The British Press; or, Morning Literary Advertiser.
London, England, 1804-06-26 00:00:00

HOUSE. OF COMMONS.

Sir CHARLES BUNBURY brouti•ht sip the re-
port of the Committee on the Corn Trade ; which
WAS agreed to, and, pursuant to a resolution contained
in the same, it was ordered that it be an instruaion
to the Committee appointed to bring in a Bill on a
former report. to make provision in the Bill pursuant
to the said report.
The Denmark Mint Bill was read a third time
and passed.
Several accounts relating to Ireland were pre-
sented at the Bar of the House.
On the Order of the Day being moved by Mr.
H. LASCELLES, fur the Committee on the Wool-
len mantiladure laws suspension Bill ;
Mr. BROOKE ohjoaed to bringing forward a
measure of this kind. year after year, instead of es-
tabli.hing some great and eifeaual regulation at
once on the subject. lie would, howner, now con-
sent to the present measure, if the Hon. Mover of
it would promise to enter next Session into a revision
of all the old statutes relating to the woollen manu-
faaure. . .

Mr. H. LASCELLES said it certainly was his
intention to lay before the House a proposition to
this elfcra.

The Bill then went through the Committee, the
Report was received, and the Bill ordered to be
read a third time t,t-r-.

Sr EVAN NEPEAN obtained leave to bring in
a Bill for raising a permanent force in Ireland.

The SECRETARY at WAR moved for leave to
bring in a Bill to enAle His Majesty to raise foreign
corps, and indemnifying those who had taken fo-
reigners into His Majesty's service.
Mr. CREEVY wished to know if there was to be a
clause in the B•li for the benefit of those whose reli-
i ions persuasions were different from the religion of
• Church of Englmi ; atid to exempt them from
t: ?enalties they might otherwise incur.

SECRE TARN' at WAR sail, it was lu-
te- • the Bill s. ould comain a clause to r',
eff ;t was to be confined solely to
corps.
Mr. ANCIS said, that, even in the present stage
of this pr.w.eiaing, he cote's' not help remarking that
it was one of a very unconititmional nature; • • • ~
. =cording to our laws and coostitution, no lose
troops could be allowed to collie into this country,
or within six miles (.f. he coast ; nd hen ished
know whether he siould have a..other opportunity
to discuss this question ?
The SECRE CARY at WAR said, the lion.
Geollemaa would hare a great many.

Mr FOSTER obset ved, that he had on a former
day given notice of Ids intention to bring forward a
regulation for the purpose of correCting many errors
and abuses that prevailed in the revenue depart-
ment:. in Ireland ; and the measure wou! be found-
ed on a similar one, which was adopted some years
ago in this country. His great objets wai, first to
Lave an accurate enquiry made into the s: ate of
those oth.:es. ar. I, when :he ik of the enviri
should hr 1i i it..tore the Hou.,e, Pa7k4:itt-nt would
then lw able to judxe wb.:!ber -any, Jed what ••-t..ps
were ra,..essary to be taken. lie tier :loved,—
" That live be given to briiiy, ia a Bill fit appoint-
ing Coramissionci to enquire into the amount of
the C.-es, S.ilari , emoluiniers, and or'ner r.ratuale•
receved by officers empioyed in I- laid. to ex-
arn.n: into t:le aShseb whiz)) prevale,l in the sante ;
anal t., rev,r; to the Hous.2 their (.creations, and
tnzgest as may occur t i them toward,
the better of the revenue in Ireland."
Sir JOHN NEWPORT said, he felt himself im-
pelled to the and r aura his these to the Right
li in. Gentle:mu, for bringing forward a m..•asure of
this inm-rance, which uceld be of the most sub-
staTial benefit to 1::1and ; a berktit much greater
than any that had evrr beer, felt in this corintr y ; he-
catt,c t!.e 45u,:.% were mach greater in the ono than
the other. '1 he Right Hon. Gentleman had on a
former day drawn a. inel imholy pi 'tare of the fin-
ances and rever'.ies Ire! tad; atJ is was evident
that that situa.ion wea.ioned In a great rr.ea-
vire by the abuse, is prcvail...d 1.1 the pirlihk
boards in Ireland. -Ilse i..c.dental esp.:tic:l of thc•c
hoards wc:c enormous. 1.1 thr the peen Aire
department, no los. a -.!int titan was allowed
for losses sustained in one of the mail c.iache,. The:r
law expenses welt: equally enormous. The biil of
COW for law exiwuc.., in the post office .'apartment,
during the last year. amounted to no I?ss than 5,800.
Those of the paving board were 20001. and similar
erpences attended the board of commisiioners for

wide streets. The fees received Ly ollicers in ail de-
partments of the revcnitt., were also widely oppres-
sive ; those persons in ,übordinate ..[nation, were in
Vie habit of esatii:g enormous and oppress r^ fees.
These were abuses which callLd for an in.

vestigation, and he was confident that meth :la in-
vestigation would b.: highl) gratifying to the peo-
ple of Ireland, who would eheattit:ty p.ty
Uses, is soon as they saw the a:lg for inipasii.g them
accompanied with a fair and ile,:t/r.oe enquiry into
all the abuses which prevented the due collitßinn of
the public revenue. The great L.ll.metis 'hat re-
mained in the hands of the collet trs, were another
circumstance which made an cnquiry still more ne-
ctissary. These had considerably eitci eased during,
the last year. It appeared large stints or tLe
money were now due, by some who had hem pro-
Inta;:d from subordinati to higher 41%d t!..41
deceased colleaors, in whose bulauces had re-
mained unpaid, left large est.ttes behind them.
The law expences were not only enormous in every
department of the revenue ; but the slims in r:hici•
offenders had been cottviEted were remitted, and the
public was thus deprived of the benefit wising from

them. These were great evils, which 'required a
speedy iuvestigation and cure. He thought it ne-
:essary thus to trouble the House with this short
statement ; and he earnestly hoped the regulation
proposed by the Right Hon. Gentleman would be
speedily carried into effe&.

. ,
Mr. FOS'T'ER said, he would not enter into any
discussion on this subjeCt until the Hill passed through
Parliament, and the Commissioners of Inquiryishould
report their opinion to the house.

Sir JOHN 'NEWPORT' said, his only objeet in
stating whit he did, was to shew the absolute ne-
ces.ity of such a Bill as that which the Right Hon.
Gentleman had just moved for.
Mr. ORNISBY said, the Hon. Baronet had stated
man fads in a way that required explanation from
him, in order to do away the impression they other-
wise must make upon the House. The incidents
and law expences in the Post Office department
had been occasioned chiefly by the many mail rob-
beries which were committed. The Commissioners
of 11'ide Streets must necessarily have had nu-
merous proceedings at law before they could
carry into effect the business for which they had been
instituted ; and surely no one could say, that 2,0001.
in one year was too great a sum for the costs at-
tending those proceedings ; on the contrary, he con-
sidered it a very low sum. As to the Commis-
sioners of the lteveaue having remitted penalties,
they had done no more than exercise the same
powers which belonged to the Commissioners in this
country ; who frequently used their discretion in
extending indulgence to those who had been suf-
ficiently punished already. He was sorry to hear
the Hon. Baronet make the statements he did, which
he must deprecate, because they were made at a
time when they could not be answered.
Mr. FRANCIS said, titel-lon. Baronet appeared
to him to have done no more than make a plain
statement of fak% ; and he now wished to.knew, whe-
ther it was intended that there should be any correc-
tion of the abuses prevailing in Ireland, before the
Commissioners under the intended Bill should make
their report ? This he was anxious to know, on ac-
count of what fell from t! •e Right lion. Gentleman
opposite, when he last got up to speak.
Mr. FOSTER said, he only meant that there
should be no discussion, nor any regulation on the
subjed, until the Commissioners should make their
report. But, as to the immediate correction of
abuses, all he could now say, was, that he himself
would answer for it, every exertion should be made,
in the mean time. to make the Revenue Officers in
Ireland do their duty.

•
Mr. ORMSBY said, he thought it necessary to
remove a very e • impression that seemed to
dwell on the minds of Gentlemen with regard to
the balances in the hands of Colledors. Such ba-
lances hal exisied, since the year 1".!9, and he
never knew them less that' 90,0001.
Mr. NIAG RICE FITZGERALD said, that as
one of those employed in the superintendance of the
revenue in rieland, he th night it necess try to say a
f. d, i:n subj:Et of the sums in the hands
There certainly was the sum of
6:40d0l nsw outstanding; hut the monies actually
I into the hands of collators bore a very small
prop.o.len to that sum. The Treasury of Irel tnd
h id used itel:•titie.atible exertions in enleavouring
a: that no mere : should bs in the bonds of col-
leEtors than was absolu:e.y Accessary. o:,e cause
of money rem.:ie:ng in their hands, was the slit&
culty of remitting it from distant parts of Ireland
to the capittl. Bir he could assure the House, that
whenever the Collectors appeared to have any dis-
position to keep money in their hints, the Com-
missioners of the revenue took the most prompt and
effedual means to get it from them.
Mr. CORRY heeged Lave to trouble the House
with a few observations on this subjed, in addition to
what he had stated on a former day. So far
;') re being 1:00 0001. in the hands of colleam
I rise wfitii.l he surprised to hear whoa that sum
to illy was. There was now a return of 551,0001.
est:in:beg revenue, charged to the collators
At this time ; but this sum was Oct is their
':.tads; they had not yet received it. The
:loose would see what the cAuse of this was
from the tact which he was about to state. It was
111.• eustun for the surveyors of excise in Ireland, to
go once a month and visit All persons subjed t s the
excise duty ; for instance, distillers and maltsters.
•1 hey received returns from the gaugers or inferior
excise officers, of the sums for which these were lia-
ble to pay : and they made a monthly return of
them before they were paid; and the head Collator
made a return of them to the Board of Commis-
sieners ; and all these sums were charged to his ac-
count before ever they were collated in. The Collec-
tor thus sppears to have balances remaining in hand,
when he has not received a shilling. The persona
liabie to the excise duty had generally a month's
credit in paying the money. With maltsters and
distillers this amounted to the sum of about 3 or
100,0001. The mot.ey, therefore, which was sup-
posed, from the returns, to be in the Collator's
hands, was not paid. And he could assure the
! loose, that of the 600,0001. said to be due to
the Irish Government, not above 50,0001. WAS
adrielly in the hands of Collators He now
spote from the written documents which he exa-
mined ; and from which it appeared, that this sum
did, since January last, flitdoote from 31,0001 to
-19,0001. which sum it never exceeded; that was
all the Collators now had in t:,eir hands ; and why
so much was remaining in their possession, he had
already explained to the House. In order to satisfy
the House on this subjed, he now gave notice, that
ha woul,f to-morrow move fur certain returns, which
would clearly chew that his statement was corral ;
and would put an end to all mistaken views on the

subj•.•;t.
Mr FOSTER said, so far from having any ob-
j:•Riun to. lie ratlicx wished for, the proJation of
t.ie papers alluded to by the lion. Gentleman. With
rzspea to the balances remaining in hand, he would
maintain, that the sum of 600,0001. was now due
to Government ; that it ought to have been received
by this time; and that Government could have
compelled the payment of it. The Commissioners
the Irish Treasury, he contended, were as re-
spansil le for the due colleaion of the revenue, as
the Commissioners in England were.
Mr. FRANCIS said, that what he had heard
from the several Gentlemen who spoke on this sub-
:lea, was sufficient to prove to him, that it was of
couaiderable importance. He was glad to find that

the Right Hon. Cattleman (Mr. Corry) intended
to move for certain papers ; and, until these were
produced, ha should forbear to make auy further
observations on the business.

Mr. M. FITZGERALD, in explanation, said,
that the Irish Treasury was controuled by the Go-
vernment, vrith regard to the power it h t l ‘,f en-
forcing the colleaion of the revenue. And tiro
19,u,t01. was the highest sum in the hands of the
Colleaurs.

The !Vbition male by Mr. Fosraa was then put
and carr4o.

Mr. PI 1' gave notice, that on Friday next, in
the Committee of Supply, he would rekr to the
consideration of the House, a proposition on the
subjeft of the Civil List ; and also a motion relative
to the Duties on Stamps.
Mr. CURRY gave notice, that he would to-mor-
row move fur papers relative to the balances in the
hands of Collectors in Ireland.

Lord ARCH( BALD lIA MILTON prehented
Petition from certain Freemen in G1.1,7,exv, statin;;,
that they conceived alarming alterati'ms were abou:
to he made in the Corn Laws of the kingdom ; and
praying that these might not be adopted. Ordered
to lie on the Table.

Mr. FOSTER brought up a Bill for laying addi-
tional Duties on Stamps in Ireland. Read a first,
and ordered to be read a second time to-more ow.

Mr. HUTCHINSON said, if the Bill compre•
hended a tax on the registry of freeholds, he should
oppose it in a future stage.
Mr. FOSTER said, it did contain a clause to
that aid

Mr.HUSKISSON brought up a Bill to enable
the Commissioners of the Treasury to issue Exche-
quer Bills ; read a first, and ordered to be read a se-
cond time to-morrow.
Mr. JOHNSTONE moved that there be laid be-
fore the House the particulars of the accounts made
up on the Ist of March last, by which the East India
Company claim from Government the sum of
4,018,0001. Ordered.

On the Order of the Day for receiving the Re-
port of the Liverpool Prize Goods Bill ;
Mr. Alderman COMBE opposed the Bill, on ac-
count of its affeEting the interests of several mer-
chants in London : he said there were Coun.el then
in attendance to speak against the Bill, and moved
that they be called in.
Mr. ROSE said, the Commissioners of the Cus-
toms had given it, as their opinion, that the goods
in question might be landed and sold at Liverpool.
They were now landed thei e, had paid all the charges,
and the expence of removing them to London
would amount to no less than 17l per cent. The
revenue was not to derive the least benefit from this
Bill. It was a measure merely for the benefit of the
captors of the goods, who wanted nothing else but
that they might not be put to the expence of remov-
ing goods from a place into which they had brought
them, under a misconception as to the rights of the
East India Company. As to the underwriters, who
opposed this Bill, because they might get insurance
money, if the goods were to be sent by sea from Li-
verpool to London, it was too absurd to weigh for a
moment, on this question.
Mr. JOHNSTONE conceived, that the Bill in•
volved in it the interests of private merchants in Lon-
don and in Liverpool: he thought th:tt the best mode
would be to refer it to a Seleet Committee upstairs.
Mr. DENT said, the question now appeared to
him to be this: whether the brokers and under-
wri:ers in London should compel the merchants
at Liverpool to ship and land their goods a second
time, and run all the hazard of losing them ?
Sir T. METCA LFI., said, that London was the
only market for the %ale of East India goods. In
'I tic!: the owners of the goods in question had
a verthed that they would sell them in defiance of
the law. But an order sea; sent down from the Com-
missioners of Cus:•:.:, that they should not do so.—
He would not se this Bill, nor did the East India
Company mean to do so.
Mr PRINC EP said, as the Bill was for the relief
of individuals, his objedions against it were re-
moved.

Mr. GILES Gbjeled to the Bill, as being a parti-
cular case, in which a general A4I of Parliament
was about to be dispensed with. Tne Al of the
43J of the King provided, that all East-India
goods, whatever British port they were brought to,
must be sold in London only. The parties who fitted out
letters of marque, and brought those goods to Li-
verpool, must have kno.vn that law, and could not
have aeled under a misconception.
After a reply from Mr. Ross, the Report was
received, and Counsel ordered to be heard to-mor-
row on the 3d reading of the Bill.