The Express.
London, England, 1852-12-16 00:00:00

INFLUENTIAL MEETING OF JAMAICA

PROPRIETORS.

sahnoduldiniblelletialktialen
riaefttoerTard mawerenhanhtnlaneat.trms
ico:nnected with the
LasiPstwEh.:77l4..:"BagydPviirelefiefizOanGood". in Barrett. Esq., 'onSLthjeameabeil
nbttlye.Jjeftror msis ciPrahj a
HenryAAssociation)
LU Yates,:
s li )
n tripe, Henry Pearce,
island of Jamaica, was held at toYnallwahsowl:osm:Rtisa(cohatihroie.l.l.i.
•
cwfmohirtOqhhuni respectmeeting
TP.::'lllt.Pa utaeoPo e f that
statement
t resolvingr
iuogn
fto
re the
n eC ;toe
sl 1
once r of f
otheu
ing colony. The meeting was convened by William (Sonia,
Esq., Alexander Ste wart,q ,W. j,
S. Watson Taylor
Esq., Captain Dawkins, W. W. Meekest's:l, Eeq., Henry
Marshall, Esq., William Girod and William Smith, Ere.
(delegates from Jimmies) Henry Davidson, Bee.,
William Beckford, Esq., W. Q. Wright Benweit,
Esq., Richard Davis, Esq., M. Foster, E,q,, Joen
Douglas, Esq., S Moss, Esq., W, T. Child,
&c. The chairman opened the tueincle of the meeting
in a temperate statement of the distressed position in
which Jamaica was placed, after which Mr. Girod co •
eluded an elaborate. speech by
:submitting aemewei,,
lengthy but well.writtenmenional for the consideration of
the meeting. The adoption of the memorial was strong.y
edvoceted by Mr. Davidson, who ceps...sited the obligaton
the meeting was under to Mr. Girod for the active and
practical steps which he had adopted, and of which be
highly approved. It was then proposed by Mr. Barret
and seconded by Mr. Marshall, that Mr. Girod's memoriz.l
be adopted, and after receiving the signatures of as miry
Jamaica proprietors as could be obtained, should be pre-
seated by a large deputation to the Earl of Derby,
and that a committee be appointed to tale t:.•
necessary ii,7l to carry out the ohjects in vi, w.
Mr. Smith, while eeMially agreeing iii &warding to Mr.
Girod the thanks that were due to him fur the able memo-
rial which he had submitted to the meeting, was of opinion
that the time had arrived fur tine adoption of a mush
stronger and more decided coune. He propos, d, therefore,
that instead of asking further assistance from the govern-
ment, the House of Assembly at Jamaica should be urged
to take a course in reference to their local supplies, the
effect of which would force the government to eppean
the colonists for assistance instead of the colonists applying
to them ; he therefore proposed • resobriou to tee
effect that the time had arrived when the Amina-
bly of Jamaica should refuse to levy any further
taxes on the ruined inhabitants of that island until
government the ..f thin country consented to afford them
that relief to which they were justly entitled. This amen.,
ment, which was seconded by Mr. Most, led to a warm
and energe in discussion, in the course of which, a rely
general approbation of this amendment, as an ulter.er
measere, was expressed. Mr. Marshall, however, very
forcibly appealed to the meeting, and stated that although
they might feel disappointed at the Chancellor of the
Exchequer's statement, he had rem .0 to believe that toe
government would shortly do something for Jamaica, sc.l
he •honglst it would be injudicious to take steps wh.ett
might appear hostile, and which might probat'y hove tne
effect of deterring the government from 'imposing acy
measure of relief; they had had quite enough of Lord
Grey's colonial administration, and he hoped that the Olifti.
nal resolution might be canted. On a show of bends toe
original resolution was carried, and the following ger.t.e.
men appointed • mown, e, lleckford,
Davidson, Mr. Watem Taylor, Mr. Barrett, Mr. have',
Mr. Marshall, and Mr. Girod. The meeting then resole, d
to form a Jamaica Association in London, for the purpo,e
of protecting the interests of that colony, and • large num-
ber of gentlemen present enrolled themselves as members.
After • vote oft •auks to Mr. Yates for his conduct in the
chair, the meeting, which woo one 01 the largest c01n0,4
~meetings ever assembled in London, separated.

SOCIETT OF ARTB.—ANNUAL EXHIBITION or N-
VENTIONL—The prevent exhibition is arranged under six
principal heads. 1. Motive machines, including railway
mechanism. 2. Manufacturing meellines and Weis.
3. Building contriosnev v and materials, mid naval and mili-
tary mechanism. .1. Philosophical instrumi•nts and him].
ware. 5. Agricultural implements and saddlery. 6. M's-
celleneous, including articles for personal ma. In the hrst
clam, some electro-msenetio machines, for use as prime
movers, invented by M.'Fromenr, of Paris, are exhibited
by M. Fontaine Moreau. A drawing of Mr. ISPeonnel:'s
express engine attracted much attention, as combining the
most recent improvements in the nonsti netion of loeomo-
tire engine.. Mr J. Rock, jun., exhibited au humus, d
railway luggage van for facilitating Om 1
of the tarpateing, at present an extremely inconvei.:(l.:
and lahourions operation ; several modification, of strum
enginee applicable to agricultural purposes, and fin faci!i-
rating the turning of the engine on the field, and the distri-
bution of manure were likewise shown. Gold•aash:ng
machines were exhibited in several van i..ties The en..i. c.
lion will well repay a visit, serving as it dies to mink the
prestress of*. eV, in ON of its leading fattens, aseehaar
cal invention.

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT
HOUSE OF COMMONS.—WEDNESDAT, Dic. 15.
The Srakkalt took the dui/ at 12 o'clock.
PRTITIONS PJ
PJ

_ INSTITVTIA.
-EN favour of the supply of parliamentary papers to Mr
claim Institutes:—B!! Kr. MACAULAY, from the Philo-
garbing botiaty of Edinburgh ; Mr. COLLIER, from
Plymouth ; Mr. O. GORE, from Osweatry ; Lord BROOK It,
lbw Warwick ; Mr. WTI ALLEY, from Peterborough ; Mr.
GREENALL, from Warrington. •
TAN BUDD= AND House TAT.—By Mr. HADFIELD,
teem She/Bald ; Sir F. SMITH, from Chatham, against.

THE MALT TAX.
Mr. FREWEN gave notice that to-morrow (this day)
he should present a petition from the hop growers of Sussex
praying for a repeal of the Built tan.
POOR LAW ORDERS.
Mr. COBBETT asked the President of the Poor Law
Board whether the orders of the board, issued op ~:ith of
August last, bad been rescinded, and whether sny subati-
toted order had been prepared ; sod Viso when it would be
issued to the board of guardians.
Sir J. TROLLOPE said that the order had been re-
minded and a modified order prepared, which would be
rioted, he bilieved, that day, and seat to toe bJards of
guardians as soon as possible.
In an answer to a question from an Hon. Mtn t RM.
Lord NAAS said he hoped to be able, after the recess,
to siring in a measure for the iraprovemert of towns in
Ireland; bat it would depend on the busier•s of the ses-
sion, as he should not bring it is unless he bad a prospect of
itspassing nea: session.
THE LAW OF SETTLEMENT.
Mr. WISE begged to ask the President of the Poor-law
Board, whether there was any intention of altering the law
alsettlement, or of proposing any change in the mode of
charging the rates for the relief of the poor ?
flar J. TROLLOPE said h.• had considered the subject.
but it was one which required so much consideration, and
was of so much importance, that it could not h, under-
taken except with the direct enacurrence 01 the govern-
ment. He had placed all the information be p asess.d be-
fore the government, and the subject was now occupying
their attention.

LAND PURCHASED FOR UNION wominousEs.
Mr. WISE begged to ask the President of the Puor-law
Board whether Own was any information in the Poor Jaw
olSre as to the quantity of had which has been hired or
purehased by boards of guardians for the purpose of culti-
vation by the inmate• of union workhouses ; and whether
soy statements hay. been transmitted to the Poor-law
Board, showing the result of the employment of the inmates
of workhouses on tho land so hired or purchased ; and if
any such infortnetion or statements hare been given or
stmt, whether the President will place a copy of the same
am the table of the house ?

Sir J. TROLLOPE said he could furnish the informa-
tion required by the bon. 'gentleman of the quantity of land
purchased or hired by boards of guardians for the pupae
alluded to, hut the b Ards were not in the habit of forward-
ing to the Poor-law Board detailed accounts of the tiaantial
Or moral results of such employment of the poor. The
Poor-law Board only received sue It information incidentally
through the reports of the Poor-law Inspectors, so that the
information they possessed was very aware. If the ho..
gentleman wished, he would furnish the accounts of t►e
laud purauctl or hired.

TENANTS COMPENSATION (IRELAND) BILL.
On the motion for the adju•trned debate Cia UM second
reading of On. bill,

Mr. .I D. FITZOERAND said he did not intend to op-
pose the wood reading of the bill ; be only wished to refer
to what had °teemed on Wednesday morning last. After
the debate was adjourned se arrangement was aside be-
tween the Secretary for the Home Department sad the hoc.
and learned member for Kilkenny. that hie bill and that of
the Anomie -Hymnal for Ireland should b referred to a
select meinsittee ; and he thought that the right be.. gen-
Unitas, m he did not dissent to the courts proposed by the
Seeiretary for the Home Department, had assented to it;
sad adamants some gentlemen es that (the opposition) side
of the !muse were dorbtful shout the ezpa diem of studio,
the bill of the bon member for Kilkenny to a *elect com-
mittee. where it bad • fair chance of being strangled, yet
they assented to it. After that be (Mr. Fitzgerald) had
seen with surprise the observations of • noble lord in
issothu place, who, in putting a question to the noble lord
at the head of the government, bad stigmatised the hill
of the hon. member for Kilkenny as subversive of the
right. of property, and se one which had bean twice re-
jected by parliament. as a communistic measure, and he
asked the noble lord whether the arrangement which had
been made had his sanction ? If the bill of the bon. sans-
her fur Kilkenny was • communistic measure, it was, he
(Mr. Fitzgerald) thought, the duty of the government to
oppose it step by step, and not to consent to the second
reading. The noble lord at the head of the governmest,
after the arrangement had been made, stated that he bad no
bursar's is saying that the principle of the bill of the boo.
member for Kilkenny was subversive of the nchts of pto-
party. sad w.arld never be passed by any parhaniest, and
that the second reading had bees assented toady proforma.
That rringulse proceeding was followed by one still more
manatee cm the part of the Attorney. General for Ireland,
and he (Mr. Fitzgerald) was about to quote • letter written
by that richt hon. itentlemae, principally to give hiss an
apparition,. for ezplanation. That right hen. pulsates
wrote • letter to the editor of the Eremite: MU!, which is
considered to be the organ of the government in Ireland, to
the following effect : That he bad seen in his paper en
senile headed ' Mr. Napier's compromise of Irish pro-
perty.' The charge preferred against him was that be
had snowed Mr. Serjeast Shoes bill to be read • second
Vote, and to go to • select eMakitte• with the bills of the
gevesumeat. That charge was refounded and untnie.
That wee plain langurt sad he trusted he had
seed mash language as weld espllin his mesaing,
and which was not to any cavil or the
charge of ambiguity." Tint knows, however, was
eyes to cavil sad the of -sislassity, for the
nght hoe. gentleness did set okay that he bed ghosted to
Mr. &wiliest Share bds. geed • mead that. Dilate
t/a• right bee. reatlemes meat ? Wee he set in hL pima
when the arrangemont win made ? He spoke twigs after-
ward', and he did not utter • word of dowse. Me
Fitzgerald) complained that this was set Mart sod Mir
dealing towards the Irish ambers ; sad he woad earn
that irthe bill of the be.. member for Killieray less nab-
venire of the rights of property, sad wee • esesalahtle
he should oppose it step by step. mad H show
muck more was it not the duty of tAnjpoerienSent to elp-
pose it ? With regard*, the two tine Serfaiasezdat
diereinem, be dimmed free. one Imam Yll9 ile
pristine, bat be sssested to the Idol* the dross
although he thought ease of the details '4eellemallh The
bill of the primmest did set eeshis the pried* et
property in improvnamita," but that of the ben. amber
fee Kilkenny did. The he.. member esseleded hymens*
retieg the secusity of setting: this impertast yaw
ties, which was net merely as Irish. bat ma impend

- Mr. add It woe es the pheelpleled stated by
the hes. geatiestes—ties imperious of Ms as es
espie temelles—eltat shoe lid he bed II&
Reidy lei
lo the mideeeesi 'Web its weelestie edimessise.
It wok a ipeseties he had Rhea up es a plight warabir,
and heihre be was • member et die ; mid he
had hayed Mat 'brawl might he
ew edited, if Meknes. est of deme.altreeTarreri:
they would have gless dims sp. mid. smiles elli mewled.
sadism, have esdesessred mme meeme se this
peat that would he hosed*. Is I The gelbet sow,
like all Irish subjects, divided beat Isee the sod end the
persimoi. (" Hoer, ben," eel a isedh.) Me moll Wee
to the Bret piece to dm peesesel Me hod howl
it stead Is ea Irish aneggeme that be bed essemeed
wake pressen to die mese leaks el *shill of the hes.
memb tee Messy; and it wee doted that it wee the
geed ram
oseemmt elf the Indi party
_doe bid alissined that
semeal. MO sot teas. He had tell Me hes. sod
leaned meseher is ILlikeese that it ems aid emmeiseg to
melte em with ararism e. tab
Lew ftwo....si. Me beim of Ihe bowed that the
ebeesdler ef die use most be esseshed. ele•
eided to soy arreogimeest, gad, as the Membetalleill%
Mesa Ms We win eat deers fee mend madam OW
dews weft le Male hi ehLeetime is ths bit of the Ina
ma Mimed amber 11. r seeseaseses et
what had hers dead hy the les. member Me Mass thse
night with regard to >b (Mr. Ifqpier's) hal he was dew
Fell* ito send an images to Delft seat day, making at-
sesgemesee fer the amoduades of the ere hr the
ties is meet inspertast telel- se whisk he M ble
duty is selese, see shish wee to mime es ea eliseloy,,
and ba mall dews es Tweedy night emend to ester ea
tea tilesseses. Pelkshig dem his bill was ineeesilholis
with Wt of the his. eaembes for Killteastae Melt he
ee grted that deem gmtlemes who hod thessibee
to asses so ether MI ties that of Mr. Crashed
weed eater me Ile diesemies es the tees NM The delete
west es, esd the hes. sod horsed member ter X
made a wry Imp sod able goes*, sad be (Mr. 14=7,
remembering thee he bee ea a hems, emesiss had rep,
pottunity of eilassaii the doirei*tb,t it somaN
he right that other seedless= he Mewed to speak.
Ti. boo. gentlemen the riambee he Armagh was the tasty
member on that (the miehearld) aide of the heaps who
spoke, and he wu relieved by the hos. member ter Carlow
a a very teaperate spaseb. He (Mr. Napier) wee admit by
the Chmedier of the leshrepow te follow Ida, ash esswer
the epee& of the hes. esembee he X ilkeway, hot et that
..mat the efiewromeet ',the debau was moved. Up to
that time, be led so nodes bat that the dismiss mode
go on. A divides took place, and his right hon. freed die
tieeretary for the Dom^ Department, in whose heads ars
Plc charge of Irish affairs, arranged with the hes. sod
learned member for Kilkenny, that inseam% of pretended
the debate an the principle of the two bin., as semi of this
complicated details of the other bills would have to g, to a
select risnunitte, it wosid be as will if they all west to a
whet eve sitter, awl is the r. welt the bare weehl he in a
batter sesditkie to ems to as aptelso wpw them. Hada,
beard We elated by his right bes. Bead the Ikaastasy hr
die Ham Depertenest—whe M knew was in llse
*Mims hot a real moiety to get the bills iemseide=
agenageneat had bees made, although it wee net the
emu w (fit. Napier) wadi have taken, nor wadi be
have weested ft that sevespiesent ; stilt, as his right hes.
mime gag ablaut of the affairs of Ireland, be thought
it wall hove best a petty proceeding on hie r.
trw.part, If he hod got up aad objected
leweiver ho vilest set have approved of it. ati the
elleed and sew, batted eadeavourel to dear the
Owl= OM, pommel part if it, and turban no desire
of a geed code by whir.h the Matisse of
sad truest is leased slabs be milled, he wield
Wel to the house esd the mute whether is the serer

La Isad_t#nt

pet With
there was

ettigt it sight
tittered is c,

in the •17
fourih bill,

other*. By
theittelvel

matter of importance, ~._
for, sad complaints had been ...
often obliged to make improvements which ought to bin
been made by the landlord. In that bill It wee erestrary
to look to the *ligation of the I ,ndloril, who, Wes tonawt
for life, was as likely to lose the value of kis
u a tenant ; and when he cline to the Timensi=igesalses.
tion Bill he had to rube similar provisions. Them this
was • bill for facilitating leasing power, and establishing,
the principle of contracts bitumen landlord and tenant;
and, indeed, the basis of the new code was to place the'!
relations between legalised end tenant on the principle of
contract. Th, third bill was one for the consolidators of
' the rights sod obligations if landlord and tenant; and then
elms the bill now before the house. The objections to his
bill had been reduced to two chases. The first objection
which was taken by the learned serjeant (Mr. &dint Shit)
wu, that be bad destroyed the tenant right of Ulster, sad
the property acquired under that tenant right. He thought
all the other bills were open to that objection. Now, he
was the last man who would he disposed to do anything
against this tenant right of Ulster. He was • native of that
province, and we. coasseted with it by the ties of lineage.
Bet if hr had dope anything with the tenant right of Ulster
he should have expected some opposition from the members
connected with Ulster, but be had heard no observations
from them. But how would it destroy lb. tenant right of
Ulster, that was to sa the real tenant right of Ulster 1 He
held in his hand a book published by the hon. and learned
member for Cork, In which he referred to • statement made
by Arthur boiling in 1776, that in the north of Ireland
they cultivated, or rather borroned the soil, and also
worked at the loom. By and bye, in consequence of
the industry of the inhabitants, the district became
more prosperous, and there arose en active competi•
Lion for had, and the tenants diliosed of their holdings to
others who wished to occupy the land, a practice which
was encouraged by the landlords is may instance. ; be-
cause, when en incoming truant paid a price for the im-
provement of the land, that was appliedin payment of the
arrears of rent doe from the out-going tenant.
They did not do as In Scotland, when the arrange-
ment was made between the landlord and tenant at
the beginning of the mufti, and both parties understand-
ing what their outlay was to be, there was ao scramble and
no contest at the close. Dui in the north of Ireland the
landlords encouraged the practice he hod spoken of, and in
that way it was that this tenant right had grown up. Then,
by the fall in prices and th- want of competition, the inte-
rest of the temente of course had fallen of. But nose of
these bills touched the tenant right of Ulster, because they
could not do it ; it was • matter of dealing with particular
estates. Were they to legislate for the sale of the goodwill
of the land t It they did not do that, they did not make a
good taunt right. He said the only thing they could
justly legislate for was compensation for tenants' improve-
ments. He confined himself to that. And did they tell
him that he could not justly legislate nom that without
destroying the Ulster tenant right ? With regard to the
Meter tenant right, it was not created by it of paella-
most; bat ha had the report of the Devon commission, say-
iag it erm not wise to interfere with it by law. This
he had the report of the committee of 1845, not
touching it. Thirdly, be had the bill of Lord Lincoln and
Sir James Graham met teaching it Then be had the com-
mittee of 1816, roessmendiag that there should be &clause
that nothing should istarlbre with iti ned he bed also the
admirable report of the liertheep if Friserh, relently pub•
balled, which had • *Whir esseemmembatien. He was there-
fore fortified in the coarse he had taken of not attempting
to do that which ought not to he dime, that was, to interfere
by law with the private dealings sad private transaetioas of
landlord and tenant. He sow else to the went charge
male against the bill, which wag, that its machinery was
complicated. Now, if any gentlemen would show him any
machinery that was less eorpliested, se goo would be more
glad to substitute It than himself. Hue be emildered that
the complicated machinery was 011111111117. The maeldeery
under the bill of Lord Stanley was mil men semlitated
—it contained • system of imspeetlea. Thee there
was the bills of Lord Limit and Sr James
Graham, also very complicated ; eat theethe hill
of the late government owe boa le the system
of lupines. He confidently • te a somparivan of
his bill with the bill produced the eimmittes of that
"IC
house with the amistancii of Mr. as to whether it
was ant less complicated. Th.t bill provided for going
Iberia the revising barrister. Indeed of that pilintinary,
Ihe gave the landlord the option, when be bad received
noise of the tenant for any Inpreesserte—he gave him
• %Aiwa of doing it himself, midi the. Lad Improve.
mat Bill ; and then, if be undoes& to wary out the im-
prowmasat, the tenant got the ben" awl bed to pa y an
oddities to his real for that loggeweenst. Bet if the
Beard of Week. nowt= deg the Imseesimest node
art be tor We limit of the dnia,tbest ft was rend= '
that he wee an bend le ge ea =Maw work. lie bed '
received a kiln go the easiest at tie MU from Mr. M.
Clines, a Magee of gee of the Lewin gemosies of a farm
ha Ulster, when tenant right woe quite as well mdse.
MOM as in Bakes's', in which be said he
in bill would do, and that it 0E614 Is
ow, honest man. The Board of Anis bad in noir
emeaties employed the assets themselves, who bad sun
On simisage serried am sad= the ispeedea et the editors
et the Beard of W sedl the tenants had emir=
soMelmoe skill and le mode beiges ea their
ma ftww They weld IMMO these imgeweisoli thew I
sole= god by his bill they essid wore gemeggesallmo ter
them. As tar es hie MB owe. ft yeah be a hew te the
tenantry of Ireleed. Ni. Ifteses Crawford, who was '
imasairsd before the Boom imossiesioa, with a view to
what be wished to mosampfth, said the object of his
peepediea was to Wen On Wen to remunerate the
await the tee prelemmilea et the tenancy. He on
ekedw lierio:stl a:4i: adjust the
re
nt, aid be re •• In my that is •
thing whisk sansot be by ineeMosat."
Mani Irwin geght to = "dated hi of gni. He
wean seinefte to their being plated in Callhomien gold 1
and seat over is Ireland. This sublime had also bums ben. ,
died by the hew end leaned seember for Ceelt, wbo, in
the beak be had =blithe& amill—•• It wend be ea dean-
cep te the latellisoe leaeat se be awe= that ale Yee of I
balks& penis with clink had kr costs le be Ben by
Juries or by em =her wine et ralealiga on
ems of theme Medan whisli gene by the smiles ,
et On Maisie fir the et Use mobimatiel I
Wei& hit Ow imeestleshis miaow It le the dew la- i
to nibs boinedgesse teamed= as Um ohleikanyzei i
glevrallidyagonse see wish night sad is Ws I
et fteemeatry .** Thee Illea-Teri, a great . I
gait he midi age elle+ It teEillelb that there assem =
teed= le isiethre with the, ile
s'r iiliisitheire- I
mien the wait he peso= i that mud be I
demi. Is sheen be eamefteteematis denme itheig=
domed any ill which he Mlhsd Wail violate the
rieseeptareperly. rt
ON= what bed he . 1
as *meatWell. eseneorgisa hr him Wail
Tire mega aseiia allow in !re es as yetis
cirplosir Night to be mils by the iodised = egesei.
Orgesiese—iy the helmet It he awe he as Ong I
sae by Ole =net it the boiled reteseL And I
741:7111esesse it was far the pails =el that the I
should he heemisially cultivated. Xi Mem= Craw. 1
ford mid be Masi le wan the ter=
ftegg
let his ewe=
_an by deity of armed= 1
li
he bed anise ern Wir. limes Oseertnes pee.
• R
He bid women te the s= the
yggleelle _ei wait sow Owns et In
mod he hail surd SO bin yeenesis In a lens wish
egg% be eseifteel ha lie a esepeareery psi= ; mad il he
gram laftelinel =ft by lb boiler& he gage bit the veins
ell ft= It thew ogee say
&OM 01==. radio be hhig mmisidessi. It I
the
....... ow to. abort, let It be imagined ; it the I
was to. es4Ced let it be ditililled. It. I
.7 .= b• messkteetban be abseil be it they I
mole ageonspilsh thee Thee with ewe to tae I
pesesenste whist bel loge =lee ter sman_yin • it they ,
=se le he maim MileitieW wader Wm Idli, the tenant 1
wadi he gemmemelsi ter the= gni he no as roues is I
yeleletjommise why the maw mini set be sesepranted I
fin sash iNfINGIIIII6. an he W boned e=erimies to i
One ellat lay Ow bill of 1841 they were atabM to rasa 1
lozea=prowessate made vitalist its years. Ho had sot 1
We hit memo a glim =that bed me 1
noshed the ganglia et et =Mom= '
Ile (lb. Napier) did an onametene ft= the boa. god
' hented gentleman's errech went so 11.1116 In fewer of his
sera Mil, as against that of the government. (Hoar. beer.)
OM be (Mr. -Napier) lei is his howl Ur. illatlllia Craw-
lised'a bill erten ; but be ion aethieg la ft sheet We
Blow ewes= It any peeps= olive Oar=
mi n be thsk leipregoeseles mod Ms or the bill
hi wimp.. «mod. It said that if the healed
we le robe ds TISSO nod kis = resale= anise
r.setwk. 1.„., lEngle dem= empeasellso he agile
fteneeemsesto obit wen spelled, portlisi that wok b-
emire or brine the per law nimbi& (Hear. bus.)
There =re so provisions for the adlualnest of rents; Or
making impreeemeats the resrte_ et Ole unmet, er hr
itaft the landlord to suuses ble property spinet Mt
ma or to camel lasses. The preamble of the bees=
'a bill malaise_ 11l a miss which was rather mem
logo Warm gni lows of whisk they bed
=May week. (A limb.) It resit= that
various leans bad been entered hie when prime were
higher, and Matti that prices bed tallee, lad were likely
tli Noah low. No doubt Ireland bad Worldly serried
few meat legislation. 11. did net tomer ite say that dr
mesh mot benefit in the end, brit is too meantime sae
wend haw to pay • heavy poise tse it. He found, by •
lielmin be had to his hand, that, thsegh the geese aleph=
inereawd, there were some mantbe is which set were than
half the quantity of wheat wee yews that was pabeen
is 1845. (Hear, hear.) Bulty hid wet ilia GO se itai,
sod, whets the malt tax was reissued, its ;pewit would pro-
bably decreer. (Cheers and leragitter. ) Ibroarer, he
leaned serjesat's hill contained a shows essopeliag Lad-
lois to cancel leases made when produse was sommending
More rimunerative price*. (Hear, WO Ewa Hr. Shar-
orm Crawford's bill of 1848 hat memo el these disposes
donee, eons did it 5..-act the a amp., or the
laity of tenors. Ile (Mr. X assertred that If a
sa
Meant made improvements as property of the Wa-
ived, which were to been= rated- in the ell,'
HI would be contrary to the teat plea of the law of yge•
party to soy that an abovlnte perpetual interest in au*
fradr nesseuts Nem', r....ed In the tenant. In Bestiend
—sad they were no CAI. there—(laughter and thesie)—•
Wirmaittee of tenant* bad f: ported, that to be Keured in the
eiessiae of their improvements (they wen ref=tist
&si fin ege), for years 'amid be • tenant cos

for his rompostaarisi. (llu; has.) -Widt rogoodFitts IS
the Water twat right. deo~9 dig his. odd lam&
that isvolood dot weversey voloodas of tho
_ .

Mr. Serjeant SHEE rose to expire. The we, is the
bill fair valuation," meant • valuation that wee fair.
(Loud laughter.)
Mr. NAPIER—But the hirers wr a matter deprive.
It was • thing that mast be settled berver the roared
and the tenant; and he aril erre Meer to ire/sr
between them. It was • carearsiel tromeantims and meet
be treated by the rules of tionsmene. (Beer, Mar.) lie
would admit that there was in the present stair of Ireland
an unhealthy competition for land ; but the parties must
agree between themselves as to price; for rent was a pure
matter of commercial bargain. (Hear, hear.) Mr. Shar-
man Crawford had proposed • most cumbrous plan of ar-
bitration. Each side was to seminar as arbitrator, and
every one knew that that—particularly In Ireland—(a
laugh)—was not a cry satisfactory way, for the arbitra-
tors generally received their instructioas. (Hear, hear.)
Then they were to appoint an umpire, and if he did not
decide they were to go to the assistant barrister; and,
lastly, they might appeal to a jury. Eves the hon. mem-
ber tor the county of Cork said In his book that any at-
tempt to mettle rent by arbitration would prove a delusion,
aad would only lead persons to quit a practical benefit for
as impracticable scheme. (Cheers.)
Mr. V. SCULLY protested against the right hon. gen-
tleman reading isolated passages.
NAPIEIt would read, then, what followed. The
hon. member said that the labourer might as well demand
to have the minimum rate of hie wages fixed by whites-
' tion or the farmer the lowest pries he should take
for his cattle and sheep, but the result would only be
that the labourer would go unhired, the sheep and
rattle sabred and the land mart. (Cheers and laughter.)
Neither the bill of 1843 nor that of 1848 had put forward
any proposition like that of the learned serjeaut for cool
polling the landlord tqagerender hie land to the tenant. All
that the tenant had a right to ask he (Mr. Napier) proposed
to give him In the bill before the house • and in this way.
If the landlord sought to increase his rot (which be must
de by giving notice to quit unless the adhitfanal root was
the Start would be seemed ht the pm- els& of his
far such • period as would eampimmaim Ya he Ids
improwsienei, so that the landlord emald net ems • MO*,
mat epw him. (Hear, hear.) If the bill of the hem mud
I pestleman opposite were passed, the Mailleeth
would immedietely he served with notices to reduce a
their rats, and if dr I refused, they would have le pay
their ems& far what Wry had laid out, and to take beet
their lend. Bat surely that would be a flagrant breach of
the sestmet fate which the parties had entered.
Me dill net deny that the tenant might have • moral right
to a resitimemeat of Ile bargain now that the circumstances
of the essay had bonne se widely different from those
under which the agreement was made ; bet that was a
matter to be left entirely to the good feeling of the parties;
for it was impossible for legislation to interfere in sack a
I era without striking at the very tiers of the law of contract,
and of the laws which regulate commercial transactions.
(Hear, hear.) In conclusion, he arid aware the keen
that he had long studied the subject, and that hie lets
anxie had bees to frame the measure In • liberal milt
towards the tenantry of Ireland. (Cheers.) He Surd
that os both sides they would cast ride all personal car-
thirstier, and avoid those acres of reerireirtion and aMfe
which had long rendered Irish debit's the °problem of
parliament. (lieu, hear.) Such scenes word only retard
the prosperity of Ireland, and defeat those hopes which her
great capabilities might well entitle them to entertain.
(Cheers.)
Mr. JOHNSON ISSITTH, the new member for Lisburn ,who
has been elected ia the room of Si, J. E. Tannest,
took the oaths and his seat. _

-iiiiiiCAB(i;;;;w44 the debate) quite ceacarred la
the appeal of the right hoe. sad learned gratleman (Mr.
Napier), but he had not dose justice to the has. geadense
the member for Ends. The indurated/as which Lad
been come to was, that there should be a fair committee—
fair, not only with respect to the manner of its selection,
bat as regarded the meaner is which it should pursue its
inquiries. It wee undimmed that the hen. gentlemen who
were to compose it would ester epos their task perfectly
unfettered, sad with a desire to arrive at a wise and bun-
ion' emelosioa. Bat how stood the case now ? The
INN* lied at the bead of the government had stated in
nastier place—at least if he had been correctly reported—
lbst whatever might be the decision of this consulate,
esd however Tameable that incision night be, the eon-
litioene et the goanuneat was against the 11114•11111 of his
has. soot liaised friend (torjeaat Shea), and to maintain
tot asededee the/ were absolutely pledged. (Hear.)
Tluit annuli altered the state of things, sad he (Mr.
Leer) wished to be told by the goaraineat whether they
were to eater into a mere illusory inquiry, or whether
Hwy were to have a fall, fair, free sad sabbreed
im-
tioe / (Men.) The right hos. gestionse hid
Mg • IreKohniss te which he (lir. Lame), at a =jest!
Dahlia, had hoes a party. He accepted that
Is believed that tenant right was bediepeowsbkr
easesesey ; but amid be Onetime go into ism
sifts pledged menet inquiry, ad with a hater-
ninths on to lot my sow light honk is opts
hit Wed ? (Cheers.) The roma he AMNIA le the
saw of of the right hos. gesiyeses night Se berthed is ISO
weed. H. wished to hem a nmeore that siond Mowe of

meservatise. (Chesen) Bet the MI et the right km.
madames wee set • semerem of Oda menerrative
form ; but it wee, is its very prisdpie ed emenes, a rem-
lationary gemems (Cheers.) It wee • Ma that would
create aa estkeiy mew girder a thing—s MR that bad
nothing is seemess with esything Eddie is lath society.
(Cheers.) The Oak hes. madames la amok npso the
=ciple amegmmetisigagde ;
perearl
iesay it not be
bled thee hie barbs be tree in En g-
seed, but he (Mr. Leese) ea Meld that it was ',pH•
sable to Ireland. Hebrews has. mob le the Deem
Oessaasinn, and he (the hea. member) did set wish to
*pato ear improper mistime to the grisdemrs who had
eidseled that inquiry ; but he wee, seddheime, entirely
Osatielled with the result' te width they bed arriveL
There had been no emmistis attmstialed. cumuip the
ease a the mead ; the people a de%
at the Met dodos ha mod dam gestimed Mgisee
if peed* ask dams Woe paellestmet. Is adi •I Meet
of de Repeat a die Deem Cemmleass," it dm dad
to be • very deeded mist whether the Maki bed Lid
rest epos the impememests of their tesidle I ad is a
week whisk had bees wrings snider the simeidimileme a
the debt km. gentlemes (Mr. Noddy blemelf, it wee
piellivdy aided that Tem few mash ems added. New It
wee lake impwielble Set lid mil be(Hew led)
The whale vestal a Imbed bees eadmated INIS et
4,111020.1. eeeriye het it was straw* new at 12,1100,811111.
(" Eau, boar." ad a durum se illsoutt) Well, the lest
pear law whelks gam it at .11,1/10,0001.; and he wee,
thetelbre, a delemest ma maim the mark I.
paling et 12, (Ler, hear.) These tie or saves
millkse, this, and ham berm crested by gegmbedy ; sad,
every owe angled that had set hoes dem by the land.
Mein. Them amid not be the shadow ef • doubt that it
led bees amid by the tellellie, sad this se half ef the
=iseweered err raked, is es the land, bat es their
(Chews.) Ose geed reams wh Irish
Ihesmiese weee se dietesead to perlimeest, odd py erhaps
te the pubis geamially, wee the ha Net the Irish
Maude were • laden. sad Improvident
rim Est eimpaki that with those of
Me Nesbit lewd *bet weed be the remelt /
Is the Ise{ edam et Perturb " Pommes of the
Nation " r too, It wee doted that the rental
is bed ambled *nee 171111._ aleu hear.) Thee
it be ems that the ealemeidedad ilmanad IriA
lessetry—(vies of " Ns, se!" esseler odes sf " Hear,
buin—ths Wombed and lambed Irish tessatry—
wlso lived is miesseble seiteas bemuse they and is
Um is better,
_led edged= amid Ms head name 'nem
drol ulds theleO—aer hass)—and why woes treks Nell
bemuse their '
Wales& wad not let them wear breed
=l6j sod* imemed mad a their misery ea
is the SIM dm% ea the lemillesis and torte
Mk
eempandim together with geed be=
ebielitte. (Led deem) New he (lb.
wee met egyieg that bilk ',dealers wag le be asss.
Wilywith 266116 h ; bat if they would iseedimate
Newt
M the bet kelt eestary, they wadi ad tbet
the Mesa bed made awry elld within Me seem
and MI dime much mere than he hod had
esseersgemist to do. (Chem.) He Nisi es
the bend, thereby*, not to ahead the peeled wasp.
meat, but only to giro to the isasetrioes eased the 1111
.0 cell big own property his ewe. (Lae, beer.)
He ems* new to W wised= is
perk*. Desliked theSeelebe weed mbar=
or aestbsd. If sass leek bad Is Undid- at a greed
rest of 101, ad built a beam epee it which he was able
to let at 401. or 5111. a year, kerbs the whole period of
his bending lease, the gest wad be sudsiest set gay to
pay him Interest is hie rally, but to legion his eapital
with a fair bridle relit at the end of the tens. That
was of come petting an mitre= OW, but he bred sty)
that the uses principle would apply to Beglid ad late
agrieultare. But wee that the ere with Ireland I (Hear,
hem.) The man I. saglsod, drum be hisi sopped eft.
Whims le a Maladies speeslaties, Ma the seed absolute
sad entire peemedes *Owed se keg as lie lOW 1101;
bet Is bated, Ile mom lb pemedes a the improvemmits
wee set Me *nest wbe led made lie% bet the ladiesi.
(Hear, hear.) The poor rack-rested 11111ffilli lived to the
and of his term like- a WA soseedmee like aba
sea with a gig, is something very little
th:nuispisamsa sew the tht hon. gentlemen offered lie
pri of being robbed for 7, 14, go 21 years,
w " (Cheers.) Wu he}esess4 a drawing.:
eddred. picture ? Well, thee, be Wit to big head
de re is the Encumbered Estelle Oommisidted te
Lord Climedon, dated May 3, 1851, sad Is bet dessmea
it wag debit that the rents charged were " iongamy M-
-611•111111 far beyond any BUM that could by any peedliflity be
milested from the tenants." (Cheers.) In the twenty of
alikesay there were whole districts to which It was the
egMeln to put, as a matter of course, impossible rents up-n
gbellosantry. (Oh, oh.) He was not saying that this
ME in rd, but be wag speaking of particular and Imp
that would offsets* by thin bill. And this this"
cede as a custom by good landlords and bad alike--the
geed landluid not attempting to enforer, or enforcing with
ISesething like mercy, these imptesible rents; and the
bed mime the power they gave him, whesever he had
SIMON for doing so. Thug, whoa as election mourred,

did set opium% himisid is a senile tool the
est end Its arrears were sidieshil. (Cheers.)
what toad they snake • ennweamilsi peeled
e that t (Hear, hear.) In the NW of
wee • certain property contaiting 81, tenants
'stands. It was tolerably well seassged, and the
.4 tolerably wormier. The land was not par-
te and the rent of the whole before 1790 was
. Bs. Bd. per Irish acre. Daring the war the
.• 225. 10d., and at present it eras 18e 3d. pa
(Hear, hear) The tenants had no leases, but
were meetly tenants at will, and the highest rents that
timid a• et bad been charged—for he was bringing no
=e•f extravagant extortion—and so they had been
t* their present amount. Nineteen of the tenants
Ind Wilt slated horses (seven of them with two stories)
bowies 1826 and 1810.

Lord NAAS asked if the boo. gentleman would give the
names
Mr. LUCAS only desired an opportunity of proving these
facts before the committee, for ha challenged. investigation.
bet he must decline to run the risk of injuring the poor
people whose muss he was pleading. (Hear, hear.) Ten
of the tenants bad stout-drained (most)y with drains six
yards *part) 240 English acres, or one-fifth of the whole
property, the exact proportion, as stated in the July
number of the Edinburgh Beaune, of the drained land
in the improved counties of Norfolk and Bedford. (Hear.)
Twenty-three of the tenants or their predecessors had re-
claimed from bog or rock no less than SOO English acres;
and the buildings on the estate paid a rent of 1271. a year,
of which 1201. worth hail been erected by the tenants at a
1 cost of 4,0001. Daring the whole period the tenants had
been paying rent upon the full value of their own improve.
I masts; and it did happen in at least onecase that the original
rent was more than the land was worth even when improved.
In 1790 the father of two of the tenants (brothers) had
been put in possession of 83 acres, which was now culti-
vated in two farms by his sons. They had made the
CtronendeaTimeevte. me4taaintattliettelt:ldwiate° :eledn hmaurcdilly make
lion from this estate; but, theism, in some cases,
where farms had become vacant, the landlord had been
compelled to Ist them, with all their improvements, at
reduced rents—clearly showing that the tenants who
had made these improvements had beton rack-rented
in thane. [The honourable gentleman then men-
! tinned some other instances of a similar nature.]
The general result was that, in regard to the condition of
the tenantry in that part of the country, they never had
been so badly off as they were now. He would. now bring
before them anoth• r class of ease in which the tenant was
equally deprived of the benefit of his improvements. When a
tenant expended his capital or his labour in improving and
increasing the Taus of the land, what he wanted was, not
merely good terms but twenty, in order that he might go
on making further outlays, so that be might cultivate his
Lad to the best advantage. If he was deprived of such se-
aunty, and the landlord, from political or religious
=dyes, interfered with his teaantrv, that wee another
reason why the t should not be satisfied with
what the right honourable and learned gentleman called
the compensating period, as a sufficient compensa-
tion for his outlay. He believed the shortest eons-
rasating period his right hen. and learned friend snowed
for drainage and similar permanent improvements was 7
years. This would bring them bask only to HIM; there-
fore, In point of fact, the eompensating period of *soups-
tins with which the right hoe. and leaned gentleman
asked the Irish tenantry to be satisfied with was
the 7 years of famine, when all the Want could possibly
make was just sufficient to pay his landlord his rent Was
that any compensation for the capital and labour ezpended
in adding to the permanent value of the property ? When
they Ink this into account, and the feet that the whole pro-
esorie of the landlord had been already ahmehan b the
MGM llimelf be the shape of rack reels, be drunk' he
W mete mat a ease in favour of the Irish Slant es against
thin pert of the bill, and in favour of the propceal of his
• end lemsed friend (Mr. Eistrjesat Shoe). The mei.
skim of hie M. and 1 d friend's bill u ith regard to
the Ulster Mee( right depended not so much on the
recital r M ass weerkiog enactments. The right hon. and
lamed gandeman differed with that side of the house as ,
to what the Dieter tenant right was. But that bad
Minn to do with the cam. He was by no
MOM 1111 be understood as giving up the recital of the bill,
but he need not if the words " Ulster tenant right " were
Meek eat for all that it had to do with the reel question.
TM sem put forward by his hon. sad learned friend's bill
was simply thi- —That whore it could be proved there was
e custom in existence giving to the tenant anything over
and above the valee of the permanent improvements cre-
ated by means of his own labour and capital, he should
here by law so much as that urge and custom when proved
would entitle him to. That the custom differed in different
Indid not affect the case at all. The same thing existed
in many parts of England, but there was no difilculty what-
ever in establishing what was the local custom in each locality.
His hon. and learned friend was not, therefore, reduced to
the necessity of defining specifically what the Ulster tenant
right was, and of applying it in one particular form in all
localities. All that would be required to be done was to
ascertain in each cam if any particular custom of tenant
right existed, and if so to adhere to it. (Hear, hear) The
bill of his boa. and learned friend differed from that of the
government in this essential particular, that It ensured as-
ponied= to the tenant for the improved vales which his
industry sad capital had created. He did not wan to say
that the present ministerial masers was worse then others
which had preceded it. ()a the wastrary, he believed all
the government bills which had hoes brought is had been
equally bad, because in sane of them had the ease of the
tinsel been fairly dealt with. Of the present bill he might
say that the retrospective clauses would confiscate all Im-
provements already made, wad thepeospective clauses ren-
der it imparibb that improvement should continue to be
mad*. He Weed the right lese. and learned gentleman
would mph" dr time between chi and the cammenee-
meat of the Mem et the essomilette in reemideelog the
vanities of somposeeeng peeledoe so he bed receasidered
his origienl aviation with regard Se retrespeetive cempenna-
ties, and Who did so, he (Mr. Imo) bad but little doubt
that they would arrive at a setietteligy malt. On his own
peek and that of hie Mods atmeerisise, be assured the
hum that they were nag drifts or rases trig property,
dikar s • the sae side or the Mhos Their object was to
mho Whine seorte pospirly end le assist the right
hoe. and learned mane, if hi weld allow them. to
Moat &just and sariameagy settlement ef this lens agitated
Zl:isad thee is swab kis, by assamijorurealor
ssne'lreland than had hitherto bees
her, to raise an imperishable mesment to his ortaliC
seer. (Cheers.)
Kr. DRUMMOND obsenell that the boa. gentleman
who Dad jest
_sponse mimed tonoose that the
Melo et Mee liSh weee to be emit to a select own-
' mine% skits sheets bass Me power of lending for persons
eat end ef into tams ; if that was to be
He same, M bile weld remain Wore the committee all
Me swim end es** week he dens. He admitted the
Melt Mimi dot bed boss said es the ember side, both
with mewl to Miele end tosses. He believed too,
the Mw was now alledae deal wish the essialato
of • large body et as* ma. (Chasse.) s be-
lieved MS fm the of imams, all that
was on the Nand In Ireland had been platted them
by the tenenin themeolves, sad it was only jam
that they shoal be 11101111111 in some way or other in its pos.
mien. (Hear, but.) Bet his dillienity was In dealing
with the isseties by legislation. If this bill were for
Tabbies or Wales, he Should certainly oppose it, and they
sent only pressed with Its wandered= on the_ ground that
Irdeed was aliogetker en emptisnal ease. With regard
te the landlords, if they were unlike all other landlords,
abeam thatch Dutch, or Chinese, as it appeared
Wry leisgh)—they mast take the consequences ;
km the me nes eieeptimml, inasmuch as here was a large
=seatesipmense Mooing to be relieved eras what they
to he a great hardship sad Wankel, and
he Meet roller meld be obtained in no other
way. Thelma:lea ea how was Me to be done?
TIM boa. apposite had spoken of a revolutionary
I mason ; wee Mr. Sharman Crawford's bill,
which to some Meat was equally es with that of the At.
teensy General for Ireland. According to the law of Great
Britian, all Sutures met the landbehaved to ;this land.
The revolatiesary pMelple mcogaised I. tech of the
mamas was, that they should no barer belong to to.
landlord but to the tenant. It was time that lithe ease was
to be met, they must devise some machinery for the pur-
pose; but, what he wished to be understood was, that as
the ease was exceptioaal, the law to meet it was
also exceptional, and that it should cease when the
exeeptiml eirentstmes which called it into existence
were removed. For his own part, he did not like excep-
tional legislation—he had always regretted to ate the word
Ireland introduced into particular sots of parliament, con-
sidering, as he did, that every act parsed ouriht to MEM
Is Ma es well as Ragland and Scotland. The right hoe.
gentlemen (Hr. Lucas) had objected to the term premed
as OSSPIIIIMIUOIII for drainage in seven years. He (Mr.
Drummed) would give Ito opinion as to what might bio a
fair tens In Ireland, but In this countris he had seen ex-
posses incurred for drainage and irrig ;non completely re-
Mid in two years, while in others it would not be returned
Is several. He mentioned this to show that it was impoe-
Ale to lay down any general rule, but thatuome cheap and
reedy machinery must be devised by which a poor
and ignorant man could obtain ready redress.
(Hear, hear.) It, trusted that the members of the
committee English and Irish, would go Into the inquiry
determined to find a remedy for the evil before they came
out undeterred by what they might hear on the ono side or
the other.

Bar J. It . SHELLEY reminded the hone. that there
were two sides to the question, and warned them lest in
giving compensation to the tenant they infiicted an in-
justice on the landlords. (Hear, hear.) He thanked
the government for the desire they had evinced to
bring this question to s satisfactory adjustment, and he
hoped the Inquiry of the committee would result in subetan•
tial benefit
Lord NAAS thought his right hon. and learned Mend
had clearly proved that the hon. and learned gentleman's
bill was antagonistic to that of the government, and that
coosistently with the principle of the one the other could
not become law, but as both referred to the some subject,
it was thought that they might be referred together to
the same committee with advantage. Ile had, however,
no doubt that the decision of the committee would
be confirmatory of that to which the house had
arrived last erasion, when it rejected Mr. Sharman
Crawford's bill on the second reading. His (Lord
Ness's) ejections to the principles of the hon. and
learned gentleman's bill, which was the same as
that *fleet year, remained unchanged end he believed he
wee correct in stating that every member of tht. hence had
made up his mind on the subject. The course taker,
therefore, was nothing more than transferring the dist..
don of the question frem the b•iuse to a select committee,
eV. ry member of which wool.; hire previously decided on
the side he would tedth With regard to the statements

1868.

Made by the boo. member hr Meath, be had beard
statements more likely If hied to erroneous conclusion..
He rejoiced, however, to be enabled to confirm that hon.
gentleman me to the Improvement going on in Ireland, the
darkest hour In whom history, be believed, was now post.
(liar, hear.) Not gradual, but rapid and sudden im-
provement, was spreading over the land, good prices were
obtained, pauperism and crime were diminisking,a wholesome
system of emigration was in active operation. (Loud cries
of "oh," and derisive cheering from the opposition Irish
members.) Yes—though he might regret the exodus of so
many thousands of the people from the land of their birth
he could not forget the happy change to which those people
were going, and how immensely their co. dition would he
improved—(more derisive cheers from the same quarter)—
that thole who were now lining in misery where going to
where they would enjoy wealth and plenty—(cheers re-
peated)—that those who were now living on potatoes, salt,
and water—(derisive cries of " hear, hear ")—for that was
the truth—were going when they would be able to get
plenty of bread, beef, and beer—(renewed cheep)—that
they were leaving • country where they paid high rent
for their land—(hear, bear) —to go to one where land
could be had almost for nothing—that they were
exchanging a country where, from over oopulation, the
competition of labour was so great that the industrious
counties of the people were paralysed, for one, where labour
was in large demand, end that they were leading habits of
idleness for those of industry and enterprise. (Hear, hear.)
He believed there was hardly an emigrant who had left
Ireland whose position had not been enormously improved,
and though they might regret that so many were obliged to
leave their homes, still they could not but rejoice at the im-
mense improvement which must result from their emigra-
tion. The bon. member for Meath had attacked the land
lords of Ireland, and had asserted that all improvement in
the land wan made by the tenants, who were often deprived
of the legitimate advantages their improvements ought to
bring them. Now, though there were good and hod in all
claws, the landlords, as body, did not merit the wholesale
condemnation which the hon. member had heaped upon them
To whom was owing the great improvements in agriculture
which had Liken place of late years consequent on the in-
troduction of machinery soil better modes of cultivation
To the exertions of the landlords, and to the exertions they
had made and were still making through the means of the
agricultural soeieties and otherwise. (Hear, hear.) And
who we. it but the landlord. that had expended two Mil-
lions within a few years under the Irish Land Improve-
ment Acts—on their tenants' often as well as on their own
land? (Hear, hear.) He believed the tenantry of Ireland
as a body were ready to admit that they had received great
and solid advantages from the efforts of their landlords.
The hon. gentleman had said that one reason why the
Irish tenantry had not kept pato with those of other
countries was that their rents were too high. In that user.
Lion he (Lord Naas) thought the whole secret of the tenant.
right movement came out. The real object of the movement
and of the society with which the hon. member wassonnected
was to lower rents. (Ministerial cheers.) He altogether
denied the statism= made by the hon. member, that as •
rule improving tenants were harshly or notably dealt with
by their landlords, or that they were deprived of their
holdings without that compensation which was dos to them
for uaexhatuded improvements; and the instances adduced
by the hon. member, if true, were entirely exceptional,
and append to the general practice of the country. He
believed the bill of his right hon. friend had given great
sati.faction to a large body of the Irish tenantry---in fact
letters had been received from tenants in various parts of
the country expressing their satisfaction. They (the
tenantry) had been so long disappointed and deluded by
false premises and false hopes, that they knew now could
never be carried nut, that they were gratified to find a
real sad substantial measure was brought in by the
forenames' for their benefit, ensuring them compensation
in every case in which they were really entitled to it. The
question simply was,after all, should they refer the bills to a
select committee ? The principle of the government bill
was that compensation to tenants should be allowed for im-
provements made, but the principle of the bill of the hon.
member for Kilkenny, which went to legalise the tenant
right of Ulster, threw over the question of improvements
altogether. (No, no.) Yet the teaant right of Ulster,
which differed in various localities, did not proceed upon
the principle of compensating for improvements. The bill of
the hon. member confined the landlord'. right to the soil
only as it came from the Creator, leaving every thing put
upon the land, every improvement, whether made by the
outgoing tenant or his predecesson, tho property ab-
solutely of the tenant. (Hear, hear.) Then, again,
it gave the tenant at any time the right of cow.
palling a :readjustment of rent. Now, he rgreed with
the hen. member for Montrose as expressed last year, that
any measure for settling rent any other means than
mutual agreement between landlord and tenant was nothing
kw than communism. It further proposed to abrogate all
arrears, and to wipe out the debts the tenant had voluntarily
incurred. It was impossible to say that a bill proceeding
on such principles wan not in effect • confiscation of the
landlord's property. (Hear.) In the committee, as in the
house, he should feel it his duty to take the same course in
opposing such a principle. He admitted that the claims of
the tenants of Ireland were irresistible, that legislation was
absolutely nursun, and that it was impossible under pre-
sent circumstances to apply the same principle for Ireland
as was applicable to England, and with a sincere
desire to legislate with fairness nod in justice to the tenants,
with whom his sympathies were—(bear)—end believing
sincerely that his right hon. and leers= friend's bill would
go far to meet their claims, he should ge into the conside-
ration of the question. (Cheers.)
Lord WIONCK had already stated that no settlement would
be satisfactory to the tenantry of Ireland which did not re-
cognise a right of property in the tenant in such improve.
meets as were put upon the land by means of his capital
or his industry. That was the only settlement
which war based in justice, and with which the
tenants of Ireland would be satisfied. The fault
of the bill of the government was, that it ad-
mitted this principle in respect to buildings and ma-
chinery, but nut as to all other improvements. Extend
the same principle to all improvements, nod be for one
should be satisfied. He objected to the complicated nature
of the right hon. gentleman's measure. The Irish Timber
Acts (6 Geo. III.) gave the tenants a legal right in the
Woke pistol by themselves. That was • case entirely
to that of tenants' improvement., and why should
rat ? Where no specific agreement existed
the Mesa' should have • legal right Is whatever increase
is value he might make in the land.
Hr. WHITESIDE contended that his right hon. friend's
bill powided for all that was or could be fairly
ilmonsded by the tenant ; mad it for it by a eer-
ie= aleeal, and a readily machinery. Every
lituyeriga of the Devoe Ceemaidem hod been adopted
gerarantost, hots the hey mut beyond the re-
commended= of hot ohowittlisart If the rash timid
be to hobo the bill wee and moo histrotory
With to
elhorally, he MO. should rejoice.
road to the hon. sod Wm& patinwma's (Mr.
Serjeowt Shot's) bill, it was wrjunt h potwohio and int-
geohitaido in its details.
Kr. V. SCULLY could sot snow thu WI to be read a
soma time without protesting against it in its principle
owl its detail..

Th.bill gra; tee■ read . woad tinge,
Mr. WALPOLE presaging to state to-morrow when the
select committee should be appointed.
The be... then adjourned at ail o'clock.

PUBLIC OPINION ON THE BUDGET.

MANCIZESTIR.—Yesterday a numerous meeting of
the Manchester Town Couocil was held, sad at the close of
the proceedior is the afternoon, Mr. Councillor Btracey
enovid that a petition be prmented to the House of Com-
mons, praying it to reject the budget for the increase and
extension of the inhabited house tax, sad aka praying for
the repeal of the duties on soap sad paper, is preference to
the proposed reduction of the malt duties. Mr. M'Dougall
seconded the notice, which was supported by Alderman
Hopkins. A discussion took place, in the *sane of which
an amendment was moved negativing the original motion.
Upon a division, there were 37 votes for and 4 against the
motion.
Ni

•Trus—Yesterday at noon a publie
meeting was held at Neweastle•on•Tyne, when a very strong
resolution was passed against the budget.
EDINBURGH.—On Tuesday the Edinburgh Cham-
ber of Commerce resolved to petition the House of Com-
mons against the feminine of one-helf of the duty
an malt, and the theolleasdentineka end doublieg
iithebenes tax. The MOO day the Edinburgh town men-
ial ammireeuely adopted a pithiest* the snow offset on the
soden ado lima Provost, who usetsubid that the mak-
es: 'einholen was not called for , and would art benefit,
the public, end showed that the is the haus tax
would ass U IN Edinburgh the am et 11,7112/. betted of
whhh it now realised there. • midis was also
node by Oinaidllor Dick to petition against the attending
lithe insane tax to incomes below INL, bus was lost by
12 to 16, several members reprematiag that this motion
might endanger their success in the other °West. The pe-
titions in both eases were ordered to be sent to Mr.
liseaulay for presentation.

CHATIImII.—On Tuesday, a public meeting was
held at Chatham' on the same subject, the High Con-
stable prodding. A resolution was moved sad earOod, de-
claring the provisions of the budget to be estersenvs and
unjust. The resolution was carried by atnimatatloa.

CURVILINEAR OMNIRUS.—Mr. W. C. Scott has
patented, and is now exhibiting in the Bazaar, King.street,
Portman-square, a vehicle which he calls the " Curvilinear
Omnibus," and which be states, and no doubt supposes, is
• novelty, though we fancy it will be a familiar machine to
those who have travelled In the northern towns of Bog- I
land. The difference between it and the ordinary Loudon
omnibus m slight, but important, consisting in the panels at
the backs of the seats being rounded, instead of flat,
thereby increasing the interior space, and (each seat being
I separated trout tie others by arms) greatly increasing the
commodiousness. The " Curvilinear" omnibus is obviously
a decided improvement, simply as any greater width in
aa omnibus would be an improvement ; but the width is
still insufficient for comfort, and when we do make a change
in the metropolis in this direction it is to be hoped we will
go to the perfect. at once, and (Temple bar and other im-
pediments h'.ing removed) adopt together the Parisian om-
nibus standard for convenience, and that of New
Torts for speed.
TDE CONSERVATIVE LAND SOCIETY.—The execu-
tive committee, on Tuesday last, elected C. L. Gruncisen,
Esq., the 'secretary of the society. Kr. Oruneisen has be, n
connected with the public press, at home and abroad, for
many years.

THE EXPRIIOB,. Tliily3D4,7 . EVENING, DECEMBER 18,
...4. • • v .
_._ .
Us be had not done hie tee:ti— Ti that ob: glis ) was plowed's*
r Ham Oust did sot sandlot himself u a sena, tool tbe
tb regard to thros 0 the • b legs IrNaad, t the pilesi ran inspossibla rent and It. rrrrrrrrrr enforced. (Cheers.)
no substaatial aisbatina to. aciplej • , tubas bars th•
.10MOty Ms Ludt,* ; Well, now, what could they make • compenaatiu period
'gm be
iimirtould bg cap N, bat ogrek,.4 / th• Marta ba bagroud wag ma la • eon like that/ (Hear, hear.) In the ounty of Hil-
committee ; anir t beta pissed Imp~elfalewhi Ole thareaskkost Howsfte nap, that keno, Nero was • certain property containing 31 tenants
lof their beiag ',gird to-The tO make nraproussub is author soda's lapd aught to de- and 7 torralands. It was tolerably well managed, and th•
I, it ought ant to be iffliliftglid Man boat the pries the owner et Na freehold. (Hut, (tur.) H. (Mr. landlord was tolerably popular. no land was not par-
Sy one of the bills he bad prodiall *55 landlords Napier) knew that this susteary opinion wee popular, but titularly fertile, and the rent of the whole before 1790 was
s should b, *stabled ft mail Ispieweasits. a that flu was famed in Monk*. (Haar, hear.) At the about 3201., or Be. Bd. per Irish acre. During the war the
importance, which had not bees balm provided um time, be was twat wlaspal la treat the limit in the rent roes to 225. 10d., and at prevent it eras its 3d. per
[uplands had been made that testast• had bun most libiral 'hammy, is..
... the lotted to his allowed Irish acre. (Hear, hear ) The tenants bad no lessee but