The Sun.
London, England, 1808-05-26 00:00:00

PRIVILEGE.

Sir FRANCO BURDETT, Adverting to the commu,
nication which be had thought it his duty to make
to the House on a former night, relative to certain
poceedings in one of the Courts below, which ap-
peared to him to trench upon, the Privileges of that
'louse, informed the House that the practical con-
sequences, for which it had been recommended to
bim to wait, had now taken place. 'He surd the
House, that in bringing this veigiou again brfore

wrong.
Mr. TrERNRY was convinced that there could be
no Ad amounting to a breach of the privileges of
that House,, which the power of that House could
nut reach. " He thot.ightlhat this was a very grave
and serious question, asit affecled the privilegei of a
Member of-that House. But here.lwbegged.tm.be
• nnderstood not to-mean the slightest refleetion upon
,tbe Noble and Learned Judge, than whom no per-
set more able or upright, nor less likely to:lnterfere'
with the'privileges bf that House, had ever sat upon
the Wench. No Judge, hosvever, was, infallible,
and theliraeliee of the Court below sixlwed the, pos-
' sibillty:of. a Judge-being mistaken, '.[his question
~,rlsfeog'their peivileges oughtlobe set-at rest. It
t Peen said that the expence was only two or three
hundred,poueds; but if there had been but two Pan-
didate4; it might have been tool. Which would., have
:seen a very heavy penalty upon a Candidate having
only his qualification of 3001. a-year. •
LitYctsTEß denied that the fait of the Ho- .
nonrablellaronei having-the benetit of the elettion,
was the ground ;upon which the verdid against the
llon. Baronet had been founded. It had been
lett to the Jury to decide, whether, under all the
circumstancee.of the case, the'FlonOurable Baronet
was not liable.. It had been proved that the agent.
its his iwereat, and particularly one Percy, .had, day
after day, clematichAt seats for the check clerks
employed during the election. The Hon. Baronet
seemed to have taken his itsformation krom. inaccu-.
rate tuxes or hearsay, oust not tram ftnrauthentic
source. Tlw, vircomitance of the Hon. .13ortitset
travia;; takCit Ms seat, might have been mentioned,
but he was certain that it was not the ground upon '
which the learned Judge. bad direCted the.Jary to
find against the Hon. Gentleman,
Air.; Titsa N r Y explained._
IiATI/U 452- declared, the more he had heard
this, subret discussed, the more he was convinced it
was utterly impessible for the House to interfere.—
If they could net have Ines brought before them
which could not be found upon the record, the
,House could not go into thesdiscussion. The Hon.
Baronet therefore was right in not submitting any
motion to the House upon the 'subjett, as it would
`lead to no practical. result.
The SPEAKER, after what had passed upon this
aubietit, felt it incumbent upon him to state the views '
which he had upon the suhjed, reference having
been made to what had fallen from him on a former
evening. As far as he could recollefit what he then
said, he had not advised the Hon. Baronet to wait fir
any peatlieal 'consequences that might result from
the 'proceedings of the Courts below. and then bring
the matter before the House ; but that when those
cotatequenees should Was place, if he should then
tanttilpe of opinion that they amounted to a breach
of The privileges of the House, he should submit it to
I the consideration of the House. But as to the ques-
, lion ipmeratiy, if brittle should be held by any
Judge upon the bench, which was injurious to the
privileges of- that tiottie, that House would rap-

CATHOLIC PE:rITIONS.
StIELUDANT presented a Petition from the Ro;.
man Catholics of the County of Wexford, praying
relief from fhe civil disebiliiies to which they are at
present exposed.—Ordered to lie on the table.
Similar Petitions were then presented from the
Romae Catholics of Waterford, of the County and
Chi of Kilkenny, of the County of lorry, by Sir
John Newport, Mr. Butler,And Mr. M. raege.
raid; which were severally ordered to lie on the
table. •
Mr. SHAW (of Dublin) presented a Petitioe.front
the Lord-Mayor, Atdernien, and Common Council
of the-City of Dtablitis; against the catholid.Peiition
and Claims,, Wilide“Wt~s also ordered to lie db dais
Mr. GRATraelfteti rose, and moved that the .Pee
titian which he had presented from. the .1.10 man ce.t
thOcs of Ireland be read; which haviog been read
accordingly,
Mr. GitArr&N again rose, and adverting to the
Petition which had just been read, •the nember of
signatares, ail ite4l soul' to the vev,:r3l-11:
titions which had been that day laid upon the table
upon, the same .subject, was conlident that the.
House must feel that the Petitions contained the
sense of the Catholics of Ireland. In what he had
to say, therefore, on this occasion, be should
sumo that they spoke the sense et the 'Catholics of
Ireland. The Petitioners formed a considerable
portion ofthereleiloraef that. House ;. they possessed
political.. power; they applied to the constitutional
organ for a legitimate objet. Theyrayer it their
Petition he would recommend to, the Spirit of
Concord, that nothing might be said in the
debate which._ would sharpen the feelings of the
public mind : and that, whatever might be the
decision, though the restalt should n-‘: be according
to that prayer,. yet nothing should occur in the die-
CUSSiOn which might add irritation to disappainttlent.
Irb those Gentlemen • who might be indisposed to the
case Of the Petitioners, he would recommend toe to
go back"to former times—not to go back to the
Battle of the Boyne—uot to go back to the year
1745—n0t to those periods when both parties were,
engaged in the heat of contest and divisions. It
Gentlemen go back to these periods, the Catholics
will go badk 864. If tou make out your case against
them, they will make out their case against you.—
Then it will be 'history against history—the man of
blood against ire man of blood—both patties will re-
nnin nurt.iretielled and irreconcilable, whilst the
victory will belong to the common enemy of
both.— 'I not now loolc.back to those
perlo44, .iyhen oppression and violence were pro-
&lced by the tiny of bigotry, lutoxiCated with vic-
tory. Tice two nations, in settling their accounts,
would have somethiugto admire in vach, any much
to forget. [he `Nurse of event rendered the ceasing
of religious animosity fundamentally and absolutely
tvevess:ff for the very existence of the.empire. What-
ever ditlerence of opinion there might be as' to the
which kept up these distinetions, there was none
as to disposition. The good sense of both nations
had produced an etfea on the spirit of the Country,
friendy-.10'.a, more liberal and tmlightened system
of policy.' It-was therefore with regret that he had
oh a late occasion seen written ou tie: walls, abuist
this city, the words,
." No Popery.,' ,it was
with very great regret Its saw Petitions presented
to that House against the of th 4 Cgholics
as it etrumatieg trout a fanatical people? devoted to
the rancorous bigotry. anxious to proscribe a great
portion of :the ir-felltiwssebjeas, It was, theretere,
with more satisla&ion he observed that, on the pre-
sent occasion, only one petition of that description,
that presentw„: that day (by Mr. ShaW) had been prom
&ming ainst the Pethionsof the CatholiCs. Thiti was
a demonstration of the, favourable dispusititei of the
pobliq mind. And it would indeed be strange if
the contrary were to have been the case,w bast the Go-
vernment of the country • had given such He example ,
of the liberality of its feelings t9w. Ws Catholics.
The Government bad takeo Cetholiesinto its pay in
the service of, the State—it had established the ca..
tholic Religion in tanada---it had maintained a cloSe.
alliance with,Alse Catholic Power Auarriait Matt
restored the Ppo—it bad in a yeeent instancewisely
told vuerouiV pri?ttekod the Catholic Royal

of Portogni
.in its emigra tiorqo the lir:tzps, in all this
the Clovernment hail nif,ited inost it
.planted Popery in North Ainerica and Soinh Athe-
yica, Government atlvd upon the soundest policy,
and at the same titne 'its condua . showed. the inno-
`cence olPepery. None of the,fortner connexions
'of this Country no* remained on the Continent--,4,.
Ave had now no. Allies there—it only remained,
therefore, for the Lgislature,to. provide- for,, the se-
'curitl, of the Enipircp,bytiniting in closer connexion
-all classes of 04 own pe,ople. The Petilioncrs pray-
od that they might be• atlinitteil-to all the offices of
'Stare-, to nil the departments of the Public SerNice,,
and to seats in Parliament. the A& of the 33d of
the: 'King' gave, to the Catholics political power
when it gave them the clee.iive franchise
gave them adinksion to all offices, civil,. naval,

and military; laving some eXCeptions, about for
ty, in nembet,; and the :Petitioners now prayed
against these exceptions, and applied for adtnis‘ion
to all. Bat befiire he proceeded to 'consider the
prayer of these Petitions., should first examine
some ohjedians which' were ordinarily urged against
tile Catholics. It was objeded against them that
they acknowledged the temporal power of a foreign
Potentate, and that they were not bound by the ob-
ligation of an oath. What • was this but to say,
that those men who constitute a .great portion.
of. the army and navy of 1116 Country,
.are de:;-
tiitue of those principles that are necessary for the
prOervation of the social coinpaa, awl the maio-
tdnanee of all civil, 'government ; tleit,the religion is
.ekeerable„ and all who protess it,' unworthy of any
riglits or prillege‘
,whatever? as if' the_ Catholic
rtligien was not professed by the greatest propor-
tion 4 Europe. It tilt" oojection be well founded, it
would follow that the Christian Iteligian is illusive.
The objectors riltiq eithe,,,r give up their objections,
or thk,,divinity. rat .Tho ,cnristiart Religion'.. 'ln the
year 1791 several quest:ons were prop;ised to six of
tkie Most eminent,Vniversilies ott. the Continent, on
bite, sebjed of these objections. The questions were
submitted to the Universities Of Paris, Thauay, St.
Q,nter's, Alcala, and Salamanca, and, the answers
Were, thlt the Catholics did aclinoWledge the tem4.
ppial power of the Pope; ilia;: they did not believe
that the Pope. could absolve ,subjectts from their alle-
glance to their' Sovereigns ;, that ' they did not hold
the doarines.,that, faith was nO to be kept with
betetics—and that. they did knit act nowledgein the
?bee etc her tvrnporal or deposing powers. These
*ere the ari,wers, given by these learned. gniversitih,
Under: a teelieg of moral indignation, that such
sholdd have been ascribed to Catholics.—
Whatetrer nay be field as the orthodox doc—
trines upon other parts, of their religious perina-
sion, tltese tenets have been .utterly condemned as
met terming any part of the Catholic Vaith. He was
justified in. concluding, therefore, that thee tenet.;
forth ne part Of the Catholic Faith. The Catholics of
Ireland, too, had repeatedly renoutieed these doc--
trines. .By the 13th and 14th of his Majesty they'
bad abjured the temporal power of the Pope; by
the Ad of 1792 they badlikeWise abjured that doc-
trine, and renounced any pretenhion to the property
of Ireland. By the Atit of the aid of the King they
had also cdsclainit?d the infallibility of the Pope, as
formin,-; no, part of the Catholic Religion, and undcii
that Ala, too, the swore to maintain. the Proteatant
Establishist:qn and the State. There was no mural
Isotnpatibility, therelme, between the two religions.
Bo', say the objedors, there is a political ineompati-
bnity. Let us examine that point. They contend
ti,'lat the Catholic Religion is incompatible with an
at 13C111ZIClit to a
,Protestant, Prince,'but favourable to
a connection With a Foreign Power ; as if the doc-
trine of transithiitantiation, and the celebration of the
Mass, Were, not coesisteot with allegiance to a
Pi'atestant -C Government. To suppose such a 'thing,
would be its great a miracle as tranobstantiation it-
self. There is not, there cannet be, in either any
ofdetacitment or ottaehment. , What has
taken place in America, as well as in Europe, proves
that en, the Continent there has been a silent im-
provement, a political .reform in' prngressive opera-
tion. Sueh.a change as Mr. Payley had in contem-'
phi.ion,, when Site said, that if the Catholics and the
rthteAants were left to thetn'selve3, Withotit ex-
citing animosities, the Catholics would soon ac-
quire the Mildness of the Protestants. It would be
recollected, that there had been no Protestant com-
bination in America. The American Protestant 4nd
Catholic combined with the letench, WereCatho-
tics, and the difference of their religious creed never
interfered with their vigorous co-operation for their
common object,' 'At present, this country had no
Protestant
..Atty—no Ally upon the-Continent heat

Sweden. On -the cuntraiyt Pretestains and Catholics

ixAre formed into an Anti-Englith:;Confederacy. if
ns :Proteatants we could not. find any Ally on the
Continent, were we by giving ourselves op to the
rairkucAs of religious hig6try, to deprive the country
of the services of So large a proportion of our fellow
subjeCts; to depauperate every efficient branch of
the public establishment. By sO.doing they would
not give the country fair play.- It would lite._
vitahly become the vidtim of the tolerant spirit of
the Continent, and the religious bigotry of its own.
11,4 tihonlet eonwrid therefore there was'
no political incompatibility with a Protestant Geytni_.
mein in the Catholic reiigion, whilst there was a
strong pOlitical necessity to unite all CIIISSeS of the
people, by removing ail civil disabilities on the acore
cif felt ion. Jt o:iution of the most rational
political writer,, thai testa were- symbOical of poll..
tieal sentiments.' The opinion was Sound as a ge.
neral prolio§ition, though not perhaps universally
true. As a general proposition, it would not. be
deniod that all ,the cla-ses of subjects bad a right to,
laws—that the State had a right to the assist.
mice and services of all the talen4 of its subjects--
Oat the State had not a right to imposts arbitrary'
tests. There WO a case, however, in which the State
rigs jits4ied in imposing such tests,when the religion
of some of the stihjeCts was the meilintn of foreign at-
taeliment. Here the case was not so. There was no
for,ji,n ,ittaciiment,. for the object of it had long
ceased. :it was not 'poSSible to stinniSe any 4breigo
CO01)01101) through $31,0 only with the
Pori. 1... et that be examined. It is but a name--
tit >„,...tholics consider Inot but as the Interpreter,
IneVC spiritual Pope—ttbjurcd
iri a 1;. coieg-,--hi all mix,ed—particniarly
in a:4 tHe cases, and those that
,relate
in any t.'.! State. But it was' objetted.
that marriages, 1 C,t course in herninices, Were
go pjt:Ateti 'to the j flt the Pope. The.
;ilea ahhitti and un.iinitron4. 'The House

. .
• knew that marriage was a eleil contra& eply'a
and -that the course of itilierliance W4S g'OOFlO,
.by the law, of the.Colintr.a 'That-their ithheritilince-:
is governed by the late ate the land, thetaca'llaireata,
by their.having loot; that inheritances-a-witatsethea,'
stX
and nth of Williarn—witneas the i ptle Geo!IL. a - .
again the ead Geo. 11.---aaais,thar disinherited We .
Catholics, by dissolving their Marriages:. vria:! nott-
part .1.0, be conaidaaed - Wtl4-titli,po.***-I.o;etthsTfTlti-
nication. This power the. (,lathes insiat has parer,
been eMployed .or t t 1
.e.npot:i.l pitrpniv:i ; 00
.irtil.,c.!n7
natty, persons excommuniCated in L'cli,lll4, may e(ipi
SiSilgtlat fiii and every temporal comfort, ixing,ey.7
eluded only from_ the sacrament.. It lili been oh-
jelled against.the Catholic Clergy t00,.'! nil in pt inted
works, that they deny the right- nt the Protestant
Clergy to tythes—that they assert their 'own. right
to tythes—ahat they deny an existence to the.Proa
testant Establishment—that they claim a legal exist-
erica fur a Catholic Eatablishmeot, and that they ern-
ploy excominutrication -to temper:l)a. Th,,,e charges.
the Catholic Priesthood have airawered, by, a flat
denial to every one, and all this they declare therm.
selves ready to i wear.• at the same tiine appealing
to their fellow-subjeds for a correboration of their
declaration, ExCominunicatien was now confined to
the higher orders of the Clergy, and very rarely re-
sorted to. Dr. Troy, who has the most' populous
Bishoprick in Ireland (Chrk)'has stated, 'that only
two instances of excorninunieation luta oceurreet
during his incumbency; and that only two, likewise,
had occurred in the whole ofitia predecesiot'sadini-
, nistration of that See. Under .all these eiromate
stances, he appealed to the House, whether 'tibia
power of execnumuoication or the infiaeuce okthe
Pope could be looked upon as dangerous. That ina.
flaience was ptvely•spiritual, and Aid not exteed,
even to the appointment of the Members of his Ca-
-1 tholic . Hierarchy. .
,They 'nominated themselves,
I •aod looked to the Pope but tOr his-spiritual Anai,,,,,,
of web. nOrninatio,n. But it: it should t' suPlawed.
that there was the smallest danger in this course,
I he - had a iproposition to suggest,,, which. he hid
authority to it which-it-roved 'ne was instructed
to. make, namely, that lair )NajeatY may inter-
fere upon any such, oceaaioa with his negativea....,
This would have the effect of preventing any Ca-
tholic. Ecelesiaatie being advanced to the goaern-
, merit of that church in Ireland, who was not politi-,
cally 4 pproved of by the Gerveroment of that country.
It' it was true that Buonaparte halt contront over'tlie
Pope-a-the Pops o'er the Catholic Clergy in Ireland
---arid the Catholic f.,:iew'over. the Catholie Laity
there ; then it followed t12..3t .Beietaattarte hat, ii, OAP,
trout four a large proportion at- the British army pod
navy. It was in the preaent situation of things,
therefare, Wallet) a =trout existed, that the chewer
was to be apprehended, and not lime granting t'the
prayer of the Petitioners. The proposition he had
now made would remove all that danger at once, and
establish the moral and political iatirety of his Ma.
jesty'redominions. He asked of Parliament, there-
fore, to accept his proposition and grant the prayer
of the *Catholics-4o invigorate the Constitution
by conneding the Catholic People with the Par-.
Willem, and conneding the Kiog with the Cattle,
lie Clergy; by the interference which he a wattld
exercise with the appointments. So far he had
argued the subject on the general grounds. He'
came next to COOSICItt it air applied, to Great Aritain.
and Ireland. It had been objeaed that the atilliit
at' the Catholics were itiColliitifCnt with the Deo-hula
don otillights, and the Oath prmtibed. by that hi,
strument. But if that were the case, he must as.
sert that the Revolution, which established alitali--
berties of this Country, was-fraught with ilitherality
to Ireland, and the Declaration of Rights would be
fatal to its own objed. Yet it' they she uld look .to
any fundamental law upon the subledi how would
the case stand ? The first ihatalice in which it had
been prescribed wail in 1541, when it passed by a
• Vote of the two Houses, but without any legislative
authority.—lt was afterwards, in the year sixtporie,,,
enjoined by a Resolotioa of both Hooses of Parlia.
Mont, without becoming an A& of the Legislature,
Then it had the srindion cif the Britiali Legiata-
'turd, in a for Mal Mt, but that was an Act of op,.
pressiou, that could not bind the List) Legialatere.,
The Ala of William, which re-enacted the proa
vision, was also in A of oppression. it was not
until the year 1782, that the enc.& of these Ads,
and the oaths they enjoined, , were done away_ by
a Bill . introchiced by an Horiourable Friend, of.
his in that Hoese. What,. however, was the
oath that had been enjoined. It was a . vio-
, lafion of the principle of the DCOaratioll of Rights,
arid of the Act • of Settlement, which had after-
wards been established. These constitutional in
moments required that the King should be Protetie
' tam, They did not reqnire that the two other branches
of the Legislature should also be Protestant, This
he positively denied ; as the principle upon which
both rested wasathat the State should have the benefit
of all the talents of all descriptionS of subjects in the
other branches atilt Legislature.- The principle 44 triie
provision therefOre was different .from the principle
of Ow iiVerence. It never could follow that because
it was .expres,4y provided that the, king should he a
Pretestaut, that the other branches of the Legisla,
tore should b Pthtestaet too. The, principle ofthe
provision, was consistency, the principle of the in-
ference ihtolerance. It was a fundanaental law of
the Empire since the Union, that the Coannons part
of the Legislature should be'.eleded by CatholiCs.
They ruetat extend their ceostittition, therefore, or,
abandon lt, by excluding one-4114.0t the population
of the empire from any ahem in the Legislature. It
they were to look for existence or duration :for the
Empire, they should grant the application of the Pea,
deniers. What were the dangers which menaced the
Country ? either domestic treason and insurrections,
err the powes and attacks •tif the external enemy.—
Would the internal danger, therefore, , be more it'
they were to have Catholics amongst theist, and'fill-
ing offices of trust and''confidence, , who could at,
fectually awl equally manage .and regulate the lie.
mourn toll protettathe .lititeec-St3 of the- ileapk; ~...,.
WOUld the danger-be' more if the people were to he
attached tolheic ciovernmintt. by a common 'partici,
pation. of,,aivil and pelnieg rights, and tho•Goverea
meet aepported by the onion and zealous cotopers..
tiett of all classes (if its subjects?, Would not the dam.
ger from the external or, tatreign enemy 'be inure, if
by an injudicious arid its course the,Legivlature
were tot ivethat enemy the power of soothingthe
mortification, firing the resentment,-and exciting the
,imbition (At: one.fittilef..tbe,populatiota of tho ef,illi.
try/ But if ever there was any civil incomp.itiw.

. .
lityiwould the ConstitutiOu be safe after wtttidrating
selarge a proporeett,of its
,teopular suppe4ts I I the
.tre safe when its reots4re.eut away -I Is the capi--
eefirteewhe.n its base is rerreoved Whf had
.they
net ex.lended theite'r nininseAoteand their Levy en
• .Nieese to I7elatid.? Becau they had not extended•
'thou. Constitution
,to .:that Country, • Parliament
was no ix to strike upon that shore whose
leanity enftertt d. no;' tope of" safety, or slieligr=
,Getalceeele ijght: say, Celt it Arai .necespary to re-
41st t ho cleintsi in feeler to guard 1 he,,,,,Chereb
and State kle:boyed, titcy erught be seeneed;
lett ht e ase.w.cetlftdente,,iliat \ neither- Church letor
state could be safe„.uulesseby the union and co-
operation of all descriptions of subjeas in the com-
mon cause. It had' been Objetled that Catholic
Counsellors tort Pr4testant King 'would be ae anti-
Maly. That he denied. It was not an anomaly foe
Henry the Fourth of Fretted -to be served by .Stilly„
nor that LoniS should ernployTurenee:
idea was absurd, and under the impression of sticli
a bigoted notion, he would ask` Whether they \meld
be ready conscientiously to deprive,one-fifth at the
Population of the Ettpire of 'their just and legiti-
mate rights ? It had been said, t hat the objet of
the Catholics was; to establish the Cetholic'Church.
To this his answer was, that the.V•lial, and could Gave,
do etch intention, their ob)eLt Was to obtain aeets
'Parliament, and be admiseible en all the 'other ottipes
of the State. This was Treinch more` constitutiopef
objea then that of those who wished for a monopoly
of Parliament, and to excinde se I •a,pertiou
their felloW. aubjeas froth all the emitieot affibes
of the State. The Catholics' had been accused of
treason because they refused' to take the Oath, of
supremacy, which the Disseritere did not take, find
front their attachment terthe'DOpe. This charge too,
is urged after the repeated declarations of Parka=
mein to thecontrary; after the -A6t
gave them political power, end recognised the' prin-
ciple of their claims. As .to their •endeavotiring,
it advenced to power, to overturn the 'Protestant Re-
ligion and establish their own, that objealen- was"
founded upon the Sally as the former opinions, that
Catholics were incapabheof -every virtue and eapeble,
of every vice—art execrable race' not to, be softened
by any mild treattnene. It waS here to beohseried,'
that the 'Catholics paid the Protestant Clergy, and
that could certainly be no geed ground 'for rellising
their claitns: Those who , tirged-'-sttelf Charges 'and
justified them,upon the score of religion; rendered
even Omnipotence subservient tri.their vile purposes.,
They accommodated the Deity with a certain por-
tion of our Vices and iniquities. The casuists lost sight
of the Deity, and of his most heavenly attribetei, and
endeavoured to found the immortality of the Church"
upon a forgetielnes, of birth, It was only upotilhe
mild. and beneficent qualities that belong to the Au-
thor of all religion that they should found the stability-
of the Church, and say of it, " estO perktup." But
whilst bigots- overlooked the Deity and his attri-
butes, they did not lose sight of 'a little. profitable
Church establishment. They set up their' Own
passions as the diaates of religion, .and.profaned,
the worship of the Deity, by making it the pretext
for extravag3ncies. The Protestant Establishment'
should not be propped or bolstered up 'by any eq.',
temptible Test Laws: How, he would ask, were
the Catholics to. overturn the Church Establish-
ment ? It roast be either by law or by figee, • If by
law, they must become the majority, which no per.
son can apprehend ; and by admitting their claims, a
constitutional diredtion would be'givelt td their,
sical- force. So at least it 'would besaid'Of Turks-or
Heathens : but that is tio(the language in w Web fel-
low Christians are spoked of. 'They areto he styled
an execrable sea, which 'the more they get the
more they tfemtnid. So it 'was thitt sects Of
tiaras were accustomed to speak .of etadh other. It
was asserted that the' rish Catholics were hostile to
the State, and to those who professed the religion'
ef•the State.' -It was not as belonging to irelend that
:they could ha supposed to be se, for then the Irish
Protestants would beequally actuated by the same
hostility. 'lt was not as Catholics that the imputa-
tion mild attach to them ; for then the Catholics of
England would be equally liable to it.' The_ sub-
stance of the chatgc • than, if it had any in it,
ipplied neither to the Irish charaCter, nor to the
Catholic principles, but to the defect of the law:—
. He therefore begged' Gentlemen to consider the
very dangerous mischief that flowed from laws of
this sort,
,which had in themselves the' substan-
live causes of hatred and hostility in the bdsom of
the State. Ile could, indeed, ..conceive it possible
-that a certain sting may have been left behind'by the,
fong and grinding operation of the penal-laws, which
May continue to operate notwithstanding the repeal
Of those laws. But let it not be therefore said, that
the Catholics were governed well, but that their,per-
verse and recreant spirits were not to be reconciled.
• This was as much as to say that man had done all
that was possible for them, but that Gpd had made
-them so much amiss as to be absolutely incorrigible.
'lire, root of the evil lay in an absurd code of laws,
and.Perliament had, of course, the remedy in its
own bands. - He • woeld recite to the period of
the, repeal, of the *Test AU, and he would cite
the words of a- great. Law Lord, who describ-
ed 'the penalties of the Catholic as beginning at
his birth,' and perseeuting Itito till his death.-
The. penal laws received him at his birth,, they
stood by hie- bridal bed,, and they did not leave
hint at rest even in'his coffin :- these dreadful penal-
ties were partly repeale.d by the Irish Parliament, and,
it renniintel now for the Imperial Legislature to re- •
move that part of the bsrthen that Was. still in
forde. The- Irish nation was told that there were
many narrow spirits- in its Parliknent, and certainly
there . were some who! world always endeavour to
thwart any large measure iii favotir of the Catholics,'
but that an Imperial Parliament would be' regulated by
libetel principles, and would legislate on a grand scale.
i7le now called for the pert4mance of the promise.
He would proceed to the argtiment, if such it could
he caned, pfdaugers,likely to reshlt to the scellement-
of 'property k Ireland, in the event of admitting the,
Catholics to political preiver. Great alarm had been
excited by the-map of Ortetues, containing thedistri-
WOOof the lands dpropertylameng the antient pro-,
priet9R, The,faCtWASe- however; that this likened
been, made for tho use or tit Govemment,, 'by
W. been,
, and that a ruprtoo having been preserved";
in. fir4w,, a eeptebf that copy had. been • obtained •by
'a person us the -ierrice this &high 'Government,
is wetter. of history. And thise was' the "Sottrelte:
and eitvlutqaoceit of-that puttliCetion whielt gave s 0;: f.
muesli Unnecessary ill: 'there. were kw Catholics

• • •
Who could claiin by aritieht descent,ll that clattn
would be alloWed. But there were many- who hell
by ,reeent, purchase. „ It w?s net true that the Catba,
lies had so small a share as some stated in the landed
property of Ireland. Their, ,proportion was half a mil.
lion in fee simple.-- One Noble Lord of that penes..
. sion (the .Ent,l2si lienalate). was.. Propriotembef laudi
to the v;‘ I 9P: -4-.70.0004,4 y.ear, ..tht.a4sh- he stliti-set
mean to smy that -the Noble-- Lerd-received all.that.
—Was a revoltnion•hr landed property-to-be appre•
!tended frompersotis co eircurnstauced ? With respett
to the tetiantryoi:Ahe Unman (;allnalic persuasion',
they were in. a state of great poverty, from which
thy could not tiossibli -wade into a S41101)00 1.0.#1
formidable to the landed proprietors. 'They co
take possession of the land only by force of*artnft
er.by force• of law ena&ed for the purpose, V*
relief which he proposed now to give, would net
add to the physical strength Of the Catholics,, and
would rather be a reason for exercising that
strengths" in:defence of the State. ,And as co tit*
attainment of general possession Of landed property
6y a , l'Arliargcntary . tnea#ure, , it; was-necessary, pit*
violas, to.,:,that, to have a tuajority .01 Catholics td,
P4li:ttat.tuto,whicli could only .be- cffeaed by first
gelt-iog-Romessiork of -- that very lauded ProPealA
xt.hiclf tbilxery l'ar.kiantent was. to, afford the tnaitlk
4r, e I
.t ering upon. How great was the a UstkEt
dity of dreading as' a, consequence what should ,t 1,
1.1
~.gist-as tliti cause of the consequence so dreaded..
&dee:to stop divisions, dangerous, in the ev,:ht o
An invasion; -noW to much to be' readea, the Pe,s roi=.
taut inhabitants -Of many of the counties, thens.ibill
that-their Protein-ant Establishment and Protestant.
State could not .be defended. witbout the aid of ittilt
! Catholics,, had, presented Petitions in favour of the
.: claims of the Catholics. There -were nitre cumuli's
M all-that-had shewn thii • noble-mtmople of libel
rainy and sound, policy. .The Ctiantiegs of Clare and
Galway .had; at meetings convened by the Shea;
expi-!sssed their 'ardent wish for : admitting Amp'
qi,f„)l..ic brethren to.the bilaietiis of the Consaktutioa.
In the. coynties of Tipperary, kilkenny, ftosedittl
won, Wall:110d; and Meath, and m the tUwu Pi,;
NgwtY, res'olittiOns to the sane eireet were eliterO
into; not perely by the Proteitant gentry and ille.
hahitaitts, bat by the great bulk of the ProteitaA
lauded proprietors. This recommendation, he CO'.'
tended, was' owing not to the initierice. of li'pertililt,
and confidence merely, not• to the absence of all s'in'e
piciois of an intention 'to invade the Linde& ptir
perty at a convenient opportunity, but to li'tr
stronger and more immediate feeling of the.alag4
a, divided Country would have to- encounter in. Ga
of an it vasion from au active and liowertul-EnesnY:.
On this principle there wise. Yretes!ants clepreol
the terrible privilege of an extensive moutVolf '
constittAiohal right and, political power. On till!
priociple,Jbey caine to offer up their monopoly, raid
to beg the admission of others to defend, as a coo:
'Won right,. the-66-iififiy, WithOili the Snflicient -le*:
fence of which neither the preiervation of politio.t
power, nor. of landed prbperty,..-cOuld be hoped**
.They came to offer up their monopoly for tht Pre'ol
yation of Great. Britain- andlrelargt it their recotr
niendation was acceded to, it would be the means of a.
greater power of defence than could be looked to front,
the ,Local Militia 'or. the Levy. ell Masse. ' 'WI.I
answer was to be given to the recommendation,ooo
to the "Petition ? Weultl,- it be. said, 4lat - though:4l
ready thought worthy of the participation of MI
eleClive franchise, and thbugh now offering a coi,ll-
troll- over the, eh action of their DishoPi, the Qi?,t*
point In which' tlie power of. the Pope is esereiS;di
the present prayer...was .to 'be tejetled ? Would 111,
House of Com-mons 'say; "INo, we will klivo 11I1,;
country to its. ditiSions, Mid the church to the l'epc'_,-.
Thoudi the'.prayet of the Petition. may not he o°'
• iiinnt.7liately 'granted, it, could not be deferred 10!,.4.
W:is•it thenVvorth while, for a tenipinary,pwwo4''
whicti Would soot, become open awl -general, to 10v0
.the Colutry to its diSsentions, and -the •clittrcl!tl
the Poi :e ? Was it worth while to for brie`..
objet the recommendation of .so large a portion. _
the Protestants of Irelands? It was cOnteiniect,- titl:
the °hied of the Petition was ofd no ‘t;i4l-41, ~?i
that- it. Wa::, little, regarded or desired by the. r,,il.
tioners tbemSelVes, But „would it be. Cottto"4",,
• by those who-expended so much labour and-ltia64, '
in seekins; seats in' Parliatnent, that seats. in I)4li'
liament were 'of no value, _. or that it Was 'll3Btte!: 0
-no moment to suhjeCt .any dais of men .to Ou'
sion from them ,? • It 'IVLIS Said the,Catholics vk'cr''. nut,,
desirous of seats in .• Parlianient, and, the declarT,,
tiolt of Connaught was cited in proof. Buttb°"4III10
rebellion 'was not 'denounced as a conserlitent:e of
refitsal, it did not' lbllew that the. boon, ,if givcil'.
'would not be justly and highly valued; fittlP.4l")2l.
cure could not be satistied'with.exelusion,lcoul st'i
firms of hor‘our and dignities, and theexclUsion.°'
etwhxaecileuil:llliotle:X:Cir:ltsiS exclusion "et ght
eir)aediiiliPlogrr6altit'di r4dei I:ht olal.tiudratbi re: i. 1/81:11rfiet
highest degree. If there was an indifference lo tb,3e,
.11.n.eegnits/tatru) :le;
Constitution
it roved that the Catholici wc,r,..
so subdued by tyrant ig.vi, 'diet the spirit of attact
tt oh their,.
1.)l a :11 tf. ai t svOuall:t.iitbtolu.t. ittl)iftle) wvh;l'aossaydeeTsditlri,3l,lt-bg-li.:::eilletat':ll3i'lait(4: ,
it from the centre to the ,extrernities. Till
~j 1;"
was done,. the exertions of the State' wow-
crippled, , and. instead of sendidtiinti''er'sibitco tictjnttl:
the enemy abroad, it would be neices9a,ty tQ'
'l4-4.iti?
them at. borne to defend Ireland. In every,.`
that' was to .be taken, the gover,lioleht W°
be haunted by the penal' laws. .it Wits netlc'
sary now to place things on such a foOting, t"
soldiers may be called upon not to light fur drier ale) .
but for Ale corogiltitiotr... .Now there wat 114 t'ld
povver of using the language that may 'oe addr,eisc,&
to their pride. ankl-to their passion;.-- Ho bitd ntr•O.o
it said, that 'the oath of the King at his coroliatie-,
was ihcompalit>le ;with, the p,issurt; of the reliyf.P°,
sought for by the Catholics. It was no; Parliainebla',/,'
to talk'of Abe teelingsof air' Kiog. But for tlio,e ft:ILI
ti'lligoitigliteitt7tdattlil;3:ollbilgelliite4CAA'asrilblaknireeisiraer4iY.t.co- IT"Ica:aelli:,
JO io4llire: wiheilier or not the re presetttAtioir 0e
i.,,
wasps', and tad to sufferlhe enemies of the c...3411:1.,
lics,te mbustr.the teligiOn of God, and 64 pietl,'o
tli:t ,15.:44, without contradiction or roil.e.""+" ',-11,4
-14.‘vissof Ent,land 'Wert, SO bordinale :to, t e .!!"'. ".,,iti
619„1(1t1,0f 4.l_,,VAdq tiMrdi-TCon Oh liberties of 114 Y ..
tV ithoq;.:44tpltitiog. a brt.-:tell of their oath'. ' tie 1
our
it'ore, atilt- sworu ~to maintain talc penal 1',1":"/
~,,..
1: unit}'" tire Ltg,Waturo horo ti):lkin4 j!'''%V
11',10,
'{Signs fith icipe:•:t to i he, Chtlici). k tier P.‘,04
axons rdttPealbg the church were'. to be o'l°l '

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