1874. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD. 1541 

By Mr. RUSK: .'l'he petition of Amanda M. Sherwood, for a pension, 

to the Committee on Invalid Pensions. 

By Mr. SAWYER: The petition of citizens of Wisconsin, for appropriations for· the improvement of the Mississippi, Fox, and Wisconsin Rivers, to the Committee on Commerce. 

By Mr. SAYLER, of Ohio: The petition of Cornelia M. Arthur, of 

Cincinnati, for increq,se of pension, to the Committee on Invalid Pensions. 

Also, the petition of bankers, merchants, manufacturers, and other 

citizens of Cincinnati, Ohio, l'epresenting that they view with alarm 

the various schemes to increa-se .the irreU.eemable paper currency of 

tho country, ancl askin~ Con!?ress not to authorize its increase in any 

form whatever, to the uomrruttee on Banking and Cuxrency. 

By Mr. SOUTHARD: The petition of William Parks, for a pension, 

to the Committee on Invalid Pensions. 

By J\.Ir. STONE : The petition of bankers, merchants, and other 

citizens of Saint Louis, remonstrating a9_ainst the h;sue of any more legal-tender notes, to the Committee on tsanking and Currency. 

Also, the petition of certain citizens of Saint Louis, for the payment of the French spoliation claims, to the Committee on Foreign 

Affairs. 

By Mr. STORM: The petition of graduates of the United States 

Naval Academy, of June 4, 1869, for restoration to rank as determined 

at the time of their gmdu!.!>tion, to the Committee on Naval Affairs. 

By J\.Ir. WALLS : The memorial of the LegislatuTe of Florida, for an appropriation to improve the Haulovel' between Musquito Lagoon 

and Indian River, in Flol'ida, to the Committee oli Commel'ce. 

Also, the memorial of the Legislature of Florida, for an appropriation to improve the Ocklawaha Ri:ver, to the Committee on Commerce. Also, the memorial of the Legislature of Florida, requesting appropriations for certain harbor and river improvements in the State of 

:Florida, to the Committee on Commerce. · Also, the memorial of the Legislature of 'Florida, for the establishment of a mail-route from Pilatka to Haw Creek, },lorida, to the Committee on the Post-Office and Post-Roads. 

By· Mr. WHEELER: A communication from Brigadier-General A. 

A.. Humphreys, Chief of Engineers, relative toestima~esforthe improvement of Ashtabula Harbor, to .the Committee on Commerce. .AL~o, papel'S relating to discontinuing the use of the cutter Relief as a. revenue-cutter, and·using it for a boarding station in Mobile Bay, 

to the Committee on Commerce. 

By ~Ir. WOOD : The petition of.Edmund Woog for a pension, to the 

Committee on Invalid Pensions. 

IN SENATE. 

TUESDAY, February 17, 1874. 

Prayer by Rev. E . D. OWEN, of Washington. 

On motion of Mr. FENTON, and by unanimous consent, the reading 

of the Journal of yestel'day's proceedings was dispensed with. 

COAST SURVEY REPORT. 

The PRESIDENT p1·o tempore lai<l. before the Senate a letter of the 

Secretary of the Treasury, inclosing the report of the Superintendent 

of the Coast Survey, of the operations of that serviqe during the year 

ending November 1, 1873 ; a motion to print which was referred to 

the Committee on Printing. 

PETITIO~S AND MEMORIALS. 

Mr. SCHURZ. I beg leave to present the petition of several banks 

and prominent business men of Saint Louis, respectfully represent.inrr 

that they view with alarm the propositions before Congress for i.J~ creasing the volume of United States notes; that they believe that 

any additional issue of paper money by the Government would be most inj~rrious to the interests of the nation; that the country is now snffermg, and has been for the past twelve years, great loss and inconvenience arising from an irredeemable currency. The petitioners beg 

leave to represent most earnestly that the resumption of specie pay- ~ents at the earli~t practicable time is imperatively required by the 

mterests of the nation, and they most respectfully deprecate the issue· of nny more leg~l-t~nder n_?tes, as such a prooeeding would be understood as postpomng rndefimtely a l'eturn to a somlfl financial condition. 

I move tho reference of this petition to the Committee on Finance. 

The motion was agreed to. 

Mr. PRA.TT pre ented the petition of :Mrs. Hester Stoll, widow of 

Urbin Stoll, praying to be allowed a pension; which was referred to 

the Committee on Pension . 1\fr . .ANTHONY presented the petition of the Grand Division of the 

Sf!nS of Temperance of the State of Rhode I land, signed by W. D. ~1lton ~nd ?ther office!s, praying for the appointment of a commisSIOn of ;nqmr;y concermng ~he alcoholic liquor traffic, its rel:1tions to 

paupensm, crnne, the pnbhc hen.lth, and general welfare; which wa-s ordered to lie on the table. 

Mr. BUCKINGHAM presented the petition of the Methodist Episcopal church, of ~lairstown, New Jersey, signed by the pastor anll 

other officers, prayrng for the appointment of a commission of inquixy 

concerning the alcoholic liquor traffic, its relations to pauperism, crime, 

the public health, and general welfare;, which was ordered to lie on 

the table. 

J\.Ir. SCOTT presented the petition of D. K. Blaine and other citi- zens of Beaver County, Pennsylvania, praying for the appointment 

of a .commission of. inqu~·y concernin~ the alcoholic liquor traffic, its 

relatiOns to panpensm, crnne, the public health; and general welfare; 

which was ordered to lie on the table. Mr. FRELINGHUYSEN presented the petition of the Yellow Frame 

Presbyterian church of the Newton Presbytery of the State of New 

Jersey, signed by Rev. R. B. Foresman, pastor, and other officers, 

praying for the appointment of a commission of inquiry concerning 

the alcoholic liquor traffic, its relations to pauperism, cl'imeJ the pub- lic health, and general welfare ; which was ordered to lie on the 

table. 

Mr. CRAGIN. I have received several memorials which Twill pre- sent to the Senate in relation to the Nautical .Almanac: one from the 

American Philosophical Society, at Philadelphia; another from the 

Academy of Natural Sciences, at Philadelphia; another from certain 

citizens of Philadelphia; another from the. Franklin Institute; and 

I may be pardoned if I simply read the preamble and resolution of 

the Franklin Institute, as they are very brief: 

Whereas the Franklin Institnte learns with mnch regret of the intention of 

the Government, at Washington, to curtail the amonnt of a~propriations for the 

United States Nautical Almanac; and whereas, in the opirnon of this Institute 

the .r autical Almrmac is one of the most practically nsefnl of thoso efforts of 

Amorica,n science which stand before the world nnsnrpasscd by any other nation; 

and whereas, in the economy of the mana~ement of this great national work, as well as in the a-ccuracy of the details which it furnishes, the Nautical Almanac 

is an object of pride to onr citizens, a. necessity for onr commerce, and a model tQ 

other conntries : Therefore, 

Be it rc.~olvod, That the Franklin Institute res:eectfully petitions Con~s rather 

to increase than to diminish the appropriation for an object so cathohc, so neces- sary, and so creditable to the conntry. 

.A.s the Committee on Appropriations have reported the naval 

appropriation bill,"! move that these memorials lie on the table. 

The motion was agreed to. 

Mr. STEVENSON presented the memorial ol certain loyal citizens 

of Kentucky a-sking an appropriation to Mrs. Vaughan and Mrs. Jackman of $25,000 each for patriotic services rendered the Government during the late rebellion; which was referred to the Committee on Military Affairs. Mr. DAVIS presented the petition of Hans W. Phillips, · Clark 

Hanes, and John Beam, of Wheeling, West Virginia, praving com- pensation for five-eighths of the steamer Planter, alleged to have 

been captured by the rebels in the port of Mobile, condemned and 

sold as a prize; which was referred to the Committee on Claims. 

Mr. GOLDTHW A.ITE pre ented the petition of the Board of Trade 

of Mobile, praying for an appropriation to complete the opening of 

the bars in Mobile Bay; which was referred to the Committee on 

Commerce. He also presented a memorial of the Board of Trade of Mobile, pra,ying for an appropriation to orgt'Lnize the United States mint a.t New 

Orleans; which was referred t.o the Committee on Finance. He also presented the petition of Geor_g_e W. Stuart1 praying com- pensation for services rendered to R. H. li:ousseau while minister to 

Hondura-s; which was referred to the Committee on Claims. ~Ir. CONKLING. I present the petition of John B. Perry, praying 

that a national convention may be called to meet at Philadelphia on the 4th of July, 1876, to make a declaration of peace-" peace on earth, 

good will to men." I have some doubt about the reference which 

should be given to this petition, but I move that it go to the Committee on the J ndiciary. 

The motion was agreed to. · Mr. CONKLING presented the petition of Division No. 263 of the 

Sons of Temperance of the State of New York, si~ed by its officers, 

praying for the appointment of a commission of mqniry concerning 

the alcoholic liquor traffic, its relations to pa.uperism, crime, the public health, and general welfa,re; which was ordered to lie on the table. 

Mr. SUMNER presented the petition of the members of the con- gregati~n .of the Reformed church of Newark, New Jersey, signed by 

Rev. William J. R. Taylor, pastor, and other officers, praying for the 

appointment of a commission of inquiry concerning the alcoholic 

liqnol' traffic, its relations to pauperism, crime, the public health, and 

general welfare; which wag ordered to lie on the table. 

He also presented the petition of citizens of Vineland, Cumberland 

County, New Jersey, praying that a pension may be gTanted to Rhoda. 

Hart, widow of Phrnbus Hart, and mother of LewiR Hart, who died 

while in the service of the United States; which was referred to the 

Committee on Pensions. 

J\.Ir. GORDON. I present the petition of S. E. Allen and 44 others, 

who cl:rim that they were entitled to 20 per cent. additional compensation for services in the Treasury Department under the joint reso- lution of February 28, 1 67. It seems that their petition was not 

allowed by the Court of Claims. They nowrepresentthattheSupreme 

Court of the United States reversed the decision of the Court of Claims, 

and they ask to be restored to their position in that court. I move the reference of this petition to the Committee on the Judiciary. The motion was agr ed to. J\.Ir. BUCKINGHAM presented a letter from the acting Secretary of 

the Interior, addressed to the chairman of the Committee on Indian 
]542 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD. FEBRUARY 17, 

Affairs, accompanying a copy of a r eport of Inspector E. C. Kemble in relation .to the condition of the Indians of the Siletz agency, in 

Oregon; which was referred to the Committee on Indian AJfairs, and 

ordered to be printed. · 

CUSTOMS-REVENUE SERVICE. 

l\fr. FENTON. I present a petition in re~ard to the customs-reve- nue service, and upon which I should be glau to submit a few remarks. This petition is signed by merchants of Now York, generally, and I 

do not know but all of them importers. I will take the liberty to 

read a sentence from their petition which presents the case better 

than any words of mine could do. They sa.y: 

Deeply impressed with the importance of reform in the customs-revenue service 

of the country, including the practices of agents, informers, and oflicials,..aml of 

the reduction of the enormous sums received as alaries and perquisites, werespectfuliv ur15e E)arly and favorable action upon the bill of Senator FK~"'TON, "to r~<TU.lat.e 

the serviCe in the collection of customs at the various port of entry in the united 

States and the disposition of fines, penalties, and forfeitures incurred under the 

laws relating to customs. and for other purpo es." Wo believe this bill, should it become a law, would remedy in a great measure the evils of which we have just reason w complain. 

Mr. Pre identt~he bill to which these petitioners referwa~ presented 

to the Senate a little more than two years ago, and refen-ed to th 

Committee on Finance. That'committee, after consultation with many 

persons who were familiar with the customs-revenue service of the 

oountry, and who were competent to advise, and with officers of the 

T:rea.sury Department, and especially with the then Secretary of the 

Treasury, reported the bill, verylittlo changed, to the Senate. I was unanimously instructed by the committee to ask for early action 

upon it. 

The bill thus perfected, as we believe, propo eel to equalize, or rather 

to adjust upon the basis of salaries, the compensatiQn of customs officers, so that those occupying principal positions whose services in any 

other department of human activity would be considered at least 

amply compensated at '5,000 or '10,000 a yea.r, should not have the 

opportunity-of ma.king from 75,000 to l OO,OUO a year, as now. It 

also propo ·ed to sweep awa.y the whole system of moieties, the evils 

of which are a grievous burden, indeed one of the greatest afflictions 

to American trade. I am justified in saying that this moiety busines , supplemented by the act of l\Iarch 2, 1867, authorizing the seizure of 

books and p:1pers, is the source of numberless extortions and iniqui- ties on the part of the cu tom-house officers, agent , and informers. 

The bill n.lso proposed to simplify the whole customs-revenue ma- chinery, so that the importer upon the one hand, and the Government 

upon the other, whose interests are identical, should be fairly and 

faithfully protected. 1\fr. President, I endea:vored again and again, in vain, to secure the 

favorable attention of the Senate to the bill thus reported. I wa met first by the honorable Senator from Connecticut, the chairman of 

the Committee on Retrenchment, [1\fr. BucKINGHAl\I,] with the statement that that committee had in charge the investigation of New 

York customs-service affairs, and that delay was important, to the end 

that the light of their observation, when their report was sub1nitted, 

should be cast upon the subject. Unfortunately, their report lingered 

until the last days of the ession, and the bill was not reached. At the last session I made further efforts to bring the bill before 

this body, and I was there met :by the chairman of the Committee on Commerce, [Mr. CHANDLER.] speaking for that commit-tee, that they 

thought it was a subject that properly should go before the Commit- tee on Commerce. Finally, despairing of securing action otherwise, 

I moved its reference to that committee. But two months passed of 

that session, and it slumbered, so far as the Senate knew, in the pigeon- h oles of the committee-room. Again at the beginnin~ of this e ion, on the very first day, I 

moved the reference of this bill to the Committee on Commerce. I 

it too much to a k now, is it too mnch to expect, that the committee 

will soon report the bill, or something better if they can i I at lea~t. 

j oin my voice with these memorialists, in the hope that the grav 

abu es, of which few can now plead ignor~ce, may be uprooted and 

destroyed. They arei to ay the least, a reproach upon our Government, and no person or party in authority can longer afford to be indifferent to the demn.nd for reform which now comes to u from so many quarters. · I move the reference of this petition to the Committee on Com- merce. 'rhe motion was a,greed to. l\Ir. BUCKINGHAM subsequently said : In risi.ng to a k leave to 

introduce a bill, I wish to say a wonl in reference to a remark mnd 

by the Senator from New York_[Mr. FEl\"'TON] this morning. Hereferred to a committee of which I was chairman, and which was in 

existence orne two years ago, and stated, in substance, that action was delayed on a bill in whiCh he felt particularly interested on the 

g1·ound that the committee authorized to investigate certain char~es 

at the custom-house in New York had the matter under consideration 

and hoped to make some report upon it. He stated, in substance, 

that that report was delayed so long that no proper act.ion conlu b 

taken by the Senate. I uo not suppose he rc::illy int ndeu that we should infer tha.t he charged us with nnnece a.ry clolay. Mr. FENTON. No, Mr. President; I remarked that unfortunately 

the report did not rea<lh us until the closing days of that se sion. I 

made no reflection on the committee. 

. ~Ir. B CKINGHAl"\1. · I beg leave to say that the1:e wa no want of 

diligence on the part of tba.t committee, or any member of that com- mittee; and there was no rea on why that report shonld not have been 

ma.Ue before except that there was actually no time. That is all I b.l1ve 

to say on that ubject. · 

PAPERS WITHDRAWN AND REFERRED. 

On motion of 1\fr. BORE~IAN, it was 

Ordere j, That C. S. Bell have leave to withdraw the papers filed with his memo. rial her 1vfore r eferred to the Committee on :l'lfilitar,y Affairs. 

On motion of .Mr. FRELINGHUYSEN, it wa 

Ordered, That the petition and papers of Sarah F . Staple.", in bPhalf of tbe heirs 

of tho ·la.to .John Ros~, be taken from the files and r eferred to tho Committee on Claims. 

On motion of Mr. PRATT, it wa. 

Ordered, Th.<tt the paper in the ca-<>e of Samuel .John on, of Now Orleans, praying compensation for the u e of, and occupancy by the Unit.ell tates of, certain 

houses aud lots in that city from .July, 18G2, to October, 18G5, be taken from tho 

files and ~·eferred to the Committee on Claims. 

On motion of Mr. LOGAN, it wa 

. Ordered, That t~ e petition and papers of the officers of the Seventh Cavalry, praymg for compensation for loss of property causell by the burning of tl!ci.r quarters at Fort Buford, Dakota Territory, be taken from tho files and referred to the Com.• mitteo on .Military .A.ffuirs. 

.REPORTS OF COl\Il\llTTEE • 

Mr. LOGAN, from the Committee on Iilitary Affairs, t.o whom was referred the bill (S. No. 379) for the relief of Nathan Cole, late cap- tain Twenty-third Regiment Veteran Re erve Corps, reJ)Orted it without amendment. He also, from the same committee, to whom wa referred the bill 

(H. R. No. 1224) for the relief of William J . Denniston, late an act- ing lieutenant Seventieth New York Volunteers, reported it withont 

amendment, and submitted a report thereon; which wa ordered to 

be printed: 

He also, from the same committee, reported an amendment by W[bY 

of substitute for the bill (S. No. 320) to increa e the Pay Department 

of the Army, reported from the committee on the 3d instant. l\Ir. PRATT, from the Committee on Claims, to whom was referred 

the memorial of T.·T. Garrard and others, claiming compen ation for 

the destruction of their salt, salt-wel.Th, &c., in Clay County, Kentucky, by United States troops, in 1 62, submitted a report, accom- panietl by a bill (S. No. 4~6) for the relief of those suffering from the 

destruction of the salt-works near Manchester, Kentuck-y, pursu:mt 

to the orders of Major-General Carlos Buell. The bill was reatl ancl passed to a second reading, and the report was orcleretl to bo printed. 

Mr. SCOTT. The Committee on Claims, to whom was referred the 

bill (S. No. 171) for the benefit of the legatees of A bnry Dickin , clecea ed, have instructed me to report the same back with a recom- mendation that it be indefinitely postponed. This is accompaniecl with a written ropo:rt, and as I believe one of the members of the 

committee desires to submit the views of the minority, and a bill on the sa.me subject has pa ed the other House, I suppose it may go on the Calendar. · The report was ordered to be printed, and the bill to be placed on the Calendar, with the ad ver e report of t.he committee. Mr. MITCHELL. I desire to submit the viows of the minority of 

the committee on that case, and a k that they be printed .with the 

report of the committee. · · · The PRESIDJ<JNT pro tempm·e. That order will be made. 

Mr. SPENCER, from the Committee on l.lilitary Affaii's to whom wa~ referred the petition of a committee of tho American Institute of 

Homeopathy a king an extension of the signal ervice o as to obtain 

information for the benefit of the public health, submitteclanaclver e report thereon ; which was ordered to be printed, and the committee was dischar~ecl from the further consiclera.tion of the petition. 

l.fr. SPENt;ER. I am also instructed by the same committee to a k 

that tho petition of Willia,m McCarrick, praying for arrears of bounty, 

be recommitted to the committee for further consideration, as orne new evidence has been presented in the case. The PRESIDENT JWO ten~pore. That order will be made if there 

be no objection. · . Mr. SPENCER, from the Committee on l\filit:uy Affair , to whom was referred t.he bill (S. No. 10, ) to relinquish the intere t of the 

United States in certain. la.n<ls to the city and connty of San Fran- cisco, in the State of California, reported it without amen1lment. Mr. CRAGIN, from the Committee on NavalA.fi'a.irn, to whom was referred the bill ( . No. 342) for tho r elief of the officer · a nil crew of 

the United Sta.tes ships Wyoming and Ta Kiang, reported it witlwnt 

amendmerrt. l.fr. CRAGIN. The committee make no written report at thi s- sion in this ca e, aclopting the report p:tade at the las sion of tho 

last Con~ess. 

Mr. MERRD\fON, from the Committee on Claims, to whom was referrecl the petition of Silas HuTd, Seth Hurd, and oth rs of Connecticut, praying to be allowed compensation for o::unnges for c·cr- tain injuries to their "fi bing place" by persons in the employm nt 

of the nited tate , ubmitted.an ad>er~e r c>J ort thereon; , hich was orderecl to lJo priutecl, alHl th ommittee We s discharged. from the 

f-urth r con~illcration of the petition. 
1874. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD. ·1543 

Mr. ALLISON, from the Committ~e on Pensions, to w~om was r eferred the petition of George Reisinger, of Oregon,_ prayrng for a pension, reporte(l adversely thereon, and asked to be discharged from 'its further consideration; which wa.s agreed to. 

BILLS INTRODUCED. 

1\fr. BOGY asked, and by unanimous consent obtained1 leave to 

introduce a bill (S. No. 497) to repe~l ~he fourteenth s~c~10n of the ~wt entitled" An act making appropnatwns for sundry Civil expen es of the Government for th.e year ending June 30, 1871," approved July 

15 1870; which was read twice by its title. Mr. BOGY. I desire this bill to be in lieu of the bill introduced 

by me yesterday. . I also ~ove that the memorial which ~ presented 

yesterday on the same subJect be r eferred to the Committee on Indian Affairs. I see by the RECORD this morning that it was referred 

to the Committee on the Judicin.ry. My intention was to h ave h ad 

it referrea to the Committee on Indian Affairs. I move now that the 

memorial be withdrawn from the Commit tee on-the Judiciary and 

referred to the Committee on Indian Affairs with this bill. 

Mr. CONKLING. Will the Renator from Missouri state to what 

matter this rel:ites Y The formal reference to a section of a law does 

not give us the subs~ance. , . . M:r. BOGY. It is in relation to some lands located m what ISca~ed 

the Black Bob reservation in Kansas- the Shawnee reservatwn. Those lands were surveyed many years ago and patented to tho_ Indians. The condition of the patent was that they ~ould not be alien- a.tcd. Since then it has become a matter of necessity for these lands 

to be disposed of and go into the hands of white settlers who are 

th~~~ . The PRESIDENT pro ten~po1'e. The question is on the motiOn of the 

Senator from Missouri. 

The motion was agreed to. 

1\fr. GORDON asked, and by unanimous c~msent ?btained, leav~ to 

introduce a bill (S. No. 498) to· repeal a certam port?-on of ~he ~ens1on 

laws, and for other purposes; which was read tw1ce by I~s title, re- ferred to the Committee on Pensions, and ordered to be prmted. 

Mr. HITCHCOCK a-sked and by unanimous consent obtained, leave 

to introduce a bill (S. No. 499) to authorize the issue ~f a supply 

of arms to the authorities of the State of Nebra,ska; which was read 

twice by its title, referr.ed to the Committee on l\filitary Affairs, and 

ordered to be printed. · Mr. SPENCER a.sked, and by unanimous consent obtained, lo..1 v~ to 

introduce n, bill (S. No. 500) for the relief of Dr. John. B. Read; :w:hich was read twice by its title, and referred to the Comnnttee on Military 

Affairs. 1\fr. ANTHONY asked and by unanimous consent obtained, leave 

to introduce a bill (S. N~. 501) providing for the appointment of two 

members of the Senate and three of the House of Representatives on the board of examiners to the Naval Asylum; which was read twice 

by its title, referred to the Committee on Naval A:ffuirs, and ordered 

to be printed. 

1\fl:. STEVENSON asked, and by unanimous ·consent obtained, leave 

to introduce a bill (S. Ne. 502) f?r the relief of l\~s. M~ha :yaughn 

and Mrs. Louisa Jackman; whiCh was read twice by Its tiule, and 

referred to the Committee on Military Affair8. · Mr. PRATT asked,· and by unanimous consent obtained, leave to 

introduce a bill (S. No. 503) for the relief qf Susan R. l\1oore, the relative and leO'atee of Phoobe Schofield, a pensioner; which was read 

twice by it.s0title, ::md referred to the Committee on Pensions. 

Mr. SARGENT asked and by unanimous consent obtained, leave to 

introduce a bill (S. No: 504) for the relief of certain homestead and 

pre-emption settlers on the pu~lic lands; w_hich was read twice by 

its title, referred to the Committee on Public Lands, and ordered to 

be printed. Mr. CARPENTER (1\fr. ANTHONY in the chair) asked, and by 

un"tnimous consent obtained, leave to introduce a bill (S. No. 506) to 

further protect the polls in the election of President, Vice-President, and members of Congress; which was read twice by its title, referred 

to the Committee on Privileges and Elections, and ordered to be 

printed. 1\Ir. BUCKINGHAM asked, and by unanimous consent obtained, 

l eave to introduce :1 bill (S. No. 505) to amend "An act making appropriations for the current and contingent expenses of the Indian 

Department and for fulfilling treaty stipulations with various Indian 

tribes, for the year ending _June 30, 1849, a_nd for oth~r pmJ>oses," 

approved July 29, 1848; which was read twice by Its t1~le, referred 

to the Committee on Indian Affairs, and or.dered to be prmted. 

T~'fBER AND HEDGES 0~ WESTERN PRAIRIES. 

"rr. WRIGHT submitted the following resolution; which was c·on- siLlerecllJy unanimous consent, and agreed to : 

R esolved That tl1e Committee on Public Lands be insb:"Ucted to consider the ex- p cdienc:y of further lewslation on the subject of ~~comaging tJle planting ancl cultivation of timber and hedges on the western prarrlCs, ana particularly whether it would not be expedient to 'l.Jllend the homestead law so as to ueduct from the time requirecl to perfect homestead title a reasonable number of months for each acre of timber aucl mile of h etlge phmted and cultivated t hereon. 

THE R~KL."'<G SYSTEM. 

Mr. BOGY. I offer the following resolution, which I will read: 

Resolved, That the Committee on Finance be, and is h ereby, directed to inquire into the expediency of providing that hereafter all banks shall be chartered or 

organizecl by the States, each State to decide the question as to the number of- banks and capital r equired for its legitimate wants, and each State to provirle such !!Ual'antees to depositors as may be dePmcd proper; all banks to be organized under the pronsions of a law requiring the deposit of bonds as now provided for national banks · the Federal Government to have the keeping of snch bonds and the issuing of the ~nrrenoy, and to be r esponsible for the redemption of the circulation. 

I am in favor, 1\fr. President, of a free-banking law. At the same time I can very well understand that a free-banking law may lead to verv QTeatfinancial troubles hereafter. It may cause verywildopera- tions~beyond all q~1estion. Nevertheles~, betw~en the. present restrict- ive system, confinmg the amount of crrculatwn which shall ~e used 

by this entire nation to a given amount of money, and openm~ the 

question wide to an unlimited amount of money- of the two evils, I 

would prefer the latter; recognizing one as well as the other, however, to be an evil. . . . . . Now sir, without ·detammg the Senate any length_ of time, 1t cl~es 

seem~ me that in leaving the quest~on to the States we.are p~tting back the great question of the creatiOn of banks where It ongmally 

belongs to the States, and not in the Federal Governmen'i. T'lere are States that require and want no banking circulation. California 

has as a basis gold and silver; so has Nevada, so has Oregon. 

Mr. MORRILL, of Maine. Will the Senator yield to me for a 

moment'i . Mr. BOGY. Certainly. M:r. MORRILL, of Maine. Is this a question on the presentation of 

a petition"' 

The PRESIDENT p1·o tenLp~re. On the offering of a resolution. The 

Senator from Mi"'souri has given notice that he desired to offer a res- olution which he has read, upon which he is commenting. Mr. ~IORRILL, of Maine. I feel at liberty to raise this question, 

because my honorable friend, I know,~ not suspect me of ~ny clesire to take him off the floor on any occasiOn. But, 1\Ir. President, I 

think a practice is growing up here, and indeed has grown up recently, 

of addressing the Senate upon the presentation, or offer to present, 

of resolutions and petitions, which, it seems to me, is a very great 

hinderance to business, especially t.he business of the morning hom; 

and therefore, I feel quite at liberty to raise the question at this tim~ a-s to the regularity of this proceeding. I raise the que tion of 

order whether the Senator from l\fissomi is proceeding in order. The PRESIDEl~T p1'o tempore. The morning hour is undoubtedly 

intended under the rules, for business, not debate; and the remarks, 

of the S~nator from Missouri are out of order if objected to by any 

Senator. But this sort of debate has grown up within the last year or two, and ha-s proceeclcd'by common consent, so that t~e C_hair does 

not feel at liberty to call a Senator to order; but on obJeCtiOn made 

by any Senator, the Chair will rule that. all_ deb_ate is out of order. The Senator from Maine objects, and the Charr will rule that further 

debate is out of order. 1\lr. CONKLING. Merely for the sake of personal, individual information I inquire of the Chair, under what rule or rules of the Senate 

debate 'on presenting a petition is out of order 'i · . 

The PRESIDENT pro ten~pore. So far as t·he present occupant of 

the chair is informed, the rules are almost silent about morning busi- ness. There is nothing about the morning hour in the rules that the 

present occupant of the chair can find. But the practice of the Sen- · ate as he is informed, has been, until very recently, to devote the 

mo{·ning hour to business, and not to debate. Mr. CONKLING. If the Chair and the Senator from Missouri will 

indulge me in a remark, I beg to say that I h.ave ~o d?ubt the Chair 

is quite wann.nted, by a reference to recent trmes, m ~ remar~ that 

the practice of the Senate has been as stated; but I think the hiStory 

of the Senate will not vindicate the statement of the Chair. I had 

occasion recently to turn over a volume of the speeches of Mr. Web- ster and I was surprised to see the length of the remru·ks submitted 

bv Mr. Webster when a member of this body upon presenting peti- tions and often petitions not among the gravest which were presented . I thiA.k the history of former times will show that that was quite the 

practice. 1\fy recollection of the rule is that it requires that, previous 

to a petition being read, if it is r ead, a brief statement shall be made 

of the substance of the petition; and I know of no other rule bearing 

upon the question. I am very glad attention has been called to this 

matter and I think it is very well to have an understanding about it; 

and I ~in inclined to think the Senator from Missouri is quite within 

the written rules of the Senate. 

Mr. MORRILL, of 1\!aine. My object was, more than anything else to call the attention o-f the Senate to what I regard as a practice' certainly not in harmony with the proper tmnsaction of the 

business of the Senate; and having done that, as my honorable 

friend fTom Missouri is probably 11repared to make a statement of ~ 

views at this time, I will not raise the q11estion of order, but I give 

notice so that ;pobody nee<.l be taken by surprise that hereafter, with a view ~f bringing the attention of the Senate to this pract ice, I -will 

raise this question. 

Mr. CONKLll\G. Is t his a resolution which the Senator is debating'? 

1\fr. fORRILL, of 1\fa.ine. Yets, sir. 

l\Ir. CONKLING. Then I be:; to take back as much of what I 

said as grew out of my misapp1·cheusion. I supposetl the Senator wns speaking to a petH:i?n .. If it is a resoluti?n un~oubtedly t~e 

rule prevails that one obJectiOn would compel 1t to he over; and if 

it lies over, of course it is not in order to debate it. I supposed the 

Senator from ~fissouri was speaking to a petition. 
1544 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD. FEBRUARY 17, 

Mr. BOGY. I had really got through my remarks. i move that 

the resolution be referred to the Committee on Finance. 

The PRESIDENT pro tempore. The resolution has now b~en sent 

to the desk, and it will be read. 

The Chief Clerk read the resolution. The PRESIDENT pro ten~pm·e. Is there objection to the present 

consideration of this resolution Y The Chair hears none. :Mr . .ANTHONY. Upon that point, the resolution having been 

received by general consent, the question that is now under consideration of the Senate is debatable, I -presume. 

The PRESIDENT pro tempore .. Undoubtedly. 

Mr . .ANTHONY. Then it seems to me that the Senator from Missouri was quite in order. He offered a resolution, and moved its refer- ence; and upon that motion, it seems to me, he hadarighttoaddress 

the Senate. The PRESIDENT pro tempm·e. The Chair clid not understand the 

Senator from :Missouri to move its reference. He gave notice that he 

desired to introduce a resolution, which he said he would read. 

Having read it he proceeded to debate it. He did not offer it; it was not sent to the table; it was not reported to the Senate; and he did 

not a k for its present consideration at that time. 

Mr. ANTHONY. The rea-son why I made the remark was that I was pr~nounced out of order, not by the Chair, but by some Senators, 

the other day, for doing precisely the thing which the Senator from 

Missouri has done, and which I think he has done in order, if he re- moved a reference. 

Mr. BOGY. The Chair misunderstood. I moved the reference of 

the resolution to the Committee on Finance. 

The PRESIDENT 1n·o tempore. The Chair did not so understand. If 

that is so he was mit> taken as to the status of the resolution. 1\fr. ANTHONY. I did not mean to arraign the decision. The PRESIDENT pro tentpm·e. In addition to that the Chair would 

remind the Senate that no motion can be made on a resolution until 

it is sent to the desk and is under consideration by the Senate. Previous to that time a motion to refer would be out of order. :Mr. BOGY. The Chair will indulge me, as I am one of tho youngest 

Sena,tors jn the body. · Mr . .ANTHONY. I beg to state that it was not mypurpose to arraign 

the decision of the Chair, but to refer to a similar procee(ling on my own part some days ago, which several Senators thought was out 

of order ; but I believe the Chair thought I was in order at that time. The PRESIDENT p1·o teutpore. subsequently s::hld : The Chair desire::~ 

to state, in regn.rd to the resolution which was offered by the Senator 

from 1is ouri, [ Ir. BOGY,] that the Sena.tor finally a-sked its present 

consideration, '1nd the Chair was in the act of putting the vote when 

tho Senator from Rhode Island rose, and the Chair awarded him the 

floor. The Chair will now again submit the question on agreeing to 

that resolution. The resolution was agreed to. 

now provided by law; and this provision shall first apply to the class of cadet en· :rtneers entei.ing the Academy in the year 1874, and to iJ1 subsequent classes· and 

that all acta or parts of acts inconsistent herewith be, and are hereby, repealed. 

. 1\Ir. CRAGIN. I will state that this amendment is simply exteudmg the term at the Naval Academy of cadet engmeers fmm two years ~o four, _so as to m:.1ke ~t co~Tespond with the change made last ye:1r m relat~on to ~ade~ nnilihip_men- the law also requiring two yeas'r 

sea-semce; this w1ll make SlX yeart>, the same as in the case of cadet 

midshipmen. It is all right, and is recommended by the Department · and I hope it will be adopted. ' 

The amendment was agreed to. 

1\Ir. CRAGIN. There is a verbal correction that should be made in 

the first line of sechlon 2. The date should be ":lOth" of J une instead 

of "13th." That is a typographical error, I presume. ' 

The PRESIDENT pro tentpm·e. That amendment will be made if 

there be no objection. ' 

I.Ir. C~AGIN. I .am instructed to offer a slight amendment to the 

:fi..n!t sectwn, t~ which_ I am sure there will be no objection. After 

the word "engmeer," m the last line, I move to insert the followinO' 

proviso: 0 

. P.rovided, That the regulanons of the Navy Department in relation to examinations, and amount of sea-service previous to such e:xruninations, be complied with. 

The amendment was agreed to. · 

The bill was reported to the Senate as amended and the amendments were concurred in. ' 

';('he ~ill was ordered to be engrossed for a third reading, read the 

third trme, and passed. 

On motion o! Mr. CRAGIN the title of the bill was amende(] so as to read : "A bill to change the titles of certain naval officers and for 

other purposes." ' 

ROBERT N. M'MILLAN. 

~he next bi)l on the C~lendar wa-s the bill (H. R. No. 1041) for the 

relief of Ro?ert N. Mcl\~~1ll,_late collector of customs and snp rintendent of lights for the district of Tecbe in the State of Louisiana· 

which. wa-s considered as in Committee of' the Whole. • ' 

It directs the proper accounting officers of the Treasury to adjust 

and settle t.he account oi Robert N. Mcl\lillan late collector of ens- toms and superintendent of lights for the di~trict of Teche in the 

State of L~uisiana, an~l to allow him the sum of $706.56, beincr the 

amount prud for salanes of keepers and assistant keepers of firrhthouses for the first quarter of the ye~u· 1861. 0 

1\Ir. WES~. I am no_t aware whether there is a report in this case, 

but I. cnn bnefly explam to tho Senate the circumstance . This Mr. 

McMillan _in ~861 wa-s the United States light-bouse uperintendent 

for t?at t~trwt, and was compelled by stress of circumstance in clisbursmg this amount of '706 to ta.ke receipts in the name of the Confederate St.ates of America,, and he was not creclited by the United 

States on his bonds for thn.t amount. The bill does not require ::my 

money from the Treasury, but merely enables him ·to adjust his ac- LIQUOR-'1'RAFFIC COJ\fMISSIO:N. counts. 

Mr. WRIGHT. I move that the Senate proceed to the considera.- Mr. CONKLING. How is he entitled to creclitf I did not hear the 

tion of Senate bill No. 161, to provide for the appointment of a com- Senator. -

mission on the ubject of the alcoholic liquor traffic. . Mr. ~ST. He was obliged in paying the money to the employes 

Mr. SCHURZ. Allow me to make a suggestion to the Senator from rn the L1ght-House Department to take receipt. in tille name of the 

Iowa. The consideration of the bill was objected to yesterday by Confederate States of America, as all the officers in the Southern States 

the Senator from Connecticut, not now in his seat, [1\Ir. FEr..&Y,] and were co~pelled to do at that time. He u ed the United States money. he thereby indicated that he desired: to debate it; and he being not The bill wa-s reported to the Senate without amendment ordered now here, I suggest to the Senator from Iowa to let the bill go over to a third reading, read the third time, and passed. ' 

for the present. SCIOTHA BRASHEARS. 

Mr. WRIGHT. If it can be understood that the bill shall not lose Tb 

•t 1 th Cal d I h 11 t b' t t th t' .e next b~ on the Calenrl.ar was the bill (S. No. 351) granting a I s P ace on e en ar, s a no 0 ~ec 0 e sugges !On. pension to Smotha ~rasbears, late of the Seventeenth Regiment KenThe PRESIDENT pro tempore. Dy order of the Senate made yes- tucky Cavalry; which was read the second time, and considered as in 

terday, this bill is placed at the head of the Calendar, and will re- Committee of the Whole. main there. · I 

RIGHT Th I h 11 b h ~ directs the Secretary of the Interior to pl ace on the pension-roll Mr. W · en s a not 0 ject to t. e postponement, for snb,]ec.t to the provisions and limitations of the pension laws, t-he nam~ the reason su<Ygested by the Senator from l\li souri. f s h 

The PRESIDENT pro tem1wre. The next bill on the Calendar will 0 ClOt a Brashears, late of the Seventeenth ReO'iment Kentucky 

be reported. :~. Cavalry, at the rate of eight dollars per month. 0 

TITLES OF NAvAL ENGINEERS. The bill was reported to the Senate without amendment, ordered 

Th CIIIE CLEBK Th t bill th C I d . th bill (S to be engrossed for a third reading, read the third time, and passed. e F . e nex on e a en ar IS e . No. 269) to chan<Ye the titles of certain naval officers. MATTHEW WOODRUFF. 

Mr. WEST. f must appeal to the Chair that that is not the next The next bill on the C::tlendn.rwas the bill (S. No. 365) for the relief 

bill on the Calendar. A bill has gone by twice, yesterday and to-day, of Matthew Woodru11', late first sergeant of Company G, Twenty-first 

to make room for this one; and the Senator fmm I owa consents that Missouri Volunteers; which was considered as in Committee of the we shall take it up and act upon it. Whole. The PRESIDENT pro tempore. The Senator fro·m Louisiana is mis- Mr. CONKLING. Is there a report in that case f 

taken as to the matter of fact. Senate bill No. 269 wa-s laid aside Mr. BOGY. I ask that the report be read. 

yesterday, because the chairman of the committee that reported it 'lllie Chief Clerk read the following report submitted, by Mr. SPEN- was not in his place. It ·was objected to and laid asjde; and each CER, from the Committee on Military Affairs, on the 23d of J anuary : 

morning the call of the Calendar commences at the point where it left Tho petition shows that the P' titioner enlisted .rune 15, 1 61, served honorably 

off the day before. and without absence or furlough until a.bout March, 1864, when he was dischargei-l The Senate, as in Comtnittee of the Whole, proceeded to consider by rea on of re-enlistment a-s a veteran, receiving then the nsual furlough with ills 

the bill ( S. No. 269) to change the titles of certain naval officers. re~ent;_ that he served faithfully as first-sergeant of his companyuntli about th~ The Committee on N"val A .a·arr· s reported the bill, "'""th ""n amend- 2d of April, IS6ti, nearl;y a year after the surrender of the enem:y, when 1·eceiving w .t:U..L "£ w intelliaence of his brotner's death1 and being called home to a.dniinist,er to the com- ment to strike out f,he words "and that all acts and parts of acts fort of a dependent father and &sters, one of whom was n. helpless invalid and 

inconsistent therewith be, and are hereby, repealed," and to insert as dependent up_on public chario/, he, being una.ble to obtain a furlough, left his com- t· 2 th f 11 · mand at Mobile, Alabama, Without leave and proceeded home. Rcturnin..,. to· his sec IOU e 0 owmg : . co~mand .aft:er an ~bs nce of twenty-six daJ:S, he. met his regiment on the"'way to SEc. 2. That from and after the 13th day of .Jnne, 1 74, the course of instruction .

1 

Samt Loms, It haVInrr been mm~tered out of serVIce. All the papers having b u at tlie Naval A cad my for cadet engineers :;lla.ll ]Jo four years, insteml of two as tmned over, the rolls could not be altered, and hence he wa-s reported as a deserter. 
1874. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD. 1545 

It was not hia intention to desert, the war being over, but to return t o hia command, 

his absence being temporary and brought about by the fortuitous circumstances 

stated. 

Lieutenant-Colonel Best, of his regiment, and other officers, corroborate this state- ment, and speak in the hiO"hest terms of hia long, arduous, and exemplary service as a good soldier. Colonel :Best, while admitting the petitioner did wrong, urges that the circumstances were extenuating, and recommends proper relief; and the 

proof shows the petitioner was sover.elywounded at the battle of Fort Blakely, Ala- bama, April 91 1865, from which he now suffers, and that he wa.s brave and gallant, participating m all the battles in which hia regiment was engaged. 

The bill was reported to the Senate without amendment, ordered 

to be engrossed for a third reading, read the third time, and passed. 

OLIVER POWERS. 

The next bill on the Calendarwasthe bill {S. No. 366) fortberelief 

of Oliver Powers ; which was read the second time, and considered as in Committee of the Whole. 

The bill declares that Oliver Powers, of Company K, Tenth Ten- nessee Cavalry, shall be allowed pay as private from the 15th dn.y of 

February, 1864, to the day of the mll.9ter-out and discharge of that 

company, together with such bounties and allo~ances as would have 

been due him by law had his name remained on the rolls of his 

company. _ The bill wa-s reported to the Senate without amendment, ordered 

to be engrossed for a third reading, read the third time, and passed. 

FRENCH SPOLIATION CLAIMS. 

The next bill on the Calendar was the bill (S. No.5) to provide for 

the adjustment and satisfaction of claims of American citizens for 

spoliatione committed by the French prior to the 31st day of July, 

1801. 

The PRESIDENT pro tentpore. Is there obJection to the present con- sideration of this billY 

Mr. PRATT. I object. 

The PRESIDENT pro tentpore. It will be laid aside. 

EXPORT BOND OF JOHN S. MILLER. 

The next bill on the Calendar was the bill (H. R. No. 483) to author- ize the cancellation of an export bonc.l for a portion of the distilled 

spirits of .JohnS. Miller, on boardof bonc.led cars of the United States; 

which-was considered as in Committee of the Whole. 

The bill proposes to authorize the Secretary of tbe Treasury, on the 

production of proof satisfactory to him of the destruction by fire of 

fifty barrels of alcohol without fraud, collusion, or negligence on the 

part of· JohnS. Miller, the owner of the alcohol, while the same was in the custody of the Unlted States, in bonded cars at Sterling, Illinois, in transitu for export to Buenos Ayres, in South America, on or about the 1!:5th of August, 1872, to cancel such bonds as may have been 

given for the exportation of the alcohol so destroyed; but bonding 

certificates are to be produced showing the bonding, a~ requirec.l by 

the regulations of the Secretary of the Treasury, of all a.lcohol or distilled spirits except the fifty barrels destroyed by fire included in 

these bonds. 

The bill was reported to the Senate without amendment, ordered 

to a third reading, read the third time, and passed. 

ALONZO V. RICHARDS. 

The next bill on the Calendar was the bill (S. No.100) for the relief 

of Lieutenant Alonzo V. Richards; which was considered as in Committee of the Whole. 

It proposes to direct the Paymaster-General to pay Alonzo V. Richards, late second lieutenant in the Signal Corps, United States Army, 

the pay a.nd allowances of a. second lieutenant of that corps from the 

22d of l\Iarch, 1864, to the 10t.h of 1\Iay, 1865, less the pay of a sergeant 

of the corps, received by him during that period. The bill was reported to the Senate without amendment, ordered 

to be engrossed for a third reading, read the third time, and passed . 

INQUIRY INTO CAUSES OF EPIDEMIC CHOLERA. 

The next business on the Calendar was the joint resolution (H. R. 

No. 29) authorizing the Secretary of War to detail medical officers of 

the Army to inquire into, and report upon, the causes of epidemic 

cholera; which was considered as in Committee of the Whole. 

The Committee on Military Affairs proposed to amend the joint res- olution so as t{) make it read: 

Whereas epidemic cholera prevailed during the ye.'ltr 1873 in various parts of the 

United Stn.tes, especially in the valley of the Mississippi, causin.,. de:J?lorable mor- ta.lity; and whereas it is hi$hl:V important that whenever such epi'aem1cs occur~ the 

fa.cts concerning the sprea.a of the disease aml its mode of propagation shoulu be ascertained as fully as possible, with d. view to the prevention or limitation of fu- ture outbreaks : Therefore, 

Resolved, &c., That the Secretary of War be, ap_d he is hereb:y, authorized and directed to detail one medical officer of the Army who shall, durmg the present year, 

under the direction of the Surgeon-General of the Army, in connection with the su- pervising surgeon of marine hospitals, acting under the direction of t he Secreta.!Jr 

of the Treasury, visit the towns at which cholera _prevailed during 187:l, or such of 

them as, in the opinion of the Surgeon-General and Secret.'\ry of the Treasury, may be necessary, confer with the health authorities and resident physicians of such 

towns, and collect, so far as po sible, all facts of importance with r egard to such 

epidemic, and shaJI make a detailed report of the inform..'l.-tion collected on or before 

the 1st day of .January, 1875, to the President, to be submitted to Congress. 

The amendments were agreed to. 

The joint resolution was reported to the Senate as amended, and the 

amendments were concurred in. 

It was ordered that the amendments be engrossed,.._'IDd the joint reso- lution read the third time. 

Mr. LOGAN. I a~k that this joint resolution be changed to a. bill. 

The PRESIDENT pro tempore. The Chair will inform the Sen- • ator that this being a House resolution, it is not usual to make the 

change, because it would interfere with the keeping of the records of 

the House of Representatives. 

1\fr. LOGAN. Very well; I ask that the title be changed so as to 

conform to the body of the resolution. 

1\fr. STOCKTON. Do I understand this resolution to be reported 

by the Committee on Military Affairs of the Senate T 

The PRESIDENT pro tempm·e. It is. 

1\fr. STOCKTON. I should like to inquire of that committee 

whether the Secretary of War needs an act of Congress to authorize 

him to detail a.n Army surgeon to go to any town in this country; and 

that seems to be the whole. object of the act. 

Mr. LOGAN. Under the law the Secretary of War cannot detail a surgeon to perform any duty except Army duty. This is duty outside 

of the :regular line of a surgeon's Army duty; and for that rea~on it 

requires an a.ct of Congress. 

:Mr. STOCKTON. That wa-s the simple question I wished to ask. 

If that is the opinion of the committee, I have nothing more to say. 

Mr. LOGAN. I do not think there is any doubt about the law in 

that particular. 

The joint resolution was read the third timfi), and passed. 

The PRESIDENT pro- tempm·e. The title will be amended as suggested by the Senator from Illinois, by strikin?, out the words "medical officers," and inserting, "a medical officer. ' 

1\t:ESSAGE FROM THE HOUSE. 

A message from the House of Representatives1 by Mr. LLOYD, its 

Chief Clerk, announced that the House had passed the following bills ; 

in which the concurrence of the Senate was requested: 

A bill (H. R. No. 2073) restricting the refunding of CllStoms duties 

and prescribing certain regulations of the Treasury Department ; 

and 

A bill (H. R. No. 1284) authorizing the chief clerk of the War Department to sign requisitions on the Trea-sury during the temporary 

absence of the Secretary of War. -

NATIONAL-BANK CIRCULATION. 

The PRESIDENT pro tempore. The morning hour having expired, 

the Senate resumes the consideration of the unfinished business, which 

is the bill {S. No. 432) to amend the act entitled 'fAn act to provide 

for the redemption of the 3 per cent. temporary-loan certificates and 

for an increase of national-bank notes," approved July 12, 1870; and 

the question is on-the motion of the Senator from Connecticut [Mr. 

BUCKINGHAM] to recommit the bill to the Committee on Finance. 

1\fr. WRIGHT. Mr. President--

Mr. MERRIMON. I desire to offer an amendment. 

The PRESIDENT pro tempore. An amendment is not in order at 

the present time. The motion is to recommit the bill to the com- mittee. 

Mr. MERRIMON. But I wish to make an amendment to that mo- tion. · 

The PRESIDRNT pro tempore. That would be out of order. 

Mr. MERRll10N. I beg to be heard on that point. 

The PRESIDENT p'ro tempore. Certainly, the ChaiT will hear .the 

Senator. If the proposition is to instruct the committee, it is in 

order. ~fr. MERRIMON. That is it. 

The PRESIDENT pro tempore. That is in order undoubtedly, but 

the Chair did not understand the Senator as proposing to do that. 

1\fr. MERRil\fON. I move to amend the motion to recommit by 

providingThat the committee be, and they are hereby, instructed to report, aa soon a-s practicable, a bill providing for the increase of the national-bank circulation, so that the 

whole volume thereof shall not exceed 00,000,000. 

___ Mr. WRIGHT. Mr. President, when on yesterday afternoon I took • the floor, it was with no purpose on my part to make a speech on tho 

subject now before the Senate; and if any one suppo ed from my havin~ the floor at the time of t.he adjournment that that. was my 

intontwn, I wish to nndec ive him at once. At the time of the adjournment the question before tho Senate was on recommitting thiM 

bill, on the motion of 1Jle Senator from Connecticut, [l\1r. BucKINGHAl\1.] The Senator from North Carolina [Mr. :MERRIMON] now propo es to amend that, by recommitting the bill with instructions. 

I think it not unimportant that we recur to the history of this question in the Senate at tho present session. · It will be remembered that some weeks since a resolution was offered by the chairman of the Committee on Finance, [Mr. SHERMAN,] and purporting to come from that committe , instructing it to 

bring in a bill looking, as I term it, to conditional resumption. That was followed by an amendment proposed by the Senator from Delaware, [Mr. BAYARD,] looking to absolute or unconditional resumption. That was moved to be amended by the Senator from :Michigan [Mr. FERRY] by a proposition looking to an increase of cunenoy, 

either in greenbacks or n ational-bank paper. His proposition was general, looking to an increase in currency. We di'3cus ed that question some two or three weeks, the object being to obtain a vote upon one or all of these propositions, that the Committee on Finance might have some instructions, somo guide-know somewhat of the course they shoulll take. 
1546" CONGRESSIONAL RECORD. FEBRUARY 1 7, 

I deem it not improper here to say-I do not think that I do more than is my duty, nor yet reveal anything imt>roper in the action of 

the committee-that I wa-s opposed to this proceeding. My prefer- ence was that we should report a bill to the Senate covering a far as possible the general subject, which b~ing before the Senate and 

discussed, when we reached a vote aml dispo ed of it we should reach a practical result. I remember that I maintained then, as I do now, 

that after we had had all the discussion upon the general propositions, ·and the committee were then in. tructed generally and brought 

i,n our bill, we should have the same discussion over again, and that · it were better that we reported a bill at once. \Vhen it was said to me, 

"We can probably not agree upon a bill now," I said, "We c:m. agree 

upon a bill as well a-s upon this r e olution," because we did not agree 

upon that. However, the proposition was presented to the Senate, 

amendments were suggested, as I have already stated, and we had 

the di!:;cussion. · Now, i submit to the Senate, what would have been thought of a proposition to 1·ecommit that resolution in the p:ridst of that discussion, when the very object of the committee in presenting the resolution was _to obtain the sense of the Senate upon the general question Y 

If the resolution had been recommitted, the committee would have 

been no wiser, would have had no instructions to aid or assist them, 

any more than when they reported the resolution. That resolution, 

however, was laid a ide, and the bill now before the Senate was brought to our attention. Contrary to the expectation of the com- mittee, it was proposed here, as it is now, to ingraft upon. that bill some matters that are outside of its general purport. 

The bill, it will be remembered, only provide~, a ha-s been said 

here, for carrying out an existing statute to provide for the redistribution of , 25,000,000 of national-bank currency. It was supposed by 

the committee that we could po ibly, by introducing that bill and 

getting a-ction upon it, accomplish what everybody conceded wa-s but 

proper, so far as concerned the circulation of the banks provided for 

by existing statutes. I say, however, that contrary to what was expected amendments have been proposed to that bill which bring 

up the general subject whether we shall have an increase of currency, 

whether we shall have an addition to the banking circulation in a limited amount, or whether we shall have an increase in the way of 

free bariking. All of these questions, :m.d more, a~·e before the Senate. · 

When the subject is in this condition, and before any vote has been 

taken by the Senate, it is proposed to recommit this bill. It appea~·s 

to me that if the1·e was any policy in introducing the original resolu- tion for the pmpose of obtaining the sense of ~he .Senate, if it was important to the committee that they should have an expression of 

the sentiment of the Senate on that subject, it is equally important 

that we should have it now; and to ask that this bill shall be recom- mitted before we have an expression irom the Senate is, it seems to me, 

to admit that we have had these four, :five, or six weeks of debate 

without accomplishing any pmcfical result. I therefore think, and 

I submit to the chairman of the Committee on Finance and the friends 

of either side of this proposition, whether it be conditional or absolute resumption, or for an increa-se of currency, that it were better 

that we have an expression of the Senate on the questions involved, 

and when we have such expression, then I think no one would object 

that the bill should be recommitted, if it was deemed necessary or advisable for the purpose of perfecting its details. When we have 

had such an expres ion, I have no doubt the committee would carry 

out the sense of the Senate, whatever might be the views of individual members of the committee on the subject that was committed 

to them. I therefore shall oppose the motion to recommit at this 

tinie. I think it but fall> in view of what has taken place here; I 

think it but fair in view of what was asked by the committee; I 

think it but fair in view of what are known to be the views of mem- bers of the committee, that the Senate should give some expre sion 

to its views, and act either upon this bill or upon some other bill 

before the subject is recommitted to the committee. It seems to me that that is logical also. It seems to me that if we recommit this bill 

at this time, without any expre sion of sentiment, it will nece arily 

follow that the committee, not having any instructions from the Sen- ate, being divided upon the subject, will be unable to agree upon a bill, and the question will be left in such a condition that it will be 

impossible to tell where we shall bring up, impossible to tell whether we shall have any action on this subject at the present session of Congress. I therefore submit to the chairman of the committee, a.s also 

to the Senator from Connecticut who moved this reference, that it 

would be better to have an expression of the Senate before the bill 

shall be r ecommitted. :Mr. President, having said thus much upon the que tion before the 

S nate, the motion to recommit, I claim indulgence for a very few 

moments while I refer to another matter. It seems that I am mot 

unfortunate in the motions that I make touchin~ bills that are before 

the Senate or that I have any connection Wlth, either a-s having 

reported them or a a member of the committee. I remember that 

when the bill to repeal the law touching salaries was before the Sena.te, I accepted and voted for an amendment offered by the Senator 

from :Maryland, [Mr. HAMILToN,] and at once it w~ said by almost 

every one in· favor of the bill that it would certainly defeat it. I 

acte l iu that cas as I do upon roo t propositions, from a conviction 

that it wa.S right and that it would tend to bring about the result that 

I desired. I shall not refer to the result in that ca e, nor to bow near the bill that was finally passed agreed with the bill that I then ac- cepted. Last week when tho question was before the Senate upon 

the amendment of the Senator from North Carolina, [Mr. ~URRDIO"N,] 

and when he withdraw his propo ition to incroa e the amount to be 

redistributed to 75,000,000 and proposed an absolute increase of 

national-bank currency of· S46 000,000, I, deeming it but proper and 

right for the purpose of perfecting the bill before the Senate, mov d 

to strike out " 25,000,000" and insert "$50,000,000." Instantly my 

friend from Illinois, [ Ir. LOGAN,] my friend from Michigan on my 

right, [Mr. FERRY,] and my friend over the way, the · Senator from 

Georgia, [Mr. Goni>o~,] appealed to me to withdraw that amendment 

for the rea on that it would certainly defeat the effort the friends of an increa e of the cuiTency had in view, and I was told in rather 

plain terms that I was hardly true to the position I had occupied in 

the :first part of the session; that I had announced myself in favor of an increase of the currency, and that now by my action I was clis- tracting and dividing those who were in fa'vor of that proposition, 

and that unless I withdrew my amendment it would certaintly encl 

in the defeat of what they wanted. I confess that such was the zeal 

and earnestness of my friends on either ide of me and the appeals 

tha,t they made to me that I was led to doubt the correctnes of my 

position: I confess that, not looking at my friend on my right [Mr. 

FERRY] for awhile, I absolutely thought that he felt unkind and that 

he was not in the best humor in the world. I however looked at 

him after awhile, and I found that there was nothing in the world 

the matter with him, that he was only earnest. He had that earne t-· ne s which every man must have to be truly eloquent. If it be true, as was said of the great Chalmer , that .the secret of his eloquence wa.s ea~·nestness, real, genuine blood earnestne , my friend from 

Michigan is the most eloquent man on this floor, for he certainly is 

tho most earnest man on this subject I have found yet, unless it be 

my good friend the Senator from lllinoi ·, [1\fr. LOGAN.] I like such 

earnestness. I am always glacl to see it; and I know of no person on this floor who give better exhibition of it than they do. I know 

it springs from the conviction that they a~·e right; and having the 

strong conviction in their own minds that they are right, they can hardly conceive that those who differ with them in the course that 

should be taken can, by pos ibility, be right. .And yet, sir, let us see where we were then. I proposed to amend 

that bill by strikin()' out "twenty-five" and in erting ":fifty." I 

then pointed out the objections there were to the substitute proposed by the Senator from North Carolina. I thought I saw then 

what the Senator from North Carolina aclmittcd almo t the n x:t 

mornino- by the introduction of another substitute, withdrawinO" the one he had propo ed, that it had been prepared ha tily, was crude in 

its form, and that upon reflection and exainination he would see that 

it were better to amend it or to substitute something else for it. The 

next morning he did accordingly introduce a ub titnte, withdrawing the one he had offered the day before, conforming in many re- spects to the sugge tions I had made; and instantly my frien<ls who 

felt that it was incumbent upon us to stand by the first proposition 

and do nothino- at all that would seem to antagonize it, favored the 

proposition in this new form. 

That was not all. Notwithstanding the appeal to us to stand by 

the forty- ix millions as :first introduced, in the crude form I have 

already stated, and though that was abandoned the next morning and 

another substitute offered, instantly they stood by that, and insisted 

that we should tand by that also; but yesterdr'1y, when t he Senator 

from P ennsylvania [Mr. CAMERON] proposed 9 a sub titute for that 

proposition free banking, we were appealed to at once to stanll by 

that ancl abandon not only the :fir t substitute offered by the Senator 

from North Carolina, but the second one also, and it is insisted that 

every person who· does not stand by the propo ition of the Senator 

from Pennsylvania is tending to distract and divide the friends of an increase of the cuTrency. 

Mr. President, the question as it is now presented, aside from some amendments that I think would have to be made to it, is preci ely in 

accord with the position tlillt I took the first day that I spoke in the 

Senate on this subject. I said that I was in favor of increa ing: the 

greenback currency; and that is where I stand to-day. I said, however, if we are to have an increase of national banks let tho e banks 

bo free, so that every person in the land having the requisite capital can engage in banking upon the same terms that any other person can. I say that is what I maintained if we were to have banks at all. I maintain that to-day. But I was opposed, as I then t..'tted, to an increase cif national-bank currency, to the amOtmt of forty-six millions, or any other linrited amount, and I proceeded to state very 

briefly the reasons that influenced me against any increa e of a limited amount. I can only repeat what I said then, that I am atirfi ,a 

that the people of this country are oppo ed in principle to national 

banks at all. I am satisfied tl.tat if we are to have national banks wo hould have free banking, and that they are opposecl to any provision 

that shall look to the increase of these banks to an amount limited, 

for they do believe that these instii.u.tions are monopolies in thoir 

character, and are in the ha,nd.s of a few, whereas th y honlll be in t,ho hands of all persons who have the capital antl de ·ire to engaO'e in 

banking. I said, however, that if there was to be :111 incre< e of tho currency 

at all, I W2.S in favor of an increase of greenb::wks. I stand there to-
1874. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD. 1547 

day. If I vote for the proposition of the Senator from Pennsylvania, 

with proper restrictions and amendments, I shall do so under protest, 

and from a conviction that I shall not l>e able to get an increase of 

greenbacks, and that if there is to be an increa e of circulation it is 

only to be derived through the free-banking system; for· I say here 

to-day that, in my judgment, the Government should be divorced 

from banks. It should take no further ep in the direction of organizing banks for the issue of paper. My judgment is that the people 

demand that this shall be done, and that not.hing in t he coming years 

will tend so much to bring reproach upon Congress as tho fact that 

the Government maintains its connection with these banks, and that 

Congress, from year to year, legislates upon the e subjects. Do you 

ask me why f I will give you one reason. It is known throughout 

the cotmtry-and I do not mention it to the discredit or the disparagement of members of Congress, but I state the fact- that a large num- ber in this body, as also in the House of Representatives, are interested 

in national b~nks. It is probably true that t hey will be interested in 

national banks in the coming years, whether we provide for an increase 

to a limited amount, or for free banking; but, ix, I tell you, n.ud I now give this note of warning, that, in my judgment, in the coming 

years no one thing will bo brought up so much as a reproach to the 

action of Congress as the fact that we organize banks, that members 

of Congress become members of such banks, and have to legislate up~n the subject from year to year. You may say that these men, are honest, and will not be influenced in their action by reason of such connect ion; but the fact remains that they do legislate upon the subject ; the people know it; and it is utterly impossible that you can remove from the minds of the people the impression that they will 

be influenced by their intere tin such institutions. Therefore, in my 

jmlgment, Congress should take no fm·ther step in the direction of 

the organization of national banks. I think that steps should be 

taken at as ,early a day na possible consistent with good faith to these 

banks, and the interest of tho e -who have capital thero invested, to 

withdraw such circulation and divorce the Government and Congress 

entirely from all connection with them. 

I have said that I was in favor, if there was an increase, of having 

that increase in greenbacks. I am in favor of such increase. I was . in favor of it when I came here. I stand there yet. The people that 

I have the honor in part to represent, I know, are in favor of such 

increase, were in December, and are yet. I am in favor of such 

increase in the way of greenbaeks, because the people of t·his country are better satisfied with that currency than any currency they have ever had. · Mr. President, I have ah'ea-dy said more than I intended whem I rose. A few more words, and I have done. I have proposed that 

there shall be a redistribution of 50,000,000, instead of :l5,00Q,OOO as provided by the law of 1870, and ns provided by the bill reported by 

the committee. It occurred to me, as I stated at the time I offered 

the amendment, that it would be a fair and just compromise between 

the different sections of the country; that our friend.s in the East 

would resist any proposition to redist1:ibute the entire excess that 

they had of banking circulation, and that we in the We t and South 

felt that 25,000,000 was not quite just to us in view of the increase 

of wealth and population in those portions of the country. I therefore suggested $50,000,000 as a fair compromise. I can ee that our friends from the East very reasonably, and perhaps justly, insist upon 

holding on to this circulation.. I have no doubt that we shoultl do 

the same thing if the balance was in our favor; and I do not expect 

the Senators from the East to willingly yield this redistril>ution; but 

I submit to them whether it is not better, everything considered, that 

they should give up this without a struggle, or at lea-st not resist it, 

and thus yield what seems to me but just and fair to the other portions of the country. It occuTred to me that if we conld t.hus amend 

the bill, we might be n,b1e to pa it, and get this question from before the Senate. I think it may possibly be done yet. But, whether this 

amendment shall be adopted or not, I desire to sa.y tha.t I shall vote 

against the proposition of the Senator from North Carolina for the increase of the bank currency by the amount of $46,000,000, and if 

required to vote upon the proposition of the Senator from Penn yl- vania, I hall vote for free banking with all the afeguar~, and all 

the restl:ictions, and all the limitations that may be necessary to make 

it entirely safe for the people. 

With reference to such banks, I want to add one thing more. We 

ca.nuot fo~~et the fact that these banks do sometimes fail, either by r ett on of tlle mismanagement of those contTolling them, the corruption of officers, or their dishonesty, or their frauds. Then, though it 

may be true that the bill-holder is protected by reason of thegnarantoo of the Government, it is nevertheless truo that depo 'itors often 

lose, anu lose very largely, becau e of such dishonesty aml such fraud. 

One, two, or three, failures of that kind throughout the year tend more to bring such banks into reproach,· tend more to bring reproach 

upon the Government, tend more to bring reproach upon Congres, 

than almost anything that could occur in connection wit h our finances. 

The Government guru·antees this circulation. The people e-verywhere 

feel, whether they are justified in so concluding I do not stop now to 

inquire, that the Government sta.mls responsible to them, not only for 

the circulation, but for the <loposits. It is not true iu fact, n,nd yet 

they do have a feeling that the Government should be thus responsi- ble, and when they thus lose by r eason of th defauJt of the officers 

of these banks, they charge the efaul~, they charge the fraud, they 

charge the dishonesty, upon the law and upon the Government. I 

think the Government should not place itself in a. position to be thus 

charged and to be thus reproached from year to year. If, however, 

you give them a currency that is gu::Lranteed by the nation, and that 

they know full well is good under all circumstances, they willl>e satisfied with it. 

It has been said here that I am opposed to specie payments. Nothing could be more untrue. I am in fa.vor of specie payments '\}"hen 

trade and commerce shall bring us to that point, but I am opposed to 

specie payments by any forced law. 

Why, Mr. President, look over the history of this nation; see what 

has taken place in the :finan<."ial worLd upon this subject. I undertake to say here to-day, and to put it upon record, that though we have had laws in the States and in the nation providing for the 

redemption of bank currency, providing for the payment of gold, 

what has been the fact¥ When you could receive your gold readily, 

when business was prosperous, when there was no question at all with 

reference to the solvency of banks, but they were paying over their 

counters readily, no man cared anything about gold, no man cared 

whether he got gold for his bills or not; but let there come the least 

revulsion; let there come the lea t .thing to disturb trade or com- merce, and instantly the banks closed, tmd you did not get any gold ; 

and there never has been a time in the history of this nation when 

you want-ed gold more than at all other times that you got gold. It 

never has occurred, and it never will occur. If the laws of trade and 

the trade of the country do not jnstify the paying out of gold by the 

banks and those that have it, you never get the gold, and the time of 

all others that you want it is the time that you do not get it. I therefore say that if by law you provicle for a return to specie payment, 

you may, by possibility, force it so far as the Government is con- cerned; bnt you just as inevitably bring contraction; you ,just ns inevitably stop the wheels of trade, stop all the industries of the coun- try, and bring a crisis upon us, beside which that of the last few 

months is a mere nothing. 

Mr. Pre ident, I was surprised ye "fierday, when talking upon this 

subject, anrl with reference +..o getting gold here to carry out the 

resolve, to hear the language of the Senn,tor from Nj3w Jer ey [:Mr. 

FRELIXGIIUYSEX.] There is contained in his speech !l. most significant admission. I will read what he said: 

Jill:. President, those are two measures we should adopt-reasonable retrench· ment and necessary taxation; aml the third mP.asure is this: We should do just 

what we have pleuged our faith we would do, ' 'make provision"-that is the lan- gua~e of the pledge-to ba,,e the United States notes convertible into coin. Tills we .hould do by authorizing the Secretary of the Treasury from time to time to accumulate golu. I heard wh!:.t the Senator from Ma ~husetts [Mr. BOUTWELl,) 

said ou thaL subject, and I do not ag-tee with him-I believe it entirely feasible to accunmlate rroltl It is true Great Brita,in preferred that the 15,500,000, tho amount of the geneva. a.w:u·d, should not be paid hero in gold and preferreu keeping 

it; but if wo were taking measmes t{) resLllUe specio payments in this oountry, thore 

is enough of 11tatesman. hip in that nation, and enough of appreciation of tbeir own interests to induce them to afford every facility to aid us to accompli h that purpose. The,y woulu interpose uo obstacle to our effecting a loan of gold. They know that tho difference botw·een gold or convertible notes and irredeemable :{!a per has at some 1 ime heen an almo t prohibitory tariff and an obstruction to thrur importations here. They know that during the war, when gold was 200, manufactories were e. tablisbed allover the oountry; that it operated as to many of therr man· uf:.wt.ures as a, prohibition; that to a, degree gold, being worth more than our cur- r ency, still has that otl'cct. .And they would be ready to aid us in obtaining '1. loan 

that would enable us to commence pecie payments. · 

And thereby stop the encouragement of manufactories. That is 

the fair, legit.O:mate result of the proposition stated. In other words, 

come to a gold basis, do it by forced legislati9n, do it by accumulating gold in the Treasury of the nation, and yon thereby will have 

the encouragement of England; they will give us their gold to bring 

about this clesiredre ult, that thereby they may encourage their own manufactories and <liscourage ours. If that is tlie proposition, then 

I say, in all canclor, that is another reason why I am not in favor of 

this forced contraction and this forced resumption. 

1\fr. President, it seems to me- if we unite upon the proposition for a redistribution of $30,000,000 of the bank currency, our friends from 

the East cannot reasonably object to it; ancl I think it would accom- plish a grea.t good in. the direction we all desire so far 38 the South 

and West are concerned. I u.gree with the Senator from New Jersey 

that this is a question that should not be determined upon local con- siderations nor by mere personal feeling. Sir, there is something 

higher and nobler anu truer in all public action than a mere personal 

triumph. It is higher and better for all men to stand by what they 

believe to be right, and to bottom their action upon what they believe to be principle. We may build in this ca e, as in ail others, 

wit.h granite ever o high, and yet, in the language of the .greatest of 

American orators, fr. Phillips, though we may thus build, the pulse 

of the weakest girl could beat it down. I say there is something 

higher and nobler and truer than a. mere personal triumph. It is 

not a que ·tion whether my good friend, the Senater fJ:om Illinois, 

shall have this matter di po ed of in the way he ·deems best, and 

thereby feel that he has accomplished something thn,t is per onal to 

himself, nor that I should have it re ult in the same way; but that 

we shall compare views, look to the best interests of all portions of 

this grand a,nu growing country, and settle this question npon such 

principle n.nu such a. basis that all shall feel that it is for the l>est 

intm·ests of all portious of tlle nation as far as possible. It is true 

that no man can expect that his own individual views shall be carried 

out to tlle exclu iou of all other , uor should we stop or hesitatA to 
1548 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD. FEBRUARY 17, 

do as nearly right as we can because we are unable to accomplish all 

that we believe to be right in the direction desired; but comparing 

views, looking to all portions of tho nation, we shoulu settle the question now before the Senate in such a, way as that we shall feel it is 

permanent; and in such a way also u.s that all portions of the cornltry shall be satisfied. 

When we have done that, my good friend from Vermont [Mr. MoRRILL]-his coming into his seat now reminus me of it-can proceeuin 

the direction that he seemed to think was necessary, or at least if not 

necessary, agreea,ble to his constituents in the production of maple 

sugar and pretty girls. My good friend suggested the other day that · until Vermont sha,ll cease making more maple sugar and producing more pretty girls than any other State, they could not expect to 

escape reproach in the ffena,te. If my good friend had not come into 

his pbce just at this moment, I perha,ps would not ha,ve thought of 

it. If he will pardon me, I make this suggestion to him: I remember 

that some years since, in one of th13 States, a gentleman of my own name was a candidate for re-electiOn to the office of governor. He was visited one day by a number of friends, and, while at table, one of them from the good county of :Morgan, wheremyfriendremembers 

the ague wa probably born and grew to its full shaking power, 

suggested to him, "Governor, you are going to get an·the votes in our county." The governor rep lieu that he was very glad to hear it; 

he was very happy to know that his admini tration was so acceptable 

to the people that all persons were going to vote for him. Said his 

friend, ''Governor, it does not make any difference about the administration." "Then," replied the governor, "I am very happy to know 

that whigs and democrats·are all goin~ to vote for me." His friend 

rejoined, "It does not make much difference about the whigs or the 

democrats; you just keep right on making Wright's Indian vegetable 

pills, that cure the ague every time, and you will get all our votes." 

[Laughter.] 

My good friend from Vermont cannot do anything better, in my 

judgment, than proceed right on in the direction he indicates. I am sure there is no feeling so far as- we are concerned ; I am sure there is no feeling anywhere on this subject; I am sure the desire on the part 

of all here is to-reach a proper and just result. I believe that we can d9 it if we continue this discussiOn; and when we shall have taken 

the sense of the Senate upon the questions now before us, I shall vote 

for a motion to recommit this bill, unless in my j 11dgment its details are so perfected by the action of the Senate that a recommittal is unnece ary. I am sure, however, when we reach tha,t point, no one will rea onably object, havins- had an expression of the Senate, to 

such recommittal, if they believe it is in the line that will tend to the 

perfection of the bill and get before the Senate what we all desire. 

Mr. LOGAN. I was very sorry to hear the Senator from Iowa allude 

t,o this mn.tter as a personal triumph, and int~mate that I felt as though 

it would be a personal triumph to have it acted upon in a cert.ain way. 

This is a very astonishing character of insinuation. What personal 

triumph could there be in having this matter uisposeu of either one way or the other, so far as I am concerned¥ I have not offered a solitary 

proposition on the subject. Certainly it could be no triumph to me. I am not seeking any personal triumphs on this or any other question. 

I have discussed it according to my theory; according to my ability, 

however poor that may be; according to my way of discussing question . ft m<:~.y not be of the same character, or the same mode and 

manner, as that of my friend from Iowa. 

One woru further. The Senator from Iowa intimates that certain 

gentlemen here have changed their position. I think that remark was entirely uncalled for and unnecessary, especially so far as it applied to myself. In the first speech that I made on this subject in the 

Senate Chamber some time aO'o, I insisted on an increase of the cur- rency by $50,000,000; but in the very same rema1·k I adued, "looking 

ultimately to free banking," showing that that was a favorite meas- ure with me. That will be found in the first remarks I made in the 

Sena,te on the subject. I did favor the proposition of the Senator 

from North Carolina, thinking that if we could not get anything else 

I would tak.e that. I do favor the proposition of the _Senator from 

Pennsylvania, it coming up first because it is more desirable than 

the other; but if that fails I sh;Jl vote for the other, intending to get 

the best thing possible for the country in the view that I have of the 

subject. 

I do not wish todiscu s thismotion to recommit at all. I attem'ptecl 

to do that last night. I only wish to say to my friend from Iowa, 

that in speakin~ of changes that have been made on these propositions, anu especially l.>ecause he offered a motion, his remarks were a li :t.le st ronger perhaps tllan he intended to make them. I did not criticise 

the motion tb::~,t he offered. I said I was sorry it was offered at the 

time; but so fn.r as the right to offer it is concerned, he certainly had 

that right. 

As to his insinu:ttion with reference to the Senator from Michigan 

and my elf, as much as to say to the Senate, "Here is a young gentleman on my right, and here is a young gentleman on my left, who are proceeding in this discussion in a way that is riot very pleasant; perhaps they are nrging their views a little too strongly," I have 

t.wthing to sa.y except this: I shall never attempt to create prejudice against men because they attempt to iliscnss measures in their way 

of di cussing them. I shall never attempt to produce that kind of pr judice here in the Senat e or elsewhere, because I understand this 

bouy to be one in which evory member has the same right that auy 

other member b::~ s to discuss questions in a proper manner, so that he 

keeps within the rn1es. As to whether the Senatorfrom Michigan on tho right, and tho Senat-or from Illinois on the left, have participated 

to some extent in this discus ion or not, tha t is what tbey have n. 

right to do, the same as any other Senators. If their views aro not 

correct, no one need adopt them. I am sure t.hat this is no question 

coming from me, nor is it a proposition of the Senator from Michigan; 

but clliferent propositions pertaining to tho is ue now before the 

Senate have come before us for ns to discuss anc.l to decide upon. I 

said yesterday evening that I was ready to vote. I say so no·w. The 

propo ition is satisfactory to me. I thought I had a ri~ht to say that. 

I merely wished to say this much to place myself rignt. in reference 

to these propositions, because the Senator insinuated that changes bad 

been made upon them that I cannot see or understand. I merely desire . to say to him that I have changed no position that I have occupied 

from the beginning, but I shall vote for every measure which tends 

to do that which I think ought to be done by the Senate. 

1\Ir. 'WRIGHT. l\Ir. Pre ident, I am very much surprised indeed 

that my friend from Illinois should have the impre sion that I had 

insinuated that he had done anything that was the least improper 

and that he hn.d not a perfect right to do. This is the first time I 

have ever risen in my place here to say a word with reference to a matter personal. I think it will be found that when I have anything 

to say with reference to any Senator here I will not leave it to mere insinuation. So far as my good friend is concerned, of course he had a perfect right to take any course he pleased with 1·eference to this q~estion. I did not intimate that he had pursued other than a straightforward course in reference to this question. I never intimated that 

be was seeking a personal triumph. Such a thing never entered my 

mind, and I am truly surpri ed that he should get such an impression. 

I have ·but one word more to say. He says that I referred to my 

young friend on my right and my young friend on my left. I beg m.v good friend not to have the impre sion that I e timated myself so much 

older than either of them. It would be a que tion of very great doubt 

in my mind as to whether either of them had the advantage of me in 

that respect. I therefore shall not allow them to claim anything in 

tbe way of ao-e. Mr. BUCKINGHAM. l\Ir. President, I do not often refer to the • Constitution of the United States, for I am not a constitutional lawyer; and yet I read that "Cono-ress shall have power to coin money 

and regulate the value thereof ;fl and this leads me to a very different 

conclusion from that at which the Senator from Iowa has arrived in 

regard to the power of Congress over money. It does seem to me that it puts the whole power of regulating not only oin, but any- thin~ which is to pass current as mone_v:, in the contr~l of Congre s; 

and It does appear to me that the establishment of banks by the different States is a violation of the implied power of Congress in that 

clause to which I have referreu; for I do not see how it is possible for 

Congress to regulate money if it is to be under th control of thlrtv- seven States, each State differing in the exercise of its power in order 

to control the currency. 

Wtth that view I believe that it was one of the wisest things which 

Congress has ever done to adopt measures to organize a system of 

banking unde;r national authority, which blotted out of existence the 

banks of the States; and with that view I hope that Congress will 

maintain and exercise this power in such a manner that the currency 

shall remain as it now is, of equal value in all sections of the country, an object which cannot be obtained under State banks. How this 

shall be done and how we shall manage in reference to this bill a,nd 

the different propositions which ru·e before us it is difficult for me to 

determine. I certainly am in favor of a bill whichshallgrantequalprivileges in bankinginall pru·ts of the country, a,nd I would have equal 

restraints upon banking and banks located in every section of the 

country. I would have New England and the North restrained in the same manner and having the same liberty that I would give to Lanks 

iu any other section of the country. I think it is one of the most 

unwise, unsatisfactory, and I might say unjust, provisions made by law 

to undertake to parcel out the distribution of currency to different 

sections, based upon any basis which we can calculate; and therefore 

I am in favor at the earliest moment po sible of removing all those 

restrictions and rriving liberty. But I should like to see a bill which 

shall contain both the free<lom anu the restraints, so that we can see at one single view precisely the system which we are to have; and it 

is in this view that I moved to recommit the present bill to the Committee on Finanoo; but I do not know that they will bring forward 

such a bill as I prefer. 

I should hesitate about voting1 for the proposition of the Senator 

from Pennsylvania [l\Ir. CAl\mRON] unles it should contain in it some restriction, some limitation, something which will make it safe for a bank to give a note, a promise to pay, and ~omethingwhich will hold 

it to its obligations. Free banking, without restraint, is a promise to 

pay, but a promise which is never fulfilled. The legal-tender notes are promises to pay, but they are promises which have not been re- deemed. I agree to the intimation of the Senator from Iowa that it 

might be very unwise to legislate so as to force the business of the 

country or the banks of the country into such a position as to com- pel them to meet all their obligations in specie at any particular time. I do not believe it is now practicable, if possible; but I do not believe 

there is another mea ure which is practicable and within the power 

of the Government. If you will make free bankiug and require the 
1874. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD. 1549 

banks, as they are required now by law, to redeem in legal-tender 

notes, thatmaybeverywellif you will go a littlofurther, and require 

the Government of the United S~ates to redeem those legal-teuder 

notes. . Now, the question is, is that possible or is it impossible 7 I think 

it is to-day impossible, or, if it could be done to-day, it would be impossible to-morrow; ana therefore I am not ready either to sa.y that 

the Government of the United States shall redeem its pledges in coin 

to-day or to-morrow ; nor am I ready to say that it shall accumulate 

all the coin which it can place its hands upon · and gather it into the 

public Trensury until it sha.ll have such a proportion as t.o justify the 

resumption of specie payments. • But there is another way, which I have suggested before, which I . think we can adopt, and if the honorable Senator from Pennsylvania 

will incorporate it in his bill, I will go for it with all my heart; and 

that is in connection with that bill to require of the Government to 

redeem on demand its lega.l-tender notes, either in coin or in interestbea.ring bonds which may be easily converted into coin. Do that, ancl 

I am with the honorable Senator in the vote, often and every time. 

Mr. SCOTT. Mr. President, I offer this amendment to the instructions propo ed to be given to the committee in the amendment offered 

by the Senator from North Carolina . . I offer as an amendment to his 

amendment: 

And providing for the redemption of the whole national-bank currency in specie or the interest-bearing bonds of the United States. 

Mr. President, when the Senator from Connecticut made his motion 

yesterday to refer this bill back to the Committee on l!"'inance, I ven- tured to express my belief that that was the best thing the Senate 

could do. Never ha.ving been accustomed to accomplish any purpose 

that I desired by indirect means, and never desiring to dodge any question which it was my duty to meet, I did not suppose for one moment 

that any Senator would attribute either to any member of the Committee on Finance who favored that reference or to the whole com- mittee anything savoring of artifice for the purpose of getting this measure awa.y from the Senate. I thought the experience of the Senate 

had been such as to satisfy all that we could get no definite action 

upon any bill proposing to treat simply one phase of the financial 

question; ~nd I think I may again with safety a.ppeal to the experi- ence of the Senate to verify that remark. What ha.s been that experience Y · I may not be correct in the order of time in which they were introduced; but we had first a resolution from the Committee on Finance, 

and debate went on ad libitum, upon that. The resumption of specie 

pa.yments, the question of reserves, of interest upon deposits, of mtes 

of interest, everything connected with banking and finance was dis- cuss~d upon it. Then came the bill simply to authorize national 

banks to deposit lega.l-tentler notes instead of their own circulation, 

and withdraw bonds to an equivalent amount-a bill introduced by 

the Sena.tor from Indiana, [Mr. l\!ORTO r.] Again came the bill to 

authorize the establishment of banks of deposit., without circulation. 

The bill of the Senator from Indiana came up, and again was opened 

up the whole discussion. We had homilies upon the amount of the 

circulation of France and of Engillnd, upon how notes were issued 

upon exchequer bills and coin in England. We ha.d e.-erything con- nected with the subject of fi.uance on the simple proposition coming 

from the Sta.te of Indiana. to permit a bank that had more capital than 

it wanted to ~et rid of $10,000 of jt at a time. So when the bill came up for ·establishing banks of deposit, mthout circulation, the whole 

subject was entered upon again; and th'en when this bill is considered, simply to enforce the provisions of the existing law, we are out 

upon the whole sea. of specula.tion and theories of finance again. 

After all this, when the Senator from Connecticut, without consultation, so far as I am aware, with anybody, certainly without any con- ference with the Committee on Finance-or if there was a conference, 

I as a member was left out-made his motion to refer this subject 

back to the committee, the Senator from Illinois talks about "dodg- in~" and" management" to get the bill out of tho Senate. 

1t wa-s not because I am unwilling to meet any of these questions 

that I favored the reference. I think I am ready .to meet any of 

them. But I think it is perfectly apparent to the Senate t.hat we would run the risk of an ill-considered measure, if upon this bill, 

proposing only to accomplish one purpose, we venture to act upon 

runendments offered in the Senate without having had full time to 

consider them, and without having had them subjected to the exam- ination of a committee. Certainly the members of the Committee on Finance never claimed that their action should bind the Sena.te, 

much less that it should bind the Senator from lllinois, [:Mr. LOGAN,] 

who we all know acts upon evory question so independently, o en· tirely devoid of all idea of dodging or evading any question, that it 

matters not from what committee a measure comes, his judgment alone 

wjll settle for him how he shall act upon it. _When the Senator from Connecticut made the motion to refer, I 

thought, and I still think-and in this I may difl'er from my colleagues on the committee-that the best mode of disposing of this 

question is to refer it back. If we are·to have instructions by the 

votes here, very well; I shall ue glad of them; but if we t.ake the instruction upon this question as it is now before us, what does it 

amount to 'V It amounts to an instruction to increase tho nationalbank circulation to an amount not exceeclin"" 1$400,000,000. Even if 

the amendment which I offer to it is adopted, it simply provides for 

• 

the redemption of the national-bank circulation in gold, or in legaltender notes. But what else are we ·to do 'f How are we to dispose 

of the question which affects these national banks largely, one which 

has received perhaps as much attention in the country as any other,· the question of whether they are to pay or receive interest on their 

deposits f How a. bout tho question of ta.x:ation, whether they are to 

continue paying their ta.x:es to the States Y .And how about the question of taxation upon the deposits of private banks 'f Here is a que tion upon which the Sena.te ha-s not even power t<> originate a measure, and which may be necessary if these questions of taxation or interest upon deposits are to be considered at all. How are you 

to dispose of the question of reserve Y How a.re you to dispose of the 

question of the rates of interest which .they are to be permitted to 

take f How are you to dispose of tho many questions which will 

inevitably be presented, each Senator bringing forward those which 

suggest themselves t,o his mind upon this billY 

I am, as I have already said, not at all unwilling to meet these 

propositions. Without seeming to be presumptuous, I think I am ready to meet and vote, so far as I have light on the subject at present, upon every one of these questions. I cannot vote at present for 

the a.mendment offered by my colleague for free nationa.l banking 

without any limitation and without any provision for redemption. I 

ha.ve no hesitation in saying that I am in favor of free banking. I 

u,m in favor of free banking, the Government furnishing legal-tender 

notes through the hanks, and the banks being primarily responsible 

for their redemption in gold or United States bonds, antl the Govern-· 

ment ultimately responsible; but I am not in favor of doubling the 

number of national ba.nks upon their present organization. I would 

be willing to see every legal-tender note now issued bearing a different impress. I am willing to see them all returned and redeemed 

either in coin or the bonds of the United States, and others issued in 

their place, acknowledging the truth upon their face. That truth is 

that neither this Government nor any other government, nor any bank on the face of the earth, can carry on the business which civilization 

demands with a paper currency and be ready at all times to redeem 

tho whole amount of that paper _currency in gold; and therefore 

those notes should be reissued acknowledgin8' the truth which everybody has ackuowledged, that we will pa.y tltem in specie when we can, a.nd when we cannot we will redeem them with our bonds be:.tring interest. - I think, 1\lr. President, this discussion has elicited that there .is a very geneml concurrence in three truths. I at least think I have 

gathered that many from this discussion. One is that everybody is 

in favor of specie payments at some time; the-second is that nobody can toll when we shall be able to resume; aml the third is tha.t when . we do resume, and a pa.nic come , we cannot continue to redeem in 

specie. I do not know I have heard anybody question these. 

I must, perhaps, add another, although not so plainly announced as these three, and that is that we cannot legislate so as effectually to 

prevent panic. Panics are just as inseparable from a credit system as floods are n·om a. country that hat~ rains. Panic will come wherever 

credit is used, and the extent of the panic depends entirely upon the 

extent of the debt.. When a mechanic fails, his creditors in his neighborhood go to Iris shop a.nd want their money; if they cannot get tho 

money they want security; and if they cannot get secmity they :no willing to take his commodities; and if they canno~ get any of them, 

he is a banluupt. The extent to which the credit goes measures the 

extent of the panic. If a manufacturer or merchant fails, it is a little larger than when the mechanic fails. If a bank fails, it is .a little l.ar~er t.hau when a manufacturer fails; and if a great banking institutiOn known throughout the country and throughout the world fails, 

it disturbs confidence in all banks, and you have a panic that will last 

until men get back to sobor reflection and see whether there was a.ny 

occasion for the panic or not. 

Tha.t is what we ha.ve had; and here, I suppose, upon this one bill 

to carry out what was recognized to be justice in the law of 1870, to remove an obstacle in carrying that law out, we are to meet all the 

remedies thnt are to be prescribed fo1· pa.nics, upon amendments suggested on the spur of the moment in the Sennte, instoad of having a well-considered measure in the light of all the discussion we have had. 

Now, sir, my purpo e was, and I am free ~o avow it, to economize 

time, to get these questions all into one bill, and then have one discussion antl au end to the whole subject, instead of repeating the same discussion over five or six different bills presenting different aspects 

of the question, a.nd perhaps failing to agree upon any of them. 

I may be mistaken in that; I may desire to accomplish results instead of making speeches; but if so I have to blame my practical 

nature for it. I do desire to see a. result; others may prefer the 

speeches without practical results. ·I do desire to see the Senate meet 

all these questions and try whether they can agree upon any system ; 

and I shall vote, notwithstanding the criticisms of my friend from 

Illinois, to refer this bill back to the Finance Committee, and we wiU 

endeavor to work in the :).ight which this discussion has shed upon it. 

If we can have instructions, so much the better; but if we are to have 

them, and we are to have any practical measure on this subject before 

the end of the e sion, I trust they will come soon, so that we shall ue able to go to work and report in time to havo action upon the report. 1\fr. FERRY, of Michigan. Mr. President, I have but a few wonls 

to say upon this question of reference. I withheld saying auythino- yestenlay, nor did I design. saying a word at this time until I found 
1550 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD. FEBRUARY 17, 

that almost all of the mem)Jers of the Finance Committee have ex:- presse<-1 their views and disclosed the fact that those views differ not 

at all from what they were when expressed in committee. I think I am not ti·espassing upon the rules of the Senate when I say this 

much, ina much as the. bill before us, which it is ;now propos~d to 

recommit to the comrmttee, ·came from that comrmttee followmg a resolution asking the judgment of the Senate upon the que tion of 

finance. , When the motion was made to recommit, it struck my mind as a little disrespectful to the request of the committee. I am well aware there was no such intention in the m.over of this motion, and if I had 

any such thought it would be dismissed this morning since -hearing 

what has been said by the Senator from Connecticut. And yet I 

find that this bill was reported by the chairman of the committee 

after a resolution had appeared here at the instance of that committee, reported by the chairman, inviting precisely the question that is now at issue before the Senate, simply the judgment of the Senato 

upon the question whether its policy shall be to increase or contract 

t.he currency. Now, sir, I confine myself stlictly to tho question at 

issue in the point of reference, and that involves the whole subject, 

in my judgment. The Senator from Pennsylvania who has just taken his Jleat, [Mr. 

Scorr,] referring to this bill that appeared in the Senate, the design of 

which was simply to enforce a statute now practically a nullity, tated 

that it was simply that and nothing more; anu yet we fmd it here with · amendments attached for which the committee is not now responsible. The bill was spread before the Senate, and I, at least, am not r esponsible for what the net has drawn. But the Senator cannot shut 

his eyes to the fact that upon it and with its reference goes the question whether this committee shall report for an increase or a contraction of the currency. · I have listened very carefully to the di cnssion upon this question, 

and, so far as disclosed )Jy the members of the Finance Committee, I 

find that they repeat precisely the position that they took in com- mittee. I have not changed my view. The Senator on my left, [Mr. 

WRIGHT,] as he has expressed himself this morning, has not changed 

his view. Therefore I cannot see any profit, any gain by the recom- mittal of this bill to the committee, for the committee must of 

necessity report back precisely the judgment of the majority of its 

members, and it was because of that, the committee fin<-ling itself in 

the dilemma of disagreement, that it invited the judgment of the 

Senate before proceeding further on this great question. Now, sir, 

it is proposed, after the lapse· of weeks in discussion on this very 

question, to remand it back to the committee, and before the instructions offered by the Senator from North Carolina were pr~entod, 

proposed to remand it back simply for the action of the committee 

without a judgment of the Senate. 

l\ir. President, if there had been any test vote in the Senate I 

should have .been perfectly willing to accord with this motion to 

recommit this bill, but until the present moment no vote has been 

taken, <md with the exception of the speeches that have been made 

by but a minolity of the Senate on this question, we are in the dark so far as the judgment of the body is concerned, though I should be 

very willing to support this motion if we could economize time by it. 

I cannot see how it is possible to derive any practical benefit from 

recommitting this bill without the instructions of the Senate. True, 

it appeared here for a single object, but it now stands with the great 

question attached, and you cannot dismiss it, and the. Senate is con- fronted with it; and now it is' proposed to send it back either to 

sleep in the committee or to return with substantially the same idea . I wish to say in this connection that I have changed my judgment 

upon one point, and based, too, on this very bill_; aud to that extent 

I thank its appearance here that it has corrected. my judgmen~ upon a question and will lead me to vote directly opposite to what I intended. When this bill was reported originally it was my intention to vote in favor of it; but when I heard from the lips of the 

present occupant of the chair [Mr. ANTHONY] the prote t of a portion of his State against the withdrawal of twenty-five millions of 

currency from New England, Rhode Island protesting against the 

withdrawal of its portion, I, in that respect, changed my judgment, 

and I have based it upon this admis ion of Rhode Island that she 

has not currency enough. If that be so, what light, what practical 

right, have you to demand that Rhode Island and New England shall 

surrender what they have enjoyed and what they needY That lays 

the foundation for the whole question in my mind, and has led me to 

the very issue presented by the Senator from North Carolina, that if 

Rhodo Island and New England have not cturency enough, then the 

West and South have not enough; aud I am ready to vote for the in- crease of forty-six millions precisely upon the basis and upon the 

fact disclosed by the action of the Senator from Rhode Island. 

That is all the change that has passed through my mind upon this 

bill and the re olution reported by the committee; and I ro e to state 

it as a member of the Finance Committee, that I might not be misapprehended, and that the Senate might not mi apprehend its action, so far as I am concerned. I cannot see how it is po 'ible to gain n.ny more intelligent view th:tn we now possess by sending it back to th~ committee. True, by·the action of a committee yon may formulate some plan and perhaps save some moment ; but when it comes to the issue of whether thjs branch of Congress is ready to" increase or decrease the cturency, your committee is blockaded in itself, and I 

there is no denial of it. If I doubted it, it is admitted by the Senator from Pennsylvania, [Mr. COTT,] who h as offered an amendment 

to the in tructions ba~ed upon specie resumption. 

I a k, therefore, what is the use of recommittal if we desire to meet 

this is ue as is stated, an<l I am fr8Jl.k to say I am ready to meet it, as ready as the Senator from I ennsylvania or the Senator from Illinoi : but we cannot shut our eye , neither will the country release us froni 

the responsibility of deciding now whether we shall adopt a policy of 

expansion or contraction ; and that is the is ue that was before 'the 

committee and is now _before the Senate. Therefore I say that practically t.he effect of the refp,rence, without any such intention of the movers or supporters, is t6 waive the question before the en ate, and 

let it be considered in the committee, by and by reviving the iliscussitm, to occupy more weeks of the Senate. If I were to express my 

judgment, it would be that now, at the close of the di en siorr, when 

the que tions are all fresh in the minds of Senators, we should pro- nounce the judgment of the Senate and inform the co\llltry whether we are for expansion or conti·action. The country feels that this 

should be done. We get it in our mails and through all the sour e of information; and yet the Senate halts upon a-question of such 

gravity, and is unwilling, afLei' a di cussion of three or four week , to 

pronounce its judgment before the country. I am ready. If I p ak 

earne tly on this matter, it is because it covers the very gist of the 

whole question. I am ready to put my vote on record on this vital 

issue, and I beg that it may be taken early. I have not interposed 

delay to any great extent; but I have, so fatr as I have felt it my duty, 

expres cd in an humble manner my belief. and my judgment of the 

que tion with that sen e of duty. I express now, just before the vote 

is taken, the hope that we may undeceive ourselves, and my belief 

th:.tt if this hill goes to the committee we stand now as then. · Mr. SHERMAN. :Mr. ~e ident, this debate has gone so far that 

it seerus to me it would be better to have some satisfactory result 

from it by a vote of the Senate on some of the leading propositions 

involved in the debate. When my friend from Connecticut [ fr. 

BUCKINGHAM] yesterday, without consulting me certainly, or anybody but his own good jU(l~ment, proposed to refer this matter to the 

Committee on Finance, I was rather disposed to acquiesce in it; but a night's reflection has convinced me that on the whole it is better 

that we should have a vote of the Senate on some of these proposi- tions. · . • 

The proposition no": submitted by the Senator from Penn ylvania on my right [l\ir. ScoTT] presents fo.:.· the :first time in this wholo 

debate a practical, distinct question, which must be settled :first of all, as it seems to me. The proposition to settle our :financial ilifficultie by free banking is an old one. I am decidedly in favor of it, and 

have always been in favor of repealing all the limitations upon banking privileges. llut the idea of free bankin~ without redemption, or free banking with the bank-notes redeemable in irredeemable l)aper 

money, is the ·wildest scheme of lunacy. It was twice enacted into 

history; once in the French revolution and once in onr revolutionary 

war; and a third time, I may add, by the late so-called Confederate 

States. If you can unite the idea of free banking with some mode of 

redemption, make our notes practically par in gold, you will have 

solved the financial question. That is the only solution. · · The only question; it has seemed to me from the beginning of this 

controversy, is ~ to the chara{}ter of that redemption. Fir t, as to 

whether any measures should be taken at all, I should have to <lifter 

with my friend from Mas ::t.chusetts, [Mr. BouTWELL.] I think tho 

country is bound by honor, by public faith solemnly pledged, and tho republi,~an party is trebly bound by obligations of honor, tluee tim e~ 

repeated, to take some steps toward the reuemption of the notes of 

the United States. Therefore I think we ought to do something, 

although I would far rather join with him in doing nothing than · something which goc in the opposite direction. 

It seems to me, then, that the question comes down to this: What 

plan of redemptiqn can be adopted that will avoid the evils to the 

country of a sharp contraction of the currency and derangement of 

busine s a:fl':ftrs I do not believe it is possible to maintain coin 

redemption in the country now. Why Y Because ten years of irredeemable paper money have driven out of our country the great bocly 

of the gold that w::ts in it; and,. to-day we have only 135,000,000 of 

gold in the United States of America, whEil·eas before the war we had .,.300,000,000. I say, therefore, that any proposition like the 

proposition of my fiiend from New Jersey, [1\ir. FREL~GHUYSEN) or that of my friend from Vermont, [1\Ir. MoRRILL,] looking to coin re- demption, seems to .me impracticable. We cannot draw to this counti-y 

any large sum of gold without it so disturbing the money relations 

of other cotmtlies as t-o react upon ourselves and disturb our own. Therefore I di miss it a a, thing actually impo ible. 

But are we, then, without remedy Is there no other mode. Why, 

1\h'. Pr ident, the mode was suggested by the law of 1 62. It is tho 

simple t modo that could pos il>ly be devi ed. It is the mode that ev ry honest man in tho world woulcl resort to. If a man would not 

yielu to it iu his private life, he wonlcl be called dishonored anu dis- graced in every community Of the world. That is, when his note is 

pre ented to him and he cannot pay it, at least he will give his obli- gation for it ben.ring interest and the best security practicable. That 

is now the position of the United States. The Unitefl States now stand with 380,000,000 o:{ its notes outstanding which it has promisecl to pa.y,.which it i pledged to pay in coin, but which it cannot 
1874. CONGRESSIONAL RECORDo 1551 

pay; and now what objection can there be to giving for such a note 

to anybody who desires it the bond of the United States with interest to be paid promptly and annually 1 Is not that an obligation of 

honod Is not that an oblig\tion of good faith t Would not every 

good citizen be bound to do thaU 

nut it is objected that this would contract t,he currency; this would 

produce great evils in the country and great distress. Let us see. If 

in connection with that proposition to reueem your currency you 

have another proposition which would allow anybody who holds your 

bonds to organize a bank unuer the same burden of redemption, it r move all difficulty ; and the two propositions, taken together, will 

furnish a system of relief that it seems to me is perfectly feasible 

and perfectly easy. If your notes should flow into the Treasury, in 

exchange for bonds, they might be paid out again in the ordinary cour e of the ope1·ations of the Treasury Department; they might be 

used in the redemption of 6 per cent. bonds of the United States to 

the amount of 1,200,000,000. If this did not furnish sufficient cur- rency for the business. of the country, then the way is open to any man who holds bonds of the United States to :file them in the Trca - ury and to start a bank in :my part of the territory of the United 

States, without limitation or restriction. 

The burden of redeeming bank-notes with greenbacks, themselves 

convertible into bonds, would always make the bank-notes and the 

greenbacks equal to bonds, which are now equal practically to gold. Sir, I never could answer this simple proposition : "Wby should we give to capitalists the right to deposit their bonds and receive banknotes secured by them, and yet refuse to give t.o the holuer of the 

note they issue the right to demand the same bonds in case the 

notes are not paid . " Wby should the bond be worth more than the 

note Y Why should the capitalist be able to take his bonds and go and 

get notes of the United States for them T They are notes of the United 

State . A national-bank note is just as much a note of the United 

States as a greenba..ck. The United States agree& to pay it; is bound 

to pay it; holds the security to pay it; it is really a, note of the United 

States. These notes are issued in the interest of capital. Why shoulu 

not these capitalists redeem these not-es in the very ·ecurities that are deposited with the Government for their redemption Y There is no difficulty in the way of it. One ought to be convertible into the other, 

promptly, quickly, surely. · Now, sir, I do not intend to discuss this question; I did not intend even thus far to enter into the argument of the question of redemp- tion, but only to say that whenever free bankiug is proposed you 

must unavoidably connect With it some plan of redemption, and then 

the system is very free and very easy, and I can vote for it with the 

greate t pleasure. Two simple sections, one the section proposeu by 

the Senator from Pennsylvania, [Mr. CAMER04 ,] and another a sec- tion which would authorize any holder of a greenback to apply to 

the Government of the Unit-ed States and receive 5 per cent. bonds 

at his pleasure, will be enough; and then the whole thing is auto- matic; no secretary has discretion or power over the subject. Every 

holder of a note has a right to demand a bond, and every citizen of 

the United States may engage in banking. The whole system is free. nut, sir, I have said all I desire to say about that point, except as it bears on the order of business. Look at it. We have got three 

de.~ees removed from the bill th~t is now pending before us. The 

bill now pendinO' before us is a bill simply to cn;rry into execu- tion the law of 1S70, which has been recommended to us in the ordinary course, referred to the Committee on Finance, carefully prepared 

and reported here, with the expectation- it seems to have been a vain 

one-that it would pass without much objection. Every one saw that 

it was important to give to the Western States opnortunities to or- ga.p.ize banks when they h:ul not their fair share of them already, and 

that theN ew England States- a few of them that had a great excess- might very well suffer the inconsiderable loss of a portion of theiT 

circulation in order to satisf-y a jllSt local demand. That seemed to 

be simply fair. We reported such a bill, and now what have we got 

First we have a propo ition to defeat the act we report, because any 

of these amendments cuts off the head of our poor bill. One propo- sition of the Senator from North Carolina [MT. MERRDIO~] is taswell 

the volume of bank paper $46,000,000 without any restraint, but to 

jllSt lift and swell to that extent the bank paper of the country. 

That raises the question of inflation, for no plan of redemption is propo eel. That, it seems to me, entirely defeats the object of our bill 

and destroys it ; and that comes from the southern section. This 

25,000,000 bill was intended to give relief to the Boutlt. It was said 

that while the South were engaged in war they could not. engage in 

the business of banking. l\Iost of the applications that are now in 

existence for new banks are from the South or far West; and when we provided what we regarded a-s an easy, gradunJ, yropcr means of 

relief to the South and West, lo ;md behold, the southern Senators, 

almost to a man, say they do not want that; they will not take this 

relief which will satisfy their local demand unle s we floocl the coun- try with more paper money. That is the position in which we are placed by them. 

:Mr. HOWE. Will the Senator allow me to ask him a question 

1\Ir. S:&"-ERMAN. I prefer to be allowed to conclude what I have to 

say without interruption. When we get.over that, why if that amendment should be voted 

down, then the Senator from Pennsyh-ania, [.Mr. CAMERox,] venerable in years and character, for whose opinion I alw~ys h:we respect,- comes here and proposes-what Y He says our bill is not sufficient, 

lay it aside, ancl then he propo es free banking. Well, what cloes 

that me:m' 'fhat means the 1-ight of any capitalist, not to convert 

his bonds into money, but to hold on to his bonds~ or rather to deposit 

them safely where they ~vill be kept for his benetit, and where he will 

get his interest promptly, and upon that deposit to issue 90 per cent. 

of the amount in paper money. When is that paper money to be 

paid The Lord knows when! There is no provi ion for its.redemp- tion. It is to be paid in greenbacks; but when are the greenbacks 

to be paid~ No man will say. Every measure looking toward paying greenbaoks ha-s been voted down. Although the administration 

of General Grant commenced it official life with a solemn declaration 

that the greel1backs should be made as good as gold, yet no p roposi- tion .has been pas·ed by either House of Congress even looking to it; 

and now it is proposed, without making any provision for the pay- ment of the greenbacks, to is ue more bank pn,per .in an unlimited 

amount. How much can be issued ~ There are 1,600,000,000 of bonds,- so that between 1,400,000,000 and $1,500,000,000 can be is ned in this 

form of paper money, with no restTiction, no limitation. 

It seems to me that this proposition of my honorable friend i too 

wild. If he was just entering upon the heyday of life, with tho 

vision of hope spread out before him, and castles rising in the air 

buo.ya:nt with. hope, he might indulge in these glorious visions of an unlimited amount of paper money. But it seems to me that for the 

Nestor of the Senate to proclaim this wild, illimitable is ue of paper 

money i!l entiTely too hopeful. Why, sir, if you adopt this step von army against the redemption of our promises the whole of the bank- ing interest of the country, now already, I fear, too much arrayed 

against it. You never would see pecie payments in my time or in 

your , sir. It would burst up and leave behind ruin and misfortune, as all the irredeemable paper money schemes are very apt to do. Now, Mr. President, if you will accompany the propo ition of my 

friend from Pennsylvania with something that will hold it to the 

earth, something that will look to a promise of payment, then it is· right enough. The trouble i , ho has the balloon :filled, but he has no ballast, no crib, no bucket, no basket to hold it to the earth, and the 

very moment he cuts t.he .-opesit is gone. Now, sir, if he will add to 

it some provision to redeem the notes that he issues, some provision 

that. will make the greenbacks as good as gold, or as near to it as the 

condition of our affairs will enable us to do- any scheme what.ever, I 

do not care what it is, that will provide for the redemption of our broken l)romises- then I can vote with him with the greatest pleasure, as I always wish to do. 

Mr. President, it does seem to me that it is better to strip t)lls bill 

of all things that have been thrown around it, and then in due time, or right off if yon please, take up the great que tion and pass some such bill as has been propo eu for free ban.h.Tig nnd redemption. That 

probably will settle the financial question. Bnt now we are three degree~:~ romQved. What shall we do'f Yesterday >vith great reluc- tance I said I was disposed to vote to refer this to the Committee on Finance to get out of the drag we were then in; but now it is made worse anu worse. Iy honorable friend from Connecticut has offerecl a motion to refer. My honorable friend from Illinois [ fr. LOGAN ] 

ays that is a dodge. The Senator from Connecticut is not a very 

good dodger. I am sure I am not accustomed to dodge; and am not 

disposed to do it now. I want a fair vote on all these propositions 

after Senators have had a ehance to debate them. But that is not 

all. After the Senator from Connecticut had made this effort, then 

the Senator from North Carolina [l\fr. MERRBION] comes back and 

wants to hitch on to this motion instructions that we shall report his 

particular iuea. Then my friend from Pennsylvania, [Mr. Scorr,] 

not to be behindhand, wants to hitch on to them another series of 

instructions. So now the question before the Senate is. what instruc- tions shall be given to the Committee on Finance as to what they shall 

do when they do report or after this matter is re-referred J 

Mr. Pre ident, I again appeal to the Senate. Let us drop all these 

clogs that surround 118, and go back to the bill that has been reported 

and that is now on our table. Let us p::tss that first as clearly right, 

clearly j n ·t, and then let ns take up this great question, and see if we cannot agree on some plan for free ban.h.-ing that will also provide a plan of redemption that can be carried out with proper regard to·the 

public policy and the public fait.h . · Mr. CAMERON. I de ire only to say a word. to my friend from 

Ohio. I believe he has changed years with me. Old men generally are sllSpicious; young men are hopeful. The Senator from Ohio, I 

think, is about a quarter of a century younger than I am; and yet he 

talks a bout my. :filling balloons. I have not attempted to make' a bal- loon which I cannot bring to the earth. If I had any difficulty about 

it I wonld get drags, and I would compose the drags of old men like 

him, men who have no faith in their country, no faith in their fellow ., and hardly any faith in them elves. I have tlntire faith in this great 

country of ours, and I have entire faith in the good people who pop- ulate this country. 

I ha,ve not proposed a, measure which pever looks to specie pay- ments, as tlle Senator seems to suppose. On the contrary, I propose a measure which I believe will bring specie payments earlier than any 

of the propositions produced by the Senator who is the chairman of 

the Committee on Finance. I believe that this GoveL'Umeut in a few 

Jears, if you give the people time to work up to their necessities, 
1552 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD. FEBRUARY 17, 

will resume specie payments and continue them for long years under a. proper banking system. · Why, Mr. President, the country would be ready now to resume sDecie payments if the greenbacks were out of the way, and I pro-

-p:lse to take them out of the way by making them the basis of a brmkin~currency which surely locks them up in the vaults of the banks. 

J shall have no objection, after this amendment of mine shall have 

l ·een passed, that you shall make provision that the Government shall 1 13deem its greenbacks in bonds in one, or two, or three years. I am uot in lavor of attempting to make the Government resume now. ~he cannot do so. It is irupossiblefort.he Government to resume now, 

a,nd everybody who reflects on the subject must know that. 

I have great respect for our Finance Committee. One that I con- sider among the ablest men on that committee is my tlolleague,· [Mr. 

Scori,] and every one who knows him and knows me knows that 

there is no man in Pennsylvania for whom I have greater regard, or for whose judgment Ihavemorerespect; and yet that committee have 

had the subject before them for two or three months without arrivin~ 

at any pmctical result. I am not willing to believe that if we semt 

this bill back to them they will do much more work thn.n they have 

done hitherto. I mean that a-s no disre pect to them; but I ·say it 

because I know human nature. Men having fixed ideas in 1;heir minds are very unwilling to take advice, or to take suggestions from anybody else. They will go ba-ck into their committee-ro.om with their 

old notions, and they will try to get idea-s and suggestions which will 

strengthen their old notions; and If ar if we send the question back 

to them, it will come to us again in a chaotic condition after c~owhile, 

and we shall have to go to work again and do w.hat we have been 

doing now; and we shall have to waste as much tim-e hereafter as we have already wasted on this subject. 

This ,currency question is the great one of the day. Whether the 

proposition.that I produce will bring great results or not, it will produce this: it will give confidence to the people in their representatives; it will satisfy them that we have some proposition looking to 

their benefit; and that is w bat we need now more than anything else. 

Mr. MORTON. Mr. President, the motion to refer these propositions back to the Committee on Finance is a seductive one; but I 

submit that there can now be no very g()t)d reasons for it. As has 

been just said by the Senator from Pennsylvania, the committee had 

this whole question before them for nearly three months and all that 

they have offered here is -what my friend behind me [Mr. SHER11IAN] 

calls this '~little bill," to take twenty-five millions from New England and give it to the States in the South. He says it is simply to 

carry out the law of 1870. It is a new bill in every sense. The act 

of 1 70 is a dead letter. The provision was inadequate four years 

ago; it is grossly inadequate now; and everybody knows it. My 

friend himself admits it is only a half-way measure. It is not that, 

even; it is less than a third-way; and now when the committee came forward to give us a bill, why did they not give us an adequate 

bill f Why come forward with a little piece of patch-work after 

three months' incubation during this session 'l 

Mr. President, what excuse can there be for this act of spoliation 

upon New England except upon the prinCiipJe that the currency shall 

not be increa ed at ·all-for disguise it as you will, it is in the nature 

of a spoliation ¥ Can you take $~,000,000 from the loans and discount 

of three or four States without producing disastrous result.s Y My 

friend from Massachusetts, not no win his seat [Mr. BOUTWELL] showed . us the other day very conclusively how a proposition to take fifteen 

millions of gold, the amount of the Geneva awMd, from England, a country plethoric with gold, threatened the financial equilibrium of 

England, and it was so adjust-ed by negotiation that the money was paid without a dollar of gold being brought to this country. He 

made that clear to us. We all understand how locking up ten or fifteen millions of currency in the city of New York will produce a panic in stocks that will :tffect the whole country; and I 1mdertake 

to say that the withdrawal of twenty-five millions from the loans and 

discounts of Mas achusetts, Connecticut, Rhode Island, and New York, 

w:ill a.ffect tho e States disastrously; and whatever my friends here 

may say about it, their people will not be content with it, and they 

will find it out. I have recently conferred with one of the most intelligent and one of the largest busine s men in Boston, who says, if it 

i upposed in the Senn,te that M?ssachusetts will consent to the withdrawal of 13,000,000 from tho loana and discounts of Massachnsetts, 

they are very much mistaken. No such consent will he given by the 

people. 

I said it was in the nature of a spoliation, and so it is. It does not come entirely from the banks thn,t were formed last, after l\fa sa- ohusetts, Connecticut, and Rhode Island bad got their share of the 

currency; but it comes as well from the bank that were first formed, 

and that got their currency legitimately. They have to contribute to 

this amount as well as the later banks. 

Now, Mr. Presiclent, there are two sets of arguments used here, I 

believe, by my fl:iend from Ohio. He told us the other day very 

emphatically that this redistribution of ~5,000,000 would suffice for 

two years to come ; thn,t it would not be t..'l.ken; and now we are told 

that free ba.nking will all a.t once flood the country with increased 

paper money. We would not take $25,000,000 in two years if it was offered, and free banking will uddenly flood the conntry with 

$1,700,000,000. One argument or the ot.her must be wrong. I submit 

that both are wrong. There is a common sense, and there- is a fair 

medium in regard to this that ought to be considered, and not go to ~xtremes upon either hand. 

Why, l\fr. President, it is contended Jtere by the Senator from Rhode 

Island not now in his seat, it is contended by others, that New England has not a dollar more of circulation than he needs; that her 

busine requires what. she has got, and I believe it. Then if you 

withdraw 25,000,000 from New England, she will confe edly have 

25,000,000 circulation less than she needs. If you give $25,000,000 to 

the South and West they will have that much more, but they will 

have very much less than they need. What kind of a bill is it that 

produces such results, that takes 25,000,000 from New England when she needs all she has, and her repre entative contencl for it on this 

floor, and gives that amount t,o the West and South, when it is far le s than they needY 

Am I not authorized a,nd justified, therefore, in calling it a mere half-way measure, a mere piece of patchwork¥ As I said before, what excuse can be made for this act of spoliation, except upon the principle that there shall not be any increase of currency under a.ny circ·um- stances f 

Mr. President, this is a generation of fault-finders. The "school 

for scandal" is the only system of common schools that now prevails 

throughout the States ; and there is nothing that is worse slandered 

and vilified than the currency. According to the argum nts made on this floor the very worst thing for this country is the currency. It 

is a wonder that there are any solvent men in the country, that we have made any progress whatever, when we consider what a villainous currency we have got. Who talks in this way about it f Is 

it the mass of the people of the United States f Not a bit of it. The 

great body of our people East and West are satisfied with this cnr- I'ency, and believe it is the best currency we. have had; and while 

they expect to come back to specie payments at some time, and want 

to do it, they want to do it natnrally; they believe that specie payment is the normal condition of the currency, when the country i in a normal condition; they believe that specie payment is the result of a condition of the country, rather than of any artificial process. You 

cannot make specie payment and retain it1 unless the country is in a condition for it; and when the country is m a condition for it, specie 

payment will come without a resort to these artificial processes. 

Now, Mr. President, how does the matter stand Y Here is a bill to 

redistribute 25,000,000 of bank currency.. My friend from Ohio has 

just said that that was intended for. the Southern States. He con- fesses by that remark that the Northwestern States are to be left out 

in the cold entirely. Of thirty-seven tates only eleven have got 

their full share of the apportionment. Of those eleven some five or six have a very large exce s. There are twenty-six States that have 

less thn,n their apportionment. The ratio of deficiency differs very 

greatly in those States. These 25,000,000 will be apportioned among 

tho e St ates having the greatest ratio of defici-ency. The result is 

thn,t ten or eleven States would not get one dollar out of this twentyfive millions; the entire Northwest would not be allowed anJ1hing 

under the apportionment. They are left standing out; they are to 

take the chances of future legislation. They are left standing in the 

pillory. Take my friend's own great State. There is no auth01ity now to organize a national bank in Ohio. There is no authority to 

organize a State bank in Ohio. That State is bound hand and foot, 

growing fa-st as she is and developing every way. There is no capacity now to organize a State or national bn.nk in Ohio. I do not believe her people are satisfied with that. If they are like the people of Imli- ana I know they are not satisfied with it. Certain clas e of her people are, a-s they are in every State. The men who e fortunes consist 

in a fixed money capital are satisfied with it. They would like any 

legislation that would increase the value of their money. I expect men to act naturally. I expect them to be for what is their interest. 

A man that has 100,000 in greenbacks, if he can have that money 

made worth 110,000 by any artificial process in the course of one year, wants it done. The men of :fixecl capital do not want more money, nor do they want more banks. Why, sir, I never knew·a village merchant who wanted another store on the opposite corner. I 

do not know of any town in my State where the banks want more banks in that town. Men are governed by their interests. I am speaking now for the mass of the people, and what I believe to be 

their interests, and what I believe to bo their desire. Here is a bill 

of redistribution which makes no provision at all for any State in the 

Northwest, and leaves twelve St ates at least that are deficient-and 

States that are grpwing, too, more rapicUy than any others in this 

Union-without the means of getting an additional dollar of banking 

circula,ti on. I appeal t,o my friend if that can be defended for one moment. I 

ask what justification c:m be offered for such a bill a that Y .If he 

undertakes to legislate for redi tribution at all it should be f·ull, it 

should be equitable. Here is a hill giving 23,000,000 to certain 

State , leaving other States unprovided for. Something may oconr in future time by which they will get it, but they h ave to t ake tlw 

chances of it. Can yo~ satisfy them with that Y Will the State of 

1\fis ·onri be satisfied with a future cha.nce t I undertake to say not. 

I h ave reason to believe that she will n ot. She h as immediate de- mands, and they are growing, and as f ast as· t hey grow t hey ought. 

to be answered aml provided for in some wa.y. Yon cannot t!lk e enough money from the States in exce s and give it t o the States ia 

deficiency without producing a panic in the Eastern States. Fifty 
1874. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD. 1553 

millions will not do it, let alone twenty-five millions. Fifty millions 

t:lken from New Englancl would result in almost the total prostration 

of business in New England. 

Mr. President, we are told that if we increa-se the national banking 

circulation we bring on speculation and we put specie payments further 

off. I do not believe ono word of it. There is-no logic in it. If you 

increase the number of national bank;s, do they not under the amendment offerecl by the Senatorfrom Pennsylvania [Mr. CilillROX] have 

to redeem in greenbacks T .Are they not mquired to have a reserve of 15 per cent. for circulation and 15 per cent. for deposits, and, if the 

banks are in a large city, of 25 per cent. for each' You increa-se the 

demand for greenbacks; you do not increase the number of greenbacks, but you increase the demand for them. So far from increasing 

the premium on gold, I believe it will rather tencl to bring it down. 

There is a great diffe1·ence between increasing the national-bank circulation and increasing the volume of greenbacks; but my friend 

talks as if it was all the same thing. It is not the s.1me thing. There 

is a radical difference. These banks have limitations. He said they were to be without limitations. They have limitations. What are they'¥ That whenever a note is presented at their counter and a demand for legal-tenders is made, they are bound to give the legal-tenuers, or, if not, that note can be protested and in the course of ten 

days the bank pot into liqniuation. They are required to redeem at 

their own counters, and they are required to have redeeming agencies 

elsewhere in one of the redeeming cities; and, what is more, if they 

fail to redeem, their.bonds may be forfeited. There is a provision in 

the law that when a bank fails to redeem, the Treasury Department 

may forfeit the bonds at their pn.r vaJ.ne. Although these bonds com- mand a premium of twenty cents in the market, the Government has a right under the law to forfeit these bonds to the Government at their 

par value, thus inflicting upon the bank the penalty of the total loss 

of the premium on its bonds. That is the provision of the law now. The Government has the discretion. It may forfeit the bontls at their 

par value, or it may order the bonds to be sold. I believe, thus far, 

it has only ordered bonds to be sold in the market; but power has been 

reserved to the Government from the beginning of forfeiting the 

bonds at their par value whenever a bank fails to -redeem its notes in 

greenbacks. As the Senator from Pennsylvania said, so far from being an obstacle in the w.ay of resumption, I believe it will contribute 

to that result. It makes money plentier, and that is what the people 

want. I can only say for my State that while we have men who want no more banks and want no more currency, and some of them would like 

to see contraction of the currency, yet the great body of the people 

of my State·want more currency, and I believe that is the general 

expression throughout the Northwest. Of course I shall be told they 

do not know what is good for them. They think they do. They think 

they know what they want. What I desire to meet is the statement ma-de here by the Senator 

from Ohio, that there is no limitation. There is the same limitation 

upon national banks in the futme that there has been in the past, 

that they are required tq redeem in greenbacks. My friend sai.d that we might have the national-bank currency rtm up to $1,700,000,000. 

Why, sir, the whole of the greenbacks would be taken up in reserves long before yon woulu get to 1,7.00,000,000. How can these banks rocure the reserves 'f The difficulty becomes greater with every 

additional -bank thlllt is organized. Banks will not be organized 

except as they are profitable and as local needs require them. Here 

and there in Iowa, lllinois, Indiana, Ohio, all around, they want 

b::tnking facilities. They cannot get them now; they .are bound 

hand anu foot ; and my friend seems determined that they shall 

remain in that condition. 

Mr. ANTHONY. I desire to ask the Senator from Indiana a question; I did not wish to interrupt him in the course of his remarks. 

He says the State of Ohio can have no increase of banking capital, 

national or State. Whose fault is it ' Do t.he people of Indiana or the people of Rhode Island prevent the people of Ohio from having 

bank capital under State charters if they want it, or do the people 

of Ohio prevent themselves from having it 'l And are we to interfere to relieve them from restrictions which they imposed upon themselves, and which they can remove whenever they choose' · Mr. MORTON. The State of Ohio cannot organize a State bank as a bank of issue, for the rea-son that Congress has passed a law taxing 

the issues of that bank 10 per cent; 

Mr. ANTHONY. The Senator spoke of bank capital, not of cir- culation. 

1\Ir .. MORTON. I was speaking of circulation. My friend understands that. Ohio cannot establish a bank of circulation because that 

circulation is taxed 10 per cent. by the United States. Therefore she 

is cut off as effectually as if there was a prohibition. The nationalbank circulation is how restricted to 354,000,000. How does my 

friend stand in regard to that matter! My friend is opposed to having a dollar of circulation taken from Rhode Island. I think he is 

right about it. He says Rhode Island has got no more than she neecls. 

He is opposed to having an increase of the whole amount of circulation to the amount of one dollar; he has said so. Therefore the position of my friend is that the States that have less than tliey need, that are growing rapidly, must remain just as ~hey are. His State has got enough. She is satisfied. She cau• afford to hold still. Other States 

that have not got enough must be satisfied, must be content with what 

-they have. That is the logic of it. . . . 

98 

Mr. ANTHONY. The Senator and I were talking of two very different things. He spoke of bank capit.aJ, and bank capital and bank 

circulation are constantly confounded in this debate. They are two 

very .different things. If my friend holds that because we have more circulation issued by our banks in Rhode Island than they have in 

Indiana, we have more money in Rhode Island for that reason, wo differ so widely that I do not think we should ever come together. When I contend against taking the circulation from the banks of 

Rhode Island, it is not because I believe it would make money any 

less plenty in Rhode Island, any more than I believe if yon were to 

take a hogshead of water out of the Potoma,c you would make a bolo 

in it. I believe it would come right back where it belongs. But I 

believe it would be an act of injustice to those institutions which were persuaded and compellecl 'into the national banking system 

under the promise that they should ha.ve a certain profit, which is 

not a. very large one; It is an injustice to them to take it from them. 

I do not believe it would make one particle of difference to the relative circulation of Rhode Island and Indiana if half our banks were taken from our State and carried there. 

11fr. IJ.Aj\fLJN. Not a. bit. 

Mr. MORTON. Let me say to my friend from Maine that it wonltl 

make a very large bit of difference; and why 'I The money that is 

issued by the banks of Rhode Island, and is loaned out, must come back there in payment of bills every few days, every two, or three, or four months. Consequently the money is constantly flowing back. 

It makes money plenty there. I am astonished to hear that argument 

made upon this floor, that it is just as well to have all the bank~!"! of 

circulation in one end of the country as to have them distributed all over the country. Men have to borrow meney. They go to the banks 

t9 get that money; and when their bills become due they take the 

money back to those banks and pay it there, and there the money is 

to loan again. If they pay it back in Providence, 't is there to be 

loaned again. If they pay it back in Indianapolis, it is there to be 

loaned again. It is a remarkable argument that it makes no differ- ence where these banks are located. 

Mr. GORDON. Will the Senator from Indiana allow me to interrupt him just there, in order to strengthen his position? I should 

like the Senator from Rhode Island to ans:wer this question : If it be 

true that money goes, without reference to the location of banks, 

where it is needed, I should like the Senator from Rhode Island to 

tell me why it was that cotton, which was needed by the J;Danufacturers in the East, and needed abroad, this fall, could not be sold for 

ten cents, when it was worth from fifteen to twenty cents, by tho 

markets of Liverpool~ Why was it that money did nd't go to Georgia 

then¥ Why, sir, if I had owned ten thousand bales of cotton in 

the town in which I live, I could not have sold it, for days and days 

together, for five cents a pound. Why' Because the money was not 

there. The banks di.d not have the money. Adopting the similitudo 

of the Senator from Rhode Island that it would flow like the water 

of the Potomac to the hole, why did it not flow to that hole then 

I ask the Senator from Rhode Island, if he can, to answer that question. 

Mr. MORTON. Mr. President, the point made by the Senator from 

Rhode Island exactly touches the very question in dispute. Why is 

it important that ea-ch locality shall have its own bank if it is able 

to establish a bank¥ First, that it may have the advantage of b~tnk 

creclits. We know that bank credits take the place of currency. 

Mr. ANTHO:YY. Tbey can have them without circulation. 

Mr. :MORTON. In the next place, that they shall have the benefit 

of the circulation, because, as I said before, when a bank of circnb.-: 

tion in Providence loans its money, that money must come back to 

Providence. Now, suppose we reverse it; suppose we t:lke the circulating banks in Providence and put them down in Indianapolis; the 

money has to go there instead of going to Providence. Is it neces n.ry 

that I should enforce a proposition of that kind V My friend says it 

makes no difference to Providence whether the banks of circulation are situated there, or in Boston, or in Indianapolis. 

l\1r. ANTHONY. Not a bit. 

Mr. 1\IORTON. Not a bit; but when it comes oo giVing up those 

banks of circulation, he says it is a great hardship; it is a wrong. Why' "Because they were forced to take.it." They were not forced 

to take it. They have got twice as much as they formerly had. My 

friend from Ohio [Mr. SHERl\fA.!.'I"] answered that argument the other 

day. He showed what the circulation of Rhode Island was before 

the war, and that it is more than doubled now. They were not forced 

to take it. They took it because it wa.s profitable. I do not blame 

them for that. They want to keep it for the same reason. My frien<l 

fights against its beillg taken from them. He represents his constituents when he does so, and I justify hlm. in doing so; but wl!.eu 

he comes here and makes an argument that it does not make any 

<li:fference after all whether they have those banks there or not, I am not satisfie<l with it. We are to be satisfied With the argument when we have not got the banks. They are to keep the banks upon the same argument. 

Sir, our people cannot be satisfied with that argument. They want 

something more substantial; and I s.ay to my friends now that if this 

national bru;Uring system cannot be made aujustable to the wants of 

the whole country it must give way. 11lnch as I (letest the olcl State . banking system, and dep1or6 its evUs, I haye 1\0 do-qht the people will 

go back to it if this is to be ~ cast .. iron system an<l the thing is to 

l·ema.in just as it is~ 

• 
1554 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD. FEBRUARY 17, 

Let me say to my friends from the South1 do not _be deluded by the 

idea contained in the argument of my friend trom Ohio. He says, "\Ve 

will give you the $25,0UO,OOO; that will be enough for you; therefore, 

why are ;y;ou talking about free banking " I tell you you will never get the $25,000,000. This Senate can be amused with this· sort of 

thioo-, n..s it has been for the last till:ee months, for the next three 

months, until the session passes by, and nothing is done, and you or I will not live to see the time when 25,000,000 will be taken by violence from the banks of three or four States. I have no iden, that that 

proposition will ever become ~he law of _this country, or 1!= it does, th.at 

it will ever be executed. It IS a delusiOn. If you get mcreased crr- culation, you must get it in some other way, upon some better principle than that, and that is all we are contending for here. 

There ha-s been a certain sort of weakness running through all this 

debate, and that weakness was that, whenever a demn,nd was made 

for the extension of equal banking facilities to all parts of the coun- try it was an attack on New England. Who has made the attack on New Encrland Y Not 1: It has heen made by those who proposed to 

take fro~ her 25,000,000 or $50,000,000 of her currency. Those are the gentlemen who make the attack upon New England. Those of us who want to len,ve New England what she has got, and simply ask 

that other parts of the country shall have what they need, are making no attack upon New England or upon the Eastern States. 

1\!r. HAMLIN. Mr. President, I surrgo::~ted in an undertone, in re- sponse to a remark that fell from tho Yips of tho Senator from Rhouo 

Island, [:Mr. ANTHONY,] that I ilid not think that if a part of this circulation were taken from Rhode Island it would make one mill differ- once in its circulation, and the Senator from Iniliana, in consequence 

of that undertone remark t.hat I made, ad<lrcssed himself to me. Mr. MORTON. Not offensively, I hope. 

l\Ir. HAMLIN. Not at all. It is only in consequence of that that 

I wish now to say a very few words. 

I can only say that he being a gentleman of so vigorous _an intellect, and with a mind so comprehensive and so intelligent, I marvel 

at the conrse of the Senator from Indiann,. It is indeed a day of 

marvels when we can heru:, hour after hour, sentiments uttered in this 

Chamber such as those we have listened to, that there are to be no evil results from an unlimited issue of irredeemable paper money. 

That Senator has read to no account the history of irredeemable paper 

money if he is disposed to again inflict its evils upon us. I believe it 

would be worse than a pestilence that should sta~ at noonday, aud 

your panic of 187-3 in the future would pale away into utter insignificance in the results that would follow such :1 wild and visionary 

scheme. I cn,n conceive of no sane man arguing soberly such a proposition. 

Now,sir, in relation to this currency. I affirm thatyoumaytake one- half of the circulation from Rhode Island, you may diminish by one- half the circulation which by law tb.e banks in that State are entitled 

to to-day, audit will not affect her circulation one mill. What isitthat 

controls the circulation of a bank, and where does that bank circulation goY It goes where the laws of trade and commerce carry it; 

ancl when the value of that currency is as good in Louisiana as it is 

in Rhode Island it will go there ; when it is as good in Georgia to purchase cotton it goes there. I knowthatunderthe old system of local 

banks, when you had your weekly or monthly clearing-house banks, or houses appropriated to that purpose, where the banks were virtually compelled to redeem at those stated periods, the circulation had a localitv, because the character of the bank beyond its own locality wa-s not 'known, and there went back through those various clearinghouses the circulation of the local banks; but how is it with the banks 

to-day f If you go into any bank in Rhode Island, I hazard the 

opinion now that in all the transactions, in all the discounts and loans, 

of those banks they do not pay out one dollar of their own bills in a hundred. Indeed I have heard a cashier of one of the bank_s say that 

it was marvelous even to find at any time a single bill of their own bank in their transactions. 

Mr. MORTON. Will t he Senator allow me a word right there f 

:Mr. HAMLIN. Certainly. 

Mr. MORTON. The banks of Providence loan their bills. A cor- responding amount of money has to como back in payment of the 

bills or notes. They may not get their own bills, or only a small part 

of them, but an equal amount of money must go there every sixty, 

ninety, or one hundred and twenty days in payment ; so that a like 

amount of money continually runs there, and it must run to every 

b:mking center. Therefore, although they send their money out in 

loans and they may not get the same bills back, they get a like amount 

of money back in payment of tho debt; and that is the advantage of 

having the banks scattered all over the country, because the money 

goes back to the money centers all the t.ime. Mr. HAMLIN. And precisely so in relation to every locality. Whatever are the business transactions in Indiana, whatever may be the 

paper negotiated there, or whatever may be the purchases made by the merchants, there go the bills, the currency with which to nego- tiate ancl pay those transactions; and it is the currency of Rhode 

Island-I use that State for illu!rtration, because it has been brought into this debate-it is the currency of Rhode Island that is used there, 

precisely as it would be used there if it were issued from a bank in 

t.he very town and ueighbOI'hood in which the transaction took place. 

There is just this and no more in the establishment of banks : They are convenient to the persons who have busine to do at them; bu+ 

when yon come to the use of tho circulation of the country, I affirm 

that it makes no difference whether tho bank be estaulishcd at tho 

point where the business is negotiated or at another point under a system like ours-a system· where the bill of an Indiana bank is just !lB good in the State of Maine as it is in the State of Indiana. 

It is that uniform value of tho currency that sends it through the 

channels of trade into the remote t corners of the llepnblic, and there 

it stays; and it is thus that tho currency of the country holds its cqni- librium, if I may use that term, or aujusts it lf to a perfect system 

and makes it as good in one place and equal in volume with that of 

another place. That, sir, is my opinion. 

Now they tell us in the. West and they tell us in the South that they 

want more banks. I am disposed, if I cn,n in any way consistent 'vith 

my duty, to givo to them the facilities of banks. I wish to do it; but 

I will vote here to-day to take 50,000,0000 from tho New England 

banks ancl give it to other sections of tho country before I will vote 

to increase an irredeemable paper cmrency one dollar. And yet the 

Senator says we resist it, and that it is an injustice. I grant that to a certain extent it may be. We entered into this banking system at a period of time when the Republic was rocking to its center, and 

when capital, always timid, was doubtful whether it would be a suc- cess or a failure, and we claim that we are entitled to some merit for 

the action that we took in that day; and we do say that this circulation is worth something to us-it is worth somewhere from lt to 2t 

per cent. pel' annum; and~ therefore, it is a hard measure now, after 

having diverted tho capital of our banks into national banks, to ask us to contract our loans and our cre(lits, and to place a portion elsewhere. But rather than meet the hazarcl n,nd the evil of addinoo more irredeemable paper money to the currency I would cheerfully 

and willingly vote to take even a larger sum than this bill proposes 

from the New England States. I think the Senator from Ohio [1\Ir. SHERMAN] this morning struck 

the precise key-note to the remedy by which we may relieve the coun- try. Why may we not provide by law that additional banks may 

be given to these localities where they say they want them, where 

they say they need them, where they say they have the capital to 

invest in them 1 Why may we not, without SIVelling our currency or adding to the irredeemable paper currency, allow them to do that 

precise thing, and retire an equal number of greenbacks when the.v 

do soV If they have the means to purchase the bonds on which to 

found the banks, they have the means to purchase the greenbacl.:s; 

and then you do not add anything to the inflation of the currency aml 

yon do not injure the loeal banks or the banks now in existence by 

taking from them the circulation to which, under tho existing law, 

they are entitled. I confess I cannot see any objection to the sng- ge tion of the Senator from Ohio, and it is the precise course which 

had sugcrested itself to my mind a-s the one which we might most 

wi ely ad'opt in this emergency ; and I would carry along with that 

also the suggestion, made at an early day, I think, in the discussion 

upon the resolution submitted by the Committee on Finance, of pur- , chasing a given quantity of gold to aid in the r·esumption of specie 

payment. • It seems to me, _Mr. President, that we cn,n ge~out of our difficulties 

in that way; but if it be true that the only issue to be presented to us here and now is of increasing our currency, irredeemable as it is, 

then we may j~st as well meet that question now and here. I would 

deem it wise to recommit the whole subject, not that I would avoid a vote upon any proposition, however wild, in my judgment, or how- ever abstract. When· the Committee on Finance submitted to the 

Senate its resolution suggestive of instruction from the Senate to that 

committee, I thought it would have been a still better mode for them to have prepared a bill which should have contained within its provisions their suggestions for all the questions growing out of.. the present 

time. They did not do so. We have come to no vote upon that res- olution; but I think it wiser now that tho whole matter should go 

to the committee, that they may return to us a bill not like this pres- ent one, simply taking the circulation of banks from one section ancl 

diverting it to another, but one which shall embrace a compact system, and meet all the jssues that necessarily grow out of the pre ent 

time. 

It seems to me that the very course of this debate furnishes us wisdom by which we mi&-ht and shonld be directed. What is the precise 

que tion before us f 1t is a bill to divert certain currency from cer- tain banks to others to be established. And what are you talking 

about \Vhat is the practical question bofore the Senate1 Hardly 

any connection with that, but one of creating a now volume of irredeemable paper money, with, as I s:1y, no additional safeguards. Tho 

Senator from Indiana [Mr. MORTON] tells us that th re are the same provisions existing -that existed at the time when the e banks wero 

created. Tme; but is it not equally true that we have been £rom the 

clo e of the war looking to a period of time when the good faith of the 

Government could be kept, and when om· curren y could be made 

equivalent in value to the metal; and I a kif, then, there is no differ- ence in the time when that banking system was cre:oted an<l now, that 

shoulu make a difference iu our action between then and nowf 

Mr. :MORTON. Will my friend allow me to ask hlm a question 'l 

1\Ir. HAMLIN. Certainly; with pleasure. 

Mr. MORTON. I want to ask my friend this qnestjon : If the 

volume of green backs is now the same, tho number is not increa ell, 

how are tho difficulties of the Government in the way of ·redeeming 
~-·· 

1874~ CONGRESSIONAL RECORD. 1555 

that given amount of greenbacks increased by adding to the volume 

of the national-bank paper f 

.Mr. HAMLIN. I will answer that,question uy a plain propos~tion. 

I have my notes out to-day for a given amount, and I have not got 

the u.bility to pay them, and to-morrow I propose to double that 

amount with no more ability to pay. I ask the. Senator from Indiana 

if he thinks I can assume and meet my liabilities when they are 

doubled, when I cannot meet them upon half that amount~ I ask if 

the Senator would not expect it would take a little longer period of 

time! W ealth is produced by labor, and in no other wa,y, and it is 

the labor of your country that has got to furnish the mea-ns with 

which to pay your indebtedness; and it is a work of time. Now, sir, 

I say it will take a longer time for the labor of the country to pay 

the national indebtedness if you increase that indebtedness. That is 

mv answer, and I think it is a practical one. i have said in this discursive way something more than I meant to 

have said, and yet there is one other suggestion that. I wish to make, now that I am on the floor. I suppose tho men who framed this law 

were wiser than we are, and I do not know that it is respectful to 

those gentlemen even to comment npon their law. I know the old 

law tells us that the circulation of the conntryshoohl be based upon 

·wealth and population. I do not think there was. anything of argument in all that language that ,yent into t he law. I think it was merely suggestive as an inducement to get the country to ent.er into 

that s. stem of banking when it became necessary to save the lifo of 

the nation; but now that is inade the basis of an a-rgument, that the 

circulation of your country shonld be based upon population. I can 

conceive o£ nothing within the scope of my imagination more ridicu- lous. I do not believe they have (l:Ot as many plows in Wall street a-s 

they have upon the prairies of Indiana; and you might tell me tha,t 

you should und rt~Lke to r egulat,e by law t hat they must have just as many })lows, according to populat.ion, in 'Vall street as theyhaYe got 

upon the prairies of Indiana. Tl1e argument would address H.self 

c::mdidlyto my judgment with just as much force if I were told they 

needed in that commercial center just the same number of agricultural implements that they nee<lell in an agricultural locality; and 

the argument is just as sensible to my mind that they need banks as mue}h in an agricultural community, in a spars~ly settleu country, as they do at cqmmercin.l centers. Yotr wn,nt currency to pay the small 

balances of tmde; you want to pay the diftorences at the cle:u:inghouses; you want enough to pay the ordinary transactions in daily 

life; and that is n,ll the currency you need unless you want to set 

afloat a wild scheme of speculation, or unless you may happen to be somewhat indebte<l an<l want an inflated currency to pay debts upon. · We have got partia,lly out of the terrible calamities of tlle war. 

It may, perhflps, be said that we ha,ve got our h ead anu shoulders 

ont. Is it wise again to immerse the country into paper money and 

ask us to go over again just so much of the grm:m<l as we have trod- den ah·eady Y And will it not be precisely t hat in r esult if we go 

back to that condition of thing3 which existed only a few years ago? 

It looks so to me; and looking at it in that way, while I have every 

disposition in the world to concede to every locality', Nor th aml 

South, East ancl West, ever-y facility that shaJJ be n ecessary, and to 

g ive them all the quoth even of banks upon population if they can furnish the means to establif:lh tllem, yet it does seem to me marvelous 

that we should see here, when the ·un i<:J going down upon the nine- teenth centm-y, aml with all the lights of the world before us, reasonable, sane men askin~? for an issue of more irredeemable paper money. From the manner m which my very esteemed friend from Illinois 

.[Mr. LOGAN] spoke yesterday, I could not donut tha,t there was in 

l1is earnest and honest convictions a belief that there was a ma,jority 

in tho S nato in favor of doing that very thing; and I confess when 

I witnessed his earnestness, nnd when I hau been appealed to to know 

what wa,s my position, for the purpose of cr.nv a.ssing the Senate, I did 

fear that tho Senator was right. I hope, however, that it may proYe 

otherwise, antl that we may find a mode of giving to those sections 

which arc demanding them more banks, without incmring tl10 perils 

that must come upon us a-s cert<Uin as the sun shall perform its circuit 

in the' heavens if we again flood this land with more irredeemable 

paper money. 

One thing more. The Senator fi·om Indi:1na said, in reply to a sug- gestion from the Senator from Ohio, that his argument was inconsistent, because h e said that if you had free banking the country 

woulcl be flooded with paper· money, and if you passed this bill . it 

would last two years, and the $25,000,000 would not be used. I do 

not see the inconsistency. When you open the door without limita.-

tion, let me tell the Senator fi·om Indiana that the State-s in which 

the larger and preponderating amount of cn.pital is situated to-day 

conld ancl would establish four banks where theStates that have not 

now their quota would establish one. Consequently, if you limit and 

place at distinct points the $25,000,000, it may be true, as the Senator 

from Ohio sail!, that you would not use it within a given time, two years, 

while if you had a system unrestricted, then, although there are more 

banks in certa-in localities than there are in others, the greatest 

:1mount wonld-be established in those places still, and yet any circu- 1:1tion that they might furnish under the present system would tind 

its own level. 

Mr. President, I di<l not merur to say so much as I have. 

Mr. HOWE. Mr. President, I believe tbe pending motion is to recomm.it this whole subject to tho Committee on Pina,nce. I have 

usually voted with my friend from Connecticut [1\fr. Bucrw'\GITA:'.:t:) 

upon all questions affecting the fina,:nces of the country. I very geuerally agree with him in his ideas of what ought to be done aml his 

methods of doing it; but I am not quite satisfiecl with the wisdom of 

t.his propo ition of his. I do not at this moment see the advantage of 

recommitting tbis subject to the Committee on Fina11ce. I do not see how they can enter upon the consideration of the subject with any 

light which has not been before them for yea,rs. They have known 

for months and years the condition of the country. They have had so much to guide them aJways. It is very true that if the subject goes 

back to them again and ·now, they will have whatever aid they ca,a 

get from a pretty protracted ancl rather voluminous debate. They 

will not have the aid of a, single expression of opinion on the part of the 

Senate itself; and, for myself, I should doubt their getting very much 

light out of the debate. I should "be mther more afraid they would 

be smothered than illuminated by it. Therefore, I am inclined to think 

the subject had better be kept here a little longer. I was the more inclined to this opinion when I beard my friend 

from Maine [Mr. MORRILL] say last evening that in spite of this longdrawn-out debn.te h e had not arrived at a conviction upon any one proposition which h ad been mooted. That is discouraging. If wo ha,ve spent all these weeks in d ebate without conveying a conviction 

to one so clear-sighted as my honorable fi·iend from faine, I think we must be very persistent, very diffose, very la.borions, if we expect, 

by debate, to bring the whole Senate to one conviction upon all the 

propositions which have been debated here. With that necessity 

before us, I am persuaded w e had better go on ; we had better keep 

the subject h ere. Besides, sir, if w~ send it back to that committee, they will occupy some time in deliberation. Thoy cannot report it bu.ck to-morrow or 

next (ln,y, probably not next week . Iu the mean time the Senate be- comes engrossed. with other topics, and whatever proposition . they 

bring ba-ck to us by and by will come to us with something of the 

freshness of novelty, although it may have been talkecl of over and 

over again in these past days. We shall come back to it again, and 

this debate would very likely be repeated again. It seems to me, 

therefore, that time must be lost by a recommittal, and truth in the end be rendered no more secure. I heard my honorablefriendfromMichigan [Mr. FERRY] say just now tha,t upon one point he had changed his mind. I do not know but 

that I shall convict myself of having changed my own upon one poin$ 

before I sit down. About the only thing I know, or ever supposed 1 

knew, about :finance, wa-s this: not that we had too much or too little 

circulation in the United States; not that too much or too little of it was in this State or in that, in this section or in the other ; but t~e 

one thing I thought I did know waa t hat theTe were certain commu- nities in that portion of the country which I best know, communities 

which have almost come into exist ence since your national banking 

law wa-s first enacted, communities which have grown very much in 

numbel'S and in business since that time, communities which require 

banking facilities, have been seeking them yea,r after year, and have 

been excluded from t hem by your law. I ha vo wn,nted to relieve agai.n!:i"tl 

that one positive local want which I thought I knew was a real one. 

There being capital, no matter wh eth er in thoselocalitiesorelsewheretha,t is not the concern of the GoverlliDent, nor mine- there bein~ 

capital somewhere, which, if you permit it, would offer banking fa-eih- ties to those communities, I thought your Jaw should ofl'er those facilities. I have wanted to r elieve against that deprivation. Senators arotmd me, particularly and notably the Senator from Ohio, 

the chairma.n of the Committee on Finance, recognize that as a real 

want, r ecognize that as the creature of youT bw, and he came before us some wooks since with a proposition to relieve it. His proposition wa,s to withdraw a certain amonnt of ha.nkbg circulation from 

a quarter of the Union where it is supposed to be somewhat in excess; 

an(l to distribate that among these communities which comp]u,in of 

this deficiency. Well, I could not vote a,ga,inst that. Whenever it is 

brought to a vote in tho Senate I f:lhall have to vote for it. I did not 

like it when it was first proposed hero. I luwe not gro\\·n fond of it 

since it first cn,me llero. I sympathize with the outcry that is raised 

on the part of that portion of tho country which is to be rifled, which. 

is to be raided upon. I believe with the Senator fi·om Indiana tha,t 

this measure will not be altogether healing in its effects; that if it 

heals a, wound in one pa1·t of the country it will create a wound in 

another part of the country. Besides that, it is not manly, -it is not 

statesman-like. What is the complaint which you have heard on tho 

part of the South and of the ·wesU Not that Rhode Island had too 

much bank circulation or bank capital; not that New York had; not 

that New England ha.d; but that certain communities in tho \Vest 

and in the South were denied their equal rights, their equal privi- leges under your law; tlaat your law created a privilege and confined 

it to a portion of the p eople of. the United States. That is not the 

office of law; that is not the privilege of law. \Vhen yonr law creates a franchise, a privilege, when it has defined the conditions upon 

which one man, or one community, or one corporation, may eirculato 

paper as money, if it undertakes to r-estrict that ri£;ht to a. por-tion of 

the American people, l'tnd to exclude from it another portion of tbe 

American people, it is a monopoly which has been denounced by all 

right law for two htmdretl years. · My friend fi·om Massachusetts [Ur. BOUTWELL] says.,-and I cm:mot 

p:1ss the occasion-that it was not denounced Ly the Supreme Court 
1556 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD~ FEBRUARY 17, 

in the Slaughter-house cases. I have two replies to make; that it 

does not militate at all against what I sa.id, for two reasons: :first, the 

Supreme Court argued that there was no monopoly before them in 

that case. If they were wrong on that and did not denounce it, I · s ... ill insist upon what I said, because then it was not the law that 

spoke. The law for two hundred years has denounced monopolies. 

I said this proposition did not strike me assta,tesman-like; for when we ask to have this restriction removed from us, what is the reply'f 

Not that it is not a restriction; not that it ought not to be removed; 

bnt instead of any proposition from any quarter; unless I accept the 

proposition which wa-s moved last evening by the Sena.tor from Penns.ylvania [Mr. CAMERON] to wipe off ~ re~tric?on and ~tall 

portions of the country to an equal participation m these pnvileges, 

my honorable friend from Ohio proposes to get up a. donation party, I 

take it, (for it resembles that more t.han anything else,) to call upon 

New England to visjt the distressed portions of the country with 

such little contributiona as she can a:flord. We are always glad to see our friends from New England when they come forward voluntai'ily, either on a ·charitable mission or any other-very glad to see them; but when they come to us in the name of charity, we want ·them to come smiling-at least not with such outcries, not with such 

complaints a-s I have heard day after day on this floor. If we have 

got to take their book of lamentations with their contributions, I 

would rather go without their contributions. 

I agree with the Senator from Rhode Island, [Mr. ANTHoNY,] I 

agree with the Senator from Maine, [Mr. HAMLIN,] that this is wrong 

treatment for the banks of New England. But I think I never saw a community so anxious to be outraged as they seem to be. They 

really insist upon havin~ this wrong perpetrated. If they do, how c::m i help myself T I said, therefore, that if you brought me to vote on this proposition, I should have to vote for it. I should like to be 

spared that humiliation. .Anrl, Mr. President, I think there is a way 

of escape open. The Senator from North Carolina [Mr. MERRDWN) 

hns discovered it. He proposes that instead of making a raid on our New England communities in order to recapture a little bank circulation, the bank circulation sliall be increased: I think he proposes an increase of forty -six millions of banking circulation. The Senator from 

P ennsylva.nj.a [Mr. CAMERON] goes him better, and proposes an unlimited increa e; that is to say:, an increaae unrestricted by law. Now I 

want to see that day. Then your law will be right in that respect; 

it will be relieved from the imputation of having created privileges 

for a portion of the .American people. I think, therefore, I shall be 

compelled. Compelled '1 No, sir; not under any spur that I know of 

except it be that of my own convictions-! shall be privileged to vote 

for this proposition of the Senator from Pennsylvania; and then your 

law will be mor~ wholesome iihan I think it is at present. 

I think some dan~er ~ght grow out of that measure standing by 

itself. I do not think that will cure every ill under which you are now suffering. I only count upon it to cure two-not enough, but 

better than none. It will reduce the number of the ills we labor 

under; it will cure two; it will break up that monopoly now existing, and it will relieve us from this necessity of making a raid on any 

portion of the co1mtry for present relief. But then there will be 

other evils in our system which will require attention. Notably 

there will be this one, that yon will still have afloat in this commu- nity a circulation of from three hundred and fifty to four hundred 

millions of promissory notes issued by your Government, notes by 

which-I say again, in spite of what has been said to the contraryyour Government promised to p ay certain sums of money. They will 

be ·afloat still, still unpaid. The proposition of the Senator from 

Pennsylvania does not reach that difficulty-does not propose to touch 

it at all. I do not think the rest of us should lose eight of it. 

My honorable friend from Iowa, who sits before me, [Mr. ALLISON,] reminds me in good time that that proposition of the Senator from 

Pennsylvania will he open to amendment when it gets before the 

Senate. I am glad to hear that. Not having seen anything amended 

for a longtime, I wa-s naturaJJ.y oblivious of that little fact. [Laughter.] · Yes, it will be open to amendment. Why not amend it'/ Why 

not, when you offer this provision to the capital of the country to 

furnish it with banking facilities everywhere to any extent that it 

will comply with the conditions of your present banking la.w, also s~y to the holders of these different promises, " If you are tired of 

them, if you would rather have an obligation of the Government 

p aying an interest of 5 per cent., not to be paid ori demand, but to 

be paid at somo future time, take it 'I" Why not say that by way 

of amendment of the proposition of the Senator from Pennsylvania Y 

What is the objection to that'/ It cannot contract your circulation, 

because here is the capital of the whole country to furnish you circula-tion based upon the cremt of the Government of the United States. 

Why not then say to the holders of these greenbacks, '~If you want 

1JO exchange them for a 5 per cont. bond, do it '1" 

:My honorable friend from Indiana [Mr. MoRTON] may say, as I think 

I heard him say a short ,time ago, that this is the best currency in tho 

world, the best currency we ever had, and that we cannot afford to give 

it up. Mr. President, I cannot agree with my honorable friend on that 

proposition. It is as good as I want myself, I admit, when I have no other use for money but to pay my bills at the hotels here in Washington, or on the way between this :tnd my home in Wisconsin; as good as I want when I have nothing to do with money but take up my note 

which my honorable friend may hold. But, Mr. President, after all 

that is said in jm1tice to this currency, it is not a good currency · for 

when you go to the clearing-house of the world, then you find that it ~acks somewhere from 8 to 20 per cent. of being good; never goou at 

1ts face there, where the exchanges of tho productions of aU the world 

:li'e made. That is not its worst difficulty. ·The worst thing to he 

said of it is that it is. at one figure one day and at another fi!!'Ure 

another day. Within the last four months, I think-within the last six 

months, any way-it has pendulated all the wn,y from 8 to 18 per cent. 

Mr. STEW ART. About 10 per cent. difference. 

1\Ir. HO"\YE· The extreme flu~tuation being 10 per cent., Mr. President, that 18 not a wholesome kind of currency. I believe this and 

I can prove, I guess, right where I stand, that the power to '~coin m~mey" ~ one of the most_ delicate and one ?f the gravest powers 

With which a government lS clothed. To com money is a pretty 

solemn enterprise; it is a pretty grave undertakin~. The government which undertakes that task owes it to mankind to make the 

very best article it can. And what are the most essential qualities 

of such an agent f One is that it should be as little fluctuatincr in 

value itself as possible; one is that it should be as porlable as possible; one is thatit should be as enduring as possible. A more indispensable ~lemell:t tha_n either or than all thes.e, I think, is this: that, so facr as ·s poss1ble, It should be a commodity equally desirable to 

every person on the face of the earth. To be a perfect money it should 

be a money having t.h.ese qualities that I speak of, and in them some- thing equally desired by every body on the face of the earth. No 

paper can ever have this last qu~lity, no matter who makes it-whether a bank or a government. No coin can realize it fully. A coin upon 

which all the commercial nations of the earth had agreed in ,stamping one value would come pretty near this quality. But the Government having fixed the character of the comm·odity which shall 

bo known as money, havirig complied with these conditions, made 

the best article it can, then one other duty rests upon it, in my jndg~ 

m~nt, to wit: that in tim? of _p~ace, ex?ept moved by some great. 

eXIgency, that government 18 cnmmal which allows anybody to circnlate anything elso a-s money unless it be convertible into this money on demand. The government which authorizes my friend, myself, or you, or a bank, to circulate its promises as money upon any other con- dition than that they _shall be converted on demand into th:lt which 

the law acknowledges to be money, is criminal; and when the Government undertakes to circulate its own promises, not convertible, it 

too is criminaL I cannot doubt it. There is no escape from it. 

I must not be misunderstood. I recognize the full nature of that 

great exigency which forced our Government upon this experiment 

of circulating its own notes. I know all about that. I know what 

their divine mission has been. I know how beneficent the action of 

this paper has been heretofore. But, sir, that was to meet an emer- geney, an emergency which has passed; and I always thought, while 

that was the only exigency.! ha-d ever seen which would warrant 

such an experiment, that the Government meant anu that the Government ought to do what on the face of this paper it said it would 

do-pay it and get it out of the way. 

1\fr. President, instead of looking with any dread upon the retirin(J' 

of these greenbacks, therefore, I have only one anxiety about it, that 

it shall not be done in such a way as to lesse,n the facility for paying 

the existing obligations of the country. . Mr. 1\IORTON. Will my friend say how he would do it Y P erhaps 

I did not hear that part of his speech. How would he retire them 'I 

1\Ir. HOWE. 1\Ir. President, I would authorize your Secretary of 

the Treasury, just as fast a-s he issues bank-notes under the proposed 

law of my friend from Pennsylvania, [Mr. C.Al\:IERON,] to convert an interest-bearing bond into greenbacks, and bu,rn up the greenbacks; 

and there you are with the same amount of circulation that you had 

before, varying in chara-cter; there are a hundred thousand or a million le s, as t he case may be, of United States notes, but the same quantity of bank,notes in their pla-ces. 

1\Ir. BUCKINGHAM. How would you have the banks redeem f 

Mr. HOWE. I do wi h my friend from Connecticut would not ask me questions; but he does. He wants to know how I would have 

the banks redeem. I would have them redeem their debts just as my friend redeems his, in legal-tenders. 

Mr. BUCKINGHAM. Where would be the legal-tenders then t· ?!Ir. HOWE. Noxt week 100,000 of them are converted into bonds; 

the next week 1,000,000 ; and so on; and by v.nd by I should hope, 

in God's providence, the last one would disappear. How would tha 

banks redeem their paper then f In what was left with the character 

of legal tender upon it. I do not know of anything that would ba 

left but coin. I should not expect anything to be left of that character but coin. I should expect the banks to redeem their paper in coin, 

the coin of the Republic. , 

Mr. BUCKINGHAM. Will the Senator allow me to ask him a 

question 

J'tir. HOWE. I give way. 

J\fr. BUCKINGHA.M. I should like to have the Senator show how 

the banks ClUl redeem their notes in coin when the legal-tender notes 

shall all be retired or converted into bonds ; and how the banks can maintain that redemption, if the Government cannot maintain it now f 

What ability will there be in the bankS, or what change will there be 

in the busines relations of this country, -to enable the banks to furnish on demand all the coin which ~y be necessary to meet the balance 

of tro.de against us, when the Government cannot do it Y 
1874. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD. 1557 

Mr. MORTON. I suggest to my friend from Connecticut that that 

is a pretty hard conundrum. [Laughter.] 

.Mr. HOWE. Now that is discouraging. [Laughter.] When I 

have my honora.ble friend from Connecticut -to put questions, and my 

honomble friend from Indiana to make affidavits that they cannot be 

answered, it is v, little discouraging. · :1\Ir. President, am I mistaken about this f I say the Government of 

the United States cannot redesm its promises in coin; and the reason I assign for that is because the Government of the United States is a bankrupt, is a pauper, without resources, without a dollar for that 

purpo e. It can lay taxes. That is the end of its resources. It is 

liable to be called into a court of bankruptcy, my friend from Ohio 

[Mr. SHERMAN] suggests to me, because its paper has been unpaid for 

fourteen days. The Governmtmt can ~ay taxes. That is the end of 

its resources. It never does and never dares to lay a tax except to 

meet a current expense. That is one reason why the Government 

cannot redeem its paper. 

There is another re~on. It has no business relations with everybody; it has no breath; it has no life. Everybody preys on the Government; everybody goes for the Treasury. When there is a chance 

to grab something there, the grab is ma{je, if it is nothing more than an additional salary. [Laughter.] 

Mr. President, I do not think capitalists could redeem the same amount of paper. I do not think a bank can pay four dolla,rs with one, 

any more than the Government can. That is not what specie payment means. It means simply that those who furnish the paper will supply to the holders of the paper whatever amount of coin the lmsine s of the country demand. That very thing. has been done from the 

time your banks. closed in 1861 down to this time. CapitaJ has furnished busine s with all the coin it needed. 1\fr. STEWART. Jut as they do in France now. · Mr. HOWE. So here now, you want to pay a bill of exchange in London or in Paris; go into a bank and you will get it. Capital upplies 

it now. The bank charges you a premium, to be sure. Why! Not 

because that enables them any better to furnish the bill. They charge 

you that premium because some uncrucified whelps who were gambling yesterday on Wall street mn the premium up to 12 or 15 per 

cent. That i the reason why the bank here charges you a premium. 

Capital does furni h this coin. While you make believe it does not, 

it furnishe it. If you were to change your countenance and ltll make 

believe that it did, I think capital, instead of strai,ning harder t.o furnish coin, would furnish it 'much easier. I admit that if a; panic should 

sweep the country ; if you were all to be overtaken by lunacy at once ; 

if you had a bank-note circulation o£ 00,000,000, and everybody who 

had any of these notes should be suddenly overtaken by the insane 

idea that he must have a dollar of coin for it, he would not be able to 

get it. That would not be the fault of the banking system, it would 

not be the fault of the banks, it would be your fault. Banks always 

have, with scarcely an exception, met the real obligation existing 

between them and their customers ; that is, furnished so much coin a was required for business. When in addition to that a scared people have raided upon them for what they did not want, the banks 

have not been able to respond. 

Sir, I must pas over this whole matter, simply by repeating my 

conviction that instead of this greenback currency being the best 

currency in the world, that which is convertible into nothing, a paper 

of solid value, re_presenting capital, and convertible into the coin of 

the Republic, is a paper infinitely to be preferred. 

But, Mr. President, we ought to a.,o-ree to one or the other of these 

propositions. The world was very old indeed before we resorted to 

the expedient of a Government paper. I do not think when that 

eX]_1edient was resorted to anybody contemplated that we should ever undertake to keep that in circulation, a.nd to make it convertible on demand into coin. But if it be the judgment of the statesmen who 

occupy eats on this floor to-day that the Government can fix itself 

in some way in which it can keep this paper in circulation, and make 

it convertible, and that bank paper cannot be made so convertible, 

say that-try jt. If you can do it, if it is the right of the Government to circulate the paper, it should circulate the whole. of it; it 

should not share this privilege with any private corporation whatever. 

There hould be no two opinions, in my judgment, on that point. 

I do not see what practical difficulty there is, therefore, in our beginning to vote some time or other, if I should ever get through 

with my remarks, [laughter,] on some of these propositions. I do not 

see, if you are really willing that other portions of the country should 

have any banking facilities, wlly you should not do it in accordance 

with the plan suggested by the Senator from Pennsylvania, [1\fr. 

CAMERON.] The only po ible objection I think that can be urged or ha been urged against that, is the danger of inflation. Well, if 

yon provide some such waste-gate as I have suggested, taking up the . exces , funding your exce s in the bonds of the Government, then 

you are guarded a-gainst inflation. I see no objection to that, uuless 

you are unwilling that the peopl_e of the United States should pay 

5 per cent. interest for money. I do not think any one is going 

to take that ground. I do not think that is an unreasonable interest 

to pay. So then, if no one else does, when the time comes, I think I 

shall offer a.n amendment in accordance with the suggestion of my 

friend from Iowa [Mr. ALLISON] to the proposition of the Senator 

from Pennsylvania, and I hope the Senate will agree to it; and if the 

Senate should agree to it, I shall have great plea ure in voting then 

for that bill which will remove these restrictions on banking. 

1\Ir. ALLISON. I hope my friend from Wi conslltwill not interpret me as proposing any amendment. I simply suggested that it 

would be open to amendment. 1\Ir. HOWE. He put the possibility of moving an amendment. 

1\lr. ALLISON. I do not care to father the amendment. 

Mr. HOWE. Now I do not want to sit down without saying to 

the Senator from Ohlo [.1\Ir. SHERMAN] one thing. When he was on the floor a short time since, I rose to ask him a question for information, and the Senator objected to being interrupted. .Mr. President, 

I waived my right; but I want to submit to the Senator that it was my parliamentary and my constitutional right to interrupt him for 

the purpose of asking a question. When one is making a formal 

speech, it is not quite good taste to indulge in such. interruptions; 

but the Senator from Ohio, I submit, is employed as a teacher. He 

stands at the head of the Finance Committee. He is ex offwio the 

teacher of the Senate. This is the subject with which he is especially 

familiar. I insist we have a right to a k him, in addition to hi 

speeches which he makes for the general enlightenment of the Senate, 

that he shall give special lessons to any neophyte, particularly, anxious 

to be informed on this subject. . 1\fr. SHERMAN. I will answer my friend any que tion he may put 

to me. I- do not consider myself able to teach him, but I will try to answer any question. . 1\.Ir. HOWE. The privilege I asked wa this specific one; it was this specific privilege that was denied. I am not arraigning the Senator; I am not finding fault with him; I am only a erting what I 

think is the right of a Senator on this floor; particularly when the 

floor is occupied by one especially charged with the investigation of a particular subject, we have a right to put inquiries to him about it. 

This might be abused. I know very well the Senator from Ohio will 

not insist that I have ever abused it, or intended to abuse it. Debate 

cannot have its full benefits, its full advantages, without this right. Mr. SHERJ\.IAN. Before the Senator takes his seat, I will say that 

I am ready to answer any question he puts; but, at the same time, I 

do object; as a matter of daily practice, to this constant interruption 

of Senators. Indeed, it has grown up of late; and I think we ought 

not to have any questioning unless when a Senator is through, and 

then if any Senator desires to make an inquiry let him put it, and it can be properly answered. . • Mr. THURMAN. Mr. President, I have no.t said a word on this 

great ~object, and if the Senate is not impatient to adjourn at this 

hour, I should like to occupy ·about fifteen minutes. :Mr. FENTON. Would not the Senator prefer to go on to-morrow Y 

Mr. THURMAN. No ; because I have no et speech to make; and 

I ,have risen to say what I have to ay in the briefe t po sible time. 

The Finance Committee of the Senate reported a bill to carry into 

execution a previous law which has not been executed, and the non- execution of which, in my humble judgment, is without sufficient x- cuse. Forthwith this bill, perfectly simple in its character, providing for nothing but the execution of a law which we ourselves pa ed 

but a few years ago, is loaded down with every po sible kind of proposition that the ingenuity of man can devise on the subject of finance, 

ba,nking, and the currency- propositions the most inconsistent, and some of them, to use a very mild term, the most extraordinary. 

This satisfies me that you cannot touch any branch of this question 

in this body without having the whole subject brought into discussion; not simply speeches made upon it, but propositi<ms submitted 

for legislation, and legislation of the largest and most important charact4ir. .Although the charters of the national banks do not expire, 

any of them I believe, before 1884, now ten years in advance of that we are to have a discussion upon the relative merits of national-banknota currency and greenbacks, and measures to be taken either to 

enlarge and perpetuate the national-bank system or to dispense with 

it altogether; and that, too, upon eYel'Y finance measuTe that the 

committee can report. 

Mr. President, it has been said that the Am..erican people are em- inently practical. I begin to believe that the Senate of the United 

States has not that characteristic. That it is eminently talkative the 

debates on finance for tho last two months have amply shown. I 

take my full share of the 1·esponsibility for talking on other matters. 

On this, fortunately for me, I have perfectly clean skirts. 

Now, sir, in view of the fact that the Senate will not let the com- mittee report any measure, and let it stand Qn its own merits, and 

etther adopt it ·or vote it down, but will load it with all sorts of 

propositions upon the general subject, I am for recommitting this 

bill to the committee, and let them bring in what they in their wisdom think is the best mea.aure to be submitted to the Senate. They 

have shown that they think themselves competent to do that thing, 

and I confess that I have been slightly amused when I have looked 

at the resolution which they reported, and aJ.so at the amendments 

that have been proposed to it. On the lOth of December last, more than two months ago, the Committee on Finance reported this resolution: 

Resolved," That it is the duty of Congress durin~ its present session to adopt definite measures to redeem the pledge made in tne act approved March 18, 1869. entitled "An acl to stren~then the public credit," as follow : "And the United 

States also pledges im faith to make provision at the earliest practicable period 
1558 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD. -, FEBRUARY 17, 

for the r edemption of the Unitell States notes in coin;" and the Committee on Finance is dirnctt3d. to report to thl} S3nate. at as earl_y a. day as practic:1ble, such 

me:t.Sures ns will Dot oulr redeem this pledgo of the public faith, but willa! o furnish a currency of unifoi·m value, a.l ways reneemablo in golcl or its equivalent, and so ndjnsted as to meet the changing wants of tL·a[le and commerce. 

Mr. Pre-siclent, it must be borne in mind all the t1me that this resolution comes from the committee, and it therefore assumes that that com- mittee is capable of doing, what f That it is capable of reporting meas- ures that will redeem the pledge of the United States "to provide 

at the earliest practicable p.:lriod for t'he redemption of the United 

ctates notes in coin." The committee .asserts its competency to do 

that. In the next place, it asserts its competency to report measures that will "furnish a currency of uniform value, always redeemable in 

gohl or its equivalent." That is the second thing that it affirms its 

competency to do. Then in the third place, to report measuTes for 

such a cunency as will be "so adjusted a-s to meet the chan~ing wants 

of trade and commerce," whateYer that may mean. Now, if the c-om- mittee has this competency, which it asserts by offering this resolution, I want it to report its measures; ancl the only wonder is that it 

has not reported them long ago. Why did they come to the Senate 

to ask us to tell them to do that which they assert they are able to 

do Y They had the whole subject before them by the reference of 

that portion of the Pre3ident's message relating t.o finance and tho 

currency to that committee, and from the very consti·tution of the 

committee and its functions and duti~ as prescribed by the Senate. I can see some rea1son why this tub was thrown "to the whale- to produce a lengthened debate in the Senate while the country recover ed 

from the panic in which it was plunged last September, and which 

continued to some extent even to the meeting of the Congress ; but, as a practicable measure, as a practicable initiation of legislation, what 

in the world was the use of that resolution Y 

The committee which is charged with the consideration of this sub- j ect, and which is supposed, and rightly supposedl no doubt, to have more information upon it than auy~ody else in the Senate or than 

the great body of Senators, affirms its competency to do that which 

it considers to be so desirable for the country, and which so larrre a portion of the Senate and of the whole country think is so desirable; 

and yet instead of reporting a measure, we have had two months' 

debate upon a mere abstraction, and all the political economy that 

could be found in books or in newspapers has been dealt out to the 

Senate of the United States. I do not say this because I a.asume to scold or to reproach any gent leman, or to condemn the course that has been ta}ren; but I do say 

that it strikes a practical man as a little extraordinary indeed that, 

when the committee is competent to do what this resolution professes 

it to be competent to do, it has not done it long ago; and I am for 

giving it the opportunity to do it. - Then we had a substitute for this resolution offered by the Senator 

from Michi~an, [.Mr.- FERRY] who asks us to strike out all a-fter the 

word " r esolved," and inst.ruct tho committee as follo!VS: 

That the Committee on Finance is directed to report to the Senate at a-s early a day as pr acticable such measures as will restore commercial confidenceWhat does that mean, I should like to know V What "commercial confidence" is shaken that requires legislation to restore it? I should 

like to have some explanation of that; I have heard none yet. Then 

what nextfand give st.'\bility o.nd elasticity to the circulating medium. 

That is a little funny. Mr. HAMLIN. India rubber. 

Mr. THURMAN. No; if it was made out of India rubber it would 

not be stable. It is to be stable; that is, to be fixed; and it is to be 

elastic; that is, it is not to be fixed. [Laughter.] That is that thing. Then as to the mod1U1 of making it stable and elastic, that is, fixed 

and not fixed ; that is, "through a moderate increase of the currency." 

I have h eard nothing like that since General Jackson's famous letter 

about "a judicious tariff," which captured P ennsylvania,; for who was there that could oppose a judicious tarifff Now, what is" a moderate increase of the currency f" I shonlu like to know. One ~entleman says $46,000,000, another says $80,000,000, and some papers m the country are saying a thousand millions. What is "a moderate increase of the currency Y 11 Is there any usc in sending such 

instructions as this to the committee¥ "\Vhat light do they shed 

upon this subject T ·what advantage to the committee are they 

What directions do they give to them Y This assumes that they can do: what' That they can report measures that will restore 

commercial confidence. "Well, the committee have not said. that. They assume a great competency by their own resolution, but they 

have not assumed that. Then they are to report measures that will 

give "stability and elasticity to the circulating meclium." That I 

think would trouble them; and then that can be done "through a 

moderate increase of the currency." Well, I want them to. investigate 

and see what they can do. I do not waJ+t·t.o tell them to do it, for I 

h aYe very great doubts whether ·they can do it-immense doubts 

whether they can do it. Until they affirm that they are competent 

to do that, as they have affirmed that they are competent to uo that 

which is prescribed in the original msolntion, I will not give thorn 

any instructions on the subj ect. . · Bnt now, Mr. President, a few 1)J_'actic'al words on this question. Is 

it not vlain that we cannot in open session mature any ;measure ab 

initio on this subject Y .Are we going to dispense whh the Finau_ce Committee Y Is it a committee of no uRo, h:ts it no functions to :perform, ha-s j.t no special competency for it,s duty, that we shall take 

_everything out of its hands, and whenever it reports anything, any 

me3sure, however plain and practical and simple it may be, the ~enato 

must go to work and draft here in the Senate measures t hat; shall 

regulate all the financial and banking and business of tho country V 

No, sir; thei·e is no nscin having a committee if that is to be attempted. The right way r in my humble judgment, is to send these mea· ures back, without instTUctions,_ to thitt committee where they belong ::md 

to whom they were committed by our reference of the President's rues age last December. Send this bill back to that committee ; antl 

let it in its own wisdom report to us such measures as in its belief 

the interest of the country d~mands. Then it will be for us to con- sider them, anu to agree with them or disagree with them, to mnen<l 

and modify them if necessary, or reject them altogether, or adopt 

them. That is the way to got at practical legislation. If you pur- suo the course you have been taking, I venture to say tha£ the end. 

of. this ~ession will find us without one sifl:gle practica-l measure upon 

this subJect on th~ statute-book. Yo~ will n!3ver get any practicaJ. mea-sme at all until you devolve on tb1s collliD.lttee, to whlch the sub- ject belongs, the duty, and the r esponsibility too, of recommending 

such practica_l measure~ in tho form of legisl:;ttion as in their judgment they think are wtse. You go on h ere Wl.th a debate indefinite 

and interminable, until everybody will get sick with it, country and 

all .- But send it back to the committee; they will have bad the benefit of tho opinions that have been expressed, the able speeches no doubt that have been made; and let them h·ame such a measure as they in their judgment think right, and bring that before the Senate 

for its consideration. I shall therefore vote to refer back the whole 

subject whenever: I can get -the opportunity to do it1 to that com- mittee, and without any instructions whatsoever. 

M.r. ANTHONY. Mr. President, I wish to say a single word. The 

Senator from Georgia [:i\Ir. GORDON] proposed a question to mo, :tlld 

I endeavored to get the floor to reply, but I was superseded by Senators who are much better able to discuss the question than I am; and 

I did not care to intrude. If I understood him aright, the Senator 

irom Georgia asked me if there was money enough, if theTe wcro-no evils that an increased amount of ounency would not cure, why it was thAt there was a few months ago such an enormous discrepancy 

between the price of the great staple of the South in southern mar- kets and in the northern markets; why it was when cotton could bo 

sold at ten cents a pound in the southern markets, and was worth a 

great deal more than that in the. northern markets, it was not purchased at tho South, and why men in the North did not take advantage of that state of affairs, and the men in the South ditl not take 

advantage of it I do not see the pertinence of the question to the 

matter which is under consideration, because, certainly, it could not 

have been owing to any difference in the currency. The relations 

bet·ween tho cotton markets of the·North and the cotton markets of 

the South are now in their normal condition; and yet, with the ex- ception of the additional is ue of part of the forty-four million 

reserve, which I think is not more than twenty-five millions, there is no more currency afloat now than there was before. It could not 

have been owing to any deficiency of currency, because ·if it was owing to that it would not be cured now. Bnt, moreover, the same disturbance of the relations between the cotton markets of Liverpool 

and the cotton markets of the South existed, as between the cotton 

markets of theN orthern States and the cotton markets of 1,ho South. 

Certainly there was money enough in Liverpool. I suppose_- the rea- son was the panic which disturbed, overthrew, and for the time 

almost annihilated all the laws of trade and of finance. The reason was because no man dared to make any future contracts; because the 

manufacturers either closed their mills or bought from hand to mouth. 

No man dared to put out his obligations. Now we see the normal 

condition of things restored, and, practically, upon the same volume 

of currency. 

I think my friend from Indiana [:Mr. MORTON] put a question to 

me, why it was if we did not think the disproportionate amount of 

currency which we have in our section of the cotmtry was an advantage, we were so unwilling to have it withdrawn. My friend h·om 

Indiana did not listen to me in the fow remarks I made on this 

question with anything like tho attention that I always do to him or he would have known that I never have objected to withdrawing 

the cmrency upon any other grounds than that to do so would bo 

unjust to the ba,nks with which we made a contract. We told them 

that if they would in vest in this system of bankin~ they should have 

certain acl vantages. I think it is not fair, I think It is not good fai th, 

to take them away. So far as the State of Rhode Isltl,ndis concerned, we shall have more money to loan if this circulation is taken from 

us than we have now, beca"use for every ninety dollars we have put 

out we have had to buy a hundred-dollar bond which costs 115, nml 

then we have to pn t 15 per cent. in the I'e erve. But I say it is mlfa ir 

to those with whom we made the contract. It is a violation of public fait. h. 

Mr. MOR~ON. I would say to my friend, as he lives on the coast, 

that when a wave break on the shore and clashes up on the beach, 

the wator£nns right back into the ocean. So when tho banks of Providence thTow out their currency in loans and di<Jconnts to any part of 

the country, it runs right back to the bank center. That is ,yhat 
1874. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD. ·1559 

always takes pla.ce. That is the advantage of having banks everywhere. 

1\fr.ANTHONY. But you must have the water. How are you going 

to get the currency unle you have the ca,pital to buy it wHh 1 If 

you apportion ten millions of cmTc,ncy to the State of Indiana, sho mu t have the capital to get the curr ncy with, and the capital of In illana can be employed much mm·e pr~fi.tably than in banking. 

Mr. MORTON. .Allow me to suggest there that that is c;me of tho 

mistakes that tho Senator and others have made in this debate all the 

time. They say we have not got tho water; we have not got the capi- . tal. They a sumo that we ar~ poor. · Mr. ANTHONY. No, sir. 1\fr. MORTON. If wo are poor,. of course we caunot take it. I say we ha,ve the capital; but we cannot invest it, because you do not allow us to do so. l\1r. ANTHONY. I bog pardon of my friend. I say the State of 

Indiana can employ its capital more profitably than in banking, not 

that it has not capital. 

Mr. 1\IORTON. Let us judge. 

:Mr. ANTHONY. Let not my friend put into my mouth what I did 

not say. 

1\!r . .l'IIORTON. No. . 1\fr. ANTHONY. We know Indiana is·wealthy; and I say it may 

employ its wealth more profitably than putting it into bank circulation, which yields abont It per cent. profit. 

l\h. MORRILL, of 1\Ia.ine. Evidently wo shaH not conclude this 

bill to-night, and I want a short executive session. I move that the 

Senate proceed to the consideration of executive business. . The motion was agreed to. 

MESSAGE FTIOM TilE HOUSE. 

A message from tho House of Representatives, by Mr. LLOYD, its 

Chi f Clerk, announced that the House had pas ed a bill (H. R. No. 2074) to amend an act entitled "An act to provide for the establishment of a military prison, and for its government," approved l\1arch 

3, 1873; in which the concurrence of the Senate was requested. 

E~"ROLLED BILLS SIGNED. 

The roes age al o announced that the Speaker of the House had 

signed the following enrolled bills; and they.were thereupon signed 

by tho President of tho Senate pro tempore: 

A bill(H.R. No.17Gl) granting certain swamplands in Holt County, 

l\1i ouri, to said HOlt Cotmty, for school purposes; and · A bill (H. R. No. 1769) for the relief of Colonel DanielMcCluro, assistant payma..ster-goneral. 

HOUSE BILLS REFERRED. 

The bill (H. R. No. 1284) authorizing the chief clerk of tho War 

D partmont to si~n requisitions on the Treasury during the temporary absence of tho Secretary of War, was rea,d twice by its title, and referred to the Committee on Finance. . The bill (H. R. No. 2073) restricting the refunding of customs duties 

and prescribing certain regulations of the Trea ury Department, was reacl twice by it<> title, and r eferred to tho Committee on Fina,uce. 

Tbe. bill (H. R. No. 2074) to amonu a,n act entitled" An act to provide for the establishment of a military prison and for it· government," 

approveu March 3, 1873, was read twice by its title, and referred to 

the Committee on :Military Affairs. · 

EXECUTIVE SESSION. 

The Senate proceeded to the consideration of executive business. 

After five minutes spent in executive session the doors were reopened, and (at fouro'clock.and fifty-fiveminntes p.m.) the Senatea.djourncd. 

H OUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES. 

TUESDAY, February 17, 1874. 

Tho House met at twelve o'clock m. Prayer by the Chaplain, Rev. 

J . G. BUTLER, D. D. 

Tho Journal of yesterday was read and approved. 

The SPEAKER. The morning hour begins at ten minutes past 

twelve o'clock, and reports are in order from tho Committee on Military Affairs. W A.R DEP ARTME!I."T REQUISITIOXS. 

• Mr. COBURN, from the Committee on Military Affairs, reported back a bill (H. R. No. 1284) authorizing the chief clerk of the War Department to sign requisitions on the Trea..sury during the temporary absence 

of th Secretary of War, with the recommendation tha,t it do pass. 

The bill, which was read, provides that when, from illness or other cause, the Secretary of War is temporarily absent from the War Department, he may authorize the chief clerk of the Department to sign 

rcqui itions upon the Treasury Department, and other papers requiring tho signatme of said Secretary; the same, when signed by the 

chief clerk during such temporary absence, to be of the same force 

and effect as if signed by the Secretary of War himself. 

Mr. HOLMAN. I wllih to inqrnre whether this practice has been 

nulnlgctl in by·any oth r Department of the Government' It confers 

101po:rtant powers upon this chief clerk. 

1\!r. COBURN. It has not been indulged in by a,ny ot.hor Department, but there is no Assistant Secretary of War. It is a matter of 

convenience, and is recommended by the Secretary of War himself. 

It is one which, so far a t he committee can see, will work no harm. 

Of course .the Secretary of War will not authorize it except in extreme cases. 

l\Ir. HO~IAN. It is a grave responsibility to impose upon this 

chief clerk. · The bill was ordered to bo engrossed and read a third time ; and 

being engrossed, it wa..s accordingly read the third time, and pas ed. 

1\fr. COBURN moved to r econsider the vote by which the bill was passed ; aud also moved that the motion to reconsider be la,id on the 

table. 

The latter motion was agreed to. 

ISSUE OF TOBACCO TO TRE ARl\IY. 

~1r. COBURN. I am directed by the Committee on Military Affairs 

to report back, with the recommendation that the committee be uischarged from the further consideration of the samo, and thc<tt it do 

lie on tho table, a bill to authorize the issue of tobacco to enlistcu men of tho Army. 

The SPEAKER. There does not appear to·be any.record tha,t this 

bill was over referred to the committee. Mr. COBURN. It was referred in connection with a communication of the Secretary of War. 

The SPEAKER. This is an illustration of the inexpediency of 

having bills referred in that way. 

fr. COBURN. Let the record be altered so a..s to refer to the com- munication of the Secretary of ·war. There was no objection; and tho committee was discharged from 

the further consideration of the memorial of the Secretary of War, 

asking the passa-ge of a law providing for the issue of tobacco to 

the enlisted men of the Army. 

GE!I."ERAL DON CARLOS BUELL. 

Mr. COBURN. I am instructed to present a report of the Committee ou :Military Affairs, in relation to the communication of the 

Secretary of War, concerning a copy of the proceedings in the matter of the comt of inquiry in the case of General Don Carlos Buell. I ask 

that the report be read. 

The report was read. Tho committee to whom was refened the 

letter of the Secretary of War in relation to the copy of the proceedings in the matter of the court of inquiry in the case of General Don 

Carlos Buell, which is to bo furnished by him to Congress, state that 

they have had the samo nuder consideration, and find that a copy has 

been put on file in the office of the Secretary of War; that there is no ftmd out of which to pay for the required copy, and no clerk to do 

the work. They therefore recommend that the sum of $500 be appropriated to employ a copyist to do the work of transcribing tlte 

said record, which the report of the Secretary of War shows to con- tain one hundred thousand words. The committee recommend the 

passage of the following resolution: 

Resolved, That the Committee on Appropriations be in tructen to r eport in the proper bill :m appropriation of $500 to enable the Secretary of War to furnish Con· gress with a copy of the proceedings of the court of inquiry concerning General Don Carlos Buell. • 

The resolution reported by the Committee on :Military Affairs was agreed to. 

NAVIGATION OF SNAKE RIVER, IDAHO. 

l\1r. HAWLEY, of Illinois, from the Committee on Military Affairs, 

reported back the bill (H. R. No. 44.2) authorizing the Secretary of 

War to have a survey and estimate made of the cost of removing 

obstructions to navigation from Snake River in the Territory of Idaho; 

and moved that the committee be discharged from its further con- sideration, and that it be referred to the Committee on Commerce. 

The motion was agreed to. 

MILITARY PRISOX. 

Mr. HAWLEY, of illinois. I am also instructed by the Committee on Military Affairs to report back the bill (H. R. No. 1035) 'vith an amendment in the nature of 2 substitute. The substitute (H. R. No. 2074) to amend the act entitled" An act 

to provide for the establishment of a military prison, a.ndfor its government-," approved l\Iarch 3, 1873, was received and read a first and 

second time. The bill proposes so to ameud the said ant that all acts and things 

therein required to be done and performed at Rock Island, in the 

State of Illinoi~ shall be done and performed at the military reser- vation at Fort Leavenworth, in the State of Kansas, provided t.hat 

the Government buildings, now on said military reservation at Fort 

Leavenworth, shall bo modified and used, so far as practicable, for 

the purposes of said prison. The question was on ~rdoring the bill to be engrossed and read a third time. 

Mr. HAWLEY, of illinois. At tho last session of Congress a law 

was passe<l for the pmpose of establishing a military prison at Rock 

Island, in, the State of Illinois. That act was approved on the last 

day of th~ session, the 3d of March. The first section of that act is in 

these words : That there shall be est..,blisherl at Ro k I sland, in tho St.."l.te of lllinoi.s, a. prison for the confinemoutand reformation of offt:>udors against the rules, regulatio.us, and