## ORIGINAl

IN THE MATTER OF LIBERTY FOUNDATION, INC.

DFMS NO. FAA-2012-0477

TELEPHONIC CONFERENCE 

# - ..

BEFORE THE HONORABLE J.E. SULLIVAN

HISTORIC JORDAN SPRINGS 1160 JORDAN SPRINGS ROAD

c 

### STEPHENSON, VA 22656

SEPTEMBER 20, 2012 11:00 a.m.



# RECEIVED SEP2 52012 

## HEARINGDOCKET

800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313,.,.(tINTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page2 1 APPEARANCES: 2 HONORABLE J. E. SULLIVAN 3 U.S. DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION 4 OFFICE OF HEARINGS, M-20 5 1200 NEW JERSEY AVENUE, S.E. (Ell-310)

### ~·· 6 WASHINGTON, DC 20590 7 PHONE: 202.366.2132 8 9 ON BEHALF OF THE RESPONDENT: 10 STUART A. GOLDSTEIN, P.A. 11 9350 SOUTH DIXIE HIGHWAY, lOTH FLOOR 12 MIAMI, FL 33156 13 PHONE: 305.670.1222 14 15 ON BEHALF OF THE COMPLAINANT: 16 ADRIANNE WOJCIK, ESQUIRE 17 OFFICE OF THE REGIONAL COUNSEL 18 GREAT LAKES REGION, AGL-7 19 FEDERAL AVIATION ADMINISTRATION 20 2300 EAST DEVON AVENUE 21 DES PLAINES, IL 60018-4696 2 2 PHONE: 84 7 . 2 9 4 .7109 23 24 ALSO PRESENT: 25 CODY L. SMITH, OBSERVER

The Reporters Group ccoountuy

# RT~EPORTERS Court Reporting,Video Stephenson.VA 1.4**~** •Inc. &UtigatlonTechnology www.reporter!;!QCQ!!J!.com Videography LitigationTechnology )NWW.advl§g!lltech.com Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CQuntyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20,2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page3 1 TELEPHONIC CONFERENCE CALL 2 

### SEPTEMBER 20, 2012 3 THE COURT: 

### We are on the record in the matter 4 of Liberty Foundation. This is Docket number FAA-2012- 5 0477. Today is Thursday, September 20, 2012 and the 6 parties have convened for a litigation scheduling 7 conference. The FAA is represented by its attorney, 8 Adrianne Wojcik. The Respondent, Liberty Foundation is 9 represented by it's attorney, Stuart A. Goldstein. 10 Also present at the office of Hearings is Cody L. 11 Smith, an Attorney with this office who is sitting in 12 an observer today. 13 Good Morning Counsel. 14 MR. GOLDSTEIN: 

### Good morning Judge. 15 MS. WOJCIK: 

### Good Morning. 16 THE COURT: 

### Let's talk a little bit about 17 just the procedural matter, then we can talk a little 18 bit about venue. As you know, I filed a order setting 19 this rule 16 litigation scheduling conference on July 20 9, 2012. And since then I've received a variety of 21 different documents, and I"ll try and identify them 22 very quickly so that we're all on the same page and to 23 make sure that it's a document that's been filed that I 24 have gotten it. So, on July 13th 2012 the respondent 25 filed, the respondent's suggestion of hearing location

The Reporters Group Stephenson,VA**~roup.com** County

## ~ 

## COURT:

. EPORTERS .•nc. Videography

# ~ltigationTechnology Court Reporting,Video &LitigationTechnologll www.advlliQaltech.com Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160Jordan**Sp~ngs**Road t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.eountyCourtReporters.com .·. 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTY FOUNDATION September20,2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page4 

### 1 on July 17th, 2012 the FAA filed the administrators 2 response to respondent's suggestion of hearing 3 location. 4 On July 24, 2012 the respondent filed it's 5 answer an affirmative to defense's complaint, which was 6 served on June 21, 2012. On July 25, 2012 the 7 respondent filed the respondent's reply to the 8 administrator's response to respondent's suggestion of 9 hearing location. 10 And then on August 28, 2012, the respondent 11 filed it's response to the FAA's request to admit 12 genuineness on certain documents. I'll simply note 13 that the FAA chose not to file the initial request with 14 this office. That was certainly fine, it is not 15 required to file discovery materials with this office, 16 unless there is a motion involving certain discovery 17 disputes. And then, lastly on September 4th, 2012 the 18 parties filed their joint proposed scheduling discovery 19 plan. 20 Ms. Wojcik, was there anything that I missed 21 in terms of that list of filing since July 9th, 2012? 22 MS. WOJCIK: 

### No, your honor. That's all I 23 have as well. 24 THE COURT: 

### Okay, and Mr. Goldstein, anything 25 that I might have missed for your client?

The Reporters Group Stephenson.VA wwwnportersgroup.com. County

## ~ 

## COURT: EPQRTERS,Inc. Videography U!itlgationTechnology Court Reporting,Video & LitigationTechnology www.actylegaltecb.com Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHEMATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page5 

### 1 MR. GOLDSTEIN: 

### I don't think so, your Honor. 2 THE COURT: 

### Okay, thank you both very much. 3 Let's talk then about the proposed discovery 4 schedule and the trial date recommendations to this 5 court. Thank you very much for filing that material. 6 I have looked at it and I have tried to incorporate it 7 into a little bit of an expanded discovery set-up, so 8 that we have initial discovery, general discovery, a 9 supplemental discovery phases all identified. And I've 10 also expanded a little bit on the pretrial motion 11 suggestions that you gave me, because typically what I 12 like to do, is set up a dispositive motion schedule, so 13 that if anybody wants to file for partial or full 14 summary judgement or those types of things to narrow 15 the issues for the actual trial, they can do so. And 16 in those kinds of motions, I like to set up an oral 17 argument. Just in the event that I get material that I 18 have questions, we already have it set within the 19 discovery schedule process, so that it doesn't disrupt 20 the actual time-line that the parties had been working 21 on. 22 So, with that in mind, I"m going to suggest 23 some things that track your schedule and see if it 24 would work for you. So I have on your proposed 25 schedule, a December 18th, 2012 date for exchanging

The Reporters Group

# ~OuntUy**R~EPORTE.** S '- 1..4**~** · 

# R CourtREporting. VidEO

### :::;,~~~~roup.com. Videography litigationTechnology 'Inc. &LitigationTechnology www.advlegaltecb.com Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page6 

### 1 expert witness summaries and reports. But I also have, 2 and I'll start with page one, excuse me, I was on page 3 three. I have an initial discovery request that should 4 be answered by September 21, 2012. That's tomorrow. 5 Counsel starting with you, Ms. Wojcik, is that still an 6 acceptable deadline for you? 7 MS. WOJCIK: 

### I believe so. I was planning, 8 Mr. Goldstein and I exchanged our discovery requests 9 awhile ago, and we have been working on them. And as 10 far as the FAA is concerned, I am planning to send them 11 responses to this initial discovery today, so that Mr. 12 Goldstein has it tomorrow. That's how things look on 13 my end. 14 THE COURT: 

### Okay, Mr. Goldstein, what about 15 you? 16 MR. GOLDSTEIN: 

### I'm just waiting on some final 17 information, your Honor. But I think I'll get my 18 responses out tomorrow. 19 THE COURT: 

### Why don't I do this, I always 20 like to err on the side of caution. I'm happy to adopt 21 the September 21, 2012 date for the initial discovery 22 request deadline. It sounds like you have already done 23 a lot of that, but I'm going to err on the side of 24 caution and give you till tomorrow for the request. 25 And then I'll shorten up the time for response, and put

The ReportersGroup Stephenson.VA www.reportersgr.rum,com. County

## ~ 

## CQUR"J: ·EPQRTERS.Inc. Videography

# ~itigationTechnology Court Reporting.Video &LitigationTechnology**~vlegaltecb.com** Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTY FOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page7 1 that down for next Friday September 28th, 2012. So, 2 instead of having everything done tomorrow, I'm giving 3 you an extra week to do it, just in case something 4 comes up that you haven't anticipated. So that would 5 mean, that on or before September 28th, 2012 you all 6 would need to respond and provide, serve, file

... I 7 shouldn't say file, because I don't need to see them, 8 but serve with each other with any and all initial 9 discovery material. 10 MR. GOLDSTEIN: You mean responses, Judge? 11 You mean responses to the discovery that is out there? 12 THE COURT: Correct. Let me try this- again, 13 I'm sorry I wasn't clear. Tomorrow, Friday September 14 21, 2012, is the deadline for the last day for the 15 parties to request initial discovery. Next week on 16 Friday September 28, 2012, is the deadline for the 17 parties to respond to the initial discovery request. 18 Which means, that all your initial discovery should be 19 finished by next Friday the 28th, 2012. Then, we would 20 start with the general discovery exchange deadline. 21 So, I would propose to you that October 12, 2012 be the 22 last date for you to exchange or serve all additional 23 general discovery requests. And that would include, 24 but would not be limited to your request for 25 interrogatory, requests for production, and so forth.

County

## ~**~~=p~=~::~r~AGroup** 

## COURT.**~EPQRTERS,** Inc. www;reportersgroup.Q:!ffi Videography litigationTechnology Court Reporting.Video &litigationTechnology www.adylegaltech.com Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.countyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page8 

### 1 And then you can begin exchanging your responses to 2 those general discovery requests up and through 3 November 30th. Which gives you about six weeks to do 4 that, and then in December, December 21st for example, 5 we can then go into the supplemental discovery stage, 6 so that if there is any further supplemental discovery 7 based on the general discovery, you can get that done 8 between say, Mid December, 2012 through January 25th, 9 2013. Which coincides with your discovery date on page 10 2 of your proposed discovery plan. Does that make 11 sense? 12 MS. WOJCIK: 

### It does to me your honor. 13 THE COURT: 

### Okay, then starting with you then 14 Ms. Wojcik, do you know what I'm talking about in terms 15 of the initial discovery, the general discovery, and 16 the supplemental discovery? Have you worked in this 17 way before? 18 MS. WOJCIK: 

### I haven't specifically, I think I 19 have a rudimentary understanding of what you mean, your 20 honor. But if you would be so kind as to elaborate on 21 this, that would be much appreciated. Just so that we 22 are on the same page. 23 THE COURT: 

### Do you have your rule book with 24 you, so that we can follow along together? 25 MS. WOJCIK: 

### I do, however please give me a

The Reporters Group ccoountuy

# R,.~EPORTERS Court Reporting,Video Stephenson,VA 1.4**~** •Inc. &litigationTechnology www.reportersgrmm.com. Videography LitigationTechnology www.advi§Qaltech.com Corporate: Historic:JordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t. Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHEMATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page9 1 moment just to locate it. Yes, your Honor. 2 THE COURT: Mr. Goldstein, do you have a copy 3 of your court rule book with your as well? 4 MR. GOLDSTEIN: I have the rules of practice 5 and civil penalty hearings, is that what your Honor's 6 referring to? 7 THE COURT: No, I'm talking about the federal, 8 civil rules of

... 9 MR. GOLDSTEIN: Let me put the phone down one 10 second and I'll get it. 11 MS. WOJCIK: I'll need a moment, your Honor 12 too

... I thought we were talking about the rules of

... 13 I'm sorry, the rules of civil procedure you mean? 14 THE COURT: Yes, because I use them in 15 conjunction with the statutory rule. 16 MS. WOJCIK: Your honor, can I also take a 17 five minute break, please to locate them? 18 THE COURT: Why don't you not do that, and you 19 can look at the book later. In the future, if you 20 appear before me, it's always helpful to have your rule 21 book with you, if your asking me to explain things. 22 MS. WOJCIK: Absolutely. 23 THE COURT: Yes, I'll route you to the rule 24 book right away. 25 Mr. Goldstein, are you with us?

'TheReportersGroup ccoountuy

# Rti:ep

s lA**~** 

# ORTERS CourtReporting,Video

## :;o~~~~royp.cgm Videography litigationTechnology 'Inc. &litigationTechnology G www.advkgaftech.com

orporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777

.**www.countyCou~Reporters.com** 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page 10 1 MR. GOLDSTEIN: 

### I am your Honor, I put in on 2 speaker phone. If the Court Reporter can't hear me, 3 I"ll pick up the handset again. 4 THE COURT: 

### Okay. What I'll recommend that 5 you both do, is take a look at CR-26. And it 6 identifies specifically, under 26(a} (1) what initial 7 disclosure covers. It also identifies the disclosure, 8 the first disclosure of expert witnesses and the sights 9 of written reports that experts are required to provide 10 throughout the discovery process. And the time to 11 disclose, generally disclose expert testimony or 12 process. And then under rule 26-B as in boy, it then 13 talks about general discovery, so that you can read 14 that and kind of get a feel for the difference between 15 those, initial disclosure that kind of give a very 16 broad scope of information to the opposing sides, 17 verses general discovery which starts to get into the 18 more meat and potatoes of discovery practice. Which 19 would involve, request for production, interrogatory, 20 request for admission, setting up depositions, those 21 kind of things. Where you are getting into the more 22 detailed specific requests ,for information that are 23 specific to the disputes that the parties are trying to 24 resolve. 25 And then within the

... let me see if I can



### - TheREporle"'G<OUP 

## COURT.

# ~EPQRTERS Cou"

# -g.

Vld<a

## ::.::;~~~~roYJ),gm} Videography

## ~itigationTechnology 'Inc. &

## ==:~;g";~~~~~: Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page 11 1 find the last part of

... Supplemental discovery is 2 basically is not as clearly identified in CR-26, but I 3 think most people who practice litigation are aware 4 that supplemental discovery is triggered by questions 5 that arise once your initial and general discovery are 6 complete. For example, if you have a witness that 7 suddenly pops up for the first time in your general 8 discovery exchange, and you haven't had a chance to 9 address that. You'll have a chance to clean up the 10 plate, so to speak, in the supplemental discovery stage 11 for those kinds of little loose ends that haven't 12 gotten taken care of that came as a surprise to you. 13 So, Ms. Wojcik, starting with you, does that 14 help at all? 15 MS. WOJCIK: It does, thank you so much.' And 16 I will certainly look up the rule in detail, right 17 after the conference. 18 THE COURT: Okay. And you can utilize and I 19 do all the time. I utilize the civil rules in 20 conjunction with the code of federal regulation. So, 21 you'll see the litigation order that I sent to you 22 twice, to CR-26, CR-36, 14 CFR Section 13-220 and so 23 forth. So, I'll always be giving you authority that 24 you can use as guidance, if we don't talk about it 25 specifically at the conference.

The ReportersGroup CcoOuntUy

# R~EPORTERS CourtReporting.Video Stephenson. VA l..t**~.** ,Jnc.**~portersqrpup.com** Vidt:ography litigationTEchnology &litigationTechnology Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t ll60J d WWW.adv/maltECb.com 800.262.8777 011 anSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313

# ______________

# .........

INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20,2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page 12 

### 1 MS. WOJCIK: 

### That sounds good, thank you. 2 THE COURT: 

### So, getting back

.. Mr. Goldstein, 3 you have appeared before me before, do you have any 4 questions about that so far? 5 MR. GOLDSTEIN: 

### No, I don't your Honor. I 6 

### didn't know we were going to be 

## .. it's fine, I do a 7 

### fairly good at federal litigation, it's fine. I just 8 

### didn't know we were going to be bound to the federal 9 

### rules of civil procedure and I don't know that we are. 10 So at some point, I'd like to ask you that question. 11 Or if we are, which portions of the federal civil 12 procedure we're going to be bound by. 13 I thought we were going to be bound by, and 14 again I have no problem with the federal rules of civil 15 procedure, but I was using the rules to practice in 16 civil penalty hearings as a guide. So, if there might 17 be a conflict between the two, I guess we can call you 18 and try and resolve it, if we cant. 19 THE COURT: 

### Okay. I think what you will find 20 is that the federal rule, the code of federal 21 regulations tracks, very closely the discovery process 22 in the civil rules of procedure. Particularly, under 23 section 13.220. So, I utilize the court rules in 24 conjunction with the code of federal regulations, so 25 that people have specific guidelines to look at. It

The ReportersGroup ccoountuy

# RT~EPORTERS CourtReporting,Video Stephenson,VA I'**~** · •Inc. &litigationTechnology www.reoorter3Qr_gyp,g>_m Vldeography litigationTechnology www.advlegalteCh.com Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www;CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313

# .......______________ INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page 13 

### 1 actually, in my opinion, is quite helpful to everybody. 2 Particularly when there is a hole in the code of 3 federal regulations and people don't know what to do. 4 MR. GOLDSTEIN: 

### And I think we have, in our 5 initial discovery request to each other, I think we've 6 kind of sought out this information that's in 26(a) (1). 7 THE COURT: 

### That's right. And most people do 8 that, just because of litigation practice in general. 9 But for folks who are looking for guidance, I try and 10 provide that to them. Let me see if I can find, I also 11 think it would be helpful to you. I may not be able to 12 find it right now, but if I see something, I'll add it 13 into a litigation order, so that you can view 14 additional authority for that. 15 In any event Mr. Goldstein, staying with you, 16 do you have any trouble or any problem with having the 17 initial discovery, general discovery, and supplemental 18 discovery phases, specifically identified in the 19 litigation process? 20 MR. GOLDSTEIN: 

### Not at all your Honor. 21 THE COURT: 

### Then let's talk about the date, so 22 I have September 21, 2012 for the last date for the 23 parties to serve each other with initial discovery 24 requests. And it sounds like that is going to be easy, 25 since you have already done it. I have September 28th,

TheReportersGroup

# ~OuntUy**R~·** St h v, '-**I.4~.EPORTERS** CourtReporting.Video

## ~=:~r::roug..gmz Videography litigationTechnology 'Inc. 

# u Litigation

### Technology Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t l1GOJod S . www.adv/Ega/tErh.com soo.262.s7 77

### '~~

### an 

### prmgsRoadt 

### Stephenson, VA22656 

### www.countycourtReporters.com**877.837.83:1_~**INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20,2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page 14 

### 1 2012 for the deadline to respond to the initial 2 discovery request. According to what you both told me, 3 your going to be early on that, that you both think 4 you'll be done by tomorrow. Which is a week early. 5 I 

### then have, a tentative date of October 12, 6 2012 for you to exchange or serve your additional 7 discovery requests. Which would be asking for 

### 8 interrogatories to be answered, requesting documents, 9 disclosing expert testimony according to the court 10 rules and so forth. 11 Ms. Wojcik, is October 12, 2012 an adequate 12 time for you to get that material together and send it 13 to Mr. Goldstein? 14 MS. WOJCIK: 

### I believe it's an adequate time 15 to serve a request of a general discovery nature, yes. 16 THE COURT: 

### Okay, Mr. Goldstein, is that a 17 comfortable time for you as well? 18 MR. GOLDSTEIN: I 

### think so your Honor. It's 19 two weeks. 20 THE COURT: 

### Okay. 21 MR. GOLDSTEIN: 

### And if we get our initial 22 responses tomorrow or Monday, then it will be three 23 weeks, so it ought to be enough time. 24 THE COURT: 

### Okay. And then from October 12 25 through November 30th, 2012, would be approximately six

Th•

# ._...,..Group COURT:GePORTERS court._

......-

## ::::~~~~roup.com VideographyVtitlgationTechnology 'Inc.

## &=~=~:;:~;~:~ Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page 15 1 weeks with an understanding that there is a 2 Thanksgiving holiday in there. But would November 30, 3 2012 be a sufficient deadline for getting your general 4 discovery done? Starting with you Ms. Wojcik? 5 MS. WOJCIK: I believe so, your Honor. May I 6 just ask a question? 7 THE COURT: Sure. 8 MS. WOJCIK: I'm assuming that if we need to 9 conduct depositions, those could be conducted as part 10 of the supplemental discovery, that might arise from 11 the general discovery after November 30th. If that's 12 the case, then November 30th sounds like a good date to 13 end General Discovery. 14 THE COURT: Well, ideally, you would be doing 15 your initial or general depositions within your general 16 deposition deadline. 17 MS. WOJCIK: Okay. 1.8 THE COURT: But if you and Counsel can agree 19 to change it, without Court approval to the procedural 20 schedule, you would want to do that with the 21 understanding that if you have difficulties after 22 agreement, your in more difficult territory, because 23 you have changed the procedural schedule. So, 24 essentially I'm looking at November 30, 2012 as a due 25 date to take all of the depositions that you thought

Stephenson.VA ·**I;~ ~.**  ,Inc. Court Reporting,Video &litigationTechnology The Reporters Group

# CcoQuntyUR~·EPORTERS .www:reportersgroup.com · Videography litigationTechnology Corporate· Hist · J rda

. www.advlegaftech.com

. one o nSprmgs t 1160JordanSpringsRoad

### t 

### Stenhen"on "A

### 2'"6rt:. 800.262.8777 ,.., "' 'I I'H**~·** OIV www.CountvcourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20,2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page 16 

### 1 you needed to take, with the supplemental period after 2 that time, in case you need supplemental discovery. If 3 you think November 30th doesn't work for you, then tell 4 me what would. 5 MS. WOJCIK: 

### Your Honor, if we can have maybe 6 two more weeks after November 30th, to finish 7 depositions. I think that we might appreciate that 8 extension. 9 THE COURT: 

### Mr. Goldstein, would that be 10 acceptable to you? That would push that date out to 11 December 14th, 2012. 12 MR. GOLDSTEIN: 

### That would be find with me 13 Judge. 14 THE COURT: 

### Okay. Then I'll note that the 15 general discovery deadline is December 14th, 2012. 16 Let's then talk about the supplemental discovery 17 request deadline. One week after that is December 18 21st, 2012 and we're moving into the Christmas and 19 other holidays. Would that work for just the request 20 deadline and then have a approximately a month after 21 that for any other finishing up discovery? Ms. Wojcik? 22 MS. WOJCIK: 

### Your Honor, I would propose that 23 we extend the deadline for serving supplemental 24 discovery to December 28th. I know it's a holiday 25 week, so maybe not much can be done between the 21st

The ReportersGroup CcoQuntUy

# RT~EPORTERS courtReporting.Video Stephenson,VA I J**~** •Inc. &litigationTechnology www.reportersgrgyp_.com. Videography litigationTechnology www.advlegaltech.com Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20,2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page 17

1 and 28th, but I think that gives us a few more days to 2 make a request if necessary. 3 THE COURT: Mr. Goldstein, what's your 4 position on that? 5 MR. GOLDSTEIN: I was going to say, your 6 Honor, that I think just one week, which would be from 7 the 14th to the 21st probably is not enough time. And 8 I'm just concerned that the 28th, because that is the 9 week of Christmas

... 10 COURT REPORTER: Your Honor, I'm having a 11 problem hearing Mr. Goldstein. 12 MR. GOLDSTEIN: I'm sorry. I'm just a little

13 concerned that there might not be a lot of

.. this is

14 just for supplemental requests? 15 THE COURT: Right. 16 MS. WOJCIK: Correct. 17 MR. GOLDSTEIN: So, okay. I think the 28th

18 will be okay. 19 THE COURT: Well and let me suggest this too, 20 I can always push that out to January 4th, 2013. But 21 it would

...we would then be looking at January 25, 22 2013, according to your proposal for all discovery to 23 be completed by that date. Ms. Wojcik, would that work 24 for you? 25 MS. WOJCIK: It would, I just wanted to



# ...-·-· COURT.G.ePORTERS 

# c-..........Vid<O

## :;::;~~~;.rgyp.com Vldeography

## ~itigatlonTechnology 'Inc. &litigationTechnology www.advlegaltecb.com Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTY FOUNDATION September20,2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page 18 

### 1 propose to the other party of course, with the judge's 2 approval, that maybe it wouldn't be a bad idea to agree 3 that we push the deadline for requesting supplemental 4 discovery to January 4th, and then just expand the 5 deadline for responding to the discovery to January 6 31st. We're pushing by just a couple of days, but I 7 think that would be helpful. 8 THE COURT: 

### Mr. Goldstein, what do you think? 9 MR. GOLDSTEIN: 

### I'm fine with that Judge. 10 THE COURT: 

### I'll put

...I'll note January 4, 11 2013 is the deadline for supplemental discovery 12 requests with January 31, 2013 is the deadline to 13 finish taking all supplemental depositions and 14 responding and answering all supplemental discovery 15 requests. 16 Then let's talk a little bit for the deadline 17 for filing dispositive motions. I'm looking at Mid18 February for any motions to be filed. Would February 19 15, 2013 be acceptable, that's about two weeks after 20 your supplemental discovery is closed. Ms. Wojcik, is 21 that acceptable? 22 MS. WOJCIK: 

### That is your Honor. 23 THE COURT: 

### Mr. Goldstein? 24 MR. GOLDSTEIN: 

### I would like another 25 additional week on that.

The Reporters Group Stephenson,VA www.reportersgroup.com County

## ~ 

# COURl: · EPORTERS.tnc. Vldeography

# ~itlgationTechnology CourtReporting.Video & LitigationTechnology www.advlegaltech.com Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page 19 1 

### THE COURT: Then let me take a look at my 2 calendar. That would be February 22, 2013. Okay, and 3 then I'm going to set dates for the answer to any 4 dispositive motions and I'll also set a date for filing 5 the reply. Looking at my calendar, would March 8th, 6 2013 be sufficient time to file an answer? Ms. Wojcik, 7 starting with you. 8 

### MS. WOJCIK: Sounds good your Honor. 9 

### THE COURT: Mr. Goldstein, is that acceptable? 10 

### MR. GOLDSTEIN: Yes, your Honor. 11 

### THE COURT: Okay, and how about March 15th, 12 that's one week for filing any reply, Ms. Wojcik? 13 

### MS. WOJCIK: One moment your Honor, I'm just 14 looking at the calendar. That would be fine. 15 

### THE COURT: Mr. Goldstein? 16 

### MR. GOLDSTEIN: Well

... 17 

### THE COURT: Not enough time? 18 

### MR. GOLDSTEIN: One week just seems a 19 little

... I'd rather have the extra time, just in case. 20 So, an additional

... it doesn't have to be two weeks, 21 maybe 10 days? I know Passover is in there. 22 

### THE COURT: Oh, let me take a look. 23 

### MR. GOLDSTEIN: Good Friday is the 29th. 24 

### THE COURT: How about March 20th, would that 25 work?

The ReportersGroup Stephenson,VA**~reportersgroup.corn** County

## ~ 

# COURT. .· .EPORTERS.tnc. Videography U!itigationTechnology Court Reporting,Video & LitigationTechnology www.advlegaltech.com Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTY FOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page20 1 MS. WOJCIK: 

### That's fine by me. 2 THE COURT: 

### Mr. Goldstein? 3 MR. GOLDSTEIN: 

### March 20th would be okay, 4 yes. First day of Spring. 5 THE COURT: 

### Okay. Then let's talk

...I once 6 did an oral argument after getting these types of 7 motions, if no dispositive motions are filed, then I 8 automatically convert the oral argument to a telephone 9 conference for a pretrial status conference. I found 10 that that works really well and it is pretty efficient 11 because everybody already has it on their calendar. 12 So, if the replies are in by March 20th, how about the 13 week of either March 24th or March 31 for a one our 14 telephone conference. Ms. Wojcik, do you have any 15 preference? 16 MS. WOJCIK: 

### No, your honor, I just realized, 17 I apologize, I'm looking at the 2012 calendar, not 18 2013. But I don't have any conflicts at this point so 19 I'll adjust. 20 THE COURT: 

### Okay, Mr. Goldstein, how about 21 you? 22 MR. GOLDSTEIN: 

### No problem, except I note the 23 29th is good Friday. 24 MS. WOJCIK: 

### Oh, then if it is your Honor, 25 then I would appreciate it if we could do this on a

The Reporters Group Stephenson,VA www.reportersgroup.com County

## ~ 

# COURT: EPORTERS.tnc. Videography tf.!itlgationTechnology Court Reporting.Video & LitigationTechnology www.advlegattech.com Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings i 1160JordanSpringsRoad i Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page21 1 different date. 2 THE COURT: Okay well, I had given you a two 3 week time frame, so do you want to do it before Good 4 Friday or after Good Friday? 5 MS. WOJCIK: Before Good Friday would be fine 6 with me. 7 THE COURT: Mr. Goldstein, any preferences? 8 MR. GOLDSTEIN: It's fine with me too your 9 Honor. 10 THE COURT: Let me take a look

... I have to 11 give myself time to read everything once you filed it, 12 so let me see what I have. Why don't we try for 13 Wednesday, March 27th and I think you both

... no, Ms. 14 Wojcik you're in Chicago, is that right? 15 MS. WOJCIK: I am. 16 THE COURT: Okay, so your one hour behind 17 Eastern standard time? 18 MS. WOJCIK: Correct. 19 THE COURT: Do you have any preference for 20 time on Wednesday, March 27, 2013? 21 MR. WOJCIK: No, your Honor, I'll adjust. 22 THE COURT: Mr. Goldstein, any preference? 23 MR. GOLDSTEIN: No, I'm fine your Honor. 24 THE COURT: Why don't we do this then, at 25 11:00 a.m. Eastern time. That would be 10:00 a.m. for

The ReportersGroup Stephenson.VA**~portersgrQYR.com** County

## ~ 

## COURT: EPORTERS.tnc. Vldeography

# ~itigationTechnology Court Reporting,VidEQ & litigationTechnology www.advlegaltEch.com Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTY FOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page22 

### 1 you Ms. Wojcik. 2 MS. WOJCIK: 

### Yes. 3 THE COURT: 

### And then shortly after that, I'm 4 looking at your material, let me just take a second 5 look at your proposed dates. Final witness list, let's 6 talk about a final witness list after that, and the 7 reason I like to do that is because if you prevail on a 8 dispositive motion, either in whole or in part, that 9 

### changes how many witnesses you're going to call and how 10 much evidence you need to mark and submit. And I'd 11 rather Counsel have less to do, than more to do if 12 whenever possible. So, let's assume that I issue a 13 decision within a week of March 27th, probably what we 14 need to do

.. how about if we set April lOth

... for I 

### 15 need to just double count that. How about April 15th, 16 excuse me for the submission and exchange of witness 17 list and exhibits? Ms. Wojcik, would that work? 18 MS. WOJCIK: 

### Yes. 19 THE COURT: 

### And Mr. Goldstein? 20 MR. GOLDSTEIN: 

### Yes, your Honor. 21 THE COURT: 

### Okay, let's talk next about the 22 hearing itself. I know there is a venue issue and I'll 23 address that. But let's talk first about how many days 24 that you think this hearing might take, assuming that 25 no dispositive motions are made or that might be

County

## ~ TheReportersGroup COURT.6.:JEPQRTERS,Inc. Stephenson,VA**~** CourtReporting,Video & LitigationTechnology www.advlegaltech.com wwwreportersgroup.com Vldeography LitigationTechnology Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page23 1 granted. 2 

### (Inaudible) 3 MR. GOLDSTEIN: Your honor can I ask a 4 question for clarification? 5 THE COURT: Sure. 6 MR. GOLDSTEIN: When you say final witness 7 list, do you mean witness and exhibits list? 8 THE COURT: Yes. Where you have a list of the 9 witnesses you intend to call, a short statement of the 10 testimony from such witness, if you have an updated 11 resume from an expert, to submit that, and then provide 12 a copy to the opposing party of the documents that you 13 intend to offer. Premarked provided

... per 14 instructions in the litigation order I sent. 15 MR. GOLDSTEIN: Okay. 16 THE COURT: Okay, so Ms. Wojcik, starting with 17 you, how long do you think this hearing would last? 18 MS. WOJCIK: I believe we need at least two 19 days, your honor. 20 THE COURT: And would that be just for your 21 case in chief, or everything? 22 MS. WOJCIK: No, I was thinking about 23 everything. 24 THE COURT: Mr. Goldstein, what is your 25 position?

TheReportersGroup Stephenson,VA www.reportersgroup.com. County

## ~ 

## COURT:

. EPORTERS .•nc. Vldeography tf!itlgatlonTechnology CourtReporting,Video & LitigationTechnology www.advlj;galtech.com Corparate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTY FOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page24 1 MR. GOLDSTEIN: I would say two to three days, 2 your Honor. 3 THE COURT: Okay, so let's err on the side of 4 caution at least for now, and say three days. In terms 5 of venue, I have had some information on venue that has 6 been provided by both parties. I think it may be a 7 little too soon to talk about venues, since you haven't 8 done any significant discovery. And the reason I say 9 that is, because it seems to me that it's a little too 10 soon for me to make a decision about who is least 11 convenienced or who is th most inconvenienced at this 12 point. Since you don't even know who your planning to 13 call. And what I would like to do is differ the issue 14 of venue, until at least the general discovery is done. 15 So that I can find out more specifically from both of 16 you, how the trial is shaping up, in terms of your 17 discovery and what kinds of (Inaudible) are intended on 18 both parties in terms of the choice of venue. This 19 would at least give me an idea of whether there are 20 things available to the parties in terms of admissions, 21 stipulations, written testimony, documentary evidence, 22 and so forth that might eliminate some of the problems 23 that have been raised at least in the initial venue 24 suggestion. 25 So, let's talk about three days and a

The Reporters Group Stephenson,VA W'J'iY)treportersgroup.com County

## ~ 

# COURT: EPORTERS,,nc. Vldeography U!itlgationTechnology Court Reporting.Video & LitigationTechnology www.advlegaltech.com Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t. 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page25 

### 1 location yet to be decided, in terms on the time on our 2 calendars. So, if we have April 15th, 2013 for the 3 exchange of exhibits, starting with you Ms. Wojcik

... 4 I'm sorry, I'm getting a little, my computer has just 5 gone a little screwy, so I need to fix that. Okay, I 6 think I got that fixed. From April 15th, let's talk 7 about

... I'm going to look at my calendar. I have, I'm 8 going to suggest a couple different weeks and then 9 check in with both of you. I have the week of May 12th 10 open, I also have the week of May 19th open and the 11 week of May 26th open. Ms. Wojcik, do you have block12 outs, or black-outs in any of those weeks that would 13 prevent you from attending a three day trial? 14 MS. WOJCIK: 

### I do not at this point, your 15 Honor. 16 THE COURT: 

### Mr. Goldstein, how about you? 17 MR. GOLDSTEIN: 

### No, your Honor. I would just 18 note that the 27th is Memorial day, but

.. so travel 19 might be kind of difficult. No, I don't have anything 20 on my calendar for those weeks. 21 THE COURT: 

### Let's then

.. thank you for 22 pointing that out. Let's choose the week for May 19th. 23 The 27th is Memorial Day okay, so I need to back track 24 for that weekend. I have on my calendar, Mr. Goldstein, 25 that there may be some religious holidays on May 15th,

The Reporters Group Stephenson.VA www.reportersgroup.com County

## ~ 

## COURT:

..EPORTERS .•nc. Videography U!ltigationTechnology Court Reporting.Video & LitigationTechnology**www.advl~altech.com** Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.countyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTY FOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page26 

### 1 and May 16th are those holidays that you might have on 2 your calendar as well? 3 MR. GOLDSTEIN: 

### Actually I don't see those, 4 on this calendar that I'm look at. 5 THE COURT: 

### Okay. Let's look at, actually I 6 can do May

... Just so you know I have an attorney who 7 observes Jewish holidays and he's advised me that May 8 15th, 2013 and May 16th, 2013 are Jewish holidays. But 9 if neither of you observe those holidays, then we can 10 set it for May 12th, the week of May 12th. I'm just 11 concerned, I just want to make sure that week is okay. 12 MS. WOJCIK: 

### I just want to say, I don't have 13 any conflicts to the week of May 12th. But I'll defer 14 to Mr. Goldstein. 15 MR. GOLDSTEIN: 

### I don't

.. I'm not sure which 16 holidays they are so, it's okay with me. 17 THE COURT: 

### Okay, well then let's set this for 18 May 14th to begin with, May 15,. and May 16th to end. 19 And I usually start at 9:00 and end at 5:00, just as a 20 default. Although there may be times when the parties 21 need to tweak that a little bit. And then on May 13th, 22 we can set that as a travel day for our calendars. And 23 May 17th as a travel day. If we start on May 14, then 24 the question is, do you want me to give you a date to 25 file pre-hearing briefs, if you choose to do that? And

The Reporters Group Stephenson,VA www.reportersgroup,com County 

# tic COURl: · EPORTERS.tnc. Videography

.

# ~itlgatlonTechnology Court Reporting.Video &LitigationTechnology www.advlegaltecb.com Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page27 1 if so, would the date of April 30th be acceptable? Ms. 2 Wojcik? 3 MS. WOJCIK: It would to me your Honor. It 4 gives us a week after to find a list of witnesses and 5 exhibits are exchanged. That would work for me. 6 THE COURT: Okay, Mr. Goldstein, how about 7 you? 8 MR. GOLDSTEIN: Me as well, your Honor. 9 THE COURT: Okay, then April 30th it is. And 10 then let's talk about a date to convene to discuss and 11 decide about venues. I'm going back to the discovery 12 schedule and we may be able to address this either in 13 Mid-December or Mid-January. And that would be

.. that 14 would give people enough time to talk about travel 15 schedules with witnesses if needed. How about the week 16 of January 7th for telephone conference on the issue of 17 venue? Ms. Wojcik, is that acceptable? 18 MS. WOJCIK: It is your Honor. I just would 19 like to make a note on this. I've been told by my 20 supervisors that if it is decided that the venue will 21 happen in Georgia, then we may have to transfer the 22 case to that office. So, because of that contingency, 23 the sooner we decide the venue, the more we would 24 appreciate it. But September 7th sounds

.. I mean, I 25 don't have any conflicts, so if that's the best date

The Reporters Group Stephenson.VA www.reportersgroup.com County

## ~ 

## COURT: EPQRTERS,Inc. Videography

# ~itigationTechnology Court Reporting,Video & litigationTechnology www.advlegaltech.com Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page28 1 for everyone, I'll adjust. 2 THE COURT: Well, let me ask you this Ms. 3 Wojcik. I've read everyone's venue materials, I 4 haven't received any information from you or Mr. 5 Goldstein about specifically who you are planning to 6 call, how much it would cost to go to the alternate 7 forums suggested by the opposing party. And why your 8 request for venue should trump one way or the other. 9 And so, it makes it very difficult for this 10 Court to make a decision, that's in the interest of all 11 the parties and in the interest of efficiency and 12 administrative justice, without that kind of 13 information. 14 MR. GOLDSTEIN: Your Honor, if I may. I'm 15 sorry, I didn't mean to

... 16 I think in my suggestion, I did list four or 17 five witnesses all of whom, let's see I listed five 18 witnesses that I know of now, all of whom that live in 19 the Atlanta area. So, I believe I did provide some 20 information. 21 THE COURT: Yes, I wasn't talking to you. 22 MR. GOLDSTEIN: I'm sorry. 23 THE COURT: Yes, I was talking to Ms. Wojcik 24 first. I'll get to you in a minute. 25

The Reporters Group Stephenson,VA www.reportersgr_QYR.com MR. GOLDSTEIN: I'm sorry your Honor.

County

## ~ COURT:

. ·EPQRTERS,Inc. Videography ff!ltigationTechnology Court Reporting.Video & LitigationTechnology www,advlegaltec:h.com Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTY FOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page29 1 THE COURT: What I'm saying to Ms. Wojcik for 2 example, is that obviously we have a venue issue that's 3 in dispute. And typically when a court looks at 4 venues, it looks at not only what the parties prefer, I 5 but also what the parties are propoting in terms of 6 witnesses to be called, the cost of]calling those 7

# ::::::·::~**a::r::::l:::y~ ::e:fy::aj::~**  ::p::::eyou are 8 9 witnesses have to be taken out of tteir local. It's

I 10 also helpful in looking at venue, i1 the parties have 11 already addressed to full resolutioJ, alternate ways to 12 pare down the testimonial evidence, by stipulations, by 13 admissions, by interrogatories, andJso forth.

I 14 So, the tenor of what thelcase looks like 15 

# today, whenitbroadlyaddressedbyltheparties, can 16 change radically after discovery isldone and you find 17 out that the five witnesses that yol were planning to 18 call, actually has been whittled do1n into two 19 witnesses that you were planning tolcall. That's what

i 20 I'm talking about, in terms of the fenue disput. So, 21 it seems premature to me, for this

### ~ourt to making a 22 ruling on the issue of venue, when tou haven't I 23 finished, actually haven't even statted your general 24 discovery to look at those kinds of issues. And once 25 you have general discovery done, it's very helpful then

The ReportersGroup Stephenson,VA www.rEportersgroup.com Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsR d t 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.c m Court Reporting,Video & litigationTechnology www.advl§galtech.com Stephenson, VA22656 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTY FOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page30 

### 1 at that time, to take a second look at it and say, 2 "Okay, I may have had five witnesses in September, 2012 3 that I thought I was going to call, but now that I've 4 done general discovery, it turns out that I only need 5 three witnesses and of those three, only one is an 6 expert. And that one expert will only need to take an 7 hour on the stand and I can fly him in and out, in one 8 day. And the cost of that is going to be x, y, and z." 9 And when both parties are able to say that, then I have 10 a much better basis upon which to review. The conflict 11 between the parties, in terms of the venue, the 12 convenience, and the cost, so that I can address that 13 dispute in a better informed manner. 14 So, your saying to me Ms. Wojcik, that you 15 want to get the venue issue addressed as soon as 16 possible. I understand that. January 7th may be too 17 late for you. So, do you want to look at it 18 potentially sooner, and how much sooner, how much time 19 do you think your going to need in the general 20 discovery phase to get more information, so that you 21 can then funnel a better sense of fact to this court in 22 support of your motion, pro a Chicago venue? 23 MS. WOJCIK: 

### Your honor, first I would just 24 like to say, I understand your explanation and I 25 actually appreciate it. I haven't thought about it

The Reporters Group Stephenson.VA www.reportersgroup.com County

## ~ 

## COUR'I .·ePORTERS.•nc. Videography

# ~itigationTechnology Court Reporting.Video &litigationTechnology www.advlegaltech.com Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20,2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page31 

### 1 this way, to be completely frank. But it does make 2 sense. So, thank you for the explanation. 3 When I say sooner, I'm not necessarily 4 objecting to the date of January 7, I'm merely making a 5 note that if maybe we can do it by the end of December. 6 Even, I think the general discovery responses are due 7 December 14th. I know that there was sort of Holiday 8 time, but if it would be possible to discuss the venue 9 issue before shortly after the 14th, when all the 10 general discovery is due. I think I would appreciate 11 that. If it's a problem, then we'll adjust to January 12 7th. 13 THE COURT: 

### Okay, Mr. Goldstein, do you have 14 any objections to pushing this up into December? 15 MR. GOLDSTEIN: 

### Let me just look at my 16 calendar, your honor. I don't your Honor and the 17 reason I don't is because I believe Ms. Wojcik and I 18 have a pretty good Idea who we're going to call as 19 witnesses. We had a, if you want to call it a sister 20 case, that was before the NTSB that involved the 21 mechanic who did some work and made some log entries, 22 so we've been through a case already that was settled. 23 So we've disclosed, in that case, who are witnesses 24 were going to be and so forth. And we've taken 25 depositions in that case, or at least I did. And I was

The ReportersGroup Stephenson.VA www.reportersgroup.com. Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com CourtReporting,Video &litigationTechnology www.adviEgaltech.com**Steph~nson,** VA22656 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTY FOUNDATION September20,2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page32 1 going to bring that to your attention at some point. 2 And in our discovery responses that are due a week from 3 tomorrow, we've asked and we will respond to who we 4 think our witnesses are going to be, and with a brief 5 statement as to what they are going to say. But I 6 think we know anyway, but we're going .to do that again. 7 So, I don't have a problem with moving it up, certainly 8 to convenience Ms. Wojcik, it's fine with me. 9 THE COURT: Okay, so we may even be able to do 10 it before December 14th, 2012, is what I'm hearing from 11 you? 12 MR. GOLDSTEIN: I think that we have a ... you 13 know things will come up I believe, but I think we have 14 a pretty good idea based on what we already know who we 15 may be calling. I've deposed two FAA People, they may 16 list some others, I don't know and that may change 17 things, but

... yes, I don't have a problem with it. If 18 we need to change it later on, we can call you. 19 THE COURT: Okay, then I'm going to suggest we 20 try and set it during your general discovery exchange. 21 Because it sounds like you have the ability at this 22 point, to at least tentatively identify what you can 23 stipulate to and find out to a certain degree, how much 24 the cost will be for moving out of your local. Ms. 25 Wojcik, would that be about a fair statement of where

The Reporters Group Stephenson,VA**~porterJ;!group.com** County

## ~ 

## COURT. EPORTERS .•nc. Videography

# ~ltigatlonTechnology Court Reporting,Video & LitigationTechnology**~dvlegaltech.com** Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROFLIBERTY FOUNDATION September20,2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page33 

### 1 you are right now? 2 MS. WOJCIK: 

### Yes, your Honor. We would have 3 to do some work to produce cost estimates. And I'm not 4 quite sure what kind of evidence for that you would 5 want to see, but if these are just estimates, I think 6 we could do those during the general discovery. 7 THE COURT: 

### I think it would be a fairly 8 standard way of addressing cost for example, I could 9 tell you that it would cost me approximately X amount 10 of money to have a round-trip ticket to go to Chicago. 11 I can tell you it cost me X amount of money to bill a 12 hotel for 4 nights, because I would be coming in on 13 Monday, staying Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, leaving 14 Friday. And where that would be

.. but it's a 15 reasonable cost, it's a government per diem for 16 example. You know, those kinds of things and it 17 involves going on the internet or calling an airline, 18 calling a hotel, talking about general meals if your 19 witness has to stay for more than one day, 20 transportation, those kinds of things. If your 21 actually paying for experts, which the FAA might not 22 do, but the respondents might. Then the cost of the 23 expert's fee and how much the experts charging, either 24 by the half day or the day and so forth. Those kinds 25 of things are very helpful to find out. Does that make

The Reporters Group Stephenson.VA www;reportersgroup.com County

## ~ 

## COURT: EPORTERS,,nc. Vldeography

# ~ltigationTechnology Court Reporting.Video & litigationTechnology www.advlegaltech.com Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTY FOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page34 

### 1 sense, Ms. Wojcik? 2 MS. WOJCIK: 

### Yes, and we will do that. 3 THE COURT: 

### Okay, thank you. I'm looking at 4 the week of October 28th at this point. Which should 5 give you plenty of time, between now and the 28th, 6 unless I hear a gasp from someone. Which I may have 7 just heard? 8 MS. WOJCIK: 

### No, I'm sorry, I just took a deep 9 breath. But it wasn't a gasp. 10 THE COURT: 

### So, the week of October 28 is too 11 soon, do you want me to look at November, Ms. Wojcik? 12 MS. WOJCIK: 

### You know, I'll defer to the other 13 side, but as I said in the beginning, it's frankly in 14 the FAA's interest to resolve the issue, one way or the 15 other as soon as it's reasonable to do so, so if 16 everyone is okay with October 28th, I believe that by 17 that time we can look at some costs and provide that 18 information, so that we can all have a discussion about 19 that. 20 THE COURT: 

### Okay, Mr. Goldstein, is that 21 acceptable to you, to set a conference on that week? 22 MR. GOLDSTEIN: 

### If it was at the end of the 23 week, your Honor. I have a conflict the 29th and 30th, 24 which are Monday and Tuesday. And then the following 25 week, I have a conflict the 7th and 8th. So, if it was

The Reporters Group Stephenson,VA www.reporter_:mroup.com. County

## ~ 

## COUR't

. EPORTERS.Inc. Videography

# ~itigationTechnology Court Reporting,VidEO & LitigationTechnology www.advlegaltech.com Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings l 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTY FOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page35 1 the end of the week, the 2nd. I think that would be

.. 2 you know, to the extent you can predict airfare six 3 months in advance. I think that's pretty impossible. 4 THE COURT: I'm not asking you to predict, I'm 5 asking to contact the airlines and find out what they 6 are going to quote you. I don't know about you, but I 7 scheduled airfare in advance and so it's clear that 8 sometimes if you buy a ticket, very close in time to 9 the time that you want to go, those costs go up. It's 10 also clear that they often stay fairly standard up 11 until a point of about 2 weeks prior to you leaving or 12 going. So, I just want to get a general idea from both 13 of you, how much you think it's costing your client, if 14 you have to go outside of your preferred local. 15 Because that's one of the things that I'm suppose to be 16 looking at in terms of the convenience and cost to each 17 party that's seeking a different local. 18 So, how about if we look at Friday November 19 2nd, again at 11:00 a.m. in the morning, does that work 20 for you Ms. Wojcik? 21 MS. WOJCIK: It does. 22 THE COURT: Okay, and Mr. Goldstein? 23 MR. GOLDSTEIN: Yes, your Honor. 24 THE COURT: Okay, November 2nd, 2012 at 11:00 25 for a telephone conference, and then let's talk about

The Reporters Group Stephenson,VA www.reportersgroup.com County

## ~ 

# COURT: EPORTERS,tnc. Videography U!itlgationTechnology Court Reporting,Video & LitigationTechnology**~dvlegaltech.com** Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page36 1 filing some additional materials with the court. Could 2 you all have your materials filed by October 24, Ms. 3 Wojcik? 4 MS. WOJCIK: Yes, your Honor. 5 THE COURT: Mr. Goldstein? 6 MR. GOLDSTEIN: By materials, you mean the 7 cost? 8 THE COURT: Yes, I would like some 9 supplemental information from both of you regarding why 10 you think the costs are prohibited for your client. 11 Your talking about, not only what you prefer and where 12 people are located, but also how much it's going to 13 cost you if you are the losing party on the venue issue 14 essentially. So that I can compare and contrast who

.. 15 what the costs are for the parties. If Mr. Goldstein, 16 you have five witnesses and it's going to cost you 17 $1500 and the FAA has three witnesses and it's going to 18 cost them $400, I have to take that into account, one 19 way or the other. 20 MR. GOLDSTEIN: Okay, I have no problem with 21 that. 22 THE COURT: Okay, so I will set October 24, 23 2012 as the deadline fo reach party to file 24 supplemental materials on the venue issue. Now, Ms. 25 Wojcik and Mr. Goldstein, I'll just note that I'm going

The Reporters Group Stephenson,VA**yvww~rtersgroup,com** Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com Court Reporting,Video & LitigationTechnology www.advlegaltech.com Stephenson, VA22656 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page37 

### 1 to be sending you out a standard litigation procedural 2 order, which talks about requests for modification, if 3 you want a formal modification of the litigation 4 scheduling order. It will talk about filing a motion 5 regarding discovery disputes within 10 calendar days 6 after service of the deficit discovery response or 7 after the response is due and you didn't get it for 8 example. I say this, not only because I anticipate 9 that's going to be a problem in this case, but just so 10 you know what this order is going to say. 11 If you do make a motion to compel discovery, 12 I do expect you to have an informal conference with 13 each other first, according to CR-37 and to note that 14 you had that informal conference to try and resolve the 15 discovery dispute before you bring it the court's 16 attention. In addition, if you have a discovery 17 dispute, I do want the moving party to consult with the 18 opposing party to talk about some calendar dates to put 19 it on my calendar for oral argument. And then to 20 contact my office, so that you can get that set as soon 21 as possible, so that I can help you out as fast as 22 possible. And that way we can keep on the discovery 23 schedule and not have to reschedule everything. 24 In addition, I identified Cody L. Smith as an 25 observer today. He's also an attorney in this office

The Reporters Group Stephenson,VA**www.repo~.com.** County

## ~ 

## COURT: EPORTERS .•nc. Videography

# ~ltigationTechnology Court Reporting.Video & LitigationTechnology www.advlegaltech.com Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page38 

### 1 who is available to answer questions about the order if 2 you get it and don't understand anything. And I'll put 3 his name and phone number in the order as well. 4 

### Ms. Wojcik starting with you, is there 5 anything else that we need to address for your client 6 today? Or any questions you might have? 7 MS. WOJCIK: 

### There is nothing I can think of 8 my Honor, your Honor. 9 THE COURT: 

### Thank you. Mr. Goldstein, 10 anything you would like to ask about or any matters we 11 still need to address for your client? 12 MR. GOLDSTEIN: 

### Not that I can think of, Your 13 Honor. 14 THE COURT: 

### Okay, thank you both very much for 15 your time today, it appears our business is complete. 16 I'll be issuing this order within either today or 17 tomorrow. With that, I look forward to talking to you 18 on November 2nd, 2012, regarding venue and I'll look 19 forward to getting your materials. We can go off the 20 record at this time. I wish you a good day. 21 MR. GOLDSTEIN: 

### Thank you, your Honor. 22 MS. WOJCIK: 

### Thank You. 23 (WHEREUPON, the telephone conference was 2 4 concluded.) 

### 25

The Reporters Group Stephenson.VA**~.reportersgrou~corn** County

## ~ 

# COURT. ·. EPORTERS.tnc. Videography ff!ltigationTechnology Court·Reporting,Video & litigationTechnology**~.advlegaltech.corn** Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20,2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page39 1 CAPTION 2 3 The foregoing matter was taken on the date, and at the 

### 4 and place set out on the Title page hereof. 5 6 It was requested that the matter be taken by the 7 and that the same be reduced to typewritten form. 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25

The ReportersGroup Stephenson,VA**l!!lW.W.reporte~gyp;com.** County

## ~ 

# COURT. EPORTERS,,nc. Videography f.f!itigationT.:chnology CourtReporting.Video &LitigationTechnology www.advlegaltech.com Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page40 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 CERTIFICATE OF REPORTER COMMONWEALTH OF VIRGINIA AT LARGE: I hereby certify that I am a Notary Public for the State of Virginia at Large, and hereby certify that the foregoing constitutes a true and accurate transcript to the best of their ability.

Further, this is to certify that I am not an employee of nor related to any of the parties, and I have no financial interest in the outcome of this

matter.

JACOB MACE COURT REPORTER / NOTARY NOTARY REGISTRATION NUMBER: 7508361 My Commission Expires: September 30, 2015

TheReportersGroup Stephenson,VA )NWW.reporter$group.com County

## ~ 

## COURT. · EPORTERS .•nc. Videography

# ~ltigationTechnology CourtReporting.Video & LitigationTechnology www.advlegaltech.com Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page41 $ $1500 36:17 $400 36:18

0 0477 3:5

1 10 19:21 37:5 10:00 21:25 lOth 22:14 11:00 21:25 35:19 35:24 12 7:21 14:5 14:11 14:24 12th 25:9 26:10 26:10 26:13 13.220 12:23 13-220 11:22 13th 3:24 26:21 14 11:22 26:23 14th 16:11 16:15 17:7 26:18 31:7 31:9 32:10 15 18:19 26:18 15th 19:11 22:15 25:2 25:6 25:25 26:8 16 3:19 16th 26:1 26:8 26:18 17th 4:1 26:23 18th 5:25 19th 25:10 25:22 2 

### 2 8:10 35:11 20 3:2 3:5 2012 3:2 3:5 3:20 3:24 4:1 4:4 4:6 4:6 4:10 4:17 4:21 5:25 6:4 6:21 7:1 7:5 7:14 7:16 7:19 7:21 8:8 13:22 14:1 14:6 14:11 14:25 15:3 15:24 16:11 16:15 16:18 20:17 30:2 32:10 35:24 36:23 38:18 2013 8:9 17:20 17:22 18:11 18:12 18:19 19:2 19:6 20:18 21:20 25:2 26:8 26:8 20th 19:24 20:3 20:12 21 4:6 6:4 6:21 7:14 13:22 21st 8:4 16:18 16:25 17:7 

### 22 19:2 24 4:4 36:2 36:22 24th 20:13 25 4:6 17:21 25th 8:8 26(a) (1 10:6 13:6 26-B 10:12 26th 25:11 27 21:20 27th 21:13 22:13 25:18 25:23 28 4:10 7:16 34:10 28th 7:1 7:5 7:19 13:25 16:24 17:1 17:8 17:17 34:4 34:5 34:16 29th 19:23 20:23 34:23 2nd 35:1 35:19 35:24 38:18

3 30 15:2 15:24 30th 8:3 14:25 15:11 15:12 16:3 16:6 27:1 27:9 34:23 31 18:12 20:13 31st 18:6

4 

### 4 18:10 33:12 4th 4:17 17:20 18:4

5 5:00 26:19

7 7 31:4 7th 27:16 27:24 30:16 31:12

TheReportersGroup ccoountuy

# RT~·EPORTERS CourtReporting.Video Stephenson.VA**1.~ ~**  •Inc. & litigationTechnology www.reportersgroup.com Videography litigationTechnology www.advlegaltech.com Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.countyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313**....----------------------------~----------** INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20,2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page42

34:25

8 

### 8th 19:5 34:25

9 9 3:20 9:00 26:19 

### 9th 4:21

A 

### a.m 21:25 21:25 35:19 

### ability 32:21 

### able 13:11 27:12 30:9 32:9 

### Absolutely 9:22 

### acceptable 6 : 6 16:10 18:19 18:21 19:9 27:1 27:17 34:21 

### according 14:2 14:9 17:22 37:13 

### account 36:18 

### actual 5:15 5:20 

### actually 13:1 26:3 26:5 29:18 29:23 30:25 33:21 

### add 13:12 

### addition 37:16 37:24 

### additional 7:22 13:14 14:6 18:25 19:20 36:1 

### address 11:9 22:23 27:12 30:12 38:5 38:11 

### addressed 29:11 ' 29:15 30:15 

### addressing 33:8 

### adequate 14:11 14:14 

### adjust 20:19 21:21 28:1 31:11 

### administrative 28:12 

### administrators 4:1 

### administrator's 4:8 

### admission 10:20 

### admissions 24:20 29:13 

### admit 4:11 

### adopt 6:20 

### Adrianne 3:8 

### advance 35:3 35:7 

### advised 26:7 

### affirmative 4:5 

### ago 6:9 

### agreement 15:22 

### airfare 35:2 35:7 

### airline 33:17 

### airlines 35:5 

### already 5:18 6:22 13:25 20:11 29:11 31:22 32:14 

### alternate 28:6 29:11



### am 6:10 10:1 21:15 

### amount 33:9 33:11



### answer 4:5 19:3 19:6 38:1 

### answered 6:4 14:8 

### answering 18:14 

### anticipate 37:8 

### anticipated 7:4 

### anybody 5:13 

### anything 4:20 4:24 25:19 38:2 38:5 38:10 

### anyway 32:6 

### apologize 20:17 

### appear 9:20 

### appeared 12:3 

### appears 38:15 

### appreciate 16:7 20:25 27:24 30:25 31:10 

### appreciated 8:21 

### approval 15:19 18:2 

### approximately 14:25 16:20 33:9 

### April 22:14 22:15 25:2 25:6 27:1 27:9



### area 28:19 

### argument 5:17 20:6 20:8 37:19

County

## ~ TheReportersGroup 

## COURTf

## gEPQRTERS,Inc. Stephenson,VA**I~ ~**  CourtReporting.Video & litigationTechnology www.advlegaltech.com l!!LWW.reportersgroup.com Videography

-litigationTechnology Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.countyC:ourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20,2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page43 arise 11:5 15:10

assume 22:12 assuming 15:8 22:24 Atlanta 28:19 attending 25:13 attention 32:1 37:16 attorney 3:7 3:9 3:11 26:6 37:25 August 4:10 authority 11:23 13:14 automatically 20:8 available 24:20 38:1

aware 11:3 away 9:24 awhile 6:9

B bad 18:2 based 8:7 32:14 basically 11:2 basis 30:10 begin 8:1 26:18 beginning 34:13 behind 21:16 believe 6:7 14:14 15:5 23:18 28:19 31:17 32:13 34:16 best 27:25 better 30:10 30:13 30:21 bill 33:11 bit 3:16 3:18 5:7 5:10 18:16 26:21 black-outs 25:12 block 25:11 book 8 : 2 3 9 : 3 9:19 9:21 9:24 bound 12:8 12:12 12:13 boy 10:12 break 9:17 breath 34:9 brief 32:4 briefs 26:25 bring 32:1 37:15 broad 10:16 broadly 29:15 business 38:15 buy 35:8



## c calendar 19:2 19:5 19:14 20:11 20:17 25:7 25:20 25:24 26:2 26:4 31:16 37:5 37:18 37:19 calendars 25:2 26:22 cant 12:18

care 11:12 case 7:3 15:12 16:2 19:19 23:21 27:22 29:14 31:20 31:22 31:23 31:25 37:9 caution 6:20 6:24 24:4 certain 4:12 4:16 32:23 certainly 4:14 11:16 32:7 

### CFR 11:22 chance 11:8 11:9 change 15:19 29:16 32:16 32:18 changed 15:23 changes 22:9 charging 33:23 check 25:9 Chicago 21:14 30:22 33:10 chief 23:21 choice 24:18 choose 25:22 26:25 chose 4:13 Christmas 16:18 17:9 civil 9 : 5 9 : 8 9:13 11:19 12:9 12:11 12:14 12:16 12:22 clarification 23:4

The ReportersGroup 

# couyRTr/iePORTERS Court Reporting,Video Stephenson.VA I J**~** •Inc. & litigationTechnology**~tmQrtersgroup.com** Videography litigationTechnology www.advlegaltech.com Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777**www~CountyCourtReporters.com** 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20,2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page44 

### clean 11:9 

### clear 7:13 35:7 35:10 

### clearly 11:2 

### client 4:25 35:13 36:10 38:5 38:11 

### close 35:8 

### closed 18:20 

### closely 12:21 

### code 11:20 12:20 12:24 13:2 

### Cody 3:10 37:24 

### coincides 8:9



### comes 7:4 

### comfortable 14:17 

### coming 33:12 

### compare 36:14 

### compel 37:11 

### complaint 4:5 

### complete 11:

### 6 38:15 

### completed 17:23 

### completely 31:1 

### computer 25:4 

### concerned 6:10 17:8 17:13 26:11 

### concluded 38:24 

### conduct 15:9 

### conducted 15:9 

### conference 3:1 3:7 3:19 11:17 11:25 20:9 20:9 20:14 27:16 34:2l 35:25 37:12 37:14 38:23 

### conflict 12:17 30:10 34:23 34:25 

### conflicts 20:18 26:13 27:25 

### conjunction 9:15 11:20 12:24 

### consult 37:17 

### contact 35:5 37:20 

### contingency 27:22 

### contrast 36:14



### convene 27:10 

### convened 3:6 

### convenience 30:12 32:8 35:16 

### convenienced 24:11 

### convert 20:8 

### copy 9:2 23:12 

### Correct 7:12 17:16 21:18 

### cost 28:6 29:6 29:8 30:8 30:12 32:24 33:3 33:8 33:9 33:11 33:15 33:22 35:16 36:7 36:13 36:16 36:18 

### costing 35:13 

### costs 34:17 35:9 36:10 36:15 

### Counsel 3:13 6:5 15:18 22:11 

### count 22:15 

### couple 18:6 25:8



### course 18:1 

### court 3:3 3:16 4:24 5:2 5:5 6:14 6:19 7:12 8:13 8:23 9:2 9:3 9:7 9:14 9:18 9:23 10:2 10:4 11:18 12:2 12:19 12:23 13:7 13:21 14:9 14:16 14:20 14:24 15:7 15:14 15:18 15:19 16:9 16:14 17:3 17:10 17:15 17:19 18:8 18:10 18:23 19:1 19:9 19:11 19:15 19:17 19:22 19:24 20:2 20:5 20:20 21:2 21:7 21:10 21:16 21:19 21:22 21:24 22:3 22:19 22:21 23:5 23:8 23:16 23:20 23:24 24:3 25:16 25:21 26:5 26:17 27:6 27:9 28:2 28:10 28:21 28:23 29:1 29:3 29:21 30:21 31:13 32:9 32:19 33:7 34:3 34:10 34:20 35:4

County

## ~ The ReportersGroup 

## couR·"[f

## AEPORTERS.Inc. CourtReporting.Video Stephenson,VA**~** & LitigationTechnology www.reportersgroup.com. Vldeography litigationTechnology www.advlegaltech.com Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20,2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page45 35:22 35:24 36:1 36:5 36:8 36:22 38:9 38:14 court's 37:15

covers 10:7 CR-26 10:5 11:2 11:22 CR-36 11:22 CR-37 37:13

D date 5:4 5:25 6:21 7:22 8:9 13:21 13:22 14:5 15:12 15:25 16:10 17:23 19:4 21:1 26:24 27:1 27:10 27:25 31:4 dates 19:3 22:5 37:18 day 7:14 20:4 25:13 25:18 25:23 26:22 26:23 30:8 33:19 33:24 33:24 38:20 days 17:1 18:6 19:21 22:23 23:19 24:1 24:4 24:25 37:5 deadline 6:6 6:22 7:14 7:16 7:20 14:1 15:3 15:16 16:15 16:17 16:20 16:23 18:3 18:5 18:11 18:12 18:16 36:23 December 5:25 8:4 8:4 8:8 16:11 16:15 16:17 16:24 31:5 31:7 31:14 32:10 decide 27:11 27:23 decided 25:1 27:20 decision 22:13 24:10 28:10 deep 34:8 default 26:20 defense's 4:5 defer 26:13 34:12 deficit 37:6 degree 32:23 deposed 32:15 deposition 15:16 depositions 10:20 15:9 15:15 15:25 16:7 18:13 31:25 detail 11:16 detailed 10:22 diem 33:15 differ 24:13 difference 10:14 different 3:21 21:1 25:8 35:17 difficult 15:22 25:19 28:9 difficulties 15:21 disclose 10:11 10:11 disclosed 31:23 disclosing 14:9 disclosure 10:7 10:7 10:8 10:15 discovery 4:15 4:16 4:18 5:3 5:7 5:8 5:8 5:9 5:19 6:3 6:8 6:11 6:21 7:9 7:11 7:15 7:17 7:18 7:20 7:23 8:2 8:5 8:6 8:7 8:9 8:10 8:15 8:15 8:16 10:10 10:13 10:17 10:18 11:1 11:4 11:5 11:8 11:10 12:21 13:5 13:17 13:17 13:18 13:23 14:2 14:7 14:15 15:4 15:10 15:11 15:13 16:2 16:15 16:16 16:21 16:24 17:22 18:4 18:5 18:11 18:14 18:20 24:8 24:14 24:17 27:11 29:16 29:24 29:25 30:4 30:20 31:6 31:10 32:2 32:20 33:6 37:5 37:6 37:11 37:15 37:16 37:22 discuss 27:10 31:8

TheReportersGroup ccoountuy

# RT~EPORTeR·s CourtReporting.Video Stephenson,VA 1,**~** •Inc. &litigationTechnology :www.reportersgroup.com. Videography litigationTechnology www.advlegaltech.com Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtRepo.rters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20,2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page46 discussion 34:18 dispositive 5:12 18:17 19:4 20:7 22:8 22:25 disput 29:20 dispute 29:3 30:13 37:15 37:17 disputes 4:17 10:23 37:5 disrupt 5:19 Docket 3:4 document 3:23 documentary 24:21 documents 3:21 4:12 14:8 23:12 done 6:22 7:2 8:7 13:25 14:4 15:4 16:25 24:8 24:14 29:16 29:25 30:4 double 22:15 due 15:24 31:6 31:10 32:2 37:7 during 32:20 33:6

E early 14:3 14:4 Eastern 21:17 21:25 easy 13:24 efficiency 28:11 efficient 20:10 either 20:13 22:8 27:12 33:23 38:16 elaborate 8:20 eliminate 24:22 else 38:5 entries 31:21

err 6 : 20 6: 2 3 24:3 essentially 15:24 36:14 estimates 33:3 33:5 event 5:17 13:15 everybody 13:1 20:11 everyone 28:1 34:16 everyone's 28:3 everything 7:2 21:11 23:21 23:23 37:23 evidence 22:10 24:21 29:12 33:4 example 8:4 11:6 29:2 33:8 33:16 37:8 except 20:22 exchange 7:20 7:22 11:8 14:6 22:16 25:3 32:20 exchanged 6:8 27:5 exchanging 5:25 8:1 excuse 6:2 22:16 exhibits 22:17 23:7 25:3 27:5 expand 18:4 expanded 5:7 5:10 expect 37:12 expert 6:1 10:8 10:11 14:9 23:11 30:6 30:6 experts 10:9 29:7 33:21 33:23 expert's 33:23 explain 9:21 explanation 30:24 31:2 extend 16:23 extension 16:8 extent 35:2 extra 7:3 19:19

F FAA 3:7 4:1 4:13 6:10 32:15 33:21 36:17 FAA-2012 3:4 FAA's 4:11 34:14 fact 30:21 fair 32:25 fairly 12:7 33:7 35:10 fast 37:21 February 18:18 18:18 19:2

The ReportersGroup ccoountuy

# RT~··EPORTERS CourtReporting,Video Stephenson,VA I J**~** •Inc. & LitigationTechnology**www.reP.Qrtersgro~,~p.com** Videography litigationTechnology www.advlegaltech.com Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROFLIBERTYFOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page47 federal 9:7 11:20 12:7 12:8 12:11 12:14 12:20 12:20 12:24 13:3 fee 33:23 feel 10:14 file 4:13 4:15 5:13 7:6 7:7 19:6 26:25 36:23 filed 3:18 3:23 3:25 4:1 4:4 4:7 4:11 4:18 18:18 20:7 21:11 36:2 filing 4:21 5:5 18:17 19:4 19:12 36:1 37:4 final 6:16 22:5 22:6 23:6 fine 4:14 12:6 12:7 18:9 19:14 20:1 21:5 21:8 21:23 32:8 finish 16:6 18:13 finished 7:19 29:23 finishing 16:21 first 10:8 11:7 20:4 22:23 28:24 30:23 37:13 five 9:17 28:17 28:17 29:17 30:2 36:16 fix 25:5 fixed 25:6 fly 30:7 fo 36:23 folks 13:9 formal 37:3 forth 7:25 11:23 14:10 24:22 29:13 31:24 33:24 forums 28:7 forward 38:17 38:19 Foundation 3:4 3:8 frame 21:3 frank 31:1 frankly 34:13 Friday 7 : 1 7 :13 7:16 7:19 19:23 20:23 21:4 21:4 21:5 33:14 35:18 full 5:13 29:11 funnel 30:21 future 9:19

G gasp 34:6 34:9 general 5:8 7:20 7:23 8:2 8:7 8:15 10:13 10:17 11:5 11:7 13:8 13:17 14:15 15:3 15:11 15:13 15:15 15:15 16:15 24:14 29:23 29:25 30:4 30:19 31:6 31:10 32:20 33:6 33:18 35:12 generally 10:11 genuineness 4:12 Georgia 27:21 getting 10:21 12:2 15:3 20:6 25:4 38:19 given 21:2 gives 8:3 17:1 27:4 giving 7:2 11:23 Goldstein 3:9 3:14 4:24 5:1 6:8 6:12 6:14 6:16 7:10 9:2 9:4 9:9 9:25 10:1 12:2 12:5 13:4 13:15 13:20 14:13 14:16 14:18 14:21 16:9 16:12 17:3 17:5 17:11 17:12 17:17 18:8 18:9 18:23 18:24 19:9 19:10 19:15 19:16 19:18 19:23 20:2 20:3 20:20 20:22 21:7 21:8 21:22 21:23 22:19 22:20 23:3 23:6 23:15 23:24 24:1 25:16 25:17 25:24 26:3 26:14 County

## ~ TheReportersGroup CQUR'[fAEPQRTERS,Inc. CourtReporting,Video Stephenson,VA**~** & UtigatlonTechnology www.reportersgroup.com. Vldeography litigationTechnology www.advlegaltech.com Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page48 26:15 27:6 27:8 28:5 28:14 28:22 28:25 31:13 31:15 32:12 34:20 34:22 35:22 35:23 36:5 36:6 36:15 36:20 36:25 38:9 38:12 38:21 

### gone 25:5 

### gotten 3:24 11:12 

### government 33:15 

### granted 23:1 

### guess 12:17 

### guidance 11:24 13:9 

### guide 12:16 

### guidelines 12:25

H 

### half 33:24 

### handset 10:3 

### happen 27:21 

### happy 6:20 

### haven't 7:4 8:18 11:8 11:11 24:7 28:4 29:22 29:23 30:25 

### having 7:2 13:16 17:10 

### hear 10:2 34:6 

### heard 34:7 

### hearing 3:25 4:2 4:9 17:11 2 2 : 22. 2 2 : 2 4 23:17 32:10 

### hearings 3:10 9:5 12:16 

### help 11:14 37:21 

### helpful 9:20 13:1 13:11 18:7 29:10 29:25 33:25 

### he's 26:7 37:25 

### hole 13:2 

### holiday 15:2 16:24 31:7 

### holidays 16:19 25:25 26:1 26:7 26:8 26:9 26:16 

### honor 4 : 2 2 5 : 1 6:17 8:12 8:20 9:1 9:11 9:16 10:1 12:5 13:20 14:18 15:5 16:5 16:22 17:6 17:10 18:22 19!8 19:10 19:13 20:16 20:24 21:9 21:21 21:23 22:20 23:3 23:19 24:2 25:15 25:17 27:3 27:8 27:18 28:14 28:25 30:23 31:16 31:16 33:2 34:23 35:23 36:4 38:8 38:8 38:13 38:21 

### Honor's 9:5 

### hotel 33:12 33:18 

### hour 21:16 30:7

I 

### I"ll 3:21 10:3 I"m 5:22 

### I'd 12:10 19:19 22:10 

### idea 18:2 24:19 31:18 32:14 35:12 

### ideally 15:14 

### identified 5:9 11:2 13:18 37:24 

### identifies 10:6 10:7 

### identify 3:21 32:22 

### I'll 4:12 6:2 6:17 6:25 9:10 9:11 9:23 10:4 11:23 13:12 16:14 18:10 19:4 20:19 21:21 22:22 26:13 28:1 28:24 34:12 36:25 38:2 38:16 38:18 I'm 6:16 6:20 6:23 7:2 7:13 8:14 9:7 9:13 15:8 15:24 17:8 17:10 17:12 17:12 18:9 18:17 19:3 19:13 20:17 21:23 22:3 25:4 25:4 25:7 25:7 26:4 26:10 26:15

The ReportersGroup Stephenson,VA**www.reportersgroup~g,m.** County 

# r6c COURT:.· EPORTERS.tnc. Videography U!itlgationTechnology CourtReporting,Video &litigationTechnology www.advlegaltech.com Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page49 27:11 28:14 28:22 28:25 29:1 29:20 31:3 31:4 32:10 32:19 33:3 34:3 34:8 35:4 35:4 35:15 36:25 impossible 35:3 Inaudible 23:2 24:17 include 7:23 inconvenienced 24:11 incorporate 5:6 informal 37:12 37:14 information 6:17 10:16 10:22 13:6 24:5 28:4 28:13 28:20 30:20 34:18 36:9 informed 30:13 initial 4:13 5:8 6:3 6:11 6:21 7:8 7:15 7:17 7:18 8:15 10:6 10:15 11:5 13:5 13:17 13:23 14:21 15:15 24:23 instead 7:2 instructions 23:14 14:1

intend 23:9 23:13 intended 24:17 interest 28:10 28:11 34:14 internet 33:17 interrogatories 14:8 29:13 interrogatory 7:25 10:19 involve 10:19 involved 31:20 involves 33:17 involving 4:16 issue 22:12 22:22 24:13 27:16 29:2 29:22 30:15 31:9 34:14 36:13 36:24 issues 5:15 29:24 issuing 38:16 it's 3:9 3:23 4:4 4:11 9:20 12:6 12:7 14:14 14:18 16:24 21:8 24:9 26:16 29:9 29:25 31:11 32:8 33:14 33:15 34:13 34:15 35:7 35:9 35:13 36:12 36:16 36:17 I've 3:20 5:9 27:19 28:3 30:3 32:15

J January 8:8 17:20 17:21 18:4 18:5 18:10 18:12 27:16 30:16 31:4 31:11 Jewish 26:7 26:8 joint 4:18 Judge 3:14 7:10 16:13 18:9 judgement 5:14 judge's 18:1 July 3 : 1 9 3 : 2 4 4:1 4:4 4:6 4:21 June 4:6 justice 28:12

K kinds 5:16 11:11 24:17 29:24 33:16 33:20 33:24

L last 7:14 7:22 11:1 13:22 23:17 lastly 4:17 late 30:17 later 9:19 32:18 least 23:18 24:4 24:10 24:14 24:19 24:23 31:25 32:22 leaving 33:13 35:11 less 22:11 let's 3:16 5:3 13:21 16:16 18:16 20:5 22:5 22:12 22:21 22:23 24:3 24:25

TheReportersGroup Stephenson,VA www.reportersgroup.gm} County

## ~ 

## COUR't · EPORTERS.1nc. Videography

# ~itlgationTechnology CourtReporting.Video & litigationTechnology www.advlegaltech.com Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page50 25:6 25:21 25:22 26:5 26:17 27:10 28:17 35:25 Liberty 3 : 4 3 : 8 limited 7:24 list 4:21 22:5 22:6 22:17 23:7 23:7 23:8 27:4 28:16 32:16 listed 28:17 litigation 3:6 3:19 11:3 11:21 12:7 13:8 13:13 13:19 23:14 37:1 37:3 little 3:16 3:17 5:7 5:10 11:11 17:12 18:16 19:19 24:7 24:9 25:4 25:5 26:21 live 28:18 local 29:9 32:24 35:14 35:17 locate 9:1 9:17 located 36:12 location 3:25 4:3 4:9 25:1 log 31:21 long 23:17 loose 11:11 losing 36:13 lot 6:23 17:13

M manner 30:13 March 19:5 19:11 19:24 20:3 20:12 20:13 20:13 21:13 21:20 22:13 mark 22:10 material 5:5 5:17 7:9 14:12 22:4 materials 4:15 28:3 36:1 36:2 36:6 36:24 38:19 matter 3:3 3:17 matters 38:10 may 13:11 15:5 24:6 25:9 25:10 25:11 25:22 25:25 25:25 26:1 26:6 26:7 26:8 26:10 26:10 26:13 26:18 26:18 26:18 26:20 26:21 26:23 26:23 27:12 27:21 28:14 30:2 30:16 32:9 32:15 32:15 32:16 34:6 maybe 16:5 16:25 18:2 19:21 31:5 meals 33:18

mean 7:5 7:10 7:11 8:19 9:13 23:7 27:24 28:15 36:6 means 7:18 meat 10:18 mechanic 31:21 Memorial 25:18 25:23 merely 31:4 Mid 8:8 18:17 Mid-December 27:13 Mid-January 27:13 mind 5:22 minute 9:17 28:24 missed 4:20 4:25 modification 37:2 37:3 moment 9:1 9:11 19:13 Monday 14:22 33:13 34:24 money 33:10 33:11 month 16:20 months 35:3 morning 3:13 3:14 3:15 35:19 motion 4:16 5:10 5:12 22:8 30:22 37:4 37:11 motions 5:16 18:17 18:18 19:4 20:7 20:7 22:25 moving 16:18 32:7 32:24 37:17 myself 21:11

The ReportersGroup CcoQuntUy

# RT~EPORTERS Court Reporting.Video Stephenson.VA l.1**~** . •Inc. & LitigationTechnology www.r§J.QctersgrQ.Yp.com Vldeography LitigationTechnology**www.advlc;m~Jtecb.com** Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page51

N narrow 5:14 nature 14:15 necessarily 31:3 necessary 17:2 neither 26:9 nights 33:12 note 4:12 16:14 18:10 20:22 25:18 27:19 31:5 36:25 37:13 nothing 38:7 November 8:3 14:25 15:2 15:11 15:12 15:24 16:3 16:6 34:11 35:18 35:24 38:18 NTSB 31:20

0 objecting 31:4 objections 31:14 observer 3:12 37:25 observes 26:7 obviously 2 9 : 2 October 7:21 14:5 14:11 14:24 34:4 34:10 34:16 36:2 36:22 offer 23:13 office 3:10 3:11 4:14 4:15 27:22 37:20 37:25 Oh 19:22 20:24 okay 4 : 2 4 5 : 2 6:14 8:13 10:4 11:18 12:19 14:16 14:20 14:24 15:17 16:14 17:17 17:18 19:2 19:11 20:3 20:5 20:20 21:2 22:21 23:15 23:16 24:3 25:5 25:23 26:5 26:11 26:17 27:6 27:9 30:2 31:13 32:9 34:3 34:16 35:22 35:24 36:20 36:22 38:14 open 25:10 25:10 25:1121:16

26:16

32:19 34:20

opinion 13:1 opposing 10:16 23:12 28:7 37:18 oral 5:16 20:6 20:8 37:19 order 3:18 11:21 13:13 23:14 37:2 37:4 37:10 38:1 38:3 38:16 others 32:16 ought 14:23 outs 25:12 outside 35:14

p page 3:22 6:2 6:2 8:9 8:22 pare 29:12 partial 5:13 Particularly 12:22 13:2 29:7 parties 3:6 4:18 5:20 7:15 7:17 10:23 13:23 24:6 24:18 24:20 26:20 28:11 29:4 29:5 29:10 29:15 30:9 30:11 36:15 party 18:1 23:12 28:7 35:17 36:13 36:23 37:17 37:18 Passover 19:21 paying 29:8 33:21 penalty 9:5 12:16 people 11:3 12:25 13:3 13:7 27:14 32:15 36:12 per 23:13 33:15 period 16:1 phase 30:20 phases 5:9 13:18 phone 9:9 10:2 38:3 pick 10:3 plan 4:19 8:10

TheReportersGroup ccoountuy

# RT~EPORTERS CourtReporting,Video Stephenson,VA I'**~** •Inc. &litigationTechnology www.reportersgroup.com Videography LitigationTechnology www.advlegaltech.com Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160Jordan·SpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA.22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20,2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page52 planning 6:7 6:10 24:12 28:5 29:17 29:19 plate 11:10 please 8:25 9:17 plenty 34:5 point 12:10 20:18 24:12 25:14 32:1 32:22 34:4 35:11 pointing 25:22 pops 11:7 portions 12:11 position 17:4 23:25 possible 22:12 30:16 31:8 37:21 37:22 potatoes 10:18 potentially 30:18 practice 9 : 4 10:18 11:3 12:15 13:8 predict 35:2 35:4 prefer 29:4 36:11 preference 20:15 21:19 21:22 preferences 21:7 preferred 35:14 pre-hearing 26:25 Premarked 23:13 premature 29:21 present 3:10 pretrial 5:10 20:9 pretty 20:10 31:18 32:14 35:3 prevail 22:7 prevent 25:13 prior 35:11 pro 30:22 probably 17:7 22:13 problem 12:14 13:16 17:11 20:22 31:11 32:7 32:17 36:20 37:9 problems 24:22 procedural 3:17 15:19 15:23 37:1 procedure 9 :13 12:9 12:12 12:15 12:22 process 5:19 10:10 10:12 12:21 13:19 produce 33:3 production 7:25 10:19 prohibited 36:10 proposal 17:22 propose 7:21 16:22 18:1 proposed 4:18 5:3 5:24 8:10 22:5 proposing 29:5 provide 7:6 10:9 13:10 23:11 28:19 34:17 provided 23:13 24:6 push 16:10 17:20 18:3 pushing 18:6 31:14 put

...I'll 18:10

Q question 12:10 15:6 23:4 26:24 questions 5:18 11:4 12:4 38:1 38:6 quickly 3:22 quite 13:1 33:4 quote 35:6

R radically 29:16 raised 24:23 rather 19:19 22:11 reach 36:23 realized 20:16 really 20:10

reason 22:7 24:8 31:17 reasonable 33:15 34:15 received 3:20 28:4 recommend 10:4 recommendations

TheReportersGroup CcoQuntUy

# RT~EPQRTERS CourtReporting,Video Stephenson,VA I-'**~** •Inc. &litigationTechnology www.et=portersgroup.com Videography litigationTechnology

. www.aclvlegaltech.com Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page53 5:4 record 3:3 38:20 referring 9:6 regarding 36:9 37:5 38:18 regulation 11:20 regulations 12:21 12:24 13:3 religious 25:25 replies 20:12 reply 4:7 19:5 19:12 Reporter 10:2 17:10 reports 6:1 10:9 represented 3:7 3:9 request 4:11 4:13 6:3 6:22 6:24 7:15 7:17 7:24 10:19 10:20 13:5 14:2 14:15 16:17 16:19 17:2 28:8 requesting 14:8 18:3 requests 6:8 7:23 7:25 8:2 10:22 13:24 14:7 17:14 18:12 18:15 37:2 required 4:15 10:9 reschedule 37:23 resolution 29:11 resolve 10:24 12:18 34:14 37:14 respond 7:6 7:17 14:1 32:3 respondent 3:8 3:24 4:4 4:7 4:10 respondents 33:22 respondent's 3:25 4:2 4:7 4:8 responding 18:5 18:14 response 4:2 4:8 4:11 6:25 37:6 37:7 responses 6:11 6:18 7:10 7:11 8:1 14:22 31:6 32:2

resume 23:11 review 30:10 round-trip 33:10 route 9:23 rudimentary 8:19 rule 3:19 8:23 9:3 9:15 9:20 9:23 10:12 11:16 12:20 rules 9:4 9:8 9:12 9:13 11:19 12:9 12:14 12:15 12:22 12:23 14:10 ruling 29:22



## s schedule 5:4 5:12 5:19 5:23 5:25 15:20 15:23 27:12 37:23 scheduled 35:7 schedules 27:15 scheduling 3:6 3:19 4:18 37:4 scope 10:16 screwy 25:5 second 9:10 22:4 30:1 section 11:22 12:23 seeking 35:17

seems 19:18 24:9 29:21 send 6:10 14:12 sending 37:1

sense 8:11 30:21 31:2 34:1 sent 11:21 23:14 September 3:2 3:5 4:17 6:4 6:21 7:1 7:5 7:13 7:16 13:22 13:25 27:24 30:2

serve 7:6 7:8 7:22 13:23 14:6 14:15 served 4:6 service 37:6 serving 16:23 setting 3:18 10:20

TheReportersGroup countuy

# R't~EPORTERS.Inc. CourtReporting.Video Stephenson,VA**~** &LitigationTechnology**~reportersgroup.com** Videography LitigationTechnology**~vlegaltech.com** Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page54 settled 31:22 set-up 5:7 shaping 24:16 short 23:9 shorten 6:25 shortly 22:3 31:9 sides 10:16 sights 10:8 significant 24:8 simply 4:12 sister 31:19 sitting 3:11 six 8:3 14:25 35:2 Smith 3:11 37:24

someone 34:6

sooner 27:23 30:18 30:18 31:3 sorry 7 :13 9 :13 17:12 25:4 28:15 28:22 28:25 34:8 sort 31:7 sought 13:6 sounds 6:22 12:1 13:24 15:12 19:8 27:24 32:21 speak 11:10 speaker 10:2 specific 10:22 10:23 12:25 specifically 8:18 10:6 11:25 13:18 24:15 28:5 Spring 20:4 stage 8:5 11:10 stand 30:7 standard 21:17 33:8 35:10 37:1 start 6:2 7:20 26:19 26:23 started 29:23 starting 6:5 8:13 11:13 15:4 19:7 23:16 25:3 38:4 starts 10:17 statement 23:9 32:5 32:25 status 20:9 statutory 9:15 stay 33:19 35:10 staying 13:15 33:13 stipulate 32:23 stipulations 24:21 29:12 Stuart 3:9 submission 22:16 submit 22:10 23:11 suddenly 11:7 sufficient 15:3 19:6 suggest 5:22 17:19 25:8 32:19 suggested 28:7 suggestion 3:25 4:2 4:8 24:24 28:16 suggestions 5:11 swmnaries 6 : 1 swmnary 5 :14 supervisors 27:20 supplemental 5:9 8:5 8:6 8:16 11:1 11:4 11:10 13:17 15:10 16:1 16:2 16:16 16:23 17:14 18:3 18:11 18:13 18:14 18:20 36:9 36:24 support 30:22 suppose 35:15

sure 3:23 15:7 23:5 26:11 26:15 33:4 surprise 11:12

T taking 18:13 talk 3:16 3:17 5:3 11:24 13:21 16:16 18:16 22:6 22:21 22:23 24:7 24:25 25:6 27:10 27:14 35:25 37:4 37:18 talk. . . I 2.0: 5 talking 8:14 9:7 9:12 28:21 28:23 29:20 33:18 36:11 38:17

The ReportersGroup CcoQuntUy

## RTrliEPORT.ERS courtReporting,Video Stephenson,VA I'**~** . •Inc. & LitigationTechnology**www.rea:mrter~.~** Vldeography

. LitigationTechnology www.advtega!tech,com Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.CountyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313INTHE MATTEROF LIBERTYFOUNDATION September20, 2012 Case Ref#16895-1 Page55 talks 10:13 37:2 telephone 20:8 20:14 27:16 35:25 38:23 TELEPHONIC 3:1 tenor 29:14 tentative 14:5 tentatively 32:22 terms 4:21 8:14 24:4 24:16 24:18 24:20 25:1 29:5 29:20 30:11 35:16 territory 15:22 testimonial 29:12 testimony 10:11 14:9 23:10 24:21 th 24:11 thank 5 : 2 5 : 5 11:15 12:1 25:21 31:2 34:3 38:9 38:14 38:21 38:22 Thanksgiving 15:2 that's 3:23 4:22 6:4 6:12 13:6 13:7 15:11 18:19 19:12 20:1 27:25 28:10 29:2 29:19 35:3 35:15 35:17 37:9 throughout 10:10 Thursday 3:5 33:13 ticket 33:10 35:8 till 6:24 time-line 5:20 today 3:5 3:12 6:11 29:15 37:25 38:6 38:15 38:16 tomorrow 6:4 6:12 6:18 6:24 7:2 7:13 14:4 14:22 32:3 38:17 track 5:23 25:23 tracks 12:21 transfer 27:21 transportation 33:20 travel 25:18 26:22 26:23 27:14 29:8 trial 5:4 5:15 24:16 25:13 tried 5:6 triggered 11:4 trouble 13:16 trump 28:8 try 3:21 7:12 12:18 13:9 21:12 32:20 37:14 trying 10:23 Tuesday 33:13 34:24 turns 30:4 tweak 26:21 twice 11:22 types 5:14 20:6 typically 5:11 29:3



### u understand 30:16 30:24 38:2 understanding 8:19 15:1 15:21 unless 4:16 34:6 updated 23:10 upon 30:10 usually 26:19 utilize 11:18 11:19 12:23



### v variety 3:20

venue 3:18 22:22 24:5 24:5 24:14 24:18 24:23 27:17 27:20 27:23 28:3 28:8 29:2 29:10 29:20 29:22 30:11 30:15 30:22 31:8 36:13 36:24 38:18

venues 24:7 27:11 29:4

verses 10:17 view 13:13



## w waiting 6:16 wasn't 7:13 28:21 34:9

TheReportersGroup ccoountuy

# R'T'~·EPORTERS CourtReporting,VidEo Stephenson,VA 1.4**~** . •Inc. & LitigationTechnology www.repoctersgrgyp.com Videography litigationTechnology www.adviEgaltech.com Corporate: HistoricJordanSprings t 1160JordanSpringsRoad t Stephenson, VA22656 800.262.8777 www.countyCourtReporters.com 877.837.8313