Northern Times.
Liverpool, Merseyside, England, 1860-01-27 00:00:00

WAREIIOUgE, COMMITTEE.

The. ,poceedings of this committee were confirmed
vithout comment, on the motion of Mr. Hubback.

MARINE COMMITTEE.

The iiroceedings of this committee were net read.
Mr.'"MONDEL moved the confirmation of the pro-
ceedings.
Mr. FORWOOD asked how soon the telegraph aldng
the dock quays would be in operation.
Mr. HARTLEY explained that the necessary huts
would be completed in about six weeks, and by that time
the line would be ready.
Mr.*Tonrg wished to ask a question with reference to
the telegraphic communication between the two sides of
the river, which was referred to the Marine Committee,
with the addition of two members of the board. He
was in hopes that some report would have been brought
tip to-day on this subject. He was given to understnd
that they had not taken the matter into consideration in
consequence of the absence of a member ; but he thought
no time shouldie lost. The board had determined that
a communication should be made'' and :they should not
be defeated by any slight ditficulty in the way. He
could not conceive any necessity for delay. He believed
arrangements might be made for promptly carrying this
out, and he hoped the chairman of the Marine Com-
mittiee Would give them an assurance that some step in
advance should be taken before the next meeting of the
board.
Mr. MONDEL assured Mr. Tobin that he was as earnest
in the matter as that gentleman could be. The un-
avoidable absence of Mr. Brocklebank and the engineer
alOne prevented the matter being considered on Tuesday
last. It would, no doubt, be brought before the board
at the next meeting.
The proceedings were confirmed.
PILOTAGE COMMITTEE.

These -proceedings were confirmed without comment,
on the motion of Mr. Shand, seconded by Mr. Mss.

DOCKS AND QtTAYS COMMITTEE,

The proceedings of this committee stated that the
agents for the New York packets, using the Waterloo
Dock, having explained the reasons- of the non-com-
pliance with the regulations of appropriated berths, it
was resolved that the number of berths appropriated to
the New York lines be reduced from five to four.
On the motion of Mr. Smith, seconded by Mr. For-
wood, the proceedings were confirmed.

MASTER PORTERS COMMTTTEE.

The proceedings of this committee were confirmed on
the motion of Mr. Arnold, seconded by Mr. Segar.

COMMUNICATIONS.

A. letter having been read from the Rev. A. Knox,
soliciting a renewal of the annual donation of £25 to
the Birkenhead Hospital, it was resolved on the motion
of Mr. Bushell, that a donation of £5O be granted.
An application of Thomas Burgess, receiver of town
dues on goods coastwise, and of anchorage dues, wa.4
referred to the Finance Committee.

The following resolution from the Improvement
Committee of the Town Council, was submitted to the
board :—"That the sub-committee of this committee,
appointed to consider the best means of effecting the
improvement in, the approaches to the landing-stage, be
requested to confer with the. Mersey Docks and'Har-
hour .Board upon this important. subject."—Referred to
the Works Committee, and the Docks and Quays Com-
mittee.

A letter from Mr. Smithells, traffic manager of the
Lancashire and Yorkshire Railway, in reference to the
accommodation for their timber traffic, was referred to
the Works Committee.

—A
letter from Messrs. Jackson and Eastman, calling
attention to the unprotected state of the quay occupied
by them for their Westport and Galway steamers, was
referred to the Docks and Quays Committee.
A resolution of the "Watch Committee of the Council,
enclosing a report from Major Greig, as to fire-engines
being placed near the liuskisson and Canada docks, was
referred to the Docks and Quays Committee.
A memorial from the agents of steam-vessels occupy-
ing berths in the Wellington-dock, requesting the board
to place the dock on the same footing as other steam-
docks, was referred to, the Docks and Quays Committe6.
A letter was read 'from Mr. J. B. Lindsay, enclosing
certificates to prove that he had successfully transmitted
electric communications across the rivers Dee and Tay,
without a connecting wire or cable, and offering to
exhibit the• experiment at Liverpool.
Mr. BUSHELL said he thought Mr. Lindsay had
achieved an important result ; and he hoped the com-
munication would be referred to the Marine Committee,
so that Mr. Lindsay might have an opportunity of
showing whether this great invention was practicable 9r
not.

The communication was accordingly referred to the
Marine Committee.
KEEPING A CLEAR TRACK FOR TILE WOODSIDE FERRY

BOATS.

The CHAIRMAN said the next subject was the one of
which Mr. Shand gave notice last week :—" That a bye-
law be enacted, imposing a penalty of not exceeding Z 5
on any vessel which shall anchor within the limits of
the river directed to be kept open for the passage of the
ferry steamers between Woodside and the Liverpool
Landing-stage, from the Ist of October to the Ist of
March in each year."
A letter was read from the Underwriters' Association
on the subject, enclosing the report of their surveyors.
The surveyors reported that they felt confident that any
compulsory measure of the kind would be difficult to
carry out, and prejudicial to the safe navigation of the
river ; but, at the same time, they concurred in the in-
struction given to the pilots to avoid anchoring as much
as possible in the track of the ferry boats.
Mr. SHAND, in proposing his motion, said he be-
lieved a clear passage between Woodside Ferry and the
Landing-stage to be much desired; but he thought the
difficulties of accomplishing it were not sufficiently con-
sidered. However, up to this time the Pilot Committee
had used every exertion they possibly could, in order to
keep the space clear ; and so far as the pilots were con-
cerned, in all deviations from the rule laid down, they

had given the .Pilot Committee a most satisfactory expla-'
nation. He felt a difficulty in laying a penalty upon
ships, under such circumstances ; but it was the only
plan which those specially interested in the matter con-
sidered to be sufficient. His 'own opinion was, that if
they had the power, the board should prevent steamers
passing the river in dense fog. (Hear, hear.) '
Mr. Mops seconded the motion.' _ _ _

Mr. MONDEL said he had hoped' td have heard much
better grounds for passing a resolution so pregnant with
mischief.' 'He would oppose this bye-law—first, beCause
from the nature of the navigation it could not be
maintained ;, secondly, because it was the admis-
sion, .
of an incorrect principle ; and thirdly, because
he believed that it would -not diminish the danger of
crossing the river in dense fogs. file did not. think,
where the tide ran at the 'rate it did in the river Mersey,
of over 61 4 knots an hour, that the, could deny there
.
was considerable 'difficulty in handling vessels even in.
calm weather. Therefore, upon that grOund, he con-
tended, it was a laW that could not be maintained ; that
ships would get into this prohibited space despite any
rule'or regulation. Secondly, it was the admission of
an incorrect' principle. If they made a passage clear 'for
Woodside, how would they deal 'with the passage to
Seacombe ? They would recollect that the Seacombe
People petitioned thai a free passage might be kept clear
for them. 'lf to Seaconabe why not to Birkenhead and
Tranmere aLso—(hear, hear)—and if to these, why
not to every ferry on the shores of the Mersey ; and
then let them conceive how they would carry on the
trade of the port. With
‘regard to the third point, he
did not believe it Would diminish the danger of crossing
'the river in a dense fob.- For the information of the
.•
public,'. he would read the report which the Marine Com-
mittee came to 'on the subject. It was as follows :
Froni the evidence before them, your committee have de-
duced. the" folio wing conclusions :
ht. That no mark'S can be established capable of pointing
out, during the fog, to vessels. coming to anchor, or to ferry-
boats ditilag their passage across the river, the limits of any
reserved space.
2nd. That it is utterly impossible, at all times and under all
circumstances, to prevent vessels anchorng in any such space.
. 3rd. That, the prescribed track, if any, would be resorted to
by more than the. Woodside Ferry boats, and also by steam-
tugg crossing the river,'and by coastwise steamers and ships
Coming in from sea, for the purpose of turning to go alsngside
the landing-stares, and for docking; and your committee are
of opinion that this could,not be prevented by any bye-law.
4th. That the entire removal of ships frbra so large a por-
tion of the anchorage ground would increase their number
lying opposite the other ferries, and thereby materially add
to the difficulty of working them. .
sth. That the removal of the large passenger ships and
steamers further to the northward would increase the diffi-
culties of embarkation generally, and would be especially in-
' ,convenient to, if not endanger, the steamers with emigrants
to and from Ireland and elsewhere, entering and going out of
dock by night, or in thick weather, and, therefore, also be
injurious to the. trade of the port. '
6th. That your committee should, oa the whole; view with
considerable apprehension any alteration of the character pro-
posed. The expftience of twelve years proves tbat the danger
attendant upon the_ crossing of the river, under present circum-
star.C,3s, has ensured a Careful systeni of Management, which
has happily been rewarded' by, .a: singular freedom from
accident; whereas, the supposed existence of a clear passage
would tend to "increased speed and diminished.caxtion,',' and
greatly add to the danger if a collision should occur.
Under, all the circumstances, therefore, and alter very careful
and anxious consideration. of the whole subject, your c tmmittee
are of opinion that it is not ,desirable that the board should
exercise thc!.powers in question by so regulating tte mooring
and anchoring of vessels as to endeavour to provide a particular
track for the ferry steamers.

That report was made after taking the evidence of 48
parties, and giiing the subject a full consideration for
three months. Mr. Mondel then went on to show that
if a clear track were kept; the ferry steamers would not
be able to keep in it during a fog ; and quoted various
parts of the evidence in support of his views.
Mr. DARBY:3IMT: had listened with very great atten-
tion to what Mr. Mondel had said, and on behalf of the
people of Birkenhead, he would say they were very
grateful to that gentleman for his great' attention to
this subject, for the purpose of protecting their lives,
and their property also, he supposed. Now he (Mr.
Darhyshire) had consulted nautical men—old ship-
masters, lieutenants in the navy, masters in the navy,
and he believed* even an admiral in the navy was of the
the same opinion 'too, but "he felt that Mr. Mondel had
taken such a decided prejudice on the subject that there
was no possibility of turning him even if he quoted the
opinions of these persons. They knew that the pilots
were, frequently compelled to anchor in the track, at the
dictation of the masters of the ships, and that the Pilot
Committee had no power in the matter. TheTeople of
Birkenhead thereupon simply asked that power should be
taken to enforce the directions that the committee gave
to the pilots—not to anchor ships in the track when
there was another anchorage for them. In reference to
the surveyors for the Underwriters, he had . opinions
from gentlemen as competent to pronounce upon this
question as they were, and upon a review of the whole
case, he could see no reason whatever why the Dock
Board should not make the bye-law proposed.
Mr. TOBIN said Mr. Mondel, in the opposition he
raised to the enactment of the bye-law by the Dock
Board, difided his subject into three parts; one being
that, if passed, the bye-law could not be maintained.
Now it appeared the Dock Board did think it desirable
that power should be taken to keep the track open, be-
cause they some time since passed a resolution, which
was moved by Mr. Moss and seconded by Mr. Mondel
himself, that an instruction be given to the pilots that
they were absolutely ordered to avoid anchoring- all out-
ward-bound vessels, and as much as possible all inward-
bound vessels, in the track of the Woodside ferry-boats.
Having passed that resolution, it was imperative upon the
Dock Board to see that that order was not evaded is any
shape or way. That order had been found to be inoperative
in many cases ; for the pilot would say, "I cannot anchor,
there ; but if you, the master, tell me to do so, I shall
be free from all blame." The remarks of the Pilot Com-
mittee proved this, for the pilots had not attempted to
.justify the anchoring there on the ground of necessity,
but that there had been a demand from the master that
he should anchor in that particular place, and that he
could not therefore refuse to do so. New, there would
appear to have been collusion between the pilot and the
captain to evade the law, and he could give them an
instance of it. Mr. Hubbdok had informed him that
the Crescent City, belonging to Mr. Beazley, was in the
track of the ferry boats. Mr. Beazley saw her ihere,
and was much annoyed at the fact. Arrived at his
office, he found there the captain, and asked for an ex-
planation. The captain said the pilot let go anchor there
without any authority or instructions from him to do so.
By-and-bye he heard some loud conversation and found
that the pilot had arrived in his office, and had brought a
letter to the captain for him to sign ; the contents being
to the effect that the captain had sign
him to let
go his anchor in that place, because, as he stated, "if
you sign that letter, it will be my exoneration." Now,
as the captain was not held responsible, but the pilot
w
was, unless he as screened by the captain giving him
such a letter as that, the order became inoperative, and,
therefore, it was right that the board should lay hold of
the captain, and so prevent the evasion of the resolution
that they had passed. Mr. Mondel had said that it
would be impossible to enforce the law in all cases.
Granted; but the master would appear and show that he
was compelled by stress of weather, or other unavoidable
circumstances to anchor there, and then the fine would not
be inflicted. But then another objection was started, and
Mr. Mondel asked them if they kept open the track for
the Woodside boats, how could they in justice refuse to
do the same for the other ferry steamers ? The answer
was simply this—that it was necessary for one set of
steamers to run ; that the Woodside was the shortest
and most central route, and the parties from the ferries
north and south concentrated at Woodside, and 'thus
prevented the necessity for opening the track to the
other ferries during fog. But he (Mr. Tobin) would go
further, and he would say that if .the track were open
the other ferries would not avail of it, because the small
number of,passengers they would get would not com-
pensate for the extra risk they would run. Mr. Mondel
said it would be increasing danger to keep the track
open, but. if that were so, how could it be con-
sistently reconciled with the resolution, the adoption
of which was seconded by yr. Mondel himself, that the
pilots should not anchor vessels in the track ? (Hear,
hear.) It was perfectly unanswerable that a clear and open
space, if it could be maintained, must unquestionably
diminish the risk ; and although at first there might be
some difficulty, yet the water-bailiff could warn vessels
off the ground when they were in the track. He (Mr.
'Tobin) should be very sorry and extremely displeased if
any of his captains anchored in that track. (Hear, hear.)
It was not 'prudent to do so, and he was mush, annoyed
when he saw any vessels of his there.
Mr. LANGTON had not changed ais opinion as to the
inexpediency of prohibiting ships anchoring in the part
of the river referred to,; but as the Cheshire people con-
ceived that such a prohibition would promote theirsafety,
he would vote for Mr. Shand's resolution, and so place
the responsibility on the shoulders of those who bad
demanded a clear track.

Mr. SMITH considered Mr. Mondel's argument's un-
answerable.

Mr. LAIRD appealed to ,gentlemen crossing the river
when a five or six knot tide was running, whether
ferry-boat had not a better chance of hittinfs the point
She wanted if there was a clear track than 131.1 e had when.

SORTITER