The British Press; or, Morning Literary Advertiser.
London, England, 1824-03-26 00:00:00

I R ISII TANNER.`.

Sir 11. PAENEI.I. presented a petition from certain tanner% in
Ireland, praying for a repeal of the taxes on leather. The lion.
Member complained of the gradual decay of the wide in Ireland in
consequence of thlt tax.
The CII A NCLLIA)K of the EXCHEQUER maid. he had
looked to the subject alluded to by the Hon. Member, and he hoped
to have been able to give a definitive answer upon the subjt•c: be-
fore this; but the investigation had been taken up by the Com-
missioners of Inquiry. whose peculiar duty it was. 'l'his subject
had attracted their peculiar attention; they were now examining
evidence upon it, &La in a short time they would be in a state to
give their report.
Mr. ELLIS, as we understood him, was averse to any alteration,
as the Irish tanner would have to pay wore than lie had at
present.
The petition was ordered to lie nn the table.
HIDES AND SKINS.

Sir M. RIDLEY preonted a petition front the tanners of New.
castle against the duty on hides and 'Man.—Ordered to lie on the
table.
TVIINPIKE BILL.

Mr. CRIPPS moved for leave to bring in a Bill to amend and
consolidate the Turnpike Road Acts. Those passed last Session
were long and laborious; it was impossible for any person to put
in force the clauses of these Bills, as they could not be understood.
There was another error of which lie ouniplained ; there was a
'maximum of penalty defined, but there was no mit:imam. A ma-
gistrate might indict a penalty as high as tire pounds, but the mi-
nimum was entirely at his discretion—this was in the Turnpike
Act, In the Highway Act, if the penalty of forty shillings was im-
posed, an appeal was admitted ; to avoid this appeal, the magis-
' trate often inflicted a fine of 395. and by this nn ass an abuse was
committed. lie would move for leave to bring in a Bill to amend
and consolidate the Turnpike and Highway Acts, passed in the lid
and 4th years of George IV.
f7p in the motion being seconded,
LEWIS trusted the Hon. Member would not endeavour
to consolidate the Bills, one of which consisted of lOU clauses, and
the other of 95. He would facilitate the attainment of his object
by combining these Bills. It would be must desirable to simplify
these measures, but they should pmcced with caution, as they
would be liable to the danger of being obliged to make new regu-
lations.

Sir M. W. RIDLEY thought much good had bean done by the
regulations passed in the last Session of Parliament, and he wished
to wait for the effects of experience upon the subject. They should
wait until they saw how the measure winked. Ile would therenre
recommend the lion. Member to withdraw his motion till the next
Session.

Alt. PEEL joined in the wish that the motion would be for the
present withdrawn. He also wished for the benefit of experience
on the subject. If these laws were to be passed, the statute bock
under which the table already groaned would be swelled to an
enormous extent. If he knew his Honourable Friend well, he
would gladly acquiesce in a measure evidently intended for the pub-
lic good.
Mr. CRIPPS said he felt himself pledged, as an active Magis-
trate, to bring this measure before the House; but from the &Ida-
ration made, and the wishes evinced, especially by the Night Hon.
Gentleman, he had no objection to withdraw hi► motion.
illotion withdrawn.
EDUCATION IN IRELAND.

Sir J. NEWPORT rose for the purpose ot submitting to the
consideration of the House a question of the highest importance to
the interests of the country at large. Ile would assure the House,
that if the matter which he was about to lay before them required
a display either of ability or eloquence, he would allow the motion
which he had the honour to bring forward to fall to the lot of a
more gifted person. To his present course he was enforced by
what appeared, to him the necessity of the measure. Great as the
difference of opinion was which was found to exist upon other mat.
tem, there would, he believed, exist none upon the urgency of ex-
tending a system of education to the population of every country,
more especially to a population circumstanced as was that of Ire-
land. He would enter as little as possible into details. lie tended
the necessity would be admitted by all, of addressing the Parlia-
ment upon a measure, the object of which was of paramount im-
portance to the intereatmot the country at large. He felt justified in
stating this measure to be of paramount importance to the country ;
for, as the necessity of education was admitted, it followed that that
system of education should be conducted on the best principles pos-
sible, and should be made subservient to the interests of the coin-
niunity at large. He was perfectlyaensible of the dificultien of the
situation in which he was placid ; these difficulties were involved in
and arose from the conflicting opinions of a population extremely di-
Med upon many subject., and especially so upon every thing con-
nected with religious opinions. ((dear.) In the measure hewn
about to propose, he would most studiously abstain from uttering
any sentiment that might excite an acrimonious feeling, either in
one party or the other. (Ilea, hear.) The abstaining from such
topics lie regarded as a strict duty. The question to be discussed
was one of the most serious imnortance ; and nothing, he was
aware, would be more fatal to the interests of the community, and
to the attainment of the object he had in view, titan the use of ex-
preasinns which would by possibility cause any exasperation of
feeling. (Hear, hear.) tinder the influence of these sentiments,
he would not impute blame for any thing that had occurred. He
would not impute blame even where it was supposed it might have
been desceveiL The conduct to which blame was imputed might
have !Arisen from an excess of feelings of the best nature. Hewes
conscious of his nwn liability to error, and he would therefore cau.
tumefy abstain from any observation on the errors of others. As to
the manner in which he meant to proceed to this discussion, he
would take the liberty of stating, that lie intenikl to give a brief
sketch of the subject before the House. Whilst he was convinced
of the propriety of this mode, he was sensible that those gentlemen
who had looked with accuracy to the subject, were as well acquainted
with its nature and tendency as he was himself ; but he was at the
same time conscious that he addressed an assembly, many of whom
had not the opportunity of investigating the subject ; and then
were others of them who, from the lemur and the objects cf their
own pursuits and avocations, would be led to a oonehision of a
different nature. It was for these reasons he felt himself compelled
to trespass upon the attention of the House to this statement con-
cerning that measure, the success of which it was his object to
promote. For this purpose lie should refer to the year 1711. five
years front that period of time when the Parliament of Ireland
asserted its own independence, and established the truth of those
pflociples by which it was enabled to assert the independence of
its country. At that time the Parliament of Ireland turned its'
attention to the subject of education. Ile mcntionei this to
shew that education was at an early period the object of
the Parliament's attention ; anti when that hotly deemed itself
competent to legislate for itself, it applied its attention to the subject-
In January 1707 the then Lord Lieutenant laid the plan for the
improvement of the education of the Inch people ; and in the
April following certain resolutions were agreed to, to that effect.
.9 Bill WAS afterwards brought in, and heven Conmiivaioners of
Inquiry were appointed to inquire into all schools for public edu-
cation, and the state, and condition, and management of such
schools. Down to June 17911, that commission was continued;
hot no good resulted, anti the inquiry was altogether abortive.
The cause of this lie believed to be, that if the examination took
place abuses would be discovered. and the matter remain dor-
mant. In 18IX the question was taken up by him, but for which
he took no credit, as his being in office then was a mile necident.
He then saw what bad been done, the abuses committed in public
and private foundations, and lie laid the whole before the then
Lord Lieutenant, who directed further inquiry, and a commission
was aopoiuted, consisting principally of ecclesiastical persona, many
of them the lieduk of the church; amongst them were also a few lay.
men, one particularly—the great, the good, the eloquent Henry
Orattan. 'lime Reports were made by these Commissieners, and
twelve Appendixes, containing valuable information ; at the same
time that they developed iibuso,, remedies were suggested ; nothing,
however, was effectively done, and at last came the Fourteenth
Report, which was the moat important of all that had been made,
inasmuch as it was generally .geed to. In IBM Commisalorers
were again appointed, but the schouls of Erasmus Smith and the.

Charter Schools were not included. The Right Hon. Gentleman
roceeded to read 'extracts from that report, which recommended
thit no religious ditainctiora should be made in the education of
' the pulpit:, but that all should be governed by the same system.
Having this view mach at heart, be thought it essential that all at-
tempts at proselytism should be cautiously avoided. Ily such
means alone could education be made really useful. Education at
sitiionng tilnietint., aarid whichto
receive
all the Royal schools was dear, and there were but very few scholars
tel
aughtto be the reverse. There was a great
eabieen
gratuitouspeyfovhis hi
children's nedv,s education.truction
,luid
out
even the
honest labourer would ratherof
his little earnings, than receive it gratuitously. Such an honour-
able feeling should be cultivated and extended as widely as pos-
sible. Their anxiety to receive education was particularly rental k-
allge, and he wished that the charges at the Royal schools should
be so lowered as to enable all to attend them. l'he report even
stated that Catholic evening schools were formed, in order to fur-
fish means to the children of the poor who could not spare them in
the day to obtain the benefits of education. Such a fact of itself
spoke volumes on this subject. The report went on to sine, that the
Christian religion should be the basin of education, and that the
ople should be particularly taught their duty to God, their neigh-
urs, their country, and the Government ; but without any secta-
rian views, or any attempts at proselytism. Front this report two
facts appeared—the anxiety of the people for education, and die
necessity oldie Government affording it as cheaply as possible. Io
the Royal schools there were few scholars—six in one, 13 in ano-
ther, and nine in a third; the funds were considerable, and so were
the rates of tuition, as each of them had from seven hundred to
above one thousand a year; anti six guineas a quarter, under ,
such circumstances, was too high for day-scholars and ne-
..gto
cessarily kept a great many children from them. lie had the
highest authority in this country for stating, that educa-
tion was at least promoted by allowing such sums. In Derry the
royal school had 9004 a year--and, talking of this subject, he could
not avoid thanking the Drapers' Company of the City of London
for their good and honourable endeuvouts in that part of the coun-
try ; and he sincerely wished the objects and the principles they
promoted would he followed more extensively than they had,
hitherto been. A farnung school was recently established in the
county of It'exford, which he thought likely to do good; and
he hoped similar schools would be extended throughout that coun-
try. Two objects would be united by such achouls—good moral
as well as useful agricultural knowledge, which were both highly
essential to a population like the Irish. Ile had found that a
great distrust was prevailing against this spread of education in
Ireland, on the part of the Catholies ; but it should be recollected,
that we were Protestants about dispeosing that bit-wing, and that
in kindness and fairness we shohld make every allowance for such
jealousy. I )car object, however, should be to abate that jealousy
and use every exertion to allay any irritation on the subject
whfell might exist. Such had all along been his object. Through-
out Ireland individuals made great exertions to form schools,
amongst whom he was gratified to have one, who resided in the
city he hut the honour to represent—he allude:l to 31r. Edmond
Rice, who, front a humble walk in life, bei:ig by trade a butcher,
bad accumulated a considerable property, a latch he had fur
years wholly devoted to the education of the pew. it was im-
passible for him to speak of the vast advantages which resulted
front his taheol. All classes of persons now sought as their
servants the children educated at his school; and a class of
persons, known for their severe morality and caution in mer-
cantile affairs, generally selected their clerks front it also. Such
facts needed no explanation; but it was useful to state them, in
order to confirm the statement he made, in the first place, as to the
desire of the Irish for education ; and in the second place, as to the
advantages it 'eonferred on those who lout received it. In the Ilio-
cote of 'l'uarn, there were IrAi Roman Catholic schools, and in
Cloyne no leas than 239, and the terms generally were not higher
than twenty-one shillings •-year, fur raiding, writing, and arith-
metic. Ile had so far said enough to explain his views ; but in
ing an address for the appointment of a Commission, lie felt
80111 C difficulty. Two methods suggested themselves to him, the
first, to have a Committee of this !louse; and the second, to send a
t'oininission to Ireland. Each of these methods had its advantages
as Cell as its disadvantages. The report of the Committee here
would do more with public opinion on the subject; but then
again it would be attended with great expense, and per-
haps delay. If a comnibesion were sent to Ireland, the exami-
nations would take place on the spot; and he was the more
inclined to think that upon this other ground it would have the
sanction of this Donne. When, besides, he looked to the results
of the last commissions in Ireland, u to the law courts and the
revenue, he thought a similar commission would be attended with
the happiest results on the subject of education. In filet, too much
praise could not be given to the gentlemen taampeating those com-
missions, for the zeal, fidelity, End talent with which they executed
the very t.rduoiss duty itr.posed upon them. The Honoitrable Bart.
then concluded by moving, "That a commission be appointed to
inquire into the general system of education in Ireland, to state
bow the errors prevailing could be remedied, and report their opi-
nions thereon to this House."

111r.111(MILBURN mud, there was so much of temper and con-
ciliation in the manner in which this important subject was brought
before the (louse, that he only regretted he did not fill some more
prominent situation, to convey to the Right Honourable Gentleman
his thanks. This question was important in many views. Edna.
tion should be extended as widely as possible, and without even
the appearance of proselytism. !le agreed that our gifts might
be viewed with jealousy, and that all our objects should be to abate
that jealousy. Ig therm views he fully concurred with the Right
lioaourable Baronet. Iledid not mean to say abuses did not exist,
from over seal or worse metiers, and lie thought the Right Hon.
Baronet was wise sin abstaining front their notice. If they had
existed before or at this time, there was little ground for charge on
that head. Ile wished a general concurrence to this measure, and
he WAS therefore anxious to avoid the use of a single expression
which could mar the coalman object of at.. lie knew there was aid
is in the people of Ireland the strongest anxiety to obtain education,
and he knew that Parliament gave them the means of gratifying
that happy and useful disposition. The higher orders of Ireland
paid great attention to this subject, and he hoped its completion
would not be long delayed. Ile again expressed his cone-uric:me
in the motion, and thanked the Right Baronet for the temperate
and judicious manner in which he had introduced this question.
(heat, hear.)
Mr. J. SMITH thought the concession of the Government to-
night was a proof of the -liberality with which they had lately acted,
and he would therefore abstain from entering into particulars with
which he would otherwise have troubled the House. lie thanked
the Government for what they had dome; but he wondered they
had 'so long been supine on this important subject. We trained
taue dogs betbre we expected a duty Iron' them; but man alone was
left to his passions, and then we hanged hint fur a breach of our
sanguinary and ferocious laws. For himself he would prefer a
Committee on this subject, because so much could be got out by
cross-examination, and because it was not always that Commissions
did their duty, though in the present case lie hoped they might.
There were many districts in Ireland in a state of woes ignorance
and misery, and scarcely above the level of the brute creation ; and
he wished to see some remedy to improve their condition. We had
spread our pity and our money far and wide, and it was net a little
singular that we should have so long overlooked Ireland. (for first
object should be to extend education, and then would follow other
pnvilegen. Everything turned tenon the persons to be appointed as
Commissioners; and both the House and the country should be
sa:isfied that they were persons able, willing, and, above all, deer.
mined to do their duty. If this Rystena were persevered in, he
expected what had long been the object of his life would be realized,
and that a brave, generous, and long.suffering people, would be
admitted to the full participation of those blessings to which, by
justice and the British Constitution, they were eminently entitled.
Mr. Secretary PEEL said, in consequence of the course the de-
bate had taken, he should have abstained from offering a single
obeerystion but for the allusion made by the lion. Member who
spoke last to a speech delivered by him (Mr. Secretary Peel) seve-
ral years since, with reference to the education of the people of
Ireland —a speech containing opinions I then entertained, and
fruit which I have never dissented, upon that most important sub.
jot, the education of the people of Ireland. The lion. Member
has insinuated that my anxiety on that subject terminated with the
speech, which he has been pleased to call eloquent ; because no
fruits, he contends, have arisen ; no moral improvement is per-
ceptible in the condition of the peasantry of Ireland. Sir, the
Hon. Member hail forgotten that education is in its march slow,
and that its operations are not more permanent than they tare gra.
dual. The cultivation of the mind of a people long neglected,
yet displaling,eyert in its nuegfigence,a grandeur, and an influenee;l
and au originality, ismoe the- aelsiovesnent of any momentary sub.!
negation; et requires all the cautious working* of pmgreeeive im-
provement, before you can see this tong-neglected mind in its regu-
fated condition,holding the feelings and passions of the man in their
proper station, and circulating throughout a country the benefit it
Kasobtained from education. It is not in a few years, I say, that
these improvements are to be expected, but they will come ulti-
meetly, Mid no matter how longs people may be engaged in earn-
ing the benefits of education, it will repay the toil and anxiety of
procuring it ; it will rear well and dignify the people who have re-
ceived its blessings. 1 am anxious, however, most fully to con-
vince the lien. 3lenther that I have not neglected to act upon the
opinion which, in 1813, 1 entertained and stated in this Howie.
Since that time fourteen reports, thirteen of which referred to, and
conipLined of abuses prevalent in the endowed schools of Ireland,
have been published ; the fonneenth referred to a new system for
the 4:ducat:on of the present poor of Ireland. With regard to these
abuses, tor I will call them by their right name, which prevailed to
catch a:: extent in theendowed schools of Ireland, it was my wish to
provide the most effectual remedy t and the very preamble to the Act
will clearly prove that I neither shrunk from a deceleration of those
abuses roe from the suggestion of a remedy. Now with respect to
that Plan tar the universal education of the poor to which the
Fourteenth Report is exclusively centined, my only apprehensions
were, that by asking to accomplish too much we should fail alto-
geehtr ; aid, at the period when that Report was made, I own I
telt ansico* that the question should for some time be eufblged
quietly to rest, in order that the then heated state of the public
mind, the alieruntand jealousies then prevailing, should pass away,
and thus admit of our legislating on this subject at a more suitable
season. But not one year subsequent to the delivery of that Re-
port, the subject of the education of the poor was taken up by me,
and public aid was atiiirded niost extensively to all societies having
for their object the education of the poor. One society, too, had
been then formed, and, in the year 11116, there was not a single .
school connected with that society. 13 three. •years tome that pc-:
rind, 320 schools were connected with it. A 311 here permit me to
say, that in the formation of these schools every thought of puree-:
lydant was altogether excluded. My object was, to unite the chit- •
learn of different religions from their earliest Infancy--to bring them
up together under the same roof; and I was quite setislied, that a
common education in their different creeds, which still allowed of
theconstant union and close intimacy oldie chil deem would gradually
wear ate av those aeerbitita and unbind feelif gs which have too long
made thipeople of Ireland an unhappy, because a disunited people.
(Cheers.) 'l'o that great object I still co:a-sive ell our exertione
should tend. Sure I am they cannot fail. I have stated, that in
the year 1817 there welt 320 schools iu connection with she society

to which I have abided ; one year afterward,, that number increased
to 531/; the following rear to 7271 and last year they amounted to
1,100. Now I seek not Ey disparage any other system of education;
but here are the facts, and I sac they show the beesflt% so far, of
system hitherto adopted for tlie extension of (dilution. 1 hare
thought it right to say thus much, to remove the impression that I
was indifferent to the question. I have not been so indifferent;
and though I acknowledge much remains to be done, yet we must
not therefore chose our eyes against what has already been accom-
plished. I admit, with the Honourable Member, that much will
depend upon the selections made by Ministers for this important
trust; and I am sure too, that the chniee rill be made with a
view onlir to the interests of this most important question.
31r. ROWNLOW observed, that without a liberal edu-
cation of the people of Inland, particidarly of its lower
orders, he saw no hope for that country: Ile trusted there
I was net to be found in the House a single member who
I would deny the benefits of education. no one would
be hardy enough to deny in the abstract, that education
was calculated to benefit a people; but it was the fashion to
consider the Irish in this, as in all other cases, an exception to the
general role, and resolutely to question the advantages to such a
people of mural and religious instruction. He would willingly in-
' troduce the man who harboured such sentiments to a scene he had
lately witnessed, and he would there perceive the children of Irish
parents exhibiting the advantages of such cultivation. On the
17th of this month, said Mr. Brownlow, I dined at the an-
niversary of Saint Patrick (a laugh); and though I dined to
celebrate the birth-day of ivy natal Saint, I can assure the
Honourable .11entbers who laugh that i saw nothing through
• magnifying medium. It was to me quite delightful to per-
ceive the condition of those children, though it was a painful
feeling to contrast that condition with the state of the poor chil-
dren of their own country. Ile never could consent to any system
of education in which religion did not go hand-in-hand with mental
improvement; nor should he give his sanction, however unim-
portant, to anyone measure that separated the Protestant from the
Catholic children ; such separation would convert religion into a ;
demon of discord, and make of the schools theological arenas. A
prition had a few nights since been presented by the Catholic
Bishops of Ireland, in which they respectfully and most honestly I
stated, first, their dissent from any system of education which was
unaccompanied by religious constraint; and, secondly, their con-
scientious unwillingness to allow the per teal of the Bible in
schools without mote or comment. He had heard of many men
who were said (though in she absence of the Bible he knew
not how) to have lived moral lives without religion, and the
late Mr. Hume had been mentioned as an example; he
would admit the correctness of the example ; but who would
argue from a particular to a universal, or assert that the cold
and passionless philosopher was a model for the peasant's
imitation? Therefore he would admit that the Catholic Bishops
were correct in excluding all instructions front their flock which had
not religion for its corner-stone. lie would go further too, and
knowing then:yen:nee in which the Bible was held in Ireland, he
would consent to t sande it as a class book front the school, and
leave it as the companion of the cottage; but sacrifices—mutual
sacrifices—must i.e made by Protestant and Catholic ; and as he
was most conscientiously convinced (an opinion that be had not un-
frequ •.ntly contenitnicated where it was most unacceptable) that a Ca-
tholic was as well calculated for a good subject as a Protestant, and
that education alone made the difference between them, he gave his
most cordial support to the motion of the Right llou. Baronet.
The Address was then agreed to.
LABOURING CLASSES.

Lord J. RUSSELL presented a petition from Mathew Phillips,
engineer, praying that the Rouse would take into consideration the
state of the labouring claw,. In introducing a motion for a select
committee on the condition of the labouring classes,he sake in so low
a tone that we wive utterly unable to discover his prefatory obierv-
ations. lle objected to tits employing of the poor and paying them
from the poor's rates, and concluded by moving for the appoint-
ment of a select committee to inquire into the present condition
of' the labouring classes, with a view to prevent the payment of the
labouring poor out of the poor's rates, and to report thereon to the
!louse.

Mr. Secretary PEF:L suggestnl the prudence of limiting the
motion to the particular object which the Noble Lord appeared to
have in view, namely, the uptc:intitient of a committee to inquire
Imo the practice prevalent in some pans of the coantry, of paying
the labouring poor out of the poor 's rates, and the consequences
thereon. Ile would have no objection to a motion so framed.
Lord JOHN RUSSELL said, he had no objection to limit hi►
motion. Ilia object was, in framing it as it originally stood, to
show how the grievance pressed on the labouring classes.
The motion was then agreed to.
V ICT CALL! NG DEPA RT 31 ENT.

Mr. CROKEIt moved for leave to bring in • 11111 for the pur-
chase of lands for the use of the Victualling Department at Ply-
mouth. The Don. Member said be was prepared to chew the great
advantages which would be derived to the public service from the
purchase of these grounds, but he should resole his statement for
the second reading of the Bill.
Mr. HUME remarked that the better course, in his opinion,
would have been, and it certainly was the more usual course, to
justify the meassore before the Rill wax brought in.
Mr. CROKER—I am perfectly ready to chew the necessity of
the measure at this moment, but I yielded my own convenience to
the wishes of several Members interested in this question, and my
willingness to oblige is very harshly termed an unusual course in
this House.
Mr. IHUME-4 as trite satisfied, if the discussion will take
place on the second reading—Agreed to.
ORDNANCE DEPARTMENT. _

Sir H. HARDINGE said, that in the Acts Malice to the Bar-
rack Depart Tent, there were some deficiencies, which it was deem-
ed advisable to remedy, and for that purpose he had to move that
leave be given to bring in a Bill to remove doubts u to certain pro-
perty formerly belonging to the Barrack Department, and now in
the Ordnance Department.—(:ranted.
SI I.K TRADE BILL.

The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER sold he was
anxious to proceed with the third reading of this 13111, se it would
not detain the House; and anxious to proceed to the discussion of
the Game Laws Amendment Bill. He should therefore more the
~-der of the day, for the third reading of the Bill.
After a few words from Mr. DAVENPORT, Mr. 11111311 T, and
Mr. P. Moon F., the Bill was read a third time, and
GAME LAWS AMENDMENT BILL.

, . .
Mr. S. WO RTLEY moved the Order of the llay for the
further consideration of the report of the Gagne Laws Amend.
ment BilL
The House went into s Committee.

Sir/. SHELLEY objected to the second clauseof this Act,
since it gave to every person possessing the power of killing or
taking game by any wiy he thought praiser, but did not give him
the pryydr of transferring that power.
B OODEN read the clause, enumerating the various
species of game under the Act.
Lord MILTON wished to know whether, by agreeing to the
clause, he was precluded from objecting to the enumeration of
animal+.

BIi(HIDEN replied in the affirmative.
bold LTON, with that understanding, objected to the whole
clause. It introduced a new species of animals as game, which
were not game by the law of the land, and it was, therefore, likely
to prove an enormous grievance to the whole people of England.
He apprehended that the Bill was not introduced fur the purpose
of contributing to the amusements of country gentlemen ; he
rather supposed its object was to diminish the enormous mass of
crime winch was produced by the present game laws. He con.
tended that the operation of the Bill in its present shape ass
to extend the mischief of the game laws. He had no plan of his
own on this subject, but he certainly entertained strong objections
to the whole of the present Hill, excepting to that part of it which
went to make game saleable; as it would have the effect of in-
creasing the rigour and the odium of the game laws, by investin7
a property in persons of what was before considered incapable of
becoming property. (In the whole, he thought the Bill a most un-
popular measure.
Sir JOHN SEBRIGHT observed, that the present game laws
were unpopular. because the whole of the game belonged to one
Lord of the Manor (hear) ; but surely any measure which would
enable the proprietor of land to chew an instance of civility to
his neighbour, could never be unpopular. As the law now stood,
the son of a Squire, who was a pauper in the workhouse, had a
right to shoot game, while a proprietor of land could not bestow
such a right on an honest tradesman who had perhaps waited a
hang those for his bill. (Laugher/0 Ho thought that all nutria.
thins upon game were odious, and that • more popular measure
than the present could not be brought forward.
Lord M ILTON said • few words in explanation.
Mr. BEHNAL Miser/ea, that it was intended by the Bill
to make game property ; now he desired to be informed whether
it was meant, that if unauthorised people killed game, and car-
ried it away, they would not be deemed guilty of felony, the same
as if they had killed and carried away barn-done fowls.
Mr. S. IVORMEN' said, that it would he easy to introduce •
clause, supposing the lion. Member's objection to be well founded, ,
declaring that such persons should be liable to no other penalty
than what was named in the drill. I

Mr. ONCE suggested, that it would be better to omit all
animal* that were not game.
This was, after some discussion, agreed to; and the words,
rabbits, bustards, woodcocks, snipes, quails, landraila, teal, and
widgeon, were excluded from the clause.
On the clause for vesting the property in game on the landowners.
Idr. CHI /I!LBURN rose to expres* his dissent from the principle
of the clause. He objected to the transfer of the property from
the Lords of Manors, to whom it now belonged. As an instance
of the injustice with which the clause would operate, he stated
that he was Lord of a Manor M which he had not an aae of land.
Ile happened, however, to be also owner of the tithes ; and he was
thus enabled to make arrangements for the enjoyment of his sport-
' ing. ley this clause he would be deprived of his right, and if
through inadvertence he attempted to exercise it, he would only be
able just to avoid the treadmiill. (a laugh.)
Mr. BERNAL supported the clause, which would entrench upon
no manorial right whatever, for that could be no right which waa
enjoyed at the pleasure of another.
Sir J. WiIIOTTESLEI contended that the clause would anni-
hilate a right which was
.practicalle enjoyed very extensively and
beneficially, and which, in die sale of ;miserly, was found to give
it increased value.
Sir J. SERB 11;11T was in favour of the chaise. The manorial
rights over the hmiloa ner were such as one gentleman ought not to
possess over another, and at the same time were in themselves of no
efficacy, beano* they were enjoyed, so far as sporting at least was
concerned, only by sufferance of the landowner.
Sir.l. WROTTESLEY wished still to be allowed to enjoy them
by sufferance.
Mr. Alderman HE YGATE mentioned an instance in which an
increased vatue of 1,3/191. had been given far an estate far the no-
rigi.ts. If this clause wee; prowl the purchaser W 4141.1 he
cheated oat of that onto. They wire not irnalioary ritt:. Ha
felt, in his own case, that they were of importance ; e begged

the eniumittee to pausc berme they voted away the most andet,
property in the kingdom.
11 r. opium. d the clause.
Mr. S. 11•011'I'LLY argued, that the right of the Lord of the
Manor was, in point of filet, not worth sixpence. This clause would
give the Lords of Manors a beneficial right, which they did not now
enjoy. In all inclosed manors they would become the hgal
pie tars of the game, with power to deal with that as with every
other species of property belonging to them. The question lout
to the root and principle of the Hill, which, wi lout this clause, be
would not carry forward.
Lord MILTON said, that it was undeniable that the Bill would
carry into ellect a great interference with the rights of propertf.
and he doubted whether it would ever be found paeticabie to invest
the right to wild animals as a pmperty in any clans of persons. In
his opinion, the object in amending the (/attic Laws ~hould be to
prevent the filling of the gaols with crintinala, and decrease the,
mass of litigation arising Man the absurd and mischievous enaet.
mints now in existence. The wise course of legislation would con
list in taking away temptation and repealing penalties. Ile would
recommend that the bad laws should be got rid of, and none sub.
stitut.al.

Mr. Sxretary PEEL said, he doubted whether it would be het.
ter to try the legalization of the sale of game with the present laws
of qualification, Slld reserving the present rights of Lords of liag.
non, or to accompany the experiment wilts ari investment ado
' property In game in other hands. I}n that 'location he would ghat
no opinion until the Bill came before the Honse at a sub. ,em
stage. If the Noble lewd meant to advise the abolition et pet
nalties for poaching, he certainly differed f:om him. Such a course
of legislation would turn the whole hulk of the labouring num.'s.
don of the country into an armed body, prowling about to destroy
the property of the higher classes. (Lord Milton intimated that
the Right Hon. Gendentan was mistaken:l If the Noble Lord
did not mean to recommend that course, he could not understand
frorn his words what peerise object the Noble Lord had in view.
Mr. S. WORTLEY, said that he was COUViIICed, from roach
reflection on the subject, It was impossible to make game. saleable,
without altering the law of austifleation. No injustice or oppression
could be greater than that of allowing one set persona so sell what
ass grown and fed on the land of others. It was not to be supposed,
that it would be borne, that game should be maintained at tits eapeem
of the landowner er his tenants, and that they should lie forbidden
to kill it by another person, who afterwards erereixed that right in
order to put the proceeds into his own pocket. Bill oft such
princinples ought nett to pass, and he was sure it would not.
Mr. Secretary Pt:El. said he was anxious to see some amend.
merit of the game laws, amid he confessed be inclined to the opinion
of his Hon. Friend (Mr. Stuart Wortley), but he would reserve his
sen meets until a lover stage of the nietwore.
Sir .1. SEBRIGHT said the odium of the Game Laws arose
principally from the right of spnrting being confined to a few; and
he wits satisfied the country would not hear of a Bill to make game
saleable, while game continued to be the exclusive property of da
privileged classes. The Bill of last year was therefore unpopular:
but the he believed would be well received, because it gave flat I
land-owner power over his own estate.
Mr. W. BANKES Said this was no experiment that could be
tried. and if found unadaileable, repealed ; if it failed, the House
bad no retreat. They would give a valuable right to the land.
ownem, of which they could not afterwards deprive them. He ad.
vised the Committee to reflect before they dealt so lightly with
property that bad descended to the present holders from disaut
71:L.N0 man was snore aware than himself of the obnoxiousness
Game Laws, but he would not therefore strike a wanton blow
at them, which would produce no benefit:L.l result, either by6.re.
clueing the Oak of litigation or lessening the number of aiming
Lard BINNING also felt that the House could not retrace its
stepts, and he agreed that no interference with existing fifth's
ought to be attempts(' unless a great benefit could be gained. But
the present state of the Game Laws was so abominable, that he
could have recourse to any thing that promised a chance of escaping
from it. Ile sueporied the clause with great unwillingness indeed,
but he was afraid that without it the Bill could not be passed.
Mr. MONCK observed, that though this Bill was an roped.
ment in the present state of society m this county, the principle
bad been saccessful among the Saxons, before the Norman (en.
(meet, and in France since the Revolution.

Alter some further remarks Awn Mr. C. WILSON, Mr. EVAXS,
LOrtl Mir.vox. and Sir J. f nit :LLEY,
Sir. J. WROTTESLEI' •il, he hoped the Hon. Gent .too
had introduced the Bill, won d consider the propriety of retaining
the iitvolissive rig'itu of the Lords of Manors, so far as the appoint-
ment of s game-keeper went, allowing the landowner, as now, to
warn him off when trettpassing without leave.
Mr. S. WORTLEY said, he would give his attention to the
suggestion.
The Committee then divided—

For the (:lauae 82, against it 29—Majority 53.
On the best clause for giving the Isndowner power to qualify
others to kill his game,
Mr. IIi:RNA). stated his objections to a power by alliche
non-resident landowner might send any number of persons to kill
game on his tenant's land. _

Mr. J. SMITH onn:urred in the opinions of the Hon. Gentle-
man u to the doubtfulness of the policy of this clause, and joined
in expressing his apprehension of the disposition manifested to in-
terfere with ancient rights.
Mr. S. WORTLEY explained the object of the clause. It was
clear the power could not be given indiscriminately to the tenant.
Mr. Alderman II EYGATE asked what security a leaseholder
could have, that his landlord would not avail hinnelrof this chase
to molest and injure him ?
.Mr. tiOULIWRN again urged the propriety of leaving the
Lords of Manors in
thought it would be better to leave out that part
of the clause that gave the landlord permission to shoot oven Is:is
on which the gime was reserved to the tenant, unless he obtained
the consent of the tenant.

Sir T. ACKLAND thought that a declaratory chose would
answer the purpose— by which the landlord would nut have the right
to use the new privilege, excepting under a new covenant.
Mr. WORTLEY tippet:Jed to the Gentlemen opposite if he
had or could have any object in view except to put the law on a
just footing to all parties. He would have no objection to withdraw
the clause for the present and proceed to the discussion of another:
or, if it were preferred, he had no objection to have progrew te-
ported.
This course seemed most agreeable to the House, and the House
having resumed,
The CHA 1101 AN reported progress, and the further discussion
was postponed until this day.
The other Orders of the Day were then disposed of, and the
House adjourned at half-past twelve.

NOTICES OF MOTIONS THIS D.Y.
Mr. Martin (of tealway)--Bill to regulate the proceeding by
Outlawry, and subsequent proceeding by Custodiant thereon II
Ireland.
ORDERS OF THE DAY.
Qualification of Jurors' Bill.--Committee.
Usury Laws Repeal Bill.—Committee.
County Courts' Bill.—Committee.

FOREIGN INTELLIGENCE.

FRENCH PAPERS.

The Paris Journals of Tuesday reached us last night.
The following are extracts
[ From the Journal des Dehals.l
l'Ants, Msaett 22.
The mass of the Holy Ghost for the opt. ing of the
Session of the Chambers, was celebrated to-dav in the Church of
Notre Dante with the usual ceremonial. MM. the Peers of France
occupied in the casement of the choir, at the right of the high altar,
separate seats. The Deputies were placed opposite them. Other
seats hail been reserved for the Staff' of the Division and of the
Palace. Praying desks had been erected for the Royal Family se-
der a canopy suspended from the vault • behind them were the
seats of the Ministers, of the Marshals ofFrance, and of the gruel
ofticeni of the Crown.

At twelve o'clock the retinue, escorted by a body of gendarmes,
by different squadrons of the Royal (hard, and by the Bode-
Guards of Monsieur, reached the square before the church porch te
Notre-Dame.
.Monsieur the Archbishop, in his pontificalia, proceeded, at the
head of his clergy, to meet the Princes and Princesses shorn he
complimented, and who immediately entered the church in the fol-
lowing order:—His Serene Highness the Duke of Orleans, his
Royal Highness the Duke of Angouleme, his Royal Highness
Monsieur • their Royal Highnesses Madame. Duchess of Angoa•
leme, 31adamc the Duchess of Berri, and Her Serene }Degas
Mademoiselle D'Orleans.

The Princes and Princesses having been led in procession to
their seats, divine service began immediately. Al. the Areltbishe,
officiated, and intoned the Vera ereamoy. The mass, with mm/
ended by a solemn benediction. Their Royal Highnesses retuead
to the Tuileries with the same retinue. Oa their way 111:7 was
bailed with cheers and cries of " Use the King !"—"
3lonsieur !"—" Live the Duke of Angouleme !"—" Live the
Bourbons!"
Sir Charles Stuart. the British Ambassador, will give en We&
nesday, the 21th instant, a grand ball. The Gentle:nen w.P. I,c ad.
witted in dominos, and the Ladies in fancy dresses, without made.

The King of Sardinia was to set out on the Vd from Turin fee
limos. It is supposed that the Court will reside during a month
and a ::alf in that city. It win return afterwards to Turin, to
which place the Prince of Carignan will repair from Florence, when
he is a: present.
This morning, at seven o'clock, Delaporte, Renaud, and ()chard.
condemned to death the day before yesterday by the Court of
Assizes t and Pigeonnate, RAKI, Charpentier, and Renard, ees•
rleinncti to hard labour for life, have been transferred to Bical.
Filleul, who was acquitted, has not yet been s.tat liberty.
[From the Corstitadimmell
PARIS, :Willett 22.
The Marquis de Loltl, murdered at Salvaterm, was the brothe:-
in-law to the Marquis of Marialva, late Ambassador of Pante
at Paris. He served in France in the Portuguese Pion, with w
rank of Colonel of the 'hi regiment of Chas.seurs i (*kcal.
A dreadful tire has lately destroyed the ei.devardt Abbe, 01
II erkenrode, an immense building, which served as a srinning arsi
cloth manufactory, situated between Dinh and Hasselt (Nethr.
lands). It took place on the 17th, at eleven o'clock at night. In
the course of six hours the cloths, the machinery, and other Woo'
facturing implements, were reduced to ashes. This disaster leaves
without labour more than MO workmen.

Frt Ellett Ft: lc o IX. MARCH M.--Five pee cent. (,C'o
"enc., at ; eased at liar k ,rock,See-
polite:, 4 pew -nt 6.—u 4111011:., 143 h—in frerca, IM.I. Lxt Nor
Londan—upe moittle, Mli.; ttu a raohtlis, 231. Ilk.

• „ate
w;
and
re game
r of the
opular
:ace the
:ould be
t Ileum
he land.
Head.
ly with
diPlact
°innate
an blow •
by tr-
iads,
race its
righ:s '•
d. Hut
that he
:waning
indeed,
:al.
rineiple
n ton-
Eraxe,
•
It. who
mauling
ippoint-
now, to
El to the
qualify
which
a to kill
Gentle-
-1 Joined
al to in-
It was
:nun. !
eholder
ebran
log ilea
at part
btained
• would •
he right
to if he
111 on I
ithdraw
nother:
am re-
: House
tension
and the
ding by
:real ul
1
1
night.
n 22.
of the
urch of
• France i
alw,
Other
I of the
lily or-
refe the
e grand
damns,
ID dc•
torch al
at the 4
Loin he
the fol-
ini, his
ighnese
Angou•
igbDen
sake se
hbath els 1
I mu=et
7 was • ,
”
line
awe the
Weal-
: ed.
• nsata.
urin foe •
month
uric. to
::, when
'our(
d, COT,
Htr 0t n•
It 2Z
biotite
torugal
with ths
•
,bey of
ing assi
Nether- •
ht. In
r warfo•
it keel
t. COG& I
, Nes- la
ipge