The British Press; or, Morning Literary Advertiser.
London, England, 1803-03-12 00:00:00

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'him. It seas' teertilitii the undoubted pi' terative
of the Crown to make peace or war, and as un-
datibtedly the privilege of the House to grant or to
withhold supplies ; by • which means the House,
utouge they could net prevent a declaration of wet,
possessed the power of giving it a pradical negative,
by denying the means of prosecuting it. Kat the
questions of peace and war were very different ;
even when peace is concluded, it is a question, what
degree of information may with propriety be given.
In case of war, every possible degree of informatiMi
ought at a proper period to be given ; but m case
of peace, if that peace proved satisladoty, there was
no Arena flcie necessity for explanation. In case of
war, there was no inconvenience attending the full
elucidation of the subjed ; hut at the conclusion of
peace, it was often necessary to withhold many cir-
cumstances attending the negotiation for that pur-
pose. lie by no means meant, in case of war, to .
withhold any information on that subjc.l ; he wish-
ed- varticularly to explain this point; but before the
negotiations which were carrying on Nver.t ,breuglit
to a ctmchtsion, it would be unwarrantable in his
Majesty's Ministers to give the information now re-
quired of theta. The Hon. Gentleman opposite to
hint (Mr. Fox) had dropped a word in mistake,
which implied that the Hoe se would be pledged to
the war by the Vote of Supply. But he would beg
leave to observe, that the House would not be so
committed ; and he would at the same time ask,
whether in case of an armament during important
discussions, the 1-louse ought to call for information,
or whether it \meld be proper in his Majesty's Mi-
nisters to give it ? The Hon. ( leatleman has alluded
to the affair of the Russian armament—Oa that -sub-
ject there was a diversity of opinion among the best
informed mtn. Rut the war between Russia and
Turkey did not immediately affect the security of
his Majesty's dominions ; and as to political rea-
sons, every reason would weigh Against a war with
Russia. But the question at present is very differ-
ent : it is a question with a Power at all times
dangerous to this country. He might see a
case when an .arrnament in the ports of France,
even without any pending discussions, would
justify the Measure- of arming on our parts ; but
when there was not only an armament prepar-
ing, but discussions at the estme time going forward,
the combination of such powerful motives rendered
the adoption of precautionary measures doubly ne-
cessary. The French may. mean, .and he trusted
did mean honestly ; but until the discussions were
concluded, vigilance, precaution, and preparation
were indispensibly necessary on our parts. At the
same time he mast again repeat, that thosemea-
sures were merely precitutioaary, and could not in
the remotest degree be sup posed. to commit the
country in a war with France ; • and most assuredly,
*lore the country was so committed, the clearest
information should be required by Parliament, and
given on'the part of his Maystv's Ministers. He
was desirous to answer what fell from an Hon.
t,entlemin opeosite to him (Mr. Francis) respect-
ing the confidence he had hitherto reposed in his
lifajesty's present Ministers. It is certainly the un-
doubted privilege of every member of this House
to give or to withhold, without any influence what-
ever, his free support, as his duty may dictate to him;
and his Majesty's Ministers, however highly they
May prize the confidence of any member of this
House, should never desire or require it, except upon
the most pure and constitutional grounds; and that
confidence should be founded on the most mature
'deliberation and the most tried experience. All that
his Majesty's Ministers can say is this, that they
may indulge a hope of being dealt fairly with*. He
would beg leave to say on their part, 64 DO not pre-
judge us—do not withdraw your confidence with-
out good cause, founded on setisfadory enquiry."
Ilis Majesty's Ministers are perfedly aware of their
heavy responsibility ; and he believed he might say,
without presumption, that their condud was inva-
riably direded to the hest of their judgments, and
the full extent of their abilities, to the. service of
their King, and the interests of their country. They
would be ready at a proper season to give every in-
iiirmation that may be required, and wished to
stand or fall by the opinion of Parliament. He
therefore would repeat his hope that they should be
dealt fairly dealt with, and not prejudged, hut al-
lowed to continue that reserve which their duty en-
forced, until they could lay it aside With safety. As
to the amendment moved by an Hon. Gentleman
(Mr. Dent); he believed, thoueh amendments may
be moved for the purpose- of decreasing a supple,
it was unusual to move for its increases and should
there be any necessity (which he trusts there will
not be) for an augmentation, it can be resorted to
without difficulty in the event cf war.
Mr. FOX in explanation, said, that he was hap-
py to find the Noble Lord .agreed with him in the
general principles he laid down. He acknowledged
a slip of the tongue ; and instead of saying, :that
voting the Supply would make us a party to the war
—he meant to say that it would make us a party to
the armament. The Noble reed said, that the ease
of Russia was different from the present. It might
be so. He said the armaments in the ports of France '
rendered it necessary for us to arm also—But was
there any necessity of a Message to inform us, that •
armaments were carrying on in the ports of France,
when that circumstance was notorious. But now
two grounds for arming were urged, the one in res-
pect to the armaments, and the other to the discus-
sions ; and upon either of those grounds to vote the
,Supply, must necessarily make us a party to the ar-
mament. As to the question of Prerogative, he
must. contend, that when .once you establish it as
a maxim, that his Majesty's Message. without any
explanatory information, should be in itself a suf-
ficient cause for voting a supply—from that mo-
ment there was an end to the check which the
Legislature had-noon the Executive Power. The
Hon. Gentleman then alluded to a motion made in
the year 1791 by an Hon. Gentlemen,- now absent,
(Mr. T. Grenville) which went to establish this po-
sition, that, before a supply was granted, previous
information as to die objets for which it was in-
tended should be indispeusibly necessary. As to the
present case, we had no information whatever—We
arc told of discussions and armaments in France,
which, when combined, were urged as sufficient
grounds for the adoption of this measure; but as to
the nature of the discussions, we are totally in the
(Jerk. If it was absolutely necessary to arras, Minis-
, ters, he said, were justified in doing so, even before
it could lie: sandioned by a vow of this House ; brit
if he understood the Constitution of England, there
was not a point in it more clearly defined than this,
that he should not vote away the money of his con-
stituents, without the most tatisf.Etory infortnatiou.

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--1111F77.
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Lord HANtritESEURY in etplanat7on said, the
iliqe.rence between the case. of Russia and the pre-
sent was this. In the former there was an, arma-
ment, but no discussion pending. Suppose there
'. were no armaments preparing in the ports tit k'rance,
and his Atkisty's Me:..sage required a supply, barely
on the subjea of the discussions then pending, the
Hon. Gentleman might then .objed ; but here we
were called upon, because the state of .cli.cussions
uid the milita-y preparations combined, impelled
us to the a:l:)ption of mnsures of precaution,
Mr. ELLIO I' rose. merely for the purpose of
adverting to the systematic darkness which was ob-
served, no: oaly on the. present but on former occa-
sion% He wished to know what information had
• seen given respating the late treaty; how far it
had been carried into effea ; or why, if the execu-
tion of was to be interrupted now, any places had
been given up ? Why our armies have with such
blind security been reduced, and our viEtorious
deets dismantled ? Upon all or any of these points
no information had been given. Ministers still per-
severed in that system of obscurity ; and he con-
tended that the present call upon the House was
in the spirit of that sys:em, a d that it was unpre-
cedented' to vote a supply without a previous expla-
nation of the objca !Or which it was intended, and
the cause which required it.

Mr. CANNING said, it was not his intention to
pursue the discussion of the constitutional questions
which had been entered upon. What he urged on
a former night was not meant, and he hoped not
calculated to disturb the unanimity which mani-
fested itself,on that occasion. His object was en-
tiseiy direaisd- to the acquisition of information on a
sulejed so highly momentous to the country. lie
was sorry to observe, that the answer he received
was badly calculated to give him any satisfadion on
the subjea ; he was told, that if lie was urgent for
information, he could make a motion fer applying
to his Majesty for that purpose. He did net meats
to complain of that answer now, but he finds that a
Member of rerliement must at times suspend the
most urgent enquiries. He would go as liras any
man in adopting measures of security, but if he was
kept completely in the dark, as to the nature of the
danger Which those.measures are intended to meet,
he could not help trespassing on the attentioa of the
House, by expressing his sentiments of disappoint-
ment. He should, however, vote for what is called
for by the words of the message, on the ground
that armaments being in a state of preparation in
the ports of France, is certainly a good cause for
arming ; neither can it be denied, that those pre-
parations being made while a discussion is pending,
is another cause ; but then why should it not a.so
be considered a cause for additional information ?
When the first expedition to. St. Domingo was pre-
paring i n the pone of France, no' ealousy was ma-
nifested on that occasion ; and if. at tliat time any
person ventured to point it out as an object of alarm,
he would be accused of wishing to create ill-blood
between the two nations. Was it not strange then
to hear this urged es an. argument now, for assum-
ing an hostile 'appearance which was disregarded
then ? lie was confuleotthere must be some other
cause for having recourse to this measure, with
which we arc not likely to be made acquainted.
He did not blame Ministers for their conduct; he
rather thinks them entitled to his praises, but he
must still urge his wish for information. He ruses
for the supply, not only to be prepared against
invasion; but he would strengthen the hands of
Ministers to bring those discussions to a final con-
!elusion, and put an end to this delusive repose,
which we could not be said to,enjoy—He wish-
ed to put an end to a state which was. not
-state of peace—a state for which history afford-
ed no precedent ; for which no vocabulary af-
forded a name—A state which shook our political
security and existence more than the most calami-
tous war, with all its horrors, could do. But he
trusts Ministers will take such steps as wiil rid us of
this political lethargy ; and if we are again to re-
lapse into a feverish dream of pacific security, lie
will be diseppointed in the object fur which he this
night gives his votes
Sir WM. PULTENEY thought that those Mi
nisters who would - not involve the country into
war, unless forced to it, were most likely to meet
the general approval of the country. •An Hon.
Gentleman opposite (Mr. Canning) had seemed to
him to wish for that sort of information which it
would be very imprudent to grant, during the pen-
dency of the present important negociations. It ap-
peared to him that to grant such niformation would
be 'injuring the negociations between this country
and France.--s What was the reason wily the ques-
tion of peace or war was intraested to the Executive
Government ? It was because there were points con-
tin' elly arising, the disclosing of which might be
atteaded with consequences extremely prejudicial.
Could-any man sunrise that the armament now pro-
posed would be sighcient to curry on a war ? It was
nothing more titan a wise precaution to prevent. a
war. • It would have the effea of shewing to all
Europe, and particularly to that power which lead
excited the alarm, and convince it we were prepared
for the worst. He hoped our preparations would
not end. here ; he trusted, we should not altogether
depend on our fleets, but place our military at home
in a forMidable posture. He thought, when so much
was at stake, Ministers ought 'not to aa with a par-
simonioas economy, like a parcel of stock-holders.
He believed the day' must come, when this country
and France would struggle for power. The - First
Consul had distinctly told us we, mast, fight' fir our
all ; and therefore, if we are to have a struggle, we
had better have it now than at any attire period.
France wanted peace more than we -did; and he
was peretralea that the insolent publications issued
by the First Consul had excited a spirit of indigna-
tien in the breast of every subjea. He was •far
from wishing a war should take place, bat he
hoped we shoeld take care to be ready foe it when-
ever it did. That a great struggle would take place
between Enelend and Fiance, was an event which
ate considered as certain, and he really believed we
had no reason to be apprehensive with regard to
the event.
Mr. FOX and Mr. CANNING shortly es-
' plained. •
Mr. TRENCH observed, that an Hon. Gentle-
man (Mr. Canning) had mentioned, that the Mes-
sage from the Throne insininued, thu although
the avowei purpose. of the Free arritaraent was
colnaial, yet that the real purpose of it was hostility
with regard to this country. Now he would ven-
ture to say, there was no such iusizmation,cantaincti
in any part of hi: ISlejesnt's Message. It was cited
I to be tub/Ai:IL But it hid beta truly said by a

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