The Express.
London, England, 1855-02-09 00:00:00

hi hen, would have
ttbratvality of a
sissre sti
ns
lie the case • :bat
winker, if 'I
had,
the reepassibility le
ass me, I should
Comatose there was .
flea epperitket urn
the sem, I nes rely I
of tbe geremseest. 1
adminstratios st the .
mown the werny
Wm: ilidgelirliall
sigh opines, 'o
tiose el the ry•Finiest, . _ +SI dear, .
sbeithitilles les tbey wire Sneed to gel it) trabAsl ‘,
the gneiss read cwt nisi wet leer, that Theoust.
Penmen wag the samt ailed fie by the ethereal wide of
the mashy. Mee bees,) ...1.-eposit not oaly of tie press;
i!silt ales to tha language of atembars of pediment he tie
I kaew that there was a very gh M ost cNees is
M o
to coley on of that ante Assent% who, ster ether,
mem a scalier antoptios yeas the imam
nisi is cast ea all the rest of Ms elleelgen.
Meer, Isar.) Though posit se to my, in tbe
assiset of the war, cm of tit wettest ishes, as it ap-
ses to in, which has existed, we • ese arida( la rte Aso
that bee bees presided over by the sable Aletiset himself,
—Semen, the late aid Loneliest inbeilmomtel the militia.
ee:usbeer.) Bat he that ant My, to pulls mimed=
viseeast had a itemplott IMMllptile• sad abode-
dee fees ell the shertiewitop OM btaillots of bit eel-
Wiese. The has. cud Mowed gestimess lobe=
forward the motionMedi de covieteele W.
hi
dabs& his opiates that VieseteePalnentos was *a any
slim whit was fit ta messed wad Wets illenastey. Sad
.sees
authority then all, Ibsen* of obi sees vitelowt's
Whop. who, emblesiel do one of the late getementat
isdefensibee, sal irsamieg he oeseset of the war mei that
be was essealled rather prematurely to seeds tees its
rasks,--iihat amble lord himself goseronsly and moat *dr
teresteddy ewilitleed Mosel( to a oeSeeive, end desisted
that in Ids opines the ally penes to swing the silitazy
) Wren of this eseistey was his late oelbewes Visiewit Pal-
-1 Inenten. New, I pat it to your loubligisel put it to the
ematry—will that feeling offeesillog Is nehmen,
' with that pleural declatatioe to ben of a very diger
wished samber of the other house—• goades sawn by
• large peens ef the sees, by a esenikeablo amble itt
, m re dies Hone el Clemeers. emetlesed by the high
me oe
,' authority of the noble led the late midget of tit etioseell
1 a,i sit gnat prospect of imatutity from attack, or what
of a wassaity oa a dense. would • goncameat
Ce2lstrii which was formed to the esclesics et that sae
inetl= (Chain.) I hope I may acts be usleseteml as
in tear • single meanie that the imenideratiens I
have milinini 111 were these ohm with prompted as
@Weal, to desire to obtain the oessealion of the noble
IMMO, se ft say that I thought mob mosperatioa was
sat emettel to the ewes. 4 the geresemant. I readily
eteser=ageley sea atuitl*, the great abilities, the
great the great shad expo-
' risen—as oiled espirrieset"dell:nat Ism eta thirty-seven
years of edles—of the noble viscount. I reedity admit the
L advantage of his personal popularity. I readily admit also,
although it le not • usual grouted to be staged is reheated,
yet the eireaustances of the ease on so pro Otat I may
,be nosed fat alluding to it—ellibetnik iit se this
country would look with reaseatMe mg well-_-ed jot-
;ins as to may walilleatiom he sin whin eat et en-
sexiao with Mew states es Mega gedismonoles i P• I
mast be permitted to add, that la the prommieserniotenees,
' as OM sad liglematentetfiettiesitt the yid it the orbit
. vinous% it suet wet be emitted that he wee gaartaity asp-
, smite merest se isiessibeable Whims over tho nun-
, Glint( that Bovereign with when we arose, happily ea
' terms of tho strictest and dare t allieree, and that he
enjoyed, to a great extent, the mielbsso of that great
' mat, whose superior ability sled power, get less than the
nano be beers, enabled him to grasp, end to held, Its
sad enmeney, the sceptre of thatsF2. (Hear, bear.)
I. Mess like these, whet we are in a femaliabie
alai sans war, with, at swat mentat,
Freda ear only moored ally, though Ibis; se hag Se
be so—as sash • time, it is a pestle qualieleatios
foraModise is Ms moat* that the =Yew in cotes.
ties pewees the woefidowee el these to whim we are
is
dot I(steata SL.riblieertio=l:llTe"ti Ltd:
vantages which would have bass sostelsoe by say cabinet
formed at the pretest mann whisk was amequsinted
with all that tangled web of dipessasey that hes been woven
within the last two yeas. In that respect that noble
visement proseased peculiar advantage, and woald have eon-
rem& peculiar advantage upon any government of which
be should have been a member, by bringing to that govern-
ment and to that cabinet his iatimate knowledge of all the
transactions of the last two years—the difficulties that have
arisen—the embarrassments and obstacles that have os-
eurred—and the feelings and views of those foreign courts
with which de in that long period we have been in
eamanticatien. Under all these cireimstancee, and
spas all these consideration, I cams to the con-
skein that, with the Annassisted numerical strength
of thee who placed their maidens in we, it
was ispessibh that I could enter spin ten milk any
assesses of that which I soneurred with the noble earl
(Shiniest) is thinking ease desirable and necessary for the
country at this period—a sting government. (Hear,
hear) It was impossible for me, without some extraneous
aid, to Aster myself with the expectation that I could se-
cure tithe watintry • strong government. It was impressed
with these ideas and convictions that ea the following
woraiwg I obeyed her Majesty's nonatons. I laid be-
, ton be Ms/oft without reserve my views with regard
to NO Ilete septet.% with regard to the composition of the
am: tbe7olkaad the
ibaln wal:ie:h these Pankspartiesiamigt
Elm
I set emboss' from her Majesty that there
milgtilleibeseaseesses under which the Hone of Com-
ities aiddigive to such a government as I might be eaa-
Wen linssimen without ex transom support, • gemstone
lamistalele ; I thiat those airearastauces could oily be
those in which there would be to alternative between the
mistimes of the geoernasent I was about to form and no
governante at all, and that thin would be no security
wbatever—nay, not Oat this, bat no prospect of forming
a government which a ould command a majority in the
other house, so long as there was a large party who would
be united in the nicks that some person was excluded
Ms tbat goverisment who oeght to have been included in
bond to have brought the weight of his ataistenee sad
assmoth to it. (Hear, bear.) Alter • statement, to which
Isersuestizity listened with the moat gracious atteatioa, I
with the request that I might be enabled to cola-
munioste with Viscount Palmerston, for the purpose of ob-
teen his concurrence and assistance io forming the admi-
nistration which, at bar Majesty's request, I was about to
undertake. I also stated to her Majesty that I could not
expect to obtain that concurrence on the part of the noble
viscount, sales he were permitted to bring with him one or
two of thee with whom he bad recently acted.
I felt also, notwithstanding tome personal and political thr-
eesome that the abilities of some et those gen-
tlemen Wile have added materially to the strength
of the government and to the power of debate
it the House of Commove; and that their presence
=Jakob. desirable, not oaly on accoutt of the rapport and
notation,* which they would give to the viscount in
joining the administration, but also en account of their own
individual sad personal sleets (Hear, ker.) I stated to
her Majesty that, is my humble person, withest some such
extraneous assistance, I did not feel myself in a condition to
promise to her Majesty that strong government, soured of
a majority in both hoses, which I thought, at the present
moment, it was most desirable, if potable, that her Majesty
should poetess. (Hear, bear.) I was then bound to oonsliet
not any pommel or party interests, but that which was fOr
the honour tithe crown and the welfare of the country;
and first, and pre•ecoinently for the welfare of the country
and the dignity of the crown, I placed the necessity of
having, if possible, a strong end united gestation. I
inning submitted to her Moist, my banes Mein, that ,
—failing my eadeavoure to form such • genrsiment as
should held oat the promise of Snag* as well as
of union—ber Majesty should carefully amide whether
it were possible to term any other osithinattes se public
gees by which that abject would be men lady to be
achieved. when those men were to be snobs be—what
the combination was to be—was • subjoin apes width of
coarse I did not presume to offer any opines to bat Ma-
jesty ; bat after venturing to offer that nigesties, whisk I
believed to be for the good of the country, I conaluded by
assuring her Ilejety that—strongly as I felt the Moieties
of my position—if such a combination, giving greater
strength to the government than any which I could ander-
take to bring to her Majesty's support, were found to be
impracticable, that, at all hazards, end under all circum-
stance's, that bar Majesty should not be left without a go-
meant —(eheera)—and that whet such other combing.
dens bad base tried sad had been found to be onsuctess•
fel, then, with better hopes of parliamentary support, bat
whether with or without better hopes of such support, I
would answer for myself and those noble lords and
gentlemen with whom I had the hardness of act-
ing, that at all events the country should not be
without a government, and that at all !lewd', all risks, sod
all sacrifices, our humble services should be plated mre-
tersdly at her Majesy's disposal. (Else, bear.) I may
mks this opportunity of noticing another pont, is tonsi-
lqueues of the rumours which have gone abroad that, urn
that ocessin her Majesty sought to fetter my discretion
by any reatrieden. (Hear, bear.) My lords, every one
who knows the respect whieh her Maisity hes ter the coa-
st tailor' and the strict and rigid manner in which she walks
In the light and paths of that constitution, will be well
aware that sash a report Vie most unfound, d. (Hear,
bear.) But I feel =reit batted in duty for the information
of those who may not hays the same means of knowledge,
to state that, not only was no obsteale, no restriction whet-
placed in my way, but that not the slightest difficulty
Vim wage upon ar.y suggestion or recommeadati,e, either
Mlle see or measures, which I felt it to he my duty to sob-
oh to ler Mejc.ty. (Hear, hear.) It eonsequence of this
Interview, whirr% lasted from halflost eleven to near
sae e'eloek, I called spew the noble viscount (Palesentoe),
whom I foetid at hi. hour. I immediately aossmunieated
to him the oommission with which I was charged from her
Majesty. lam bound here to state that the noble viscount
showed that he would have been exceedingly unwilling—
nay, that be felt that it would be
en impoesible, without the
coo tanner sad eteoperatioo of me of his friends in the
late goveremeat, to give to me that assistases and support
whisk otherwise he did not eines himself disinclined to
give. I hod at ones anticipated suck a feeling es the part
se the ante Meow ; for I knew that it wee perfeetly as-
teal; and. I tamed the two of hie cello gate whom 1
... thought would moat readily eceseat to est sloop with blot

I .1,14 ters, ed wheyreeld lave

gressins/43
owl lONIAN hint lam framkness thatwhith
as shun Inaate tomtit I stated to hint that,
with *s MA II the Rua el did not think it
vestigial" fir may miebior M oimblai
thete duties of an
astoulamnblatelimm dopoilmenti and btained from
the nehl• lh lire iosetintimme is that opinion, and that
with the lad the ZOOM Of Causes, the arduous and
important datieszof
_Minister ol War were totally immewits-
tible. 1 was isaffied—by an ad a self-abnegation and "OF
ruder, fee wkiebuy light hos. friend deeorvesthissollll
pralso--ie state as part of my friend Mr. Dime% est
with eierti the bbl of the bouts, with Milk Mbed
bees es s linstw occasion, in the el the 1
mobil beiteild swills, all diluent prOtenlink IS
it, Is sistiels of the great abilities sad amassed
the maim t. Mein) And he (Kr. Mandl) adds'.
what I think ben to his credit, that not only am
he willies WS* le wadies a right to which, lOW
airing his gelatiesehip In the maservative party, he was
fairly estitaid, in favour of the noble viscount, but be
added able that such a susnetin might render more mg
the accasios of the two hisses' the noble viscount, who
might be willing to act webs the noble viscount, though
they might be len willing to set wager him (Mr. Disraeli).
(Hear.) I quitted the noble viscount after about half an
hour's internew,—her Majesty_awaiting the result of that
interview before returning to Windsor; and I informed the
noble viscount that her Majesty would leave a messenger in
waiting in town. to receive from me and to convey to
Windsor the result of any communication which he might
welerteho to make to Mr. Gladsgoae and to Mr. Sidney
Hubei& Moen) I certainly returned with a very Swag
Messy mind that the noble viscount was ready
ad ,lf he could obtain the concurrence of his late
willeeries, to join the administration I was endeavouring to
fees. The statement he made to me ma that he could
give so Mahe answer till he had had ha opportunity of
esmietunicating with Ikea, but that he hoped, before the post
west est—et all events is a very few burs, to convey to
tam the final decision at which he had arrived. I did not
his from the noble viscount till half past mine at night.
• Hosts Loan —What hour wee it when you left him?
The Earl of DERBY.—I lest the noble visoount shortly
babes two; and at half peat nine, when I had, In point of
bet, written • note to the noble viscount teay that I could
sot detain her Majesty's messenger any longer, I re-
, mind, to my considerable uprise, a note from the noble
.TiMMOIL. .1 will not trouble your lordships with the terms
nee* stated that upon full and complete noiso
ties be lei lOW to the conclusion that it he were to join
my government he could not give to it that support that I
i was good enough to think his presence would afford, that
he had sommunicated with Mr. Gladstone and Mr. Sidney
Herbert, somewhat to my desire, and that he would let
them write their own answers. At half-put nine that
night I received a note from Mr. Gladstone ; and between
seven and eight the following morning one hem Ile. Sid-
ney Herbert. Both of them were conceived in kind mad
courteous terms, of which I bad no reason whatever NOb j
plain; but I was certainly struck with an impression In
Mr. Gladstone's note. He says that Lord Palmerston had
communicated to him the wish I had expreseed, that be
should form part of the administration. "1 else leers lessi
him," he says, ' that he is not of opinion that be esti*
himself render you useful service in that whisisinzeffina."
Now „ I confess 1 received that with sear sigethes boom
I bad reason to suppose, at two o'clock, wbes seat lend
left me, that his support was dependent spa the
raneet.F,.
of his colleagues; and at half-past aka* at 1
received a note from Mr. Gladstone, stating that Pal-
menton, is communicatieg my message to hint, had stated
that be did not think he could concur in being a member of
my government. My lords, in that state of things—the
occurrence I anticipated having taken place—and with no
objection upon any political ground, or upon any astern-
plated meagre' or upon the position which it was intended
the noble viscount himself should hold, or any of his col-
leagues with whom he was about to be connected—hiving
received from the noble viscount and his friends the notes
to which I have referred, declining to form any part of that
administration, I felt I was then in a position to state to her
Majesty that the first contingency I had tefemd to having
taken place, I thought it was for the intimate ache country
and her Majesty's convenience that she should adopt the
subsequent sane I had advised, namely, to ascertain
whether it was possible, by any other oonshinalon of public
men, to form any stronger or more effective administration.
Further than that,' have no personal communication to make.
I quitted her Majesty with • very deep and sincere ezpreasloa
of regret on my part, that, under existing circumstances,
it was not possible for me to render her the assistance which
she required—that I could not assure her that strong go•
vernment which it was absolutely essential for the interests
of the country should be formed—but that, in the event of no
furthex combination being able to be made, I was then ready
to offer to her Majesty my humble end devoted services. I
may be asked why, liter referring merely to the noble
viscount who had been designated in public opinion as the
person entitled to the first consideration, and pesseesiog ooa-
Womble influence in the Heave of Commons, why I did
not seek the possible assistants and the possible co opera-
ties of others? And in the presence of the noble earl
(Clarendon) who held, and still holds, I presume, the wish
of the foreign deportment, I will state upon that subject
=ly what I took the liberty of addressing to her Ma-
. I stated that I considered it would be an immense
advantage to any government to have, as a member of it,
as. who was conversant with all the diplomacy of the last
two years, and who was thoroughly acquainted with all the
negotiations in which we had been concerned ; and
with that view and others, I stated that I should
apply for assistance to Viscount Palmerston. I took
the liberty to add that, with regard to my noble
friend the Secretary for Foreign Affairs, I entertained the
highest °taken of the ability, industry, and zeal with which
he discharged the duties of his office. I added—what I
hope the noble earl will say I was justified in adding—that
there was no personal feeling which might throw the
slightest impediment in the possibility of our acting toge-
ther in the same cabinet; that, on the contrary, I believed
there existed between as a Moan and mutual regard. But
I felt it my duty to odd also that, desirous as I might have
been of obtaining the estimation and assistance of one so
experienced and able as the noble earl opposite, I felt that
the political connexionof that noble earl—the political
relations in which that noble earl stood towards meet of
those with whom I was in the habit of acting—and his
political connexion with others with whom I was not
acting or about to act—did cot justify me in making any
direct approach or overtures to the noble earl, eves if I had
ration to know that they would have been favourably
received (mar, hear) sad that I should not feel
justified in making any overtures in such a
I quarter what-
ever might be my esteem for the noble earl, unites did so
by her Majesty's empress sanction and injunction. Whatever
might have been the games of such an application, I will
say that that is the only port of the course taken by me in
refersace to the formation of a government on which I look
back with doubt as to the propriety or the wisdom of my
abstaining from making any such application either to the
noble earl or the noble marquis (Lansdowne) who sits near
him, and from whom, I am suite certain, I should have
had the advantage of a dispassionate and a friendly opinion.
(Hear, hear.) ily lords, such were the reasons which led
me to decline to undertake the responsibility of forming a
government, with regard to which I could see no security
for its strength and continuance. I have nothing to do with
`subsequent treasactions. The noble viscount, It appears,
has found hinted( justified, and has thought himself enabled
to submit to her Majesty the names of a cabinet
which he thiaks is mare likely to Wore and command
the confidence and support of a majority is the two houses
of parliament. It is not for me, for a single moment, to
express an opinion how far the noble viscount has done cor-
inctly in that respect. I will not for a moment say that the
noble viscount was not krtified in recommending to her
Majesty a government which he believes to presets that
strength, and to be entitled to that confidence. Were Ito
urea may other opinion, it might lay the noble viscount
open to the suspicion, I believe most uutounded, of haying
acted from mere personal considerations. From such
motives I wholly and absolutely acquit his; and I catthot
doubt therefore that he has the fullest confidence in the
degree of popular rapport and cionfideace w bieb that govern-
ment, as now formed, is likely to command. I feel that I
have now offered to your lordships all that it is otheassry
for me to state, perhaps at too great length, but I am
desirous of not omitting the slightest details which might
throw light upon my motives for satiag as I have done.
before I cause to
(Hear, hear.) I have endeavoured,
that conclusion, and acted upon it, strictly and impartially,
as in the presence and under the eye of Him who is the
searcher of all hurts, to examine into the motives by which
I have been sweated ; to satisfy myself that I was in-
fluenced by me desire of unduiy graspieg at office—to satisfy
myself, on the other hand, that I was not timidly shrinking
from a respolssibillty which fairly ought to rest upon my
shoulders. (Cheers.) My lords, I should shrink from a*
responsibility, except from that which I felt there was
danger to the interests of the country in incurring—that of
having offered to her Majesty a government which had net
to itself sufficient elements of strength and Grams, sad
therebysabjeeted her Majesty sad the country to as bees.
unitises and a disappointment which I had no right oat
pose them to, and having added to the euthanasia's*
which was sufficiently great already. (Hear, hear.) V I
have erred, I bow to the decision of my friends and my
trountry. I may have exhibited too great timidity, in
taking upon myself responsibility ; though, I think, what-
ever errors may have been impute to me in political life,
they have bees generally rather of the opposite cieete lotion.
I may hove disappoiated the over sugulas and over.jealoas
expectations of those over whose interests I am bound to
watch, with whom I ant connected by every tie of political
and personal friendship, but whom, much es I desire to
please and gratify them, I desire still more to be able suin
fectorily and permanently to serve. It was not my opinion
that under such circumstances the great coasenatin party
should prematurely and rashly undertake the respossibility
of administering the affairs of this great country in this por-
tentous crisis. Upon that belief I acted, honesty, 00n-
aWationsly, sad, to the best of my judgment. My jun&

THE EXPRESS, FRIDAY EVENING, FEBRUARY 9, 1855.

those
I alike

tieseperenuently secure
__k_and vorfakteggeouride.
liajaWa the se,Wl intigri , and the
• =Europe. (Van, rebp.) And will add,
RIO 3 oral. ilbefillinirtintly *bit hie fallen from the
noble lord gebeie at -Maio! thegovernesent to the other
how. Wad Sem sell be .deep efiepadbility attaching to
'any one wheelie/I 011Oduleopeeekliewevet earnestly called
fie sibble dim met mute • Cm- the .sentry end to Europe
these great results—that a responsibility will attach to him
as deep, if not deeper still, who, after such multi shall
have bees ibitis ed. shalt esstinse foe a single moment the
Wimp and the beams emeseseelineed
The el LANSDOWNE hawedwar. wit(hCheersa detail
et his own geneniEngs daring tha late ministerial crisis,
explaining ke esestitntional principles which rendered it
fitting for she Clasen to send in ireeeession for Lord Derby,
Lard Jabs gensoll, and Lord Palmenton. The noble
'Lutists modeled by exhorting all parties in the Inlet&
Ines, sod. moss the public, to eta-operas heartily
for the sitaseement of the common came:-" We
shall expect to derive great advantage from the
advice sad resistance, not only of the regular sup-
porters of the government bet of those who are generally
adverse to itsliniteiples. (Hear, hear.) But, my lords, it
is not in the field or politics—it is not in parliament alone
that a great duty is to be performed. Every person in this
country has a duty to perform at this moment. In the great
coated in which we are engaged, with one of the greatest
and meet powerfel empires in the world, we must'depend is
great measure upon the mirage of our soldiers, and upon
the wisdom and ability of our commanders. But let it be rue
membered that Rio not by them alone who are actively es-
gaged that the victory is to be woe. (Cheers.) It is a contest of
representative government 'palest despotism ; and if we are
enable to oppose to the energy of despotism that unanimity
which I believe patriotism is always able to command,
despotism will prove too strong for liberty ; and the moral
to be learned from the transaction will only be, the feebleness
and the vices of representative government. (Hear, hear.)
My lords, it is the duty, not only of every member of this
cud the other house, but also of every oisethat exercises in-1
fleeces out of parliament—it is the duty especially of thee.
very eminent sad distingaished persons who are connected I
with one of the noblest institutions of this weeny, the free
press of England—it is the duty of those individuals, it is
the duty of all persons, who by the accident of their position
or their talents have won the confidence or pined the
approbation of the circle in which they live, be it great or
small—it is the duty, I say, of all, to say nothing, to de
nothing, to write nothing, which can impede or interrupt
the national progress. (Loud cheers.) It is by this
alune that the constry can seemed ; and I trust there is no
man that, by taking a different eourse, will forego his
share of the national triumph, if triumph we may ; or, on
the other hand, will saddle his own conscience, if unhappily
we should fail, with the reproach, never to be effaced, of
having by any set, word, or deed, contributed to that
failure. (Loud cheers.) My lords, I entirely ague with
my noble friend (Earl Granville), who remarked in bison-
salient statement that we have gone too far in our despon-
dency, as we had undoubtedly gone too far in our antici-
pations of triumph. My lord., this country must be pre-
pared both tor success and failure, whatever may be the
oomposition of the ministry. For those members of it who
have retired, I feel both affection and respect ; and I must
say that, whatever may be the objections on public grounds
to the inquiry pureed to be made by the other house, to
those late ministers personally it would be a great gain ;
for it would be found that many things falsely, rashly, un-
justly, and partially attributed to them are really doe to
other causes. (Chun.) Ono of the objects I had in view,
in the advice I gave, has been attained. The present
arrangements have secured the uninterrupted maintenance
of those negotiations with our allies in Europe which have
been fir the last two years conducted with increasing success
from mouth to month, under the auspices of my noble
friend (Lord Clarendon), unimpeached and unattached, and
which I believe in my conscience will tend more and more
to unite the whole of Europe in that cause, which is the
cause of the whole of Europe, and which by the union of
the European powers cannot fail to effect the great object for
which the war was commenced. (Loud cheers.) The
noble marquis then resumed his seat, once more thanking
the noble earl (Lord Derby) for the conciliatory remarks
which he had made, and expressing his full confidence in
the success of the new government."
At the conclusion of some remarks from the Earl of
DIALERSBURY,
Lord PANMURE said—After what bad just fallen from
the noble earl, it was impossible for him to avoid addressing
to their lordships a few obeeriratione,and they would be very
few. He concurred in the observations that fell from the
noble lord opposite, that no man should undertake an
secs of responsibility under the crown without endeavour.
lag to satisfy the public of the grounds on which he had
undertaken that office. He was aware of the great respon-
sibility which attached to the office he had undertaken, and
that the eyes of the country were turned more to that office
than to almost any other. He shrank from undertakieg
the office until he was informed that it was thought that
the experience he had had in the administration of military
affairs might be conducive to the advantage of his soverign
sad the country. Re thought that the eyes both of this
.entry, and, as the noble earl had said, :of many other
imintries were turned too conspicuously on the one depart-
ment which he had the honour to represent—be meant the
department for the administration of military affairs. He
looked to the ministered the country for the support of the
administration of that department, and he hoped that the
planters -of the crown would share with him the re-
sponsibility of the administration of throe military affairs
which he had taken upon himself to direst. He was quite
aware that mach was required of this department, that
many reforms must take place, and that at as early an op
portunity as possible. But he was not prepared to ente
with the noble earl on those discussions new, nor was he pre-
pared at that moment to state to the house to what extent,
or with whet speed he could take upon himself to enter
upon the execution of those retains. He should
endeavour, if he could: do nothing else, to give
to the country the assurance that none should be
employed under his administration whom he did not con
eider fitted for the employment to which he should m I
moon--
mend them, or in which he should employ them on his own
responsibility ; and if in the transaction of those affairs he
should be called upon to do acts which were painful to hiss-
ed( but newer( to the publics service, be trusted that be
might be enabled to perform those duties in a manner
which would prove that he was only influenced by a desire
to promote the interests of the country. He should not
trouble their lordships farther. He should endsavont to do
that which he thought neoseary for placing the adminis-
tration of military affairs on a proper footing, and he
trusted that too much might not be expected of one who
had so recently succeeded to the office. He succeeded to
the officio in no antagonism to his noble friend who had pre-
ceded him • he did not know that he could Wing to it
more diligeisce, More .sal, than that which had mmked the
noble duke's caner. In bringiag to the office his expe-
rience of the odministratioe of military affairs under a
tamer government, he was bringing to it also an expe-
rience which he should
he having for several years of his life served in the army ;
and bailey so served he could beer his full testimony to
the high encomiums passed by the noble earl who preceded
him en our regimental system. And he took this opportu-
nity of saying that whatever might be the defects
of the British army in other respects, he believed our real-
mental system to be as perfect as that of any other country
in the world. We might be deficient in what was called
the staff of the army, but so far as the regimental depart-
ment was concerned, he believed it was on a good foun-
dation, and that there was very little to improve in that
direclon. Having made these observations, he hoped he
should receive from their lordship that consideration which
they were always dtsposed to extend to those who were
anxious to perform their duties, and he hoped he should
not be out of place in aching from those elsewhere, out of
doors, that forbearance which was necessary to those who
undertook a responsible oommiesion suck as he bad un-
dertaken. Ho could only soy that, should he fled from any
circumstance that he was unequal to the task he had un-
dertaken, he would have the honesty at onee to vision that
inequality, and to surrender to abler and better hands the
important department which he could not preside over
without indaogering the best interests of the public service.
(Hear, hear.)
Earl RODEN said—The country` oult appreciate the
conduct of the noble lord in accepg, at this time, the
office he had undertaken. It was an act of great
patriotism. He thought
Powersthre should be some public
appeal to the Almighty for the gaiety and meccas of
the army.
The motion was then agreed to.
FISHERIES (NORTH. AMERICA) BILL.
This bill went into committee.
The Berl of CLARENDON took the opportunity of
stating that the conduct of the American fishermen who
had come on shore for the purpose of curing fish and drying.
their nett, was no infraction of the treaty.
The bill then pawed through committee, and their lea.
hips adjourned at ten minutes to 'tett eolotk.

HOUSE OF COMMONS—THURSDAY, FEB. 8.
The Srukuan took the chair at flee minutes to four
o'clock.
The emend reading of the London and South Western
Railway Bill was postponed for a month.
The helve then went into Committee of SOOPIT.
Yr. COWPER said, as it was agreed that Uwe should
he no discussioe of importance at that period, he should not
enter into explanations with regard to what he had to pro-
nom, which was, that the sem of 1,616,0001. be pentad for
excess of erneaditure in the navy for the year ending
Slat Horeb, 1158.
In reply of Ste H. WiLLocroaar,
Yr. COW PER stated that the teal meant (dike estimate
was 1,988,0001.

mellathatp;isfeetialnled".. CoPthilailuktPiata geritilitenhtltsoltbojainetsta, abject,
ci(tghtraiearltieno'nl,beywred yesterday,
returned from the Crimea, and that I took the oppoeteugs,
of inquiring into the actual state of the army before Sena;
topol, and whether it was the fact that the men were se
emaciated as bas been represented. He told me that a glee
many men had died, and that a great many were stlll lien
bat with regard to a great portion of the troops who wen
of stronger constitutions, he said that they appeared to be
all their strength, and ready to perform any
duty which might be required of them. The hail
will permit me also to eall attention to the feet
that ours is not the only army before Sebastopol,
Then is the considerable fora of our allies baton
that plus, so that in fact not less a number them
80,000 men are there collected. I cannot but take this
opportunity to say that I have seen, with some disgust, the
attacks which have been made on the gallant commends/
of the British part of that force. (Hear, hear.) I amazes
he is not only an experienced soldier but that he is as feel-
ing and attentive to the sufferings of those under his corn.
nand—(hear, Year)—as any man who ever wore the British
uniform. (Hear, bear.) I hope, I believe, that he will
rise above the attacks which have been made upon Mat by
a ribald prose. (Hear, hear.) I must also take this eta.
den to say a word upon the present position of the exam
live. rho house bar now placed before it a minister, theans
minister of the crown, who has great experience upon tim
subjects now pressing upon the attention of us all—(hetc
hear)—whose energy is undoubted, and who has always
satisfied this house by declarations the most patriotic, and,
at the same time, by an adequate discharge of the dottes
which have been thrown upon him. (Hear, hear.) Ws
have also learned that a noble friend of mine has been celled
upon to undertake the duties of Secretary of State for ito
War Department. My noble friend was for a long ttoss
Secretary-at-Was in this house ; he is a perfect muter of
the principles which regulate our army, and he will, I
doubt not, turn his immediate attention to any improvement
which can be suggested. (Hear, hear.) He will not,
I believe, be induced to adopt, under the same
of improvement, innovations which might be destructive to
the very existence of the army ; but he will adopt, I ern
sure, every plan which the science of the present cloy, sag
the skill which enterprising men have brought to bear gm,
every kind of arms placed within his reach, for the ponees
of raising the condition of our soldiers. (Hear, hear)
believe that my noble friend the present Secretary of
State for the War Department will be ready to place that
army, which has suffered, not from want of discipline, or of
military organisation, in a position to sustain the reputatin
of the British soldier. (Hear, hear.) I have heard suer*
tions made that the whole military organisation of this coon.
try is defective. I do not pretend to speak as to the details
of that organisation, but this I know perfectly well, that
when the Duke of York and the Duke of Wellington car
mended an army, there was then no want of organised'.
—(hear, hear)—there was then no want of • fern ready
to sustain at any moment the reputation of this country.
(Hear, hear.) Nor can I think that there is so mock
of faultiness as it is now the hellion to imposts to or
system. I have no doubt that, in the years of peace which
we have passed through, many parts of our system may
have got out of use ; it may be that in the first year of war
we have attempted too much; but I have every hope, that
the establishments which are required will be organised,
and the changes which are necessary made by my noble
friend. I have no doubt but that this house will net
grudge him the means of carrying these necessary reforms
into effect. Moreover, sir, I feel sure that the majority of
this house will give to her Majesty's present advisers their
medial support, retaining of course their power to interfere
should at any moment the interests of the country be lest
sight of, at the same time giving to the ministry as oppor-
tunity of carrying out by means of the executive all the
measures which can be effected without an interference or
the part of this house prejudicial to the best interests of the
country. (Hear, hear.)
Mr. RICH thought that the right bon. gentleman (ths
Chancellor of the Exchequer) ought to explain the state-
ments which he made, and that the best interest* of the
country required that the whole truth should be known.
If our army were in the state which some hon. gentlemen
said it was, rather than that we should be in a Bute of
ignorance, it was much better that France, and even Runs
should know the facts.
Mr. S. WORTLEY explained that he did not presume
to find fault with hon. members for seeking information;
he only complained that they should make public desponding
and exaggerated pictures of the bad condition of our army.
Mr. G. BUTT explaineo that his object in rising Indium
solely to elicit information.
Mr. HARCOURT felt it his duty to state that the "pti-
vete letters which be bad received from the Crimea were
not of the despondent complexion of those refereed to by the
hon. member for Weymouth (tile. Butt). They spoke of
hardships, it was true, of bad weather, and of many other
vicissitudes of a soldier's life in actual service, but then
was no trace of despondency about them. (Hear, hear.)
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said that
after what bad been stated by his noble friend (Lord J.
Russell) behind him, in explanation of the apparent dis-
crepancy between his statement and those which appeared
in the public journals, it was hardly necessary for him to
add anything upon that subject. His noble friend had
already pointed out that the discrepancy arose from a diL
formes in the mode of estimating the numbers. In those
statements which made out that our army consisted of so
small a body of men, not only were all branches of the ser-
vice, except infantry, excluded, but even a considerable
portion of the rank and file were not taken into account.
This was because in every army a large portion of the rank
and file were employed in duties not strictly military,
But he (the Chancellor of the Exchequer) bad felt it
his official duty to rise on this occasion to correct a misap-
prehension of the hon. member for Inverness (Mr. Baillie),
who said that he (Mr. Gladstone) bad included in his state.
went, Turks, and also the sick and wounded. Now, he
begged to assure that hon. member and the house that theta
war not a single sick or wounded man, nor a single Turk—
that there was, in fact, no one but the members of the
British army included in the numbers which he stated no
the house when be said that there were 28,300 men en-
gaged in the discharge of military duty before Sebastopol.
That was the number when he made his statement; ten
days had since elapsed, and the number would perhaps be
somewhat altered. Re confessed that he did not wonder
at the statements which had been made that night in the
house, nor could he venture to complain of them. The
tide of feeling ran so strong when those who were possessed
of all one's sympathies were in a situation of so much hard.
ship, privation, and suffering, that be would be either mote '
or less than man, who, to the anxieties so much felt, vu
not forced to give some outward expression. Hence he
(Mr. Gladstone) would not presume to find fault; all be
would do was to beg and beseech of hon. members to place
sanutniceu, thechr statement
tennopt
made
adttebiry
thefee hon. member
spossible r
F.
fo For
tin;
mouth (Mr. Butt), a statement founded upon private in-
formation—
Mr. BUTT said he bad read the fads, to which he bad
adverted, in the aewspapen.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said the news.
papers could only form their statements upon private infer-
mation. However, the statement of the hon. member was not
confined to that house ; it would go forth into the world; and
however wrong such an idea undoubtedly was, there was a
notion amongst careless and idle readers that things said in
that house became backed by the weight of the house. Thus,
stateme,pte with little or no foundation, or, it might be, es-
aggerated and distorted, might be productive of mischief
shout incalculable. He would, therefore, ask hon. gentle-
men to place as much restraint upon themselves as their
natural interest would' allow them. (Hear.) He quite
agreed with those hon. gentlemen who urged the propriety
of asking fur information upon a doubtful matter; that was
a far more careful and less dangerous mode of proceeding
than the practice of placing before the house statements
founded upon information always more or leas open to error
Mr. G. DUNDAS said that he had not long since re-
turned from the Crimea, and from what he bad himself
observed he did not think the state of things there was so
bed as some hon. gentlemen made out. (Heir, hen) A
great deal of suffering undoubtedly arose from want of
fuel; but be was glad to find, when he was at Malta, that
Price's Candle Company_ had submitted to the Secretary
for War a very ingenious stove, by which a very small
quantity of fuel might be most advantageously used.
When hon. memben heard that men sometimes had to
sat their rashers of pork uncooked, they would at ones
see the privations that this want of fuel occasioned.
Mr. M'GREGOR said that it would be better if, instead
of these desultory conversations, members would
.see
that no vote was passed without a close and sufficient

.ed to, sad the hoses resumed.
JBBIILL'B EDUCATION BILL.
AL said, $a asking for leave to being is
gigela nodes, fqr the proloolig
nglead, row sot wish to say earbiag
4ad to • Aegasaion. It was desirable, how'
ee bill sholaWlse. introduced, in order that it
pr ale that the country might me what
us. It would, of wane, hereafter be
government to take say course the timed
Leave was then gives to bring in the
THE ARMY IN THE CRIMEA.
Oa the motion that the house do now adjourn.
Col. SIBTRORP said he deeply regretted that in the
meant state of affairs the Chancellor of the Exchequer
Wended to 'propose an adjournment for a week. He was
well aware that the members of the government were very
uncomfortable in their seats—(laughter)—and required a
little time for reflection and repentance with regard to the
course they had pursued; but the whole country would
object to any postponement of the pending inquiry. Every
hour was important, for the nation could have no confi-
dence in ministers who had been tried, condemned, and
he regretted that he eoald not add executed (Laughter.)
He loped the time was not distant when they would be
dismissed from their places, never to return. They were
certainly the worst lot of ministers he ever knew.
(Laughter.)
Mr. G. BUTT said the right hon. gentleman the Chan-
cellor of the Exchequer had recently stated, and the
country had been cheered by the statement, that the effee
tive force of the army in the Crimea at the data of the last
returns was, in round numbers, 30,000 men. That an-
nouncement had certainly created considerable surprise in
the minds of many who had friends in the Crimea with
whom they corresponded. He had himself received a letter
from a gentleman high in rank there, and capable, he
should have supposed, from his position, of forming a
tweet opinion, which supported the statement made the
other day in the Mews, that the effective force unfortu-
nately did not amount to 12,000 men. Of course there
was no party feeling on that question—there could be none.
The Chancellor of the Exchequer might rest assured that
his (Mr. Butt's) sole feeling oa the subject was that deep
anxiety which he shared with the country for the re-
mainder of the army which had achieved and suffered so
much. When be heard from a person so well-informed
as the right. bon. gentleman must be, that the amount of
the effective force at the date of the last niter's was 30,000
men, he concluded that that statement was derived from
the returns made from time to time to the Horse Guards
from the army. (Hear.) His object in rising was to beg the
right hon. gentleman to supply on the following
day information which would show that this state-
aunt was one which might be relied upon ; and he
need scarcely tell him that by so doing he would afford
great relief to the country. He bad read that day in the
Metes a prediction that a frightful Wasttophe was at
hand, the state of things being such that they could not
count upon an effectual resistance. Except the statement
of the right hon. gentleman, which certainly was a great
relief to him at first, there was no statement to be found
which did not point to the almost tirade annihilation of
the army ; and be did entreat the right hon. gentleman to
say something when the subject was introduced on the fol-
lowing day which would cheer the country during the
peried of adjournment. At present the country felt not
only that a great number of men bed perished through
neglect and incompetence, not only that a blot had bees
cast upon its owe fame, but that the very security of the
empire was endangered.
Mr. J 8. WORTLEY did not know whether the Chan-
cellor of the Exchequer was about to give any answer to
the hon. gentleman, but for his own part he most earnestly
deprecated repetitions of such statements as they had beard
from the benches of that house. (Hear, hear.) They were
sot only beard there, but were conveyed elsewhere, and
boa. members ought to recollect that a deep responsibility
rested upon those who repeated what they found in private
aesosate. He could not uaderstand the patriotism which
WOW Itself in repeating what he believed to be exagge-
rated reports as to the weakness of our force be-
fogs Sebastopol. (Hear, hear.) What good purpose
was it to serve ? Was it to be supposed that
what the noble lord the member for the City of London
bad well termed the "heartrending" sufferings of the
army, were not pressing on the minds of the government
at that moment; and was it, or was it not, the fact that
sew men had been appointed, for the purpose of remedy-
ing existing defects ? (Hear, hear.) Under these einem-
stances, was there any national object to be gained by re-
peating, day after day, these melancholy and deepondisg
statements, which he again said he believed to be gross
exaggerations? (Hear, hear.) He had himself blood
relations in the Crimea. and he had yet to learn that any
one officer had written home is such terms of despondency
as he had with shame beard within the walls of
that house. (Hear, hear.) Every letter which he
had recently seen spoke with the utmost confidence as
to the result of the expedition. (Hear, hear.) He would
ask whether it were fair to draw the comparisons which bad
been drawn between their army and that of the French?
It was not for him to say what was the present condition of
the French army or what had been its losses ; but he be-
lieved its condition would not be coasidered so excellent
were there in France opportunities for making statements
on the subject similar to those which existed in this
country. (Hear, bear.) The desponding statements which
had been put forth were calculated to discourage our
own soldiers end t• prompt the Russians to another attack.
If another battle of Inkermann was to be fought, it would
be upon those who make statements such as had been that
niebt heard in the belie that the blame would fall. He
(Mr. 8. Wortley) ed that the Russian army bad
suffered as much as our own ; nothing else could account for
their inaction. Let hon. gentlemen ask for a strong govern.
meet if they pleased ; let them sanction the selection by the
crown of those whom they believed to be able to form such
a government; but let them not put forward, night after
night, and upon private information, facts which, if they
were true (be at least believed them to be exaggerated),
would be Incentives to the enemy to take advantage of
our position. (Hur, hear.) He would ask hon. members
if they bed seen statements in French newspapers,
which were said to receive their tone from the influence of
the highest authorities, wherein was espriesed astonish-
ment and shame at the statements which bad been made in
the House of Commons ? Those journals stated that since
1815 this country had sought not to be a military nation—
(hear)—aod appeared to be content to rest on put glories,
whereas Prance ever since 1815 had been endeavouring to
recover from the misfortunes which she bad suffered ; that
the army had been the idol of France, that its organisetioa
bad been improved in every practicable manner, but said
they, "the English are now reaping the experience which
we have gained. '
Mr. H. BAILLIE did not think the leaned mem-
ber who had just sat down was quite justified in
his attempt to lecture into silence those gentlemen
on that (the opposition) side of the house, who
had asked for information from the government. If
any lecture were called for it should have been addressed to
the Chancellor of the Exchequer, for it was only through a
voluntary statement of that right hon. gentleman that the
matter now under discussion had been alluded to. (Hear,
beer.) He (Mr. Baillie) could understand the inconve-
nience of ministers not desiring to give information upon
the subject ; he could understand the Chancellor of the
Exchequer pleading the exigencies of the public service as
a reason for cot giving an answer to questions which might
he put to him ; but, when a minister of the crown thought
fit to make a voluntary statement setting forth facts in a
manner certainly not tallying with the generally received
views upon a question of great importance, it was
the right of the house nay, of every individual
member to know the grounds of the statement which the
right hon. gentleman had made. (Cheers.) It bed bees
said by some who professed to be able to give an opinion
upon the subject, that the Chancellor of the Exchequer, in
the statement which he volunteered to the house a few days
since, had included not only the Turks serving in the army
of the East but the sick and wounded also. He (Mr.
Baillie) did not see how else the discrepancy in the state.
resent of the right hon. gentleman was to be explained. For
his own part he believed that the actually effective number
of British bayonets in the But was 10,035 only.
Lord J. RUSSELL—I do not wonder that my right bon.
friend (Mr. 8. Wortley) wishes to avoid a discussion of this
kind, but at the same time there is one statement which
has been so commonly put forth, that I am not surprised
that hon. gentlemen opposite ask for some explanation, and
that they are surprised that there should be a discrepancy
between what is ordinarily circulated as the state of the
army and the official account which they hear from minis.
airs. The statement usually put forward fixes the number
of men before Sebastopol at about 12,000, and it is gene.
rally understood that 54,000 have been sent out. It is then
asked, how is it possible that, having seat out 54,000, you
have now only 12,000 remaining, and how comes it that so
enormous a number as 42,000 men have been
lost to the army. Now the house ought to be in-
formed that this is not a fair comparison. If
you take 64,000 on the one side as the number sent out, you
ought not to take 12,000 as the number remaining in the
Crimea. (Hear, hear.) The 54.000 includes all the cavalry
and all the artillery; it includes every commissioned and
every non commissioned officer; it ineludes every man pre-
sent under arms, every one employed as an orderly, upon
hospital duty, or in any way whatever. Hence, when you
have taken away all the artillery and all the cavalry, all
officers, whether commissioned or non-commissioned, and all
'menenaployed in various ether duties not strictly military,you
will get at a fair number with which to compare the number
of men now spoken of mutually under arms in the Crimea.
If you speak of the number sent out as 54,000 you must add
all these persons to the number of effective bayonets now
berme Sebastopol; they Were included in the mess of the
64,000. They ought now also to be included. When an
endemics wad made in this , it would be found that
the discrepancy would disappear. Renee it is a mistake
into which bon. ruttiness have fallen, but it is a mistake
which I think ought to be convected ; and I cannot but
think that ft wilt be a comfort to the house and the country
to know the real teeth. (Hear, bear.) Of course the state
of our troops Las town lemeatahle. and I should be the last
I versos fa this haul .to soy ant hos. members should

scrutiny.
_ The hones then adjourned et 20 minutes pest 6 to ROOS

HOLLAND.—It is stated in a letter from the High,
of the tad, that the Dutch government intends to present
bills to the Chambers for effecting diminutions of tams of
ma a larger scout than thosa wbieh attain memben of
the opposition had intended to prime.

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