The Press.
London, England, 1853-05-28 00:00:00

THE PRESS.

Sir B. HALL : I understood, my Lord, that the principles upon which
your Lordship's Administration were formed were Liberal.
Lord ABERDEEN : Yes, they are Liberal ; I look upon Liberal and

Conservative to be synonymous epithets.
Sir R. Nous : Will your Lordship have the very great goodness
to inform the Commissioners what may be the meaning which
your Lordship ascribes to the epithet " Conservative" ?
Lord ABERDEEN: I ascribe a negative meaning to it.
Sir B. HALL : And to the word " Liberal" ?
Lord ABERDEEN : I use that word with the same signification.
CHIEF COMMIssIoNER : Then your Lordship would have us under-
stand that, by the definition of a Government as one of Libe-
ral Conservative principles, you mean a Government with nu
principles at all?
Lord ABERDEEN ; I believe that is about my moaning.
CHIEF COMMISSIONER : The Commissioners will not trouble your Lord-
ship further at present; they must pursue this inquiry in other
quarters. Let Lord John Russell be sworn.

His Lordship was sworn accordingly.
: I believe, my Lord, you were Prime Minister

CHM COMMISSION]
in 1851?
Lord JOHN : I was,
GMT COMMISSION)!

: And had been so for several years ?

Lord Jo HN : Yes.
Cnizir COMMISSIONER : I believe 1 ant correct in stating, that the
last witness tried to turn you out in 1850, and that you de-
feated him, ho being then looked upon by you and your col-
leagues as " a piece of antiquated imbecility"?
Lord JOHN : Yes : what you say is quite correct.
CHIEF COMMISSIONER : You have since accepted office under him ?
Lord Joa.; : Not exactly ; I have no office, but I serve under him.
CHIEF COMMISSIONER : You are, however, Leader of the House of
Commons ?
Lord JOHN : It is very difficult to lead the House of Commons with-
out holding office, but I believe I am, at least, nominally,
Leader of the House.
CHIEF COMMISSIONER : When you were Prime Minister you wea a
Whig?
Lord JOHN : Yes 1 was.
CHIEF COMMISSIONER : Do you still call yourself a Whig?
Lord Joni, : I call myself now a " Conservative Democrat."
CmEr Commission!' : What arc the principles of a " Conservative

Democrat"?
Lord J OHN : Well, we have not yet settled that point : it does not
press—there are several matters that do—the Budget, and also
India. But I have no doubt the principles, when they are
settled, will be very good principles.
CHIEF COMMISSIONER: Has your Lordship any further explanations to
offer the Commissioners?
Lord JOHN : No ; I think the least said the soonest mended.
CHIEF COMMISSIONER: Call Sir William Molesworth.

The Right How Sir William Molesworth sworn.

CHM' Comasstotan : The First Lord of the Treasury has described
the principles of the present Administration as Liberal Con-
servative, to which he says he annexes no meaning, and Lord
John Russell has defined his own principles to be those of a
Conservative Democrat : as it is of great importance to ascer•
taro what the principles of the Government really are, the
Commissioners wish you to favour them with your view of

the case.
Sir WILLIAM 11101.E8WORTH : I have no hesitation in unequivocally
expressing them. My principles are Radical principles, and
I joined the Administration of Lord Aberdeen because I be-
lieve those principles will be carried into► effect.
CHIEI► COMMINIONEk : You are a Radical Reformer?

Sir W. MOLESWORTII : Tam a Radical Reformer, like Bentham and

like Grote.
Sir R. 'sous : Will you have the extreme goodness to state to us,
Sir William, whether you are of opinion that the colleagues
with whom you are associated arc likely to carry those prin-
ciples into effect ?
Sir W. MOLISWORTH : Certainly ; otherwise I should not be their
colleague. I take office to advance my principles. I could
have wished to have seen Mr. Cobden or Mr. Bright in the
Cabinet, because they are the public men with whom I most
entirely agree ; but it is not for me to dictate who shall be
members of a Government. All I can do is to take care not
to be a member of a Government myself which does not
sincerely intend to advance my political views.
B. HALL : You are of opinion that a Radical Baronet is a very
proper person to be a Cabinet Minister ?

Sir W. MOLESWORTII : Without entirely assenting to the position of
the Hon. Commissioner, I have no hesitation in saying, that it
is my opinion that Ministers should be Radicals; whether
they should also be Baronets is a separate portion of the
proposition.
Sir B. HALL : You see no objection to a Radical Minister being also
a peer ?
• Sir W. MOLESWORTII: I do not feel called upon to give any opinion on
that point, or how far the duties and privileges of a peer of
Parliament are reconcilable with the principles of Bentham
and of Grote. At present, a Radical Reformer, I have be-
come a member of a Cabinet which I believe will carry out the
principles of Radical Reform, and I am satisfied.
Here Sir ROBERT INGLIS observed that he was not satisfied, and that
he should wish his colleague, Mr. Gladstone, to be examined, who was
accordingly sworn.
Sir R. IsoLts : It being our duty to ascertain the political opinions
of the present Government, and generally to understand the
principles which they propose to uphold, and consider-
able perplexity having been occasioned by the varying and
somewhat contradictory evidence offered to us on this head
by the noble Premier and several of his distinguished col-
leagues—Lord Aberdeen stating that the principles of his
Government were Liberal Conservative, to which epithets his
Lordship added he attached no meaning ;—my noble friend,
Lord J. Russell, leader of the House of Commons, having
described himself as a " Conservative Democrat," and the Right
Hon. Gentleman, the First Commissioner of Works, having
unequivocally announced that he was " a Radical"—l have
to ask you whether you are prepared to state what, according
to your understanding, is the political character ofthe existing
Administration?
Mr. GLADSTONE : I have no hesitation in definitely answering your
inquiry. The present Administration of Lord Aberdeen is a
" strictly Conservative " Administration, and in that character
I alone consented to become a member of it.
' Sir R. Nous : May I take the liberty of inquiring to what party in
the House of Commons you look for the support of that Go-
vernment ?
Mr. GLADSTONE : I look to the great Conservative party, formed on
the principles of the address to the electors of Tamworth in
the year 1835.
•
Sir B. HALL : How do you reconcile this statement with that recently
made by Sir W. Molesworth ?
Mr. GLADSTONE : In this way : the statement recently made by Sir
W. Molesworth is his own statement. If he, avowedly a
Radical Reformer, chooses to sit in a strictly Conservative
Cabinet, he must settle that with his own conscience.
Sir B HALL : What do you understand by the term " Conservative
Democrat" ?
Mr. GLADSTONE : No follower of Sir Robert Peel ever made use of
such a term. It was only used by a distinguished but subor-
dinate member of the Government ; and therefore goes for
nothing. I look upon these phrases in general as methods to
disguise an unsatisfactory position ; but that does not con-
cern the followers of Sir R. Peel, whose position is peculiarly

satisfactory.
CHIEF COMMISSIONER: Do you ascribe the same meaning to the
epithets Conservative and Liberal which Lord Aberdeen
does ?
Mr. GLADSTONE : As united I do. I think the phrases, then, really
mean nothing further than a general expression of confidence
in Lord Aberdeen's Administration. Without Lord Aber-
deen the epithets would revert to their original significance.
Sir B. HALL : Am I to understand that, if a question of making
peers arose to-morrow, you would feel it your duty to select
the individuals for those honours from the "strictly Con-
servative " party ?
Mr. GLADSTONE : Clearly ; I should be very surprised were Lord
Aberdeen to contemplate any other course.
Sir B. HALL : Then all I can say is that a more unconstitutional
Government never existed.
Mr. GLADSTONE : I understand the taunt, but I hope I shall be able
to restrain myself.
Sir B. HALL : Did you ever hear of such a thing as an " organised
hypocrisy" ?
Mr. GLADSTONE . If this line of examination is proceeded with I am
afraid I may get into a passion.
Sir R. INnus : My Right Hon. Friend, I think, had better retire.
Sir B. HALL : We need not trouble him again. His evidence has
only added to the perplexities of the question. However, I,
for one, am resolved to get at the bottom of this business.
There must have been many confidential letters pass during the
negotiations for forming the Government. They must be
produced. In the meantime, I give notice that I shall summon
Sir James Graham for examination, as to the principles of the
existing Government, at our next meeting.
(dcijounki to Friday wt.)