The British Press; or, Morning Literary Advertiser.
London, England, 1803-03-29 00:00:00

en place not long 4:1(.6, for a man was ecervicted
that offe.-ce Lek assiees.
Mr. HOW lOUSE send, Hs cony::!ion was nn-
eonneo.4 with the present subjtet.
'lle report was then ordered to be Won into
consist:nation on Friday next.
Geeealeial Whale Fishery Bill-was teed a
third time :sod passed.
On the motion of the MASTIt the ROLLS,
'the Roman Catholic Oath Bill wile read a second
time and ordered to a Committee of the whole I louse
to-inoetail - • . •
bathe motion of qr. IsEE the Consideration of
.the rept t of the Itch Law-Courts.Bill was deferred
AO Monday oat. .
Lord EIISTON moved the order of the•day for
having James Trotter called to the Bar.
The SPEAK ER. " Before I put the question, I
wish troretr;nd the House, that the Course of pro-
ceeding when e prisoner is.brought to the bar is this,
that no question can be put except from the shale.
I therefivre wish that ally I Member who has
any question •to propose will instruct me on the
subject rrevious to the prisoner's being called to the
Der." •
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER
said, he conceived the lion. Gentleman who moved
for the pi isoncr's beinx called to the Bar, should have
given some prey ions instructions to the Speaker.
Mr. I'IERNEY said. he was aCtilated by a wish
to hear what the Prisoner had to say in his defence.
Ile era% not brought there at his particular instance,
but also by the Noble Lord who aaed as Chairman
on the Committee.
The CHANCELLOR of the F.XCIWQUER
explained, and the Prisoner was then ordered to be
!nought to the Bor.
The. Prisoner having appeared at the Bar, in cus-
tody of the Serjennt at Arms,
• The SPEAKER said—" James Trotter! a Selea
Committee of this House, appointed to enquire
Into the merits of a Petition complaining of an
.undue Eleection fir Dunfermline, have reported,
that you having been duly summoned to attend as a
'Witness en the Selefl Committee, have disobeyed
the Warrant of this House. I therefore ask you,
what you have to say in your defence ?"
The Clerk was then ordered to take down and
read his answer.
The Prisoner said, he was not at home for ten
days, from the time of the first notice haring been
served, as he was absent on private business.
The SPBAK E R. " HaS the Prisoner more to of-
fer in his dole ice ?"
The second time the notice was served, he went
army early is the morning, and was not informed
of it hr his family. He was extremely sorry to have
Life stied the Hense, and he did not know of the
dmgerons consequences. or he should have cone" up
• a: his own expense.
The Prisoner was then ordered from the Bar.
Lord EUSTON said, he conceived it was the
pea lice on those occasions to have the pri-
soner reprimanded and discharged on paying his
fees and the expences of the m?ssenger who was (Rs-
. remind Lo Sceelend for hint Ile therefore moved
that James Treater be brought again to the Bar, for
• the purpose( being reprimanded and Xscharged on
paying his fees.
Mi. TIER *.I• said, the Noble Lord had. sup-
pared the measere in the Committee. The only
precedent the Meese could have was the case of
Alex ender Nleurice, in I7eti, who was committed to
Newgate for a similar offence. And the only thing
that could justify' the Neble Lord is the motion he
hail made, was 'what fell from the prisoner in hi.;
defence. If the House was satisfied with v. iiet he
stated; for his own part he could have no objec-
tion, but he thought it a strange defence, when the
.priumu:e had taketi.seven weeks on his journey, ill
obedience to the orders. of this House ; he therefor.:
would muve to have the minutes of the Committee
• rend. .
. Mr. W. TnINDAS said, it was irregular to al-
lude to the proceedings of a Committee.,
Mr. 'FIERNEY said, he was not surprised at the
Right Hen. Gentleman's starting up to opeose him
on the occasion.
SPEARTR said, no papers could be read
• hut what were first laid on the table by order of the
House.
Mr. Ti RN E V.; in explanation, was called to order
by Mr. lie AGUE, who said, the danger of suffering
Members to read what passed on Committees was
too obvious to require comment.
Mr. TIERNEY contended he had a right to read
n 4 thin:4 he pleased as a part of his speech. He
tiara). wished to go on the relent of the Committee,
which expressly mentioaed that the prisoner was
duly served.
the Report of the Committee was then read by
the Cite k.
Mr. TIERNEY' said, he felt himself in a very
disagreeable situation. He wished Geinlemenwould
tell Lim how to proceed, as they were so prompt to
oppose him on the grounds of irregularity. He
then allude.' to the case of Alexander Maurice, who
was committed to Newgate to a similar offence.
Now the House should consider the differen. e of the
. eases— Mitur;ce was in embarrassed circum-
stances, which prevented him from attending :
this man was not so eircimeseinced. Besides,
• the Speaker's warrant, wheaever issued on a par-
ticuler occasion, W.LS Si) universally known, that
it must he a matter of ruituriet in his neighbocr-
hood, of which he could not be ignorant.—He
• would be as unwilling as any Hon. Member to
urge measures of severity, but he was confident that
.this man's absence was a wilful one, and he was
strengthened io this opinion by what appeared from
• the evidence of two witnesses, that he had otlered
bribe of 3301. He thought it unnecessery to dwell
• on the ktrocity of the offence.—As a petitioner
could have no new trial, and his tights would be
entirely lost by having a witness secreted. Every
one knew that it could be no punishment to be con-
' fined under the roof of the Serjeent at Arnis, where
. every thing cianfortable was provided. lie there-
fore moved that the prisoner be cvmmitted to New-
, gate, as in the case of Maurice.
Tha SI'EAKER said, the original question was
not disposed of,and must he
Mr. stlE R 'DAN said he Aleuld give his nega-
tive to the motion. N.) reasonable excuse had been
ffeied, and perhaps this man's expenees would be
&flared from the election purse.
The LORD ADVOCATE of SCOTLAND
said, the poor man's disobedience was we wilful,
and that he was already poi:is/red by an absence
from his farm, and a very expence. Ills case was
differentfrom that of Maurice,- who Tired in town,


:tad had the choice of two evils either of iney/.40
the displeasure oft.. I louse, or fa in in the•sly of
eretlitorie
AWKIN'S BliOW4.`.lE laid the only ques-
tion was, whether the offence was wilful, or pro-
ceeded from ignorance ; at the same great respea
was due to the report of a Committee.
Mr. WILLIAM DUNDAS disclaimed the im-
patience imputed to him by the Hon. Gentleman,
to start forward in this poor man's defence, who
was already too much punished, and wished to ask
how the House could ceensistently commit this poi-
son to Newgate, after having so lately dismissed
Shuttle,Yorth, (who was guilty of gross prevarica-
tion) with a reprimand.
Lord DI LO etid, that though he was as sen-
sible as any Member of this House of the impor-
tance of the sublea, yet as the man confessed his
offence, will the House wish to push matters to se-
verity, after the punishment already infliaed by so
long an absence from his family ?—There was, he
said, a case in point won the Journals, which
was that of one John Tyrwhit, who had not been
examined before an Eledion Committee, because
lie did hot appear pursuant to his summons.
This man had been taken into custody on the ‘.llst
of March, and discharged on the nth of the same
mr.ath. Upon the whole, it was a circumstance
which was not likely to occur often, as since the rear
771, there appeared no more than three of them
upon the Journals.
Mr. FOX said, that be certainly would not will-
ingly be disposed to be on the severe side of this
or any other question ; but at the same time he
must feel that it would not he of trifling importance
to any person who regarded the privileges of that
House, and the justice, fairness, and impartiaiity of
the proceedings of Election Cemnsittees. If the
Motion made bv the Noble Lord this evening should
he assented to, he did not hesitate to think that these
was at once an end of justice and fair trials in mat-
ters of Eledion. If there was any t'o iht as to the
merits of the case, then it would be right to have
the minutes of the proceedings on the table, from
which the House would he enabled to form a conchs-
sive judgment. Attempts had beenmede to compare
the present ease with those of offencesof prevaeicatinn.
He had no objection to do so. They were not, in-
deed, to be compared on any principle of moral,
right or wrong; for perjury was in that view infi-
nitely more wicked, immoral, and infamous than
simply staying away ; but in point of effect there
were many cases in which the latter were mischiee.
ous. A man conviaed of perjury had other courts
to appeal to, if he thought himself aggrieved; hut
here there were no other laws and no other courts,
and if the House of Commons did not punish, no-
body else could. He repeated, that this offence was
not so disgraceful as wilful and corrupt perjury, hut
it was one which teemed with injustice, and would
pass with impunity, if the House of Commons did
not denounce its vengeance agaisea it. The prisoner
seil, be did not know the consequences; but he
(Mr. Fox) wished him to know, and all the people
of England, Sentient!, and Ireland, to know, and
culprits to feel the severe and dangerous conse-
quences of an offence so flagrant; but none of them
ever could or would know it, if in the pre-
cent instance this man were suffered to escape.—
if it be true that there is such a thing as corruption
praCtised at Elections, (and he feared it would
scarcely admit of much doubt), hose easy would it
be for the persons exerting influence, or exercising
corruption, to indemnify a person so absenting him-
self, tram all expences, supposing there should be no
other kind of punishment attached to tt The of-
fenders, in that case, may go back by no means stig-
matized, and even receive the thanks of the person
who employed them. Let it but go forth in the
world, that persons in this situation are to escape,
and the House may as well say to candidates, " You
have only to calcuiete how much it will cost to keep
away a witness-201. travelling, 301. fees," &c. for
it would be as much a snhjed of calculation as any
other that could be stated. He said, he never heard
any objeaion made before to the equity of the mi-
nutes of Committees. If quotations were displeasing,
and the Gentlemen were not satisfied, and could not
make up their minds from the Report, and the de-
fence they heard at the Bar, he had no objedion to
the minutes being laid upon the table, though for
himself he confessed he did net think it necessary. As
to the defence, he mast suppose it to have been well
considered ; but, notwithstanding any ingenuity it
may possess, the House had yet to consider whe-
ther it may not he prejudicial.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER
said, he felt. some degree of anxiety upon this sitb-
jed. He was not. disposed for rigor, but at the
same time must wish to support the authot:ty of the
House. If the case regarded the punishment only,
he should refer to the opinion of the Committee ;
but as the House had the opportunity of referring to
the same materials, he wished the decision to be
postponed till there should be time to consider
of
them. The precedents already referred t, he did
hat think stridly applicable; for there was this dif-
ference, that the former prisoners pleaded igno-
rance of any crime, and the present prisoner inno-
cence of any punishment. He wished the present
motion either to be curtailed or withdrawn, and the
minutes of the proceedings to be laid b+re the
House,

Mr. ROSE thought it sufficient, tha! the Report
stafed a matter of t.ta. It wa, a principle cf juc
tire, that no rarty s!tould benefit by withdrawing a-
witness. Perjury was indeed morally worse ; but
this he contendcQ to be more peinicious, as the truth
may be extrwied from a- perjurer, by the counsel
who cross-examined him, but nothing could be ex-
tra&ed from the man who staid away. A corrupt
man would not fear risking 401. or 501. by .staviug
away, to benefit a Gentleman who might give him
' 5001. for that service. Ile had long wished that
courts of justice had more power to punish perjury ;
and he thought the present offence should be
marked in order to deter others.
Mr. G. VANSIT FART said, that the recom-
mendation of the Committee was made before they
had heard the inconsistent defence of the Com-
nuttee.
Mr. T. GRENVILLE: hoped the House would
not be pressed to come to a speedy decision. It was
impossible for 'any reasonable man to doubt of the
prisoner's guilt, and if the I louse determined in the
affimatire of the present Motion, the right of elec-
tion was absolutely at an end. lle never knew a
grysser trespass than the present, and the mischief
would indeed be great, if posterity was to hear that
the House, after entertain:ng the present question,
should dismiss the rights a f roppesentAtiou. /met

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