IN THE UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT

FOR THE NORTHERN DISTRICT OF TEXAS

DALLAS DIVISION 

UNITED STATES OF AMERICA ( NUMBER 3: 04-240-G 

(

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VERSUS ( 

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HOLY LAND FOUNDATION, ET AL. ( July 18, 2007

__________________________________________________________

VOLUME 3

VOIR DIRE EXAMINATION

BEFORE THE HONORABLE A. JOE FISH

__________________________________________________________

A P P E A R A N C E S:

For the Government: MR. JIM JACKS

MR. BARRY JONAS

MS. ELIZABETH SHAPIRO

MR. NATHAN GARRETT

Assistant United States Attorney

UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE

NORTHERN DISTRICT OF TEXAS

U.S. Courthouse 

1100 Commerce Street

Dallas, Texas 75242

214/659-8600

For the Defendant and Shukri Abu Baker:

MS. NANCY HOLLANDER 

MS. TERESA DUNCAN

FREEDMAN BOYD DANIELS 

HOLLANDER 

20 First Plaza, Suite 700 

Albuquerque, NM 87102

505/842-9960 

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For the Defendant El-Mezain:

MR. JOSHUA DRATEL

LAW OFFICE OF JOSHUA L. DRATEL

14 Wall Street, 28th Floor

New York, NY 10005

212/732-0707 

For the Defendant Mufid Abdulqader:

MS. MARLO CADEDDU

LAW OFFICE OF MARLO P. CADEDDU

3232 McKinney Avenue, Suite 700

Dallas, Texas 75204

214/744-3015 

For the Defendant Elashi:

MS. LINDA MORENO

LAW OFFICE OF LINDA MORENO

PO BOX 10985 

Tampa, Florida 33679

 813-247-4500 

For the Defendant Odeh: 

 MR. GREG WESTFALL

WESTFALL PLATT CUTRER

Mallick Tower

One Summit Avenue, Suite 910

Fort Worth, Texas 76102

817/877-1700

Court Reporter: Cassidi L. Casey, CSR No. 1703

1100 Commerce Street, Rm 15D6L

Dallas, Texas 75242

214/354-3139

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P R O C E E D I N G S:

THE COURT: Good morning, Ladies and Gentlemen. 

Thank you for being on time. Before we get started, I 

wanted to pass along to you a couple of tidbits of 

information that were given to me after recess. 

First, I was asked to caution counsel who are 

questioning the venire to please stay near the microphone. 

As I think I have told all of you before, we have a remote 

courtroom here which is really set up for the media, and I 

think some of them have been utilizing it, and there was a 

point during the questioning yesterday that counsel got 

too far away from the microphone, and they could not hear 

the questioning. That's Point 1. 

And I don't know the answer to that because I 

know you are under time limits, but the jury administrator 

reported that several people who were questioned yesterday 

complained when they got downstairs, particularly Ms. 

Medina, that they couldn't get a word in edge-wise, that 

apparently some of them had pre-planned vacations, and 

they wanted to tell us about that, but they didn't have an 

opportunity. So if you feel you can spare the time from 

your questioning to ask about things of that nature, it 

might be a good thing to do. 

Mr. Kiblinger, I think we're ready to see our 

first member of the venire, Mr. Torrez. 

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Good morning, Mr. Torrez. Counsel for the 

parties have some questions this would like to ask you 

about this case. 

MS. MORENO: Thank you, your Honor. Mr. Torrez, 

my name is Linda Moreno. I'm one of the defense attorneys 

in this case. I want to ask you some questions about the 

questionnaire you filled out a couple of weeks ago. I 

want to ask you about anything you think you might have 

heard about this case. I want to talk to you a few 

minutes. 

First of all, I see in your questionnaire that 

you are unemployed. So my first question to you is this 

case is going to take three to four months. Maybe longer, 

maybe less. Is that going to impose any kind of economic 

hardship for you? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. Right now I am unemployed, 

and I take care of my daughter and my father. My father 

has cancer. I just help him. 

MS. MORENO: I'm so sorry to hear that. I 

understand your situation. 

So I guess my question is unnecessary. Have you 

any pre-planned vacations? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MS. MORENO: Are you fluent in Spanish? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, ma'am. 

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MS. MORENO: Have you had an experience where 

someone was translating a sentence or a paragraph to you 

from Spanish to English and the words were accurate, but 

the meaning was off? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, I have. 

MS. MORENO: Can you think of any examples of 

that? 

VENIRE PERSON: Not a certain example but I can 

tell you where I did experience that is where I would take 

a trip to Ruidoso and my friend, we went to his family, 

and it was mainly a lot of Spaniards. 

MS. MORENO: From Spain? 

VENIRE PERSON: Blonde and blue eyed. Their 

Spanish is just so proper it's completely different from 

what I'm used to as far as the Spanish over here which is 

pretty much broken. And he would be telling me something. 

And what I'm thinking, I'm hearing he's telling me 

something different. There is Spanish words that have 

multiple meanings, a lot of words do, and their words, 

yeah, it has one true meaning that we're used to. And it 

did throw me off a little bit.

MS. MORENO: So you have had that experience? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: Thank you. 

You have a cousin who's a prosecutor? 

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VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: Where is that? 

VENIRE PERSON: Somewhere near El Paso. He was 

in Laredo. 

MS. MORENO: Are you close? 

VENIRE PERSON: I mean we grew up together. But 

you know, we're not like close close, no.

MS. MORENO: Well, the reason I asked such a 

private question -- if you are close to your cousin -- is 

what we're talking about here is to try to find jurors who 

can be fair, open, who don't come to this process with any 

baggage, with any prejudices or preconceived notions. And 

so my question is, is your relationship with your cousin 

who's in law enforcement going to color the way you look 

at this case? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, it would not. Once he 

passed the bar exam and everything, became a DA, he has 

been so busy with his job we have become more distant than 

ever. We rarely talk, maybe once a month. 

MS. MORENO: Do you know any Muslims? 

? 

VENIRE PERSON: A couple. Not too well. 

MS. MORENO: I'll ask you this question also 

because these gentlemen are Muslim, and this case involves 

the Holy Land Foundation charity which is an American 

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Muslim charity. So I need to know if you have had any 

unpleasant experiences in your life with Muslims. 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MS. MORENO: How about with persons of Arab 

descent? 

? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MS. MORENO: Let me ask you a media question. 

This is the case of the Holy Land Foundation which as I 

said is an American Muslim charity, and I want to know if 

you have heard anything about it in the media, read 

anything about it? 

VENIRE PERSON: I haven't even watched TV the 

past two or three weeks. I didn't even know what it was 

about or anything. Like I said, I'm always volunteering 

for grand jury and as far as for me to give back and do my 

part. 

MS. MORENO: I appreciate that. I believe you 

were in the grand jury in 2005? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: Where did you sit? 

VENIRE PERSON: 600 Commerce. I sat at the 

back. 

MS. MORENO: But you were in a grand jury? 

VENIRE PERSON: Right. 

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MS. MORENO: Anything about that experience that 

was negative? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. Some of the cases we 

decided to bill or true bill or no bill they are heart 

breaking. It takes a majority of us. 

MS. MORENO: Yeah, to do your duty as a citizen. 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: Thank you so much, Mr. Torrez. 

THE COURT: Counsel for the government? 

 MS. SHAPIRO: Good morning, I'm Liz Shapiro. 

I'm counsel for the government, and I have a few follow-up 

questions for you. You said on your questionnaire you are 

married. 

VENIRE PERSON: Legally married but separation. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: So when you talked about the 

separation on your questionnaire, that's what you were 

referring to? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, right. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: And you said on your 

questionnaire there were problems during that process. 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: Has that been resolved? 

VENIRE PERSON: Completely for my little girl's 

sake. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: You have a three year old 

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daughter? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: Does she live with you or her 

mother? 

VENIRE PERSON: Joint custody. She resides with 

me mainly. It's on the paperwork. Her main residence is 

with me. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: And if you were to serve on this 

case for a period of four months, would there be a problem 

of child care? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, ma'am. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: You have that all taken care of? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: And you said you worked for the 

Postal Service? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, ma'am. I did. During the 

separation that's when -- I couldn't take any more stress 

from my job as well. So I had to walk away from it at 

that point in time. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: What was it that you were doing 

when you were working for the Postal Service? 

VENIRE PERSON: Window clerk. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: So you were dealing with 

customers? 

VENIRE PERSON: Correct. 

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 MS. SHAPIRO: How long did you do that? 

VENIRE PERSON: March in 1998. I believe I 

worked to October. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: And before you worked for the 

Postal Service, where did you work before that? 

VENIRE PERSON: Odd jobs, warehouse jobs and 

just about anything and everything. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: You were talking to Ms. Moreno 

about your grand jury service, was there anything at all 

about your service on the grand jury that would affect 

your ability to hear all the evidence and judge this case 

fairly? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, ma'am. It would actually 

benefit me. As I said, you get to view everything from a 

different aspect than you would normally in court. 

Teaching you to look at everything from every aspect, not 

just the first. So go by the facts of the case. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: Okay. Ms. Moreno also talked to 

you about the situation in a foreign language where there 

might be a word that is translated or can have different 

meanings, and you were giving us an example of one of 

those. In this case, there would be translations that 

will be introduced of documents that are in the Arabic 

language or Hebrew language. If those translations are 

admitted in this case, would you be able to accept that 

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translation? 

VENIRE PERSON: I would have to get every 

aspect -- as far as what meanings of words would mean. 

What transmissions it came in and what text it's being 

used. I have to know every meaning. I would like to know 

the meaning of the word, what it would mean in slang, 

proper. That way I can make a judgment, not go by what I 

was hearing. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: If you are given a document and 

that's the translation the Judge admits in the case and 

that's the only translation you may see, would you be able 

to accept that as the translation of the document? 

VENIRE PERSON: Honestly I wouldn't because if I 

know there is -- me being bilingual and everything, I know 

Spanish has multiple meanings to words. I'm not going to 

feel comfortable unless I have knowledge of what that word 

means. I'm not going by just the first thing I see or 

hear. I'm not going to be comfortable with that. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: If the Judge were to instruct you 

that this translation was the evidence in the case and 

that you are only to consider that translation, is that an 

instruction you could follow? 

VENIRE PERSON: Of course, I mean, if that's 

what he wants to give me, yeah, I wouldn't have a problem 

following that aspect if I can't get the other details on 

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it. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: Ms. Moreno didn't actually I 

believe describe the charges in this case for you. So I 

wanted you to understand what is actually being alleged 

here, and it's a case about the government alleges the 

defendants here provided material support to a designated 

terrorist organization and that organization is called 

HAMAS. Have you heard of that? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, I have not honestly. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: At the end of case, the Judge 

will give instructions about the law the jury has to 

follow in deciding the case and as part of that 

instruction, he may tell you that providing money to a 

terrorist organization is against the law, even if some of 

that money is used to purchase things that you might 

consider as charity or humanitarian aid like food or books 

or pack backs for children, something of that nature. Are 

you okay with that? 

VENIRE PERSON: Fine. I mean that's why we're 

here, to make sure that everybody did follow the law. 

That's why we're here to make the judgment that no law was 

broken. So yeah, I have no problem with that. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: So if the Judge gave you that 

instruction, you would be able to follow that? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, ma'am. 

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 MS. SHAPIRO: Thank you very much. 

THE COURT: Mr. Torrez, we are in the process of 

talking to the members of the pool from which the jury 

will be drawn that would hear this case. I expect this 

process will go on for another day or so. So until you 

hear from us again, you should not discuss this case with 

anyone or allow anyone to discuss it with you, and if 

there are any media accounts of the case, you should not 

read or watch or listen to any of those. 

Good morning, Ms. Bailey. 

VENIRE PERSON: Good morning. 

THE COURT: Counsel in this case have questions 

for you. 

MR. WESTFALL: Good morning, Ms. Bailey. I'm 

Greg Westfall. I'm one of the defense lawyers in this 

case. I am going to speak with you for a few minutes, and 

then the government will probably have a few questions for 

you. 

VENIRE PERSON: All right. 

MR. WESTFALL: This is the Holy Land Foundation 

case. It is the United States versus Holy Land 

Foundation. It involves allegations that Holy Land 

Foundation and several of the men involved with the 

Foundation gave material support to a terrorist 

organization, HAMAS. Having told you that, does that ring 

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any bells? Have you heard of the case? 

VENIRE PERSON: Not really. Just on TV a little 

bit I saw a little something. 

MR. WESTFALL: Anything you have heard 

influenced your opinion at all? Do you have any opinions 

based upon that? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. WESTFALL: This trial may go as long as four 

months, maybe a little bit longer than four months. Do 

you have any pre-planned travel or anything like that? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, I'm supposed to go on a 

cruise November 11th. 

MR. WESTFALL: Anything else between now and 

November 11th? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. My husband had a stroke 

last Friday. 

MR. WESTFALL: Last Friday? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: Tell me about that. 

VENIRE PERSON: He hasn't gone back to work yet. 

He's doing okay, but I have to be there to monitor his 

medication. 

MR. WESTFALL: The Court is intending to meet 

Monday through Thursday, basically business hours, and 

then Friday is off. Is that going to pose a problem with 

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you in helping your husband? Do you have a back-up plan? 

Do you have anyone else that can help you during those 

hours? 

VENIRE PERSON: Also I'm a diabetic. Sometimes 

I fall asleep a little after I eat something, but not all 

the time. 

MR. WESTFALL: All told, do you have the ability 

to serve on a jury? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, I do. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you know any Muslims? 

VENIRE PERSON: Not really. 

MR. WESTFALL: Have you ever had any bad 

experiences with Muslims? 

VENIRE PERSON: I know the Farakhan was a 

Muslim. That's all I know. 

MR. WESTFALL: Have you ever followed what Mr. 

Farakhan has done? 

VENIRE PERSON: Not really. 

MR. WESTFALL: You are an OR nurse? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: How long have you been doing 

that? 

VENIRE PERSON: Thirty-six years. 

MR. WESTFALL: Where do you work? 

VENIRE PERSON: Federal hospital, VA Hospital. 

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MR. WESTFALL: Do you know a doctor over there 

by the name of Cadeddu? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. WESTFALL: What does free speech mean to 

you? Have you ever thought about your freedom of speech? 

VENIRE PERSON: That you can speech freely 

whatever you feel within your heart. 

MR. WESTFALL: Can you think of a country or a 

place that doesn't have freedom of speech? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. WESTFALL: There is speech out there I 

imagine that you don't like, isn't there? Can you tell me 

some? 

VENIRE PERSON: If there is some countries 

that -- 

MR. WESTFALL: Speech in our country -- like 

whether it's music lyrics or flag burning or something -- 

there is speech out there that insults everyone? 

VENIRE PERSON: It doesn't offend me. 

MR. WESTFALL: Doesn't offend you? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. WESTFALL: How do you feel about other 

people being able to say what they want to say? 

VENIRE PERSON: I'm okay with that. 

MR. WESTFALL: Is that a right that you value? 

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VENIRE PERSON: That's a right I value. I 

wouldn't say I agree with it. But I think everybody is 

free to have their own speech. 

MR. WESTFALL: If you were going to set out to 

suppress somebody's speech, make it where they couldn't 

say what they wanted to anymore, what would you do? 

MR. JACKS: Your Honor, I object to that just on 

the grounds of relevance. 

THE COURT: Sustained. 

MR. WESTFALL: Mr. Farakhan. Mr. Farakhan says 

things that certain people become highly offended at. 

That's an example of somebody being able to exercise their 

freedom of speech in this country, isn't it? 

VENIRE PERSON: Right. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you think Mr. Farakhan should 

have to stop saying that? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, I do. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you think he should have to 

stop saying what he's saying? 

VENIRE PERSON: Some of the things he says, I 

believe so. He should. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you think that he should be 

made to stop saying? 

VENIRE PERSON: Not necessarily. I just don't 

have to abide by it. 

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MR. WESTFALL: How do you feel about being on a 

case as a juror where -- We're talking about Muslim men, 

and the allegation has something to do with terrorism. 

Terrorism is in the title of the charge. What are your 

thoughts on that? 

VENIRE PERSON: I don't have to follow it. I 

can listen to it. 

MR. WESTFALL: You are okay with it? 

VENIRE PERSON: I'm okay with it. 

MR. WESTFALL: What's your favorite thing about 

nursing? 

VENIRE PERSON: Caring for the people. You 

know, making sure they are comfortable and I'm there for 

them. Letting them know that. 

MR. WESTFALL: And you treat mainly veterans? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, always. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you like that particular 

aspect of your work? 

VENIRE PERSON: Oh, I love it. 

MR. WESTFALL: Are you treating Gulf War 

veterans? Do you have veterans that went to Iraq? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, Vietnam, you know, all the 

wars. 

MR. WESTFALL: Have you ever heard of HAMAS? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

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THE COURT: Mr. Westfall, your time has expired. 

Counsel for the government have questions for Ms. Bailey? 

MR. JACKS: Yes, your Honor. Good morning, Ms. 

Bailey. My name is Jim Jacks. I'm an Assistant United 

States Attorney. I'll be one of the prosecutors in this 

case that will be representing the government during this 

trial. I have a few questions myself to ask you if you 

don't mind. 

VENIRE PERSON: Okay. 

MR. JACKS: We have your questionnaire, and then 

we have another list that contains information that you 

provided to the jury clerk. You indicated that you are 

married. What does your husband do? 

VENIRE PERSON: He's a chemical tech at Texas 

Instruments. 

MR. JACKS: What does that mean? What does he 

actually do? 

VENIRE PERSON: The chemical tanks that they 

bring in, he was to monitor the gauge and different kinds 

of chemicals that they use for TI for whatever project 

they are doing. 

MR. JACKS: How long has he worked there? 

VENIRE PERSON: Forty years. 

MR. JACKS: You may have answered this, but how 

long have you worked at the VA Hospital? 

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VENIRE PERSON: Thirty-six years. 

MR. JACKS: How long have you been an operating 

room nurse? 

VENIRE PERSON: Twenty-eight years. 

MR. JACKS: And you have two sons, and I take it 

they are grown and both out of the house. Do they live in 

the Dallas area? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, they both live in Dallas. 

MR. JACKS: It seems like you have traveled 

quite a bit overseas and out of the country. Were those 

trips for pleasure or some other? 

VENIRE PERSON: It was for pleasure. 

MR. JACKS: And were there multiple trips? You 

have marked that you have been to Germany and France and 

Puerto Rico and Mexico. For example the places in Europe, 

was that one trip or different trips? 

VENIRE PERSON: That was one trip. 

MR. JACKS: And Puerto Rico was a separate trip 

and Mexico? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, on a cruise. 

MR. JACKS: You have served on trial juries 

before. One of them you described as a real estate 

matter. Do you know whether that was a civil or criminal 

case? 

VENIRE PERSON: It was a civil. 

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MR. JACKS: So two private parties were suing 

each other or one of them was? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, one of them was. 

MR. JACKS: And I guess the jury rendered a 

verdict in that case. And then an earlier case you 

describe it as Molestation, like child abuse? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: Down at the state? 

VENIRE PERSON: Crowley. 

MR. JACKS: How long did that trial last? 

VENIRE PERSON: Five days. 

MR. JACKS: How long were the jury 

deliberations? 

VENIRE PERSON: Probably a day. 

MR. JACKS: Were you the foreman of the jury? 

VENIRE PERSON: Oh, no. 

MR. JACKS: And you indicated that a nephew of 

yours by marriage -- Does that mean your husband's side of 

the family? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: -- was convicted of murder. How 

long ago was that? 

VENIRE PERSON: This past May. 

MR. JACKS: And I take it he was sentenced to 

the penitentiary? 

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VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: Did you attend the trial? 

VENIRE PERSON: As a witness. 

MR. JACKS: Regarding that experience, how do 

you think your nephew was treated by the criminal justice 

system? 

VENIRE PERSON: I think he was treated fairly 

well. 

MR. JACKS: Who was the victim in that case, 

somebody known to him? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, his first cousin. 

MR. JACKS: Having been on a criminal jury 

before, I'm sure you recall that after all the parties 

have finished presenting evidence and either before or 

after, depending on which court it is in, the Judge gives 

instructions to the jury and tells them what the law is. 

That would happen as well in this case. 

The Judge will tell you in his instructions to 

you that -- You have not heard of HAMAS? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. JACKS: I anticipate the Judge will tell you 

that HAMAS is a designated foreign terrorist organization; 

that is, the United States has designated them a terrorist 

organization. And I expect the Judge to tell you that a 

person in the United States cannot give anything to 

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benefit a foreign terrorist organization, even if it's 

something that would otherwise be considered a charitable 

or humanitarian item like food or clothing or books or 

medical supplies. Even that type of aid or support is 

against the law. Would you have any problem with that 

aspect of the law and following that instruction from the 

Judge? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, I wouldn't have a problem. 

MR. JACKS: Thank you. 

THE COURT: Ms. Bailey, we're in the process of 

talking to the members of the panel from which the jury 

will be selected that would hear this case. I expect that 

process will go on for another day or two. So until you 

hear from us further, you should not discuss the case with 

anyone or allow anyone to discuss it with you, and if 

there are any media accounts about this case, you should 

not read or watch or listen to any of those media 

accounts. 

Thank you, ma'am, you may excused. 

Good morning, Mr. Boozer. Counsel for the 

parties in this case have some questions they would like 

to ask you. Mr. Westfall. 

MR. WESTFALL: Good morning, Mr. Boozer. I'm 

Greg Westfall. I'm one of the defense lawyers in this 

case. I am going to speak with you a few minutes. Okay? 

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VENIRE PERSON: Okay. 

MR. WESTFALL: This case is the United States 

versus the Holy Land Foundation. Have you heard of it? 

VENIRE PERSON: I might have hit it in the 

headlines of the paper. 

MR. WESTFALL: It involves allegations that the 

Holy Land Foundation which was an American Muslim charity, 

and some of the men who work with that charity gave 

material support to HAMAS which is a foreign terrorist 

organization. Having told you that, ring anymore bells or 

different bells than it did before? 

VENIRE PERSON: The extent of my knowledge would 

be that I glance at the newspapers most days, and I do 

recall some arrests, and I don't know that I got the 

details, and I don't know the time frame. A couple of 

years ago, there was some arrests made in Richardson, the 

area or something like that, and beyond that I would know 

zip. 

MR. WESTFALL: That's the same one. Based upon 

anything you have read or heard, have you reached any 

opinions about the guilt or innocence of anyone? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. WESTFALL: Let's focus for a second on 

hardship. And by hardship I mean something that would 

make it difficult, if not impossible, something like you 

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are going to lose your job. I know you put in a hardship. 

VENIRE PERSON: It's not a hardship letter. 

It's just my schedule is such. I'm a pilot, and as such I 

needed to know what days I would be needed to be here so I 

could schedule it. After that there was no problem. 

MR. WESTFALL: So if this thing goes four 

months, you are not going to have a problem with that? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. WESTFALL: No problem with prepaid vacations 

or anything like that? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. WESTFALL: How long have you been a pilot? 

VENIRE PERSON: Fifteen years. 

MR. WESTFALL: Did you learn in the military 

or --

VENIRE PERSON: Civilian. 

MR. WESTFALL: In American Airlines, I would 

imagine they have probably had some training since 9-11 

that has to do with terrorism? 

VENIRE PERSON: I'm with American Eagle which is 

the stepson of American. But it's minor in nature. They 

go over certain cases and tell us okay, for example, any 

time there is any situation at all, you lock the door. 

That's basically -- And then they go over certain 

situations that have occurred in the past. As an example, 

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used to be before 9-11 you did whatever somebody that was 

getting on board -- you tried to comply. Now, you just 

close the door and land. So that's the extent of it. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do they teach you anything like 

profiling or what someone looks like that you are supposed 

to be suspicious of? 

VENIRE PERSON: I wouldn't call it profiling. I 

would say that more attune to listening to uneasiness of 

anyone -- the flight attendants, the other crew members, 

something you heard in the airport, something through 

security or saw in the newspapers, etcetera. 

MR. WESTFALL: Have you had any incidents where 

you had to lock the door and immediately land the plane? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. WESTFALL: Anyone you know had that? 

VENIRE PERSON: No one I know. I have heard of 

instances where this has happened, but no one I do know. 

MR. WESTFALL: I saw you went to Iran back in 

the seventies. 

THE DEFENDANT: Yes, sir. 

MR. WESTFALL: I guess the Shah was still in 

power then? 

VENIRE PERSON: He was out of the country sick 

at the time, but yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: Nowadays do you know any Muslims? 

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VENIRE PERSON: The only guy I know is I traded 

at a gas station with a guy. I'm not sure he is Muslim or 

not. 

MR. WESTFALL: But he's Arab? 

VENIRE PERSON: I think he told me he's from 

Iran. So I know he's from Iran because we talked about 

that. 

MR. WESTFALL: Sounds like that may be a fairly 

pleasant experience. 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, he's a nice guy. 

MR. WESTFALL: Have you ever had any bad 

experiences with Muslims or Arabs? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, sir, not that I know of. 

MR. WESTFALL: Any particularly good things? 

VENIRE PERSON: Good mechanic. I mean he 

repairs my truck. But that's the extent of it. 

MR. WESTFALL: I probably don't need to ask you 

this, but how do you feel about the prospect of being on a 

jury where we're talking about Muslim men and the charge 

has terrorism in the title? 

VENIRE PERSON: That's a pretty simple question. 

I think I am fair enough that I let the facts on whatever 

the case is stand up. I don't have that many 

preconceptions on things. I listen to what the people 

say, and from that I will go ahead and make a decision. 

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MR. WESTFALL: Been on a jury before? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. WESTFALL: So you know that a decision by 

the jury has to be based on only the evidence in the 

court? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: What drew you to piloting? What 

drew you to be a pilot? 

VENIRE PERSON: I was still in insurance and 

hated it, and a friend of mine gave me lessons and said, 

hey, this is a career you might like, and I looked at it 

and said, okay, I am going to do it. And on my form it 

says that I have worked two jobs for almost twenty years 

this month, and I went to work for a trucking company and 

did my schooling and pilot training during the day, and 

then I started working as a pilot. 

MR. WESTFALL: So now all you do is piloting. 

You don't have to have a second job? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, I'm retiring from the other 

job this month. 

MR. WESTFALL: One other thing I wanted to talk 

to you about, but I got so interested in the story. 

Oh, have you had to have a security clearance or 

anything like that? Have you done any sort of 

investigation work with the federal government? 

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VENIRE PERSON: The only security clearance we 

have is at the airport. We send in fingerprints, and they 

do a background check on us. I guess that's a security 

clearance. That's all I would know of. 

MR. WESTFALL: So you haven't been in the 

military? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, sir. 

MR. WESTFALL: Thank you very much, sir. 

THE COURT: Counsel for the government have 

questions for Mr. Boozer? 

 MS. SHAPIRO: Good morning, my name is Liz 

Shapiro, and I'm one of the prosecutors assigned to this 

case for the government. 

VENIRE PERSON: Good morning, Elizabeth. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: You indicated on your 

questionnaire that you are married. Is that right? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, ma'am. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: And does your wife work outside 

the home? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, ma'am. She's director of a 

day care. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: Is that in the Dallas area? 

VENIRE PERSON: Irving, Dallas County. 

MS. SHAPIRO: Young children, preschool? 

VENIRE PERSON: I think it goes up through first 

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or second grade. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: And she works full time there? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, ma'am. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: And you indicated that your best 

friend is a lawyer. Is that right? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: And does he or she work at a 

firm? 

VENIRE PERSON: Works over in Arlington, used to 

work for Hill Gilstrap. I think he works now for -- I 

have the name in my wallet. I can get it if you want the 

name. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: Is it a big law firm? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, ma'am, I don't think so. 

It's small. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: Does he practice criminal law? 

VENIRE PERSON: I think he's more on business 

law. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: Has he talked to you about the 

kind of work he does? 

VENIRE PERSON: We don't talk shop. We talk 

baseball and rangers. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: I noticed you were a wrestler? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, ma'am. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: What weight class? 

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VENIRE PERSON: 167, 177 and 187. 

MS. SHAPIRO: You managed to maintain that? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, added a couple. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: As Mr. Westfall told you the 

charges in this case involve material support to a 

designated terrorist organization. At the end of the 

case, as I'm sure you know from your jury experience -- 

You said you served on several juries. Is that right? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: If you will recall, the judge 

gave you instructions at the end of the case. 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, ma'am. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: In those instructions the Judge 

may tell you that material support to a designated 

terrorist organization may include not only money but 

things that you might consider to be humanitarian type of 

assistance like food or clothing or books or backpacks for 

children, things of that nature. If the Judge instructed 

you that that, too, was against the law, would you be able 

to follow that instruction? 

VENIRE PERSON: I think so, yes, ma'am. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: Does that bother you at all or 

give you hesitation? 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, I think before I agree or 

disagree, when the Judge gives me an order like that I'm 

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pretty well determined to have to follow such. 

However, as far as, yes, I think I could. It 

would be possible to distinguish that some things might be 

humanitarian and some things might be other things. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: But if the Court were to give you 

instruction that under the law knowingly giving assistance 

of an humanitarian nature even, assistance that benefited 

a terrorist organization, that was against the law, would 

you be able to follow that instruction? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, ma'am. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: Thank you. 

THE COURT: Mr. Boozer, we are in the process of 

talking with the people in the pool from which the people 

will be drawn that would hear this case. I expect that 

process to go on for the rest of today and possibly into 

tomorrow. So until you hear from us again, you should not 

discuss the case with anyone or allow anyone to discuss it 

with you, and if there are any media accounts about this 

case, you should not read or watch or listen to any of 

those. Thank you, sir. You may be excused. 

Good morning, Ms. Jensen. Counsel for the 

parties have some questions to ask you about this case. 

MR. WESTFALL: Ms. Jensen, I'm Greg Westfall. 

I'm one of the defense lawyers in this case. I want to 

speak to you for a moment about this case. 

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VENIRE PERSON: Okay. 

MR. WESTFALL: This case is United States versus 

Holy Land Foundation. It involves allegations by the 

government that the Holy Land Foundation and some of the 

men involved in the Foundation gave material support to 

HAMAS which is a terrorist organization. Having told you 

that, does that ring any bells? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, I think I heard something 

about Holy Land Foundation being in the news years ago, 

but not really any details. 

MR. WESTFALL: Nothing recently? 

VENIRE PERSON: Monday I heard something about 

it, but I went the other way. When I heard it, it rang a 

bell. 

MR. WESTFALL: How do you feel about being in a 

jury with Muslim men and terrorism is in the title? 

VENIRE PERSON: I'm not sure I have any feelings 

about it one way or the other, anymore than I would any 

other jury. It's a little bit inconvenient, but I will 

deal with it. 

MR. WESTFALL: Inconvenient? 

VENIRE PERSON: It's a lot farther to drive than 

work. 

MR. WESTFALL: On the issue of inconvenience, 

this could go four months. 

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VENIRE PERSON: I get paid at my job. That 

would be all right. 

MR. WESTFALL: Okay. Very well. You work with 

the Postal Service? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: What is the union? 

VENIRE PERSON: American Postal Workers Union. 

MR. WESTFALL: And that's like the main union? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, they have seven. 

MR. WESTFALL: Seven unions? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: Are you a steward or have you 

ever been a steward? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. WESTFALL: I saw in your questionnaire you 

went and interviewed with the FBI in relation to something 

you used to do or did at some point which is the Titan 

missile project. 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, data entry. 

MR. WESTFALL: What were the Titan missiles? 

That a cold war thing? 

VENIRE PERSON: I think so. I don't remember. 

MR. WESTFALL: So where did you go to do the 

data entry? 

VENIRE PERSON: I worked in Dallas for TI. 

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MR. WESTFALL: Oh. How long did you do that? 

VENIRE PERSON: On the actual Titan missile 

project? 

MR. WESTFALL: No, in that sort of area with the 

security clearance and all. 

VENIRE PERSON: It was just the one project, and 

it was three months. 

MR. WESTFALL: Have you always done that kind of 

work? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, I don't like data entry. I 

would rather be up doing something physical. 

MR. WESTFALL: So you left data entry and became 

a mail carrier? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, I'm a mail processor. 

MR. WESTFALL: I guess there is a big mail 

processing plant here in Dallas? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, there is two. 

MR. WESTFALL: And you work at one of the 

plants? 

VENIRE PERSON: Right. I work at the Bulk Mail 

Center. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you do any charity work? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: What do you do? 

VENIRE PERSON: My husband and I work with a 

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group in Dallas called Youth World, and my husband is a 

guitar player, and I help him with the fundraisers and 

organizing events and that sort of thing. 

MR. WESTFALL: What does Youth World do? 

VENIRE PERSON: They cater to underprivileged 

youth of all classes, Oak Cliff mostly. 

MR. WESTFALL: What does Youth World do for the 

underprivileged youth? 

VENIRE PERSON: Music lessons, a place to go 

after school rather than getting in gangs. They are 

multi-denomination Christian group so they also preach. 

Give them a place to share faith. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do they provide scholarships? 

VENIRE PERSON: Not that I am aware of. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do they give them food? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, after school. 

MR. WESTFALL: At Christmas do they give them 

presents? 

VENIRE PERSON: Not that I am aware of, but they 

put them in touch with organizations that do that. 

MR. WESTFALL: How long have you done that? 

VENIRE PERSON: About two years. My husband has 

been involved five years. 

MR. WESTFALL: Have you had you any intention of 

quitting? 

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VENIRE PERSON: I don't do it much, but no, the 

children need us. 

MR. WESTFALL: You said give them an opportunity 

other than gangs by giving them food and a place. 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: And giving them love and 

attention? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. If they don't receive 

those things, they are likely to get in those gangs and 

get in trouble. 

MR. WESTFALL: And do violent things? 

VENIRE PERSON: Let's hope not, but yeah, 

possibly. 

MR. WESTFALL: Ms. Jensen, thank you. 

THE COURT: Counsel for the government have 

questions for Ms. Jensen? 

MR. JACKS: Yes, sir. My name is Jim Jacks. 

I'm an Assistant United States Attorney here in the 

Northern District of Texas. I'm one of the prosecutors in 

this case and will be representing the government during 

this trial. I have a few questions for you if you don't 

mind. How long have you worked for the Postal Service? 

VENIRE PERSON: Since 1993. 

MR. JACKS: Immediately prior to that was that 

when you worked for Texas Instruments? 

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VENIRE PERSON: To several years prior to that. 

MR. JACKS: Before you joined the Postal Service 

what was your profession? 

VENIRE PERSON: I had two young children. I was 

a homemaker. 

MR. JACKS: And I guess maybe before your 

children were born -- I'm trying to get an employment 

history a little bit. How long did you work for Texas 

Instruments? 

VENIRE PERSON: Just the three-month project 

when they needed extra help. They laid me off. 

MR. JACKS: Before your children were born, what 

kind of work did you do? 

MR. JACKS: I worked in a warehouse pulling 

orders for -- actually it ended up being Wal-Mart, but it 

started out being Western Merchandisers. 

MR. JACKS: Have you lived your entire life here 

in the Dallas Fort Worth area? 

VENIRE PERSON: I was born in New York State. 

Lived there until I was seven. My stepfather got laid off 

and found work here, because the economy was bad, and we 

moved here. 

MR. JACKS: What year was that? 

VENIRE PERSON: 1975 or 1976 I think. 

MR. JACKS: So you have lived here all of your 

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adult life? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. I went back to New York for 

three years and came back to Texas. 

MR. JACKS: Where did you live? 

VENIRE PERSON: Upstate New York. Do you know 

where Binghamton is? 

MR. JACKS: Yes. 

VENIRE PERSON: That's where. 

MR. JACKS: You listed your husband's job as an 

environmental aid.

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, it's not what it sounds 

like. 

MR. JACKS: Tell us what it is. 

VENIRE PERSON: He works as a liaison between 

BEA systems and EPA to make sure that hazardous materials 

are properly deposed of. 

MR. JACKS: BEA Systems? 

VENIRE PERSON: Right. 

MR. JACKS: Who do they do? 

VENIRE PERSON: They used to be Boeing. They 

build cockpits of airplanes. 

MR. JACKS: Are they located in --

VENIRE PERSON: No. Irving. 

MR. JACKS: Two children and they attend school 

in Grand Prairie? 

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VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: And one is home schooled? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: Who home schools him? 

VENIRE PERSON: My husband. 

MR. JACKS: When does he do that? 

VENIRE PERSON: In the evening after work. 

MR. JACKS: Has he been home schooled for his 

entire age? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. He didn't do well. He 

didn't get along with the other kids. 

MR. JACKS: The organization you referred to, 

Youth World, you said that's a multi-denominational 

Christian organization? 

VENIRE PERSON: That's correct. 

MR. JACKS: How did you or your husband become 

connected to that organization? 

VENIRE PERSON: Through BEA Systems. 

MR. JACKS: It's something the company 

encouraged or supported? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, they do an annual campaign 

or charity drive, and they were looking for organizations 

to donate money to and Youth World applied, and my husband 

was on the committee that evaluated them, and he mentioned 

he played guitar, and they said they were looking for 

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someone to give guitar lessons to the children after 

school, and my husband worked out a date and time, and he 

started doing that about five years ago. 

MR. JACKS: Would you give us an idea of how 

many hours a week or a month he spends on that? 

VENIRE PERSON: He does about eight hours, and I 

generally get in an hour, hour and a half a month. I do 

very little. 

MR. JACKS: As has been mentioned to you, the 

principal charges in this case -- It's alleged that the 

Holy Land Foundation is an organization and several 

individuals that worked with it provided material support 

to a terrorist organization; namely, HAMAS. Have you 

heard of HAMAS or aware of what it is? 

VENIRE PERSON: I have heard of it. I wouldn't 

say I'm aware of what it is other than it's supposed to be 

a terrorist organization. 

MR. JACKS: At the end of the evidence the Judge 

will read his instructions to the jury which is 

essentially what the law is. It says what must be proven 

and definitions and that type of thing so the jury will 

know the law and then can apply the law to render its 

verdict. Do you understand that concept? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: I anticipate that the judge will in 

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his instructions tell the jury that HAMAS is a designated 

terrorist organization. And I also anticipate that he 

would as part of his instructions tell the jury that any 

contribution or any material support provided to or for 

the benefit of HAMAS is illegal, even if it's of a charity 

nature. Even if it's food or clothing or medical supplies 

or backpacks. How do you feel about that aspect of the 

law? 

VENIRE PERSON: I'm sure it's there for a 

reason. It's not necessarily morally correct. 

MR. JACKS: Would you be able to follow the 

instruction? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: So even though you thought it was 

morally incorrect, if you found that was the -- that money 

was provided and that's the way it was spent, you would be 

able to return a verdict of guilty beyond a reasonable 

doubt, if you found that was done? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: Thank you. 

THE COURT: Ms. Jensen, we're in the process of 

talking with the members of the pool from which the jury 

will be selected that would hear this case. I expect that 

process will go on today and probably into tomorrow. So 

until you hear from us further, you should not discuss 

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this case with anyone or allow anyone to discuss it with 

you, and if there are any media accounts about the case, 

you should not read or watch or listen to any of those. 

Thank you, ma'am, you may be excused. 

Good morning, Mr. Neal. Counsel for the parties 

have some questions to ask you. Mr. Neal, I'm Greg 

Westfall. I'm one of the defense lawyers on this case. I 

want to talk to you a few minutes. Okay? 

VENIRE PERSON: Okay. 

MR. WESTFALL: This is the case of the Holy Land 

Foundation. The United States Government is alleging that 

the Holy Land Foundation and several of its men associated 

with the Holy Land Foundation gave material support to 

HAMAS which is a terrorist organization. Having heard 

that, do you recognize the story? Have you heard about 

it? 

VENIRE PERSON: I think I heard about it a while 

back, but I don't know much about it other than the name, 

and I think it was in Richardson. 

MR. WESTFALL: You haven't read or heard or seen 

anything? 

VENIRE PERSON: It may have been a long time 

ago. But I don't remember anything. 

MR. WESTFALL: It's a case -- It's an American 

Muslim charity and obviously Muslim men and the issue is 

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whether they -- I mean the government alleges they gave 

material support to HAMAS. The case has something to do 

with terrorism. Terrorism is in the name of the charge. 

How do you feel about being in a jury on that type of 

case? 

VENIRE PERSON: I really don't know what to feel 

about it. If I had to be picked, I had to be picked. I 

don't know that I feel anything one way or the other. 

MR. WESTFALL: Your dad I guess was in the Air 

Force? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, he was. 

MR. WESTFALL: Retired? 

VENIRE PERSON: He's retired from the Air Force 

but not from working. He works for Customs. 

MR. WESTFALL: He works for ICE now? 

VENIRE PERSON: U.S. Customs and Border Officer. 

MR. WESTFALL: Where? 

VENIRE PERSON: In New Mexico. 

MR. WESTFALL: So he mans like a border 

crossing? 

VENIRE PERSON: He actually manages the border 

crossing. He's the senior officer there. 

MR. WESTFALL: What brought you over here? 

VENIRE PERSON: I haven't lived with my parents 

in years. I haven't lived with them since 1996. I mean 

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they live their life, and I have mine. I probably see 

them every couple of years. 

MR. WESTFALL: And you have a bachelor of fine 

arts? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: Where did you get that? 

VENIRE PERSON: Art Institute. 

MR. WESTFALL: In Dallas? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes and University of Pittsburgh 

for a while. 

MR. WESTFALL: And you do graphic arts now? 

VENIRE PERSON: I'm an art director for Zig 

Zeigler. 

MR. WESTFALL: Oh really, how many art directors 

does Zig Zeigler have? 

VENIRE PERSON: Just one, me. 

MR. WESTFALL: So what do you do for Zig 

Zeigler? 

VENIRE PERSON: Pretty much design his manuals 

and pamphlets and logos. 

MR. WESTFALL: How well he is? 

VENIRE PERSON: Pretty good for someone who's 

eighty. He still comes in the office every Monday 

morning. 

MR. WESTFALL: Anything about your job -- If 

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this trial goes like four months, is that going to be an 

issue at your job? 

VENIRE PERSON: I thought about it, and I think 

I can probably do the work in the evening. I could 

probably go ahead and work from home. It would be 

inconvenient, but I don't think it would be work 

threatening I guess I should say. 

MR. WESTFALL: You said in your questionnaire 

that you have followed the Palestinian-Israeli conflict 

pretty closely. 

VENIRE PERSON: I listen to KVRA and the BBC. 

It's always on there. 

MR. WESTFALL: So aside from listening to the 

public radio, have you read any books? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, I just follow the news. 

It's too pointed. News is one thing, but a book is a 

little more pointed. If that's the case, I would have to 

probably read every other book. 

MR. WESTFALL: Excellent. Do you know any 

people who practice the Muslim faith? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, I do not. 

MR. WESTFALL: Have you ever? 

VENIRE PERSON: I'm sure I have known some 

friends, but we never talked about it. It's been a while. 

It was a long time ago, but as far as right now, no, I 

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don't know anybody that said they openly practiced it. 

MR. WESTFALL: Have you had any bad experiences 

or good experiences with Arabs or Muslims? 

VENIRE PERSON: I worked for an Iranian guy 

about four years, and he was nice. I mean I didn't have 

any problems with him. He told me a little about his 

faith. 

MR. WESTFALL: What did you think? 

VENIRE PERSON: It's interesting. Actually I 

don't practice faith, but I found it interesting 

historically speaking because it all came from the same 

base. So it's interesting. 

MR. WESTFALL: In your questionnaire we're 

talking about citizens versus noncitizens and whether 

Constitutional rights should be afforded to them. 

VENIRE PERSON: That's a tricky question. I was 

actually weighing it when I answered that question. I 

started thinking about American citizenship and human 

rights. Should they get the same rights? I don't know. 

My dad defended this country, still defending it for the 

last forty years. So it's pretty hard for me to say that 

someone who's not a citizen should get the same rights as 

a U.S. citizen, but at the same time there is human rights 

that cross over. So it's a tricky question to answer. 

MR. WESTFALL: How about some people will draw a 

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distinction between citizens and noncitizens and other 

people will draw a distinction between legal residents and 

illegal residents? 

VENIRE PERSON: I know what you are saying. If 

the case is they are a legal resident, it gets tricky. If 

they were a legal resident, I would have to give them the 

same rights as an American citizen because they are 

supposed to be here. No, if they are illegal, I wouldn't. 

That's for sure. 

MR. WESTFALL: How do you feel about freedom of 

speech? 

VENIRE PERSON: I feel strongly about it. 

Again, when my father defended the country, you are 

afforded freedom of speech. So I feel very strongly about 

that. I feel strongly about any rights given to citizens. 

MR. WESTFALL: Any places that don't have 

freedom of speech? 

VENIRE PERSON: A lot of places. Almost all the 

European countries and everyplace else. They have a Roman 

law or marshal law where you are pretty much guilty first. 

They don't have freedom of speech over there, that's for 

sure. 

THE COURT: Mr. Westfall, your time has expired. 

MR. WESTFALL: Thank you, your Honor. 

THE COURT: Counsel for the government have 

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questions? 

MR. JACKS: Yes, your Honor. Good morning, Mr. 

Neal. My name is Jim Jacks. I'm an Assistant United 

States Attorney for the Northern District of Texas. I'm 

one of the prosecutors that will be representing the 

government in this trial. I just have a few questions for 

you as well. Your time that you lived overseas, was that 

with your family when your dad was serving overseas? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: She has to write down everything. 

And I know we are far apart and this room is not conducive 

to hearing each other, but if I could get you to speak up. 

VENIRE PERSON: Sure. 

MR. JACKS: How long have you worked for -- Is 

it Zeigler? 

VENIRE PERSON: Zig Zeigler. 

MR. JACKS: Yes. How long have you worked 

there? 

VENIRE PERSON: Four and a half years. 

MR. JACKS: Before that, what kind of work did 

you do? 

VENIRE PERSON: A bar manager of a night club. 

MR. JACKS: In Dallas? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: Which one? 

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VENIRE PERSON: It no longer exists. It was 

Area 51, but it was the Iranian gentlemen I worked for. 

Him and his sons owned it. 

MR. JACKS: How long did you work there? 

VENIRE PERSON: About four years. 

MR. JACKS: Was it by Love Field? 

VENIRE PERSON: Downtown where the Old Stork 

Club used to be. 

MR. JACKS: And what did you do before that? 

VENIRE PERSON: I worked as a freelance graphics 

designer off and on and worked at bar places. But 

basically a freelance designer. 

MR. JACKS: And in layman's terms what did you 

do as a graphic designer? 

VENIRE PERSON: Just design logos, posters and 

stuff like that. 

MR. JACKS: Did you work for a company? 

VENIRE PERSON: I freelanced so I worked for a 

whole bunch of companies. I don't remember half of them. 

MR. JACKS: And Zig Zeigler, what is his 

company? 

VENIRE PERSON: It's a performance company. We 

do business training, corporate training, sales, you know, 

stuff like that. 

MR. JACKS: And how big is the company in terms 

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of employees? 

VENIRE PERSON: I would say less than thirty. 

It fluctuates. We go anywhere from thirty to fifty. 

Hasn't been over thirty since the time I worked there. 

MR. JACKS: Their offices are? 

VENIRE PERSON: Addison. 

MR. JACKS: With regard to this gentlemen you 

worked for when you were asked if you knew any Muslims, 

you said an Iranian. He was in fact a Muslim? 

VENIRE PERSON: Most definitely. He wore 

necklaces that had different items of faith on it. 

MR. JACKS: How observant was he? Did he pray 

five times a day? 

VENIRE PERSON: You know, I don't know the 

extent of his faith. I know when Iran was mentioned, he 

was open to talk about it. I don't know that he was 

observant because he owned a night club that had drinking 

in it. I know his wife wasn't, and I don't think his sons 

weren't either. 

MR. JACKS: It's hard to hear. Did you say you 

talked to him about your faith? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. I didn't talk to him about 

my faith. Occasionally, yes. 

MR. JACKS: But you talked to him about his 

background? 

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VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: How long has your father been with 

the Customs Service and Border Protection? 

VENIRE PERSON: About eight years now. He has 

always done something with the country, firefighting. He 

believes in it strongly. 

MR. JACKS: Has he always been stationed in New 

Mexico? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, before Customs he's been 

stationed in Europe fifteen years. 

MR. JACKS: Mr. Neal, you have had very little 

explanation given to you about the trial. Generally it's 

been stated that the central charge, if you will, is 

providing material supported to a designated terrorist 

organization. Have you ever served on a trial jury 

before? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, this is my first time even 

being called. 

MR. JACKS: Have you ever received a jury 

summons before? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. JACKS: After both sides have presented 

their testimony in evidence and depending on if you are in 

state court or federal court, before the attorneys give 

their final summations, the Judge will tell the jury what 

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the law is, and he would read from a document, and the 

jury will get copies of that document. It tells you what 

the government must prove, what the law is, definitions of 

words that are words of art, that type of thing. I expect 

in this case as part of the Judge's instructions, he would 

tell the jury that HAMAS has been designated as a 

terrorist organization by the U.S. government. I also 

expect in those instructions he would tell the jury that 

anything that is given to a terrorist organization -- 

money, clothing, charitable items -- is still a violation 

of the law. If that money was spent for food or clothing 

or medicine that was provided to the benefit of this 

terrorist organization, that's still a violation of the 

law. If that instruction was given to you, could you 

follow that instruction? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: Thank you, sir. 

THE COURT: Mr. Neal, we are in the process of 

talking with the members of the pool from which the jury 

will be selected that would hear this case. I expect that 

process will go on for the rest of today and probably into 

tomorrow so until you hear from us again you should not 

discuss this case with anyone or allow anyone to discuss 

it with you, and if there are any media accounts about the 

case, you should not read or watch or listen to any of 

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those. 

Thank you. You may be excused. 

Good morning, Ms. Taylor. Counsel for the 

parties have some questions they would like to ask you. 

MS. MORENO: Good morning, Ms. Taylor. You are 

going to have to speak up a little bit so that I can hear 

you. My name is Linda Moreno. I'm one of the defense 

attorneys in this case. I am going to ask you some 

questions about the questionnaire you filled out a few 

weeks ago and if you have heard anything about this case 

which we will discuss in a minute. 

This is the case of the Holy Land Foundation which is 

an American Muslim charity. I'm wondering if you have 

heard anything about the Holy Land Foundation in the press 

or TV or on the radio? 

VENIRE PERSON: I haven't heard anything. I 

have heard other people talking. I have a four year old 

daughter. So I don't get to watch the news. I have just 

heard other people talking.

MS. MORENO: You have a four year old daughter, 

and you are a busy mom? 

VENIRE PERSON: Single and her dad is not 

around. So it's just me all the time. 

MS. MORENO: Let's talk about that. This case 

may last three to four months, maybe longer. So what we 

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need to know is if that kind of jury service would be an 

economic hardship for you or in your family. 

VENIRE PERSON: As far as my daughter goes, I 

have to pick her up from day care by six. Like I said, 

I'm a single mom, and I don't have anybody to help me. I 

live in Waxahachie, and she goes to school in Red Oak. 

MS. MORENO: How far is Red Oak from her? 

VENIRE PERSON: It's twenty-five miles, but with 

the traffic and commute it turns into an hour drive. 

MS. MORENO: So you would have to leave this 

courthouse by five o'clock? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, if not earlier. That's 

what time her day care closes. So I have to pick her up 

by six. 

MS. MORENO: What about in the morning? 

VENIRE PERSON: Her day care opens at 6:30. 

It's not an issue getting her there. It's picking her up. 

MS. MORENO: And what do you do? 

VENIRE PERSON: I'm an investment banker, and I 

sell investments for the bank as well.

MS. MORENO: And in terms of your job, would 

three to four months pose a difficulty? 

VENIRE PERSON: I looked it up after I got the 

form, and human resources says they will pay you, but they 

could fire you for anything. I don't know. 

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MS. MORENO: Have you talked to anybody about 

your summons? 

VENIRE PERSON: My managers and stuff. I told 

them about the paper I got and said it's going to last 

four months, and they are like I hope you get out of it. 

MS. MORENO: They said that they would like you 

out of it? 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, yes, but --

MS. MORENO: If there is any further information 

that you get from your job before this process is over in 

the next day or two, could you alert us? Let the Court 

know or the jury clerk know? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: You said when I asked you if you 

had heard anything about the case -- You said you heard 

others talking about it. 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: Tell me about that. 

VENIRE PERSON: They are saying it's on the news 

and talking about it, not in detail what it's over, just 

talking about, you know, the Holy Land trial and big case. 

I don't know in detail about anything. I just get to 

watch the Disney Channel. That's it. 

MS. MORENO: Lots of Disney Channel? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

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MS. MORENO: There aren't too many trials on the 

Disney Channel? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MS. MORENO: All right. Let's talk about this 

case. This case is one where the government claims that 

this foundation provided material support to a terrorist 

organization. Knowing that, just that little bit of 

information, does that cause you any concern about sitting 

on a case like this? Does that bring anything up for you? 

Let me tell you there aren't any right or wrong answers 

here. So it's our opportunity to hear what you really 

feel about this. 

VENIRE PERSON: It's a little scary considering 

what the subject is over and stuff like that. As far as 

that whole thing -- I don't know. It's a little 

intimidating. 

MS. MORENO: I have heard you say intimidating 

and fear? 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, after 9-11, terrorists is 

like whoa. 

MS. MORENO: Given the thoughts you have and the 

concerns that you have, do you think that you could really 

put those aside and presume these gentlemen innocent which 

is what is required of a juror to sit in this case or 

would that be very difficult for you? 

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VENIRE PERSON: I don't know. It's kind of 

hard. I think it's just a touchy subject for everybody 

that is American that experienced 9-11 and went through 

the whole thing. As a person, yeah, I would try to, but I 

guess it's just that word, you know, and everything that's 

been going on ever since then. 

MS. MORENO: I appreciate what you are saying in 

terms of you would try to. What the law requires in this 

case is that you must assure us -- And it's okay if you 

can't assure us. But you must assure us that would not 

color your opinion and those prejudices would not affect 

the way you would evaluate this case. You would have to 

assure us of that. Could you? 

VENIRE PERSON: I would try my hardest. When 

you say prejudice, I mean it's not against a certain race 

or a religious thing. It's just that word. 

MS. MORENO: I'm talking now more about the 

prejudices, not so much about your fears. Well, let me 

ask it this way. Would you knowing -- And you are the 

only person who can answer this question sitting there. 

With your state of mind right now as we're discussing 

this, would you want to be judged with someone with your 

state of mind in a case like this? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. I feel like I'm a very 

open person and not judgmental. I think I would be fair, 

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but you know, it's kind of like going to work and having a 

bad day. You have to put that aside and focus on your 

job. 

THE COURT: Ms. Moreno, your time has expired. 

MS. MORENO: Thank you so much. 

THE COURT: Counsel for the government have 

questions for Ms. Taylor? 

MR. JACKS: Good morning, Ms. Taylor. 

VENIRE PERSON: Hello. 

MR. JACKS: My name is Jim Jacks. I'm an 

Assistant United States Attorney here in the Northern 

District of Texas. I'm one of the prosecutors in this 

case that will be representing the government during this 

trial, and I just have a few questions for you as well if 

you don't mind. 

How long have you worked for the bank? 

VENIRE PERSON: I have worked for that bank 

since April of last year, but I have been in banking for 

about two and a half years now. 

MR. JACKS: So April of 2006? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: I believe it's Bank of America? 

VENIRE PERSON: Citizens National Bank. It's a 

smaller bank in Ellis County. 

MR. JACKS: Is it in Waxahachie? 

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VENIRE PERSON: The one I worked at is out of 

Red Oak, but they are officed out of Waxahachie. 

MR. JACKS: Before that bank, what bank did you 

work at? 

VENIRE PERSON: I didn't. I was a stay-at-home 

mom and went to school. 

MR. JACKS: I'm confused.

VENIRE PERSON: I worked Guarantee Bank 

currently. Before that I worked First Citizens National 

Bank of Texas. It's headquartered in Waxahachie with an 

office in Red Oak, and I worked there a year, and prior to 

that I stayed home a few months, and prior to that I was 

going to nursing school. 

MR. JACKS: Where did you attend nursing school? 

VENIRE PERSON: Navarro in Waxahachie. 

MR. JACKS: The Guaranty Bank you worked at, is 

that in Dallas? 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, I was, but now I'm in 

Arlington. 

MR. JACKS: You said your day care where your 

daughter stays closes at six so you need to make sure that 

you are there by six o'clock? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: So if the Court were to adjourn at 

4:45 each day, you would expect that would give you time 

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to get there if you were chosen for this jury? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: You said, I believe, that you are a 

fair person, not judgmental and one that will listen to 

both sides and then make a decision. Did I hear you 

correctly? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: As far as the notion of fear, it was 

your answer is the word "terrorism" has a different ring 

to it than say a fraud case or a drug case or something 

like that? --

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, I think it does. 

MR. JACKS: But the fact that this case is still 

a criminal trial in a courtroom with a judge and twelve -- 

at least twelve jurors -- 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: -- would that reassure you that at 

the end of the day this is still just a criminal case? 

VENIRE PERSON: It's a criminal case regardless 

of what it is. It's just the subject matter. 

MR. JACKS: Are you aware if there have been 

other terrorism trials in the United States? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. JACKS: Okay. If you were chosen and became 

a member of this jury, will you be able to follow the 

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Court's instructions on what the law is and issues like 

the burden of proof that the government has and the 

presumption of innocence that the defendants enjoy? Can 

you follow those instructions from the Judge? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: Have you lived in this area all of 

your life, in the Dallas Fort Worth area? 

VENIRE PERSON: I grew up in Dallas. I was born 

in Saint Paul Hospital. I just moved to Waxahachie about 

five years ago. 

MR. JACKS: And you have never been on a trial 

jury before; is that correct? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, never. 

MR. JACKS: Have you ever received a jury 

summons before? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. JACKS: At the end of all the evidence after 

both sides have presented all the testimony and witnesses 

and documents that they want to present, the Judge will 

read and give his instructions to the jury which contains 

the law the jury is supposed to use in the case, and it 

will tell the jury this is what must be proven before you 

can find this person guilty of this charge, and he would 

have definitions in there, and so if there is a word used 

in one of these laws, if necessary, he would define it in 

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that same instruction. I expect as part of his 

instructions, he would tell the jury that HAMAS is a 

terrorist organization. I don't remember if you were 

asked. Have you ever heard of HAMAS? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. And when I filled out the 

questionnaire, that's the first time I have seen any of 

the names. 

MR. JACKS: I expect the Judge will tell you 

that HAMAS has been designated a terrorist organization by 

the United States Government. I also suspect in his 

instructions he would tell you that any type of material 

support -- money or goods or services -- that are given to 

a terrorist organization or to an entity affiliated with a 

terrorist organization is against the law, including if 

that money is later spent on what might be considered 

charitable items -- food or clothing or educational 

materials, books, backpacks. If that is in the 

instructions, if the Judge says even money or materials of 

that nature is a violation of the law if it's given 

knowingly to a terrorist organization, would you be able 

to follow that instruction? 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, I think it is. If you are 

supporting them in any way, giving them a piece of bread 

or supplying a bomb. 

MR. JACKS: Thank you, ma'am. 

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THE COURT: Ms. Taylor, we are in the process of 

interviewing the panel from which a jury will be selected 

to hear this case. I expect that to go on through 

tomorrow. So until you hear from us you should not 

discuss the case with anyone or allow anyone to discuss it 

with you, and if there are any media accounts, you should 

not read or watch or listen to any of those.

VENIRE PERSON: May I approach? 

THE COURT: Yes, sir.

VENIRE PERSON: I don't know if it matters or 

not, but I have a vacation in October. The ladies down 

there told me to let you know of that. 

THE COURT: Would you mind telling that to 

everybody? 

VENIRE PERSON: Sure. 

THE COURT: It was just disclosed to me by Ms. 

Taylor that she has vacation plans in the month of 

October. Can you tell us about that? Have you paid for 

those already? 

VENIRE PERSON: My mom is taking my family on a 

cruise starting October 7, and it's lasting for a week. 

The lady downstairs told me to tell you about it. So I'm 

telling you. 

THE COURT: Thank you, Ms. Taylor. 

MS. MORENO: First of all, I apologize for not 

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going into the vacation, and I will keep that in mind the 

next time. We would move for both a hardship and a cause 

challenge on this young lady. She's got a vacation from 

October 7 for a week. Clearly, it doesn't seem from all 

the estimates that this case will be over by then. 

Secondly, the picking up of her daughter, if I recall 

correctly, I think the Court indicated you expected the 

jurors to be bussed from a particular location. So it's 

not that she's going to be able to leave here at 4:45 and 

directly pick up her child which she has to get to at six 

o'clock. The reason I asked about the distance is I'm not 

from here. It's a good hour, and I think that would pose 

a problem. 

Additionally, on the cause issues, the young 

lady when I asked her about the presumption and a case 

like this, she indicated that she thought the terrorist 

charges were scary and intimidating. She indicated she 

would try to put them aside. I kept asking for 

assurances, but she could not provide them. I can provide 

the case law over the evening about the issues and there 

can be no equivocation that she can afford these gentlemen 

the presumption of innocence. 

THE COURT: Mr. Jacks, do you have an objection 

to the challenge for cause of Ms. Taylor? 

MR. JACKS: Yes, sir, I don't believe any answer 

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she gave anywhere near approaches the grounds that she 

should be excused for cause. I think her answer was that 

she would follow the Court's instructions and observe the 

requirements of the burden of proof and presumption of 

innocence. And I do not believe that any of her answers 

in any way indicate at the end of the day she couldn't be 

a fair and impartial juror. 

THE COURT: Thank you. I am going to take the 

challenge for cause to Ms. Taylor under advisement. There 

is one other member of the venire that we have talked to 

that I wanted to give all of you an update about. I'm 

sorry. I have been intending to do this for the last 

twenty-four hours, but it has slipped my mind every time. 

But I wanted to cover it now while it is on my mind. This 

is on first day I believe, and I believe the last person 

we saw on the first day. Mr. Ivan Cabrera. He's a 

military reservist, and he expressed some concern that he 

might be receiving training orders, and after that I 

talked to Mr. Morales, and it turns out that Mr. Morales 

and Mr. Cabrera had trained together. So I asked Mr. 

Morales if he had any way to determine if orders would be 

received by Mr. Cabrera and he told me he would check into 

it because he knew an officer that had access to the 

computer. And he told me yesterday that he had been in 

touch with that officer, and he understood that Mr. 

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Cabrera's orders would be forthcoming, and I don't 

remember the exact dates. Do you? 

MR. MORALES: 8th through the 20th in 

preparation for going to Iraq. 

THE COURT: Thank you, sir. We'll be in recess 

for fifteen minutes. 

(Recess)

THE COURT: Good morning, Mr. Rosalez. Counsel 

for the parties in this case have some questions they 

would like to ask you. 

MR. WESTFALL: Good morning. My name is Greg 

Westfall, and I'm one of the defense lawyers in this case. 

I know you had to wait around this morning, and we 

appreciate your patience, especially that you had to wait 

for us to take a break. I want to talk to you a few 

minutes, and then the prosecutor may get up and talk to 

you. First off, I want to talk to you about your family 

situation. You said you are single but you have a ten 

year old child. 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. WESTFALL: Are you caring for your child? 

VENIRE PERSON: We have joint custody. 

MR. WESTFALL: So if you are on this jury for a 

period of months, is that going to interfere with your 

ability to care for your child. 

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VENIRE PERSON: No, sir. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you have anything else like 

prepaid vacations? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, I do. September 21st I'm 

going on a cruise. 

MR. WESTFALL: For how long? 

VENIRE PERSON: Five days. 

MR. WESTFALL: How long have you had the 

tickets? 

VENIRE PERSON: I bought them early march. 

MR. WESTFALL: Is it all prepaid? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: If you didn't go on the cruise, 

would you be able to get your money back? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, sir, I believe the deadline 

was yesterday. 

MR. WESTFALL: This a family type of vacation? 

VENIRE PERSON: It's twenty friends of mine. 

We're all going. Someone is getting married. 

MR. WESTFALL: It's a wedding? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. WESTFALL: Very well. Thank you for telling 

us about that. 

VENIRE PERSON: You are welcome. 

MR. WESTFALL: The case is United States versus 

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Holy Land Foundation. And it involves allegations of 

material support to a terrorist group, that being HAMAS. 

Having told you that, do you recognize the case style? Do 

you recognize the facts at all? 

VENIRE PERSON: I really haven't followed it. 

MR. WESTFALL: Have you heard of it? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, I heard of it just from TV. 

MR. WESTFALL: Based on anything you have heard, 

have you formed any opinions? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. WESTFALL: What does a coding tech do? 

VENIRE PERSON: We code lenses for binoculars. 

Everything is pretty much laser guided in the military. 

So we code the lenses on the binoculars so the soldiers 

won't get blind. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you just do it for military 

operations? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. Just military. 

MR. WESTFALL: Have you been in the military? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, sir. 

MR. WESTFALL: How did you get this job? 

VENIRE PERSON: I coated lenses, like glasses 

eight years. So a friend of mine gave me a referral for 

Northrup. 

MR. WESTFALL: Is that who you work with, 

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Northrup? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. WESTFALL: Did you get a security clearance? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: So you have been investigated by 

the FBI? 

VENIRE PERSON: I don't know the extent of their 

investigation, but they did a background check on me and 

everything. 

MR. WESTFALL: Did you do any other kinds of 

military equipment like scopes or anything like that? 

VENIRE PERSON: We do like tanks, windows for 

tanks. 

MR. WESTFALL: You personally do.

VENIRE PERSON: Every now and then. It depends 

on what the job calls for. 

MR. WESTFALL: This coating prevents lasers from 

being able to go into the binoculars? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. And vice versa for 

the tank windows. 

MR. WESTFALL: Have you had any terrorism 

training or anything like that as a result of your job? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. WESTFALL: How do you feel about being on a 

case where we're talking about Muslim men who are accused 

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of something where terrorism is actually in the name of 

the offense? 

VENIRE PERSON: I have no problem. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you know any Muslims? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, sir. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you have any people of Arabic 

descent that work at Northrup? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, sir. 

MR. WESTFALL: Have you ever any good 

experiences or bad experiences with Muslims? 

VENIRE PERSON: No experiences at all. 

MR. WESTFALL: What else do you do besides your 

work and your child? 

VENIRE PERSON: That's about it. My son is 

pretty much everything to me. 

MR. WESTFALL: Does he do things like play 

soccer? 

VENIRE PERSON: Soccer and basic ball. 

MR. WESTFALL: You go to those games? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. I try to be assistant 

coach on some of the teams. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you do any kind of a 

charitable work? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, sir. 

MR. WESTFALL: Are you involved in your church? 

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VENIRE PERSON: No. The only church I'm 

involved in is when I visit my family, Pentecostal. So I 

go over there. 

MR. WESTFALL: You do with your family to do 

that? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, Easter and stuff like that. 

MR. WESTFALL: Your brother was a detention 

officer for the State of Oklahoma? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: Does he still do that? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. WESTFALL: What does he do now? 

VENIRE PERSON: I believe he works at Wal-Mart. 

MR. WESTFALL: This is a criminal case, and all 

the rights apply when you are char ged with a crime in the 

United States. You have the right not to testify against 

yourself or testify at all if you don't want to. You know 

that? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: You have the right to the 

presumption of innocence. Have you ever heard of that 

term, presumption of innocence? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, sir. 

MR. WESTFALL: You have a right to have the 

state prove or the government prove its case beyond a 

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reasonable doubt. Have you ever heard of the 

beyond-a-reasonable-doubt standard? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. WESTFALL: Well, the presumption of 

innocence means as a person sits here and is charged with 

an offense, they are presumed innocent until and unless 

the government proves its case beyond a reasonable doubt. 

Having told you a little more about that, have you heard 

of that? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. WESTFALL: Not from watching Cops or 

anything like that? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. WESTFALL: That is a very valuable and 

serious protection to anyone who's charged with an 

offense. Anyone who's accused -- a citizen or a 

noncitizen -- who's accused in the United States. Do you 

think that's fair? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you think it's fair to have 

that in a case that involves terrorism? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: Thank you very much. 

THE COURT: Counsel for the government have 

questions for Mr. Rosalez? 

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MR. JACKS: Thank you, your Honor. Mr. Rosalez, 

my name is Jim Jacks, and I'm an Assistant United States 

Attorney for the Northern District of Texas. I will be 

one of the prosecutors in this case, and I will be 

representing the government. I have just a few questions 

for you if you don't mind. How long have you worked for 

Northrup Grummen? 

VENIRE PERSON: Two and a half years. 

MR. JACKS: And before that, where did you work? 

VENIRE PERSON: SOR America. 

MR. JACKS: And that's some kind of an optical 

company or lens manufacturing? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. JACKS: Where are they located? 

VENIRE PERSON: They are located in Farmer's 

Branch. 

MR. JACKS: And Northrup Grummen is located 

where? 

VENIRE PERSON: In Garland. 

MR. JACKS: Is it near Raytheon? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, it's right down the street. 

MR. JACKS: You live in Rowlett? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: Did you grow up in Oklahoma? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, I grew up in Dallas. 

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MR. JACKS: But some of your family is in 

Oklahoma? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, they relocated when my mom 

married. 

MR. JACKS: Have you lived in the Dallas area 

your whole life? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. JACKS: Do you remember receiving a part of 

the questionnaire early before you came down to the 

courthouse and filling out this multi-page questionnaire? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. JACKS: And that part of it pertained to 

hardships or conflicts. I cannot remember. I'm sure I 

saw it. Did you mention the upcoming cruise in that form? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, I didn't. I think that 

would be a hardship. 

MR. JACKS: And the purpose of this cruise is a 

wedding? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. It's a friend of mine. 

MR. JACKS: Are you in the wedding? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. JACKS: Where does it depart? 

VENIRE PERSON: Galveston and then Yucatan and 

Mexico. 

MR. JACKS: And you said it's for a week? 

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VENIRE PERSON: Five days. 

MR. JACKS: Your brother you said works for the 

State of Oklahoma as a detention officer? 

VENIRE PERSON: He did. 

MR. JACKS: How long has it been since he did 

that work? 

VENIRE PERSON: Two to three years. 

MR. JACKS: What does he do now? 

VENIRE PERSON: Works in Wal-Mart in Ada. 

MR. JACKS: This a prison that he worked at or a 

county jail? 

VENIRE PERSON: It was a prison. 

MR. JACKS: You indicated in response to a 

question that you had some friends that had been arrested 

for different things. One individual -- Actually two 

individuals you said had been charged with intent to 

distribute drugs. 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. JACKS: Are those charges resolved or are 

they still pending? 

VENIRE PERSON: They are resolved. 

MR. JACKS: Were they convicted? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, they are on probation. 

MR. JACKS: Was that in Dallas County or some 

other county? 

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VENIRE PERSON: Dallas. 

MR. JACKS: What drugs were involved? 

Marijuana? Cocaine? 

VENIRE PERSON: I believe cocaine. 

MR. JACKS: How close are you to those friends? 

VENIRE PERSON: I see them once, probably twice 

a month. 

MR. JACKS: Did you ever attend court on their 

behalf or anything like that? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, sir. 

MR. JACKS: Based on what you have learned about 

that, do you feel like they were treated fairly by the 

criminal justice system? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: Is there any question in your mind 

about that? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. JACKS: Thank you. 

THE COURT: Mr. Rosalez, we are in the process 

of hearing from the panel from which the jury will be 

selected to hear this case. I expect that will last 

through tomorrow. Until you hear from us, you should not 

discuss the case with anyone or allow anyone to discuss it 

with you, and if there are any media accounts, you should 

not read or watch or listen to any of those. Thank you, 

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you may be excused.

VENIRE PERSON: Thank you. 

THE COURT: Good morning, Mr. Griftner. Counsel 

for the parties have some questions to ask you. 

VENIRE PERSON: Is there a couple of things I 

can say? 

THE COURT: Yes, sir. 

VENIRE PERSON: I didn't realize the longevity 

of this, and I'm a new business office, and due to this 

I'm missing computer training program for the sales 

program, and as well as I have a trip this weekend to go 

to California to promote my business. 

THE COURT: How long is that trip supposed to 

last? 

VENIRE PERSON: That will be just through the 

weekend. 

THE COURT: Thank you. Mr. Westfall. 

MR. WESTFALL: I'm Greg Westfall. Thank you for 

waiting for us. I'm one of the criminal defense lawyers 

on this case. I am going to speak with you a little bit, 

and then the government will speak with you. This is the 

Holy Land Foundation, the United States versus the Holy 

Land Foundation, and it involves allegations of material 

support of a terrorist organization, specifically HAMAS. 

Have you heard anything about the case? 

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VENIRE PERSON: I remember like a year and a 

half ago when it was in the news. I don't follow the news 

on a regular basis, but the bigger things I usually hear 

about from workers or family. 

MR. WESTFALL: Have you formed any opinions on 

anything you have read or heard about the guilt or 

innocence of the defendants? 

VENIRE PERSON: I don't know. That's a hard 

question to answer. It's hard to say yes or no honestly. 

MR. WESTFALL: I'll tell you why I asked. The 

jury that is impaneled ultimately for the trial -- You 

know how long it could last now, four months? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. WESTFALL: The jury has to make a decision 

one hundred percent on the evidence and testimony that is 

given in trial inside this courtroom from that witness 

stand. And no preformed opinions or personal feelings can 

interfere with that. That is kind of a requirement for 

sitting on the jury, and that requirement changes case to 

case because, you know, if you are on a car theft case, 

the feelings may be different than if you are on a high 

profile case and has different issues. Do you know what I 

mean? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, before I got into it -- I'm 

dyslexic, and I scanned through it, and I didn't realize 

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the complexity of the case. Like you said, a stolen car 

or something like that would be a much easier way. But 

yeah, I probably have feelings towards a certain way. 

MR. WESTFALL: The legal basic question is can 

you set those feelings aside and judge this case only on 

the evidence. And there is no right or wrong answer to 

that question. 

VENIRE PERSON: Honestly not really. That would 

be hard. 

MR. WESTFALL: You don't think you can? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. WESTFALL: I saw the Griftner's Motorcycles, 

and I thought that might be your business. 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. I have been working on it 

for a month now. I just turned twenty-five and got my 

inheritance, and I just put the open sign up last 

Wednesday. 

MR. WESTFALL: You have a fairly substantial 

financial investment? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, my life is riding on it. 

If it doesn't go, my life is in the gutter. 

MR. WESTFALL: Thank you. 

THE COURT: Counsel for the government have 

questions? 

MR. GARRETT: No, your Honor. 

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THE COURT: Mr. Griftner, we're in the process 

of talking to the panel that will hear this case, and I 

think that will go through tomorrow. So until you hear 

from us, you should not discuss the case with anyone or 

allow anyone to discuss it with you, and if there are any 

media accounts of this case, you should not read or watch 

or listen to any of those. 

MR. WESTFALL: Your Honor, we challenge the 

juror. We don't think he can be fair and impartial. 

THE COURT: Does the government have a position 

about that? 

MR. GARRETT: No objection. 

THE COURT: I will excuse the juror for cause. 

I think we're ready to see next Ms. Gonzales. 

Good morning, Ladies and Gentlemen. Counsel for 

the parties have some questions to ask you. 

MS. MORENO: Good morning, Ms. Gonzales. My 

name is Linda Moreno, and I'm one of defense counsel in 

this case. I want to ask you some questions about the 

answers you filled out on the questionnaire a couple of 

weeks ago. Do you remember that? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: And also if you have heard anything 

about this case. So I am going to ask you a few questions 

for a few minutes. 

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This is the case that involves the Holy Land 

Foundation charity. Holy Land Foundation, have you heard 

about it or read about it in the media lately? 

VENIRE PERSON: I have heard about it in the 

news, but I really haven't been paying attention to it. 

MS. MORENO: Was that recently or? 

VENIRE PERSON: It was -- I think it was Friday 

morning as I was going to work. 

MS. MORENO: Did you hear anything of any of the 

details about the case? 

VENIRE PERSON: I really didn't pay any 

attention. 

MS. MORENO: I see that you are a driver for 

O'O'Riley Auto Parts? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, I'm a driver. 

MS. MORENO: This case may take three to four 

months. Perhaps longer. We're not sure. Knowing that, 

would that cause you any difficulty or economic hardship 

at your job? 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, I'm the only one. I'm not 

married. I'm single. So I am responsible for my bills. 

MS. MORENO: Do you know if your company would 

pay you? 

VENIRE PERSON: I think they do. I'm not too 

sure.

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MS. MORENO: You are not sure? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MS. MORENO: If you find out they don't pay you, 

would you please alert the Court? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: You are a Spanish speaker? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: Is Spanish your first language? 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, my mom doesn't speak 

English. And at work, too, they are mostly Spanish 

people. 

MS. MORENO: In this case, there is going to be 

translation evidence -- documents, transcripts -- from 

Arabic to English. Have you ever had a situation in your 

life where someone was translating something from Spanish 

to English? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MS. MORENO: Let me give you the example. Are 

you nervous? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: I am, too. Let's relax. Have you 

ever had a situation where someone was translating from 

Spanish to English and the words were correct, but the 

meaning was wrong? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

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MS. MORENO: Have you ever had that experience? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MS. MORENO: This is a case that involves 

allegations of terrorism. The government says the Holy 

Land Foundation which is an American Muslim charity 

through humanitarian aid supported terrorist organization 

named HAMAS. Have you ever heard of HAMAS? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MS. MORENO: Knowing this case involves charges 

of terrorism which are pretty serious charges -- Do you 

agree? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: Does that cause you any concern in 

sitting on a jury like this? Does it worry you? 

VENIRE PERSON: I guess. 

MS. MORENO: And I'm sorry to explore this with 

you, but there is an important reason for me to do that, 

and I want to tell you what you say is not right or wrong. 

We're not looking for right or wrong answers. We're not 

looking for a certain answer. We're trying to determine 

if this is a good case for you to sit on in terms of your 

ability to be fair and impartial. Can you tell us, assure 

us, that you would not be concerned or afraid to sit on a 

jury like this? Or would you have some fear? 

VENIRE PERSON: I think I would have some fear. 

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Concern. 

MS. MORENO: Tell us about that. 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, I am very -- I get very 

nervous. I am very forgetful. I can't remember. I can't 

communicate that well with people. And if I was asked 

questions, I would probably not be able to answer them. 

MS. MORENO: In this case which may take, as I 

said, four months there is going to be a lot of 

evidence -- transcripts, documents, videos and tapes. Do 

you think it would be difficult for you to remember and 

follow along on this evidence? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: Would that be so difficult for you 

that you couldn't really keep track of the information and 

fulfill your duty as a juror? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: You couldn't do that, could you? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MS. MORENO: Thank you so much. We really 

appreciate it. Pass the juror. 

THE COURT: Counsel for the government have 

questions for Ms. Gonzales? 

MR. JACKS: Yes, your Honor. Good morning, Ms. 

Gonzales. 

VENIRE PERSON: Good morning. 

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MR. JACKS: My name is Jim Jacks. I'm the 

Assistant United States Attorney here in Dallas. I'll be 

one of the prosecutors in this case which means I will be 

representing the government during this trial, and I have 

a few questions to ask you as well for a very brief 

moment. 

How long have you worked for O'Riley Auto Parts? 

VENIRE PERSON: Ten years. 

MR. JACKS: Have you ever held another position 

over the driver? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. JACKS: Do you make deliveries to car 

dealerships and garages and that type of thing? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: Is your work schedule Monday through 

Friday or do you work on the weekends or does it vary? 

VENIRE PERSON: Monday through Friday. 

Sometimes Saturdays. But mostly from Monday to Friday. 

MR. JACKS: And some of the people who have 

filled out the questionnaire have filled it out 

differently, but do you have any children? 

VENIRE PERSON: I have three boys, but they are 

all grown. 

MR. JACKS: Do they still live in the Dallas 

area? 

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VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: Have you lived in the Dallas area 

your entire life? 

VENIRE PERSON: Since 1974. 

MR. JACKS: Before that where were you living? 

VENIRE PERSON: In California. 

MR. JACKS: Were you born and raised in 

California? 

VENIRE PERSON: I was born in Mexico, and at the 

age of seven I came to the United States. 

MR. JACKS: What caused you to move from 

California to Texas? 

VENIRE PERSON: Work. 

MR. JACKS: You were told just a little bit 

about this trial. The principal charge essentially has 

been referred to as providing material support to a 

terrorist organization; namely HAMAS. And you said you 

had never heard of a group called HAMAS. 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. JACKS: And I think you have indicated that 

you are nervous about being here. Is that correct? 

VENIRE PERSON: Correct. 

MR. JACKS: In terms of the word "fear," were 

you afraid before you came here or nervous? Which is the 

more accurate if you can? 

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VENIRE PERSON: I guess I was afraid when I got 

the letter to appear. 

MR. JACKS: What was it that made you afraid? 

What were your concerns? 

VENIRE PERSON: The questions that I was going 

to be asked. If I was going to be able to understand them 

and answer them. 

MR. JACKS: All right. So it was more 

nervousness or concern or anxiety on your part about being 

able to respond to questions like this in front of a group 

of people. Is that a fair statement? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: Is that different than being afraid 

for your safety? Are you afraid for your safety or just 

anxious about being questioned in public about things? 

VENIRE PERSON: I think it's mostly anxious and 

anxiety. 

MR. JACKS: Have you ever served on a jury 

before? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. JACKS: Have you ever received a jury 

summons before? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: About how many times approximately 

if it's a lot? 

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VENIRE PERSON: Just one. This is two. 

MR. JACKS: This is the second time? 

VENIRE PERSON: This is the second time. 

MR. JACKS: The earlier time, was that the 

Dallas County Courthouse? Is that where you went? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: You have obviously no experience 

being a juror during a trial. You did say that you get 

nervous. Did I hear you correctly? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: And you cannot communicate --

VENIRE PERSON: Well, I have a hard time 

communicating. 

MR. JACKS: If you should end up on this jury, 

do you think that you could pay attention to the evidence 

and give both sides -- Let me ask that one step at a time. 

Do you feel like you could pay attention to the evidence? 

And when I say evidence, I'm talking about witnesses that 

get on the witness stand and then maybe documents, videos, 

photographs. Do you feel like you could pay attention to 

those things as they are being discussed during the trial? 

VENIRE PERSON: I can, but I might forget. 

MR. JACKS: Would it help you if you were 

allowed to take notes? 

VENIRE PERSON: Probably, yes. 

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MR. JACKS: If the Judge was to allow the 

jury -- That is permissible under the law to allow the 

jury to make notes of what happens so that they can 

refresh their memory. Anything else that would -- you 

think we should know about your feelings if you were 

selected as a juror? Anything else that you think we 

should know about? 

VENIRE PERSON: That I'm taking medication for 

depression? 

MR. JACKS: Okay. Is that something you take 

daily? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. Just when I am --

MR. JACKS: When you feel like you need it? 

VENIRE PERSON: When I feel like I'm getting 

depressed. 

MR. JACKS: Does that medication seem to do its 

job? 

VENIRE PERSON: A little bit. 

MR. JACKS: Ms. Gonzales, near the end of the 

trial, after both of the parties have presented all the 

witnesses they want to present and all the documents, the 

Judge then will tell the jury -- He'll be on the Bench, 

and he would read to you his instructions which basically 

tell the jury this is the law that you apply to this case, 

and you will have a copy yourself. Each juror will have a 

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written copy of those instructions. 

THE COURT: Mr. Jacks, your time has expired. 

MR. JACKS: Thank you. Thank you, Ms. Gonzales. 

THE COURT: Ms. Gonzales, we are in the process 

of talking with each member of the panel from which the 

jury will be drawn that would hear this case. I expect 

that process will continue today and into tomorrow. So 

until you hear from us again, you should not discuss this 

case with anyone or allow anyone to discuss it with you, 

and if there are any media accounts about this case on the 

television or in the newspapers or on the radio, you 

should not read or watch or listen to any of those media 

accounts. Thank you, you may be excused. 

MS. MORENO: Thank you, your Honor. We would 

move for a cause challenge on this particular juror. She 

was very clear that she was very nervous and scared. She 

Stated quite clearly that she would have difficulty 

keeping track of the evidence. Keeping in mind this is 

going to be a three- to four-month trial, that would 

probably not be fair to both sides, your Honor. She's on 

medication for depression. The stress of this trial would 

certainly impact that. But most importantly, she was even 

during Mr. Jacks's questioning -- It's quite clear that 

she has a tremendous amount of anxiety in serving on this 

case, and I think that would not be fair to either side. 

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So we move for a cause challenge. 

THE COURT: Mr. Jacks, do you have a position 

about that challenge for cause? 

MR. JACKS: No. 

THE COURT: I will excuse Ms. Gonzales for 

cause. 

Good morning, Ms. Voss. Counsel for the parties 

have some questions they would like to ask you. 

Mr. Westfall. 

MR. WESTFALL: Thank you, your Honor.

Ms. Voss, how are you doing? 

VENIRE PERSON: All right. 

MR. WESTFALL: My name is Greg Westfall. I'm 

one of the criminal defense lawyers on this case. I want 

to speak with you a very few minutes. Thank you so much 

for waiting. 

VENIRE PERSON: You are welcome. 

MR. WESTFALL: This case, as you may know by 

now, is United States versus the Holy Land Foundation. 

The allegation by the government is that the Holy Land 

Foundation -- which was an American Muslim charity? 

VENIRE PERSON: Okay. 

MR. WESTFALL: The Holy Land Foundation and 

several of the men in that foundation gave material 

support to a terrorist organization, specifically HAMAS. 

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Material support to HAMAS. You probably never heard of 

material support, but from the words "Holy Land 

Foundation, criminal case, Muslim charity, HAMAS, 

Palestine," does this ring any bells? Have you heard 

about this before? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. WESTFALL: Okay. Would you do me a favor? 

Just be sure to keep your voice up. The walls kind of 

echo. Thank you so much. Do you work? What kind of 

warehouse is it? What do you do? 

VENIRE PERSON: We deal in cereal and snack 

bars. 

MR. WESTFALL: You make cereal and snack bars? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. We box it up, and they ship 

it off. 

MR. WESTFALL: Is it the food? 

VENIRE PERSON: Cereal. 

MR. WESTFALL: How long have you been doing 

that? 

VENIRE PERSON: About a year. 

MR. WESTFALL: What did you do before that? 

VENIRE PERSON: Not too much. 

MR. WESTFALL: Just hung around? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: How do you like your job? 

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VENIRE PERSON: It's okay. 

MR. WESTFALL: What do you do besides your job? 

VENIRE PERSON: Play basketball and listen to 

music. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you have a pick-up game like 

at the Y or just in the neighborhood? 

VENIRE PERSON: The neighborhood. 

MR. WESTFALL: Is there a group of you that 

regularly plays? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you have teams or a league? 

VENIRE PERSON: Not a league but certain teams. 

MR. WESTFALL: Is it organized like you have 

jersies? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. WESTFALL: Just in there in the 

neighborhood? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: You have been playing basketball 

a long time? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: Did you play in high school? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: Which position do you play? 

VENIRE PERSON: Wing, point guard. 

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MR. WESTFALL: Have you ever been -- You've 

never been on a jury before, have you? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, sir. 

MR. WESTFALL: How do you feel about being on a 

jury? 

VENIRE PERSON: Kind of nervous. 

MR. WESTFALL: Now you are having to be asked 

questions by a lawyer which is nerve-racking? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: And this is a case that could go 

on four months. Maybe longer than four months. Maybe 

shorter than four months. But four months is kind of the 

over/under. I want to ask you, does that cause you any 

hardship? Are you going to lose your job or do you have 

any family duties, anything like that that would be 

impaired? We will be in court I think as a general 

principal during business hours from Monday through 

Thursday. 

VENIRE PERSON: Okay. 

MR. WESTFALL: So knocking off about 4:45, five 

o'clock and not being in court on Friday. Given that, do 

you have any family issues, job issues, that would be very 

impaired as a result of that? 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, I take care of my aunt 

that's kind of legally blind. It's like after work. I 

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pick her up around 3:20 every day. Other than that, 

nothing else. 

MR. WESTFALL: So you pick up your aunt at 3:20 

every day? 

VENIRE PERSON: 3:20 every day. 

MR. WESTFALL: Is there anybody else that could 

pick up your aunt while you are doing this? 

VENIRE PERSON: I don't think so. I have been 

doing that for the last four years. 

MR. WESTFALL: Is there any other arrangements 

that can be made for your aunt? 

VENIRE PERSON: It's possible. It's possible. 

I have to talk to her about it. 

MR. WESTFALL: If no arrangements can be made, 

is that something that would distract you at 3:20 every 

day? 

VENIRE PERSON: It's possible. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you know any Muslims at all? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. WESTFALL: Have you ever had any good 

experiences or bad experiences with Muslims? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. WESTFALL: How do you feel about being a 

juror in a case where Muslim men has anything to do with 

terrorism? 

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VENIRE PERSON: I can't say. 

MR. WESTFALL: What kind of music do you listen 

to? 

VENIRE PERSON: R and B. 

MR. WESTFALL: What are some of your favorite 

groups? 

VENIRE PERSON: R. Kelly. I can go on and on. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you feel strongly about 

freedom of speech? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: What does it mean to you? 

VENIRE PERSON: Speak what's on your mind. 

MR. WESTFALL: You speak your mind? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you like being free to speak 

your mind? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you think other people should 

be free to speak their mind? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. WESTFALL: Even if you don't like what they 

are saying? 

VENIRE PERSON: Even if I don't like what they 

are saying. 

MR. WESTFALL: Thank you so much. 

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THE COURT: Counsel for the government have 

questions for Ms. Voss? 

MR. JONAS: Good morning. My name is Barry 

Jonas. I'm with the Department of Justice, and I'm one of 

the prosecutors on this case. I just have a few follow-up 

questions to ask you. I understand in your answers to Mr. 

Westfall you said you have not heard anything at all about 

this case. 

VENIRE PERSON: Correct. 

MR. JONAS: Have you ever heard of the 

organization known as HAMAS? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. JONAS: Know nothing about them? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. JONAS: You remember the questionnaire you 

filled out a few weeks ago? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JONAS: One of the questions asked about 

employment, and you checked you were unemployed and laid 

off. I guess I'm a little confused. Are you currently 

working at the warehouse? 

VENIRE PERSON: I am. 

MR. JONAS: So this is just a mistake? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JONAS: You also mentioned that you had a 

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brother who had a drug charge.

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JONAS: Can you tell me about that? 

VENIRE PERSON: I really don't know too much. I 

just know that's the reason he's in jail now, because of 

drugs. 

MR. JONAS: Do you know how long he's been in 

jail? 

VENIRE PERSON: About three years. 

MR. JONAS: Is he a close brother? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JONAS: Do you think he was treated fairly 

in the criminal justice system? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JONAS: So there is nothing about his 

experience that would cause you to think negatively of the 

prosecution? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. JONAS: You also indicated you have a friend 

who is a security officer? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JONAS: Do you know where he works or she 

works? 

VENIRE PERSON: Not anymore. It was Statewide 

Patrol. 

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MR. JONAS: That's a private company? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JONAS: But he doesn't work there anymore? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. JONAS: You mentioned you pick up your aunt 

every day at 3:20. You said she is legally blind. Where 

do you pick her up from? 

VENIRE PERSON: Dallas Lighthouse for the Blind. 

MR. JONAS: Where do you take her? 

VENIRE PERSON: To her house. 

MR. JONAS: Do you stay with her after you pick 

her up? 

VENIRE PERSON: Sometimes. 

MR. JONAS: Does she live alone? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JONAS: When do you take her? 

VENIRE PERSON: 6:20. 

MR. JONAS: Do you drop her off on your way to 

work? 

VENIRE PERSON: I work nights. 

MR. JONAS: So you pick her up on your way back 

from work? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JONAS: When do you sleep? 

VENIRE PERSON: Sometimes I don't sleep. 

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MR. JONAS: Okay. I have had days like that. 

No further questions, thank you. 

THE COURT: Ms. Voss, we are in the process of 

talking with the members of the panel from whom the jury 

to hear this case will be drawn. So until you hear from 

us do not discuss the case with anyone or allow anyone to 

discuss it with you, and if there are any media accounts 

on the television or in the newspapers or on the radio, 

you should not watch or listen or read any of those 

accounts. Thank you. You may be excused. 

MR. JONAS: Your Honor, we would request the 

court consider her situation for a hardship. 

THE COURT: All right, sir. I will add her to 

the list. 

THE COURT: Good morning. Counsel for the 

parties have some questions to ask you. 

MR. WESTFALL: Good morning, I'm Greg Westfall. 

I'm one of defense lawyers in this case. This is the case 

of United States of America versus Holy Land Foundation 

which involves a foundation and some Muslim men that are 

alleged to have given aid to a terrorist organization 

named HAMAS. Have you heard about that? 

VENIRE PERSON: I heard the name HAMAS. 

MR. WESTFALL: So you have heard of the Holy 

Land Foundation? 

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VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. WESTFALL: Anything that you have heard, 

have you formed an opinion one way or the other about 

whether the defendants are innocent or guilty? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, sir, I just briefly read 

about it. 

MR. WESTFALL: This trial could go on four 

months. Will you be okay with your employment if you end 

up doing jury service for that long? 

VENIRE PERSON: I'd probably get fired, lose my 

job. 

MR. WESTFALL: What do you think are the chances 

of that? 

VENIRE PERSON: They will let me go. 

MR. WESTFALL: We're looking at four days a 

week, Monday through Thursday, during business hours. 

Under that set of circumstances, do you think you would be 

terminated from your employment? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: Would that create a financial 

hardship on you? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you support anyone else 

besides yourself? 

VENIRE PERSON: My wife and grandson. 

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MR. WESTFALL: Does your wife work also? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. WESTFALL: Does your grandson live with you? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir, he does. 

MR. WESTFALL: So you basically support the 

family on wages you earn? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. WESTFALL: You said in your questionnaire 

that you followed the Palestine-Israeli conflict somewhat 

closely? 

VENIRE PERSON: For personal reasons I 

understand what's going on. 

MR. WESTFALL: Tell me what you understand. 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, from what I understand the 

Palestinians are fighting for the land taken away by 

Israel, and from what I understand, HAMAS is the group 

that came out of Palestine, and they are fighting a war. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you do any charity work 

outside the home at all? It sounds like you have a lot on 

your hands, but do you do any volunteer work or charity 

work? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, sir. 

MR. WESTFALL: Have you ever? 

VENIRE PERSON: What do you mean by charity 

work? 

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MR. WESTFALL: Volunteering with the church or? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you have any friends or 

associates or acquaintances that are Muslim? 

VENIRE PERSON: I have a supervisor that's 

Muslim. 

MR. WESTFALL: How do you and he get along? 

VENIRE PERSON: Great. We're good friends. He 

happens to be like a supervisor. And like I said, I try 

to understand the conflicts in the Middle East, all the 

parties involved. I'm not an expert, so I have an idea of 

what's going. Instead of expressing a foolish opinion, I 

understand what's going on. He's Palestinian. I was 

curious to what was going on. I never asked somebody that 

has lived in that area. I want to hear their point of 

view, and he explained that HAMAS is sort of a -- compared 

them somewhat to Black Panthers. They had some bad people 

in the group, yes, but the main idea was to fight for 

justice for them and the same thing here. HAMAS was 

simply another part of Palestine. 

MR. WESTFALL: After speaking with him, did your 

mind change? Did you have some ideas before, and you got 

new ideas? 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, it gave me a better 

understanding of what's going on over there. They have a 

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news clipping on the television one day on the news 

channel. They were giving a brief history as to how this 

thing came about, and from what I understand Israel took a 

lot of their land, and Palestinian people are fighting for 

it. So I support their cause, believe me. 

MR. WESTFALL: Thank you very much. I'm sure my 

time is up. Thank you. 

THE COURT: Counsel for the government have any 

questions of Mr. Abelar? 

MR. JACKS: Good morning. My name is Jim Jacks, 

and I'm part of the prosecution in this case, and we'll be 

representing the government. I just have a few questions 

for you. 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. JACKS: You work for Central Parking 

Systems. Do you work at a particular lot all the time? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. JACKS: Where is that lot located? 

VENIRE PERSON: I work at the Urban Towers, 222 

O'Connell Boulevard. It's at 114. 

MR. JACKS: What are your hours daily? 

VENIRE PERSON: Six to 2:30. 

MR. JACKS: And you said your supervisor is a 

Muslim? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

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MR. JACKS: What nationality is he? 

VENIRE PERSON: Palestine. 

MR. JACKS: Does he know any of the individuals 

on trial? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, he doesn't. 

MR. JACKS: Have you asked him? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, I haven't asked him, but 

when I asked the question about -- explain more about 

Palestine and HAMAS, I didn't know what HAMAS was until it 

came in the news more often. But again, I wanted to have 

a better understanding so who better to ask than someone 

from that region. And what got my attention is one of my 

supervisors, he's got a very good business head on him. 

MR. JACKS: Let me ask you. Is he somebody you 

see every day? Stop by every day? 

VENIRE PERSON: He's like the second in charge. 

MR. JACKS: Does he work at that location all 

the time? 

VENIRE PERSON: That location and a couple of 

others. 

MR. JACKS: So you see him every day? 

VENIRE PERSON: Every day. 

MR. JACKS: When you filled out the 

questionnaire I guess on June 7th and saw references to 

questions about the Holy Land Foundation and the names of 

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these individuals and then questions asking about the 

Israeli and Palestinian conflict, did you talk to him 

about it after you filled out the questionnaire? 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, I asked about it trying to 

understand the conflict itself. But not about this trial 

or this case. 

MR. JACKS: Okay. But have you talked to him 

about this case and the Holy Land Foundation, the fact 

that you may be on the jury? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, sir. 

MR. JACKS: Did you see newspapers articles on 

it in the last few days? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, sir. 

MR. JACKS: Do you read the newspapers? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: Do you take the Dallas Morning News? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: Do you watch the news at night? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: Have you seen news stories about the 

trial? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. JACKS: You have gotten your information 

from him because you are interested in the circumstances; 

is that right? 

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VENIRE PERSON: In the region, in the conflict 

itself, but not any particular -- other than just to be 

informed so I understand the conflict. 

MR. JACKS: Have you accepted what he has told 

you as true? 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, not just because he talked 

to me, but because of the news clippings that I have read 

and seen on the television, the History Channel provided. 

MR. JACKS: So you have gotten your information 

from other sources, too? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: TV shows, History Channel, that type 

of thing? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: Are you of the belief that HAMAS is 

like a freedom fighters' organization? 

VENIRE PERSON: Somewhat. 

MR. JACKS: So if the United States Government 

has declared them to be a terrorist organization, do you 

disagree with that description of them? 

VENIRE PERSON: I have mixed feelings because in 

every group that you find, freedom fighters, no matter 

what nationality or country you are going to have bad 

people. But from what I understand they are fighting for 

Palestinian land. 

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MR. JACKS: Right. But if the government has 

said that organization is a terrorist organization, does 

not differentiate among individuals, just says that 

organization is a terrorist organization, do you disagree 

with the government having done that? 

VENIRE PERSON: I have mixed feelings. 

MR. JACKS: All right. If the Judge told you at 

the end of the case that this group has been designated by 

the government as a terrorist organization, would you be 

able to accept that or would that influence your verdict? 

Your mixed feelings. 

VENIRE PERSON: To be honest, I want to 

support -- I believe in the HAMAS, their war, if you will. 

Unfortunately, they are going about it the wrong way, but 

they took their land. They took their land. 

MR. JACKS: Would those feelings affect you? 

Would you be thinking about that when you are serving on 

the jury? 

VENIRE PERSON: I look at the facts. 

MR. JACKS: I understand, but you bring your 

feelings in because you are human. 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: Would those feelings affect your 

verdict? 

VENIRE PERSON: To some extent, yes. 

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MR. JACKS: And going back to your job, if you 

were going to lose your job from being on this trial, is 

that going to affect -- When you are sitting here for 

months not having any income from your job, is that going 

to concern you while you are sitting here? 

VENIRE PERSON: Of course. 

MR. JACKS: And would it pre-occupy your mind 

and make it difficult for you to serve as a juror? 

VENIRE PERSON: I don't know. I won't be 

thinking about that really. My concern would be the case. 

MR. JACKS: Do you want to be on this jury? 

VENIRE PERSON: I don't know if you would want 

me here because I believe in what the Palestinians are 

doing. I don't like how they go about doing it. The 

terrorists. 

MR. JACKS: Do you think the government might 

not want you on this jury? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: Because of your views and that would 

be a part of your decision making process? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: So you kind of come into this based 

on -- I don't know if research is too high toned a word. 

But based on your experiences, you have some ideas about 

who's right and who's wrong in the Palestinian-Israeli 

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conflict? 

VENIRE PERSON: Again, I would have to say if I 

was picked, no matter how I feel about the conflict over 

there, I still have to look at the facts. 

MR. JACKS: I understand. But are you saying 

you are not going to be setting aside what you have 

learned on your own regarding how you feel about the 

situation over there, your opinion about who's right and 

who's wrong? 

VENIRE PERSON: What I think about who's right 

or wrong is not my concern. It concerns the facts of the 

trial. 

MR. JACKS: I understand. 

THE COURT: Mr. Jacks, your time has expired. 

Mr. Abelar, we are in the process of talking to 

all the members of the panel from which the jury will be 

drawn that would hear this case. I expect that process 

will go on today and into tomorrow. So until you hear 

from us, you should not discuss this case with anyone or 

allow anyone to discuss it with you, and if there are any 

media accounts about the case in the newspapers or on 

television or in the newspapers or on the radio, you 

should not read or watch or listen to any of those news 

accounts. 

VENIRE PERSON: I understand. 

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THE COURT: Thank you. You may be excused. 

MR. JACKS: Your Honor, at this time the 

government moves to excuse Mr. Abelar for cause based upon 

the reason that he has formulated an opinion that would 

affect his deliberations and that he's basically 

formulated the belief that HAMAS is a resistance or 

freedom-fighting group, and in addition also, concerns 

regarding the loss of his job would be other grounds that 

would affect or could affect his ability to serve on the 

jury. 

THE COURT: Mr. Westfall, do you have a position 

about that? 

MR. WESTFALL: Your Honor, as to the challenge 

for cause, Mr. Jacks posed the question to him "Would this 

affect your verdict," and his answer was "I can look at 

the facts. I would look at the facts in the trial." He 

said that a couple of different times which is what is 

required of him. I can see how the opinions that he has 

are not the same opinions that Mr. Jacks would want a 

juror to have. But people he disagrees with, that is not 

a requirement for being struck off the jury. The issue is 

can he set those aside, and he said a couple of times on 

his own volition, I will pay attention to the facts. I 

will pay attention to the facts. This wasn't an issue 

where he was, you know, just made to go along with 

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statements that, yeah, I can apply the burden of proof. 

He actually said I can look at the facts. 

The hardship, your Honor, that's the Court's 

discretion after the Court's investigation of the 

hardship. He seemed kind of equivocal about the hardship. 

THE COURT: Thank you, sir. I am going to take 

the challenge for cause to Mr. Abelar under advisement for 

the time being. 

Ladies and Gentlemen, we're at the noon hour so 

I would like to take our midday recess, but I did want to 

supplement the discussion we had yesterday afternoon about 

the schedule for the remainder of the week. There are a 

number of pending challenges for cause or requests for 

hardship excuses that are pending, and I have not decided 

those, but I think probably some of them will be granted 

at least, and so for the purpose of determining how many 

people we still need to see in order to have a sufficient 

number to wind up with a jury of 12 and six alternates, we 

still have some ways to go. I don't know that I have ever 

covered this with counsel before -- and I don't know that 

you would have any way to know this -- but our jury clerk, 

jury administrator, has an automated telephone system, and 

normally that's the way these jurors or potential jurors 

are communicated with. They are told to call this phone 

number after three o'clock on a given day for 

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instructions. And I think that I will not be able to know 

for sure that we have a sufficient number of people from 

which to strike our lists by three o'clock today. I'm not 

optimistic that we will reach that threshhold by then. So 

I think probably we are going to be in session on Friday, 

and I know that must be a disappointment to all concerned. 

But I think the first time that we will be able to 

communicate with these persons that we have interviewed to 

tell them to come back for a general voir dire session 

will be after three on Thursday. So I wanted to alert 

everyone of that fact in view of our discussion yesterday 

afternoon. We'll be in recess for lunch until one 

o'clock. 

(Recess)

THE COURT: Good afternoon, Mr. Jones. Counsel 

for the parties have some questions that they would like 

to ask you. Mr. Westfall. 

MR. WESTFALL: Thank you, your Honor. 

Mr. Jones, I'm Greg Westfall. I'm one of the 

criminal lawyers on this case. Let me speak with you for 

a few minutes. Do me a favor and raise your voice so I 

can hear you over here. 

VENIRE PERSON: Okay. 

MR. WESTFALL: Thank you so much. This is the 

Holy Land Foundation case, as it has come to be known. 

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United States versus Holy Land Foundation for Relief and 

Development. Have you heard of it? 

VENIRE PERSON: I think I recall. 

MR. WESTFALL: Let me tell you more. It 

involves allegations that the Holy Land Foundation and 

certain men who were associated with the Foundation gave 

material support to HAMAS which is a terrorist 

organization. 

VENIRE PERSON: I recall now. 

MR. WESTFALL: What have you heard about it? 

VENIRE PERSON: Recently, not much. This was, I 

would say, over a year ago. I have been out of the 

country. 

MR. WESTFALL: Right. Anything that you have 

heard give you an opinion one way or the other? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, sir. 

MR. WESTFALL: I know you have been gone for a 

year. Master sargeant? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. WESTFALL: What is your specialty? Do you 

still have the same MSO that you did when you first 

started? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. It fluctuates. 

MR. WESTFALL: What is your specialty? 

VENIRE PERSON: My current is petroleum. 

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MR. WESTFALL: Are you all right talking about 

this? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: What did you do when you were in 

Iraq? 

VENIRE PERSON: My primary mission was 

operations NCOIC for our company operations which pretty 

much consisted of running the support missions and 

overseeing convoy operations. 

MR. WESTFALL: So you were the NCOIC at the 

company level? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: So kind of quasi first sargeant? 

VENIRE PERSON: (Witness nods)

MR. WESTFALL: Did you go actually out and do 

any of the patrolling or any of the action? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. WESTFALL: Please tell us about that. 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, initially our primary 

mission was to supply fuel for base operations and the 

local community. We supplied the water source for that 

area. It escalated from that to where we were tasked to 

run convoy missions to the southern and southeast portion 

of Iraq. 

MR. WESTFALL: Did you have to use interpreters 

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to do what you did -- 

VENIRE PERSON: No, sir. 

MR. WESTFALL: -- to run a supply route. How 

long have you been back, since November? 

VENIRE PERSON: Since November. 

MR. WESTFALL: You say you are still trying to 

readjust? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: Could you please tell us a little 

bit about that? 

VENIRE PERSON: I guess skittish and leery about 

my surroundings. On edge to the extent that I don't 

socialize a lot, with a lot of people. Problem sleeping, 

resting. A little irritability. 

MR. WESTFALL: The supply missions that you did, 

were they both night missions and day missions? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. WESTFALL: Did you encounter any IED's while 

you were doing it? 

VENIRE PERSON: No IED's but did encounter 

hostile fire. 

MR. WESTFALL: This trial you may know from the 

questionnaire -- I don't know if you know or not, but it's 

going to last a long time, like four months, five months. 

It will be four times a week for the entire business day, 

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Monday through Thursday. 

Do you think that right now you are in a good 

position to turn your attention to a four-month long 

trial? 

VENIRE PERSON: I believe so. 

MR. WESTFALL: You believe so? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. WESTFALL: Then -- You said you were trying 

to readjust and feeling skittish. I didn't know if you 

want to dive into this like four months. 

VENIRE PERSON: I don't think there is going to 

be any banging -- 

MR. WESTFALL: If someone startles you in the 

elevator it's generally pretty safe. Did you know any 

Muslims over there? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, I did. 

MR. WESTFALL: Did you get to know any of the 

locals? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, we had a lot of interaction 

with the local populace to where pretty much where we had 

a lot of the supply routes we had across the Shiekh's 

territory. 

MR. WESTFALL: What did you think of them? 

VENIRE PERSON: I was pretty leery. It was hard 

to know who to trust and who not to trust. And after time 

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went on, it seemed like pretty much everybody was under 

the table. It was who had the money, what type of favor 

could be done. So you really couldn't establish a 

hardcore trust. 

MR. WESTFALL: So they have gone to just about a 

black market economy over there? 

VENIRE PERSON: Pretty much. 

MR. WESTFALL: Well, this case involves 

obviously Muslim men who are charged with something that, 

you know, where terrorism is in the title. How do you 

feel about being a juror on a case where you are actually 

trying to decide something the government is alleging and 

it has something to do with terrorism? 

VENIRE PERSON: I don't equivocate every Muslim 

the same. Like I say, there were some good Muslims. 

There were some that I had to rely on as far as the 

information in some of the areas who proved to be pretty 

much trustworthy. I don't form any bias. 

MR. WESTFALL: You have been an NCO a long time. 

Have you been in the army reserve a long time? 

VENIRE PERSON: Seven years. 

MR. WESTFALL: Have you done any of the charity 

work? Sometimes they have charity drives in the army. 

Have you done some of that? United Way or any charity 

work with your church? 

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VENIRE PERSON: Well, the unit prior to -- The 

unit I was currently with in Tyler, Texas, we used to have 

a lot of civil type of affairs. We would participate in 

parades, social events, Boy Scouts, Cub Scouts, things of 

that nature. 

THE COURT: Mr. Westfall, your time has expired. 

MR. JACKS: Good afternoon, Mr. Jones. My name 

is Jim Jacks. I'm an Assistant United States Attorney 

here in Dallas. I'll be part of the prosecuting team 

representing the government during this trial, and I have 

a few questions for you as well. 

I think I speak for everybody in the room when I 

say thank you for your service and what you have done. We 

are all appreciative of people like you and what they have 

done. 

VENIRE PERSON: Thank you, sir. 

MR. JACKS: With regard to your emotional state, 

having come back from a combat area, is it such to a 

degree that you have had counseling or been to the VA or 

had anything like that that you have utilized? 

VENIRE PERSON: I'm currently going to 

counseling, yes, sir. 

MR. JACKS: Is that helpful? 

VENIRE PERSON: Not really. 

MR. JACKS: You may have to just work it out on 

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your own? 

VENIRE PERSON: It takes some time. It was a 

big adjustment to life. 

MR. JACKS: I believe you said you grew up in 

Dallas. You are a native Dallasite? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. JACKS: Where did you go to high school, 

college? 

MR. JACKS: Yes. 

VENIRE PERSON: Lincoln High School. 

MR. JACKS: How about college? Did you attend 

some college? 

VENIRE PERSON: I spent a year and a half at 

North Texas State. 

MR. JACKS: How long have you been with the Post 

Office? 

VENIRE PERSON: A little over twenty years. 

MR. JACKS: Has it always been in the capacity 

as a letter carrier? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. JACKS: I think you put down a city carrier. 

Does that mean you have a route in the city? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. JACKS: How long have you had your current 

route? Obviously just since you came back from overseas 

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did you get the same route back? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. JACKS: How long have you been in the army? 

VENIRE PERSON: Thirty-one years. 

MR. JACKS: So you enlisted in the late 

seventies? 

VENIRE PERSON: March of 1976. 

MR. JACKS: Did you retire from active duty 

after twenty years? 

VENIRE PERSON: After thirty-one. 

MR. JACKS: So you are done. Your obligation is 

complete? 

VENIRE PERSON: I hope so. 

MR. JACKS: Well, thirty-one years is probably 

enough for one person to give. 

You indicated as far as your outside activities 

that you are a member of your men's council at your 

church? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. JACKS: What church would that be? 

VENIRE PERSON: Mount Haven Missionary and 

Baptist Church. 

MR. JACKS: What part of town is that? 

VENIRE PERSON: Garland. 

MR. JACKS: And the men's council, what do they 

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do as far as what service or function do they provide for 

the church? 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, we pretty much coordinate 

a lot of the social events that pretty much surround 

functions for the men's choir. Different activities, 

community services. The list goes on. 

MR. JACKS: Are you a pretty regular attendee at 

the church? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. JACKS: How big is the church? 

VENIRE PERSON: About twenty-two hundred.

MR. JACKS: I see you have spent tours of duty 

in South America. 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. JACKS: What parts of South America were you 

in? 

VENIRE PERSON: Guyana. I can't remember. 

MR. JACKS: That's all right. You have been on 

a jury before? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: Is it just the one that you recall? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: Was that a civil matter about child 

support? 

VENIRE PERSON: Spouses. 

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MR. JACKS: So one spouse was seeking either 

more child support or alimony or something like that from 

the other? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. JACKS: You have a son and a daughter? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. JACKS: Are both of them away from the home? 

Have they grown up and left the home? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. JACKS: Did they live with you or your wife 

last? 

VENIRE PERSON: My wife. Ex-wife. 

MR. JACKS: Your son you said had some contact 

with the local police. Can you tell us briefly what the 

nature of that was? 

VENIRE PERSON: I want to say that it was maybe 

some issues with drug involvement or usage. 

MR. JACKS: Was anybody arrested? 

VENIRE PERSON: I know he was put on probation. 

MR. JACKS: Do you feel like the criminal 

justice system treated him fairly in that situation? 

VENIRE PERSON: As far as I know, yes, sir. 

MR. JACKS: Is there some question in your mind 

maybe about certain aspects of it? 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, there was a situation 

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where he was arrested, and they said that they had him on 

video tape and went through a lot of formalities and spent 

some money and turned out to be that it wasn't him. So 

there was some issues there but --

MR. JACKS: You spent the money for his lawyer 

and that type of thing? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, I assisted. 

MR. JACKS: Mr. Westfall told you the charges in 

this case are providing material support to a terrorist 

organization --

THE COURT: Mr. Jacks, your time has expired. 

MR. JACKS: Thank you, your Honor. 

THE COURT: Mr. Jones, we are in the process of 

talking to the members of the panel from whom the jury 

will be drawn, and I expect that process to continue until 

at least tomorrow. In the meantime, you should not 

discuss this case with anyone or allow anyone to discuss 

it with you, and if there are any media accounts about 

this case on television or in the newspapers or radio you 

should not read or watch or listen to any of those media 

accounts. Thank you, sir. You may be excused. 

THE COURT: Good afternoon, Ms. Overy. Counsel 

for the parties have some questions for you. 

MS. MORENO: Good afternoon. My name is Linda 

Moreno. I'm one of the defense attorneys in this case. I 

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am going to ask you about the questionnaire you filled out 

a few months ago and if you have heard anything about the 

case. This is a case that involves the Holy Land 

Foundation. And it is an American Muslim charity. I'm 

wondering if you heard anything about it in television or 

radio. 

VENIRE PERSON: Just seeing the head lines in 

the paper the past couple of days and immediately turned 

them over because I knew I wasn't supposed to read them. 

MS. MORENO: Before that, have you heard about 

the Foundation in the recent past, not just the recent few 

days? 

VENIRE PERSON: I'm sure I heard about it four 

or five years ago when everything occurred, but life has 

happened since then so, no, I don't really remember too 

much about it. 

MS. MORENO: Let me ask you something from your 

questionnaire. You indicated you have a diabetic 

condition. 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: I need to inquire, forgive me, if 

that is something that might interfere with your jury 

service. 

VENIRE PERSON: Probably not. The only thing, 

as I mentioned, I'm a Type II, and I control it with 

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diabetic medication -- and I'm not insulin dependent -- 

and by eating regularly. So I need something to eat about 

every two hours. I have no idea what sort of breaks are 

included. So I put that down. 

MS. MORENO: I see that you are unemployed at 

the present time. 

VENIRE PERSON: Currently. Well, actually I 

have three jobs, but they are all in process to the full 

time position I was going to be looking for shortly. 

MS. MORENO: Well, tell me about those three 

jobs. 

VENIRE PERSON: The first one is a cashier at an 

Ace Hardware shop in Coppell. I was employed there full 

time until May. I gave them my notice because I was going 

to be looking for full time employment elsewhere. I still 

work Sundays for them to keep my discount. 

Another job that I'm working is a part time for 

a company called Care Now which has a series of primary 

care type outlets throughout the Dallas-Fort Worth area. 

I'm an undercover shopper. They police 

themselves. I do that on my own time, and I get paid when 

I turn in the reviews on ones I'm assigned. I turned in 

three this month, and then occasionally I clean house for 

a neighbor. 

MS. MORENO: This trial may last four months. 

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Would this affect your financial status? 

VENIRE PERSON: Of course. It's going to affect 

anybody's if it lasts four months. Yes, absolutely. 

MS. MORENO: Well, what we need to know is if 

that affect is so severe that it would impact you in a 

very serious financial way. That's why I'm asking you 

that. Because we would like to know that and the Court 

would like to know that in considering whether you should 

or should not serve on this jury. So why don't you tell 

us about that. 

VENIRE PERSON: It will impact me, not 

necessarily in a serious, serious way. My husband is 

employed and has been employed for the last two and a half 

years with the same company. We don't anticipate anything 

happening with that position. So we're financially okay. 

Do you need to make some money? Yes, that's why I was 

going to a position that was going to pay a little more 

than the cashier position I had at this point. How long 

it will be until I find something, I don't know. 

MS. MORENO: Do you have any vacations 

scheduled? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, we took our vacation in June 

right after I gave my notice in anticipation of full time 

employment. 

MS. MORENO: This is a case that involves 

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charges of terrorism. The government alleges in this case 

that the Holy Land Foundation charity sent humanitarian 

aid to the Occupied Territories, the West Bank and Gaza 

and that this humanitarian aid was in the form of food, 

money, books, library books and the rebuilding of homes, 

that kind of aid. The government alleges that aid somehow 

benefited the terrorist organization HAMAS. That's what 

they say. First of all, do you know anything about HAMAS? 

VENIRE PERSON: Not necessarily. I hear the 

word on the news. 

MS. MORENO: Knowing that snippet of 

information, that these are charges that are 

terrorism-related, do you have any opinions about that? 

What do you think about that? 

VENIRE PERSON: I think it would cause any 

thinking person concern in the day and age that we live 

in. Is it going to make me crawl in a hole and die? No. 

MS. MORENO: What I need to know from you is 

whether that would impact you to fairly evaluate the 

evidence in this case. In other words, your mission is to 

be the judge of the facts, the facts presented in this 

room and nowhere else, and knowing this is a case that 

involves charges of terrorism and what you just said, 

those concerns, would that affect your ability to be fair 

and impartial? 

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VENIRE PERSON: I don't see why. 

MS. MORENO: Let's talk about speech. There is 

going to be a lot of speech introduced in this case I 

expect in the form of conversations, transcripts, 

etcetera. What are your thoughts on freedom of speech? 

VENIRE PERSON: It's one of our American rights. 

MS. MORENO: What about speech that is 

provocative and inflammatory? 

VENIRE PERSON: I would have to hear specifics 

before I made a judgment. 

MS. MORENO: What would you want to hear, when 

you say you want to hear specifics? 

VENIRE PERSON: I'm not sure what you are 

talking about, when you are talking about inflammatory. I 

consider some of what they say on television nowadays 

inflammatory. Would I want to listen to it? No. Turn it 

off. That's also an American right, turn the knob. I 

have to know more. I have to know locale, who was talking 

and to what. I would have to know more. 

MS. MORENO: Let's say you heard speech in this 

case that was critical of American foreign policy and 

critical of the Government of Israel. You heard that. 

You saw it in documents, heard it in conversations, read 

it in leaflets. What do you think about that? 

VENIRE PERSON: Generally with the information 

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you just provided, I would say that's probably someone's 

right. 

THE COURT: Ms. Moreno, your time is up. 

MS. MORENO: Thank you. 

THE COURT: Counsel for the government have 

questions for Ms. Overy? 

MR. JONAS: Good afternoon, Ms. Overy. My name 

is Barry Jonas. I'm one of the prosecutors in this case. 

I have just a few questions for you. With regard to your 

employment, you stated that you are preparing for a full 

time job? 

VENIRE PERSON: I was preparing to look for a 

full time job. I had gotten my notice in to my current 

employer Ace, and I think about three days later I 

received the jury summons in the mail which had an 

explanation sheet that said if selected this could last up 

to four months. 

MR. JONAS: Hopefully less? 

VENIRE PERSON: Needless to say some freedom of 

expression language passed in our house.

MR. JONAS: Prior to the notice coming and those 

words coming out of your mouth, what type of job were you 

looking for? 

VENIRE PERSON: I was considering the 

possibility of going back into teaching. I was 

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considering substituting. With the state of our schools 

right now the chances of my working full time in a very 

short period of time were probably good because they need 

people desperately. So I was thinking about substituting 

around in the area where we had moved the last couple of 

years to see if I found a school I liked and go back into 

teaching full time. 

MR. JONAS: When were you a teacher? 

VENIRE PERSON: I was a teacher a couple of 

years ago with the Dallas Independent School District. 

MR. JONAS: Where did you teach? 

VENIRE PERSON: A couple of different places, if 

I can remember their names now. I went through the 

Dallas -- I can't think of the name of it. Where you come 

from a different occupation and you go through their -- 

accredited process, and they put me basically where they 

needed me. I taught at two different schools in DISD that 

year, and life happened and things changed for a while. 

MR. JONAS: I would like to change the subject 

briefly, and I apologize. I know this is somewhat of a 

personal questionnaire. But on your questionnaire you 

indicated that your father had issues with the IRS? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JONAS: And it appears there were 

criminal -- or were they civil? 

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VENIRE PERSON: They were civil I guess. It's 

been a while now, and I don't remember. Did my father 

ever serve jail time? No. 

MR. JONAS: In this case there may be someone 

from the IRS that would testify for the government. 

Besides these feelings that everyone has for the IRS, do 

you have any additional feelings for the IRS that could 

negatively impact your listening to the testimony? 

VENIRE PERSON: Other than the general, everyone 

is -- In fact, they have been running an ad for the last 

two weeks, and I was going to call them because they are 

looking for people to work in the Dallas area. I thought 

that might be interesting. 

MR. JONAS: To work for the IRS? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JONAS: So you don't have negative feelings, 

anymore than any of the rest of us? 

VENIRE PERSON: No.

MR. JONAS: On the questionnaire about the 

testimony of law enforcement officers, you checked, yes, 

that you have difficulty accepting a statement regarding 

giving equal weight to the testimony of a law enforcement 

officer versus non law enforcement. Was that a mistake or 

do you consider police officers to be more credible or 

less credible? 

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VENIRE PERSON: In general more credible. 

MR. JONAS: If the Judge instructs you in this 

case that you should consider that testimony as you would 

any other testimony, would you be able to accept that 

instruction? 

VENIRE PERSON: I believe I would because it 

would be in a different context than just being on the 

street. 

MR. JONAS: Ms. Moreno briefly mentioned the 

allegations in this case. And at the end of the case when 

both sides present their evidence, the Judge is going to 

instruct you, and we expect he's going to tell you that 

the U.S. Government has designated HAMAS to be a terrorist 

organization and that under the law, providing any support 

to HAMAS, money or otherwise, is illegal. Would you be 

able to accept that instruction even if you found the 

items to be what most people would consider charity? 

VENIRE PERSON: If that was the definition 

applied in this case, yes. 

MR. JONAS: Thank you very much. 

THE COURT: Ms. Overy, we are in the process of 

talking to the members of the panel from which this jury 

will be drawn. So until you hear from us further, you 

should not discuss this case with anyone or allow anyone 

to discuss it with you and if there are any media accounts 

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about the case in the newspapers or on television or 

radio, you should not pay any attention to any of those 

media accounts. Thank you. You may be excused. 

THE COURT: Good afternoon, Mr. Proctor. 

Counsel for the parties have some questions they would 

like to ask you. 

MS. MORENO: Good afternoon, Mr. Proctor. My 

name is Linda Moreno. I'm one of the attorneys in this 

case. I am going to ask you some questions about the 

questionnaire you filled out a few weeks ago and if you 

have heard anything about this particular case. 

This is a case that involves an American Muslim 

charity called the Holy Land Foundation. Have you heard 

anything about it in the press? Any media accounts? 

VENIRE PERSON: I remember seeing when they 

raided the offices. I remember the images of bringing 

things out of the office. That's all I remember. 

MS. MORENO: Where do you live? 

VENIRE PERSON: In Dallas.

MS. MORENO: And was that a few years ago you 

remember seeing that? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: Have you seen anything recently? 

VENIRE PERSON: No.

MS. MORENO: Anything about that memory -- This 

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is our opportunity to talk to you and see if you are right 

for this jury. There are no right or wrong answers. 

Doesn't matter what they are. Just looking for your 

honest, heartfelt opinions. 

That said, is there anything you heard then 

about the charity that causes you any concern or raises 

any red flags for you? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MS. MORENO: This case involves an American 

Muslim charity that the government claims through the 

distribution of humanitarian aid supported a terrorist 

organization named HAMAS. Have you ever heard of HAMAS? 

VENIRE PERSON: In the news, yes.

MS. MORENO: Is there anything about what I have 

just told you, the nature of the charges, material support 

of a terrorist organization -- They sound pretty serious, 

right? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: Is there anything about that that 

causes you any concern or brings up any opinions that you 

may have? 

VENIRE PERSON: Not really. 

MS. MORENO: Do you know any Muslims? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MS. MORENO: Have you ever had any dealings, 

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business dealings, personal dealings with persons of 

Arabic descent? 

VENIRE PERSON: I drive a bus in Dallas, and I 

go through an area that has a lot of Muslims probably. 

Near Richland College. 

MS. MORENO: And you can tell they are Muslims 

by what? How they dress? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, mainly by the way they 

dress. 

MS. MORENO: Do you have any opinions about 

that? It's okay to have opinions. 

VENIRE PERSON: I just think it's odd, the way 

the women have to wear things covering their head. 

MS. MORENO: In this case, all of the gentlemen 

charged are Muslim, and they are all of Arabic descent and 

so I would like to know, sir, if there is anything about 

that -- sitting in judgment of persons who are Muslim and 

of Arabic descent -- that you think, you know what, I 

can't be fair. I really can't have an open mind about 

this kind of case. 

VENIRE PERSON: It doesn't really matter to me, 

the religion or where they are from. 

MS. MORENO: Do you know anything about the 

religion? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

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MS. MORENO: As a bus driver, have you received 

any first responder training? Any emergency training? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, not really. 

MS. MORENO: None at all? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MS. MORENO: You are in the union? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: Do you hold a position in the 

union? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MS. MORENO: What's the union? 

VENIRE PERSON: Amalgamated Transit Union. 

MS. MORENO: How long have you been a member? 

VENIRE PERSON: Seven to ten years. 

MS. MORENO: And you don't hold any position in 

the union; is that right? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, I don't. 

MS. MORENO: Is there anything about the length 

of this trial? It's a four-month trial. 

VENIRE PERSON: I would love to miss work, but I 

have plane tickets paid for for Nicaragua in August. 

MS. MORENO: August when? 

VENIRE PERSON: 10th. 

MS. MORENO: When did you get the tickets? 

VENIRE PERSON: About a month or so ago. 

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MS. MORENO: Is that a family excursion? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: With your wife or other members of 

family? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

THE COURT: Counsel for the government have 

questions of Mr. Proctor? 

MR. JONAS: Very briefly, your Honor. 

Good afternoon, Mr. Proctor. My name is Barry 

Jonas. I'm one of the prosecutors in this case. I have a 

couple of questions. You have a seventeen year old 

daughter. Tough age I imagine? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. JONAS: If you were to be chosen for the 

jury, are there any issues of child care? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. JONAS: I notice in the questionnaire you 

filled out you have a degree in construction management? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JONAS: Have you ever worked in construction 

before? 

VENIRE PERSON: Briefly until everything went 

down in the construction industry for a while, and then I 

applied for a DART bus driver. 

MR. JONAS: It's cyclic, good and bad? 

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VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JONAS: I notice you put down you have been 

in Dallas for twenty-five years? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JONAS: Where did you grow up? 

VENIRE PERSON: Louisiana and came to Dallas in 

the seventies. 

MR. JONAS: What brought you to Dallas? 

VENIRE PERSON: My mother moved here, and I kind 

of followed. 

MR. JONAS: Nothing further, your Honor. Thank 

you. 

THE COURT: Mr. Proctor, I would like to ask a 

question about the plans that you have made, these prepaid 

plane tickets for August 10th to August 20th. Is there a 

possibility of changing the date of that trip if you were 

selected to serve on this jury? 

VENIRE PERSON: Not from me. No. 

THE COURT: And if you were selected to serve on 

the jury and had to miss the trip, does that mean you just 

lose the money you have already paid for those tickets? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

THE COURT: You can probably tell we're in the 

process of talking with the members of the panel from 

which the jury will be drawn that will hear this case, and 

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I expect that process will go on through today and into 

tomorrow. Until you hear from us again, you should not 

discuss this case with anyone or allow anyone to discuss 

it with you, and if there are any media accounts about the 

case in the newspaper or on the television or radio, you 

should not read or watch or listen to any of those media 

accounts. Thank you. You may be excused. 

MS. MORENO: Your Honor, I would ask the Court 

to consider Mr. Proctor's vacation and take that under 

advisement in your hardship considerations. 

THE COURT: Yes, ma'am, I will do that. Thank 

you. 

Good afternoon, Ms. Graham. Counsel for the 

parties have some questions they would like to ask you. 

MR. WESTFALL: Ms. Graham, good afternoon. 

VENIRE PERSON: Good afternoon. 

MR. WESTFALL: My name is Greg Westfall. Thank 

you for doing this and coming and waiting. 

VENIRE PERSON: Thank you. 

MR. WESTFALL: I'm one of the defense lawyers on 

the case. I would like to speak with you for a few 

minutes. The case, I'll just let you know, is United 

States versus the Holy Land Foundation, and it involves an 

American Muslim charity. The government alleges that the 

charity and some of the men involved with the charity gave 

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material support to HAMAS which is a terrorist 

organization. After telling you that, do you recognize 

the facts at all from the case in the media? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, sir. 

MR. WESTFALL: Don't know anything about it? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, nothing about the news. 

Anything about the news. 

MR. WESTFALL: You don't watch the news? 

VENIRE PERSON: I look at the History Channel, 

National Geographic. 

MR. WESTFALL: You work at the cafeteria for 

DISD. How long have you been doing that? 

VENIRE PERSON: Two years and before that I 

worked at a family-owned restaurant in Oak Cliff. 

MR. WESTFALL: How do you like the work at the 

cafeteria? 

VENIRE PERSON: It's fine being around the 

children. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you work in the line and give 

the food? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, I do. 

MR. WESTFALL: Are you in an elementary or --

VENIRE PERSON: Elementary. 

MR. WESTFALL: You got the babies. While they 

are still cute? 

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VENIRE PERSON: Right. 

MR. WESTFALL: You used to live in Flint? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: When did you come down here from 

Flint? 

VENIRE PERSON: 1998. 

MR. WESTFALL: Why did you leave Flint? 

VENIRE PERSON: It was a voluntary layoff from 

Citizen's Bank. So I took a voluntary layoff. 

MR. WESTFALL: What brought you down here? 

VENIRE PERSON: I'm from Louisiana. 

MR. WESTFALL: And so you wanted to go back to 

the south where it wasn't cold anymore? 

VENIRE PERSON: I love cold weather. 

MR. WESTFALL: You do? You are in the wrong 

place. This case involves allegations of material support 

of terrorism. So terrorism is in the name of the offense. 

How do you feel about sitting on a jury that could involve 

issues like that? 

VENIRE PERSON: I wouldn't mind it at all. 

MR. WESTFALL: Are you active in your church? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, I'm not. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you do any sort of community 

work? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, I do not. 

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MR. WESTFALL: Have you ever done like voluntary 

work? 

VENIRE PERSON: When I was in Michigan but not 

here. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you know any Muslims? 

VENIRE PERSON: (No response)

MR. WESTFALL: Or people who are Arab? 

VENIRE PERSON: I know friends from Ethiopia and 

Nigeria. 

MR. WESTFALL: And you have good experiences 

with them? 

VENIRE PERSON: Sure do. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you know anybody who's of 

Arabic descent? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, I don't. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you have any dealings with 

people of Arabic descent in your day-to-day activities? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. WESTFALL: Had any good experiences? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. WESTFALL: Bad experiences? 

VENIRE PERSON: I don't know any Arabs. 

MR. WESTFALL: That's the conclusion I was 

arriving at. Thank you so much for speaking to us. 

THE COURT: Counsel for the government have 

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questions for Ms. Graham? 

MR. JACKS: Good afternoon, Ms. Graham? 

VENIRE PERSON: Good afternoon. 

MR. JACKS: My name is Jim Jacks. I'm an 

Assistant United States Attorney here in Dallas, and I 

will be one of the prosecutors representing the government 

during this trial. I just have a few questions if I could 

ask you. 

So you moved to Dallas in the late eighties? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, September 1988. 

MR. JACKS: At that time did you go to work for 

the restaurant you were telling us about? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: What was the name? 

VENIRE PERSON: Michelle Fried Chicken. 

MR. JACKS: Where was it located? 

VENIRE PERSON: On Overton Road. 

MR. JACKS: And you worked there? 

VENIRE PERSON: Until 2005 whether it closed. 

MR. JACKS: Did you work as a waitress or some 

other capacity? 

VENIRE PERSON: Waitress and cook. 

MR. JACKS: Are you off for the summer? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, I am. 

MR. JACKS: And are you doing anything else at 

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this time? 

VENIRE PERSON: I'm taking care of my sister. 

She's handicapped and bedridden. 

MR. JACKS: Does she live with you in your home? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: Who else lives with you? 

VENIRE PERSON: My twin sister and my niece. 

MR. JACKS: Is your twin sister the one who's 

handicapped? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. JACKS: You have another sister? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: Does your sister that requires 

care -- does she require care around the clock? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, she does. 

MR. JACKS: And your other family --

VENIRE PERSON: My twin sister takes care of her 

but when she gets a little tired, I step in. 

MR. JACKS: Do you have any children of your 

own? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, I don't. 

MR. JACKS: And I take it from your 

questionnaire that you have not served on a trial jury 

before. 

VENIRE PERSON: No, sir. 

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MR. JACKS: Have you ever received a jury 

summons? 

VENIRE PERSON: Only from the City of Dallas. 

MR. JACKS: Was that for like municipal court? 

VENIRE PERSON: George Allen. 

MR. JACKS: I believe you said your brother 

worked for the Dallas Morning News. 

VENIRE PERSON: He used to. 

MR. JACKS: Is he retired? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, he is. 

MR. JACKS: And what did he do when he work for 

them? 

VENIRE PERSON: Worked on computers. 

MR. JACKS: What does he do now? 

VENIRE PERSON: Nothing. 

MR. JACKS: Is he still here in the Dallas area? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. JACKS: When did your brother come to Texas? 

VENIRE PERSON: 1976. 

MR. JACKS: Before you came? 

VENIRE PERSON: Oh, no, I came in 1972 and moved 

to Flint. 

MR. JACKS: To talk to you a little bit about 

the charges in this case, have you heard of the terrorist 

group HAMAS? 

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VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. JACKS: The principal charge is essentially 

that the Holy Land Foundation and certain men working for 

it provided material support to this terrorist 

organization, HAMAS. And at the end of the trial when 

both sides have finished presenting their evidence, the 

Judge will tell both sides what the law is and what the 

government must prove to prove its case and definitions of 

words that you might need to know so that you can do your 

job. And I expect in those instructions he would tell 

you, the jury, this group HAMAS has been designated by the 

United States Government as a terrorist organization. I 

also expect that he would include in his instructions a 

statement telling the jurors that it is against the United 

States law to give anything to or for the benefit of a 

terrorist organization. That means even things considered 

charitable items like food, clothing, medical supplies, 

books, that type of thing, even that type of stuff. It 

would be against the law to provide that type of material 

to a terrorist organization. Do you understand that 

aspect of the law and could you follow that aspect of the 

law if the Judge told you that was the law? 

VENIRE PERSON: I sure could. 

MR. JACKS: Okay. Thank you. 

VENIRE PERSON: Thank you. 

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THE COURT: Ms. Graham, we are in the process of 

talking with the members of the panel from which the jury 

will be selected that would hear this case. I expect that 

process will continue until at least late tomorrow. So 

until you hear from us again, you should not discuss this 

case with anyone or allow anyone to discuss it with you, 

and if there are any media accounts about the case on the 

television or in the newspapers or on the radio, you 

should not pay any attention to those accounts. 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

THE COURT: Thank you. 

Good afternoon, sir, is your name pronounced 

Morones? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

THE COURT: Counsel for the parties have some 

questions they would like to ask you. 

MR. WESTFALL: Mr. Morones, I'm Greg Westfall. 

I'm one of the defense counsel in this case. I would like 

to speak to you for a few minutes. This case is the 

United States versus Holy Land Foundation for Relief and 

Development, and it involves allegations that the Holy 

Land Foundation and some of the men who were involved in 

the Holy Land Foundation gave material support to HAMAS 

which is a terrorist organization. It's a Muslim charity 

originally in Richardson, Texas. Having heard that, does 

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that ring any bell? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, I have heard of it. 

MR. WESTFALL: What have you heard? 

VENIRE PERSON: Just what you told me. 

MR. WESTFALL: Based on what you have heard, 

have you formed any opinions about whether anyone is 

guilty? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, sir. 

MR. WESTFALL: On your questionnaire you 

answered Number 3 yes, which is do you have a problem with 

hearing or vision? 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, I have to wear these 

glasses to see you and other glasses to read. 

MR. WESTFALL: So you don't have any problems 

that aren't correctable with glasses? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. WESTFALL: Tell me. You work full time for 

the night crew. What do you do? 

VENIRE PERSON: I work a night crew at Sam's on 

Park Lane. 

MR. WESTFALL: How often do you have to do the 

night crew? 

VENIRE PERSON: Five days a week. 

MR. WESTFALL: Monday through Friday? 

VENIRE PERSON: Tuesday through Saturday. 

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MR. WESTFALL: Did you do the night crew last 

night? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, I had to take off the night 

before, I couldn't be here this morning. 

MR. WESTFALL: You look amazingly spry I was 

going to say. This trial is likely to go four months. Is 

your job in jeopardy if that happens or are you going to 

have to be working all night and coming in here? 

VENIRE PERSON: I run a three-man crew 

sometimes, and when I'm out, there is only two men to pick 

up for me, and I have to talk to them to find out if they 

can replace me for that amount of time. 

MR. WESTFALL: Would you please look into that 

and let the jury clerk know as quickly as you can? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: You know this case has something 

to do with terrorism. Terrorism is in the name of the 

offense. How do you feel about the possibility of being a 

juror on this case? 

VENIRE PERSON: I have mixed feelings about 

that. My niece was in New York City at the time of 9-11, 

and she saw a lot of it, and a year later she killed 

herself. Nobody knew why because she was getting ready to 

get married. We figured it was because of that. She saw 

a lot. 

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MR. WESTFALL: I'm sorry. Were you pretty close 

to your niece? 

VENIRE PERSON: I was one of the favorite 

uncles. I was the youngest of three uncles, and we were 

more close to the young kids. So I was real close to her, 

yes. Her name was Octavia Padilla. 

MR. WESTFALL: Well, let me just say this about 

a trial. Have you been on a jury before? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, I never have. 

MR. WESTFALL: Every trial is different. The 

requirements and the appropriate things to think about to 

be a juror on any type of trial kind of goes along with 

the type of trial. This trial certainly involves material 

support of terrorism. And in order to be an effective 

juror, you would have to be able to make a consideration 

of the guilt or innocence of the people based upon only 

the evidence here in trial. 

Your niece, only you can say. Is that the kind 

of thing that would be on your mind? Would your niece be 

on your mind when you're in here during this trial? 

VENIRE PERSON: She has been on my mind since 

she did it. I believe it had a lot to do with her doing 

it to herself. She was a curator for a museum in New 

York. Like I said, she was about to get married, and 

there was no reason for her to do that. 

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MR. WESTFALL: I am very, very sorry. Do you 

think this might not be the best trial for you to sit on 

the jury? 

VENIRE PERSON: I wouldn't think so. To be 

honest with you, it would be hard for me to do that. 

MR. WESTFALL: Sir, thank you so much and I'm 

sorry for your loss. 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

THE COURT: Counsel for the government have 

questions for Mr. Morones? 

MR. JACKS: Yes, sir. My name is Jim Jacks. 

I'm an Assistant United States Attorney for the United 

States Attorney's Office, and I'll be representing the 

government during this trial. I too extend my sympathy 

for the loss of your niece. How long had she been in New 

York? 

VENIRE PERSON: About two years. 

MR. JACKS: Was she from this area? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, she had graduated from SMU. 

She had gone to North Carolina first to her sister's house 

and then to New York City. 

MR. JACKS: And what museum she was working at? 

VENIRE PERSON: Fine Arts Museum. I don't know. 

MR. JACKS: And it's my understanding that you 

and your family don't know why, but you surmise it might 

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have been partly because of the incident on 9-11? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: Where was she when that happened? 

VENIRE PERSON: I don't know. She said she saw 

part of it when she came down to talk to us, but she 

wouldn't talk that much about it. So I don't know how 

close she was to it. 

MR. JACKS: Your job responsibilities, what are 

your hours where you work? 

VENIRE PERSON: I work from nine o'clock to five 

or 5:30. 

MR. JACKS: Is that something you choose to do 

or is that the only hours that work can be done? 

VENIRE PERSON: That's the only hours that work 

can be done. 

MR. JACKS: When you are not going to respond to 

a jury summons during the day, is that when you sleep and 

get your rest? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. I sleep from nine o'clock 

to two or three o'clock in the afternoon. Get up for an 

hour, eat lunch and lay back down and get back up at 6:30 

or 7:00. 

MR. JACKS: Is it your opinion if you were to 

end up on this jury, having gone through what you have 

gone through that you will not be able to be a fair and 

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impartial juror for these gentlemen? 

VENIRE PERSON: It would be hard for me to say. 

I would like to be, but I don't know if I could. 

MR. JACKS: Well, is there a chance that you 

would hold them responsible for what happened on 9-11? 

VENIRE PERSON: Not directly, no. 

MR. JACKS: Indirectly? 

VENIRE PERSON: Depending on if it comes out the 

money is going to terrorists, your Honor. 

MR. JACKS: Well, but if the money is going to 

terrorists and you believe that beyond a reasonable doubt, 

then that would make them guilty, and if you believe they 

are guilty, that doesn't necessarily make you an unfair 

juror, does it? 

VENIRE PERSON: My opinion? 

MR. JACKS: Yes. 

VENIRE PERSON: Yeah. I don't think it would. 

MR. JACKS: Well, as Mr. Westfall said, only you 

know. If you should end up on this jury -- and that's 

something yet to be decided -- could you be a person that 

would listen to the evidence, listen to the Judge's 

instructions and follow the law, give these gentlemen the 

presumption of innocence that the Constitution says they 

are entitled to, require the government to prove its case 

beyond a reasonable doubt? You are the only one that can 

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tell us that, and I guess the ultimate $64,000 question is 

can you do that? 

VENIRE PERSON: I think I possibly could. 

MR. JACKS: Do you feel like this would not be 

the jury that you should be on? 

VENIRE PERSON: In my heart I don't think so. 

MR. JACKS: Does that mean, no, I don't think I 

should be on this jury? 

VENIRE PERSON: I don't think I should be on 

this jury. 

MR. JACKS: Thank you. 

THE COURT: Thank you, Mr. Morones. We're in 

the process of talking with the members of the panel from 

whom this jury will be drawn, and that process will 

probably go on for the rest of today and into tomorrow. 

Until you hear from us, you should not discuss this case 

with anyone or allow anyone to discuss it with you, and if 

there are any media accounts on the television or in the 

newspapers or on the radio, you should not pay any 

attention to those accounts. Thank you, sir. You may be 

excused. 

MR. WESTFALL: Your Honor, we'll submit Mr. 

Morones for inability to be fair and impartial. 

THE COURT: Any objection to that, Mr. Jacks? 

MR. JACKS: No, sir. 

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THE COURT: I will excuse Mr. Morones for cause. 

Good afternoon, Ms. Munoz, counsel for the parties have 

some questions they would like to ask you.

MS. MORENO: Hello, Ms. Munoz. I'm one of the 

defense attorneys in this case, and I am going to ask you 

some questions about the questionnaire you filled out.

VENIRE PERSON: Okay. 

MS. MORENO: Remember doing that a couple of 

weeks ago? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: First of all, this is a case that 

involves the Holy Land Foundation which is an American 

Muslim charity in Dallas, and I'm wondering if you heard 

anything about the Holy Land Foundation in the press 

recently. 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MS. MORENO: Do you recall hearing anything 

about it some years ago? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MS. MORENO: Have you been in Dallas your whole 

life? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: I see that you are unemployed. 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: Are you looking for work? 

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VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: I ask you that not to pry, but this 

case is going to take about four months. 

VENIRE PERSON: Okay. 

MS. MORENO: And I'm wondering what kind of an 

effect is that going to have on your life and your home? 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, I just recently started 

looking for a job, so. It's not really going to effect 

anything. I still live with my parents. 

MS. MORENO: They are helping you? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: Where did you go to school? 

VENIRE PERSON: High school? 

MS. MORENO: Yes. 

VENIRE PERSON: Riley Christian Academy.

MS. MORENO: Where is that? 

VENIRE PERSON: In Dallas.

MS. MORENO: Did you go to college at all? 

VENIRE PERSON: I went to Cedar Valley and 

Trinity Valley. 

MS. MORENO: What did you study? 

VENIRE PERSON: Just my basics. 

MS. MORENO: Did you get a degree from there? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MS. MORENO: This is a case that involves 

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allegations of terrorism. The government claims that this 

organization, Holy Land Foundation, sent aid to a 

terrorist organization. Books, clothes, medicine, things 

you would think of as charity. But the government says 

these items somehow benefited a terrorist organization 

named HAMAS. That's what they say. Have you ever heard 

of HAMAS? 

VENIRE PERSON: Just on television but I didn't 

pay any attention. 

MS. MORENO: If you were picked as a juror on 

this case, you would have to pay a lot of attention to 

things like that, HAMAS and terrorism. What are your 

thoughts about that? 

VENIRE PERSON: About terrorism? 

MS. MORENO: About sitting on a case with 

charges of terrorism. 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, I believe that it's not 

right, but I don't really have thoughts. 

MS. MORENO: In a criminal trial, anyone who's 

accused of a crime has the presumption of innocence. Have 

you heard of that before? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MS. MORENO: What it means is under the 

Constitution anybody accused of a crime is presumed 

innocent. They start way up here; they are presumed 

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innocent. And that presumption of innocence goes away 

after the government proves its case beyond a reasonable 

doubt. Have you heard of that term beyond every 

reasonable doubt? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: And what I'm asking you is in a 

case that involves charges of terrorism which are pretty 

serious charges, do you have any concerns about that or 

problems with the presumption of innocence? What do you 

think about that? 

VENIRE PERSON: I don't know. Everybody --

MS. MORENO: Let me tell you there aren't any 

wrong answers. We're just looking for your opinions and 

how you feel inside? 

VENIRE PERSON: Okay. 

MS. MORENO: No one is judging here but we need 

to know, and only you can tell us if you have some 

opinions that would make it difficult for you to sit on a 

case like this. 

VENIRE PERSON: No. I mean due to the fact that 

I don't know that much about it I can't have a negative or 

positive thought to it. So. 

MS. MORENO: Do you know any Muslims? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MS. MORENO: Have you ever dealt with any people 

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of Arabic descent? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: Tell us about that? 

VENIRE PERSON: Cosmetology school, a lot of 

them came in, and we talked to them. 

MS. MORENO: Were they Muslim women? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: How did you know they were Muslim? 

VENIRE PERSON: We had to go to a certain room 

and cover everything up, and no one could see us work on 

their hair, only us, and then cut their hair. 

MS. MORENO: What did you think of that? 

VENIRE PERSON: We got used to it. Every week 

you had your clients, and you got used to it. 

MS. MORENO: Did you ever ask them why they 

cover? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, but after you hear 

everybody's story, you forget it. They said in their 

custom, it's not allowed for anybody to see their hair. 

MS. MORENO: What did you think about that? 

Here were these ladies who covered their hair, covered 

their heads. What were your thoughts about that, you as a 

young lady? 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, everybody has their own 

beliefs. So it's not like I went into detail, you know, 

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why do you do it. Don't you ever want a change? That's 

them. That's who they are. That's what I thought about 

that. 

MS. MORENO: Did you ever ask them if they 

wanted to change? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MS. MORENO: And so you would go into a room and 

cover the room and then you could wash their hair and cut 

their hair? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, it could only be you. 

Nobody else watching or anything like that. If you need 

an instructor or something like that, you had to ask them 

first if the instructor could come in, but other than that 

it was just you and them. 

MS. MORENO: Did you ever talk about that 

experience with your friends who didn't cover? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MS. MORENO: So in sum, what did you think of 

that? Do you still have Muslim clients? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, not no more. It was just in 

cosmetology school. 

MS. MORENO: Just in school? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes.

MS. MORENO: Was that a good or bad experience? 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, I thought it was good. 

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It's not like you are going up to someone and say why do 

you cover yourself up, but they opened up and said, oh, 

this why. I didn't really ever question it really. 

MS. MORENO: So now when you see women who 

cover, what do you think about that? 

VENIRE PERSON: They have their own beliefs. 

You do what you got to do. Nobody should really question 

you why or anything like that. 

THE COURT: Ms. Moreno, your time has expired. 

MS. MORENO: Thank you, your Honor. Thank you 

so much. 

THE COURT: Counsel for the government have 

questions for Ms. Munoz?

MR. JONAS: Yes, your Honor. Good afternoon. 

My name is Barry Jonas. I'm one of the prosecutors in 

this case. You said you live with your parents. Do both 

of them work? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, my mom works in a factory, 

and my dad is a truck driver. 

MR. JONAS: Who does your dad work for? 

VENIRE PERSON: He has his own business. 

MR. JONAS: Drives an eighteen-wheeler? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JONAS: Long distance? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, he's local. 

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MR. JONAS: And your mom works for --

VENIRE PERSON: A company. It's a factory. 

MR. JONAS: What do they make? 

VENIRE PERSON: Things for your shower. 

MR. JONAS: And you said you were going to start 

looking for a job. What type of job? 

VENIRE PERSON: Cosmetology. 

MR. JONAS: Did you graduate? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JONAS: When was that? 

VENIRE PERSON: Last year. 

MR. JONAS: And since you have been graduated, 

what have you been doing? 

VENIRE PERSON: Just basically babysitting. 

MR. JONAS: Any brothers or sisters? 

VENIRE PERSON: Stepbrothers and sisters. 

MR. JONAS: Do they live at home with you? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. JONAS: You put down on your questionnaire 

that you filled out that you speak Spanish. 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JONAS: Fluent? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JONAS: What is spoken at home? 

VENIRE PERSON: Both. 

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MR. JONAS: Very briefly, this is case is about 

an organization called the Holy Land Foundation that Ms. 

Moreno told you about that is accused of providing money 

or support to a terrorist organization known as HAMAS. I 

think she asked you if you have heard of HAMAS. 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. JONAS: After you hear the evidence, the 

Court will instruct the jury as to the law. We expect he 

would say that HAMAS is an organization designated by the 

United States Government as a terrorist organization and 

any support to HAMAS, money or otherwise, is illegal, even 

if that money is used for what most people consider to be 

charitable stuff. Would you be able to accept that 

charge? 

VENIRE PERSON: Well -- 

MR. JONAS: Would you be able to listen to the 

Judge and accept his instructions to you that if you found 

the defendant gave money to HAMAS, even though it was used 

for what you normally think of as good things, you could 

still find them guilty? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. JONAS: You cannot find them guilty for 

giving good things to a terrorist organization? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, I could. 

MR. JONAS: Thank you. 

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THE COURT: Ms. Munoz, we're in the process of 

talking to the members of the panel from whom the jury 

that would hear this case will be drawn. Until you hear 

from us you should not discuss the case with anyone or 

allow anyone to discuss it with you, and if there are 

media accounts on the television, in the newspapers or on 

the radio, you should not listen to any such accounts. 

Thank you, you may be excused. 

Good afternoon, Mr. Taylor. Counsel for the 

parties have some questions they would like to ask you. 

Mr. Westfall. 

MR. WESTFALL: Thank you, your Honor. Mr. 

Taylor, I'm Greg Westfall. I'm one of the defense lawyers 

in this case. I want to talk to you for a few minutes. 

This case is United States Government versus the Holy Land 

Foundation. It involves a Muslim charity, an American 

Muslim charity who the United States Government is 

alleging gave material support to HAMAS which is a 

terrorist organization. What do you think? 

VENIRE PERSON: That's tough there. 

MR. WESTFALL: What's tough about it? 

VENIRE PERSON: Finding that they got something 

like that that's going on around here. I don't hear too 

much about it, but the limited I do hear, I know it's 

pretty serious. 

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MR. WESTFALL: This came out of Richardson. So 

it's kind of in the area. But you had this look of 

surprise on your face. Is that the first time you have 

heard of it or first recognition? 

VENIRE PERSON: First time I have been in 

something like this. This is the first time I have been 

selected. So it's all a surprise to me. 

MR. WESTFALL: That's all I want to talk to you 

about is your experiences. It's part of the process of 

putting the jury together. Have you heard of the case? 

Have you heard of the situation at all through the 

newspapers or any media or talking or anything? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, I haven't heard anything 

about it. 

MR. WESTFALL: We're talking about Muslim men 

that are on trial for an offense that has in the name of 

that offense terrorism, the material support of terrorism. 

How do you feel about that? The possibility of being a 

juror on something like that. What do you think? 

VENIRE PERSON: Really, I don't have a whole lot 

to say about it, but like I say, I'm new to this. I 

haven't sit and listened to what's going on and how 

different things occurred. So I really don't have a whole 

lot of experience about how things are going on. 

MR. WESTFALL: Have you ever heard of HAMAS? 

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VENIRE PERSON: I have heard it. 

MR. WESTFALL: Tell me what you have heard. 

VENIRE PERSON: Really nothing at all. I just 

heard of it. 

MR. WESTFALL: Have you followed the 

Palestinians-Israeli conflict at all? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, whatever it is, I hope it's 

all right and everybody get together and talk and hope 

everybody get to what you might want to call it an 

agreement on something. Somebody here fighting on this 

side and somebody disagreeing on the other side and maybe 

everybody can get together and agree on the same thing. 

MR. WESTFALL: You work with the independent 

school district. How long have you worked them? 

VENIRE PERSON: I have been there seven years. 

MR. WESTFALL: What do you do in your off time? 

VENIRE PERSON: Really relax. What we do is we 

strip floors and furniture and stuff like that and my 

working at a school that has three floors, we have a whole 

lot to do. 

MR. WESTFALL: You work at a high school? 

VENIRE PERSON: E.P. Comstock on Jim Miller, and 

it's a middle school. 

MR. WESTFALL: You do that work mainly at night? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, I work at night from 2:30 

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to 11:00. But now when the kids are out of school we work 

through the summertime 7:30 to 4:30 or we may have 

overtime where we work from six until we fall out. 

MR. WESTFALL: Are you involved in the community 

or in church? 

VENIRE PERSON: (Shakes head)

MR. WESTFALL: So you kind of work and go home? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, I go to work and go back to 

the house. 

MR. WESTFALL: You watch TV? 

VENIRE PERSON: Every once in a while because 

when I come in at night the TV is watching me. 

MR. WESTFALL: You got those big brother TV's. 

Sports? 

VENIRE PERSON: Only sports is drag racing. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you go? 

VENIRE PERSON: Sometimes but the time I have, I 

try to sit around the house and enjoy my family. I'm an 

only child, and I try to spend a lot of time with my 

mother. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you think you could be fair in 

a criminal case where people are accused of supporting a 

terrorist organization? 

VENIRE PERSON: Sure. But I would like to know 

more what's going on behind the scenes. 

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MR. WESTFALL: And in four months I bet you can 

learn a lot about what's going on behind the scenes. 

Your job going to be okay? 

VENIRE PERSON: I don't know. I have to talk to 

them about it. School is out, and we're getting ready to 

start cleaning our building. We haven't started because 

they are remodeling and putting sprinklers in and doing 

the roof and stuff like that so most of my time won't be 

there. 

MR. WESTFALL: Well, if you are in a position 

where you are going to lose your job and it's to the 

extent that you can't pay attention in here, that's 

something the Court needs to know about pretty quickly. 

Okay? 

VENIRE PERSON: Okay. 

MR. WESTFALL: This trial can go four months, 

possibly shorter, possibly longer. But Monday through 

Thursday business hours. So we'll be knocking off about 

five, about quitting time, and if that gets in the way of 

your job where you are going to lose your job or affect 

you financially, please let the jury clerk know. 

VENIRE PERSON: Believe me, I will. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you have any other issues I 

haven't asked you about? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. Just want to get interested 

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and find out what's going on and how things go. 

MR. WESTFALL: Thank you for your patience. I 

know you have been waiting around all day. 

VENIRE PERSON: I have been here since eight 

this morning. 

THE COURT: Counsel for the government have 

questions of Mr. Taylor? 

MR. JACKS: Yes, sir. 

Mr. Taylor, my name is Jim Jacks. I'm an 

Assistant United States Attorney here in Dallas. I'm one 

of the prosecutors on this case. I'll be representing the 

government during this trial, and I just have a few 

follow-up questions for you, if you don't mind. How long 

have you worked for DISD? 

VENIRE PERSON: Seven years. 

MR. JACKS: What kind of work did you do before 

that? 

VENIRE PERSON: I was a truck driver before I 

went to DISD. 

MR. JACKS: Who did you work for? 

VENIRE PERSON: Premium Laundry. 

MR. JACKS: Was that locally here in the Dallas 

area that you drove? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. I was here and driving from 

Sherman to Durant, Oklahoma. 

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MR. JACKS: And what would you be hauling? 

VENIRE PERSON: Linen. 

MR. JACKS: How long did you work at that job? 

VENIRE PERSON: Eight years. 

MR. JACKS: What led you to change from being a 

truck driver to going to the school? 

VENIRE PERSON: I was there eight years, and I 

didn't get a vacation, and I kept going, and then I had an 

accident, and I told them I was through. 

MR. JACKS: Was there a time-off period or did 

you pretty quickly get a job with the school district? 

VENIRE PERSON: I was off maybe a month, maybe 

two. 

MR. JACKS: Were there any legal proceedings 

that resulted from that accident? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, I haven't heard anything 

else about it. 

MR. JACKS: All right. Have you always worked 

as a custodian for the Dallas Independent School District? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: You have two children. Daughter and 

a son? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: Do they live with you or with your 

ex-wife? 

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VENIRE PERSON: They stay with their mother. I 

have never been married. 

MR. JACKS: Are they still in that home with her 

or moved out of the house? 

VENIRE PERSON: From what I know, they are still 

at home with her. They stay in Texas City. 

MR. JACKS: Okay. Is Dallas your home? Is that 

where you were born and raised? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: I've got the questionnaire that you 

filled out two or three weeks ago. I just want to ask you 

a couple of follow-up questions. One of the questions 

was -- says some of the defendants are citizens of the 

United States and some are not. The question was would 

you afford each of the defendants the same consideration 

in evaluating the evidence, and you answered no. Can you 

explain your concern about that? 

VENIRE PERSON: I don't know because I probably 

just really didn't understand it fully. 

MR. JACKS: So what is your opinion about 

affording the same rights for citizens and noncitizens? 

Should that be the case or different for noncitizens? 

VENIRE PERSON: Probably should be different. 

MR. JACKS: In what way? 

VENIRE PERSON: I really couldn't say. 

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MR. JACKS: There was another question I wanted 

to ask you about. It says the Court will instruct you 

that the testimony of a law enforcement officer is 

entitled to no greater weight or lesser weight than that 

of any other witness, and the question was do you have any 

difficulty accepting that statement, and your answer was 

no. So you believe that a law enforcement officer's 

testimony is entitled to the same weight as any other 

person? 

VENIRE PERSON: They should if he's involved. 

MR. JACKS: And have you had any family member 

or close personal friend or yourself had any contact with 

law enforcement? 

VENIRE PERSON: I have two cousins behind bars. 

MR. JACKS: What are they in jail for? 

VENIRE PERSON: Both of them for murder, I 

think. 

MR. JACKS: And are they in prison right now? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: When were they sent to prison? 

VENIRE PERSON: That's a good question. I don't 

remember that one. It's been a while. I would say 

probably back in the nineties. Late nineties. 

MR. JACKS: Were you friends with them? 

VENIRE PERSON: They were my cousins. 

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MR. JACKS: Yes, were you friends with them 

during the time before they went to prison? 

VENIRE PERSON: I wouldn't say we were close, 

but we communicated. 

MR. JACKS: Did they have a trial before they 

were convicted? 

VENIRE PERSON: I think they did, but I didn't 

attend. 

MR. JACKS: From what you have heard and the 

information you have received about it, do you believe 

they were treated fairly by the criminal justice system? 

VENIRE PERSON: I put it like this. If you do 

wrong, you suffer the consequences. 

MR. JACKS: Just to talk to you about the 

charges in this case, the charges have been basically 

summarized as this Holy Land Foundation and the men 

working for it supplied material support, which can be a 

lot of things, but the indictment in this case says they 

supplied money to this terrorist organization HAMAS. At 

the end of the case, the Judge will tell the jury what law 

should be applied, and I expect he would tell the jury 

that HAMAS has been designated as a terrorist organization 

by the U.S. Government. I also expect that he would tell 

the jury that it's illegal to give anything to HAMAS, even 

if it's in the nature of charitable items like food and 

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clothing and medical supplies. Could you follow that law 

or could you accept that instruction and that law and 

return a verdict of guilty even if you believe that what 

they sent or purchased with that money was humanitarian or 

charitable items? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, I can do that. 

MR. JACKS: So even the fact that whatever that 

money was used for may have been for something that would 

otherwise be good, if the judge told you that would still 

be against the law, you could return a verdict of guilty 

if that was what the evidence showed had been done? 

VENIRE PERSON: If that's what the evidence 

show, yes. 

MR. JACKS: Thank you. 

THE COURT: Mr. Taylor, we are in the process of 

talking with the members of the panel from which the jury 

will be drawn that would hear this case. I expect that 

process will go on through today and into tomorrow. Until 

you hear from us further, you should not discuss this case 

with anyone or allow anyone to discuss it with you. And 

if there are any media accounts about the case in the 

newspapers or on television or the radio, you should not 

read or watch or listen to any such media accounts. 

VENIRE PERSON: Okay. I don't watch much news 

any way, but the little bitty I do watch. 

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THE COURT: Thank you, sir. You may be excused. 

Good afternoon, Ms. Fletcher. Counsel for the 

parties have some questions they would like to ask you. 

MS. MORENO: Thank you, your Honor. I see from 

your questionnaire you are an attorney. 

VENIRE PERSON: I went to law school. 

MS. MORENO: Did you take the bar after that? 

VENIRE PERSON: I have taken it once, and I 

passed. 

MS. MORENO: And you have an MBA? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: And what do you do now? 

VENIRE PERSON: I work for Fannie Mae, mortgage 

banker. 

MS. MORENO: Do you have any intentions of 

taking the bar again? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: Want to practice law? 

VENIRE PERSON: Eventually. 

MS. MORENO: I would like to ask you some 

questions about your answers to the questionnaire. One of 

the questions in the questionnaire was the right to 

silence, and that is if someone did not take the stand to 

testify would you hold it against them, and I think you 

said did you not know. What did you mean by that? 

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VENIRE PERSON: I meant that I know it's not the 

right thing to do, but depending on what's going on, I 

wouldn't necessarily not do that.

MS. MORENO: I'm not clear. What do you mean? 

VENIRE PERSON: I understand the person has the 

right not to take the stand but being human --

MS. MORENO: Would you hold it against them? 

VENIRE PERSON: I don't know if I would. 

MS. MORENO: Why is that? 

VENIRE PERSON: I think the human element. 

Depending on what's going on. You get emotionally 

involved in things, and sometimes you might do that. I 

can't say I definitely would not. 

MS. MORENO: Is that because you might want to 

hear their side of the story? 

VENIRE PERSON: Possibly. 

MS. MORENO: This is a case involving the Holy 

Land charity. Have you heard about this case in the news 

recently? 

VENIRE PERSON: Not very much, no. I haven't 

time to watch the news much lately. 

MS. MORENO: Have you been busy? 

VENIRE PERSON: Very. 

MS. MORENO: Doing what? 

VENIRE PERSON: Family, work, church. 

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MS. MORENO: Anything you heard about the Holy 

Land Foundation? Do you remember any of the details? 

VENIRE PERSON: Not really. 

MS. MORENO: Are you aware this is a case that 

involves charges of terrorism? 

VENIRE PERSON: That's what I do know. 

MS. MORENO: And how do you know that? 

VENIRE PERSON: From what I have heard. 

MS. MORENO: And what is that? 

VENIRE PERSON: People talking to me.

MS. MORENO: So you have heard a little bit 

about the case? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: From family members or friends? 

VENIRE PERSON: Both. 

MS. MORENO: What have you heard in those 

conversations? 

VENIRE PERSON: Just allegations of terrorist 

activities. I don't know any details as far as names or 

anything like that. I haven't been involved in very 

detailed conversations other than hearsay, tidbits. 

MS. MORENO: What do you think about those kinds 

of charges? 

VENIRE PERSON: They are very serious. 

MS. MORENO: And how do you feel about being 

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perhaps selected as a juror in a case like this? 

VENIRE PERSON: It's a very important trial, and 

I would take that very seriously. 

MS. MORENO: Do you have any concerns or 

apprehensions about serving as a juror in a case like 

this? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: That's what we're here to find out 

from everyone that we're talking to today. So there is no 

right or wrong answers. We want your honest heartfelt 

opinions because these gentlemen deserve a fair trial by a 

jury that can fairly judge the evidence. So why don't you 

tell me about those concerns. 

VENIRE PERSON: I think part of it is just given 

everything that has occurred since 9-11. I have my own 

personal opinions about this country, where you live. So 

I take it seriously when there are allegations such as 

terrorism, and I think you feel -- I think it goes back to 

the original question you asked me, you know, somebody not 

wanting to take the stand. I think in this type of 

situation, you want to hear all the facts. I would want 

to hear all the facts and know what's going on, and given 

the seriousness of the charges, I just think personally it 

would possibly bother me if that were to happen. But I 

think it's really the emotional casualties of the country 

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in which you live. You get involved. 

MS. MORENO: In a case like this with these 

kinds of charges, it would be very important to have 

jurors who were not affected, were not affected by 

personal concerns or apprehensions about looking at a case 

that had charges of terrorism. My question to you is -- 

Let's go back to the right to silence issue. If these 

gentlemen did not take the stand, would you hold that 

against them? 

VENIRE PERSON: Probably. 

MS. MORENO: I really thank you for your candor 

because it's so important here. And if they did not take 

the stand, you would probably sit there and think what? 

What would you wonder? 

VENIRE PERSON: Are they guilty? 

MS. MORENO: And if they didn't take the stand, 

would you think to yourself that they are probably more 

guilty than not because they are not talking? 

VENIRE PERSON: Probably. 

MS. MORENO: And so you could not honestly 

afford these gentlemen that Constitutional protection 

under the Fifth Amendment; is that correct? 

VENIRE PERSON: I don't think I could. 

MS. MORENO: And nobody is really going to 

change your mind about that. Isn't that right? 

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VENIRE PERSON: At this point. 

MS. MORENO: You are a lady of strong opinions I 

think. 

VENIRE PERSON: I don't think so at this point. 

MS. MORENO: Fair enough. Pass the juror. 

Thank you. 

THE COURT: Counsel for the government have 

questions for Ms. Fletcher? 

 MS. SHAPIRO: Yes, sir. Good afternoon. My 

name is Elizabeth Shapiro. I'm one of the prosecutors 

representing the government in this case. We just have a 

few additional questions to ask you today. You indicated 

in your questionnaire that you are married. 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: What does your husband do for a 

living? 

VENIRE PERSON: He's in gas. He works as a 

manager. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: With a company? 

VENIRE PERSON: A gas company. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: Has he worked there a long time? 

VENIRE PERSON: About six or seven years, yes. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: And before that, did he have a 

different kind of job? 

VENIRE PERSON: Similar. 

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 MS. SHAPIRO: And you have two children at home 

it sounds like? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: It looks like both you and your 

husband work outside the home. Do you have child care? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes.

MS. MORENO: If you were to serve on a jury for 

a length of time that we're talking about, would that be 

an issue for you? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, I do have child care, but 

there is a portion of that responsibility that falls on 

me. So it would be somewhat difficult. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: Do you think if you were selected 

for this jury that you might be able to find substitute 

arrangements? 

VENIRE PERSON: Given the estimation of the 

length of the trial it could be difficult. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: It looks like you spent some time 

abroad. 

VENIRE PERSON: Traveling. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: You went to Spain and France. 

Were those holidays, vacation? 

VENIRE PERSON: Vacation. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: Did you enjoy that? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

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 MS. SHAPIRO: Europe. Ms. Moreno asked you 

about the right to silence, and you had a conversation 

with her about that. If the Judge were to instruct you 

that under the Constitution these gentlemen have a right 

not to testify in this case and that you could not under 

the law hold that against them, if he were to instruct you 

in that way, would you be able to follow that instruction? 

VENIRE PERSON: I don't know. I'm just being 

honest. I think there is a human element. Given what you 

have heard and seen during a trial, I think there are 

times when it's difficult. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: So do you think that despite what 

the Court may tell you is the law and the defendant's 

rights are under the Constitution -- do you think you 

would not be able to follow that instruction? And 

understand there are no right or wrong answers. Whatever 

you honestly feel. 

VENIRE PERSON: I honestly believe I wouldn't, 

and I believe there are times when it happens in other 

places. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: Thank you. 

THE COURT: Ms. Fletcher, we're in the process 

of talking with the members of the panel from which the 

jury will be selected that would hear this case. That 

process will probably go on through today and into 

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tomorrow. So until you hear from us again, you should not 

discuss this case with anyone or allow anyone to discuss 

it with you, and if there are any media accounts about the 

case in the newspapers or on television or on the radio, 

you should not read or watch or listen to any of those 

news accounts. Thank you, ma'am, you may excused. 

MS. MORENO: Your Honor, on behalf of the 

defense we move for a cause strike against Ms. Fletcher. 

She could not afford these gentlemen their Fifth Amendment 

Constitutional protection and even questioning she could 

not be rehabilitated. She was clear and unequivocal, and 

as an attorney, someone who went to law school, she knows 

exactly what those protections are. 

THE COURT: Counsel for the government have a 

position about this? 

 MS. SHAPIRO: No objection, your Honor. 

THE COURT: I will excuse Ms. Fletcher for 

cause. 

Mr. Kiblinger, I think we're ready to see next 

Mr. Odell. 

THE COURT: Good afternoon. Counsel for the 

parties have some questions for you in this case. 

MR. WESTFALL: I'm Greg Westfall, and I'm one of 

defense attorneys in this case, and thank you for your 

patience in waiting around all day. This case, as you 

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probably know, is the United States versus Holy Land 

Foundation, and the Holy Land Foundation is accused of 

giving material support to HAMAS. It sounds like you may 

have been to the Holy Land Foundation's offices. 

VENIRE PERSON: I can't remember if I made a 

visit there or not, but I was involved in discussions 

because we were working with the accountant and all the 

activity. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you remember who your point of 

contact was there? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, I do not. 

MR. WESTFALL: But you had a person within the 

Foundation you were speaking for? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, I was speaking with UPS. 

MR. WESTFALL: I had it in my mind that you were 

driving a truck. Were you actually at like the home base? 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, I work in a solutions 

group with technology, and I support the sales force and 

customers. So solutions is kind of consulting. 

MR. WESTFALL: Well then all right. You know I 

go through two days seeing you in a brown outfit and going 

into a store. 

VENIRE PERSON: That's what most people think of 

UPS, seeing the drivers. 

MR. WESTFALL: Did you actually ever speak with 

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anyone from the Holy Land Foundation? 

VENIRE PERSON: I don't believe so. 

MR. WESTFALL: Just UPS people? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: I know you heard a lot about it 

and you were sensitive to the Holy Land Foundation name. 

So I know you may have seen things in the newspapers that 

other people may have missed. How much have you heard or 

read or been exposed? 

VENIRE PERSON: Not a lot. It would peak your 

interest a little bit if you saw a blurb on the 

newspapers. Hey, I remember that happening or I know that 

account. 

MR. WESTFALL: Well, based on anything you have 

heard or read or thought about since then, have you formed 

any opinions as to the guilt or innocence of the Holy Land 

Foundation or the gentlemen who were in it? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, it's just interesting, 

something that I knew kind of a little something of. 

MR. WESTFALL: How do you feel about being a 

juror on a case that has anything to do with terrorism, 

material support of terrorism? 

VENIRE PERSON: Not quite sure how to answer 

that. I can't say I'm real excited about it. I'm glad 

for the trial system. 

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MR. WESTFALL: Is there another case that you 

would be, like, real excited about? 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, I just don't think I would 

get real excited about anything that was indicated to be a 

four-month-long ordeal. You know the nature of the trial 

you think of safety or security or things going on. 

MR. WESTFALL: Are you worried about your safety 

or security as a result of being on the jury? 

VENIRE PERSON: I would think my family more so 

than myself. 

MR. WESTFALL: Tell me about that. It sounds 

like you have given it some thought. Are you worried 

about your family's safety if you are on the jury? 

VENIRE PERSON: Not really but it has crossed my 

mind. What if. 

MR. WESTFALL: Well, if you are worried at all 

about your family's safety, it's a pretty significant 

thing. 

VENIRE PERSON: Obviously my safety is well, but 

to me that's not as big a concern as, like I say, my 

family. 

MR. WESTFALL: Well, the issue of your safety 

and your family's safety, this trial could go four months. 

Do you see worrying about that like the whole time we're 

in trial? 

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VENIRE PERSON: I think it would always be in 

the back of your mind, sure. 

MR. WESTFALL: While we're in trial, what the 

jury is supposed to be considering is the evidence. This 

is the way the American criminal justice system works. 

Jurors ideally don't know anything about the case so that 

they can make a decision based only on the evidence in 

here. And a car theft case is -- You wouldn't be looking 

two ways to get home if you are in a car theft case or a 

drug case or something like that. But this case involves 

terrorism. The issue is whether you could give fair and 

impartial consideration to the evidence, and what that 

means is whether you could make your decision based only 

on the evidence or if issues of personal safety and such 

would be on your mind to the point where it would either 

distract you or inform your decision in any way. 

VENIRE PERSON: Right. I don't think it would 

cause problems looking at the evidence in the case. It's 

just a concern. 

MR. WESTFALL: Well, then I am going to move 

past that. Do you know any Muslims? 

VENIRE PERSON: Not really. Not like friends or 

people that I really would hang out with. Obviously in 

just the line of work I do I make lots of visits and see a 

lot of different customers. 

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MR. WESTFALL: Do you have opinions about Arabs 

or Muslims? 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, I don't have opinions. I 

try to be pretty open, but the thought is since 9-11 you 

think about it a little more than in the past. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you find yourself suspicious 

of Arabs? If there was two guys on the street speaking 

Arabic, what would your reaction about? 

VENIRE PERSON: Not a lot of reaction but I 

might wonder a little bit about, hey, are those guys 

involved in something? 

MR. WESTFALL: Have you looked into the 

Palestinian-Israeli conflict at all? 

VENIRE PERSON: It's not something I followed. 

It's not something I perk up and pay extreme attention to. 

MR. WESTFALL: Have you ever formed any 

conclusions as to who's right and who's wrong? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. WESTFALL: I'm about to have to sit down. I 

want you to think about this. We have talked about 

Muslims, and we have discussed some things. We're talking 

about the presumption of innocence, whether the men can be 

presumed innocent beyond a reasonable doubt until proven 

guilty by the government. Can you give these Muslim men a 

full presumption of innocence? 

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VENIRE PERSON: I don't believe so. 

MR. WESTFALL: Thank you. 

THE COURT: Counsel for the government have 

questions for Mr. Odell?

MR. JONAS: Yes. Good afternoon, Mr. Odell. My 

name is Barry Jonas. I'm a prosecutor for the government, 

and I have a few questions for you. How long have you 

worked for UPS? 

VENIRE PERSON: Twenty-two years. 

MR. JONAS: Do you enjoy it? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JONAS: If you were selected to serve on the 

trial, it could last four months or longer. Would you 

have a problem at work? I understand everybody would have 

a problem. But would you be fired? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, I wouldn't get fired, but 

there might be a different position when I returned. But 

I'm in something I enjoy doing, and I worked a long time 

to get to this position. 

MR. JONAS: Would those concerns weigh on your 

mind during the trial? 

VENIRE PERSON: I wouldn't think so. 

MR. JONAS: So it wouldn't affect your ability 

to be fair or impartial? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, sir. 

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MR. JONAS: You stated you did not deal with the 

Holy Land Foundation directly but you know other people at 

UPS who did? 

VENIRE PERSON: Right. People who did and even 

had discussions about potentially going to make a visit 

but had not done so. 

MR. JONAS: And in your discussions with your 

fellow employees, what did they say about the Holy Land 

Foundation? 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, like I say, it was a long 

time ago. Nothing in particular. It was more business 

matters. They were looking to do some things with 

international shipping and that sort of thing. 

MR. JONAS: Do you recall filling out the 

questionnaire a few weeks ago? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JONAS: And I have to ask you a sensitive 

question, and I apologize for that, but it's something we 

need to know. You put down that you had a medical 

condition that could make it difficult for you to serve as 

a juror. I understand it may be embarrassing, and if you 

prefer a sidebar. But can you tell us something about the 

condition and how it can be regulated? 

VENIRE PERSON: My only concern was really 

sitting for hours or long periods of time without just a 

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break for a restroom and that sort of thing. 

THE COURT: Mr. Odell, typically we go about an 

hour and a half at a time before a break. Would that be 

suitable? 

VENIRE PERSON: Most times yes, but morning is 

when it's more troublesome or a problem. 

MR. JONAS: Thank you very much, Mr. Odell. 

THE COURT: Mr. Odell, we are in the process of 

interviewing the members of the panel from which the jury 

will be drawn that would hear this case. I expect this 

process to continue through today and into tomorrow. So 

until you hear from us again, you should not discuss this 

case with anyone or allow anyone to discuss it with you, 

and if there are any media accounts about this case in the 

newspapers or on television or the radio, you should not 

read or watch or listen to any of those news accounts. 

Thank you, sir. You may be excused. 

We'll take a fifteen-minute recess at this time. 

(Recess)

THE COURT: Good afternoon. Counsel for the 

parties have some questions for you. 

MS. MORENO: Good afternoon, Mr. Carrillo. My 

name is Linda Moreno, and I have just a few questions for 

you. Remember filling out the questionnaire? I have some 

questions about your answers. One of the things you 

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indicated was perhaps a hearing problem, and I see that 

you are leaning forward. Tell us about that problem. 

VENIRE PERSON: The hearing problem? A little 

bit. I work around loud machines and stuff, and so I tend 

to say what, repeat that again. 

MS. MORENO: Do you have any hearing devices 

that you use? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MS. MORENO: Would you say it's difficult for 

you to hear? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. Just a certain pitch. 

MS. MORENO: We're going to be in trial for 

three to four months, and as you can see, this is a big 

courtroom, and it doesn't have the best acoustics. So we 

need to know if your hearing is going to be a problem. 

VENIRE PERSON: I don't see a problem. 

MS. MORENO: I mentioned it was going to be a 

long trial, and I'm wondering if that causes you any 

difficulty at your job, poses any kind of hardship for 

you. 

VENIRE PERSON: I'm getting paid at work. 

MS. MORENO: Tell me about your job. 

VENIRE PERSON: I'm a printer. Been there 

twenty-three years. I'm happy with my job. I like it. 

MS. MORENO: Good. What kind of things do you 

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do? 

VENIRE PERSON: We print checks, brochures, 

forms, basically everything. 

MS. MORENO: There was also a question about any 

medical conditions, and apparently you crossed it out. Do 

you have any other medical concerns that we should know 

about? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, just had a physical not to 

long ago, and I was fine. 

MS. MORENO: Congratulations. 

VENIRE PERSON: Thank you.

MS. MORENO: I want to tell you a little bit 

about the charges in this case so that we can explore if 

you have any issues. I want you to know there is no right 

answer or wrong answer. 

VENIRE PERSON: Okay. 

MS. MORENO: Just looking for your honest 

opinions. This is a case that involves the Holy Land 

Foundation which is an American Muslim charity. Have you 

heard about that? 

VENIRE PERSON: When I filled out the question, 

I did. I did remember, and then on the drive home I 

started remembering something about it on the news. I 

caught it on the news, but it's within a while.

MS. MORENO: A couple of years back? 

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VENIRE PERSON: Like I say, when I first filled 

out the questionnaire, I didn't remember, but thinking 

about it on the way home I remember hearing about it. I 

think it was in Plano or Richardson. 

MS. MORENO: Yes, that's right. These are 

serious allegations. They are just allegations, but they 

are serious, and the government claims that the Holy Land 

charity sent humanitarian aid and that the humanitarian 

aid was in the form of food and medicine, books, diapers 

for babies, money for needy families to help the poorest 

of the poor in West Bank and Gaza and the Occupied 

Territories. Okay? 

VENIRE PERSON: Okay. 

MS. MORENO: They say this humanitarian aid 

somehow benefited this terrorist organization called 

HAMAS. Have you heard of that? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: How have you heard of that? 

VENIRE PERSON: That it was an organization and 

they are in the Middle East or something like that. 

MS. MORENO: Have you followed the conflict over 

there at all? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, but not really. I don't 

pay too much attention to it. 

MS. MORENO: Have you watched news reports about 

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what's going on in the Occupied Territories? 

VENIRE PERSON: I try not to. It's depressing, 

the bad news that comes on the news and stuff like that. 

MS. MORENO: In this case because of the serious 

allegations, we need to know if you've got any -- I'll 

call it baggage. You know what, this is a case that 

involves terrorism charges, and I don't want anything to 

do with that. I'm not the kind of juror that could be 

fair in this case. And what we all want to know -- and 

that's why we're questioning all of these people today -- 

is if you fit in that category, if you have some issues 

that would prevent you from being fair and impartial. 

VENIRE PERSON: To be impartial? If I am picked 

for this and I got to hear the evidence and you know -- I 

got to hear what's going on and stuff before I make a 

decision on that. 

MS. MORENO: Is there anything about the nature 

of the charges -- terrorism, material support of a 

terrorist organization -- that brings things up for you, 

causes you any apprehension? 

VENIRE PERSON: Repeat that again. 

MS. MORENO: Did you not hear me? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MS. MORENO: Is there anything about the nature 

of the charges, material support of terrorism, that brings 

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up any issues for you? That's what we're trying to 

explore here. What do you think of those kinds of 

charges? 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, I'm against terrorism, you 

know. And if the evidence points to anything to do with 

the terrorism, then you know, you know, it's going to be 

hard for me not to find them guilty or you know -- 

MS. MORENO: What if the government does not 

prove its case in this kind of a serious trial? 

VENIRE PERSON: Okay. 

MS. MORENO: If they don't prove their case. 

Let's say they showed that the humanitarian aid only went 

to the needy. Okay? 

VENIRE PERSON: Okay. 

MS. MORENO: And did not benefit any terrorist 

organization? 

VENIRE PERSON: All right. 

MS. MORENO: And the Judge instructs you if 

that's what you found that you would have to accept that, 

that does not prove their charge. Okay? 

VENIRE PERSON: Okay. 

MS. MORENO: Do you have any problems? 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, if the government proves 

that they were -- like the HAMAS -- I heard it's a 

terrorist organization, they got ties to it. And I 

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believe if you aid a terrorist group in any form -- If you 

are associated with them, you know, that's the same as 

giving them the money to do something, something bad. 

THE COURT: Ms. Moreno, your time has expired.

MS. MORENO: Thank you. Thank you, sir. 

THE COURT: Counsel for the government have 

questions for Mr. Carrillo.

MR. GARRETT: No, your Honor. 

THE COURT: Mr. Carrillo, we're in the process 

of talking with the members of the panel from whom the 

jury will be selected to hear this case. That process 

will probably go on into today and through tomorrow. So 

until you hear from us again, you should not discuss this 

case with anyone or allow anyone to discuss it with you, 

and if there are any media accounts about the case in the 

newspapers or on television or the radio, you should not 

read or watch or listen to any of those media accounts.

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. JACKS: Your Honor, I would like to request 

if Ms. Moreno when she discusses the allegations in the 

charges -- if she could simply refer to what's in the 

indictment. The indictment only alleges that they sent 

money. There is nothing in the indictment about they sent 

humanitarian aid or the poorest of the poor or any of 

those descriptive terms that she's using. So if she is 

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going to talk about the allegations, I would ask that she 

talk about the allegations as they are stated in the 

indictment. 

THE COURT: Well, I can only reiterate what I 

said earlier in some of our discussions, Mr. Jacks. 

Counsel I think are much more familiar with the evidence 

in this case than I am at this point. And so whether the 

evidence will be as Ms. Moreno stated it, I don't know. I 

know that in your questioning of these venire members and 

that of other counsel for the government, you have 

referred to what you expect I will instruct the jury, and 

I guess I deduced from that there would be evidence to 

support such an instruction. So it seems to me that Ms. 

Moreno was trying to get at the same thing albeit in a 

slightly different way. So I just admonish counsel for 

all sides again to keep these questions based upon what 

you believe the evidence in this case will be. More than 

that I cannot say. 

Good afternoon, Ms. Buonasera. Counsel for the 

parties have some questions they would like to ask you. 

MS. MORENO: Good afternoon. Is Buonasera 

Italian? 

VENIRE PERSON: Italian. 

MS. MORENO: My name is Linda Moreno. I'm one 

of the attorneys on this case. I want to ask you a couple 

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of questions about the answers on your questionnaire. 

This is a case that involves the Holy Land Foundation 

which is an American Muslim charity. I see that you have 

lived in Richardson your whole life. 

VENIRE PERSON: No. For the past eight years. 

I grew up in Plano. 

MS. MORENO: Okay. Have you heard about the 

Holy Land Foundation in the press recently or in the last 

few years? 

VENIRE PERSON: Just recently. Because of all 

the paperwork we filled out. 

MS. MORENO: The questionnaire? 

VENIRE PERSON: The questionnaire, yes.

MS. MORENO: Before you filled out the 

questionnaire, do you recall ever hearing about this 

charity? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MS. MORENO: And after you filled out the 

questionnaire before you came to court today, did you hear 

or read anything about it in the press? 

VENIRE PERSON: I heard about it, but I didn't 

read anything really. 

MS. MORENO: What did you hear? 

VENIRE PERSON: That this trial was based on 

that foundation and that it was going to be a trial that 

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was going to determine where exactly their money was 

going, I guess. 

MS. MORENO: This is a case that involves 

allegations of terrorism. The government alleges that 

this charity sent humanitarian aid to the West Bank 

territories -- Gaza, West Bank and other places around the 

world and that aid was in the form of medicine, food, 

books, the rebuilding of homes which were destroyed, that 

sort of humanitarian aid. The government further alleges 

that aid somehow benefited this terrorist organization 

called HAMAS. Okay? Have you heard of HAMAS? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MS. MORENO: Now that I have just given you a 

little brief summary of the charges and the charges are 

material support of a terrorist organization, is there 

anything about that that causes you any concern? What are 

your thoughts about that? 

VENIRE PERSON: I don't know. Like what? 

MS. MORENO: Do you have any opinions already 

thinking, oh, this is a case that involves charges of 

terrorism, I don't think I want to be here? 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, yes, I guess so. 

MS. MORENO: First, let me tell you there is no 

right answer or wrong answer. We're here and everybody 

wants to pick a jury that can fairly evaluate the 

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evidence.

VENIRE PERSON: Right. 

MS. MORENO: A juror who doesn't have a lot of 

baggage and fear and preconceptions. 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: What we need to hear are your 

heartfelt opinions? 

VENIRE PERSON: Okay. 

MS. MORENO: So talk to me about your heartfelt 

opinions. 

VENIRE PERSON: I don't know much about the 

case, and I don't know that much about the allegations. 

So I don't feel like I have that much of an opinion. 

Obviously, I have a strong opinion about terrorism, but 

that doesn't necessarily mean that it relates here, I 

guess. I don't know. 

MS. MORENO: So as you sit there, you don't 

think "I'm afraid, I don't want to be on this jury or I 

have some kind of a concern or apprehension?" Do you have 

any thoughts like that? 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, should I be afraid to be 

on the jury? 

MS. MORENO: I'm asking you if you have any 

thoughts like that. 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, yes, I guess I do. 

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MS. MORENO: Why don't you share that with us.

VENIRE PERSON: Well, if it's a big high profile 

case, I don't want to be part of it. 

MS. MORENO: You don't? 

VENIRE PERSON: If it's going to be dangerous, 

no. 

MS. MORENO: Do you think it's going to be 

dangerous? 

VENIRE PERSON: I don't know. 

MS. MORENO: I'm inquiring and I apologize for 

pushing you on that. We need to know your opinions. Only 

you know if you have any apprehensions about being 

involved in a case like this.

VENIRE PERSON: Slightly apprehensive. I think 

my husband is much more apprehensive. 

MS. MORENO: So have you discussed your jury 

summon? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. He knew I was coming 

today, and he read the paper and said this is probably the 

case and said you don't want any part of that. 

MS. MORENO: Does that influence you in being 

able to sit on a case like this, your husband saying you 

don't want any part of that? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, not really. 

MS. MORENO: See at the end of the day, these 

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gentlemen have every right to expect from any juror who 

sits here that a juror can fairly look at the evidence and 

have no apprehensions, no fear whatsoever. So my question 

is can you afford them that right? And if you can't, we 

want to know that and that's fine. 

VENIRE PERSON: I think I can. 

MS. MORENO: Do you have any doubt about that? 

VENIRE PERSON: I don't think so. 

MS. MORENO: The presumption of innocence, have 

you heard of presumption of innocence? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: These gentlemen are afforded the 

presumption of innocence. And as a juror you have to be 

able to commit a hundred percent that you can absolutely 

unfailingly give them that presumption of innocence. Can 

you do that? 

VENIRE PERSON: I think I can do that, yes.

MS. MORENO: Do you have any hesitations about 

that? 

VENIRE PERSON: If I could be fair? 

MS. MORENO: If you could give them the 

presumption of innocence. 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, I mean, everyone is 

innocent until proven guilty. I believe that I guess. 

MS. MORENO: And do you believe you can give 

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that in this case? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: And you have no hesitation about 

that.

VENIRE PERSON: No, I don't think I do. 

MS. MORENO: And you took a while to answer and 

that's because? 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, you are making me think 

that -- 

MS. MORENO: I'm sorry. I don't mean to. I'm 

just asking what your opinions are, what your state of 

mind is. 

VENIRE PERSON: I think I could be fair if I 

served on a jury and weigh the evidence. 

MS. MORENO: And could you be fair in this kind 

of a trial? 

VENIRE PERSON: I think I could be fair. 

THE COURT: Ms. Moreno, your time is expired. 

MS. MORENO: Thank you. Thank you, Ms. 

Buonasera. 

THE COURT: Counsel for the government have 

questions for Ms. Buonasera? 

MR. GARRETT: Briefly, your Honor. 

Good afternoon, Ms. Buonasera. 

VENIRE PERSON: Buonasera.

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MR. GARRETT: Good afternoon. My name is Nathan 

Garrett, and I'm one of the Assistant United States 

Attorneys, and I'm one of the prosecutors on this case 

representing the government, and I have a few questions 

for you. First of all, I don't want anything I say or Ms. 

Moreno said to put any thoughts in your head. We want to 

know honestly what you believe. 

VENIRE PERSON: Okay. 

MR. GARRETT: You mentioned under your 

questioning of Ms. Moreno that you are married. Is that 

correct? 

VENIRE PERSON: Correct. 

MR. GARRETT: What type of work does your 

husband do? 

VENIRE PERSON: We own a landscaping business. 

MR. GARRETT: So you own that together? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, he and my father but I'm not 

in that business. 

MR. GARRETT: And you have three children, 

thirteen, ten and seven? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. GARRETT: And what do you do in your free 

time? 

VENIRE PERSON: I work. 

MR. GARRETT: And have three kids at home? 

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VENIRE PERSON: I don't have any free time. 

MR. GARRETT: I only have two. I don't think 

you marked that you have served any jury service before. 

VENIRE PERSON: I have not. 

MR. GARRETT: Have you ever been called down 

here before like you are today in terms of a jury pool? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. GARRETT: First time? 

VENIRE PERSON: I think I was on a pool a long 

time ago, but they never got down that list far enough. 

MR. GARRETT: I understand. And you are a high 

school counselor? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. GARRETT: Where? 

VENIRE PERSON: Plano East. 

MR. GARRETT: How long have you had that job? 

VENIRE PERSON: I went back to work full time 

for a year. I went back last year, and before that I 

worked at Richardson High School, and prior to that I was 

in private practice as a licensed professional counselor. 

MR. GARRETT: So you have been a counselor for 

how long? 

VENIRE PERSON: Fourteen years. 

MR. GARRETT: Always education related? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, I was in private practice 

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doing individual and family therapy. But it was part time 

when I was raising my children. 

MR. GARRETT: In the schools at the beginning? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, I was just seeing a few 

clients to keep my license up for a few years, and I went 

back to the school, and last year I decided I would start 

back full time. 

MR. GARRETT: Do you prefer the schools or the 

private? 

VENIRE PERSON: I prefer the school. 

MR. GARRETT: Why? 

VENIRE PERSON: The productivity. I was working 

a lot with the adolescents. Private practice is a lot of 

therapy appointment after appointment after appointment, 

and in the schools there is more variety. I help the kids 

with colleges, crisis counseling, I work with schedules. 

Just a lot more variety. 

MR. GARRETT: You work with a number of other 

counselors I guess in a school that big? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. GARRETT: Ms. Moreno mentioned to you the 

charges, the allegations in this case, what they are. And 

to touch base on that, the allegations are that the 

government is alleging that these gentlemen, these 

defendants and the companies for which they work, provided 

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material support to a terrorist organization. And that 

terrorist organization is HAMAS. And at the end of the 

case if you are called to serve, if you are that fortunate 

to serve, the Judge will give you what are called 

instructions, and those instructions will be on what the 

law is in this case. 

VENIRE PERSON: Right. 

MR. GARRETT: So then you will take the facts 

you find yourself collectively and apply them to that law. 

And I instruct you that the Judge will instruct you that 

HAMAS is a terrorist organization, and as a result of that 

designation, I expect the instructions will tell you that 

one cannot send any material support to that organization. 

And you will hear allegations of money. You can't send 

money, regardless of what that money is used for. So even 

if that money were spent on things you might consider 

charitable items -- medical supplies or books for schools 

or anything like that -- would that be an instruction you 

would have difficulty following? 

VENIRE PERSON: Not if that was the instruction. 

MR. GARRETT: Thank you for your time. 

THE COURT: Ms. Buonasera, we are in the process 

of talking with the members of the pool from which the 

jury will be selected that would hear this case. That 

process will probably continue from today into tomorrow. 

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So until you hear from us further, you should not discuss 

this case with anyone or allow anyone to discuss it with 

you, and if there are any media accounts about the case in 

the newspapers or on television or the radio, you should 

not read or watch or listen to any such media accounts. 

Thank you. You may be excused. 

Mr. Kurian, counsel for the parties in this case 

have some questions they would like to ask you. Mr. 

Westfall. 

MR. WESTFALL: Thank you, your Honor. Mr. 

Kurian, I'm Greg Westfall. I'm one of the defense lawyers 

in this case. I want to talk to you for a few minutes. 

Okay? Thank you for waiting all day to speak with us and 

please just relax. I know this is probably not your 

favorite thing to do on a sunny afternoon. 

You actually know about this case? 

VENIRE PERSON: I learned about the case through 

the media. 

MR. WESTFALL: Please tell me what you have 

seen. 

VENIRE PERSON: This is about Holy Land 

Foundation? 

MR. WESTFALL: Right. 

VENIRE PERSON: And money laundering and 

exporting illegally and it's a charity organization. 

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That's what I know about it. 

MR. WESTFALL: Right. Well, based upon what you 

know, did you learn about it again recently? 

VENIRE PERSON: Whatever I heard in the news 

media, that's all I know. 

MR. WESTFALL: Well, based upon that, have you 

arrived at a conclusion as to whether they are guilty or 

not? 

VENIRE PERSON: Based upon the news media, 

guilty. 

MR. WESTFALL: You think they are guilty? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, based on the news media. 

But I don't know the whole story. 

MR. WESTFALL: Well, we're having a little 

difficulty here. Is that your opinion or is that what you 

perceive is the news media's opinion? 

VENIRE PERSON: News media. 

MR. WESTFALL: What is your opinion? 

VENIRE PERSON: I don't have any opinion, sir. 

MR. WESTFALL: Karikal, India, is that a city, 

small town? 

VENIRE PERSON: It's a state, south part of 

India, yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: Any particular city that you are 

from? 

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VENIRE PERSON: Yes, I'm from a city called 

Sonepur. 

MR. WESTFALL: And Malayalam? 

VENIRE PERSON: Malayalam, yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: That is your native language? 

VENIRE PERSON: That's correct. 

MR. WESTFALL: I have not heard of that. Is 

that what they speak in Malaysia? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, no, that's the language in 

the state of Karikal. Each state has its own language. 

MR. WESTFALL: How many states are there? 

VENIRE PERSON: I don't know. I left India 

years ago. 

MR. WESTFALL: When did you leave? 

VENIRE PERSON: I left in 1985. 

MR. WESTFALL: What do you do at Parkland 

Hospital? 

VENIRE PERSON: I am a manager in engineering. 

MR. WESTFALL: And you are a mechanical engineer 

I guess? 

VENIRE PERSON: Electrical. 

MR. WESTFALL: Electrical engineer? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you still have family back in 

India? 

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VENIRE PERSON: Not close family. Close family 

are here. My parents, my siblings are here. 

MR. WESTFALL: In your work or whatever, do you 

have any contacts with Muslims? 

VENIRE PERSON: Not very close contacts, no. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you know any? 

VENIRE PERSON: In our department there is 

people -- there are people from Arabic countries, yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: Tell me about them. Do you have 

good experiences or bad experiences? 

VENIRE PERSON: Not particularly any experience 

other than just coworker. 

MR. WESTFALL: Just professional experiences? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. WESTFALL: And you put in there that you go 

to church? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, I do. 

MR. WESTFALL: Are you pretty active in your 

church? 

VENIRE PERSON: I was very active until I have 

my own business. I don't have much time. 

MR. WESTFALL: Your own business? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir.

MR. WESTFALL: So you have your own business 

besides Parkland? 

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VENIRE PERSON: My wife have her own business. 

She runs the business, and I help her. 

MR. WESTFALL: What business is that? 

VENIRE PERSON: Restoration business. She runs 

the business, and I help her. 

MR. WESTFALL: What is it? 

VENIRE PERSON: Fire and water. 

MR. WESTFALL: I bet that keeps you busy. 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, all evening, and with the 

two kids, pretty busy. 

MR. WESTFALL: Are there any charities here like 

American charities that send money specifically over to 

the people in India? 

VENIRE PERSON: I'm not aware of this. I'm sure 

there are, but permanently I don't have any persons. 

MR. WESTFALL: Have you done any kind of charity 

work or volunteer work? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. I donated money to 

charities here, March of Dimes and charities like that. 

MR. WESTFALL: You do that on a regular basis? 

VENIRE PERSON: Every year, yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: They come around at the employer 

and say it's time to donate? 

MR. GARRETT: That's correct. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you do any through your church 

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at all? 

VENIRE PERSON: Not much. 

MR. WESTFALL: You mentioned one other thing. 

You don't like to watch the killing of another human 

being? 

VENIRE PERSON: I'm not violent, and I don't 

like to watch violent graphics. 

MR. WESTFALL: I agree with that. We have here 

Muslim men and a case that has terrorism in the title. 

Can you be a fair and impartial juror in a case like that? 

VENIRE PERSON: Sure. I don't have anything 

against Muslims. 

MR. WESTFALL: No hesitation? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you have anything going on in 

the next four months? 

VENIRE PERSON: I have manage a project at 

Parkland, a 1.5 million dollar project. I just finished 

with the design. We are in the process of bidding it. 

MR. WESTFALL: Is the project going to crater if 

you are not there four months? 

VENIRE PERSON: I don't know who will handle it 

if I'm not there. I'm not sure. 

MR. WESTFALL: Well, if it is a situation that 

could distract you from jury service, four days a week -- 

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From nine o'clock basically to five o'clock Monday through 

Thursday, those are the hours. It could go four months. 

If something in your life like this project is in grave 

peril of cratoring because of your jury service to where 

it would distract you in your jury service, the Court and 

we need to know about that. Are you in that situation? 

VENIRE PERSON: The project I just explained 

about, that may have some impact. I don't know how much 

that will be. 

MR. WESTFALL: Well, if you get a handle on 

that, speak with the jury administrator or get some 

message to the Court so that everyone knows in time. 

Because this trial is coming, all right? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. WESTFALL: Thank you so much. 

THE COURT: Counsel for the government have 

questions for Mr. Kurian? 

MR. JACKS: Yes, your Honor. Good afternoon, 

Mr. Kurian. My name is Jim Jacks. I'm an Assistant 

United States Attorney for the Northern District of Texas. 

I'm one of the prosecutors on this case. I will be 

representing the government during this trial, and I have 

a few follow-up questions, if I may. You left India in 

1984? 

VENIRE PERSON: End of 1984. So I think I 

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reached here January 2nd or something like that. I don't 

remember the exact date. 

MR. JACKS: Your wife is from Burma? 

VENIRE PERSON: Originally, yes. 

MR. JACKS: Did you and she meet in the United 

States? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, we met in Singapore. She 

lived in Singapore for a long time. 

MR. JACKS: Did you meet her before you came to 

the United States? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. JACKS: What took you to Singapore? 

VENIRE PERSON: Family friends. 

MR. JACKS: You have two young children, and 

your wife operates this new business? 

VENIRE PERSON: She handles it all during the 

day, and I work in the evenings. It's a twenty-four hour 

service. 

MR. JACKS: It's a twenty-four hour service? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: Do you have employees that work for 

you? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. JACKS: And from your description it sounds 

like your company -- if a building or residence is damaged 

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by fire or water, you go in and clean it up and try to 

restore it? 

VENIRE PERSON: That's correct. 

MR. JACKS: How long has that been in existence? 

VENIRE PERSON: Two years just about. I don't 

have an exact date. 

MR. JACKS: About how many employees do you have 

at any given time? 

VENIRE PERSON: About four or five. 

MR. JACKS: And you said there is a project or 

contract that you are in the process of bidding for? 

VENIRE PERSON: At Parkland Hospital, yes. 

MR. JACKS: Did you say the value of that 

contract? 

VENIRE PERSON: Approximately 1.5 million 

dollars. 

MR. JACKS: To do what? 

VENIRE PERSON: To install generators and gears. 

MR. JACKS: This has nothing to do with this 

company of you and your wife's? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, it's my day job. 

MR. JACKS: When did you acquire your 

citizenship? 

VENIRE PERSON: I believe in 1992. 

MR. JACKS: Would that be true for your wife? 

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Was it the same time when she got her citizenship? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, I have been here way before 

she came. 

MR. JACKS: Is the Dallas area the only place 

that you have lived in the United States? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. I came to New York 

originally. That's where I came to and then moved here. 

MR. JACKS: How long did you stay in New York? 

VENIRE PERSON: A few days. Probably a week or 

so. 

MR. JACKS: Okay. Where did you get your 

education? In the United States or India? 

VENIRE PERSON: Majority of the education in 

India and I got an associate degree in electronics. 

MR. JACKS: Where did you get your associate 

degree? 

VENIRE PERSON: It's a private school in Dallas. 

MR. JACKS: You show that you are a member of 

the Pentecostal church? 

VENIRE PERSON: That's correct. 

MR. JACKS: Was that the faith you followed in 

India or did you adopt that faith after you moved to the 

United States? 

VENIRE PERSON: We are always a christian 

family, but different denomination. We got baptized when 

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we got here. 

MR. JACKS: Is there anything in the Pentecostal 

faith that prohibits its members from judging other people 

or am I confusing that with some other faith? 

VENIRE PERSON: I don't know. I can ask my 

pastor. I'm not sure. 

MR. JACKS: How would you describe your activity 

in the church? Did you and your family go weekly? 

VENIRE PERSON: Like I say, our business is 

twenty-four hours. Sunday morning I get a job and I don't 

go to church. So it's not as usual as it used to be. 

MR. JACKS: Where is your church located? In 

Garland? 

VENIRE PERSON: In Garland. 

MR. JACKS: How big is it? 

VENIRE PERSON: Very small. Our community. 

MR. JACKS: So two hundred twenty? 

VENIRE PERSON: No, probably about twenty 

members, twenty families I would say.

MR. JACKS: Twenty families? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. JACKS: You said you heard of this case 

through the media. Have you heard of HAMAS? 

VENIRE PERSON: What I heard through the media. 

MR. JACKS: Do you pay attention to what's going 

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on overseas and around the world? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. I don't have time actually. 

MR. JACKS: The Judge will give the jury the law 

that applies. He would tell you at the end of the case 

what the charges are and what the government must prove to 

prove that a person is guilty. He will give you 

definitions of words. So if there is a word you might not 

understand, he would put a definition in there. I 

suspect, first of all, that he would tell the jury that 

HAMAS has been designated a terrorist organization by the 

U. S. Government, and secondly, I suspect he would tell 

the jury that any type of contribution or material support 

to HAMAS is against the law, even if money is given and 

that money is used for humanitarian things like food or 

clothing or medical supplies. If the money is used in 

that manner but if it's for the benefit or use of HAMAS, 

it's against the law. If that is the instruction, would 

you follow that instruction and find a verdict of guilty 

if you believe that the government has proved those acts 

beyond a reasonable doubt? 

VENIRE PERSON: Sure. 

THE COURT: Mr. Kurian, we're in the process of 

talking to the members of the panel from which a jury will 

be selected to hear this case. I suspect it will continue 

through tomorrow. So until you hear further from us, you 

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should not discuss the case with anyone or allow anyone to 

discuss it with you, and if there are any media accounts 

on the television or news or radio, you should not read or 

watch or listen to any accounts. Thank you, sir, you may 

be excused. 

Mr. Mooney, counsel for the parties have some 

questions they would like to ask you. 

MR. WESTFALL: Good afternoon. I'm Greg 

Westfall. I'm one of the defense lawyers in the case. I 

want to speak to you a very few minutes, and then the 

government will want to speak with you. Okay? 

VENIRE PERSON: Okay. 

MR. WESTFALL: This is the United States versus 

Holy Land Foundation case. It involves a Muslim charity, 

an American Muslim charity and allegations by the 

government that the charity and some of the men who work 

with the charity gave material support to HAMAS which is a 

terrorist organization. The charity was based in 

Richardson. After telling you that, does that ring any 

bells? Are you familiar with the case? 

VENIRE PERSON: I have heard a little bit about 

it. That's about it. 

MR. WESTFALL: From what you have heard or 

thought about or may or may not have discussed with 

anybody, have you arrived at any opinion as to whether the 

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defendants are guilty or not guilty? 

VENIRE PERSON: I don't know enough of the facts 

to form an opinion like that. 

MR. WESTFALL: How do you feel about being a 

juror in a case where terrorism is at least in the title 

of the offense? 

VENIRE PERSON: I don't know. I never 

experienced it before. 

MR. WESTFALL: Ever been on any juries at all? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: You have been on a couple of 

juries, haven't you? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: So you have experienced being on 

the jury? 

VENIRE PERSON: That's correct. 

MR. WESTFALL: This one may run four months, may 

run more than four months, but four months is probably 

everyone's best estimate of what we're looking at. How do 

you feel about that? 

VENIRE PERSON: It seems a little long, but I 

understand major cases do run this long. 

MR. WESTFALL: We aren't California. In 

California, they can make a DWI last four months. This is 

going to be a pretty long very complicated case. It 

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sounds like -- You mentioned that you have auditing 

experience and you would use that in looking at the facts. 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: Tell me about that experience. 

VENIRE PERSON: I work reviewing bank 

procedures, cash funds, everything involved in the 

industry. 

MR. WESTFALL: So are you called in whenever 

there has been thought that maybe somebody has done wrong? 

Do you come in and do a forensic audit or just like an 

annual audit type of deal? 

VENIRE PERSON: I actually did both. I'm called 

in when there might be some possible cases of malfeasance 

or problems. Most of the work though was ordinary 

operational type of how to improve things, etcetera. 

MR. WESTFALL: On the forensic audits, I guess 

you look for a paper trail, and the paper trail pretty 

much tells the stories? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: How many forensic audits have you 

done, do you think? 

VENIRE PERSON: Probably only three or four. 

MR. WESTFALL: Are they recently in your career 

or way back? 

VENIRE PERSON: This would have been twenty 

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years ago. 

MR. WESTFALL: I guess you would be looking for 

money that was stolen or misappropriated somehow? 

VENIRE PERSON: Right. 

MR. WESTFALL: And you would be able to figure 

that out from looking at the paperwork? 

VENIRE PERSON: Sometimes. Sometimes there is 

gaps in there that can go elsewhere. The bulk of it is in 

the paperwork at least. 

MR. WESTFALL: So as a forensic auditor, if the 

paperwork looks like it's in good condition, what did you 

do? If the paperwork looks like it's in good condition -- 

I's dotted and T's crossed? 

VENIRE PERSON: If it looks in good condition, 

yes. I don't always trust somebody else's paperwork. 

MR. WESTFALL: Way back in the seventies you had 

to have a clearance for something? 

VENIRE PERSON: That was in my military career. 

MR. WESTFALL: Tell me about your military 

career. 

VENIRE PERSON: I was in the army three years, 

and I needed a secret security clearance because of the 

nature of the work I was doing. 

MR. WESTFALL: Without giving away any secrets, 

what did you do? 

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VENIRE PERSON: Tactical nuclear weapons. 

MR. WESTFALL: Okay. You did three years, 

enlisted? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: And then you got out? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: Did you ever do anything with 

your clearance after that? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. WESTFALL: You said you followed the 

Israeli-Palestinian conflict closely, but you didn't put 

anything else out. What do you think about that? 

VENIRE PERSON: I look at it as a key to what's 

happening in the Middle East. 

MR. WESTFALL: Tell me about that. 

VENIRE PERSON: This has been going on for 

thousands of years, and I would like to see if there are 

any trends, both positive and negative, of what's going on 

right now. 

MR. WESTFALL: Any sense of who's right and 

who's wrong in the Palestinians issue? 

VENIRE PERSON: Not really. I think both sides 

are somewhat hard headed. 

MR. WESTFALL: How would you change it? 

VENIRE PERSON: I don't see much change. I 

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think they are both hard headed about that, and there 

could be some movement if they are willing to give in 

some. 

MR. WESTFALL: How do you think the war on 

terror is going? 

VENIRE PERSON: Locally, nationally or across 

the world? 

MR. WESTFALL: Internationally? 

VENIRE PERSON: Doesn't seem to be going all of 

that well right now. There are a lot of hot spots all 

over the world and a lot of people being hurt. 

MR. WESTFALL: What could we be doing 

differently? 

VENIRE PERSON: As individuals? 

MR. WESTFALL: As a country. 

VENIRE PERSON: As a country, I don't know. 

I really don't. It seems like we have tried a 

number of things. It just doesn't seem to help. I think 

there is too much of a cultural difference. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you know any Muslims? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you have any good experiences 

with Muslims? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: Thank you very much. 

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THE COURT: Counsel for the government. 

MR. GARRETT: Yes, your Honor. Mr. Mooney, good 

afternoon. My name is Nathan Garrett, and I'm an 

Assistant United States Attorney and one of the 

prosecutors who will be handling this case for the 

government. I just have a couple of things -- maybe more 

than a couple but a few things to follow-up with you. 

Okay? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. GARRETT: First of all, I agree with you 

four months sounds a little long. We're on the same page. 

You state on your questionnaire you are married. 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. GARRETT: Does your wife work outside the 

home? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. GARRETT: What type of work does she do? 

VENIRE PERSON: She's a school principal. 

MR. GARRETT: So she keeps you in line as well? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. GARRETT: Elementary, high school? 

VENIRE PERSON: Elementary. 

MR. GARRETT: Is that in the Dallas-Fort Worth 

area? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

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MR. GARRETT: And you have one daughter? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. GARRETT: Thirty-one years old? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. GARRETT: Does she still live around the 

area? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. GARRETT: And in your questionnaire, you 

have lived in the area for twenty years; is that right? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. GARRETT: And where were you living before 

you moved to this area? 

VENIRE PERSON: Western Pennsylvania. 

MR. GARRETT: You mind me asking what brought 

you to Texas? 

VENIRE PERSON: Too much snow and cold. 

MR. GARRETT: Those are all good reasons. I'm 

from Kansas City. Those are good reasons. You also 

mentioned to Mr. Westfall that you were in the military. 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. GARRETT: You also were in Hawaii? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. GARRETT: How does a guy get that draw? 

VENIRE PERSON: I'm not sure. 

MR. GARRETT: But it was a good one? 

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VENIRE PERSON: I was actually going through 

officer training, and when I got out of there I was going 

everywhere, and at the time ninety percent were going 

straight to Vietnam.

MR. GARRETT: And you got Hawaii? 

VENIRE PERSON: Hawaii and nuclear weapons. 

MR. GARRETT: Always a trade off? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, there is something about a 

four star general looking over you when you are running 

through your work. 

MR. GARRETT: And now, of course, you have a 

principal at home so more of the same. You were in the 

military I think you said three years? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. GARRETT: Did you serve on any reserve 

status or anything like that when you got out? 

VENIRE PERSON: It was inactive reserve. 

MR. GARRETT: And looks like -- I'm looking at 

your questionnaire. You have served on three juries? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. GARRETT: Those were all criminal I think? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. GARRETT: And for one of them you have about 

1983 on the time frame. Were the other ones before or 

after that? 

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VENIRE PERSON: Before. 

MR. GARRETT: So since 1983 you haven't served 

on a jury? 

VENIRE PERSON: I have been called, but not 

actually served.

MR. GARRETT: Federal court or state? 

VENIRE PERSON: State. 

MR. GARRETT: Down at the Crowley Building. 

Okay. 

As Mr. Westfall touched on, the allegations of 

this case include that the defendants knowingly provided 

material support to a terrorist organization. As you may 

recall from your prior jury service -- I know it's been a 

while -- at the end of the case the judge will give you 

instructions on the law, and you and your group 

collectively take the facts and apply them to that law. I 

expect the instructions to be that HAMAS, the group at 

issue here, is a terrorist organization, been designated 

by the government as a terrorist organization. And as a 

result of that designation, one cannot send material 

support to HAMAS. Cannot send money and other things to 

HAMAS. And I expect the instruction to include even if 

that money is spent on so called humanitarian things -- 

medical supplies, books, those sorts of things -- if it 

goes to the benefit of HAMAS, that's illegal. 

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VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. GARRETT: Is that an instruction you would 

have any problem following? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. GARRETT: Thank you for your time. 

THE COURT: Mr. Mooney, we're in the process of 

talking to the members of the panel from which the jury 

will be selected that would hear this case. I expect that 

process to continue through today and into tomorrow. So 

until you hear from us further, you should not discuss 

this case with anyone or allow anyone to discuss it with 

you, and if there are any media accounts about the case in 

the newspapers or on television or on the radio, you 

should not read or watch or listen to any such media 

accounts. 

VENIRE PERSON: I understand. 

THE COURT: You may be excused. Thank you. 

Good afternoon, Mr. Huffman. Counsel for the 

parties have some questions they would like to ask you. 

MR. WESTFALL: Good afternoon. I'm Greg 

Westfall. I will like to talk to you for a bit. Do you 

know what case this is? 

VENIRE PERSON: Not specifically but in general. 

MR. WESTFALL: It's United States versus Holy 

Land Foundation, and it has to do with an American Muslim 

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charity that is accused by the government of giving 

material support to HAMAS which is a terrorist 

organization. Is that the same one you have heard about? 

VENIRE PERSON: Basically, yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: What have you heard? 

VENIRE PERSON: That it was essentially a money 

laundering scheme and a money funneling scheme. That's 

essentially what I heard. 

MR. WESTFALL: How far back are we talking you 

heard this in the media? Was it a long time ago or 

recently? 

VENIRE PERSON: Mentioned yesterday morning the 

jury selection process. And before that, I remember it 

being mentioned on the news about the sting being done, 

but I couldn't give you the date on that. 

MR. WESTFALL: Based upon what you have read and 

what you have heard, have you formed any opinions about 

the guilt or innocence of the defendants? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. WESTFALL: You said on your questionnaire 

you followed the John Walker case. 

VENIRE PERSON: I didn't follow it. I heard he 

had been convicted. But I didn't follow it on a daily 

basis. 

MR. WESTFALL: Well, the question was a little 

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ambivalent. What did you think of the conviction or the 

outcome of the case? 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, anybody found guilty of 

something like that I thought should be punished to the 

extent of the law. 

MR. WESTFALL: I guess he ultimately pled 

guilty? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: And then Tim McVeigh. You listed 

Tim McVeigh. 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you design weather radar 

systems? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: Can you tell us about that? 

VENIRE PERSON: Channel 5, they use our radar 

processing system. They call it Storm Track 5. We have 

systems in Oklahoma City, Tulsa and just sold one in 

Sherman. 

MR. WESTFALL: So you work for the company that 

makes them? 

VENIRE PERSON: I write the software, and we 

install the computers and software in our sites. 

MR. WESTFALL: Did you go to school here in 

Texas? 

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VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. WESTFALL: A and M? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, sir. 

MR. WESTFALL: You said you followed the 

Palestinians-Israeli conflict closely? 

VENIRE PERSON: Kind of hard to avoid it. 

MR. WESTFALL: Tell us how you followed it. 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, there is a war going on 

right now. Trying to keep a sense of what is happening in 

the world. 

MR. WESTFALL: Any sense of who's right or 

wrong? 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, I believe murder to 

further a political cause is reprehensible. 

MR. WESTFALL: And which side does that? 

VENIRE PERSON: At this point in time I would 

say the actions of HAMAS and groups like them fall into 

that category. 

MR. WESTFALL: We have Muslim gentlemen in this 

case charged with something to do with terrorism, material 

support of HAMAS. There is a lot of different kinds of 

trials, criminal trials. Have you ever been on a trial 

before? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MR. WESTFALL: The thing that a juror has to do 

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and the jury has to do is make a decision based upon the 

evidence in court. That's the only fair way, the only way 

that the process self executes and keeps hopefully coming 

up with the right result, and it's different in every 

trial and every jury. We have a case here of five Muslim 

men charged with something that has to do with terrorism. 

How do you feel about being on that jury? 

VENIRE PERSON: About being on the jury? Well, 

if I am asked, I will serve. 

MR. WESTFALL: How do you feel about being on a 

jury for four months? 

VENIRE PERSON: Honestly it doesn't excite me. 

I have a very large project. I work in our family 

business, and our work force is cut by about a fifth. 

MR. WESTFALL: Do you believe that you could 

give them the presumption of innocence? That's the way 

our system works. Do you believe you can apply the 

presumption of innocence? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: No hesitation? 

VENIRE PERSON: I would like to think that of 

myself. Honestly, yes. 

MR. WESTFALL: Very good. Now, on the issue of 

your family business, is this going to hurt your business? 

VENIRE PERSON: It certainly won't help, but 

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we'll get by. 

MR. WESTFALL: Well, if the business is going to 

be impaired to the point that it will distract you from 

your service, this is the kind of thing the Court needs to 

know about and the jury administrator needs to know about, 

and they need to know about it quickly. 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, if I understand correctly, 

service would be at least four days a week. 

MR. WESTFALL: Four days a week. 

VENIRE PERSON: So essentially eight hours a 

day, four days a week, Monday through Thursday. 

MR. WESTFALL: Right. 

VENIRE PERSON: That would definitely cause 

problems with work. It's not a money issue. It's a 

manpower issue. 

MR. WESTFALL: If it's an issue at the end of 

the day that could really hurt your business -- Basically 

would you sit here and be distracted because you are 

worried about your business? That is the kind of thing 

that can be taken into consideration as long as you give 

us word quickly. Do you have any questions? I know you 

sat around all day. Anything else we need to know about 

or the Court needs to know about? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

THE COURT: Counsel for the government have 

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questions for Mr. Huffman?

MR. JONAS: No, your Honor. 

THE COURT: Mr. Huffman, we're in the process of 

talking to the members of the panel from which the jury in 

this case will be selected. That process will continue 

until sometime tomorrow. Until you hear from us, you 

should not discuss the case anyone or allow anyone to 

discuss it with you, and if there are any media accounts 

about this case in the media on television, newspapers or 

radio, you should not read, watch or listen to any such 

media accounts. Thank you, sir. You may be excused. 

THE COURT: Good afternoon, Ms. Hodge. Counsel 

have some questions for you. 

MS. MORENO: Good afternoon, Ms. Hodge. Thank 

you for waiting all day. I have some questions I would 

like to ask you in this case. I'm Linda Moreno. This 

case involves the Holy Land Foundation. Have you seen 

anything in the press, heard anything on the TV or on the 

radio about an organization that has been accused of 

material support of terrorism? 

VENIRE PERSON: I may have, but I didn't pay 

much attention to it. 

MS. MORENO: You don't recall anything? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MS. MORENO: You are a quality assurance 

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inspector? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: Where do you work? 

VENIRE PERSON: Summercut. 

MS. MORENO: What kind of work is that? 

VENIRE PERSON: Production. We make paper cups, 

spoons, forks.

MS. MORENO: And you are the lady that goes by 

to make sure they are as they should be? 

MR. JACKS: I go by and take the cups and test 

them for leaks. 

MS. MORENO: And how long have you done that? 

VENIRE PERSON: Ten years. 

MS. MORENO: This is a case that may last four 

months. No court on Friday, four days a week. But four 

months. Could be more, could be less. Is that anything 

that's going to cause you a hardship, any problems at 

work? 

VENIRE PERSON: At work? I don't think so. 

They would have someone to cover what I do. 

MS. MORENO: So you are not concerned about this 

long jury service affecting your job in any way? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MS. MORENO: If you find that out within the 

next day, please let us know. 

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VENIRE PERSON: Okay. 

MS. MORENO: Where did you go to school? 

VENIRE PERSON: South Oak Cliff High School. 

MS. MORENO: Do you know any Muslims? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MS. MORENO: No experience or dealings with 

people who are Muslims? How about people of Arabic 

descent? 

VENIRE PERSON: Not that I know of. 

MS. MORENO: The gentlemen charged here are all 

Muslim and Palestinians. I ask you these questions to 

determine whether you have had any bad experience with 

Muslims or if there is any kind of prejudices or ideas 

that you have that you wouldn't be a fair juror in this 

case. 

VENIRE PERSON: I haven't had any. 

MS. MORENO: I'm sorry? 

VENIRE PERSON: I haven't had any experience 

with Muslims. 

MS. MORENO: When you use the term Muslim, what 

do you think? 

VENIRE PERSON: I think of what the guy's name. 

I think of Mohamed Ali. Any famous person like that.

MS. MORENO: This is a case that the government 

alleges that the Holy Land Foundation sent humanitarian 

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aid and the humanitarian aid was in the form of food, 

medicine, books, the rebuilding of homes that were 

destroyed, libraries. Okay? Mobile bread bakeries. Now, 

this humanitarian aid the government says benefited the 

terrorist organization called HAMAS. Have you heard of 

HAMAS? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MS. MORENO: The government says this 

organization somehow benefited the terrorist organization 

HAMAS. Let me ask you, have you heard of the presumption 

of innocence? And in this country anybody accused of a 

crime is presumed innocent. Do you understand that? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: Knowing what the charges are, just 

what the allegations are, do you have any problems in 

affording these gentlemen the presumption of innocence in 

a case like this? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MS. MORENO: Does it cause you any kind of 

concern? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MS. MORENO: You need a break? 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, I have asthma. 

MS. MORENO: Well, I'm sorry. Is that something 

that might affect you in your jury service? 

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VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MS. MORENO: So we don't need to go there. Then 

I won't. The burden of proof, have you heard about the 

burden of proof beyond a reasonable doubt? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: There is anything about making the 

government prove their case beyond a reasonable doubt in a 

case involving terrorism charges that makes you wonder, 

that makes you think maybe they don't have to prove it 

beyond a reasonable doubt? 

VENIRE PERSON: I would think that we have to 

prove it. 

MS. MORENO: You don't have any hesitation about 

that? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

MS. MORENO: Thank you so much. 

THE COURT: Counsel for the government have 

questions of Ms. Hodge? 

 MS. SHAPIRO: Yes, your Honor. Good afternoon. 

My name is Elizabeth Shapiro, and I'm representing the 

government in this case. I have just a couple more 

questions to ask you. I take it from your questionnaire 

that you were born and raised here in Dallas. 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: And it looks like you have a son. 

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Is that correct? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: Do you have any other children? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: The one son? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: How old is he? 

VENIRE PERSON: Thirty-one. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: I notice on your questionnaire -- 

And I apologize for raising it -- that it looks like he 

was convicted of a drug charge. Is that right? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, he was. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: Back in 1993? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: Did he end up doing jail time for 

that? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, he did. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: Is he out of jail now? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: And during that process, did you 

feel like he was treated fairly by the criminal justice 

system? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes, I did. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: Nothing about that experience 

that would color how you would look at the government in 

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this case? 

VENIRE PERSON: No. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: Ms. Moreno explained a little bit 

about the charges in this case, and I wanted to explain 

them a little more. The allegations are in this case that 

the defendants and an organization they worked for sent 

money overseas to benefit a terrorist organization. Do 

you understand? 

VENIRE PERSON: Run that by me one more time. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: Sure. The allegation or one of 

the principal allegations are that the defendants in this 

case and the organization they work for, the Holy Land 

Foundation, sent money from here, from Dallas, to the 

Middle East, to the West Bank in Gaza, Palestine, and that 

they did that with the intent to benefit a terrorist 

organization. Okay? 

VENIRE PERSON: All right. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: So my next question is at the end 

of the case, when the judge -- after you hear all the 

evidence from both sides -- instructs you on the law -- 

And the judge will do that at the end of the case. He 

would give you instructions so that you know what to do 

with all the facts you heard. You decide the facts, and 

then you apply the law the Judge will give you at the end 

of the case. With me so far? 

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VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: And the Judge will instruct that 

HAMAS is a terrorist organization. The United States has 

so designated it. He would also instruct you on what 

material support means, and he would likely tell you that 

sending money to a terrorist organization with the intent 

to benefit that organization is material support. Okay? 

He may also tell you that even if some of that money that 

was sent over there went for humanitarian purposes -- in 

other words, to buy food or clothing or books, but that 

humanitarian assistance went to the benefit of a terrorist 

organization -- that that, too, is material support, and 

that is against the law. Do you understand? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: If the Judge gave you those 

instructions at the end of the case, would you be able to 

follow them? Do you have any problem with that concept? 

VENIRE PERSON: I think I could follow that. 

 MS. SHAPIRO: Great. Thank you. 

THE COURT: Ms. Hodge, we are in the process of 

talking with the members of the panel from which the jury 

will be selected that would hear this case. I expect that 

process to continue until tomorrow. So until you hear 

from us further, you should not discuss this case with 

anyone or allow anyone to discuss it with you, and also if 

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there are any media accounts about the case in the 

newspapers or on television or radio, you should not read 

or watch or listen to any of those media accounts. Thank 

you, ma'am. You may be excused. 

VENIRE PERSON: Thank you. 

THE COURT: Good afternoon, Ms. Brown. Counsel 

for the parties have some questions to ask you. 

MS. MORENO: Good afternoon, Ms. Brown. My name 

is Linda Moreno. First of all, thank you for waiting all 

day long. I have only a few questions for you based on 

the answers you gave in your questionnaire that you filled 

out a couple of weeks ago. We asked in the questionnaire 

if you had any opinions regarding the conflict between 

Israel and Palestine, and I believe you indicated that you 

might be partial to Israel because of its supported by the 

United States and its significance in the Bible? 

VENIRE PERSON: Right. 

MS. MORENO: Can you explain that? What is 

steering you to this support? 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, the Bible is the story -- 

especially the old Testament -- of Israel's place in the 

world, and that's primarily where the Bible mentions 

Israel, is in the old Testament. 

MS. MORENO: You also indicated that you might 

be partial to Israel because of its support by the United 

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States. You seemed to have two reasons. 

VENIRE PERSON: Israeli's support by the United 

States? 

MS. MORENO: Yes. 

VENIRE PERSON: United States has long supported 

Israel. I have always felt that was good. 

MS. MORENO: This is a case that involves the 

Holy Land Foundation, a charity. It's an American Muslim 

charity. Have you heard anything about it in the media? 

VENIRE PERSON: I think when it broke several 

years ago. That was in the newspaper, yes. So I read 

that. 

MS. MORENO: Do you recall any of the details? 

VENIRE PERSON: I pretty much skimmed it. I 

think there was some concern about it supporting terrorist 

activities. 

MS. MORENO: Yes, ma'am. So my question to you 

is -- And we're going to be talking about your feelings, 

your honest feelings. 

VENIRE PERSON: Right. 

MS. MORENO: So I'm asking you -- And we're all 

asking you to be open about them. There aren't any right 

or wrong answers, and no one is judging you here. 

VENIRE PERSON: Right. 

MS. MORENO: What these gentlemen are entitled 

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to and what the Court wants is to sit jurors in this case 

who can be absolutely fair and impartial. Okay? 

VENIRE PERSON: (Witness nods)

MS. MORENO: So my question to you is with 

respect to your opinions on Israel, you talked about being 

partial? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: In this case, the government 

alleges that this charity sent humanitarian aid over to 

the West Bank and Gaza to the occupied Palestinian 

territories. 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MS. MORENO: And they claim this humanitarian 

aid benefited the terrorist organization HAMAS. Now, do 

you have any thoughts on that? Any opinions on that? 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, I think the United States 

Government has to be pretty sure of itself to make such a 

claim. I'll say that. 

MS. MORENO: Can I take that to mean if this 

case has gotten this far where we're sitting here now 

picking a jury, do you think these guys are probably 

guilty? There is probably something to the government's 

case here? 

VENIRE PERSON: I think the wonderful thing 

about America is everyone is presumed innocent until they 

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are proven guilty. 

MS. MORENO: Okay. Let's talk about how you 

think of that presumption of innocence as you sit here 

today. If this case involves issues about Israel and 

Palestine -- And I expect they will. Based upon your 

answers in the questionnaire you already indicated you 

already have a partiality towards Israel, and I'm asking 

you is that a partiality that would carry you through this 

trial? 

VENIRE PERSON: I don't know that I could rid 

myself completely of that partiality, no.

MS. MORENO: I appreciate that. Now let's 

suppose in this case you were told you had to rid yourself 

of that partiality. You had to forget the things you read 

in the Bible and things you feel as an American. Could 

you do that honestly? 

VENIRE PERSON: It would be very hard. 

MS. MORENO: You just mentioned the presumption 

of innocence. And the law says these gentlemen expect and 

are entitled to every single juror presuming them innocent 

one hundred percent without hesitation, without 

partiality. 

VENIRE PERSON: Right. 

MS. MORENO: Can you promise this Court and 

these gentlemen that you could do that, given your ideas, 

CASSIDI L. CASEY, CSR, 214-354-3139

UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT

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religious beliefs and political opinion? 

VENIRE PERSON: I can't promise, no. 

MS. MORENO: So you couldn't afford these 

gentlemen the presumption of innocence. 

VENIRE PERSON: I would like to; I can't 

promise. 

THE COURT: Counsel for the government have 

questions of Ms. Brown? 

VENIRE PERSON: Hello. 

MR. JACKS: My name is Jim Jacks. I'm an 

Assistant United States Attorney for the Northern District 

of Texas. I'm one of the prosecutors in this case, and I 

will be representing the government. I just have a few 

questions for you as well. You mentioned that I guess in 

your views -- when pushed that you are somewhat partial to 

Israel in the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. Correct? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: Do you understand this trial is not 

about who's right and who is wrong and that's not an issue 

in this trial?

VENIRE PERSON: Yes.

MR. JACKS: As far as what you know about this 

case, is it strictly from what you may have heard either 

in a news story or a newspaper article? 

VENIRE PERSON: Newspapers. 

CASSIDI L. CASEY, CSR, 214-354-3139

UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT

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MR. JACKS: So anything that you say about the 

case is strictly what somebody else put into a newspaper 

article? 

VENIRE PERSON: That's correct. 

MR. JACKS: You haven't heard any evidence. Is 

that true? 

VENIRE PERSON: I have never seen anything or 

heard anything about it, except through the newspapers. 

MR. JACKS: All right. And those were 

allegations in the paper, correct? 

VENIRE PERSON: Somebody wrote what they thought 

was true. 

MR. JACKS: I believe you said that you believe 

in the presumption of innocence. Is that correct? 

VENIRE PERSON: Yes. 

MR. JACKS: That every person is presumed 

innocent unless and until they are proved guilty? 

VENIRE PERSON: I believe our legal system is 

based on that. 

MR. JACKS: And even though this case may be 

about material support for terrorism, would you apply that 

presumption of innocence even in this type of a case, even 

in this serious type of case? 

VENIRE PERSON: Well, I said I would like to. I 

can't promise I could. 

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MR. JACKS: Well, before you came in here and 

were questioned by defense counsel, did you feel like you 

were a fair and impartial juror? 

VENIRE PERSON: Not particularly, no. 

MR. JACKS: And in what sense did you feel like 

you would not be a fair and impartial juror? What was it 

that you thought would prevent you from being a fair and 

impartial juror? 

VENIRE PERSON: I think the papers. I think 

what I have read in the paper has influenced me, for one 

thing. 

MR. JACKS: Have you ever read anything in the 

paper that you later found out not to be true or you knew 

even when you read it that's not what happened? Have you 

ever experienced that? 

VENIRE PERSON: I'm sure I have. Yes. 

MR. JACKS: Would you be able to do that in this 

case? To disregard whatever some newspapers wrote and 

decide the case based on your front row seat to hear what 

the evidence is and what the facts are? 

VENIRE PERSON: I would try to. I would try to. 

MR. JACKS: Do you feel like you wouldn't be 

able to do that? You wouldn't have the discipline to do 

that or if you could maybe share with us if there is any 

doubt or hesitancy on your part? 

CASSIDI L. CASEY, CSR, 214-354-3139

UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT

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VENIRE PERSON: I would try to be objective. 

That's all I can say. 

MR. JACKS: Do you understand that you are not 

required to forget whatever you have learned? That's not 

a requirement to be a juror. 

VENIRE PERSON: Right. 

MR. JACKS: The $64,000 question I suppose is if 

you were chosen to be on this jury, could you listen to 

the evidence and weigh the evidence, be fair and impartial 

to both sides and follow the Court's instructions in terms 

of what the law is and be a fair and impartial juror. 

Could you do that? 

VENIRE PERSON: I would like to do that. I 

would try to do that. As I said before, I can't promise 

that that is the way it would be. 

MR. JACKS: Thank you, ma'am. 

THE COURT: Ms. Brown, we're in the process of 

talking with the members of panel from which the jury will 

be selected that would hear this case. That process will 

probably continue through a good part of tomorrow. So 

until you hear from us again, you should not discuss this 

case with anyone or allow anyone to discuss it with you, 

and if there are any media accounts about this trial in 

the newspapers or on television or on the radio, you 

should not read or watch or listen to any such media 

CASSIDI L. CASEY, CSR, 214-354-3139

UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT

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accounts. Thank you, ma'am. You may be excused. 

MS. MORENO: Your Honor, we move for cause 

against Ms. Brown. She cannot afford the presumption of 

innocence against these gentlemen. She indicated she can 

not be a fair and impartial juror. 

THE COURT: Mr. Jackson, do you have a position 

about that? 

MR. JACKS: No objection. 

THE COURT: I will excuse Ms. Brown for cause. 

Ladies and Gentlemen, due to the hour I think this will be 

our last person to see today. As in the two preceding 

days, I think we have made good progress today, but I'm 

still not satisfied that we have enough people, given the 

pendancy of these challenges for cause that I have taken 

under advisement as well as the persons who have expressed 

some hardship about serving in this case. So I think we 

need to continue to process for some period of time 

tomorrow. Perhaps all day depending on the progress we 

make. But certainly probably until noon. 

We had an issue left over from yesterday 

concerning joint representation of the defendants in this 

case, and Ms. Hollander and Mr. Cline asked overnight to 

discuss that, and I don't know how much time it will take 

to fully deal with that issue, but I would like to at 

least have a progress report if counsel have made any 

CASSIDI L. CASEY, CSR, 214-354-3139

UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT

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progress after overnight in how to handle this issue.

MR. CLINE: Your Honor, John Cline for Mr. 

Elashi. Is it all right if I speak from here? 

THE COURT: Yes. 

MR. CLINE: Your Honor, the question is whether 

Mr. Elashi is in a position to speak on behalf of the Holy 

Land Foundation on this issue of a potential conflict. 

Unfortunately, we don't know either of the current status 

of the Holy Land Foundation, whether it exists even as an 

entity or Mr. Elashi's status, if it does exist. And so 

although he has no personal objection to the joint 

representation, I'm afraid he cannot speak for the Holy 

Land Foundation at this point. 

THE COURT: Anyone else on the defense side who 

wants to be heard on this issue? Ms. Hollander. 

MS. HOLLANDER: Your Honor, I would just add 

that I would agree since it's my firm at issue here. I 

agree that's the position he takes, that there is no 

dispute on behalf of the Holy Land Foundation. 

THE COURT: I'm not sure I have really thought 

through the implications of that. We do have or at least 

I thought we had the Holy Land Foundation as a represented 

defendant in this case; that is, represented by counsel. 

But I'm inferring from what has been said that there is no 

natural person as the representative of the Holy Land 

CASSIDI L. CASEY, CSR, 214-354-3139

UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT

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Foundation who would be the client for the attorney who's 

representing the Holy Land Foundation. Am I understanding 

that correctly? 

MS. HOLLANDER: That is correct at this time, 

your Honor. 

THE COURT: Let me think about that issue a 

little more and see what I think about advising the 

defendants of joint representation. 

Another I guess housekeeping issue that I needed 

to discuss with you is, as I mentioned earlier today, we 

need to put a notice on the automated telephone system 

that the clerk's office uses for jury communications by 

three o'clock tomorrow afternoon as to what we're going to 

do on Friday. And I don't yet have a good idea of how 

much time we will need for a general voir dire session, 

and so I don't know at what hour to schedule it to 

commence on Friday. And also the actual method of 

exercising peremptory challenges, as I have discussed 

previously with counsel at our various status conferences, 

is not really familiar to me. I have never been through 

that before, and so I don't know how much time to 

anticipate that process will take. So I would like some 

guidance from counsel as to what our schedule for Friday 

should be. 

MR. WESTFALL: And I wanted to update you on an 

CASSIDI L. CASEY, CSR, 214-354-3139

UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT

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assignment. I have now spoken with the government over 

lunch, and we both agree in principal to this, and I will 

submit it to the Court in writing tomorrow. I can do it 

on a letter if that's okay. If that's not, I will file it 

ECF. 

THE COURT: Either way is fine with me. If a 

letter is easier for you given the fact that this is an 

overnight assignment, do what's easiest for you, but I 

probably will want to file whatever you submit among the 

records in the case. So it really doesn't matter to me 

what form it takes. 

MR. WESTFALL: Neither side can imagine there is 

going to be questions submitted to the Court to ask the 

panel. I think this has pretty much taken care of that 

for sure. So we're envisioning the Court's general voir 

dire that would be given in a criminal case without any 

additional questions by attorneys or any additional 

submitted questions by an attorney. Also an introduction 

of the parties and reading the witness list. I'm sure 

your general voir dire includes the role of the judge, 

judge of the law and the role of jury and matters like 

that that we haven't been explaining to them and then 

finally a stern admonishment about the media. The trial 

starts on Monday or I guess the Dallas Morning News thinks 

it's going to start on Monday, and we look forward to 

CASSIDI L. CASEY, CSR, 214-354-3139

UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT

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really ratcheting it up. I envision having that to you in 

the morning. 

THE COURT: Well, if that is the case, I would 

think -- Although we're dealing with a pretty large group 

for my courtroom, between fifty and sixty people, those 

kinds of things to be covered in my standard voir dire 

probably would not take more than thirty minutes to an 

hour, I would think. 

MR. WESTFALL: And I would think the actual 

exercise of the peremptory challenges would be an hour or 

less. 

THE COURT: Refresh my memory and you may not be 

the one to answer this so you can defer to your cocounsel 

if you need to. But does the panel need to be here while 

that process is done? 

MR. WESTFALL: The panel does not technically 

need to be here at all, your Honor. We just need to know 

where everyone is sitting on the panel, and then if the 

panel is not here, it would be quicker because we can 

stand up there at the desk. 

THE COURT: That's what I was wondering. It 

seemed to me it might expedite things if they were not. I 

didn't know whether they needed to be. 

MR. WESTFALL: That would make it quicker, but 

we need to know where everyone is sitting for sure. 

CASSIDI L. CASEY, CSR, 214-354-3139

UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT

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THE COURT: It sounds like it might be a good 

idea to start at nine o'clock Friday morning and do the 

general voir dire session however long that takes -- 

thirty minutes or an hour -- and send the people we have 

voir-dired in that session down to the jury assembly room 

on the first floor and do the peremptory challenges so 

that if we need to communicate with them -- yes, you are 

on the jury or no, you are not -- we can notify them when 

to be back. 

MR. WESTFALL: I think that's a very good idea. 

And they don't have to spend much time there. 

THE COURT: Well, I have been thinking as I go 

along. If anybody wants to correct me about any false 

assumptions, now is the time to do so. 

MR. JACKS: Judge, I think there is some 

sentiment on this side of the room that it would be 

helpful to have the jury panel in the courtroom and the 

parties making the strikes at the Bench because you talk 

to so many people and they run together. You try to make 

notes, but there is some benefit with being able to 

refresh your memory and being able to look out there and 

say, oh, yeah, that's this person. 

THE COURT: Well, I don't have any objection to 

that. And I didn't understand Mr. Westfall to be opposed 

to that. 

CASSIDI L. CASEY, CSR, 214-354-3139

UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT

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MS. HOLLANDER: Well, the problem is the clients 

have to have input, and that's a lot to be at the Bench. 

I have used the struck method for years, and that's not 

usually done. As the panel goes along, they get to make 

choices. 

THE COURT: It sounds like they have better 

notes than the government does. 

MS. HOLLANDER: I would agree with Mr. Jacks 

would like to have a little picture. 

MR. WESTFALL: Well, we will have an hour while 

you instruct them. 

THE COURT: Well, I guess we can leave that for 

the moment. I don't think I have to make a decision about 

that right now, and I may want to reflect on it some more 

before making a decision. 

Is there anything else that counsel want to 

raise while we're together? 

MS. MORENO: Yes, your Honor, if I may. Juror 

Number 67, who was the juror on the first day, July 16th, 

who was Number 6 on the list, Mr. Jacob Baccus, the Court 

recalls yesterday that he had indicated some information. 

I just wish to bring this to the Court's attention. 

Indeed, we believe Mr. Baccus's wife actually made home 

visits to the Elashi family and provided a lot of care for 

the Elashi's youngest son who does have Down's Syndrome. 

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UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT

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I wanted to confirm that. And that lasted quite a period 

of time. 

THE COURT: Thank you, ma'am. Go ahead. 

MR. JONAS: Yes, your Honor, just a follow-up on 

the issue of scheduling for next week. I have conferred 

with the government's witness. He can be here. He would 

be flying in Sunday night. So if the Court wishes to 

start the Daubert hearing Monday morning, we can do that. 

THE COURT: That would give me greater comfort I 

think just in case this hearing takes longer than you now 

expect. That would give us some additional cushion that 

day.

MR. JONAS: Another matter we're going to have a 

conference on, if the Court recalls the government sent a 

letter to the Court regarding the defense request for over 

a thousand declassification and we requested a CIPA 

conference, and Mr. Dratel sent a letter stating the 

defendant cannot reevaluate or reevaluate their list. We 

will be sending a letter tonight or first thing in the 

morning basically stating our desire for a Section 2 

pretrial conference. So maybe we can do that Monday after 

as well. 

THE COURT: Perhaps, depending on how much time 

we have. Thank you. Ladies and Gentlemen, we'll be in 

recess until nine o'clock tomorrow morning. 

CASSIDI L. CASEY, CSR, 214-354-3139

UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT

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C E R T I F I C A T I O N

I, Cassidi L. Casey, certify that during the 

proceedings of the foregoing-styled and -numbered cause, I 

was the official reporter and took in stenotypy such 

proceedings and have transcribed the same as shown by the 

above and foregoing Pages 567 through 829 and that said 

transcript is true and correct.

I further certify that the transcript fees and format 

comply with those prescribed by the court and the Judicial 

Conference of the United States.

s/Cassidi L. Casey

______________________________

CASSIDI L. CASEY

UNITED STATES DISTRICT REPORTER

NORTHERN DISTRICT OF TEXAS

DALLAS DIVISION

CASSIDI L. CASEY, CSR, 214-354-3139

UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT

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< A >

Abdulqader 2:22

Abelar 106:9, 112:15, 113:3, 

114:7

abide 18:25

ability 11:11, 16:7, 68:25, 

85:22, 113:9, 130:24, 192:23

able 11:25, 12:11, 13:24, 

17:23, 18:12, 32:19, 33:9, 

43:11, 43:17, 62:25, 64:20, 

66:9, 69:14, 71:18, 86:6, 

89:6, 89:10, 110:10, 115:1, 

115:7, 135:4, 135:16, 153:15, 

155:25, 166:13, 166:16, 

184:14, 185:7, 185:15, 

205:22, 206:14, 227:5, 

247:16, 254:17, 254:23, 

261:20, 261:21

above 265:7

abroad 184:19

absolutely 129:3, 206:14, 

250:2

Abu 2:1

abuse 22:6

Academy 159:15

accept 11:25, 12:12, 110:10, 

135:4, 135:16, 166:13, 

166:17, 177:2, 199:19

accepted 109:4

accepting 134:21, 175:6

access 67:23

accident 173:9, 173:15

account 188:13

accountant 187:7

accredited 133:16

accurate 6:3, 88:25

accused 71:25, 74:16, 

74:17, 160:20, 160:24, 166:3, 

170:22, 187:2, 235:1, 240:19, 

243:11

Ace 128:13, 132:14

acoustics 195:14

acquaintances 105:4

acquire 220:22

across 119:21, 229:6

action 117:16

actions 237:17

active 123:8, 144:21, 215:18, 

215:20

activities 123:16, 124:5, 

145:17, 180:19, 249:16

activity 187:8, 222:7

acts 223:19

actual 36:2, 258:17, 260:9

Actually 11:13, 13:2, 13:4, 

20:17, 39:15, 45:21, 48:9, 

48:17, 72:1, 77:15, 114:2, 

117:15, 120:11, 128:7, 

187:16, 187:25, 212:16, 

223:2, 226:12, 232:1, 233:5, 

262:23

ad 134:10

Ada 77:9

add 102:13, 257:16

added 32:3

Addison 52:6

addition 113:7

additional 134:7, 183:12, 

259:17, 259:17, 263:11

Additionally 66:14

adjourn 61:24

adjustment 122:3

administrator 4:15, 114:22, 

218:11, 239:5

admits 12:10

admitted 11:25

admonish 201:15

admonishment 259:23

adolescents 210:13

adopt 221:22

adult 40:1

advisement 67:9, 114:7, 

142:10, 256:15

advising 258:7

affairs 121:3

affect 11:10, 59:11, 110:16, 

110:23, 111:3, 113:5, 113:9, 

113:9, 113:15, 129:1, 129:2, 

129:5, 130:24, 171:20, 

192:23, 243:25

affected 182:4, 182:4

affecting 241:22

affiliated 64:13

afford 66:21, 174:15, 182:21, 

186:9, 206:4, 252:3, 256:3

afforded 48:15, 49:14, 

206:12

affording 174:21, 243:16

afraid 85:23, 88:24, 89:1, 

89:3, 89:13, 89:14, 204:18, 

204:21, 257:12

Again 14:6, 33:16, 49:13, 

54:22, 92:8, 107:10, 112:2, 

142:2, 150:5, 178:16, 186:1, 

194:12, 195:5, 198:21, 

200:13, 201:16, 213:3, 

255:21

against 13:14, 24:5, 32:19, 

33:8, 59:15, 64:14, 73:16, 

149:14, 149:19, 177:10, 

178:24, 179:7, 182:9, 185:6, 

186:8, 199:4, 217:12, 223:13, 

223:17, 247:13, 256:3, 256:4

age 41:9, 88:10, 130:16, 

140:12

ago 5:7, 22:22, 25:16, 34:9, 

42:3, 44:23, 47:25, 55:10, 

63:10, 80:2, 82:21, 99:16, 

116:12, 127:2, 127:14, 

133:10, 136:10, 136:20, 

139:25, 158:9, 158:18, 

174:11, 193:11, 193:15, 

196:9, 209:10, 214:13, 227:1, 

235:10, 248:12, 249:11

agree 18:2, 32:24, 85:11, 

169:12, 217:8, 230:10, 

257:17, 257:18, 259:2, 262:8

agreement 169:10

ahead 28:25, 47:5, 263:3

aid 13:16, 24:4, 40:10, 85:6, 

102:21, 130:3, 130:4, 130:6, 

130:6, 137:11, 160:2, 197:8, 

197:9, 197:14, 199:12, 200:1, 

200:24, 203:5, 203:7, 203:9, 

203:10, 243:1, 243:1, 243:4, 

250:9, 250:14

Air 45:9, 45:13

Airlines 26:17

airplanes 40:21

airport 27:10, 30:2

AL 1:13

albeit 201:14

Albuquerque 2:9

alert 57:11, 84:4, 115:10

Ali 242:23

alimony 125:2

allegation 19:3, 93:20, 

246:10

allegations 14:22, 25:6, 

34:3, 70:1, 79:23, 85:4, 
116:5, 135:10, 144:16, 

150:21, 160:1, 180:18, 

181:17, 197:6, 197:6, 198:5, 

200:20, 201:1, 201:2, 203:4, 

204:12, 210:22, 210:23, 

211:14, 224:15, 233:10, 

243:15, 246:5, 246:11, 

253:10

alleged 13:4, 42:10, 102:21

alleges 13:5, 45:1, 130:1, 

130:6, 142:24, 200:22, 203:4, 

203:9, 242:25, 250:9

alleging 44:11, 120:12, 

167:18, 210:24

Allen 148:5

allow 14:7, 24:15, 33:17, 

44:1, 54:23, 65:5, 78:23, 

82:5, 91:1, 91:2, 92:9, 102:6, 

112:20, 126:17, 135:24, 

142:3, 150:6, 157:17, 167:5, 

177:20, 186:2, 194:13, 

200:14, 212:2, 224:1, 234:11, 

240:7, 247:25, 255:22

allowed 90:24, 162:19

Almost 29:13, 49:18

alone 101:14

along 4:4, 41:11, 86:11, 

105:7, 113:25, 153:12, 

261:13, 262:4

already 65:19, 141:21, 

203:19, 251:6, 251:7

Also 7:23, 11:18, 16:4, 

37:11, 43:2, 54:7, 64:10, 

82:23, 99:25, 100:19, 104:1, 

113:7, 131:17, 149:13, 

176:23, 196:4, 231:18, 

231:21, 247:4, 247:8, 247:25, 

248:24, 258:17, 259:18

alternates 114:18

Although 257:11, 260:4

Always 8:15, 19:16, 36:8, 

47:12, 53:5, 53:7, 122:18, 

173:18, 190:1, 209:24, 

221:24, 227:15, 232:7, 249:6

Am 5:16, 14:16, 24:25, 

28:22, 29:12, 37:14, 37:19, 

55:8, 67:8, 79:20, 82:24, 

83:21, 84:21, 86:3, 86:4, 

91:12, 99:22, 114:6, 127:1, 

136:9, 146:24, 154:1, 158:5, 

190:20, 198:13, 201:7, 

214:18, 222:4, 238:9, 258:2

Amalgamated 139:12

amazingly 152:5

ambivalent 236:1

Amendment 182:22, 186:9

America 1:7, 60:22, 75:10, 

102:19, 124:13, 124:15, 

250:25

American 7:25, 8:10, 25:7, 

26:17, 26:20, 26:21, 35:7, 

44:24, 48:18, 49:7, 55:13, 

59:3, 85:5, 93:21, 127:4, 

131:6, 131:17, 131:21, 

136:12, 137:9, 142:24, 

158:12, 167:16, 190:5, 

196:19, 202:3, 216:12, 

224:15, 234:25, 249:8, 

251:15

among 110:3, 259:9

amount 92:24, 152:12

annual 41:21, 226:11

Another 14:5, 20:11, 24:13, 

87:9, 105:20, 128:17, 147:11, 

175:1, 189:1, 217:4, 258:9, 

263:13

answer 4:14, 48:24, 59:20, 

62:9, 66:25, 67:2, 80:9, 81:6, 

85:20, 86:6, 89:7, 113:15, 

175:6, 188:23, 196:15, 

196:15, 203:24, 203:24, 

207:6, 260:13

answered 20:24, 48:17, 

151:10, 174:16

answers 58:10, 67:5, 82:20, 

85:19, 99:6, 137:2, 161:13, 

178:21, 181:10, 185:16, 

194:25, 202:1, 248:11, 

249:23, 251:6

anticipate 23:21, 42:25, 

43:2, 129:14, 258:22

anticipation 129:23

anxiety 89:9, 89:17, 92:24

anxious 89:15, 89:16

anybody 48:1, 56:5, 57:1, 

97:6, 125:18, 129:3, 145:13, 

160:24, 162:19, 224:25, 

236:3, 243:11, 261:13

anymore 18:6, 25:10, 34:18, 

100:24, 101:3, 134:17, 

144:13

anywhere 52:3, 67:1

apart 50:11

apologize 65:25, 133:20, 

193:18, 205:10, 245:10

apparently 4:19, 196:5

appear 89:2

appears 133:24

applied 41:23, 135:19, 

140:24, 176:21

applies 223:4

apply 42:22, 73:15, 91:24, 

114:1, 211:9, 233:16, 238:17, 

246:24, 253:21

appointment 210:14, 

210:14, 210:14

appreciate 8:18, 59:7, 68:14, 

86:20, 251:12

appreciative 121:14

apprehension 198:20, 

204:19

apprehensions 181:5, 

182:5, 205:12, 206:3

apprehensive 205:14, 

205:15

approach 65:8

approaches 67:1

appropriate 153:11

Approximately 89:24, 

220:15

April 60:18, 60:20

Arab 8:4, 28:4, 145:7

Arabic 11:23, 72:6, 84:14, 

138:2, 138:15, 138:18, 

145:14, 145:17, 162:1, 191:8, 

215:8, 242:7

Arabs 28:12, 48:3, 145:22, 

191:1, 191:7

Area 21:7, 25:17, 30:22, 

36:4, 39:18, 51:2, 63:6, 63:7, 

76:5, 87:25, 88:2, 105:15, 

117:22, 121:18, 128:19, 

133:5, 134:12, 138:4, 148:16, 

154:18, 168:2, 172:23, 221:4, 

230:24, 231:6, 231:9, 231:12

areas 120:17

aren't 58:1, 58:10, 151:15, 

161:12, 225:23, 249:22

Arlington 31:9, 61:19

army 120:20, 120:23, 123:3, 
227:21

around 55:23, 68:13, 94:23, 

97:1, 133:5, 143:17, 147:14, 

167:23, 170:18, 172:3, 

186:25, 195:4, 203:6, 216:22, 

223:1, 231:5, 239:22

arrangements 97:10, 97:14, 

184:15

arrested 77:14, 125:18, 

126:1

arrests 25:14, 25:16

arrived 213:7, 224:25

arriving 145:24

Art 46:7, 46:12, 46:14, 54:4

article 252:24, 253:3

articles 108:11

Arts 46:4, 46:11, 154:23

aside 47:13, 58:23, 60:2, 

66:18, 81:5, 112:6, 113:22

asked 4:6, 7:8, 52:8, 57:14, 

64:4, 66:11, 66:15, 67:20, 

80:10, 86:5, 89:6, 96:7, 

99:18, 105:14, 107:6, 107:7, 

107:8, 108:4, 166:5, 171:24, 

181:19, 185:1, 238:9, 248:12, 

256:22

asking 66:18, 108:1, 129:6, 

161:6, 204:23, 207:11, 

231:14, 249:21, 249:22, 

251:7

asleep 16:5

aspect 11:15, 11:16, 12:3, 

12:25, 19:18, 24:6, 43:7, 

149:21, 149:21

aspects 125:24

assembly 261:5

assigned 30:12, 128:22

assignment 259:1, 259:8

assistance 32:17, 33:6, 

33:7, 247:11

Assistant 1:30, 20:4, 38:18, 

50:3, 60:11, 72:20, 75:2, 

87:2, 121:8, 146:5, 154:12, 

172:10, 208:2, 218:19, 230:4, 

252:11

assisted 126:7

associate 221:14, 221:15

associated 44:12, 116:6, 

200:2

associates 105:4

assumptions 261:14

assurance 240:25

assurances 66:19

assure 59:9, 59:10, 59:10, 

59:13, 85:22

asthma 243:23

attend 23:2, 40:24, 61:14, 

78:8, 122:11, 176:8

attendants 27:9

attendee 124:7

attention 38:7, 83:5, 83:12, 

90:15, 90:17, 90:20, 107:12, 

113:23, 113:24, 119:3, 136:2, 

150:9, 157:20, 160:9, 160:11, 

171:12, 191:15, 197:24, 

222:25, 240:22, 262:22

Attorney 1:30, 20:5, 38:18, 

50:4, 60:11, 75:3, 87:2, 

121:8, 146:5, 154:12, 154:13, 

172:10, 178:5, 186:12, 

218:20, 230:4, 252:11, 258:1, 

259:18

Attorneys 5:5, 53:24, 55:8, 

126:25, 136:8, 158:5, 186:24, 

201:25, 208:3, 259:17

attune 27:8

audit 226:10, 226:11

auditing 226:1

auditor 227:10

audits 226:16, 226:20

August 139:21, 139:22, 

141:15, 141:15

aunt 96:24, 97:3, 97:7, 

97:11, 101:5

Auto 83:14, 87:7

automated 114:22, 258:11

Avenue 2:27, 2:45

avoid 237:6

aware 37:14, 37:19, 42:14, 

42:16, 62:21, 180:4, 216:14

away 4:12, 10:18, 104:15, 

125:7, 161:1, 227:24

< B >

B. 98:4

babies 143:24, 197:10

babysitting 165:14

Baccus 262:20, 262:23

bachelor 46:3

Back 8:16, 8:23, 15:20, 

27:18, 40:2, 40:3, 44:18, 

69:14, 101:21, 111:1, 115:9, 

118:4, 121:18, 122:25, 123:1, 

132:25, 133:6, 144:12, 

155:21, 155:21, 170:8, 

175:23, 181:18, 182:7, 190:2, 

196:25, 209:17, 209:18, 

210:6, 210:7, 214:24, 226:24, 

227:16, 235:9, 245:13, 261:9

back-up 16:1

background 30:3, 52:25, 

71:8

backpacks 32:17, 43:7, 

64:17

backs 13:17

Bad 16:12, 28:11, 39:21, 

48:2, 60:2, 72:10, 97:21, 

105:17, 109:23, 140:25, 

145:21, 163:24, 198:3, 200:3, 

215:10, 242:12

baggage 7:12, 198:6, 204:4

Bailey 14:10, 14:14, 20:2, 

20:4, 24:10

Baker 2:1

bakeries 243:3

ball 72:18

banging 119:12

Bank 56:20, 60:16, 60:17, 

60:22, 60:23, 60:24, 61:3, 

61:3, 61:8, 61:10, 61:16, 

130:3, 144:9, 197:11, 203:5, 

203:6, 226:5, 246:14, 250:10

banker 56:19, 178:14

banking 60:18

Baptist 123:22

baptized 221:25

bar 7:17, 50:22, 51:11, 

178:7, 178:16

Barry 1:27, 99:3, 132:8, 

140:9, 164:15, 192:6

bars 94:12, 94:13, 175:14

base 48:12, 117:20, 187:16, 

210:23

baseball 31:22

Based 15:6, 25:19, 29:4, 

70:8, 78:11, 111:22, 111:24, 

113:3, 151:5, 153:16, 188:14, 

190:7, 190:13, 201:16, 

202:24, 213:2, 213:6, 213:9, 
213:12, 224:18, 235:16, 

238:1, 248:10, 251:5, 253:19, 

254:19

basic 72:18, 81:4

Basically 15:24, 26:24, 

51:12, 91:23, 104:5, 113:5, 

133:16, 165:14, 176:15, 

196:3, 218:1, 235:4, 239:17, 

263:20

basics 159:22

basis 80:3, 216:20, 235:24

basketball 95:3, 95:19

BBC 47:11

BEA 40:15, 40:17, 41:18

became 7:17, 36:12, 62:24

become 7:18, 18:11, 41:16

bedridden 147:3

beginning 210:3

behalf 78:9, 186:7, 257:6, 

257:19

behind 170:25, 171:2, 

175:14

belief 109:15, 113:6

beliefs 162:25, 164:6, 252:1

believes 53:6

bell 34:14, 151:1

bells 15:1, 25:10, 25:11, 

34:7, 94:4, 224:20

Bench 91:22, 261:18, 262:2

benefit 11:14, 24:1, 43:5, 

54:12, 149:15, 199:15, 

223:16, 233:25, 246:7, 

246:15, 247:7, 247:11, 

261:20

benefited 33:7, 130:7, 160:5, 

197:15, 203:10, 243:4, 243:9, 

250:14

Besides 72:12, 95:2, 103:24, 

134:6, 215:25

best 31:4, 154:2, 195:14, 

225:19

bet 171:1, 216:8

better 105:24, 107:11, 

107:11, 262:6

beyond 25:17, 43:17, 73:25, 

74:7, 156:11, 156:25, 161:2, 

161:3, 191:23, 223:20, 244:4, 

244:7, 244:10

beyond-a-reasonable-doubt

74:2

bias 120:18

Bible 248:16, 248:20, 

248:22, 251:15

bidding 217:19, 220:11

big 31:13, 36:15, 51:25, 

57:21, 122:3, 124:10, 170:13, 

189:20, 195:13, 205:2, 

210:19, 222:15

bigger 80:3

bilingual 12:14

bill 9:4, 9:4, 9:4

bills 83:21

Binghamton 40:6

binoculars 70:12, 70:14, 

71:18

bit 6:21, 15:3, 15:9, 21:10, 

34:19, 39:8, 55:6, 58:7, 

79:20, 88:14, 91:18, 118:10, 

148:23, 180:11, 188:11, 

191:10, 195:4, 196:12, 

224:21, 234:21, 246:3

bitty 177:25

Black 105:17, 120:6

Blind 70:15, 96:25, 101:6, 

101:8

Blonde 6:13

blue 6:13

blurb 188:11

board 27:2

Boeing 40:20

bomb 64:24

book 47:16, 47:18

Books 13:16, 24:3, 32:17, 

47:14, 64:17, 130:5, 130:5, 

149:18, 160:3, 197:9, 203:8, 

211:17, 233:24, 243:2, 

247:10

Boozer 24:20, 24:23, 30:10, 

33:12

Border 45:16, 45:19, 45:21, 

53:3

born 39:7, 39:12, 39:19, 

63:8, 88:7, 88:9, 174:8, 

244:23

bother 32:22, 181:24

bought 69:10

Boulevard 106:20

BOX 2:36, 94:14

Boy 121:4

BOYD 2:6

boys 87:22

Branch 75:16

bread 64:23, 243:3

break 68:15, 194:1, 194:3, 

243:22

breaking 9:5

breaks 128:3

brief 87:5, 106:2, 203:14

Briefly 103:5, 125:14, 

133:20, 135:9, 140:8, 140:22, 

166:1, 207:23

bring 20:19, 58:9, 110:20, 

262:22

bringing 136:16

brings 137:20, 198:19, 

198:25

brochures 196:2

broke 249:10

broken 6:16, 13:22

brother 73:7, 77:2, 100:1, 

100:10, 148:6, 148:18, 

170:13

brothers 165:15

brought 45:23, 141:8, 

144:10, 231:14

Brown 187:21, 248:6, 248:8, 

252:8, 255:17, 256:3, 256:9

build 40:21

Building 171:6, 219:25, 

233:8

Bulk 36:20, 227:8

bunch 51:19

Buonasera 201:19, 201:21, 

207:20, 207:22, 207:24, 

207:25, 211:22

burden 63:2, 67:4, 114:1, 

244:3, 244:4

Burma 219:3

burning 17:17

bus 138:3, 139:1, 140:24

business 15:24, 31:17, 

51:23, 79:9, 79:12, 81:13, 

96:17, 103:16, 107:13, 

118:25, 138:1, 164:21, 

171:18, 193:11, 208:15, 

208:18, 215:21, 215:22, 

215:24, 216:1, 216:2, 216:3, 

216:4, 216:5, 219:15, 222:9, 

238:14, 238:24, 238:24, 

239:2, 239:17, 239:19
bussed 66:8

busy 7:18, 55:21, 179:22, 

216:8, 216:10

buy 247:10

< C >

Cabrera 67:16, 67:20, 67:22, 

68:1

Cadeddu 2:25, 2:26, 17:2

cafeteria 143:11, 143:16

California 79:12, 88:6, 88:8, 

88:12, 225:23, 225:24

call 27:7, 114:24, 134:11, 

169:9, 198:6, 236:17

called 13:7, 37:1, 53:18, 

88:18, 128:18, 136:13, 166:2, 

197:15, 203:11, 209:5, 211:3, 

211:4, 214:1, 226:8, 226:12, 

233:4, 233:23, 243:5

calls 71:16

campaign 41:21

cancer 5:18

candor 182:11

capacity 122:18, 146:21

car 80:20, 81:1, 87:12, 

190:8, 190:9

Care 5:17, 10:10, 10:12, 

30:21, 56:4, 56:13, 56:16, 

61:20, 68:25, 96:24, 128:18, 

128:19, 140:15, 147:2, 

147:14, 147:14, 147:17, 

184:5, 184:10, 259:14, 

262:24

career 29:11, 226:23, 

227:18, 227:20

Caring 19:12, 68:21

Carolina 154:20

carrier 36:13, 122:19, 122:21

Carrillo 194:22, 200:7, 200:9

carry 251:8

cases 9:3, 26:22, 225:22, 

226:13

CASEY 3:1, 265:3, 265:17

cash 226:6

cashier 128:12, 129:18

CASSIDI 3:1, 265:3, 265:17

casualties 181:25

category 198:11, 237:18

cater 37:5

caught 196:24

cause 58:8, 66:2, 66:14, 

66:24, 67:2, 67:9, 82:13, 

83:18, 85:13, 92:15, 93:1, 

93:3, 93:6, 96:13, 100:16, 

106:5, 113:3, 113:14, 114:7, 

114:13, 130:15, 158:1, 186:8, 

186:18, 190:18, 237:14, 

239:13, 241:17, 243:19, 

256:2, 256:9, 256:14, 265:4

caused 88:11

causes 137:6, 137:20, 

195:18, 198:20, 203:16

caution 4:6

Cedar 159:19

Center 36:21

Central 53:13, 106:15

Cereal 94:11, 94:13, 94:17

certain 6:8, 18:11, 26:22, 

26:24, 59:15, 81:3, 85:20, 

95:12, 116:6, 125:24, 149:3, 

162:9, 195:11

certainly 92:22, 153:13, 

238:25, 256:19

certify 265:3, 265:10

challenge 66:3, 66:24, 67:9, 

82:8, 92:15, 93:1, 93:3, 

113:13, 114:7

challenges 114:13, 256:14, 

258:18, 260:10, 261:6

chance 156:4

chances 103:12, 133:2

change 105:22, 133:19, 

163:1, 163:5, 173:5, 182:25, 

228:24, 228:25

changed 133:18

changes 80:19

changing 141:16

Channel 57:23, 57:24, 58:2, 

106:2, 109:8, 109:12, 143:9, 

236:16

char 73:15

charge 19:4, 28:19, 45:3, 

53:13, 63:23, 88:15, 100:1, 

107:16, 149:2, 166:14, 

199:20, 245:11

charged 74:5, 74:15, 77:16, 

120:9, 138:15, 237:20, 238:6, 

242:10

charges 13:3, 32:5, 42:10, 

66:17, 77:19, 85:9, 85:10, 

126:8, 130:1, 130:12, 130:23, 

137:15, 148:24, 160:16, 

161:7, 161:8, 176:15, 176:15, 

180:5, 180:23, 181:23, 182:3, 

182:6, 196:13, 198:7, 198:18, 

198:25, 199:3, 200:21, 

203:14, 203:14, 203:20, 

210:22, 223:5, 243:14, 244:8, 

246:4

charitable 24:2, 54:10, 

64:16, 72:23, 149:17, 166:13, 

176:25, 177:5, 211:17

charities 216:11, 216:12, 

216:19, 216:19

check 30:3, 67:22, 71:8

checked 99:19, 134:20

checks 196:2

chemical 20:14, 20:18

chemicals 20:20

Chicken 146:15

child 10:10, 22:6, 66:10, 

68:19, 68:21, 68:25, 72:13, 

124:23, 125:2, 140:15, 

170:19, 184:5, 184:10

children 13:17, 30:24, 32:18, 

38:2, 39:4, 39:7, 39:12, 

40:24, 42:1, 87:21, 143:18, 

147:19, 173:21, 184:1, 

208:19, 210:2, 219:14, 245:3

choices 262:5

choir 124:5

choose 155:12

chosen 62:1, 62:24, 140:14, 

255:8

Christian 37:11, 41:14, 

159:15, 221:24

Christmas 37:17

Church 72:25, 73:1, 105:1, 

120:25, 123:18, 123:20, 

123:22, 124:2, 124:8, 124:10, 

144:21, 170:5, 179:25, 

215:16, 215:19, 216:25, 

221:19, 222:8, 222:11, 

222:12

CIPA 263:16

circumstances 103:17, 

108:24

Citizen 9:6, 48:22, 48:23, 

49:7, 74:16, 144:9
Citizens 48:14, 49:1, 49:15, 

60:23, 61:9, 174:13, 174:21

citizenship 48:18, 220:23, 

221:1

City 122:21, 122:22, 148:3, 

152:21, 154:21, 174:6, 

213:20, 213:24, 214:1, 

231:18, 236:18

civil 21:23, 21:25, 121:3, 

124:23, 133:25, 134:1

Civilian 26:16

claim 250:13, 250:18

claims 58:5, 137:10, 160:1, 

197:7

class 31:25

classes 37:6

clean 128:23, 220:1

cleaning 171:6

clear 92:16, 92:23, 179:4, 

186:11

clearance 29:23, 30:1, 30:4, 

36:5, 71:3, 227:17, 227:22, 

228:8

Clearly 66:4, 92:17

clerk 10:22, 20:12, 57:12, 

114:21, 152:14, 171:21, 

258:12

client 258:1

clients 162:14, 163:19, 

210:5, 262:1

Cliff 37:6, 143:14, 242:3

CLINE 256:22, 257:2, 257:2, 

257:5

clipping 106:1

clippings 109:7

clock 147:14

Close 7:5, 7:7, 7:7, 7:9, 27:3, 

78:5, 100:10, 153:1, 153:5, 

153:5, 155:7, 175:12, 176:3, 

215:1, 215:1, 215:5

closed 146:19

closely 47:10, 104:10, 

228:11, 237:5

closes 56:13, 61:21

clothes 160:3

clothing 24:3, 32:17, 43:6, 

54:10, 54:11, 64:16, 149:17, 

177:1, 223:15, 247:10

Club 50:22, 51:8, 52:17

coach 72:21

coated 70:22

coating 71:17

Cocaine 78:3, 78:4

cockpits 40:21

cocounsel 260:13

code 70:12, 70:14

coding 70:11

cold 35:21, 144:13, 144:14, 

231:16

collectively 211:9, 233:16

College 122:8, 122:11, 

122:12, 138:5, 159:18

colleges 210:16

color 7:14, 59:11, 245:25

combat 121:18

comes 46:23, 156:8, 198:3

comfort 263:9

comfortable 12:16, 12:18, 

19:13

coming 132:21, 132:22, 

142:18, 152:8, 205:18, 

218:13, 238:3

commence 258:17

Commerce 1:34, 3:2, 8:22

commit 206:14

committee 41:24

communicate 86:5, 90:11, 

115:8, 261:7

communicated 114:24, 

176:4

communicating 90:13

communications 258:12

community 117:21, 124:6, 

144:23, 170:4, 222:16

commute 56:9

companies 51:19, 210:25

company 29:14, 41:19, 

51:17, 51:21, 51:22, 51:25, 

75:12, 83:22, 101:1, 117:7, 

117:11, 128:18, 129:14, 

165:2, 183:19, 183:20, 

219:25, 220:20, 236:20

compared 105:16

complained 4:17

complete 123:12

Completely 6:14, 9:23, 

251:11

complexity 81:1

complicated 225:25

comply 27:2, 265:11

computer 67:24, 79:10

computers 148:13, 236:23

Comstock 169:22

concept 42:23, 247:17

Concern 58:8, 67:17, 85:13, 

86:1, 89:9, 111:5, 111:10, 

112:11, 130:16, 137:6, 

137:20, 174:17, 189:20, 

190:19, 193:24, 203:16, 

204:19, 243:20, 249:15

concerned 85:23, 115:6, 

241:21

concerning 256:21

concerns 58:22, 89:4, 

112:11, 113:7, 130:24, 161:8, 

181:4, 181:13, 182:5, 192:20, 

196:6

conclusion 145:23, 213:7

conclusions 191:17

condition 127:19, 193:20, 

193:23, 227:11, 227:12, 

227:14

conditions 196:5

conducive 50:11

Conference 263:14, 263:17, 

263:21, 263:25, 265:12

conferences 258:19

conferred 263:5

confirm 263:1

conflict 47:9, 104:9, 108:2, 

108:5, 109:1, 109:3, 112:1, 

112:3, 169:6, 191:13, 197:21, 

228:11, 237:5, 248:13, 

252:16, 257:7

conflicts 76:13, 105:10

confused 61:7, 99:20

confusing 222:4

Congratulations 196:10

connected 41:17

consequences 176:13

consider 12:21, 13:16, 

32:16, 102:12, 131:15, 

134:24, 135:3, 135:17, 142:9, 

166:12, 211:16

consideration 153:15, 

174:15, 190:12, 239:20

considerations 142:10

considered 24:2, 64:15, 

149:16

considering 58:13, 129:8, 
132:24, 133:1, 190:4

consisted 117:8

Constitution 156:23, 160:24, 

185:4, 185:14

Constitutional 48:15, 

182:21, 186:10

construction 140:18, 

140:20, 140:23

consulting 187:19

contact 125:13, 175:12, 

187:10

contacts 215:4, 215:5

contains 20:11, 63:20

context 135:7

continue 92:7, 126:15, 

150:4, 194:11, 211:25, 

223:24, 234:9, 240:5, 247:23, 

255:20, 256:17

contract 220:11, 220:14

contribution 43:4, 223:12

control 127:25

conversation 185:2

conversations 131:4, 

131:23, 180:17, 180:21

convicted 22:21, 77:22, 

176:6, 235:23, 245:11

conviction 236:1

convoy 117:9, 117:23

cook 146:22

coordinate 124:3

copies 54:2

Coppell 128:13

Cops 74:11

copy 91:25, 92:1

corporate 51:23

Correct 10:25, 41:15, 43:10, 

63:12, 84:23, 88:21, 88:22, 

99:9, 182:22, 208:11, 208:12, 

214:6, 216:24, 220:3, 221:20, 

225:16, 245:1, 252:16, 253:4, 

253:10, 253:14, 258:4, 

261:13, 265:8

correctable 151:15

correctly 62:6, 66:7, 90:9, 

239:7, 258:3

Cosmetology 162:4, 163:21, 

165:7

council 123:17, 123:25

counseling 121:19, 121:22, 

210:16

counselor 209:12, 209:20, 

209:21

counselors 210:19

countries 17:14, 49:19, 

215:8

country 17:8, 17:16, 18:13, 

21:10, 27:23, 48:20, 49:13, 

53:5, 109:23, 116:13, 181:16, 

181:25, 229:15, 229:16, 

243:11

County 30:23, 60:24, 77:11, 

77:24, 77:25, 90:5

couple 4:4, 5:7, 7:22, 25:15, 

32:3, 46:2, 79:5, 82:20, 

107:19, 113:17, 113:22, 

127:8, 133:5, 133:9, 133:12, 

140:11, 158:8, 174:12, 

196:25, 201:25, 225:11, 

230:6, 230:7, 244:21, 248:12

course 12:23, 111:6, 129:2, 

232:11

Courthouse 1:33, 56:11, 

76:10, 90:5

courtroom 4:9, 62:14, 80:16, 

195:14, 260:5, 261:17

cousin 6:25, 7:9, 7:13, 23:11

cousins 175:14, 175:25

cover 67:14, 162:10, 162:16, 

163:8, 163:16, 164:2, 164:5, 

241:20

covered 114:20, 162:21, 

162:21, 260:6

covering 138:13

coworker 215:12

crater 217:20

cratoring 218:4

crawl 130:17

create 103:20

credible 134:24, 134:25, 

135:1

crew 27:9, 151:18, 151:19, 

151:22, 152:1, 152:9

crime 73:15, 160:20, 160:24, 

243:12

criminal 21:23, 23:5, 23:12, 

31:16, 62:14, 62:18, 62:19, 

73:14, 78:13, 79:19, 93:14, 

94:3, 100:13, 115:20, 125:20, 

133:25, 160:19, 170:22, 

176:11, 190:5, 232:21, 

237:22, 245:21, 259:16

crisis 210:16

critical 131:21, 131:22

cross 48:24

crossed 189:14, 196:5, 

227:13

crossing 45:20, 45:22

Crowley 22:9, 233:8

cruise 15:12, 21:20, 65:21, 

69:5, 69:13, 76:14, 76:17

CSR 3:1

Cub 121:4

cultural 229:19

cups 241:6, 241:10

curator 153:23

curious 105:14

current 116:25, 122:24, 

132:13, 257:8

Currently 61:9, 99:20, 121:2, 

121:21, 128:7

cushion 263:11

custodian 173:19

custody 10:5, 68:22

custom 162:19

customers 10:24, 187:19, 

190:25

Customs 45:14, 45:16, 53:3, 

53:9

cut 162:11, 163:8, 238:14

cute 143:25

CUTRER 2:43

cyclic 140:25

< D >

DA 7:17

dad 45:9, 48:20, 50:8, 55:22, 

164:19, 164:20

daily 91:11, 106:21, 235:23

Dallas-fort 128:19, 230:23

Dallasite 122:5

damaged 219:25

dangerous 205:5, 205:8

DANIELS 2:6

DART 140:24

data 35:19, 35:24, 36:10, 

36:12

date 42:2, 141:16, 219:2, 

220:6, 235:15

dates 68:2
Daubert 263:8

Daughter 5:17, 10:1, 55:18, 

55:20, 56:3, 61:21, 66:6, 

125:5, 140:12, 173:21, 231:1

day-to-day 145:17

days 22:11, 25:13, 26:4, 

69:7, 77:1, 102:1, 103:15, 

108:12, 127:8, 127:12, 

132:14, 151:23, 187:21, 

217:25, 221:9, 239:8, 239:9, 

239:11, 241:15, 256:12

deadline 69:15

deal 34:20, 94:11, 193:1, 

226:11, 256:24

dealerships 87:13

dealing 10:23, 260:4

dealings 137:25, 138:1, 

138:1, 145:16, 242:6

dealt 161:25

decide 120:12, 246:23, 

254:19

decided 9:4, 114:14, 156:20, 

210:6

deciding 13:12

decision 28:25, 29:3, 62:5, 

80:14, 111:20, 190:7, 190:13, 

190:16, 198:16, 238:1, 

262:13, 262:15

declared 109:19

declassification 263:16

deduced 201:12

DEFENDANT 2:1, 2:13, 2:22, 

2:31, 2:40, 27:20, 166:18, 

185:13, 257:23, 263:18

defendants 13:6, 63:3, 80:7, 

103:4, 174:13, 174:15, 

210:25, 225:1, 233:11, 

235:18, 246:6, 246:11, 

256:21, 258:8

defended 48:20, 49:13

defending 48:20

defense 5:5, 14:15, 24:24, 

33:24, 44:7, 55:7, 68:12, 

79:19, 82:18, 93:14, 102:18, 

126:25, 142:20, 150:18, 

158:5, 167:13, 186:8, 186:24, 

212:11, 224:9, 254:2, 257:14, 

263:15

defer 260:13

define 63:25

definitely 52:10, 179:13, 

239:13

definition 135:18, 223:8

definitions 42:21, 54:3, 

63:24, 149:8, 223:7

degree 121:19, 140:18, 

159:23, 221:14, 221:16

deliberations 22:13, 113:5

deliveries 87:12

denomination 221:25

depart 76:22

Department 1:31, 99:4, 

215:7

dependent 128:1

Depending 23:15, 53:23, 

156:8, 179:2, 179:11, 256:18, 

263:23

depends 71:15

deposed 40:16

depressed 91:15

depressing 198:2

depression 91:9, 92:21

descent 8:5, 72:7, 138:2, 

138:15, 138:18, 145:14, 

145:17, 162:1, 242:8

describe 13:3, 22:6, 222:7

described 21:22

description 109:20, 219:24

descriptive 200:25

deserve 181:11

design 46:19, 51:15, 217:19, 

236:12

designated 13:6, 23:22, 

23:23, 32:6, 32:14, 43:1, 

53:14, 54:6, 64:9, 110:8, 

135:13, 149:11, 166:9, 

176:22, 223:10, 233:18, 

247:4

designation 211:12, 233:20

designer 51:11, 51:12, 51:14

desire 263:20

desk 260:20

desperately 133:4

despite 185:12

destroyed 203:8, 243:3

detail 57:20, 57:22, 162:25

detailed 180:21

details 12:25, 25:15, 34:10, 

83:10, 180:2, 180:19, 249:13

detention 73:7, 77:3

determine 67:21, 85:20, 

203:1, 242:12

determined 33:1

determining 114:16

Development 116:2, 150:21

devices 195:6

diabetic 16:4, 127:18, 128:1

diapers 197:9

die 130:17

difference 229:19

Different 6:14, 6:18, 11:15, 

11:20, 20:19, 21:16, 25:11, 

52:11, 62:9, 77:15, 80:21, 

80:22, 89:13, 113:17, 124:5, 

133:12, 133:15, 133:17, 

135:7, 153:10, 168:23, 

174:22, 174:23, 183:24, 

190:25, 192:17, 201:15, 

221:25, 237:21, 238:4

differentiate 110:3

differently 87:21, 229:13

difficult 25:25, 58:25, 86:10, 

86:13, 111:8, 161:18, 184:12, 

184:17, 185:11, 193:20, 

195:9

difficulty 56:22, 83:18, 

92:17, 134:21, 175:6, 195:19, 

211:19, 213:15

Dimes 216:19

DIRE 1:18, 115:9, 258:15, 

259:16, 259:20, 260:6, 261:3

directly 66:10, 156:6, 193:2

director 30:20, 46:12

directors 46:14

disagree 32:25, 109:20, 

110:4

disagreeing 169:11

disagrees 113:20

disappointment 115:6

discipline 254:23

disclosed 65:16

discount 128:16

discretion 114:4

discussed 90:21, 191:21, 

205:16, 224:24, 258:18

discusses 200:20

discussing 59:21

discussion 114:11, 115:11

discussions 187:6, 193:5, 

193:7, 201:5
DISD 133:17, 143:12, 

172:14, 172:19

Disney 57:23, 57:24, 58:2

dispute 257:19

disregard 254:18

distance 66:11, 164:24

distant 7:18

distinction 49:1, 49:2

distinguish 33:3

distract 97:15, 190:16, 

217:25, 218:5, 239:3

distracted 239:18

distribute 77:17

distribution 137:11

DISTRICT 1:1, 1:2, 1:32, 

38:19, 50:4, 60:12, 75:3, 

133:10, 169:14, 173:11, 

173:19, 218:20, 252:11, 

265:18, 265:19

dive 119:10

DIVISION 1:3, 265:20

doctor 17:1

document 12:9, 12:12, 54:1, 

54:2

documents 11:23, 63:19, 

84:13, 86:9, 90:19, 91:21, 

131:23

Doing 10:20, 15:21, 16:21, 

20:21, 36:11, 42:3, 93:11, 

94:18, 97:7, 97:9, 103:9, 

111:14, 111:14, 118:19, 

142:18, 143:12, 146:25, 

153:22, 158:8, 165:13, 171:7, 

179:24, 192:18, 210:1, 

227:23, 229:12, 245:15

dollar 217:18

dollars 220:16

donate 41:23, 216:23

donated 216:18

done 16:17, 29:24, 36:8, 

37:21, 43:18, 53:5, 110:5, 

120:3, 120:22, 120:24, 

121:13, 121:15, 123:11, 

145:1, 155:13, 155:15, 

177:11, 193:6, 216:16, 226:9, 

226:21, 235:14, 241:12, 

260:15, 262:4

door 26:23, 27:3, 27:13

dotted 227:13

doubt 43:18, 74:1, 74:7, 

156:11, 156:25, 161:3, 161:4, 

191:23, 206:7, 223:20, 244:4, 

244:7, 244:10, 254:25

Down 22:8, 50:10, 65:11, 

75:21, 76:9, 122:21, 128:4, 

140:23, 141:2, 144:4, 144:10, 

155:5, 155:21, 165:19, 

191:19, 193:19, 209:5, 

209:10, 233:8, 261:5, 262:25

downstairs 4:17, 65:22

Downtown 51:7

drag 170:15

Dratel 2:15, 2:16, 263:17

draw 48:25, 49:2, 231:23

drawn 14:4, 33:14, 92:6, 

102:5, 112:17, 126:15, 

135:23, 141:25, 157:14, 

167:3, 177:17, 194:10

dress 138:7, 138:9

drew 29:7, 29:8

drinking 52:17

drive 34:22, 41:22, 56:9, 

138:3, 196:22

driver 83:13, 83:15, 87:10, 

139:1, 140:24, 164:19, 

172:18, 173:6

drivers 187:24

Drives 120:23, 164:22

driving 172:24, 187:16

drop 101:18

drove 172:23

drug 62:10, 100:1, 125:17, 

190:10, 245:11

drugs 77:17, 78:2, 100:6

due 79:9, 161:20, 256:10

DUNCAN 2:5

Durant 172:25

During 4:11, 9:20, 10:16, 

16:2, 20:6, 29:15, 38:20, 

60:13, 87:4, 90:8, 90:21, 

92:23, 96:17, 103:16, 121:10, 

146:7, 153:20, 154:14, 

155:17, 172:12, 176:2, 

185:10, 192:21, 218:22, 

219:16, 245:20, 265:3

duties 96:15

duty 9:6, 86:15, 123:8, 

124:12

DWI 225:24

dyslexic 80:25

< E >

Eagle 26:20

earlier 22:5, 56:12, 90:4, 

201:5, 258:10

early 69:10, 76:9

earn 104:6

easier 81:2, 259:7

easiest 259:8

East 105:10, 197:20, 209:15, 

228:14, 246:14

Easter 73:6

eat 16:5, 128:2, 155:21

eating 128:2

ECF 259:5

echo 94:9

economic 5:14, 56:2, 83:18

economy 39:21, 120:6

edge 118:12

edge-wise 4:18

education 209:24, 221:12, 

221:13

educational 64:16

effect 159:6, 159:8

effective 153:14

Eight 42:6, 53:4, 70:23, 

172:4, 173:4, 173:7, 202:5, 

239:10

eighteen-wheeler 164:22

eighties 146:9

eighty 46:23

Either 23:14, 52:19, 92:25, 

125:1, 190:15, 252:23, 257:8, 

259:6

El 7:3

El-mezain 2:13

Elashi 2:31, 257:3, 257:6, 

257:10, 262:24, 262:25

Electrical 214:21, 214:22

electronics 221:14

element 179:10, 185:9

Elementary 143:22, 143:23, 

230:21, 230:22

elevator 119:14

Elizabeth 1:28, 30:14, 

183:10, 244:20

Ellis 60:24

elsewhere 128:15, 227:8

embarrassing 193:21
emergency 139:2

emotional 121:17, 181:25

emotionally 179:11

employed 128:13, 129:13, 

129:13

employees 52:1, 193:8, 

219:21, 220:7

employer 132:14, 216:22

employment 39:7, 99:19, 

103:8, 103:18, 128:15, 

129:24, 132:10

encounter 118:18, 118:20

encouraged 41:20

End 13:10, 32:6, 32:11, 

42:18, 62:18, 63:17, 67:6, 

90:14, 91:19, 103:8, 110:8, 

135:10, 149:5, 155:24, 

156:19, 176:20, 205:25, 

211:2, 218:25, 223:4, 233:14, 

239:16, 245:15, 246:18, 

246:21, 246:24, 247:16

ended 39:15

enforcement 7:14, 134:20, 

134:22, 134:23, 175:3, 175:7, 

175:13

engineer 214:19, 214:22

engineering 214:18

English 6:3, 84:10, 84:14, 

84:16, 84:23

enjoy 63:3, 170:18, 184:24, 

192:10, 192:18

enlisted 123:5, 228:3

enough 28:22, 123:15, 

183:5, 209:10, 225:2, 256:13

entire 39:17, 41:9, 88:3, 

118:25

entitled 156:24, 175:4, 

175:8, 249:25, 251:20

entity 64:13, 257:10

entry 35:19, 35:24, 36:10, 

36:12

environmental 40:10

envision 260:1, 264:1

envisioning 259:15

EPA 40:15

equal 134:22

equipment 71:11

equivocal 114:5

equivocate 120:14

equivocation 66:21

escalated 117:22

especially 68:14, 248:21

essentially 42:20, 88:15, 

149:2, 235:6, 235:8, 239:10

establish 120:3

estate 21:22

estimate 225:19

estimates 66:5

estimation 184:16

ET 1:13

etcetera 27:11, 131:5, 

226:15

Ethiopia 145:8

Europe 21:15, 53:10, 185:1

European 49:19

evaluate 59:12, 130:19, 

203:25

evaluated 41:24

evaluating 174:16

evening 41:7, 47:4, 66:20, 

216:9

evenings 219:17

events 37:3, 121:4, 124:4

Eventually 178:19

Everybody 13:20, 18:2, 59:2, 

65:14, 120:1, 121:12, 161:11, 

162:18, 162:24, 169:8, 169:9, 

169:12, 192:14, 203:24

everyone 17:18, 115:11, 

134:6, 134:9, 181:9, 206:23, 

218:12, 225:19, 250:25, 

260:18, 260:25

everyplace 49:19

Everything 7:17, 11:7, 

11:14, 11:16, 12:14, 50:10, 

59:5, 70:13, 71:9, 72:15, 

127:14, 140:22, 162:10, 

181:15, 196:3, 226:6

everywhere 232:3

Ex-wife 125:12, 173:25

exact 68:2, 219:2, 220:6

exactly 186:13, 203:1

exam 7:17

EXAMINATION 1:18

example 6:8, 11:21, 18:12, 

21:15, 26:22, 26:25, 84:18

examples 6:6

Excellent 47:19

except 253:8

excite 238:12

excited 188:24, 189:2, 189:4

excursion 140:1

excuse 82:13, 93:5, 113:3, 

158:1, 186:17, 256:9

excused 24:19, 33:20, 44:4, 

55:2, 67:2, 79:1, 92:13, 

102:10, 113:1, 126:21, 136:3, 

142:7, 157:21, 167:8, 178:1, 

186:6, 194:17, 212:6, 224:5, 

234:17, 240:11, 248:4, 256:1

excuses 114:14

executes 238:3

exercise 18:12, 260:10

exercising 258:18

exist 257:10

existence 220:4

exists 51:1, 257:9

expect 14:4, 23:24, 24:12, 

33:14, 43:23, 54:4, 54:8, 

54:20, 61:25, 64:1, 64:8, 

65:3, 78:21, 92:6, 112:17, 

126:15, 131:4, 135:12, 142:1, 

149:10, 149:13, 150:3, 166:8, 

176:21, 176:23, 177:17, 

194:10, 201:11, 206:1, 

211:12, 233:17, 233:22, 

234:8, 247:22, 251:5, 251:19, 

263:11

expected 66:7

expedite 260:22

experience 6:1, 6:9, 6:22, 

9:1, 23:4, 28:9, 32:7, 85:1, 

90:7, 100:16, 163:16, 163:24, 

168:24, 215:11, 226:2, 226:4, 

242:6, 242:12, 242:18, 

245:24

experienced 59:3, 225:8, 

225:14, 254:15

experiences 8:2, 16:13, 

28:12, 48:2, 48:3, 72:10, 

72:10, 72:11, 97:21, 97:21, 

111:24, 145:10, 145:19, 

145:21, 168:9, 215:10, 

215:10, 215:13, 229:22

expert 105:11

expired 20:1, 49:23, 60:4, 

92:2, 112:14, 121:6, 126:11, 

164:9, 200:4, 207:18

explain 107:8, 174:17, 

246:4, 248:18
explained 105:16, 218:7, 

246:3

explaining 259:22

explanation 53:12, 132:16

explore 85:16, 196:13, 199:2

exporting 212:25

exposed 188:9

expressed 67:17, 256:15

expressing 105:12

expression 132:20

extend 154:14

extent 25:12, 27:3, 28:16, 

52:15, 71:7, 110:25, 118:12, 

171:12, 236:5

extra 39:11

extreme 191:15

eyed 6:13

< F >

face 168:3

fact 52:9, 62:13, 108:8, 

115:11, 134:10, 161:20, 

177:7, 259:7

factory 164:18, 165:2

facts 11:17, 28:22, 70:4, 

110:19, 112:4, 112:11, 

113:16, 113:16, 113:23, 

113:24, 114:2, 130:21, 

130:21, 143:3, 181:21, 

181:22, 211:8, 225:2, 226:2, 

233:16, 246:23, 246:23, 

254:20

Fair 7:11, 28:22, 59:25, 62:4, 

67:7, 74:18, 74:20, 82:9, 

85:22, 89:11, 92:20, 92:25, 

130:24, 138:19, 155:25, 

157:23, 170:21, 181:11, 

183:5, 190:11, 192:24, 198:9, 

198:12, 206:20, 207:13, 

207:15, 207:17, 217:10, 

238:2, 242:14, 250:2, 254:3, 

254:6, 254:7, 255:9, 255:11, 

256:5

fairly 11:12, 23:7, 28:8, 

78:12, 81:18, 100:12, 125:21, 

130:19, 176:11, 181:12, 

203:25, 206:2, 245:21

faith 37:12, 47:20, 48:7, 

48:10, 52:11, 52:15, 52:21, 

52:23, 221:21, 221:22, 222:3, 

222:4

fall 16:5, 170:3, 237:17

falls 184:11

false 261:13

familiar 201:6, 224:20, 

258:20

families 197:10, 222:19, 

222:20

Family 6:10, 22:19, 50:8, 

56:2, 65:20, 68:17, 69:17, 

73:2, 73:4, 76:1, 80:4, 96:15, 

96:22, 104:6, 140:1, 140:4, 

147:16, 154:25, 170:18, 

175:11, 179:25, 180:14, 

189:9, 189:13, 189:17, 

189:21, 189:23, 210:1, 

214:24, 215:1, 215:1, 219:13, 

221:25, 222:8, 238:13, 

238:24, 262:24

family-owned 143:14

famous 242:23

Fannie 178:13

far 4:12, 6:15, 8:16, 12:3, 

33:2, 47:25, 50:11, 56:3, 

56:7, 58:14, 62:8, 120:16, 

123:16, 124:1, 125:22, 

180:19, 209:10, 235:9, 

246:25, 250:20, 252:22

Farakhan 16:14, 16:17, 

18:10, 18:10, 18:15

Farmer 75:15

farther 34:22

father 5:17, 5:17, 49:13, 

53:2, 133:22, 134:2, 208:17

favor 94:7, 115:21, 120:2

favorite 19:10, 98:5, 153:3, 

212:15

FBI 35:16, 71:6

fear 58:18, 62:8, 85:24, 

85:25, 88:23, 204:4, 206:3

fears 59:18

Federal 16:25, 29:25, 53:24, 

233:6

feeling 119:9

feelings 34:17, 80:17, 80:21, 

81:3, 81:5, 91:5, 109:21, 

110:6, 110:11, 110:16, 

110:21, 110:23, 134:6, 134:7, 

134:16, 152:20, 249:18, 

249:19

fees 265:10

fellow 193:8

felt 249:6

Field 51:6

Fifteen 26:13, 53:10, 68:6

fifteen-minute 194:18

Fifth 182:22, 186:9, 238:14

fifty 52:3, 260:5

fight 105:18

fighters 109:16, 109:22

fighting 104:15, 104:17, 

106:4, 109:24, 169:10

figure 227:5

figured 152:24

file 259:4, 259:9

filled 5:7, 55:9, 64:5, 82:20, 

87:20, 87:20, 99:16, 107:23, 

108:3, 127:1, 136:10, 140:18, 

158:6, 165:20, 174:11, 

196:21, 197:1, 202:11, 

202:14, 202:18, 248:11

filling 76:10, 193:14, 194:24

final 53:25

finally 259:23

financial 81:19, 103:20, 

129:1, 129:6

financially 129:15, 171:21

find 7:10, 63:23, 84:3, 

109:22, 129:19, 152:11, 

166:20, 166:22, 172:1, 181:8, 

184:14, 191:6, 199:7, 211:9, 

223:18, 241:24

Finding 167:22

Fine 13:19, 46:3, 143:17, 

154:23, 196:9, 206:5, 259:6

fingerprints 30:2

finished 23:14, 149:6, 

217:18

Fire 56:25, 118:21, 216:7, 

220:1

fired 103:10, 192:15, 192:16

firefighting 53:5

firm 31:8, 31:13, 257:17

firs 4:6, 203:23

First 2:8, 4:25, 5:11, 5:12, 

11:17, 12:17, 23:11, 30:25, 

49:20, 53:17, 61:9, 64:6, 

65:25, 67:15, 67:16, 68:17, 

84:8, 115:7, 116:21, 117:13, 
128:12, 130:8, 139:2, 154:20, 

158:11, 163:13, 168:3, 168:4, 

168:5, 168:6, 197:1, 208:5, 

209:8, 223:9, 230:10, 248:9, 

261:6, 262:19, 263:19

fit 198:11

fiv 171:19

Five 22:11, 37:23, 42:3, 

52:13, 56:11, 63:10, 69:7, 

77:1, 96:20, 118:24, 127:14, 

151:23, 155:10, 218:1, 220:9, 

238:5

flag 17:17

flags 137:7

Fletcher 178:2, 183:8, 

185:22, 186:8, 186:17

flight 27:9

Flint 144:2, 144:5, 144:7, 

148:22

Floor 2:17, 261:6

floors 169:18, 169:19

Florida 2:37

fluctuates 52:3, 116:23

Fluent 5:24, 165:22

flying 263:7

focus 25:23, 60:2

follow 12:22, 13:12, 13:20, 

13:24, 19:6, 32:20, 33:1, 

33:9, 43:11, 47:15, 54:15, 

62:25, 63:4, 64:21, 67:3, 

80:2, 86:11, 149:21, 156:22, 

177:1, 185:7, 185:15, 223:18, 

235:22, 235:23, 247:17, 

247:18, 255:10

follow-up 9:11, 99:5, 172:13, 

174:12, 218:23, 230:7, 263:4

followed 16:16, 47:9, 70:5, 

104:9, 141:10, 169:5, 191:14, 

197:21, 221:21, 228:10, 

235:21, 237:4, 237:7

following 12:25, 24:6, 

211:19, 234:3

food 13:16, 24:3, 32:17, 

37:15, 38:4, 43:6, 54:11, 

64:16, 94:16, 130:4, 143:20, 

149:17, 176:25, 197:9, 203:7, 

223:14, 243:1, 247:10

foolish 105:12

Force 45:10, 45:13, 187:18, 

238:14

foregoing 265:7

foregoing-styled 265:4

foreign 11:19, 23:22, 24:1, 

25:9, 131:21

foreman 22:15

forensic 226:10, 226:16, 

226:20, 227:10

forget 90:22, 162:18, 251:14, 

255:4

forgetful 86:4

forgive 127:21

forks 241:7

form 29:12, 56:24, 76:14, 

120:18, 130:4, 131:4, 197:9, 

200:1, 203:7, 225:3, 243:1, 

259:11

formalities 126:2

format 265:10

formed 70:9, 80:5, 103:3, 

151:6, 188:15, 191:16, 

235:17

forms 196:3

formulated 113:4, 113:6

Fort 2:46, 39:18, 63:7

forthcoming 68:1

fortunate 211:3

Forty 20:23, 48:21

forward 195:2, 259:25

found 39:21, 43:15, 43:18, 

48:10, 133:6, 135:16, 166:17, 

199:19, 236:3, 254:13

four-month 92:19, 119:3, 

139:19

four-month-long 189:5

Fourteen 209:23

frame 25:15, 232:24

France 21:14, 184:21

fraud 62:10

free 17:4, 18:3, 98:15, 98:19, 

208:22, 209:1

FREEDMAN 2:6

freedom 17:5, 17:9, 18:13, 

49:10, 49:14, 49:17, 49:21, 

98:9, 109:16, 109:22, 131:5, 

132:19

freedom-fighting 113:7

freelance 51:10, 51:12

freelanced 51:18

freely 17:6

Friday 15:16, 15:17, 15:25, 

83:7, 87:16, 87:17, 87:18, 

96:21, 115:5, 151:24, 241:15, 

258:14, 258:17, 258:23, 

261:2

Fried 146:15

friend 6:10, 29:10, 31:5, 

70:23, 76:19, 100:19, 175:12

friends 47:24, 69:18, 77:14, 

78:5, 105:3, 105:8, 145:8, 

163:16, 175:24, 176:1, 

180:14, 190:22, 219:13

front 89:10, 254:19

fuel 117:20

fulfill 86:15

full 31:2, 128:8, 128:13, 

128:15, 129:23, 132:10, 

132:13, 133:2, 133:7, 151:17, 

191:25, 209:17, 210:7

fully 174:19, 256:24

function 124:1

functions 124:5

fundraisers 37:2

funds 226:6

funneling 235:7

furniture 169:18

< G >

Galveston 76:23

game 95:5

games 72:19

gangs 37:10, 38:4, 38:9

gaps 227:8

garages 87:13

Garland 75:19, 123:24, 

222:13, 222:14

Garrett 1:29, 208:2, 230:3

gas 28:2, 183:17, 183:20

gauge 20:19

gave 13:23, 14:24, 25:8, 

29:10, 32:11, 34:5, 44:13, 

45:1, 67:1, 70:23, 93:24, 

105:24, 116:6, 128:14, 

129:23, 142:25, 150:23, 

166:18, 167:18, 224:17, 

247:15, 248:11

Gaza 130:3, 197:11, 203:6, 

246:14, 250:10

gears 220:18

ged 73:15
general 96:16, 115:9, 134:9, 

135:1, 232:9, 234:23, 258:15, 

259:15, 259:20, 261:3

Generally 42:7, 53:12, 

119:14, 131:25

generators 220:18

Gentlemen 4:2, 7:24, 51:2, 

52:7, 58:23, 66:21, 82:15, 

114:9, 138:14, 156:1, 156:22, 

181:11, 182:8, 182:21, 185:4, 

186:9, 188:17, 206:1, 206:12, 

210:24, 237:19, 242:10, 

243:16, 249:25, 251:19, 

251:25, 252:4, 256:4, 256:10, 

264:4

Geographic 143:10

George 148:5

Germany 21:14

gets 49:5, 147:18, 171:19

getting 27:2, 37:10, 56:17, 

69:19, 91:14, 152:23, 171:5, 

195:21

Gilstrap 31:10

girl 9:23

Given 4:5, 12:9, 49:15, 

53:12, 54:9, 54:14, 58:21, 

64:12, 64:19, 80:16, 96:21, 

102:21, 114:25, 181:14, 

181:22, 184:16, 185:9, 

189:12, 203:13, 220:8, 

223:13, 251:25, 256:13, 

259:7, 259:16

gives 23:15, 32:25

giving 11:21, 33:6, 38:4, 

38:6, 64:23, 106:2, 134:22, 

166:23, 187:3, 200:3, 227:24, 

235:1

glad 188:24

glance 25:13

glasses 70:22, 151:13, 

151:13, 151:15

Gonzales 82:14, 82:17, 

86:22, 86:24, 91:19, 92:3, 

92:4, 93:5

goods 64:12

gotten 108:23, 109:9, 

132:13, 250:20

grade 31:1

graduate 165:8

graduated 154:19, 165:12

Graham 142:13, 142:15, 

146:1, 146:2, 150:1

Grand 8:16, 8:19, 8:24, 11:9, 

11:10, 40:25

grandson 103:25, 104:3

granted 114:15

graphic 46:11, 51:14

graphics 51:10, 217:7

grave 218:3

Great 105:8, 247:19

greater 175:4, 263:9

Greg 2:42, 14:15, 24:24, 

33:23, 44:6, 68:11, 79:18, 

93:13, 102:17, 115:19, 

142:17, 150:17, 167:13, 

186:23, 212:11, 224:8, 

234:20

grew 7:6, 63:8, 75:25, 122:4, 

202:6

Griftner 79:3, 81:12, 82:1

grounds 18:8, 67:1, 113:8

group 37:1, 37:11, 70:2, 

88:18, 89:10, 95:8, 104:16, 

105:18, 109:22, 110:8, 113:7, 

148:25, 149:11, 187:18, 

200:1, 233:15, 233:17, 260:4

groups 98:6, 237:17

grow 75:24, 141:5

grown 21:6, 87:23, 125:8

Grummen 75:7, 75:17

Guarantee 61:8

Guaranty 61:16

guard 95:25

guess 5:21, 22:4, 27:21, 

30:3, 36:15, 39:6, 45:9, 47:7, 

59:5, 85:15, 89:1, 99:20, 

107:24, 118:11, 134:1, 157:1, 

201:12, 203:2, 203:22, 

204:16, 204:25, 206:24, 

210:19, 214:20, 226:16, 

227:2, 236:6, 252:14, 258:9, 

259:24, 262:12

guidance 258:23

guided 70:13

guilt 25:21, 80:6, 153:16, 

188:16, 235:18

guilty 43:17, 49:20, 63:23, 

103:4, 151:7, 156:12, 156:13, 

166:20, 166:22, 177:3, 

177:10, 182:15, 182:18, 

191:24, 199:7, 206:24, 213:7, 

213:10, 213:11, 223:6, 

223:18, 225:1, 225:1, 236:3, 

236:7, 250:22, 251:1, 253:17

guitar 37:2, 41:25, 42:1

Gulf 19:20

gutter 81:21

guy 28:1, 28:2, 28:10, 48:4, 

231:23, 242:22

Guyana 124:17

guys 191:7, 191:10, 250:21

< H >

hair 162:11, 162:11, 162:19, 

162:21, 163:8, 163:9

half 42:7, 50:19, 51:19, 

60:19, 75:8, 80:2, 122:13, 

129:13, 194:3

handicapped 147:3, 147:9

handle 217:22, 218:10, 

257:1

handles 219:16

handling 230:5

hands 104:20

hang 190:23

happen 23:17, 181:24

happened 27:17, 127:15, 

133:18, 155:3, 156:5, 254:14

happening 129:15, 188:12, 

228:14, 237:9

happens 91:3, 105:9, 152:7, 

185:19

happy 195:24

hard 48:21, 52:20, 59:2, 

80:8, 80:9, 81:9, 90:12, 

119:24, 154:5, 156:2, 199:7, 

228:23, 229:1, 237:6, 251:17

hardcore 120:4

hardest 59:14

hardship 5:15, 25:24, 25:24, 

26:1, 26:2, 56:2, 66:2, 76:16, 

83:18, 96:14, 102:12, 103:21, 

114:3, 114:5, 114:5, 114:14, 

142:10, 195:19, 241:17, 

256:16

hardships 76:13

Hardware 128:13

hated 29:10

hauling 173:1
Haven 123:21

Hawaii 231:21, 232:5, 232:6

hazardous 40:15

He'll 91:22

head 107:13, 127:7, 138:13, 

170:6, 208:6

headed 228:23, 229:1

headlines 25:5

headquartered 61:10

heads 162:22

hearing 6:17, 12:8, 50:12, 

78:20, 151:11, 158:17, 195:1, 

195:3, 195:6, 195:15, 197:3, 

202:15, 263:8, 263:10

hearsay 180:21

heart 9:4, 17:7, 157:6

heartfelt 137:4, 181:10, 

204:7, 204:9

Hebrew 11:24

held 87:9

Hello 60:9, 158:4, 252:9

help 5:18, 16:2, 37:2, 39:11, 

56:5, 90:23, 197:10, 210:15, 

216:2, 216:5, 229:18, 238:25

helpful 121:23, 261:17

helping 16:1, 159:10

herself 152:23, 153:23

hesitancy 254:25

hesitation 32:23, 207:3, 

217:13, 238:20, 244:13, 

251:21

hesitations 206:18

High 80:21, 95:22, 111:23, 

122:7, 122:10, 159:13, 

169:21, 205:2, 209:11, 

209:19, 230:21, 242:3

highly 18:11

Hill 31:10

historically 48:11

History 39:8, 106:2, 109:8, 

109:12, 143:9

hit 25:4

Hodge 240:12, 240:14, 

244:18, 247:20

hold 139:8, 139:15, 156:5, 

178:24, 179:7, 182:8, 185:6

hole 130:17

holidays 184:22

Hollander 2:4, 2:7, 256:22, 

257:15

home 30:19, 41:2, 41:4, 

41:8, 47:5, 61:12, 104:19, 

125:7, 125:8, 147:4, 159:6, 

165:17, 165:24, 170:7, 174:3, 

174:6, 174:7, 184:1, 184:5, 

187:16, 190:9, 196:22, 197:3, 

208:25, 230:15, 232:12, 

262:23

homemaker 39:5

homes 130:5, 203:8, 243:2

honest 110:12, 137:4, 154:5, 

181:10, 185:9, 196:17, 

249:19

Honestly 12:13, 13:9, 80:9, 

81:8, 182:20, 185:17, 185:18, 

208:7, 238:12, 238:22, 

251:16

hope 38:12, 57:5, 123:13, 

169:7, 169:8

Hopefully 132:18, 238:3

Hospital 16:25, 16:25, 20:25, 

63:9, 214:17, 220:12

hostile 118:21

hot 229:10

hour 42:7, 42:7, 56:9, 66:12, 

114:9, 155:21, 194:3, 219:17, 

219:19, 256:10, 258:16, 

260:8, 260:10, 261:4, 262:10, 

264:2

hours 15:24, 16:3, 42:5, 

42:6, 67:13, 96:17, 103:16, 

106:21, 128:3, 155:9, 155:13, 

155:14, 171:18, 193:25, 

218:2, 222:10, 239:10

house 21:6, 101:10, 128:23, 

132:20, 154:20, 170:9, 

170:18, 174:4

housekeeping 258:9

Huffman 234:18, 240:1, 

240:3

human 48:18, 48:23, 56:24, 

110:21, 179:6, 179:10, 185:9, 

217:4

humanitarian 13:16, 24:3, 

32:16, 33:4, 33:7, 85:6, 

130:2, 130:4, 137:11, 177:4, 

197:8, 197:8, 197:14, 199:12, 

200:24, 203:5, 203:9, 223:14, 

233:23, 242:25, 243:1, 243:4, 

247:9, 247:11, 250:9, 250:13

hundred 80:15, 124:11, 

206:14, 222:17, 251:21

hung 94:23

hurt 229:11, 238:24, 239:17

husband 15:15, 16:1, 20:13, 

22:18, 36:25, 37:1, 37:22, 

40:9, 41:5, 41:16, 41:23, 

42:2, 129:12, 183:15, 184:5, 

205:15, 205:22, 208:14

< I >

ICE 45:15

idea 42:4, 105:11, 105:18, 

128:3, 258:14, 261:2, 261:10

ideally 190:6

ideas 105:22, 105:23, 

111:24, 242:13, 251:25

IED 118:18, 118:20

II 127:25

illegal 43:5, 49:3, 49:8, 

135:15, 166:11, 176:24, 

233:25

illegally 212:25

images 136:16

imagine 17:12, 26:18, 

140:12, 259:12

Immediately 27:13, 38:24, 

127:8

impact 92:22, 129:5, 129:11, 

130:19, 134:8, 218:8

impaired 96:16, 96:23, 239:3

impaneled 80:11

impartial 67:7, 82:9, 85:22, 

130:25, 156:1, 157:23, 

190:12, 192:24, 198:12, 

198:13, 217:10, 250:2, 254:3, 

254:6, 254:8, 255:9, 255:11, 

256:5

implications 257:21

important 85:17, 181:2, 

182:3, 182:12

importantly 92:22

impose 5:14

impossible 25:25

improve 226:15

in. 130:17, 147:18

inability 157:23

inactive 232:17

incident 155:1
incidents 27:12

include 32:15, 149:13, 

233:11, 233:22

included 128:4

includes 259:20

including 64:14

income 111:4

inconvenience 34:24

Inconvenient 34:19, 34:21, 

47:6

incorrect 43:15

Independent 133:10, 169:13, 

173:19

India 213:20, 213:23, 

214:12, 214:25, 216:13, 

218:23, 221:12, 221:14, 

221:22

indicate 67:6

indicated 20:12, 22:17, 

30:15, 31:4, 66:7, 66:16, 

66:17, 77:13, 88:20, 100:19, 

123:16, 127:18, 133:22, 

183:12, 189:4, 195:1, 248:14, 

248:24, 251:6, 256:4, 262:21

indictment 176:18, 200:22, 

200:22, 200:23, 201:3

Indirectly 156:7

individual 77:15, 210:1

individuals 42:12, 77:16, 

107:3, 108:1, 110:3, 229:14

industry 140:23, 226:7

inferring 257:24

inflammatory 131:8, 131:14, 

131:16

influence 110:10, 205:21

influenced 15:5, 254:10

inform 190:16

information 4:5, 20:11, 57:9, 

58:8, 86:14, 108:23, 109:9, 

120:17, 130:12, 131:25, 

176:10, 262:21

informed 109:3

inheritance 81:16

initially 117:19

innocence 25:21, 63:3, 

66:22, 67:5, 73:21, 73:22, 

74:5, 80:7, 153:16, 156:23, 

160:20, 161:1, 161:9, 188:16, 

191:22, 191:25, 206:9, 

206:10, 206:13, 206:15, 

206:22, 235:18, 238:16, 

238:18, 243:11, 243:16, 

251:3, 251:19, 252:4, 253:14, 

253:22, 256:4

innocent 58:23, 74:6, 103:4, 

160:25, 161:1, 191:23, 

206:24, 243:12, 250:25, 

251:20, 253:17

input 262:2

inquire 127:21

inquiring 205:10

inside 80:16, 161:14

inspector 241:1

install 220:18, 236:23

instances 27:17

Instead 105:12

Institute 46:7

instruct 12:19, 135:12, 

166:8, 175:2, 185:3, 185:6, 

201:11, 211:10, 211:10, 

247:2, 247:4, 262:11

instructed 32:18

instruction 12:22, 13:13, 

13:24, 24:6, 32:20, 33:6, 

33:9, 43:12, 54:14, 54:15, 

64:1, 64:21, 135:5, 135:16, 

177:2, 185:7, 185:15, 201:13, 

211:18, 211:20, 223:17, 

223:18, 233:22, 234:2

instructions 13:11, 23:16, 

23:18, 32:11, 32:13, 42:19, 

43:1, 43:3, 54:5, 54:8, 63:1, 

63:4, 63:20, 64:2, 64:11, 

64:18, 67:3, 91:23, 92:1, 

115:1, 149:10, 149:13, 

156:22, 166:17, 211:5, 211:5, 

211:12, 233:15, 233:17, 

246:22, 247:16, 255:10

instructor 163:12, 163:13

instructs 135:2, 199:18, 

246:20

Instruments 20:15, 38:25, 

39:9

insulin 128:1

insults 17:18

insurance 29:9

intending 15:23, 67:12

intent 77:16, 246:15, 247:6

intention 37:24

intentions 178:15

interaction 119:19

interest 188:11

interested 29:22, 108:24, 

171:25

interesting 48:9, 48:10, 

48:12, 134:13, 188:18

interfere 68:24, 80:18, 

127:22

international 193:13

Internationally 229:8

interpreters 117:25

interviewed 35:16, 115:8

interviewing 65:2, 194:9

intimidating 58:16, 58:17, 

66:17

introduced 11:23, 131:3

introduction 259:18

investigated 71:5

investigation 29:25, 71:8, 

114:4

investment 56:19, 81:19

investments 56:20

involve 32:5, 144:18

involved 14:23, 34:5, 37:23, 

72:25, 73:2, 78:2, 105:11, 

142:25, 150:22, 170:4, 

175:10, 179:12, 180:20, 

182:1, 187:6, 191:11, 205:13, 

226:6

involvement 125:17

involves 7:24, 14:22, 25:6, 

34:3, 70:1, 74:21, 79:23, 

83:1, 85:3, 85:9, 102:20, 

116:5, 120:8, 127:3, 129:25, 

130:23, 136:12, 137:9, 

142:23, 144:16, 150:21, 

153:13, 158:12, 159:25, 

161:7, 167:16, 180:5, 190:10, 

196:18, 198:7, 202:2, 203:3, 

203:20, 224:14, 240:17, 

249:7, 251:4

involving 179:17, 244:8

Iran 27:18, 28:6, 28:6, 52:15

Iranian 48:4, 51:2, 52:9

Iraq 19:21, 68:4, 117:5, 

117:24

irritability 118:14

IRS 133:22, 134:5, 134:6, 

134:7, 134:14

Irving 30:23, 40:23
Israel 104:16, 106:3, 131:22, 

248:14, 248:15, 248:21, 

248:23, 248:25, 249:6, 250:5, 

251:4, 251:7, 252:16

Israeli 108:2, 249:2

Israeli-palestinian 228:11, 

252:16

issue 34:24, 44:25, 47:2, 

56:17, 113:21, 113:24, 182:7, 

184:9, 189:22, 190:11, 

228:21, 233:18, 238:23, 

239:14, 239:15, 239:16, 

252:19, 256:20, 256:24, 

257:1, 257:7, 257:15, 257:17, 

258:6, 258:9, 263:5

issues 63:1, 66:14, 66:20, 

80:22, 96:22, 96:22, 125:17, 

126:4, 133:22, 140:15, 

144:19, 171:23, 190:14, 

196:14, 198:11, 199:1, 251:4

Italian 201:22, 201:23

item 24:3

items 52:11, 54:10, 64:16, 

135:17, 149:17, 160:5, 

176:25, 177:5, 211:17

itself 108:5, 109:2, 250:17

Ivan 67:16

< J >

Jacks 1:26, 20:4, 38:17, 

50:3, 60:10, 66:23, 75:2, 

76:1, 87:1, 92:2, 92:23, 93:2, 

106:10, 112:14, 113:14, 

113:19, 121:8, 124:12, 

126:11, 146:4, 154:11, 

157:24, 172:9, 201:5, 218:19, 

222:20, 252:10, 252:22, 

262:8

Jackson 256:6

Jacob 262:20

jail 77:11, 100:5, 100:8, 

134:3, 175:15, 245:15, 

245:18

January 219:1

Jensen 33:21, 33:23, 38:14, 

38:16, 43:21

jeopardy 152:7

jersies 95:14

Jim 1:26, 20:4, 38:17, 50:3, 

60:10, 75:2, 87:1, 106:10, 

121:8, 146:4, 154:11, 169:22, 

172:9, 218:19, 252:10

jobs 11:6, 11:6, 29:13, 

128:8, 128:11

John 235:21, 257:2

joined 39:2

Joint 10:5, 68:22, 256:21, 

257:11, 258:8

Jonas 1:27, 99:3, 99:4, 

101:1, 101:18, 132:8, 133:8, 

140:10, 164:15, 192:6

Jones 115:15, 115:19, 

121:7, 126:13

JOSHUA 2:15, 2:16

judged 59:22

judging 161:16, 222:3, 

249:23

judgment 12:7, 13:21, 

131:10, 138:17

judgmental 59:25, 62:4

Judicial 265:11

July 262:19

June 107:24, 129:22

juries 21:21, 32:8, 225:9, 

225:12, 232:19

Jurors 7:10, 62:15, 66:8, 

114:23, 114:23, 149:14, 

182:4, 190:6, 250:1

Justice 1:31, 23:5, 78:13, 

99:4, 100:13, 105:19, 125:21, 

176:11, 190:5, 245:21

< K >

Kansas 231:18

Karikal 213:20, 214:10

keep 66:1, 86:14, 94:8, 

128:16, 201:16, 210:5, 237:9

Keeping 92:18, 92:18

keeps 216:8, 230:19, 238:3

Kelly 98:7

kept 66:18, 173:8

key 228:13

Kiblinger 4:24, 186:19

kids 41:11, 153:5, 170:1, 

208:25, 210:15, 216:10

killed 152:22

killing 217:4

kinds 20:19, 71:10, 180:22, 

182:3, 199:2, 237:21, 260:6

knob 131:17

knocking 96:20, 171:18

Knowing 58:7, 59:19, 83:17, 

85:9, 130:11, 130:22, 243:14

knowingly 33:6, 64:20, 

233:11

knowledge 12:16, 25:12

known 23:10, 47:23, 99:11, 

115:25, 166:4

knows 186:12, 218:12

Kurian 212:7, 212:11, 

218:17, 218:19, 223:22

KVRA 47:11

< L >

L. 2:16, 3:1, 265:3, 265:17

Ladies 4:2, 65:11, 82:15, 

114:9, 162:21, 256:10, 264:4

lady 65:22, 66:3, 66:15, 

162:23, 183:2, 241:8

laid 39:11, 39:20, 99:19

landscaping 208:15

Lane 151:20

language 11:19, 11:24, 

11:24, 84:8, 132:20, 214:5, 

214:9, 214:10

Laredo 7:4

large 238:13, 260:4

laser 70:13

lasers 71:17

Last 15:16, 15:17, 22:10, 

48:21, 55:25, 57:4, 60:18, 

67:12, 67:15, 78:21, 79:14, 

80:12, 81:16, 97:9, 108:12, 

118:24, 125:11, 128:25, 

129:13, 132:16, 133:5, 

134:10, 152:1, 165:11, 

192:13, 202:8, 209:18, 210:6, 

225:24, 241:14, 256:11

lasted 263:1

lasting 65:21

lasts 129:3

Late 123:5, 146:9, 150:4, 

175:23

lately 83:3, 179:21

later 64:15, 132:14, 152:22, 

254:13

laundering 212:24, 235:7
Laundry 172:21

laws 63:25

lawyer 31:5, 96:8, 126:5

lawyers 14:15, 24:24, 33:24, 

44:7, 68:12, 79:19, 93:14, 

102:18, 115:20, 142:20, 

167:13, 212:11, 224:9

lay 155:21

layman 51:13

layoff 144:8, 144:9

leaflets 131:24

league 95:11, 95:12

leaks 241:11

leaning 195:2

learn 26:14, 171:2, 213:3

learned 78:11, 112:7, 

212:17, 255:4

least 62:15, 114:16, 126:16, 

150:4, 225:5, 227:9, 239:8, 

256:25, 257:21

leave 56:10, 66:9, 144:7, 

214:14, 262:12

led 173:5

leery 118:11, 119:24

left 36:12, 125:8, 214:12, 

214:15, 218:23, 256:20

legal 49:2, 49:5, 49:6, 81:4, 

173:14, 253:18

Legally 9:14, 96:25, 101:6

length 139:18, 184:8, 184:17

lens 75:12

lenses 70:12, 70:14, 70:22

less 5:14, 52:2, 132:18, 

134:25, 241:16, 260:11

lesser 175:4

lessons 29:10, 37:9, 42:1

letter 26:2, 89:2, 122:19, 

259:4, 259:7, 263:15, 263:17, 

263:19

Letting 19:14

level 117:11

liaison 40:14

libraries 243:3

library 130:5

license 210:5

licensed 209:20

life 8:2, 39:17, 40:1, 46:1, 

63:7, 76:6, 81:20, 81:21, 

84:15, 88:3, 122:3, 127:14, 

133:18, 158:21, 159:6, 202:4, 

218:3

Lighthouse 101:8

likely 38:9, 152:6, 247:5

limited 167:24

limits 4:15

Lincoln 122:10

Linda 2:34, 2:35, 5:5, 55:7, 

82:18, 126:24, 136:8, 194:23, 

201:24, 240:16, 248:9

line 143:19, 190:24, 230:19

Linen 173:2

lines 127:7

list 20:11, 102:14, 124:6, 

209:10, 259:19, 262:20, 

263:18

listed 40:9, 236:9

listen 14:9, 19:7, 24:17, 

28:24, 33:19, 44:3, 47:11, 

54:25, 62:4, 65:7, 78:25, 

82:7, 92:12, 95:3, 98:2, 

102:9, 112:23, 126:20, 

131:16, 142:6, 156:21, 

156:21, 166:16, 167:7, 

177:23, 186:5, 194:16, 

200:17, 212:5, 224:4, 234:14, 

240:10, 248:3, 255:8, 255:25

listened 168:22

listening 27:8, 47:13, 134:8

lists 115:3

live 10:3, 21:6, 21:8, 40:4, 

46:1, 56:6, 75:22, 87:24, 

101:14, 104:3, 125:10, 

130:16, 136:18, 144:2, 147:4, 

159:9, 164:16, 165:17, 

173:24, 181:16, 182:1, 231:5

Lived 39:17, 39:20, 39:25, 

45:24, 45:25, 50:7, 63:6, 

76:5, 88:2, 105:15, 202:4, 

219:8, 221:5, 231:9

lives 147:6

living 88:5, 183:16, 231:11

Liz 9:10, 30:11

local 117:21, 119:20, 125:14, 

164:25

locale 131:18

Locally 172:22, 229:6

locals 119:18

located 40:22, 75:14, 75:15, 

75:17, 106:18, 146:16, 

222:12

location 66:8, 107:17, 

107:19

lock 26:23, 27:13

logos 46:20, 51:15

longer 5:13, 15:9, 51:1, 

55:25, 83:17, 96:11, 171:17, 

192:13, 263:10

longevity 79:8

look 7:14, 11:16, 110:19, 

112:4, 113:15, 113:16, 114:2, 

132:12, 143:9, 152:5, 152:13, 

168:2, 206:2, 226:17, 228:13, 

245:25, 259:25, 261:21

looked 29:11, 56:23, 191:12

looking 41:22, 41:25, 85:19, 

85:20, 103:15, 128:9, 128:15, 

132:23, 134:12, 137:3, 

158:25, 159:8, 161:13, 165:6, 

182:5, 190:8, 190:18, 193:12, 

196:17, 225:19, 226:2, 227:2, 

227:6, 232:9, 232:18

looks 27:5, 184:4, 184:18, 

227:11, 227:12, 227:14, 

232:18, 244:25, 245:10

lose 26:1, 96:14, 103:10, 

111:2, 141:21, 171:11, 

171:20

loss 113:8, 154:7, 154:15

Lots 57:24, 190:24

loud 195:4

Louisiana 141:6, 144:11

Love 19:19, 38:6, 51:6, 

139:20, 144:14

lunch 115:12, 155:21, 259:2

lyrics 17:17

< M >

ma'am 5:25, 10:11, 10:16, 

11:13, 13:25, 24:19, 30:17, 

30:20, 31:3, 31:14, 31:24, 

32:12, 32:21, 33:10, 44:4, 

64:25, 142:11, 186:6, 248:4, 

249:17, 255:16, 256:1, 263:3

machines 195:4

Mae 178:13

Mail 36:13, 36:14, 36:15, 

36:20, 132:15

main 10:6, 35:8, 105:18

mainly 6:11, 10:6, 19:15, 
138:8, 169:24

maintain 32:2

major 225:22

Majority 9:5, 221:13

Malayalam 214:3, 214:4

Malaysia 214:8

malfeasance 226:13

Mallick 2:44

manage 217:17

managed 32:2

management 140:18

manager 50:22, 183:18, 

214:18

managers 57:3

manages 45:21

manner 223:16

manpower 239:15

mans 45:19

manuals 46:19

manufacturing 75:12

March 11:2, 69:10, 123:7, 

216:19

Marijuana 78:3

marked 21:14, 209:3

market 120:6

MARLO 2:25, 2:26

marriage 22:18

married 9:13, 9:14, 20:13, 

30:16, 69:19, 76:4, 83:21, 

152:24, 153:24, 174:2, 

183:13, 208:10, 230:12

marshal 49:20

Master 116:18

materials 40:15, 64:17, 

64:18

matter 21:23, 62:20, 109:22, 

112:3, 124:23, 137:3, 138:21, 

259:10, 263:13

matters 65:10, 193:12, 

259:21

MBA 178:10

Mckinney 2:27

Mcveigh 236:9, 236:10

mean 7:6, 12:3, 12:6, 12:23, 

13:19, 17:4, 20:16, 22:18, 

25:24, 28:15, 45:1, 45:25, 

48:5, 59:15, 80:23, 98:11, 

104:24, 122:22, 141:20, 

157:7, 161:20, 178:25, 179:4, 

204:15, 206:23, 207:10, 

250:19

meaning 6:4, 6:20, 12:5, 

12:6, 84:24

meanings 6:19, 11:21, 12:3, 

12:15

means 12:17, 74:5, 87:3, 

149:16, 160:23, 190:13, 

247:5

meant 179:1

meantime 126:16

mechanic 28:15

mechanical 214:19

medical 24:4, 43:6, 149:17, 

177:1, 193:19, 196:5, 196:6, 

211:17, 223:15, 233:24

medication 15:22, 91:8, 

91:16, 92:21, 128:1

medicine 54:12, 160:3, 

197:9, 203:7, 243:2

Medina 4:18

meet 15:23, 219:5, 219:9

member 4:25, 62:25, 67:10, 

92:5, 123:17, 139:13, 175:11, 

221:18

members 14:3, 24:11, 27:9, 

43:22, 54:19, 102:4, 112:16, 

126:14, 135:22, 140:3, 

141:24, 150:2, 157:13, 167:2, 

177:16, 180:14, 185:23, 

194:9, 200:10, 201:9, 211:23, 

222:3, 222:19, 223:23, 234:7, 

240:4, 247:21, 255:18

memory 91:4, 136:25, 

260:12, 261:21

men 14:23, 19:2, 25:8, 

28:19, 34:5, 34:16, 44:12, 

44:25, 71:25, 93:24, 97:24, 

102:20, 116:6, 120:9, 123:17, 

123:25, 124:5, 142:25, 149:3, 

150:22, 152:10, 168:15, 

176:16, 191:22, 191:24, 

217:9, 224:16, 238:6

mention 76:14

Mentioned 41:24, 42:9, 

52:15, 99:25, 101:5, 127:25, 

135:9, 195:17, 208:9, 210:21, 

217:3, 226:1, 231:19, 235:12, 

235:14, 251:18, 252:14, 

258:10

mentions 248:22

Merchandisers 39:16

message 218:12

met 219:7

method 258:17, 262:3

Mexico 21:15, 21:19, 45:18, 

53:8, 76:24, 88:9

Michelle 146:15

Michigan 145:3

microphone 4:7, 4:12

midday 114:10

Middle 105:10, 169:23, 

197:20, 228:14, 246:14

miles 56:8

military 26:14, 30:6, 67:17, 

70:13, 70:16, 70:18, 70:19, 

71:11, 227:18, 227:19, 

231:19, 232:13

Miller 169:22

million 217:18, 220:15

mind 20:8, 38:22, 59:21, 

59:23, 60:15, 65:13, 66:1, 

67:13, 67:14, 75:6, 78:15, 

92:18, 98:12, 98:13, 98:16, 

98:19, 105:22, 111:7, 125:23, 

138:19, 144:20, 153:19, 

153:20, 153:21, 172:13, 

182:25, 187:15, 189:15, 

190:2, 190:15, 192:21, 

207:12, 231:14

mine 29:10, 46:1, 69:18, 

70:23, 76:19

minor 26:21

minute 55:11

minutes 5:10, 14:16, 24:25, 

44:8, 68:6, 68:16, 82:25, 

93:15, 115:21, 142:22, 

150:19, 167:14, 212:12, 

224:10, 260:7, 261:4

misappropriated 227:3

missed 188:8

missile 35:18, 36:2

missiles 35:20

missing 79:10

mission 117:6, 117:20, 

130:20

Missionary 123:21

missions 117:8, 117:23, 

118:15, 118:16, 118:16

mistake 99:23, 134:23

mixed 109:21, 110:6, 
110:11, 152:20

Mobile 243:3

Mohamed 242:23

Molestation 22:6

mom 55:21, 56:5, 61:6, 

65:20, 76:3, 84:9, 164:18, 

165:1

moment 33:25, 87:6, 262:13

Monday 15:24, 34:12, 46:23, 

87:15, 87:17, 87:18, 96:17, 

103:16, 119:1, 151:24, 

171:17, 218:1, 239:11, 

259:24, 259:25, 263:8, 

263:21

monitor 15:21, 20:19

month 7:19, 29:14, 29:20, 

42:5, 42:7, 65:17, 78:7, 

81:15, 128:23, 139:25, 

173:12

Mooney 224:6, 230:2, 234:6

MORALES 67:19, 67:19, 

67:21, 68:3

morally 43:10, 43:15

Moreno 2:34, 2:35, 5:5, 11:8, 

11:18, 13:2, 55:7, 57:9, 60:4, 

82:18, 126:25, 131:2, 132:3, 

135:9, 136:8, 161:12, 164:9, 

166:3, 179:7, 180:11, 180:14, 

184:7, 185:1, 194:23, 200:4, 

200:20, 201:8, 201:14, 

201:24, 201:24, 207:18, 

208:6, 208:10, 210:21, 

240:16, 246:3, 248:9

Morones 150:13, 150:17, 

154:10, 157:12, 157:23, 

158:1

mortgage 178:13

mostly 37:6, 84:10, 87:18, 

89:16

mother 10:4, 141:9, 170:20, 

174:1

Motorcycles 81:12

Mount 123:21

mouth 132:22

move 66:2, 88:11, 92:15, 

93:1, 186:8, 190:20, 256:2

moved 39:22, 63:9, 133:5, 

141:9, 146:9, 148:21, 174:4, 

221:7, 221:22, 231:12

movement 229:2

moves 113:3

MSO 116:21

Mufid 2:22

multi-denomination 37:11

multi-denominational 41:13

multi-page 76:10

multiple 6:19, 12:15, 21:13

municipal 148:4

Munoz 158:2, 158:4, 164:13, 

167:1

murder 22:21, 175:16, 

237:13

Museum 153:23, 154:22, 

154:23

Music 17:17, 37:9, 95:4, 98:2

Muslims 7:20, 8:2, 16:10, 

16:13, 27:25, 28:12, 48:3, 

52:8, 72:4, 72:10, 97:18, 

97:21, 119:15, 120:15, 

137:23, 138:4, 138:6, 145:5, 

161:23, 190:21, 191:2, 

191:21, 215:4, 217:12, 

229:20, 229:23, 242:4, 242:7, 

242:13, 242:19

myself 20:7, 189:10, 238:22, 

251:11

< N >

named 85:7, 102:22, 137:12, 

160:6

namely 42:13, 88:17

names 64:7, 107:25, 133:13, 

180:19

NANCY 2:4

Nathan 1:29, 208:1, 230:3

National 60:23, 61:9, 143:10

nationality 107:1, 109:23

nationally 229:6

native 122:5, 214:5

natural 257:25

nature 4:22, 13:17, 26:21, 

32:18, 33:7, 43:6, 64:19, 

121:5, 125:15, 137:15, 

176:25, 189:5, 198:17, 

198:24, 227:23

Navarro 61:15

NCO 120:19

NCOIC 117:7, 117:10

Neal 44:5, 44:6, 50:3, 53:11, 

54:18

Near 4:7, 7:3, 67:1, 75:20, 

91:19, 138:5

necessarily 18:24, 43:10, 

129:12, 130:9, 156:13, 179:3, 

204:15

necessary 63:25

necklaces 52:11

need 8:1, 28:17, 38:2, 56:1, 

61:21, 91:13, 114:17, 127:21, 

128:2, 129:4, 129:16, 130:18, 

133:3, 149:9, 161:16, 163:11, 

193:19, 195:15, 198:5, 204:6, 

205:11, 218:6, 239:6, 239:22, 

243:22, 244:2, 256:17, 

258:11, 258:15, 260:14, 

260:14, 260:17, 260:17, 

260:25, 261:7

needed 26:4, 26:4, 39:11, 

133:17, 227:22, 258:9, 

260:23

Needless 132:19

needs 171:13, 239:4, 239:5, 

239:23

needy 197:10, 199:13

negative 9:2, 134:16, 

161:21, 228:18

negatively 100:16, 134:8

neighbor 128:24

neighborhood 95:6, 95:7, 

95:17

Neither 259:12

nephew 22:17, 23:5

nerveracking 96:8

nervous 84:19, 86:4, 88:21, 

88:24, 90:9, 92:16, 96:6

nervousness 89:9

New 2:18, 39:19, 40:2, 40:5, 

45:18, 53:7, 79:9, 105:23, 

152:21, 153:23, 154:15, 

154:21, 168:21, 219:15, 

221:6, 221:8

newspaper 142:5, 249:11, 

252:24, 253:2

Newspapers 25:13, 27:11, 

92:11, 102:8, 108:11, 108:14, 

112:21, 112:22, 126:19, 

136:1, 150:8, 157:19, 167:6, 

168:12, 177:22, 186:4, 188:7, 

188:12, 194:15, 200:16, 
212:4, 234:13, 240:9, 248:2, 

252:25, 253:8, 254:18, 

255:24

next 57:11, 66:2, 82:14, 

186:19, 217:16, 241:25, 

246:18, 263:5

Nicaragua 139:21

nice 28:10, 48:5

niece 147:7, 152:21, 153:2, 

153:18, 153:19, 154:15

Nigeria 145:9

night 50:22, 52:17, 108:18, 

118:16, 151:18, 151:19, 

151:22, 152:1, 152:2, 152:3, 

152:8, 169:24, 169:25, 

170:12, 263:7

nights 101:20

nine 155:10, 155:19, 218:1, 

261:2, 264:5

nineties 175:23, 175:23

ninety 232:3

NM 2:9

Nobody 152:23, 163:11, 

164:7, 182:24

nods 117:14, 250:3

non 134:23

noncitizen 74:17

noncitizens 48:14, 49:1, 

174:21, 174:22

None 139:4

noon 114:9, 256:19

normally 11:15, 114:23, 

166:19

North 122:14, 154:20

NORTHERN 1:2, 1:32, 38:19, 

50:4, 60:11, 75:3, 218:20, 

252:11, 265:19

Northrup 70:24, 71:1, 72:7, 

75:7, 75:17

notes 90:24, 91:3, 261:20, 

262:7

Nothing 34:11, 97:2, 99:13, 

100:15, 141:11, 143:6, 

148:15, 169:3, 193:11, 

200:23, 220:19, 245:24

notice 128:14, 129:23, 

132:13, 132:21, 140:17, 

141:2, 245:9, 258:11

noticed 31:23

notify 261:8

notion 62:8

notions 7:12

November 15:12, 15:14, 

118:4, 118:5

Nowadays 27:25, 131:15

nowhere 130:22

nuclear 228:1, 232:6

Number 1:7, 114:13, 114:18, 

114:25, 115:2, 151:10, 

210:18, 229:18, 262:19, 

262:20

nurse 16:19, 21:3

nursing 19:11, 61:13, 61:14

NY 2:18

< O >

o'clock 56:11, 61:22, 66:11, 

96:21, 114:25, 115:3, 115:13, 

155:10, 155:19, 155:20, 

218:1, 218:1, 258:13, 261:2, 

264:5

O'connell 106:20

O'o'riley 83:14

O'riley 87:7

Oak 37:6, 56:6, 56:7, 61:2, 

61:11, 143:14, 242:3

object 18:7

objection 66:23, 82:12, 

157:24, 186:16, 256:8, 

257:11, 261:23

objective 255:1

obligation 123:11

observant 52:12, 52:17

observe 67:3

Obviously 44:25, 90:7, 

120:9, 122:25, 189:19, 

190:23, 204:14

Occasionally 52:23, 128:23

occupation 133:15

Occupied 130:3, 197:11, 

198:1, 250:10

occurred 26:25, 127:14, 

168:23, 181:15

Octavia 153:6

October 11:3, 65:11, 65:18, 

65:21, 66:4

Odd 11:6, 138:12

Odeh 2:40

Odell 186:20, 192:4, 192:5, 

194:2, 194:7, 194:8

offend 17:19, 17:20

offended 18:11

offense 72:2, 74:6, 74:16, 

144:17, 152:18, 168:16, 

168:17, 225:6

Office 2:16, 2:26, 2:35, 

46:23, 61:11, 79:9, 122:16, 

136:17, 154:13, 258:12

officed 61:2

Officer 45:16, 45:22, 67:23, 

67:25, 73:8, 77:3, 100:20, 

134:23, 175:3, 175:7, 232:2

officers 134:20, 134:24

offices 52:5, 136:16, 187:4

official 265:5

often 107:10, 151:21

Oklahoma 73:8, 75:24, 76:2, 

77:3, 172:25, 236:18

Old 9:25, 51:7, 55:17, 55:20, 

68:19, 140:11, 231:3, 245:7, 

248:21, 248:23

Once 7:16, 7:19, 78:6, 

170:11, 178:8

ones 128:22, 232:24

open 7:11, 52:16, 59:25, 

81:16, 138:19, 191:4, 249:22

opened 164:2

openly 48:1

opens 56:16

operates 219:15

operating 21:2

operational 226:15

operations 70:17, 117:7, 

117:7, 117:9, 117:20

opinion 15:5, 59:11, 103:3, 

105:12, 112:8, 113:4, 116:15, 

155:23, 156:15, 174:20, 

204:13, 204:14, 213:15, 

213:16, 213:18, 213:19, 

224:25, 225:3, 252:1

opinions 15:5, 25:21, 70:9, 

80:5, 80:17, 113:18, 113:19, 

130:13, 137:4, 137:20, 

138:10, 138:11, 151:6, 

161:13, 161:18, 181:11, 

181:16, 183:2, 188:16, 191:1, 

191:3, 196:18, 203:19, 204:7, 

204:10, 205:11, 207:11, 

235:17, 248:13, 250:5, 
250:15

opportunity 4:21, 38:3, 

58:11, 137:1

opposed 261:24

optical 75:11

optimistic 115:4

ordeal 189:5

order 32:25, 114:17, 153:14

orders 39:15, 67:18, 67:21, 

68:1

ordinary 226:14

organizations 37:20, 41:22

organized 95:13

organizing 37:3

original 181:19

Originally 150:25, 219:4, 

221:7

others 57:16, 107:20

otherwise 24:2, 135:15, 

166:11, 177:9

outcome 236:2

outfit 187:21

outlets 128:19

outside 30:18, 104:19, 

123:16, 184:5, 230:14

over/under 96:13

overnight 256:22, 257:1, 

259:8

overseas 21:10, 50:7, 50:8, 

122:25, 223:1, 246:7

overseeing 117:9

overtime 170:3

Overton 146:17

Overy 126:22, 132:6, 132:7, 

135:21

own 18:3, 112:7, 113:23, 

122:1, 128:21, 147:20, 

162:24, 164:6, 164:21, 

181:15, 208:15, 208:16, 

214:10, 215:21, 215:22, 

215:24, 216:1

owned 51:3, 52:17

< P >

P. 2:26

pack 13:17

Padilla 153:6

page 230:11

Pages 265:7

paid 35:1, 65:18, 128:21, 

139:21, 141:21, 195:21

Palestine 94:4, 104:17, 

105:20, 107:2, 107:9, 246:14, 

248:14, 251:5

Palestine-israeli 104:9

Palestinian 105:13, 106:4, 

108:2, 109:25, 250:10

Palestinian-israeli 47:9, 

111:25, 191:13

Palestinians 104:15, 111:13, 

228:21, 242:11

Palestinians-israeli 169:6, 

237:5

pamphlets 46:20

panel 24:11, 65:2, 78:20, 

82:2, 92:5, 102:4, 112:16, 

126:14, 135:22, 141:24, 

150:2, 157:13, 167:2, 177:16, 

185:23, 194:9, 200:10, 

223:23, 234:7, 240:4, 247:21, 

255:18, 259:14, 260:14, 

260:16, 260:18, 260:19, 

261:17, 262:4

Panthers 105:17

paper 25:5, 57:4, 127:8, 

205:19, 226:17, 226:17, 

241:6, 253:10, 254:10, 

254:13

papers 254:9

paperwork 10:6, 202:11, 

227:6, 227:9, 227:11, 227:12, 

227:15

parades 121:4

paragraph 6:2

parents 45:24, 159:9, 

164:16, 215:2

Park 151:20

Parking 106:15

Parkland 214:16, 215:25, 

217:18, 220:12

part 8:17, 13:12, 43:3, 54:5, 

64:1, 76:8, 76:12, 89:9, 

105:20, 106:11, 111:20, 

121:9, 123:23, 128:17, 155:5, 

168:9, 181:14, 205:3, 205:20, 

205:23, 210:1, 213:22, 

254:25, 255:20

partial 248:15, 248:25, 

250:6, 252:15

partiality 251:7, 251:8, 

251:11, 251:14, 251:22

participate 121:3

particular 19:17, 66:8, 

92:15, 106:16, 109:2, 136:11, 

193:11, 213:24

particularly 4:17, 28:14, 

215:11, 254:4

parties 5:2, 22:1, 23:13, 

24:21, 33:22, 44:5, 55:4, 

68:9, 79:4, 82:16, 91:20, 

93:7, 102:16, 105:11, 115:16, 

126:23, 136:5, 142:14, 

150:15, 158:2, 167:10, 178:3, 

186:22, 194:21, 201:20, 

212:7, 224:6, 234:19, 248:7, 

259:19, 261:18

partly 155:1

Parts 83:14, 87:7, 124:15

Paso 7:3

Pass 4:4, 86:20, 183:5

passed 7:17, 132:20, 178:9

past 8:14, 22:23, 26:25, 

127:8, 127:11, 190:21, 191:5, 

202:5

pastor 222:6

patience 68:14, 172:2, 

186:25

Patrol 100:25

patrolling 117:16

Paul 63:9

pay 56:24, 83:11, 83:23, 

84:3, 90:15, 90:17, 90:20, 

113:23, 113:24, 129:17, 

136:2, 150:9, 157:19, 160:9, 

160:11, 171:12, 191:15, 

197:24, 222:25, 240:21

paying 83:5

peak 188:10

pendancy 256:14

pending 77:20, 114:13, 

114:14

penitentiary 22:25

Pennsylvania 231:13

Pentecostal 73:2, 221:19, 

222:2

perceive 213:16

percent 80:15, 206:14, 

232:3, 251:21

peremptory 258:18, 260:10, 
261:6

performance 51:22

Perhaps 83:17, 181:1, 195:1, 

256:18, 263:23

peril 218:4

period 10:9, 68:24, 133:3, 

173:10, 256:17, 263:1

periods 193:25

perk 191:15

permanently 216:15

permissible 91:2

personal 80:17, 104:11, 

133:21, 138:1, 175:12, 

181:16, 182:5, 190:14, 

257:11

personally 71:14, 181:23

persons 8:4, 115:8, 138:1, 

138:17, 216:15, 256:15

pertained 76:12

petroleum 116:25

phone 114:24

photographs 90:20

physical 36:11, 196:8

pick 56:4, 56:13, 66:10, 97:1, 

97:3, 97:7, 101:5, 101:7, 

101:11, 101:21, 152:10, 

203:25

pick-up 95:5

picked 45:7, 45:7, 112:3, 

160:10, 198:13

picking 56:17, 66:6, 250:21

picture 262:9

piece 64:23

pilot 26:3, 26:12, 29:8, 

29:15, 29:16

piloting 29:7, 29:17

pitch 195:11

Pittsburgh 46:9

place 17:9, 37:9, 37:12, 38:4, 

144:16, 221:4, 248:21

places 21:15, 49:16, 49:18, 

51:11, 133:12, 185:20, 203:6

plan 16:1

plane 27:13, 139:21, 141:15

Plano 197:4, 202:6, 209:15

plans 65:17, 141:14

plant 36:16

plants 36:19

PLATT 2:43

Play 72:16, 95:3, 95:22, 

95:24

played 41:25

player 37:2

playing 95:19

plays 95:9

Plaza 2:8

pleasant 28:9

Please 4:7, 84:4, 117:18, 

118:9, 152:13, 171:21, 

212:14, 212:19, 241:25

pleasure 21:11, 21:12

pled 236:6

PO 2:36

Point 4:11, 4:13, 10:19, 

35:17, 95:25, 105:15, 129:18, 

183:1, 183:4, 187:9, 190:15, 

201:7, 237:16, 239:3, 257:13

pointed 47:16, 47:17

points 199:5

police 125:14, 128:20, 

134:24

policy 131:21

political 237:14, 252:1

pool 14:3, 33:13, 43:22, 

54:19, 209:6, 209:9, 211:23

poor 197:11, 200:24

poorest 197:10, 200:24

populace 119:20

portion 117:23, 184:11

pose 15:25, 56:22, 66:12

posed 113:14

poses 195:19

position 82:10, 87:9, 93:2, 

95:24, 113:11, 119:3, 128:9, 

129:15, 129:17, 129:18, 

139:8, 139:15, 171:10, 

186:15, 192:17, 192:19, 

256:6, 257:6, 257:18

positive 161:22, 228:18

possibility 132:25, 141:16, 

152:18, 168:18

possible 33:3, 97:12, 97:12, 

97:17, 226:13

Possibly 33:15, 38:13, 

157:3, 171:17, 171:17, 

179:16, 181:24

Post 122:15

Postal 10:15, 10:21, 11:5, 

35:4, 35:7, 38:22, 39:2

posters 51:15

potential 114:23, 257:7

potentially 193:5

power 27:22

practice 31:16, 47:20, 48:10, 

178:18, 209:20, 209:25, 

210:13

practiced 48:1

Prairie 40:25

pray 52:12

pre-occupy 111:7

pre-planned 4:19, 5:22, 

15:10

preach 37:11

preceding 256:11

preconceived 7:12

preconceptions 28:24, 

204:4

prefer 193:22, 210:8, 210:10

preformed 80:17

prejudice 59:15

prejudices 7:12, 59:11, 

59:18, 242:13

Premium 172:21

prepaid 26:9, 69:3, 69:11, 

141:14

preparation 68:4

preparing 132:10, 132:12

preschool 30:24

prescribed 265:11

present 63:19, 91:21, 128:6, 

135:11

presented 53:22, 63:18, 

91:20, 130:21

presenting 23:14, 149:6

presents 37:18

press 55:14, 136:14, 158:14, 

202:8, 202:20, 240:18

presume 58:23

presumed 74:6, 160:24, 

160:25, 191:23, 243:12, 

250:25, 253:16

presuming 251:20

presumption 63:3, 66:15, 

66:22, 67:4, 73:21, 73:22, 

74:4, 156:23, 160:20, 161:1, 

161:9, 191:22, 191:25, 206:9, 

206:10, 206:13, 206:15, 

206:22, 238:16, 238:18, 

243:10, 243:16, 251:3, 

251:18, 252:4, 253:14, 
253:22, 256:3

pretrial 263:21

Pretty 6:16, 28:21, 33:1, 

46:19, 46:22, 47:10, 48:21, 

49:20, 70:13, 72:15, 85:10, 

117:7, 119:14, 119:20, 

119:24, 120:1, 120:7, 120:17, 

124:3, 124:4, 124:7, 137:16, 

153:1, 161:7, 167:25, 171:13, 

173:11, 189:17, 191:4, 

215:18, 216:10, 225:25, 

226:17, 249:14, 250:17, 

259:14, 260:4

prevent 198:12, 254:7

prevents 71:17

previously 258:19

primarily 248:22

primary 117:6, 117:19, 

128:18

principal 42:10, 88:15, 

96:17, 149:2, 230:18, 232:12, 

246:11, 259:2

print 196:2

printer 195:23

Prior 38:24, 39:1, 61:11, 

61:12, 121:1, 132:21, 209:19, 

233:13

prison 77:10, 77:12, 175:18, 

175:20, 176:2

Private 7:9, 22:1, 101:1, 

209:20, 209:25, 210:9, 

210:13, 221:17

probation 77:23, 125:19

Problem 10:9, 12:24, 13:22, 

15:25, 24:5, 24:8, 26:5, 26:7, 

26:9, 66:13, 72:3, 118:13, 

151:10, 192:14, 192:15, 

194:6, 195:1, 195:2, 195:3, 

195:15, 195:16, 234:3, 

247:17, 262:1

problems 9:20, 48:6, 151:14, 

161:9, 190:18, 199:22, 

226:14, 239:14, 241:17, 

243:15

procedures 226:6

proceedings 173:14, 265:4, 

265:6

processing 36:16, 236:17

processor 36:14

Proctor 136:4, 136:7, 140:7, 

140:9, 141:13, 142:9

Production 241:6

productivity 210:12

profession 39:3

professional 209:20, 215:13

profile 80:22, 205:2

profiling 27:5, 27:7

program 79:10, 79:11

progress 256:12, 256:18, 

256:25, 257:1

prohibits 222:3

project 20:20, 35:18, 36:3, 

36:6, 39:10, 217:17, 217:18, 

217:20, 218:3, 218:7, 220:10, 

238:13

promise 251:24, 252:2, 

252:6, 253:25, 255:14

promote 79:12

pronounced 150:12

proof 63:2, 67:4, 114:1, 

244:3, 244:4

proper 6:14, 12:7

properly 40:16

prosecuting 121:9

prosecution 100:17, 106:11

prosecutor 6:25, 68:16, 

192:6

prosecutors 20:5, 30:12, 

38:19, 50:5, 60:12, 75:4, 

87:3, 99:5, 132:8, 140:10, 

146:6, 164:15, 172:11, 

183:10, 208:3, 218:21, 230:5, 

252:12

prospect 28:18

Protection 53:3, 74:15, 

182:21, 186:10

protections 186:13

prove 54:3, 73:25, 73:25, 

149:8, 149:8, 156:24, 199:9, 

199:11, 199:20, 223:5, 223:6, 

244:7, 244:9, 244:12

proved 120:17, 223:19, 

253:17

proven 42:20, 63:22, 191:23, 

206:24, 251:1

proves 74:7, 161:2, 199:23

provide 37:13, 66:19, 66:19, 

124:1, 149:19

provided 13:6, 20:12, 42:12, 

43:4, 43:16, 54:12, 58:6, 

109:8, 132:1, 149:4, 210:25, 

233:11, 262:24

providing 13:13, 53:14, 

88:16, 126:9, 135:14, 166:3

provocative 131:8

pry 159:2

public 47:14, 89:15

Puerto 21:15, 21:18

pulling 39:14

punished 236:4

purchase 13:15

purchased 177:4

purpose 76:17, 114:16

purposes 247:9

pushed 252:15

pushing 205:11

put 26:1, 37:20, 58:23, 60:2, 

66:18, 81:16, 122:21, 125:19, 

128:4, 133:16, 141:2, 165:19, 

176:12, 193:19, 208:6, 

215:15, 223:8, 228:11, 253:2, 

258:11

putting 168:10, 171:7

< Q >

quality 240:25

quasi 117:13

question 5:12, 5:21, 7:9, 

7:13, 7:23, 8:8, 28:21, 48:16, 

48:17, 48:24, 59:20, 77:14, 

78:15, 80:9, 81:4, 81:7, 

107:8, 113:14, 125:23, 

141:14, 157:1, 164:3, 164:7, 

174:14, 175:1, 175:5, 175:21, 

181:19, 182:6, 193:18, 196:4, 

196:21, 206:3, 235:25, 

246:18, 249:17, 250:4, 255:7, 

257:5

questioned 4:16, 89:15, 

254:2

questioning 4:7, 4:11, 4:13, 

4:22, 92:23, 186:10, 198:10, 

201:9, 208:10

quicker 260:19, 260:24

quickly 152:14, 171:13, 

173:11, 239:6, 239:21

quite 21:10, 92:17, 92:23, 

188:23, 263:1

quitting 37:25, 171:19
< R >

R. 98:7

race 59:15

racing 170:15

radar 236:12, 236:16

radio 47:14, 55:15, 92:11, 

102:8, 112:22, 126:19, 127:6, 

136:2, 142:5, 150:8, 157:19, 

167:7, 177:22, 186:4, 194:15, 

200:16, 212:4, 224:3, 234:13, 

240:10, 240:19, 248:2, 

255:24

raided 136:16

raise 115:21, 262:17

raised 88:7, 174:8, 244:23

raises 137:6

raising 210:2, 245:10

rang 34:13

rangers 31:22

rarely 7:19

ratcheting 260:1

rather 36:11, 37:10

Raytheon 75:20

reach 115:4

reached 25:20, 219:1

reaction 191:8, 191:9

reading 259:19

readjust 118:7, 119:9

ready 4:24, 82:14, 152:23, 

171:5, 186:19

real 21:22, 153:5, 188:24, 

189:2, 189:4

realize 79:8, 80:25

reason 7:8, 43:10, 66:11, 

85:17, 100:5, 113:4, 153:25

reasonable 43:17, 74:1, 

74:7, 156:11, 156:25, 161:2, 

161:4, 191:23, 223:20, 244:4, 

244:7, 244:10

reasons 104:11, 231:17, 

231:18, 249:1

reassure 62:17

rebuilding 130:5, 203:8, 

243:2

recall 23:13, 25:14, 32:10, 

66:6, 116:3, 116:9, 124:21, 

158:17, 193:14, 202:15, 

233:13, 240:23, 249:13

recalls 262:21, 263:14

receive 38:8

received 53:19, 63:14, 

67:22, 89:21, 132:15, 139:1, 

148:1, 176:10

receiving 67:18, 76:8

recent 127:11, 127:11

Recently 34:11, 83:6, 

116:11, 136:23, 158:15, 

159:7, 179:19, 202:8, 202:10, 

213:3, 226:23, 235:11

Recess 4:5, 68:5, 68:7, 

114:10, 115:12, 115:14, 

194:18, 194:19, 264:5

recognition 168:4

recognize 44:15, 70:3, 70:4, 

143:2

records 259:10

Red 56:6, 56:7, 61:2, 61:11, 

137:7

reevaluate 263:18, 263:18

refer 200:21

references 107:24

referral 70:23

referred 41:12, 88:16, 

201:11

referring 9:17

reflect 262:14

Refresh 91:4, 260:12, 

261:21

regard 52:7, 121:17, 132:9

Regarding 23:4, 112:7, 

113:8, 134:21, 248:13, 

263:15

regardless 62:19, 211:15

region 107:12, 109:1

regular 80:3, 124:7, 216:20

regularly 95:9, 128:2

regulated 193:23

rehabilitated 186:11

reiterate 201:4

related 209:24

relates 204:15

relation 35:16

relationship 7:13

relax 84:21, 169:17, 212:14

relevance 18:8

Relief 116:1, 150:20

religion 138:22, 138:24

religious 59:16, 252:1

relocated 76:3

rely 120:16

remainder 114:12

Remember 35:22, 44:23, 

51:19, 64:3, 68:2, 76:8, 

76:13, 80:1, 82:21, 86:4, 

86:10, 99:15, 124:17, 127:15, 

133:13, 134:2, 136:15, 

136:16, 136:17, 136:21, 

158:8, 175:22, 180:2, 187:5, 

187:9, 188:12, 194:24, 

196:22, 197:2, 197:3, 219:2, 

235:13

remembering 196:23

remodeling 171:7

remote 4:8

render 42:22

rendered 22:4

repairs 28:16

Repeat 195:5, 198:21

replace 152:12

report 256:25

reported 4:16

REPORTER 3:1, 265:5, 

265:18

reports 197:25

reprehensible 237:14

representation 256:21, 

257:12, 258:8

representative 257:25

represented 257:22, 257:23

representing 20:6, 38:20, 

50:5, 60:13, 75:5, 87:4, 

106:12, 121:10, 146:6, 

154:13, 172:11, 183:11, 

208:4, 218:22, 244:20, 

252:13, 258:2

request 102:11, 200:19, 

263:15

requested 263:16

requests 114:13

require 147:14, 156:24

required 58:24, 113:18, 

255:4

requirement 80:18, 80:19, 

113:21, 255:5

requirements 67:4, 153:11

requires 59:8, 147:13

research 111:23

reserve 120:20, 232:15, 
232:17

reservist 67:17

residence 10:6, 219:25

resident 49:5, 49:6

residents 49:2, 49:3

resides 10:5

resistance 113:6

resolved 9:22, 77:19, 77:21

resources 56:24

respect 250:5

respond 89:10, 155:16

responder 139:2

response 77:13, 145:6

responsibilities 155:8

responsibility 184:11

responsible 83:21, 156:5

rest 33:15, 54:21, 134:17, 

155:18, 157:15

restaurant 143:14, 146:12

resting 118:14

Restoration 216:4

restore 220:2

restroom 194:1

result 71:22, 96:23, 189:8, 

211:11, 233:20, 238:4

resulted 173:15

retire 123:8

Retired 45:12, 45:13, 148:9

retiring 29:19

return 43:17, 177:3, 177:10

returned 192:17

reviewing 226:5

reviews 128:22

Richardson 25:16, 44:19, 

150:25, 168:1, 197:4, 202:4, 

209:19, 224:19

Richland 138:5

Rico 21:15, 21:18

rid 251:10, 251:13

riding 81:20

rights 48:15, 48:19, 48:19, 

48:22, 48:23, 49:7, 49:15, 

73:15, 131:6, 174:21, 185:14

Riley 159:15

ring 14:25, 25:10, 34:7, 62:9, 

94:4, 151:1, 224:19

Rm 3:2

Road 146:17

role 259:20, 259:21

Roman 49:19

roof 171:8

room 21:3, 50:11, 121:12, 

130:22, 162:9, 163:7, 163:8, 

261:5, 261:16

Rosalez 68:8, 74:25, 75:1, 

78:19

route 118:3, 122:22, 122:25, 

123:1

routes 119:21

row 254:19

Rowlett 75:22

Ruidoso 6:10

Run 117:23, 118:3, 152:9, 

225:17, 225:18, 225:22, 

246:9, 261:19

running 117:8, 134:10, 

232:9

runs 216:2, 216:4

< S >

S. 223:11

safe 119:14

safety 89:14, 89:14, 189:6, 

189:7, 189:13, 189:17, 

189:19, 189:22, 189:23, 

190:14

Saint 63:9

sake 9:24

sales 51:23, 79:10, 187:18

Sam 151:19

sargeant 116:18, 117:13

sat 8:22, 239:22

satisfied 256:13

Saturday 151:25

Saturdays 87:18

saw 15:3, 27:11, 27:18, 

35:15, 67:16, 76:14, 81:12, 

107:24, 131:23, 152:22, 

152:24, 155:4, 188:11

saying 18:16, 18:19, 18:19, 

18:23, 49:4, 57:19, 59:7, 

98:22, 98:24, 112:5, 205:22

says 18:10, 18:20, 29:13, 

42:20, 56:24, 64:18, 85:4, 

110:3, 156:23, 160:4, 174:13, 

175:2, 176:18, 243:4, 243:8, 

251:19

scanned 80:25

scared 92:16

scary 58:13, 66:17

scenes 170:25, 171:2

schedule 26:3, 26:5, 87:15, 

114:12, 258:16, 258:23

scheduled 129:21

schedules 210:16

scheduling 263:5

scheme 235:7, 235:7

scholarships 37:13

School 37:10, 37:16, 40:24, 

42:2, 56:6, 61:6, 61:13, 

61:14, 95:22, 122:7, 122:10, 

133:6, 133:10, 159:12, 

159:13, 162:4, 163:21, 

163:22, 169:14, 169:19, 

169:21, 169:23, 170:1, 171:5, 

173:6, 173:11, 173:19, 178:6, 

186:12, 209:12, 209:19, 

210:6, 210:10, 210:19, 

221:17, 230:18, 230:21, 

236:24, 242:2, 242:3

schooled 41:2, 41:8

schooling 29:15

schools 41:4, 133:1, 133:17, 

210:3, 210:8, 210:15, 211:17

scopes 71:11

Scouts 121:4, 121:4

seat 254:19

second 25:23, 29:18, 31:1, 

90:2, 90:3, 107:16

Secondly 66:6, 223:11

secret 227:22

secrets 227:24

Section 263:20

security 27:11, 29:23, 30:1, 

30:3, 36:5, 71:3, 100:20, 

189:6, 189:8, 227:22

seeing 127:7, 136:15, 

136:21, 187:21, 187:24, 

210:4

seeking 125:1

seem 66:4, 91:16, 229:9, 

229:18

seemed 114:5, 120:1, 249:1, 

260:22

seems 21:9, 201:13, 225:21, 

229:17

seen 44:20, 64:6, 108:20, 

109:8, 136:23, 185:10, 188:7, 

212:20, 240:17, 253:7
selected 24:12, 43:23, 

54:20, 65:2, 78:21, 91:6, 

132:16, 141:17, 141:19, 

150:3, 168:7, 181:1, 184:13, 

185:24, 192:12, 200:11, 

211:24, 223:24, 234:8, 240:5, 

247:22, 255:19

selection 235:13

self 238:3

sell 56:20

send 30:2, 211:13, 211:14, 

216:12, 233:20, 233:21, 

261:4

sending 247:6, 263:19

senior 45:22

sense 228:20, 237:9, 237:11, 

254:5, 263:24

sensitive 188:6, 193:17

sent 130:2, 160:2, 175:20, 

177:4, 197:8, 200:22, 200:23, 

203:5, 242:25, 246:6, 246:13, 

247:9, 250:9, 263:14, 263:17

sentence 6:2

sentenced 22:24

sentiment 261:16

separate 21:18

separation 9:14, 9:16, 10:17

September 69:4

series 128:18

serious 74:15, 85:10, 129:6, 

129:12, 129:12, 137:16, 

161:8, 167:25, 180:24, 197:6, 

197:7, 198:4, 199:9, 253:23

seriously 181:3, 181:17

seriousness 181:23

serve 10:8, 16:8, 111:8, 

113:9, 129:9, 134:3, 141:17, 

141:19, 184:7, 192:12, 

193:20, 211:3, 211:4, 232:15, 

238:9

served 21:21, 32:8, 53:15, 

89:18, 147:23, 207:14, 209:3, 

232:19, 233:2, 233:5

Service 10:15, 10:21, 11:5, 

11:9, 11:10, 35:4, 38:22, 

39:2, 53:3, 56:1, 103:9, 

121:13, 124:1, 127:23, 209:3, 

217:25, 218:4, 218:5, 219:18, 

219:19, 233:13, 239:4, 239:8, 

241:22, 243:25

services 64:12, 124:6

serving 50:8, 92:24, 110:17, 

181:5, 256:16

session 115:5, 115:9, 

258:15, 261:3, 261:5

set 4:9, 18:4, 81:5, 103:17, 

113:22

setting 112:6

Seven 35:9, 35:10, 39:20, 

88:10, 120:21, 139:14, 

169:15, 172:15, 183:22, 

208:20

seventeen 140:11

seventies 27:19, 123:6, 

141:7, 227:16

several 4:16, 14:23, 32:8, 

39:1, 42:11, 44:12, 93:24, 

249:10

severe 129:5

Shah 27:21

Shakes 170:6

Shapiro 1:28, 9:10, 30:12, 

30:24, 32:2, 183:10, 244:20

share 37:12, 205:1, 254:24

sheet 132:16

Sherman 172:25, 236:19

Shiekh 119:21

ship 94:14

shipping 193:13

shop 31:21, 128:13

shopper 128:20

short 133:3

shorter 96:12, 171:17

shortly 128:9

show 177:13, 221:18

showed 177:11, 199:12

shower 165:4

shown 265:6

shows 109:12

Shukri 2:1

siblings 215:2

sick 27:23

side 22:18, 92:25, 169:11, 

169:11, 179:15, 237:15, 

257:14, 259:12, 261:16

sidebar 193:22

sides 53:22, 62:5, 63:18, 

90:16, 92:20, 135:11, 149:6, 

149:7, 201:16, 228:22, 

246:20, 255:10

sign 81:16

significance 248:16

significant 189:17

silence 178:23, 182:7, 185:2

Similar 183:25

simple 28:21

simply 105:20, 200:21

Singapore 219:7, 219:8, 

219:12

Single 55:22, 56:5, 68:18, 

83:21, 251:20

sister 147:2, 147:7, 147:8, 

147:11, 147:13, 147:17, 

154:20

sisters 165:15, 165:16

sit 8:21, 58:24, 85:21, 85:23, 

154:2, 161:18, 168:22, 

170:18, 182:13, 191:19, 

204:17, 205:22, 239:18, 

250:1, 251:3

sites 236:23

sits 74:5, 206:2

sitting 58:8, 59:20, 80:19, 

85:14, 111:3, 111:5, 138:17, 

144:18, 160:15, 193:25, 

250:20, 260:18, 260:25

situation 5:20, 11:19, 26:23, 

68:18, 84:14, 84:22, 102:12, 

112:8, 125:21, 125:25, 

168:11, 181:21, 217:24, 

218:6

situations 26:25

Six 56:4, 56:14, 61:21, 

61:22, 66:10, 106:22, 114:18, 

170:3, 183:22

sixty 260:5

skimmed 249:14

skittish 118:11, 119:9

slang 12:6

sleep 101:24, 101:25, 

155:17, 155:19

sleeping 118:13

Slightly 201:15, 205:14

slipped 67:13

small 31:15, 213:21, 222:16

smaller 60:24

SMU 154:19

snack 94:11, 94:13

snippet 130:11

snow 231:16
Soccer 72:17, 72:18

social 121:4, 124:4

socialize 118:13

software 236:22, 236:23

sold 236:18

soldiers 70:14

solutions 187:17, 187:19

Somebody 18:5, 18:12, 

23:10, 27:1, 105:14, 107:14, 

169:10, 169:11, 181:19, 

226:9, 227:15, 253:2, 253:11

somehow 130:6, 160:5, 

197:15, 203:10, 227:3, 243:9

Someone 6:2, 27:5, 42:1, 

46:22, 48:22, 59:22, 69:19, 

84:15, 84:22, 107:11, 119:13, 

132:1, 134:4, 164:1, 178:23, 

186:12, 241:20

sometime 240:6

Sometimes 16:4, 87:18, 

101:13, 101:25, 120:23, 

152:10, 170:17, 179:12, 

227:7, 227:7

Somewhat 104:9, 105:17, 

109:17, 133:20, 184:12, 

228:23, 252:15

Somewhere 7:3

son 72:14, 125:5, 125:13, 

173:22, 244:25, 245:5, 

262:25

Sonepur 214:2

sons 21:5, 51:3, 52:18

SOR 75:10

sorry 5:19, 67:12, 85:16, 

153:1, 154:1, 154:7, 207:10, 

242:17, 243:24

sort 29:24, 36:4, 37:3, 

105:16, 128:3, 144:23, 

193:13, 194:1, 203:9

sorts 233:24

sound 137:16

Sounds 28:8, 40:11, 104:19, 

184:2, 187:3, 189:11, 219:24, 

226:1, 230:11, 261:1, 262:6

source 117:21

sources 109:10

South 124:13, 124:15, 

144:13, 213:22, 242:3

southeast 117:23

southern 117:23

Spain 6:12, 184:21

Spaniards 6:11

Spanish 5:24, 6:3, 6:14, 

6:15, 6:18, 12:15, 84:6, 84:8, 

84:10, 84:15, 84:23, 165:20

spare 4:21

speaker 84:6

speaking 48:11, 105:21, 

145:24, 187:13, 187:14, 

191:7

specialty 116:20, 116:24

specifically 79:24, 93:25, 

216:12, 234:23

specifics 131:9, 131:12

Speech 17:4, 17:5, 17:6, 

17:9, 17:11, 17:16, 17:18, 

18:3, 18:5, 18:13, 49:11, 

49:14, 49:17, 49:21, 98:9, 

131:2, 131:3, 131:5, 131:7, 

131:20

spend 170:19, 261:11

spends 42:5

spent 43:16, 54:11, 64:15, 

122:13, 124:12, 126:2, 126:5, 

184:18, 211:16, 233:23

spoken 165:24, 259:1

spoons 241:7

Sports 170:14, 170:15

spots 229:10

spouse 125:1

Spouses 124:25

sprinklers 171:7

spry 152:5

stand 28:23, 80:17, 90:19, 

178:23, 179:6, 181:20, 182:8, 

182:13, 182:16, 260:20

standard 74:2, 260:6

star 232:9

start 160:25, 165:5, 171:6, 

210:6, 259:25, 261:2, 263:8

started 4:3, 29:16, 39:16, 

42:3, 48:18, 116:22, 159:7, 

171:6, 196:23

starting 65:21

startles 119:13

starts 259:24

State 22:8, 39:19, 53:24, 

59:21, 59:23, 73:8, 73:25, 

77:3, 121:17, 122:14, 133:1, 

207:11, 213:22, 214:10, 

214:10, 230:12, 233:6, 233:7

Stated 53:13, 92:17, 132:10, 

193:1, 201:2, 201:8

statement 89:11, 134:21, 

149:14, 175:6

statements 114:1

Statewide 100:24

stating 263:17, 263:20

station 28:2

stationed 53:7, 53:10

status 129:1, 232:16, 257:8, 

257:10, 258:19

stay 4:7, 101:11, 174:1, 

174:6, 221:8

stay-at-home 61:5

stayed 61:12

stays 61:21

steering 248:19

stenotypy 265:5

step 90:16, 147:18

Stepbrothers 165:16

stepfather 39:20

stepson 26:21

stern 259:23

steward 35:12, 35:13

sting 235:14

stolen 81:1, 227:3

Stop 18:16, 18:19, 18:23, 

107:15

store 187:22

stories 108:20, 226:18

Stork 51:7

Storm 236:17

story 29:22, 44:15, 162:18, 

179:15, 213:13, 248:20, 

252:24

straight 232:4

Street 1:34, 2:17, 3:2, 75:21, 

135:8, 191:7

stress 10:17, 92:21

strictly 252:23, 253:2

strike 115:3, 186:8

strikes 261:18

strip 169:18

stroke 15:15

strong 183:2, 204:14

strongly 49:12, 49:14, 49:15, 

53:6, 98:8

struck 113:21, 262:3

study 159:21
stuff 51:16, 51:24, 57:3, 

58:14, 73:6, 149:18, 166:13, 

169:18, 171:8, 195:4, 198:3, 

198:15

style 70:3

subject 58:14, 59:2, 62:20, 

133:19

submit 157:22, 259:3, 259:9

submitted 259:13, 259:18

substantial 81:18

substitute 184:14

substituting 133:1, 133:4

suffer 176:13

sufficient 114:17, 115:2

suing 22:1

suitable 194:4

Suite 2:8, 2:27, 2:45

sum 163:18

summarized 176:16

summary 203:14

summations 53:25

summer 146:23

Summercut 241:4

summertime 170:2

Summit 2:45

summon 205:17

summons 53:20, 57:2, 

63:15, 89:22, 132:15, 148:2, 

155:17

Sunday 222:10, 263:7

Sundays 128:16

sunny 212:15

supervisor 105:5, 105:9, 

106:23

supervisors 107:13

supplement 114:11

supplied 117:21, 176:17, 

176:19

supplies 24:4, 43:6, 149:17, 

177:1, 211:17, 223:15, 

233:24

supply 117:20, 118:3, 

118:15, 119:21

supplying 64:24

supported 41:20, 53:14, 

85:6, 137:11, 248:15, 249:5

supporting 64:23, 170:22, 

249:15

suppose 251:13, 255:7

supposed 15:11, 27:5, 

42:16, 49:8, 63:21, 79:13, 

127:9, 190:4

suppress 18:5

surmise 154:25

surprise 168:3, 168:7

surround 124:4

surroundings 118:12

suspect 64:10, 223:9, 

223:11, 223:24

suspicious 27:6, 191:6

Sustained 18:9

sympathy 154:14

Syndrome 262:25

system 23:6, 78:13, 100:13, 

114:22, 125:21, 176:11, 

188:25, 190:5, 236:17, 

238:17, 245:22, 253:18, 

258:11

Systems 40:15, 40:17, 

41:18, 106:16, 236:13, 

236:18

< T >

table 120:2

Tactical 228:1

talked 9:15, 11:18, 28:6, 

31:19, 47:24, 52:21, 52:24, 

57:1, 67:10, 67:19, 108:7, 

109:6, 162:5, 191:20, 250:5

Tampa 2:37

tank 71:20

tanks 20:18, 71:12, 71:13

tape 126:2

tapes 86:9

tasked 117:22

taught 133:17

Taylor 55:3, 55:5, 60:7, 60:8, 

65:1, 65:17, 65:24, 66:24, 

67:9, 167:9, 167:13, 172:7, 

172:9, 177:15

teach 27:4, 133:11

teacher 133:8, 133:9

Teaching 11:16, 132:25, 

133:7

team 121:9

teams 72:21, 95:11, 95:12

tech 20:14, 70:11

technically 260:16

technology 187:18

telephone 114:22, 258:11

television 92:11, 102:8, 

106:1, 109:8, 112:22, 126:19, 

127:5, 131:15, 136:1, 142:5, 

150:8, 157:18, 160:8, 167:6, 

177:22, 186:4, 194:15, 

200:16, 212:4, 224:3, 234:13, 

240:9, 248:2, 255:24

tells 23:16, 54:2, 226:18

Ten 68:18, 87:8, 139:14, 

208:20, 241:13

tend 195:4

TERESA 2:5

term 73:22, 161:3, 242:20

terminated 103:18

terms 51:13, 51:25, 56:21, 

59:8, 85:21, 88:23, 200:25, 

209:6, 255:10

Territories 130:3, 197:12, 

198:1, 203:6, 250:11

territory 119:22

terror 229:5

terrorism-related 130:13

terrorists 58:19, 111:15, 

156:9, 156:11

test 241:10

Testament 248:21, 248:23

testify 73:16, 73:17, 134:5, 

178:24, 185:5

testimony 53:23, 63:18, 

80:15, 134:8, 134:20, 134:22, 

135:3, 135:4, 175:3, 175:8

TEXAS 1:2, 1:32, 1:35, 2:28, 

2:46, 3:3, 20:14, 38:19, 

38:25, 39:8, 40:3, 50:4, 

60:12, 61:10, 75:3, 88:12, 

121:2, 122:14, 148:18, 

150:25, 174:6, 218:20, 

231:15, 236:25, 252:12, 

265:19

text 12:4

theft 80:20, 190:8, 190:9

themselves 128:21

therapy 210:1, 210:14

thinking 6:17, 48:18, 110:17, 

111:10, 130:16, 133:4, 197:2, 

203:20, 261:12

thinks 259:24

thirtee 208:20

thirty 52:2, 52:3, 52:4, 260:7, 
261:4

Thirty-one 123:4, 123:10, 

123:14, 231:3, 245:8

Thirty-six 16:23, 21:1

though 43:14, 166:18, 

226:14, 253:20

thoughts 19:5, 58:21, 131:5, 

160:13, 160:18, 162:22, 

203:17, 204:20, 204:24, 

208:6, 250:15

thousand 263:16

thousands 228:17

threatening 47:7

three 5:13, 8:14, 9:25, 36:7, 

40:3, 55:25, 56:22, 77:7, 

83:16, 87:22, 100:9, 114:25, 

115:3, 115:10, 128:8, 128:10, 

128:23, 132:14, 153:4, 

155:20, 169:19, 174:11, 

195:13, 208:19, 208:25, 

226:22, 227:21, 228:2, 

232:13, 232:19, 258:13

three- 92:19

three-man 152:9

three-month 39:10

threshhold 115:4

throughout 128:19

throw 6:21

Thursday 15:24, 96:18, 

103:16, 115:10, 119:1, 

171:18, 218:2, 239:11

TI 20:20, 35:25

tickets 69:9, 139:21, 139:24, 

141:15, 141:21

tidbits 4:4, 180:21

ties 199:25

Tim 236:9, 236:10

time-off 173:10

tired 147:18

Titan 35:17, 35:20, 36:2

title 19:4, 28:20, 34:16, 

120:10, 217:9, 225:5

today 33:15, 43:24, 54:21, 

92:7, 112:18, 115:3, 142:1, 

157:15, 177:18, 181:9, 

183:12, 185:25, 194:11, 

198:10, 200:12, 202:19, 

205:19, 209:6, 211:25, 234:9, 

251:4, 256:11, 256:12, 

258:10

together 7:6, 67:20, 168:10, 

169:8, 169:12, 208:16, 

261:19, 262:17

tomorrow 33:16, 43:24, 

54:22, 65:4, 78:22, 82:3, 

92:7, 112:18, 126:16, 142:2, 

150:4, 157:15, 177:18, 186:1, 

194:11, 200:12, 211:25, 

223:25, 234:9, 240:6, 247:23, 

255:20, 256:18, 258:13, 

259:3, 264:5

toned 111:23

tonight 263:19

took 106:3, 110:15, 110:15, 

129:22, 144:9, 207:6, 219:12, 

265:5

Torrez 4:25, 5:1, 5:4, 9:8, 

14:2

touch 37:20, 67:25, 210:23

touched 233:10

touchy 59:2

Tough 140:12, 167:20, 

167:21

tours 124:12

towards 81:3, 251:7

Tower 2:44

Towers 106:19

town 123:23, 213:21

Track 86:14, 92:18, 236:17

trade 232:7

traded 28:1

traffic 56:9

trail 226:17, 226:17

trained 67:20

training 26:18, 29:15, 51:23, 

51:23, 67:18, 71:22, 79:10, 

139:2, 139:2, 232:2

transcribed 265:6

transcript 265:8, 265:10

transcripts 84:13, 86:9, 

131:4

Transit 139:12

translated 11:20

translating 6:2, 84:15, 84:22

translation 12:1, 12:10, 

12:11, 12:12, 12:20, 12:21, 

84:13

translations 11:22, 11:24

transmissions 12:4

travel 15:10

traveled 21:9

Traveling 184:20

treat 19:15

treated 23:5, 23:7, 78:12, 

100:12, 125:21, 176:11, 

245:21

treating 19:20

tremendous 92:24

trends 228:18

trial. 113:16

trials 58:1, 62:22, 237:22, 

237:22

tricky 48:16, 48:24, 49:5

tried 27:2, 229:17

Trinity 159:20

trip 6:10, 21:16, 21:17, 

21:18, 79:11, 79:13, 141:16, 

141:20

trips 21:11, 21:13, 21:16

trouble 38:10

troublesome 194:6

truck 28:16, 164:19, 172:18, 

173:6, 187:16

trucking 29:14

true 6:20, 9:4, 109:5, 220:25, 

253:6, 253:12, 254:13, 265:8

trust 119:25, 119:25, 120:4, 

227:15

trustworthy 120:18

try 7:10, 59:4, 59:8, 59:14, 

66:18, 72:20, 105:9, 170:18, 

170:19, 191:4, 198:2, 220:1, 

254:21, 254:21, 255:1, 

255:14, 261:19

Trying 39:7, 85:20, 108:4, 

118:6, 119:8, 120:12, 199:1, 

201:14, 237:9

Tuesday 151:25

Tulsa 236:18

Turn 119:3, 128:22, 131:16, 

131:17

turned 81:15, 126:3, 127:8, 

128:22

turns 56:9, 67:19

TV 8:13, 15:2, 55:15, 70:7, 

109:12, 170:10, 170:12, 

170:13, 240:18

tw 57:11

twelve 62:14, 62:15

Twenty 29:13, 69:18, 
122:17, 123:9, 222:17, 

222:18, 222:19, 222:20, 

226:25, 231:9

Twenty-eight 21:4

twenty-five 56:8, 81:15, 

141:3

twenty-four 67:13, 219:17, 

219:19, 222:10

twenty-three 195:24

Twenty-two 124:11, 192:9

twice 78:6

twin 147:7, 147:8, 147:17

Two 8:14, 21:5, 22:1, 24:13, 

29:13, 36:17, 37:22, 39:4, 

40:24, 60:19, 75:8, 77:7, 

77:15, 90:1, 128:3, 129:13, 

133:17, 134:11, 143:13, 

152:10, 154:17, 155:20, 

173:13, 173:21, 174:11, 

175:14, 184:1, 187:21, 190:9, 

191:7, 209:2, 216:10, 219:14, 

220:5, 222:17, 249:1, 256:11

Tyler 121:2

Type 24:4, 32:16, 42:21, 

45:4, 54:4, 64:11, 69:17, 

87:13, 109:12, 120:2, 121:3, 

126:6, 127:25, 128:19, 

132:22, 149:18, 149:18, 

149:19, 153:12, 153:13, 

165:6, 181:20, 208:13, 

223:12, 226:11, 226:15, 

230:17, 253:22, 253:23

typically 194:2

< U >

U. 223:11

ultimate 157:1

ultimately 80:11, 236:6

uncles 153:4, 153:4

undercover 128:20

underprivileged 37:5, 37:8

understand 5:20, 13:4, 

42:23, 89:6, 99:6, 104:12, 

104:13, 104:14, 104:16, 

105:10, 105:13, 106:3, 108:5, 

109:3, 109:24, 110:20, 112:5, 

112:13, 112:25, 149:20, 

174:19, 179:5, 185:16, 

192:14, 193:21, 209:11, 

223:8, 225:22, 234:16, 239:7, 

243:12, 246:8, 247:13, 

252:18, 255:3, 261:24

understanding 105:25, 

107:11, 154:24, 258:2

understood 67:25

uneasiness 27:8

unemployed 5:12, 5:16, 

99:19, 128:5, 158:23

unequivocal 186:11

unfailingly 206:15

unfair 156:13

Unfortunately 110:14, 257:8

Union 35:6, 35:7, 35:8, 

139:6, 139:9, 139:11, 139:12, 

139:16

unions 35:10

unit 121:1, 121:2

University 46:9

unless 12:16, 74:6, 253:17

unnecessary 5:21

unpleasant 8:2

upcoming 76:14

update 67:11, 258:25

UPS 187:14, 187:24, 188:3, 

192:8, 193:3

Upstate 40:5

Urban 106:19

usage 125:17

uses 258:12

using 200:25

usual 222:11

utilized 121:20

utilizing 4:10

< V >

VA 16:25, 20:25, 121:19

Vacation 65:11, 65:17, 66:1, 

66:3, 69:17, 129:22, 142:9, 

173:8, 184:22, 184:23

vacations 4:19, 5:22, 26:9, 

69:3, 129:20

Valley 159:19, 159:20

valuable 74:14

value 17:25, 18:1, 220:13

variety 210:15, 210:17

various 258:19

vary 87:16

verdict 22:5, 42:23, 43:17, 

110:10, 110:24, 113:15, 

177:3, 177:10, 223:18

versa 71:19

VERSUS 1:10, 14:21, 25:3, 

34:2, 48:14, 69:25, 79:22, 

93:19, 102:19, 116:1, 134:23, 

142:23, 150:20, 167:15, 

187:1, 224:13, 234:24

veterans 19:15, 19:21, 19:21

vice 71:19

victim 23:9

video 126:2

videos 86:9, 90:19

Vietnam 19:22, 232:4

view 11:14, 105:16, 115:11

views 111:19, 252:15

violation 54:10, 54:13, 64:19

violent 38:11, 217:6, 217:7

vision 151:11

visit 73:2, 187:6, 193:5

visits 190:24, 262:24

voice 94:8, 115:21

VOIR 1:18, 115:9, 258:15, 

259:15, 259:20, 260:6, 261:3

voir-dired 261:5

volition 113:23

VOLUME 1:17

voluntary 144:8, 144:9, 

145:1

volunteer 104:20, 216:17

Volunteering 8:15, 105:1

Voss 93:7, 93:11, 99:2, 

102:3

< W >

wages 104:6

wait 68:13, 68:14

waiting 79:19, 93:16, 

142:18, 172:3, 186:25, 

212:13, 240:15, 248:9

Waitress 146:20, 146:22

Wal-mart 39:15, 73:13, 77:9

walk 10:18

Walker 235:21

Wall 2:17

wallet 31:11

walls 94:8

wanted 4:4, 4:20, 13:4, 18:6, 

29:21, 67:11, 67:14, 107:10, 
115:10, 144:12, 163:5, 175:1, 

246:4, 258:25, 263:1

wanting 181:20

wants 12:24, 203:25, 250:1, 

257:15, 261:13

War 19:20, 35:21, 104:17, 

110:13, 229:4, 237:8

warehouse 11:6, 39:14, 

94:10, 99:21

wars 19:23

wash 163:8

watch 14:9, 24:17, 33:19, 

44:3, 54:25, 55:18, 57:23, 

65:7, 78:25, 82:6, 92:12, 

102:9, 108:18, 112:23, 

126:20, 142:6, 143:8, 170:10, 

177:23, 177:24, 177:25, 

179:21, 186:5, 194:16, 

200:17, 212:5, 217:4, 217:7, 

224:4, 234:14, 240:10, 248:3, 

255:25

watched 8:13, 197:25

watching 74:11, 163:11, 

170:12

water 117:21, 216:7, 220:1

Waxahachie 56:6, 60:25, 

61:2, 61:10, 61:15, 63:9

ways 114:19, 190:9

weapons 228:1, 232:6

wear 138:13, 151:12

weather 144:14, 236:12

wedding 69:20, 76:18, 76:20

Wednesday 81:17

week 42:5, 65:21, 66:4, 

76:25, 103:16, 114:12, 

118:25, 151:23, 162:13, 

217:25, 221:9, 239:8, 239:9, 

239:11, 241:15, 263:5

weekend 79:11, 79:16

weekends 87:16

weekly 222:8

weeks 5:7, 8:14, 55:10, 

82:21, 99:16, 134:11, 136:10, 

158:9, 174:11, 193:15, 

248:12

weigh 192:20, 207:14, 255:9

weighing 48:17

weight 31:25, 134:22, 175:4, 

175:4, 175:8

welcome 69:24, 93:17

West 130:3, 197:11, 203:5, 

203:6, 246:14, 250:10

Western 39:16, 231:13

Whatever 17:7, 20:20, 27:1, 

28:22, 169:7, 177:7, 185:16, 

213:4, 215:3, 254:18, 255:4, 

259:9

whatsoever 206:3

whenever 226:8

whether 17:17, 21:23, 45:1, 

48:14, 103:4, 129:8, 130:19, 

146:19, 151:6, 190:11, 

190:13, 191:22, 201:7, 213:7, 

224:25, 242:12, 257:5, 257:9, 

260:23

whoa 58:20

whole 51:19, 58:15, 59:4, 

76:6, 158:20, 168:20, 168:23, 

169:19, 189:24, 202:4, 

213:13

whom 102:4, 126:14, 

157:14, 167:2, 200:10

wife 30:18, 52:18, 103:25, 

104:1, 125:10, 125:12, 140:3, 

216:1, 219:3, 219:15, 220:20, 

220:25, 230:14, 262:23

willing 229:2

wind 114:18

Window 10:22

windows 71:12, 71:20

Wing 95:25

wish 262:22

wishes 263:7

within 17:7, 187:12, 196:24, 

241:24

Without 193:25, 227:24, 

251:21, 251:21, 259:16

Witness 23:3, 80:16, 90:19, 

117:14, 175:5, 250:3, 259:19, 

263:6

witnesses 63:18, 90:18, 

91:21

women 138:13, 162:6, 164:4

wonder 182:14, 191:10, 

244:8

wonderful 250:24

wondering 55:13, 127:5, 

158:13, 159:5, 195:18, 

260:21

word 4:18, 11:20, 12:6, 

12:16, 59:5, 59:16, 62:9, 

63:24, 88:23, 111:23, 130:10, 

223:7, 239:21

words 6:3, 6:18, 6:19, 6:19, 

12:3, 12:15, 54:4, 54:4, 

84:23, 94:2, 130:20, 132:22, 

149:9, 223:7, 247:10

wore 52:10

Workers 35:7, 80:4

working 10:21, 29:16, 45:14, 

81:14, 99:21, 128:17, 133:2, 

149:3, 152:8, 154:22, 169:19, 

176:17, 187:7, 210:12

Works 31:2, 31:9, 31:10, 

40:14, 45:14, 45:15, 73:13, 

77:2, 77:9, 100:22, 100:23, 

164:18, 165:1, 183:17, 190:5, 

238:17

World 37:1, 37:4, 37:7, 

41:13, 41:23, 203:7, 223:1, 

229:7, 229:11, 237:10, 

248:22

worried 189:7, 189:12, 

189:16, 239:19

worry 85:14

worrying 189:24

Worth 2:46, 39:18, 63:7, 

128:19, 230:23

wrestler 31:23

write 50:10, 236:22

writing 259:3

written 92:1

wrote 253:11, 254:18

< Y >

year 9:25, 39:23, 55:17, 

55:20, 60:18, 61:11, 68:19, 

80:1, 94:20, 116:12, 116:18, 

122:13, 133:18, 140:11, 

152:22, 165:11, 209:18, 

209:18, 210:6, 216:21

yesterday 4:11, 4:16, 67:24, 

69:16, 114:11, 115:11, 

235:12, 256:20, 262:21

York 2:18, 39:19, 40:2, 40:5, 

152:21, 153:24, 154:16, 

154:21, 221:6, 221:8

Young 30:24, 39:4, 66:3, 

66:14, 153:5, 162:23, 219:14
youngest 153:4, 262:25

yourself 73:17, 91:25, 

103:24, 164:2, 175:12, 

182:17, 191:6, 211:9, 251:13

Youth 37:1, 37:4, 37:6, 37:7, 

37:8, 41:13, 41:23

Yucatan 76:23

< Z >

Zeigler 46:13, 46:15, 46:18, 

50:15, 50:16, 51:20

Zig 46:12, 46:15, 46:17, 

50:16, 51:20

zip 25:18

< Dates >

july 18, 2007 1:13, 1:13, 1:13

september 1988 146:10, 

146:10