### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 1 U.S. DEPARTMENT OF ENERGY MOTORS TEST PROCEDURES NOTICE OF PROPOSED RULEMAKING PUBLIC MEETING

Department of Energy 1000 Independence Avenue SW Forrestal Building Suite 8E-089 Washington, D.C. 20585

Tuesday, July 16, 2013 9:03 a.m.

Reported by: Natalia Thomas, RPR/CSR, Capital Reporting Company

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 2 1 A P P E A R A N C E S 2 Moderator: 3 Doug Brookman, Public Solutions 4 5 Present: 6 Lucas Adin, U.S. Department of Energy 7 Emmanuel Agamloh, Advanced Energy 8 Kirk Anderson, UL LLC 9 Ashley Armstrong, U.S. Department of Energy 10 Dale Basso, WEG Electric Corp. 11 Alex Boesenberg, National Electrical Manufacturers 12 Association 13 Rob Boteler, NIDEC Motor Corporation 14 Rick Budzynski, Baldor Electric Company 15 Kitt Butler, Advanced Energy 16 Jeff Casey, Brook Crompton ? Americas 17 Brian Coffey, Navigant Consulting, Inc. 18 Pamela Costello, Navigant Consulting, Inc. 19 Roger Daugherty, Baldor Electric Company 20 Daniel Delaney, Regal Beloit 21 Andrew deLaski, Appliance Standards Awareness Project 22 Gary Fernstrom, California Investor-Owned Utilities

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 3 1 A P P E A R A N C E S (cont'd) 2 William Finley, Siemens 3 Ami Grace-Tardy, U.S. Department of Energy 4 Jack Graul, U.S. Department of Energy 5 Armin Hauer, ebm-papst 6 William Hoyt, National Electrical Manufacturers 7 Association 8 Sanaee Iyama, Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory 9 Michael Kido, U.S. Department of Energy 10 Frank Ladonne, UL LLC 11 Paul Lin, Regal Beloit 12 John Malinowski, Baldor Electric Company 13 Douglas Rawald, U.S. Department of Energy 14 Tim Schumann, SEW-Eurodrive 15 Stephen Tabor, Bluffton Motor Works 16 17 18 19 20 21 22

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 4 1 A P P E A R A N C E S (cont'd) 2 Attending via webinar: 3 Al Padilla, UL LLC 4 Austin Bonnett, Austin Bonnett Engineering, LLC 5 Derek Greenauer, UL LLC 6 Howard Jordan, Consultant 7 Jim Raba, U.S. Department of Energy 8 Linda Wilson, New York Attorney General's Office 9 Michael Woodford, Air-Conditioning, Heating, and 10 Refrigeration Institute 11 Michael Bruin, General Electric 12 Robert Hart, Consortium for Energy Efficiency 13 Steve Ruffing, Nidec Motor Corporation 14 Timothy Ballo, Earthjustice 15 Vijeta Jangra, Navigant Consulting, Inc. 16 17 18 19 20 21 22

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 5 1 A G E N D A 2 9:00 - 9:25 am Welcome, Introductions, Opening 3 Statements, Overview, Statute, 4 Context 5 9:25 - 9:45 am History of Rulemaking 6 9:45 - 12:45 pm New Motors Definitions and Testing 7 Instructions 8 12:45 - 1:00 pm Closing Remarks and Adjourn 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 6 1 P R O C E E D I N G S 2 MR. BROOKMAN: Let's get started. So please 3 take your seats. Good morning, everyone. Welcome. 4 This is the U.S. Department of Energy's Motors Test 5 Procedures Notice of Proposed Rulemaking Public 6 Meeting. Today is Tuesday, July 16, 2013, here at the 7 Forrestal Building in Washington, D.C. And my name's 8 Doug Brookman from Public Solutions in Baltimore. Nice 9 to see you this morning. Glad you could join us. 10 We're going to start off this morning with 11 welcoming remarks from Ashley Armstrong. 12 MS. ARMSTRONG: Hi, everyone. Just want to 13 welcome everyone. Thank you for coming to our public 14 meeting. As you know, the point of the public meeting 15 is to gather as much of feedback as possible from you 16 on our proposal, so we encourage you to engage often, 17 and we appreciate everyone's participation. 18 MR. BROOKMAN: Thank you. We start with 19 introductions, typically, and I'm going to start to my 20 immediate left. And you can get used to turning these 21 microphones on and off. You'll see the little green 22 button illuminated. You've got to get it close to your

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 7 1 face. And if you'd say your name and organizational 2 affiliation. 3 MR. CASEY: Yes, I'm Jeff Casey with Brook 4 Crompton - Americas. 5 MR. HOYT: Bill Hoyt with National Electrical 6 Manufacturers Association, or NEMA. 7 MR. DELANEY: Dan Delaney with Regal Beloit. 8 MR. FERNSTROM: I'm Gary Fernstrom, retired 9 from the Pacific Gas and Electric Company, but as a 10 consultant representing the California Investor-Owned 11 Utilities, which would be PG&E, the Southern California 12 Edison Company, San Diego Gas & Electric, and the 13 Southern California Gas Company. 14 MR. SCHUMANN: I'm Tim Schumann with SEW - 15 Eurodrive. 16 MR. DAUGHERTY: Hi, Roger Daugherty with 17 Baldor Electric Company, a member of the ABB Group. 18 I'm also the Chairman of the NEMA Technical Committee 19 for Motors and Generators. 20 MR. MALINOWSKI: John Malinowski, Baldor 21 Electric Company, and also ABB Incorporated. I'm also 22 a Chairman of the NEMA Motor and Generator Section.

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 8 1 MR. BOTELER: Rob Boteler, Nidec Motor 2 Corporation, St. Louis, and I'm Chairman of the Energy 3 Management Committee for NEMA. 4 MR. FINLEY: Okay. Bill Finley with Siemens 5 Industry, and I'm the Chairman of the International 6 Standards TAG Committee. 7 DR. AGAMLOH: Emmanuel Agamloh from Advanced 8 Energy. 9 MR. HAUER: Armin Hauer of ebm-papst. 10 MR. LADONNE: Frank Ladonne, Underwriters 11 Laboratories, now UL LLC. 12 MR. TABOR: Steven Tabor, Bluffton Motor 13 Works. 14 MR. BROOKMAN: Did you say Sam? Say your 15 name again? 16 MR. TABOR: Steven. 17 MR. BROOKMAN: Thank you. 18 MR. ADIN: Lucas Adin, DOE's Appliance and 19 Equipment Standards Program. 20 MS. GRACE-TARDY: Ami Grace-Tardy, Department 21 of Energy General Counsel's Office. 22 MS. ARMSTRONG: Ashley Armstrong, DOE.

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 9 1 MR. BROOKMAN: Why don't you just stand over 2 here? Stand up. 3 MR. RAWALD: I'm Doug Rawald for the 4 Department of Energy's Office of Enforcement. 5 MS. COSTELLO: I'm Pamela Costello from 6 Navigant. 7 MS. IYAMA: Sanaee Iyama, the Lawrence 8 Berkeley National Lab. 9 MR. BROOKMAN: Please. 10 MR. ANDERSON: Kirk Anderson, Underwriters 11 Laboratory. 12 MR. BUDZYNSKI: Rick Budzynski, Baldor 13 Electric. 14 MR. BASSO: Dale Basso, WEG Electric. 15 MR. BOESENBERG: Alex Boesenberg, NEMA. 16 MR. BUTLER: Kitt Butler, Advanced Energy. 17 MR. LIN: Paul Lin from Regal-Beloit. 18 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Again, so thank you -- 19 all of you for being here. Welcome. Jack, we have 20 individuals that have joined us online. Can you tell 21 us who has joined us via the Web? 22 MR. GRAUL: We've got Al Padilla, Austin

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 10 1 Bonnett, Derek Greenauer, Howard Jordan, Linda Wilson, 2 Michael Bruin, Michael Woodford, Robert Hart, Steve 3 Ruffing, and Timothy Ballo. 4 MR. BROOKMAN: Thank you. So I'm just going 5 to -- all of you received a packet of information when 6 you registered this morning. The agenda for today's 7 meeting is as follows. Immediately following this 8 brief agenda review, we're going to have some overview 9 slides and comments from Ashley, and then anyone that 10 wishes to do so can make a brief summary statement 11 about issues that matter to you, issues that are 12 important to you. 13 From there, we'll have a description of the 14 history of rulemaking and then new motors definitions 15 and testing instructions. At the close of the day 16 today, which we anticipate will be perhaps, as 17 reflected in the agenda, 12:45 or 1:00 or perhaps even 18 earlier, another opportunity for anybody that wants to 19 to make additional comments to make sure everything you 20 need to say gets said during the course of this meeting 21 today. 22 I'd ask for your consideration. Many of you

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 11 1 have been here before. Please speak one at a time. If 2 you'd say your name each time you speak for the record, 3 there will be a complete transcript of this meeting 4 made available to you. Please say your name each time 5 you speak. 6 Be concise, share the air time. If you'd 7 keep the focus here, turn your cell phones on silent 8 mode, and limit sidebar conversations. You've already 9 gotten in the habit of turning these microphones on and 10 off. That's very helpful. We need to have the 11 microphones on to hear your voice. 12 And webinar participants, if you would mute 13 your phones and raise your hand to join the meeting, 14 then -- it has worked in the past. Hopefully, it'll 15 work today. If you speak clearly, then we'll probably 16 be able to hear you in the room, and the Department of 17 Energy is trying hard to make sure these meetings are 18 accessible to everyone. 19 So I think that's the preliminary stuff. 20 Then to Ashley Armstrong. 21 MS. ARMSTRONG: Sure. So everyone 22 received an agenda. We expect this public meeting to

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 12 1 go fairly quickly. We are going to present our 2 proposal as it relates to what you've seen in the 3 Federal Register Notice. It includes a variety of some 4 definitions that we propose as well as additional 5 testing instructions or test setup to incorporate for 6 certain types of motors in addition to the test 7 procedures that are already in the CFR. 8 So Doug just hit this. We have people 9 listening via webcast. If you want to speak, please 10 raise your hand, and Jack will coordinate with us. 11 Otherwise, you can type in a question, and he can also 12 relay that to us. 13 So as we already said, the purpose of the 14 public meeting is to present our proposals, and, 15 really, we're trying to get feedback from you guys. 16 Our final rule and our proposals are only as good as 17 the feedback we receive. So we encourage you to engage 18 and explain all your reasons why you may have different 19 comments on the subject so we can thoroughly consider 20 those for the final rule. 21 Throughout the presentation, you'll see 22 issues boxes in yellow. These are issues that the

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 13 1 Department has specifically identified that we seek 2 comment on, so we'd particularly like your feedback on 3 those, although your feedback's not limited to those, 4 so feel free to speak up at any point in time. Just at 5 the outset, the deadline for submitting comments is 6 September 9th. Doug, I'll turn it over to you. 7 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Thank you. As we said 8 here, now is an opportunity for anyone that wants to to 9 make an opening statement, brief summary remarks about 10 issues that matter to you. None at this time? Okay. 11 So now back to Ashley. 12 For those of you that are new to these 13 proceedings, this packet of information and these 14 PowerPoint slides will be -- kind of dictate the flow 15 of discussion. That's where we hope you'll insert your 16 comments. It's easier for the Department to follow 17 your comments that way. Okay. Back to Ashley. 18 MS. ARMSTRONG: So this is just a history of 19 the rulemaking. You know, back in May of 2012, we 20 published a final rule updating test procedure for 21 small electric motors. It did a variety of different 22 things. We've initiated a rulemaking for motors by

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 14 1 publishing a framework document as well as a request 2 for information, and now we're at the proposed rule 3 stage for the test procedure part of it. 4 So as you can see on the slide, we expect -- 5 our scheduled projected final rule publication is at 6 the end of the year, assuming everything goes according 7 to schedule. As we know, it typically does here at the 8 Department. We welcome you guys to submit comments 9 during the comment period as well as here. 10 I'll turn it over to Pam. 11 MS. COSTELLO: Good morning. As I said 12 earlier, I'm Pam Costello with Navigant Consulting, and 13 I'm going to be taking you through the first part of 14 this presentation, and then my colleague Brian Coffey 15 will take over. 16 So now that Ashley's told you a little bit of 17 the background of the rule, we're going to go into a 18 little bit of the test procedure applicability and what 19 types of motors this -- we're proposing this test 20 procedure applies to. 21 So DOE's proposed test procedure is 22 applicable to all motors that meet the following

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 15 1 characteristics: 2 single-speed induction motors that are rated 3 for continuous duty by MG1 or for duty type S1 by IEC; 4 contain a squirrel cage or cage rotor; operate on 5 polyphase alternating current, 60 hertz sinusoidal line 6 power; are rated 600 volts or less; have a 2, 4, 6, or 7 8- pole configuration; have a 3-digit NEMA frame size 8 or IEC metric equivalent or an enclosed 56 NEMA frame 9 size or IEC metric equivalent; are rated no more than 10 500 horsepower, but greater than or equal to 1 11 horsepower or the kilowatt equivalence; and meet all of 12 the performance requirements of one of the following 13 motor types: NEMA Design A, B, or C motor, or IEC 14 Design N or H motor. 15 MR. BROOKMAN: Roger. 16 MR. DAUGHERTY: Roger Daugherty. I don't 17 find anything in the proposed language and changes to 18 Subpart B that incorporate this information that says 19 that these test standards are applicable to these 20 particular characteristics of a motor. Could you 21 explain why they're not there? 22 MS. COSTELLO: You mean the specific language

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 16 1 for these to say that -- or do you just mean the 2 validation for why it's these motors? 3 MR. DAUGHERTY: Roger Daugherty. I was 4 looking for the specific language, and I think I'll get 5 into this more when we move into the definitions to 6 give some example of why this is important. 7 MS. ARMSTRONG: So I guess I'm going to turn 8 around the question to you to before I answer it. Do 9 you feel that there needs to be? I mean, I think the 10 Department's proposal tried to lay out definitions of 11 different types of motors, which tried to explain the 12 scope of coverage that was the applicability of our 13 regulations. And then we further explained in the 14 preamble this list of items. So do you think 15 additional clarification is warranted, I guess? 16 MR. DAUGHERTY: Roger Daugherty. If you'd 17 grant me the time at this point, then I can go through 18 the reasoning as why I feel this is very, very 19 important. Definitions need to be very clear, we found 20 out over the years, so that they can be properly 21 interpreted. 22 When EPAct was passed in 1992, it provided a

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 17 1 definition of electric motor which encompassed many of 2 these characteristics that are on the screen that we're 3 talking about. So that helped to identify exactly what 4 an electric motor was, what the test procedures were 5 that applied to that particular type of motors so that 6 we could do certification. 7 However, there was still some confusion 8 because EPAct had also defined special purpose and 9 definite purpose motors. So the Department came out 10 and published in 1997 a policy statement for the 11 interpretation of the general purpose, the definite 12 purpose, and special purpose motors, and that went a 13 long ways to help clear up that everything we needed to 14 know was in the definitions. 15 Then in 1999, the Department published the 16 final rule, which, when it adopted the EPAct definition 17 of electric motor, it modified that definition 18 slightly, but to encompass IEC motors, to cover an 19 issue about voltage, et cetera so that in the end, by 20 1999, we had a definition of electric motor which tried 21 to clearly define the motor types to which the test 22 procedures applied.

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 18 1 In -- when EISA came along in 2007, Congress 2 replaced that definition of electric motor as a covered 3 type with a definition of a general purpose electric 4 motor of Subtype I and a general purpose electric motor 5 of Subtype II. Included in those definitions once 6 again was all the required characteristics of the motor 7 so that one could make a determination as to whether or 8 not a particular type of motor fell into either a 9 Subtype I, Subtype II, or we -- up until slightly after 10 that date, we still had the policy statement that 11 helped to explain definite purpose and special purpose. 12 Then when DOE adopted EISA into Subpart B, it 13 ended up removing the policy statement, so we have no 14 guidance of what a definite purpose and special purpose 15 motor is any longer from the Department. However, we 16 still had an actual expanded definition that the 17 Department did for the Subtype I and Subtype II motors, 18 to which the test procedures applied in the standards. 19 So at the present time, the item which 20 identifies the motors that are considered covered 21 products are the definitions, and then the test 22 procedures apply to those motors covered by the

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 19 1 definitions. In this proposal that we have before us 2 today, what I see in that proposal is I don't find 3 definitions that are in the light of the present 4 definitions and the past definitions, and I think this 5 is going to cause a lot of confusion. 6 So, for example, we have the very simple one 7 to look at, is the totally enclosed non-vent, the TENV 8 motor. In the proposed definition, the only 9 characteristic of that motor is that it is enclosed, it 10 is cooled by free convection, and that it be a device 11 which transforms electric power into rotating power, 12 period. That's it. 13 Then it is very interesting that the 14 Department has made a very important change to sub -- 15 to Appendix B, to Subpart B, which is on the last page 16 of the Federal Register Notice, by having made a 17 decision that if this comes about, then this test 18 procedure that's in Appendix B is applicable to all 19 special and definite purpose motor types for which 20 definitions had been established and that if any 21 manufacturer wishes to mark any of those motor types 22 with an efficiency value, he must follow the test

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 20 1 procedures in that Appendix B. 2 The problem there is that a TENV motor can be 3 a polyphase motor, it can be a DC motor, it can be an 4 inverter-controlled motor, it can be multiphased motor, 5 it can be in various applications and various uses. It 6 can have various performance characteristics, none of 7 which are necessarily the NEMA Design A, B, C or the 8 IEC N or H. 9 But what this proposal tells me is that 10 because you defined the TENV motor, then that single11 phase motor has to be tested according to a polyphase 12 test standard. That DC motor has to be tested to a 13 polyphase test standard, et cetera. 14 Another example is the submersible motor. 15 Now, the information indicates that the intent is not 16 to include standards for submersible motors, yet it's 17 the Department's intent, through this significant 18 change to the test procedures, that if a submersible 19 motor is to be marked with an efficiency level, it must 20 be tested according to these procedures. Yet you go 21 through a big discussion that it's -- no one knows how 22 to test a motor according to these -- a submersible

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 21 1 motor according to these test procedures. 2 So in the end, my point is it is very 3 important that each definition that we look at be clear 4 and complete in the motor that it is to describe and 5 that it is to fall within this test procedure. Now, 6 one proposal for that -- I was thinking about this last 7 night -- is that when you adopted the EISA definitions, 8 prior to that, you had defined a motor to be a piece of 9 equipment which transformed electrical power into 10 rotating power. Then the electric motor, with all these 11 type of characteristics, and now Subtype I or Subtype 12 II, were defined off of that base. 13 When you made the changes for EISA, you 14 replaced the definition of motor and used that 15 definition as electric motor, and that's where the 16 problem comes into place. The proposal is that if you 17 go back and restore the original definition of motor as 18 to what it was, and then you define electric motor to 19 be a motor which has these characteristics that you've 20 listed on the screen, then from this definition of 21 electric motor, you can define the Subtype I and the 22 Subtype II as being one of these electric motors, with

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 22 1 certain other characteristics being the NEMA frame or 2 the IEC frame size or different flanges and different 3 shafts and things like that for the Subtype II. 4 That also allows the definition of TENV motor 5 to be an electric motor, which is one with these 6 characteristics, that also have the design 7 characteristic of being cooled by free convection. So 8 there is a way to get this, but the point is that I, as 9 the manufacturer, need to be very clear on what each of 10 these definitions totally mean, not partially mean. I 11 need a total definition. 12 MR. BROOKMAN: So, Roger, in these comments, 13 are you speaking on behalf of NEMA, or are you speaking 14 for yourself? 15 MR. DAUGHERTY: Roger Daugherty. I'd say 16 those will be on behalf of NEMA, and then NEMA will 17 submit that in their comments. 18 MR. BROOKMAN: That's what I wanted to get, 19 because that -- laying out that hierarchy the way you 20 did, that stream, that that would be very, very useful 21 in your written comments. And, also, we'd like to get 22 as much of that on the record today as we can. Okay?

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 23 1 So thanks for that clarification at the 2 outset. 3 Now, and do we have others before I return to 4 the presentation materials? We'll return -- 5 MR. MALINOWSKI: John Malinowski, Baldor. 6 MR. BROOKMAN: Yeah. 7 MR. MALINOWSKI: When we're looking at this 8 three-digit NEMA frame size or IEC metric equivalent, 9 we presently have that in EPAct and EISA, and we find 10 that that excludes several IEC frames. I believe it 11 would be the Department's wish to include the 100 frame 12 and those larger frames that we identified that was on 13 the chart yesterday that you saw. 14 There's not an equivalent NEMA frame to 15 those, but yet they should be within the scope of 16 coverage of this testing NOPR. And then I think Roger 17 will probably get into it later when we talk about NEMA 18 Design A, B, and C versus IEC Design N and H. The IEC 19 designs are not necessarily equivalent to the NEMA 20 designs. They're similar, but some of the current 21 regulations are not exactly the same. 22 For example, Design N for IEC could be

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 24 1 equivalent to a NEMA Design A, or it could be 2 equivalent to a Design B, depending where the inrush 3 current would be. So they're not exactly equivalent, 4 and we need to be careful of that when we refer to IEC 5 designs. 6 MR. BROOKMAN: So just to clarify, as we go 7 through the individual definitions, that would be the 8 place to offer a more complete comment, correct, John? 9 MR. MALINOWSKI: Exactly. 10 MR. BROOKMAN: And also -- Roger, you want to 11 follow on? 12 MR. DAUGHERTY: Yeah. This is Roger 13 Daugherty. With respect to what John was just saying, I 14 guess the one would be, at this point -- because what 15 he was talking about doesn't appear in any of the 16 proposed definitions. 17 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. 18 MR. DAUGHERTY: And that is this IEC 19 equivalent idea and this 56 NEMA frame size. As far as 20 the IEC equivalent goes, NEMA has three, A, B, and C. 21 IEC has only two, N and H. The IEC H is only 22 applicable to 60 hertz and was actually derived from

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 25 1 the NEMA Design C. So that one is directly equivalent. 2 With regards to the Design N of IEC, there are, in a 3 lower horsepower ratings, from 1 horsepower to maybe 4 around 30 horsepower, the locked-rotor current levels 5 are the same for the IEC Design N as they are for the 6 NEMA Design B. 7 For the higher ratings, the locked-rotor 8 current limits of Design N are higher than they are for 9 Design B. Consequently, there can be IEC Design N 10 motors that are equivalent to NEMA Design B. However, 11 in the same rating and using the DOE notation that 12 rating is an enclosure, a pole number, and a horsepower 13 or kilowatt value, that an IEC Design N could be 14 equivalent to a NEMA Design A. 15 So looking at something that is labeled IEC 16 Design N, it may not be clear to the -- those 17 unfamiliar with other markings that that is actually 18 equivalent to NEMA Design A, rather than a NEMA Design 19 B. So you should take that into consideration in 20 writing a standard section that you say is a parallel 21 action going on with respect to this test standard and 22 recognize that, at least at the present time, whether

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 26 1 or not there will be different efficiency levels that 2 are being looked at for A versus B, and then you'd have 3 to split it in N. 4 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Thank you. Now let's 5 go back to Pamela. 6 MR. DELANEY: I'm sorry. One more point on 7 this, if you can go back one more slide. I thought 8 Roger was going to cover this on the 56 -- 9 MR. BROOKMAN: Dan; right? 10 MR. DELANEY: Sorry. Dan Delaney, Regal 11 Beloit. So you add this section on enclosed 56 NEMA 12 frame size. Of course, this is covering the small motor 13 section that has a 56 open. We do introduce 8-pole 14 here, so that would allow open 56 frame, open, not 15 covered, as well as anything about 3-horsepower would 16 also not be covered as a 56 frame open. So just wanted 17 to point that out, that that would be a gap in that. 18 MR. BROOKMAN: Are you saying that's 19 something NEMA does, or is that -- 20 MS. ARMSTRONG: Something with definition 21 limit. 22 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay.

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 27 1 MR. DELANEY: Yeah. 2 MS. ARMSTRONG: It's not listed. 3 MR. DELANEY: Yeah, it's not listed. It 4 would be an area that would be a non-covered product, I 5 guess, we're assuming. Again, back to the definitions 6 of getting clarity and making sure that you have 7 overlap between the two. 8 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay, good. Thank you. Now, 9 Pamela. 10 MS. COSTELLO: So moving on, in this 11 rulemaking, DOE is proposing definitions to clarify the 12 applicability of the existing test procedure to a 13 variety of covered motor types. However, DOE is also 14 proposing definitions to clarify the motor types that 15 DOE has tentatively decided not to consider adding 16 proposals for testing. And we'll go over those in the 17 next few slides, but just to summarize, those motors 18 include an air-over-electric motor, a component set, a 19 liquid-cooled electric motor, submersible electric 20 motors, and definite purpose, inverter-fed electric 21 motors. 22 So moving on to the first of these motors,

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 28 1 while most motors, when manufactured, have a fan 2 attached to them as a means of providing cooling 3 airflow across the surface of the motor frame, an air4 over-electric motor has no fan attached, and these 5 motors rely on an external means of cooling. 6 So based on these conditions, DOE's proposing 7 to adopt the following definition. An air-over8 electric motor means a motor designed to be cooled by a 9 ventilating means external to, and not supplied with, 10 the motor. 11 At this time, DOE requests comment on its 12 proposed definition for air-over-electric motor and the 13 decision to include both open and and enclosed motors 14 under the same definition. 15 MR. BROOKMAN: Roger Daugherty. 16 MR. DAUGHERTY: Roger Daugherty. I think 17 I'll say that -- say this just on this definition, but 18 it applies to, again, all the definitions, but just to 19 be clear, that this definition identifies only one of 20 the characteristics of the air-over-motor for which 21 either it will be exempted or standards adopted, 22 whichever is the case.

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 29 1 So to go back in my previous comments, it's 2 important that this definition be a total definition. 3 It must incorporate the performance characteristics and 4 any other constructional characteristics out of the -- 5 and, again, if electric motor is redefined in 6 accordance with the proposal of those nine 7 characteristics, that'll take care of this. 8 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Thank you. Other 9 comments on this definition, noting that NEMA and 10 others will supply copious written comment; right? 11 Right. Okay. Pamela. 12 MS. COSTELLO: Okay. So electric motors have 13 several primary components that include a rotor, 14 stator, stator winding, stator frame, two endshields, 15 two bearings, and a shaft. A combination of these that 16 does not form what DOE is considering an operable motor 17 can be called a component set. 18 So based on that, DOE is proposing to adopt 19 the following definition. A component set means a 20 combination of motor parts that require the addition of 21 more than two endshields to create an operable motor. 22 These parts may consist of any combination of the

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 30 1 stator frame, wound stator, rotor, shaft, or 2 endshields. For the purpose of this definition, the 3 term "operable motor" means an electric motor 4 engineered for performance in accordance with nameplate 5 ratings. And this definition, in part, is helping to 6 eliminate confusion between these motors and partial 7 motors, which we'll be discussing later today. 8 So at this time, DOE requests comments on 9 this proposed definition for a component set. 10 MR. BROOKMAN: Steve Ruffing, who is joining 11 us via the Web, has requested to comment. So, Steve, 12 unmute your phone, and let's see if we can hear you. 13 Speak clearly and loudly. 14 MR. RUFFING: Thank you. Steve Ruffing, 15 Nidec Motor Corporation. So two comments. The first 16 is I wanted to emphasize that in these definitions, we 17 should be careful about using the words "motor" and 18 "electric motor" interchangeably. I noticed on the 19 previous slide, it said that air-over-electric motor 20 means a motor. Do we really mean electric motor there 21 instead of motor, or does it matter? Are those terms 22 interchangeable? I noticed in the NOPR, the majority

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 31 1 of the definitions use the term "electric motor" there, 2 whereas liquid-cooled electric motor, the word "motor" 3 was used. So that was my first comment. 4 The second comment was in distinguishing 5 between a component set and a partial motor, if you add 6 more than two endshields, that's defined to be a 7 component set. My question is if you add two 8 endshields, along with their associated bearings, is 9 that considered a component set, or is that still a 10 partial motor? 11 MS. COSTELLO: So the definition for partial 12 motor would be, as you said, two endshields with their 13 bearings. That would still fall under partial motor 14 and not component set. 15 MR. RUFFING: Okay. Thank -- then that 16 should - - so then the definition for component set is 17 not complete, then. It says if you had more than two 18 endshields, it's a component set. So someone could 19 interpret that as two endshields plus a bearing being a 20 component set, whereas actually that's a partial motor, 21 so I think the definition should say maybe more than 22 two endshields, including bearings when required, or

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 32 1 something of that nature. 2 MS. COSTELLO: Okay. Yeah, that's very 3 helpful. Thank you. 4 MR. BROOKMAN: Thank you. Thanks, Steve. 5 Yes -- 6 MR. RUFFING: Thank you. 7 MR. BROOKMAN: -- John? 8 MR. MALINOWSKI: John Malinowski, Baldor 9 Electric. When we think of component sets and what we 10 sell from our company, most often, it is simply a 11 stator without a frame and a rotor with or without a 12 shaft. Usually in a component set, endplates, cooling 13 fans, bearings, et cetera, are not involved. That's 14 most often done by the OEM who's assembling the 15 component set into a motor. 16 I would agree with Steve that the business 17 about it being a complete motor, less endplates would 18 get it too close to what we would call the partial 19 motor. Normally, a partial motor would have one 20 endplate on it, but certainly it could have no 21 endplates on it. But this is kind of a tough one to 22 differentiate between the two. But certainly, it's --

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 33 1 you know, the bare components, stator and rotor set, is 2 the basic things applied. 3 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Thank you. Yes? 4 Please say your name. 5 MR. BASSO: This is Dale Basso, WEG Electric. 6 Just a thought on the component set, and I think what 7 we're all trying to get to is the rotor/stator. If you 8 define it anything other than a rotor and stator 9 component set, I'm afraid you're going to get into 10 somebody determining what component is in addition to 11 the end brackets. You know, do they add a conduit box? 12 Do they add a seal? 13 So you're going to end up getting an awful 14 lot of interpretation, if it's not a harder definition, 15 and I wonder if what we're really trying to get to is 16 basically the rotor stator set. 17 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Thank you. Other 18 comments on this definition before we move on? Okay. 19 Pamela. 20 MS. COSTELLO: Okay. Moving on, while most 21 motors are cooled by air, liquid-cooled motors rely on 22 a special cooling apparatus that pumps liquid into and

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 34 1 around the motor housing. Requests were made earlier 2 for greater clarification between liquid-cooled, 3 immersible, and submersible motors. The latter of 4 these two are going to be defined later in this 5 presentation, but to start to help eliminate this 6 confusion, DOE is proposing to adopt the following 7 definition. Liquid-cooled electric motors means a 8 motor that is cooled by circulating liquid or liquid9 filled conductors coming in direct contact with the 10 machine parts. 11 So at this time, DOE seeks feedback on this 12 proposed definition for liquid-cooled electric motors. 13 MR. BROOKMAN: Roger Daugherty. 14 MR. DAUGHERTY: Roger Daugherty speaking on 15 behalf of NEMA. We welcome this definition, and we 16 welcome that you pretty much got it from the MG1 17 standard. We did comment on this previously in NEMA 18 comments on the previous proposal of this definition. 19 While you made this modification in alignment with what 20 NEMA had suggested, on second thought, it may still be 21 confusing to what is meant by liquid-filled conductor. 22 Now, we know that the intent there is --

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 35 1 that's like a tube or something that channels the 2 liquid through the machine in some manner of fashion. 3 Many people, particularly since we're talking about 4 electric motors, may see conductor as being electrical 5 conductor material through which you're passing liquid. 6 Now, such machines do exist in the industry of passing 7 water, very pure water, through the electrical 8 conductor themselves, but that's very big equipment, 9 but it does exist. 10 So we're at a loss as to how to really take 11 care of this little phrase, but it would appear that if 12 you just dropped it, it would not remove anything of 13 importance from the definition, so you may just drop 14 the term liquid-filled conductor and just leave it as a 15 -- means a motor that is cooled by circulating liquid. 16 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Thank you. Other 17 comments here on this definition? Yes, please. Find a 18 microphone. Right there. Your name, please? 19 MR. COFFEY: Hi, this is Brian Coffey with 20 Navigant. Does -- with that definition, though, does 21 that run into any trouble with, say, submersible 22 motors?

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 36 1 MR. BROOKMAN: Roger Daugherty. 2 MR. DAUGHERTY: Roger Daugherty. I don't 3 believe so necessarily because it does say that it's a 4 circulating liquid. Submersible motors, many times, 5 are just sitting in a volume of liquid, but that 6 liquid's not actually circulating through the motor 7 itself. 8 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Final comments here? 9 MS. COSTELLO: So moving on to submersible 10 electric motors, while most motors are not defined for 11 operation under water, a submersible electric motor is 12 capable of complete submersion in liquid without motor 13 damage. Special seals prevent the inlet of liquid into 14 the enclosure. The electric motors also rely on 15 properties of the surrounding liquid to cool the motor 16 during continuous operation and therefore are only 17 capable of continuous operation while completely 18 submerged. Therefore, DOE is proposing to adopt the 19 following definition. Submersible electric motor means 20 an electric motor designed for continuous operation 21 only while submerged in liquid. 22 At this time, DOE requests comment on its

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 37 1 proposed definition of submersible electric motor. 2 MR. BROOKMAN: No comments here. It's okay 3 to say it's a good definition. It's okay to -- no, I 4 really -- for the record, it's not a bad thing to say 5 this is sufficient or good. I'm not fooling. 6 MS. COSTELLO: And we'd also be interested, I 7 think, in knowing if this sufficiently eliminates the 8 confusion between submersible and liquid-cooled, which 9 was what Brian was touching on. 10 MR. BROOKMAN: Rob? 11 MR. BOTELER: Rob Boteler with Nidec. We -- 12 NEMA believes this is a sufficient definition. 13 MR. BROOKMAN: Thank you. I hate to have to 14 pull for it. Okay. Thank you. And can you respond to 15 Pamela's question? Does it help to clarify 16 MS. COSTELLO: I think Roger did. 17 MR. BROOKMAN: Did he? Okay. 18 MS. COSTELLO: Yeah, I think he 19 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. 20 MS. COSTELLO: Okay. 21 MR. BROOKMAN: Yeah. Great. Thank you for 22 that. Okay.

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 38 1 MS. COSTELLO: Okay. So next we have 2 definite purpose, inverter-fed electric motors. Now, 3 in this rulemaking, DOE's considering both motors that 4 are engineered to work specifically with an inverter 5 and those that are capable of working with an inverter, 6 but are otherwise capable of normal operation. That 7 second group, we'll talk about later, but for the first 8 group, DOE's proposing to adopt the following 9 definition. Definite purpose, inverter-fed electric 10 motor means a motor that is designed for operation 11 solely with an inverter and is not intended for 12 operation when directly connected to polyphase 13 sinusoidal line power. 14 DOE requests comment on its proposed 15 definition for definite purpose, inverter-fed electric 16 motors. 17 MR. BROOKMAN: Roger? 18 MR. DAUGHERTY: Roger Daugherty, speaking on 19 behalf of NEMA again. In this particular case, you've 20 defined the basic concept of an electric motor 21 connected to an inverter, which could encompass single22 phase motors as well as polyphase motors. But then,

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 39 1 further in the definition, you sort of say that this 2 definition only applies to polyphase-type motors. 3 In the context of having a very general 4 definition of inverter-fed electric motor, we think 5 polyphase should be removed from that definition. 6 However, this, once again, goes back to my previous 7 comments that if electric motor is then clarified with 8 those nine characteristics, then that would pull that 9 in here and properly identify what these polyphase test 10 standards and the type of motors that they're being 11 applied to are polyphase, so that would bring in the 12 polyphase reference, rather than having it here in the 13 definition. 14 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Additional comments? 15 MS. COSTELLO: Okay. So moving on to the 16 next section of the presentation, DOE would like to 17 propose definitions for a group of motors that DOE 18 feels clarifying definitions would aid the industry 19 moving forward, but that they do not feel additional 20 test setup instructions are necessary for at this time. 21 So to start, since a definition for NEMA 22 Design B motor has already been adopted, DOE believes

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 40 1 adopting the next two definitions will help provide 2 consistency in the treatment of all motor types. 3 First, DOE proposes to adopt the following 4 definition. A NEMA Design A motor means a squirrel 5 cage motor that is designed to withstand full-voltage 6 starting and developing locked-rotor torque as shown in 7 NEMA MG 1- 2009, Paragraph 12.38; pull-up torque as 8 shown in NEMA MG 1-2009, Paragraph 12.40; breakdown 9 torque as shown in NEMA MG 1-2009, Paragraph 12.39; 10 have a locked-rotor current higher than the values 11 shown in NEMA MG 1-2009, Paragraph 12.35.1 for 60 hertz 12 and NEMA MG 1-2009, Paragraph 12.35.2 for 50 hertz; and 13 has a slip at rated load of less than 5 percent for 14 motors with fewer than 10 poles. 15 And as DOE notes that general purpose 16 electric motors that meet this definition and are rated 17 1 to 200 horsepower are currently subjected to 18 standards and DOE is not aware of any difficulties in 19 testing these motors with current procedures, they're 20 not proposing any test procedure amendments at this 21 time. 22 So moving on for a definition for NEMA Design

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 41 1 C, DOE proposes -- 2 MR. BROOKMAN: Let's just pause on this 3 slide. 4 MS. COSTELLO: Yeah. 5 MR. BROOKMAN: Roger Daugherty. 6 MR. DAUGHERTY: Roger Daugherty, speaking on 7 behalf of NEMA. It is true that you have presently 8 defined a NEMA Design B. I think we would encourage 9 that you use similar language in the definition of NEMA 10 Design A, and I'll get to Design C later, because, in 11 particular, with respect to the second point of the 12 definition and those that follow, has pull-up torque as 13 shown in NEMA MG 1-2009, in the present definition of 14 NEMA Design B, that corresponding information just 15 makes reference over to the locked-rotor breakdown and 16 pull-up torques adequate for applications and 17 references the paragraphs. 18 And when you get to those paragraphs, it's 19 clear that those are -- the table maximum values and 20 that the intent isn't that the motors meet the value in 21 the table, but that they do not exceed the value that's 22 in the table. So -- well, for torques, yeah. The

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 42 1 torque or minimum torques, locked-rotor currents are 2 maximum, excuse me, so that the torques must exceed the 3 value that's in the table and not actually meet the 4 value in the table. And so perhaps if you just were 5 consistent in the definitions of A, B, and C, then that 6 would take care of the -- 7 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. 8 MR. DAUGHERTY: -- the concerns. 9 MR. BROOKMAN: Thank you. 10 MS. COSTELLO: Okay. So for NEMA Design C, 11 DOE is proposing to adopt the following definition. 12 NEMA Design C motor means a squirrel-cage motor that is 13 designed to withstand full-voltage starting and 14 developing locked-rotor torque for high-torque 15 applications up to the values shown in NEMA MG 1-2009, 16 Paragraph 12.38; pull-up torque as shown in NEMA MG 1- 17 2009, Paragraph 12.40; breakdown torque up to the 18 values shown in NEMA MG 1-2009, Paragraph 12.39; have a 19 locked- rotor current not to exceed the values shown in 20 NEMA MG 1-2009, Paragraphs 12.35.1 for 60 hertz and 21 12.35.2 for 50 hertz; and has a slip at rated load of 22 less than 5 percent.

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 43 1 And as DOE is not aware of any difficulty in 2 testing these motors currently, they are currently not 3 proposing any test procedure amendments for Design C 4 electric motors. 5 So at this time, we request comment on the 6 definitions for both NEMA Design A and NEMA Design C. 7 MR. BROOKMAN: Please -- 8 MR. BASSO: This is Dale Basso, WEG Electric. 9 The only thought I have in looking at these definitions 10 is, you know, NEMA covers 50 and 60 hertz, but since 11 this regulation is really only for 60 hertz, it might 12 add some confusion or potentially a misinterpretation 13 if somebody's allowed to look at the 50 hertz values in 14 the table. So I would just suggest we not include 50 15 hertz values in the definitions. 16 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Thank you. 17 Roger Daugherty. 18 MR. DAUGHERTY: Roger Daugherty. I believe 19 that the concern that Dale just expressed will be, once 20 again, taken care of if the definition of electric 21 motor was the nine characteristics, because one of 22 those is 60 hertz.

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 44 1 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. 2 Yes, Frank? 3 MR. LADONNE: Following along those same 4 lines, if the nine characteristics were included, it 5 would seem that, under the definition for Design A, 6 that it wouldn't be necessary to say for motors with 7 fewer than 10 poles. 8 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. You don't need that at 9 all? 10 MR. LADONNE: No, because the nine 11 definitions describe motors 2, 4, 6, or 8-pole. 12 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. 13 Roger? 14 MR. DAUGHERTY: Roger Daugherty on behalf of 15 NEMA. Just to point out that the Department was 16 correct in including that because that's part of the 17 definition in the NEMA standard, MG1 standard. 18 MR. BROOKMAN: The 10-pole 19 MR. DAUGHERTY: That the slip may exceed 5 20 percent for motors with 10 poles or greater. 21 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Okay. Okay. Roger, 22 keep going.

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 45 1 MR. DAUGHERTY: Roger Daugherty. My point I 2 wanted to make about the Design C definition is the 3 very first item, part of its definition, that it says 4 it would have torque values that are up to the values 5 shown. The values in the tables are minimum values, so 6 it must have values that are not less than those that 7 are shown. But, again, if you would use the similar 8 present definition of NEMA Design B, but just reference 9 the appropriate paragraphs, that would take care of it. 10 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Thank you. Final 11 comments here? 12 MS. COSTELLO: Okay. Now, because many 13 motors imported into the U.S. are built to IEC 14 specifications instead of NEMA specifications, DOE is 15 proposing to include a definition for IEC motor types 16 that are similar to NEMA motor types to help ensure 17 that these functionally similar motors are treated in a 18 manner consistent with equivalent NEMA-rated -- NEMA19 based electric motors. 20 The first of these motors is an IEC Design N 21 motor, which DOE is proposing to adopt the following 22 definition for. IEC Design N motor means an electric

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 46 1 motor that is an induction motor designed for use with 2 three-phase power; contains a cage rotor; is intended 3 for direct-on-line starting (as demonstrated by the 4 motor's ability to operate without an inverter); has 2, 5 4, 6, or 8 poles; is rated from 0.4 kilowatts to 1600 6 kilowatts; and conforms to Sections 6.1, 6.2, and 6.3 7 of the IEC 60034-12 edition 2.1 requirements for torque 8 characteristics, locked-rotor apparent power, and 9 starting. 10 DOE is not aware of any testing difficulties 11 for these motors at this time so is not proposing any 12 test procedure amendments for IEC Design N electric 13 motors. 14 MR. BROOKMAN: Roger Daugherty. 15 MR. DAUGHERTY: Roger Daugherty for NEMA. 16 Within this definition in the third item, you include a 17 parenthetical phrase, "as demonstrated by the motor's 18 ability to operate without an inverter." We fail to 19 see why that parenthetical phrase is included. It's 20 not there for NEMA Designs A, B, or C, and you're 21 saying that the IEC Design N is equivalent to those. 22 So perhaps you could explain why that

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 47 1 parenthetical statement's needed, or NEMA suggests that 2 you remove that parenthetical statement. It's not 3 actually a part of the IEC definition in the IEC 4 standard. 5 MS. COSTELLO: Okay. So your recommendation 6 would be to remove it based on the fact that it's not 7 part of the IEC regulations and it is not similar to 8 the NEMA Design A, B, and C definitions? 9 MR. DAUGHERTY: Roger Daugherty. Yes. 10 Removing it would just eliminate any confusion as to 11 why it's there. We can certainly see the reason it was 12 probably put in there, but it's not really a part of 13 the definition. 14 MR. BROOKMAN: Ashley Armstrong. 15 MS. ARMSTRONG: So this is Ashley from DOE. 16 I realize that it may not be part of the IEC 17 definition. I think the question was what we were 18 trying to do was clarify the definition where we 19 thought there was potentially an ambiguity. So I think 20 the question for us is is it needed? And maybe it's 21 needed in the other definitions too, even though they 22 may be slightly different, but intentionally the same

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 48 1 as the IEC definitions and NEMA definitions. 2 MR. BROOKMAN: Roger? 3 MS. ARMSTRONG: So just because it's not an 4 IEC standard isn't necessarily a good reason for the 5 Department not to adopt something that it believes 6 needs clarification. So I guess I'm asking do we 7 really think that adds clarification? 8 MR. BROOKMAN: Roger? 9 MR. DAUGHERTY: Roger Daugherty. I think, 10 speaking on behalf of NEMA, that we don't see the need 11 for that clarification. As I said, it just seems to 12 introduce some confusion and ambiguity into the 13 definition, that the definition without that standing 14 as is stated is sufficient to identify an IEC Design N 15 motor. 16 MR. BROOKMAN: Dale? 17 MR. BASSO: Dale Basso. I wanted to -- on 18 the clarification of that, the problem with that short 19 a definition is it might actually introduce more 20 confusion because there are motors designed -- 21 dedicated inverter operation that could be operated 22 across a line, but they won't have the characteristics

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 49 1 required. They may have excessive locked-rotor 2 currents, or they may not have the right kinds of 3 torques for a standard operation. 4 So there's a lot that goes into a motor 5 that's dedicated for VFD operation that that doesn't 6 take into account. 7 MS. COSTELLO: Okay. 8 MR. BROOKMAN: Go on. Yes, please. 9 MR. SCHUMANN: Tim Schumann with SEW - 10 Eurodrive and probably on behalf of NEMA also. With 11 regards to the point, next to the last, is rated from 12 .4 to 1600 kilowatt, again, kind of coattailing off of 13 Roger's comments, we'd go back to the definition. It's 14 intended to cover 1 to 500 horsepower. I think this 15 would introduce some confusion as to what's covered and 16 what's not based on power rating. 17 MR. BROOKMAN: Tim, what would you suggest be 18 done? 19 MR. SCHUMANN: If we were to amend this 20 definition here, it would have to copy the base 21 definition as described in the nine points, 1 to 500 22 horsepower, or drop this altogether and just refer back

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 50 1 to the main definition of an electric motor. 2 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Dan, you wish to 3 comment here? 4 MR. DELANEY: Yeah, just one other comment I 5 wanted to make, not really specific to Design N or H, 6 but a comment that the NEMA -- so Dan Delaney, Regal 7 Beloit, speaking on behalf of NEMA here. We have 8 discussed using additional test methods. I didn't 9 really see a specific section really talked about. 10 Obviously, there's an IEC test that is IEC 60034-2-1, 11 which is similar to the existing IEEE 112, Method B, 12 and CSA C390. Just wanted to add some comments. If 13 this is the appropriate time, this NOPR, through test 14 procedures, to possibly introduce that as a third 15 alternate test standard for the IEC Design N and H or 16 the other Design A, B, or C. 17 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Additional comments 18 here? Okay. 19 MS. COSTELLO: For IEC Design H electric 20 motors, DOE is proposing to adopt the following 21 definition. IEC Design H motor means an electric motor 22 that is an induction motor designed for use with three-

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 51 1 phase power; contains a cage rotor; is intended for 2 direct-on-line starting (as demonstrated by the motor's 3 ability to operate without an inverter); has 2, 4, 6, 4 or 8 poles; is rated from 0.4 kilowatts to 1600 5 kilowatts at a frequency of 60 hertz; and conforms to 6 Sections 8.1, 8.2, and 8.3 of the IEC 60032-12 edition 7 2.1 requirements for torque characteristics, locked8 rotor apparent power, and starting. At this time, DOE 9 is not proposing any test procedure amendments for IEC 10 Design H electric motors. 11 And DOE requests comments on the proposed 12 definitions for both Design H and Design N motors. 13 MR. BROOKMAN: Roger Daugherty. 14 MR. DAUGHERTY: Roger Daugherty. Just to 15 point out that while on this slide, it may include two 16 poles, in the proposed language that's at the end of 17 the NOPR, two poles is not included, and it is correct 18 that two poles not be included because there are no 19 Design C or IEC Design H motors defined for two poles. 20 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Thank you. 21 MS. COSTELLO: Thank you. 22 MR. BROOKMAN: Additional comments on both N

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 52 1 and H? Tim? 2 MR. SCHUMANN: Tim Schumann, SEW - Eurodrive. 3 I just noticed that there's a difference in the 4 definition, which is probably pulled from IEC, but in 5 the second-to- last bullet where it says "is rated 6 from," it's clarified at the end there "with a 7 frequency of 60 hertz." The previous slide, under IEC 8 Design N, does not contain the same definition, which I 9 don't think follows the intent of the DOE. 10 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Thank you. 11 John? 12 MR. MALINOWSKI: John Malinowski, Baldor. 13 Again, this should be amended to show the 1 to 500 14 horsepower range that was in your initial nine points, 15 perhaps. And with regard to Design N, in that a Design 16 N motor could be equivalent to either a NEMA Design A 17 or B motor, should there be any verbiage added to that 18 effect? 19 In other words, if you split apart testing 20 differently for Design As or Bs or look at it 21 differently, should the verbiage say, "An IEC Design N 22 motor equivalent to NEMA Design A or equivalent to NEMA

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 53 1 Design B" to differentiate the performance of that 2 Design N motor? 3 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Thank you. Additional 4 comments here? 5 MS. COSTELLO: Okay. Next we're going to 6 move on to a couple of electric motors with 7 encapsulated windings, and electric motors with 8 encapsulated windings have additional insulation that 9 completely encases the stator windings to protect them 10 from condensation, moisture, dirt, and debris. In the 11 preliminary TSD, DOE proposed a definition for an 12 encapsulated electric motor, but today DOE is instead 13 presenting two different definitions for these motor 14 types. 15 First, DOE proposes to adopt the following 16 definition. Electric motors with moisture-resistant 17 windings means an electric motor that is designed to 18 pass the conformance test for moisture resistance 19 described in NEMA MG 1-2009, paragraph 12.63 as 20 demonstrated on a representative sample or prototype. 21 And at this time, DOE's not proposing any 22 test procedure amendments for electric motors with

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 54 1 moisture- resistant windings. 2 MR. BROOKMAN: Let's have comment here. 3 Roger? 4 MR. DAUGHERTY: Roger Daugherty. This has 5 more to do with the way the actual language is printed 6 in the NOPR itself rather than what's on the screen. 7 In the NOPR, in this definition of electric motor with 8 moisture- resistant windings, just to make note that 9 this parenthetical statement incorporated by reference, 10 "see Section 431.15," this particular referenced 11 paragraph of 12.63 from NEMA is not in 431.15, so the 12 Department, I'm sure, will look into adding that into 13 that section. 14 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Thank you. Additional 15 comments here? Wait. John wants -- and John, please. 16 MR. MALINOWSKI: John Malinowski, Baldor. 17 With regard to what we're calling moisture-resistant 18 windings, right now, within the industry we have a 19 couple different versions of that. One would be the 20 encapsulated winding, where the entire winding is 21 encapsulated and sort of podded in a compound, and that 22 certainly locks out moisture. Another type would be a

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 55 1 vacuum pressure impregnation, and in those cases, we 2 often can take the motor and submerge it in water and 3 do an electrical test there to show the integrity. 4 Specifically, going back to our original -- 5 this Subpart B business, the exemptions from covered 6 motors, the encapsulated winding was one that was 7 exempted from having to meet any regulations for 8 efficiency. And as a motor company that builds such a 9 motor, we believe that is probably an oversight that 10 should be included. We don't -- we consider that a 11 type of moisture-resistant winding, but certainly not 12 the most common type. 13 It's the most common type, perhaps, for the 14 food industry, and maybe that type of winding 15 protection was taken from pump industry or some other 16 process industry and brought into that for additional 17 protection of those windings, but as far as it being 18 exempted from coverage or testing or what have you, we 19 don't believe that that should be exempted. 20 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. 21 Pamela. 22 MS. COSTELLO: Okay. Moving on, for the

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 56 1 second type of motors with encapsulated windings, DOE's 2 proposing to adopt the following definition. Electric 3 motors with sealed windings means an electric motor 4 that is designed to pass the conformance test for water 5 resistance described in NEMA MG 1-2009, paragraph 12.62 6 as demonstrated on a representative sample or 7 prototype. 8 And similar to the last slide, DOE's not 9 proposing any test procedure amendments for electric 10 motors with sealed windings at this time. DOE seeks 11 comments on this proposed definition and the proposed 12 definition for moisture-resistant windings at this 13 time. 14 MR. BROOKMAN: Roger Daugherty. 15 MR. DAUGHERTY: Roger Daugherty. Just as a 16 similar note, the reference to Paragraph 12.62 will be 17 put into 431.15 for reference. Thank you. 18 MR. BROOKMAN: Thank you. Additional 19 comments here? Roger? 20 MR. DAUGHERTY: Roger Daugherty. Just to 21 make a note that on this particular subject, on Page 22 38463 of the NOPR, as published in the Federal

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 57 1 Register, DOE also requested data or information or 2 comments regarding the effects of specially insulated 3 stator windings on efficiency. I assume that, although 4 it wasn't included in this list at the back, DOE is 5 still interested in obtaining that information? 6 MS. ARMSTRONG: Yes. 7 MR. BROOKMAN: Department of Energy says yes. 8 Okay. Thank you for that clarification. 9 Pamela. 10 MS. COSTELLO: Okay. So moving on to 11 inverter- capable electric motors, currently being 12 suited to operate on an inverter does not exempt a 13 motor from having to meet efficiency standards. 14 Today DOE is maintaining this approach while 15 also further clarifying its position by proposing the 16 following definition. An inverter-capable electric 17 motor means an electric motor designed to be directly 18 connected to polyphase, sinusoidal line power, but 19 which is also capable of continuous operation on an 20 inverter drive over a limited speed range and 21 associated load. 22 And as these motors operate the same as

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 58 1 general purpose motors when they're not connected to an 2 inverter, DOE is not proposing any test procedure 3 amendments for inverter-capable electric motors at this 4 time. DOE requests comment on its proposed definition 5 for inverter- capable electric motors and its tentative 6 decision not to propose any test procedure amendments 7 for inverter- capable electric motors. 8 MR. BROOKMAN: Roger Daugherty. 9 MR. DAUGHERTY: Roger Daugherty on behalf of 10 NEMA. As in the previous comment with respect to 11 inverters, again, this proposed definition includes 12 polyphase, but, once again, if the definition of 13 electric motor were to refer to polyphase, then 14 polyphase doesn't need to be within this, and it 15 becomes the more general definition of any motor that's 16 connected to an inverter. 17 MR. BROOKMAN: John? 18 MR. MALINOWSKI: John Malinowski, Baldor, but 19 this is probably a NEMA comment. This definition is 20 pretty wide open as far as the type of three-phase 21 motor that could be connected to an inverter. 22 Explosion-proof motors for Division 1 are included in

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 59 1 coverage. You can't take an explosion-proof motor, any 2 explosion-proof motor, and operate it on an inverter. 3 It loses its UL and CSA listing. We have special 4 motors that have been tested with inverters, so 5 although your definition is correct, some of these 6 standards that are out there and limitations would 7 modify this in some way. 8 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. 9 Gary Fernstrom? 10 MR. FERNSTROM: Gary Fernstrom, California 11 IOUs. I'd just like to make sure that this definition 12 is specifically constrained to polyphase motors and 13 does not include single-phase motors. 14 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Thank you. Other 15 comments? 16 MR. FERNSTROM: Is there a response to that? 17 MS. COSTELLO: Yeah, the intention is for 18 this to be contained to polyphase motors. 19 MR. FERNSTROM: Thank you. 20 MS. COSTELLO: Do you feel that further 21 clarification would be needed in the wording to make 22 that understood?

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 60 1 MR. FERNSTROM: No. I was just looking for 2 your interpretation. Thank you. 3 MS. COSTELLO: Okay. Thank you. 4 MR. BROOKMAN: Other comments here? Okay. 5 MS. COSTELLO: Okay. So moving on to totally 6 enclosed non-ventilated electric motors, based on 7 changes made by EISA 2007 and support from the 8 industry, DOE is analyzing totally enclosed non9 ventilated motors in the energy conservation standards 10 rulemaking. As part of this, DOE is proposing to add a 11 definition for these motors. 12 DOE proposes to adopt the following 13 definition. Totally enclosed non-ventilated electric 14 motor means a motor that is built in a frame-surface 15 cooled, totally enclosed configuration that is designed 16 and equipped to be cooled only by free convection. 17 DOE has considered whether any test 18 modifications are necessary for these motors, and at 19 this point, DOE knows of no technical reason why a 20 totally enclosed non-ventilated electric motor could 21 not be tested using IEEE Standard 112 or CSA C390-10. 22 So at this point, DOE's not proposing any test

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 61 1 procedure amendments for these motors. 2 DOE requests comments on its proposed 3 definition and preliminary decision not to propose any 4 test procedure amendments for totally enclosed, non5 ventilated electric motors. 6 MR. BROOKMAN: Gary Fernstrom. 7 MR. FERNSTROM: Gary Fernstrom, California 8 IOUs. Again, could we go back to the prior slide for 9 just a moment? I'd also like to make sure that this 10 applies to general purpose motors, but not special or 11 dedicated purpose motors; is that correct, or am I 12 mistaken about that? 13 MS. COSTELLO: I think I would have to verify 14 to be clear on what the exact original intention was 15 with the definition, but Brian might jump in. 16 MR. BROOKMAN: Yeah. Brian. 17 MR. COFFEY: This is Brian Coffey with 18 Navigant. So this definition is intended not to make 19 use of those terms at all, so this definition is just 20 intended to stand on its own and be interpreted as 21 such. 22 MR. FERNSTROM: All right. Well, I'm more

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 62 1 specifically concerned about dedicated purpose pool 2 pump motors, which may be three-phase motors, 3 polyphase, and are in the horsepower range that you're 4 considering here in that they're in the range of like 5 one to three horsepower. And my concern is whether 6 this test procedure and the resulting efficiency rating 7 would be applicable to those products or not. And it 8 looks like it would be. Thank you. 9 MR. BROOKMAN: Dan? 10 MR. DELANEY: Dan Delaney, Regal Beloit. 11 Just to follow on to that as a further discussion, 12 there are commercial-type applications I can understand 13 of three- phase pool pump applications; may or may not 14 be used on an inverter. That may be acceptable for 15 those. A residential product that may have, let's say, 16 a single- phase input or a three-phase input to a 17 dedicated drive and loaded and sold as a unit would not 18 be considered -- and I'm kind of interested to learn if 19 that is what we were talking about. There is those two 20 types of products that are out there, not nearly as 21 much with a dedicated drive specially built, designed 22 for that motor combination, most of those being a

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 63 1 single-phase input, but there are three-phase. 2 MR. FERNSTROM: Well, that's an excellent 3 question that serves as an opportunity for further 4 clarification. I'm not thinking about large commercial 5 pools that use five or greater horsepower electric 6 motors, which may or may not be controlled by 7 inverters. I'm thinking about the residential and small 8 commercial- type products that are sold as a pump and 9 motor and are really connected with a drive on the 10 motor. And sometimes the motors serving that 11 application are three- phase induction motors, and it 12 seems to me that this test procedure, then, would apply 13 to those products. 14 MR. BROOKMAN: That last comment was from 15 Gary Fernstrom. Dan, you want -- 16 MS. ARMSTRONG: So can I just ask the 17 question -- is -- 18 MR. BROOKMAN: Ashley, please. 19 MS. ARMSTRONG: This is Ashley from DOE. Are 20 -- is your argument that they shouldn't -- it shouldn't 21 apply, or is the question just is it -- do they apply? 22 MR. FERNSTROM: I'm asking the question does

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 64 1 it apply or not? My desire would be that it does not 2 apply. 3 MS. ARMSTRONG: And why? 4 MR. FERNSTROM: However -- why? 5 MS. ARMSTRONG: Uh-huh. 6 MR. FERNSTROM: Because California regulates 7 pool pumps and pool pump motors, and I want to avoid an 8 issue of preemption or an issue of conflict with the 9 test procedure that's specified for these products. 10 MS. ARMSTRONG: Okay. 11 MR. BROOKMAN: Dan? 12 MR. DELANEY: Dan Delaney, Regal Beloit. I 13 think, Ashley, and I believe it's addressed with the 14 comments that are in here, directly connected to 15 polyphase. The product that we're talking here are not 16 directly connected to polyphase. The majority, if not 17 100 percent, would be directly connected to a single18 phase supply. 19 MR. BROOKMAN: Gary. 20 MR. FERNSTROM: Well -- Gary Fernstrom, 21 California IOUs. This integral product that's sold is 22 served from a single-phase utility source. That source

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 65 1 powers the drive, which, in turn, may power a polyphase 2 motor. 3 MS. ARMSTRONG: Uh-huh. 4 MR. FERNSTROM: So it kind of depends on 5 whether you look at the source as the source provided 6 to the integral product -- 7 MS. ARMSTRONG: Yep. 8 MR. FERNSTROM: -- that drive and motor sold 9 together, or the motor only. 10 MR. BROOKMAN: Additional comments here? 11 Okay. 12 MS. COSTELLO: Okay. So now we can move on 13 to our request for comment on totally enclosed non14 ventilated electric motors. 15 MR. BROOKMAN: Pamela read the definition. 16 Take a peek. You can see the comment box there. And 17 also, as she said, the preliminary decision is not to 18 propose test procedure amendments for TENV electric 19 motors. Comments here? No comments here? Oh, yes, 20 please. 21 DR. AGAMLOH: Emmanuel Agamloh. With regard 22 to (inaudible) includes non-ventilated, I think the

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 66 1 test procedure, there is no need for any new test 2 procedure, but I have a question about the air-over 3 motors. I think we had some -- the definition 4 previously, you know, in the opening slides, and since 5 the manufacturers are here, in terms of physical, you 6 know -- the products, putting the product together, 7 air-over motor and then TENV motor physically, how they 8 all look, and whether there are potentially any, you 9 know, avenues here for a loophole, you know, in terms 10 of the air-over motors. 11 I don't have any information on the volume of 12 these type of motors, but is it possible that that will 13 create some kind of loophole with respect to the TENV 14 that is covered and air-over that is not covered? 15 MR. BROOKMAN: And will you restate the type 16 of motor you're referring to? 17 DR. AGAMLOH: Air-over. 18 MR. BROOKMAN: Uh-huh. Okay. Air-over. 19 Okay. 20 Dan? 21 MR. DELANEY: Dan Delaney, Regal Beloit. I 22 was going to comment on this earlier. I felt the

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 67 1 definition, as it stands alone, on air-over is 2 adequate. There is the discussion between the two. 3 When you have a TENV motor, the differences between 4 maybe simply the marking and the further definition, 5 how that's defined in the nameplate, that's very 6 important for manufacturers. That is not something in 7 the marketplace today that has been around for a 8 terrible amount of time for this product. 9 Now that we're into DOE's small motor 10 electric rule as well as the electric motors, now that 11 they're coming down into both those range, it's going 12 to be important that the certification, which we feel 13 probably is not clear enough for this air-over and 14 TENV, so they're a product of the TENV that can be 15 provided simply as a TENV, a TENV just like motor that 16 can have comments about making it air-over by provided 17 the same airflow that a TEFC product would be or a 18 complete different realm of air-over electric motors 19 that are fan duty, whether they be in the airstream, 20 whether they be belted, whether it be some type of 21 connected blower. 22 So there's all types of definition on the

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 68 1 air- over that get into a lot of, we'll say, not as 2 straightforward with the airflow over. So it's going 3 to be important about the nameplate marking and 4 certification to clarify what is an air-over versus 5 other types. 6 MR. BROOKMAN: And Gary. 7 MR. FERNSTROM: Gary Fernstrom. One more 8 thought about the pool pump motor. I believe 9 historically, these three-phase pool pump motors, that 10 are powered by drives have not been considered to be 11 subject to this test procedure, but I'd like to 12 recommend an additional clarification be made such that 13 where we're talking about motors that are sold with an 14 integral drive, that we're referencing the power that 15 goes into the drive, not the power that may necessarily 16 present itself between the drive and the motor, so that 17 would make this type of product, in effect, powered 18 from a single-phase source, and it would be clear that 19 that type of product is not covered by this test 20 procedure. Thank you. 21 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Pamela -- 22 MR. deLASKI: Excuse me, Doug?

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 69 1 MR. BROOKMAN: Yes, Andrew? 2 MR. deLASKI: Andrew deLaski, Appliance 3 Standards Awareness Project. So I want to come back to 4 the question that Emmanuel asked -- 5 MR. BROOKMAN: That's -- 6 MR. deLASKI: -- and that Dan responded to. 7 MR. BROOKMAN: That's -- 8 MR. deLASKI: So I thought I heard what you'd 9 said, Dan, was that, yeah, it could be a problem. 10 That's what I thought you were saying. And then I 11 thought I heard you say that the way to address it 12 would be through careful labeling in terms of how the 13 manufacturers certify our product and then label it on 14 the nameplate; is that what you said? 15 MR. DELANEY: Dan Delaney, Regal Beloit. One 16 thing I think it's lacking is -- so we've provided a 17 definition of air-over. 18 MR. deLASKI: Right. 19 MR. DELANEY: We have not clarified that the 20 statement, then, goes on the nameplate as an enclosure 21 of air-over in the certification side to declare that. 22 Okay? It's defined as an air-over.

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 70 1 MR. deLASKI: Yeah. 2 MR. DELANEY: In the industry today, you'll 3 find many different forms putting air-over. I wouldn't 4 say there's a very good standard industry term there. 5 So it's important that the DOE provide a clear 6 definition that it's necessary in the certification to 7 declare an air-over product. 8 MR. deLASKI: So I guess my question is -- 9 maybe to you, maybe to the Department -- is, well, 10 where does that happen? Because like this is the 11 definition we have right here is to -- 12 MS. ARMSTRONG: It's the top one right there. 13 MR. deLASKI: Is -- this is it? 14 MS. ARMSTRONG: From the Department's 15 perspective. 16 MR. deLASKI: So if we need something more on 17 air-over, what I see is what's here on Page -- on Slide 18 14. Now, what I hear you saying is that we need more. 19 MS. ARMSTRONG: So that definition should be 20 self-standing. In other words, that's your way you 21 decide if you mark it or not. And should the 22 Department potentially ever in the future disagree with

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 71 1 you, that would be the argument that we would be -- I 2 mean, those were the -- the characteristics defined by 3 that definition would be what we're arguing over. 4 MR. BROOKMAN: Thank you, Ashley. Additional 5 -- Dan, nothing additional? Andrew, did you get your 6 MR. deLASKI: Yeah, and I guess I would just 7 throw it back to the NEMA folks. You clearly need to 8 do some more thinking about this, it sounds like. You 9 know, just -- this is an issue that's being raised now. 10 And the question, I guess, would be is there NEMA -- is 11 there existing NEMA -- what I'm hearing you say is that 12 there isn't the existing NEMA. This is a relatively 13 new issue coming up, and it needs some development 14 within NEMA. So it sounds like something that 15 MR. BROOKMAN: John? 16 MR. MALINOWSKI: John Malinowski, Baldor. On 17 the subject of air-over motors, for enclosure on the 18 nameplate, we put open air-over, totally enclosed air19 over. And typically we would put the CFM required to 20 keep the motor cooled to its rating, a minimum CFM 21 required to keep it cool. 22 In some cases, we have motors that are built

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 72 1 that might be totally enclosed fan-cooled. And let's 2 say it's rated as 10 horsepower as a TEFC motor, but 3 used in a totally enclosed air-over in an airstream, it 4 may be rated at 12 1/2 horsepower. 5 So we certify with the DOE for a 10 horse 6 motor, and its efficiency is, you know, compliant at 7 that level, but when it can carry way more heat at -- 8 you know, with an air-over cooling, it's got more air 9 over it than it does with the motor fan. So it can run 10 at 12 1/2 horsepower. You know, again, it's marked in 11 that respect. 12 All the motors that we make that are air13 over, you've got -- as Dan said, you've got a couple 14 different types of air-over. One might be a fan on 15 shaft, where it would be like a propeller fan that 16 would be on the motor shaft that would be pulling air 17 through a tunnel. More common would be a belted load 18 to a larger fan, and the motor would be sitting in, 19 say, a wall fan, and it would be sitting in the 20 airflow, getting air over it in that respect. 21 So I'm not sure DOE wants to get into the 22 details of how they're applied. I think simply the

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 73 1 idea that they're an air-over motor and should be 2 marked as such should be sufficient. 3 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. 4 MR. MALINOWSKI: And with respect to the 5 California pump, if that motor is a covered motor, you 6 know, it needs to comply with the regulations. If it's 7 an inverter-only motor that's never meant to run or 8 incapable of running on a line, then it's a non-covered 9 product. It's an inverter duty motor. So I don't 10 think anything needs to be exempted because it's a 11 swimming pool pump motor. 12 MR. BROOKMAN: John, I think Dan said that 13 the descriptors, the words used for air-over motors, 14 that it's not standardized, or something like that. Is 15 that something that NEMA's going to do? 16 Alex Bosenberg. 17 MR. BOSENBERG: Alex Bosenberg, NEMA. I've 18 made a note to discuss that within NEMA and answer that 19 in our public comments. 20 MR. BROOKMAN: Thank you very much. 21 MR. BOSENBERG: Written comment. 22 MR. BROOKMAN: Gary Fernstrom.

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 74 1 MR. FERNSTROM: So to go to the -- 2 MR. BROOKMAN: Gary -- 3 MR. FERNSTROM: Gary Fernstrom. To go to the 4 California regulations again, we're concerned about 5 single-phase pool pump motors under five horsepower. 6 Where it begins to be complicated is with the variable7 speed products that take single-phase power and may 8 convert it to three-phase to drive an induction motor. 9 And we want to make sure there's no confusion 10 around motors being used in that application. They may 11 not uniquely be able to operate only through a drive. 12 They may be able to operate on the line. But the way 13 they're assembled, packaged, and sold is for 14 application operating from single-phase power. 15 MR. BROOKMAN: Please go ahead. 16 MR. LIN: Paul Lin with Regal Beloit. I 17 think in the beginning, the definition said would 18 exclude permanent magnet motors; is that correct? 19 MS. COSTELLO: Which definitions? 20 MR. LIN: In the beginning, in the first few 21 slides that you had, where you -- 22 MALE SPEAKER: Talking about the squirrel

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 75 1 cage motors. 2 MR. LIN: Right. So I think -- 3 MS. COSTELLO: Oh. 4 MR. LIN: -- in that definition, that would 5 exclude all the pool pumps that Gary's concerned about. 6 MS. COSTELLO: This one? 7 MR. FERNSTROM: Gary Fernstrom -- 8 MR. LIN: Correct. 9 MR. FERNSTROM: -- PG&E. Not necessarily so. 10 Many of these pool pump motors are permanent magnet 11 motors, all right, but some utilize three-phase 12 induction motors that are powered through inverters and 13 sold into that application. 14 MR. BROOKMAN: Thank you. 15 John? 16 Dan's next, I guess. Dan. 17 MR. DELANEY: Just to go back to the air-over 18 one last time, I wanted to have clarity, if I could get 19 from DOE, on definitions here. So Steve Ruffing had 20 brought this up earlier. I just wanted to have 21 clarification. The definitions entered here, did they 22 apply to electric motors and small electric motors, or

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 76 1 is it applying primarily to just electric motors? 2 MS. ARMSTRONG: Just electric. 3 MR. BROOKMAN: Ashley, for the record. 4 MS. ARMSTRONG: Just electric. 5 MR. DELANEY: So just electric motors, the -- 6 MS. ARMSTRONG: Correct. 7 MR. DELANEY: -- integral horsepower, 1 to 8 500? 9 MR. BROOKMAN: Roger Daugherty. 10 MR. DAUGHERTY: Roger Daugherty. However, in 11 the present definition of "electric motor," it is 12 merely a device that transforms electrical power into 13 rotating power. It's not limited to size. It's not 14 limited to type of power or anything. 15 So, once again -- and this issue about this 16 pool pump motor, if this -- if these definitions are 17 complete definitions, which could be achieved by making 18 certain that electric motor, as referred to through the 19 definitions, encompass the nine points, then that will 20 take care of many of the issues and many of the area of 21 confusion. 22 And then the word "motor" that's being used

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 77 1 is not presently defined. It was previously defined, 2 but after EISA, the Department removed that definition 3 and used it for electric motor. So, again, another 4 push for getting electric motor to be clearer to the 5 understanding and distinguished from the small electric 6 motor in the other subpart. 7 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Frank. 8 MR. LADONNE: Frank Ladonne, Underwriters 9 Laboratories. I think Gary's point -- and I understand 10 it completely because we see these motors -- is that 11 very often there are three-phase motors that are sold 12 with an integral inverter as part of the motor. 13 So I think the point is what do you consider 14 the electric motor? Do you consider the electric motor 15 the way it's sold with the integral inverter, or do you 16 consider the electric motor, as determined by these 17 requirements, to be the motor itself and separate out 18 the inverter that is packaged with the motor? So I 19 think it's a very important point that deserves some 20 clarification. 21 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Thank you. 22 Dan.

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 78 1 MR. DELANEY: I'd just like to add maybe one 2 last point on this. On the Issue 31, which is the 3 definite purpose, inverter-fed electric motor -- and 4 I'll say NEMA's position would be defined as that, a 5 definite purpose, inverter-fed electric motor -- 6 operation solely for with that inverter. And it's not 7 intended for operation, you know, separated from that 8 inverter, so I would say that it's clearly defined 9 there in the definite purpose. 10 MR. deLASKI: As an exempted -- Andrew 11 deLaski. As an exempted motor? 12 MR. DELANEY: That's correct, yes. 13 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Let me note that we're 14 on Slide 29, and we have -- 45 or 47 is the number of 15 substantive slides. I'm going to suggest maybe we 16 should take a break in a little bit. 17 Roger Daugherty, before we go to break? 18 MR. DAUGHERTY: Roger Daugherty. Yes, sort 19 of a summary of these definitions now that we've gone 20 through and that most of these definitions were lifted 21 from the NEMA standard and use NEMA terminology. Most 22 of these definitions do not include any references to

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 79 1 IEC or IEC equivalent or anything like that. 2 And just so the Department's aware that in 3 the IEC world, they do not use the terms like TENV. 4 They don't use the terms air-over. They designate the 5 equivalence of these by the use of an IP code, which is 6 a classification of protection, and an IC code, which 7 is classification of the method of cooling. 8 So if you were to look at an IEC motor rather 9 than finding a TENV notation, you're more likely to see 10 that it's identified by an IP and maybe an IC code, and 11 the same for the air-over motor, and the same for most 12 of the other motor types. So you should consider 13 incorporating the IEC equivalences within each of these 14 definitions. 15 MR. BROOKMAN: Do the NEMA definitions 16 include those equivalences? 17 MR. DAUGHERTY: No. 18 MR. BROOKMAN: No? I was just curious. 19 MR. DAUGHERTY: The -- Roger Daugherty. In 20 instances where there is a direct correlation between a 21 NEMA letter code designation, like the TENV and things, 22 and an IEC IP code or a corresponding IEC code, in the

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 80 1 NEMA MG1 standard, those code letters are provided in 2 parentheses next to the identifier, such as totally 3 enclosed non-vent, so -- 4 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. 5 MR. DAUGHERTY: -- there are some. There are 6 instances where there -- you will not find both, that 7 there is not necessarily an IP code that may be 8 corresponded to the NEMA identifier, or there is not an 9 IEC code that happens to correspond. But where there 10 is correspondence, you will find it in the NEMA 11 standard. 12 MR. BROOKMAN: Ashley Armstrong. 13 MS. ARMSTRONG: So can I assume that NEMA, in 14 its comments, will make suggestions where there's not a 15 corresponding IEC code? 16 MALE SPEAKER: Thanks for the assignment. 17 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. 18 MS. ARMSTRONG: No problem. 19 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Andrew deLaski. 20 MR. deLASKI: Doug, I assume we're finishing 21 up on definitions, so -- 22 MR. BROOKMAN: Yes.

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 81 1 MR. deLASKI: -- before we -- 2 MR. BROOKMAN: Yeah. 3 MR. deLASKI: -- so before the break -- 4 MR. BROOKMAN: Yeah. 5 MR. deLASKI: -- I appreciate all the work 6 done to make these more accurate and more specific and 7 all the work that NEMA's doing to give you good 8 comments. One comment I want to make in general at a 9 high level is that, you know, these are definitions 10 that are adopted through regulation, and, therefore, 11 they're definitions that can be modified in the future 12 through regulation. They're not statutory definitions, 13 so they're definitions that are -- can be modified. 14 What I want to -- the point I want to make is 15 that it may be in the future, at some subsequent 16 rulemaking, that there's a desire by stakeholders that 17 DOE expand coverage again to additional motors. So as 18 DOE does work up definitions, you know, please do it 19 with an eye towards keeping in mind that there may be a 20 time in ten years from now, some other point where some 21 additional motors should be brought in the coverage of 22 the rulemaking, just like in this instance, we're

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 82 1 talking about covering a lot more motors. 2 So that flexibility is retained by the 3 Department, as I understand it. And I see nodding from 4 Ashley and others over here. Just because we're making 5 -- just because we're restricting this definition now 6 is not the final word forever and ever kind of thing. 7 MS. ARMSTRONG: Correct. 8 MR. deLASKI: Okay. And I also apologize for 9 being a little late this morning. I want to just make 10 a -- just a brief opening thought to share with folks, 11 which is that as I read this test procedure, NOPR, I 12 think it tracks very well, very closely with what the 13 Motor Coalition recommended in our joint comment last 14 summer. And I think it puts the Department on track to 15 adopt what I hope will be a proposed rule that very 16 closely -- for standards that could very closely follow 17 along recommendations of the Motor Coalition. 18 So I want to thank the Department for their 19 work in developed a proposed test method that lays the 20 groundwork for -- addresses points that were made by 21 our -- in our joint comments. It doesn't address 22 everything exactly as we asked for it in our test

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 83 1 procedure recommendations, and that's some of the 2 feedback that you're hearing today and will continue to 3 hear in the second part of this hearing, so thank you. 4 MR. BROOKMAN: I thought the Federal Register 5 Notice did a pretty good job of describing some of the 6 Motor Coalition's -- 7 MR. deLASKI: Yes. 8 MR. BROOKMAN: -- positions on all that. 9 Okay. Okay. I'm not foreclosing returning to 10 reconsider or re- discuss the definition issues. Don't 11 want to do that. These are really critical, really 12 important functionality. But let's take a break. It's 13 now about 20 minutes until 11. Let's take a 15-minute 14 break, which means we'll return at 5 minutes until 11. 15 You must wear a badge like this, visible, if 16 you're in the Forrestal Building. There are restrooms 17 on both ends of the hall. If you want a cup of coffee, 18 go quickly down to the ground floor. Just about 19 directly beneath us on the ground floor, there's a 20 Dunkin' Donuts coffee shop. And we'll see you back 21 here in 15 minutes. And we made good progress already 22 this morning. See you back here in 15.

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 84 1 (Whereupon, a brief recess was taken.) 2 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Let's resume. So we 3 are going to proceed. And by my count, we're about on 4 Slide 30. And back -- before we continue, Roger 5 Daugherty. 6 MR. DAUGHERTY: Roger Daugherty. During the 7 break, I was asked some questions to try to clarify 8 some things, and it brought to light something that I 9 just now noticed, that if you could go back to Slide 10 12, which are the nine characteristics -- 11 MS. ARMSTRONG: You really like that slide. 12 MR. DAUGHERTY: Yeah, I do. I mean -- 13 MS. ARMSTRONG: That's your favorite slide. 14 MR. DAUGHERTY: -- that's an important slide 15 here. 16 And down where it refers to frame sizes, that 17 it refers to -- has a three-digit NEMA frame size or 18 IEC metric equivalent -- I won't deal with the other at 19 this comment -- what was done in the last revision of 20 the definition of Subtype I, the Department had 21 proposed a way to try to include this issue of this 100 22 IEC metric frame that was exempted under the previous

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 85 1 rules for the previous years. 2 And as a result of that, what is presently in 3 431.12, as part of the definition of the Subtype -- the 4 general purpose electric motor of Subtype I is the 5 language that it is built in accordance with NEMA T 6 frame dimensions or their IEC metric equivalents, which 7 is pretty much what it says on the screen there. 8 But in addition, it says "including a frame 9 size that is between two consecutive NEMA frame sizes 10 or their IEC metric equivalents." So that was a way of 11 trying to pull in. So if, in these nine points, for 12 that particular one, you were to go to the present 13 language and the present definition, you would 14 encompass some earlier points that were made of trying 15 to include the IEC 100 frame and those two higher 16 frames that are presently not covered by this 17 particular type of language in these present nine 18 points. 19 However, during that rulemaking, for what did 20 end up in 431.12, NEMA did point out that this 21 additional phrase does become quite confusing because 22 it now, if you look at U frames, those are frame sizes

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 86 1 that are between NEMA frame sizes. 2 So it appeared to -- while it wasn't expected 3 that it was intended, it appeared that it pulled U 4 frame into Subtype I, whereas Congress had specifically 5 included those in Subtype II. It also raised an issue, 6 if you do consider, only in physical dimensions, that 7 an IEC 100 frame, which part of this additional clause 8 applies? Are those dimensions such that they lie 9 between two NEMA frame sizes, or are they dimensions 10 that lie between two IEC frame sizes? 11 And we had asked for some clarity back then. 12 I don't think -- I think at NEMA, we forgot to follow 13 up with a request for clarification of that. One 14 possible way of clarifying it is that the present 15 statement between modified to state that it's including 16 a T-frame size that is between two consecutive NEMA T17 frame sizes or an IEC metric frame size, which is 18 between two IEC metric frames. And that would take 19 care of the confusion. It won't quite -- or at least 20 by putting a T in there, it will take care of the U21 frame confusion and get that and leave it where it's 22 supposed to be, over in Subtype II.

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 87 1 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Additional comments on 2 any of this before we move on? Okay. 3 MS. COSTELLO: Okay. So moving on to the 4 next part of the presentation, we're going to talk 5 about a group of motors that DOE is proposing to add 6 additional instructions to for testing, but that they 7 are, at this time, not proposing definitions for. 8 So first we have electric motors with non -- 9 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. We have a preliminary 10 comment from Roger. 11 MS. COSTELLO: Okay. 12 MR. BROOKMAN: Roger Daugherty. 13 MR. DAUGHERTY: Yes, Roger Daugherty. I see 14 that it seems to be missing from the request for 15 comments from the Department in the request, but 16 there's a very important clause that's being added to 17 this Appendix B, to Subpart B, that has a significant 18 impact that I'm not aware exists on any other product, 19 and that's this note that's at the beginning, with that 20 note stating that for any special or definite purpose 21 motor type for which definitions are provided or for 22 which specific testing procedures are provided, must be

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 88 1 based upon results generated by test. Test only. 2 That's the only thing it refers to here. 3 Further, that if a manufacturer wishes to put 4 an efficiency on a type for which the Department has 5 not established any standards, the manufacturer's still 6 obligated to have to test to make such a determination. 7 That's what the paragraph says. And so -- 8 MS. ARMSTRONG: But -- 9 MR. DAUGHERTY: -- we're very concerned with 10 the introduction of this paragraph. 11 MS. ARMSTRONG: So -- 12 MR. BROOKMAN: Ashley Armstrong. 13 MS. ARMSTRONG: -- I think you're asking 14 about -- you're differentiating between testing and the 15 use of an AEDM; correct? 16 MALE SPEAKER: Yeah. 17 MS. ARMSTRONG: So in DOE's -- 18 MR. DAUGHERTY: No, no. 19 MS. ARMSTRONG: -- regs, the way I read them 20

-- 21 MALE SPEAKER: Roger says -- 22 MS. ARMSTRONG: -- we can clarify, to make

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 89 1 this clear, the intent was never to -- we see a testing 2 procedure or determination of a rating as the use of 3 the test or an AEDM. So an AEDM is still allowed. 4 What you're doing today would still be allowed. That 5 AEDM would have to be, you know, pursuant to DOE's 6 regs, but -- or, you know, validated, et cetera, 7 substantiated. But there's no intention to say, just to 8 differentiate, you must test them through this 9 language. So we can clarify as necessary. 10 MR. BROOKMAN: Roger. 11 MR. DAUGHERTY: Roger Daugherty. I thank you 12 for that clarification; however, I believe that one of 13 the most significant issues is that this paragraph 14 applies to any special or definite purpose motor type 15 for which definitions are provided. That means that 16 what we have discussed this morning that would be non17 covered types, but because you include a definition -- 18 MS. ARMSTRONG: No, we got your point. 19 MR. DAUGHERTY: Okay. 20 MS. ARMSTRONG: We got it. 21 MR. DAUGHERTY: Well, I have one more point. 22 MS. ARMSTRONG: Slide 12, plus the four

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 90 1 exclusions. Got it. 2 MR. BROOKMAN: And the specificity. Keep 3 going, Roger. Yeah. 4 MR. DAUGHERTY: Yeah. My other point is that 5 this paragraph is being designated as a note, and it 6 contains mandatory language, and we sort of covered 7 this in a previous rulemaking from a NOPR that was -- 8 came out on January 5th of 2011, a Supplemental Notice 9 of Proposed Rulemaking on mandatory requirements. 10 Then NEMA submitted comments to that dated 11 February 4th of 2011. DOE then considered that in the 12 final rule that was published on May 4th, 2012. The 13 issue was to make a point that within the motor 14 industry -- and I believe pretty much other industries 15 also -- in the standards that we work with, notes are 16 not considered part of a standard. 17 They are not to contain mandatory language. 18 They are not interpreted as such. And many times, 19 those standards even state that right at the beginning. 20 So we encourage DOE not to use notes when there's a 21 mandatory requirement. 22 If you were just -- if something was just

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 91 1 being explained that is appropriate in a note, 2 mandatory requirements, we do -- we feel there would be 3 confusion of those who see a note and say, "Well, the 4 notes don't apply because they've never applied to 5 anything else I've ever done, and IEEE standard and 6 ANSI standard and IEC standard, a NEMA standard, so the 7 note doesn't apply." 8 The Department seemed to take that into 9 consideration in that final rule, and that was where 10 that language I was just talking about regarding frame 11 sizes came from. It was incorporated into the 12 definition rather than being established as a note. 13 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Thank you. We're going 14 to move on now -- 15 MS. COSTELLO: Okay. 16 MR. BROOKMAN: -- to Pamela. 17 MS. ARMSTRONG: Actually, I want to say 18 something real quick, though. 19 MR. BROOKMAN: Pamela. 20 MS. ARMSTRONG: So we -- 21 MR. BROOKMAN: Oh, Pardon me. Ashley. 22 MS. ARMSTRONG: -- we appreciate the

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 92 1 statement. 2 MR. BROOKMAN: Ashley. Ashley, please. 3 MS. ARMSTRONG: The note is in reg text. It 4 is -- it would be law, and it is a requirement. And 5 this is how we're writing notes in terms of 6 representation requirements across the board for many 7 of our products. You'll see them a lot in different 8 test procedures. 9 That being said, we understand the statement, 10 but we do want you to understand that it carries the 11 same weight, regardless of whether this is not common 12 on how it's done in industry. 13 MR. BROOKMAN: Now we're moving on. 14 MS. COSTELLO: Okay. 15 MR. BROOKMAN: Pamela. 16 MS. COSTELLO: So moving on to electric 17 motors with non-standard endshields or flanges, DOE's 18 aware that some electric motors may have special or 19 customer-defined endshields or flanges that do not 20 necessarily conform to NEMA specifications. And as DOE 21 is now considering standards for special and definite 22 purpose motors, the dimensions of a motor's endshield

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 93 1 or flange would no longer dictate if a motor should 2 meet standards. 3 For this reason, DOE's proposing to add a few 4 testing instructions. If a situation arises where 5 motors with non-standard endshields cannot be attached 6 to a testing laboratory's dynamometer, DOE proposes 7 that the custom endshield be replaced with one that has 8 standard dimensions and mounting configurations. This 9 replacement must be obtained through the manufacturer 10 and be constructed of the same material as the original 11 endplate. 12 At this time, DOE invites comment on its 13 proposed instructions for testing electric motors with 14 non-standard endshields or flanges. 15 MR. BROOKMAN: Roger? 16 MR. DAUGHERTY: Roger Daugherty. The issue 17 here, as the manufacturers see it, is with respect to 18 the requirement that the manufacturer would be 19 obligated to provide an appropriate endshield of the 20 same material as the original endplate, particularly 21 for a manufacturer that doesn't normally manufacture 22 endplates of normal NEMA dimensions or IEC dimensions.

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 94 1 This puts an obligation on the manufacturer 2 to create something that he doesn't really have in his 3 facility. 4 MS. ARMSTRONG: So can I ask what you 5 suggest? Because as I understand it, this is what NEMA 6 suggested the additional instructions be. What did you 7 suggest, then? 8 MR. BROOKMAN: Thank you, Ashley. 9 Now to John. 10 MR. MALINOWSKI: John Malinowski, Baldor, I 11 guess speaking on behalf of NEMA. I think what we 12 talked about was the manufacturer would be involved in 13 a partial motor and getting you an endplate. When 14 we're talking about a special-dimensioned endplate or 15 such, I'd like to defer to our Advanced Energy guys 16 here, who test these sort of things. Typically, those 17 can still be tested on the dynamometer. 18 Most often, we would mount the motor in a -- 19 perhaps in a cradle or mounted on the mounting base, or 20 you would have a bracket that the motor would bolt to, 21 and, you know, you just need to drill some different 22 holes in that bracket to allow the mounting. Usually a

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 95 1 special endplate isn't so special that you can't put it 2 on the dynamometer. 3 MS. ARMSTRONG: So -- 4 MR. MALINOWSKI: Where we were talking with 5 respect to us supplying an endplate was really for that 6 partial motor where we'd give you an endplate for that. 7 And I'll have some comments on that when we get to it 8 as well. 9 MS. ARMSTRONG: Yeah. I mean, this is Ashley 10 from the Department. And I know you've heard me say 11 this before, but I think we're looking for standardized 12 instructions, and what you seem to be describing seems 13 like a model-specific instructions, depending on how it 14 be able to be fit to a dynamometer, that the 15 manufacturer may elect or that DOE may decide, you know 16 -- I mean, we can write it such that, you know, for 17 non-standard endshields that cannot be attached to the 18 dynamometer, DOE is free to modify them such that it 19 can be attached to the dynamometer any way that DOE 20 sees fit, and we can do that too. 21 But what we were trying to do is put 22 standardized language such that, you know, a

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 96 1 manufacturer's expectations of how we would attach this 2 to the dynamometer is similar to what they would do if 3 they were testing. 4 MR. BROOKMAN: Well -- 5 MS. ARMSTRONG: And maybe there's not a way 6 to do that with these, but that's what we were going 7 for. 8 MR. BROOKMAN: John, follow on. 9 MR. MALINOWSKI: I guess, Ashley, if we look 10 why we have a special endplate, it may have a non11 standard bearing size or a large shaft or whatever, and 12 in reality, there isn't a standard endplate that we 13 would give you for that. I'm thinking of a shaker 14 motor or something that we would make for industry 15 that, you know, it may have a huge shaft coming out of 16 it that just -- there's not a standard NEMA endplate 17 that would fit there. It's designed for a specific 18 OEM. 19 A lot of times, these endplates are designed 20 where the endplate is actually part of the customer's 21 compressor or machine. We don't give him a partial 22 motor. We build a motor that has part of his machine

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 97 1 as part of our motor. 2 So we give him a complete motor. It's 3 standalone. It can be tested on our dynamometer. It 4 can be tested no load on our production floor. But in 5 respect to giving a standard endplate for that motor, 6 maybe we can, maybe we can't. It would really depend a 7 lot on the motor. 8 MR. BROOKMAN: Andrew, follow on. 9 MR. deLASKI: I was just looking at the 10 regulatory language at the end here, and I want to just 11 clarify something, because Roger used the words "We 12 have an obligation to provide an endplate," and I don't 13 see an obligation in here, in the existing language. 14 What I see is sort of best efforts. Right? What it 15 says is, "If this is necessary" -- I'm looking at -- 16 no, on the very last part of the rule. 17 MR. BROOKMAN: You're referring to page, in 18 the Federal Register Notice -- 19 MR. deLASKI: 38482. 20 MR. BROOKMAN: Thank you. 21 MS. ARMSTRONG: I think they're saying -- 22 well, correct me --

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 98 1 MR. deLASKI: It says you've got to give me 2 an endplate if you can, right? I mean, you're going to 3 request it, and they may or may not be able to give it 4 to you. 5 MS. ARMSTRONG: I think their question is 6 what happens if we can't? 7 MALE SPEAKER: Well -- 8 MS. ARMSTRONG: Then are we free to do what 9 we want? 10 MR. deLASKI: Then you're going to do your 11 thing, and they're going to respond to you. This is 12 for an enforcement test, right, we're talking about? 13 MS. ARMSTRONG: Mostly. So -- 14 MR. deLASKI: Right? So -- 15 MS. ARMSTRONG: -- ideally, we would like to 16

-- 17 MR. deLASKI: -- you're going to have to sort 18 it through, right, in the instance; right? 19 MR. BROOKMAN: That's -- thank you, Ashley 20 and Andrew. 21 Now back to John. 22 MR. MALINOWSKI: Well, I guess some of my

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 99 1 comments -- I was going to talk about partial motors -- 2 are probably applicable here as well. Let's say a 3 piece of equipment is coming in and you're taking a 4 motor from that piece of equipment out of commerce. 5 Okay? The importer of that equipment is probably not 6 the motor manufacturer. You know, it may be something 7 coming in -- let's say it's a compressor coming in from 8 India and it's got a special endplate or a partial 9 motor on it that's part of that equipment. 10 So the DOE takes that motor and wishes to 11 test it on a dynamometer. This poor guy is just an 12 importer/distributor of the equipment. He doesn't even 13 know who the motor manufacturer is. He's not even 14 affiliated with that. So is he obligated to go back to 15 India and say, "Gee, Mr. Compressor Manufacturer, I 16 need to get an endplate for the motor that you put on 17 the machine that I'm trying to import into the 18 country," or it's a special endplate. 19 I mean, it's -- you know, it kind of goes 20 back to I'd like our friends at Advanced Energy to 21 comment how they do the testing of products like this 22 in their lab. I mean, they have facilities where they

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 100 1 can do this. 2 MR. BROOKMAN: Just a second. Before we move 3 on, did that clarify -- Ashley, did that -- 4 MS. ARMSTRONG: (Inaudible). 5 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Go ahead. 6 DR. AGAMLOH: Emmanuel Agamloh, Advanced 7 Energy. The special endplate -- there are different 8 types. There is not, you know, a specific -- and the 9 fact that the motor has a special endplate doesn't mean 10 that you cannot test it. 11 However, if the motor has an endplate which 12 completely, you know -- you are not able to test it 13 because of that endplate and you take that endplate 14 off, the motor falls probably in the category of a 15 partial motor, and the way you treat partial motor 16 should be similar to the way you treat this type of 17 motor. 18 If we are saying that the manufacturer can 19 provide an endplate to test partial motor, the 20 manufacturer should be able to provide an endplate also 21 to test a motor for which, you know, certification or, 22 you know, coverage is required, which doesn't have an

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 101 1 endplate that fits -- or that will make it fit on a 2 dynamometer. 3 So I think that, you know, either you make a 4 new endplate or the testing lab makes a new endplate. 5 Somebody has to make that new endplate somehow. 6 MR. MALINOWSKI: And it may not be on the 7 same material. Maybe aluminum. 8 MS. ARMSTRONG: Is that the issue, the 9 material? 10 MR. BOTELER: Not totally. Rob Boteler with 11 Nidec. 12 MR. BROOKMAN: That was -- 13 MR. BOTELER: One of the issues is the 14 material, but just -- 15 MR. BROOKMAN: Rob -- okay. Summarize. So 16 John says it may not be the same material. Ashley says 17 is the material, is that the key issue? 18 Rob, keep going. 19 MR. BOTELER: No, I don't think the material 20 is the key issue, but it is an issue that, when we make 21 an endplate or Emmanuel makes an endplate, that it 22 doesn't really matter what the material would be, I

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 102 1 don't think. 2 If we have a cast-iron motor and we need to 3 make an endplate, could we make it out of aluminum? 4 Because we're not going to go out and create a new 5 casting for one endplate. And the material wouldn't 6 affect the efficiency of the motor as long as it uses 7 the same -- you know, the bearing and it's on the 8 correct bearing center. 9 MS. ARMSTRONG: So let me just go back. This 10 is Ashley from DOE. Material issue aside -- so I 11 understand that part, but if I understood what Emmanuel 12 said, he said they should be treated similarly to 13 partial electric motors, and how we're treating partial 14 electric motors is we're saying, "Fine. Endshields 15 meeting a NEMA or IEC spec shall be obtained for 16 testing." 17 And are you telling me that that cannot be 18 done in all cases for non-standard endshields? In 19 other words, for those non-standard ones that cannot be 20 attached to a dynamometer and you had to remove, can 21 you -- I mean -- 22 MR. BROOKMAN: John.

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 103 1 MR. MALINOWSKI: I guess my point here -- 2 John Malinowski, Baldor. My point here is that the 3 endplate, the dummy endplate that we put on doesn't 4 have to meet a NEMA or IEC spec. All we're looking for 5 is a piece of metal with a bearing to carry the shaft 6 load while the motor's on the dynamometer. 7 The dimensionality of that endplate, whether 8 it's got a C face or a D flange or a whatever on it, is 9 irrelevant, totally. All you need is a flat piece of 10 steel that engages and centers a bearing in the housing 11 and supports it while you couple it to the dynamometer. 12 In some cases, if it's a round-body motor and there's 13 not a base to mount and support the motor on the dyno, 14 that endplate may have to have holes drilled in it in 15 any manner needed for the testing facility to bolt to 16 their dynamometer. 17 So it's a customized piece. We, as a motor 18 manufacturer, would have customized pieces that we use 19 for our testing. When the Navigant people did their 20 facility visits last year, they saw those pieces. They 21 saw the shaft adapters and everything. I think they 22 saw that at other motor manufacturers. These guys have

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 104 1 the same kind of pieces that they use and go out to 2 have an electric motor shop locally build it for them. 3 You know, so having it meet NEMA or IEC dimensions for 4 the adapter is irrelevant. 5 MR. BROOKMAN: Emmanuel? 6 DR. AGAMLOH: Emmanuel Agamloh. To the 7 extent that, you know, the testing and efficiency 8 characterization is concerned, I agree that those 9 dimensions are not really relevant. If the motor is -- 10 you know, it depends on how the endshield will look 11 like. But if there is a way of, you know, attaching a 12 cover that will center the bearings, the rotor 13 completely, and for that purpose, the motor will now be 14 able to be mounted for testing, the standard dimension 15 is, you know, extraneous to the requirements. 16 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. 17 Rob? 18 MR. BOTELER: Rob Boteler with Nidec. Yeah, 19 I think one of the issues that I have is that the 20 replacement is obtained from the manufacturer and to be 21 constructed with the same material. I think we need to 22 be open enough that if the manufacturer -- to John's

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 105 1 point, it's an offshore manufacturer, and it can't be 2 reasonable to secure it, that the test lab could 3 manufacture a replacement endshield. 4 I think probably the bigger issue we're going 5 to run into is some of our friends who build gear 6 motors, when we change the endshield, we also change 7 the bearing center so now the rotor assembly cannot be 8 used. So that brings us to a new level of modification 9 that has to be dealt with. 10 MR. BROOKMAN: Ashley? 11 MS. ARMSTRONG: Ashley needs to think about 12 what she wants to say. So is your ask from the 13 Department that the Department engage you in a 14 discussion and agree upon the endshield that is needed 15 for testing, period? What is your ask, I guess? What 16 language -- 17 MR. BROOKMAN: What is our ask? 18 MR. LADONNE: And just to clarify, if I'm not 19 mistaken, it looks like Ashley's looking for -- the 20 Department of Energy, pardon me, is looking for some 21 sort of a useful and elegant descriptor here that's not 22 going to bind everybody up and make enforcement

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 106 1 possible and -- right? Does that exist? 2 MS. ARMSTRONG: But I think we want to set 3 expectations about how we would test or the process we 4 would use for testing. And if we don't need identical 5 things, we want to agree, at least, at the outset that 6 if we need to engage in a discussion with you about 7 what the endplate is, that we engage, we agree, and 8 that's it. 9 MR. BROOKMAN: While you're thinking, Frank - 10 - I've dropped out of the queue. I apologize, Frank. 11 You're in that -- go ahead, please. 12 MR. LADONNE: So I don't know if this is the 13 element solution you were looking for, but it's a 14 solution. And I think that Ashley earlier had kind of 15 the kernel of the language, and, you know, in light of 16 what everyone has said, I think you need to put in 17 language that says that the endshield may be modified 18 or fabricated to the extent necessary to facilitate 19 coupling to the dynamometer, but so that that 20 modification or fabrication doesn't affect the results 21 of the test, period. You know, and that leaves both 22 the manufacturers and the test lab open to do what they

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 107 1 need to do. 2 MR. BROOKMAN: Ashley? 3 MS. ARMSTRONG: So we were doing well, Frank, 4 until we got to that end of the statement, where it 5 says the results, basically, are unaffected by -- you 6 know, it's hard to prove that. If the results -- 7 MR. LADONNE: Right. 8 MS. ARMSTRONG: -- aren't what is expected -- 9 MR. LADONNE: Right. And here's what I meant 10 by that. 11 MS. ARMSTRONG: -- we do not want to pinpoint 12 the endshield. I mean, we want to agree, "This is how 13 you test," period, and the results are what they are. 14 MR. LADONNE: Right. Okay. Frank Ladonne, 15 Underwriters. And what I meant by that was that 16 endshields may or may not have ventilation openings. 17 Okay? So if there are ventilation openings that are 18 going to affects the results of the test, those 19 ventilation openings need to be, you know, emulated as 20 close as possible to what was there originally. 21 MS. ARMSTRONG: I guess that brings up a good 22 question, and all of you can talk in one second. How

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 108 1 do you test? I mean, what is -- if we're trying to 2 emulate what you did in your lab 3 MR. BROOKMAN: John. 4 MR. MALINOWSKI: Let me take a whack at this. 5 And let me kind of start over and say that the initial 6 comment was concerning customized endplates or 7 mountings. Just because it's got a customized endplate 8 or mounting doesn't necessarily mean that it can't be 9 tested on the dynamometer. That's point one. So we 10 don't -- 11 MS. ARMSTRONG: I think we got that; right? 12 MR. MALINOWSKI: We don't have to have a 13 special endplate for that. If we can't, you know, do 14 that, then we make an adapter so that that endplate can 15 bolt to the dynamometer. If we can't do that, then we 16 -- what we would actually do in our production would be 17 test a motor of like electrical design. In other 18 words, you know, we would take the guts out of the 19 motor and put it in a standard configuration and test 20 it. 21 The -- you know, the special endplate or 22 special shaft or whatever wingdings you hang on the

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 109 1 outside of the motor is just fluff. It is not anything 2 that affects the performance of the motor. When the 3 guys came through and looked at product going through 4 our plants, they saw motors that had spline shafts. 5 They had motors that had hollow shafts. They saw 6 motors with three-foot-long shafts. 7 We wouldn't put a motor with a three-foot8 long shaft on the dynamometer and test it. We'd test 9 the basic NEMA T frame equivalent of that motor and 10 know what the efficiency of that is in performance, 11 because a three-foot-long shaft isn't going to affect 12 the performance of the motor. 13 So how we'd test it is we'd test a standard T 14 frame configuration. I think we've talked about that 15 in the past, but, you know, the idea of taking a motor 16 from a machine that's in commerce and testing it, when 17 we get into some of the shaft configurations and some 18 of the other things that we'll talk about later, you 19 know, those are where all the little adapter widgets 20 will have to come into play. 21 Can you take a motor with a three-foot shaft 22 and put it on a dyno? Well, yeah, you could. You

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 110 1 know, you'd have to have it -- it would be a challenge 2 for these guys to have the dyno bed long enough to 3 space the motor back far enough away to put a coupling 4 on the end. 5 To the point that we talked about some of the 6 gear motors, some of the gear motors that we have 7 actually have a gear that's cut into the motor shaft so 8 there's not an easy place to put a coupling on that. 9 But could you test it? You know, if you can couple to 10 it and couple to the dyno, you could test it, but, you 11 know, the challenge is going to be how do you test it? 12 You talked about modifying the motor for 13 testing, so let's say you went in there, and you put it 14 in a lathe, and you cut the shaft down so that a 15 standard coupling would fit on the shaft. How do you 16 then return that motor to commerce? Let's say a guy is 17 importing a machine, and you take all of the motors out 18 of his machine and test them. He's kind of out a 19 machine now that doesn't have any motors on it. You 20 know, how -- I mean, that's certainly, you know, who's 21 responsible for that? 22 You know, the more we talk about this, the

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 111 1 more questions that kind of come up through the whole 2 process. You know, who pays for the endplate on these 3 things when we have to fabricate an endplate? I don't 4 -- you know, the manufacturer might be the importer of 5 the pump or the compressor. 6 MR. BROOKMAN: Frank. 7 MR. LADONNE: Frank Ladonne, Underwriters 8 Laboratories. Yeah, so I guess, you know, another way 9 of saying this, that the heartburn we're all having 10 with the wording that's here is some of the language 11 that says, "Replace with one that has standard 12 dimensions and mounting configurations, must be 13 constructed of the same material." A lot of that 14 language is kind of immaterial to the task at hand, 15 which is coupling the motor to the dynamometer. Right? 16 So I think, you know, language, as I had 17 suggested earlier, you know, to the extent necessary to 18 facilitate coupling to the dynamometer is really what 19 you're after. I think that the more prescriptive we 20 tried to be, the more trouble we get into, in my 21 opinion. 22 MR. BROOKMAN: Rob?

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 112 1 MR. BOTELER: Rob Boteler with Nidec. I 2 think we understand a little more clearly now what the 3 issues are, and I think we would like to come back in 4 our written comments and define this a little more 5 clearly. 6 MR. BROOKMAN: Thank you. Okay. 7 MS. ARMSTRONG: We'd appreciate that. 8 MR. BROOKMAN: Thank you. 9 MR. deLASKI: I mean, I guess a thought for 10 Ashley, which is that, I mean, it may be that you just 11 -- there is some situation where it just can't be done. 12 MS. ARMSTRONG: Yeah. 13 MR. deLASKI: And is that a problem for you? 14 I mean, that troubles you? 15 MS. ARMSTRONG: We would -- ideally, in an 16 ideal world, we would like a way to test any motor that 17 we would choose to test. That's not to say we would 18 ever get there, but 19 MR. deLASKI: Yeah. 20 MS. ARMSTRONG: And what this was trying to 21 do is at least articulate a process for which we would 22 go through and test a given motor. Now, if that

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 113 1 process includes discussing with the manufacturer 2 either the endshields or the modifications or whatever 3 needed, only if it can't be connected to a dynamometer, 4 you know, in order to facilitate testing, then that's 5 one way to go, but we would agree that that's a 6 process, iron it out, and then we just test it, or if 7 we couldn't, we would allow the test labs free will to 8 modify as they see fit. 9 But what we'd like to do is develop a process 10 so there's a common expectation there on how we would 11 test or -- going forward. That's the idea. But, yes, 12 I mean, we'd like to test -- be able to test -- 13 MR. deLASKI: It just strikes me -- 14 MS. ARMSTRONG: -- any motor. 15 MR. deLASKI: -- that if you end up with a 16 system that's good 95 percent of the time, that that's 17 probably sufficient? 18 MS. ARMSTRONG: That's close. I mean -- 19 MR. deLASKI: You're ending up with a system 20

-- 21 MS. ARMSTRONG: -- the going-in position is a 22 hundred --

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 114 1 MR. deLASKI: Right. 2 MS. ARMSTRONG: -- but the fallback position, 3 sure. 4 MR. deLASKI: Yeah, there's going to be -- 5 just coming up with a perfect solution probably isn't 6 possible, but getting there -- getting close, you know, 7 strikes me as being possible. 8 MS. ARMSTRONG: I think that's the question 9 here, Andrew. 10 MR. BROOKMAN: Dale? 11 MR. BASSO: Dale Basso. Just -- I know this 12 probably doesn't quite fit the rules you're trying to 13 get to, but let me ask if it's -- if it can be worked 14 out. In those situations where the modification is too 15 extensive or can't be done to test, what manufacturers 16 often do is the electrical design is what we're 17 concerned about, and so we often will build a motor of 18 that electrical design using standard construction 19 endshields as -- 20 MALE SPEAKER: General purpose. 21 MR. BASSO: General purpose. Okay. So but 22 the same electrical design so that, unfortunately, it's

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 115 1 not the one that you can pull off the shelf and test, 2 but if you pull it off the shelf and say, "Okay, we 3 want to test this, but we can't couple it. Supply me 4 the equivalent electrical design in a standard 5 enclosure," then we could supply that, and you could do 6 a comparison of is it really the same electrical design 7 by looking at the core and the rotor and say, "Is it 8 equivalent?" 9 We can provide performance data. We have 10 lots of options along those lines of building the 11 motor. Unfortunately, it's not your off-the-shelf 12 motor, but you could verify that it's the same 13 electrical characteristics based on the performance 14 data and the physical motor. 15 MS. ARMSTRONG: So I think, you know, perhaps 16 in your comments, consider, you know, obviously, if you 17 can test the shift, test the shift. If you can't 18 connect it to the dynamometer, then you would engage in 19 the manufacturer to obtain, you know, the endshields or 20 whatever, and then perhaps as a last resort, that could 21 be an option for consideration. 22 I can't tell you whether DOE would accept it

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 116 1 at this point, but it would be nice to see a 2 walkthrough of, okay, if you finally get to that 5 3 percent that Andrew was just talking about bucket where 4 you just cannot ever hook this thing up to a 5 dynamometer and test it, this is what you should do 6 instead. 7 MR. BROOKMAN: One of our webinar 8 participants has a comment or a question. Steve 9 Ruffing, you're on the line. 10 MR. RUFFING: Thank you. Steve Ruffing, 11 Nidec Motor Corporation. And I apologize. I had to 12 drop off the call for a moment because I had a 13 technical difficulty. I couldn't get my -- enable the 14 muting controls. So I may be repeating some things 15 that were discussed in the last few minutes. I 16 apologize if that's the case. 17 It appears to me there's three relevant 18 characteristics for the endshield, the first of these 19 three being the most essential, which is the dimensions 20 that allow the bearings to be accommodated and coupling 21 the dynamometer to occur. So those are an absolute 22 essential, and those were discussed significantly in

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 117 1 exchanges leading up to this. I don't have anything 2 more to add to that. 3 The second characteristic is any ventilation 4 openings that may or may not be present. And it was 5 discussed how can you ensure that any holes you put in 6 there are -- emulate what's happening in the actual 7 endshields for the motor? 8 I guess in that case, it seems the 9 manufacturer would have the best idea of that, and, 10 therefore, the manufacturer should be given the option 11 to provide the endshields if they can. If they 12 decline, then I would suggest that they not be required 13 to supply them, but the test facility could do that 14 instead. 15 And then the third characteristic, it was 16 discussed in the NOPR about the magnetic properties of 17 the endshield possibly affecting any current losses in 18 the motor. Someone else previously made the comment 19 that if the actual material in the motor is cast iron, 20 then it would be a -- it would place a significant 21 burden on the manufacturer to try to provide a cast22 iron replacement for that, and I agree, so I think any

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 118 1 requirement that the material be matches is 2 impractical, and any resulting differences and any 3 current losses that result from that will just have to 4 be, you know, accepted, and there's no way to really 5 work around that. 6 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Thank you. 7 John? 8 MR. MALINOWSKI: Just -- John Malinowski, 9 Baldor. Just another thought here, perhaps, is the 10 idea that the manufacturer would be made to test it in 11 his NVLAP-certified lab under the, you know, observed 12 by DOE or, you know, their party. 13 If we start looking at the scope of motors 14 that are covered, I don't think -- well, at least to my 15 knowledge, I don't think the test labs that you're 16 using have the capabilities of testing motors from 1 to 17 500 horsepower up through 8-pole sizes. So, you know, 18 we would have some challenges in that respect if you 19 chose to test a fairly large motor. 20 I think Advanced Energy -- I think these guys 21 are somewhere in the 250, 300 horsepower, 4-pole range, 22 so when you start getting motors larger than that, UL,

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 119 1 CSA, these guys don't have labs that are suited for 2 these large motors either. 3 And we brought this question up earlier when 4 you had that test about doing witness tests at our 5 facilities. It's done by our customers. They send 6 people in and watch us test motors for them. UL comes 7 in and watches us do tests of motors for different 8 standards and regulatory things, and CSA. 9 So, you know, perhaps that's another 10 alternative for consideration, particularly in those 11 motors that are really strange. We -- that would put a 12 little more of the burden back on the manufacturer, and 13 we've got all the test setups to do these. Some people 14 even have vertical dynamometers to test vertical 15 motors. So 16 MR. BROOKMAN: Frank? 17 MR. LADONNE: Frank Ladonne, Underwriters 18 Laboratories. Yeah, to John's point, I agree 19 completely. You know, nobody wants to ship a 500- 20 horsepower motor if they can avoid it. You know, there 21 are economic penalties to doing that. So we -- you 22 know, at UL, and I know Advanced Energy and others, we

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 120 1 do a lot of witness testing, and there's really nothing 2 wrong with that. It's a reasonable solution to a 3 problem. 4 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Thank you. 5 John? 6 MR. MALINOWSKI: I'm sorry. 7 MS. ARMSTRONG: I think -- just one more 8 thing. Hold on one sec. Sorry to interrupt you. I 9 think that it's not out of the question, and we've 10 stated this before, for the Department to go on-site to 11 a facility where it makes sense or where we need to 12 because there's not a third party. 13 What we're really talking about here, though, 14 is the procedure, how it's tested. So we are -- once 15 we get there, you know, that's fine, and where -- and 16 that's great that you have the facilities, but we're 17 trying to agree upon a process or a procedure on how 18 it's tested, regardless of where it is. 19 MR. MALINOWSKI: Yeah, I agree that's very 20 important to do. The other thing is the expectation -- 21 I don't know how many of you have ever been watching a 22 test of an IEEE 112 test, but the motor has to be

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 121 1 brought up to operating temperature before the 2 efficiency test can be done. 3 And on a small motor -- excuse me. On a 4 small motor, that may be two or three, four hours. But 5 when you start getting into larger machines, it may 6 take eight hours, and then it may take, you know, 7 several hours to do the actual test. So the whole test 8 may take 12, 14 hours to perform. So it's certainly 9 not something you bring into a building and throw it on 10 a dynamometer and 20 minutes later, you're done. 11 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Thank you. That was 12 John speaking last. Are we ready to move on now? I 13 think we are. Pamela. 14 MS. COSTELLO: So similar to custom 15 endplates, some manufacturers provide motors shafts 16 with a special diameter, length, or design because of a 17 customer's special application. At this point, DOE is 18 not aware of any motor shaft design that has prevented 19 DOE's test laboratory from performing a proper test, 20 according to IEEE 112 Test Method B. 21 DOE understands that a motor shaft 22 configuration has minimal, if any, impact on an overall

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 122 1 motor efficiency, so DOE is proposing to add the 2 following testing instructions. If a testing facility 3 cannot attach a motor to its dynamometer because of the 4 motor's shaft extension, that facility should use a 5 coupling or adapter to mount and test the motor. 6 DOE requests comments on its proposed 7 instructions for testing motors with non-standard shaft 8 dimensions. 9 MR. BROOKMAN: Roger Daugherty. 10 MR. DAUGHERTY: Roger Daugherty. I'd 11 actually had a comment -- I didn't know I was going to 12 generate so much discussion on -- comment on the 13 previous subject, but -- and it was pointed out that 14 maybe I was misinterpreting the language, but under 4.2 15 of Appendix B, when I saw language that said that the 16 endshield or flange shall be obtained through the 17 manufacturer, I interpreted that as a mandatory 18 requirement, not just something that might be done. It 19 was a shall. So I guess if I'm misinterpreting that 20 it's mandatory, I would surely like to know that. 21 MR. deLASKI: Well, the way I interpret that, 22 that's a mandatory on the Department, not on you,

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 123 1 right, either by request, right, or purchase, so it's a 2 mandatory on who's doing the test; right? 3 MS. ARMSTRONG: IT's -- 4 MR. deLASKI: So the question is who's doing 5 the test. 6 MR. BROOKMAN: So that was Andrew. Now back 7 to Ashley. 8 MS. ARMSTRONG: The key here is if it's 9 necessary. So if it's necessary, then we will. 10 Depends on the -- it depends on what kind of testing 11 we're in. 12 MR. BROOKMAN: Roger? 13 MR. DAUGHERTY: Roger Daugherty. I seem to 14 keep getting more and more confused, but it says "shall 15 be obtained through the manufacturer." What -- 16 MS. ARMSTRONG: That's correct. 17 MR. DAUGHERTY: To me, that means the 18 manufacturer is the one who is to provide it. 19 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. So some work needs to 20 be done there. Let's keep going. Pamela, you -- 21 question on the table -- did you read the comment box? 22 MS. COSTELLO: Yeah. We're now on Issue 13,

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 124 1 so any comments on non-standard shaft dimensions? 2 MR. BROOKMAN: Comments on non-standard shaft 3 dimensions? Okay. No comments? 4 MS. COSTELLO: Okay? 5 MR. BROOKMAN: Yes. 6 MS. COSTELLO: Okay. Moving on to vertical 7 electric motors, DOE does not feel definitions are 8 needed at this time for these motors, as there's no 9 industry confusion or ambiguity in whether an electric 10 motor is a vertical electric motor. However, DOE does 11 feel some testing clarification is necessary. 12 DOE is proposing to add the following testing 13 instructions. Electric motors, which are otherwise 14 designed to operate vertically, will be tested 15 horizontally. For solid-shaft motors, no further 16 adjustments are needed. However, for hollow-shaft 17 motors, DOE believes that an attached solid-shaft 18 extension is a feasible approach as long as the 19 attachment maintains sufficient clearance through the 20 drive end of the motor to enable the motor to be 21 attached to the dynamometer. 22 DOE does not anticipate that testing a

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 125 1 vertical hollow-shaft motor in a horizontal 2 configuration would add undue testing burden when 3 compared to testing a solid-shaft vertical motor. 4 DOE also notes that they're declining to use 5 Test Method E for vertical motors. As the primary 6 difference between Test Method E and Test Method B is a 7 different method to calculate stray load losses, DOE is 8 concerned that Test Method E could produce results that 9 are inconsistent or inaccurate relative to testing 10 comparable motors under Test Method B. 11 At this time, DOE seeks comment on its 12 proposed instructions for dealing with the various 13 construction differences between vertical and 14 horizontal motors. 15 MR. BROOKMAN: Rob. 16 MR. BOTELER: Yeah. I think if you go back 17 to the slide -- I think the one thing that I would 18 point out is where you say that it will be tested 19 horizontally. And John made the comment a minute ago 20 that some manufacturers do have vertical dynamometers, 21 so I think maybe it would be that they may be tested 22 horizontally and allow the use of the vertical

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 126 1 dynamometer, certainly, that they're typically used for 2 manufacturers that 3 MR. BROOKMAN: Gary Fernstrom. 4 MR. BOTELER: Well, we're going to do 5 bearings next. Okay? We're not touching bearings 6 here. 7 MR. FERNSTROM: Okay. Gary Fernstrom, the 8 California IOUs. Rob just alluded to the question I 9 had. If we're going to require these vertical motors to 10 be tested horizontally, the bearing load is different. 11 So it seems to me there's the potential that you would 12 get a non-realistic test result. 13 So it seems to me, at a minimum, there ought 14 to be an option for testing them vertically, and, in 15 fact, if they're going to be used vertically, if 16 there's a systemic difference in the performance, they 17 ought to be tested the way they're going to be used, or 18 vertically. 19 MR. BROOKMAN: John, you want to comment? 20 MR. MALINOWSKI: John Malinowski, Baldor. I 21 guess I'm probably speaking on behalf of NEMA members 22 in this case. We've talked about these vertical, high-

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 127 1 thrust motors before, regardless of whether they're 2 hollow-shaft or solid-shaft. The motors have bearings 3 in them that are designed for axial loading rather -- 4 and we're going to get into some of that later. Issue 5 17 gets into this. We'll talk about it later. 6 But, you know, a lot of these testing 7 configurations get into what is allowed today. Some of 8 these larger motors have oil bath cooling for the 9 bearings, and we'd be taking out the angular contact 10 bearings and replacing them with conventional ball 11 bearings. We'd be taking out some of the shaft seals 12 and testing the motor without those. So, you know, the 13 motor would be tested in a -- quite a different 14 configuration than what it would be used in in the 15 field. 16 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Yes, please, Ami? 17 MS. GRACE-TARDY: So the reason that we're 18 requiring the horizontal testing is, as you know by 19 statute, general purpose Subtype II are supposed to be 20 tested in a horizontal position, and we've carried that 21 through for this rulemaking as well. That's where 22 that's coming from.

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 128 1 MR. MALINOWSKI: These are -- 2 MS. GRACE-TARDY: I don't know if these are 3 Subtype II or where they would fall, but that's -- 4 MR. MALINOWSKI: Yeah. John Malinowski 5 again. If we think a little bit outside the scope of 6 what Subtype II is today and look at what the proposed 7 coverage would be under the coalition petition, it's 8 not limited to just low-thrust, P-Base motors. It 9 would be all motors, and where the low-thrust motors 10 predominately are grease-cooled, a lot of them having 11 the thrust bearings on the shaft and the bottom part of 12 the motor, some of the others would be an oil bath13 cooled bearing that would be in the top. 14 And that would be most common in the hollow15 shaft motors, which are not covered at all under the 16 scope. The reason we test them horizontally is because 17 there's very few companies that actually have a 18 vertical dynamometer suited to test these types of 19 motors vertically. 20 And when we start talking about vertical 21 motors and such, in the industry, a vertical motor 22 could be a conventional C-face motor without a base on

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 129 1 it. We might call that a vertical motor too. So we 2 need to be careful with some of our terminology when we 3 start talking about vertical motors. 4 MR. BROOKMAN: Emmanuel? 5 DR. AGAMLOH: Emmanuel Agamloh. I agree with 6 Rob to make provisions for horizontal testing, but 7 also, since we heard that some manufacturers have 8 vertical dynos, dynamometers, the use of M.E., it's 9 appropriate. But I think that in any case, testing them 10 in the horizontal position is consistent with the 11 previous, you know, vertical, solid-shaft motors that, 12 you know, have to be tested in horizontal position. I 13 don't see anything wrong with that. 14 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Thank you. 15 Final comments on this? Moving on. 16 MS. COSTELLO: Okay. DOE is aware that 17 further instructions may also be necessary for the 18 bearings on vertical motors. DOE proposes to add the 19 following testing instructions. For motor bearings 20 that can only operate vertically, and testing 21 horizontally would cause problems for the motor, a 22 testing laboratory should replace the thrust bearing

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 130 1 with a standard bearing, which shall be interpreted as 2 a 6000 series, open, single-row, deep groove, radial 3 ball bearing. 4 For any motor with bearings that are capable 5 of operating properly when the motor is tested 6 horizontally, the motor should be tested as-is. 7 DOE requests comment regarding its proposed 8 approach to testing electric motors with bearings 9 capable of horizontal orientation. DOE also requests 10 comment on its proposed approach to testing electric 11 motors with bearings not capable of horizontal 12 orientation. 13 MR. BROOKMAN: Rob? 14 MR. BOTELER: Rob Boteler with Nidec. NEMA 15 would agree with that. 16 MR. BROOKMAN: Thank you. 17 Additional comments? No additional -- yes, 18 Emmanuel? 19 DR. AGAMLOH: The language there with the 20 testing lab should replace the cross bearings with a 21 standard bearing. It is my opinion that some of the -- 22 you know, for some of the vertical or, I would say,

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 131 1 even a good number of the vertical, hollow-shaft motors 2 with even angular contact thrust bearings, you can 3 operate those motors within the horizontal position for 4 testing purposes. I'm not talking about, you know, you 5 know, actual use, which require the reliability, you 6 know, the impact that will have as a thrust load will 7 have on the longevity of these bearings. 8 For testing purposes, I think that you can 9 test some of these models with the bearings that they 10 are equipped with. And so the language should rather 11 be, you know, may or -- rather than should. 12 MR. BROOKMAN: Ashley? 13 MS. ARMSTRONG: So I'm just going to read a 14 little bit of the reg text, but I think that's -- you 15 hit the intent, right, that it's only if the unit under 16 test cannot be reoriented horizontally that we would 17 need to make modifications. So you would test it with 18 its regular bearings if it can be operated 19 horizontally, but if it can't, then you need to switch 20 something out. Okay? 21 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Okay. Additional -- 22 yes, Roger.

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 132 1 FEMALE SPEAKER: We all agree. 2 MALE SPEAKER: Maybe not. 3 FEMALE SPEAKER: He said NEMA agrees. 4 MR. DAUGHERTY: Roger Daugherty. I don't 5 think I commented on this one yet. No, I was just 6 looking through the reg language, and 4.7 certainly 7 deals with vertical motors where the bearings are 8 incapable of horizontal operation, and in the 9 discussion, of course, we're trying to cover those 10 where it is capable of horizontal operation. 11 I don't recall seeing the language in the reg 12 that provides the inference that a vertical motor, 13 where it can be successfully tested horizontally, shall 14 be tested horizontally. I -- 15 MS. ARMSTRONG: Well -- 16 MR. DAUGHERTY: I only see the one case. I 17 try to interpret the other case, but I don't know where 18 I find it. 19 MS. ARMSTRONG: Okay. I mean, it just says 20 "Vertical electric motors and electric motors with 21 thrust-bearing shall be tested in the horizontal 22 configuration," period. And then there's an -- but I

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 133 1 see what you're saying. 2 MR. BROOKMAN: Yeah. 3 MR. DAUGHERTY: Yeah, Roger Daugherty. 4 MS. ARMSTRONG: I get it. 5 MR. DAUGHERTY: That's not the title of the 6 subject. Okay. 7 MR. BROOKMAN: Specificity. Okay. We've got 8 it. That last comment was from Ashley, and then, 9 finally, Roger. Okay. Now we're moving on, yes. 10 MS. COSTELLO: Now, moving on to the topic of 11 sleeve bearings, on this topic, DOE has consulted test 12 labs, subject matter experts, and manufacturers and 13 tentatively determined that sleeve bearings do not 14 significantly degrade efficiency when compared to 15 spherical radial ball bearings. 16 DOE also does not believe it is any more 17 difficult to attach a motor with sleeve bearings to a 18 dynamometer than a standard general purpose motor 19 equipped with radial ball bearings. For this reason, 20 motors with sleeve bearings will be tested as-is. DOE 21 requests comments on its decision not to propose 22 additional test procedure clarifications for motors

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 134 1 with sleeve bearings or a definition for these motor 2 types. DOE also requests comment regarding the effect 3 of sleeve bearings on a motor's tested efficiency. 4 MS. ARMSTRONG: Everyone agrees. 5 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. No comments? 6 Rob, go ahead. 7 MR. BOTELER: Yeah, Rob Boteler with Nidec. 8 NEMA would agree with Item 20 and 21. 9 MR. BROOKMAN: Thank you. Always try to make 10 sure -- additional comments, if there are any? None. 11 Okay. 12 MS. COSTELLO: Okay. I'm going to pass off 13 to Brian Coffey now. Thank you. 14 MR. BROOKMAN: Thank you. 15 MR. COFFEY: This is Brian Coffey with 16 Navigant. I think we are getting to the end here, so 17 I'm going to go through motor definitions and testing 18 instructions. I think there are four of these. 19 First up is immersible electric motors. DOE 20 proposes to adopt the following definition. An 21 immersible means an electric motor primarily designed 22 to operate continuously in free air, but is capable of

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 135 1 withstanding complete immersion in liquid for a 2 continuous period of no less than 30 minutes. 3 DOE requests comment on its proposed 4 definition for immersible electric motor, especially 5 with regards to differentiating this motor type from 6 liquid-cooled electric and submersible electric motors. 7 We talked a little bit about this earlier. 8 MR. BROOKMAN: Emmanuel? 9 DR. AGAMLOH: Emmanuel Agamloh. The no less 10 than 30 minutes, it's good for testing purposes, for 11 the current definition, which is -- I'm not quite sure 12 if it is good for this particular definition because it 13 doesn't seem to impose, you know -- it looks like you 14 can put it in liquid indefinitely. And I think there 15 is some need for clarification here. 16 MR. BROOKMAN: There should be an upper 17 limit? 18 MALE SPEAKER: Could be in liquid -- 19 MR. BROOKMAN: Yeah? 20 MS. ARMSTRONG: Yeah. Why would it need to 21 be? 22 MR. deLASKI: This is a covered -- this is

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 136 1 Andrew. This is a covered motor, not an exempted 2 motor, so you wouldn't -- 3 MALE SPEAKER: Covered. 4 MR. deLASKI: Right? 5 MR. BROOKMAN: John Malinowski. 6 MR. MALINOWSKI: Yeah. John Malinowski, 7 Baldor. You know, these are motors that are designed to 8 run in a dry pit, and when a flood occurs, the motor, 9 you know, gets immersed in water, and it shuts down. 10 It may sit in that immersed condition for a couple 11 weeks before the flood recedes, and then it has to 12 operate afterwards. 13 So our product, you know, says 14 days on it, 14 is what we sort of talk about as far as its life in 15 immersion. You have moisture detectors. It shuts the 16 motor off when it senses water, so it does not operate 17 while immersed. It differentiates it from a 18 submersible motor. 19 MR. BROOKMAN: Can you -- 20 MR. MALINOWSKI: This is more like a -- you 21 would look at it and say it looks like a TEFC motor. 22 MR. BROOKMAN: Are there revisions -- would

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 137 1 you add or subtract words from this definition? 2 MR. BASSO: No less than 14 days? 3 MR. MALINOWSKI: I'm not sure the time of 4 immersion is even relevant. 5 MR. BASSO: John, the only caution is you've 6 got a submersible motor that's rated continuous -- 7 MR. MALINOWSKI: Right. 8 MR. BROOKMAN: Hey, Dale? 9 MR. BASSO: You don't want that -- 10 MR. BROOKMAN: Hey, Dale? Go to a microphone 11 and say that on the record. 12 MR. BASSO: Okay. Yeah. I guess a 13 distinction we do need to make is there is such a thing 14 as a submersible motor rated continuous in air, and 15 it's really there so that it can run in air or submerge 16 and back to air, where the immersible motor is kind of 17 a one- time submersion before it has to be rebuilt or 18 repaired. So it's able to be submersed for a shorter 19 period of time and not a continuous operation in the 20 immersed condition. 21 So I guess I'm not exactly sure, but I think 22 we need to add something to the definition to be able

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 138 1 to distinguish between the immersible and the 2 continuous in air submersible. I guess NEMA will add 3 to this and get back to you in comments. 4 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Okay. Thank you. 5 Thanks to NEMA for clarifying. Additional comments 6 here before we move on? 7 MR. COFFEY: Great. So more on immersible 8 motors -- this is with test instructions. DOE proposes 9 to adopt the following. Contact seals will not be 10 removed during testing, but DOE will allow for a run-in 11 period of a maximum of 10 hours prior to performing 12 IEEE Standard 112, Test Method B. 13 MR. BROOKMAN: John Malinowski. 14 MR. MALINOWSKI: I'll be the bad guy again. 15 John Malinowski. I guess I'm talking on behalf of NEMA 16 again. We had an ex parte meeting yesterday and passed 17 around some different types of seals. And there was a 18 seal -- a couple different types of seals that we saw. 19 What this could be is a ceramic seal with a spring on 20 it. That thing could run forever and never wear in. 21 The other type of seal would be a lip seal. 22 The sealing we use on our motor has back-to-back lip

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 139 1 seals with a grease labyrinth in the middle to keep 2 water from coming in, and ten hours isn't going to do 3 anything there. You're talking several hundred hours 4 before you would do anything. 5 And with it in a grease bath, it's really not 6 going to wear. So it's going to have a high amount of 7 friction on the sheaves and probably would never wear 8 enough. It's a case like any of the other motors that 9 we have that are covered, but we should be allowed to 10 remove seals for efficiency testing. 11 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Additional comments on 12 contact seals? 13 MR. BASSO: This is Dale Basso. I just would 14 be curious why this statement is put in there when 15 normally all the other type motors are allowed to 16 remove seals. Should we not just delete this from the 17 requirement? 18 MR. BROOKMAN: Ashley Armstrong. 19 MS. ARMSTRONG: This is our proposal. You 20 can certainly recommend. We did propose this 21 specifically, though. 22 MR. BASSO: Why?

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 140 1 MS. ARMSTRONG: I think you just explained 2 it, right, that if they never wear in, they have an 3 impact on the efficiency. So the question, then, 4 becomes should that additional loss because of the 5 seals that never weigh in, be reflected to the 6 purchaser? 7 MR. BROOKMAN: Dale. 8 MR. BASSO: This is Dale Basso. I think the 9 issue is that's true of all seals that might never wear 10 in, and the reason they were removed is because the 11 focus of this is the electrical design. It's a 12 relative issue of from the standard efficient design to 13 the NEMA premium design, you still make those same 14 steps for motors with or without seals, and you get 15 that relative improvement. 16 So it's -- we can make that comment back to 17 you again on this, but it really hasn't changed from 18 the rest of the motors. 19 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Andrew. 20 MR. deLASKI: And this is Andrew, and this 21 kind of goes to the Motor Coalition's basic 22 recommendation, which was that we have a level, Table

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 141 1 12?12, that applies to the vast majority of motors that 2 meet the basic definition of electric motor that we 3 talked about earlier today. So if you're going to have 4 a standard for seals, you'd have to figure out what 5 that standard was, right? And it would be different 6 than 12.12 because it has an efficiency impact. 7 So this kind of starts to break the basic 8 framework that we outlined in our petition. So to me, 9 it strikes me as -- and then to the point that Dale 10 made, that, you know, the user -- the NEMA nominal 11 efficiency is -- the motors are operated in the field 12 in conditions that depart from NEMA nominal efficiency. 13 So, you know, the fact that that motor has a 14 different performance in the field than what's on the 15 nameplate is true for almost every motor that's being 16 used in the field. So to me, that's not a 17 determinative factor that therefore I can't -- you 18 know, that the standards be different. So it's one 19 piece of information for the consumer. It's not the 20 determinative piece of information. 21 MR. BROOKMAN: John Malinowski. 22 MR. MALINOWSKI: Again, this is a comment on

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 142 1 shaft seals in general. It's common practice for IEC 2 motors to have a lip seal on pretty much anything. 3 Most of their motors are totally enclosed, fan-cooled. 4 They don't build open motors commonly in the sizes that 5 you talk about. And they have a lip seal on the shaft 6 end. 7 So, you know, our -- that would differentiate 8 them from NEMA frame motors, where we don't use a lip 9 seal as standard. We would perhaps use -- you saw the 10 V- ring slinger that is a non-contact seal, and a lot 11 of our motors use that labyrinth seal, that bronze seal 12 that is a non-contact device. 13 Neither of those has any frictional losses to 14 the motor. The only time we would use lip seals is 15 really in the presence of liquids and such that may be 16 in a motor design for sanitation, a wash-down style 17 motor used in the food industry, and even in some of 18 those, we're getting away from lip seals and going to 19 non- contact seals. 20 You know, it's a further differentiation 21 between NEMA motors and IEC motors. My experience with 22 our colleagues at ABB is that they test the motor

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 143 1 without the lip seal attached for efficiency, and then 2 those are attached at final assembly before shipment. 3 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Thank you. 4 Rob? 5 MR. BOTELER: So with John -- this is Rob 6 Boteler. With John's last comments, so in the, you 7 know, trying to stay with global harmonization, which, 8 you know, there's certain folks on the Hill that want 9 us to do that, we would recommend that we remove the 10 seals. 11 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Thank you. 12 MR. COFFEY: Okay. So that takes us through 13 immersible motors, and now we're on to brake motors. 14 For integral brake electric motors, DOE proposes to 15 adopt the following. Integral brake electric motor 16 means an electric motor containing a brake mechanism 17 either inside of the motor endshield or between the 18 motor fan and endshield. 19 DOE requests comment on that definition. 20 MR. BROOKMAN: Dale? 21 MR. BASSO: This is Dale Basso. I think -- 22 what you just said -- I'm not reading. So you said not

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 144 1 -- you said it includes it whether it's inside the 2 endshield or between the fan, and this says "but not 3 between the fan and motor endshield." 4 FEMALE SPEAKER: That's non-integral. 5 MR. BASSO: Oh, I'm looking at non-integral. 6 Never mind. 7 MR. BROOKMAN: Roger Daugherty. 8 MR. DAUGHERTY: Roger Daugherty. The 9 definition here is it's proposed -- particularly the 10 part that says that the brake mechanism may be inside 11 of the motor endshield. I don't know how much an issue 12 that gets to be as to what the phrase "inside of the 13 endshield" means, if that total brake mechanism somehow 14 must be actually part of -- within the endshield, you 15 take the endshield off, you removed all those parts. 16 Perhaps a more encompassing language is 17 somehow to refer that the brake parts may be within the 18 frame enclosure. So regardless of where they are 19 within the frame enclosure, then there's no issue 20 relative to the endshield. And then, of course, the 21 rest of the definition, that it could also be external 22 to the frame enclosure, but between the motor fan and

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 145 1 endshield. And just recognize that there's more than 2 one endshield in -- 3 MR. BROOKMAN: John, follow on? 4 MR. MALINOWSKI: Yeah. I -- John Malinowski, 5 Baldor. This is assuming that you're using a TEFC 6 motor, and you could clearly have an open motor or a 7 TENV motor. When we talked -- last week, we talked 8 about the idea of in an integral brake motor, that the 9 brake mechanism would be somehow embedded or as part of 10 one of the endplates of the motor. 11 I'm thinking of a design that we have that 12 has the brake external to the motor body, but the brake 13 coil itself is embedded as part of the casting of the 14 endplate. And then we have some versions of that that 15 are TENV and others that have a fan external to that 16 and a fan cover. 17 We've got another version that is a 18 conventional C-face on the tail end of the motor, and a 19 bolt-on brake external to the motor is used, but then 20 we have the C -- or the TEFC fan and such mounts to the 21 housing of the brake so it's sandwiched between the 22 brake and the motor. I mean, it's the same brake we

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 146 1 would use in a brake motor where it might be mounted to 2 the fan cover, but we mount it to the motor and 3 sandwich it between the TEFC fan and the motor body. 4 That motor could not be run separately 5 without the brake or the fan on it, so we consider that 6 an integral brake motor, even though it differs from 7 the idea of the break being an integral part of the 8 endplate. 9 MR. BROOKMAN: So we're looking for revisions 10 to the language, if we can get it here. 11 MR. MALINOWSKI: NEMA will have to clarify 12 this. 13 MR. BROOKMAN: Thank you. 14 Gary Fernstrom. 15 MR. FERNSTROM: Gary Fernstrom, California 16 IOUs. 17 A question for industry: does this class of 18 motor have a mechanical brake, or how are motors that 19 have an electrical braking mechanism accommodated in 20 terms of definition here? 21 MR. BROOKMAN: Dan, you want to give us -- 22 respond to that?

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 147 1 MR. DELANEY: Dan Delaney, Regal Beloit. So 2 what I gather from your question is the construction. 3 So most of these brakes, whether integral or non4 integral, are -- as John Malinowski pointed out, an 5 electromechanical brake. Essentially a coil, when 6 energized, releases the brake. When power's removed, 7 it energizes the brake. It's not a dynamic brake, 8 typically. It's a static brake. It's a holding brake. 9 MR. FERNSTROM: Thank you. 10 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. 11 MR. COFFEY: Okay, great. Moving on, test 12 instructions for integral brake electric motors. DOE 13 proposes the following. The brake mechanism will stay 14 attached during motor testing, but will be powered 15 externally while performing IEEE Standard 112, Test 16 Method B. DOE requests comments on that. 17 MR. BROOKMAN: No comments here? 18 Emmanuel. 19 DR. AGAMLOH: Emmanuel Agamloh. I think 20 that's a good approach. 21 MR. BROOKMAN: Thank you. 22 Roger?

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 148 1 MR. DAUGHERTY: Roger Daugherty, just to 2 point out that this may become a similar issue as I 3 believe Andrew referred to on the seals, that if these 4 brake components remain in place, then any friction and 5 windage loss associated with those components during 6 the testing may affect the efficiency. 7 And so whether or not, if you're proposing 8 efficiency standards with the brake parts in place, 9 that those standards may need to be different for 10 integral brake motors than for dissembled or electrical 11 design that does not have the brake components in it. 12 MR. BROOKMAN: Thank you. 13 Final comments on this? Moving on. 14 MR. COFFEY: Okay. Non-integral brake 15 motors. Definition lies to -- DOE proposes to adopt the 16 following. Non-integral brake motor -- non-integral 17 brake electric motor, excuse me, means an electric 18 motor containing a brake mechanism outside of the 19 endshield, but not between the motor fan and endshield. 20 DOE requests comment on that proposed 21 definition. 22 MR. BROOKMAN: Roger?

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 149 1 MR. DAUGHERTY: Roger Daugherty. In some of 2 the previous comments -- and, again, looking at this 3 idea of -- we're trying to define a lot of things with 4 respect to endshield, and perhaps at least the first 5 part of the definition that may be more appropriate, 6 that the brake mechanism is outside of the frame 7 enclosure. 8 So that sort of takes care of it not being 9 anywhere within the basic frame enclosure of the motor, 10 rather than just trying to refer to it as outside of an 11 endshield. 12 MR. BROOKMAN: Dan? 13 MR. DELANEY: Dan Delaney, Regal Beloit. And 14 just to add on to what Roger said, by reading this -- 15 and this is a question, if DOE can clarify -- I would 16 read that as if I have a sandwiched brake, a through17 hole brake that passes the motor shaft from the back 18 endshield, opposite drive end endshield, through the 19 brake, now I'm connecting my opposite end TEFC fan to 20 that. I read that as that would not be covered; is 21 that correct? 22 MS. ARMSTRONG: Why would it not be covered?

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 150 1 MR. DELANEY: But not between the motor fan 2 and endshield, but that would be located between the 3 motor fan and endshield. The description of the brake, 4 I mentioned. 5 MALE SPEAKER: (Inaudible). 6 MR. DELANEY: Okay. 7 MALE SPEAKER: (Inaudible) go back to the 8 same -- earlier definition. Yeah. Yeah. 9 MR. BROOKMAN: Here. 10 MALE SPEAKER: Outside -- 11 MR. BROOKMAN: Just right here, right? Yeah. 12 Ashley, use your microphone. 13 MALE SPEAKER: This is not an untypical 14 construction. I was not going to say typical, but that 15

-- 16 MR. BROOKMAN: Wait. Here, wait a second. 17 MS. ARMSTRONG: (Inaudible). 18 MALE SPEAKER: Let's call this the drive and 19 endshield. Okay? This is the opposite drive-end. 20 Then they have a shaft coming through. We have what's 21 called -- there's a C-face that comes on the back, but 22 through shaft brake. It looks like we have a fan.

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 151 1 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Dan's drawing a 2 picture. For those of you that are online, Dan -- 3 MALE SPEAKER: Tell us what you've got. 4 MR. DELANEY: So what I've drawn, just 5 essentially, is a motor. And on the opposite drive end 6 -- it's a TEFC motor. On the opposite drive end, we 7 have a standard, let's say, opposite drive end shaft 8 before our TEFC motor, which has a shift coming through 9 the opposite drive end endshield that goes through a 10 through hole brake and then -- so that's a -- passes 11 through -- there are brakes that actually have an 12 extended shaft to, so there are other methods of having 13 when the clutches engage an outboard shaft. 14 But there's also through-hole brakes as well, 15 and then a fan is just -- is on, either the motor shaft 16 or the shaft, of the outboard brake. The through-hole 17 brake is a style that is available. So the way I read 18 the definition -- I don't see the issue number here, 19 but anyway, the definition of this non-integral brake, 20 this construction would not be covered. And that was 21 the question, just for clarification. 22 MR. BROOKMAN: No, no, no, no.

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 152 1 MR. DELANEY: Yeah. Just to clarify, this 2 would be a third-party constructed brake, not -- I 3 understand whether it's by manufacturer or not, but 4 this brake here is typically a brake bought by a third5 party manufacturer of brakes. Got the same kind of 6 static holding brake. 7 MR. MALINOWSKI: The brake I've got like that 8

-- 9 MR. BROOKMAN: John Malinowski, get your 10 microphone on. 11 MR. MALINOWSKI: John Malinowski. The brake 12 design that we would have in that respect is the same 13 diameter as the motor body. So it would be a bigger 14 diameter, and the fan cover doesn't attach to the motor 15 body, it attaches to the brake. Okay? 16 So it's like that, and we've always treated 17 that as a non-covered product because I can't take the 18 brake off of that and run it as a TEFC motor alone, 19 whereas the one thing you've not covered under this 20 Issue Number 7 is you keep going back to fan and 21 endshield, and that ties you to a TEFC motor. If it's 22 TENV, I take the brake off, it's still a standard

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 153 1 motor, and it should be covered, or if it's an open 2 drip-proof motor and I take the brake off, it's still a 3 general purpose-style motor. 4 So the configuration that Dan is showing 5 there with the brake in between there, where we've 6 mounted the fan and such to the motor, you know, that's 7 not going to work as a general purpose motor if the 8 brake were removed. 9 You're -- in both cases, you're not 10 addressing TENV or open motors. You keep tying things 11 together with fans and endshields, and that's kind of a 12 error. 13 MR. DELANEY: So Dan Delaney from Regal. 14 Just to clarify again, I don't disagree with what 15 John's saying, that if you remove the assembly that's 16 back here, which hence then removes the shaft and the 17 fan cover, makes that not the intended construction 18 that could be tested, so understood. 19 The construction that's being shown here, the 20 brake could be removed, or it could be left there and 21 should not affect any performance, whether cooling or, 22 obviously, the intent of the operation of the motor, so

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 154 1 2 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Thank you. Yeah. Yes? 3 MS. ARMSTRONG: No, we're good. 4 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. 5 Dale. 6 MR. BASSO: This is Dale Basso. The drawing 7 that you put up there exactly fits the definition of 8 integral brake motor that was defined here. If you 9 look at -- if you reread it, the definition -- because 10 I misread the wrong one the first time, but the 11 integral brake motor covers exactly that construction 12 of the brake being between the fan and the bracket. 13 So it would be, then, the proposed test. 14 Currently that would be considered a non-covered 15 product. Assuming that it gets covered in the new 16 definition, then the test method would be separately 17 powering that brake, because if you did take that brake 18 off, it does affect the airflow over the motor, and it 19 does affect the cooling. 20 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Final comments? 21 John Malinowski. 22 MR. MALINOWSKI: I guess I'm just still

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 155 1 concerned that we need to go back and review the 2 definitions in both cases here so that we encompass 3 TENV motors and open drip-proof motors -- 4 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. 5 MR. MALINOWSKI: -- because neither would 6 have an external fan. 7 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Thank you. 8 MR. MALINOWSKI: NEMA will help you with some 9 comments there, I think. 10 MR. BROOKMAN: Thank you. The Department's 11 looking forward to receiving those. 12 MR. COFFEY: Okay, great. Now we're -- that 13 brings us to partial electric motors. We got into this 14 a little bit in the context of component sets, but for 15 this purpose, DOE is proposing the following 16 definition. Partial electric motor means an assembly of 17 motor components necessitating the addition of no more 18 than two endshields, including bearings, to create an 19 operable motor. For the purpose of this definition, 20 the term "operable motor" means performing in 21 accordance with the applicable nameplate ratings. 22 MR. COFFEY: So DOE requests comment on this

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 156 1 proposed definition. 2 MR. BROOKMAN: John? 3 MR. MALINOWSKI: John Malinowski. I think we 4 need to -- NEMA needs to help you define the difference 5 between partial electric motor and component set. This 6 two endshields business goes back to the comments we 7 had earlier, where if I've got to add two endshields, I 8 think in most of our minds, that would mean that this 9 is probably a component set. A component set could be 10 a stator and rotor, or it could include, in some cases, 11 a motor housing. 12 Partial electric motor, I think, in most of 13 our minds, has one endplate and bearing on one end, and 14 the other end is designed to fit up to a gearbox or a 15 compressor or a pump or some other device and may or 16 may not have a bearing on that end, but certainly does 17 not have an endshield. 18 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. 19 Alex? 20 MR. BOESENBERG: This is Alex Boesenberg with 21 NEMA. I have a question about integral brake motors 22 that I wanted to ask. I'll wait until they finish the

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 157 1 conversation on this slide. 2 MR. BROOKMAN: Yeah, I think we're done with 3 this slide, if you're ready. 4 MR. BOESENBERG: Yes, thank you. Regarding 5 Slide -- let me find it -- Slides 42 -- no, wait. 6 Well, regarding the DOE's position on integral brake 7 motors, on the Federal Register Notice, or the NOPR, 8 Page 38467, the DOE notes that the Motor Coalition 9 suggests to do the challenges of testing integral brake 10 motors, that they not be covered because of friction 11 and windage losses, differences in design, and what 12 could result in a wide variety of performance of those 13 products. 14 The DOE responds there in Column 3, in the 15 top half of the page: "Well, we tested two of them, and 16 we think it's okay." Could the DOE further outline 17 that position, why two is an appropriate sample size? 18 MR. COFFEY: That's DOE's beginning of an 19 attempt to explore the issue and wish to present the 20 data, which in this case showed that there wasn't an 21 appreciable difference, and, you know, that's what it's 22 putting out there for comment right now. Certainly one

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 158 1 could do more testing, but this is what's out for 2 comment. 3 MR. BROOKMAN: Final comments on this? 4 Ashley? 5 MS. ARMSTRONG: So I think it depends on 6 which table you're looking at because we tested them in 7 different configurations when we were trying to come up 8 with our proposed method. But if you go -- you can 9 look at the variety of different ones, but if you go to 10 Table 3-5, which is actually on the next page that Alex 11 -- that shows when we tested with the brake removed, 12 which is what you guys were advocating, versus with the 13 brake powered separately on the two integral and the 14 one not integral. 15 And you can see that our efficiency results 16 were what I would say comparable. Recognizing this is 17 a limited dataset, so we do welcome your data and 18 feedback at this time, but we did do some independent 19 testing there. 20 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Let's move on. 21 MR. COFFEY: Okay. So then that brings us to 22 the test instructions for partial electric motors. DOE

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 159 1 proposes the following instructions. Testing 2 laboratories will obtain an endplate from the 3 manufacturer of the motor and test with that endplate 4 in place. If bearings are also needed, then standard 5 bearings should be used, which should be interpreted as 6 a 6000 series, open, single-row, deep groove, radial 7 ball bearing. 8 DOE requests comment on its proposal for 9 testing these partial electric motors. 10 MR. BROOKMAN: Roger Daugherty. 11 MR. DAUGHERTY: Roger Daugherty. This 12 testing requirements also includes the mandatory 13 requirement that the manufacturer be supplying an 14 appropriate endshield for testing. Again, take the 15 case of a company that may be making an -- that's -- 16 let's say a integral gear motor and that you separate 17 the motors section from the gearbox so you now 18 essentially have a partial motor, and now you want to 19 put an endplate on it, but that manufacturer has no 20 experience of manufacturing any standard nameplate -- 21 or endshields for that product because his product is 22 not sold with standard endshields. So it puts an onus

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 160 1 on that manufacturer to come up with that standard 2 endshield. 3 The other that's not noted here in the 4 presentation, but is the first sentence in the proposed 5 language of the test procedure, that the partial 6 electric motor shall be disconnected from their mated 7 piece of equipment. 8 This sort of precludes any investigation 9 where you may just obtain the partial motor itself, 10 that there's a likelihood that someone may -- is 11 shipping around just partial motors. And so what you 12 may come across and want to investigate is a partial 13 motor, so it won't actually be mated to anything when 14 you obtain it. 15 MR. BROOKMAN: John? 16 MR. MALINOWSKI: One of the other things that 17 we might correct in these is when we're saying we're 18 adding a 6000 series open, single-row, deep groove, 19 radial ball bearing. We probably don't want to use an 20 open ball bearing because that won't keep the grease 21 in. You probably want a shielded bearing in both cases 22 where we talk about this.

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 161 1 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. 2 MR. MALINOWSKI: And, obviously, an open 3 bearing, when you would get it, does not have any 4 grease in it. So that would be a particular problem. 5 MR. BROOKMAN: Emmanuel. 6 DR. AGAMLOH: Emmanuel Agamloh. Yeah, I had 7 a similar concern with that; not only that, but also if 8 you specify open bearings, then the -- maybe the lab or 9 whoever is going to test it has to grease it, and 10 there's a possibility of over-greasing, which may, you 11 know, excessively increase their losses. So I think 12 sealed or shielded bearings should be appropriate for 13 this. 14 MR. BROOKMAN: Thank you. 15 MALE SPEAKER: (Inaudible) shielded. 16 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Shielded. Okay. So 17 moving on. 18 MR. COFFEY: Okay. Moving on. And this 19 takes us to motors requiring general clarification. 20 It's our last section, and there's only one of these, 21 so let's get through it. These are electric motors 22 with non-standard bases, feet or mounting

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 162 1 configurations. DOE believes that non-standard 2 mounting feet present no additional testing issues that 3 require clarification. Test labs can adjust the test 4 benches as applicable for the unit being tested to 5 accommodate those feet. 6 And DOE's position is that feet, base and 7 configuration do not affect the tested efficiency 8 friction, windage losses, or any rotating elements of 9 the motor and instead the feet base and configuration 10 affect only how a motor is physically installed in a 11 piece of equivalent. 12 So DOE seeks comment on its instruction for 13 testing these motors with non-standard bases, feet, and 14 mounting configurations and also on any other testing 15 difficulties that may arise from testing electric 16 motors with non-standard base feet or mounting 17 configurations. 18 MR. BROOKMAN: Comments? Any comments on 19 non- standard bases, feet, and mounting configurations? 20 No comments? Okay. 21 MR. COFFEY: So we heard a lot of good 22 comments today. Of course, we'll want to receive these

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 163 1 in writing. The options are either by email, post, or 2 if it's urgent or you have a flair for the dramatic, 3 courier. Comment period runs until September 9th of 4 this year at 11:59, at which point it will turn into a 5 pumpkin. 6 Okay. So closing remarks and questions, and 7 that's all we had. 8 MR. BROOKMAN: Yes. Roger Daugherty first. 9 MR. DAUGHERTY: Roger Daugherty. So today 10 we've gone through quite a few definitions. I can make 11 the observation that most of these terms that are being 12 defined are partially maybe attributable to the 13 coalition petition that was submitted. And that 14 petition was based upon having observed, from the 15 policy statement that DOE issued in 1997, what it 16 identified as definite purpose and special purpose 17 motors and were therefore exempted up to this date that 18 we are now considering to include. 19 In this new paragraph in this note in 20 Appendix B, a reference is made to those definite 21 purpose and special purpose motors for which DOE has 22 provided definitions. If I look at the definitions as

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 164 1 we just went through them today, I would not be aware 2 that a TENV motor, as it's defined, is either definite 3 purpose or a special purpose motor. The policy 4 statement has been removed. Appendix A to Subpart B is 5 being removed from the code. So I have no point of 6 reference to make the interpretations as to the actual 7 intent of these definitions and how they apply. 8 And so I think we need some -- what I'd like 9 to see is that that policy statement be re-put back in 10 to the code with appropriate modifications as necessary 11 to identify these types of motors, electric motors for 12 which you've now provided definitions, but you provide 13 them as being definite purpose or special purpose 14 machines. 15 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Thank you. As was 16 promised at the outset, an opportunity for anybody that 17 wants to to make closing remarks, especially any issues 18 that you think were not covered sufficiently. Bill? 19 MR. FINLEY: Yeah. Bill Finley. I'd like to 20 make one comment, going back on the bearings -- this is 21 not a closing remarks, but basically on the bearing 22 itself, when you talk about shielded versus open

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 165 1 bearings, I just want people to be aware that if you go 2 shielded, it's very possible it'll take weeks or months 3 to break in so the losses are down to what you normally 4 see in operations, so you have to be concerned about 5 that, where typically we use an open bearing, but if 6 you use a shielded bearing, you're going to have to 7 make sure you run it in long enough that the losses 8 drop down to a normal level. 9 MR. BROOKMAN: I thought the original 10 language was open. 11 MR. FINLEY: It is normal, but we brought a 12 shield that popped in here for just a second. 13 MR. BROOKMAN: I see. John, use the 14 microphone. 15 MR. MALINOWSKI: Sorry. John Malinowski. 16 The comment was to change open to something else 17 because one of these simple fabricated endplates is not 18 going to have any grease retention capability, unless 19 that gets designed in, and that may be difficult to do 20 on an ad hoc kind of an endplate. 21 You know, if we can give you an endplate that 22 has a grease retainer in it, a bearing cap on it

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 166 1 that'll hold the grease in place, you know, that would 2 certainly be the best thing to use with an open 3 bearing. But if we cannot, you know, there's not going 4 to be a way of keeping grease in the bearing long 5 enough to run a test. 6 MR. BROOKMAN: Bill? 7 MR. FINLEY: Yeah. Bill Finley. And I agree 8 with that comment. There is conditions where you may 9 need to use a shielded bearing, but you have to beware. 10 The run-in time is quite extensive. And so, 11 preferably, the open bearing would be the better 12 solution, except for where you have circumstances where 13 you can't retain the grease, and then we'd have to work 14 this out, but then some additional, longer testing 15 would be required. 16 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Okay. Closing remarks? 17 Yes, Dan? 18 MR. DELANEY: Dan Delaney, Regal. Just a few 19 comments. I wanted to add kind of a collection of some 20 things we were talking about. First item, we talked 21 about IEC Design N and some of its criteria. Some of 22 the activities that Bill Finley represents, that's on

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 167 1 the IEC Committee, is some development similar to IEC - 2 - or, I'm sorry, our NEMA Design A limits, where you 3 have locked- rotor currents that can exceed. Maybe 4 you'd meet the same locked-rotor torque levels, but you 5 have a much higher inrush of locked-rotor current 6 level. 7 In that case, technically, I guess, that 8 would fall out of the scope of any of our requirements. 9 Maybe we want to have that addressed somehow in some of 10 the scope and the Design N. If it falls outside of 11 that, it would be a very easy way for a loophole, let's 12 say, for that to fall out in a Design N. 13 Second note I wanted to add, as I mentioned 14 earlier, on behalf of NEMA, we do feel that it is 15 relevant to add an alternate test plan per the IEC, 16 their IEC 60034-2-1. Industry accepts this as an 17 equivalent test method. There are very slight 18 differences in the test method, but it has been 19 industry accepted, and I think that would go a long way 20 in adding the IEC design letters to that, adding that 21 as yet a third equivalent test method. 22 And then, lastly, some of the definitions, as

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 168 1 Roger pointed out, are very good, very good steps in 2 the right direction to try to improve these. One thing 3 that we also see as some of the challenges and 4 definitions, stepping back into the small electric 5 motor rule, it would be very helpful for us to either 6 extend some of those definitions there or to revisit 7 some of the definition aspects of that, either through 8 a test procedure rule or other method as well through 9 small electric motor. We certainly would like to 10 engage with that as well. Thank you. 11 MR. BROOKMAN: Okay. Thank you. Other 12 comments here as we move towards closure? Okay. 13 Nothing additional. So then let me turn it back to 14 Ashley Armstrong for closing remarks. And for my part, 15 I'll thank all of you. We've covered a lot of ground 16 here very efficiently and some rather complicated 17 stuff, so thanks to all of you. The disclosure, the 18 level of direct communication was excellent. Thank 19 you. 20 MS. ARMSTRONG: Well, I'm just going to thank 21 everyone for coming. Have safe travels home, for those 22 going far away and near. And we look forward to

### Capital Reporting Company Motors Test Procedures Public Meeting 07-16-2013

(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 169 1 getting your comments. 2 MR. BROOKMAN: Thank you. 3 (Whereupon, at 12:40 p.m., the Motors Test 4 Procedures Notice of Proposed Rulemaking 5 Public Meeting was concluded.) 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22

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(866) 448 - DEPO www.CapitalReportingCompany.com © 2013 154:18 air-over28:7 66:2,7,10,14,17, 18 67:1,13,16,18 68:4 69:17,21,22 70:3,7,17 71:17,18 72:3,8,14 73:1,13 75:17 79:4,11 air-over-electric 27:18 28:12 30:19 air-over-motor 28:20 airstream67:19 72:3 Al4:3 9:22 Alex2:11 9:15 73:16,17 156:19,20 158:10 alignment34:19 allow 26:14 94:22 113:7 116:20 125:22 138:10 allowed 43:13 89:3,4 127:7 139:9,15 allows 22:4 alluded 126:8 alone 67:1 152:18 already11:8 12:7,13 39:22 83:21 alternate 50:15 167:15 alternating 15:5 alternative 119:10 altogether49:22 aluminum 101:7 102:3 am5:2,5 61:11 170:7 171:5,6 ambiguity47:19 48:12 124:9 amend49:19 amended 52:13 amendments 40:20 43:3 46:12 51:9 53:22 56:9 58:3,6 61:1,4 65:18 Americas 2:16 7:4 Ami3:3 8:20 127:16 amount67:8 139:6 analyzing 60:8 Anderson 2:8 9:10 Andrew 2:21 69:1,2 71:5 78:10 80:19 97:8 98:20 114:9 116:3 123:6 136:1 140:19,20 148:3 angular 127:9 131:2 ANSI 91:6 answer 16:8 73:18 anticipate 10:16 124:22 anybody 10:18 164:16 anyone 10:9 13:8 anything 15:17 26:15 33:8 35:12 73:10 76:14 79:1 91:5 109:1 117:1 129:13 139:3,4 142:2 160:13 anyway 151:19 anywhere149:9 apart52:19 apologize 82:8 106:10 116:11,16 apparatus 33:22 apparent46:8 51:8 appear 24:15 35:11 appeared 86:2,3 appears 116:17 Appendix 19:15,18 20:1 87:17 122:15 163:20 164:4 Appliance2:21 8:18 69:2 applicability 14:18 16:12 27:12 applicable 14:22 15:19 19:18 24:22 62:7 99:2 155:21 162:4 application 63:11 74:10,14 75:13 121:17 applications 20:5 41:16 42:15 62:12,13 applied 17:5,22 18:18 33:2 39:11 72:22 91:4 applies 14:20

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