The Express.
London, England, 1855-07-21 00:00:00

Bit believed that the only way wee to act In ea energetic
, and that linty shinier so laid out should be well
*gout •
ded Under these eireametanos he onld sot take
up es himself 'he responsibility of fefuo'no this lots.
The CHANCELLOR of the EICHEQU nit said he
was desirous to out the attention of the committee to the
penal a is whisk this 'Amery would be pleased in etasa
these resolutions were not peened. (neon boar.) A _of? ;
treaties had been entered into between the ENVOI of
tD
Fr. crh and the Salts., with reference to Om eenteseden of ,
a lon, gad, in annequnes of that
Bar ro of the French and her Majesty =TS=
mace representations to their respective legislative beano
the repreeestaties of the Emperor of the From& Wiles
peer died, is point of time, that of het hiej-sty to pail
ttselin
aL It hid always been the practice in this country.,
oesetter treaties as imperfect until the ratiticatioese were es. ,
red, sad, according to this practice, her Majesty, after I
the treaty had been signed, did not lay it before parlinsient,
be wait d anti the ratifications had bees exchanged.
The Emperor of the French pursue I a different souse, for
le piewated the treaty to the legislative hedtiilFFremeee
sad it ens takes into ooseideration by that . wade'
Gomm isnot& was •ppointed, sad the report of the isemmissin
woe is layout *flits guarantee according to the propontin
of the gortrument ; and that guarantee bad been Merle
adopted he the Legislative Chamber. That was the state of
some. in Yrs .ee in cousequence of the*usvoot”)o,whicb was
soder their consideration. That convention had now been
brenht under the notice of the British have of pert arrest
by ti • recommendation of her Majesty, and they bad to
iseendes whether the house would thick fit to enable her
Reje.ty ti fulfil her engagement is that eanventien, and
In perform her pert in the guarantee of the loan. which
was so hen the joiat rum/awe of France and England.
Whet would be the effict of the rejection of the 'notations?
Why, that her Sieje.ty would have to communicate to the
Emperor of the French that it isnot in her power to fulfil
the eleventh's into which she has entered, and to inform
the E anon r f the Preneo that the assent to tbst oonvene
tins whisk he bed obtain,{ from his legislative chamber
wdl to void. That would be the necessary cinsequenee
of the step which heanurable members now pro.
posed to adopt. He folly admitted the right of
go bonus to refers its anent to the resolution now
en the table, sad he fully admitted that the assent of her
blekety to this convention was conditional, and made to
depend upon the subsequent anent of her perliament.
(Hear, he ass.) He by no means denied their right to refuse
Omit ascot to these reisolutioes, ennv ne zn.-rele wiehred to
point out to the house the position in which her Majesty and
bit. t testy's government would be placed in reference to
her sCy if the resolution should he negatived. Ho Gould
perfectly understand the view which had been stated by the
bon. member for Wick (Mr. Leine, :hat we were to
deprive oar:eine of rendering any auistance to foreign
governments, and to limit ear expenditure to the pay and
maintenance of our own troupe; that we were to be of no
moist inn to any foreign power, because such montane.
could only lead to complication and dace ty ; and that
whether It were • loan, subsidy, or free gift of any kind, he
objected to any such system, and that he could only
consent to vote for the supply of our own army aid navy,
the eutanditure for which wecould control. and the apro-
priation of which we could have procured by an act of par-
liament. That wee perfectly clear and distinct, but he did
sot urderotand the line which had been taken by the right
hon. member for Oxford (Mr. Gladstone), and by other
gentlemen in the coursed this debate, sod who admitted to
g certain :teat that circumstances might justify us giving
Insistence to a foreign power, but who maintained that, of
all modes, a guarantee was the least expedient. Now, lot
them examine the alternative which they proposed for their
adoption. Is the first place, they said that a loan was
better then ary other thing, and they produced the example
of the Sardinian loan. Redid not deny that that arrange
moot was a good arrangement, and worthy of the &deplete,
of the house ; but he confessed he was unable to SRO
the es'raordinary advantages which it had as commend
with • guarantee with respect to the loan, we raised the
money which we advanced to Eardinio, and it might be
meld toot we raised it by loan. It was 2,000,0001., of which
1,000,0001 was payable is the present year, and 1,000,0J01.
of which loan had been now advanced to Sardinia and
1,000,0001 more would become payable next year, 1,1 the
war continued so long. What advent:go bad that over •
guorentee ? Had we any control over the appropriation of
the loan? It was paid to the Sardinian g ant, and
the appropriation of it the Sardinian government effected,
it of court, being understood that it was to defray the ex-
penses of the war. He was at a loss to understand what
advantage. ben. members could discover in the loan
advsneet by us to Sardinia us compared with the
guarantee which we were about to give to Turkey.
The neat coestion was whether, instead of a guarantee,
they should arist Turkey by • subsidy or a free gift. If so
what would they do? They must go into the money
market and borrow the money. The had net in the Ex-
chequer five milliono to advance for the purpose. That was
not one of the contemn which was included in the esti,
mates for the year. The sum which it was his deity to sub-
mit to th hone as the sum which was required for the ser-
vice of the ;oar woe, he regretted to say, lingo beyond
example in the financial 'leonine, of this country ; but it
did act include five million' for the Turkish loan.
Among the miens to which it was neceeiary to resort was a
a loon for sixteen millions. In contractirg for that loon it
was necessary that certain unerances should be given to
the leaden cf the money, In order that they might have a
security, and that the coma try might obtain the money on
advantageous terms. One °ribose essurai.ces was that no
new loan should he raised until the iostalmente of that loan
were paid The last of those instalments would not be-
come doe till the month of December next. If it should
please the hone to reject the resolution now before
them ; if, as they told them, the executive wu t•
devise some other moans of Inlfilliog its engagements;
it we. to negotiate afresh with France and
with Turkey, in order to decise come other means
by which the funds fcr this war were to he furnished,
if ate ulterior course was to he resorted to, how would it be
possible tot the government of tn. country to raise the
fonds necessary for the purpose. They said they were not
to guarantee the loan to Turkey, but by what mean was it
proposed that the obj,et in view was to be effected? H.
nested that thou gentleman who proposed simply to reject
this resolution, who talked of the advantage of subsidies as
compared with guarantees would have the kindness to ex-
plain to the committee what was the practical course
which they wished her Majesty's government to adopt. It
wr old sot he sufficient for the house simply to adopt a nee
gages course; it was net sufficient simply to reject a pro-
posing's of this tort, and to say it was the duty of the
executive government to devise some other means of ful-
filling the enroi meats of the mows, the engagements
of this esuatry with foreign powers; he said it was the
duty of those gentlemen who called on the house to reject
the resolution, to point out distinctly to the ,government
what practical nurse was open to them by which they could
raise that sum of meaty, and by which they could fulfil the
engegemeats Into which the crown had entered. There was
the argument, which was dwelt upon by the right boo.
gentleman the member for Buck., who seemed to think that
eve -y loan which was raised in this country, which he felt
ealled noon to notice. It was that every abstraction of
the ostieoal capital engaged the national faith, and
that the government was responsible for abstracting
so souk from the wealth of the ecuotry. Now, if any
fore-ga power raised a loan in England, that necessarily, by
obtaining eoutributioas from English suherribets, subtracted
somsub from the wesith of the country ; but the Conroe which
it was new proposed to adopt was simply to guarantee a loan
effected by the Turkish government. Teo years ago that
g•vernmeet 'Misted a loan, principally subscribed for by
English contributions, which abstracted fee m the wealth of
this country, and the subscribers hod their benefit in the
tautest paid by the Turkish government ; but there was no
differeace, so far as regarded the wealth of this country,
between a loan en ustraeted for by prints contractonand a
loan eontraeted for under the guarantee of our government.
H. nested that the committee would pause before resorting to
the e ion. of at once rejecting this noolution en which a
bill was to be framed that was to be introduced. Agreeing
to the resolagen would not preclude the house from discuss-
ing the bill in its future stages. There was nothing to pre-
elude their decision hereafter. If there was any further
informant' which it was is the power of her Majesty's
poreressent to furnish which was desired by the house, it
would be their wish to furnish inch information, whether it
were statistical information, or whether it were information
as to tho application of money by the goveroment of Turkey
to which they might be legitimately entitled. Bot
be tru fed that after the statement of facts which he had
bleesht under their consideration that they would not pro-
ceed to the enema length of at ones put ing an wad to this
reeo lution. and curing a difficult and embarrassed state of
effete, which would be produced if the resolution were re-
jected.
Mr. WALPOLE said he had supposed when the Chan-
miler of the Exchequer rasa that bo was about to accede to
what he considered was the reasonable proposition of his
right hon. friend, that this resolution, as now proposed,
'limed not be forced on the house wiih•mt further toad.
deration. For many reasons he might urge on the Rovers-
mint to reeconsider their determination. The arguments
against the proposition were not only unanswered, but
be beiieved Decease they were unanswered they were
unanswerable. They were in this peculiar and singular
poei-on that, with the exception of the First Lord of the
Tres cry and the Chancellor of the Exchequer, not a single
gentleman had offered a single argument in support of the
proposition ~The non. member for Lambeth said be would
su Neon the government by his vote, but he offered to the
bouts the strongest possible arguments against the propo-
sition. But if he was disappointed by the Cheneellor of the
Exchequer thus persisting in a ratelution which he musts*,
had sot earthing to recommend it, he wee still more I,IOP.
prised by tbe lea ;nage which be teed, which wile totally at
varieties with th • more sonsitutional laogusge of the First
Lord of the Treasury. The Chancellor of the Exchequer
indeed said that this convention made by the Crown
with foreign countries parliament might have a right to
consider, bat the whole line of his argument welt contradict
ter, to test observation, and it amounted to this that they
had the power to consider this convention sou to object to
it; yet still, as they had entered into it, they *wet adopt
it. Now be begged leave to doubt whether that was the
the omeritationat do:trine, and be thought it was advise
Upon to the house and to the country, that this gelding
had hi en raked now, le order that they might came to some
oodettfoltdfoll ot to wbat were to be the propositions them
were to be asked to contest to. The Chancellor of the Bm
chequer took it upe a the different* between &guarantee ad
a loan, and asked, was not a goarenteo better Ibo
a loan ? But who and that they attend mate
• loan to Turkey, unless they had a puarantee that • lend
would be the meet advntegesee. Timm the other alter•
native that the Mongolia of the Exakseper put was thia...
be wd,lf ps vUI not lan a gismo, era leas, an you

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