The Daily Times.
Liverpool, Merseyside, England, 1860-11-20 00:00:00

BIRKENIfEAD M-AiiMIBgIONERS.

OPItiSfTIO. TO MR:. TRAIN'S SYS'II2.III OF
STREET - RAILWAYS.- • .
A special meeting of the Birk.enhead Commissioners
was held yesterday morning in the board=room,
Hamilton-square. Mr. Laird occupied the chair. The
otlei eorathissioners present were—Messrs.wHind,
Keightley, Harrison, Rae, Barnett, M‘Gill, alker,
Whittle, Menaieg. EYans, Cook, Milnes, Peck, Baylis,
and Willoughby.
The CLEnK read the minutet of the last meeting of
the Street. Railways Committee.
The foll Owing is an extract of the proceedings : --
"Deputations in support of the memorials for and
against street railways were received. Mr. Stitt, Mr.
Ledward, Mr. Bevan, and Mr. Cross explained the
views of the memorialists who objected to an extension
of the street railways as at present constructed.—Mr.
Williams, Mr. Craven, Mr. M‘White, and Mr. Moore
attended as the deputation in support of the memorial
advocating an extension of the street railway, and
presented an additional memorial having the same
d-__ject. The deputation having withdrawn, the exten-
sion proposed by the minute of the committee of the
20th ult., and the adjournment thereof having been
further considered, it .was resolved that the extension
be limited for the present to
park entrance along Park-road Estingle line from the
junction of the latter with Palm-grove;
South, to the
e ; that one of the
tracks in Conway-street, and the 'curved track between
Chester-street and the shore road be 'removed; that the
•
connectine. line along, Bridge-street, from Hamilton-
street to Argyle-street, and the sidine. into Church-
street be approved."
The CHAIRMAN read another memorial favourable to
the street railway scheme, bearing 346' signatures, of
it would appear he said, respectable ratepayers. The
following is the meviorial :
"Your memorialists, ratepayers and owners of pro-
perty in the township of Birkenhead and Claughton, are
favourable to the principle of street railways where
these can be introduced without obstructing the ordi-
nary traffic of the highways, or endangering the safety
of the public. Such railways, your memorialists submit,
should be constructed so as to be available for general
traffic, and to be crossed and recrossed without danger
or inconvenience—by conveyances not using the rails—
that nairow streets and
,roads should be avoided—that
such tramways should be laid down by the authorities
as part of the system of public pavement, and be subject
to their regulations and control; and they further
suggest that a reasonable toll might fairly be required
from the omnibuses using the rails. The present street
railway your memorialists consider objectionable in
principle, construction, and operation, the flange rail
and high .curves seriously obstructing the general
traffic, and proving dangerous to the public. They
therefore earnestly request that you will require that
that the evils complained of be remedied; and until this
is done, and the full term of trial originally agreed upon
has expired, that you will not sanction any extension of
the line."
The CHAIRMAN called upon
Mr. HARRISON, who moved the confirmation of the
proceedings of the committee, entering upon a long
argument upon the whole question of street railways.
He referrea at length to the meeting of the committee,
at which the deputations explained the objects of the
memorials. There were not, he said, two opinions as
to the desirability of a system of street railways. Mr.
Knox was in favour of laying the rails upon narrow
streets. Mr. Stitt was not against the scheme, if the
rails were laid in the manner which he considered
'desirable and convenient, and came there not so much
to oppose the scheme as to show that American
experience in the matter was too limited. The speaker
went on to say that the memorial against 'Train's scheme
was signed by 170 ratepayers, representing property
assessed to the sum of £5,000, whilst the memorial for
street railwayS bore the signatures -of 610 ratepayers,
having property assessed at £27,000. The line which
Mr. Stitt would adopt had been recommended for trial
in Liverpool. Until that experiment had been tried,
they could not take any further measures. Mr. Ledward
thought that the present railway might be improved.
Mr. Bevan honestly confessed that until his name appeared
in print he remained unconscious of the fact that lie had
signed any memorial, and he wished to see a single line
constructed on the middle of the street, in order to allow
carriages to ran on each side. In favour of street rail-
ways, Mr. Williams declared that the deputation could
see not the slightest objection to the railway, nor so far,
as they had ascertained, had they been attended with the
slightest injury. Their horses crossed and recrossed the
rails without meeting the slightest accident, and lie
considered that there was no difficulty whatever in
the matter. Personally, the speaker was one of.
those who bad signed the petition bearing 610
signatures. He had driven all over the roads,
and lie could not detect the difficulties represented by
Mr. Train's opponents. The curve was not all that he
might wish it, and other improvements might be advan-
tageously made ; but it was enough, he considered, that
they had the directors promise to make any improve-
ments introduced into any town •in the kingdom. He
thought that nothing could be more honourable than
the manner in which the directors had treated the com-
missioners in the matter. They were not dealing with
Mr. Train, but with their neighbours, who were honest
men, and proprietors of property in the township. No
one could have been more cautious before giving his
countenance to the railway system. He had gone' to
many places specially in order to see and make inquiries,and his advice to the commissioners was, that -they,
should adopt all improvements, and give the railway and
its directors a fair trial. He disclaimed personal motives
in the matter; but considered it their duty to the rate-
payers to adopt the measure that benefited them. He
did not agree with Mr. Stitt that the majority should
rule : the ratepayers were the proper judges of matters
relating to the township; and if his views, as a com-
missioner, did not agree with those of the ratepayers, he
should think it his duty to resign his position. He
should oppose two lines in Conway-street, and asked
them to confirm the proceedings.
Dr. BAXLIS would not, after the able expos 6 of the
subject made by Mr. Harrison, detain them at any
length with remarks of his own. He had taken some
trouble to ascertain, if possible, the feelings of the
majority, of the ratepayers, and—knowing that he was
only surprised that the committee had not gone further
in the matter. He would propose an amendment, not,
however, from any feeling of hostility. Having wit-
nessed the success of the undertaking finding the
majority of the ratepayers decidedly in its favour, and
so few constituting an opposition, whose employes,
stationed sit the Ferry, obtained 'signatures to their
Memorial by representing it to be in favour of the
extension of the railway, he could not do less than give
it his countenance. The history of the street railway
in Birkenhead proved, without any doubt, that the
people were perfectly satisfied. In two months after
its inauguration, 90,000 persons travelled upon it, and
no one could remain unconvinced of its superiority over
former means of transit. However, he thought that the
track to Claughton should displace the one to the park, the
:latter being in his opinion a complete mistake. Via
Clatighton the park was easily accessible, and the track
would have the advantage of traversing the centre of the
township and the densely populated outlying districts
on the side of Claughton, and it would do away also
with the necessity of having a second line. Re thought
it was a pity; that both lines had not been raised in Con-
way-street.. If they meant to have the . railway let it be
worked Vi-the advantage-of the township and the safety
of the public. Double rails were required in various
places for shunting purposes. This should be inevitably
done at once. After some further remarks he proposed
an amendment to the effect that permission be granted
for the extension of the railway to Palm-mrove, Charles-
vine, and Orange-street, joining the railway in Hamil-
ton-street.
Mr. BAR NETT seconded the amendment.
Mr. Coos objected to any extension of the street
railway at present, although he was favourable to the
principle.. Any one possessing a carriage could see the
objection to Mr. Train's system, and until Mr. Train
obviated these objections, he should vote
.against the
confirmation of the proceedings of the committee. He
proceeded to read a letter from Mr. Sanderson to the
board, when •
Mr. Itatnisox 'interra

_ _p, g
knew by personal communication with Mr. Sanderson,
that that gentleman did not desire, but objected, to have
the letter read.
The CHAIRMAN explained that it rested with the
meeting whether Mr. Cook should read the letter at all.
Mr. Coox considered that he should not be doing his
duty did he not read the letter.
After some further conversation,
Mr. Coox read the letter, which stated that the
writer (Mr. Sanderson) thought the rails, as at present
constructed, dangerous. If, however, that and other
minor objections were removed, the system might prove
a great public convenience. (Hear, hear.)
Mr. TlAnursox askhd Mr. Cook to read his (Mr.
Harrison's) answer' to Mr. Sanderson's letter.
Mr. Coon explained that he objected to the railway
as at preeent 'constructed. It was exceedingly danger-
ous, and the board were not justified in consenting to
schemes fraught with public danger: It was all very
well for persons who came from Liverpool and rode from
the Ferry to the Park to exclaim admiration ; but when
they' considered that' Mr. Train had stated confidently,
when he sought. to introduce the railway to the town-
ship, that not only would it not be attended with incon-
venience, but might be used by other vehicles, if desir-
able—when it was discovered that it caused general
inconvenience, and could not possibly be used by any
vehicles save those of Mr. Train, it became a question
whether they would grant the road for the private use
of one person. (Hear, hear.) There appeared to exist,
a difference of opinion about the memorial against fur-
ther- extension of the railway, but he sincerely believed
that no names were attached to it without consent.
Dr. 13Axus repeated that he had been assured that
names were attached to the memorial in the manner he
had already described.
Mr. COox—Well, I don't believe it.
The CHAIRMAN remarked that neither of the memo-
rials Was-aliSelutely against the system of street railways.
Mr.
,Coox :felt certain that no gentleman would
sanction the railway.as it was, and until improvements
had been carried into effect; and he proposed an amend-
ment to that effect. •
Mr. M`Gill seconded Mr. Cook's amendment without
making any continent.
.Mr. MENZIES said that -there appeared to be ucon-
fusion of 'opinions upon the subject. He thought that
it would be inadvisable and difficult to make great altera-
tions in the lilies already laid ; and anything they might
say or resolve he imagined could have reference only to
what shoilldTh"6- delie in other localities. -ivy wanted
light on the matter. No two gentlemen in or outside
the Board-room appeared to agree.
Mr. EVANS thought that he was in a position to offer
an opinion on the question, and he had a firm convic-
tion that in. the present state of affairs the railway
would not answer. He would advocate lines to 'Rock.
Ferry. or Eastham, but not through narrow streets
He wished to see the'system having a fair trial ; but hp
should certainly.oppose any extension of the lines already
existing until improvements had been effected.
Mr. HARRISON, in replying, remarked that of the
610 signatures on the .memorial fer extending the lines
to Palm-grove, 60 were those of ratepayers possessing
private vehicles. One of those was Mr: Charter ,who
owned several vehicles, and he saw no objection what-
ever to the railway. He agreed with Dr. Baylis—
but at the last meeting the chairman pointed to a diffi-
culty which would make it impossible to carry into
effect the doctor's amendment : therefore, lie hoped it
woeld be withdrawn. With regard to Mr. Sander-
son's letter, lie (Mr. Harrison) thought that Mr. Cook's
conduct confirmed him in his opinion that the oppo-
sition sprung, from .parties entirely opposed to street
_railways. . Mr. Sanderson, it appeared, was in favour
of improvement—so was he. . But he would take

ted him.

remarkin

that he

his own opinion long before that' of Mr. Sanderson, who,
knew no more than himself, if so much, about the
matter. He repeated that if Dr. Baylis knew the
objection to which the chairman at the last meeting
referred, he would immediately withdraw his amend-
ment. In conclusion, he hoped that this subject would
not be converted into an election cry, and that no ha&
feeling would be endangered, Whatever opinion each
held, he hoped it would be expressed in good feeling,,
and that they should go on amicably outside at least.
Mr. RAE premised that they all agree about the•
desirability of the principle in the abstract. They only
differed about the mode in which the railway had been
and should be constructed. With reference to the exten-
sion of the line to the park entrance, the company, he
believed, would undertake to lay 1 instead of 4-inch
flange, and it- would be for them to test the improved
experiment. On these grounds he should vote for the
extmsion of the street railway.

Mr. WILLououBY had found the railway objection-
able, and he thought the commissioners ought not to.
sanction schemes dangerous to the public. He had had
opportunities of speaking to a great many ratepayers,,,
whose opinion was that one rail only should be granted_
He questioned whether they had legally power to sanction
any powers to the directors without appealing to Parlia-
ment, and doubted that Parliament would sanction such
a proceeding at all. Agreeing with Mr. Cook as to the
danger to vehicles rising from the rails at present con-
structed, he instanced a cart which' broke down in
Conway-street, detaining the train for nearly half an
hour, thus proving that the carriage could not easily be
turned off the rail to the road.

.------
Mr. HIND had an eye to the public good. He
confessed that when he returned home after a consider-
able absence, he was disappointed as to the form of
the line. However, it would be unfair to Mr. Train to
raise these rails rashly ; but he considered the committee
had been hasty in coming to the conclusion of extending
the railway to Palm-grove. A line along Devonshire-
'
road to Okion would be far more serviceable, and they
would obviate the necessity of running through narrow
roads. He thought it would be well to allow Mr. Train
an opportunity of laying better rails, and then they might
come to a definite conclusion. He moved an amendment
to the effect that it is inexpedient to make any further
extension of the railway until the company provide
better rails, subject to the approval of the board.
This amendment was seconded by Mr. Peck.
The CHAIRMAN remarked that there appeared but
one opinion about the street railways, every one admitted
that the principle was good. Individually he was, he
might say, against it; but he sunk his objections in the
general good. The proposition to have the lines laid in
narrow streets would certainly meet with his strongest
opposition. He would also object to the railway passing
u through private property, unless such property was,
henceforward, dedicated to the use of the public uncon-
ditionally. Mr. Newlands, of Liverpool, had, it ap-
peared, prepared an improved plan, which was proposed
by some should be adopted in Birkenhead. Instead of
taking up the rails, he certainly thought every opportu-
nity should be presented to Mr. Train for carrying out
any improvement he might think applicable ; at an
events, after Mr. Train had expended such a large•
amount of money, he would be sorry to see the Commis-
sioners turning round upon him and not allowing him a
fair trial. For these reasons he should support the
confirmation of the proceedings.
A good deal of conversational discussion ensued be-
tween the Chairman, Dr. Baylis, and others, as to
which amendment should be put to the meeting first.
Dr. Baylis contended that the last amendment should
take the precedence. After a good deal of conversation,
wiiich, at one time, appeared to be angrily continued,
Dr. Baylis withdrew his amendment; and the Chair-
man put Mr. Cook's to the vote, when there appeared
seven for and ten against.

Mr. Hind's motion was then put to the meeting and,
lost, Mr. Hind being the only person who voted in its
favour.

The original motion for the confirmation of the pro-
ceedings was then carried by a majority of one only.

A NEW TOWN-HALL FOR BIRKENHEAD.

The CHAIRMAN announced that on Wednesday last,
during a conversation between himself and Mr. Jackson,
the latter offered to give to the township the land form-
ing the square in front of the market-place, on condition
that a town-hall should be erected thereon. He (the
chairman), feeling the importance of the offer, imme-
diately sent parliamentary notice to London, and to
Friday's Gazette. He did so because Wednesday was
the last day on which it could be done. He now
apologised for his conduct in the matter. If they dis-
approved of the steps taken, he would have the satisfac-
tion of knowing that he had done his duty to the town-
ship, and he would bear the whole of the expense. He
would not invite discussion at present, and only required
to know whether they were content.
Mr. Gough made some remarks. The chairman was
understood to have the approbation of the board.
There being no other business, the board adjourned.

LIVERPOOL POLICE COURT.-YESTERDAY.

(Before Mr. RAFFLES.)
NEGLECTING A CHILD.

Inspector Valentine brought up John Lebee (a Ger-
man) and his wife Mary, who reside in Davies-street,
off Dale-street, charged with having neglected their
child. It was stated that the man worked at Messrs.
McFie's sugar house. The inspector said, I was in-
formed that the prisoners used to lock up their child in
a' room for several hours together, and that it was
starving. I went to the place with an officer, and found
the door fastened. I forced it open and found the child
all but naked, lying on a little straw in the corner of
the room in a most filthy condition. It was much
emaciated, and had the appearance of being starved. I
sent it to the workhouse and watched the place, and in
the evening the prisoners came to the place in a state of
drunkenness, and then I took them into custody. Mr.
Raffles : How old is the child ? It appears about Bor g
months, but I understand it is 14 months. A surgeon
from the workhouse stated that the child was in a state
of the greatest emaciation, and appeared to be starved.
A crust of bread was given it, and it began to devour it
in the most ravenous manner, and he then saw it was
hungry and sent it to the nursery, where every attention
was paid to it. Mr. Raffles : How is it now ? Going
on well, sir,, and will soon recover. Mr. Raffles : Then
it was hunger that caused the emaciation ? Yes, it must
be starvation, for it was otherwise healthy. Mr, Raffles
Let the prisoners be remanded, and enquiry made about
them. They were then remanded.