken with respect to it
that was unworthy of the station the Right Hon. Gentle-
man held in his situation in that House.--( Hear.) That
Bill had been smuggled through the House at two o'clock
on Saturday morning.—( Cries of " Order.") He begged
to know why such an unworthy course bad been taken.— 1
(Cries of " Order.")
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER would
not take the slightest notice of what had fallen from . T the
Hon. Gentleman. His vituperation he would passi ludebrf in
papers perfect silence. With respect to the
tl him they
by the Hon. Gentltman, he had never o
hear.)
would be laid on the table of the House.—(Hear,
reverse—he
had told him quite the ,
would
On the contrary he
General Burgoyne
had told him that a letter froth
it was impre,per to lay
be put into tirs onnes,
c,f the House.
So far as regarded the
either it or the other pavers on the table
Bill distinct notice had been given,
that the Bill was to pass
was d'-tin,tly understood •
and it .:, .
.ht Tae Hon. Member, there.
• g that nig .
the third remit')
fore, had himself to t l hank for what had taken place, because
if he had been in his
c what he complained
of would
1) ac ,
not have occurred.
Mr.ELLIS rose amid loud cries of Order I and Chair!
He was surprised to hear the Chaneelh,r of the Exchequer
state that he would pass by with
contempt what he had
statcd.
11,3 believed the rule of the House was,
that w 1 Icre .
measures were opposed, notice was given
0 Honourable Members who intended to oppose
them of their being forwarded a stage. What was
the course that had been pursued with respect to the Bill?
Why at two o'clock in the morning, without Any notice
whatever, the Bill had been read a third tinieitird_passed.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said