William G Ogilvie

2423 Beacon Dr. Salt L ake Cit y, UT 84108 (801)673
- 1382 September 25, 2013 Docket Management Facility US Department of Transportation 1200 New Jersey

Avenue, SE West Building Ground Floor Room W12
- 140 Washington, DC 20590 **Subject:** Petition for Exemption or Substitution of Military Flight Experience for Experience Requirements of FAR 141.33( a) ( 4 ) ( ii) **William George Ogilvie ATP Certificate #3190540**  Dear Sir, The FAA Administrator has demonstrated willingness to consider military flying experience as equivalent experience to civil experience in other areas of Title 14. Military flight time is counted for flight experience required to meet all of the civilian pilot certificate levels including ATP. A military

pilot operating equ ipment with a civilian ty pe designation is granted that ty pe rating on his Comme rcial Pilot or ATP certificate [ FAR 61.73 ( e) ]
. US military instructor pilots who hold a commercial pilot or airline transport pilot certificate are granted a civil flight instructor certificate upon completion of the knowledge testing of FAR 61.185. The precedent is set for awarding equivalency of experience. I present a brief history

of my assignments and experience that you may compare it to an instructor with two ye ars ’ experience as a FAR part 121 first officer, a FAR part 135 captain, or FAR part 91 S ubpart K c aptain as required b y FAR 141.33( a)(4)(ii). You will find my experience give s me the perspective necessary to relate e ach subject taught to its applicability to air carrier operations. I have operated in scheduled operations similar in scope to that of a supplemental air carrier operating under FAR part 121 and a FAR 135 or FAR part 91 subpart K captain. While Iwas not operating under company operating spec ifications created to comply with these specific regulations , my actions as Pilot in Command of a military airplane w ere governed b y documents of similar nature and scope. In most cases onl y the title of the regulation was different. The basic rules of operation in my military fl yi ng were taken directly from FARs. Approach procedure s , ATC operations, airspace rules were essentially the same as those in the civil regulations. Even crew dut y and crew rest procedures were similarly governed. Flight deck procedures were outlined and we used the same checklists and error detection/mitigation sy stems used by large aircraft operators throughout the world. Finally , theaircraft flight characteristics, navigation, communication and flight sy stems were represent ative

of those of a large transport category airplane used in air carrier and commercial operations. I served in the United States Air Force as a flight crew member for twenty
- four y ears and five months between March 1978 and August 2002. For four ye ars I served as a Test Program Navigator in DC
- 130E/H
. Upon completion of that assignment I was selected to attend Undergraduate Pilot Training at Vance AFB , OK, graduating in August 1983. My pilot flight experience includes three y ears as first officer and captain operating weather reconnaissance C
- 130s out of Anderson AFB, Guam where I led m y crews into the eye of tropical cyclones, Ty

phoons, and Hurricanes. We tracked these storms to provide forecast data to protect the US Pacific Fleet. In January

1986 I moved to Omaha, Nebraska, assigned as a first officer, captain and instructor in the C
- 21A, a military

variation of a Lear 35. Operations in Omaha were essentially the same as FAR 91 sub part K or FAR part 135 operation s . I obtained my Civilian ATP certificate while flying the Lear 35. Missions were dispatched through a central dispatch facility located at Scott AFB , Illinois. A ty

pical day of flight operation was three to five legs that often took the airplane from coast to coast
. We moved high ranking military and civilians to and from both civil and military fields. In m y six y ears and two assignments operating the Lear 35, Itransited a variet y of airports including: Andrews AFB, Denver Stapleton, Chicago Midway ; Chicago O'Hare; L os Angeles International; San Francisco International; Napa Valley Regional ; Cody , Wyoming ; and Billings , Montana
. We also operated medical evacuation flights and I made three trips to Howard Air Base, Panama while flying the Lear. In Oct ober 1989 I was transferred to Scott AFB in Southwest I llinois. I continued to fly the Lear 35 while serving as the Air Mobility Command Operational Support Aircraft Safet y Program Director. My primary duties included assisting in the investigation of major aircraft acci dents involving C
- 141, C
- 130 , C
- 5, and C
- 135 aircraft world
- wide. I had primary responsibility

for the investigation of two major accidents involving a VC
- 137 (Boeing 707) and a C
- 9 (DC
- 9)
. I saw first
- hand the influence of the then new concepts of CRM and championed the development of the concept within the Air Mobility Command. In June 1993 I was rewarded with a chance to continue flying. I was reassigned to Tucson, Arizona and assigned to fly as captain of electronic warfare C
- 130s. The mission of this airplane was to place the radio jamming capability of the airplane in position to support friendl y forces b y denying the enem y the use of radio communications. Training was dispatched from the squadron. Operationally

we were tasked for missions in th e theater Air Tasking Order. In two combat assignments I was based in Avaino, Ital y , flying over Bosnia and in Dhahran , Saudi Arabia , fl yi ng over Iraq. During the assignment to Saudi Arabia I also served on the battle staff in the Air Operations Center cr eating the Air Tasking Order
. The mission of the EC
- 130 was such that we operated at altitudes above cruise ceiling at maximum endurance speeds. The airplane is one of onl y a few C
- 130s equipped for air to air refueling resulting in long crew dut y perio ds and extended flight times. We operated the airplane on the edge of its capability and on the edge of human endurance.April 1998, at the end of my 20th y ear of service I was selected to move to Travis AFB, California where I operated the C
- 5 Galax y as first officer and captain. We operated similar to a FAR 121 supplemental air carrier operating the C
- 5 along scheduled routes and on special airlift missi ons moving outsized cargo world
- wide
. I moved the P resident ’ s motorcade vehicles, Marine 1 SH60 helicopters, and mundane things like light carts. On other missions Imoved 200,000 lbs
. of assorted boxes. I committed to an additional four y ears to obtain the assignment flying the C
- 5 but ended up serving four y ears and five months due to the events of September 11, 2001. During that time period the C
- 5 navigation sy stems were upgraded from a triple inertial reference unit s ys tem to a FMS sy stem with GPS integrated with the existing inertial sy stems. I flew both configurations. During m y last six y ears of service in the US Air Force I obtained a certified flight instructor certificate with single, multi
- engine and instrument airplane ratings. In September 2002 I retired and began teaching aviation at the colleg iate level at Utah Valley State College and moved to my present facult y position at Westminster College in Salt L ake City , Utah in 2006. S ince 200 2 , I have taught courses on : large airplane sy stems, flight theory , human factors, meteorology , aircraft cert ification, advanced aviation phy siology , aircraft dispatch procedures and the FAR 141 certified pilot certification ground schools for private, instrument, commercial and multi
- engine airplane. I have taken up the sport of soaring. In November 2011 I add ed glider to both m y commercial pilot privileges and my flight instructor privileges. I respectfully

submit my

experience as an appropriate substitute for the requirements set forth in FAR 141.33(a)(4)(ii). They give me the perspective necessary to relate e ach subject taught to its applicability

to air carrier operations
. I will provide a cop y of m y official military flight time record summary

page and a copy

of m y DD214 as evidence of my experience upon your request. And I request a letter of exemption permitting me to act as an authorized instructor in an FAA Approved FAR 141 Airline Transport Pilot Certification Training Program. Respectfully , William G. Ogilvie, Maj. USAF (Ret.) Aviation Instructor, ATP B737, L382, LR
- Jet Westminster College , Salt Lak e City bogilvie@westminstercollege.edu (801)832
- 2626 (801)673
- 1382