The Sun.
London, England, 1839-04-24 00:00:00

JOINT-STOCK BANKS.

—.-
Mr. HUME gave notice, that to-morrow evening he
would ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer what course
he meant to take with respect to Joint-Stock Banks ;
because he (Mr. Hume) had deferred a motion relative
to the Bank of England, in expectation that the Right
Hon. Gentleman would make some statement regarding
tkose Banks.
SCOTCH UNIVERSITIES.

Sir JAMES GRAHAM inquired when the Report
of the Commissioners appointed to inquire into the
Scotch Universities would be laid upon the table of the
_House ? .

t
n Air. FOX MAULS said the Report relating to
Glasgow was now in print, and would be laid upon the
table as soon as it was ready.
MANNING OF THE NAVY.

Sir E. CODRINGTON said that the question he
Was about to bring forward was one of great public
importance, and attention had been recently drawn to
it because it had been brought before the• House as a
party question—(Hear,hear)—andhe hoped that those
gentlemen who felt doubtful as to the propriety of his
new bringing it before the House would recollect what
they had said on that occasion. He should, at the
conclusion of his speech. move the following resolu-
tion :—" That the system of reducing the crews of her
Majesty's ships, in time of peace, below the number re-
quired to make them efficient in time of war, is inju-
rious to the best interests of the service ; and that it is
the opinion of this House, that all her Majesty's ship,
when actively employed, or about to quit the British
Channel, should in future have but one complement of
men, whether in peace or war." In discussing the
Navy Estimates many observations had been made as
to the necessity of keeping the,Navy in an efficient state
for war purposes. Each side of the House had ac-
cused the other of deteriorating the Nary ; and he be-
lieved what each side had said of the other. The R;ght
Hon. Bart opposite had said a great deal about
the number of ships which he had launched,
and various other things which he had done. He (Sir E.
Codrington) verily believed that that Right Hon.
Ihronet had conduced, rather than otherwise, to the de-

nefficient crews. Captain Broke, who took the Chesa-
peake, always destroyed his prizes rather than weaken
his force, as he knew that he must depend solely on the
efficiency of his crew. When his (Sir E. C.'s) ship was
paid off at that tine, he had been ordered to select '2O
of his crew to be sent on board the Endymion. He did
so ; and what was the consequence of the Endymion
being efficiently manned ? She met the American fri-
gate Prei•ilelt and captured her, although she was a
larger ship. Captain Berkeley hod pressed this subject
on the attention of the Admiralty ; his colleagues agreed
with him ; and because the Under Secretary chose to
put cut a hook supporting a contrary opinion,
the landsman's opinion ; and Captain Berkeley
answered hirn, that officer was dismissed. This
was not the case with the Army ; they. were not
governed in this way ; nor would the Navy, if they
possessed the same influence as the Army. They should
have at their head a person unbiassed by party, as the Army
had. His conviction was, and he believed it was the convic-
tion of every naval man, that no ship should go out of
the Channel for foreign service without being fully
manned. If any ship was lost in battle, or upon a lee
shore, in consequence of their paltry savings, he should
feel bound to say that it was no saving at all ; the great
point of importance, in his opinion, was the saving of
the lives of the men. It was utterly useless sending
out ships at all unless they were properly manned. He
had been induced to bring forward his motion because
he fully believed from the statements they would fully
concur with him in its necessity. If, however, he was
deceived in that, it was the fault of Hon. Members,
and not his. He could not, however, believe that any
Member would be so false to the sentiments he had ex-
psersed of doing justice to the Navy. The Hon. and
Gallant Member concluded by making the motion of
which he had given notice.
Lard INGESTRIE seconded the motion. He was
delighted to have an opportunity of agreeing with the
Gallant Admiral on this subject, although differing with
him in politics. He had had the honour of sailing under
the Gallant Officer, who had led him to victory, and he
had no doubt he would do so again. There appeared
to be on this subject what in a nautical phrase would be
called a lull ; he was glad, however, that the Gallant
Admiral seemed determined to change that lull into a
sharp breeze.—(Laughter.) He could see no reason,
looking at the state in which this country was placed,
almost in a state of war with Canada, America, and
India, why her ships should not be properly manned.
What was the state of the officers of the Navy ? He
would venture to say such as would not be tolerated by
any other nation in the globe, and the men, in coi;se-
quence of the vessels being so indifferently manned, had
their work greatly increased ; they were deprived of
their regular rest, and had very inadequate pay.
To show the state of the Navy of this country,
as compared with others, lie need only advert to
a circumstance that had occurred to himself some time
since. He was on the coast of Malaga, alongside an
American corvette ; she had twenty guns, and the vessel
in which he was carried twenty-eight, yet that corvette
had forty-six more men than he had.—(Hear, hear.)
He should like to know if the Navy of this country were
allowed to remain in the state in which it was at present,
where sailors would be got ready cut and dried in the
event of a war. He thought that in manning the navy
the Admiralty ought to look to the future as well as
the present ; be considered that it would be well to
introduce a system of apprenticeship in the Navy.—
(Hear.) He trusted that the Gallant Officer would not
only press his motion to adivision but would carry hispoint.
There ought to be more officers, as well as more men,
sent to sea, and he was sure the country would cheer-
fully agree to the supplies necessary for this increase,
whether in ships or men, for the Navy had still strong
claims upon the gratitude of the country. He felt
strongly upon this subject, and had great pleasure in
seconding the motion of the Hon. and Gallant Admiral.
Mr. WOOD protested against the introduction of
questions connected with the naval and military es-
tablishment in such a manner. He had hoped from
the opinions that had been expressed before in the
House against it, that he should not have had again
to complain. The Right Hon. Baronet opposite com-
plained that the Noble Lord opposite said it was
wrong,' and then he went into details.—(Laughter.)
This was not a question of censure on the Board of
Admiralty, but the Hon. and Gallant Admiral and
the Noble Lord called upon the House of Commons,
whether competent or not, to condemn the system
that had been adopted by every distinguished officer
that sat at the Board of Admiralty daring the peace,
and there had been practised by all the experienced
officers at the Board, from Lord Howe and Lord
St. Vincent to Sir Thomas Hardy and Admiral
Dundas, all of whom recommended reduced es-
.ablishments in time of peace. He thought the

House of Commons should not be called upon to pro-
nounce its opinion in this manner. His Hon. and
Gallant Friend had said, that if the Captains of the
Navy were referred to, they would be of his opinion.
It was well known that Captains always wanted more
men, whether in war or otherwise, but against this he
would put the conduct of the experienced Admirals he
had mentioned ; however, it was a fact, that
.these
complements were now higher than at any former pe-
riod ; in fact they were very near the war complements
of former times. The complement of a fist-rate man
of war now was 220 higher than in 1815 ; that of a
second-rate was 95 higher than in 1816, and that of a
third-rate, was 48 higher. He would omit fourth-
rates, and take the same ships, of which there could be
no doubt. Now, the Macedonia, for example, a fifth-
rate, had nine nice more in her peace complement than
she had when_tbe action referred to was fought, but

the Hon. and Gallant Officer's object would be not to
stand upon peace complements, but to send ships to sea
always ready for action—whatever might be the pros-
pect of peace or war. He (Mr.',W.) would readily
admit that ships ought to be efficiently manned for
the service they had to perform ; but to maintain
either an Army or a Navy in full war strength in time
of peace, when there was no prospect of war,
would be absurd and an useless waste of men and mo-
ney. In war ship's companies had often to fight with
their guns during a long action, to protect their decks,
and to work exposed to a lee shore, but in peace they
had none of those things to do ; and it was a complaint
that many of our ships suffered by laxity of discipline
while lying in harbour for the protection of our com-
merce. He had no apprehension of a sudden break-
ing out of war, as spoken of by his Hon. and Gallant
Friend ; in:leed war never broke out so suddenly but there
was time enough to send out the necessary nurnberof men
to any squadron. On a foreign station there was ge-
nerally no difficulty of getting men ; and one Com-
mander had lately informed !sim that he felt more
difficulty in refusing men than in getting them.
His Hon. and Gallant Friend had talked of the diffi-
culty he had encountered in fighting the battle of Na•
varino with reduced complements ; but such a contin-
gency was not likely to occur again, and if he had fought
the battle with so much credit to himself with a peace
complement, surely a similar number would not be in-
adequate for the ordinary duties of peace. The battle
of Algiers was fought with a considerable number of
ships on the peace complement. It was not that peace
complements were not merely to be regarded on the
score of economy ; he believed that if 2,000 men more
were to be voted by the House, that it would be more
advantageous to employ them in sending out a larger
number of ships than in filling up the complements. As
our commerce was amply protected, it could not be
well complained that too many ships were sent
to sea ; in fact, so large a number of ships were
necessarily kept at sea, in order to afford the
officers the menus of acquiring a practical education,
and not, as might be considered to give patronage to
the Admiralty. He did think that the returns which had
recently been made by the Admiralty showed that, so far
from the crews being of so inferior a description, the
number of aisle seamen now in her Majesty's ships was
larger in proportion than at any former period ; for-
merly the proportion was one-third able seamen, one-
third ordinary seamen, and one-third landsmen ; however
since 1834 it had been 64 able seamen, 32 ordinary
seamen, and four landsmen per cent. ; this proportion
even was exceeded in some circumstances. In 1835,
Captain Hyde Parker, who would not be suspected of
a partial rating of men, stated that the proportion in
the Rodney was 83 per cent, of able seamen, and . no
landsmen. In 1838, the 27 per cent, was reduced to
23, amongst whom were several that had been trained
from boyhood in the service ; the Noble Lord was also
wrong when he stated that large ships took a longer time
to man ; now, since they came to the Admiralty, an 18
sun
ship took a longer time to man than the Vanguard or
any other ship. He would admit that desertions were;
generally very frequent from ships on the home sta-
tion. They had not taken any great precautions to
punish such men, but it was not on account of hard
work that they generally deserted. But is 1836 the
desertions from Sir Charles Parker's squadron were
less than in 1835 or 1837. It very often happened
that when a seventy-four was under the necessity of
unbending her sails, the Pique, which was under-
manned, was under no such necessity. He had been
assured by Commodore Douglas, that when he was
lying with the French, his ships' crews, and which
were less than the French, always performed their
work quicker. The Hon. Member read extracts from
letters, to show that zeal for the service had very
much declined in Officers immediately after the war,
and that the discipline of old Officers was much inferior
to the present system in general, whence he concluded
that less blame was attributable to the Navy at present,
either on the score of zeal or of discipline, than would
be inferred from the speeches of the Hon. Gentleman.
It was well known that these letters were addressed to

The order of the day for hearing Counsel against the
Jamaica House of Assembly Suspension Bill was then
read, and
Mr. Sergeant MEREWETHER appeared on be-
half of the people of Jamaica, and proceeded to ad-
dress the House. The Learned Sergeant said he ap-
peared for the five hundred petitioners against the
Bill, all of $1 hom were closely connected with the
island ; and he should endeavour to show that the
Imperial Parliament ought not, in wisdom and in policy,
to pass this Bill. He could not trust himself to cha-
racterize this measure. Its effect would be wholly to
destroy the popular portion of the Constitution of
Jamaica. He was sure that, addressing as he did, an
assembly, which stood as a barrier between the encroach-
ments of the Crown on the one hand and the people on
the other, a deep sense would be entertained of the
awful importance of this question. To subvert a Con-
stitution was a serious measure. It was a measure
which would not be adopted towards a country which
lay under our arms ; a conquered nation would not have
its own laws and Constitution abolished in so summary
a manner. Yet this was the measure which was to be
acted upon towards one of our most faithful and most
valuable Colonies. What justification could be al-
leged for such a measure. The idea of punish-
ment was quite out of the question ; for no
crime had been charged—certainly none attempted
to be proved ; and the notion of political
necessity was equally groundless. The House of As-
sembly had not refused to legislate until some condi-
tion had been fulfilled which the Imperial Parliament
could not grant. The Assembly had only appealed
to the justice of their Sovereign. They had justly
declared that they found it impossible to legislate, be-
cause their functions had by the Government been
improperly interfered with. It was an error in the in-
dividual now ;exercising the: executive functions in
Jamaica, to suppose that theie were seventeen laws re-
quiring renewal, and this error had been removed by
the Colonial Secretary, who stated in his dispatch there

A large party of emigrants, comprising many of
the principal tradesmen of Chichester and their families,
are about to take their departure for South Australia.

BALLOON ASCENT.—On Monday evening a
candidate for aeronautic fame, made his first ascent from
the gardens of the Standard Tavern, Shepherdess-walk,
City-road. The inflation being completed the ascent took
place a few minutes before six, having in the car Mr.
Gypson, the proprietor, Mrs. Brady, the wife of the pro-
prietor of the gardens, and Mr. Henry Green, who took
the management of the machine. The latter excited con-
siderable notice and apprehension from the crowd, on ac-
count of his temerity of standing on the hoop at the bottom
of the balloon until the machine went out of sight. The
balloon soon disappeared behind a cloud, and took a direc-
tion towards Essex.