From: Mahesh P. Sampat [mailto: maheshsampat@bellsouth.net] Sent: Wednesday, October 26, 2011 3:24 PM To: Richard Parker; Kenneth Winder; Bruce RHirsch Cc: phopkinson@hvolt.com; Aaron.Meyers@cooperin dustries.com; adelaski@standardsasap.org; ahofmann@publicpower.org; Aris Marantan; artr osenfeld@gmail.com; august.esch@gmail.com; BermanEconomics@gmail.com; Brian Coffey; bsmith@fed eralpacific.com; Chris Boulduc; Caitlin Johnson; carlos.gaytan@ge.com; carlosgsiqueiros@eaton.c om; chad.kennedy@us.schneider-electric.com; charlied@uus.org; chuck.simmons@pgnmail.com; clark.silcox@nema.org; cstephens@neea.org; Daniel.Cohen@hq.doe.gov; dave.millure@met glas.com; DYoung@energy-solution.com; eduardorobles@eaton.com; Eric.Petersen@akst eel.com; gbf1@pge.com; gjrosenquist@lbl.gov; greg.coulter405@gmail.com; James.Lass@c leco.com; Jennifer.Tiedeman@hq.doe.gov; Jeremiah.Freeman@ee.doe.gov; jerry.corkran@coo perindustries.com; jerry.schoen@aksteel.com; jhodge@howard-ind.com; Jim.cree vy@nema.org; Jim.Raba@ee.doe.gov; jmauer@standardsasap.org; john.caskey@nema.org; john.cymb alsky@ee.doe.gov; jrossetti@mlgw.org; kcoughlin@lbl.gov; mark.stoering@xcelenergy.com; Matthew Nardotti; maxinesavitz@aol.com; mhyland@appanet.org; Michael Rivest; mwaltner@nrdc.org; Paul.Ryan@hitmet.com; phil@pjharter.com; pkumar@publicpower.org; Raymond.Polinski@at imetals.com; rgreeson@federalpacific.com; richardparkerdc@gmail.com; rick.anderso n@faypwc.com; robert.saint@nreca.coop; robert.vanbuskirk@ee.doe.gov; rroy@nrdc.org ; ScottB@lvmetals.com; snadel@aceee.org; srosenstock@eei.org; tballo@earthjustice.org; Te ckman@nwcouncil.org; thomas.patzner@us.schneiderelectric.com; vijay.tendulkar@onyxpower.com; Zhimei Luo; Ken Winder Subject: RE: Replacement Cost for Transformer Pole

Hello Bruce: Thank you for your explanation... Sorry for little delay in respons e, I was traveling. I can certainly understand i ssues dealing with changing tran sformers where access is limited such as "back lot" services... hopefully these si tuations are limited to "older" systems and p erhaps are smaller part of your entire system. Now coming to Pole change -out issue... As I understand, ther e are two major considerations that could lead to pole change-out...

1. Height: If the height of the transformer increas es then that could lead to changing to "Taller" poles if the additional height creates encroachment issue... 2. Weight: If combined load imposed by "all" users exceeds pole strength.

As for 1st issue, as transformer's efficien cy increases, generally unit' s "foot print" increases (tank diameter may increase) and height decreas es... The reason for this is that due to higher efficiency (lower Losses) "le ss cooling" surface is needed... As for 2nd issue, higher efficiency does results in higher weight due to additional materials... but as Wes's analysis has shown that this in crease in weight can be "minimized" if the manufacturer is willing to cha nge the core material... per his an alysis, weight increase can belimited to less than 15% for 30% reduction in losses... Hopefully, in most cases you will have that much margin... Hope this "Transformer De signer's" perspective is helpful... Thank you. Best Regards, Mahesh Sampat EMS Consulting 706-549-8155

--- On Mon, 10/24/11, Hirsch, Bruce R <Bruce.R.Hirsch@bge.com > wrote: From: Hirsch, Bruce R < Bruce.R.Hirsch@bge.com > Subject: RE: Replacement Cost for Transformer Pole To: "'Mahesh P. Sampat'" < maheshsampat@bellsouth.net >, "Richard Parker" < richardparkerdc@gmail.com >, "Kenneth Winder" < kwinder@mleainc.com > Cc: " phopkinson@hvolt.com " < phopkinson@hvolt.com >,

" Aaron.Meyers@cooperindustries.com " < Aaron.Meyers@cooperindustries.com >,

" adelaski@standardsasap.org " < adelaski@standardsasap.org >, " ahofmann@publicpower.org " < ahofmann@publicpower.org >, " amarantan@navigant.com " < amarantan@navigant.com >,

" artrosenfeld@gmail.com " < artrosenfeld@gmail.com >, " august.esch@gmail.com " < august.esch@gmail.com >, " BermanEconomics@gmail.com " < BermanEconomics@gmail.com >, " brian.coffey@navigant.com " < brian.coffey@navigant.com >, " bsmith@federalpacific.com " < bsmith@federalpacific.com >, "Chris Boulduc" < cabolduc@lbl.gov >, " Caitlin.Johnson@navigant.com " < Caitlin.Johnson@navigant.com >, " carlos.gaytan@ge.com " < carlos.gaytan@ge.com >,

" carlosgsiqueiros@eaton.com " < carlosgsiqueiros@eaton.com >, " chad.kennedy@us.schneiderelectric.com " < chad.kennedy@us.schneider-electric.com >, " charlied@uus.org " < charlied@uus.org >, " chuck.simmons@pgnmail.com " < chuck.simmons@pgnmail.com >,

" clark.silcox@nema.org " < clark.silcox@nema.org >, " cstephens@neea.org " < cstephens@neea.org >, " Daniel.Cohen@hq.doe.gov " < Daniel.Cohen@hq.doe.gov >,

" dave.millure@metglas.com " < dave.millure@metglas.com >, " DYoung@energy-solution.com " < DYoung@energy-solution.com >, " eduardorobles@eaton.com " < eduardorobles@eaton.com >,

" Eric.Petersen@aksteel.com " < Eric.Petersen@aksteel.com >, " gbf1@pge.com " < gbf1@pge.com >, " gjrosenquist@lbl.gov " < gjrosenquist@lbl.gov >,

" greg.coulter405@gmail.com " < greg.coulter405@gmail.com >, " James.Lass@cleco.com " < James.Lass@cleco.com >, " Jennifer.Tiedeman@hq.doe.gov " < Jennifer.Tiedeman@hq.doe.gov >, " Jeremiah.Freeman@ee.doe.gov " < Jeremiah.Freeman@ee.doe.gov >, " jerry.corkran@cooperindustries.com "< jerry.corkran@cooperindustries.com >, " jerry.schoen@aksteel.com " <

jerry.schoen@aksteel.com >, " jhodge@howard-ind.com " < jhodge@howard-ind.com >,

" Jim.creevy@nema.org " < Jim.creevy@nema.org >, " Jim.Raba@ee.doe.gov " < Jim.Raba@ee.doe.gov >, " jmauer@standardsasap.org " < jmauer@standardsasap.org >,

" john.caskey@nema.org " < john.caskey@nema.org >, " john.cymbalsky@ee.doe.gov " <

john.cymbalsky@ee.doe.gov >, " jrossetti@mlgw.org " < jrossetti@mlgw.org >,

" kcoughlin@lbl.gov " < kcoughlin@lbl.gov >, " mark.stoering@xcelenergy.com " < mark.stoering@xcelenergy.com >, " matthew.nardotti@navigant.com " < matthew.nardotti@navigant.com >, " maxinesavitz@aol.com " < maxinesavitz@aol.com >,

" mhyland@appanet.org " < mhyland@appanet.org >, " mrivest@navigant.com " < mrivest@navigant.com >, " mwaltner@nrdc.org " < mwaltner@nrdc.org >,

" Paul.Ryan@hitmet.com " < Paul.Ryan@hitmet.com >, " phil@pjharter.com " < phil@pjharter.com >, " pkumar@publicpower.org " < pkumar@publicpower.org >,

" Raymond.Polinski@atimetals.com " < Raymond.Polinski@atimetals.com >,

" rgreeson@federalpacific.com " < rgreeson@federalpacific.com >, " richardparkerdc@gmail.com " < richardparkerdc@gmail.com >, " rick.anderson@faypwc.com " < rick.anderson@faypwc.com >,

" robert.saint@nreca.coop " < robert.saint@nreca.coop >, " robert.vanbuskirk@ee.doe.gov " < robert.vanbuskirk@ee.doe.gov >, " rroy@nrdc.org " < rroy@nrdc.org >, " ScottB@lvmetals.com " < ScottB@lvmetals.com >, " snadel@aceee.org " < snadel@aceee.org >, " srosenstock@eei.org " < srosenstock@eei.org >, " tballo@earthjustice.org " < tballo@earthjustice.org >,

" Teckman@nwcouncil.org " < Teckman@nwcouncil.org >, " thomas.patzner@us.schneiderelectric.com " < thomas.patzner@us.schneider-electric.com >, " vijay.tendulkar@onyxpower.com " < vijay.tendulkar@onyxpower.com >, " zhimei.luo@navigant.com " < zhimei.luo@navigant.com >, "Ken Winder" < kwinder@mleainc.com > Date: Monday, October 24, 2011, 10:20 AM Mahesh,

The answer to your question will probably be all over the map. In reality, utilities are governed by the pole loading standards as set forth in the NESC. WE build our system to meet wind or ice loading requirements. The area of the Country we are in determines how much loading we can put on a pole and still met the standards. Company practices including third part attachments and storm hardening requirements will also affect when a pole needs to be changed. Essentially anytime a change is made on the pole (either a change in equipment or an addition of equipment) the pole loading is checked to make sure it does not exceed the Code requirements. Thus, changing a transformer with a heavier transformer will trigger a review and possibly a pole change-out.

Because we were purchasing transformers on a TOC basis (A/B factors), the 1-1-2010 DOE requirements had minimum effect on the size of our single ratio transformers. Our dual ration transformers (13kV/4kV primary), however, were greatly affected with respect to weight and size. The majority of cases where we need to replace a dual ratio transformer, require us to change the pole. The issue is compounded on “lot line” work where we cannot get a truck to the location. In these cases, men must manually pull the transformer up the pole to set it. This classof transformers is where we have started doing more refurbishment of used units to help resolve the replacement issues.

We are also concerned of the increase in weight with respect to our truck capacities. Our Digger/Derricks which are used primarily for pole replacement but can also be used to lift a transformer are rated at 1,590 lbs. max. Our bucket trucks, which we buy equipped with a jib for lifting equipment, are our primary truck used for lifting transformers. They are rated from 660 lbs to 2,000 lbs. max depending on how far the jib is extended. As transformers get heavier, the ability to use of a truck to set transformers is lost thus driving up transformer replacement costs to “lot line” type levels as discussed in a previous email.

Finally, I would like to restate my concern with transformer size. When we talk size problems most people think of the vault and network type transformers. While these are a concern, my main concern is the size of pole type transformers. We in Baltimore (and I assume most large cities throughout the US) constantly battle to maintain safety clearances from other utilities on our poles and also from public infringement on the safety separations set by Code. In a congested city like Baltimore, even minimal changes in the size of a transformer can lead to major work to ensure the safety clearances are maintained. I know the goals are to improve air quality, but the certain death from electrocution is an even more ominous affect that could result from the changes being proposed.

Bruce

From: Mahesh P. Sampat [ mailto:maheshsampat@bellsouth.net ] Sent: Thursday, October 20, 2011 1:10 PM To: Richard Parker; Kenneth Winder Cc: phopkinson@hvolt.com ; Aaron.Meyers@cooperindustries.com ; adelaski@standardsasap.org ; ahofmann@publicpower.org ; amarantan@navigant.com ; artrosenfeld@gmail.com ; august.esch@gmail.com ; BermanEconomics@gmail.com ; brian.coffey@navigant.com ; Hirsch, Bruce R; bsmith@federalpacific.com ; Chris Boulduc; Caitlin.Johnson@navigant.com ; carlos.gaytan@ge.com ; carlosgsiqueiros@eaton.com ; chad.kennedy@us.schneider-electric.com ; charlied@uus.org ; chuck.simmons@pgnmail.com ; clark.silcox@nema.org ; cstephens@neea.org ; Daniel.Cohen@hq.doe.gov ; dave.millure@metglas.com ; DYoung@energy-solution.com ; eduardorobles@eaton.com ; Eric.Petersen@aksteel.com ; gbf1@pge.com ; gjrosenquist@lbl.gov ; greg.coulter405@gmail.com ; James.Lass@cleco.com ; Jennifer.Tiedeman@hq.doe.gov ; Jeremiah.Freeman@ee.doe.gov ; jerry.corkran@cooperindustries.com ; jerry.schoen@aksteel.com ; j hodge@howard-ind.com ; Jim.creevy@nema.org ; Jim.Raba@ee.doe.gov ; jmauer@standardsasap.org ; j ohn.caskey@nema.org ; john.cymbalsky@ee.doe.gov ; jrossetti@mlgw.org ; kcoughlin@lbl.gov ; mark.stoering@xcelenergy.com ; matthew.nardotti@navigant.com ; maxinesavitz@aol.com ; mhyland@appanet.org ; mrivest@navigant.com ; mwaltner@nrdc.org ; Paul.Ryan@hitmet.com ; phil@pjharter.com ; pkumar@publicpower.org ; Raymond.Polinski@atimetals.com ; rgreeson@federalpacific.com ; richardparkerdc@gmail.com ; rick.anderson@faypwc.com ; robert.saint@nreca.coop ; robert.vanbuskirk@ee.doe.gov ; rroy@nrdc.org ; ScottB@lvmetals.com ;snadel@aceee.org ; srosenstock@eei.org ; tballo@earthjustice.org ; Teckman@nwcouncil.org ; thomas.patzner@us.sc hneider-electric.com ; vijay.tendulkar@onyxpower.com ; zhimei.luo@navigant.com ; Ken Winder Subject: Re: Replacement Cost for Transformer Pole

Hello Ken:

Thank you for developing this info... It looks like DOE wasn't too far off in assuming cost of $2000/per pole change out...

The only other remaining question left that needs addressing is...

"When" does pole need to be changed? IE : What are "Engineering Rules/Limits" that result in pole change out...

Once we know that, we/DOE can estimate change-out frequency...

Thank you.

Best Regards,

Mahesh

--- On Wed, 10/19/11, Kenneth Winder <kwinder@mleainc.com > wrote:

From: Kenneth Winder < kwinder@mleainc.com > Subject: Replacement Cost for Transformer Pole To: "Richard Parker" < richardparkerdc@gmail.com >Cc: phopkinson@hvolt.com , Aaron.Meyers@cooperindustries.com , adelaski@standardsasap.org , ahofmann@publicpower.org , amarantan@navigant.com , artrosenfeld@gmail.com , august.esch@gmail.com , BermanEconomics@gmail.com , brian.coffey@navigant.com , bruce.r.hirsch@bge.com , bsmith@federalpacific.com , cabolduc@lbl.gov , Caitlin.Johnson@navigant.com , carlos.gaytan@ge.com , carlosgsiqueiros@eaton.com , chad.kennedy@us.schneider-electric.com , charlied@uus.org , chuck.simmons@pgnmail.com , clark.silcox@nema.org , cstephens@neea.org , Daniel.Cohen@hq.doe.gov , dave.millure@metglas.com , DYoung@energy-solution.com , eduardorobles@eaton.com , Eric.Petersen@aksteel.com , gbf1@pge.com , gjrosenquist@lbl.gov , greg.coulter405@gmail.com , James.Lass@cleco.com , Jennifer.Tiedeman@hq.doe.gov , Jeremiah.Freeman@ee.doe.gov , jerry.corkran@cooperindustries.com , j erry.schoen@aksteel.com , jhodge@howard-ind.com , Jim.creevy@nema.org , Jim.Raba@ee.doe.gov , jmauer@standardsasap.org , john.caskey@nema.org , j ohn.cymbalsky@ee.doe.gov , jrossetti@mlgw.org , kcoughlin@lbl.gov , maheshsampat@bellsouth.net , mark.stoering@xcelenergy.com , matthew.nardotti@navigant.com , maxinesavitz@aol.com , mhyland@appanet.org , mrivest@navigant.com , mwaltner@nrdc.org , Paul.Ryan@hitmet.com , phil@pjharter.com , p kumar@publicpower.org , Raymond.Polinski@atimetals.com , rgreeson@federalpacific.com , richardparkerdc@gmail.com , rick.anderson@faypwc.com , robert.saint@nreca.coop , robert.vanbuskirk@ee.doe.gov , rroy@nrdc.org , ScottB@lvmetals.com , snadel@aceee.org , srosenstock@eei.org , tballo@earthjustice.org , Teckman@nwcouncil.org , thomas.patzner@us.schneider-electric.com , vijay.tendulkar@onyxpower.com , zhimei.luo@navigant.com , "Chris Boulduc" < cabolduc@lbl.gov >, "Ken Winder" < kwinder@mleainc.com > Date: Wednesday, October 19, 2011, 8:36 PM

Richard and Committee: Attached is a spreadsheetshowing the cost to replace an existing pole in a three-phase distribution circuit with an ex isting single-phase distribution transformer mounted on it. This information was developed to estimate the cost to replace an existing pole with a new, higher strength pole required because of the increased we ight of the distribution transformer. This estimate represents the cost to do this for my Cooperative. Other Utilities will be furnishi ng this information for their systems. Kenneth A. Winder, PE

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