The Express.
London, England, 1863-05-19 00:00:00

THE i'XIMIESS, TUESDAY -EVENING, MAY 19, 1863.

Mr. NBWDEGATE mid every bon. ireseiber who voted
for this bill would vote for a long stride is the direction of
raising up an antagoeistic supremacy it this country, which
timid not but lea& to divisions, heart-burnings, and strife,
as it had done before. (Hear, hear.)
Mr. ADDERLEY said • very short amended bill of the
existing act of George IV. would be amply sufficient to
meet the exigencies of the rase. It might give the visiting
justices the responsibility of seeing that in proper cams the
Roman catholic prieopers had the attendance of their priests.
such remuneration to be given as the visiting justices might
think fit. He was aware that such a measure would not
have the same weight in the eyes of Roman catholic'
as the present bill ; but that was it. very mischief.
Mr. BRIGHT said be did not believe there was a
city in this country in which there was • gaol con•
taining protestant and catholic prisoners in which city there
might not be found onostantly benevolent and Christian
men, who would devote all the time necessary for teaching
these prisoners, and that without any act of parliament
enforcing their attendance, or any stipend to remunerate
them for their services. But that was not • plan which
the government would recommend, or to which the house
would probably consent. They, however, adopted the other
plan, of having* fixed minister for the prisoners of their own
church, and they gave him • stipend, and specified his duties.
They bad within the walls of these prisons, or many of
them, • considerable number of catholic prisoners, and be
said that on every principle of justice and equality as
among the population of this kingdom, they ought to be
treated in the name manner in regard to their education mid
their moral and religious training, while they were under
the care of the state as prisoner', as those of any protestant
denomination or the members of their own church. (Hear,
hear.) And therefore he, who did not want to pay either
church minister or catholic priest —who thought it might be
done in some other way—could not in his conscience
leave the present state of things as he found
them, and felt bound to vote for the bill.
The house then divided, when there appeared :
For the third reading 196
Against it l6l-29
The bill was than read a third time and pugged.
CASE OF W. B. FA.RQUHARBON, A CONVICT.

CHINA.
Lord NAAS gave notice that 'kind') alter Whitsuatide,
ea seeps into committee of supply, he should call attention
to the state of affairs is Chine. (Hear, hear.)
FERRTHAENDDIST.RESSid
theIhNo.THEwNIRT H.remember that
three weeks ago he brought under their notice the condition
employed in the cotton manufacture. In
of the
operatives
resident of the Poor.lawßoardstatedat an
engineer bad already been sent into Lancashire
forth.pur-
pose of providing the people with work, and that he had
no doubt that gentleman would in three weeks have made
his report. He wished now to ask Whether that report had
bees received.
Mr. VILLIERS observed that the bon. gentleman had
misunderstood the statement to which he had referred.
He (Mr. Villiers) could not have said that he had sent down
any person to make the inquiries, because what he said
somata to a proposition in lieu of one made by the hoc.
gentleman himself. But he did say that if • person com-
petent, se he presumed such • person would be, were sent
down to make such inquiries, it would require mom than
three weeks to complete them. The civil engineer who
was directed to proceed to there districta on that day three
weeks to make those inquiries bad just forwarded to him his
report. The inquiry was not concluded, but by means of
great industry and energy the report was very nearly com-
plete. The report was very fuU, but he hoped to be able
to place it on the table to-morrow.
GREENWICH HOSPITAL.
Mr. LIDDELL asked the Secretary to the Admiralty
whether it was true that the late Aooountant-General had
been in the receipt of ;103/. per annum from the funds of
Greenwich Musa ; and, if so, what duties on account of
the hospital he performed ; whether his successor continued
to receive the same salary and to perform the same duties ;
and if not, what amiogementa were made for the proper
auditing of the prize accounts, and under what authority the
remuneration for the performaeoe of such duties was charged
upon the revenues of Greenwich Hospital.
Lord C. PAGET in reply stated that Sir Richard Brom.
ley, the late Accountant-General of the Na?. enjoyed •
salary of 3001. a year on account of his duties, which were
onerous, as auditor of the prize accounta. That money
was not taken from the funds of Greenwich Hospital at all,
but from the Five per Cent. Reserve Fund, which was kept
back from ell prize monies for various contingencies, future
claims and other matters. With regard to the questions
as to who abouid be the future auditor, and what salary
such officer should receive, those were matters which were
now under the consideration of the government.
BRAZIL.
Mr. POLLARD-URQUHART asked the Crider Secretary
of State for Foreign Affair had the Brazilian minister de-
manded his pusporta, or made any communication to her
Majesty's government to the effect that he had instructions
whit's might require him to suspend diplomatic relations be-
tween England and Brasil; was any correspondence pend-
ing ; and would it be laid upon the table of the horror when
complete?
Mr. LATARD said the only answer he could give wet
tha. the correspondence between her Majesty's government
and the Bouillon minister was still pending, and it would
of course be highly inconvenient at present to lay the
papers on the subject upon the table of the house.
THE VOLUNTEER BILL
Replying to a further question,
The Marquis of HARTINGTON said he proposed to
take the committee on this bill that day fortnight.
COURTS OF JUSTICE CONCENTRATION.
Mr. A. MILLS inquired of the Secretary of State for the
HMO. Department whether her Majesty's government
had arrived at any decision as to the course to be adopted
with reference to the building and concentration of
courts of justice, and the sites to be chosen for that pur-
poem ; and, if so, whether he would state what ruessureesit
ha been determined to adopt.
Sir 0. GREY replied that his right hon. friend would
bring in • bill for the appropriation of certain funds for the
purpose referred to, and in the event of that measure re-
raving the sanction of parliament, a bill for the coscentra-
tion of the courta would be ink-educed next session. The
bill could sot be proceeded with earlier owing to the stand-
ing orders not having been complied with.
THE CALAIS AND OSTEND MAILS.
Sir S. NORTIICOTE asked the Secretary to the Admi-
ralty whether any personal or written communications had
taken place between the Post-office and the Admiralty. or
between any officers of the Post-offioe and the First Lord of
the Admiralty, with reference to the employment of Admi-
ralty vowels for the mail service between Dover and Oalaia,
or Dover and Ostend.
Lord C. PAGET said that the only communication which
he knew of within the last few weeks had been a personal
communication of a gentleman from the Post-office, who
came to the Duke of Somerset and himself to ask
whether, in the event of any difficulties arising with regard
to the mail packets between Dover and Calais and Ostend,
the Admiralty would give them any assistance. The answer
of the Duke of Somerset wasu,, that it would be highly in-
convenient that the Admislty should be called upon to
perform any of their duties. (Hear.)
THE MACLACH LAN CASE.
- - - - -

- - -
Oaths motion for going into committee of supply,
Colonel NORTH asked the Secretary of State for the
Home Department if it was true that a convict of the name
of William Stuart Farquharson, alias Frederick William
Stuart, bad Istelyarrived from Bermuda and wee now in Mill.
bank hoon ; if so, what was proposed to be done with him?
The hon. ad gallant gentleman avid that this man wee
tried at Oxford before Mr. Baron Martin for forgery, and it
then appeared that he bad been en aloer in two or three
militia regiments, and that he had succeeded by means of
forged papers in getting himself engaged as a curate, and
while in that capacity he performed the services of the
church at cbristeuings, mamagee, and burials. Having
pleaded guilty to the offence of forging an endorsement to
• bill of exchange, the learned baron sentenced him to
twelve years'nal servitude, and expressed his regret that
be was unable to award • severer punishment. At the
beginning of the serif:re the Secretary of State for the Home
Department stated, in reply tea question he put, that this
man befogged to a gang of convicts at Bermuda who
were about to be sent to Australia, but about ten days ego
he (Colonel North) received an anonymous letter stating
that be had been brought back to Millbank Prison. He
hoped to bear from the right hon. baronet that a man
of en dangerous a character would be sent out of the
country again, and without any ticket of leave.
Sir G. GREY said he did not know the history of the
man, but he found on inquiry that be was now in Millbank
Prison. When the convict establishment at Bermuda was
broken up a portion of the convicts were sent to Western
Australia, sod the remainder brought home, this man being
among the latter ; bat the selection of the men who came
beak to this country depended upon the authorities in Ber-
muda. The boo. and gallant member might rest satisfied
that the convict in question would not receive • ticket of
leave. He was not entitled to one for some years to oome,
and he would be dealt with precisely es all the other con-

Mr. BL&CICIIIIIN (f7x7ii;:it:i7iiiig)i:sked the Secretary
of State fee the Rome Department when the papers on the
Maclesbian ease, moved for as an unopposed return on the
4th of May, would be laid upon the table?
Sir G. GREY replied that the paper, which were very
voluminous, would be laid on the table to-morrow (this day).
SMITHFIELD DEAD MEAT MARKET.

Sir & 1L iiibaaked the Secretary of Stave for the Home
Department if he could inform the house why the Corpora-
tion of the City of London had not proceeded to construct
the dead mast market in Smithfield, for which an act Irma
obtained in the year 1860?
Sir G. GREY had no means of answering the question or
Cll.'s the information required. He received, however, a
that day from the City Solicitor, stating the steps
taken by the corporation, and that communication would be
predated if the hon. baronet moved for it.
MR. ODO RUSSELL AND THE PAPAL GOVEILI-
RENT.

Lad J. MANNERS--IW;h to put • question to the
noble lord at the bead of the government. The edge lord
said that be would look through the despatches of Mr. Odo
Russell and see whether there was anything in them which
should be laid before the home for their information. I
wish now to ask the noble lord whether he is prepared to
say whether those despatches can be produced or not?
Lord PALMERSTON—The statement made by my hon.
friend the Under Secretary of State was not founded upon a
despatch, and there is no despatch which would kW out
the point which my noble (timid wishes to produce. From
time to time my noble friend at the head of the Foreign-
office lays before parliament despatches that explain the
course d various transactions, but in this case there is
nothing to present.
Lord J. MANNERS—Then I understand that the state-
ment made the other night by the Under Secretary for
Foreign Affairs was not founded upon any despatch from
Mr. Odo Russell?
Mr. LAYARD—May Ibe allowed to explain. The noble
lord appears to be under a miesppreheosion. It is my con-
viction that I said nothing shout a despatch or anything
that would justify the hon. member for King's County (Mr.
Hennes) in supposing that there was such a despatch. I
have referred to every report of what took place on the
occasion referred to, and I find my impression confirmed
that I said there was a despatch, or that what I said
was founded upon a despatch. ("Oh, oh," and "Hear.")
Mr. HENNESSY—I wish to se, then, if there was no
despatch, whether there was any communication or letter
on the subject. When, in the course et a debate, a state-
ment was made on the part of the ministers contradicting
a statement which was published sod laid on the table by
one of the diplomatista of her Majesty's service, it is to be
supposed that the miniater makes the contradiction upon
some authority. (Cheers.)
Mr. LAYARD—My hon. friend, in his question to me,
said there were three despatches. two of which had been
placed on the table, and that a third, which had not been
produced, was referred to by me in my speech. I have
)set stated that that was an entire misapprehension. What
I said and repeat now is, that there was a moral conviction
on my mind and upon Mr. Odo Rusaell's mind that the
(seta he had stated were true. I did not refer to any de-
spatch, nor can I find anything iu the reporta of what I
maid which will bear that construction. (Hear, hear.)
Lord J. MANNERS—Perhaps I may be allowed to
mention what the hoe. gentleman really did say. He said,
"Mr. Russell well knew upon what authority he made the
statement, and he would now state solemnly to the house
that Mr. Russell bad justified his statement, and bad shown
that what he said was true." (Chem.)
Sir G. BOWYER-1 with the hon. gentleman would
inform the house what were the grounds of the moral
conviction of which he has spoken. (Laughter.) Has he
received any communication on the subject? (Order, order.)
Lord PALMERSTON— I must be allowed to answer the
question of the hon. barnoet, and to Mate that her Majesty's
government entirely decline to furnish him or anybody else
with any materials out of which a quarrel can begot up and
perpetuated between Mr. Odo Russell and either the French
or the Papal authorities. (Loud cheers.)
PRISON MINISTERS BILL.

The third reading of this bill having been moved by Sir
G. GSM . .

Mr. BLACK moved that it be read a third time that
day six muoths. It was stated that the object of the mea-
sure was to give the dimeoters the right of appointing chap-
hies foe prinessers of their own persuasion, but it was
obvious that the oral dienenters who would be appointed
neder it would be )'tames catholic priests, and he .hould
like to know bow nonconformist ratepayers who refused now
to pay church rates would be induced to contribute to the
support of Roman catholic prison chaplains. Of all who
visited the prisons be believed now did more good than
those beeevolent sympathising Christiana who west into the
cells and raid with the prisosen, and gave them good
HOUSE OF 003010NEL—MONDAY, MAY ut. oonswil and iestanction. The practical working of the
present bill would, of neceesity, interfere with all this.
The 81%&1131 took Um eltairat four o'clock. . (Heart hear.) If a second Era. Fry were to wish to visit
PRIVATE BURNES& the prisoners, the Romeo catholic priest might prohibit her
The Rilwawil Railway Bill wee read a third time sad paned. visit. The bill was in fact a violation of religious liberty,
The Stirling's Estate Bill was read a second time. and likely to lead to strife. It was injurious I. protestant
diamoten is England sod Scotland, and was not for the
ROYAL NAVAL RESERVE. biome% of the prisoners themselves.
Lord C. PAGET pre notice°, hie intention after Whit- Sir G. GREY wished merely to state that the fed apes
stands to sweeter leave to Wag in a bill for iatmducing which the bill proceeded had not been cootrovertai,
into the Royal Naval Reserve engineer omen, sod likewise that there were tlioomoda of Roman eathollo pricings is
to give fennithis to gentlemen owning Urge yachts who nn the various pols throughout the eonetry, fa ekes Mist.
beeithie mastan. , one instruction DO %MAI pyridine wan wads.

Oo the motion of the Earl of DONOUJHMORi this bill
paned through committee.
Their lordships adjoerasd ►t a quarter pat 8 o'clook.

(Hear, beer.) All the rest of it was mere surplusage out-
side of this gentleman's testimony. It was with the utmost
reluctance that Captain Carnegie atteiteled—indeed, he
(Mr. Cobden) believed be had almost to compel his atten-
dance ; but this was the statement be made .•_ that at the
time of the general election in 1850 he had filled the
office of lord of the Admiralty—that it bad been
thought desirable that be should have • seat in
parliament, and it was proposed that be should try Dover.
He described how, being in a public office one day, sod in
the presence of a gentleman whose name be (Mr. Cobden)
would not now mention, as it wu unnecessary for the pre-
sent purpose, Mr. Charehward came up to him, and spoke
of his being a possible candidate for Dover, and be maid that
Mr. Churchward then proposed to him that he (Mr. Church-
ward) should Five him Lis nipped at Dover. sad coupled with
that proposition of support the condition of having the con-
tract renewed for his postal service from Dover to Calais.
(Hear.) Now redly the whole question was this. (Hear.)
There was nothing outside it that the committee had
troubled themselves about ; and now the question was
whether Captain Carnegie's testimony was to be credited in
this matter. He was passed through the most searching
examination. But what other motive could Captain Cu-
=gm have had—sittiated ea he was as a lord of the Ad-
miralty—in refusing to go to Dover and to greet to the
proposal of Mr. Charchward. In fact, he was astonished
at the indiscreet way the proposel was made to him—a pro-
posal which in itself wee so =chunked and indiscreet for
any human being to make, that he could not have ima-
gined it possible it would have been made to him. It must
be borne in mind that Captain Carnegie, as a lad
of the Admiralty, would be called upon to exercise a sur-
veillance over Mr. Church ward. Price of " No, no" from
the opposition benches). He_ (Mr. Cobden) heard hon.
gentlemen opposite say no ; he begged to say he knew much
MOTS about the matter than they did. (Hear, hear, and
laughter.) He had served upon more committees of she
house than hon. members—la laugh)—snd he knew that
every packet upon its arrival and departure bad to be exa-
mined by an inspector, which inspector was appointed by the
Admiralty—(hear, hear)—and therefore, of course,
he had the power of fining • man or remitting
his fines ; of administering rigid justice in these
cases, or of being lenient and allowing the man to
escape. This was the position of Captain Carnegie.
"How could I," said Captain Carnegie, " one of the lords
of the Admiralty, listen to a prepaid made boldly to me,
made =disguisedly to me, that I should forward the scheme
of this gentleman, and then that he would give me his
support at Dover?" (Hear, bear.) The committee had
heard the bon. baronet the member for Stamford describe the
critical circumstances under which this contract was made.
He said that he had himself decided against the arrange-
meet, and that it was while his mind was undergoing a
change that Mr. Churchward made this proposal to Oeptain
Carnegie. He (Mr. Cobden) would not say it was in con-
sequence of that proposal, but it did so happen that the
government decided to take the course which Mr. Church.
ward wished, namely, to renew the cor tract which was not
to expire till 1863—(bear, hear)--and was to run till 1870.
Now, if it had been a omitted for the West led's mail, or
eves foe on between Liverpool and New York, there
would have been some kind of excuse for looking ahead for
a year or Iwo, because such • contract might require • good
deal of preparation. (Opposition theme.) Bata postal service
between Dover and Calais needed nothing of the sort.
Meer, hear, and cries of " Yes ! yes !") In six menthe
they could contrive such • service, and there was
consequently no motive for pressing the question in the way
it was pressed by Me Churchward. (Hear hear.) Be
(Mr. Cobden) would not read the evidence of Captain
Carnegie, but he would instead read what was stated in the
index as the substance of it. "Captain Carnegie had an
interview early in April. Mr. Churchward spoke freely
and openly on the subject of the contract, and seemed
anxious that it should be renewed before the Dover election
was over. (Cheers.) Examination as to the actual words
used. " Witness clearly understood that Mr. Churchwand's
support waste becostingent u pon the renewal of the contract."
Before reading the meet extract, it would be proper to say
that Captain Carnegie was severely cromezmnined as to the
meaning of the word "the ,' but he declined to interpret
it. The summary peoeeedd thus : "It seemed to Mr.
SUPPLY. Cburchwerd that ' they' were anxious to defer signing
The house resolved itself into committee of simply. the renewal of the contract till after the election. If ' they
had wanted him to return two government members, he
Mr. PEEL mooed • vote of 250,0001. on account for the
„,„, should have felt obliged to do so, but that he should have
iPanCtuedterrliproce'visiionn part
tfor apet;tme esoutam oft.o966M;.B7CBhilrewhitiZl—for preferred to support witness and Mr. Osborne." There was
Fateful dame cy and indeed contradiction in the
the conveyance of mails between Dover and Calais and •__FP_ ~,,. Sail ' believed the commitisa were
Dover and Ostend, but no part of which sum is to be •""'e."re, . '"" •
unanamouny disposed to believe Captain Camegie,
applicable towards making any payment in respect of rather the say ether wit. opposed to him.
the paned subsequent to the Wth of June, 1863, to
Mr. Churchward, by virtue of a attract entered into I:No, no.") WaL he should not have thought any one
with him on the 26th of April, 1859. He stated
lieved otherwise, for therewas no aodeavour made to set
other of any
that new contracts had been =tend into for several uP the testimony
mail services, the West Indies, Brawl, Cape, kc. By • ells
am- cant to, if' Captain- Carnegie What, then
spoke the ' does the
truth ? It
resolution of the house no contract was to be completed wee undoubtedly an attempt to suborn a high functionary,
to induce him to dispose of the public money and to accept
until it had been laid before parliament for • month, and bribe. NO.) a bnoe. re*, so.") It either meant that or it meant
as it was not practicable to lay them at present on the _- i ems.) The right hon. member for Stamford *eked
table, it wan thought desirable to ask for a vote on appellee i
payment being made for the services at the rate of the new why ifgthey stigmatised Mr. Churchward they should not
ad stigmatise him. That was, however, the most shallow
contract. The modification of the vote in reference to Mr.
churchyard was introduced in nom,. of o vote of the* view in the wood to take of the matter. Suppose &contractor
went into • go
stead office with his pocket well lined with
house resolving that Mr. Charchware's contract should nut btu notes init." of vow; end mop.. he tendered
Ise renewed at its expiration in June nue The ground of
, con-
this resolution was corrupt exptclieets, proved to the satis-
those notes to • public fu would they not
faction of a committee of the Doris, for the purpose of ob. eider it a criminal sot even elder/ the public functionary
Wan might not have accepted the bribe? It was net necessary
election at Dover. Arrangements had been made with the . -- • rd. to conntitute it an offence on the
taming
the
renewal of
the eentreet' le reference
so the tempter.= in o
Belgian government for the conveyance of the mails tern-
of Mr. Chnrehward. Mr. Churchyard did not succeed. 4,
pozarily. A tender had been made and conditionally grtain Car. . was too coo/cautious•• man, and rather
accepted foe the =dermas= of the services in question for ?:"
go
a subsidy of 12.M31. a year. than to Dover and accept the support of MeChurchward, c
Sir S. NOBTHCOTE said the vote was • novel one in its when it might be suspected that he had a sinister p
terms, but he believed it he moved the omission of the motive, be declined to stand at all. (Hear, hear.) I.
words relating to Mr. Churohward he should raise such an The question now arose what ought the beau to do
If these were the biota there could be DO doubt or hesitation there nut?
issue se would bring the question to a decision. He con-
tended that the question was not concluded by the de. about it. The committee had suggested that they should Mr. Sargood rid that was so ; and no matter how frandu-
n ider the contract was null lied void. Some people lent the circumstances under which the annulling of the
eision a the select committee or the vote of the house
consider
tad that the house could not legally refuse to pay the bankruptcy was obtained the court was fund= cane and
alluded to ; for it was admitted by Mr. Laing and Mr. lulu
y. Well, he would pay it in an way but a lespd or. could not even examine • witness until there was a new
Gladstone in the debate on the motioa which ended
Phnenees•) If this gentleman thought be had a legal claim bankruptcy. The 6th and 12th sections of the Consolkim
in the vote that Mr. Clittrchward's contrect should not
let him.establish it in • court of law. For his part he (Mr. eon Act clearly defiited the jurisdiction of the court, and
be continued, that at the end of the period of the
contract the house would be at liberty to risen. C *deo) would agree to vote the mousy necessary to confined it to all mutters in baukruptcy. The adjudication
eider the subject. He argued that Mr. Churchward enable Mr. Churobward to establish his claim by • legal pro- being annulled, acid the petition on which it was founded
had • valid contract for the mail earn= till 1870, which he Ourand pay all the expenses of the trial, disnoased, the court had clearly no jurisdiction, and Mr.
could establish in a court of law, and if it was rescinded by rather than vote the money for the contract after Adams was to all intents and purposes ea though he had
the report of the committee. (Cheers and counter cheers.) never beau made • bankrupt. The petitioners, Mr. Elsey,
a vote of the bolus • collision would ensue between the What irould the public say to them out of doors? They of the Bank of leashed, and Mr. Lawreuoe, described
house and the courts of law. He also contended that it was
ought to affect •vi ue even if they had not got it, (A laugh.) themselves se creditors' aaaignees under "the above
owing to Mr. Churchyard that the present efiki e. a Mail H was • committee whose report simply meant this— bankruptcy," when there was in reality no bank-
service was established ; and that, looking at the new co i• 1
that • person had been to a public office and tried ruptoy ; and the summons issued against Mr. Adams
tracts for which tendert had been made, there could be no ._ bliel '
laving, as the rate could not really be below that of Mr. s" a- lord of the Admiralty. The object was to obtain stated a perfect untruth, for it said that the bankruptcy
Chutchward. Be moved that the words of the vote relate a contract by the most corrupt memo; and what was the was in counts of prosecution, whereas it had been put an
log to Mr. Churchward be omitted. sort cif bribe offered ? Why, it was of the very kind that end to three years ago. He submitted that the petition
Mr. BOUVERIE was of opinion that the form of the
house. Oa the one hand, an attempt had been Mr. Lawmen =clouded that the court had jurisdiction.
ought to be moat repugnant to the members of that ought to be dismissed. .
vote on account was irregular, and it cast a duty on the
made upon the virtue of • public functionary, The omission of toe word " bankrupt " from the petition
committee of supply which belonged to the house alone.
whom they were specially there to superintend ; sod on the was wholly immaterial ; for it was in the affidavit. Urdu
Mr. WALPOLE agreed that it was not in this fix= that other hand an attempt bad been made to dispose, by nor- the 12th sec. of the Couolidation Act the court bad the
an important constituticaal question should be brought
raptforward. He suggested that the vote should not be pat hi pt means, of the votes of • constituency, in whose purity same original jurisdiction asthe Conn of Chancery had had
and independence the house ought to be most deeply in- previously. 'rite petition merely asked the court to rescind
that form, without reference to the amendment.
tweeted. There was really nothing before the house but ins own order.
The CHAIRMAN of COMMITTEES said the vote is its
rth,is,.cir :lion—was Captain Carnegieentitled to their credit ? Mr. Frargued said that was not the prayer of the petition.
present form „as samintiona ; but the only question le If was no doubt that they ought to act upon It proceeded upon a coutingency.
had to deal with was the amendment, and he thought it " "
the resolution of the committee, and if necessary to let the Mr. Lawrence said that it prayed for an inquiry, sad upon
was admissible.
Sir M. PETO was of opinion that the government had by ty enforce his claim in • court of law. But on't let the the result of that inquiry, that the order of the 4th of
conduct condoned any offence of Mr. Churchirszer have the effect of d ping corruption and waded.
y con o
a, house Intake • in the face of this report which would May, 1860, annulling toe adjudication, might he re-
their
and ought not to have revived • question which ought to '"" (cheers) The Commissioner—The upshot of all this is that the
have been settled in 1860, when the vote of the house was bribery.Sirl CAIRNS observed that the course the house was matter was settled at that time by • compromise.
taken. now asked to pursue was without precedent in the annals of Mr. Lawmen—A= my simple preparation is that the
In answer to Mr. AYRTON, parliament. The committee of supply had no more to do court has at may time power to reseed an order which was
The ATTORNEY-GENERAL said that any legal right
th the conduct of Mr. Churchward than with the Reform obtained by fraud. The arrangement then made concealed
of Mr. Church ward on the contract would not be affected ;11. Mr. Ch hwaid had been told that he could bring the true orate of the baulu upt's affairs. Every court of record
by the proposed vote of the house in a court of law,
his action at law, and if the house did no more than they lies power to remind an order obtained from it by fraud.
Mr. AYRTON said that in that case Mr. Churchward were requested to do by the resolution, ad Mr. Church- All we have to do is to make out a primA facie case of
oneht not to be prejudiced in his legal right. in • court a nerd req tan action, be would be certain to recover fraud, and we are here prepared to do so. There are mm-
law—at any rate the question ought not to be discussed on es for breach of contract and for being interrupted in merous instances where the Lord Chancellor and the Court of
• vote on account. the performance of the service. If, however, the Appro. Review have rescinded orders to annul improperly obtained.
TheATFORNEY-GENER A L urged that the vote adopted
ration Bill were pulsed, then the government would be : (ego exp. Lavender, 4 Dem. and Ch. 484, sad other cases.)
mar tbe result of the previous mess stun of the house, and foul laud pleading that, in their defence. I The act of 1849 had given to this court all the powers and
it was not possible to awry out that resolution in any eMr. HUBBARD was of opinion that the interests of the i jurisdiction in bankruptcy which Lad formerly belonged to
other form. taxpayers bad been overlooked by both the last and the pre- I the great seal. (See exp. Freeman, 1 Rowe, 380 ; exp.
Mr. MALINS, as a reasonabte man, had supposed that
sent goveraments in the arrangements with Mr. Church. 1 Kuight sod another, 2 Rowe, 319 ; sad exp. Crump,
after what had occurred in 1860 nothing would have been
head of the affair of Mr. Chnrchwarel, which was then ward but he did not think that the best way of punishing Suck, 3.) If this court had not jurisdiction where could
men for political immorality was to break one's bargains the petitioners go? The Court of Chancery would not en-
brought before the house on slight grounds and decided with them. Looking at the transaction in • commercial . tertain the matter, because the original jurisdiction was now
against him by • narrow majority. point of view with great disapproval, he should be glad to in this court.
Sir G. BOWYER objected to the public time of the find • fair and honourable opportunity of cancelling it; but I Mr. Sargood said the petitioner did not salt that the order
house being taken up with Mr. Churchwerd's affairs, he could
(Hear, beer.) He bad been asked to postpone some public of an infraction of a contract in reference to which he lad The prayer of the petition was that Adams, being no longer
badness on the ground of this vote, but he repudiated it. , nothi more to allege against the contractor than • distrust • bankrupt, might be examined, aud that other pomp, might
(Hear, hear.) He did not think this was the place to die- of hi political honesty. he examined with • view to the discovery of • fraud.
cum Mr. Churchward's private claims. It was now nearly The SOLICITOR-GENERAL said that what the remota- I
The petition did not aver fraud simplicitez, but asked that
tee o'clock, and they mot to be in amply. The impression Lion asked was thatthe house should confirm its former de- the court, without any jurisdiction, should examine wit-
pranced upon his mind- was that Mr. Cburchward bad a determine for ne • • The
good many friends in that house ; and the discussion looked moon. present was the proper time to perms, and then revive the bankruptcy.
very much like a job of Mr. Churcheard's (" Oh, oh" and what the money should be voted, and when it had been Ha Honour said he should like to consider the question ;
voted it would find its way into the Appropriation Bill ; and it was a very intricate one, and required • good deal of con-
' Haar, hear.") He protested against the loss of time— it was to carry oat the purpose of parliament as declared in eidsratom,
(hem bear)—be thought the matter was one which ought to
be left to the government for the time beteg—Omer, beau 1860 that the vote amumed a form which, if agreed to, . Mr. Lawrence raid it wu very important that they should
and he should certainly vote against Me. Churchward, the government in their consciences believed would be a have his klonow's judgment immediately, as there were
in favour of the government. (Hear, bear.)
Mr. COBDEN had • very few words to say because be Mr. Sergood—We may promise you that, whichever way
complete- answer to any action for damages or breach of other matters peeing arising out of it.
contract, for there could be nodemage or breach of contract
where an essential condition of the contract was that no it is, we shall not program very quickly.
was not going into the legal question cell, but having held
mone was to be paid =lees voted by parliament. I His Honour said be would ipso judgment as soon
as he
the most responsible post in the committee before which Colonel DICKSON Isle that the hoe. gentleman who had considered the matter.
this subject was mooted, be thought it necessary had just sat down had favoured the house with a damns- ; (We have • copy of the petition before us, but in the
to make a few observations. The truth was that
improper.)
~,i_ tion on loose politics. Be &eked whether such a diem*, present state of the case its publication would be olni-
-1 the whole matter lay in a nutshell. What ''''' Ur could come from any hon. member with worse grace. ously
committee bad now to decide tamed merely upon the eel. (Cries of " Oh" and laughter.) Those who had attributed
&SOS of one gentleman. (Hear, hear.) lo the year 1859, corrupt motives to the late government in the matter had i
alter he (Mr. Cobdeolhed been two years out of parliament,
i signally failed to Wettish their cam, and be trusted that the I
be returnedfrommeriee i net her*, "ken Per, di house would not break faith with • public servant who
say discussions, and being unconnected with any previous had faithfully discharged the trust committed to him.
movements of a party character in the house, be was, as be The committee divided.
supposed, appointed chairmen of the committee over the For the vote 176
beads of other much more able and experienced mu than Against it l6B-8
himself, solely on the ground of his having been about from
the political areas. The first thing be encountered in the The announcement was received with loud cheers by the
committee was a personal question, which was always very miniaterialiate, and with counter cheers quite as loud by
disagreeable to hint to meet with. It appeared that early the opposition.
In the, year 1859 a remark made, he believed, bL the right Mr. DISRAELI asked when the government proposed
hoe. baronet the member far Dritwkda (Mr J. Pekingtool, to Meet the resolution.
reflecting on the conduct of Captaia is, who was 00e. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER replied—
netted with the government la some agar tali- This dos!!
teal intermit, be (Mr. Cobden) forgot which, drew from Mr. WALPOLE said be thought it was important to
Captain Cameos a letter explaining that be bad refused to miss the mimics on the merits according to the usual
steed as • candidate foe Dover, and stating that be could forms of the house. A new mode at taking votes bad
not is justice to his owe emus of honour become a her introduced, • resolution beteg agreed to on a subject
candidate for Dover upon the terms on which be which was not a nastier of supply. The committee would
was ax stand. Well, he (Mr. Cobden) do well to resider whether an opportunity should mot be
foaled tted to
the question was mixed pp with given to °milder the real merits Of the queetion. Nothing
thepseket service at Dover ; sad au of the first 'Map the could be mare simple. The home should hare ea ?Pyor
cononittee inquired into was the eireaunereoes of the re- tunity of considering the sew CeetMet to be substituted for
newel ef the contract with Mr. Obureitward, and its or- this one. The mew contract was not even before them at
sexton with Captain Cepllll
Now, the whole of the this moment.
gramme depended wen the issthiimay of Cag/sfa Come.. Mr. DISRAELI said be made the inquiry not with

reference to coming to a decision co the merits of the gum.
tioe, but with reference to the bunnies before the house.
To-day there wes so important matter before the boon,
which would probably take up some time, and it would be
inconvenient that they should enter afterwards upon adu
rousion involving an important oonetitutlonal question.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER mid the
service must be provided for. Hon. gentlemen were par- '
ticular about taking questions of general interest on the
first day after the recess. There wu an important questiou
standing on the paper for to-day, and he did not suppose
that it would be possible, if the report were fixed for to-day,
to get to the discussion till a very late hour. But looking
to the state of the arrangements for the service he did not
think that the govero.uent would be justified in naming any
day later than Thursday in next week.
The Chairman was then ordered to report the resolu-
tion? and

The house resumed.
THAMES EMBANKMENT (NORTH SIDE) BILL.
. .

This bill was read a third tiene.esid pseud.
VAOCINATION (IRELAND) BILL.
This bill was read a third time and pissed.
OFFENCES (SOUTH AFRICA) BILL.
On the order of the day for the committee on this bill,
Mr. C. FORTESCUE stated that the object was to
amend the act 6 and 7 William 111., entitled " An Act for
the Prevention and Punishment of Offenders being her
lilsjesty's Subjects in South Africa."
The house then went into committee.
The bill passed through committee.
NEW ZEALAND BOUNDARIES BILL.
This bill also passed through committee.
The load Drainage (Provisional Orders) Bill passed
through committee.
The Salmon Fisheries (bootbuid) Act Oontintummi Bill
also went through committee.
The Vice Admiralty Courts Bill was read a second time.
The house was counted out at 20 minutes past 1 o'clock.