The Express.
London, England, 1864-03-12 00:00:00

THE Pi:PRESS, EATUT, DAt IVtilll4l, MARVA 12, 1864.

000sidored to he part of the day schools, and so inspected.
7'he appointment of a special staff of inspectors would b.
espied's, besides which the inspectors so appointed would
be without employment for one-half the year, seeing that
the eight schools were only held during the winter months.
BANK ACT (8001'LAND) BILL.

Sir A. AGNEW asked, as was unientood, when the
above bill woe to be brought on.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER segthat the
shareholders of the Waters Bank of Socitland had made an
application respecting their note', in which the government
could not concur. In order, therefore, to give time for ex-
planations, he would Si the bill for Monday next, and on
that day would state whoa it would be proceeded wink.

lkor• a Item cumber of poor sal ho reduce the rains. Be
limed "That That the home was of embalm that it was just
sad expedient to extend to Ireland the beneficial provisions
of the Hagfish poor-law."
Themotion was seseeded by Mr. Blake, mid opposed by
Mr. Vanes, who contended that the intrude:this of the
English poor law into Ireland would be a virtual °estima-
tion of the land of that country. It we aho opposed
Sir F. Rs gate and Mr. O'Reigy, the latter of whom said
that, however much the decline of population in the sistmr
island was to be lamented, if the English law of settlement
were transplanted there the state of things in that reapoot
would be even worse than it was at preseot.
Air H. BEUGE contended that the workhouses of Ireland
Wit. well-managed institutioes, and mid that the land there
wm rated in Mumma sertion ain this country, end that
the yearly amount act expended in the 'minimal's* of-
the poor was upwards :87,030‘. He complained, bow-
ers', of the solarise of offieers, some of whom were essso7llol
for imperial purposes, and the expenses incurred for ringetra-
ties of births, deaths, and marriages, which had alimi
whatever to do with the relief of the poor, being charged
upon the poor rates.

After some remarks from Mr. Dcxwr and Sir P.
O'Baus, . .

Mr. H. HERBERT said that if the motion meant any-
thing, it meant the introduction of outdoor relief into
Ireland, as a means of checking the rapid emigration of the
people. But his belief was that the causes of the exodus
were each as would reader any legislative measure totally
inoperative. As long as there was such a vast difference in
the rate of wages between America and Inland it would be
perfectly idle to attempt to stop the tide that was now
flowing, and not °sly would the proposal be inoperative, bat
it would tend to increase and encourage rather than to
arrest emigration.
Sir R. PEEL pointed oat that it was not the came that
out-door relief was wholly unknown in Ireland, for by the
last returns it appeared that no ler than ten thousand per-
sona were in the receipt of that kind of relief. He contended
that it would be a great social error to Windup, geoarally
system which would teed to elevate those who removed '
poor-law relief above the independent allover. He
showed that the system of out-door relief is Scotland bad
proved so demorslising that a stand had been made
against it, sod the workhouse test extessively established.
The adoption of suck a plan as that proposed by
the metros would largely increase the expenditure for poor
relief in Ireland. He dad not deny that emigration from
that country had greatly inc eased, but he did deny that
it was attributable to social, bat mainly to natural mama
and the obvious temptation to the peasant of better return
for his labour than he could obtain at home. In refereace
to an assertion that discontent wee so rife in Ireland that
secret societies and brotherhoods existed, the right hou.
gentleman gave • very amusing account of the sect called the
Fenian, [which he showed to be the name of an ancient
body, who were the militia of the country. There were,
he ventured to say, few members who knew what Yemen
meant. ("Hear, " ada laugh.) Perhaps he might be
allowed to explain. (Cheers, and laughter.) In Ireland
they dealt in potatoes and romance. (laughter.) The
Fenians were a very ancient body. In • note to one of
Moore's poems " The wine cup is circling is Arras's bells."
there occurred the words, ** Fenian Fenn,the ancient
national militia of Ireland." (laughter.) It wee ion long
ago when the condition of Ireland was one of per-
fect contentment—about the third century he thought.
(Laughter.) It was as well they should know
what the history of the Fenian. was. (Renewed
laughter.) In the third century there was • king
called Cormack, who had ten daughters—(laughter)—aW
one of these married Fioni tt Crnhthall • man of inde-
pendent mean—(laughter)—who took an immense liking to
hie father-is-law, and determined to establish • national
militia, which he called after himself, Fawn or Feenii.
(Laughter.) He believed that the Fatima then were
very mediae what they were supposed to be at present.
They were moo of considerable distinction for a long period
of time, gaining all the battles of their king& At length
the time came when they squabbled amongst themeless,
they became divided into two meta and theism attacked
the other. (laughter.) At last the sovereign of the time,
whose name he forgot—(a langh)—could no longer tolerate
the dimensions in these corps, and al called in the
national army and annihilated every man. (Load
laughter.) Nis, one man he believed escaped, and lived up
to the time of St. Patrick—be moat have been a very old
man then—(laughter) -and this man recounted toSt. Patrick
the glories deb ancient Fenian* It was interesting to see
what strange people these were. Their duty was to defend
the country, but in the winter they were billeted upon
the inhabitanta. They must have been very nosey
customers if they were as noisy as the }Mans of the
present day. (Laughter.) During the autumn and summer,
, however, they had to look after themselves—they west out
fishing, ad boiled the fish they caught in big pota.
(Laughter.) They only wore • sort of pocket-haridkerchief,
which they stripped off, and bong upon a tree while
they bathed themselves. They also slept in trees
.like the gorilla of the preempt day. (Laughter.)
They were obliged to marry, not from any mereentry
consideration, but merely to get a virtuous wife. They
were bound not to insult any woman ; they were boned to
relieve the poor, and not to turn their backs or refine to
fight with nine men of any other nation. (Laughter ) There
was a most remarkable point with regard to the Fenians
which he hoped the present brotherhood did not follow—
they were obliged before they enlisted to show their ex-
treme skill in running. Their hair was long, they plaited
it round their he and were obliged to run through a
wood, the whole corps mooing after them, and if they did
not succeed in getting up a tree at • certain distance before
the rest of the corps gut to them, they could not enlist
with the Fenisas. (Laughter.) That was an authentic
account of the ancient Pecans. They bad at the present
day • brotherhood who called themselves after the
same name. and he hoped that the modern Fenians
would ratifies themselves to the amusements of their
predebssors, and would not enter into those dispute.
which in the time of Cormthal led to the annihilation
of the corps. (Laughter.) He must oppose the motion
of the hon. and learned option:lan, became he thought
it would do considerable mischief, and add three.
fold to the burdens of Ireland. The poor law of 11838 and
1847 answered the moot sanguine expectations which had
been formed of it by Sir C. Lewis and Lord J. Russell. He
had held his present office much longer than it was usual in
recant years to bold it, and be had sees much of the country.
He had Warped to admire not only the character, but
the leathern)°, and industry of the people. He
was able to appreciate inferences in that country
arising from distinctions in locality, race, sad rah-
gioo, which he was sorry to say carried the mad back to
times of impreesiou and animosity to the British government
—to times of insecurity and uncertainty, arising from the
absence of that closer political connexion sad that freer is-
tercourse which happily now subsisted between the two
countries, and which were calculated to dispel that 104110-
sitter, of prejudice which bad too long prevailed. (Hear,
hear.) The differences and difficulties of the past, would yield
more and more to the influence of circumstasses, which
were visibly tending at the present moment to develop the
national remotes and enterprise, and which, if carried on,
as he hoped they would be. with spirit and determination,
would unquestionably result in the substantial improvement
and permanent benefit of that country. (Hem, hear.)
Mr. BRIGHT urged that if the not distant future of
Ireland should present an aspect such as the chief secretary
had depicted, where the demand for labour would exceed
the supply, and high wages and general prosperity would
bs the rule, the question the home ought to put to itself
was, whether we had not arrived at • time when the
law in Ireland should be assimilated to that of Eng-
lard. There were two arguments, however, against
that—namely, that the humblest classes of Irish had
little disinclination to accept the relief of paupers, and,
as the right bon. ;aroma feared, that the proprietors of
land could sot be trusted with the administratioa of the
law so usefully and advantageously as the same clam could
be entrusted with it in thia country. That might be
so, but Eugliahmen need not be indueoced by those
arguments ; and he did not think there was any
conclusive use in favour of maintaining the differ-
epos in the law between England and Ireland.
The 000dition of Ireland was deplorable, and her
position in relation to England not dissimilar to
that of Venetia towards Austria, and of Poland towards
Russia. Is fact, it was admitted by both proaestants and
catholic* alike that the country was now more disloyal and
disaffected than at any period in her history ; sad to
illustrate the temper of the Irish mind he stated that he
bad been assured by a large landed proprietor medal in
the south of Ireland that if the Freoch were to land in
Bantry Bay to-morrow they would be received with open
arms by the surrounding population.
Sir J. WALSH said that the debate had been carried on
with singular moderation until the hon. member for
Birmiogbam had risen to sow dimension in the house. He
regretted to find that after every Irish member bad spoken
in • conciliatory spirit, an English member should stand up
and speak as the boo. member for Birmingbati had spoken.
He (Sir J. Walsh) would characterise the speech of that
hon. member as the most inflammatory and the moat
marked by the 'pint of d son he had ever heard in
that house. (Oh, oh.) He coo d remember the late Mr.
O'Connell, but he had never heard bim use such inflam-
matory observations ; besides, which be had begged the ques-
ting from the beginning ; as he should recollect that wham
25 years since we reformed the poor-law in England we
had had long experience of it, whereas in Indeed
it was introduced for the first time. He was sorry to find
the boo. member using his eloquence to widen any breach
that might exist between the two countries.

Mr. MAGUIRE raid that the boo. member for Birming-
ham did not require any defence from him, but be must
say that he differed very much from the hon, baronet who
had just at down as to the character of that hon. member's
speech, or the intention of the speaker. He (Mr. Maguire)
believed that there were times when men were
bound to speak the truth, although when they
did so their accents sounded harsh to thou
who wished to have the truth veiled over. He wu sorry
to 'spree, his opinion that there was very great esaspera•
than amongst the people of Ireland at the pretest moment.
The right boa baronet opposite had made light of the
emigration, and bad pointed to Germany, to Western
Europe. and to Great Britain as also having their emigre-
doe. Bat what were sixty thousand a year from the mil-
lions of Englaed to the 120,000 from Ireland out of the
five-and-a-half millions which were still left la the entotry?
The stream of emigration wee flowing on day after day
with a stringer sod more impetuous current, and it was
carrying away not the idle and dissolute, but the strong and
energetic. He wished his boa. friend. embed of the vague
roulades obi* he bed pat to the house, would withdraw
hie ososebooat mot trios la a bill to using tits Wolin

poor-law in Ireland. He should be sorry to bring the law
of removal from England to Ireland, bemuse it destroyed
paseperty sad eireumscribed the liberty of the working man.
He could wish to see is Ulster aid elsewhere the same
system introduced which elated in the North of Ireland.
The tenant right system of the North of bedewed wee is his
opinion the salvatioa of the farmers of that country,
wed was the cense of the perfect agreement between the
leadlord and tenant (Haar, hear.) Is justice to those
who administered the present law he was bound to say there
wake great improvement in the conduct of the board of
guardians in Ireland. Out-door relief, however, was not
Weeded with danger, bull/nth beneficial results, sad he
Goad vie b to see the boards of guardians give that relief
more liberally than it was now given, Let sot the right
hoc. baronet (Sir B. Peal) in future, when there was dis-
tress in Ireland, poirkto the poor-law, and say the small
number of pauper+ in the workhouses wan • proof of no
distress. He knew there ware numbers of fieople
who would actually rather die in • garret or
• ditch than enter the walls of • workhouse.
He thought that Ireland would he better governed by
Irishmen ; but if that could not be the case, be trusted that
legliebnien would endeavour to govern the country io •
wise, just, aid gammon spirit.
Mr. W. S. KNOX complained of the intemperate and
offensive speech of the boo. member for Birmingham, and
denied the truth of hie statement, that if a French army
landed in Bantry Bay it would be received with acclama-
tion by the in the south of Ireland.
Mr. RIGHT said he did not make that statement. but
had quoted it from -to Irish protestant gentleman of large
Pr
r. ItNOX said be was satiated that if such an army
leaded in Bantry Bay the people of Ulster would rim as
one man to expel! the invaders.
Lord NAAS said that the hoe. member had gone back to
the history of Ireland 100 years ago, and raked up old
grievances. He depicted the country se being in a disloyal
state, and said that the feeling of the people was alienated
from England and their natural leaders, but notwithstand-
ing the long time he had been • member of that house, he
had proposed a remedy fee that state of things. No ooe
regretted more than he (Lord Nam) did the emigration from
Ireland, but he did not find that any summation had bees
made to stop it. The hoe. member for Dungarvanrid
" adopt tenant right r but where tenant right existed
animation was most rife. (Hear, bear.) The fact was that
emigration depended oa causes far beamed the reach of par-
liament or any laws, and moil those causes be included the
higher rate of wages and the greater certainty of obtaining •
competency on the other side of the Atlantic. He thought
that gentlemen who like the hon. member for Birmingham
declared before the face of the people, many of whom
ware ill-educated and illiterate, that the true cane of
to emigration was the apathy of the British parliament and
its indsposition to do anything for the poor distressed po-
pulation of Ireland, incurred a heavy responnbility. No
member who had spoken during the present seesioo, he was
satiated, had incurred • deeper or more serious responsibi-
lity in that reepect than the hon. member for Birmingham.
No doubt it was a matter of notoriety that a great amount
of disaffection existed in Ireland, but it did not arise from
anything which was done in this country, but
was caused by paid emissaries from America,
who came over to that country and endeavoured
to delude the poor people that they could saisoessfully re.
sistthe power and might of Ragland. He was far from
saying that improvements could sot be made in the Irish
poor law ; but after the full inquiry into the whole subject
by • committee two years ago, he took it that the leading
principles of that law would be maintained. He was of
opinion that they could not take a course which would more
certainly crush the people of Ireland and encourage emigre-
eioc than by extending the principles of the English poor-
' law to thatcoontry, and adopting • system of outdoor re-
lief. (Hear. hear.)
Mr. HENNESSY then withdrew his motion.
ROAD ROUND ST. JAMES'S PARK.
Sir W. FRASER celled the attention of the First Com-
missioner of Works to the state of the road round Si.
Jaime's-park, at present and for many years past, sod ex-
pressed • hope that the right hon. gentleman would take some
measures as soon as pomade to improve that thoroughfare.
He knew it was said that country members were averse
to the country at large paying for metropolitan improve-
ments, but this was an appanage of the crown, and as the
crown had 0000eded the right to the road, the least they
could do was to keep it in repair.
Mr. COWPER said, es far as he was aware, considerable
care was taken to make the road • good oat There was a
great dad of traffic upon it and it bad been in • bed state
owing to the amount of traffic and the wet weather, bat •
quantity of granite had been placed on it, and when the
roller had baba used it would be in • good condition.
The house then weal into committee of supply pro
fermi, and immediately resumed.

-1413—*AttUirnes•

HOUSE OF LORDS.-HASCH 1L
APPIALt

The Lords present ;may the Lord Chancellor, Lord Crap-
worth, Lord St. Lemards, Lord Wensleydale, Lord Chelms-
ford, and Lord Kiwis/we.

THE ATIOENIT•OENEILLL b. NOMA= JAM
HENRY HESTON ?IMO; JACO* WILLIES. DAVID WILSON,
ADD WILLIAM THOMPSON CLAIMING THE SHIP ALEXANDRA.

This is an appeal from the deoisiou of the Court of Ex-
chequer Chamber, arrived at es tlio Bth of IfisMnery,
dismissing au appeal from the Court of Exchequer. The mat-
ters which go to the anhetanee of the case are riot mailer eon-
sideratioa oo the present ocoasica, the only poet for
argument arid decision being the competency of the Court
of Exchequer to mote rules by which an appeal was per-
mated from the revenue Nile of that court to the Court
of Exchequer Chamber, and by oorteequence to their lord-
ships' home.
The Attorney-General. the Solicitor-General, the Queen's
Advocate, Mr. Locke, Q.C., sad Mr. Thomas Jones ap-
peared for the appellant; Wu H. Cairns, Mr. Kerslake,
Q.C., Mr. Mellish, C.C., and Mr. Kemplay, were for the
respondent.
The Attorney-General opened the arguments on the part
of the appellants.
The Solicitor-General followed on the same side, and at
the conalusion of his arguments the further bearing of the
cue was adjourned to Monday.

COURT OF PROBATE AND DIVORCE.
MAId 11.
(Before the Judge Ordinary.)

CARSTAINS V. cAsyrens, WILLSON, DIGGS, AND DICIENNBON.
The counsel for the respoadeuta couteoded that the seri.
dews did not substantiate the pleas ; but Do attempt was
made to prove the countercharge against the petitiorier.
Sir J. Wilde having summed up,
The jury found that the allegations of adultery with
Dickenson bad beau proved, but that the others bad Dot.
Sir J. Wilde thee proaounaed a decree nisi with costa
monist Dickens," bat le Mend Gonne against the other
00-respoodants.