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London, England, 1826-02-15 00:00:00

THE BRITISH PRESS.

the debate on this question. those gentlemen molt opposed to each
other agreed in regard to the great extent of mischief that was pro.
dured by the conduit of the Bank of England in the course of the
last year. Looking back to what that conduct had been on peril.
cular occasions—for instance, in the year 1787, in the year IM,
and in the year 1783, he found the course pursued by the Bank had
been precisely the same ; which w. s a course of over. issues on occa-
sions when, by a proper acquaintance with the circumstances of the
country, they must hive perceived would be injurious: and on
other occasions too great a contraction of those issues. He would
nut, in the present thin state of the House, enter more fully into
the subject, but he could not avoid expressing his full conviction
that until the excessive privileges of the Bank were got rut of,
there would remain with them a power to do mischief which in the
nature of thing. 'mist take place. Ile was ready to give the Hon.
Member (Mr. Pewee), and those with whom he acted, every credit
for their good intentions, and for being anxious to conduct the
affairs entrupted to them to the best advantage to all; hut still it
was out of the nature of things to think that those whose first busi-
ness it was to look to the profits of the proprietors for whom they
acted, would or could throw away those opportunities presented to
them for making a profit by an extensive issue of paper, though
inconsistent perhaps with the best interests of the country. Ile
wished to ask the Right Hon. Gentleman (the Chancellor of the
Exchequer) why the plan proposed by 3lr. Ricardo, for allowing
the Bank to pay in gold bullion, was not allowed ? lie had always
understood that the only reason was, bermes: of the quantity of
forgeries of small notes. Now, as they were about to get rid of
small notes, he thought they might with propriety refer again
to that plan. With regard to the admission of silver
as a staudarti together with gold it appeared to him that
if it were practicable, without disturbing the present mint regu-
lation., there was no objection to the measure. But he was of
opinion that anything that wan calculated to disturb those regula-
tion!' would be a most improper and injurious measure. But he
could sec no reason why the Bank should not be allowed to pay in
gold bullion or silver bars. eetimating the latter according to Its
proportionate value with gold. There wee one point more which
he would touch upon, merely by way of observation. He had been
much surprised that in the course of this discussion no Gentleman
had mentioned the influence which the Usury JAWS evidently had
with reterelice to the currency. The operation of those laws upon
the commercial affair' of thie country haul in a great degree contri-
buted to the distress that had been produced. It was stated in a
book to which frequent reference had been made, and which was
the work of a man of considerable practical knowledge, he meant
the late publication of Alr. Tooke, that stock and other property
haul been sold for the purpose of discharging debts for money, 20
and 30 per cent. less than its real value; and a banker had told
him (Sir H. Parnell), that he knew of a case where property had
been sold as much as 70 per cent. for the same purpose. Why
should they allow laws to exist that conirelled persons to SafTiliet:
their property dm.? He begged therefore to !tugged to the Right
Hon. the Chancellor of the Exchequer to consider whether it was
I not practicable to do much good to the commercial world by re.
Hewing discounts front the operation of these Usury bawl/. lie
called upon the Right lion. Gentleman to consider whether the
I commercial interests could not be materially benefited by such •
step ? There three measures which he had suggested, namely, the
doing away altogether of the Bank monopoly, that was, to take
away its exclusive privileges ; the allowing the Bank to pay in bul-
lion, and the repealing of the Usury Lawn, were, in his opinion,
essentially necessary to he adopted in order to effect any real and
permanent good to the country; and considering the vast portion
Of evil that originated from the uncontrolled power possessed by the
Bank, by its influence on the circulation, he thought there was no
sum which could be estimated as being proper to be given in com-
pensation to the Bank fur giving up those privileges which this
country ought not to pay.
Mr. Alderman BRIDGES did not see that any other measure
could be resorted to at present, except what was done in 1793,
namely, the issuing of exchequer bills for the relief of the
merchants of London, and through them to all parts of the
country. Unless some such thing were done, he really thought
that it would not only threaten the safety of his Majesty's Govern.
ment, but that of the country also. lie therefore entreated his
Majesty's Ministers to give the subject their most serious consi-
deration, and apply a remedy as epettiily as possible.
Sir F. BLAKE observed, that it struck him with some surprise
to notice that now that his Majesty's Ministers had adopted a libe-
ral line of policy, all were become liberal in their turn ; and even
some of the friends of Ministers, who were not liberal in any re.
spect before, were so in this, in denouncing the measures that had
been lately espoused by the Government. Ile would say to those
Hon. Mashers, " Go on, tear his Majesty's Ministers to pieces if
you can." (Laughter.) He begged to assure the Right lion. Gen.
denten opposite, that he did not mean it in a literal sense, nor did
he apply it individually. (Much laughter.) It was an unusual
thing for Hon. Members of his side of the House to rise up and
support his Majesty's Ministers, but they ever elid so when they
considered the Government were acting consistent with the true in.
tercets of the country. For this reason it was that he now rose to
return his sincere thanks to his Majesty's Ministers, for the very
liberal line of policy they were pursuing; and he was glad to find
they were determined to persevere in that line, notwithstanding the
gloomy apprehensions of some lion. Members on their own side of
the House. It had been said that there was a combination between
the two sides of the House, but he knew of none; but even if
there were, what harm could there be when such men combined to
do the most good to their country ? There were men of high
talents on his side of the House as well as on the other—men of
great experience and strict integrity; and when such men united to
do good, it did not follow that they would conspire to do evil.
With regard to the system of free trade, he thought that at present
there was a necessity for suspending its operation in part ; but
when the circumstances of the country would permit it, he hoped
the principles of free trade would be carried into effect in the most
extensive way.
Mr. Alderman HEYGATE thought the Hon. Member who
had just sat down had made the most singular speech that ever he
heard in his life. His Majesty's Ministers did not speak the semi-
menu of t he nobility or gentry of the realm, who usually supported
them. Whatever might be the opinion in this House, there was
but one opinion out of doors, and that was that the country was
sacrificed to a cold-blooded theory. It was impossible that any ex-
cept those who belonged to the political clubs of modern economists
could embrace the principles that were now broached. The truth
of the matter was this, that the majority of persons who
had supported his Majesty's Ministers, he would venture
to affirm, did not approve of what was now going on. Did
they receive any cheers (Laughter) or support tiom those Gen-
denten who eat beside them ? No. Where did the support and
approbation they met with come from ? It came from those who
were their bitterest opponents, and who had been so for the last
thirty years ; and they were almost the only persona who counte-
nanced their measures. The Ministers might say what they
would about their liberality, and the support they enjoyed, but he
would defy them to carry the thing through. They must show
some sympathy for the people. The present state of things was, he
had almost said, • disgrace to the Government. Public secu-
rities were at so great a discount that they could not be re-
lied upon. Exchequer bills were now at a discount of twenty
shillings. Was that a right state of things ? Was there not
evidently some mismanagement that admitted of it ? Ge.
neral principles might be all very fine, but were they therefore
always practical? How could Government expect that men could
carry on the commercial transactions of London, while such a de-
rangement existed in the credit of the country? There were mo-
ments when Ministers must consult the wishes of the people, and
he maintained that things could not go on much longer, if his Ma-
jesty's Ministers did not not give some relief. If the present
course of things were persisted in, there must be a consulsion;
society could not go on. Ile pressed this upon the consideration
of his Majesty's Government: he would maintain, and the example
of all history showed it, that there were periods when general prin.
elides, however good, must for &moment be disregarded ; he meant
at a time of
.great panic. The feeling out of doors was just this,
that his Majesty's Government were neglecting the sufferings of
the people, for the sake of a system which they had espoused, and
that they refused rendering any relief, but were determined to let
matters go on till the evds cured themselves. Whether the
Ministers or the banks had caused the present distress, he
thought one thing was quite clear, that a case wan made out
for interposition. He wished to see Government popular, and
hoped his Majesty's Ministers would come forward and rid the best
they could for the country. If the new projects of political cm-
nomy were carried into effect, he was confident they would produce
a state of unparalleled agitation. The manufacturing interest was
the first to feel the distress ; the monied interest followed ; and the
agricultural interest would be the next. The agriculturists new
came forward to thank the House that their execution was sus.
pended for a year, but their turn would assuredly collie unites there
Was some relaxation of those projects which were daily undermin-
ing the foundation of our national prosperity.
Mr. 111'31E thought that as the lion. Gentleman who had just
eat down had appealed to the House to preserve the country from
the dangers of political economy, hue ought to point out the parti-
cular parts of the conduct of hie Majesty's Ministers which were
opposed to his notions of political economy. If he (Mr. Hume)
understood rightly that Hun. Gentleman did not speak correctly the
general feelings of the country. If he alluded to the removal of the
restrictions on trade, that was a measure which had met with the
unanimous approbation of the House as well as the country. lie
was not disposed to charge the country with such a want of good
sense as to turn round and find fault with measures which were ope-
rating beneficially as far as they went. The Hon. Alderman
talked of political economy, but he (Mr. Hume) would be glad to
know what the lion. Gentleman meant by political economy. The
principles of political economy were nothing more than those prin.
elides which every gentLnuan applied to the management of his own
house and his own property, only that they applied to the manage.
ment of the state. Ile agreed that the measures of Ministers were
ill-timed, and though Well at other times, he regretted that those
measures were now about to be carried into execution ; yet tie ad-
mitted lie knew not how such a course could be avoided. The
Hon. Alderman had said, why not inane exchequer hills ? but he
should be 'sorry to risk the regular proceedings of Government by
an extra Issue of exchequer bilk He would be glad if the state of
the Bank allowed it to give assistance, but he believed that the Bank
felt the pressure like the community, and could not relieve the dim_
tress. With regard to the issue of exchequer bills, he thought the
observation that fell from the Chancellor of the Exchequer was de.
cisive. lie understood the Right Hon. lientkinan to say, we
would if we could. It was hard for gentlemen to sit on the free.
sue, Bench and answer round assertions when their opponents ne.
glected to point nut particulars. Let the Gentlemen who found
fault with Ministers bring forward the particular points upon which
they opposed them, butt let them not deal in weeping assertions.
Mr. Alderman WOOL) said, his Ilon Friend (Alderman )ley.
gate) complained that the Ministers were not cheered, hut lie for-
got (fiat they had something better than cheers. They had a large
n ajority. (Hear nod hughtes.) He (Alderman Wood) was out

of these who were found M the small minority of 39, because from
his extensive correspondence with all parts of the kingdom. he was
of opinion that the Ministers ought to increase the circulation, and
the proposed measures would have a contrary tendency. He
thought all things would go on well, if they were let alone. There-
fore he voted against Ministers, but he believed they were anxious
to do all they could to relieve the country. No doubt the distress
was very great. There was a failure announced this afternoon of
a large house connected with the foreign loans. He did not think
much of the proposed plan for issuing exchequer bills. If there
was a large issue of these bilk, it would produce an immediate tall.
which would affect those whom the measure was intended to re-
-I'eva. And if we waited patiently, there was no doubt that all
would be well. The Bank had power to save the country, and had
evinced its disposition so to do. The Government ought not to
interfere. His Hight Hon. Friend. (Alderman Ileegaie,) ought
to be satisfied with having driven the Secretary for Foreign Affairs
out of the House i:y his speech last night. (Laughter.) It
was not for the Government ithertere upon evtry occasion. If in-
dividuals chose wildly to speculate, and lost by those speculations,
Government was not to blame.
. .

Mr. Alderman fIEYGATE explained, and protested that he
was the ha person who would wish to drive the Eight Hon.
Secretary for Foreign Affairs out of that House.
Mr. ATTWOOD next addressed the,lioutee, hut in so low ■
tone that his observations were quite inaudible in the gallery.
Mr. PEARM said the Bank, during the last month, had af-
forded accommodation to the most unlimited extent; mud's. ts'
bills were discounted, and continue I to he so to as great an extent
as was consistent with the security of the Bank property. But great
as this accommodation was, it was not sufficient to meet all the
difficulties of the present state of things. Mammy merchants had
property of such a kind that they could not brim g it to ih: Bank
on paper. His opinion was that there should to a recurrence
to the practice which formerly. prevailed of issuing exchequer
bills under the control of Commissioners. At the present nioinent„
when wealthy and respectable merchants were in a state of em-
barrassment for want of money to fulfil their engagements, the
issue of Exchequer bills under Commissionere, as done before,
would be highly advantageous: they should he issued at the rate
of 5 per cent. interest, which would prevent the money from finding
its way back to the Bank. It was an object that the interest
should be higher. There was a large capitalist who would
not lay out his money, but kept it by him, because the interest
was low, and the want of confidence so great. But if the interest
was high, the money would be absorbed and taken up by those
who had no connection with the Bank, and were at present dia.
tressed. . . . . .

Air. W. SMITH thought it was a hard principle to lay down,
that because a titan had lost one part of his property he ought to
lose the rest. It certainly was improper that Government should
be called on to afford relief to those who had suffered by mad and
wild schemes of sneculation, which Government could not control.
lin the other hand, it was going too far to expect the Bank to
sacrifice its property to relieve the distresses of individuals. Yet
something ought to be donee-and befwas convinced might be done.
There was a large quantity of goods in the market, and the
holders were at a loss in pay their bills. These persons were
suffering under the distress without having taken any part
in the improvident transactions which c %used it. The (;han-
cellor of the Exchequer said, that Government could not
assist the holders of goods now, for fear of encouraging specu-
lation. He (i)lr. Smith) thought the Right lion. Gentleman car-
ried his argument too far. No man would enter upon the even-
lation under the impression that if he failed he might derive some
trifling assistance. If Ministers could devise any mode of alle-
viating the present distresses they were bound to do so. Such a
line of conduct he was aseueed would no; serve as an eons urage-
, mem to individuals to indulge in rash and extravagant speeds-
[ions. It might be well to consider whether advances could not be
made on goods without leaving Llovernatent with insufficient se.
clarity.
Mr. If f;SEISSON said that as the debate had been hitherto
purely practical, he would not follow the example set by the Hon.
Alember for Coventry, by going largely into matters unconnected
with the• practical details. He should content himself with re-
minding the House what situation the country was in with respect
to the practical authorities on the subject before ft. The Honour.
able Member for London ( Mr. Wilson) had asked a question of
his Right lion. Friend (the Chancellor of the Exchequer), and in
asking that question had given his own opinion. The question
was, whether it was the intention of Government to issue exchequer
bills for the relief of those affected by the present distress ? And
the Honourable Gentleman at the some time said that he thought
an issue of exchequer bills would afford relief. The Honourable
Member for Callittgton (Mr. Attwood) was of opinion that instead
of issuing some millions of exchequer bills, the Bank of England
should come forward and sell off all the securities of different de. •
scriptio a which were lodged in its toilets. Such a proceeding he
(Mr. liuskisson) would assure the Honourable Gentleman would
produce a Tenth exactly the opposite to that which he anticipated.
The Honourable Gentleman's proposal would tend to straiten
the circulation in such proportion as the Bank of England hap_
pened to hold securities. If Ministers were blamed, it was clear
' that those who blamed them were not quite agreed in opinion
upon the measures proposed. It was clear that they did not
agree in their theories, and that in their conclusions they were
i distinctly opposed. lie knew that the state of the commercial
community was very bad, and that their distresses were likely
to be greatly aggravated by the occurrences which he understood
had taken place that day. The entharranments of the c miner-
cial community resulted from the difficulty of procuring bills
of exchange, which was the necessary consequence or the want of
public confidence. The Bank was peace ly ready to facilitate
transactions even beyond its ordinary rules ; but the difficulty was,
that bills could not be created—the instruments which it was neces.
vary to produce at the Bank in order to obtain money were not to be
had ; therefore there was no possibility of procuring front the Bank
the money which was wanted. In the present state of commercial de.
preesion it was obvious that there was a much greater circulation ne-
cessary than in a moment of credit. The question was, how to supply
a remedy for that deficiency of circulation ? The Hon. ,Member tor
Callington thought, that though Government could not advance
money upon the goods which choked up the warehouses. the Bank
might; but such a principle would be contrary to the principles of
political economy. He could inform the Hon. Gentleman that
such a proceeding on the part of the Bank would be contrary to
something still more binding than the principles of political econo.
my—it would be contrary to their charter, and to the law as it at
present existed. The Bank was not at liberty to lend money upon
goods. But to return to the question, which wan how to supply
the deficiency in the circulation—if the Bank Committee, in
the year IMO, had agreed upon any principle, it was, that
when the circulation was sufficient, whether that security was
supplied upon one kind of security or another watt altogether
immaterial. Whether the larger proportion was upon Govern.
ment security, or upon the security ot merchants bills, as con.
cerned the currency and circulation, was a matter of the utmost
indifference. Co other political considerations it might be very
improper that there should be too great a proportion of Govan-
ment securities, and it was now wholly immaterial whether the
Bank supplied the deficiency of circulation by bills of exchange
or by any other security, But we cou'd not have balls of exchange,
from the want of conhuence ; and if the Bank, which vas tot
choked up as some Hon. Members believe, instead of sellir g, was
to purchase the securities now in the market, it would necessarily
throw a greater amount into circulation, and add to the currency.
His Hon. Friend ('(jr. Smith) thought there was no danger in
setting a precedent when distresses occurred from overtrading to de-
vise Wails of relief. Such a precedent certainly would not induce
any man to enter upon a sp:cula'ion, when there was a morel s r-
tainty of its turning out unfortunate; but it would produce a
greater readiness to enter into those wild speculations, if the
speculators were sure of relief should the hazard end badly.
Leery man would feel his own difficulty as the greatest
which had ever occurred, anti none of the peculiar features of the
present emergency would be considered sufficiently striking to
warrant a different line of conduct. The effect ot the measure
proposed would be to teach sanguine speculators that if they could,
not get out in time, for to this they looked, and not to the final
success of the projects, they had an asylum in Government. This
was an encouragement to speculator', as much as the relief afforded
by the poor laws was an encouragement to those who by such means
were placed in a state of dependerce, whilst they might have sub-
sisted' by their own exertions. If the Wink was at liberty, he was
sure it had the means of issuing, to whatever extent was necessary,
the additional quantity of paper, and he was convinced it may be
done with safety. The securities which should be taken out ot the
market by the Bank may in due and proper time be taken up by his
Al ajeety'e Government. taking care to make provision fur repayment.
There was great difficulty, no doubt, in affording any adequate re-
lief, such was the total stoppage of commercial emifidence. But
the measure which he now suggested for the Bank to act upon
may begin to-morrow morning, whilst any measure originating
with the Government must pass in its several stages through that
House, where it would be subject to discussion, and could not ope.
rate to any extent on the currency until a considerable ti me had
elapsed. In conclusion, he was convicted that his Right Hon.
Friend (the Chancellor of the Exchequer), acting in perfect concert
with the Bank, had not only taken the best course which the cir-
cumstance' allowed; but that course, compared with the ethers
recommended, was free front danger and inconvenience.
Mr. E. ELLICE apologized to the House in again rising, but
he was anxious to express his feeling that it would be derogatory to
the 110u5..•, when distress was extending itself, if it slid not afford
relief. In reference to an observation that had fallen front hit
Honourable Friend the Member for Cellington (Mr. Atwood), he
would point out that there was a very greet difference between the
Bank advancing money on exchequer bills for Government, and
their advancing it on account of the merchant, as in the latter case
there would be a second security. There was no doubt that the
issue of exchequer bills would give relief, but not if they were to
go into the market; they would then only go to affect the priceof the
I funds. It was impossible now for a matt, however respectable,
to obtain an advance on goods, for persons who had the
; ability to. do so were as jealous of their credit as their capital,
I and they would not accept bills on such security, and therefore it
was that it was impossible that relief to merchants could be given
on grinds alone. it' an issue of exchequer bills should take place,
he (Mr. Ellice) was convinced that properly applied they would not
find their way into the market ; and he would put a case to the
House. Suppose a country banker to have advanced a sum of mo-
ney on mortgage, on a good estate, he is in want of morey imme-
diately, anti applies to the London bankers, bitt they wilt net ad-
vance, and that it would take six or twelve months to get h.:
amount in, suppose that person was enabled to obtain exchequer
bills for his mortgage, why then the exchequer bills would go to Lis
London banker, and money would beobtained. The exchequer bills
and mortgage deeds would be lodged as security, and the exchequer
bills, the medium ofassistance. would never come tolight. Fitly other
cases might be put where the events would he of a similar nature.
He (Mr. E.) had a recollection of a mensal:Lica in which he was

concerned in the year 1793. A person reptiring an silvans,
considerable amount, deposited with his banker exchequer lid
the amount of 50100 f., and gave personal security; the bills Us't
locked up under the seals of the three partners of the bankiret
house, and Government were never called upon for the *nu.% a•-•
He (31r. Ellice) apologized for troubling the House at such let.L.t-h.'
but these were circumstances which he wished most strongly to Cin."
under the consideration of Government. He could not but call',"
1 the Right Hon. Gentleman to look at the state ofthemanufac ens; •
districts. In the north of Yorkshire it was not a question.
t;
who would pay their bills, Per they were all alike unable top,
and the labourers were discharged, the manufacturers
not ~ money wherewith to pay their wages. lie (Mr. Ellice) ennwa, agreed with the observations that had heca made, that it would eel
be politic Mr an issue to be made by the Bank of England, bateau.;
that would only be putting off the evil for a period, lie ti;
Ellice) was assured that if an issue Of exchequer hills to the
amount of five millions should rake place, two millions ammo would not be demanded. He had &me all in his power to pun
necessity,of Such relief being afforded to his .Majesty's 3fira„ta_
at the game time he was willing to adn:it That the Ito, H 4:
Gentleman the Chancellor of the Exchequer, and it was due
to
him to say so, had sacrificed Ws feelings in the canister hetaanit,
Mr. PEA RSE said a few words in explanation, but which err;
inaudible in the gallery.
Mr. T. WILSON said that he hail hoped in asking the questiee of his Majesty's Ministers as to all issue of Exchequer huh tau
their answer would have been favourable, for he felt that Willey had so consented to alleviate the present difficulLies, the intirnstaia of the public press to-morrow mornleg to that effect would boa
been most cheering to the feelings of the public.
Mr. ATTWOOD made an observation or two, but which gig
not reach the gallery.
Mr. HUSKISSI iN said across the table that the Bank woe
precluded from advancing money on goods.
On the quesron that the report on the resolution be brought up.
Mr. H. GURNEY said that he should move an amendiseat w similar nature to that tie had the honour of submittng last night,
which was, that the words ""Batik of England" should beemitu.d,
He cont.4ded that in many parts of England there was s total
want of a circulating medium ; and he did not see how that could
be supplied so well ea by notes of the Bank or England. The
difference be. wren the country hanker and the Bank of England
was, that to the Bank of Eaglard they had the security of :he
country, while in that of the country banker they only had thus(
the individual, or individuals, cotnpnsing the firm ,• and he (31r.
Gurney), could not but concur in opinion wiat an Hos.Directut
(Mr. Pearse), that much undeserved oLloquy had been thrown
tin
the Bank of Et gland—and, if it was not too harsh an exerts.
sion, that they had been cruelly belied. The Bank of Englsed
had done all in their power to alleviate the late stagnation, and
wha'ever might be the consequence arising nut of the question as to
the exchequer bills, the Bank could not be accused of not basic.,
dune every thing in their power to stay the lore calamity.
Mr. E. WODEHOUSE rose to express his sans action that the
Hon. Illettiber (Mr. Gurney) had proposed Iris amendment that
amendment was a measure of safety, and safety was a leninve
blessing. The object of Parlhilrlent was not u, lose time ni idle
cavilling, but to act for the best. The House and the couttry •
were march indebted to his Hon. Friend (Mr. Gurney) for the din
of conduct he had pursued ; no man could regard political
sistencf more than he (Mr. Witelttliouse) did, and he trusted fa
should not be accused of departing from it if lie said that o
thought his Majesty's Ministers had taken a narrow and coot:Acted
view of the question betore the House. lie hoped not to be coml.
tiered in hostility to them, and he must any that, as regarded Ile .
question of the repeal of the assessed taxes, or any suer servep:ng
'nelsons, he should feel himself called upon to support them : 14.1.
on this question be must repeat that, in his view of the cast. r
Majesty a Minist:ra had taker, a very narrow and contracted vas
of the question, and therefore he felt bound to support the Aimed.
me it tit his lion. Friend.
The House sas then cleared for a division, but none took place.
The Report was brought up and agreed to; and the Blouse
juurned at Half-past Ten.

LIST OP THE MINORITY
Of thirty-nine, who (on the I:Sth Feb.) voted against the pater?
any Itmlution, at the present time, fur withdrawing Bank nom
under N.

Attwond. Matthew Crossett, L. R. Palmer, C. Fysshe
Bright, Henry Gs Coyne, General Plummer, J.
Benett, John Hume, Joseph Rotuma, A. %V.
Ilritlges, Nlr. Aid. Heygate. Mr. Ald. Roberts, Col.
Blair, James Heathcote, L. G. Robertson, A!ex.
Baring. Sir Thomas Honywood, W. P. Robinson, Sir George
I 'alcraft, Joho Inner, John Smith, Samuel
Calvert, Nich. Ingilby, Sir ll'. A. Smith, Abel
Farquhar, Sir Robert Irwin, John Thompson, Mr..V.d.
Gurney, Hudson Kempt, T. R. IVilson, Thomas
Gordon, Robert Martin. John Whitbread, W. 11.
Griffith, L. W. Moberly, John Wood, Mr. Ald.
Graham, Sir SandfordMaberly, Major Walker, J.
Tellers—Baring, Alexander ; Wit ttesley, Sir J.

After the division on Mr. Bering's motion on Monday night
when the House went Into a Committee on the Chancellorm tr.
Exchequer's resolution, Mr. Hudson Gurney moved to on.,t
words •• of the Bank of England" in the resolution for dinoc.
tinuing the circulation of one-pound notes.

LIST OF THE MINORITY.
Attwood, Matthew Martin, John Thompson. Aid.
Buxton, F, Palmer, F. Wodehuuae, Ectrr.d
Gordon, Boa. W. _

Teller—Hudson (Jamey.

CATHOLIC MEETING.

There was yesterday a very numerous and respectable adjourned
meeting of the Catholic Gentlemen, to take into consideration the
resolutione which are to be submitted to the Aggregate Mtetingoa
Tuesday. -

MICHAEL DILLON BELLEw, Esq. in the Chair.

• •
Mr. O'Gorman acted as Secretary.
Mr. O'CoNstEit. moved the first resolution. that the General
Petition be consigned for presentation to the Marquis of Linsdown
in the House of Lords, and to Sir Francis Burdett in the House of
Commons.

31r. CorrwAr seconded the resolution. It was put from the
chair and carried.

Dlr. O'CoxxELI. moved the next resolution, namely—That the
be
Noble Lord and the Honourable Gentleman should requested
to present the pttitiol as early as convenient.
Mr. O'Butex suggested whether they should not be left a dies
er tion as to time?

. .
Mr. LAWLESS insisted that it should be imperative.
Mr. CONWAY—lmperative! no:.sense
Mr. O'Cowwwm. said that the word convenient answere.d
the purposes of Mr. O'Brien besides, they should a: letit be
civil in their language to their advocates.
Mr. LAWLESS would be civil to no one but ladies. He insktel
that the word " possible" should be supplied in place of "ca•
venient."

Mr. W. MArrow did not see any thing disrespectful inch:
word " possible."
Mr. CONWAY said that a discussion of this kind was really chi 1.
ish. Did any snan conceive that, after all, Lord Lansdown and r:t
1.
.Burdett would not use their diserrion ?

Mr. O'Costrrect. begged gentlemen to remember that "
stbly" might mean the very day on which the petition should Trull
the doors of Parliament. Now twelve or fourteen days must elapse
before that period ; and it should be recollected that the Assizes
were at hand--that the Irish Members would be coming over to
assist their electioneering friends in putting the presentments—a
duty which they owed set all times, and patttcular.y at the eve ofs
general election. (Hear.)
Mr. O'GORMAN MAHON thought the Catholics should areas
their gratitude to the people of New York at the next Aggrega s
Meeting. However, it was not his wish to divide the Cathohr
body on any question It wax his opinion that, in expressing then
gratitude to the people of New York they would not adopt thereby
the sentiments contained in the address from that people. It was
said that that address recommended to the Catholics dangerous
things, and that they should therefore be extremely cautious is
adopting its sentiments by any proceeding on their parts in referents
to it. Allowing this to be the case were they not to be thanked,
at all events, for the good intentions which actuated them ? li 3
man, with the wish to serve another, should unintentionally ic2,tra
him, he was not the less entitled to gratitude and thanks on :hr
account. Mr. Mahon concluded by reading a resolution for a re:e.
of thanks to the American people, for the generous expression of
their sympathy in favour of the Irish Catholics.
/11r. Lawless thought it impossible, if the question were
brought forward before any Irish assembly, that they would rot
warmly express their gratitude to their friends in America. The.
only question was, 20 to bring it forward as to meet the wishcate
all parties, and to obviate the designs of those who would bssely
misconstrue all their actions. No o e could prevent Mr. Mahon, of
any other gentleman from bringing his propotition be or the Ag'
gregate Meeting if he should so wish to do. If negatived at that
Meeting, he (Mr. Lawless) thought that Mr. Mahon should Piton':
to she will of the people. Ile also felt convinctd that it well
duty of every Irish Catholic to seize the earliest opt on may which
would present itself of expressing his thanks to any pereola °t.
people who deserved (Hear.) The object which he had to
view was not to return banks in any indirect. or, it he might so
call it, wit. way. (A laugh.) He alluded to the amendment pre-
posed by his eloquent friend, 31r. Wyse, at the fourt:ten d A—
sociation, on the subject now under consideration, which amend-
ment he (31r. Lawless), without the slightest intention of burg
any way personal to the mover of it, characterised as a cowardly
evasion. He entirely concurred with Mr. Mahon that they should
thank the Americans ; but who weretliey that deserved their thanks
—surely not the whole of the American people, not the inhabitolas
of Boston or Washington, or North or South Carolina. No, it rat
to their generous mends in New York that the thanks were di"
and it was to them and them alone they should be given. Pair.
Lawless concluded by reading* resolution which he should movers
an amendment. It was to the eflixt, that they had read with gratitude
the aentiments of the people of New York. containing the exttreg:
sion of their generous sympathy in favour of the Irish Catbollea-,
but that in expressing this gratitudethey took the opportentlY
declaring their inflexible attachment to the 115ritish Cons itutioi,
blessings of which they had so long sought to obtain.
Mr. A. linowx e seconded Mr. Lawless's amendment.
31r. (Yrostx;.:t.t. would oppose any vcie of thanks on. that <0!"
ject. lie had read the adtlresa with deep and mature considers '.'t"
and had deliberately weighed the sentiments which it corded" - •
anal he would now only say, that altheagh he had served the tat

th lies in his humble capacity for 25 years, he would, he was con.
deserve to lose every respect for his service., if any they
wee-, during that period, did he support any resolution of thanks
is die Americans for the address which had been trained in New
yetis. One more replete with tithes which might be used against
them in Parliament he had never heard. If they wished to give
their siteruies real arguments against them, instead of pretence.,
which alone were now used by them as foundations of their oppoxi-
ten, let them adopt this Resolution. But if their intention was to
low the British people thin .their only wish was to seek the bles.
s no and privileges of the British Constitution through the Consti-
s national and Parliamentary sources, they would unanimously
end at once reject the resolution recommended for adoption. In
the tint place, he would ask, had the majority of the 1 irctine de-
pherately weighed the bearing of the address, upon which they
were called on at the present moment to decide by their vote ? .Mr.
O'Connell then proceeded to read passages of the address, the
adoption of which, by their vote to the framers of in would Im-
plicate the Catholics of Ireland. Hauperticularly adverted to the
Freese which said, that ~the desirewd separation rises unbidden
in every Irish breast ;" and that which said, speaking of
the Church Establishment of Ireland, " it is, surely, time
t undo that Establidnnent." He was not the advocate of
t c Established Church t on the contrary, he considered the
tenets it professed erroneous ; and it was his conviction that they
were en, which made him adhere to his own religion. He also
thought that too much riches would undo any religious establish-
ment. lithey adopted that sentiment of the address, they ought
to go further. and tr.alte pikes In an hour after. (Cries of "Nn,
no 1"1 Mr. O'Connell proceeded to read other parts of the Ad-
dress of a sirolar witur., the adoption of which, he said, would be
most fatal to the ('leholie cause. It was an argument used by Mr.
Plunkett in favour of t'atholic Emancipation, that the conceding of
that great measure would tend. in the strongest degree, to the oecurit y
of the Church Eluablish went ofthe country. In the courve ef last Ses-
sion also Mr. Hume had omitted to bring forward his usual motion
with respect to the Church Establishment, lest his doing en would
injure the then pending Catholic Bill. And would they, by adopt-
ing the sentiments of this address, deprive their Parliamentary
yrieruls of such a strong argument in their favour? It was his
opinion that if they adepted such a resolution, and that their ques-
tion was brought on for discussion during the present Parliamentary
Salina, the previous question would be moved and carried. It
would be, in tact, opening a bark door through which the great
object they all should have in view, namely. a discussion on their
claims, would escape. The expresainn of their gratitude on such a
sebjeet, attended as it would be by the disastrous results he had
adverted to, would do very well for a romance t but if they pre-
ferred reality tonomance, they would join him ( Mr. ('Connell) in
seciving the resolution. He would ask this .Meeting were they
desirous of a separation from England ? (Cries of " No, no.") He
(Mr. O'Connell) was as ready ss any man to state his conviction
thin the connexion between the two countries, as it was at present
tdminietered, was a curse. But at the same time. it was his firm
I e'lef that the greatest blessing which could be conferred by
heaven on Ireland. was that connexion as it ought to be. Ile
thought that every thing of value in this life, every thing worth
preserving found its germ and seed in the principles of the British
( 0 stitation, and that there could not be greater impnlicy or crime
on the part of any who wished well to both countries than to desire
their separation. I Hear.) Would they go before Parliament, he
would again ask them, and say that they approved of the part of
the address which said that the " desire of separation rises unhidden
in every Irish breast ?" He would call on all who wished for the
success of EmaneipaCon, not to throw an additional stigma on the
Catholics. Ile had been formerly for the giving of a vote of thanks
to the American people to a certain extent, but he had since
weighed the matter more deliberately, and his opinion now was,
th it he had been wrong in at all entertaining the idea of thanking
them. He would ask, did they imagine the Catholic Aristocracy
would join Cheat in the vote, even If they should determine on
pressing it? No, he was of opinion that they would firmly and
manfully dissent from it. He did nor, when speaking thus of the
Aristocracy, mean to say that they should submit to them. nor on
the other hand should they be shaken off lightly. The best mode
of acting would be to continue the exertions of both. They should
mot, therefore, quarrel with the Aristocracy on a mere matter of
compliment, and one which did not involve any principle. Those
who were desirous of division would vote for the resolution of
thanks; foe such a vote, he felt convinced, would cause diesenition
in the Catholic body; they who wished to go before Parliament and
any, that " the desire of separation rose unbidden in their bosoms"
would vote for the rosolution but those who wished well to the
counter, who sought for emancipation. and who expected the co.
operation of the Aristocracy, would vote against it.
Mr. D. O'llat Lew hopsd the Aristeocracy would set on this
occasion as became men of spirit. He regretted that the sitting
of the fourteen days' Association had not continued till this day,
as they might very consistent move a retraction of the vote of cen-
sure which had been passed on AI?. Anthony 3larmion, after
hearing what had fallen from Mr. O'Connell on the same subject.
which was in his (Mr. 011.'s) opinion couched in much stronger
terms.

Mr. O'Cox X r.t.t. called Mr. O'Reilly to order. He had as.
hewed what could not be borne out or warranted by what had fallen
from hilt (Mr. O'C.) It was one of the most unfounded of all
the adurenies which had been uttered against him, to state that he
had spoken in stronger terms of the connexion between the two
countries than Mr. Marmion had done. But there was a kind of
importance attached to every calumny against him.
Mr. O'REILLY did not Intend. As the remotest decree, to say
anything of Mr. O'Connell which bis recollection of the words he
had aced would not warrant. Hie opinion was, that they ought to
be thankful for kindness. no matter where it was displayed, who.
tharin India, China, or Japan.
Mr. LAWMAN said that Mr. O'Connell had been misrepre-
sented. If be understood that gentleman rightly, he had declared
that no man could wish more a•dently for the connexion of the
two countries than he (Mr. O'Connell), and his belief that the
anion of both would be more strongly cemented by creating mu.
tualgnod.will between the people of all religions. (Hears) lle
was against any vote of thanks. . .

11r7REn1tiirrn approved of the vote as a simple expression of
their thanks for the sympathy evinced in their favour by the
Americana.

Mr. CONWAY—Aye, and that vote arose, he thought, from the
ciretunstance of ao address having been framed by the /interim]
people, and transmitted to the Irish Catholics. The question then
was, whether, in thanking them foe that address, they did not vir-
tually adopt the sentiments (and it wall acknowledged on all hands
that some of them at least were moat obnoxious) it contained ? In
his opinion it was quite manifest they would do so.
Mr. RONAYNE was against the resolution, as he saw no ?food
which could result from it, and it might be productive of touch
mischief to their cause.

Mr. HVOHES thought the resolution a mischievous one. and
that the Catholics had very little to do when they directed their at.
tendon to it at all.

The Secretary (Mr. O'Oon wax ) thorght it would be unmanly
to as that the Catholics should nut thank their friends in America
foe that address, which, in his opinion, did not contain a stronu'r
sentiment, or one couched in stronger terms than 11r. O'Connell
had this day used. He bad taken down the words which Ilr.
O'Connell had made use of as he had wtered them, and they
were •• that he considered the connexion, as it existed at present, a

rune."

31r. O'CownEr.t.—Good God! am I said to have tittered such
an expression ? I said no such thing. He (Mr. O'Connell) had
alertly said that the connexion as at present administered was not a
blessing : but lie qualified his expre-...i0n by stating his opinion,
that it properly administered, it would be the greatest benefit
which could be conferred on this country. (Hear, hear.) It was
tint by taking down and quoting against him isolated phrases in a
sentence that his observations were to be undercood. Indeed be
could see no reason at all why his words should be taken down this
way by Gentlemen, and afterwards made use of against him.
Illr. O'Cloa MAX had taken them down merely in order to reply
to them. He was convinced he had noted them down correctly;
but even allowing them the interpretation now affixed to then) by
Air. O'Connell, what was it but telling the British people, that if
they emancipated not the Catholics, the events of the next year
would be so and so ; and pointing oat the consequences of persist-
ing to refuse their rights to the Catholics. What was it which
made It a curse ?—that very Established Church with which they
found fault in America. He would di recate here and elsewhere
the evils of the Establishment. Why was it considered a public
calamity that the speeches at die great national dinner had not been
reported? It was because the admirable sentiinents of Lord
Purtarlington and other Protestant Noblemen, then delivered
witb respect to the Established Church, had not been laid before
the public. He would give his support to the motion for the ap.
potritment of a Committee.

Mr. Smut. thought that Mr. O'Connell might eav to his
Learned Friend, (Mr. O'Cloeman,) in the language of Cassius to
Brutus,

" Why are all my words observed,
Set In a note-book, conn'd and leam'd by rote,
To dash into my teeth ?"
Ile would advise gentlemen to have better memories, and not to
retain single fragniests of s speech without bearing in recollection
the paws es which form the context. After some further observa.
tions on this head, Mr. Shell concluded by proposing as an amend-
ment, " that the ardent and honourable anxiety for the success of
our cause evinced by the Americans, afforded an additional proof of
the solicitude felt by all the friends of liberty in the success of the
Catholic cause." This amendment,•iih hie opinion, would obviate
all objections. It did not at all dihnk the Americans; it merely
put on record a most important fact—namely, that the sympathy of
all pans of the world was evinced for their success. In using the
words "ardent and honourable," they sulkies dy expressed their
opinion of the conduct of the Americans.
Mr. COPPINGICA and Alr. LAWLESS MSC to tieeond the resolu-
tion, upon which

Mr.O'Coxx ELL moved that the meeting adjourn to Monday,
which wu secuntitl by Mr. Conway, and carried.
Mr. O'CoNNELt., ot. Kilgory. county Clare, was called to the
Chair, thanks were voted to 3lr. BELLEW, and the meeting, which
was vary numerous, adjourned.—Dublin E. Post of Thursday.

--- - - -
Ilia Majeety's frigate Tartar arrived on Thursday at
Gravesend. having a min on board in irons who, it iv said, has
confessed himself to be the murderer of filr:Bird, of Greenwich,
f !which Hussey wu hanged, and who upon his trial confessed
i'mt he was an accomplice, but that the real murderer was gone to
lea—Ciagae Porte Herald.
At Bow-street yesterday two of the boys, Sullivan and
Wilson, who committed the robly ry in Mr. 31oore's ('he special
;hider's; chambers, were admitted as evidence for the Crown. and
the third, Chaihnead, was committed to Newgste for trial .
Torkiogtrin and his son were also committed to the mile prison,
as receivers of the stolen property.

;TOLES VESTE V
New 4 per Cent. 92 91 90i
Long Ann.
India Stock
lAtto Acct. 215 216
Ex. Dills 1 „MM. 14 22 16 dia
Ditto, 5110 t. 12 21 13 dia
Ditto Small 12 8 die
Lottery Tickets IW. 11A.

STOCKS YESTERDA V.
Mexican Bonds
Ditto Bolide (1825) 384 Li 6
1 594 49 51 2 494 63 24
2
Ditto Acct. 374 4 3 3 2 G 3
Peruvian Bonds 31
Russian Bonds 73:4 3
Ditto Acct. 744 4 4 3
Sprmiph Bonds 84 9
tto Acct.
Ditto MO, 'J

YESTERDAV.
Leghorn
Demos
Venice........
Malta
Naples "toli
Palermo.... .... ...per os. 119
Lisbon 50/
Oporto 51
Rio Janeiro 45i
Bahia 4$
Buenos Ayres 43
Dublin
Cork 1
atm Liori,rea
Z. a. d.
Portugal Goldin coin° 0 0
Foreign Gold in bare 3 17 3
New Doubloons.— 0 0 0
New Dollars 0 4 IL
Silver in hart, stand 0 I 1

43i
26

PRICES OF SHARES YF.STERIYAV.
MIMES.
lihnre. Patti. Primness per
tun 10 3dl.