azza1625/createdebate-arguments huggingface dataset:
Debate: Marines Urinating on Taliban
Side: Funny.

Feeble response. Numbers are things that we perceive. But numbers are not art. Now, I am not saying that it cannot be made into art, what I am saying that numbers themselves are not art.I actually agree with on some levels. Well, the first question that pops in my mind, are numbers created or discovered? Art by definition states: 1.The expression or application of human creative skill and imagination. (google definitions). If numbers are discovered: The visual representation of "6" is considered to be art. However, the natural definition of six is not art. If numbers are created, then yes, numbers are art because they are the expression of human creative skill. Your question is still illogical. All you are trying to do is to extrapolate beyond necessity.Still, we can't prove that what makes sense to our brain is the actual truth of this world and universe.
Debate: Marines Urinating on Taliban
Side: Horrible.

Well, the first question that pops in my mind, are numbers created or discovered?That is irrelevant. What I have proven is that physics doesn't answer all of life's questions.Still, we can't prove that what makes sense to our brain is the actual truth of this world and universe.What you are asking is equivalent of asking "what, on Earth, is north of the North Pole?" The question makes no sense and therefore I am not obliged to answer it.
Debate: Marines Urinating on Taliban
Side: Funny.

That is irrelevant. What I have proven is that physics doesn't answer all of life's questions.Wait, what? We are on another topic of discussion. You said that numbers aren't art. That is why i went i wrote "Well, the first question that pops in my mind, are numbers created or discoverd?"You are right. Physics doesn't answer all of life's questions. What, on Earth is north of the North Pole?"A direction.
Debate: Marines Urinating on Taliban
Side: Horrible.

It doesn't matter that they were as you say 'empty shells'. They relieved themselves onto the bodies of people who thought they were doing a justifiable cause. It is the act that is disgusting. Putting waste on someone else just because you do not agree with their beliefs is a shameful act. Even when the Taliban have killed numerous American soliders does not mean you have to degrade what is left of them.
Debate: Marines Urinating on Taliban
Side: Funny.

I agree with you as well Liber. Outside the human morality, this is acceptable. In one sense, there is no difference between uriniating on the ground and urinating on the dead body. Those who dispute your argument are those who speak with their morality. I believe that it is morality that tells us that it is wrong. Surely, your nerves must be hit if you find someone urinating on your love one. That is morality, love, and respect speaking. I could be wrong.
Debate: Marines Urinating on Taliban
Side: Horrible.

Regardless of whether you personally find it right or wrong, the friends and family of the dead do and will find it wrong and offensive. This fact alone is insignificant, but understand that causing unnecessary resentment may lead to retaliation and death of yet more people. "Winning hearts and Minds" isn't just some BS propaganda slogan, it's a matter of safety and making sure we aren't fighting the same people 10 years from now.
Debate: Marines Urinating on Taliban
Side: wrong

so why do all cultures respect dead bodies?Why do all cultures have some sort of rite for dead bodies, from cremating to burrial, to prayers, to speeches.Whether it's in the USA or Africa, Europe or Asia, there's a good reason why when someone dies, the body is treated with respect.An empty shell? Tell that to the whole world.
Debate: Marines Urinating on Taliban
Side: Funny.

I am afraid that my knowledge of ethnology and social customs in that it pertains to death and the remaining body is limited, and I cannot think offhand of any culture which disrespects the corpse; still, I would not say that all cultures respect the corpse, for there are many cultures and many different systems of belief.An empty shell? Tell that to the whole world.Considering that I announced my belief on a public, online website, I believe that I did "tell it to the world" just about as well as I possibly could.
Debate: Marines Urinating on Taliban
Side: Horrible.

---I cannot think offhand of any culture which disrespects the corpseNeither can I. I'm guessing you're from the USA, have you ever been to a funeral, better yet, have you ever been to the funeral of a soldier? Why all the trouble, if it's just an "empty shell"? ---Considering that I announced my belief on a public, online website, I believe that I did "tell it to the world" just about as well as I possibly could.That was rhetorical :pWhat I meant is go to a funeral in your town or city or village, and tell the people paying their respects to whoever is deceased that "it's just an empty shell". Furthermore, I dare you to piss on the corpse of anyone getting buried at that funeral.What would happen? Why? What do you think?
Debate: Marines Urinating on Taliban
Side: Funny.

Why all the trouble, if it's just an "empty shell"?Because our society tells us that such is the proper method for dealing with the human body.Furthermore, I dare you to piss on the corpse of anyone getting buried at that funeral.I am quite certain that, in this country, such an act is illegal. Despite agreeing with few of the laws of this "great and free" land, I have never knowingly broken one.What would happen?People would be angered. I am not entirely saying that they shouldn't be angered, for they have been raised in a society where this practice is highly shunned; if they (the people appalled by the urinating act) actually thought about what was going on, they may very well come to the same conclusion as me: that the corpse doesn't matter.
Debate: Marines Urinating on Taliban
Side: Horrible.

---Because our society tells us that such is the proper method for dealing with the human body.All right, if you wana go down that road.Our society (including military code, historically) tells us to respect others, including enemies, including dead enemies.So why no respect in this case?--I am quite certain that, in this country, such an act is illegal. Despite agreeing with few of the laws of this "great and free" land, I have never knowingly broken one.So how do you justify doing such an illegal act in someone else's country?----People would be angered.exactly--- I am not entirely saying that they shouldn't be angered, for they have been raised in a society where this practice is highly shunned; if they (the people appalled by the urinating act) actually thought about what was going on, they may very well come to the same conclusion as me: that the corpse doesn't matter.Can you demonstrate that?
Debate: Marines Urinating on Taliban
Side: Funny.

including military codeMilitary code is not based upon some transcendent thought, but upon the same societally/religiously-induced morality which tells you that urinating on a corpse is bad.including enemies, including dead enemies.Too bad Chinese society doesn't tell them that. Just click the link and run a search for "urine" (ctrl+f, in case you didn't know).So how do you justify doing such an illegal act in someone else's country?Kinder Surprises are legal in Canada. They are hollow chocolate eggs with a toy inside, which violate an American restriction on placing choking hazards inside of foodstuffs. If I go to Canada, I can buy as many as I want. I can eat them, play with them - just about anything I want. But if I try to bring an uneaten Kinder Surprise to the States, I can be stopped and fined. Am I breaking the law if I commit a legal act in another country, despite that act being illegal in my own?I am now aware of the legal status of urinating on a corpse, and if the laws under which the perpetrators were governed at the time when they committed the act requires it, they should be prosecuted. What I mean to do here is not insist that the law be ignored, but rather reevaluated.Can you demonstrate that?I did in my first argument.
Debate: Marines Urinating on Taliban
Side: Horrible.

----Military code is not based upon some transcendent thought, but upon the same societally/religiously-induced morality which tells you that urinating on a corpse is bad.Then why in all societies, all religiously induced morality related cultures, or not, from 2000 years ago to today, from Scottish tribesmen to Japanese Samurai do we find that code of honour? Not that it is necessarily based upon "some transcendent thought". That's not what I said or meant. ---Too bad Chinese society doesn't tell them that. Just click the link and run a search for "urine" (ctrl+f, in case you didn't know).I'll ignore that.----Am I breaking the law if I commit a legal act in another country, despite that act being illegal in my own?You're assuming that it's "legal" to desecrate dead human beings in Afghanistan.---I did in my first argument.Where? I've contested every single one of your points.Except the "let's point figures at the Chinese" one, for obvious reasons.
Debate: Marines Urinating on Taliban
Side: Funny.

Then why in all societies, all religiously induced morality related cultures, or not, from 2000 years ago to today, from Scottish tribesmen to Japanese Samurai do we find that code of honour?What code of honor are you talking about?That's not what I said or meant.It's what you implied. Why else would "military code" matter to your argument? I'll ignore that.I don't see why. It was showing that some cultures use urine in torture, countering your statement that all societies "respect enemies".You're assuming that it's "legal" to desecrate dead human beings in Afghanistan.I did not assume that, and I even said as much. If they committed a crime they ought to be prosecuted. As I said before, I am not trying to convince anybody about the legality of their actions, rather on its moral implications.Where? I've contested every single one of your points.And I have successfully counter argued each of your points.Except the "let's point figures at the Chinese" one, for obvious reasons.Not obvious to me. Do you deny that the Chinese are a culture?
Debate: Marines Urinating on Taliban
Side: Horrible.

----What code of honor are you talking about?Respecting the enemy, and in particular, a dead human being. (i.e. not videoing yourself, in fact, including without video and photos, pissing on a dead human being)---It's what you implied. Why else would "military code" matter to your argument?I implied transcendence? tran·scen·dent (trn-sndnt)adj.1. Surpassing others; preeminent or supreme.2. Lying beyond the ordinary range of perception: "fails to achieve a transcendent significance in suffering and squalor" (National Review).3. Philosophya. Transcending the Aristotelian categories.b. In Kant's theory of knowledge, being beyond the limits of experience and hence unknowable.4. Being above and independent of the material universe. Used of the Deity.No, I did not.---I don't see why. It was showing that some cultures use urine in torture, countering your statement that all societies "respect enemies".Torture a) is a specific situation within war b) does not concern a dead human being and is therefore off topic. c) anyone can pick one example of anything, it's easy. Example : http://youtu.be/6l5R_wELf8E The scandal about the Israelian soldier posing with prisoners. "A former Israeli soldier has posted photos on the internet of herself posing beside bound and blindfolded Palestinian prisoners. She entitled the facebook page as, "the best days of my life". "Regardless, Chinese society and culture is one of the cultures that respects enemies and "warriors" the most. If you're not Chinese, or don't live in China, you could yourself look up famous Chinese authors and thinkers, from the attitude of martial artists (warriors) such as Ip Man to thinkers such as Confucius.---If they committed a crime they ought to be prosecuted. As I said before, I am not trying to convince anybody about the legality of their actions, rather on its moral implications.What do you think laws are based on if not morals in the first place?And why did you bring this up in the first place then, while indenting "this" :----I am quite certain that, in this country, such an act is illegal.----And I have successfully counter argued each of your points.oO You want a run down of the conversation?Great thing about this (as opposed to an oral discussion) is that we can go back and check ;)---Not obvious to me. Do you deny that the Chinese are a culture?I deny that the Chinese culture (as you stated) is one that does not respect fundamental ethical codes that are common to most if not all cultures present and past.I'd also point out that you're grasping for sophistic arguments.
Debate: Marines Urinating on Taliban
Side: Horrible.

So would you not have anything against a Taliban urinating on a dead American hero? What if it was the dead body of the President? They're not JUST empty shells.
Debate: Marines Urinating on Taliban
Side: Funny.

So would you not have anything against a Taliban urinating on a dead American hero?No.What if it was the dead body of the President?What would that matter? A dead body is a dead body, no matter the position in life.They're not JUST empty shells.Your point?
Debate: Marines Urinating on Taliban
Side: Horrible.

What would that matter? A dead body is a dead body, no matter the position in life.Hm. Interesting point of view. I still think it's wrong to piss on a dead body. Even if it wasn't wrong, it'd be weird right..?
Debate: Marines Urinating on Taliban
Side: Funny.

Again, disregard the Funny/Horrible tags. I wrote the Customer Service rep to discuss this and changes are being made. The choice of only 2 items are inflammatory. Although that often is a catalyst in passionate debate.I asked that people keep their positions, premises and arguments objective so that their would be a benefit to the argument rather than party mantras. I hope that the responders who ignored this request will refrain from that in future debates, otherwise, you encourage trolls.There is no point in debate if the other side sees no value in learning or looking from another perspective or have overlooked a relevant point. Otherwise, you're only talking at a blank wall.I thought the argument about pissing on someone's mother was valid. Although, without morality (like another person stated), the action itself is merely functional. As someone stated, they could have been pissing on a rock although, clearly, that wasn't their intention.Morality is completely subjective. If I were an atheist then I would make up my own rules where mostly I would only refrain from wrongful acts (as defined by social norms, society and mores) if I would get caught or the results wouldn't be worth the act. Excluding acts that EVERYONE considers reprehensible - like eating babies or spilling beer. That's just me though. My intention is not to make a blanket statement about atheists. My best friend is an atheist and I would give him a kidney if he needed one.Regardless of your position on their actions and our presence in a foreign country engaged in combat, I think it's reasonable to say that their action back fired.I've enjoyed debates where I was asked to argue on behalf of the opposition. You end up learning things you might not have otherwise. As an analogy, the best cop was a criminal never caught. The best criminal is a cop. The best defense attorney is one that was a prosecutor and the best prosecutor is one who was a defense attorney; you learn the weakness of the other by being in their shoes.I placed my life on the line for the rights of my opposition to argue freely. I fought for the rights of people who have lived under tyranny, torture, and constant fear of death to have the opportunity to live freely.For those who have never served in combat - and again, I ask you to walk a mile in someone else's shoes - you cannot understand what it's like to be a Soldier/Marine/Sailor/Airman or a victim.Thanks to everyone and next time you enter into an argument, be respectful. You'll never win or progress by attacking someone's character or not offering them a valid non-inflammatory or unoriginal response/premise to consider.
Debate: Marines Urinating on Taliban
Side: Funny.

the taliban are horrible people and deserve this punishment. I see no reason why not to do something like this
Debate: Marines Urinating on Taliban
Side: Funny.

i would not use the word funny, id say give them a round of applause and give the marines a medal, . or perhaps the bodies were on fire, and they wanted to put it out, to stop the fire spreading.
Debate: Marines Urinating on Taliban
Side: Stupid

Well, if the choices are funny or horrible, I guess this side.Stupid is a better description though. We know Taliban is insane. We know we have to win the hearts and minds of not-insane people in Afghanistan. Why give Taliban ammunition to recruit?Unfortunately those marines need to be discharged quickly, and probably dishonorably. Which is too bad because they may very well have been good soldiers.If you absolutely have to pee on a dead body, for god's sake make sure no one is recording.
Debate: Marines Urinating on Taliban
Side: Horrible.

"We know Taliban is insane."Really, how do you that? From the world class journalism the US mainstream media provides?"We know we have to win the hearts and minds of not-insane people in Afghanistan."Yes, you have to try to make them happy and contented with their servitude, and US puppet regime."Why give Taliban ammunition to recruit?"I don't think it takes a genius to realise this was far from an isolated incident. This kind of behaviour is institutional in the US army, of that I have very little doubt.
Debate: Marines Urinating on Taliban
Side: Stupid

Really, how do you that? From the world class journalism the US mainstream media provides?View above answer. I do know they are insane. It is also a horrible political system and no country should allow them power within their borders.Yes, you have to try to make them happy and contented with their servitude, and US puppet regime.No, you have to have some compassion for a people under the thumb of one horrid government after another. Perhaps you believe shitting in holes in the ground and wiping with your hand and women treated like slaves is preferable to being a U.S. ally, but at least give them the option asshole.I don't think it takes a genius to realize this was far from an isolated incident. This kind of behaviour is institutional in the US army, of that I have very little doubt.So I need proof a documented political group who has actually been in power in countries is insane. But you see one video of soldiers peeing on a corpse and now they all do it? Gotcha ._.
Debate: Marines Urinating on Taliban
Side: Horrible.

"It is also a horrible political system and no country should allow them power within their borders." So you have the moral right to remove them?"No, you have to have some compassion for a people under the thumb of one horrid government after another."Wow, you think your countries actions overseas are do to with compassion for the people suffering under dictatiorial regimes, are you kidding me? Your country is responsible for keeping most of those regimes going."Perhaps you believe shitting in holes in the ground and wiping with your hand and women treated like slaves is preferable to being a U.S. ally, but at least give them the option asshole."Oh right, you're just giving them the option, how foolish of me, you're just giving them the option to have their country invaded. Here's a statement from RAWA (Revolutionary Association of the Women of Afghanistan) Afghanistan's oldest political and humanitarian organisation just about the time the war was starting: "“Taliban should be overthrown by the uprising of Afghan nation.” It continued as follows: “Again, due to the treason of fundamentalist hangmen, our people have been caught in the claws of the monster of a vast war and destruction. America, by forming an international coalition against Osama and his Taliban-collaborators and in retaliation for the 11th September terrorist attacks, has launched a vast aggression on our country... what we have witnessed for the past seven days leaves no doubt that this invasion will shed the blood of numerous women, men, children, young and old of our country.”"So I need proof a documented political group who has actually been in power in countries is insane."I never denied they were insane,I just doubt your knowledge of the Taliban doesn't extend past a few CNN specials, what I find amazing is how you view your military compared to them, this is despite the fact that proportionallly your military is responsible for more death and destruction than the Taliban, or any so called "terrorist" group could ever dream of."But you see one video of soldiers peeing on a corpse and now they all do it?"No, I see a morally bankrupt military force that has somehow convinced itself it is the opposite of what it actually is.
Debate: Marines Urinating on Taliban
Side: Horrible.

That's a really good argument, which I have respect for, I could into the reasons why I disagree with a lot of it, but I think I'll try and wrap it up with just a few parting comments."so I'm against regime change unless it is in the role of supporting a people's uprising; similar to what we did in Libya"While I didn't shed any tears for Gaddafi I certainly didn't support what went on, and I don't think the country is better off, although I am hopeful it may be in the future. Again though, if any good comes froms the Wests intervention in Libya, it will be conincidental, the actions of the west are never altruistic."Not most, but certainly some."More than you're aware of, ill bet."It is not as if the U.S. actively suppresses freedom though."Actually, thats precisely what it does. The US doesn't want a free middle east, never has."Mistakenly or correct it is usually from the position of the lesser of two evils."This again is simply not true, I'm not going to pretend that if another country had the power the US does it would act diffferently, because it wouldn't, but I can't stand this liberal opinion that US is well meaning, that it is just a gentle giant that sometimes messes things up, I can assure this isn't the case at all. The US is just like China or Russia, absolutely ruthless in pursuing its own aims and interests no matter what the cost in human lives, suffering, environmental destruction etc., it has however created a myth that it is force for good, this is only among its own population however, and many Europeans. Serious investigation will dispell this myth, I can assure you."Let's not pretend though that this is the U.S. on its own. Minus Iraq and a couple outliers, it is just as often France, England or some other super power requested that we aid in one of their pet causes"I'm sorry, you're absolutely right, most of the europeans powers are just as culpable a lot of the time."I mean, it's simple to ask the biggest kid in the room to beat up a bully, than blame the big kid for the bloodshed when you get called to the principal's office."This is a perfect example of the lie that so many americans beleive, its just not true. I wish it were."What would England do if they had the U.S. military for instance?"In previous centuries England occupied the position of power of the US, and they were certainly no better."would the Nazi's have taken the rest of Europe and eventually the world? Maybe, maybe not. What if the U.S. had said "okay, only Japan bombed us, why waste lives in Europe?" Let's not get carried away with how horrible the U.S. is."The US began its imperial expansion after the WW2, not that it wasn't an imperial power prior to WW2, but after WW2 nobody could compete with it, since world war 2 america has invadaded (overtly and covertly) and/or bombed a total of 66 countries.