The Sun.
London, England, 1830-07-01 00:00:00

The Order of the Day being rend for taking into con-
sideration his Majesty's most gracious Message, the same
was read by the Clerk of the House, when
The Duke of WELLINGTON ruse and said—My
Loth, it is now my duty to, call the attention of
your Lordships to that part of his Majesty's moat gra-
cions Message, in which he has thought proper to inform
yen that it is not his intention to call the attention
of Parliament, at the present period, to any new
matter. My Lords, according to the ancient Consti-
tution of this country, the Parliament would have
been immediately dims dyed on the demise of the Crown ;
bat, my Lords, owing to an Act which passed in OA; reign
of King William, and which was continued,tt reign
of Queen Anne, both Houses are now ei!,!Mg.. My Lords,
his Majesty's servants have hutr;dy advised his Ma-
jesty to send this Message in, while his Majesty in-
forms your Lordships, ths,', notwithstanding it is in
the power of Parlk;titent to sit six months longer,
lie has been ;educed to declare his intention of
dissolving it upon an early occasion, and that it is not hie
intention to bring forward those measures under your consi-
dwation, which, under othercircumstancen, it might be con-
venient to have proceeded in. It is necessary, therefore,
my Lords, that I should state generally to your Lordship
what are the views and intentions of his Majesty's Go-
vernment, and what their motives in giving his Majesty
the advice they have done. My Lords, we are now ar-
rived at the season of the year in which it usually happens
that Parli :meet has been drawing to its termination
Business has been so advanced as that generally, within a
month of the present time, the business of the Session
closed. It is not necessary, my Lords, that I should call
your attention in detail to the present state of business.
It is enough for PM to request your consideration to the
votes of the house of Commons, and the vote* of this
blouse, by which you will see that so much business still
smith)* to be brought forward, that his Majesty's Mi-
nisters thought it their duty to advise the King to
adopt the course which be has done, and unless hie
Majesty had taken the course which he has, there could
have been no hope of the close of Parliament fur a
very considerside time. Under these circumstances, and
considering the calamity which has recently befallen us.
and which has beta axpeeted fora considerahla Period,
all Snell knowing that when that event took place a
new Parliament moat be called, and a general election
take place, his Majesty has thought it better to ad-'
vise the close of the present Parliament, under the cir-
cumstances stated, and also in consequence of there
having been for the lent three months considerable
excitement throughout the whole country is mute-
queue of the expectation of a general election. His '
Majesty's Ministers could not, therefore, have enter-
tained a hope of keeping in town a sufficient num-
ber of Members to carry on the business which must
sooner or later be brought under the consideration of Par•
liamont. Under these circumstances his Majesty's Mi-
nisters have thought it their duty to advise his Majesty
to putt an end to the present session as soon as possible.
Measures, my Lords, will be brought forward in
the other House, and therefore it is not necessary fur
me to enter into them here, for the purpose of taking
into account the estimates that have already
been laid before Parliament, and also for the raising
of such sums as may be necessary for carrying on
the business of the State. These measures are neves
miry to provide for the honour and dignity of the Crown.
All other measures, soy Lords, will be postponed
until the meeting of another Parliament. Under theft
circumstances', toy Lords, I shall move that an humble
Address be presented to his Majesty, to return to his Ma-
jesty the thanks of this House for the communication which
his Majesty has been pleased to make, mud to express the
deep sense which this House entertains of his IlLjesty's
kindness in king unwilling to recommend to the at-
tention of Parliament at this advanced period of the
Session, and the present state of public business, any new
matter which may admit of postponement without
any detriment to the public service ; and to assure his
Majesty that this House most cordially joins with
hint in opinion that it would he most conducive to the
general convenience, and, to the interests of the country,
to call a new Parliament with as little delsy as possible ; and
to assure his Majesty that this House will apply themselves
to conform tcs such measures, and will concur in making
rub temporary provision, as may he requisite for the con-
duct of the public service, in the interval that must elapse
between the close of the present Station, and the assem.
tiling of a new Parliament.

CM the motion that the Lord Chancellor read the Ad-

Earl GREY rose, end said,—My Lords, I must confess
that it did appear to me yesterday, that the proposition
contained in his Majesty's most gracious Message was one
of the most novel and extraordinary kind that I ever wit-
news'. My Louis, if that was my impression yesterdays,
I 111110 say that that impreession has not been dimieished
by the very inefficient and unsatisfactory explanation
which the Noble Duke, at the head of his Majesty's Go-
vernment, has been pleiseeil to give of the course he means
to propane to puma on the present occasion. My Lord'',
he began his speech by stating to your Lordship. the effect
and object of the law pained in the reigr of King
and continued in Queen Anne, by the authority of which
law we are et this moment assembled. That law was passed
fior the purpoee of enabling Parliament to sit to enact
legislative provision* in CARS of emergency, That being
so, my Lords, and if it should appear to you, as I trust it
will, that there are at this moment subjects of great im-
portauce, calling for our irntnediats interference, which
cannot be delayed without injury to the public service—if
such be your Lordship.' impression, then I think your Lord-
ships will see that there is no necessity for calling on your
Lordships to assent to the proposition of the Noble Duke.
My Lord., we are called upon to make a temporary pro-
vision for the service of the State, which, it is said,
is neeesaery to be provided for, in order that
they may be satisfactorily performed in the interval
that awl claps between the close of the present
Session soil the assembling of a new Parliament.
That is one of the propositions of the Noble Duke.
Another, my Lord., is, that we are met to express an
opinion of the propriety and of the necessity of the
itnaredi ite dissolution of Parliament. My Lords, I
perfectly concur with the Noble Duke, in what
he has stated as to the expectations of the probable alias°.
lotion of Parliament, and tilat considerable anxiety Iris
arisen in the contemplation (,t that event, and the evils
that would result from the keg thened delay of i dissolution.
This evil, it it be one, is out only of comparison ; and we
inti.t weigh well before we avoid this lesser, lest we should
fall into a deeper one. We saw this evil approaching us
'luring the long and afflicting illness of his late Majesty ;
men's minds werevertatily directed with great carnestnesi

to his Majesty, but still, my Lords, in the mean time, the
business proceeded under an administration, as it appears
to me, incapable of directing Hear, and cheers. )
My Lords, the Nolie Duke has told your Lordships that
much time i 4 requisite still to complete that business
which ordinarily would have been brought to a termination
at this period. What proof have we that the business may
nut be completed within a convenient time? Is it not
my Lords a most extraordinary thing that we are to be told
upon this occasion, afier Parliament has deliberated fur
upwards of fire months upon those measures which were
recommended by his Majesty at the commencement of the
session, that they are to be delayed, and that hie Majesty's
Ministers are in such a state of embarrassment that they
find it impossible to proceed. My Lords, I defy any man
to understand what is the object of his Majesty's Ministers.
What are we, my Lords, now asked to de ? We are to
confide in Ministers who have brought us into the situa-
tion in which we at present find ourselves. We aro
.to confide in the means of going on by such an unreason..
able proposition as the one now submitted to the Howe.
At. the same time it is proposed to your Lordships, in order
to get tit of the increase of business, and to avoid the con-
fusion that would be introduced int ) the public service if
some provision were not made, to place in the hands of the
Ministers, who have already shown themselves incompetent
to manage the business of the country, a temporary grant
of public money. In what manner had they already de•
served the confidence of Parliament so as to establish ground.
fur its future confidence ? See, my Lords, the extraordinary
circumstance under which your Lordships are called on to
adopt this addremis.—(llear.)—My Lords, since the law
was passed in the reign of King William, there has been
occasion frequently to call it into practice. On the acces-
sion of Queen Anne, on the accession of King George 1.,
on the accession of George 11., on the accession of George
111., and on the accession of his late Majesty, the Perlin-
meat continued to sit under the authority of this law. At
an earlier period of our history, it was frequently necessary
that Parliament should, after the demise of the Crown, be
re-assembled to watch over the public interests. This bad
happened at all periods of the year. The accession of
Queen Anne took place in January (some Noble Lords
said August, some March, and Earl Grey correcting him-
self, said March). The accession of Queen Anne was in
March, that of George I. in August, of George 11. in
June, of George 111. in October, and that of his late Ma-
jesty, George IV., in the month of January. An accea-
sion, therefore, bad happened at different periods of the
year, and under every possible combination of circum-
stances ; and in all these circumstances Parliament had
continued to sit and to act. The only exception was on
the accession of his late Majesty, when Parliament was
immediately dissolved ; a precedent which it seems is now
:0 be followed. In all the other cases, Parliament, whe-
ther autt;.!ily sitting or in rezee; lei! having to he assem-
bled, and at all periods in former times, had not found it
inconvenient to sit; and in almost all eases the Parliament
had settled the Civil List, and provided for the support of
the Government and the dignity of the Crown before it
was dissolved. All the precedents of these former periods
were departed from in February, 1820. The Parliament
which was assembled at the demise of George 111. had it
measure recommended to it similar to that now recom-
mended--a measute to make a temporary .provision
fur the support of the Government, with a view to
an immediate dissolution. But that precedent was
not a good precedent. There are more precedents the
other way, and precedents more worthy to be fol-
lowed ; but I will not pertinaciouly insist on the ne-
cessity of settling the Civil List before the close of the
Parliament as an argument why the precedents of
farmer times should be followed, in preference to
the precedent on the accession of his late Majesty. I
must, however, call on your Lordships to consider under
what circumstances the Parliament was then placed. Par-
liament met in February, having previously met for
short time. The Session was just entered on ; neither
Supplies were proposed nor Estimates brought in, nor were
there any alterations of the laws proposed. All the busi-
ness was to begin de novo ; and the time required for
the consideration of them and carrying them into law. was
so great that the time, it was stated, would moire at which
the Parliament must les dissolved before they could he
completed, which would occasion, as was represented,
great difficulty, inconvenience, and danger. It was, there-
fore, recommended. to Parliament not to engage in any
measures which would protract the period at which Par-
liament might be dissolved, without any evil consequence
or danger resulting from the dissolution. But how are
the circumstances now? Are we at the beginning of a
Session of Parliament ? Have wenot time to pass the mea-
sures, not now to begin but in progress? Most we begin
' the whole business of the Session de novo 7 No, my Lord..
On the 4th of February, his Majesty's most gracious
Message recommended some important measures, they
were in accordance introduced, but some of them were
not in so happy a state of progress as could be wished,
or as the situation of the country required. It was neces-
sary for the good of the country that these measure, be
brought to a termination before Parliament was dissolved,
Far be it from him to wish to interfere with the Royal
Prerogative ; but his sense of public duty obliged him to
object most strenuously to the motion of the Noble Duke,
Ile could see grounds of opposition in what was stated,
and also grounds in omitting subjects that ought to, have
been introduced, which called for the serious consideration
of that House. lie wen not prepared, nor did he expect
to hear, the proposition of the Noble Duke, and he
hoped their Lordships would allow a further time for the.
consideration of the important matters contained in
the Message from the Crown. Nothing could be
further from his thoughts than to titter a word of die.
respect towards the distinguished individual who brought
forward time motion ; but he wished that the Noble
Duke and the Government had anticipated a subject which
had been under the consideration of many of the Members
of that House. It was a subject which he alluded to with
great delicacy. He was well aware of the Willits and
regular life of his present Majesty, and he might be blessed
with long life, but at the moment he was addressing their
Lordships how many were summoned to their last account
without any notice. Under such circumstances, therefore,
when the uncertainty of life was considered, what danger
must the country be exposed to without a Parliament. Their
Lordships would consider what a condition must the country
be in if there was no successor to the Crown appointed during
the minority of the next heir. Unless some provision
were made, the moment the Crown descended to a minor
sovereign, however young he or she might be, that mo-
ment be possessed all the rights of Majesty. In such
state of things, the probability of which was very
slight, the consideration of the subject ought not for
a moment to tie delayed. lie did not know in what
terms to bring the subject under the consideration of their
Lordships ; he did, therefore, hope dist further time
would he allowed. He should never shrink from any
duty Ismeause it was painful; and be hoped their
Lordships would consider that the public interests and
the public safety required something to be done., lie
thought the proper mode to introduce the subject to which
he bad alluded would he by a recolumentlation from the
Kier, and if the Ministers would have the boldness
to propose such a course, he was mitire hie present
Mairety would nut object to it....-(Hear, hear. )--He did
not wish to do any thing but in the roost respectful loan-
nee, and only wished to recommend the adoption of such
measures es would be conducive to the hunour of the
King and the good of the country ; but be must at the
Noblesame tha
tytime
Duke,ie)lnter
y ica,
amid na Poe:tit; :wityn"agett
hiosa:fgcattoiihtnis
constitutional
Govtm ernment lar 1:1::::otei
rat
tinboasynn
ocaoef timeftite)iattn -t.
lismcntary grants.
the Government of the country should not by any measure
be thrown into anarchy anti confusion, which, if the pro.
position of time Noble Duke was seceded to, was a poi.
'Why that he could not exclude from his mind. Undme
such circumnotences be dill entreat the Noble Duke to al-
low of further time for the consideration of an address to
the throne. If the 1\ obit) Duke did not accede to this
he should endeavour to press it upon the consideration of
their lordships by way of amendment. Ile should do it
in terms the most respectful. He very much he.
mented the necessity and the shortness of time that
had elapsed since they were made acquainted with his
Majesty's most gracious Message, but from en imperative
sense of public duty he felt called upon to propose an
amendment, that that debate be adjourned till to-muorrew
evening._(clear bear.)
Time Earl of tiAItROWBY stated, that he could not
agree with army of time observations of the Noble Earl; but
lie approved of the proposal with which he cuncluded.-..
(Hear, hear.) He differed with time Noble Earl in his
view of the state of public business, and thought that it
would be, looking at the advanced period of the &slime
for the bock of the public, that the business befitre Per-

liament should be postponed. It appeared to him that,
puusiin,lgicall)lu,,pisntsessisblemilliiclihgeenoeuel,4 there
not would ould remain
a ina"
and of
carried
through,as few Members of the other house would remain in town,
and those few would be occupied with their own interests,
it would be better to postpone all business which could be
postponed. With respect to the settlement of the Civil
List, the Noble Earl said he would nut insist on that:
and with respect to the second point, to which the Noble
Earl had alluded, and which was of great importance, if
the Noble Esrl, with all his great talents and habits of
public speaking, found a difficulty in addressing their
Lordships on it, other Noble Lords might well decline say-
ing anything on the subject. He must agree with the
Noble Earl in Paying that lie bad not overstated, he had
understated the possible danger to which the country
might be exposed. The Noble Earl had stated that A
minor might be the King ; but it was quite possible that,
at the demise of the Crown, there should be no King. He
would ask their Lordships if it would be possible to ray
who is the King at the demise of the Crown?—(Hear.)
Ile saw that the allusion he made was fully comprehended
by the Noble Lords opposite; they saw the grounds of the
d ffictilty of determining who should be proclaimed King,
Au heir to the throne was at all times possible, and there
might yet be issue to hie Majesty. It was not only poe.
Bible in law, but it was not improbable in fact, that at the
demise of his Majesty there might be in an advencedatage
of existence a being who would be entitled to all their
Lordships' allegiance, and what step would it be possible to
take to provide for such a possible contingency? He was
aware of all the difficulty of legislating on the subject, but
some measure might be provided as a temporary expedient,
not as a permanent law. It would be possible, he thought,
to point out a person on the spot capable and proper to be
entrusted with the power of Government. He thought,
in such a ease, her Majesty the Queen might be autho.
rised to exercise the powers of Government fur six weeks
or two months after Parliament should assemble, or for
six weeks or two months after Parliament were assembled.
There was a person near the throne competent to exercise
the functions of Royalty, and apparently the best person
who could be selected in whose hands to place the Royal
power, should such a calamity occur as had been hinted
et. Ile only threw this out as a suggestion. He would
consider her Majesty the Queen in the light of a trustee
for the possible infant or 'Lir Presumptive, for a shout
period. Ile considered the subject on the whole as sur-
rounded with difficulties, and he should vote for the post-
ponement merely on the ground that it was necessary to
have a little more time to consider it.
The Earl of WINCIIILSEA supported Lord Grey's
amendment. The only motive which induced Ministers to
recommend the dissolution of Parliament mast be
the consciousness of their own inability to carry
on the public business. At all events Parliament ought
not ti separate until some pros;siaei vole made id the case
of a demise of the Crown. Ile hoped they would agree
to postpone the question.
The LORD CHANCELLOIL—IIe was anxious at
this early peri, d of the debate to express his opinion. The
question, as it appeared to him, was purely one of ex-
pediency—whether they should go on with the present
Session of Parliament, for the purpose of completing that
!atinees which was already before Parliament, in addition
to the subject alluded to by the Noble Earl, or whether
they should at once put an end to their present delibe-
rations, in order to resume the general business of the
country as early as possible. It appeared to him, when
he considered the conveniences and the inconveniences of
the case, that the conveniences greatly predominated in
favour of the proposal of his Noble Friend. They had ass opportunity of knowing, front the votes of the other
House, how the business stood there, aid he would ven-
ture to say, that if in addition to that business they were
to take into consideration the two points to which the
Noble Earl had alluded, many months must elapse before
they could come to a close. Besides which, be begged to
ask if so late a period of the Session was a judicious time
for bringing on the discussion of questions of so great im-
portance ?—(Hear, hear.) With respect to the House of
Commons, would it not be found that many Members
were absent, and that many others were attending their
electioneering engagement, ? and then, he would ask:
whether, under theist, circurnateueee, it would be possible
for theist to proceed with a subject ? The Noble Earl had re-'
fared to the nature of the measures existing in the ether
froteae, and had pronounced a sweeping condemnation of
them. He could not consent to meet the Noble Earl on
this subject in this sort of side-wind way; but he was
confident that he could show that there was no ground
for Bitch a charge. It had been said, that the Civil List
might lie postponed; but if Parliament continued sitting,
it would be disrespectful towards the King not to take
that subject into consideration...Meer, hear.).--And let
them recollect what was the nature of that measure, and
what were the inquiries to which it would give rise, In
1820, When all the propositions for the Civil List had been
in preparation fer three, four, or five years, nevertheless
the single discussion of that question occupied the Atten-
tion of Parliament for five weeks ; they, therefore, could
not expect that it would be less than several months in this
instance. With respect to the other measure, lie must
confess that he did not indulge in the gloomy anticipations
of the Noble Earl : and he was tonfident that he could
satisfy their Lordships, that the country did not stand in
'a different situation from former occasions. What was
the case shortly after the accession of George the Third ?
The nit itw of Wales was born; Was the ease on that
event immediately taken into consideration? On the con-
trary, he believed three or four Seasiona were allowed to
pass before any allusion to the subject was made. All that
was now required was the lapse of two or three months.
In his apprehension the case with respect to infants
was the same as with Sovereigns of a maturer age.
Podiament would meet, as it had met on the present
occasion the Privy Council also would assemble in the
same manner, and the proceedings in all these respects
would be the tune. It was in the power of a
minor Sovereign to choose his own servants, and
therefore if the previous officers of State were continued
in their situation, it would be their duty to bring the
question of the Regency before Parliament ; if others
were appointed, then on them would all the responsibility
of the Government devolve. In both cases the same &Ili-
, cultic* which had already been suggested would follow,
except in such cases as when the heir happened to be the
son of the reigning Monarch. Pediment, in such cases,
had never interfered, but had always thought it more wise
to wait the course of events; and then, if anything called
for interposition, the wisdom of Parliament was always
able to find an adequate remedy.—No inconvenience, in
his opinion, could follow from the delay that was con-
templated ; and even if the circumstance to which the
Noble Earl bad Alluded, should occur, no practical in-
convenience would ensue; for Parliament would imme-
diately meet, and provide for the difficulty. On these
grounds lie should give his snppurt to the proposal of his
Noble Friend.
Viscount GODERIC4 could not conceive how any one
who adverted to the course of business in the House of
Commons could fail to see that nothing was done—( Heer,
hear)—and if they were to separate without having dune
anything, it would produce in the country such a degree
of inextricable confusien, as all the skill, power, and in.
tenuity of the Noble Duke would never he able to re.
medy.---(Cheers.)—lt Was not necessary to state in de.
tail the measures to which he referred; but they were
some of the most important interest, as regarded the
commerce, agriculture, and finances of the country, all of
which seemed to hint to be in such confusion, as to ran_
der it impossible for Parliament to adjourn. It was very
well to say that it was the fault of gentlemen who sat in
the other House of Parliament---(hear).--and that tlay
had neglected their duty, because they had not given ready assent to all that Government had proposed...-
( Heer, hear.)—Of all reasons for advising the King to
dissolve Parliament, that appeared to him to be the worst
and lie was astonished that any one would venture to pay
the existing Parliament so bad a compliment. This then
is a consideration which ought not to be overlooked, and
he should like to know, before he voted with the Noble
Duke, to which of the measures already before Parliament
Government intended to apply itself for the purpove of
having them settled—whether it was to be by withdrawal
li
--whether by again having two or three alterations-....0r
whether by leaving them altogether to take their chance:
They would he deserting their duty if they did not attend
to time consideratione, and if they did not endeavour to
impress, on the Government the propriety and necessity of
reconsidering the measure proposed that night. With re..
gird to the other topic which had been started, he would
not take on himself to add much. He could not how.
ever admit that the case which the Noble and Learned
Lord had brought forward bore upon the point. lie
thought that it rather went to that there was a tie.

cessity for insvaediate consideration of the subject than
the reverse, and he thought there never was a case in
which they were more hound than now to take care that
they (lid not proceed beefily, ineonsiderately, or rashly.
The Earl of ELDON hoped he shoeld Le estensed if be
offered a few words in explanation of the reasotis that ift
doted him to support the amendment of the Noble Earl.
He had no inclivatioa to make any observations on the
conduct of the two Houses of Parliament during the
items! onnt ;
inaenataln
reh,e
eo u 1
tdh
otuhgehr
te fo
treLtl ooakt
least
atth ey presenttlie
ought to adopt the proposal cif postponing the
subject to the following evening. If, however] it
were supposed that he hail any objection to an early
appeal to the people of England, in order to deter-
mine, in a Constitutional manner, what they thought of
the measures of the Government, it was a great mistake.
If that were the only question in view, no one could he
more anxious than he was for a dissolution that very night.
They had beard a great deal of dissatisfaction stated in
rumours and reports. He should, therefore, be glad for
the people to have an opportunity of expressing that die-
satisfaction by acts rather than words; and when that
opportunity WWI afforded, if they (lid not avail themselves
of it, he should say that it was their own faults if they
had further occasion to make use of the language of com-
plaint. Ile would not undertake the task of answering
his Learned Friend on the Woolsack, but the impression
made on his mind, notwithstanding the speech of his
Learned Friend, and of the Noble Duke was, that they
were both strongly in support of the pmpoaition of the
Nottle Earl.—(Cheer.) Ths Noble Dnke had told them
that the Parliament, in the reign of William UL, had
thought it right to alter the Constitution of the country
as far as regards the instant dissolution of Parliament on
the demise of the Crown, and to give it a limited power
of meeting and sitting after that event. Surely, if this
chewed anything, it chewed the necessity that had been
felt by that and subsequent Parliaments of having a Session
after the death of the King, instead of an itnmediate dis-
solution.
From the style in which his Learned Friend
had talked of Royal infants, one might conclude that he
thought them just as good as any ; and for the matter of
that, he dared to say, that if he (Lord Eldon) was a Mili-
tary Prime Minister, he shoulsl like nothing better than an
infant King.—(Loud cheers.) They had already, through
the good offices of the Government, admitted into power
what lie must still call idolatrous and superstitious;
and the next step in the way of power, be supposed, was
for them to have a little infant, of what size he really did
not know, but, as far as he could guess, lie really did not
believe that if it were placed under the ample integuments(
which covered his Learned Friend's head, they would be
able to see it.—(Cheers and laughter. )—And wty was
all this to be? Because the law, in what the Scotch
would call its fiction, and in what we call its preeutnp.
wappuzi AIWA V.n infant, if Royal, had as much
sense es if it had arrived at the age ef threescore and ten.
But take this case as applying generally, and see vi!!4her
it would lead them. Suppose they were to have another
Guy Fawkes, and all their Lordships were to be blown up
.if his Learned Friend was so lucky as to escape..-before
the successors to the Peerages could be settled, and the
next brothers admitted to the House, it would be fleece-
sary to inquire how many widows there were, and to ad-
mit no Peers presumptive till it was seen whether there
was not so many little Peers inclosed in the bodies of
those widows. It was, therefore, on the grounds of ins-
policy and inconvenience that lie should vote against the
Noble Duke's proposition, and because it was evident that
opriety required that the proposition of a Regency
should not flow from the Parliament, but from the Crown
itself.
Lord ELLENBOROUGH, from hereditary regard for
the Noble and Learned Earl who bad last addreksed them,
would regret more deeply than any one the supposition
teat they had been addressed for the last time by him;
but he must at the same time expre.s a hope that they bad '
for the last time beard the. Noble and Learned Earl Wraps
theta in a tone of jocularity on a subject which com-
manded such general and heart-felt sorrow, as a calamity.
(Hear, bear.)--He certainly must say that he had not
expected to hear from the Noble and Learned Earl such a
tone in adverting to this important subject, and which, be
would also add, be had beard with equal regret and e'er-
prise.--(Hear. )--The general desire of all must he to adopt ,
such steps as would be most conducive to the public ben.-
fit. The Noble Viscount hail declared that nothing had
been done ; but if that was the case he should like to know
on what view of the subject the Noble Viscount had,
within the last few days, founded the hope that much could
now at this state of the Session be done ? All the difficulties
of the case were increased. The Members of the House of
Commons were now certain of that dissolution which
previously they bad only apprehended. The Noble Earl
(Herrowby) had admitted that there were no hopes of con-
eluding the business before Parliament witk advantage to
the truistic service ; and therefore if these two questions
were added, how much more hopeless must the cause be ?
It had been said many years ago, " Stay awhile, and we
mil make an end the sooner." He thought that this was a
wise maxim, and because he thought so, he should sup-
port
and he would say,
s n
ortev eFr, that l e hail
behg l never
gt
as
the
of e!
hl
1 04‘3,1 his
t
given an opinion with a firmer
in the judgment he had formed. He regressfes exc ee dingly
what hail fallen from the Noble Eat! (Grey) ; and advert.
ing to the conduct which that Noble Earl hail pursued
since the formation of the present Government, he must
say that be had not expected such a declaration. But at
the same time, since be entertained those opinions, he re-
joiced that he had expressed them, so that they might
know who were their friends and who were their enemies.
Great as might be the danger of having such an opponent
its the Noble Earl—..great as was his pain in seeing that
he was at last and unexpectedly arraigned against them.....
still they would maintain themselves in their strict path of
public duty, reckless of what might be the consequences
to themselves. The Noble Earl seemed to have forgotten
that last year the present Government had earriesi a
measure in pursuance of the same detertnination which
he (Earl Grey) had year after year contended for, and
which he (Lord Ellenborough) would take upon himself
to say that no other Government could have carried. For
the sake of the principles by which they were actuated,
they had run the greatest risk; and in the same course
they would continue, in spite of the opposition of the
Noble Earl, as long as his Majesty was pleased to require
their services_-(Hear, hear)—endeavouring to the best
of their abilities to maintain the public interest, and to
further those ohjecte which it was his Majesty's desire to
promote.
The Earl of HARROWBY briefly explained.
The Duke of RICHMOND would tint detainrAuvv.itd:htileir Lordship, many minutes with any general observations
upon the question in discussion, still less would he pro-
ceed to answer the speech of the Noble Lord opposite, and
for the obvious reason, that the speech consisted of nothing
less than an attack upon the Noble and Learned Earl near
him—an attack upon a character which stood infinitely
higher than did that of the Noble Lord himself. lie (the
Duke of Richmond) should not have troubled their Lord-
ships with even that short notice of the speech of the
Noble Baron, were it not impossible for the Noble and
Learned Earl to rise in his own defence, having already
spoken. It was merely necessary to call their Lordships'
attention to the circumstance, for nothing could be more
needless than fur him (the Duke of Richmond) to take
that defence upon himself, for the character adverted to
was above all reproach. As to what the Noble Baron
bad said of another Noble Earl, it was equally unneces-
rimy to reply to that, for in the short period which had
been given far reflection since those observations bad
escaped from his lips, be must have anticipated that he
should rue the hour when he had dared--aye uncoe-
stitutionally dared to attack that Noble Earl—he
would say unconstitutionally dared to do so, for no
Minister had a right to impute motives to any
cle)7trairollfy Phaatriliaunnednetrs--too((C1 ritelsieofNo"blNe oilanroo'n "et's")(l—ay !Inge 11
glad his opponents had avowed them-
that he was
xelves—for that it was much better to have a known
opponent than a secret enemy. Now he would appeal t,
their Lordships if that was not imputieg moiives.—( Hear,
hear, hear.) Could any moan, with the principles or the
feelings of tvgentlemate sit indifferently tinder such impu-
tations ? If any Noble Lord was of opinion that the Noble
Baron had not made those imputatious, it was to be hoped
that he would have the goodness to sta'e to the Howe
what else he did say ; Itiele he sarit,:ni:iiii.ne,eo:loasatfo
nistration possessed the confidence et the Crown, and that,
IPt:::11e) et?: they
vAe that "ei
sreet
of
office. TheaPuvernment scented, and not without resson.
ld
nut give them large supplies without those wo er ex la la-
-11 1'
taig:tiltitt:hrileies:on I) for

Lord ELLENBOROUGH ran to explain, but he ti F 7?,
trttated it would be hardly necessary for him to enter ie :'..1
any eiplanatioor lie hoped it could not he *opposed
.t liie ~.
that i i
he meant to imp any improper mo.ives to the I.
and Learned Earl, fot whom he entertained pereonally awl -; I
otherwise the highest rege,d, .4 what he might cell N 1...1
deep hereditary respect. He believed that he was exactly, k...;
ute
g
4
the last person in the House likely to Impute to the Noll..
Lord SELSEA made one or two obeervationa, whirl) --,a
were it:addible below the bar.
M t
The Marquis of LANSDOWICE felt himself bound no
to enter into anything eittaneosts upon a discussion like'
and Learned Earl any but the purest motivea. I
11l
the present; but he legged of their Lordships to look at r *,
the painful condition in which they were placed, and in oil
which he fully concurred with the Noble Lord opposik:44
who spoke last ; hut they could not but consider it their
..
first duty to give repots and tranquillity to the petiole ti,.
But what was that Noble Lord's rceeipt for affording tier
repose and tranquillity to the people? It was the moss rc.?
extraordinary that, under the circumstances bad ever been r. .
enunciated in Parliament; it was, in these circumstance* t,
of difficulty, to abandon the people; it was, iu these cir- i.,,!
cumstances of uncertainty and danger, to steeled to pro• :_ki
vide for the safety and good envernment of the people. ,::;;
He called upon the
and recommended them to leave to another Parliament to .7-4
do that which ought to be done inetantly,...-to another gi
present Parilament to forget its duty, s..
Parliament to he hereafter assembled at an itsdefiuite t. 4
period ! He need scarcely remiud their Lordships VI:
that to adopt such advice, would he to contradict .1.-.1
the policy of all legislation in this coaster,
from th
earliest periods. Was it not in all eases the coins, v' .1 i
which Parliament adopted, to provide for deaths and
other possible events? Was it not a large portion 41
the bus nese of legislation to provide lot possibilities? :,,
That was the argument. The course fur which he and ".
his friends contended, it was alleged would prodtree much
inconvenience to indivisleals--withent its appearing to he ,;.-z
recollected, thatagreat constitat'onal precedent was elinsit -"L:
to be created, the remote effects of which no man could vs,:
anticipate. He would retrace the question to a narrow i
compass. Was Parliament to turn its back upon its own
functions at a moment when those functions happen to b'
of the highest importance to the public interest 7 lie l•
skated not to affirm, that if they once gave way
would put an end to the Act of William and to the
Queen Anne. The Noble Lord seemed to ho'
proportion as the exigency was great and clinic
the incompetency of Parliament to provide fo.
difficulty was great, but they were not capab
riding for it. Was that any thing more than a.
many words that the most important functions
ment--Parliament was not able to discharge ?
Acts to which he referred ought to be repealed at. ..,e ear-
liest opportunity; ',.!• would not enter ;aria part'culara ; I,ut
they were difficulties which could not be considered insu-
perable, and which, if Parliament shrink from contending
with, they would no longer be deserving of the fruit
reposed in them by the Constitntien. They had been
accused of having been actuated by party purposee, lie
confessed himself totally at a loss to understand what
purpose of party could be served by the course they had
adopted : they had been influenced by no consideration,
except a conviction that it was the duty of Parliament to
provide, temporarily at least, for the exigency that might
arise; and it was upon that ground that they called fot
the delay of a single day to consider whether it might hr
desirable to make the provision of which he spoke tent
porary or otherwise. He could not conceive how Par•
liament could lend a band to its own dissolution, leaving a
case of so much importance unprovided for, involving a ,
great a change-4o momentous a principle of the Consti
tution itself. The manner in which that contingency
might be provided for is quite another question ; but sure
he was, if it went forth to the public that, on an occasion
like the present, Parliament had not provided fur the
possible contingency, they could not but lose the con&
sowltitiwgiiinointulidness,antneatigpewihtritfh:oonnumt
denee of the people, and they should deserve to lose it, if
the inconvemence felt is the last reign left no impreseion
upon their minds. or prodeeeti no effect upon their vote.
ttreawnhheoi
tor thatdu'dtsibeintiestthhamoutagdrheet:nuegeeewssa hricylfir sin;
good motive they shrunk from the present difficulty, and
their Lordships would bat bear these considerations is:
mind, he felt persuaded they would concur with him in
thinking, that to ask a delay off twenty-four hours was
not asking too mech. What might be done even at the
end of that period, would sot afterwards shut them out
from a full discussion of the question at a future time,
nor would it pledge any Peer to the vote he might give
hereafter.

The Marquis of LONDONDERRY, upon so momentous
nn occasion as that, would not occupy their Lordships' at-
tention for mere than a very few minutes. The Address
which they bad been called upon to vote, introduced so
many, and such considerations, that he could nut bring
himself to advert to them in the slight and cursory manner
which the limits he prescribed to himself necessarily im-
posed. He then entered into a warm defence of the
character and conduct of the Noble and Learned Earl
whse.,e,ortri the amendment, as well as of those who
acted with He deprecated the haste with which the
proposition of tn. Voble Duke was pressed forward, lie
urged the advantages of g:ein,; his Majesty's Government
time to reflect upon the course the) -weir pursuing, and he
also entreated them to consider how irsynrtsnt it was for
themselves to have time to reflect upon whs. was perfectly
unknown to any one of them before they rams. down to
the House that evening. He believed there was not a
Noble Lord in that House who, before they sat, had
least idea of the proposition that was to be submitted to
them ; he therefore contended that en extension of the
time was a matter of the utmost consequence. He also
thought the case of considerable importance, from the
mode in which it had been treated by the Noble Baron
behind him. That Noble Lori, though he talked much of
repose and tranquillity, had thought proper to snake
personal allusion to a Noble Earl opposite, and that on an
occasion when they were assembled to discuss one of the
greatest questions which could be brought before them.
The Noble Marquis renewed his defence or the conduct of
the Noble end Lamed Earl--especially as regarded the great measure last yesse---offering the highest testimonies of
admiration to the uniform consistency and di.intereatedness
of his career. lie (Lord Londonderry) approved of that
measure, and thanked the Noble Duke for tarrying it ; but
he could not forget that it was the supporters of the presen
amendment who sowed the seeds of that measure, thougl
they never had the satisfaction of reaping the fruit. A
the honour fell to those who same in at the eleventh hour
bat it was a fact beyond dispute that it was the advocacy Noble Lords opposite which brought that great measure t
maturity. He, therefore, could mot silently allow the Nob,
linon to take credit to that Government for a measure, a'
the gratitude for which was due be other pat ties. In far,
it was one of those measures which sooner or later lose
have been acceded to, no matter who held the reins of Ge
veriment. Manyeecusations of party motives had been mass
in the course of the present dissuasion; and that alone,
thought, ought to influence the House in Tither adopting tl
amendment thee the motion: and, agsins as so many pe
sonal allusions had been made, and as so little time his been asked for, he thought the Howse would hest consult i
own dignity, as well as the truest interest if the publics b
voting with the Noble Earl who moved the ansenshnen
In so voting they pledged themselves to nothing. When ti
question should come fully to be discussed, he was not pr
pared to say what course he should advocate or vote for
but in present circumstances he had not the :belie
difficulty in **Ong, that it would be net only ineoi
renienr, but indiscreet, fee Parliament to separate within
making the necessary arrangements on the matter uncle
consideration.

'4l

"Si
3
~~

The Marquis of BUTE then advanced to the tabl
tuned away from the bar, and addressed the noose, t
in a manner so difficult to be heard, that only a few frig.,
menu of what fell from his Lordship can be given. Tia
Noble Lotd then entered into an culogium upon tit public character and Government of the
Noble Duke, 00
expressed the deepest groirode to him fir the inea.ured
last year ; and he thought also that for many oh r tner
cures, the country had reason to feel very grateful to t
Present Government.
The Earl of CARNARVON put it to the Muse wh
Sher the continuance of the StAsiso lot It few di
longer was not infinitely a lass rift than parasite*
the country to incur the htmarti of sash ao event
that the twistability of vtbich was coitittoplattal. )
ottiv