The British Press; or, Morning Literary Advertiser.
London, England, 1824-03-09 00:00:00

DUTIES ON Vl'ool..

Mr. S. AVORTI.iii presented apetition from the inhabitant%
if Curie, praying for a gradual repeal of the duties on wool.—Laid
xi: tilt table, and ordered to be printed.
igisli UNION DITTIES.
Mr. S. WORTLEY presented s petition from the inhabitants
a Huddersfield against the union duties with Ireland.
Mr. PEEL gave notice, on die part of his Hon. Friend the Secre-
.tary fur Foreign Afrairs, that he should move that the motion eels-
.tire to the %Vest Indies should be postponed from Friday next to
the ensuing Tuesday ; and he observed, that if' a Noble Lord (J.
Russell) had been in his place, be should bare requested him to
differ his motion, which stood for Tuesday, to a future day.
SCOTCH SALMON FISHERIES.

Zr.A LYNDSAY presented a petition front the inhabitants of I
Aberdeen, praying to be heard by Counsel relative to the salmon
Mammies of Scotland.
Mr.MUME trusted that this subject would be brought before
ag;urntaittee of the Douse, if not during the present, in the course
.of the next Session.
Mr. LYNDS-11' thought it desirable that it should be done.
observed, that it involved public rights as well as private ad-
vantages.
The petition was laid on the table.
'Ordered to lie an the table and tab* printed.
SMALL DEBTS RECOVERY BILL.

Colonel illiißalpresenteti;peu'tior;fro;;-itre traders of
Wisbeach, in Cambridgeshire, in favour of the Bill for the reco-
very Of small debts.
Ordered to lie on the table. I

'Sir 31. N. RIDLEY presented a petition from an individual
named Robert Foster, complaining of the injury done to public
budding, by smoke, and stating that he had invented some method,
to which he humbly entreated the attention of the House, for the
prevention of such injuries.

COMBINATION LAWS.
Mr. 111/31E presentedtpetition frown the hat manta
La 'ndon and Southwark, against the Combination Laws.
Ordered to le on the table.

RIBBON LODGES IN IRELAND.

LortIALTHORP postponed from to-morrow, tbr which night
a notice had been giveu by the Noble Lord, to Thursday next, Ms
motion fur the correspondence between Richard Newton Bennett,
..Esq., and Mr. Gregory, in the year 1823, respecting the auppres-
Mon of an Amnesty to the Ribbon Lodges in Ireland,. also, a 31e-
s:wad from Messrs. Leslie and Gore to the Lord Lieutenant of
Ireland, on the ease of Thomas Hughes; also, any correspondence
beer/ado the Irish Government and the Magistrates of the counties
N' Mayo and Galway, respecting an Amnesty to the Ribbonmen
in
Mr. BUXTON presented to the House a petitkon, signed by
23.000 of the silk weavers of London and Middlesex. As it was
wished on the other side of the House to postpone the discussion
on this subject, until a later hour, he should only take that oppor-
• tunity 'of saying that there was something in this petition, dis-
nnguishing a from all others that had hitherto been presented to
the House ou this must interesting question. All the other
;tendons pruereded from the masters or those capitalists who had
sunbaked large fortunes in the silk trade, soil to whose petition
there was, according to the policy of the Chancellor of the Es-
• chequer this simple answer—•• True it* you now complain of the
imuntaliate consequences of a liberal policy; you say that it will
produr,e immediate inconvenience; I admit that argument; I can-
not resist the fact, but it is the business of legislative enactment to
provide for future, as well as temporary advantage, and therefore,
• though you are likely to sustain some protein inconvenience, that
incaovemence will be more than compensated by your subsequent
advantage." Now that answer, which might apply well to those
caoitalista, was not soiled to the individuals whose names appeared
• tethat petition. It came from those whose daily bread depended
eta their daily labour ; who might be said to live from hand to
mouth, and whose wants were so immediate as to make any appeal
to their distant advantage as idle mockery. With this observation
he should move that the petition be brought up.
Mr. 1;1,1.18 observed, that this was not the first petition from
the operative SellVerA. He hail himself presented one from the
same body * few evenings since, and at this moment there were in
his possession from 15 to 20 petitions from the same class of silk
manufacturers. There were also at that moment as many pea-
-tip:A in preparation as would well nigh cover the floor of the House,
limn the same clad of individuals. _

The petition VMS r:ad, and ordered to he on the table, and to be
printed.

TOBACCO DUTIES.

Mr. ESTCOURT presented a petition from the inhabitants of
Devises, praying for a reduction of the ditty on tobacco.
• Me. BENNET concurred moot fully in the wishes of the peti-
tioners. Indeee, no one could view the immense extent to which
suatuggling was carried,. as it regarded the article of tobacco, with-
out feeling that the enormous duty to which it was subjected was
we sale cause of such smuggling. How, indeed, could it be other-
wise, when the smuggler cod kl afford to sell tobacco at one-tenth
the *ice of the regular trader? With such temptation, it was not
to be wondered that desperate risks were undertaken, seeing that I
igne successful achievement would compensate the speculating
smuggler for mane losses.
ein• JOHN NEWPORT said, that the smuggling to such an
Satan of tobacto was manifestly the result of the heavy duties im-;
pared so unwisely upon that article.
Mr. BRIGHT observed, that the revenue had not only de. I
messed since the increase of duty oil tobacco, but that diminution
hid tyam in the ratio of the increase of population. It was quite
certain that excessive smuggling was attributable in this article
solely to the excessive duty. In a recent instance a vessel was.
anti though there were on board the vessel only 75 cases of
&al there were 1,000 bags of tobacco. lie could mention many
tar hvoznces, all proving the utter impolicy of keeping up such
estrratragant duties.

REPEAL OF THE RESTRICTION ON SILK IM-
PORTED.

r. EST GOIY RT prese:teca pe- titi;in from the n3nnufacturers of
a silk sstabiishmect recently formed at Derires, against any altera-
tion In the existing restrictions on silk goods imported.

ViCTUALLERS' LICENCES.

. .
Mr. I,VNDSAY presented a petitionfrorn the inhabitants of a
town in Lancashire against the duty on victuallers• licences.

AAIERICA.
lir J. MACKINTOSH 1;1144,1 am desirous, Sir, of fixing a day
Inc the discussion of a question of which I gave a general notice, on
the diplomatic, or rather the want of diplomatic relations between
state and South America. I would willingly bring forward
; very impnritint question, on Thursday sennight, it my lion.
iend the Member for Aberdeen would postpone a motion, most,
;portant too, but not so pressing as mine, until some future day.
Mr. HUItIE had no objection to meet the wishes of the (louse,
' he could not acromphsh that object better than by yielding to
vest of his lion. and Learned Friend. It was truly said by
ion. and Learned Friend that the motion fixed for that evens
fa.; most important—it was for returns relating to the impress.
of seamen, but he should bring it forward on a future day.
WAYS AND MEANS.
the motion of Mr. lIUSCISSON, the House then went in:4

a Committee of Wat's aril Means , the Order of the Day to that by any apprehensions of trouble end techniesl diecoltv. Put to
'effect having vreviously been read. Intent to the questke regarding dee sugoz; the Right Min. Geode-
SUGAR DCTIES. man (31r. Husk's:u im) had attributed the ncrotie cniteuniption to
Mr. HITSKISSON said, although he untlerstcod it to be the to- ithe increasing wealth and increased comforts of the people, and
tention of the Moo. Member fur Aberdeen to move for some rednes; added, that in process of time the demand would entirely absorb
lion of the duty on sager, yet as he was utterly ignorant of the • the whole produce. If the premises in which the Right lion. Gent.
grounds upon which such a motion was to be reconimcnded, the had proceeded were correct, it was impossible to deny his conclusion.
Committee would excuse hint from anticipating the statement of the! He (Mr. E.) thought it would be inexpedient to press this question,
Hon. Member for Aberdeen. Ile should content himself at present; if it would have the effect of doging the financial accounts.
with moving the resolution in the towel way—" That it is the opi- I He was of opinion that the increased consumption of sugar might
Men of this COMmittee :hat the duty continued by the Aet of the : fairly be attributed to other causes than those stated by the !tight
last Parliament to his Majesty on sugar, should be further eon-' Hon. Gentleman. Ile was apprehensive that it was partly owing
tioued." to less permanent and more accidental causes. He considered that
The question having been put from the ('hair— amongst these the remission of taxation had produced its share of
Mr. HUME said he felt very great reluctarce in pressing upon general benefit, and that was a cause which conic not be looked
his Majesty's Ministers any measure of unauthorised or irexre- , forward to operate again for a long p&od he was afraid. lie was,
dient economy, after the liberal policy they had displayed, and I however, disposed to believe that the increased consumption had
the considerable reductions, which. of their own free grace, they bad I arisen in a fresh measure from the causes stated by the Right lion.
vouchsafed to a gleeful people. Ile was convinced, however, that Gentleman. At least he thought it was clear that the V. India
the measure which lie was about to propose. while, on the one hand, proprietors had made out a prima [uric case, that would entitle
it tended to the relief of the subject, could not, in the slightest them to claim some plan of general and comprehensive relief. If
degree, cripple the finances of, the country; he thought the state- i H
the consumption increased according to the ratio stated by the
ment they had just heard, as to the effect of excessive duty on Right on. Gentleman, or indeed any other, it was reasonable to
tobacco, should convince the Committee that the reduction, which expect that the surplus produee would be reduced within a mode-
it was his intention to propose, could have no injurious effect upon irate and manageable amount; but on that presumption he did not
the revenue arising from sugar. Ile had an account of the ditties think the Right lion. Gentleman warranted to call on the %Vest
upon sugar, and the increase of duties on that article had, as in India Proprietors toawait patiently the operation ofnatural causes in
the ease of tobacco, diminished its consumption ; not that he their favour. On the contrary, he conceived they had a tomng claim I
thought the smuggling of sugar was carried on to any great extent ; on his Melody's Government for some measure of financial relief.
indeed he rather thought it was of all articles of consumption that and in the expectation that that just claim would be satisfied, he I
in which smuggling was least employed. He wished, however, at Ist 1,1 prefer that the duties on rum were suffered to remain in i
the present moment, when great changes were effecting, to ewer- their present state.
tain whether we ought not to look to the interest of the consumer, Mr. E. ELLICE said, that the proposed remission of the ditty
as well as that of the manufacturer. How, for instance, was the on runt was too email ever to introduce that spirit into general con-
great portion of the public interested in a reduction of the duty on eumption, and ass he had not the same feeling as his Honourable
silk ? With the bulk of ;he people this was really an uninteresting Friend (Mr. haring) with respect to the actual Sinking Fund,
and useless reduction % Ile did not mean to say upon principles of though he certainly wits a decided friend to an efficient Sinking
political economy, that the reduction was not politic, since it let in Fund, he should prefer the adoption °lsome more extensive plan of
that other, and more important question, the removal of those per. relief. He had also some fears as to the permanency of the in-
, nicions prohibitor duties. It sae right to remove them- and he creased consumption of sugar. In the present distressed state of
hoped his Majesty s Ministers would carry into complete effect their the \Vest India proprietors, he considered the! were entitled to
liberal policy. The Connnittee would recollect that at the present such relief as the present surplus of the revenue would enable the
I moment the West India proprietors were sunk in the tieepe,t die- country to afford them. He wished the Right Honourable Gentle-
! tress; and he thought therefore that his Majesty's Ministtrs ought man to give a pledge, not for the proposal of any particular rues-
to consider, wether a portion of the duty could t of be reduced sure, but merely that the state of the West India interests would be
without injury to the fi•itinees of the country, and certainly with taken into consideration. They sought not temporary relief, but
!great advantage to the West India proprietors. Such a reduction, some general measure of policy that would remedy their present
i lifIif effected, would serve to increase the consumption, and of course distresses and prevent similar evils in future. The substitution of
to add to the revenue. He had several instances to shew that the sugar in the distilleries in preference to foreign barley imported
duty on sugar was much beyond what that article could bear: a when by law the ports were opeoed;•'would tend materially to bent_
Committee of the House of Lords, to shew the increase of revenue, fit the planters without hurting oar agriculturists at home. He
leant which they inferred the prosperous condition of the country , advise his Honourable Friend (Mr. Hume) to withdraw his mu-
had not rotted it convenient to take sugar into the account. In ! titan, as he was coneinced that it was the sincere wish of Govern-
• England it had greatly tliniinishe.d; in Ireland still more so ; and I meat to promote the interests of the West India body in every re-
, he knew not how, with such facts before them, they could hesitate Poeta, anst particularly to relieve them front the pressure under
to do at once an act of grace and of pont-cal advantage. It was I which they now laboured. (lieu, hear.) He could not perfectly
with that view that he should propose to reduce the duty on sugar • understand the statistical accounts of the Right Honourable Gentle-
from 275. to 20s. per hundred. Ile was aware that he might be man. They ought to be laid on the table without a motion, in or-
that relief had already been affinoled to the West India proprietors der that the whole subject might be brotight fully under
in the reduction of the duty on ruin ; but what was that relief ?—A the view of the Committee. With respect to the comparative
paltry reduction of 1:10. per gallon on rum ; and this granted too, consumption of sugar in 1791 and now, the Right Honour.
• when by the Act of the last session, they had: is rael, excluded rum able Gentleman should not forget the large uddO ion to our
from Ireland and Scotland. (Hear.) Therefore this reduction was population during that period, and the large addition also to the
not in fact equivalent to the loss sustained by the West India pro. wealth of the country. 'lke increased consumption might be ace
'oleo" in the previous exclusion that shut tut the consumption of counted for by other reasons than that immense prosperity into
rum from Irelard and Scotland. The lion. Member concluded by which the Right lion. Gentleman resolved the cause of every int_
! proposing as an amendment that the proposed duty of 275. per bun- I prevenient iii the country. As to last year, the prices of provisions
I duo( should be reduced to :'Us. I were so low that the poor man was able to indulge in many lux-
. .. .

uries of which he feared the advance to be expected neat year
would again deprive hon. It therefore appeared fair that the appre-
hended decrease of consumption from that cause should be met by
a proportionate decrease of the duty on sugar. Ile felt that the
11 est Indians required all Ow assistance that could be given to
them. The mere fact, that in 1791, when the price of sugar was the
same as at present, the duty was only twelve orthirteen shillings
per cwt., while now it was twenty-seven shillings, was sufficient
to show how much they were entitled to a relief from taxation.
Mr. CAM:RAFT confessed that this was a subject with which
he was not conversant. With respect. to the proposal to admit
Nagar into the distilleries in common with foreign barley, when the
latter might be imported, he should not be suspected of giving
any but a disinterested opinion in saying that it had his entire ap-
probation. Considering the peculiar pressure on the West India
unwests, he would not object to the immediate admission of sugar.
Hear, heat.) lie had come into the House with an opinion that
'dee supply of sugar far exceeded the demand ; but it appeared from
I dee Right lion. Gentleman's statement that for the last three years
the demand had exceeded the supply. (No, no.) He was sorry to
find he was mistaken, but the Right Hon. Gentleman had been so
understood in the part of the House where he (Mr. Calcraft) was
sitting. He came down to the House to support the motion, but the
reasou assigned by the Right Hon. Gentleman, founded on thegresti
consumption under the existing duties, had led him toa different
conclusion. As a member of Parliament, however, he felt that he
was bound to guard the interests of the consumer as well as the
West India planter (Heal, hear.) But the consumer would, he
bdkwed. not receive sty benefit from so trifling a reduction of the
duty. The increase of consumption proved that the duty did not
preps on the consumer. If the supply of agar exceeded the demsed,
the only way of operating permanently in raeour of the West India
interests was by some mode like that pointed out by his Hon.
Friend (Mr. Baring) to Increase the demand, until thew was an
aid of the redundant supply. He begged his Hon. Friend (Mr.
Hume) to withdraw his motion, and wished the Right Hon. Gent.
to take it into Ins oonsiderfsfue whether sugar might not be !home.
lately introduced into the tßstilleries, on which he conceived the
West India Proprietors should found their best hope of relief.
Mr. H ILTSKISSON rose to explain. Ile had stated that in 11114,
at the period of the peace, there was a very considerable excess of I
supply. Between that period and 11123, the further increase of
supply over and above the excess of supply in 1814, amounted to
628,000 cwt. and during the same period the i..4.7,,5e of conounip.,
tion over and above the consumption of 1814, was 921,000 cwt.
The consequence was, that the 'ncreased supply over and above'
the previous average excess was less by the relative excess of
consumption than in 1814. Suppose the general statement stood
thus Cwt.
In 11114, the total supply might be estimated at
In 1823, at

Mr. BARING perfectly concurred with the lion. Member for
Aberdeen, that it was the duty of a wise Government to assist any
interess in the country suffering under severe and peculiar depres-
don. Whether the agriculturist was the sufferer, the West India
pruprieter, or the East India merchant, it was unquestionably the
duty, and, indeed, generally the interest of Government to grant
all possible relief to the suffering interest ; and if be really thought
that the relief now proposed, namely the reduction of the duty on
sugar, would prove beneficial to the West India proprieter, he
should vote for the amendment. Undoubtedly when such a
anion as this was made, he, who did not view the sinking fund=
the same eyes as his Hon. Friend, the Member for Aberdeen, was
bound to look at the state of the finances of the country, to see'
whether the country could seare from its income the proposed re-
duction of duty. Now, though he was of opinion that the country'
could not spare it, yet if he could persuade himself that subteen-,
tial advantages would arise to the West India proprietor from the :
duetion, he should assist the preprietor. The Ilon. Member seemed
to think that the public were Interested in the reduction of this duty.
Was there a single petition from the public to support that opinion?
What were the public to gain by it ? An abatement of id. or Id.
per pound in the price of sugar. There was, indeed, ere circum-
stance connected with this subject, to which he was most dent-
ous of drawing the attention of country gentlemen—the present
price of barley. In a few weeks, in all probability, the ha:rased
price of barley would have the effect of opening the ports for itsintro-
doction ; and the consequences of such an importation were not to
be calculated. He would, therefore, propose to the feeling, as well
as the policy of country gentlemen, to allow distillation from sugar,
and tints assist on the one hand the West India proprietors, and
exclude the introduction of foreign barley. TI is would be a mea-
sure both gracious and politic, and one which he strenuously re-
commended to their serious consideration. In the course of two
months the chief business of distillation for the year *mild hate
terminated, and the quantity of sugar employed in thismoeess
would prevent the opening of the ports to barley. The H4111011,-
able Member said, in conclusion, that he should oppose the amend-
ment of his Honourable Friend, the Member for Aberdeen.
Mr. HUSK IeSON was exceedingly glad that his Honourable
Friend, the Member for Taunton, had stated his opinion of the
amendment pmpcsed by the Honourable Member for Aberdeen.
The Honourable Member for Aberdeen had grounded his observa-
nces on a reference to the duty on tobacco, to which some allusion
had been made in the early part of the night. Now, if he correctly
comprehended the object and tendency of these observations, they
were intended to chew that the amount of duty on tobacco led to
considerable smuggling. NV hether this was a correct conclusion
or not, he did not then think it necessary to inquire. But the
Honourable Member for Aberdeen had seriously asserted that in
respect to sugar there was no such smuggling, so that his objection
did sot apply. He had been much surprised to hear the Hoer
Membeemsert, that since the year 1814 there had been no increase
in the consumption of sugar. On the contrary, there was no one
article which had so much increased. The average consumption
for the three years ending on the sth January, 1817, was 2,214,000
cut.; from Sib January, 1819, to sth January, 1822, it was
2,762,000 cwt., being an increase on the averages of the latter of
' these two periods of 540,000 cwt., bring at the rate of 20 per cent.
From official documents, which would soon be laid before the
House, it appeared that in the last year the consumption was
3,130,1100 cwt. makingan increase of 40 per cent. This was a
ebodusive proof of the great and rapid progress of consumption.
As to Ireland, to which the Hon. Member had alluded, there were
many circumstances which prevented a similar increase. The Leaving a balance of comparative increase of consump-
people were not in a mate of ease and comfort; they were in want tints of - - - 292,000
of employment and in penury. But could any Gentleman sup. In this manner tl.e increase of consumption had overtaken the in. ,
pose that a diminution of a halfpenny in the pound would crease of supply. If the ratio of increasing consumption was eon.:
give any great increase to the consumption of as article, if tinued for two or three years, there would be no surplus of supply.
nut of the tiro necessity. at lent the first luxury of the poorer As to the production of the accounts on which he had grounded this
classes? lie would now show the state of the supply, as statement, he could assure the Honourable Gentleman (Mr. Ellice)
compared with the consumption since the peace. The Right that them was no single figure in his statement that was not before
Honourable Gentleman entered into a long detail of figures, the House. it had been his duty to calculate the progress which I
to shew that since the year bill there had been an increase of he had stated that evening. If there was any part of the founda.l
' eonsunmeon, growing on the increase of the suppl If this had don of his calculations not before the House. it would be presented
wreason
hitherto been the ca, there was no why it should not coo- in a few days with the annual accounts, when every Honourable
nein. We were nor, pperhaps, far from the period when the aup. Gentleman would be able to satisfy himself as to the correctness of 1
ply would not exceed the consumption, or at least in a very alight the ratio he had stated, viz. 20 per cent. annually on the whole
degree only. It was satisfaetory to know that the consumptionof period, but for the last year, considered by itself, 40 per cent. In I
' lest year, na compared with former years, was the largest ever the present state of the distilleries, at this advanced period of the I
' known. Those persons who were coovteasnt with the state of the 'season, he was afraid that the immediate introduction of sugar I
' West India colonies, were of opinion that there was no likelihood would be attended with no benefit to the West India proprietors. :
of any increase in the annual produce, but, on the contrary, rather As to the question that liberty ought to be given to the distillers to 1
a tendency to a decrease. As to the new colonies, in cons.- use sugar, when the porta were opened for the importation of ,
quence of there being no possibility of importing any more foreign barley, he could nee no objection to the proposition. (Hear, !
slang, there was not a chance of any
.great increase. He trusted hear, hear.) When we admitted the necessity of drawing a supply
that he had now made out a sufficient ease, as far **regarded of barley froth foreign nations, ibex could certainly be no objec-
the
question of consumption and the pressure of taxation _ don to admit another article, the growth of our own dominions, in '
The tax on sugar was by no means the one which eallat roost or. competition with it. (Hear, hear.) The average, however, could
gently for relief. It would not be shown that any other article not be taken till the )sth of May. Could any substantial relief be
called for it so feebly. This proved the great augmentation of then given to the West India Proprietors'' As a proposed pert of i
the case, comfort, and prosperity of the people of England ; a general arrangement for their relief he would promise to bestow
foe, if they were not so, there would not be such an increase his closest attention to it, and ,he had no doubt he could promise'
fo the use of an article which was the link between luxuries and also that his Right lion. Friendrwoirld act in a similar manner.
necessaries. Indeed, since the year I7ed, the quantity of sugar Mr. CAM:HM.7 said, the way to make the statement Intel- I
' consumed in England and Ireland was increased double ; and ligible would be to contrast the supply and consumption for the i
at this moment the quantity consumed in this kingdom was last three !ear*.
equal to that consumed by three times the same population in Mr. J. BEN ETT was favourable to the admission of sugar into !
the rest of the world. With revert to the substitution of sugar the distilleries in competition with foreign barley. He doubted I
fur bark, in the distilleries, he was ready to admit the principle that the country was by any means in that state of prosperity in I
of the Honour:4de Member for Tatman; but he thought which it was represented by the Right Hon. Gentleman. Ile
it ought to be left entirely to the distillers. Perhaps it was less begged to ask the Right Hon. Gentleman a question which had
expedient at the present moment, as there were only sax weeks left been suggested to him, namely, whether, as the House was about to
Wive the distillers would begin to work, and there would scarcely regulate the duty on rum, the British distillers would be at liberty ;
be time enough to provide for necessary changes of sugar for bar. to convert rum into gin ? If they were, distillation front con 'I
ley. lie had sonic experience on this question, and knew that it would be wholly stopped. He put this question because his atten- !
was environed win difficulties. Besides, the measure would be a Linn had been called to the subject by a letter from a very lineal- I
strong one, now that the ports were shut against the importation of gent constituent. I
barley. He thought that heelistel stated enough to convince the Mr. HUSK ISSON supposed the Hon. Gentleman was aware
ftiends of the West India interests that those interests were about that the distiller and rectifier were different persons. (Hear, hear.)
to experience a great amelioration by the mereeee of consumption, He felt that the question propounited to him was attended with great
and the effects of other causes which had relieved other interests difficulties. If the British rectlfiemposseseed the liberty objected
from similar distress. to by the lion. Gentleman. he( Mr. Ilueltimion) felt that it would;
Mr. C. It. ELLIS said, that although the West India interest' be slesirable to reduce the surplus stock of rum now on hand.
Arould receive with gratitude every prnpositior, which went to relieve Mr. BEN ETT observed that it appeared then that the power 1
their distresses, yet be was afraid the proposition of the Hon. Merv- to convert gin into rum did not aim. (A laugh.)
her for Aberdeen, in spite of its plausible appearance, was not Mr. BRIGHT agreed that the proposal to allow theintroluction
I likely to be of any great service. The Chancellor of the Excite- of saga? into distilleries wa. of great importance 0 the West India
quer had already conceded a redaction in the duties on rum, and interests. The situation of those merchants should be fully entered
gad alio altered the mode of collecting that duty, so as to poultice into, for they were deserving the best consideration of the Hoene.
a benefit nearly equal to the teduetion. The question then was., Now with respect to the duties' on beer, he agreed with several of
whether the proposition of the lion. Member was such as wafer,' d the gentlemen who preceded him, that the mode of collecting the
greater advantages than the reduction of the Chancellor of the Es- duties was, if possible, more objectionable than their amount. For
chequer. Ile had studied the question pretty deeply, and was con- himself he did not anticipate any speedy improvement in the situ-'
vincel that the balanceof advantages would not be in favour of the mein of the West India planters, who had, certainly, a right to
Ilon. Gentleman's proposition. It might be asked, why not try complain in consequence of the changes made iu the Irish and
both schemes ?—reduce the tax on sugar as well as on rum. To this :Scotch Distillery !ems. They should all be on the mine footing.
he would reply, that the claim of any interest to relief wee not to be It has been said that there was no consumption of rum in Ireland;
tried by the extent of its own distress, but by a comparison with the then Ireland would net suffer by placing the West India rem-
!
situation of other Messes. The Fame objemion was not to be made to rower in the same situation with her. In Scotland, however,
the proposition of the Hon. Member for Taunton with respect he knew that rum had been consumed in large quantitime but in
to the use of sugar in distilleries. If the thing could be managed consequence of the increased duties dad diminished. In short. the
so as not to injure the agricultural Interest, he should be in its West India rum-grower should not be excluded from the Irish and
I
• favour. Ile was aware that the subject involved some technical Scotch market, be the consumption little or be it niuch. On refer.
difficulties. He had sat upon a Committee on the subject, and was ; ring to the report of a Committee made on the subject in 1807.
aware of the nature of those difficulties ; but he knew that these 'he found that the comomption of nun had only been decreased
difficulties always gave way when it was ascertained that Govern- . by the cheapness of whiskey ; and he was sum, if the prim of rum
mcnt was serious in its resolution to carry the manure into effect. and whiskey were nearly the mime, that the consumption of rum
• Ile hoped that the Right lion. Gentleman would not be prevented would be greatly augmented. The report were to state that Mr:tisb

- 3,1410,000
- 3,800,000

Leaving a comparative cackles of supply of . Zioo,Boo
more now than in 1814. Suppose that in 1814 the consumption
was 2.580,000 cwt., the gtoss excess of supply then would be
1,1100,000 cwt. Suppose that now the consumption amounted to
3,100,000 cwt., the excess of supply would be duninished, as com-
pared with 1814.
Cwt.
The increased consumption since 1814 was
The increased supply, including thst from the new
islands, was

921,000
929,000

spirits posed off, (considerable langhlie,) slid that etten was the
favourite liquor, he suppose foe outs pod -natural reason. At I
all events one thing was. abviusuilit claar, that rum should not be
fu
rther thrown out of cono H mption. e thought the people of
Ireland—the poorer people ha meant—should be tt opted by its
cheapness to use sugar, and give them some stronger desire than
they now seemed to feel for the indulgence of a few luxuries.
Mr. F. LEWIS observed that the reports just alluded to by the
lion. Member, mentioned that Genera was the favourite liquor in
Scotland at the period to which he Minded. Ile thought that the
West India interest need not be in the Last alarmed at the change
which was wade in the Irish and Scotch Distillery Laws, because
the consumption of sum in Scotland was very little, and in Ireland
still less. Formerly the only duty on spirits in Ireland was 3s. lid. a
gallon, but that was so often evaded that he verily believed sot more
than 29.8 d. was received on the aggregate consumption. The duty
was now fixed at Ihe low rate, and he conceived it would produce
more to the revenue, than it did when it was notnim-lly at live
shillings and sixpence. The West India interest had no chum
whatever for indemnification on that branch of the question.
Their object seemed to be to shift ttie pressure--to change the
shoulders who were to hear it; but he asked why should the loss
of duty on sugar be made up by a charge on the barley grower?
The duty on rum was now brought to a level with that on British
spirits. (No, no, co.) Well, perhaps he might mistake as to
the exact scale of both ; but in the principle lie was right, the
! principle being to ditoiAsh the duty on rum so as to allow its cont-
. petition with British spirits. If, again, sugar were admitted on
cheaper terms when British spirits were high, he contended that
the English barley grower would he a double sufferer. If the
harvest were precarious, the foreign barley grower would come into
the market, and what etween him and the sugar grower, the Eng-
lish fanner would be subject to a double drawback. In his (Mr.
Lewis's) view, the much wiser plan would be to take off duty to a ;
certain degree on every thing, and spread the benefit over the whole
surface of the community.
Mr. H. SUMNER said that after what he had heard he must;
decidedly oppose the reduction of the duty on sugar (us we under-,
stood); and he wished the Hon. Member for Aberdeen would
withdraw his amendment. When the agricultural interest was
sufferiqg they. were supported by the West India interest, and he
had no objection, if it could be safely done, to assist them in re-
turn. Rut then he was not disposed to let the sugar grower, as well
as the foreign corn grower, at once cotnpew with the British
barley grower. At the same time he was free to say that the %Vest
India planters were entitled to every protection.
Mr. ROBERTSON did not consider that the reduction of the
ditty on ruin would prove advantageous to the West India planter.
He was fully impre,sed with this conviction, and he should at
present content himself with the simple expression cf that opinion.
111 r. MANNINO said (as we understood him, for he spoke in a
feeble under tone) that the reduction of the duty on sugar would not
interfere with the interests of the English barley grower.
. Mr. PLUM ER supported the reduction of the tax on sugar.
Sir ISAAC cortls.—l think the concessions of the Minister
have been very favourable to the %Vest India interest, and I shall
vote for the continuance of the tax on sugar.
Mr. WHIT3IOIIE said it was not his intention to follow up his
motion of last session upon the Corn Laws (we believe) at the pre-
sent. Upon the subject now before the Committee, he thought the
proposed reduction on sugar would not be attended with the expected
benefits.
Mr. 111'3IE in reply observed, that the question he put to the
Committee was, that the consumption or sugar by no means ;
equalled the expectatiors entertained in 1822. Ile held in his hand
a paper which shewed that fact, and expressly denied the statement
of the Right lion. Gentleman. The pri:e of sugar was 73 shillings!
• hundred at the period alluded to, and in 1823 it was 335. and
the consumption, in place of being doubled, as it ought tube, was
leas than in the former period. The decrease of price caused an
increased consumption, but not a consumption equal to what was
expecteaL He thought himself fully justified in calling for the de-
crease cf the duty on sugar. The reduction would be little less to
the revenue, and of great advantage to the West India Planters.
If, however, they thought otherwise, he called for the reduction on
behalf of the people of England. On the part of the public, he
thought this reduction should take place ; but opposed as he was
by Gentlemen and the West India interest, he had little expectation
of carrying his amendment. Under these circumstances, he would
not press the House to a division, and would, with their leave,
withdraw his amendment.

31r. C. GRANT said a few wcrds ; but from the buzz which
prevailed, we could not hear a single sentence of what the Bon.
Member said.
Mr. GORDON thought there was some secret understanding
between the Government and the West India body, which should
be awed, and that was, as to the renewal of a Bill in which the in-
terests of the refiners here woul,; be considerably affected. The
West India planters already had a bounty of three shillings; for,
though the duty was nominally 30s. only Vs. were paid. He could
not see why gentlemen coveted this bounty when they so liberally
praised the doing away bounties on heir.ps, Irish linen, and other
matters. Such inconsistency was a little singular, to say the least
of it.

The Amendment was then withdrawn. The House resumed,
and lifr. Brogden brought up the Report, which was ordered to be
*mired tomorrow.
USURY LAWS. _

Mr. W. WYNN, in the iiietteeOtlifrTSergeant Onslow, Tofu-
poned the further consideration of the Usury Laws Repeal Bill
till Slay next.
FRENCH TROOPS IN SPAIN. . _ .

Sir J. RUSliillpostponeditia motion on the evacuation oldie
French troops out of Spain till Thursday next, the Ilth inst.

CUSTOMS ACTS.

On the motion of Dlr. iiiiskiiisiks, the House resolved itself
into a Committee of the whole House on the Customs Acts.

financial regulations ? lie was of opinion, that if there were eye
a time fur a complete change of that system which was Nana
to impede and obstruct our prosperity, it was at t.
H.
might be permitted to affirm, that now, if ever, Lreiteili'ne was
collie for givii.g relief, nut only from our prevent but our future
embarratainents—that now, if ever, the chance was given us or
sowing the send of new prosperity, interest, and wealth ; and it was
lawful for us to expect that we would reap all the advantages of a
full and n.ature harvest. These adeanN,:es we should attend to
time of peace, and if at a future period the country was meta.
tunately called to war, that prosperity would enable her to am
with EAU the burdiens imposed upon her by the d.fficulties of her
situation. Taking this view of the question, and firmly impanel
with the test important consequence* that were likely to moult, be
would ask the Parliament if they meant to continue or alter the
present system of law, as it stated the silk and woollen redo
i'his discussion, it was unnecessary the him to say, was most ably
opened upon a former occasion by his Right Honourable Friend,
the Chancellor of the Exchequer. For his pan, lie owned he was
satisfied of the disadvantages under which dame trades laboured by
the laws as they existed at present, and he was confirmed in his
opinion upon the sub.ect, not only by stet fell front the Metnbees
for Cheshire and Taunton, but also by wha, bail been Ruggeated by
the toasters and labia.. ers engaged in the silk trade 'I ite object of
these petitioners was relief. lie had looked into the petition, and
found the petitioners wets not quite satisfied with the lawn it ;fleet.
ed the trade. lie would intrude upon the patinae of the House by
readings few passages from this petition;—it went to state, that the
trade in silk was depressed below its level, by the v.-saute of re-
gulations most &trinomial to its interests and prosperity; that if
its regulations were conducive to its interests, it would receive an
secession of prosperity, and by judicious management the silk trade
of Great Britain would not be surpassed by any foreign trade, what.
ever, and would meet triumphantly with any competition. This
was a part of the petition which went to &hew the dinatisfactiee of
the petitioners. \Filen it was attempted to account for the prospe.
pity of the cotton trade, it was imid this was the staple trade of tbe
country, whilst the silk ens a foreign one; and therefore a duty
upon the raw material of the latter was pressed for. The time,
therefore, was now coons to chew the great benefit derived to the
country front the system hitherto adopted, of laying a duty upon the
raw material imported; and how it was preferable to the system of
laying our own markets open. It could be "hewed by those who
supported this genend argument, that when a trade was fettered, and
a duty laid on the importation of the foreign raw material, and by
these means the application of capital to this branch of trade was
impeded—when by this system the price of labour was raised, the
trade than circumstanced could neither flaunah nor prosper, or come
with any thing like the chance of success to a fair competitioa.
Against this he imagined no general argument could be advanced.
Another argument used by the lion. Member for Taunton was, that
die trade in silk was not a native trade—that this manufacture was
like fruit ;it grew or could mow only in certain places. From this
argument be dissented. He averred that the silk trade, if the re-
strictions sod monopolies were removed, would grow and extend
itself, not only to Spitalfields, but it would flourish, and spread, and
expand itself through every part of England. lie would appeal to
the lion. Gentleman, and ask him if Taunton were not a
remarkable manufactory for silk ? Ile would of course ad.
nth it wax ; but thirty or forty years since it was equally
remarkable for its cotton inumfactories. lie did not know thirty or
forty years since who was the representative for Taunton;
he was an individual like the present, eminent for sound ancl7tlasPs
manlike views; he might be a great merchant and a distinguished
member of the mercantile and commercial interests: and suppose
I measures were taken for the repeal of certain duties and taxes
which affected the property of the cotton trade as it then stood--if
new regulations were to be formed noldela would impose but few
duties upon it ; if those regulations were to be removed which im.
posed restrictions and monopoly—if the trade were by this tneans sof.
tered to diffuse itself with freedom, what would not the Member for
Taunton of that day have eaclainid ? Would helmet Ray to the Minis..
ter, what measures are you taking ? You are repaling taxes, the
repeal of which will destroy our woollen trade—you are acting
in a manner injurious to the staple of the country. India give
rngland the raw material of cotton in the greatest abundance:
It is therefore easy for you to carry on the cotton trade, to col.
tivate this manufacture, where there is so little labour and
much raw material. You are bound to protect us who have so
much more labour than is required in the manufactuee of count.
Just so the Member for Taunton is now making objections re'
the destruction of what he calls the staple. The inhabitants of
l'auntoin at the time to which he alluded, would petition teethe
exclusive support and monopoly of woollen. They would say this
staple would be ruined ; that the consumption of flannel petucoats
would be destroyed: that worsted hose would no longer be wan:
they would go the length of Raying, that the Legislature accorded
with their view. inasmuch as there was a law to compel the dead to
be shrouded in woollen. What, he would ask, was the consequence or
those measures, which it was feared would go to the ruin of the staple?
When it was no longer subject to those institutions ad restraints
under which it was pretended the silk trade prospered and flourished,
when the monopolies and exclusions under which it laboured
were taken off, , it made a most surprising progress to prosperity ins
short period, and in his opinion, every article of silk would ad.
ranee in the same proportion as that of cotton, if the test/ham
were in like manner removed. He would state the way In which
the two manufactures, silk and cotton, had advanced in a gins
time ; he would go back to an interval of 40 years. In the yer
1703, the amount of woollen exported was not more than 330,101.
In the year 17133, two yens after, when we were relieved from the
difficulties of war, the exportation of woollens did not exceed
064,0001. At present the export was about four millions, Wee am
increase compared with the export, at the period alluded to, in the
proportion of five to one; within the same time the exponaueo of
cotton had risen to the amount of twenty-seven million thee"
hundred and seventy thousand pounds, being an increase an
more than forty times, and the export of woollen Cuing it
would admit in round numbers six millions, the export of est..
ton was greater than it in the proportion of five to one. (Loud
cheers.) These advantages were gained by suffering capital
to flow in its own direct channel, and by measures prone.
ing a free trade. He would admit, in the statement which he nudes
and he was bound in fairness to admit it, that the value of the ma-
nufactures to which he alluded was official, mid higher than the
real ; but front the best information be could acquire upon Mesa..
ject, the real value of the cotton manufactured in the kingdom its
foreign and home consumption, amounted to thirty-two minimise
this he believed to be the real, and not the official value. (Hears
hear.) And he would ask if, after this increase of manufacture,
unparalleled in the history of the world, those little and useless
taxes would be suffered to remain upon the raw material? He
would not enter into details upon the subject ; but of the thirty.
two millioas of which he had spoken, not more than five mil-
lions went to the purchase of the raw material and the intei.
est of capital ; the remaining twenty-six or twenty.sevez minims
were produced by the capital and the industry and labour of the
parties employed in the trade, and he reverted boldly to the propo-
sition which he mentioned be:fore, that it was scarcely possible to.
give relief to any particular branch of a manufacture without ex-
tending that relief to others ; and in his opir.ion, if it were not for
the success, and vigour and wealth of the cotton trade, it would he
utterly impossilne for this country to continue the war of twenty
years, in which we were engaged, or at any rate to survive the
gigantic exertions which we were compelled to make, and the sums
of money expended in the country by the twelve hundred thousand
persons employed in the trade, and the money required fur their
pay, for thew various wants and consumption, were of more utility
and relief to other interests, and amongst the agricultural, thsa
could be forced upon them by any artificial measures whatever. It
was upon the increase of individual wealth and prospetity he de.
pended for the gradual relief of burthene, and not from tat:Nei.
ment of any artificial regulations whatever; it was not upon nub
unnatural enactment+ he depended, it was upon individual ris.
sources, upon the activity and industry of the manufacturing ?o-
pulence and to the improvements which took place, and are take/
place daily in the use and inventions of machinery. There was
be knew an objection to the use of machinery. as it dinsinithol
those works which were the result of manna labour. This
objection was now done away, and it was converted into a benefit,
as the machinery was increased, and consequently a greaternamr
ber of hands was employed. Whilst the exclusive restrictions sad
protections were kept up on silk, it would, in his opinion, bosh
ways inferior. There was, in consequence of the system, no gown
petition ; it was competition that gave lite and real to ingenuity ;
it gave perseverance and invention ; it was proved by es.
penence, that error was removed by competition alone. As s
proof of his assertion, it was in this silk trade alone we wean' bar
behind. The security given to this trade by our eateietions,
chilled and benumbed all efforts: there ens no neeneeity for the ex-
ercise of genius, as all parties employed in the trade were are of
a market ; for which reason it was evident to all thanes that the

Mr. IlUaltIsSON then pn ...ceded to say, that although his
Right Honourable Friend the Chancellor of the Exchequer had,
with a perspicuity peculiarly his own, stated his views and the
views of government on the general finances of the country, on the
intended repeal of duties, and amongst them, of those in silk; yet
he (Mr. Huskisson) finding there were objections to that plan,
both in this House and out of it—that different opinions prevailed,
with reference to the important subject connected with the system of
remitting duties; considering these circumstances, he hoped, though
he might not be able to follow the example ofhisßight on. Friend,
that he would at all et ents receive the indulgence of the Committee
(hear), while he stated the general views of government on the sub-
ject. To the general plan of finance already laid before the House and
the public, there seemed to be two classes of objectors : one was
of opinion the remission should be in direct taxes, as was the case
last year ; and the other were those who wished the laws regulating
the trade in silk still to remain. With respect to the first class, the
course pursued by the Government was such as was thought to be
most conducive to the comfort and ease of the various and wide-
spread interests of the country. 'When the finances of the country
enable the Government to remit any portion of the taxes, they look-
ed first to the bumbler classes, and, with a view to benefit them,
some of the eeitties were taken offaalt, malt, leather, and, though
last not least in operation and effect, the lottery. (Hear, hear.)
Seven millions of taxes had been already remitted, with a view to
relieve the poorer and middle classes ; but it was asked, both here
and elsewhere, why not let any further remission you can make, be
continued in the direct taxes ; as, to do so, would at once prove
sure, easy, and certainly more popular? The latter he believed,
the former he much doubted. :den certainly did not like to see
the face of the tax-gatherer, if they could help it ; but the Govern-
ment, having so long looked to those classes he had mentioned,
were now bound also to look and see if they were not to encourage
the industry of the country, by the repeal of such a duty
as that upon silk. Acting as they had done, upon a new
and liberal commercial policy, the duties upon inch a branch
of menufactsre as that of silk deserved every consideration.
The objections made by these two classes of persons were worthy
of attention, and possessed weight: but lie was free to confess the
broad view he took of the subject was by every means in his power
to form some financial and commercial regulations which would
have the effect of combining at once protection and relief, which
would not only be advantageous to our present interest hut mature a
harvest of prosperity for the future. When the House took into
its consideration the vast and mighty changes that were daily taking
place, as to the restrictions imposed upon commerce, when it con.
signed the spirit that was acting at present, and the extent to which
it MU carried, he was sure there was not a man iu the country
who would not declare that we ought nut to lose the opportunity
which presented itself to us, if our real and sincere object were to
advance the prosperity of our country, and to give her an equal
share of those markets now open to us. It was true the struggle
for independence still existed to some extent between the provinces
of South America and Spain ; that struggle might continue
logger; but it was fair to conclude that these provinces would
never return, as far as their commercial Ilependence was
concerned, to the same state as before. When the wide field open-
ed* by this state of things was considered—when it was taken into
statesman-like view, when the indefinite extent of these circum-
stances was reflected upon, he trusted he would not be deemed er-
roneous in the supposition, that restrictions of monopoly and exclu-
sion were not thou which were likely to add to the wealth and pros-
perity of the country. It was reasonable to suppose that the tame
advantage would be derived by an extensive trade with the South
American Provinces as there was spread over the extensive po-
pulation of the l'nited States ; and his decided opinion was,
that any system was injurious to the prosperity and interests of the
country, which prevented bar from coming to as extensive markets
as the people of every other country. It was a prir iple generally
moser.ted to; as was the admission of all manufacturers interested
or concerned in trade, that there were certain principles, which,
when acted upon, impede the progress and prevent the advance of
commerce, by obstructing a fair competition, and in contbrmity to
which laws and regulations are passed which endeavoured to force
capital to certain branches of trade, by means of prohibitions.
These principles must of necessity be obstacles to free trade, by
laying heavy duties on the raw material, or by drawbacks upon the
expoaation. It was admitted that these measures were equally
injurious to the interests of a free trade ; and lie would venture to
assert that it was well worth the contemplation of his Majesty's
Government. Great benefits would be generally conferred upon
the country by making the changes to which lie was alluding ; and
considering die question in this point of view, he would appeal to
the House--he would ask them, if, for the sake of the small sur-
plus revenue whith they had in hands—if, for the sake of the
trifling reduction of tar,es which could be effected, it would be con-
sistent with the prudence of Parliament—whether it would be
worth their while. to forego the chances of roost important results to
the country in eeneral, and put them in cotnpar'son with the re-
duction of a few inconvenient taxes? It was observed by the lion.
member for Taunton*, that the excess of our revenue was but
small, and small as it was, there was nothing about it which could
lead to the expectations of its permanence—that ;t was caused by
the reduction of taxes to the amount only of 500001. annually—
that he took into the consideration the savings of four tears, and
found them to be but two millions, and this eating depended merely
1 upon casual receipts. He would ask the Honourable Member if it
would add to our interest to extend the diminution of taxation,
ntl lose the benefit which we may derive frutu gin present

manufacture of silk was interior in this country, not only
in the w.irk of the loom, but or warping and in dying the silk;
in all these respects we were far behind, and if the same systems
were applied to the cotton manufactory, he made no doubt it would
be as much interior to it as it was junior to it ie. Its intro-
duction into the country. It was therefore his decided opinion_ sad
that of the friends with whom he acted, that the repeal of these
restrictions would be the only chance to the manufacturers of this
country of coming to a fair competition, and giving the opportunity
of using the industry which was open to them. ile wield en-
deavour to look at this question in a statesman-like manota, and
would e.ideavour to prevail upon the Parliament to rapport him in
the repeal of those restrictions, not for the reasons alone which he
had mentioned, but for others he would state. The svatem of
which he complainel was not productive of injury and inifiaventa
ence to the silk trade alone ; it was also the occasion and source of
new laws. What, lie would ask, would be thought of that system
which was protected by laws, one of which enabled any person.
who would be ruffian enough to avail himself of it, to snatch an
article of silk from an individual in the streets, assuming it to be
foreign. Another law authorized the Custom-house other to enter
the house of any private person, and look ibr any 'nick In sill:,
whether of furniture or otherwise, and this in a rnannettotally un-
congenial with the spirit of English law : and all these efforts were
unavailing, the law was evaded ; the higher daises always pa-
messed the articles ; for these violations of the law the higher
classes were always responsible ; but if there restnetincs
were taken off, these evils would not again be oomplained
of It was with regard to silk, as it was with regard to
game; if there were no game laws there would he no poachers.
In both cases the higher classes possessed, and ever would
possess the articles forbidden, and were responsible for the
evils arising from the treach of the laws. Ile was unlearned in
the character of the laws which lie censured, but he believed, by
making application to the Court of Exchequer, any might
procure a writ of assistance., and under this au ty he might
search the house of an individual under pretence of looking for
smuggled silks, and he might enter the house as if it were a ga-
ming-house and illegal practices were carried on there. There
was another part of the argument to which he wished to allude.
Ile spoke of- the petition in which the parties prayed for the
maintenance of the restrictions; they were not insensible, the,
were not blind to their own Interest; they gave up tkg restric-
tions; they only required that thedutleashouldbe kept op,A,lssgb he

~at th
tititstm3
:'rench 1
from 13

duty
maw
ware 01
allord

wan a difference of 11
the petitioners princii
cent. Here, therefor
came from America
they went thence to
wodve, ur be conscie
be given. Ile would]
victual said he went tw
inspecting the manufi
a manufacturer, and
surance of 20 per cen
and he admitted that
improperly introduced
trade, ler no sooner
country than it was ii
topks west taken of
They were not only
to Brighton (hear, he
glens they were sold
could be otherwise p
the effects of the prof
the country by an ins
not injure the trade,
sold, of course, at
plain proof that
the foreigner as to ens
not be difficult, by
given, and the arrange
fish artisan, not only
to beat him out of t
tore : this would be
from mere perversion
the prevailing mode tt
was procured by a vin
answer of Mr. Hale
state, that he had se
that day : in that to
*hackles of the Spitalt
they had no fear of a
when they would elm
factures. He would
Chancellor of the Exi
in learning the details
any proposition on the
consequence they wen
tardiness on the other
they would not collie I
wait for results, and
arrangements, he was
enter Into a successful
out of the market.
he heard abroad, nam
all. the beat judges M
which he felt for the
with him, and it v
with all the respeci
persons on the pram
could not agree to
Judges of their own
He admitted that
were favourable to I
checked general in&
persons who looked ui
as injurious to their co
who bought on comp
ism material and nee
a reduction in the pric
the course of all glee
it wag the business ol
guard them as much s
persons out of the Hu
citing those feelings
tlwse persons who was
benefits of the mop
neat dange: ; they f
become fashionable
servant-maids were a
arising from the col
tresses. (Laughter.)
the case, he felt justiti
Anent to support the iv
(Hear, heir.) He Iss
absence of the Chance
the incdnvenience whi
would hold back, and
reduction would audit
stagnation of the mane
As to the mode of pane
by. which the silk tea
might perhaps prevail.
ter to proceed by grade
bell, but the effect woe
Willed the measure sl
Wary. It was therefor
else Stli of July, 1823
este operation. The'
of duties, from the am
petaled for their daily
of trade might be than
of this speedy arrange
neeerupany the alter
abjection satisfactorily
*an to diminish it.
propose to the Comm
tent have stocks of ail
aright be permitted
to the respective war
the duty which they h
to them—and that tl
atg the reduced dt
be trusted, wo
}ended non-ensploym
If such non-employe
the Pith of March.
lion of this regulation
MI towards those ergs
itirmilas for them to
.cos sanguine enough
Mk. The shop of eve
inventory had of the
possession ; that woul
the next point, monel,
trade of this countrr i
fled been determined
duty, as proposed by t
take place until ..lu
Hey that this duty sho
nwesnres something
who were to be affee
not regret (whatever
time, satisfied if tit,
ores. It would, th
be admissible for tl
on hand, to receive
previously paid, and
the continuance of the
years longer would, lu
tore to encounter the e
by the proposed red
article,. He had the
. which he intended to
conformable to the I
. formed on the subject
lieved, were sometiros
long-beers eonvermet
connected with cbanl
sobs so much of an et
from the view that •
feed a practical sys
wet consistent with
derressetie interests. 1
any ether department
comparative depressio
tributable to the ado()
enraged when the
policy were acted ups
nations, which ascot
susi which was invari
advantages to such i
Ia this, as in ever
thins whom the meat
thee should be regard
erinterests of tl
n and most i
he Right Hon. Gen
restitutions :

Thatll; the opi
she 24th of 31nrch 18
several sorts of silk,
mina; and also, that I
Manufactured silk shm
duties shall be paid in
" Oa silk, from am
huska, or wa
not cl ed, 7s. Rd.
manufactum
1214 for every cwt. it
Xr. BARING had
of the 'Right Hon. (le
• soulf well ewpget
'lll.llll lion him a gen

could not say what
wsy, as, nuiwithw
muds that Frene
premium of from
and would
eni
coti ncl
adn
protecting the ma
when the real star,
• the protection aif
to the minutes of
from the petition I
manner in shut
be would 'hew
relligent no doubt
an individual not I
to relieve the work
in and acquaintan
apected individual
the market fur the
cent. There was
who time to Euro
asked what their
of. France and Em
petition between th
some there was a I

•c irzie ever
WWI Nand.
icsent. Ho
c time was
our future
oleo us or
and it was
images of a
attend to in
was norm.-
Ler to hear
aides of her
impressed
to result, be
•r alter the
11:11 tales?
I noose ably
'Lie Friend,
'ned he was
laboured by
ruled in his
le 3lcanbers
uggeated by
lir object of

ctitiuu, npel

r am it &heat-
le Home by
ate, !hat the
.re.,sure of TC
pity; that if

trreire an
he .ilk trade
trade, what-
tion. This

tti.faction of
the ProsPo-
r trim of the

foie a duty
The times
•rived to the
uty upon the
he system of
7 those who
lettered, and
:vial, and by
of trade was
is raised, the
%p r, Or COMO

)rooperity in a
k would ad.

might
tri he might
of looking for
' it woe a ga-
thers. 'rhea
'he'd to anode.
rayed for the
iatbibit, they
4141gic-
t
h•

could not say what the operation of the petition would be, ever in this
~,,y, as, notwithstanding the prohibitna, it was admitted upon all
bawds that French patterns were unported into this country at a
premium of front 15 to 20 per cent., and these patterns were sold,
:end would continue to be sold in the shops of hoodoo ; and if
an ad valorem duty of 30 p.r cent. were laid on for the purpose of
protecting the manufacturer, it would be unavailing. Here then,
when the real state of the trade was considered as compared with
the protection adirded by the laying on a duty, he would refer
to the minutes of evidence read befiare the House. Ile would chew
from the petition the feelings of the parties themselves, as to the
manner in which the alteration of the laws would affect them ; and
he would chew how inconsistent these individuals, honest and in-
telligent no doubt, were, he would read the evidence of Mr. Hale,
an individual not less remarkable for his benevolence and anxiety
to relieve the working classes of the trade, than for his knowledge
in and acquaintance with every thing contacted with it. This re-
spected individual being asked in general terms what would protect
the market fur the nianufacturers, said not less than a duty of 30 per
cent. There was also the evidence of two American merchants,
who came to Europe for the purpose of buying silks; they being
asked what their idea of the die ereuce was between the light goods
of France and England, in reference to the subject of a fair com-
petition between the tradesmen of both countries, answered, that in
some there was a difference of 25 per cent.; in black silk there
was adifference of 20 per cent., and in ribbons (and to this branch
the petitioners principally referred) there was a difference of 25 per
cent. litre, therefore, was the testimony of two merchants, who
came from America to purchase silks; they came to England—
they went thence to France—and the only difference they could
paMve, or be conscious of, was less than the protection intended to
be given. Ile would return tithe evidence of 31r. Hale: this indi-
vidual said he went trice to Paris, and to Lyons, for the purpose of
inspecting the manufactures. 'Fbepersons there had no idea, he was
a manufacturer, and they ()Bard to send hint to London, for an in-
surance of 20 per cent. any quantity of silk he might require ;
and he admitted that the vast quantities of the article were thus
improperly introduced into the country ; it did not injure the silk
trade, tin no sooner was a single French pattern found in the
country than it was inimedietely copied, and perhaps a thousand
copics wen taken off the single French pattern. (Hear, hear.)
They were not only copied but sold; they were generally sent
to Brighton (hear, hear), and by means of fishwonien and smug-
glen they were old as French patterns, at a higher price than
could be otherwise procured fur French. (Laughter.) Such were'
the effects of the prohibition. The foreign articles were sent into
the country by an insurance of so much pet cent., and yet it did
not injure the trade, fiat a thousand copies were taken here and
sold, of course, at a profit. This was, in his opinion, a
plain proof that when we were so near competing with
the foreigner as to make and sell these copies as French, it would
not be &Math, by giving the 30 per cent. ; and when time was
given, and the arrangements were properly made to enable the Eng-
lish artisan, not only to meet the foreigner in fair competition, but
to beat him out of the market in this as in every other manufac-
ture : this would be rendered more easy, when it was no longer,
from niece perversion of taste, or unaccountable feeling of fashion,
the prevailing made to think nothing good could be worn, except it
was procured by a violation of the law of the land. He thought the
answer of Mr. Hale could not be gotten over. Ile was happy to
state, that he had seen some of the silk-weavers of Manchester on
that day : in that town the silk trade was free front the severe
shackles of the Spitaltields laws ; and these gentlemen assured him
they had no fear of a competition--and the day was not far distant
when they would excel theforeigners in this as in all other manu-
factures. Ile would assure the lion. Member that he and the
Chancellor of the Exchequer had spared neither pains nor labour
in learning the details of the trade ; they did not come forward with
any proposition on the subject until they acquired information ; in
consequence they were accused of precipitation on one hand, and of
tardiness on the other. These accusations they could not help;
they would not conic forward at once with any plan ; they should
wait for results, and by waiting patiently for the completion of all
arrangements, he was sanguine enough to expect the country could
enter into a successful rivalry with foreign nations, and beat them
out of the market. (Hear.) There was another argument who
he heard abroad, namely, that individuals themselves were, aft.*
all, the best judges of their own interests. With all the deference
which he felt for the opinions of those who held communications
with him, and it was a part of his duty to attend to them—
with all the respect which he felt for the opinions of those
persons on the practical matters connected with their trade, he
could not agree to the proposition that they were the best
judges of their own interest ad connected with the public
lie admitted that impositions of restrictions and drawbacks
was favourable to heavy capital, but they cramped-Mole and
eheeked general industry. There was also a numenta class of
persons who looked upon the taking the duties off the raw material
as injurious to their own interests. He meant broken and persons
who bought on commission. They bought large quantities of the
raw material and received payment in the gross, snd consequently
a reduction in the price would be detrimental to their interests. In
the course of all great changes some interest must be injured, and
it was the business ot Parliament to touch them tenderly, and to
guanl them as much as possible. There was also another class of
peons out of the House, who were not remise ear inactive in ex.
citing those feelings which they had received abroad. He meant
these pennon who were afraid they would be deprived of the
benefits of the smuggling trade. These persons were in immi-
nent danger • they feared, if the duties were taken off; it would
become fashionable to wear silks not smuggled, and the
servant-maids were also apprehensive of losing the importance
arising from the confederacies entered into with their mis-
tresses. (Laughter.) From the consideration which he gave
the case, he felt justified in standing up and calling upon Parlia-
ment to support the important measures which he had to propose.
Incur, heat.) He lamented he had to perform this duty in the
absence of the Chancellor of the Exchequer ; but he was aware of
the inedovenience which would follow it delay took place; the buyer
would hold back, and expect to get the article even cheaper than the
reduction would authorise him to expect, and by his remissness a
stagnation of the manufacture would, to a certain extent, takeplace.
As to the mode of proceeding in the remission of the several duties
by. which the silk trade was restricted, some variety of opinion
might perhaps prevail. It might perhaps by many be thought bet-
ter to
apce
by gradual reduction, first to take off a quarter, then
kW, t the effect would ultimately be the same, and he therefore
limbed the manure should be lather speedy and decisive than di-
latory. It was therefore, that instead of postponing this measure to
the Bth of July, 1825, He would prefer that it should have Mune-
Mate operation. There was an objection to the sudden remission
of defies, from the apprehension that by it a great many who de-
pended for their daily subsistenceon their earnings in this branch
of trade might be thrown out of employment by the sudden effect
of this speedy arrangement of the duties. But he would propose to
etwompaoy the alteration with what he hoped would meet this
objection satisfactorily, and rather tend to increase employment
than to diminish it. The arrangement, therefore, which he would
propose to the Committee for the relief of those who might at pre-
sent hare stocks of silks not numufactured, on hand, was that they
might be pemiittcd from the 25th of March to return that stock
to the respective warehouses from which they had taken it—that
the duty which they had originally paid upon it should be returned
to them—and that they should be at liberty to take it out again,
SAE. g the reduced duty, which he now
pro,mootf :iklng. stlLt paour.d.
'll4 he trusted, would have the effect of
betided non-employineot of the working manufactures, or at larset,
If such non-employment ensued, it would
.not continue beyond
the 26..11 of March. That there should be a limit to the applica-
tion of this regulation, was manifest ; but it would be fairly acted
en
towards those engaged in this trade : it would serve as a fresh
'Stimulus for them to enter into the competition which he (Mr. H)
was sanguine enough they would successfully enter upon with I. rench
ilk. The shop of every haberdashercould not be entered on, and so
1 inventory had of the several species and quantities of silk in their
possession ; that would be an endless task. He would proceed to
, the next point, namely, the prohibitory duty ; and in order that the
trade of this country might have time and opportunity to thrive, it
had been determined as moat advisable that the reduction of this
duty, as proposed by the Chancellor of the Exchequer, should not
take place until July 5, 111211. It might be perhaps better po-
licy that this duty should terminate now, but as in all legislative
messans something should be esmeeded to the feelings of those
who were to he affected by a particular enactment, lie would
not regret (whatever tatty be his own opinion) the extension of
time, Banished if the measure be attended with ultimate suc-
cess. It would, therefore, :from the period he had assigned,
be admissible for those who had stocks of this commodity
on hand, to receive the duties and drawbacks which they
previously paid, and this reduction, together with the prospect of
the continuance of the prohibitory duty at present In force, for two
years longer would, he hoped, enable this branch of our manufac-
ture to encounter the competition to which it would he then exposed
by the proposed reduction on the importation of the foreign
artide. Me had thus stated fully the purport of the resolutions
. which he intended to move in the Committee. They might not be
conformable to the views of some Gentlemen, whose opinions,
formed no the subject of political economy, though honest, he be-
lieved, were sometimes erroneous. He ( Slr. Huskisson) had too
long-been conversant in the intricate and complicated consequences
connected with changes in various branches of our manufactures,
lobe so much of an enthusiast as to propose any alteration, merely
from the view that it presented in theory. He had always pre-
ferred a practical system fo ed und on liberal principles, as, as
wet consistent with that due regard to our foreign relations and
domestic interests. If the present branch of our manufactures, or
any ether department of the commerce of this country, suffered a
comparative depression with similar branches in others, it was at
trlbutable to the adoption of a restrictive policy. That depression
changed when the principles of that liberal and comprehensive
policy were acted upon which commenicated reciprocal services to
nations, which encouraged a friendly intercourse between them,
and which was invariably attended with increased enjoyments and
advantages to such countries as adopted and acted upon them.
In this, as in every other question, the separate interests of
those whom the measure most concerned should be regarded, but
they should be regarded only as consistent and connected with the
general interests of the empire, the superintendcoceof which was
the int and most important rule of legislation. (Hear, hear.)
The Right lion. Gentleman concluded by moving the following
resolutions :
" That it is the opinion of this Committee, that from and after
the 24th of 3larch MG, the several duties end drawbacks on the
several sorts of silk, hereinafter mentioned, shall cease and deter-
mine.; and also, that on the sth of July, Illthi, the prohibition of
manufactured silk shall cease and determine, and that the following
duties shall be paid in lieu thereof.
" Os silk, from and after the 11th of April, 1824. on raw silk, or
noise, or husks, or waste, or floss silk, per pound 3d.; on thrown,
not dyed, 7s. Rd.
" On manufactured silk, from and after the sth of July,
182 bi, for every cwt. imported, 301. 1
Mr.lllA RING had listened with great attention to the statement;
of the Right Hon. Gentleman on a subject as important certainly i
" Maki well eagagethe attention of the Howse. Although he had
aged limn hint a great deal of the encouragement which the pro.

posed Alteration In the duties upon silk wat calculated to give to
these who were engaged in this ; branch of our manufactures; al-
though he had beard plans of liberal policy recommended ; yet he
in vain listened for as argument. Nor had be heard any dung to
alter the opinions he had previously expressed. Ile gave his Ma-
jesty's Ministers great credit for the objects which they shoed to
attain : it was not through hostility to them that he cliif'erel from
the present measure; nothing could be more disinterested than
the conduct of Governmen—they assumed • very heavy responsi-
bility. He had himself always advocated principles of liberal
policy, but he was not prepared to coincide in the present.
exercise of policy, as applicable to the subject on which the Maier
were now called upon to legislate. The Right Honourabe
Gent had spoken largely in praise of free principles of trade, and
against monopoly, but the Right Hon. Gentleman could rot surely
forget or overlook the monopoly which we encouraged. Was nut
the footing on which the sugar trade of the West Indies stood a , '
monopoly ? Or what greater monopoly could there be than that'
which the landed interest of this country possessed in the corn
laws? (Hear.) These great monopolies the Rt. Hon. Gent. did not
touch or cope with, but confined himself to points of minor consi.;
deration. tor the application of principles of liberal policy. Nl'hat '
he (Mr. Baring) feared from this competition, about to be intro-
duced, was that the great superiority of French silk in every de-
pertinent and progress of its manufacture, would create a demand to
the prejudice and injury of those engaged in that manufacture at
home. Did our cotton and woollen manufactures, he would ask,
thrive under regulations similar to those now proposed to be applied
to the silk trade? Or was it not to the proteoton which the legisla.
ture afforded to them, that their success was attributable. 'Why then
abandon a system in one instance, which had been found successful
in other branches of our manufactures ? Instead of declamation on
liberal policy, it would be better to inquire into the causes which
made • particular branch of manufacture thrive in one place better
than in another. There was something in the nature of the article
itself, which accounted for such a superiority, and in local CiTCUM.
stances which were more suited often to one branch of in-
dustry than another; for instance, in Manchester a woollen
manufacture was carried on with unrivalled successes, and
Sheffield enjoyed a high reputation for cutlery ; again, the
watches and trinkets of Geneva were highly prized, and thus, in
various places some separate distinct article of' trade or manufacture
was cultivated with peculiar success. In inquiring into the causes
which gave France a pre-eminence in silk, he would mention the
' anecdote of a person of his acquaintance, who had resolved upon
attaining a knowledge of the French mode of dying silk, he had
offered to a person engaged in that department of manufacture in
France, a large sum of money to make him acquainted with the
manner in which lie dyed his silks. The individual to whom ha
applied. deelined taking his money, and told him that the whole
secret of his method consisted in this, that he never dyed silk except
in a bright sun. Now in woollens and cottons the precise colour was
not so important as in silk, where the fashion of the article and its
value depended on the precision and clearness of its hue. Thus it
would appear there wens as he said, something in nature which
often conferred a superiority in • particular article, and which gave
to it, as it were, " a local habitation." It would, he apprehended,
be impossible to transfer the manufacture of Lyons to Exeter. The
great consideration for the House to look to was, that there was
which it could be made saleable abroad was (with the exception of
the article of silk stockings), by mixing it with worsted andcotton,
no market for silk manufactured in this country. The only manner in
so that he may say, that the home consumption of this manu-
facture was the only consumption of it. If the prohibitor
duties were taken off; he feared that the superiority of the French
silk, would give it a preference to the utter ruin of the manufacturers
of England. If a treaty were on font, or if any advantage were to
be gained by the sacrifice of this thriving branch of our industry,
why then let it go ; but do not give it up without some reciprocal
service or adequate compensation. Freedom of trade was a good
thing when it was introduced and adopted on equitable terms.
But here the liberality was all one side. We were called
upon to give up a rapidly increasing part of our manufactures,
but were to receive nothing in return. (Cries of " )dear, hear.")
After remarking on the inconsistency of the plan of the flight
Honourable Gentleman, in reference to tho duties he intended to
impose on the admission of orgazine silk and thmwsted silk, and
the departure from free principles in the imposition of a duty of
7s. lid. on the importation of the latter, the Honourable Member
proceeded to remind the Hoose of the reproof which they received
from the horde last Session, for legislating on the Spitalfields Acts
without ample information. Ile recommended the propriety of
deferring any decision upon the present measure without inquiry,
lest a:similar reproof might be sent down to them. It had been said
that our superiority in machinery would enable us to counterbalance
the superiority of the raw material which France produced, but he
believed, that in looms and every other machine for the manufac-
ture of silk to perfection, France was in no degree inferior to this
country. As to the distant period of time (1826) at which the
Right Hon. Gent. proposed that the prohibitory duty should cease,
he (Mr. Baring) apprehended that the anxiety and dread of compe-
tition which would prevail, in the interval, would have the effect of
throwing a damp over that branch of manufacturre. It would para-
lyze it and be destructive of all industry, and every active enter-
prise in that branch of our national industry which is DOW io a
daily improving state. A respectable person engaged in the trade
said, on hearing that the prohibitory duty would not cease until
1826, " I sin glad of it, for I shall have time to get out of it."
This delay was, in his opinion, more injurious even thatm the
mediate adoption of the measure. If it be good for anything which
he (Mr. B.) believed it not to be, boldly try it, but let it not con-
tinue in a state of suspense for so long a period, without the state-
ment of any good or sufficient ground for doing so. He believed
that France was not the only place which produced silk that might
find a market in this country. From the specimens of silk imported
from India, there was reason to believe that if encouraged thetas iit
would reach a very high degree of perfection. lie understood,
however, it was the policy of the Court of Directors not to allow it
• fair competition, which, if true, was to be regretted, ira it cut of
a source of wealth which, if cultivated and promoted, might arrive
at a successful rivalry with the silk of France or of any other nation.
Haying passed the law, they would then throw the manufacturer
Into confusion, and would have to look about for a raw mate.
rial to establish a manufacture, in which, according to thy Right
Honourable Gentleman's own assertion, this country was In every
point inferior. Ile could assure the House that nothing but n
strong Renee of duty urged him to oppose the Right Honourable
Gentleman's measure, which he considered would be attended with
the most mischievous consequences. He hoped the House would
look more carefully into the subject than they at present seemed
inclined to do, and have something more to guide them in their
deliberations than a Committee of the Lords. If they ruined these
individuals, he trusted they would have at least the satisfaction of
reflecting, that they had not done so rashly ; and should they after.
wards find that they had eked, they would then be consoled that
they erred after taking every precaution. Ile was aware that the
feeling of the Committee was against hi.n, and therefore he would
not trespass longer on their patience.
31r.WALLACE observed, that no person called in question the
principles upon which the measure of his Right lion. Friend was
founded. He was satisfied that the opposition came chiefly from
those Gentlemen who were Members for places the inhabitants of
which thought themselves interested in keeping up the monopoly.
They took the alarm that had spread itself, through their eonstitu.
ens, that some danger would accrue to the manufacture with which
they were connected. He did not blame those Hon. Members kg
the course they were pursuing: be only wished to caution the
House not too readily to concede to their alarms, but give the
country the benefits of free trade wherever they could be extended,
which would be equally a benefit to the trade the constituents of
these gentlemen were engaged in. But the opposers of the dimi.
notion of duty seemed inclined to make this trade an exception to
all others, and to maintain the monopoly in contradiction to every
wound principle applicable to other trades and manufactures. If
recognised principles and tried theories were applied to this trade,
it would be found to be now only flourishing under the strictest
and heaviest prohibitions, which had all the character of a dose
monopoly about it, operating as s heavy tax on the country itself.
He was as anxious as Honourable Gentlemen opposite, that the
silk manufacture should flourish; but he wished it to do so on prin-
ciples beneficial to the country, and he had no doubt it was capa-
ble of flourishing in conformity with those principles. The stimu-
lus it would receive front the proposed alteration would, he was con-
fident, double the trade ; and great as were the numbers at present
employed in it, they might still be doubled, and that this country
would be enabled to compete with France in a very short time in
the silk manufacture, when liberal principles of trade were adopted.
Ile did not think that he could be accused of being visionary m
arguing in this manner, when gentlemen looked at the effect that
the tax had on the raw material. In Mr. Wilson's evidence before
the Committee, he was asked what was time effect of raising the
price of the manufacture? His answer was, that in one instance
tt was 84 per cent., and in another 48 per cent. Why was it that
this country could not compete with the French silk? It was by
reason of the duty ; and that was proved by a reference to the kale 1
of the manufacture before the war, for then the English had an
excellent foreign trade. Haring silk from India, he had no doubt,
after his Right Honourable Friend's measure had been some time
in operation. that this country would be enabled to serve the'
French market, because the raw material could be raised cheaper in
India than in France. If a moderate duty would not prevent
this country from meeting France, how well could she compete
with her Continental neighbour if it were taken off altogether.
An Honourable Gentleman had spoken of the labour of France
being infinitely cheaper than that of this country; and another
Honourable Gentleman had said, that he should be ready to admit
that the proposed measure would be a salutary one, if the Corn
Laws were repealed. But he was prepared to chew that there was
a great fallacy about the price of foreign labour. The wages in
the silk and mien manufactures were higher in this country than
in France; but from a conversation that he had had with a large
cotton manufacturer of France, now in this country, he learnt that
although wave were lower in France, tem labour was performed
for them. The effect of this wm, that notwithstanding the price
of labour was cheaper in France, a manufacture of cotton could be
carried on at a lower rate of expense in this country than there.
This comparison, he would admit, applied to the cotton manufac-
ture; but he could not see why it might not be applied to the silk:
for it might be connected generally with the manufacturing labour
in France, and therefore might bear upon the silk as well as cotton.
Every one knew, in a manufacture where there was no competition,
exertion to reduce the expenditure was not called into action, or
many operations in the eat manufacture might be done cheaper;
but the state of monopoly had prevented the reductions, because
the manufacturers did not consider it worth their while to attend to
them. The Ferric!' machinery in the finer broches of the silk
trade was superior to that produced in this country ; and a time,
which he thought rather long, had been proposed, to give the ma-
nufacturers of this country an opportunity to make the change with
edict; but still, although he might consider the time lops, it
&hewed that every facility would be given to those interested in the
,change, to prepare hr it. If this measure were not passed, it would
not only bring dishonour on our sincerity, but upon those that
would ensure the future prosperity of this country. Ile recollected
a petition presented not many mars since by the Honourable Glens.
"page (Bar. Bating) :rem the imeroimato of the city of LOW"

in which the principles he row opposed were strenuously advocated;
fox the prominent feature of it WAS against prohibitions of every
kind, lie was certain that if the prohibitions were taken away, the
public would get a cheaper and a batter commodity; and the great
object of the present tuensure was, on the one side, to found
principles in confOrmity witii those that had been more or less re-
cognised ; and on the other, to enable this country to compete with
France, and to carry our silk trade to other parts of the world. If
• the doctrine of the opposers of thin proposal were sound, the cotton
trade, which was peculiar to India, ought never to have been re-1
moved from that (Ilener of the globe. And he could seemly
Shen in a stronger point a xi: w the advantages of the measure,
than by an analogy to that extensive and important branch of our
wealth, both as it regarded the employment of industry, the use of
capital, and the exercise of ingenuity; all these advantage■ would
have been lost, if the principles he was advocating had not been in
' active operation with regard to the. cotton trade; and why should
they not apply equally to the silk manufacture, and enable this
country, in that branchislso, to compete with foreigners ? The
exertions that were made is the cotton trade were dependent on
principles that his Right Ifonourahle Friend wished to apply to
the silk, and which he was confident must always prove successful,
where they do not prematurely destroy restrictions that must, after
they had been once Mimed, be carefully got rid of however impo-
litic their first introduction might have been. His Honourable
Friend's measure did not hastily destroy these restrictions ; it was
founded on the soundest principles of trade ; and for those reasons it
should have his support.
Mr. fIUTTERIVORTII hoped time would be allowed for the
due consideration of thisquestion. One point that he particularly
wished to impress on the minds of the Committee was, as to the
drawbacks. Ile thought that there ought to he no difference be-
tween the drawback allowed to the merchant and that allowed to
the manufacturer, ash would be a very hard case on a merchant
with 30 or 40,0001. worth of silk on his hands not to be allowed the
full drawback given to the manufacturer.
Mr. W. PEEL was not going to enter into the question before
the House, but he was certain if Oovernment would pursue the
principle they were acting upon with regard to silk, towards
printed calicoes, and repeal the duties on them, as he proposed to
the !louse in 1819, he was satisfied the yeatest advantage would be
derived from the measure, for the manufacture would be greatly
benefited, and the revenue would not suffer.
Mr. DAI'ENPORT wished to know if the French would take
any article of the manufacture of this country in exchange for
their silks ? Ile thought a little more time ought to be given be-
fore the measure was decided upon, to enable the weavers (to
use a manufacturer's phrase)" to wind up their bottoms." (Much
laughter.)
3lr. ELLICE opposed the 'lotion, and thought, before this
country thought of competing with foreigners, the Right Honour-
abe Gentleman and his colleagues ought to begin at the foun-
dation, and put the price of labour in England on a footing
with its price in other countries, by repealiud the Icom-laws.
If competition was the object, he thought for some time it was idle
to expect it, but he hoped that it was not quite without expectation.
The Reciprocity Duties Bill had been rejected, both by France and
America; he hoped that hereafter some better policy would pre.
veil with those countries.

Mr. LI'TTLETI IN said that the arguments by which the
course Government meant to pursue was defended on that Light hid
made such an impression upun
Mr. ELLIS wished the Right lion. Gentleman to state whether
there would not be some allowance to the manufacturer for the
stock in hand.

Mr. WHITMORE said, notwithstanding the respect he felt for
the arguments he had heard from the Hon. Mianbers for Taunton
and Coventry, they went but a very short way in convincing him
that the measure originally proposed by his Majesty's Government
was imperfect. Still, however, he felt very grateful to the Govern-
ment for the considerate course they had adopted on this occasion.
Mr. BARING and Mr. HUME trusted that some allowance
would be made to the manufacturer oq the stock in hand.
Col. DAVIES said, as the drawl's& was allowed on exported
silk, why not on that forborne consumption ?
Mr. BUTTERWORTH and Mr. HALGIMAND jointly ex-
pressed their hope that some relief would be administered to these
who held manufactured goods.
Mr. WILSON thought it not quite fair to press Government
further upon the question of allowance to the manufacturer on
stock in hand.

Mr. PHILIPPS suggested the expediency of taking off the duty
on the dying materials.
Mr. Ald. HEYGATE slid that the danger was only put off for
two years, and therefore it was the duty of the silk manufacturers to
look to the danger.
Mr. HUSK ISSON stated, that ha did not see his way clearly
through the difficulty suggested, of allowance to the manufacturer
on the stock in hand. If it could be suggested, he would willingly,
as in equity he was bound to adopt such a suggestion.
Mr. ELLIS suggested the House should not divide.
The question was then put, and the original motion carried with.
out a division.

31r.liffikiSSON said, that ha proposed to take the resolution
upon wool without discussion at present.
Mr. WORTLEY acceded to this preposition.
Mr. BIJSKIBBON, in reply to a question from Mr. Bright,
said, it was intended the duty should its taken off on the sth July.
The resolutions were then proposed and agreed to.
The proposition for repealing the duty on coals was thee put.
The repeal of the bounties on linen wu then proposed and

Colonel DAVIES asked if it was intended to place a duty on the
importation of French gloves. Ills constituents were much inter-
ested in this qtowtion.
Mr. H USK ISSON thought his eematiguents would he quite Wis.
fled with the duty intended to be placadbn gloves, vs per cent.
Mr. HUME Inquired when the bounties were to expire on whale
fishery
Mr. HUSKISSON said they would all expire next year.
Mr. BROODEN, on the Howse having resumed, brought up
the report.
The other Orders of the Day were then read.
GAME BILL (bECOND READINO).
Mr. S. WORTLEY postponed theiecond reading of this Bill
till Thursday next.
QUALIFICATION OF JURORS.

The second readiniof this Bill Was postponed till to-morrow.
GA( REGULATION BILL.
On the motion of Mr. Secretary PEEL, the House went into a
Committee on the Gaol Regulation &IL
The report was brought up, and ordered to be taken into further
consideration on Friday next.
WEIGHTS AND MEASURES.
The House went intoa Committee on the Weights and Measures
Bill.

report ordered to be received to-morrow (this day.)
the Soutl) American Postage Bill was read a third time and
passed.
CATHOLIC BURIALS IN IRELAND.
Mr. OOULBURN gave notice fur his Hight Hoe. and Learned
Friend, the Attorney-General for Deland that he should postpone
his notice of motion for the introduction of a Bill respecting burials
in Ireland, from this day
until this da se'nnight.
NATIONAL DEBT.
Mr. HUME moved for a return of the average price of the pub.
lie funds since the year 17tH, as far u the ptncliases of the (,am.
miosioners for the reduction of the National Debt would 'hew,—
Ordered.

Mr. HUME also moved for the amount of the dividends of
saved by the reduction of the S per cents. to 4 per cent., and the
amount of the capital given by way of bonus on that retbaction,
and the permanent dividend thereon.--Ordered.
The other orders of the day were the di posed of, and the Howse
adjourned at Otie o'Clock.

MYFICES OF MOTIONS THIS DAY.
1. Mr. Goulburar—lfill to amend Tithe Composition Act of last
Session.
2. Mr. Maherly,—Motion on the Laws relating to Beer and ]halt.
ORDERS OF THE DAY.
1. Recovery of Penalties Bill ;—Committee.
2, Cattle 111-treatinton Bill ;--Catandetee.

A LIST OF THE MINORITY
Of 24 who noted for the (:lose proposed by Mr. thane to prevent
Flogging of Soldiers.
Allen, J. ill. Moberly, J. Ridley, Sir M.W.
Bennet, ILO. Mabcrly, W. L. Smith, J.
Brougham, H. Martin, ,T. Smith, W.
Brown, D. lioncka. ill• Sykes, D.
Buxton, T. F. Palmer, C. Welk", J.
Evans, W. l'owlet, 1100. J. F. Wilson, Sir R.
Gordon, R. Itamiden, J. C.
Orattao, J. Rice, T. S. TELLES.
Ilutchinson,lln.C.ll. Itamsbottom, J. J. llume.