The British Press; or, Morning Literary Advertiser.
London, England, 1825-05-13 00:00:00

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PARI.I.4MENTARY INTELLIGENCE.

IIOUSE OF LOR II3DAY, May 12.
As it vas Holy Thursday, theirleordships did not sit to-day.
HOUSE OF COMMONS, TUtaSDAY, MAY 12.
EAST INDIA REVENUE.
A person from the India House brought up a statement of the
amount of the East India Company's revenue.
IRISH AIANUFAi•TURES.
SirJOHN BRYDGES presented a petition from the noblemen,
gentlemen., traders, and manufacturers of the county of Waterford,
in favour of the Irish Manufactory Company's Bill. The peti-
nioners loafed it to be their opinion that the encouragement of such
eompanies wbeld Steady conduce :o the prosperity, peace, and
happiness of the Irish people.—Laid on the table.
LEITH DOCKS BILL.
Mr KENNEDY, in consequence of what had taken place in
the Committee on that Bill, moved ihat the evidence be printed.
After some observations from Ale DUNDAL, Mr. KENNEDY,
and Mr. J. P. GRANT.
The evidence was ordered to be printed by the authorised printer
of the !louse, at the expense of the parties.
The SPEAKER taking the opponanity to observe, that the
potence of printing evidence through the means of printers not au-
thorieed by the HOOST was contrary to the law of Parliament, the
appointment of a printer by the House being intended as a guard
against the substitution of any other evidence by the parties than
neat which was taken before the Committee, and as a security fur a
leithfel transoeipt under Its immediate sanction and authority.
`CARNARVON RAILWAY.
On the motion that the Report on the Carnarvon Railway Bill
he brought up,
Mr. BERNAL moved, as an amendment, that the Bill be re-
committed.
Sir ROBERT IFILLIA:1113 said, that the parties opposing
this Rill were connected with a mining company, and acted from
interested motives.
Mr. BERNAL denied the imputation. if applied to him. and
hoped his Honourable Friend knew him better than to suppose he
could be guilty of opposing any public Bill on private motives.
He had no connection whatever with the mining company men-
tioned.
Atlas a few weenie from Mr. DAVENPORT end Mr. WORE,
The amendment was negatived without a division. the Report
brought opt and time Rill ordered to be read a third Date.
BASINGSTOKE CANAL.
Mr. S. SMITH presented a petition from the Provost and Fel-
lows of ibe Royal College of St:blare, Eton, against certain parts
of tie Basingstoke Cana Bill.—Befeired to the Committee.
HULL DOCKS.
Mr. DENISON presented a petition iruen certain merchants of
Loudon and Southwark connected with the trade to Kingston-on.
Roll, against some parts of the 'lull Docks 8i11....•-Referred to the
Committee onsaid Bill.
COUNTY COURTS BILL.
Lord AIiTHORP presented a petition front the inhabitants of
Manchester. in favour of the County Courts Bill.
Mr. 0. PHILLIPS presented a petition from Bolton, in Lan-
ceshire, in favour of the County Courts gill.
These Petitions were laid on the table, and ordered to be printed.
COMBINATION LAWS.
heint-VILTON presented a petition, signed by 5,000 persons
of Sheilidjli praying that no alteration may take place in the Com-
bination bias, and that the repeal of the last Session be left tin.
tonetted.--Otdered to be printed.
IRISH FItEEHOLDERS' BILL.
Mr. GRATTAN lee • g a petition from the county of
Monaghan, ' Bill, again expressed his
eversion to the t of so large a portion of the
peasantry.
Mr. S. RICE said the Bill was not intended, an wan generally
supposed, to disfranchise real freeholders, but leaseholders, and
thnee who voted from fictitious titles ; an far from being a limitation
of the right of voting, it was, in his opinion, a real extension.
Mr. ()RATTAN thought it a monstrous proposition to assert
that the alteration of the qualification from forty shillings to ten
pounds, was not a limitation of the right of voting.
Mr.- HUME could net understand what the Hon. Member
for Limerick meant by saying it was an extension of the qualifies-
nen. The Bill of the lion. `!ember for Staffordshire (Mr. Little-
ton) was intended to take away from all future forty shilling free.
holders the right of voting, and fie the future qualification at the
sum of ten pounds; now. if that was not limitation, he really knew
not what wee. The llor. Member for limerick said that it was
intended to put an end to the practice of fictitious voting and the
evil.; attendant upon it. If there was such a practice why not put
an end to it at once by some specific measure ; that would be the
proper method of dealing with the evil, if it existed. He begee
leave here to observe, that it had been stated he dill not, on account
of his hostility to this Bill, vote for Catholic Emancipation. That
was not correct ; he had attended in his place, and voted in the
majority, which he was sorry did not prove much larger.
hoed ALTHORP said the Bill was one of best and wisest
jreasurea which had ever been sent forth from that House. It
would put an end to that system of dividing properties which had
wholly extinguished the power of the middling and independent
deem in Ireland. It would again give those middling classes that
relative importance tbcy before possessed, and take away from the
iniatocracy the means of converting great counties into close Ito.
roughs. The measure had his unquelified approbation.
Mr. LITTLETON argued, that as not one individual now
livinX would be deprived of their present right of voting by the '
Bill, It could not be very properly called a measure of disfranchise-
anent. It was a virtual extension of the legal power of freeholders,
by removing that mass of fictitious votes which overpowered the
expression of their opinion, and therefore both an extension of their
right and an obvious reform. The Honourable Member fur
Montrose (Mr. Hume) supported every proposition for a reform of
line representation of his own country (Scotland), and he (Mr.
Littleton) did not see on what principle he could deny the Jame
Cawood to Ireland, when it was known that It would put an end to a
TiTtitTOUS system of representation. He would ask, what a repre.
'tentative of the fair and liberal feeling of any county in England
would think, if one or two gentlemen of large property commenced
Ropier's of cutting up their esta•es into small freeholds, and there.
by drowning, at the next getter:ll election,the honest and intlepend• ,
cot voices of those who had hitherto trusted them with the preset.- '
vation of their rights and interests ? Would they venture for a
moment to stand up in that House, and support such a system ?
'Would they not give an instantaneous assent to any measure that
would pat an end tow practice tending to destroy all liberty and
independence? Such was precisely the case in Ireland, and he
would consider himself unworthy to retain his sent in that House,
returned to it as he was by the uninfluenced voice of one of the
malt populous, wealthy, and liberal counties in England (Stafford-
altiree If he did not do his utmost to put an end ma practice so
much at variance with all the principles of tree representation. He
had been induced to trouble the lloase with these few observations,
from a consideration of the ignorance which he observed was pre-
valent on this subject ; and from a desire to put an end to the miss
understanding, misrepresentations, and misconstructions, which
had totem from the proposal of an alteration.
Sir J. NEWPORT said he knew many counties where men of
property refused to register their votes. from a convictitm that they
would in every case he overwhelmed by the fictitious votes of some
great landholder, and that there was therefore no use in creating a
right which they could not exercise. lie, for his part, did nut
know how any man alto hall read the evidence on this subject, or
knew at personally. could refuse to put an end to a system so nib'.
ehievous, or consider it at all as a disfranchisement of legal
voter*.
Mr. S. BOURNE considered the subdivision of estates one of
the greatest evil!' attendant upon the present state of Ireland. The
greater part of the freeholds were held at a rack-rent, and therefore
they had no pretensions to be considered like the forty shilling
freehold., known in England. Ile thought a measure more im-
portant to the welfare of Ireland had never passed the House.
kir. IV. W. BECHEIt expressed his disposition to support the
Bill.
Mr. AIONCK said they should rather disfranchise the pot-
walloping voters of English boroughs. Ile condemned the Bill,
and declared hit intention to oppose it.
Lord 311s,TON declared himself favourable to the Bill, and
thought his Honourable Friend ( Hr. Hume), front the expressions
which had fallen from hint on the subject of Scotch representation,
would, when he considered it thoroughly, be inclined to support
it. He admitted th:tt it would disfranchise a great number of
voters : but he could riot, from its connection with the teat mea-
sure of Catholic Eauncipation, and from hie conviction that it
would in some measure conduce to the ultimate success of that
great national advantage, refuse to give it his support. But what
the ruse principally for was, to ask the Honourable Member for
Staftimlshire (llr. Littleton) whether it was his intention on that
Ought to go into the Committee on the Freeholdere' Bill, or whether
he would not consider it expedient to postpone its further considers-
ten until the fate of the Ruiner, Catholic Bill was detennined else-
where; for unless that Biil should prove successful in that other
place, he apprehended it would be quite absurd to think of pressing
on the accompanying measure in that House. (Hear, hear )
Mr. LITTLETON 'aid he felt happy that the Noble Lord had
asked the question. as it was one which had been put to him several
-times, both in the House sad ont of doors. Ile begged to say that
he had noilbjectien to postpone the further consideration oa his
own part, but that he felt himaelf precluded from announcing a
positive determination upon the subject, without the consent of the
Hon. Members for Armagh and Down. if they acceded to the
Noble Lord's suggestion, tie had no objection ; bat he at the eame
time hoped that his doing so would not he construed into any want
0: good faith on his part, for lie deettred most solemnly that up to
Alt night he had not entertained the slightest intention of retarding
site usual course.
11r. FORDE said a few words in a low tone of voice. We
understood him to express his consent to the arrangement pre-
-posed.
BROWNIA)W, with great emotion, and in a tone of voice
'ti low as to be nearly inaudible, said he left the matter' entirely
711 the hands of the House; for he was compelled to say, that
atter havine 'civet' the subject his most attentive consideration, and
listened ',lift the mast intense anxiety to all that had been ad.
..uneed fur and against Catholic Eatar.cipation, he -felt that he
would now vote fur that measure, whether it was or was not
eeeonipantetl by thmenother Bills, which had been introduced as
•A'Aitltie.4 foam its dangers. (Hear, hear.) He had, indeed, he was
compelled to say, been driven from post to postern his attempt at
objecthms to Emancipation, until he haul not an inch of ground
to steed upon flood cheers); and lie was satisfied that no one
could helve heard the 'vetch of the Attorney-General for Ire-
land with out feeling convinced of the wisdom, policy, and justice,

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of granting, to the full extent, the concessions required. (Loud
cheering.)
Alr. LITTLETON pledged himself to bring the Bill under
the attention of the House with the same alacrity and zeal, after
the determination of the question of Emancipation.
Sir C. COLE thought it a duty he owed his constituenui to de.
care t.is intention of opposing the Bill, whenever it came before
the House.

Sir F. BURDETT, after expressing his admiration of the
conduct and lanauege of the Hon. Member for Armagh, said he
had always considered the qqestion which they were now consi.
dering as a measure of conciliation due to the wishes of the Pro-
testants of Ireland: for whatever might be said of the justice
of the Catholic Claims—and he was or:e of those who admitted
that justice to its full extent.—still he could not keep out of view '
the claims of the Protestants; because, unless they granted
Catholic Emancipation on terms acceptable to the Protestants, they
would do little towards the Feat object of all their wishes—the
pacification of Ireland; and Instead of accomplishing their desires,
find that the difficulties were not ended, but had only changed
sides. He felt it his ditty, now that the matter was mentioned
incidentally, to say that he had not only supported it as one of the
means for attaining their object of the cometaidation of the empire,
but as a principle of Reform; and he did not hesitate to declare his
opinion, that if the principle was applied to this country it would
be equally beneficial. The other Bill, for paying the Catholic
Priesthood, was, he thought, equally desirable, because it secured
the independence of the Catholic Clergy, while it gave a great
support to Emancipation. He considered the question of Catholic
Emancipation as one of religious liberty, anti that they were
bound, in granting that booe, to make a provision for the Mi.
nisters of the Catholic religion. Inclined, as he would be, to sup-
port either measure on its own merits, he felt more fully pledged
to give them support,fram their connexion with that other measure,
which MUM: prove SO eminently beneficial.
Colonel TRENCH, on tieing, proceeded to advert to a discus-
sion which bad taken place on a former night on the Elective Fran-
chise Bill ; on which occasion the Hon. Member fur Galway (Mr.
Datyi retuned on his colleague (Mr. Martin). (Cries of " Order.")
The SPEAKER said, that otter having prevented another Hon.
Member from adverting to a speech imam on a formes night, he
was bound in courtesy to interrupt the. Ilea. Gentleman (Colonel
Trer.ch) in the allusions he was about he Make to a former discus-
sion. It was with reluctance he soy Hos. Gentleman,
but when the deviation from the Ware the House was
great, as at present, he was abbe. Illageger edentitotly, to tie so
Colonel TRENCH wished o y se eg his regret to have
heard Iran the Hon. Member for Sraitishire that Ireland was
likely to lose the advantages of the point useful and important
measure. (Cries of " No, no.")
Mr. J. SMITH presented a padding ism certain landholders of
Ireland respecting_ certain rends.
Sir N. COLTRUlifgaigematedliaviss from the proprietors
of the salmon fishselesof pinta Selgion Fisheries' Bill.
After a few words from Mr. 'lt, the petition was or-
dered to be laid on the table.
Mr. HUMS presented a petition limn the Operatives of Car.
marthen. The Honourable Genders.* also presented It petition
from the Cotton Spinners of Glasgow, velative to the regulation of
the time of labour in Cotton Mills.
Mr. 11U1II: presented a petition from Ashtois-under-Lyne,
praying to be heard by witnesses behre the Committee on the
Combination Laws.
Mr. BROWNLOW presented a petition from the city of Ar-
magh, in favour of the Irish Manufacturers' Bill.
Mr. CURTEIS presented a petition from certain Landowners
in the neighbourhood of Lewes, in Susses, against any alteration in
the Corn Laws.
DELAYS IN CHANCERY.
Sir J. NEWPORT gave notice, oil the part of an Honourable
Friend (Mr. J. %Vahan's), that on Thursday, the 19th of this
month, he would present a petition, complaining of the delays in
Chancery.
IRISH BUTTER TRADE.
Sir If. PARNEI.L presented two petitions, one from certain
Merchants exporting butter, and another from Merchants import-
ing butter into this country, praying for inquiry and for alterations
in the Irish Butter Trade.
The petition was then brought up, and ordered to be printed.
Sir J. NEWPORT presented a petition from the Farmers and
Dairymen of Waterford, Wexford, and New Ross (frequenting the
Waterford butter-market), praying that no alteration should be
made in the Rutter Laws.
Mr. DOHERTY presented a similar petition from New Ross.—
Ordered to lie on the table.
Mr. GOULBURN presented a petition from the prisoners con.
fined in the Four Courts, Marshalsea, Dublin. praying to be allowed
the benefit of rules, as enjoyed by persons confined in the King's
Bench and Fleet Prison—Ordered to lie on the table.
PAYMENT OF LABOURERS.
Mr. bIONCK brought forward his motion 'to prevent the pay.
meat of labourers out of the parochial poor rates. The present
absurd regulations were equally disadvantageous to the labourer
and the farmer. The situation of an unmarried man was pecu-
liarly unfortunate, and this induced individuals to marry who
would never have thought of it otherwise. The object of the Bill
which lie was about to bring forward was threefold. The first
abject was to prevent the extedsion of the present system into
Altman and districts where it did not yet prevail ; the second was
Ie protect the married man ; and the last and principal object was
Ili benefit the single man. The Honourable 111 e-fiber concluded by
moving for leave to bring in a Bill to prevent labourers from being
paid out of the poor rates.
Mr. BENETT (Wilts) did not object to the Bill which was
about to be brought forward ; but he felt considerable alarm at the
intention of touching the present law. He feared any interference
must prove disadvantageous to the poor. The present systetn
worked well. The oily objection to it was, that it was admini-
stered too liberally. However, it should be remembered that those
who administered the laws were themselves the principal contribu-
tors to the rates.
Sir G. CH ET WYND thought the proposed alteration quite un-
necessary. Ile did not think any lawyer would take upon himself
to say that labourers must be paid out of the poor rater. Ile (Sir
G. Chetwynd) did not think such a prectice was legal. Ile thought
any defects in the present system could be corrected by the local
influence of individuals.
Mr. aIONCK replied. The practice of which he contemplated
the abolition was an abuse, but he (Mr. :Houk) conceived it was
legal by the Act of Elizabeth.
Leave was then given to bring in the Bill.
ASSIMILATION OF THE CURRENCY.
Upon the motion of Mr. %Vett/keg, the House resolved itself
into a Committee on the Currency Laws.
Mr. WALLACE then rose to move some resolutions for the As-
similation of the English and Irish Currency. He should propose,
that the future issues of the Bank of Ireland should be in notes equi-
valent to the Bank of England, and of theaame value of currency ;
and to prevent any mistake occurring from the existence of notes of
the old and new class in Ireland, the latter should be marked in
such a manner as to distinguish them from the old notes, till all
the latter should have been called in. A proceeding somewhat si-
milar was to be adopted ir. the case of private bankers' notes, which
were not to be re-issued as formerly, but the old stamps to be al-
lowed for on their return to the Stamp-oflice. He wished it to be
understood, that nothing in this measure was to be permitted to
affict the right of voting possessed by the forty-shilling freehohlers
under the present valuation. The alteration was one, as he thought,
altogether calculated to facilitate the commercial intercourse be.
tween the two countries, by rnnoving much confusion and in-
tricacy which crusted under the present system of currency. The
Right Hon. Gentleman concluded by moving his first resolution
for the assimilation rd. the currency of England and Ireland.
Sir J. NEWPORT said, much apprehension and confusion
would arise in the first instance fmm the adoption of the proposed
alteration, and reel a letter confirmatory of the anxiety and doubt
entertained on the subject in Ireland. Ile, however, looked upon
the assimilation as desirable in its nature, anal likely to remove
great difficulties which at present existed in the commercial inter-
course of the two countries.
Mr. 1,. FOSTER thought the clearness of the intended measure,
in all its details. sufficient to remove every apprehension that might
otherwise be entertained. Sir %Valiant Petty had, lung ago, well
said, with tcgard to the currency, when speaking of Ireland, " This
distracted people thought that calling their coin by a better name
did increase its value." As for the present arrangement, he
thought, at the expense of a little mistake and confusion at first, it
would finally come into operation with great and permanent ad-
vantage.
Sir li. PA Rb:ELI. said, this was the last of the great meastires
for the purpose of establishing the commercial communication be-
tween the two countries on the most perfect footinpossible. He
was happy it was the intention of the Honourable Member to pro-
pose au alteration in the existing copper currency in Ireland, be-
cause that was the point on which the lower orders were most likely
to be mistaken without such a regulation. He considered the
measure altogether its one franghewith the greatest possible advan-
tage to the corniminity.
Mr. ORENFELL suggested the propriety of improving the
quality and raising the standard of the copper coinage in Ireland.
Mr. M. FITZGERALD thanked the Ilonourable Member
(Mr. Wallace) for the provisions of his measure, which were ex-
tremely salutary, arid not likely to create that confusion and mis-
apprehension in Ireland that some Gentlemen seemed to imagine.
On the contrary, itwould tend to simplify add disembarrass trans.
actions at present vary intricate in their nature.
After an observation from Sir J. NEWPORT, on the subject of
the coppercoin circulating in Ireland,
Mr. WALLACE said; if the copper currency were issued at a
Donniel value, approaching the actual and intrinsic value of the
metal, as was the case in the years 1318 or 19, the coin would dis-
aapear altogether on the occurrence of a small rise in the price of
capper-
Mr. ORENFELL said, much of the•copper coin n Ise in circu-
lation was of the date alluded to. Hut there was another and a
contrary danger to be provided ageinst. If the copper currency
were to be reduced too low, it would- operate as an encouragement
to counterfeiring the coin, when it could be done at so considerable
an advantage.
The Resolution was then agreed to.
The remaining Resolutions were then put, and also agreed to.
The House then Tenoned, and the Report was ordered to be
brought up to-morrow.
The order of the day was then read for going into a Committee
on the
BANKERS' (IRELAND) BILIs.

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Sir G. 11 ILL thought this an importait measure, and was de-
%iron, it should come from the Committee in IA perfect a Viatica&
posaible. With this object he would propose that an amendment
be introduced into the preamble of the Hill, which would not go
ininiediatcly to velvet the 31st of Lleorge 11., that being, as he,