azza1625/createdebate-arguments huggingface dataset:
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

I think you have misunderstood me. I think killing animals is wrong because it causes pain. I think killing humans is wrong regardless.And modern day slaughterhouses are a grotesque abomination. See: http://www.createdebate.com/debate/show/ Factory_farming_needs_to_be_reformed Some aspects of morality are fickle, others are strongly grounded in fundamental principles. If I had to kill to eat, I would. I would be committing evil, but that evil would be justified.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

I am in complete agreement with you that we need to improve the conditions in which these animals live and also find better ways to make the killing perhaps completely painless.But that is not what you have been advocating at all. That is not what the people that carry this slogan in the streets are advocating neither. They want us to stop eating meat period (someone else here used that word actually). That's what I have a problem with.On the face of it, killing is something that sounds fundamentally wrong. But by your admission, the killing of animals for food is not so fundamentally wrong. What is more morally acceptable? That the Eskimos respect the fish and allow themselves to die? Obviously not. Why? Because that would be MORE wrong than killing the fish to survive.Now, just because I'm not an Eskimo doesn't mean that somehow all the reasons that justified me eating meat are gone. What comes to play is choice. I am luckier than the Eskimo because if I don't feel comfortable eating meat then I have other alternatives to choose from. I can choose to eat meat one day and beans on the next day. But arrogant people feel really compelled to want to impose only one choice to everybody. And that is nothing short of fascism.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

Actually, the humane treatment of animals is exactly what I've been advocating. It seems you have been reading into my arguments something that isn't there. I also think this position is the one endorsed by the majority of animal rights activists. Perhaps you're looking at the extreme fringe and assuming it represents the majority.Survival is by far the most important justification for eating meat. Take that away and what do you have left? It tastes good? Is that really enough of a reason? And, no, taking away a choice is not fascism. We have many laws which inhibit choice. Murder, for example, is illegal. The question is simply whether those laws are justified.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

No, taste is not the only reason people eat meat. There are a few sources of protein, such as Meat, Poultry, Fish, Eggs and Vegetable sources such as Nuts, Soya and Beans.But it's only the protein from animal sources that contains the full range of essential amino acids needed from an adult's diet. The best one being Poultry and Fish because they contain less fat than red meat.If you were to stick to vegetable sources, you would need to supplement your diet with a larger variety of foods and possibly some additional vitamin supplements. So you see, it doesn't come without consequences.Think about this for a second. We all know there are bad consequences if your diet excludes fruit and veg. What makes you think that there are no consequences at all if you completely exclude meat from your diet?
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

First, combining multiple non-meat products gives you the full range of amino acids. You should be eating a range of foods anyway.Second, dairy products contain complete proteins.Third, protein powder, which I have mentioned a couple of times already, is another attractive option.Your point about only eating vegetables is irrelevant because vegetables are not the only non-meat product that exists.There are bad consequences to excluding fruits and vegetables from your diet because they contain vitamins and fiber. There are no negative consequences at all from excluding meat. In fact, studies have shown forgoing meat makes you less likely to die from a heart attack:http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content/full/70/ 3/516S#FN2 "We... compare the death rates from common diseases of vegetarians with those of nonvegetarians with similar lifestyles... In conclusion, vegetarians had a 24% lower mortality from ischemic heart disease than nonvegetarians, but no associations of a vegetarian diet with other major causes of death were established."http://www.eatright.org/cps/rde/xchg/ada/hs.xsl/advocacy_933_ENU_HTML.htm "It is the position of the American Dietetic Association and Dietitians of Canada that appropriately planned vegetarian diets are healthful, nutritionally adequate and provide health benefits in the prevention and treatment of certain diseases."
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

Then, for the sake of your own health, eat what diet you think best. Don't tell other people what to do.But that is beside the point, as we both know. We both know very well, that meat is not murder. Murder is murder, and meat is meat, and murder is immoral and meat is a part of life.So if you say it is then the blood is on your hands hypocrite. Don't tell me you never tasted chicken nuggets.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Produce also murder

Ending the life of any thing living is murder in the broadest sense, to feed, clothe and shelter humans something must die plant or animal. I agree nothing should have to suffer to sustain us, however things must die or we do. Lions kill and eat gazelles, however they would die if they only ate grass. We don't know if plants suffer or are aware because it is beyond our understanding. Vegans have the right to believe as they do, however they are no more, no less superior or moral.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

We don't need to kill animals for clothing. In fact most clothing is made from crops such as cotton, not from animal products.We also don't need to eat meat to be healthy.We know very well how suffering comes about -- our senses send signals to our brain which in turn creates the feeling. Plants don't have brains or any other means of cognition, therefore they cannot suffer.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

personally,I don't eat meat,I don't enjoy eating it and I know I'd never be able to kill an animal myself.BUT Were all animals! we just think were better than the rest!they do it to each other,why shouldn't we join?personally,I love animals and I wish they wernt being killed for food but I accept it because I know that it's part of what we do,from the very beginning.in saying that,alotof people cross out many animals for food and I don't understand it,why do some live to die and others live to be preserved forever?if it's okay to eat pig and Cow it should be okay to eat horse and dog.I don't believe animal slaughter is right as I believe we have anequal right to live as they do but i believe its and also,we can live without them in our diet,were just selfish and enjoy them too much!
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

You seriously need to eat a double bacon cheeseburger. ..................
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

However you slice it, whatever your moral/ethical feelings are towards this, eating meat is directly causing the end of multiple sentient lives. Ending sentient life is murder. Simple.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

I think that meat is murder! What gives us the right as humans to take the lives of innocent animals for our own selfish needs? There are so many other alternatives yet we choose to kill others to live ourselves. Animals live breathe and feel just the same as us humans do they just cant cry out in pain as we would. But they do feel pain and they shouldnt have to because of us!!!
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

What gives animals the right to kill each other? It's just survival of the fittest. Don't get me wrong, how animals are slaughtered is repulsive, wrong, and should be fixed. But if we didn't kill animals at all, they would rapidly overpopulate because of how we disrupt the natural food chain, and complete with us for space and resources. Meat may not be necessary for sustenance, but death is just part of the development of life on earth.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

Our ways of killing animals are unnatural, and unfair. Does the lion hold a slaughterhouse for the zebra? No.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

I think that we shouldn't have to hurt or torture the animals before we eat them. We should put them down humanely, even if it costs a lot. Would you want to suffer first before someone eats you? I don't think so.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

Animals kill each other because they lack the mental capacity to do anything else. We as humans are capable of choosing not to cause pain.Animals could never compete with us for resources. We've got guns. If a vegetarian had to make a choice between a human dying and an animal dying they would kill the animal. (Well, maybe some fringe lunatics wouldn't, but the vast majority would...)Practically all of the meat that we eat comes from animals that we breed. Hunting is something done mainly for recreation and is outside the scope of vegetarianism.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

If a vegetarian had to make a choice between a human dying and an animal dying they would kill the animal.--It totally depends on the dying person...Hunting is something done mainly for recreation and is outside the scope of vegetarianism.--It shouldn't be. Anyone eating meat should kill the animal themselves. There would be significantly more vegetarians.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

Have you never killed a spider? Cockroach? Mosquito? If so, was it for a selfish human need? I don't know that there's anything wrong with killing other animals for our own needs, though it is wrong to kill for sport. The way an animal is killed and the freedom it was given in life is what matters.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

The difference is they are stupid animals, while you are a stupid human. Or did I get that wrong? You are a stupid animal too then? Bwahahahaha.And you actually believe you have a right to tell other people what to do and what to eat and not eat? You know what you are? You are a bully. That's right, you are a bully who tells other people what they should or shouldn't do. And you actually think anyone will respect you? HAHAHAHAAHHAHAHHAHa.AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHALOL
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

Idiot. We're bullies because we're saying murder is unacceptable. Ha! Really get new ideas.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

Typo.....................................................................................................sorry.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

Ok. I am not religious by any means but I do know for a fact that the Bible clearly says God created all cloven hooved animals for the benefit of man. Although, judging by some of the comments on here, the majority of you are atheist, maybe Buhddist. By the way. Meat IS murder....Tasty Tasty murder! I love my bovine, swine, poultry, fish, fowl, venison (that's any of the cervid species), and crustaceans. TED NUGENT ROCKS!
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

We have the right of domain over animals. Animals don't have souls a dog doesn't even know it's dog or any animal even know what it is. If you are starving and are out in the wild any walking animal that is not human i guarantee that you would look at any animal as dinner in order to survive.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

I wouldn't phrase it that way because it is too general but i agree with the idea. I think the way animals are bred, raised, and killed is morally wrong. Anything that eats meat could be considered a murder and people can eat meat but that doesn't mean people need to eat meat. The fact that humans don't need to eat meat yet advocate and support the mass production and killing of various animals is cruel and obsessive.Real carnivores and omnivores can eat meat raw without getting sick. They also enjoy eating raw meat. They are not repulsed by the idea of eating a dead animal if they pass it.The human anatomy is not specialized for eating meat it is just able to cope with it. That doesn't mean it is natural for a human to eat meat such as a hamburger or grilled chicken. http://www.earthsave.ca/articles/health/ comparative.html  has further explanations about the human anatomy's lack of optimization for eating meat.Humans are willing to eat meat because once it's cooked it tastes good. Also humans generally don't catch their own pray and gut it and prepare to eat. They don't see the slaughterhouses. Infact humans are so far removed from the meat making process that they can't truly know how much of what they are eating is any certain type of meat or additional organic materials. They don't see the mass blood, sickness, weakness, or pain that is associated with slaughterhouses.Killing any living thing without need is wrong and to induce suffering while killing that being is even worse. So yes meat is murder, because humans can easily survive without meat and are actually healthier when they do.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

The title assumes that murder is wrong, which it is not.As said by I don't know how many, the example of a predator killing a weeker animal is not immoral, because the predator has no capacity for empathy.Problem is, we do. So what do we do about it?Right now what we do is ignore it, and say it's okay because we're the predator and we observe in nature that this is what predators do.I would argue that we should try to hold ourselves to a higher standard than this.Does it really matter if we do?Probably not, but that does not mean that we should not at least try to kill the food we eat with as little pain as possibe, and it also does not mean we should not attempt to allow our prey to live in comfort for whatever amount of time we give them here.However, saying that, it is important that we as humans understand that other humans are more important than animals.I love my tortoises. But if a human being is starving, and in some post-apocolyptic world there is no other means of sustanance, guess what, my great little toroises have to die.This is where the far left occassionally takes it too far. Humans are more important than animals. End of story.At the other end though. Just because we can kill whatever we want without penalty, and just because we sometimes do kill whatever we want, does not make it morally okay.There has to be a level of understanding of what it means to be human and have self-awareness, I find many on both sides lack this completely, making me wonder if we really aren't just "predators" who by coincidence have extra large brains.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: MY CAT IS DEAD AND I MISS HIM FFFFuuuuuu

I think so, yes. The meaning of murder though, at least as it is in the Oxford American Dictionary, involves premeditated killing of another human, but why differentiate between an animal that isn't human and humans? It's a superficial (purposeful) misunderstanding that keeps a lot of "unimportant" cases out of court. Murder is the premeditated killing of any animal. The thought of killing a process, (consciousness in any form at all) is murder. This is even true for plants, though the severity differs greatly because plants aren't (as far as we understand the idea), conscious.  The problem is in the industry though, not the act of eating animals. It's human, to eat meat, but it's not human to treat meat as nothing more than a Big Mac. What I mean by that is, people used to respect animals and feel pain for each animal's death. Native Americans would purposely use every part of an animal that they killed to make it's death as meaningful to people as possible. There were spiritual aspects involved, but I feel the principle is most important.  We treat animals like shit now, if not worse. We raise them with the idea that they will all one day be shat out by someone a number of hours after being tasted. They are slaughtered without regard, which is understandable because of the emotional damage you would put yourself through if you had to slaughter so many a day... you would go insane, if you cared about each of them as your own pets... Eugh, well my cat just died yesterday and I've been drinking to compensate for his loss... even though he was just a cat. Maybe I shouldn't be talking about the treatment of animals right now...
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

who would ead his or her pet ? can your really say there is no other choice but to eat meat ? the basis of cruelty is not seeing it.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

I wouldn't call it "murder", but I do believe that anything which causes undesired pain to a sentient being is wrong.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

Yes it is. Fortunately, I don't care and I am able to enjoy the delicious flavour of a thick bloody steak or a braised veal shank.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: you cant say no to chicken nuggets

Firstly, I really want to stress that human beings are NOT meant to eat meant(Naturally). You can double check this with any biologist. It can be told from our teeth structure, which indicates the kind of foods our body was meant to eat, and meat is NOT one of them.Secondly, meat is not just killing animals, but also killing us! Every year, to meet the consumers' demands, lots of animals are brought up. The first problem, is that the animals will have to get food from plant sources(usually), however, cutting down greens will mean that there are less plats removing carbon from the air. Secondly, animals also give out alot of methane, which like carbon dioxide, enhances the green house effect, contributing to global warming.On the other hand... well, its true... eating meat has become part of our life, so taking meat away is, and will be a difficult task.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

Another hippie huh? Alright, I'll say it again. The Bible says God made all cloven hooved animals for the benefit of man. The beast of burden ring a bell? That's right, any and all cloven hooved animal. If you are at a loss?.... Any bovine, swine, cervid, ( cow, sheep, goat, pig, venison [deer, elk, caribou, reindeer, antelope, moose, impala, gazelle, etc.]). Secondly, the offset of oxygen to carbon dioxide and methane is so minimal it pales in comparison to the overpopulation and ridiculously large amounts produced by big cities. Global warming? HAH! Another falsehood in the long list of propaganda brought forth by self proclaimed scientists. But if you are truly concerned? As Ron White put it.."I'm Doin' MY Part By Eatin' The Cow."
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

Yes, it sure is. WHY? you might ask well, i can answer that.Factories that manufacture meat and diary treat the animals like....well crap.Animals are kicked, hit, squished to death, stabbed while alive and torture.The animals are later affected by disease of the unclean environment that they are putted in. Who eats does animals? PEOPLE. Many, as in a lot of companies have this "meat" then manufacture into stores. Basically people eat meat that has been in crap and has diseases, that were adopted from the environment were it was once alive.In order for this not to be consider murder, factories need to use less t torture ways to kill the animals. For example instead of having them to suffer alive threw all this thinks is to just use paralyzing so they can't feel pain. This workers are to cruel to the poor animals.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

Well, by definition. I eat meat still =)...........................
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

i think the conditions in which we kill and eat animals is brutal and wrong for a long while animals have sustained us and though some people say that its fair because we dominate well maybe we don't deserve to dominate... we are destroying the entire world hundreds of thousands of species and we are the only one that destroyed and continue to destroy everything else, including ourselves, all the technology and skills and brains we have we managed to screw everything up just because animals don't know how to drive a car or turn on the sink doesn't mean we have the right to treat them this way it means they aren't polluting and wasting water i think that now days we have the means to live a long healthy life without eating as much meat as we do it is natural to eat meat but it is also natural to go out and catch it not go though a driveway! that does not mean your gonna go out in the wilderness with only your handmade weapons to get a primal burger because we don't have to... and we don't have to eat as much meat as we do we are treating the animals brutally and it is wrong
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

Killing animals is definitly murder because there are so many alternatives to iron and protein such as beans, nuts, eggs, spinach etc... Killing animals is not nessicary.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: No, I disagree

Have you ever stepped on an ant? Gone fishing and used a worm for bait? Hit an animal while driving your car? Swatted a fly? Smash a mosquito? Stepped on some creature and smushed it when you walked in grass?If you say killing an animal for meat is murder than all that i just desribed is wrong and murder on the same level. I do not believe that killing something and causing pain is right...but in a society that puts animals on the same level as humans, I cant consider this murder. Some people say it is murder because the animal can not give consent. Well then abortion is murder as well because the human life in the womb cant give consent either.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

Humans are perfectly capable of surviving on a diet that consists of fruit and vegies. We don't need meat in out diet, you can easily supplement those foods. Saying that animals are killed more brutality in the wild is not true, the animals will have a free life then suffer a short death. The animals that are killed for meat are tortured from birth. Whether or not they are killed painlessly or not it shouldn't matter. Pigs have a brain capability equal to a 3 year old, and the way pigs are treated disgusts me. So unless killing 3 year olds "painlessly" becomes legal, killing anything painlessly or not is wrong.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

With all the evidence gathered in "The China Study" the video "forks over knives" first for our health we should switch but I don't advocat that "meat is murder" in the criminal sense, I just believe we don't need to kill animals to survice. It would also be more efficient worldwide to save the protein for people instead of feeding it to animals and then kill them.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

Yes, it is unfair to carry on killing for some twisted people's pleasure. I can't eat meat, being wicce, but I rally don't think I'd want to.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

Yes, even though I eat meat and I don't mind, in the back of my mind, I know that if it's at least wrong to me.Animals eat animals is a fact, so there's nothing truly wrong about it, but if I had more of a choice/lived by myself, I would try to mainly eat non-animal products.
Debate: Meat is Murder!
Side: Yes, I agree

This is a poem that I really like and that I think it tells the truth. "If animals could talk what do you think they would say. More than likely it would be please stop abusing me this way. But animals cannot talk so for them we must speak. They are poor, helpless, and weak. They cannot care for themselves or get their own water and food. Please don’t hit me again. I promise to be good. Don’t leave me tied to this tree. I need freedom to roam. Can’t you see? I have never hurt you so what is it that I have done? I only want to play and have a little fun. I am an animal but I can feel pain too. Please don’t abuse me I just want to love you." By: Lori Beeler