The Express.
London, England, 1862-03-19 00:00:00

PETITIONS I'itir.s4ENTED.

Loral A-ERmii)NE, in preaenting -outlier Vetdiou
spited the Termed rode, said he would take the iippertnnity
et expressing frt. cirnest hopv that this intpot tant
cult questi. would continue to be the temperate
binnt which had lurked the avachwton, that had hitherto
taken place 1114 :I It. lle ran tot-II tAttttiegl tt.th the roper
whit% born mad.. in the discussiou. Vi the measure
eras fist brought fer•ved. previous I. the netting of par-
Ivanvest. tittle 11.1. xll unit et,al outcry agiiinst it. Vint
there was :he ndtgorn. obje. tion, but that appeared
to hays bet u eutirelv 411.1uthoteL tither °Ner
times which had been made had been either
showiest,' or n.oditied, nod he therefore anticipated that if
the discussion ern• continued in the owls calm and dist
part...ate writ which bad hitherto characterised it, they
would be able to rurise at some measure calculated to Iwo-
dove the dewed revolt.
Lad ffT. LTA IN.llta3 pee notice of his intention to
propose a series of msointicies on this subject.

OF HABEAS CORPUS INTO II ER MAI ESTI"S
PIassESSIONS ABROAD BILL.
The above Lill was read seemed time.
OFFICERS' COMMISSIONS BILL.

Pawl DE ORET end RIPON proponed the second reeding
ef this ball whit* bad come ap from the Commune, and
triely explained its provisions.
The bill was road a snood time.
CONSOLIDATED FUND (1:18,000,000) BILL.
This bill was also mad a second now.
OFFICERS OF THE INSOLVENT DEBTORS COURT.

Lori CHELMSFORD called the attention of the home
I. the tees of the clerks mad dicers of the late Insolvent
Court, who hail been tmusferred to the Court of Bank-
ruptcy under the act passed in the last *elision of parliament
for loncoditig the law relating to bankruptcy end insolvency
in England. The outdo and lamed lord said he felt it his
duty to brisg the matter before the public, because be felt
most strongly either that the rights of the officer; of the
late Insolvent Court had been improperly withheld, or that
• breach of faith bad been committed towards them which
aught to be repaired without delay. If wrong had been
committed the government alone were responsible for it.
Be, is somewhat pointed language, expressed an opinion
either that the Lord Chancellor, who when Attorney-
General was the framer of the measure, had neglected to
!supply himself with information relating to this matter
which was within his reach . • or if he had obtained it, had
aeglected to avail himself of it, and thus caused a great in.
insure to be dne.
The Li 'RD CHANCELLOR did not desire, having re-
ferred to the character of his position, that the noble lord
should hare used any different tone, or exhibited any dif-
ferent tanner, from that in which be bad introduced this
questiou. It must be evident to all who had beard him,
that if he pitied the clerks much, he hated the Lord Chan-
cellor mom. l Logliter nod " Hear, bear.') The noble sad
harped lord brought forward his attack, not shrinking
from charging the Lord Chancellor even a ith falsehood;
sad this was a man with whom he had been for several week.
In confidence' intercourse, Land yes the noble lord had not
before mentioned cos word of his present disclosure.
be had fait muck any communication with respect to
this malignant maault, not eves to the extent of enabling
the Lewd Chancellor. 'op itspary, to ascertain the fact', or
eyes to ens,. ptirdied with the correspondence upon the
subject. (Hear, hear.) Such was the nature of the attack,
sad their lordstuie would gather from what palmed on a
former occamon what was the feeling that had given rise to
it. la the first place he would ask what motives he could
have for envie...pit or throwing obstacles io the way of
these poor men" It would have been a pleasure and oath.
factious to him, whatever the noble lord miebt think, to
have iudolged their utmost expectations. He spoke with
ailment, mud truth, which he cared not whether the
wigs lord gave him credit for or not, when be
said that when be disco wined the circumstances it

was to him a matter of deep regret (Hair, bear.)
He denial that h., had ewer seat aseurancim to the
clerks that their &dimes weak! be paid or that the few
thee reamed were enmeshed by the 30th clause. He
bad bees desirous that should receive the ainenat
of salaries that Lad bees ebsged ea the parliamentary
rote, and the words "as merely as may be " referred
to the salaries paid by parilemene. He thee. with peat it
dignation. repudiated the dialp that is Mating a ere for
the law Alms of the seem lee had laben peas to prevent
the deem in the statute Wog ewes* seated. dedsslsg
that he weld scare* fed word, to atria the eoetewpt
be hit foe the insiauetion. Proceediag to reply to the doubts
=saabout the officers being trans/wed, he explained
sons.. that the ditikelty azme from the question
wheeler the clerks could be demised transferred till the
Men was closed. Having stated the decision at which
the law *Acme of the crows had arrived in the matter, be
rod the Letter. he hod addressed to Mr. Lew, to show that
he bed fairly stated the pashas. of the case of the aide*
mad had eimeenid his walloper to tel them in having the
eels** investigated. He explained that he had suggested
the polities to parliament, became then the matter would
be referred to • select eceendelse.whi•b erivild report on
the ease le the loom been. and that the House of
linumesee *mid thew peetelay grant cunipmeation, a
tome which they woad sot feel &Towed to
*dime without such • repeal. ho immune had he felt for
Um, bud raw. .4 these gendsoieu that he had procured
theme to be filled ap by the Treasury for their eakries,but
they, harks( to compromise their tights, had refused to
weep& them. He had amend them that co rights would
he eseqweesieed by receriviag the cheques. He regretted
mach the chums bed bees welded under a misconstruc-
tion, which be thought ought to have to-en pointed out at
the time by the ofecera of the lambent Court. He had,
Leveret, dose all is his power to remedy that error, and
could do so mace than leave the ease in the heads of their
lordship&
The Earl if DERBY said, bearing in mind the warning
giren trim by the ouble abed learned bird the woolsack the
other amid, he had refrained, and Ms no'.le (need near hint
had ref raised, trim' iuterruptiog the wibte snit Learned lord
oleo when be wee using language which ;hey were certainly
see acs-meowed to hear in that place. (Wear. bear.) He
cook! really understand that the noble :mil tainted toed felt
oessidemble irntation at the charges made against him, the
etatemmits that were made. supported by evidence, in the
powerful speech of the noble and learned lord beside him
flairil 4:helmeted). But the noble wed learusil lord must
oid, Le eurprised if persons bolding a high statiou
iadulged tbenmelves by speakieg in the mildest end
calmeet manner, but sinking use of expressions attributing
to noble turtle malignant feelings, and feelings of rankling
irritatiou, and ascribing motives, language which they
were out wen-turned to bear in that house, and which he
believed was equally 11111COILINICIS he the other house of podia.
nient - illear, boar)-- if a molds lord could make use of such
enpii •-1”1"10 in this house, end could speak of a gentleman as
sad as highly respected as Cinemissiocer
Law a. :I person who was utterly unworthy-- (Hear.)
Thn LIMRU CHANCELLOR.—The cheer prevented my
heartug the word which fell from the noble earl.
The Earl of DERBY said the words ehivh Le understood
the noble and learned lord to make use of .errs, that Mr.
Commie-ice's law was a person unworthy of entering into
say arritmosit.
The 1.4 .Oftl) CHANCELLOR—Iaid the manner in which
that correvundeoee had been used was unworthy of fur.

—.---
The Karl of I iElt 11l raid be certainly re.,oieed tabour this
corre,ki4. of the noble amd learned krd, but these who
Nat tear him certaialy esanniented on it at the time as
strear,; language. Rut he was shout tuck:, viol be repeated,
that the noble and !carted lord, if he was ill the habit, not
with sedrat feeling, hoz in the most Ivac:•I 111.1113 tr, of at.
trobsitio.. the most sordid motives to th•ee .110 were ano-
atisMl him in this house and elo. is here, the noble
sad learned lord must not be autprisol at molt a alarm
proceeding leading to corresponiLog irritative, Dor
sweat he he eurierietcl to hear those wad
motives attributed to himself. The woge and learned lord
had read a letter which he had sent to Mr. Comm/dome

low, giving ma assurance that if they rcmived their sala-
ries. that act should sot prejudice their other claims.
All he (the Earl of Derby) could say was that,
if after that lIIISUNIICO they refused to draw
their poiliiries, they acted unwirely. H.
was, Lowiiser, else cf opinion they would hay. scud
winii.; it they ahatilloortt ViLeir legal eL,iw altogether,
sad tzu.te.l wholly to their moral unit equitable claim Wag
iscoupod by the law officals of thee-rev:a. The motile mad
learord lord asked what elm could the govornoimat hairs
dace for Corm. He would tell him. They might havers,
to leri..o tot end ?Ad that a moss cousins:lima had bees
*wed on the act—a riestrudioa which was ucoer is.
Matted- that they, lout chiedy the I.onl Chancellor,
were re pousthle for have/ caused • tier tow.
pectuti.iry loos and great Forecast jib. niveuit tit e to
• usttoter getatrinee,
Fiendnai of whom htol Ittog •
sett ..t A it l p, a that though they hail so legal claim
yet it was foe their hamar, a more especially fur the
imnioial honour of the sable .tsrl learned l..rd, juntas
should lho drne to those men. (Hear, I.ear.) The amuse
which the gmersaisat ought to hare pumped—sad which
Iw h.. rd they would pumas, after what had taken Naos,
wetting aside all irritations sad moos] feeling, sad looking
may to the matte of the case—MlS to come down
to the :bon with a declaratory Lill, or 0001111
ether mourage, to remedy the defect is tho /kaki
aisprey Act. He fat confidant that io the cam
of justice sad hiiinabity the Home of Commits would with
ens mace meant to a clans which the govermunit admitted
to be founded, if sot on strict leual right, at hat as a
slows ram of tweet sad squitalble right. (Hear. hear.)
Earl h; AN VILLE mid he weer recollected an oteraiou
is which • lectors such as ant glees by the noble earl to
hie Noble mail loused Mood as tM wooloick was mere ma-
orierred. (Hoar, best.) The peat couvirmatins was
brims Ly a speech of the Debit sad learool lord opposite.
He would not cbandwriso it as violent, hit ha
eertaiely did sot mime with the betas earl that
it wee powerful. (A_ laugh.) It was a speech
of comidemble length whisk we difficult to follow, aod it
was deliepred is a toes of baster sad mow, before • huger
washer of gore than
of atiemlvd, who wand to hare
seam dews for the rupee lmaging it. It was • speech
which, if adlrereed to him Marl OntaLinlite would hare
somidersd siaristiv offeasies. Hs not feel
eat which he otherefTes';ojd hare dune,
ketither that the arcane of tbsoille eid harped lord. ow
the recheck would he thoroughly cod perfectly reinitiates.
Set say less the sobas and learned lord's toss of haateroad

sneer n.ist undesirable to be introduced iota the olisenenien, I
but hi, hole speech conveyed to their lordships that a '
(!:17id hostility existed on the part of the Lord Chan-
t.trsotssilly toward. them officers, which he knew did •
not to the aligbrest extent prevaiL
Lord CPA:WORTH said that he bad listened to •
great portion of the debate with the greatest possible Fain.
(Hear, hare) It was always a matter of regret to
hear expreseions of penned serimeny between two noble
peen, and especially when them noble lords sat
day by day administering
_imam in that,
„bnonn together
In such a case the exlidotteos we. extremely Inn"l
deeply to be deplored. He, however, treated that all these
feelings would pass away. Whoa the dales of these unfortli
nate officers was brought ender his belies he said he
would support it. because he coundend that Joni°e ought
to be done to them ; but he thought that V the governumat
mired for the appointment of a mien eastralites of the
House of Commons to consider their ease, that was all that
could well be done. It would bee mendsl to their legisla-
tion if the House of Commons bad a moment's hesitation in
setting the batter right.
Earl RUSSELL soul—l rise merely for the porpose of
answering the observations of the noble lord opposite who
appealed to the government to say that these acts have been
e acts of the government. They are acts for which the
government are responsible, and it is unjust to charge my
noble and learned friend, the Lord Chancellor, with pun-
' cular acts where he is supposed or represented to have acted
harshly. I beg you to consider what was the question whim
the go% mimetic had before them. It has been said that the
late Lord Chancellor stated that the clerks were secured the
whole of their fees which they had before received. But,
supposing the Treasury had been asked to pay as amount
equal to those fee*, and found that the fund was
wholly iosudicient, it must have obtained some
legal authority. We should have had to ask the
law officers of the crown if they were justified
in paying that money, and it the law officers said that
there was nothing in the clause to justify us in that
course, would the Treasury have been justified in paying it?
Then it would have to be considered, was the government
to bring in another bill in order to give them the power to
pay the clerks ? The government thought that that course
would not be soccer/Jul, and that the clerks would not ob-
tain what they expected. Another course then remained,
namely, that the clerks should state their case, state their
grievances, state tliassurances thee had received, and the
expectations they had entertained, on the matter being
:nought before a select committee, and the government
would have said that although we could not, after the
opinion of the law otßcers of the crown, consider this a
legal claim, yet we considered it • moral and equi-
table claim, and would have asked you to go
into all the circumstances with a view of Nabs.
fyiog that moral and equitable claim. The noble
and learned lord assumed that this committee would
be called upon to consider this question of law, but
that is not so. The question of law would not be referred
to the committee at all; for d this was • legal claim the
Diener ought to go ton legal tribureal ; but if the clerks
decline that course and consider this • moral and equitable
claim, then it becomes a question fee emsiderstion by •
committee of the House of Commons, and I believe it on
be better thus considered than by any east body. I have
always been. of opinion that the claims of lours by any
legal reform were best consulted by a committee of the
}louse of Commons. But before the imposition of • charge
on the public, the House of Commons most be 'abided of
the justice of doing so. I hope that the clerks will be in-
duced to take the course pointed out by the government,
which is prepared to support them in this as an equitable
rod mural claim.

Lord KLNUSDOWN was satisfied that in proposing this
coarse it was the intent)on of the government to support the
claim of the clerks, and he entertained the greatest hope
that what the legislature intended to do iu the matter
would be done speedily. West./
Lord itEDESDALE said that if there were any doubt as
to the equity of the claim he could easily understand the
proposition to refer the matter to a select committee of the
other house of parliament. There appeared from the con-
versatswas which had taken place no doubt on the subject,
sad if similar explanaticies were made in the other house
the artist could be settled without expense or the waste of
the namable time of members of parliament. For his own
put, be thought no further explanation was required.
--- - -

The Duke of SOX ERSEfoould assure the noble lord
(Lord Rodeo&le) that the other house was not likely to be
se restilly satilled oe this subject se his noble friend
isseolsed. Mr/ would require to have sow further infor-
matics as to the out to which the country wee to be put,
and thecirewastanses under which it was iocurred. The
fun of these bast two different returns se to the amount
of fens hitherto received by cjarks would ill4hloo the House
a Omani to look closely into the matter.
The LORD CHANCELLOR could easily understood that
be himself was in a position of some difficulty when he saw
the two returns to which reference had bens made. The
one prepared in Much set forth the amount of fees as
3,001 X. and the suheequeut return as 4,0001.
After a few words from the Earl of Dans; the matter
was allowed to drop.
Their lordships adjourned at km minutes to doe o'clock.

HOUSE OF COMMON--TuesDAT, Mica 18. I I
The Brum took the chair at four o'clock.
PRIVATE BUSINESS. 1
The Deride Railway Bill was read • third time and mend.
The reports of the committees on the following bills !
were wandered :—The Bradford Corporation Water, the
Yearibeater, Shefilekt, and Lincolnshire Railway (additional i
powers), and the Westonouper.Bare Pier Bills. 1
THE CIVIL SERVICE ESTI!! ATE&
Mr. A. SMITH gave oinks that ou Friday next, oe going
into committee of supply, be should move that the civil !
service estimates, with the exception of those for civil con-
tingencies, should is future be laid on the table of the
house within one manila after the meeting of parliament;
and the estimates for civil eoetiegescies one mouth after the
31st of March, the cad of the Anemia' year.
SLAVE TRADE PAPERS.
In answer to a question by Mr. W. Foaming, .
Mr. LAVABO said that the slave trade papers for the
year were being printed, and would be laid on the table in a
few days.
EXAMINATIONS ON ENTRANCE INTO
i WOOLWICH.
Mr. OONINCHAM. asked the Secretary of State for
War why admissions to Sandhurst were not placed on the
same footing as those to Wuolwich, namely, competitive
examitsatice.
Sir G. C. LEWIS said the answer to his bon. friend's
question was this—that Woolwich was an academy for the
education of °dicers of the Engineers and Artillery, and it
was thought desirable to obtain greater securities with
respect to the scientific attainments and intellectual ability
of the candidates fur those two services, than of candi-
dates for the line.
FOREIGN IMPORT DUTY ON SALT.
Mr. J. TOLLF-iLiCHE asked the President of the Board
of Trade what steps had been taken by the government to
put an end to the virtual prohibition against the impor-
tation of English salt into France ; and whether there was&
warped of the trade in that article being
.placed, at an
early period, on a more favourable footing, in conformity
with the spirit of the French treaty. Whether instructions
had been given to her Majesty's minister at Brussels to
exercise due vigilance in obtaining from the Belgian
government the measure of justice of admitting
Brithh trade to • full participation in any advantages
granted to the trade of any other country • whether it was
not the fact that English vessels were still excluded from
the conveyance of salt to Belgian porta, whilst France had
acquired, under her late treaty with Belgium, the right to
carry salt to Belgian ports, in French vessels, and that they
also enjoy • diax,uut of 7 per cent. on the duty of 2711.
per ton levied on French marine salt so imported into
Belgium ; and, whether the government had instructed Mr.
Mallet, of tie. Board of Trade, who is now at Berlin, to ob-
tain permission for the transit of salt through the terri-
tory of the Zollverein, with building facilities in the Zoll-
verein ports for salt, so as to mashie this country to send that
article up the large rivers into Poland and Russia, which
°gastrin are now, to a great extent, supplied with Austrian
salt.
Mr. GIBBON said in answer to the first question, which
related to the reduction of the duty on salt to be imported
into France in conformity with the spirit of the French
treaty, he wad only say the government had been led to
hope for souse tins, past that the import duty would be
eeriderahly diminished; but sonic delay had arisen, as they
bed been told, in consomme of en inquiry which was being
made with reference to the excise duty on salt made in
Erases; bed that it was seminary to regulate the import
ditty ea salt according to the result of that inquiry. That
vas themes, of the delay as the government were informed,
hat he (Mr. Gilson) would make further inquiries and en-
deavour to ascertain what prospect there was of a speedy
settlement of this question. With regard to Belgium, at
present the Belgian government had not agreed to grant the
same treatment to Disliked that it had extended to many
ether amber, and at that moment no doubt our trade with
Belgium was not to so desirable a position as it was
with France and other countries. The government
bed not failed to urge that we were entitled
to equal treatment with other countries, and they hoped
they should succeed in obtaining that favoured-natio. !
clause which was the subject of consideration. With re-
@tact to the British deg being aensodated to that of Fame
to Belgium for the carrying of salt, that, he
would take place when the favoured-lattice cCiTaseurkese
granted Ly the Belgian government. With regard to the
Yet subject of inquiry, be Waved that Mr. Mallet had not
/waived as such ioatructioos. There was no opportunity
SW is make any representations which would be useful
with regard to the gramma al salt.
EDUCATION, SCIENCE, AND ART.
Lord H. LENNOX, pursuant to notice, moved the fol.
, lowing resolutiou :—" That this house is of opinion that,
tor the preparative of aey animates, and for the expeedi-
, tars of my masks voted in aid of the British Museum, the
National lasing, and all other institution having for their
object the promotion of education, science, au d art, one
I lanlitOT of the crown should Ire reeponsilde to this house.*
1 Hs might mention, to appease the minds of the more
i timid representatives of those gentlemen in that house,
I that he wished to respect vested rights and to leave the
body ~f trustees where they were, confident that growing
I
, ace.ratelli„ifaenetale at:cltvemprogtharees. of.yethminmnobeeecnousekiwoui2d,
oprrodove
. (Laegliter.) Of the property which the British Museum now