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1 U.S. ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION AGENCY

2

3 PUBLIC HEARING

4 COMMENTS ON PROPOSED CLIMATE, AIR QUALITY, AND

5 PERMITTING RULES FOR THE OIL AND NATURAL GAS

6 INDUSTRY

7

8 WEDNESDAY, SEPTEMBER 23, 2015

9

10 9:00 A.M. - 7:55 P.M.

11

12 U.S. EPA REGION 8

13 1595 Wynkoop Street

14 Denver, Colorado

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16

17

18

19

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21

ATKINSON-BAKER, INC.

22 COURT REPORTERS

(800) 288-3376

23 www.depo.com

24 Reported by: Carla D. Capritta, RPR

Registered Professional Reporter

25 File No.: A909468
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1 APPEARANCES:

2 ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION AGENCY PANEL:

3 GREG GREEN, HEARING CHAIR

DAVE COZZIE, HEARING CHAIR

4 CHERYL VETTER

AMY HAMBRICK

5 DIERDRE ROTHERY

MONICA MORALES

6 CLAUDIA SMITH

7

8 SPEAKERS:

9 Tracee Bentley Joe Salazar

Jon Goldstein Shakti

10 Kathleen Sgamma Paddy McClelland

John Loewy Su Ryden

11 Vincent Calvano Phillip Doe

Wes Wilson Barbara Mills-Bria

12 Cindy Liverance Griselda Landa-Posan

Kate Fay Meriam Johannes

13 Christine Berg Andre Gelfuso Goetz

America Sherwood Kelsey Silver

14 Robin Mann Rudolph "Rudy" Gonzales

Dirk Richter Alex Renirie

15 Daniel Tso Dulce Saenz

Ralph Motto Anne Harper

16 Cindy Borroway Eric Huber

Stan Dempsey Josh Joswick

17 Elliot Jim Eric Waeckerlin

Jim Armstrong Rhonda Peters

18 Kathy Plomer Milt Hetrick

Jesse Ulibarri Karen Dike

19 John Jacus Karen Kalavity

Alexa Ballenger R.J. Harrington

20 Camelia Feibelman Catherine Collentine

Christina Aguilar Bryce Carter

21 Cynthia Martinez Douglas Henderson

Bruce Baizel Sussy Valdez

22 Korby Bracken Audrey Mascarenhas

Eva Henry Alissa Grutze

23 Pam Eaton Jonathan Beltran

24

25
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1 SPEAKERS:

2 Jesse Prentice-Dunn

Stephanie Hsiung

3 Roger Singer

Peggy Tibbetts

4 Kristin Dickinson

Hilda Nucete

5 Sophia Guerrero-Murphy

Susan Kohut

6 Marilyn Ham

Cherry Hall

7 Casey Quinn

Chris Eaton

8 Andrew Casper

Angela Miller

9 Catherine Sundvall

Becky English

10 Kent Abernethy

Jessica Abell

11 Joan Seeman

Lauren Swain

12 Robert Alexander Field

Scott Hatfield

13 Lewis Romero

Jeff Neuman-Lee

14 Rosemary Lytle

Elizabeth Hudetz

15 Chris Applegate

Brendan Blanchard

16 Sheila Davis

Emma Bray

17 Peter Mueller

Michael Saul

18 Matt Hardwick

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20

21

22

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25
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1 P R O C E E D I N G S

2 (Commencing at 9:00 a.m.)

3 MR. GREEN: Good morning, everyone. I'm going

4 to go ahead and open up the hearing. My name is Greg

5 Green, and I'm chair of today's public hearing. I'd

6 like to thank everybody for coming today.

7 Joining me on the panel are Cheryl Vetter from

8 our Office of Air Quality Planning and Standards, on my

9 left; Amy Hambrick, also from AQPS, on my right; and Dee

10 Rothery from Region 8.

11 We're here today to hear your comments on

12 EPA's proposed rules relating to the oil and natural gas

13 sector. The specific rules are:

14 Oil and Natural Gas Sector: Emissions

15 Standards for New and Modified Sources;

16 Source Determination for Certain Emission

17 Units in the Oil and Natural Gas Sector; and

18 Review of New Sources and Modifications in

19 Indian Country: Federal Implementation Plan for

20 Managing Air Emissions from True Minor Sources Engaged

21 in Oil and Natural Gas Production from Indian Country.

22 EPA's Administrator signed the proposed rules

23 on August 18, 2015.

24 The proposed New Source Performance Standards

25 will establish methane and VOC standards for
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1 hydraulically fractured wells and require owners and

2 operators to find and repairs leaks. The proposed rule

3 also would extend emission reduction requirements

4 further downstream, covering equipment in the natural

5 gas transmission and storage segments of the industry

6 that was not regulated in the Agency's 2012 rules.

7 The proposed Source Determination Rule

8 clarifies the EPA's air permitting rules as they apply

9 to the oil and natural gas industry.

10 We also are taking comment on the proposed

11 federal implementation plan to implement the Federal

12 Minor New Source Review Program in Indian Country for

13 oil and natural gas production. That plan, known as the

14 FIP, would be used instead of site-specific Minor New

15 Source Review preconstruction permits in Indian Country.

16 It would incorporate emission limits and other

17 requirements from six EPA emissions standards, including

18 the 2015 proposed updates to the New Source Performance

19 Standards on which we are taking comment today.

20 If you would like more details on the proposed

21 rules, there are fact sheets available through our

22 registration desk downstairs.

23 Before we get started, I'd like to go through

24 a few housekeeping items and ground rules that will make

25 today's hearing run smoothly.
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1 First, please be sure you have checked in at

2 the registration desk, even if you are not planning to

3 speak today. And if you signed up to speak online or by

4 phone but haven't told us that you're here, please step

5 out to the registration desk and let the EPA staff know

6 that you've arrived.

7 I will call speakers up in pairs. When your

8 name is called, please come to the speakers' table at

9 the front of the room.

10 When I call you to speak, please state your

11 name and spell it for the court reporter. Your comments

12 will be transcribed and included in the record of

13 comments on the proposed rule.

14 It is very important that you tell us which

15 rule or rules you are speaking about.

16 Each speaker will have five minutes to give

17 comments. We have a timer light to help you know how

18 much time you have left to speak.

19 When the light turns from green to yellow,

20 that means you have one minute remaining; when it turns

21 red, that's the signal you are at five minutes and it is

22 time to stop.

23 When you are finished speaking, please remain

24 at the table until the person next to you has completed

25 his or her testimony.
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1 We are here to listen to you today; however, a

2 panel member may ask questions to clarify your comments.

3 I will then call up the next pair of speakers

4 and so on.

5 If you have brought a written copy of your

6 testimony, please give that to the staff at the

7 registration desk before you leave today. We will put

8 any written comments submitted today in the official

9 docket for the proposed rules.

10 We also have comment cards available at the

11 registration desk if you would like to submit additional

12 written comments today.

13 If you want to comment in writing later,

14 stop by the materials table near the registration desk

15 and pick up a copy of the instructions for submitting

16 written comments. Comments must be received by

17 November 17, 2015.

18 Let me assure you that EPA gives as much

19 consideration to comments we receive in writing as we do

20 to comments we receive at public hearings like this one.

21 So if you have more comments that you

22 would like to provide the EPA, please submit them by the

23 comment period deadline. Your comments will be

24 reviewed.

25 If you have any questions during the day,
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1 please see the staff at the registration desk, and

2 someone will assist you.

3 Thank you again for taking the time to share

4 your comments on the EPA's role, and let's get started.

5 So our first two speakers are Tracee Bentley

6 and Jon Goldstein. You may have to speak up a little

7 bit in the microphone to project a little bit. And

8 Ms. Bentley will go first.

9 MS. BENTLEY: Good morning. My name is Tracee

10 Bentley; T-r-a-c-e-e, B-e-n-t-l-e-y. I believe I'll be

11 addressing all of the regulations that we're speaking

12 about today.

13 MR. GREEN: Thank you.

14 MS. BENTLEY: Okay. Good morning. My name is

15 Tracee Bentley, and I'm the executive director of the

16 Colorado Petroleum Council, a division of the American

17 Petroleum Institute. API is the national trade

18 association representing all facets of the oil and

19 natural gas industry, which supports 9.8 million U.S.

20 jobs and 8 percent of the U.S. economy.

21 API has more than 625 members that includes

22 large integrated companies as well as exploration and

23 production, refining, marketing, pipeline, marine

24 businesses, and service and supply firms. Collectively

25 they provide most of the nation's energy, and many will
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1 be directly impacted by the proposed regulations we are

2 here to discuss today. In five minutes it's difficult

3 to speak substantively to the details of these reviews

4 and proposed actions; however, API intends to submit

5 detailed comments on each.

6 For my first point, our industry has

7 voluntarily led the way in its pursuit of improved

8 operations to safely maximize the recovery and capture

9 of these valuable oil and gas resources. We are

10 incentivized to do that, and many of these leading

11 technologies that have been broadly used by industry

12 were subsequently incorporated by EPA in its Natural Gas

13 STAR Program.

14 My second point: Even as U.S. oil and natural

15 gas production has surged, methane emissions have

16 declined significantly. For example, methane emissions

17 from hydraulically fractured natural gas wells have

18 fallen nearly 79 percent since 2005, and total methane

19 emissions from natural gas systems are down 11 percent

20 over the same period. These reductions have occurred

21 during a time when total U.S. gas production has

22 increased 44 percent.

23 This industry has also played a significant

24 role in the 27-year lows in power sector CO2 emissions

25 we see today.
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1 These trends are indicative of what our

2 industry, when given the freedom to innovate, can

3 achieve to improve the environment and our nation's

4 energy security. What our industry has and will

5 continue to achieve under the current regulatory system,

6 without directly regulating methane, dwarfs the emission

7 reductions EPA has estimated in these proposed rules.

8 My third point is that directly regulating

9 methane as proposed in the NSPS rule is unnecessary.

10 The 2012 final rule indirectly regulates methane by

11 regulating natural gas as a surrogate for VOCs. Since

12 methane is the primary constituent of natural gas, there

13 are no additional emission reductions that will occur

14 from replacing the surrogate regulatory concept with

15 direct regulation of methane; therefore, EPA should

16 continue the practice of indirectly regulating methane

17 through the use of natural gas as a surrogate for VOCs.

18 My fourth point: We urge EPA not to get in

19 the way of the success story, by developing one-size20 fits-all regulatory solutions. Our industry is big,

21 it's complex, and our operations vary substantially

22 across the nation. As we learned in the development of

23 the 2012 NSPS rules, EPA should exercise caution in the

24 development of these rules, to allow operational

25 flexibility as it seeks one-size-fits-all regulatory
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1 solutions. Industry must be able to comply with the

2 requirement of these new rules. In the 2012 NSPS rule,

3 EPA allowed implementation for storage vessel

4 requirements to be phased in to accommodate the vast

5 number of affected facilities. EPA should consider

6 whether or not a similar compliance schedule is

7 warranted in the proposed NSPS rules.

8 We also urge EPA to accommodate operators that

9 are currently implementing leak monitoring and repair

10 requirements, whether due to existing air permits; state

11 regulations, for example Colorado's Regulation 7; or

12 voluntary commitments, to satisfy the federal rules that

13 -- federal rule requirements and minimize regulatory

14 burden for those operators.

15 Finally, we urge EPA to coordinate its efforts

16 with other agencies to avoid implementing duplicative

17 requirements that could potentially hinder the continued

18 production of the energy that our nation will continue

19 to demand. The rules we are discussing today are a

20 small slice of the pending regulations that our industry

21 is facing. EPA has also released proposed control

22 technique guidelines for implementation of the pending

23 revised ozone air quality standard and pending

24 regulatory requirements from the Department of

25 Interior's BLM on federal lands. These will also add to
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1 the cumulative impact to our industry in future

2 operations.

3 We urge EPA and the Administration to

4 coordinate their efforts and strongly encourage you to

5 extend the comment period by 60 days, to allow a minimum

6 of 30 days overlap with the proposed BLM rule. Without

7 this overlap, industry will not have the chance to

8 understand the cumulative impacts and provide meaningful

9 feedback to avoid conflicting requirements across

10 federal agencies.

11 To close, CPI and its members recognize the

12 importance of developing these valuable resources

13 responsibly; however, the last thing we need is more

14 duplicative and costly regulations that would increase

15 the cost for energy for Americans and undermine our

16 competitiveness --

17 MR. GREEN: Please wrap it up.

18 MS. BENTLEY: Thank you. -- and undermine our

19 competitiveness when the operations that will bear the

20 brunt of these regulatory impacts represent only 1.4

21 percent of total U.S. greenhouse gas emissions.

22 CPI remains committed to working with the EPA

23 and the Administration to identify additional cost24 effective control opportunities when, which implemented,

25 do not hinder our ability to provide the energy our
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1 nation will continue to demand for many years to come.

2 Thank you.

3 MR. GREEN: Thank you very much.

4 Mr. Goldstein.

5 MR. GOLDSTEIN: Thank you. My name is Jon

6 Goldstein. I'm senior energy policy manager for

7 Environmental Defense Fund. J-o-n, G-o-l-d-s-t-e-i-n.

8 On behalf of our one million members nationwide, we

9 would thank you for the opportunity to testify today on

10 this important issue.

11 You'll hear today from many voices,

12 representing many different sides of this issue. There

13 are a few key facts that I wanted to share at the outset

14 that are beyond debate.

15 Number one, methane is a very potent climate

16 pollutant. And, in fact, over the first 20 years after

17 it is emitted, pound for pound, methane has more than

18 80 times the carbon impact of carbon dioxide. If you

19 want, as I do, to address the issue of climate change in

20 our and our children's lifetimes, cutting methane

21 pollution is critical.

22 Number two, the oil and natural gas sector is

23 the largest industrial source of methane in the United

24 States. EPA estimates oil- and gas-related methane

25 emissions exceed 7 million metric tons per year,
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1 equivalent to a 20-year climate warming effect of

2 160 coal-fired power plants.

3 And, number three, there are readily available

4 low-cost technologies that can substantially cut these

5 emissions. A study by ICF International concluded that

6 the industry can cut methane emissions by 40 percent or

7 more for only one penny per thousand cubic feet of

8 natural gas produced. Because these measures capture

9 gas that would otherwise be wasted, while they reduce

10 pollution, they also have an important -- save an

11 important domestic energy resource. And at the same

12 time, these same technologies also capture other ozone13 forming and cancer-causing pollutants.

14 For these indisputable reasons, we strongly

15 support EPA's proposed standards that will for the first

16 time create national requirements to reduce dangerous

17 methane pollution and waste from the oil and gas

18 industry. However, the facts justify EPA going further

19 than its current proposal in its effort to cut methane

20 emission.

21 While inventory data provided by the oil and

22 gas industry itself indicates it is the largest

23 industrial source of methane in the U.S., the most

24 recent scientific studies suggest the amount may yet be

25 substantially higher; in fact, the most up-to-date study
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1 on methane emissions from Barnett Shale area in Texas

2 concludes that emissions from the oil and gas sector are

3 actually 50 percent higher than estimates.

4 Why the discrepancy? Scientists from EDF and

5 Reading University researchers found that the

6 underreporting of methane pollution was due, in large

7 part, to a small number of sites with extremely large

8 leaks. These so-called super-emitter sites are

9 unpredictable. They may be old or new wells, marginal

10 or large producers, and they may have been fine

11 yesterday but today show evidence of large methane leaks

12 that just cropped up.

13 Frequent leak detection and repair inspections

14 are the only way to catch and fix this problem, but the

15 proposed EPA standards only call for monitoring twice a

16 year, with opportunities for facilities to reduce the

17 frequency of monitoring even further. This is not good

18 enough. We urge EPA to finalize an LDAR program that

19 calls for at least quarterly monitoring and is not

20 subject to frequency adjustments.

21 States like Colorado and Wyoming are leading

22 -- and leading companies have recognized that more

23 frequent monitoring is necessary and cost effective.

24 And they've employed these solutions in a commonsense

25 way to help protect air quality and is consistent with
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1 economic development.

2 No state has done more to lead on adjusting

3 methane emissions than Colorado. Governor Hickenlooper

4 and his administration deserve praise for making

5 Colorado the first state in the nation to directly

6 regulate methane from the oil and gas industry. EPA

7 should recognize the requirements these states have put

8 in place as it finalizes these standards.

9 And not only is the air benefiting, Colorado's

10 economy is stronger for these actions as well. In the

11 year since Colorado enacted its rules directly

12 regulating methane, Weld County, the heart of the

13 state's drilling boom, had the country's highest job

14 growth rate.

15 These rules are also fostering a vibrant and

16 growing methane mitigation industry. According to a

17 recent report from Datu Research, Colorado ranks third

18 in the nation for clusters of the companies that make,

19 sell, and support methane-control technology, the

20 majority of which are small businesses.

21 EPA's proposed standards are an important

22 step forward, but it can and should be improved by

23 making leak detection and repair requirements at least

24 quarterly.

25 We also respectfully urge EPA to quickly take
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1 action to address emissions from existing sources, with

2 thousands of wells already out there that can also be

3 cost-effectively controlled with these same measures.

4 Again, on behalf of Environmental Defense Fund

5 and our members, thank you for the opportunity to

6 testify at today's hearing. We appreciate your

7 consideration of our comments and recommendations as you

8 finalize these standards.

9 MR. GREEN: Thank you, Mr. Goldstein. One

10 question. Were you commenting on the NSPS or all the

11 rules?

12 MR. GOLDSTEIN: All the rules.

13 MR. GREEN: All right. Thank you very much.

14 MR. GOLDSTEIN: Thank you.

15 MR. GREEN: Both of you.

16 Our next speaker is, if I pronounce this

17 right, will be Kathleen Sgamma.

18 MS. SGAMMA: Good morning.

19 MR. GREEN: Good morning.

20 MS. SGAMMA: Thank you. Kathleen Sgamma with

21 Western Energy Alliance. We represent oil and natural

22 gas producers in the West, in Colorado and across the

23 West. We are the independents, the small producers with

24 an average of 15 employees.

25 I'm going to start, really, by putting some
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1 things in perspective, because I'm going to deviate from

2 my prepared comments. What we just heard from EDF is

3 what we've been hearing from EDF for quite some time.

4 It is trying to exaggerate the issue, and so I would

5 just like to address a few things, to put things in

6 perspective. And I know you know this. I mean, I'm

7 going to be quoting from your own inventories.

8 But, you know, first of all, the industry, the

9 oil and natural gas industry, is not the largest

10 industrial source of methane in the United States.

11 According to EPA's inventory, it is agriculture, which,

12 of course, bears the question of: Why is the oil and

13 natural gas industry being singled out, as compared to

14 other industries, when we're the only industry that

15 significantly captures, and puts to beneficial use,

16 methane?

17 So I think another thing that EDF is doing to

18 exaggerate the problem is talking about how methane is

19 more potent than CO2, for example. Well, that is true,

20 but it persists in the atmosphere, of course, decades

21 less than CO2, perhaps even a hundred years less.

22 So taking that all into account, which is what

23 EPA's inventory does by converting everything into

24 carbon dioxide equivalents, of course, is that -- and

25 again, I know you know this, but we're continually
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1 hearing this from EDF -- when you put those in carbon

2 dioxide equivalents, which takes into account the

3 potency of methane compared to CO2 and other greenhouse

4 gases, methane accounts for 9.5 percent of U.S. green5 house gas emissions.

6 When you look at what the contribution is of

7 the oil and natural gas industry to overall greenhouse

8 gas emissions, it's about 3.4 percent, so 10 times less

9 than the largest source, which is, of course,

10 electricity generation.

11 And that begs another point, which is that

12 when we use more natural gas for electricity generation,

13 we achieve extremely high rates of carbon diox- -- or

14 carbon -- excuse me, climate change benefit. So by

15 using more natural gas for electricity generation, of

16 course, we have delivered more climate change benefit

17 than any other industry. Brookings Institute estimates

18 that the natural gas industry is 2.6 times more

19 effective at reducing greenhouse gas emissions than is

20 wind and 4 times more effective than solar.

21 So I think it helps to put the larger

22 perspective on the issue. If we spend too much time

23 making the production of oil and natural gas more

24 difficult, more costly, with these rules, and I'm

25 speaking to the -- the full complement of rules before
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1 EPA, then what we're doing is we're actually potentially

2 jeopardizing a much larger climate change benefit that

3 comes from the increased use of natural gas. So if we

4 focus on these very costly regulations that EPA's own

5 data show are not cost effective, buried in the rule,

6 we -- you know, we are losing sight of that larger

7 climate change benefit.

8 When EDF talks about estimates being

9 50 percent higher than previously thought, what they're

10 doing is looking at studies that are trying to get at

11 measuring methane emissions effectively. They, EDF,

12 University of Texas, and others, have done various

13 studies, and they all range from about 1.1 percent

14 leakage rates, which is EPA's current estimate, to

15 about, at the high end, 1.6. So that 50 percent higher

16 is a range of studies that are showing very low leakage

17 rates.

18 And, in fact, EDF mentions that, as long as

19 emissions are -- those leakage rates are below

20 3.2 percent, which 1.1 to 1.6 is well below 3.2, natural

21 gas still delivers a huge climate change benefit.

22 So I just wanted to put that EDF -- those

23 talking points into perspective. I see my time is up.

24 Thank you very much.

25 We do request 60 days' extra time for the
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1 comment period.

2 MR. GREEN: All right. Thank you very much.

3 Our next speakers are John Loewy and Vincent

4 Calvano. Mr. Loewy, you will go first.

5 MR. LOEWY: Thank you very much, and thank you

6 for the opportunity to comment on EPA's proposed rules

7 governing methane emissions from oil and gas operations.

8 My name is John Loewy. I live in Denver, Colorado, and

9 formerly I served as chair of the Colorado Air Quality

10 Control Commission.

11 Listening to some of the comments, since I

12 walked in, reminds me of many days I spent on the other

13 side of the table, listening to similar comments. It's

14 very interesting. It's kind of like a flashback.

15 In my role as -- formerly, as chair of the Air

16 Quality Control Commission during the 2014 state rule17 making, I helped enact strong rules that allowed

18 Colorado to become the first state in the nation to

19 tackle methane emissions in the oil and gas industry.

20 These sensible rules are helping eliminate more than a

21 hundred thousands tons of methane as well as more than

22 90,000 tons of smog-forming pollution from our air

23 annually. That's the same amount as produced on an

24 annual basis by all the cars and trucks in Colorado.

25 This morning I would like to comment briefly
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1 on the importance of regulating methane emissions and

2 Colorado's experience in doing so and to offer a couple

3 suggestions for strengthening the rules proposed here.

4 First, a couple points about methane, and

5 you've already heard a bit of this. Methane packs

6 84 times the warming power of carbon dioxide over a

7 20-year time frame. Cutting these emissions is among

8 the fastest and most cost-effective ways to reduce --

9 excuse me -- human climate impact.

10 Cutting methane emissions, based on our

11 experience, is eminently feasible and highly cost

12 effective. A study by ICF International concluded that

13 the oil and gas industry could cut methane emissions

14 40 percent for about one penny per million cubic feet.

15 Methane emissions from the oil and gas

16 industry are a huge problem nationally and here in

17 Colorado; more than 7 million tons every year, according

18 to your figures, EPA's figures. And as you heard

19 before, this has the equivalent climate impact of 160

20 coal-fired power plants.

21 Cutting methane will have significant benefits

22 to public health. The same techniques proven effective

23 in cutting methane, also reduce the emissions of

24 pollution that leads to ozone formation, which is a

25 serious public health threat.
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1 Getting these rules in place in Colorado was

2 not easy. It took leadership from our governor and a

3 willingness to work together from leading industry

4 members, environmental and public health advocates,

5 along with the expertise and dedication of the staff at

6 the Department of Public Health and Environment.

7 It was also an unprecedented level of public

8 involvement which was solicited and received.

9 It's immensely gratifying that EPA has looked

10 toward Colorado's rules as a model upon which to base

11 this current proposal. As I've indicated, though, that

12 rulemaking process was extensive, involved all the key

13 players of industry and other groups as well, and is in

14 the process of being fully implemented now, and, as I

15 understand from my former colleagues, implemented

16 smoothly.

17 While EPA's proposal is a good start, it falls

18 short of the Colorado rule in two key areas:

19 First, the EPA rule, proposed rule, does

20 nothing to regulate existing sources of many thousands

21 of oil and gas wells that have already been drilled and

22 are potential sources of harmful pollution across the

23 country; and, second, the proposed rule could be far

24 stronger on its leak detection and requirement -- and

25 repair requirements.
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1 In both these cases, EPA can look to what

2 Colorado has done to prove what's achievable.

3 Again, I thank you for the opportunity to

4 express my views today.

5 MR. GREEN: Thank you, Mr. Loewy. And I

6 assume, from your comments, that you are speaking

7 primarily towards the emissions standards for new and

8 modified sources.

9 MR. LOEWY: Yes, that's correct.

10 MR. GREEN: All right. Thank you very much.

11 Mr. Calvano.

12 MR. CALVANO: Good morning. Thank you for

13 allowing me to bring these comments before you.

14 My name is Vince Calvano. I'm from Boulder,

15 Colorado. And I'm a member of the Rocky Mountain Sierra

16 Club and also on the Policy Committee of the Colorado

17 Renewable Energy Society, but I'm here speaking today on

18 my own behalf. And I'm also here in support of the

19 methane pollution standards proposed by the EPA for the

20 oil and gas industry.

21 And I appreciate the efforts that the EPA's

22 made to increase monitoring and curbing the emissions

23 standards from both new and modified sources. But as

24 you heard, many times before me, this very real problem

25 warrants doing more and having stronger standards.
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1 The oil and gas industry is responsible for a

2 large percentage of the methane emissions, and once

3 again, the impacts that it causes call for including all

4 sources and strengthening monitoring standards,

5 including, you know, existing sources. So I'd like to

6 see the EPA's proposed rules include those as well as.

7 And the oil and gas industry also claims that

8 the emissions are trending downwards; and, if true, they

9 should embrace proposed standards and work to accelerate

10 this trend. However, we can't rely on the industry, as

11 we know, and we need the EPA to enforce strong standards

12 not just for the positive cost benefit analysis, but we

13 need strong standards because they're vitally important

14 to reduce the impact on human health and the

15 environment, in fairness to future generations.

16 Thanks.

17 MR. GREEN: Thank you, Mr. Calvano.

18 Our next speakers will be Wes Wilson and Cindy

19 Liverance. I'm sorry if I didn't say that right.

20 MS. LIVERANCE: You were close.

21 MR. GREEN: Our first speaker will be Wes

22 Wilson. Please don't forget to tell us which rule

23 you're speaking on. Thank you.

24 MR. WILSON: Well, thank you. Can you hear

25 me?
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1 MR. GREEN: Yes.

2 MR. WILSON: My name is Wes Wilson. I worked

3 for EPA, right here in this office, for 35 years as an

4 environmental engineer. I'm now retired and

5 representing Be the Change, a nonprofit organization

6 dedicated to better government here in Colorado.

7 I'm here today as a concerned citizen to

8 testify that these rules are inadequate as a remedy and

9 they're not in time to be effective.

10 You're going to use your Clean Air Act

11 authority to compel the industry to reduce methane and

12 toxic air emissions, and that should have some benefits

13 for climate stability and reducing ozone and health

14 threats. But these rules would only reduce methane and

15 VOCs, by EPA's own estimate, by about 25 percent. In

16 other words, less than a fourth of the toxic gas that's

17 emitted from oil and gas production, mostly from

18 fracking oil wells, only 25 percent will be captured.

19 Is 25 percent enough to matter?

20 To a large extent, EPA is mimicking what's the

21 experiment here in Colorado under the Clean Air, Clean

22 Jobs Act of 2010, which cut coal-fired power plants, and

23 the utilities choose to replace that with natural gas

24 plants.

25 That should, as the President and the industry
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1 allege, that conversion should, give a climate benefit,

2 but that claim is conclusively false. Here in Colorado

3 the ambient air analysis by CU and NOAA show more than

4 4 percent of the methane produced by the industry

5 escapes. In Utah the same analysis shows 9 percent;

6 shale gas methane in Marcellus would have a 12 percent

7 leakage rate. At least 4 to 9 percent we're seeing in

8 the West is very comparable to what Professors Tony

9 Ingraffea and Robert Howarth of Cornell found in 2012

10 when they estimated the life cycle emission rates

11 between 3.9 and 7.8 percent. In contrast the EPA's

12 bottom-up approach only alleges a 2.4 percent leak rate.

13 The critical question EPA has to answer: What

14 amount of methane leakage would assure that substituting

15 natural gas for coal aids climate stability and how do

16 we achieve that?

17 EPA's fact sheet shows now-dated information

18 about methane's global warming potential being 25 times

19 that of CO2 over a century, but the IPCC's last, or

20 fifth, assessment updated that to 36 times. But since

21 methane has a short atmospheric life of 12 years, the

22 IPCC specifically warned policymakers that there's no

23 scientific basis for comparing global warming potential

24 over a century. Over 20 years, methane is 86 times more

25 heat-trapping than CO2. But critically, methane has a
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1 global warming potential of 125 times in 10 years,

2 considering feedback mechanisms. Fully a threatening

3 125 times more heat is -- solar heat is retained by a

4 pound of methane, compared to a pound of CO2, in that

5 critical decade after methane escapes.

6 The EPA should adopt a 125 global warming

7 potential because that is, in fact, the amount of heat

8 retained on the globe. Therefore, unless the future

9 leak rate is less than 1 percent, then the claim that

10 natural gas is better for the climate than coal is

11 false.

12 We just heard, from Kathleen Sgamma, that the

13 EDF has published approximately 3.2 percent would still

14 be natural gas better than coal. They lowered that to

15 2.7, 2.8. Well, even that number doesn't compare

16 favorably with the 4 to 9 percent leakage rate we're

17 getting in the West, as observed by NOAA. So if these

18 rules go in, a 25 percent reduction would get us back to

19 a 3 or 7 percent leak rate, clearly higher than EDF's or

20 this 1 percent number they're using for the 10-year

21 global warming potential.

22 Now, initial studies by EDF seem to be

23 comparable, but EDF reported last month that

24 uncontrolled oil completions to be hundreds of times

25 more than EPA's inventory. Just last month, the
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1 inventor of EPA's approved methane measuring device

2 reported that this field instrument may underestimate

3 methane releases by a factor of 10 over 100. Perhaps

4 that explains why EPA's ambient measurements show

5 consistently higher leak rates than EPA's or EDF's

6 bottom-up.

7 Let me -- I want to get to VOC reduction and

8 health benefits.

9 MR. GREEN: One minute, Mr. Wilson.

10 MR. WILSON: In Colorado, epidemiological

11 studies show a 30 percent increase in birth defects for

12 residents within 10 miles of an oil or gas well. NOAA's

13 ambient air studies show 55 percent of VOC emissions

14 along the Front Range originate from the oil and gas

15 industry.

16 Colorado's rules require a bit more; however,

17 the Colorado regulations only capture about one-third of

18 the methane and VOCs. The remaining two-thirds is not

19 captured due to exemptions for existing and stripper

20 wells and the key fact that even 95 percent effective

21 flares still release both VOCs and methane. Neither the

22 state's plan nor EPA would reduce the cumulative gas

23 emissions, given this industry's expected growth.

24 As the inventor of the Peter Principle

25 recognized: Bureaucracies defend the status quo long
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1 past the time when the quo has lost its status. You're

2 defending this fossil fuel industry with these rules.

3 You can and must do better to achieve a

4 climate stability goal and the public health protection.

5 Allowing the industry to release these toxic gases is

6 harmful to children today and children of the future.

7 Thank you.

8 MR. GREEN: Thank you, Mr. Wilson.

9 Ms. Liverance.

10 MS. LIVERANCE: Hello and good morning. I am

11 Cindy Liverance, the deputy director of the American

12 Lung Association here in Colorado. And I want to thank

13 you, first of all, for taking the time to hold this

14 hearing for public comments to limit pollution and

15 improve air quality through action on methane and toxic

16 air.

17 I am not an expert on oil and gas drilling and

18 all of the pollution it creates. But ozone pollution is

19 a problem that the American Lung Association is deeply

20 concerned about, and these rules to clean up methane and

21 air toxics will help. Many of the same leaks and

22 outdated practices that lead to methane pollution also

23 pollute our air with the emissions that lead to the

24 formation of harmful ozone.

25 When methane is released into the air, VOCs
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1 are also emitted and include the carcinogen benzene,

2 which is a primary component of ozone. Ozone can cause

3 coughing, wheezing, shortness of breath, trigger asthma

4 attacks, and is linked to premature death. Children,

5 our seniors, and people with asthma, respiratory

6 disease, and heart disease are the most vulnerable to

7 this pollution.

8 Methane is also a potent heat-trapping gas; it

9 drives local climate change. Climate change is already

10 taking a toll on the lung health of millions of

11 Americans, from worsened air quality, extreme heat

12 events, wildfires, and more. And once again, climate

13 control affects the lung health of everyone but

14 especially our young and our seniors.

15 Methane pollution is not a problem that will

16 go away on its own. These proposed new methane

17 pollution standards are an important step in the right

18 direction and will begin to address the public health

19 implications of oil and gas air pollution while also

20 bringing the United States closer to its commitment to

21 reduce overall greenhouse gas emissions by 2025.

22 The great state of Colorado has already taken

23 steps to address pollution from oil and gas operations,

24 but all communities across our nation need these

25 pollution control measures. And that is why EPA
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1 regulations are important for all and existing oil and

2 gas operations.

3 In a poll conducted this past August by the

4 American Lung Association, 60 percent -- 67 percent of

5 the registered voters overwhelmingly supported the newly

6 proposed standards to cut emissions of methane and other

7 toxic chemicals from the oil and gas industry.

8 Additionally, this was with voters across

9 partisan lines, supporting these regulations. This

10 includes 86 percent of Democrats, 72 percent

11 Independents, and 47 percent Republicans. It's also

12 important to note that:

13 Voters with strong support across the nation,

14 with at least 65 percent of the voters in every region

15 in the country in favor of stricter methane standards;

16 And voters strongly support -- sided with the

17 side of regulation on methane pollution, as opposed to

18 voluntary action by oil and gas companies.

19 Statistics and polls are helpful to gauge

20 support for an issue, but we need to also remember, we

21 are talking about people and their health and the

22 benefits of breathing healthy air.

23 We urge the EPA to finalize a strong methane

24 and air toxic standard for new sources and to promptly

25 act to address the existing sources as well. The strong
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1 majority of Americans will support you. Anything less

2 shortchanges our futures, our health, and our children.

3 Thank you.

4 MR. GREEN: All right. Thank you very much.

5 Our next speakers will be Kate Fay and

6 Christine Berg. And once again, please remember to tell

7 us which rules you're addressing.

8 Kate Fay, you're first.

9 MS. FAY: Thank you. Good morning. I am Kate

10 Fay, and I represent Noble Energy as manager of

11 environmental and regulatory policy.

12 As you know, Noble, along with others, was

13 involved in the development and implementation of

14 Colorado's methane rules. Excuse me. We believe it's

15 important for EPA to learn from that experience. Noble

16 Energy will provide more detailed written comments

17 later, but for now, we have a few comments to offer

18 regarding the air rules, Colorado air rules, and the EPA

19 proposal.

20 At Noble Energy we believe that taking

21 necessary steps to keep methane in the pipe is the right

22 thing to do. Noble believes adopting methane

23 regulations in Colorado demonstrates that collaboration

24 can result in a strong and workable state-led regulatory

25 regime.
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1 The Colorado rules are tough and were designed

2 to achieve additional environmental benefits that are

3 technically and economically feasible. EPA should

4 follow Colorado's lead and support state-led regulatory

5 approaches.

6 Just as an example, additional requirements

7 contained in the EPA proposal that we were evaluating at

8 this time, would result in significantly higher

9 compliance costs for, among other things, personnel,

10 technology, inspections, recordkeeping and auditing,

11 without apparent additional value or environmental

12 benefit.

13 Colorado's demonstrated that state government

14 and the oil and natural gas industry, nongovernmental

15 organizations, and the public can and do work together

16 to achieve results that protect human health and the

17 environment while enabling responsible energy

18 development. We believe that the EPA should follow the

19 state's lead.

20 Thank you very much. I look forward to

21 working with you.

22 MR. GREEN: Thank you, Ms. Fay.

23 MS. FAY: And I'm, excuse me, speaking about

24 NSPS.

25 MR. GREEN: Thank you. Ms. Berg.
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1 MS. BERG: Thank you for the opportunity to

2 speak today, and I'm also speaking to the methane

3 emissions standards.

4 I am the mother of a two-year-old and recently

5 discovered I have one on the way. I can't tell yet.

6 I'm also the mayor of the beautiful city of Lafayette.

7 My journey this morning began as I drove my

8 child to her grandparents' house just across the border

9 of Lafayette to Erie. Erie is part of Weld County,

10 which has the distinction of hosting half the well sites

11 in the state, over 20,000 in one county. We share the

12 same air regardless of boundaries, political mindset,

13 rules and legislation. I know, all too well, the impact

14 the oil and gas drilling can have on a community, in my

15 work with families who have been impacted. The negative

16 effects of fossil fuels operations have on our land, our

17 air, and our climate are clear, and polluters need to be

18 held accountable.

19 Oil and natural gas producers in Colorado

20 wasted nearly 250,000 metric tons of methane in 2013,

21 before the state's rules were put into place. The good

22 news is, Colorado is now leading the way on clean air.

23 The even better news is, the Environmental Protection

24 Agency is beginning to move in that direction. While I

25 support the EPA taking action to preserve air quality
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1 and protect public health, they can and should do more

2 to limit methane and other pollutants coming from oil

3 and gas wells.

4 Colorado is the case study on how strong

5 methane protections can co-exist with a strong economy.

6 Our economy expanded faster than expected last year, one

7 year after increased protections were finalized.

8 Two years ago Colorado finalized the best-in9 the-nation methane protections for oil and gas

10 development. Colorado's air protection rules are the

11 equivalent to taking all the cars and trucks in Colorado

12 off the road. The Colorado rules cut more than 100,000

13 tons of methane from the atmosphere; that's the same as

14 8 million tons of carbon.

15 Innovation is the key. The new methane

16 protections in Colorado have actually created new

17 industries in the state. A recent report from the Datu

18 Research ranks Colorado third in the nation for methane

19 mitigation technology.

20 While these points are all great news for

21 Colorado, the fact of the matter is the EPA can and

22 should do more to cut methane from oil and gas

23 development. While the proposed rules are a step in the

24 right direction, Colorado's methane success story --

25 success story should inform the EPA that they can go
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1 much further to reduce air pollution from oil and gas

2 wells nationwide.

3 First, we need to develop robust programs that

4 proactively detect pollution leaks. Second, the EPA

5 needs to move forward with a significant process to

6 address methane pollution from existing wells, in the

7 final rule, for the sake of climate and public health.

8 Colorado's rules deal with both new and

9 existing wells. There's no reason EPA cannot at least

10 match or perhaps even exceed what we have put forward in

11 Colorado.

12 We hope the White House, the EPA, and Colorado

13 members of the Federal delegation take note of what

14 we've done on methane here in Colorado and understand

15 that strong air quality protections and economic growth

16 can happen at the same time. And ask yourselves,

17 shouldn't all children, all people, regardless of where

18 they live, have equal access to clean air standards?

19 The path to cleaner air is here, it's

20 attainable, and Colorado is leading the way.

21 Thank you.

22 MR. GREEN: All right. Thank you both.

23 Our next speakers are America Sherwood and

24 Robin Mann.

25 MS. SHERWOOD: I'm America Sherwood. Good
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1 morning.

2 Pope Francis has declared climate action a

3 moral obligation; he considers it our moral duty to

4 safeguard future generations, especially the world's

5 most vulnerable people and creatures, from the great

6 dangers of climate change.

7 I agree and I am here on behalf of the

8 vulnerable. I'm not a paid lobbyist but an informed

9 ordinary citizen, not a special interest group.

10 The Lung Association's State of the Air report

11 grades the following Colorado counties an "F": Adams,

12 Arapahoe, Boulder, Douglas, El Paso, Jefferson, Larimer

13 Rio Blanco, and Weld County. A "D" was given to Denver,

14 Garfield, and La Plata counties.

15 This report also contains the population by

16 counties as well as those people under 18 and over 65,

17 which includes me, who have as asthma, COPD, CV disease,

18 diabetes, and the poverty estimates lists per county.

19 The numbers are nowhere close to zero, but in the

20 thousands and ten thousands. These are all related --

21 lung-related illnesses that point to the gases we are

22 all breathing now and have been breathing. The deaths

23 were not reported. But there is a report that there is

24 2.1 million deaths worldwide in the IOP, I-O-P, studies.

25 I know that other states have decided to
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1 regulate methane as well. Our air in Colorado contains

2 methane as recorded and observed by NOAA in their air

3 quality studies. We are sharing methane with the rest

4 of this planet and our immediate neighboring states.

5 NOAA measured the methane in our air from oil

6 and gas. It found that 20 tons of methane per hour were

7 exhausted into Colorado's and this planet's atmosphere.

8 Benzene and other volatile gases are spewed into the

9 atmosphere at much higher levels than government

10 estimates. These gases affect our nation's crops,

11 drinking water, along with sea life, plant and animal

12 life, as well as our health.

13 Leaks occur when fracking or chemical wastes

14 are attempted to be stored from sediments (inaudible).

15 Poor regulation, inattention, lack of law enforcement

16 contribute to delinquencies and continual violations.

17 This lawlessness has created a monumental cleanup

18 project that will take generations to recover from.

19 If this generation does nothing, we are

20 causing our own extinction. No one will be spending

21 money on anything except doctor bills and funeral costs.

22 The sick, the dying, and the dead cannot invest in any

23 future.

24 As decision-makers we, as a nation and

25 inhabitants of this precious planet, have to do what is
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1 good and right for mankind. Our legacy and credibility

2 are in peril if we do nothing to change the wrong

3 direction we have taken until now.

4 As a 30-year-old retired teacher -- 30-year

5 retired teacher from having taught a yearly lecture on

6 ecology to my class, I owe it to my students, as well,

7 to testify here today.

8 Thank you.

9 MR. GREEN: All right. Thank you very much.

10 Ms. Mann.

11 MS. MANN: My name is Robin Mann. I'm from

12 Rosemont, Pennsylvania. I'm here with fellow Sierra

13 Club members, but speaking today on my own behalf.

14 Thank you for the opportunity to comment. I'm

15 commenting on the NSPS standards.

16 By issuing these first-ever standards to

17 reduce methane pollution, EPA is recognizing methane as

18 the powerful contributor to climate change that it is

19 and the oil and gas sector as its largest industrial

20 source. EPA is also more fully responding to the major

21 public health threat posed by methane and the VOCs,

22 soot, and hazardous air pollutants from the oil and gas

23 sector.

24 Thank you, EPA, for promulgating this very

25 important, if overdue, regulation. Though not as
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1 comprehensive as it needs to be, especially in omitting

2 existing sources, the draft is a good start.

3 Between the summer's massive fires, some still

4 consuming Western forests and communities, and severe

5 drought there and every -- elsewhere, the climate crisis

6 is screaming for attention. It is clearer and clearer,

7 by the day, that we must shift our economy away from

8 fossil fuels altogether, as quickly as possible. And in

9 the meantime, aggressive action is imperative to limit

10 emissions from all greenhouse gas emission sources.

11 Oil production and the processing, production,

12 transmission, and distribution of natural gas accounts

13 for nearly 30 percent of U.S. methane emissions. It is

14 past time for the oil and gas industry to enjoy this

15 unlicensed -- to enjoy this unlimited license to

16 pollute.

17 Federal regulation of oil and gas emissions is

18 imperative. The states have resisted putting effective

19 limits on the industry's fugitive emissions, the threats

20 to their citizens' health notwithstanding. And

21 everyone, everywhere deserves to breathe air that is

22 free of toxics and safe to breathe.

23 Colorado is the exception that proves the

24 rule, responding to high smog pollution levels and

25 threats to public health from its burgeoning oil and gas
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1 industry and last year becoming the first state to

2 directly regulate methane pollution from oil and gas

3 operations, including existing ones.

4 I know a lot of people here live under the

5 methane cloud. I'm from Pennsylvania. Communities in

6 the Marcellus Shale region are suffering the effects of

7 unchecked methane pollution from drilling operations and

8 compressor stations. Many residents near well pads and

9 compressor stations have been sickened; many have had

10 their homes rendered unsafe and unfit to live.

11 The recent peer-reviewed studies in -- two

12 recent peer-reviewed studies in Pennsylvania have linked

13 the health impacts to concentrations of fracking

14 operations; one related to frequency of cardiological

15 hospitalizations, and the other to incidence of low16 birth-weight babies.

17 So far the political will has been utterly

18 lacking to address this, but we're working on that.

19 Federal methane standards will begin to shift the cost

20 of methane pollution from the health of children and

21 communities to the oil and gas industry that largely

22 refuses to employ effective leak detections.

23 Only about 2 percent of Pennsylvania operators

24 of existing sources participate in EPA's voluntary

25 Natural Gas STAR Program. The natural gas industry in
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1 Pennsylvania alone wastes enough methane to heat over

2 half the households in Pittsburgh for a year and emits

3 the equivalent of 700,000 cars.

4 The draft rule is a good start. It covers

5 many of the emission sources of concern. But full and

6 comprehensive coverage is needed. The final rule should

7 include the additional sources of liquid unloading

8 events, intermittent pneumatic controllers, the well

9 site compressors, and also storage tanks.

10 EPA also needs to ensure that gas flaring is

11 held to an absolute minimum by requiring zero-emission

12 equipment or gas capture wherever that's technologically

13 possible; and where it's not technologically possible,

14 the combustion needs to be as efficient as possible,

15 95 percent or higher.

16 The approach to leak detection and repair

17 monitoring is also a concern; it is an open invitation

18 to industry abuse. Owners and operators are

19 incentivized to lowball the leaks that they find, in the

20 way that the rule is structured, to avoid more frequent

21 inspections. EPA should replace this trust-based

22 approach with regular inspections, scheduled on at least

23 a quarterly basis.

24 Also, in the final rule, EPA should fully

25 represent and monetize the societal benefits in health
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1 cost savings from reduced methane pollution. These

2 benefits are an important underpinning of the rule, and

3 they need to be represented. The industry savings as

4 well are a societal benefit, from conserved methane, and

5 they need to be quantified in the final rule.

6 It is critically important for the EPA to

7 follow up to develop strong and effective standards for

8 existing sources as soon as possible. The impacts to

9 people's health and the air quality in our communities

10 are occurring from current operations, and those won't

11 be covered by the proposed rule. Those emissions must

12 be covered if the U.S. is to meet its international goal

13 of reducing overall greenhouse gas emissions 26 to

14 28 percent below 2005 levels.

15 MR. GREEN: Please wrap it up.

16 MS. MANN: I'm a grandmother of three tiny

17 grandchildren. I want to see them inherit a just and

18 stable and a good future. We're not on our way there

19 yet, but this is a good start. We need to do better.

20 Thank you.

21 MR. GREEN: All right. Thank you very much.

22 Our next speakers are Daniel Tso and Dirk

23 Richter.

24 MR. RICHTER: Good morning. My name is Dirk

25 Richter, and I live in Longmont, Colorado. And I'm the
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1 owner of a company. It's a small company that I started

2 last year.

3 Over the last 15 years, I've been a research

4 scientist and engineer working at the National Center

5 for Atmospheric Research in Boulder and the University

6 of Colorado. And during this time, I carried out

7 airborne air quality studies with NASA and NOAA and

8 National Science Foundation-sponsored projects.

9 Last year I started a company, which entered

10 the Methane Detector Challenge issued by the

11 Environmental Defense Fund, in partnership with eight

12 major oil and gas companies, with the goal to

13 development smart, cost-effective sensors that can

14 provide continuous unmanned leak protection for every

15 well production site in the nation.

16 Natural gas has become an important piece of

17 the total U.S. energy mix today and foreseeable future,

18 and when done right represents the least carbon19 polluting fossil fuel resource.

20 Emissions from gathering and distribution of

21 natural gas caused by unintended leaks, however, can

22 have several significant impacts, including:

23 Air quality: Hitchhiking volatile organic

24 compounds contribute to high ozone levels and toxic

25 gases such as benzene, impact the safety of workers and
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1 residents that live in close proximity to production

2 sites;

3 Second, climate system: The warming potency

4 of methane released in the atmosphere is 80 times of

5 CO2; and with trillions of cubic feet of production each

6 month, leak rates as small as 1 percent have a

7 significant impact to the climate system;

8 And, third, lost revenue: Even at 1 percent

9 leak rate, that is currently the lowest estimated leak

10 rate, over $1 billion simply evaporates into the

11 atmosphere.

12 Innovative solutions to address this problem

13 are becoming available. These market-ready solutions go

14 above and beyond the currently successfully applied

15 technologies and lead to win-win situations for all

16 stakeholders. Specifically, the benefits of continuous,

17 autonomous, and on-site leak detection are complementary

18 to existing leak detection efforts but offer the

19 following additional benefits:

20 Operators know the leak size and location of

21 well sites that have leaks and can instantly deploy

22 their LDAR team efficiently and thus reduce truck rolls

23 and associated overhead costs;

24 Leaks can be fixed in hours, not months. This

25 is of tremendous value, especially for larger leaks;
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1 The amount of gas saved is much -- much more

2 than the capital cost of continuous autonomous monitors,

3 which have little to no associated labor costs for years

4 of dependable service;

5 Operators can prove that they are near zero

6 emissions and radically improve the safety of on-site

7 workers and ensure the safety of residential complexes

8 in cases of urban developments;

9 Operators gain insight to the frequency and

10 failure rate of components which are causing the leaks

11 and, hence -- and, hence, can continuously improve

12 infrastructure and reduce costs.

13 In the past year, our company, together with

14 the Environmental Defense Fund and eight major oil and

15 gas companies, including Anadarko, Noble, and Shell, we

16 have been innovating and testing real-world solutions,

17 which will be entering a pilot phase with operators

18 early next year.

19 Our low-cost sensors are developed and made in

20 Colorado and use one of the world's most sensitive,

21 rugged, laser-based sensor technology that our team,

22 with decades of experience of laser technology, has

23 tirelessly -- tirelessly been developing over the course

24 of this last year.

25 Two rounds of independent industrial testing
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1 at the Southwest Research Institute in San Antonio,

2 Texas, have confirmed our breakthrough technology and

3 showed strong results. The sensing solution cost per

4 site is a fraction of the cost saved by reducing the

5 leak rate by just 1 percent.

6 It is of utmost importance that this

7 particular and other future innovative initiatives will

8 be embraced in any forthcoming regulation policy and

9 rules.

10 As regulations move forward, incentives for

11 technology innovations that result in win-win situations

12 must be embraced and perhaps even rewarded; otherwise,

13 progress towards -- progress towards leak-free natural

14 gas production can be slowed. And progress in making

15 natural gas the cleanest fossil fuel energy requires

16 innovation, cooperation, and cost-effective solutions,

17 especially in a downmarket environment.

18 We hope that such considerations will be

19 included in forthcoming regulation and policy that is

20 currently under review.

21 Thank you.

22 MR. GREEN: Thank you, Mr. Richter.

23 MR. TSO: Good morning. Daniel Tso.

24 (Spoke in Navajo.)

25 MR. TSO: Good morning, and I appreciate the
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1 opportunity to come before you. I just expressed my

2 Clan's and therefore also expressed my relationship with

3 the Mother Earth.

4 As we grow up, Navajo people are taught that,

5 yes, your mom, she bore you; she's not going to be here

6 forever. Mother Earth will always be here for you; for

7 your water, food, and the clean air. And so that's how

8 we grow up to be -- do our best to be stewards of the

9 land. But with this new technology of hydraulic

10 fracturing, we are facing a tsunami of industrial

11 development.

12 Yes, we hear about the wells, and the

13 horizontal drills, but all that also comes with the

14 pipelines that connect the wells, the tanks that hold

15 the produced water, the tanks that hold the crude oil,

16 plus compressors that compress the well. And so we are

17 now seeing a devastated landscape. Where people thought

18 the land was worthless: Let the Navajos live there.

19 And now for profit, for economic advancement, for the

20 almighty dollar now, we -- they find out the land has

21 value.

22 We, as Navajo People, we've always known it

23 had value. That is our customary homeland, land between

24 the sacred mountains. We were told that: Occupy that

25 land, you hold the Earth together. And now we see this
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1 impact, and it puts us in a -- in a different realm.

2 Now we have to start talking about air quality, the

3 effects of the methane releases, the compressors that

4 are pumping out and are being allowed to release more

5 than the EPA standards.

6 The energy companies go to the environment

7 department to ask for waivers on the air quality

8 standards; and left and right, they're being allowed the

9 waivers. So we are faced with hydrogen sulfide, other

10 volatile organic compounds, that -- that is way away

11 from the rules and regulations that are in place.

12 And now you are proposing some new regula13 tions, but I say to you, there has to be monitoring,

14 there has to be good reporting, there has to be

15 enforcement. Enforcement is the key, and the imposition

16 of penalties to those entities that do not meet those

17 new regulations and standards.

18 The other aspect that we are concerned with is

19 the impact of the health to our elderly, to our

20 relatives that are in marginal health status. We have a

21 high prevalence of diabetes, and we have our folks being

22 driven to the dialysis units in Farmington, and so the

23 roads are the lifeline to good health. And right now we

24 have 150 trucks on dirt roads, and those trucks raise

25 the dust. And so then the folks that have
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1 breathing/lung problems, they are also affected.

2 So we --

3 MR. GREEN: Please wrap it up.

4 MR. TSO: Okay. And so in that aspect, we are

5 asking, yes, we -- we applaud the fact that you are

6 wanting to do the more stringent regulations, but again,

7 I say there has to be monitoring and there has to be

8 enforcement and imposition of penalties.

9 I appreciate the time.

10 MR. GREEN: Thank you. Before you leave, I

11 just want to make sure I have your names right. First

12 speaker was Dirk Richter?

13 MR. RICHTER: That's right.

14 MR. GREEN: And second speaker's name is

15 Daniel Tso?

16 MR. TSO: Correct.

17 MR. GREEN: All right. Thank you very much.

18 MR. TSO: Thank you.

19 MR. GREEN: Our next speakers will be Ralph

20 Motto and Cindy Borroway. Please remember to tell us

21 which rules you're speaking on. Thank you.

22 MR. MOTTO: My name is Ralph Motto, and I'm

23 with Lasen Inc., and I'm speaking on all three rules

24 that you are making.

25 I would like to thank you, first, for allowing
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1 me to speak, and thank you for addressing a very

2 important problem. I'm not a speaker and I'd rather

3 have a dental root canal than be up here talking, but

4 I'll try to do my best so you can understand.

5 I'm with a small company called Lasen. We

6 have developed a infrared LIDAR, a laser sensor system,

7 applied along the pipelines between 150 to 300 feet at

8 65 miles an hour. We record the full pipeline visually

9 and give accurate GPS markings of each leak we find. We

10 have a sensitivity of 5 parts per million. And it's

11 been proven on several government tests. Our accuracy

12 is 98 percent.

13 Since 2004 we have flown over 200,000 miles

14 and found over 20,000 leaks. The DOT put out a report,

15 and I have it here in the packet for you, of between

16 2005 and 2011, we have saved 2.933 trillion BTUs of

17 methane energy because we have detected those leaks; and

18 we prevented 46,000 tons of carbon from escaping into

19 the atmosphere.

20 We give a report within 24 hours after we fly

21 the lines, with GPS location of the leaks. The oil

22 companies, we have several of them that are applying for

23 them and were very happy with our source.

24 Now, after saying all that, the reason why I'm

25 here is we read through your regulations, and any oil
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1 company reading through them will determine the only

2 system that you endorse is the IR camera or the OGI.

3 It's a good system. It really is -- and we have tested

4 it quite a few times -- when you can control your

5 environment, you have a -- and have the persons trained

6 to operate it.

7 But even in the best scenario, we say it's fit

8 only about for 10,000 parts per million -- 10,000 --

9 yeah, I'm sorry, I'm not -- I'm a terrible speaker. We

10 have found that, in aerial surveys, it's only -- the

11 best it can possibly do is just 30,000 parts per million

12 detection of methane.

13 We are very concerned because on Page -- on --

14 in your report, on Page 117 and 166, you say it is the

15 best system out there for detecting methane. Any oil

16 company reading your report will think that you endorse

17 the IR camera only, and all other systems out there are

18 null and void. And our experience is that the majority

19 of the leaks that we find are below the 10,000 parts per

20 mill.

21 If your -- if you -- if you keep the verbiage

22 the way it is, then -- and there are other systems out

23 there that are different than ours, that work well, but

24 we have found that we believe our system, of course, is

25 the best. But if you keep the verbiage the way it is,
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1 the oil companies are going to think that this is the

2 only system you endorse, and you are going to miss the

3 90 percent of the leaks that are out there.

4 That's -- I'm finished.

5 MR. GREEN: All right. Thank you, Mr. Motto.

6 If you'd like to leave the package with you or include

7 it downstairs at the registration desk.

8 MR. MOTTO: Okay.

9 MR. GREEN: All right. Ms. Borroway.

10 MS. BORROWAY: Thank you. Good morning. My

11 name is Cindy Borroway. I'm a Lakewood city councilor

12 and a thirty-year-plus Colorado resident. I am not

13 going to be nearly as technical as the previous speaker.

14 I'll keep my comments brief, and they're about the EPA's

15 methane emissions standards.

16 As a mom, I can tell you that I'm very

17 concerned about the impacts of methane and smog-forming

18 pollution from oil and gas development, on my family's

19 health, and my health, and my future grandchildren.

20 As an elected official, I can tell you that

21 the people of the city of Lakewood share these same

22 concerns. We are seeing far too many ozone action days

23 on the Front Range, and we see now that the Denver area

24 is being bumped up from moderate to nonattainment for

25 ozone pollution, a sign that we need to do more in order
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1 to try and stop the pollution.

2 I believe I mentioned, I'm a 30-year resident.

3 When I moved here in 1984, we had the big, brown cloud,

4 for those who have been here long enough, and you

5 actually were told don't go jogging in the morning

6 because it's so bad. After seeing it clear up, I hate

7 to see it go backwards.

8 EPA rules are a step in the right direction;

9 however, the EPA should know that Colorado has been

10 taking action to cut this pollution. As EPA moves

11 forward, it should look to Colorado as a shining example

12 for a template. Colorado's first-in-the-nation methane

13 rules are the equivalent, in pollution cuts, of taking

14 all the cars and trucks of Colorado off the roads. They

15 also eliminate more than a hundred thousand tons of

16 methane from our air. And I believe a previous speaker

17 mentioned this as well.

18 I'm happy to see the EPA moving ahead with

19 similar rules to try and develop the kinds of stronger

20 requirements to reduce methane and smog-forming

21 pollution nationwide. Cutting methane emissions just

22 makes good sense. Nationwide rules have been very cost

23 effective, since every ounce of methane captured is an

24 ounce the oil and gas -- oil and gas industry can sell.

25 Moving forward, EPA should take a hard look at
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1 what Colorado has done to strengthen its proposal in

2 these key areas:

3 Colorado's rules apply to existing wells, and

4 the EPA's proposal only applies to new ones. This is a

5 huge loophole that needs to be closed. Our air is dirty

6 now, so we need to address thousands of wells out there,

7 without delay.

8 The EPA rule also needs stronger and more

9 frequent leak detection and repair inspections; four

10 times a year, as Colorado requires for most source leak

11 detection. Twice a year, with the possibility of even

12 less frequent inspections than the EPA has proposed, is

13 not good enough for our air.

14 Colorado has shown what is possible. I've

15 seen it happen here in the 30 years I've been a

16 resident. It's now time for EPA to level the playing

17 field for all the oil and gas industry across the U.S.

18 with strong and sensible nationwide action. I believe

19 that this could continue to happen where we make changes

20 in our air quality, and my constituents will thank you

21 for doing that, as long as you make it a little bit

22 stronger than you have.

23 Thank you for your time. Good morning.

24 MR. GREEN: Thank you both.

25 MR. MOTTO: We're trying to marry both
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1 technologies together, and we're looking for funding to

2 do that.

3 MR. GREEN: Thank you. Our next speakers will

4 be Stan Dempsey and then Elliot Jim.

5 Are you Mr. Dempsey?

6 MR. DEMPSEY: I am, thank you.

7 MR. GREEN: Okay. If you could just do me a

8 favor, I think you heard, but she's asked you use your

9 microphone. That would be great.

10 MR. DEMPSEY: Use the microphone, okay.

11 Thank you very much. Good morning. My name

12 is Stan Dempsey. I'm president of the Colorado

13 Petroleum Association. The Colorado Petroleum

14 Association, we call ourselves CPA, is a nonprofit trade

15 association that does business in Colorado, and we

16 represent all the segments of the oil and gas industry

17 in Colorado.

18 Colorado's oil and gas industry supports

19 213 jobs directly and indirectly in Colorado. It

20 contributes $25.8 billion to the economy. Yet our

21 member companies have had to meet difficult changes to

22 their operations due to the steep decline in oil prices

23 since late last year.

24 EPA's proposal can significantly affect the

25 ability of operators to successfully develop oil and --
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1 oil and natural gas operations, as the EPA proposed

2 regulations will impose significant new costs at a time

3 when energy companies are already suffering from a

4 difficult commodity market.

5 In Colorado, sustained low natural gas prices

6 since 2008 have had a long-term effect on production in

7 certain oil and gas phases. The number of oil -- of

8 drilling rigs operating in Colorado is half of what it

9 was a year ago. Western Colorado in particular has seen

10 a high unemployment rate and very few wells have been

11 drilled.

12 The rules will have significant impacts on

13 domestic energy development, which will also affect our

14 ability to supply affordable oil and natural gas, which

15 will affect energy costs for struggling families in the

16 United States.

17 CPA and its members have been actively engaged

18 in the development of Colorado's air quality program for

19 many years and have developed a strong working

20 relationship with the Air Pollution Control Division of

21 the Commission. We're thankful for the opportunity to

22 provide Colorado operators the experience with respect

23 to the proposed federal rules in the past. We've taken

24 them seriously, and we appreciate that.

25 Thank you for holding this public hearing in
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1 Denver, particularly since Colorado has been at the

2 forefront of crafting and implementing air quality

3 programs and regulations, addressing air quality

4 challenges in various Colorado communities, including

5 those related to oil and gas.

6 As you know, on February 4, 2014, Colorado

7 adopted the first methane regulations, related to oil

8 and gas, in the country. CPA, on behalf of its members,

9 played an impactful role in making necessary and

10 important changes to that regulation. CPA challenged

11 many of the facets of the proposed rules, as we did not

12 agree that the basis for adoption had been demonstrated,

13 and CPA had significant concerns about the costs,

14 benefits, and technologies proposed as a part of that

15 rulemaking, and we have concerns about EPA's Subpart

16 Quad Oa proposal.

17 Specifically, CPA has long articulated its

18 continuing belief that regulating methane directly is

19 unnecessary and that the capture of methane can be

20 viewed as a co-method of -- of regulating volatile

21 organic compounds. EPA achieves this co-benefit by its

22 current practice of regulating natural gas as a

23 surrogate for VOC in the current Subpart Quad O rule.

24 Since methane is the primary constituent of natural gas,

25 no additional benefit can be gained by directly
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1 regulating methane in the new proposed rules, as the EPA

2 admits on Page 1, dash, 1 of the RIA of the current

3 rule -- for the current rule.

4 The Colorado Petroleum Association has had an

5 ongoing and involved dialogue addressing issues and

6 concerns that have arisen, through its members, with the

7 Air Division in Colorado over the last 18 months

8 concerning Regulation 7. As a result of those efforts

9 undertaken in Colorado in 2014, implementation has not

10 been as significant, and there's been substantial steep

11 learning curve for all -- for all players. EPA must

12 learn from these hiccups and efforts in Colorado, or

13 else similar difficulties will arise on a national

14 scale.

15 As EPA evaluates the potential regulation, we

16 strongly urge the Agency to acknowledge those states,

17 like Colorado, have adopted robust and significant state

18 regulations related to oil and gas, and in Colorado's

19 case, methane, though implementation remains ongoing and

20 challenges continue.

21 Operators have devoted vast amounts of money,

22 resources and personnel to understanding and complying

23 with engaging on Regulation 7. Though CPA and its

24 members remain in an -- in an evaluation mode, there are

25 many components of this proposed regulation that either
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1 conflict with, duplicate, or show themselves to be

2 inconsistent with the Colorado Regulation 7.

3 Because Colorado's program will achieve all

4 the necessary goals and requirements of EPA's proposal,

5 Colorado's program should be able to stand in lieu of

6 EPA's proposal. A long compliance with Regulation 7 in

7 Colorado will not hinder the efforts of achieving

8 improved air quality. In fact, CPA members have worked

9 throughout the world to improve their operations.

10 We're the beneficiaries of innovative

11 technology in Colorado resulting in increased production

12 of oil and gas, while at the same time achieving sizable

13 emission reductions. For example, in the Denver14 Julesburg Basin north of the Denver area, oil production

15 has gone up since 2002 but emissions have gone down with

16 the development of state-of-the-art emission controls

17 employed to meet Colorado air quality standards.

18 We have a significant concern about the cost

19 benefits and technology proposed in your rulemaking.

20 For example, we urge --

21 MR. GREEN: Please wrap it up.

22 MR. DEMPSEY: Certainly. We urge you to

23 compare the actual compliance costs with Regulation 7 as

24 compared to those that were proposed, and hopefully

25 they'll inform your decision.
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1 Thank you.

2 MR. GREEN: Thank you very much. Is it

3 Mr. Elliot or Mr. Jim?

4 MR. JIM: It's Mr. Jim.

5 MR. GREEN: Okay. Thank you.

6 MR. JIM: Thanks for asking. Good morning.

7 To be honest with you, this is the first time I've ever

8 done anything like this on behalf of Sierra Club. I am

9 coming from the Four Corners area of the country, and I

10 wanted to thank you all in advance for offering us this

11 opportunity to speak before you.

12 I am close, pretty close, to the state line,

13 so I pretty much use Colorado as my playground, I guess.

14 I like to jump on my bike, do a lot of playing in and

15 around Durango. And the only reason I can do that is

16 because I have asthmatic problems, I guess, if I decided

17 to stay in my own state, which is Farmington. And I

18 can't do that because I start losing my breath and

19 stuff. So I usually bike in and around Durango. And it

20 just seems like something should be stressed about

21 methane in my part of the world.

22 I -- to be honest with you, I don't have a lot

23 of facts and logistics before me, but I do stress

24 stronger EPA regulations and policy enforcement, just

25 like any other person that wants to breathe and has the
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1 right to clean air.

2 I -- oh, I also used to work for a big oil

3 field company in the Farmington area, and I used to

4 drive a chemical truck. And I have seen, firsthand, how

5 some of this -- some of this -- some of those guys work

6 in the field. And it's probably not the best thing to

7 see, you know, some of the practices they have.

8 As a matter of fact, I've even gotten released

9 from one company for having -- I guess, blowing the

10 whistle, more or less. But I was proud to do that, you

11 know, because I'm all for the environment, and I just --

12 seems like something everybody should be concerned

13 about.

14 I understand that I live in a methane hotbed.

15 And you can see satellite images projecting these --

16 these views, and it's actually quite humbling and scary

17 at the same time. So I think, and I stress and implore,

18 any kind of regulations and enforcement that -- that

19 make you put people in place.

20 Again, I do thank you for your time, and

21 that's all I have.

22 MR. GREEN: All right. Thank you very much,

23 both of you.

24 Next speakers will be Jim Armstrong and Kathy

25 Plomer.
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1 MR. ARMSTRONG: Good morning. My name is Jim

2 Armstrong. I'm president of Apogee Scientific, a

3 Colorado company that was founded in 1993. And I built

4 the company to do three things: Protect the

5 environment; to protect the security of our nation; and

6 to provide quality services to the customers, in terms

7 of being cost-effective solutions to problems.

8 I'm excited to provide testimony today to the

9 EPA concerning the proposed rulemaking -- -making for

10 controlling methane and volatile organic compounds

11 through natural gas well sites, processing equipment,

12 and connecting pipelines. I have three points that I

13 wanted to stress, three main points.

14 Number one: I encourage the EPA to develop

15 effective regulations based on the sampling performance

16 standards and not be limited to any particular methods

17 for sampling, such as the proposed IR imaging cameras

18 and the possible use of the Method 21 technology.

19 Number two: While it -- while it is

20 definitely appropriate to find all methane and VOC

21 leaks, large leaks may occur at gas wells and operating

22 sites. These super-emitters, as some people call them,

23 release many times the quantity of future emissions

24 anticipated from more typical small leaks.

25 These larger leaks are most impactful to the
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1 environment, and they result in the loss of revenue for

2 the operators and the lessening of the resource of the

3 operators in terms of their longevity.

4 It is therefore recommended that more rapid --

5 more regular, rapid, and cost-effective monitoring is

6 carried out for at least the larger leaks to be

7 considered for the proposed regulations.

8 Gas companies -- Number three: Gas companies

9 should be given the choice to choose what appropriate

10 and improved monitoring levels can be used. For an

11 example, Apogee has been providing a fully vetted and

12 award-winning mobile leak monitoring system to the

13 natural gas and oil community for over a decade. The

14 LDS is a elegant solution that measures methane, total

15 hydrocarbons, and CO2 simultaneously and individually at

16 .25 parts per million lower detection limits and at a

17 speed of 50 hertz.

18 That means that these detectors, they're

19 mobile detectors, can be used on ground vehicles at

20 highway speeds, or be they trucks or ATVs in off-road

21 conditions, or from helicopters or used in airborne

22 sampling.

23 The example I'd like to give you is that a gas

24 company in West Virginia approached us to use the LDS

25 unit for some helicopter surveillances of their
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1 operation where they had not only well operations in

2 mountainous areas but also ran their connecting pipe3 lines across a piece of these mountains, making it very

4 difficult to get to them by either trucks or by walking

5 leak detection surveys.

6 The -- this part of the country is loaded with

7 deciduous trees, so you get a tree canopy that makes it

8 impossible, literally, to use things like LIDAR or the

9 IR camera systems to be able to spot the leaks. On the

10 other hand, the system we have, the leaks came to us.

11 So it worked very effectively for them. And again, it

12 points out the fact that gas companies should be able to

13 use whatever works best for what their needs are.

14 And finally, to repeat the three main segments

15 that I want to leave you with, they are, to develop

16 regulations based on sample -- sampling performance

17 standards and quality methods and equipment to meet

18 those standards. Number two, conduct more frequent

19 monitoring, especially for super-emitter leaks.

20 Certainly I would agree with other speakers today that

21 sampling more than twice a year is good policy in terms

22 of the regulations that you're going to propose. And to

23 allow gas companies to determine what monitoring methods

24 work best for them.

25 Thank you. I appreciate the opportunity to
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1 speak to you.

2 MR. GREEN: Thank you, Mr. Armstrong.

3 Ms. Plomer.

4 MS. PLOMER: Thank you. My name is Kathy

5 Plomer. I'm here on methane standards. And I'm from

6 Broomfield, Colorado. I want to thank you for the

7 opportunity to offer comment on the proposed EPA methane

8 capture rule.

9 As a little background on myself, I've lived

10 in Colorado for the last 22 years. I have three

11 children; 14, 17, and 19; all born and raised here. I

12 have 25 years of work experience in the field of public

13 health, and I currently serve on the board of education

14 for Adams 12 Five Star Schools. I'm a school board

15 member, but I am speaking today on my own behalf.

16 I am testifying today to support and urge

17 strengthening of the EPA's recently prepared methane

18 standards for the oil and gas industry. Given the rapid

19 growth of oil and gas development in Colorado, these

20 rules are critical to protect air quality and public

21 health.

22 The issue of air quality and safety around oil

23 and gas drilling sites strikes particularly close to

24 home, as there is a large 19-well drilling operation

25 being proposed 2500 feet from one of our middle schools
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1 and within a mile of three other schools in the school

2 district where my children attend school and I serve on

3 the board of education. The proximity of this potential

4 drilling site to the neighborhood and schools makes harm

5 mitigation, including methane capture, even more

6 critical.

7 When methane is released into the air, harmful

8 pollutants that have specific and public health

9 consequences are released; this includes toxic chemicals

10 like benzenes, which are linked to cancer, and other

11 smog-forming pollutants that can trigger asthma, a risk

12 to our kids and others alike.

13 I'm proud to live in the first state to

14 regulate methane pollution. I am relieved that

15 Colorado's standards and EPA's new proposed rules would

16 cover emissions from new wells proposed near schools and

17 residences where I live. What is concerning to me is

18 that the EPA's new proposed rules do not cover existing

19 wells, which are the major source of the methane

20 problem. Currently millions of tons of gas and toxic

21 chemicals are leaking from drill sites and during

22 transport.

23 We all breathe common air, and I believe we

24 all deserve to breathe clean air, free from methane and

25 oil and gas production. National standards are critical
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1 for the health of the public and for the reduction of

2 greenhouse gases. So I urge the final national

3 standards be that they include requirements for all

4 methane leak sources in the gas and oil industry. This

5 includes covering storage vessels and compressors at

6 well sites.

7 I'd like the final national standards to

8 require source operators to use zero-emitting equipment

9 that capture gas for sale or beneficial use on site.

10 And finally, I'd like them to require more

11 frequent leak inspections, of at least four times a

12 year, especially of compressor stations.

13 I believe we need to continue to study and

14 gather evidence of the safety of fracking and other

15 drilling practices in general; but in the meantime, as

16 drilling proliferates and gets closer to schools and

17 residences, sensible requirements to reduce methane

18 released into our environment are more critical than

19 ever for our public's health.

20 Thank you for the opportunity to speak today.

21 MR. GREEN: All right. Thank you both.

22 All right. Our next speakers will be Jesse

23 Ulibarri and John Jacus.

24 Mr. Ulibarri, I hope I pronounced that

25 correctly.
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1 MR. ULIBARRI: Yes, you did. Thank you.

2 MR. GREEN: Thank you.

3 MR. ULIBARRI: Good morning. My name is Jesse

4 Ulibarri. I'm a state senator representing southwestern

5 Adams County, specifically the cities of Commerce City,

6 Federal Heights, Westminster and Arvada, and the

7 unincorporated neighborhoods of southwestern Adams.

8 It's, fortunately, the area where I was born and raised,

9 where my grandparents raised my parents, where I'm

10 raising my two young kids.

11 It's my honor to be here today, to join you

12 for this public hearing, enjoy the perspective that I

13 have of being a life-long resident of southwestern Adams

14 County, and specifically as somebody who represents

15 150,000 residents here in the state of Colorado.

16 I'm here to talk specifically about the

17 impacts of methane on low-income communities of color.

18 The area I just described is predominantly low income

19 and predominantly folks of color. I represent

20 52 percent of my population which is Latino, 9 percent

21 which is African American, 4 percent which is Asian

22 Pacific Islander.

23 My district is sandwiched between the greater

24 Wattenberg Field on the north end, the DIA Airport to

25 the east, the Suncor refinery to the south, and the
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1 Cherokee Power Station also to the south. The coal

2 trains come into Denver; put a power plant right through

3 the center of my district. Our families are between

4 multiple highways; I-25, I-70, 270, and US-36.

5 So when we talk specifically about the impact

6 of climate change and the release of methane, it's

7 something that my community knows personally because it

8 happens, literally, in our backyard, whether it's the

9 pipeline that's coming from the oil fields down into the

10 Suncor refinery, is the refinery itself, or the impact

11 that we've seen from climate-related disasters,

12 specifically the unusually strong wildfires and floods

13 that we witnessed here in the West and specifically here

14 in Colorado.

15 Just about two years ago, we had a incredibly

16 tough flood that impacted southwestern Adams County,

17 Weld County, Larimer County, and it was all communities

18 of color that disproportionally felt the impact. Entire

19 communities, trailer parks, were wiped away because of

20 the flooding. And we know that methane, in the near

21 term, is one of the most heavy pollutants for climate

22 change.

23 And so when we talk about the rules that we

24 want to be implemented by the EPA, we want you to follow

25 the lead that Colorado has set, in setting a very high
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1 standard, but we want you to go even further than we

2 have or even further than Wyoming or even further than

3 Idaho or other states that I've talked to on methane

4 capture and methane-limiting rules.

5 For us here in Colorado, we heard a call from

6 the Administration to limit methane in -- by the

7 Administration to see reduction by 40 to 45 percent, and

8 we want the Administration to actually follow through

9 with that commitment. This rule is a first step, but I

10 want to make sure that whatever comes forward is much

11 stronger so we can actually ensure that the impact that

12 we're seeing developed in my community, in the senate

13 district I represent, and for the people that have

14 elected me to serve on their behalf that, in fact, we're

15 doing everything that we can to ensure their health and

16 safety.

17 I want to close with a final note, which is

18 that specifically Latinos in the state of Colorado are

19 at disproportionate risk of being diagnosed with asthma,

20 that Latinos living in Colorado specifically have a much

21 higher rate of asthma and are much more likely to die

22 than nonwhite Latinos possessing an asthma diagnosis.

23 One of the aggravating factors is air quality, and so

24 this is something that is incredibly vital for my

25 community and for the people I represent.
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1 So again, thank you for taking the time to

2 hear the public on this, but we want to make sure that

3 the rule is as strong as possible.

4 MR. GREEN: All right. Thank you very much.

5 Mr. Jacus.

6 MR. JACUS: Good morning. My name is John

7 Jacus, and I'm a partner with the Denver office of Davis

8 Graham & Stubbs, commenting here this morning for our

9 client Western Energy Alliance. The Alliance and its

10 members appreciate the opportunity to comment at today's

11 public hearing and urge EPA to carefully consider their

12 concerns and comments prior to final action on the

13 proposed rules and guidelines.

14 The Alliance represents over 450 member

15 companies engaged in all aspects of environmentally

16 responsible exploration and production of oil and

17 natural gas across the West. The Alliance represents

18 independents, the majority of which are small businesses

19 with an average of 15 employees. The regulatory burdens

20 imposed by the recent onslaught of federal and state

21 regulations has had a particularly acute impact on the

22 Alliance's members. Please consider these comments on

23 EPA's proposals for still more federal regulations, many

24 duplicative of state requirements, in light of that

25 unique Western and small-business perspective.
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1 My first comment concerns the time made

2 available by EPA for written comment. While the

3 Alliance is willing and able to comment on the proposed

4 Source Determination Rule in 60 days, we need

5 significantly more time to comment on Quad Oa NSPS

6 rules, the draft CTGs, and the Indian Country Minor New

7 Source Review Program proposals. We'd ask for an

8 additional 60 days for making our comments on those

9 rules and proposals due in January; January 16, I

10 believe, of 2016. Thank you.

11 Also, these are high-level comments. More

12 detailed comments can only be prepared after careful

13 examination of the proposals, the regulatory impact

14 analyses, and other important sources of information for

15 these rulemakings as guidelines.

16 Turning to the draft Control Technique

17 Guidelines, the CTGs published last Friday are a

18 resource for states in their determination of reasonably

19 available control technology, or RACT, for existing oil

20 and gas sources in moderate to severe ozone

21 nonattainment areas. The Alliance appreciates that

22 these guidelines do not represent a hard floor or

23 otherwise significantly constrain states in their

24 determination of RACT controls for existing oil and gas

25 sources of the type addressed by EPA in nonattainment
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1 areas. And those controls would be specific to VOC

2 contents.

3 The Alliance's members generally prefer to

4 work with state and tribal permitting authorities to

5 establish RACT when necessary for specific oil and gas

6 source types and emissions of VOCs in their operations.

7 As a threshold matter, we note that the

8 proposed CTGs are based, in large measure, on controls

9 adopted by various states, some as state-only

10 requirements not intended for inclusion in an ozone SIP

11 at the time of adoption. EPA's proposed guidelines

12 recommend including such controls in SIPs, however, and

13 the same controls that are already on the books at the

14 state level, like here in Colorado, have not been fully

15 implemented or evaluated for their effectiveness.

16 Such a proposal at this time would appear to

17 unilaterally remove from further state consideration the

18 effectiveness and feasibility of those controls, which

19 we think is inappropriate, and premature at a minimum.

20 Additionally, for those states with many of

21 the proposed control techniques already in place or

22 being implemented, it does not seem appropriate to

23 require SIP revisions based on the proposed CTGs in just

24 two years' time, especially since those states are ahead

25 of many others. The deadline for SIP revisions should
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1 be three years for all affected states or perhaps three

2 years for those states with many of these types of

3 controls already on the books, rather than just two

4 years.

5 It's time EPA gave progressive states, and the

6 operators located there, some credit for early adoption

7 of improved control techniques.

8 More specific control technique comments

9 include:

10 That the use of methane data from the

11 Greenhouse Gas Reporting Program and back-calculating

12 VOCs based on assumed gas composition is problematic.

13 This is nontoxic methane with low or no VOCs, in the

14 case of dry gas, and we think that the cost benefit

15 calculation suffered in those instances in particular as

16 a result of that approach.

17 There's a lot of misinformation about methane.

18 Methane, like carbon dioxide, is found naturally in the

19 atmosphere. It poses no direct health threat. It's not

20 toxic. There's no national standard for it, and, when

21 used in electricity generation, provides many clean air

22 benefits.

23 Turning very briefly to the Source

24 Determination Rule, the Alliance is concerned that EPA's

25 proposed clarification of the definition of "stationary
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1 source" for this sector is effectively a redefinition

2 that is inconsistent with binding case law and prior EPA

3 regulatory definitions remaining in effect for all other

4 sectors of our economy.

5 That said, and without waiving those concerns,

6 the Alliance strongly prefers the first preferred option

7 for clarifying the meaning of "adjacent" when

8 determining what comprises a stationary source for air

9 permitting purposes in the oil and gas sector. By

10 establishing a specific distance within which sources

11 under common control and in the same industrial grouping

12 are considered adjacent, Option 1 promotes certainty and

13 timeliness in the CAA, the Clean Air Act, permitting of

14 oil and gas in the facilities, which is a critical

15 concern of the oil and gas exploration and production

16 sector.

17 MR. GREEN: I think you have a half a minute.

18 MR. JACUS: Thanks very much.

19 Finally, concerning the effects of a

20 clarification like EPA's Preferred Option 1 -- excuse

21 me. Regarding EPA's Preferred Option 2, allowing for

22 aggregation beyond a quarter mile if facilities exhibit

23 exclusive functional interdependence, this option is not

24 favored by the Alliance and is arguably illegal, in the

25 light of the 2012 ruling of the Sixth Circuit Court of
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1 Appeals in the Summit Petroleum vs. the EPA case.

2 Thank you very much for the opportunity to

3 comment.

4 MR. GREEN: All right. Thank you both.

5 MR. JACUS: Sure.

6 MR. GREEN: Our next speakers will be Alexa

7 Ballenger and Camelia Feibelman.

8 (Ms. Smith replaced Ms. Vetter on the panel.)

9 MS. BALLENGER: Hello. My name is Alex

10 Ballenger, and I'm an environmental sciences student

11 from CU Boulder. I would like to thank you for this

12 opportunity to offer comments.

13 I'm here to speak on behalf of myself and my

14 family and all others who have been impacted in some way

15 by air pollution, in support of the EPA's recently

16 proposed methane pollution standards for the oil and gas

17 industry.

18 As I'm sure you know, methane is an extremely

19 potent greenhouse gas, with more than 80 times the

20 warming impact of carbon dioxide over a 20-year time

21 period. This means it is one of the most powerful

22 greenhouse gas emissions contributing to climate change,

23 and this has far-reaching implications for not only

24 environmental health but public health as well.

25 As someone already suffering from asthma and
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1 upper respiratory disease, I know firsthand the impacts

2 that poor air qualities and smog and soot-forming

3 emissions and hazardous air pollution can have on human

4 health. I do not want this for my future children or

5 theirs, and I'm sure you feel the same way about your

6 own family.

7 The EPA's newly proposed standards will help

8 reduce these, alongside methane, generating immense

9 public health benefits as air quality improves, and

10 acting as an important step in addressing climate change

11 on a national scale. While I applaud these new rules to

12 new and modified sources of methane emissions, I hope

13 that the Agency will take the next step by developing

14 rules to reduce methane emissions from existing sources

15 as well.

16 The oil and gas industry must take

17 responsibility for their pollution, rather than asking

18 the public and our environment to bear the burden alone.

19 And again, thank you for this opportunity to

20 comment.

21 MR. GREEN: All right. Thank you very much.

22 Just real quickly, we have a new panel member,

23 that's Claudia Smith.

24 All right. Go ahead, Ms. Feibelman.

25 MS. FEIBELMAN: Well, first, thank you all so
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1 much for giving us the opportunity to comment. My name

2 is Camilia Feibelman. I'm the director of the Rio

3 Grande Chapter of the Sierra Club, which represents

4 7,000 people throughout the state of New Mexico and West

5 Texas. Ten of us from New Mexico traveled, I think, a

6 collective 20 hours to get here from Farmington and

7 Albuquerque, in part because of the strong feeling that

8 there is a need for action now.

9 You've probably seen the satellite images of

10 the largest methane plume in the country hovering over

11 our Four Corners area, which many call a national

12 sacrifice zone, which supplies a lot of the fossil fuels

13 that power our homes.

14 So together we drove up. We're young people,

15 middle-aged people, and seniors. We're urban people and

16 rural people and tribal people. We're kids and nurses

17 and citizens.

18 So all of you from New Mexico, can you wave,

19 wave to everybody and say, We've come a long way to have

20 you hear us. We thank you for putting out these rules.

21 We think they're incredibly important.

22 Our main hope is that you will apply them to

23 existing oil and gas operations. It's our understanding

24 that by 2018, 90 percent of the methane emitted will

25 come from existing sources, and this seems absolutely
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1 essential. The technology exists, it's job creating,

2 and it's natural resources that can be sold on the

3 market.

4 A little bit about New Mexico. In 2013 New

5 Mexico emitted, through leaking, flaring and venting,

6 about 250,000 metric tons of methane. That's enough to

7 power the entire city of Albuquerque, about a half a

8 million people, for a year. Since 2009 New Mexico has

9 lost $42.7 million in royalties due to leaking, venting,

10 and flaring.

11 We're one of the poorest states in the

12 country. We have shocking levels of poverty, hunger,

13 throughout our state, that could be attended by this

14 lost revenue. In New Mexico we have 180,000 people who

15 suffer from asthma. As Elliot Jim mentioned, he can't

16 even go biking in his own hometown because of the impact

17 on his health. Two of our counties exceed ozone levels.

18 And interestingly enough, of the 475 oil and

19 gas producers in New Mexico, fewer than ten have joined

20 the EPA's voluntary methane reduction program. The

21 voluntary program is not working. These need to be

22 required rules. And again, that rule ought to emphasize

23 existing wells so that we can capture that 90 percent or

24 so of methane release that will source from existing

25 wells.
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1 We also think that inspections should occur

2 monthly so that we can really keep on top of

3 implementation.

4 I guess I should just close by saying we're on

5 the road to Paris. Our nation and the President and our

6 citizens have to show, before the world community, that

7 we're pulling our part, that we're doing our part.

8 We're a fairly small portion of the world's population,

9 and yet we use so many of its resources, causing grave

10 consequences to the places that can least afford to

11 handle it.

12 I spent ten years in Puerto Rico, where the

13 effects of global warming are on the forefront: Coral

14 bleaching, erosion of our coastal areas. In New Mexico

15 we're in a deep drought that, even with lots of summer

16 rain, we're not even close to emerging out of.

17 So at the end of the day, we've got to keep

18 fuels in the ground, especially the fuels on public

19 lands. It is just a shame to see a small few making

20 lots of money off fossil fuel extraction when the rest

21 of us are paying for it with our health.

22 So we hope you'll do everything to see these

23 rules implemented and applicable to existing sources.

24 Thank you.

25 MR. GREEN: All right. Thank you very much.
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1 Before we go on, I just want you to know that

2 the light is working sometimes and sometimes it's not.

3 So I don't want to interrupt people to let you know that

4 there's only one minute left, so when we get to the

5 five-minute point, if the light's not working at that

6 time, I'll just let you know.

7 Our next speakers will be Christina Aguilar

8 and Cynthia Martinez.

9 (Ms. Vetter replaced Ms. Smith on the panel.)

10 MS. AGUILAR: Good morning. Thank you for the

11 opportunity to be here. My name is Christina Aguilar,

12 and I am from Denver, Colorado. I am the executive

13 director of the Colorado Organization for Latina

14 Opportunity and Reproductive Rights, otherwise known as

15 COLOR.

16 At COLOR we work to engage and empower the

17 Latino community to speak out about the policies that

18 impact our community. We are committed to ensuring that

19 Latinas and our families are able to access health care

20 and have the opportunities and protections to live with

21 safety and dignity. I am here today as a member of this

22 country's diverse Latino population and as one in five

23 Coloradans who are Latino, to support the EPA's proposed

24 methane pollution standards for the oil and gas

25 industry.
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1 What we know is that when it comes to air

2 pollution, women of color and our families are often

3 disparately impacted. Increased exposure to pollution

4 has a dramatic and damaging impact on women's health.

5 Research shows that exposure to toxic chemicals in

6 polluted environments have resulted in women

7 experiencing early puberty, infertility, uterine

8 fibroids, and other reproductive health issues.

9 This is made worse when you consider the fact

10 that women of color and low-income women are less likely

11 to have access to health insurance or quality affordable

12 care to prevent and address the health problems that may

13 have environmental causes.

14 Methane, as you know, is the most significant

15 driver of climate change in the near term, with an

16 impact on climate change over 80 times as potent as

17 carbon dioxide in a 20-year period. Oil and gas

18 companies emit 7 million tons of methane from their

19 operations each year, the equivalent of 160 coal-fired

20 power plants. These emissions are expected to increase

21 25 percent in the next decade if nothing is done.

22 Unfortunately, in the United States and

23 specifically here in Colorado, Latino communities are

24 among the first and worst impacted by the climate change

25 and unhealthy air quality that is worsened by methane
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1 pollution. Many Latinos live in the country's most air2 polluted cities; and as methane pollution and climate

3 change make our air quality even worse, it is our

4 families' health that is suffering.

5 Already 14 percent of Latino children have

6 received an asthma diagnosis, and they are 40 percent

7 more likely to die from this condition than are our

8 nonLatino white children. It is unconscionable for

9 Latino mothers to have to worry about letting our kids

10 out to play, outside, or to walk to school, for fear

11 that their health is being damaged by the air that they

12 are breathing, both in our neighborhoods and in our

13 communities.

14 Also problematic is the fact that Latinas will

15 face greater threats from methane pollution driven by

16 the warming of our climate, because of where many of our

17 families work. For example, climate-exacerbated extreme

18 heat increases the risk to Latinos, who make up one in

19 four workers in the outdoor industries of both

20 construction and agriculture.

21 Finally, the issues that we face with both

22 financial stability due to economic injustice also means

23 that Latinos in our families do not have the same

24 ability to bounce back after a climate-related disaster.

25 One in four Latinos is living under the poverty line.
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1 This is something that we have to consider as we turn on

2 the news and see that fires are burning in California

3 right now, as I speak. It is impossible to deny that

4 the unusually strong wildfires and floods that we have

5 seen across the Western U.S. in recent years are linked

6 to the change in our climate.

7 We expect more for our community. In fact,

8 85 percent of Latinos believe that reducing air

9 pollution is an important issue our leaders need to

10 address. Many Latinos don't have the resources to deal

11 with these increased health costs. That's why

12 addressing methane pollution is so important to us.

13 The good news is that solutions for cutting

14 methane emissions are not only readily available, but

15 they are cost effective and will help save a valuable

16 American energy source. This is a win-win situation for

17 Latinos and for all Americans, protecting our health,

18 saving energy, and helping address climate change. When

19 we look at the impact global warming is having

20 throughout the country, it is clear that we simply must

21 do more.

22 We look forward to seeing the strongest

23 possible methane standards finalized, alongside a rule

24 to limit methane pollution from existing sources, to

25 achieve the full reduction to methane emissions that
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1 were pledged.

2 Thank you again for this opportunity.

3 MR. GREEN: Thank you. Ms. Martinez.

4 MS. MARTINEZ: Thank you for having me this

5 morning. My name's Cynthia Martinez, and I'm a native

6 of Colorado, specifically Brighton, Colorado, and I am a

7 Brighton city councilwoman. I am also a member of the

8 Colorado Sierra Club and I love Colorado. I am here on

9 my own behalf.

10 We know that people from all over the country

11 have discovered the beauty, uniqueness, and

12 opportunities we have to offer here in Colorado. Our

13 mountains and rivers and unique quality of life are just

14 some of the reasons many people have chosen Colorado as

15 their home.

16 In the previous year, Colorado was the first

17 state to directly regulate methane pollution from the

18 oil and natural gas industry. Our rules included

19 stringent measures to detect and repair leaks, minimize

20 venting and flaring. Our economy is growing at a much

21 faster rate than we could have anticipated. And given

22 the rapid growth of all oil and gas development, it only

23 makes sense we would continue to regulate methane

24 pollution, and it -- it is very crucial to protecting

25 the health and welfare of Colorado.
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1 As a Brighton city councilwoman, I worked hard

2 at bringing up-to-date rules and regulations in

3 preparation of the oil and gas industry partaking in our

4 area. It was the intent of our council that working

5 with the oil and gas industry was crucial due to the

6 recent enactment of new regulations by the Colorado Oil

7 and Gas Conservation Commission governing such matters.

8 However, we had some very serious concerns regarding the

9 protection of our domestic water supply.

10 Through our city council staff and our

11 planning commission, we were able to work with the

12 Colorado Oil and Gas Conservation Commission in adopting

13 a new order, which set forth specific requirements of

14 oil and gas industry to protect groundwater in and

15 around Brighton.

16 This special rule recognized the unusual

17 circumstance that Brighton had in the majority of its

18 needs for water supply from shallow groundwater wells.

19 The order established buffer zones and best management

20 practices and prevents the drilling of new oil and gas

21 wells within 500 feet of existing city water wells and

22 within 300 feet of any river, stream, lake or ditch

23 which is part of the water supply system for our city.

24 Additional groundwater sampling is required

25 within a one-half mile radius from any existing city
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1 well and within 500 feet of a river, stream, or a lake

2 related to the Brighton water supply.

3 The best management practice for any new wells

4 within these defined areas require additional measures

5 such as SNIPA (phonetic) drilling systems, containment

6 of fluids within tanks, berms and containment devices,

7 automated monitoring and shutoff capabilities, and

8 emergency spill define systems.

9 This order was the culmination of the

10 cooperative efforts by our City staff, representatives

11 from the Colorado Oil and Gas Conservation Commission,

12 the Colorado Department of Public Health & Environment,

13 representatives from the oil and gas industry, and our

14 community.

15 Why is this experience so important? It is

16 important to understand how we arrived at our goal. We

17 collaborated with many different partnerships. We

18 educated each other as to our concerns and utilized our

19 expertise. We worked through difficult times to

20 understand each other's positions and issues. And we

21 accomplished so much more: A mutual victory for all of

22 us.

23 My point is, whether it is water supply from

24 shallow groundwater wells or methane pollution, it is

25 our responsibility to work together on solutions. I
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1 believe my experience in working with the oil and gas

2 industry was crucial, and we must continue working

3 together to protect our citizens' environment and, most

4 importantly, our future, so that we all succeed.

5 Colorado ranks third in the nation for

6 companies that manufacture, sell, and support methane

7 control technologies. It is the home to 19 of these

8 companies, the majority of which are small businesses,

9 and four companies in the industry have manufacturing

10 plants in our states. These companies equal jobs.

11 Our state regulations demonstrate that smart

12 environment policy can go hand in hand with economic

13 growth. But remember, when methane is released into the

14 air, so too are harmful pollutants that have significant

15 public health consequences. This includes toxic

16 chemicals, like benzene, which are linked to cancer, and

17 other smog-forming pollutants. These industrial leaks

18 are like an invisible oil spill happening every day.

19 We all deserve to breathe clean air, free from

20 toxic ozone and lethal emissions from oil and gas

21 production. We can protect our state by adopting strong

22 rules to protect our quality and public health and

23 welfare. These rules are a critical opportunity to

24 much-needed commonsense protections in place.

25 It is our responsibility to protect our
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1 community. I love Colorado and believe that we are

2 leading the way in protecting our future.

3 Thank you for your time this morning.

4 MR. GREEN: All right. Thank you both very

5 much.

6 Our next speakers are Bruce Baizel and Korby

7 Bracken. Mr. Baizel.

8 MR. BAIZEL: Good morning. Thank you for the

9 chance to make comments. My name is Bruce Baizel. I'm

10 the director of the Oil & Gas Accountability Project and

11 the Energy Program for Earthworks, a nonprofit

12 organization. I also serve on the STRONGER board, which

13 is the local stakeholder group that looks to state oil

14 and gas regulations across the country. I'm one of the

15 environmental stakeholders on that board.

16 Today I'm just speaking on the behalf of

17 Earthworks, and I'm speaking to the methane rule, not to

18 the aggregation or ozone.

19 Our organization has worked on oil and gas

20 issues for more than two decades, and we commented on

21 the NSPS for the oil and natural gas source category in

22 2012. We have thousands of members throughout the Rocky

23 Mountain states, in Texas, in California, and in the

24 Marcellus Shale region. Many of our members are and

25 will be affected by the climate change impacts of the
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1 largely unregulated emissions of methane from oil and

2 gas operations throughout those states.

3 Overall, we strongly support the rules of the

4 NSPS as significant steps in addressing methane

5 emissions from upstream oil and gas operations. We are

6 seeing a reduction in leaks in Colorado due to

7 Colorado's recently adopted methane rule, so we are

8 confident that these amendments by EPA will also lead to

9 significant reduction in leaks and emissions of methane

10 in states that have not directly regulated methane.

11 We also believe that the rule will provide

12 health co-benefits to those who live close to the

13 thousands of oil and gas facilities covered by this

14 rule, and we believe that the rule will provide an

15 economic benefit to this industry through the capture of

16 additional product that can be sold in the marketplace.

17 We are confident that an industry which has figured out

18 horizontal drilling techniques will also be able to find

19 a way to comply with this rule while remaining

20 profitable.

21 We appreciate that the amendments will apply

22 to new, reconstructed, and modified equipment,

23 processes, and activities across the oil and natural gas

24 source category. This represents the first step towards

25 the full regulatory coverage that is needed for this
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1 significant range of methane emission sources. However,

2 here on the Front Range, in the San Juan Basin where I

3 live, and in other areas of the Rockies, emissions from

4 the thousands of existing wells and facilities already

5 constitute a significant source of emissions and

6 resulting impacts to workers and to people living,

7 working, or going to school nearby.

8 At Earthworks for the past year and a half, we

9 have been documenting the emissions from oil and gas

10 facilities in Colorado, New Mexico, North Dakota,

11 California, Texas, Ohio, and Pennsylvania, with an

12 infrared camera. Generally we find that older existing

13 facilities seem to be leaking more methane emissions

14 than new facilities, as shown in videos.

15 And I'll be submitting these comments

16 electronically, so you'll have the links to them.

17 This certainly seems to be the case up here in

18 the Niobrara and in the San Juan and especially in the

19 New Mexico portion of the San Juan Basin.

20 In addition, the Climate Action Plan for

21 Colorado, recently released, reinforces that more will

22 need to be done to rein in methane emissions, that that

23 plan highlights the greenhouse gas emissions in the

24 state will increase by 77 percent from 1990 to 2030.

25 And if you look at the Figure 31 on Page 19,
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1 that's where I'm getting that from. And this is, in

2 part, due to increased emissions from the oil and gas

3 sector in the state. This illustrates why we need the

4 EPA rules and standards to cover existing as well as new

5 oil and gas facilities.

6 For these reasons, we urge the EPA to adopt

7 these proposed amendments without delay and to begin the

8 process of controlling emissions from existing oil and

9 gas facilities as soon as possible.

10 I thank you for traveling to Denver and

11 holding these hearings and for your attention.

12 MR. GREEN: All right. Thank you very much.

13 Mr. Bracken.

14 MR. BRACKEN: Good morning. My name is Korby

15 Bracken. I'm the director of Health Safety &

16 Environment at Anadarko Petroleum Corporation, Rockies

17 operations, both providing general comment and specific

18 comments on the four proposed rules that the EPA has

19 released.

20 Anadarko is one of the nation's leading

21 producers of clean-burning natural gas. Anadarko is

22 proud that our voluntary actions and collaborative

23 approach with regulators and other stakeholders are

24 resulting in cleaner air, fewer emissions, and more of

25 our product reaching our consumers.
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1 Our company has played a transformative role

2 in how energy resources are being produced, which

3 includes implementing emission-reduction technologies

4 and best practices across our operating areas. We also

5 focus on improving the science around methane emissions,

6 through studies with respected academic institutions and

7 the Environmental Defense Fund. Earlier this year we

8 demonstrated our support for a collaborative,

9 constructive, and state-led approach that resulted in

10 the modifications to Colorado's VOC rule, known as

11 Reg 7.

12 Primarily as a result of voluntary practices,

13 the natural gas industry has dramatically decreased

14 methane emissions while increasing production to the

15 point now that we are able to export natural gas to

16 other parts of the world. Technologies employed to date

17 by our industry have reduced methane emissions from

18 hydraulically fractured natural gas wells by almost

19 78 percent while natural gas production has increased by

20 38 percent.

21 Anadarko, alone, in the DJ Basin, has reduced

22 volatile organic compound emissions by 98 percent from

23 2013 to 2014, while increasing our production by

24 10 million barrels over the year, all through voluntary

25 efforts.
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1 These constructive and collaborative efforts

2 are reducing emissions and ensuring natural gas remains

3 abundant and affordable and continues to be the most

4 reliable and salable option allowing for U.S. carbon

5 reduction targets.

6 Anadarko offers the following specific

7 comments to the proposed rules:

8 Regarding Quad O and the CTGs, we share the

9 concerns of our industry that EPA's one-size-fits-all

10 approach to methane reduction will significantly and

11 unnecessarily increase costs. Such an approach would

12 also carry the unintended consequences of curbing

13 further emissions reductions by discouraging voluntary

14 efforts by oil and gas producers and providing states

15 the opportunity to come up with state-specific rules

16 that fit operations in their region.

17 Detailed, prescriptive regulations restrict

18 innovation and can inadvertently set limits on actual

19 emission reductions. By contrast, a combination of

20 collaboration and voluntary actions often lead to more

21 workable and constructive regulatory structures. We

22 urge the EPA to allow the development of these

23 strategies and provide flexibility.

24 If EPA continues to propose revisions to

25 Quad Oa, it needs to consider whether it is written in a
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1 manner which industry is able to comply. In the 2012

2 NSPS rule, of the original implementation of Quad O, we

3 filled out a phased-in approach for compliance. We

4 believe EPA should consider whether or not a similar

5 phased approach for compliance schedules is warranted

6 for this proposed rule.

7 Operators are already implementing voluntary

8 leak detection repair -- detection measurements based on

9 regulatory and voluntary programs. EPA's in a position

10 to allow such existing leak detection and repair

11 programs to satisfy federal requirements. This will

12 incentivize companies to continue to develop innovative

13 and cost-efficient strategies around leak detection and

14 repair.

15 Regarding source determination or source

16 aggregation: The proposed Source Determination Rule

17 provides minimal to no environmental benefit while

18 significantly increasing the time burden and cost of the

19 permitting process to states and permit applicants.

20 Controls for upstream oil and gas facilities are based

21 on the type of equipment installed already. The type of

22 equipment on-site will not change based on the

23 aggregation of locations. The proposal will simply

24 change the complexity of permitting, with no air quality

25 improvements. We strongly encourage the EPA not to
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1 finalize the proposed Source Determination Rule.

2 Finally, for the Federal New Source Review on

3 Indian Country: As written, this particular rule has no

4 utility, will not allow for a streamlined permitting

5 mechanism for Utah, in which we operate, in the tribal

6 area shale, due to the inability to use the federal

7 implementation process for synthetic minors and in

8 nonattainment areas or areas that are anticipated to be

9 nonattainment.

10 Finally, we request the EPA and the

11 Administration better coordinate its regulatory efforts

12 with the Bureau of Land Management. We strongly

13 encourage the EPA to extend the comment period to allow

14 a minimum of 30 days to overlap the proposed -- the

15 proposed BLM Venting and Flaring rule. Without this

16 extension, stakeholders will not have a chance to

17 understand the cumulative and overlapping impacts, in

18 order to provide meaningful feedback, to avoid

19 conflicting requirements across several agencies.

20 Again, thank you for allowing me to speak

21 today.

22 MR. GREEN: All right. Thank you both.

23 Our next speakers are Eva Henry and Pam Eaton.

24 Ms. Henry.

25 MS. HENRY: That'll be me. Good morning. I
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1 am Adams County Commissioner Eva Henry. I represent

2 over 480,000 citizens north of Denver.

3 As an elected official, as a mom and

4 grandmother, I know firsthand how crucial clean air is

5 for our families and communities in Adams County. I

6 also know that steady, good-paying jobs are a

7 front-of-line issue for working people in Adams County.

8 That is why I am proud that the state of Colorado has

9 been a leader on strong rules to limit methane

10 pollution. These rules clean -- clean our air and put

11 our businesses in a great position for growth as the

12 federal government follows suit.

13 In 2014 Colorado became the first state in the

14 nation to tackle methane emissions from the oil and gas

15 industry. I am proud of the strength of our rules and

16 collaborative process that led to their enactment, with

17 industry leaders like Noble, Anandarko, Encana sitting

18 down with the environmental and community leaders to

19 come to an agreement on this.

20 These sensible rules are helping eliminate

21 more than 90,000 tons of smog-forming pollution from our

22 air annually, the same amount produced by all the cars

23 and trucks in Colorado; and more than a hundred thousand

24 tons of methane, a highly potent greenhouse gas.

25 These rules do not kill jobs. They are
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1 fostering a vibrant and growing methane mitigation

2 industry in Colorado. According to a recent report from

3 Datu Research, Colorado ranks third in the nation for

4 clusters of companies that make, sell, and support

5 methane control technologies. The majority of these

6 companies are small businesses. This industry also

7 supports four Colorado manufacturing plants, providing

8 solid jobs across the state.

9 The Colorado methane gas rules did not kill

10 jobs. In the year after the State of Colorado enacted

11 our rules directly regulating methane, according to

12 Federal Bureau of Statistics, my county, Adams County,

13 businesses are second in the nation for job creation.

14 Seeing the success stories, other states have

15 started to follow Colorado's lead. Wyoming, California,

16 Ohio, and Pennsylvania have all adopted or are in the

17 process of adopting rules that will significantly reduce

18 methane and smog-forming pollution from the oil and gas

19 sector. And this year the Western Governor Association

20 passed a resolution highlighting the importance of

21 regulation of methane emissions and a quantization of

22 natural gas that is currently lost to leaks, venting,

23 and flaring throughout the West.

24 Building on Colorado models, these rules will

25 help create a level playing field for the Colorado oil
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1 and gas companies, promote efficiency in the oil and gas

2 industry, and better protect the health of families from

3 oil- and gas-related air pollution.

4 National rules will also help Colorado's

5 methane mitigation industry as other states and regions

6 play catch-up. The oil and gas industry itself has

7 noted that, due to Colorado's strongest-in-the-nation

8 methane rules, they will have to do little, if anything,

9 to demonstrate compliance with the new federal

10 regulations.

11 However, the EPA should go farther. Unlike

12 Colorado, the EPA -- EPA proposal only addresses new

13 wells. It would do nothing to reduce pollution from the

14 hundreds of thousands of oil and gas wells that are

15 already out there.

16 Also the EPA should take a closer look at

17 Colorado's strong requirements for companies to

18 regularly check for and fix leaking equipment at

19 drilling and production sites. The EPA rule, as

20 proposed, is leaving far too many tons of pollution on

21 the table, that could be sensibly and cost-effectively

22 controlled, as we have done here in Colorado.

23 This methane rule proposal is a good start,

24 but it can and should go even farther to protect our air

25 and foster a vital Colorado economy success story.
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1 Thank you.

2 MR. GREEN: Thank you.

3 MS. EATON: Hi. Excuse me. Hi. I'm Pam

4 Eaton, and I'm here today to speak about the NSPS rule.

5 So I'm the senior director of Climate

6 Emissions Reduction Campaign of the Wilderness Society.

7 The Wilderness Society is a not-for-profit organization

8 dedicated for more than 75 years to the protection and

9 management of our federal public lands. And I

10 appreciate the opportunity to speak today in support of

11 efforts to reduce methane emissions from the oil and gas

12 sector.

13 Methane emissions from oil and gas development

14 are a significant problem for health, the climate, and,

15 when it comes to federal public lands, taxpayer

16 revenues. Currently more than 30 -- 36 million acres of

17 federal public lands and minerals are under a lease by

18 the oil and gas industry, and a total of 6 million acres

19 are in production. That production comes from more than

20 94,000 wells. And another 9 -- 5900 drilling permits

21 have been approved and have not yet been drilled.

22 The venting, flaring, and fugitive leaks of

23 methane associated with this potential development have

24 resulted in significant and costly waste of natural gas,

25 impairment of public health, and increased greenhouse
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1 gas emissions. A recent report by ICF found that across

2 federal and tribal lands, oil and gas companies are

3 losing enough natural gas each year through leaks,

4 unintentional venting and flaring to equal nearly $330

5 million at current market prices. That's enough natural

6 gas to meet the heating and cooking needs of 1.6 million

7 homes. And over a million tons of methane emitted from

8 oil and gas operations on federal and tribal lands in

9 2013. EPA has calculated that this much methane is

10 equal to the greenhouse gas pollution from 5.6 million

11 cars.

12 All told, between 2008 and 2013, venting and

13 flaring of methane from our nation's public lands and

14 water increased by 51 percent. And without new rules to

15 address the problem, it will continue to increase.

16 Proper regulation and oversight is critical

17 for mitigating these impacts, and that's why we're glad

18 to see both EPA and the Bureau of Land Management moving

19 forward with rules to reduce methane emissions and

20 waste. And we hope that EPA and the BLM will continue

21 collaborating to ensure integrative, smart, thorough,

22 and effective regulations of methane emissions and

23 waste.

24 And we appreciate the Obama Administration's

25 focus on moving forward with guidelines on the oil and
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1 gas development, to stop the waste of the nation's

2 resources.

3 The regulations in front of us today are a

4 great start, but more needs to be done. So we hope to

5 see, one, EPA strengthen and finalize the rules of

6 methane emissions from the oil and gas sector; a new

7 rule from BLM to reduce natural gas waste on new and

8 existing sources; and the initiation of EPA guidelines

9 to reduce -- reduce methane emissions from existing

10 sources in the near future.

11 Thank you for having us here today and for

12 listening and for your hard work on moving forward with

13 these regulations.

14 MR. GREEN: All right. Thank you very much.

15 Our next speaker will be Joe Salazar.

16 MR. SALAZAR: Good morning.

17 MR. GREEN: Good morning.

18 MR. SALAZAR: Shall I begin?

19 MR. GREEN: Yes, please.

20 MR. SALAZAR: Thank you very much. I'm State

21 Representative Joe Salazar. I represent Thornton and

22 parts of Unincorporated Adams County. I want to thank

23 you for being here today. I want to thank you just for

24 being in your positions. I understand what it's like to

25 be in tough positions, and sometimes praise as well as
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1 disdain is heaped upon you, and I get that and I

2 appreciate you.

3 I heard some members of the industry come up

4 and talk about cost compliance and talk about the

5 fearful things that would happen here in the state of

6 Colorado and across the nation if the EPA enacts these

7 rules. And while I disagree with my friends on the side

8 of industry, one thing that happens here in the state of

9 Colorado is that if they're not trying to get you to

10 drink the fracking fluid to show how safe it is, they're

11 trying to get you to drink the Kool-Aid about tough

12 compliance.

13 And we heard that in 2014, when Colorado

14 adopted the most stringent rules on methane in the

15 nation. We heard them come up, talk about how the

16 apocalypse was going to happen, the sky was going to

17 fall, it's going to chase jobs away, the industry's

18 going to fold. And we've been hearing that for a number

19 of years now, and guess what? None of that is true.

20 And, in fact, the industry individuals who

21 came up here never told you that either today. They

22 didn't tell you that, after 2014, that Colorado's

23 economy continued to boom, that they're still making

24 profits, and yet Colorado's air is a little bit easier

25 to breathe because of our rules.
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1 I could regale you with all sorts of data, and

2 I probably wouldn't do that because you know the data

3 better than I do. But I want to talk to you about what

4 we see happening here in Colorado, what we see which

5 precipitates such rules being enforced here in the state

6 of Colorado.

7 I went camping this weekend. I went to

8 Granby, beautiful place. I don't know if all of you are

9 from Colorado or not. But I went camping, woke up in

10 the morning and it was freezing cold, and walked outside

11 my tent and saw the beautiful aspen trees. The leaves

12 had just turned this beautiful vibrant gold.

13 And right behind these beautiful trees and

14 right behind these beautiful leaves was pine beetle

15 kill, all over the place, the same pine beetle kill that

16 I see when I drive to the Navajo Reservation once or

17 twice a month, going over Wolf Creek Pass, as a result

18 of climate change because of the warming of our

19 environment because of gases like methane.

20 And it made me sad because my family's been

21 here a long time, both Spanish and indigenous sides. I

22 can trace my roots back to the late 1500s, early 1600s

23 on the Spanish side; about 25,000 years, the indigenous

24 side. And I've always taken great pains to be a good

25 caretaker of this state and fight for the environment,
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1 because fighting for the environment means that I'm

2 fighting for my constituents, I'm fighting for the

3 population, I'm fighting for my children.

4 I was fully in the support of the stringent

5 methane, because that was a way that we could fight to

6 ensure that our kids would have good air to breathe.

7 Because, after all, isn't that what we're trying to do,

8 is we're trying to ensure that our children have good

9 air to breathe, clean water to drink, and to leave the

10 Earth a better place than what it was when we came here?

11 I was at a press conference a little while

12 ago, and one thing that I said, and I hold true to this,

13 is that you don't put profits over people and you don't

14 put profits over the environment. We are better than

15 that, or we should be better than that.

16 I ask that the EPA adopt these rules. In

17 fact, I ask the EPA to adopt rules that are more

18 stringent than Colorado's. It's not going to result in

19 the apocalypse to the industry. They'll still make

20 profits. But we'll know that we'll be protected.

21 Thank you very much.

22 MR. GREEN: Thank you very much.

23 Our next speakers will be Shakti and Paddy

24 McClelland. Shakti will be first.

25 MS. SHAKTI: Does this work? My name is
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1 Shakti. I am on the Lakewood City Council. I'm here

2 speaking on my own behalf, not on behalf of the City,

3 and speaking in support of these proposed regulations

4 and to encourage maybe strengthening them in certain

5 ways.

6 So I think the regulations are very important,

7 for a number of reasons. One has to do with the

8 frequency of extreme weather events. At the city level,

9 we are on the front lines when it comes to responding to

10 extreme weather events. In Lakewood we have recently

11 increased our funding for storm water and drainage and

12 emergency response, and that's in response to the -- the

13 weather patterns that we're seeing in Colorado.

14 The second reason has to do with air quality.

15 And that has to do with our -- the fact that we're out

16 of compliance for ozone in this area, the -- just the

17 basics of we want to make sure we're preserving human

18 health. And also we want a pristine view of the

19 mountains. That matters to us in Colorado.

20 So both of those -- these issues, can't

21 only -- we can't address them alone. And if we look at

22 the ozone, as an example, we already have methane rules

23 here; but on the high ozone days, more than half of the

24 ozone, models tell us, come in from other states. And

25 so it just reinforces the fact that we can't do this
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1 alone and this is an area where it's appropriate to have

2 federal regulation.

3 The third reason is the protection of the

4 reputation of natural gas. To some extent natural gas

5 has a reputation of producing less greenhouse gases, and

6 it's important to maintain that reputation, to the

7 extent that it's true. And it's also important for

8 Colorado because it's an important industry in our

9 state.

10 And then the final one just has to do with a

11 sort of basic practicality. If we're going to be

12 drilling and getting methane, we should be using it to

13 heat homes and cook.

14 So I -- I support the regulations, and I think

15 that they should be strengthened, particularly in the

16 ways that we see Colorado having already successfully

17 implemented regulations; and most importantly, to

18 include existing wells just because the impact of those

19 regulations will be so much greater.

20 So I thank you for your work and for the

21 opportunity to speak.

22 MR. GREEN: Thank you. Ms. McClelland.

23 MS. McCLELLAND: Hello. I'm Paddy McClelland.

24 I'm here with The Climate Reality Project but mostly

25 also with another group, called Wall of Women Colorado,
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1 and we're a group of mothers. I'm here as a mother

2 today, more than anything; a woman, a mother. I have

3 two young sons, who just headed off to college.

4 I'm a third-generation Coloradan. And so what

5 it was like in Colorado is, you know, the air was clean,

6 we didn't have to look at fracking wells and water

7 storage tanks. We could go in the mountains and go on

8 hikes and not worry about breathing. And that has

9 changed. What it was like is over.

10 I was here a year ago, at this same meeting,

11 and I think a lot has changed in a year. I think the

12 elephant in the living room is climate change, and we

13 all know it.

14 I started because my young son -- I'm going to

15 tell the polar bear thing. That makes a lot of people

16 annoyed, but I'm going to. When my boys were about

17 seven years old -- they're twins -- and we were watching

18 Planet Earth or something. And all of a sudden there

19 was a scene with a mother polar bear, and she hit their

20 little bottoms to run up the hill because the ice was

21 cracking behind her.

22 And I have twins too and so it kind of touched

23 my heart in a way that other things don't. And, but my

24 son looked up at me, and he had tears just rolling down

25 his face, and he said, "Mamma, what are we going to do
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1 about it?" So that was my moment, that was my moment of

2 change.

3 Now I just want to say that, you know, it's

4 amazing to me because it's kind of insanity, another

5 study. And we all know it's happening. Always another

6 study, more information. We have a house burning down

7 now, and we all know it. Every scientific study,

8 everything that happens, we know our house is burning

9 down. And you know what? My children and your children

10 are in that house.

11 And I would just like to say, there's some

12 choices here. You're going to, you know, stand by and

13 just watch it burn? Are we going to sit there and just

14 have a glass of wine or a cup of coffee and just pretend

15 it's not burning? Or are we going to try to stop it?

16 Or there's another thing: We could just throw a little

17 more methane on it to make it happen quicker. So I just

18 contend, this is -- this is all wrong. Everybody in

19 this room knows it's wrong.

20 There's one more, beaver, story I want to tell

21 you. When the beavers hear the water running in their

22 home, they all rush out and try to find wood to fix the

23 problem in the dam, because they know they're in

24 trouble. And I would contend, every person in this room

25 hears the water running, and we need to decide.
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1 I'd like to just take the last ten seconds and

2 have everybody in this room think about, in 20 years,

3 what you're going to tell your children or grandchildren

4 you did about this fire burning. Just a moment silence

5 for, like, ten seconds.

6 Thank you.

7 (Pause in the proceedings.)

8 MS. SHAKTI: Thank you all.

9 MR. GREEN: All right. Thank you.

10 (Pause in the proceedings.)

11 MR. GREEN: All right. Thank you. Our next

12 speakers are Su Ryden and Phillip Doe.

13 MS. RYDEN: Good morning. I'm Su Ryden. I'm

14 a state representative representing House District 36,

15 which is east Aurora and east of Aurora. Most of my

16 constituents are in -- all of them are in Arapahoe

17 County at this point.

18 I've been working on issues in the legislature

19 on oil and gas issues for several years now. And I'm

20 sure it's already been said this morning, but I do want

21 to reemphasize that I feel we've done a lot of really

22 good work here in Colorado. In fact, in 2014, under

23 Governor Hickenlooper's leadership, we became the first

24 state in the nation to tackle methane emissions from the

25 oil and gas industry, and we're proud of the strength of
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1 our rules and the collaborative process that led to

2 their enactment. And I believe that it's actually given

3 the companies doing business in Colorado a competitive

4 edge in being able to adapt to any new regulations

5 nationwide.

6 So I would really encourage you to -- to at

7 least come to Colorado's level; and if you can, go as

8 far as beyond that as is practical and possible.

9 So that's mainly what I want to say, is I'm

10 proud of what we've done here. Our -- our companies

11 that are operating here have told us that they feel that

12 they would be able to reach standards everywhere without

13 a lot of extra effort, since they've already done it

14 here.

15 So thank you very much.

16 MR. GREEN: Thank you. Mr. Doe.

17 MR. DOE: Yes, my name is Phillip Doe. I'm

18 the environmental director for a grassroots organization

19 here in Colorado called Be the Change. Wes Wilson and

20 my colleagues spoke earlier. He did all the heavy

21 lifting on the details of what we think some of the

22 limitations of this rulemaking is.

23 And let me say, before I go any further, that

24 I once was in charge of national rulemaking of the

25 federal lobby association of those rules and
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1 regulations, so while I have sympathy, I don't have a

2 lot. They're not throwing tomatoes at you. So that's

3 what they did to me.

4 First, I -- my hope had been that I could show

5 you some slides of FLIR camera work we did this spring

6 with Earthworks. Couldn't do that, but you can find

7 them on the Internet: May 2015 Front Range FLIR. Now,

8 keep in mind, they show you two views. They show you

9 the view you see without the flare camera, without the

10 infrared, and what you see afterwards.

11 Keep in mind that most -- all of those

12 operations, all of those fracking operations, are under

13 the state's air quality guidelines. They are shocking.

14 The amount of toxic gases we're introducing into the

15 atmosphere is simply shocking. So one of the things I

16 would ask you to do is look at those. And think of it

17 as right that you also regulate existing oil and gas

18 wells.

19 On to a larger subject, and that is the

20 leasing of public land to the oil and gas industry.

21 Several years ago, when we were very concerned about the

22 amount of land that was being leased, we did some

23 checking, and about 10 percent of the land in the state

24 was already leased to the oil -- public land was leased

25 to the oil and gas industry.
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1 Estimates are out there that if President

2 Obama's rules, the Clean Air rules, are successful,

3 we'll reduce toxic emissions by about 5 gigatons by

4 2030. If we were to stop leasing the public -- public

5 lands in this country, offshore and on, we'd reduce the

6 toxic air emissions by 450 gigatons.

7 Now, that is something we can contend with.

8 And we think it should be done. And if it isn't done, I

9 think that the public will simply insist on it by

10 evermore forceful means.

11 I thank you for your attention.

12 MR. GREEN: All right. Thank you very much.

13 All right. We seem to be out of scheduled

14 speakers, so is there anyone in the room that would like

15 to speak at this time?

16 All right. Well, we have three people

17 scheduled to speak that we're still waiting for, so I'll

18 keep the hearing open until we see if these folks show

19 up. If not, if somebody wants to speak in the meantime,

20 please just let us know.

21 (Pause in the proceedings.)

22 MR. GREEN: All right. We do have a speaker,

23 so if you would introduce yourself, tell us who you are

24 and spell your name out for the court reporter, we'd

25 appreciate it. Thanks.
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1 MS. MILLS-BRIA: My name is Barbara

2 Mills-Bria. The last name is spelled M-i-l-l-s, dash,

3 B-r-i-a. And I just wanted to echo what my colleagues

4 from Be the Change have said about the oil and gas

5 industry and the methane emissions and what's going on

6 that we can't see, that we should be seeing, and how

7 harmful these gases are.

8 I feel like, if we could have trusted the oil

9 and gas industry a bit more, this would be easier for

10 you. But they have not -- they've been disingenuous

11 through the years, either threatening to pull out or --

12 or whatever. But, I mean, frankly, the Saudi Arabians

13 are affecting the bottom line more than any regulation.

14 The biggest industry in Colorado is the

15 recreational industry, so why are we not protecting that

16 as stringently as possible, instead of the boom-and-bust

17 oil and gas industry?

18 So thank you very much.

19 MR. GREEN: Thank you. Anyone else? Come on

20 up.

21 MS. LANDA-POSAN: Hello. So my name is

22 Griselda, and that's spelled G-r-i-s-e-l-d-a. My last

23 name is Landa-Posan; L-a-n-d-a, hyphen, P-o-s-a-n. So I

24 am a student at CSU. I'm currently studying wildlife

25 and conservation biology, and I'm actually here with --
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1 to protect our future as well as representing ACSU,

2 which is the student government at CSU.

3 So, first of all, thank you very much for this

4 opportunity. I just want to let you know, I've got to

5 speak on behalf of all my students. At CSU we are all

6 very passionate about protecting our environment. And

7 we think that what you're doing, taking these steps to

8 help protect our environment from methane gas and things

9 like that, is very, very important.

10 But something that we feel is a big issue is

11 the fact that this will only cover new and modified

12 infrastructure, even while existing sources are, by far,

13 the major source of the problem. So some studies have

14 shown that by 2018, nearly 90 percent of all methane

15 emissions in the oil and gas sector will actually come

16 from sources that now exist, which aren't covered by

17 this proposal. So I just feel like that's something

18 that's really important to keep in mind and always

19 strive to do better.

20 Thank you so much for what you're doing, but

21 we can always try harder for the coming generations.

22 I'm sure you all have people you love, that are younger,

23 so just do everything -- everything you do, just do with

24 passion and love, and we can -- we can make a

25 difference.
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1 Thank you.

2 MR. GREEN: Thank you very much.

3 Come on up. If you would give us your name

4 and spell it out for us, we'd appreciate that.

5 MS. JOHANNES: Yeah, it's Meriam, M-e-r --

6 MR. GREEN: Use the microphone, please.

7 MS. JOHANNES: Oh, sorry. M-e-r-i-a-m; and

8 it's Johannes, J-o-h-a-n-n-e-s.

9 And I guess my point of view is, I work in a

10 pediatric office in Lakewood. We have a very large

11 Medicaid population, and kind of looking at, you know,

12 there's always a cost; whether one way or the other,

13 someone pays. And we have a lot of patients who come in

14 with asthma-related illnesses. I just kind of looked

15 up, real fast, the facts. Medicaid spends $60 on every

16 person on Medicaid to pay for respiratory medicines and

17 care. The increase in asthma, I think, is not quite

18 10 percent, maybe 7 or 8 percent overall.

19 And every year we have kids that come into the

20 office, very low oxygen, very sick, and they go out in

21 ambulances. And a lot of it is because people with

22 private health insurance, they're affected as well. If

23 you have a child and you're very worried that you have a

24 $500 bill to go to the emergency room, you tend to go to

25 the doctor more. And so those kids go out very sick,
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1 and then we add on an ambulance cost.

2 So I just kind of wanted to point that out,

3 because it's very sad when you see that, you know, up

4 close.

5 Thanks.

6 MR. GREEN: Thank you very much. And just so

7 you know, when we do our cost benefit analysis that we

8 do with every rule, we take this type of thing into

9 effect and we calculate the costs and the benefits of

10 that. So thank you for your comments.

11 MS. JOHANNES: Thank you.

12 MR. GREEN: Sure, come on up. Did one of you

13 want to speak as well? Do you want to speak?

14 MS. GELFUSO GOETZ: Yes.

15 MR. GREEN: Okay. Come up.

16 MS. GELFUSO GOETZ: Do I need a mike?

17 MR. GREEN: Pardon me? Yes, please, use the

18 mic.

19 MS. GELFUSO GOETZ: That one?

20 MR. GREEN: Yep. All right. If you would,

21 your name, and spell it out for us.

22 MS. GELFUSO GOETZ: My name is Andrea Gelfuso,

23 G-e-l-f-u-s-o, Goetz. I teach environmental law at the

24 University of Denver. I taught the Clean Air Act last

25 night, and I'm sorry I didn't have my students come with
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1 me today. But you've heard from a lot of good public

2 speakers, because they're members of the public who are

3 concerned and we know the environmental and the health

4 impacts of uncontrolled methane.

5 I worked for the Department of Interior. I

6 studied BLM in oil and gas cases. I remember when

7 industry said that horizontal drilling would put them

8 out of business. So that's a common refrain from

9 industry. Colorado passed the toughest methane rules in

10 the country. That hasn't put the oil and gas industry

11 out of work. It's overproduction. So that isn't the

12 problem. It's not the methane rules; we understand

13 that. Colorado has the toughest methane rules in the

14 country, but because of transboundary pollution,

15 Colorado already has a -- has an ozone issue.

16 Colorado took the lead in these methane rules.

17 EPA really needs to help out states that are working

18 hard to improve air quality, who are trying to comply

19 with the Clean Air Act and trying to protect public

20 health. Colorado was a leader. EPA can be a leader for

21 the nation and raise the bar, which will protect public

22 health and the environment.

23 So I -- and I think we really do. 47,000 oil

24 and gas wells just in Colorado. Those are the existing

25 ones. We need to work on, you have to -- you have to
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1 regulate existing as well as the new wells.

2 Thank you very much for your time.

3 MR. GREEN: Thank you. Go ahead.

4 MS. SILVER: Hi. My name is Kelsey Silver.

5 That's K-e-l-s-e-y, S-i-l-v-e-r. And I'm a student at

6 Colorado State University, and I'm here to show the

7 effects -- the effects of methane to everyone. I'm here

8 to defend our future. And I'm concerned because I

9 consider this an invisible oil spill, and -- and

10 currently there are no existing source rules for current

11 oil and gas companies.

12 Colorado's extremely important to me, and I

13 plan on living here for a very long time. And while I

14 understand that there are many health benefits

15 associated with this rule -- or I understand that there

16 are, so I really appreciate your work. I do have

17 asthma, and I know very -- of a lot of people at my age

18 that do have it as well.

19 So I thank you for your work, and keep it up.

20 Thank you.

21 MR. GREEN: All right. Thank you very much.

22 All right. We do have a speaker, Rudy

23 Gonzales.

24 Is there anyone else that would like to speak?

25 We're going to break for lunch after Mr. Gonzales, so if
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1 there's anyone else that would like to speak, this is

2 your chance.

3 All right. It's all yours.

4 MR. GONZALES: Hello, good morning. My name

5 is Rudy Gonzales, Rudolph Gonzales, G-o-n-z-a-l-e-s.

6 I'm the executive director for Servicio de la Raza,

7 Services for the People, which is a now 43-year-old

8 human service nonprofit serving metro Denver and, some

9 areas of our work, across Colorado.

10 And I'm here today as a member of the Latino

11 population, and I prefer to be called Chicano. And, you

12 know, I was a native of Denver, an extreme native of

13 Colorado, born here in Colorado. And I want to talk

14 about, a little bit about, the issues that methane gas

15 has caused in our community and with our children, our

16 youth.

17 You know, I -- I have -- I have 15 nieces and

18 nephews, and that includes great-nieces and nephews.

19 Ten of those nieces and nephews suffer from asthma. I

20 remember, I have six sisters and a brother, and we were

21 part of the great "baby boomer" generation, and none of

22 us have asthma. I have developed allergies in my late

23 40s; I'm now 57 years old. But born, we -- none of us

24 had asthma. I had one cousin, out of about 200, that

25 had asthma. And now it seems that, more and more, and
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1 very indicative of my nieces and nephews, 10 out of 15.

2 That's 20 percent right there, in that little sample

3 group, that have serious problems with asthma.

4 And so it really is affecting the health of

5 the Latino population in this country, these kind of

6 issues. And we think about where we work, most of us

7 work in outside industries. That is even more alarming,

8 the fact that, you know, we're seeing over 7 million

9 tons of methane, which is 80 percent more dangerous,

10 emitted into our atmosphere.

11 And in the next, what, decade, that should

12 increase by 25 percent? That's untenable. That's

13 unacceptable, especially in this country, especially

14 with our population. Because we're -- you know, we

15 constitute most of the poverty in this country, along

16 with the African American population. And when you look

17 at poverty, we don't have the support systems, we don't

18 have the high-level health insurance and health care.

19 In fact, we oftentimes cannot even access health care.

20 And so where does that leave us? To suffer in

21 silence, to suffer, and with degenerative health

22 conditions. That's unacceptable in our community. So I

23 urge the EPA to continue to do that work to ensure that

24 this country and this -- and our air is healthy for

25 our generations to come and for ourselves.
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1 You know, we talk about oil and gas and, as

2 every industry in this country and this country,

3 obviously capitalism is profit driven, unfortunately.

4 And it's about profit, and it's always a cost

5 compliance: If we have to do this, it's going to cost

6 us more. Well, so what? Our people, each of you, each

7 of us, is just as important as any dollar.

8 So I would -- I would, you know, thank the EPA

9 for enforcing and continue to monitor and increase, you

10 know, regulations on this industry and help us to

11 decrease the emissions of methane in our environment, in

12 our air.

13 Thank you.

14 MR. GREEN: Thank you, Mr. Gonzales.

15 All right. We've got one more. All right.

16 We have Alex Renirie. I know I didn't say that right.

17 MS. RENIRIE: I was going to say, does the

18 pronunciation help? Okay.

19 MR. GREEN: Okay.

20 MS. RENIRIE: Thank you so much for holding

21 this today. Is this working? Should I hold the other

22 one?

23 MR. GREEN: Try that one.

24 MS. RENIRIE: Okay. Hello. My name is Alex

25 Renirie, and I work for the Sierra Club in Santa Fe, New
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1 Mexico, just a few hours south of the methane hot spots

2 in the Four Corners region that's recently drawn

3 national attention.

4 I've heard the stories of communities most

5 affected by rapidly expanding oil and gas operations in

6 our state, and I'm horrified by the damage this industry

7 is inflicting on our people and our climate.

8 New Mexico oil and gas produced over 250,000

9 metric tons of methane in 2013, triggering inescapable

10 damage to our health and our climate in New Mexico. One

11 in four of New Mexico high school students have asthma,

12 which is much higher than the national rate. And in

13 2013 two counties had a combined 16 days that exceeded

14 the national ozone standards, further exacerbating these

15 kids' diseases. Our state has also experienced

16 record-breaking wildfires and droughts in recent years

17 as a result of our warming planet.

18 As a toxic pollutant and one of the most

19 potent greenhouse gases, as we all know, there's no

20 excuse not to act aggressively to cut methane emissions

21 if we want to avoid the most devastating impacts of

22 climate change.

23 Occasionally, when I start to lose sight of

24 what climate change actually means and the realities

25 that we're up against, I go back to this vivid
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1 description that Arthur -- author Mark Lynas wrote about

2 what our world would actually look like at 4 degrees

3 Celcius of warming, a number that, climate scientists

4 agree, that we're already swiftly approaching.

5 "He pored over tens of thousands of scientific

6 papers that used advanced computer modeling . . . [and]

7 studies of geologic records," and paints the following

8 ominous picture:

9 Once upon a time by midcentury

10 Earth is becoming unrecognizable. With

11 seas 3 to 4 feet higher and rising

12 faster, parts of low-lying coastal

13 cities worldwide are periodically

14 underwater, including Boston, New York,

15 and the islands formerly known as the

16 United Kingdom.

17 The major project in the U.S. is

18 moving 150 million coastal city dwellers

19 inland, but interior cities are balking

20 at the unbearable strain of millions of

21 more climate refugees.

22 Savage temperatures dominate,

23 hotter than anything in our species'

24 evolutionary history.

25 Food production is crashing
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1 worldwide and water shortages are

2 chronic. The 60 percent of the world's

3 population whose crops depended on the

4 failing -- failing Asian summer monsoon

5 are starving and thirsting.

6 Climate chaos has put nuclear-armed

7 India, Pakistan, and China on a hair

8 trigger.

9 The world is truly unraveling.

10 Megadroughts.

11 New category 6 hurricanes called

12 "hypercanes."

13 Mass starvation. Cascading

14 economic crises.

15 Failed states.

16 Entire populations fleeing the

17 tropics toward northern climates.

18 Stretched beyond adaptation, it's a

19 civilization in fast-forward collapse,

20 [he writes].

21 But really the deal was sealed when

22 the climate crossed the bright line of

23 2 degrees Celsius and self-reinforcing

24 positive feedback loops triggered

25 runaway change.
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1 By the time 3 degrees inexorably

2 triggered 4, then 5, then 6, Earth

3 resembles the "Mother of All Disasters"

4 that occurred 250 million years ago when

5 95 percent of all terrestrial and marine

6 species went extinct. Adaptation takes

7 time; but with climate change, speed

8 kills.

9 Now, this is not an exaggeration and this is

10 not the future. We already see it happening. And you

11 hold one of the keys to preventing this crisis. You

12 have the moral imperative to lessen the damage caused by

13 a too powerful oil and gas industry in this country, and

14 these rules don't go nearly far enough to mitigate

15 emissions and slow warming.

16 We demand that you take steps to

17 immediately -- immediately to extend these rules to

18 cover existing sources of methane, which account for

19 90 percent of current emissions. I'm counting on you to

20 be bold and use your power to do what unquestionably

21 needs to be done: Slash greenhouse gas emissions

22 aggressively and immediately. And as a young person, I

23 sincerely fear the alternative.

24 Thank you.

25 MR. GREEN: All right. Thank you very much.
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1 All right. We have one more speaker. And I

2 know I can't pronounce this one correctly. It's Dulce

3 Saenz.

4 MS. SAENZ: Very nice. Nice job.

5 Good morning. My name is Dulce Saenz, and I

6 grew up in Hudson, Colorado, after immigrating from

7 Mexico at the age of two.

8 I'm the director of Protogete: Our Air, Our

9 Health, a program of Conservation Colorado aimed at

10 elevating the voices of Latinos in the climate fight.

11 I'm here today as a member of this country's diverse

12 Latino population and as one in five Coloradans who are

13 Latino, to support the EPA's proposed methane pollution

14 standards for the oil and gas industry.

15 The most vulnerable people in our society are

16 oftentimes the most impacted by environmental

17 injustices; our elderly, our children, our low-income

18 communities and communities of color.

19 Latinos specifically are disproportionately

20 affected by poor air quality, suffering higher rates of

21 chronic ailments like asthma. Latinos are three times

22 more likely to die from asthma than any other ethnic

23 group in the U.S. 68 percent of Latinos in Colorado

24 live in counties that violate federal smog standards,

25 and 39 percent of Latinos live within 30 miles of a
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1 power plant.

2 Methane is the most significant driver of

3 climate change in the near term, with an impact on

4 climate change over 80 times as potent as carbon dioxide

5 in a 20-year period. Oil and gas companies emit

6 7 million tons of methane from their operations each

7 year, the equivalent of 160 coal-fired power plants.

8 These emissions are expected to increase 25 percent in

9 the next decade if nothing is done.

10 Unfortunately, in the U.S. and here in

11 Colorado, Latino communities are among the first and

12 worst impacted by climate change and unhealthy air

13 quality that is worsened by methane pollution. Many

14 Latinos live in the country's most air-polluted cities

15 and as methane pollution and climate change make our air

16 quality worse, our families' health gets worse.

17 Already 14 percent of Latino children have

18 received an asthma diagnosis, and they are 40 percent

19 more likely to die from their condition than are

20 nonLatino white children.

21 Also problematic, most of the global warming

22 we see in our lifetimes is driven by methane pollution,

23 and Latino communities face greater threats from climate

24 change because of where we work. For example,

25 climate-exacerbated extreme heat increases the risk of
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1 Latinos, who make up one in four workers in the outdoor

2 industries of construction and agriculture.

3 Our communities also face serious challenges

4 to resilience, the ability to bounce back after a

5 climate-related disaster like the unusually strong

6 wildfires and floods we have seen across the Western

7 U.S. in recent years, because one in four Latinos live

8 under the poverty line.

9 That's why addressing methane pollution is so

10 important. And solutions for cutting methane emissions

11 are not only readily available, they are also highly

12 cost effective and will help save a valuable American

13 energy source. This is a win-win situation for Latinos

14 and for all Americans, protecting our health, saving

15 energy, and helping address climate change.

16 The Administration pledged to cut methane

17 emissions from the oil and gas sector 40 to 45 percent

18 over the next ten years. So while EPA's proposal is a

19 critical first step towards meeting this national goal,

20 it must include the best practices we know to help

21 achieve the needed reductions.

22 Looking forward, we encourage and expect EPA

23 to tackle the biggest problem of our -- the biggest part

24 of the problem: methane emissions from wells, pipelines

25 and facilities and operations that are currently in
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1 existence. Already Colorado is among a handful of

2 states blazing a trail to reduce methane emissions

3 quickly and effectively, and EPA'S proposals need to be

4 strengthened to be at least as protected as the policies

5 adopted by Colorado, Wyoming, and Ohio.

6 We look forward to seeing the strongest

7 possible methane standards finalized, alongside a rule

8 to limit methane pollution from existing sources, to

9 achieve the full reductions to methane emissions that

10 were pledged.

11 Thank you for the opportunity to comment.

12 MR. GREEN: Thank you very much. Before you

13 step down, will you spell your name for the court

14 reporter.

15 MS. SAENZ: Dulce, D-u-l-c-e; Saenz,

16 S-a-e-n-z.

17 MR. GREEN: Thank you very much.

18 Okay. At this time I'm going to put the

19 hearing in recess. We'll resume at 1:00 o'clock sharp.

20 Thank you very much.

21 (The hearing was in recess from 12:00 p.m. to

22 1:01 p.m.)

23 MR. GREEN: I'm going to go ahead and open the

24 public hearing back up. We're still waiting for one of

25 our panelists, so I'm going to open it up. If she shows
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1 up, we'll start listening to testimony again. I'm going

2 to start by reading the same statement that I read this

3 morning, to open it back up again.

4 So good afternoon. My name is Greg Green, and

5 I'm the chair for today's public hearing, and I'd like

6 to thank everybody for coming today. Joining me on the

7 panel today are Cheryl Vetter from the Office of Air

8 Quality Planning and Standards; Amy Hambrick, also from

9 the Office of Air Quality Planning and Standards; and

10 Monica Morales from Region 8.

11 We're here today to hear your comments on the

12 EPA's proposed rules relating to the oil and natural gas

13 sector. The specific rules are:

14 Oil and Natural Gas Sector: Emission Standards

15 for New and Modified Sources;

16 Source Determination for Certain Emissions

17 Units in the Oil and Natural Gas Sector;

18 Review of New Sources and Modifications in

19 Indian Country: Federal Implementation Plan for

20 Managing Air Emissions from True Minor Sources Engaged

21 in Oil and Natural Gas Production in Indian Country.

22 The EPA Administrator signed the proposed

23 rules on August 18, 2015.

24 The proposed New Source Performance Standards

25 would establish methane and VOC standards for
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1 hydraulically fractured wells and require owners and

2 operators to find and repair leaks. The proposed rule

3 would also extend emission reduction requirements

4 further downstream, covering the equipment in the

5 natural gas transmission and storage segments of the

6 industry that was not regulated in the Agency's 2012

7 rules.

8 The proposed Source Determination Rule

9 clarifies the EPA's air permitting rules as they apply

10 to the oil and natural gas industry.

11 We're also taking comment on the proposed

12 federal implementation plan to implement the Federal

13 Minor New Source Review Program in the Indian Country

14 for oil and natural gas production. That plan, known as

15 a FIP, would be used instead of site-specific Minor New

16 Source Review preconstruction permits in Indian Country.

17 It would incorporate emissions limits and

18 other requirements from six EPA emissions standards,

19 including the 2015 proposed updates to the New Source

20 Performance Standards on which we are taking comment

21 today.

22 If you would like more details on the proposed

23 rules, there are fact sheets available at the

24 registration desk.

25 Before we get started, I'd like to go through
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1 a few housekeeping items and ground rules that will help

2 make today's hearing run smoother.

3 First, please be sure that you have checked in

4 at the registration desk, even if you're not planning to

5 speak today. And if you signed up to speak online or by

6 phone but haven't told us that you're here, please step

7 up to the registration desk and let the EPA staff know

8 that you've arrived.

9 I will call speakers up in pairs. When your

10 name is called, please come to the speakers' table at

11 the front of the room.

12 When I call on you to speak, please state your

13 name and spell it for the court reporter. Your comments

14 will be transcribed and included in the record of

15 comments on the proposed rule.

16 It is very important to us that you tell us

17 which rule or rules you are speaking about.

18 Each speaker will have five minutes to give

19 comments. We have a timer light to help you know how

20 much time you have left to speak.

21 When the light turns from green to yellow,

22 that means you have one minute remaining; when it turns

23 red, that's the signal that you are at five minutes and

24 it is time to stop.

25 When you are finished speaking, please remain
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1 at the table until the person next to you has completed

2 his or her testimony.

3 We are here to listen to you today; however, a

4 panel member may ask questions to clarify your comments.

5 I will then call up the next pair of speakers

6 and so on.

7 If you have brought a written copy of your

8 testimony, please give that to the staff at the

9 registration desk before you leave today. We will put

10 any written comments submitted today in the official

11 docket for the proposed rules.

12 We also have comment cards available at the

13 registration desk. If you would like to submit

14 additional written comments, please do so.

15 If you want to comment in writing later,

16 stop by the materials table near the registration desk

17 and pick up a copy of the instructions for submitting

18 written comments. Comments must be received by

19 November 17, 2015.

20 Let me assure you that EPA gives just as much

21 consideration to comments we receive in writing as we do

22 to comments we receive at public hearings like this one.

23 So if you have more comments that you

24 would like to provide the EPA, please submit them by the

25 comment period deadline. Your comments will be
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1 reviewed.

2 If you have any questions during the day,

3 please see the staff at the registration desk, and

4 someone will assist you.

5 Thank you again for taking the time today to

6 share your comments on EPA's proposal. And with that,

7 we'll get started.

8 Our first two people from the afternoon are

9 Anne Harper and Eric Huber. And please don't forget to

10 tell us which rules you're commenting on. Thank you.

11 MS. HARPER: Do I have to do anything here?

12 MR. GREEN: It should be turned on. Hold

13 your -- hold your speaker up to your --

14 MS. HARPER: Can you hear?

15 MR. GREEN: There's a microphone at the end of

16 the cord.

17 MS. HARPER: Oh, it's at the end of the cord?

18 You can see how much I know about this.

19 MR. GREEN: There you go.

20 MS. HARPER: Okay.

21 MR. GREEN: So you if you give your name and

22 spell it out for the court reporter, that would be

23 great.

24 MS. HARPER: Okay. I'm Anne, Anne Harper;

25 A-n-n-e, H-a-r-p-e-r. And I'm here today -- I am not
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1 being paid to come here, and I think that's significant,

2 because I have been a resident of Colorado for 50 years,

3 more than 50 years. And I just want to thank you for

4 coming here. And it's a small sign that there's still

5 some democracy left in America that the public is

6 allowed to speak.

7 And I would like to just say, for some

8 perspective, that anybody who comes and sits in these

9 seats that is being paid, I think that's not what the

10 point of this is. I think the point of this is to

11 listen to people who understand the threat of methane in

12 our environment, in Colorado, in America, and in the

13 world, and that we citizens of Colorado care. And I

14 have noticed a humongous difference in the air quality

15 in this state since I was a little child.

16 And I know that the thing that compelled me to

17 come here today is because my home, which is on the

18 border of Boulder and Weld County -- I'm in the half --

19 a half-mile into the Weld County side, which is a

20 free-for-all for the oil and gas industry. Even with

21 the COGCC rules in place, in 2006 the EPA,

22 unfortunately, allowed the oil and gas hydrofracturing

23 to be exempt, basically exempt, from the water quality

24 and air quality standards.

25 And what is happening to us is, we had a
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1 little bit of fracking around our house, with small

2 units. And during the inversions, we have a huge issue

3 of white air around our home and all the valley in Weld

4 County. I see it. It's a place that barely has

5 anything else going on in it, and it is polluted. And

6 the air during inversions, absolutely toxic. Sometimes

7 it's so bad, I can't believe it.

8 And last November I found out that two 12-well

9 sites are being planned within 1500 feet of our house,

10 and I have been in a battle with the COGCC since then.

11 I am not being protected by the COGCC. They are

12 completely embedded with the industry, the oil and gas

13 industry, who, I'm sure, you'll hear from many times

14 today, because they have just one goal, and that is to

15 make money. They do not care about us, the people of

16 Colorado, the people of the United States. They do not

17 care.

18 I have seen it numerous times. I go to all

19 the COGCC hearings. I went to a neighborhood meeting.

20 I am educated about the subject, and I have not -- I am

21 dismayed. I am absolutely dismayed at the way the COGCC

22 has treated us as a community. We're a small

23 agricultural community, and we do not want 24 new wells

24 with the humongous facility sites.

25 The EPA standards are not strict enough, no
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1 matter what. No way. There should be two -- these are

2 major petrochemical plants near our home. There is no

3 way. And there are numerous citizens all over the state

4 of Colorado who are very, very concerned about this

5 issue. I am one. There are 200 people outside right

6 now, fighting for -- for the rights for the citizens and

7 communities to not have methane in their house.

8 So much methane comes out when you're first

9 fracking those wells, and it's all going to be in our

10 house. We won't be able to open our doors for

11 14 months. And the fracking is 14 -- I mean, there's so

12 many issues, and the industry likes to call them

13 nuisances, and that's -- that's just plain insane. It's

14 more than a nuisance. It's a lifestyle change.

15 Not only that, the 117,000 truck trips that

16 would be involved near our home, 50,000 of them would be

17 made 25 feet from our house. We bought a house in the

18 country; bucolic, beautiful place. They are unwelcome.

19 Thank you.

20 MR. GREEN: Thank you. Mr. Huber.

21 MR. HUBER: Can you hear me all right without

22 this? Use the mic? Hi. My name's Eric -- is this on?

23 MS. HAMBRICK: The other one.

24 MR. HUBER: Now you can hear me. Hi, my

25 name's Eric Huber. I'm the senior managing attorney for
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1 the Sierra Club in Boulder Colorado, and I also live in

2 Boulder, near Weld County, which you just heard about

3 from the previous speaker and have probably heard about

4 a lot this morning, because it's a real case study in

5 what's happening here and why EPA's action is important

6 to us. It exemplifies what's happening up and down the

7 Front Range.

8 And I realize this is a national rule and this

9 is a multistate hearing, but Weld County is sort of the

10 poster child, if you will, for the fracking boom and

11 what's happening. There are 18,000 wells or more in

12 Weld County, which includes -- Weld County's a rural

13 area just northeast of here, but has some small cities

14 like Greeley, Windsor, and Erie, and the state setbacks

15 are 500 feet from residential areas.

16 And that is a lot of the -- the conflict

17 that's coming, and between the state and the industry,

18 and that's why it's so important to everyone that the

19 federal government come in and put controls on the -- on

20 this industry and enforce them.

21 Industry likes to say, Well, let us self22 police. The state says, We have the strongest methane

23 rules in the country, we'll take care of it. Well,

24 Longmont, Colorado, which is a small town that sits on

25 the border of Weld County and Boulder County, tried to
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1 put in rules to increase the setbacks just a little bit,

2 and they were sued by the State and by the industry

3 both.

4 And so that's what we're up against, is the

5 State and the industry acting in concert against the

6 local governments and against the citizens trying to

7 protect themselves from this pollution.

8 Now, I know that this is a very technical rule

9 on methane emissions. But according to EPA's website,

10 controlling the methane emissions also controls the VOC

11 emissions and the toxics and, hence, all of the impacts

12 that people are experiencing from that, you know, the --

13 MR. GREEN: Mr. Huber, if could you use the

14 microphone, then that would be great. Thanks.

15 MR. HUBER: Okay. So what does all this have

16 to do with EPA's methane rule? So the methane rule sets

17 limits on both methane and VOCs. Capturing methane

18 emissions also captures these VOC emissions and the

19 toxics that the people are objecting to.

20 And there's also a direct link between methane

21 and ozone and health impacts, and methane is a precursor

22 to ozone. And there was a study in 2013 by the

23 University of Colorado that the ozone levels in Erie and

24 Weld County, and the VOC levels, the unhealthy ground

25 levels of ozone in Erie, was all due to oil and gas
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1 operations. So regulating the methane is going to

2 address the everyday problems these people are facing.

3 So we appreciate what EPA is doing, and we ask

4 for the strongest possible methane rule from EPA, and to

5 strengthen them in these four ways:

6 We ask you to expand the scope of the

7 standards, because not all of these operations are

8 covered. So we want to cover unloading operations,

9 controllers, compressors, everything;

10 Strengthen the standards for leak repair so

11 that you get all fugitive emissions and don't skip any

12 surveys;

13 Ensure that the oil and gas companies capture

14 all possible gas to reduce flaring; and

15 At some point regulate the existing sources.

16 I believe this rule is all new and future sources, and

17 that's good. But we need to do something about the

18 existing sources too, because by 2018 nearly 90 percent

19 of all methane emissions will come from sources now in

20 existence.

21 So that's all I have to say today, and thank

22 you for listening.

23 MR. GREEN: Thank you, Mr. Huber.

24 Our next speakers will be Josh Joswick and

25 Eric Waeckerlin. Please don't forget to tell us which
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1 rules you're speaking regarding. And we ask that both

2 parties stay up there until both people have testified.

3 MR. JOSWICK: There is just one microphone

4 that's working?

5 MR. GREEN: Just one of them's working.

6 MR. JOSWICK: Is this it?

7 MR. GREEN: Yeah.

8 MR. JOSWICK: I guess it is. I'm Josh

9 Joswick. It's J-o-s-h, J-o-s-w-i-c-k. I'm here to

10 testify on NSPS Quad Oa.

11 Josh Joswick, I live in southwest Colorado,

12 and that means that I live under the largest methane

13 cloud in the U.S. And it also means that I drove more

14 than six hours to get here. And, six hours, you have

15 some time to think. And I was thinking about that I

16 honestly couldn't tell you how many times I've done

17 this, in terms of testifying before in a rulemaking

18 legislative hearing geared toward holding the oil and

19 gas industry accountable for the impacts its -- its

20 actions create.

21 As county commissioner, a mayor, a private

22 citizen, as a community organizer for over 25 years,

23 I've testified on how imperative it is to control this

24 arrogant juggernaut. Sometimes people who are holding

25 these hearings listen, and I hope you will.
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1 First, I want to thank you. I want to thank

2 the EPA for doing something that's long overdue. This

3 rulemaking is an acknowledgment that there's a problem

4 out there that needs to be addressed through -- and

5 here, I apologize for using some coarse language --

6 regulation. What the industry is spewing into our air

7 should not be spewed into our air, and the proposals --

8 and your proposals start to address that. But they need

9 to go farther. And the one thing that's standing in the

10 way of their going farther is, of course, the industry.

11 In those 25 years that I have been testifying,

12 I have come to count on one sure thing, and that's the

13 industry's mantra that any proposed regulations or rules

14 will create too great a financial burden for the

15 industry to be viable; and if any proposed rules are

16 adopted, it will leave the state that is proposing those

17 rules. Simply put, those are lies, and the industry is

18 very adept as saying them. Rules have been adopted.

19 The industry has never suffered from any of those rules,

20 regulations, or legislation here in Colorado, and it

21 won't suffer if the EPA adopts meaningful rules.

22 I was in a meeting once where this industry

23 truth-teller actually came out with one of the more

24 honest industry positions that I have ever heard on

25 health matters. It was said, during a discussion of --
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1 on populations that are susceptible to air-pollution2 caused asthma, and that's young children and the

3 elderly and the infirm -- this guy said, and I quote,

4 What's a little asthma?

5 As disappointing as it was to hear that, it

6 was good to hear it, because that confirmed what we knew

7 all along, that that was the true industry view of its

8 impacts and its responsibilities for them: What's a

9 little asthma? Perhaps the truest thing I've ever heard

10 the industry say, and the closest they have ever come to

11 owning their total disregard for the damage they bring

12 to our communities.

13 If you go into the dictionary, it's surprising

14 how many definitions of "victim" you'll find, but

15 nowhere will you find the definition: Victim, the

16 world's most powerful industry, upon being subjected to

17 methane emission regulations.

18 Yet that's the claim that industry makes for

19 what the EPA is proposing: The industry, victim of an

20 out-of-control bureaucracy hellbent on regulating it out

21 of the country.

22 That claim is a perversion. There are victims

23 here, and it's not the industry. The victims are the

24 people who have to breathe the air the industry fouls.

25 But what's a little asthma? The EPA can actually do
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1 something about that, and that would be to strengthen

2 its draft rules.

3 There's another industry perversion being

4 offered here, and that is, wrapping the flag around

5 domestic production and claiming minimalist regulation

6 or even self-regulation are for the greater good because

7 that promotes energy independence. Everyone here knows

8 this is not about energy independence, it's about bottom

9 lines. Here in Colorado where we adopted methane

10 emission regulations, the industry is thriving. No

11 matter how stringent the rules are that you adopt,

12 operators will continue to do just fine. They know

13 that, yet claim otherwise, and that is a falsehood. And

14 that's what you can call them on.

15 Please enact rules that mean something. What

16 the industry spews into our air harms us. There's no

17 contesting that. All the industry has is a false

18 economic argument, and that cannot be the basis for

19 rules that mean anything. These rules that you have

20 proposed are a good start, but you can make them

21 stronger, and they need to apply to all facilities,

22 existing and prospective.

23 And if you are going to adopt rules, please

24 enforce them. Don't go through this whole thing and

25 then just let them lie.
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1 Thank you very much for being here today.

2 MR. GREEN: Thank you very much, Mr. Joswick.

3 Mr. Waeckerlin.

4 MR. WAECKERLIN: My name is Eric Waeckerlin;

5 E-r-i-c, last name is W-a-e-c-k-e-r-l-i-n. I'm here as

6 a resident of Colorado, a Westerner, and a proud father

7 of a nine-year-old daughter. My comments today are made

8 on behalf of the Western Energy Alliance and its

9 members.

10 The Alliance appreciates EPA holding this

11 hearing and providing stakeholders with the opportunity

12 to comment. We are confident that EPA will carefully

13 consider the concerns raised by some of the proposed

14 rulemaking package provisions, and we look forward to

15 working constructively with the Agency prior to

16 finalization of the rule. My comments today will be

17 largely directed at the NSPS Quad O, Rule a.

18 The Alliance represents over 450 companies

19 engaged in all aspects of environmentally responsible

20 exploration and production of oil and natural gas across

21 the West. The majority of its members are independent

22 producers, small business with an average of

23 15 employees. Because of the Alliance's demographic,

24 the regulatory burdens imposed by the recent onslaught

25 of federal and state regulations have had a particularly
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1 acute impact. In this extremely challenging price

2 environment, the Alliance strongly encourages the EPA to

3 carefully consider not only the cost and burdens

4 associated with NSPS Quad O, Rule a, and the rest of

5 this rulemaking package, but also the cumulative impacts

6 from all the various rulemakings, either ongoing or

7 pending. This includes the 2012 NSPS, which is just now

8 being implemented, the BLM venting and flaring rule, the

9 upcoming new ozone standard, and the myriad non-air10 quality federal rulemakings such as the BLM hydraulic

11 fracturing rules and ongoing issues surrounding access

12 to public lands and overly stringent resource management

13 plans. There's also significant regulatory activity

14 facing the Alliance's members at the state level,

15 including air quality rulemakings in Colorado and Utah.

16 In short, the current regulatory and price

17 environment is posing substantial concerns for the

18 western oil and natural gas industry, and the Alliance

19 urges EPA to narrowly tailor this and future regulations

20 with this operating environment in mind.

21 With respect to the NSPS amendment, while the

22 Alliance is still reviewing the voluminous materials

23 associated with this rule, we have identified several

24 initial concerns that I would like to focus on. First,

25 as a threshold matter, the Alliance will need more time
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1 to review and comment on these rules and is asking for a

2 60-day extension to do so.

3 Second, the amendments are characterized as

4 setting standards for both VOC and methane emissions

5 across the source category; in many respects, however,

6 it appears that EPA has duplicated much of what was done

7 in the 2012 NSPS and subsequent reconsiderations.

8 For example, the new rules establish methane

9 standards for many pieces of equipment already regulated

10 for VOCs; yet at the same time, EPA has found that the

11 best systems of -- best system of emissions reductions

12 for methane is the same as it is for VOCs. Thus we

13 question whether many of the methane benefits being

14 advertised have been and are already being captured

15 through existing VOC controls. In fact, in the 2015 GHG

16 inventory, EPA expressly states that the 2012 NSPS are

17 in part responsible for the consistent decline in green18 house gas emissions from the upstream oil and gas

19 production segment.

20 This raises fundamental questions about

21 whether these rules are needed; if they are, whether

22 such a sweeping approach is justified; and perhaps most

23 importantly, why EPA has not given the current NSPS

24 Quad O rules the full opportunity to realize the

25 significant VOC and methane benefits.
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1 Our members have also identified some initial

2 concerns with several aspects of the proposed rules

3 related to leak detection and repair. I'll refer to

4 that as LDAR. As others have commented or will comment

5 here today, the Colorado LDAR program is not a

6 translatable model, for many reasons, including the

7 nascency of the program and the fact that the DJ Basin

8 is very unique in terms of infrastructure and access.

9 We recognize that the proposal does not merely copy the

10 Colorado program, and we urge the EPA not to do so in

11 the final rule.

12 We also strongly support flexibility across

13 the entirety of these regulations. This would include

14 flexibility in how monitoring and repairs are

15 accomplished, and, perhaps most importantly, a codified

16 recognition that compliance with a stringent state LDAR

17 program should be deemed compliance for federal rules.

18 The Alliance is encouraged by the semiannual monitoring

19 frequency and believes such frequency is supported by

20 the data. The recordkeeping requirements, however, are

21 unduly burdensome and not workable. And the definition

22 of "fugitive emissions components" needs fixing.

23 MR. GREEN: If you could wrap it up,

24 Mr. Waeckerlin.

25 MR. WAECKERLIN: Yes. Thank you for the
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1 opportunity to comment, and we look forward to working

2 constructively with the Agency prior to final rule

3 promulgation.

4 MR. GREEN: Thank you.

5 MR. WAECKERLIN: Thank you.

6 MR. GREEN: Our next speakers will be Rhonda

7 Peters and Milt Hetrick. Ms. Peters.

8 MS. PETERS: My name is Rhonda Peters. It's

9 R-h-o-n-d-a, last name P-e-t-e-r-s. I'm here today as a

10 concerned mother and a member of the Moms Clean Air

11 Force. I care about children, and I believe that they

12 need to be protected from methane pollution, which is

13 linked to childhood asthma.

14 You've already heard testimony about the facts

15 on how methane relates to ozone, which is linked to

16 asthma. I am here today because I personally know far

17 too many children who have asthma, and I'm keenly aware

18 that it can take those children's lives at any time.

19 Therefore, I support the EPA's proposed rule to cut

20 methane pollution, but I feel it falls short by only

21 applying to new wells and not existing ones.

22 Methane is a powerful greenhouse gas which

23 contributes to global warming, smog, and asthma, which

24 children are particularly vulnerable to. It also

25 contains carcinogens like benzenes and formaldehyde,
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1 which can lead to cancer.

2 The oil and gas industry has an extremely

3 heavy presence in Colorado, with over 40,000 fracking

4 wells. It is the largest industrial contributor of

5 methane pollution. In addition to harming our

6 children's health and fueling extreme climate pollution

7 and extreme climate events, methane pollution annually

8 wastes billions of dollars of natural gas; however, this

9 waste and this pollution can be prevented.

10 Colorado was recently the first state to enact

11 guidelines that would require methane to be captured at

12 the 95 percent level. These guidelines were supported

13 by the majority of the oil and gas industry because they

14 are achievable. However, what we have learned in the

15 last couple years is that industry self-regulation

16 doesn't work, and these guidelines need to be enforced

17 and they need to be stronger. The EPA's proposed rule

18 to cut methane pollution, it makes good common sense for

19 our children and it must also be applied to existing

20 wells.

21 Reducing methane pollution is important to

22 moms because childhood asthma and cancer are serious

23 issues. People in the Denver area have seen the freeway

24 signs frequently warning us of high ozone levels, but

25 not everybody here understands what they mean. They
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1 mean that people who have asthma are at high risk of

2 asthma attacks and that children, whose lungs are

3 developing and growing, they are at risk for developing

4 asthma and therefore they should remain inside.

5 Again, methane released from the oil and gas

6 industry can be prevented, and we know this. Colorado

7 already took the first steps to make that happen. The

8 rules need to be enforced through other than industry

9 self-regulation, and federal action is needed to apply

10 to both existing and future wells.

11 I'm thankful to come today and be able to

12 speak on behalf of the many children that I know who

13 personally -- I know personally who have asthma. There

14 are many children who can be spared from developing

15 asthma, through the EPA's actions. Strong methane

16 pollution standards are needed to protect children. The

17 proposed federal standards are certainly a good first

18 step, but they are not sufficient.

19 And that is why I have taken time away from my

20 work and other responsibilities to be here today. I'm

21 calling on the EPA to protect our country's children by

22 ensuring that the final rule applies to both existing

23 and to new wells.

24 Thank you.

25 MR. GREEN: Thank you.
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1 MR. HETRICK: Good afternoon. My name is

2 Milt Hetrick; that's M-i-l-t, H-e-t-r-i-c-k; a retired

3 engineer and physicist, and I live in Centennial,

4 Colorado. Thank you for this opportunity to offer

5 comments related to methane pollution.

6 I'm a lifetime member of the Colorado Sierra

7 Club and a number of other organizations concerned about

8 sustainability, but I'm speaking today on my own behalf

9 as well as my two great-granddaughters', who were born

10 two years ago, in supporting the EPA's methane pollution

11 standards for the oil and gas industry.

12 I'm also here representing a growing number of

13 people who have already transitioned away from burning

14 ancient hydrocarbons, also known as fossil fuels. Four

15 years ago we capped off our natural gas line into our

16 home and installed a geothermal/geoexchange heat pump,

17 that exchanges thermal energy with the earth, for all

18 our heating and cooling needs. So we no longer buy

19 natural gas to burn. So I'm standing in a different

20 sandbox, so to speak, than some other people.

21 The 40 solar panels on our roof generate the

22 electrical power for all our electrical appliances and

23 provide the power to operate the geothermal heat pump.

24 The PV system also generates enough electrical energy to

25 allow us to drive a plug-in hybrid car 10,000 miles a
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1 year without burning gasoline. So we really don't need

2 coal, oil, and natural gas to provide the energy to keep

3 our lights on, to cook our food, to operate our

4 appliances, to cool and heat our home, or even for local

5 transportation. Now, admittedly, cross-country travel

6 and food production are still problematic because fossil

7 fuels, and specifically natural gas, is used extensively

8 in these centers.

9 And we still need natural gas for sustainable

10 nonburning uses, such as plastics and feedstock for

11 making carbon fibers that we need for lightweight

12 materials in our transportation sector.

13 But we should leave the methane in the ground,

14 from a climate change perspective. We know that. But

15 if we do extract this resource for sustainable,

16 nonburning purposes, then the drilling, fracking,

17 collection, transportation processes involved should be

18 done in a manner that prevents the methane from escaping

19 into the atmosphere. This is where the role of the EPA

20 is so critical.

21 According to the IPCC, the climate change

22 potential of methane is 86 times that of CO2 when

23 averaged over a 20-year period. Historically, EPA has

24 used a factor of 20, averaging over a hundred-year time

25 frame. But since the methane molecule only stays in the
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1 atmosphere for between 10 and 15 years, it makes sense

2 to use the IPC factor of 86.

3 We all agree that burning natural gas is

4 cleaner than burning coal or oil; however, simple

5 calculation indicates that if this extraction process of

6 drilling, fracking, collecting, transporting the natural

7 gas to where it eventually gets burned, if more than

8 4 percent of that natural gas is lost as leaks or

9 escapes into the atmosphere, that factor of 86 makes

10 this methane more -- or worse for the climate than

11 burning coal. Natural gas is only a clean fuel if it's

12 produced at less than 4 percent leakage from well to

13 wheels, or to the burner.

14 For decades the oil and gas industry has been

15 self-reporting their leakage. They understand it's not

16 in their best interest to self-report no more than

17 3 percent leakage. Yet when independent investigators

18 go out with mobile or airborne sampling equipment, they

19 find the leakage range from 6 to 17 percent in certain

20 fields. The EPA must get directly involved in

21 monitoring methane emissions.

22 The EPA has to set emission standards that

23 assure the extraction of gas, regardless of how it's

24 used, is not going to result in further global warming,

25 climate change, and all the associated unsustainable
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1 ramifications.

2 I'm not a big fan of regulations, but when

3 people behave irresponsibly, then the rest of us have no

4 recourse but to create laws and regulations that demand

5 the oil and gas industry respect our lives and the lives

6 of our children and the long-term habitability of this

7 planet.

8 I thank you, and Addison and Isabella, my

9 great-grandchildren, thank you for the great job you are

10 doing, despite all the obstacles that we've put in your

11 path and despite our failure to fund your work properly.

12 MR. GREEN: Thank you. Our next speakers will

13 be Karen Dike and Karen Kalavity. Whenever you're

14 ready.

15 MS. DIKE: Okay. My name is Karen Dike. I

16 live in Longmont, Colorado. I'm a representative of

17 Coloradans Against Fracking and also a member of Sierra

18 Club.

19 As I was preparing for this, I thought, What

20 should I tell the EPA? I could tell that you methane is

21 86 times more potent than CO2 as a greenhouse gas, but

22 you already know that. I could tell you that everyone

23 touts the Colorado methane regulations, but the methane

24 and other toxins in our air here have increased, but you

25 already know that. I could tell you that methane and
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1 other VOCs from fracking are contributing to very high

2 ozone here, so high that the American Lung Association

3 gave us an "F" and you, the EPA, have labeled us as a

4 nonattainment area, but you already know that.

5 I could tell you that methane is leaking not

6 only from fracking extraction sites but in every point

7 along the way, but you already know that. I could tell

8 you that, along with methane spewing out of all these

9 wells, it brings with it VOCs that are dangerous to our

10 health, but you already know that. I could tell you

11 that the amount of methane leaking is known to be vastly

12 underestimated, and you already know that.

13 I could tell that you methane is going to

14 drastically increase global warming, which will

15 adversely affect all parts of the world, with sea level

16 rise, droughts, wildfires, habitat destruction, and more

17 frequent severe weather, but you already know that.

18 But have you thought about the consequences of

19 that? And I decided what I would do is read you a poem

20 by Drew Dellinger:

21 It's 3:23 in the morning and I'm

22 awake because my great-great23 grandchildren won't let me sleep. My

24 great-great-grandchildren asked me in

25 dreams, "What did you do while the
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1 planet was plundered? What did you do

2 while the earth was unraveling? Surely

3 you did something when the seasons

4 started failing, as mammals, reptiles,

5 birds were all dying? Did you fill the

6 streets with protests when democracy was

7 stolen? What did you do once you knew?"

8 So I'm going to say to you, if you turn a

9 blind eye to the methane pollution, you are

10 participating in the war against the future of our

11 children, which is being waged by the fossil fuel

12 industry.

13 Here's what I would tell you: There is no

14 need for new regulations. The President has the power

15 and needs to have the courage to eliminate all new wells

16 and should do so immediately. The EPA needs to reclaim

17 their power to enforce all the regulations that were

18 ended with the Halliburton loophole. All current wells

19 that are noncompliant need to be closed if compliance

20 isn't met within a month. Enforcement of the Clean Air,

21 Clean Water, RCRA, and other regulations, and immediate

22 severe consequences must happen now. This would have an

23 immediate effect on our environmental degradation and on

24 the U.S. contribution to climate change.

25 Don't say it can't be done. It can. Put
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1 people to work building an infrastructure for the

2 future, instead of export terminals for fossil fuels.

3 Tell President Obama and the head of the EPA: You know.

4 Now what will you do?

5 Thank you.

6 MS. KALAVITY: I'm guessing it was me, Karen

7 Kalavity, K-a-l-a-v-i-t-y. Okay.

8 Fracking is seen as a way of unearthing

9 natural gas. Natural gas does burn cleaner than many

10 other fossil fuel types of resources. The problem is

11 that extracting natural gas is a very dirty process,

12 even though burning it is a relatively clean way of

13 unleashing energy. Let's understand that we as humans

14 do not create energy, we just unleash it and provide it

15 in a different form.

16 Many people have said that we should leave our

17 fossil fuels in the ground because then we will not be

18 unleashing any new methane or greenhouse gases; rather,

19 we will leave it there in a sequestered state that does

20 not affect our atmosphere and ecology. With all the new

21 alternative and clean energy forms, this sounds like a

22 very good idea.

23 It is now as cheap or cheaper to use solar and

24 wind energy than -- than fossil fuels. The expensive

25 part of the renewable solution is not the production of
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1 them but rather the retrofitting them into our old

2 fossil fuel infrastructure. This is where we need to

3 start making some decisions. Are we going to continue

4 to use dirty fossil fuels just because our -- our

5 infrastructure was set up for them decades ago? Or are

6 we going to start making clean energy a priority and set

7 up infrastructure to allow this?

8 Though I have not seen any real studies on the

9 matter, it is my impression that all of these wildfires

10 are part of the CO2 and methane problem. Even though I

11 listen to advertisements talking about how we have

12 safely fracked for over 60 years, there is no mention of

13 the cumulative effect of fracking more and more and

14 more. Just because something does not cause harm in

15 small doses, does not mean that it can't cause extreme

16 harm in extreme and continued doses. And that is where

17 we are at with fracking and fossil fuel extraction.

18 I have heard that the escaped natural gas

19 emissions from wells are about 10 percent. How in the

20 world can we expect not to have truly volatile --

21 volatile experiences when that is the allowable amount?

22 Supposedly Colorado has some of the strictest laws in

23 the nation with regard to fracking. Well, that is all

24 pretty much relative when all the laws are really lax,

25 in the first place.
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1 And Colorado has a very low severance tax,

2 much lower than Wyoming and other states. This means

3 there is a lot more extraction going on in Colorado

4 because oil and gas companies only pay a fraction in

5 taxes to the state, as compared to the amount received

6 in other states. Again, when 10 percent emissions from

7 the wells going into the surrounding atmosphere is

8 considered strict, I just have to wonder what the heck

9 you are so proud about in your advertising.

10 And those are volatile gases. I think the oil

11 and gas companies should have to start paying out when

12 hundreds of homes start burning up in wildfires, because

13 I believe these wildfires are directly related to

14 natural gas emissions and other fossil fuel extractions,

15 especially right at the well source. This wasn't

16 happening years ago, and now reports of wildfires are on

17 the news daily.

18 And I'm going to take an aside. I have some

19 time. I don't want to just pick on the oil and gas

20 industries when it comes to climate change and green21 house gas production. As a vegetarian who cares about

22 animals first and a sustainable planet second, we must

23 stop eating meat and slaughtering animals to the degree

24 we have gotten used to. Raising animals for food uses

25 30 percent of the world's land mass. In our own
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1 country, the U.S., we have cleared more than 270 million

2 acres of forest to make room for grain- and pasture-fed

3 animals such as cattle, pigs, sheep -- sheep and

4 chickens. We like to complain about the rainforest

5 that's cut down in Brazil, but the USA has been tearing

6 down trees for generations before it ever happened

7 elsewhere, and to a huge degree.

8 We need to understand that carbon emissions

9 are a problem because we do not have enough trees and

10 other plants to absorb these excess greenhouse gases.

11 If there were more trees that could use carbon dioxide

12 and release oxygen, then we would not have a problem.

13 But we continue to cut down trees and convert forests to

14 pasture and man-made deserts. We do it in Denver, we do

15 it as a nation, and we do this as a worldwide practice.

16 We cannot keep lording over nature and think that trees

17 are there to chop down and animals are there for us to

18 butcher and the Earth is there for us to destruct.

19 The meat and dairy and egg industries produce

20 65 percent of the worldwide nitrous oxide emissions.

21 Nitrous oxide is 300 percent more powerful at trapping

22 heat in the Earth's atmosphere than carbon dioxide.

23 This means that diets of meat eaters create seven times

24 the greenhouse emissions as the diets of vegans.

25 Turkeys, chickens, pigs, and cows collect --
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1 and cows collectively are the largest producer of

2 methane in the U.S. Methane is 20 times more powerful

3 at trapping heat in the Earth's atmosphere than carbon

4 dioxide. And this was a figure that we're relating to

5 what is said and, in fact, is probably 86 six times

6 more.

7 If one person exchanged eating meat for a

8 vegan diet, they would reduce carbon dioxide emissions

9 by 1.5 tons per year. That means that if every American

10 dropped one serving of chicken from their diet, it would

11 save the same amount of CO2 as taking 500,000 cars off

12 the roads.

13 Also, taking meat off the diet reduces water

14 consumption. Nearly half the water in the U.S. goes to

15 raising animals for food. It takes more than 2400

16 gallons --

17 MR. GREEN: Can you wrap it up, please.

18 MS. KALAVITY: Okay. That's my spiel. But

19 it's more than the oil and gas industry, and so we need

20 to be more involved.

21 MR. GREEN: Thank you. The next speakers are

22 R.J. Harrington and Catherine Collentine.

23 Mr. Harrington.

24 MR. HARRINGTON: Thanks, Greg.

25 MR. GREEN: Find your testimony?
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1 MR. HARRINGTON: Got it. That's been

2 submitted electronically.

3 My name is R.J. Harrington. That's

4 H-a-r-r-i-n-g-t-o-n. Thanks, Amy, Greg, Cheryl, and

5 Monica. It's a pleasure to have you here today.

6 Appreciate you guys taking your time. I know you get

7 paid to do it, but we especially appreciate you having

8 this hearing again in Denver.

9 Josh mentioned earlier, he can't remember how

10 many times he's been here, at various other testimonies.

11 This is my third time in the last couple of years. I

12 was here in the fall for the new source carbon rules and

13 then last year for the existing source carbon rules, and

14 now I'm back for methane.

15 I'm here as a business owner. I am a member

16 of Environmental Entrepreneurs, and that industry

17 association is made up of folks that care not only about

18 business but also about the bottom line and the

19 environment. So it's all about the economy, it's all

20 about energy, it's all about the environment.

21 I'm also here on behalf of my two children.

22 May Eve is 11 and Connell is 9, and they would much

23 prefer to see us keep this ancient hydrocarbon under the

24 earth. As mentioned earlier, we could use these fuel

25 stocks for a lot better products than just burning them
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1 up into the atmosphere, regardless of how ostensibly

2 better burning methane is than coal.

3 So my prepared statement is that the new

4 methane standards are a great first step. Thank you.

5 But to really ramp up economic activity in Colorado and

6 address the problem, we need tougher standards to cut

7 pollution, not just from future oil and gas development

8 but existing oil and gas operations across this great

9 state of Colorado and the nation. These standards must

10 also be accompanied by a budget for enforcement and

11 penalties for noncompliance.

12 By listing emissions from oil and gas

13 operations, you would send an even stronger, clearer

14 market signal to the private sector that would stimulate

15 the nation, grow Colorado small businesses, and create

16 more jobs by investing in clean energy sources. Wind

17 and solar energy efficiency, those are the industries

18 that will power us into the future, instead of

19 continuing to be dragged into the past.

20 A lot of folks say that regulations are bad

21 for business, regulations will cost the consumer money.

22 Now, you'll get a lot of statistics from both sides of

23 this story, but I can tell you that, as a small-business

24 owner, there are millions, billions, if not trillions of

25 dollars waiting to be unleashed into the economy to
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1 transform our energy sector. Those that complain that

2 their small businesses are being drowned or put out of

3 business by regulations can retool, they can retrofit.

4 And we also believe, as environmental

5 entrepreneurs, that this industry as well as some

6 support from the government, both at the federal and

7 state level, should step up to the plate of retraining

8 and make sure that those that are displaced by this

9 coming economic revolution are supported.

10 We mean that sincerely, because the jobs in

11 efficiency wind and solar are local, they cannot be

12 outsourced, and there's already a huge economic engine

13 that is happening right now. Environmental

14 entrepreneurs have already invested hundreds of millions

15 of dollars in this sector and are poised to unleash

16 hundreds of millions of dollars more.

17 So thanks again for being here. I thank

18 everybody that's come in today, be they paid or not, to

19 sacrifice part of their day. And again, I am doing so

20 not only on the behalf of my business but also on the

21 behalf of my children and their ability to breathe

22 cleaner air.

23 Thanks.

24 MS. COLLENTINE: Okay. Hopefully, that's

25 enough.
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1 I'm Cathy Collentine. That's

2 C-o-l-l-e-n-t-i-n-e. And I want to say thank you so

3 much for the opportunity to offer my comments today on

4 the proposed rules covering methane emissions from oil

5 and gas operations.

6 Like I said, my name is Cathy Collentine. I

7 work at the Sierra Club, but I'm also here to speak on

8 my own behalf as a resident of Colorado. Two years ago

9 I moved here and I saw, firsthand, traveling up the I-25

10 corridor, the expanse of the oil and gas operations here

11 along the Front Range. I'd never seen that before, and

12 the proximity of the operations to homes and schools and

13 hospitals, to businesses and to communities, as well as

14 places of natural beauty was astounding to me.

15 I learned very quickly that Colorado has a

16 serious smog problem. Today in Denver, I loved looking

17 up the mountains. And I'm a little sad the days that I

18 can't see them, but realized very quickly that that was

19 due, in no small part, to vast expansion of oil and gas

20 development in this state.

21 I participated and testified in favor of

22 strong methane and volatile organic compound emissions

23 regulations before our state Air Quality Commission here

24 in Colorado early last year, and shortly thereafter

25 Colorado became the first state in the country to
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1 regulate methane emissions from oil and gas operations,

2 as you guys well know. I'm pleased that the EPA has

3 taken it upon themselves to protect the health of our

4 climate and communities, of the public health and

5 safety, by proposing rules that would similarly regulate

6 methane and smog-causing emissions from oil and gas

7 operations across the country.

8 The Sierra Club has membership in a number of

9 states, including North Dakota, places that don't have

10 rules like Colorado does, places that the stories are

11 even more lurid of the health impacts and other impacts

12 to the community, to families and to children than we

13 have here.

14 You've heard a lot about how methane is the

15 primary component of natural gas and it's a contributor

16 in the climate change. In that same two-year time span

17 that I've been here in Colorado, I've seen what it means

18 for us and for many others across the country when we

19 talk about climate change. The flooding, the fires, the

20 unmanageable destruction of homes for people, homes for

21 wildlife, caused by exacerbated climate change is a

22 reality for us here.

23 We have the technology to capture these

24 emissions. We've heard from small-business owners who

25 own those companies and who are proud of the work that
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1 they do and who believe that they can help to move us

2 towards cleaner air. We also have the technology to

3 pursue a transition to clean energy, and you just heard

4 from folks talking about the fact that that is feasible

5 and that's something that can happen now. Both of those

6 technologies are ways that we'll need to move forward

7 without delay.

8 And it's not only the climate, it's the health

9 and safety of the public and of those who work and live

10 in and around the oil and gas operations. We cannot

11 regulate fracking enough to make it safe. We do know

12 that. But these rules do provide a first step to

13 protect public health across the country.

14 Methane is released with volatile organic

15 compounds that are known carcinogens, like benzene.

16 These cause asthma and these cause upper respiratory

17 ailments. This hurts people who work for the industry

18 and those who oppose its expansion alike. Studies here

19 in Colorado have shown higher cancer risk for people

20 living or working near wells, due to exposure to benzene

21 emitted with methane and other volatile organic

22 compounds. We need to reduce these exposures, these

23 risks, these toxic emissions, and strong rules with

24 mandatory compliance is a step to do just that.

25 This rule should cover previous rulemakings on
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1 volatile organic compounds and methane capture. Storage

2 vessels are heavy emitters, and they should be included.

3 Please add them to this rule, to ensure that that major

4 source of methane and VOC pollution is not left

5 unregulated.

6 This rule is the first step. It covers new

7 and modified sources, but it doesn't cover existing

8 ones. You've heard the statistics before, but I want to

9 make sure that it's one that you've written down; that

10 by 2018, which is three years from now, 90 percent of

11 methane emissions will come from current operations.

12 Those existing sources need to be regulated, and delays

13 only exacerbate the impacts on the climate and public

14 health.

15 Inspections for leaks must be uniformly

16 required at a higher frequency than they are under

17 current rules. They need to be required on at least a

18 monthly basis. Leaks must be required to quickly be

19 fixed, once they're detected, and not allowed to persist

20 for six months or longer without action. This is health

21 and safety we're dealing with, not inconsequential

22 matters. And it's been shown that while some operators

23 will do their best to go beyond compliance with the

24 rules, we've seen, time and time again, that many do

25 not. It must be required and it must be enforced with
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1 proper inspection.

2 I'll wrap up by just saying thank you for the

3 opportunity to participate in the public comment session

4 today. I truly do hope that, a few months down the

5 road, I can applaud strengthened final rules; and that I

6 know you guys look forward to seeing me again, to talk

7 to you about existing source regulation.

8 Thank you.

9 MR. GREEN: Thank you. Our next speakers are

10 Bryce Carter and Douglas Henderson.

11 MR. CARTER: Good afternoon. Thank you again

12 for having all of us here today to speak about the

13 rules. As you've heard, throughout today, there's been

14 a lot of support from not only technical experts but

15 also people out in the field that have experienced this

16 directly. And I want to talk a little bit about that

17 piece of it.

18 MR. GREEN: Before you do that, Mr. Carter,

19 can you spell out your name.

20 MR. CARTER: Yeah, certainly. My name

21 is Bryce, B-r-y-c-e; and the last name's Carter,

22 C-a-r-t-e-r. And my profession, I'm actually a

23 organizer for the Sierra Club.

24 And I've been doing community organizing for

25 nearly a decade now. And I've been blessed to be able
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1 to travel a lot, and I got to live in North Dakota for

2 four months. And I met a lot of people that have been

3 directly impacted by emissions from fracking and seeing

4 the impacts of methane emissions from climate change all

5 across the country, but especially seeing -- or hearing

6 the stories of those that have been impacted.

7 When I was in North Dakota, I urged a lot of

8 people that were scared to speak up about being --

9 having had health impacts with their children and their

10 families, because of the culture out there. I talked to

11 people who have lost livestock that were grazing near

12 fracked wells. And if you look at satellite images, you

13 see this green glow that is in North Dakota. And I --

14 it terrifies me to think about how many rogue emissions

15 have gone into the atmosphere over the last decade

16 especially, but many decades, that helped fuel climate

17 change.

18 Here in Colorado we're no stranger to seeing

19 what climate change brings. We've been in the front

20 lines of fires, where, here in downtown Denver, I

21 remember on certain days a few years ago, it was raining

22 ash; where I've seen an Apocalyptic plume coming from

23 Colorado Springs, when the fires were burning there,

24 burning down homes there.

25 And I also, four years ago, testified when we
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1 -- you all held a hearing on natural gas then, and I got

2 to meet some people that are on the front lines of a lot

3 of these neighborhoods where these fracked wells are

4 just a few meters away from property lines. And,

5 similarly, the same stories with their health impacts,

6 of having these fumes go right into their homes and

7 getting sick from it.

8 And, in fact, this one family who had to use

9 inhalers, I remember being told that they were so sick,

10 they were starting to have nerve damage from it. And

11 their whole bodies, everybody was sick all the time.

12 And the doctors say that that's from long-term exposure.

13 So looking at the flooding that's happened,

14 that's been two years ago, we, Sierra Club and other

15 organizations, went out to homes in these impacted

16 communities, flooded-out basements, destroyed lives.

17 And oftentimes we kind of forget those that don't have

18 the same resources as others. There's a little

19 community that were in trailer homes, that was washed

20 away. And I've heard from a lot of emergency personnel

21 from different cities that a lot of those folks were

22 lower income and no one knows where they went after

23 their homes were destroyed.

24 So when you talk about reining in methane

25 emissions, I think, first and foremost to me, that comes
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1 to mind, is the fact that stray fuels are contributing

2 to climate change, especially when you look at the

3 equivalent in, up to 2013, 160 coal-fired power plants

4 worth of emissions for greenhouse gases. I think that's

5 unacceptable in this time when we have solutions to

6 this.

7 Colorado certainly has been a leader. And

8 certainly, when we look at the rule, it's great that we

9 see it implemented and we see this leadership from the

10 EPA. And as other speakers have talked about, it's

11 extremely important that we take it to the next step,

12 talking about making sure we regulate existing wells for

13 those that are currently being impacted and are downwind

14 of these wellheads that are emitting methane and other

15 toxins.

16 And certainly, by the end of the day, we would

17 all love to see it in the ground, where it should be,

18 and lean toward a clean fuel energy future.

19 Thank you.

20 MR. GREEN: Mr. Henderson.

21 MR. HENDERSON: Good afternoon. My name is

22 Douglas Henderson; D-o-u-g-l-a-s, H-e-n-d-e-r-s-o-n. I

23 live in Fort Collins in northern Colorado, a region of

24 the country that's heavily affected by oil and gas

25 development. I'm active with a number of civic and
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1 environmental networks, local groups like the Fort

2 Collins Sustainability Group and larger organizations

3 such as 350 and Food & Water Watch. And the values and

4 views that I express are shared by many others locally

5 and across Colorado and across the country.

6 The radical expansion of fracking in recent

7 years has generated substantial, ongoing, and increasing

8 controversy and conflict in northern Colorado, within

9 communities and between municipalities and state-level

10 authorities, over issues involving public health, the

11 environment, resource and property rights, and local

12 self-determination versus state-level authority.

13 Problems of oil and gas development, in

14 particular fracking, in northern Colorado are recognized

15 and documented. And while we know more research is

16 needed, the mounting evidence is clear that oil and gas

17 development is causing:

18 Air pollution in emissions of methane, the

19 subject of this hearing; volatile organic chemicals;

20 ozone; and, of course, CO2;

21 Pollution of surface waters and groundwaters,

22 and destruction of water from a renewable resource to a

23 toxic slurry, which the industry likes to call "produced

24 water";

25 Health damage. Over 700 chemicals used in
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1 fracking, many are endocrine interruptors that disturb

2 hormone function;

3 Property damage to farms, suburban neighbor4 hoods within town limits like Greeley;

5 Political conflicts and legal battles;

6 And the cost of these are borne by

7 individuals, by families, by communities, and

8 governments. The fossil fuel industry denies

9 culpability and evades responsibility.

10 The scale of damage from oil and gas keeps

11 growing. We have exploding trains, pipeline leaks and

12 spills, outrageous damage to oceans and coasts, melting

13 glaciers and polar ice, rising sea levels; now the

14 Arctic is being assaulted; and the mega-problem of

15 climate change, which is looming and accelerating and

16 will affect everything on Earth.

17 The science community and a large portion of

18 the public are convinced that global warming is

19 occurring and caused or exacerbated primarily by fossil

20 fuels. In Colorado and elsewhere, evidence about damage

21 from oil and gas comes out in testimonies at hearings,

22 videos posted online, protests, in panels and

23 conferences, in science and technical journals.

24 Public support for clean energy is at an all25 time high, but it falls on deaf ears in our contemporary
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1 political environment.

2 As the leader of the Fort Collins

3 Sustainability Group put it recently, "We're confronted

4 with an existential threat to civilization, and it's

5 going to take a very big, concentrated effort to tackle

6 it, an effort comparable to what the U.S. put out to

7 beat the Axis powers in World War II. But what we're

8 seeing is a kind of business-as-usual response."

9 Indeed, the oil and gas industry goes forward

10 with full intention to mine, process, and sell all the

11 fossil fuels in the planet, just business as usual. The

12 industry treats the environment -- water, land, and

13 air -- as a dumping ground.

14 Under Vice President Cheney, fracking gained

15 exemption from our nation's hallmark laws protecting our

16 environment. The industry actively campaigns to deny

17 science when it does not suit their interests, and funds

18 antiscience campaigns just as the tobacco industry did

19 before it, acting egregiously against public interest

20 and public health and the environment.

21 Industry denies culpability for its damages.

22 And when it cannot escape culpability, it binds those

23 who are compensated to nondisclosure, imposing threat of

24 financial ruin if anyone speaks out and tells the truth.

25 In northern Colorado, the fracking industry
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1 brings a reign of pressure and fear to communities:

2 Teachers and school administrators afraid to speak out;

3 political leaders, businesses, and media who know the

4 political price of industry's wrath; local government

5 employees who will face repercussions for speaking out.

6 This is not the America that most Americans want.

7 We all use and need fossil fuels in our lives

8 now, but we also understand the need to change direction

9 rapidly, away from fossil fuels to clean, renewable

10 energy. A lot of technology exists now. Economics of

11 renewables are rapidly improving and increasing. And

12 for as long as we continue to need fossil fuels, it's

13 imperative that its production and use proceed in a way

14 that does as little damage as possible, including the

15 strictest methane rules you can come up with.

16 We applaud the Obama Administration, the

17 EPA, and those who lead and support efforts to require

18 the highest standards to protect public health and the

19 environment from fossil fuels, including methane

20 emissions.

21 The other day, while listening to the radio, I

22 heard an ad from the gas industry that said --

23 MR. GREEN: You need you to wrap it up.

24 MR. HENDERSON: -- that said, "Gas provides

25 energy whenever you need it, even when the sun is not
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1 shining," with the obvious, if inaccurate, implication

2 that gas is needed when solar panels aren't producing

3 energy. The ad ended with the industry's catchphrase,

4 "Think about it."

5 Well, I and millions of others are thinking

6 about it a lot. We know that -- that economic renewable

7 technologies exist that can meet a large portion of our

8 power needs. We think that humans are highly inventive,

9 and more so given -- and more and green -- and better

10 green energies will come faster, the more priority we

11 give to it.

12 We think that instead of investing hundreds of

13 billions of dollars and more years in the dirty climate14 crisis fossil fuels, we should be putting that

15 investment into clean and green energy.

16 We think the fossil fuel industry should be

17 stopped from stymieing green innovation, stopped from

18 treating our environment as a dumping ground for its

19 pollution, stopped from evading responsibility for the

20 damages it causes, stopped from corrupting our political

21 environment.

22 We think it is time to recognize that if we're

23 going to have a habitable future, fossil fuel needs to

24 remain in the ground.

25 We think it is great news that commitments to
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1 divest from fossil fuel now totals over $2.6 trillion,

2 up from 50 billion just a year ago, a 50-fold increase

3 in just one year.

4 We think this gives hope and inspiration,

5 because there is no Plan B.

6 MR. GREEN: Thank you. Our next speakers will

7 be Sussy Valdez and Audrey Mascarenhas. Ms. Valdez.

8 MS. VALDEZ: Hi. My name is Sussy, S-u-s-s-y;

9 Valdez, V-, as in Victor, a-l-d-e-z. I came to America

10 in 1997, having experience of doing my high school

11 thesis in South America about pollution. I was in

12 industry, and I saw how they dumped material in the

13 rivers, and also emissions of gas. So then I came to

14 America and I got informed as to what is happening here.

15 And sorry for bringing it up, but you might

16 recall the movie, John Travolta in, "Civil Action,"

17 where there is the dumping of all those toxins in the

18 water and they were having cancer. So I remember that

19 EPA stood up and brought all that cleanup of all that

20 town water that was really making those people get sick.

21 So I am here to only make this comment,

22 because I don't have experience and I don't want to name

23 industry, but they insist that the government go to no

24 regulations, and they're ready for it. They do

25 everything, like, perfect for passing the test. They
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1 audit, inspections. But after the inspectors are gone,

2 they go back to their bad procedures.

3 So my personal comment, while you are

4 expressing that, if you can put some people or some way

5 to really make it that they follow the rules

6 99.9 percent of the time, because it's perfect. It is

7 like having somebody overlooking them. Maybe drones

8 flying, so they cannot shoot them down; cameras, men,

9 you know. That is wonderful.

10 So that's my only comment. So please

11 implement something that is going to be really in favor

12 of every single person, because whatever is happening

13 underground contaminate the water, and it leaks by many

14 people who live many miles away.

15 I appreciate it. Thank you.

16 MS. MASCARENHAS: Good afternoon, ladies and

17 gentlemen. Thank you for the opportunity to speak. My

18 name is Audrey Mascarenhas.

19 So I represent a company --

20 MR. GREEN: Would you spell that for her,

21 please.

22 MS. MASCARENHAS: I was afraid you were going

23 to say that. So Audrey is A-u-d-r-e-y; and last the

24 name, Mascarenhas, M-a-s-c-a-r-e-n-h-a-s.

25 MR. GREEN: Thank you.
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1 MS. MASCARENHAS: So we need fossil fuel,

2 especially in the short term. And I think the challenge

3 really is how do we do this. Well, and how do we do it

4 sustainably. And I think the rules that are being put

5 in place around methane, hazardous air pollutants,

6 volatile organic hydrocarbons, go a long way to

7 addressing the requirement for the oil and gas industry.

8 I represent a company, Questor Technology,

9 that provides clean waste gas combustion technology.

10 We're able to take methane, (inaudible), and volatile

11 organic hydrocarbons; combust them at 99.99 percent

12 combustion efficiency, which means we don't release any

13 hydrocarbons off this process and all we're putting into

14 the atmosphere is just water and CO2.

15 For example, when you look at the data in

16 White Paper in 2011, if we took all the uncontrolled

17 emissions and combusted it cleanly, we would reduce

18 greenhouse gas emissions by 87 percent, at a cost of

19 less than a dollar-fifty a ton.

20 But in addition, after combusting it cleanly,

21 we've got an opportunity to utilize that heat, whether

22 that heat is used for process or heating a building at

23 site, generating power for that site, or using it to

24 treat water, all this technology is readily available.

25 Right now, we are providing this technology
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1 throughout the United States, especially in key oil- and

2 gas-producing areas. So, for example, in Colorado,

3 we're providing solutions on closed-loop completions, so

4 ensuring that we don't have any emissions. And

5 companies are using it to create a social license for

6 the community, address community concerns on air

7 quality, but also get rid of one issue that is a big

8 issue in the (inaudible).

9 And we're working similarly in West Virginia

10 and Pennsylvania. We're working with industry to

11 provide solutions to make sure that volatile organic

12 hydrocarbons aren't produced in the atmosphere. In

13 Texas we're doing the same thing with CO2 and H2S and

14 (inaudible), for example.

15 What's important about all this is it's being

16 done in a very cost-effective way. So complying with

17 the rules aren't onerous. There's technology that's

18 readily available that allows companies to be able to

19 meet this.

20 Probably the key out of all this is really

21 creating an opportunity to create the win-win community

22 or social license to operate. And as I walked into this

23 room today, I mean, I can see lots of people outside

24 protesting. And I think, if we need the energy from

25 fossil fuel short term, we really need a path to find a
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1 way to create the win-win, so between industry and

2 community. In this low-price environment, we really

3 need to find -- find ways that we can cost-effectively

4 create what you're trying to do, which is reduce

5 greenhouse gas emissions, improve air quality for

6 communities.

7 And I really believe technology holds that --

8 that key, so the ability not only to put in regulation

9 that can force companies to pay fines, but also

10 regulation that encourages the use of technology. I

11 guess, looking at flaring and some of these as the

12 low-hanging fruit, so the opportunity not only to deal

13 with it cost effectively, but to use that energy wisely.

14 So I thank you for the opportunity to speak to

15 you.

16 MR. GREEN: Thank you. Our next speakers are

17 Alissa Grutze and Jonathan Beltran. And the court

18 reporter's asked us to remind you to use the microphone

19 so she can hear you.

20 MS. GRUTZE: Hello. I'm Ali Grutze,

21 G-r-u-t-z-e, and I'm here, in turn, for the Sierra Club

22 here in Denver. I grew up in Illinois, and I am

23 speaking on my own behalf today, and in support of EPA's

24 recently proposed methane pollution standards for the

25 oil and gas industry. I just wanted to take this
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1 opportunity to speak today.

2 Given the rapid growth of the oil and gas

3 development, I want to stress why we need to enforce

4 methane regulations.

5 First of all, in order to reduce and prevent

6 further climate change, these rules will require a

7 willingness of the industry to clean up their act by

8 drastically cutting emissions from methane pollution.

9 As you probably already know, this gas traps more than

10 80 times as much heat as carbon dioxide over a 20-year

11 time period. And in 2012 it accounted for 10 percent of

12 greenhouse gas emissions in the U.S. And as long as the

13 extraction and production of natural gas continues, our

14 climate and health will continue to suffer.

15 However, these rules not only cut climate16 warming methane emissions; they will also protect public

17 health by curbing emissions of smog-forming toxic

18 pollutions -- pollutants. These emissions are dangerous

19 for the health of communities and workers; have been

20 linked to cancer, respiratory disease, lung and

21 neurological damage, and asthma attacks. And if we are

22 to substantially reduce oil and gas pollution for future

23 generations, we need renewable energy to replace fossil

24 fuels.

25 I am personally extremely concerned for our
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1 planet's future and the oil and gas industry impacts on

2 it already. And I ask you please help protect the

3 public and the environment from further devastation.

4 So thank you.

5 MR. BELTRAN: Hello. My name is Jonathan

6 Beltran. Beltran is B-, as in boy, e-l-t-r-a-n. And I

7 appreciate the opportunity for commenting my side on

8 what I heard. Drove by and saw a petition going on, and

9 it looked interesting to me, so I figured, check it out.

10 And I've heard comment, it is a highly potent

11 greenhouse gas and 86 times as powerful as carbon

12 dioxide during the time that it remains in the

13 atmosphere. And from what I understood from that is

14 that, I have a little sister and a little brother who

15 grew up nice and healthy; and realized that, growing up,

16 now they're like 16 and 17 years old, now they got

17 asthma.

18 As a young child, I believe they would have

19 had opportunities that many of us can have. Sports. I

20 got a little sister, she loves sports. But she can't

21 join them, for the reasons that methane has the second

22 most prevalence; that yearly, 30 percent of most

23 emissions come from oil production and natural gases.

24 And I believe that it would help out if methane, somehow

25 we can work around, you know, making it more greener for
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1 us.

2 Oh, I believe a way for modifying this for

3 workers that can clean up after their own methane

4 pollutions: I work with a construction company and we

5 work with a lot of chemicals. A way that we work around

6 it is getting rid of it correctly and in a way we can

7 reuse the -- everything, instead of having leaks and

8 letting it get out and polluting our world.

9 And I appreciate it. Thank you. And --

10 thanks.

11 MR. GREEN: Thank you very much. Our next

12 speaker is Jesse Prentice-Dunn.

13 And we only have one more person on the list.

14 Is there anybody else in the audience that would like to

15 testify, that hasn't testified yet?

16 Okay. It's yours.

17 MR. PRENTICE-DUNN: All right, I get the last

18 word. So my name is Jesse Prentice-Dunn. It's a long

19 one. P-r-e-n-t-i-c-e, hyphen, D-u-n-n.

20 Thank you for the opportunity to testify. As

21 I said, my name is Jesse Prentice-Dunn. I live in

22 Denver, Colorado. I'm a member of the Sierra Club here,

23 testifying as a private citizen. So I want to thank

24 you, first and foremost, for holding this hearing today,

25 taking into account the public's views.
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1 I moved here about two years ago, expecting to

2 move into a land of clean air, that Rocky Mountain high,

3 and was shocked to see the brutal air quality of the

4 Front Range. I'm a biker. Every day, I can feel that

5 sun burn on the inside of my lungs from the ozone. I

6 can't see the mountains.

7 And when I go on trips on the weekend, I can

8 see the gas industry and fracking everywhere, from the

9 giant rigs, the flaring, to the brown cloud that hangs

10 over Weld County north of here. It's very apparent:

11 The gas industry's impacting our environment; and in my

12 opinion, not for the better.

13 I want to applaud the EPA for proposing these

14 regulations. I'm sure you've worked long and hard on

15 these, and so thank you for your tireless work. With

16 that said, I don't think they go far enough. We know

17 that the problem, in addition to new sources, is the

18 ones that are already there. So I urge you to, once

19 you're done with this, get to work on the next round;

20 regulate those existing sources.

21 Second, I understand that some of the leak

22 detection and repair systems, the frequency of

23 inspections is determined based on the percentage of

24 leaky parts and kind of determined by how much a company

25 reports that it's leaking. I urge you not to determine
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1 the frequency of inspections based on these voluntary

2 reports, because that just leads companies to falsify

3 reports, to underreport their leaks, so that they don't

4 get inspected so much. So I would say increase the

5 frequency of inspections.

6 I've heard many people talk about the need to

7 move to renewables. I would support that. I haven't

8 heard as much from folks in the industry saying it can't

9 be done. And I'd add to that, don't -- don't let folks

10 tell you that this can't be done and can't be done cost

11 effectively. As you're probably all aware, EPA's rules

12 from cleaning up sulphur in the stationary sector has

13 increased fuel economy in passenger cars. Every

14 industry has met these regulations without issue. And I

15 would say that a bet against strong standards is a bet

16 against American ingenuity.

17 So I will close by saying thank you for your

18 work, and finalize these things, and keep going. Thank

19 you.

20 MR. GREEN: Thank you, Mr. Prentice-Dunn.

21 All right. That's all I have for right now.

22 Once again, is there anybody that hasn't testified, that

23 would like to? All right. We have a volunteer.

24 Please give us your full name and spell it out

25 for the court reporter.
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1 MS. HSIUNG: My name is Stephanie Hsiung, and

2 my last name is H-s-i-u-n-g. Stephanie is

3 S-t-e-p-h-a-n-i-e. I work for the Sierra Club, but I am

4 here as a person speaking on my own behalf.

5 I do want to thank you, as many people have,

6 for holding these hearings and listening to us and our

7 concerns, and I really do applaud you guys for moving

8 forward on this rule. I do think it's a little bit

9 overdue, and I really would like to see EPA move quickly

10 on addressing existing sources of methane and VOCs in

11 the oil and gas industry.

12 As a resident of Boulder, I spend most of my

13 time outside when I'm not working, and it is a real

14 concern to me that the ozone levels have reached such an

15 unhealthy level along the Front Range. And I think most

16 people who live here really do enjoy the outdoors, and

17 not only the health of people's kids and the elderly are

18 at risk, but the more time we spend outside, the more

19 air that we're breathing in that is containing high

20 levels of ozone is really not good for any of us.

21 And so I think this is a fairly easy and kind

22 of commonsense way to address one significant source of

23 methane pollution and VOC pollution. The science is out

24 there. We all know the health impacts of ozone. And

25 methane is obviously a huge climate forcer, more so than
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1 carbon, and it's also a precursor to ozone.

2 So I'm sure the EPA knows this, but not only

3 do the methane -- does methane pollution contribute to

4 greenhouse gases in the atmosphere, but it also

5 increases the background level of ozone globally. And

6 so while VOCs -- excuse me -- while VOCs may have a

7 great impact on local air quality, the large amounts of

8 methane pollution going into our atmosphere is raising

9 the background level of ozone everywhere. So that

10 diminishes air quality everywhere, for everyone.

11 I guess I'll have to close and urge EPA to

12 really implement the strongest regulations that they see

13 fit and move forward to address existing sources in

14 the -- from oil and gas production.

15 So thank you.

16 MR. GREEN: Thank you. Our next speaker will

17 be Roger Singer.

18 MR. SINGER: Good afternoon. My name's Roger

19 Singer. That's R-o-g-e-r, S-i-n-g-e-r. And I want to

20 start out by saying that I too am a representative for

21 the Sierra Club, as a staff person, but I am here today

22 representing myself as well.

23 As you have heard many times before, we do

24 want to thank you; sincerely appreciate the time and

25 effort that EPA has put into a creating this proposed
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1 rule. It is a significant step forward in trying to

2 address greenhouse gas emissions.

3 And I believe the EPA and soon the BLM are on

4 the right track in terms of creating controls to address

5 emissions from dangerous methane; on the right track,

6 but we can still do better. I agree with others that we

7 need to be able to actually reduce methane emissions

8 significantly. The rules as they are now will probably,

9 at best, leave them stagnant or flat. We are calling

10 and asking for a 40 to 45 percent reduction from the

11 2012 levels by 2025.

12 We are asking that you please address existing

13 sources as well. And my understanding is, the BLM

14 version of methane rules coming out, that they will, we

15 hope, address existing sources. We hope the EPA will as

16 well.

17 I would like to say that we now recognize that

18 federal agencies have the authority, the backing, and

19 the public support to be able to afford those

20 significant reductions in methane emissions and other

21 greenhouse gas-causing sources. Thank you for the steps

22 you've taken now. Please act aggressively, knowing that

23 you have this huge amount of public support behind you.

24 Thank you.

25 MR. GREEN: Thank you. Anyone else? All
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1 right. We'll probably have people trickling in

2 throughout the afternoon, so we'll just keep it open

3 till the next speaker shows up.

4 (Pause in the proceedings.)

5 MR. GREEN: Do we have Peggy Tibbetts and

6 Kristin Dickinson in the room?

7 MS. TIBBETTS: I'm here.

8 MR. GREEN: Come on up.

9 MS. TIBBETTS: Right here?

10 MR. GREEN: Yeah.

11 MS. TIBBETTS: My name is --

12 MR. GREEN: So I was going to ask you to state

13 your name and then spell it for the court reporter.

14 And then the way this light works here is:

15 You have five minutes to give your testimony. The

16 yellow light will come on when you have one minute left;

17 and when the red light comes on, your five minutes are

18 up.

19 So with that, it's all yours.

20 MS. TIBBETTS: My name is Peggy Tibbetts;

21 P-e-g-g-y, T-i-b-b-e-t-t-s. My husband, Tod, and I have

22 lived in the town of Silt since 1996. Silt is located

23 in western Colorado, in western Garfield County, where

24 in 2009 there were about 4,000 active oil and gas wells.

25 As of September 1, 2015, there are over 11,000.
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1 Along with those wells, there are compressor stations,

2 gas processing plants, tank farms, pipeline transfer

3 stations, and hundreds of miles of pipelines.

4 Silt is nestled in the basin of the Colorado

5 River. With well pads and facilities to the north,

6 south, east, and west of town, we are surrounded. We do

7 not have air quality monitoring in Silt, but we

8 definitely have an emissions problem.

9 Oil and gas facilities leak methane emissions

10 that include other hazardous air pollutants like

11 benzene, ethylbenzene, toluene, xylene, and styrene.

12 The common acronym is BTEX or, in this case, BTEXS.

13 Even I didn't fully understand the seriousness

14 of the human health risks caused by ambient BTEXS

15 emissions from oil and gas operations until I became

16 sick last year. In April 2014 blood and urine samples

17 were collected from me, my daughter Emma, and my

18 granddaughter Haley, who was 12 years old at the time.

19 They also lived in Silt, eight blocks away.

20 Dr. Greg Dooley, at Colorado State University

21 lab, conducted the testing. The urine samples for all

22 three of us tested positive for the metabolites for

23 ethylbenzene, xylene, toluene, and styrene. Haley's

24 blood also tested positive for those chemicals.

25 Emma moved Haley and her little brother out of
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1 Silt this past spring. For more than a year my body has

2 been besieged by nine different bacterial infections.

3 This year I underwent DNA testing. The results were

4 analyzed by a DNA researcher and toxicologist. The two

5 most significant things the analysis revealed are:

6 Number one, my body is unable to process

7 BTEXS;

8 Number two, my immune system is not

9 functioning because my body is contaminated by BTEXS

10 caused by cumulative, prolonged exposure.

11 Without a functioning immune system my body is

12 unable to fend off the normal bacteria that our bodies

13 are exposed to on a daily basis.

14 Tod travels regularly to New York City and

15 Boston for his job. After spending a week at a time in

16 these dense urban environments, he returns home to

17 poorer air quality. As he heads east on the freeway

18 from Battlement Mesa to Silt, he complains the air

19 smells, his eyes become irritated, and he starts

20 coughing and sneezing. He doesn't get sick when he

21 travels to the East Coast. He gets sick when he comes

22 home to Silt.

23 In February 2014 the Colorado Air Quality

24 Control Commission adopted stricter methane emission

25 standards, making our state the first in the nation to
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1 address fugitive methane emissions. Unfortunately, the

2 new regulations do not go far enough in addressing leaks

3 in existing oil and gas sites and facilities, and the

4 operators are essentially allowed to self-monitor and

5 self-report.

6 In March this year, Tod and I participated in

7 the Citizens Empowerment Project sponsored by

8 Earthworks. A small group of citizens took a trained

9 thermographer on a guided tour of more than a dozen oil

10 and gas sites and facilities in western Garfield County.

11 The thermographer used the FLIR Gasfindir

12 camera to expose otherwise invisible emissions from

13 these sites and facilities. The one- to three-minute

14 videos show massive clouds of hazardous air pollution

15 pumping out of these facilities. Something as innocuous

16 as a produced water tank is actually shrouded in a cloud

17 of toxic emissions.

18 The truth is, that level of fugitive emissions

19 is ongoing 24 hours day, 7 days a week, every -- at

20 every single oil and gas well pad and facility. And we

21 as residents have no other choice but to breathe that

22 contaminated air.

23 Stricter methane emissions standards mean less

24 BTEX emissions as well as other hazardous air

25 pollutants. In order to save the lives of the residents
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1 who live in the gas fields, as well the workers, I urge

2 the EPA to adopt the strictest rules possible.

3 We desperately need meaningful enforcement and

4 increased federal inspections of all oil and gas

5 facilities, new and existing. We must not allow -- we

6 must not continue to allow the operators to self7 monitor and self-report. We must impose heavy fines on

8 violators and shut down the violators who fail to

9 comply.

10 Our ultimate goal must be zero emissions.

11 It's good for public health, good for the environment,

12 and good for the oil and gas industry's bottom line.

13 Above all, it is most certainly attainable.

14 Thank you.

15 MR. GREEN: Thank you, Ms. Tibbetts.

16 MS. DICKINSON: Good afternoon. Can you hear

17 me? Yeah? My name is Kristin Dickinson; K-r-i-s-t-i-n,

18 D-i-c-k-i-n-s-o-n. I am an environmental coordinator

19 with Enerplus Resources.

20 Enerplus is an oil and gas exploration and

21 production company, and we operate on Fort Berthold

22 Indian Reservation in North Dakota. The majority of our

23 facilities are located on lands leased from the

24 three affiliated tribes or individual tribal members

25 themselves.
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1 My testimony today is specific to the Indian

2 Country Minor Source Review FIP rulemaking. I can

3 provide unique perspective on both the rule -- on the

4 rule both because Enerplus operates exclusively on Fort

5 Berthold Indian Reservation in North Dakota and because

6 I personally completed the existing postconstruction

7 registration requirements of the Indian Country Minor

8 Source Review for Enerplus.

9 Currently the Tribal Minor Source Review

10 requires operators to submit a registration within

11 90 days of initial production. Proposed -- the proposed

12 rulemaking requires True Minor Sources that elect to

13 comply with the proposed FIP, to register their sources

14 30 days prior to beginning construction.

15 Enerplus respectfully requests that EPA

16 consider changing the proposed language to allow for

17 postconstruction registrations, as opposed to the

18 proposed preconstruction registrations.

19 Preconstruction registrations present a number

20 of challenges to operators because:

21 It is difficult to predict oil and gas

22 production and gas composition for an individual well or

23 pad prior to startup. Factors such as completions

24 technology improvements, downhole failures, drilling

25 into different formations such as the Bakken or Three
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1 Forks in our case, infill drilling, and even continued

2 uncertainty in reservoir characteristics such as the

3 extended sweet spots, can all influence the well's

4 productivity and the well's specific gas composition;

5 This uncertainty leads operators to

6 essentially guess production and emissions rates if they

7 are required to do a registration prior to construction;

8 To be conservative we will likely overestimate

9 our production and PTE to ensure registration values

10 aren't exceeded upon startup. This will result in

11 registrations with emissions estimates nowhere near

12 actuals.

13 The oil and gas industry has seen instances in

14 the past where the PTE from permits and registrations

15 such as these were used to analyze oil and gas emissions

16 in scientific studies and, even more concerning, used

17 for emissions modeling for actual conditions and

18 impacts.

19 These unrealistically high emissions estimates

20 will then misrepresent impacts of oil and gas to the

21 public and other agencies such as the Bureau of Land

22 Management, Forest Service, and the U.S. Fish and

23 Wildlife Service.

24 A possible solution to this issue would be to

25 allow operators to update their registration after
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1 startup; but under the current proposed Indian Country

2 Minor Source Review FIP, a modification is limited to a

3 physical change or to an increase in emissions:

4 There are currently no provisions to revise

5 the FIP registration emissions downwards post6 construction using actual emissions;

7 If the EPA chooses -- chooses to stay with

8 provisions requiring preconstruction permitting,

9 Enerplus respectfully requests the EPA provide operators

10 the ability to adjust the FIP registrations downward,

11 postconstruction.

12 In addition to the complications with

13 preconstruction estimates: The EPA's proposed

14 requirement for preconstruction registrations in Indian

15 Country is inconsistent with oil and gas regulations in

16 surrounding states -- in a state surrounding tribal

17 lands:

18 For example, the North Dakota Industrial

19 Commission requires a facility register within 90 days

20 of initial production, an example of a postconstruction

21 registration;

22 Even federal regulations such as Quad O allow

23 operators the ability to determine PTE within 30 days of

24 first production, another example of using actual test

25 figure emissions;
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1 Regulations like these acknowledge the need

2 for actual data in order for one to provide an accurate

3 emissions estimate;

4 The inconsistency between the proposed Indian

5 Country FIP and other federal and state oil and gas

6 permitting requirements poses a disadvantage to tribal

7 members and tribal operators on a reservation where

8 mineral royalties are a crucial source of income for the

9 tribe and critical to their economic development and

10 self-sufficiency.

11 In summary, Enerplus requests the EPA to

12 revise the Indian Country Minor Source language to

13 either:

14 Provide for postconstruction registrations in

15 order to be consistent with the states in Quad O; or

16 Make it publicly clear that the provided

17 preconstruction emissions are overestimates and not

18 representative of actual emissions and therefore should

19 not be used for modeling or scientific analysis;

20 If the EPA decides to stick with

21 preconstruction registrations, please allow operators

22 the ability to update them after production without a

23 physical change or increase in emissions, in order for

24 them to more accurately reflect emissions.

25 MR. GREEN: All right. Thank you.
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1 MS. VETTER: I was going to ask her to give

2 that to the court reporter.

3 MR. GREEN: Yeah, and I was going to ask the

4 last speaker to do the same. Could we get a copy of

5 your testimony?

6 MS. TIBBETTS: Sure.

7 MR. GREEN: Thank you. Our next speakers are

8 Hilda Nucete and Sophia Herrera Murphy.

9 All right. Ms. Nucete, it's all yours.

10 MS. NUCETE: Hi. My name is Hilda Nucete;

11 H-i-l-d-a, N-u-c-e-t-e. I am originally from Venezuela,

12 but I have been living in Adams County for the past

13 decade. I am here today as a member of the Latino

14 community, as one -- one out of five Coloradans here in

15 the United States. And I am here because I would like

16 to support proposed methane standards for the oil and

17 gas industry.

18 For me, this issue is quite personal. I am

19 originally from Venezuela, and I grew up in an area

20 where a lot of refineries were there. It was an oil

21 camp, in fact, in Marcaibo, Venezuela. And growing up,

22 I was affected by asthma. After my dad passed away, we

23 were able to move to the city, and, surprisingly enough,

24 in the inner city that was polluted, my asthma declined.

25 I was not having attacks anymore.
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1 And in 2007, due to the difficult political

2 situation in Venezuela, my family had to immigrate to

3 the United States. As I moved to Colorado, my asthma

4 came back, and the question to my family was: We moved

5 to the United States in order to search for a better

6 lifestyle, to search for a better air quality, better

7 dignity, you know. And we moved from a Third World

8 country to avoid those Third World standards, and I come

9 to Colorado and I have received the same standards that

10 I was receiving in Venezuela. So for that, this is very

11 important for me.

12 Methane is one of the most significant drivers

13 of climate change and of health of the Latino community.

14 When 14 percent of Latino children have asthma and

15 Latino communities are 40 percent most likely of having

16 asthma as any other ethnic group, it becomes a very

17 personal issue and an issue that is affecting, as I said

18 before, one out of five Coloradans.

19 So that is why we're looking forward to

20 seeing stronger possible methane standards to finalize,

21 along with a rule to limit methane pollution from

22 existing sources, to achieve the full reduction of

23 methane emissions that you guys have.

24 Thank you.

25 MR. GREEN: Thank you. Ms. Guerrero-Murphy.
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1 MS. GUERRERO-MURPHY: Yes, hi. I'm Sophia

2 Guerrero-Murphy. It's S-o-p-h-i-a; G-u-e-r-r-e-r-o,

3 hyphen, M-u-r-p-h-y. So I am also here speaking as a

4 member of the Latino community. I grew up in Alamosa,

5 Colorado, which is in the southern end of the state, but

6 I come today from Jefferson County, which is where I

7 currently live.

8 The San Luis Valley is a place -- it's really

9 rural, for people who don't know. There's not a whole

10 lot of, like, huge carbon/methane producing industry.

11 But our air quality there is still atrocious because of

12 the way the weather works, and there are mountains, so

13 the things that get carried over the smaller mountains

14 on one side of the valley get stuck. We also have the

15 Sand Dunes, are there. It leaves behind sand and it

16 also leaves behind pollution.

17 So our air quality there, instead of like

18 being in a beautiful rural valley, is actually much

19 worse than the air quality on the Front Range. We

20 therefore have higher rates of many health issues, but

21 particularly bronchial/respiratory health issue rates

22 there are pretty stunning.

23 And then in general -- I mean, that is, you

24 know, a very Latino-heavy area, but in general, as Hilda

25 mentioned, the Latinos in this country, and really any
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1 nonwhite children, are so much more likely to suffer

2 from respiratory issues, that a methane rule, that is

3 going to be affecting our overall air quality and

4 therefore your overall health.

5 And the health of your family is particularly

6 important for populations of color, disenfranchised

7 populations, because in addition to all of that, there's

8 less resilience, right, when you're being attacked by

9 climate change, because methane is ultimately one of our

10 biggest contributors to climate issues, climate change,

11 and you are in a community that doesn't necessarily have

12 the funds to recover from a disaster, a climate-related

13 disaster. You know, that's -- that's another issue.

14 So it's not just your air quality every day,

15 but it's also the way that you can be resilient to

16 those. It's also the way that you, if you don't have

17 the funds to be able to move, right, like you heard some

18 really tragic stories today of people that are living in

19 places that are highly polluted because they don't have

20 an option to be somewhere else, you know, either because

21 of their homes or they don't have the money to be

22 elsewhere. The list goes on. But we need to be

23 protecting our citizens from those things, in their jobs

24 and their homes. They need to be healthy.

25 And in general, too, like this kind of rule
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1 works, right? It just -- it works. We've seen it

2 happen in Colorado here. We've reduced an amazing

3 amount of methane pollution and that's fantastic. And

4 so having it be a federal regulation will give us better

5 air quality. And I know that seems really simple, but

6 there seems to be a notion we can regulate all we want

7 and it's not actually going to improve anything. But it

8 does.

9 We used to have lead in our gasoline; and five

10 years after we made unleaded gasoline the standard, we

11 had 95 percent less lead in our air. And thinking about

12 that now, you can't have lead in the air, we know that's

13 a toxic metal. That's disgusting. Hopefully, that's

14 how people will be feeling about these high levels of

15 methane, in the future; that it's toxic, right?

16 And right now it seems perfectly normal, but

17 it shouldn't be, because it's not okay for you. It's

18 not healthy. And we need to be healthy, we need to

19 protect our citizens.

20 We are so lucky to live in a country where we

21 can give, like, testimonials like this, that can make

22 that kind of thing possible. And just, I would

23 reiterate, I really look forward to watching these

24 strong methane rules go through on the national level.

25 And then one more tag note is the importance
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1 of baseline data because there's kind of a loophole at

2 the moment, where it's difficult to really gauge how

3 much methane's being controlled and reduced unless you

4 have really great baseline data. And so that should be

5 appropriate in that ruling.

6 Thank you.

7 MR. GREEN: All right. Thank you both very

8 much.

9 MS. NUCETE: I also don't have a copy because

10 I just spoke, sorry.

11 MR. GREEN: Okay.

12 MS. NUCETE: I can e-mail you stuff, if you

13 like.

14 MR. GREEN: Okay. We have two more. Our next

15 speakers are Susan Kohut -- I don't know if I pronounced

16 that wrong -- and Marilyn Ham.

17 MS. KOHUT: Hi. I'm Susan Kohut; it's

18 S-u-s-a-n, K-o-h-u-t. And I'm from Denver; originally

19 from New Jersey, but I've been in Colorado for over ten

20 years and, as many people, moved out here for all of the

21 wonderful things in the outdoors.

22 And just here today, briefly, I want to thank

23 you for the opportunity to offer comments and really

24 appreciate the EPA taking the important first step to

25 control methane emissions from oil and gas sources.
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1 As we know, the oil and gas industry is the

2 largest industrial source of methane pollution, and the

3 EPA's proposal represents the first-ever methane

4 controls for the oil and gas industry.

5 Under the standard, oil and gas operators will

6 install controls that will reduce not only methane but

7 also smog- and soot-forming pollutants and hazardous

8 emissions, which will generate significant public health

9 benefits, in addition to climate benefits.

10 However, the rule only covers new and modified

11 infrastructures, even while existing sources are, by

12 far, the major source of problems. By 2018, nearly

13 90 percent of all methane emissions from the oil and gas

14 sector will come from sources now in existence, which

15 aren't covered under the proposal.

16 The U.S. cannot meet its international green17 house gas reduction commitments unless it cuts methane

18 from oil and gas sources by 40 to 45 percent, from 2012

19 levels, by 2025. At best the current proposals will

20 keep methane emissions flat. We cannot achieve the

21 reductions needed unless EPA regulates existing sources

22 from the oil and gas sector.

23 While I support the EPA's efforts to develop

24 methane standards from new and modified sources, the

25 Agency must begin work on an existing source rule as it
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1 moves forward with the New Source Rule.

2 Colorado's one of this country's leaders when

3 it comes to reducing methane pollution, and in 2014

4 Colorado became the first state to directly regulate

5 methane pollution. To that end, I hope the EPA will

6 strengthen and finalize these rules and move swiftly to

7 issue standards covering both new and existing sources.

8 This is a state of people who love the

9 outdoors, and with optimal methane controls in place,

10 fracking is still dangerous and unnecessary. And I

11 support a swift transition to clean energy, clean and

12 renewable energy, and energy efficiency.

13 Thank you.

14 MR. GREEN: Thank you. Ms. Ham.

15 MS. HAM: My name is Marilyn Ham;

16 M-a-r-i-l-y-n, H-a-m. I'm a longtime resident of

17 Cheyenne, Wyoming. Thank you for the opportunity to

18 comment on the proposal to reduce oil and gas and

19 drilling production and facilities emissions. I believe

20 the reduction is important for public health and in

21 reducing impacts to our climate. Rules need to be

22 implemented that strengthen the public's right to clean,

23 safe air. It is my hope EPA will act promptly.

24 I am a member of the Cheyenne Area Landowners

25 Coalition and live in an area north and east of current
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1 activity in Laramie County, Cheyenne, Wyoming. At the

2 present, Laramie County is experiencing the state's

3 greatest demand for Applications for Permit to Drill.

4 The applications currently number well beyond 2,000; and

5 even now, with the slowing in drilling, we still have

6 activity. I see the oil and gas trucks going down I-25

7 and U.S. 85, so I know we are still impacted. It has

8 not been long ago when a well just east of us was being

9 drilled that, for days, we had the odor of natural gas.

10 My husband, who suffers from asthma, complained about

11 it.

12 It has also been the last couple of weeks that

13 a study by NYU was touted on the news broadcast, that

14 stated that breathing air with minute levels of foreign

15 chemicals could shorten life expectancy by 3 percent;

16 another study said up to 10 percent.

17 Rules need to be strengthened in: One,

18 requirements to all existing wells, not only new wells;

19 two, the EPA should increase the proposed 95 percent

20 control of wet seal emissions to 98 percent control,

21 which is achievable through current technology; for

22 pneumatic pumps, also increase from 95 percent to

23 98 percent control through available technology, and

24 with the Best Available Control Technology available

25 standard in Wyoming; remove the technical feasibility
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1 exception, which creates a loophole that allows for

2 designing away of regulatory applicability; five,

3 industry should be using best practices in unloading

4 liquids, to prevent blowdown or venting of VOCs and HAP

5 emissions, and EPA should include those facilities in

6 their regulations; six, EPA should lower volatile

7 organic compound thresholds for storage tanks from 4 --

8 from 6 tons a year to 4 tons per year.

9 Thank you for the opportunity to comment. We

10 know industry can and does perform at a higher standard

11 in many states. Strengthening the EPA rules should mean

12 a greater standard of performance in every state.

13 Thank you.

14 MR. GREEN: All right. Thank you both very

15 much. And if we could get copies of your testimony,

16 that would be great.

17 All right. Our next commenters are Cherry

18 Hall and Casey Quinn.

19 We're doing a battery check, just real

20 quickly, on the microphones. So if you will give us

21 about ten minutes, that will be great. Thanks.

22 (Pause in the proceedings.)

23 MR. GREEN: All right. Ms. Hall, if you would

24 go first, please.

25 MS. HALL: I'm Cherry Hall. My first name is
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1 spelled like cherry, and it's pronounced Sherry --

2 MR. GREEN: Cherry, use the microphone,

3 please.

4 MS. HALL: Oh, I'm sorry.

5 MR. GREEN: So the court reporter can hear

6 you.

7 MS. HALL: Okay. I'm Cherry Hall. First name

8 is spelled like cherry, C-h-e-r-r-y; middle initial is

9 L; last name's Hall, H-a-l-l. I live in Cheyenne,

10 Wyoming, and I have since 2000. Prior to that, I lived

11 in Sheridan, Wyoming.

12 I've lived in Wyoming since 1989. I'm a

13 landowner and a grandmother, and that's why I'm here

14 today. I do have some professional credentials, but I

15 am here, again, speaking to you today as a landowner and

16 as a grandmother. I am concerned about environmental

17 issues, and I appreciate being able to be here today and

18 express my thoughts and my concerns to you.

19 First of all, I would ask the EPA to act

20 quickly to implement new rules that will strengthen the

21 rules that we already have; and we know that several

22 states are requiring this, regarding limiting air

23 pollution emissions from the oil and gas industry. I

24 live in a subdivision about 10 miles north of Cheyenne.

25 I'm surrounded by oil wells, and I'm not happy.
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1 I would also ask that you require the proposed

2 rules to apply to all existing oil and gas well sites

3 and facilities, not just a few wells or a few

4 facilities. We need to apply the new rules to all

5 existing facilities.

6 Regarding compressors at transmission

7 facilities, we recommend that the EPA increase the

8 proposed 95 percent control to 98 percent control, and

9 this is readily available and achievable, as I

10 understand it. I am a member of the Powder River Basin

11 Council and am also a member of the Cheyenne Area

12 Landowners Coalition.

13 Regarding pneumatic pumps at well sites and

14 transmission facilities, we recommend an increase from

15 the proposed 95 percent, again, to the 98 percent

16 control. As I understand it, this is achievable and you

17 have capability to do that.

18 I also request that the EPA remove technical

19 feasibility exceptions. If the well cannot be completed

20 with reduced emissions, it shouldn't be drilled, in the

21 first place.

22 And I thank you for letting me come and speak

23 to you today. It's a long trip from Cheyenne, but we're

24 always happy to come to Denver. We wish the Rockies

25 would win a few more games.
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1 Thank you.

2 MR. GREEN: All right. Thank you. Mr. Quinn.

3 MR. QUINN: Can you hear me? Got me? Okay.

4 Thank you for giving me the opportunity to be

5 here today. My name is Casey Quinn. That's C-a-s-e-y,

6 Q-u-i-n-n. I represent the members of Powder River

7 Basin Resource Council. Our council represents roughly

8 1,000 members, 1000-plus members, and about half of

9 those live near oil and gas production facilities.

10 First and foremost, we commend the EPA for

11 heading in the right direction by seeking to cut oil and

12 gas emissions, for the sake of public health and

13 reducing climate impact. That said, we do believe these

14 proposed rules should be taken a bit further if the EPA

15 is serious about limiting emissions.

16 I'm going to reiterate much of what Ms. Hall

17 said and Ms. Ham said.

18 Specifically, concerning compressors at

19 transmission facilities, we recommend that the EPA

20 increase the proposed 95 percent control of wet seal

21 emissions to 98 percent control. This is available and

22 achievable through current combustion technology.

23 Regarding pneumatic pumps at well sites and

24 transmission facilities, we recommended an increase from

25 the proposed 95 percent control to 98 percent control.
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1 Again, this is achievable through current combustion

2 technology and is the presumptive Best Available Control

3 Technology standard in Wyoming.

4 In terms of the green completions, we request

5 the EPA remove the technical feasibility exception. We

6 believe it invites poor design or even creates a

7 loophole that encourages a deliberate designing away of

8 the regulatory applicability. We believe that if the

9 well cannot be completed with the standards set forth,

10 it should not be drilled.

11 For liquids unloading facilities, we recommend

12 that EPA include those facilities in the regulation and

13 require that emissions during liquids unloading be

14 minimized with current best practices. Wyoming requires

15 this statewide, addressing liquids unloading through

16 minor source permit conditions.

17 These conditions include: VOC and HAP

18 emissions resulting from episodes of blowdown or venting

19 must be minimized to the extent practicable; manual

20 blowdown and venting must be attended, to minimize the

21 duration of such events; and records must be kept

22 detailing the duration, process conditions, control

23 measures taken, and estimated emissions from each event.

24 We also request that the EPA lower the

25 proposed VOCs emission threshold for storage tanks from
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1 6 tons per year to 4 tons per year. Wyoming already

2 enforces the 4-tons-per-year threshold for tank-flashing

3 emissions in Wyoming's Upper Green River Basin area, and

4 requires controls for all tanks, regardless of the

5 emission levels, in the Jonah-Pinedale area.

6 And then, most importantly, all these proposed

7 rules only apply to new wells. We feel that if the EPA

8 is serious about limiting oil and gas emissions, we need

9 to apply these rules to all existing facilities.

10 Industry is more than capable of performing to

11 a higher standard, which is shown in several states. We

12 request that the EPA strengthen the proposed rules, to

13 implement this higher standard of performance.

14 Thank you.

15 MR. GREEN: All right. Thank you both. Could

16 we get copies of your testimony?

17 All right. Our next presenters are Chris

18 Eaton and Andrew Casper.

19 MR. EATON: Hi. My name is Chris Eaton. I'm

20 an attorney with Earthjustice here in Denver. I want to

21 thank you all for the opportunity to comment here on

22 EPA's proposed methane pollution standards.

23 Eartjustice is a national public interest law

24 firm dedicated --

25 MR. GREEN: I'm sorry, Mr. Eaton. Could I get
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1 you to spell your name for the court reporter.

2 MR. EATON: Oh, sorry. E-a-t-o-n is the last

3 name.

4 Earthjustice is a national public interest law

5 firm dedicated to protecting the environment through

6 mitigation and advocacy. Our Rocky Mountain office,

7 here in Denver, previously was involved in Colorado's

8 rulemaking to limit methane emissions in the oil and gas

9 sector, and we're pleased to see the EPA following

10 Colorado's lead on the front lines.

11 Earthjustice supports EPA's proposal to cut

12 methane pollution from new and modified oil and gas

13 sources. These standards are a commonsense step toward

14 protecting our climate from a very potent greenhouse

15 gas. At the same time, these standards will have the

16 co-benefit of reducing harmful air pollution affecting

17 communities that are on the front lines of oil and gas

18 development.

19 We're particularly encouraged that EPA has

20 proposed broadly applicable methane leak detection and

21 repair requirements for the oil and gas sector. We're

22 also pleased that EPA has included downstream sources in

23 the proposed standards; namely, the transmission and

24 storage segment. And we're happy to see that the Agency

25 is addressing the harmful practice of venting gas during
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1 oil well completions.

2 Colorado's successful regulation of methane

3 emissions from the oil and gas sector demonstrates that

4 achieving meaningful emissions reductions from the

5 sector is entirely feasible and has very little

6 downside. In fact, since Colorado's rule was adopted

7 last year, oil -- oil field production and employment

8 have increased in the state. But while we so generously

9 support EPA's proposal, there are several ways that we

10 would like to see EPA strengthen its standards.

11 For one, EPA should expand the scope of the

12 standards to include several other key pieces of

13 equipment and practices, specifically liquids unloading

14 operations, storage vessels, and compressors at well

15 sites. These are significant sources of methane leaks.

16 Low-cost controls exist that can be applied to these

17 practices and equipment to reduce these leaks and should

18 be included as a part of the standards.

19 Second, EPA should strengthen standards for

20 leak inspection. Performing inspections only

21 semiannually is much too infrequent and inadequate;

22 monthly or even quarterly inspections would be -- are

23 more appropriate to identify and repair leaks in a

24 timely manner.

25 In addition, allowing facilities to skip
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1 inspections based on prior results has the potential to

2 increase harmful leaks. For one, past performance

3 doesn't accurately predict current or future

4 performance; new leaks pop up all the time. And it sort

5 of creates an incentive to ignore leaks, in order to be

6 able to skip the next inspection.

7 Finally, the proposed rule allows oil and gas

8 companies too much leeway to flare off natural gas

9 instead of capturing it. Flaring wastes valuable

10 natural gas and increases pollution. So EPA should

11 allow flaring only in exceptional circumstances, when it

12 is genuinely not possible to capture the gas for sale or

13 on-site use.

14 With those suggested improvements, these

15 standards for new and modified sources represent a great

16 commonsense first step in a regulatory scheme that, we

17 would hope, ultimately leads to methane emissions

18 standards for existing sources, just like we have here

19 in Colorado.

20 These existing sources will be responsible for

21 the vast majority of methane emissions from the oil and

22 gas sector for the foreseeable future; nearly 90 percent

23 of methane emissions in that sector will come from

24 existing sources in 2018. So it's imperative that the

25 EPA build on its initial efforts and expeditiously move
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1 forward to limit these from existing sources.

2 So I thank you for your time.

3 MR. GREEN: Thank you. Mr. Casper.

4 MR. CASPER: Good afternoon. My name is -- my

5 name is Andrew Casper, and I serve as regulatory counsel

6 to the Colorado Oil and Gas Association, or COGA. COGA,

7 through its over 300-member companies, fosters and

8 promotes the beneficial, efficient, responsible, and

9 environmentally sound development, production, and use

10 of Colorado oil and natural gas.

11 COGA has a long history of working

12 cooperatively with -- with the state, in a number of air

13 quality-related matters. COGA was a key participant in

14 the 2014 Colorado rulemaking, often referred to as the

15 "Methane Rule," upon which many of these new NSPS

16 amendments are based. During this process, we worked

17 closely with the Division to craft the most workable

18 rules possible, sometimes challenging certain proposals,

19 and in the end we learned a tremendous amount. We are

20 encouraged that the EPA's willing to learn from our

21 experience, appreciate the opportunity to provide public

22 comment, and I now offer these comments in that spirit.

23 This industry has seen a surge in regulatory

24 activity over the past several years, both at the state

25 and federal levels. Nowhere has this -- that activity
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1 been more pervasive than here in Colorado. Whether it

2 is the original Quad O NSPS, the impending BLM venting

3 and flaring rules, the ever-tightening ozone standards,

4 the 2014 Colorado Regulation No. 7 methane rules, or

5 this new rulemaking package at issue today, our members

6 are seemingly in perpetual rulemaking or rule

7 implementation mode.

8 Meanwhile, the facts tell a story undeserving

9 of such intense scrutiny. By EPA's own numbers, methane

10 and other air emissions from this sector have declined

11 substantially over the past 30 years, and despite a

12 significant uptick in production, this -- despite a

13 significant uptick in production. This is due to a

14 variety of factors, including voluntary programs, the

15 2012 NSPS, and important advances in technology and air

16 pollution control.

17 Here in Colorado air quality along the Front

18 Range has never been better, despite continued and

19 significant population and mobile -- mobile source

20 growth. Can improvements be made? Of course, and they

21 have. Our members operate the most highly controlled

22 and environmentally responsible facilities in the

23 country, if not the world. This has yielded not only

24 invaluable economic benefits, but it's also a remarkable

25 environmental success story.
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1 As EPA embarks on yet another major rule2 making, we urge the Agency to vigorously address the

3 fundamental questions, like: What is the public

4 benefit, health and otherwise, from these rules? Are

5 they necessary, and in what form, given that the 2012

6 rules have barely had time to take effect? And whether

7 the global climate change and other air quality benefits

8 being promised will actually be realized.

9 I would also like to provide you with some

10 brief comments on Colorado's experience with the 2014

11 regulations. It is critical to stress that Colorado

12 operators are in the early stages of implementing these

13 new Colorado rules. Needless to say, there have been

14 bumps along the road during the implementation phase.

15 We don't yet have a full understanding about what may be

16 working and what may be not. We don't yet have data

17 regarding the regulatory burdens and costs imposed by

18 the Colorado -- the Colorado rules. Thus, it would be

19 premature for the EPA to use Colorado estimates to

20 justify new federal rules; it would be inadequate rule21 making to merely adopt the Colorado rules nationwide.

22 Moreover, there are several reasons to

23 approach the Colorado model with caution. First, they

24 are state-only rules and have not been EPA approved as

25 part of the State Implementation Plan, meaning their air
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1 quality benefits have not been proven, to any reasonable

2 degree of scientific certainty.

3 Second, the DJ, Denver-Jules (sic), Basin is

4 very unique. There is an unusual amount of

5 infrastructure, pipelines, and roads in place that make

6 implementation of the Colorado rules, and the LDAR

7 program in particular, unique compared with other, more

8 rural areas across the country. Because travel costs

9 and the presence of infrastructure tend to be

10 significant cost drivers for rules like those being

11 contemplated, what may be cost effective in Colorado may

12 not be elsewhere.

13 In closing, COGA appreciates the opportunity

14 to provide this public comment. We encourage the Agency

15 to remain cognizant of the significant regulatory

16 challenges facing our industry and to coordinate its

17 regulatory efforts across federal agencies, with the

18 states. In addition, we very much encourage the Agency

19 to formally recognize established, robust, and stringent

20 programs like Colorado's and allow operators the

21 flexibility to comply with such state programs in place

22 under federal requirements.

23 Thank you.

24 MR. GREEN: All right. Thank you both. Our

25 next speaker is Angela Miller.
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1 Mr. Casper, if you have a written testimony,

2 could you leave that with us, please.

3 This must be Abigail.

4 MS. MILLER: Yeah.

5 MR. GREEN: I don't think we can hear you.

6 MS. MILLER: Is this on?

7 MR. GREEN: Yeah, you can just hold it, if you

8 like. And if you would, would you state your name and

9 spell it for the court reporter as well. Thank you.

10 MS. MILLER: My name is Angela Miller;

11 A-n-g-e-l-a, M-i-l-l-e-r. And this is Abigail Miller.

12 We live in Superior and want to thank you for allowing

13 us to speak today.

14 The gas and oil industry is expanding at a

15 rapid rate, and the rules that we're discussing here

16 today have a significant opportunity to greatly put --

17 to put protections, that are greatly needed, in place

18 for air quality and public health. And the two in hand

19 -- the two go hand in hand, and they cannot be

20 separated. I personally have asthma, and I'm here to

21 tell you, from personal experience, that the days when

22 the smog is visible, a boatload of medication will not

23 make me feel okay, and sometimes we have to alter our

24 plans.

25 The rules that we are discussing here today
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1 need to apply to everyone, every industry, and they need

2 to apply everywhere. No one should be allowed to be

3 exempt. We need to regulate airborne toxins, including

4 the ozone-inducing VOCs and the methane emissions.

5 Methane is the primary constituent of natural gas and is

6 a potent greenhouse gas. Methane is 80 -- 86 times more

7 potent than carbon dioxide over a 20-year time frame.

8 The gas and oil industry is the largest industrial

9 source of methane. The rules we discuss here today can

10 significantly reduce dangerous air pollution.

11 I'm asking the EPA to go even further and

12 protect -- can you guys hear me? I feel like I'm

13 echoing.

14 MR. GREEN: Yes.

15 MS. MILLER: -- and protect what is really

16 important, and that's our children and grandchildren's

17 future. They need clean air to breathe. Although we

18 can leave them money in our wills and trusts, they

19 cannot breathe money. Some people who are cynical and

20 driven by money might laugh and say, yes, you can. I'm

21 here to tell you, you cannot breathe money.

22 So the legislation we're talking about is

23 critical. It covers only new and modified

24 infrastructure. This is a wonderful step in the right

25 direction, but I have a concern about the existing
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1 sources being a huge contributor to air pollution. So

2 it makes sense that the draft rules also monitor

3 emissions and require adequate reporting that deal with

4 existing methane emissions as well.

5 And on a sidebar, I know that representatives

6 from gas and oil companies are listening, and I want to

7 encourage you to expand your portfolios to include

8 renewable energy. Stockholders will get on board

9 because we all need clean air. And Colorado offers a

10 lot of sunshine and a lot of land. This is a perfect

11 place to extend and expand the renewable energies. I

12 know that the change is difficult, but it's possible,

13 and we're long past due for some much-needed change in

14 the right direction, for our kids and grandkids.

15 We need to ensure that the final standards

16 include requirements for all methane-emitting sources in

17 the gas and oil industry. We need source operators to

18 use zero-emitting equipment or capture gas for sale or

19 beneficial use on-site, not flare captured gas, unless

20 it's entirely impossible to do so; not difficult or

21 expensive, but impossible. There is a difference. More

22 frequent leak inspections are also needed, at least four

23 per year, and possibly more for compressor stations. We

24 need to reduce our greenhouse gases, and the time to do

25 that is now. At best, this current proposal will keep
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1 emissions flat, and that's good; however, to see a

2 reduction, we need a little bit more change.

3 Colorado has some methane regulations in

4 place; however, in 2013 oil and natural gas operations,

5 unfortunately, wasted enough methane to meet the needs

6 of over 1 million cars, and I think that's significant.

7 Also, there was enough wasted that could have heated --

8 it could have went to heating and cooking to a town the

9 size of Colorado Springs. More than 3 million of us

10 here in Colorado have to breathe in areas where the

11 ozone levels are not deemed healthy. And I can tell

12 you, as I've mentioned with my asthma, on these days

13 when those levels are high, all of the medications,

14 trips to my doctor's office, still don't make me feel

15 good.

16 In 2012 a study found that emissions from

17 unconventional natural gas development caused health

18 risk for folks living and working near the well pads.

19 So I have to ask, Seriously, what are we doing? We need

20 clean air. So again I'm going to reference our children

21 and future generations and ask that we make some strong

22 changes.

23 I want to thank the EPA for proposing methane

24 standards for most of the same sources included in the

25 2012 standards for VOCs. It is promising that
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1 regulations have extended to sources that are the

2 transmission and storage segment. I am, however, asking

3 the EPA to quantify and monetize the public health

4 benefits that the rule will generate by also reducing

5 emissions of VOCs. I would like to encourage the EPA to

6 include, in its cost benefit analysis, the monetary

7 savings that would add up with the sale of conserved gas

8 in the transmission and storage segment. This is a

9 significant benefit for everyone.

10 I want to say --

11 MR. GREEN: I'm sorry. I'm going to have to

12 ask you to wrap it up.

13 MS. MILLER: Okay. I want to say that we just

14 all need clean air to breathe, and our kids and future

15 generations are depending on us. This is the time to

16 put the regulations in air -- in action so that we can

17 have clean air now and in the future.

18 Thank you so much for your time today.

19 MR. GREEN: Thank you. Thank you very much.

20 Our next speakers will be Catherine Sundvall

21 and Becky English.

22 Just as a quick reminder, a couple of things:

23 When you start out, if you could state your name and

24 spell it for the court reporter, that would be helpful.

25 And then, secondly, you're limited to five
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1 minutes. So the way this clock works is that when the

2 yellow light comes on, that means you have a minute

3 left; and when the red light comes on, that means your

4 time is up.

5 So thank you very much.

6 MS. SUNDVALL: My name is Catherine Sundvall.

7 It's C-a-t-h-e-r-i-n-e, S-u-n-d-v-a-l-l. My background

8 is, I'm a Colorado state-trained master gardener.

9 And I have gone to sites in Weld County, and

10 especially the town of Erie, where we have found that

11 there's neighborhoods near places that are fracking,

12 that we see damage in the plants and the landscape, in

13 the lawns, and especially in any areas where they

14 have -- they have landscape fabric that's put down

15 underneath the -- the rocks, rock mulch; in places

16 that's really common, like in between roads and -- and

17 the residential lawns or the residential landscaping.

18 And what we're noticing is, especially with the

19 landscape fabric, that the -- there's something coming

20 up from the ground.

21 And it just started when the fracking began,

22 so logic says that it's caused by methane or other kinds

23 of gases that are coming up out of the fracking zones.

24 And we have noticed that one -- especially one

25 location where we had irises that had been planted there
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1 and growing for 30 years and therefore the irises were a

2 very dense mat and created like a barrier between the

3 surface and the soil; that that would start to collect

4 whatever this is and kill the irises. And these irises

5 were growing for 30 years, so all of a sudden they died.

6 And the death -- we did some research with

7 CSU, and the death of these plants are very similar to

8 what happens when you have natural gas mains break and

9 it damages trees and it damages bushes and grasses and

10 surrounding the -- the main break. So, you know, using

11 deduction, we see that -- we're thinking that the

12 fracking is causing this landscape damage that we're

13 seeing. And it's concerning because this is surrounding

14 people's homes, this is surrounding playgrounds, this is

15 surrounding parks.

16 And the fracking isn't necessarily right next

17 door. There's some distance between where the fracking

18 has happened, and the wells, and where we see this type

19 of damage emerging.

20 So I ask the EPA to investigate this,

21 especially in the town of Erie, where we have fracking

22 pretty close to residences, to validate that the damage

23 we're seeing is caused by natural gas, and that the

24 natural gas is coming out of the ground in places that

25 we did not expect it to, and that the fracking isn't
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1 necessarily contained to where the oil and gas industry

2 thinks that the emissions are occurring.

3 So thank you very much.

4 MR. GREEN: Thank you.

5 MS. ENGLISH: Good afternoon. Am I audible?

6 MR. GREEN: Yes.

7 MS. ENGLISH: I'm Becky English; B-e-c-k-y,

8 E-n-g-l-i-s-h. And I just want to thank you, EPA, for

9 holding these hearings and for promulgating these rules.

10 It's a beautiful day in Denver, thanks to EPA.

11 And I say that because I grew up in these parts, and I

12 remember the horrible brown cloud of the late '60s,

13 early '70s. And then EPA came in and started, you know,

14 making sure that our smog problem continued to decrease

15 over time, even as our population continues to increase.

16 So thank you, EPA.

17 I'm here today as one of many representatives

18 of the Sierra Club. I'm the vice chair of our executive

19 committee here in Colorado, of the Rocky Mountain

20 Chapter. I am a member of the Rocky Mountain Chapter's

21 legislative committee, and I'm the clean energy

22 emissions specialist. So I'm certainly not an expert in

23 oil and gas matters, but I wanted to come and speak

24 today because this is obviously such an important

25 development.
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1 First, I want to thank EPA for promulgating

2 these rules, which represent a very important step

3 forward in reducing the accumulation of methane in our

4 atmosphere, which is obviously such a dangerous gas, as

5 you know, causing horrible short- and medium-term

6 temperature rise for our atmosphere. So I recognize

7 it's not easy, in the current political climate, to make

8 a great rule like this happen, so I want to thank you

9 for all that you've endured in this process and -- and

10 for making this happen.

11 Second, I want to urge you to use the methane

12 rules as a mere point of departure and strengthen them

13 considerably, over time, quite aggressively. Even

14 Colorado's rules are stronger. And, believe me, it's

15 not easy to oppose the oil and gas industry in our

16 state, because this industry, as you may have observed,

17 is sometimes capable of being pretty reckless. And so I

18 just want to urge you to stay the course, make these

19 rules stronger as time goes by.

20 Third, I want to point out that state-of-the21 art technology is available right now to -- to really

22 clean up the methane in our environment. We have a

23 wonderful company down in -- west of Colorado Springs,

24 Colorado, in a town called Woodland Park. The company

25 is called Sturman Industries, S-t-u-r-m-a-n.
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1 And Eddie Sturman has come up with a wonderful

2 engine that can do a lot of different things, but one of

3 the applications is that it can be located along the

4 seams of a gas pipeline; it can find the -- I mean, it

5 can be located right there where the pipe junctures are;

6 it can detect any fugitive leaks, and it can capture

7 them. And it can even -- you know, with auxiliary

8 equipment, it can deliver it to a nearby pipeline or

9 waiting trucks or whatever, waiting tanks.

10 This technology is here now. There's other

11 wonderful technology on the horizon and already

12 available. So I don't want you to ever fall for the

13 line that it's just too expensive or just too impossible

14 to create the technology that is necessary to do methane

15 capture.

16 By the way, this technology can be powered in

17 the field, without being hooked up to the grid, with

18 similar energy.

19 Fourth, I want to encourage you to enforce the

20 methane rules and all the Clean Power Plans with great

21 vigor. This Clean Power Plan and the methane recovery

22 has the potential to greatly accelerate the necessary

23 transition to 100 percent renewable energy, along with

24 serious measures for energy efficiency and conservation

25 that we can all do on a local basis, including major
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1 energy demand reduction that people and utilities can

2 all do and all sectors can participate in, including the

3 transportation sector, where I happen to be an

4 entrepreneur.

5 I'm delighted that you're doing this, and I

6 just want to urge you to keep going. Thank you so much.

7 MR. GREEN: Thank you. Ms. English, if we

8 could get a copy of your testimony, that would be great.

9 MS. ENGLISH: I'm going to have to send that

10 to you later. My computer broke today, and so I'm going

11 to have to print that out for you later.

12 MR. GREEN: Sounds good.

13 MS. ENGLISH: I can do it electronically too,

14 right?

15 MR. GREEN: Yes, thank you.

16 All right. Our next speakers are Kent

17 Abernethy and Reverend Jessica Abell. If you would

18 start out by stating and spelling your names, that

19 would be helpful. Thank you.

20 MR. ABERNETHY: My name is Kent Abernethy;

21 K-e-n-t, A-b-e-r-n-e-t-h-y. I'm a member of the Sierra

22 Club, Rocky Mountain Chapter.

23 I was born and raised in Denver, Colorado.

24 Excuse me. In the 1970s Denver had the worst air in the

25 country, second only to Los Angeles, California. My
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1 lungs were weak and I was thought to have a minor case

2 of asthma.

3 Well, thanks to the EPA and emission controls,

4 Denver's air is cleaner now than it was in the '70s.

5 And my lungs are good. Doesn't sound right -- like they

6 are right now, but my lungs are good and they're free of

7 asthma.

8 The EPA must have the strongest rules

9 possible, in order to safeguard the health of our

10 citizens, for our health and the air that we breathe,

11 and the health of our planet's climate.

12 Note that today the Pope was visiting, and

13 both the Pope and the President, both, spoke out that

14 the time to act on climate change is now. And it's an

15 absurd waste of our resources to burn off methane energy

16 in the pursuit of oil and natural gas.

17 I realize that the EPA's job has been made

18 more difficult when horizontal fracking was introduced

19 and was exempted from the Clean Water Act. Today the --

20 today, enforce the strongest rules possible for our air

21 in Colorado, the nation, and as the Pope and President

22 emphasized, the world community. Tomorrow, address

23 irreversible contamination of our water due to fracking.

24 Thank you.

25 MR. GREEN: Thank you.
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1 MS. ABELL: Jessica Abell, A-b-e-l-l. Good

2 afternoon. On behalf of Colorado and New Mexico

3 Interfaith Power & Light, I wanted to offer a huge thank

4 you to the EPA for these hearings. We applaud your

5 commitment to the public voice. My name is Jessica

6 Abell, and I serve as the project director for Colorado

7 Interfaith Power & Light.

8 The Interfaith Power & Light movement has a

9 presence in over 40 states and represents thousands of

10 congregations throughout America. These Muslim, Jewish,

11 Buddhist, B'hai, Unitarian, Pagan, Mormon, Christian,

12 and other various houses of worship are places where the

13 sacredness of Creation is a common part of separate

14 scripture and separate religious practice.

15 This morning Pope Francis was welcomed to our

16 nation's capital, and tomorrow he addresses Congress.

17 We know that a significant portion of what he will be

18 saying is a reflection of his recent encyclical, Laudato

19 Si: On Care of Our Common Home. Pope Francis provides

20 leadership for all people of faith in his call for us to

21 take seriously our role to care for Creation and to be

22 good stewards of the Earth. Now, I'm a Baptist

23 preacher, not a Catholic, but my own faith nods along

24 with this Pope more often than not.

25 There are many religious conservatives who
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1 argue that Papal teachings are not the proper place for

2 environmentalism; they wouldn't ask a spiritual leader

3 for policy advice. But we in the Interfaith Power &

4 Light movement believe that no justice-oriented policy

5 change has ever happened in America without the faith

6 voice present. Not a one, ever.

7 The abolition of slavery, the suffrage of

8 women, the Civil Rights movement were provided passion,

9 preaching, and a moral voice by people of faith. And

10 now our moral compass as Americans must be oriented to

11 include the protection and stewardship of Creation.

12 I am bringing with me today a letter from New

13 Mexico Interfaith Power & Light that is signed by faith

14 leaders there. More signatures and similar letters will

15 be generated throughout the region as we look toward the

16 upcoming climate talks in Paris. The regional IPL

17 communities here, Utah, Arizona, New Mexico, Colorado

18 and western Texas, have special care and concerns for

19 the tribal peoples living at our center. Many of us are

20 nurturing and seeking relationships within the Four

21 Corners, Navajoland, and other places contained within

22 what is called Indian Country.

23 In this letter from New Mexico faith leaders,

24 they commend the EPA for proposing increased oversight

25 and regulation of methane within Indian Country. These
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1 are important steps.

2 The letter says, "The new proposed methane

3 rules are a moral step in the right direction to address

4 the health implications of methane leaks with toxic

5 chemicals such as cancer causing benzene and smog

6 forming pollutants that trigger asthma. Curbing methane

7 pollution is critical because it is over 80 times more

8 potent than carbon dioxide in the first 20 years after

9 release and is responsible for one-quarter of human made

10 climate warming. If federal action by the BLM and EPA

11 are not taken, methane pollution from the oil and

12 natural gas industry is projected to increase around

13 25 percent over the next 10 years."

14 I have copies of this letter to leave with you

15 today.

16 Pope Francis reminds us that "Human-induced

17 climate change is a scientific reality. And its

18 effective control is a moral imperative for humanity."

19 The recent Islamic Declaration on Global Climate Change

20 calls followers of all faiths to specific actions of

21 protection and stewardship. This is the time to heal

22 many of the wounds we have wrought on our land.

23 We know that pollution is not discrete, that

24 it is not belched from industry to stay in just one

25 place. Whether it be an accidental spill into a river
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1 that then flows through various states and jurisdictions

2 or the dispersion of methane that these proposed rules

3 would curb, toxicity spreads.

4 An ethic of regionalism and a spirit of

5 cooperation must be on your minds as you consider oil

6 and mineral policies on tribal lands. There is no place

7 for disrespect or colonialism when we are discussing our

8 common human roles as environmental protectors.

9 Federal agencies like yours can nurture

10 healthy and regional local solutions. Perhaps people of

11 faith and leaders in the Interfaith Power & Light

12 movement can be of service to all parties as you engage

13 in the struggles of negotiating oil and mineral rights

14 and regulations with various voices, both sovereign and

15 corporate. However you move forward, know that we

16 support this action of curbing methane pollution.

17 Thank you for the opportunity to address you

18 today. You and yours will be in our prayers.

19 MR. GREEN: All right. Thank you both. And

20 if we can get copies of your testimony, that would be

21 helpful.

22 Okay. I don't have any more cards at this

23 time. Is there somebody in the audience that wants to

24 testify?

25 Come on up. If you would start out by stating
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1 your name and spelling it out, I would appreciate it.

2 MS. SEEMAN: Tell me if I'm too loud.

3 MR. GREEN: No, you're okay.

4 MS. SEEMAN: All righty. My name is Joan

5 Seeman. And I am here to --

6 MR. GREEN: Will you spell it out for us,

7 please.

8 MS. SEEMAN: It's J-o-a-n, Joan; and Seeman,

9 S-e-e-m-a-n.

10 MR. GREEN: Thanks.

11 MS. SEEMAN: I'm here today to thank EPA for

12 taking a very aggressive move in this country. I mean,

13 it's just -- it's thrilling. Thank you very much. That

14 is a very lengthy document that was produced. There

15 were a lot of issues in the document.

16 But first let me say that you have absolutely

17 embarked on one of the most serious issues in the

18 country and the world. Climate change is undeniably a

19 problem, with devastating impacts. Climate change has

20 harmful public health impacts. The Clean Power Plan is

21 an undeniable economic opportunity to move forward;

22 clean energy, creating jobs and economic growth.

23 And climate change is also a undeniable human

24 rights issue. I helped a community many years ago move

25 away from the Cherokee Power Plant in Denver, Colorado.
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1 They literally were under the emissions and the down2 draft emissions and upset conditions. And it was legal.

3 It was legal. And many people were impacted, and they

4 had to seek legal advice to get out of there.

5 And while at this point we are looking at

6 generating standards that are good for tall stacks,

7 disbursement, easy disbursement, et cetera, it is still

8 important that we have to look at the issue called

9 location. Most of the general public believes that the

10 EPA sets standards based on location. We here in

11 Colorado have learned, and I've certainly learned

12 throughout the years, location is not what these

13 standards are all about. So many that are impacted

14 locally, with generators and emission points that are in

15 their backyard, are concerned.

16 But generally speaking, as we look at what the

17 EPA has done with the Clean Power Plan, they definitely

18 have moved ahead to help us undo decades of dirty power

19 plants. Air pollution from these power plants have

20 caused life-threatening illnesses, child asthma, and

21 it's cost billions of dollars. And we all pay the price

22 for this pollution. And now as the President has moved

23 forward and the EPA has moved on these proposals, the

24 public is definitely grateful for curbing dangerous

25 carbon pollution for the first time. And so the Clean
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1 Power Plan gives us that opportunity to move forward and

2 begin to address how dangerous these power plants are.

3 One issue, though, that has come to my

4 attention, and it's a local issue, and I really didn't

5 know how to begin to help the public understand, that

6 the EPA has an hierarchy of waste management. And in

7 this document that's been produced, there are folks that

8 were very concerned about EPA's -- that they don't call

9 it an exemption; it is an incentive that the public is

10 very concerned about.

11 I've been called about a zoo here in Denver

12 that has been funded by Western Energy Alliance, and

13 they wanted to partner and had partnered with the zoo to

14 bring up a waste energy facility. There's a big debate.

15 This is gasification. This is pyrolysis. This is

16 plasma gasification. This is not an incinerator. We

17 have a war going on in Colorado locally, with the EPA

18 defining this system as an incinerator. And what we're

19 learning is, it is gasification incineration; it is the

20 production of syngas, a manufacturing of syngas, in the

21 zoo, in City Park, in the neighborhood.

22 And it was difficult to help them understand,

23 because they were concerned about the EPA and concerned

24 that the location seemed to be a problem. And, you

25 know, again, they don't understand. Again, as I
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1 emphasized at the beginning, EPA role is not to prevent

2 based on location.

3 And so --

4 MR. GREEN: I'm sorry, I have to ask you to

5 close.

6 MS. SEEMAN: I will close. Sorry about that.

7 So dilution is not the solution to pollution,

8 and we have a problem here in Denver. And the hierarchy

9 of EPA's waste management is helping to at least move

10 that along, which is absolutely fabulous.

11 And in the end, I do hope that you'll look

12 closely at the document that incentivizes bulk garbage

13 burning, because we're seeing that we may be heading

14 back to a point where we have incinerators in our

15 backyard, and that's what appears here.

16 So thank you again. And the community really

17 does appreciate what the EPA's doing. And thank you.

18 MR. GREEN: Thank you very much. And if

19 you'll leave us a copy of your testimony, we would

20 appreciate it.

21 MS. SEEMAN: I can send it.

22 MR. GREEN: Thank you. Is there anyone else

23 that would like to testify?

24 All right. We're going to keep the hearing

25 open. We've had folks trickling in all afternoon, so
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1 we'll just stay in an open status until the next person

2 shows up.

3 Did you want to testify?

4 MS. SWAIN: I was scheduled at 4:15, so I

5 didn't want to --

6 MR. GREEN: Come on up.

7 MS. SWAIN: -- jump the gun.

8 MR. GREEN: Nope, that's fine.

9 MS. SWAIN: Where do I go?

10 MR. GREEN: Have a seat. And if you can start

11 out by stating your name and spelling it out for us,

12 that would be great.

13 MS. SWAIN: I'm Lauren Swain. I live in north

14 Denver, just about five miles northwest of here,

15 something like that. And --

16 MR. GREEN: Please, if you could, spell out

17 your name for us.

18 MS. SWAIN: I'm sorry. Lauren Swain; Swain,

19 S-w-a-i-n.

20 THE REPORTER: Spell your first name.

21 MS. SWAIN: L-a-u-r-e-n; S-, as in Sam,

22 w-a-i-n, as in Nancy.

23 MR. GREEN: All right. Thank you.

24 MS. SWAIN: Pardon me. I'm here to say that

25 while we're thankful for the attention that is being
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1 given to methane pollution and the climate hazard that

2 it presents, we always have to acknowledge that new

3 regulations are not to be celebrated. When new

4 regulations are sought, it is automatically an admission

5 of the failure of the previous regulations to adequately

6 protect our environment, our climate, and/or human

7 health. And we've known about these problems for a long

8 time.

9 I'm here to say that Colorado's rules and

10 regulations are not adequate. We still have people's

11 neighborhoods threatened with toxic emissions; with 24/7

12 noise with truck traffic; with the threats to their

13 water supply from drilling, well bores, and spills; in

14 addition to potential for thermogenic contamination from

15 the frack zones.

16 That's the least of our worries because we

17 have routine spills at sites across the state and

18 sometimes blowout with massive amounts of toxic water

19 spreading over the landscape. And we don't want these

20 in our neighborhoods. And these rules will not prevent

21 people from being subject to these hazards in their

22 neighborhoods, and they are not enough.

23 So in addition, I'm concerned that the capture

24 of methane may demand the construction of more pipe25 lines. Pipelines leak. Pipelines lead to explosions.
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1 Pipelines are also a problem. They are not the answer

2 if we're going to capture methane.

3 The management of methane is not an easy

4 thing. And I appreciate you taking on the task with

5 these rules that are projected to reduce methane by

6 something like 25 to 30 percent over the next few years.

7 We're lucky, on a good day, if the enforcement is

8 adequate. If we're not relying on an industry

9 self-reporting, on a good day we'll get cuts like that,

10 25 or 30 percent.

11 But there are no plans to cut the number of

12 wells being drilled, so there's nothing to prevent

13 25 and 30 percent more wells being drilled very quickly

14 and making up, essentially -- you know, not right on the

15 money with the numbers, but essentially completely

16 erasing all the gains that these new rules present; you

17 know, would present ideally.

18 And, of course, even with our weak rules that

19 are not protecting people here in Colorado, at least

20 they were kind enough to apply them to existing wells.

21 And we're asking the EPA for the same kindness.

22 And I don't think "kindness" is the right

23 word. It is not a favor to provide good rules, that

24 protect people, to the American public. It is the

25 responsibility of our government to do that; not to
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1 listen to industry, but to listen to us and protect our

2 health from the benzene, hydrogen sulfide, and

3 formaldehyde emissions that have been detected and

4 measured, right under people's noses, at four to eight

5 times what is a safe level set by the EPA.

6 People are breathing in toxins that the EPA

7 says they should not breathe, and that's not acceptable.

8 And if you can't -- if our current laws are not

9 protecting us from that, how can we trust that this law

10 will protect our climate? We need trust. We need

11 aggressive laws. These are not problems that go away

12 because of our good intentions. These are not problems

13 that go away because our opponents are intimidating us

14 or that we have to win the election. These are problems

15 of real people on our only planet, our only home.

16 And I hope these rules make a difference, and

17 I hope they're applied across the board. And I'm quite

18 sure that it won't be enough difference until our

19 neighborhoods are protected from toxin emissions, ozone

20 pollution, the threat of spills, and global warming

21 itself that is sure to result from weak rules and weak

22 enforcement.

23 And I know that you can do better, and I know

24 that we need to do better as soon as possible, meaning

25 we don't wait. We need clean air, clean water, and we
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1 need it now.

2 Thank you.

3 MR. GREEN: Thank you very much. If we can

4 get a copy of your testimony, I would appreciate it.

5 Come on up. Do we have anybody else that

6 wants to testify at this time as well? Come on, if

7 you're ready. No?

8 All right. If you would start out by stating

9 your name and spelling it out for us, I'd appreciate it.

10 MR. FIELD: My name is Robert Alexander Field.

11 Field is spelled F-, Freddy, i-e-l-d. Sorry, ready?

12 MR. GREEN: What was the last name again?

13 MR. FIELD: Oh, Field.

14 MR. GREEN: Field? Okay. Thank you. Yep, go

15 ahead.

16 MR. FIELD: So my name is Dr. Robert Alexander

17 Field. I've been measuring ambient levels of methane

18 and VOCs since 1989 for the UK government, European

19 Commission, and a variety of U.S. state and federal

20 agencies.

21 MR. GREEN: Could I get you to use the

22 microphone, so everyone can hear you.

23 MR. FIELD: Should I start again? Is that

24 better?

25 MR. GREEN: No, that's okay.
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1 MR. FIELD: Take two. My name is Dr. Robert

2 Alexander Field. I've been measuring ambient levels of

3 methane and VOCs since 1989 for the UK government,

4 European Commission, and a variety of U.S. state and

5 federal agencies. I'm the author of a number of

6 publications, including most recently in the "Journal of

7 Atmospheric Chemistry and Physics." This paper directly

8 relates to oil and gas emissions with wintertime ozone

9 in Wyoming.

10 Since 2011 a combination of facts have led to

11 air quality improvements in the Upper Green River Basin

12 in Wyoming. These factors include application of LDAR

13 program by developers, reduced activity, meteorology,

14 and state-driven regulation related to nonattainment

15 designation. Most recently my research is based upon

16 downwind plume quantification of methane and VOC using

17 EPA Method OTM 33A. It is evident that some well pads

18 have higher leakage rates than others.

19 Given my personal experience of breathing VOC

20 levels far above normal ambient concentrations, I

21 strongly support the proposed NSPS rules for methane and

22 VOC. This is important for climate change, ground-level

23 ozone, and to human health. When oil and gas operations

24 are efficient, there are clear benefits to everyone; the

25 public, industry, and government.
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1 Thank you.

2 MR. GREEN: I have one question for you before

3 you leave. You say some oil pads leak more than others.

4 Do you see any way to predict which ones will leak and

5 which ones won't?

6 MR. FIELD: We're still working on that, so I

7 wouldn't -- I would refer you to the academic papers

8 currently in the literature, where in the basins we see

9 leakage rates, in some basins, of 1 percent; in other

10 basins, maybe 6 percent.

11 In terms of the fine detail, that's the

12 research question of the moment: Is it related to

13 production in one area at a different time for gas? Is

14 it related to maintenance programs? What are the

15 driving factors of OCS that's ongoing?

16 MR. GREEN: All right. Thank you very much.

17 If we can get a copy of your document, that would be

18 helpful.

19 All right. Do we have anybody else that wants

20 to testify? All right. Come on up.

21 Five minutes? All right.

22 Anybody else? Well, we'll take a five-minute

23 break, then. Thanks very much.

24 (Recess taken from 4:17 p.m. to 4:22 p.m.)

25 MR. GREEN: All right. I think we're ready.
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1 Come on up. All right. Wherever you're ready.

2 MR. HATFIELD: This is on?

3 MR. GREEN: Yeah, state your name and spell it

4 out for us, please.

5 MR. HATFIELD: Can you hear me now? My name

6 is Scott Hatfield, H-a-t-f-i-e-l-d.

7 MR. GREEN: We're having trouble hearing.

8 MR. HATFIELD: Hi, my name's Scott Hatfield,

9 H-a-t-f-i-e-l-d, from Boulder, Colorado.

10 I think the time to look at methane releases

11 is long overdue. I certainly welcome steps in this

12 direction. The effects on climate, ozone, public

13 health, hazardous releases of carcinogens and VOCs is

14 widely known and documented. Low estimates were,

15 23 times more potent a greenhouse gas as carbon dioxide;

16 other studies have been coming up at 64 times. It's

17 pretty critical. And I hear today 80, but at any rate

18 at least 23 times, 80 times as potent a greenhouse gas.

19 This is going to be a critical step in trying to reach

20 the goals of the Climate Action Plan.

21 Seems, though, that focusing on new sources is

22 just a small step in the right direction, and the time23 table proposed is way too far in the future to be able

24 to have significant impacts on trying to reach the

25 Climate Action Plan goals of limiting global temperature
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1 increases to 1-1/2 to 2 degrees Celsius. Regs need to

2 be developed for all major methane releases. It's good

3 to see landfills addressed. Much can be done in

4 agriculture and concentrated animal feed lot operations,

5 that was done in terms of how cows are fed, to

6 drastically reduce a lot of methane releases in their

7 farts.

8 But what's especially needed is for different

9 to -- or for a possibly different set of regs to oversee

10 existing oil and gas operations, not just ones that are

11 in ozone nonattainment areas. This has a huge climate

12 impact, and it's also a huge public health threat.

13 People are getting sick and dying all over the state

14 here and in Pennsylvania and other places where the

15 fracking movement is widespread.

16 Existing oil and gas operations outside of

17 limited nonattainment areas aren't addressed. This is

18 just a drop in the bucket. The fugitive emissions have

19 been vastly underestimated, and they need to adequately

20 represent greenhouse gas -- greenhouse gas contribution,

21 beyond just the fuel that's exhausted.

22 It seems like, you know, just limiting these

23 methane fugitive release regs to new sources in ten

24 years, that are only existing in nonattainment, might be

25 in compliance with the oil and gas industry's climate
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1 action plan of 6 to 8 degrees Celsius average, or more.

2 They don't seem bothered by it. And begs the question

3 if oil and gas influence is in the EPA public health

4 report on fracking water.

5 And here in Denver, much of those in

6 nonattainment comes from Weld County diesel generators,

7 not specifically fugitive methane releases are affecting

8 our ozone nonattainment. So the effects go beyond the

9 immediate area.

10 Also, quickly here, just to talk about these

11 federal regs being based on the Colorado regs. That's

12 not very good. Colorado does have some fugitive methane

13 regs, but they're irrelevant. At the time of the ballot

14 initiative which I worked on, we had 13 oil and gas

15 inspectors statewide. It takes four years for an

16 inspector to actually get to an oil and gas site.

17 We have a campaign called Operator Oversight

18 and it is drastically limited in scope. The regs called

19 into question Operator Oversight here as well as in the

20 EPA report on public health hazards of fracking.

21 Thank you.

22 MR. GREEN: Thank you very much, Mr. Hatfield.

23 Do we have anyone else? Come on up.

24 MR. ROMERO: Hello. My name is Lewis Romero.

25 Lewis, L-e-w-i-s; Romero, R-o-m-e-r-o. I have testimony
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1 today. I had not even planned on speaking today at all,

2 except I'm very happy that so many people are involved

3 in --

4 MR. GREEN: Could you use the microphone,

5 please?

6 MR. ROMERO: I'm very glad that so many people

7 are involved in caring for our environment. I came up

8 here, actually, to talk a little bit about my life.

9 When I went to China, I went to Beijing, it was

10 dangerous to walk outside. That's how bad the air was.

11 It's dangerous to drink the water. That's how bad it

12 is. It's dangerous to go swimming. That's how bad it

13 is. It's dangerous to do anything, you know, that's

14 related to open sewage and situations that we would

15 consider, in this country, completely horrid.

16 But at the same time, I also recognize that

17 Colorado's the leading oil and gas producer in the

18 Western states, but it also has to be tempered with the

19 ability for us to control what's going on. I can't

20 imagine what the world -- what this country would look

21 like if we were taking the China model, which is

22 basically, the EPA is whatever you can get away with.

23 It's very disheartening to see great,

24 beautiful landscapes being completely trashed by the

25 environment -- or the environment being trashed by
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1 little to no regulations. So I'm really appreciative

2 that we are in a situation in this country where we have

3 a voice, we have the ability, we have the -- we have the

4 department that actually can make a difference. And I'm

5 real appreciative of that.

6 So again, it's very -- I'm honored to be here,

7 because it is such an important endeavor, and I think

8 that we are blazing the trail here in the oil and gas

9 industry for these states in moving forward.

10 The altitude here is a very important decision

11 in, you know, controlling oil and gas emissions, because

12 the altitude here has a tendency to exacerbate the

13 problem. CO2; people with asthma, which is a health

14 issue for people in general; and the reduced oxygen

15 certainly doesn't promulgate well with reducing the

16 already thin oxygen that we have by all these other

17 pollutants.

18 Things as simple as not allowing gas mopeds in

19 the major cities is a great way to reduce the problems

20 that I see in China or in Monjo or in the -- even in the

21 inner parts of the country in China that are completely

22 trashed because of the lack of regulations.

23 So I'm very happy that this is going on here

24 and in Washington and in Pennsylvania, and I hope that

25 good things come out of this.
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1 And thank you very much.

2 MR. GREEN: Thank you, Mr. Romero.

3 Do we have anyone else? All right. Well,

4 we're open until 8:00 o'clock, so we'll stand by in case

5 anyone else shows up.

6 (Pause in the proceedings.)

7 MR. GREEN: All right. I think we have

8 another speaker. Come on up. Do we have anyone else?

9 All right. Just a couple ground rules real

10 quickly. When you start your testimony, if you could

11 start out by stating your name and then spelling it out

12 for the court reporter, that would be helpful.

13 And then we limit testimony to five minutes,

14 so we use this timing light here. When a yellow light

15 comes on, that means you have one minute left; when the

16 red light comes on, that means your five minutes are up.

17 So the floor is yours. Thank you.

18 MR. NEUMAN-LEE: Hi. I'm Jeff Neuman-Lee.

19 That is N-e-u-m-a-n, hyphen, L-e-e. Capital L-e-e,

20 sorry. I'm from Denver. And I'm here to testify that

21 the rules should be as stringent as possible; that they

22 don't cover existing well sites is not helpful, however.

23 Going forward, they're nice, but we are way behind.

24 I think you can look at the West Coast; you

25 can look at the fact that we had a wet -- the wettest
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1 May in the 48 states; heavy rain, terrible dryness; and

2 this is from climate change. And it's right here, right

3 now.

4 There's a great little movie about some guy

5 whose house was down the hill. He didn't hear the thing

6 to get heck out of town. So when he finally left town,

7 he was driving through his town on fire. And Governor

8 Brown from California says that's -- that's where we're

9 at now. You know, my kids, they're in their 20s, early

10 30s. Their world is different right now, it's different

11 because of climate change. In 30 years it's going to be

12 that much more different.

13 Your problem is that you have to deal with an

14 applicable world. Our politics do not match our climate

15 situation. Our politics is -- is like a straightjacket,

16 and the house is burning down and we can't get out of

17 it. It takes courage to lead, and leadership means you

18 go first. So I hope that you have as stringent rules as

19 you possibly can, to hang on to all of the methane that

20 you possibly can.

21 Thank you.

22 MR. GREEN: Thank you very much,

23 Mr. Neuman-Lee.

24 Do we have anybody else that wants to testify

25 at this time? All right. I think what I'm going to do
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1 is put the hearing in recess for 15 minutes. We'll

2 resume with a new panel at 5:10. Thank you.

3 (Recess taken from 4:52 p.m. to 5:19 p.m.)

4 MR. COZZIE: Good evening. My name is David

5 Cozzie, and I am the chair of this evening's public

6 hearing. Thank you for coming this evening.

7 Joining me on the panel today are Chris

8 Stoneman from the EPA's Office of Air Quality Planning

9 and Standards, Alexis McKittrick from EPA's Office of

10 Atmospheric Programs, and Carl Daly from the regional

11 office here in Region 8.

12 We are here today to hear your comments on

13 EPA's proposed rules relating to the oil and natural gas

14 sector. The specific rules are:

15 Oil and Natural Gas Emissions Sector:

16 Emissions Standards for New and Modified Sources;

17 Source Determination for Certain Emission

18 Units in the Oil and Natural Gas Sector; and

19 Review of New Sources and Modifications in

20 Indian Country: Federal Implementation Plan for

21 Managing Air Emissions from True Minor Sources Engaged

22 in Oil and Natural Gas Production in Indian Country.

23 EPA's Administrator signed the proposed rules

24 on August 18th, 2015.

25 The proposed New Source Performance Standards
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1 will establish methane and VOC standards for

2 hydraulically fractured wells and require owners and

3 operators to find and repair leaks. The proposed rule

4 also extends emission reduction requirements further

5 downstream, covering equipment in the natural gas

6 transmission and storage segments in the industry that

7 was not regulated in the Agency's 2012 rules.

8 The proposed Source Determination Rule will

9 clarify the EPA's air permitting rules as they apply to

10 the oil and natural gas industry.

11 We are also taking comment on the proposed

12 federal implementation plan to implement the Federal

13 Minor New Source Review Program in Indian Country for

14 oil and natural gas production. That plan, known as the

15 FIP, will be used instead of site-specific minor New

16 Source Review preconstruction permits in Indian Country.

17 It would incorporate emissions limits and other

18 requirements from six EPA emissions standards, including

19 the 2015 proposed updates to the New Performance -- New

20 Source Performance Standards on which we are taking

21 comment today.

22 If you would like more details on the proposed

23 rules, there are fact sheets available at the

24 registration desk.

25 Before we get started, I'd like to go through
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1 a few housekeeping items and ground rules that will help

2 make today's hearing run smoothly.

3 First, please be sure you've checked in at the

4 registration desk, even if you are not planning to speak

5 today. And if you've signed up to speak online or by

6 phone but haven't told us you're here, please step out

7 to the registration desk and let the EPA staff know that

8 you've arrived.

9 I will call speakers up in pairs. When your

10 name is called, please come to the speakers' table at

11 the front of the room.

12 When I call on you to speak, please state your

13 name and spell it for the court reporter. Your comments

14 will be transcribed and included in the record of

15 comments on the proposed rule.

16 It is important that you tell us which rule or

17 rules you are speaking about.

18 Each speaker will have five minutes to give

19 comments. We have a timer light to help you know how

20 much time you have left to speak.

21 When the light turns from green to yellow,

22 that means you have one minute remaining; when it turns

23 red, that's the signal that you're at five minutes and

24 your time is up.

25 When you're finished speaking, please remain
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1 at the table till the person next to you has completed

2 his or her testimony.

3 We are here to listen to you today; however, a

4 panel member may ask questions to clarify your comments.

5 I will then call the next pair of speakers and

6 so on.

7 If you have brought a written copy of your

8 testimony, please give that to the staff at the

9 registration desk before you leave today. We will put

10 any written comments submitted today in the official

11 docket for the proposed rule.

12 We also have comment cards available at the

13 registration desk, if you would like to submit

14 additional written comments today.

15 If you want to comment in writing later, stop

16 by the materials table near the registration desk and

17 pick up a copy of instructions for submitting written

18 comments. Comments must be received by November 17,

19 2015.

20 Let me assure you that the EPA gives just as

21 much consideration to comments received in -- we receive

22 in writing as we do to comments we receive at public

23 hearings like this one.

24 So if you have more comments that you

25 would like to provide the EPA, please submit them by the
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1 comment period deadline. Your comments will be

2 reviewed.

3 If you have any questions during the day,

4 please see the staff at the registration desk, and

5 someone will assist you.

6 Thank you again for taking the time to share

7 your thoughts, comments on the EPA's proposal. Let's

8 get started.

9 At this time I'd like to call forward Rosemary

10 Lytle and Elizabeth Hudetz, Hudetz (pronouncing).

11 MS. HUDETZ: Hudetz.

12 MR. COZZIE: If you'd like to start.

13 MS. LYTLE: Yes, good afternoon. I'm Rosemary

14 Lytle. I'm the president of the NAACP Colorado,

15 Montana, Wyoming State Conference. Our state conference

16 speaks for our national organization and its

17 game-changer initiative and helps to coordinate the

18 activities of our 23 chartered units in these three

19 states. I'd like to thank the Environmental Protection

20 Agency and the Obama Administration for the opportunity

21 to offer these comments today.

22 Coloradans have had a front-row seat to the

23 devastating impact of methane pollution and its impact

24 on public health in our communities. In over 3 million

25 places where we live, 3 million of us live in places
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1 where ozone levels exceed national clean air standards.

2 And the NAACP believes that this is entirely

3 unacceptable.

4 Methane is a highly potent greenhouse gas and

5 is a major contributor to climate change. Nationally

6 the oil and gas industry is the largest industrial

7 source of methane pollution, emitting over 7.3 million

8 metric tons of methane in 2013 alone, equivalent to CO2

9 emissions from over 160 coal-burning power plants. That

10 means that not only are methane and other emissions from

11 oil and gas operations polluting our air, they are acute

12 contributors to the costly and harmful climate change

13 we're seeing today.

14 We know that, today in Washington, D.C., Pope

15 Francis talked about climate change and asked us not to

16 leave the duty of dealing with climate change to the

17 next generation. The NAACP asks the same of you.

18 Methane and carbon dioxide, the number-one and

19 the number-two drivers of climate change, are impacting

20 low-income communities of color and other

21 disenfranchised communities that are very often, even

22 right here in Colorado, closest to the industrial

23 sources of air pollution, at a far greater rate than any

24 other communities.

25 Not only this, our communities are hit the
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1 hardest by climate change and climate change-caused

2 disasters. We can't continue to afford to rebuild our

3 homes after disasters like fires and floods caused by

4 climate change, or pay for a heat bill spike during a

5 polar vortex.

6 It's not just climate that's being affected,

7 it's our very health and well-being. We know that

8 methane pollution specifically contributes to the

9 formation of smog, which causes asthma attacks,

10 respiratory problems, and permanent lung damage.

11 And we also know that African American

12 children specifically have an 80 percent higher rate of

13 asthma and nearly three times as likely a chance to die

14 from asthma complications as their peers who are white.

15 And the NAACP believes that this is a disgrace.

16 These regulations proposed by EPA can only be

17 the beginning of the work that we must do to combat

18 climate change, protect our communities, and safeguard

19 true public health. Colorado has always been a leader

20 in the fight against climate change, and even when

21 industries like the oil and gas industries oppose

22 regulation, we know that we continue because we must.

23 We know that we must continue because of the

24 health of our communities, and the NAACP encourages the

25 EPA to finalize strong rules that will be the first step
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1 in fixing our climate and reducing the significant

2 impact of methane and other toxic pollutants on our

3 health.

4 Thank you so much for the chance for the NAACP

5 to offer these comments.

6 MR. COZZIE: Thank you, Rosemary. Any

7 clarification questions from the panel? All right.

8 If you want to go ahead, Ms. Hudetz.

9 MS. HUDETZ: Okay. It's going to take me five

10 minutes just to put this thing on. Is that okay? Hi.

11 Can you hear me?

12 MR. COZZIE: Maybe if you could just hold the

13 mic so the court reporter can hear.

14 MS. HUDETZ: Hi. I'm Elizabeth Hudetz. I'm a

15 volunteer with the group Citizens for a Healthy Fort

16 Collins. And, yes, thank you for taking our comments

17 and listening to what the people living here have to

18 say.

19 Fort Collins was one of the first cities in

20 Colorado to pass a five-year moratorium on fracking, in

21 2013, to study its effects on human health, safety, and

22 property values. We did this through the process of

23 petition and vote and educated enough of our population

24 to win by a 60-40 margin. Oil and gas sued us. Our own

25 Governor Hickenlooper, a former oil and gas man,
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1 threatened to sue the People of Colorado, i.e., the

2 State of Colorado would sue the People of Colorado, to

3 protect the oil and gas industry.

4 I remember the city council meeting when the

5 spokesperson for oil and gas proudly presented a

6 document signed by numerous companies that backed

7 fracking. Our council checked into it and discovered

8 that most of the companies were unaware that that was

9 what they were signing and did not back fracking.

10 Oil and gas talks about the economy and how we

11 need their jobs, but theirs are the most dangerous jobs

12 on the planet. When we switch to a green energy source,

13 which we will have to eventually, there will be jobs,

14 and they won't be the most dangerous jobs on the planet.

15 In the documentary "Merchants of Doubt," Naomi

16 Oreskes, professor of history and science studies at

17 San Diego U, writes that the oil and gas industry used

18 the same ad agency R.J. Reynolds used in the late '80s

19 to cast doubt on the evidence showing that cigarettes

20 caused lung cancer. Apparently doubt is all it takes to

21 undo all the scientific evidence showing otherwise.

22 They don't even have to prove it, just plant that seed

23 of doubt.

24 The doubt created by these agencies has caused

25 us to delay doing anything to curb or halt global
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1 warming, and now global warming is here. The tipping

2 point has occurred. All we can do now is slow it down.

3 Heat, plants dying, fires, torrential downpours causing

4 flooding. The fire season has increased 78 days a year

5 now, over what it was previously; 100-year floods are

6 occurring every year now.

7 Fracking is the most destructive business

8 practice in the world today. Numerous accidents, on the

9 part of oil and gas, from spills into our oceans, on our

10 land, to explosions, killing wildlife, compromises the

11 health of every living creature on our plant, leaving

12 earthquakes and flammable water in its wake. Then

13 there's the venting of toxins that are just part of the

14 process. And we let them do this.

15 In Greeley on April 16th of this year, a

16 number of fracking tanks exploded, shooting up to

17 90 feet in the air. The industry came and claimed to

18 have it under control. Almost immediately afterwards,

19 another tank of fracking chemicals exploded and blew up

20 into the air, proving their words to be false. And with

21 less than 15 inspectors in 2010, for 43,000-plus wells,

22 it's impossible to see if they are complying.

23 The cycle of drought; fires; torrential

24 downpours of rain; hundred-year floods, yes, every year

25 now -- as I speak, in the Pacific Northwest one of the
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1 wettest places in our country, is battling an inferno; a

2 hell storm, as it's been called by those that are

3 fighting it.

4 In the Pope's encyclical, he reminds us: Our

5 lives are intimately connected with those of every other

6 species and we cannot live without them. The Earth's

7 wealth of biodiversity delivers priceless ecosystem

8 services. Birds, bees, and even beetles, flies, and

9 ants pollinate our crops. It's up to us and generations

10 to come to stop what is known as the sixth mass

11 extinction, which threatens to eliminate 20 to

12 50 percent of all living species on Earth within this

13 century.

14 The Pope reiterates the broad scientific

15 consensus that human actions are its primary cause. We

16 share this planet, our only home. We are organisms; the

17 Earth, our host. What kind of organism kills its host?

18 Because that's exactly what we are doing. And we seem

19 to shrug it off as just another bothersome irritation.

20 Until it's on our doorstep, it's easy to not take it too

21 seriously.

22 The EPA was created to protect us and the

23 environment from exactly the things oil and gas has done

24 and is doing. We have a right to clean air and water, a

25 safe home. No one should be allowed to come onto our
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1 property and into our homes, denying these rights. Any

2 group of people from another country doing this would be

3 considered terrorists, but oil and gas can do this and

4 sue us if we try to stop them.

5 They say we're taking away their right to make

6 money. But what about our right to health and happiness

7 guaranteed by our U.S. Constitution? They have access

8 to our legal system, most of our large institutions, and

9 our government; rewriting laws, giving themselves a free

10 pass on meeting the standards of clean air, clean water,

11 and drinking water.

12 The Halliburton Loophole was inserted inside

13 another bill --

14 MR. COZZIE: Please wind up.

15 MS. HUDETZ: Okay, I'm almost done. -- to

16 sneak this through our legal system, and gaining any

17 environmental protection, and their practices are the

18 most destructive to life on our planet. Oil and gas can

19 pretend they're not responsible, but, unlike the

20 industry, the scientific facts don't lie.

21 Until regulatory agencies communicate to

22 industry that the risks don't outweigh the benefits of

23 this technology, alternatives won't be implemented with

24 the sense of urgency needed to effect the changes

25 necessary to drive a new clean air economy.
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1 The question now is whether or not we will let

2 a small group of people destroy our planet in the name

3 of monetary profit, their monetary profit at our

4 expense. It's time for the Environmental Protection

5 Agency to stop looking the other way and protect us.

6 Thank you.

7 MR. COZZIE: Thank you very much. Does anyone

8 have any clarifying questions? Thank you very much.

9 I don't have any speakers at the moment. Is

10 there anyone in the audience that would like to speak?

11 All right. I have no more speakers on the

12 list, so I think what I'll do is I'm going to leave the

13 hearing open and we'll adjourn the second hearing until,

14 hopefully, the next speaker.

15 (Recess taken from 5:38 p.m. to 5:59 p.m.)

16 MR. COZZIE: Good evening. We're going to

17 reconvene the panel here. We have a speaker. I call

18 forward Chris Applegate.

19 MR. APPLEGATE: Just over here?

20 MR. COZZIE: Right over there.

21 MR. APPLEGATE: All right.

22 MR. COZZIE: You have five minutes on the

23 timer.

24 MR. APPLEGATE: Yes.

25 MR. COZZIE: If you'd just say your name and
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1 spell your name for the court reporter.

2 MR. APPLEGATE: Okay, great. It's Chris

3 Applegate; C-h-r-i-s, A-p-p-l-e-g-a-t-e; Denver,

4 Colorado.

5 MR. COZZIE: Could you use your microphone as

6 well.

7 MR. APPLEGATE: Oh, yeah, I can do that.

8 Better? All right.

9 "Climate change is a problem that can no

10 longer be left to future generations," His Holiness Pope

11 Francis said earlier today at the White House, side by

12 side with President Obama. I stand with Pope Francis

13 today in tackling a problem facing not only the United

14 States but the world. The EPA's commonsense rule to

15 address methane and VOC emissions from new sources is a

16 critical step in combating climate disruption and in

17 reducing the air pollution that harms public health.

18 As an oil and gas employee here in Colorado,

19 the methane emission rules implemented here at the state

20 level was created together with industry, government,

21 and the public to make our communities safer and to

22 reduce greenhouse gas emissions. The industry I work

23 for did not leave the state, drilling has not stalled

24 due to the new rules, nor have I been a witness to any

25 complaints from any colleagues I work with. I expect
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1 that this rule, once implemented, will only have one

2 effect, and one effect only, and that is cleaner air for

3 the community in which we operate.

4 Last year when Colorado came out with its own

5 rules, Anadarko, Encana, and Noble Energy all were in

6 favor of the proposed rules. Curtis Reuter of Noble

7 Energy said, "We support the Air Division's proposed

8 rules because it's the right thing to do for the

9 environment, for public health and our company."

10 The new federal EPA methane and VOC emission

11 rules falls in line with our local rules to protect the

12 environment and public health, although it does not take

13 into account previously drilled wells that are leaking

14 methane into our communities. The proposed rules should

15 extend to older wells. That may be a deviation away

16 from my colleagues, but I do believe that people I work

17 with are genuine in their efforts to make sure where we

18 operate is safe for our workers and the communities we

19 are operating in. Extending the rule to include

20 previously drilled wells would help reduce current

21 pollution in our oil and gas drilling communities.

22 The industry I work for is not perfect and

23 never will be. That is why a clean energy economy is

24 growing, and fast, so that we can truly embrace energy

25 independence and a green-collar economy.
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1 Currently more than 3 million Coloradans live

2 in areas where ozone levels exceed national clean air

3 standards. There is no doubt that additional greenhouse

4 gas emissions from oil and gas operations contribute to

5 this, enormously, with tens of thousands of wells

6 existing. We have to be sure to extend this rule for

7 current active wells.

8 I love getting outdoors, and I visibly see

9 climate disruption right here in my own backyard here in

10 Colorado. I'm excited about the current energy

11 transition, and I look forward to the transition of jobs

12 into the new clean energy sector in the years to come,

13 but at this current time we need to ensure that current

14 energy sources we use are done in the safest way

15 possible.

16 I look forward to seeing this rule implemented

17 and, hopefully, strengthened to include wells previously

18 drilled.

19 MR. COZZIE: Thank you. Could you pass your

20 document to the court reporter?

21 MR. APPLEGATE: Oh, yes.

22 MR. COZZIE: Thank you. Does anyone have any

23 questions from the panel? Thank you.

24 I have no more speakers on the list. Would

25 anyone like to speak from the audience? Well, we'll
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1 stay open here for a little while longer, until we get

2 some more speakers.

3 (Pause in the proceedings.)

4 MR. COZZIE: We're going to reconvene the

5 panel at this point. At this time I'll call forward

6 Brendan Blanchard and Sheila Davis. If you'd both just

7 take a seat at the table right over here.

8 As we go through this, we have a timer here,

9 it's five minutes. You have five minutes to speak.

10 When it turns yellow, it means one minute is left; and

11 the red light means that your time is up.

12 When you start your -- if you speak into the

13 microphone; if you'd also say your name and spell your

14 name for the court reporter.

15 And I guess we'll start with Sheila, will

16 start first.

17 MS. DAVIS: My name is Sheila Davis;

18 S-h-e-i-l-a, D-a-v-i-s. Is this mic picking me up? I

19 don't think so, but --

20 MR. STONEMAN: You may have to hold it closer

21 to your mouth.

22 MS. McKITTRICK: Some folks have needed to

23 hold it up right there.

24 MS. DAVIS: Okay. All right. Do I need to

25 spell my name again?
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1 MR. COZZIE: No, you're good.

2 (Pause in the proceedings.)

3 MS. DAVIS: Does this work?

4 MR. COZZIE: No.

5 (Pause in the proceedings while EPA staff

6 replaced equipment.)

7 MS. McKITTRICK: Thank you for your patience.

8 MR. STONEMAN: Thanks for your patience.

9 MR. BLANCHARD: No worries.

10 MR. COZZIE: Just go ahead.

11 MS. DAVIS: All right. My name is Sheila

12 Davis. That's S-h-e-i-l-a, D-a-v-i-s. And I'm a

13 physician. And I am the acting temporary director of

14 the University of Denver Healthcare Leadership program.

15 And I began my career in health care in -- as

16 a medical student in West Philadelphia, at the

17 University of Pennsylvania, and I chose the area of

18 pediatrics. And while I was in medical school, I

19 watched children cycle in and out of the ER, emergency

20 room, for asthma, essentially. And not only did they

21 cycle in and out of the emergency room, some of them

22 wound up in the intensive care unit.

23 And what you probably know, but I will

24 explain, is that West Philadelphia sits right next to an

25 oil refinery, so the air is filled with pollutants;
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1 among them, methane. And we all know that there are

2 several triggers for asthma, but air pollution is one of

3 them. And meta-analyses reveal the correlation between

4 increased concentration of air pollutants and emergency

5 room visits. And so I urge you to adopt tougher methane

6 pollution standards.

7 And I plan to submit a written comment with

8 data so that -- if you're not convinced of my anecdotal

9 information. But the incidence and prevalence of asthma

10 in communities where there is a lot of air pollution

11 is -- it's off -- off -- you know, I mean, it's -- it's

12 considerably greater than in communities where you don't

13 have these air pollutants.

14 Thank you.

15 MR. COZZIE: Thank you. Any clarifying

16 questions?

17 MR. STONEMAN: We appreciate your patience.

18 MS. DAVIS: Sure.

19 MS. McKITTRICK: Thank you very much.

20 MR. BLANCHARD: All right. Is it working?

21 All right. So my name is Brendan Blanchard;

22 B-r-e-n-d-a-n, B-l-a-n-c-h-a-r-d. So I'd like to thank

23 you for the opportunity you've given me here to speak

24 and give my opinion before the final decision's made.

25 I am in favor of tighter oil and natural gas
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1 regulations, and my information and concern comes from

2 peer-review research that's been done while working at

3 the University of Colorado. The research from these

4 scientists has demonstrated that in the Denver-Julesburg

5 Basin of Colorado, an area with 25,000 oil and natural

6 gas wells just north of here, emissions of volatile

7 organic compounds from the leakage and venting of oil

8 and natural gas activities totals 8 to 19 times the

9 emissions of all 5 million cars registered in Colorado.

10 That's right, one oil and natural gas basin totals 8 to

11 19 times the total volatile organic emissions of all

12 5 million cars currently registered in Colorado.

13 So I'm a journalism student, and I work at the

14 University of Colorado Boulder, at the Institute of

15 Arctic and Alpine Research. As a student in Boulder,

16 I'm concerned that the surrounding county is already in

17 excess of the current air quality standards, due to oil

18 and natural gas emissions, and I'd like to see tighter

19 regulations that will help protect air quality and the

20 health of Colorado citizens.

21 In the past several years, scientists from

22 multiple institutions, including the University of

23 Colorado and NOAA, have collaborated on half a dozen

24 peer reviewed articles detailing the emissions of the

25 oil and natural gas development in Utah and Colorado.
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1 Their findings show that a person living in downtown

2 Denver, a city of one million people with industrial

3 production and hundreds of thousands of running cars,

4 will be exposed to less ozone, methane, and known

5 carcinogens such as benzene on a day-to-day basis

6 compared to someone living in rural Weld County, where

7 there is heavy oil and natural gas development.

8 So the largest cause of poor air quality is

9 currently the emission of total volatile organic

10 compounds, which leads to increased ozone production in

11 the atmosphere. Published literature across the United

12 States has also shown that 5 to 6,000 premature deaths

13 are due to elevated ozone levels each year, and upwards

14 of $500 million of crop damage are a result of these

15 elevated ozone levels. Published research has also

16 shown that 65 percent of high ozone days in Boulder are

17 attributed to air transport from the Denver-Julesburg

18 Basin, an area with heavy oil and gas development.

19 That's two-thirds of high ozone days in Boulder are

20 attributed to air transport from the Denver-Julesburg

21 Basin.

22 Similarly, this research has shown that in

23 2013 the Uintah Basin in Utah, which has just a

24 population of 30,000 people and is very similar to the

25 Denver-Julesburg Basin of Colorado, has more exceedences
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1 of the EPA current ozone standards than the city of Los

2 Angeles, which has 10 million residents. And Denver3 Julesburg Basin is just like this.

4 Colorado claims to have some of the strictest

5 oil and natural gas regulations in the country, going

6 above and beyond the current standards. But just in

7 Denver-Julesburg Basin, again, oil and natural gas

8 operations are still responsible for 8 to 19 times more

9 than the total emissions of all 5 million registered

10 vehicles in the state of Colorado.

11 So even though these new regulations will have

12 an economic cost, similar costs have already been taken

13 up by the American consumer in previous years. When the

14 Clean Air Act was updated in 1990, the estimated cost

15 per car to meet the new regulations was close to a

16 thousand dollars. And American carmakers have been paid

17 since 1990.

18 So each year consumers are spending millions

19 of dollars to maintain these emission standards, which

20 seems rather unfair when the oil and natural gas

21 industry, in just one basin, is producing grossly more

22 emissions, especially from methane and total volatile

23 organic compounds. So these new regulations would force

24 oil and natural gas to play their part in protecting the

25 environment and lowering emissions.
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1 The new regulations proposed for eliminating

2 methane and total volatile organic compound emissions

3 are crucial towards lowering ozone because they are

4 released in much larger amounts than any compounds that

5 are currently regulated.

6 My hope is that passing the new standards can

7 bring about better air quality across the country.

8 Businesses may not appreciate stricter regulations, but

9 in my opinion, they are necessary to help improve the

10 health and the quality for everyone.

11 Thank you.

12 MR. COZZIE: Thank you, Brendan. Any

13 questions from the panel? Thank you very much.

14 (Recess taken from 6:23 p.m. to 6:53 p.m.)

15 MR. COZZIE: This is David Cozzie. I'm the

16 chair for tonight's hearing on several oil and gas

17 proposals. We're going to reconvene, as we have some

18 speakers.

19 Just for the speakers, when I call your name,

20 I'm going to call you up to the table in front. I'd ask

21 that you use the microphone.

22 You'll have five minutes to speak. We have a

23 timer. It'll show you green, you start when it's green.

24 When it turns to yellow, you have a minute left; and

25 then red, your time's up.
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1 I'm going to call you up in pairs of two. I'd

2 ask that you both stay at the table until both speakers

3 are done.

4 And we're here to listen to you. If we do

5 have any clarification questions from the panel, we'll

6 ask those.

7 At this time, I'll call forward Peter Mueller

8 and Emma Bray. And when you introduce yourself, I'd ask

9 that you say your name and spell it for the court

10 reporter.

11 MS. BRAY: How should I attach this?

12 MR. COZZIE: You can just hold it behind.

13 MS. BRAY: Hi. My name's Emma Bray, and I'm

14 16 years old, and I go to East High School. It's Emma,

15 E-m-m-a; Bray, B-r-a-y. And so I founded the group Kids

16 Against Fracking two and a half years ago, after

17 witnessing terrible air and water pollution in the place

18 where I was born, in Queensland, Australia; also after

19 seeing it increase here in Denver, where I've lived for

20 15 years.

21 I wanted to thank the EPA for coming here

22 today and asking for our feedback on the proposed new

23 federal regulations. I noticed that you are conducting

24 hearings in Pennsylvania and in Texas as well.

25 Colorado, Pennsylvania, and Texas, three states that
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1 have been harmed by the oil and gas industry; three

2 states where industry has been permitted to do what they

3 like, virtually with no regulations; three states where

4 the regulatory agencies are also the proponents of gas

5 and oil; three states that couldn't be more different in

6 geography and culture, except for one thing: The

7 presence of large reserves of methane gas and companies

8 who are eager to exploit that geology by digging out and

9 burning fossil fuels for their own profit, even next to

10 schools, hospitals, and homes.

11 Federal governments and even our President

12 sometimes called methane gas clean energy. It is not.

13 I'm sure that you all saw the photo of a little Syrian

14 boy lying dead on the edge of the ocean after trying to

15 escape an intolerable situation with his family.

16 Thousands of people are trying to escape a country that

17 has been devastated by a civil war. And why did that

18 civil war start? It started after a four-year drought,

19 where the government could not and did not help the

20 citizens. It was a farmers' revolt in a place where

21 people are starving.

22 Climate change is contributing to drought,

23 fires, flooding, hurricanes, Arctic ice melting,

24 acidification of the oceans, and other events that cause

25 social and civil unrest. People become refugees when
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1 their very survival is at stake.

2 If the U.S. does not quickly and seriously

3 reduce greenhouse gases, the consequences will be

4 catastrophic for everybody on the planet. We are liable

5 and we could do more, but some are profiting from an

6 industry that is doing terrible damage. Many people and

7 companies are making choices to slow down climate

8 change, and sustainable energy choices must be the place

9 where we go.

10 1. Should all emissions be captured or just

11 the large operations? This is one of those commonsense

12 questions -- requirements that you speak about. All

13 emissions should be captured. If we have the technology

14 to capture emissions, then they should all be captured.

15 I do not think that the EPA's regulations go far enough.

16 All emissions should be captured, not just those coming

17 from new installations.

18 Our state came up with a rule, two years ago,

19 that all methane emissions must be captured. Is that

20 happening now? No, it's not. Voluntary reporting and

21 voluntary upgrades do not make sense if we're trying to

22 meet our commitments to reducing greenhouse gas

23 emissions.

24 How would the E -- how would the EPA or states

25 enforce these rules? Companies who do not comply with
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1 requirements should incur serious fines and penalties.

2 3. Must companies fix leaks? Yes, they

3 should fix leaks. This is common sense.

4 4. Federal laws should be stronger than state

5 laws because states are influenced by too many special

6 interests and don't take everybody's welfare into

7 account. The first law should be, Do no harm.

8 Companies should have to monitor their emissions and

9 should be liable for environmental degradation, just

10 like they've been liable for toxic waste. CEOs who make

11 a hundred million dollars a year should be asked to pay

12 for their carbon and methane emissions. Right now they

13 are polluting without paying for their damage, and the

14 most vulnerable are the first to suffer.

15 5. All companies must legally abide by strict

16 regulations, not regulations that don't do nearly

17 enough. In the case of methane gas, which is a huge

18 contributor to greenhouse gas, it must not be vented

19 into the atmosphere. Methane gas should be captured and

20 not fused off.

21 My suggestion is to limit severely or ban

22 fracking before we find ourselves unable to breathe the

23 air or drink the water. It seems unbelievable, but

24 unbreathable air is actually occurring in other

25 countries and here as well. The air is compromised in
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1 many cities. People can't breathe. People in other

2 countries are banning fracking and coal-fired power

3 plants because they see it as an intolerable risk. For

4 those who flew into Denver, I'm sure you had a view of

5 the brown pollution that covers the northern part of the

6 city. The pollution was not here just a few years ago.

7 We had clean air here for 25 years, mainly because of

8 EPA's air regulations that were instituted in the early

9 1970s and 1980s.

10 Thanks so much for your interest in my

11 comments, and thanks for taking the measures you are

12 taking at this time. If you ask the question, "Is the

13 danger we are in something we can try to prevent?" if

14 the answer is, "Yes," I hope you will make new strong

15 regulations.

16 Thank you.

17 MR. COZZIE: Thank you, Emma. If you wouldn't

18 mind handing a copy of your testimony to the court

19 reporter, that would be great.

20 Does the panel have any questions?

21 MR. STONEMAN: No, but thank you for coming

22 out. We really appreciate it.

23 MS. BRAY: Thank you as well. It means a lot.

24 MR. MUELLER: Okay. Thank you very much.

25 Well said.
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1 Dear Panel: My name is Peter Mueller. I'm

2 the CEO of a small company called EcoVapor Recovery

3 Systems. My remarks tonight pertain around how to

4 further reduce emissions from oil and gas production

5 sites equipped with storage tanks and VOC incinerators.

6 I was a little concerned that you and I may not have

7 exactly the same interests or same goals, but actually

8 we do. It is to capture all the gas.

9 Over ten years ago, the CDPHE put in place

10 regulations to reduce VOC emissions from oil storage

11 tanks, in an effort to reduce the ground-level ozone in

12 Colorado's Front Range. I've been here since '72, and

13 we don't see the purple haze anymore. The CDPHE rules

14 allow producers to either capture or incinerate vapors.

15 However, no viable technologies existed to safely

16 capture the gas at that time, so producers,

17 understandably, chose to incinerate flash gas on-site.

18 Those incinerators, also known as combustors or flares,

19 now dot the landscape all over the Front Range and burn

20 off VOCs with destruction efficiency ratings of

21 95 percent or better.

22 However, it's turned out that the gas flashing

23 from the oil in the oil storage tanks is almost as

24 energy rich as the oil itself, and as much -- and much

25 more so than the natural gas that's produced in the
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1 well. For example, the natural gas used to heat this

2 building has about 900 cubic feet -- or, I'm sorry,

3 900 BTU per cubic foot energy content; whereas, the

4 flash gas coming off oil storage tanks has an energy

5 content up to four times higher. We've seen it as high

6 as 3600 BTU gas coming off those tanks. It is rich in

7 natural gas liquids, including propane and natural

8 gasolines.

9 The obstacle to recovering this gas has been

10 that it becomes contaminated with oxygen while it's in

11 the tanks; and the natural gas pipelines,

12 understandably, will not accept such a mixture into

13 their systems, leaving the producer, again, with little

14 choice but to incinerate this very rich and valuable gas

15 stream.

16 To put the situation in perspective, the

17 average home in Colorado uses approximately 9,000 cubic

18 feet of natural gas each year. Each combustor can

19 incinerate up to eight times that amount each day,

20 enough to heat up to 2800 homes. There are hundreds, if

21 not thousands, of combustors in use in Colorado today.

22 I believe this gas, currently considered a waste

23 product, has a higher and better purpose. If we recover

24 it and put it to beneficial use, we are both reducing

25 waste and emissions.
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1 Six years ago EcoVapor began developing

2 technology to capture this gas and remove the oxygen so

3 that it could be sold and used along with conventional

4 natural gas. We have worked with several producers here

5 in the Front Range, both large and small, testing the

6 process before putting it into commercial service five

7 years ago. Since that time, we've recovered enough gas

8 to heat over 100,000 homes while preventing thousands of

9 tons of pollutants from entering our atmosphere.

10 There's a chart attached to the testimony that

11 I handed out. Can you hand out those copies?

12 THE REPORTER: Yes, I will.

13 MR. MUELLER: This slide represents the -- on

14 the left side, the emissions, in tons per year, of a

15 flare -- or two flares, actually, that would be

16 combustion up to 160 MCFs a day of 2800 BTU gas. That's

17 a -- 2800 to 3000 BTU is a normal range. And you can

18 see that 77 tons per year. Using our system, that gets

19 it down to 7.5 tons, over 90 percent reduction. And

20 that -- and those emissions include the engine that

21 powers that system. We're also looking at an electric

22 model as well.

23 This technology now provides producers with a

24 real choice that didn't exist when these regulations

25 were first put in place. To be clear, not every well
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1 site is a candidate for our system, as many wells

2 produce either no oil or too little to make the

3 installation cost effective; nor are they a lifetime fit

4 for any well, as production eventually declines to the

5 point where, again, our systems are not justified. But

6 new and recent sites, which are producing the highest

7 rates of oil, also produce the bulk of the flash gas,

8 and that can be economically captured.

9 Governor Hickenlooper is aware and supportive

10 of our technology, as are officials with the CDPHE,

11 COGCC, and EPA Region 8. We look forward to working

12 with more producers, to capture more gas and turn it

13 from waste into valuable products and simultaneously

14 reduce emissions.

15 Thank you.

16 MR. COZZIE: Thank you, Peter. Any questions

17 from the panel?

18 MR. STONEMAN: Thank you very much.

19 MR. COZZIE: Thank you very much.

20 At this time I'd like to call forward Michael

21 Saul. And please use the microphone and introduce

22 yourself, spell out your name for the court reporter.

23 MR. SAUL: Good evening. My name is Michael

24 Saul, that's S-a-u-l, and I am an attorney here on

25 behalf of the Center for Biological Diversity. Thank
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1 you for the opportunity to comment on the proposed

2 methane New Source Performance Standards.

3 As you know, methane is both an ozone

4 precursor with serious public health implications and a

5 very potent greenhouse gas, with approximately 87 times

6 more warming potential than carbon dioxide over a 20-

7 year span. Methane, obviously, also has a much shorter

8 lifetime in the atmosphere, making short-term methane

9 mitigation a crucial step toward any progress on climate

10 stabilization.

11 The Administration has made clear it's aware

12 of the importance of limiting methane emissions, both in

13 international obligations and to mitigate catastrophic

14 warming, as has been noted in the President's methane

15 strategy.

16 The oil and gas sector is the largest single

17 sector contributing to methane emissions. At 2013 the

18 most recently available data show approximately

19 183 million metric tons of carbon dioxide equivalent

20 versus approximately 165 million methane tons for

21 enteric fermentation from agriculture or from livestock.

22 It's -- it's our position that methane leakage

23 and venting from the sector is actually likely much

24 higher than reported in EPA's inventory. Peer-reviewed

25 scientific literature suggests that methane emissions
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1 leaking from various stages of oil and gas operations

2 are at least double the estimates in EPA's emission

3 factors.

4 Consequently, it is absolutely essential that

5 methane from this sector be controlled, and be

6 controlled quickly, through strong standards for both

7 new and modified sources.

8 We know that multiple mitigation options exist

9 for methane emissions from the oil and gas industry and

10 that, in fact, most of them are very cost effective and

11 involve proven technologies and practices.

12 Therefore the Center strongly supports efforts

13 to directly limit methane emissions from new oil and gas

14 sources under Section 111(b) of the Clean Air Act. We

15 also support the most rapid possible implementation

16 schedule for such standards:

17 The proposed amendments to New Source

18 Performance Standards for oil and gas generally limit

19 methane emissions from important sources, with the

20 significant exception of liquids unloading;

21 And we note that the proposed standard would

22 include, for the first time, green completions for

23 hydraulically fractured wells; pneumatic pumps,

24 compressor stations, and well sites; and requirements

25 extended to all pneumatic controllers, centrifugal
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1 compressors, and reciprocating compressors.

2 We would request that the EPA act more

3 decisively and strengthen rules that control leaks from

4 this significant pollution -- pollutant from the oil and

5 gas industry, specifically:

6 Stronger methane reductions can be achieved

7 with proven technology;

8 We think the rule's proposed leakage of up to

9 5 percent from some units is greatly excessive, and a

10 methane leakage rate of anything greater than

11 2.8 percent would make the life cycle burning of natural

12 gas in power plants more harmful, from a warming

13 perspective, than coal;

14 Liquids unloading is also a significant source

15 of leaks and should be a source component under the

16 rule;

17 We believe that the proposed leak detection

18 and repair schedule is not sufficiently frequent. The

19 proposed rule would allow decreased monitoring based on

20 a leakage rate of less than 1 percent. We are strongly

21 concerned that this creates a disincentive on industry

22 to monitor for and repair leaks. And -- and therefore a

23 fixed quarterly monitoring schedule is more appropriate,

24 particularly given that the literature indicates that

25 the occurrence of leaks is neither systematic nor
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1 necessarily predictable.

2 At the same time, we -- we recommend that EPA

3 should also take rapid steps to promulgate emission

4 guidelines under Section 111(d) of the Act to address

5 existing sources, which constitute nearly 90 percent of

6 all methane emissions from this sector out of expected

7 in 2018. Thus the vast majority of current emissions

8 will continue unabated until existing sources are

9 addressed under 111(d).

10 Thank you.

11 MR. COZZIE: Thank you, Michael. Any

12 clarifying questions from the panel?

13 And I think, if you have a copy of the

14 document you can leave with the court reporter, that

15 would be helpful.

16 MR. SAUL: Okay.

17 MR. STONEMAN: Thank you very much for coming

18 down.

19 MR. SAUL: Thank you.

20 MR. COZZIE: Especially this late.

21 At this time I have no more speakers. We will

22 take a short recess here.

23 (Recess taken from 7:11 p.m. to 7:47 p.m.)

24 MR. COZZIE: Since we have a speaker now, we

25 can reconvene the panel.
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1 If you would spell your name for our court

2 reporter, that'd be great. You've heard about the

3 clock.

4 MR. HARDWICK: And I'm the last one here.

5 MR. COZZIE: All right. Okay, go ahead.

6 MR. HARDWICK: All right. My name's Matt

7 Hardwick. I currently speak for myself. I found out

8 about this hearing through the -- oh, sorry. So I found

9 out about this hearing through the Sierra Club. I was a

10 legislative volunteer for Colorado's House Majority

11 Office and worked on a research project on methane

12 emissions and the current state of the methane emission

13 detectors, such as they are.

14 I was also an intern for a state rep,

15 Representative Joann Ginal from Fort Collins. She

16 doesn't -- she currently isn't on any energy-related

17 committees for the general assembly, but she does have a

18 interest in health issues, which made me -- and to have

19 me work on the recent oil and gas task force here in

20 Colorado, governor's task force, that listen to --

21 listen to hearings regarding health issues. In any

22 case, it made the repeated mentions of asthma that I've

23 heard about throughout today very interesting.

24 I'd like to talk a little bit about what I see

25 is one of the larger issues here, which is that while
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1 the amount of methane seems inexhaustible and the oil

2 and gas industry seems to treat it as inexhaustible, it

3 isn't. It will run out. It may run out in a hundred

4 years, as the industry claims. It may run out in ten or

5 so years, which seems likely, given the energy demands

6 of this country, never mind India, China, and the rest

7 of the world. But it will run out.

8 In fact, but for George Mitchell's innovations

9 in fracking, which, you've probably heard, that's been

10 around since the late '40s, George Mitchell's energy

11 innovations back in the late '90s, we wouldn't have this

12 bonanza to deal with. We'd have a rude awakening, to

13 say the least. Who knows how long it'll last. So we

14 have to act responsible from this gift given to us.

15 I don't have any real recommendations. I'm

16 still learning about the issue myself, and today has

17 been fairly informative. It sounds like what the EPA's

18 doing is a good job and, like many here, I encourage you

19 all to keep it up and to keep in mind the larger reasons

20 for developing your all's policies on methane and

21 other -- as well as other current fossil fuels.

22 And the only thing I would add is it seems

23 like -- it seems like a good transition fuel, although

24 if you -- and as long as the obvious challenges, like

25 from the VOCs and to this thing called, I want to say,
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1 BTEX are kept in mind, and, I mean, then the transition

2 to cleaner fuels -- air, hydropower, and solar -- will

3 be that much easier.

4 And that's all I have to say, and I -- my

5 nerves are starting to give out a little. Thank you for

6 all you do, and I hope you have a good day.

7 Thank you.

8 MR. STONEMAN: Thank you very much. I

9 appreciate it, and for staying all day and listening.

10 MR. HARDWICK: Not a problem.

11 MR. STONEMAN: Thank you.

12 MR. STONEMAN: Not a problem.

13 (Pause in the proceedings.)

14 MR. COZZIE: At this time we are with no

15 additional speakers. It is 7:55. We're going to

16 adjourn the -- close the hearing for the day. I thank

17 all those that have participated.

18 (The hearing was adjourned at 7:56 p.m.)

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1 REPORTER’S CERTIFICATE

2 I, CARLA D. CAPRITTA, Registered Professional

3 Reporter, certify;

4 That the foregoing proceedings were taken

5 before me at the time and place therein set forth.

6 That all foregoing proceedings were recorded

7 stenographically by me and were thereafter transcribed;

8 That the foregoing is a true and correct

9 transcript of my shorthand notes so taken;

10 I further certify that I am not a relative or

11 employee of any of the parties, nor financially

12 interested in the action;

13 I declare, under penalty of perjury under the

14 laws of Colorado, that the foregoing is true and

15 correct.

16 Dated this 28th day of October, 2015.

17

18

19 __________________________

Carla D. Capritta, RPR

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