The Sun.
London, England, 1830-12-09 00:00:00

CHANCELLOR OF IRELAND.

tool FARNHAM had waited for two nights far the
pinpose of eeeing the Noble Led at the head of the Go.
vet ens.eit phsee, in order to put a question to 1.14
tio most important subject ; but though the Noble Pearl
was net new present, he could ant debty the questino any,
longer. He wonted their Lordships that he did not put
the question out of any feeling' of hostility to the Ad-
mirristratium - lie was one of those erbe held .the opinions
that the more the administration of jostles was separated
from political consideration the better. lie brimmed that
the constitution oldie Government Isere made it neretwery
that the place on the•Woolssek ahouW be granted for
political consideration*. Ile thought the two things
ought, for the benefit of the public, to be kept distinct. :But'
if the necessity he alluded to existed here, it surely did
not NO, in Is elerol. lie asked the, question mrthe ground
of a report that Sir. A. Met was to bsewithdrawn from
the Chancery in !ridged to make room. for Lord Plunkett;
tie had hoped that the Miniatare would redeem their
pledge of economy, end one strong °ligation he bad to
this rumoured change was, that: it would saddle the
country with en additional • charge of 4,0004 a year.
There were now not less than six retired ChancellorSearol
let the unsettled None of politice,now, he should not be
inueh surprised if they bad more retired Chaneithem added
to the list. In eases of family settliMents it was now a
prudent practioe not to burden the estate of tins nation.
No new Chancellors aught to be made or petitioned, ;. till
senile of the antecedent dowagers had died off-, for other-
wise he slaw no end to the public. burdens. The Noble
Lord then paid a very high compliment to Sir A. Ifert's
adsoillistration of Equity Law, and said that if his Noble
Sucetessor dill but imitate that Learned Person, he would
certainly give universal satisfaction to the suitors and the
bar. Perhaps there might he some intended economy in
the now appointment. If so he Arndt] be glad to hear
of it, and to have given Ministers the opportunity of
explanation.
The LORD.CIIANCELLOR raid that nothing could be
more fair and candid than the question now put, and hi'
only regretted that it hart not been put at a time when the.
most minute information could be afforded in answer.' Ile
regretted that it bed been put in the absence of his Noble
Friend, and that in point of time it Was :somewhat prema-,
ture. The Noble Lord had said that perhaps there were
economic Arrangements connected with the moverneet in
spiritism, and that he wished to afford the Government the
opportunity of explanationon that subject. Ile must have
been aware that unless the arrangements ware complete,
no:explanation could be given, Ilia question had been pre-
ceded by statements of such importance as to call for some
reply. Whether or not it watt desirable for the better ad.•.
ministration of jnOtice in this country that the Ordinary
rule of the separation of Judicial from political functions
should continue to be deviated from in the instance of the
Keeper of the Great Seal, was a quesition of do lets difliculty
than importance. At filet sight mnstpersons Would he. in.
nlined to give an answer in the negative on the general prin-
ciple gated by, the Noble Lord ; on the other hand,
there was something peculiar in the powers and jurietlietlese
of the Chancellor, which rendered it not so clear that the
operation might to take plug. 'That, however, was not now
the quortitrit.: The change wisuld'he the greatest in the ad.
ministration of justice that had refer been adopted; it wee
not eenetioned by one pretwelent.;.eit hielesever yet heenfor'-
madly proposed to the Legiidatnre'; hut if -ever a& pr 4,,„;.
tion should be made, after dee eotice, heshoitill not he found
wanting et the discussion of It. The Noble Lora bed
asked why the separation, though rest mede EnglaOd,
might not be made in Ireland; GO snewered, that there,
as here, it was without any precedent; In 1801. under
the administration of Lord Shinier* Lord Redesdale was
made chancellor of Ireland; in I.Bo‘, when Mr. Pitt
came into office, he went OUS--(Loni Fartataol,—Nd.)--
The Notify Lord was right. Lord Itedesdale slid eon-
films in office; and that only Made the parallel stronger ;
for Lord Eldon, who had before been mule Chancellor
here, did not go out upon that change of Ministry, but
eoatinued under Mr. Plttie, as tinder. Lord Sidaswitlee
Administration, to hold the Great Heal. 'When, on Mr.'
Pitt's death, in 1806. another* Adosioirtretion Wpb
formed, Lord Redesdate came freest Ireland, and Ora sue.,
needed by the Right Howe George Ponsonhy ; and when;
in •1801, the Duke of -Portlend'a Asinsiorstrasion was
formed, Lord Manners took the itals; which be held under
the Adminietrations of 'Mr. Peroisval and Lcsr+l Liverpool.
When the Liverpool Advalnietration ,came to an end, the
satire rule was again acted on In Ws countries. teed
Eldon retired, and was stleiefeled 14r,Lorli Lyndlottliere,
nod Sir A. Hurt in the sattniivay sueetttled Lord Alan,.
het*. who only held the teals under the new Administration
until the arrangements they desired could be completed.
Ail these oases showed that tire chinigeig of Chancillool in
troth eountrisit basil depended oil ilou'ehanges of Administre-
tines, Its need not, tiesrefore, say bat any distinction
now to he WOota haulm the two eountries In thet respect
wmild be perfently new. Haub a change Might 'be
right; but, at ell avesstaa it ought 4rist to he iwrimsdy
'lnwood. It was no matter-a charge against the preient,
thavergournt that they had suit, of their own act deharte
r •
Irma the recodeots of ait format, Governmettt*:.., tio6h
a charge might. he proper after that and the other 'Meuse
ow, it thrir 'mums ; but the Millistovi were galley

of no dereliction of duty in not making it without such a
sanction. lie would not say whether the Government
might or not issue directions for such change of the Chan-
cellors ; but nothing was finally done at this moment. Ile
W,IM not !MIMI to state whether such a change wua con-
templated ; it was needless for him to say he leant towarde
it; but it had not yet heerk:Onallydvteratined. With re-
spect to the concomitant matter of the .widowhoods,. the
principles proposed by. the*ible Lord are new in cases of
this kind. All the .Chancellors he had mentioned had had

retiring; pensions; hut he would say this, that if any altera.
fon was made (though he would not state the details), be
was sure the arrangements would be made with the
strictest repro! to economy in the administration of the
pecuniary resOnreeti of the country.—(llear, hear.) The
salary, would be so modified as it had never been before,
and in such a manner as to consult the distresses of the
public : and though the saving might not be considerable
it would be important, for be was folly convinced that
nothing" could he unimportant which went to save one
farthing of the public money.
BREACH OF PRIVILEGE.
_ _

Lord MELBOURNE said that their Lordships were
aware that an individual had been arrested in their House,
charged tvith an outrageous offence. That offence might,
perhaps, he treated as a breach of privilege; but he ap-
prehended. without going into, any btatement of his rea-
C/1111 for it, their Lordships would agree with him that
the Most convenient and proper course to adopt would be
to hand over the offender to he dealt with according to the
ordinary course of law. His Lordship then moved,
That Francis Seek, now in the custody of Sir T.
Tyrrwlitt, he delivered over to the Civil Authorities, to
be dealt with according to law."
PROCESSION OF THE TRADES.

The Duke of WELLINGTON had heard.of a transac,•
tion occurring this day which he considered' of much snore
impottence than that alluded to by the Noble Lord. . Ile
meant, that of an address having . been presented to the
King lq
.a large body. of people, who came up to the
Palace in • procession, with flags and other ensigns. He
wished to know whether the Government Were before-
harid acquainted with the intention of the people to form
this proCesSion,
.and he reneived that he considered it of
tench More importance than the' matter which the Noble
Lord had just ietroduced to the House. ' ' •
Lord MELBOURNE, in so low a tone of • voice as to
render it very difficult to catch whet he said, would, for
the information of their Lordships, state the circumstances
and the proceedings that led to the transaction to which
the Noble Duke had alluded, Almost the day after he
reeeived.the Seals of • the Department which he had the
'• honour to hold, he had been waited,upon by a deputation
of the different trades of the city of London,
.who stated,
that /it monaequence of the severe disappointment which
they lied felt through the postponement of his . Majesty's
visit, arid through the alleged cause of that postponement,
they were most anxious to present an address to his Ma-
jesty, testifying their loyalty. to his Majesty and their at-
rachment to his Majesty's' family. Seeing no objection
to presenting such an address, and being at the same time
assured that it was intended to be presented by three in-
'ilieiduels selected for that purpose, he had certainly taken
hie Majesty's pleasure with respect to receiving that ad-
dram, and his Majesty had been most graciously pleased to
express his consent to receive the address. It was cer-
tainly understood by him, at the time he communicated
with the deputation from the trades. that the address was
to be presented in the ordinary course and manner. He
was therefore, much surprised yesterday to find that a
hand-frill had been placarded abont the streets of this
town, calling on all. the trades to meet and accompany the
deputation to St. James's, and measures for forming a
procession were adopted. On receiving intimation of this
placard, be immediately consulted all the authorities who
were likely to afford him information, for his guidance
in this matter, and be consulted the heads
.of the. Police,
and all were of opinion that it would be much better to
suffer that procession'to take place than to attempt to pre-
vent it by forcible means, and the beads of the Police said
they would become answerable (if the procession were suf.
fared to take place) fur the tranquillity of the City, and the
complete presavation of the public peace. :Under these eir.
cumatuncee, and considering the character, „of the present
times, he bad thought it better to allow etntifirocession , to
take place, than to resort to means of a strong-nature for
its prevention. He had reason to believe that the result
now fully justified his conduct, and that the whole pro.
ceedlnehad been most tranquil.
The LORD CHANCELLOR wished, on behalf of his
Nettle Friend, to say a few words upon this subject, and es.
'Tmeitially to remind their Lnrdships,that it was not so easy to
prevent the assembling of a great number of pi.got;te 0 en
occasion such as that now referred to. It waespo doubt,
true, that large assemblages were attended With much
danger to the. public peace ; but still if a vast number of the
trades of London said, " We are anxious to see our Sove-
reign, and wish to accompany time Deputation that is to
present to him our loyal Address," how was it possible to
prevent their doing so? Their Lordships could not pre-
vent people from walking in the streets ; and though pro-
cessions were- not convenient things, they could not pre-
vent -processions even with banners, for processions were
but long lino of people walking in one direction. The
14w gave them no power of :prevention, until there was
either, an actual breaeh of the peace or a most imminent
risk of its being. broken. Ife, there.rore, quite agreed with
those who had given their advice to his Noble Friend
(especially as those who.gave it were answerable for the
,preservation of the public peace, to the necessity of
which they. wera most fully alive), that it would be most
unwise to take measures of few; for measures of force
they must have been to prevent that which prima facie
was.* lawful assembly. He hail taken care to aucertaiu be-
fore he had lea the Palace in what state the people were who
had assembled round in melt numbers, and how they had
conducted themselves. That their mambos were very great
was quite true; the Noble Duke was not at all misinformed
on thaeoebject, but he learned from those persons at the
Palace from %shwa he had inquired, that never did. any Net
of people conduct themeelves. more peaceably ; nothing
could be snore peaceable thaw their way of going along,
and of their waiting at the Palace, and though they lingered
about it for some little.time to see the individuals going in
and out, and possibly with the wish to see his Majesty
(whom they might; perhaps, expect to have the pleasure of
seeing at one of the windows,)..yet they bed never once re-
quested hiss Majesty would appear ; and his Majesty, in
time, was engaged in most important business, having hell
a Ceuncil immediately after he received the deputation,
but they expressed no disappointment nor any symptoms
of irritation,. nor did they commit one single act which
was not perfectly in consonance with the complete preeer.
%intim' nf the public peace.
The Duke of WELLINGTON was surprised at the
declaration of the Noble and Learned Lord that these as-
sembliee could not be preveated, for ha believed that
there was an Aet of Perliament to prevent persona- beyond
a 'certain number from assembling together. ' It was quite
unusual to permit addresses to his Majesty to be presented
by large bodies of people.' He knew of no instance in
which that course had beets permitted. Ile had nut heard
of the circumstances stated I.y the Noble Viscount oppo-
site, and if he had known that the Government had been
aware of the procession beare. it took place, lie should
nut lave put the question, Ile could only say that the
practice, if not contrary to law, was most dangerous.
The resolution of Viscount MELBOURNE, respecting
Francis Seek, was then •earried.—Adjourned. •