The Express.
London, England, 1852-05-21 00:00:00

THS MILITIA BILL.

The bolos then went into committee as this bill, ra-
mming at the 17th clause.
Mr. GIBSON said he wished to ask a ipialaias as to the
anode in which the ballot was to be etisidneted, and whether
it was intended to adhere to all the previsions of the 42nd
Oro. 111. with reference to the ballot ? Many of those pro
visions would be exceedingly objectionable at the peteent
time. By them every householder was bound to make a
lot of every man dwelling under his roof, and to state any
phy.ical infirmity any one might be labouring under which
might incapacitate him from serving, and this list was to
be placed on the church doer.
Mr. WALPOLE said it was intended to adhere to the
provisions of the 42nd George 111. That act was in force
a long time, and he was not aware that any inconvenience
result, d.

Mr. ittIOUT coaddered it would be very unpleasant if
a min had an infirmity that it should be printed in a list
on a dumb door. When they came to the 28th clause, It
would be kis butt to propose that Mr. Dermal, as the chair-
mem M the omaeuttee, amnia hare the wand Geo. 111, before
bba. sad ahead read the whole of its ammo from the be.
&an to the and to thew, heis ember that they might
Mgr what it was they wets oseetiog be this bill.
n• thrIORNEY.OINILIAL sail he did net think it
wed/ be to to pabibb the pertivsko infirmity which
• peso hem serving in the militia.
Y the_ elan ffireolied ler was that a return should
le soft iiiipedift ash se were labouring wader say

Infirmity, but there weld be no neosedty whatever to state
what their infirmities were. Ile Mir Y. Theespr) did not
think that permute wail feel sue 00111110 esissidst •
s
and with reaped le the deputy- he &WI likii
to know what they were It fur if duty sedgroi
to Ana ? (" Hear, leer," and .) He had Sea
the right hon. gentleman (Ms. /L ) ereenited bike
dress of a depurlientised; end be mid set swan doe
M was only mashie el. ersithAig awe ass Se eau ,
dime nun whisk be bed bad the of wing hies so
ensue (Laughter.) Her (saki be admit that the tins
wee a. Wellies se bad been described. There was to be a
es the 10th of October, at which the =h-
ired load were to be appointed; and the notice
was to be gins and to be dud on the church door three
days before the latter. He &greed that it would be better
to adopt the plan panned in recent ads, and to order the
notices to be placed upon the dean of all the chapels as well
so the parish church.
Mr. WALPOLE was understood to say that he would
consent to an szteuslon of the notion.

AR;;f7wwords from Mr. Wilson,
The AT'fORNEY-GENERAL obsimmal that the we-
lkin of physical infirmity would be seeloilaintbe sargeon
who would have to examine each puree. he entered
the corps. The questions of whether anum was an ap-
prentice or a member of the Watermonee Company, were
quest,uns of fact, and such as a deputrEsstenant WAS quite
qualified to decide.
Mr. MO WATT remarked that this. soda. similar
eW-
missiuns had demonstrated the false McWe.be yid& the
committee was placed, by not having the sit helm them
upon which they had to legisls,e.
Mr. WALPOLE said that it they had brought in a bill
simply to amend the law relating to the militia fee the
purpose of raising • force by voluatevy odietomed, they
would have left the law respecting the oNopeher
of the militia exactly where it was. n• gams=
done nothing to alter the old law exeitit to anus" sad
mitigive it ; end they had certainly no disineliaation to
introduce improvement.. He would admit that it would
be desirable to extend tic notices ; sad if there was any
doubt so to the publication of the infirmities, he would in-
troduce a proviso to place it beyond dispute. (Hear, heat.)
Mr. BRIGHT said it was understood that when • man
enlisted in the regular army he was forced to undergo
very minute surgical examinstioa ; that he was stripped
naked, and was, in lac!, obliged to submit to • far more
narrow scrutiny than say beast sold in Smithfield. Would
that course be pursued towards the men ballotted for the
?
Mr. WALPOLE should :think not. The militiaman
would only have to undergo such an 'elimination as would
enable • surgeon to certify that he was • proper person for
the service; and he (Mr. Walpole) had no hesitation in
saying that the Secretary at War would make such regula-
tions as would preven. anything of the kind described by
the bon. member. .

—Mr.. HARDCASTLE then moved the following proviso:
And whereas by the said tint recited act, it is declared
that the provisions of any existing act of parliament for the
punishment of mutiny and desertion, are to be in force with
respect to the militia during such time as they are assem-
bled for the purpose of being trained and exercised, but so
that no punishment shall extend to life or limb, and where-
as suck provisions render militiamen liable to corporal
punishment, it is hereby expressly declared that no such
provision shall be held to extend to any militiamen net em-
bodied so far as to render them liable to corporal punish-
meat by the sentence of a court-martial."
Major BERESFORD thought that this question had
been bottled by the previous discussions; and that it
was quite impossible to have two mutiny bills. Moreover,
by the custom of the army, corporal punishment woo never
inflicted except for disgraceful condact, and therefore the
object of the hon. gentleman's proviso was already met.
Sir 0. PECHELL thought that flogging to the army
ought to be abolished, but he doubted whether it could be
dispensed with in the navy, when there were not the means
of ordering confinement. lie should support the clause.
After a brief discussion,
The ATTORNEY-OENERAL, in answer to Mr. Tyr-
unit, said that the militia. when embodied, were liable to
the Mutiny Act, as were also the volunteers.
Sir D. DUNDAS saii the house had passed the Mutiny
Act within a very few weeks without any objection being
made to the indiction of corporal punishment. If corporal
punishment was the law in the army it ought to be so in
the emboaicd militia, too. (Hear, hear.) Were it other-
wise, there would be the greatest difikaslty in maintaining
discipline is the army. (Hear, hear.) The 6th section of
the Mutiny Act provided that it should not extend to
tia corps or volunteers, except where that was specifically
provided for by another act. Hence, the question was an
open one; and it might fairly be discussed whether they
were bound to inflict the same punishments on men who
were called out by ballot, against their will, as were inflicted
on soldiers. (Hear, hear.) This was not a question for
military men only, but for the whole house. He would
put it to the government whether it was not desirable
to reconsider the subject, of making the militia subject to
flogging during the period of drill.
The Earl of MARCH thought that, as the period of train-
ing was so short, corporal punishment would be the more
necessary.
Mr. 0. STANLEY had hoped the government would
take into consideration this question, and so alter the clause
as not to subject militia men to corporal punishment while
training. la our Indian army, though oar soldiers were
subject to corporal punishment, and the native troops were
not, the conduct of the latter was quite as good.
After a few words from Mr. Il&autmon,
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said, the
government had given this clause the gravest eonsideraties,
but it was by no means of a simple nature. The 'abject
was me that could not be tampered with ; sad till the whole
subject was taken into consideration, it was impossible to
entertain these exceptions. The government, therefore,
felt it their duty to oppose the proviso.
The committee then divided.
For the proviso
Against it 133-46
The clause was then agreed to.
On clause 18, which provides that men shall not be liable
to the ballot after 35,
Mr. HEADLAM moved as an amendment that no per-
ems above 2.5 should be liable.

Mr. WALPOLE said the effect of this would be very
seriously to increase the hardship of the ballot. The object
of the bill was to render ill liable, as far as could cenve-
niently be done ; but if the age was limited to Prom 18 to
25, the area from which the men were to be drawn would
be seriously diminished. By taking them principally from
the young mem, there would be a greater risk of interfering
with the recruiting for the arm
Sir 11. VERNEY supported the
amendment.
Mr. MO WATT said that no doubt the hardship of ser-
vice would be felt much more by persons approaching the
age of thirty-five, who were generally settled down in life
and had wives and children, than it would be by young men
at the age of twenty. (Hear, hear.) When the right bon.
gentleman said that it was desirable to interfere as little as
possible with the enlistment for the army, it was to be ob-
served that this was a consideration which could not apply
to those who would not go of their own free will either into
the army or the militia.
After some discussion,
Mr. WALI'OLE, in reply to Mr. Mowatt, said that there
wee no particular age for volunteers. They might serve
even after the age of 35.
The committee then divided.
For the amendment
Against B9-37
The clause was then agreed to, as were clauses up to 20.
On clause 21,
Col. ESTCOURT said that the training ought to be
continued for ninety days in the slat year, end net re-
newed during the subsequent year, eseerdsi IN days,
for the purpose of muster. He &NM WON a pewits to
the effect at the end of tbe ante.
Sir H. VERNEY esseeelied Ant steely thram.dr2
would exact too great au Iscoseeaternee en mew of
and agriculturists to be submitted to, and sespeted that
the militia should be tenni out for half the month of No-
vember, half the now* of Des ember, wed the whole of the
mouth of May, whoa Offirdiusa emploptest WI scarce,
and volunteers there're, soy le be etwelwed.
Major BERESFORD eabl that the sospeelisee thrown
out by the bon. baronet might be seeded out, if
found necessary, by an order in council.
After some conversation,
The period of twenty-one days In the body of the clause
having been agreed to,
Colonel ESTCOURT moved the proviso previously al-
luded to, giving the government the power, if necessary, to
extend the training to ninety days, with the understanding
that the drill daring the following years should be &ban-
dewed. . .

The ATTORNEY-GENERAL suggested that the pro-
viso would be more advantageously attached to the follow-
ing clause (the 22nd).
Col. U. PENNANT supported the proviso of the boa.
and gallant member for Devine.
Major BEItESFORD thought the power conferred upon
the government to call out the militia for fifty-two days in
one year, if desirable, and for 21 days in :he succeeding
year, would be found quite sufficient to give a thorough drill.
The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER wandered
that the discretionary power confided to the crown of call-
ing out the militia for 66 days if necessary. would be found
amply sufficient. That period had been flied upon after
serious consideration, and with the advice of the military
authorities. He could not agree therefore to the proviso
of the hon. and gallant member.
Mr. M. GIBSON objected to the billeting of reconciles
in beer shops for so long a period as 66 days. He did amt
urge the danger to morality, as he Mow that was ma a
military consideration—(a laugh) ;—but he did urge the ia-
justice of billeting such a number of saw in boom of en-
tertainment. If the country required a sank* the sowntry
should provide barracks for them. TM boa. member con-
cluded by moving the following proviso:—" Provided that
notwithstanding soy thing contained in the said Ina switad
act, or soy other act, no officer, neawasnalasionsd officer,
drummer, or private man, serving In the militia, whoa
called out for the purpose of training and exercise, shall In
quartered or billeted in any inn, livery stable, alehouse,
victualling house, or in any home of any pawn selling
brandy, strong waters, spirits, beer, cyder, wine or me-
theglin, by retail, without the consent of the respostirs oc-
cupiers thereof."
Major BERESFORD opposed the proviso, as being son-
t sry to the established custom of the country.
After an observation from Sir H.
Mr. BRIGHT said that the liaised victuallers had
always been harshly treated in them matters.
Captain BOLUS-110 opposed the proviso, on the ground
that there was no spare barrack accommodatWa, sad, he
sides, the presence of soldiers was but a very alight Moon-
TellieDee in public-houses, open to all comers.
The ATTORNEY.GENERAL explalaod the impracti-
cability of tarrying out the proviso, and
GIBBON replied, contending that the memo