The Sun.
London, England, 1830-01-18 00:00:00

DEVON COUNTY TITHE MEETING.

(From the Western Times.)
CASTLE or emus., FRIDAY, eau. 15.
This long anticipated meeting of the freeholders of this
county took place this day. About half past 11 o'clock,
the doors of the Nisi Prins Court were thrown open, and
long before 12 the Hall was densely crowded. The High
Sheriff, Sir H. P. Davis, Bart., took the chair. Befere
the Under-Sheriff could proceed to read the Requisition
the numbers outside the Hall had so far increased, that the
call for an adjournment to the Castle yard became too cla-
morous to be resisted. The Hen. Mr. Fettowxs said
that if there were but fifty who could not hear the debate,
he should be anxious for an adjournment. The Iligh
Sheriff yielded to the call, and the meeting adjourned to
the open air. A waggon had been previously provided as
a hustings, on which the Sheriff and a number of gentle-
men took their station. There were assembled according
to the best of our judgment above 2000 persons, and the
meeting continually increased, to that the adjournment was
absolutely necessaryt
We are well assured from information from different
parte of the county, that had the language of the Requisi-
tion been more strongly worded, aiming at a gradual par-
tial abolition of tithes, the number of freeholders who
would have attended the meeting, 'mould not only have
been too numerous for the Hall, but would hale filled our
large Castle yard. The feeling on this important subject
is deep and strong in the agriculturists of this great county,
and, under the direction of any confidential leader, they
would boldly follow him to measures, which weuld lite-
rally disarm the title of radical.
Mr. CAREW, the Under-sheriff, read the following re-
quisition, which he stated was signed by upwards of eleven
hundred payers and receivers of Tithes.
" To the High Sheriff of the County of Devon.
" We the undersigned, Inhabitants of the Comity of
Devon, being all either Payers or Receivers of Tithes, Re-
quest that you will convene a County Meeting, to consider
the propriety of petitioning the Legislature to take into
their deliberations the present state of the Tithe Laws, and
to make such arrangements for a better mode of pry seat
of tithes, as shall appear, after the most mature investiga-
tion, to be fair, and just to all parties interested therein.
The Urroxft-Snrerer read a letter he had received from
Mr. Bastard, one of the Members for the county, which
stated, that be was prevented attending the county Meet-
ing, as Mrs. Bastard was near her confinement, (The
reading of this letter excited some merriment among the
audience, and some jokes at the expense of the Honuor-
able Member.
The Hon. New Tow FuLtowas then same forward and
addressed the meeting
He said before he entered en the important question
for which the present meeting was convened, he must take
occasion, in the name of those who signed the requisition
to the High Sheriff, to thank him for having given them
the means of addressing Parliament, by convening the
meeting of to-day. It was the usual course for persona
who addressed a meeting to begin with an introduction,
and to end with the motion which he intended to make,
but would now be as he often was, a little out of order,
and in order tlAt there might be no mistake, he would now
beg leave to with reading the petition, in the first
place, which he intended in conclusion to move for the
adoption of the in •eting. The Hon. Gentletnau then real
the following petition sq.—.
To the Right Hon. the Lords Spiritual and Temporal o
Great Britain and Ireland, in Parliament es,etelded.
The bumble petition of the undersigned inliabitente of

tie &minty of Divan, being all either lando
payers or receivers of tithes—
Sheweth,

That your petitioners presume to address your Right
Honourable House, under the firmest conviction that the
existing Tithe Laws are highly injurious to the beet inte-
rests of society, both in a religious anti political point of
view—

That they are injurious to Religion, because they are
(as dilly experience evinces,) a cause of the most violent
and inveterate disputes, and of destroying thlt harmony
and confidence which ever ought to exist between the
pastor and his congregation, and of engendering the worst
feelings where the best alone should prevail.
That the Tithe Laws are most injurious to tiro_, intetests
of agriculture, as they are often an absolute bar to im-
provement, and are at all times moat dittouraging to the
farmer, as by their operation l'v it placed in a worse and
different situation than any other speculator, since by em-
barking his capital in agricultural pursuits, he becomes
liable to have the tenth part of his capital taken from him
by the tithe-holder, who, withoat capital, labotar, or risk,
frequently derives considerable profit, in iota:lces where
the cultivator himself is a loser.

That the influence of the Tythe Laws is most preju-
dicial to the interests of society, by deterring persons
possessed of unemployed means, from using those oleans
is reclaiming and improving poor lands, an ellVrtt Of the
greatest importance to the public, as the 'result of their
so doing would be an increase of eniployment for the
labourer and mechanic, atonsequtat diminution of pauper-
ism, the production of a greater quantity of corn, which
*would in a certain degree render our dependence on
Foreign grain unnecessary, and produce a more extensive
demand for our manufacture in the home market.

That since Tythes were originally estaqished, all pro-
perty has undergone material changes, and particularly
agricultural, by the operation of these laws, and in con-
sequence of an increase of public burthens within these 30
years, coupled with other circumstances, the inconveniences
of them have been rapidly accumulating.
That your 'petitioners have also to complain that dis-
putes respecting the payment of Tythes, Mt determined in
a Court, constituted in a manner peculiar to itself, and
withont the constitutional intervention of a Jury.

That your Petitioners ask for no innovations on the
principles of the British Constitution, nor for any unfair
or improper sacrifice from any piny, most humbly pray
that your Honourable House will, at an early period of
this Session of Parliament, as the business of the nation
wilt allow, take into its most serious consideration
the present state of the Tythe Laws, and the effects now
resulting from them ; also the changes which have oc-
eurred since they were framed, and that after a strict and
mature investigation of the question, in all its relative
bearings, it will be pleased to adopt such measures, and
make such arrangeraents as shall appear to your Right
Honourable House to be consistent with juslice to the
Payers and Receivers of Tythes, and most beneficial to the
general interests cf religion and those of the community at
large.

After what I have now read to you, I think you wil
not accuse me of being willing to deprive any of the bene•
fits of his property, or to abolish any property, with-
out doing justice to all ; and if, after I have gone into
some detail, into which I must go, however tedious,
I trust you will also do me the justice to
believe that I advocate the common good of all.
In the first place, then, I must tell you that I am a
considerable tithe holder myself, and am closely con-
nected with persons who are still greater titheholders, and
therefore I am anxious for the just settlement of this
question; but some would say that this is an improper
time to agitate this question, and that it is a mere con-
sequence of the Catholic Relief Bill.—(Applause.)
I agree with you, and I only mention this, bec iuse that
if the argument be worth any thing, it is in my favour,
as now the Catholic. Relief Bill is passed, we have lei-
sure to attend to the present question. But I will ask,
when can we here abetter time? Some persons will
say, that the present is never the right time for discussion
of grievances. I consider the present always the best
time for reform, and this is particularly the time for the
discussion of the tithe question. As the Bishop at the
last visitation told his clergy that a Bill would be brought
into Parliament for an alteration in the tithe laws, we
therefore thought ao time was to be lost in calling a
meeting. The clergy cannot complain that they are
taken by surprise, as they appear to know more of the
matter than we do. If this he not the right time—if
you are not sufficiently distressed—will you wait till
yon are in greater difficulties, and till distress shall pre-
vent your tilling the ground at all, and when the irn-
r".”‘'"'"'
r''- to liuror". ---" ---
~
cultivated,' nu the titheholder of his t. utk.. HA-
together. I have been thirty years in this county,
eighteen years of which I was in Parliament, but nei-
ther here nor there hare I ever heard this question dis-
enseed. Why it should have so long slept, I cannot
tell; and I see no reason why it should sleep any
longer. I am told I am holding out false hopes to the
country ; I do no such thing, I only request the Legisla-
ture to consider the subject, proposing no particular mode
of alteration, but reserving to ourselves the right Of peti-
tioninh against it ; all we want is discussion ; let each
men think for himself. The difficulties of au alteration
of the laws are objected as a reason for not meddling with
them, and because Mr. Pitt, alter investigating the sub-
ject, admitted that it could not be done. That great Mi-
nister, unfortunately for the country, is now dead, and
another, a less able Minister, has beea able to pass the
Catholic Relief Bill, which the great Mr. Pitt found also
beyond his abilities. It is said that the distresses are not
occasioned by the tithes. I admit it ; but one part of the
property of the country is very much injured by the tithes,
and land is affected by it, by grievances not applicable to
any other species of property, in being subject to tithes,
by which a portion of the property is, as it were, trans-
ferred to a stranger. All other payments are in money ;
but tithes have this peculiar property—that the tithe-
holder may choose to be paid either in money or in kind.
Whatever disputes arise between the parties, reference is
made to the Ecclesiastical Cow ts, where, without the in-
tervention of a Jury, a Judge generally presides, who has
not been bred to the Law, and who is most frequently
chosen because he happens to be a very good divine.—
(Here the Hon. Speaker was interrupted by frequent ap-
plause, and by cries of " It's the Inquisition." " Relics of
Popery, &c.") The farmer may plough, if he chooses, he
may expend what labour and what capital he will on his
land, but he is forced to enter into a partnership with the
tithe-holder, who is a sort of sleeping-paitner. A sleep-
ing-partner indeed he is, for be contributes neither mind,
body, or capital, to the concern ; though he comes in re-
gularly enough to take his share of the profits, only one
little tenth—moderate enough !—( Laughter and applause.)
—He has no share in the difficulties, he has none in the
risk. But then, I do the saine.—( Loud cheering.)—l am
as bad as the rest of them. But suppose I, or any other
wise partner should say to the farmer, I am hungry,
Plough; and the farmer shoidd say, I won't plough.—
You know we can't force him. Again it is objected,
that a commutation is impracticable, because you cannot
please every body. I grant it—but do you not know that
nothing is so common as an Inclosure Bill, and with that
Bill have all parties been pleased. And yet can any one
'fame a single Inclosure Bill, in which the Clergyman
and Landowner, were not each benefited. In
ease of a dispute between the clergyman and the
farmer, where the clergyman takes his tithes in kind, he
has no power to compel the farmer to plough that he may
have his tithes—and I remember a case in Hampshire, at
Lamport, near Andover, where a gentleman was the
owner of the whole parish, and on account of a quarrel,
he took the whole of the parish in, and threw it out of
cultivation, and I well remember that, as a boy, I caught
many a hare oa the property, but found nothing that was
titheable except the thistle,. The evil effects of the sys-
tem on the growth of timber, and on coppice woods, is
not the least part of the evil. A friend of mine in the
north of Devon has a large timber estate, yet he will not
emit his coppice, in anticipation that the present unjust
law must be altered ; and yet the timber is going back,
and he is losing the interest on his money ; and so both lie
and the titheholder are suffering a loss. One word more,
if farmers are in debt they will be unable, by extra labour,
while the prevent tithe system exists, to get out of debt.
It cannot be done, because the titheholder comes and takes
the principal part, and sometimes all the extra labour.
There was no tax in Ireland on the growth of tobaccco.
In Enniscorty the farmers took advantao of this, and
planted tobacco; they paid my brother, who was their
landlord, 401. per acre, and as it was an -uncertain crop,
the titheholder took 61. per acre, and still they netted
1001. per acre by the crop; and paid off their debts;
but in consequence of the tithe laws, they have not
since thought proper to renew so desirable a culture.
One word more, on a point I had almost omitted, but
which has just been suggested to me by my Hon. Friend.
I meant to allude to an Act of Parliament applicable to
Ireland only, and I will read the preamble of that Act to
you, as that Act may be, for aught I know, quoted as a
precedentora tha.present occasion. The Act of Parlia-
ment is the 4th Geo. V. cap. 99, and it recites that—
,' " Whereas i:ariona
,ciretOpstances relating to the agricul-
ture and population Of I lid, and whal does not apply
to GreaVPritithii: 4
reattel— 't peculiarly expedient that for
i-1
the purpoik„ofifurtliiir couraging the industry and en-
terprise of others, far, ' and occupiers of land, and ma-

tiering the incomes arising frOm tithes there more certaii,
in amount, and more eaty of collection, and of avoiding
controversies respecting the same, provision should be
made nr the authorising compositions to be made for
tithes in Ireland only to endure for a tittle to be limited."
That Act cannot apply to England, from the difference in
the nature of l',Mantcy. In England the tenants hold
for sariatis lengths of time. In Ireland they almost al
hold for 31 years or one life. Mr. Fellows concluded
his speech, by moving that the petition be bad read be
adopted by the meeting.
In ceMjni forward to second the petition, C. P.
I-1.0,.1.4.14, Esq. said, he could not but entertain some ap-
prehension, lest the share he had had in calling the meet-
ing might subject him to the imputation of hiving acted
with presumption; but as however it was proved, the,
there were, at least, 1,100 persons in the county who
were ankions that it Should be called, he trusted, that he
should not only obtain pardon for what he had already
done, but also for presuming, as he was about to do, to
enter upon the discussion of a question, which we were
lately told by an Hon. Magistrate who attended at our
preliminary meeting, and sign'ed the requisition, had
proved too mighty rOr the greatest men the country ever
produttl this was certainly a most discouraging consi-
deration; but as the Hon. Magistrate, in the further
course of his remark, went on to state a particular griev-
ance, in which his interests bed been implicated, and also
admitted, that the tithe laws, in their present state, were
fraught with evils, he felt his drooping courage revive, as
the very moderate share of common sense which is the
utmost he ever pretended to lay claim to, whispered, that
if admitted evils existed in any part of our laws or cus-
toms, it would be a bitter libel on our Constitu-
tion to say for a moment, that reform was im-
possible. They had always been hitherto ingeni-
ously persuaded that uothing could be done, and
coesequently nothing had ever been attempted;
but he hoped that the effects of this meeting
Would be felt; that justice and reason would
prevail ; and that it would at last be proved that some- '
thing could be done. But to return to the point. —The
origin of the tithes in this country is a little obscure; it is
believed to have been in or about 697, but it does not ap-
pear that any laws were made for enforcing their payment
until about 797, when On, King of Mercia, granted the
I tithes of his kingdom to the Clergy, and this was con-
firmed
by Ethelwolf, about the middle of the 9th century.
That the tithes were obta;ned by an arttul priesthood,
working upon the superstitious fears of an unenlightened
people, may fairly be presumed, as it is related by Spel-
man, that amongst other methods resorted to, in order to
induce the people to pay their tithes, a Capitulary was
made in the Synod of Frankfort, in 704, that in the
famine which had recently taken place the ears of corn
were found to contain no seed, the infernal spirits having
devoured all, and that those spirits had been heard to re-
reproach the people with not having paid their tithes.—
About the middle of the ninth century Ethelwolf
further confirmed the grant to the clergy, and the
infernal spirits never said any more about the mat-
ter that he had ever heard. So much for the origin
of tithes. He now came to the manner in which
they were directed to be divided and applied. Black-
stone, and others, tell us, that at the first establish-
meat of parochial clergy, the tithes of the parish were dis-
tributed in a four-fold division, one for the use of the
bishop, one for maintaining the fabric of the church, one
for the use of the poor, and the other for the officiating
clergyman. Afterwards three divisions were alone made
and it will be found that the division was required to be
made before witnesses; and by 15th of Richd. IL, cap. 6,
a portion of the tithes was directed to be appropriated to
the use of the poor; and this Statute is confirmed in
the strongest terms by 4th Hen. IV., in the year 1402.
It seems, says Blackstone, in observing on those Acts, the
people were frequently sufferers by the withholding of
those alms fur which, among other purposes, the payment
of tithes was oriainally imposed. Ile should now shortly
call their attention to what he had every reason to believe
was the state of the country when tithes were obtained,
and indeed for centuries after. According to the best in-
formation he had been able to procure, it was certainly in
a most wild and uncultivated state; the inclusures
which had taken place only within the last two cen-
turies bore him out in saying, that at the institution of
tithes, farming consisted in little beyond merely turning
up the soil and scattering the seed in the rudest manner;
the strongest land, and that which required the least
trouble in cultivating, was selected, and after having been
once cropped, was left quiet until it recovered of itself'.
Land was plenty enough, and personal labour of little
value. .Artificial crops, awl artificial modes of culture by
ssaers-,&.r - 'Ass; - gt oven, 2like
lteveu Vlat a great neat of the corn was imported. The
cattle also partook of the wild nature of the soil and times,
and the new Leicester sheep were, he took it, unknown. I
What proportion a tenth of the produce of the land then
bore to a tenth of the land in its present state, he should in
some degree leave for their private consideration; but that
the evils and burthens of the tithe laws had been more
severely felt since the increase of taxation and the system
of agriculture had been completely altered, was indisput-
able, and he did not think he could pursue a more effec-
tual method of proving this than by calling their attention
to some of the calculations of a late Rev. and Learned
Doctor, who was a most zealous friend to the tithe sys-
tem in all branches, anti who entertained great fears
that -his Reverend Brothers were not sufficiently alive
to their own interests. Dr. Bearblock, in one of his cal-
culations, as he understood it, certainly went pretty fir as
he calculates the Tythes, as he was disposed to take them,
at 2,000,000 more titan Mr. Pitt in 1798 calculated the
whole rental of the kingdom ; and he differs but very little
from one made by Mr. Colquhoun, in 1815 ; but in jus-
tice to the memory of the Rev. Doctor, lie was called upon
to say, that in another calculation lie states that any sum
not exceeding one-third of the rent would he a reasonable
composition ; or, that in the event of land being given in
lieu of tythes, the tythe-owner would be justly entitled to
3331 out of every 1000 acres in the kingdom, only one-
third of the land in the kingdom. All this without one
word about the poor, and the repair of the fabric of the
Church. Why, with what contempt this Rev. Doctor
must have regarded the stupid management of the tithe-
holders in the earlier ages, who were content with only
at first one-fourth of their tithes ; but lie hoped the Doctor
had the candour to recollect, that possibly, stupid as the
Barons and people were in those days, they might
possibly have objected to the measure which would
have taken one-third of the land at a blew. It
was too much to attempt it at once, it was therefore left fur
after ages to do; but although the Rev. Doctor and him-
self could not agree, yet he was obliged to him for his cal-
culations, as they afforded the strongest argument that
could be adduced in favour of the absolute necessity of a
reform and alteration in the existing tithe laws; fur he
grieved to say, that the calculations lie had alluded to, ex-
cessive as they might at first sight appear, would, on a mi-
nute investigation, be found more correct than might be
supposed, whilst the tithe laws remained in their present
state. Indeed the titheholders' claims are indefinite, and
in seasons like the present, he is almost the only person
who gets any thing, the landlord might lose his rent and
the farmer the profit his toils ought to make, but still the
tithe owner gets his tithes, and is sire of them as long as
the land is cultivated at all. He did not pretend to say
hut that they had now continual instances presented to their
view, of the clergy snaking reductions in their demands,
nd much to their hononr it was that they did so, but

still, the power to refuse reductions was in their hands.
The landlord was a different affair, he must reduce, be-
cause the rent could not be paid, and lie had a perma-
nent interest in the laud, and it was bad policy
to take all the tenant possessed. The titheholeder's
was a very different case.—Bat to return to Doctor
Bearblock and his calculation, there were two points
that he ceuld not perceive, the learned Doctor bad
at all touched upon ; perhaps they escaped his recollection,
he meant the manner in which tithes were originally dis-
tributeil, and the capital now necessary to be invested in
carrying on a farm: Most likely, as his business was only
with the produce raised by the investment of that capital,
he left the other calculation to a gentleman they all knew.
That the land in many instances, was little more than the
mere vehicle by which crops were produced, but that by
extra manuring, and other methods not dreamt of in 856,
or even in 1402, such lands will be made to produce
tolerable crops, but mark the consequence,—•the Tithe-
owner claims and takes, not the tenth of the value of the
land, but the tenth of the capital expended upon it.—
Suppose:a man purchases an estate for 5,0001. and ex-
pends 5,0001. more in the improvements, the tithe-holder
takes tithe of the 5,000/. expended, and the farmer's
only consolation is, being told, you know it must be so;
but the question is, ought it to be so? But they all
know that attempts at improving lands often failed,
and the improvers frequently sustained a very
great loss instead of gaining profit ; still the tithe-
holder, without having incurred the slightest risk or
trouble, obtains his ends. Suppose the improvement and
putting in the crop, occasioned an expence of 100/, and
that the crop, after harvesting, does not turn out to be

worth more than 601., the titheholder gets 61., while the
person who had► taken the risk and trouble loses 44/.
Suppose the crop worth 1101. the titheholder take..
111., and the farmer loses 11. But suppose the crop
should pay 201. per cent., and tura out worth 120/., the
farmer gets but 81., whilst the titheholder gets 121., two

pound.' more than half the profit; thus the farmer is
placed in a different and worse situation than any other
speculator whateVer. The late Archdeacon Paley ihost
justly observed, in his " Essay upon Moral Philosophy"
But, secondly, agriculture is discouraged by every
constitution of landed property which lets in those who
have no concern in the improvement, to a participation of
the profit. This objection is applicable to all such cus-
toms of manners as subject the proprietor, upon the death
of the lord or tenant, or the alienation of the estate, to a
fine apportioned to the improved value of the land. But
of all institutions which are in this way adverse to cultiva-
tion and improvement, none is so noxious as that of tithes.
A claimant here enters into the produce who contributed no
assistance whatever to the production. When years, perhaps,
of care and toil have matured an improvemeut ; when the
husbandman sees new crops ripening to his skill and indur.-
try; the moment he is ready to put his sickle to the grain,
he finds himself compelled to divide his harvest With a
stranger. Tithes are a tat not only upon industry, but
upon that industry which feeds mankind ; upon that
species of exertion which it is the aim of all wi.e laws to
cherish and promote.' But before he proceeded any further
lie wished particularly to claim the attention of those pre-
sent who might happen to be renters of land, because Ile
was aware that attempts had been made, in order to induce
them to believe, that in the event of any alteration in the
Tithe Laws, the landlords alone would reap the benefit ;
but he should think no reasonable or calculating man could
be so misled. Suppose a man should take no estate, upon
which the amount of tithe was certain, and suppose by an
error in judgment he pays, fur an estate worth 1001.,
1101. per annum. Now the farmer makes extra exertions
and lays out an extra sum of money to make up the defi-
ciency, and the land will produce, perhaps 20 bushels per
acre, by extra labour and manure, at an out-lay of
40s. per acre additional, and in return the farmer
may perhaps raise five bushel,' more per acre, which at'
10s. per bushel gives, after deducting the out-lay of 40s.
an extra profit of 10s. per acre. The titleholder takes
only half the profit of his extra capital. But if the lank.'
were tithe free, and a real rent charge or fined money
commutation were paid, the firmer would then derive the
whole benefit of the 10s. per acre for his extra capital, and
this improvement would be very much encouraged. They
would also bear in recollection, that out of every 101. paid
for labour, one pound is paid for the titheholder. "It is
labour" says Mr. Locke, in his Essay on Civil Govern-
ment," which puts the greatest part of the value upon
land, witl.out wh'sit it would be scarcely worth anything.
It is to that we owe the greatest part of all its useful pro-
ducts, for all t hat the produce of an acre of wheat is more
worth than the produce of an acre of as good land which
lies waste, is the effect of labour. Nature and the earth
furnish only the almost worthless materials, as in them-
selves." The titheholder takes not only a tenth of the
produce of the land, but also a tenth of all capital ex-
pended on land, and of all improvements. To take
an example—a farmer, for the purpose of improving
his breed of sheep, hires a ram for the season at 401.,
50/. 601.—this is capital sunk, and the whole return will
be in lambs, which are titheable ; now suppose his lambs
in consequence improve in value 10s. each, the titheholder
takes every tenth lamb, and so takes one•tenth of the ca-
pital expended, with its improvement. In many instances
the same things may be said to be twice tithed ; for
instance, hay is tithed, and the 10th taken, still the milk
of the cows fed upon the remaining nine parts is tithed ;
the same as to turnips. The tenth lamb is taken, still
the wool of the remaining nine is tithed, And corn is
twice tithed : it is tithed when first harvested but in tith-
ing the crop produced from it, no allowance is made for
the quantity sown. In some parishes the composition is
entered into upon the gross, that is, outgoing rate, and the
consequence is, that on the event of an expensive law suit
with another parish, an increase of poor-rates or other
burthens, an increase of tithe is demanded ; the farmer is
told that be must raise three rents off the land, to pay his
way, but whether he can rise it off the land, or is obliged
to pay from his private profits, still the tithe-holder's
demands are the same. Indeed the less be gets in this
instance, the more he must pay. The effects of the
tithing system are moat prejudicial to the interests
of trade, as well as to the agriculturists, as there are vast
quantities of land that would pay for cultivating, if it was
not for the demands of the tithe-holler ; and capital would
be employed in cultivating lands of this description, in the
same manner as in any other trade or speculation. The
natural consequence would be, that a great encrease of em-
ployment would be provided for our labourers and mecha-
nics, and there would necessarily be a greater demand for
our manufacturers. He would only trouble them with one
calculation more ; a most excellent system had been lady
adopted, and was getting very e.-esteral, that of giving
small portions of Waste 11.112 to enable them
to raise crops of potatoes, Sze, for their own use ; be advo-
cated this system and thought the greatest benefits were
likely to result from it, in a variety of ways ; but if some
alterations in the tithe laws were not.effected the plan would
fail. To prove this, he would just read a statement and
calculation, made by a man perfectly competent, and who
was a practical man, and perfectly understood the question,
Suppose a labourer was given an acre of uninclosed land
with permission to inclose and cultivate it,—the
following would, he believed, be found a pretty ac-
curate statement of the expellee and profits :—lt
has been denied that the tithe system does pre-
vent the cultivation of unenclosed land ;—the fact is,
that the tithe-holder receives all the benefit from the
bringing into tillage of uncultivated lands, as will be
seen from the following statements,—so that the letting
out of small portions of land to the poor, of an acre each,
according to the plan called " Cottage Economy," is be-
neficial, not to the poor cottager, but to the tithe-holder.
Land, when enclosed and brought into cultivation, is
tilled the first year into wheat, and the next to barley ; or
the first year to potatoes, and the next to barley. On an
enumeration of both methods, the tithe-holder alone is the
gainer, and the farmer gains nothing, or is actually a
loser, without taking into the account any thing for rent,
or the heavy burthen of taxation he must bear. Ex-
penses of tilling an acre of wheat, in an acre of unen-
closed land.
Pairing and burning £1 10 0
35 Bushels of lime at Is. 6d. per bushel 2 12 6
Preparing Lime 0 6 0
Ploughing .... 0 8 0
Hacking in 0 12 0
Seed
Weeding 0 1 0
Reaping and Liquor
Saving

6 14 6

Value of the crop, average IS bushels per acre,
at 9s. per bushel—less by Is. per bushel ex-
pences of carrying to market and sale 7 4 0
Deduct expences 6 14 6

Return
Tithe-holder takes tenth of value of crop, 71. 4s 0 14 4

Leaving the farmer out pocket 0 4 10

This lose the farmer hopes to make up by his barley
crop, now therefore take the Expences of Putting in an
Acre of Barley (second year's tillage) :
Ploughing three times 1 1-- 0
Dragging, rolling, and sowing
Seed
Weeding 0 1 0
Cutting
Gathering, binding, &c 0 3 6
Carrying
Reed, and thatching
Thrashing and winnowing 0 13 0

Total expences

Value of crop, average 25 bushels, at 4s. per
bushel 5 0 0
Straw not allowed for, because not allowed to be sold
or carried off the land.
Deduct Tithe on value of crop, 51 0 10 0

Net 'Return
3 16 0
Deduct expen ces

Leaving a profit on Barley crop of 0 11 0
Deduct loss on Wheat on Ist year's crop 0 4 10

Leaving a profit on the two years' crop of only 0 9 2
and this without any allowance for rent, taxes, or risks,
which is not as much as the outlay would have made at
simple interest.

EPn: _ces of Planting an Acre of uuenclosed Land with
Potatoesxe

Paring and Burning
Ploughing . ........................................ 0 15 0
Dragging and rolling
Planting ............................................
Healing
Digging
Manure and carriage
Seed

12 11 2
Total expense

..15 0 0
.. 1 10 0

Value of crop, at average of 100 bags at Bs.
per hag
Tithe, 10 bags, at 3s. per bag

13 10 0
.
Deduct eipences 12 11 2

Gain to farmer
Gain on second or Barley crop as before 0 14 0

Leaving a profit on the two years' crop of 1 12 10
and this without allowance or deduction being made for
rest, takes, or risk ; so that the tithe receiver is the only
perstm benefitted by the cultivation of unenclosed lands ;
and they are not worth cultivation,. even rent-free, tax-
free, and risk-free, if the tithe-holder be allowed to take
his tenth of the produce.
Supposing the Potatoe, or first year's
crop, to be but '7O bags an acre, at 3s
per bag lO 10 0
Deduct tithe 1 1 0

9 9 0
Expenses of Potatoe crop l2 11 2

Leaving the fainter a lost!. on his first
year's crop 3 2 2
No stronger argument than the situation of Scot-
land, as compared with Ireland, could be given.—
Scotland was a poor country,—lreland a rich one
Scotland was in the highest state of improvement ;
Ireland, on the contrary, was in the most wretched
state of cultivation. What occasioned this difference ?
In Scotland there were no tithes. Ile was about
to touch on dangerous ground. and might lay himself
open to perhaps much animadversion—one charge how-
ever they could not bring against him with truth, that he
entertained opinions which be was either afraid or ashamed
to acknowledge. They had all their different ideas as to a
remedy—the one he would point out had already, in some
degree, been pointed out by Parliament. Under the new
Inclosure Acts a seventh of the land had been allotted to
the clergy, but in its uncultivated state ; he considered,
that the 10th of the cultivated land would be a fair equi-
valent for tithes—hut as it would be inconvenient for a
clergyman to farm the tenth of every estate, consequently
he could only let it, and receive the rent like another
landlord. He would therefore recommend, that the 10th
of the rent should be paid to the clergyman—it would be
a very handsome equivalent, as, at one time, they had
only a third' of that. He did not come there under
any feelings :of personal interest, and it might appear
strange he should be so zealous ; but he would state, that
two hundred acres of his property were tithe free ; and
for the remainder, no dispute had ever arisen between
him and his rector ; to whose open and gentlemanly
conduct he begged to pay this public tribute of
merited respect. He hoped the Clergy would not think
too hardly of him, for attempting to take from them a dis-
gusting power, which could not be in unison with their
feelings, and for trying to be the means of giving them one
of a gentler description ; a power over the hearts, the
minds, and the affections of their parishioners. He would
fain see the clergy the friends, the advisers, the protectors,
the consolers of their flocks. He would fain see them in-
culcate by their examples, that beautiful precept of their
heavenly master, " love one another•." But this desirable
state of things could never be accomplished as long as the
present tithe laws were in existence. He had now in his
pocket authenticated sdocuments to chew, that the litiga-
tion of tithe qutstions, in a parish in this county had cost
the immense sum of 4,700/. The rector demanded 11,001.,
and at length consented to take 500/. He had now oniy
to thank them for the patience with which they had heard
him—not fsr ever he trusted—he hoped to meet them there
again ; for as long as the limited powers lie possessed re-
mained, whenever any question which involved
,the inte-
rests of the people was discussed, he would limp to his post.
Time and misfortune made sad inroads, and should this be
the last time ke might have the power of addressing them,
he intreated them that they would do him the favour to
bear in their recollection, his parting exhortation—Perss.-
vere by every constitutional means. If they were de-
feated they must try again. Reason and justice must pre-
vail. Again he would say—Persevere !
Captain BULLER (of Whimple), although lie did not
sign the requisition, yet was not less anxious to give the
question his most cordial support. He came before them
as an independent freeholder to give support to the prayer
of the petition, first, because he thought the discussion
desirable ; and secondly, because he thought the correc-
tion of the evil practicable Tithes or Church property
was held for uses which lie considered highly advantage •
ors to the community. Ile had no objection to the pos-
session of the property by the Church, but he had to the
se Ste collection; first, because it esntinually
hrnugtit the Clergyman into collision with his flock;,_
and secondly, because it was a decided bar to the im-
provement of the land. The use for which tithes were
intended to be directed were of the most beneficial kind,
as affecting the well being and the morals of society;—
it might he replied that these purposes were not
always answered, and that the property of the Church
was not always applied to its proper ends, but,
though a very important question, this was not at present
before them—that was a question of Church reform, and
rei argument against the use could be brought on the
ground of the abuse of tithes. That an amendment was
practicable had already been proved by the application of
the principle of commutation in enclosure bills. An
instance bad come under his immediate observation, and
he held in his hand a letter from a clergyman, speaking in
the highest terms of it. It was not the object of the pe-
tition to point out the mode of redress, but to leave it to
the wisdom of the Legislature ; yet he considered that
the plan of a fixed corn rent, averaged on any certain
number of years, would prove highly beneficial, as he had
already seen it proved. By this mode the farmer
would never be subjected to the dreadful injustice
he at present felt; for now, if by the superior in-
dustry or the expenditure of greater capital he
doubled his produce, he was immediately sub-
jected to double tithes ; an evil so glaring
that it called loudly for redress. It was not his wish
to disguise any objections ; and he was willing to al-
low that few clergymen were oppressive in their
levies of Tithes; and taking it genera ly he believed that
if the full value were attempted to be levied, the burthen
would be:intolerable ; he was ready to acknowledge that he
had called on the clergy to make a present sacrifice, but he
would undertake to show that it must ultimately tend to
their advantage ; for unless they made some sacrifice, im-
provements, such as inclosures could not take place; in
calling on them to forego their claims en future improve-
ments, they could scarcely be said to make a sacrifice, for
if such claims were still held, such improvements neither
would or could take place.—( Hear, hear.)--He had only
a few words more to say. He was warranted in saying
that the gentlemen who brought forward this measure,
did not mean to attribute the present distress to the tithes,
however augmented by it. It arose from various causes.
The country he eonsideied as standing in the situation of
a spendthrit, who had borrowed and spent for a long
period ; but now came the day of repayment.—(Cries of
" Question.")—lt had been his lot to visit many countries,
but in all that lie had seen, not excepting that boasted
child of liberty, America, he had seen nothing that equalled
his own; even in her distress England was great.—(Cries
of " Question," and hear, hear, and applause.)
Calls were now made for Sir Thomas Acland, but he
did not come forward, on which
Counsellor BIRD said, if their Members did not choose
to come forward, he would. He did not know if he (Sir
Thomas) came there to address them ; but this he knew,
that he (Mr. Bird) came to Inert him. Though not a
yeoman himself, he was the son of a yeoman, and he was
proud to have been born and bred among them ; as he
was confident they were not only the first to keep in the
constitutional course, but to keep others in that course
also. It was needless to go back to the origin of tithes, it
was fur them now to meet the question like men. He
thought, however, they had put the cart before the horse
—(Loud laughter.) If it was the intention to petition
the Legislature, they should make a House of Commons
who would attend to them. One of their members, he
understood, was attending his wife in her confinement.; if
he was studying midwifery, he trusted it was fur
the purpose of delivering the country from its dis-
tress. The Learned Gentleman objected to the petition
being entrusted to Sir Thomas Acland for presentation to
the House of Commons. The Learned Gentleman then
proceeded to state that he had sometime: since entrusted
a petition to Mr. Brougham to be presented to the House
of Commons on the subjects of Trial by Jury, on Open
Courts, on Clerical Magistrates, &c., and that Mr.
Brougham had informed him that the House paid no at-
tention to petitions. That Mr. Hume then presented the
petition of which lie had furnished Sir Thomas with a copy,
and it had been reported in an Exeter Paper, a magisterial
organ, that Sir Thomas said that Mr. Bird's petition was
a tissue of untruths. That afterwards at a meeting of the
Magistrates in Sessions, it was admitted that one of his
allegations was true. Sir Thomas was present, and had
then an opputunity of explaining, but did not do so.
(The Sheriff intimated to Mr. Bird that he was out of
order.) Mr. Bird resumed, saying he would leave the
hustings protesting that the petition ought not not to be
entrusted to Sir T. Acland to be presented.—(Cries f
order, off, off, and great noise.)
The Rev. Mr. Jones said that be regretted the attaek

PIICIS OF SNARLS Tlll2 DAY AT ONE O'CLOCk.
Paid. Par share.
Anglo le, x. Min. Co. (ss. at Si. pm.) XlOO 43% 3 14
801-ne'*Mining co. .C,OO 480 471
13razillan Mining cu,,,i,aii, - 5 _ fiii
Brazilian Imp. Min. Cu. (lie. at 51. pm.) £2O • ‘, BA
Ditto National lO £6- ?714
Real del Monte Mining Co. £4oo 70 71
United Mex. Min. Co. (lee, at 21. pre..) £3934 18
Protector Insurance Comp ... 2 £1 13 0

PRICKS OF IRISH STOCKS, DUBLIN, JAN. 15
/Sank Stock
Consols, 3 per cent
Gov. Stock, 2% per cent. 99% National Ditto —
Ditto, New — Patriotic Ditto —
4 per Cent. — !Hibernian Bank 18%
Gov. Deb. 3% per cent.... 91% 'Provincial Ditto 24
Royal Canal Stock --; Royal Irish Mine
jorifelreland ....... 4%
Grand Canal Stock
City Deb. 4 per cent =llMminPeinrigalCoM.
Rallut Office Deb. 4p. c 92% !Commercial Buildings —

MAILS.
Arrived. Due. Arrived. Due.
1 America 0 0 Hamburg 3
0 Brazil
O Buenos Ayres ....... 0 0 Jamaica 0
O Carthagena. 0 0 Leeward Islands
2 Dublin 0 0 Lisbon I
I Flanders 0 0 Mexico
O France 1 0 Sweden
2 Guernsey &Jersey.. 0 2 Waterford .....

NIGH WATER. AT LONDON BRIDSZ TO-MOZROW.
Morning ,t 7 minutes after P. I Evernng...39 minutes after 7.

ett ;inn.

LONDON,
MONDAY EVENING, JANUARY 18, 1830.

In our columns of to•day will be found a full
report of an important meeting—for which we
are indebted to that spirited and enterprising
Journal the Western Times—on the subject of
Tithes. We have no space to discuss the ques-
tion to-clay, but cannot forbear drawing attention
to one singular circumstance alluded to by the
Honourable Mr. NEWTON FELLOWES. It
is beautifully illustrative of the blessings of
the Tythe System. "He (the Hon. N. FEL-
LOWES) had in his pocket authenticated docu-
ments to show, that the litigation of tithe
questions, in one parish in Devon, had cost
the :immense sum of 4,7001. The rector
demanded 11,000/. and at length consented to
take 5001." This is just the twenty-secondth
part of the sum demanded, or a composition of
about tenpence three-farthings in the pound ! !

The French Papers of Thursday and Friday

contain no news.

FSYNCA Ft:rms.—Paws, JAN. 15.—Five per Cents.,
108f.60c. 80c.75c. Three per:Cents., 85f. 85f. 20c.
10c. ; Bank Stock, 1,687 f. boc. ; Naples, :Stock, 94f.
30a. ; Royal Spanish Loan, 81i; Spanish Rentes Per-
petuelles, 62. Exchange on [Loudon, ono month, 25f.
60e. ; three months, 25f. 45e.—Couts Authentique.

There is, perhaps, no part of our commercial
law whose alteration would be so beneficial to
trade as that relating to partnership. Though
a capitalist cannot legally receive more than 5 per
cent. for the loan of his money, he is neverthe-
less debarred from investing it in trade together
with that of other persons, without making him-
self liable for the whole partnership debts. The
consequence is, that people unused to business,
especially small capitalists, are naturally cautious
of engaging in industrious enterprises, in which,
by the acts of others over whom they may have

no effectual confront, they may possibly be tn.'
terly ruined. Hence the productive industry d
the country is seriously checked ; and, nuclei
circumstances such as those which have so con.
siderably reduced the rate of profit to be derived
from almost all branches of business, it is obvi•
ous that the evil is rendered so much the greater.
A motion of Mr. POULETT THOMSON stands
for next Session, to allow the formation of part'
nerships en commandite. This proposition sp•
II pears to have been suggested by the French lalf
which, in this respect, our Legislature would
hardly do better than take as its model. The
Code de Commerce recognizes three kinds of
partnerships; the first, en nom collectif; in which
all the partners are liable for each other, as with
us, and must all have their names ostensibly in‘
the firm ; the second, en commandite, composed
of some partners generally responsible and act'
ing, and of others liable only to the extent of
the capital brought in by them, who are not al
liberty to interfere in the business, or to publish
their names in the firm ; and the third, called
anonyme, being a public company, formed
under the KING'S sanction for a specisi
purpose, the members of which are liable
only to the extent of their shares. The last of
these answers to our chartered Companies ; the
second kind of association is that which ought
to be legalized in this country. It would of course'
embrace any number of partners, large or small.
The material point to be looked after by the
public with regard to partnerships is to have tile
means of knowing who the persons are with whore
dealings take place, and whether there is a sof'
ficient amount of responsibility in the firm. The
French code provides for this by requiring Ail
extract from the articles of all partnershe
either en nom collectif or en commandite, to be
registered within fifteen days with the greffier
the Tribunal de Commerce of the Arrondisse'
ment, and to be affixed in the Court for three
months for public inspection. The extract rnosi
specify the names, descriptions, and residences
of all the partners, the firm of the partnershifh
and its term, and must distinguish the aclid
partners from those en commandite, stating She
amount of capital subscribed by each of tbe°
respectively. This registration might be node
in England with the Mayor or principal me
trate of the town, by partnerships carried on is
or near towns, and in smaller places with sot
person to be appointed for that purpose ;
should also probably be inserted in the GOO
the object being to give the matter publicity.
There is another part of the French partneli
ship law worthy of notice, we mean that whic
compels partners to resort to arbitration for 01
settlenient of their disputes among themsel°
If the parties cannot agree upon arbitrators, the'
arc named by the Tribunal de Commerce, ail'
the award admits of only one appeal, viz., to sh
Cour Royale. Di. c,vd, oat partnel
ship whose affairs are secure from beilll
ever engulfed in a Court of Chancery I ./r
bitration is of necessity the only means by whirl
justice can be done in cases of disputed accono°
of the nature of those in ninety-nine out of
hundred partnership disputes. it would be
act of the most provident consideration on the
part of our Legislature, to prevent partners vihe
are unfortunate enough to quarrel, from Inv,
ing themselves in the additional misery of she
Lord Chancellor's place of torment.
If our Partnership Laws be, in effect, dery
mental to industry, by taking away from the
ducement to enterprise, which is alleged to be
already insufficient from other circumstances, tl
is extremely important that they should be Psii
on a footing that would hold out greater Woo'
ragement to trade. To interfere witf a mane
right to limit, by agreement, his liabiliy on 0'
count of his, partners, is an arbitrary act at the
best ; and if it cannot be shown to be i‘ecessid
for the public security, amounts to an ideust.o'
Now it seems to us clear, that it wonld be vitae~
safer to deal with a firm formed en comnsandi
on the French plan, than with any partaersil)
on the present system, and more especially nci°
regard to bankers. If Mr. THOMSON'S MOO
is brought on, as we hope it will be, little obr
tion can be anticipated, unless it be from s'll
superannuated law politicians as old Lol/
ELDON and REDESDALE. But the comae
cial interest should especially take this mate
up, and petition for relief, either in connectl
with, or absolutely from, a repeal of the Us'
Laws. There is no reason to believe that e
Government is unfavourable to the change p'
posed ; on the contrary,:the measure being P
calculated to stimulate the industrious enere
of the nation, seems precisely of the sort whs
any judicious
In
dicieoxuescutin.
Ministero would be very desert
put

Nothing of importance occurred in any °le
Law Courts up to the period when we went to press.
Mr. HOY is returned for Southampton.

---•-
An agent of Prince LEOPOLD has beenv
gaged, for two or three days past, in going round toe
booksellers, and collecting for the Prince every world
any authority, that has reference to Greece.
Prince LEOPOLD left the residence of
Countess of BitionswATEß, near Hemel Hampsteaio
Saturday, and returned to his seat at Claremont. if
Royal Highness pas,ed through London on his way.
The Duchess of KENT has,• during the pi
inclement weather, caused coals and food to be distria,
by ticket, daily to the poor of Kensington and its b'
bourhood.
Lord STRANGFOAD continues seriousn-
dispos2d at his residence in Harley-street; but west,.
stand he has been pronounced out of danger. 3ne
time his physicians bad given over all hope of pretiof
his life. His complaint was an abscess on the liver