The Sun.
London, England, 1863-02-13 00:00:00

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT

HOUSE OF LORDS—Last Evening.
The LORD CD.ANCELLOR took his seat on the woolsack
at file o'cicck. _

ROME.
Earl RUSSELL said the noble lord opposite (Nor-
rnanby) had a motion on the paper respecting Rome for
Monday next. He had to ask him to postpone proceeding
with it until the following day.

The Marquis of NORNIAIsiBY said he had great plea-
sure in complying with the request of the noble earl; Tues-
day would suit him equally well.

TRAFFIC IN THE CITY,
Lord CHELMSFORD moved the first reading of a bil
giving to the Lord Mayor additional powers with respect
to regulating the traffic in the City of London,

The bill was read a first time.
HARBOURS OF REFUGE.
Lord RAVENS WORTH called the attention of Govern-
ment to the report of the royal commission appointed to con-
sider the question of the harbours of refuge, and asked if

any steps were in progress to carry out the recommenda-
tiens of the commission which are contained in that re-

port. In doing so he said the subject was regarded with
the greatest interest by the shipping and commercial com-

munity. The report of the commission was of the utmost
tance; considering that on the average of six years the
amount of property lost amounted to no less than

£1,500,000, whilst the loss of human life for the same period
could not be less than 1,545, and the number of vessels
wrecked at least 800. It was the opinion of some \
that even if the harbours were made they would not an-
swer the purpose for which they were intended ; but he
should like to know from the noble duke opposite
whether he participated in that opinion, as also whether
the Government regarded the matter in the same light.
It was also said that the shipowners regarded the matter
with dislike, because it was supposed that these harbours
of refuge would afford the seamen opportunities of loiter-
ing and idling their time away, instead of proceeding
on the voyage. It was easy to discuss the question
in cold blood, whilst it was not so easy for a crew to take it
so if caught in a storm off a dangerous coast, where
there was not a single port for them to fly to for safety. He
did not know a case more in point than the loss of the
unfortunate vessel the Lifeguard. A harbour of refuge
might have been the means of preventing such terrible
disasters. A great deal might be said for the shipowners,
inasmuch as they (the legislature) had some years back de-
prived them of protection, and exposed them on their own
shores to competition of foreigners who had the materials
for building much cheaper. It was not to be wondered
that, to meet such keen competition, ships not quite sea-
worthy were despatched on their voyages, and when a storm
overtook them the value of a harbour into which they could
run for safety would be inestimable. The Lifeboat Institu-
tion had been the means of immense benefit, and he could
not forbear mentioning Miss Burdett Coutts' name for the
manner in which she had supported that laudable institu-
tion. The noble lord then referred to resolutions carried
in the Government of 1859, which was to the effect that the
recommendations of the commission ought to be carried out,
and remarked that notwithstanding that strong expression
of opinion nothing had been done. Now, however, there
was a surplus in the exchequer, and he sincerely hoped that
something would be done to effect so great a benefit, and
thus give some protection to the shipping of the country,
and in doing so it might be possible to employ many per-
sons now suffering great distress in Lancashire in the con-
atruction of these works.

The Duke of SOMERSET said the subject was sur-
rounded with the greatest difficulty, but he was most
anxious that all the security possible should be given to the
shipping interests. There were, however, other questions
besides those of humanity. It was true that the Royal
Commissioners recommended the erection of harbours, but
there was another recommendation, that the expenses should
be borne, viz., one-fourth by the Government and three-
fourths by passing tolls. Subsequently the shipowners ob-
jected to passing tolls, while the local ports, which were to
be made into harbours, objected to being made liable for
some part of the expense. In fact everybody wanted
the money to be spent, but did not like to con-
tribute anything. Another question also to be considered
was, in the event of these harbours being made, whether it
would not be necessary to have them supplied with means
of defence, and to do that a great outlay would become ne-
cessary. By comparing the different parts of the coast on
which shipwecks took place, it would be found that it was not
at those particular places named for harbours of refuge that
the greatest loss of life occurred. The works at Dover,
Portland, and Holyhead were fast progressing towards
completion, and when they were thoroughly completed he
thought they would afford great facilities for the protection
of life and property. As to the question of convict labour,
Portland was a very convenient place for the employment
of convict labour; but some thought that free labour was
quite as cheap. A most important recommen-
dation made by the commissioners in 1858 was
that provision should be made for the raising of loans
for the construction of harbours. An Act was passed for
that purpose, and half a million had been already taken up
under that Act. Five places had been already aided by
loans, and several others were looking for help and he be-
lieved a great number wculd avail themselves of the assist-
ance. He thought it much better that local exertion should
be used than that Government should do all the work. But
he did not think that the saving of life would be much.
Bad ships ill-found would be sent on voyages in which
harbours of refuge were conveniently situated. He thought
the Government had not neglected their duty in regard to
the subject, although they could not go the extent the
commissioners wished them to go.
Lord RAVENSIVORTH said that the loss of life on
the west coast of Scotland, mentioned by the noble duke,
must have been caused by loss of fishermen's boats. There
was no trade on that coast.
The Duke of SOMERSET had taken the loss of life from
the returns, but after all those returns did not give a true
idea, for one large ship lost upon a coast swelled up the
number. (Hear, hear.) The Wick people wanted only a
fishing boat harbour, and he hoped it would be constructed,
but he could not pledge the Government to anything.
TICKETS OF LEAVE. _

The Earl of M ALM ESBURY asked for papers relative
to the case of a felon to whom a commutation had been
granted.
Earl GRANVILLE was understood to promise them.

The Duke of MARLBOROUGH asked it his noble friend
had ascertained as yet whether Redpath wes .t large on a
ticket of leave either in this country or in a colony, and
whether he can at any time return to this country.
Earl GRANVILLE replied that Redpath had been
transported to Western Australia. When a rumour
reached this country that he was at large, his noble friend
inquired at the II ome Department. No answer had been
received from the colony as yet, but with regard to Red-
path's return to this country it was quite impossible.
The Duke of NEWCASTLE said that Itedpath would
not have been entitled in this country, or under the ordi-
nary rules in a penal colony, to a ticl et of leave until about
this time. but the governor of Western Australia had
adopted a new system of marks of good conduct. by which
Redpath, having obtained the number requisite to procure
his ticket of leave, had been enabled to get it long before
the time at which he might have become entitled under the
ordinary system. He might observe, in reply to observa-
tions which had been made upon the conduct of th 3 right
hen. baronet, the Secretary of State for the Home Depart-
ment, that Sir George Grey had nothing to do with the
matter further than that, when Redpath, having obtained
the ticket of leave, applied for a conditional pardon, his ap-
plication came before the Home-office, and Sir G. Grey, so
far from granting it, asked how the convict had obtained
his ticket of leave so soon.
The Earl of DERBY believed that a ticket of leave in a
colony left men strictly under the supervision of the Go-
yes ntnent and the police, whereas in this country it meant
quite a different thing. He understood a ticket of leave in
a colony was only a kind of secondary punishment.
The Duke of NEWCASTLE said that was not the case.
The convict was not employed n Government works when
he had his ticket of leave. If he were a servant he could
not leave his master's house without permission. If living
in his own house he should be in before 10 o'clock at night,
and he was under tke surveillance of the police; but that
was all. Redpath was in his own house. He was receiv-
ing from his wife, who was in this country, an annuity of
20(.) a year.
The house adjourned at 20 minutes after six o'clock.

ROUSE OF COMMONS--Last Evening.
The Symaxtu took the chair at four o'clock.
STAN DING ORDERS.
On the motion of Col. W. PATTEN, the following were
nominated the select committee on standing orders .—Col.
Wilson Patten, Mr, Walpole, Mr. Henley, Mr. Wrightson,
Mr. Herbert, Mr. Bramston, Mr. Bonham-Carter, Mr.
Lefroy, Mr. Dunlop, Mr. Pullen, and Mr. E. Egerton.
COMMITTEE OF SELECTION.
Qn the motion of Col. WILSON PATTEN, the following
Committee of Selection was nominated—Mr. Dunlop, Mr
llerbal, Mr. Bonham-Carter, Lord Hotham, Mr. Mow.
bray, and the Chairman of the Select Committee on Stand.
ing Orders.