The British Press; or, Morning Literary Advertiser.
London, England, 1819-12-18 00:00:00

charge, of misgovernmeet or write IM the expen ii- Even the Nnele Lord s'a'rail ies opinion, after an
1
tare; Ise mentioned, as proofs. oldie contrary, the ineffectual emhaas inie. that tee continuance
y to V
reduction of sixteen millions. Of taste, at the foie of of the war was a twitter of eecessity. It was not,
tee oar, and the decreased expenee of all the este- I therefore, fair to ascrilw the veer. nr the desires,
teehments. It was his opinion with respect to the I which it was supposed in !ri ave cu .to
sed any party
Me n' chele tramasmions. sleet an impel would be 1 in that House ; foe, et the periarl when the
both cruel mid witserhanneistery, and a greater I greatest efforts were made, the war wee considered
tench of the Conoitutudis slum had for a long time lit war of necessity—of existence. But, linw-
teem place. If an itivesierstints on the one hand i ever dear the war, set• after all, he thought the
esd taken place, and that a party in Parliament I security of the country was cheaply perehaaerl ;
marked those tranaections with cen•ure, and conee- I they had saved themselves., they hal saved Europe,
quesoly threw the weight of Perlionneery disitepro- j and the poorest man in the cosinter, however rim-
Mallon on the conduct of the alegiatretes, it would I tressed, participated in the pride and glory which
not he a desirable thing that Magistrates should be I the country achieved. The deetresses of the
celled on to do their duly, not according to law, I, conotry was created be the elate of her fiereign
!meet.oe to te isions of a poly in Valet- 1 trade—that ar Is clearit.' prvd. for the "Vieille
If, on the ohilserm hand, the isoliduct ofr the i torah state of the countryo e
, us well as the ma-
magistrates was 'approved, and that of the per- 1 nufactures connected with her niters's; cosionmp-
ges •lin promoted the meeting hail been repro- j hon. were in a flourishing condition. Ile felt as
hated, would those presons go to their trial on fair I much for the sufferielgo of the poor as any men,
inure if the weight of Parliament was egainst them ? 1 and if it could he eliewn to him that there
He could not hut covidlemie in the strongest men- I wag any practical mode of relief. then lie would
nee the conduct of Harrison and Hunt, and others ; ! throw
the wind —ll the pri
nciples
ofons poli
tical economy
would die
to
but still he would wish, as they ale Englishmen, Ibut judici atempt
that they should have a fair trial, and that no party touch more harm than gone. Government could
in Parliament should have the opportunity of in- I not take from the pockets of one part of the people
flurociox Judges or Juries, against men who are to ; to relieve another—t
disthey
bute could taut establishawl
a
take their trial in an English court or jnoice. ; ponr wine!. and ri to the right
With respect to the Bill before the. House, lie slid ; to the
l le
af ft, without
fat least esiabdvan celialsing
dsoniltc
not think it was opposed to the true principles of i principe security or the more., a.
the Constitution, but was, on the contrary, intended' was Isis opinion. tlett if any means more than another
forthe protection of the loyal and peaceable, taut were beet adapted to ruin the country, it would
men for the protection of the deluded themselves. I be that of the Government sad the Parliament
Earl GROSVENOR explained. i taking upon then, the support of the poor.
Government were tint inaresible to the distress of
Lord LAUDERDALE said, he aid not believe 1
the country, or inactive as to every practical mode
there Slag nog conspiracy to overturn the Constitu-
of relief. A fund had been established in 1817,
tion in this country. He (lid not agree with his i
under the direction of Commissioners, and there
Noble Friend, that the cause of the public distress ;
was a sum of half a million remaining of that
proceeded from a disregard to the principles of I
economy ; greater causes produced that distress, fund, ready to he lent out, on Government re-
soil, in twiny material iestances since the war, criving security for the repayment. He had on
this subject received communications, particularly
their Lordships did as much al they could to
and Government offered to lend
establish economy. The policy of the. Noble Lords ; from Scotlend,
i nioney, provided the Gentlemen of Scotland would
opposite was the cause of that distres; that policy
1 emigrant to assess themselves; and on the faith of
which had induced them to persevere in a long mid
those assessments, the money would he advanced.
expensive war. When lie considered the present
einstion of the eaautey..-en lie looked back, The Noble Lord next entered into s defence of the
and compared it to her situation in former times, Bile which lie looked on at a permanent measure ;
lie was confounded. Since the year 1794 to the at the same time he was willing to let it have a
year 1818, they had expended a capital of 67() trial, in the first instance, of five years. He said
millions. which, for twenty-four year., was at the spirit of the bull was not against the right of
and lie pointed out various instances
the rate,
ef 428 millions of extra expenditure ; this Petitioning,
, where the public voice was heard in Parliament, as
extra expenditure for a period of twenty-four years.
I expressed at meetings very different from those
created an extra population and an extra demand
i which had been held in the open air. He concluded
for Lebow ; but when that great expenditure ceased.
I by **yin that the Bill was neither opposed to the
it was impossible but that the extra demand for
1 Of the e"glitatti".
fair right of petition, nor to the ancient principles
menefactures should be diminished, it was the un-
avoidable result that the demand for labour, and '
The Marquis of lAISDOWN opposed the Bill at
the wages of labour should diminish. This ex-
...
traerdinary state of things was to he traced considerable length. He was glad, however, to
find that there had been a material change for the
to that oar of twenty-four years which arose and I
1 better in the Bills since they were originally intro-
was coutittuell through the fatal policy of the Go-
duced, and he hoped that still further improvements
eel-emcee. lie could not but emote :nit those mesas would be inside. He condemned, in etrong terms, the
sures, unaccompanied as they were by any measure i
of rehef, or by any thing that could evince the egos- character and conduct of those who had promoted the
late agitating meetings, and he acknowledged the
paths of the Government for the distresses of the pen- Inecessity of putting them down by law, but he
plc. Was it right to peas those Bills, without any !
i could not approve of a departure from ancient prin-
iimeiry into the evil they meant to meet. He div-
approved of those methods of „lee pueeihme„ei. I ciples, and of making Magistrates the inquisitors 1
of opinem, instead of the preservers of the peace.
and of that cold-blooded want of feeling, which he
considered very diagraceful, that would oppose , The most Learned Judges, on long consideration,
measure, for the relief of the poor, because, indeed, were found to diti.er as to whit-. language was or
those measures were supposed to he incousiatent was not calculated to stir up the people to rebel-
wo ii the maxims of political economy. %vete . lion; but the Magistrate was to'decide oti it ate large
those maxims of political economy respected during I meeting. mid without a moment's comideratiou.—
the enormous expenditure of the 24 years war— ' He considered it not the least extraordinary that
mid hat: they now a right to give that answer to the Ireland should be included in this Bill. When the
people, who, by their policy, were reduced to a Bill was intended as a permanent Bill,'lrelatal was
wretched aituation ? He was at a loss to see how I not to be included in its provisions; but when it was
measures for the public relief were opposed to the made a temporary measure, then Ireland was in-
I eluded. The reasoning' as to both countries
ininciples of political economy. Would a direct
were inconsistent—it was said to England, we
tax en landed and funded property, for the relief I
a the manufacturing districts, he opposed to that must deprive you of this right because you have
. abused it ; it was said to Ireland, we will deprive
prirciple ? ‘Vhat prevented them from enteling into
you of it because you have not exerted it.—
public and useful works, MINIS, alla other worke
of public utility ? Ile condemned the measure, I hat" was peaceable and tranquil—there was
wheels complained merely of an existing evil, an tio complaint, no charge of sedition against her—
rail proceeding from acknowledged distress, with. J why, then, was it just or humane to include her in
provisions of so severe an Act ? The Noble
out at the same time manifesting any sympathy for I the
see poos. or pointing omit any Means of relief. If I Lord (Liverpool) had said, that Ireland was placed
by any lin the mime situation as the peaceable parts of Eno-
he saw the Gover 1111 l ent disposed to relieve,
sew, the manufecturing districts, he would go ' land; but would the Noble Lord„disl the Noble Lon
rd
when Ireland was disturbed, mid when measures of
gaud-in-Is with them, but he could discover 1
severity were passed against her, did he say to the
els disposition of the kited. They had heard 1
- I people of England, the county of Down or of
of contributione for the relief of foreign coon
Galway is disturbed, therefore 1 will include all
tries—every peasant in every country in Europe i
England in the provisions of a severe law, which
had, from time to time, been relieved by their 1,
is necessary because of those disturbances ?—No
bounty. IVas it when distress visited their I
matter how Ireland conducted herself, still she
own people—was it when their own manufacturers I
i was the object of infliction, and of suspicion. The
weie in a state of famine. that their helots were to
policy cow pursued towards'
her reminded him of
be closed against the voice of misery ? If they re- I
spirited their country—if they respected the ien., l the Imes of Dryden—
" Your placid looks deceive me not, good man,
of humanity—lf they felt for the true security 1
1 know you mesiewhst murderous acts yeti can."
of their power, they would set seriously about 1 The Noble Marquis concluded by saying. that the
rellevine, by every practical means, the pre-
e 1 great cause of the distress was to be found in an ex
eading distress,. To govern the people by kind- I debt and • , -
_.
~..__
__,__.
__ 1 cessive an overpowering taxation ope-
nesa Iva..
wry
byswt
hmidoidedieoflosgtuorreseetnie "or 7: ;
Lordratio on the diminished means of the country.
the oely BLEstNTON said, that in the Committee
people could be restored—if they did not feel for I lie would move that Ireland should be left out of
the people, it was not to he supposed that the the Bill. From the papers on the table or from
people would feel for them, or could retain those I any other source. there could not be brought for-
t.. .temp of reverence end attachment for the inati-
which I ward the slightest_ evidence to justify such an its-
tuitions al d Government of their coition., ction on lreland•
formeily distiuguished the patriotic loyalty of Eng- I Lord HOLLAND condemned the Bill, as uncon-
lishenete s Menial cruel foolish, and mischievuus : un-
The Earl of Lteeneoot. said, he did not believe 1 c-toinistitutio'nal, because it fritted away the right of
'lust the public distress was the cause of the die. petition—cruel, because it made it felony for one
affection ; but he slid' believe. that those who abused I
man to !latest to aeuther—foolish, because it only
that dieeffection could not have carried Oa their 1 telided to eggrevate the evil—and mischievous, he-
schemes if it were not for that sham
es. The die. ' cause it would drive the people from pitlelic meet-
tress of the people was a powerful iostrumeut to
1 inns to private conspiracies, and imam" of clamour,
their hawk, but the distress was test the cutter of I • - would
!1 it stove theist to use the dagger of the eases.
else alinmetent ; 00 the coutrary, lie Itati the in... .
I nut. . uheNoble Lord said, he would not divide
%beensatiest from .English tie 1111 l hictirrere,
ww-1 be I the House, but would in the Committee deliver
loolietirti it was precisely the smite with respect to •
her opinions more at large.
etectolatel.•that those well were must disatieteed Their Lordships, without a divisions resolved to
.wete mimosa wine were least distressed—and, in fact, Igo into a Committee on the Bill on Monday next.
• that tee most discontented had abundance of 1 The Earl of ,
CARN•RVON then 'flayed, that the
.wages. The Noble Lord (Lauderdale) had said. I Committee
that the rnisfortoues of the country grew out of the I the
Ball to the Ist day of July, 1822.
pokey a the Cover:orient, and out of a war of The House divided, when there appeared—
four years. [Here his Lordship went into !lie Motion—Contents ..........20
ivreniys
as tlefehee of the Government, as connected with Proxies ifs
the last war.] The Noble Lord should, lie said,
have see wis that time war could have been
avoided. It was on all hands ailoweir that it
cantle mot, and for sixteen }ears pietious to 1814,
else VW was considered' an necessary, that front
MO platy was there a word of peace beard.—

- 38

A;ainst it—Not COlPtiflliS
PrJaier.
-- 135

Majority against the Motion.. 97
The [louse then adjourned at Two O'CLOCK.

Hir.:sr, or commoNi, riotuy, DryExaillt 17

Sir 11 PARY►f.t gave notice. tlot mt 11nrithe next b►
irnot.l nt••r► for I.ivr to bring in Roil fur the briter rega•
ut Puna at Elictiono in Ireland.

I'ENRYN.
On the motion of S.r C. BURRELL. That the
further consideration of the 8ri0,..c on the Pcisr}u
Bribery Bill be po•ipunrd its Alatsslay she '2141 of
February next, the lion. Ilar.w.et Fkillf, that jo, had
Wit entirely to ale up his mi:•11 as to the ioe("e
(-drum lie might adopt troll respect to l'etoy...—
Mr mind was not made op, whether he would
porsue the faille line that was intended to he taken
with re.prct to Gramposuid. Ile was Iherelare Ili*.
posed to postpone the Co.u.i.terasisi of the tlue■tion
until after the recess, when lie hoped lii rt.trlVe the
support and co-operation of lion. Members.
Mr. V. BLAKE Suitt a few words, which were ilk-
-1 audible in the gallery.
IMr. WYNN 'Mil. there was one strong objection
; to the Grampoutol Bill ; it wee by that lull pro-
posed, that unconvicted voters Of Grampounsi
should have votes for the county. Ile thought that
the representation of erosion...A should hr a!ways
held sacred, but the Bill intended to bring house-
holders., sort other voters. on an equality with the
county freeholders. Ile thought, that v here slit-
feretit boroughs in the same Calluity were 411111'311-
chimed, the unconvicted voters of those corittilm-
tary boroughs might be allowed to return distinct
Members. This principle wait meted on in Wtstro.
and was not felt to be at all iticonvessieitt ; and for
the accommodation of the voters, it would be ra•y
to introduce a clause in the Bill, to authorize std.
jourtimvuts of the poll.
Sir C. AloacK considered the plan heretofore
adopted, of tending the franchises to the adjacent
hundreds, one which was attended with rut-chief
sod inconvenience, as it frequently happened that
a forty shilling freeholder had, by virtue of his
, single holding, the right of voting for various

Members.
After some further conversation between Sir C.
MON CK. Mr. D. CII.nEItT, and r.
Oanow. the further cunsiderumm of the Itiout
was postponed to the Vet of Ftimunry.
IRISH ELECTIONS R 11.1..
On the motion of Mr. C. W. WTN N, I lip House

resolved itself into • Carnmittre on the Irish Flee- '
tion Bill. The Report wan, Teemed, Bud the Bill
read the third time and passed.
ENGLISH INSOLVENT DEBTORS' BILL.
Lord ALTMORP brought up the &ghat' lii.ol-
vent Debtor'. Bill, which was read a 111.14 tune, and
ordered to be read a second tittle on the 16th of
February next.
Mr. CALCRATT said, lie entirely agreed in the
propositions laid down by the 11;11, and he merely
rose to call the attention of the Noble Lord to
some observations, which. no doubt very ten-
tionally on the part of his Noble Friend. greatly
wounded the feelings of a respectable individual.
the late Chief Clerk of the Insolvent Debtors'
Court. Ile (Mr. Calcraft) knew that individual
for many years, and he never tiered or knew any
thing of him that was not much to his credit.
Lorkl ALTHORP explained. He did not intend
to throw any imputation on the individual alluded
to in the observations which he made ; in the-inves-
tigation before the Committee nothing whitever
came out that could subject the individual to ern-
sure. His observations were of a general nature as
to the propriety of the reform of the Court, and not
intended to affect the late Clerk, whose conduct lie
tow no moron to censure.
On the motion of Mr. CALVERT, on account
was ordered of the Duty on Hops of the growth of
the year 1819.
ORDNANCE ESTINIATES.
On the motion of Mr. It. WARD, the Votes on
the Ordnance Estimates were postponed to Monday

next.
Lord A. HAMILTON presented a Petition from
Lanark, against the Duties on Malt.
Mr. Alderman WOOD said, that utter the recce.%
he intended to submit some prositiou to the House
for the appropriation of Dartmoor Forest for the
employment of the poor.
Mr. Serjeeut ONSLOW said, the worthy Alder-
men should first ascertain whether Dartmoor
Forest was private property.
NEWSPAPER STAMP DUTIES BILL.
Lord CASTLEREAGH moved the Oilier of the
Day for the further consideration of the Report on
the Newspaper Stamp Dullest Bill.
Mr. JOHN SMITH said. that a respectable and
useful portion of the couninunity, the booksellers,
were under very painful apprehension that the Bill
would have the effect of militating against their
interests. He would therefore submit to the Noble
Lord, that, independent of other consideretioes,
time ought to be given fora full and due manias-
tion of the provisions of the Bill.
Lord CASTLEREAGH said, that the general prin-
ciples of the measure might be then discussed, and
in the interval between this and Monday, there
would be sufficient time afforded for the examine.
tion of the details of the Bill.
Sir C. BURRELL suggested Tuesday.
Mr. J. P. GRANT mid, that when he applied at
the 'Vote-office for * copy of the Bill, lie was in-
formed, that there were not sufficient copies for the
use of Members.
The SPEAKER said, that the usual number of
copies had been printed for the use of Members.
Mr. J. P. GRANT resumed, and said, it
did appear to him that this was by far the most
important of all the measures proposed to Parlia-
ment. principally when considered as the foundation
of future legislation. He put it, therefore, to the
Noble Lord, whether there was any necessity fur
pressing forward the measure at present. It seem-
ed to him to require the most mature consideration
and ample discussion from the House.
Lord CASTLEREAGH said, that the principle of
the Bill seemed to his Majesty's Ministers to be of
great importance,_(Hear.)—So far lie agreed with
the Hon. and Learned Gentleman ; but he candid-
ly confessed. that if some measures were not taken
to deliver the country front the abuses of the press,
he thought the consequeuces would he pregnant
with danger and calamity. All toe changes iiitr. -
ducrd consisted in mitigating and narrowing the
operation of the measure. If Gentlemen ow site
objected to the details, they might be discussed 011
Monday uight, but lie had hoped that the princi-
ple would be debated this night.
Mr. BROUGHAM said, that he had thought the