azza1625/createdebate-arguments huggingface dataset:
Debate: Abortion: What About a Man's Choice?
Side: a woman's right to choose

Just to refresh, a woman's body is not an incubator. Nor are we talking about a baby, or a child, for that matter. We are talking about a fetus. If a woman chooses not to wait for the fetus to develop in her womb, that is certainly her choice, and her choice alone. As Loudacris said, the man's choice comes in when he decides to have sex. If he doesn't want to run the risk of having to wonder whether or not abortion is fair for a man, he should remain celibate.
Debate: Abortion: What About a Man's Choice?
Side: Men Have A Say

fe·tus   /ˈfitəs/ Show Spelled[fee-tuhs] Show IPA –noun, plural -tus·es. Embryology . (used chiefly of viviparous mammals) the young of an animal in the womb or egg, esp. in the later stages of development when the body structures are in the recognizable form of its kind, in humans after the end of the second month of gestation.Fetus is used to refer to the child at a particular stage of his or her development. Calling the child - and it is a child - a fetus is a very poor attempt to sanitize the act. It'd be similar to saying, "We're not talking about a young man or woman, for that matter. We're talking about an adolescent." Please, explain what the child's level of development has to do with whether or not we can kill it.Also, suppose I agree that the child can be killed at the behest of the mother with absolutely no say-so from father. It seems to me that the child is, for all intents and purposes, the sole property of the mother. The family courts certainly seem to think so. I say that during the time it's legal for the woman to have an abortion, the father can pay the cost of an abortion and simply walk away. If the woman decides to abort, no problem. If she doesn't, well, the baby's hers. No child support, no nuthin. The woman has no excuse. You're probably gonna wanna say something about how the man has responsibilities to the child he brou- blah blah blah. Anyone who supports suctioning babies out of the womb no longer has the right to say "what about the baby". If the man doesn't wanna pay the price, no whining from him when the baby's born. Any objections?
Debate: Abortion: What About a Man's Choice?
Side: men have no say

"Fetus is used to refer to the child at a particular stage of his or her development. Calling the child - and it is a child - a fetus is a very poor attempt to sanitize the act."Calling a fetus a child is a very poor attempt at romanticising the act of pregnancy. It doesn't "sanitize the act" (whatever act it is to that you are referring)."Please, explain what the child's level of development has to do with whether or not we can kill it."The fetus is not a stand-alone organism biologically. It cannot maintain 2 of the 7 principles that are necessary to be a "living organism". It cannot maintain homeostasis or metabolism. Development has very much to do with it since it is biologically not "alive" until it is born; therefore, one cannot kill it if it were not alive. According to the Royal College of Obstetricians and Gynaecologists and the Journal of American Medicines Association both have concluded through research that while in utero, the fetus is in an "unconscious state"; therefore, it is not a sentient being."It seems to me that the child is, for all intents and purposes, the sole property of the mother."The uterus is the sole property of the woman and the fetus is inhabiting it. The child (which is the developmental stage AFTER birth) is a legal responsibility to both parents."The family courts certainly seem to think so."This is only AFTER birth as I stated above, it is a legal responsibility to both parents. If you are using a "child support" issue as your argument, it would be in your best interest to actually understand how that works as well - the Family Courts are only interested in the best interest of the child and it comes down to "status quo"."If the woman decides to abort, no problem. If she doesn't, well, the baby's hers. No child support, no nuthin."Again, you are sorely mistaken as to what "legal responsibility" means.
Debate: Abortion: What About a Man's Choice?
Side: Men Have No Say

Let's say the woman gets pregnant, but the man does not want to have the baby, at all. He doesn't want the baby to even exists. Is it right for him to say she MUST have an abortion? Absolutely not! So if he doesn't have a say in this situation, he shouldn't have a say in whether she wants or doesn't want a baby. It is in her for 9 months and it is her uterus in which the baby lives. The male is not physically affected by the baby, so he should have no doing--he should have an opinion, but should have no action.
Debate: Abortion: What About a Man's Choice?
Side: men have no say

The real reason that men should have no say is that until the child is born, it's a medical procedure and they have no right to tell anyone else what they can and can't have done medically. That's a matter for the patient and the doctor. Think about how a man would feel if he had, let's call it a tumor, growing inside him that may cause him some discomfort and annoyance but no serious health concerns. Say he wants his doctor to remove it. But his wife who has a say in his medical procedures due to her stake in his future (he will provide and provide for her future children) says no. Since it's not medically necessary and law allows her a say, he can't get it removed. Further, your supposing the men want to stop women from having an abortion. What about men forcing women to have abortions for babies they don't want to be responsible for. If they have any say at all, that is a real possibility.
Debate: Abortion: What About a Man's Choice?
Side: men have no say

A man's choice for what? It's a mass of differentiated cells within a woman's uterus. What choice does a man have concerning the medical procedure to remove it? At the time when the majority of abortions occur, this is not a "baby", "child", etc, it's an embryo that is not a stand-alone organism as many seem to suggest that the moment of conception this mass of cells is going to function as if it were a developed baby.If the man really wanted his child to be born, he should discuss this prior to having sex in the first place. After a man ejaculates, he has no other say in the matter, it is then a part of a woman's body.It's the "pro-life" rhetoric that causes any form of stress around abortion. It's the potential of a life that the man is stressing over, he should be aware that his sperm in each ejaculation is the potential of life too - shouldn't he be just as stressed when he masturbates and it has no chance for developing further as well?
Debate: Abortion: What About a Man's Choice?
Side: men have no say

The woman makes the final decision. It's HER body, not the man's, SHE gets to decide. He does not have to go through having a child in his body.
Debate: Abortion: What About a Man's Choice?
Side: men have no say

That is a personal decision. If it were made a law that men have a say in the woman's abortion, it would be taking away a LOT of her freedom. Say a woman is in an abusive relationship, and she gets impregnated by her husband. She's too afraid to leave her husband because she wont have any money or place to stay. She doesn't want to bring up a child in this lifestyle so she wants to get an abortion. But her husband wants to keep the child. They go to court, but since it's a LAW that the man has a say over the 'child' she has to have it. This is ridiculous. It may be your sperm, but it's the woman's body. It may be hard for you- even devastating- but pregnancy shouldn't be taken so lightly! If your girlfriend gets pregnant, you want to keep the child (for yourself, she doesn't), and she agrees: TADA! You now have a child for yourself, and the woman didn't have any of her rights violated. This cannot be made a law. It would have SO MANY downfalls. It would do more bad than good, and violate the right a woman has over her body.End of discussion.
Debate: Abortion: What About a Man's Choice?
Side: Men Have A Say

Wow. Really just wow. Men do have a saying it dosent matter if it's in her body it's still part HIS child. Let's say then the MAN dosent want the kid. Oh but the woman does and the guy has no saying in it so here comes the kid he never wanted. Ofcourse maybe they shouldn't of had sex but it dosent change the fact. Obviously women deserve a say in it 100% however they should both be allowed to talk about it and decide together hence MARRIGE- making choices TOGETHER
Debate: Abortion: What About a Man's Choice?
Side: men have no say

"Let's say then the MAN dosent want the kid."Then he still has no say until after birth. The fetus is part of the woman's body until birth, there's not much he can do. However, the issue here is a legal one, as the birth of the baby now gives it status as a "person" and legally the biological father would have a legal responsibility to the child. Any decision for the man to "opt out" of this would have to be taken through court before his responsibility is removed."Obviously women deserve a say in it 100% however they should both be allowed to talk about it and decide together hence MARRIGE- making choices TOGETHER"Men can discuss it with the woman, but ultimately the choice is the woman's - it's her body. As for "marriage", that's an option but not necessary. It still does not give the man the right to choose for a woman on any issue.
Debate: Abortion: What About a Man's Choice?
Side: Men Have No Say

Fuck yes! You so rock! :)
Debate: Abortion: What About a Man's Choice?
Side: Men Have A Say

I agree in principal, it should be a joint decision, but if the worst comes to the worst, the mother decides to have it, and the father decides its a definite no-no, then an agreement should be made where the mother takes ALL rights and responsibilities for the child and the father is able to walk away under NO financial, moral or emotional obligations.Too many women use children and pregnancy as a weapon. (and yes, I am a woman, a married woman who took on her husbands child and adopted two more because MY choice to have a child through pregnancy was taken away by another woman)
Debate: Abortion: What About a Man's Choice?
Side: Men Have No Say

Men do not have the right to force their will on women. Women have the right to choose what happens to their bodies.
Debate: Abortion: What About a Man's Choice?
Side: Men Have A Say

it's not just "their" bodies though is it?it's a biological entity that is 50% NOT a womans...
Debate: Abortion: What About a Man's Choice?
Side: Men Have No Say

Women still have the right to choose .
Debate: Abortion: What About a Man's Choice?
Side: Men Have No Say

Men do not have a say in what women do with their bodies. Men are not the ones who experience pregnancy, childbirth, and postpartnum shit. Unless and until they do, they do not have the right to say what a woman does with her body. My body, my right, my choice. Deal with it, you patriarchal sexist jerks.
Debate: Abortion: What About a Man's Choice?
Side: Men Have No Say

The woman's choice is what matters. The person carrying the baby has the right to choose, not anyone else.
Debate: Abortion: What About a Man's Choice?
Side: Men Have No Say

A man gives a deposit to a female that is a gift. He has no say about what a female should do with his gift.
Debate: Alabama outlaws abortion. No exceptions for rape or incest. PRISON if violated. Good Law?
Side: Good, if you sell coat hangers

I am prolife with exceptions. I think exceptions should be made for rape victims, because I was raped when I was 22. No one will ever change my mind on this. That  governor was never raped, and has no right to a rape victim's body. She is not a woman, but a glorified girl. Real men and women support a rape victim's right to choose. Anyone who disagrees can kiss my *.
Debate: Alabama outlaws abortion. No exceptions for rape or incest. PRISON if violated. Good Law?
Side: Good, if you sell coat hangers

Would you concede to the victim having to file a report of a crime?
Debate: Alabama outlaws abortion. No exceptions for rape or incest. PRISON if violated. Good Law?
Side: Good, if you sell coat hangers

Most definately. I believe in punishing rapists............................................................................................................
Debate: Alabama outlaws abortion. No exceptions for rape or incest. PRISON if violated. Good Law?
Side: Good, if you sell coat hangers

Of course. But this would require a victim make a report. If a woman wants an abortion and was not raped, she can always say she was to the doctor, and then get an abortion. But if she has to report it to the police, she is less likely to make a false claim for the sake of an abortion, as that would be a crime.
Debate: Alabama outlaws abortion. No exceptions for rape or incest. PRISON if violated. Good Law?
Side: Good, if you sell coat hangers

I was thinking about the "rape exception" the other day. I'd expect this to cause some pregnant women to file false police reports of rape in order to get an abortion.
Debate: Alabama outlaws abortion. No exceptions for rape or incest. PRISON if violated. Good Law?
Side: Good, if you sell coat hangers

I was thinking about the "rape exception" the other day. I'd expect this to cause some pregnant women to file false police reports of rape in order to get an abortionHello W:Isn't it a shame that if a women wants to CONTROL her own body, she has to LIE to the cops??excon
Debate: Alabama outlaws abortion. No exceptions for rape or incest. PRISON if violated. Good Law?
Side: Good, if you sell coat hangers

Well, yeah, when you want to murder someone not out of self defense, you'd best lie to the cops.Con, did you know that you can control your own body before getting pregnant?
Debate: Alabama outlaws abortion. No exceptions for rape or incest. PRISON if violated. Good Law?
Side: Good, if you sell coat hangers

While I am pro-abortion up to around 3-4months I don't agree that it's simply a matter of controlling her own body. The foetus is a life too and in fact it's experiences in the womb (e.g. auditory) shape it's preferences and behaviour (1).Sources:(1) https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2003/05/030513080440.htm
Debate: Alabama outlaws abortion. No exceptions for rape or incest. PRISON if violated. Good Law?
Side: Good, if you sell coat hangers

While I am pro-abortion up to around 3-4months I don't agree that it's simply a matter of controlling her own body. Hello again, W:Look.. To argue WHEN to abort because of a heart beat, or legs, when they feel pain, or whatever arbitrary mark you wanna make is all BULLSHIT..In the real world, life starts even BEFORE contraception if you think the sperm and the ova are ALIVE, and they absolutely ARE alive.. So, it's TRUE... Abortion at ANY time is taking a life. The REAL question WITHOUT all the fluff, is does a women have that right..excon
Debate: Alabama outlaws abortion. No exceptions for rape or incest. PRISON if violated. Good Law?
Side: Yes, if you wanna rule wombs

Abortion at ANY time is taking a life. The REAL question WITHOUT all the fluff, is does a women have that right..She has many rights.The right to not have sex.The right to use condoms.The right to use birth control.The right to murder someone? I don't think so Con. Consider it like a gun grab. We're protecting the kids without violating the 2nd Amendment. It's a win win.
Debate: Alabama outlaws abortion. No exceptions for rape or incest. PRISON if violated. Good Law?
Side: Good, if you sell coat hangers

There is no comparison between a sperm and a thinking, feeling 9 month foetus. My line in the sand is brain activity at 14 weeks and, given that pregnancy causes the cessation of menstruation, any regular woman will know they are pregnant before that point.Abortion at ANY time is taking a life. The REAL question WITHOUT all the fluff, is does a women have that right.Woah, wait, are you saying you support 9 month abortions? I don't see any difference in the value of the life of a 9 month baby inside or outside of the womb.
Debate: Alabama outlaws abortion. No exceptions for rape or incest. PRISON if violated. Good Law?
Side: Good, if you sell coat hangers

Woah, wait, are you saying you support 9 month abortions? I don't see any difference in the value of the life of a 9 month baby inside or outside of the womb.Hello again, W:I understand that YOU have your line. But, it's YOUR line.. It's NOT a real line.. It's NOT my line. It's NOT bronts line. In fact, it's ALL made up. I'm simply saying there IS no line, and lets STOP pretending there is.I think, when viewed in those STARK truths, the conversation changes..excon
Debate: Alabama outlaws abortion. No exceptions for rape or incest. PRISON if violated. Good Law?
Side: Good, if you sell coat hangers

Does the suffering of the foetus matter less than the suffering of a newborn? A 9 month old foetus is identical to a newborn and it's not acceptable to kill them under any circumstances, is it? Look, if you make me choose between no abortions and abortions up to birth I won't be on your side.
Debate: Alabama outlaws abortion. No exceptions for rape or incest. PRISON if violated. Good Law?
Side: Good, if you sell coat hangers

I won't be on your side.Hello again, W:Don't you think the argument I'm having with you, isn't one I've had with myself?? Well, it IS.. And, I remain CONFLICTED. So, in truth, I don't HAVE a side.Or, I do.. For MYSELF, I have a side. Should I FORCE my side on you?? I dunno.excon
Debate: Alabama outlaws abortion. No exceptions for rape or incest. PRISON if violated. Good Law?
Side: Good, if you sell coat hangers

Does the suffering of the foetus matter less than the suffering of a newborn? No I'm a Nihilist.
Debate: Alabama outlaws abortion. No exceptions for rape or incest. PRISON if violated. Good Law?
Side: Good, if you sell coat hangers

There is no comparison between a sperm and a thinking, feeling 9 month foetusI remember being a sperm.
Debate: Alabama outlaws abortion. No exceptions for rape or incest. PRISON if violated. Good Law?
Side: Good, if you sell coat hangers

Woah, wait, are you saying you support 9 month abortions? I don't see any difference in the value of the life of a 9 month baby inside or outside of the womb.They are different. The foetus doesn't cry in the womb.
Debate: Alabama outlaws abortion. No exceptions for rape or incest. PRISON if violated. Good Law?
Side: Good, if you sell coat hangers

If you agree that abortion is necessarily the taking of life, but that placing a "when" on the development is completely arbitrary, then why shouldn't a woman have the right to end her motherhood after the arbitrary point of "birth"?
Debate: Alabama outlaws abortion. No exceptions for rape or incest. PRISON if violated. Good Law?
Side: Yes, if you wanna rule wombs

I'd expect this to cause some pregnant women to file false police reports of rape in order to get an abortion2 things here.Thing 1If she says rape, she'll have to have someone to accuse, and/or physical proof. Thing 2If abortions go down 99%, but false rape claims go up .5%, that's a net win.
Debate: Alabama outlaws abortion. No exceptions for rape or incest. PRISON if violated. Good Law?
Side: Good, if you sell coat hangers

If she says rape, she'll have to have someone to accuseAren't false rape accusations a major problem at the moment?If abortions go down 99%, but false rape claims go up .5%, that's a net win.I think reducing abortions is great, particularly given the current blasé attitude towards it. It's frankly disgusting how some people view an 8 month old baby as "a bundle of cells". However I do think that if done sufficiently early it can be better than bringing a child into the world in some circumstances. 14 weeks is when their brain impulses start to fire (1) and so up until then I see abortion as far less egregious than after that point.Sources:(1) https://www.babycenter.com/fetal-development-week-by-week
Debate: Alabama outlaws abortion. No exceptions for rape or incest. PRISON if violated. Good Law?
Side: Good, if you sell coat hangers

If she says rape, she'll have to have someone to accuseAren't false rape accusations a major problem at the moment?Yes. That's why you create a law punishing provably false accusations.
Debate: Alabama outlaws abortion. No exceptions for rape or incest. PRISON if violated. Good Law?
Side: Good, if you sell coat hangers

It's pretty difficult to conclusively prove an allegation false. Moreover, the accused's life is usually ruined by the allegation; losing their job, partner, friends and so on.
Debate: Alabama outlaws abortion. No exceptions for rape or incest. PRISON if violated. Good Law?
Side: Good, if you sell coat hangers

Yes. If you are pro-life, then having a rape exception without the necessity of filing a report leaves a gaping loophole. Any woman can still have any abortion so long as she makes the claim. The requirement to file a report leaves the loophole, but puts some sense of skin in the game for lying. This would only be a consideration for those on the pro-life side.
Debate: Alabama outlaws abortion. No exceptions for rape or incest. PRISON if violated. Good Law?
Side: Good, if you sell coat hangers

Such a rule would lead to an increase in false rape reports. Aside from the great deal of harm inflicted on the falsely accused, it would make finding the real rapists more difficult.An abortion limit of 14 weeks, however, allows abortion when necessary while balancing against the suffering of the foetus. After all, the foetus doesn't have any brain activity until 14 weeks.
Debate: Alabama outlaws abortion. No exceptions for rape or incest. PRISON if violated. Good Law?
Side: Good, if you sell coat hangers

Such a rule would lead to an increase in false rape reportsThat’s likely. But false rape reports are illegal, which is why someone would hesitate before using that reason illegitimately for an abortion. It would be a problem for the falsely accused. Rape is pretty difficult to prove, especially if the report is false. The standard for guilt is “beyond a reasonable doubt”. Whether the report is true or false, if it regards an abortion, we have the DNA of the father. Finding them would not be too difficult.As for the 14 weeks, it is certainly preferable to later stages. But suffering is not the only consideration when determining to end a life. Indeed, in all other circumstances it is not a sufficient justification, all else being equal, even if it is a necessary consideration.
Debate: Alabama outlaws abortion. No exceptions for rape or incest. PRISON if violated. Good Law?
Side: Good, if you sell coat hangers

It would be a problem for the falsely accused. Rape is pretty difficult to prove, especially if the report is false. The standard for guilt is “beyond a reasonable doubt”.It's also exceptionally difficult to prove something conclusively false, and even in cases where things later are proven false the accused's life is still ruined in the meanwhile.Whether the report is true or false, if it regards an abortion, we have the DNA of the father. Finding them would not be too difficult.The sex could have been consensual, though.But suffering is not the only consideration when determining to end a life. Indeed, in all other circumstances it is not a sufficient justification, all else being equal, even if it is a necessary consideration.I agree, I simply don't believe that it's a good idea to create too many children that other people will have to care for, be that through adoption or welfare. Allowing abortion to some degree reduces the number of children that other people have to support. This means that we can look after those unwanted children who aren't aborted better because proportionally we have more adoptive parents and resources available. Note also that children raised in poverty and/or in single parent homes have far poorer outcomes later in life. For these reasons, I view abortion as a necessary evil. What are your thoughts on abortion?