The Sun.
London, England, 1863-07-15 00:00:00

BRAZIL-THE WRECK OF THE PRINCE OF
WALES,

Lord CHELMSFORD called the attention of the house
to the " Memorandum regarding assessment of compensa-
tion in the case of the Prince of Wales," which had been
laid upon the table ; and asked the Secretary of State for
Foreign Affairs to inform the house upon. what grounds the
Queen's Advocate founded his estimate of the sum of £2,360
as the amount of compensation which ought to be paid for
the cargo, after making allowance for probable and neces-
sary damage ; what was the nature and description of the
cargo and its invoiced value, and if the owner had received
anything from the underwriters in respect of its loss ; also,
in what manner the Queen's Advocate had ascertained that
the loss of wages and effects ought to be estimated at £290
and the compensation for "possible murders" at £B4O
His lordship contended that the arbitration of the King of
the Belgians having resulted in a decision against the
charges made on behalf of the officers of the Forte, the right
to make reprisals was completely disposed of, as these re-
prisals had been made partly to obtain reparation for the
alleged insult which had been offered to the British navy in
the persons of the officers of the Forte. He hoped therefore
to hear from the noble earl that he had offered some expres-
sion of regret, or made some amends, to the Brazilian Go-
vernment for the course which he and Mr. Christie had pur-
sued. When the Brazilian Governmentresibted the demands
which the noble earl had made through Mr. Christie, and

when they refused to make any compromise, but simply
surrendered at discretion to superior force, they placed
this country in the very delicate position of being judges in
our own cause. It was our duty, under such circumstances,
to behave with great caution and forbearance ; but he
thought that the very contrary spirit had been shown. The
case was referred to the Queen's Advocate, and ho had
made the award up m some appraisement which he (Lord
Chelmsford) would be glad to see explained. Surely a ship-
broiler or an insurance underwriter would he better autho-
lilies as to the urobable value of a ship's cargo and sailors'
kits than the Queued Advocate. The noble lord went over
the whole case of tho loss of the Prince of Wales, and cen-
sured the demand made for freight upon the Brazilian Go-
vernment as an utterly unjustifiable demand, freight not
being earned until the goods are delivered. lie condemned
the charge for seamen's wages allowedly the Queen's Ad-
vocate, and as to the ass,s,,rnent of £BlO for " possible
murders," the Brazilian Government denied the charge of
murder, and he was at a loss to understand how the curious
sum was arrived at. (Laughter.) The very term used was
a strange one. All could understand what " probable mur-
ders" meant, but anything so vague as " possible murders"
he had never heard of before. In conclusion, he asked
Earl Russell whether he had made any amends to the Bra-
zilian Government for the forcible seizure of their ships,
and the enforcement of demands which were awarded to be
groundless ; what was the nature and description of the
cargo which the Queen's Advocate had valued at two-thirds

of the invoice value; whether Mr. Stephens had received
anything from the underwriters on account of insur-
ance; how the seamen's wages came to be assessed at £290;
and how the calculations had teen made which settled the
compensation for possible murders at £840?
Earl RUSSELL said that the noble lord had made many
statements very favourable to the Brazilian Government,
but what her Majesty's Government knew was, that when
a British vessel was wrecked on the Brazilian coast the au-
thorities refused to produce the bodies or to hold an in-
quest. It was easy for the noble lord to make statements
favourable to the Brazilian Government, which had taken
good care that there should be no proofs forthcomint. It
was not because the award of the King of Belgians was in
favour of the Brazilian Government in the matter of the
officers of the Forte that therefore her Majesty's Govern-
ment was wreng in compelling the submission of the ques•
tion to arbitration. If the Brazilian Government had agreed
to leave the matter to arbitration in the first instance, no
reprisals would have been made. Mr. Christie pressed upon
them the offer of arbitration, and they would not accept it.
Until the reprisals were made nothing could be done. In
fact, the Brazilian Government had for some time treated
her Majesty's Government with a degree of contempt which
was very unusual between friendly Powers. As to the
noble lord's suggestion about a shipbroker, the Government
were not in the habit of going to shipbrokers or insurance
agents for advice. They usually applied to the law advisers
of the Crown, and the Queen's Advocate was the proper
officer to whom they had referred. The noble lord, as the
advocate of the Brazilian Government, alleged that the
cargo had gone to the bottom—but the evidence of Mr.
Consul Vinkes showed that the vessel was afloat and at
anchor when he saw her, several days after the wreck. Her
boats were drying on shore; they were unbroken, and the
oars were in them. Several packing cases were open on the
shore empty—and the paper which lined them was dry, and
bore no appearance of having been wetted. It was true that
Mr. Christie had made no demand for compensation for the
murders--but the Queen's Advocate thought that the
charge was fair and just. He (Earl Russell) had no doubt
whatever that the people u ere murdered. Mr. Stephens,
the owner of the ship, had received nothing nu account of
insurance from the underwriters—and he (Earl Russell)
considered the charge as assessed was very moderate. As to
our relations with Brazil, he thought they would be very
much improved by the Brazilians finding that British sea-
men could net be murdered or British vessels plundered
with impunity,
The Earl of MALMESBURY said that the papers
showed that the Brazilian Government had produced four
bodies, and that they were proved not to have been mur-
dered,
Earl RUSSEL—There were ten bodies seen, and only
four were produced.
The Earl of MALMESBURY said that the other six

were buried in the sand. and could not be found. (Earl
Russell made a gesture of dissent.) The affair was a dis-
grace to this country, and ho regretted that the oble earl
had not 'given any reply to his noble friend, or my assur-
ance that he would make amends to the Brazilian Govern-
merit, and say that he regretted the reprisals were made.
He hoped that no false pride would voyeur the noble earl
from seeking a reconciliation. with Brazil. Our feelings on
the unfortunate slave trade had led us to do many things
wh;ch disturbed oar relations with other,countries ; and the
Aberdeen Act, by which British cruisers were empowered
to board, search, and seize, Brazilian vessels suspected of
being slavers in Brazilian waters, was calculated to prevent
a good understanding from being established between the
two countries. It was mere legalised piracy in search of
piracy, and Lord Aberdeen often expressed his regret for
for having passed that Act.

Earl RUSSELL said he had been informed by the Por •
tuguese Minister in London that he was instructed to use
his good offices in bringing about an amicable understand,
ing been this country and Brazil. He (Earl Russell)
thought it best to wait until that proposition became before
her Majesty's Government.

Earl FORTESCUE warmly defended the character of
his friend Mr. Christie.

After a few words from Lord MALMESBURY, the
subject dropped.
GALWAY AND NEW YORK MAIL PACKETS.
The Earl of HARD WICKE asked the Postmaster-
General :—lst. Whether the contract for the conveyance
of mails between Galway and America has yet been con-
cluded. 2d. Its terms ; and whether any and what modi-
fications, more especially as regards the landing of mails or
telegrams at St. John's, Newfoundland. 3d. When the
performance of the service is to commence. 4th. Whether,
notwithstanding the reports of the Admiralty surveyors as
to the unfitness of the vessels, the Government are prepared
to incur the risk of another failure in this service. sth.
Whether any steps have been taken by the Government
authorities to insure the public against the consequences of
those deficiencies in the vessels of the Galway Company
pointed out by the Admiralty surveyors.
Lord STANLEY of ALDERLEY replied that the pro-
posal of contract had been accepted. 2. That the terms
were precisely the same as in the previous contract, except
that no member of either House of Parliament should be a
contractor, and the mails should be landed at St. John's,
Newfoundland. 3. The service would commence when the
company declared themselves ready, 4 and 5, his lordship
said, he would answer together. The terms of the contract
should be observed, and time should be kept.
Their lordships then adjourned.

HOUSE OF COMMONS—Last Evening.
The SPEAKER took the. chair at a quarter after 12 o'clock.

PRIVATE BUSINESS.
The Edinburgh Water Bill was read a third time.
FORTIFICATIONS (PROVISIONS FOR
EXPENSES).

Mr. MASSEY brought up the report of the resolutions,
making provision for the expenses and payments to the
Bank of England, already agreed to.
The house then went into committee, and a clause to this
effect was embodied in the bill.
The house resumed.
UNION RELIEF AID ACTS CONTINUANCE
BILL.

On the motion for going into committee,
Mr. CHILDERS rose to move, "That, in the opinion of
this house, it is desirable that any monies raised under this
bill, by way of loan on the security of the rates in the dis-
tressed manufacturing districts, should be applicable to
assist emigration to such colonies as may be will-
ing to co-operate in carrying it out." He, for one,
had not much faith in the employment of the
distressed artisans on public works, believing that the
greater proportion of the money would go into the pockets
of the contractors and in the purchase of materials ; but as
the general opinion of Lancashire was in favour of the plan,
he had felt it his duty to give it his support, Supposing
the war in America to shortly cease, it would take at least
four or five years before the cotton trade of Lancashire
could be restored to its former condition. For many years the
influx of people into the cotton districts had been at therate
of 35,000 a year, and he attributed the great increase of
crime last year to the inability of these people to obtain a
living, and thus they became a component part of the
dangerous classes. The emigration from this country and
Ireland from 1852 to 1858 was far larger than in the four
or five preceding years. In the years 1860-1-2 there
had been a great falling off, so that in prosperous years
the emigration had been much greater than in those of an
opposite character. In the present year, however, there
had been a great augmentation of emigration. Acts of Par-
liament were in existence to enable parishes to assist the
irremovable poor and orphan children to emigrate by a
charge on the rates not to exceed one-half of the average
rates of the three previous years; but the adoption of sueh
a plan in order to relieve the distress in the cot-
ton districts would be but as a drop in the bucket.
By the adoption of his motion, as an addition to the
bill, parishes would be materially aided in promoting emi-
gration, and they would find that the colonies would readily
co-operate in so good a work. Many of their southern
colonies had ceased to a great extent to be pastoral, and now
presented a multitude of these mining and manufacturing
occupations which went so far to make up the wealth of
nations. Hence there was an ample field in our colonies
for the profitable employment of the distressed artisans in
the cotton districts. It was absurd to say that the English
mill hands could not stand the climates of our colonies in
the southern hemisphere, because they were particularly
adapted, on account of the genial warmth that prevailed,
the absence of snow, east winds, and fogs, to renovate the
impaired health of these artisans. Though numbers of emi-
grants had gone during the last year or two to Australia
the labour market had not been disturbed nor wages re-
duced. He contended that the " assisted" emigration he
proposed would be a great boon to the distressed cotton
hands, who, he wail satisfied, were most desirous of emi-
grating. In the course of a year or two a sum of from
£200,000 to £300,000 would be available, out of colonial
funds, for the promotion of emigration, provided the emi-
grants themselves contributed a little sum. He appealed to
the house to accede to his motion, and thus mitigate the
prevalent distress.
Mr. MARSH seconded the motion. He spoke from
great experience when he said that our colonies would be
glad to receive a great accession of emigrants. The colo-
nies did not want particular specialties in emigrants. If
they had good common sense and were willing to
work they would be sure to succeed. For
instance, in the old days of transportation,
it was fottnd that London pick-pockets made the best shep-
herds. (Laughter.) He quoted statistics to show that
wages in Queensland were high, and food exceedingly
cheap. It was, too, a capital place for women, because there
were no shops; (Laughter.)
Mr. NEWDEGATE supported ,the bill, because an ex-
ceptional reFource was needed in the present extremity, and
he was satisfied that this was the best one that could at the
present juncture be devised for the relief of the distressed
cotton-workers. The emigration, under proper guidance
and protection, of women was exceedingly desirable, in
order to correct the present glaring disproportion of the
sexes in this country,

Colonel W. PATTEN denied that the Lancashire com-
mittee were hostile to the emigration of the distressed cot-
ton hands. They had no right to expend money placed in
their hands for the relief of distress to a foreign object not
indicated by the donors. (Hear, hear.) The committee
were taking steps to guard against the distress that might
be apprehended in the winter, and he hoped the house
would believe that the committee would do their best to
meet all the rational requirements of the distressed opera-
hear.)
tires. (Hear,

Mr. FE RRAND considered that the hon. member (Mr.
Childers) would not succeed in carrying his motion, because
the manufacturers had leagued themselves with the Go-
vernment to keep them in the vicinity of the mills, in case
their services should be required. It appeared that £460,000
out of the £1,000,000 subscribed had alone been devoted to
the operatives, making, with the £200,000 lately raised
under this bill, only 30s. per head on the 400,000 to 600,000
needing aid. There were actually 30,000 able-bodied men
out of employment in Lancashire, and he advised the local
committee to direct their attention to eairying them into
the districts where he knew for a fact there was at that mo-
ment a paucity of haymakers.
Mr. BAGWELL adverted to the lamentable distress
among agriculturists in various parts of Ireland, especially
in the west, and said the way the two classes of her Ma-
jesty's subjects—those in Ireland and in Lancashire—were
treated presented a remarkable contrast. Nothing was done
for the former, but if the Government did not afford these
poor people succour, he warned them that the people would
fail in their loyalty.
Mr. HIBBERT contended that the present state of the
law afforded every facility to parishes to aid in the emigra-
tion of distressed inhabitants willing to leave their native
land.

After a few words from Mr. ADDERLEY,
Mr. VILLIERS advised the hen. member (Ir. Childers)
to withdraw his motion. He proposed that there should be no
compulsory emigration, but that it should be quite optional.
He had not, however, proved that either the operatives
or the parishes supported his motion. Then he clearly de-
monstrated by figures that the emigration during the pre-
sent year had greatly increased, If so, why interfere with
what was going on ? The hon. gentleman had stated pub-
licly that the colonies had a quarter of a million of money
ready for the promotion of emigration; but he had not
shown that such really was the case, though the hon. mem-
ber had stated that he expected to be made the holder of
this large sum. The nanss of emigrants did not care to go
to Australia, but to America, and the right hon, gentleman
quoted statistics in eupport of his statement. He feared
the hon. gentleman had unfortunately mixed
up his
humanity with his interest in Australia; in fact, accord.
ing to him, England's misery was Melbourne's opportaity.
His opinion was that if employment could be found here for
the distressed operatives in this country it would be impro-
per to encourage emigration. Cotton operatives were not
required in Victoria, and, indeed, several of the colonies
had no need of such hands. It was the duty of Govern-
ment to see that men were not encouraged to leave their
native land unless they were well satisfied that they stood
a good chance of doing well in the future. It was useless
sending the operatives to Queensland or any other place
where there was not sufficient evital or Channqls of em-

ployment open. Parishes had by law ample powers to
keep emigration in check, but they had not seen it expe-
dient to put the law in force. The Government could not
curtail emigration.
Mr. HENLEY deprecated the use of the expression
by the right hon. gentleman, "England's misery was Mel-
bourne's opportunity," as positively indecent, seeing the
succour afforded by Australia to the suffering operatives at
home. (Hear, hear.) He lacked information with respect
to the £250,000 spoken about as to be furnished by the colo-
nies to promote emigration. Fearing that the Lancashire
distress in the coming winter would be exceedingly severe.
he deemed it wise to give every power to the authorities
that might possibly tend, in their discretion, to mitigate the
misery that prevailed. (Hear, hear.) Could any portion
of the £200,000 to be raised under this bill be devoted to
emigration ?
Mr. VILLIERS replied that the guardians could use the
moneyd forvo any which at
tth(eHperaesre.)nt time they
could devote
Mr. COBDEN thanked the right hon. gentleman (Mr.
eth ePourrdpi purpose
y to
poor r
Villiers) for the patience and zeal which he had devoted to
the alleviation of the distress in Lancashire. (Hear, hear.)
The motion would be inapplicable, because the session was
nearly at an end, and it would be requisite to send out to
Australia to get the co-operation of the authorities there to
assist in the work. He had inquired at the Colonial-office,
and found there was not ls, in hand, so far as the colonies were
concerned, to assist emigration. (Hear, hear.) Then the
Queensland Company, and indeed, the Emigration Office,
in prescribing the nature of persons helped to emigrate,
omitted factory operatives, because there...is no field of ope-
rations for them. The operatives themselves—especially
such as lived together in parishes, receiving from £1 lOs to
£2 per week—objected to emigrate. If so, they would have
heard a good deal about it. It would be cruel to ship off
people to the antipodes, without being sure they would
do well when they got there. Queensland was
one of their youngest colonies, and with a small
population, and possibly is a few months they might learn
that this population was too great for its resources. He
advised th' working people not to emigrate to any place
except they were pretty well certain that they would be
able to do well for two or three years abroad, and not to be
carried away by such ill-advised schemes for their so-
called benefit, as that advocated by Dean
.Close, who, in a
recent case, desired to consign a number of emigrants to
the care of Captain Pitt, an aide-de-camp of the governor,
without being satisfied that they would do well there.
Sir B. LEIGHTON supported the motion.

The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER hoped the
debate would bear some fruit, and that the house would
quickly divide upon the motion. He defended the right hon.
gentleman (Mr. Villiers) from some expressions cast upon
him with respect to his address. His right hon. friend simply
meant to contend that it was no part of the functions of the
Government to direct and control emigration. The right
hon. gentleman (the Chancellor of the Exchequer) then
entered into an explanation of the existing acts bearing
upon the matter at issue, and argued that this was no time
to lay down a new principle of operation, seeing that these
acts were deliberately enacted, and when wages and comforts
of the industrial classes were being generally enhanced.
The factory operatives were not a class of emigrants who
would succeed in the colonies. Moreover, the bill was only
sought to be enacted for six months, so that it would be
futile to place this clause within it. Our colonies had be-
haved nobly in regard to the Lancashire distress, and it
would be unfair to send them shoals of emigrants for whom
they had no need. He should, therefore, vote against the
motion. (Cries of " withdraw.")
Mr. DODSON supported the motion.

Mr. CHILDERS withdrew his motion so that the
house might go into committee, when he shpuld prepose a
clause that would, he hoped, meet with the approval of
the Government.

After a few words in explanation, by Mr. HORNBY and
Mr. FERRAND,

The motion was withdrawn.
The house then went into committee,
On clause 1,

Mr. POTTER proposed to add the following proviso :
Provided always, that the sections 3 and 5 of the said Act
shall be construed and read as if the words " one shilling
and sixpence" had been there inserted in lieu of the words
" three shillings."
Mr. VILLIERS said he had fixed the amount at 3s, after
minute inquiry, and believed it would work well.

After a short discussion the amendment was withdrawn,
and the clause passed.
Mr. TOLLEMACHE proposed the following clause :
That section 3 of the act of last session, as extended by this
act, shall be read and construed as if the words '° six shil-
lings and sixpence," were substituted in that section for
five shillings."
Mr. VILLIERS assented to the amendment, so that the
clause will stand at 6s. 6d.

In reply to Sir H. WILLOUGHBY,
Mr. VILLIERS intimated that the rate of interest
would be similar to that paid on account of public works.
The remaining clauses were agreed to.
Mr. CHILDERS desired to propose an amended clause
with respect to-emigration.
Mr. VILLIERS asked his hon. friend to propose the
clause on the report.

The sitting terminated at 4 o'clock.
The house resumed at six o'clock.
EMPLOYMENT OF CHILDREN IN POTTERIES.
Mr. FERRAND gave notice that on Thursday he would

ask whether the Government intended in the ensuing next

session to introduce a measure placing children employed
in potteries and paper-tube factories under the protection
of the Factory Acts. And also whether their attention had
been directed to the great destruction of human life for
many years past by the bursting of steam boilers, and if so,
whether they were of opinion that steam boilers ought to be
placed under Government inspection.
PUBLIC EXECUTIONS.

Mr. HIBBERT gave notice that early next session he
should call attention to the demoralisation caused by public
executions, and to the desirability of capital punishments
being carritd out within the interior of prisons,
INDIAN CIVIL SERVICE.

In reply to Mr. VANSITTART,
Sir C. WOOD said he was quite aware that complaints
existed of promotions not being as rapid amongst the civil
servants of the North-Western Province of India as it was
in Bengal, but the matter was one with which the Home
Government did not interfere, as all appointments were
made by the Governor-General and lieutenant-governor of
the province.
NAVAL OFFICERS ON FOREIGN STATIONS.
Lord NAAS asked the Secretary to the Admiralty
whether orders would be issued to naval officers on foreign
stations, forbidding them to attack the ports or ships of
friendly powers without a declaration of war or distinct in-
structions from the Home Government. He asked the ques-
tion, in consequence of what was stated to have taken place
at Tringanu.
Lord C. PAGET said instructions were given to our naval
officers generally not to engage in hostilities, or have re-
course to violence, without the sanction of their superior
officers. And the officers at Tringanu had received positive
instructions not to engage in any hostilities without the
sanction of the Governor-General of India or the Governor
of Bombay.
THE SANITARY CONDITION OF THE INDIAN