The British Press; or, Morning Literary Advertiser.
London, England, 1810-05-18 00:00:00

COMMITTEE OF FINANCE.

The House having resolved awlf sato a Coat-
aittre—

Mr. Basses said, that it was his intention to
produce au • sinendrnern, which. he hoped, mid
meet with I!ie approbation. ei the House, end of
his Rig), Honourable Friend On the other side (tile.
Chatijv!lni of the Exchequer.) The object to which
it a., .hierteil chiefly, was the abolition of sine-
cure olfee., but he should incest poratc with it a
provi.ion for remasicrating those who deserved well
tithe public, which, he hilpaide, nomad do airily all
objecti..., to the main principle. It was manifest
to every one, that Clan offices had now fallen into
such iii,repuie, that all who were intended to be
funbiureil by them, were, 00 the contrary, des.
geared. and seat into society under a double angina.
The kosolittion *lnch he should here the honour of
prorang, would go to release them from IMO hu-
miliohon, and would produce the very best effects
upon publiC economy. •It would create a par-
ticular fund for the express purpose of rewarding
the pulhic Retrains, so that each fond could hetallitied
%Mown purpoiles ;a circumstance of the stigma' im-
portance to the proper management and regulation
ef the ex penditure. He cautioned the House against
that feeling, which might prompt them to with-
hold all farther Reform, because there were some
person who demanded too much. If, is conse-
quence of the unreasonableness of others. they were
I.d to adopt a sullen silence, and as oniaripmving
obstinacy themselves, in his opinion they would
adopt the very worst policy. Some time ago. the
resotution, which he now proposed, would be
thought reasonable, nor could he see any reason
why it should not at present. It would shew those
pram's, who were inclined to go to extremes,
that they were ready to do what was right. and to
adopt swell reforms as were useful. He moved this
reolutioo, because hr thought the system of sine-
titre offices a bad one, and because lie thought that
public servants would hr better provided for. -114 such
steps as this, the Constitution would be improved,
aud the cerstituent body brought at last to think well
*Atwell whointheywererepreeentedinParliament.
He 10. krd traon it as a very great objection. that
the wan who became possessed of any sinecure
ii-
Inatioa, be his deserts what they might, had the
poser to enjoy the products. thereof perpetually;
Ind the circumstance of his having been endowed
nib a large fortune independently, which, of
etioi.e, obviated the necessity of inch addition,
ih•udd be considered attentivadc. and would ogee
rit. itrougiy, even of itself, against the rositinnalice
a system. He concluded with moving
ovdinson, reco ii mending the abolition of sinecure
ev, with the exception of those irosnedist• ly
t..4iiected with Ilia Majesty, awl the Royal Fa-
; and, at th, same time, recommending, that
71- other way should be adopted tor rewording
alio were entitled to public sckilowledg.

`lr. ilet:aT
Matirts *aid, that be would very
agrie in the Ilan. Gentlelnots'fi B.whilion•
n'ie would arAnnolcdge, that ru effic.eut
should be rewarded, and t'a,tr those who
'' the pu6li avrvin,s, should uut be ea-
. 4: • 1 from a similar in sidcrotion ; hot he did
that the made ur rewording by sine-
re.c.. by any chg.hic or unnhjec-
plln of corupt•nsition 1.,r al um. service's.
I- • rt tivy's eartietteu *Levied, that if the Creeu

was unable to grant a pension, or any other rem u-
iteration, the •giatiteferisid bea,ficeucte of Perlin-
meat would be immediately exeftiil. Ile acknow-
4edged, there bad been nu light introduced jute
the Resolution, and that he would have been better
littstitilie;l, if it went to the abolition of all sinecures,
,:without exception and modification. %Vith r.sprct
to rewarding civil services by pension, the l'ailia-
ment would, in such case, posies, an authority
over the reward. The advantage then, would
be, that the reward was certain, because the
pension was cei min; and sorely an honourable
and certain petition was notch preferable to a
sanecure situation, disgraceful as it was, and du-
bious in its profits and emoluments. There was
!mother very striking dkadvantage, besides those
itheadystated, in the system of sinecnres; the Crown
was never apprised of what it conferred as a siue-
core, the probable value was not known to it; for
if the Crown possessed such information, the sine-
cures, amounting to nearly half a million, which had
'been store time since beatowed, would not have
been cdoferred; it was said, that the persons
thus distinguished were considered disreputable,
and that obloquy was inseparable from the posses-
sion of sinecure offices—that argument was surety
a very strong and convincing nue in favour of their
abolition. He was convinced that every thing voted
in the Committee of 17e0, upon this subject. should
be carried into effect. The abolition oistuecures
was looked upon by the public as a measure of in-
dilpensahle utility; they were highly diesatisfietl
with their existence, and were justly repugnant to
any unnecessary mere lee of the public expenditure.
Whatitver might be said of the prosperous state of
the trade and commerce of the country, he looked
upon the necessary consequences of taxation 4 the
ereating of great capitalists, and breaking down
the middle ranks of society. He was of opinion,
that when a peraou was quitting his public duties,
-atone regard Mould be had to his situation upon
the' question of et:toupee-adios' ; for it man who was
possessed of large fortune, and who was indepen-
dent of the office which be held, was certainly not
to expect so greet a remuneratioa for his services,
us that loan who was dependent upon his situation,
for support, and whoodevoted all his time and at-
tention to the duties of that situation. As in entire
reform could not he obtained. he was most anxious
to obteiu the best he could, and therefore would
agree to the resolution of the Hee. Gentleman.
Mr. Lima mitt, that so argument had been ad-
duced ageing' the propriety of the system of sine-
cure offices. Gentlemen hod spokes much of the
considerable disadvantages which, resulted front
such an establishment. but they bad not stated the
advantages which would result from aufssibstitti-
lion ; the fact was, that au unfair view laud been
taken of those offices, which did not exist muter
such circumstances of above as bad been represent-
ed. If !aureoles were too numerous, the flambe,
could be reduced ; but the essence of the system
should still remain unimpaired. He certainly con-
teived that Idiom offices should be confined to civil
sciences, as he would be sorry that the House should
not enjoy the pleasure of rewarding as it thought fit
the exertions of naval or military merit.
Lord ALTleoarle did not know any objection
that could be made to the abolition of inuecures,
wholly and without exception, and conceived that
rewards were belt and most properly conferred by
pension. The abolition of the former had been
looked upon bj some Gentletnen as an encroach-
ment upon the prerogative of the Crow ti; but such
a 'measure could not diminish the prerogative in
the seine proportion that it was increased by other
circumstances.

Mr. W. tinten spoke in strong terms in favour
of the rystaintion, which. modified :a it wits, would
produce a most desirable change in the system
which was carried to such excess. It hail been
said, that the persons upon whoa* those distinctions,
sucb as they were, had been conferred, were de-
serving of coo...iteration for their services. This was
not the case; for many who had never performed
any praiseworthy act, tending to the public benefit,
were hesped.with sinecures. He did not conceive
that Ministers would have proposed the sum of
2,7001. per annum, to the First Lord of the Ad-
:ninety, independent' of his official emolunieuts.
if that sum was to be pensioned to him ; they re-
marked and atteuiled to the distinction between
pension sod sinecure. He contended that the
principle on which the present resolutions were
founded, was not new, bet had been acted upon
through a long series of years ; and. in support of
his opiuion, quoted acts of resumption iii many
rites. Novelty could not, therefore, be urged
nougat the measure. The necessity for abolish-
ing sinecures. arose from the severe pressure
of public burdens. These could only be re-
duced by lowering the annual expenditure, and
not less by the present measure, which would con-
vince the people that, whether great or small, the
economy of Government was directed to prevent
any imprudent waste of money, which, by being
retained, would lessen the taxes. It had been said,
that all officers attached to the Crown, and Princes
of the Blood, should be spared in this reform ; but
he had no hesitation in saying. that the diguity and
honour of the Crown would be more consulted in
attaching the alfections of the people, than by pen-
sioning l d Lords of the Bed-chamber at 100 1. a-
year, who had votes im the other House, and genes
rally voted one way. Were they without salary,
would the splensloor of the Crown be diminished,
or the character of these Noble Lords lowered in
public estimation ?
Mr. B•seattp adverted to the number of Cm-
iniveCi fur re rOfalillg abuses is public expenditure,
and imputed the great prevalence of discontent. to
there Paving been nothing done of their Reports ;
end year aver year passed. without any remedy
bring 4 j•pliel A consciousness of this, he Gls-
served iii the proceedings of the House and the
agitation of toes: 'Oats. They had no rights, taut
the rights of Cir people; mod ought, by economical
retrenchment, to .hew the people that they de.•
served their c oitidence.
Mr. Witiletrow said, the retrenchment of sine-
cures nuutd not lessen in any extent nortis
the hurtle,, of the people. It eas th• rtfore (sit
the prifici;le alone that the *:utter sv.. 4,4 :Is di.-
Ile übrVeri to the ion !cut IL -Motto-is,
because they one soor.-e sir 1, ..and. and
said they asstd.' satniitut another, 'olio Ii oilier,
they did not den . . In • pps,•itooi Al-
'burin and Mr. *AO, he asserted, that the

trice of the Crown, to far from having increased.
had decreased.—(Sletioro of hear! fishes the tipposi-
lion.) Ile defended this assertion, on the ground
that though the patronage of the Crown had in-
creased double 'since 1782, in consequence of the
increased expenditure, yet that it was not in a
greater proportion to the wealth and population of
the conntry. on which it had now to operate. in
proof of this, he took the value of land and of
trade, and thence deduced, that the wealth of the
nation was in proportion of five to one, to what it
had been in 1782. _ . .

Mr. Vi &HUMES!) replied to the last speaker. He
ridiculed his criterion of judging of the prerogative
by the value of lend, or a linshel of corn, as if the
prerogative was to fluctuate with a good or bad
h . lie condemned the whole system of re-
warding by sinecures, which he coosidersid as hay.
Mg fallen to value 1001. per rent. per diem, since
the appointment of Mr. Yorke to the Auditorship
of the Exchequer. He reflected on the appoint-
ment of Lord Liverpool to the Werdenship of the
Cinque Ports which, he thought, a distinct act of
favouritism. Which wooldhavelirnn more applicible
for the reward of great military or starlit services.
Though he agreed with the two resolutions now
blended together, he would rather they had, as last
year's, been kept distinct. The ioelivatiou of. his
sabot was, dist sioecures might be abolished alto-
gether, and the addition to the resolutioe seen.
uised too much the principle of sinecures,
in his opinion, rested on no misciple whatever,
lie animadverted on the offices held by Mr. Pewee-
rat, was proceeding to cornmeal oo the amounted
their emoluments, when he was islowned across the
table, that Mr. Pereevel, sincse..ho was appointed
First Lord of the Admiralty, had not received the
salary of Chancellor of the Exchequer. •
Mr. WIIITSIBAD said. be was happy to beer
this, of which he bad no previous knowledge. and
trusted the new First Lord of the Admiralty would
follow so good en example.—/Hear,
however, argued, that it would he much better
that ethtieut offices should be fully paid, rather
than eked out by sinecures. He would not allow
Mr. Burke's Bill Witte taken as decisive of his opi-
nion. Mr. Rorke had dime what he could,. mot
what he would do. Upas all acconnts, he thought
sinecures ought to be immediately abolished, übd
that, too, without the competisatiOn contended for
to the present holders; If the resolution now pro.
posed was adopted, what security we there thot
the Dew fund might not, in time, be abused, an the
presort tiptoes was? He ism also averse-to giving
superasemsatioo after a certain term of services,
and thought the resolution could not be framed
to meet all the objections to it. Even if the
powe, of reinuneratiou was lodged in the House
of Commons, even that in time would come to
be too easily obtaiord. He denied that the
power of the. pension fist was given to-the Crows
to give to favourites. iihid 'otitis Crows the 41
per Cents. and the Droim of the Admiralty to do
this with? The Crown had the miner to be just
and liberal, and the interests of the Crown and the
people were owe and indivisible. O. the whole. he
wished the Right Horn fiesitleinan (Mr. Bank's)
to be more explicit in explaining the nature of bas
substitute, which, w now proposed. would partake
of the odium-attached to Its originaL Ile would
ratlikr have the people prnitified with the swift of
150A001. a-year. as • loon, than that the. Howse
should be forced perhaps to give it obeli it would
be little thought of.
Mr. IVisserou and Mr. LOlll3 explained.

The Cuancesion of the EMR.. QUM' agreed
that the interests of the Crown and the people were
one; but doubted. whitlier taking from the prero-
gative of the Crown, was eitli r ellieltititUg the ill.
tercets of the Crown or the people. • The present
resolution, with its qualificatious. if. he under..
stood them, was useless, if not lintilmi,sible. He
could not conceive that the siibctitution of pension
fur place, as a reward for services, would either di-
minish the public burdens, or the prerogative. of
the Crown. He briefly replied to the •objeetions
urged against the latter mode, and contended,
that equally substantive ones might be urged
against the reward by pension. Did any man
believe that this was the way to please and eon•
tent the people, or appease the clamour, which
those who declaim *gamut sinecures, as stig-
matising the individuals who accepted of them,
were too apt to increase ? He defended the appoint-
meat of Mr. Yorke, than whom a more honourable
soon did not exist; and contended that this had cast
no odium on the system of rewarding services by
grants of sinecure places. As fur his emoluments,
if it would afford the Has,. Gentleman any plea-
sure, he could inform him that Mr. Yorke had, in
consequence of holding the office of Teller of the
Exchequer, relinquished the 4,0001. •-year,
granted during the Administratiou,. of which
Mr. T. Grenville formed a part, to that Gentle-
man, as First Lord of the Admiralty.—
He now entered into, refutation of the doctriues
on which the present resolutions were founded.
The mode to he substituted for what existed was
unknown ; but if it was intended to give persons,
after a certain term of services, a right to reward,
that remold destroy the prerogative. He also ob-
jected to the idea of floating pensions, and contend-
ed against the mistaken doctrines of resumption,
maiutained by Mr. W. Smith. As for substitut-
ing pensions for sinecures, as • mode of reward, the
cry of those who now joined his Mon. Friend (Mr.
Bank's) would be as lung and as loud against pen-
sions, should he be enabled to carry his I-resent
motion. With a eie to economy, it uttered nu
hope; and as for retrenching the prerogialie,- of
the Crown, he perfectly coincided with his lion.
Friend, ( W halloo.) is ho•e argil ments ere easier
laughed at. thou refined, that the other parts of the
Constitution had increased !proportionally more in
strength and wealth. than the patronage and in-
llueuce of the Crown had incraatsd. Upon these
grounds he opposed the res.'s,' ion, us °tiering no
ailiantage in any respect, and being satisfactory to
folly.

is rid littTOX Wall of opinion, that the resolii-
ti nw of his Ilion. Friend (Mr. limikes) &served the
support of the flour" lie thought, if they Were
conieJ, they could do ■way with public ecau•iel.
Ile will IA person that did not give nay to public
r !amour ; butt Ins was • (invents which node no 'sty
wi 11-usteweing and laudable perilous do..cootriited ;
for which reason, it should have lilt cotire support.
CANNING, to a spctch rcpl4.;te'b‘ith argu.

ment, said, however, it jesijM be injuries,
feelings, he could dot rot .ipPalaj every
ment uttered by his Rigiit Mei. 1 the.
cellop of the Exchequer. Aftok to a teviaa
the resolutions, which he comemated se -
argumentative manner, he cooeletied, >by Gariipf
that he would not strip the Clews df the vanish -
encouraging and paying talentdeet had been :-
to its service ; hut, as the resolutioa, it propoitd,
made a provision fir that kind of eessiceS it shoal'
have his support.
Mr. PETIM 'Muoae said, that Ila.did sat
the resolution, as.first proposed by Ms filabaYr.
able Friend (Mr. Martin) went far
that then. under diseussion did not go:*
on which account be could not agree to eithor.
then entered at length into the coedit* r
Majesty's !streusel Ministers, as it related
titions, and contended, it wts their wish .
from the Royal ear the opinion of its subjects,
the grievances of the public. The litilase •
bad deviated from the right coarse, • re
their petitions, for be coosidered the privileges
the people to he es dear to the country es f'
Tilers of the House.. The people were
tented, and nothing wits done to dioviate
were in that state that they mould. nrily
.any thing, a • match, a piece of nistalin, ,
thing else that coati be made a rallying polio,.
Strangers were excluded, sod the Cinewiltest
divided, when there appeared. ,

res

Majority *pilot Mildews& •
On our being re.edositted into the
found Mr. 11.‘111surta on his. legs.
that he bpd net Noy objection to has
fiats being misfired, out after Ilse
as he would have an, opportunity, at this
of the Report, to distills any of dente of the
Geodeura• (Mr. Brakes), which be might
approve of.
The Resolistions or lb. Minim were,,
ingly pet. and negatived.
The House resumed, and the Castait
leave to bring tip the Report ou Tuesday
which was agreed ie. •
The other Orders df the da nerd-then aisplialt
of, and the House adjourned at mil

Lrcsois
Mean the aplial Liman Otis lAN Cliambarlals,
This prim* EMMA; 'Mg 116 IN% Tier '
Savour WI palm • Now imi• Castle
THE MANIAC' Oa; THE I*ls :gat.
The maraca". by N.. ftilipr. Mr. ust_44
wrenimigi, -Mc Mayirma, Mr. ). Hid* Mr. was
Dowses, Mr. Madrimi, Mr.Mhirsial; 'Mrs. Mosuisis:'
Bishop, Mn. Mosel, Ike. kr.
. .

To iiiiete wig he added, gee gaga's(
THREE WEEKS AFTER MARgLaGR.
Sir Charles Rath" Hr. Hothead ; Dra Mr. Der
Lady Racket, Mrs Edwia ; Mrs. Mrs. Starks.
••• ThoOgl -7egeo;111,
as Moodily seat, to Nd. ts 7, Striae, awl, &p/ate "
Lyceum Theatre.
t+t• For Sfacetiatieoas lategigeteee see the hiat

THIC BRITISH.PRiC

-LON D014,*-
FRIDAY. MAT

A Conversation took place last night io the
orLords, epos the moticn for the second
of the Reversion Bill. It derives odditional.
from the observations made upon the present
of the public miud. The Bill was rejected.

Ministers were left, last bight, in .i Minority,
upon Mr. Plillits'S Resolutions fur the show'
of Sinecure Paces. Here is the great source
disconteut that now agitates the public.
Ministers oppO' so every. plan of Constitutional
form ; mod, although the sense of the Hong
Commons, mad of the country, has been repeal
declared against them, in the most anew,'
railleaef. they continue in office.

We understand the SPLAKII of the Hi
Commons has withdrawn his special pies
Famects"Buusisres declaratiee, and pleaded
general issue. •

Eat Game, lost oight, put off his tootles
state of the Imam to Friday, the itt of Jose.

A Morning Paper, of yesterday, devoted
its columns to as article, purporting to be
ewer to Mr. PoesoNsv's speech on Friday
wets oat win stating, as a priaciple, that the
legee demanded by Mr. Ponscruar, for the
of Commons, exceed eves wine belongs to
!lament, consisting of the three estates, the
Lords. sad Commons; while iterlakur, that
aver Parliament, this constituted, cheese
is the law, however contrary it may be
ceding usage or statite. Whbre the foul
involves so much cleaning, a clear and
fastory superstructure WY DOE to .be expect

and, of course, the perusal of the ankle,
futatioo of Mr. Poirtoestr's speech. has

appointed As. , We most confess, bower
it displays an affectation of decp learning, and
letter lucubratious.

Government, we understand, have readif
ed to the request from the Junta of Galli,
a supply of anus. It is melancholy, to reflect
such a request should have ever been pec-
an. that the proposed supply should be
Authentic accounts lone been received
Locative of our former statement of Lonl
Isnving marched M Grohs) 1.
who threatened Itodrigo. A Bestowal:
lion has, pso:,uht), been furifht, before title I
11Ir. M aca.c.n ma is stated to bate wired.
on the Ist instant. Me is beariamewd
clown.? with the title of Envoy of file Itribeeek
jelty, and Mr. W. Kisroll. who Secolortaied
11th that of his Stalls/7 of Legatioo.

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