The Press.
London, England, 1857-07-11 00:00:00

THE BENGAL MILITARY FUND.

Viscount GODERICH rose to move, pro found, the
appointment of a select committee to inquire into the
present state of the Bengal Military Fund.
Mr. V. SMITH said, as the noble lord did not mean
to press his motion, he might simply state that this
was a question which had arisen between the officers
who were entitled to the military fund of Bengal and
the East India Company, in which the East India
direction took one view, and those who were interested
in the fund another. The question stood at present
in this position. In June last the Court of Directors,
with his sanction, sent out a despatch stating that,
although they did not waive their claim of right to
any further contributions to this fund, still, if in the
course of two years from January, 1856, the revenue
was not able to meet the charges upon it, it would be
a question whether further contributions should be
called for. That would of course be &matter of gene-
rosity on the part of those who were called on to con-
tribute. . _

The motion was then withdrawn.
IRISH VICEROYALTY.

Mr. ROEBUCK moved a resolution, " That the
office of Lord Lieutenant of Ireland ought to be
abolished." He brought forward this motion, he
observed, which had been made at various times
under very different circumstances, at a most auspi•
cious time. Ireland was now not only an integral
part of this great country, but she was happy in her
Government sod in ber external and internal circum
stances, except in this one particular. Ireland ought
to be a fractional part of this country, a part, of the
United Kingdom ; he wished to make her like a
county of England, and the measure he proposed
would take away the last badge of her subjection.
Now, he asked what benefit Ireland derived from her
being in possession of a papier-mache sort of
royalty. What did the Viceroy do for Ireland? He
was the focus of intrigue in Dublin. He made Ire-
land to depend, not on her individual exertions, but
on the Government. Every one win, knew anything
of Dublin knew the sort of scenes which took place
there, and for this reason that a Lord Lieutenant
resided there. Then the expense of this tinsel
monarchy to the country was estimated at 100,0001.
But that was not all the mischief. There was
divided responsibility. How was Ireland governed
now ? First, there was the Home Secretary, who was
a member of the Cabinet. Next, the Lord Lieu-
tenant, who was a viceroy, but not a member of the
Cabinet. And, thirdly, there was the Secretary for
Ireland, who had a seat in that house. These three
persons were the real Government of Ireland, and
yet they were not connected with each other, and
none was responsible for what was done by the
other. That was a great mischief. The Lord Lieu-
tenant was a great sham. There were certain

functions of Government which belonged to the
Imperial Legislature, and these functions should be
carried on in the seat of empire. The hon. member
then called upon the Government to support the
motion, and urged the following plea :
He had a curious document in his pocket. It contained
the names of those members of the present Government
who voted for the proposal of Lord J. Russell in 15.50 to do
away with the Lord Lieutenant, and to establish in his
stead a fourth Secretary of State. He would read the
names, fir the satisfaction and edification of the house, in
alphabetical order. 'They were Mr. Baines, Mr. Bouverie,
Lord E. Bruce, M r. Cowper, Viscount Duncan, Sir 0. Grey,
Mr. Hayter, Mr. H. Herbert, Mr. Keating, Mr. Labouchere,
Mr. Cornewall Lewis. Mr. Monsell, Lord Mulgrave, Mr.
Osborne, Lord A. Paget, Lord Stanley of Alderley, Mr.
Villiers, Mr. Wilson, and Sir C. Wood. But the wonder
did not stop there, for there were six gentlemen who had
been Secretaries of Ireland, all of whom voted for the same
motion, namely, Mr. Labouchere, Sir J. Young, Mr.
Horsinan, Mr. Iler4ert, Lord Naas, and Sir W. Somerville.
Of course the noble lord, who was at that time Prime Mi.
nister, brought the question before the Cabinet, so that be
supposed it had the approval of SirF. Baring, Lord Claren•
don, and, lastly, Lord Palmerston.
Mr. HADFIELD seconded the motion.
Mr. M‘CtiLLitoll moved the previous question. He
admitted the total inutility of the Irish Viceroyalty,
but refused to destroy the office until some substi-
tute was provided. This, he remarked, Mr. Roebuck
had declined to attempt. The Legislature still re-
tained the distinction betwaen the three sections of
the United Kingdom, passing bills exclusively appli-
cable to England, Ireland, or Scotland respectively.
Until this tripartite system of legislation was aban-
doned, it would, he argued, he premature to abolish
the office of Lord Lieutenant. He challenged the
house to recognise the completeness of the Union by
passing, in the ensuing session, a single Reform
Bill, taking effect throughout the whole extent of the
British Isles, and everywhere organising the electoral
franchise upon some uaitorm and symmetrical prin-
ciple.
Mr. GROGAN also opposed the motion, among
other reasons because, as he believed, the existence
of a Viceregal Court in Dublin presented some coun-
teracting influences to the tendency towards absen-
teeism so strongly developed among the wealthier
classes of the Irish community.
Mr. WHITESIDE said if Mr. Roebuck had proposed
to identify the poiicy by which Ireland was to be
governed with that of England, and had a plan for
working out that object, he would support his reso-
lution. But such a plan required a vast amount of
preliminary inquiry and consideration, and this was,
in his opinion, a fatal objection to the motion. He
was bound to say that he did not think the prosperity
of his country bound up with a Lord Lieutenant.
Sir W. SOMERVIT.LE supported the motion.
Mr. MAGUIRE thought the office of Lord Lieute-
nant a " sham and a mockery :"

To hear hon. gentlemen, one would be led to suppose
that everything in Ireland depended on the Lord Lieute-
nant. What had that functionary done for Cork, or for
Belfast, or for any other great commercial town in Ire-
land? And yet they had been told that to the Lord Lieu-
tenant the prosperity of Ireland was to be attributed. Why
that was downright blasphemy. He would repeat the
phrase. The prosperity of Ireland was to be attributed to
Heaven ; to attribute it to any earthly agent—above all to
the Lord Lieutenant—was blasphemy.

Lord Carlisle, it could not be denied, wa3 popular :

He had made himself master of the Irish dance. From
Sir Roger de Coverley to the " double shuffle," he was
acquainted with them all, and, indeed, was at the present
time completely upon a footing with the Irish people.
His popularity had been of the greatest utility at the elec-
tions. He had been almost übiquitous ; not a pie was
there throughout the length and breadth of the land but
he had a finger in it. Indeed, lie hail been of great use to
the Ministry. But what use had he been to the country?
He (Mr. Maguire) bad been, to the Castle; he did not go
to scrape and shuffle—he went on public business ; but he
found he could do nothing. The Lord Lieutenant could
not stir ; he was a mockery; he hardly ventured upon an
opinion ; and preciselr in the same position was the Irish
Secretary. He (Mr. Maguire) had therefore come to the
conclusion that there ought to be some responsible officer
to whom Irish members could go, who would have a seat
in the Cabinet, and be able to state with decision and au-
thority his views upon any subject.
Mr. Maguire concluded by declaring, amid roars of
laughter, that he should vote against Mr. Roebuck's
motion, because no equivalent for the office of Lord
Lieutenant bad been proposed.
Mr. VANCE and Mr. BAGWELL opposed the motion.
Mr. HORSMAN thought the question one which
should be left to the consideration of the Govern-
ment. It was one thing to condemn and another to
reconstruct, and unless the Government saw what
was to be substituted for Lord Lieutenant, they
could not support the motion.
Lord PALNER3TON said there was no denying the
importance of this question ; but this was an ab-
stract resolution which, if adopted, ought to be
followed up by some practical measure to carry it
into effect. Mr. Roebuck, however, had left that
task to others, without suggesting any arrangement

by which the government of Ireland might be carried
on, after the adoption of a resolution, at the conclu-
sion of the session, condemning the existing state
of things, rendering that state of things inefficient
for the Government during a long period of time.
This was a very inconvenient method of proceeiring
on a grave question of this kind. The question was
one surrounded with great difficulties, and he was
not prepared at the present moment to propose any
arrangement that would be satisfactory. He should
vote for the previous question, and oven those who
thought that, as an abstract proposition, the office of
Lord Lieutenant might be dispensed with might vote
for the previous question, which meant that the
motion was not one whioli it was desiral.e for Par-
liament to entertain.

Mr. DLSRAELI said the motion was unquestionably
of no ordinary character; it proposed to make a
great alteration in the Administration of Ireland, and
the house should have the reasons before it which
rendered such an alteration expedient and necessary.
Now, no such reasons had been placed before tne
house, and the charges brought against the office of
Lord Lieutenant were of so general a character as
would not, even if there were time, justify immediate
or precipitate legislation :
In the first place, it is said that the office is of a deceptive
character—that it is, as it has been repeatedly styled by one
hon. gentleman in the course of his speech, " a sham "—a
word, the English of which I douht, and the parliamentary
use of which I would almost deprecate. The reasons that
have been advanced to show that the office is a sham "
have not brought conviction to my mind. Some traits
have been referred to which perhaps prove that to a certain
extent it is a ceremony and a pageint ; but is the house
prepared to terminate all ceremonies and to put an end to
all pageants? Some of the objections which have been
made to the office of Lord Lieutenant of Ireland would
apply to sib„,, • Isr• high offices of State, and, if it were
not something like utitspoe“.y to say so, I am not sure
that they would not apply to the monarchy itself. Indeed,
if you come to analyse all the arrangements and forms
that surround the fulfilment of office, I am not clear that
the highest offices in this house might not be open to the
charge of being what the hon. gentleman styles " a sham."
You might analyse the fulfilment of public duties, and
prove that an unknown clerk in a public office could fulfil,
and perhaps does fulfil, all these functions which attract so
much public attention and obtain so much public confidence.
You might reduce government to a much more simple and
rude form than it is at present. Bat having done all this—
having destroyed all sentiment and all responsibility—some
day or other an awful crash might occur, and then you
would discover that all the time you were simplifying the
forms of government you had been in point of fact but
destroying all the sources of authority.

Without asserting that this form of administration
is the one best adapted to the state of affairs in
Ireland, or that it is best calculated to deal with all
the circumstances which it has to control, and with
which it has to contend, the right hon. gentleman
maintained that it was absolutely necessary that a
clear case should be put before the house before
a change in the character of the Administration of
Ireland was sanctioned, and that nothing but a
feeling of general discontent acting upon tho Go-
vernment would justify the house, particularly at
this moment, in entering upon the consideration of
the question. No case had, however, been laid
before the house. Accusations had been made
against the Lord Lieutenant, but they were not
justified in voting for the resolution unless the
enormities of the office were so obvious, the public
discontent so overwhelming, and the Ministry so
negligent that the House of Commons ought to
conic forward to provide a remedy for the wrong.
This was not their position, and their only course
Was to vote for the previous question, which implied
that it was not convenient at the present time to
discuss the motion.

Mr. CONOLLY having spoken against the resolution,
and Mr. ROEBUCK in reply, the house divided, when
the previous question was carried by 266 to 115 ; so
the resolution was not put.

RESERVED FLEET.

Sir C. NAPIER moved for returns of the names
and rates of all steamers reserved and in commis-
',ion, the number of their crews, &c. These returns,
he said, were necessary in order to see the actual
state of the steam navy, and he entered into many
details to show that our navy was not sufficient for
the requirements of the country in the event of a
war.

The motion was seconded by Mr. BEXTINCK.
Sir C. Woou said the questions raised by the
speeches of the two hon. members would require a
long statement on his part, which he did not think
it expedient to make at that late hour, especially
since he must merely repeat the details he had given
when moving the navy estimates. With respect to
the returns asked for, the Government would not be
Justified in giving them, which would be contrary to
practice.

A short discussion ensued, in the course of which
some strong expressions were used by Sir C. NAPIER
towards Admiral DUNCOMBE, to which the Speaker's