azza1625/createdebate-arguments huggingface dataset:
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

http://encarta.msn.com/dictionary_/sentient.html 1. conscious: capable of feeling and perceptiona sentient being2. responding with feeling: capable of responding emotionally rather than intellectuallyhttp://www.aolsvc.merriam-webster.aol.com/dictionary/sentient 1 : responsive to or conscious of sense impressions 2 : aware3 : finely sensitive in perception or feelinghttp://www.aolsvc.merriam-webster.aol.com/dictionary/aware 1 archaic : watchful, wary2 : having or showing realization, perception, or knowledgeLet me put it this way, you are equating an extremely basic, rough, and extremely applicable definition of "sentience" with human "sentience". I don't hold that you are using sentience in its correct context, just abusing its various meanings. Words have specific, contextual definitions. Human sentience, which is our current context, is inapplicable in almost all animals without debate. Some come close to human sentience, but no case has shown "awareness" (the defining characteristic of sentience in human beings) definitively in any animal. If you are going to afford animals the same rights as humans, based on sentience, they need to have the same sentience as humans. If they have less sentience, they have less rights. And, in this context, we are talking about human sentience. Since no animal has human sentience, or awareness, they are afforded no rights and may be eaten at will. It is entirely irrelevant that you've found a definition of the word "sentience" that you can apply to animals you wish to protect. It is a "sentience" that is far removed from the context.Let me be more clear: we can keep quibbling from occurring by resting our definition of sentience on what humans have. If you accept that there are many definitions of sentience (which there are), in the context of this debate we are talking about human sentience and granting human rights to animals based on the level of human sentience they have. They have none, for they are not human or on the level of humans. They may have what you could call "animal sentience", but that is inferior to human sentience and therefor human morals are inapplicable. You'd have to develop a moral system based entirely on animal sentience, and decide whether that moral system is equal to humans. To do THAT, you need objective criteria. Technically speaking, animal sentience needs to create its own morals (just as human sentience did). Because animals cannot do that, and humans can, animals have no morals and actions from or towards them cannot be judged on a moral scale. Humans, who generate moral-making sentience, can be judged according to morality and may be forced to play by moral rules. However, moral rules only cover beings that have morals. Anything that does not fall under moral rules can have anything done to it. Like: Hammers, Squid, Planets, Atoms..etc. The only time morals can play a role is if a human-sentient being is affecting another human-sentient being. "Subjective sensations of good and bad are the foundation of any system of ethics."And my subjective sensations are different than yours. Which is what I was saying.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

"Where capacity_for_pain might be 1 for humans and .01 for cows and .000001 for shrimp."Okay, then cows get .o1 of the rights that humans enjoy. Please explain what that would entail. Or is there no correlation between sentience and rights? As long as it falls above o on a sentience scale a creature gets equal rights to humans? Sounds like the exact opposite of a utilitarian system. It's too inclusive to be useful, and it is to convoluted to work as a guide to moral behavior.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

There's no such thing as rights in the sense that you are using the term. We should simply do what we can to minimize suffering, both human and non-human.I don't see this system as convoluted at all. To put it more simply: Animal suffering matters, although it matters less than human suffering. Even if it were convoluted I don't think that would be relevant because it would simply be reflecting the complicated nature of reality.A good first step would be to stop breeding and slaughtering mammals and birds in factory farms. If you accept that animal suffering matters at all, factory farms are obviously a horrible thing.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

I don't believe that animal suffering matters, not in and of itself. Unless you have an objective reason why it should, it is just a matter of personality and personal philosophy.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

Suffering in mammals and birds matters because they have brains which process pain. There is your objective reason. Do you not accept that pain is generally bad?Why does human suffering matter, in your opinion?
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

I study animal communication, and I see sentience. I work with a mini-herd of horses- and I can understand their body language as I can speak english. It is wrong to presume they are stupid because they do not speak our language and do not look like us- that's the same morals that founded the slave trade.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

How do you know, vegetables and other plants respond to sound (music and conversation). The respond to touch (patience plant), they trap and eat prey (venus fly trap). They are aware of light and warmth. Because you cannot communicate with them does not mean they do not communicate with each other.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

How do you know? Have you ever tried to talk to a plant? Maybe they are suffering in silence when you rip them from their roots and throw them in a basket like holocaust victims thrown into pits.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

Your kidding me right? That is the dumbest argument I have heard all year(though maybe I should just read more of your posts). If you are so worried about pain, spare me the pain of reading something that stupid.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

But when you look at it, plants don't scream out in pain like how animals do. They just die without screaming out in pain. So technically it's not murder. And I don't think that we humans hurt the plants or torture them before we eat them.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

Are screaming and pain your definitions of murder? If someone gives an overdose of heroin, the recipient dies without pain, but it is of course still murder.Also, we don't torture our animals before we kill them. In fact, most animals killed for human consumption die quickly, which is more than happens in nature most of the time.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

Bears eat moose and people so that means we need to turn bears into vegetarians aswell as any other carnivore.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

Bears do not factory farm moose, and actually very rarely kill a moose- only eating unnatended young as an adult is fully capable of making micemeat of said bear.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

Incorrect. First of all, bears are naturally omnivores. Humans are naturally herbivores. Theyre bodies could not function normally without meat, while ours can. It's not their choice to become vegan, its our choice since we have millions of options while they don't.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

We are naturally omnivores, not herbivores. Look at your teeth sometime. See those pointy ones? Those are meant for tearing MEAT.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

I do think we eat more meat then we should but these last years have found us eating healthier foods in general. With the addition of poultry and fish added to our diets I think we've come a long way from the meat and potato meals many of us grew up with and even our snacks are healthier than ever. I don't think meat equals murder in any way since most meats are raised for human consumption and the supply is never depleted because of this. Meat, in adequate and reasonable amounts, balances our diet and it's not that we couldn't all be vegan's or vegetarians but why not eat the meat that is given to us via the age old system of supply and demand when being either of those doesn't appeal to our personal tastes.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

I'm for eating meat, I'm for drinking liquid meat [milk].
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

war is murder! all you vegetarians are an outrage! so you do not eat meat, hurray for you! I do not care what you eat to stay alive, after all everyone, including you, consumes the dead to stay alive! think about that for a minute. you eat how you want as will I. you don't need to throw a parade, I could care less, and so should you. worry about something important in life will ya? after all, if it weren't for a high protein meat eating diet, you would still be a monkey!
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

If eating meat is Murder , then we should all starve to death , a Plant is a living thing also , if you eat a plant then it is murder also.. Kind of dumb to think we should all eat man made crap to save a life of an animal and let nature takes it's course, when we are animals also and part of the food chain....
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

To factory farm and abuse, to render that what was once beautiful to a lifeless carcass. Nothing wrong with that idea?
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

Humans have been eating animals since the beginning of time. Meat is a very good source of protein. We could eat other things but meat is very accessible as well as good tasting. God gave us these animals for our survival, we need to respect the animals that we eat, in other words we should not kill more than we can eat.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

Just because we've been doing it for a long time doesn't make it right. This is basically just saying, "it's natural," like everybody else on this side of the debate.Protein powder is better than meat. It's cheaper, has no fat, and is designed to be more easily absorbed by your body. And it doesn't require the killing of animals.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

We should kill more than we can eat, but we shouldn't be stuffing it in our mouths either.Animals were here before us. They weren't "given" to us.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

Religions out of the equation, meat tastes horrible. It reeks of death and the residuals... I hated that my mother made me eat meat until I was fifteen, I still feel sick at the memory.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

I think Donnie Darko can rap this up a bit. It's pointless to care about the death of an animal. Yes, when torture of an animal occurs it's wrong because it's prolonged pain of a living creature. But just to kill it (for food, vanity or sport) is part of what makes us human. We dominate.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

It's pointless, eh? So, have you actually never had a pet? And if so, when it died, you didn't care? How sweet.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

it's not like we don't care, but really. What point can you find? Animals are irrational, imbecile creatures that only know 4 things:Mate Feed Kill Repeat. The simplicity of their life style invokes that death does not matter.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

random down vote from someone who can't prove me wrong... how sad.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

I've seen all of the following attributes in animalsHateLove FriendshipFearExcitementCareLogicHumourAngerDistasteProtectivenessAnd more...
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

If you're against torturing animals, then you should be against the meat industry. Cows are hung upside down with their throats slit, left to bleed to death. Chickens have their beaks removed without anesthesia because they live in such cramped quarters that otherwise, they would attack each other. Veal calves are forced to live their short lives in stalls that aren't big enough for them to move, stand comfortably, lie down comfortably. Pigs are often killed by having their skulls smashed with blunt objects, a process that due to the lack of caring and knowledge of the slaughterhouse staff, often takes a long time. Lobsters are boiled alive. Did I cover enough of the meat industry to make clear the torture involved? Should I go on?
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

I eat meat, there's nothing wrong with it. I won't judge people who don't but there's wrong with it.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

Get real !Get human! Eat a burger! Have you ever notice a humans brain function level who deprives their body of meat? it's like talking to a wet noodle. not to mention, without meat the brain funtion is also to passive for the ever natural aggressive nature of human kind! so you need to fight or flight, and without energy you can't do much of either one. by the way I love animals as much or more as the next!
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

I am an IB student, and love debating- wet noodle? I don't think so. Almost my entire IB German class is some kind of vegetarian, and they are all amazing and interesting people. Learn what you're talking about-really.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

Wet noodle...interesting. Well, my brain hasn't had meat in 13 years, so here's the wet noodle talking back. I believe what you mean is that the iron and protein, as well as other nutrients, are key for optimal functioning, so it should be noted that any nutrients found in meat can be found in other sources as well. As for fight vs. flight, and your supposed lack of energy, I'd like to add in the concept of fitness and overall health. Vegetarians typically have lower cholesterol due to the lack of meat in their diet, so while fighting or fleeing, we'll keep going while you're keeled over from a heart attack.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

Murder is defined as an illegal activity. Eating meat in not illegal (well, except maybe cannibalism).Obtaining meat does involve killing.But so does eating vegetation and fungi. Using antibiotics involves killing.Every time you clean something you are killing countless microorganisms. Life cannot be supported without killing.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

I am not a vegetarian, so no, I disagree meat is not murder because why would it be so easily accessible and fulfilling as food as it is to people, if it was?
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

If meat is murder, then what does that make me for going to Wendie's and ordering the Baconator!? (;
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

A Porkypooper?''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meathttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder...nope. Meat is food. Get used to it.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

Meat is food. That is true. Some people do not understand that. And they are hypocrites and obnoxious boobs for trying to stop others from enjoying their food, and then they turn around and enjoy a guilty pleasure. Like chicken nuggets.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

It's disgusting! It's dead bodies! Wake up, people!.......................................................................
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

If we didn't eat meat, there would be way too many animals. How is it that we eat so much meat, yet none of the animals have population problems. Imagine the world if we couldnt kill animals for meat. And since you dont want to eat meat, then i guess you are against hunting. So without any hunting, imagine the world if animals couldnt be killed.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

Well actually most meat people eat comes from animals raised for the sole purpose of consumption (cows, chickens, pigs, etc...). If people stopped eating meat, then there would be no reason for farmers to raise this livestock, and therefore would not exist at all. In this way, people eating less meat would mean less animals.Where you are correct is with animals like deer, or other wild animals. Because most of the local predators for these animals have reduced populations, or in some cases are completely wiped out, there numbers probably would increase. When you factor in the amount of domesticated animals, however, there would more than likely be an overall decrease.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

Is meat murder? We dont call the lion who ate the lamb a murderer. And I wouldn't call myself a MURDERER after eating the 500g texas Tbone I had for dinner tonight. MMMMMMMMMMMMMM . I consider this totally different to the unlawful killing of another human being. I think for breakfast I'll have myself a double helping of scrambled chook period. YYYUUUMMMMYY!!!
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

I feel sick... how can anyone possibly think that fried corpse is a delicacy? It's weird- completely horrible.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

Would you rather he ate it raw?! How can you possibly feel sick about something that is literally ingrained in nature?
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

As long as they kill th anomals with a shock masine and it doesn't hurt. If they hurt the animal it is NOT ok.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

As long as they kill th animals with a shock Mashine and it doesn't hurt. If they hurt the animal it is NOT OK.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: MY CAT IS DEAD AND I MISS HIM FFFFuuuuuu

No, meat is not murder. murder is murder. And meat is meat. And you can purchase both for the right price. But murder is immoral and wrong. But meat is not. But you will probably disagree.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

You can't say no to chicken nuggets.I already said this before in response to another argument, if you will call it that, really it was weak sauce, and weak sauce doesn't go well with anything really. But anyway I thought for the common good of the debate, I would include it separately so that if someone doesn't want to read all the debates, they can just scroll down and hit this one bam without having to click to see the argument. You know what I mean.You can't say no to chicken nuggets.Yes, they are loved the world over.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Not murder but environemtally unsound

Killing animals for food? Not necessarily murder. Hunter-gatherers took down the slow and injured of herds, as do natural predators, and no one calls that murder. However, factory farming is disgusting, cruel, and environmentally unsound. The "meat is murder" viewpoint is a luxury of modern farming, and those who do not have access to the resources we do need meat in their diet for protein; however, they kill and process it. I think that to eat meat, one should have to process it him/herself, and be very aware of where it came from and how it lived, as well as make up for the carbon cost of eating it.I must say that I do not do this myself, before anyone asks. And to some extent this is hypocrisy. Flay me for it, whatever.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

At which point does killing become murder? You can obviously take the lives of fungi, bacteria, and plants without causing an uproar. For animals it's a bit trickier. Insects are ok to kill because they're a nuisance. But other animals aren't? ---------------------------------------------------- I don't have any problem with using animals for food. My problem lies in the fact that they aren't respected prior to the time we kill and eat them. I'd much prefer it if animals were given a lot of roaming space, were killed humanely, etc. I want an animal used for meat to be given the most natural life we can possibly give within a farm setting.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

Meat is essential for proper balance of the food cycle.If we had stopped eating meat,I mean all of us.we would be disturbing our food cycle.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

We've already disturbed the food cycle too much- we're barely part of nature any more.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

There is a place for all of God's little creatures. Right next to the mash potatoes and gravy. Animals. It's what's for dinner. ;)
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

Meat is not murder. I do think that there has to be good conditions for animals on farms and for the majority of livestock they do it is so regulated and monitored that you would have to look hard to find unsuitable conditions in this day and age of big commercial farm.Everybody is different with there bio chemistry if i could only eat plants and not meat I would but my system is built around meat I would become anemic if I did not eat meat and only plants.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

Getting meat involves killing animals, but it doesn't constitute murder. Or at least it doesn't have to.I acknowledge the fact that many companies at present kill animals inhumanely in order to harvest meat from them, but this is not always the case, and so I'm not going to label all killings as inhumane. There are fast, painless or nearly painless ways of doing this and they have been practiced for many years by a number of people. Eating meat is also natural; the human body is omnivorous and able to eat both vegetation and meat, which means that there is a reason for the killing which (assuming it is done humanely) can justify it.I don't think there's anything wrong with eating meat, but I do believe they need to impose stricter regulations regarding the treatment of these animals. The fact is that many people enjoy meat, regardless of the opinions of many vegetarians, and the most anyone can hope to change in this industry is to slightly lower the amount of meat consumed and the treatment of the animals up to and including the slaughter.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

Immediately, it can be said that murder is a legal term applying to humans, and that it is not applicable to non-humans. To discuss the morality of killing animals, that is up to how you define your own morals. My personal opinion is that it is not wrong to kill animals, for sustenance or sport. It is also not wrong to kill plants, bacteria, et cetera. If you claim killing animals is immoral, then it follows that killing plants is also immoral, because in both cases you are ending an organisms life.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

Well, considering, humans are atop of the food chain, meat is hardly murder. It is food. Plants are alive just as much as animals. Is that murder? CASE CLOSED!!!
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

It's not only murder, it's mass murder. Opression, slaves, all on the same basis- we're more powerful than you, so we can kill/enslave you because there's nothing you can do about it.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

If eating cow or pig is murder, then is a cat eating a mouse murder or is a lion eating a zebra murder? No, it is the survival of the fittest, so with our brains and tools, humans sit uptop of the food chain.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

Lions do not factory farm zebras (for the x00th time), and that is the only way a lion can live- we have options.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

First, if lions could factory farm zebras, they would, but since they are a primitive animal, they only survive on present consumption.Second, we have options only because animals are factory farmed, if not, millions would starve if not billions. Then, humans would be forced into a primitive and agrarian economy, and this whole computer thing wouldn't exist because productivity would plummet due to no food supplies.Third, the consumption of meat is the reason why man has evolved into what he is now with our brains, in which we created tools, before our brains developed, humans were strictly gathers.