The Sun.
London, England, 1801-06-09 00:00:00

0
d

upon the principle of the scientific Instruftion of
the Officers who . composed it, without which
neither discipline nor valour would prdve of es.:
senti4 service. It was the result of all modern
experience that War was reduced to a science,

anal must be cultivated as such ; nor could much
advantage be derived from Military -Manceuvres
if we were deficient in skill to defend ourselves

against the envy and maliciouS' intentions of the
Enemy, who watched in order 'to attack and if
possible to destroy us at every possible opportunity.
All those nations who had •negleeted the study of
military sciencefhad sunk into a state of abje&
dependance on others more skilful, whilst in pro-
portion as a nation had cultivated' military-arts, ji-
had been found expedient to form establislitnents of
this nature with a view to preserve and, extend .tbe
knowledge of military science. Neither discipline
for ecommy could be introduced in an army 'where
military knowledge and science were wanting.' It
might be asked whether therowas any thing in the
heal situation of Great Britain or Ireland tp render'
such an institution useful or necessary ? acknow:
kdged that. an ,inSidar. situation rendered•-us less,
-exposed to attacks, add to which that the high state
of discipline as Well as undaunted valour of, our
• -INL IlYy, had set us more at ,ease from the apprehension
f Invasion ; but as the same'time he was persuaded
that no prudent man would suppose, that the Fleet
alone could Undertake, at all times,. and under all
circumstances, effeelually 'to prote& the widely-ex-
Nlett. casts of Great Britain and Ireland from in-
-4'14 at Al points. An, Army of some kind was
absolutely necessary forborne defence ; and it ought
to be in such a state,
,and to be so instrUded, as to
enable it to encounter any invading Enemy.
Here the SECRETARY at WAR proceeded to pass
ibigheueorniums on the illustrious Prince, the gal-
clt Commander in Chief in this country, who might
i
said to have new-created the Army within a
few: years ; and whose zeal, diligence, .and patrio-
tie NieWS COW be exceeded by none. ,I- le was at
°nee the Protneor of the deserving Officer, and
the Soldier's Friend; Zeal, alacrity, and enter.
f°rize were Aire chara&eristies of British Officers ;:
Y'ltYs and a most ,determined courage, distin-
Pishcd both Officers and Men, which had octet-
suffered a stain, and he 'trusted never would.—
All that Was wanting,- to British Officers, was
a more frecitient opportunity of obtaining a
• entifie knowledge of their profession. It was true,
there had been men of great and uncommon ge-
nnisin this profession, a Marlborough, a Cadogon,
a Wolfe, a Stuart, and
,an AbercrOrnby ; but it was
to an Institution: of the nature nos.v proposed that
tile Country must look for an able supply of such
j., Officers. The syitem of modern British education
did not afford sufficient opportunity to young men
in-tended for the 'Science of Arms to attain a know,.
ledge of the rudimentS. ;of their profesion. In the
Navy, a young man entered early into a cou,re of
anstrudifans, and must pass, through a rigid exami-
nation by competent judges,. before ,he could receive
a -Licut.enoot's Commission ; but: in the Army the
'was different. A young man 'entered into the
Army at 16 or S years of age, whilst the Public
• rt43ols had afforded him little more than a know.
`l4fe of grainnear and the dead languages. In.
t'e opinion of many Offieers, an Institution.. of
trfir nature was the oily thing wanting to s the •
tritish Army. With this adirantage, ' 'young
"Miters would emulate • their brethren on the
e.•it, and be equally entitled to the gratitude and
confidence of their Country. Such an Institution was.
not novel. - There was the Royal Naval Academy
• a! Portsmouth; and the Royal Institution at Wool.
wish for' Cadets in the,'Artillery and •pgineers
bt!t hoWever important .theSe had proved, they could
only hoconsidered.as subordinate parts of a whole,
if the Academy for 'Artillery, Ste. bad • been
10Q *so—itseittl,- how much 'More . would this now
Proposed, which had respect. *to the general Staff of
the Army I Seine, judgment might bes-formed of
the Utility ofsucb an :Est,tblishinent, from what had
laCen'efrqdea,u'pon a, very litnited scale at If gh kyy.,
comp", at the small ,annual execute 15901. Of
the Officers educated there,' nine had been found
9446-0 to an ai,s Assistants to the Quarter-Masier-
Gemal of she Army ; and of these, four were
nosy with the Army of Egypt, and had been
fOund of the'moss impottant service; hesides.these,
sex retnained qualified to- join thoStadol the Army,
The benefits of this Institution had alreatlY extend.
ed in nineteen Officers, 'who had joined their Regi.
Items, and twenty-four now 'remained there.under
a"curse ' An obje'aion pro_
'°s&l plan might
.posSibly be started • upem a Con-
:'-itittilonal ground, that the House ought 'alivays to
have x CoLstiturional influence over the, Army ; but
"2- proposed grant would no more take, this Witt.
Zlce out of their hands than auy other Annual
:rule for the Supply of the Army. bucli a Sys.
`tmarical Institution was more necessary no'w
• than ever; when France,
,our inveterate Erie*,
'ad obtained four.fold.means of tarrying on War
against us, and from the formidable aspen of the
political horizon of Europe, when Peace itself,
finder present circumstances, can be. but a hollow
Armed Truce, and-when the envy, hatred, and, un-
charitableness of almost all Europe contin9ed to
Perseeute this Counery. Was it not then incumbent
Parliament to strengthen both-the arms of our
public security?
Mr. YORKE then mn-ied " that a sum not ex,.
teedino 30 Pool. be granted to His Mrsj is TY fof
the
purchase of •lands, and for building a Military
'"ege, for the service of. the year 18‘or."
Mr'...3*()/VES. said, he could riot look upon a
ensure of 'this ` riture, which recommended an

emulation of a syitesti of Continental policy, with-
out .1 considerable degree of constitutional jealousy.
, • might have supposed that this measure had been
t)orrew-ed from Prussian or Austrian Generals. He
disliked every thing that tended to Germanize the
tnglish. Army. He %visited the Right Hop. Gen-
tie
amil had not mentioned the worn Pe4c.o in .the
Way 4e- had done, and in .corineetion' with such,
opprObrious terms on our Enemies. 1-k should not
let Lis face wholly B.,,ainst this rpe‘Abttile ; but, if
PLlrsticti, he should wig; to sec a siminir Itutitution,
With respeett to the .1%, vy.
211r.`r'01? h saW, s,o such liv,titutien was want-'
td t re"gpt.4l ttl/4r the Navy-; according .tothe
!Ystctu on whiCii our Navy. ~vas ev-r.Y
is tlu Scrvict. rat. itselfitself the 1)6(6‘;1,k1-)1

strut ion. J teiitics, there• was a .person in every,
Man of War) whose province it was to ttistrua
young men in the duties of their profession.
Mr. JQNES explained.
Mr. MARTIN said, he remembered the, time,
when a Standing Army in time of Peace was reck-
oned-unconstitutional, and he inight -say the same
with respal to the Barracks ; but lie wondered not,
after such attacks had beeo on the Constitu-
tion; that a measure of this nature was brought for-
ward; and he declared, he was old-fashioned enough
to wish, that this Country might depetid on nothing
but our Navy 'and Militia.
Mr.YORKE defended this measure from any at-
tack on the Constitution.
Mr. IFILBERFORC,E"iaid, he highly- approved
of the measure. In proportion as he wished to see
a small Standing. Army, he wished to see that Army
well instruled and disciplined, . and so as to render
the most etfeaual Service. He only wished the Plan
had been farther extended, so as to include a system
of Education and support for the Children of Soldiers.

Mr. YORA.'L said, it was his intention to move
an -additional sum _for the better support of the
Children of Soldiers, so as that ther.Building at
Chelsea might contain too° Orphan r Children- in-
stead of goo. He thought it better to provide:for
that Institution out of the Public Purse, 'than. by
the present plan of dedutting a day's pay from the
Soldier ; the amount of this might -be from s 5 to
zo,oool..atid when the Meaßure was brought for-
'ward,, and particulars stated, he trus.tia this stain
would not appear too great. In-the mean time, he
should move in the Committee, that the sum of
84721, be granted, to His MA J ESTI' for defraying
the .Expences of a Royal Military Asylum for Sol-
diers' Children, at. Chelsea.

Mr, WI:VDU/1M concurred in thinking that it'
was, infinitely better the expence. should be charged
on the Public than taken from the Soldiers' pay.
Mr. WILBERFORCE wished to know, whe-
ther the Institution was to be confined to the or-
phan childrenof Soldiers ?
Mr. YORKE said, it was intended in the first
instance to apply this Tnstitutiun to those children
who had lost their fathers and in their,' and in the
next place to those who had lost their fathers.
Mr. WILBERFORCE said, that the children of
, although not orphans, in many iu,tances
called for the compas‘ion of.the House and the Pob-
lic, and he thought that even if aeting from a Fir-
triple of dry economy, it would be, ropers to make
some provision for them, as the best recruits for
the Arm r.
_

, Mr. O'HARA said, the Hou,e should consider
that tlfe Army was voted from yar to year. The
true policy was to consider the Soidieras a Citizen,
and that he might return at Peace into the Alas:, oi
his Fellow-Citizeni; whereas to eticate the Chiidr,:n
of Soldiers for a military life, might lead them to t
different idea.

• Pr. LtiIitRENCE agreed that the Soldier 'should
not be considered as sepirated from the mass of `the
Cotnmunity, but the present measure was pelriectiy
disOnd from that, and was one to which he per_
feCily acceded. It wits necessary at' a. time ttihen
Europz was.assuMing,-a Military charaa‘:r, and
tary coufedepcies Were! forming.. This Country
could never be extedlcil to take a tead,in the
tary counsels and confeder.cies-of Europe., without
the means of operating to that efrltd.

Mr. WILBERFORCE, appyoved of t..e prqpc.
sitiou before the House ;. but he rather %vishe.l it
should be carried farther than was now proposed.—
It was not only the orphans of Soldier:, bet even
these children whose parents were alive, were gre.tt
objetts of the compi'tsslon of the liou,e indeed, in
the present state 9f the world, it would he ci,.!sirethle
that a much mote general system of eduction could
be adopted. '

Mr. WlNtHAM'said, that it had been supposed
that the object if the Institution was to make those
Mho Sere admitted into it all Soldiers, hitt' it
liould be recollected, that p obably one :half of
site childre,n would be girls, and as to the boyl,
it would depend upon their own choice- whti‘her
they would be Soldiers or not.
and Dr. LAWRENCV severally ex-
plained, after which I:he Resolution; was ;4greed to,
.hid the Report Was ordered to -be received to:inor.:
_ _

The keport of tie Indemnity Bill was brought up.
F. BURDETT 'presented a Petition from a
person of tie name of }high, who taken upi
and imprisoned in consequence of 'a warrant from
the 'Secretary of State. The Petition, whieh was
at considerable It ngth, concluded with praying that
the Flabeas Corpus Indemnity Bill might not ribs.
It wts ordered to he raid on the Table.
Sir F. BuRDET/ presented a Petition from :ma.
then person. '
Mr. .d4KEI said, these Petitions contained as-
sertions which might be true, or tuight, be false,
but which the persons who were accused had no op.
parrunity of answering ; and he really thought it
hard that persons who had, in times of difficulty like
the present, done their duty to the Public, should
be exposed to charges which they had no means of
answering.. These Petitions contained a great
many allegations which would remain upon the
Journals uncontradiatd, because the persons accused
had no opportunity of contradiding them.
The. CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER .
said, there was. a great deal of weight in what had
fallen from his Hon. Friend. When the first Pe.
titian was read, he thought it, was presented upon
the ground that the 'Bill before the House went to
deprive the petitioner of t remedy for some griev_
axe which he had sustained, hut this was by no
means the case) for the Coons of Justice were
,now
open, in& 'Would continue to be so after the But
passed, for the redress of the grievances stated in
these Peeitions. , 1 lie Petitions hai no reference
whatever to the Bill, and consequently were not at,
all applicable: Besides,, he agreed with his 14cm.
Friend, that the House ought to be reludant in en-
citayges io which the peisons agair at
whOin they were made had m no eahs of replying.
—lt ,atight appear strange to some Gentlemen
who had not looked hack into the proceedili..zs
zind orders of the Bow; its ;let times, but great

leirrtb anti ratticular:ty.werd obleatorts tO Peti.
tion. There unlcrubtedly must be limits to a Peti-
tion, ,cause otherwise public business would be in-
tempted, and the whole time of the House might
be occupied in reading Petitions, however irrelevant,
me, elv if they were couched in respeaful terms.—
If this praftice was suffered, the Votes could not be
printed in time, the Journal, -Aruld be overloaded,
and 4 very great additional oxpence incurred in
printing them. He therefore, in jimitice to the per..
sons who were attacked, hoped the House would be
upon its guard with.tespea to these Petitions, more
especially when they did not apply to the Bill of
which they complained.

Mr. .H. MOICE said, he did not know the
names of. the Petitioners or their Cases, but he
really did not think the I-fouse ought to rejda the
Petitions. There was no doubt but that the late
11Iinisters had aged in; many instances contrary to
Law ; but he did uoe.mean. to, say that they must 1
necessarily be guilty beeaitse they had done So, be-
cause there Were many cases in which men were not
only excuseable but praise-worthy, for adiog
Crary to Law. 'The.lath undoubtedly
thought, that in aeting contrary to the Law, they
had acted beneficially for the Country; if they
thoUght so,' they had a right to be satisfied, but
those who thought otherwise,: certeinly had a right
to petition therefore he thought these poor people
Ought to be allowed to compittio, for it was all they
Could do ; for as to redress, they certainly could not
obtain it. If they began to renew their mal-prae-
tices, the Ministers had the power in their hands,
and might take them up.; but he really belieired
that the present Mioisters: would merely take up
pest. Sons. of this descriptirin, bat they would experi-
ence no unnecessary hardship in theirconfinement.
Upon these grounds, he thought tbese Petititms.
ought to be received, even if they were a little ir-
regtilar, because no mischief could possiblY ensue.
C 1141VC ELLOR (Me EXC HE QUE R said,
lie hld not opposed the bringing up the Petition, he
had merely cautioned time litin4 against permitting
a praaice which might be ottremely" inconvenient
to put)lic ; the Petition did not 'apply to
the Bid, becitwe it did not tic, r ve them of a, reme.t.,
for the giievances of V.'hich they cotnplained,
they complaiimedmi•rely of the.comitinent aoll re-
tcritipn, then the retinani %stook' tic applicable to
the ; but they comiJained,of ill-treatment, and
this. Biit by no means teak away, the remedy which
the Law gitve them:. •
Mr. 'l'ooxr expiaitied .
Mr. 1 E k .said,. the complaint of the Peti-
tioners was for ill-treatment in prison, which was
iii eonseqUenec of their commitment. • ,
The CH CELI.O It of the Exc. EQU E explained.

Mr. 11171.1"1:BRE AO conceived that petitioning
was the inherent right of thePeoplc cif thii Country,
and therefore he was 441ou"islieti to hear the. Right
Hon. Gentleman say, it was an ObjZaioll to a Peti-
tion if it was 'too long, .cr too minute in detail.'
Lord WICESBORY said, that his Right Hon.
Frie,nd had been completely misunderstood, Nobody
doubted but that it was the right of the Subjea to
petition. His' Right Hon. Friend had merely
state4-That it might be eiitnised in such a manne(
as to produce great inconvellience to public business.
Those were the greatest friends to the right of
petitioning, certainly ought to be the Most anxious
to prevent its abuse.. The beSt' way
,to protect the,
righr, was to use it:with moderation.
Mr. GREY disaproved.• of the doarine which
had been laid down. The persons'who had the most
o;xasion to petition thoste vho perhao'had the
least means, from want of:learning, of draWing them
up with stria accnracy, and therefore, he thought
the House ought not to lie too strict T in ohjetaing" to
a Petition because it was too.long. H • was
of opinion, that
,the tnere con venience of the House
Ought not to be put in companion with the mostvaluable rights of the Subjeo.
The C I ANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER, in
eXpißki:itiOti, said, he had never stated that the mere
convenience of the Houst; was to be put in compmi.
don with this most sacred and valuable privilege.
lielutd only said; that the. House ought to attend
to the rnanner in which it was ,us•ed,:
Mr, IV. SMITH conceived the Petitions' were
relevant, and my lit to he received.
Dr. LAWI is NCE rose—,-when the E AK. P. a
submitted to the Howie vvhetlier the discussion ought
to go on, as there was no objedion made to`receiv-
tug the Petition.,--A short conveNrition took
ph t
between Mt, PIIF:Y, Mi TtLi;.tley, .and tie
• SP?, AY.ER,. upon thiti.pO;Of Order. After whkh
vi tic B Continat:.3 tie said, there mil ht
be infor:nalities in the. Petition, but perhaln in the
e'ilse of Peti4ns it ‘was not 61,44 to in Lb() Stfiet.---,
14th there ,untioubtedly might be too much pirrtieu,
larity in 'editions ;tier ought they unnecessarily be
'made the meiLllS 'Of conveying charge4.again!it. public
persons, who could not regularly answer them.
The Petitioni,was. then brought up and tread ; it
stated the hardships which' the Petlttoner, had suf
fered, and prayed that the Bill.might not pass..
Another Petition was piesegted. by Gem WAL-
POLE (as we understood) on behalf of a person of
the name of Eastbourn, stating hardships' which he
alledges he has suffered, and praying relief, andthat
the Indemnity Bill may not pass into a Law Or-
tiered to be laid on the Table.
Mr. Tr ERNEY 'presented a siMilar Petition on be-
half of John Bone, of Flee r-streer, complaining' also
in ~11 similar manner, and ending With a similar
prayer. Ordered to be laid on the Table.'
The Amendments made in the Bill by the Corn-
mittee were then read and agreed to; and the Bill
was ordered to be ingrthssed and to he read a third
time on Thursday next, if then ingrossed.
The Order of the Day being read on the Bill for
exempting Members serving for Ireland from the
payment of ~certain Duties on impottatidn of goods
.as they import them, or bring .tber'n into this Coon_
try for their use, Sp.
ABBOT observed, that the Bill now betore
rite houSe bad for its_objetl to_exempt ,MeMbers sat
Parlittnent coming from Ireland from the Dutie
Which Were imposed on carr'Llge,,plAte, alltibtooks,
--&c. These Were objects settled some measure
by me 'AZI of Union bet -Ween the, two, Countries.;
and although there be -sotne iustances in
wt ith these Members might be inai.le to hear be liens
limproperly and inequitably, yct it would seem a

elictriorlitlty that the pro' :slons or the ACt
of Onion should be dots t iiway, as it wqs prop,.Aqi
they should by the ;resenty Md. He trot iit
therefore that 'Government might give such tiller:.
lions to the Oft,cers of the Revenue an might make
the matter as little embarrassing asitosslble to the

Gen,tlemen who welt' the suhjea of these
At the same time he. thought that the main nbiva
__ •

of the Bill now before the i foose; which eotild not
be obtained without a Legislative Provision, he
should think of providing for by another Brli bet-
ter adapted as he conceived) for the ltidt•pose
intended) than that which %vas now befor the.
House. He meant to include in that Bill) if

the [-louse should give leave to bring it in, Ail
perkons who were compelled to come from Ire.
land on their public dury, although they might
not be Members of Parliament. For these reasons,
it was his wish that the present Bill might be re.
moved altogether; in order that another Bill it!ight
be introduced. For which purpose, he should móVe,
that the Order of the Day for the House going
into st Committee of the whole House on the Blit

he alluded to, might be discharged, which he moved,
and after a few word!, ffurn Dr. LAW It A, Mr.
Tittticu, Mr. CU ILLY, and Mr. W. SMtr i, was

. .
Nut, and agreed to.
Mr. Aspol• then moved, " That the said Bill
be withdrawn."--44dereci.

Ile next moved, « Thar leave be given to bring
in a Bill for exempting from the .payment of certain
Duties, such I4lenibers of both Iloo.ses of Parliament

as serve fc-r either .h louse Of Parliament for Ireland,
together with such other persons !Is are therei;i de.
scribed, and as may I:ete..a! -only an occasional x:esi.
(knee in Great Britain, ike."—Gr.mted.
This Bill was afterwards brought in by Mr.
CURRY, read a fir“ time) and ordered to be read a
second time tomorrow, and to be printed.
The second reading of, the- Irish Uourt of justice
regulating Bill was deferred to 'I twit, on the
Motion of Mr. GEPO GE I'ON 01113 Y.

The Notary Public Repiating Bill was read a
second time, and ordered TO be committed to a Se.
le& Committee, for the purpose of malting its Pro.
isions extend to Ireland and Scothuid, on the Mo-
tion of Nlt. Lursiir.
The It ish COntroverted Eldlion Bill was read a
second time, on the' Motion of Mr. AB wr, alter
at few words frtirn Sir jetitz SiNcLAta.
The Irish Spirit Regulating .Bill, The Irish Ex-
piring Laws Bill, awhile 'lrish. Distillery 13:11 were'
read a third tune, and passed, on the Motions of
Mr, CoRRY.
The Standing Orders on Road and inelosure Mrs
tt ore agreed to he submitted .to th consideration of
a committee, with a view of coining to one general
regulation, and• to assimilate the .proceedings of
both Houses of Parliament, on the motion of Mr.
BunccE and the •SFCRIITAILY at Wit.
The Resolution of the Committee on the impotta.
tion of Tea into Ireland without the payment
of duty, was agreed to. '
Mr. CORRY stated, that he had submitted this
propositiOn to the Chairman of thelEast Judi% House,
and it was approVed. He tywefore moved, " That
'a Bill he brought in pursuant to this Resolution."
•--Ordered.

The Bill fur the "more `speerly and effe6lual re.

cowry of Exchecrer Debts due to Hl5 MA 1 lisTy
England and 'lreland, and making the judgment
of the, Court of the one evidence in a certain man..
ner in the ather, was read a first ,lime, and

ordered to'be read a second time to.morrow, and to
be printed.
The Bill for regulating the Trade of Malta, and
for declaring that the same b?IonV: to Europe, %vas
read a 'fi6t time, and ordered, to be read r second
titne to-morrow, on the Motion of Mr,Vnea4 tlr A R

Several Orders of the Day were dtlerred can the
Motion of Mr.' VANsITTART.

'l'he Copper Bill was read a Second time, and or..
dered to be ctmmitted to a Committe of the Whole
House to-morrow.

Agreed' to 'go into a Committee of the whole.
House tomorrow on the Irish and English Star op
Duty Bills.

6eferred till to-morrow the third rending, of th*
flair Potvder andMearti
to Wednesby next.
The third reading of the Fines and Forfititures
Bill to-morrow.

Mr. VANSITT AkT observed, that the mode of
eollMing the Excise Duty on Bricks had been
found to be so inconvenient, that it was deemed cx.
pedient that the Duty should no lobger, ttke-
on the size and weight, hut on the number of
Bricks. He therefore,. said, that ;thiS subject was
to he submitted to,a Committee. of the whole Howe
to-morrow. He gave notice also, that he should
submit ref t ommittee,cl the wholelloTA: to.mor.
my, a Resolutio,t, for exempting
Rice, ant-other Articles of Provkinn, tlom the
Duties at present payable on, the Sale of them by
way of Auction.

On the Motion of Mr. Pitaairottrr the House
resolved itself into a Committee on Campbell's Di.
vorce Bill. ,
Mr. BRAGGE suggested the propriety of the
Hon. Gentleman's moving to rennrt r -• p ,6, and
to ask leave to sit again, as the Holistwas thin
that the Clauses of the Bill, two of which ;ire of
the most important nature, could not receive the
proper discussion, and as be could not agree to
their being passed without further deliberation, if
t:ie Hon. Gentleman persisted in carrying die. BPI
through the Committee, he must move to count the
House out.
Mr. PIER REPOINT complained of die expellee

,•
attenning tnese repeated (it:lays' to Dr. 1/4-amPneit,
but agreed to postpone the. consideration of these
Clauses in the Committee till 'Friday.
,The SPEAZER obsf:rvect,'l4.ft the Von. Gen-

tleroann had not comulted the .s 3 in of expcifee. to
Dr. Campbell, in mQvint; the Committee on the
Bill in so thin a Hor,i..t. ; of that as far as 6ept.n;lea
nivm him, f.trtl;s:r 04;r0e.:. txt saved, he 110 W
proposed that it shall be understood that tnis FAA--
'less Ir.hail come on first after, foor O'clock on Frid.,:„;,.
This arrangement was nreeti to in the Commit..
tte, and confirmed the
'The House ;,..icort,eci at ttm o'clock till t.;.1110 ,
row.