azza1625/createdebate-arguments huggingface dataset:
Debate: Elvis or Jackson , who's a better singer?
Side: jackson

MICHAEL JACKSON. He was not just the greatest entertainer but he was also the very first and true artist that busted racial barriers. More and more people now are coming to terms to the fact that Elvis was all about copying black music and things passed on for years about him were a MYTH. For example, that 1 billion sales claim has been believed by the mindless public but it was clearly a propaganda made 5 years after Elvis' death (in 1982, published in Washington Post where the manager of his catalogue was quoted as making the claim) but had no explanation nor facts behind it. And this rolled trough the years and the mindless public believed. Also, that claim of 2.5 billion viewers of Aloha from Hawaii satellite telecast was another bogus propaganda. It claims that 60% of the people in the Philippines watched it, but a good of friend of mine from there has facts to back up that during the 70's there was no way to find out the TV ratings back then. Michael Jackson is the greatest entertainer of all time - far none.
Debate: Elvis or Jackson , who's a better singer?
Side: jackson

MJ. Music videos would not be used as a promotional tool without him. MTV would've died a long time ago. BET would've died. There wouldn't even continue to be a Super Bowl halftime show without him. Best-selling album of all time, Thiller, and most iconic music video FOREVER. Moonwalk is the most iconic dance move of the past 30 years. Maybe even ever. White glove. White socks/blak shoes. Most iconic artist in this lifetime.
Debate: Elvis or Jackson , who's a better singer?
Side: jackson

I really don't understand how anyone can call Elvis Presley a genius. He was a good singer and a good entertainer but genius? I don't think so, because to me you have to write and compose your own songs to be called a genius and Elvis never did that. The people who wrote and composed those songs for Elvis. They were the real geniuses
Debate: Elvis or Jackson , who's a better singer?
Side: jackson

1 Michael obviously had better dance skills and overall was a better entertainer2 MJ albums averagely sold far better than Elvis's considering Michael had far less albums3 Michael Jackson wrote many of his own songs, unlike Elvis who wasn't really known for his songwriting skills4 Jackson revolutionised music videos after making of Thriller, and broke many racial barriers being the first black artist featured on MTV5 Michael Jackson was awarded Artist of the Century Award by AMA
Debate: Elvis or Jackson , who's a better singer?
Side: jackson

Elvis presley is a thing of the past while MJ's influence can be seen everywhere and in today's pop scene which makes him relevant and alive. Michael Jackson rocked the whole world. Michael Jacskon INNOVATED and elvis IMMITATED!
Debate: Elvis or Jackson , who's a better singer?
Side: jackson

Okay this it tough because I happen to be an Elvis Presley fan too...there are many differences between the two Kings. Elvis very rich generous kind know to give free Cadillacs to strangers etc. he did not go the humanitarian route, Michael did. Michael was the first celebrity to bring massive attention to the hungry globally. Michael appeals to age groups from 2 yrs. old to 80 years old, Elvis only age groups maybe 30 years old to 80 years old. Elvis didn't hit his mark until he was in his early twenties, Michael started singing and dancing by the time he was 5 or 6 years old hit the mark at age 10. Elvis Presley was more of a singer he moved his hips unbelievably, but he was no dancer. MICHAEL JACKSON WAS A SINGER AND A DANCER AND ENTERTAINER, also dabbled in a few movies, looks to me like MICHAEL could have been actor, director too if he wanted to be. Elvis was no actor, but he sing good in those musicals girls screaming movies. I believe correct me if I am wrong, but is the song Rockin Robin kind of rock in roll? Elvis did write some of his songs Love me Tender one of my personal favorites, here comes MICHAEL JACKSON wrote at least more than 60 songs, and i believe there are some few he did not write like Man in the Mirror. Elvis famous in the United States and Europe mainly, MICHAEL JACKSON famous GLOBALLY all over the world from U.S to RUSSIA all the way to SPAIN & AFRICA.. Elvis Presley's untimely passing really hurt I was in high school at the time, but the pain went away after about 3 months. MICHAEL JACKSON passing away more far worse still grieving terribly, the difference MICHAEL JACKSON was able to connect with his fans and the world like no other artist, when he went I felt like I lost a relative, didn't feel that with Elvis's passing..well if I keep going this will be way to long. I LOVE YOU ELVIS, BUT DON'T BE MAD PLEASE! MICHAEL JACKSON IS THE KING THE TRUE KING, MICHAEL JACKSON IS THE KING OF MUSIC!
Debate: Elvis or Jackson , who's a better singer?
Side: jackson

Are you kidding me? You guys are acting like toddlers!! Micheal is and will always be better. His career started when he was just a young child with Jackson 5! He had one of the most common known hits in history when he was just 8 or 9! ABC!!!! After got to be there and ben, he struck at us with Off the Wall. After he changed the world of music with that, he hit us with Thriller that made the world moonwalk. Later, he made the "bad" album with smooth criminal, man in the mirror, the way you make me feel, and bad. That album made his existence WELL known and had the world singing and dancing to all his amazing songs. Lastly, he finished off his long-lasting legacy with dangerous with Black or white, heal the world, and remember the time. By that point, Michael Jackson had completely filled the earth with his music and he was blowing up at an incredible rate. He was famous his whole life, and his death was tragic. His talent was supreme and will always live on. Therefore, elvis will never compare, his music started later and was nowhere near as good as Michael's. So shut up.
Debate: Elvis or Jackson , who's a better singer?
Side: jackson

To be honest how can you compare these 2 singers when they are two completely different singers, Michael Jackson was the King Of Pop and Elvis is the King of Rock but in my opinion I would say Michael Jackson because of the fact Michael Jackson wrote 85% of his own songs and Elvis did not right any, I think Michael had a much better singing voice and can hit high pitches that not even Elvis can hit as he was a low octave singer... They were both amazing singers in their own style.... Michael was a much better dancer than Elvis, Elvis could dance but sometimes it looked like Elvis was having a seizure whilst dancing and Elvis was better with instruments than Michael was but Michael did most of his instrumentals by beat boxing.... In my opinion i will have to say Michael Jackson was the better artist because of creativity and was willing to write most of his own songs unlike Elvis getting other people to write them for him....
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: yes

one of my opponents says krishna has followed some unfair means let me tell my friend he wants to teach people unfair means is always unfair and it must be avoided at any cost.....he also makes the point whether one will be ready to taste failure after hardwork..........what absurdity it is hard work will never take you to failure is he ready to follow unfair means in the exams to get good marks??????Krishna's words are very clear if you work hard you need not look for the fruit it will come itself....
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: yes

friend,i feel your speech is not in a correct mannerLord Krishna wanted to show that we must suppress the Evil no matter what ever the means be.well,consider your own situations-Do you work hard to get Knowledge or good marks or just because the hard work is the best way that can be used to achieve you end? means have no meaning without a perfect resultYou write the Exams and you will surely be very anxious about your marks.Then how can you say that you need not look for the fruit????You debate only to win dont you?
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: No

what i mean is different and it is realitymy goal is to win with a right path and a right way......................i debate only to win because what i say is reality......................................
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: yes

dear deepishm, ur comment to rebut my teammate is not meaningful-krishna did not teach any one what u said but he taught that according to the situation , u will have to shift ur preference. he wanted to show that evil must be supressed at anycost
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: no

then maybe my dear friend you should be called as the modern writer of the abridged bhagvad gita!........better reply with some evidences than just posting comments for points!
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: yes

i want to ask my one of my opponents who mentioned about scientists,he says scientists set their goals and work towards it did einstein set his goal,did newton set his goal first?????
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: yes

but that was an unexpected case and the mean would not have been so important if Newton had not put it to the goal, to the use and to the END. Thus, the importance of the mean is dependent on the end
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: no

and my dear friend where is the end without mean........if newton would have concluded on something without proving it through experiments!would his theory been written in our books..............
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: No

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Debate: end is more important than means
Side: No

setting goal doesn't mean to be explain relativity theroy for einstien, gravity for newton etc. the aim of the scientist is to invent something very useful to the mankind
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: No

mr.phoenix, I kindly request you not to leave meaningles messages in the debate
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: No

parents and teachers are nowadays only pressurising at sudents to get gud marks. if end is all that they are looking for, then why do we have invigilators inspecting us, checking our means during the exams?Rashmi
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: yes

the scope of education extends far beyond obtaining marks- its main aim is to acquireknowledge and use it in your day to fay life in a positive manner.if someone says you are fit for nothing in studies it does not mean the end of the world. we could be having any other talent and we use it to shine in our life life. so we ultimately aspire for success in life. (the End)
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: No

i think many of us know about emperor Asoka.he was behind the war of Kalinga. He wanted to achieve the end, i.e to extend his territory and conquer Kalinga and he did succeed. But what happened after the war? He realized that the end was not worth the means by which it was achieved. He repented for what he did and today, he is one of the most remembered kings in history of India. Even though he killed so many people during the war, he is remembered for his repentance after it as he learned that the "means" wasn't correct.Rashmi
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: yes

but this is not the only instance to be taken into consideration as neha had said, positive approach is important.the whole world is actually killing terrorists and not terrorism!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: No

do you know how the battles of the past were won successfully even before enterring the battlefield?it is the result of PLANNINGplanning leads to perfectionso i believe that planning is none other than the means used i suppose?i conclude that means are more important.
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: yes

princy,listen to me.if your plan in the battle flied fails, the planning is no longer regarded as a good one .but whether you win or not the end is constant it is always the best end. victory is always a good oneyour planning will come into the existence of the society only if it is able to get you to the end.so it is not important.moreover, you plan only to win. if you are planning for something, it shows that you are trying to achieve your end at any cost, because it is more important to win the battle and save your motherland rather than thinking that killing people is a sin. you should also think that if you don't kill them, they will kill you and your dependents.
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: Too many variables

Situations. Situations.There are way too many variables left out of these little sayings. Like what IS the end and what ARE the means? If killing someone would save the whole world, does it justify the end-is the end more important? Maybe. But what if you killed someone to save your baseball card collection... Then is the end more important than the means?As far as these concept goes, it's impossible to tag one thing as more important than the other because the means may have more impact than the end or vice versa.
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: No

You wrote it as I would have Warlin...right on! ```````````````````````````````````
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: No

Without Means it may be correct or incorrect the aim cannot be achieved. to reach to the end we need to start.
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: yes

actually, ankit joshi is wrong because though we need a starting but we work and use the means for a definite destination and that destination is the end. And I would like to remind one thing to you that it has been said that end is more important than the means but it has not been said that means is not important. Only the comparison has been made.
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: No

I believe the means are the most important factors of the journey to the end. People can do some pretty mean things in order to get to the end they wish to reach. Therefore the means are the most important steps you can take to reach a good end.
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: yes

I agrre that the means are important but I strongly disagree that they are most important because the journey about which you have told will start if we at first think about the end and without thinking of the aim, the destination, the goal; we cannot use the means
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: yes

my partner annop is absolutely correct.you start not because that you have the best resources and noblest means- but because you want to reach your aim.you may have you bike - but you start it not because that it is a good mean but because you want to reach your aim at first
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: yes

But my dear, remember that without thinking of the end, without making the damn end determined, you will not even be able to use the means. So my friend, tell me which is more important? the used means which has to be used to achieve the end or the end itself which we are suppose to start
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: yes

Even though he hardworks to reach his goal if it is not reached or is in bad path. There is no importsnce of means
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: No

If we take values, morals, ethics into account and count it more towards the spiritual way then means definetly becomes the most important factor. Its natural for everyone to look back at where they come from and want to show their struggles. This justifies the importance of means."True good is never achieved by the doing of evil"- Adolf Hitler is an EXAMPLE !!
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: yes

dear vaish; i had liked to say that your speech was correct; but i felt that you stepped into wrong perceptions and conclusions :the last of your speech is , of course not the correct saying-to prove my rebuttal, i will Base myself on your own example so that it will be easy for anyone to understand:You have mentioned about Adolf Hitler: An autocrat and the main person behind the mass killing of Jews ;but do you agree that his death is the True good for Jews?in that case, just think what means have been used by England, France and other countries to Force him to commit suicide? Do you think that war is a better mean?NO!!!!!!!!!Then how can u say that good is extractable only from good means????????????Sorry to hurt u r feelingsBye
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: No

No, results are not the only thing that matters. If we followed this maxim, then cheating your way through school, but graduating as valedictorian would be fine. The end is justified. The way you achieve something is as important as the end result. I think this saying was created in order to justify unjustifiable actions, as a way of ignoring ethical obligations and getting away with it. Unfortunately, it simply doesn't work.
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: yes

i cant understand how my worthy opponent fails to see the difference between the justification of the mean on the basis of the end obtained and the importance to the end.for eg. america used nuclear weapons to win the war. THE END IS ALWAYS GIVEN IMPORTANCE IN THE WAR LIKE THAT> NOT THE MEAN USED. BUT IT IS FAR FROM JUSTICICATION OF THE MISUSE OF NUCLEAR ENERGY.
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: No

The end, unlike the cheese, does not stand alone. It was the result of some previous action(s) taken. So the importance of the end cannot be considered alone. It is equally important to be moral in the means by which you achieve something as the end which you sought. If it were true that the end were more important than the means, then terrorism ought to be perfectly acceptable. Afterall, the end is what matters. The reason I brought up the justification argument is that the original quote by Machiavelli is "The end justifies the means", so I was really only bringing it up in order to dispute the saying itself.
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: yes

dear spoon,your argument is admirable. i vote your statements. it is true that there can be no journey with out a path or road. but........... i have never heard of a journey without an end. look, let me tall u something. You are arguing against the motion, that is Means are important than the End. But from your argument, it is crystal clear that you give 50-50 preference to end and means... meaning that you stand in the mid point and then again bend towards means!!!!!!!! first stay at a single point and then ......well means ultimately lead you to the end only. if there is someone to say that end is not important and then follow this rule in this fast moving generations, he/she is just going to make a chain of means without any end.....most of the members who are talking against the motion, do not follow it in their own life. so if they cant be true to themselves they have no right to preach it to others..the last line may hurt some people... but it is the truth
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: No

when we walk through in our life by taking means then only we will reach the end.such that means are important in life.
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: yes

But we will not talk about the means till we do not even think about the end. Suppose, you are climbing over the Mt. Everest but you would only talk about the used means in that, when you would make it definite that what your actual aim is and what do you actually want to achieve
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: yes

If we start , making a glass of lemon juice. If we forget to put lemon extract in that the end becomes waste, so is there anyone who asks what did you do or says its not nice. So do the ends.
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: No

Think of it like a movie. The end may be sensational but there are only a few movies where the end is sensational and, when it is, it is due to the special effects which is, of course, the means. So the means is more important ;)
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: yes

This is a very surprising point and I have a strong point against that: No movie finishes without an end and about the special effects by the means, actually, we cannot use them till we are moving towards the end. So, end has already made a pathway for the others to came and means are just the sources to follow that path and nothing else
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: yes

annop, as always , is right. also i find ist amaizing that my opponent dares to compare life with a movie!!!!!
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: No

i think end is not as much as important than means because if our means are not right than how our end or goal is pureif we lack in means , we are unable to achieve specific ends
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: yes

But you can even see the examples of those children who are not having great means but are still going well and are achieving those goals that a person having total means is not being able to achieve
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: No

In every war, every act of oppression, every instigation of genocide, every institution of slavery . . . have we not always argued that the ends would justify the atrocities of the means? And did they?.....Ends: Promoting democracyMeans: Vietnam War.....Ends: Increasing material resource trade to EuropeMeans: Apartheid.....Ends: Preparing a young person to be marriedMeans: Genital mutlilation.....Ends: Exploration of New WorldMeans: Genocide and forced relocations of Native peoples.....Ends: Healthy economy of southern statesMeans: Slavery.....I agree with Spooner - the saying "the ends justify the means" is all-too-often an excuse to disregard ethics, and to attempt to justify the unjustifiable by slapping a platitude on it.
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: No

The means is much much more important than the end. suppose you want to be the person with the top marks in class or college, what you need to do is study really hard... but instead the common practice is copying or peeking. if found out, this can lead to your failure in not only the exam, but also in life. you will become known as a rowdy. why not avoid all that and just rectify your means for reaching a desirable end? after all, you know the old saying... "prevention is much better than cure"
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: no

Practice makes man perfect, this saying holds true because the more we practice the most we remember, the best we write
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: yes

But i favor your argument but only those cheat who didn't studied well in the whole year.those who studied fixing a goal of good marks before them they have always succeeded.
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: yes

life is built on certain ethics,morals ,valuwes,divine justice.......have my opponents made up their mind to sacrifice this for the end.......
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: No

If your means undermine your end, then you haven't won at all. For instance, "fighting terror" to make the world a better place only made the world hate the United States, and it's not doing anyone any favors. If you achieve an end by tainted means, the end will be much more difficult to achieve in the long run.
Debate: end is more important than means
Side: No

I am shocked that the question of whether the end is more important than the means even came up?How can it be?it was discussed before about what Krishna said, but what is the point of defeating evil if we become evil in the process. Example: You are fighting a war for freedom but if you use the labour of slaves to win the war. You win your freedom at the cost of the freedom of others.