The Sun.
London, England, 1830-11-04 00:00:00

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT.

MUSE OF LORDS—(LAST RIGHT).
Thar Lordships met at Half-past Twelve o'clock..
The Earl of JERSEY informed their Lordships, that
,the (King had desired him to inform the House that his
IkLiiesty would receive the Address which their Lordships
had voted, in. answer to his Speech, at St. James's Nine,
after one &thick.
. The Loan CILANCELLOR, the Marquis Buzz, and other
Peers present, then proceeded in state to St. James's Pa-
lace, and the House adjourned to. to,morow.
'ROUSE OF COMMONS.—(tAST, NIGHT. )
tefore proceeding with the regular business of the
House this day, the SPXAKER, stated that private petitions
could not be received after the 25th of February.
Sir 3. NEWPORT gave. notice, that he should move
en the 23d of November for leave to bring in a Bill,. hay.
Stag for its object the improvement of the Irish Grand Jury
Law..

The Right Hon. Gentleman also gave notice, that lie
should take an early opportunity to
.submit to the consi.
deration of the House a measure relative to the Board of
First Fiuits.
Sir J. 'MACKINTOSH expressed his intention to pre-
sent a petition concerning 'the Danish claims on the' same
day, namely, the 281 of November.
Mr. O'CONNELL gave notice, that 'he should move
on the Ilth of November for leave to bring in a Bill to re.
peal the Irish Subletting Act. It was likewise his inter'.
tion to move, on the 7th of December, for leave to bring
in a Bill for P.adiral Itefinan in the prosentsystern of Par-
liamentary'Representation.
Mr. LITTLETON gave notice of a motion for the Ifilth
of November, respecting the payment of liitioureral wages
-otherwise than in money.
Mr. C. W. WYNNE stated that on tomorrow (this
day) Its thould move for leave to bring in a Bill to re.
peal the Act 'that requires the taking the Oath of Alt.
auration—( Hear, hear)—and also to obviate the nixes.
• city for Alembera of Parliament being sworn before' the
Lord Steward.
Mr. KENNEDY gave notice that it was his ittittition
to •move at an early period of the Session forltiatt to
bring in a Bill extending the Eleet'a,e rranchise in the
-cities and boroughs of Scotland.`-a-leheora..)...:Petitions
- were then presented against an trileatil Undue return at the
late elections for Rye, Pei th, Malden, and other places,
and regulations for their future classification•
%%et. pro
poll and agreed to.
Mr. C. W. WYNNE suggested that in consemienee of
the number of election petitions, four ballots a day ought
to he taken instead of two, commencing with the 11th of
'December.
Mr. BROUGHAM assented to the arrangement, but
•vecommended that an !additional week should he allowed!
in the case of Scotch eleetioni, as the parties in question.
might not be prepared for bringing such inquirica to so
speedy an issue. This proposal was adopted accordingly.
Mr. GREENE presented a petition from the hector and
other inhabitants of Whittingliam, in Lancashire, for the
Abolition of the Slave Trade.
Mr. O'CONNELL presented a -petition front certain
persist*, confined, fur debt in the Four Courts -Marshalsea,
,Dublin, complaining of the discipline' of that prison, and
praying that the abuses of the Court of Conscience might
be torrected.
Mr. lIUME took that opportunity to ask the right
lion. Home Secretary whether he was prepared to intro-
dune any measure for the amendment of the law respecting
imprissiiment for small debts.
Sir It. PEEL replied that he hail no such intention.
The Law Commissioners, at his suggestion, had expressed
themselves quite willing to take up the subject, hitt stated
at the ladle time, that they were already employed upon
matters of much more importance. Ile was therefotealis•
inclined to interrupt their lemurs, or interfere with busi-
ness already intrusted to much.abler hands; hut it was,
perfectly competent for the lion. Gentleman himself to in-
troduce a Bill of the nature he recommended, if the subject
appeared to him too pressing to admit of any postpone-
ment.—(llear, heir.)
Sir S. NEWPORT complained that too great a delay
in man% on the suggestions of the Commissioners had
already taken place, and adverted more particularly to the
remissness displayed by the Law Officers of the Crown
relative to the Sheriff's. bill of het Session,
Mr. 'DOHERTY denied this imputation, Which' he
thought was sufficiently disproved by the fact that many
.regulations in compliance with the opinion of the Cons-
cnissioners had already been introduced. Night after night
last &Won had his attended, to the hours of three and
four in the morning, for the purpose of carrying the Bill
alluded to, but hail always failed, owing to that accumula-
tion of business before thus House.
Air. O'CONNELL bore testimony to the truth of the
Hon. Gentleman's statement, and remarked, that the fate
of this Bill was in itself a proof of the ill effects of the
present Parliamentary hours on the public busineta of the
country. ,
me. HUME again animadverted on the remissness of
the Right Hon. Secretary in not bringing in the Bill Of,
which he had.jost spoken. Why should he thus endea-
vour to shift his ditty from his own'shoulders fur the pur-
pose of palming it on his?, What else was he paid fur?
—(Laughter.)--As to himself, he had already promoted
petition upon petition relative to this very subject, and
had invariably been treated by the Attorney-General with
insolence and contemt. Ha was, therefore averse to tin-
dirt:ace such a task, however necessary lie might deein it,
because healid not choose to expose himself to the risk of
being insulted.—(Laughtier.)—lt was much 'to tie feared;
however, from the whole aspect of his Majesty's. Speech,
that Ministers were disposed to attend rather to. foreign
politics than to tint interests of their country at. hoMe.
Sir R. PEEL most eatnestly disclaimed the indifference
to law reform which the lion. Member had ascribed 'to
hits, He was alWays ready to, devote. to the amelioration
of the law as moth time as he could set apart from the
onerous and important duties of lia office -4ltear.)
Mr. ANGELO TAYLOR had always considered im-
prisonment for debt as a disgrace to the county in which
it prevailed, and theretbre should gladly support any loco,
sure for its abolition. He doubted, however,. very moil!
Whether the Common Law Commiseionera could, owing
to the magnitude and variety of the subjects of their in-
vestigation, bestow the attention to the "matter which it
merited. At the stuns, time he was free to admit that dui
Right Hon. Home Secretary was not officially responsible
for bringing forward the Bill propmed by the Iron. Mem-
ber for Middlesex. .
The petition was ordered to be printed.
STATE or BELGIUM.'
-
Mr. 110I1I1011SE gave notice, that he should on
Friday, the 12th inst., snout pn Addretal tp the Crew on
the relations of this Coontiy to Belgiimi...l.(flaitr, hoary).
WEST INDIA SLAVERY'.
Mr. BROUGHAM gave ,notice of a :motion for Oa
215th instant for the abe'lition of pip%) ideally. The 'oil,.
ject was one of ileep-fil(intortatice to the Unitril Kipp
dam, and therefore one on whitsb no time ishould lio 10,t in
bringing it nefbre Parliament: ''He meant to confine him-
self on that, day to calling the attention of the House to
the general question of negro slavery,. by mevlpit for 14,
Committee Or consider the best and speediest tee in. for'ita
total abolition, and should 'postpone to future day the
consideration of the several mattlim of detail involved in
the general question, ,
Petition& for the abolition of tietr,r9 slavery were pre-
sented from Canterbury, (2), by Lard Fordwich ;_frost}
the Isle of Ely, by; Lord F, Othoroe 1..-frorn Bloxbarn, by
Mr. Payne ; from Aloorgreau,
.spats, by Air, Montan ;
—front Leicetter,,hY Lewes F. 'NealkerS Gloucester,
(9)' by Mr. Phillpotta i«,from Oxford, by, Mr.', Might,
...-lionom Devizes, Wilton,,and New Sarum, by tor. Drnoti,
..-front ,Sonthompton, by Sir fi„ Start horn Ney.
eastle.upott-Tyno and other ;daces.
t'OTE BY BALLOT.
,
Mr, 'WARBURTON gave
,notice, that. lie
.tionuld on
the 26th of Fehruary submit to the House a proposition,
that the Rata's at elections of Members 4,411,4 1.10,0,
should henceforward be taken by ballot, ,
On the motion of Mr. Honors, retort,* were urarre4
of the amount of raves paid to the poor of the several
neristo io England and Wales liy the twurtterd in the
last year. ,
Mr. ii UME gave notice, that he 'should to.moripw move
in address. to the Crowe for copies of all the Treaties its
existence oeswego thist!OUntry and Belgitim, MO Portugal.
CHINA TRADE.
Alr. W. I.VIIITMORE gave notice, that lie should
the i2d instost itlhinit to the.ilonse curtain resolution's oo
the trade ofties i otsistry wills China.
COAST DUTY ON COALS-
Mi. RICE gave withal that 'he should, oil Elie 11th
December, move for a Omit of the duty on `sris.borisc
coals in the Bolted Kingdom.
(4% thii couture of Sir 11. 'PArtlitir4, returns 'Wore
ordered of the roman of the imports of tobacco; foreign
isser tee, Entree* brandy, and get,eila, tvi!lt the airlottyt sat
ditty paid, Ise:. for 41orrit r uttautaystinn, 00E4 the jant yi•ar.
Lord AUQEN'I' grays, noliee of 4 trwtiort for Friday, t 6
19th inist.',for heave to bring io a Usti for prshiiling
nloymerit for the labouring potw, ‘viti adequate wastes,
Mr. 1111011011 AM 'gave notice, that to, 00,04 no dist
day week move for ;cave t,,) f,ring we,, titGihs to thht
which he hail ititooitteti to the liouia last pais r 0,11,4,
County Courts. As the Olttlitt of the Din was thin per.
nay undcrotootl, ha 'did nut expect a I.4:lli,iiinx seal tht

occasion of-toying for leave to bring it in, and therefore
saw no objection to his taking the first stage on a
Wednerday,...-.a a day on which it was generally, understood.
there shouldhe no important or lengthened discussion.
Lord P. LI GOWER gave notice, that he should on
Thursday, the II th inViint,Move. fift. a Cbinmittee en
the Tolle and Custom atlrelatuk
BILSINESS'pr THE HOUSE. .
Sir R.' PEltt,:io moving tn, submit to the Mose the
usual arrangements, in obediente to which an certain days
the orders of the Mute `about(' have a priority of notice,
wished to make one or two observations on the general
Inoineca of the Honse."--(Hear.) The experience of the
last Seasion, anti the etidence of the several notices of mo.
• tiona which hail hcen given that evening, chewed them
that it waif a matter of great impertancathat some under.
standing shoulil be come tt with it view to facilitate the
progress of tlLi puhlia business. It was exceedingly diffi.
cult to devise a mode by which this end could be attained
with satisfaction to all patties. It was very easy for any
Hon. Member who did net fill a public Capacity, to move
that the House should meet at ten (Mock ; and if only the
pensonal inconvenience ef Rat. Members were to be taken
into account, it titottlil give way, cis au objection hot suf-
ficiently Validt but this was not the objection which he
cniortilittlkto the proposition; Ida was founded on the
important nature of the public duties of many Members
of that Houses riii s 1 n 04 of great importance occupied
several Wolfer* of the executive—himself, fit example—.
darthg the while of the morning, up to the . time the
Reuse usually met—business which could not be neg..,
lected,, nor even negligently performed, without dettitnent
of the piddle service. How, then, could those occupied
in the pehlienffiees he in their seats at an early hour?—
(Hear, hear.) . Then there was the business of Commit-
tees, also of paramount importance—indeed, Without dis-.
paragitnent to the House at large, he might safely say that
the business of Parliament could not go en without the
aid of Committees. !kV, he should like to know, could
Members attend tO their duties in that House, and to the
important linainess of Committees, if the House met in the
mertoing?....;s(Hear.) Under these circumstances, be felt
an unwillingness to depart from the ordinary usages of the
House, and should indeed have felt at a loss what to sug-
gest to facilitate the public bwiness, but for the volun-
tary after of the Right lion. Speaker, in the spirit of that
I sacrifice of all , personal consideration to the promotion
of the public service which • had ever distinguished him
since he was first raised to the Chair--(Loud -cheers)—to
take the Chair at three instead of the usual hour of four
o'cleck,-.4llear, hear,)---By this means one clear hour
would be gained Air the diacossion of private business, He
therefore proposed that the Speaker should take the Chair
each day at three o'clock, with the understanding that the
public business should commence at five o'cloek.—(Hear.)
Committeefausoelly met at twelve, and ended their labours
at four o'clock. He proi;ofied that they should meet at
eleven, and sit till three o'clock, anti thus be enabled to
attend to their business in that House. He doubted very
much the policy of precluding Hon. Members altogether
from the means of attending to their private affairs, and
therefore would not propose that Committees should meet
earlier than eleven o'clock; one bdur and a half—that
was, the interval between post time, half past nine, and
the time of Committee—was surely not too much for Hou.
Menthol to attend to their afire, mid read the letters of
their constituents.—(llear, hear.)—He did not propose
the present arrangement as permanent, or say that other
arrangements might not be expedient; he only proposed
it as themost feasible within their reach.
Air. BROUGHAM had a plan of his own to propose
for facilitating the public business, but would postpone it
in order to afford the experiment—for such he understood
it to be—of the Right Hon. Bart. a fair trial. Too much
could not be said in praise oldie spirit in which the Right
Hon. Speaker had sacrificed an hour of the short time
afforded to him for repose afttr his unremitting and most
serious labours to the public-,(Cheers)—a sacrifice for
which-he was sure the House and the country would feel
duly grateful.—(ll,oud.eriee of Hear.)—There were se-
veral points of detail which might easily be arranged as
as to enable the business to commence at three o'clock.
For instance, it, would take time to familiarize Members
with the change in the hour, so that it might often be
difficult to lutve the requisite number (40) -of
.Members to
ennatiiute a: House. Perhaps, in the event of on two days
nut a tufficient number attending, it Might be competent
to the Speaker to have a call of, the House,—but all these
matters admitted of an easy remedy.
Colonel DAVIES wished to know whether it was meant
that after five o'clock no public petitions should be pre-
sented ?

Mr. HUME said that ..it was necessary to adopt some
measures to prevent the public business from falling into
the same state of arrear in which it had unfortunately got
during the last Session and the Session which preceded it.
To accomplish that object, he should propose that the
House, besides sitting an additional hour each day, should
she make Wednesday and Saturday days of business.—
, (Murmurs from all parts of tl:e House, and cries of "No,
n0.")......He admitted that it might be inconvenient ; but
where public duty and private convenience clashed, it was
ineumbint upon the representatives of the people to sacri-
fice their'convenience to the just claims of their country.
He was convinced that if the two days which he had
named were added to those already let Aside for public
business, they would, with the additional hours which the
•

Howe was going to 44 every day, be sufficient for the
transaction of the public business. There was, however,
atiother improvement which he begged leave to suggert to
the present. system. To allow gentlemen, to get through
the business of the House properly, one hour ought to he
alloteed them for ilioner.—(A in,tanee,
after meeting. at. three o'clock, they might proceed with
Joltiness till five o'cloek.• M that hour they might adjourn
till six anti then meet again. - Under the present system
or meeting at four, and going on without any adjournment,
he had often eitifered, and he:had no. doubt that other Mem.
bets had also buffered great inetnivenience.. When a great
question was likely to'conie on, lie lied often been glad to
make his dinner with a &son pears. [ye do not know
whether Mr. Hume meant pears or pairs two words,
though of different meaninge, being idrin sonanies : the
deelaration was, however, received' with much laughter.]
On such occesiobs he had often:seen a. House of two or
three bundled Members reduced in a few minutes to a
Melee of thirty or forty Members, Nay, whin even the
greatest eloquence was addressing them, be had •seen -the
benches deserted, anti queationi compulsorily postponed,
because there was no audience to. listeo to the discussion.
And why was that? Because dinner was ready.
thought that if a certain hour
were ,set aside far dinner, more Members would attend
regularly to their ditt6 than-they did at present' 'lndeed,
it was almost impossible, under the present system, for
a Member,' to attend to: hit ditties. in that .House, and
to his. duties as a Member. of. its . Committees.. 'He
often went.to.a. Committee at elevers.teclock in the morn.:
ing, and: remained there till after three &clack. --Ile 'then
mane down to the House with petitions :which he had to

present; and there he was often obliged to• remain till five,
six, and seven. seelocit. .Now was he to go away with his
petitions unrepresented, or was he to remain in the How
fasting? - He had remained fasting in the House for 16
or I'7 hours at a time 'fretpututly ; he bad done it not
merely 60; but 400 times.4S-(A laugh.).-.llow few were
there: base physical strength initild stand. it? For him-
self, he believed that he bail now got accustomed to' fut.,
ing.—(A should they not adopt the prac-
tice followed in other legislative assemblies-s-as, for in-
htenCe, in ,those of the United (states? There a bell
rang. fur rlinner at: five n'alciek, and us soon 'at it rang,
the threw was emptied immediately, even in the middle
of a fine venterice...-,(A. laugh•)io.,4 I think, ' coati-
need 111 r. Hume, addressing himself to the Speaker, "that
1040164 is you, wr ought; to adopt a similar system, aa
it is iwtil calculated to meet. your convenience. All those
who kin)* the conetant attendance which yon are obliged
,
Its
everylnorning, atid'the' perpetuatreference whirh
is made tg you on points of form from the different Cons-
mitteas tibieb are them sitting, know- that an hour and a
half is all the time that you.bave Out of ~the '2l, house to
take exercise in Now, the system which I venture to
reeoldisierel'intikt is more cumfOrtable to you, for it must
. .

. .
hr convenient to you, Sir, to retire, at hoe &cloak to a
econfortahle dinner, as no doubt your like to bare.--(A
laugh.)-.41-in Ant of ThtiliSinent could he passed to
prevent gentlemen from-feeling ineonvenienee when they
went with Mat their dinners it *mild be all well enough.
unfortunately, such an Ant of Perlin.
ment, tinder the present constitution of the human ;to-
math, would he nothing but a-dead letter. When heti-
nets, is tn he AIMS, it is i.iecesitry, that we itimild, nppiliach
it in that-calm and equablo-teroper which. no man can
poeseis wholntse gone walnut% his dinner. I - have head
It °briniest; over, 'and over again, : by strantgera. who have
visited this Metropolis,- and who have tomehow or other
else visited this Hone, as a moat extraordinary occur.
ranee, that, as soon as the dinner hour arrives, no in-
ducement can prevail -upon Members to stay in the House
to listen to the discussions which may then be going
on. We
,have often matters of the- deepest interest
before ur, wbiel".,induee Many to stay who are ge-
nerally absent- from- our discussion'', Hut even then
what . is the' genersl practiee? 'Why, Members stay
in the House till seven o'clock ; then, es the hour of din-
ner „is fast' advancing, they pair off till ten &clock. At
that hour-they-return again to their phicoi,. and give their
votes upon questions ore which they have not heard ft wcrd
the tishaW, As ibis is- it Xteiv kullanicut, I hope thal

the House will feel it incumbent to take some measure to
change the practice upon that point. If it does, I think
that we may compress into a narrower compass much of
our discussions, and do much more business than we have
done in any of the late Sessions. Dining is a matter of
pleasing gratification to many--(A laiigh)—to me, it is
a matter almost of indifference. But any one who saw
the manner of conducting business last Session must seer
the necessity- of making some alteration in our mode of
proceeding: common decency orders us to proceed upon a
new course, as the whole country is crying out that our
old system was 'a shame and a scandal to the House of
.Commons." The Hon. Member then proceeded to advise'
his Hon. Friend the Member for Waterford, not to press
his motion for an adjournment every night at nine
o'clock. He thought that a very useful compromise might
be made, and he for one was ready to make it, provided
the House would adopt his suggestions; and hie Hon
Friend would abandon the strictness of his motion. He
thought that they ought to meet at three o'clock, as hail
been suggested by the Right Hon. Gentleman—that they
should occupy themselves with private business till five ;
that they should adjourn till six; that at six they should
meet again, and proceed with public; business till twelve
o'clock, it being distinctly understood that no new matter
was to be taken after eleven o'clock. By such an arrange.
ment any man, whether he was in a public office or had
only private business to attend to, would be able on re-.
tiring at twelve at night, to rise in the morning in 'a fi
condition to meet the (lilies of his office. He said thstt
it was impossible, for any man, with less than an iron
strength of constitution, to discharge his duty as a man
of business properly, at an early hour of the next morn.'
ing, if he had been compelled to pass .the greater part of
his night in that House. Let Hon. Members just rem!.
feet how business was often transacted at iliac hour. He
heel seen, more than once, seventy orders of the day dis-
posed of after midnight ; and l►e had often felt himself ob-
liged to sit up to a very late hour, for the mere purpose of
stopping the discussion on matters, which, if lie had not
oppcoed, would have been passed without any inquiry into
their merits. He should sugg at as en amendment, upon
the present system, that whenever petit ions were presented,
one Minister of the Crown at least should be present to
listen to their contents. Ile udinitted that this might be
imposing a severe duty upon them ; but as the House was
going to retire at. an earlier hour than had been usual
in l►te Sessions, and as they would in consequence
be exposed to much less laboUr that they had hither-
to been compelled to undertake, lie thought that they
Might not to have any objection to take upon themselves
the new but not unnecessary duty.--(llear.)
Mr. 13110UPHAAI said that he rose to put a single
question to his Ron. Friend the Member for Middlesex,

protesting at the same time against his Hun. Friend's plan
for sitting six days in the Week, a labour which no strength
but that of his Hon. Friend, or of himself, or of a man
of iron nerves, could undergo, no matter whether he was
a mieister who had the public business to transact, or a
private gentleman who had nothing to attend to but his
own concerns.—( Hilar, bear. )_Protesting, then, against
his Hon. Friend's proposal fur sitting on Wednesdays and
Saturdays—Meer, hear,)—he would now proceed to put
one question to him regarding his dining scheme. Having
found easy means to empty the House of its Members at
the hour of five by the ringing of one hell, ha now wished
to know whether his Hon. Friend had got another bell to
ring at six o'clock, to bring back to their duties those gen-
demon whom lie had scared away by the ringing of his
first ?—(Hear, hear ; and a laugh,)
Mr. C. FERGUSSON also expressed his conviction
that the public Wiliness could not be conducted as it ought
to be, unless some change were made in the present sys-
tem. Every important business was now brought on after
midnight, and they it happened, that few subjects of para-
mount interest obtained the discuseion which they required.
Ile had been earlier and later in that House than any Mem-
ber present, always excepting his Hen. Friend the Member
for Middlesex.—(A loud tang universal cry of No, no,"
mixed with much laughter.) Ile repeated the assertion,
and contended, that he bad lost a deal of his time in the
House in listening to dull discussions on petitions, which
could lead to no useful practical resultovlien the discus.
lions ought rather to have been'reserved till the matter of
them came before the House in sonic shape in which it
might produce an useful practical result. Ile thought
that petitioners bad no right to expect that a full discus-
sion should take place on the claims of their petitions when
they were first presented • on the contrary, he thought
the House had a right to Again from entering into such
discussion. There was another grievance, of which he
thought every Member bad a right to complain. When
fifty or sixty orders stood simultaneously together, no
one, who wished to be present at the discussion of any
one of them, could be absent during any part of the time
that the House teas sitting,—and every body knew that
it sometimes sat from four o'clock in the afternoon to four
o'clock in the morning. If such a person were absent for
a single hour, it was very likely that on his return he
would find that the question on which he wished to ex-
press his sentiments had been disposed of in silence during
his absence; or, perhaps, at an earlier hour in the even-
ing. lie therefore thought that the orders of the day
ought,;ln future, never to be taken out of their turn, but
should coins on in regular rotation ; and that no preference
should be given to any of them, merely because they had
reference to the public business, or were brought forward
under the auspices of Minister..
Mr. O'CONNELL was afraid that the suggestions of
the Right Hon. Gentleman would be found insufficient to
arrest an evil, of whose existence every Member seemed to
be convinced. The beat mode of arresting its progress
appeared to him to be this—to fix three days in tbe week
for the transaction of the business of the House, and to
fix other ihree days for the transaction of the business of
Committees, the Committees not tieing allowed to sit on
the same days with the House.. At any rate he thought
that the Conoriittees ought to be empowered to sit upon
Wednesdays aul Saturdays, as tl)e House did not usually
transact businew on those days. With regard to the time
of sitting, he had discovered, by reference to the Journals,
that the practice of commencing their sittings at so late an
hour in the day,was of very modern growth. Up to ti'''
year 1793,.the chair was always taken at two or three
o'clock, at least so Said Hated!. It appeared from their
Journals, that in the year 1788, at eight o'clock in the
morning 100 Member' were present, and the Speaker was •
in the chair, In March, 1738, the debate was suppOsed
to have commenced late, because it did not commence till
eleven o'clock in the morning. The standing order of the
year 1695, said that no new matter should be undertaken
after one o'clock and that of the year 1098 said, that the
orders of the day abould be read at twelve o'clock, The
4th of January, 1641, the day whieh was so celebrated,
owing to the coining of Charles 1, to the bar—(Mr.
Brougham..." To the chair")—tO seize the five Members,
was the first day in which candles were lighted: in the
Rouse. Such being the case, he saw no reason why the
House should not recur to its ancient praCtice. His con-
stituents required an, adjournment at :an early hour, in
order that Members might be in .a proper condition to per-
form the business' of the public..—(Cries of " Ohl oh I"
and lenghter.)—Helad originally determinid to move the
question of adjournment at nine o'clock, because he knew
that an hour would be lest in diecutessonbefare it could be
carried. He had; hawever, no objection to postpone the
questiod :of adjournment till ten o'clock, so "that the House
was up at eleven. To its sitting later than eleven o'clock,
he could nut consent; but to that hour it might sit, so
that they were all in bed by twelve o'clock.—(Laughter.)
—llu should certainly feel it his duty to take measures to
prevent the house from sitting later than eleven o'clock.
Mr. MA I3EIU.Y made several observation's which did
tint reach the gallery, owing to the confortion prevalent in
the House. ; We understood him to express a hope that
genie of the Right lion. Ceentlemen Opposite would give •
an answer to the question which hail keen askedr.-whe-
tber the orders of the day would he taken in future in
rotation, and without preference to these brought forward
by the Government, .

IiOntIOUSE Said that the lengthened discussion
in which they were now engaged was a good practical
illustration of the mode of doing business,—(Hear.)—He
. thought that by the rlulation now 1311)plifieti those who
were inclined to. shirk their duty would shirk it still,
whilst' thorse who were not would not receive the slightest
benefit from it. The only rank of it, would be that it
would give the Speaker an opportunity of which he was
at present deprived, namely,. the opportunity of taking
refreshment. He thought that it would be for the benefit
of the public if the House should, either by the Act of
Parliament, or by a vote of its QW7I, take measures to
place in the Speaker's chair, when he was uaal,i® to attend
from indisposition, some other Member specialirappointed
Mr the duty, either the Chairman of the Committee of
Ways and Means, or seine other Member whom the House
might select. He did not know whether this cods be
done consistently with the forme of the Hume: but the
occasions on which the individual se appointed should
take the chair should only be those of, indispensable no.
cessity.—(Hesr.)
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER 'rose in
cousequone," of the matinee in which the Bun Member for
iAbing•tion had called upon the members of his Majesty's
lOovernment to reply to the questions Which he had, put
'respecting the practicability •of. taking the orders of the
pay. 4pon occasionsrill the order of thew rotation. Speek-
ny any 'regard tu lii, own perionnil eonveniruee,
iiitittle were to come to Otters deviiiou a, the ilea. Mem-
!but from i}je Metre conviOlOn; " ha must say that if the

her called for, it would preclude die Government from
carrying on the bnsiness of the country. For instance,
the business done in the Committee of Supply was often
of indispensable necessity ; but if that business could only
be taken as it came on in the order of the day, six weeks
might elapse before the Minister who had to p repose it
could bring it tinder the consideration of Parliament, and
then, when he bad once lost his turn, be world he unable
to regain it for,six weeks more, in consequence of the
manner in which the orders of the day would be arranged.
His feeling was, that on a question of this iMpottance they
ought to act cautiously in their experiments. As to the
idinner;plan of the Hon. Member for Middlesex, the objec-
tion to it had been so well put by the Hon. and Learned
Member for Yorkshire, that he felt it unnecessary to press
it further. In conclusion, he expressed' a hope that the
House would agree to make the experiment which had
been proposed by the Right Hon. Gentleman.
• Mri MABERLY said, that the Bight lion. Gentleman
had misunderstood the suggestion which he had thrown
out. He had proposed that two days in the week should
he deviated to the. Government business alone; such a re-
gulation, he was convinced, would ,be advantageotas, both
for the Government and the House, It would also obviate
the objection which the Right Hon.-Gentleman had just
started.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUEP said,
that he certainly had not understood the Hon. Member to
have made such a statement as that which lie had just
offered to the House. But even that statement did nut get
rid of all the objections which he had to the Hon. Mem-
ber's scheme.
Lord Ammar and Lord NuceNr said a few words, but
they were inaudible in the gallery.
Mr. BICE said that regulations, he was convinced,
would not remedy the evils complained of, unless Hon.
Member* would use their own discretion in addressing the
House.—(Hear, hear.) He was afraid, ton, that the
public would not be satisfied unless Wednesday were added
to the days of public business. (Crier of " No, no.")
Mr. D. W. HARVEY said, that in the whole-of this
discussion it appested to be taken for granted that the
petitions presented were indispensable, and that the number
of them could not be diminished. Now, this was a very
great. mistake. It was in the power of the House to lessen
the number of petitions by taking away the causes of those
petitions.—t-(llear, and laughter.) If the House would
consent teParliamentarY reform, -to the reduction of taxa-
tion; and to the abolition of the slave trade, the only ques-
tion remaining-would be, how they should occupy .their
time.—(Hear, and laughter.)
Mr. N. CALVERT said it was evident that a discus-
Sion like the present could lead to no practical result, end
be begged to suggest that a Select CoMmittee should be
appointed to consider the mode of conducting the business
of the House.
Mr. Alderman WAITHMAN complained, that though
he had 13,000 or I LOOO'constittiento, he could never get
an opportunity of speaking, except upon the presentation
of petitions.—(llear and a laugh. )—He was, he was
ashamed to say, in a scut of dose when his lion. Friend
(Mr. Home) began his speech ; but when his Hon. Friend
talked'about dining, he awoke op directly; at the sound
of the word " dining," as, being an. Alderman, it was na-
tural he should,,--(Hear, and a laugh.) Hie Hon. Friend
complained that others had prevented him from taking his
dinner; hut let bin, tell his Ilon. Friend, that he (Mr.
Howie) had; often, by his long speeches, prevented him
' (Mr. Alderman Weidman) from dining.--(Laughter.)
That his lion. Friend did a very great deal of good in the
House, he should be the last person to deny ; but he was
quite sure that his Hen. Friend took up uo very small
portion of the time of the House in doing it.—(Hear, and
laughter.)—He wished his Hon. Friend would come
among his (Mr., Alderman Weidman's) brethren in ..the
City, and dine fur a few weeks with them. That would
perhaps, give his Hon. Friend a salutary fit of the gout
and lay bhn op for, a • week or. two, and then they would
see whether his observation were not correct, and whether
in the absence of his Hon. Friend, the public business
could not be got through much more speedily,--lie would
not say better; the fact was, that while those members
who had the faculty of speaking half a dozen times in the
course of a night persisted in 'exercising that faculty, no
regulations would,do any good.
Sir ROBERT PEEL said that all that bad taken place
during this discussion contlimed him in the opinion he had
expressed at the outset,- namely, that the (ovation was one
of extreme difficulty. All that could be hoped for was,
that Min. Meinhers Would use their individual discretion.
Auy gentleman might, if Ire-pleased, detain the House fur
four or five hours, and unlessgendemen would curtail their
speeches, or the House put down the practice of enlarging
unnecessarily upon fertile topics of argument and oratory,
be did not see what good end any regulatiim could answer.
(Hear, hear.)—They had got now into the habit of print-
ing almost every petition, and the reason assigned for, this
course was, the prevention of lengthy discussions upon
petitions ; yet, since this plan had been adopted, be was
Pure that debates upon petitions had , been considerably
lengthened. All that could be done by way of regulation
on the subject was, as it appeared to him, to give 'up two
hours to private business,—the public business being
brought on always et five o'cleck. At the same time he
thought it should be understood, that any gentleman who
thought proper might present a petition at any other period
of the evening-, if there should be no public business befbre
die House. Yet, after all, almost every thing must depend
upon the individual discretion of Hon. Members, who
could do touch more than any regulation could effect to-
wards the attainment •of the desired end, if they would
address themselves fairly and seriously to the sultiect under
debate, laying aside all extraneous matter, and not indulg-
ing in surplusage, which never carried conviction with it,
anal which often tended rather to obscure than. to throw
light upon the subject before the Houte.—(Clicers.)L—
Some of the suggestions" that had been thrown out were,
he thought, obviously impracticable. If, for instance,
they would agree to adjourn the House for an hour,
at five o'clock, he order that Members Wright take
their dinner, such . a regtilation would, he was sure,
make no alteration • in the dinner-hours of the,
majority of the House. They tvlio were accustomed te
dine at seven o'clock, would still dine at that hour, and
not between five and. six. Thin, againots t the proposal
of the Hon. Member for. Waterford (Mr. O'Connell) of
setting sside three-days for private business, lie thought
they would rather lose than gain by that arrangement. It
wasimpoisible to get through the public business in three
&aye; and the evenings of the three days devoted to private
businese would -be spent in some other way, anal nut in
that anticipated by the Hun. -Member: Indeed, be did
not see how 'gentlemen who had been attending commit-
tees all day could be expected to devote their evenings to
the 031118 employment. What he proposed, therefore, was,
that the House for the future should meet at three o'clock ;
that r the time from three to five should be devoted to private
business ; and that the public business should always com-
mence at five o'clock.—(Hear, hear.)—lf, however, this
did not•theet the wishes of the House, then he thought the
only course to he taken was to appoint a select Committee
on the subject, as his lion. Friend (Mr. N. Calvert) op..
Oosite had recommended.

WOOL) begged to know whether there was any
onderittatuling with regard to the hour of adjournment.
If there was, it ought to be made a Sanding order.—
Hear," from Mr. O'Connell.).....He begged also to know
whether Wednesday was to he added to the days of public
litisiuess—(Cries of 6, No," 66 no,;") end whether, during
,the time set apart for receiving petitions, one of the Mi-
nistere of the Crown woabt ha always preterit?
• • Sir 11' PEEL thought it impassible to ix any hour for
the edjoutrunent of the House.. A regulation of that Chi
:racter would, he'Vvas convinced, lie extremely miechievo.ue,
They must not,make it peremptory to break off in the
midst of a diseoesion, nu matter, how important and how
pressing that discuesion might Hear, fiver.) It
;would be better to leave it to the /loose to determine, on
„melon made at the time, whether thil, should adjourn or
'Continua to.slt. As to adding Wednesday to the day of
public business, his only objettien to that was, that he
h it beyond the strength of Honourable Members
'tea
teusPitfer five days in succesaion.--( Hear, hear.) If it
should be Insisted on that Wednesday should be a day of
public' busbies., lie was . quite sure that on Friday Hon.
Members would find themselves too much jaded.—.too much
'exhausted, to apply themselves to the public busing,* in
such a manner as the transaction of such business re.
—(Hear, hear.) 'He could not, its be thought the
would see, promise to he present every day during
the presentation of petitions.. The duties of his office
:would not allow him to make any such promise. This,
however, he would promise, namely, that he would do ail
le could, consititeritly with his duty to the country, to be
present every day.—(Cheera.)
Mr.. HUME said that the Right Hon. Gentleman was
not the only Minister of the Crown. All they required
Was, that some Minister of the Crown should he present
-during the presentation of petitions.
Mr. C. W. WYNNE thought the Hon. Member for
midinesex (Mr. Hume) took a very extraordinary view of
this iohjeot ; for it a petition 'related to a matter con-
nected with the Home Department, the pretence of the
Colonial Seeretary or the Chancellor of the Exchequer
would not be much more desirable than that of any Other
)11ettiber.--(Hear; and laughten) The way, however,
pf obviating the inconvenience which the Hon Member
Uppeared anxious to guerd,againit woo, as it Appeared
)1101, obvious enough. Who! 'any Roo. Menthes' had a
iietitiOU to present which be 'thought required' 'di. attest

tient of Government, let him make a communication to
the Minister to whose department the subject-matter of the
petition belonged.. This would insure the attendance of
that Minister.—(Hear,' hear.)
Here the conversation dropped, and the usual sessional
orders were tweed to without discussion.
• -REPORT OF .7111:: ADDRESS.
On the question being put that " the Report of the Ad-
dress'to his Majesty be brought up,"
Mr. MABERLY said, that be rose to enter his protest
against the very extraordinary speech they had heard from
the throne. He called it extraordinaey, because he thought
nothing could be more extraordinary than for the ministers
to put into the mouth of his Majesty a speech which
omitted all mention of reform, and of reduction of taxa-
tion, the two; topics which agitated the, whole empire,
from one end of it to the other. He would show the
Right Hon. Gentleman opposite that he was not insen-
sible to the propriety of his supestion respecting speech.
making in that House. lie would make, a short speech,
and not dwell uselessly upon any but important topics
He must, however, be allowed to say one word upon a
topic which was not connected with the matters which he
had risen for the litapose of addressing himself to. He
alluded to the questiOn of repealing the Union. It ap-
peared to him that to agitate such a question could lead to
no good, but that, on the contrary, it was calculated to
open afresh those wounds which late measures he hoped
would perfectly heal. lie would address himself to the
two topics lie haul mentioned. First, his Majesty in his
speech, said nothing about reduction of taxation. The
word economy was tiled in the, speech as usual; but so it
was last year, and yet they had no reduction in conse-
quence. He meant, no reduction in consequence of any
thing in thir speech; fur he was convinced that the re-
ductions which were effected had not been contemplated
by the Ministers, but were forced upon them by the voice
of the Muse. This was all owing to the labours of the
Finance Committee having been stopped. Then, as
to ReforM, how had the Ministers treated the coun-
try He dirl ,not know whether it would be con-
sidered irregular fur him to allude to what had taken
place elsewhere, but they must all be aware, that in
another place, a Minister of the Crown had distinctly said
that there should be no reform.—(Hear, hear.) Nay,
this Minister had gone farther, and described the present
system as an, excellent one,—as a system which worked
extremely well.—(Hear, hear.) That it did work well
he was ready to admit. It worked well fur Governors,
but it worked very ill for the governed. For instance.
how was he repreiented? He resided in Surrey ; and that
county was said to send 14 Members to Parliament. Now
by whom were these Members sent? The two for the
county, two for Guildford, and two for Southwark, were
sent by the people; the two Members fur Haslensere were
the nominees of a certain Noble Lord ; the two Members
for Getters were the nominees of another Noble Lord; the
two Members for Ryegate were the nominees- of two
Noble Lords ; and the Members, for Bletchingley were the
nominees of a large coal-owner.—(Hear, and laughter.)
Now was this condition of representation such as the people
ought to endure? They had last night passed a resolution
that Peers should not interfere in the election of Members
of that House; but was not such a uesolutiun a mere farce
when compared with facts like those he had stated ? Scot-
land was an instance of the want of reform. But the
Prime Minister had told them that reform was not facet-

miry, and that there shall be,no reform. He (Mr.
Mi-
berly) would ask, hew could his Majesty expect a tranquil
reign under such circumstances ?—(Hear, hear.) His
Majesty was made to express his confidence that be should
transmit the Constitution unimpaired to posterity, but
ho (Mr. Maberly) hoped that it was not in the way meant
by his Prime Minister, but that his Majesty should transmit
a reformed Constitution to posterity. In this Speech, with
which the public had been an disappointed, there was hardly
a man in the country who did not expect the mention of the
introduction of some moderate reform. He would ask
those Members in that House who had constituent's, whe-
ther they would not commit a gross dereliction of their
duty to their constituents if they did not at once raise their
voices against those nominees of Peers wht were sent into
that House to overpower the people. If his Majesty
would' not reduce the taxes and reform the Parliament, he
wits likely in twelve months to be the most unpopular mo-
' nerds that ever sat upon the British Tbrone.—(Hear,
hear. )—lss saying so, he was convinced that he only gave
expression to the feelings of the people of the whole em-
pire. He was firmly impressed wiih the conviction that
the tranquillity of the country would nut continue undis-
turbedunkss we had a reform in Parliament and a reduc-
tion of taxation. Those who opposed :reform might AO-
OM the advocates of it pf being desirous of introducing
revolutionary principles and doctrines, but the time might
shortly arrive when, the advocates of reform could turn
round upon them and say--,, You who are against grant-
ing those rights and privileges, which not the lower or-
ders only but all the middle classes of society in this coun-
try demand, you may cry out against the reformers as re-
volutionary, but it is.you that are bringing in a revolution
by refusing to reform the Parliament." From Ms know-
ledge of public opinion, he wouhl say, that they should
have to repent grievously if they allowed the present Ses-
sion tole over without granting that which she people
claimed. He would put it to those Members who really
had-constituenti, whether they would allow the nominees
of Peers and coal-owners to overpower them in that
House.—(lrear, hear.)
An Hon. Mem ern, whose name we could not le iris, con-
tended that such a subject as reforni had never been intro-
duced into a Speech from the Throne. For his own part,
he declared that he had never yet seen any plan of reform
to which he would give his assent.

Mr. TENNYSOIN said, that though he was the repre-
sentative of a borough, he should always vote as ha had
hitherto done, for-the people; and he should never give
his support, to that degraded system 'open which the public
opinion ref England had been often and so recently pro-
nounced. Though it was not unutual to omit the mention
of reforinin the Speech from the Throne, his Illajeity's
Ministers appeared blind to their own destruction in having
done so on this occasion. His Grace of Wellington would
soon see that it did not' depend, upon his Nigh behest to
prevent the success of reform.—(Cheers.)—Public opinion
would soon,prevail over the decision of Parliament, and
while he (Me. Tennyson) trusted. that the Government
would not precipitate the people into extreme measures, he
coufidently hoped that the people had too much good sense
to piecipttate themselves into anything like violence:—
(Henri hear.).-His! Majesty', determination with regard
to the Civil List, as annponced in the speech, was deserving
of the highest praise, and would no doubt meet with the
approbation of every man in the country. The Hon.
Member proceeded to' allude,. in eulogistic terms, to the
conduct of the Marquis Camden, who had given up the
profits of his sinecure to the coffers of the public treasury.
He trusted! that such a noble example would be followed
by. ether great ainecurista. There was no service, he con-
coved, which more demanded a favourable notice front the
Sovereign of this country.s..-(Heer.)—After expressing
'his approbation of the paseage in the Speech relating to
France, the.llop. Gentleman went on to say, that upon
the other hand he disapproved as much of the passage re•
garding the' Belgians.' He maintained that the public
feeling of this country were embarked with the oppressed
',llelgians.—(llear, bear.)-•..Nothing, in his opinion, was
.113 Ors calculsted to excite the indignation of the whole pee.
plc of this country, than. such conduct on the part of hie
Majesty's Ministers, who had abused the confidence which
their Sovereign hkl placed in them, by putting into his
mouth language en repugnant to his feelings.—,(Hear.):When they eliould come to the paragraph in the Adana,
relating to the Belgians; be (Mr. Tennyson) should feel it
his duty to move an amendment for the omission of that
paragraph, and the insertion of soothel.. The language
`to which be referred was' most unfit to be employed by
a Sovereign who had just eucceeded to the Throne, and
be (Mr. Tennyeon) would certainly move an amendment
upon the paragraph in question in the Address.
Mr. T. WOOD rime to address them, not as the Arm.
her fora borough, but as the representative of a free and
unbetight population, and ha would tell them how that
populatiots would receive his Majesty's Speech. They
would receive it (to barrow the phraseology of the Speech
itself) " with grief and , intligoatiOn."—( Hear.) The
hopes of, his Majesty's Ministers appeared to rest upon the._
alarm tlqliad gone abroad, and it seemed that within the
'last few days certain great Peers ka4 given in their adhe-
sion to the Government, because they were afraid, as in
1792, that the revolutionary spirit would extend hero from
France, and they wished to divert it by engaging us in a
war. But be (Mr. Wood) hoped that Parliament would
resist to the utmost of its power the grant of any subsidy
or money, by which troops might be sent abroad, or as.
distance afforded to interfere between the Dutch and the
Belgians, or the Belgians and any other nationo—( Hear. )
lie was not opposed to the recognition of Don Miguel,
hut he prayed thiPorteguese refugees not to trust to his
_ -

lumesty, not to rely upoi the word-of him who had vio.
ated the most solemn oaths,' and lest they might rely
with too great confidence upon the assurances of the Bri-
tish Government, be thought it right to remind them of
the cam of the murdered Ney at Paris. In the Speech
from the Throne his Majesty was made to say that "be
could not view without grief and indignation the efforts
Whiell were industriously made to excite amongst his
people a spirit of discontent and disaffection." To whore
itorts-were &content and disaffection, if they prevailed,
ustly attributable? He would point to Statufintl, to 11..
baster, and to Newark, and t 4 thole Noble Iltere who in

defiance of the Conitittition laitidegitilitli-thetn- NAM
interfering in the election of the Bletitherii of that Howe
These were the men.who bad excited discontent and
affection.--(Hear, hey.) The subject of reform had
omitted in the Speech--and that perhaps would nett
been considered very remarkable, as it heti sem b'
mentioned in.a speech from the throne; but the Bo
Speech was generally followed by the Vennosois if I
Miuisters, and the dictatorof the Crown bad said that
form was not wanted,, end that reform they should
have. Now, in the name and on the behalf of
people of England; he (Mr. Wood) would say that 11
did want reform, and that they should bare reform.
(Cheers.) He considered the repeal of the Vs
a foolish and impracticable scheme, but the pea
of Ireland should not be prevented from discus
that or any other public question in the nun'
in which they had been prevented. The ,'cart s
sent their nominees to that House might well
alarmed by the late revolution in France, for the t
charge in the articles of impeachment that had been der
up against the wretched Exellinisters there, was for int
fering in the elections, and depriving the people of Ii
just rights and privileges. .Let net those Noble Peers
the flattering unction to their wide, that the French Che
her was the only plare where such an impeachment woo
be referred. Itis Alajesty talked of transmitting the Co
atitution unimpaired to esterity. Now the truth sr
that. the Constitution wasp just the government which
adirtinistration thought proper to recommend to the Sit
reign. The impeachment of the seven Bishops was
hinding down of the Coustittition unimpaired tspostetit
The introduction of the Dutch °nerds by 'Wilhite was f
the purpose of handing the Constitution down uniinpair
to posterity. The passing of the Septennial Aet wars
nounced at the time to have a similar, abject tin
view ;
in the reign of George 111. we attempteCtO Anwri
for a similar purpose. All these thing' ff
were done
sooth in order to transmit the Constitution unimpaired
posterity, Indeed, so late as the reign of George IV., 1
were told that the Constitution mainly c
wonsisted
ten ri S
bay
o
ing the Dissenters out of office. Away, colts tha
le"
fabric of a vision," and 'the Constitution Wad Still t
better from the change. The following year, when rel
was about being extended to the Catholics, similar alas
were excited, but the Catholic Bill was psll.lll, and "we'l
year and a half after the passing .of it, Ids Majeto:7
!sistere put such wards as these into the nimithett
Mlesty—that his object Was to transmit the 01;10406
unimpaired to posterity; He (3lr. Wood).was therde
convinced, that if reform were once carried, ko4ll. .6f
impaired to posterity.—(ll.•ar)---11"
'Meetly lucceei }w entertained no doubt, it wits h,_l 4bl
bade that in the next speech from the throne lin o.r
ur
i'outd speak as usual of transmitting the
this speech from the throne would be received With joN
nation throughout the cuntry. -
Mr. LEADER said that .whers be hard etaternoe,
made as to the mode in which his ffiejestS'eSPetd.'w:l,,
be received in England-ik was rittlisioo 21;i: 'ti
manner his (Mr Le:ulcers) cor.etitacuts would !if;
Ireland. Until the unfortunate and unjust !",":: pro:
taxation which was list Session directed 411°`
in the repeal of the Union .seal meet' u'"'D ke
the people of that country. The name of the' e
Wellington was always mentioned by thou with respecv
and the anxious .deaire of all was to promote Pe nee
t'i'bial
establish tranquillity. Until that fatal measorstd in
was first introduced, the people of Ireland did noit
about a repeal of the Union. It w 0,11.1 he for. 701::
joie; • Government to take the state of Ireht.ll,_,,,
mediate consideration, and to devise coins,, effeettlatis,usto
peditious measures of relief, in order to prevent t
serious consequences to the empire. • ',made
Mr. RUTH YIN hoped that the Government a
continue in the course which had already heat Irelaindwtit
situation in the scale of the Powers of Europe, !11l ti
respect to her proper rank in • Ilse British einintewo;
tvne
could say that in the county became from, `in
Certain if •
spirit of disturbance, but • the people ars' . weir
none sod eentiinects flirty, without any iptris
_to!
Outdd, lead to animosity or tumult. The late well {nose
had cauied disturbances, se might have been Wel
labp
!
and it was in vain to think of
proclamation', for if the aubstetstisl "1"91 Tai: rllll
were not removed, agitation would not "me' die, el
of restoring tranquillity to Ireland would bel, !,)17,f th
PloYmeot to the poor ; but whilst the poeu.a:"
it were vain. Let Ireland but receive patter) frit, 10,."`14
ount-ey was idle and destitute, ail
laud and there would be nntletlier of dislot_ll4,l:l of II
present the greatest ;mischief-4M the 'l'm". the Poi
whole of the inhabitarate of lard iuto ciliate;
niCdiste bin
Were.tlivided front the right wttay as jet, to ed.
to connect them, and a ,tote of snide
country could be tranquil ww-
exist•A. lee e raw obaersations WI
Lord MORPETII would make bi Eon. fiend
out transgressing the rule which the totibiroome,
hopes of
.tr
man oppossite, the SecrettieY 01....„143 ouos,e. owes'
partment, had so judiciously 111" wa It wog soft 101
shortening the Ilboure of the flottse• 'ti". old eperdil
ever, but exotelta his hope that the 7.ariletowr
cease for giving attention to leeland,l“).
relief, arid in the mean time he' 1301 jhticirir:liailrilten'
would pursue in common those intsstrtes - lost
to the combined welfare of both countries. pito, be
in the Speech from the Throne telatinf t°
to l'ineeeiro
whiEhbi* Hun, Friend behind him wiebed,
For hie P,rtt
cot saltily the sore place in the speech,' Fa, l' scat
felt convinced that if there were one obo.'
body of the people recognised Wet thin e_ui)shod
there were one line of policy which they 40seieter
adopted more than any other, it was that wr
no, oat
(crevice iu the internal concern, of 8e1i1i0ni..!,..04 eetteb,'
eountty.—(Hear, hear,' from the .opeoll,..'d oprigo
and " bear" front Sir Robert Peel.)---Ile aio
was only stopped by a few moments from imerehio nee
don, in which lie had been anticipated renting tb
Friend 'the Member for Westminster, fee pigio,II
interference of this country in the affairs of ne the JO"
only wished that blinisters would interfere Woof a
of that House, instead of interfering in the in of 0046
of other countries, He could not but
that within that House,' and more Oil"' 'deeply
sr
doors, the minds of all men were
.reent
pressed with the conviction that the I"
times of alarm, and pregnant with danger, ti
the whole surface of the world was 'a
nail fr!
state. in how many quarters were the:ire:la
epees scenes of great agitation. It °alai" 'test iftlrriar
deny, and in some titles vain to regret,10. oree
political changers were in progreis,' th0ugh...41,0 foy tt
stances sufficient provocation had not been:ol. 002
countr might have cause to trent'''.
alterations of Creverninent that Were Pra4ucielii: etiaa-
could Only express hie satisfaction, that
tiori poi!
'here "1" no just ground of alarm of ecgl3/1//u tern 'll,l
tranSitet"
score of alterations in the Governments #A-.4,
the hiel
he painful, and re-actions might mar for 1 that in tb
Inge which they producer!, and yet Ile.blahl',74i esteter.
m
country amendments would be effscted cos-'
we resolved to enforce pribeiples of ceo 1 n°ll fficarlooe
to such a reform of Parliament as should b. aded,
to grant all that could with justice be dtal,„ce he°
;then take our stand against unsafe concessi"P!! osee
that we should have th of 11°4° nd 'lll
e great mass" „ado, ft,
sound
.prioriple in the country upon au' se all 1111nv
this would be the moot effeetual way, to.t!re
with which' we might he nienactri..e;•('',`6'4liieb
was equally certain that'an- administretton e
mined upon a contrary course, pronwineed
peeititing sentence airtime itself fist it os' I 141
utter.—(Hear, hear.)
c •ie
Mr. WAYLAND' was of Opinion that, its
degree of distress existed in the oetrotry,'*ollt"
was attributable--to a disproportion- berret:r., ;Id&
triouspopuletion and the.productive <VIP°. a St.trigili
try. We had an increasing polittlatient IT" sii/e
or decreasing amount of productsve
endeavour to discover the 1,04 means tu
With ti to
people and giving an impulee to capital. . ,004111
it Was necessary to afford protection to ti
es
of Capital. ,Ide did not mean to isay..tha "',. oeri
general, but hue was convinced that it WAS roue'. '
. • es to
ter'sleelY diffused than some pectins dish' coo
Mr. ROBINSON acid they had met till"`.:Xv.s4
stances of no ordinary difficulty, which author.74;lo,,is
Min who bad conaftuenea to represents to 16°40 00'
liner, however humble, by offering advice to otoote
and the Goeernment as to the eitnation of al, 001
lie could not but express hie .appreheneiona ftS ',l",:eport
taus meaning of that expression in the Adriret. lie
fu be omitted by the Hon. ffierriber neor Jhooti
heves' that Governmeut the
no psvont totentton vi.e 01
interference in the case of the Netherlands, butt o 0
possible to say what would be the roods if we 000
selves up with the- Holy Alliance in thie rnif et
the Right Hon. Gentleman opposite el.* it) ,_,„„„,00
assurance that if we engaged in the too-007_4,0th
practice of interfering in continental affairs (tif;;;;1 oy
had been so frequently the prolitio sourts
distress)—could th tieght Ilk. Gentleman
.01, seut e
Hurled to t° oetit
after entering armmediation 4 alo orgo .
we might not be compelled to follow II? L 7, he Ali 081
Stith a hostile armament?---(Hear.) thin
Reel, that his constituents, and the peolli?,..3fitisstyrii
groweally, were not prepsreal to e„pport
rernitteat in at .contitrental crusarle.-4 "74.41,00 Sts'
not enough to occupy our attention 0 by

• s •
:fiteentmental polities the constant the
tne of disenssion ?
• He protested against that pert of the Address which retrain
to the •Netherlanda. With reference to another part which
related to our home policy, every one concurred in the ne-
cessity of repressing disturbance and calling back the Ms-
, guided to obey the laws, but he was sorry that his Majesty
had not been advised to follow up the sentiments of the
Speech with some expression of sympathy for the distresses
of the people.—(Hear.) Thero might and ought to have
been a recommendation to take into consideration the state
of the labouring and agricultural population, with a view
to affording them relief. A great portion of the evils of
the country was created by misdirected legislation. To
excessive taxation and the operation of the Cern Lawa,
which, however agreeable to the landed interest, were in-
' compatible with the prosperity of the labouring classes,
. much of the distress was attributable. We should direct
our attention to endeavour to provide employment to the
industrious classes, and afford them meana of existences in
that way, and by a reduction of taxation affecting the no-
' cessaries of life, • and by nn alteration in the Corn Laws.
Mr. Alderman WAITIIMAN nbserved that it was
painful to him to be compelled to make observations which
mialit seem to imply disapprobation. of the Speech froni
the Throne, for nu one had entered those walls with a
stronger desire to give. hi 4 support to Government in all
matters affecting the public interest, with respect to which
.Ministers should appear to adopt the right courses. Itwass
matter of regret with him, that, in the present situation of
the country, his Majesty had omitted all notice of the dies;
tress which prevailed but too generally among his subjects.
Ile entered his protest against that part of the Speech
which indicated a disposition to interfere in the affairs of
• the Netherlands. Such interferenee was at variance with
s the feelings of the public at large.--( Hear.) Ile knew,
from communications which he had that day bad with dif-
ferent individuals in the city, that the idea of interference
had caused a great degree of irritation.—(Hear.) The
lion. Member proceeded to complain of the conduct pur-
sued by Government with respect to 'Reform ; if Ministers
Were hostile ton Reform of Parliament, they ought at least
to have taken the opinion of the new House of Commons
;an the subject before declaring their resolution, and they
should have shown themselves willing to yield to the press-
anre of circumstances ilhoetile to their- opinious ; but in-
dividuale semetimes profited by experience, governments
never. lie might have' passed over the omission of all
reference to• Reform in the King'w Speech, the rather as
there would have been future opportunities for supplying
, it, but that he had learned from another quarter, with the
. deepen regret, that an expression had been uttered on the
•-part of the Government, to the effect that Ministers neis
they intended themselves to agitate; one support if intros
by others, the question of Parliamentary Reform—.
"ear, hear.) The Alderman proceeded to instance same of the defects at present existing in the representation,
And referred to the fthe t teats for which
sled
he La"
Garton,
wo
w are It was quite. notorious were regularly sold
when vacancies occurred, It was against the system which
admitted of the existence of rotten boroughs that he
protested--he did not censure individuals for dealing in
seats 50 long as that system was continued. If he were
the owner of Garton, probably be might sell the represen-
tation ax others, did, and no doubt he should he thought a
great fool if he did nut.__( Laughter.) It would be better
far Ministers to concede Reform in time,. and with a good
grace, for the day Would come when it could no longer be
r"i'led• 1 say (added the 'Hon. Aldermen) that day will
tome upon you like a thief in the night....-(Great laughter.)
Ile trusted that Ministers might be ;tutored to reconsider
and retract their opinions on the subject of Parliamentary
'Reform. Hs attributed the distress which existed to want
unployment and contraction of capital. Strange as it
tnay seem, there existed at the same moment a great deal
'ofever-Production, anti while Such causes were at work, it
wal in vain to expect any permanent relief from a dimi-
,nution or remission of taxes.
Mr, C. FEAGUSSON could not concur in the amend-
ment, although he expressed his disapprobation of that
.Part of the Speech and Address which felated to the affairs
e! the Netherlands. He would not give any opinion as to
the merits of the quarrel between the King and the people
la that countrys-he would not give any opinion on the
subject of the affairs of France, hnt'at the same time he
illaught if we considered the situation of matters as they
otal at present,. that the words of the Royal Speech were
eat leulated to do infinite mischief, instead of restoring
tanql4iiiitY in the Netherlands, and effecting the union of
tile two countries. His Majesty was' made to talk of three-
Ode; of the population of the entire country as revolted
subjects. We talked of these men as revolted subjects,
and yet these trete the men wits had raised armies, taken
towns, and attacked citadels. The persons at the head of
it P'"i'inal government were those with whom we
,thould have to treat if we were really in earnest in our
!int to tranquillise the Netherlands. If ever any treaty
twiieto Such
to be made, these men must be parties to the nego-
.on. .stien worsts, then, as those used in the Speech
Wcre• to say the least of them, unnecessary, when it was
1m easy to adopt another mode of expression. It would
'nye been easy to state that his Majesty regretted that the
attempts of the King of Holland to bring about a reecerioilia-
lien with the people of the Netherlands had failed. On the,
'subject ef the revolution in France, he believed there was,
.fit one opinion, hut upon that of the Netherlands he knew
that a eolodderable difference of opinion slid exist. How-
lett, we should take the authorities in the Netherlands as
ers found them, and we should not use any language in
tlPeehing of them which would tend to excite, irritation,
.4 throw, ohstaele in . the way of, that amicable negotie-
tion'which it wise, hi presumed, desired to set on font ;
14" he could not hring himself to believe that the Go-
ernment 4 this' Count intended an be took
th,
curliest opportunityry of stating, buttau aer? repidest•otattwo
nr tunetituents, lie would never consent to the shedding of
nor, drop of English blood, or the expending of theamallest
rtiouis,itef
.the realm, for the purpose of forcing the'King of
I.lenti on the people of the Netherlends.—(Hear.)—
dad not mean to say that the words of the speech ne-
Zthsarily conveyed FM intention of war on the part of this
4;11,7" but that they referred rather to mediation ; but
s was not the usual cuitoin of mediators to begin by
sreat •
then
ening and calling namec—(Cheers.)—lle must
:I:fore think that' the use of the. Words "revolted sub.
to adopt the phrase lately used in another
-.17) 'writ‘., inopportune.":-(;Tome Members 80111,
~,!IntOvvartl.")s---No ; the word to which he 'referred was
I"PPorturte '" fur he would ask with what face could
Ise sts. ?
d to mediate or negotiate with parties whom
Learn'at hrintled 'am " revolted sulsjecti 2" The Hon. and
uC ed Gentleman then went on to 'show, that the spirit
lust e treaties to which we had become party' was to
.1464,4.. tee the
,united kingdom of Holland and the Nether-
Tre,m,foreign aggreesion, but the! any armed inter-
t cee "eiWten the subjects of these two countriee Wes
eh° 'n'eMidateti; 'anti that we were not called upon by
lave treatise to take any part' in the contest'between the
§,,og Of Holland and his Tiedgie- subjects. The chief thing
t,,slaa guaranteed was the integrity of the two countries
tai:,r:tlunsier one Government; hat let it be considered that
tio.,te latesty had himeelfstubmitted the question of the' le-
is : e aeperistion of three two portions of the kingdom
447
eStatea-General, and flint their High Mightinesses
pct, hi
.of. the' separation; so that, in
...At:Z. the very thing which were called on to guarantee
on of the two kingdoms-.'shad been broken by the
slay the King and the StateesGeneral. There was
toi, _le other :point in the Speech front the Throne to
' ehhint would advert, that was the'point 'relating testlie
'eons, etween 'England end' Ireland. He was toast stre-
h Y ()Molted to th r • ofas • s
e felt 8" MO tatOri that Union, because
"t:ineed, that if carried into effect, it would. be
'l.4e rilia of
tood Ireland. He had not yet heard of any one ttia
.i!tinient ill favour ;of such separation. If. it Worn
nipit 7.otulthe is
terestnof Ireland were not attended to in.
troy
0! he must deny it. He denied that there was
4,0;,`" attrition to those interests, or any want Or
thisgmffin un the part of English Members to do every,
4.lr.itthivat. could be done fOr Ireimul. If more was nOt
01140 the means did not exists.and because
(41afitiiiient assistence was not given to that object from Ire-
itisi Len/414 The given
had been cited WO Iron.
Lena
,he .-74"ernher for Viraterford in support of his view'
igrirrhonswere those of the Stibsletting Act, and the
etottement of the forty-Sbilling freeholders. These
ititss been Productive of much individual suffering,
itist. dY 010 unfeeling conduct of many Of the
.tanolortis. • Alt the Sub-letting Act was, he might
s.o4l,:'letii,tv,tekof thsiJrini Members themselves, and it was
eldeh• ii'.,"49l's,nPort others the lame of a wafture
au not worked
SMath ,ht so well na was expected. The
0t . - 'had, his must say, taken a warm 111.-
4, ,1111 Irish matters, arid for his 'own part he would "Y
harl.been Onei of the first, end not an Irish allele
!iit° aPP4an the equelis of h duties t "tarn
tw._ . IL 100 t
st. mottles, by raising those of Ireland to the
irbilincinps
heel cif i:arnr.,tlx. in Atts4nti, (Inc word as to another
;44 s t-j,,!_ /ion. 4110 Ititrti, Member for 'Crated:9rd.
to contnleined of the facility given to
ebetly, estuld° teCt his tenant, for non-payment of rent,
„At
,e doubt that the lentilord bad the clearest
th. "73 et Ilia tenant his rent were not Paid; and.
,I)":Zlt'ettaes of that precise were reduced, it must Isti
the
who 'tiltiUustely would to pay ersd n.: 4n4 Learned Geutleman, who ,de-
'el of this ex" a regal reformers complained of the renness
:Dn. pertitse of an ejectment froni t 71. ,to 22., srigi7rciei h. ng husk the blessing of` inheavy empentists
147litestka sa`,.!!'lnetle' bringing ejeetrneota for stens'
ft#13‘...01.14: h#lodopaftigs won the

•
Hon. and I..!eaynecl Gentlen-lilt's notion of legal reform,. if
this were his 'cheap law, he certainly could not concur
with him in his opinion of either.—(Hear.)—Yet this
was also one of the argsunents urged by the Hon. and
Learned Gentleman in fteoui of a repeal of the Union.
He did not object to the Hon. Gentleman fur having an
opinion in'favour of that repeal. The question was a con-
stitutional one; and he only 'wished that he would fix a
day to bring it fikward and have the sense of the Muse
taken upon it. 'There was a precedent for such a motion.
In the House-of Lords, soon after the p tssing of the Act

of Union with Scotland, a motion Was made for leave to
bring in a Bill fur _repeal, and it was lost only by a
Majority of 'four. Now he would say, that if the Hon:
and Learned Gentleman should have the whole of his
minority amount to four, be might think himself very
locky;—(He'ar, and a laugh.)—lle had heard too much of
the public and private conduct of the Hop. and Learned
Member to ithpute to him any improper motive. The
whole of his life showed that lie acted for what he con-
sidered the interest of Ireland, Ile had done much for his
country, as much in het as King, Lords, and Commons;
yet, giving him credit for what he had dope, he could
wish that he would confine his efforts for the repeal of the
Union to the walls of that House, and that he would
use his great eloquence and his powerful influence, to per-
/made that Wine, rather than the forma!irm of societi
' out t.f it, such as they had seen in Ireland, and 'that be
would abstain from such a practice as the collection of
rent, to be' paid out for any purpose, legal or illegal. The
principle was a bad one, and Might load to dangerous
abuSe.. Io conclusion, the Hon. and Learned Gentleman
again expressed his objection to that part of the' speech
and the address which referred to theyeople of Belgium.
Mr. CRIPPS next addressed the }Lime, but, for the
greater part: was very imperfectly heard in the gallery.
We understood him to say, that the alltasion made in the
,Spetch to the present state of helgitun could not 'he con.:
street) into-any intention of war on the part-Of this coon.'
try, and he was sure no such intention existed. The words
of the speech referred rather to the dispositiori of Govern-.
ment to restore. tranquillity there
.by,ntediation,itand that
Wax very' natural on the part of Government with respect
to a tintiri•ry in which be felt so deep an interest. The
Hon.- Member also expressid his regret at the delusion
which existed amongst some of the labouring classes, and•
which led them to acts of riot and outrage ; .but he was
sure-that they, were urged to those depredations by those
Who Should have given them better advice; and.he was'
convinced that notwithstanding what had occurred in
some nlacJs, the mass of the people were sound at bottom.
As to It eland, it was in a much more tranquil state then
the exaggerated' aecounts'or some individuals would lead
us to believe. The agriculturists of that country were
every day getting an increased vent for their produce, to
the:great disadvantage of the British. farettir and vizier,
tort to the great advautage of Ireland generally. Ireland
-Was so'closely linked with this country that it was impos-
sible 'for the latter to be prosperous unlesS the former w.s
so also. A.great Aral had been said about the word " en.
lightened," but he thought Hon. Members had not suffi- '

"dent means of judging of the character of the Govern-
inent of the Netherlands.—(Hear.)--His Majesty's Mini-
ster* pos%eased, ao doubt, a better opportunity*of knoWing
the nature of that Government. He did not know what
'objection could be taken to the course proposed by Mi-
nisters, of offering themselves as mediators between the
•people of Belgum and the King of Ho]land. If they
went to far as to enter Upon a war, detested at the pre-
sent moment, and deprecated by all Englishmen-q Hear)
—it would be then time enough to oppose them.--(Cries
of " No, no.")
Sir G. MURRAY would not trespass long on the time
of the House, AS he fully coincided in the wish expressed
by his Right Hon. Friend,, that short speeches might be-
come the habit of the House. In the first place* her was
desirous,of stating his opinion, that it was indispensable
that the repeal of the Union between England and Ireland

should not take,place.--.. (Hear, hear.) Ile fully concurred
in the feeling which had been uneadinously eapressed, that
the prbsperity of Ireland and Great Britain was insepa-
rably linked together ; and that tiny Measure tending to
separate them would he highly prejudicial to both countries.
Nothing, he conceived, was so important to the empire at
large as the proapotity of Ireland,,—nothing. was more
'calculated to maintain and strengthen the kingdom,_and
nothing would more effectively prOmote prosperity hi 'be-
hind, than by giving to that country a full participation in
all the blessings and advantages whichisve ourselves eh-
The great evil of Ireland wag, that no
sooner was one ranee of agitation removed than soother
was creeted.—(Hear, hear.) He hoped the present cause
of agitation would meet with little success. He trusted
that the good sense of the people of Ireland would, after
some little delusion perhaps at first, effectually put down
the proposition for the repeal of the Union which had been
brought forward.—(llear, bean) With respect to the
Sub-letting Act, he considered it a measure good in itself,
though it might perhaps have ben carried into execution
with too harsh a hand. In diacuseing that part of his Ma-
jesty's Speech which alluded to the affairs of Belgium,
some lion. Gentlemen seemed to have drawn an inference
that unjust and hostile interference was thereby thteittened.
Yet,' as fee at he could form an opinion of that part of
his Majesty's' SPeech, he 94 no reason for thinking that
any intention to interfere in such a manner was implied.
—(Hear.) He eoiild net conceive how his. Majesty's
speech could be thought to express any intention of hos-
tile or military interference in the internal affairs of the
Pletherlands.—(Hear.)—The-great principle of the British
Government wat the principle of non-interference. Cases
might occur, lie hoped rarely, in which interference would
be necessary ; but such cases would form the exception,
-and not the rule. All, however, that was expreased by
his filajeliVe speech Was, that a mediation shoiild take
piece, and there was nothing in the treaties by which the
kingdom or the Netherlands was settled to exclude the
Powers %ilia' were parties to them, from mediating.' Some-
thing hail been said about the linnolicy'of Great Britain
meddling with the affairs of Europe, but he thonght it
was impossible for this country. to detach itself from the
affaire of the other nations of Europe. The King's Si eettli
expressed a desire to preserve the repose of the world, and
there was nothing to indicate a disposition on the part of
Government to involve this country in war.—(Hear.)
Tlie policy of the Government was peace.--(licar, bear 4
—Government had been some time taunted by its oppo-
nents for not having interfered in the affairs of Pokugal.
Government lied been pressed to interfere in the affrirs of
Portugal! Government hail ken blamed for not allowing
troops to assemble in this country with the intention of
proceeding to Portugal; But had Government permitted
these troops to assemble, what a dangerous precedent would
have been established! The. Ex-Sovereign of France
would then. have had a right to be allowed to assemble
troops in this country, for the.purpose of disturbing
the existing Government of the French nation. 'rile
principle ,upon which the Government acted, Was to
afford an asylum tam think, unfortunate persons who fled
to this country, so long as they abstained from, prac-
tice,' which might involve the country in the quarrels of
other nation*. The Hen. MeMber oppOsite (Mr, C.
Forgesson) had censured the,use of the words cc revolted
subjects," and contended that they imputed blame to the
people of Ilelginin who opposed the King of Holland.—
BR he-begged to 'observe that the revolt of the Low
Countries against 'Philip of Spain was spoken of in his-
tory, without any, intention of disapproving Of the etintluot
of the people, as that revclt was considered to be perfectly
justifiable. Snme 'reference, had been made to the Holy
Alliance;-" but •he begged distinctly to state that this
country had never been a metriber •of.the -holy Allidnee;
ninth Ire trusted that it never would adopt the line of policy
adopted by it. * When tie Governmetif connected itself,
'with its allies in corilult with respect to the, good. govern-
ment of the.Netherlansli, it did so not to pro Mote, bitt to
einleavour, by all means, to prevent war.-.-(Hear.) One
lion. Member blamed the King's Speech, becisuse nothing
was said in it about reduction of taxes; but he would re-
mind the House that hie Majesty pledged hirnielf to en-
force a strict system of economy in every department of the
State. Aoother complained because, the
Ding's Speech contained nothing about ParliainentatT,
Morin. Tnar was a ritrirject respecting which there pre,
valted'a variety of opinions, and it would hem' been in-
Aisctsot to have breached such a topic in his Majesty',
Speech, It would be much better, if any geofiepiatt.hail,
any thing'to propose oW'iliat suhject, to originate it at
onee .in that blouse. With' 'respect to Parliamentary
'Worth, he would express himself as a Noble ,Lord ex-j
proofed himself last. night-4ot, the, measure 40 brought
And he would shaPe his course for or against
60)?eVearriid' niint, in prOpartien as he consislered the Mat-
ter detrimental or beneficial to, the country. Fle4'(sit,
Cleorge, 4forreY), .Avola: in like.manner, perfeetty
ling to listen to any,
,proppsition on the aubjects of
Parliamentary' Reform ; but lie should shape his conduct
• thin theoglit tbe peOposition beneficial or
in.propor
detrimental to the country.—(Cheers.) An Hon. Gen,
tleman thought that beetitiselitiltiliji#ity'eSperch evoke of
trim:flitting the blissings of the.Conatitution Unimpsired
to posterity, that therefore all idea of Botany wit,* repelled.
But be enticoived that thltl.exPreui"4 Meant those
s
greatrptinciples which, were: the foundation of our lo
and.tieot
should bp transtiritted unimpaired to. lm!*te"ty'
and detached patio er.ll!, .•
eght
that partitit4t
not fronisqne to time undergo niptlifie,ittip sod a trill
nest iy7.riso'b Out disl4l'anlige,"
beof tleit
Coiistifut(on; - The repeal 'of the Teat Affe, at ifill.)Tet,
ing of the ROOltill Catholic Belief Bill; were to mines to
ct,stref!t

which the great principles of 'the Constitution weranot
departed from, but applied in such a manner as to extend
still further those advantages which a great portion of shy
people already enjoyed.---(Hear.) So far as Reform went
to give the, country a. rood and advantageous system of
government, he was perfectly willing, Reform should take
place.—(Cheers.) He was afraid, from those cheers, that
he had gone a little further than he had intended. When
he spoke of supporting any measure of Reform which
would give the country a good system of governmeht,
be by no means thought that a great extension of the &active
fraochise would have that effect, but directly the reverse.
He'wes willing to admit, that abstractedly every man in the
coontripossessed a right to have the country well governed;
but he was far from admitting that it would be wise or pro.
dr-nt that every man should have a vote in the goverment
of the country. He was perfectly satisfied that that privi.,
lege must be restricted to a amull portion- of the nation
in order to work with advantage. Teat the present sys-
tem did work well, the proof was the advantages which
this country enjoyed at home, the polder it possessed
abroad, and the proud station it occupied in the scale of
nations.—.(Hear.)--lie was q the sure that the most im-
portant ingredient in the Constitution of the country, which
contributed much to its prosperity, was the existence in it
of a highly respectable and powerful aristocracy. It was
the 'exigence of that element in the Constitution
was most likely to secure this country against-those changes
anti convulsions which had been witnessed in other coon-
flear.)—He was alsoof opioon,that if the entire
influence of the aristocracy were confined within their own
House; they would be unable to defend themselves against
the attacks of those who were opposed to them, and they
would anon fall if brought into collision wilt. Other powers,
unless they were protected by certain outworks, which were
Hot only necessary In their own security, but advantageous
to the State.—(llear, hear.)
Sir R. CIRESLEY thought that the general complaint
against his Majesty's Speech was occasioned, not by what
it said, but by what it bad omitted. He certainly re
greeted that not a word had been said about the distress
which, it must be admitted, prevailed to a great extent in
the country; but he was glad his Majesty had declared his
intention ref enforcing the strictest .economy in all the de-
partments of the State, as such a course would offer the

befit mean* of allevia►ing the liltre►s*. The lion. Member

be would support the -Address, because though his
Atijegy's speech 14-131. M that it was the King's intention
to transmit the Constitution unimpaired to his successorOt
did not denounce the ddoption cf anrsalutary measure of
reform.,
- Mr. DENMAN felt gratified at the Speech- which had
been delivered by the Right lion.
_Secretary opposite (Sir
G.-Murray.) That speech he was convinced, would be
received with satisfaction throughout the country. -He
only-regretted that, in anether'place, where a Minister of
the Crown had thought it necessary to explain the am-
bignons meaning of pia of his Majesty's Speech, similar
sentiments • were not to be discovered. It was maw of
deep regret, that in these times of alarm, while a Right
Hon. Secretary in the House of Ominous wss express-
ing himself in favour of reform, and rot even restricting
himself from approving of a measure for universal ea,
frage—(for he loutdeclared his anxiety. to discuss every
plan orreform, and his.desird to know how the !Joust; of
Commons could be reformed so as to be mark fit for the

purposes of good government, the only principle on which
Any rcformwas,prpposed)...4 Noble person at the heath of
the Government, and who might I e said to direct the
destinies of Europe, had, within 24, hours, and within
100 yards of that spot, declared that no reform should he
listened to.---(llrar, hear.)—Not only would the Govern•
went bring forward no plan of refOrm as had been fondly

,„
expected, hut no plan was to be listened to, and no
antendtnent of the Constitution was to he auffered—(Hear.)
—The people were indebted to the Right lion. Secretary
for the sentiments which he had expressed, but they were
more obliged to the' Noble person at the bead of the Go-
vernMent for having fairly told them what they had to
expect, and let them into theAsecret as to the principle!,
on which the government of :the country was to be
conducted. It was with regret and disappoint.
ment he hid heard every paragraph of his Majesty's
Speech read from the Chair. There was not a

. „
.single aenteneeln
,it .worthy the apprphation of au en•
lightenedAllutioietration or anindependent Parliament.
In the. first place, Government told Parliament that it was not
their intention to interfere in the concerminfother nations when
by that very speech they did interfere...Jiver.) They, said they
came forward as mediators ; but they declared that they had
made up their minds that one of the parties.was us the Wrong;
and that, forsooth, that party had occasioned all the evils which
afflicted atelgitnn and threatened the repose of Europe.—(Hear.)
He objected to the Government of this country volunteering
their opinion on the subject. Who wanted to know what they
.thought on the matter?—(Hear, hear.) The people of lielttagun
were, however, slandered by being designated revolted sub .
But the Righelion. Secretary said there was no reproach in the
words, and observed that the Low Countries were stated in' his-
tory to have revolted against Philip. But supposing Queen
Elisabeth . had addressed Parliament, designated the people of
the Low .Countries revolted subjects, and expressed her regret
at-their rning ' against their ; enlightened Sovereign, he..should
like to know what the House of. Commons of that day Would
have said ? was a parallel cats% If we were to enter. into
the discussion of how foreign people and foreign Governments
had conducted themselves?, by did the King's speech limit itself
to theft meagre 'account ot enlightent f Orleans becoming
of rench ? Was It aned Government which lied
led to that change ?—(Hear.)—Why, then, was rot the en.
lightened Govertonent of Charles X, referred to ? And as to
interference, if there ever was a time when our interference in
French affairs would have been beneficial, it was the period be-
tween' the dissolutien of the first Chamber and the Issue of the
Ordinances,...interference then might haie been usefully exec.
eked. But in the case of France the Speech was li tithed to a simple
statement of the fact; and the Hon. Seconder. had told the
House that as the Duke of Orleens. hail been recognised by the
Ittliewis:s"iiicellli,g.iiittlflotlikt'wo °doe:steamtie-
King of England kts.Kignagl.of
lary, on the same principle, that Don Miguel 111113 t acknnw.
ledger( as King of Portia
the improvements of the age, and wonderful to see the progress
of education In its-effects upon the boniest mind, in the mode In
which the French petiole had conducted themselves, attbrding an
example to all the world how a bad Government ought to be re.
listed.—(Hear.)—Notwithstanding the provocations they had re,
calved, they. bad exercised a wonderful' forbearance at a time
when they could have done whatever they pleased. It had been
justly asked when had the victories of despotism been so con.
titteted?•-•(Bear.)—When Governments had succeeded tit recd.
vering,what they deemed their just rights, they were said to ex-
hibit a wonderful degree of moderation if they shed but little
blood. -But in- France the triumphant party seemed to be en.
deavouring to save the lives of their greatest enemies, and, great
• as their guilt was, he (Mr. Denman) trusted they.would be gavial
by their.owninsignificance from the punishment they justly de.
served,•••{Haar.)-allie people of France had done all they could
to preserve themselves without..unnectit.sary .sacritices. But in
the' case. of Belgium he could not say so much. -He
Could . not say who, WAS right and . who was wrong. He
did not know the state of facts;_ but that made it the more
improper for ..a, House of Common, to echo back the
charge of revolt—(llear),a-particularly in a case •of so
such importance, where a single word put into the moteh of
our King might produce smother expenditure of 11200,000,0001,
..-(llear.)—At to the epithet "enlightened," which had been
applied to the'finvernmeet of the Netherlands. the Ministers
who had prevailed upon his Majesty to adopt it, could have had
no knowledge of the subject. But the people of England knew
that the fundamental law of that kingdom had been violateile—
that the liberty of the pros had been put down and the trial by
jury got rid Of. As far as he could ace of . the Belgian instirree.
tire), it did appear as if a sort of Paris fashion had spread abroad,
for. there had nno immediate cause for the revolt when-it
broke out. That circumstance, .however, made the lesson the
more serious to other countries.—(llear.)a-When some important
event,oggurred to-thako the pillars upon which the Conabtution
'lo4leuK,ftlybbYoYrui lartaglitil,:a)AgnyttolgiatibtabhuefFes,
suffering's we it re
rested,- all the real-grievances of the people rose to the 'orate.—
. When once they were in a state of excitement, a strain, a hurt,
'a
weakness only, would betray their real feelings. I o our own
for Government to • has e'conci-
; evewe willk ru
provide t
achhat
yl in44nriant:hitti;etrih:ea:ugial"ribl:Pvinutti etediPkt:st.ll,;:ialligutilditY4
not I'ollTh/eat." But, no; all was defiance—all was menace.—
" We will put dawn sedition,". mild his -Majesty's Ministers;.-
" at thelame time we will give permission to any Members on
the opposite side of the House to bring forwent any project of
reform, with, a reservation :of the rights.. of those ni another
place to interfere -in' the -election of Members of the Neese
of Cornroont,"—.{Crieji of hear, hoar, hear.}•••Butt, they would'
not put word inte the speech respecting the /carets of
the people's. grievances. In ~that, unconititutlonal and in.
tolersible abuse in the representation of the people, which make!
It most stink in the, nostrils of the country, when the petiole
were told of their being represented in the Commons House of
rarliament.—{Hear.)—The people expected that the King's (so.
Vernmeatt,3lpW wpolikettnats - forwatatiwitit, oats, tneasuko ;and
if the Governtrient would nut do it, they looked to the BMW,
nt CbinmOnii 'anti if the illouse would . not du what it was their
bounden duty to do, the people would look to it themselves. Ile.
did not say -that they svpuld fetsia dispositibo to resort to
Pleasures, but they would proceed by petition aott remotest ritere,
but If that 'Would not du,. be did not 'say' tfiey would have re.
ceurse to any thing which savoured of vielene,e; nut if the
country was to loaded with the taxation of former years, and
discontents arose,: there. were Onnished, Ditherer individuals'
who were intent on mischief and agitation, topics of frightfill
grievances, rendered still More alarming by the indication which
hail appeared elsewhere, of a deteripleation to resist alt altetwOt'
at redrets; and a crisis was not unlikely to arrive, the thill3o,
quences of which the youngest in that )louse might have
reatott to deplore. With regard to
.the Union. he felt the
utmost dislike and reptispaoce to every motion, fur lUe re..
peal- Of -a legislative -or any other union between the two
countries oil:natant! and Ireland. If the Honourable and
Leartteci Menther for Waterford had au rievalica to.alleffe*'
for which; however,- the repeal of the Uplort was the- last re,
metly-,let, then/ be brought ' forward, and let 'the- liouse -eon.
sider.of the remedy. Let Use Iritift :people state what their
grievances are, anti let the Gov-eminent endeavour to redress,
them.' As far as he knew the state of the case, We were Peed
In a situation entirety new. .11e -well Teuton-Met-at, -not Duel
Years, ago, winin a motion for reform was brought forward, it had
beee /volute( by a Bight It im Geotlentam, who asktai, What
haie you to )faits by reform ?" Mr. Canning referred triumph.
&fitly tu.thil', individuala,amongtt the Ministers who represented
popular Olapes. But it was riot so pow. Let .the tbr.
Yerkshire tout Middlesex 'come forward mid tell them what was
the otitte andfrielings sit-the country. He (101 r.•l)en-me con:-
clotted. syn.!) protesting, ost behalf of - the people,- of Logitunii
agaituit the )horrible' idea that we were to tender our interfortaoce
in the affkirs of a foreign•nation,rafter rirottouncintin favour of
its Government. Ministers couldAtot he ill • trounounieation,
with thiappeple, they. could licit _know. their sentisoints, vv
they lilt''such a -proposition into the mouth of the Kitsg. 1 f
there had been any Weltaxinsidered- amendment far the todrest
of theMre444#4t4oll,of.the.people before, the House, he would
and. wilen the odestion of the Address came
agahaYine sisetUPPLlene'itheit.tiouse- he" should fhel- it to be• his 'duty' to say
that lie nester would supporti it. .- . - ..•
• eta; ;kg lafusl*(4s ell(letttoodltruake anew observatieess
but we could Out collect their tenottr... ljeaieared to speak lu
Parliamentary teriirmiAtind'of extension of 'tellteßell'-
tatianlia thethanutautiningitnwila,,
.; •.
i Wit (4QNit„cit felt.great relit:o.4,e, to, aildrets: the.
IkOil , ither the apetain'of the'_ tvell4reated--acter,' the' Item nail
i iii(-• alitenthiol•fee,NOttingha4 *ltftt..-be was ghat t 0 see
the House ASlthi. lie was not surprised at the objection which

had been made to the King's Speech, by those from whom tiitt
objection was natural and proper, that the subject of Parlie-
mentary! Reform' had not been recommended to the House. He
was bound to say that he saw as plain as any man,. the tide that
ran so strong in favour of that question in • the country.—(Heat,
hear.) Ile knew there had been a clamour raised throughout
the country in its favour, and It wet no Wish or aspiration of his
to take an unpopular view of a public question, Still he stoed
there to say, that alter full consideration, and some little expe-
rience, his opinions on that question remained unehanged. •`Flint
were those opinions? he might be asked. Ho had formerly
stated; that he thought the measure would be dangerous to, the
interests of the country. Some remark; had been Made after the
declaration which had been uttered in euether place on this- guess
'on. But When MI °cense-in occurred to state that pe.rton'e opt.
nion, it was ant:oily and open colirse to say that that opinion re.
wattled um:hanged ; It might otherwise be inattinated, a You
are lying by, and trimming your sails. till you ere in trust diree.
tion the wind blows.' If the King's Speech had • Omitted the
mention of Parliamentary Reform, so had every speech from the
throne, as far its the memory of Man Menet-h. He viewed the
events of Paris is ith satisfaction not unmingied With regret, for
he lamented that the King was a bigot, and his Minister it fanatic,
while he could not hot admire and applaud .the gallantry; with
.which the people had Asserted their Violated liberties. -
Mr. SANDFORD, who nekE addressed the Maude; was ender.
steed to deny (tue necessity of an armed interterenee between the
King_of the Netherlands and his subjects. Hewes go, to hear
the Noble Lord opposite apply. the terra clamour" to • the ex.,
pression Of popular feeling on the subject of Parliamentary.itei
form. The irreiiistibie torrent of politic opinion that was ciemiter
dpwn emengst thetn lie Loptel.Wp(all seep )'titre' filtee every vestige of
aristocratic prejudice that could bay, thetated siteh•language., :
Mr. H. DAVIS refused to entertain any plea of rtalemeatary
Reform, as he conceived that every !Merest in the count*, Waft
alreade, 'represented. He Viewed the proposal with inexnres.
stole dismay, and greatly feared it wetild be discovered, when too
late, that the change demanded was very much miscalled by those
who designated it reform. His constituency comprised a greater
number Of feeortied tates than was necessary to the election of
any other Member Of that heti lie aid tuft hesitate to sav
that the question was one of itidat tiattietttut eter Merited
within the wells of Parliament- It appeared, Inrifeeer; 'That
no twenty men of those who advocated reftiret,". eohld he
found to agree In opinion as to whet would be the Lest Made Of
attainietviti M
,
r. HUG Es (it tat On the (*petition (tenches) expressed
the warmest approhatinn of Odes/ Sentiment contained in the
Address, in which, therefore, from the beginnlng to the end Ile
most cordially concurred -.(Cheers, and laughter.) 11l treed
give Mitiisters his unqualified confdesce, and support theM
through evil report And good report without any compromise of
principlekor sacrifice of MS independence.. This determination
he was the More anitiotie to take the ,present opportunity of
avowing, as It had been bruited about, hint lie lied become a
member ore factiout and irreconcileable Opposltion.—elle.peated
cheereend laughter.) He had been sent to that flouse. by the
unbiassed votes of a free, a higleminded, -and intelligent consti-
tuency, to wheels it was but justice to say, that their represente-
tivenever yet had been, and never would become, the bonded:tee
of a &diem-e(lleer, near.) In this awful and.tremendous crisis
—a,ctishi more eetraertlinary that; apy whieh the chroniclers of
the whole world could produce—it pfeaseft l'teridenee to elevate
to the throne a mild, amiable, and paternal, monarch; Whe had
0:lectoil the existing Ministry et the -commencement of his reign
to guide the councils of State. He should, therefore give them
his temtifienee, and he scrupled not to pl'omlse that he would
strengthen their hands,—(Cheers.) The thee, he trusted, was now
past when their support ola usetul measure would be regulated
by their feelings tua ards RIC /edit of the House from whence it
had proceeded. • ,
Atter it few words from Mr. Titevolt, the purport of Windt it
Will impossible to collect in the (lathery, the Speaker put the re.
port be brought up, on wheel
Sir it. PEEL sale, that the discustion, which had just taken
place imposed fit him Ole date of making one or two observa-
tions on the subject 111 ParlitutuadarY Itelormi respecting which
the Hon. and Learned Member for York lied so reeeffilreiren
notice oft' motion.' This task he would rather on the present
occasion have avoided, as he was unwilling to express an opinion
on Well A question until it should have been legitimlttely brought
under the consideration of the Ilease. A construction, how.
ever, had been put teethe declarations of his !tort lion. Friend
which deprived him tit ail alternittive, With r are tilt ire roles-
tion generally he might remark, that he had never Ilitnerio
taken a very decided ;nut. Oeposed to it, he ,admitted he cer-
tainly had been, but at the same time (with very few exceptions)
he had contented himself with a sheet vote. It appeared that a
passage in the speed) of his ltight Hon. friend had. been inter-
preted as expreesive of the senthrients Clovernmetit gencrelli,
on the subject. Now he fully admitted that he sew difficulties
fibout the question of reform which he was by tut ustaus pfe-
paredlo He wished, nevertheless, to say pathing then
which might in any demo prejudice the discussion hereafter, or
inferfere with its advitneement to a satisfaetory termination...,
( car.)--I Le saw considerable difficulties attendant on the mere
agitation of the topic, end he confessed iihnseif at a loss to con-
jecture the principle of limitation which the Hon. and Learned
Member appeared to contemplate as the guarateco of a moderate
retinue The Member for Nottingham (Mr. Denman) had hal.
mated, as hounderstocel hint, that no Measure of reform which
stilt allowed of the interference of Peers in the return •of 'Mein.
bort or the Home elf Commons would, satisfy him, lilt argu-
ment, he conelederi front the tenor of his speech, nine. be dh
meted against an aristocratic Government altogether. To such
~n extent he was not preparou to go; nor did he at present *see
any prospect that ouch a mellow° of safe . moderate reform, es
hltliftijesty's Government might be IncOned to sanction, woeld
satiety the 'demands ot expectation') of the refortners. This only
he would now premise, reserving a fuller exposition of pia senti.
mehts to the opportunity when they could be regularly and sea-
sonably explained. At to the interference with Belgium, he
()wiled he was surprised td find such a difffirence of opinion after
the tietech which they had heard front the Noble, lord. opposite
taut night. ' They had but one of three courses to pursue ; either
to disavow ail' interest In the afiLirs of Belgium, as the lion.
Member. for Middlesex suggested, allotting French' soldiers
to mike what incurelons they pleased, and take possession of
Antwerp and other' fortifications uninoletted; or by military
Interffirenee to compel the submission -of the provinces to the
King (neither of which we adopted) ; or lastly, when.eivil •• was
wan rasing in a part of Europe, from its position. peculiarly cadet*.
hired' to embmil neighbouring atatos, to meffiate wait a view tea
restore tranquillity, and not for the purpoire or subjtigating the
Netherlands; and this was the species of interference to which
the Braid] Government had had, recourse.—(Hear.)—The
Speech' from the Throne did not contain It word which IleCes
fierily implied the re.annexation of the provinces' to the
Crown from which they is revolted. The first course, there-
fore, w0..1,1 have beca very diflerent from that which England
had always hitherto observed, and the second would have lad
to the devastation of the country, lie did not perceive the tans.
logy which the Hon. awl Learned Gentleman seemed to revise
title between the case or the Netherlands and that of the parti-
tion of Poland. The Right Hon. Baronet here referred to two
speeches from the King in list?, relative to the Internet Mason.
sums of Holland, to prove that this teasnot the first time of such
interference on the pert of Great Britain; and cited the opinion
of Mr, Fox as confirmatory of the sumo policy, • The Hon. and
Learned Member for Yorkshire was also in error as to the (mi.
Mons of Mr. Pitt on the policy or this country with respect to
the question of interference as was proved by that emitteet
Statesman's despatch to theltussiatt Ambassador in 1805. He
had shown, t•liet, that contrary to the lion. and Learned Gene
thenan's assertion, the -allusion by way of interference with lb.
pruoletcny4tahltic'sniswte"rs Vetrea nnoDivvellittYirialui 1 angKwinitghisre'sPpoceuethtoi Wand thattial
and was that approved of by
tcthe i
'realhighestuu mw (ftsht e(
fxsnwis cr:itiehi
net°l:rittoCitl)vefeet el:l°l°i could
i'L'illat°t; 1s
:c:e dit
r"uni.attsicel eot'ott h'ons. i
vtohrr legal ql
t:tl7,si
the King of folland, on certain conditions or fttmlinnental lasts.
the violation or which by that King alone could anthorbio the
Belgians to apply to the Allied: Powers, the parties to the Can.
great for:Meets; reducing the mtertion fee rite consideration of
Parlisinent to the simple Fact—did or did not the King of I tole
14141 violate the fundamental laws on which netted. his sove-
reignty over Belgium hear,)--He (Sir K. Pool) con.
tendeff that the Kittg of Iliffiand did not ; and that he, on the
contrary, manifested great readiness to submit the redress of any
grievances of which hiclielgian subjects might complain to the
he States-Gerw.ral. It
taw,erocootratillugoatritilluotugaerooll roeflr:s
Princest Frederick to Brussels
Wit a violation of the llelgian liberties. What were the facts P
He firmly believed that Prince Frederick's march to Bruited*
was far from beteg a preconcerted military movement—that it
was made without any definite purpose of violence.' 'trues:els
Whist before been the scene of an undefined Commotion,' the
objects of which were the removal of an unpopular Minister,
and of a municipal tax. To check the excesses of the agents in
this insurrectiote the inhabitants ,organized themselves into a
burgher guard, which most probably would have succeeded but
for the fineigners and unemployed poor in the neighbourhood,
who flocked into the town mud ultimately enabled the inturgents
to defied the burgher guard. Prince Freder ck had no other
Jett than to appoint this guard !to protect property, and was este-
Matted when he met with the resistance which had been Mitred
to his entry. The charge of treachery, thereffire, conic, not hold
ittittaill,SitwhAhlilidrelsTedildtiflohtt
pl
o. B
thea r oiler.°
slow.
toco eateolyeeml
it,tu
it their duty to Ming tinward la obedience to the King's Speech.
to sanction of any or the measures which' Ministers migr
'ilat this wits the fact, was evident from. the circumatenee of
the Hem. Member for VVestminster having that evening given
entice of a motion with respect to Belgium, though he had not
;contouroor
raised his voice against the Address. • Cotitident that the policy
which Ministers were pursuing tower& Belgium was., the
soundest they could adopte-was that most likely to restore
,tranquillity an Belgium," the , tole object of the conference with
our Allies—lie was prepared to vindicate it at the tittiog oppor-
tunity,
Mr. BROUGHAM had lietentel 'to the Right Hon. Baronet's
,observations with his best Attention • but . lie confessed' he
thnught that his (IWO, itrguments,. or tallier propositions, cif last
flied with respect to Belgium, were wholly untouched by them.
Not-all the minieterialluctibrationeof the 14 hours which heal
elapsed since he had •addressed these arguments to the House—.
net all the aid which the Right Hon. Baronet, had reeelved since
out tif doers—for hit could not 'leek flir any within arming his
polleagues—rear, and a laugh)....eould show that he erred hi
fffiftit, I.lo' 4,40 letter, in saying, that since the French reve-
hition—ihr that
the
the peried to which he particularly called
the attention of the Ifouse—no kina's lipeech contained Such
an allusion by way of interference witirthe afikirs of indepen-
dent States, .as that of the Speech to which the Address then ea-
sier consideration WAS an answer. His eharge against Ministers
Was, not that of ititerfering at all, or of not preserving 'an utter
litdiehrence, but of disqualifying themselves from becoming
useful arbitretora by taking a iiecidtal part on quo aide of the
parties among whom, forsooth, they were: to restore tranquil.
hoar,)-.:ln the awe of Portugal, in ISM,' us in
that of the Low Countries, In IN7,:our interference was foundedpit pit the faith of treaties. But surely that pretext put(' not be set pp just now in the ease of Holland and Belgium. Whit, then,
train tic maitre of our Interference, it was nod ng mere ucrr
less—mei t hie WAS the gravamen of his charge..than making the
Ding of ling unit 4 partisan between the King, of Rolland and,
ins lielgian tebjects ; anti this wits called this best means of re-
!tering tranquillity.-e(Haar, said the-King of Eng..'
end was made a partisan against thC Beigiana; for in the Spaeth.
te bestows ail praise on the • King of Holland, while he de-
eounces the Belgian' as rebels,' end an unjust faction; and after
this
sound
qin uestion—.was ;ids a::,),:,:nttbitfit:ri,lY:ooe';io—etdl4(liiitli.,elbillalaF,,rgi:ay)ysktiot!'f:httrootetineix)eaeric'en'it:iiriaonaptsngutstilt.,:l;ecetinntrrt:tit.tit:hb(lig::
o' that ()rand he had confined his observation'', as that contained
in the Speech under conskleration ?—(Hear.)..it had been said
that Mediation Was all that we intended with respect to Belgium.
Mediation" wee a soft ethooth werd ; but those whoanterfered
As mediators were frequently•• Obliged to" fight. • ".Mediation"
meant money" nuineymeant supplies—and supplies meant taxes.
...Mears hear.)..Who had called fur our niediatiali 10—(Hear.)•
...We were mediators only,oe one sitie-...0n behal.f of the '''ii.
Lightened Monarch" of Holland. One word with respect te the.
reet)gnitkni of Don Ho did not, object tat thet'proeeefl-
findtechittel°. Yltatteuilfewlltiee firitellift.l°ct°eirltruM;tinhweiritrfi:licteigivitichat tilt'
time ',defied for thus teeogniton was rather awkward. It seethed
As though Ministers had nitended to say, " Gtr, we have re'
cognised ).unit 1 lailip I we, limy air well roognise. Von Miguel.—
pee is as good as the other."—(Expressions of dissent flout the
2`testeury lienet.,neellorore ha concluded,
'v
he Could not avoid ei.
mowing Ole iltetifieekloo which Ite had ex' ri-eteed at hearing
the'llight lion, Secretary Ibt the Colonies. avow himself to he 4
friend to Parfiamentary reform, He 'weed not elate with cer-
tainty whether the Right Hon. Secretary went to exactly The ow leneth as be (Sts. Brougham) did his %heaps .with•
respect to reform ; but at 'present be seemed inclined to
ea, until
nolangt:r,e,,n,ehtL,,:icoetcenv,,,,:ritrci:ciiitgt.:lh.ea:X;lbhete'yptttbitueer,Urtettilt:itia'b)e,ture?a,lidlitlasitg,iitillityeletbnedgn
cedii.vissgebehnor•til:hruf
laelibter,),4 le !tight bell. lOW *a:rotary ditlertd Iletheatil
ttan; Oat!
tied with the present, constitution, et l'arlinment, mid tat• nit
change which had ever been propounded, or which they (mild
sassseive might Ito prepoiStV'eliiiiti, their (teat
chhititittian"'" A -14118114-41 e .fikewise felt --great Oct age big ith Another fileotier.of tilt Getternikleffits 4.4°119"...f**
pred-hts.admiratintr' of . the hrifte Frendi peep tbi
risen and frustrated the gravities which their wretched 00V0s1.•

ment had 'attempted tn peipei 'ate. Hotte 'le the 'lilserel senti-
ments which these two intlivitluale had expressed will agree with
those of their tolleagues, it *44.4 not for him to inqUire, That
was their business; and to.mettaw morning, or tome, other there,
they might perhaps settle' it amongst themeeeeA laugh.)—He
would trotetle the House with eel, another Observance]. So is
men seetned to think that bur sithobeitine of the ecrndnet of the
French mitten should lett lie to wish for snare such scene' al
home as had been exhibited abrceid, With these persons he dli.
filed tote tele. lie was fur ref rie—litt preservlnge not for
I pulling dfteineefor restoration, not fer reeettition. lie was a
shallow politician, a miserable reasoner, and he tlueight no
trust.worthy man, who argeed that, because the people 0(1'06
had justifiably and glorlterely Melees', lawless oppressioni the
people of London and Dutein. Ought to rise for reform. Devoted
les he was to the cause: or Parlienientary reform, Be did net coil.
' sitter that the refesal of that benefit, ot, lie Would see. 144
right, to the people of this eturnitry (if le wereat legal refusal" by
King, Lents, aunt Calumets, whits,, he hoped to God would not.
take piney would be in the slighte,t Lire& ereltel case to any
thing which htid happened In lee )
Sir 11, PEEL said he eras dethoes ill sayinsii few weeds with
reference to wh .t hail fallen front the Hen. and Learned Gen.
Oman respecting the recognition of Dee Miguel, beeettse he
was as anikeie ne the Here and Leartiett t.eentleman that 44 good
understanding elleteld 641bSiat. iAtiVecti this etsunfrY and Foams
In the last Speech front the 'Clifene, which wee cfelieertel on the
eth. of Fehruary, ROI, an elevate were- Marie to the ptetability
of the recogoition of. Don Miguel. lf 'eat tweed:se:try, etate
that at that time ece,ey is hail occurred in Frinee which red.
tiered the reengfillitoi of Louis Philip necessary.
Mr. BROUGHAM -eiff.frekel himself perfectly sationleti with
the explanation which had beett mere by the Right lion.
metary.
'Vet PALMERSTON wished to know wheifieea In the event
of lide ;Metre granting the Amnesty, it 4411:1 411 C ifilaMinn tit
the British tse‘crinneeit In interfere to compel tern to ektloute
it if be should be dispegee ties too do so. ileless there ahotiki
be some guarantee for the exectitiOn ef fhe amnesty, imilviditals
would not emu re to place them elves /eon Miguel's power:
Sir R. PEEL said, he coeld best gnawer the etleslion by state
ing the circumstances connected with' the proposed eitetnty.
e heel done all in our power, by advice. and friendly Wee.'
fereneei to eensuit the interests of those who were denounced
by thp: pijithine fickvetitnent Portugal. The language we held
wee, the* weitlki net requite the lissulog of that amnesty, as the
condition of cult teeognititet cif the Portuguese Government,
but we declared that tintets It shotdd be published to the world,
the retogyrition would not take thee. did not promise that
the recognition would take place if the amnesty shoeld be
ofiltree, but we stated that the withholding of the amnesty
Would prevent that recognition; lie did not think it would be
prudent in him to state *hat Reps this Government might be
called upon to take, in the event of a particular ease arising.— i
(Ilear.)—He would, however, state that we Were not guarantees
for the fulfilment of the Amnesty.
'Hie report was then brought up, and agreed to.
Mr. H UME rose to move, that two paragraphs should be
added toehe Address, dint' expressing regret that the King had
not stetted that taxes would be rteitseisit and the other declare..
tart' of the necessity of Parliamentary Befsnen. The Hon. Lien.
Oman prefaced his motion by complaining tlttt no allusion to the.
Cairn Laws or the East India monopoly had been Miele In the
King's Speech, and stated that due vengeence would be Oben I
for these timiettions,
Sit lit RE,EI4 protested Against the use of such language.
theiMit.;oHaeUesMZrsiemittlistitmistidesilifily6 lone:wet
utliisiiiltesliolifntishtris,,,7lt,ilil 108 e
Sir rt. PEEL—Surely the non. Menem slum not call that
ve gen ance.
Mr. HUME—That is what I meant.

The vroposed additions were negatived.
The Ilti,sse then adjourned At a QU4RTUA PAHT Two o'Ci.oegt

SPIRIT OF THE PtillLlo JOURNALS.

The present, is a most itnpnrttnt crisis, and Wti ahall
speak our did:duns freely upon matters connected both
with the foreign and domestic policy of the country, hay.
ing the King's Specs in view tnetely, rather than di,.
cussing it in the detail. The production itse:f eras
ccc-
tainl. attacked with great spirit and some success by inn
llt ougham, in Otte particular point,—namely, the passage
rebating to Delginin. But still we think, though the cx.
Plotsions themselves might have titltte elssrly renounced
*tot disavowed the principle of intorferentfe, yo that,
joined with explanations given by the Duke of Wellington
in his speech' they are, iu a good degree, satisfactory and
assuring as to the present purpose of the Aritish Govern•
meet, not to interfere in the internal gustrels of the
people composing lately the kingdom of Holland. For
the purpose of Coutirming this our opinion, we shall. el.
tract the two passages:— •
"1 have witnessed, with deep regret, foe state of elks in
the Low Countries. I lament that the enlightened Adminiors-
,lois of the King should not have preserved his domlnititts from
fetich; and that the wise and, prudent measure of stibmitto7g
the desires and the complaints of his people to the deliberations
of an Extraordinary Meeting of the States-Oenerat should have
led to no satisfactory result. 1 arti endeavouring, in concert with
my Allies, to devise such means of restoring tranquillity as may
he compatible with the welfare and good goVeflinsent of the
Netherlands', and wills the future security of other States.4..The
Mars Speech.
"Be. (the Duke of Wellington) could assure the House, that
there was no intention whatever on the part of hie Majesty's Mi.
nistarse--there was not the slightest intention on the port of any
Power whatever,--to interfore, by means of arms, with the ar-
rangements respecting the Netherlands.'7 The Duke's .Speech.

The pp:et:ll-of Sir George Murray (a. C4liiiiet Minister)
livit night is even more explicit. lie Awes, that " When
the Government contieeted itself with its allies to consult
with respect to the good government of the Netherl Andy
it did so, not to promote, but to endeavour, by all means,
to prevent War.' Sir B. Peel also contended, that "the

onle object of the conference* Will to restore tranquillity in
Belgimin." This being premised, now comes the peat

• I
question—may not war awl spring up in spite of these
nun-intentions on the part of the present Ministers of the
great Powers, from causes over which they have no
control ? In answer to this question we shall say, that
the whole, or at least the first movement, depends upon
France, and not upon this country. Frence has here
our disavowal of the principle of interference; She
has hitherto strictly end honourably observed it herself;
and we have no doubt hut the very eminent and die.
tinguished pewit whom the King of the French has sent
here as his representative, in applying the whole of his great
talents and accumulated experience to that important ob.
ject—the preservation of the tranquillity of Europe. But
let it be observed that he is the Arnbassador, not the Mi.
nistry of France. That Ministry it changed or changing,
and, so fir as a change may be operated, it will be from
men of more temperate to men of less temperate prin-
ciples. We recollect when the French Ministry was
formed,' that the Duke& Broglie, M. Guizot, awl Baron
Leuis, were thought liberal enough ; now, however, they
are not thought liberal enough; and should the mere-
,rent (to use the French term) continua--should the King
be mai* to stop its course—what assurance have we that
the Ministry now forming may not soon be replaced by
another yet more radical, till at bait the councils of France
will fall into the hands of a set of Jacobins, whom uothiug
but war will satisfy ? For be it observed, that though the
British radical', simple knave., affect to rove and revere
their brethren of France, the latter hate England from the
crown of its head to the sole of its font; they sigh for
Bonaparte, and slavery and plunder. The whole, therefore,
depends upon the firmness and power of the King of France
to keep the portfolios of office in the hinds of men of tempe-
rate views, of moderation, and rational principles of liberty.
In inclination we are convinced his Majesty will net fail; but
if he fail in tesolutlon or power, then the most dreadful can
sequences may be'apprehended. We turn our view now to

the domestic policy of our own country, The puke of
Wellington has expresacd his determination to resist all
reform : the declaration will probably attach to his admi-
nistration come 'of 'thb high Tories, who have sat more
loose to him since Catholic Emancipation and the repeal
'of the Test and Corporation Acts have been carried.
Should atTaire fall into that unhappy train and course in
,France of which we have spoken above, undoubtedly the
ilread of reform will he greatly increased in this counts),
`in one class of people, and the inclination to change in-
flamed in another by the influence of example ; and in
this conflict of principle it may be difficult to say what
wonld be the result ; hut we cannot help observing that
the Duke,' or whoever may be his succe.eor inheriting his
/pinions will not have the same elemente of resistance
placed at hit disposal; us were poasessed and used with
Noah rigout by Mr. Pitt. Between radic4l re-

loon, however, and no reform, we know which
we should ehoe4e. The evil* of the former are
enarehy, rlunder, 'daughter, auk! slavery ;—those nC
. .

the latter, proyobing interferenees with popular
fights—berou,Omortgering Peers—corrupt 'maktritiee---,
aye, and corrupt minorities toot—partialities in the Ore-
firm and rejection of public funettonariest-,-severer
tion than necessary ; evils" had enough no doubt, but cor-
rected anti controlled by the sense of shame and the appre-
hension of consequences, It is clear, then, how lunch
depends upon Trance, even with respect to the internal
tiovernment of England. We hope much that What is
Called the mourement there will be stopped or impeded
but should the fact prove otherwise, the ret,ruaers of this
Oonntry.,-the radical reformers we mean—will not have
it to'say that tbiogs have only fallen into confusion in
France because reform was resisted; for a just and tempe-
rate revolution has been effected...-4 thorough but a mild
yelling's has been established: and if these do nut satisfy,.
what bounds can lie set to popular demsnds—when can
an heedless people, impelled by unprincipled demagogues,
be antiafied—till they remelt the bourne of all civil cononO..

tions,—slavery, downright slavery,--under the iron rule of
some Upstart tyrant from their own body; and therefore the
more justly odious because he trends upon his equals. Timec
We commend to public notice the resolutions of the
electurs of Stamford on the interference of I ,li:seter at
their late eleotion. It is the conduct of such a man as
this, and his brother Peer at Newark, that will tlu more
to shake the aristocracy of this country, whilst other aria-
tocracies are sinking around us, than any efforts of jam).
binism. It is impossible to respect the Peers whilst they
au little respect themselves. Was it inserted in the leases
of Lord Exeter's tenants at Stamford, or the Duke of
Neweastles tenants at Newark, that they tshou!ri respec.
lively receive Members of Parliament at the hands of their
landlords? No : thic would have heen too audichtus and
insolent. 13nt in what does the present course differ, ex-
cept that it add, treanhery coil hatameis olio to audacity
ond
There ire riiit; 'We believe, two rillOjAtEt peramis who
think differently with respect to the`Kities i4PeiCh. Ali
agree that the exprewie“ of an opinion ou the question

between the Bing of the Netherlands, and the Reigisne,
was, to say the least of it, peculiarly ill-judged. If, as the
Duke of I'Vellington alleges (and we are not inclined to
distrust him,) there is no intention on the part of the Go•
verntnent of this country to interfere by force or by an
appeal to firms, In order to effect an arrangement eatisfae-
toey to all parties.—to declare in the outset that the King
time right and the Belgians in the wrong, does not
teem calculated to impress the Belgians whit our impar-
tiality, or to ludtwe them to repose confidence in ua as
tnedittors. The Duke of Wellington is entitled, like
other people, to have his opinion; hot it indicates strange
notions of derunry and propriety to thrust an opinion re.
Opentinl the int►rnal affairs of a foreign (unitary into a
Speech from the Throne. We repeat, we do not believe
that the Doke contemplates en appeal to force. But we
can hardly wonder that a different cone rnetion should so
evirrally have been put on the Speech. The reference to
the treaties is what chiefly creates alarm :

Impressed at all times with the necessity of restecting the
faith of nAtional engagements, lam perstmded tha my deter.
mination to maintain, in conjunction with my Allies, those ge-
neral 'Treaties by which the political ay tent of Etirope has
been established, will °Mr the beat security for this repose of
time

If the Duke were to carry this principle rigoroutily Into
fired, force most ultimately be resorted to, should pers
*wagon prove unavailing. In vain abenld the pealtl'or
Belgium and the people of Holland exclaim, the treaties
tat *Well you allude do, indeed, hind us to remain united,
hut we ate miserable under the alliance, and we with to be
separated—the Holy Alliance step in:and fto We heroJ
made your union the alibied of a treaty, and, you must
not lie Parroted. In train manner the views of those who
are most corterrned are held in the least regard. In fact
the Doke of Wellington it at issue with Limed( on the two
principles- -lehas expressed his desire of nonsintetvent ion,
and maintaining, in corajnnction with his Mies, the trea-
ties by which the system of Europe, as he tennis it, bans
been estehlished. To pretend that a people shall not
chants their Government because it LOS been deearcil in
a treaty that the sovereignty should belting to a certain
Prince, is maintaining the pritiCiple of intervention. If
the Duke of Wellington did not contemplate an appeal to
force on the failure °fen attempt at conciliation. the lan-
Fringe he used seems very mach at valiance with Lis ob.
yea, as it is calculated to induce a persuasion in those
Powers which are faterested in upholding the principle Pr
tron.intervention, that a determination Is taken to compel
the Ilehtians to return to their allegiance Whether they
will or not. We need not say that were such an idea to
be taken up by the people of France, the Government ef
that country might be plated in a situstion of considerable
embarrassment. The least enspicion that the Xing of the
rreneh might connive at each an invasion of the right of
every pe/le to choose their. own Government, might he
very preyndieial to his' interest's. With respect to the
omission of all mention of reform and retrenchment, this
does not surprise us. So far from yielding to reform, the
thike of Wellington said that the wit of man could devise
no Canstlttttkn at all comparable to ours, shirk, in ever),
respect, was perfeetinn itself:
is And this leads Mc," told his Grace, 4. to advert to the re.
commendation of the Noble P.arl (Grey)) to prepare against the
etils that might threaten front Ateroad, by promoting content-
inent end tranquillity at home; and tverloubtedly it was the duty
of tiovernUtept to do so by every proper and reasonable cape.
silent to which It might be in their power to resort. But then
the Noble Earl had refetemensied the expedient of Parliamentary
Reform, and remarked that he did not think the Gawernment
was as yet prepared with anyldan on the subject. The Noble
tethers* right , for certainly Government was not repared with
any plait for Piallamentary Reform. I will go farther, and sae
that I neva heed that any country ever had a more mprosell
or more satisfactory representation than this country enjoys at
this moment. Ido brat mean to enter upon that subject now, ass
it is probable that wee rill have abundant opportunities to coil-
vider it afterwards; but Ido say that this country bas now a
Ifogislature more calculated to answer all the purposes of a good
LealsietUre than any other that cast be well devised—that it
pooseasel, and deservedly possesses, the confidence of the
country, and that its discussions have a powerful inthience jn
the country.' And, I will say further, that if I hail to Oral at
issfislature, would create one,—.net equal In exrellence to the
',rest, for that I could not Upon to be able to do, but some.
thing as tsearl44 the same description as possible. should
form it of . powered of a very large prosenteet of
the property o lb* country, in which the landholders
should have a great preponderance, I, therefore, am tun pee.
mad with any measure of Parliamentary deform, nor shall arty
MettstAra of the kind be proposed by the Government as long as
I hold My present position.'
The Hake hods the state of the Representation satisfac-
tory to himself, and therefore naturally enough lie deem*
it a good Representations Why should it be supposed that
a Minister would final fault with what answers 'his .purs-
ppm? But the Duke here show. himself a skilful mend
the *Ohl, No Minister who might feel disposed in con-
sent to a reform in the Representation, could possibly oh.
tamp the suffrages of an existing Parliament, because the
majority, having an interest hostile to reform, would of
course be rendered dissatisfied by the proposal of a measure
to that purpose. By becoming Reformer, therefore, he
insist make tip his mind to cease being Alinist.z. The
Duke could not prevail on Parliament to agree to Reform;
but if means could be found for disposing Parliament in
favour of Reform, the SEMI means would dispose hiss
Graeae in favour of it, The -only means by which Parlia-
ment could be apnoed to favour Reform, would lie a de-
monstration us the part of the great body of the owners of
proiterty in this country, that they were determined to have
;t. There can be no sineetlen that the middle classes ere
much more powerful, were they united, than the Avis-
tocracy or rather the Oligarchy's Bait at present the
latter presume on the apathy of the middle classes. Thu
Oligarchy, we may he,seaureal, are not to be coaxed into a
love of Reform. A chance speech at a meeting, or a inn•
lion in the House of Commune, will produce but little its..
pression on them. They must see that the middle classes
are in earnest-..and this aasurediy they have stover yet
seen. Mr. Hume observed on Tuesday night—.
If the Right lion. Gentleman (Sir Robert Peel) thought
that the British people were for ever to be hewers of wood and
drawers of water. while a small class lived luxuriously en their
boniest., he weuld find himself mistaken.. What the People
wanted was relief from taxation, and with that a cure of the
pre ent vice of election*. They wanted to get the Peers out of
the Commons-to confine the farmer to their own department.
That was the cry from one end of the country to the other'.
They asked for bre.sd and they were given stones. They were
told shot the Government meant to meddle with the atTaire of
other countries; and he believed they did so, to keep the people
of England quiet; for such had always been the tricking Pcille?
of this' Government. Hut was such a dowse to be ;mount
when thousand' were dying of went.... (No, uo l from 'the Tretee
'may lieneltes.).-Ile was not surprised that they who fattened on
the riches of the land should deny this assertion ; but he wished
they mould go and look into the state of the persist* in different
parts of the country, and then they would not deny that which
no man could with truth deny. The people required a reform
of that House, because that House was the origin oral/ the cells
from. which the country outlived. The Noble Lord who has)
moved the Address had expressed a wish with which he (Mr.
Hume) most heartily concurred—namely, that the Government
should give liberty to all, injury to none. He agreed with that
sentiment; but, he asked, was that the NW at the present ines.
meat, when millions were granted fer the gratitleetton of a 6,w
at the expense of the starving artisans of the country I Every
act of that House tended to the same point."

Whenever the middle classes act in such a manner as to'
show that they share these opinions of Mr. Home, we
shall obtain reform, but not till then. Mr. Brougham,
however, is to perform little lees than a miracle, for be is
" to combine all- Interest* and all opinions in favour of a
restoration of the Constitution to its state of original pu.
city," lie afterwards declared, The peopled Englaud
prefer a limited Monarchy, and with that on,Aristocreey
for en Arirtocracy is a neceesOrY pert of a limited Mo-
narchy. The people of England ,are treat heertilaa they
love their institutions. I wish well to the right* ofjhe
people, cud by those rights I sin resolved to live, being
really to perish with three rights and for them ; been's.),
forone, too* those rights are understood by the people„,
and ere appropriate to their character and temper. Limited
Monarchy, and Aristocracy, are the hest security far, these
right*, and T for oue wish for no oltange. I wish .fur'„ pu
revolution ; and I speak I am sure the sentiments of tint
great hulk of the people, who love the institutions of their
country, who love Monarchy and love Nobility; becau.e,
with the 6044 and liberties of the'peopla themselves, these
ere all knit up together. They have I strong attschment,
Mere, to our forrn of Gownment; lad for my men
part,' I declare that I Wonld infinitely rather, if all thee
must perish, perish with them, than survive to read on
the ruins the memorable Nemo of the instability of the
best loimeu institutions." The life of the Honourable
and Learned Gentleman is of too much value to the
country to be rashly exposed; but we are not in any
greet alarm on account of his threat of perishing with
Aristocracy, rather than survive it. We wish we
could see as favourable s prospect of the wee" of his,
plan for restoring the Constitution to the state of hastiglnal
purity as of the touluraoce of the ot,jcet of his love. But
what does Mr. Brougham mean by attachment to Aristo.
ciao, ? If ha means that every peso should he protected
in the enjoyment of his property, whether large; or small,
and that the posseslorre of large property should be as
astute as the possessors demon properties, his attachment,:
is a Air and rational one. Hot Who means that the psi*.
seniors of large properties should also be allowed to invade,
the property of others, in order to Ferret the disintott.
herment of their own, we demur to hit proposition. Mr.
Brougham must either submit a proposition calculated to
secure the property. of the many from the invasion of the ..
few, or a proposition calcalated to perpetuate the advantage'
Which the few now enjoy at the ea:prose of the many. One
or the other of these he nowt do—hoth he cannot. We
answer for it that it his plot go to wrest from the'
Aristocracy the power they at present stijoY of filling, the
house of Common* with their noininee, it will lie laughed
at by them. The Doke of Wellington, though be can.:.
not say such fine things in praise' of the d‘ilstocracii`
Will find a much readier access to their fay'reor
who tells them that the Constitution, 111 it is, isMO
unaceptible of isuProvemint, is sure, the stica'‘iik,
ul weer. The Aristueranl are quite satisfied
they are. Itlr. Broitibein .'hiW a Pei/11444 tongue;'
but it will rteittife dettl rowiu fu pet. $O4