Northern Times.
Liverpool, Merseyside, England, 1859-04-08 00:00:00

.-. • . .
present state of the dookyartZs
.is described House of Commons were allotted to them, is as
!
as peculiarly favourable to their construe- follows :
tion. The four iron-plated ships whit.' France
is building are each to have 36 heavy guns, to throw Proportionately
31st March,
to Estimated Proportionately to me mean of the
an 801 b. hollow percussion shot. The naval men: of populationonthe a. to amount yry.po_rtionately
Numbers
t Revenue from
France assert that in ten yeras time ships of the lint? in the Two Fore-
will have become obsolete. France and England ,
have an equal number of line of battle ships-29 in Ens-land.. ..... 447 514 • 480
both cases. We are building 21, and France 11. B"tland • 71 74 73
Ireland ...... 136 66 101
England has 26 frigates complete, and 8 building ; _
France 34, and 12 building; while 17 of-our frigates Total of the! 654 I 654 1 654
are screws, the French have only 15. Our sailing U. Kingdom L....
ships number 296 ' • the French 144. These results bear a remarkable approximation to
The trial of the Phcenix prisoners in Belfast has
concluded for the present. There being no probabi-
the actual state of the case, much more so, pro-
lity of the jury agreeing to a verdict, they have been baby than than there is generally any idea of. For it
discharged, and the prisoners have been required to happens that England has 467 members ; Wales,
renew their bail, and will stand their trial next 29 ; Scotland, 58 ; and Ireland, 105,—numbers
assizes. • , , i, ~ , • ,

The usual weekly Meeting of the health committee
was held yesterday. The medical officer of health
reported that the deaths registered in Liverpool
last week, were fewer than in any week since the
midd eof 1857. A deputation from Glasgow waited
upon the committee for information as to the sani-
tory arrangements of the town, which being sup-
plied the committee were thanked.
The Assizes were concluded yesterday, and in the
case of the Rev. C. P. M'Carthy v. Murney, for
slander, the jury gave a verdict for the plaintiff for
fifty pounds damages.
The Wallasey Commissioners held their usual
monthly meeting last evening, at which Dr. Parr
took Mr. Pooley to task, for some reflections he had
made on gentlemen of New Brighton, at the last
meeting. The matter did not come to a lengthened
discussion, as Mr. Pooley did not seem inclined to
enter upon it again. Some general business was
transacted, which will be found reported in another
column.

Yesterday, an inquest was held at Mr. Crafter's,
Derby Arms Hotel, Rock-ferry, on the body of a
boy, who died on board the reformatory ship Akbar,
under what is considered at present strange circum-
stances. The boy was ill, from his admission, on
the 19th February, until his death on Monday, and
it appeared that he was " stripped" on Sunday, by
what has been sworn to be "six cuts of a cane over
his trousers." 'Whatever the cause of death may turn
out to be, the case has caused some excitement, and
all sorts of rumours. It is not our duty, nor inclina-
tion, to say more at present, as the case is still
pending, and the inquest has been adjourned to
Tuesday next. We publish the details to-day as
far as they have transpired.
Another case of " Life in Hotham-street," will be
found in our Police news this day. It is a
pretty quarrel as it stands, and no doubt,
will frighten some one with a " silver shop "
some where or other in the " good old town."
We fear, as Mr. Mansfield said, "that gentlemen,
who frequent such houses,' do strange things now
and then, probably forgetting the commandment,
Thou shalt not steal."

REPRESENTATION-POPULATION -
TAXATION.

WE have had so much of this combination of
subjects lately, through the long debate on the
Reform Bill, that it is not with any wish to enter
again, thus early upon their discussion in theory that
we now refer to them, but only to make a very feiv
passing remarks on one or two practical points, as
brought out by a Parliamentary paper, relating
thereto, which has been issued within the last few
days, and which produces some rather curious calcu-
lations respecting it.
The paper we allude to is a return of the present
estimated population of England, Scotland, and
Ireland, according to the most recent data possessed
by the Registrar General, and the total amount of
revenue derived from taxation in England, Seotland,
and Ireland respectively, for the two years ending
Dec. 31, 1858, under the departments of Inland
Revenue, Customs, and Post-office ; showing, also,
the number of representatives which each` of the
divisions of the United Kingdom would have if the
654 members of the House of Commons were allotted
to them-1, proportionately to such population;
2, proportionately to such revenue ; and 3, propor-
tionately to the mean of such population and
revenue.

These results bear a remarkable approximation to
the actual state of the case,—much more so, pro-
bably, than there is ge.nerally any idea of. For it
happens that England has 467 members ; Wales,
29 ; Scotland, 58 ; and Ireland, 105,—numbers
which do not differ very widely from those which are
given above, as proportionate to the mean of the
united estimates of population and revenue from
taxation .

Such calculations as these, and their issues, are
not only interesting, but valuable, in enabling one to
come to right conclusions on the great question of
Parliamentary representation. Under such a
system as ours, it is of most momentous conse-
quence to keep closely and carefully in view, the
preservation of that security which is sometimes
called the balance of the. Constitution, —the political
equilibrium of the State ; and which is found to be
effected by two contrivances,—a balance of power,
and a balance of interest. This balance of power is
to be secured, by taking care that there shrill be no
influence possessed by one part of the Legislature,
the abuse or excess of which may not be counteracted
by some antagonist influence, existing in another
part; while the balance of interest, which goes along
with, and gives efficacy, to the balance of power,
is to be obtained by such a disposal and adjustment
of the respective interests of the three Estates of the
realm, that if any one of them should attempt an
encroachment, the other two should unite in its
resistance. Yet these means of promoting checks to
secure the requisite equilibrium, cannot but be
affected by those very elements of Parliamentary
representation at which we have here hastily
glanced. And the calculations which such statistics
as those referred to afford are so valuable for the
purpose, that one's deep regret is they are not
furnished in greater completeness.

BANKRUPTCY AND INSOLVENCY : DEBTOR

Now, as regards population. That of England
is set down at 19,836,610 ; that of Scotlond at
3,139,860 ; and that of Ireland at 6,020,423,
thus showing the population of the United Kingdom,
to be now close upon twenty-nine millions ; which,
is a large increase upon that of the census of 1851,
a fact which is not to be overlooked, more especially
in connection with the character of such increase, in
any scheme for the extension of the elective fran-
chise. Then as to revenue from taxation. The
aggregate amount, it appears, in the two years ending,
December 31, 1858, was £103,493,844 for England,
£14,918,234 for Scotland, and £13,227;457 for Ire-
land,—Scotland, although containing little more
than half the population of Ireland, producing
a greater amount of revenue from taxation,—yet
both Scotland and Ireland, of course/ falling very
far short of England, even in proportion to their
amounts of population respectively. Thus, however,
do population and taxation stand towards each
other, in the three several divisions of the United
Kingdom.

AND CREDITOR.

THERE is a very close connection between these
two terms. If there were no such relations as those
of Debtor and Creditor, there would be no such
issues as those of Bankruptcy and Insolvency. The
former are the means through which the latter arise.
It is very much a matter of cause and effect. To be
bankrupt is to be in debt beyond the power of
payment ; and to be insolvent is to be unable to pay
one's debts,—which is much the same thing. They
combine, therefore, to constitute one great subject,—
great in any state of society where credit prevails,
and debt of necessity is incurred; but more especially
in a commercial country, under such circumstances,
since it is a system on the integrity and good faith
of which its prosperity so much depends.
It is a subject on which, of late years, there has
been a great deal of legislation ; and still is more
required. That improvements in the law have
thereby been effected, cannot be denied; yet is. the
law very far from faultless, after all. What EDMUND
BURKE said upon the subject, now nearly a century
ago, is still in great part true. " There are' two
capital faults in our law," was his remark, "-with
.relation to- civil debts : One is, that every man is.
presumed solvent ; a presumption, in innumerable
cases, directly the reverse of truth. Therefore the
debtor is ordered, on a supposition of ability and
fraud, to be coerced his liberty until he makes
payment. The next fault is, that the inflicting of
that punishment is not on the opinion' of an'
equal and public judge, but is referred' to
the arbitrary discretion of a private, nay interested
and irritated individual: He who formally, is, and
substantially ought to be, the judge, is in reality no
more than ministerial, a mere executive instrument
of a private' man, who, is at once judge and party."
Now both. those " capital faults" have since
BURKE'S day,—within. a comparatively few. years,.
indeed,—in some considerable degree been. corrected.
Our bankruptcy laws remove all risk of the:debtor's
being " coerced his liberty," except for gross fraud ;
and our Insolvent Courts afford' he•means.of release
from such. coercion, save for such delinquency, or .
something of a similar character. Still there is a,
great deal of power left in the hands of " a private,
interested, and irritated individual." The debt itself
is not a crime, or the inability to pay it, of itself,,
necessarily so ; but they are rendered such by cir-
cumstances ; and these circumstances, it' is, that
constitute that for which alone the punishment of
imprisonment is due, and the power, and the
discretion of inflicting which ought-not, either in
justice or humanity, to rest in anywise, either
directly or indimectly, with any private and partial
man,. but only with " au equal and public judge."
Creditors have a. right to be protected against fraud,
and everything of the nature of fraud, involving, as
of necessity it must, great and often, aggravated loss.
'But they who have been guilty of no fraud, or any-
thing approaching thereto, certainly ought not to
be regarded, for however temporary a purpose, in.
'the same light as fraudulent, while they are but
unfortunate insoNents.

Numbers must necessarily have to do with any-fair
scheme of popular representation,; although, at the
same time, their amount must be- adjusted, their
influence modified, by other elements. With the
elements of property and educa.ian we have nothing
at present to do, because neither one nor the other
is noticed in the Parliamentary returns on which we
are remarking. But these both constitute very
important influences, and camnever, with. v.,dvant age,
be denied their full weight in any representative
system. Pass we on, then, to.taxation. The revenue
from taxation we have already mentioned ; and its.
proportion to the population of each, division of the
United Kingdom. Now taxation is; n thing which
has a very peculiar connection with. representation,
inasmuch as it is through this representation, in, the
House of Commons, that it is, constitutionallT en-
forced. Every law which, by the remotest con-
struction, may be deemed to levy money upon the
property of the subject, must originate, that is, must
first be proposed, and assented to, in the House of
Commons ; by which regulation, accompanying the
weight which that assembly possesses in all its
functions, the levying of taxes is almost exclusively
reserved to the popular part of the Constitution, the
members of which, it is presumed, will not tax
themselves, or their fellow-subjects, without being
convinced of the imperative necessity of the
aids which they grant. And besides so im-
posing the taxes, the Commons watch their
appropriation with the same judicious care and
economy as they do the imposition of them. To the
House of Commons, as the representatives of the
people, has the expenditure of all the taxation to be
accounted for. And these well-known facts,—which
we only repeat for the purpose, of the occasion,—
certainly show in how close a relation taxation stands
to representation.
present,haLveet shown
uh sowsene,
practicallyt
then, how how the representation is, at
it bears
to
dbypothpeulaptrioopno, ratinodn
tie
revenue from taxation. We find by the Parliamen-
tary paper before us, that the number of representa-
tives which each of the divisions of the United
Kingdom would have it the. egg 'members of the

Two new attempts to make further improvements
in the law on this subject are now before Parliament,
—one having originated in, and having now passed,
the House of Lords, the production of the, LORD
CHANCELLOR; the other having been introduced in
the House of Commons by Lard JOHN RUSSELL,
where it has passed its second reading. The title of
the LORD CHANCELLOR'S measure is the Debtor and '
Creditor Bill ; that of Lord JOHN RUSSELL'S, the
Bankruptcy and Insolvency Bill. They both aim at
much the same object, thoughby somewhat different
means. The conflicting opinions which have to be
encountered, in legislating upon this subject, and
which characterise to a certain extent these two
measures respectively, have been thus stated by the
LORD CHANCELLOR, with reference to his own
measure, and its reception, bo44;11 in Parliament and
by the mercantile commun;:c-y :—" There were two
distinct classes of opinio;n which divided the com-
mercial world. One oi those was that the creditors
should have no pvwer whatever—should not be
allowed to interf
rzre with the administration of the
affairs of the Insolvent. Many persons of the highest
authority ;.,o the commercial world took that view.
Their 01;;Inion was entitled to the greatest respect,
and :could no doubt influence any one framing a
bill on this subject, and determine him to adopt the
view which persons of such weight in the City of
London represented. But if the Government had
framed the bill on their suggestions, they would
have encountered a powerful opposition by another
class of persons, who had, since 1831, when the
official assignees were first croted, insisted on the

THE NORTHERN TIMES FRIDAI, APRIL 8, liBs-§

right of creditors to have more control over the
administration of their affairs. They had been
complaining, from time to time, of being thrust out
of all interference when the Bankruptcy Court got
hold of the affairs of an insolvent debtor. Evidence
was given to a considerable extent on the subject of
such administrations before the commission of 1852,
and the commissioners appeared to have favoured
the views of that latter class. He did not, however,
mean to say the question was so clear that any
decided opinion could be formed on the subject. It
was necessary to examine what were the different
circumstances that required attention ; and in
choosing between conflicting opinions, it was the
duty of the Government to adopt that course which
they thought best calculated to do justice to the
different classes concerned." This, it is Considered,
has been done pretty fairly in the Bill which has
passed the Lords, and now awaits attention in the
Commons. Lord JOHN RUSSELL'S Bill takes a
somewhat opposite course, more especially as respects
the powers of creditors, and the system of assignee-
ship. It is not improbable that an exceedingly good
measure may be made out of the two together. And
it satisfactory, therefore, to find that bath are to be
referred to a Select Committee of the House of
Commons, with that view.
The great point, then, will now be, the composition
of the Select Committee. Lord JOHN RUSSELL has
expressed his hope, that it would consist of persons
who were fully competent, from their legal know-
ledge and mercantile experience, to came to a right
conclusion upon the matter. And no doubt this will
be the case. But then there are persons out of doors
whose mercantile experience might furnish valuable
suggestions, in dealing with such a subject for legis-
lation ; and, to secure this, it is proposed to call upon
such persons to give evidence before the Committee.
A difference of opinion upon this point has been
expressed in the House of Commons. But, as Mr.
Secretary ESTCOURT remarked, " the Committee
themselves would exercise their judgment upon' the
matter, and at any moment they thought proper
they might apply to the House for permission to
call witnesses before them." This it is, on every
account, most desirable should be done. legal
knowledge upon the question, there may be abun-
dance in the House ; and there is no doubt the
Committee will contain, a fair contribution of it.
But what is more particularly wanted is mercantile
experience ; and this is not so easily found among
Parliamentary politicians. As the SoLicizoir.
GENERAL observed, "If they accompanied the
appointment of this Committee with the power of
calling witnesses, the Committee- would' probably
proceed to examine into the whole question.
Whereas, if they allowed the Committee to wait
until they considered the channels through which
the inquiry was to run, there would be ample time
for them to come down to the House and to ask for
further power to call witnesses at that particular
stage of the inquiry," This, course, then; it has been
determined to pursue. The:whole question' will thus
be gone fully into ; and with two Bills before them,
each: of which contains something good, though
neither of them, perhaps, is yet anything like
perfect, there cannot,. one weed think, be any very
formidable difficulty in. the Committee presenting to-
the. House, for its sanction, a good Bill, cut of the
two,—and one for whi6h the' creditor, as well as the
debtor, would hereafter, let us hope, have reason to
be grateful.