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London, England, 1837-06-17 00:00:00

therefore this proposed church or chapel would be of great
convenience to them. Ile was radt the individual who intro-
duced the Bill into the House. The Bill was read a first and
second time by the Hon. Member for Marylebone. Ile was
in the chair at the time it passed through the Committee when
the Hon. Member for Marylebone voted for the preamble of the
Bill, and he proposed a proviso, which wa, cemented
to by the Committee, excepting Primrose Hill, for the
operation of this measure. Ile could not understand. on what
r*round the Hon, Member for Abrylebone should move the
postponement of the third leading, of this Bill for three
months. Looking at the proceedings of the Committee, and
considering that that Hon. Member was the individual who
had introduced the Bill, he hoped and trusted the House
would assist him ( Mr. D.) in rescuing- the Hon. Member for
Marylebone from so unjust and inconcistent an act as that of
slavimi, as he wished to do, his own offspring. —( Hear, hear, 1
and laughter. )
Mr. HUM E said the petition which his lion. Friend the
Member for Cockermouth had just presented was signed by
6,000 of his ( Mr. ll's. ) constituents, who had requested him to
state the grounds on which he opposed the present Bill. It was
quite true that the Hon. Member for Marylebone had given
the notice stated by the lion. Member for Finsbury ; but, in
consequence pf the examination of witnesses which had
taken place, fhe Honourable Member had requested him
to make the motion, and he thought he had exercised
sound discretion in not moving the amendment.-
He had no interest whatever in the mea;e-

War )
nut as the repre-
-,:n interested in having the
_ which from time immemorial had
.- Gs a place of recreation. Ile believed that at the
Ante of the great plague in London the people had encamped
on the Chalfont estate, the Lir being mare pure there than in
London. That had been a place of usual resort for the in-
habitants of London, and it might be at all times seen covered
with a large population. Within the last two years a
Cemetery had been established at Highgate, and another
about 500 yards from where it was intended to establish
the present. If the present Bill was carried it would have the
effect of shutting up those common fields to which the people
of London had always had access, as it was intended by it to
enclose Primr,:se-Lill almost down to the reservoir in the

sentative of those who were

ground preserved t, •'

been ❑scud

Regent's-park. The House had resolved, that wherever it
was practicable, places of amusement and recreation should be
provided for the working classes in the neighbourhood of large
towns; and he (Mr. Ilume) regretted that the House had
been counted out a few nights since, when he intended to sub-
mit a motion for an address to the Crown to purchase that pro-
perty for the use of the public. Under these circumstances, he
trusted the House would agree to the amendment he was
about to propose, which was, that the Bill be read a third time
that day three months.
Mr. WILKS seconded the amendment. He had no
personal interest in the matter any more than the Honourable
Member for Middlesex ; but however desirable it might be
that there should be Cemeteries established in the neighbour-
hood of the metropolis, the House should take care that they
did not go too far, and it appeared to him that they would
be doing so if they acceded to the present Bill. There had
been not less than 470 acres of land appropriated for Ce-
meteries in London within the last few years, and that
would be found, according to the calculations that had
been made, quite adequate to the wants of the po-
pulation of London for two thousand years.— ( Hear, hear.)
Sir S. WH ALLEY said no person had been placed in a
more painful situ tion than himself, because he had endea-
voured to discharge his duty to the public and his constituents.
No one would venture to say that he had been actuated by
other motives than those of consideration for the welfare,
health, and happiness of his constituents, whose interests were
about to be sacrificed to private speculation. He was de-
lighted to find that his Hon. Friend the Member for Middle-
sex was about to move, so that the grounds might be secured
to the public—(Cries of " Hear")—and he hoped the House
would agree to the amen dment, otherwise the grounds would
be given into the hands of private speculators, and the public
would be deprived a that enjoyment which they were now
entitled to.

_ .....
Mr. AG L I ONB Y said he had other objections to the mea-
sure than any which bad been vet stated to the House. He
hoped that his Hon. Friend (Mr. Hume) would be enabled
to carry his intention into effect.—( Hear.) His objection was
upon technical grounds; and he wished to know whether a
Bill conferring suc!i extensive powers was to be brought
in and passed without any notice having been given to
any party.—( Hear, hear.) He was aware that Cemetery
Bills did not require notices ; but this Bill gave most extraor-
dinary powers. For instance, in the o:iginal Bill there were
clauses which empowered the Company to take any grounds
in Middlesex within ten miles of London. Not only so, but
they were empowered to be a trading Company in land, being
empowered to grant leases of the 230 acres they were entitled
to take for 99 years, but they were further empowered to take
land anywhere else, so that they did not, at any time, hold
more than two hundred end thirty acres.—( Hear.) These
were extraordinary clauses, and he believed such extensive
powers had never before been sought. He contended that
under the principles of the Standing Orders notice should
have been given. Now by the original Bill the Company had
the power of enclosing Hampstead-heath.— ( Cries from Mr.
Duneonibe of " No, no.") He would say " Yes, yes."
Now by the Standing Orders for enclosing and improv-
ing lands, no person could bring in a Bill for such
a purpose without notice. The Hon. Member for Finsbury
had referred to former Bills, and said that the House was re-
fusing to this Company what it had granted to others. That
remark might be worthy of some attention, but it was no rot-LT
son because the House had committed one absurdity that it
should commit another. Until his attention had been called the
other day to it, he was not aware that such a monstrous
power as a roving commission had been given in any Bill.
In four other Bills of a similar nature to the present, actual
contracts had been made for the purchase of the lands, which
course he contended ought to be adopted in the present Bill,
and that course not being adopted, he trusted the House would
reject the Bill. By the Bill, although there was not a direct
there was an indirect power to enclose foot-paths. He had no
hostility to this particular Bill, provided Hampstead-heath and
Primrose-hill were protected ; but whenever he saw a, measure
with such extraordinary provisions as the present he should

oppose it.
Mr. C. BULLER deprecated any discussion with regard
to the Standing Orders at the present stage of the Bill. The
Bill gave no compulsory powers to take land. It merely in-
corporated the Company ; and so far from including Primrose-
hill, it enacted that it should not be touched. Supposing that
it even did include Primrose-hill, he put it to the House whe-
ther it would not be better to have the place as a Cemetery
than covered with houses.
Mr. WAKLE Y would only say the people looked to this
question with a very strong and earnest feeling. Primrose-
hill was the Hyde- park of the working classes.—( Hear, hear.)
He would ask Hon. Members, how would they feel if a propo-
sition were made to make a Cemetery of Hyde-park ?—( Hear.)
What would be their decision? NVhy, they would decide
against such a proposition the moment it was made to the
House. He called on them, therefore, to act with reference to
the working classes exactly as they would act with reference
to the aristocracy, and not to give the Company the power of
making a Cemetery in the Hyde-park of the working people.
From 10,000 to 14,000 persons attended there on holidays.
It had been proposed to purchase Primrose-hill, hut that was
anticipating a question which they had no right to do, be-
cause it might be a question, whether Eton-college had
the right to enclose that place.—( Hear, hear.) Ile must
say it would be cruel awl neglectful of the interests of the
working classes to support the present measure. ( Hear, hear.)
He believed the Bill would be rejected by the House. He
was sorry to see his lion. Colleague engaged in such a cause,
because he knew that no man entertained a kindlier feeling,
towards the mass of the population.— ( Hear, hear, hear.)
He believed that he had been deceived by interested
parties, and he (Mr. Wakley) believed that by and by his
Hon. Colleague %%mild be one of the first to rejoice at the re-
jection of the measure by the House.—( Hear.)
After a few words from Mr, A NGERVIEIN,
Mr. DUNCOM BE replied.
Strangers were then ordered to withdraw, and the House
divided, when the numbers were—
For the third reading
Agianst it
Majority .
The Bill is, consequently, lost. •
On the motion of Mr. aH A LMER S, the Report of the
Nairn's Estate Bill was further considered, and ordered to be
read a third time.

-65

wriuld have been saved by that means. He trusted that the
Home, if it was any gratification to the parties who had spent
the • money, would allow their sober judgment to be the mat-
ter of consideration. If it should turn out that this plan was
the worst, why the House would be informed of that fact by
the report of the engineer.
Captain PEC'HEI.I, ex plait; ed.
HOPE sail it was important the House should know
before th.,y referred the matter to the engineer, whether the
parties interidej to travel over new ground, or whether the
lilies could be j,,ined together in such a manner as not to
travel over land, the map and plan of which had not been de-
posited.—( Hear.)
M. P. TH 0 APSON did not conceive it was possible for
the engineer to go into the consideration of any other line than the
lino already referred to him. He understood the motion was that
the engineer should be at liberty to inspect the plans, the parties
iti tending toget oneline compounded out of the other lines. On
!bat understanding be had no objectio❑ to the mot'.on, and should
give it his zuppoi 5. lie considered this a t.e, like the other
case, as simply the means of afford,ng- information
to the House for its guide with rev,' 2.et to one line or the
other.

The motion was thet:. ~„reed to 'A ithout a division.
Mr. FA ZAK:.1.7:1;,L EY' brought up a further report from
the Poor
Committee.

CHURCH ,LEASES.
Mr. A. TREVOR SV RS desirousof asking the Noble Lord
opposite whether Monday was positively the day on which the
Noble Lard intended to nominate the Committee on Church
Leases ?

Lord JOHN RUSSELL had stated yesterday that he
would bring it on on Monday.
Mr. TREVOR then renewed the motion of the Hon. and
Gallant Member for Lincoln for Nlonday next upon that sub-
ject.---( Hear, and a laugh.)
On the motion of Lord SANDON the Liverpool Improve-
ment Bill was read a third time and passed.
COLLIER DOCKS.
Captain ALS AG E R moved an extension of time for the
Center Docks Committee to make their report, till Monday
next.

Mr. HAWES had been instructed to oppose the-applica-
tion, inasmuch a it renewed powers granted fourteen or fifteen
yez:rs ago to several Companies, and which cut through the
Kennington Common, one of the few places in the neighbour-
hood of London open to the putlic.
After a few words from Mr. BARN ARD,
Mr. WI LKS hoped the Hon. Member for Lambeth would
withdraw his opposition.
The motion was then agreed to.
Mr. F. FRENCH presented a petition from Roscommon
against the Bill for dissolving the Agricultural Bank cf
Ireland.
On the motion of Mr. HUNIPHREY, the South London
Market Bill was read a third time, and passed.
REGISTRATION OF BIRTHS, Stc.
Lord JOHN RUSSELL said the Registration of Births
nod Marriages Bill was one which much pressed ; he would
therefore take the liberty of moving the third reading, in order
that it might be sent up for the consderation of the other
House.

Mr. GOULBURN protested against such a Bill being
enacted. It was so complex in its character, that none but
lawyers could understand it.
The Bill was then read a third time. and passed.
BOUNDARIES OF BOROUGHS.
In answer to Mr. G A SKE LI.,
Lord JOHN RUSSELL said he would be sorry to post-
pone the Boundaries of BorouOis Bill ; but be did not think
it could be proceeded with during the present Session. He
would, however, be glad. of any suggestions which might
make the Bill more re-. feet.
WILLS BILL.
Lord J. RUSS.ELL, in answer to Mr. Aglionby, said
the Wills Bill hP.I just come from the Lords, and would lead
to some disctr.sion. He had not conferred with the Attorney-
General, but he would propose that it be considered on
Tuesday week.
REGISTRATION OF VOTERS.•
In answer to Mr. Mii.Es, the Noble Lord said that
the Registration of Voters' Bill had been sent up
io the House of Lords last session, as be understood,
with the concurrence of all parties, otherwise he would
never have inserted the names of the barristers. —(Hear. )
It was, however, thrown out, and he was very much afraid
there was no chance of passing the measure during the pre-
sent Session. He would be happy if he could so shape the
Bill as to pass it, but he was afraid it could not be.
Lord PA LNI E R STON, in answer to a question from Lord
Sandon, said that a treaty had been in existence some years,
by which France and Spain had virtually conceded to each
other the rights of the coasting trade. With reurd to tho
second question, he had received official information of the de-
cree to which the Noble Lord referred; but it was not con-
fined in its operation exclusively to this country, but related to
coals deposited on the coast of Spain for the use of steamers
generally. The moment the decree was issued the British
Minister at Madrid remonstrated against it, and the matter was
still undecided.

TURKISH EMBASSY—LORD PONSONBY.
On the Order of the Day for going into Committee of Sup-
ply being read,
Sir STRATFORD CANNING begged to put a ques-
tion to his Noble Friend (Lord Palmerston) in relation to the
state of their embassy at Constantinople ; and as the question
he was about to ask was connected with the expenditure of the
country he thought the present occasion not an unfitting one
to introduce the subject.—(Hear, hear, hear.) It appeared
from information which he had received that Lord Pon-
sonby, the British Ambassador at Conitantiuople, had
applied to, and obtained from, his Government leave of ab-
sence, in order that he might return to this country
on his own private affairs ; and that Sir Charles Vaughan,
who was Ambassador to the United States of America,
was sent on a special embassy to Constantinople during the
absence of the regular Ambassador. The public journals had
announced the arrival of Sir Charles Vaughan at Malta,
where he ( Sir S. Canning) understood he still remained.
Lord Ponsonby bad not returned to this country, and there
were now no less than two Ambassadors employed in that
service, the one at Constantinople and the other Malta. Now
he could not see why two Ambassadors were more required in
Turkey than in any other quarter of the world. The usual
practice in cases where an Ambassador was absent on leave
was to appoint the secretary to the embassy to discharge the
duties until his return, and he could not see on what ground
the practice was departed from in the present instance. Mr.
Urquhart, who had been lately appointed secretary to that
embassy, he believed was also on his way home to this country.
The Noble Lord would correct him if such was not the fact.
With regard to the appointment of that gentleman a departure
from the usual course had also taken place. It had been the
practice of the service to select persons to fill the office of se-
cretary from those who were attached to the embassy; but in
that case Mr. Urquhart, who was not attached to the service,
was raised over the heads of those who had been for years con-
nected with the embassy. ( Hear, hear.) No doubt the Noble
Lord had good reason fur the course he had adopted. But the
main point of his (Sir S. Canning's) observations related to
the unnecessary expense which this preceeding would entail
on the country if the facts were as he had described them. He
did not mean to say that occasions might not arise where the
expense of a special embassy would not be perfectly justifiable.
But he thought the present case was one which required ex-
planation.
Lord PALMER ST ON said the Right Hon. Gentleman
had asked eay Sir Charles Vaughan had been sent out to
Constantinople. Why for the reason which be had himself
given—namely, that Lord Ponsonby was about to return
home on lease of absence.—( Hear, hear.) He (Lord Pal-
merston) did not think it expedient that they should be both
at Constantinople at the same time, and as it was necessary
that they should confer together on matters connected with
the embassy, Sir Charles Vaughan was instructed to proceed
to Malta to await the arrival of Lord Ponsonby. Lord Pon-
sonby was detained at Constantinople longer than he ex.
petted, and having since relinquished his leave of absence, in
consequenee of his private affairs not requiring his presence in
this country, Sir Cleirles Vaughan was then on his return
home.—( Laughter.) The Right lion. Gentleman had said
that this was a question of expense ; but did he not happen to
know of any place where a special mission was sent, and
where they had their ordinary Minister P—( Hear.) With re-
gard to the selection of Sir C. Vaughan as Ambassador Ex-
traordinary (for that was his title) their interests in that part
of the world rendered it necessary that they should have the
weight and authority of a regular ambassador in preference
to a Charge d'Affaires.—( Hear, hear.) With respect to the
charge of the Right lion. Gentleman as to the infelicity of
his (Lord Palmerston's) appointments, he might undoubtedly
have been unfortunate in some of his selections—(A laugh)
—but, whether right or wrong, lie had always endeavoured to
select the persons whom he conceived best fitted to discharge
the duties of the offices to which they were appointed.—
( Loud cheers.)
Sir S. CA NNING did not know whether the House was
satisfied with the explanation of the Noble Lord ; but he con-
fessed to him that explanation was anything but satisfactory.
The Noble Lord's memory must have been at fault when he
instanced the case of his diplomatic employment at the Court
of Madrid, because that was a special mission not connected
with the affairs of Spain but of Portugal.—( Hear, hear.)
Whether the failure of that mission arose from the infelicitous
manner in which the business was conducted on the part of
the Ambassador, or from the infelicitous instructions of the
Noble Lord, it was not for him to say—( Hear, hear)—but
while he had the honour of representing in that House any
constituency, however small, he would never shrink from ex-
pressing any opinion which he conscientiously believed neces-
sary to a proper discharge of his duty.—( Cheers. )
Mr. D. W. HA RVE Y could see no reason why, because
Lord Ponsonby wished to come home, that the country should
sustain the cost of another Ambassador, and the Right Hon.
Gentleman, instead of the unintelligible taunt he bad thrown
out, should have moved for a return of the expenses attending
the embassy of Sir Charles Vaughan. Instead of this, how-
ever, the Right Hon. Gentleman and the Noble Lord had
been passing genteel compliments and indulging in drawing-
room courtesies. One spoke of his Noble Friend and the
other of the Right Hon, Gentleman,-.-(A laugh.) But why
should the Right Hon. Gentleman complain of this diplomatic
confab in the Mediterranean? Did he not know that there
as no species of corruption which was not sanctioned by the
Tories? And had he no connection with a worse job these
this ? was glad, however, to find that the Tories were
now Advocates of economy, cud he trusted the Right Hon.
Gentleman would move for a return of the expellees of this
appointment.—(
Lord rIy,4I.IERSTON thought it very unjust to refuse
Aged in foreign countries for
that this permission should
pekol:ll:r,tratit and
.arduous duties ; and,
• fur his part, so far from t. 1.1- 6
I;eatavr°s oirfi the absencedis cll taor glee rosfolni ms;
leinevosyhosutlod
refiiuelrnvehroymme,uch disposed to order
even if they were die.
theirhed
igpri9aini
itaetdi,c