maybe pin this down and then I think we also did some very preliminary experiments on natural images and I think we're seeing sort of similar effects and there are kind of interesting questions we can all skier like you know if we train and then sort of reinitialize but just preserve the scale like you know do you see a difference in convergence speed that's like one of the basic questions we could try and try and answer and then I think there are sort of other questions that also came up through this process sort