Northern Times.
Liverpool, Merseyside, England, 1859-05-12 00:00:00

SPECIAL COUNCIL.

A special meeting of the Town Council was held in the
Town-hall, at eleven o'clock, yesterday, for the purpose of
taking into consideration the report of the special committee
upon town improvements. The Mayor, Wm. Preston, Esq.,
presided.
Before the proceedings of the day were gone into,
Mr. Steains asked permission to correct an error which
had been made in the nomination of a churchwarden for St.
Luke's church. Mr. Beets was desirous of retiring, In
consequence of ill-health, and it was decided that the name
of Mr. Samuel Abbott should be substituted. By an error,
however, this had not been done, and the name of Mr.
Beets was continued. He therefore moved that permission
be given by the council to correct the error, and substitute
the name of Mr. Abbott.

The motion was agreed to

The council then proceeded to consider the report of Ow
special committee, which, having been printed and circa.
lated, was taken as read.
Mr. Earle said, as the committee were desirous of havirq
the fullest aid and information from the council, he move(
that the council go into committee fur the purpose 'of 'con.
sidering the subject.
Mr. Alderman Bennett seconded the motion, which was

agreed to.
The following letter on the snhjeet was read

To the Mayor, Alderm

en, and Members of the Town Council of t
Borough of Liverpool. _ .

in November last, pray!!l

DU of the Pur

with a view to the formation of a p
(as the parties who were chiefly i.
memorial) again to crave your att

:1 for ordinary bail
remainder should be kimilarlyilispo

t will l

hat could possibly happen to tlu
working classes generally, and particularly to those resident at the
south end of the town. With regard to the proposed boulevards,
we do not presume to offer any opinion, further than to express
our hope, that if either of the two plans are carried out, it may b(
the one nearest to the town, which, if embracing a large opei
space at each extremity, the Parliament Fields being the souther'
terminus, and a similar public park and p!ay-ground at the norti

4Bne of the great

and teithin

far as West Deby

offer to the resicieir
wealthy inhabitants

dvantages such an undertaking may
outskirts of •ti.e.fown, and to the
it would be altogether too far re-

moved from the-dw

the information aff

far their use or benont,
sided us whilst obtaining signatures to
1, that we ' —.resent the general

the former memor,.., rairly
feelings of the working men of. Liverpool, we venture mo:
humbly and respectfully to submit this expression of our wam
and wishes to the favourable consideration of your honourabl
Council.

Mr. Earle said he differed with the opinions expressed in
that letter. A good part of the nearer boulevard was
already encumbered with buildings, and would not have
anything like the appearance which the outer boulevard
would have. The Borough. Engineer had stated the ad-
vantages of the two, and he (Mr. Earle) thought those of
the outer were greatly preponderating. On the 4th of
April last, there was a very long article in the London
Times which began by stating, " We want a new London."
Now that, he thought, was the case with Liverpool. They
would want a new Liverpool before many of them knew
where they were, and he, therefore, thought it was high
time that some steps should be taken for the improvement
of the town. (Hear, hear.)
Mr. Alderman Gardner was glad Mr. Earle approved of
the plan he had mentioned. It was against Mr. Earle's
own interests, but he believed it to be for the public advan-

It would be a very important plan for drainag,

Eight, or ten years ago
adopt No. 2, but he the

-should have been very happy-t
it it quite impossible now. N

one could erect a resident

Al, with any hope of bein

secured himself by buyina. large property all round. II
much preferred the outer aulevard.

Mr. Bennett said, in order that they might have some-
thing before them to discuss, he begged to move that the
plans, as laid before them that morning, and more
particularly that portion comprised in the outer boulevard,
be referred back to the improvement committee, and to
report further upon, on the score of practidabilty and
expense, so that they might have it before them in a more
complete form than it was at present. lie considered, with
his friend Mr. Gardner, that it was an important feature of
the whole scheme that, to go nearer to the town with the
boulevard would be short-sighted policy. The advantages
of the outer boulevard were many. In the. first place, it
would be for many years rural, which one placed nearer by
half a mile to the town would not. Again, it formed the
natural area of drainage, and it was this important feature
of drainage that first suggested it to the favourable con-
sideration of the borough engineer. As regarded the
memorial which had just been read, he regretted that the
parties writing it did not take a larger view of the subject.
The streets along the outer boulevard would be wide and
open streets, and would yield great pleasure to those
walking along. it; and, no doubt,rthere would be many
omnibuses starting along the margin of the boulevards, so
that, for a trifling sum, they would be able to get into the
most pleasant part of the country..
Mr. Gardner said he' had great pleasure in seconding

the motion

Mr. Hodson said he differed entirely from Mr. Bennett,
aid asked if his motion would eschew entirely the boule-
vard No. 2 ?

The Town-clerk said it would not bind the council to

any thing

Mr. Frodson said it struck him very forcibly, that if
they were to have a boulevard round Liverpool, it was more
for the classes in the centre of the town than those in the
outskirts ; and a great object of the improvement committee
was a sanitary one, and he thought that the nearer these
boulevards were to the town, the more conducive would they
be to the health of the people ; and he hoped as any expence
gone to in this matter would have reference to that subject,
that it would be secured. But as he was anxious to hear
the opinions of other gentlemen who had given the subject
a fuller consideration, he would refrain from making any
further remarks till the discussion was further advanced

Mr. Gladstone said he could see no objection whatever to
the consideration of the report being referred back to the
special improvement committee. There was no doubt that
the report contained "some most valuable suggestions, and
not only valuable, but absolutely necessary, because he quite
agreed that the period had arrived when some very important
changes were necessary in the construction of their streets.
He would only now remark upon one suggestion contained
in the report, and to which he had hitherto taken exception,
and after some reflection he remained of the same opinion
still with reference to it. It was in regard to the Moll
level bridge. It was not now the time to go into that par-
ticular branch of the subject. On some future oc-
casion it might be necessary for him to do so.
When that idea was first mooted, it wa

confinec

and regarded as a 'matter of local interest, imme
diately affecting those who had property in the immediat
vicinity of this proposed bridge. But if the suggestion wa
to be entertained by the council, and the work to he carrie
out, then it became a matter of general interest, because i

would have to 'be paid for out of the rates. And
could not satisfy his mind that Toxteth-park distriei

for instance, would be satisfied to be called upon to contribut
some £lOO,OOO for the purpose of carrying out this object
but be that as it might, it was his own individual opinion
and he might.be mistaken, they should be very glad to have
the whole matter quietly discussed, for the purpose o
ultimately seeing what plan was the best to be carried out.
He presumed the course would be for the committee to go
veryclosely into the recommendations of the report, and when
they had finished their operations, make a special resolution
to that council, pointing out any alterations and improve-
ments which they thought were specially required But to
advise that council to take up a scheme
involving
a million
and a half of money, without giving the council and the
people time- to consider it irf all its details, would be
perfectly futile. The recommendations should he placed
before the public, that .they might fully consider them.
Then, when the council would take up the whole subject
again, they would be in a position to have before them the
opinion of the community as to what was really desirable.
It would again be one particular point in this subject,
while they were all indebted to Mr. Earle for the
trouble he had taken on this subject (hear, hear), he
did hope that whatever. was done with any land, the
principle of payment,. where property was taken,
they should be able in some shape to make the pro-
prietors of such property bear a portion of the expense.
(Hear, hear.) Because really, if the people were alone to
be looked to to bear this expense, he thought those having
property, which might be rendered two-fold valuable by
the carrying out of the plan, ought to pay some proportion
of the rate. Ihe hoped some such basis of calculation as
would secure this would be adopted. (Rear, hear.)
Mr. James Holm° said he could not quite agree with the
resolution proposed by Mr. Bennett He thought a middle
course might be adopted, which would give more satisfac-
tion to the public at large. He suggested that a boulevard
running by,- what might be looked upon as the future boun-
dary of Liverpool. The two points were—one, the great
,e ann;i
mkt
boundary road being made by Lord Derby, and Mlet-lane,
on the 'North end and Ullet-lane at the Southiel d
would not do to bring this matter before the public,
them at once for the money. If they could accomplish one
of these boulevards, they would accomplish a great object
for the town.
Mr. Anthony said, if the outer boundary plan was earrici

'out, he thought that 'West Derby, and the rural district of
West Derby, would most likely join in some part of the
drainage. A health committee was about to be formed for
the districts of West Derby, Stanley, and Tuebrook. If
that committee should be formed, the council might consult
then on the subject. _ _ _

Mr. Acison said, there was no one going from Liver-
pool into Toxteth lark but would be struck with one fact,
the great mistake of former councils not having purchased

that —valuable land on the west side of the Park-road, and
thereby securing one of the most beautiful parks that any
town could possess. He believed the corporation might
have purchased it, some years ago, at a trifling. sum, from Lord
Sefton. But many people now living would say that, they
would then have have thought it madness to parchase land
• for a park so far out of Liverpool. He was inclined to
think with Mr. James Holme that, an intermdiate course
might he adopted. Boulevard No. 2, would be, in a few
years, to all intents and purposes, a portion of the town, and
if they went a little further it would retain its rural
character for many years to come. It would be unwise in the
council to seek to carry out such schemes as were laid down in
the report without giving the town of Liverpool some
opportunity of speaking on the question. Ire thought it
was of the greatest importance that there should be a con-
siderable delay, to allow the scheme to be well discussed by
the people.
Mr. Mozley thought the object of 'die_ committee had
probably been mainly attained by the ventilation of the
plans. lie believed they were met

:en their hands

'hey on

by giving a sanction

) their Proceeding.:te obtain some inc4e Matured and defi

nite plans

•;e improvements were

ie time had arrived wk

undoubtedly

grapple with the subject in it bold and comprehensive
scheme. (Hear, hear.) At the present moment, any
opinions they were enabled to 'form, 137 ere necessarily of too
crude a nature to permit the council to embark in any
specific scheme. He therefore trusted that Mr. Bennett
would shape his motion so as to refer back the whole
subject to the committee, to hring-sorne matured

it the followin

Resolved, that 6

ornmittee, comprising the report of the borough
engineer, be referred to the committee, with instructions to
reconsider the whole subject, and to report to the council,
as early as possible, what improvement they would recom-

and defir

ings of tl

mend for adoption."
Mr. Gladstone presumed it was distinctly understood that
in dealing with the matter in this manner the council
would not be bound to any specitie plans. (Hear, hear.)
Mr. Aikin supposed it would be distinctly understood
that, while the committee would have the consideration of
the whole subject referred back to them, they would not be
confined to the consideration of the present proposals, but
that it would be in their province to entertain the question
of other improvements, although not mentioned in the
plans. (Hear, hear.) There was a great deal of informa-
tion to be laid before the council and the committee before
they could venture to propose any plan of a definite
character. He thought it was hardly respectful
to the many thousands of memorialifts, who addressed
the council some time ago respecting Parliament-fields.
(Hear, hear.) To that subject he trusted some consideration
would be given. (Hear, hear.) Re hoped it would not
be ignored, but that the whole subject would be gone into;
and, when the committee had fully informed themselves,
that then they would come before the council again, not to
.•

ay a sc

,
upon the table for the council's guidance.
,
Mr. Graves was quite sure there could be no difference
of opinion as to the propriety of adopting, if not all, at
least many of the suggestions embodied in the report of the

came before the council again, it would come on as a
question of expen3e mainly, and that that would be the
most difficult point they would have to deal with. (Hear,
hear.) The most important items in the report were the
boulevards ; and it struck him that, if ever they were to be
carried into effect, it must be by a combined action on the
part of the council and of the landlords through whose
property they would run. (Hear, ' hear.) In referring it
back to the committee, he hoped the council would give
them power to confer with the landlords to whom he had
referred.

The Town-clerk said that power was already in the hands
of the co:nmittee.

Mr. Bennett did not see how they could possibly get at
the expenses in any other way. He was speaking lately to
a very large landowner, Mr. John Shaw Legh, who told
him that if the boulevards touched any portion of his
land, more or less, he would freely give it. (Cries of
" hear," and cheers.)
Mr. Ald. Cooper said, before the council became com-
mitted to any particular scheme, he should wish to see
how the money was to be raised for the purpose. (Hear,
hear.) Mr. Gardner had said that the first scheme might
be made available for a large system of sewerage. He (Mr.
Cooper) had had some experience in sewerage for the out-
skirts, and he was aware that they could sewer—and make
a very grand sewer for the the Newsham House estate—
without going to any expense of boulevards. He quite
agreed with Mr. Gladstone, that if they improved the pro-
perty of the landlords the landlords ought, for their own
interest, to deal liberally with them. If one of
the boulevards went through an estate of his,
he thought he should be • inclined— although not often
very liberal —to be a little liberal in such matters.
(Laughter.) He thought his own interest would induce
him to do so, but nothing else would. (Hear, hear, and
laughter.)

Mr. Jeffery said, he simply rose to set the council right
lest they should be under a wrong impression. Mr. Cooper
had said that he knew something about the mode of draining
the Newsham-house estate. It would he gratifying if Mr.
Cooper had gone a little further, and told them what it
was, for he (Mr. Jeffery) had directed his attention to that
subject yesterday, with the borough engineer, and the latter
distinctly told him that there were no means whatever of
draining the News%am Hodse estate at :a less cost than
£12,000, unless some such project as one of the proposed
boulevards could be carried out. (Hear, hear.) Now,
if Mr. Cooper knew of any other plan, unknown to the
borough engineer, it would be very satisfactory that he
should inform the council of it. (Hear, hear.) It was of
the utmost importance that the committee should proceed
with the greatest possible despatch. It would be observed
that there was a suggestion that North John
street should be continued through Atherton-buildings.
Now, he understood that Atherton-buildings had changed
hands, and unless steps were taken immediately, it would be
too late, for some expensive buildings would be placed upon
that site. (Hear, hear.) Unless the committee determined
what they would propose to do, and how they would do it,
and that speedily, every year would increase their difficulty,
and would raise some new obstruction in the way of their
carrying out the improvements, thus producing, perhaps,
irreparable injury to Liverpool. (near, hear.)
Mr. Cooper said, he had had some conversation with Mr.
Newlands in reference to the matter, and he was still of
the opinion that he had expressed, that the whole matter
could be done withoht going to all the expense of boulevards
or anything else. Still, he would not say that it could be
done without cost.

Mr. Job said, the approache3 to the river of such a great
seaport town like Liverpool, formed part of the natural
promenades for boulevards. The motion now before thecouncil

the opinions now expressed upon it, I take as a recognition
of that principle. The details have been an open question, and
I think that we should not be committed to either the first
or the second of these boulevards. lam glad to see that
the council has recognised these plans. I think the filling
up of the George's Dock Basin would be of great benefit to
the town. As it stands at present I think it a disgrace to
the town. Its present state is most unhealthy, and most
unsightly. If the committee could effect that improvement
it would confer a great benefit on the town.
The—Town-clerk said, one point that the committee
were to consider was the means of improving the approaches
to the pier-head and landing stages.

- --
Mr. R
yley thought if the matter was to be postponed
from time to time it would not be effected. If they expelled
a number of the poor population out of their present houses,
they would have to go somewhere, and if proper habitations
were provided for them it would be found that they would
require a very large area to accommodate them, and then
ground now unoccupied would be taken up. He hoped,
if the matter was referred back to the eommittee, that they.
would act as promptly as possible, as there was not one
moment to lose. They would have to pay a rate, no doubt ;
and he had no doubt but that the public out of doors would
see the necessity for such an improvement.
Mr. Steaius said be had no intention of saying a word on
the subject when he entered the council room, as he would
rather listen to the opinions of others than to offer any
opinion of his own. At the present time, however, any one
could see that buildings were springing up weekly, almost
daily, and what could be at present done for £12,000 would
soon cost £50,000 or £OO,OOO.

Mr. Dover said he could not allow the subject to pass
without making an observation on it. lie would like to ask
Mr. Earle-

Mr. Earle : Speak up. (Laughter.)
Mr. Dover said he was only asking. Mr. Earle to give him
the same credit in the matter he had given him, and not to take any of his remarks as applied personally. He knew he I
Was going to take rather an unpopular side of the question, i