Northern Times.
Liverpool, Merseyside, England, 1857-12-18 00:00:00

-e251 0 0

which sum we declare we receive in full discharge of our claims
respectively upon the voluntary rata, and th at we will not again,
either directly or indirectly, bring forward the same claims in any
quarter. JAMES COLLINS,
JAMES Hoses,
GEORGE ATKINS,
KINDER LIVERSIDGE.
Under such 7ircniastamtes the Voluntary Rate Committee see
that, in the faithfaal discharge of their duty ,owards t'is contributor&
of the Voluntary Fund, they would not ha justified in making any
farther payment to the parties named, and that the balance now in
hand should be restricted to its legitimate objects, including the
emairtrati,n of poor persons chargeable to the parish, and the Parlia-
mentary expenses iccurred on its behalf.

C. FREDIIYUCK CAnNE, Chairman.
Liverplol, 7th April, 1855.
at an adjourned meeting of parishioneers, held at Easter,
1855, a-resolution beingthen carried, advising the volun-
tary rate committee to pay over the balance of 1:575 4s 5(1
to Messrs. Liversidge, Atkins, Hobbs, and Dr. Collins,
the meeting dissolved without electing a new committee.
The members of the parish parliamentary water com-
mittee then urged their claim upon the voluntary rate
committee for the £576, but were threatened with legal
proceedings if they appropriated the money in such a
manner. On the other hand, Messrs. Liversidge, Atkins,
Hobbs, and Dr. Collins threatened proceedings if it were
paid otherwise than to them. Placed in this dilemma,
the money had been held in abeyance ever since, and to
meet the difficulty fairly, and with the least offence to
any, it is not proposed to do, what some think should
have been done in 1855, elect a new committee, and when
that committee had chosen its treasurer, Messrs. Carne
and Hutchison will hand over the balance, that it may
he used for the purposes for which it was contributed.
We shall therefore now proceed to the election of a com-
mittee.

Mr. Denton said, in order to facilitate the business of
the meeting. he begged leave to propose that the old
Voluntary Rate Committee be appointed again, in collec—
tion with the present churchwardens and overseers, to
dispose of the fund as they thought advisable, in accord-
ance with the resolutions already read, and adopted at
the meeting of the 19th of April, 1852. The following
were the names he would propose :_The Rev. Rector
Campbell, Messrs. C.Y. Carne, Robert Hutchison, Chas.

Wilmer, John Hand, Joseph Gardner, Joseph Shakeshaft,
Hugh Molyneux, Richard Johnson Bigham, H. W. Banner,
John Whitley, George Summers, Thomas Savage, S. B.
Jackson, J. Denten, Thomas Luff, Edward Bradley, John
Woodruff, J. Shaw, Bairstow, Owen, Smith, and Crellin.
Mr. Molyneux seconded the motion.
Mr. Nevison thought the motion did not state sufa•
ciently what the committee:was to be constituted for.
Mr. Denton said it had been already stated by the
Chairman. Ho considered that the Chairman had fully
explained the duties of the committee.
The Chairman : I think, gentlemen, YOR will see at once
that it would be utterly impossible for us to settle any
question which may be disputed between one parishioner
and another, and which may arise oat of our proceedings
of to-day. Snch questions we cannot settle here. I think,
therefore, we had better confine ourselves strictly to the
specific object for which we have been called together.
I have already read the instructions given to the Volun-
tary Committee, which were laid down in the year 1852,
and by which, I conceive, the committee will still be
guided.
Mr. Atkins thought there might be some objections
raised to the Rev. Rector's name, which stood first upon
the list. It would be in the recollection of gentlemen
there that the Rector had more than once declined to act
in matters in which he stated to be extra-parochial, and
not coming within his province as Rector of the parish.
On that ground he should object, to the Rector being
named on the committee.

The Chairman: In reply to that, I may state that the
Rector has never declined to act with the parishioners
when they called upon him to do so in connection with
these proceedings, and I do not think he will decline now.
Mr. Atkins : If my memory does not fail me, 1 think he
did so at the adjourned vestry of 1854.
The Chairman: I think he always very properly dis-
tinguished between that which was strictly and legally a
parochial proceeding and what was extra-parochial, and
refused to take any part in the proceedings until the
vestry meeting was dissolved, and a public meeting
constituted ; but he never declined to come forward when
we called upon him to do so, and I do not think he would
now.

Mr. Atkins : If that period be-referred to, I think you
will find that the meeting stood adjourned from the Easter
vestry for a fortnight, strictly to consider the disposal of
the voluntary rate fund. When the meeting assembled,
part of the business was gone through, and then the
Rector interrupted,
The Chair.nan : The Reetor was not upon the last list,
and he felt himself aggrieved because he was not.
Mr. Atkins begged to propose, as an amentment, that
the Rector's name be withdrawn.

Mr. Liversidge believel they had been called together
that day for the purpose, as the announcement stated, of
appointing a committee to receive the balance now in the
hands of the ex-churchwardens, and it seemed to him
rather a singular course of procedure to propose a reso-
lution which did not accomplish the end for which the
meeting had been called. They were called together to
elect a committee to receive the amount, and yet Mr,
Came and Mr. Hutchison were to remain on the com-
mittee. What ground had they to feel satisfied that the
money would change hands, that it was transferred from
the ex-churchwardens, Messrs. Carne and Hutchison ?

The Chairman : It may save a great deal of time if you
allow me to an; ver the question. Both these gentlemen
authorise me to say that if a committee be elected by the
contributors to this rate, they will immediately hand over
the money to that committee.
Mr. Liversidge : To themselves—they will. hand it over
to themselves. They are upon the committee.

The Chairman: But they are not the committee. They
are only private individuals like myself. The committee
will have to appoint its own Treasurer, and the Treasurer
will at once receive the money from 'Sr. Carne and Mr.
Hutchison.

Mr. Liversidge : I think Mr. Carrie and Mr. Hutchison
ought to be left out altogether.
The Chairman : Well, when we come to these names,
you can propose any gentlemen you please in their stead.
The amendment proposed by Mr. Atkins hiving received
no seconder, fell to the ground.
Mr. Liversidge then proposed, as an amendment, that
Mr. Carne's name be left out of the list.
Mr. Atkins seconded the amendment..

Mr. Hutchison said the chairman had set forth very
clearly the history of the voluntary rate from its com-
mencement. He had taken an opportunity a few days
ago to explain to several gentlemen who took an interest
in the question the position which Mr. Carne and
himself occupied with regard to it• ; and, in those
days of newspapers, he had no doubt that most of
them had seen some report of the meeting. Bet,
for the benefit of those who might not have seen it, he
would recapitulate one or two points which would
perhaps guide the meeting in. coming to a decision.
When Mr. Carne and he were elected in 1853, there was
a balance in hand of £260. The vestry elected in 1853
passel a resolution that the claims Of Mr. Liversidge and
others, for further payment, on account of the expenses
to which.it was alleged they had been put, should be
referred, for consideration, to the Voluntary Act Com-
mittee. After many meetings, that Committee resolved
that .£2sfi of the old balance be appropriated to them pro
rata, with which the claimants were satisfied. At the
vestry of 1554, where, according to the usual custom, the
Voluntary Rite Committee should have been re-appointed
—the meeting broke up without doing so. He was not
prepared to say whether there did really exist any legal
tschnicality which would upset all their proceedings or
not—there was no doubt of this, that if the Committee
had takeu any steps, they might have involved themselves
in a good deal of difficulty, because many gentlemen—and
among them lawyers too, held that the Voluntary Rate
Committee had expired by flexion of time, having been
only elected for twelve months. Others again contended
that the Voluntary Rate Committee was still in existence ;
it was considered, therefore, the best way of meeting the
difficulty, to call the subscribers to the fund, and them
only, together, because they only were the owners of the
money, and let them appoint a new committee to supply
the deficiency of which they had been guilty in 1854.
That was the primary object of the present meeting. It
would afterwards, perhaps, be for the consideration of
thr meeting, whether they would give instructions to that
committee.

The Chairman: We cannot entertain that subject
to-day.
Mr. Hutchison said the only business then for which
the meeting was called, was to appoint a committee.
With regard to the election of members, he could say that
the Rev. Mr. Campbell had expressed his willingness to
serve on the committee, and felt aggrieved wen his
name was omitted in 1853. That was, he thought, quite a
sufficient answer to Mr. Atkins. With regard to the
other point, he confessed his own feeling was, that Mr.
Carne and he ought not to be re-elected en the committee.
(Hear, hear.) But, however, he would not stand in the
way of whatever was agreed to, especially because ho
knew the question so well in all its bearings, that he
could say the greatest forbearrnce was necessary on the
part of all of them. (Hear, hear.) It was the desire of
Mr. Carne and himself, to have the question settled as
amicably as possible, and it appeared to them the most
straightforward and satisfactory way would be, that all the
gentlemen who contributed money for the purposes defined
in the resolution read by the Chairman should meet and
re-appoint the committee, rather than that Mr. Carne
should proceed to do an act which they were called upon
to do by • several gentlemen, who thought they could
oblige them to pay money twice over, or to pay it to
parties who had already given a receipt in full of all
claims. (Question, question.) If a committee were
appointed that day, Mr. Came and he would at once
hand over the money to the Treasurer who should be
appointed by that committee. It appeared to Mr. Carrie
and himself also, that to avoid any invidious remarks, it
would be better to re-elect the whole of the old committee
without the exception of a single name, adding the pre-
sent churchwardens and overseers. •

The Chairman: Na the churchwardens 'and overseers
as such ?

Mr. Hutchison : No, by name.

Mr. Carne said that it was well known to the chairma❑
and other gentlemen that both ➢lr. Hutchison and himself
were desirous of leaving the committee, but it was thought
that as he (Mr. Carne) was well acquainted with every
circumstance connected with the matter in dispute, from
having attended all the meetings of the committee, it
would be proper that he should be elected on the new
committee, in order to give any information that might be
required of him. Ho had attended every meeting of the
committee—he had, on almost every occasion, presided as
chairman, and for himself he thought it would be judicious
to name him cue of the new committee.

Mr. Liversidge moved that Mr. Alderman Bennett be
elected i❑ the room of Mr. Came.
Mr. Atkins seconded the amendment.

Mr. Liversidge asked if the votes of the parties who
contributed to the voluntary rate of 1852 would be taken
Mr. Hutchison replied that he fully expected:that such
a qaestion would be put, and in answer he begged to say
that only those who contributed to the voluntary rate of
1853-'54 would be allowed to vote. He would take all
the responsibility of receiving their votes and theirs
alone, whatever it would cost him. That he conceived,
was perfectly clear and straightforward. Furthermore,
the getting of the money was dependent on his signing a
check, and he begged to say that he would not sign it
except on that condition. He presumed he was then
addressing contributors of 1853-'s4,and the course he would
take was this :—they would now appoint a committee
to receive the money_ from him and Mr. Carne ; the com-
mittee would then meet and elect their officers, a
treasurer among the rest, and to that treasurer he and
Mr. Carne would hand over the money bodily and
entirely.
The votes were then taken, and there appeared—For
the amendment : Messrs. Chesney, Avison, Faggerty,
Atkins, and Critchley. It was found, however, that
Messrs. Faggerty, Avison, acid Critchley had not paid
the rate of 1853-4, and their votes were, in consequence,
struck off—Against the amendment : Messrs. Lowe, Sum-
ner, Shakshaft, Molyneux,lCarne, Howarth, Denton, and
Jackson. The votes of Messrs. Sumner, Shakshaft,
Molyneux„ and Denton were disallowed, they not having
paid the rate of 1853.4 The amendment was therefore
lost by 2 to 4, and Mr, Carne declared elected.

The next name was that of Mr. Robert Hutchison.
Mr. Lowe moved, as an amendment, that Mr. James
Thomson be elected instead.

Mr. Critchley seconded it. 71 '
A poll was taken, when it was lost*,,by 2 to 4 (the gating