The Express.
London, England, 1855-03-22 00:00:00

THE STATISTICAL SOCIETY.

DISCUSSION ON LOANS RAISED BY MR. PITT.
On Monday evening theflith ordinary meeting of
the Statistical Society for the session 1864-66 was held at the
rooms of the society in St. Janses's-square ; W. Tooke,
Esq., F.R.S., to the chair. The attendance, which was un-
usually numerous, included Lord Ouretone, Lord Mar-
rowby, Lord CIMISTVOS Lord Ebrington, M.P., Sir C.
Luau, Sir J. Boileau, bin., &o.
After the transaction of some routine business, a ditmission
took plans on " the loans raised by Mr. Pitt during the first
French war,1793-1801." The paper treating of this subject
read by Mr. Nomura at a late meeting of the society, has
appeared in the Daily News.

Dr. Future, who sow opened the discussion, took saioppo.
site line of argument to that adopted by Mr. Newmarch,
maintaining in brief, that Mr. Pitt did not make the beet
bargain on the part of the nation possible to hiss at the
dins, and that the system of landing which he carried out
was highly injurious. This view was combatted by the
Berl of fierrowby and Mr. Hill. Mr. Hodge, Mr. Daneoo,
sad Mr. Nelson also spoke, the discussion extending over •
wide range of topics, and betokening wide ditterences of
opinion amongst the members of the society, on matters of
lame.. Late in the evening Lord Overstates rose.
Lied OVIESTONI, after observing that he had not given
Os subject the attention it was entitled to receive, eon-
issed—l have seen but a portion of Mr. Newinuotes
pamphlet, having been interrupted during the parasol, but
I read that portion with the greatest interest, and certainly
felt that, to • great extent, I agreed with him. I
have
superficial view of the subject which would, from
the mere fact that the nemisol amount of debt
exceeds the amount of money received, bring at once
a charge of grime ignorance or neglect of duty, or indiffer-
ence towards national interests, to one of the greatest states-
men that hes ever flourished in Europe, and who was
characterised by an order of intellect stleismescountered in
oar history. (Hear, hear.) Those who hastily attribute
all this to Mr. Pitt are speaking without sufficient study,
and their opinions must undergo • severe examination
before they eon be entertained by superior and seriously-
reflecting men. It seems to me, sir, that the qpestion before
us this evening can be approached in a very simple form.
It is, as I think, merely this: Was the money borrowed by
Mr. Pitt on behalf of the nation, borrowed upon the best
terms which the circumstances of the times permitted, or
from blameable waste or ignorance, was it borrowed on less
favourable terms than he could have obtained ? To answer
i that, we have to ascertain the rate of isterest at which the
loans were borrowed. That is a branch of the subject to
which Mr. Newmarch has well addrersed himself;
and you will find upon reference to the figures
that the absolute rate of interest which we contracted
to pay, was below, and not above the market rate
of interest at that period. (Hear.) Another question is,—
did Mr. Pitt, in borrowing that money, give to the lender a
security which indirectly involved an injury to the nation
and a benefit to the lender beyond what the nation paid
for ? That again must be to • considerable extent a matter
of positive calculation; and if calculated, it will prove, I
thick. that the advantage to the lender and disadvantage to
the borrower was not so great as is ordinarily &apposed. But
we must remember also that these loans were the object of
public oompetitios. If the advantages were so extraordi-
narily great to the leader, bow some* it that the lenders
did not raise their terms, and by the ordinary principles
which regulate the market price, give higher and better
terms to the borrower? We have been dealing with this
question to-night too much in an abstract or philosophical
light. You must show that it was in Mr. Pitt's power to
do otherwise. Some gentleman objected to the argument
that the borrower was in the hands of the lender, and con-
tended that the lender was in the hands of the borrower

- -
How was it in the saw in point ? Mr. Pitt wee
the person coming on behalf of the nation at •
moment of great difficulty, when the national safety was at
stake, and he was therefore • borrower of absolute necessity,
and an immediate borrower by necessity. (Hear, hear.)
What were the circumstances of the lenders. They were
perfectly free to lend or not to lend ; to lend now or to wait
another year. Under such circumstances, the borrower
I say was in the hands of the lender. He must come forward
and borrow not only on such terms as the lender of but
mot offer securities of each a form, character, and duration,
no will be most popular with the lenders. (Hear, bear.) Mr.
Pitt was necessarily tied up moreover by the actual state of
the money market at the time. At that period the stock
market was loaded with • largeness of floating stock—stock
that is in the hands of dealers and speculators. Mr. Pitt could
not wait, be must raise millitcis and tens of mil-
lions at once, for the defence of England was at stake.
His alternative was either to bonus In the stock in
which he did borrow, or not to borrow at all.
And that he was alive to these considerations and conscious
of the ultimate advantages of borrowing on higher stocks,
and involvieg termination at so distant period, we have
evidsace in the fact that • portion of many of his lean. were
borrowed in those stocks. He was as sagacious in these
matters as we are ; but the public safety was his first con-
suieratioo, and that provided for, he took the portions of the
debt then required in other securities. The issuing of ex-
chequer beads by the Chancellor of the Exchequer in the
late ministry was analogous in principle to that adopted by
Mr. Pitt. It was with Mr. Pitt est mousiest. rerun►. His
lordship then expressed the alarm with which he had heard
the propositioa to raise money for the state by mortgage,
sad ooncladed with expressing the hope that the country
would not be desirous to augment the debt, from the idea
that because the property of the country was augmented, an
augmented debt would not expose us and posterity to very
many dangers.
- - - - -

- -
The CHAIRIMN observed that he had a perigee recollec-
tion of the circumstances under which Mr. Pitt had effected

'the loses, sad no one at that time b. that a diffaeat
mode mold be adopted.
_ _

Mr. tiswstuaci then made an able reply to the various
objeetions which hie paper had united, end with his remarks
the discussion wu brought to a aloes.

Ms. LAW'S COLLECTION Or Ai

small eollection of autographs, which was brought to the
bummer by Messrs. Penick and Simpson, of Piccadilly. on
I Monday sad Tuesday last, contained some 'samples of more
thee usual interest. In some departments the collection
was .very meagre; in autographs of royal personages, for
instance), but of men who, net bens born to greatness, or
' having it thrust upon them, have achieved it fur themselves,
the catalogue prrsented an array of illustrious names of all
periods, from Praline Bacon to the present day. The fol-
lowing brief Het will show the measure of appreciation
awarded to sash matters in these, as some choose to term
them. times of depressioe. Lot 4,a letter of Joseph Addi-
son, 21. Be. Lot 21, &letter of Lord Bacon, enlarging on the
happinem of bevies a good wife, 161. Lot 42, -a litter of
Junes Boswell, 81. Lot 60, a letter of Hobert Barns, 41. 166.
Lot 86, a letter of the reformer, Jolla Calvin, 92.95. Lot 78,
a letter of the great Lord Chatham, ealieseug verses ad-
dressed to David Garrick, 131.105. USDA &MAW of Fredetie
Prises of Wales and the Prisesse /reyssta, on one sheet,
61. 16s. Lot 147, a letter of David Geeriek, 41.45. Lots
164 and 166, two letters of Oliver Moldierisith, 161. 12s. Lot.
272 and 273, two letters of Mary, Crew et William 111.,
71. 18,. Lot 317, a short letter of Ille Isom Newton, as
Muter alba Mint, deoliaing to reesememd to saw a oon-
Tired counterfeiter of the coin, this under sasesses of
death, 41. Lots 404 to 408, three letters of Sir nieltard
Steele, 81. ls. Lot 444, a letter of George Washington, 61.
Lot 480, a letter of John Wesley, 81.8.. Lot 478, a letter
of Sir Christopher Wren, 31. Lot 490, the draft letter book
of 8. Pep's, connected with the drain of Christ'. Hospital,
64. 179.84. There were several letters of Nelson I. the col-
lection, in ens of which he lemur of his arm as being " in a
fair way of healing ;" these letter sold for about 41. each.
It was enreelind that all the mineral lots sold foe more
than dry Imo Plealbeed a previous 'actions. Surely here
is centre dee "adlosesea."

LORDS ELDON AND STOWELL. The White
Horse Inn, retterslase, wee formerly the great Oxford
house : here Lord Rides when he kft school and ohne to
London, in 1776, met'his brother, Lord Stowell. "Be
took me," lays Lord Elden, " to me the play at Drury-lane.
Love played Jams in the farce, and Ms Pop, played
N.U. When we came oat of the hones it rained hard.
Then were then few lasokasromehes, sad we both got
Into see sedan-chair. Turning out of Floinownt law Fit-
ter-lane, there was a sort of contest between oar dualism.
sad soma persons who win comics op Flat-street, whether
they Afraid first pass Fleet stress, or we in our chair first
get oat of Fleet-sine% into Fetter-laps. In the straggle
the sedan-chair was overact, with as in it." (Lord Eldgfee
Awake Book.)—Tiasos'a CwienNe 01 Looden.