The British Press; or, Morning Literary Advertiser.
London, England, 1824-06-05 00:00:00


IRELAND-EDUCATION COMMISSION.

1 Sir beggedto ask if the Commission for
examining into the state of education in Ireland was to be speedily
I sent to that country ?
Mr. PEEL said there was no reason whr the Commission should
not be speedily prepared, and offered for the signature of his Ma-
jesty. The whole of the objects of the Hon. Baronet's address
would be embraced in the inquiry of the Commission.
Mr. S. RICE hoped all interested persons would be excluded
from the Commission.
Mr. PEEL said the Hon. Member would find the names highly
satisfactory.
NEW CHURCHES.

On the motion that the Report of the New Churches Bill be
brought up.
Colonel DAVIES objected to it as unnecessary, and a waste of
public money. If the sum proposed were to be voted, he had
much rather apportion it to those clergymen who were now so ill
paid. He should therefore move, that the Report be brought up
this day six months.
Mr. LEYCESTER said, we wanted good preachers, not large
chUrches ; and when the people called for bread, they received
but stones. The incumbents should not have the patronage of the
churches ; and churches, he was sure, would not be wanting if a
better arrangement took place ; in fact they would rise around us
like exhalation. Ile objected to the reception of the Report ; it
imposed an unfair burthen on our Dissenting brethren, merely to
add to the dignity or gratify the cupidity of the church.
31r. COOPER contended, that this grant was by no means pro.
iligate, as its object was to provide places for the moral improve-
ment of the people under the principles of the Established Church.
If Dissenters were allowed seats in this House, they should have
judgment and delicacy enough to keep their peculiar sentiments to
their' own breasts. (Cries of Question !")
Mr. HUME said he was surprised at the last remark of the lion.
Member. The Dissenters paid taxes as well as others, and should
not allow themselves to be fleeced of their property by the Church.
The lion. Alember seemed to think that no man but a High
Churchman should deliver his opinions in this House. He (Mr.
Hume) considered the grant a profligate grant, because it was not
applied to the general use of the State, but only fer the advantage
of (he few. All unequal taxes were unjust, and on that score the
rant was pectiligue. Abney would not produce as lIHNOSIMP to the
Churth ; mike contrary, the richer the Clergy the less they gene.
rally labour. Those who did most for the good of religion were
those whose seal prompted them to build churches, and give
moral instruction almost gratis. The fee simple of the Church
property wss already near two hundred millions, and they, that was
to say the House, should see how that was appropriated before
they were ready to give fresh grams. With such an income as the
Church enjoyed it was unfair to call on the Pi.senters (one
half of the whole population) to vote for Ch re es for the
well paid Protestant other half of the people. lie would not
hesitate, and he was satisfied that Members on the opposite
side of the House would agree with him, that if the
vicarage of churches was given to those who built them, there
would be no need of contributing a single penny of the public mo-
ney to such s purpose. The money paid for the very seats in some
churches was amply sufficient for building churches and defraying
all expenses attendant on them. This was the case of the wealthier
churches. The religion of the country was not improved by these
grants, neither by the former million nor the present 500.0001.
it incurred patronage, it did not benefit religion; and that increase
'of patronage was peculiarly dangerous and objectionable. It had
been said by • great man, that there could not be a more dangerous
instrument-lin the hands of the Govetninent than a servile priest.
hood. This object, and this alone, was promoted by the present
grants. He would be glad to see clergymen hold their parishes by
their good behaviour, and not by the tenure by which they at pre.
sent held them. This was the opinion of many Members on the
opposite side out of deers; but it was well known that Members
were wont to speak one language out of the House and another in
it. (Hear, and a laugh.) On these grounds he would support the
motion of his Hon. Friend.
Mr. C. WILSON supported the Bill, and contended 'that the
measure was highly necessary and acceptable to a majority of the
people of the country. There was no more salutary mode of ap-
plying the public money than by the application of it to the sup..
port of the religion of the country.
Mr. LENTESTER explained.
Mr. GURNEY was apprehensive that these would be unequally
and partially distributed.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER replied, that
this money would be subject to the provisions of the Act under
which the former grant of a million was made disposable. Its dis-
tribution would be placed in the hands of Commissioners pursuant
to that Act, who would exercise their discretion in lending in some
instances—in giving a part and the parish giving a part also ; and
in those cases where the whole sum should be given or withheld,
and gauntly to guard against the apprehension of abuse thrown
out by the Honourable Member.
Sir J. NEWPORT complained, that the majority of the
churches in Ireland were built, not by Parliamentary gift but by
Parliamentary loan, which was repaid by taxation on Roman Ca.
-tholic parishioners. (Hear, hear.) It was most unconstitutional
and unfair to grant and extend this money in the shape of gift to a
Picturant population, and place it as a tax on Protestant Dissent.
erg and Roman Catholics, who hsduer hum-Freer- advantage in the
loan. When the subject of education was introduced it was said,
let the object be erected by contributions ; if the people were sa.
tisfied that they wanted churches u much es education, they would
then do re ; but the truth was, no real necessity existed. Time
country boasted of its liberal principles ; but, in our treatment of
Catholics and Dissenters, we were worse than the most bigotted
nations of the Continent.

Mr. V. FITZGERALD supported the BM, and defended it
from the charge of inconsistency imputed to it by the Honourable
Member for Waterford.

Mr. GRATTA'N ngttedin the sentiments of his Hon. Friend
(sir J. Newport).
Mr. PHILLIPS had not berate offered his opinions on this sub-
jeet ; but it struck him very forcibly, that the petition which was
last night presented b the Hon. 3lember for Kerry, contained
matter peculiar/Lam to the present question. That petition
stated, that the Catholics of Ireland were without churches,
or horses of worship; new it appeared to him extremely unjust to
oblige thaw persons to pay for the erection of buildings to which
they did not resort, whilst they were themselves left wholly un-
provided with accommodation for their religious worship. This
was the very extreme of illiberality. Notwithstanding what had
been said of the bigotry of Prance, he would say that it was Rot
exceeded by such illiberality es this, which was a shame both to
the Parliament and the Church. To add to the abuse, this
500.0004 was to be expended where it was not wanting.
Mr. MONCK was desirous of offering a few words before the
House proceeded to a division. He was as anxious as any person
could be to support the Protestant Establishment; for, as kng as
a religion was supported by the State, he would be the last man to
lend himself to the spoliation of the noses necessary to maintain it
suitably. At the same time he could not approve of the conduct
we adopted towards Dissenters, and of the unfairness of the burden
imposed upon them in contributing to the building of our churches.
As an instance of the advantage derivable Loin free contributions to
such purposes, he would mention Aloorlields, which was a most
commodious house of worship, and one into which no person, no
instter of what religion, could enter without feelings of veneration.
He (Aft. Monek ) would approve of the plan et' giving the patronage
of such houses of worship, which they themselves built, to Me-
thodists and sectaries. By this means they might be included in the
Church, for the Twenty-nine Articles sere so general as not to pre.
vent Methodists or Arkin', or any other sectaries from being in-
cluded in it. As to the premed measure, there was no immediate
I ncee:siiv for it, and It might at all events be with propriety post-
poned till the next Session of Parliament.

The gallery was theleilo:tcyd for a. division. The numbest mans..
For the Amendment . 9 Against it . d
The Report was then brought up,tand the Bill read a third time.
COCOA NUTS BILL.
The Report of the Cocoa Nuts Bill was brought up, and ordered
to be taken into consideration to-morrow (this day).
NEWFOUNDLAND JURISDICTION BILL.
The Report of the Newfoundland Jurisdiction Bill was brought
11 up. and the Bill was recommitted.
Several amendments were agreed to, and the report was ordered
to be received to-morrow.
COMBINATION LAMPS.
The Report of the Combination haws Repeal Bill was received,
and the Bill ordered to be read a third time to-morrow.
QUALITHATION OF JURORS BILL.
Mr. W ESTERN pustponed, until Monday se'nnight, the further
consideration of the Report ow the Qualification of Jurors Bill.
Mr. CIII PPS was extremely desirous that this useful Bill should
pass this Session.
Sir E. KNATCHRULL did not eoreur in the opinion or wish
of the Hon. Gentleman who had spoken last. He thought it would
be more material by permitting it to stand over until next Session.
Mr. Alderman WOOD thought the utility of the measure was so
obvious as to require its speedy adoption.
Report postponed till Monday se'nnight.
MASTERS AND WORIsMENS' BILL.
The Masters and Workmens' Bill passed through a Committee.
The Bill was reported, with some verbal amendments, to the
House. The Report was brought up, read a second time, engrossed,
and ordered to be read a third time to.mormw.
HORSES SLAUGHTERING BILL.
The Horses Slaughtering Bill went through a Committee pro
foento.
On the motion that the Report should be brought up,
Mr. WYNN objected to the measure. It Win quite absurd to
suppose that every man was to be compelled to keep a journal of
every feed of corn he gave his horse, which was one of the wise
provisions of this Bill.
Mr. SMITH thought asses ou jtat to be included in the provisions
of the Bill.
Mr. MARTIN said, the Bill might be defective ; its provisions
might possibly be imperfect, and the wit of the Hon. Member
might perhaps be deemed by some peculiarly pungent. To him,
however, it seemed that it would be much more worthy of the good
feeling usually displayed by the Hon. Member to substitute • re-
medy for that which was defective, than to labour a joke the the
entertainment of the unthinking.
Mr. SMITH explained, that nothing was farther from his inten-
tion than to undervalue the humanity of the Hon. Member for
Galway, but he thought this was not a subject fit for legislative
enactment.
Mr. JOHN SMITH concetrad that the evil of the injurious
treatment of homes was attributable to the want of education of the
lower orders of the community.
Mr. MARTIN thought that some legislative measure should be 'I
adopted, to cause the immediate slaughtering of the horses by those
persons to whom they were consigned, when qualified for no fur-
ther exertion.
The Bill, with its amendment, was reported to the House, and
ordered to betaken into further consideration on Wednesday next.
LANCASTER COUNTY COURTS BILL.
The Committee on the Lancaster County Courts Bill was de-
(erred until Wednesday next.
EAST INDIA TRADE BILL.
The Order of the Day for the Hcuse resolving itself into a Corn-
mittee on the East India Trade Bill was read.
The House went into Committee. The Report was brought up
and received, the Bill read a second time, and ordered to be read
a third time on Wednesday next.
SALT DUTIES REPEAL BILL.
On the motion of Mr. HERMES, the Order of the Day for the
House resolving itself into a Committee on the Salt Duties Bill was
then read.
The House went into Committee, the Report was received, and
the Bill read a second time, and ordered to be read a third time on
Friday next.
The other Orders of the Day were then disposed of, and the
House adjourned at a Quarter before Eleven o'Clock.

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