The Express.
London, England, 1864-07-02 00:00:00

THE EXPRESS, THURSDAY EVEN)NIS}, JULY 2, 1864.

and it appeared that notwithstanding the danger which
they ran, the natives, Is the district, where such things
occurred, would continually being down their alike sad
other goods in order to trade with forsiguers. He had felt
it his duty to defied Admiral Kuper's conduct, who he
believed simply performed he duty. The noble earl objected
to the &dowel's Bring on ries, and thought he
should have run away. [Eau4 acv—No. so.] As the
batteries had fired on the shim,' the admiral to return
the fire or not! (Hear, hear.) Nothing wag so
iajarious elk. tot to deal effectually with such
people. (Fl*, bear.) The French bad just had a difficulty
with the &beams in consequence of one of their ships
having been fired upon. The fact wits it was very difficult
to deal with the Japanese people. They knew but little of
their habits and prejudices, and it was not easy to go on
with them amicably. They would have occesionel out-
breaks and misfortunes of this kind unites they were pre-
pared to abandon the country. Rut how could that be
dose ? The Americans, the French, the Rus-
sians, the Prossiaas, the Swim, the Dutch,
in fact all the European nations, were trading under
the same treaty rights; and were they to run away and
leave the other nation, in pommies? If the government
withdrew, the English is that country would then trade
with the Americans, and the English government would
have no hold upon them. Lord Elgin said that they re-
quired a force in Japan as mach to keep their own
people is order as the Japanese. He believed the beet
course they could pursue was to adhere faithfully to the
treaty, to practise moderation and forbearance towards the
Japanese, and, while punishing those who misbehaved
themselves, to hold the Japanese strictly to their bargain.
(Hear, beer.)
The Earl of CARNARVON thought this question of
Japse, and of our influence and position there, was far too
serious a one) to be treated so • party matter. It
was one of the most important questions which
parliament could entertain, but unfortunately while their
attvatioo was distracted by other matters nearer home,
they had little time to devote to a matter growing up so
many thousand miles away, affecting our relations with
China nod Japan. The only party in Japan whom we could
touch, and actually had touched, was the Tycoon, and he
was the party most favourable to England, as the govern-
meat had themselves acknowledged. The Tycoon was at
war /10130 with • great many of the Mimes. and by pressing
upon him England was playing their game, for the Daimios
were most anxious to weaken his authority in every possible
way. It was quite clear from the correspondence that a great
constitutional change was going on at Japan at that moment.
The Illuddo, who was • young and ambitious man, was re-
gaining his power, and many of the Dsimios were making
common muse with him, and the Tycoon, by having shown
favour to foreigners, had becomes most unpopular person in
Japan. He thought her Majesty's government were in
great danger of pulling down about their ears the whole
fabric of the government of Japan, which was at present an
existing society. If they did do so would they undertake
the responsihility of governing that country themselves?
He agreed substantially with everything which had fallen
from his motile friend, cod he also agreed wish the whole of
the resolution, which his noble friend had moved, excepting
the last, which proposed that her Majesty's government
should without delay enter into negotiations with the
government of Japan.
Earl GREY replied. He submitted that the government
had rot denied the facia which ha had brought forward,
bat that they had admitted that the conduct of her Ma
;My'. subject, in Japan was nut good, and that the agents
of the government were utterly unable to make them con-
duct themselves better. (No, no.) He would propose that
those parts of the treaty which it was admitted the Tycoon
and the government of her Majesty could not carry into
effect should be modified, and he thought that that would
be eesy thing to perform. (Hear, bear.)

The liousedivided.. : '—
Contests
Noutootemis

Majority against the resolutions l9
THE PUBLIC AND REFRESHMENT HOUSES

(METROPOLIS, lox) BILL.
This bill wu read a second aim-.
THECOUNTY CONSTABULARY SUPERANNUATION

BILL
Ths report of amsodineots was brought op art wood to,
sad their lordships adjourned at tea minutes to 9 o'clock.

HOUSE OF COMMON& •—FRIDAY, JULY 1.
The Srm.tris took the chair at 4 o'clock.
PRIVATE BUSINESS.

The Independent Gas Company Bill, sod the NewpanY
sod Cornwell Joaction Railway Bail were road a third time
sod paned.

PRISONERS IN THE WEST RIDING.
Colonel SMYTH asked the Secretary of State for the
Home Depsnment whether in the of the next assizes
for the West Ridiog of Yorkshire being held at Leeds, the
maintenance of prisoners in the Leeds borough gaol, ta ac-
cordance with the notice in the Gazette of the 10th ultimo,
would be a charge on the oouatprate of the West Riding.
there being ample scoommodatioo for such prisoners in the
West Itiduirryneon at Wakefield? . . . .

tier G. GREY was not stile to give • positive opinion
upon the subject, but he believed the fact to be that
hitherto priaosers committed for trial at the &seizes for the
West Riding had been sent to York Castle.
Colossi SIIYTH —No, to Wakefield.
_ _

Sir G. GREY—That in after trial. I believe the fact to
be, that whores. the West Hiding has hitherto been put to
the expense of the maintenance of prisoners committed for
trial at York Castle, those prisoners will now be sent to
Leeds, and the prisoners who now go to Wakefield will con-
tinue to go there. The charge upon the emote will be the
same, sod the only change will be that of sending prisoners
to Leeds instead of to York Castle.
METEOROLOGICAL DEPARTMENT.
Sir J. ELPHINSTONE irked the Secretary to the
Admiralty whether the opinion of Vice-Admiral Pitsroy,
president of the Meteorological Department of the Board at
Trade, hail been takes as to the winds and current. which
prevailed in the Mid Atlantic is the months of July, August,
and September ; and, if so, whether he would. lay that
opinion upon the table of the house : and whether the
Lords Commissioners of the Admiralty were aware that the
facts set forth is Captain Ilaury's wind chart for the month
of August were io every respect opposed to the information
given to the house by the noble lord the Secretary to the
Admiralty, on theauthority of the hydrograpber of tbe navy.
Lord C. PAGET said the Admiralty had not consulted
Admiral Fitzroy, but they had consulted their own hydro-
prophet, who was thoroughly well versed in these matters.
With regard to Capt. Maury 's facts being to direct opposi-
tion to those of the hydrographer of the navy, he hsd to state
that instead of their being in direct opposition, they were
in direct accordance.
Sir J. ELPHISSTONE—WiII the noble lord obtain the
opinion of Admiral Fitzroy, mid lay it en the table?
Lord C. PAGET—No •we are perfectly satisfied with the
opinion of our own hydrOgrapher. (A laugh.)

s •

adequate portion of the forest for purposes of health sad
reoreatioo, from time immemorial enjoyed by the inhabitenta
of the neighbourhood sod the metropolis."
The SPEAKER ruled that the motion could not be pat.
Mr. PEEL, replied to the speech of Mr. Cox, justifying
the course taken by the government with references to the
recommendation of the select committee, observing
that the government would have no objection to the
adoption of a resolution similar in effect to the fore-
goiog ; sad be stated a proposition made by the Treasury to
the Metropolitan Board at Works for mules out the sug-
gestion of the committee.
The diecumion was cautioned by Mr. PIACOCKK and Sir
J. Tztowaes.

Mr. DOULTON would move early next session that the
whole subject be referred to • select committee. He was
oppaied to his hon. frieod's proposal, for be did not wish to
see the foreeteoclosed at all ; and though the rights of the
crown might be but small, yet if they were insisted epos
they would secure the end he had in view—namely, the
preservation of the forest for the eejoyment of the public.

lino of the third reading being put, walked oat
of the bona (Opposition cheers.) He did not
thick • bill of this character ought to pass without
some explanation being given by the responsible ministers
of the crown. The course pnraued by the right hos. gen-
tleman (Sir G. Grey) that evasion gave them some ides of
what was meant by dieriminatiog resielanom They were
warned ageing indiariminatiog resistance ; they now knew
what was meant by discriminating resistance—it meant
promising to oppose a bill when no great party struggle was
in prospect, and not opposing it when party votes became
of consequence. (Opposition chars.) Ducnnunating rosiet-
ape* was discrimuiatiog in point of time—it was resistance
when it suited yon.—(renewed 600,0)—but at all events
some gratitude wee due to those, whoever they might be,
who enriched their native language. (Laughter" " Running
away" was a coarse and vulgar arm ' • that was now ailed
discriminating regattas. They had had lately &good many
weenie= of iwtiog reeistasor. They would perhaps
soon have to discuss • foreign policy on which
discriminating resistance had been shown. (Criss
of "Question.") Surely it was material to I.IIOW bow per-
fectly consistent the policy of the govetument was, whether
they were dealing with • domestic or with a foreign ques-
tion. In each case they promised to render help when it
wee convenient, and when it ceased to be convenient they
walked Olif cf the house. (" Hear, bear," and laughter.)
Well, he saw that the house was not much inclined for
discussion. (Ministerial cheers.) He only rose to draw
attention to the conduct of one of the chief ministers
of her Majesty's government, and be trusted
that before the house finally decided the right hon. gentle-
men would explain the cams* which he bad pursued.
(Hear, bear.)
Sir G. GREY said he was ready to give the noble lad
the explanation be wanted, and he trusted that in doing
so he should sustain the character in which the noble lord
had spoken of him as a representative of her Majesty's
governmlint. In the previous discussion which took plus
with regard to this bill he spoke his own individual opinion
—(" Oh, oh," and " Hear, hear")—and in expressing that
opinion ke did not, as the noble lord imputed to him, pro-
mise to oppose the bill in any stage. (Hear.) He agreed
in the principle of the bill, but he stated that he thought
his hon. friend who had charge of it would act wisely
if, instead of asking for what parliament would not grant,
instead of pressing the bill io • shape ra which it wee not
likely ultimately to pass, he limited it by consenting to
amendments being made in it which would place Oxford on
the lame footing as Cambridge. He said he thought that
would be the most prudent course, because it would afford
the best chance of the acceptance by parliament of • bill
which would confer great advantage on these who
were =eluded from privileges which they ought to passes.
He did his hest to induce his boo. friend to accept that
modification of the bill ; and be believed there were those
on the other side of the house who were actuated by • di!.
fereot spirit from that of the noble lord— (cheers) —who
would then have met his hon. friend in • spirit of generous
conciliation, and that the bill if thus passed through par-
liament would have been a great improvement on the ex-
isting la*. (Hear, hear.) Not objecting to the principle
of the sill, ha did not feel justified in voting against
the third reading. (Hear, hear.) He should
ban been willing to see the bill assume'
another shape, but he never promised to propose amend-
ments ; he did not wish to press amendments, and be
thought he was only taking that course which became him
under tie circumstances, in not recording his vote against
the bill.' When the noble lord accused him of walking out
of the house, he would ask why did not the noble lord him-
self, whim the amendment was moved by his hon. friend the
member for the University of Oxford, rise in his place and
state theground on which heopposed the third reading !The
noble lord was now seeking to take advantage of members
coming down to the house who were not present
at the division which had just occurred—(hear. hau)—
thus taking • most unusual course. He admitted that the
noble lord had a perfect right to comment on his (modest if
be tbo*ht
d fit to do so. He had, however, now stated the
groan which had influenced his conduct, and he hoped the
house Would think that be had acted rightly. (Cheers.)
Lord J. MANNERS said the right hon. gentleman stated
the other day that he expressed only his own individual
opinion, sod did not act u the organ of the government.
He had again inspoken hisindividual capacity—(opposition
I sheers)—and up to the present moment the house had not
' been favoured with the opiuios of the government.
(Cheers.) Who was the member of the government who
told them that he spoke in his individual capacity ! Why
the right hon. gentleman the Home Secretary. In whose
departrient, be should like to know, were questions affect-
' ing the universities, if not in that right hon. gentleman's!
(Cheers.) If the right hon. gentleman told them, as be
presumed he mast to do, that her Majesty's
government had to opinion on this measure,
he was perfectly willing to accept that statement, and be
hoped it would go forth to the country that on • measure
intimately affecting the interests of one of the most famous
and ancient universities of the country her Majesty's
government had no opinion. With respect to what the
right hon. gentleman said about his noble friend's not rising
after the member for the univenity (Sb' W. Haulm:eta to
express his opinion, he (Lord J. Manners) most say
he never heard a more unjust or more unfounded
charge. No member of the government rose to
answer his hon, friend, and if his noble friend had risen be
valid have risen to beat the air, having no one to contend
against, and he would, no doubt, have been charged with
unnecessarily occupying the tires of the house. (Hear,
hear.) He thought the scene which had beep presented in
that house when it was presented to the country io the
morning would not redound to the credit of the govern-
ment. (Coats.)
Sir M. FARQUHAR rose amid loud cries of "Divide."
He said he was perfectly astonished at the coolie which
had bean punned by the government 00 that occasion, 00
member of it having spoken before the division on the third
reading. (Hear, bear.) He hoped there would be another
division on that most important question.
Mr. NEATE rose amid loud ones of •' Oh, oh," and great
interruption, and nothing which he said was audible.
Mr. COLLINS, who rose amid loud cheers from the
opposition, and cries of "Divide," seat proceeded to address
the house, but amidst the noise that prevailed only a small
portion of what he said was heard. He laid he had only
just acne to the house, and wished to hear the reasons for
the bill. By this bill it was proposed to go further than
they went with the Cambridge bill. (Divide.)
The house then d ivided—
Ayes
Noes

Majority
Great cheering on the opposition side of the house, and
counter, cheering on the ministerial benches.
The SPEAKER, having repeated the numbers of the
divisioe, said— After what has just occurred, the horse, I
think, frill not be surprised that f should give the house
the opportunity of deciding for itself, and taking another
vote upon thequertion that this bill do pass. (Hear, hear.)
In order to do so, I give my vote for the Ayes. (Cheers.)
The hone, then divided on the question that the bill do
pus.
The numbers were—
For the passing of the bill
Against
The announcement of the numbers wu received with ve-
hement and long continued cheering by the opposition.

DIVORCE AND MATRIMONIAL CAUSES AMEND-
MENT BILL.
This bill passed through coomouttes.
STREET MUSIC (METROPOLIS) BILL.

The house having goes isto committee on this bill,
Mr. AYRTON said that he had a provision to move to
clause 1, the object of which was th►t as a condition prece-
dent to a street musician being arrested he should be told of
the circumstaoess which constituted the grounds of arrest.
If hon. members were themselves likely to be entangled in
a bill of this kind they would take care to hedge round the
power of arrest by every possible limitation and precaution.
(Hear, hear.) He was desirous of protecting the inhabi-
tants of the metropolis of whatever condition by the same
precautions. (Loci cries of " Divide.") If bon. gentlemen
were not disposed to listen he should move that the chairman
report progress. (" Hear, bear," and "Oh, oh.")
The committee then divided on the question of reporting
mopes, :

For reporting progress
Airsioat
Mr. AYRTON said he thought it necessary to take the
souse of the house upon the amendment of which he bad
given notice, which was to add at the end of clause 1,
provided he shall have bees truly informed by such
householder of the circumstances under which be is required
to depart, sod shall be given into custody by such house-
holder." His object was that the musician should be in-
formed of the reason why be was required to depart.
Mr. ADDERLEY thought the proviso was absurd. Sup-
posing while a lady was engaged in some domestic comma,
lion • band of 20 German trumpeters came before
the window, under the proviso, though they all
spoke German, she would have to inform them " truly*
why they were required to depart--(laughter)—next, the
householder must inform them, bat he was not at home.
(Laughter.) The boo. and learned member also seemed to
forget that the public streets wen only for the purposes of
traffic.

Sir G. GREY thought the proviso was altogether none.
ceseary. Under the existing law, if a musician were re-
quired to go away on the ground of the illness of any one
to the house, sod be refused, he could be summoned before
• magistrate. If, however, the hon. and learned member
meant that the musician should be the judge of the circum-
stances. that was quite a different thing.
Mr. LOCKE said the right hoc. baronet seemed to mis-
undenthod the nature of the clause. He thought the
music playerought to be informed of the reason why be was
ordered to go away.
Mr. CLAY maid the clause proposed by the member for
the Tower Hamlets went too far. The musician most be
ai.e:ted to go away by the householder, but the house-
might he dying, and wax he to get out of his bed to
tell the musician to go away!
Mr. AYRTON said he would alter the word "house-
holder" to '• the person making the charge."
The committee divided :
For the amendment G7

. .
Against it
AYRTON then moved another ameodment, to the
effect that the musician should be taken lobo custody only
co the charge of the poison making the complaint.
Sir G. GREY ooncurred in the ameadment, and It wee
Woad to.
Sir G. GREY moved to add to the clause the (alloying
proviso :—" Provided, that the person making charge for an
akar.* spinet this act shall eccompan) the .xutattle who

shall take into custody any pence offeodiog u aforesaid to
the nearest police station-house, and there sign the charge-
sheet for such purpose."
Agreed
to.
Sir G. GREY moved to add a clause giving power if the
person oilskin the charge rains to enter into renogilisuco
to promo* to discharge the prisoner from custody.
AgreedY to.
Mr. ARTON then moved a clause Imposing a penalty of
40a. for singing or playiog near soy public-house or beer-
house. _ _

---
Sir G. GREY opposed the amendment, sod the clause wu
se! atived.
• • • • •

Mr. ILLNKEY, amid much laughter, moved a,ptoviso
that the act shall not extend to " Pooch sad Judy.'
Mr. PEACOCKE thought this rendered legislation ridi-
anions.

Sir G. GREY also thought this clause would render the
bill absurd. . .

lir. CLAY would not have supported the bill if he bad
had the slightest ides that it would have interfered with
Punch.
The committee divided.
For the cbiuse
Against
The prsa.ble was then agreed to, sad the house

Petted mud Published by WIWAIII KM BALMS. of No. I.
hz.hut.street. to las City of louden. hinter. at the
to LArbardotroet. to the Ptothast of Wbft•Mare.-
6/1111111•1. JVI.T 2. 10