1968-11-06

Mr. Ian Wahn (St. Paul's):: Mr. Speaker, I have the honour to present the second report of the standing committee on external affairs and national defence.


Mr. G. W. Baldwin (Peace River):: On a
point of order, Mr. Speaker, with regard to the report presented by the chairman of the standing committee on external affairs and national defence, there has been some discussion by way of the usual channels as to some means of disposing of it. I think it might be in order if I gave the house some views on the matter which might be acceptable.
As this matter came from the house, it has been suggested that the house give consideration to making an order that one supply day, not to include a Wednesday or Friday, be set aside to debate this report of the standing committee on a motion to concur in the said report; that on such motion all standing orders and precedents applicable be waived to the extent necessary to permit an amendment to be moved, as would be the case on a motion to amend a supply motion under standing order 56; and, at 15 minutes before the ordinary time of daily adjournment on such day, Mr. Speaker shall interrupt the proceedings and forthwith put all questions in order to dispose of the said motion and any amendments then before the house.
There have been some discussions on this matter and the house may feel disposed to giving unanimous consent to the suggestion that has just been made. I understand there must be unanimous consent to dispose of the matter in this way.


Hon. Donald S. Macdonald (President of the Privy Council):: Mr. Speaker, as the hon. member for Peace River has said, there have been discussions in the vein of the proposed order he has suggested. We would be quite agreeable to an order being made in that regard and would look forward to bringing
this matter forward, subject to that order, upon the return of the Secretary of State for External Affairs from his Latin American trip. We would be agreeable to having an order made in those terms.


Mr. David Lewis (York South):: Mr. Speaker, I know my colleague the hon. member for Winnipeg North Centre (Mr. Knowles) has been discussing this matter with other house leaders, and this was agreed to. Perhaps I misheard the hon. member for Peace River, but I thought he said something about not excluding a Wednesday or Friday. Or were his words "not including Wednesday or Friday"?


Gerald William Baldwin: It is one sitting day but excluding Wednesday or Friday, since sometimes that is less than one sitting day.


David Lewis: Now it makes sense. That is what I hoped was meant.


Mr. Speaker:: Is this proposal approved by the house and so ordered?


Some hon. Members:: Agreed.



INCOME TAX


Hon. Jean-Pierre Cote (Minister of National Revenue):: Mr. Speaker, I should like to table a statement, in English and in French, concerning the application of the Income Tax Act to Hutterian Brethren colonies in Canada, as promised in reply to the questions raised in this house concerning that matter.


Mr. Speaker:: Has the minister leave to table this document?


Some hon. Members:: Agreed.



HUMAN RIGHTS


Hon. Bryce S. Mackasey (Minister of Labour):: On October 2 the hon. member for
2470	COMMONS
Statement on Non-Discrimination Policy Hamilton West (Mr. Alexander) asked it the minister would undertake an investigation for the purpose of determining whether the government was guilty of having condoned discriminatory practices against Eskimos in the Panarctic project; second, whether the minister would ascertain the benefits or otherwise derived by Eskimos from the Panarctic project, and whether such persons have been affected by discriminatory practices.
The investigation of the possibility of discrimination against Eskimos by Panarctic was undertaken as promised by the fair employment practices branch of the Department of Labour.
[DOT] (2:40 p.m.)
The branch could find no evidence of discrimination against Eskimos practised by Panarctic Oils Limited. It is important to note that no Eskimo lives on Melville Island where the exploratory seismic survey work to find likely drilling sites was being carried on this summer, almost 600 miles north of the Arctic circle. Furthermore, this particular highly technical exploratory work is carried on by United Geophysical, and only highly skilled technicians and personnel can be used.
The government has a commitment from Mr. Godfrey, vice president of Panarctic Oils Limited, that Panarctic will employ as much native help as possible as this project develops. This point was stressed on several occasions by the former minister of Indian affairs and northern development in negotiations resulting in the setting up of this company, and only recently the present Minister of Indian Affairs and Northern Development sought and received assurance from Panarctic on this particular commitment.
As proof of Panarctic's co-operation with the government, arrangements have been made for six Eskimos to be brought south to undergo training this fall and winter for work on the crew of the first oil drilling rig which is scheduled to commence operations around February 25, 1969. It should be noted that a drilling crew normally consists of about 20 men, of which at least half must be men with many years' experience.
The training course, in a drilling industry school, will be conducted under the auspices of the Alberta Petroleum Industries. It will commence on November 25 and will continue until Christmas. Arrangements are being made for further on the job training with
[Mr. Mackasey.)
DEBATES	November 6, 1968
actual drilling crews until the drilling company hired by Panarctic begins operations with one drilling rig late in February.
Mr. Godfrey also informs us;
In 1969 it is likely that a further geophysical program will be conducted and we are presently discussing with the geophysical company the possibility of training some Eskimos this winter for work in the Arctic in 1969. As the tempo of Panaractic's program increases, we sincerely hope to employ as many local inhabitants as we are able to qualify for employment.
I wish to assure the hon. member that I have instructed the fair employment practices branch to continue to investigate the situation in the far north in the coming months, in co-operation with all other appropriate government agencies. We must ensure that discrimination in any form against the native population, in employment or in training, whether studied or merely due to negligence, shall not take place.
The affirmative action to which the Panarctic Oils Limited group is now committed is commendable, and a model for employers in the north.


Mr. Lincoln M. Alexander (Hamilton West):: I am pleased the minister has seen fit to give me a reply to the question which was asked of him. I should just like to put this house on notice that we must at all times be concerned about the grievances which are now coming to light every day among the different segments of this vast community. At no time can we afford to let these grievances lie dormant, because while lying dormant they can become aggravated and when it becomes necessary to find solutions the task is much more difficult, if indeed it is possible to find solutions.
I am pleased also to hear the government reaffirm the policy under the northern development program which was instituted during the Diefenbaker regime. One must keep in mind that the Eskimo has proven himself adaptable; he has shown evidence of this at Rankin Inlet. We must continue to encourage his acquisition of further mechanical skills, because the Eskimo is adaptable by nature and capable of becoming a great productive force. I therefore trust the minister will see to it that this program continues to be of benefit to the Eskimo population, and that the Eskimos take advantage of it to the greatest possible extent since in the long run this will be to the advantage of all Canadians.
November 6, 1968

Questions


Mr. David Orlikow (Winnipeg Norlh):: Mr. Speaker, I am certain all members of the house will greet with satisfaction the statement of the minister following his inquiries, to the effect that no discrimination exists in the new oil exploration program just beginning in the far north. I suggest to him we should not have to make such inquiries every time a new project is entertained or begun in the northern part of Canada. I suggest that he discuss with his colleagues the advisability of writing a clause into any contract or concession which the government concludes with companies that intend to work in the northern parts of the country, spelling out clearly that it is government policy that there shall be no discrimination based on race, colour or creed.
I hope, Mr. Speaker, we will be more successful with the new projects than the government apparently has been with the power company which it owns and operates in the Yukon and Northwest Territories, which employs very few Indians and Eskimos. I would like to mention one more thing before I finish. I hope the government will take steps to see that the kind of discrimination in the field of social relations which occurred on the Dew Line project, in the Whitfield case with the Marconi Company, cannot happen again. In other words companies should know it is government policy that there be no discrimination on the job, or in any other way, in northern Canada.


Mr. Gerard Laprise (Abitibi):: Mr. Speaker, I should like to say very briefly how pleased I was to hear the statement of the hon. Minister of Labour (Mr. Mackasey) on the steps taken by Panarctic Oil Limited which had at least ten Eskimos come south to take training courses during the fall and winter to better prepare them for the jobs the company can offer them in that area of the Arctic.
Having had the opportunity of visiting a few Eskimo centres a few years ago, I saw how easily the Eskimos learned to handle the mechanical equipment the white people use in the performance of certain jobs.
I therefore feel that the Panarctic Oil Limited decision is wise and should be followed by all the other companies operating up north.



QUESTIONS

[Stage Direction]
(Questions answered orally are indicated by an asterisk.)

Mr. Coates: 1.	What firm or firms were retained by the Company of Young Canadians as consultants and what was the total paid to the firm or firms of consulting and professional fees for the fiscal year 1967-68?
2.	How many individuals on the staff of the Company of Young Canadians received salaries of $10,000 or more, what are the names of the individuals and what were the responsibilities of each?
3.	What was the total amount paid for advertising in the various communication media and what firm or firms were retained by the C.Y.C. for these purposes and what did each receive for their services?
4.	What was the deficit of the C.Y.C. for the fiscal year 1967-68, and how does the government intend to cover this deficit?
5.	What was the total amount paid to volunteers of the C.Y.C., how many volunteers were involved in the Company and what are the names of the ten volunteers who received the largest allowances and what was the amount in each instance?
6.	What was the total of expenses for the Executive Director of the Company of Young Canadians for the fiscal year 1967-68, and what is his annual salary?


Hon. Gerard Pelletier (Secretary of State):: I am informed by the Company of Young Canadians as follows: 1. The following firms were retained by the Company of Young Canadians in a consulting and professional capacity in the fiscal year 1967-68: Gowling, MacTavish, Osborne & Henderson; P. S. Ross & Partners; Societe de Mathematiques Appli-quees Inc.; Aubrey E. Golden:	Human
Behaviour Research Group; Gille Desroches et Associes Inc.; Berger, Tidsdall, Clark and Lesly, Ltd.; Conseil des Oeuvres de Montreal; Touche, Ross, Bailey & Smart; Welby Computer Services Ltd. The total amount paid to these firms in consulting and professional fees was $87,121.93.
2.	Eleven staff members received salaries of $10,000 or more: Alan Clarke, executive director; Stewart Goodings, assistant director; Richard Salter, director of operations; Martin Beliveau, associate director; Ben Baich, project staff, Alberta; Marty Sawma, internal education; Geoff Cue, project staff, B.C.; Campbell Mackie, program staff, Ottawa; Richard Gaudreault, co-administrator; Michel Coupal, translator; Andre Leclerc, director of information.

November 6, 1968
Questions
3.	The Company of Young Canadians did not pay anything in the fiscal year 1967-68 for advertising in the various communication media and it retained the services of no firms for this purpose. Three television commercials were made for a total cost of $4,000. These commercials were shown on the two major television networks, C.B.C. and C.T.V., and on private stations as public service ads, at no cost to the Company.
4.	The deficit of the C.Y.C. as shown by the statement of income and expenses for the year ended March 31, 1968 was $94,345.00.
Name	Living $ 215.18
Gerry Fatels	
Serge Loyer	265.00
Albert Burger	260.00
Edouard Casaubon	360.00
Yves Brunet	362.00
F. Bertrand Ede	180.00
Francine Carrieres	220.00
L.-P. Aubert	360.00
Jean Roy	250.00
F. Marchand	250.00
The company intends to recoup this deficit in its current year of operations, and for the three months ended June 30th, 1968, the economies effected have resulted in an excess of receipts over disbursements of approximately $40,000.
5.	The total amount paid to volunteers of the C.Y.C. in the fiscal year 1967-68 was $526,904. The number of volunteers who were paid through the payroll was 293.
The following names of the ten volunteers who received the largest monthly allowances and the amounts are:
Personal	Special	Total$	$	$35.00	35.00	285.1835.00	35.00	335.0035.00	35.00	330.0035.00	85.00	480.0035.00	85.00	482.0035.00	135.00	350.0035.00	35.00	290.0035.00	35.00	430.0035.00	-	285.0035.00	-	285.006.	The total of expenses for the executive director of the Company of Young Canadians for the fiscal year 1967-68 was $3,913.85. His annual salary as set by order in council was $20,000.


CHARGES AGAINST SEAMEN'S UNION
Mr. Howard (Skeena): 1.	Since January 1, 1963, were any charges laid against the Seafarer's International Union or any officer or member thereof or against any person to the effect that Section 268 of the Canada Shipping Act had been allegedly contravened?
2.	By whom were such charges laid, upon what dates and what are the names of each person or organization so charged?
3.	What has been the disposition of each such charge and the date thereof?
4.	What costs were incurred by the Government of Canada with respect to (a) obtaining information leading up to the charges being laid (b) the actual laying of the charges (c) witness fees (d) expenses of witnesses (e) transportation (i) of witnesses (ii) R.C.M. Police Officers, and (iii) others than those mentioned in (i) and (ii) hereof (f) telephones (g) telegrams (h) legal fees (i) matters other than those referred to in (a) to (h) inclusive?
5.	How many hours were used by R.C.M. Police officers in dealing with these charges and what is the estimate of wages paid to such officers for such activities?
6.	Were any witnesses brought from Vancouver and, if so, did one or more of them put in an

expense claim for silk or nylon stockings and, if so, was the claim accepted and paid?


Hon. G. J. Mcllraiih (Solicilor General):: 1.	Yes. 15 members of the seafarer's International union were charged under section 408 of the Criminal Code of Canada that they conspired to persuade great lakes seamen to absent themselves from duty in violation of section 268 of the Canada Shipping Act.
2.	Corporal J. L. G. Charron, R.C.M. Police, on January 30, 1964. There were two informations, the first charging William Glascow, and the second charging Harold Chamberlain Banks, Leonard J. McLaughlin, Harvey McKinnon, Thomas Piercey, Fred Southern, John Royee, Rene Turcotte, Paul Gagne, Henning Jacobson, Gilbert Gauthier, John McQuaig, Gilbert Johnson, Raymond Doucet, and Donald Swaite.
3.	(a) Southern, Turcotte, Jacobson, and Johnson were dismissed by Sessions Judge Emile Trottier on June 29, 1965; (b) McLaughlin, McKinnon, Piercey, Royce, Gagne, Gauthier, McQuaig, Doucet, and Swaite were dismissed by Sessions Judge Emile Trottier on June 22, 1965; (c) The charge against Glascow was withdrawn on August 10, 1967; (d) The charge against Banks is still outstanding.
November 6, 1968



4.	(a) $17,038.97; (b) $2,923.44; (c) Information not available; (d) $9,854.20; (e)(i) $1,038.00; (ii) $4,204.20; (iii) Nil. (f) $550.00; (g) $1,712.23 for telex service including man hours (approximately); (h) $90,796.08; (i) $1,953.00.
5.	2,444 hours in service of summonses, subpoenas and attending trial for an estimate cost of $7,505.41.
6.	Yes. There is no record of a Vancouver witness putting in an expense claim for silk or nylon stockings.


BOOK &quot;CANADIAN NATIONAL RAILWAYS&quot;
Mr. Fortin: 1.	What amount did Colonel Stevens receive for writing the book, "Canadian National Railways"?
2.	Was this book published in the French language and, if not, has the C.N.R. taken steps to publish this book in French?
3.	When will this book be published in French?


Hon. Paul Hellyer (Minister of Transport):: The management of Canadian National Railways advises as follows: 1, 2 and 3. Colonel Stevens was employed by the company to supervise the research into and the collection of historical material related to the company and its predecessor companies dating back to 1832. This material, which is kept in the company's library, is made available to and is frequently consulted by outside railway and transport researchers. Following the collation of the historical data Colonel Stevens, on his own, and with the permission of the company, wrote two books covering the company's history. The publication of these two books was solely the undertaking and the responsibility of the author who made arrangements with publishers. (It is our understanding that the books have not as yet been published in French.) The specific arrangements concerning the publication were between the author and the publisher. In so far as the historical data is concerned, the company is continuing to collect and collate historical material which, together with that already assembled, is available to researchers. When the collection of material is completed
Questions
and placed on a current basis and the company decides to make any publications, then these will be in both languages.


VISITS BY FRENCH GOVERNMENT OFFICIALS
Mr. Coates: 1.	How many officials of the Government of France have made special visits to Canada since April 1, 1963?
2.	What are the names of these officials and in each instance, what was the purpose of the visit to Canada?


Hon. Mitchell Sharp (Secretary of State for External Affairs):: 1. French citizens who are admissible to Canada and who do not fall within the immigrant category may enter this country without a visa provided they hold a valid passport. For this reason, even though the receiving country should normally be advised of official visits planned by foreign officials, the Canadian government does not keep a list of French government officials who have come to Canada on special visits since 1963.
2.	Not applicable.


POOL PAYMENTS FOR GRAIN
Mr. Dumont: 1.	What does the Canadian Wheat Pool pay the Western farmers for different categories of grain?
2.	What is this same grain worth at the elevators in Fort William, Port Arthur, Sorel, Trois-Rivieres and Quebec?


Hon. Jean-Luc Pepin (Minister of Industry, Trade and Commerce):: 1. Under the Canadian Wheat Board system of marketing, farmers receive an initial payment at the time of delivery and the balance when the delivery pool for the crop year is closed. Final payments for the 1966/67 crop year pool for oats and barley were announced on March 12, 1968, and for wheat on March 27, 1968. The total price realized by producers on various grades of these grains basis in store the Lakehead were:


DISCHARGE OF SEWAGE FROM SHIPS, ESQUIMALT HARBOUR
Mr. Anderson: What steps have been taken to provide federal ships, including naval vessels, using Esquimau harbour with holding tanks to eliminate the discharge of raw sewage into the harbour?


Mr. Yves Forest (Parliamentary Secretary to President of the Privy Council):: I am
informed that all the ships operated by the civil departments and using Esquimalt harbour regularly, except one R.C.M.P. patrol boat, are equipped so that they do not discharge raw sewage. Two older ships operated by the Department of Energy, Mines and Resources are not so equipped, but normally they do not use this harbour. The submarines and the oceanographic research ships Quest and Endeavour are the only naval vessels fitted with holding tanks.


TENDERS FOR MAIL DELIVERY, PLACENTIA, NFLD.
Mr. Carter: Were tenders called for the recently awarded mail delivery contract for Placentia and St. Mary's Bay, Newfoundland and, if not, what was the basis of the award?


Hon. Eric W. Kierans (Postmaster General):: No.
Note: The service which formerly operated between St. Vincent's (St. Mary's Bay) and the main, highway (connecting with the St. John's and Argentia Highway Service) was rearranged to operate between St. Vincent's and Whitbourne via Placentia, by virtue of an arrangement with the contractor.


PAYMENTS TO ANDREW PAUL, B.C. INDIAN
Mr. Howard (Skeena): For each fiscal year since 1949-50, how much money by individual payment, if any, was paid to, or on behalf of, the late Mr. Andrew Paul, a Native Indian from British Columbia, and what was the reason for the expenditure in each case?


Hon. Jean Chretien (Minister of Indian Affairs and Northern Development):: Mr. Andrew Paul has been deceased since July 28, 1959. Consequently there is no longer any information, available within the department to reply to this question.
November 6, 1968

Questions


CASH PAYMENT FOR FARM STORED GRAIN
Mr. Soulham: Is the government giving consideration to a policy to establish cash payments at the rate of one cent, per bushel, per month, for farm stored grain and, if so, when will this legislation be presented to the House.


Hon. Otto E. Lang (Minister without Portfolio):: Mr. Speaker, the answer to question 406 is no.


ANALYSIS OF ABORTION PILLS
Mr. Yewchuk: Has the Department of National Health and Welfare refused a request to analyse in its laboratories various abortion pills feared dangerous?


Hon. John C. Munro (Minister of National Health and Welfare):: The Department of National Health and Welfare receives each year a number of requests from individuals asking that an analysis be carried out on a specific product. Since no action can be taken on the results of such analysis, the individuals are informed that the Department of National Health and Welfare is not in a position to perform such a service. However, if there appears to have been a violation of the Food and Drugs Act or regulations, an investigation is initiated and any official samples obtained during such investigations are, of course, analyzed in departmental laboratories.
In February, 1968, the president of the Association for the Modernization of Canadian Abortion Laws, wrote to the Department of National Health and Welfare indicating that she had in her possession three types of pills "which are being given to women in the Ottawa-Hull area in conjunction with certain injections to induce abortions." The association requested that the pills be analyzed.
On the basis of all the information available, there did not appear to be any violation of the Food and Drugs Act or regulations.
Accordingly, no analysis of these pills were carried out in the laboratory of the food and drug directorate.


PROVINCIAL PAYMENTS UNDER ASSISTANCE PLAN
Mr. Clermont: What were the amounts paid to each province under the Public Assistance Plan of Canada in 1967?


John Carr Munro: Federal payments to the provinces under the Canada Assistance Plan during the fiscal year 1967-68:
	$
Newfoundland	17,901,873
Prince Edward Island	1,738,858
Nova Scotia	10,263,995
New Brunswick	7,185,018
:Quebec	102,602,470
Ontario	100,287,774
Manitoba	15,571,938
Saskatchewan	13,403,926
Alberta	26,538,313
British Columbia	32,719,792
	328,213,957
* Payments to Quebec were made under the Established Programs (Interim Arrangements) Act through the Department of Finance.


PROSECUTIONS FOR OVER-QUOTA GRAIN DELIVERIES
Mr. Mazankowski: What are the number of violations and prosecutions for the 1967-68 crop year, with respect to over quota delivery of grain?


Jean-Luc Pepin: In the 1967/68 crop year, The Canadian Wheat Board was informed of 272 violations and breaches of The Canadian Wheat Board Act or regulations in respect of the over-quota deliveries of grain. Prosecutions were instituted in each case. One hundred and fifty-one persons were prosecuted and in some cases more than one charge was laid against a single person.


UNCLAIMED INCOME TAX DEDUCTIONS
Mr. Dionne: What is the amount of Income Tax deducted at source, in accordance with the Income Tax Act, which has not been claimed by Canadian taxpayers during 1966 and 1967?


Joseph Julien Jean-Pierre Côté: Computation of unclaimed tax deductions for the 1966 taxation year: Tax deducted at source from employees on account of tax payable under the Income Tax Act (Canada) and under the income tax acts of agreeing provinces, $3,061,262,734.24. Credit allowed on assessment of individual income tax returns for tax deducted at source, $2,986,608,419.84. Remainder represents the amount of tax deductions remitted by em-

November 6. 1968
Questions
ployers and not claimed by employees by means of the filing of an individual tax return, $74,654,314.40.
The amount unclaimed in respect of the 1967 taxation year is not available. Statements will be prepared as at December 31, 1968.


WAGE EXPENDITURES, CAPE BRETON HIGHLANDS PARK
Mr. Muir (Cape Breion-The Sydneys): What amount was expended in wages at the Cape Breton Highlands National Park in each year since 1958?
Hon. Jean Chretien (Minister of Indian
Affairs	and Northern	Development):	1958-59	Year ending	31	Mar	59 $	335,5641959-60	(( tt	31	Mar	60	329,7861960-61	u tt	31	Mar	61	453,0971961-62	tt it	31	Mar	62	572,5741962-63	tt it	31	Mar	63	419,1571963-64	it tt	31	Mar	64	349,0881964-65	it tt	31	Mar	65	439,9611965-66	tt tt	31	Mar	66	490,4761966-67	tt it	31	Mar	67	439,8281967-68	it it	31	Mar	68	416,574

APPLICATIONS	1960	1961	1962	1963Received*	21	18	21	15Approved	4	0	8	9Rejected	10	12	26	4
Under consideration


C.B.C. TIME GIVEN QUEBEC PARTIES
Mr. Caouette: For the period October 10 to 15, 1968, inclusive, how much time was alloted by the CBC to (a) the Parti Quebecois (b) the Ralliement Creditiste, during information programs and during free programs?


Gérard Pelletier: I am informed by the Canadian Broadcasting Corporation as follows: (a) French networks: approximately 5 hours and 41 minutes. English networks: approximately 3 hours and 5 minutes, (b) French networks: approximately 1 hour and 30 minutes. English networks: approximately 7 minutes.


APPLICATIONS FOR PARDONS
Mr. Muir (Cape Breton-The: Sydneys):
1.	How many applications have been received by the Solicitor General for pardons, from citizens who at some period in their lives committed an offence under the Criminal Code but now feel their citizenship since that time justifies the elimination of that criminal record?
2.	How many of the applications for pardon have been approved, how many have been rejected and how many are presently under consideration?


George James McIlraith: 1964	1965	1966	1967	Up to Sept. 30, 1968	TOTAL45	70	152	256	158	75615	9	20	40	65	17024	14	29	84	64	26787	87
* Numbers in this column include applications and correspondence relating to expunging of criminal records. Many applicants, on being informed of the procedure and thorough investigation that is made, either abandoned their applications or failed to provide the information required to make a decision.


C.M.H.C. FUNDS FOR CONDOMINIUM HOUSING
Mr. Goode: Will Central Mortgage and Housing Corporation use any of the recently allotted funds for condominium financing and, if so, how much?


Hon. James Richardson (Minister without Portfolio):: Mr. Speaker, the answer to question 544 is yes. Applications for the financing of condominium projects will be considered along with applications for other types of

housing. No specific amount has been set aside for condominium products.


PROMOTION COST, WILDLIFE SERVICE PAMPHLET
Mr. Paproski: 1.	What is the total cost for 1968-69 of the advertising program in all media on behalf of the Canadian Wildlife Service pamphlet, "Hinterland Who's Who"?
2.	How many times in 1968-69 has the above pamphlet been advertised on television?
3.	On how many stations in Canada has it been shown in the period in question and how many times on each station?
4.	What has been the cost of television advertising of this pamphlet to date?
5.	Was a similar television campaign put on in the United States on behalf of the above-named
November 6, 19G8

pamphlet and, if so, what has been the cost to date?
6.	How many requests for the pamphlet have been received in (a) Canada (b) the U.S.A.?
7.	What was the total cost of pamphlets sent out?
8.	How many persons in the Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development worked on the production of the pamphlet in question and what was the total cost of production?


Joseph Jacques Jean Chrétien: 1. Nil. There is no advertising program for the "Hinterland Who's Who" series of leaflets (4 pages, 8|" x 11") on Canadian wild animals. The Canadian Wildlife Service has produced eight one-minute television clips in English and French and has supplied them to television stations across the country. The clips are telecast as a public service without charge. The cost of producing one clip in French and English is about $1,625 using footage from a stock-shot library.
2.	Most stations do not report their showings, but fifteen stations reported showing the clips 1,260 times in the four months April to July. The estimated value of this time provided free as a public service by media, is $152,698.
3.	CFTK, Terrace, British Columbia, 54 showings; CBC-TV, Edmonton, 8 showings; CHRE-TV, Regina, 180 showings; CKCH-TV, Regina, 60 showings; CJAY-TV, Winnipeg, 197 showings; CBC-TV, Winnipeg, 26 showings; CKCO, Kitchener-Waterloo, 48 showings; CJOH-CJSS, Ottawa, 25 showings; CFCF-TV, Montreal, 77 showings; CBMT, Montreal, 15 showings; CBVT, Quebec City, 61 showings; CJPM-TV, Chicoutimi, 126 showings; CJCH-TV, Halifax, 200 showings; CBYT, Corner Brook, Newfoundland, frequent use, but no total available; CJON, CJOX, CJCN, St. John's, Newfoundland, 184.
4.	Nil.
5.	No.
6.	From April to September 1968, a total of 18,998 requests for information on wildlife (10,480 in French) were answered by the Canadian Wildlife Service and 1,099 came from the United States. Of these inquiries, 4,170 mentioned the television clips and specifically requested leaflets in the "Hinterland Who's Who" series, but few were from the United States.
7.	From April to September about $3,720.
8.	Production of the leaflets required a small percentage of the time of one information officer and one editor. The cost of
Questions
producing the 105,700 leaflets sent out between April and September 1968 was $3,720, or about 30 each.


INCREASED DISABLED PERSONS ALLOWANCES
Mr. Muir (Cape Breton-The: Sydneys):
What consideration has been given by the government to the possibility of increasing allowances for the disabled under the Disabled Persons' Act?


John Carr Munro: No consideration is being given to increasing allowances under the Disabled Persons Act as provision is made under the Canada Assistance Plan for federal sharing in supplementary payments to persons who require additional aid, or alternatively for the provinces to provide basic assistance for disabled and other persons in need through general assistance measures. No federal ceiling is placed on the amounts of aid granted under either of these alternatives.


DREDGING OF MONTMAGNY BASIN
Mr. Lambert (Bellechasse): 1.	Has the Minister of Transport been made aware of difficulties of communication presently existing between Montmagny and Ile-aux-Grues as a result of the lack of dredging in the Montmagny Basin?
2.	Having regard to the economic importance of migratory bird hunting, particularly on Ile-aux-Grues, will the Minister of Transport have the Montmagny Basin dredged in the near future?


James Armstrong Richardson: Mr. Speaker, here is the answer divided into two parts: 1. No.
2. Any decision about the dredging comes under the responsibility of the Department of Public Works.


FEDERAL ASSISTANCE FOR OLYMPIC GAMES
Mr. Coates: 1.	What was the total amount of assistance made available by the federal government to participants in the Olympic Games and how were these monies provided?
2.	How many individuals from Canada participated in the Olympic Games?


John Carr Munro: 1. The federal government through the fitness and amateur sport program of the Department of National Health and Welfare provided a total of $281,609 to

November 6, 1968
Questions
assist sports governing bodies in the selection participating in the 1968 Olympic summer of the 1968 Canadian summer Olympic team, games in Mexico city. Details of federal aid in providing pre-training for the team and are as follows:
	National		
	Champion-	Pre-Olympic Participation	
ships	Training	in Olympics$	$	$Canadian Olympic Association	-	20,000	73,485Fencing	4,353	1,395	Gymnastics	6,429	3,510	Track and field	36,393	11,828	Weightlifting	5,406	-	Wrestling	7,186	17,750	Cycling	4,258	-	Equestrian	1,873	7,828	Oarsmen	5,100	-	Shooting	10,782	-	Swimming and diving	24,820	9,908	Yachting	8,314	5,319	Canoeing	15,672	-	130,586	77,538	73,485
2. The Canadian Olympic team was made up of 136 athletes and 32 officials for a total of 168.


CAPE BRETON-SUPPORT FOR TOURIST INDUSTRY BY DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION
Mr. Muir (Cape Breton-: The Sydneys):
1.	To date, what financial support has been given by the Cape Breton Development Corporation to the development and expansion of the tourist industry?
2.	To what groups or individuals has this financial support been provided and what was the amount involved in each case?


Mr. Russell C. Honey (Parliamentary Secretary to Minister of Forestry and Rural Development):: The Cape Breton Development Corporation makes an annual report and does not otherwise disclose the details of its operations.


FEDERAL POTATO SUBSIDIES
Mr. Clermont: 1.	How many commercial potato producers have applied for benefits under the federal aid program announced by the Minister of Agriculture on March 27, 1968, in (a) Canada (b) Quebec (c) the County of Papineau in Quebec?
2.	What is the total amount of subsidies under this program in (a) Canada (b) Quebec (c) the County of Papineau in Quebec?
[Mr. Munro.l
3. What is the average number of acres allowable per potato producer applying for a subsidy?


Hon. H. A. Olson (Minister of Agriculture):: 1. To date: (a) 10,975; (b) 4,029; (c) 76.
2.	(a) $2,348,850; (b) 737,075; (c) 21,387.50.
3.	8.5 acres.


JAMES EARL RAY-COURT ACTION ON PASSPORT APPLICATION
Mr. Woolliams: 1.	Has any person, persons and/or corporation been charged in reference to the application granting Mr. James Earl Ray a Canadian passport or passports?
2.	What charge has been laid?
3.	What court is this charge now before?


George James McIlraith: Mr. Speaker, the answer to part 1 of this question is yes; Mr. Henry Moos, Kennedy Travel Bureau, 296 Queen Street West, Toronto, Ontario. The answer to part 2 is that Mr. Moos was charged that he did sign a declaration without the due administration of the declaration, contrary to section 12 of the Commissioners For Taking Affidavits Act, R.S.O. 1950, chapter 57. The answer to part 3 is that the information was laid before Mr. B. Jeffery, J.P., Toronto, Ontario on October 4, 1968. The summons served on Mr. Moos is returnable at magistrate's court, Toronto on. November 13, 1968.
November 6, 1968



QUESTIONS PASSED AS ORDERS FOR RETURNS


Mr. Lambert (Edmonton: West):
1.	In the Public Service how many persons occupy the rank of deputy minister, associate deputy minister or the equivalent and how many such persons have an executive assistant or equivalent on service establishment?
2.	What is the normal salary range for such executive assistants?
3.	Similarly how many persons occupy the rank of assistant deputy minister or its equivalent and how many executive assistants or equivalent on service establishment?
4.	What is the normal salary range of the latter executive assistants?
Return tabled.


CLASSIFICATION OF EXECUTIVE ASSISTANTS TO SENIOR PUBLIC SERVANTS
Mr. Lambert (Edmonton: West):
With reference to Question No. 955 of last Session, how many persons by individually named departments or agencies discharge the functions of executive assistants to (a) deputy ministers (b) assistant deputy ministers of their associates or equivalent in rank as the case may be and which of these are classified at (a) the AS 4 level-(b) the AS 5 level-(c) above the AS 5 level?
Return tabled.


CAPITAL RETURNS AND PROFITS OF CROWN CORPORATIONS
Mr. Fortin: 1.	For each of the Proprietary Crown Corporations, what was in 1967, the return on the capital invested?
2.	For each of the said Corporations, what was the profit in 1967 and what part of such profit was paid to the government?
Return tabled.


CONSTRUCTION OF ACCESS ROADS
Mr. Fortin: 1.	How many forest access roads were subsidized by the government in 1965-66-67-68 in the federal constituency of Lotbiniere?
2.	How many miles of road were built (a) in each province (b) in the federal constituency of Lotbiniere?
3.	What amount was spent for this purpose (a) in each province (b) in the federal constituency of Lotbiniere?
Orders for Returns
4.	What amount will be spent for each province and for the federal constituency of Lotbiniere in 1968-69?
Return tabled.


COMPANY OF YOUNG CANADIANS- CONSULTING FEES
Mr. Diefenbaker: 1.	In the Report of the Company of Young Canadians for 1967-68 there is an item that $489,019 was expended for consulting and professional fees during the year.
2.	What are the names and addresses and amounts paid to each of the recipients of such payments?
Return tabled.


POST OFFICE VEHICULAR AND HIGHWAY SERVICES
Mr. Mather: 1.	How many temporary arrangements have been entered into for vehicular and highway services by the Post Office Department in 1967 and for the first six months of 1968?
2.	How many signed contracts for such services have been made in the same period?
3.	What has been the cost of (a) the temporary arrangements, per arrangement (b) the signed contracts, per contract?
Return tabled.


NATIONAL STANDARDS ORGANIZATION
Mr. Flemming: 1.	Is the government considering the setting up, through some department, of a completely new national organization on standardization to be known as The Standards Council of Canada and, if so, is it proposed that such a Council will take over the duties which have been carried on by the Canadian Standards Association, which has been acting as Canada's National Standards body for 49 years, under charter from the Government of Canada?
2.	Has the government received complaints relative to the efficiency and performance of the Canadian Standards Association which would cause such a step to be considered?
3.	Does the Canadian Standards Association receive a grant from the Government of Canada and, if so, what is the amount of the grant for the present fiscal year and for each of the last five years?
4.	What is the estimated initial and annual expenditure of the proposed Standards Council of Canada and what portion of this expenditure will be supplied directly by the Government of Canada and what amounts will be supplied by others and by whom?
5.	Has the Government of Canada investigated what additional funds would be required to enable the Canadian Standards Association to provide full and complete services in connection with national and international standardization and

November 6* 1968
Motions for Papers
related certification services and, if so, what is this amount?
6.	What will be the remaining functions of the Canadian Standards Association if the Standards Council of Canada is formed to take its place?
7.	Is it contemplated that the Canadian Standards Association will have a part in the operations of the Standards Council?
8.	Does the government not consider it advisable for the purpose of improving its financial position to use and develop the Canadian Standards Association as the appropriate organization to continue to carry out the responsibilities rather than setting up a duplication of same at greater expense?
Return tabled.


Mr. R. R. Souiham (Qu'Appelle-Moose Mountain):: Mr. Speaker, I rise on a point of privilege. Question No. 200 in my name has been standing on the order paper since September 20. In looking through this question I can see no reason for such tardiness on the part of the government in answering. I do not think this statistical information should be hard to secure and, I would appreciate having an answer in the near future.



MOTIONS FOR PAPERS

Yves Forest: Mr. Speaker, notices of motions Nos. 28 and 30 are agreeable to the government, subject to the usual reservations with regard to confidential papers and authorization from government authorities concerned.
Would Your Honour be good enough to call notices of motions Nos. 24, 27 and 31?
I ask, Mr. Speaker, that the remaining notices of motions be allowed to stand.



PREVENTION OF CRIME

[Stage Direction]
Motion No. 28-Mr. Valade:
That an humble Address be presented to His Excellency praying that he will cause to be laid before this House a copy of all letters, telegrams and other communications exchanged between the Government of Canada, or a representative thereof, and the Government of the Province of Quebec concerning the measures to be taken for the prevention of crime in Canada.
Motion agreed to.

[Stage Direction]
Motion No. 30-Mr. Schreyer:
That an order of the House do issue for copies of all correspondence received by the Minister 
of Indian Affairs and Northern Development from persons or organizations within the Province of Manitoba relative to the re-organization of the Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development.
Motion agreed to.

[Stage Direction]
Motion No. 24-Mr. Howard (Skeena):
That an order of the house do issue for a copy of the report of the interdepartmental committee, the establishment of which was announced on March 29, 1965, which studied the question of fish and game laws as they relate to native Indians.
Joseph Jacques Jean Chrétien: Mr. Speaker, I would ask the hon. member to be kind enough to withdraw his motion, because it deals with privileged papers within the department and, unfortunately, we cannot table them in the house.


Mr. Frank Howard (Skeena):: Mr. Speaker, that suggestion might be acceptable were it not for the fact that the minister has already produced one of the interdepartmental documents pursuant to a previous motion for papers. I do not think I can accede to the request; therefore I must ask that the question be put.


Mr. Speaker:: Is it the wish of the hon. member that the matter be transferred for debate or that the question be put at this time?


Mr. Howard:: Question.



ARDA REPORT ON POVERTY AMONG INDIANS

[Stage Direction]
Motion No. 27-Mr. Orlikow:
That an Order of the House do issue for a copy of the Report prepared by ARDA dealing with poverty among the Indians of Canada.
Russell Clayton Honey: Mr. Speaker, there is no report as referred to in this notice of motion. The reference may be to a working paper designed for interdepartmental purposes which is confidential and not for publication.
I have spoken to the hon. member for Winnipeg North this morning, and I understand that in view of this information he will consent to the removal of the notice of motion from the order paper.


Mr. Speaker:: The motion is dropped.



PASSPORT APPLICATION, JAMES EARL RAY

[Stage Direction]
Motion No. 31-Mr. Woolliams:
That an Order of the House do issue for a copy of all applications and/or other documents leading up to the granting of a passport and/or passports to Mr. James Earl Ray, the alleged assassin of Martin Luther King.
Hon. C. M. Drury (President of the Treasury Board):: Mr. Speaker, the Minister of Justice has already informed the house that this case, involving a passport application to which my hon. friend has referred, is now before the courts. The matter is therefore sub judice at this time, but we expect that the documents in question will become public knowledge in the course of judicial process during the trial. Therefore, with great respect, I would ask the hon. member to withdraw the motion.


Mr. Eldon M. Woolliams (Calgary Norih):: Mr. Speaker, I should like to accommodate

November 6, 1968
Inquiries of the Ministry the minister but I do not think the matter has anything to do with court proceedings. I would therefore ask him to produce the documents, and ask that the matter be transferred for debate.


Mr. Speaker:: Transferred for debate.



DOMINION-PROVINCIAL RELATIONS PROSPECTIVE FEDERAL WITHDRAWAL FROM JOINT SOCIAL PROGRAMS

[Stage Direction]
On the orders of the day:
Hon. Robert L. Stanfield (Leader of the Opposition):: Mr. Speaker, I should like to ask the Prime Minister a question arising out of replies given by the right hon. gentleman on Monday and yesterday concerning the intention of the government to withdraw from a number of shared cost programs and turn over additional tax points to the provinces. Is the government now giving notice to the provinces required by law to terminate the existing agreement on the hospital insurance plan?


Right Hon.   P.-E. Trudeau@Prime Minister: No, Mr. Speaker.


Robert Lorne Stanfield: I have a supplementary question with respect to the intended withdrawal of the federal government from the medicare program after five years. Does the five year period date from the entry of each province into the medicare plan, or from the date of the federal legislation coming into force?


Mr. Trudeau:: Mr. Speaker, I understand that the five years is counted from the date when the legislation came into force.


Robert Lorne Stanfield: Mr. Speaker, I have a further supplementary question. When the federal government withdraws from any of these shared cost programs and taxation points are turned over to the province, will the province, in order to continue to receive fiscal transfers, have to meet from time to time standards established and set under these programs by the government of Canada?


Hon. E. J. Benson (Minister of Finance):: Mr. Speaker, the provinces have to have the standard established in order to get into the programs. It is our intention, I should like to make it clear to my hon. friend, to work out a formula that provides the provinces with at least half the continuing cost of the program involved. It should also be emphasized I believe, that if the provinces run the programs

as efficiently as possible from that point onward, the formula might even give them a surplus.


Hon. Marcel Lambert (Edmonton West):: supplementary question to the Minister of Finance, Mr. Speaker. I will repeat a question that I asked of the Prime Minister yesterday. Does this include programs devised or proposed by the federal government and imposed upon the provinces without prior consultation, such as was the post-secondary education program?


Edgar John Benson: Mr. Speaker, nothing was imposed upon the provinces in the postsecondary education program. We simply recognized the great priority of post-secondary education in Canada and transferred to the provinces amounts far beyond anything that was advocated even in the Bladen report.


Robert Lorne Stanfield: A further supplementary question, Mr. Speaker. For the purpose of clarification, would the Minister of Finance indicate how his proposal is different from the existing arrangement, since the federal government is going to continue beyond 1972, 1973 and 1974 to meet half the costs of shared cost programs?


Edgar John Benson: This is the fact, Mr. Speaker. It would take a long explanation, so I would refer my hon. friend to Hansard for December 6, 1966, at pages 10773 and 10774, where a rather full explanation was given by the then minister of finance.


David Lewis: Mr. Speaker, the question I was going to direct to the Prime Minister now seems to me even more relevant than it was before the orders of the day were called. In view of the importance of the subject that has been discussed on orders of the day, does the Prime Minister not feel that a full statement should be made by the government on which programs are in view, and exactly how the transfer will be made, so that this house can debate a matter so basic to the welfare of Canadians?


Pierre Elliott Trudeau: Mr. Speaker, this basic matter, as the hon. member puts it, is at least two years old. At that time the then minister of finance made a very lengthy statement in explanation of our whole position. I suggest that the hon. member refer to it.


David Lewis: A supplementary question, Mr. Speaker. Since a statement made two years ago about a general situation and a statement about matters which are being discussed in a
November 6, 1968

concrete way with the provinces are obviously different, may I ask the Minister of Finance first, and the Minister of National Health and Welfare second, whether they would undertake to make a statement to the house as to the discussions that have taken place with their counterparts in the provinces in connection with this matter?


Edgar John Benson: Mr. Speaker, I think that the proposal I made to the provinces was basically the same as that made in 1966 by the minister of finance.


David Lewis: But we ought to hear it.


Edgar John Benson: I did not materially change the proposal. I referred the Leader of the Opposition to some pages in Hansard and I would also refer this hon. member to them. They outline the programs involved. In addition to this, I would refer him to the Medical Care Act and what is contained therein.


Gerald William Baldwin: Mr. Speaker, I should like to ask the Minister of Finance a supplementary question. In order that the government and the provinces may at all times have careful and precise knowledge of the cost of these programs, would the minister lend them his computers?


Edgar John Benson: Mr. Speaker, I would be very pleased to if they need them.



FINANCE


[Stage Direction]
On the orders of the day:
Mr. Andre Fortin (Lotbiniere):: Mr. Speaker, I wish to direct a question to the Minister of Finance.
Since the Canadian government has made a $32 million loan to the Newfoundland HydroElectric Commission at 51 and 5g per cent interest per year, as recorded at page 2201 of Hansard, and since Hydro Quebec has just floated a $50 million bond issue, does the Canadian government intend to grant the same facilities to Hydro Quebec at the same rate as Newfoundland?


Edgar John Benson: Mr. Speaker, I believe the loans to Newfoundland-though I should like to check this first-are made under the Atlantic Provinces Power Development Act, which is a specific act passed by parliament setting out the conditions under which loans can be made to the 29180-1571
Inquiries of the Ministry Atlantic provinces for this particular kind of development. It is, of course, part of the development program to encourage expansion in the Atlantic provinces and to overcome regional disparities.



CANADIAN CITIZENSHIP


[Stage Direction]
On the orders of the day:
Mr. W. B. Nesbitt (Oxford):: Mr. Speaker, I should like to direct a question to the Secretary of State. Would the minister make a statement to clear up the widespread misunderstandings and confusion which have been created by statements reportedly made by the minister, and particularly by his parliamentary secretary, concerning the alleged preferment presently granted Commonwealth citizens in relation to the conditions which must be met prior to their obtaining Canadian citizenship? I ask this question because of the statement attributed to the minister and his parliamentary secretary to the effect that British subjects pay-


Mr. Speaker:: Order. The hon. member has asked his question; I believe it is that a statement be made by the minister on motions.


Wallace Bickford (Wally) Nesbitt: With great respect, Your Honour, unless I explain in a sentence the basis for my question it would be very difficult for the minister to know to which statement I have reference.


Mr. Speaker:: Order. The question was asked on a number of occasions yesterday so I am sure the minister knows what it is about.


Wallace Bickford (Wally) Nesbitt: With great respect, Mr. Speaker, the statement attributed to the minister was that citizenship would cost British subjects $5 whereas in fact it costs $10.



CANADIAN BROADCASTING CORPORATION


[Stage Direction]
On the orders of the day:
Hon. W. G. Dinsdale (Brandon-Souris):: Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Secretary of State. In view of the government's straitened financial position and the resultant economies in the distribution of printed media of communication, as represented by the recent Post Office Act amendments, is it the intention of the government to effect similar economies in

November 6, 1968
Inquiries of the Ministry the electronic media of communication, such as the C.B.C.?


Gérard Pelletier: I believe, Mr. Speaker, that the government wants to make all the savings possible and reasonable. However, I am not aware of a particular study being conducted at the present time on the particular and specific problem of electronic communications within the Canadian Broadcasting Corporation.


Mr. J. P. Nowlan (Annapolis Valley):: Mr. Speaker, I have a supplementary question that I would direct to the President of the Treasury Board. Has Treasury Board approved an order in council authorizing the expenditure of $66 million odd on the C.B.C. building in Montreal, construction to begin in December, as set out in a return made to this house on October 16?


Charles Mills (Bud) Drury: Mr. Speaker, I would have to have reference to the particular return to check this.


Mr. Georges Valade (Sainte-Marie):: Mr. Speaker, I simply wish to rise on a point of order.
I wanted to put a question to the hon. Minister of Transport but, since he is not in the house, I shall keep my question for another day.



CRIMINAL CODE


[Stage Direction]
On the orders of the day:
Mrs. Grace Maclnnis (Vancouver-Kingsway):: Mr. Speaker, I have a question for the Prime Minister. In view of the different dates given by the President of the Privy Council and the Minister of National Health and Welfare for the introduction of legislation to take contraception out of the Criminal Code, would the Prime Minister resolve the contradiction by telling us the actual date of the introduction of this legislation?


Donald Stovel Macdonald: Mr. Speaker, perhaps I could respond to that question best by pointing out to the hon. lady that the bill was introduced in the other place last week.
[Mr. Dinsdale.l



DOMINION-PROVINCIAL RELATIONS EXTENSION OF TAX COLLECTION ARRANGEMENTS

[Stage Direction]
On the orders of the day:
Mr. C. A. Gauthier (Roberval):: Mr. Speaker, my question is directed to the Minister of Finance.
In view of the fact that the minister has obtained the consent of the provincial delegates, during the last federal-provincial conference, to collect income tax for another five year period, could he tell the house whether that was a unanimous decision on the part of all the provinces?


Edgar John Benson: Mr. Speaker, I believe my hon. friend is talking about the tax collection agreements that apply to provinces other than Quebec, which carriers on its own tax collection. Mind you, it does not apply to all taxes in all provinces. For example, Ontario collects its own corporate tax. The provinces of Ontario, Quebec and British Columbia collect their own succession duties as well.


André-Gilles Fortin: Mr. Speaker, I do not think the hon. minister has answered the question, for we all know that all the provinces impose taxes. We would like to know if the decision was taken unanimously during the discussion at the federal-provincial conference.


Edgar John Benson: Mr. Speaker, no one disagreed.



HEALTH AND WELFARE


[Stage Direction]
On the orders of the day:
Mr. Robert C. Coates (Cumberland-Col-chester North):: Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Acting Minister of Energy, Mines and Resources. Is the minister in a position to indicate what action the department is taking to eliminate or contain the fire that rages on in a mine dump in the town of Springhill. Smoke is polluting the whole town of Springhill. I directed a similar question to the Prime Minister yesterday.


Mr. R. J. Orange (Parliamentary Secretary to Minister of Energy, Mines and Resources):: Mr. Speaker, all matters relating to the safety
November 6, 1968

and control of mining operations and abandoned mine workings come under the jurisdiction of the province concerned. The fire in the coal mine dump at Springhill, Nova Scotia, has been burning for a number of years and the department of mines of that province is actively continuing its investigation of ways and means of controlling the burning and the smoke pollution. The federal government stands ready to provide technical advice relative to this provincial responsibility, should it be requested.


Robert Carman Coates: A supplementary question, Mr. Speaker. If federal officials have no jurisdiction in the area, why have officials of the Department of Energy, Mines and Resources gone to Springhill to study the matter? On what basis has that been done, and why?


Robert John (Bud) Orange: Mr. Speaker, I assume they have gone at the invitation of the provincial department of mines.


Robert Carman Coates: A further supplementary question, Mr. Speaker. Could the acting minister inform the house whether air pollution is a responsibility of the federal government?


Mr. Speaker:: Order, please.



EXPO '67 INQUIRY AS TO SALE OF EXPO EXPRESS

[Stage Direction]
On the orders of the day:
Marcel Joseph Aimé Lambert: Mr. Speaker, in the absence of the Minister of Industry, Trade and Commerce may I direct a question to the Minister without Portfolio, the hon. member for Saskatoon-Humboldt. Some ten days ago I asked the minister to advise the house what steps were being taken to protect the city of Edmonton with regard to the disposal of the Expo express. Some time has passed. Can the minister tell us just what steps have been taken. Just what is the decision with regard to the public sale of equipment forming part of Expo express?


Otto Emil Lang: Mr. Speaker, nothing really has
changed in the time that has passed. Discussions between interested parties are going on and I assure the hon. member that the proper interests of all parties will be taken into consideration.


Mr. Steven E. Paproski (Edmonton Centre):: A supplementary question, Mr. Speaker. In this case is the highest bid for the Expo express to be accepted?
Inquiries of the Ministry


Otto Emil Lang: The high bid in fact was accepted in the case of the Expo express.


Marcel Joseph Aimé Lambert: For which
tender?



AIR TRANSPORT


[Stage Direction]
On the orders of the day:
Bruce Andrew Thomas Howard: Mr. Speaker, my question is intended for the Acting Minister of Transport. In view of the recent loss of another aircraft, bringing the total to 45 lost in southern British Columbia in the last ten years, is the minister considering the compulsory installation of homing beacon devices on aircraft operating in southern British Columbia?


James Armstrong Richardson: Mr. Speaker, I sympathize with the concern that is expressed about this matter. Generally speaking, the department is in favour of safety devices of this kind, but the kind of search and rescue device that is being spoken of has not had wide acceptance, and it is expensive. For those reasons it has not been made compulsory.


Bruce Andrew Thomas Howard: A supplementary question, Mr. Speaker. Is the
acting minister aware that this device can be purchased for less than $200?


Mr. Speaker:: Order, please.


Georges-J. Valade: A supplementary question, Mr. Speaker, to that asked by the hon. member who has just sat down. Can the minister take this house into his confidence and say whether the report to the effect that the Minister of Transport is to change servicing procedures at Dorval and Malton airports represents official government policy?


Mr. Speaker:: Order, please. The hon. member cannot ask a minister to confirm or deny reports of this nature.



INDIAN AFFAIRS


[Stage Direction]
On the orders of the day:
David Orlikow: Mr. Speaker, I wonder whether the Minister of Indian Affairs and Northern Development can

November 6, 1968
Inquiries of the Ministry answer the question I asked of him yesterday. He said he would reply today.


Joseph Jacques Jean Chrétien: Yes, Mr. Speaker, I am ready to answer. I have made an investigation regarding the question of the hon. member and no employee of the Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development has issued a list of people who receive welfare payments in the province of British Columbia.


Mr. Robert Simpson (Churchill):: Mr. Speaker, may I direct a supplementary question to the Minister of National Health and Welfare. Can he advise the house if his department is continuing to circulate among drugstores in British Columbia lists of Indians receiving welfare and entitled to free drugs?


John Carr Munro: Mr. Speaker, that question arose yesterday, We are checking into the matter at present. I do not believe that is the situation, but I shall try to give a more adequate reply tomorrow.


Robert Simpson: A further supplementary question, Mr. Speaker. When the minister is looking into this matter will he ascertain whether old age pension recipients are being included on lists that are being circulated?



NATIONAL SECURITY


[Stage Direction]
On the orders of the day:
Eldon Mattison Woolliams: Mr. Speaker, my question is directed to the Solicitor General and arises out of starred question No. 642. Has the Solicitor General consulted with the Attorney General of Ontario or any other province, or with any other authority, with respect to charges being brought against certain persons with regard to perjury in connection with false declarations in two applications for passports?


George James McIlraith: Mr. Speaker, I should like to take that question as notice.



GRAIN-REPORT OF SCIENTISTS RESPECTING EXPORTS TO JAPAN

[Stage Direction]
On the orders of the day:
Mr. Don Mazankowski (Vegreville):: Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Agriculture. On October 23 the minister took as notice a question concerning results achieved by a committee of two senior scientists sent to Japan by the Board of Grain Commissioners, as to the export and processing of Canadian grains. Does the minister now have a report to make to the house?


Horace Andrew (Bud) Olson: No, Mr. Speaker. I undertook to make a report when these two gentlemen returned to Canada. I thought that would be on October 23. They were not then back in Canada and I will check to see if they are back now.



NATIONAL CAPITAL


[Stage Direction]
On the orders of the day:
Mr. Lloyd R. Crouse (South Shore):: Mr. Speaker, I wish to direct a question to the Minister of Forestry and Rural Development which arises from questions asked in the house on September 19 and 23 and October 21. Has a decision been reached with regard to a committee of the house to deal with matters concerning the national capital?


Hon. Jean Marchand (Minister of Forestry and Rural Development):: No, Mr. Speaker.



FINANCE


[Stage Direction]
On the orders of the day:
Mr. Gilbert Rondeau (Shefford):: Mr. Speaker, my question is directed to the Minister of Finance.
Does the minister intend to recommend granting a new charter to the Montreal District and City Savings Bank which applied recently for a commercial bank charter?


Mr. Speaker:: It seems to me this question could be placed on the order paper.
November 8, 1968



AIR TRANSPORT


[Stage Direction]
On the orders of the day:
Steve Eugene Paproski: Mr. Speaker, since the Minister of Transport is not here may I direct my question to his parliamentary secretary. Is there any intention of allowing Canadian Pacific Airlines, Western Airlines or Pacific Western Air Lines additional flights in and out of Edmonton to compensate for those which were deleted from Air Canada's winter schedule for that capital city?


James Armstrong Richardson: Mr. Speaker, decisions of that kind come under the Canadian Transport Commission and will be reviewed by that body.



CANADIAN BROADCASTING CORPORATION


[Stage Direction]
On the orders of the day:
Mr. Robert McCleave (Halifax-East Hants):: My question is for either of two ministers who are seatmates-the Minister of Labour or the Secretary of State. Has either been advised that a group of C.B.C. newsmen belonging to a C.L.C. union had prevented a C.B.C. newsman from a C.N.T.U union from reporting the dominion-provincial conference this week in Ottawa on national networks, and what action is contemplated?


Mr. Speaker:: Order. Could that question not be placed on the order paper?


Robert Jardine McCleave: Since this involves the freedom of the press, Mr. Speaker, I will ask that it be debated at ten o'clock.



AGRICULTURE


[Stage Direction]
On the orders of the day:
Mr. John Burton (Regina East):: My question is for the Minister of Finance. Is the minister now able to inform the house whether or not he will propose accelerated depreciation allowances for farm grain dryers similar to those for farm grain storage equipment?


Edgar John Benson: have asked the Minister of Agriculture to
Inquiries of the Ministry look into the feasibility of doing this. We intend to have a consultation on the matter in the near future and when a decision has been reached an announcement may be made.



USE AND OPERATION OF GRAIN DRYERS

[Stage Direction]
On the orders of the day:
Mr. A. P. Gleave (Saskaloon-Biggar):: My
question is directed to the Minister of Agriculture. In view of the large quantities of out-of-condition grain on the prairies, is the Department of Agriculture, through the Board of Grain Commissioners, giving any assistance or advice to farmers on the use and operation of farm grain dryers?


Horace Andrew (Bud) Olson: I had a report yesterday from the minister of agriculture for Saskatchewan. He advised me they had made a survey and found there are more than 800 on-farm grain dryers in that province, having a capacity of something like 800,000 bushels a day. This is so far in excess of anything which has been available in other years that we think the situation is well in hand.
As far as advice is concerned, pamphlets have been put out by the Board of Grain Commissioners giving both advice and caution, I might add, so that some of the milling qualities of the grain should not be adversely affected.


Alfred Pullen Gleave: Is the Board of Grain Commissioners making spot checks on the quality of grain as it is going through local dryers?


Horace Andrew (Bud) Olson: I do not know whether they are making any special effort of that kind this year. The hon. member is aware that the Board of Grain Commissioners does this as a normal practice, but I will inquire to find out whether any special arrangements have been made to meet the exceptional conditions this year, and, if not, I will ask whether the board does not think it advisable that additional checks should be made.



FISHERIES


[Stage Direction]
On the orders of the day:
Mr. Frank Moores (Bonavisla-Trinity-Con-cepiion):: I have a question for the Minister of Fisheries. Does the minister intend to pay deficiency payments to the east coast fishing industry up to the end of October, as he announced on October 16 in this house, or only until the end of September as he advised the industry on October 18?

November 6, 1968
Inquiries of the Ministry


Hon. Jack Davis (Minister of Fisheries):: Mr. McCutcheon:	Would it be sate to
This matter is now under active consideration, assume that this would be in the year 1968?



EXTERNAL AFFAIRS


[Stage Direction]
On the orders of the day:
Mr. Paul Yewchuk (Athabasca):: My question is for the Prime Minister. Can the right hon. gentleman assure the house that Canada has lived up to its international image as a peace keeper by actively encouraging the government of South Viet Nam to attend the Paris peace talks which are set to begin as soon as South Vietnamese representatives attend?


Charles Mills (Bud) Drury: I will take that question as notice.


INCOME TAX
[Stage Direction]
On the orders of the day:
Mr. Henri Latulippe (Compton):: I should like to put a question to the hon. Minister of Finance.
Can he tell the house whether he intends to change or to cancel the $120 ceiling on the new tax increase?


Mr. Speaker:: I would suggest to the hon.
member that he should put his proposal during the budget debate which will, I believe, be resumed within the next few minutes.


AGRICULTURE
[Stage Direction]
SUGAR BEETS-PHASING OUT OF SUBSIDY On the orders of the day:
Mr.   Mac. T. McCutcheon@Lamblon-Kenl: have a question for the Minister of Agriculture further to the one I asked him in October relative to the phasing out payment of $60 an acre to sugar beet growers. When can farmers expect to receive these cheques? Can the minister give us an approximate date.


Horace Andrew (Bud) Olson: I do not think I can give an approximate date for the arrival of those cheques, but I can advise the hon. member that we now have the data, or the statistical information we need in order that the necessary proceedings can go forward.


Horace Andrew (Bud) Olson: I think it would be safe to assume that the minister will give a more detailed reply tomorrow.


ROYAL CANADIAN MOUNTED POLICE
[Stage Direction]
On the orders of the day:
Mr. Roch La Salle (Jolielle):: Mr. Speaker, a week ago the member for Charlevoix asked the Minister of Justice why the house of the chairman of the school integration movement at Saint-Leonard is kept under guard by the R.C.M.P. The minister replied, in the absence of the Solicitor General, that when the latter was in the house, he would give us that information. Can the Solicitor General of Canada give us that information today?


George James McIlraith: Yes, Mr. Speaker. The R.C.M.P. were in Saint-Leonard, but on a matter which had no connection with the school integration activities going on there. They were there in connection with an entirely unrelated matter.


POST OFFICE DEPARTMENT
[Stage Direction]
On the orders of the day:
Mr. Arnold Peiers (Timiskaming):: I should like to ask the Postmaster General whether it is the intention of his department to circulate the criteria being used by the department in connection with the phasing out of rural post offices.


Eric William Kierans: I think we discussed this matter at considerable length during the passage of the post office bill. There are approximately 2,500 post offices from which the revenue is less than $445 a year. We are comparing this with the cost of operating those offices, and we are making a number of decisions about closing them. But I think the basic consideration is the economics of the situation.


William Arnold Peters: Is it the intention of the department to use criteria additional to the one the hon. gentleman has mentioned, and would he be prepared to provide details to members who are keenly concerned about the future of rural post offices?
November 6, 1968	COMMONS


Eric William Kierans: I would be prepared to do so. There are no political considerations in mind, if that is what the hon. member is suggesting.


William Arnold Peters: On a question of privilege, I did not suggest there were political considerations involved. I said there were perhaps other considerations, such as the population in the rural areas concerned. We would like to have this material.




[Stage Direction]
On the orders of the day:
Mr. James A. McGrath (St. John's East):: May I direct this question to the Prime Minister. Can he tell the house whether in the interests of good neighbourly relations he has sent a telegram of congratulations to the new President-elect?


Right Hon.   P.-E. Trudeau@Prime Minister: Yes, Mr. Speaker, I did send a telegram. It said: "Warmest congratulations and good wishes on your electoral success yesterday." That is the beginning of the telegram.


An hon. Member:: To whom was it sent?


Pierre Elliott Trudeau: I believe it was sent to-


An hon. Member:: A fellow by the name of Nixon?


Pierre Elliott Trudeau: I can tell the hon. member that the electronic devices of the CBC have been working well. It was sent to Presidentelect Nixon.
The message went on to suggest that there be warm co-operation between our two governments, and that the objectives and aspirations which Canadians share with our friends and neighbours in the United States would be pursued by our government.


Some hon. Members:: Hear, hear.



BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE

Mr. Stanley Knowles (Winnipeg North Centre):: Mr. Speaker, I rise on a point of order, or at least on a question of order, and I should like to direct my remarks to the President of the Privy Council.
[DOT] (3:50 p.m.)
Before I do so, however, perhaps I might be permitted to echo the sentiments expressed the other day by the hon. member for 29180-158
DEBATES	2489
The Address-Mr. Stanfield Oxford, and extend the best wishes of the house to the Minister of National Revenue on the occasion of the surgery he is to undergo tomorrow.


Some hon. Members:: Hear, hear.


Stanley Howard Knowles: My
question to the President of the Privy Council relates to the hour between five and six o'clock today. In view of the fact that there are so many members anxious to speak in the budget debate could we have unanimous consent to waive that as private members hour, not losing the Wednesday, so that we can get in a couple more speeches on the budget?


Donald Stovel Macdonald: Mr. Speaker, I would be quite agreeable to that, subject to the usual reservations with respect to the rights of private members. Perhaps we could make that an order of the house now.


Mr. Speaker:: Is it agreed that this be made an order of the house?


Some hon. Members:: Agreed.


Joseph Julien Jean-Pierre Côté: Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank the hon. member for his good wishes, and I would just like to say that the operation will not take place tomorrow. I am going into hospital tomorrow and the operation will be next week.


David Lewis: Good luck anyway.