The Sun.
London, England, 1863-02-14 00:00:00

JUDGES' CIRCUITS.

Mr. A. MILLS asked the Secretary of State for the Home
Department whether it was the intention of her Majesty's
Government to take any steps in pursuance of the recom-
mendations of the Circuit Regulation Commission, or in
any way to alter the existing divisions of the judges'
circuits ?

Sir G. GREY explained that some alteration would be
made in the Northern Circuit. The necessary regulations
were now under the consideration of the Lord Chancellor.
PRIVATE BILLS COSTS.

Mr. A. MILLS asked the President of the Board of
Trade, whether the reference to the committee abut to be,
appointed on private bill legislation, would include the
question of the expediency or otherwise of empowering
committees on private bills to award costs in certain cases ?
Mr. M. GIBSON replied that if the house thought pro-
per to appoint such a committee the subject of considering
costs would fairly come under its consideration.

SUPPLY.
EPPING AND HAINHAULT FORESTS.

Mr. PEACOCKE moved that an humble address be pre-
sented to her Majesty praying that her Majesty would be
graciously pleased to give directions that no sales to facili-
tate enclosures be made of Crown lands or Crown forestal
rights within 15 miles of the metropolis.
Mr. COX seconded the motion,

Mr. F. PEEL replied that the Crown only enjoyed the
right of supervision, or strictly speaking, forestal rights,
over Epping Forest, and this only over 2,060 acres. The
proposed address would therefore not answer its purpose.

Sir G. GREY said all that had been done was in accord-
ance with the Enclosure Act. They could not draw a
rigid rule in these matters.

Mr. BUCK STONE considered that these forests should
be maintained for the benefit of the public.
Mr. LOCKE said if the Crown had done wrong in part-
ing with these lands, care should be taken that no damage
was done to the public in the future. The gentleman should
recollect the old legal maxim—nullum tempos occurrit regi.
Mr. AYRTON supported the motion.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCIIEQUER opposed
the motion. The discretion of holding or parting with
these lands would be left entirely in the hands of the
Crown. The laying down of a rigid rule would prove ini-
mical to the public. (Divide, divide.)
Mr. HENLEY supported the motion.
After a few words from Sir Henry Willoughby, Mr.
Melina, and Lord Enfield,
The house then divided on the motion for going into
committee, when their appeared—
Ayes 73
Noes

Majority...,
POST OFFICE SAVINGS BANKS.

The house then went into committee, and
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER proposed
the following resolution :—" That it is expedient to amend
the laws relating to Post-office Savings Banks, and to grant
power to the Government for the conversion of certain per-
petual Government annuities standing in the name of the
Commissioners for the Reduction of the National Debt, an
account of the Post-office Savings Banks, with certain
other stocks and annuities." He said that the object of the
present committee was to obtain a parliamentary resolution
for the purpose of enabling him to bring in a bill relative
to Post-office savings banks. It was a bill which touched,
it was true, in one or two respects, the powers of other sav-
ings banks, but simply in relation to transactions that were
between the two classes of savings banks. It had nothing
whatever to do with the general management of the old
savings banks, nor with the management of the funds held
on behalf of the old savings banks, and for that reason he
proposed to call it the Post-office Savings Banks Bill. The
resolution which he would move, and which would be in
conformity with the terms upon which the committee was
appointed, would be a resolution of a general character, and
did not refer to some portions of the bill ; but the bill was
a very short and simple one, and he would state to the com-
mittee in two or three minutes what would be its principal
provisions. At present there was no legal method of ena-
bling the old savings banks to wind up. A certain portion
of them had expressed a desire to wind up, and, so far as
depended upon the trustees and managers, had acted upon
that desire to wind up. Now, he did not think that provi-
sions for enabling the old savings banks to be wound up
were likely to be very extensively acted upon. They had
now had some experience upon the subject, and though a
considerable number of the old savings banks had done
what in them lay to wind up their transactions and band
over their deposits to the Postroffice savings banks, yet,
when they looked at the amount and degree of develop-
ment which these savings banks had reached, the aggregate
was comparatively trifling. There were about COO savings
banks in the country, and out of those he thought about
30 or something more, between 30 and 40, that had desired
to wind up their establishments. But the committee would
be able to judge of the comparatively small scale of the great
bulk of those savings banks, when he told them that the
average of deposits in those banks which had been desirous
to wind up was only about £7,000; whereas the average
amount of the deposits in the remaining savings banks,
nearly 600 in number, was more nearly £70,000, though not
quite so much. Therefore, what they had to provide for was
not the likelihood of any general sweeping or rapid change
from the one class of savings banks to the other, but the
desire which had been, he thought naturally and reasonably,
expressed by the managers of a certain portion of the banks,
where this sphere of action had not been a very extended
one, to divest themselves of the liability and responsibility
of those concerns, and hand over the whole cash and assets
to the Post-office savings banks as to the Commissioners
for the Reduction of the National Debt, subject of course to
all claims of the depositors upon that cash and assets. That
was the principal legislative object of the bill he should pro.
pose to introduce, if the resolution should be accepted by
the committee. There was another legislative enactment
which he had in view. He should not at present attempt to
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explain the details of it, which were rather complicated, but
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pecially of minors under seven years of age ; and in some
cases, where the Legislature had not by any direct enact-
ment taken that course, yet the bye laws which had been
framed from time io time by the managers of different savings
banks, and which had received the assent and approval of
the Commissioners for Reduction of the National Debt, and
had thereby acquires the force of law, had placed the accounts