The British Press; or, Morning Literary Advertiser.
London, England, 1825-04-22 00:00:00

DISTILLERY LAWS.

The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said he intended
on to.mcrrow evening to bring Wore the II MAC a questit n of some
importance. It was his wish to move certain resolutions pre-
paratory to bringing in a Bill to amend the Distillery Laws. It
would expedite the business much, if on to-morrow he were
allowed to move these resolutions in a Committee of Supply. as a
preliminary measure.
U3IE was ready to meet the wishes of the Hon. Mete.
bee. He would therefore postpone his motion to Wednesdaynext.
Mr. W. HORTON wished the Honourable Riember to he
another day.
RU3lE—Let it stand for that day, or any day af:ertrards
that would be most convenient. (Heir, hear.)
ADJOURNED DEBATE—C.ITHOIAC RELIEF BILL.

tier F. BURDETT nicreed onsetthe ot tie dyfor :Titetina
reading of the Catholic Relief Bill.

On the question being put from the Chair,
Mr. I.IOI.7LBURN rose—He commenced by saving, that when
he concluded on the former evening, be had brought his observa-
tions to that point where his argument would have shown that the
very Bill itself furnished the most incontroversible evidence of the
danger likely to follow Emancipation. That very Bill pointed our
the danger by the smithies which were intended to guard against it.
Ile would proceed to consider how far these securities were calcu-
lated to achieve the important object fie which they were intro-
duced. To avert the danger which they were to guard against, the
securities were threefold: those contained in the preamble of:11E11in ;
that great and important one, coatained in the provision for establish -
ing a commission to inquire into the loyalty of those who were to fill
high offices in the Catholic Church, and that was to control the
correspondence with foreign Powers ; the last anti most important
security of all was that for limiting the Protestant succession of the
throne. As to the first security, he begged to say, that be could
not consider it IL any degree valid, since no future legislature
would find any difficulty in disregarding the declaration of the
preamble, if it thought it necessary. He would proceed to examine
theopinions of those who brought forward the present Bill, and
the opinions of those most intimately connected with it, as to how
far that succession was secured from them. It would appear that
it wax not looked on as immoveably fixed, and further, that they
cast forward their views to the day when the throne should nu
longer be filled by a Protestant. Ile would advert in the first it -
stance to the evidence of a gentleman often mentioned in the
House, Mr. O'Connell—evidence so important as to chaßge the
opinions of the Honourable Member for Armagh (Mr. rflownlowl.
From that evidence he thought it plain that if ever the issue of the
Princess Sophia of Hanover should fail, an event which he (Mr.
Goulburn) could not allude to without pain, and which the Cs.
tholies seemed to contemplate as not improbable, the moment
might be looked for as not fat distant when a Catholic might sac.
crel to the throne of Great Britain. The next part of the preamble
refers to the security of the Episcopal Church. If he (Mr. Goll•
I burn) construed rightly the Act of Union, be understood it as se-
curing firmly and inviolably the permanency and superiority of
the Protestant Episcopal Church of Ireland, and as never having
at any time contemplated the possibility of is being replaced by.
or put in competition with, any other. Now, what did this Bill do
for the preservation of that supremacy ? Why., it recognised tint
existence and establishment of a rival Roman Catholic EpiEcopaze
in all its splendor. Ile had heard with satisfaction his Right
Hon. Friend the Attorney-General for Ireland assert, that as long as
the Catholic Prelates were content to call themselves Roman C.uho-
lie Bishops, they were not overstepping the just hounds of their
acknowledged privileges; but the moment they departed from
that language, and called therriwnves Bishops of the Church, they
were wrong—they invaded the privileges of Zhe Protestant Epia.
copacy, and violated the principle of the Constitution. If, then.
they were to have, as he (Mr. Gnulburn) had heard from common
rumour--and one-half of the arguments by which this Bill was
supported are founded upon common rumour—it they were to have
a Catholic Priesthood, paid throughout till its gradations by the
Government of the country, fixed in all its titles and dignities.
wanting no one quality to make it as much the Church at Ireland
as that Church which was to be considered by the Act of Upton
supreme, how were the supporters of this Hill to reconclle the
contratliciion ? or how was the one Church to maintain its in.
violable supremacy. when another was, to be invested with the
Mine privileges and power ? Looking at this measure in the RUM:
favourahle view, he must repeat, that he thought it tended to the
subversion of the Protestant Church. He now came to the amino
to be derived from the oaths which were to be admiatstered to the
Catholics; and he would repeat what his lion Friend tee Mt ?the;
for Carle Castle (Mr. Banked had advanced upoa a !amr
evening—that this oath, rejecting and disclaiming all interference
of the Pope in temporal matters, conveyed a direct aeltnewledg-
ment of his spiritual authority. Ile would ask. then, if oaths MUM
be taken by both Catholic and Pio:extant. when entering this
House, or upon the assumption of office, while the Codicil(' is
taking the oath denying the Pope's temp .cal authority. what must.
he would repeat, be their situation--he meant that of the
Protestant, while taking the oath of supremacy?—au oath
which not only denies that the Tope's spiritual authority should
exist in England, but goes further, and declares that it ought 1101
to exist. Why he would say to the Hor.ourable Baronet (Sir F.
Bartlett). who had the reputation of having-Ironed this len,
that it was a cor.dition in which be ought not to have pieced
them ; that it would subject them to the imptastioi, of perjury
that it would compel them to do a violence to their cense-Race. and
that it was. with mew to the security to beflerir,el irons oaths,
the most objectionable course that could lame bean ii,rcared. i
although lie perfectly aware that VTYlilleTlthit pOrttl.l of the
(11111111 were taken front the Bill, to give gererul relief to the Cache-
lien, be twat still contend that they pee no accunty against the
disavow any intention to subvert the present Proust:int Establieh-
:to_
pole(
t ; but be could eery well eon:Tier that while a Catholic took
ClhttouwrebeashaPtruirlier btehluitiliedan2Cenrwmatt.holileti.ac ualiesnrneoYtti., bderOinennles"‘'i4mairnalgitudralt
that oath. he might at the same time think it a perfectly CiWiCitlf-
thous action, and perhaps a great moral duty, to do every thing in
his power to advance the interests of the Roman Catholic Church.
How, then, could a Catholic use his utmost intentions to support
and uphold his own chereb,_erithout some kind of hostility to that
which was opposed to it ? He would refer them to the words of Dr.

lirly

t. or

... .

10

L

hb—tbet puma Se abeam webby Gentlemen on the other side
isooßes veturned ter the snwoet of this question. That Rev. peri
ma dose not. he says in his bp* object so much to the Protestant I
Chants faselfas tint it isopposed to every other state in the kingdom
Alte ; that It redo= a state of things which should not be al.
ixelto eziet any eiviliaeLlosintry (hear. bar); that it is de.
ocrisclive to the intaests of any nation, and the more especially one
whose populaden is lagged in the tillage of lend. ((Beer, hear.)
The Reverend Gentleman, after deploring the wretched condition
etthe peasantry antler its control, then arldreeees the Archbishops,
and mho from what heaven have you fallen show me the apostle
hem whom you derive your right to exercise the functions of your
meted oldee—and, after deelaiitungayon the hypocrisy, the tricks,
sad the lies by which that church barn been promoted and supported,
gees before the Committee with the ink scarcely dry upon his book,
is give that evidence upon which Gentlemen had founded their ar.
ezelra. Whet., however, had been the evidence of that person
the Committee ? God forbid the Roman Catholics should en.
Satan any intention to take away the tithes of the Ptotestsnt
chinch. They disclaimed any such intention, but, when pressed a
little farther, he admitted that the extent of those tithes were very
injuriosa to the country, and that it would be advantageous to the
Catholic if they were removed. Can we then say that the Catholics,
while they disclaim any intention to meddle with the Protestant
Cher* do not look with a very jealous and anxious eye upon the
eandensents and power enjoyed by it, and that when they are
brought fairly into competitisn, they will not yield to the eminent
impulses of nature in advancing that church whose interests the
ate moot materially bound to sustain: ? In the former Bill which
Tasted through that House, the Right Honourable Secretary
for Ireland had thought proper to introduce certain oaths
as securities for Protestant ascendancy, which were not only to be
administered to one class, but to all the Roman Catholic Priest-
hood. The most important past of this security that Bill now
leaves out. In the former Bill, as far as an oath can be binding,
they bound the Roman Catholic Clergy not to make any attempt to
subvert the Church of England. But now, in deference he sup-
posed is Catholic prejudice, and sacrificing Protestant security,
they exempted a certain claw:, the most powerful in the priesthood,
and the best calculated from their situation to wield the mass of the
people in any project which might be contemplated for the destruc-
tion of either Church or Government. Yet this Bill, thus leaving
such a body in that situation, was said to provide securities ; it was
inhered in, too, with an assertion, that they might take precautions
to ascertain the purity
.of the Catholic Bishops—that they had the
means to ascertain their loyalty, and their attachment to!the laws
and constitution of their country. And what would Gentlemen of
this House believe these precautions to be—he meant theme who
might not have read the Bill? Wh the appointment of a Com-
mission of four Roman Catholic Bishops, bound by an oath, to
sate whether they consider the candidate a fit end props person
to be apnointed a Bishop of the Catholic Church, and for the pur-
posts of advising a Magistrate of the State who shall be appointed
to wield, for good or for evil, the power with which they are en-
trusted. Ile did not know what might be the constitutional feeling,
but he MUM. say Oint a stemnd Cabinet, thus sitting. and thus ad-
wiaing the Crown, was hostile to constitutional principles. And what
is it they are called upon to say? Why, that A.B. is, In their belief,
s loyal subject. They are not compelled to make inquiry—not bound
to enemies—to take no steps of inquiry—the individual may be a
Ingot—although loyal, he may profess certain feelings upon parti-
cular subjects, which., upon inquiry, would exclude him from any
church; but no—there is to be no inquiry ; the simple affirmation of
the commiesion—a declaration of loyalty which we all know would
dot be refused any where, or by any one who had a slight know.
tolge of a candidate for office, the sim_ple assertion that they
know A. B. to be loyal is considered sufficient to warrant his ap-
pointment to the important situation of a Catholic Bishop. But
even if the Commission had it in their
.power to ascertain, he
t Mr. Oeulburr) did not think they stood in a situation to refuse
their consent to the appointment. The individual selected comes
ttom the Pope to be elected by those who hold their power from the
Isere authon,y—and„ is it possible to suppose that, knowing the
caedidate to be confirmed by their superior, they will have the
ocu.:age to disobey his mandates, and reject that person he has m-
inted for the office? But the Commission has another and more
important duty to perform : it has to guard against communica-
tion oith the Pope for receiving dispensations or other articles.
The clause which provides, be it observed, for our safeguard, states
that they are to examine all bulls and papers from the Holy See,
and, if they are not found injurions or treasonable, they . are to re-
port immediately to the Lord Lieutenant; but, if injurious, what
then ? Why, the House will suppose they are to report Instantly
too ; no such thing. The only penalty to the party is that the pa-
per is to be returned to the owner without indorsement ; but not a
word to his Majesty—no communication then. In fact, if he (31r.
Gouthurn) was to invent a Bill for carrying on a treasonable cor-
respondence in war, or a dangerous one in pesce, he did not know
he could produce, by any ingenuity, one more fitting for the pur
pose than the Bill now before the House. The laws had been be-
fore of undistinguishing severity to the Catholic, but now they were
called upon to make that to the Catholic a misdemeanour which to
the Protestant would be hie!' treason or death. God forbid lie should
impute any bad motives to it zee who drew the Bill, but he must say
the:re was something cal,„hie negligent in making a commission ore
Catholic Prelates die euerdiane of British anthority. This Bill calls
upon us to confer tit_ same privileges upon the English as the Irish
Catholic. Now there was rot one objection he had made to the
Bishop winch did not apply with tenfold force to the Vicar
A postelic. a•he Irish Mello!, held his situation for life when ap-
petite., but the Vicar Apostolic is removable at the pleasure of
the Pope. He had looked io vain for any security against the in.
tluence which might be exercised by a Foreign Power over him :
but whatever might be devised, he limn at all events congratulate
England in having escaped from the kind and considerate protec-
tion of a Catholic Committee. So much for the securities contained
in the Bill. But although art and policy had been retorted to by
the supporters of this question, so that the House might not be let
into all the secrets of its accompanying provisions ; yet he thought
lie might, without any violation of Parliamentary decorum, advert
a little to what had been nunoured, as the accompaniment of
I..Mtltolic Emancipation. First, then, for that Irish bonus, the dis-
franchisement of 40s. fmeliclders. He would ask, did the Hun.
Gentlemen mean to disfranchise all the 40s. freeholders at once, no
roarer how created? or does he mean only to the system of
,eeatibg them ? If he means to do the tint, lie would, in his
teut.ioti, be guilty of a gross injustice. If lie does not, he
Would ask the Member for Armagh ( Mr. Brownlow) ar d for
Down (Col. Forbes). where is the security? Nothing short of a
i.'aigue could then guard them against di r evils of CatholicEnienci.
piebon; and their posterity could only hope to receive beeed tfrom this
p:eeau denary measure when they had perhaps nothing left to retain.
its to the pruposed arrangement for the clergy, he thought it calm:-
I ste.d only to render the measure more objectionable titan it WAS be.
tore. ([hear, hear.) What would the Mime think of a Roman
Catholic Church establishment vying with a Protestant one---of
Roman Catholic bishops having an authorized jurisdiction in
the same diocese with a Protestant prelate ? Such an establish-
ment, he, for one, would never sanction. It was simply the propo-
sal for theienaintensnce of a church, the principle' of which were
hostile to those of the cst.abliahed relie,ion of the coontry. It had
been said that the principles of the Roman Catholic religion were
ciianged, and that they had more approximated to thoni of
use Protestant faith titan formerly. If such a change had r:tilly
taken placc—if both religions were so closely assimilated Met art
arraegene nt could he satisfactorily made, he would be moat
desi-
eoue to effect that arrangement, and to do away with the °dime the-
astoricom alluded to by a Noble Lord (Lord Olilior.) by which the
members of both religions became more violent as they approached
wearer to each other. It was impossihie not to suppose that the
non and object of it Roman Callialic sierarchy in Ireland would be
to extend the sphere. of the lhanino Catholic religion in Ireland,
and it was therefore that he was hostile to a regular establishment
(mops provided for it, conscientiously atteclied ss he was to the
princ:oleo of the Protestant faith. (Hear, heal.) It was an admitted
roctice tied principle of the Roman Cathohcs, that tile Pope was
infallible ; and when the gitestion was put in the Corn:Mime on the
state of Ireland, to what dal this infallibility relate, it was answer-
id by Dr. Doyle—to the explanation of articles of faith and the
morality of the Gospel. 'l'his was an important admission, and
showed the extent to which the supremacy of the Pope was enter-
taincl by Roman Catholics. It wits the more so, when it was con-
stirred that the circulation of the Scriptures was prohibited by the
Roman Catholic Church, and that the exercise cf private judgment
upon them was also forbidden, which seated the privilege of expo-
sabon in the Chitych. Ouy thing he hoped the Houle would hear
in mind, that Pro estantior was the religion of the legislature;
that its stitomity was in hissing the members of the legislature pro-
of that retie:inn—to i.n hierarchy and clergy being provided
for by the state, and in the property which they possessed : but that
security wnold, in his opinion, be dissolved by admitting the
Boots.' Catholic% to Puri...moo, who would raturaliy find
nn intercs: s hatever in pies:tailor the Pro :wart religion, and
wouht be found suptionisig this moiion of the Honour-
ride Itlentbi r. for the alto rionni it church property. (Hear, hear,
hear.) It had beta said. that concilintion was On .! of the principal
()Watts of this ; for his p•ot anticipated no such satisractory
/1414.. from :u, thinieit it wvic osssed it:to a law. It was not, io hit
opinion. tee ineltgil,iiiiy of idlicc, or the non-enjoyment of office.
by which do: Itnimen were sffeci.eti, and of which. in the
result of passing this Hill, they would complain. How plausible
world it nut IV• far the Roman Catholic itenisigogite then to say—
" V•re arc c: c ihle to offices, bit tlioe who have the disposal rd
them, constitute the predominant power. and they, are dotemiined
that we shell not have th...c places to which we are eligible by law."
This would still remain A cause of cirriph:ht, although the Bill
were to pass ; and the popular elemagngoc in Ireland would not be
flood wanting to irritate and exasperate the mind: eta remarkably
susceptille perple on this topic. Olear, hear.) It was true that
the Homan Cs:holies were in die proportioh of six millions to two
'ma ,Ireland: but that ester showed the grester necessity duct ex.
nted for protecting the Protestant Religion w Ireland. Looking
at 'Sr. question in every point of view than it hail lo en presented to
impartially regarding the constitution cf his country—valuing
and desirous of upholding its present security, and not only at-
tached to the laws and liberties of his country, but also attached
moscientiously to its religion—anxious to preserve i•s gown's and
outwork., and to resist every crafty device, calculated to diminish
its 'security ; and deeming the granting rat this measure to have a
trodency to enliven the establishments of this country, and to
unno the principles recognised Ea die Reformatino, and at
wouki oppose the Bill, and he hoped he would
h- %hi ported by the House In doing so, and it: thereby watching
Jrtt,s important interests, which it was their heat and bounden
4 it a to tlosud codex of " Hear, hoar.")
lit O.P. NG ',aid that tic had been IV' attentive observer of
tl e e' dente Oven before the Committee on the state of Ireland,
-^d he cane. to A ,ion trim it not at ail corresponding to that
v. !•i'• P-i"lit Hen. Friend. ( I tear, oir.) His opations, after
its:it:erste vonsidiratirM of that ey:tkr.ce, inure nearlf coincided
ot. t..hee of the lion. Alembtr for Armagh (Mr. Brownlow),
the whole House had listestilso with thinl'httioni and

than which be new beard one that Ailed him with gnat &lights l
not only for the eloquence which that Honodwbk Gentlemen
brought to the diet:onion every subject, but for the candour, the in- I
genuousness, the courage, and the tone of manly end liberal senti-
ments by which it was distinguished. (Loud cries of "Hear,
I hear.") To that Hon. Member be bad also to add another Hon.
and Gallant Member (Colonel Ford), who, abandoning the early
prejudices in which he had been educated, came forward and gave
the promise of his support to a measure vitally important to the in- ,
tereets and welfare of his country. His Right Hon. Friend had
given an alarming description of the state of Ireland. That descrip-
tion he believed to be as true as it was alarming. He (Lord Bin-
ning) adopted the description, but he differed from him in the con-
clown to which that description induced him to arrive. (Hear.)
That the people of Ireland were dined:ailed, that they were irritated
and divided into parties he admitted, and what did his Right lion.
Friend recommend to remedy this admitted evil ? " That things
should remain as they were." (Cheers.) From such a remedy
there was, in his opinion, little prospect of available relief. The
misfortunes of Ireland were, in his opinion. mainly attributable to
the present system of exclusion. His Right Hon. Friend had re-
gar that system of exclusion as the security. He (Lord Binning)
regarded it as the weakness of the Protestant religion, Ile agreed
with the Hon. Member for Yorkshire (Lad Milton) that the Pm-
tenant religion (to which he was warmly attached) should
be upheld, not by restrictive laws, but by the purity of its
doctrines and the respectability of its Ministers. (Hear, hear.)
In the discussion of this important question, and in the progress
which it had made throughout the country nothing more excites!
his surprise than the very great change which had taken place in
the grounds on which the opponents of this measure mainly relied.
The good old cry of " No Popery," which was once so familiar
to their ears, was no longer heard. The period was fresh in his
recollection, when an Hon. Member (Dr. Duigenan), now no more,
was wont to come down to that House, armed with authorities and
books of reference, and denounce and anathematize the doctrine of
the Roman Catholic religion. (Hear, hear, and a laugh.) lie was
usually followed by an Hon. Baronet (we believe Sir T. Leah-
bridge), who impugned whatever doctrines had not been impugned
by the lion. Member who preceded him. In that way did the
debate on this question usually commence and often continue.
But these authorities were no longer referred to; all the rubbish
had been fortunately cleared sway—(hear, hear, hear--all the
arguments as to the Roman Catholics not keeping faith with he-
retics were now removed. They were removed by the evidence of
Roman Catholic Bishops—of the Roman Catholic clergy, and the
Roman Catholic laity. Hie Right Hon. Friend had referred to the
letters of J. K. L., and argued against the present Bill on ac-
count of these letters. In doing so he did not, in his (Lord Bin-
ning's) opinion, act quite fairly. When the doctrines which had
been imputed to the Roman Catholics were denied by their advo-
cates in that Bonet, the reply usually was, " Can you get a
Roman Catholic who will concur in opinion with you ? Is there a
Roman Catholic Bishop who will be found to adopt your semi.
menta?" We bring forward Bishops and Clergymen, and Catholic
laymen of that persuasion, who confirm what is asserted here in
their defence, and then the subterfuge resorted to is not to
believe them—(hear, hear, hear to affect not to do so.
This was not fair and candid dealing. The suseessinn to the
Croon had been adverted to, and the principles which the Roman
Catholics entertained on this point bad been objected to. It had
been stated that they wished to limit the right of succession. The
evidetice of Mr. O'Connell upon that point chewed, that there was
no such sentiment generally entertained by the Roman Catholics •
and the answer to that iuquiry before the Committee was to the et:.
feet, that they extended the right of succession to all the heirs of
Sophia of Hanover, to all the branches of her family, the members
of the House. of Brandenburgh. of the Court of Prussia, and
to • number so great, extensive, and ulneost unlimited, as to
constitute a whole regiment of royal personages. (A laugh.)
The Roman Catholic Church already exists in Ireland, and the only
question is, whether we should make the Government of Ireland
safe and recurs, or leave the country exposed to all known dangers,
and numberless unknown danger.. But it is said that the Catho-
lics refuse to deny the power of the Pope In spiritual matters. (low
can the Catholics be asked to abjure the spiritual authority of the
Pope? They are willing, bona /,de, to abjure the temporal power,
and this is fully sufficient for the safety of the State. If the Catho-
lics frankly avow their independence of the Pope's temporal power,
we ought not to ask for more. The Pope has the spiritual power,
but if we take from him the temporal power, all is done that is ne-
cessary for the security of the State. Much had been said about
oaths, but lie (Lord Binning) should be glad to see the Protestant
oaths reconsidered. It was not civil to tell men they were idolaters,
and it was particularly impolite to. because it was untrue. How-
ever the question before the House should be disposed of, he hoped
to see the oaths reconsidered in the course of the present Session of
Parliament. (Hear.) lie now carne to the polemical writings of
Dr. Doyle, which were the object of much disapprobation. He
(Lord Binning) did not come forward as an apologist for the writ-
ings of J. K. L. They were marked with the talent, intelligence,
and strength of mind, which distinguished the right Reverend
Prelate to whom they were universally attributed ; but he regretted
that an individual of Dr. Doyle's acknowledged influence and abi-
lity, should have been so much provoked as to have written those
letter . Many sez.timenta contained in these writings, he did not mean
to defend. He did not attempt to defend the attacks on the Protestant
Church Establishment, but yet in candour he would contend that
the letters of J. K. L. and the evidence of Dr. Doyle may be placed
tegether ; and though the same person may be the teeter in one
case and the witness in the other, he did not think that this person
should be fairly charged with gross inconsistency. Take the third
of the series of twelve letters, and the work entitled "A Vindication
of the Roman Catholics of Ireland," and contrast these with the
evidence of Dr. Doyle. It is true, J. K. L. states that the
Church Establishment in Ireland, with the temporalities it now
possesses, is a monstrous evil. He states the tithe system to be a
monstrous evil. This he does in common with many others ac-
quainted with the state cf Ireland. In justice to himseif, he (Lord
B.) would state that he was no enemy to tithes, and that Parliament
was bound to protect the owners of tithes as well as the proprietors
of any other kind of property. But although these were his (Lord
B.'a) opinions, lie was aware that a spirit of opposition to tithes was
abroad, and he thought it no wonder that the Roman Catholic Pre-
lates should partake in the hostile feeling which prevailed. Besides
stating his objection to tithes, J. K. 1.. had also asserted, that the
Church, as by law established, was maintained by force. Now this
was not far from the truth. (Hear.) He could not state that it was
untrue; and this, amongst other reasons, induced hint to vote for
the Pill. But what said Dr. Doyle, in his evidence before the Com-
mittee ? Ile states that he prizes the Church of England infinitely
more than any other church outside the pale of his own. (Hear,
hem.) This was Dr. Doyle's evidence. It was true that when he
was asked whether he agreed with the sentiments expressed in the
letters of J. K. L. ? he replied. '• I dare say I do." This was little
to be wondered at. It was well known that Dr. Dnyle was the
writer of these letters: every one knew this, for he was publicly
thanked fir them by the Catholic Association. If the letters of
J. K. L. and the evidence of Dr. Doyle were full of contradictions
and contrarieties, the House was bound to give credit to the evi-
deqce of the Rev. Prelate rather than to the letters of J. K. L.
This was only candid and fair, and in accordance with common
sense. The sentiments of any writer, however manly, should not
be preferred to the oath of a Christian Bishop. The Hon. Member
for Derry (Mr. Dawson) thought that Pope Gregory or Bonifece
could act have fonutt a more fit instrument than J. K. L. Dr.
Doyle must have been not a little surprised to have found himself
in such company. (A laugh.) But what (observed the Hon. Den-
tient:rut were the avowed sentiments of this fit instrument of I'ope
Gregory ? He distinctly states that " the pnwrr of the State is
independent of the church, that the Roman Catholics don't recog.
nise the power of the Pope in temporal affairs, and that if he pre-
stoned to interfere with their allegiance to their King, the reply of
a enesetentioes Rninen Catholic must be, " Your kingdom is nut
of this world." These were the avowed opinions of Dr. Doyle. and
these abjurations did net rest upon his respectable authority solely.
They were corroborated and supported by other metnhers of the
Catholic Hierarchy. The titular Bishops of Dublin, Tuani,
Ar-
magh, in short every Roman Catholic priest, who had been ex-
amined, agreed in these sentiments. Mr. Blake, who was in no
way answerable for the speeches of Mr. O'Connell, or the writings
of Dr. Doyle. stated this to be the prevailing sentiment of Roman
Catholics. lie (Lord Binning) beliered the evidence before the
Home.. He could never bring himself to believe that such men
came forward and told falsehoods. lie was ready to join with the
Honourable rember for Armagh (Mr. Brownlow) in attaching im-
plicit confidence t 3 the esitience before the Committee, and he
thought the (louse was justified in teeing upon the information
derived front ouch witnesses,. He did not think it nccessnry to
enter into any farther details at this period, but he should take
the liberty of stiering a few remarks cei the two collateral questions.
which had been mentioned in connexion with that now before the
House. As to the disqualification of certain classes of electors, he
was not willing to deprive any man of the right of voting, but the
situation of freeholders in Ireland should be considered, when they
corn, forward not to support any popular pri+ ciple. but to act im-
plicitly upon the dictation of others. This should be considered;
card it stenild alto be considered what moire there should
be in giving tip the elective franchise. lie did not think
it could ever be quoted as a precedent, because to have
it a precedent, the country must be similarly circumstanced,
and there twist be an equal motive. Considering these cir-
otiosteecest, considering what was to be given up and what was
to he gained, he should rot hesitate, in order to secure the peace
and halipiness of Ireland, to allies! that security which the Catholics
of freleptl were willing to enter into, and the Protestants of Ire-
, Lind would he satisfied if they received. A. to the expedicecy of
a provision for the Catholic Clergy. the lion. Member for Corfe
Castle (Mr. Bankes) had observed upon the expense which such
3 Ifl,ll.llte would entail. lie (Lord Binrine) did not conceive
the expense to be worthy of mulch considtration. lie did not
care a .farthing whether the expense should be one, or two, or
three hundred thousand pint nds, it the object in view was attained.
But it was asked, how can you in sole upon members of the Bs-
. tablishol Church. and upon Presbytt ritties and Dissenters, to sup-
port the Roman Catholic religion v Ile should reply by usking,
Don't you impose upon the Catholics to support the Protestant
Esta'Jltsltnivie ? (Hear.) The Cathnlic Church was firmly este-
Wished in Ireland. Ile was sorry for this, hut so it was; and the
only question remaining is, whether the Otivernment of that
t country cannot be placed oil a mere secure footing, and the peace
I and prosperity of Ireland hr better secured? In conchiaion, he
would cinteoatulate the House on the great progress which this
I goes:ion teed made. lie considered this measure the best remedy
for the evils which afflicted !mime'. It was a sedative which
r could he properly applied, for the misery of Ireland is. that
, every that g which collies is as poison. The fountain of justice is
I embittered, because the people tied themselves degraded. lie
I hoped the If ause and the country would long continue to persevere
io the liberal course of policy latterly pursued ; he Impel! this
Bill would he sent to the other House, and if it should be rejected
row, Le :rutted it would be again seat, until die necessity was