The Sun.
London, England, 1808-03-11 00:00:00

Cquse he understood from the a Ivertisetnent7 th-nt
buly those who ccincurred iu the Petition were re

'quired to assemble.
Mr. 141ELLIsti frout his considerable transaaion§
with America, haiing goods and lands, there to a
large amount, thought fnmself fully justified in at-
tending the meeting, although not direkaly an
American merchant.

Mr. Goaltos wished to know oti xvbat ground
on Hon, Gentleman opposite (Mr. Sharpe) could
justify his having attended ?
Mr. SHARPS, in reply, stated that he was COQ..
corned in one of the largest manufactories in Man-
chester, the prodge of which was exported to
America.

Sit A. Noo ra. regretted that au Hon. Baronet op- I
posite (Sir IL Peele) had not attetund th&tneeting,
as- he might have described to the persons assembled.
the distress which most of his constituents were suf-
fering. from he Orders 'hi Council.
Sir 11. PEV..‘E allowed) and 'lamented that many.
thousands of manufadurers were Buttering- very se-
verely ; but denied that the Ordet's in' Council were:
the cause of those sufferings. They arose from the
measures, or rather from the no-measures, of his
Majesty's ,late Ministers; and he trusted that they
would be soon relieved by the vigour and good sense
of his Majesty's present Ministers.
Mr. host: also contended, that the' distress to
which the learned Geotleman allUded did not arise •
from the Orders in Council, but frotn circumstances
which preceded, and were unconnected with them.
Sir J. NEWPORT didnot suppose that any one ima-
gined thediStress of the ulhtturers to arise from
the Orders iu Council ; but. they were calculated to
increase those distresses, and to. render them irre-
mediable, Reverting to a former statetiwut of his,
NVitit resped to Ireland, he asked whether it was
possible that the Americaos could be ignorant that,
. forty thousand hogsheads ofitlax seed, amounting
to tour-fifths of what was required by Ireland, were
annually imported in that country from America.—
He was anxious that the House should be in posSes-
sion of the fullest infortnation on every part of this'
important subject before they committed themselves'
Upoll it. Alluding to the late abandonment by.the
Chancellor of the Exchequer of the proposed duty
on salt, lie maintained that the ,Right Honourable
Gl...nth:man ha i given up to that duty, not I).t.le:lOSe it
atfeded tk intettnits of the country, but, because. his
political interests as a Minister were at stake.
. The CHANCIKI.LOW of the ExcKEettifix rose, and
was proceeding to defend himself from the imputa-
tion cast upon him by the Hon. Baronet, len he
was called to order by gr. WUITIIttIiAD, who r.Oll-
- that he ought to confine himself to the ex-
, planation of what he had said, and not enter into an
explanation of what he had. done.
• The Srt::Atiett Observing that the debate had tra-
s tlled out ut the gnestion before the Honse, decided
that the
,Bight I-fun. Gentleman had not been out of
order in. what be Was proceeding to advance to' his
oihn justification, although it certainly would b. for
the convenience Or' the House that the discussion
should not be allowed to deviate so' widely from its
*original direction.
The Gi ANCbILLOR of the 'EXCITEQ,OEtt reserving-,
until another opportunity, what he had to sayon the
subjea, the Motion that the Petition do he on the
table Was put and agre,...d to,
• Mr. Alderman Costae, after the Petition was
I ordered' to lie on the table, rose to4nove, that the Pe-
titioners be heard by their Council, in support of the
'Petition, when

The Strrmtun, claiming the assistance of the I
House upon the question, eplained what he con-
ceived to be the pratStice of the Rouse with respea
to Petitions, and proceedings titteon.' Whenever
a Petition was presented to the House, the Member
pr!!senting it, had his election either to move, that.
it be referred to a Committee to examine the matter
thereof, on its being read, or that it do lie on tho
table. In the latter case, it was not the practice to
• Move any proceeding upon the Petition on the' same
day, but it was perfeCtly competent to any Honour- f
able Member to give notice of a mdtion for such
further proceeding on a future day.
Mr. Alderman Co.NIBE then, taking shame to him-
self for the error into which he had fallen from his
ignoranee'of the form of the House, was proceed=
iug-to give notice, that he should to-Morrow Move
that the Petitionerb should be heard by' CounSel in
support of their Petition ; when the CIIANCELLoit
of the E:,C.CLIEQUE:ti informed the Hon. Member, 1
that the report of the Mutiny Bill steed for' to-mot-
' row, and that with a view to its being read a; third
time on Monday next, in order to leave the other
Fleusesofficient time to pass the Bill tplore the .2:ith
instant, the proceedingwith that bill could nut be
deferred.
A short conversation 'ensued, on the subject of
exhig the day fur the nonceofthe Hon. Afdertn.in ;
but the matter was chopped upon Mr. Wit rTe
stating that another Heft. Member had a similar l'e-
titian to present to the House. •
General GAII.CoyNE 'then rose to present a Pet'-
. tion of the same .description of that:whieh,had been
under discussion, but in a. morteoncise form, His
Constituenti, who had brought:up ihe Petition which
bad.beentrejatedion A foritter night, had felt it their
duty ,to sett 4 to. Liverpool for instrnaionS, and were,
authorised to prepare the Petition he. held in his
hand, free from that defeet in point of -form which
bad been fatal to their former Petitions. He should
not, therefore, detain the .House by any further ob-
servation, but move that the Petition be received.
The Petition was then brought up and read, be-
ing substantially similar to the two former Petitions
against the Orders in Council,
Geeeral GAlcovn
•thep, that he should not fall
into the error of the Hon. Alderman,
.gave notice,
that he Should on Monday next move that the Peti-
tioners should be beard by Counsel in
.support of
their 'Petition but being informed that Thursday
the first open clay, he agreed to 4x.hisnotice for
that day.
(,39eral. Togirfill, on the stibietst,of this. Peti-
frtft.itmegogy to: stale, dot, tic had had no
notiee ):vhirtfuget 4111 public Mectitig of his ConSti-
tneratS czilloa for tfo9,pktrpt;e of r ea-41sid,:ring or de-
upon this. PericiOn. lie w:ts. as- desirous as
H any, 011011 could, :ht of tjo., ~,i4cpinion of his
Constituents, a:.l Of an lijnourablepopularity ; and
he had no he.;itation, w nut that asreat -inaj,:rity of
.11.0 tiuoAitihrots n;,O:st i‘l." the pcot,eed-
incrc) that 1.4.al IJ-ee4t .(1 01111 1:1,,,i5v 35 in-
b' •

hiSters.
Mr. SHERIDAN. observed, that the Hen, General
(Gascoyne) hed fallen into the same error It Idch he
had iniputed to the Hon. Alderman. This night the
Orders in Council Bill wn to pass thrOugh its last
stage, and to• be heard with elle4l ; the 'Petitioners
eiould heheard before the Bill passed threagh its
last stage; It Was not for the House to anticipate
what might be. the .eftZea of the arguments of Coon.
sell and of the evidence that might be brought for-
ward in support of the allegations of the Petition. '
Mr. S. was proceeding, when called to order by
-The CUANCELLOR of the Exeitzraurt, Who ob-
served; the question before the House wns, that .
the Petititmers be heard by. Counsel in support of their
Petition.
It was then ordered, that the Petitioners be heard
byl Counsel in .supporcof. their Petit toe ..
General GAscoeNE„in rising to note, the hearing
of the Counsel on Thursday next, slated, that the
Petition had oely been received that 'thy from Li-
verpool by his constituents, and that, consequently,
if Couosel were immediately to, be called in support
614,, they net come so fully prepared as they
ought upon the subject.` As to what' had fallen from
his 1-11Onteatiable Colleague, he had, only,,to- observe,
that havjug. receivtd the Petition from a . most re-
speaable portion of his constituents, he fiilt it to be
hiS'hoenden ditty to vesent it to the House, and ti-)'
procure the them a becring. He theretbre, more&
that they be beard:by Counsel on. ThersdeY nest.
Mr. SUBRI.O.I,N 11,4 been determined to move an
amencluient, diet the Petitioners be now :wind;
bur since the Hen. General said that Cieuttsel 'were
nut. prepared, he. woutd be forced: to. waive; that io..
tention. it was full/ untlerstoud, that the. Petition
was substatel,illy ageinst the Bill betre the flouqe;
though; in poi fit of form, it could not apply tri it;
and: be bege.o•Thu House) to. reeled what woold be
its situ-Moo if it sheuld lets the Bpi this niOtt, and
then hear Counsel in behalf of the Petitioners
against- it.
Mr. CHRBVEY and Mr. WiiITBRBAD statist], that;
they personably knew that Counsel were in attend-
ance to be heard at the Bar in beleilf of the Peti-
tioners ; upon which- Gent:ral. CiASCYN'& stated,
that ha.hali received the Petition but-as be Melte inta
the House, and
sunder. ,an understanding bcween
his Contaitnents and'the Merchams of London, who
were als'a Petitioner's agaltist the Orders in Conned,
and alio betwixt him and the Hon: Aldermau who
presented dw London, Petitiou, thee beta Petitions
were to 'proceed. hand in hand, and be heard oo
00'0n-le' day. He had neSides thought, from the
very' - compliceted nature of the question, that•no
Counsel tpUktlllie had stuticient time to be, pre-.-
pared adequately to discuss ; but as he learned
that dounsel were in attendance, lie shoidd beg
leave to withdraw his original motion, in order IC
move that Counsel be 'law heard.
leng conversation ensued, in which Lord
C4STLEBBAGn stated the Petitioners had tWO New.-
dies against the Bill,,if they should. make Ont their
case. Ist. In consciquence of the Clame for its re-
peal during the present Session ; and 2city, by au
Addresss to his Majesty-, praying that he May not
act upon the Orders in Council, it; which case
the Ad would be d dead letter, as it wits only .cor-
roberative of these Orders in Council.
Mr. PONSONBY, Mr. Alderman COMBF., Sir AR-
THUR PtuVTT, Dr. LAi.VUENCH, Mr. Mottats, Mr.
WINDliAm' Lord HENIIV Ph'ILTV, and Mr. ADAm,
contended that the Petinouers .e4it to be heard be-
.fore the passing of the for ,hat it : would be
nugatory to give thorn' a hearing alter the measure
should. have passed that HOLlie, the Lords not being
competent to alter it, its h was a Money Sill, and
therefore having no altern:itive but to pass or to re-
le& it ;n toto.
Mr, STaettENs contended that the point had been
decided both as to the letter end the - substance,
that the Petitioners could not he heard against the
Bill, and thus therefore it was not material whe-
ther they should be heard ,'telex or after the pass-
ing of the
Ali. PeLE CARET was friendly to the general oh-
Jet% of the Wets in CounCil, becaese the mea-.
seres of former Governments covered the 'trade et
our euennes,at the tespence of our own, and .those
Orders in Conucil ,he. bailed as a new era is our
commercial history. As,. hoit*,•er, he bad dotibts
of the expediency and Wisdom of some of the pro-
visions of ahe Bill, he should vote for the immediate
bearing qi Counsel.. •
A division then melt place :
For now hcarinx 66
• Apr:lt..toting Coutii.l4.t.ut. Tlitirsday 99
• ,
Cot4iivl are ti4Vrtif9re to he-beard on. Thursday
next.

(.sty our re-admission we found the CO ANCRLLOR
Ot C 114411/ E on.itis. legs, tuoviug tile Order
of Ow I),ty for the .third re.itlitig Qt' the Orders in
Ctkroxii l ijl.
On the questidn being put, thar-,the.Bill L now
re td a t bird. t lute, au' anqudment.. wtti tonveti by
Lord Vollistont?„ that it be,rcasi a timu on
Monday se'intiAnt. , • .
The question and the amendment being put,
The eFIX:MELLOR Of the. EXCIIIMUZit moved,
that the Orders; in • council Bill, be .read. a • third
time.

Lord FOLKSTON n -moved, that the debate be ad-
journed till Monday seinnight.
A question of precedente.arnse here between Mr.
W. Strata and Sir W. Scorr, the latterspeaking to
the principle of the Bill, and the former to the
mere question 'of time.
After some discussion, in which the thlittloELLOß
of the EXCIIBUIMR insisted on the right of going
into the principle upen;the question of going on now.
or adjourning ; •
Mr. SNirrtt insisted•the question was a-mere ques-
tion of time. •
The SPR6KPR decided that the question was 3
mere question Of-time, but that the general question
may be-brought in on that questieu. .
-Mr. WarraucAb 'clairnecl.the precedence for his
Hon. Friend Mr. SMITH, in addressing the. Chair,
A Priorr, right was.claitiled,,tbrS.4',W••sccaT„hot th 4
,Hon, Baronet havinggirep. way to thp'o4lll on tilt}
other side, -
Mr. Siagtk al dr,essed the, shortly, stating, •
that. ,Petitioos:ffogi.-oxher ,crarters,
-holy fro' Maorhystm WLY& ithoot to ;00,:ctiforea
against the Orders in COuncil. •
AdiYision ton_k_pkw.:
Fur pi co:WIT% on Moil* $.2'4141.4 -1g
v.. . '