Local Audit (Public Access to Documents) Bill — House of Commons, 2017-03-24
Topic: Government Operations
David Nuttall (Conservative, Centre-right): I, too, welcome the Bill in the spirit in which it has been introduced, despite the fact that my attempt to amend it did not meet with the approval of the promoter of the Bill, my hon. Friend the Member for Aldridge-Brownhills (Wendy Morton). As I said at the time, it was not a wrecking amendment but a genuine proposal to try to improve the Bill I listened carefully to my hon. Friend on amendment 1 but did not wholly agree with her. The explanatory notes refer to citizen journalists, and the heading of clause 1 includes the words "and citizen journalists". Her explanation was that journalists includes citizen journalists. If that is the case, why was it thought necessary to go on to say "and citizen journalists" in the title of clause? That needs looking at again, but I am conscious of the important point made by my hon. Friend the Member for Christchurch (Mr Chope). I appreciate that, if it were amended in the other place, it would spell the death of the Bill in this Session, unless the Government make time for the Commons to consider any Lords amendments. It is a question of what is more important. Is it more important that we get this legislation right, or do we let it go through in a form that we are not happy with? It is a fine balance. I hope that the answer lies in the Government saying that if the other place does feel that it is appropriate for the Bill to be amended, they will find Government time in which to consider those amendments on the grounds that those in the other place may have read this debate and heard our arguments as to why the Bill would benefit from further clarification. Their lordships may reach a different view from that taken by this House today The reason I suggest that it would be appropriate for the Government to find time for any Lords amendments to be considered is that after the Act that this Bill seeks to amend—the Local Audit and Accountability Act 2014 —was passed, it was put out to consultation by the Department for Communities and Local Government. In December 2014, it published its response, which says at paragraph 4.11 on page 10: "Government believes that journalists should also be able to inspect accounts and information, in the interests of local people, and therefore intends to legislate at the earliest opportunity to ensure that the definition of ‘persons interested’", as defined in section 26 of the 2014 Act, "is wide enough to enable this." That was a very clear commitment by the Government to making this amendment to the legislation, albeit that it is now being introduced in a private Member’s Bill. There is therefore a sound argument as to why they should make this time available I wholeheartedly support the general thrust of the Bill. It is right that we should give as much access as possible to those who are "interested"—the phraseology used in the initial legislation, which is now being extended to include journalists. I am sorry that we are not extending that to all electors who can vote in local elections, but the Bill is nevertheless a step in the right direction. It is right that we try to extend the right to inspect the accounts of local government, and all the other bodies listed in schedule 2 of the 2014 Act, to journalists and citizen journalists I accept that there is a concern that this might result in those bodies being inundated with requests, as was suggested earlier, but there is no evidence to suggest that that would be the case. I suspect that the answer lies in the legislation, which provides for the bodies to be able to charge for copies of documents that are taken away. We are weighing up two competing interests. The overriding interest is the interest of the public in knowing what is going on. The alternative is to say, "Well, once the accounts are published, there should be no right for anyone to go in and inspect the underlying documents, the books of accounts and so forth." I do not think that any of us would want to go down that road. I suspect that what we have stumbled on here is probably the best of the options available to us. I would like to have gone further, but, nevertheless, extending the right to journalists is better than nothing. It is now up to journalists to make use of the new power that will be given to them once this Bill becomes law It will be interesting to see whether anybody covered by this Bill actually seeks to do what Bristol council did in respect of the 2014 Act and exclude citizen journalists because they are not specifically mentioned other than in the clause title. I hope that does not happen. If anyone tries to do that, I would refer them to the explanatory notes, which makes it very clear that the term "citizen journalists" should include "bloggers and others who scrutinise local authorities but who may not be accredited member of the press." Paragraph 7 of the explanatory notes states: "As well as accredited members of the press, the term journalist would be extended to cover ‘citizen journalists’, such as bloggers, enabling them to inspect the accounts of a local authority where they are not a local elector so that in publishing their findings they can help enable the public to hold that local authority to account." That is the key to the whole Bill. It is about being able to hold elected politicians to account. I trust that when the Bill is considered by the Lords, they will look carefully at the arguments that have been made here and consider whether it is worthy of further amendment. But I hope that the Bill is not amended in the other place unless there is an assurance that the Government will provide time—it will have to be Government time, as there are no more private Members’ days allocated in this Session—for those amendments to be considered I thank my hon. Friend the Member for Aldridge-Brownhills for her work in ensuring that the Bill has reached this stage and for the efficient and courteous way that she has handled proceedings. I wish the Bill well.