Subcommittee on Aircraft Safety 

Spring 2103 Meeting Minutes

Meeting location: William J. Hughes Technical Center, Atlantic City, NJ

Meeting date: March 12 – 14, 2013 

Purpose: SAS Guidance Review for FY 

2015 R&D Budget 

Facilitator: John Wiley, FAA DFO

Note taker: Jim White, Lumark Technologies

Day 1 - March 12, 2103 

A1 Welcome Remarks

Presenters: John Wiley, John White, Cathy Bigelow 

Discussion: John Wiley (FAA, DFO) and John White opened the meeting by welcoming the 

Subcommittee on Aircraft Safety (SAS) members, FAA presenters, and other attendees present 

and on the phone. John mentioned that Joe Del Balzo, SAS Chair, would not be able to attend 

and that John White would chair this meeting. John White announced that Bill Rosenkrans had 

retired from the SAS. He asked that each of the SAS members “sign-up” to take the lead on 

preparing Findings & Recommendations (F&R) for each presentation.

B REDAC Roles & Responsibilities

Discussion: Cathy Bigelow presented REDAC and Subcommittee: Roles and Responsibilities. 

This presentation covered the legislative basis for the REDAC and the Subcommittee on Aircraft 

Safety, and the role of the REDAC/SAS during the preparation of the FAA research portfolio. 

Conclusion: John White commented that the SAS appeared to be on track with FAA budget 

preparations. John Wiley asked that the SAS finalize their F&R before they adjourn. 

 

1 Letter designations represent location of presentation in the binders distributed at the meeting.
Subcommittee on Aircraft Safety Spring 2103 Meeting Minutes

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C Budget Review

Presenter: Mike Gallivan

Discussion: Mike explained that the budget picture for FY 2013 through FY 2015 remains 

unclear. The Continuing Resolution, Sequestration, and the OMB Passback for the FY 2014 

budget will impact budget planning. The Out Year Targets (on Slide 11) are the original targets 

provided and do not reflect the current climate.

Conclusion: The SAS commented that their guidance will be affected by the level of flexibility 

established by the Administrator, but for now they would focus at the project level.

D FY 2015 AVS R&D Portfolio Review

Presenter: Robert A. Pappas

Discussion: Rob presented FY 2015 Aviation Safety R,E&D Portfolio. Rob highlighted the AVS 

R&D mission statement, lifecycle management of requirements, and the current status within the 

portfolio process. He presented the Program Planning Team (PPT) financial summaries. He 

stated that the FY 2016 AVS Strategic Guidance was already under way and that AVS is getting 

away from prescriptive guidance and encouraging the Technical Community Representative 

Group (TCRG) to also take a more strategic view. There was some discussion regarding recent 

OMB Passback cuts to Human Factors programs. The consensus is that OMB wants to see more 

performance outcomes identified in the budget documents.

Conclusion: Rob stated that now is the time for the SAS to influence the FY 2016 strategic 

guidance and that the SAS can ask questions regarding the implementation of the research. He 

mentioned that he needs R&D facility data to develop “per-unit” costs base-lined against 

competitors. This presentation addressed Action Items 1 and 9 from the previous SAS meeting. 

Action Item 1 was addressed with a handout2

.

E Strategic Plan

Presenter: John Wiley

Discussion: John informed the SAS that he had initiated an effort within the Aviation Research 

Division (ANG-E2) to prepare a 10-year strategic plan for Aviation Research. An early draft of 

the nine topic areas covered in the plan is complete but not ready for distribution. He added that 

the goal is to present a draft version to the SAS after stakeholder review at the next SAS 

meeting. The plan includes a bottom-up and top-down approach that addresses the continuity of 

research capabilities by developing appropriate laboratories and right people.

 

2 Handout 1: Non-Top 60 Requirements delivered to SAS by Rob Pappas on March 13, 2013.
Subcommittee on Aircraft Safety Spring 2103 Meeting Minutes

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Conclusion: John Wiley introduced Alanna Randazzo as the new Manager of the Software and

Electronics Section (ANG-E271) and Michel Hovan as the new Portfolio Manager for the 

Division (ANG-E2).

Action Item: Present the Draft ANG-E-2 Strategic Plan at the next SAS meeting.

Person Responsible: ANG-E2 Division Manager

Due date: August 2013 SAS Meeting

F Aeromedical Research

Presenters: Robert Johnson (with Jean Watson, Estrella Forster, and Jeff Gardlin on the phone)

Discussion: Robert presented FY 2015 Aircraft Safety PPT Portfolio Review - Aerospace 

Medical Research (AM) BLI A11.j. He commented that there are over 600,000 pilots in the 

United States and that airplanes have performance manuals but people do not. He discussed the 

AM research areas, capabilities (laboratories, simulators, and people), and Quad charts for each 

of the four AM FY 2015 requirements. Jeff Gardlin presented four Quad charts for the FY 2015 

Fire and Cabin Safety (FCS) AM requirements.

Conclusion: The outputs of AM research include educating and alerting FAA Flight Surgeons 

regarding Agency policy. System-level crashworthiness research complements related work at 

NASA and is more specific (spinal and lumbar) and focused on tolerance of the human body.

Action Item: Provide a high-level rationale for prioritizing Aeromedical requirements at the next 

SAS meeting and deep-dive at the Spring 2014 SAS meeting

Person Responsible: Robert Johnson

Due date: August 2013 SAS meeting

Action item: Update Fire and Cabin Safety Quads charts with correct Out-year funding levels.

Person responsible: Rob Pappas

Due date: No later than August 2013 SAS meeting.

G NextGen – Weather Technology in the Cockpit

Presenters: Gary Pokodner (with Steve Abelman on the phone)

Discussion: Gary presented FY 2015 Aircraft Safety PPT Portfolio Review - Weather 

Technology in the Cockpit (WTIC) BLI – A12.d. He identified turbulence, general aviation 

lethality rates, and efficient use of meteorological (MET) data as key program elements. The 

program supports standards and requirements not delivery of weather products. Primary 

consumers are Aircraft Certification (AIR) and Flight Standards. He presented Quad charts for 

the four FY 2015 research requirements.

Conclusion: Gary addressed Action Item #8 from the previous SAS meeting by providing a 

copy of the August 2012 SAS WTIC presentation to a member of the Human Factors 

Subcommittee. Steve Abelman stated that the key is to quantify operational benefits and help 
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build business cases. The current metric is the release of a standard with the intuitive belief that 

it will improve safety.

H Flightdeck/Maintenance/Systems Integration Human Factors

Presenters: Kathy Abbot and Tom McCloy

Discussion: Kathy presented FY 2015Aircraft Safety PPT Portfolio Review - BLI A11.g 

Flightdeck/ Maintenance/ Systems Integration Human Factors. She distinguished between this, 

the core HF program, and the work in NextGen. Slide 5 identifies the level of budget cuts in FY 

2014 from the OMB Passback. Kathy went into some detail regarding upset recovery and its 

relationship to two other BLIs (Slide 7) and the fact that they are looking at the full range of 

upset, including reaction and mitigation to startle. Kathy presented Quad charts for eight FY 

2015 requirements.

Conclusion: It is not clear how the OMB Passback cuts will impact the HF Roadmap. The SAS 

also referred to an apparent trend that several aircraft technology implementations are ahead of 

the planned R&D.

I NextGen – Flight Deck Human Factors

Presenters: Kathy Abbot and Tom McCloy (Dan Herschler on phone)

Discussion: Kathy presented FY 2015Aircraft Safety PPT Portfolio Review - NextGen Flight 

Deck Human Factors BLI A12.c NextGen Air/Ground Integration Human Factors. She 

informed the SAS that the requirements under this BLI are prioritized like the core requirements 

but the NextGen Office (ANG-E) does the programming. Kathy spoke about the capabilities 

(people and simulators) at Civil Aerospace Medical Institute (CAMI), Volpe National 

Transportation Center, and NASA; and the leveraging of industry R&D investments at 

Honeywell. She presented Quad charts for six FY 2015 requirements and linkages between the 

requirements and NextGen Operational Improvements.

Conclusion: Program outputs support recommendations for regulatory guidance for aircraft 

certification and approval of operations for NextGen.

J Fire Research and Safety

Presenters: Jeff Gardlin (on phone) and Gus Sarkos

Discussion: Jeff presented FY 2015Aircraft Safety PPT Portfolio Review - Fire Research and 

Safety Portfolio Review. He spoke about the transportation of lithium batteries, recent freighter 

fires, future risk of fire accidents, and related NTSB cargo airplane fire protection 

recommendations. Jeff also discussed unknown smoke and odor incidents and the evolution of 

improved FAA flammability test standards for aircraft interior materials. He emphasized the fire 

safety program capabilities (people and laboratories) and presented a Quad chart for the FY 2015 

research requirement.

Conclusion: SAS members commented that the smoke and odor research is timely and necessary 

and that overall the program is forward looking with proactive R&D.
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K Advanced Materials/Structural Safety

Presenters: Larry Ilcewicz (on phone), Joseph Pellettiere, Jeff Gardlin (on phone) and Curtis 

Davies

Discussion: Larry presented FY 2015Aircraft Safety PPT Portfolio Review - BLI A11.c -

Advanced Materials and Structural Safety (AMASS) - Advanced Materials and Structures -

Crashworthiness. He explained the FAA approach to composite safety and certification 

initiatives (Slide 5) and the breath of FAA composite team members and the importance of 

teammates outside the FAA (Slide 7). Larry presented Quad charts for six FY 2015 research 

requirements. Joe presented the crash dynamics roadmap (Slide 15) and explained the “Single 

Process Crashworthiness”. He presented Quad charts for two FY 2015 research requirements.

Conclusion: The work under this program is different than related work done by NASA as it

will provide a more analytical approach and assess larger scale impacts to the fuselage.

L Aircraft Icing

Presenters: Tom Bond and Jim Riley

Discussion: Tom presented FY 2015Aircraft Safety PPT Portfolio Review - Aircraft Icing 6DB -

With an update on Icing Weather Tasks A11.K. He identified research requirements that support 

continued operational safety (COS), standards and policy, and certification. Tom presented 

Quad charts for five FY 2015 research requirements and emphasized that industry gets a 

significant return on investment for FAA research that supports Appendix C Icing certification 

and COS. Tom identified those requirements that are funded through the Aviation Weather 

Research Program (AWRP).

Conclusion: Research on ice crystal and supercooled large droplet (SLD) icing conditions 

supports a more robust enforcement and a means of compliance.

M Weather Program

Presenters: Steve Abelman and Roger Sultan (both on phone)

Discussion: Steve presented FY 2015 Aircraft Safety PPT Portfolio Review - Weather Program 

A11.k. He mentioned that he was filling in for Warren Fellner. The Weather Program addresses 

issues related to safety, efficiency, and capacity. A portion of the program focuses on AVS 

weather related requirements (Slide 5). The balance of the requirements are prioritized and 

scored through the Weather Program Planning Team. Steve presented Quad charts for ten 

AWRP research requirements. Roger Sultan presented three Quad charts for the AVS related 

requirements.
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Conclusion: The presentation included a handout3 that responded to Action Item #7 from the 

Fall 2012 SAS meeting. The SAS members will review the information in the handout and 

discuss as necessary at the next SAS meeting.

O System Safety Management

Presenters: Mike Basehore, Warren Randolph (both on phone), Katherine Lemos, and Hossein 

Eghbali

Discussion: Mike presented FY 2015Aircraft Safety PPT Portfolio Review - System Safety 

Management (SSM) BLI A11.h. He emphasized that the goal of the SSM program was to 

identify and analyze emerging threats in a cooperative nature with industry. This means 

reaching out to all who fly in the National Airspace System (NAS). Mike presented Quad charts 

for four core research requirements and one for F&E sponsored research, NextGen – System 

Safety Management.

Conclusion: There are no research requirements for SMS in FY 2015.

The Digital System Safety presentation scheduled for 3:30 PM on March 12, 2013 was moved to 

the morning of March 14, 2013.

SAS members reviewed their F&R homework assignments and the list of new action items from 

Day 1 presentations.

Meeting adjourned at 5:00 PM.

 

3 Handout #2: 2011 Quality Assessment of COSPA.
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Day 2 - March, 13, 2013

Meeting commenced at 8:00 AM

The SAS members reviewed the draft Findings and Recommendations from the previous day and 

pending action items. The SAS confirmed that Action Item # 6 from the previous SAS meeting 

was closed with the confirmation that Multi-Radar Multi-Sensor (MRMS) capability is expected 

to be implemented operationally at NOAA in early FY 2014.

John Wiley presented An Overview of the William J. Hughes Technical Center. He covered 

aviation activities and programs; Government, academic, and industry partnership; and FAA 

R&D with an emphasis on the Aviation Research Division ANG-E2. John introduced Rich Lyon 

as the Acting Research Director of the Tech Center.

SAS members took tours of research laboratories at the William J. Hughes Technical Center.

P Continued Airworthiness – Flight Control Mechanical System

Presenters: Paul Siegmund (on phone), Wes Ryan (on phone), and Dave Sizoo (on phone)

Discussion: Robert Jones presented FY 2015Aircraft Safety PPT Portfolio Review - Transport & 

Small Airplane Directorates (TAD & SAD) Part of BLI A11.e System Safety Management. He 

emphasized that this research is focused on Part 23 aircraft and that one of the key outcomes is 

enabling the use of low-cost systems that provide envelope protection and increased situation 

awareness. He presented the Quad chart for the FY 2015 research requirement. There was some 

discussion regarding the FAA response to the SAS F&R #4 (AF447 accident) from the Fall 2012 

SAS meeting.

Conclusion: Training is a necessary component and it is addressed under a human factors 

requirement (HF-15-01) and through collaboration with industry. Changes to either the HF or 

FCMS requirement are coordinated through the sponsoring organization. The SAS closed 

recommendation F&R #4 from the Fall 2012 SAS meeting.

Q Continued Airworthiness – Structural Integrity Metallic

Presenters: Mark Freisthler (on phone) and Mark Orr

Discussion: Mark presented FY 2015Aircraft Safety PPT Portfolio Review - Structural Integrity 

Metallics (SIM) Part of BLI A11.e Continued Airworthiness. He emphasized that the focus of 

the research is on bonded repair technologies and small airplane risk analysis. He explained the 

role of the SIM TCRG (slide 6) and the in-house capabilities (laboratories and people – Slide 7). 

Mark presented four Quad charts for the FY 2015 research requirements. Mark Orr presented 

the Quad chart for the risk assessment and management of small and transport COS. He spoke to 
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the average age of the GA fleet (41 years) and the fact that fatigue was not included in the 

original design. GA represents a non–homogeneous fleet with a wide range of use.

Conclusion: The transport airplane segment can benefit from the probabilistic risk management 

factors for corrosion developed in this program. The SAS closed Action Item #2 from the 

previous SAS meeting based on the handout4 of Airworthiness Directive History.

R NextGen – Alternative Fuels for General Aviation

Presenter: Peter White (on phone) and Dave Atwood

Discussion: Peter presented FY 2015Alternative Fuels for GA Portfolio Review - NextGen BLI 

A11m. He explained the linkage between this program and the Destination 2025 performance 

goal, petitions and potential litigation from environmental organizations, industry requests, and 

lack of a market driver to replace 100 low-lead fuels. Peter presented the Quad chart for the FY 

2015 research requirement and the highlights from the Unleaded Avgas Transition Aviation 

Rulemaking Committee (UAT ARC) Final report and the UAT Action Plan.

Conclusion: The FAA Technical Center is the only place to test unleaded alternative fuels. 

Phase 1 will focus on fit-for-purpose fuel properties and performance.

Action Item: Provide information on out-year funding levels. (Dave Atwood)

Due Date: August 2013 SAS meeting

S Terminal Area Safety

Presenters: Jeffery Schroeder, Don Stimson (on phone), and Andrew Cheng

Discussion: Jeffery presented FY 2015 Aircraft Safety PPT Portfolio Review - Terminal Area 

Safety (TAS) Part of BLI A11.h System Safety Management. He explained that the program 

would begin addressing helicopter issues in FY 2015 in the areas of final approaches when using 

advanced vision, guidance for helicopter taxi operations, and single-pilot RNAV/RNP 

operations. The latter two areas may remain in Human Factors. He presented Quad charts for 

six FY 2015 research requirements. He emphasized the integration of the Advanced Maneuvers 

(TAS-15-01) requirement with the FCMS and HF requirements related to upset recovery and 

prevention.

Conclusion: Most of today’s simulators need fidelity improvements before they are used for 

upset prevention and recovery training. ASIAS may offer additional information on runway 

excursions due to unstable approaches. Jeff provided information regarding “lowering approach 

minima for helos enabled by GPS WAAS requires improved visual cues” (Slide 9). He informed 

the SAS that “minima” are for helicopter point-in-space approaches, not ILS approaches. The 

SAS Recommendation from the Spring 2011 meeting will remain open.

 

4 Handout #3: Airworthiness Directive History (3 pages 0.
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T Center of Excellence (COE) for General Aviation Partnerships to Enhance General 

Aviation Safety, Accessibility, and Sustainability (PEGASAS)

Presenter: Peter Sparacino

Discussion: Peter presented FY 2015Aircraft Safety PPT Portfolio Review – Center of 

Excellence for General Aviation PEGASAS. He explained the decision by the Administrator to 

compete and then award a new COE for General Aviation. Peter gave an overview of 

PEGASAS membership and capabilities. The program does not have dedicated funding but 

relies on resources that come from the pool of technical program managers in ANG, ARP, and 

AVS.

Conclusion: The COE is a 10-year Cooperative Agreement that requires substantial involvement 

from the Government.

SAS members reviewed their F&R homework assignments and the list of new action items from 

Day 2 presentations.

Meeting adjourned at 4:15 PM.

Day 3 – March 14, 2013

Meeting commenced at 8:00 AM

SAS members reviewed draft F&R from Day 2. SAS members Chris Benich and Greg Bowles 

were on the phone.

N Digital System Safety (includes NextGen Advanced Systems and Software Validation)5

Presenter: Barbara Lingberg (on phone)

Discussion: Barbara presented FY 2015Aircraft Safety PPT Portfolio Review - Software and 

Digital System (SDS): BLI A11.n: Advanced System and Software Validation and BLI A11.d 

(partial): Aircraft Icing/Digital System Safety. Barbara focused on the need for collaboration 

between different types of engineers to meet present and future challenges (Slides 4 and 5), and 

program capabilities (Slide 9). Barbara presented Quad charts for the three FY 2015 research 

requirements funded under the core research program and a Quad chart for the FY 2015 research 

requirement funded through the NextGen program. This later requirement Systems 

Considerations for Complex Software Intensive Systems (SDS-15-01) addresses issues unique to 

the systems level that represent a domain boundary shift for the program.

Conclusion: Traditional methods and processes to address software and digital systems will not 

be adequate. The SAS commented that the expertise issues that concerned the SAS in the past 

appear to be resolved yet the technical challenges remain. There are no glaring gaps in the 

 

5 This presentation was originally scheduled for Day 1, March 12, 2013.
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program research but the breadth of the challenge to the FAA is significant. The SAS questioned 

their own ability to vet the entire scope of this area.

Action Item: Show explicit outputs and outcomes regarding wireless interfaces on the aircraft.

Person Responsible: Barbara Lingberg

Due date: August 2013 SAS meeting

U Continued Airworthiness – Engine NDE

Presenters: Jorge Fernandez and Cu Nguyen

Discussion: Jorge presented FY 2015Aircraft Safety PPT Portfolio Review – Engine Nondestructive Evaluation (NDE). He informed the SAS that the emphasis of the research is to 

support policy and rulemaking and that they are about halfway through a 20-year master plan. 

He presented the Quad chart for the FY 2015 research requirement. The recommended practice 

for sonic infrared inspection may be delayed due to work on volcanic ash.

Conclusion: The SAS commented that the collaboration with industry helps make this a model 

program.

Action Item: Provide out-year funding levels for Continued Airworthiness - NDE.

Person Responsible: Rob Pappas

Due date: August 2013 SAS meeting

V Propulsion and Fuel Systems

Presenters: Jorge Fernandez and Joe Wilson

Discussion: Jorge presented FY 2015Aircraft Safety PPT Portfolio Review - A11.b – Propulsion 

and Fuel Systems. He informed the SAS that the emphasis of the research is to support policy 

and rulemaking and that they are about halfway through a 20-year master plan (part of the 

previous presentation). He commented that much information will be released after the research 

program is complete. Jorge presented the Quad chart for the FY 2015 research requirement and 

commented that the focus is on lifing critical rotating parts considering defects created during 

manufacturing.

Conclusion: Although the research program is expected to end in FY 2017, the FAA will find a 

way to answer any questions that remain following the conclusion of the research program.

W Aircraft Catastrophic Failure Prevention Research

Presenters: Jorge Fernandez and William Emmerling

Discussion: Jorge presented FY 2015Aircraft Safety PPT Portfolio Review - Aircraft 

Catastrophic Failure Prevention BLI A11.f. He informed the SAS that key focus of this research 
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program evaluating predictive analyses for blade containment. Jorge presented the Quad chart 

for the FY 2015 research requirement.

Conclusion: Completion of research on metals is about 18 months away. The research on 

composites will take much longer as the research is just beginning.

Action Item: Provide an implementation plan for incorporating Aircraft Catastrophic Failure 

Prevention research into regulatory products.

Person Responsible: Jorge Fernandez

Due date: August 2013 SAS meeting

X Continued Airworthiness – Rotorcraft systems

Presenters: Chinh Vuong and Paul Swindell

Discussion: Chinh presented FY 2015Aircraft Safety PPT Portfolio Review - Rotorcraft Systems 

(RS) Part of BLI A11.e Continued Airworthiness. He informed the SAS that focus of this 

program is to support continued operational safety (COS) of rotorcraft, including bird strikes. 

The program capabilities reside in the people (TCRG members) and partnerships (Government, 

industry, and foreign authorities). He presented Quad charts on three FY 2015 research 

requirements.

Conclusion: There is no FAA approval yet to use HUMS monitoring for usage credit.

Action Item: Investigate opportunities for FY 2014 funding for the Advanced Control Systems 

(RS-15-02) requirement based on progress in FY 2013.

Person Responsible: Chinh Vuong

Due date: August SAS meeting

Y Continued Airworthiness – Maintenance and Inspection

Presenter: Rusty Jones

Discussion: Rusty presented FY 2015Aircraft Safety PPT Portfolio Review - Maintenance & 

Inspection. He informed the SAS that the focus of this research is to support development of a 

technical base of trained and qualified people by preparing guidance for inspectors and the 

industry. He presented Quad charts for two FY 2015 research requirements.

Conclusion: NDI impact detection capabilities will become more important as the number of 

composite aircraft on the ramp increase. The increased use of MRO (Maintenance, Repair and 

Overhaul) drives the need to develop risk-based oversight methodologies. The SAS commented 

that the overall program looks good.

Z Unmanned Aircraft Systems Research
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Presenters: Jim Williams, Kerin Olson, Sherri Magyarits

Discussion: Jim and Kerin presented FY 2015 Aircraft Safety PPT Portfolio Review - Unmanned 

Aircraft Systems (UAS) Research BLI A11.l. Jim opened the discussion by providing a high level 

view of the UAS research program. The FAA developed a five-year UAS Integration Roadmap 

that is being vetted by OMB. Jim expects release of the Roadmap by early June 2013. Jim 

explained that integration of UAS into the NAS requires standards and processes for 

certification; policies and guidance to demonstrate regulatory compliance; and procedures and 

mitigation strategies to ensure safe UAS operations in all classes of airspace. Research provides 

the data and analyses to support each one. Much of the data to support rule-making will be 

collected from military operations. Success of the research will be measured by the speed at 

which UAS is introduced into the NAS. Jim closed his remarks by commenting that hosting the 

UAS program in AFS is the right choice due in part to the level of resources available. Kerin 

addressed the program capabilities by presenting the UAS R&D Portfolio Matrix Team (slide 5). 

This slide closes Action Item # 4 from the previous SAS meeting. Kerin presented Quad charts 

for nine FY 2015 research requirements. The requirement numbers represent the prioritized 

order.

Sherry Magyarits presented UAS Integration into the National Airspace System - Concept of 

Operations (ConOps) Version 2.0. The mature state vision of UAS in the NAS provides hooks 

for research activities and sets a level of expectations for the user. The ConOps assumes full 

NextGen implementation and associated capital improvements. The ConOps will not address 

small UAS (less than 55 lb.) as rule-making for that class is underway and they will not operate 

in a NextGen environment. UAS are aircraft and each one will have a pilot-in-command (PIC). 

Autonomous UAS operations are not permitted. FAA policy will control priority of airspace. 

There is no visual compliance, in that seeing is qualitative and sensing is quantitative. All UAS 

operations will be conducted under Instrument Flight Rules (IFR) flight plans.

Conclusion: The see and avoid rule will not be applied to UAS. FAA legal opinion argues that 

you can’t put a machine or instrument between the human and the object. New regulations and 

rulemaking will be necessary. Next step is to work the ConOps down into a requirements 

shortfall. Jim Williams ended the discussion by reminding the SAS that integration of UAS into 

the NAS is a continuum.

Action Item: Release of the Roadmap will remain an open Action Item (#5 from previous SAS 

meeting).

Person Responsible: Jim Williams

Due date: June 6, 2013
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SAS Recommendation Review

The SAS reviewed the status of open Findings and Recommendations from previous SAS 

meeting. This chart does not reflect F&Rs from this meeting.

Recommendation

Number Program/Description

FAA

Recommendation

SAS Decision

Open Close

Spring-2011-18 Terminal Area Safety/Flight 

Control & Mechanical Systems

Close

Open

Fall-2012-01

UAS: The FAA Administrator 

should review whether the FAA 

is appropriately organized to 

address the UAS integration 

challenge and whether sufficient 

FAA RE&D resources are being 

devoted to the challenge

Close Close

Fall-2012-02

ASIAS: FAA considers 

conducting research into 

connecting the human element 

with the operational events 

recorded by ASAP/FOQA data.

Close Close

Fall-2012-03

HF-Flight Deck: The SAS 

recommends that AFS revisit 

their research needs to support 

the implementation of FAR 117 

as well as approval and 

development of FRMS. The 

high level of industry interest 

and activity in this issue will 

likely necessitate funding for 

research and support in FY 2014 

as well as FY 2015.

Close Close

Fall-2012-04

FC/MS: If lessons from the 

AF447 incident regarding flight 

controls design and certification 

warrant new research, the SAS 

recommends the research be 

prioritized and accelerate for 

near-term completion.

Close Close
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Closing Remarks 

John Wiley reviewed the two-year outlook for SAS meeting venues. This outlook replies to 

Action tem #11 from the previous SAS meeting. 

Fall 2013; August 20 – 22, 2013; Washington, DC (At GAMA Headquarters) 

Spring 2014; TBD; either CAMI or FAA Technical center 

Fall 2014; TBD; Washington, DC 

There was some discussion regarding new membership for the SAS, especially for software 

systems. The DFO and the SAS chair will begin discussions in this matter immediately. The 

FAA will also make an effort to get the presentation materials to the SAS members for their 

review about two weeks ahead of the meeting. The FAA asked the SAS members if they could 

share their views of future technologies that could impact aircraft safety. They were also 

reminded to prepare questions for the full REDAC and the Administrator prior to the next 

REDAC meeting.

John White thanked the SAS members and the FAA for their efforts and complimented the 

presenters for providing such high quality information. John Wiley also thanked the SAS and 

FAA participants and adjourned the meeting at 1:24 PM. 
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AGENDA 

(Actual)

Tuesday, March 12, 2013 

Telephone Bridge (202) 493-4180, Passcode: 8255 

Time Subject Presenter

0800 

0810 

0815 

Welcome

• Introductions 

• Agenda Review 

• Discussion of changes and expectations

John White /John Wiley/

Cathy Bigelow

0830 Budget Review Mike Gallivan

0847 FY15 AVS R&D Portfolio Review Robert Pappas 

0947 Strategic Plan John Wiley

1000 Break

1015 Aeromedical Research Jean Watson /Bob Johnson 

1105 NextGen - Weather Technology in the Cockpit Gary Pokodner 

1134 Flight Deck/Maintenance/System Integration 

Human Factors Kathy Abbott/Tom McCloy

1220 Lunch 

1306 NextGen Human Factors Kathy Abbott/Tom McCloy

1347 Fire Research and Safety Jeff Gardlin/Gus Sarkos 

1419 Advanced Materials/Structural Safety Joe Pellettiere/Larry Ilcewicz/

Curt Davies

1505 Break

1517 Aircraft Icing Tom Bond/Jim Riley

1555 Weather Program Roger Sultan /Warren Fellner

1625 System Safety Management Mike Basehore/Warren Randolph/ 

Katherine Lemos/Hossein Eghbali 

1645 Review Action Items and Recommendations All

1655 Adjourn 
Subcommittee on Aircraft Safety Spring 2103 Meeting Minutes 

Note: Dress code is business casual

Wednesday, March 13, 2013 

Telephone Bridge (202) 493-4180, Passcode: 8255 

16 

Time Subject Presenter

0800 Review Action Items and Recommendations John White

0825 Division Overview Director’s 

Conf. Room John Wiley

TIME TOUR LOCATION CONTACT

0845 Fire Safety Tour: Gus Sarkos 

0900 Lithium Batteries Bldg. 204 

0930 Cargo Compartment Fire 

Safety Bldg. 275 

1000 Interior Material 

Flammability Bldg. 287 

1030 FASTER Labs Bldg. 211 John Bakuckas 

1100 Fuels Lab Bldg. 211 Dave Atwood

1130 Human Factors Lab Bldg. 28 Kenneth Allendoerfer 

1215 Lunch 

1303 Continued Airworthiness 

• Flight Control Mechanical Systems

Robert Jones/Bob McGuire 

1337 Continued Airworthiness 

• Structural Integrity Metallic

Mark Freisthler/Michael Reyer/

John Bakuckas 

1425 NextGen – Alternative Fuels for GA Mark Rumizen/Dave Atwood 

1450 Break

1505 Terminal Area Safety Jeff Schroeder/Andrew Cheng

1545 COE for General Aviation (PEGASAS) Pete Sparacino

1600 Review Action Items and Recommendations John White

1615 Adjourn 

1700 Dinner 

Berkshire Grill 

6105 Blackhorse Pike 
Subcommittee on Aircraft Safety Spring 2103 Meeting Minutes

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Egg Harbor Township, NJ

Thursday, March 14, 2013

Thursday Telephone Bridge (888) 924-3230, Passcode: 668176 

Time Subject Presenter

0800 Review Action Items and Recommendations John White

0810 Digital System Safety (includes NextGen Advanced Systems and 

Software Validation)

Barbara 

Lingberg/John 

Lapointe

0856 Continued Airworthiness

• Engine NDE

Jorge 

Fernandez/Cu 

Nguyen

0913 Propulsion and Fuel Systems

Jorge 

Fernandez/Joe 

Wilson

0918 Aircraft Catastrophic Failure Prevention Research

Jorge 

Fernandez/Bill 

Emmerling

0939 Continued Airworthiness

• Rotorcraft Systems

Chinh 

Vuong/Paul 

Swindell

1020 Break

1030 Continued Airworthiness

• Maintenance and Inspection 

Rusty 

Jones/Dave 

Galella

1048 Unmanned Aircraft Systems Research

Jim 

Williams/Kerin 

Olson/Sherri 

Magyarits

1200 SAS Recommendation Review John Wiley

1230 SAS Feedback John White

1300 Future Meeting Planning and Discussion John White

1324 Adjourn John White
Subcommittee on Aircraft Safety Spring 2103 Meeting Minutes

18

Note: Dress code is business casual

ATTENDANCE

SAS Members:

Chris Benich

Greg Bowles

Andy Lacher

Jim Mangie

Doug Rohn

Todd Sigler

John White (Acting Chair)

John Wiley DFO

Participants:

Kathy Abbot

Allan Abramowitz

John Bakuckas

Cathy Bigelow

Tom Bond

Fred Brooks

Curtis Davies

Gloria Dunderman

Steven Edgar

Hossein Eghbali

Bill Emmerling

Jorge Fernandez

Paul Fontaine

Tom Flournoy

Dave Galella

Sharon Graves

John Hensyl

Michel Hovan

Robert Johnson

Cliff Johnson

R. C. Jones

Rusty Jones

Charles Kilgore

Ken Knopp

John Lapointe

Xiaogong Lee

Katherine Lemos

Rich Lyon

Sherri Magyarits

K. Maris

Tom McCloy

Robert McGuire

Nelson Miller

Curtis Nguyen

Kerin Olson

Mark Orr

Maria Paine

Robert A. Pappas

Joseph Pellitiere

Gary Pokodner

Alanna Randazzo

Jim Riley

Gus Sarkos

Andrea Schandler

Jeff Schroeder

Vincent Schultz

Chris Seher

Peter Sparacino

Traci Stadmueller

Paul Swindell

Isidore Venetos

Tong Vu

Chinh Vuong

Ed Weinstein

Jim White

Jim Williams

Joe Wilson

John Zvanya

On-phone:

Steve Abelman

Mike Basehore

Tom Chidester

Estrella Forster

Mark Freisthler

Mike Gallivan

Jeff Gardlin

Dan Herschler

Larry Ilcewicz

Barbara Lingberg

Debbie Prigal

Warren Randolph

Wes Ryan

Paul Siegmund

Dave Sizoo

Corey Stephens

Don Stimson

Roger Sultan

Jean Watson

Peter White
Subcommittee on Aircraft Safety Spring 2103 Meeting Minutes 

19 

ACTION ITEMS

1. Present the Draft ANG-E-2 Strategic Plan at the next SAS meeting. (ANG-E2 Division 

Manager) 

2. Provide a high-level rationale for prioritizing Aeromedical requirements at the next SAS 

meeting and deep-dive at the Spring 2014 SAS meeting. (Robert Johnson) 

3. Update Fire and Cabin Safety Quads charts with correct out-year funding levels. (Rob 

Pappas)

4. Show explicit outputs and outcomes regarding wireless interfaces on the aircraft. 

(Barbara Lingberg)

5. Provide out-year funding levels for Continued Airworthiness – NDE. (Rob Pappas)

6. Provide an implementation plan for incorporating Aircraft Catastrophic Failure 

Prevention research into regulatory products. (Jorge Fernandez)

7. Investigate opportunities for FY 2014 funding for the Advanced Control Systems (RS15-02) requirement based on progress in FY 2013. (Chinh Vuong) 

8. Release of the UAS Roadmap will remain an open Action Item (#5 from previous SAS 

meeting). (Jim Williams)