The Sun.
London, England, 1839-04-20 00:00:00

that they v e-e properly discharging their duty,
they would fearlessly Igo on and inquire whether or not
they were entitled to that condemnation which they in-
tended to vote to-night. What object would such a pro-
cee iirg have on the character of the House? None ; for it
would be seen that they were treating with indifference
a co-ordinate branch of the Legislature. They were entitled
to pause.—( Great cheering from the Ministerial benches.)
He knew that he was asking in vain ; he knew that their
minds were made up ; he knew that they were decided to
take the course pointed out to them by unwilling friends,
and hard taskmasters, but it would be a source of satisfac-
tioa to those Members on his side of the House' that they
had refused to accede to the proposition, and had voted in
opposition to a measure which could only be looked on as
an unjustifiable intrusion, and as an impotent resentment.
The Noble Lord sat down amidst great cheering
Mr. O'CONNELL should not have said one word if
he had not felt that he had an important duty to perform.
It was only a sew eof this obligation that should induce
him to address the House after the feeling and eloquent
address of his Hon. Friend the Member for Tipperary.
The Hon. Member for Kilmarnock had replied to him, and
no doubt he felt that he was a worthy antagonist, who had
given a complete answer to his Hun. Friend.—(Cheers
and laughter.) Next rose a man of a different character.
He had read somewhere, to quote a favourite phrase of
the Noble Lord, who had made use of it more than once
in the course of that debate, that the sight most pleasing to
the gods was a great man struggling with adversity, and he
supposed that the Noble Lord was of ioion that the next
sight was an able man struggling with a bad cause. The Noble
Lord's speech, besides many jokes, some good, some bad,
had consisted of a series of sophistries in legislation. He
should not have thought it fitting to spend one moment on
the speech of the Noble Lord, had it not been for some of
the documents which the Noble Lord had produced,
among others, a letter from a gentleman's agent to the
gentleman himself. He did not for one moment insinuate
that the Noble Lord had written that letter, and sent it
over to be copied.—( Cries of " Oh.") But if such
documents were admitted as authorities, such things
might be done.—( Hear, and cheers.) But he protested
most against the statements of an anonymous letter pur-
porting to have been written by a Roman Catholic who
was more liberal titan the Noble Lord; and it appeared
that his liberality consisted in stating that he was afraid his
name should be known lest he should be murdered. Did

the Noble Lord wish the House to imagine that Roman
Catholics were murdered in Ireland because they were
more liberal than he was? Was not this an imputation
on the Protestants? This was the first time that such
documents had been produced to the House. He would
put it to the House if the document produced by the Noble
Lord was entitled to authority, but great talents were com-
patible with great indiscretion.—(lronical cbeers from the
Opposition.) He thanked them for either part of the corn-,
pliment.—( Ministerial cheers.) The Noble Lord had
assumed his permament station, and it appeared that he
now belonged to the great party by which he was sur-
rounded, and a most compact party it was, for not one of
that party had arisen in the course of the present debate
who had not expressed a different opinion. Would the
Right Hon. Baronet adopt the principles of the lion.
Member for Sligo or of the Honourable Member
for Wakefield, or perchance he might adopt the principles
of the Hon. Member for Kent ?—( Cheerr. ) Was it on his
support and vote that the Noble Lord relied—on his, who
had last night in that House uttered the most atrocious
calumnies.—(Cheers, and cries of " Oider.")

The SPEAKER said he did not understand the lion.
and Learned Member to impute calumny personally to the
Hon. Member for Kent.
Mr. O'CONNELL—The Honourable Member had
stated that the Catholic Clergy were ignorant
and grossly immoral—a charge which, he said, was false
and calumnious, and he flung back with contempt and scorn
his atrocious calumny..—( Cheers.) Nothing could ex-
cuse such language, not even the ignorance of such extreme
brutality as is found in the county of Kent.—( Cheers, and
cries of " Order, order," " Chair, chair.")
Sir R. BATE SON rose to order. Such language
was not Parliamentary.
The SPEAKER did not know that it was disorderly
to impute ignorance to an Hon. Member.—(Cries of
" Brutality.")
Mr. O'CONNELL had said that ignorance to the ex-
treme of brutality, such as had been exhibited in his (Mr.
P.'s.) own county was no excuse for the charges brought
by him against the Catholic Clergy, and which could not
be palliated by the lowest state of degradation, such as
also existed in the county of Kent. He had calumniated a
body of clergy who laboured most earnestly for, and de-
voted themselves to the benefit of their flocks, and who
were regarded by them with the greatest affection. Such
observations were fit only for the atmosphere of Exeter
Cheers.) He could not attribute them to virtue,
" For virtue's self may too much zeal be had,
The worst of madmen is a saint run mad."

—(Great laughter and cheering.) He hoped the Hon.
Member would reserve his charges for a place where they
could not be replied to. Complaints had been thrown out
by the Noble Lord of the length of time the debate bad
taken, and he believed they were now in the sixth night—
An HoN. MEMBER—The fifth.

Mr. O'CONNELL—The sixth day had dawned on
them, but the question had not taken more time than ils
importance required. It involved propositions of the
greatest magnitude, and might produce consequences
of the most disastrous nature. It included two dis-

tinct and separate considerations—first, the jurisdiction
and authority of the House of Lords ; and second, a no
less subject than the good Government of what was called
one-third of the empire. If there was really any doubt
on the point, he would observe upon the paltry attempt
by which it was denied that the vote of the House of
Lords was not a vote of censure. At one moment it was
asserted, and denied at the next; and the Hon. Baronet
opposite had not the manliness to assert that the vote,
in its terms, was a vote of censure. Could it be de-
nied that it was essential to declare that the
system of government had rendered life and property in-
secure? But he was not disposed to detain the House on the
first point—the jurisdiction and authority of the House of
Lords. The mode of the decision would imply the power
of controuling the Executive, and appointing the Adminis-
tration. It was an attempt to take from that House the
influence over the choice of Ministers that ought
to belong to it alone. He did not mean that the
theory of the Constitution did not confer that influence
equally upon the House of Lords, but that theory became
inapplicable when the House became the representative of
a particular class, and when it became irresponsible.
Above all, he objected to that power, because, if the
Ministry misconducted itself, the House of Lords was the
only tribunal before which it could be impeached ;
and what could be so unfair as to prejudge that
which might come before them as Judges?—
(Hear, bear.) Nothing could be more unconstitutional
or more inconsistent with the principles of freedom.
It was an attempt to nullify the Reform Bill, and if they
succeeded, then the House of Commons would be nothing
more than a second Chamber of the House of Lords.
The Reform Bill was intended to take away from the
House of Lords that unconstitutional controul which made
their fiat fate, and which nominated the Administration
by their nominees in the House of Commons. If the
House of Lords succeeded in their present attempt the
people would have to begin the work of Reform again. They
must pare the nails and wrest the claws from the tiger of
aristocracy—thy must come to the charge again, and not
leave their work unfinished. Their vote that night would
not determine the question—it would remain in obscurity.
The House would recollect the statement of the Hon.
Baronet the Member for Wiltshire, when he was accused
of having perpetrated a lively sally, and spoke of the su-
perior wisdom of the House of Loirds.—( A laugh. )
He had done him (Mr. O'Connell) the honour
of making a personal attack upon him ; but that
was a common practice. He bad stated that he was not
at the Corn Exchange, and he (Mr. O'Connell) know
that he was not—he would not be either ornamental or
useful.—( Great laughter.) But when he did make that
scurrulous attack—( Cries of " Oh, oh,)—it was so dis-
tinctly—if he had been there he would have learned
that the sycophantic adulation of any man, however high
his title, would be left to the scorn he so well merited.
The Hon. Member for Belfast, in the palmy days of his
republicanism, had learnt them the expression
ofhe
the
infinitelyt
constitutionenth
g greater
transmittereaotef rt
hirneoptif a .
ortuafosneocolefs,baLnfoadrcdtels:
twoaisl lausttZaitTce.a"tßuu.atsthere
they were to govern Ireland in future ? Upon that question
he would meet the Noble Lord at once. He did not ask
for a vote of approbation on the Legislative Govern
mcnt of Ireland—(Tory cheers)—and for that they
had been taunted by the Right Honourable Baronet
opposite. Nothing could be more unfair than to put the
question in that way to the House, inasmuch as the opposite
party would not allow them to carry out their policy in Ire-
land. It might be good party tactics ; but, at all events, it was
neither common sense or common honesty.—(Cheers.)
They might want to change the principles of the Govern-
ment of Ireland. Oh ! change them, and then see what a
situation they would be in. Was British dominion so much
cherished ? Was there so little of jealousy among Irish
people of a Tory rule, that the change might be lightly
made. They domineered over the country for 700 years,
(Laughter.) He should not be surprised if Hon. Gen-
tlemen did not know the history of Ireland, but
so
stpi
ou
nsd4u.
hisr in
theg
fingermtuh,ed e
row:, h
tothi l
the slaughters,
ysui
Irsoaeaafultnatgdenhtmsdht
Ireland. She
rftt s
them,
hlhahocanenmtdg;htihsaa
hpedi
oebr.4bbuire:i r
showing
yn:.
he would defy any of them to put their finger upon any
bright
eci g couldba tg g er'
imnagsic.
tCo o
duoldthey
commonh o jwu s thine
taon
swindled out of her native Parliament, and they had
multiplied their abomination to such a degree—
they had tow fixed the tribute to such a degree--
at the time of the Union Ireland owed 2 800,0001.
England at the same thee owed 45,000,0001.—( Hear,
hear.) They had taken upon themselves to pay the
2,800,0001 , but they' had thrown upon the back of Ire-
land the 45,000,000/ —( Haar, and " No, no.") How had
they tre ited Ireland 1 eely ? By the Reform Bill they had
given Eagland an extension of franchise, while they had
greatly restricted the franchise in Ireland. To such a de-
gree had this been carried, that the county of Anglesea
alone, with its 4,000 inhabitants, was possessed of as many
voters as the county of Clare, which had a population of no
less than 702,000. Then had they not for three
years refused all corporate reform. (Loud cries of
.4 No, no.") Who s rid " No, no."—( Great laughter. )
for three years, they had been attempting to make the
franchise so high, as that the many should have beeu ex-
cluded, and that the whole of the privilege should be
centered in the bands of the few. Was it nothing that
the people of Ireland were obliged to support the Church
of the minority, it was not so in either England or Scotland,
and the people of Ireland felt it as a great grievance. It
was quite true that they had got no legislative relief
m
upon any one of those things, he had only mentioned the
in order thot Hon. Gentlemen should consider before they
gave their vote against a motion that would tend
to excite disorders in that country. He asked
the House whether at any period of history the people of
Ireland had declared themselves satisfied with the Execu-
tive Government, that period had now come ; he stood
there in the name of his constituents and the people of
Ireland, to tell the House that thee were grateful to the
Executive Government of Lord Nermieb —( Cheers. )
justice and
They had got the r2ign of •Y.
impartiality at last