The British Press; or, Morning Literary Advertiser.
London, England, 1807-08-04 00:00:00

MILITIA ENLISTMENT SILL.

Lord CASTLERE.IG m:y •dth- rf
day for taking into furth2r conider.t .i!,:•.a
Service or Enlisttnemt

Lord H. PE t "no rrunity f cr•s.
tioning the Nosle L ird as to hi. intent:les Ann ie•
gat-J to the 'Vrainiag II:II. llc wilted to I!-
stand whether it was ',deeded tirelle to
Bill, by bringing, in a new one, or tn:rely to
an amendment upen it ?
Lord CASTLEREAGH answered, that it %vas
his inteation to propose aa ariarriiiiment t' it.
Mr. WM IlititEskl) observed, that the Howe
would recoiled how the N ibis Lard had been
good as to entertain them by ridiculing that Bili,
giving them a history of the proUble coatlut
of co .:tabus of parishes, and telling them th..t it
was impossible that a man could he trained e.e.,
such assistance; he should he glad to know
country could be put into a proper state of defence.
at a time wilen the Noble Lord himself bad C.-
unified it u being in a forlorn acid coatentptibla
situ mon e
Lord CASTLERE AGA replied. that he should
be extremely anxious to state more fully his re.sons
upon this susjeaa, when the matter was more imme-
diately under their considerati•in.
On the motion being put tram the Chair—
Mr. FRANKLIN rose. and, at considerable
length, strongly objected to the principle of the
Bill. He had little expectation of its wee's. He
could not have conceived that any measure of this
kind could have been in coutempletien of Minis-
ters, as there had been no intimation whatever
conveyed through any authentic channel to ete
Militia Officers. as to their intentions, nor had there
been any regular or timely intimation afforded to
the I-1 use ItSeli. This WA, not only a s sijesa of
coniplaint, but of very serious complain', as he
knew that many persons coaneael with that species
of force, finding nothing ot this kind I.kely to come
forwa. d, nor any intimatiou given of it its the e.rly
part of the Sessiun, had now dispersed thems• Ives
over the country, and who ere no: likely to be pre-
sent at the discussion of a subject of the utin.,s; im-
portance. He hLI to complain too that the Noble
Lord had, in the first opening of his project, hi. ted
at probabilities, and ezmessed dounts as ti
would he his concludons. Had the Noble Lord
been more early in his intimation, or Mare explicit
in his detail of the g neral principles of the met-
Etre, he was convinced that many 11,11 Gentlemen
would have deemed the matter so impertant, that
they w told not have left the lipase at such a time,
had they thought that a measure of this sort west.,
be brought forward. The Noble Lord had shewa
such a degree of hesitation and dtioiety as to the
Bill which he himself had brou3ht in, that he
(Lord C.) bad aduelly introduced an am:ndinent
in the Comm,ttee ; it was perhaps the most imPor-
ant feature in the w'nole Bill itself. That chow
went incidentally to disturb that system, whieni if
it was to be disturbed at all. ought to have
disturbed openly and directly; ai..d. therefor., i. •
hid to complain, that the principal pact of
Bill had not been introduced in a clear and -
find manner, so as to give to the public a not. .• •
of what was about to be dcie. He was anxious
state his sentiments upan this matter, at a time whorl
the Bill had been altered and amended. Ills ()like-
ti ill to the measure was, that it traded to disroei-
rage the Maliaa service. .1 measure, which, it Lew-
snry, ougnt not to hare been introduced incidentally-.
Snell a measure ought to Lye been brought for-
ward A: a great feature of general policy, teil
adapted for the goof of the country, and grnwoi
out of the new state of Europe, and iif ten-selves ;
bitt instead of this, it had been merely introduced.
co!lati-rally and incidentally, as a measure of expe-
diency. He could not entertain those favourerle
sentiments which lie might have done bad it
bas
brought I inward As A great military measure, Calttl-
lited /.0 correspond with the urgency of affairs --
Tile Militia re-girnents had alvantages which n
regiment of the Line had, and were better cake! ted

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for the Wm* tb, cowry • litt great portion of
awe, 1111 bees in silt' service, and were, as far 16
it cc,a peeible, perf:i in field evolutions, not meetly
for ern 4'n,it. for they could fence well wi it the
word W
with could fence ell with a HI. It was his
oreien that the hi litia service was most improtant
totee safety rf this country, and in this opininn he
• confirmed byte Militia Ads them-Ave., which
ceeenen eel by saying, 1. That whereas it h ssen-
e at there be a large force raised for the defence
or es- realm upon the shortest notice," &c. &c.—
Such were the leading festures of these Bilk, and
do' ale r day had shewn that the establishmeat of
them had become more and more important:. If
ttes country ever was to become a Militarr N Ation,
is was Tw -3! e,senti rl that this force should er.ist in
original sure, for we should have a regular army
er trAuseend ant clergy growing out of it. 1h e
Re vim Army, as established upon the till
was a sluggish body of men, giving
Cenatclves up to a miiitery life. after being sits-
.: • i ,•1!h all others But where the whole pen-
have sum-thing of those military feelings. which
`e:r. leg teem parriotic ane zealous to defend their
z ;an Iliberties. how different would be the ge-
t_ char a ter of the connery l It appeared be
all views the most false to suppose, that senpli-
ce era, or one using needful in suojeds of this
eel. It ire•ered to elm that the greater Cie variety
or Ince, tie greater was the security affor 'ed. One
et the met important reasons which hz htd tot-
eirrif ,-in' 1 for the system of his Right Hon.
y end teas. that it had a great tendency to increase
this milt .cry disposition throughout the people. He
could gee iv:lemon why any individuals would be dis-
contentee. whennature had placed them ins iettletlolll
which cal!eJ upon them to defend thee country.
/alu. h ha.. be.ii said against the priVtice of wing
s Inpulsory means. but t're history of modern Eu-
r Fe had sheAn, :h it v.luntary eng.zements were
croidered as mere dengereus to the State than coin•
pale:ly eng.venkhti, and he believed that the jea.
I ,tar which thenc, arises hied been as telly felt an
th:- country as in A .y ; and it was not of these Jr:a-
le-les of our li;wi tie. that our military force
a old grow. He cool t not help, upon this ocea-
e. reading a p4sstge horn the Co iimentaries
the Laws of England. Here the Hon. Viernber
tea.'. that in .1 laud et liberty it was .xtrernely deri-
veas to make a distinct order of the profession of
At ri3. In hi absolute :tlim itchy 'his ntig't be ne-
%treaty he the safety of the P, ince ; but in tree
gees, ell!' es by proFssion were justly deemed
ahjels of je,busy. It was not meth the reign nt
betas. VII that the king had a Standm. Army
ahem ins per; m. The army should nut h;distinet
fi3m the people. &c.
Mr. WeIIISH ED KEEN! said, he had in his
band certain suggestions, whelp he had colieded
from a Colonel of Mill ia, relative to a military
establishment. which he highly Approved of. The
6: sr of these suggestions was to enable Lards Lieu-
tteants of Counties to form themselves into a local
Militia, to be regularly trained for twenty-ergot
t, end not to leave their counties except in cases
of imminent danger of invasion. There might
thus be a force of 160,000 local Militia. The second
suggestion was to enable His Majesty to accept
t: c services cf tine-fourth of the embodied
billing annually into the Regular Army, so that the
emilier would amount to about 20,0*d0 men. the
thiri suggestion wa. te enable Lords LieutenAnrs
of reentres to accept of the services of the local
Militia, to fill up the drafts of the regularly em=
tra•! , J Mlilfii, by ballot. The Furth, t t enable
Leutenants of counties to employ the Stiff of the
I-al llalitia :o train the men of the einiudied
VelitrAi doting the t tc.e th y are not engaged
vr.th rrai^t• tto I:,esi ; and lastly to employ the
it; i Seiff cf t e local Militia. when not otherwise
ene loyed, in veining persons under the TrAining
Act. These suggestions, he theught, were the best
adapted for the purpose of preset mg the country,
and making US a military nation.
The SECRETARY at WA:t said, he ha I in-
tended to make s incl observe ti se; upon what had
fa'len front the Hon. Geo:Leman who had spoken
fi sr, but be rez!ly was at a loss to say what he
aimed at. D:a be mete is propose :he eeopeon of
etoriptil •neasni ,s toward: the increase of .on,
Regular Army 'Plait was no, w!1 at w.anlJ meet
with concurrence at pre:e ::. Tae Right tic.
relatable Gentleman nest ptetended to mike •o.;:e
severe animadversioes upon the Acts of the termer
Session, yet howev-: hestle he was es them, he
approved ma• h of the present ni •asure. b:e4l,,e
it did' not at all interfere with any other sys'em.
It entirely stood ue in its own gr :ends To di,-
corer however the fallacy of the lUght Hon. Gen-
temm's ('sir. Windham) system, it wa. only ne-
cessary to enter into a comparative view of the re-
spective measures, and esti nate their virtues by
their apgrAtent success. He siippreted the plait
brought forward by his Noble Friend (Coat-
re KJ, as, in ins opinion, at would he one the:
uld taise more men for *.!.e I: A r cry, to
1,4 run.,:hs, than tie ,a G-P::e,raage's
had done during tee w:tule time they had been et
toter.

Dr LAWRENCE strenuntr.iy nripse 1 the mea
sore, and dee.il: npnn the mrrots co that of his R•g,-rt
lien frivEJ, which last he thought he mig,l j tot y
I..rrn a porinsvhisai one, for none hut a plidoscsphet
. L. ii bare suggette.l it. He blamed igrin.ters fur
forward their measure at so h a late pi-tiod
the withou: giving an early nat:ce ot their
-..ntions. I lie general cry of the country's bring rn
r;:ir seos what the Noble Lord and hi, cull:A.4;ft'
!5*,,,,51 the defence of their novel Inc Asti:es upon ; but
It 4, rot necessarily follow that our dangin wa;
teal. n..w tha, when tin Army of Re;arve and
1. Dills were itarodoced, when toe tarot
the cou:;try with invasion. He re.:01,0,1
,0,1 the leer when the Noble Lord opplsite l".ra
.fiiendi to these temporary military esp.2.Licnts,
w.the late great muter in the sof.,;olot expedi-
!ore had ississkluerd ; our army since then had beer.
treCTVAWI from 101,000 to 181,000 men. deditfling
~.h."'"30.c0l men wanr.si for our fineign settlements.
ie 26.000 men proposed to be transferred Irvin the
to the regu!ar army, must be replaced, and
Clete V... 11 not time for filling up with effeelive men
loch a chasm, to do any real service, in ease we
were in danger oi immediate contest. Our internal
diftoc e was also otherwise incaeased by means of
mutello Towers; as to Military Canals, he doubted
*hailer wej would be feud of any sezvicc to the

cnnntry. But it was notlel, our m:litary defence
which was to be depended on; we were also to
reckon upon our nav4l superiority, and the ii.jary
which we might do the enemy's fleet in any attempt
at invasion. But although our means of safety were
increased, be feared also that our danger would be
increased by the enemy's keeping us in a perpetual
state of fear and alarm, which would tend to wear
out the public spirit. The nreasnre of the Noble
Ltrd could not be available as to any early prnjettl-
ed invasion, whilst it would injure the Miliria,which
was the constitutional ditlence of the country. The
landed interest had been treated as it they were in-
sufficient for their coun.ry's defence, and either
they would be !irsle to be disgraced in the eyes of
their country, or be reposed to danger, in coming
into the Eeld against the enemy with weakened bat-
tali ins. Ile c•rnsidered it to be essential to keep up
our on its present footing, nor did he slunk
that the new measure would answer the purpose
proposed.
The SECRETARY at WAR explained.

Mr. G. JOHNSTONE declared he had never
heard anv one out of that House, who denied that
the measure under consideration would augment our
military force. The Noble Lord's plan was such
as met with his cordial sunort, and the chief
ground of objeition made by Uentlernen on the
other side of the House temed to be that i; inter.
feted with the system of the. Right Hon. G-rst oppo-
sic, which %ea. evidently defeetiv • ; whil.t, by the
plan of the Noble Lord, 3,000 mr;i wouk he added
to our Regular Army In tit:: alarm of illu-
sion, in 1893. we h ! gr • cer nomher of a
disposable Army, as VOil.l.2,tet:s, when
the &Inger was out so great as it is now, with
a dimint.hed force. But the Hon. and Learned
Gentleman thought that the danger from France
ve.ys less now tha., in former items With such im-
probabilities it w is alto st impoes•nle to hold an
ingsment. But can 7iy one allow himself to be-
lieve that there is les- danger from France now, of
in six months time, when she lett Holland at com-
mend, and every port from the Baltic to Toulon ?
But now, when she would he unah'.e to bring her
regular force to the opposite co •st t eight or ten
montlis to come, now was our me for iiseparing
the m• ansc' defence. for ',lie, did no' forebode
any of these iojorioits efftets, which pro:trued
measure wa, likely tY, produce upon the lil; ;on
the contrary, he believed that the Militia wruld
continue to do its duty r. he country. and :y .t
most formidalsle weapon of defence ; and a
belied alto that by thy. •r-risfer of our Yito
the Line, our means ilefence would h i.,ach in-
creat-d. It was a d-,-1 virrespon • art with res.
sun and common seals:, that when placd under re.
gitlar Offizers, their miliyary know&edgr and capa-
bilities won d incr-ase.

Dr. LA "b* I'.NCE eaplained.
Mr WILIIERFJACE declared, if be coal!
believe th• justness o' the opinion advanced by
the Honourable and Leaned Gentleman, that the
danger, or (as the term was softened), the ern-r.
g ncy of the count, y was not so great, he should
be one of the last to disturb the Military Syst trn
of the country And he thought it was a most ex-
traordinary exlm:ile and of ea of party prejudice,
that any G sticm in sueuld now for the 6r.t time
express a fem., not etat we should feel the force of
France too pest, but that oar publte spirit would
be worn away itt preparation. But had not the
enemy already proved superior to the two greatest
monarchies ? and it so, may he nor now venture
much farther than he would have done before ?
That he may also have obtained greater credit with
his army t , attempt achievements which he might
formerly have shrunk at, more especially as lie had
no enemy new left behind him. Was it not then
erraordinary to hear, on tie other side of the
House, all t is danger exploded.? There was, how-
ever, no room for dismay. He believed that this
country, thre.igh the blessing of Providence, and
the means wiiish she /miscued, would be found suf.
fitietit not only to hale the designs ot the enemy,
but also to transmit to our posterity the bl•ssings
wnich sirc enj •yed. Was there no danger of our
enemy attacking at least some of our toreign set-
tlement ? And to guard against such attempts, waa
it tnt necessary to strengthen these settlements,
w.thottt :no much we Aeon g our internal forc,??
I ha Maks.; 's Ministers were responsible fur the
s.tftty a th• it country at h .ine. as well A• of their
settlements abroad, and he felt disposed to hive them
a considerable degree ot credit tor their vigilance.
Wh •.1 lie rec 11e.Red that a few years ago some of
the first naval and cr.ilitary charaacrs in the country
stat..d, that see vr-re no: secure front the possibility
of invasion, he would ask, ought we nut in provide
against the pi,ssihildy, by all the means which
Providence had put in our posits:. ? Gentle-
men. now in Opposition. took upon them to
say that the country was not in danger ; nor did
t'l^y know the am .unt t tf.e force which the enemy
might oppose to us Under suck circumstances,
it was not philosophical Ve lit'S We were to trust to,
or the calculation flint. s. I he emergency was
great and unparalleled, and sn sh-ulsi be our means
f defence. Ile would call up ,n the Gentlemen
and np n i is country not In deceive themselves.
.Wa . it -or true, that l'asm •parte had conquered
the first mon arc its in the world ? T tat Ids armies
were flushed with sive .ss, and that th y may
venture on an attack which they would not have
dine 'aelore ?—We know what was the conse-
(pence of a false security in G neral Mack
and others. and saw, ourselves. may tue it in a few
months time, it we cf.. not make use of every ex-
ertion. A disposable force was now wanted. and
conaderiag this, and all the various circumstances
n, • passing before us, he should consider it a de-
reliSion of puhli: duty. if he did not afford them
the means they asked for defending the country ;
not but that he felt some danger us the measure
now proposed discouraging the spirit of the
lustitution ; Luc at the same time he
felt himsel bound by superior motives to con-
sent to the measure of the Noble Lord, al-
though with a full view of the inconveniencies
that belonged to it. He also felt that there would
be a considerable difficulty in fillsng up the Maitre
afterwards. To remedy this evil, he should be for
increasing the allowance to the NM who should
&dually serve. lie also wished, that a discretionary
power might be vested in His Majesty to dismiss
these new Militiossen even before the limited pe-
I riod of seven years, its or ler to prevent the necessity

• •
of discharging so large a number as 66,000 men at
one peel dof time. He alt' thought they thou!
lose no time in training the population of the coun-
try to tfe me of arms ; n but that he thourl.t
alterations were necessary in the Training Act ;
but he hoped Pali-men.: would not separate with-
out improv.ng to the utmost that priactple of ill&
fusing a military spirit through the country. Ai-
thnu Himap4rte n.-7,11t know the number of nor
regular troops, he could not know how much rat
the population of the country might be trained and
inc. rporated with nor army ; and this measure of
tracing he thought arGuld be much better now than
at a future lime.

Earl TEMPLE said, that he and those who
thought with him, were not ag-onst an increased
force. hut at the same time they were in favour of
the conciliatory sy.tern which had b•en introduced
he his Right Honourable. Friend (Mr. Windham).
If this wit the moment of IM/TO:tnit danger, why,
he would ask, did not Miniver' bring furward
their plan lone months ago? By a paper he held
in his hand, the success of the military measure of
h's Right Honourable F:iend was devil, ascer-
tained. Comparing e two corresponding r.
riods, from January to October 1405, and
January in Olober Mi. it appeared that there
was an increase of re:ritits in the latter periad,
amounting to 10.709, whilst Vie desertions hitt
decreased in a similar proportion. As a Mt
litia (Nicer, he felt cause to complain that good
faith had not been kept with the Miii ia. They
had a right to be told what was ex;....Cted • I
them, instead of being made suSsecirient to
the purposes of the moment. The plm
now g ,-opo.ed was of the nature of 1 forced levy
ofr the army, and in so un %tr.ti proportion, the add,-
tional burden bearing hitriLo on the poorer classes
ut the community. The N hie Lord (Castlereagh)
th-n out of iilSee, had %tiled itmsrlf t e great friend
of r!,e Miiitia, and was for increasing the pay of
Officers; but now he proposed of the sm.:,
but instead of it, he brought forward this offensive
measure unexpeltedly.

Sr, 10101. SEBOAGHT Fupportei the princi-
ple ut the Bill, but o' jeated to the clvise, giving the
men Cie cption to enlht for lifer or fur a limited pe-
riod

Colonel WOOD, in a very able speech, supported
the mea,u.e, And was proceeding to animadvert
urns the clause Above alluded to, when he was re-
minded by the SPEAKBR, that the qUestion before
the House was not ups any spec.tic clause, but
upon the general principle of the

Mr. WINDA AM observed, that it had been
saii, that he and the G -ntl:men who ad-d wth
him, were not impressed with t' e present cri-
tical situation of the country; but he did not
recollea that he had on any occasion stated
that he was not affeard by the dangers of the
times. How far the measure now proposed was
c dculared to me t the present emergency, or
whether it would answer that emergency tor a 'ono'
or a definite time, was anoth6r tire.tion. If we
cote:J he sere of having a meastir. .-ays ready to
nice( the ;resent de ogtr. he oust confess su:11
measure would be the must desirable ()Net in the
present most awfiel crisis, but how this was to bet h
tained was another question : WAS it to be go •1 oy
the Noble Lord's (Castlereagh) plane C • in'y, in
his humble jolgroent, not. The N' 1. .rd's plan
w t 14111C101.11, and had been the b o• • 't the country
for years. That which wa- h.cnojea of tie late
Ministry to establish, was r i.h]ea of the present
to break down ; and while -n- one en leavoured to
raise the country above the difficulties and em-
barrassments that ovawlielmed her, the other's
ohjea WAS to bring things back to their former
lame,,table situation The present measures were
calculated to obtain immediate r. het, without any
retrospea to future events ; it was like endeavour-
ing to support nature with drams and cordials, ant
where we know these remedies are resorted to, not
to speak figuratively, but praaically, the general
economy of nature is underroked, and the consti-
tution destroyed. The measures of the late Ad-
ministration, whether gond or bad, had for their re-
jea to &stain a-,supply for the Army, adequate to
its consumption, which was never known in any
curer instance. All, however, agreed, that the pie-
s nt was a mere temporary measure, for a tem-
porary supply, and not by any means fit to be
resorted to in cases of necessity or emergency.
liy this measure the army neither paint,' nor lost,
Et. as it increased the one titre', it doninished the
other. As to the measnre he h.,d the honour to
propose, if kV. to itc proper op-ration it would have
produced in the enuise of the next year .30,000
ha, n, arid have had, upon the grounds alone
et the papers before the House, as full an
ef-
lea for raising men for the regular army, as
j the two plans of the Nonle Lord, namely, the
Additional Force AA, and the ordinary recruit-
ing. 'fire former was calculated harshly to drive
poor men into the army, perverting the rune-
' tioos of Constables, Bailiffs, Headborougbs, &c.
Ike. and even *fleeing the Bench of Bishops
and the Judges themselves. He continued, in an
able speech, which we regret our limits will not
permit us to detail, to draw comparative elf.as
between the two measures, and contended that while
the one gate a permanent force to the regular
army, the other must tend t, decrease it every

year.
Lord CASTLF.REAGH, in a speech of consi-
dei able length. combated the arguments of the
Right Hon. Gentlyman, and contended, that while
his plan would ultimately produce a regular force
of 300.000 men. exclusive of volunteers and
teral forces, the measures of the Right Hon Gen-
tle nan would not produce, in six yea•s, as great a
disposable force. calculated tor every emergency,
as his Lordship's plan would produce in the space
of six months. He admitted the Right Honourable
Gentleman's measures vo uld effectually answer the
end of feeding the army, but were not adequate to
any immediate necessity. He took a comparative
view of the state of the Regular Force previou. to
the sanctioned system of the -Right Hon. Gentleman
(Mr. Wadham). and since it was in operation.
Whatever difference of opinion might exist upon
the best means of increasing the Regular Service
of the country. yet it must be urn,. rsally admired,
that the plan which gave an accession of forty-four
thousand man. was at least one which both provided
for the energy of the moment and is ed the
ultimate secs ity of the country. The Noble

Lord entered fully into the merits of the measure.
on cl rqnci.u,l..d with at..rtting. that experience
sr uid prove itc tluotry effefts.
Tile Han then divided upon the clause ;
• . os
. 4a
• •

• 30
1%;•! B;11 WAS then ordered t' be real a third time
this d.ty.

'll4j,;ty

:MIIJ HA COMPLETION BILL.

The re ,nr, of the Co.npletion
taken in:o lus;:ier c And s.• -fral n•rt
cia.isrs were proposed by Lord CastlereAg:i. a:d

- •
•i..
Mr. YOIIKE expresieu a wish. that those bat-
ktted for slioui .1 liable to serve either in Eng-
land or (r-ho L', as •.ccaßioi. might, require.
Sir CFI IRLES POLE pulposed to exempt llit
M4jevy's Servants employed in the Vianalling
Office, in the same mvni.er as t rose servini in
Dock-yards and the Ordnance Department aee
v.:v.-opted by .let from the Ballot, and submitted a
c'suse (or ilia, ,liirpose, which was negatived with-
(Alt a division.
The Bill was then ordered to be read a third time
this day.
The Report of the Irish Militia Transfer Bill was
nest ral.zo into tuithra consider:trim), and sons
fling Amentlmr!as provased and agreed to, au! the
Bill or,:vreJ to he read a third time this d .y.
The comini...ll of the Irish Arms Bill was post-
pone] to this day, and the K' port of the Irish Nis•
'nix Completion Bill was ordered to 'se taken eat*
further consi&r.ition truouo-row.

..The Foreign Grinds rell was reported. and or-
dered to he read a third time tn-morrow.

The I(i.h Spirt Dr I 'lack 131:1 was committed,
and order:d to be rcri..rt,..l this day
l'hr ()Vier rders were then pons Toned. and at
HILF PAST THREE &CLOCK the H me*
-tij toned.