Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 1 1 2 3 PUBLIC HEARING ON TIER 3 PROPOSED RULE 4 5 6 7 Wednesday, April 24, 2013 8 10:00 a.m. 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 UNITED STATES ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION AGENCY 17 Sonesta Hotel Philadelphia 18 1800 Market Street 19 Philadelphia, Pennsylvania 20 21 22Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 2 1 PARTICIPANTS 2 CHRIS GRUNDLER 3 PAUL MACHIELE 4 MICHAEL OLECHIW 5 KATHRYN SARGEANT 6 MARK KATAOKA 7 JONELL IFFLAND 8 TIA SUTTON 9 TAD WYSOR 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 3 1P R O C E E D I N G S 

### 2MR. GRUNDLER: Good morning, everybody, and 

### 3 welcome. I want to welcome everyone here that traveled 

### 4 from far or nearby and those who are on the phone 

### 5 listening in to this hearing. 

### 6 I'm Chris Grundler. I'm the Director of 

### 7 EPA's Office of Transportation and Air Quality, and I 

### 8 will be the presiding officer for today's hearing. 

### 9 With me today are my colleagues, Mike Olechiw, Paul 

### 10 Machiele, and Kathryn Sargeant, and my attorney from 

### 11 the Office of General Counsel, Mark Kataoka. 

### 12We've a large number of people representing 

### 13 either themselves or organizations who have signed up 

### 14 to speak today. Thank you so much for the time you're 

### 15 devoting to this important process, particularly those 

### 16 of you who are citizens and who have come here to share 

### 17 your views. 

### 18 Let me say just a few words of introduction 

### 19 and then we'll get started with your testimony. We're 

### 20 hearing today testimony on proposed new standards for 

### 21 vehicle emissions from passenger vehicles and some 

### 22 heavy duty vehicles, and the related standards forTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 4 1 sulfur and gasoline. These proposed standards, which 

### 2 we are calling Tier 3, would significantly reduce 

### 3 health-related pollution from new cars, SUVs, pickups, 

### 4minivans, and large passenger vehicles, as well as from 

### 5 large pickups and vans, beginning in the 2017 model 

### 6 year. Once it is fully phased in, we expect the 

### 7 proposed Tier 3 program to prevent thousands of 

### 8 premature deaths and illnesses annually, for example, 

### 9 avoiding as many as 2,400 premature deaths each year, 

### 10 23,000 cases of respiratory ailments in children, and 

### 11 close to two million lost school days, lost workdays, 

### 12 and days of restricted activity every year once the 

### 13 program is fully phased in. 

### 14These large health benefits would require 

### 15 significant new investments, primarily by the auto 

### 16 manufacturing and oil refining industries. We expect 

### 17 that auto makers would need to add an average of about 

### 18 $130 to the cost of a new vehicle for improved emission 

### 19 control systems, and refiners would need to invest an 

### 20 average of about a penny a gallon to reduce sulfur in 

### 21 their gasoline products to protect these emission 

### 22 controls for the full use for life of these vehicles.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 5 1However, we project that the annual health 

### 2 benefits of the program in dollar terms -- these are 

### 3 the benefits that we can monetize -- would be even 

### 4 larger, far exceeding these costs. We're estimating 

### 5 that the total health-related benefits in 2030 would be 

### 6 between $8 and $23 billion annually compared to an 

### 7 overall annual compliance cost that we are estimating 

### 8 at $3.4 billion. 

### 9 In designing these standards, we are 

### 10 following a proven formula that we've used in the past 

### 11 in which we consider both the vehicle and the fuel as 

### 12 an integrated system. Taken together, the elements of 

### 13 this proposed program can achieve the large health 

### 14 benefits that I just referenced. And we believe it 

### 15 will achieve these benefits at a reasonable cost to 

### 16 society. 

### 17The auto companies and the fuel industry will 

### 18 have plenty of time to meet these standards which we've 

### 19 designed in a flexible way and which will be phased in 

### 20 over a number of years. As I noted, the requirements 

### 21 do not start until 2017, and the vehicle standards 

### 22 would phase in through the year 2025.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 6 1To further ease this path to compliance, 

### 2 we're composing flexibilities for both industries, 

### 3 including special economic hardship provisions, 

### 4 additional lead time for compliance that would also 

### 5 available to affected small business concerns. 

### 6 What do these standards do? Under the 

### 7 proposed standards, auto makers would reduce their 

### 8 tailpipe emissions of smog forming volatile organic 

### 9 compounds and nitrogen oxides by 80 percent. The 

### 10 standards would also establish a 70 percent tighter 

### 11 tailpipe standard for fine particle pollution and 

### 12 reduce fuel vapor emissions to near zero levels. To 

### 13 enable these stringent standards throughout their life, 

### 14 refiners would be required to reduce the sulfur levels 

### 15 in gasoline by more than 60 percent, down to 10 parts 

### 16 per million starting in 2017. 

### 17One of the most important features of this 

### 18 program also means that all gasoline vehicles built 

### 19 prior to the new vehicle standards in 2017 will run 

### 20 cleaner on this new low sulfur gasoline, providing 

### 21 significant and immediate health benefits from day one. 

### 22Part of the program, and this is all in the docket andTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 7 1 is available on our website, is a description and 

### 2 results of an extensive new testing program that EPA 

### 3 undertook to better understand the effects of sulfur on 

### 4 vehicle emissions, and it's on the basis of this 

### 5 extensive test program that we now understand much 

### 6 better the impacts of sulfur on vehicle emissions. 

### 7These benefits matter, and they will help 

### 8 greatly the State efforts to reduce harmful levels of 

### 9 smog and soot, and enables the States and local air 

### 10 quality agencies to meet the National Ambient Air 

### 11 Quality Standards which are in place to protect public 

### 12 health. 

### 13 Another feature of this programs is that it 

### 14 aligns the requirements that auto makers have to make 

### 15 in the coming years so that they can design a vehicle 

### 16 that can be sold in all 50 States. The standards work 

### 17 together with the California clean vehicle and fuels 

### 18 program, and create a harmonized nationwide approach to 

### 19 reducing emissions from automobiles. 

### 20 In addition, we've designed the proposal to 

### 21 be implemented over the same time frame as our new 

### 22 greenhouse gas and fuel economy standards. So whatTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 8 1 this means is auto makers will have one set of targets 

### 2 to meet from both California and the Federal government 

### 3 for a range of pollution, from greenhouse gas emission 

### 4 standards to these what we call criteria pollution 

### 5 standards, as well as air toxics. This is a huge 

### 6 benefit to the auto makers in that it provides them 

### 7 certainty over an extended period of time so they can 

### 8 design their products and invest in technology 

### 9 accordingly, and have a streamlined compliance process 

### 10 that enables them to create one vehicle that's 

### 11 available to all consumers nationwide. 

### 12So this is a brief summary of our proposal. 

### 13 I encourage everyone to visit our website for any other 

### 14 information that you may need. The website has a wide 

### 15 range of information, including how to find materials 

### 16 on the public docket, the regulation themselves, and 

### 17 extensive discussion of the program. We have fact 

### 18 sheets out in the hall at the reception area as well as 

### 19 instructions on how to find this website and how to 

### 20 find this material and much more. 

### 21So with that brief summary, let me share a 

### 22 bit of logistical information, and then we'll getTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 9 1 started. Because of the number of people who would 

### 2 like to speak today, we're asking you to limit your 

### 3 testimony to five minutes. We estimate that -- for 

### 4 everyone who has already signed up, this will take us 

### 5 well into the evening, so I'd ask your cooperation. 

### 6 We've provided some helpful indicator lights at the 

### 7 desk to help you time your presentation. Yellow means 

### 8 wrap it up. Red means shut up. 

### 9 [Laughter.] 

### 10 MR. GRUNDLER: And this will allow everyone a 

### 11 chance to present their views, which is important. 

### 12You're welcome to leave any supplementary 

### 13 written material behind. And part of the instructions 

### 14you'll find on the website is also how to make comments 

### 15 post today's hearing. The comment period will remain 

### 16 open through June the 13th. 

### 17We will be here as long as it takes so that 

### 18 everyone can have their say. We're going to be using 

### 19 panels to speed up the process. The order is provided 

### 20 with the agenda at the reception table of these panels. 

### 21If anyone is here that wishes to testify that has not 

### 22 already signed up, please do so at the reception table.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 10 1Whether you're testifying or not, we'd ask you to sign 

### 2 in so we know who's all here today. We'll be going 

### 3 straight through the panel with a few short breaks. 

### 4Again, because of the numbers of organizations and 

### 5 people that would like to testify, we will not be able 

### 6 to respond to questions from the audience today, but 

### 7 you're welcome to leave them behind, and we will answer 

### 8 them by email. 

### 9 Now I'm going to read some text that my 

### 10 lawyers wish me to read: "We seek testimony and 

### 11 comments on all aspects of our proposed rule. We're 

### 12 conducting this hearing in accordance with Section 

### 13 307(d)(5) of the Clean Air Act, which requires EPA to 

### 14provide interested persons an opportunity for oral 

### 15 presentation of data, views, or arguments, in addition 

### 16 to an opportunity to make written submissions. 

### 17After today, we will keep the official record 

### 18 of this hearing open through June 13th, 2013, for 

### 19 submission of any rebuttal or supplementary 

### 20 information. 

### 21We will conduct this hearing informally and 

### 22 formal rules of evidence will not apply. As presidingTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 11 1 officer, however, I am authorized to strike statements 

### 2 from the record which are deemed irrelevant or 

### 3 needlessly repetitious, and to enforce reasonable 

### 4 limits on the duration of the statement of any 

### 5 witness." 

### 6 If you would like a transcript of today's 

### 7 proceedings, you should make arrangements directly with 

### 8 the court reporter sitting behind us during one of the 

### 9 breaks. We'll also make the transcripts available on 

### 10 our website and in the public document for the 

### 11 rulemaking. 

### 12So with that, I think we're ready to get 

### 13 started. Let me ask the first panel to take your 

### 14 seats. And if you will, please write your name on that 

### 15 blank card at the corner of the table in front of you. 

### 16 It will help us and the audience. I'd ask each 

### 17 panelist to please state his or her name and 

### 18 affiliation, and please speak slowly and clearly so our 

### 19 court reporter can record these proceedings accurately. 

### 20 When the witnesses on the panel have finished their 

### 21 presentations, we'll have an opportunity to ask 

### 22 clarifying questions related to your testimony.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 12 1Witnesses are reminded that any false 

### 2 statements or false responses to questions may be a 

### 3 violation of law. 

### 4We will try to accommodate everyone who would 

### 5 like to testify. 

### 6 Thank you, and as soon as our panel is 

### 7 seated, we will proceed. And I'm going to ask Mr. Paul 

### 8 Billings of the American Lung Association to lead us 

### 9 off. Paul? 

### 10 MR. BILLINGS: Good morning. I am Paul 

### 11 Billings, Senior Vice President for Advocacy and 

### 12 Education at the American Lung Association. On behalf 

### 13 of the 34 million people with chronic lung disease, I 

### 14 urge the Environmental Protection Agency to adopt the 

### 15 final Tier 3 motor vehicle emissions and fuel standards 

### 16 by the end of this year. 

### 17Released earlier today, our annual state of 

### 18 the air report shows 132 million people currently live 

### 19 in counties with unhealthy levels of air pollution, 

### 20 areas that get failing grades. Today you will hear 

### 21 from some who will question the benefits of more 

### 22 protective standards or widely exaggerate costs. WeTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 13 1 have heard these outlandish claims for decades, and 

### 2 each time such claims are proven false, and the 

### 3 underlying analyses flawed. 

### 4EPA's job is clear: set cleaner gasoline and 

### 5 vehicle standards, protect the public health, 

### 6 especially the most vulnerable: our children, older 

### 7 adults, and those with chronic lung and heart disease. 

### 8 The Clean Air Act grants EPA the authority to set 

### 9 standards for vehicles and fuels and to reduce air 

### 10 pollution that threatens public health under Section 

### 11 211. The Clean Air Act grants the EPA administrator 

### 12 the authority to limit the sulfur and gasoline which 

### 13 reduces the efficiency of emission control 

### 14 technologies, and leads to greater tailpipe pollution. 

### 15When pollution from motor vehicles endangers public 

### 16 health, Section 202 of the Act requires the EPA 

### 17 administrator to take necessary action. 

### 18 Although we have made progress in the U.S. 

### 19 towards healthier air, the air we breathe is still 

### 20 making millions of Americans sick. Pollution from 

### 21motor vehicles is a major contributor to ozone and 

### 22 particulate matter. These pollutants trigger asthmaTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 14 1 attacks, worsen existing conditions, such as chronic 

### 2 obstructive pulmonary disease, diabetes, harms heart 

### 3 and lung health, and can lead to early death. 

### 4As the American Lung Association noted in our 

### 5 recently released report, "A Penny for Prevention: The 

### 6 Case for Cleaner Gasoline and Vehicle Standards," the 

### 7 health benefits of this systems approach, cleaner 

### 8 gasoline and tailpipe standards, are significant. 

### 9 Cleaner gasoline provide immediate reductions from the 

### 10 existing fleet of vehicles, and the improved vehicle 

### 11 standards will ensure auto makers continue to develop 

### 12 and sell new cleaner burning vehicles. 

### 13 Our analysis estimates that by 2030, the 

### 14 standards under consideration today will prevent more 

### 15 than 2,500 premature deaths and more than 15,000 asthma 

### 16 attacks each year. The standards will provide up to 

### 17 $22 billion in economic and health benefits annually by 

### 18 2030, increase productivity by preventing more than 3.3 

### 19 million days of missed work and school. And these 

### 20 benefits are conservative. Our analysis only looked at 

### 21 the eastern half of the United States. The actual 

### 22 benefits could be much higher.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 15 1As reported by the Health Effects Institute 

### 2 in 2010, near roadway exposure to traffic pollution is 

### 3 high and affects a larger population than previously 

### 4 thought. Their analysis showed a causal relationship 

### 5 between traffic-related air pollution and asthma 

### 6 exacerbations in children. The HEI reports that 30 to 

### 7 45 percent of people living in large North American 

### 8 cities live within 300 to 500 meters of a highway or 

### 9 major road, zones that are most heavily impacted by 

### 10 traffic pollution. 

### 11To reduce exposure to this toxic brew of 

### 12 traffic-related pollutants, including particulate 

### 13 matter, we encourage the EPA to set the tightest 

### 14 tailpipe standards for non-methane organic gasses, 

### 15 nitrogen oxides, and particulate matter, and the lowest 

### 16 possible downstream cap for sulfur. We will submit 

### 17 detailed comments on how to specifically strengthen the 

### 18 proposal in writing. 

### 19 My wife and I are blessed to have two healthy 

### 20 and active daughters. Soccer, lacrosse, and track are 

### 21 their competitive sports. Like every parent, every 

### 22 individual breeze, I care deeply about the quality ofTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 16 1 the air my family and I breathe. Last year, my younger 

### 2 daughter was diagnosed with exercise-induced asthma. 

### 3 Her high school is adjacent to I-495, Washington's 

### 4 capital beltway. Air pollution from vehicles and the 

### 5 resulting smog and soot are a real and direct threat to 

### 6 her health and the health of her teammates. 

### 7In my wife's fifth grade class, there are far 

### 8 too many children with asthma. We must protect all of 

### 9 the children, whose lungs are still developing, and all 

### 10 the vulnerable populations from air pollution. 

### 11The American Lung Association applauds the 

### 12 U.S. EPA's effort to cut life threatening tailpipe 

### 13 pollution through the long-awaited cleaner gasoline and 

### 14 vehicle standards. To save lives and protect public 

### 15 health, these standards must be finalized no later than 

### 16 the end of this year. 

### 17Thank you for the opportunity to speak in 

### 18 support of these critical safeguards. 

### 19 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you, Mr. Billings. 

### 20 Mr. Solomon? 

### 21MR. SOLOMON: Thank you and good morning. My 

### 22 name is Matt Solomon. I'm Transportation ProgramTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 17 1 Manager for the Northeast States for Coordinated Air 

### 2 Use Management. NESCAUM is the association of air 

### 3 pollution control agencies in Connecticut, Maine, 

### 4 Massachusetts, New Hampshire, New York, New Jersey, 

### 5 Rhode Island, and Vermont. I'm speaking today in 

### 6 recognition of the air quality public health and 

### 7 environmental benefits that will accrue in our region 

### 8 if EPA promulgates the rule, the Tier 3 regulation. 

### 9 I'd also like to recognize and thank you and 

### 10 your staff for the incredible diligence and hard work 

### 11 that you've put into this important rulemaking. 

### 12 NESCAUM and our member states are committed 

### 13 to clean vehicles as evidenced by the adoption of the 

### 14 California low emission vehicle standards in seven of 

### 15 our member states. While Tier 3 vehicle emission 

### 16 standards would not directly affect emissions from new 

### 17 vehicles sold in these States, it would reduce 

### 18 pollution transported from neighboring regions, and 

### 19 ensure that out of state vehicles operating within our 

### 20 region have comparably low emission characteristics. 

### 21More importantly, the Tier 3 fuel standards 

### 22 would improve air quality in the northeast byTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 18 1 significantly reducing emissions from the existing 

### 2 fleet. By harmonizing vehicle emission standards with 

### 3 those in the California program, Tier 3 would 

### 4 facilitate compliance by automobile manufacturers, 

### 5 enabling them to harness economies of scale by 

### 6 deploying advanced emission control technologies in all 

### 7 new vehicles sold nationwide. 

### 8 While Tier 2 vehicles are significantly 

### 9 cleaner than their predecessors, motor vehicles remains 

### 10 the largest source of ozone forming pollutants in the 

### 11 region. As early as 2007, EPA recognized the 

### 12 importance of Tier 3 standards to help States meet the 

### 13 NAAQS for ozone, and it is late in delivering the much 

### 14 needed reductions from the light duty vehicle sector. 

### 15 It is both feasible and appropriate to set new Federal 

### 16 exhaust and evaporative emission standards and clean 

### 17 gasoline requirements comparable to those already in 

### 18 place in California. 

### 19 The low sulfur gasoline provisions in the 

### 20 proposed Tier 3 rule would provide critical air 

### 21 quality, public health, and environmental benefits in 

### 22 the northeast. Cleaner gasoline allows pollutionTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 19 1 control equipment on cars and trucks to operate more 

### 2 effectively and can significant reduce oxides of 

### 3 nitrogen and other vehicle emissions. The introduction 

### 4 of 10 parts per million sulfur gasoline would result in 

### 5 a very large and nearly immediate reduction in NOx 

### 6 emissions from the existing fleet of gasoline vehicles. 

### 7Lower sulfur gasoline also facilitates the 

### 8 deployment of advanced technologies to improve fuel 

### 9 economy and reduce greenhouse gas emissions, which 

### 10 would help mitigate the impacts of climate change, 

### 11 reduce gasoline consumption, and save consumers money. 

### 12Motor vehicles are the Northeast's largest 

### 13 source of NOx, which is the most important contributor 

### 14 to elevated regional ozone concentration and an 

### 15 important precursor to find particulate matter 

### 16 formation. These pollutants are responsible for tens 

### 17 of thousands of premature death, hospital emissions, 

### 18 and lost work and school days in the U.S. annually. 

### 19 Reductions in NOx associated with the Tier 3 

### 20 rule would also help States meet the new nitrogen 

### 21 dioxide NAAQS and reduce environmental impacts of acid 

### 22 rain, coastal marine eutrophication, and regional haze.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 20 1National and regional NOx controls, including those 

### 2 from motor vehicles, have proven to be extremely 

### 3 effective in lowering ambient levels of ozone in the 

### 4 eastern U.S. NESCAUM estimates that the Tier 3 low 

### 5 sulfur gasoline provisions alone would reduce NOx 

### 6 emissions in the eastern U.S. by more than 175,000 tons 

### 7 per year. These NOx reductions would benefit air 

### 8 quality and public health in the northeast by lowering 

### 9 the ozone reservoir that forms in the eastern U.S., and 

### 10 by reducing the amount of low level NOx emissions and 

### 11 pollutants derived from NOx that are transported into 

### 12 the northeast Mid-Atlantic region. 

### 13 Even with the projected benefits associated 

### 14 with the programs currently in effect, many of our most 

### 15 populous areas are predicted to be a non-attainment 

### 16 area for the current 75 part per billion ozone max in 

### 17 2015. Attaining the standard in these areas will 

### 18 require additional NOx reductions within our region, as 

### 19 well as in upwind areas that contribute to the region's 

### 20 pollution burden. 

### 21Tier 3 is the most significant strategy the 

### 22 Federal government could implement to help StatesTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 21 1 attain and maintain the NAAQS for ozone. The combined 

### 2 near-term benefits of the low sulfur gasoline 

### 3 provisions and the increasing benefits of the tailpipe 

### 4 standards would help areas that need additional 

### 5 reductions to attain and assist other areas to stay in 

### 6 attainment. 

### 7According to the petroleum industry's own 

### 8 estimates, the Tier 3 program would monthly decrease 

### 9 eight-hour ozone by up 1.2 part per billion in 2022. 

### 10 Although proponents of the proposed rule characterize 

### 11 this reduction as insignificant, in fact, it is very 

### 12 substantial and greater than could be achieved by any 

### 13 other known practical measure in the same time frame. 

### 14 Further, the benefits of the new emission standards 

### 15 would increase over time with fleet turnover. 

### 16 Reductions not achieved through the Tier 3 program and 

### 17 other Federal measures would have to come from 

### 18 additional controls on local sources. 

### 19 I'd like to quickly mention two other 

### 20 provisions that would contribute to improved air 

### 21 quality and reduce public exposure to toxic 

### 22 contaminants in gasoline: reducing evaporativeTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 22 1 emissions to near zero levels from all affected 

### 2 vehicles as is currently the case with hundreds of 

### 3 thousands of California certified vehicles on the road 

### 4 in the northeast. In addition, the use of -- the 

### 5 requirement to use a gasoline ethanol blend in place of 

### 6 indolene would ensure that certification testing more 

### 7 accurately reflects emissions from in-use vehicles. 

### 8 Thank you very much. 

### 9 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you, Matt. 

### 10 Next I'd like to ask Mr. Tim Hogan to provide 

### 11 his comments. Mike Stanton, you're on deck. 

### 12MR. HOGAN: Good morning. I'm Tim Hogan, 

### 13 Director of Motor Fuels at the American Fuel and 

### 14 Petrochemical Manufacturers. The AFPM is a trade 

### 15 association representing high technology American 

### 16 manufacturers of virtually the entire U.S. supply of 

### 17 gasoline, diesel, jet fuel, other fuels, and home 

### 18 heating oil, as well as the petrochemicals used as 

### 19 building blocks for thousands of products vital to 

### 20 everyday life. 

### 21EPA proposes that refiners further lower the 

### 22 amount of sulfur from gasoline despite the fact thatTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 23 1 our industry already removed 90 percent since 2004. 

### 2 The remaining incremental reduction of trace amounts of 

### 3 sulfur will cost refiners almost as much as the Tier 2 

### 4 reduction 10 years ago, which removed 15 times more 

### 5 sulfur than the proposed Tier 3 regulation would 

### 6 require. 

### 7A Baker and O'Brien analysis estimates that a 

### 8 gasoline sulfur content reduction will cost refiners 

### 9 $10 billion in capital costs, and $2.4 billion per year 

### 10 in operating costs, increasing the cost of producing 

### 11 gasoline by six to nine cents per gallon. We know that 

### 12mobile source emissions have declined because of the 

### 13 Tier 2 standards, and this will continue because not 

### 14 all cars and light duty trucks in the current fleet are 

### 15 Tier 2 vehicles. However, the estimated air quality 

### 16 benefits of Tier 3 will be much smaller than Tier 2. 

### 17 For ozone, this reduction is estimated to be no more 

### 18 than .05 parts per billion by 2022. 

### 19 The Agency claims that this proposed Tier 3 

### 20 standard is necessary for States to attain the existing 

### 21 ozone NAAQS. Last year, EPA promulgated nonattainment 

### 22 areas for the 2008 ozone NAAQS. Most -- 36 areTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 24 1marginal out of 46 total nonattainment areas -- must be 

### 2 in compliance by 2015 based on monitoring data for 

### 3 2013, 2014, and 2015. Tier 3 will not help these 36 

### 4marginal nonattainment areas because it will not be 

### 5 effective before 2017. 

### 6 We believe that there should be at least five 

### 7 years between the promulgation of a Tier 3 rule that 

### 8 includes reduction in the sulfur content, gasoline, and 

### 9 its effective date. Refiners need this lead time to 

### 10 schedule equipment modifications or the installation of 

### 11 new equipment during a turnaround. Otherwise refiners 

### 12may be temporarily shut down with the associated supply 

### 13 impacts. 

### 14Tier 3 is not required by law, and the 

### 15 selection of 2017 is arbitrary. If the EPA promulgates 

### 16 a reduction in the sulfur content of gasoline in late 

### 17 2013, then the effective date should not be earlier 

### 18 than 2019. The AFPM recommends that the current 

### 19 refinery gate cap for gasoline remain at 80 ppm sulfur. 

### 20 This would not interfere with an engine technology. 

### 21 Even the Agency has proposed that 80 ppm is prudent for 

### 22 2017 to 2019.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 25 1The AFPM supports a new certification fuel. 

### 2 Indolene should be replaced with E10, not E15. Almost 

### 3 all gasoline today is E10. It is speculative to expect 

### 4 that E15 will be the predominant fuel in 2017. The 

### 5 current certification fuel in California is E10, and 

### 6 one of the stated goals of this proposal is 

### 7 harmonization with California standards. 

### 8 New regulations can actually create conflicts 

### 9 with existing regulations. These conflicts could 

### 10 jeopardize a refiner's ability to comply with federal 

### 11 formulation regulations. Refiners will often have to 

### 12make modifications to operations that are necessary to 

### 13 make clean fuels. Such upgrades could trigger 

### 14 greenhouse gas emissions regulations, putting these 

### 15 projects in jeopardy. 

### 16 Incongruously, as a result of the required -- 

### 17 requiring the refiner industry to install energy 

### 18 intensive equipment to reduce additional sulfur, the 

### 19 Baker and O'Brien analysis estimates the greenhouse gas 

### 20 emissions will increase by one to 2.3 percent in 

### 21 refineries as a result of this proposal. 

### 22The Administration needs to understand thatTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 26 1 further gasoline sulfur reduction will cause an 

### 2 increase in emissions at the refineries. In this 

### 3 instance, mandating lower sulfur fuels under the Clean 

### 4Air Act will require facilities to install advanced 

### 5 technologies that increase energy use for the 

### 6 formulation of increasingly complex motor fuels. For 

### 7 example, sulfur is a component of crude oil. Hydro 

### 8 treating is the principle technology used to reduce 

### 9 sulfur and petroleum products. This and other 

### 10 technologies in turn require significant additional 

### 11 energy consumption with associated greenhouse gasses 

### 12 and other emissions. 

### 13 The production of extra hydrogen necessary 

### 14 for the hydro treater results in an increase in GSG 

### 15 emissions because the hydrocarbon source must be 

### 16 cracked to remove the hydrogen, releasing large amounts 

### 17 of CO2. Therefore, the proposed gasoline sulfur 

### 18 reduction standard will increase the carbon footprint 

### 19 at refineries. 

### 20 The AFPM has requested that the public 

### 21 comment period for the Tier 3 rulemaking be extended 

### 22 beyond June 13. There are hundreds of documents in theTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 27 1 docket, and additional time is necessary for a 

### 2 comprehensive review. AFPM recommends 90 days after 

### 3 publication of this proposal in the Federal Register. 

### 4Thank you. 

### 5MR. GRUNDLER: Right on time. Thank you, Mr. 

### 6 Hogan. 

### 7Mr. Stanton? 

### 8 MR. STANTON: Yes, good morning. My name is 

### 9 Mike Stanton. I'm President and CEO of the Association 

### 10 of Global Auto makers. We represent 15 international 

### 11motor vehicle manufacturers, a number of original 

### 12 equipment suppliers, and other automotive related trade 

### 13 associations. 

### 14And it's hard to believe it's been nearly a 

### 15 year and a half since we were here in Philadelphia 

### 16 providing testimony on the proposed standards for 

### 17 greenhouse gas emissions and fuel economy. And in that 

### 18 testimony, we emphasized the need for uniformity. Auto 

### 19 makers need to be able to manufacture and sell vehicles 

### 20 that are compliant in all 50 States. The benefits of 

### 21 producing one fleet for sale in all 50 States is 

### 22 critically important and provides real and significantTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 28 1 health and environmental benefits for our Nation. 

### 2Today we have returned to consider another of 

### 3 the President's goals: to reduce criteria pollutant 

### 4 emissions under the Tier 3 rule. Global auto makers 

### 5 and its members have supported the Administration's 

### 6 effort to develop these standards. And while 

### 7 challenging, the proposed standards are feasible and 

### 8 provide the necessary flexibility and lead time. 

### 9 But these standards cannot be met with 

### 10 vehicle changes alone, and the Tier 3 proposal 

### 11 recognizes another critical component in reducing 

### 12 vehicle emissions, and that is fuel quality, or, more 

### 13 specifically, the sulfur content in gasoline. We 

### 14 believe the proposed fuel standards for a nationwide 

### 15 supply of clean, ultra-low sulfur gasoline is critical 

### 16 for auto makers to meet the new and highly stringent 

### 17 vehicle emission standards. We support the 10 parts 

### 18 per million average and a low cap for sulfur and 

### 19 gasoline. 

### 20 Ultra-low sulfur gasoline has been available 

### 21 in California for years, and the ability to comply with 

### 22 emissions standards in California is premised on theTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 29 1 use of such fuel, recognizing the need to treat the 

### 2 vehicle and the fuel as a system. In addition to 

### 3 needing ultra-low sulfur fuel to achieve the proposed 

### 4 emission standards, ultra-low sulfur fuel is also 

### 5 critical to auto manufacturers' effort to meet the 

### 6 combined 54.5 miles per gallon fuel economy and 

### 7 greenhouse gas emission standards by 2025. And, most 

### 8 importantly, the ultra-low sulfur fuel will provide 

### 9 immediate and substantial public health benefits from 

### 10 the existing fleet of nearly 250 billion vehicles on 

### 11 the road today. 

### 12According to the National Association of 

### 13 Clean Air Agencies, the impact on the fleet is 

### 14 equivalent to taking over 30 million vehicles off the 

### 15 road. And today vehicles are lasting longer, and the 

### 16 average age of all vehicles on the road is 11 years. 

### 17 While the proposed standards will be another great step 

### 18 in reducing the fleet's emissions, it will take time 

### 19 for fleet turnover to fully realize the benefits. In 

### 20 the meantime, the ability to immediately and directly 

### 21 reduce emissions from the vehicles on the road today by 

### 22 reducing sulfur and gasoline cannot be matched.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 30 1Thank you. 

### 2MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you. 

### 3 Mr. McCulloch, you're next. 

### 4MR. MCCULLOCH: Thank you and good morning. 

### 5 I want to thank the distinguished members of the panel 

### 6 for hosting this session today. My name is Rob 

### 7 McCulloch, and I'm Senior Policy and Legislative 

### 8 Advocate for the BlueGreen Alliance. 

### 9 The BlueGreen Alliance is a national 

### 10 partnership of America's largest labor unions and 

### 11 environmental organizations. Our partners include the 

### 12 United Autoworkers, United Steelworkers, and IUECWA, 

### 13 with deep membership in the auto industry, the supply 

### 14 chain, and the refining industry. Our environmental 

### 15 partners include the Sierra Club, NRDC, and the Union 

### 16 of Concerned Scientists, many of whom are here today to 

### 17 provide resounding testimony at this session. 

### 18 We'd first like to commend the Obama 

### 19 Administration and, specifically, the Environmental 

### 20 Protection Agency, for their outstanding leadership on 

### 21 reducing air pollution from passenger vehicles and 

### 22 trucks through a variety of innovative programs.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 31 1The Tier 3 program enhances a comprehensive 

### 2 Federal approach, making our vehicles more energy 

### 3 efficient and less polluting, to include a strong 

### 4 tailpipe rule established last year that will nearly 

### 5 double fuel efficiency of passenger vehicles by 2025 to 

### 6 54.5 miles per gallon. Also, the first every heavy 

### 7 duty standard, which by 2018 will improve commercial 

### 8 truck efficiency, between seven and 25 percent among 

### 9 classes. Since pollution reduction is strongly 

### 10 commensurate with efficiency gains, these efforts will 

### 11 also provide significant benefits to air quality and 

### 12 greenhouse gas mitigation. 

### 13 The Tier 3 program takes these measures a 

### 14 step further by reducing levels of harmful pollutants 

### 15 to include nitrous oxides, carbon monoxide, and 

### 16 particulate pollution, which have a direct impact on 

### 17 public health. America's working families deal 

### 18 firsthand with the impacts of dirty air in terms of 

### 19 missed work and school days, increased medical costs, 

### 20 and long-term health effects. 

### 21The BlueGreen Alliance strongly supports the 

### 22 proposed Tier 3 program since in addition to cleaningTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 32 1 our air and reducing harmful pollution, the cleaner 

### 2 fuels established in the program will help the 

### 3 automotive industry meet the ambitious goal of doubling 

### 4 fuel efficiency over the next decade. 

### 5Cleaner fuel makes emission systems more 

### 6 effective for both new vehicles and those currently in 

### 7 operation. In addition, making cleaner fuels widely 

### 8 available will help facilitate the development of new 

### 9 cost-effective technologies that will further improve 

### 10 fuel economy and greenhouse gas mitigation, ultimately 

### 11 saving consumers money. 

### 12The automotive industry has added more than 

### 13 200,000 jobs since 2009, and the U.S. auto market has 

### 14 had three consecutive years of double digit growth due 

### 15 in large part to rising demand for these cleaner cars 

### 16 in the market. "Gearing Up," our report last year by 

### 17 the BlueGreen Alliance and the American Council for an 

### 18 Energy Efficient Economy, estimated that meeting the 

### 19 54.5 mile per gallon rule will create more than 500,000 

### 20 jobs through the U.S. economy by 2030. Building 

### 21 cleaner, more efficient cars creates jobs by sending 

### 22money otherwise spent on fuel back into the U.S.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 33 1 economy, and also through the development and 

### 2 production of new, more efficient vehicle components. 

### 3 The Tier 3 standard will only bolster the 

### 4 auto industry's ability to meet a strong fuel 

### 5 efficiency standard and generate these net positive 

### 6 economic outcomes. Implementation of Tier 3 will also 

### 7 have a positive economic impact in other sectors as 

### 8 well. 

### 9 A report published last year by Navigant 

### 10 Economics found that on the demand side, gasoline 

### 11 prices to consumers would be negligible. On the supply 

### 12 side, upgrading refineries could create more than 

### 13 20,000 construction jobs and more than 5,000 jobs in 

### 14 refinery operations over the next three years of 

### 15 implementation. 

### 16 Additionally, the program includes critical 

### 17 elements that will allow refiners to deliver cleaner 

### 18 fuels to the market in an economical and timely manner, 

### 19 as well as provisions that ensure smaller manufacturers 

### 20 and refiners can reach compliance without unfair 

### 21 burden. It is critical to provide a mechanism like 

### 22 this to help industries transition to a cleanerTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 34 1 regulatory framework. For example, the advanced 

### 2 technology vehicle manufacturing loan program has 

### 3 created or sustained more than 40,000 jobs in the auto 

### 4 sector advancing fuel saving technologies. 

### 5We continue to -- we support the continued 

### 6 viability of ATBM and programs like it as a complement 

### 7 to efficiency and pollution standards like the 2025 

### 8 tailpipe standard and the proposed Tier 3 rule. As the 

### 9 Administration finalizes this innovative program, the 

### 10 BlueGreen Alliance looks forward to continuing our 

### 11 engagement with EPA and other stakeholders to implement 

### 12 the strong standard. 

### 13 American innovation and smart policies like 

### 14 Tier 3 will contribute significantly to healthier 

### 15 families, cleaner skies, a strong auto industry, and 

### 16 more opportunity for workers throughout the economy. 

### 17 The BlueGreen Alliance partnership is committed to 

### 18 demonstrating that cleaner cars and cleaner fuels are 

### 19 win-wins for America. 

### 20 Thank you for your time. 

### 21MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you. 

### 22Mr. Kubsh, you're next.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 35 1DR. KUBSH: Good morning. My name is Dr. Joe 

### 2 Kubsh. I'm the Executive Director of the Manufacturers 

### 3 of Emission Controls Association, or MECA. MECA is 

### 4pleased to provide comments in support of EPA's 

### 5 proposed Tier 3 light duty vehicle emission and fuel 

### 6 standards. These proposals when finalized will reset 

### 7 the bar for state of the art exhaust and evaporative 

### 8 emission controls for light duty vehicles through 2025. 

### 9 The proposals also require the oil industry to produce 

### 10 and sell ultra-low sulfur gasoline that will result in 

### 11 immediate and significant emission reductions from the 

### 12 hundreds of millions of light duty vehicles operating 

### 13 every day on America's highways, and ensure future fuel 

### 14 efficient gasoline vehicles can comply with EPA's 

### 15 proposed Tier 3 emission limits. 

### 16 MECA applauds EPA for developing a Tier 3 

### 17 proposal that will establish a national set of exhaust 

### 18 and evaporative emission standards by largely 

### 19 harmonizing their proposal with California's LEV III 

### 20 requirements. MECA is a non-profit association of the 

### 21 world's leading manufacturers of emission control 

### 22 technology for mobile sources. Our members have overTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 36 1 40 years of experience and a proven track record in 

### 2 developing and manufacturing emission control 

### 3 technology for a wide variety of on road and off road 

### 4 vehicles. 

### 5The mobile source emission control industry 

### 6 has general hundreds of billion dollars in U.S. 

### 7 economic activity since 1975, and supports 

### 8 approximately 65,000 U.S. jobs, mostly in product 

### 9 development and manufacturing. 

### 10 MECA agreed with EPA staff assessment that 

### 11 achieving the proposed Tier 3 exhaust and evaporative 

### 12mission standards and associated emission reductions 

### 13 are both technically feasible and cost effective. This 

### 14 fact is clearly demonstrated by more than two million 

### 15 super ultra-low emission vehicle and partial zero 

### 16 emission vehicle compliant light duty vehicles that 

### 17 have been sold in the U.S. market since these near zero 

### 18 emission gasoline vehicles were first introduced more 

### 19 than 10 years ago. 

### 20 This technology base of advanced three-way 

### 21 catalyst, exhaust hydrocarbon absorbent materials, high 

### 22 cell density sub straits, emission system thermalTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 37 1management strategies, secondary air injection systems, 

### 2 advanced carbon canisters, advanced low fuel permeation 

### 3 materials, and air intake hydrocarbon absorbent 

### 4materials that have already been commercialized for a 

### 5 variety of PZEV gasoline vehicle applications can be 

### 6 extended and further optimized to allow all light duty 

### 7 and medium duty gasoline vehicles to achieve the 

### 8 exhaust and evaporative mission reductions needed to 

### 9 comply with the Tier 3 proposals. 

### 10 In addition, advanced diesel emission control 

### 11 technologies, including diesel particulate filters, 

### 12 lean NOx absorbers, and selected catalytic reduction 

### 13 catalysts, will be combined with future advanced diesel 

### 14 engines to allow light duty diesel vehicles to achieve 

### 15 the proposed Tier 3 emission limits, including EPA's 

### 16 proposed Tier 3, Bin 30 exhaust standards. 

### 17A critically important element to ensuring 

### 18 that the future gasoline vehicles will be able to 

### 19 comply with these proposed Tier 3 emission limits is 

### 20 EPA's proposed reduction of gasoline fuel sulfur levels 

### 21 to a 10 ppm national average starting in 2017. 

### 22 Numerous published studies have documented fuel sulfurTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 38 1 related deactivation of three-way catalysts that are 

### 2 the primary exhaust emission control technology used on 

### 3 light duty and medium duty gasoline vehicles. 

### 4As Mr. Grundler stated, EPA has released a 

### 5 thorough and well-designed sulfur effect study on 81 

### 6 in-use Tier 3 light duty gasoline vehicles that clearly 

### 7 show significant reductions in criteria pollutants in 

### 8 comparing emission performance on gasoline with 28 ppm 

### 9 sulfur versus five ppm sulfur. 

### 10 Work authored by Umicore in a 2011 Society of 

### 11Automotive Engineers Technical Paper shows similar 

### 12 significant emission benefits on a 2000 model year PZEV 

### 13 vehicle, operated with three ppm sulfur gasoline versus 

### 14 33 ppm sulfur gasoline. In a MECA study published in a 

### 15 2007 SAE paper, an advanced three-way catalyst system 

### 16 installed on a large V-8 powered SUV showed clear 

### 17 evidence of sulfur deactivation and successive FTP 

### 18 testing with aged catalysts using 17 ppm sulfur 

### 19 gasoline. 

### 20 FTP emissions for this full-size SUV started 

### 21 at the proposed Tier 3, Bin 50 levels, and increased to 

### 22 slightly above proposed Bin 70 levels by the third FTPTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 39 1 test, and emissions increased more than 80 percent over 

### 2 three FTP tests. 

### 3 Sulfur deactivation of three-way catalysts 

### 4 negatively impacts the active precious metal catalysts, 

### 5 oxygen storage materials, and other activity promoters 

### 6 found in these sophisticated catalysts. The coverage 

### 7 and negative impacts of sulfur poisons on three-way 

### 8 catalysts depends in part on the temperature history of 

### 9 the catalytic converters found on the vehicle. Exhaust 

### 10 temperatures are expected to COO in the future as 

### 11manufacturers reduce vehicle waste heat to meet future 

### 12 vehicle fuel efficiency and greenhouse gas standards. 

### 13 These cooler converter operating temperatures 

### 14 cause catalysts to accumulate higher amounts of sulfur 

### 15 poisons with today's gasoline sulfur levels, resulting 

### 16 in higher emission levels of pollutants like 

### 17 hydrocarbons and NOx. 

### 18 MR. GRUNDLER: Time is up, Joe. 

### 19 DR. KUBSH: Thank you. 

### 20 MR. GRUNDLER: Mr. Minott, you have the last 

### 21 word on this panel. 

### 22MR. MINOTT: Thank you. My name is JoeTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 40 1 Minott, M-I-N-O-T-T, and I'm the Executive Director of 

### 2 the Clean Air Council headquartered here in 

### 3 Philadelphia. 

### 4I welcome you to Philadelphia and thank you 

### 5 for allowing me this opportunity to testify today. It 

### 6 is particularly fitting that the EPA is holding this 

### 7 hearing in Philadelphia, home to the Philadelphia 

### 8 refinery that used to be known as a Sunoco refinery, 

### 9 which supplies the East Coast with roughly one-quarter 

### 10 of its gasoline. 

### 11More than one in three Americans still live 

### 12 in the areas where air pollution levels exceed at least 

### 13 one Federal health standard, and automobiles are a 

### 14major part of the problem. NOx is the most important 

### 15 contributor to elevated ozone levels throughout the 

### 16 northeastern United States, and is the key precursor to 

### 17 find particulate matter formation. 

### 18 The standards for controlling soot pollution 

### 19 from passenger vehicles are key to reducing the health 

### 20 impacts of poor air quality, including asthma attacks, 

### 21 respiratory problems, and premature death. Labor, 

### 22 environmental health advocates, environmental justiceTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 41 1 advocates, car manufacturers, and consumer groups all 

### 2 support the proposed rule. The oil industry, which has 

### 3 historically vastly over-estimated the cost of 

### 4 compliance with environmental regulations, stands alone 

### 5 in opposing the rule. 

### 6 The proposed rule is particularly important 

### 7 for the Council's environmental justice work in 

### 8 Philadelphia's low income communities. Please remember 

### 9 as you listen today to the many voices for or against 

### 10 this proposed rule that you are being hosted in 

### 11 Philadelphia, the American city with the highest rate 

### 12 of deep poverty, people with incomes below half of the 

### 13 poverty line of any of the Nation's 10 most populous 

### 14 cities. 

### 15The reason I mention this fact at the start 

### 16 of my testimony is that members of low income 

### 17 neighborhoods live closest to refineries and major 

### 18 highways. These are also the neighborhoods that have 

### 19 the highest asthma rates and the least access to health 

### 20 care. These are the neighborhoods most in need of the 

### 21 environmental benefits provided by this rule. 

### 22The Council applauds EPA's efforts to proposeTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 42 1 the Tier 3 rules. The proposed rules will reduce the 

### 2 allowable amount of sulfur and gasoline, and will help 

### 3 an automobile's pollution control system work more 

### 4 efficiently, which, in turn, would allow it to trap 

### 5more pollution from emitting into the ambient air. 

### 6 More specifically, the proposed rules would 

### 7 reduce the refinery annual average sulfur limit in 

### 8 gasoline from 30 parts per million to 10 parts per 

### 9 million, which is a 66 percent reduction. And further, 

### 10 the rules would reduce the fuel vapor emissions to 

### 11 nearly nothing. According to the Union of Concerned 

### 12 Scientists, the expected air pollution reductions from 

### 13 the proposed rules are equivalent to removing 33 

### 14million cars from the road. 

### 15The proposed rules are cost effective. 

### 16 Please keep in mind that the American public has been 

### 17 subsidizing the cost of gasoline by not forcing 

### 18 refineries to account for the public health and 

### 19 environmental harm caused by dirty gasoline. While the 

### 20 rules may raise the cost of gasoline by a mere penny 

### 21 per gallon, the rules are estimated to produce up to 

### 22 $23 billion in health benefits by 2030.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 43 1EPA estimates that the proposed rules would 

### 2 prevent up to 2,400 premature deaths, 3,200 hospital 

### 3 visits, and 22,000 asthma attacks a year. Furthermore, 

### 4 the proposed rules would bring the United States as a 

### 5 whole in line with gasoline sulfur levels already being 

### 6 achieved in Japan, South Korea, and most of Europe, as 

### 7 well as the State of California, which is in the United 

### 8 States for those that don't know that. 

### 9 [Laughter.] 

### 10 MR. MINOTT: The proposed rules will also 

### 11 have an economic benefit. Operating and maintaining 

### 12 new refining equipment will create over 5,000 permanent 

### 13 jobs, and installing new refining equipment will create 

### 14more than 24,000 new jobs over the next three years. 

### 15 These are good paying American jobs. 

### 16 NOx reductions from this proposed rule will 

### 17 benefit public health and reduce damage caused by acid 

### 18 deposition, reduce coastal rain eutrophication, and 

### 19 reduce visibility impairment. Not a bad deal. 

### 20 The Council applauds EPA's proposed reduction 

### 21 of the annual average sulfur limits from 38 to 10 parts 

### 22 per million. I'm going to skip this.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 44 1The Alliance of Automobile Manufacturers, 

### 2 which includes BMW Group, Ford Motor Company, and 

### 3 others, has publicly stated that it supports "the 

### 4 lowest possible sulfur content at retail for uniformity 

### 5 at the pump for planning future technologies, and also 

### 6 to get the immediate benefit of existing vehicles as 

### 7 well as future ones, reducing sulfur poisoning of the 

### 8 catalyst and, therefore, minimizing exhaust emissions 

### 9 of the vehicle." 

### 10 Bill Becker, the Executive Director of the 

### 11 National Association of Clean Air Agencies, a man not 

### 12 given to hyperbole, stated, "There is not another air 

### 13 pollution control strategy that we know of that will 

### 14produce as substantial, cost effective, and expeditious 

### 15 emission reductions." 

### 16 Thank you. 

### 17MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you very much. Let me 

### 18 see if my colleagues have any questions for the panel. 

### 19 [No response.] 

### 20 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you very much. Let me 

### 21 invite panel number two to come up. 

### 22Panel two consists of Tim Johnson -- at leastTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 45 1 you didn't know, Tim, we added you -- Frank O'Donnell, 

### 2 Kevin Stewart, Patrick Kelly, Phillip Blakeman, Julie 

### 3 Becker, Jennifer McIntyre, Allison Chin, and Luke 

### 4 Tonachel. Welcome. Please fill out your place card. 

### 5Mr. O'Donnell, why don't you lead us off? 

### 6 MR. O'DONNELL: I'd be delighted. Thank you 

### 7 very much. Good morning. I'm Frank O'Donnell, 

### 8 President of Clean Air Watch, a national non-profit 

### 9 organization aimed at promoting clean air cheaply 

### 10 through education. 

### 11Clean Air Watch is delighted to be here to 

### 12 support EPA's Tier 3 proposal. When it comes to clean 

### 13 air, this is the mother of all no-brainers. This plan 

### 14 would mean cleaner air and better health. Indeed we 

### 15 believe this is the single most effective step the EPA 

### 16 can take right now to reduce dangerous smog levels 

### 17 around the Nation. It would be like taking 33 million 

### 18 cars off the road. 

### 19 This plan would also reduce deadly particle 

### 20 soot pollution, reduce asthma attacks, premature death, 

### 21 create thousands of jobs, and enable technologies to 

### 22 help us get better gas mileage, all for a cost thatTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 46 1 credible studies put at a mere penny a gallon for 

### 2 gasoline. I think we'd all agree a penny is a pittance 

### 3 to pay for cleaner air. 

### 4There's no wonder this plan is supported by 

### 5 such a broad and diverse group: public health groups, 

### 6 environmental, consumer, science groups, State and 

### 7 local environmental officials, the auto industry both 

### 8 domestic and foreign, the makers of pollution control 

### 9 equipment, the United Auto Workers. Clean Air Watch is 

### 10 delighted to be in such esteemed company. Indeed, 

### 11 every relevant stakeholder group supports this 

### 12 initiative with one exception: the oil industry and 

### 13 some allied alleged think tanks that some might refer 

### 14 to as front groups. 

### 15I'll just note that they're wrong. You're 

### 16 going to hear today, I believe, from Navigant, who's 

### 17 going to critique some of the oil industry's current 

### 18 cost projections on this study, so I will hope that 

### 19 you'll listen carefully and then leave it to them. But 

### 20 I'd like to look at some of the past examples of what I 

### 21 would call crying wolf by the oil industry. Let's 

### 22 consider a few examples where they've been wrong.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 47 1When EPA proposed a phase out of lead in 

### 2 gasoline in the 1970s, the oil industry claimed there 

### 3 was no public health advantage to be gained, and that 

### 4 this would cause supply shortages. Not only was this 

### 5 sky is falling prediction dead wrong, we know now it 

### 6 was one of the best steps for public health ever made 

### 7 by the EPA. Taking lead out of gas reduced the risk of 

### 8 lead toxicity for hundreds of thousands of children. 

### 9 It also decreased the risk of heart attack and stroke. 

### 10 Oh, and we didn't have those supply shortages. 

### 11In 1999, when EPA proposed the so-called Tier 

### 12 2 standards in allied sulfur and gas reductions, once 

### 13 again the oil industry claimed that clean up wasn't 

### 14 needed, and it would cause shut downs and supply 

### 15 shortages. In fact, in this case they even said it 

### 16 would threaten national security. Well, of course 

### 17 these problems didn't happen either. It was sheer 

### 18 nonsense. 

### 19 Let's take a third example. In the year 2000 

### 20 after EPA proposed clean diesel fuel standards, the oil 

### 21 industry again claimed -- now, can you guess -- that 

### 22 the cleanup wasn't needed, and it was cause refineryTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 48 1 shutdowns and supply shortages. Guess what? The exact 

### 2 opposite happened. The U.S. now exports clean diesel 

### 3 fuel because EPA stuck to its guns. 

### 4So I would just like to say let's learn from 

### 5 the past. This is not the United States of Amnesia, I 

### 6 hope. Let's remember the oil industry has cried wolf 

### 7 so many times in the past, always been wrong. It's 

### 8 doing it again here. Let's consider the massive health 

### 9 benefits of this plan that a lot of other witnesses 

### 10 have already talked about. We know that they dwarf the 

### 11 very modest costs. 

### 12We urge EPA to do the right thing here. Move 

### 13 ahead. Set the final Tier 3 standards and vehicle 

### 14 emission standards this year. And please listen to the 

### 15 cry of breathers for cleaner air, not the wolf cries of 

### 16 the oil industry. 

### 17Thank you very much. 

### 18 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you, Mr. O'Donnell. 

### 19 Dr. Tim Johnson, you're next. 

### 20 DR. JOHNSON: Thank you for allowing me to 

### 21 testify in support of this very important public health 

### 22 and policy proposal to dramatically and efficientlyTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 49 1 reduce toxic emissions from vehicles and fuel. 

### 2My credentials are somewhat unique. I have 

### 3 formally been tracking merging light duty, heavy duty, 

### 4 and non-road vehicle emissions for more than 15 years, 

### 5 emerging technologies, and have a valuable and unique 

### 6 insight into what is coming in the future of emissions 

### 7 and technologies. I read or listen to more than 400 

### 8 technical papers a year on the topic, interact with all 

### 9 the leading experts in the industry, including the oil 

### 10 industry, analyze the data, and then write widely-read 

### 11 technical review papers for journals, book chapters, 

### 12 and top caliber technical conferences. 

### 13 When I ask people how much more they'd be 

### 14 willing to pay for a gasoline car that was virtually 

### 15 non-polluting, the answer always comes back a couple 

### 16 thousand dollars, 30 cents a gallon, but only if it's 

### 17mandated. People are invariably shocked when I mention 

### 18 to them that it would cost only a few hundred dollars 

### 19 more for the car, and only a couple cents a gallon, if 

### 20 anything. They universally reply, do it. The Tier 3 

### 21 proposal is a bargain at a nine to one benefit cost 

### 22 ratio to society, and has strong public support.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 50 1Let me get technical. The fundamental 

### 2 catalyst problem we are talking about here is that 

### 3 sulfur is extremely surface active. It's unique to 

### 4 these types of chemicals. It absorbs readily on active 

### 5 catalyst sites, blocking the amazing action we need and 

### 6 want to clean up toxins. Surface active species are 

### 7 essentially -- are especially critical in low 

### 8 concentration ranges where most of the valuable active 

### 9 sites are sulfur poisoned in the sub 20 ppm sulfur 

### 10 range, depending on catalyst design. Dropping from 30 

### 11 to 10 ppm sulfur can have a huge impact on catalyst 

### 12 performance and durability because of this fundamental 

### 13 physical chemistry behavior. 

### 14To be sure, we have cars today that are 

### 15meeting the Tier 3 average fleet requirements with 30 

### 16 ppm sulfur fuel. However, all these cars are small and 

### 17 compact. It is a very different story in trying to get 

### 18 a large vehicle to Tier 3 average emission levels. Not 

### 19 only are the catalysts compromised, but the sensors are 

### 20 affected, causing complexities in on board diagnostics, 

### 21 which are so critical to proper fleet emissions 

### 22monitoring. We demand 150,000 durability in our cars.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 51 1High sulfur fuel makes this very difficult. 

### 2We also have catalyst formulations that are 

### 3 not as sensitive to sulfur as others. This is partly 

### 4 the result of unique formulations derived from -- 

### 5 through catalyst R&D. These formulations are usually 

### 6 intellectual property of the developers. They do not 

### 7 have 100 percent of the market share. 

### 8 Further, for many reasons, the catalyst might 

### 9 be designed differently to meet the the market or 

### 10 technical requirements, or be placed in different 

### 11 conditions. We all drive different vehicles with 

### 12 different engines and different designs. The field is 

### 13 very complex. This is why we need the low sulfur fuel 

### 14 because the technologies and engines are becoming so 

### 15 complex. 

### 16 I just attended the SAE International Annual 

### 17 Congress in Detroit. Fantastic. Developments are 

### 18 coming very quickly, but -- very important -- most 

### 19 researchers are using clean fuels in their development 

### 20 of engines and catalysts. We will see commercialized 

### 21 gasoline engines by 2020 that consume 20 to 30 percent 

### 22 less fuel. These new engines are complex, and many areTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 52 1 lean, like diesel. Lean NOx mitigation for gasoline 

### 2 requires less than 10 ppm sulfur fuel. It doesn't make 

### 3 sense to tie one arm behind the back of the auto 

### 4 engineers by requiring them to use relatively dirty 

### 5 fuel. It's essential the U.S. refinery industry enter 

### 6 the 21st century by providing an average of 100 ppm 

### 7 fuel. Europe and Japan have had it for years. China 

### 8 is doing so now, and will have it throughout the 

### 9 country in 2017. And India and Brazil are considering 

### 10 moving in this direction. 

### 11It would be shameful if the U.S. still had 30 

### 12 ppm sulfur and these countries have clean fuel. They 

### 13 all realize less than 10 ppm sulfur fuel is critical to 

### 14 clean vehicles. It all ties together. 

### 15Thank you. 

### 16 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you, Mr. Johnson. Dr. 

### 17 Johnson, I should say. 

### 18 Next up will be Mr. Stewart. Mr. Kelly, 

### 19 you're on deck. 

### 20 MR. STEWART: Good morning. I thank the 

### 21 hearing panel for your work here today. I'm Kevin 

### 22 Stewart. I serve as Director of Environmental HealthTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 53 1 for the American Lung Association of the Mid-Atlantic. 

### 2And I am representing not only the three million in 

### 3 our four-state service area who suffer from chronic 

### 4 lung disease, but also tens of millions more who desire 

### 5 to breathe clean air and so protect their good health. 

### 6 And we thank the Environmental Protection 

### 7 Agency for its proposal of these long-awaited and much 

### 8 needed Tier 3 motor vehicle emission and fuel 

### 9 standards. And we most strongly insist and on the 

### 10 ground of the health you will protect and the lives you 

### 11 will save, that the EPA finalize and adopt these 

### 12 standards before New Year's Day 2014. 

### 13 According to the American Lung Association 

### 14 "State of the Air" report released today, in our four

### 15 state service area of Delaware, New Jersey, 

### 16 Pennsylvania, and West Virginia, over 19 million 

### 17 people, almost 80 percent of the population, live in a 

### 18 county or a metro area earning at least one F for ozone 

### 19 or daily or annual fine particle pollution. 

### 20 Eighteen million of these live in one of 

### 21 eight metro area listed among the worst 25 in the 

### 22 country for one or more of these pollutant measures.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 54 1And more than half of these populations fall into at 

### 2 least one of the sensitive groups that research is 

### 3 clearly recognized to be at increased risk from air 

### 4pollution: infants, children, teens, and seniors, 

### 5 people with chronic lung and cardiovascular disease, 

### 6 people with diabetes, those living in poverty. These 

### 7 are the people at special risk, and in our region it is 

### 8 plain that they are among those most seriously at risk 

### 9 in the entire country. 

### 10 In our service area alone, we estimate, based 

### 11 upon the analysis in this month's other report by the 

### 12 American Lung Association, "A Penny for Prevention: 

### 13 The Case for Cleaner Gasoline and Vehicle Standards," 

### 14 that by the year 2030, implemented Tier 3 standards 

### 15 would provide annually on the order of 400 premature 

### 16 deaths, 275 respiratory related ER visits and 

### 17 hospitalizations, 75,000 acute respiratory symptom 

### 18 days, including asthma days, half a million missed work 

### 19 or school days, and would save costs of perhaps over $3 

### 20 billion, again annually. 

### 21The air pollution we're talking about 

### 22 controlling is not inconsiderable. In the nationalTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 55 1 inventory, about 20 percent volatile organic compounds, 

### 2 a third of nitrogen oxides, and over half of carbon 

### 3 monoxide are emitted by the single sector of highway 

### 4 vehicles. Yet we can make a serious dent in even these 

### 5 large chunks. Adoption of the Tier 3 standards would 

### 6 be equivalent to taking nearly one in seven vehicles 

### 7 off our roads. 

### 8 In the "State of the Air" report, there are 

### 9 already some signs that we may be approaching a steady 

### 10 state situation with respect to control of pollutants, 

### 11 such as fine particle pollution and ozone, under the 

### 12 current control regime. Not only is there no guarantee 

### 13 that we as a Nation will continue making good progress 

### 14 toward meeting air quality standards, but there is some 

### 15 danger that we will fail to meet them at all if we do 

### 16 not act. 

### 17Indeed, as the October 2011 report on this 

### 18 subject by the National Association of Clean Air 

### 19 Agencies very plainly points out, the ability of States 

### 20 and localities to attain the 2008 ozone standard is 

### 21 tied directly to timely promulgation and implementation 

### 22 of Tier 3 standards.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 56 1Furthermore, the American Lung Association 

### 2 has been on record for years in its position that the 

### 3 current National Ambient Air Quality Standards for 

### 4 ozone mpm are all inadequate to protect public health, 

### 5 let alone contain a margin of safety that the law 

### 6 requires. It is for this reason that the American Lung 

### 7 Association and other medical groups support 

### 8 strengthening these standards as follows: the eight

### 9 hour ozone standard to 60 parts per billion, the 24- 

### 10 hour fine pm standard to no more than 25 micrograms per 

### 11 cubic meter, the annual pm standard to at most 11 

### 12micrograms per cubic meter. 

### 13 Therefore, if we ensure that the NAAQS follow 

### 14 the law, i.e., so that they truly protect health in the 

### 15 way that the Clean Air Act requires, then this 

### 16 underscores NAAQS' point and makes the case for the 

### 17 Tier 3 rule all the more strongly. Remember, those 

### 18 millions of people already at risk, already living 

### 19 within a cloud of air pollution, protected only by 

### 20 standards inadequate to the task. These people, real 

### 21 parents and children, real neighbors and co-workers and 

### 22 friends, these people deserve relief from thatTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 57 1 pollution's burden on disease and death. 

### 2A strong Tier 3 standard is clearly part of 

### 3 that solution. It is urgent that you adopt this rule, 

### 4 implement it, and bring some much relief. 

### 5Thank you. 

### 6 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you, Mr. Stewart. 

### 7Mr. Kelly? 

### 8 MR. KELLY: Good morning, and thank you for 

### 9 providing the opportunity for API to testify at today's 

### 10 hearing on the Tier 3 rulemaking. I am Patrick Kelly 

### 11 with the American Petroleum Institute. API is the 

### 12 national trade association representing all segments of 

### 13 the U.S. oil and gas industry. 

### 14America's petroleum refining industry is a 

### 15 strategic asset, invaluable asset, for the United 

### 16 States. Maintaining a strong domestic refining 

### 17 industry is critical to the Nation's economic security. 

### 18 This rulemaking an have significant impacts on 

### 19 domestic refiners which are already heavily regulated. 

### 20 API opposes the requirement to further reduce 

### 21 average gasoline sulfur with this Tier 3 regulation. 

### 22 This rulemaking is discretionary, and API has seriousTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 58 1 doubts as to the Agency's justification for it. 

### 2API commissioned studies on the costs and 

### 3 benefits associated with further reductions in gasoline 

### 4 sulfur content, and found that they are not necessary 

### 5 for meeting more stringent vehicle emission standards, 

### 6 will yield little air quality benefits, and will impose 

### 7 enormous costs. 

### 8 API has serious concerns with the EPA process 

### 9 for developing this rule. We have been insisting EPA 

### 10 demonstrate a scientific justification for two and a 

### 11 half years. One week ago today, EPA dumped over 600 

### 12 documents into the docket, and prior to publishing this 

### 13 rule in the Federal Register, EPA published the comment 

### 14 deadline that gives us very little time to provide 

### 15meaningful input. 

### 16 EPA needs to extend, and we request that the 

### 17 EPA extends this comment deadline, to at least 90 days 

### 18 after the MPRM is published in the Federal Register or 

### 19 about mid-August. EPA needs to be transparent in 

### 20 rulemakings and not circumvent public participation in 

### 21 the process. 

### 22Reducing gasoline sulfur to an average of 10Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 59 1 parts per million is expensive. Research API shared 

### 2 with the Agency shows nearly $10 billion in capital 

### 3 costs. The annual compliance cost is about $2.4 

### 4 billion, or six to nine cents per gallon in marginal 

### 5 costs. EPA should not consider these costs in a 

### 6 vacuum. Refiners need to balance these expenses with 

### 7 the cumulative costs of other Federal and States 

### 8 regulations. 

### 9 API assessed the air quality benefits of the 

### 10 proposed standards and found the requirements would 

### 11 yield only very little additional reduction in ozone 

### 12 over the current regulations. The Tier 2 rule was a 

### 13 costly rule, but it yielded a measurable air quality 

### 14 benefit that continues to be realized as the fleet 

### 15 turns over. The prospect of spending an equivalent 

### 16 amount of money for a rule of a negligible air quality 

### 17 benefit just doesn't make sense. 

### 18 Auto makers insist they need 10 ppm gasoline 

### 19 to enable lean burn GDI engines, and yet in Europe and 

### 20 Japan where 10 ppm fuel is available, lean burn GDI 

### 21 engine penetration peaked at about two percent and then 

### 22 tailed off. Research shows it maxing out at aboutTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 60 1 three percent of the U.S. fleet. Diesel sulfur was 

### 2 kept at 15 ppm to enable an emissions control 

### 3 technology that never took off in the marketplace. 

### 4 Don't make the same mistake with gasoline. Auto makers 

### 5 can meet the emission standards without further 

### 6 reductions to gasoline sulfur. 

### 7EPA's three-year lead time is grossly 

### 8 inadequate. Six years is workable. Five years is the 

### 9 absolute minimum. Three years is insufficient to 

### 10 ensure against market disruptions. Refiners are able 

### 11 to operate for about five years between turnarounds, 

### 12 which is the most efficient time to make major changes. 

### 13 A three-year lead time means that normal maintenance 

### 14 schedules are likely to be disrupted, potentially 

### 15 impacting gasoline supply and increasing the overall 

### 16 cost. 

### 17The so-called flexibilities proposed in the 

### 18 rule do little to offset the burden of compliance. 

### 19 Small refinery exceptions are of limited utility if 

### 20 pipelines set lower specifications, which is what 

### 21 happened in the Tier 3 rulemaking. The benefits of 

### 22 averaging banking and trading of the Tier 2 rule areTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 61 1 not comparable to Tier 2. The opportunity to generate 

### 2 credits is limited by a refinery's existing equipment 

### 3 and configuration. Tier 2 sulfur credits are still in 

### 4 circulation, and it would be beneficial, and we request 

### 5 that EPA publish aggregate data on the remaining Tier 2 

### 6 sulfur credit balances in order to determine to what 

### 7 extent an ABT program would provide or could provide a 

### 8 benefit. 

### 9 With such a short lead time, the opportunity 

### 10 to generate sufficient credits to cover both the Tier 2 

### 11 requirements and bank credits for Tier 3 between now 

### 12 and January 2017 will be limited. Maintaining the 

### 13 current sulfur cap is a reasonable approach, but won't 

### 14 lower costs very much. The EPA should set a new 

### 15 certification fuel as E10, not E15. It will be likely 

### 16 the predominant fuel in the marketplace. I'm skipping 

### 17 quickly. 

### 18 Also on the certifying in a higher octane and 

### 19 higher ethanol content fuel, EPA should not go ahead of 

### 20 the requisite research and collaboration necessary to 

### 21 set new fuel specifications. And I'm out of time, so 

### 22 I'll skip my -- thank you for doing ppms.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 62 1MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you, Mr. Kelly. 

### 2[Laughter.] 

### 3 MR. GRUNDLER: Dr. Blakeman, please. 

### 4DR. BLAKEMAN: Thanks. Thank you for the 

### 5 opportunity to speak today. I am Dr. Phil Blakeman. I 

### 6 am speaking today on behalf of Johnson Matthey, a 

### 7 catalyst company based just outside of Philadelphia. 

### 8 One of our main businesses is the development, design, 

### 9 and manufacture of catalytic systems for the removal of 

### 10 pollutants from vehicle and engine exhausts. And my 

### 11 role there is the technology director for that 

### 12 business. 

### 13 Johnson Matthey strongly supports the Tier 3 

### 14proposals made by the EPA. They make an important 

### 15 substantial improvement to the quality of the air we 

### 16 all breathe. Catalyst has since 1975 been instrumental 

### 17 in limiting harmful air pollutants and smog causing 

### 18 gasses, with evident benefits for us all. 

### 19 However, there are now more vehicles and more 

### 20 miles driven than ever before, offsetting some of the 

### 21 legislative improvements in emission abatement by sheer 

### 22 weight of numbers. The need for tightening of emissionTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 63 1 limits is still strong. 

### 2The catalyst technology Tier 3 proposal is 

### 3 across the whole vehicle fleet. That's gasoline and 

### 4 diesel vehicles. It exists today, and it's already in 

### 5 the marketplace. New generations of catalysts are 

### 6 continually being developed, and they have further 

### 7 enhancements and performances. Implementation of these 

### 8 catalyst technologies to meet Tier 3 proposals is what 

### 9 our industry thrives on. We have a long track record 

### 10 of achieving these tighter emissions limits 

### 11 successfully, and this proposal would be no different. 

### 12Furthermore, California has already set in 

### 13 motion its own tightened emission limits known as LEV 

### 14 III, which are very similar to the Tier 3 proposal. 

### 15 This means our industry already has no choice but to 

### 16 implement technologies for LEV II that will clearly 

### 17 also meet the Tier 3 proposed limits. Thus, the 

### 18 adoption of the Tier 3 proposals would bring 

### 19 efficiencies to the industry by having one common set 

### 20 of emissions to achieve for the U.S. market. 

### 21One of the important aspects of the Tier 3 

### 22 proposal is to reduce the sulfur level in the gasolineTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 64 1 fuel. Sulfur compounds cannot be transformed into 

### 2 something harmless in the way that a NOx molecule is, 

### 3 turning to NOx catalysts. Therefore, all sulfur 

### 4 emissions from the engine are bad for the environment, 

### 5 and the only way they can be prevented from entering 

### 6 the environment is by removal from the fuel itself. 

### 7Sulfur also poisons the efficiency of the 

### 8 catalyst for criteria emission control. To ensure that 

### 9 the full range of light duty vehicles comply with Tier 

### 10 3 proposals, both at time of certification and during 

### 11 their use in the real world, the proposed lower 

### 12 gasoline sulfur levels, 10 ppm average, are needed. 

### 13 The EPA has recently completed an excellent and 

### 14 extensive evaluation of sulfur effects on the current 

### 15 Tier 2 vehicle fleet that clearly shows significant 

### 16 emission benefits from reducing gasoline sulfur levels 

### 17 on those existing vehicles. 

### 18 And as we move to the future, vehicle 

### 19 manufacturers are working hard to meet greenhouse gas 

### 20 requirements. Exhaust temperatures are expected to get 

### 21 cooler, exacerbating these sulfur poisoning effects on 

### 22 the catalyst. This remaining clean fuel isTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 65 1 increasingly important as we move forward. 

### 2Having low sulfur fuel may also enable new 

### 3 technologies to be introduced, such as NOx absorber 

### 4 catalysts, which are leading catalyst technology for 

### 5 highly fuel efficient clean burning gasoline engines, 

### 6 and need these ultra-low sulfur fuel levels to function 

### 7 at peak effectiveness, and allow these engines to meet 

### 8 their fuel economy potential. Sulfur in diesel fuel is 

### 9 already limited to a maximum of 10 ppm for these 

### 10 reasons, and sulfur and gasoline should also be limited 

### 11 to the proposed 10 ppm average. 

### 12Adoption of this part of the Tier 3 proposal 

### 13 would bring the U.S. in line with Europe and Japan, who 

### 14 already have these low sulfur gasoline limits, and 

### 15 places like China who have committed to bringing in low 

### 16 sulfur gasoline by the end of 2017. 

### 17In summary, it is the view of Johnson Matthey 

### 18 that the Tier 3 emissions limits and fuel sulfur 

### 19 proposals will bring significant benefits to the public 

### 20 health and the environment. Thank you. 

### 21MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you very much. 

### 22Julie Becker?Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 66 1MS. BECKER: Good morning. My name is Julie 

### 2 Becker, and I'm Vice President for Environmental 

### 3 Affairs at the Alliance of Automobile Manufacturers, an 

### 4 association of 12 OEMs. It represents about 75 percent 

### 5 of the U.S. market. 

### 6 I want to thank Chris Grundler and his staff 

### 7 for holding this hearing and for all the many hours 

### 8 they have spent with our industry and with the other 

### 9 stakeholders to help us understand this very complex 

### 10 proposal. And I also want to thank the California Air 

### 11 Resources Board for its role in coordinating with EPA 

### 12 to help ensure harmonization of the LEV II and Tier 3 

### 13 regulations. 

### 14The Alliance appreciates the fact that EPA is 

### 15 working here to achieve one national program so that a 

### 16 vehicle can be tested once, certified once, and then 

### 17 sold anywhere in the United States. EPA's proposal 

### 18 would ensure needed fuel quality to enable both near 

### 19 zero emissions for new vehicles and reduced emissions 

### 20 for all vehicles already on the road today. 

### 21These rules are challenging. They require 

### 22 large investments. According to EPA, auto makers willTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 67 1 spend about $15 billion in just 10 years to meet the 

### 2 requirements of the proposed rule and effectively 

### 3 remove tailpipe emissions from the environmental 

### 4 equation. And according to EPA, this rule, combined 

### 5 with the fuel economy and greenhouse gas program would 

### 6 bring the auto industry's overall investment in the 

### 7 vehicle emission reduction programs through 2025 to 

### 8 more than $216 billion. That's 100 times the 

### 9 investment that the oil industry is being asked to make 

### 10 under this rulemaking. 

### 11So why do auto makers support this proposal? 

### 12Well, Tier 3 brings a harmonized approach, as you've 

### 13 heard today. It builds upon the successes we've had in 

### 14 the national greenhouse gas and fuel economy programs. 

### 15It stays true to the simple principle of providing the 

### 16 cleanest vehicles to everyone nationally. And it 

### 17 provides the fuels that we need. 

### 18 EPA acknowledges that reducing the sulfur 

### 19 content of gasoline to 10 part per million average is a 

### 20 hugely important component of the proposed rule. We 

### 21 agree. We know that sulfur inhibits the catalytic 

### 22 converter's ability to reduce emissions. Lower sulfurTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 68 1 fuels at the pump mean fewer exhaust emissions in the 

### 2 air. It's that simple. 

### 3 Further, sulfur reductions in the market 

### 4 fuels produce day one benefits. So while it will take 

### 5 a couple of decades for the current fleet to be 

### 6 replaced by Tier 3 compliant vehicles, reducing sulfur 

### 7 at the pump immediately will reduce emissions from 

### 8 every gasoline powered vehicle on our road, no matter 

### 9 how old. 

### 10 On the CAFÉ and greenhouse gas front, EPA has 

### 11 repeatedly said that it expects the majority of 

### 12 greenhouse gas emission reductions and the 

### 13 corresponding fuel economy increases will come from 

### 14 advancements in internal combustion engines, gasoline 

### 15 engines, and that cleaner fuels are needed to 

### 16 facilitate lean burn technology, a pathway towards more 

### 17 efficient gasoline internal combustion. To meet the 

### 18 challenging standards for greenhouse gas, auto makers 

### 19 will need to have every tool in the toolbox at their 

### 20 disposal, including lean burn. 

### 21One final point on sulfur. You've already 

### 22 heard it this morning, and that is that we have fallenTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 69 1 behind other countries. The proposed rule would help 

### 2 Americans to get gasoline with sulfur limits 

### 3 approaching 10 parts per million cap, which is like the 

### 4 retail sulfur -- the retail levels of sulfur already 

### 5 available in Europe and Asia. 

### 6 For years, the auto industry has worked to 

### 7 provide consumers with cleaner vehicles, and we've had 

### 8 terrific results. Already we've reduced smog forming 

### 9 emissions by 99 percent. The proposed rule, as you 

### 10 heard earlier, seeks to cut remaining emissions by 

### 11 about 70 percent. But as EPA explains, the ambitious 

### 12 goal requires both advanced catalytic converters and 

### 13 ultra-low sulfur fuels. 

### 14While much progress has been made, even more 

### 15 could be done to harmonize with California's rule, 

### 16 vehicle emission requirements to harmonize the 

### 17 certification fuels and to improve fuel quality. And 

### 18 we intend to respond to this very long and complex 

### 19 proposal with written comments that will contain 

### 20 specific constructive suggestions. 

### 21But our key message is this: EPA should 

### 22 continue to treat vehicles and their fuels as a systemTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 70 1 so that our clean vehicles can have the clean fuels 

### 2 they need. Thank you very much. 

### 3 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you, Ms. Becker. 

### 4Jennifer McIntyre? 

### 5MS. MCINTYRE: Good morning. My name is Jen 

### 6 McIntyre with Mom's Clean Air Force. The time has come 

### 7 to update our standards for passenger vehicles to 

### 8 better the health of American families. I strongly 

### 9 support the new Tier 3 standards and urge the timely 

### 10 implementation of the proposed rule. The rule has 

### 11 broad support from the United Auto Workers to the 

### 12 American Lung Association to the Union of Concerned 

### 13 Scientists. 

### 14We cannot continue to accept bad air days as 

### 15 a normal part of life. This rule would begin to 

### 16 improve air quality and result in significant health 

### 17 benefits for children and those with lung and heart 

### 18 problems. We know that in Pennsylvania, more than 

### 19 22,000 children attend schools that are located within 

### 20 200 meters of a major roadway. 

### 21Nothing can prepare a parent for the terror 

### 22 of watching a toddler unable to breathe during anTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 71 1 asthma event. Both of my young daughters suffered from 

### 2 frequent flare-ups when we lived close to I-95. We 

### 3 have since moved and their health is much better. Now 

### 4 they have flare-ups once or twice per year compared to 

### 5 once or twice per month. In order to open their 

### 6 airways during an asthma flare-up, strong and harmful 

### 7medications must be administered that have serious side 

### 8 effects. But breathing is more important, so the 

### 9 harmful medicines are taken by millions of children. 

### 10 Let's send a message to those children that 

### 11 we do care about their health and safety and quickly 

### 12 implement the new Tier 3 standards. Let's tell them 

### 13 they're worth much more than a penny per gallon. 

### 14Thank you for the this opportunity to 

### 15 comment. 

### 16 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you. 

### 17Allison Chin? 

### 18 MS. CHIN: Thank you for the opportunity to 

### 19 testify. I'm Allison Chin, President of the Sierra 

### 20 club. With 2.1 million members and supporters, the 

### 21 Sierra Club is the Nation's oldest and largest grass 

### 22 roots environmental organization. On behalf of all ofTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 72 1 our members, I want to applaud the Environmental 

### 2 Protection Agency for proposing strong Tier 3 cleaner 

### 3 tailpipe standards that will significantly reduce smog 

### 4 forming pollution, saving lives, preventing asthma 

### 5 attacks, and giving Americans cleaner air to breathe. 

### 6 Over the past decades, we have made 

### 7 substantial progress in cleaning our air, in part by 

### 8 transitioning from dirty fossil fuels to clean 

### 9 renewable energy. Still today, more than one in three 

### 10 Americans lives where the air is sometimes unsafe to 

### 11 breathe. Air pollution causes a host of serious life 

### 12 threatening health problems, including asthma, heart 

### 13 disease, cancer, neurological problems, and more. 

### 14Much of this health threatening pollution 

### 15 comes from our passenger cars and trucks, which remain 

### 16 the second largest source of smog forming pollution. 

### 17 These vehicles emit more than half of all carbon 

### 18 monoxide pollution and contribute significantly to 

### 19 deadly particulate matter and other pollution that 

### 20 causes asthma and other respiratory diseases. 

### 21The proposed Tier 3 standards will provide a 

### 22 wide array of benefits. I'd like to briefly touch on aTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 73 1 few. First, cleaner tailpipe standards will protect 

### 2 public health by requiring refiners to produce lower 

### 3 sulfur gasoline and by requiring auto makers to use 

### 4 advanced pollution control technology. Tier 3 

### 5 standards will produce substantial reductions in health 

### 6 threatening pollution. According to a study by the 

### 7 National Association of Clean Air Agencies, cleaner 

### 8 tailpipe standards have the potential to cut emissions 

### 9 of nitrogen oxides, carbon monoxide, and volatile 

### 10 organic compounds from passenger vehicles by 29, 38, 

### 11 and 26 percent, respectively, by 2030. 

### 12It's important to note that reducing the 

### 13 sulfur content of gasoline will have immediate health 

### 14 benefits when new standards go into effect in 2017. 

### 15 Cleaner burning gasoline will reduce emissions of 

### 16 nitrogen oxides from existing cars by more than 260,000 

### 17 tons, the equivalent of taking 33 million cars off the 

### 18 road. 

### 19 These pollution reductions will provide very 

### 20 real health benefits. According to the EPA, the 

### 21 proposed standards would prevent up to 2,400 premature 

### 22 deaths, 3,200 hospital visits, and 2,200 asthma attacksTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 74 1 annually by 2030. Further, the standards would prevent 

### 2 1.8 million lost school and work days. 

### 3 Secondly, cleaner tailpipe standards will 

### 4provide economic benefits. With cleaner air, the 

### 5 proposed standards will provide substantial health 

### 6 benefits. According to EPA, the annual monetized value 

### 7 of health benefits could be as large as $23 billion. 

### 8 Further, the new standards will bring more American 

### 9 jobs as parts suppliers develop and build new 

### 10 technologies and refiners and auto makers install it. 

### 11According to a study by Navigant Economics, 

### 12 implementation of cleaner tailpipe standards would 

### 13 create nearly 5,300 permanent jobs in the operation and 

### 14maintenance of new refining equipment, as well as more 

### 15 than 2,4000 new jobs over a three-year period as 

### 16 refineries install new equipment. 

### 17Third, only big oil opposes these health 

### 18 protecting standards. Everyone from auto makers and 

### 19 auto workers to public health agencies and the American 

### 20 public recognize the connection between cleaner cars, 

### 21 jobs, public health, and a stronger economy. The only 

### 22 ones opposed to these standards are oil companies thatTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 75 1 oppose anything that would require them to clean up 

### 2 their act. 

### 3 While the American Petroleum Institute's 

### 4 scare tactics claim that these standards would cause 

### 5 gas prices to skyrocket, independent studies have shown 

### 6 that these standards can be achieved for less than a 

### 7 penny a gallon. This is a clear case where we can 

### 8 clean our air, protect our public health, and create 

### 9 jobs by reducing pollution from our cars and trucks. 

### 10 In conclusion, the proposed cleaner tailpipe 

### 11 standards will substantially reduce health threatening 

### 12 pollution from our cars and trucks. By giving 

### 13 Americans cleaner air to breathe, these standards will 

### 14 save lives, prevent asthma attacks, and reduce lost 

### 15 work and school days. Further, developing 

### 16 manufacturing and installing advanced refinery and auto 

### 17 technologies will create jobs all while achieving the 

### 18 standards for less than a penny a gallon. I applaud 

### 19 the Environmental Protection Agency for proposing these 

### 20 strong Tier 3 cleaner tailpipe standards, and urge you 

### 21 to finalize them as soon as possible. 

### 22Thank you again for the opportunity toTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 76 1 testify. 

### 2MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you, Ms. Chin. 

### 3 Mr. Tonachel? 

### 4MR. TONACHEL: Good morning. Thank you for 

### 5 the opportunity to testify today. My name is Luke 

### 6 Tonachel, and I'm a Senior Analyst with the Energy and 

### 7 Transportation Program at the Natural Resources Defense 

### 8 Council. I am pleased to be here on behalf of NRDC's 

### 9 1.3 million members and online activists. 

### 10 The Tier 3 gasoline sulfur and clean vehicle 

### 11 standards proposed by EPA are common sense steps 

### 12 forward for public health and the environment. The 

### 13 Tier 3 standards are part of the solution to a problem 

### 14 that we know must be addressed. Over 100 million 

### 15 Americans are exposed to unhealthy air and live in 

### 16 areas that fail to attain one or more health-based 

### 17 ambient air quality standards. 

### 18 Considering these facts, EPA has an 

### 19 obligation to set stronger standards on vehicles and 

### 20 fuels to cut pollution that endangers public health and 

### 21 welfare. By proposing standards that reduce gasoline 

### 22 sulfur to 10 parts per million and tightening autoTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 77 1 emission standards, the Agency has taken the right 

### 2 approach, one that connects the vehicle emissions with 

### 3 the fuel and treats them as a system. It is clear that 

### 4 the U.S. will only achieve the largest cost-effective 

### 5 reductions from cars and trucks if both the vehicles 

### 6 and their fuel are cleaned up. 

### 7The oil industry, through their lobbying 

### 8 association of the American Petroleum Institute, has 

### 9 questioned the value of reducing sulfur from gasoline. 

### 10 The oil industry wants us to ignore the benefits of 

### 11 cleaning up gasoline, but the benefits are clear: 

### 12 cleaner gasoline will immediately cut hundreds of 

### 13 thousands of tons of smog forming emissions annually 

### 14 from the on road stock of vehicles as their exhaust 

### 15 systems become more effective. Cleaner gasoline will 

### 16 also enable auto makers to design new vehicles to meet 

### 17more stringent tailpipe standards. Further, cleaner 

### 18 gasoline preserves the ability of auto makers to pursue 

### 19 the broadest range of technologies to meet the landmark 

### 20 54 and a half mpg equivalent standards to cut global 

### 21 warming pollution and oil consumption. 

### 22The Tier 3 standards will avoid thousands ofTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 78 1 premature deaths and result in public health benefits 

### 2 of $8 to $23 billion annually by 2030. These benefits 

### 3 far outweigh the costs of the Tier 3 standards. 

### 4Still, however, the oil industry claims that 

### 5 the Tier 3 sulfur reductions are too expensive. It 

### 6 appears that the industry believes that the public 

### 7 health protection should only be pursued if they can 

### 8 generate huge profit margins for the industry. API 

### 9 recently estimated the cost of complying with Tier 3 

### 10 sulfur requirements at six to nine cents per gallon. 

### 11 EPA estimates the average cost at less than a penny, or 

### 12 .9 cents per gallon using the API assumptions. Most of 

### 13 the difference between the API and the EPA estimates is 

### 14API's projected profit margin. 

### 15As EPA described in the draft regulatory 

### 16 impact analysis, API's cost estimate assumes a profit 

### 17 of four to seven cents per gallon, which translates 

### 18 into $4 to $8 billion in windfall profits for the oil 

### 19 industry each year. NRDC estimates that the oil 

### 20 industry is projecting an astounding rate of return on 

### 21 investment of 180 to 340 percent. 

### 22The API high cost estimates have theTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 79 1 potential to raise concerns of industry investors, and 

### 2 some refining companies are backing away from the API 

### 3 estimates to present more realistic figures. For 

### 4 example, Valero Energy, which is the largest 

### 5 independent refiner in the U.S., recently told a group 

### 6 of financial analysts that its Tier 3 compliance will 

### 7 cost to $300 to $400 million. A finance expert 

### 8 colleague of mine at NRDC used the EPA's marginal cost 

### 9 assumptions and found that the $400 Valero cost claim 

### 10 would equate to a compliance cost of approximately .6 

### 11 cents per gallon, more than 10 times less than the API 

### 12 high estimate. 

### 13 For Valero, the .6 cent per gallon translates 

### 14 into annual costs of about $95 million, or just two 

### 15 percent of the four and a half billion in pretax 

### 16 earnings that the company made on refining in 2012. 

### 17 While Valero and other companies point out the cost of 

### 18 compliance is minimal, API continues to inflate costs. 

### 19 Regulatory cost inflation is part of their history. 

### 20 By exaggerating costs, API has attempted to scare 

### 21 consumers into potential large gas price increases at 

### 22 the pump.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 80 1The reality is that these large increases 

### 2 don't appear. According to a peer review report by 

### 3 EPA, API's estimates of compliance costs for previous 

### 4 clean fuel regulations adopted in the 1990s have been 

### 5 3.6 to 6.4 times higher than the actual observed price 

### 6 changes. Similarly, a recent study by Navigant 

### 7 Economics found that the Tier 2 gasoline sulfur 

### 8 regulations, which API estimated would cost about three 

### 9 cents a gallon, have had no discernible impact on 

### 10 retail prices. 

### 11API's proposal and supporting analysis has 

### 12 found that the Tier 3 rules would deliver large 

### 13 environmental and health benefits that far outweigh the 

### 14minimal costs. NRDC recommends that EPA continues to 

### 15move forward and finalize strong Tier 3 standards by 

### 16 the end of the year. Thank you very much. 

### 17MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you. Let me turn to my 

### 18 panel and ask if they've got any questions for the 

### 19 witnesses. 

### 20 MR. MACHIELE: Just a couple of questions, 

### 21 one for Patrick Kelly. Did you say that the annual 

### 22 cost from your study was $2.4 billion?Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 81 1MR. KELLY: The annual compliance costs. 

### 2 That includes the -- it is the annual cost of 

### 3 compliance and includes capital recovery. 

### 4MR. MACHIELE: And so what is that in terms 

### 5 of cents per gallon then because that's the average 

### 6 cost then? 

### 7MR. KELLY: That's a total cost, the $2.4 

### 8 billion. And it equates to a six to nine cent per 

### 9 gallon marginal cost in most markets. Does that answer 

### 10 your question? 

### 11MR. MACHIELE: I guess -- well, what is the 

### 12 $2.4 equate to in terms of an annual -- in terms of 

### 13 cent per gallon? 

### 14MR. KELLY: In marginal costs, it would be 

### 15 six to nine. 

### 16 MR. GRUNDLER: Do you have an average cost? 

### 17MR. KELLY: We didn't do an average cost. 

### 18 While average cost is an important factor, in commodity 

### 19 markets, when all of the demand is needed for that 

### 20 commodity, the marginal cost is very relevant in 

### 21 setting the market price. And so, therefore, we looked 

### 22 at the marginal cost because of its importance to theTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 82 1marketplace. 

### 2MR. MACHIELE: Okay. Thanks. Mr. -- Dr. 

### 3 Blakeman, did you say that future vehicle technologies 

### 4will have lower exhaust temperatures and will need to 

### 5 lower sulfur even more? Is that what I was hearing? 

### 6 DR. BLAKEMAN: Yes. You know, the trend to 

### 7 get more efficiency for greenhouse gas, you're taking 

### 8 energy from the exhaust, which lowers the exhaust 

### 9 temperature. And so that means that lower temperature 

### 10 sulfur gets even more sticky and sticks to the catalyst 

### 11more strongly, and so impacts its performance 

### 12 potentially more. 

### 13 MR. MACHIELE: Okay. Tim, did you want to 

### 14 elaborate? 

### 15MR. JOHNSON: Yes. Just to highlight the 

### 16 urgency of this trend towards lower exhaust 

### 17 temperatures, the U.S. Car Consortium, made up of the 

### 18 big three auto companies, called industry experts into 

### 19 Detroit in December, a call to arms to the industry to 

### 20 develop catalysts that will perform 90 percent removal 

### 21 of emissions at 150 degrees centigrade. That's about 

### 22 100 degrees lower than we have today.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 83 1So the industry is clearly seeing directions 

### 2 towards low temperature exhaust gas, and is mounting a 

### 3 huge unprecedented campaign in the industry to get 

### 4movement into low catalyst technologies. Sulfur is, as 

### 5 Phil said, absolutely the worst component that is in 

### 6 the way. 

### 7MR. MACHIELE: Thank you. 

### 8 MR. GRUNDLER: Any more questions? 

### 9 [No response.] 

### 10 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you, panel two, for your 

### 11 time. It was very helpful. 

### 12Panel three we're adding two people: John 

### 13 German and Jody Bender. Please come on up along with 

### 14 Shannon baker-Branstetter, Bob Babick, William 

### 15 Woebkenberg, Gary Emmett, Jan Koninckx, Nancy Seidman, 

### 16 Caroline Paulsen, and Meghan Higgins. Don't forget 

### 17 your name tags. 

### 18 Welcome. I'm going to ask Ms. Bender to lead 

### 19 off. 

### 20 MS. BENDER: Thank you very much. Good day. 

### 21I am Jody Bender, a board member of the League of 

### 22 Women Voters of Philadelphia. I will soon be electedTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 84 1 as a board member of the League of Women Voters of 

### 2 Pennsylvania. On their behalf, I am speaking today and 

### 3 wish to thank you for the opportunity to provide input 

### 4 on this critical issue. 

### 5Based on our national position on air 

### 6 quality, the League supports measures to reduce 

### 7 vehicular pollution, including inspection and 

### 8 maintenance of emissions controls, changes in engine 

### 9 design, and fuel types, and development of more energy 

### 10 efficient transportation systems. The proposed 

### 11 regulations to reduce emissions and strengthen fuel 

### 12 efficiency for new cars and trucks continue to keep us 

### 13 on the road to improving public health and the 

### 14 environment. 

### 15Spring is in the air in Philadelphia. 

### 16 However, there is a whole lot more than the aroma of 

### 17 fragrant blossoms. The Philadelphia region and 

### 18 Pennsylvania as a whole have the dubious distinction -- 

### 19 excuse me -- of being among the smoggiest areas in the 

### 20 nation. This resulted in hundreds of thousands of 

### 21 people being at risk of health-related diseases, such 

### 22 as asthma, chronic bronchitis, and emphysema. CleanerTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 85 1 cars and trucks would make a difference; thus, the 

### 2 League supports these new emission standards and 

### 3 vehicle fuel standards that lower sulfur content. 

### 4Cleaner air boosts, not dampens, the economy. 

### 5The potential cost of paying more at the pump during 

### 6 these difficult economic times is but a drop in the 

### 7 bucket when compared to the billions of dollars spent 

### 8 on the direct health care, los economic productivity, 

### 9 and squandered on absent students, all resulting from 

### 10 poor air quality. The citizens of our commonwealth and 

### 11 across the Nation are depending on you, the 

### 12 Environmental Protection Agency, to safeguard our air 

### 13 and protect people's health. 

### 14With the alarming rise of pollution-related 

### 15 asthma attacks, heart attacks, and shortened life 

### 16 spans, enacting these proposed Tier 3 standards is 

### 17 truly a matter of life and breath. 

### 18 Thank you. 

### 19 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you. 

### 20 Shannon Baker-Branstetter, please. 

### 21MS. BAKER-BRANSTETTER: Thank you and thank 

### 22 you to the EPA for their hard work and thoroughTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 86 1 analysis on this rule. I'm Sharon Baker-Branstetter, 

### 2 Policy Counsel for Consumers Union, the Policy and 

### 3 Advocacy Division of Consumer Reports. Consumers Union 

### 4 supports the proposed Tier 3 standards because they are 

### 5 good for air quality, public health, and car owners. 

### 6 Consumer Reports conducts comprehensive tests 

### 7 of approximately 80 new vehicles every year, which we 

### 8 buy anonymously at retail. We provide consumers with 

### 9 objective comparative ratings about performance, fuel 

### 10 efficiency, safety, and reliability of these vehicles. 

### 11We do not accept outside advertising. Consumer 

### 12 Reports has more than eight million subscribers to our 

### 13 magazine, websites, and other publications. 

### 14Reducing sulfur and gasoline and cutting 

### 15 tailpipe emissions will provide outstanding benefits to 

### 16 public health. Over 150 million Americans breathe 

### 17 unhealthy air, and a major source of this pollution is 

### 18 passenger and heavy duty vehicles. On average, 

### 19 Americans spend over an hour traveling roads every day. 

### 20 Living, working, or going to school near 

### 21major roadways increases exposure to ozone and particle 

### 22 pollution that worsens lung and heart health and causesTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 87 1 thousands of premature deaths every year. In addition 

### 2 to the tremendous health benefits of the proposed rule, 

### 3 car owners will also see significant improvements. 

### 4 Lowering the sulfur content in gasoline cleans up 

### 5 exhaust from older vehicles. It also reduces corrosion 

### 6 of emissions control systems for existing vehicles, and 

### 7 increases the life span of catalytic converters, which 

### 8 can cause hundreds to thousands of dollars to replace. 

### 9 The national average replacement cost of a catalytic 

### 10 converter is approximately $1,400. 

### 11New car buyers will also benefit. The 

### 12 proposed rule offers auto makers an incentive to go 

### 13 beyond the minimum eight-year, 80,000 mile warranty 

### 14 currently required for emissions control systems, and 

### 15 extend it to 15 years, 150,000 miles for new vehicles, 

### 16 which could improve reliability and lower costs to 

### 17maintain emissions control systems. Low sulfur 

### 18 gasoline also enables auto makers to develop a greater 

### 19 array of technology, such as lean burn, to meet 

### 20 emissions and fuel economy standards more creatively 

### 21 and at a lower cost. 

### 22The very modest cost of these clean carTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 88 1 standards is well worth it. Addressing gasoline and 

### 2 vehicles together as a system further improves the cost 

### 3 effectiveness of reducing emissions. According to your 

### 4Agency, when the standards are fully implemented by 

### 5 2025, the standards will likely add less than $150 per 

### 6 vehicle, and less than one cent per gallon to gasoline 

### 7 costs. 

### 8 However, the benefits greatly outweigh these 

### 9 costs. By 2030, the annual health benefits would be 

### 10 between $8 and $23 billion, double to seven times the 

### 11 costs. It would be penny wise, tons foolish, to save a 

### 12 cent on gasoline only to have to pay even more with our 

### 13 health as a result of additional tons of pollution. To 

### 14put the costs in perspective, over the last four years, 

### 15 gasoline prices fluctuated over $2 per gallon, with 

### 16 weekly increases of 10 cents happening with regularity. 

### 17EPA estimates the cost of cleaner gasoline 

### 18 will be less than one cent per gallon. By comparison, 

### 19 failing to maintain proper tire pressure can waste the 

### 20 equivalent of 11 cents per gallon. By speeding or 

### 21 aggressive driving -- a driver of a typical could bleed 

### 22 20 to 40 cents per gallon. A roof rack, 60 cents perTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 89 1 gallon. Meanwhile, fuel economy standards at poised to 

### 2 save consumers the equivalent of $1.30 per gallon by 

### 3 2025. The proposed clean car standards provide a great 

### 4 service at an outstanding value. 

### 5In summary, this common sense rule is good 

### 6 for our health and good for car owners. We urge you to 

### 7 finalize the rule so it can apply to 2017 models and be 

### 8 in sync with fuel economy standards. Thank you. 

### 9 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you. 

### 10 Mr. Babick? Mr. Woebkenberg, you're on deck. 

### 11MR. BABICK: Good morning, everyone. My name 

### 12 is Robert Babick. I'm the Director from Environment 

### 13 Energy and Safety Policy, General Motors. We at 

### 14 General Motors have truly embraced the call for more 

### 15 environmentally friendly vehicles. This is evident 

### 16 from our groundbreaking Chevrolet Volt, the world's 

### 17 first mass produced extended range electric vehicle. 

### 18 The Volt is just one piece of a broader electrification 

### 19 strategy that includes the Chevrolet Spark, pure EV, 

### 20 the Cadillac ELR luxury EREV, and various hybrid 

### 21 offerings. GM is an industry leader in the plug-in 

### 22 sales, and we intend to keep it that way.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 90 1We are continuing to follow our principle of 

### 2 energy diversity as we produce numerous E85 flex fuel 

### 3 vehicles, diesel vehicles, including the new 2014 

### 4 Chevrolet Diesel Cruz, and CNG offerings in our full

### 5 size pickups and van segments. 

### 6 We're also introducing more improvements to 

### 7 conventional technology. Our engineers are working 

### 8 around the clock to simultaneously improve the fuel 

### 9 economy in greenhouse gas emissions, criteria missions, 

### 10 and safety of all of our products. 

### 11That brings me to the key reason we are here 

### 12 today, working closely with the EPA and the other 

### 13 stakeholders to achieve a harmonized and appropriate 

### 14 structure Tier 3 program. The establishment of a 

### 15 single national standard for fuel economy and CO2 

### 16 regulation was quite simply a much needed breakthrough 

### 17 that will enable more timely and efficient introduction 

### 18 of technologies customers, manufacturers, and 

### 19 regulators want to succeed. 

### 20 We know that EPA and California are committed 

### 21 to further reducing tailpipe criteria emissions, and in 

### 22 order to achieve the level of reduction proposed, ourTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 91 1 vehicles will be so clean there will be no reason to 

### 2 have competing regulatory requirements. 

### 3 Our precious engineering resources are 

### 4 already stretched thin, and requiring them to design, 

### 5 develop, and certify two of everything I think we can 

### 6 all agree is counterproductive. We need to be able to 

### 7 focus on developing one of everything, which we can 

### 8 then sell throughout the U.S. to provide everyone here 

### 9 the cleanest vehicles in the world. A harmonized Tier 

### 10 3 program properly structured can achieve this. 

### 11Another key aspect of the proposal is the 

### 12 cleaner fuels that are included. Auto makers will need 

### 13 these cleaner fuels to meet the stringent Tier 3 

### 14 emission standards EPA and California envision. We 

### 15must have clean fuels because the vehicles and fuel 

### 16 function as a single system in determining the emission 

### 17 performance of the vehicle. 

### 18 As EPA moves ahead to finalize the Tier 3 

### 19 requirements, GM believes the provision for low sulfur 

### 20 fuel levels and other clean fuel properties is 

### 21 essential, as is outlined in the Alliance's comments. 

### 22 And while clean fuels are needed to meet the Tier 3Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 92 1 standards on new vehicles, they also provide the added 

### 2 benefit of reducing emissions immediately across the 

### 3 entire on road fleet. 

### 4Finally, we would like to see some changes to 

### 5 the MPRM. For example, there are a number of things 

### 6 that are not harmonized with California's LEV III 

### 7 requirements that we will be asking to be harmonized. 

### 8 So we will continue to review the MPRM and work through 

### 9 the Alliance to submit detailed written comments to 

### 10 EPA, and I appreciate your time and attention. 

### 11Thank you. 

### 12MR. GRUNDLER: Thanks, Bob. 

### 13 Bill? Jan, you're on deck. 

### 14MR. WOEBKENBERG: Good morning. My name is 

### 15 Bill Woebkenberg, and I'm responsible for Fuels, 

### 16 Technical, and Regulatory Affairs in the U.S. for 

### 17 Mercedes-Benz Research and Development, North America, 

### 18 which is an indirect, wholly-owned subsidiary of 

### 19 Daimler AG, the global manufacturer of Mercedes-Benz 

### 20 vehicles and a leader in clean, efficient vehicle 

### 21 technology in the U.S. and the world. 

### 22Our product portfolio includes a full rangeTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 93 1 of models equipped with BlueEFFICIENCY gasoline and 

### 2 gasoline hybrid power trains, BlueTEC clean diesels, 

### 3 and F-CELL hydrogen-powered fuel cell vehicle in 

### 4 California. 

### 5Mercedes-Benz thanks the EPA, and especially 

### 6 Chris Grundler and his time, for the time and 

### 7 dedication in the creation of this rulemaking. 

### 8 Additionally, Mercedes-Benz wishes to acknowledge the 

### 9 effort required for the EPA to include automobile 

### 10 manufacturers as stakeholders in the formation of this 

### 11 proposal. 

### 12Treatment of fuel as a part of this system in 

### 13 total criteria emissions and greenhouse gas reduction 

### 14 is an important acknowledgment by the EPA that 

### 15 improvements proposed by Tier 3 rulemaking are possible 

### 16 when all contributing factors are examined and 

### 17 optimized. Sulfur reduction is one such factor in 

### 18 which Mercedes-Benz supports the EPA's incorporation of 

### 19 a 10 ppm annual average for gasoline in the Tier 3 

### 20 proposal. This advancement in fuel quality will 

### 21 immediately benefit the existing vehicles on the road 

### 22 by improving the function of catalytic converters andTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 94 1 decreasing the formation of smog producing pollutants. 

### 2In 2006, Mercedes-Benz first capitalized on 

### 3 the value of low sulfur gasoline and the reduction to 

### 4 fuel consumption it enables when it introduced in the 

### 5 EU the 350CGI CLS luxury sedan, which is equipped with 

### 6 stratified lean burn combustion. Depending on the 

### 7 driving mode, engine speed, and load, gains in the fuel 

### 8 efficiency can range between five and 15 percent as 

### 9 compared to conventional stoichiometric combustion. 

### 10 Incorporation of this technology in the EU is enabled 

### 11 by a 10 ppm refinery limit in comparison to the 10 ppm 

### 12 annual average as proposed in the Tier 3 rulemaking. 

### 13 Lean burn combustion among those technologies 

### 14 necessary to accomplish a nearly 50 percent reduction 

### 15 in greenhouse gas emissions requires low sulfur 

### 16 gasoline for peak efficiency. Fuel efficiency gains in 

### 17 CO2 reductions of this magnitude required by the 

### 18 greenhouse gas mandate are enabled by lean burn 

### 19 combustion, illustrate the importance of this 

### 20 technology and the universal availability of low sulfur 

### 21 gasoline in the U.S. to the Daimler Greenhouse Gas 

### 22 Compliance Plan.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 95 1But sulfur reduction is not a lean burn 

### 2 discussion. Even existing power train architectures, 

### 3 including downsized turbocharged gasoline direct 

### 4 injected engines would also benefit from reduced sulfur 

### 5 and fuel, so no longer would a portion of the fuel 

### 6 savings realized need to be expended by periodically 

### 7 burning off sulfur to maintain optimum effectiveness in 

### 8 exhaust after treatment systems. 

### 9 Additionally, prior testimony highlights the 

### 10 fact that power train technologies which increase 

### 11 efficiency result in core exhaust gas temperatures, 

### 12 which promote sulfur deposition and inhibit burn off. 

### 13 Thus, the effect of low sulfur on the current fleet is 

### 14 immediate and enduring. No other single step can 

### 15 provide retroactive and future benefits in criteria 

### 16 emissions and greenhouse gas reduction. 

### 17Looking forward, there are other significant 

### 18 elements regarding future fuels and ultimately engine 

### 19 design which can have a large impact on greenhouse gas 

### 20 compliance. The unprecedented increase in CAFÉ 

### 21 standards and the associated greenhouse gas 

### 22 requirements are driving a dramatic reduction orTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 96 1 downsizing in engine size and number of cylinders. 

### 2One aspect not reduced is the customer 

### 3 expectation of performance, even in the wake of 

### 4 regulations mandating improved fuel economy. Thus, 

### 5 another key enabler in reducing greenhouse gas 

### 6 contributions while maintaining performance is 

### 7 increased octane and gasoline. Octane is the single 

### 8 most important property in gasoline when determining 

### 9 engine design. Higher octane fuels permit higher 

### 10 compression ratios which directly improve efficiency. 

### 11 Downsizing engines also results in greater fuel 

### 12 efficiency. 

### 13 The optimized combination of these two 

### 14 actions with gasoline direct injection provides 

### 15 remarkable gains in fuel economy, but requires high 

### 16 octane market fuel, higher octane than is available 

### 17 today. Additionally, higher octane traditionally 

### 18 provided through selective petroleum refining and 

### 19 blending can also be further increased through the 

### 20 addition of ethanol and blends greater than 20 percent 

### 21 by volume. This powerful fuel enjoys both reduced 

### 22 carbon intensity as well as the renewable aspects ofTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 97 1 ethanol. 

### 2A vehicle equipped with a power train, which 

### 3 is optimized for a high octane mid-blend ethanol fuel 

### 4 can simultaneously fulfill what the customer desires, 

### 5 performance and economy, while reducing the 

### 6 environmental impact. In fact, Mercedes-Benz vehicle 

### 7 offerings include those with E-25 capability in various 

### 8 global markets, and can introduce them in the U.S. if 

### 9 regulatory and commercial conditions warrant. 

### 10 To summarize, the synergy of mid-blend 

### 11 ethanol and higher octane based fuel in the proposed 

### 12 rulemaking opens the door to far greater possibilities 

### 13 in greenhouse gas and criteria emission reduction. 

### 14Mercedes-Benz fully supports these proposed 

### 15 changes in certification and market fuel, and will 

### 16 provide detailed written comments containing specific 

### 17 recommendations to help advance this effort. Mercedes

### 18 Benz, with its industry leading fuel injection and 

### 19 engine technology, will take full advantage of fuel 

### 20 economy and greenhouse gas possibilities enabled by 

### 21 this opportunity. 

### 22Thank you.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 98 1MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you, Bill. 

### 2Jan, please. 

### 3 MR. KONINCYKX: Good morning. My name is Jan 

### 4 Koninckx. I'm the Business Director for Biofuels for 

### 5 DuPont. I'm pleased to be here today to provide 

### 6 feedback to the EPA on the proposed Tier 3 motor 

### 7 vehicle emissions and fuel standards rule. I'm here to 

### 8 discuss also the bright future for renewable fuels in 

### 9 the United States, and the Tier 3 proposed rule 

### 10 includes a number of provisions that can support making 

### 11 renewable fuels more widely available and economically 

### 12 competitive. Expanding renewable fuels will ultimately 

### 13 drive reductions in air pollutants, a target of the 

### 14 Tier 3 rule. 

### 15One brings a perspective of a company deeply 

### 16 involved in the agricultural and biofuels industries. 

### 17 Our seed business, DuPont Pioneer, sells corn seed to 

### 18 farmers growing for a variety of end use markets, 

### 19 including grain ethanol production. Our intimate 

### 20 relationship with our farmer customers and our 

### 21 extensive research provides us with significant insight 

### 22 into the economics of the harvest and the management ofTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 99 1 corn stover as a cellulosic feed stock. We provide a 

### 2 variety of products for the grain ethanol business as 

### 3 well, and so have an intimate knowledge of the 

### 4 operation of the sugar fermentation operations. 

### 5And one of DuPont's renewable fuels is 

### 6 cellulosic ethanol. We've been developing our 

### 7 technology for a decade. Since 2009, we have operated 

### 8 a demonstration facility in eastern Tennessee, 

### 9 producing ethanol from both corn stover and switch 

### 10 grass. The experience has made us very confident in 

### 11 our technology and the engineering for a commercial 

### 12 scale facility. 

### 13 This work has culminated in our construction 

### 14 of a 30 million gallon per year facility located in 

### 15 central Iowa, that is scheduled to begin producing 

### 16 cellulosic ethanol next year from corn stover. We're 

### 17 also demonstrating the production of cellulosic ethanol 

### 18 from switch grass, as I indicated just earlier. 

### 19 In addition to DuPont's cellulosic volumes, 

### 20 we anticipate a number of other countries doing the 

### 21 same. Multiple companies are constructing, starting 

### 22 up, or operating facilities producing renewable fuelsTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 100 1 from a wide variety of cellulosic feed stocks, 

### 2 including corn stover, switch grass, wheat straw, 

### 3 municipal solid waste, and wood fiber. This diversity 

### 4 of operations provides a high level of confidence of 

### 5multiple technology succeeding at commercial scale. We 

### 6 anticipate that cellulosic renewable fuels production 

### 7 will expand quite rapidly once technologies have been 

### 8 proven at commercial scale. 

### 9 Now, by enacting the RFS, Congress had a 

### 10 forward looking 15-year policy intending to incent the 

### 11 large-scale development of renewable fuels in the U.S.. 

### 12And the existing suite of these policies, of which the 

### 13 RFS is a significant component, has been very 

### 14 successful in standing up the U.S. biofuel industry 

### 15 that is making a material contribution to U.S. energy 

### 16 security and reducing the environmental footprint of 

### 17 transportation. 

### 18 We have to remember that we started down the 

### 19 road of alternative transportation fuels because of the 

### 20 variety of security, environmental, and economic 

### 21 ramifications of our dependence on petroleum. Those 

### 22 challenges have only grown more acute, and we're makingTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 101 1 solid progress. Future growth and biofuel supply will 

### 2 now come largely from non-food related feed stocks. 

### 3 There are a number of provisions in the Tier 

### 4 3 proposed rules that will achieve the desired 

### 5 reduction in air pollutants, but also support the 

### 6 objectives of the RFS, and if carefully implemented, 

### 7 can make renewable fuels more widely available and 

### 8 economically competitive. First, DuPont supports EPA's 

### 9 proposal to set E-15 as emissions test fuel for light 

### 10 duty cars and trucks, as well as heavy duty gasoline 

### 11 vehicles. The EPA must create the requisite incentives 

### 12 for auto manufacturers to pursue advanced engine 

### 13 technologies. Setting E-15 as the test fuel is a step 

### 14 in the right direction. The Tier 3 rule objectives go 

### 15 hand-in-hand with CAFÉ standards, and would create the 

### 16 flexibility that automobile manufacturers need to 

### 17 comply with both CAFÉ and the Tier 3 rule. 

### 18 The purpose of the CAFÉ standards is to 

### 19 reduce energy consumption that will help address our 

### 20 country's dependence on imported oil, save consumers 

### 21money at the pump, and reduce emissions of greenhouse 

### 22 gases that contribute to global climate change. HigherTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 102 1 ethanol blends will help make significant contributions 

### 2 to these objectives. 

### 3 EPA is requesting comments on alternative 

### 4 approaches to implementing E-15 as the test fuel. Two 

### 5 of the options include requiring E-15 to be available 

### 6 on the market before transitioning. Instead, DuPont 

### 7 suggests that EPA sets a specified future date for 

### 8 transitioning to E-15 as a test fuel. 

### 9 The second provision that could encourage 

### 10 larger volumes of renewable fuel involves allowing 

### 11 vehicle manufacturers to request approval for 

### 12 alternative certification fuel, such as E-30. And that 

### 13 would give vehicle manufacturers the requisite 

### 14 flexibility to improve vehicle efficiency for purpose 

### 15 of complying with the 2017 rules. 

### 16 We support allowing vehicle manufacturers to 

### 17 request approval for alternative certification fuels, 

### 18 higher octane fuels, because ethanol cannot be used as 

### 19 an octane booster. High octane petroleum fuels are 

### 20 more expensive than gasoline with an 87 rating. But 

### 21 higher ethanol blends with higher octane should cost 

### 22 less per gallon than regular gasoline.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 103 1I thank you for the opportunity to speak 

### 2 about the important provisions of the Tier 3 motor 

### 3 vehicle emissions rule standard. 

### 4MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you. 

### 5Nancy Seidman, welcome. 

### 6 MS. SEIDMAN: Good morning, Chris and the 

### 7 panel. At least I think it's still morning. My name 

### 8 is Nancy Seidman. I'm an Assistant Commissioner of the 

### 9 Massachusetts Department of Environmental Protection, 

### 10 and I'm here today as Co-Chair of the Mobile Source and 

### 11 Fuels Committee of NACAA, the National Association of 

### 12 Clean Air Agencies, a national nonpartisan, non-profit 

### 13 association of air pollution control agencies in 43 

### 14 States, D.C., four territories, and over 116 

### 15metropolitan areas. 

### 16 On behalf of NACAA, thank you for this 

### 17 opportunity to testify on EPA's proposed Tier 3 vehicle 

### 18 emissions and fuel standards. NACAA strongly supports 

### 19 EPA's Tier 3 proposal. We do so because we know of no 

### 20 other strategy that can achieve such substantial, 

### 21 immediate, and cost-effective reductions in air 

### 22 pollution as Tier 3.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 104 1More than 158 million across the Nation 

### 2 currently live in areas where they breathe -- where the 

### 3 air they breathe violates at least one of the health 

### 4 based National Ambient Air Quality Standards. Mobile 

### 5 source emissions, including those from passenger cars 

### 6 and light trucks that are the focus of Tier 3, are a 

### 7 primary contributor to these violations, playing an 

### 8 especially central role in elevated levels of ozone and 

### 9 fine particulate matter. 

### 10 These vehicles also contribute to toxic air 

### 11 pollution, regional haze, and the eutrophication of 

### 12 water bodies. The emission reductions that would 

### 13 result from the proposed Tier 3 program will benefit 

### 14 the citizens in every State and locality across the 

### 15 country. 

### 16 In October 2011, NACAA published a study 

### 17 documenting the costs and air quality benefits of Tier 

### 18 3 of a Tier 3 program modeled on California's Low 

### 19 Emission Vehicle III program, including tighter 

### 20 tailpipe standards and an average gasoline sulfur 

### 21 standard of 10 parts per million. We detailed how 

### 22 reducing sulfur in gasoline will enable the use ofTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 105 1 improved emissions control technology on new cars and 

### 2 trucks, and result in an overnight reduction in 

### 3 emissions from the existing fleet on the order of 

### 4 nearly 300,000 tons of NOx. This is the most 

### 5 significant reduction in on road air pollution 

### 6 emissions EPA has proposed in many years. 

### 7By 2030, the Tier 3 program would result in 

### 8 even more substantial reduction in on road mobile 

### 9 source emissions of criteria and toxic air pollutants. 

### 10 In addition, the emission reductions will continue to 

### 11 accrue beyond 2030 with a turnover of the vehicle 

### 12 fleet. While the emission benefits of Tier 3 are very 

### 13 high, the costs of the program are very low. NACAA 

### 14predicted an increase in the cost of gasoline of less 

### 15 than a penny a gallon, and EPA has found the same. 

### 16 Opponents of Tier 3 contend that the cost of 

### 17 low sulfur fuel will not be less than a penny a gallon, 

### 18 but between six and nine cents per gallon. However, in 

### 19 making this estimate, they did not account for the 

### 20 mitigating impacts of EPA's proposed set of 

### 21 flexibilities, all of which have proven successful in 

### 22 prior fuel programs adopted by the Agency. In terms ofTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 106 1 Tier 3 vehicle control technologies, NACAA estimated 

### 2 the cost to be about $150 per vehicle. EPA has found 

### 3 the cost to be even lower at $130 per vehicle in 2025. 

### 4In all, EPA expects the monetized benefits of the Tier 

### 5 3 program to far outweigh the total annual program 

### 6 costs by about seven to one. 

### 7In its draft regulatory impact analysis, EPA 

### 8 concludes that the cost effectiveness of the proposed 

### 9 Tier 3 program is less than $4,500 per ton of 

### 10 hydrocarbon and NOx removed in 2030, which is far more 

### 11 cost effective than most other potential NOx reduction 

### 12measures being considered around the country. 

### 13 Reducing emissions that cause air pollution 

### 14 is a zero sum game. Foregoing reductions from one 

### 15 source category means seeking reductions from another. 

### 16 In the absence of a Federal Tier 3 program, areas in 

### 17 need of emission reductions will have no choice but to 

### 18 turn to other more expensive, less cost effective 

### 19 measures, including controls on small businesses, to 

### 20 meet their statutory clean air obligations. Moreover, 

### 21 achieving emission reductions of the magnitude that 

### 22 will result from Tier 3 could be extremely difficult inTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 107 1 areas where there may not be sufficient sources to 

### 2 control or where State and local regulation of certain 

### 3 sources is politically unacceptable. 

### 4Not only is Tier 3 tremendously effective 

### 5 from an air quality perspective, it is feasible today. 

### 6 The proposed Tier 3 tailpipe standards are modeled on 

### 7 California's LEV III program. The potential 

### 8 technologies for this program are consistent with and 

### 9 almost entirely the same as those on today's California 

### 10 vehicles. Further, California gasoline already 

### 11 achieves 10 part per million sulfur on average, and 

### 12 gasoline in the European Union and Japan is subject to 

### 13 the 10 ppm cap. 

### 14State and local air pollution control 

### 15 agencies are relying on EPA to adopt Tier 3. The Clean 

### 16 Air Act authorizes States to opt into California's LEV 

### 17 III standards, but not all States can take advantage of 

### 18 this opportunity. Moreover, the Clean Air Act 

### 19 precludes all States, except California, from adopting 

### 20 low sulfur gasoline standards, so it is imperative that 

### 21 the Federal government take action no later than 

### 22 December 31st, 2013, to adopt Tier 3. Otherwise, theTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 108 1 program may not apply to model year 2017, and an entire 

### 2 year will be lost. 

### 3 In closing, NACAA applauds EPA for proposing 

### 4 the Tier 3 package and reiterates its strong support 

### 5 for this program, which will benefit all citizens 

### 6 throughout the country. Thank you. 

### 7MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you, Nancy. 

### 8 Dr. Emmett? 

### 9 DR. EMMETT: Hello. I'm Dr. Gary Emmett. 

### 10 I'm a Professor of Pediatrics at Thomas Jefferson 

### 11 University, and I'm the Head of Inpatient Pediatrics at 

### 12 the Thomas Jefferson University Hospitals. Most 

### 13 importantly, I'm the primary care provider for 1,400 

### 14 children in Philadelphia and its near suburbs. Most of 

### 15my patients are people that are chronically ill, but 

### 16 the most common by far of the patients that are 

### 17 chronically ill are people with asthma. 

### 18 Out of my 1,400 patients, 200 of them have 

### 19 asthma. If I restrict my patient load to African

### 20 Americans, it goes from one out of seven to one out of 

### 21 five. If I reduce my patient load to my Medicaid 

### 22 patients, it's one out of four that have asthma. AndTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 109 1 this is a huge burden on my patient population, on 

### 2 economics, and on the hospital's resources. 

### 3 I have spent over 150 hours a year for the 

### 4 last 20 years as a volunteer in trying to decrease the 

### 5 burden of asthma on children in this city and State. 

### 6 I've been an advocate on many levels. I was one of the 

### 7 founding members of the Pennsylvania Allies Against 

### 8 Asthma, now deceased because of funding, but a great 

### 9 organization in its time. And I'm now the Medical 

### 10 Director of the Pennsylvania Asthma Partnership. 

### 11Why am I spending all this time? That's 

### 12 about three weeks of my year that I spend doing this, 

### 13 and, trust me, no one pays me for it. Well, I do it 

### 14 because asthma is the most common cause of medical 

### 15 school absence nationally, and, in Philadelphia, which 

### 16 has an even larger burden, it reflects almost half the 

### 17 days lost in school to medical reasons. I do it 

### 18 because it's the most common reason that people from 

### 19 our emergency rooms are admitted to the hospital. 

### 20 And as an individual, I can do things to 

### 21 help. I have just spent the last four or five months 

### 22 getting a pediatric asthma pathway for our hospitals soTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 110 1 that each child that comes to our emergency room gets 

### 2 the best possible care. And that means not only making 

### 3 the pathway, but, even more importantly, making sure 

### 4physicians follow the pathway, which is more exciting. 

### 5And then secondly, I can as an individual 

### 6 counsel people about the fact that they should get 

### 7 cigarettes out of their lives. Even if they don't 

### 8 smoke in the house, they take the smoke with them on 

### 9 their clothes, and the kids wheeze. I can counsel that 

### 10 they should follow the recommendations of the Expert 

### 11 Panel Report III of the National Institutes of Health 

### 12 on using preventive medicine to prevent people with 

### 13 asthma from getting sick in the first place. But 

### 14 that's my little group of 1,400 patients. Maybe I can 

### 15 expand it because of my administrative roles for the 

### 16 hospital system. 

### 17But as a group, we can cause an even more 

### 18 important effect, and that's the effect of diesel 

### 19 vehicle's emissions on asthma. If you live on a street 

### 20 that has lots of trucks and buses going down it, your 

### 21 chances of having either chronic or acute asthma is 

### 22 almost double that of someone who lives in the sameTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 111 1 city a few blocks away on a quiet street that doesn't 

### 2 have trucks on it. 

### 3 So we know that truck emissions, even though 

### 4 the diesel vehicles are much cleaner than they ever 

### 5 were, we know we can do more. And we can, once we have 

### 6 a problem, solve it. When I started I pediatrics 34 

### 7 years ago, the average lead in a child in Philadelphia 

### 8 was a 20 micrograms per deciliter. It is now a three. 

### 9 There's no safe level of lead in children, but three 

### 10 is a lot better than 20. 

### 11In this same way, if we can actually stop 

### 12 trucks and buses from idling, if we can install systems 

### 13 that turn them off when they come to a red light, if we 

### 14 can take the city light system, stop light system, and 

### 15 get them to be coordinated so there are less stops and 

### 16 less traffic jams, and on a few streets put some 

### 17 traffic officers to stop traffic jams from happening, 

### 18 we can reduce the number of children I see in the ER. 

### 19 We can reduce the number of children admitted, and we 

### 20 can have children go to school a lot more days than 

### 21 they're going to school right now. And from the world 

### 22 of pediatrics, we would thank -- all of us would thankTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 112 1 you if you could do anything to help us out on that. 

### 2Thank you very much. 

### 3 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you, Dr. Emmett. 

### 4Ms. Paulsen? 

### 5MS. PAULSEN: Hello. My name is Caroline 

### 6 Paulsen, and I'm with the Environmental Defense Fund. 

### 7 On behalf of the Environmental Defense Fund and our 

### 8 more than 750,000 members nationwide, and the numerous 

### 9 members here in the Keystone State, I thank you for the 

### 10 opportunity to testify today in support of these vital 

### 11 standards to reduce soot, smog, and toxic air pollution 

### 12 from our Nation's fleet of passenger cars and trucks. 

### 13 These standards will prevent thousands of deaths each 

### 14year and will provide billions of dollars in public 

### 15 health benefits, all for about a penny a gallon. 

### 16 Americans depend heavily on our passenger 

### 17 vehicles. In Pennsylvania alone, there are more than 

### 18 nine million registered passenger cars and light 

### 19 trucks. Almost 90 percent of us use personal vehicles 

### 20 every day for travel. Fortunately, our cars are far 

### 21 cleaner and more efficient than the gas guzzling black 

### 22 smoke spewing vehicles of decades past thanks in largeTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 113 1 part to the Environmental Protection Agency's clean air 

### 2 leadership. 

### 3 But today's passenger cars and trucks still 

### 4 remain the second largest emitters of nitrogen oxides 

### 5 and volatile organic compounds in the U.S., the primary 

### 6 pollutants that form ozone smog. High ozone levels 

### 7 cause decreased lung function, aggravated asthma, and 

### 8 are associated with premature death. Pennsylvania has 

### 9 five cities with ozone concentrations that exceed the 

### 10 national health-based standards, and three of those 

### 11 cities are in the top 20 most polluted cities in the 

### 12 Nation for ozone. 

### 13 Our passenger vehicles also emit more than 

### 14 half of all carbon monoxide pollution, and contribute 

### 15 significantly to particulate matter emissions and air 

### 16 toxics. Particulate pollution or soot has many harmful 

### 17 health impacts, including premature death. Eight major 

### 18 cities in Pennsylvania, home to millions of people, do 

### 19 not meet National Ambient Air Quality Standards for 

### 20 particulate matter. And Pittsburgh, Harrisburg, and 

### 21 Philadelphia rank among the top 20 most polluted cities 

### 22 for particulates.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 114 1The vital importance of cleaner air for our 

### 2 families, our communities, and our Nation is why I'm 

### 3 here today joined by so many others to support the Tier 

### 4 3 proposal, and it's why EPA should finalize this 

### 5 important rule without delay. The proposed standards 

### 6 would reduce sulfur levels in gasoline, allowing 

### 7 catalysts in new and existing vehicles to perform 

### 8 better. As a result of these cleaner fuel standards, 

### 9 our Nation and the communities here in Pennsylvania 

### 10 would see immediate reductions in smog forming nitrogen 

### 11 oxide emissions. And EPA estimates those reductions 

### 12 could be significant enough to bring ozone 

### 13 concentrations in communities like Bucks County from 

### 14 levels above the health based standards today to levels 

### 15 below the health standard in 2017, the first year of 

### 16 the Tier 3 program. 

### 17Additionally, the proposed tailpipe 

### 18 standards, which will require new engines to burn 

### 19 cleaner, are projected to reduce smog forming 

### 20 pollutants by 80 percent, and particulate pollution by 

### 21 70 percent from today's fleet of vehicles. According 

### 22 to EPA analysis, the particulate reductions from ourTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 115 1 passenger vehicles will result in significant declines 

### 2 in air pollution concentrations in cities across this 

### 3 State, including Pittsburgh. 

### 4The human health benefits of this proposal 

### 5 are profound. That is why it's supported by the 

### 6 American Lung Association, the Nation's air quality 

### 7 control officials, and millions of Americans. The 

### 8 emissions reductions will result in up to 2,400 fewer 

### 9 lives lost, and it will prevent 3,200 hospital visits 

### 10 and 22,000 asthma attacks, not in total, but every 

### 11 year. 

### 12EPA estimates these health care savings could 

### 13 total up to $23 billion annually. And the cost to 

### 14 achieve these vital health protections is only a penny 

### 15 a gallon for the cleaner gasoline. This estimate is 

### 16 based on several major studies, including an EPA 

### 17 analysis, a technical analysis by MathPro, and an 

### 18 economic analysis by Navigant Economics. 

### 19 The Tier 3 program provides a clear vision 

### 20 for healthier air today and a lasting clean air future 

### 21 for our children. The systems approach of establishing 

### 22 protective emission standards for cleaner cars andTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 116 1 fuels together will drive investment and development in 

### 2 emissions control technology, allow manufacturers to 

### 3 efficiently align technology upgrades, and provide 

### 4 long-term regulatory certainty for the U.S. auto 

### 5 industry, all while reducing the health burden on 

### 6 American families. 

### 7In conclusion, the Environmental Defense Fund 

### 8 is proud to join the auto manufacturers, the auto 

### 9 workers, the emissions control technology industry, the 

### 10 health experts, the environmental organizations, the 

### 11 State and local air pollution control agencies, the 

### 12 consumer groups, and the public who all agree that 

### 13 cleaner passenger cars and trucks are an important step 

### 14 forward for a healthier and stronger America. 

### 15Thank you. 

### 16 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you. 

### 17Ms. Higgins, you're up. 

### 18 MS. HIGGINS: Good afternoon. Thank you for 

### 19 the opportunity to testify today. My name is Meghan 

### 20 Higgins, and I'm the Senior Washington Representative 

### 21 for the Clean Vehicles Program at the Union of 

### 22 Concerned Scientists. UCS is the Nation's leadingTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 117 1 science-based non-profit putting rigorous independent 

### 2 science to work to solve our planet's most pressing 

### 3 problems. On behalf of UCS' more than 400,000 

### 4 supporters and network of more than 23,000 scientists, 

### 5 engineers, and public health professionals, UCS 

### 6 strongly supports the cleaner gasoline and tailpipe 

### 7 standards proposed by the Environmental Protection 

### 8 Agency, and urges the EPA to move as quickly as 

### 9 possible to finalize the standards. 

### 10 Why should EPA move quickly to finalize the 

### 11 so-called Tier 3 standards? Because failure to do so, 

### 12 to finalize the rule in 2013, will mean that the 

### 13 standards will not take effect in 2017, and we will 

### 14 lose an entire model year worth of benefits. And those 

### 15 benefits, as you've heard from many people before me, 

### 16 include reducing air pollution, improving public 

### 17 health, and creating thousands of new jobs in an ailing 

### 18 economy, both at the refineries and at high tech 

### 19 companies developing and deploying state-of-the-art 

### 20 emission control equipment for vehicles. 

### 21One of the unique benefits of the Tier 3 

### 22 program is that by lowering sulfur and the gasolineTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 118 1 that goes into vehicles already on the road, the 

### 2 program will have immediate positive impact. Reducing 

### 3 the sulfur content of the gasoline helps the catalytic 

### 4 converters work more efficiently, reducing emissions 

### 5 from the legacy fleet even while we wait for the 

### 6 vehicle fleet to turn over. By setting the standards 

### 7 for the fuel and the vehicle together -- what's called 

### 8 the systems-based approach -- the Tier 3 standards are 

### 9 able to achieve the greatest emission reductions at the 

### 10 lowest cost to society. 

### 11We witnessed the success of this approach to 

### 12 cleaning up our vehicle fleet with the Tier 2 

### 13 standards, which were phased in through 2007. These 

### 14 standards successfully reduced tailpipe emissions and 

### 15 the sulfur content of gasoline, providing cleaner air 

### 16 for all Americans. But we can and we must do more to 

### 17 protect the most vulnerable among us from unhealthy 

### 18 air. And that is why is moving ahead with the next 

### 19 phase of gasoline and tailpipe standards is critical. 

### 20 According to the proposal released by EPA on 

### 21 March 29th, Tier 3 will prevent 2,400 premature deaths, 

### 22 avoid 3,200 hospital admissions, and eliminate 22,000Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 119 1 asthma attacks each year by 2030. And all of this can 

### 2 be accomplished, but with technology we are already 

### 3 have. 

### 4Tier 3 is consistent with the global trend to 

### 5 reduce sulfur and gasoline. Refiners are already 

### 6 producing ultra-low sulfur fuel in California and much 

### 7 of the developed world, demonstrating that the 

### 8 technology to meet these standards has already been 

### 9 deployed. In 2012, the Hart Energy International Fuel 

### 10 Quality Center ranked the top 100 countries based on 

### 11 sulfur limits and gasoline. The United States at the 

### 12 current level of 30 parts per million is ranked 47th 

### 13 with higher sulfur levels than Japan, South Korea, 

### 14 Turkey, Taiwan, Thailand, Chile, and all of Europe. 

### 15Meeting the 10 part per million standard is 

### 16 estimated to cost the refiners less than a penny a 

### 17 gallon, and let's make sure that's perfectly clear. 

### 18 This is the cost to the refiners. A study by Navigant 

### 19 Economics confirms EPA's estimates, finding that the 

### 20 cost of complying with Tier 3 for U.S. refiners is "in 

### 21 the vicinity of one cent per gallon." Additionally, 

### 22 Navigant states that, "This expression of theTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 120 1 compliance cost on a cents per gallon basis does not 

### 2 imply that these compliance costs will be passed on 

### 3 fully to the consumer." 

### 4The oil industry is one of the world's most 

### 5 profitable industries. The five largest companies took 

### 6 home a combined $118 billion in profits in 20122 alone. 

### 7It's time for the oil industry to stop blocking 

### 8 progress, and given their record profits, less than a 

### 9 penny a gallon is a small price to pay to protect the 

### 10 air that we all breathe. 

### 11Despite its fear mongering, the oil industry 

### 12 stands alone in its opposition to the Tier 3 program. 

### 13 It would have you believe that the standards are 

### 14 unnecessarily burdensome, that the challenge is too 

### 15 great, and that the costs are too high. I work with 

### 16 scientists and engineers every day, and I can assure 

### 17 that this is not a question of whether or not we have 

### 18 the technical capacity to meet these standards. 

### 19 Scientists and engineers in the United States and 

### 20 around the world are already achieving goals of these 

### 21 standards, and are doing so in a cost-effective way. 

### 22 And that is why the standards are supported by healthTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 121 1 groups, labor organizations, environmental and faith 

### 2 communities, the auto industries, State and local 

### 3 officials, among others. 

### 4Please don't let the oil industry's 

### 5misleading analysis stand in the way of improving 

### 6 public health for everyone. On behalf of the UCS and 

### 7 all of our members and supporters, I urge you to 

### 8 finalize this rule before the end of the year, and 

### 9 thank you for the important work that you all do to 

### 10 protect human health, clean our air, and create a more 

### 11 sustainable future for us all. 

### 12 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you. 

### 13 Mr. German, you have the last word. 

### 14MR. GERMAN: Standing between people and 

### 15 lunch. 

### 16 My name is John German. I'm a Senior Fellow 

### 17 at the International Council on Clean Transportation. 

### 18 ICCT has broad expertise in all transportation areas, 

### 19 and our primary mission is to help regulatory agencies 

### 20 worldwide reduce air quality pollutants and greenhouse 

### 21 gas emissions. 

### 22 The ICCT strongly supports the proposed TierTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 122 1 3 standards. The standards will maintain U.S. 

### 2 leadership in light duty vehicle emission controls and 

### 3 allow the U.S. to catch up to Europe on gasoline fuel 

### 4 quality. Not only will the requirements improve public 

### 5 health in the U.S., they will help accelerate 

### 6 introduction of inexpensive emission controls in other 

### 7 countries. 

### 8 The two keys to low vehicle emissions are 

### 9 precise air fuel control and rapid catalyst light off. 

### 10 Since the Tier 2 standards were adopted, there have 

### 11 been major improvements in emission control technology. 

### 12Catalysts have improved dramatically. Fuel injection 

### 13 is more precise. Feedback of actual air fuel ratio is 

### 14 faster. Software algorithms to predict air fuel ratio 

### 15 have improved, and drive by wire system allow air and 

### 16 fuel to be changed simultaneously. This has raised 

### 17 catalyst conversion efficiency to unprecedented levels. 

### 18 The other major improvement has been 

### 19 development of initial idle retard for cold start, 

### 20 which can light up the catalyst before the initial 20- 

### 21 second idle period is done. Combining these 

### 22 technologies allow light duty vehicles to easily meetTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 123 1 the proposed Tier 3 standards, even without consider 

### 2 other improvements. 

### 3 The ICCT fully supports extending chassis 

### 4 based emission requirements to all complete vehicles up 

### 5 to 14,000 gross vehicle weight. The trend since the 

### 6 first standards were adopted in the 1970s has been to 

### 7 increase the GBW of many light trucks above the 

### 8 threshold for light duty standards. This has 

### 9 especially been a problem for diesel engines and pickup 

### 10 trucks, which are only sold above the 8,500 GBW light 

### 11 duty emission threshold. Extending the threshold to 

### 12 14,000 will ensure emission standards are applied 

### 13 appropriately to all complete vehicles. Similarly, the 

### 14 ICCT fully supports extending the supplemental FTP 

### 15 requirements to complete vehicles between 8,500 and 

### 16 14,000, which were previously exempt. 

### 17It appears that EPA is using outdated and 

### 18 overstated cost estimates. For example, the regulatory 

### 19 impact analysis shows that the estimated increase in 

### 20 precious metal cost compared to Tier 2 is $61 for a 

### 21 four-cylinder engine. For comparison, an ICCT study 

### 22 published last year found that precious metal loadingsTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 124 1 have been decreasing over time, and a Tier 3 four

### 2 cylinder vehicle only has $71 of precious metals in 

### 3 total now. EPA needs to recalibrate its cost estimates 

### 4 for the declining precious metal loadings. 

### 5The ICCT commends the EPA for fully -- 

### 6 finally proposing to reduce gasoline sulfur to 

### 7 reasonable levels. Japan and South Korea have required 

### 8 10 ppm sulfur and gasoline since 2007 and Europe since 

### 9 2009. Even Chile has required 15 ppm sulfur and 

### 10 gasoline since 2010. Given the leadership shown by the 

### 11 U.S. in most environmental areas, a lack of sulfur 

### 12 control and gasoline has been an inexplicable lapse. 

### 13 Further, the cost of reducing sulfur from 30 

### 14ppm to 10 ppm is very modest. A recent study by 

### 15 MathPro for the ICCT found that the cost would be .08 

### 16 to 1.4 cents per gallon. This cost includes revamping 

### 17 the FCC naphtha hydro treaters, historical rates of 

### 18 return on investment, supplying the additional hydrogen 

### 19 needed, and replacing losses in both gasoline volume 

### 20 and octane. In fact, the cost estimates are likely 

### 21 overstated, as MathPro assumed that all existing hydro 

### 22 treating capacity would require revamping, even thoughTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 125 1many hydro treaters installed to meet the Tier 3 sulfur 

### 2 requirements are already capable of meeting the 10 ppm 

### 3 standard. 

### 4I also want to emphasize that the impact of 

### 5 sulfur on older vehicles in grams per mile are fully as 

### 6 large as on Tier 3 vehicles, if not larger. And as 

### 7most of the sulfur impacts are reversible, reducing the 

### 8 sulfur will result in immediate and very large end use 

### 9 emission reductions. 

### 10 ICCT does have concerns in two areas. First, 

### 11 while the proposed supplemental FTP standards are a 

### 12major improvement over the SFTP standards with Tier 2, 

### 13 they are still not stringent enough. The Tier 1 SFTP 

### 14 standards were set at the same numeric level as the 

### 15 Tier 1 FTP standards. While the proposed SFTP NMOG 

### 16 plus NOx standards are 67 percent higher than the 

### 17 proposed FTP standards. The problem is far worse for 

### 18 particulate matter. As the proposed SFTP particulate 

### 19 standard is 3.3 times larger for light vehicles and 6.7 

### 20 times larger for heavy duties -- heavier vehicles than 

### 21 the FTP particulate standard. 

### 22The ICCT is also concerned about the revisionTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 126 1 to use E-15 for test fuel. This is acceptable for 

### 2 certification vehicles, but it appears the EPA is also 

### 3 proposing to use E-15 for fuel economy testing. 

### 4 Fifteen percent ethanol provides significant 

### 5 evaporative cooling in the cylinder, which would allow 

### 6 manufacturers to make modifications to improve fuel 

### 7 economy in the test cycles, but which would not 

### 8 necessarily be achieved end use. 

### 9 And I'll skip my closing. Thank you. 

### 10 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you very much. 

### 11Questions from the panel? 

### 12[No response.] 

### 13 MR. GRUNDLER: Okay. Thank you very much. 

### 14 We're running about 15 minutes early, so we will start 

### 15 panel four at 1:05. Break for lunch now. Thank you 

### 16 very much. 

### 17[Whereupon, at 12:20, the meeting was 

### 18 recessed for lunch, to reconvene at 1:10 p.m.] 

### 19 MR. GRUNDLER: We are ready to proceed with 

### 20 panel four, and I'd like to start with Molly Rauch from 

### 21 the Mom's Clean Air Force. Did I pronounce your name 

### 22 correctly?Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 127 1MS. RAUCH: Yes, thank you. Good afternoon. 

### 2I'm Molly Rauch with Mom's Clean Air Force, and I 

### 3 really appreciate the opportunity to speak with you 

### 4 today. On behalf of Mom's Clean Air Force and our more 

### 5 than 130,000 members nationwide, I thank you for the 

### 6 opportunity to speak today on this very important 

### 7 proposal to address vehicle emissions. 

### 8 I'm speaking to you today as a mom. I have 

### 9 three children ages five, seven, and nine. My youngest 

### 10 turned five just yesterday, and as I watched him blow 

### 11 out his candles last night, I was thinking about this 

### 12 hearing today and how my son's ability to take a big, 

### 13 deep breath, and make a wish, and blow out his candles 

### 14 was a precious gift, one that I can't take for granted, 

### 15 and one that we all should work hard to protect. 

### 16 One in 10 American children suffer from 

### 17 asthma. Meanwhile, more than 40 percent of Americans 

### 18 live in areas where air pollution levels exceed at 

### 19 least one Federal health standard, and cars a major 

### 20 part of that problem. Cars emit soot as well as the 

### 21 ingredients that form smog. Soot and smog trigger 

### 22 asthma attacks, making asthma worse among those whoTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 128 1 already have it and, research suggests, also causing 

### 2 asthma to develop in otherwise healthy children. 

### 3 Asthma attacks are dangerous health events, 

### 4 and as I know from my friends who have children with 

### 5 the disease, asthma attacks also burden families with 

### 6 missed school and work day. They send families to the 

### 7 doctor's office and to the pharmacy to buy medicine. 

### 8 They flood the health care system with emergency room 

### 9 visits, and they're terrifying. My children do not 

### 10 have asthma thankfully, but I myself carry an inhaler 

### 11 for my own occasional bouts of wheezing. So I know 

### 12 personally how frightening the symptoms can be. 

### 13 EPA's proposed cleaner gasoline and tailpipe 

### 14 standards will cut harmful emissions of smog-forming 

### 15 nitrogen oxides and volatile organic compounds by 80 

### 16 percent from today's levels. They'll cut dangerous 

### 17 particle pollution or soot by 70 percent, and dangerous 

### 18 air toxics pollutions, such as benzine, by nearly 40 

### 19 percent. And they'll do this by reducing the sulfur 

### 20 content of gasoline and tightening tailpipe emissions. 

### 21The air pollutants that are addressed in the 

### 22 proposed standards are correlated in study after studyTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 129 1 in a robust body of research with not only asthma, but 

### 2 also bronchitis, pneumonia, heart disease, stroke, 

### 3 increased hospital admissions, stunted lung development 

### 4 heart attacks, and premature death. Children, the 

### 5 elderly, and people who are already sick are especially 

### 6 vulnerable to the health effects of these air 

### 7 pollutants, but they're not the only ones affected. 

### 8 Every person who breathes may be affected by these 

### 9 health impacts, all of which is to say that while moms 

### 10 have a special interest in this issue, all Americans 

### 11 have a stake in the proposed standards today. 

### 12That's why Mom's Clean Air Force strongly 

### 13 supports the proposed standards, which will prevent up 

### 14 to 22,000 asthma attacks every year, according to EPA's 

### 15 analysis of the health benefits. The standards will 

### 16 also prevent up to 2,400 premature deaths and 3,200 

### 17 hospital admissions nationwide every year. They will 

### 18 reap up to $23 billion in annual health care savings by 

### 19 2030, and they will cost about a penny per gallon. 

### 20 They'll protect our kids, save us money, and they don't 

### 21 cost us every much to implement. They also have broad 

### 22 support, as you've heard today, from auto makers,Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 130 1 health professionals, the emissions control industry, 

### 2 national recreation groups, and others. 

### 3 By slashing tailpipe emissions, the standards 

### 4 very importantly will also help those children who live 

### 5 closest to major roads and traffic congestion. Those 

### 6 children are disproportionately African-American, 

### 7 Hispanic, and other minorities. They also tend to be 

### 8 poorer than children who live farther away from 

### 9 highways and traffic. Not unexpectedly, such children 

### 10 are more likely to have asthma than their white peers. 

### 11So the standards will improve the health of 

### 12 those children who need it most, and will help mitigate 

### 13 the racial, ethnic, and economic disparities of 

### 14pollution exposures and disease distribution. It just 

### 15makes good sense to clean up asthma triggers at their 

### 16 source. 

### 17I live with my family in Washington, D.C., a 

### 18 city with notoriously horrible traffic that also often 

### 19 has unhealthy levels of ozone. In fact, D.C. has 

### 20 received a failing grade for ozone levels from the 

### 21American Lung Association "State of the Air Report." 

### 22 The proposed cleaner gasoline and tailpipe standardsTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 131 1 will help reduce the number of days that my children 

### 2 have to breathe unhealthy levels of smog. 

### 3 Please finalize these health protective 

### 4 standards quickly so that my children and yours can 

### 5 blow out their birthday candles year after year. Thank 

### 6 you. 

### 7MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you very much. 

### 8 Jim Kliesch? 

### 9 MR. KLIESCH: My name is Jim Kliesch, Honda's 

### 10 Environmental Regulatory Affairs Manager, and I am here 

### 11 today to voice Honda's strong support for key aspects 

### 12 of EPA's proposed Tier 3 motor vehicle emission and 

### 13 fuel standards. 

### 14Honda is a company long committed to the 

### 15 environment, social responsibility, and sustainability, 

### 16 and we appreciate the Agency's efforts to reduce 

### 17 vehicle emissions and the adverse health impacts 

### 18 associated with them. 

### 19 Honda's engineers and certification 

### 20 specialists are presently assessing the rule in detail, 

### 21 and we will speak to it in its entirety in written 

### 22 comments submitted within the comment period. Today,Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 132 1 however, I would like to spend my time to raise two 

### 2 issues that Honda considers of critical importance: 

### 3 gasoline sulfur and harmonization between Federal and 

### 4 State regulatory requirements. 

### 5As you know, through the use of sophisticated 

### 6 emissions control technology, the automotive industry 

### 7 has been able to achieve extraordinarily low exhaust 

### 8 levels throughout a vehicle's life. The anticipated 

### 9 Tier 3 standards and the LEV Ill standards of 

### 10 California will push those emissions to near zero 

### 11 levels. But doing so requires the use of vehicle 

### 12 technology and fuels that complement one another. 

### 13 Sulfur in gasoline has long been known to adversely 

### 14 affect catalyst performance and, as a result, achieving 

### 15 the Tier 3 and LEV Ill stringencies is highly dependent 

### 16 on the vehicles' use of low-sulfur fuel. California 

### 17 has recognized this in its LEV Ill standards, requiring 

### 18 an average of 15 parts per million and a cap of 20 

### 19 parts per million. It is critical that EPA set a 

### 20 national gasoline sulfur average and cap levels 

### 21 equivalent to those specified in the California 

### 22 regulations.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 133 1Lowering sulfur will enable new vehicles to 

### 2 better meet the cleaner proposed emissions standards 

### 3 for the duration or their useful life, improving air 

### 4 quality as those vehicles work their way into the 

### 5 vehicle population. It's also worth mentioning that 

### 6 lowering the sulfur content of gasoline has another, 

### 7 less gradual benefit. As the Agency notes in the 

### 8 proposed rule, cleaner fuel "facilitates immediate 

### 9 emissions reduction from all vehicles on the road at 

### 10 the time the sulfur controls are implemented." Failing 

### 11 to bring cleaner fuel to market in a timely manner 

### 12 would miss a fundamental opportunity presented by this 

### 13 systemic approach to regulating both vehicles and 

### 14 fuels. 

### 15It should also be noted that the Tier 3 

### 16 standards have an important relationship with other 

### 17 recently finalized vehicle regulations, the model year 

### 18 2017-2025 fuel economy and vehicle greenhouse gas 

### 19 standards. As a result of the latter set of standards, 

### 20 numerous efforts are now underway to improve the 

### 21 thermal efficiency of advanced internal combustion 

### 22 engines. These efforts are successfully reducing wasteTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 134 1 heat, delivering more energy to the wheels. Yet 

### 2 because catalysts use wasted engine heat to reach 

### 3 operating temperatures, cooler engines mean catalyst 

### 4 operating temperatures. These catalysts are more 

### 5 likely to be poisoned by sulfur in the fuel. 

### 6 Countermeasures to ensure after treatment operability 

### 7 in a sulfur-rich environment would require burning 

### 8 burning unnecessary excess fuel, eroding mpg and 

### 9 putting additional greenhouse gas emissions into the 

### 10 atmosphere, exactly the opposite of the intended fuel 

### 11 economy and greenhouse gas regulations. 

### 12Setting fuel sulfur standards comparable to 

### 13 those currently set in California would ensure that the 

### 14 Tier 3, LEV III, fuel economy, and vehicle greenhouse 

### 15 gas policies are working not at odds with one another, 

### 16 but rather in a complementary manner, opening doors to 

### 17 future designs that are both cleaner and more fuel 

### 18 efficient. 

### 19 The second matter I'd like to raise today is 

### 20 the issue of harmonization between Federal and State 

### 21 standards. Much has been said during the past few 

### 22 years about the importance of regulatory harmonization.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 135 1With near unanimity, the auto industry supported the 

### 2 2012 to 2016 and 2017 to 2025 vehicle greenhouse gas 

### 3 standards, in large part because it represented a 

### 4 national, unified solution to a complex set of 

### 5 competing Federal and State standards. Honda produces 

### 6 a wide range of vehicles for an equally wide 

### 7 demographic of buyers that requires multidimensional 

### 8 considerations about what to produce, how many to 

### 9 produce, the cost to produce our products, and where 

### 10 those models will most likely be purchased. Having to 

### 11 deal with competing Federal and State regulatory 

### 12 requirements only complicates those decisions further. 

### 13 As the EPA considers setting Tier 3 vehicle 

### 14 emissions and fuel requirements, we urge the Agency to 

### 15 harmonize to the greatest extent possible with 

### 16 California's LEV III regulations for certification fuel 

### 17 characteristics and market fuel characteristics and 

### 18 market fuel characteristics. Doing so would enable one 

### 19 fleet of vehicles to meet all U.S. regulations, 

### 20 substantially easing both the regulatory burden and 

### 21 cost of complying, letting us provide our customers 

### 22 greater affordability, and allowing us to design ourTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 136 1 vehicles to maintain consistent performance and 

### 2 emissions durability across the Nation. 

### 3 One of the more important regulatory 

### 4 achievements of this Administration has been its 

### 5 actions to harmonize the Federal fuel economy and 

### 6 vehicle greenhouse gas regulations with those of 

### 7 California. A harmonized set of tailpipe emissions and 

### 8 fuel regulations would complement a key objective laid 

### 9 out by President Obama in the May 21st, 2010 White 

### 10 House memorandum. It states: "The national program 

### 11 should seek to produce joint Federal standards that are 

### 12 harmonized with applicable State standards, with the 

### 13 goal of ensuring that automobile manufacturers will be 

### 14 able to build a single, light duty national fleet." We 

### 15 couldn't agree more. 

### 16 MR. GRUNDLER: I need you to wrap it up, Jim. 

### 17MR. KLIESCH: Honda urges the Agency to 

### 18 finalize a set of standards that offers the greatest 

### 19 degree of harmonization with State standards, as well 

### 20 as to ensure that the fuel operated in these vehicles 

### 21 will accommodate the advanced emissions control systems 

### 22 needed to meet the proposed standards.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 137 1Once again, we thank the Agency for its work 

### 2 in developing these proposed standards. We look 

### 3 forward to their prompt finalization by the end of 

### 4 2013, to maximize regulatory certainty. 

### 5Thank you again for the opportunity to 

### 6 testify today. I appreciate your attention. 

### 7MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you, Jim. 

### 8 Mr. Hirshfeld, welcome. 

### 9 MR. HIRSHFELD: Thank you. Good afternoon. 

### 10 My name is Dave Hirshfeld. I'm the head of MathPro, 

### 11 Incorporated, a consulting firm specializing in the 

### 12 technical and economic analysis of refining operations. 

### 13 In the summer of 2011, the International Council on 

### 14 Clean Transportation commissioned us to estimate the 

### 15 U.S. refining sector's investment requirements and 

### 16 average cost for reducing average sulfur content of the 

### 17 U.S. gasoline pool from 30 ppm, the current standard, 

### 18 to 10 ppm, the proposed Tier 3 standard, and also for 

### 19 reducing the summer re-vapor pressure standard of U.S. 

### 20 conventional gasoline. Our report from that study was 

### 21 submitted to EPA in October of 2011. 

### 22My testimony today deals exclusively withTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 138 1 sulfur control. 

### 2Our analysis indicated that the refinery 

### 3 investment for meeting the 10 ppm gasoline sulfur 

### 4 standard would be in the range of $3 to $4 billion per 

### 5 year, and that the corresponding total annual refining 

### 6 cost would be in the range of $.9 to $1.5 billion a 

### 7 year. And that corresponds to an average cost of 

### 8 eight-tenths of a percent to 1.4 cent per gallon of 

### 9 gasoline. 

### 10 This range of estimated average cost reflects 

### 11 different assumptions regarding two economic factors: 

### 12 the rate of return on refinery investment and the 

### 13 capital cost of revamping FCC naphtha hydro treaters, a 

### 14particular type of unit in U.S. refineries to enable 

### 15 those units to carry out the more severe de

### 16 sulfurization needed to meet the 10 ppm standard. 

### 17The higher estimate of 1.4 cents a gallon 

### 18 reflects a 10 percent after tax return on investment 

### 19 and a capital cost for revamping of about 50 percent, 

### 20 about half, of the capital costs for a grass roots unit 

### 21 of the same kind and size. The lower estimate of 

### 22 eight-tenths of a cent a gallon reflects a sevenTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 139 1 percent pre-tax return on investment, and about a 30 

### 2 percent factor applied to the capital cost of revamping 

### 3 a grass roots unit. 

### 4In turn, we estimated that the capital cost 

### 5 of a grass roots FCC naphtha hydro treater would be 

### 6 about $1,800 per barrel per day, which is a standard 

### 7 unit of capital cost measurement and refining, and that 

### 8 includes both on-site and offsite investments. These 

### 9 investment estimates and refining cost estimates cover 

### 10 de-sulfurizing the refinery streams needed to meet the 

### 11 10 ppm average, supplying the additional hydrogen 

### 12 needed for de-sulfurization, replacing the small losses 

### 13 in both gasoline volume and gasoline octane that 

### 14 accompany tight de-sulfurization, and expanding 

### 15 refineries' sulfur recovery in offsites is needed to 

### 16 support additional sulfur control. 

### 17We conducted our analysis using four regional 

### 18 refinery LP models representing projected aggregated 

### 19 refining capacity in pads one through four, with all 

### 20 major regulatory programs affecting fuel quality in 

### 21 place. We have used similar refinery LP models in many 

### 22 previous analyses of the refining costs of new fuelTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 140 1 standards, including Tier 3 gasoline sulfur, ULSD, 

### 2 Federal and California RFG programs, and Arizona CBG. 

### 3 In this study, our models represented the 

### 4 U.S. refining sector maintaining regional and total 

### 5 U.S. gasoline production at the volumes projected by 

### 6 EIA for 2015, meaning the refineries would adjust 

### 7 operations to replace the small losses in volume that 

### 8 would accompany tighter sulfur control. Our projected 

### 9 product volumes, crude oil, and natural gas prices for 

### 10 2015 were developed from EIA's AEO 2011. 

### 11Meeting the 30 ppm standard, we posited that 

### 12 the method of choice for refiners would be to revamp 

### 13 their existing units rather than build grass units of 

### 14 another type. Refineries that now meet the 30 ppm 

### 15 standard with these units would add facilities, go 

### 16 through a revamp, and through that achieve the 10 ppm 

### 17 standard. 

### 18 We understand that many of these units that 

### 19 are already in place already have the capability to 

### 20 meet a 10 ppm standard, but in our analysis, we assume 

### 21 that all units in the U.S. refining sector would 

### 22 require revamping.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 141 1The U.S. refining industry has already 

### 2 installed about 75 of these advanced units in order to 

### 3 comply with Tier 2, and many similar units have been 

### 4 installed in other countries as well. Hence, the range 

### 5 of capital costs and operating costs for these units is 

### 6 now reasonably well established. 

### 7I see I've run out of time, so I'll end it 

### 8 there. Thank you. 

### 9 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you, Mr. Hirshfeld. 

### 10 We'll probably have some follow-up questions for you, 

### 11 so you can elaborate then. 

### 12Ms. Ways, Maryland. Welcome. 

### 13 MS. WAYS: Good afternoon. My name is Marcia 

### 14 Ways, and I'm the Program Manager for the Mobile 

### 15 Sources Control Program in the Air and Radiation 

### 16 Management Administration at the Maryland Department of 

### 17 the Environment. I appreciate this opportunity to 

### 18 testify on the EPA's proposed Tier 3 motor vehicle and 

### 19 fuel standards. 

### 20 I'm here today to commend EPA on issuing the 

### 21 proposed Tier 3 standards and to offer Maryland's full 

### 22 support of this important air quality program. We knowTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 142 1 of no other strategy that can provide the substantial, 

### 2 immediate, and cost-effective air quality benefits as 

### 3 these Tier 3 standards. 

### 4The Tier 3 standards are critical to Maryland 

### 5 in several ways. They are the single most important 

### 6 set of measures that EPA can implement to reduce 

### 7 transportation-related emissions, which are the number 

### 8 one contributor to Maryland's problems with ground 

### 9 level ozone. Unfortunately, Maryland records the worst 

### 10 ozone levels anywhere east of the Mississippi. The 

### 11 Tier 3 standards will dramatically reduce the emissions 

### 12 from local vehicles, but, more importantly, they will 

### 13 also reduce emissions from vehicles traveling through 

### 14 Maryland, as well as those operating in States upwind 

### 15 of us. About 70 percent of Maryland's ground level 

### 16 ozone problems originates in upstate winds -- I'm 

### 17 sorry, upwind States. Mobile sources are the most 

### 18 significant contributor to Maryland's problem with 

### 19 ozone transport. 

### 20 The low sulfur fuel component of the Tier 3 

### 21 standards alone will provide significant local 

### 22 reductions in NOx emissions from the existing fleet.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 143 1 Our research shows that reducing NOx emissions is the 

### 2 key to further reducing ground level ozone. The NOx 

### 3 reductions from the Tier 3 program are absolutely 

### 4 critical to Maryland's ability to attain the ozone 

### 5 standard, as well as our efforts to restore the 

### 6 Chesapeake Bay. 

### 7The automobile industry has achieved amazing 

### 8 technological advances in reducing automobile emissions 

### 9 and is now doing the same in improving fuel efficiency. 

### 10 The petroleum industry has made similar progress in 

### 11 reducing the emissions from fuels that are used to 

### 12 power our vehicles. In spite of tremendous progress 

### 13 made at the State, regional, and Federal levels over 

### 14 the past 40 years, poor air quality continues to be one 

### 15 of our State's most pervasive environmental problems. 

### 16 The Tier 3 standards will benefit Maryland by 

### 17 reducing emissions of the pollutants that cause our 

### 18 continuing ozone non-attainment problem. More than 90 

### 19 percent of Maryland's citizens live in ozone non

### 20 attainment areas, and reducing NOx emissions is crucial 

### 21 to improving this air quality. 

### 22In 2006, Maryland adopted one of theTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 144 1 country's toughest power plant laws called the Maryland 

### 2 Healthy Air Act. Because of this law, mobile sources 

### 3 are now the leading contributor to NOx emissions in 

### 4 Maryland, emitting more than twice the emissions of 

### 5 power plants. Emissions from cars and trucks also 

### 6 contribute to fine particle pollution and are key 

### 7 sources of hazardous air pollutants. These pollutants 

### 8 disproportionately affect people living and working in 

### 9 our urban communities where vehicle congestion and 

### 10 population density are highest. 

### 11NOx and other vehicle related pollutants also 

### 12 contribute to the number of -- I'm sorry -- a number of 

### 13 environmental problems, such as acid rain, stream 

### 14 eutrophication, and regional haze that affect cherished 

### 15 and economically valuable natural resources, such as 

### 16 the Chesapeake Bay. The Chesapeake Bay is a national 

### 17 treasure and vital to the economic health and cultural 

### 18 identity of Maryland. 

### 19 Reducing mobile source NOx emissions is an 

### 20 important component of our Chesapeake Bay restoration 

### 21 effort. Atmospheric deposition of nitrogen is 

### 22 responsible for approximately one-third of the Bay'sTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 145 1 nutrient pollution, and 50 percent of that nitrogen is 

### 2 attributable to mobile source emissions. The Tier 3 

### 3 standards will dramatically reduce nitrogen deposition 

### 4 to the Bay. 

### 5Maryland has already implemented some of the 

### 6 most stringent emission control strategies in efforts 

### 7 to attain the ozone standard. The Maryland Healthy Air 

### 8 Act, designed to reduce power plant and NOx emissions 

### 9 by 75 percent and SOCs emissions by 85 percent, is now 

### 10 in place and has cut emissions from that sector 

### 11 dramatically. 

### 12Maryland has also regulated emissions from 

### 13 consumer goods, such as household products, perfumes 

### 14 and dyes, household and industrial paints, asphalt 

### 15 paving operations, and cement plants. On the mobile 

### 16 source side, Maryland has adopted the California Low 

### 17 Emissions Vehicle program. We have required the use of 

### 18 Federal reformulated gasoline in all of our non

### 19 attainment areas, and we operate a highly effective 

### 20 vehicle emissions inspection and maintenance program. 

### 21Given the stringency of Maryland's existing 

### 22 emissions controls, the Federal constraints on StateTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 146 1 regulation of motor vehicles and fuels, and the fact 

### 2 that Maryland is significantly impacted by pollution 

### 3 transport from sources outside the region, these 

### 4 national emission control measures for cars and trucks 

### 5 are critical to achieving further improvements in our 

### 6 air quality. 

### 7The world is moving towards cleaner cars and 

### 8 lower sulfur gasoline. We are confident that the 

### 9 refiners and the automobile manufacturers will continue 

### 10 to find new and innovative ways to meet the new 

### 11 requirements. As a State agency facing the challenges 

### 12 of attaining the health-based standards for ozone and 

### 13 particulate matter, as well as undertaking measures to 

### 14 address widespread toxic air pollution, a stringent and 

### 15 cost effective program to tackle emissions from cars 

### 16 and trucks, which are key contributors to all of these, 

### 17 is critical. 

### 18 Maryland encourages EPA to take full 

### 19 advantage of this opportunity to establish a meaningful 

### 20 and effective Tier 3 program to help States and 

### 21 localities meet our clean air obligations. 

### 22Thank you.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 147 1MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you, Marcia. 

### 2Next is Ms. Wijeyewickrema. Welcome. 

### 3 MS. WIJEYEWICKREMA: Good afternoon. I am 

### 4 Kesaaraa Wijeyewickrema, Manager of the Clean Vehicles 

### 5 and Fuels Program at the American Lung Association. 

### 6 For over 100 years, the American Lung Association has 

### 7 been working to protect healthy lungs and healthy air. 

### 8 We believe that every American has the right to 

### 9 breathe clean and healthy air, and although we've made 

### 10 progress in the U.S., largely due to the Clean Air Act, 

### 11millions of Americans remain at risk from air 

### 12 pollution. 

### 13 One of the most cost effective tools we have 

### 14 available to clean up air pollution is the proposed 

### 15 cleaner gasoline and vehicle standards. For about a 

### 16 penny per gallon of gas, we can save thousands of lives 

### 17 each year. That's why the American Lung Association 

### 18 and our partners, including the American Heart 

### 19 Association, American Public Health Association, the 

### 20 American Thoracic Society, Asthma and Allergy 

### 21 Foundation of America, Health Care Without Harm, 

### 22 National Association of County and City HealthTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 148 1 Officials, and Trust for America's Health, sent the 

### 2 President a letter supporting cleaner gasoline and 

### 3 vehicle standards in January of this year. And that is 

### 4why I'm here today. 

### 5We applaud the EPA's efforts to cut life

### 6 threatening tailpipe pollution, and we urge you not to 

### 7 delay in finalizing these standards, because millions 

### 8 of Americans remain at risk. Tailpipe pollution can be 

### 9 most toxic within 300 to 500 meters of a roadway and 

### 10 can cause harm to lung and heart health. A 2010 survey 

### 11 of existing research by the Health Effects Institute, 

### 12 also found evidence suggestive of a causal link between 

### 13 traffic pollution and the onset of childhood asthma, 

### 14 non-asthma respiratory symptoms, impaired lung 

### 15 function, total and cardiovascular mortality, and 

### 16 cardiovascular morbidity. 

### 17While our most vulnerable populations to 

### 18 tailpipe pollution are children, older adults, those 

### 19 with existing conditions such as asthma, reduced lung 

### 20 function, chronic obstructive pulmonary disease, heart 

### 21 disease and diabetes, tailpipe pollution endangers the 

### 22 public health at large. It's not just those of us whoTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 149 1 live or go to school or work near busy roadways that 

### 2 are affected by traffic pollution. Particulate matter, 

### 3 deadly pollution that is formed in the atmosphere from 

### 4 tailpipe emissions, can stay suspended in the 

### 5 atmosphere for days or weeks because of their small 

### 6 size. These small particles can be transported into 

### 7 nearby neighborhoods or even hundreds of miles away, 

### 8 affecting people in neighboring cities and states. 

### 9 Cleaner gasoline and vehicle standards will 

### 10 reduce particle, or soot, pollution as well as ozone or 

### 11 smog pollution. The health benefits of the proposed 

### 12 cleaner gasoline and vehicle standards are great, and 

### 13 as you've heard today, every stakeholder except one 

### 14 supports these lifesaving standards. In January, the 

### 15 American Lung Association released a bipartisan poll 

### 16 that found an overwhelming majority -- 62 percent to 32 

### 17 percent -- of Americans support cleaner gasoline and 

### 18 vehicle standards. 

### 19 The American Lung Association urges you to 

### 20 finalize these standards immediately so that all 

### 21Americans can benefit from healthier air. Thank you 

### 22 for the opportunity to speak in support of cleanerTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 150 1 gasoline and vehicle standards today. 

### 2MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you very much. 

### 3 Next, Mark Zakutansky? 

### 4MR. ZAKUTANSKY: Thank you. It's a pleasure 

### 5 to be here today on behalf of the Appalachian Mountain 

### 6 Club. The Appalachian Mountain Club strongly supports 

### 7 the Tier 3 rule as proposed and urges that the rule be 

### 8 finalized before the end of this year. 

### 9 Our organization supports healthy, clean 

### 10 outdoor air for tens of millions to our parks and 

### 11 trails throughout the Northeast, such as the iconic 

### 12 Northern Forest in New England, the Appalachian Trail, 

### 13 and scenic places in the Mid-Atlantic region, like the 

### 14 Delaware Water Gap National Recreation Area and the 

### 15 Delaware Bayshore. 

### 16 The Appalachian Mountain Club works to 

### 17 connect people to the outdoors for healthy recreation 

### 18 in the mountains and rivers, but also close to home, 

### 19 such as in local parks or along bike paths. 

### 20 Unfortunately, many of our 100,000 members and 

### 21 supporters live and recreate in areas that are 

### 22 experiencing air pollution that poses serious healthTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 151 1 impacts. 

### 2The impacts of poor air quality on 

### 3 individuals who enjoy outdoor recreation are very real. 

### 4For example, high levels of ozone are particularly 

### 5 troublesome for children in the outdoors, especially at 

### 6 higher elevations. The Appalachian Mountain Club's own 

### 7monitoring and research, in conjunction with Harvard 

### 8 School of Public Health and Brigham and Women's 

### 9 Hospital, has shown that ozone can impair lung function 

### 10 in healthy people hiking to reach the summit of Mount 

### 11 Washington in New Hampshire. Furthermore, while ozone 

### 12 levels have improved regionally and in rural mountains, 

### 13 levels on Mount Washington remain high, to the concern 

### 14 of the AMC and our members. 

### 15Fine particulates and toxins also pose 

### 16 significant health concerns for those who enjoy 

### 17 exercising in the outdoors because they experience a 

### 18 heighted exposure while breathing more deeply. While 

### 19 our Nation works to overcome challenges in connecting 

### 20 today's youth and families to the outdoors, we must 

### 21 ensure healthy, clean air at our parks and trails in 

### 22 urban and rural areas.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 152 1Building on EPA's Tier 2 regulation finalized 

### 2 in 2000, Tier 3 uses the same system approach of 

### 3 addressing both fuel and emissions simultaneously. We 

### 4 strongly agree with the EPA that this is a cost 

### 5 effective solution, and that addressing fuel quality is 

### 6 necessary for reaching the much needed emission 

### 7 reductions that would otherwise not be technologically 

### 8 achievable. The adjustment in sulfur fuel content is 

### 9 needed as sulfur fouls the efficiency of vehicle 

### 10 catalytic converters, a key system component that 

### 11 reduces smog forming emissions and toxic air pollution. 

### 12Many States, especially here in the Mid

### 13 Atlantic, may have difficulties attaining or 

### 14maintaining the National Ambient Air Quality Standards 

### 15 for ozone in the coming years, without Tier 3. 

### 16 Oh behalf of our members and supporters, and 

### 17 the tens of millions of individuals and families who 

### 18 enjoy outdoor recreation in the Northeast and around 

### 19 our country, we urge the EPA to expedite this very 

### 20 important and common sense proposal to the final rule. 

### 21Thank you. 

### 22MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 153 1Reverend Brown, welcome. 

### 2REVEREND BROWN: Good afternoon. I'm 

### 3 Reverend Jesse Brown. I'm a pastor here, a Lutheran 

### 4pastor, in Southeastern Pennsylvania Center, serving 

### 5 congregations in both Philadelphia and in Camden, New 

### 6 Jersey. And to some degree, I am glad to be here that 

### 7 this issue is being aired, and at the same time I'm 

### 8 dismayed because my question would be, why aren't we 

### 9 there yet? 

### 10 The evidence appears to be fairly clear in a 

### 11 number of ways that without this regulation, it will 

### 12 continue to contribute to air pollution, health 

### 13 effects, and a number of other things, you know, 

### 14 already there. You would think common sense would 

### 15 work, but obviously common sense doesn't work, so we 

### 16 have to come into a hearing to plead the case before 

### 17 the public that we ought to be taking the steps. So I 

### 18 still have to ask, why aren't we there? 

### 19 We know that businesses will be hurt by 

### 20 unhealthy people. It affects particularly 

### 21 productivity, as well as parents and others who have to 

### 22 be out to take care of children who may end up withTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 154 1 asthma or other things that this proposed rule helps to 

### 2mitigate to some degree. Again, you still have to ask, 

### 3 why aren't we there? It seems rather easy -- it seems 

### 4 to be a common sense thing that if we pass this 

### 5 regulation, the benefits to America and our society is 

### 6 great. 

### 7But let me add one other thing. I think part 

### 8 of the reason why I am able to be here is because I do 

### 9 believe there is a moral imperative, and that 

### 10 imperative is not only incumbent upon us here. And you 

### 11may look at that moral imperative in all kinds of ways. 

### 12Too often when we come to these hearings, people start 

### 13 to dismiss the moral imperative as not being important 

### 14 or somehow it's somewhere else out there, when, in 

### 15 fact, the moral imperative ought to be that which is 

### 16 guiding our decision making and moving us forward. 

### 17 That's where we start with that imperative. 

### 18 Now, I might start with loving they neighbor 

### 19 as thyself, but I think it's pretty consistent with the 

### 20 imperative that you folks have in protecting the air, 

### 21 water, and land. To me, that's loving my neighbor as 

### 22 well as myself.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 155 1This moral imperative should be the guiding 

### 2 principle for our actions and your actions in moving 

### 3 this issue right along the line. And I believe that in 

### 4 the end, we of course will get this. I think we'll get 

### 5 this thing passed. But we ought to make certain that - 

### 6 - you ought to make certain that as you continue to do 

### 7 your job, that you are responsible for all Americans, 

### 8 rich and poor, in the cities, in the suburbs, those 

### 9 upstream, those downstream. However you look at it, 

### 10 you're responsible for all of us. 

### 11This measure meets that requirement. It 

### 12 takes care of all of us. It helps make our lives 

### 13 easier. It removes to some degree the misery index 

### 14 that we sometimes find with people who are suffering 

### 15 from illnesses that this regulation hopes to mitigate. 

### 16 So I'm at least happy to be here to that 

### 17 degree to be able to air my particular thought on this 

### 18 process. And I want to yield back the last measure of 

### 19 my time only to those who have good sense and common 

### 20 sense. Thank you. 

### 21MR. GRUNDLER: Well, Mr. Tsuo, the challenge 

### 22 is yours.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 156 1[Laughter.] 

### 2DR. TSUO: Well, I hope do have good sense. 

### 3 Thank you, Reverend Brown. 

### 4My name is Dr. Walter Tsuo. I chair the 

### 5 Board of Philadelphia Physicians for Social 

### 6 Responsibility. I speak today in support of the 

### 7 proposed Tier 3 rules which will reduce the allowable 

### 8 amount of sulfur and gasoline and set new standards for 

### 9 vehicle emissions. 

### 10 Now 13 years after the Tier 2 final rules on 

### 11 sulfur were published, it's time to update these 

### 12 regulations. We know that we have the technical 

### 13 ability to do this because we already require these 

### 14 standards in California, Japan, South Korea, and most 

### 15 of Western Europe. Because you will hear from many 

### 16 others on the Tier 3 rules, I will limit my few minutes 

### 17 to the harmful effects of sulfur. 

### 18 One of the most important higher sulfur 

### 19 effects is actually mechanical, and it's an adverse 

### 20 effect on the catalytic converter system. Laws of the 

### 21 effectiveness of the catalytic converters allow a 

### 22 variety of noxious and harmful pollutants in theTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 157 1 environment, notably the oxides of nitrogen, carbon 

### 2monoxide, sulfur dioxide, and particulate matter 2.5. 

### 3 All are known contributors to smog and air pollution. 

### 4Sulfur upon combustion in a car engine is 

### 5 converted into the oxides of sulfur, which are known 

### 6 respiratory irritants. There's a suffocating odor 

### 7 similar to rotten eggs. The most common and 

### 8 significant oxide is sulfur dioxide. About 10 to 20 

### 9 percent of young adults are sensitive to even small 

### 10 amounts of exposure to sulfur dioxide. 

### 11It can cause severe irritation of the nose 

### 12 and throat, and even short-term exposures of sulfur 

### 13 dioxide can trigger bronchial constriction and 

### 14 exacerbate asthma in susceptible patients. The sulfur 

### 15 dioxide can attach to small particles and are then 

### 16 inhaled deep into the alveoli of lung tissue, 

### 17 exacerbating those with respiratory disease. 

### 18 Studies have shown that these exacerbations 

### 19 can worsen emphysema, bronchitis, and pre-existent 

### 20 heart disease, leading to hospitalizations and even 

### 21 death . As such, sulfur dioxide is classified as very 

### 22 toxic.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 158 1Sulfur dioxide combined with water can form 

### 2 sulfurous acid, and continued exposure to sulfurous 

### 3 acid can lead to permanent destruction of lung tissue 

### 4 and skin and eye irritation. Its presence in high 

### 5 concentration contributes to acid rain, although it's 

### 6 largely formed by dissolved CO2, which is clearly 

### 7 harmful to our water supply and oceans. 

### 8 So in summary, sulfur is nasty. It has many 

### 9 significant adverse health effects. Reduction of some 

### 10 sulfur in fuel will lead to better emission control 

### 11 through catalytic converters, reduce respiratory and 

### 12 cardiac events, and help at reducing acid rain on our 

### 13 planet. 

### 14Thank you for this opportunity to express my 

### 15 opinion. 

### 16 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you very much, panel. 

### 17 Any questions? 

### 18 MR. MACHIELE: Sure. I'm the fuels guy. I 

### 19 have to ask a fuel question. So, David Hirshfeld, did 

### 20 your modeling account for the ABT flexibility that we 

### 21 had in the proposal? 

### 22 MR. HIRSHFELD: No, it did not because weTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 159 1 were working with regional aggregate models. They were 

### 2 not representing individual refineries, but, you know, 

### 3 regional sectors. So we really had no way of 

### 4 considering ABT within that modeling framework. 

### 5MR. MACHIELE: So a follow-up question then. 

### 6 If a refinery faced higher marginal costs than others 

### 7 for revamps like you were assuming, what options might 

### 8 they pursue versus what you assumed? 

### 9 MR. HIRSCHFELD: High cost refineries you 

### 10 mean? 

### 11MR. MACHIELE: Right. 

### 12MR. HIRSHFELD: Well, obviously one would be 

### 13 to try to capitalize on ABT, particularly if we had a 

### 14 refinery like that that was part of a multi-refiner 

### 15 company and refining circuit. Or there would probably 

### 16 be some tradeoffs available between increasing capital 

### 17 investment to go beyond revamping the FCC in exchange 

### 18 for resulting lower per gallon operating costs. 

### 19 MR. MACHIELE: Okay, thanks. 

### 20 MS. SARGEANT: I have a question for Marcia 

### 21 Ways from Maryland. You spoke to the various needs for 

### 22 emission reductions that your State faces, and ITranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 160 1 wondered if you could speak some to the timing of the 

### 2 emission reductions of when you need them and over what 

### 3 time they're helpful. 

### 4MS. WAYS: Yesterday. No, definitely within 

### 5 the time frame of the proposal. I mean, I think 

### 6 Maryland has had -- the Baltimore area has had a hard 

### 7 time meeting the current ozone standard, and I know 

### 8 that we're looking at possibly tightening the standard 

### 9 in the next few years. So anything we can get as soon 

### 10 as we can get would definitely be as helpful as we can. 

### 11MS. SARGEANT: Thank you. 

### 12MR. GRUNDLER: I'd like to pose another 

### 13 question for Mr. Hirshfeld. Earlier today we heard 

### 14 some testimony about a study that was commissioned by 

### 15 the American Petroleum Institute. Are you familiar 

### 16 with that? 

### 17MR. HIRSHFELD: I am. 

### 18 MR. GRUNDLER: Baker and O'Brien. 

### 19 MR. HIRSHFELD: I am. 

### 20 MR. GRUNDLER: Would you care to comment on 

### 21 the primary differences that account for the cost range 

### 22 in your work versus the six to nine cents that wasTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 161 1 cited this morning? 

### 2MR. HIRSHFELD: Sure. There are several. 

### 3 One has to do with the estimated capital cost for 

### 4 building grass roots FCC post treaters and, hence, for 

### 5 revamping them. The estimate that we use, which I 

### 6 mentioned in my testimony, is about $1,800 of daily 

### 7 barrel. I believe the Baker and O'Brien study used a 

### 8 number that was about double that approximately. So 

### 9 that was one difference. 

### 10 Another difference is that our focus was on 

### 11 estimating average refining costs. This is sometimes 

### 12 called a social cost or a national cost. And we did 

### 13 not -- well, we did not return or publish a marginal 

### 14 cost, whereas the headline number in the Baker and 

### 15 O'Brien study was a marginal cost, you know, the 

### 16 economics of a high cost refiner. And we did not do 

### 17 that because we didn't think it was appropriate for 

### 18 this analysis. 

### 19 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you. Anything further? 

### 20 [No response.] 

### 21MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you so much for your 

### 22 time today.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 162 1Okay. The next panel we have some additions, 

### 2 so listen for your name. Irene Harlabatos, Jacqueline 

### 3 Saier, Jalonne White-Newsome, Joy Bergey, and Reverend 

### 4 Mordecai Lebling, Larry Menkes, Christopher Miles, Dawn 

### 5 Patterson, and Reverend Pyrch, and William Kramer. 

### 6 Welcome. I hope we have enough chairs. 

### 7I'd like to begin with Ms. White-Newsome. 

### 8 DR. WHITE-NEWSOME: Good afternoon. Thank 

### 9 you so much for the opportunity to be here and provide 

### 10 comments on these proposed rules. My name is Dr. 

### 11 Jalonne White-Newsome, and I'm a Federal Policy Analyst 

### 12 with WE ACT for Environmental Justice, a 25-ycar old EJ 

### 13 organization based in Harlem, New York with offices 

### 14 also in Washington. DC. Our mission is to, of course, 

### 15 build healthy communities and make sure that people of 

### 16 color as well as those at a lower income are part of 

### 17 that process to create sound and fair environmental 

### 18 health policies and practices. And so the inception of 

### 19 our organization, in fact, was based on a clean battle 

### 20 in Northern Manhattan. 

### 21So in all of our work, we continue to engage 

### 22 communities as well as work with academic partners andTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 163 1 others to make sure that the protection of human health 

### 2 and welfare, despite the hue of your skin, and the 

### 3 resources in your pocket, or the zip code you happen to 

### 4 live in, impacts your health. 

### 5I'm sure you know that the residents of 

### 6 Harlem, New York and many other similar cities and 

### 7 towns across our U.S. are not breathing the same air. 

### 8 Some is clean and some is pretty dirty. But I was 

### 9 reminded of the importance of this yesterday when I 

### 10 went to pick up my two little girls from school. 

### 11 Usually I go through the same motions of signing them 

### 12 out and saying hi to some of the moms and dads. And I 

### 13 noticed a little girl with two little pigtails sitting 

### 14 having a breathing treatment behind the secretary's 

### 15 desk. And I kind of gave her a smile and kind of 

### 16 looked at her, and thinking about Earth Day and all the 

### 17 celebrations that have been going on. And just 

### 18 realized, this is the reason that most of us in this 

### 19 room engage in this work, to protect those little ones. 

### 20 And so I also thought about some of the work 

### 21 in Detroit, Michigan, my home town, where I've 

### 22 specifically worked with senior citizens. And in WayneTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 164 1 County, there has just always been an abundance of air 

### 2 concerns. And my aunt, in particular, who's in her 

### 3 mid-80s, has really been suffering from asthma severely 

### 4 over the past couple of years And she's lived the 

### 5majority of her life in neighborhoods that have been 

### 6 compromised by air quality and other toxins. And so 

### 7 this for me is personal for those reasons, first and 

### 8 foremost as a mom, but, secondly, as a public health 

### 9 researcher that has always worked with communities of 

### 10 color and other vulnerable populations, and now as a 

### 11 Federal Policy Analyst, where my goal is to make sure 

### 12 that our voice or some of the voices that are typically 

### 13 not a part of the conversation are interjected into 

### 14 these policy and regulation conversations. 

### 15So with all sincerity, I congratulate what 

### 16 you're doing. I'm glad you're here and proposing these 

### 17 standards. And, of course, I hope that you will move 

### 18 quickly to put these standards in motion before the end 

### 19 of the year. 

### 20 So instead of using the next couple of 

### 21minutes to reiterate probably a lot of the facts and 

### 22 figures and stats that you've heard, I'd just like toTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 165 1 quickly highlight some issues that really resonate with 

### 2 WE ACT for Environmental Justice and some of the 

### 3 broader environmental justice community. 

### 4You know, cumulative risk assessment or 

### 5 cumulative impact assessment, however you want to 

### 6 phrase it, is a way of understanding the real and total 

### 7 impacts on communities. We know that environmental 

### 8 pollution doesn't act in siloes, and that’s what we 

### 9 really need to consider as we look at these different 

### 10 rules. 

### 11When you look at EJ communities, they're hot 

### 12 spots. They're areas where there's a lot of things 

### 13 going on, and most of the time the rules and the things 

### 14 that we use to frame these rules don't capture 

### 15 everything that's happening. And so, what I would 

### 16 suggest is that, I guess, really offer a competent 

### 17 suggestion is that keep in mind that having these more 

### 18 stringent standards will work towards minimizing the 

### 19 burden on communities that are already compromised. 

### 20 So if we focus on really the most vulnerable, 

### 21 I truly believe that more people will benefit overall, 

### 22 and having the rules, like the soot rule, Tier 3, andTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 166 1 others, work in parallel is great. And so my 

### 2 suggestion, however, is that in future analyses, a 

### 3 cumulative impact strategy be employed. 

### 4I know that several of your colleagues in the 

### 5 EPA are working towards this as well as developing an 

### 6 environmental justice guidance that will be 

### 7 incorporated throughout the Agency. But I hope that 

### 8 this is something that you will strongly consider in 

### 9 future assessments to make sure that we get a real 

### 10 glimpse of the impacts and the benefits that come from 

### 11 these proposed rules. 

### 12And last, but certainly not least, is the 

### 13 importance of this rule on climate change. While the 

### 14 rule documentation specifically states that an increase 

### 15 or decrease in greenhouse gas emissions gases cannot be 

### 16 ascertained with certainty at this point because of the 

### 17 expected emission increases in the refinery process, 

### 18 what you're proposing here I think, whether now or in 

### 19 the future will reduce GHG emissions. And this is 

### 20 critical. 

### 21As an engineer that has been in several 

### 22 plants over the past 10 or 12 years, I'm confident thatTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 167 1 technology will advance accordingly. And so we can say 

### 2 with confidence in the future that there will be a net 

### 3 reduction in CO2 emissions and subsequently a net 

### 4 reduction in negative health impacts. And that is why 

### 5 I think it is so critical and so important what you're 

### 6 doing, that we take every step to improve our air 

### 7 quality, especially for those that suffer respiratory 

### 8 and cardiovascular challenges during extremely hot 

### 9 weather or heat waves, whatever you want to call them, 

### 10 that we will continue to experience more frequently in 

### 11 our changing climate. 

### 12So in conclusion, I was really pleased to 

### 13 read the section in the proposed rule that addresses 

### 14 the obvious challenges that environmental justice 

### 15 communities deal with every day: elevated air toxins, 

### 16 the proximity to high traffic roads, and other multiple 

### 17 stressors and health risk factors that really add to 

### 18 determining what your health is going to be. 

### 19 So while we wait for the science and the 

### 20 methods to catch up to better capture these 

### 21 associations between air pollution, health, and other 

### 22 chronic and physical stressors, these proposedTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 168 1 standards, the Tier 3, are one step forward to reducing 

### 2 that burden on EJ communities. So we support your 

### 3 work, appreciate your effort, and hope again that you 

### 4will move expeditiously as you filter through the many 

### 5 comments and considerations at this hearing and others. 

### 6 And so I hope, last but not least, that the 

### 7 face of that little girl reminds you that you and your 

### 8 work truly impacts the lives of those who are most 

### 9 precious to each and every one of us. Thank you. 

### 10 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you very much. 

### 11Christopher Miles, welcome. 

### 12MR. MILES: Thank you. Good afternoon. I'm 

### 13 sorry, my remarks are informal and I apologize for 

### 14 that. 

### 15MR. GRUNDLER: NO apologies necessary. 

### 16 MR. MILES: I was asked very, very quickly to 

### 17 speak for the Sierra Club, and I'm speaking on behalf 

### 18 of that club and many of the other folks that have 

### 19 actually taken their time out to speak much more 

### 20 eloquently than I can. 

### 21I'm just speaking on behalf of myself and my 

### 22 little family in East Falls, which is a small littleTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 169 1 community, growing, just near Route 1, which all night, 

### 2 day, and the following night keeps us up not only with 

### 3 noise, but actually we can smell the fumes. I ride my 

### 4 bike up and down East River Drive, and again, the 

### 5 fumes. 

### 6 And I was wondering on behalf of the folks 

### 7 that enjoy the outdoors, especially in inner city 

### 8 areas, whether we can't do more and whether we should 

### 9 do more. We just heard about environmental justice 

### 10 certainly in areas where folks are trying to keep a 

### 11 home and grow a family. We have concerns about letting 

### 12 kids go outside and play at various hours. How close 

### 13 can we be to the highway and is it safe? And so I 

### 14 have, you know, some genuine concerns. 

### 15There was a gentleman that asked a question 

### 16 about ABG, and I'm hoping someone on the record can 

### 17 clear that up, whether ABG standards will affect 

### 18 refineries. And that term is sort of an industry 

### 19 buzzword. I'm not familiar with that acronym. 

### 20 Going forward, there were a couple of things 

### 21 I had concerns with. A lot of the car companies don't 

### 22 seem to be interested in dealing with the pollutionTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 170 1 before a catalytic converter warms up, the so-called 

### 2 open loop phase. And I'm wondering if that could be 

### 3 included in some of your thinking. Perhaps something 

### 4 could be included where an auto maker might get credit 

### 5 for a start and stop system whereby if someone is at a 

### 6 drive-thru, instead of polluting, the car would just 

### 7 stop automatically, and thereby wouldn't pollute, and 

### 8 perhaps could get credit if they didn't completely meet 

### 9 some of these other tough standards. 

### 10 I was also concerned about some of the vapor 

### 11 and evaporation at gas pumps and whether that could be 

### 12 included in this, or whether in a separate rule. So I 

### 13 was thinking along the lines of cumulative that you 

### 14 could do, especially when it comes to congressional 

### 15 negotiations that happen when something gets lowered. 

### 16 Perhaps an all-inclusive thing might get to our goal 

### 17 without focusing on one small area. 

### 18 Again, I was also concerned about the 

### 19 refineries, what are they going to do with this, the 

### 20 sulfur. Is it going to be resold? Is there a market 

### 21 for that? Are they going to deal with sulfur cleanup 

### 22 and then clean in an effective manner? And finally, ITranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 171 1 was wondering -- I guess the ABG speaks to that -- will 

### 2 the refineries get credits of some sort for 

### 3 alternatives, or will there be some sort of a bonus or 

### 4 subsidy provided so that if an alternative, say, from 

### 5 an algae or greenfield comes along, it could be dropped 

### 6 in, and there could be an exchange of some sort. 

### 7And that's the end of my testimony. And 

### 8 thank you for this opportunity. 

### 9 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you very much. 

### 10 Reverend Pyrch, the floor is yours. 

### 11REVEREND PYRCH: My name is Cheryl Pyrch. 

### 12 I’m the pastor at Summit Presbyterian Church in 

### 13 Philadelphia, and I am also a board member of 

### 14 Pennsylvania Interfaith Power and Light, part of a 

### 15 national organization of people of faith concerned 

### 16 about climate change. 

### 17I want to thank the EPA and President Obama 

### 18 for proposing the Tier 3 standards, and thank you for 

### 19 this opportunity to speak. 

### 20 In our tradition, as in many other faith 

### 21 traditions, we believe that the heavens and earth were 

### 22 created by a loving God, and provided all that isTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 172 1 needed for life. Our response to such a gift and such 

### 2 a blessing should be thanksgiving, which means caring 

### 3 for the earth, not trashing it, and for all who live 

### 4 upon it. We believe that God also calls us to love our 

### 5 neighbors as ourselves, especially the poor and the 

### 6 vulnerable. 

### 7We enthusiastically support the Tier 3 Rule 

### 8 as a way to care for the earth and our neighbors, as 

### 9 well as our fam1lles and ourselves. As others have 

### 10 pointed out, the further cleaning up of gasoline 

### 11 exhaust will prevent thousands of premature deaths and 

### 12 asthma attacks each year and will be good for all 

### 13 living things. It's also, as others have pointed out, 

### 14 a common sense, modest proposal. It's a standard the 

### 15 auto industry is fully capable of making and will put 

### 16 the rest of the nation in line with California's more 

### 17 stringent and laudable standards. 

### 18 Some people have objected by pointing out 

### 19 em1ssions have already dropped dramatically in the past 

### 20 decades, but of course that's all the more reason to 

### 21 institute the rule, for what better than to build on 

### 22 success?Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 173 1Dr. White-Newsome also mentioned climate 

### 2 change. And although she did point out this rule will 

### 3 not bear directly at this time on greenhouse gas 

### 4 emissions reductions, we know that catastrophe 

### 5 barreling down upon us threatens all of life if we do 

### 6 not move as quickly as we can away from fossil fuels. 

### 7 Anything we can do in the meantime to protect life, 

### 8 such as the Tier 3 standards, is imperative. 

### 9 We can expect opposition from the fossil fuel 

### 10 industry, but I encourage the EPA to stand firm in the 

### 11 face of their protest and to institute as quickly as 

### 12 possible the Tier 3 Rule. 

### 13 Thank you again for your work on behalf of 

### 14 the Nation and the larger world, and thank you for 

### 15 letting me speak. 

### 16 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you, Reverend, so much. 

### 17Ms. Saier? 

### 18 MS. SAIER: I don't think I could top her. 

### 19 [Laughter.] 

### 20 MS. SAIER: I have to stand. I have a very 

### 21 bad back, but it's worth me coming here. 

### 22I live in Port Richmond, beautiful area, andTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 174 1 over a year ago I noticed the kids on the playground 

### 2 across the street from me. They all looked like they 

### 3 had asthma. Everyone was choking and coughing and 

### 4 coughing. I never dawned on me it was soot, and that's 

### 5 what I'm here to fight, the soot. 

### 6 When I first met Chris Mays from Clean Air, I 

### 7 left my window sill dirty only for three days, and you 

### 8 should see the soot I have on that window sill. My 

### 9 neighbor and I have, well, we wash our windows. You 

### 10 have to wash them with soap and water first and then 

### 11 Windex just to get the soot off, or you have smeary 

### 12 windows. And you'd be surprised how much dirt, soot, 

### 13 are on the windows. 

### 14Now, I'm only a housewife and a grandmom. 

### 15 I'm not a speaker, but it's very important to me and my 

### 16 grandchildren. One son lives up the street from me. 

### 17 One son lives across the street -- I mean, two blocks 

### 18 down. And they have their own children that live in 

### 19 Port Richmond, and they don't want to leave. And they 

### 20 love it there just like I do. 

### 21I came there in 1968, and it was my husband's 

### 22 childhood home we have been in for over 60 -- he's beenTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 175 1 there over 63 years. We don't want to move. And the 

### 2 other thing is sometimes it makes you wonder if we 

### 3 should. 

### 4Now here in the past summer months, I had 

### 5 three heart attacks, and not only that, I had cataracts 

### 6 removed. And it was a nurse that was here the last 

### 7 time I came to speak, and I stopped her at the back 

### 8 door. I said, what do you mean heart attack with soot? 

### 9 I looked into it. Yes, you breathe in soot, and it 

### 10 goes through your lungs, and before you know it, it's 

### 11 going through your heart, and it can accumulate. 

### 12The same thing as cataracts. I just had 

### 13 another one removed. When I asked my doctor about it, 

### 14 I said, what is it from? Dirt. And I asked him could 

### 15 soot do this, and he said yes, soot. That's why most 

### 16 people who drive wind up with a cataract in one eye 

### 17more than this eye, he said, because they drive with 

### 18 the window down. And I didn't realize how much soot 

### 19 really takes a toll on you. 

### 20 Now, the other thing is ice cream trucks and 

### 21 traffic all along my area. I am stuck between Aramingo 

### 22 Avenue, I-95, Alleghany back to Castor where everyoneTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 176 1 goes to get on or off 95. The thing is, the smells 

### 2 from all these place -- like I said, we are trapped in 

### 3 Port Richmond. And here, for instance, the ice cream 

### 4 truck that stops across the street, you can smell the 

### 5 fumes from that truck if everyone ever stood behind 

### 6 one. Now, that shouldn't be like that, but it is. 

### 7 It's the way it is, and you -- what else can you do ? 

### 8 Tell the guy shut down his motor? No, you can't. 

### 9 I had so much to say, but right now I'm very 

### 10 uncomfortable, and I have to leave. That's all. 

### 11MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you so much for coming. 

### 12And don't sell yourself short about not being a good 

### 13 speaker. 

### 14I'd now like to invite Larry Menkes to 

### 15 provide testimony. 

### 16 MR. MENKES: My name is Larry Menkes. I am a 

### 17 nationally certified sustainable building advisor, and 

### 18 I do a lot of work to make buildings more energy 

### 19 efficient. And I'm really pleased and thank you for 

### 20 this opportunity to testify today. 

### 21Although I'm here at the invitation of the 

### 22 American Lung Association, I'm also here for a numberTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 177 1 of other organizations represented that I am either a 

### 2member of or working member of. I am with the 

### 3 Association for the Study of Peak Oil, and they concern 

### 4 themselves with a lot of environmental issues. And we 

### 5 are a think tank. 

### 6 I am here, though, on behalf of myself, my 

### 7 children, my wife, my grandchildren, and my three great 

### 8 granddaughters. 

### 9 After 35 years of living in clean air 

### 10 regions, like Southeast Florida and Connecticut, and at 

### 11 sea where I spent 12 years in the merchant marines, 

### 12 including time in Vietnam with them, where I escaped 

### 13 virtually unscathed, these were areas that were 

### 14 virtually pollution free compared to this area here. 

### 15 I've been back in the area since about 1990, either 

### 16 working full time or living full time. 

### 17And I was born and raised in this area, and 

### 18 I'd lie to retire in this area. Bucks County is a 

### 19 beautiful section of Pennsylvania, and I've always 

### 20 wanted to live there. But since I've been back, I've 

### 21 contracted cancer. I've contracted asthma and several 

### 22 other conditions that my doctors link to air pollution.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 178 1I do a lot to prevent it. I buy hybrid cars 

### 2 for my family. I'm making my home energy efficient. 

### 3 It's a net zero pollution home. However, I can't do 

### 4 anything about everybody else's pollution. 

### 5In the Tragedy of the Commons, there's a game 

### 6 called the PPCC game, privatize the profits and 

### 7 commonize the costs. The costs are commonized by using 

### 8 the commons, which is our air, which is our water, and 

### 9 other things like that, to use as basically a toilet. 

### 10 The people that pollute it, and I admit that I do a 

### 11 little bit of pollution because I drive occasionally, 

### 12 and even rode the train here that has some pollution 

### 13 attached to it. But unfortunately, I can't stop the 

### 14 bulk of everybody else's pollution. 

### 15Now, certain industries who oppose this 

### 16 legislation, and I think it's wonderful, and I've been 

### 17 waiting for years. I know that this region has had no 

### 18 compliance with air standards since 1977. I served on 

### 19 the DBRPC and learned things like that here. But, you 

### 20 know, putting it bluntly, I regard myself as being 

### 21 poisoned, slowly poisoned by anyone and everyone who is 

### 22 a high polluter or even a medium polluter. I'm beingTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 179 1 poisoned slowly, and if these people would come and put 

### 2 a little bit of what they're putting in the air that I 

### 3 breathe into my water, they could be tried for murder 

### 4 if we caught them. 

### 5Now, I'm taking this kind of personally 

### 6 because I'm in my retirement age, and my conditions 

### 7 have prevented me from working. My wife is working 

### 8 three jobs to support us, and I'm working on creating a 

### 9 job for myself, but in these economic times, it's not 

### 10 easy. 

### 11Reverend Brown mentioned the morality and 

### 12 ethics of this, and I think that that trumps everything 

### 13 else. I don't think anyone has a right to poison me or 

### 14my children or my family in any way, shape, or form. 

### 15 And the Tier 3 standards will go a long way toward 

### 16 preventing some of the most egregious part of that. 

### 17I used to work as an over the road truck 

### 18 driver because the money there was better than some of 

### 19 my friends who had Ph.D.'s were doing. And I've spent 

### 20 a lot of days out on the road, and I can't plan where I 

### 21 go because the company that I work for plans it. And I 

### 22 can't plan to be away from the exposure to theseTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 180 1 toxins. Now, maybe that was a part of it, but I don't 

### 2 know. But these people have no right -- no right -- to 

### 3 poison me and my family. And that's all I have to say. 

### 4Thank you. 

### 5MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you very much, Mr. 

### 6 Menkes. 

### 7Ms. Patterson? 

### 8 MS. PATTERSON: Good Afternoon. My name is 

### 9 Dawn Patterson, and I am here today to urge the U.S. 

### 10 Environmental Protection Agency to adopt final cleaner 

### 11 gasoline and vehicle standards that will cut life

### 12 threatening tailpipe pollution. I am speaking on 

### 13 behalf of the Pennsylvania Society for Respiratory Care 

### 14 and as an individual Citizen, and I ask you not to 

### 15 delay and to please finalize these standards by year's 

### 16 end. 

### 17I serve as the Southeast Pennsylvania 

### 18 District Director for the PSRC. It's organization that 

### 19 represents 6,500 respiratory therapists in our State. 

### 20 The mission of the PSRC is to advance the art and 

### 21 science of respiratory care through educational 

### 22 publications and programs for its members, otherTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 181 1medical professions, and the general public and to 

### 2 promote pulmonary health and disease prevention. PSRC 

### 3 supports EPA's proposed standards for cleaner gasoline 

### 4 and vehicles because we believe the intent is closely 

### 5 aligned with our mission of preventing disease and 

### 6 promoting pulmonary health, as well as public health 

### 7 generally. 

### 8 As a respiratory therapist working with 

### 9 people whose health is already comprised by chronic 

### 10 obstructive pulmonary disease, asthma, and other 

### 11 diseases, I am well aware of how poor air quality can 

### 12 have serious impact on their ability to breathe. I 

### 13 live it every day, and it is heartbreaking for me to 

### 14 watch my patients gasp for air. I know my fellow PSRC 

### 15members all have similar stories. EPA can take 

### 16 measures to help these people breathe easier and the 

### 17 cleaner gasoline and vehicle standards is one of the 

### 18 most cost-effect1ve ways to do so. 

### 19 Cars, light trucks, and SUVs are a major 

### 20 source of pollution that contributes to smog and soot. 

### 21Pollutants can trigger asthma attacks, harm heart and 

### 22 lung health, and worsen existing conditions such asTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 182 1 COPD. Smog and soot pollution can even lead to early 

### 2 death. 

### 3 Strong, cleaner gasoline and vehicle 

### 4 standards will also help reduce the pollutants caused 

### 5 by using gasoline in vehicles, some of which have been 

### 6 linked to cancer. The scientific evidence shows that 

### 7 there may be a link between increased rates of lung 

### 8 cancer and incomplete burning of gasoline. 

### 9 As someone who has lost two of loved ones -- 

### 10 my mother in 2003 and my boyfriend in 2008 -- to lung 

### 11 cancer, I am acutely aware of the need to reduce our 

### 12 risk to cancer causing toxic emissions. Cleaning up 

### 13 gasoline and life-threatening tailpipe pollution can 

### 14 save thousands of lives each year, and ease the burden 

### 15millions of Americans face every day because of 

### 16 unhealthy air. 

### 17I just want to thank you for the opportunity 

### 18 to speak in support of the cleaner gasoline vehicle 

### 19 standards today. And on behalf the Pennsylvania 

### 20 Society for Respiratory Care and someone who cares 

### 21 deeply about the quality of our air, I urge you to move 

### 22 forward with these lifesaving standards, and adoptTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 183 1 final standards no later than the end of this year. 

### 2I just want to give one personal story. I 

### 3 have like two minutes left. When my mother was in the 

### 4 hospital, she was in for six months. She had her right 

### 5 lung removed because of cancer. And her left lung, she 

### 6 had emphysema. What she wanted to do was just go 

### 7 outside. It took about six weeks to get her off the 

### 8 ventilator. We weaned her off, put on a trach collar. 

### 9 She was down to 21 percent. She was only on the trach 

### 10 collar just so that she could have moisture for her 

### 11 secretions. 

### 12She urged -- she said, Dawn, can I please 

### 13 just go out and just, you know, just get some sun on my 

### 14 face. I'm like, I don't know. I don't know. Let me 

### 15 talk to the pulmonologist. I talked to the doctor. 

### 16 The doctor is, like, no, she really can't. The air 

### 17 quality is really, really poor. 

### 18 Well, I took that back to my mom. My mom 

### 19 shut down. She was, like, all right, fine. My mom was 

### 20 very stubborn, very, very stubborn. She wouldn't eat. 

### 21She wouldn't take any of her meds. She goes, Dawn, 

### 22 all's I want to do is just go outside and just get thatTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 184 1 sunlight on my face. So I said to the doctor, can we 

### 2 just take her out just for five minutes? I swear I'll 

### 3 bring her right back. 

### 4So we got the oxygen tank. We put her on 50 

### 5 percent. Got blankets, even though it was in the 

### 6 summer, and we took her outside. We took her out for, 

### 7 I don't know, 30 seconds. She goes, I need to get back 

### 8 in. I can't breathe because the air quality was so 

### 9 poor. My mom could not even enjoy 30 seconds of 

### 10 sunlight. 

### 11But she did take her meds, and she did, you 

### 12 know, start to eat. But unfortunately she did pass 

### 13 away in 2003. But I just wanted to share that with you 

### 14 and see how important it is to me personally because I 

### 15 do see patients all the time, and they are gasping for 

### 16 air. 

### 17Thank you. 

### 18 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you, and thank you for 

### 19 sharing that. 

### 20 Irene, I can't see your whole card, so please 

### 21 -- 

### 22DR. HARLABATOS: Irene Harlabatos.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 185 1MR. GRUNDLER: Harlabatos. Proceed. 

### 2DR. HARLABATOS: I was very impressed that 

### 3 you were able to pronounce that, and I really, really 

### 4 appreciate this opportunity. I have never done this 

### 5 before, so you'll have to bear with me. I found out 

### 6 about this opportunity from the Sierra Club, and I 

### 7 jumped on it because I feel very strongly about this. 

### 8 Unfortunately, I do not have anything 

### 9 prepared, so this is going to be extemporaneous. 

### 10 Hopefully I'll be able to get my thoughts out. 

### 11I'm a physician in an allergy and asthma 

### 12 practice in the area. We have multiple outpatient 

### 13 offices. I'm not representing the practice, however. 

### 14 I'm representing myself, my family, and as a physician 

### 15 as well. I've long felt very strongly about many 

### 16 environmental issues. I feel if the physical substrate 

### 17 for health is not there, then health is not going to be 

### 18 there. 

### 19 Every day I see multiple people. I see the 

### 20 little girl she talked about on the nebulizer. I see 

### 21 several of them at least every day. And I see people 

### 22 of all ages from birth to, you know, elderly who areTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 186 1 suffering from respiratory illnesses, usually asthma, 

### 2 but I see COPD. I have seen multiple other respiratory 

### 3 diseases. 

### 4And I've seen people who immigrate from other 

### 5 countries, never had any respiratory issues, and within 

### 6 a year or two of being here, develop respiratory 

### 7 issues. I see people who develop asthma after never 

### 8 having it before, you know, at age 50 or 60. And, you 

### 9 know, they're like, why would this happen, and I can 

### 10 never answer with them 100 percent certainty, but I've 

### 11 always been concerned about air quality. 

### 12I've known many people who they don't have 

### 13 asthma in their family, but they have asthma. And I 

### 14 know that there's several, you know, studies that link 

### 15 automotive exhaust and asthma, and I know that in 9/11 

### 16 when they closed down the bridge between the United 

### 17 States and Canada because they secured our borders, 

### 18 asthma exacerbations in that area fell down 

### 19 dramatically for those several days because the trucks 

### 20 -- the diesel trucks were no longer passing back and 

### 21 forth. 

### 22I know that in the 90s, in the '96 OlympicsTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 187 1 in Atlanta, they closed down traffic for the Olympics 

### 2 in the summer, and asthma emergency room visits 

### 3 plummeted. I know I have patients who don't leave 

### 4 their house during certain days in the summer. They 

### 5 just -- if they're lucky enough to have central air, 

### 6 they keep it on and they stay indoors. And none of 

### 7 them want to live that way, and I don't feel that it's 

### 8 right that people should. 

### 9 And I feel that after hearing about one cent 

### 10 increase per gallon, the cost for gasoline to pay for 

### 11 stricter standards, I can't believe we're arguing about 

### 12 this in the year 2013 with all the knowledge we have. 

### 13 I don't feel that the science is ambiguous. I don't 

### 14 feel the health effects are ambiguous. I don't feel 

### 15 that there really is any question, as far as I'm 

### 16 concerned, what the right thing to do is. 

### 17I fully support these new standards, and I 

### 18 will be, you know, very discouraged if they are not 

### 19 implemented as soon as possible. And that's it. 

### 20 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you so much, all of you, 

### 21 particularly those of you who are here just 

### 22 representing yourselves and sharing these stories. ITranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 188 1 know it's not easy. It's not something you may do 

### 2 every day, but it's very, very meaningful to all of us. 

### 3 So thank you again. 

### 4All right. 

### 5MR. MACHIELE: Oh, I'm sorry. I don't have a 

### 6 question, but to Christopher, what I said was ABT, and 

### 7 that's just an acronym for averaging banking and 

### 8 trading. So it allows one refinery to -- a little 

### 9 further control in exchange for another one not quite 

### 10 going as far. So it's just averaging. 

### 11MR. MILES: That was talking about the cost 

### 12 that the refinery is claiming versus the findings that 

### 13 you all have. Okay. 

### 14MR. MACHIELE: Yeah. For example, if you 

### 15 have a -- if a refinery is going to -- if it's going to 

### 16 cost a lot more for a refinery to comply than for 

### 17 another one to go even further, then the one that can 

### 18 go further goes further, and the one -- and sells 

### 19 credits back to the other one, or trades within the 

### 20 company. 

### 21DR. HARLABATOS: What does it stand for 

### 22 again? What is it, ABT?Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 189 1MR. MACHIELE: Averaging banking and trading. 

### 2It's a common thing in many of our rulemakings. So 

### 3 that's why it rolled off my tongue. I'm sorry. 

### 4MR. MILES: Thank you very much. 

### 5MR. GRUNDLER: Let me just also add, 

### 6 Christopher, you asked a bunch of questions. 

### 7MR. MILES: Yeah, sorry. 

### 8 MR. GRUNDLER: That's okay, and I'm not going 

### 9 to answer them, but I do want you to know that many of 

### 10 the questions are, in fact, addressed in the proposal 

### 11 with respect to cold start emissions and so on. So if 

### 12 you'd like to know more, our folks out in the hall can 

### 13 tell you where to find that information to get your 

### 14 answers. 

### 15MR. MILES: Well, expect my support then. 

### 16 [Laughter.] 

### 17MR. GRUNDLER: You should read it first. 

### 18 [Laughter.] 

### 19 MR. GRUNDLER: Thanks again, panel. 

### 20 UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: Thank you. 

### 21MR. GRUNDLER: Panel 6. Okay. Let me invite 

### 22 the 3:00 panel up. We're running a little ahead ofTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 190 1 schedule for now. There are new additions to the panel 

### 2 that I'd like to announce. Robin Mann and Emily Davis, 

### 3 along with Steve Ross, Frank Krich, David Lukens, Susan 

### 4 Edwards, Nick Rogers, and Karen Melton. Come on down. 

### 5Mr. Krich, let's begin with you. 

### 6 MR. KRICH: Okay, thank you. Good afternoon. 

### 7I'm Frank Krich, Senior Engineer at Chrysler Group 

### 8 LLC, and I'm here today to express our support for the 

### 9 Environmental Protection Agency's complete Tier 3 

### 10 package. Chrysler supports 10 ppm average sulfur 

### 11 gasoline and single, harmonized national criteria 

### 12 pollutant performance standards that treat all 

### 13 technologies equally and contribute to meeting EPA's 

### 14 air quality and greenhouse gas gas objectives. 

### 15As in previous rulemakings, Tier 3 continues 

### 16 to treat vehicles and fuels as a system, recognizing 

### 17 that fuels are critically important to achieve the full 

### 18 potential of advanced emission control technologies, 

### 19 especially during these historic time when regulations 

### 20 are driving near zero emissions and doubling fuel 

### 21 economy. Sulfur is the single most important gasoline 

### 22 parameter to enable vehicle technologies to meet theseTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 191 1 new requirements. The cause and effects are well 

### 2 known. Sulfur inhibits exhaust after treatment 

### 3 conversion efficiency, so lower sulfur means lower 

### 4 emissions. 

### 5California recognizes the environmental 

### 6 benefits of low sulfur gasoline and includes 10 ppm 

### 7 sulfur in its LEV III regulation as an enabler to meet 

### 8 the Air Resources Board's super ultra-low emission 

### 9 vehicle fleet average requirements. This same gasoline 

### 10 is therefore needed to harmonize Tier 3 and California 

### 11 LEV III to realize the emission benefits and to 

### 12maximize new vehicle development and manufacturing 

### 13 efficiency. 

### 14Low sulfur gasoline not only enables advanced 

### 15 technologies to achieve intended emission benefits, it 

### 16 has an immediate and significant effect on the 250 

### 17million vehicles on the road today, lowering emissions 

### 18 and helping States achieve attainment of ozone National 

### 19 Ambient Air Quality Standards. 

### 20 Lowering sulfur is also directionally correct 

### 21 for reducing particulate matter and toxic air 

### 22 contaminants, as well as nitrous oxide and methane, twoTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 192 1 potential greenhouse gasses. In addition, EPA's 

### 2 creation of new fuel economy and greenhouse gas 

### 3 standards anticipated the nationwide availability of 

### 4 low sulfur gasoline. Consistent with that basis, 

### 5 Chrysler supported the concept of one national program 

### 6 to improve fuel economy and reduce greenhouse gas 

### 7 emissions with the understanding that low sulfur 

### 8 gasoline would be called for in the next round of 

### 9 establishing tailpipe emissions standards, and which 

### 10 would ensure availability to enable advanced lean burn 

### 11 gasoline direct injection technologies . 

### 12Advanced lean burn GDI systems are an 

### 13 enabling technology to meet EPA and the National 

### 14 Highway Traffic Safety Administration's 2025 model year 

### 15 greenhouse gas and fuel economy requirements. Ten ppm 

### 16 or less sulfur gasoline is a prerequisite for achieving 

### 17 intended greenhouse gas and fuel economy benefits from 

### 18 lean burn GDI systems. Without low sulfur gasoline, 

### 19 lean burn GDI systems incur a significant fuel economy 

### 20 and corresponding greenhouse gas penalty due to more 

### 21 frequent sulfur regeneration events. 

### 22The auto industry has already investedTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 193 1 hundreds of millions of dollars to design, develop, 

### 2 tool and, in some cases, manufacture and produce lean 

### 3 burn GDI systems. Without absolute assurance of low 

### 4 sulfur gasoline in the marketplace, the greatly reduced 

### 5 performance of lean burn GDI will reduce use of this 

### 6 technology. 

### 7We will continue to work with EPA to bring 

### 8 California LEV III and Tier 3 as close as possible, 

### 9 with the goal of a completely harmonized California and 

### 10 Federal, one national criteria pollutant program. Low 

### 11 sulfur gasoline is a vitally important and critical 

### 12 element in achieving this goal. 

### 13 Thank you for your time and consideration. 

### 14MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you. 

### 15Ms. Davis, welcome. 

### 16 MS. DAVIS: I have been commuting by bicycle 

### 17 in Philadelphia for about 30 years. While I feel this 

### 18 means of transportation has been a net benefit to my 

### 19 health, I wonder when I end up coughing as sit in 

### 20 traffic with pollution generating vehicles. The black 

### 21 dust I clean from the sills of my street side windows 

### 22makes me wonder what my lungs must look like. I don'tTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 194 1 find this black dust on the sills of my back windows. 

### 2It is illegal to litter, yet we permit cars 

### 3 and industry to dump their wastes into our air for 

### 4 free. Just because this tailpipe litter is too small 

### 5 to see doesn't make it all right. In fact, the 

### 6 invisibility of this litter makes it more important for 

### 7 our government to regulate strongly. Our air cannot be 

### 8 used as a place to dump our wastes. We need clean air 

### 9 to breathe and to live healthy lives. 

### 10 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you for that. 

### 11Mr. Kramer? 

### 12MR. KRAMER: Hello. My name is William 

### 13 Kramer. I am a Field Organizer with the Sierra Club in 

### 14 Philadelphia. And thanks for having us here today. 

### 15 I'm also the father of a six-year-old who hopefully 

### 16 will be here later, and maybe we can convince him to 

### 17 testify. 

### 18 He is pretty educated on pollution and 

### 19 climate change. He thinks climate change will be World 

### 20 War III or is World War III. And he also wants to make 

### 21 and build -- become an inventor when he grows up and 

### 22 build a machine to go back in time to get rid ofTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 195 1 pollution, which with climate change, that may be the 

### 2 only thing we could -- way we can rid of it. And his 

### 3 mother, who will hopefully be with him, is studying to 

### 4 be an EMT, so she knows well about public health 

### 5 issues. 

### 6 And, I mean, I personally hate cars. I spent 

### 7 10 years in L.A., and that really made me hate cars. 

### 8 But I love trains, buses, and bikes. I live actually 

### 9 far away from here, but I take the train even though it 

### 10 takes twice the time because it's very pleasant. 

### 11In addition, as you can see, I dressed a 

### 12 little differently than everybody else today. I'm an 

### 13 endangered tree frog. And as Kermit said, it's not 

### 14 easy being green. Now, why isn't it easy being green 

### 15 these days? Well, we're really seeing deteriorating 

### 16 air quality. Philadelphia gets an F for air quality. 

### 17 And we're also seeing skyrocketing asthma rates, 

### 18 especially for kids. And as I'm sure plenty of people 

### 19 have testified already, asthma is no joke. You're in 

### 20 the hospital and hoping you're going to live. And I 

### 21 have a friend who's told me many of her stories of 

### 22 being hospitalized with asthma.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 196 1Primarily what I wanted to say was that I 

### 2 think it's a real -- pollution in this city and all 

### 3 over the world really is a race and class issue. Poor 

### 4people and people of color, or people of the global 

### 5majority they're now called, disproportionately suffer. 

### 6 African-American neighborhoods have asthma rates of up 

### 7 to 25 percent in Philadelphia, so it's a real crisis. 

### 8 You know, I'm fortunate. I have what they 

### 9 call white middle class privilege and a white skin 

### 10 privilege, so I'm less likely to suffer from asthma or 

### 11 other air pollution problems, but that's not the case 

### 12 in the majority of people in this town. I think we've 

### 13 had a decent mix racially today, but probably not the 

### 14mix we could have or should have. You know, when I 

### 15 ride SEPTA, I feel like that's when I get to see the 

### 16 demographics of Philadelphia, so perhaps one day we'll 

### 17 have a hearing where it looks like the people that ride 

### 18 on SEPTA. 

### 19 But at the Sierra Club, we've engaged 20 new 

### 20 African-American activists in the last year in our work 

### 21 and despite what some people have said, it's been 

### 22 really easy actually to do outreach in communities ofTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 197 1 color, and particularly in black communities. And why 

### 2 is that? Because everyone has a connection to asthma. 

### 3 You know, if I go to an environmental fair, people 

### 4might be more interested in cars or consumer products 

### 5 connected to the environment. But if we go to, like, 

### 6 Sue, my colleague, who will speak later, and I go to 

### 7 another event in an African-American neighborhood, if 

### 8 we go to a church, a street fair, there's been health 

### 9 fairs, all sorts of events, everybody understands what 

### 10 we're talking about. 

### 11I think a lot more black Philadelphians would 

### 12 be here today if it weren't for the many problems they 

### 13 face, most of it due to racism. So, you know, here if 

### 14you're black in Philadelphia, you're facing underfunded 

### 15 and poorly run schools, a bunch of which are about to 

### 16 be shut down, lack of access to good jobs or any jobs 

### 17 at all due to discrimination, and dealing with crime in 

### 18 your neighborhoods, which is ultimately rooted, I 

### 19 believe, in racism, at least to poverty that forces 

### 20 people into crime. The Wire understands the logic of 

### 21 that. 

### 22So I will quickly mention a couple of peopleTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 198 1 that we tried to get to come here today, but because of 

### 2 work and family responsibilities and other civic 

### 3 activities could not be here. We have Kevin who we've 

### 4worked with who's great. He's a teacher. He grew up 

### 5 in the projects. Now he's a proud science teacher, a 

### 6 great science teacher. He testified at the past 

### 7 hearing, and he was wonderful. But his son has asthma. 

### 8 We have Charlotte Leeks, who's a respiratory therapist 

### 9 who's come down to D.C. with us to speak, also African

### 10 American. And she gets it as a respiratory therapist. 

### 11Mary Brown Waters, her daughter has asthma. She's 

### 12 active a lot in her home and school or PTA because, you 

### 13 know, the schools are so bad. She's got to be involved 

### 14 there. Gary is a café owner. He started a wonderful 

### 15 café and he's really organizing in his community 

### 16 through his coffee shop. And Dorsha Turpin, she's got 

### 17 a child with asthma. She spoke here before. And Mary 

### 18 Leeks has a child both autistic and asthmatic. 

### 19 So I hate to speak on behalf of other people, 

### 20 but sometimes it's hard to get people who are affected 

### 21 by these problems to come because of their other issues 

### 22 they face. So I think it's important to them.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 199 1And the bottom line there is air pollution is 

### 2 a key issue of our emerging majority, majority 

### 3 population our city, and then our country is affected 

### 4 by these problems disproportionately. So if we really 

### 5 want to be a democracy that, you know, addresses the 

### 6 needs and health needs of the majority of our 

### 7 population, especially at the lower income and 

### 8 communities of color, we really have to address air 

### 9 pollution. So I'm glad we're coming up with a new rule 

### 10 to do that. 

### 11Thank you very much. 

### 12MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you, Mr. Kramer. And 

### 13 your son is welcome to testify later. 

### 14Ms. Mann? 

### 15MS. MANN: Thank you for the opportunity to 

### 16 testify. My name is Robin Mann. Though I am the 

### 17 immed1ate past President of the Sierra Club, I'm here 

### 18 today as a resident of the Greater Philadelphia area 

### 19 and as a mother and grandmother. At a time when too 

### 20 many Americans are struggling with asthma and other 

### 21 serious health problems associated with air pollution, 

### 22 I applaud the EPA for proposing standards that willTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 200 1 significantly reduce smog-forming pollution from cars 

### 2 and trucks and improve the quality of the air that we 

### 3 breathe. I urge you to move forward with these 

### 4 standards as soon as possible. 

### 5In Philadelphia, cars and trucks are the 

### 6 leading source of n1trogen oxides and a significant 

### 7 source of other health-threatening pollution, including 

### 8 volatile organic compounds and particulate matter In 

### 9 their 2012 State of the Air report card, the American 

### 10 Lung Association noted the severe pollution in 

### 11 Philadelphia County, giving it an F for both ozone and 

### 12 particulate pollution. This pollution threatens the 

### 13 health and lives of Philadelphia residents, 

### 14particularly children, causing asthma, heart disease, 

### 15 and cancer. And some of Ph1ladelph1a's neighborhoods 

### 16 that are particularly hemmed in by heavily congested 

### 17 highways suffer disproportionately from the pollution. 

### 18 The proposed cleaner tailpipe standards would 

### 19 substantially reduce health threatening pollution from 

### 20 our cars and trucks. By requiring refiners to produce 

### 21 lower sulfur gasoline, the standards would reduce 

### 22 nitrogen oxide emissions nationwide by more thanTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 201 1 260,000 tons, the equivalent of taking 33 million cars 

### 2 off the road. By requiring auto makers to use advanced 

### 3 pollution control technology, the standards will reduce 

### 4 a host of health threatening pollutions -- pollutants. 

### 5Lower sulfur gasoline will also allow advanced 

### 6 pollution control technology in cars to work more 

### 7 efficiently. 

### 8 The health benefits from the proposed 

### 9 standards are substantial. According to your proposal, 

### 10 the standards will prevent up to 2,400 premature 

### 11 deaths, 3,200 hospital visits and 22,000 asthma attacks 

### 12 annually by 2030. Additionally, the standards would 

### 13 prevent 1.8 million lost school and work days. 

### 14It comes as no surprise that the oil industry 

### 15 is once again fighting measures to protect our public 

### 16 health. Although independent studies have concluded 

### 17 that the proposed standards would cost less than a 

### 18 penny per gallon, the American Petroleum Institute and 

### 19 their oil industry allies have resorted to once again 

### 20 raising the specter of skyrocketing gas prices. I urge 

### 21 you to stand up to big oil and move forward with these 

### 22 standards.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 202 1This is a clear win-win situation. Less 

### 2 pollution will save lives and reduce asthma attacks, 

### 3 all while substantially reducing health care costs. 

### 4 Your proposal notes that these health benefits could be 

### 5 as much as $23 billion annually by 2030. At the same 

### 6 time, these standards will create jobs. New refinery 

### 7 and vehicle technologies will create jobs in design, 

### 8 manufacturing, installation, and maintenance. Auto 

### 9 makers, auto workers, public health organizations, 

### 10 consumer groups and state clean air officials all 

### 11 understand this and are supportive of cleaner tailpipe 

### 12 standards. 

### 13 In finalizing these strong cleaner tailpipe 

### 14 standards, you have the opportunity to give American in 

### 15 Philadelphia and across the country cleaner air to 

### 16 breathe. We have the technology to reduce tailpipe 

### 17 pollution and protect our public health. It's time to 

### 18 put that technology to work. 

### 19 I thank you for proposing these Tier 3 

### 20 tailpipe standards and urge you to finalize them as 

### 21 soon as possible. And thank you again for the 

### 22 opportunity.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 203 1MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you. 

### 2Ms. Edwards, you're up. 

### 3 MS. EDWARDS: Thank you, and I’m so glad you 

### 4 hold these hearings in Philadelphia because it makes it 

### 5 easier for us to get here. We went down to Washington 

### 6 when you had them down there, but it's easier to be 

### 7 here. 

### 8 As a retired educational specialist and 

### 9 Sierra Club activist, I'm here to say that I speak up 

### 10 for cleaning what is coming out of auto tailpipes in 

### 11 the U.S. as a fairness as well as a public health 

### 12 issue. 

### 13 While this is a national story, I want to 

### 14 focus on the local ramifications. In 2012, the 

### 15 American Lung Association reported that Philadelphia 

### 16 failed miserably in terms of both ozone and particle 

### 17 pollution. As Philadelphia Magazine put it, "Here in 

### 18 Philadelphia County, the Air Quality Index shows that 

### 19 we have an average of 34 orange high-ozone days a year, 

### 20 meaning Philadelphians endure over a month's worth of 

### 21 days during which the air is decidedly unhealthy to 

### 22 breathe. Even scarier, we average one red ozone day aTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 204 1 year when ozone levels are considered unhealthy for the 

### 2 entire population." Philadelphians should know that 

### 3 the city -- that our city tied with St. Louis as the 

### 4 10th worst in the Nation in terms of air pollution. 

### 5In my environmental advocacy work, which 

### 6 William spoke about already, I have recently had the 

### 7 opportunity to speak to many Philadelphia residents 

### 8 about the connections between clean air, climate 

### 9 change, and asthma, while I petitioned at health fairs, 

### 10 tabled in in communities, spoke to home and school 

### 11 representatives, led environmental story hours at a 

### 12 local library and a church camp, and more. Everywhere 

### 13 I went, particularly in African American neighborhoods, 

### 14people have children, grandchildren, siblings, or other 

### 15 family members with asthma. In some instances, it was 

### 16 -- if I would ask for a show of hands, it was as high 

### 17 as 75 or 80 percent of the people in the room had 

### 18 somebody close to them with asthma. And actually the 

### 19 highest rates, I believe, in some of our neighborhoods 

### 20 are 30 percent of children have asthma. And asthma has 

### 21 increased 50 percent among African-American children 

### 22 between 2001 and 2009, so it's really an epidemic or aTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 205 1 crisis situation. 

### 2And it's also the case the five times as many 

### 3 children as adults with asthma die from the condition, 

### 4 so I believe this standard is this. So I believe this 

### 5 is the least we can do. As long as we still use 

### 6 gasoline powered cars, which I hope we can transition 

### 7 away from as rapidly as feasible, it's the least we can 

### 8 do to reduce the pollution these cars create. 

### 9 Thank you for this opportunity to speak. 

### 10 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you. 

### 11Ms. Melton. 

### 12MS. MELTON: Good afternoon. My name is 

### 13 Karen Melton. The name I've registered for my personal 

### 14 activities is Advocate for Earth. I'm also active with 

### 15 the Sierra Club, the Chester County Citizens for 

### 16 Climate Protection, and the Climate Reality Project. 

### 17 Thank you for allowing me to testify on the Tier 3 

### 18 vehicle emission and fuel standards program. 

### 19 At the end of 2012 I accepted an early 

### 20 retirement offer from my employer of 30 years, the 

### 21 Health Care Division of Siemens AG. In part I accepted 

### 22 the offer because I knew what I needed to spend my timeTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 206 1 doing. My light-hearted description was that I was 

### 2 leaving gainful employment to try to save the planet, 

### 3 but sadly, this was entirely true. I could be happy 

### 4 tending my butterfly garden and volunteering in my 

### 5 community, but instead I spend most of my time giving 

### 6 presentations on climate change and how to reduce your 

### 7 carbon footprint. I attend a myriad of eco events to 

### 8 talk to people about clean air and clean energy, 

### 9 volunteer with various organizations that are working 

### 10 on clean air and clean energy, try to meet with my 

### 11 elected representatives to discuss their positions, and 

### 12 refute nonsense disseminated to the media by the fossil 

### 13 fuel industry, an industry fully prepared to continue 

### 14 business as usual on the improbable chance that somehow 

### 15 decades of study by thousands of scientists on climate 

### 16 change will turn out to be wrong. 

### 17In these endeavors, I am joined by a huge 

### 18 number of people belonging to an amazing number of 

### 19 organizations. But what we don't have are the billions 

### 20 of dollars and unlimited access to elected officials 

### 21 needed to counter the resources and access of fossil 

### 22 fuel companies, five of which were among the 10 mostTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 207 1 profitable companies on the planet in 2012. 

### 2There is no doubt that the fossil fuel energy 

### 3 revolution a century ago completely changed the course 

### 4 of human life. We have enjoyed vast improvements in 

### 5 all aspects of living. However, the impact of burning 

### 6 fossil fuels on the ecosystem that supports and 

### 7 sustains us began to be recognized and documented 

### 8 decades ago. Regulatory steps began to be taken to 

### 9 improve air and water quality in the 1970's. The Tier 

### 10 3 vehicle emission and fuel standards you propose today 

### 11 are another important step in the right direction. It 

### 12 is a modest change, bringing the U.S. standard for 

### 13 sulfur content in gasoline in line with California, 

### 14 Japan, and EU countries. 

### 15We are all complicit in the poisoning of our 

### 16 planet, but those who make fortunes from it, who fund 

### 17 pseudo-science denial instead of helping to reach for a 

### 18 clean energy economy, and who oppose incremental 

### 19 regulatory regulations such as this one, consign their 

### 20 own grandchildren as well as ours, to a future of 

### 21 increasing disease and premature deaths as a result of 

### 22 exposure to particulates and toxic pollutants fromTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 208 1 vehicle emissions. 

### 2The fossil fuel industry argues that this 

### 3 regulation will cost more than the one cent a gallon 

### 4 estimated by the EPA and is, therefore, too burdensome. 

### 5 Meanwhile, individuals pay with their health for asthma 

### 6 brought on or worsened by poor air quality, and 

### 7 businesses pay the price of lost worker days. 

### 8 Please finalize this regulation to help save 

### 9 lives and help save the planet. 

### 10 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you very much. 

### 11Do we we have any questions? 

### 12MR. MACHIELE: I do. I have one question for 

### 13 Frank. With respect to the system or the sulfur 

### 14 regeneration events, is that specific to lean burn GDI 

### 15 only? 

### 16 MR. KRICH: Well, that's the only one that 

### 17 would have that -- you know, the regular converted 

### 18 gasoline vehicles don't have that feature. 

### 19 MR. MACHIELE: Okay. 

### 20 MR. KRICH: But, like, with the diesel, they 

### 21 have the regenerator, we'll have to do that with the 

### 22 lean GDI, and we're already doing some tests onTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 209 1 engines, and we're finding out that, you know, it could 

### 2 increase the regenerations by like three times of what 

### 3 it would normally be. 

### 4So, I mean, so the benefit you get from GDI, 

### 5 almost half that benefit could be lost because you're 

### 6 doing regens, because, as you know, regen requires you 

### 7 to enrich the fuel and, you know, there goes your fuel 

### 8 economy and things like that. 

### 9 MR. MACHIELE: Okay. Thank you for that. 

### 10 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you very much. We're 

### 11 going to take a 20-minute break now and reconvene at 

### 12 3:05. Make that 3:07. 

### 13 [Whereupon, the meeting was recessed briefly 

### 14 at 2:47 p.m., to reconvene at 3:07 p.m.] 

### 15MR. GRUNDLER: If I can welcome panel seven: 

### 16 Mr. Steve Ross, Nick Rogers, Laureen Boyles, Mona 

### 17 Safarty, David Lukens, Jim Hart, Charlie Bugg, Russell 

### 18 Zerbo, welcome. 

### 19 Dr. Rizzo, you'll lead off. 

### 20 DR. RIZZO: Good afternoon, and thank you for 

### 21 the opportunity to testify today in support of Tier 3 

### 22motor vehicle emissions and fuel standards program. MyTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 210 1 name is Dr. Albert Rizzo, and I'm Chief of the 

### 2 Pulmonary Critical Care Medicine Section at Christiana 

### 3 Care Health System in Delaware. I've been caring for 

### 4 Delawareans for over 30 years because of their lung 

### 5 disease. 

### 6 As a pulmonary physician, I'm here to 

### 7 advocate for my patients with lung disease, and in my 

### 8 role as immediate Past Chair of the National Board of 

### 9 Directors of the American Lung Association, I'm here to 

### 10 advocate for not only those millions of Americans who 

### 11 deal with lung disease, but also for those millions of 

### 12 infants, children, teenagers, and seniors who don't 

### 13 want to develop lung disease. 

### 14It's in the best interest of public health 

### 15 for our society, and for this reason the American Lung 

### 16 Association urges the U.S. Environmental Protection 

### 17 Agency to adopt final cleaner gasoline and vehicle 

### 18 standards before the end of the year. 

### 19 Let me start by describing the health effects 

### 20 of tailpipe pollution. Motor vehicles are a major 

### 21 source of nitrogen dioxide, carbon monoxide, and 

### 22 volatile organic compounds. These are the rawTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 211 1 ingredients needed to form harmful ozone and 

### 2 particulate matter. 

### 3 Ground level ozone or smog that blankets much 

### 4 of the United States during the summer is a powerful 

### 5 respiratory irritant, and when inhaled, the ozone 

### 6 damages the lung tissue much like the summer sun burns 

### 7 our skin. 

### 8 Ozone air pollution poses health risks for 

### 9 all who are exposed, be they infants, children, 

### 10 teenagers, or seniors, and it is particularly 

### 11 troublesome to the nearly 26 million with asthma and 13 

### 12million with COPD, and the millions of others with lung 

### 13 diseases. Just as importantly, even healthy adults who 

### 14 work or play outdoors are at risk. 

### 15The EPA's just completed assessment of ozone 

### 16 shows that the health effects are not limited to the 

### 17 respiratory system and may affect cardiovascular 

### 18 health, the central nervous system, as well as the 

### 19 reproductive and developmental systems. 

### 20 The pollutants, nitrogen oxides, and sulfur 

### 21 are byproducts of gasoline combustion are transformed 

### 22 into fine particles in the air. These tiny particlesTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 212 1 are less than one-tenth the diameter of a single human 

### 2 hair, and they're so tiny that they bypassed the body's 

### 3 defenses of the nose and upper airways and lodge deep 

### 4within the lung. This is where they cause the human 

### 5 health problem. 

### 6 Particle pollution also diminishes lung 

### 7 function, causes greater use of asthma medications, and 

### 8 increases the rate of school absenteeism, emergency 

### 9 room visits, and hospital admissions. 

### 10 Both particulate matter and ozone cause the 

### 11most egregious harm as well: premature death. 

### 12 Unfortunately death is not the only harm these 

### 13 pollutants cause. For hundreds of thousands of people, 

### 14polluted air means more breathing problems on a day-to

### 15 day basis, aggravated asthma, fear-filled trips to the 

### 16 emergency room, and admissions to the hospital, 

### 17 sometimes in the intensive care units. These are the 

### 18 patients that I and physicians like me see daily in the 

### 19 hospital and in our practice. My patients already have 

### 20 reduced lung function because of their COPD, asthma, 

### 21 pulmonary fibrosis, and other diseases. 

### 22Their reserve to handle any additionalTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 213 1 impairment is limited, and the exposure to ozone and 

### 2 particulate matter is exactly the additional impairment 

### 3 that can affect my patients' ability to function 

### 4 independently on a day-to-day basis. The increased use 

### 5 of their medication, the steps up in medical management 

### 6 due to poor air quality, is burdensome to the patients 

### 7 and the caregivers. 

### 8 COPD is already the leading -- the second 

### 9 leading cause of disability and impairment in this 

### 10 country, and the personal and societal impact of this 

### 11 is amplified by air pollution. 

### 12We educate our patients daily as far as 

### 13 staying indoors and limit their activities when 

### 14possible on bad air days. However, children and 

### 15 grandchildren, soccer games, and baseball games, often 

### 16 override this best intention. So despite our warnings, 

### 17 we often see a rise in the office and emergency room 

### 18 visits during those days. The impact on the quality of 

### 19 lives, the lost productivity from work absenteeism, and 

### 20 missed school days, takes a toll on all of us. 

### 21So thank you for the opportunity to speak in 

### 22 support of what are life-changing and life-savingTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 214 1 cleaner gasoline and vehicle standards. As a 

### 2 pulmonologist who's seen the health effects of air 

### 3 pollution, I urge you to adopt these final standards 

### 4 this year. Thank you. 

### 5MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you, Doctor. 

### 6 Mr. Ross? 

### 7MR. ROSS: Hi. My name is Steve Ross. I 

### 8 live in Fishtown right by I-95, and I work right here 

### 9 in Rittenhouse. It's a round trip of about seven miles 

### 10 commute today, which I take on bicycle. I ride down 

### 11 Spring Garden Street, 16th Street, major streets with a 

### 12 lot of traffic, especially in Center city. 

### 13 This whole way through rush hour traffic, I'm 

### 14 breathing all of the exhaust, all of the fumes from 

### 15 some of these major streets. I can smell it. I can 

### 16 feel it. I can feel the effects when I get into work. 

### 17I can be short of breath even after having a pretty 

### 18 decent exercise session. This directly affects me, 

### 19 especially, and everybody else that bikes throughout 

### 20 the city of Philadelphia, especially the people that 

### 21 bike every day to get everywhere. Like I said, it's a 

### 22 seven-mile commute, but that doesn't count me going toTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 215 1 the store, going to friends' houses, going out to, you 

### 2 know, the baseball park. Anything that I do, I am 

### 3 breathing these fumes. 

### 4And these Tier 3 rules would reduce what I 

### 5 take in every day as I just get around the city. As I 

### 6 said, I live right on I-95. I'm pretty close to it. 

### 7 Throughout the summer, I live in an old home without 

### 8 air conditioning. I keep my windows open. Even in a 

### 9 couple of days, you can see a layer of soot on every 

### 10 window sill in my house that is built up just from all 

### 11 these cars and trucks going by on 95 every day. 

### 12It's a huge issue. Just looking at my window 

### 13 sill, I wonder every day what goes into my lungs. 

### 14 What's actually going in there and affecting me? 

### 15Thank you for the opportunity and definitely 

### 16 support Tier 3 and get that through. 

### 17MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you, sir. 

### 18 Nick Rogers. 

### 19 MR. ROGERS: How's it going? My name is Nick 

### 20 Rogers. I'm a competitive cyclist and an asthmatic who 

### 21 lives in Philadelphia, and I spend most of my time 

### 22 outdoors. I'm a strong supporter of the proposed newTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 216 1 clean gasoline standards, and hope my testimony today 

### 2 can help the EPA go forward with its implementation. 

### 3 As someone who suffers from asthma and spends 

### 4 of my days outside, especially during the summer when 

### 5 ozone levels are already high, I'm at a higher risk of 

### 6 health problems caused by air pollution than some 

### 7 others. It's especially important to me to protect my 

### 8 health because of what I do, cycling. I spend hours 

### 9 every day training outside on my bike, and I'm 

### 10 constantly subjected to the poor air quality in 

### 11 Pennsylvania. 

### 12I race my bike against other athletes who 

### 13 take impeccable care of their health. So my lungs need 

### 14 to be physically up to the task every weekend of pushed 

### 15 to the limit. And when air pollution from cars and 

### 16 light trucks causes me to suffer from lung problems, it 

### 17 takes all the hard work that I've done, makes it 

### 18 obsolete. 

### 19 So more important, though, than my athletic 

### 20 performance being affected by pollution from cars is 

### 21 the serious impact the pollution has on my health. 

### 22 Nationally, vehicles currently emit approximately 1.7Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 217 1 billion tons of carbon dioxide each yea. These 

### 2 vehicles are also significant sources of air pollution, 

### 3 such as particulate matter, NOx, volatile organic 

### 4 compounds, and air toxins. The proposed standards 

### 5 should substantially decrease exhaust emissions of 

### 6 these harmful pollutants from cars and trucks. 

### 7I feel that if -- I fear that if this rule 

### 8 isn't adopted, my life might be one of those that 

### 9 could've been saved with the help of reduced pollution. 

### 10 My high risk for serious lung problems as an asthmatic 

### 11 and a cyclist makes it crucial to me that EPA tightens 

### 12 restrictions on cars and light trucks. Otherwise, I 

### 13 and people like me will cost the government and private 

### 14 insurance companies billions of dollars in health care 

### 15 costs, and cause tragedies to families burdened by the 

### 16 loss of a loved one because of this pollution. 

### 17Ozone burns my lungs and airways, causing 

### 18 them to become inflamed, reddened, and swollen. 

### 19 Particles lodge deep inside lungs where they threaten 

### 20 my breathing, my heart, and my life. Cleaning up the 

### 21 emissions from cars and light trucks is critically 

### 22 important because ozone smog causes coughing andTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 218 1 wheezing, triggers asthma attacks, sends people to the 

### 2 emergency room, and causes heart attacks and strokes, 

### 3 as well as premature death. 

### 4I think the EPA could actually do even more 

### 5 in the investment and cleaning up. Even more means 

### 6 that we see even greater health and economic benefits 

### 7 and more lives saved each year. 

### 8 Thank you for giving me the opportunity to 

### 9 testify about this important issue to me. It's my 

### 10 request that the EPA please does go through with the 

### 11 proposed rule and protects everyone's health and air 

### 12 quality, especially those like myself with increased 

### 13 risks of health defects. 

### 14MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you very much for 

### 15 coming. 

### 16 Ms. Boyles? 

### 17MS. BOYLES: Good afternoon. My name is 

### 18 Laureen Boyles. I'm a civil engineer and an 

### 19 environmental study planner, and a member of the 

### 20 Environmental Justice Leadership Forum on Climate 

### 21 Change. The forum is a national coalition of 35 

### 22 environmental justice organizations working together toTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 219 1 inform State and Federal policy and advise political 

### 2 and legislative action toward the development of just 

### 3 policies and equitable reduction of carbon emissions in 

### 4 all communities. Thank you for the opportunity to 

### 5 testify on these Tier 3 standards. 

### 6 The Environmental Justice Leadership Forum on 

### 7 Climate Change supports those provisions of the Tier 3 

### 8 standards that are consistent with the organization's 

### 9 mission. I caution that the credit trading provision 

### 10 designed to offer flexibility during the transition to 

### 11more efficient vehicles and cleaner fuels seems 

### 12 counterintuitive to uniform national standards, thereby 

### 13 uniform benefits. I propose that the success of the 

### 14 Tier 2 standards are well documented and are all the 

### 15 transition that we ever needed. 

### 16 We casually speak of trading credits, but if 

### 17 we look at the transaction closely, someone is standing 

### 18 with a basket full of credits, and someone is standing 

### 19 with a basket full of dis-benefits or pollution. 

### 20 Because all communities deserve their share 

### 21 of greenhouse gas reductions, fuel savings, energy 

### 22 security, mitigation of disproportionate adverse healthTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 220 1 impacts, economic growth, and job creation, I ask that 

### 2 you consider the benefits that -- or the impact that 

### 3 the trading provision has had on the Tier 2 standards 

### 4 as we move forward in Tier 3. 

### 5Thank you again for this opportunity. I 

### 6 applaud the work that you've done as well as the effort 

### 7 that it takes to balance the protection of people, the 

### 8 preservation of the planet, and the promotion of 

### 9 economic prosperity. Thank you. 

### 10 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you very much. 

### 11Mr. Zerbo? 

### 12MR. ZERBO: Hello. My name is Russell Zerbo, 

### 13 and I'm an asthmatic. I would like to thank the EPA 

### 14 for proposing this rule and holding the hearing in an 

### 15 area strongly affected by air pollution and other 

### 16 environmental injustices. 

### 17I've lived in the Philadelphia area all my 

### 18 life. As a young man, a doctor told me that I had 

### 19 developed asthma from being exposed to chemicals used 

### 20 in hair dyes and other treatments. My mother worked 

### 21 part time at a hair salon, but in order to be at home 

### 22 to get myself and my sister, who also has asthma forTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 221 1 the same reason, to and from school and maintain our 

### 2 home, she built a small salon in our laundry room, and 

### 3 often made me breakfast while we were waiting for 

### 4 someone to get their hair rinsed out. This is why I 

### 5 have asthma. This is why I'm predisposed to be more 

### 6 strongly affected by air pollution. 

### 7In Philadelphia, 60 percent of our air 

### 8 pollution comes from auto emissions. In my own efforts 

### 9 to reduce air pollution, I do not own a car and try to 

### 10 bike as much as possible. While I use my own energy 

### 11 getting around the city, I have to ride side by side 

### 12 with cars pumping sulfur, carbon, soot, and other 

### 13 toxins into my already irritated lungs. 

### 14I thank the auto industry for supporting this 

### 15 rule and acknowledging that low sulfur requirements and 

### 16 regulations on evaporative emissions go hand-in-hand. 

### 17 This is beyond sulfur because sulfur dioxide creates 

### 18 soot and ground level ozone when it interacts with 

### 19 other toxins in the air. So to just say that it's 

### 20 about lowering sulfur emissions is very misleading. 

### 21I don't appreciate the gasoline industry's 

### 22 implication that since previous emission standards wereTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 222 1 so effective, we should be content with the current 

### 2 state of air pollution. With automotive manufacturers 

### 3 supporting it, there is no reason not to keep pushing 

### 4 the industry towards minimizing emissions. 

### 5My mother paid for my hospital bills, 

### 6 doctor's visits, and prescriptions with the money she 

### 7made polluting my body. I'm asking the petroleum 

### 8 industry to absorb the one percent gallon price 

### 9 increase in gasoline without raising retail rates as 

### 10 repayment for harming Philadelphia's air quality. 

### 11I was able to receive the medical attention I 

### 12 required, but many others are not so fortunate and 

### 13 experience much hardship because their untreated asthma 

### 14 gets exponentially worse as gas companies are content 

### 15 with standards they did want in the first place. 

### 16 Advancements in low sulfur gasoline and more efficient 

### 17 engines are reason to push emission regulations 

### 18 further, not to lag on them. 

### 19 Thank you. 

### 20 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you. 

### 21Mr. Lukens? 

### 22MR. LUKENS: Yes, thank you. My name isTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 223 1 David Lukens. I'm a concerned citizen testifying in 

### 2 support of the proposed Tier 3 rules. And I helped to 

### 3 found a natural food company actually that started out 

### 4 in Montana, and then since a lot of my work is 

### 5 relationship based, I could live anywhere that was 

### 6 affordable. I picked Philadelphia mostly because it's 

### 7 pedestrian friendly. It's a very walkable city. 

### 8 And on my way to this hearing, I actually 

### 9 knocked on a -- on the window of a tour bus and told 

### 10 them to quit their engine idling, which is something I 

### 11 try to do several times a day. And I think that that's 

### 12 an easy and effective shift, just like adopting this 

### 13 rule, which really benefits all people who walk in 

### 14 Philadelphia and in other cities. 

### 15So thank you for your consideration. 

### 16 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you. Did the bus driver 

### 17 shut off his engine? 

### 18 MR. LUKENS: Yes, he did. That happens in 

### 19 about 30 percent of the cases, immediate shut off. 

### 20 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you. 

### 21Mr. Bugg? 

### 22MR. BUGG: My name is Charlie Bugg, and I wasTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 224 1 invited to testify by the Penn Environment. I'm a 

### 2member of that organization. I'm also a low income 

### 3 landlord in Philadelphia. I'm a gardener, and I'm the 

### 4 Treasurer of the Frankfurt Garden Club, which is a 

### 5 neighborhood here in Philadelphia. I'm also a hiker, 

### 6 and an occasional sailor, and the father of a 17-year

### 7 old daughter. All these are reasons why I'm happy that 

### 8 the EPA is proposing this rule. 

### 9 I don't have asthma. I don't have any 

### 10 serious problems. But the vast majority of us who 

### 11 don't also are affected by this and believe in it. For 

### 12 instance, as a landlord, two things come to me on this. 

### 13 As a small businessman, we look at cost benefit 

### 14 analysis. One cent a gallon? I mean, it's absurd that 

### 15 that would be a reason not to do it. The price of 

### 16 gasoline goes up or down five cents a week sometimes. 

### 17 It seems a bit crazy to me. Or even the -- although 

### 18 there's no resistance from the automobile agency it 

### 19 appears, the less than $150 to do the changes that 

### 20 would be needed doesn't seem very expensive for all the 

### 21 problems it's caused. 

### 22Many of my tenants complain of asthma, and,Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 225 1 of course, as the landlord I get blamed. Often they 

### 2 will think it's something to do with the house when 

### 3 probably it could be, but it's probably a lot more to 

### 4 do with the air. So even those of us who don't have it 

### 5 are affected by it. 

### 6 I don't know -- I haven't heard the science 

### 7 so much about how much this type of pollution affects 

### 8 our plants that we grow. I certainly believe that it 

### 9 does affect them some in the long run. But certainly 

### 10 some of us like to be a little free and open. For 

### 11 instance, the raspberries that you grow are the very 

### 12 best just picked right off the vine and eaten right 

### 13 then. They kind of crush easily, and it's just 

### 14 wonderful to do that. Some other things, too. To have 

### 15 to feel like you must wash them off, it's a minor 

### 16 inconvenience, but it matters. Of course, hiking and 

### 17 sailing, we're outdoors a lot and breathe a little 

### 18 harder. It makes a difference to us there, too. And 

### 19 as a father of a 17-year-old, I'm really concerned 

### 20 about the long-term concerns here. 

### 21This happens to be the approximate 50th 

### 22 anniversary of Dr. Martin Luther King's "Letter from aTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 226 1 Birmingham Jail," and one of the things that I think he 

### 2 said, if not, somebody else similar, that if you're not 

### 3 part of the solution, you're part of the problem. So I 

### 4 feel like if we're not going forward in this, we're 

### 5 going to be -- end up going backwards. We'll probably 

### 6 end up having more vehicles on the road in spite of the 

### 7 good people here that ride bicycles so much. So we 

### 8 have to cut down the pollution per vehicle or it's 

### 9 going to get worse. 

### 10 I know that this focus isn't primarily on 

### 11 global warming, but I feel like it must affect it in 

### 12 some level. And I just want to point out something 

### 13 that maybe people are not thinking about so much. This 

### 14past winter, this past heating season, has felt to us a 

### 15 little -- especially the spring has felt to us a little 

### 16 cooler than sometimes, and maybe it is except for 

### 17 today. 

### 18 However, the Enquirer, the Philadelphia 

### 19 Enquirer publishes every day a what they call a heating 

### 20 degree days. And over this past year, our heating 

### 21 degree days were still lower than the long-term 

### 22 average. The heating degree days, which covered theTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 227 1 time from late fall to the end of this month, as of 

### 2 this morning were 4,184. The long-term average was 

### 3 4,420. We're at 95 percent of the long-term average. 

### 4 So even on a cooler than average, we think, winter, 

### 5 it's still warmer than the long-term average, so it 

### 6 does affect us. 

### 7Anybody who wants to see that type of thing, 

### 8 they changed it to the back page of the sports section 

### 9 in the Philadelphia Enquirer. I strongly support the 

### 10 new rules and wish they were stronger. 

### 11MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you very much. 

### 12 Any questions for this panel? 

### 13 [No response.] 

### 14MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you again for your 

### 15 engagement and your willingness to spend part of your 

### 16 day with us. It's very meaningful to all of us. 

### 17 UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKERS: Thank you. 

### 18 MR. GRUNDLER: One moment while we organize 

### 19 the next panel. 

### 20 All right. Our next panel -- late breaking 

### 21 news. 

### 22 MR. HART: I was told to go up front.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 228 1UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: He just walked in. 

### 2MR. GRUNDLER: Have a seat up front. Are you 

### 3 Mr. Hart? 

### 4MR. HART: Yes. 

### 5MR. GRUNDLER: Mr. Hart, Bryan Crenshaw, Joy 

### 6 Bergey, and Harold Jones, Thomas Huynh, Frank Schaller, 

### 7 And Steve Flint, come on up. 

### 8 Why don't we proceed from left to right, 

### 9 starting with you, Mr. Crenshaw? Welcome. 

### 10 DR. CRENSHAW: Hi, thank you. I am Dr. Bryan 

### 11 Crenshaw. I'm Associate Professor at Children's 

### 12 Hospital, Philadelphia, and the Perlman School of 

### 13 Medicine, University of Pennsylvania. I'm also a 

### 14 volunteer activist at the Sierra Club. But today I'm 

### 15 here to speak as an individual. You've heard a lot 

### 16 from the bike community, and I also am a member of the 

### 17 bike community. And as urban bike commuters, clean air 

### 18 -- we seem to be particularly attuned to the fact that 

### 19 it's important for our health and well-being. 

### 20 There's nothing like biking behind a vehicle 

### 21 that spewing emissions from the tailpipe to elicit 

### 22 visceral reaction to pollution from cars and how thatTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 229 1 raised concerns in our mind. Although clearly any car 

### 2 that's putting out that level of pollution is no longer 

### 3 in compliance with current regulations, it does make 

### 4 the dangers of tail pipe pollutants quite palpable. 

### 5Despite the fact that most cars are, in fact, 

### 6 are in compliance with current regulations, there are, 

### 7 as we all know, bad air days, as we heard about 

### 8 previously, for the levels of smog are not healthy. 

### 9 And on these days, the cumulative impact of the smog 

### 10 pollution is perceptible even under the current 

### 11 regulations. Therefore, it's so important for these 

### 12 new regulations to address the major sources of air 

### 13 pollutants that give rise to smog, and to begin to 

### 14 alleviate the impact of bad urban -- or bad air days in 

### 15 urban environments, such as Philadelphia. 

### 16 Additionally, I come here speaking as a 

### 17 father who is raising a child in an urban environment. 

### 18 As you heard previously from Russell, we have impacts 

### 19 of raising children in urban environments, and that, of 

### 20 course, concerns us. Fortunately for me, my son is not 

### 21 an asthmatic, but I do worry about him when he's on the 

### 22 ball field in the summer being subjected to badTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 230 1 pollution days. One is concerned that perhaps, you 

### 2 know, one needs to remove him from the field. Of 

### 3 course, that's just such a challenge. And it's for 

### 4 this reason for our children it's so important to 

### 5 reduce the amount of sulfur, and nitrogen oxides, and 

### 6 volatile organic compounds our environment. 

### 7Undoubtedly, as we've heard before, there are 

### 8 organizations that oppose these regulations, and they 

### 9 have crass monetary interests in mind. Frankly, I 

### 10 think these organizations should be ashamed of their 

### 11motivations. I mean, one cent per gallon of gas? I 

### 12 think the health of the citizens of this country, 

### 13 particularly our children, are worth these few pennies. 

### 14Even without the sophisticated types of cost 

### 15 benefit analyses that went into this decision by the 

### 16 EPA, I think that common decency and a sense of 

### 17 stewardship for our fellow citizens would argue the 

### 18 importance of reducing the health impacts of tailpipe 

### 19 emissions above and beyond those that could be 

### 20 monetized. 

### 21One has heard multiple asthmatics here at 

### 22 this hearing that have really brought the personalTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 231 1 impact of this home to us. And I think our country 

### 2 needs to get away from an obsession with pinching 

### 3 pennies, and the associated canard of the impact of 

### 4 regulations on jobs. We need to take care of our 

### 5 citizens. We need to be concerned with the well-being 

### 6 of our fellow men and women and children. 

### 7In summary, I strongly support these new 

### 8 regulations, and I think it's important to protect the 

### 9 health of all Americans, most importantly, our 

### 10 children. Thank you. 

### 11MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you so much. 

### 12Mr. Schaller, please. 

### 13 MR. SCHALLER: My name is Frank Schaller, and 

### 14 I created the Soil Food Health Forum to educate people 

### 15 about food and energy pollution. My -- I want to thank 

### 16 specifically the Sierra Club for keeping us informed. 

### 17 If it wasn't for them, I would not have known about 

### 18 this, and they're doing very good work. My testimony 

### 19 covers a micro and a macro view, so even though it 

### 20 sounds like I'm more macro, focused on the micro 

### 21 connections. 

### 22Thank you very, very much for this specialTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 232 1 opportunity to comment at this public hearing. I trust 

### 2 the Environmental Protection Agency will live up to its 

### 3 middle name and provide protection from dangerous 

### 4pollutants for our children and your own children. 

### 5 Hopefully the influence of industrial interests will 

### 6 not marginalize or overshadow the efforts and concerns 

### 7 of people testifying for stronger regulation that will 

### 8 work toward eliminating pollution our home planet. 

### 9 The next time you're in a bumper to bumper 

### 10 traffic jam for 30, 40, 50 minutes, when you arrive at 

### 11 your destination, go to the back of your car and wipe 

### 12 your finger across the back of the trunk. Look at the 

### 13 dirt on your finger and realize the direct, the 

### 14 chemical pollutants, the hormone disruptors on your 

### 15 finger are also in your lungs headed for your blood 

### 16 stream and traveling to the weakest organs in your 

### 17 toxic body. And we can thank the EPA for the research 

### 18 they've done on human toxicity. We are all toxic. 

### 19 Those same chemical compounds are also in every infant, 

### 20 child, and elderly person's lungs, blood, and 

### 21 compromised organs. 

### 22The Free Library of Philadelphia has a DVD,Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 233 1 Who Killed the Electric Car, available. No cost to 

### 2 watch it. Yes, this is a hearing on combustion engine 

### 3 pollution, but it warrants repeating that 60 to 80 

### 4percent of Americans' auto miles can be done with 

### 5 electric vehicles. The wind and solar industry is 

### 6 developing to the point of providing clean energy to 

### 7 support recharging the electric vehicles. Electric 

### 8 vehicles, cars, trucks, SUVs, can eliminate vast 

### 9 amounts of combustion engine pollution. 

### 10 Attached are references along the lines of 

### 11 Ross Perot for those who remember the charts and the 

### 12 facts that he presents. Attached are references to 

### 13 support the fact that America's energy policy can and 

### 14must move to clean renewable energy sources very, very 

### 15 soon because fossil fuels have been a pernicious 

### 16 disease, killing and damaging the people, the land, the 

### 17 atmosphere of this good earth. Tailpipe emissions are 

### 18 at the top of the disease causing list. 

### 19 After over 100 years, we can surmise a 

### 20 combustion engine will never be pollution free. 

### 21 Remember that pollution means disease and early death. 

### 22Our infants, children, and elderly are sufferingTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 234 1 terribly. No economic considerations of fossil fuels 

### 2 counterbalances, the health impact, pain, sorrow, and 

### 3 destruction to the health of the people and our planet. 

### 4The United States Environmental Protection 

### 5Agency should be applauded for its research on 

### 6 carcinogens, especially those coming out of the 

### 7 tailpipes of combustion engines: cadmium, sulfur 

### 8 compounds, nitrous oxide, carbons, et cetera. But 

### 9 please require stricter standards now while you work to 

### 10 eliminate the problem, fossil fuels. 

### 11And a P.S., everybody must see the 22-minute 

### 12 You Tube video Ten Americans from the Environmental 

### 13 Working Group, another good organization that has done 

### 14 wonderful work. 

### 15Thank you very much for this opportunity. 

### 16 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you for coming. 

### 17Ms. Bergey? 

### 18 MS. BERGEY: Hi, I'm Joy Bergey, and I don't 

### 19 know if you got the word. I'm reading testimony for 

### 20 two organizations, Pennsylvania Interfaith Power and 

### 21 Light and Penn Future. Cricket Hunter from 

### 22 Pennsylvania Interfaith Power and Light could not beTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 235 1 here, so I'll be -- 

### 2MR. GRUNDLER: Okay. 

### 3 MS. BERGEY: And they're both fairly short. 

### 4 I hope I can do them both in close to five minutes 

### 5 total. 

### 6 So I'll start by reading the testimony on 

### 7 behalf of Cricket Eccleston Hunter, who is the 

### 8 Executive Director of Pennsylvania Interfaith and 

### 9 Light, or Pennsylvania IPL. 

### 10 My name is Joy Bergey, and I'm a member of 

### 11 Pennsylvania IPL, member congregation, Chestnut Hill 

### 12 United Church. Pennsylvania IPL is an affiliate of the 

### 13 National Interfaith Power and Light, comprised of 40 

### 14 States affiliates representing 14,000 congregations. 

### 15 Members come together from diverse faith traditions 

### 16 because we share the common callings to both care for 

### 17 creation and to care for the most vulnerable among us. 

### 18 These concerns are at the root of our deep 

### 19 concern about climate change. In our private and in 

### 20 our congregational lives, we seek to reduce our 

### 21 emissions as part of our faithful witness. 

### 22These new efficiency rules proposed by EPATranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 236 1 for light cars and trucks are expected to curb 

### 2 projected greenhouse gas emissions by six billion, with 

### 3 a "B," metric tons. The rules create a predictable 

### 4market to spur innovation that will reduce our impact 

### 5 on the climate and will have both direct and indirect 

### 6 health benefits on citizens of the U.S. and of the 

### 7 world. 

### 8 Now that we know the effects of our 

### 9 consumption on God's creation and the most vulnerable, 

### 10 we have no choice but to act morally and respond. With 

### 11 these new rules, the EPA is taking the right step. The 

### 12 new mileage standards create new opportunities for 

### 13 individuals of faith to live their lives more fully, 

### 14 whether by carpooling in a more efficient car, walking, 

### 15 or riding a bike in safer, cleaner air. 

### 16 As people of faith, we urge you to continue 

### 17 the work with which you have been charged, to act 

### 18 swiftly and decisively in defense of clean air for the 

### 19 people, the country, and the planet. Thank you. 

### 20 And now I'll speak as, again, Joy Bergey as 

### 21 Federal Policy Director for Penn Future. 

### 22Penn Future is a statewide public interestTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 237 1membership organization founded in 1998, and we have 

### 2 offices across the State. So, first, thank you for 

### 3 coming to Philadelphia. Welcome back. We love to have 

### 4you here. And Penn Future supports the proposed Tier 3 

### 5 standard and thanks you, the EPA, and the Obama 

### 6 Administration for proposing this rule. 

### 7The standard, if implemented as proposed, 

### 8 would improve air quality and public health. It would 

### 9 reduce smog forming nitrogen oxides and volatile 

### 10 organic compounds by 80 percent. Vehicles would emit 

### 11 70 percent less particulate matter and 40 percent less 

### 12 of the toxic benzine. The rule would reduce asthma 

### 13 attacks, respiratory problems, and premature deaths 

### 14 caused by smog forming emissions. This is especially 

### 15 important to residents here in Philadelphia and in 

### 16 Pittsburgh where air in both cities is way too dirty by 

### 17many Federal standards. 

### 18 According to EPA's own calculations, by 2030, 

### 19 the proposed standard would prevent up to 2,400 

### 20 premature deaths, 23,000 cases of respiratory ailments 

### 21 in children, 3,200 hospital admissions and asthma

### 22 related ER visits, and 1.8 million lost school days,Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 238 1 work days, and days when activities would be restricted 

### 2 due to air pollution, all of this each and every year. 

### 3 EPA also estimates that by 2030, these public health 

### 4 benefits would result in avoiding costs between $8 and 

### 5 $23 billion annually. 

### 6 At Penn Future, our tagline is that every 

### 7 environmental victory grows the economy. So this 

### 8 proposed rule would improve air quality, benefit public 

### 9 health, and save at least $8 billion annually. What's 

### 10 not to love about this new standard? 

### 11But the economic news gets even better. A 

### 12 study by Navigant Economics estimates that the Tier 3 

### 13 rule would create almost 5,300 permanent jobs in the 

### 14 operation and maintenance of new refining equipment, as 

### 15 well as 24,000 new jobs over the three-year period to 

### 16 install the new equipment at refineries. In addition, 

### 17 Tier 3 will drive the advances in emissions control 

### 18 technology developed here in the U.S. and exported 

### 19 globally. 

### 20 Penn Future is loving this proposed rule more 

### 21 and more, and we're not alone. The standards have 

### 22 broad support from science, environmental, and healthTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 239 1 organization, UAW, consumer groups, the Manufacturers 

### 2 of Emission Control Technology, and many auto makers. 

### 3 So Penn Future encourages EPA to adopt this 

### 4 Tier 3 standard promptly as proposed without being 

### 5 weakened. Thank you very much. 

### 6 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you so much. 

### 7Mr. Huynh? 

### 8 MR. HUYNH: Good afternoon. My name is 

### 9 Thomas Huynh. I'm the Director for the City of 

### 10 Philadelphia Department of Public Health Air Management 

### 11 Services. 

### 12First, I would to thank the United States EPA 

### 13 for holding public hearing on the proposed rule of air 

### 14pollution from motor vehicle. Air Management Services, 

### 15 AMS, is the local air pollution control agency for the 

### 16 City of Philadelphia. Our mission is to protect the 

### 17 health and quality of life for the Philadelphia from 

### 18 adverse effect of air quality. It operates under the 

### 19 authority of the Philadelphia, Pennsylvania Air 

### 20 Pollution Control and the Clean Air Act. 

### 21AMS strongly support Tier 3 proposal to 

### 22 reduce emission from passenger car and light truck byTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 240 1 lowering the sulfur in gasoline. The Tier 3 would 

### 2 reduce nitrogen oxide, volatile organic compound, 

### 3 emission by eight and three percent by 2017, by 2030 by 

### 4 28 and 23 percent, respectively. The approximate 

### 5 emission of benzine and total air emissions would be 

### 6 reduced by four and three percent by 2017, and 36 and 

### 7 23 percent by 2030. These reductions will 

### 8 significantly improve to help benefit Philadelphian, 

### 9 and as well help us to meet the National Ambient Air 

### 10 Quality Standards. 

### 11Currently, Philadelphia meets all the 

### 12 standards except for ozone and particulate matter, five 

### 13 particulate matter. In 2012, we had 21 days that we do 

### 14 not meet the National Ambient Air Quality Standards. 

### 15The current level ozones mostly were created 

### 16 by nitrogen oxides and volatile organic compound from 

### 17 the automobile, and 22 percent of children of 

### 18 Philadelphians have asthma. This is the rate that -- 

### 19 the output rate of the national average. And most the 

### 20 emissions created near the roadway, and most 

### 21 Philadelphian people live within 76 meter from the 

### 22 roadway, would be impacted by the automobile results.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 241 1So in summary, I would like to have the rule 

### 2 be adopted as quickly as possible because the standards 

### 3 are consistent with California and other European 

### 4 countries already have. We do hope with the rule we're 

### 5 able to meet the air quality standard. We also are 

### 6 able to reduce the air toxic emissions. Right now we 

### 7 have eight air toxic compounds that consist more than 

### 8 one in a million risk due to the high sulfur in 

### 9 gasoline. 

### 10 Thank you for the opportunity to support the 

### 11 proposed rule, and we remain committed to protect the 

### 12 health and well-being of the people in Philadelphia. 

### 13 Thank you. 

### 14MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you, sir. 

### 15Steve? 

### 16 MR. FLINT: Thanks. Good afternoon. My name 

### 17 is Steve Flint. I'm the Assistant Director for the 

### 18 Division of Air Resources for the New York State 

### 19 Department of Environmental Conservation. I want to 

### 20 thank EPA for the opportunity to testify on behalf of 

### 21 New York State regarding the proposed Tier 3 motor 

### 22 vehicle emissions and fuel standards. And up front,Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 242 1 New York fully supports the option of the proposed Tier 

### 2 3 standards, and we're particularly interested in the 

### 3 proposed gasoline -- yeah, sorry about that -- the 

### 4 gasoline sulfur standard. 

### 5New York has historically for a long time now 

### 6 had in place the California motor vehicle emissions 

### 7 standards in order to help us meet our air quality 

### 8 objectives. We most recently adopted the California 

### 9 Advanced Clean Cars Program in 2012 to help us achieve 

### 10 and maintain reductions for criteria pollutants and 

### 11 greenhouse gas. That's the California LEV III program. 

### 12The proposed Tier 3 standards will harmonize 

### 13 the national standards with those more stringent 

### 14 technologies, forcing standards that have been the 

### 15 hallmark of the California program over the last 20 

### 16 years now. New York is confronted with serious air 

### 17 quality problems associated with transported air 

### 18 pollution, and implementation of the Tier 3 standards 

### 19 nationwide will have a positive impact on the reduction 

### 20 of transported emissions from upwind States that 

### 21 negatively affect New York. These upwind controls will 

### 22 lead to a more equitable distribution of controlledTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 243 1 costs. 

### 2And just to point out that metropolitan New 

### 3 York is in non-attainment for the 2008 ozone standard, 

### 4 and we have, in fact, based on actual monitored data 

### 5 requested a bump up of that non-attainment status to 

### 6 moderate. 

### 7Adoption of the national Tier 3 standards 

### 8 will harmonize the Federal and California standards, 

### 9 thereby reducing compliance burdens on vehicle 

### 10 manufacturers, enabling them to build vehicles to a 

### 11 single national standard. 

### 12In New York, we've implemented pretty much 

### 13 everything we can implement as far as controls on 

### 14 stationary sources. Incoming air quality is a very big 

### 15 deal to us in New York, and Tier 3 is a critical part 

### 16 of that. 

### 17We also fully support adoption of the 

### 18 proposed standards regulating the sulfur content of 

### 19 gasoline. When we adopted the California motor vehicle 

### 20 emissions standards in 1990, the Clean Air Act pretty 

### 21much hinders New York and other States from adopting 

### 22 the California fuel standards. I won't say it'sTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 244 1 impossible, but it is a high hurdle. 

### 2The proposed gasoline sulfur limited of 10 

### 3 parts per million is widely accepted, developed around 

### 4 the developed world. It's currently the standard in 

### 5 the EU, Japan, South Korea, and in California, and 

### 6 China is even moving forward with the 10-part per 

### 7million sulfur standard. 

### 8 The engine exhaust after treatment fuel needs 

### 9 to be treated as a system, as EPA has recognized and 

### 10 done with the Tier 3 and now the Tier 3 standards and 

### 11 heavy duty standards as well. And we fully support the 

### 12 proposal here to regulate the system again. Reduction 

### 13 in the sulfur content of gasoline facilitates 

### 14 improvements in engine and exhaust after treatment 

### 15 signs that can further reduce emissions of ozone 

### 16 precursors, as well as reductions in greenhouse gas 

### 17 emissions improvements in fuel economy as other 

### 18 technology is enabled. 

### 19 Sulfur is well-known poison catalysts that 

### 20 are vital for meeting existing and proposed standards. 

### 21There's been concern expressed about this for many 

### 22 years now, and Tier 3 made a lot of progress inTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 245 1 reducing standards that -- sulfur standards, and now 

### 2 it's time to go the next step and bring it down even 

### 3 further. 

### 4While the emissions benefits associated with 

### 5 the Tier 3 standards won't fully accrue until the fleet 

### 6 turnover, the environmental benefits from gasoline 

### 7 sulfur reductions will also improve the effectiveness 

### 8 of millions of catalytic converters already in the 

### 9 field. We know that some of the effects of sulfur on 

### 10 catalysts is reversible, so as soon as it goes into 

### 11 effect, we get benefits. Your documents suggest 

### 12 284,000 tons of NOx nationally in 2017. That's 

### 13 probably in the order of 10,000 tons of NOx for New 

### 14 York. 

### 15And to illustrate some of that impact, I 

### 16 looked at data -- INM data for 2012 in New York, and we 

### 17 had 17,000 vehicles fail initial INM tests for 

### 18 catalytic converter. And we don't know how many 

### 19 might've been repaired before they were tested, so we 

### 20 know that sulfur improvements would reduce that 

### 21 catalyst impact, and, therefore, not only save some 

### 22money for the owners for catalyst repairs, but alsoTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 246 1 give us environmental benefits. 

### 2Finally, just -- I'm out of time, but just to 

### 3 say as far as cert fuel, I've personally been harping 

### 4 on EPA for a long time to make cert fuel look more like 

### 5 fuel in use, so thanks. 

### 6 Again, we fully support these standards, and 

### 7 we'll be providing some more detailed written comments 

### 8 to the docket. 

### 9 MR. GRUNDLER: Thanks, Steve. The cert fuel 

### 10 provision is known as the Flint provision. 

### 11Mr. Hart? 

### 12MR. HART: I'm sorry that I didn't turn the 

### 13 microphone to my gentleman to my right. I'm a Quaker, 

### 14 and you'll -- if you haven't heard from Hollister 

### 15 Knowlton, she will be speaking, I believe. I don't 

### 16 represent the Society of Friends. I am a Quaker. 

### 17On the way from here to lunch, I was walking 

### 18 rapidly, and I made the typical pedestrian's mistake of 

### 19 running across a very wide street. Well, I'm old 

### 20 enough to half collapse. My leg gave out, and six -- 

### 21 five lanes of traffic was headed towards me. I 

### 22 recovered and ran, so I was saved.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 247 1I think back to when I was taking my son, 

### 2 who's now 37 years old, running a non-profit for 

### 3 children. When I was walking him, we took public 

### 4 transit to get to his daycare. I would walk across JFK 

### 5 Boulevard carrying his lunchbox, and the traffic 

### 6 turning that corner, the very place where I stumbled 

### 7 going out that direction, drives five cars wide at 

### 8 anything. And one particular day, a car aimed directly 

### 9 for us, and I was frozen. I didn't know what to do. 

### 10 The car swerved around me and my child. I threw his 

### 11 lunchbox at the car. 

### 12Now, coming here back from lunch, I got up to 

### 13 Market Street, and looked down across the street and 

### 14 saw a kid walk into the street, 10-year-old at most, 

### 15 and a bus came within one and a half feet of this 

### 16 child. Everybody on the street screamed. 

### 17Now, I'm way off target here. I heard this 

### 18 morning things that were way beyond me. If you look at 

### 19 the hole in my head, it's not because I'm an idiot, but 

### 20 because I was exposed in high school to concentrated 

### 21 hydrochloric acid. The teacher didn't tell me don't 

### 22 get into that bottle. I sniffed it. Now many medicalTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 248 1 procedures and surgeries later, I'm an epileptic. I 

### 2 have some cognitive difficulties. 

### 3 Going back to that boy in the street, 

### 4 everybody screamed, and I was in tears. Cars, I don't 

### 5 -- my wife takes me places. I can't drive, thank 

### 6 heavens. I'm a little scattered because of this brain 

### 7 problem. Finish up if I can real quick. 

### 8 Regulation is necessary, but regulation is 

### 9 used by industry. We saw all the industry people 

### 10 earlier, and they were overwhelming. I couldn't 

### 11 understand them. But I knew that something was going 

### 12 on there with the dots and the dashes and the small 

### 13 print. Regulation is a tool that the polluters use. 

### 14Now, I respect the Environmental Protection Agency. 

### 15 Believe me, it's in gold letters. You've done a lot of 

### 16 good work, but why should it be so much work? 

### 17The pressure should be on the polluters and 

### 18 the killers of this planet. By the way, I'm also an 

### 19 adult who acquired asthma. I see the trees in my 

### 20 backyard disappearing, shrubs, azaleas that were 10, 

### 21 12, 15 feet long are dying. And, oh, flowers are 

### 22 appearing that I've never seen, a wonderful thing, badTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 249 1 thing. This is a crazy era we're living in. 

### 2And I really -- I'm going to finish up in 

### 3 just 30 seconds. I really appreciate your work because 

### 4you are attending to a lot of difficult material. I 

### 5 respect your intelligence and what you know, and I hope 

### 6 you do well. But -- well, you've heard it. You know 

### 7 what I mean. Thank you very much. 

### 8 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you so much for coming, 

### 9 Mr. Hart. 

### 10 Mr. Butera? 

### 11MR. BUTERA: Yes, good afternoon. My name is 

### 12 Jay Butera, and I'm speaking to you today from a 

### 13 personal standpoint as a father of four children and a 

### 14 very concerned citizen. I hope you have this handout 

### 15 that I dropped off to you. 

### 16 I wanted to speak just a little bit about my 

### 17 perspective on pollution, pollution of air and 

### 18 pollution of water. And I understand that the ruling 

### 19 that we're discussing today advances us toward cleaner 

### 20 air or less emissions, you know, by significant 

### 21 percentage points. I have -- and I think that's 

### 22 wonderful, desperately needed. But I have some --Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 250 1 perhaps a slightly different perspective on pollution 

### 2 that I've developed over the last 50 years. 

### 3 I myself cannot understand why we need to 

### 4pollute at all. And I know that sounds unrealistic, 

### 5 but I'm going to explain some things that I think are 

### 6 very realistic. Why as a species with all the 

### 7 technology that we have do we permit ourselves to foul 

### 8 our water and foul our air? Why do we permit ourselves 

### 9 to use the atmosphere as a dumping ground for air toxic 

### 10 waste when we don't have to? And I'm here to tell you 

### 11 today that right now we don't have to. That's my 

### 12 perspective on pollution. And I think that we've 

### 13 become hardened to the fact that it's necessary. It 

### 14 really is not, and we can do better. 

### 15Now, on the handout that I gave you, I'm 

### 16 showing you a fleet of cars which I think is compliant 

### 17 with your rule. This fleet is in my driveway right 

### 18 now. These are my family cars. And I wanted to tell 

### 19 you that we've been driving a cleaner fleet of cars for 

### 20 a decade now. It's been no hardship on us. It's been 

### 21 nothing but savings of money, reliable transportation, 

### 22 and just a wonderful way to move ourselves around.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 251 1So on the front page, I show you our two 

### 2 vehicles. One is a 10-year old Toyota Prius Hybrid, 

### 3 which now has 165,000 miles on it. I showed you a 

### 4photograph of the odometer from this morning. That's 

### 5 our old technology. Our new technology, which we've 

### 6 had for about six months, is the 100 percent electric 

### 7 Nissan Leaf on the left side of the page. That has no 

### 8 gas tank, has no emissions whatsoever. 

### 9 First, I'll just talk about the Prius for a 

### 10 minute. By my estimates, over the 165,000 miles that 

### 11 we've driven that, we have saved, as I did the math for 

### 12 you there on the handout, 4,800 gallons of gasoline 

### 13 compared to the car that I traded in to get that Prius 

### 14 10 years ago, November 2003. At $4 a gallon, that's 

### 15 $19,000 of money saved. So when I see people raising 

### 16 red flags that this might raise your rulings, might 

### 17 raise the cost of fuel by a penny or a dime per gallon, 

### 18 I say where do I sign up, because the efficiencies that 

### 19 your various ruling on this topic are promoting will 

### 20 definitely save money. 

### 21If you turn to the second page, I'm going to 

### 22 tell you how realistic emissions free transportationTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 252 1 is. This is my equation for transportation right now 

### 2 for all of our local driving. I drive a 100 percent 

### 3 electric car. I have solar panels on my roof, which 

### 4 charges the car. So basically we're taking the 

### 5 sunlight and bottling it into the car and driving on 

### 6 it. Zero emissions, zero fossil fuels. If you don't 

### 7 have solar panels, you can plug an electric car into -- 

### 8 you can select your electricity supplier to be any one 

### 9 of the number of clean green energy suppliers that we 

### 10 have in this area and drive your car on green energy. 

### 11So all of the standards you're setting are 

### 12 attainable with off the shelf technology of today, and 

### 13 I would encourage you to adopt the ruling, make it 

### 14 stick, and then let's move on for cleaner and cleaner 

### 15 and cleaner cars until we get to zero. That's my goal. 

### 16 Thank you very much. 

### 17UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: That's good. 

### 18 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you. That was very 

### 19 interesting testimony. 

### 20 Any questions for the panel? 

### 21MS. SARGEANT: I do. Thank you for everyone 

### 22 who testified. It was all very interesting.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 253 1I did have one specific follow-up question 

### 2 for Steve Flint from New York. You talked about the 

### 3 non-attainment challenges. I was wondering if you 

### 4 could speak a little bit to the timing and the 

### 5magnitude of the emission reductions and air quality 

### 6 improvements that come from Tier 3 as it relates to 

### 7 your situation in New York. 

### 8 MR. FLINT: Well, again, Tier 3 for New York 

### 9 by itself -- Tier 3 by itself doesn't do all that much 

### 10 for us because we have the California program, and, in 

### 11 fact, New Jersey has the California program as well. 

### 12 But we will certainly see the transport benefits 

### 13 associated with it as we get improvement in air quality 

### 14 upwind from Tier 3. 

### 15The real big bite occurs with the fuel sulfur 

### 16 benefit that allows us to get immediate improvement 

### 17 and, you know, just doing a little pro rata of EPA's 

### 18 numbers, it looks like 10,000 tons of NOx for New York. 

### 19 So, yeah, we can use that. 

### 20 Our issues are we're -- we are non-attainment 

### 21 based on current monitoring data, based on 2012 data. 

### 22 We're still non-attainment. In fact, 2012 made usTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 254 1 worse because it got rid of a cool summer. So when we 

### 2 look at our current non-attainment status and the fact 

### 3 that we've requested a bump up to moderate. We need to 

### 4 get the reductions to get into attainment in the 2018 

### 5 time frame, which would be required. 2015 looks 

### 6 virtually impossible. 

### 7MS. SARGEANT: Thank you. 

### 8 MR. GRUNDLER: Steve, what kind of choices 

### 9 would the State be facing in the absence of this rule 

### 10 going final? In other words, if you didn't get those 

### 11 tons through the cleaner gasoline and the incremental 

### 12 benefit that cleaner gasoline provides for the Tier 3 

### 13 California vehicles that are on sale now? How would 

### 14you -- 

### 15MR. FLINT: Frankly, we're scrambling in that 

### 16 regard. We're looking at really every emission source 

### 17 that's out there. We are -- you know, we've had a lot 

### 18 of conversation with the Agency about transport issues 

### 19 and, you know, interstate transport on a large scale 

### 20 with, you know, the loss of the two cross-state air 

### 21 pollution rule and then its predecessor. 

### 22So we're certainly looking at upwindTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 255 1 reductions as necessary. We would have to have -- I 

### 2 think we've done some modeling someplace. We're 

### 3 looking at 70 or 80 percent reduction in our own NOx 

### 4 and still not being able to get there. We've already 

### 5 got everything done pretty much we can do. 

### 6 MR. GRUNDLER: Mr. Huynh, I see you nodding 

### 7 your head as well. Would this make your job that much 

### 8 more difficult in the absence of this -- these 

### 9 standards? 

### 10 MR. HUYNH: If the EPA not pass, we're not 

### 11 really sure the money that we ask the local in 

### 12 Philadelphia would be tremendous more than .89 cent per 

### 13 gallon people going to pay. You know, we participate 

### 14 into the CSAPR Supreme Court challenge because we're 

### 15 not really sure -- we were banking on CSAPR. Now CSAPR 

### 16 is -- whenever it be, it will be. But without Tier 3, 

### 17 the notion that we are able to meet the 2008 ozone 

### 18 standards, and I understand by the end of this year 

### 19 that standard going to be lower. So we're not really 

### 20 sure whenever we would meet the national air quality 

### 21 standards so people in Philadelphia can enjoy the good 

### 22 air quality.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 256 1MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you very much. 

### 2Thank you again, panel, particularly the 

### 3 citizens who are taking time out of their day to engage 

### 4 in the process. It's very, very meaningful to all of 

### 5 us. 

### 6 We're going to take a short break right now. 

### 7And we have one more panel. If there are any people 

### 8 in the audience who wish to provide some testimony, 

### 9 please see our folks out in the hall and sign up, and 

### 10 we'll reconvene in about five minutes. 

### 11[Whereupon, the meeting was recessed briefly 

### 12 at 4:09 p.m., to reconvene at 4:25 p.m.] 

### 13 MR. GRUNDLER: I'd like to invite the next 

### 14panelists up: Rebecca Jacoby, Eric Cheung -- did I get 

### 15 that right -- Sarah Noonan-Ngwane -- excuse me, Ngwane 

### 16 -- beautiful name -- Rosa Michnya is already at her 

### 17 seat. 

### 18 UDENTIFIED SPEAKER: You're fine. 

### 19 MR. GRUNDLER: You're fine. Welcome. We'll 

### 20 move left to right again, or your right to left, 

### 21 starting with you, Ms. Michnya. Feel free to proceed. 

### 22MS. MICHNYA: So my computer was down, and ITranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 257 1 had to handwrite this, I imagine. And I'm not a 

### 2 doctor, but after trying to recopy it on the train, it 

### 3 sure looks like it. But I'll do my best here, if 

### 4you'll bear with me. 

### 5MR. GRUNDLER: No worries. 

### 6 MS. MICHNYA: Okay. I'm Rosa Michnya 

### 7 testifying as a citizen. Thanks so much for coming yet 

### 8 again to my hometown. As I say every year, we need you 

### 9 to return again soon to talk about Marcella Shale. 

### 10 You're in such a great position today, aren't 

### 11 you, to do so much for so many with this proposed rule. 

### 12And congratulations to each of you for achieving that. 

### 13 I once called the EPA years ago to ask where in the 

### 14 Philadelphia area I could move in order to have cleaner 

### 15 air, and I was told you can't. It's all one big smear. 

### 16 That's an exact quote. 

### 17Since then I know there have been many 

### 18 improvements, but I'm still one of more than 30 percent 

### 19 of Americans, I believe, living where at least one 

### 20 Federal air quality standard is exceeded, in my case, 

### 21more than one. 

### 22But I'd like to talk instead today on behalfTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 258 1 of the kindergarten class I volunteer at once a week 

### 2 here. If I ask them tomorrow if they think we should 

### 3 all have cleaner air through cleaner gas and cleaner 

### 4 cars, I know all 30 of them would instantly raise their 

### 5 hands, and they've got nothing against dirt, that's for 

### 6 sure, or against cars. In fact, they tend to love 

### 7 cars, and trucks, and motorcycles. 

### 8 When we wrote letters to Obama recently, one 

### 9 of them asked the President to bring him a race car 

### 10 next Christmas. And now that they've mastered the 

### 11 alphabet, it's a good time to teach them what the 

### 12 letters "EPA" can stand for. And they'll also be 

### 13 delighted to hear that today we're talking about rules 

### 14 for grownups for a change. They hear a lot about rules 

### 15 obviously for good reason. We want them to grow up and 

### 16 continue to be the good citizens they are today, and 

### 17 this is a rule to encourage grownups to do the same. 

### 18 Nearly 95 percent of the children attending 

### 19 the school live below the poverty line. And what I see 

### 20 each week, say what you will about public schools. 

### 21 I've said it myself. I went to them. But what I see 

### 22 each week are a lot of people working very hard to giveTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 259 1 them a good education so that they can escape that one 

### 2 day. And asthma attacks are very unwelcome 

### 3 interruptions to all that. 

### 4In fact, the child who would've been with me 

### 5 today with his own rainbow colored name card, for him 

### 6 would've been just like show and tell. He would have 

### 7 shown you his asthma equipment and told you how he 

### 8 feels when he needs to use it, has missed the last two 

### 9 days at school because of it, and is at the doctor's 

### 10 office this very afternoon because of it, according to 

### 11 his grandmother. She's the person raising him, and she 

### 12 also wishes she could be here today because she herself 

### 13 has heart disease and quite a long and scary 

### 14 hospitalization last year. 

### 15She's the one Joshua calls mom and the most 

### 16 important person his six-year-old world. And without 

### 17 her, he would very likely be in foster care. He's also 

### 18 the one who asked Obama for a race car, by the way, and 

### 19 when I myself gave him one of those little Hot Wheel 

### 20 cars for his birthday, he said, won't mom be proud to 

### 21 see a hot car. 

### 22The cars I see in the neighborhood around hisTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 260 1 school don't tend to be electric cars or even hybrids, 

### 2 but older, larger cars. So obviously you can't do much 

### 3 about little Jamad's night in a homeless shelter 

### 4 recently, or Nagir's grief over his father who was 

### 5 shot, or how much Tamir is going to miss his little 

### 6 brother, as he recently told me, when his family splits 

### 7 up and has to live with relatives. You know, these 

### 8 kids are in kindergarten, and already they have a lot 

### 9 on their plate. And I certainly don't mean the school 

### 10 lunch. 

### 11But clearly what you can do is help kids like 

### 12 Joshua breathe easier and miss less school, and you can 

### 13 help people like Josh's grandmother live longer, 

### 14 healthier lives so they can be there for these children 

### 15 when they need them the most. So just know that there 

### 16 are a lot of us -- young, old, and in between -- who 

### 17 support you in every way in making the right decision 

### 18 on this rule. 

### 19 Thank you. 

### 20 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you so much for coming. 

### 21Mr. Cheung? 

### 22MR. CHEUNG: Thank you. Hi. My name is EricTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 261 1 Cheung, and I reside in South Philadelphia. I was born 

### 2 almost 40 years ago, a few years after the Clean Air 

### 3 Act of 1970 was passed and the U.S. EPA was formed to 

### 4 oversee its implementation. You know, it's funny 

### 5 because I can actually track changes in my life and my 

### 6 own personal contribution to air pollution with the 

### 7 evolution of vehicle emission regulations under the 

### 8 Modern Clean Air Act. 

### 9 During the 70s and 80s, when I was growing up 

### 10 in the suburbs of Philadelphia, my family's car took me 

### 11 and my family everywhere: errands, shopping, eating 

### 12 out, having fun. We racked up the mileage just like 

### 13 every other suburban, middle income family I knew. I 

### 14 was oblivious to the effects on the environment and air 

### 15 pollution my lifestyle was having. The Clean Air Act, 

### 16 however, took some major steps toward cleaning up car 

### 17 emissions by requiring the use of catalytic converters 

### 18 and setting up inspection and maintenance programs to 

### 19 ensure vehicles complied with emission standards. 

### 20 During the 90s, I had my own car and commuted 

### 21 to college from my family's home. This is a period 

### 22 when I did the most driving of my life: to school, toTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 262 1 work during the summers, and to hang out with friends 

### 2 who were scattered throughout the region. As a result 

### 3 of what I learned from my education, I had become an 

### 4 environmentalist and was much more aware of the impact 

### 5my actions had. 

### 6 Unfortunately, living, working, and 

### 7 recreating in the suburbs left me little choice but to 

### 8 drive. Meanwhile, EPA implemented Tier 1 vehicle 

### 9 standards under the Clean Air Act, which made vehicle 

### 10 engines comply with stricter standards. Tier l laid 

### 11 the ground work for cleaner cars to come through its 

### 12 system of multiple emission categories that auto 

### 13 manufacturers had to design their engines to meet. 

### 14In the 2000s I graduated from law school and 

### 15 was living in the suburbs but working in the city. I 

### 16 commuted using public transportation, and as more and 

### 17more of my life became focused on the city, I became 

### 18 less reliant on my car. I basically only drove on the 

### 19 weekends. It was around this time that Tier 2 

### 20 standards under the Clean Air Act started to kick in, 

### 21 forcing auto manufacturers to have more of the vehicles 

### 22 they made meet increasingly cleaner emissionTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 263 1 requirements. 

### 2And now here we are today in 2013 talking 

### 3 about Tier 3 standards. And at this point I my life, I 

### 4 have a house in the city, I do not own a car, and I 

### 5 rely completely on public transit, biking, walking, and 

### 6 maybe an occasional ride from a friend to work, to 

### 7 shop, to eat out, and to have fun. I almost never 

### 8 drive in a vehicle alone. My personal contribution to 

### 9 air pollution is the lowest it has ever been. And 

### 10 once, I can see the Clean Air Act is looking to improve 

### 11 as well. With the Tier 3 rules EPA is proposing, the 

### 12 result will be the cleanest-burning cars yet. 

### 13 The Clean Air Act has always been there for 

### 14me, acting to protect my health from the impact of 

### 15 vehicle emissions even as I was coming to terms with my 

### 16 own -- with my being a part of the problem. And, 

### 17 thus, I feel a need to return the favor and voice my 

### 18 support for EPA and the Clean Air Act with its proposed 

### 19 Tier 3 rules. Thank you so much for the job you have 

### 20 been doing all my life to ensure the air I breathe is 

### 21 safe. And now I can stand with you and say I have 

### 22 done my part, too, by cleaning up my own personalTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 264 1 vehicle emissions. 

### 2And I leave you with a promise: you keep on 

### 3 doing everything you can do to reduce air pollution, 

### 4 and I will do the same through the choices I make in my 

### 5 life. Please implement Tier 3 rules, and please keep 

### 6 finding new ways to improve vehicle emission standards. 

### 7Thank you. 

### 8 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you. 

### 9 Ms. Ngwane? 

### 10 MS. NOONAN-NGWANE: My name is Sarah Noonan

### 11 Ngwane, and I speak today on behalf of the Center for 

### 12 the Celebration of Creation. The Center is a project 

### 13 of Chester Hill United Church, which has been working 

### 14 on issues of environmental justice since 1989. We are 

### 15 in strong support of this proposed Tier 3 rule and 

### 16 thank the EPA and President Obama for their leadership 

### 17 on this. 

### 18 It's painful to realize that more than half 

### 19 of all Americans still live in areas where the air 

### 20 poses significant health risks, and much of that 

### 21 dangerous air pollution comes from cars and trucks. 

### 22 Many of these don't even have cars.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 265 1Citizens in the government have spent too 

### 2much money treating these diseases that result from 

### 3 tailpipe pollution. All of these health problems mean 

### 4missed days of work for adults. This hurts their 

### 5 wallets and the larger economy. The children and youth 

### 6 sickened by this tailpipe pollution miss school, and 

### 7 that hurts our future. None of this is fair. 

### 8 That's why there is such a great need for 

### 9 this new regulation. The proposed rule would prevent 

### 10 up to 2,4000 premature deaths, 3,200 hospital 

### 11 admissions, and 22,000 asthma attacks each year. 

### 12 Nevertheless, our country could be doing so much more 

### 13 to move our economy away from these filthy fuels 

### 14 that'll make us ill and are heating up the planet in 

### 15 dangerous ways. 

### 16 This is a very personal issue for me. My 

### 17 sister and I are both -- suffer from asthma, and five 

### 18 years ago she was hospitalized because of a severe 

### 19 asthma attack, and it was extremely scary for all of 

### 20 us. Along with 12 other people from our church, I went 

### 21 to Washington, D.C. on February 17th to protest the 

### 22 proposed Keystone XL pipeline, and to call on ourTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 266 1 government to stop this lunacy of supporting fossil 

### 2 fuels. 

### 3 Although the Center for Celebration of 

### 4 Creation supports this proposed Tier 3 rule, we view 

### 5 this as a small first step to the real solution: 

### 6 moving towards a clean energy economy built on 

### 7 renewable fuels and energy efficiency. The answer to 

### 8 this is no more fossil fuels. 

### 9 I'm 16 years old, and I want there to be a 

### 10 stable climate and clean air when I'm 26 years old, 36 

### 11 years old, 96 years old. But there won't be if we 

### 12 don't change course soon. 

### 13 I thank the EPA for coming to Philadelphia 

### 14 today to hear our testimonies. Thank you for doing 

### 15 what you've done so far, but please know that we have 

### 16 so much further to go. 

### 17Thank you. 

### 18 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you for coming. 

### 19 Ms. Jacoby? 

### 20 MS. JACOBY: Hi. My name is Rebecca Jacoby. 

### 21I have lived in a Philadelphia inner city neighborhood 

### 22 since 2005. Since that time, my neighborhood and thoseTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 267 1 adjacent to my neighborhood have undergone rapid 

### 2 development. In my neighborhood, which is called South 

### 3 Kensington, which is just north of Northern Liberties, 

### 4 I've witnessed an unprecedented amount of development, 

### 5 stores and businesses, but primarily new homes, are 

### 6 being built constantly on every block. In Northern 

### 7 Liberties, every square inch of free space is being 

### 8 built upon. 

### 9 The building has now crept north to South 

### 10 Kensington where I live. Two blocks from me, one open 

### 11 green space was just turned into a parking lot. Other 

### 12 green spaces are targeted for more living space. With 

### 13 this development come more people and, therefore, more 

### 14 cars. The air is already noticeably less clear in only 

### 15 six years since I've been there. 

### 16 With building machinery on literally every 

### 17 single block, first clearing trees and land, and then 

### 18 sitting for weeks and months with engines running in 

### 19 front of people's homes, the exhaust from tailpipes can 

### 20 be suffocating. Although the building crews and their 

### 21 equipment will leave eventually, the damage lingers. 

### 22 Soon the newly-built 30 or 50 or 100 new condo unitsTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 268 1 will bring families, adding their cars to the streets 

### 2 of Philadelphia. 

### 3 Cleaner standards for the trucks sitting at 

### 4 this very moment on the streets of my neighborhood and 

### 5 those adjacent to mine will bring needed relief from 

### 6 toxic emissions these trucks produce. They are more 

### 7 likely to be kept running all day, and what they are 

### 8 spewing lasts for a long time. 

### 9 The thousands of cars that will be added to 

### 10 the streets of my neighborhood will also be admitting 

### 11 toxins that reach kids playing in the streets, the 

### 12 elderly, and people trying to work outside in community 

### 13 gardens, exercising, or sitting on their stoops, a 

### 14 Philadelphia tradition in the warm months. 

### 15People in the inner city can often not afford 

### 16 central air, central cooling systems, myself included. 

### 17They open their windows in the spring and summer. 

### 18 Open windows let in all the toxins from cars and 

### 19 building machinery that people in better neighborhoods 

### 20 who have central air and can close their windows can 

### 21 avoid. 

### 22Also of concern in my neighborhood and onesTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 269 1 like it, in every inner city are the ice cream trucks 

### 2 that slowly cruise the streets an hour at a time. 

### 3 Right now, the weather has been quite cool, yet the ice 

### 4 cream trucks are already out. While the ice cream 

### 5 truck is one of summer's pleasures, the amount of 

### 6 exhaust one can spew as it sits running for half an 

### 7 hour in front of my home and the homes of others is 

### 8 stultifying. If an ice cream trucks parks in front of 

### 9 my house during a 95-degree day when I have my windows 

### 10 open, I have to close them also that my home will not 

### 11 fill with toxic exhaust from one of these trucks. I 

### 12 would rather close all the windows than have my home 

### 13 fill up with exhaust. 

### 14If these trucks and those like them as well 

### 15 as passenger cars can be positively affected by new 

### 16 standards that need to be enacted by the EPA, there is 

### 17 no question that the quality of living and breathing in 

### 18 the inner city will increase. 

### 19 There's no down side to making the air 

### 20 cleaner in the inner cities across the United States, 

### 21 which already suffer from a wealth of other ongoing 

### 22 economic, education, and environmental issues. AndTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 270 1 passing clean tailpipe standards will help. 

### 2Thank you. 

### 3 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you so much. 

### 4Mr. Polites, is it? 

### 5MR. POLITES: Polites. 

### 6 MR. GRUNDLER: Polites. 

### 7MR. POLITES: I'm Frank Polites, and I want 

### 8 to thank the EPA for giving me the opportunity of 

### 9 speaking out, testifying. 

### 10 I'm a 66-year-old veteran. On my discharge 

### 11 in '69, I went to community college and began my 

### 12 education. I can recall the first Earth Day, and we 

### 13 did something that was very appropriate. We buried a 

### 14 car. I thought maybe that would catch on, but 

### 15 apparently -- 

### 16 [Laughter.] 

### 17 MR. POLITES: On the walk from my train 

### 18 station, I noticed there's more vehicles out here than 

### 19 ever. And as an asthma individual, a person afflicted 

### 20 with asthma, I'm very concerned about my health and 

### 21 about the health of the millions of other people, 

### 22 elderly people, who have developed this terribleTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 271 1 disease. 

### 2And this new Tier 3 is very exciting. If we 

### 3 can cut down over 3,000 hospital admissions and save 

### 4 2,000 lives, and in my case there's an estimate -- 

### 5 people who do these statistics say that we can stop 

### 6 maybe 22,000 asthma attacks. I'm excited about that. 

### 7So I hope that you do consider these new 

### 8 standards. They're more reasonable. They're more 

### 9 than, you know, efficient, and effective, and 

### 10 affordable. As an elderly person, I'm not wealthy, but 

### 11 I can kick in, you know, a penny in the, you know, a 

### 12 hundred dollars per vehicle, whatever. I can make a 

### 13 contribution to support this effort. 

### 14So good luck, and I hope you're successful in 

### 15 passing these new standards. Thank you very much. 

### 16 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you for coming. 

### 17Now we're going to hear from Mr. Winters. 

### 18 Welcome. 

### 19 MR. WINTERS: Thank you. Well, I'd like to 

### 20 preface my remarks first since we're talking about our 

### 21 age and everything. I'm a 70-year-old grandfather with 

### 22 seven grandkids, and three of them are the firstTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 272 1 children or the first people in my family to ever have 

### 2 asthma. So the situation is getting worse, not better, 

### 3 in spite of the fact that I've been testifying before 

### 4 Congress and EPA since 70s passage of the Clean Air 

### 5Act. And we've gotten rid of the obvious pollution you 

### 6 can taste and see, but it's the stuff you can't see and 

### 7 the particulates that are smaller now than we ever 

### 8 conceived of back in 1970 that are really causing a 

### 9 great deal of damage. 

### 10 So it's a really relevant issue to me 

### 11 personally. I'm in fine health and do not have 

### 12 respiratory problems, but a lot of people my age do. 

### 13 And I kind of speak feel like I got to speak on their 

### 14 behalf, too. 

### 15My name is Dennis Winters. I am the 

### 16 Conservation Chair of the Sierra Club's Southeastern 

### 17 Pennsylvania Group. While the national Sierra Club has 

### 18 made its position well known regarding the proposed 

### 19 Tier 3 tailpipe standards, our 9,300 members here in 

### 20 the Philadelphia metropolitan area wish to express our 

### 21 support for these critical public health standards as 

### 22 well.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 273 1The air quality of the Philadelphia area 

### 2 remains among the country's worst. Pollution, largely 

### 3 due to the operation of motor vehicles in the region, 

### 4 continues to have serious health impacts on our 

### 5 seniors, children, and those suffering from already 

### 6 compromised respiratory systems. 

### 7The recent study by Navigant Economics lists 

### 8 annual health benefits of $5 to $6 billion, rising to 

### 9 $10 to $11 billion by 2030. In addition, Navigant 

### 10 predicts the creation of over 5,000 high-paying paying 

### 11 permanent jobs in refineries, as well as 24,000 new 

### 12 jobs over three years installing new refinery 

### 13 equipment. Yet all these real benefits are the result 

### 14 of spending an additional penny per gallon at the 

### 15 refinery. In recent times, rumors of bad weather have 

### 16 had more influence on the cost of fuel. 

### 17 In terms of air quality, Tier 3 tailpipe 

### 18 standards are predicted to reduce car and truck 

### 19 emissions of NOx, carbon monoxide, and VOCs by 29, 38, 

### 20 and 26 percent, respectively, over the next 17 years. 

### 21 By extending the life of catalytic converters, the 

### 22 standards can cut NOx from existing vehicles by moreTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 274 1 than 260,000 tons, the equivalent of taking over 30 

### 2million cars off the road. So we're not burying them, 

### 3 but maybe we can get them off the road. 

### 4According to the Delaware Valley Regional 

### 5 Planning Agency, the area MPO, conformity with the 

### 6 State implementation plan is only being achieved 

### 7 through the continuing improvements in vehicle-related 

### 8 pollution controls. Now we can assist the 

### 9 manufacturers of the nation's vehicles and advance 

### 10 clean air efforts by adopting these standards and clean 

### 11 up fuel at the refinery. 

### 12Thank you for this opportunity to receive our 

### 13 support for the proposed standards, and hopefully we 

### 14 can look forward to a future with cleaner air. 

### 15MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you very much, Mr. 

### 16 Winters, and all of you for taking the time to share 

### 17 your stories. This has been very interesting. 

### 18 I'd note to Ms. Jacoby that you're the second 

### 19 person that has mentioned these ice cream trucks in the 

### 20 city. 

### 21MS. JACOBY: Yeah, I heard that, too. It's 

### 22 funny.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 275 1MR. GRUNDLER: I would hope that in America 

### 2 we don't have to choose between ice cream and clean 

### 3 air. 

### 4[Laughter.] 

### 5MS. JACOBY: I know. I feel badly, you know, 

### 6 putting down ice cream trucks, you know. It was one of 

### 7my favorite things to chase after the ice cream trucks, 

### 8 too, but they're -- I hope that they can be affected by 

### 9 these new standards because they really are a scourge 

### 10 on the inner city. 

### 11MR. GRUNDLER: I was also struck by the story 

### 12 about the kindergarten -- kindergarten or third grade? 

### 13 Kindergarten class, and Mr. Cheung's tracing the Clean 

### 14Air Act history with his own life. And thanks to Sarah 

### 15 for having the courage to come and speak publicly and 

### 16 so eloquently. Thank you. 

### 17Let me ask the panel if we have any 

### 18 questions, further questions. 

### 19 [No response.] 

### 20 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you again. 

### 21UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKERs: Thank you. 

### 22MR. GRUNDLER: For the audience, we're goingTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 276 1 to take a break. 

### 2[Applause.] 

### 3 MR. GRUNDLER: We do have other people 

### 4 scheduled to present testimony later today, and so 

### 5 we're going to take a break and wait for them to 

### 6 arrive. 

### 7[Whereupon, the meeting was recessed briefly 

### 8 at 4:45 p.m., to reconvene at 5:15 p.m.] 

### 9 MR. GRUNDLER: We are ready to proceed. 

### 10 Ms. Knowlton, why don't you begin? 

### 11MS. KNOWLTON: I'd be glad to. Thank you all 

### 12 for coming and sitting through all of this for us. 

### 13 MR. GRUNDLER: Not at all. It's our 

### 14pleasure. 

### 15MS. KNOWLTON: It's a really wonderful 

### 16 opportunity. 

### 17So my name is Hollister Knowlton. I'm a 

### 18 member the Religious Society of Friends, Quakers, and I 

### 19 also serve as Clerk of the Seven Quaker Congregations 

### 20 in Philadelphia, and as a member of its Eco-Justice 

### 21 Working Group. I'm also a representative to the 

### 22 National Council of Churches Eco-Justice Working Group.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 277 1I am grateful to President Obama and the EPA 

### 2 for the considerable work it's already done toward 

### 3 advancing our country's environmental quality, 

### 4 especially in the face of a relatively hostile 

### 5 Congress. "Relatively" is probably softer than is 

### 6 true. Specifically, I'm here to register my strong 

### 7 support for this proposed ruling and urge that it be 

### 8 neither weakened nor delayed. 

### 9 I am pleased to hear that the auto industry 

### 10 supports this ruling, and disappointed, but not 

### 11 surprised that the oil industry does not. 

### 12In a Nation that uses a staggering volume of 

### 13 fossil fuels, a level that cannot and should not be 

### 14 sustained if we hope to have a viable biosphere for 

### 15 future generations, it is critical that the combustion 

### 16 of those fuels be at least as "clean," quote, unquote, 

### 17 as possible. Unfortunately, even cleanly burned 

### 18 gasoline results in the emission of carbon dioxide. 

### 19 Quakers take seriously the stewardship of 

### 20 this precious planet. Further, our faith calls us to 

### 21 share earth's resources equitably and to live simply so 

### 22 that others may simply live.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 278 1Climate change is already underway, and our 

### 2 Nation's addiction to fossil fuels must end in order to 

### 3 avoid its most catastrophic impacts. We cannot 

### 4 continue with business as usual, and clean, renewable 

### 5 energy sources must be the answer for our future, even 

### 6 though I know that's not the subject of today's 

### 7 hearing. 

### 8 Thank you for this opportunity to speak. 

### 9 MR. GRUNDLER: And thank you for coming. 

### 10 Ms. Sarfaty? 

### 11DR. SARFATY: Thank you. I also would like 

### 12 to thank the panelists for putting in a long day and 

### 13 for coming all the way to Philadelphia to hear our 

### 14 views on this very important area of regulation. 

### 15My name is Mona Sarfaty. I'm a primary care 

### 16 physician and Associate Professor of Family and 

### 17 Community Medicine at Thomas Jefferson University. I'm 

### 18 also immediate past president of the Medical Care 

### 19 Section of the American Public Health Association, and 

### 20 a cleric of the Prevention and Public Health Section of 

### 21 the College of Physicians of Philadelphia, which is 

### 22 actually the oldest medical society in the UnitedTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 279 1 States. 

### 2I'm speaking today as an individual health 

### 3 professional and public health professional, not on 

### 4 behalf of my academic institution. And I teach both 

### 5medicine and public health students and serve as a part 

### 6 of the quality team in my Department of Family 

### 7 Medicine, where we diligently work to improve health 

### 8 care so that the residents of the city who come to us 

### 9 for their care achieve the best possible outcomes. 

### 10 The logic of this presentation is going to 

### 11 come both from public health and individual health. 

### 12The public's health is adversely affected in 

### 13 many places in Pennsylvania today because of poor air 

### 14 quality. Based on data monitoring carried out by the 

### 15 EPA and made available by the American Lung 

### 16 Association, the population at risk because of poor air 

### 17 quality in our State is substantial. 

### 18 The citizens of many Pennsylvania counties 

### 19 are affected. In Philadelphia today, vehicle emissions 

### 20 are the largest single contributor to poor air quality. 

### 21Air pollutants that are commonly associated with 

### 22 vehicle emissions include the volatile organicTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 280 1 compounds, nitrogen oxides, particulate matter, sulfur 

### 2 dioxide. And under the influence of heat and light, 

### 3 some of these compounds are converted to ozone. 

### 4While some emissions, like hydrocarbons, can 

### 5 be detected by smell, and some, like those that form 

### 6 smog, can be detected by sight, all of these emissions 

### 7 have negative implications for human health. Some, 

### 8 like particulate matter or ozone, are invisible until 

### 9 they reach a certain level, and may be even more 

### 10 damaging for that reason. Those of us who work 

### 11 downtown do think about this and are concerned for our 

### 12 own health as well as that of the citizens who live 

### 13 here all the time. 

### 14The EPA's proposed Tier 3 rules have the 

### 15 potential to protect the air we breathe from all the 

### 16 harmful components of vehicle emissions because the 

### 17 rules will improve the function of the automobile 

### 18 catalytic pollution control systems. If these rules 

### 19 had been in effect years ago, many city dwellers would 

### 20 be benefitting right now from better health, and 

### 21 perhaps health expenditures would be less. 

### 22 Philadelphia is a non-attainment area forTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 281 1 ozone and has poor grades for particulate matter. 

### 2 While everyone is potentially affected, the people that 

### 3 are most at risk from these pollutants are those who 

### 4 have underlying medical conditions. It turns out that 

### 5 in Pennsylvania and Philadelphia especially that's not 

### 6 a small number. 

### 7At many schools in Philadelphia, 20 percent 

### 8 of the children have asthma. This is two to three 

### 9 times the national average, and originates in poor air 

### 10 quality. 

### 11In our family practice at Jefferson, we have 

### 12 978 individuals who have asthma. The human misery 

### 13 that's caused by this condition and the societal costs 

### 14 that accrues to treat it are real and unnecessary to a 

### 15 significant degree. It undermines the effort of all 

### 16 the medical institutions in the city, of which there 

### 17 are many, when the local air quality report card shows 

### 18 poor grades. 

### 19 A colleague of mine participated in an asthma 

### 20 project in Philadelphia called Allies Against Asthma. 

### 21 The project was a collaboration involving Jefferson's 

### 22 physicians, local hospitals, and grade schools.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 282 1 Several other cities were conducting similar 

### 2 activities. 

### 3 The project arranged to have school nurses 

### 4 coordinate with hospital emergency rooms to identify 

### 5 and work with families of asthmatic children to help 

### 6 them use every technique available to protect the 

### 7 children from asthma. The load of asthmatic children 

### 8 in the Philadelphia schools, which was averaged at 80 

### 9 to a school, was the highest of all the cities that 

### 10 participated in this national project. 

### 11While there are a number of factors that 

### 12 cause this high rate, the reality is that the quality 

### 13 of the air in many counties in our State doesn't meet 

### 14 the safer standards of EPA. 

### 15Not only -- those who are vulnerable to 

### 16 asthma suffer because of air pollution, also chronic 

### 17 bronchitis, emphysema, and cardiovascular disease, are 

### 18 conditions that are made worse by poor air quality. 

### 19 The medical literature is full of publications from 

### 20 this country and from foreign countries demonstrating 

### 21 the cleaner air leads to improvement in health status 

### 22 for people with lung conditions and chronic diseases.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 283 1Part of my work at Jefferson involves quality 

### 2 improvement in health care, and many medical 

### 3 institutions are under increasing pressure to show 

### 4 improved outcomes because of the significant percentage 

### 5 of the national budget we spend on medical care. But 

### 6 better outcomes not only require improved health care 

### 7 systems, they require cleaner air and a more healthful 

### 8 environment. We must take this opportunity to make 

### 9 progress, and we still have a long road to travel. 

### 10 Given the shortage of time, I will submit the 

### 11 rest of my comments for the record. But these Tier -- 

### 12MR. GRUNDLER: Please continue. 

### 13 DR. SARFATY: Thank you. These Tier 3 rules 

### 14 are not radical departures from existing standards. In 

### 15 fact, this rule will bring our country into line with 

### 16 gasoline sulfur levels that are already being achieved 

### 17 in Western Europe, South Korea, and Japan, as well as 

### 18 the State of California. 

### 19 The EPA should be applauded for pushing the 

### 20 United States in the direction of the countries and 

### 21 States that are taking the lead in improving the 

### 22 public's health by clearing up the air we breathe, byTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 284 1 regulating the emissions that originate in vehicles. 

### 2If energy efficiency and public health guide 

### 3 our decisions, we'll be on sounder footing as we go 

### 4 forward. Knowledge and the technology have advanced to 

### 5 the point where these improvements are possible. The 

### 6 time to make these advances is right now. 

### 7Thank you for listening. 

### 8 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you so much for coming, 

### 9 both of you. 

### 10 Any questions? 

### 11MS. KNOWLTON: Thank you. 

### 12DR. SARFATY: I'd also actually like to just 

### 13 take the opportunity to extend my thanks to Penn Future 

### 14 and to Penn Environment and the other environmental 

### 15 organizations in Pennsylvania, which really do an 

### 16 excellent job of keeping us updated on what is going on 

### 17 at the national level and the local level, and are able 

### 18 to bring groups out like you're seeing today. 

### 19 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you. 

### 20 [Whereupon, the meeting was recessed briefly 

### 21 at 5:24 p.m., to reconvene at 5:31 p.m.] 

### 22MR. GRUNDLER: Welcome to our Tier 3 publicTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 285 1 hearing. 

### 2DR. PANTICH: Thank you. Thank you for the 

### 3 opportunity to speak today. 

### 4MR. GRUNDLER: Please proceed. 

### 5DR. PANTICH: My name is Dr. Howard Pantich, 

### 6 and I'm a pediatric pulmonologist at the Children's 

### 7 Hospital of Philadelphia. I'm speaking today on behalf 

### 8 of the American Thoracic Society, which is a medical 

### 9 professional organization of over 15,000 physicians, 

### 10 researchers, and allied health professionals dedicated 

### 11 to the prevention, detection, treatment, and cure of 

### 12 respiratory and sleep disorders and diseases requiring 

### 13 intensive care through research, education, and 

### 14 advocacy. 

### 15I treat sick kids, kids who have severe and 

### 16 complex health conditions that impact their lungs. 

### 17 Through medications, interventional procedures, 

### 18 education, and disease management, my colleagues at 

### 19 Children's Hospital and I can usually make a difference 

### 20 in these children's lives. But there is one thing no 

### 21medical intervention can protect children from, and 

### 22 that is air pollution.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 286 1There is abundant research demonstrating that 

### 2 air pollution is bad for your health, especially if 

### 3 you're a child. Numerous chamber studies have 

### 4 convincingly shown that exposure to air pollution 

### 5 reduces pulmonary function and promotes airway 

### 6 inflammation. Epidemiological studies have linked air 

### 7 pollution to a whole host of adverse health 

### 8 consequences, including cardiac deaths, respiratory 

### 9 deaths, heart attacks, vascular remodeling, 

### 10 exacerbations of asthma, and chronic obstructive lung 

### 11 disease, and low birth weight. 

### 12What is most impressive about the scientific 

### 13 literature regarding air pollution is that it is 

### 14 comprehensive with literally hundreds of studies 

### 15 documenting that air pollution in its various forms is 

### 16 harmful to human health. 

### 17The findings have been consistent. Over 

### 18 decades, researchers have been able to apply improved 

### 19 technologies to document the health effects of air 

### 20 pollution at consistently smaller doses. Vehicle 

### 21 tailpipe emissions are a significant source of air 

### 22 pollution. Tailpipe emissions contribute to overallTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 287 1 air pollution, and also create hot spots along highways 

### 2 and other high traffic areas. 

### 3 In many cases, vehicle-generated air 

### 4pollution hits low income neighborhoods particularly 

### 5 hard. Vehicle tailpipe emissions include known air 

### 6 pollutants like particulate matter, and the emissions 

### 7 release pollutants that combine in the atmosphere to 

### 8 create ozone. Exposure to ozone and particulate matter 

### 9 is bad for human health and has been linked adverse 

### 10 health consequences, including cardiac deaths, 

### 11 respiratory deaths, heart attacks, vascular remodeling, 

### 12 COPD exacerbations, asthma exacerbations, and low birth 

### 13 weight. 

### 14The American Thoracic Society strongly 

### 15 supports the EPA's proposed rule to reduce vehicle 

### 16 tailpipe emissions. We are particularly supportive of 

### 17 the proposal to reduce the fuel sulfur content from 30 

### 18 parts per million to 10 parts per million. When 

### 19 implemented, this action will have the immediate impact 

### 20 of making all existing engines burn cleaner. It'll 

### 21 have an immediate positive impact on air pollution 

### 22 Reducing air pollution will improve children's lives,Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 288 1 and we can measure that impact in reduced asthma 

### 2 attacks, reduced emergency room visits, and reduced 

### 3 missed school days. Parents will measure the 

### 4 improvement with healthier children. 

### 5The policy will also have the double benefit 

### 6 of allowing auto manufacturers to use improved 

### 7 technology in catalytic converters and other pollution 

### 8 control technology to make future vehicles emit even 

### 9 less pollution. 

### 10 The dangers of pollution are real. The 

### 11 science documenting the adverse health effects of air 

### 12 pollution is conclusive. The technology required to 

### 13 reduce air pollution is readily available and in use 

### 14 today, and the benefits of the proposed rule are 

### 15meaningful and significant. For all these reasons, the 

### 16 American Thoracic Society strongly supports the 

### 17 proposed vehicle tailpipe rule. 

### 18 Thank you for your time, and I would be happy 

### 19 to answer any questions. 

### 20 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you so much for coming 

### 21 down, Doctor. 

### 22DR. PANTICH: My pleasure.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 289 1MR. GRUNDLER: It's very helpful. 

### 2Ms. Jenkins? 

### 3 MS. JENKINS: Yes. 

### 4MR. GRUNDLER: And then if you need to leave, 

### 5 Doctor, could you leave a copy of your written 

### 6 testimony, that way we can include it in the record? 

### 7DR. PANTICH: Certainly. 

### 8 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you. 

### 9 Ms. Jenkins, welcome. 

### 10 MS. JENKINS: Thank you. Pardon my casual 

### 11 attire. I'm headed down to the Phillies game tonight, 

### 12 so I just want to -- 

### 13 MR. GRUNDLER: Who are they playing? 

### 14MS. JENKINS: Who are they playing or how are 

### 15 they playing? They're not playing very well. 

### 16 [Laughter.] 

### 17MR. GRUNDLER: Who are they playing? 

### 18 MS. JENKINS: They're playing Pittsburgh. 

### 19 MR. GRUNDLER: They're playing Pittsburgh. 

### 20 MS. JENKINS: Yeah, they're playing 

### 21 Pittsburgh, so it's an inner State rivalry here. 

### 22I just would like to give no technicalTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 290 1 testimony. I'll let that up to the experts. But I 

### 2 have been a resident in Philadelphia for a very long 

### 3 time. I am involved with several community groups. 

### 4 I'm a board member of ADA, tries to promote good 

### 5 government, and progressive politics, and environmental 

### 6 standards, and everything that you're talking about 

### 7 today. I also am a grandmother, so I'm concerned with 

### 8 my grandchildren's health and be able to breathe, 

### 9 especially in the City of Philadelphia where so many 

### 10 children suffer from asthma and other breathing 

### 11 problems. So we want to make sure that we can do what 

### 12 we can as a society to try to make a sustainable future 

### 13 for them. 

### 14So I would just would like to support all of 

### 15 the standards that are -- that you're supporting to put 

### 16 I place, both as a family member and a resident of a 

### 17major city, and as an activist and political party, and 

### 18 community organization. 

### 19 So I just would offer that testimony, and if 

### 20 you want to talk about anything concerning, you know, 

### 21 whether the clean air needs to be beneficial to the 

### 22 Phillies to play tonight --Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 291 1[Laughter.] 

### 2MS. JENKINS: -- I would definitely answer 

### 3 any questions. Thank you for inviting me. 

### 4MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you. We appreciate you 

### 5 taking your time to come and give us your comments. 

### 6 And good luck this evening. 

### 7MS. JENKINS: Thank you. I hope you're not a 

### 8 Pittsburgh fan. 

### 9 [Laughter.] 

### 10 MR. GRUNDLER: Go Phillies. 

### 11MS. JENKINS: Indeed. Thank you. 

### 12MR. GRUNDLER: We're going to take a -- we 

### 13 have one scheduled for the next 45 minutes, so the EPA 

### 14 team is going to take a break, and we're going to 

### 15 reconvene at 6:30. And so the technical support team 

### 16 can take a break as well. We'll be back. 

### 17MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you. 

### 18 [Whereupon, the meeting was recessed briefly 

### 19 at 5:38, to reconvene at 5:42 p.m.] 

### 20 MR. GRUNDLER: Feel free to proceed, Jay. 

### 21MR. BUTERA: Yes, thank you. So appreciate 

### 22 you letting me add a few more comments. I'm Jay Butera.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 292 1I spoke earlier. 

### 2One thing I did not have time to speak about 

### 3 before was my views on the costs associated with the 

### 4 ruling. And I find it difficult to put a cost on clean 

### 5 air. And so when we talk about the potential increase 

### 6 the cost of gasoline to be one cent by your estimates, 

### 7 five or ten cents perhaps by other estimates. 

### 8 I find it -- I feel that it should be -- I 

### 9 mean, clean air is priceless. Clean water is 

### 10 priceless. And there's so many things that we have to 

### 11 pay for. It should be a no-brainer to pay for clean 

### 12 air. 

### 13 Driving down here, I saw sort of an ironic 

### 14 scene. There's an area in Philadelphia where there's 

### 15 signs. We have fines. If you play your radio too 

### 16 loud, there's signs that says $200 fine for playing a 

### 17 radio loud. I pass other signs that say littering, 

### 18 $500 fine, $1,000 fine. I was in New England over the 

### 19 weekend, and they have anti-littering signs there where 

### 20 the fine is $10,000. And I say to myself a $10,000 

### 21 fine for littering, and this guy driving down the 

### 22 highway spewing toxins visibly out the back of his car,Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 293 1 that's free. 

### 2And so, I feel that whatever cost is added to 

### 3 pollution, whatever the cost incurred to pollute, it's 

### 4 okay, because it should be costly to pollute. We 

### 5 should not be allowing pollution to be free. There 

### 6 should be a deterrent to it, and if that's a cost of a 

### 7 penny a gallon, it's cheap. And frankly, I'm against 

### 8 pollution at any cost. 

### 9 So I wanted to add that to the record. And I 

### 10 think most Americans would be happy to contribute a 

### 11 penny a gallon and $130 per vehicle toward cleaner air. 

### 12And it's a good investment, and we should not shy away 

### 13 from things that could improve health, reduce 

### 14mortality, and cut pollution. We shouldn't shy away 

### 15 from that just because of a small cost. And there's no 

### 16 cost that would be too high for those things. 

### 17Thank you. 

### 18 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you for those comments. 

### 19 I'm curious, have you seen city's -- the city has 

### 20 established a penalty for unnecessary idling? 

### 21MR. BUTERA: Yes, I've seen those signs, and 

### 22 I suppose that is something that is beneficial, youTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 294 1 know. Idling is useless pollution, so I have seen 

### 2 those, and I welcome those. And, you know, I'm not in 

### 3 favor of excessive regulations, but what's excessive 

### 4 about doing things to preserve our air and water? You 

### 5 know, it's just common sense. It's kind of -- it 

### 6 should be the first thing we protect I think at all 

### 7 costs. Yeah. And now we have the technology to do 

### 8 that, so let's go. 

### 9 I thank you for coming to Philadelphia to do 

### 10 this hearing and for allowing me to speak again. 

### 11MR. GRUNDLER: You're very welcome. Thank 

### 12 you for sharing your extra comments. 

### 13 MR. BUTERA: You're welcome. 

### 14MR. GRUNDLER: Safe travels. 

### 15MR. BUTERA: Thank you. 

### 16 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you. 

### 17[Whereupon, the meeting was recessed briefly 

### 18 at 5:47 p.m., to reconvene at 6:31 p.m.] 

### 19 MR. GRUNDLER: The Tier 3 public hearing will 

### 20 reconvene now. I'd like to invite panel number 11 to 

### 21 have a seat and to fill out a name card: Katie 

### 22 O'Malley, Gabriela Graterol, Bridget Killen, and GailTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 295 1 Mershon. Welcome. 

### 2We'll proceed from my left to right. Ms. 

### 3 O'Malley, you may proceed when you're ready. 

### 4MS. O'MALLEY: Hi. My name is Kathleen 

### 5 O'Malley. I am a Pennsylvania licensed attorney with a 

### 6 certificate in environmental law and a Masters in 

### 7 public health degree, with a certificate in risk 

### 8 assessment and communication, as well as global 

### 9 sustainability and health from Johns Hopkins, 

### 10 Bloomberg. 

### 11I work in the Philadelphia area, and I play 

### 12 sports here. I walk, bike, run, and play ultimate 

### 13 Frisbee in Philadelphia. 

### 14I am very concerned about the severe air 

### 15 pollution in Philadelphia and its effects on myself and 

### 16 other residents of Philadelphia who live, work, and 

### 17 exercise here. I understand that the American Lung 

### 18 Association gave Philadelphia an F in air quality. 

### 19 This is merely one of the reasons that I strongly urge 

### 20 you to enact the Tier 3 cleaner gasoline and tailpipe 

### 21 standards to reduce smog forming pollution from 

### 22 gasoline powered cars and trucks .Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 296 1The EPA should pass these air-pollution 

### 2 limiting regulations out of concern for the health of 

### 3 vulnerable members of the population, such as young 

### 4 children, people with asthma, those who are immuno

### 5 suppressed, and the elderly. 

### 6 Every day Americans and Philadelphians are 

### 7 exposed to a melange of carcinogens from air pollutants 

### 8 to unregulated carcinogenic chemicals, like 

### 9 polystyrene, which is a component of most yogurt 

### 10 containers. From a risk assessment perspective, the 

### 11 EPA should follow the recommendation of the Silver 

### 12 Book, also called Science and Decisions: Advancing Risk 

### 13 Assessment, which was created by the Committee on 

### 14 Improving Risk Analysis Approaches used by the EPA 

### 15 National Research Council. And the EPA should consider 

### 16 cumulative risk as it decides whether to enact these 

### 17 Tier 3 Standards. 

### 18 The Agency should enact these Tier 3 

### 19 standards to limit air pollution from cars and trucks, 

### 20 thereby reducing the amount of cumulative exposure and, 

### 21 thus, cumulative risk to Americans from air pollution. 

### 22It is very important to limit as many known exposuresTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 297 1 to air pollution as possible since we have not 

### 2 currently quantified every risk and mechanism of action 

### 3 from unknown and poorly understood sources of air 

### 4pollution. 

### 5The Agency currently has the opportunity to 

### 6 insert an upstream, technology forcing control that 

### 7 will reduce air pollution, protect publ1c health, 

### 8 improve quality of life and the environment, save money 

### 9 on medical costs, improve public confidence in the 

### 10 Agency's ability to carry out its mission, improve 

### 11 public confidence in the U.S. government as a body that 

### 12 serves the interests of the public before those of 

### 13 industry and special interests. 

### 14The technology forcing component of the Clean 

### 15 Air Act is one of the most powerful tools that exist to 

### 16 protect the environment and public health. It is not 

### 17 only the EPA's prerogative, but also its duty to 

### 18 protect public health and the environment by 

### 19 implementing technology forcing regulat1ons as intended 

### 20 by Congress when they passed the Clean Air Act and the 

### 21 1990 amendments to the Clean Air Act. 

### 22There is no reasonable argument that can beTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 298 1made to vitiate the Agency's clear duty to act to 

### 2 protect public health and the environment by enacting 

### 3 these Tier 3 standards. Thank you. 

### 4MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you very much for those 

### 5 comments. 

### 6 Ms. Graterol? I hope I didn't get that too 

### 7 off. 

### 8 MS. GRATEROL: That's pretty good. 

### 9 MR. GRUNDLER: Oh, you're too kind. 

### 10 [Laughter.] 

### 11MS. GRATEROL: My name is Gabriela Graterol, 

### 12 and I am a master of public health student at the 

### 13 University of the Sciences in Philadelphia. I am here 

### 14 to stand in support of the EPA's proposit1on on Tier 3 

### 15 vehicle emissions. As a student of public health with 

### 16 a concentration in health policy, I urge the public and 

### 17 the government to accept this proposal as what it is, 

### 18 an opportunity to do something right, an opportunity to 

### 19 Improve our children's and adults' health and health 

### 20 care cost and the environment, create jobs in research 

### 21 and development, engineering, manufacture, to develop 

### 22 lower cost technologies that are required for thisTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 299 1 improvement in fuel, reduce greenhouse gas emissions, 

### 2 and create better quality oil derived products in the 

### 3 market. 

### 4Over 158 million Americans are currently 

### 5 exposed to unhealthy levels of air pollution which are 

### 6 linked to adverse health effects, such as hospital 

### 7 admissions, emergency room visits, and premature 

### 8 mortality. Motor vehicles are a particularly important 

### 9 source of this air pollution, especially in urban 

### 10 areas, such as Philadelphia. 

### 11Asthma is a major public health issue in the 

### 12 world, and pollution certainly exacerbates it. In the 

### 13 U.S., about one in 12 people, which is about 25 million 

### 14Americans, have asthma, and the numbers are increasing 

### 15 every year. Asthma costs the United States about $56 

### 16 billion in medical costs, lost school and work days, 

### 17 and early deaths in 2007. Pennsylvania is one of the 

### 18 States that have the most proportion of adults 

### 19 diagnosed with asthma compared to any other State in 

### 20 the United States with over more than nine percent of 

### 21 the total population of adults affected. 

### 22Emission reductions from the Tier 3 programTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 300 1 would lead to immediate air quality improvements that 

### 2 would help prevent the exacerbation of asthma attacks, 

### 3 which in 2008 was one in every 12 patients. These 

### 4 improvements are critically important for States to 

### 5 attain and maintain the existing health-based National 

### 6 Ambient Air Quality Standards. In the absence of these 

### 7 additional controls, such as Tier 3 programs, many 

### 8 areas would continue to have air pollution levels that 

### 9 exceed the standard that the NAAQS is trying to set for 

### 10 the future, and continue to magnify the health issues 

### 11 involving respiratory conditions. 

### 12I believe as a citizen that it is important 

### 13 that the EPA and the government to hold gasoline 

### 14 refineries and oil companies accountable for national 

### 15 compliance on air quality. As my everyday job, I am a 

### 16 regulatory officer for a medical device company, and 

### 17 every day I make sure that the user gets a health 

### 18 product that has gone through extensive quality 

### 19 management systems against international and national 

### 20 standards in order to guarantee the user an optimal 

### 21 quality product and safe. 

### 22I believe we deserve the same from the oilTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 301 1 industry and auto manufacture industry, which is 

### 2 incidentally in support of this proposal as well. But 

### 3 for the oil industry, especially gas refineries who 

### 4 strongly oppose the idea of the proposal and investing 

### 5 a small portion of their very big, large profits to 

### 6 create a product of high quality, and so denying the 

### 7 user of an opportunity to have better and more 

### 8 qualified products for our children, their future, and 

### 9 the planet. 

### 10 Thank you. 

### 11MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you very much. 

### 12 Next, Ms. Killen? 

### 13 MS. KILLEN: You said my name right, so good 

### 14 job. 

### 15[Laughter.] 

### 16 MS. KILLEN: My name is Bridget Killen, and 

### 17 I'm from the suburbs of Philadelphia, and I just 

### 18 graduated in May. But my major was in communications, 

### 19 and I've always had a great passion for the 

### 20 environment. And I currently work at a preschool, so 

### 21 working there, it makes me realize how much having 

### 22 clean air is important to everyone, especially theTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 302 1 young kids because when I was a kid, clean air was more 

### 2 precedent, more around because no one had asthma, and 

### 3 the kids that had asthma would stick out. But now it 

### 4 seems like every child seems to have asthma on the 

### 5 playground, and it really limits their ability to have 

### 6 fun, which is sad. 

### 7But we have a moral obligation to leave the 

### 8 earth in better shape than how we found it, and that's 

### 9 what civilizations do. Of all the things we need to 

### 10 survive, air is the most important. Without food, a 

### 11 person can live for more than a week. Without water, 

### 12 they can live for several days. But if the person is 

### 13 deprived of air, they will die within minutes. 

### 14Dirty air harms the plants that we need. 

### 15 Polluted air also negatively impacts the quality of 

### 16 water. Dirty air also causes global warming. Poor air 

### 17 can limit the amount of outdoor activities we need and 

### 18 enjoy. Clean air is good for the economy, and who 

### 19 wants to live in an area that is polluted air? 

### 20 Thank you. 

### 21MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you. 

### 22Ms. Mershon?Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 303 1MS. MERSHON: Yes, hi. Gail Mershon. 

### 2I'd like to talk about two things if I may. 

### 3 The first if myself, and the reason I want to talk 

### 4 about myself is because I have asthma, and I live in -- 

### 5 I work in Philadelphia. I work in several zip codes of 

### 6 Philadelphia. And my work involves being in my car all 

### 7 day every day as I'm an itinerant occupational 

### 8 therapist working with young children. So I go from 

### 9 preschool to day care to homes, et cetera, et cetera. 

### 10 And I'm sitting in my car inhaling this stuff that's 

### 11 coming out of tailpipes all day long every day. 

### 12And I first left Philadelphia in '84, 1984, 

### 13 when I received my diagnosis of asthma and other 

### 14 respiratory conditions, because I was -- I did some 

### 15 research and I discovered that Philadelphia was quite 

### 16 polluted, and decided I didn’t want to shorten my life 

### 17 by as much as 15 years. So I left, and I've only 

### 18 returned in the last less than four years for other 

### 19 reasons, and partly because my heart is here in 

### 20 Philadelphia. 

### 21So unfortunately, I've noticed that my health 

### 22 has deteriorated rapidly since I've been back. I'veTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 304 1 been hospitalized twice with -- once with pneumonia and 

### 2 once with asthma exacerbation. And I've missed a lot 

### 3 of work to the extent that I'm in considerable debt now 

### 4 because I've had to go without pay. 

### 5So there is a very personal reason for me to 

### 6 be excited about these fuel standards, especially the 

### 7 fact that the sulfur fuel standards, that it would 

### 8 really benefit existing cars as well as new cars. 

### 9 That's very exciting to me because most of the cars I'm 

### 10 behind all day long are old, older model. 

### 11So now to switch to the children I work with, 

### 12 primarily three to five-year-olds. I'd say on my 

### 13 caseload right now, 25 percent of them have asthma, and 

### 14 I don't even need to read in their charts anymore that 

### 15 they have asthma. I can tell by looking at them, by 

### 16 talking to them, and by watching them play. I can tell 

### 17 when they've had an exacerbation and when they've had a 

### 18 treatment the night before because the results of these 

### 19 medications that they're given for their treatments, 

### 20 often times they have to have -- oh, I forget what it 

### 21 is, but it's Albuterol and some other medications that 

### 22make them very hyper and jittery. And they can't payTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 305 1 attention. They can't follow direction. They can't 

### 2 play outside with their friends. 

### 3 And this is so -- this feels so terrible to 

### 4me. They're three, four, five, and going on six years 

### 5 old, and already there's a huge strike against them, 

### 6 many strikes against them because of the air quality 

### 7 that they're breathing. 

### 8 And so I really urge you to pass these 

### 9 standards for the children and for all people who are 

### 10 suffering from asthma. Thank you. 

### 11MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you, all of you, for 

### 12 coming down and taking your time out of your day to 

### 13 share these stories and these comments. It's very 

### 14 important, and we admire your engagement in this 

### 15 process, and we take it very, very seriously. So thank 

### 16 you. 

### 17Are there any questions from the panel? 

### 18 MR. MACHIELE: No. 

### 19 MS. LOWE: I'm a latecomer, but I'm signed 

### 20 up. 

### 21MR. GRUNDLER: All right. Are you Patricia 

### 22 Lowe?Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 306 1MS. LOWE: Yeah. 

### 2MR. GRUNDLER: You're not late. 

### 3 MS. LOWE: This is my little poster, sort of 

### 4 summarizes my testimony. My boyfriend and I always 

### 5 fight over the vent, like I say close that, I don't 

### 6 want the so-called fresh air because whenever it goes 

### 7 down the hill, it stinks like rotten eggs. It's 

### 8 heavier than air, down the hill and into the stink. 

### 9 And I realize -- later on I found out the 

### 10 sulfur dioxide is heavier than air, and my boyfriend 

### 11 said, that's your imagination. Yeah, you smell it, 

### 12 like I don't care. But actually I said, well, it's 

### 13 hurting your health as well as mine. 

### 14MR. GRUNDLER: If you'll excuse me, but 

### 15 before you proceed, could you just introduce yourself? 

### 16 MS. LOWE: Oh, my name is Patricia Lowe. I 

### 17 live in Northeast Philadelphia. And we're not immune 

### 18 from that. I mean, I grew up in Olney when they had 

### 19 the choo choo trains. My said, well, it smells like 

### 20 choo choo trains. I guess a lot of it was vehicle 

### 21 emissions, but there were less cars then, and it was 

### 22 really was coal burning crap, like there was a foundryTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 307 1 near Olney High, you know. You used to smell molten 

### 2metal out of our high school window in math class. 

### 3 Air quality in Philly is better now than it 

### 4 used to be. I can attest to that being a lifelong 

### 5 Philadelphian, like, from the 50s. But be that as it 

### 6 may, I could say also that Northeast Philly smells 

### 7 smells better than Northern Liberties because you've 

### 8 got a little bit more grass and trees. But you still 

### 9 have vehicular traffic. 

### 10 So when you go down the hill on Bustleton 

### 11Avenue, like it's hilly. You're riding down the hill. 

### 12You get on the hill, you could be in the park even, 

### 13 but it's when you're down at the bottom of the hill, 

### 14you'd better have the windows shut because you smell 

### 15 the sulfur dioxide. 

### 16 So I would appreciate additional regulation 

### 17 on that. It would help my asthma. There's other 

### 18 things that help asthma like being vegetarian and anti

### 19 inflammatory diet, et cetera. But it can't all be on 

### 20 us. 

### 21I had a smoking grandfather. He was a pain, 

### 22 you know, because you had it inside and outside. But ITranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 308 1 could say what they could do for the non-smokers who 

### 2 are blameless, they should at least regulate the sulfur 

### 3 and the other noxious gasses in the air, and it's 

### 4 government's role, I feel, to do that. 

### 5Thank you. 

### 6 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you for coming. 

### 7Are you Kevin Little? 

### 8 MR. LITTLE: Yes, I am. 

### 9 MR. GRUNDLER: Please introduce yourself, and 

### 10 proceed when you're ready. 

### 11MR. LITTLE: Yes. My name is Kevin Little, 

### 12 and I am a resident of Philadelphia. I was raised in 

### 13 Philadelphia, educated in the State of Pennsylvania 

### 14 entirely. And I am now a science teacher, and I've 

### 15 lived in Philadelphia over 40 years, and my family 

### 16 lives in Philadelphia in the University City section of 

### 17 West Philadelphia today. 

### 18 I'm here because I am concerned about sulfur 

### 19 emissions from automobiles. I watched a movie called 

### 20 Fuel put out by Josh Tacal, the veggie van guy, and I 

### 21 learned that he grew up in Cancer Alley in Louisiana 

### 22 where his mother had nine miscarriages or maybe it wasTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 309 1 only seven. And they couldn't swim in the rivers, and 

### 2 they later found that everyone was getting sick. 

### 3 And that resonated with me because I grew up, 

### 4 started off in the project past Young Homes, the 

### 5 projects near the oil refinery in South Philadelphia. 

### 6 I once heard it's the largest in the country, I'm not 

### 7 sure. But I don't live there anymore. I moved away. 

### 8 But still there are problems. I've noticed 

### 9 that both my kids have been diagnosed with asthma, my 

### 10 17-year-old and my 12-year-old. And we try and eat 

### 11 right. We try and eat healthy. We try and get 

### 12 exercise. And I have specific memories of my son 

### 13 playing in the schoolyard. My son goes to a grade 

### 14 school. My daughter goes to a grade school, the Penn 

### 15 Alexander School in Philadelphia, except there's a big 

### 16 problem. 

### 17I remember a school boss idling and the 

### 18 diesel fumes and complaining. And then a few years 

### 19 later, my son was diagnosed with asthma. That couldn't 

### 20 be my son, but the diagnosis was the diagnosis. And I 

### 21 know there are laws against school buses and buses and 

### 22 diesel vehicles idling. And when we ride our bikes andTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 310 1 when I ride my bike, we try and avoid the soot coming 

### 2 out of buses and trucks. You can see it. We know that 

### 3 they're not supposed to be idling. It's against the 

### 4 law. But it happens. 

### 5I'm here today because there's another 

### 6 problem: sulfur in cars. There's no law against the 

### 7 cars idling. You can't see the exhaust that comes out. 

### 8 You can't see the sulfur coming out. It's my 

### 9 understanding the sulfur dioxide is a colorless gas. 

### 10 I remember in my chemistry class, writing out 

### 11 the equation, the combustion of octane gasoline, and 

### 12 the products are carbon dioxide and water. And I 

### 13 remember telling my students that when you burn 

### 14 something in a combustion reaction, you get carbon 

### 15 dioxide and water. I remember telling my students that 

### 16 when you see a car stopped at a red light and you see 

### 17 liquid dripping down, it's water, mostly water. You 

### 18 can't see sulfur dioxide. I can't avoid it. 

### 19 I can see the soot coming out of the buses. 

### 20 We can take license plates numbers, and we can call and 

### 21 have people fined for letting their trucks and buses 

### 22 and school buses idle, but there's nothing we can doTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 311 1 about the cars. That's why I'm here. I need you to do 

### 2 something, because both my kids have asthma, and I've 

### 3 done everything: moved out of the projects, try and 

### 4 feed them a healthy diet, make sure they get exercise. 

### 5We avoid buses as much as possible, at least the soot 

### 6 coming out of them. 

### 7But we need your help on this one. There's 

### 8 nothing else I can do. Thank you. 

### 9 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you very much, Mr. 

### 10 Little. 

### 11Cara Meglio, we welcome your testimony now. 

### 12MS. MEGLIO: Is this on? I live here in 

### 13 Philadelphia, and I work in the suburbs in King of 

### 14 Prussia about 25 miles away. I consider myself very 

### 15 lucky to have a job that I really enjoy, even though 

### 16 I'm young and just out of college. And I get to live 

### 17 in a city that I like. But the only down side is that 

### 18 I have a long commute, and I have to take the 

### 19 Schuylkill Express every day, which frequently backs up 

### 20 with traffic. So I am generally on the road for about 

### 21 two hours every single day. 

### 22And it's nice when, you know -- when it's aTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 312 1 pleasant day outside, I get to put my windows down, 

### 2 which makes it a little better. I get to breathe the 

### 3 fresh air, but along with the air I'm breathing in, the 

### 4 exhaust of all the cars that are around me, as far as 

### 5 the eye can see in both directions. And I think about 

### 6 it every day and the potential for it having a negative 

### 7 impact on my health in the years to come. 

### 8 So I just -- I don't think that's it fair 

### 9 that I should have to worry about the risks of 

### 10 developing asthma, the risk of developing respiratory 

### 11 problems just to get to work every day. And the risk 

### 12 isn't really over after I get home from work. Like 

### 13 many people in Philadelphia, I only live a couple of 

### 14 blocks away from Route 95, so really it's just a 

### 15 constant problem that I'm always exposed to. 

### 16 And I think that the proposed clean fuel and 

### 17 tailpipe standards are an excellent way to make a huge 

### 18 difference at a tiny cost. So for the sake of the 

### 19 environment, myself, and millions of Americans like me, 

### 20 I urge the EPA to adopt these reasonable new measures. 

### 21Thank you for taking my comments into 

### 22 consideration.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 313 1MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you, and we will. And 

### 2 thank you all again for taking time to share your 

### 3 comments with us. They're very, very valuable. 

### 4Any further questions from the panel? 

### 5[No response.] 

### 6 MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you so much. 

### 7Anybody else in the audience wish to provide 

### 8 some testimony? 

### 9 We're just conferring here to see if we're 

### 10 expecting anyone else. 

### 11MS. SARGEANT: Let's open back up the Tier 3 

### 12 hearing. And we have two more witnesses here today, so 

### 13 we have Noah Kramer and Miranda Outman. And so if 

### 14you'd like to proceed, either one of you. Who wants to 

### 15 go first? 

### 16 MS. OUTMAN: Sure. Well, hi. I'm Miranda, 

### 17 and Noah asked me to first deliver a message on his 

### 18 behalf. So Noah's message is to please stop pollution 

### 19 because it makes animals sick. And I would also 

### 20 endorse that sentiment. 

### 21I wanted to just say two things quickly. I'm 

### 22 about to be certified as an emergency medicalTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 314 1 technician and just joining a squad. And the illnesses 

### 2 we see have a direct environmental correlation. You 

### 3 don't find the levels of cancers that we have here in 

### 4 countries with stronger emission standards. And we do 

### 5 things, like from Central New Jersey, drive really 

### 6 young kids with metastatic cancer all the way down here 

### 7 to Philadelphia to St. Jude's. 

### 8 And while it's wonderful that we have these 

### 9 facilities, we are putting all this money into cures 

### 10 where we really have the tools of prevention at our 

### 11 fingertips. And I would just ask, you know, in my 

### 12 capacity as a health care provider, ask people to look 

### 13 around at the room because -- you want to try it? Go 

### 14 ahead and try. You want to try? 

### 15MR. KRAMER: Hi. 

### 16 [Laughter.] 

### 17MS. OUTMAN: That was really good. Yeah, 

### 18 okay. I'd just ask people to look around the room 

### 19 because in one -- if you remember that we're in a coal 

### 20 mine and wherever you look just among the people around 

### 21 you and among your own friends and family members, 

### 22 you're going to see a canary.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 315 1And then the other thing that I would say is 

### 2 that, you know, when people look back -- the other 

### 3 thing in addition to doing kind of basic medical things 

### 4 is I love history. And when people look back at 

### 5 history and they read about exciting times in history 

### 6 in, like, you know, the Second World War or something, 

### 7 they always imagine themselves being a hero. And they 

### 8 say, well, if I was there, I would do this wonderful 

### 9 thing. 

### 10 But we are right now in the middle of 

### 11 history, and we have the chance to take profoundly 

### 12 heroic and necessary action, and the next generations 

### 13 will be very disappointed if we don't. And so we have 

### 14 the opportunity right now to be heroes I history by 

### 15 standing up to this -- by standing up and doing 

### 16 something about the rapidly-changing temperatures on 

### 17 our climate. And we're kind of the last best hope to 

### 18 make a difference there. 

### 19 So thank you all very much. 

### 20 MS. SARGEANT: Thank you very much. Thank 

### 21 you, Noah, for coming. 

### 22Okay. So we have two more testifiers, soTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 316 1 we're going to wait just a moment. If you want to come 

### 2 on up and get seated, that's fine. And so we'll just 

### 3 wait a moment. 

### 4All right. So I'd like to welcome our next 

### 5 panel. Fiona Grant and John Poole. Okay. All right. 

### 6 So we'll start with Fiona. 

### 7MS. GRANT: Yeah. I'm Fiona Grant, and I'm a 

### 8 student at Cabrini College. Like the young idealist 

### 9 that I am, I can honestly say that the earth and the 

### 10 air matter a lot to me. I think about them a lot in 

### 11 the abstract. I think about the vast expanses of rain 

### 12 forests that are every day being ripped apart and will 

### 13 never exist again. 

### 14I think about the dripping, melting, 

### 15 breaking, spreading, thinning ice at the North and 

### 16 South Poles. I think about the global temperatures 

### 17 that slowly but surely creep upward, about the heat 

### 18 records that are being broken every day. I think about 

### 19 this on a global scale. I picture it all in my head, 

### 20 and I am completely and totally overwhelmed. 

### 21But beyond the abstract, beyond the 

### 22 overwhelming reality of our effect on planet Earth,Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 317 1 there is another reality, and that is the life of my 

### 2 little brother, Aidan, who suffers from asthma. Aidan 

### 3 is 14 years old. He lives with the rest of my family 

### 4 in Louisville, Kentucky. Our home city is surrounded 

### 5 by coal fire, power plants, plenty of urban sprawl, 

### 6 besides being filled with cars. 

### 7All of the pollutants and particulates from 

### 8 these various sources pool in our Ohio River Valley, 

### 9 further clogging Aidan's delicate lungs. And as our 

### 10 air gets worse and our world continues to heat, Aidan's 

### 11 ability to experience the wonders of our planet is more 

### 12 and more restricted. 

### 13 Aidan is incredibly inquisitive, watchful, 

### 14 and intelligent. He can spend hours sitting in our 

### 15 backyard, binoculars up to his bright eyes, and a 

### 16 birder's guide in his hand, perfectly still, listening 

### 17 and looking for the birds he loves. Whether they're 

### 18 sparrows, cardinals, woodpeckers, or mourning doves, 

### 19 Aidan is keen to see the point of their beak, the flash 

### 20 s of their eye, and the flap of their wings. Over the 

### 21 past couple of years, he has been compiling a complete 

### 22 and total catalogue of all the birds that have passedTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 318 1 through our yard. 

### 2I love my brother. He holds so much promise. 

### 3 I want the best for him. I want a world with air he 

### 4 can breathe. I want a world with flourishing 

### 5 woodlands, immaculate waters, the soaring peaks, and 

### 6 frozen glaciers, a world where spring comes with rain 

### 7 and blooms, summer with sun and green, fall with crisp 

### 8 color, and winter with ice and sharp chill. But I know 

### 9 that this world is dwindling. I fear that by the time 

### 10 my little brother is done with college and an adult in 

### 11 the real world, the little that is left of this world 

### 12 will have dwindled even more. 

### 13 So I'm here specifically on behalf of my 

### 14 inquisitive little brother to ask you to take our air 

### 15 seriously. Even in my city that does not have as much 

### 16 air pollution as Philly, my brother has developed 

### 17 asthma. Increasing tailpipe standards is an easy and 

### 18 simple way to prevent degradation of air across this 

### 19 Nation. This is a fabulously nitty gritty, unglamorous 

### 20 step toward a cleaner future. 

### 21Thank you so much. 

### 22MR. GRUNDLER: Thank you.Transcription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 319 1Mr. Poole? 

### 2MR. POOLE: Hi. My name is John Poole, and I 

### 3 live in the 1st District in Philadelphia. I am here 

### 4 obviously to talk to you about the proposed tailpipe 

### 5 standards and how they benefit individuals in major 

### 6 cities like myself. I originally am from West 

### 7Virginia, which is a place that's much different than 

### 8 Philadelphia, much more rural. 

### 9 And I was surprised when I moved here the 

### 10 different quality of the air. And at first I thought, 

### 11 you know, I was imagining it, and then I actually got 

### 12 to reading it because I work for a Medicaid insurance 

### 13 company. And we actually have nearly double the 

### 14 national rate of childhood asthma in Philadelphia, and 

### 15 that really struck me because I've always worked a lot 

### 16 with children in different ways. 

### 17At least half of these individuals have been 

### 18 to the emergency room at least once in the past year 

### 19 are these children. And that's even, like, twice the 

### 20 amount of just the children outside of the city in the 

### 21 suburbs, like almost right over the city line. It's 

### 22 twice as much in the city. And part of that isTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 320 1 tailpipe pollution, you know, and some of the other air 

### 2 pollution that we have in the city. As far as the 

### 3 incidence of adult asthma in Philly, we're the number 

### 4 one city with a smoking ban as far as asthma is. As 

### 5 far as cities that have problems with asthma. 

### 6 Also 16,000 children make at least -- in the 

### 7 city, 16,000 children make at least yearly emergency 

### 8 department visits for asthma, 4,800 make at least two 

### 9 visits a year, 4,400 make at least three visits, and 

### 10 1,800 make five or more visits. And this is just in 

### 11 the City of Philadelphia, the city limits. 

### 12Also, there's a lot of other benefits to 

### 13 these increased tailpipe standards that have been 

### 14proposed. Obviously, you know, you've probably heard 

### 15 from other people that appeared from the Sierra Club 

### 16 that it could prevent 400 premature deaths yearly it's 

### 17 estimated, prevent 52,000 work days lost by Americans 

### 18 yearly, could create 30,000 jobs through the 

### 19 technological advances that are required by auto makers 

### 20 and refineries to bring this up to the standard. Also 

### 21 reduction of health care costs of $5 to $6 billion by 

### 22 2020 or $10 to $11 billion by 2030. In addition, theTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 321 1 reduction of climate change contributing air pollution 

### 2 is equivalent to taking 33 million cars off the road. 

### 3 So kind of like what Fiona said, I think this 

### 4 is kind of a no-brainer, especially since it's 

### 5 supported by auto makers, United Auto Workers, numerous 

### 6 local State health agencies, environmental groups. And 

### 7many of these people estimate that it will likely on 

### 8 cost one penny per gallon of gasoline. 

### 9 So again, my name is John Poole, and thanks 

### 10 for having the opportunity to hear me. 

### 11MS. SARGEANT: Thank you so much for coming. 

### 12Does anybody have questions? 

### 13 [No response.] 

### 14MS. SARGEANT: No? Thank you so much for 

### 15 coming. Is there anyone else here who wants to 

### 16 testify? 

### 17[No response.] 

### 18 MS. SARGEANT: Okay. I think that's the end 

### 19 then, so we'll adjourn the hearing. Thank you, 

### 20 everyone, who stuck it out to the end. Appreciate it. 

### 21[Applause.] 

### 22[Whereupon, at 7:47 p.m., the meeting wasTranscription April 24, 2013 Philadelphia, PA

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### Page 322 1 concluded.] 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21