The Express.
London, England, 1864-07-01 00:00:00

THE EXPRESS: 'Via DA T

matter which is not within my province. H 6 wishes to
routine a patios which 'suppose he thinks Is of a too con-
Tetanal chanoter far this heat& (Laughter.) I remember
that some yeas ago this subject was very generally diamond
in this house, sod I think many raemben were afraid that d
there was an open and visible parry for the reception of
the ladies, the iagneeoe ezeniad by that pllary ever the •
pronediep of the house would be such as not to be alto.
vibe: desirable. (Lsogliter.) It was thoagbttluif it would
be better &Bosnian that the house should not be espood
to such an ordeal. (Laughter.) Until the house bee pro-
nounosd a difterent opinion, I most decline to remove that
conventual gratioe, which has its uses, for it nobles person
behind it to see, without being sees. (" Hear, hear," and
laughter.)
Sir G. BOWYER—Is the right boo. gentleman aware
that in the Hone of Lards ladies sit in an open gallery with-
out say piing at ell ? And is this bone likely to be in-
fluenced by the lodise when they do no harm in the House
of Lords? (" Hear, hear," and laughter.)

fifths eautaieed one ar more animal (mot ookoola.
But there were 14,243/ perishes of leas than 5,000 lehabi-
rots, sad oshridog ma aggregate popubitioe of 9,241,917.
Of that number of parishes there were 10,961, or about 66
par rod. of the what*, in which there was no school with
aa usual grant. Be did net thiak rat that weld be as.
pried ash satidactorystreel things. Be believed that them
was a greet somber of small parishes is which the duty of po
pular almation was substantially fulfilled, bat which, berg
unable or unwilling to comply yrith regulations of the Privy
Council, were deprived of say rums tame from the public f unde.

Mr. ADDERLEY °capitulated the vioe•pnsidet, and
the right hon. member for Caine on the very marked
approbation expressed by almost every inspector of the
working of the mimed code. He supported that
revised code because he did not foresee the evils which many
persons did ; but be confessed that he did not
expect to find so early as 1863 in almost all the inspectors%
reports such expraiskins of approbation, even from three
who toot the moot gloomy views of the prospects as to the
working of the revised cods. This was a very estidectory
and encouraging Mate of things, and he had no doubt that
it would rally the vigour of loss! management. He hoped
the Committee of Council would take lute consideration the
suggestions which had beer thrown oat relative to the esta-
blishairat of a more uniform system, the bringing forward
of sew minutes more prominently, and. above all, the jus-
tice of dealing morn literally with pnvate individuals who
bad is various parts of the eoantry made great Isaacss for
the education of the laming dames. (Hear, hear.)
Mr. HA.DFIELD said a yaction arose, what was the
cause of the apathy observable oa a question of such peat
importance. Darius the last hour the benches opposite had
been occupied by only three members, although the question
under consideration involved altogether ea =pinata* of
1,300,000/. He believed this apathy was owing to the
deadening effect which the panting of money by the state
for such purposes invariably produced, and wen of opinion
that it would be moc► better if the state would leave ads-
catioe alone.

Scr 85115B,THOCCTE said the theory of the hon. end
learned gentleman was *opened to the feat, es the vote for
education was oosesederably Ins than the amount in former
years. This year the sum proposed was 706,0004, agrinst a
vote of 801,0004 lest year, and a vote of 840,0004 the year
before, showing a decrease in the lain two years of 16 per
seat. Bat it wee not a little remarkable that while the
am voted wee 16 per mat. leek the anemia for the ex-
pense of admieistration was 17 per oink gmater, the
thane ander this heed the year before last boon 66,2984,
last year 72,0001., and this year 77,8004 This fan might
afford some clue to the &acuity propounded by the boa.
member. The boa. member wished to know why his Mt.-
rut was excited than formerly. It was became the house
bad found itself unable to deal with such matters • bemuse
it was mon and more at the mercy of the downs:int which
administered the grants, being unable to acquaint itself with
all the complicated details of the system ; sad because when
it had enpraseed its views sad endeavoured to adores them,
it Ind toned that it was liable to we them views quietly
set aside and its wishes lgoored, without beiog able to
make any effectual resistance.
Mr. BLACK said that this system was one of extraordi-
nary complications, and he thought the boa. bonnet had hit
a blot in it. Owit of the obvious difficulties of the case
arme from this serious circumstance, that the whole sync=
bad been made • deoominatiooal one. He ht the best of
all systems was that which they ones had ie viz.,
one school in a perish to which every child could go, so matter
to what religion be or she might belong. They ought to
devise a system net called by any religious name, and over
the schools place masters well qualified to Mack of good
dispceitioo and of Christian character, and that would be all
that could be required. The denomioational systems did
not teach religion. If they had throughout England Lod
Scotland good *ocular schools, they might leave the religious
part of the instruction to the clergymen and the parents at

--Sir J. PAIUNGTON deeply regretted the emuse taken
by the National Society, ...a was glad the Privy Gotland
had refused what were called the °madams chimes. if
the National Society wished to continue the great work
which they bad long been sagged in they would do well to
alter their rules, and be could not help hoping that the day
was not far distant when the National Society would me the
necessity of following the mares which be had pointed out.
(Hear, bear.)
Lord H. VANE quite • reed with the right hoe. hermit
that the 000seienoe clauses were to be deeply regretted, and
that if the natiooal system was to be continued it would be
sesential that they should be withdrawn or greatly relaxed.
Sir U. BOWYER said the hon. member for Edinburgh
had advocated a system of education in which religion would
be taught by the reading of the New Testament only. and
without referees's' to any particular creed. He regarded
that suggestion as being altogether impracticable. If a child
asked the teacher the meaning of • teat it
would be impossible for the master to with-
hold some explanation, and yet he could not
108 any without falling into the denominational difficulty.
The fact was that any attempt to teach Christianity without
• creed would be to teach mere iodiffereutiam, and indiffe-
rentism was precticelly deism, or no religion at all. With
regard to • purely secular education.il system, be believed
that the members of every church io this country were
opposed to its adoption, and that such • principle did not,
therefore, admit of any practical application. They them
came to the ordain actually adopted in this country,
namely, the denominational system. He felt convinced
that it was the only one that would ,be (mod
to work effectually.
Mr. BLACK wished to state that there were • good many
schools in Scotland in which religion was taught without
any Teed at aIL
Mr. LOWE said that he was quite ready to assent
to the proposition that none of the minutes of the
Privy Council should be altered except by parliament. Like
Lycurgus who made laws which were not to be changed till
he came, and intended never to come back he was ready
to assent to such a l. Bat he be-
lieved that it was not the the way to obtain
improvement by forciug departments. After five years ex•
pentince, his conclusion was, that every attempt to force on
the Committee of Privy Council only tended to reduce
efficiency and to increase exmoditure. In 1861 the amount
of the grant was 840,00D1. It was increasing by
100,000/. a year, and if it were not for the obooxions rules
which " the enemies of the human race " who presided over
the department established, the amount of the grant
would DOW be 1,200,0001. or 1,300,0004 (Hear, bear, and
laughter.) They saved the amount of the income-tax which
so many were glad to have taken off • and when it was
mid that they were prim, rigorous, harsh, precise, and bad
shown but little feeling for those whose salaries bad been
cat down, it should be remembered that they exercised
, • great public trust—that education had Dot suffered since
the new changes had been made, and that the taxpayers
had been relieved from • serious demand on their resource&

(Hear, hear.) He believed the system would have broken
down altogether if the expenditure had been allowed to
proceed unchecked, and that the changes complained of bed
given A a Dew lease of life which it never would have got
tf they bad goes on with the old extravagance. (Cheers.)
Mr. LYGON said that the unpopularity of the committee
of council dated from the time when they made efforts to
break down the deeomitiational system, which was
admitted to be a political neoessity of the country. He
thought the eystem should be plead under the law, and not
left to s nebulous administration like that of minas&

Mr. PUG II maid that he was very glad to observe
from the report of the iampecton of education in
South Wales that the programs of education is that part
011103 the revised code was very remarkable. In that re-
spect the right hos. member for Galas had proved a true
prophet.
The vote of 525,6041. foe the educatioed great is Great
Britain wia thee *peed to.