azza1625/createdebate-arguments huggingface dataset:
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: No

If the legislature successfully passes an amendment as per the process outlined in the Constitution, then yes that amendment would become the new law. This is why passing an amendment is so hard to do.And the Constitution expressly authorizes taxation, so I don't think your argument makes sense.Nixon was wrong. If you'll recall, he was forced out of office.The courts have the power to invalidate unconstitutional laws. If the government took my property without cause, the judicial system would almost certainly restore it. You may disagree with a judge's opinion regarding what laws are constitutional, but it's not true that lawmakers violate the Constitution all the time. You're also wrong when you say the Constitution can't be changed -- it can be changed through amendments.
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: yes

Changed, but only when they add more laws that PROTECT our individual rights instead of limiting them more. That's what was meant to happen in the first place. unfortunately, people think we have too much freedom and therefore push laws that only limit them. The Bill of Rights, specifically, has been tampered with too much by law makers and the judges. Sotomayor, herself, has no respect for the Bill of Rights, and she is a Supreme Court Justice.
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: yes

no your off. laws our different according to society.what i was saying is that libertarians have laws, so that the rich don't oppress, and etc.we have one law. that is the hindering a person form utilizing his full freedom. that means slavery, theft, assault, rape, so forth, is illegal in a libertarian society.and lol. i never said that the constitution cant be changed. in fact i advocate that the constitution was made to be changed.
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: No

1) I wasn't talking to you. My argument was a response to Pyg.2) I don't really understand what you're trying to say. "laws our different according to society" ...what?3) I know what libertarian means.
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: yes

lol sorry, well any argument on my debate appears so i thought it was at me.as for laws different to society, it means this. in the middle east women have very little social status in some areas and if they are caught it adultery they are dragged through the village on a donkey with their hands cut off. while here, it just results in divorce.thats what i meant.
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: yes

I'm sorry u don't like the name. i suppose that the a better name would of been TAXATION is THEFT. but i liked the idea of paradoxically words playing off each other so, i did it.
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: No

Well if you called the debate "taxation is theft" I still would've made the same objection: The words are the same in some respects but different in others. Paying attention only to the similarities between the two while ignoring the differences obscures the issue. I understand what you're getting at, but it's just not a fair way to debate. I think a less biased way to approach the issue would be to ask if taxation is justified.
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: yes

the whole point of my statement is that its political correct, which makes it logically incorrect. this type of wording is called doublethink, that is a paradox of two things that don't work but our put to gather to work. this is what government has done, legalized theft. if you have comprehended this then congrats, if not i will be expecting an other weak mustered rebuttal form you soon. and way to to and take it to an extreme with a lame argument like well pollution can cause murder.u people give this guy points because of a half sensed smart ass rebuttal?
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: No

the whole point of my statement is that its political correct, which makes it logically incorrect.Which makes no sense.this type of wording is called doublethink, that is a paradox of two things that don't work but our put to gather to work.And a wonderful example of doublethink is conflating a legal and mutually complicit practice with an illegal, non-complicit practice, and conceiving them as the same thing. Y''know, like taxation being legalized theft.this is what government has done, legalized theft.Right: doublethink.u people give this guy points because of a half sensed smart ass rebuttal?I can give you a point if you want.
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: yes

lol perhaps a little to harsh on the response, your humor intrigues me. as for the statement you said that makes no sense. it goes like this, things that people say are sometimes deemed political incorrect. such as calling a gay is politically incorrect, the right term would be different life style choice, when well, their still gay. that is the example i use in my upper statement, make any sense now?
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: yes

As Nixon said: "If the president does it, it's not against the law".When someone takes your property or money against your will, we would call it theft. But when the president (or the government in general) does it, we call it taxation. As I stated, taxation to a small extent can be justified since it pays for a basic necessities for maintaining the state which we live in; but government has far surpassed that maintenance. The FCC regulates what you can and can't say on air... it's something that's legal and mutually complicit... but according the first amendment, that's illegal. But government has a pretty good way of incorporating doublethink.
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: No

When someone takes your property or money against your will, we would call it theft. Yep.But when the president (or the government in general) does it, we call it taxationThere is a distinction, it's not against your will. By continued participation in a society where its citizens are taxed, you're agreeing to its codified mores by maintaining residence in said society, and are in agreement with its laws. As you state below, and I have disputed on the other side of the isle, we're mutually complicit. And that complicity removes the notion of theft from the debate - necessarily. Now, you can be frustrated with having your money taken, but there's no legitimate argument to be made that it is actually theft.
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: yes

If taxation was merely your complicity to stay in a society, why don't they just deport you if you don't pay taxes instead of throwing you in jail where you can be raped and shanked? Oh right, because they still need you to pay for their shit, eventually. Or, it's to make an example of you so that others will go along with their taxing system. Taxation pays for residence? What if your family was among the very first settlers? They owned this land before anyone decided to create government and start taxing people. Are you saying that it's right for government to take over, kick people out of their homes and demand that they pay up or go to jail (where they can be sodomized and murdered)? Holy shit!I understand the whole "pay to maintain the free state". The second Amendment gave government the right to provide a well regulated militia for just that purpose. And yes, as citizens who receive the individual rights, we need to help pay for that regulated militia since it helps maintain our freedom. But to somehow justify what taxation has become with that small bit of fact is over the line, sir. Taxation goes to:giving politicians an income, complete health benefits, security, transportation, food, etc.building statuesbuilding stadiumsbuilding "monuments"wasteful programs making it easier for cops to ticket people for even more revenuefree gas for any government employee who "needs" transportationand a shit load of other stuff that most would consider "not important for maintaining a free state".But an interesting thing you pointed out. What can we do about it? If we don't comply, they can buttfuck us (by putting us in a place where we will get buttfucked). And instead of people getting outraged, most of them will be like you and try to make up excuses for the government and their irresponsible use of power. It's funny, the founding fathers did fear the masses... because they knew that they would just let government become tyrannical again. They kind of want it that way, anyway. Fuckin' people.
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: No

"Taxation goes to:giving politicians an income, complete health benefits, security, transportation, food, etc.building statues...and a shit load of other stuff that most would consider "not important for maintaining a free state".Your argument is biased. You only mentioned the bad things about taxes. What about: schools, protection(police, fire, and military), waste clean-up, buildings, roads, etc.
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: yes

Because I was pointing to how far taxes have gone. there is a small amount of necessity, but that is not what our government practices.
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: No

That is not a small amount of necessity. One the largest government expenditures is public utilities and infrastructure.
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: yes

public utilities are monopolies. And, they're privately owned. They're just called public utilities because they're government supported monopolies.
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: No

How are they monopolies? There is more than one electric company that I can choose.
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: yes

Most people can not choose their electric company. But even so, if the utilities are competitive, how does this help your argument about public services?
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: No

It doesn't. I was just proving that it's not a monopoly everywhere.
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: yes

Even so, my point still stands. If anything, you only proved how wrong you were on how necessary taxes are...
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: No

If taxation was merely your complicity to stay in a society...I never said it was any such thing. I asserted that you have tacitly agreed to the laws of the society you live in by remaining and participating in that society. That is called complicity, and complicity precludes the issue of theft when it comes to taxation. And reading your response, I can see that you don't actually have a counter argument to that point. When you have that argument, please feel free to provide it.
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: yes

You're right. It's almost impossible to argue against the point that taxation is theft as long as you wish to remain in your home and not die... in your words, complicity to remain and participate in society. Oh wait, even with my new argument, I already pointed out "why don't they just deport you instead of putting you in a prison where you are BUTT FUCKED and MURDERED."Right... not theft, but coercion. If you wanna get all specific about it ~_~wait, that's two arguments now that's SPECIFICALLY a rebuttal to the point you were making. but only one is new :OOh, I get it. Deportation is to jail. Jail isn't a place where they hold you, but a place where they send you. I forgot how people are free to leave once they pay their taxes, or free to leave in general, since it's not part of the country.my God your argument is horribly flawed, i'm just making fun of you. I mean, I understand what you're trying to say, but it came out so shitty and with holes it's hard not to just say all this shit.
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: yes

I guess I should also point to how your argument is a lot like the "love it or leave it" argument. We have a problem with what the government is doing, and instead of trying to justify their actions by maybe pointing out how it's good... you're saying "if you don't like the taxes, you should either leave the country or go to jail". assuming we make it out in time.but why argue the violation of individual rights that the government does? Love it or leave it, man. "but the Constitution..." no man, love it or leave it. "but I love the Constitution, not the rape that the government did to it". you don't understand... love it or leave it. "damn, you sure are good at debate".
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: No

That's why we live in a country that allows you to vote on issues.It's not love it or leave it, it's love it, leave it, or try and change it. I can guarantee you that black people didn't love our country for a long time, but fortunately they worked to change the laws.Yay for democracy!
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: yes

Black people didn't vote on the issue of slavery... in fact, it was the white man who worked for their freedom. They had NO say in whether they will be slaves or not. They didn't even have the ability to leave.Democracy killed Socrates and banished Plato. It's not that great. It merely gives power to the masses (which the Founding Fathers did fear), which of course has resulted in banning gay marriage, ban on marijuana and prostitution, ban on gambling, strict abortion laws, the ability for government to take away your homes, the Patriot Act, etc. That's why the Constitution was written... unfortunately, the masses are too stupid to realize how much they vote against it.
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: No

Actually I was talking about Civil rights, however, if you want to talk about the role blacks played in freeing slaves I would recommend watching the movie Glory, or if you don't have the time this video:
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: yes

In Glory, they were given the option to help fight in the war. Also, many were drafted. They were segregated, lulz. Also, blacks fought on the other side, helping the Confederates, which gave them individual freedom if they fought for a certain amount... or, slave owners sent slaves in their place.But it was the white man who played the most part in ending slavery. Blacks were merely pawns, if you want to refer to black soldiers.
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: No

In Glory, they were given the option to help fight in the warAnd? I'm not sure how this contribution was different from the white soldiers.Are you arguing that because whites were in power it was them who essentially set the blacks free? I mean I never argued that white people didn't play a role, but that blacks also had some part in it. Fredrick Douglas is one example of someone who made a real difference by talking to Lincoln.It's like literally everything I say you misconstrue... what's up with that?
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: yes

because you're claiming that somehow blacks had a an actual role in their freedom. Being a soldier in a war that they did not start is not much of a role in a bill that is passed. Yes, they fought for what they believed in, but would it have made a difference if they didn't fight? hardly.it's like everything i say you misconstrue... what's up with that?
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: No

Just continue to ignore the fact that Fredrick Douglas and other blacks actually did play a part in convincing Lincoln to sign the Emancipation Proclamation. Also continue to belittle the efforts of black soldiers. Whatever you need to do to maintain your worldview.
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: yes

It was also through the effort of Republicans and Extremist Republicans who in general have been wanting this for awhile. Republicans were anti-extentionalists and extremist republicans were abolitionists. The Emancipation Proclamation was a long thing coming ever since the Republican Party was formed. The Civil War just gave them a good opportunity to do so.
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: No

I'm not disputing that the Republicans didn't play an extremely large role in the freedom of slaves: obviously they did. What I am saying though is that blacks (such as Fredrick Douglas) also played a role. Rarely can the cause of a major event be simplified to the point that there is only a single cause, and while it may help you argue your point to say that there was only one cause, doing so is intellectually dishonest.By your argument we shouldn't really give Neil Armstrong for getting to the moon since someone else would have done it if he wasn't there. In fact, why do we honor any soldiers? Any person could have easily have been in their position.Come on, give me break. Blacks did fight and die for their freedom, and they at least deserve acknowledgment.
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: yes

I never said that blacks weren't brave people who fought for what they felt was right (half of them, at least, the other half were forced to fight). That's obvious. But they did not play any strong role in the eventual freedom of slaves. You keep on mentioning Fredrick Douglas as if he were the straw that broke the Camel's back, but he wasn't. Yeah, he wrote some letters. A shit load of people told Lincoln a shit load of things. But the Republicans' agenda was already to free the slaves. The Civil War merely gave them a good opportunity to do so. Even so, the Emancipation Proclamation did not completely stop slavery, it was just a push to crack down on the enemy (allies were not forced to give up slaves).
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: No

I guess I should also point to how your argument is a lot like the "love it or leave it" argumentIt's not like that argument at all. Please stop retreating to a straw man, for your intellectual comfort.you're saying "if you don't like the taxes, you should either leave the country or go to jail".I'm simply asserting that if you don't want to be taxed by the government of the country you are in, then you are free to leave that country. I don't care if you love it, like it, or want to marry it. But as long as you choose of your own will to remain in a country where there is a tax system, then you are in agreement with its contract and are obligated to pay those taxes.
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: yes

So instead of making a debate about how bad or good taxes are, your argument is "if you don't like the taxes, you are free to leave".
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: No

So instead of making a debate about how bad or good taxes are, your argument is "if you don't like the taxes, you are free to leave".No. First, the issue of this debate isn't about whether taxes are good or bad, but whether taxes are equivalent to theft. Second, please stop putting words in my mouth. Third, if you don't have an argument addressing the issue of the debate, we're done.
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: yes

You said it's not theft because it's part of the law that we are agreeing to abide by by living here.So, when young woman were forced to sleep with the pope or had to face banishment or execution, it wasn't rape, because they could have just left their town.you just don't seem to understand what I'm saying... at all. your argument is basically "you don't have an argument". good one, dude.
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: yes

yes some one who gets it. but still again i stress. if we agreed to pay the government for security it would not be a tax, it would be a donation. which i have nothing wrong with.
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: yes

It's not about agreement, it's the law. The US constitution not only stressed the importance of individual rights, but also the importance of maintaining a Free State. This is how taxation (in order to provide security) can be justified. Now, an Anarcho-Capitalist can try and argue that privatized paramilitaries can provide a free state, but that's an entirely different debate that would lead to "Anarchy vs. Government". I am merely a person who highly advocates the Constitution (especially the Bill of Rights).
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: yes

will thats where I'm at, being a libertarian in this society would be imposable, instead i am a different brand of them. we advocate small government to the point of only security and being a representative for foreign affairs. thats all we need. the rest can be privatized and managed by us the people. we did it for 100 years before the civil war and 200 before the Constitution was even wrote.
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: No

Alright, you want a dispute? ITS NOT THEFT!!! The government is not just taking your money away from you and using it on its own interests. These services are in place to help you. If you don't like it, you don't have to live here. It's like when you're parents put some of your money away for you when you're little for college. They're not taking it away from you, they're doing something that will help you with it. And, alright, say, it is theft; its theft you agree to by living in this country. Once again, if you have a problem with it...and if not from the government, then where do we get this money from then, because not every town can afford to pay for their own services. That's why the system is in place the way it is: so everyone may receive these services. And, by the way, I didn't downpoint you just because I disagree. I disputed it. I don't know who's doing that on your side but its childish. If you're gonna downpoint me, explain why.
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: No

govt...not is not an illigal thing......money should be there with the govt for doing things for the state.......govt will get money only from the people.....so if we want a woking govt, we are responsible for giving tax........
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: No

No, taxation is what you are paying for roads, schools, police, fire etc...albeit a good chunk of your taxes are being wasted, some taxation is necessary to pay for services we use everyday.
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: No

Considering that a lot of taxes are voted for by the people and/or the money you give to the government comes back to you in one way or another, it's really just lending.
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: yes

Sorry, to burst the bubble, but under no circumstances, the people are allowed to vote taxes into law or for that matter, any kind of law. That is strictly reserved to local, state and federal government officials.Referendums can serve as a recommendation for government leaders to act accordingly.
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: No

A 1 cent sales tax increase was just voted for here in Arizona in a special election.
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: yes

Unfortunately, you are still incorrect because the public didn't write or vote on the law. Instead, Arizona voters approved Proposition 100, which means voters didn't actually write the law, it was still law created by the state legislature, and ask for confirmation by the public through a Proposition called 100. Arizona Media
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: No

Of course they didn't create it, but they voted for it so the majority of the people aren't getting their money stolen because they obviously want to pay the tax to support their schools.
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: yes

Hence, the general public can't pass law.------------------------
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: yes

if people wanted to pay the government money there would be no need for taxation. taxation is used to tax the people who don't want to pay and then the government justifies it with noble reasons. no noble right ends overshadows a unjust fair means, period.
Debate: Taxation is Legalized Theft
Side: no

You can probably frame tax as paying off debt to the goverment, the goverment builds roads, schools other things which positively effect society. If the goverment is seen as a financial institution, then daily we take out a secured loan by useing its services which then needs to be payed. The only problem is the monopoly government has in some areas, which might be preferable to other options and might not. There are several ways which taxation can be framed which puts a different spin on it, I'm not sure which one i want to use.