The Express.
London, England, 1855-03-29 00:00:00

4.14F1ai

THE ARMY BEFORE SEBASTOPOL.

MR. ROEBUCK'S COMMITTEE.
Yesterday Dr. Menzies, Inspector General of Hos-
pitals, wu recalled, and subjected to a crows:amine-
mu on various points elicited in his previous evidence.
He said that when the day before he stated to the

eommittee that he did not know hie duties," he meant that
his position was such an anomalous one. When Dr. Cum-

"Mg came out to the Crimea he (Dr. Menem) laboured
'leder the impression that hr to a certain extent superseded
Wes although Dr. Cumming told him that he did not take
drop et the hospital ; and yet at the same time be gave
eiders. In fee, ne looked on Dr. Clamming while he was
there to be the principal medical Aker. Dr. Cumming
arrived on the 4th of November, and gave directions in the
hospital, being witneu's superior in the service. Bethought
Dr. Cumming superseded him for the time being. Still he
was of opinion that he (witness) was the really responsible
person for all that went on in the hospital; but Dr. Cum-
ming being his senior, he gave orders u well as witneon
He considered Dr. Cumming responsible from the day of
his arrival for anything faulty in the state of the hoopital.
His impression was that he had no right to dispute Dr
Cummiag's orders, or to countenance them, he being his
superior officer, bat he locked on Dr. Cumming u roman,
sible for all the orders he gave. He had an impression that
Dr. Cumming came out to assume the general charge of
the hospital; but the general reports were all made to
witness. In the strict letter of the law, he ought not,
bring himself responsible, to have allowed another,
to do that for which he alone was answerable.
He took the whole charge of the hospital from Jape to
January. and he was responsible for ice general superintend
enee. He would not allow any indifferent person to give
orders, but did not consider Dr. Cumming to be ad indif-
ferent person. It was a universal rale in the army to show
a document of niperudeas where a person was to be re-
moved, but Dr. Cumming did not do this, and no instruc-
tions were given by the oommander-in-chief, nor were any
specific regulations given out upon the subject. Dr. Cum-
ming gave orders that extras should be given to the patient.
not as a commissioner, but only as witness's superior officer ;
and he took upon himself a duty belonging to witness, pre •
bably because it was desirable, but on no authority. He
considered Dr. Cummiog's orders, as his superior officer,
should be obeyed. This was his view of military medical
discipline after a long experience in the army. He had no
official eotnounication to the effect that Dr. Congaing was
to take the superintendence of his hospital, but his
impression was It was mentioned to him by a b4ll
authority, whose name he did not recollect. He
had heard from Dr. Hall that be should be relieved by
Dr. Cumming in the superintendence of the hospital. •
great objection to the situation of the dud-house was that
the sick and wounded had to be carried by the rooms wham
the patients were, and he, on that ground, objected to the
position of the dead-house ; but he could not, as there were
no buildings, select any better place, and could not remelt•
bee whether the room next it bad any patients in it. He
would request the committee to remember that his position
was a most trying one, and that his duties were so over-
powering that be could not attend to everything ; but he
issued proper directions to the officers, and expected them
to be carried out and attended to. Although his duties were
of this character he did not complain of his mullion, think-
log it would be of no use, es there were not sufficient
officers to relieve him. If the orders he gave were not
duly carried oat it was because the circumstances
would not permit of it, and from there not
being the necessary conveniences at the time. He
had an operating theatre in the general hospital and an
operating table in the barrack hospital, and he did not bear
say complaints on that score; and if the Rev. Mr. Osborne
stated there was no table, and that a man had to
be supported without a table during an operation, he (wit-
ness) was not acquainted with it. There was an operating
table is the barrack hospital, but not at the commencement,
and latterly they got operating tables made, after the battle
of BelaMave. In preparing a hospital the first thing to be
done was to prepare a room for operations ; and if Mr.
Osborne, who was at Scutari in November, stated there was
no operating table, he questioned the truth of it, though the
rev. gentleman might have supported a man while an °pew
doe was being performed, and one of the tables might have
been rieketty. Sanctions the operations wire performed
Is the sight of the sick and wounded ; but there wee
lie much confusion and so much to do that to attend
to everything was impossible. Some allowance oast
lbe wads from the immense number of wounded
that arrived, though prior preparations of course
were made. He received instructions to prepare a hospital
et Scutari for the wounded, from the commandant, Msjor
[finery, but he had not his letter on the subject.
He bad, however, a letter that he addressed to the
lummandaet on the 7th of August, in which be
I stated the amount of accommodatipn that could bapro-

vided for the sick and wounded in the hospital' at
Kola.e and the general hospital at Scutari, in the case of a
sadden emergency. He reported that the hospital at
Koalas was calculated to coatain 2,000 men, and that it
possessed all other requisites, but that it was not so eligible
ea available as the -hospital proposed to be formed at
Sanaa, which was well placed at the entrance of
Use Bosphorus, and opposite the sea of Marmors,
for the reception of the sick and wounded. In
consequence of this and other recommendations con-
tained in that report, he was authorised to carry out its
suggestions. Thought preparations were necessary to re-
ceive the wounded when they arrived, and that it would
have been desirable to have had a partition between the
operating department and the sick and wounded, so that
operations might not be dons before the eyes of the invalided
and disabled, and this was done latterly. There was a die-
peneary-room at the barrack hospital with shelves and medi-
sines. It was open day and night, sad be was not aware
that the man who made up the prescriptions was absent at
any time, or the medical officer would have reported it.
There were medical stores us a large room in the barrack
hospital, but they were heaped up without any order in the
corridors, because, he supposed, they had not room for them
elsewhere. Sheds might bare been built, but they were not,
there really was so much to do.
Mr. Lured—But nothing was done. It was much ado
about nothing. (Laughter.) When you say there was
really so much to do, does it mean the making reports end
writing letters, in which you appear is have been princi-
pally engaged, when men were miserably dying of starva-
tion and want of clothes, and medical aid, as represented
by the Rev. Mr. Osborne ?
Witness begged to give the evidence of the rev, gentle-
man, on that bead, the most unqualified contradiction. He
had a great deal more to do than merely writing reports.
He bad to go roust' the hospitals and see that all the medi-
cal officers did their duty, and to attend all important
operations.
The Chairman—When you found all the stores piled up
in the higgle-de-piggledy way described, did you take any

steps to ;ale thißivejor die his duty ?.
Witness—The purveyor knew -his duty, and be (witness)
did his best to =eke him fulfil it.
Mr. Layard—Did you reprimand, censure, or in any way
punish him, or any individual who neglected to do his duty
cemented with the hospital ?
Witness—l sent one officer away.
Mr. Layard—What was he ?
Witness—A copying clerk. (Laughter.) The Russian
prisoners were removed to Rohde*. They were under
witness's care, but the medical offices saw them removed.
If Mr. Osborne said no one took proper are of them and
that they were grossly insulted, he must deity Mr. Osborne's
statement. A guard was placed over them, and, as far se
he understood, they had all proper supplies when they ar-
rived at Halals*. He sent a medical officer on with them,
bat it was difficult to remember his name. There was a
Mr. Krensikoff, who was a Russian prisoner himself, but he
had the power of supplying them. Beds were supplied them
and bedding at Halals, and they did not sleep on the bus
boards to his knowledge. He did not go and see them, for
he bad other matters to attend to; end he did not send
any one to see that the elate of the things was satisfactory.
He could not believe Mr. Osborne's statement oa this point,
and he had teem to believe they wanted nothing. It was
the duty of the purveyor, es well as witness, to see that
entytbiag was properly provided. When a wounded man
arrived at Scutari his clothes were taken from him, be was
pat to bed, and it was the duty of the medical officer to
prescribe for him.
Mr. Layard—lt hes been stated to the committee that the
man were frequently static naked, and that in an utter Mate
of audity they were left on the common boards.
Witness—l never saw this, and must deseaseeAsy state-
ment to that effect as incorrect. The purveyor clothed them,
and the orderly medical officers got the medicines from the
dispensary. If they wanted tinnier arrowroot the steward
pot it, and these individuals were supposed to have all these
things at band. The !geed Mr. Wreford was 62. He was
still at the bead of the purveying depeitmeat, bat he could
not say he satisfied him in doing his duty. lie made repre-
sentations to the commandant sad to Dr. Smith as to
Mr. Wreford not being an efficient °Son, and as to his
opposing witness's authority, in December ; bat he had not
bean removed. Mr. Wreford had access to all parts of the
hospital, and when the sisk were sent home he had the
arrentemente, and if they were sent home improperly pro-
vided for, the commandant and Mr. Wreford had the ar-
rangements, gad were responsible. He (witness) took care
the invalids r koala be supplied with blankets and clothing
for the move.
The Choi rmaa—Then, if they were not supplied, you
were "'IP° nsible ?
Witner a—Yes. The duty of supplying the beds was the
admiral* e. It was the duty of the orderly medical rffieer to
ass that they were properly provided for, and if not, it was
his dun Ito report it to whams. Tke official regulations first
got to him two months before he left &staid. According to
the -at regulation the purveyor was responsible to witness;
but it was thought that some of these regulations were not
ar,,licahle to the East.
Mr. Layard—Wby they are espressly headed R.rulations
'for the Army in the Ran. He did not point out this regu-
lation
to Mr. Wreford because he was already aware of it.
Dr. Smith was acquainted with the fact that Me. Wreford
defied his (Whams's) instructions, or, at any rate, did not
carry nut his recommendations. In one case be suggested
the appointment of a purveyor, and Me. Wreford questioned
.weeitrds'criaughhtetocoinnsteuirtieedrehwimlthashtimo
some
labil atofeifilhtherA,iicldeo:i)schetnahae.
not he turned round on him aod said,
ohing to do with it. He (witness) frequently operated
hims.lf in the hospitals, but generally divided the opera-
tion with a seeeed.cless surgeon. Was present, or nearly
so, at every operation, it being the duty of every heed me-
dical _officer to be alweio must, an4tia iniantak;

duties caked him elsewhere, but there was on
duty so important as presiding at an operation
and seeing it properly performed. His deputy on these
occasions was first...class eieftsurgeon Carr at the general
and Dr. M'Greoer at the Barrack Hospital. At first the
h.apitels were short of medical mai:tune, but latterly they
were well supplied. He should lay that altogether there
was not a sufficiency of medical officers, but the patients
did not stiffer to any considerable extent The medical
officers worked night and day, and they were instantly on
the spot when required. Though short of number., the few
did a great deal of work. The vital powers of many of the
wounded that arrived were so low, that they would have
died under hasty operations. The head of the medical de-
partment at Chatham and Gibraltar were always present at
important operations. Mr. Wreford applied to Messrs.
Black for supplies of port wine, but he wee
not aware that be gave directions to him to
do so, and be did not know why that particular
" house " was applied to, or what quantity was sent out
from Holland. He did not know that the applieivie,a to
Messrs. Black was in consequence of a scarcity of wine rent
out from home. He received instructions from Mr. 8. Her-
bert with regard to the duties of Miss Nightingale in the
ouspital, and from Dr. Smith to the effect that he was to
afford her every assistance, and to point out in what way the
nurse. would be useful, and to attend to any suggestions she
might make. She was to receive his orders, and he was to
auead to any suggestions she made as to the nurses' depart-
ment. Their duties were to be reciprocal ; and Miss
Nightingale, when she arrived, stated to witness she was
quite astonished to find the hospital in such good
order She said this to him verbally, when she
• d, on the 4th of November, at Scutari. In
a private letter to Dr. Hail in December, be stated hew
the nurses were going on, and that they were very useful
in washing the faces and hands of the sick and wounded,
and in washing the linen, and attending to their comforts ;
but that at present their number was too small to enable
them to judge of their efficiency. The hospital was then
in tolerable order, cleanliness, and comfort; and Miss
Nightingale observed to him, that she was surprised at the
regularity and comfort that appeared to prevail in every
ward in the general hospital. He had no fear of the
strictest inquiry, and the medical men discharged
their duties with the utmost seal and devivion.
He called on the purveyor to make a return of the repairs
required for the hospital to Ceptain Gordon, tie officer (tom-
mantling the engineers, shorty before the wounded arrived
from Alma, and he also applied to have repair*. done to
the flooring at the barrack huepnal, end Content Gordon
undertook to attend to them. There were 2,000 patients in
the barrack hospital in November, and the purveyors were
supplied with clean linen before Miss Nightingale's arrival.
According to the return, which be could not confirm, only
six shirts were washed in the barrack hospital is Novem-
ber. It was the duty of the purveyor to purchase shirts,
hut he could not say there were any purchased before Slim
Nightingale arrived, but there were no reports made to tim
that they were not supplied. Considerable difficulties were
occasioned to him by Mr. Wars inefficiencies and deficien-
. .

ties • but although both Mr. Ward (now died) sud— Hr.
Wreford were deficient, he did not report against them. He
bad been examined befure the medical commimion sent out
te the Rut, sad he frequently made representations of the
stabs of the hospital to the sentniandant.
To Colonel Lindsay : He had not heard that some of the
wounded brought down to Scutari remained is the bospi-
tAl fur days with the earth on their wounds which they had
got in the field of battle. All the wounded effivers were
sent to Scutari, where there was room enough for their ac-
commodation; but be had allowed some officers who bad

come down sick, but not wounded, to go into Cunitantinople
at their own request, instead of coming into the hospital at
Scutari. When the board at Scutari decided that any offi-
cer might return home on sick leave, such officer was
allowed to proceed home at once.
To General Peel—The returns when made to him of
deaths on board the sick transports were numerical sod not
nominal ; but in some cases he never received any return
of those deaths at all.

Dr. Duebreck was next called, and he stated io reply to
questions from the chairmen. that he was a deputy-In-
spector general of hospitals at Constantinople. He arrived
there on the 16th April, and commenced his duties en the
following day. He established a general hospital at Verna,
whither he bad gone before the arrival of the forces there.
He did not choose the hospital there ; he had it assigned to
him. It was übjectionable in many respects. The windows
in it were like pigeon holes, the privies were indescribably
filthy, and many parts of the hospital wire covered
with vermin. Beene he left 'Varna, through great
exertions made at his instance, the sanitary state
of the hospital wu improved, though far from
twin in a satisfactory state. He remained in charge
of the hospital about a month, and was then suc-
ceeded by Dr. Hall. The food in the hcspitsl and tho camp
was good, and the bedding in the hospital was satisfactory.
At first, when the regiments begin to arrive at Scutari, no
purveyor's stores had presided t‘em there, end what sick
there were had food and comforts from thei commissariat.
The comforts were not such as a purveyor would have sup-
plied. After the battle of the Aline, at which be wan pre-
sent, be saw r o want of medicines or surgical appliances.
SO far as came under his observation. He left the camp
before Sebastopol on the 13th of November, up to wleich
time there were no wants among the troops that were
not supplied; but there was a prospective scarcity of fuel.
Green coffee wee served out in the camp, but he knew that
SING asful attempts were made to toast it, but that was
only done by a kind of make-shift. Ile should certainly
say the use of green coffee would be most prejudicial to
health. Before he left the Crimea, some medicines, espe-
cially opium, were consumed so rapidly as to ..use appre-
hensions of a scarcity. He sent to the spothecire at
Scutari for a fresh supply of opium, and he got it. He
believed he applied for 5011 m., and he got 30Ibe. Of lint,
on that
gotti,hkinaitli
act Far
..cr A.
it
fallob'
neut.:7d ",
He
cebeerwe
bandage., and things of that kind, there was a cum-
uli'. The
es
presentnarmyth gent slightestetvheer Asulmffevar,eesdatie
Inkermann, and he saw no want of medical comforts
on any of those =twins. He did not think much
individual suffering was caused by the ambulance weggons
we used. There was mule about thou ambulances which
he approved, though he thought some of the features in
the French ambulances might be advantageously engrafted
upon them.
To Mr. Layard—He wu only responsible for Dr. Menzies'
appointment thus far. When Dr. Hall left Scutari, Dr.
Menzies succeeded him, as much firm being on the spot as
from any other consideration ; and, besides being on the
spot, Dr. Menzies was the senior officer of his rank in the
medical department of the army. He was not at Seutftri
when Dr. Menzies was appointed. He (witness) preceded
the arrival of the forces in Bulgaria, and before they came
be, at the request of Dr. Smith (as we under-
stood) was engaged in inquiring into, and tutoring
upon the diseases peculiar to that country, and
the hest means of avoiding and treating them.
I He made several suggestions calculated, if carried out, as
he thought, to prevent disease smug the troop, but they
were not, or only very partially, adopted. nose suggestions,
however, had reference only to the stay of the army in Bul-
garia. One of those sugge-tions was, that from September
until May the army should be clothed in woollen ; but it
was not acted upon. The confusion in the hespites at
Scutari was certainly not creditable to our system. At first
there wee no purveyor there at all, and no sufficient hospital
corps. He thought Dr. Menzies was ovesuorked, and that
be was put into a position that no one man ought to have
been placed in. The presence of a superior medical ufficar
on any military station necessarily, by the laws
of the service, superseded the medical officer in
chugs and on duty ; hut then that must is-
merin general orders. lf, however, such superior
came to the station to discharge only a specific duty
hsdid not take the command of the station. A charge had
been made against the medical department that there was a
wont of lint, bandages, and medical comforts after the battle
of bakermaan. That was a calumny He was able to state
his own knowledge that an ample supply of these articles
big reachod the lines early in the day of the battle. He
I hod visited the hospital at Balaklava often, and he certainly
sever saw it in anything like tie condition described by Mr.
Stafford. Witness proceeded to enumerate several of the
transport ships for the sick which be had inspected profession-
ally previous to their entering on that service, especially the
Etrunga and the Talavere, both of which he described as
being in the highest possible order. He had 400 mattresses
provided for the sick in those transports, and 2,500
palliasses. It was his intention to have provided more pal-
liasse', but he wee unable to get a supply of hay with
which to stuff them. Re had seen Dr. Lawson with his
own hands spreading mattresses for tt.e sick en board the
Medway. After the battle of Inkermano, the bedding on
board the sick transports failed. Many of those ve.sels,
however, were supplied with medicines and combats ac-
cording to lists drawn up by himself, and with reference to
the number of sick. Ile also ordered ten dozen of port
wine to be placed on board each transport, but he was
laughed at ; and by the direction of Dr. Hall, his senior
officer, the quantity was cut down to tour and six dozen.
He mired the hospital tents regularly. Before be left,
the sick is the tents were still lying on the ground
is their great coats. Some of the divisions were
better off than others in respect to burins, rents.
Just before he left the Crimea he beard that in the
Light Division the sick had got a number of beds in
the hospial tents. The hospital tents were admirably adapted
for the purpose in fine weather, but not in winter. The
hospital marquees were excellent ; but the tect4 devoted to
hospital put poses were most of them thin and old. A large
proportion of the sick were accommodated in the marquees.
He thought it most desirable to hove mined DIM.. for the
hospitals, such as had been embodied by Miss Nightie.: we,
and also trained orderlies.
To Mr. Drummond—The routine services the molical
officers had to perform, the accounts they bed to keep, and
the great amount of writing they hod rod
do, most
duties. s. roe. ly
interfered with the discbarge of their mul
Mr. Drummond asked witness if that bad not been the
principal cause of the neglect that bad taken place in the
poems' departments?
Witness replied that he did not admit that any neglect
bad existed.
Mr. Drummond rejoined that that was another affiir,
into which he would not then enter.
Witness, in reply to Lord Seymour, stated that the sys-
tem of maintsining regimental hospitals in time of roue
bad operated disadvantageoutly to the establishment of se-
petal army hospitals in time of war.
He was under examination when the committee ad-
joutned until this day.

NEwl
derived
464,0091.

i
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rSPAPER STAMPIL—Lest year die revenue
from newspaper stamps, at vat penny ants, waa
'L le. 74- VII !limber inu,4 wes 1.11,302,179.