The British Press; or, Morning Literary Advertiser.
London, England, 1809-04-29 00:00:00

110 USE or COMMov4.

The ilerinly i'llier of the Black lio.l ioiritmonerl the
House to the Wing., of Lords, to hear Slit ko)al .1.14,4,11
(iron by Commission to certain Dill.

(1111tlit SecAst r.te. rt•turst he istoren.,l the {louse, that
thiltv!al Assent 1414 tt .-s giveu to Ih. 1. att Flat Seed Bill,
the Link...pens' Altus/atter Ball, the itlrlt Step, Distillery
and osiers! wieate Iii:11.
The Gag l.iiht t'tsn:tatay Bill sus read • second time. mil'
akycnnwt.

Au Aeconat of the Chown fie manaeitix the Public Debt
wu presented, mid ordered is lie on the Table.
Ste C.:l4mi e.:4 Gut an, it ;unposed tbe third rsarl,wg of the
Manchester Water ilsorls Rill, iii 41,11,1 E which he took or.
canion W colocree, that he had been charged w;th irregularly
hurrying' forward the Bill ; hr disclaimed hating ever takes •
an unfair advantage, any he had ever submitted to the
Dowse, or having ever rhesus marks M iiwivility to any
Member. lie was wholly uninterested is the present Bill,
and newer expected it would have been opposed.
• 11r. nwrn spoke ae..:.l‘t the BiU; lint did not think
any Meirdier had attributed improper motives to the 114,-
wooralile Gentleman who now proposed the third reading.
Mv. HAWKINS BROWN r supported the Bill.
Mr. PATTI:v considered the !Jill Ps ohm/slow to the.
inhabitants of Marieliest.e, and therefoie proposed, " That
it slionld pe re:id a second time nu this day six moottil."
After ,111111 e conversation, in whirls Mr. Spencer stauhopr,
Air James Hall, Sir Oswald Iltieley and General Turter,m,
spoke in faun or erf the Bill; and Sielt obese Perk, Mr. 3.,:,0.
coal., Mr. Blackburn', and Mr. H. Hilbert, 'post it, the
House when there arreted.
Vir the Bill on
Against ,t 4,1

$ • • 19
T•poon oar re•:ohnivolios we fooswi Mr Ili • Rl'
DrUnlinit n Claw,e whitio Ind Lren a•141(41 to the illArtfroar,'
Sl.tdae Ton whieli hr mowed' on •roroarnent, that
ingtovil of it. Jorat• being ext. to .-0 ears, it shook'
It limited to aloe

Mr. DA v.; rs Ggneir oppo•efl the furthrr promisor the
Bill Flt conreirtil that prrawri w IH) were evolirted M thew
bottles throurhout the ...cell, should be &Pawed to take rut
excarsina nut 3owday without being sohject..d to a tjX.
W.OlOll be more
saintly levied upon tho.N. wi.o could 'Mord to
ride through the terapike every o.lberAlit .
Arr. Suwst that foray >can ago Pathdtaeat had
arprvted of tit,; aoSsa. pledg.• ;stony person. had


Imes induced to give credit to Ilse mono. of 12,040 t who,
, if this Bill wee ticketed, could soar be paid, add they would
mismequattly. he defrauded of their money.
- ' Mr. Cann en thogght the anieudisitint of the Hos. Gen,
liensaw(Me. limbed) should he adopted, us in the course
a air lee monfleis many .I.ffiroliirs 'taint be obviated, and
the Boise rendered more capable of deciding upina the
*object.
Mr. Set:store BOURN, said a fear words in favour of the
asnewdment when the Gallery was cleared for a division,
whirls, however, did out take plaeii; the atueinhocut, Its we
wodnotaurt, baying been agreed to, tad the !filtered a third
time sod poised.
Mr.Wi !Ascii Ponce, in pursuance o(Cnntiee he hail given,
moved**. leave to hying in a 11111 Cr the purpose of rigid- •
teriiii and mewing Charitable bansitions fur the Iletiofit of
Pertains in Eneland.—Lemc granted
A Message from the Home of boils informed the House
that their Li rlships had agreed to the Nuvy Conip.issionate
List Bill, the S.otch Records Ball, and several private '
Bills.
The Loan ADVOrATE of SrcerLAslD obtained leave to
brine i it a bill to mitelid and ranks. Wore effectual the Local
M.:.tta of Scotland.
ORDERS IN COUNCIL.
hlr. Wtorritacto rose to ask a Right llononnetle
Gentleman opposite, whether it was true that the
Orders in Council had beet, rescinded ?
Mr. PERCLVAL replied, that they had not been
altogether rescinded, hut were now in an altered
state ; some of them still remained in full force.
MISAPPLICATION 01, PUBLIC MONEY.
Lord Ilexes' PETTY teat in pursuauce Of the
natio, he gave last 'light, to call the attention or
the Howe tai it subject of equal importance to any
! of their most valuable privileges; it was the appro-
, twisting of public moor v. without the consent of
Plirliament. It simmered by the ors:omits laid be-
fore the House. that in the month of May last, It
slim of money had been puid during tine tune Par-
liament were sifting, and without their being con-
sulted upon its propriety, to Forciipi Ministers; in
that mouth 5,0001. was granted for the purpose of
bringing Portuguese eimgrauts, and subsequently
other grants till the whole atnomited to 85,0001..
Ile was not prcpurerl to state whether the measure
was expedient or not, butt thus much he was en-
titled to say, that no ste,;la sum of motley had ever
been voted by thetn, end it was his object to %io-
dic-ate their rights. Ile hail no occasien to press
the importance of the subject on the attention of
the House, fee since the vevolutinn. whenever any
departure bum the roles of the House had taken
place in the uorropriation of public money, it had
elways lweil noticed as a deviation oily to he pal-
listed by circumstances of necessity. In cases of
iiiresior Importance to this. Parliament had niter-
fereil, and snacked such deinitions. as would be
found iii their proceedings (lithe t;eh Nlerela, 1711,
1 where the money was only transferred from nue
i sere ice to smother, which it is now the practice to
allow, in consequence of our extension of territory ;
and the embarrassments of vim renderiug it cell-
. fienit to act upon the old regulations of the coo-
'titration. But the teams, lie found fault in this
hemmer, was, that this irregularity haul taken place
without any necessity, or any pretence of necessity
~whatever, and it was the particular duty of Parlia-
ment to watch. that thew general rules were out
subverted. From the jealousy of our ancestors, 4 vote
of credit load never been heart of till the year 1720,
'main the year 1737, that haul been 'united to the
slam at which it minion( d to the present slay. The
misapplication *.limb he complained of was similar
bra misapplication fluting the Amerieati war, which
was justified on a plea of necessity. such a plea
Could net now be' made out. He hoped he should
tint he told that the sinalltiess of the stun .5,0001.
snide it unnecessary to cousult Parlisinent. and
t1,41)1 to justify what he should deetu by Ins vote a
dangerous attack on their privileges, nod neat
. thing to levying taaes without their consent ; whe-
ther the sitni were large arsenal it westifu•Aly their
dilly to watch. It wits wholly out of his power to
anticipate The defenee could lie set tip, but he felt
that they should mark their reprobation of such
practices, and would therefore submit a Itesolutioc,
the words of which were taken from other cases,
" That tlw applying any sums, appropriated or un-
appropriated, without the consent • of Parliament,
is a miliapplieation of the public money, and dun-*
gerous to the privileges of the House..".
Mr. Peat real. saw, that the Noble Lord seemed
to think thst there was no preeeilent for the tips
propitiation of publie money. similar to that of
which he complained; but Timor we're such cases
where money has been waisted for Unexpected ser-
vices, and during the sittitu of Pod Cunene, and that
moodily, without any notice being taken of it, and
lie had not erimplained of it, because the esigew, •
of the demands made it neeesiary. Here an appli-
oration hail liven iii;itte for relief to the Portuguese
Emigrants, soft two sums had been issued on the '
•.tth May and the Ad of June, to Mr. Chinnery,
Nlonsieor de 50U7.1, for that purpow. Ile con-
tended that thew. Iwo issues were U 4 fair an coyest-
ilit ore of army estraurdioaries as could possibly
arse. Upon Ow representatibn of the Portuguese
fioremMeut, that many loyal men %fluid emigrate..
if they could null an asyluii, these stuns *ere
issued to defray the iv expense% and the whole fault
i appeored to be merely hs the form : for It iii the
i stuns been drawn oust for the service of our allies
al' war. instead of Monsieur de Sousa, lie be-
! tiered it would not be doubted, but they might
I
Ibe fairly drawn for by tise Commissary.--
The \vide Loyd talks of looney voted he Parini-
, 'tient for one purpose, and applied to anotlisr and
1 distinct object. Now I r•outeud that the Issue of
' the money 111 qmstion Is strictly mid properly a
part of the army extrannlinarirsir—(Hear ./ hear!).
What are we going to do this eveniiio ? We are
' about to vote the unny extmonlinaries for the pre-
sent year, so far forth as they ran be properly esti-
mated. Does the Noble Lord menu to say, that
under this head rt. mulles is to Le voted but such
as the appropriation of olifirh can be specified?—
If he the, not, why word hi, motion in the manner
he has done? Ail-such sums so are exii.nitleil lie-
cowl the sum ap•C;tied its limo factious grant of the
Him-.e twist be vatral, untl lie could not think the
Noble Lord 'winos who had himself ..eteill in the
like manner ausiiig the period he *its in office.—
, Every's-ow. brie that army estraordinaries must
burr been riaTil during tlie.course of the tireseut
year, •ahil yet they were mot voted till this evening.
Every' one must remember the distrussion which
I took teL e upon the illysisra of money by the late
Mi:Vita, wider the head of the army extraordinas
ri.Qto the b'
ra'nch emigrants and the *Conde troops.
11e had no doubt hot the measure was fully jos-
tiara' at the time ; it was, huwever, evident, it came

strictly under. novel bead of expense, inasmuch
as it was motley advanced to a new ally at the
commencement of a war, and it was hecessanly
done secretly, us the only means of seeu ring, ito SJIC•
CebS ; bet in the present instance, the money was
advanced upon toe ground of repeated prem.-
demo—l:or instance, in the year 1007 money
was ads:weed to Mr. Cliiiinery, to he paid
over to Count Muuster and Mr. Best, fur the pur-
pose of being applied m Hanover; and in like
manner, its the year 1006 ; atld both years the
money was advanced in different sew and in va-
rioue months, both during the Pianist of Parlia-
ment and its prorogation. Yet this money had not
beets previously voted by Parliament; and lie con-
sidered it so similar to the present. and a prece-
dent so completely-in point, as to be astonished ut
the motiou coming from the geartet it did. In the
present instance Miuisters had taken care to spe-
cify the description of persons to be relieved, both
during the sitting of Parliament and after its
; the propriety, therefore, of the relief litho&
ell was nut, he conceived, disputed ; but merely
aehether, where repeated necurrencea -offered for
advancing money not specitieolly voted, Ministers
were bound to come to Parliament every time they
found it necessary to make such advances. He
hoped he lied satisfied the House that the oeca-
sion complained of was no misapplication of the
army extraoolintiries, and therefore, instead of
negeliriug the motion, he should move the pre-
vious question.
Mr. Thome contended, that the advance of
the money in question, could not be brought to.
fall under any of the heads under which it was at-
tempted to justify it. Where was the similitude
between this and the case of Hanover alluded to,
by the Right Hon. Geittleinale. In that Lowe, we
bad either au twiny, or had military operations in con-
templation, and the money was scot ler the purposes
of recruiting ; but the present bud nothing what-
ever to do with any thing in any shape inilitarv. •
But it was said to have been tolvanced for the
assistance of our allies! He certainly %%Wm.(
its much as any man to relieve their necessities,
bsitwhen lie saw 150,0001. voted for emigrants, and
afterwards no less a sum than 85,0001. approptiated
to the slime description of persons, this he could
not coosider any thing else than a cheat on tile
house. It was. however contended, that all this
cosine regularly under the head of Arniy Extraor-
dinuiries. . This he could not but consider as most
extraordinary indeed, that Portuguese, alto were
no soldiers, nor intended for fighting, oa the con-
trary, who were solely meditating Hight to the
Brazils, should fall under a telt a Aestoinination. It
even appeared, that part of this money WAS paid for
their transportation, while we boasted we were in
possession of Portugal, dcleitilino, it for our ally
against french iu.aders ; • these then were our
description of soldiers which the Right Hon. Gen-
tleman might 1w able to explain, he could not.—
The array extraordinariee of last year were voted on
the oath of May, sod it appears that the first mints
advanced upon flu, acco 1111 l were on the opt!, pre-
ceilina, meet yet nut dieelosicre whatever woe made
of the fact, or the necessity or iiiteurion of any'
further iolvence. Whet war meant by army ex-
traordinalies, but sueli nuins es might be foretell'
would be wanting for military VW /016/1 ; he should
th ertfiee he sorry that any alienation were made its
a word of the motion. The army estruordinaries of
hest year amounted to ',oleos a sum than 2r.heio.oool.
and t!ie vote of credit was for .2,200,0001 !rut he
very much emulitell whether there would not i.e
found a difference upon the latter account and the
auto iictmilly eel...mulled which akiwitifiapell it to no less
an amount than 4.100.0001. I Its. theitt. lious. Gent.
stopped :it the fi5,0001. said to he ao exprodi,l ?
which *mild esrell it to no less an amount
than hits the Right lion. Gentleman
stopped at :his totatoul. said to be expended ? Ire
rather thought he had not ; he rather theuklit it
would turn out that above 100,0001. has begot ex-
pended in transporting Portuguese to the Brazils.
(hut what have we to ill) with that? Ministers have
only to give what money they war think proper,
and then put it into the Army Extraordinaries;
and if any one Amid.' dare to complain of their so
doing. why then he must be a very extraordinary
fellow indeed ! Thug was the only ground of de-
fence he could possibly conceive, could be set up
by Minister, ; mid if this be not a swipes ground
for the motion lie did not know what wits. With
respect to the transaction of the tate Mr. 'Pitt,
alluded to by the (tight Han. Gentleman, the
differeuce between that and the present was this,
that there publicity might be longer, but here no
earthly hasp could lie imagined by a public dis-
closure of the transaction to the whole world. He
should say no snore on the subject, as he could not
conceive whet other defence could be set tip but
that made by the Right Lion.Cleestlesnan ; except
it should be contended that, as the money had
been put into hie army estroordimiries, therefore it
was army extritortlinories.
Mr. PRIICEVAL said a few words in explanation,
(holy hilt he had likened the gale of Mr. Pitt to the
preseet.
Mr. Ilusxtsaots said, he agreed with the doctrine
bud down by the Nubile Lord, if attention were only
to be had to the theory of the Constitution, instead
of adverting tit what was the constaut practice un-
der all Adininistrations. The Noble Lord had set
out with the doctrine that .o money was to lie laid
nut by Alisaistere, during the sittiog of Parliament
but what was stipulated, and sanc,ioned by their
concurrences, but seeing this fail him, be lied
shifted his ground, and contended, that the money
in question did not come under the head of
army extraordiearies. It was also contended,
that the, ease of Ilsnover was to be justified on the
ground that there was tin army there. or at least
that an Aitary operations were in contemplation.—
In that case a very great similitude w.is to be
towed to the present. in both instances the conn-
trios were over-run by the French. in leo6, were
there soy military ()monitions in contemplation as
tuu Hanover? he insisted iipou'st there was amt. In
this respect, therefore, there were precisely the
same re mines for the conduct pursued in issuing
the money in both instances. Y et then there was a
regular advance every month, both in the sitting of
Parliament and oust of it, int even in that ceso,
admitting the iisiise was for military purposes; was
at not according to their own doctrine a tit subject
to come to Vorletinent upon let, this the
Noble Lord sad his cullesi;ues had not thoug!u: fit

to do. In the pflsseht instance, he was ready
to admit, that the French were in poseession of
Portugal for the space of •tiiree Mouth', before the
issues of money commenced. An invitation had
• been held out by our Admiral upon that station, to
all such naval and military characters es were %11-
ling to follow their Prince. to the Brazils. Now, if
directions had been given to the Transport-Bea:rd.
or the Corinnessariat Uepartineuts for the purpeee of
their convevance, would they quarrel with this tip-
pliention of the expense to the army *stetson:luta-
ries ? and yet, all Pie difference was, that the bun.
nests wis left to one, who best knew who were the
proper persons so to be couveyyd, and what waa.
necessary for that purpose. dierefort con-
' tended, it was properly Is military expenditure,
us growing out ef the events of the war. But the
account of the expense incurred upon the ()exteriors
was also made a *abject of quarrel ; it certhiuty ware
not foreseen it would *have been so considerable ; itt
was but fair, however, to recollect that the eutirer
of the expense was not to he put down to the at
count of the transporting the Portuguese to ths-
Brazils. The Portuguese ships of war had touched'
here iii their passage out, and that had incurrol
considerable pert of the expense. It was
that the first advance for tin* service was no the
Mae, and that the vote of credit was on the ,
• and it was therefor,' contention. that the huntress
colll4 31 &ought then to have .Iseen stated. To
this he should answer, it was not the preetict.,
and inganced the case, when the Noble Lord was
himself in office, of the Vote to the Elector of
Hesse Caste!. The fact was, that in practice no-
tiliog was brought into specification after the au-
coma was eh's, d which was intended to be laid be-
fore Parliament. According to the system pursued,
many things not strictly military were uceustonied
to he incl.:nett iu the Army Extraordineries: as for
iiistance, the sum of I ,suOl. to a Parliaments:l
Commissioner; this could only b* accounted
for as arising from the circumstances 'attsiidant
MI the war. Upon this principle, looking ut
the war of the period it was conducted by -the
Noble Lord and Ins colleagues, he found many si-
milar charges classed as the present was; mid hi:-
holing it was not seriously intended to clog the ope-
rations of the Government by the motion ; br coif-
sidered the Resolution as unneceesury, admitting at
the same time, that. every thing that possibly could,
ought to he regularly brought into estimate.
Mr. Tisanes' and Mr. Ilesnianott each said a
few word* in explanation.
Lord 11. Parry replied• to the arguments ad.
enticed against his motion. Ile could not but he
surprised at bring told, that his motion would
hare the effect of rendering it impossible to curry
nu the service of Government ; so far from it, it
was in the recollection of the House, that lie had
expressly admitted, that under oh circumstances
in which in later times we were placed, it would be
impossible For Ministers toapply to Parhument under
the Appropriation Act, with that degree of striet-
iiess required by it. All that lie ,:ontemted for wa,.,
that-they • ore bolierd to pest ire themselves to Parlia-
ment in every instance in which they e“tweivird them.
*elves under the neceasity of a deviation ; and that
R 4 Oily were so bound, it was right fur Parliament to
exceeds a constitutional jealousy by keeping a strict
hand over them. It seemed to be found out that any
esterase whatever that should be incurred, might
I.rclassed under the head of army extnioidinaries
as arising out of the war ; at that rate every miscel-
laneous grunt whatever may be termed so. Hr was
not prepared to enter into the particulars of the
money advanced to Coma Munster. bat would it be
ventured to be stated on the other side that it was
kilt for military porpoaeti ? On the dtuotrary, he
would assert that wilco the recruiting service was
going forward in(lanai er, et sit tiring con nected with
that business was purely twittery ; but the present,
if ever troy thing was, toted fir coasidered as the
complete reverse, it might be it call on their ougua.
tensity and humanity, and w retch he did ant mesa
to disapprove of it, he only quarrelled with the ap-
pellation beetowed upon it. Ile should, therefore,
.persevere after all that had beets said, in thinking.
that whatever other variation of pi imiple might be
necessary. the House was honed not to allow such

• sal...application of the teen, us that given the
appbration of this money. under the head army tx-
traordinarier.

Mr. WILLI sx SMITH considered the whole of
the arguments used alpinist the motion as i‘itiing
more than an argameoune ad humane , and, as
such, could be no justification fur the opposition
made to it. •

Air. PLICEVAL isid a few words in further ex-
planation; after which the p.v%ions question was
earriad without a division.

Mr. livicissonainved for le.ive to bring in a
Bill fur parkiiittiar; goevia brought into ()rent Bri-
tain on board prigs taken on the high sear. whe-
ther erin4l.rioned or reAoreti. to Ire kold without tit-
jug *object to the home-consumption duty.—Or-
dered.

Mr. Wit ItERFORCE brought in the Charitable
:inn:stint' Bill ; which was read r first time, and or-
dens! to be read a second nine or Wednesday next.
Sir JOHN NKWPURT moved, M That there be
laid before the House an account of all lunl4 ad-
vanced by the Treasury of Ireland for tailitiu pur-
poses since l793."—Ordered. Also " Au account
of all sums levied at assizes in Ireland for the like
purposes and within the 'alma period."

" COMMITTEE OF supply.
ARMY EXTRAORDINARIF.S.
The Cuasetxtua of the EXCIILQUER ntettolis-
That the !louse should go into a Committee sit
Supply ; and upon the motion of Mr. Illcsanisotre
it was ordered that the Army Estimates and an ac-
count of the Three per Cent. Annuities to be paid
off, should be referred to the said Committee.
The 'louse having gone into said Committee.
Mr. HUI\ MO )1 tamed that towords raising the
supply. it the opinion of this }louse, that the
sum of 2134291. 19s. 7d. he granted towurd• de-
fraying the extnionlimiry expetsaesof the uriby in-
curred mince the 25th of December. Kll7.
Mr, W HITIRVA 11 pot a gurstiun. :14 to how the
payments were made to the Dutch nifi:•eris abroad,
formerly iu the treryice of this COUlttf% might
be possible.. he thought, that some of them might
not lie in existence, mud that other person► were
substituted in their places.—He should be glad to
know how (men. Sontag, who was incl saitl to be in
Spain, mud who 11$4 entrusted a at. thtlr p:•) tuent,
procurx d roper c. l ii, atrt.

The grc
iv)itsitte 'Oa
There were
tube but,oti
au the haul
Mr-. MA I
it were deal
iu the iCEVII
LLL cuiir.
Vie SEC
iiondt Ogle o
attually utr
CllwuSly iii
T.t
or v 41.4 pa
Mr. Ilbs
ml ca.t. atm
-au pai.
ldi-. Weu
*let 4eretet
art with lir:
T'he'Sr.
.tire of hiu
kfttishortli
Ilutch
Wisr-Ofiive
that Apart

Mr. %1' 1;
that 114114011
!hi* iudirul
Mill Worthy
3,1 f. Wia
le•ittle IDI
ir imposer!
imps)
Nit. 10..;ni
11V/11E610y
eittru.t.

Mr. th•
Putt!) curl
A roicas. iu
per,,ot
Wzrrril I:y
r.
to k fitly, if
ting lita b.•:

Tie CY
nigh! be al
to tht tod.V
to Ow Coln.
Mr. Wha
fur the Se 7i
turua
Uify the
leis.' to hat
Mr. Cita
the name o
last Admit)
Otheeri
to 115,0Q31.
Mr. tVpt
what motor
to be told
vetuavtel,
orring at t
(haat a
TIN, attnt

Mr. ‘‘'t
fair from th
was far rho
They had
%hum, witF
thiatrioui ai
di* pea/lent
warts.

Mr. Win
peace Of Si
after we It
Uhl ti 4 prov
tirmnahle tl
trace
int. and
Lutz ofra
antler shot
sultjett.

Mr. CAN
Corer to.s.let
grout*, pre
gal ; and I
tlust Clere I
to this emu
Mr. W'r
with tka I
but though
presoml the
Oren made
The Res
'l'hr folk

That a sun
ratraurilia
I ',nano...
L n 9,563
1. J,7r.7,00
L 44,014),
die salary of
L• I at*, to
*lts of the P
laicrr of seam

1.. I6,.:11 St.
the Patish
The Cot
the Iteport
day next.
COW

The Hot
take into co
of Ways is
'Weed, qn I
suns of 2,7
(pence of
lie then
should be t
erred to.
The use
i4r, tool to.
The I lou
to be broil

Mr. 1V *I
thp intends
militnry At
his motion
Conituis.im
Fitt! been i
'1.1.141 ns
Need. be I
statiug
He thatch.