The British Press; or, Morning Literary Advertiser.
London, England, 1824-02-28 00:00:00

Wale tendert of theme who sanctioned it be subject to sertsion.i Mr. HUME, in explanation, said that be had uttered nothing
Os one occasion I remember that a pink:like part of say conduct prtsondly disrespectful.to Lord Beresferd. It was .no answer to
had bees severely animadverted upon in various quartets, and the ItiM to say,. that sines 1819 the establishment had been curtailed.
greatest mortification I felt was, that an opportunity was not then He comp that in 1819 A was three times what it ought to
afforded me of vindicating it. (Hear, hest.) All the Courts of this have been.
country were amenable to the High Court of Parliament. It was i Strangers were then ordered to withdraw, end the House divided.
the duty therefore of this House to exercise a vigilant control over The numbers were—
them, particularly over subordinate Courts, for the higher Courts For Mr. Hume's Amendment - -
tad a greater security for correct conduct in being more immedi- Against it
welt, subject and open to public opinion ; but the lower Courts, in Majority against the Amendment -
the administration of justice, should be watched with peculiar On our eetum to the gallery we found
vigilance, as public opinion was not so forcibly exercised upon Mr. MUSH/EN submitting the following resolution, which
them. With the remission of the House I will withdraw the was agreed to:—
present petition, solely from a dread that a majority of this House I " That a sum not exceeding 7,0291. be granted to his Majesty
may vote against it now, and a precedent be thereby established for for defraying the expense of the Royal Laboratory at Greenwich.'
a practice which 1 conceive to be hostile to the principles of the I It was then moved, " That a sum not exceeding 35,8411. should
Constitution. However the petition may now be disposed of, I be granted to his Majesty for defraying the expense of the Ord-
ain convinced that the present discussion rill not be unproductive nance service on foreign stations."
of some good effects on the conduct of the magistracy throughout Mr. HUME did not rise to object to this grant ; indeed he knew
the country. (Hear) not how it could be lees, as long as this country consented (to
The motion was then withdrawn. the neglect of a specific treaty) to keep up establishment", at its
COMMITTEE OF St'PPLY. own expense, at such places as /ante and Corfu. All the expenses
On the motion of the CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER, attendant on those lonian Isles shuukt be defrayed by the inhabit-
the House resolved itself into a Committee of Supply. I ants of those islands.
Sir J. WROTTESLEY wished to call the attention of the It was then moved that a sum, not exceeding 4,1431. should he
Chancellor of the Exchequer to that pert of his speech on a former I granted to his Majesty for defraying the expenses of the master.
evening, which related to the reduction of the 4 per cents. lie had gunners, &c.— Granted.
stated that one-third of the 4 per cent. stock should be paid off in I It wee then moved that a sum, not exceeding 07,1341. be granted
October, to those who did not accept the transfer of their property, to his Majesty, for defraying the expenses of the Royal Engineers
pursuant to the limitation stated by the Right Honelentleman. lie I and corps of Sappers and Miners.—Granted.
halareserved to himself, however, the power of paying off the re-1 It was next moved that a sum, not exceeding 247,20111. be grant-
maining two-thirds at his convenience :no period was affixed for led to his Majesty for defraying the expences of the Royal Regis
future payment, and no amount stated. Ile wished to know what I ment of A nillery.
were the intentions cf the Right lion. Gentleman, as to the period hlr. HUME said, that he conceived this Regiment of Artillery
and amount of future paymente. twice as numerous as was necessary. He did not mean to depreciate
The CH ANCELIA )1( of the EXC'HEQL'ER said, that what the service, of the Artillery ; on the contrary, he thought it a highly
he proposed was, to pay off one third of the whole stock in October honourable corps, but the establishinent was twice as numerous as
next, to those who did not accede to his proposition of transfer into that which this country possessed at the commencement of the
I the 0.1 per cents. Future payments must be retaliated by govern. French war. Now it was well known to every military man, that
ment according to circumstances, and their ability to pay off with such a proportion of artillery was altogether incompatible in ex.
convenience. Ile therefore had not specified any definite period for tent toteh rest of our army. He was of opinion that the regiment
future payments ; hut as to the amount, he would ray it was the might be advantageously reduced from nine to six battalions.
intention of government not to pay off at one time less than ten per sir HENRY HARDINGE in reply, observed that there was
cent. But this did not limit or restrict them to the payment of one difficulty which the lion. Member for Aberdeen had completely
that precise portion : they might pay off more; they certainly overlooked ; and it was this, that the Artillery received no recruits
would not pay off' leas. from the Militia, nor could they ; so that in the accident of a war,
ORDNANCE ESTIMATES. the regiment must be completed, instead of being ready and elli-
Sir H. HARDINGE rose to propose the Ordnance Estimates clan; for, to render a man serviceable in the Artillery he must un-
of the present year, and congratulated the House on the reduction Idergo a long course of dbortpline: he must receive a species of mi.
which hid been made since last year in this branch of the public I litary education. This was an objection altogether overlooked by
expenditure. The total sum to be expended for the ordinary and the lion. Member, so remarkable for his accuracy.
extraordinary expenses of the present year amounted to 1,119,7441; Mr. HIJME said, that he had not overlooked that objection;
which, as compared with the total amount of last year, was a but if reliance were to be placed on the speech of his Majesty, war
reduction of 98,1461. in the general abstract of the Estimates was not to be apprehended. There was not even a chance of war.
for Ordnance. In stating that the sum to be expended in 1824 The Resolution was then agreed to.
is 98.140 L less than in 1823, it should be accompanied with the It was then proposed that a sum not exceeding 29,6901. be grant-
statement of the circumstance that the Ordnance barracks in ed to his Majesty, for defraying the expenses of the Royal Regi-
Great Britain and Ireland, amounting to 24,0001. had been trans- ment of Horse Artillery.
ferred from the Ordnance estimates to the barrack branch of the Mr. 11U31E wished to ask a question of the Hon. Gentleman,
department. In the department of the Artillery Clothing and Col- whether the recent appointments of Sir Benjamin Bloomfield had
lege* there would be found a reduction of 15,0001. l'owever, this not created sontedisapprobation ?He was told that Sir Benjamin had
was only for the present year, as certain repairs of buildings and been placed over the heads of officers who had long been engaged in
other expenses would require an increased allowance. In the I active service, and that he had been taken from the half-pay, at a
store department there would be found a demand of 6,0001. less time too, when it was impossible he could perform any active regi.
than the expenditure the year preceding. This diminished de- mental duty, for he was Ambassador to Stockholm.
mend arose from the sale of stores and economical arrangements in air 11. HARDINGE, in answer to the question of the Hon.
that branch of the Ordnance expenditure. As to the unprovided Member for Aberdeen, replied that the appointment of Sir Bettie-
estiniates of the year, they would not exceed 1,0901., and to that min Bloomfield had taken place in consequence of a regulation
sum he was confident no opposition would be made. Ily the sale adopted in 1814. By that regulation, officers of the artillery sue-
d certain stores, a considerable saving would accrue ; and he was seeded, not according to their brevet, but their regimental rank.
enabled to state that die whole of the land service of Ordnance This was the course that prevailed from 1814 till within a very few
would not require a larger sum than 616.2:101. The lion. Gen- weeks. It was in existence when the vacancy occurred by which
denten proceeded to ensenerate the various items of salaries to Sir Benjamin Bloomfield succeeded. The Master-General has
superannuated officers, and other smaller miscellaneous estimates, since altered that regulation, but it would hare been extremely in-
in several of which a reduction had taken place, as compared with vithious, and indeed very unjust, to have made that alteration before
the expenditure of last year. Besides, by a short method of ac. Sir Benjamin Bloomfield's, appointment. It would have been a re.
counts, and a rigid economy adopted by the Master-General and trospective act, but the fresh regulation having been made, it will
Board of Ordnance, considerable savings were made. No leas than hereafter govern promotion. He would illustrate the injustice of
230 clerks hail been suspended: very great additional labour was the regulation of 11814. Suppose an officer was to be selected to.
imposed on those who continued in office; and various gratuities morrow foe a difficult command for that service, Sir Alexander
which they enjoyed, and which were objected to in 11115, were Dixon would probably be nominated under the old system; no
discontinued to them. The sum required to barracks for the pre- matter what might be the achievements of Sir Alexander Dixon
sent year was 114.3311. For Ireland the Bernick estimates abroad, when a vacancy arose, some officer at home would be
amounted to 134,3761., which, as comps ed with England, placed over the head of Sir Aleiander Dixon.
was certainly a large sum. But he begged to remind the House, Mr. HUME had also another question to ask the lion. Gentle-
that the increase in the Barrack Department, to both countries, man. He understood that a regulation had lately been adopted by
over last year, was created by a desire to afford augmented accom• which senior officers in the artillery were permitted to sell their
modation to. the soldiers. There was a practice, unavoidable per. commissions. He was desirous of knowing the exact nature of this
taps, in time of war, of having bedsteads in the barracks piled one alteration which his Majesty was pleased to make? To what ex-
over the other, to the great discomfort of the soldiers. However, tent did it go ? At what period of service were the officers of
in time of peace. with a diminished military establishment, it was artillery allowed to dispose of their commissions?
thought proper to provide them with a more comfortable accommo- Sir HENRY HARDINGE said, that the regulation to which
dation, and accordingly many alterations have taken place in the the Honourable Member foe Aberdeen alluded, had taken place,
arrangement of the internal economy of the barracks, to promote and it was found most beneficial. k was confined to officers of 20
that object. (Ilear, hear.) Iron bedsteads, on an approved con. years standing. They were allowed to sell their commissions to
struction, had been purchased for that purpose, and the House off cers of the line. Under this new regulation, eight officers from
would see that the increase in this item of the expenditure was half-pay had lately purchased into the artillery. Under the ope-
created by the necessary repairs, and the other causes he had stated. ration of this plan, ten lieutenant-colonels, one major, and fourteen
The total of the Commissariat Store branch for Ireland was officers of interior rank, had purchased into the artillery, at an ex.
37,6621. 19s. In the various items of reduction it would appear, pense to the country? of 1011. (A laugh.)
that a fair proportion had been observed in the Ordnance Es- Mr. HUME had not asked the question for sake of finding
timates of both countries. After the entimeation of minor miseel- 'fault with the regulltdon; bat seam the great benefit that was
laments estimates, he concluded by proposing, for the adoption of likely to arise from it to one corps,-he was desirous of extending
the House, the first item in the papers laid before the House— those benefits to the marines. lie was sure that if the sinecurea
47,2331. as the salaries, &e. to the civil establishments at the bestowed upon those distinguished persons, who were never known
Tower and Pall-mall. ' to then earn before they Auld it, in wider to qualify themselves
Mr. HUME was gratified to see the Ordnance Estimates pre- for their sinecures--if these sinecures were distributed among
sented to the House in a much more satisfactory form than they that corps, it would be only an act of justice for their long and
had ever been presented to them.. The arrangement of the se- badly rewarded services.
counts was superior to that of last year. Although the sum now Sir GEORGE CLERK observed, that these regulations,
roposed to be voted was less than that of last yenr, yet it was too which he was glad to find received the approbation of the Hon.
large for a time of peace, and was even above the standard laid Member for Aberdeen, were very speedily to be introduced into
down by the Finance Committee as to what the amount of expen- the corps, which was the object of his especial patronage. They
dilute in the Ordnance department shouhl be. Still farther was it had certainly all the merit which was ascribed to them. As to
removed from what the expenditure had been in 1792, which was the Hon. Member's observations upon the sinecures of those of-
his golden era for regulating the expenses of the various insti- titers who held honourable stations in the marine corps, he should
tutions of the couairy in time of e. In 1792 the expense of ternember the services fur which those stations were bestowed.
the Ordnance department was only 444.0001. ; in 1824 (both They were the highest honours that a subject could receive. though
years of peace) it was 1,119,7741. Although this was a decrease their honourable character had little connexion with pecuniary re-
of 98,1461. as compared with last year, it was nearly as great ward.
as that of 1819, although the country had expected a con. Sir I. COFFIN reminded the Hon. Member for Montrose, that
tinually and largely decreasing expenditure in this department. on a former occasion lie said that Government wished to turn the
He would beg leave to read to the House a comparison between navy into an army ; and he should protest against it for his part.
the various sum totals of the Ordnance expenditure since the He would ever defend the marines ; they had saved both the coun.
peace In 1817 the sum total was 1,2311; in 1819, 1,2121. • try and the navy at the time of the mutiny.
in 1821, 1,3261.; in 1822, 1,2411.; in 1823, 1,217 L 9s. ; and Sir. HUME bore ample testimony to the tried loyalty of the
in 1824, 1,1191. ;—so that the House would see there existed marines, and that loyalty had been duly appreciated by others: in
scarcely any reduction between the present year and that of 1819. consequence of it, he believed, the facings of the corps had been
The) establishments at Pall-mall and the Tower, the expense of changed, and they received the additional title of royal: and he
which amounted to 47,0001., he had unsuccessfully attempted to also maintained, that no meritorious body had been less rewarded;
reduce during the last Session. His anxiety was that it should be it was as a tribute of respect to that corps that he opposed their in.
reduced to the state in which 1796 had witnessed it. He was sorry crease; for what purpose should they be augmented ? if the entire
to say, however, that hliuisters had exhibited no symptoms of • fleet were manned, more than one-third of them could not be em-
description to retrench. They kept up the establishment with ex- ployed. They consisted at present of 9,000 men, and only 2,000
tremc pertinacity, though it was clear that the two places were were employed ; the remainder went therefore to add to the rum-
wholly unneceseary. Ile had last year proposed to the House to ber of the standing army. The promotions in the body to which
" reduce the situation of Lieutenant-Govemor of the Tower, and he he alluded were miserably small ; there were in the course of last
was then told by the Right lion. the Secretary of War that the year but eight or ten promotions in the marines, whilst there were
personal attendance of the Lieutenant-Governor was constantly from seven to eight hundred in the army. He also objected to the
required. It was said that the business of the Tower could not go introduction of higher offices from the navy to cunintand them ;
on without his assistance. Now how long had he been there during the officers of the corps should receive the commissions in pre-
the last year? flow many hours had he passed at the Tower since ference ; they must feel disgraced by being placed under the coin-
his appointment? If he was correctly informed, that Noble Lord mend of officeet from another service.
and Gallant General had passed the greater portion of his time in Sir I. COFFIN insisted that it was the marines who were the
Portugal. Now how was such absence reconcileable with the vote preservers of the navy : but for them a sailor could not be kept
of the House last Sessions The Military Committee recommend. aboard a ship. He would no sooner be in at one side, than out at
ed the union of the two establishments ; and what reason was there another. (A laugh) Ile had served many yaws with the marines,
for refusing to unite them ? Let them be united, and he was satin. and knew them well. He never heard a single complaint amongst
fled that a satin of 13,0001. per annum would be effected. The them respecting the matters alluded to by the Hon. hl ember. lie
increase pro was not warranted ; and as this was the first time liked and loved the marines: why thedevil should he not ?(a laugh.)
they were to d that they could reduce no further, he would propose He had served with then for fifty years, aid it was his decided
that which at all events the union of these establishments would at opinion they had eared the country over and over.
once effect—a reduction of 9.0001. from the 47,0001. proposed. Pay of the Director General of the Field TminLlepartment, 1,77111.
With respect the Clerk of the Ordnance, he was quite willing toad- Pay of the Medical Establishments for the military, department
mit, considering the various duties that now devolved on him, that of the Ordnance, consisting of twenty-eight persons, ,7231.
was not too highly paid. The salary. however, of the principal Deduct three sultans serving in Ireland, and paid there, 8791.
Storekeeper, exclusive of fees, antounted to 7301. • and that aunt Establishment of the Piotessors, Masters, &c. Royal Military
would at once be Raved by the union of the two establishments. He Academy at Woolwich, consisting of thirteen persons, 4,2171.
had evidence before him most satisfactorily to show that the sum Additional pay to Officers of the Royal Regiment of Artillery,
which he received in fees was quite enormous; and in a publication for attending the company of gentlemen cadets, 353!.
which he held in his hand (the Perry II ;stories) it was made a Mr. IlUhlE expected a reduction would take place in the number
cause of extreme complaint that the Armory was not exhibited of cadets, according to the promise of Ministers.
but on the payment of 25., which was twice the sum required in Sir H. HARDINGE said, a reduction had taken place, especi-
-1806. Colonel M•Mahon increased that sum of his own arbitrary ally in the number of those who received instructions. There were
motion ; or if he had any authority to justify him, he should be last year 157 cadets—there were at present 127. Ile was sorry to
very glad to hear it mentioned. lie should propose that a reduc. state that the promotion of cadets was slow, in consequence of the
tiun of 9.0001. should be made from the vote proposed. new measures adopted in the artillery,. There were in that service
Sir HENRY IiARDINGE, in reply, observed, that he was at last year 1011 vacancies, which would have given promotions to no
a less to know whether the Hon. Member found fault with petal- cadets ; and these gentlemen, who were possessed of the highest
cube items, or questioned the accuracy of the whole account. qualifications, were without commissions. This was caused by the
Mr. HU:UK—The whole. filling up of e vacancies front the half-pay list. With respect to
Sir if ENRY HARDINGE—Then he should convince the the artillery service, Government had committed an act of essential
House that the proposed reduction ought not to be acceded to. injustice, at the suggestion of the }louse. The act to which he
Since the year 11119 very considerable reductions had taken place : alluded, was putting the officers of that branch of the service upon
there were then 187 clerks, of whom 26 had since beat reduced, be- half-pay ; this was unprecedented ;it was not dune at the close of
sides the labour of the Barrack Department in Ireland, the labour the American war, nor in the year 1802. The reason the cadets
of di; Commissariat stores haul been thrown upon them. There- did nut come in for a greater share of promotion was, that in the
fore, now to propose a further reduction was exceedingly unge- bestowal of commissions, the absorption of the half-pay was ex-
menus, and he was sure it would never receive the sanction of the elusively looked to.
House. As to the Raving of stores, the mode adopted had been re- Mr. IllihlE did not blame the Government; they had acted, in
commended by the Con 111 l ittee of Finance last year. With respect his opinion, withfect consistency.
to the absence of the Lieutenant-Governor, he thought it could be Sir lI.HARDINGE would state another hardship to which the
satisfactorily accounted for. It gas well known that the Noble Lord officers of the artillery were subject. Each officer, on entering the
(Bercafurd) was intimately connected with the Portuguese Govern- service, signed a paper binding himself to remain in that particular
ment in the command of the army. lie was nut allowed to land service, and not to transfer himself to any other.
there on his return from Rio Janeiro. Ile waited till an opportu- Command Pay. Extra Pay to Engineers, and Allowances for
nity occurred ; he then applied for leave to visit Portugal. Ile their servants, 719.21. 17s. faL
went to Lisbon in the beginning of October, and in the latter end Estimates of the Charge of the Officers of Ordnance for the
of November he was written to by the hlaster-General of the Ord- United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland. on account of the
mince, stating that his presence here in Deeember was quite in. allowances to Superannuated, Retired, and half-pay Officers, to
dispensable. To that letter the Noble Lord replied by stating, Officers for good services, to Superannuated and Disabled Men,
that it was impossible for him to execute in that time the business also for Pensions to Widows and Children of Deceased Officers
foe which he visited l'ortugal, and therefore he tendered his resig- I late belonging to the several Ordnance aid Military Corps foe th;
nation. The Master of the Onlnance, knowing his inestimable I year 1824, 3412,31.21. 11s 9d.
value as an Officer, refused to accept his resignation until last IRELAND.
month, when finding that the return of the Noble Lord was still Retired Officers of the late Irish Artillery, Engineers, and Pen-
uncertain, and that the duties of the office - •so important as to dons to Widows, 11,0271. 13s. 3d.

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weie
require his constant attendance, he accepted the rtsignettion of the
Noble Lord, and the Master-General nominated in his place Lord
George Murray, which nomination his Majesty was phrased to ap-
prove of. (Cheers.) Ile apprehended that it was unnecessary tie
him to say any thing in vindication of the character of the Noble
Lord. It stood upon much too high ground to require any aid
from him (Hear.) It was most desirable to retain, if possible,
the services of that Noble and Gallant I Hiker, and for that purpose
every exertion had been nixie to keep the situation vacant fur him.

:Gr. 111 7ill.:could no.t agree that the English people had a right
to pay the contributions for Jersey and Guernsey; these sums,
taken separately, were but small ; but taken together they anusunted
to a considerable sum. lie would make no objection at present ;
but he thought these stuns should not be paid in future by the
public. Ile also thought the works at Fevershatn should be given
up, and he was decidedly of opinion, that every pound laid out
upon these works was money thrown away. Ile conceived it to be
the intention of Gortmturnt, in the year 1818, w remove the estab-