in the sense that there's no neg there's no potential negative curvature and that's essentially what that proof was saying it was saying this H of the H matrix the gram matrix is simply outer products of these gradients and it was not moving a lot under these initialization schemes on widths and so forth ok so she's out and Bach came up with a nice sufficient condition of when you should expect this they call it this kernel regime to happen essentially the sufficient condition is that think of Y minus F 0 as order one