TOBACCO 

Loose Leaf and Acreage Allotments

vOVERNMLNi 

Storage KSU LIBRARIES 

HEARING

BEFORE THE

SUBCOMMITTEE ON TOBACCO

OF THE

COMMITTEE ON AGRICULTURE

HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES

EIGHTY-NINTH CONGRESS

SECOND SESSION

4111, OCTOBER 14, 1966

—0 RALEIGH, N.C.

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COMMITTEE ON AGRICULTURE

HAROLD D. COOLEY, North Carolina, Chairman

W. R. POAGE, Texas, Vice

E. C. GATHINGS, Arkansas

JOHN L. McMILLAN, South Carolina

THOMAS G. ABERNETHY, Mississippi

WATKINS M. ABBITT, Virginia

PAUL C. JONES, Missouri

HARLAN HAGEN, California

FRANK A. STUBBLEFIELD, Kentucky

GRAHAM PURCELL, Texas

JAMES H. MORRISON, Louisiana

ALEC G. OLSON, Minnesota

SPARK M. MATSUNAGA, Hawaii

MASTON O'NEAL, Georgia

THOMAS S. FOLEY, Washington

JOSEPH Y. RESNICK, New York

LYNN E. STALBAUM, Wisconsin

ELIGIO DE LA GARZA, Texas

JOSEPH P. VIGORIT 0, Pennsylvania

JOHN C. MAC KIE, Michigan

ROLLAND REDLIN, North Dakota

BERT BANDSTRA, Iowa

STANLEY L. GREIGG, Iowa

CLAIR A. CALLAN, Nebraska

Chairman

PAUL B. DAGITE, Pennsylvania

PAGE BELCHER, Oklahoma

CHARLES M. TEAGUE, California

ALBERT H. QUIE, Minnesota

MRS. CATHERINE MAY, Washington

RALPH HARVEY, Indiana

PAUL FINDLEY, Illinois

ROBERT DOLE, Kansas

LAURENCE J. BURTON, Utah

PRENTISS WALKER, Mississippi

GEORGE V. HANSEN, Idaho

RESIDENT COMMISSIONER

SANTIAGO POLANCO-ABREU, Puerto Rico

Mrs. CHRISTINE S. GALLAGHER, Clerk

HYDE H. MURRAY, Assistant Clerk

JOHN J. HEIMBURGER, General Counsel

FRANCIS M. LEMAY,-Staff Considtant

SUBCOMMITTEE ON TOBACCO

WATKINS M. ABBITT, Virginia, Chairman

JOHN L. McMILLAN, South Carolina

FRANK A. STUBBLEFIELD, Kentucky

JOSEPH P. VIGORITO, Pennsylvania

SANTIAGO POLANCO-ABREU, Puerto Rico

II

ROBERT DOLE, Kansas

PRENT ISS WALKER, Mississippi
CONTENTS

Statement of:

Alexander, Robert L., State-Federal coordinator, office of Hon. Page

Robert E. McNair, Governor, State of South Carolina 8

Allen, T. W., North Carolina State Grange 2

Burt, Elmer, Wake County Farm Bureau 18

Carr, C. Stuart, Jr., vice president, Universal Tobacco Co., Inc 12

Daniel, Elmer R., president, Nash County Farm Bureau 7

Davis, Roy B., Department of Agriculture, State of Virginia 9

Ellis, L. R., Clinton, N.0 21

Graham Hon. James A., Commissioner of Agriculture, State of North

Carolina 5

Gregory, John, president, American Leaf Organization 22

Larrimore, Rufus, Hemingway, S.0 16

McNair, Hon. Robert E., Governor, State of South Carolina, as read

by Robert L. Alexander 8

Parker, LeRoy, Rocky Mount, N.0 12

Sands, Charles D., president, Export Leaf Tobacco Co 14

Simmons, LeRoy, tobacco subcommittee, North Carolina Farm

Bureau Federation_ 3

Thorpe, A. P., III, Rocky Mount, N.0 17

Wiggins, E. G., Marion, S.0 4

Wilkinson, W. B., Jr., field representative, Virginia Farm Bureau

Federation 11

Williamson, Bailey, Raleigh, N.0 20

Correspondence submitted to the subcommittee:

Abbitt, Hon. Watkins M., a Representative in Congress from the

State of Virginia, telegram of October 14, 1966 2

Ferrell, Henry E., Knightdale, N.C., letter of October 14, 1966 25

Fountain, Hon. L. H. a Representative in Congress from the State

of North Carolina, telegram of October 14, 1966 2

Fowler, Marion S., executive secretary, South Carolina Tobacco

Warehouse Association, telegram of October 14, 1966 26

Oliver, W. B., Pine Level, N.C. letter of October 11, 1966 26

Rogers, C. U., Williamston, N.C., telegram of October 13, 1966 26

Steele, G. Fred., Jr., Durham, N.C., telegram of October 14, 1966_ 25

III

TOBACCO

Loose Leaf and Acreage Allotments

FRIDAY, OCTOBER 14, 1966

HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES,

SUBCOMMITTEE ON TOBACCO

OF THE COMMITTEE ON AGRICULTURE,

Raleigh, N.C.

The subcommittee met, pursuant to notice, at 2:15 p.m. in the

auditorium, State highway department building, Hon. Harold D.

Cooley (chairman of the full committee) presiding.

Present: Representatives Cooley (chairman) and McMillan.

Also present: Representative Hagan of Georgia; Christine S.

Gallagher, clerk; and Harker Stanton, counsel.

The CHAIRMAN. Ladies and gentlemen. In opening this meeting:,

I want to make a brief statement. I have received numerous communications concerning the subjects that will be discussed here today,

and I have decided to have a small subcommittee of the Committee

on Agriculture come here for the purpose of providing a forum in

which all interested parties will be given an opportunity to participate

and present their views.

We have with us the official reporter of the Committee on Agriculture, and I have my distinguished cclleague Mr. John McMillan,

from South Carolina, in whose district I think all of the South

Carolina tobacco is grown, here with me. We also have the official

clerk of the committee, Mrs. Christine Gallagher, with us, who is

known to many of you.

As I said, the purposes of this hearing is to provide a forum, an

opportunity to be heard on these subjects. We want everybody to

be heard fully and forthrightly. I will say I have no preconceived

ideas. I am not advocating anything. I am here just to listen and

to learn. I am quite sure that Mr. Abbitt, the chairman of the Subcommittee on Tobacco of our House Committee on Agriculture, is

disappointed that he could not be here for these hearings because the

planes were overflying Washington and, therefore, it was not possible

for him to be here in time for the hearing.

Mr. McMillan from South Carolina has been attending to a little

official business, and I have been trying to attend to a little official

business here, and for that reason I have not had a chance to visit the

markets, as I usually do. I am here to have this meeting so everyone

who wants to be heard may be heard.

I have a list of witnesses which have been made up. If anyone

else wants to be heard and will give the clerk his name, we certainly

will provide an opportunity for you to be heard. If anyone wants to

provide a statement for the record, they may turn in that statement
2 TOBACCO

to the reporter or to Mrs. Gallagher, and it will be made a part of the

record.

I have some statements here that I will include in the record later,

and two telegrams which I will insert in the record at this point.

(The telegrams referred to follow:)

Hon. HAROLD D. COOLEY,

Raleigh, N.C.:

Regret matter of great importance to my home area requires my presence in

Washington today and cannot join you in Raleigh for tobacco hearing. I commend you for arranging this hearing and I commend you and Hon. John L.

McMillan of South Carolina for your presence there, despite all the pressures of

business in Washington, to give our tobacco farmers opportunity through our

committee to let the Congress know how they feel about a development that is of

great importance to the tobacco program. Your constant vigilance and hard

work with the help of those of us who have followed your leadership have made the

tobacco program the best of all farm programs in cooperation with our farmers

and the industry generally and we want to keep it that way. You are a great champion of the tobacco farmer. Johnny McMillan and I have worked side-by-side

with you in every undertaking for the well-being of these farmers and their

families and we shall continue this teamwork to deal with every threat against

the successful operation of the tobacco program. Please relay this assurance to

those assembled for the tobacco hearing today.

WATKINS M. ABBITT,

Member of Congress.

HOD. HAROLD D. COOLEY,

Raleigh, N.C.:

District prevent my sitting in with your committee today. However am extremely interested in subject matter of your hearing because of my concern for all

our tobacco farmers. Consequently will be extremely interested in reading all of

testimony taken and getting benefit of any findings and conclusions reached by the

committee.

WASHINGTON, D.C.

October 14, 1966.

WASHINGTON, D.C., October 14, 1966.

L. H. FOUNTAIN,

Member of Congress.

Mr. COOLEY. Our first witness this morning is Mr. T. W. Allen,

North Carolina State Grange, Creedmoor, N.C.

Will you come forward, Mr. Allen. We will be Pleased to hear

from you.

STATEMENT OF T. W. ALLEN, NORTH CAROLINA STATE GRANGE,

CREEDMOOR, N.C.

Mr. ALLEN. Mr. Chairman and members of the subcommittee, we

appreciate very much having this opportunity to appear before you

and to express the views of the North Carolina State Grange. The

resolutions I will read to you were passed this morning at 10 o'clock

unanimously in the North Carolina State Grange.

It is our understanding that you are talking about two subjects, the

sale of allotments and loose leaf, am I right or wrong?

The CHAIRMAN. That is right.

MT. ALLEN. All right.

The North Carolina State Grange, after considering the pros and

cons on the idea of the sale of tobacco allotments, passed this

resolution:

The North Carolina State Grange opposes the sale of allotments and quotas

and favors the continuation of the present lease and transfer program on an

annual basis for flue-cured tobacco.
TOBACCO

That was passed unanimously in the North Carolina State Grange.

I will read the recommendations adopted by the North Carolina

State Grange today concerning the sale of looseleaf tobacco.

The shortage of farm labor and the narrow price margin which has prevailed

between tied and untied leaf, has created a strong desire among growers to sell

all of their crop untied. The N.C. State Grange recommends that the marketing regulations permit the unrestricted sale of untied tobacco just as soon as the

crop can be handled in this form. We therefore recommend:

1. That the United States Department of Agriculture ascertain whether or not

the domestic and export buyers are equipped to handle the 1967 crop in an

orderly manner if the unrestricted sale of untied tobacco is permitted.

2. If it is found that some limitations on the sale of untied tobacco are necessary for the 1967 crop, then we recommend that each grower in the states of

South Carolina, North Carolina, and Virginia be allocated a pro rata share of the

looseleaf sales that will then be eligible for price supports so that all growers in

these states will have an equal opportunity to share in the sale of untied tobacco.

In other words, we mean just a little bit plainer, that if the requirement permits the crop to be sold loose leaf, we recommend that each

farmer be given 50 percent of the crop that will be eligible for price

supports on the tobacco, so that we do away with this mad rush of

getting to the market trying to sell untied tobacco.

3. That the markets in each belt within these three states be given an equal

number of days for loose leaf sales to accommodate the marketing of untied

tobacco in accordance with the rules adopted to facilitate the sale of untied leaf

during the 1967 season.

Are there any questions, Mr. Chairman, that anyone wishes to

ask? If so, I will be glad to attempt to answer.

The CHAIRMAN. Mr. McMillan?

Mr. McMILLAN. I certainly agree, Mr. Allen, that we must do

something about this problem, and I think that it must be done

immediately.

Mr. ALLEN. Absolutely.

Mr. MCMILLAN. We cannot wait until January 1, if we are to

do anything on this looseleaf program we must to it within the next

month, I think, so that the exporters and everyone else will know

just what to expect.

I know in my State it is one of the most important problems

confronting the farmers today.

And we just cannot afford to truck 50 million pounds into North

Carolina and Georgia each year.

Mr. ALLEN. We are with you. The Department of Agriculture

in Washington, probably, already knows that and if they do not they

can mighty easily find out what the services of a company has to

handle untied tobacco. I understand they handled 400 million

pounds this year. If they can handle more than that we are with it

100 percent. If they cannot, we do think that every farmer ought

to be treated just alike, just as fair as can be in selling untied tobacco.

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you very much.

Mr. ALLEN. Thank you, gentlemen.

The CHAIRMAN. The next witness is Mr. Le Roy Simmons, North

Carolina Farm Bureau Federation, Tobacco Subcommittee.

STATEMENT OF LE ROY SIMMONS, TOBACCO SUBCOMMITTEE,

NORTH CAROLINA FARM BUREAU FEDERATION

Mr. SIMMONS. Mr. Chairman and members of the subcommittee,

ladies and gentlemen, I am Le Roy Simmons, of the North Carolina
4 TOBACCO

Farm Bureau Tobacco Subcommittee. Mr. Chairman, this resolution

that I am about to read is the position that we have had just almost

12 months ago. As all of you are familiar with the way that the Farm

Bureau works, we start within the counties and come up. We realize

that there has been a lot of water that has gone under the bridge in the

last 12 months, and I am not saying for sure but what there may be

some changes in our recommendations in the coming November. So

that the following is what we recommended last November at our

annual meeting.

We recommend that farmers be permitted to sell looseleaf tobacco on

the same basis as in 1965 during 1966. Further, we recommend the

extension of looseleaf sales and that looseleaf support prices be extended

to all regular leaf support grades as rapidly as possible.

I will be glad to answer any questions.

The CHAIRMAN. We thank you very much for your statement.

Now I will call as the next witness Mr. David Sloan, the president

of the South Carolina Farm Bureau Federation.

Give your name to the reporter.

STATEMENT OF E. G. WIGGINS, MARION, S.C.

Mr. WIGGINS. Mr. Chairman and members of the committee, Mr.

Sloan cannot be here, he had another meeting to make.

Mr. Chairman and members of the subcommittee, as you know, the

South Carolina Farm Bureau Federation has advocated as much loose

leaf as possible over the last several years. We have not had our

annual meeting this year. I will be like Mr. Simmons in stating in part

what we recommended last year, but we did have a tobacco meeting

just a few days ago and it was the feelings of the men on the committee

that we want all of the looseleaf tobacco next year that the companies

can handle. We feel like that if you will give us the opportunity to

sell loose or tied and let the companies determine by what they pay

which way we will prepare this tobacco. This year, you know, we

received more money for loose than we did for tied. We think that

this is an indication that the companies are ready to buy this tobacco

loose; and, therefore, we would recommend that you give us all of the

loose leaf you possibly can.

On the other subject of selling tobacco allotments, our tobacco

committee, I think, is split on this subject. Our chairman would

recommend not selling. We have some members on the board who

very strongly favor it. As you know, industry is moving into the

South quite rapidly. We have land that needs to go out of cultivation. And these people own this tobacco and it is very hard now for

them to get a fair price for this acreage of tobacco under the present

setup. If we were given the opportunity to sell this tobacco at a fair

market price, I think, that it would help a lot of these boys.

Also, in the western part of our tobacco section in South Carolina,

we have large farms with only a few acres of tobacco.

Now, with the minimum wages coming in, these boys will have a

very hard time mechanizing with this small amount of tobacco acreage, and if they could sell their allotments it would help them very

much. One man could purchase enough of these allotments so that

he could afford to go buy the machinery as soon as it is available to

gather this tobacco.

Thank you very much.
TOBACCO 5

The CHAIRMAN. Mr. McMillan?

Mr. MCMILLAN. Mr. Wiggins, is it not true that in South Carolina,

the majority of the tobacco farmers sold their poorest grade tobacco

in loose leaf and received a higher price for it? Is that what you

mean?

Mr. WIGGINS. You mean to say for a higher dollar?

MT. MCMILLAN. Yes.

Mr. WIGGINS. At this time in South Carolina, they sell all the way

up and down the stalk loose. We did not just sell the sorry tobacco—

we sold some of all kinds. We got $74 for it. And we turned around

and tied it. However, it was hard to get $74 a lot of the time. Any

time you try to tie tobacco for 2 or 3 cents a pound, you are hitting

your head against the wall, especially, when you go to minimum wages.

Mr. MCMILLAN. During my campaign during the past 3 or 4

weeks, I have been over the district fairly thoroughly, and I have had

people continuously and unanimously interested in this looseleaf

tobacco subject. That is about the only subject that they wanted

to discuss.

A majority of the farmers seem to want to place the tobacco on the

floor tied or untied.

Mr. WIGGINS. Let the comparies say. If they will pay enough for

tied tobacco, they will get tied tobacco, but, as it was this year, they

will get no tied tobacco.

Mr. MCMILLAN. That is certainly the opinion, I think, of 95

percent of the farmers in South Carolina.

Mr. WIGGINS. We do not recommend just turning it aloose. No,

we want to give every farmer the opportunity to do so, if he wants to

tie his tobacco, and the companies want the tobacco tied, but let the

dollars speak.

Mr. MCMILLAN. They want the proper differential paid between

tied and untied tobacco.

Mr. WIGGINS. The differential is what they want.

Mr. MCMILLAN. Thank you.

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you very much.

Mr. WIGGINS. Thank you all very much.

The CHAIRMAN. We have a very busy man with us today, the

Honorable James A. Graham, the best commissioner of agriculture in

the whole United States of America. I would like to have him come

around to be heard.

We welcome you, Mr. Commissioner.

Mr. GRAHAM. Mr. Chairman, we hope that a lot of other people

feel the same way as you do.

I wish to make a statement before this Tobacco Subcommittee of

the House Committee on Agriculture in its hearing in Raleigh on a

very common and important subject in the minds of a lot of our people.

STATEMENT OF HON. JAMES A. GRAHAM, COMMISSIONER OF

AGRICULTURE, STATE OF NORTH CAROLINA

Mr. GRAHAM. Mr. Chairman, and members of the subcommittee,

the North Carolina Department of Agriculture, through its tobacco

marketing specialists, has closely followed the 1966 Flue-cured marketing season in all belts from the beginning in the Georgia-Florida

71-386-66--2
6 TOBACCO

area. The observations and analyses of the market thus far have

focused attention on certain facts which are pertinent to this hearing

called for the purpose of considering further extension of looseleaf

sales in 1967.

First of all, it should be noted that growers have received record

high prices during the 1966 season, and that even though prices have

declined on several grades in recent weeks, growers are still receiving

record prices for most all grades.

In analyzing this record market, it was observed that the strongest competition among buyers in each belt seemed to prevail during

the 12 days of looseleaf sales. This is substantiated by the fact that

stabilization receipts were practically nil during this period, plus the

fact that many medium and low grades of primings, lugs, and smoking leaf sold untied brought $1 to $2 per hundred more than the same

grades sold tied.

Furthermore, a comparison of grade prices between tied and untied

tobacco through September 30 showed an average price differential of

just slightly more than $2 per hundred for tied tobacco. There were

348 million pounds of untied tobacco sold on markets outside the

Georgia-Florida belt this year compared to approximately 100 million

pounds in 1965. The big question is: Why did we have a 248-percent

increase in the volume of loose leaves sold this year? There is only one

answer to this question in any market, and that is: Market demand.

If the demand for untied tobacco had not been extremely good,

growers would not have marketed as much loose leaf this season. So,

the buyers themselves were responsible for the large volume of tobacco

sold untied, and actually encouraged it by failing to pay growers a

differential large enough to justify them to tie more tobacco.

Thus, it is recognized that the buying companies hold the key that

will control the amount of untied tobacco that will move into the market. Therefore, based on these observations and facts, it is the opinion

of the North Carolina Department of Agriculture that the burden of

determining the amount of untied tobacco that the industry can use

should be placed on the buying companies, and that growers should be

given the option of selling their tobacco either tied or untied throughout the marketing season. This will relieve growers of the pressure

of trying to market their untied tobacco in a limited number of days

from one belt to another, and let them take their time in marketing in

their own belt. Then all farmers will have an opportunity to sell their

tobacco in the manner that will give them the greatest economic

return on their own labor situation and market demand.

The CHAIRMAN. We thank you very much, Mr. Commissioner.

Mr. McMillan?

Mr. MCMILLAN. I would like to state that I agree with the Commissioner 100 percent. But I feel certainly that he will agree with

me that something should be done about this in the next 30 days or

. 2 months.

Mr. GRAHAM. Yes, sir.

Mr. MCMILLAN. Immediately, so plans can be made before the selling season beings next July. Also before the Department of Agriculture makes their commitments to the exporters. I am sure that it is

something that should be done. I hope that you will agree with me
TOBACCO 7

that we should maybe have a longer selling season for some of the

markets. That would relieve a little of this congestion we now have.

Mr. GRAHAM. Well, of course, it will, Mr. McMillan.

Of course, you have your weather conditions that create situations,

but I agree with you.

Thank you, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you, again.

The next witness I will call is Mr. Elmer R. Daniel, president of the

Nash County Farm Bureau.

We are very glad to have you here, and will be glad to hear from

you now.

STATEMENT OF ELMER R. DANIEL, PRESIDENT, NASH COUNTY

FARM BUREAU

Mr. DANIEL. Mr. Chairman, members of the Tobacco Subcommittee, I am Elmer R. Daniel, president of Nash County Farm Bureau,

Nashville, N.C., living in the Stanhope section of Nash County.

This is the home county of our honorable chairman, Mr. Harold D.

Cooley, of the House Committee on Agriculture.

We realize that the Flue-cured industry is faced with problems in

connection with the marketing of looseleaf tobacco. Therefore, our

Nash County Farm Bureau board of directors would like to make the

following recommendations:

Sale of looseleaf tobacco: The Nash County Farm Bureau board

of directors in session October 6, 1966, went on record as recommending that looseleaf sales be extended for next year and future years

up to the optimum degree that the buying companies can effectively

process it. This recommendation came as a result of a discussion of

tobacco-producing problems by this group in which the following

points were brought out:

1. The farm labor shortage no doubt will grow increasingly worse

with a continuous decrease in farm population.

2. Minimum wage legislation to increase farm wages will further

reduce farm labor.

3. The price differential between tied and loose leaf is not enough

to justify the time and expense involved in tying.

Sale of tobacco allotments: With regard to the sale of tobacco

allotments, the Nash County Farm Bureau board of directors in

session October 6, 1966, recommended that the necessary legislation

be enacted permitting the sale of tobacco allotments within the

county.

That concludes our statement, Mr. Chairman.

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you very much, Mr. Daniel.

Are there any questions?

Mr. McMillan?

Mr. McMILLAN. No questions.

The CHAIRMAN. Next I will call Mr. Robert L. Alexander, StateFederal coordinator in the office of the Honorable Robert E. McNair,

Governor of the State of South Carolina. Mr. Alexander is representing the Governor of South Carolina here today.
8 TOBACCO

STATEMENT OF ROBERT L. ALEXANDER, STATE-FEDERAL COORDINATOR, OFFICE OF ROBERT E. McNAIR, GOVERNOR, STATE

OF SOUTH CAROLINA

Mr. ALEXANDER. Thank you, Mr. Chairman and Mr. McMillan.

I am Robert L. Alexander, State-Federal coordinator in the office

of Robert E. McNair, Governor of South Carolina.

The following statement was prepared for the use of Governor

McNair, but he was unable to leave South Carolina at this time and

instructed me to make this appearance before this subcommittee of

the House of Representatives. With the permission of the subcommittee, I will deliver this in the first person as though Governor

McNair were here.

In recent years the entire tobacco marketing program has become a hodgepodge

system and tobacco growers are, no doubt, wondering whose interest is paramount.

The United States Department of Agriculture, representing the growers at the

national level, should use their entire influence to protect equally all farmers in

the administration of congressional agricultural programs. The punitive type of

administration by the Department of Agriculture certainly cannot be the brainchild of Congress. We recognize it as arbitrary administrative rulings.

In South Carolina the number of days for loose-leaf sales of flue-cured tobacco

was increased this season to 12 days. In other states it is, and has been the rule

to allow loose-leaf sales all during the market season.

I contacted the members of the South Carolina delegation in Washington

and the United States Department of Agriculture urging that the then seven-day

sale period be extended throughout the seasov. I have never been able to determine just what is that sound reasoning employed by the Department of

Agriculture in restricting loose-leaf sales in South Carolina. Neither have I

been able to determine how the Department of Agriculture arrives at the arbitrary

figure of a three-cent differential between tied and untied tobacco. It is the

opinion of the experts that it would cost at least eight cents to tie tobacco. The

trouble, however, is not only that lost nickle, but a shortage of labor in South

Carolina. Every tobacco grower will tell you that it is almost impossible to find

anyone to tie the tobacco. This has forced the tobacco grower in our State to

the disaster position of finding labor where there is no labor and paying some

eight cents to have the tobacco tied in order to market it on the South Carolina

market or transport the tobacco to markets in other states. In either event the

tobacco grower loses.

On August 7 of this year, two days before the tobacco market opened, the

newspapers quoted me as stating:

"There is optimism among the tobacco growers that the 1966 season will see

the farmer reap the same financial rewards as they did in 1965 when the crop

averaged a four-year high of $65.61 per hundred pounds. Observers tell me

that our overall crop will equal or surpass that of 1965 despite some unfavorable

growing weather in May and June. We are pleased that we will get additional

time to sell tobacco in loose-leaf form, but we will not be satisfied until South

Carolina farmers, like those of Georgia, will have full price supports for loose-leaf

and will be allowed to sell it in that form all season long."

My position has not changed as to loose-leaf sales for the entire season. Sales

records for the past season show nearly 60 percent of the season sales were looseleaf tobacco with an average price practically the same as tied tobacco.

Tied tobacco did not bring a price of more than three cents per pound over

untied tobacco and at present labor cost, even if labor can be found, tobacco

cannot be tied for three cents per pound. With scarcity of farm labor our tobacco

farmers are being forced to find out-of-state markets for their tobacco.

An arbitrary position of only a limited number of sales days for loose-leaf

tobacco is punitive to our tobacco growers in South Carolina. Our farmers are

not only punished pricewise, they are forced to transport their tobacco to looseleaf sales markets at additional cost.

The position that 1966 tobacco brought record prices to South Carolina growers

is only a half truth statement. Farmers do not class a successful crop on just

price per pound, the success of a crop is the income per acre. Occasional higher

prices one year for a low yield crop and continuing higher cost of production does

not solve the farmer's economic problems.
TOBACCO 9

Still another reason is the tobacco farmer needs to sell all of his tobacco loose leaf

in order to shorten the number of sales days.

Farmers cannot depend on one crop for an annual income so they must diversify

and the present period of three months to sell their tobacco crop seriously limits

the farmers who are compelled to plant more than one cash crop to remain on the

farm.

I want to reiterate the position I took in August as to a full season of loose-leaf

sales for tobacco.

I understand that the Department of Agriculture has a plan to increase the

number of loose-leaf sales days by several each year until we have a season of

loose-leaf sales. I am against this.

I, frankly, intend to delay finalizing a survey of our tobacco farmers toward

obtaining a full season of loose-leaf sales until I have the results of some pre- liminary surveys which I have directed the State Department of Agriculture to obtain for me for further presentation to the United States Department of Agri.

culture in our efforts to obtain a full season of loose-leaf sales in 1967.

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you, sir.

If there are no questions the next witness I will call is Mr. Roy B.

Davis, Jr., of the Virginia Department of Agriculture.

Before hearing Mr. Davis, I would like for you to know that a very

distinguished colleague of ours from Georgia, Mr. Hagan has joined

the subcommitte . We are very glad to have you here, Mr. Hagan.

Mr. HAGAN of Georgia. Thank you very much. I appreciate the

opportunity of being here, Mr. Chairman.

STATEMENT OF ROY B. DAVIS, JR., DEPARTMENT OF AGRICULTURE, STATE OF VIRGINIA

Mr. DAVIS. Mr. Chairman and members of the subcommittee, I

am Roy B. Davis, Jr., tobacco marketing agent for the Virginia

Department of Agriculture.

It is my pleasure today to represent our commissioner at the

hearing of this subcommittee.

I appreciate the opportunity of presenting the views of the Virginia

Department of Agriculture on this very important subject concerning

the sale of looseleaf tobacco which you have under consideration

today.

I am sure that your purpose and that of the department I represent

coincides in that we are seeking the best way to improve the profit

position of the growers of Flue-cured tobacco, to enable them to more

fully share in the affluence of our present-day society.

The tobacco programs which have been fashioned by your committee and others in the Congress, and by the administrators in the

U.S. Department of Agriculture have, in the minds of most people,

been highly successful and have enabled the tobacco growers to

enjoy many of the finer things of life.

The development and operation of these programs has required

millions of decisions—decisions made by individual growers, growers

as a group, the buyers of tobacco, the manufacturers of tobacco

products, both at home and abroad, and by our Congress and by the

administrators within our Federal Government who are charged with

the overall coordination of these programs. Each of these decisions

has an effect on the ability of U.S. Flue-cured tobacco to meet the

competition in the marketplace from other kinds of tobaccos grown

here at home and the same and other kinds of tobaccos grown on

foreign shores. Each of these decisions has either improved the
10 TOBACCO

competitive position of U.S. Flue-cured tobacco, held it constant or

caused it to deteriorate.

A look at the record shows that the use of Flue-cured tobacco in

cigarettes here at home has lagged behind the total use of tobacco

to such an extent that when we compare the proportion of Flue-cured

tobacco used in 1965 to that used in 1953, growers have lost a market

for 75 million pounds in 1965 to other kinds of tobacco here at home.

In exports, our share of the free-world movement of Flue-cured

tobacco in 1950 to 1954 was 56 percent; in 1965, only 43 percent.

This represents a loss in the market of 195 million pounds.

Why did these things happen?

The total effect of these millions of decisions has caused the competitive position of our tobacco to deteriorate and to transfer to other

growers the opportunity to produce almost one-fifth of the market

that we enjoyed just 10 to 15 years ago. Such is the nature of the

decisions with regard untied tobacco.

If the future expansion of untied leaf sales could be resolved on the

basis of my wish, as a grower, the answer would be easy. I do not

like to tie tobacco. But I do not believe the effect of past decisions

on untied tobacco and any future ones in this area will be limited to

the simple question of whether growers like to sell tied or untied

tobacco.

During the marketing year of 1965-66, 300 million pounds, or twothird of the tobacco shipped overseas was unstemmed, and in recent

weeks a number of important buyers have expressed concern over

their ability to find satisfactory supplies of tied tobacco. It is my

understanding that one major buyer has limited his purchases to tied

tobacco because his facilities overseas are not suitable for looseleaf

shipments.

While the proportion of unstemmed tobacco in our exports have

been declining rapidly, the fact that 300 million pounds were shipped

overseas last year in unstemmed form our failure to supply this market

would drive our friends to other suppliers who are willing to supply

the tobacco in the form the buyers want it. The loss of even a portion

of this market could more than offset any gains we might think we

would realize from a reduction in the cost of production, due to the

fact that tobacco is sold in looseleaf form.

In the final analysis, it is the user of our tobacco who will determine

whether a decision we make in our program will increase or decrease

our profits. History shows that we cannot force manufacturers of

tobacco products to buy from us. Just this week, I had the opportunity of discussing our present situation with one of our friends from

overseas. He commented that his company would have to adjust,

because they needed our tobacco. This is, indeed, a good position

for us to be in, but the record shows that these words are becoming

weaker and weaker though he and others like him are increasing their

usings of Flue-cured tobacco from other sources, and our share is

dropping.

It was my privilege last spring to visit a number of our friends in

one of our major market areas overseas on behalf of our Virginia

growers. Soon after the decision was made to expand the sale of

untied tobacco, a decision which has tripled the amount of untied leaf

sold in the Georgia-Florida area—that is, outside of the GeorgiaFlorida area. The other development was causing our friends more
TOBACCO 11

concern, the possibility of this threefold increase in untied tobacco

and the resultant reduction in suitable supplies of tobacco in the form

they wanted it, and this would limit their ability to find their needs

on our market.

Only time will tell whether the decision in 1966 which increased

the period of united sales from 7 to 12 days and extended it to all

types of 40 grades will reduce satisfactory supplies of tied tobacco

to such an extent that our users will seek a greater proportion of their

needs from other sources. If this is the case, a more recent decision

by the Commodity Credit Corporation to pay a refund on exports to

make our tobacco more competitive will, to a degree, be compromised.

I would, therefore, Mr. Chairman, urge that you not accede to my

desire as a grower to sell more of my tobacco in untied form, but to

order a thorough study of the effects of the present situation on our

ability to compete effectively with producers in other areas, and render

a decision that will enable us as U.S. Flue-cured tobacco growers to

expand our markets and our production possibly.

If such a study, which would include full consideration of the

effect of the present situation on our present and future sales as well

as the effects on production and costs, deals with the present amount

of untied tobacco, finds that it is too great, that the amount sold in

1967 be reduced. On the other hand, if the study reveals that the

amount of untied leaf tobacco which can be safely sold can be increased, that this be done.

Thank you very much.

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you very much.

Are there any questions?

Mr. MCMILLAN. No questions.

The CHAIRMAN. I will next call Mr. Joe Blount, a tobacco farmer

of Loris, S.C.

A VOICE FROM AUDIENCE. He is not present.

The CHAIRMAN. Then, I will next call Mr. W. B. Wilkinson, Jr.,

field representative of the Virginia Farm Bureau Federation.

We are pleased to have you here and will be glad to hear from you

now, Mr. Wilkinson.

STATEMENT OF W. B. WILKINSON, JR., FIELD REPRESENTATIVE,

VIRGINIA FARM BUREAU FEDERATION

Mr. WILKINSON. Mr. Chairman, I am W. B. Wilkinson, Jr., field

representative of the Virginia Farm Bureau Federation.

We appreciate the opportunity to make a statement concerning the

sale of untied tobacco.

At the time that this statement was prepared, we were not aware

that you would consider the sale of allotments and I have no statement

on that question.

Our farmers are interested in selling tobacco untied to the extent

that our customers are ready to handle it.

We would request that the effect of additional sales of untied

tobacco on all phases of the tobacco program be thoroughly investigated before any decision is reached. We are dependent to a large

degree on export markets for the sale of our tobacco and would request

that consideration be given to their needs as well as to the effect

that additional sales of untied tobacco would have on our marketing

system.
12 TOBACCO

We feel that it would be desirable to wait until the end of the

present marketing year and until the above factors can be thoroughly

considered before reaching a final decision on this question.

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you very much. If there are no questions,

I will now call Mr. LeRoy Parker of Rocky Mount, N.C.

We will be glad to hear from you now, Mr. Parker.

STATEMENT OF LEROY PARKER, TOBACCONIST,

ROCKY MOUNT, N.C.

Mr. PARKER. Mr. Chairman and gentlemen of the subcommittee,

I believe that I am the first one from the buying center up here, so I

will have a little different statement to present.

On behalf of Mr. Nagasawa

'

representative in charge of the Japan

Monopoly Corp., I would like to read to you his views.

The sale of loose leaves on the markets this year has made it quite difficult for

Japan to buy the tobaccos we need as we do not yet have enough facilities to

handle loose leaves in our plants in Japan.

We would not like to see an extension of sale of loose leaves next year. If next

year the markets are 100 per cent loose leaves, including Government B grades,

our purchases will be greatly reduced. Furthermore, unless grading is done in a

stricter manner, not only in loose leaves but also in bundles, American leaf tobacco

will lose its good reputation in the foreign markets.

Another problem we find is that farmers are hauling their tobacco from one

belt to another to the extent that we are no longer able to identify our purchases

by belts. This creates serious blending problems for us as we have always

historically blended American tobaccos by belts.

We respectfully request your serious consideration to our problems as stated

above.

Thank you.

The CHAIRMAN. We thank you.

Mr. McMillan, any questions?

Mr. MCMILLAN. I wonder if these Japanese know how to grade

tobacco, if they are confused about one grade from one belt to another.

Can they not tell the type of tobacco whether they desire it, or not?

Mr. PARKER. Well, naturally, Congressman McMillan I cannot

quite answer for the Japanese, but I would say that our Government

graders do not grade tobaccos by belts. They grade it by the belt

that it is sold in and not by the belt that it is grown in, and I think

that is what they mean in this case.

Mr. MCMILLAN. I see. I thought that they could tell what grade

they planted.

Mr. PARKER. They can, the grade, but not the belt, that is, in every

case. They see tobacco from one belt sold in another belt. They

have, for accounting and technical reasons, graded it in the belt in

which they bought it, even though they know it is from another belt.

Mr. MCMILLAN. That is all. Thank you.

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you again.

I will next call Mr. C. Stuart Carr, Jr., vice president, Universal

Leaf Tobacco Co., Inc., Richmond, Va.

We are very glad to have you here, Mr. Carr.

STATEMENT OF C. STUART CARR, JR., VICE PRESIDENT, UNIVERSAL LEAF TOBACCO CO., INC., RICHMOND, VA.

Mr. CARR. Mr. Chairman and members of the committee, my name

is C. Stuart Carr, Jr., vice president of Universal Leaf Tobacco Co.,
TOBACCO 13

Inc., Richmond, Va., one of the major buyers and exporters of Fluecured tobacco.

We strongly recommend that there be no further extension in the

selling of loose leaves.

In all future sales of loose leaves, we advocate the use of a burlap

sheet as a container. At no cost to the grower. Currently, warehousemen are dumping leaves into baskets and the buyer is redumping

into sheets. This double action creates an unnecessary expense.

Plus the fact that we are seriously handicapped by an acute labor

shortage. The marketing of leaves in sheets would be a step toward

eventual consideration of selling in bales.

We think that all tobacco should be sold in the district in which it

is grown.

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you very much.

Mr. McMillan, any questions?

Mr. MCMILLAN. I think all of us would like to see all of the tobacco

produced in an area sold in that area, and if the exporters will pay the

differential, I am sure that the people will try to do that.

Mr. CARR. Well, Congressman McMillan, that is a moot question,

and one that is very understandable of you in asking and of many

farmers in asking. We have seen illustrations where loose leaf brought

nearly as much or more than tobacco tied in bundles, but there are

many underlying factors that, I think, can explain that.

When people are selling tobacco in loose leaf and hauling them all

over creation—the old belt hauling it to Georgia and South Carolina,

and South Carolina hauling tobacco to the old belt, how can we know

how much tobacco is going to be sold in leaf, how can we know howmuch tobacco an individual belt is going to sell? How can we determine in any way the size of the crop, in order to fill our orders?

The Government cut its own estimate by 42 million pounds this

week, whereas a few weeks ago they had increased it.

Mr. MCMILLAN. It is my opinion that is why we are having this

hearing today, to try to remedy this situation in South Carolina.

Mr. CARR. We think that would be a great step forward enabling

us—and I speak for Universal Leaf Tobacco Co.—in determining how

much tobacco to buy and how to spend the money that these customers

of ours ask us to spend, and that is all, after all, that we are spending—

their money and not our own money. That would be a great step

forward in enabling us to know how much tobacco an individual belt

is going to sell and how we can fill our orders. If we have an order

for x number of pounds of a certain grade of South Carolina tobacco,

we may buy it much faster than need be, because we have no idea how

much tobacco is going to be sold in South Carolina under the present

marketing system.

Mr. MCMILLAN. If it is tied and untied and is on the floor, you

can buy what you want. Would that not solve the problem?

Mr. CARR. No, sir. That might solve it in the minds of some

people, but it would not solve it in my mind. We feel that the sAling

of loose leafs very definitely slows the volume of sales for the grower.

Even the U.S. Department of Agriculture people are quite clear in

saying that it takes 20 percent more space in a factory to handle loose

leaf, and it also takes 20 percent longer to process loose leaf. It is

really much more costly for a buyer to handle loose leaf, because the

handling sheets are far different from handling tobacco in bundles,
14 TOBACCO

because the sheets are more bulky—you cannot haul as much as you

can of the other, and you cannot stack as much of it in a given place.

It is also more costly to move loose leaf around after it is purchased.

And last, but certainly not least, one reason why we vigorously oppose

the selling of loose leaf beyond what has been done this year is because

of the protests that have been registered with us as buyers by our

foreign customers. As I say, we are spending their money, and they

tell us: "If you continue to sell us tobacco in loose leaf, we will find

a substitute for American tobacco."

And, gentlemen, that is being done every year. All you need to

do is just to review your statistics put out by the U.S. Department of

Agriculture, and you will see that we have been losing business hand

over fist.

Mr. MCMILLAN. Thank you.

The CHAIRMAN. If we should consider legislation prohibiting the

sale of tobacco across State lines, we would run head-on into the

interstate commerce clause of the Constitution; I do not see how we

can possibly say to a man at the South Carolina border, "You cannot

go into South Carolina," or the one in South Carolina, "You cannot

go into North Carolina." We have problems, there is not any doubt

about that.

Mr. CARR. It does seem a violation of free enterprise, there is

no doubt about it, but we just throw that out to you for your consideration. I imagine it would call for a referendum; whether or

not it is even feasible or practical, I do not know.

The CHAIRMAN. It would call for a change in the law. That is,

the law relating to interstate commerce. I do not know what we

can do about that. Anyway, we thank you very much for your

appearance here.

Mr. CARR. Thank you, Mr. Cooley. It has been a pleasure to

be here.

The CHAIRMAN. It has been a pleasure to have had you here.

I will next call Mr. Charles D. Sands, president of the Export

Leaf Tobacco Co., Richmond, Va.

We are glad to have you here, and will be glad to hear from you now.

STATEMENT OF CHARLES D. SANDS, PRESIDENT, EXPORT LEAF

TOBACCO CO., RICHMOND, VA.

Mr. SANDS. Mr. Chairman and members of the subcommittee,

my name is Charles D. Sands, and I am president of Export Leaf

Tobacco Co., of Richmond, Va.

My company purchases very substantial quantities of American

Flue-cured tobacco to supply to the cigarette manufacturers throughout the free world.

As a supplying and processing company, we have consistently

opposed any expansion of the sale of tobacco in the form of loose leaf

for the following reasons.

First, loose leaf is extremely difficult to handle on the warehouse

floors, because of its condition, as well as in the auction warehouses

and at the processing plants.

Next, it has been our experience that considerably more storage

space is required to hold loose leaf while awaiting processing.
TOBACCO 15

Loose leaf cannot be processed as expeditiously as other kinds, and

requires facilities with which some of our plants are not equipped.

As to loose leaf, under this year's marketing program, extending

marketing supports to untied tobacco during the first 12 days of the

sale it has resulted in a movement of millions of pounds of tobacco

from belt to belt and a concentration of volume into a relatively short

period, so that the processing plants are being severely congested.

The manufacturers we supply have predominantly expressed a

preference for tied tobacco. Many of them are not able to use loose

leaf in this form at all.

In addition to the increased expenses incurred in processing loose

leaf, the manufacturers have the following reasons for not wanting it:

First, uniform grade quantity is an essential point to the maintenance of blend standards. Tobaccos marketed in the form of loose

leaf contain a greater amount of mixed grading and quantity than does

tied tobacco. These leaves also contain a great deal of foreign matter,

all of which it is virtually impossible to remove at the time of the

original processing.

Many factories overseas are not equipped to handle loose leaf.

These three points cause great concern to the overseas manufacturers and are seriously lowering the prestige of American tobaccos.

Mr. Chairman, for all of these reasons which may not seem to be

particularly important to the average grower, warehouseman or the

Department of Agriculture officials, to those who are engaged in the

export of tobaccos, they are critically important. All segments of the

American tobacco industry must join hands in making available to our

customers the kind of tobaccos that they want, in the form that they

require, and at the best possible competitive prices.

If we think of the old maxim that the customer is always right, if we

make it impossible for him to buy the kinds of American tobaccos that

he wants, in a manner that he desires, packed in a manner that he

requires, if we forget that, then we are destroying the foreign markets

for our tobaccos. It would leave our customers no alternative but to

turn to other countries for their needs. There are many areas of the

world that are furnishing to our traditional customers tobaccos which

they find attractive, and unless we make available what they want

it is inevitable that they will turn more and more to our foreign competitors for their supplies.

Our experience this season clearly indicates that we must take definite steps to hold the allegiance of our foreign customers. We who

would suggest that in the 1967 crop season that the following measures be adopted to improve the present unsatisfactory marketing

condition:

First, that price support be applicable to loose leaf in only the priming of nondescript quality. This will enable the growers to market

the early tobacco untied in the season while curing and tying the

leaves higher up the stalks.

Next, that such price supports be extended to these qualities but

for only, say, the first 35 to 50 hours of the sale. This would provide

sufficient sales time for all growers in each belt to prepare their

tobacco for the market to sell as loose leaf.

Finally, if such price supports be extended to such quality that it
16 TOBACCO

would be only when the tobacco is sold in the belt in which it was

grown. This would provide for more orderly marketing of loose leaf

in each belt.

In summary, we strongly urge that the sale of loose leaf be reasonably restricted, so that there will be available tobacco that will enable the American tobacco industry to maintain its rightly place in

the free world.

Thank you very much.

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you.

If there are no questions, I will next call Mr. Rufus Larrimore,

tobacco farmer and warehouseman, Hemingway, S.C.

We will be glad to hear from you now.

STATEMENT OF RUFITS LARRIMORE, TOBACCO FARMER AND

WAREHOUSEMAN, HEMINGWAY, S.C.

Mr. LARRIMORE. Mr. Chairman and members of the subcommittee,

my name is Rufus Larrimore. I am glad to appear before your subcommittee. I want to speak directly as a tobacco farmer. Labor

is getting very scarce. We cannot get enough labor to tie this tobacco.

I have in many cases taken tobacco off the stick, weighed it, and have

given to some people to tie, and in most the cases I will be lucky if I

get 92 percent of my poundage back. That means that you lose 8

percent in poundage. If you lose that and if you average 70 cents

per pound, plus 3 cents to get this work done, you are losing 10 cents.

You take a farmer who puts that tobacco on the floor, it is bringing

the same price loose as it brings tied, and then you just cannot get

him to go back and tie his second tobacco.

In South Carolina this year, I believe that the farmers in our State

sold on the markets around 60 million pounds of loose tobacco. And

then they have taken 23-plus millions down to Georgia and about 7

million to North Carolina. They were hunting a place to sell their

tobacco loose. It was an awful thing the last 3 days of the market in

South Carolina when the farmers knew that they did not have but

just 3 more days to sell the loose tobacco. Everyone was rushing in—

everyone was trying to do their best—they were getting mad at the

warehouseman, doing everything to get their tobacco on the floor.

And we lived through almost a hell. I will tell you what is true:

When they could not sell it on our markets, they moved up into

North Carolina with it.

The farmer in South Carolina is going to sell his tobacco untied,

regardless of what State they have to sell it in.

I think the time has come now that we will have to go loose.

There is one thing: If the farmers had been given a differential

which was sufficient for this tobacco, they would have continued

tying it, if that is the way that the companies want it, but tobacco

is bringing practically the same price loose as tied.

I think that this past year was the time when we should have

diverted it all the way to loose.

Thank you very much.

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you very much. Are there any questions?

If not, I will next call Mr. A. P. Thorpe III, a tobacconist of

Rocky Mount, N.C.

We will be glad to hear from you now, Mr. Thorpe.
TOBACCO 17

STATEMENT OF A. P. THORPE III, TOBACCONIST,

ROCKY MOUNT, N.C.

Mr. THORPE. Mr. Chairman and members of the subcommittee,

my name is A. P. Thorpe from Rocky Mount, N.C. I have been

asked to read two letters this afternoon on behalf of the J. L. Tiedemann Tobaksfabrik, the largest manufacturer in Norway.

The first is by their U.S. office, the Overseas Commodex Corp.,

and it reads as follows:

Enclosing is a copy of a letter by J. L. Tiedemann's Tobaksfabrik, dated

October 12, 1961, addressed to Tobacco Division, FAS, concerning the possible

change in sales of American tobacco to looseleaf form. This letter still states

the same position that exists with us today.

Tiedemann has been experimenting with new machinery in four countries in

an effort to adapt themselves to handling loose leaves, but such equipment is not

available today. Therefore, our situation remains unchanged since 1961.

Very truly yours,

WALTER C. SPRYE,

Vice President.

Next is the letter from J. L. Tiedemann Tobaksfabrik dated

October 12, 1961, directed to the Tobacco Division, Foreign Agricultural Service:

11/14 I would very much like to thank you for arranging the meeting our Mr. Bell

had with senior officials of the Department of Agriculture when he was recently

in Washington.

It is understood that he was given a very sympathetic hearing by Mr. Murray

Thompson, Mr. Claude G. Turner, Mr. Hugh C. Kiger, Mr. John I. Morton, and

yourself when discussing the possible sale of tobaccos in an untied form. Knowing

how busy all you gentlemen must be, the time given to this conference is greatly

appreciated.

I would like to reiterate some of the points brought up during the course of the

meeting.

Shag and pipe mixtures make up the major part of total sales of tobacco goods

in this country. In these products the Norwegian public has been used to a long

rag, or cut, with no slivers of the stem; the consumer judges, to a large extent, the

quality of a product on those visual attributes. In this connection it can be

added that it is easier to change the taste of a product over a period of time than

to alter the appearance of the same product.

If the method of selling American flue-cured tobacco is changed so that sales

take place in a loose leaf form, it would appear to leave me one of two courses

to follow:

(1) Tie all purchases prior to redrying. This would in all probability increase

the cost of the landed leaf in this country and so force me to seek some cheaper

tobaccos elsewhere.

(2) Straight lay the tobaccos best possible in my own factories prior to cutting.

This method would not be really satisfactory as slivers of stem could not be

avoided; besides which the cost of production would be increased considerably.

American tobaccos are still considered to be in a class of their own and form the

backbone of my blends. However, as a matter of expediency, it has been found

that, with careful blending, certain tobaccos purchased outside America can be

used as price reducers, without in any way reducing the quality of the products.

Should loose leaf sales become the order of the day on all American flue-cured

markets, I am afraid my usage of "off-shore" tobaccos will tend to be accelerated

at the expense of the American leaf.

I would like to repeat my sincere thanks for your having arranged the meeting

and hope that as a result of it and all the others that were arranged afterwards,

the probability of loose leaf sales taking place has diminished.

Thank you.

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you very much.

Are th3re any questions?

If not, I will next call Mr. Elmer Burt, Wake County Farm Bureau.

We will be glad to hear from you now.
18 TOBACCO

STATEMENT OF ELMER BURT, WAKE COUNTY FARM BUREAU,

WAKE COUNTY, N.C.

Mr. BURT. Mr. Chairman and members of this subcommittee, my

name is Elmer Burt of Wake County, N.C.

I do not have a prepared statement. I am not here as the president

of the Wake County Farm Bureau. I would like to speak as a farmer,

a tobacco farmer.

The selling of untied leaf is one of the subjects before us, and I will

take that first. As a farmer this is the way that I would like to sell it,

without any question. I would like to sell it that way 100 percent,

but when I look at the facts I wonder if this is the statement that I

really want to make. Can our consumers handle this product in

total at any one time without definite plans preceding it? I doubt it.

And we must, even though we have the best product in the world,

satisfy our customers.

I think that planning is the thing that we must put preceding,

going all the way into loose leaf. I think that we need planning in

going into loose leaf, planning in marketing, planning in selling, and

planning in using it.

The total industry needs to make some plans.

Last year, I had great hopes that we would have a committee that

would do some planning. It was to be a marketing committee, but

so far this has not developed.

In preceding years, I have heard farmers, warehousemen, and others,

condemn one segment or one part of a segment of the industry, and

then another, in our system. This will not stand up any longer.

Our farm people, our industry people are beginning to talk to each

other. We are beginning to understand some of the problems that

the others have. We must get together, and I think that we need,

first, to get some planning and to have some farmers and some warehousemen and some company people and some consumers to sit down

and really make a thorough study of what we are doing and where

we are going and how we are going to get there, and, particularly, as

it relates to the looseleaf marketing.

Economically, I want to sell loose leaf. At the market this year,

it is not paying you to tie the tobacco, as a farmer. I sold about

one-third of my crop loose leaf. I could have sold at least another

one-third during the marketing time, but I did not, because I thought

that the market would pay me for tying it. Gentlemen, it is not

doing it. And this is the economical bind that the farmer is feeling

and that I am feeling, and there is question about it, that if the price

is there we farmers will tie every bundle of it and not sell any loose

leaf. If it is not there, we must find another answer.

Now, going to the sale of allotments. I have been against the sale

of allotments. Maybe this was an inherited thing that gained through

the years as a youngster hearing about this, that tobacco and the

land were the same.

It has only been a few short years ago that I would have thought

that it would have been the most unreasonable and unrealistic approach to try to solve some of our problems. And before the ScottTalmadge hearings in the late 1950's, I so stated; but times changed,

and a year ago I changed. And in the process I decided that an

acreage-poundage system was a thing that could be one of the salva-
TOBACCO 19

tion factors of our tobacco program. We made that change through

a vote of our tobacco people. And most of our people are now aware

that it was a good thing. It hurt me as a tobacco farmer, because I

lost poundage, but I think that in the long run, I will gain.

I think that we are going to face up to this thing of selling tobacco

allotments. I am not sure that we will sell or not sell, but farmers

need to understand all of the facts. And if you give our farm people

the facts they will make the right decisions. They do not need an

education; they need the facts. And I believe that they are beginning to see now that we must make a change in this tobacco program

of moving allotments. If we are to survive as an industry of the

magnitude that we have known in all of the life of America, we must

somehow be able to pay labor. We must be able for a few people to

have greater quantities and place it on the marketplace at a lesser

cost than we have for years past. Mechanization will be the answer

if we are to survive in this tobacco industry as farmers. Mechanization is going to be costly. In order to be able to absorb this cost

there must be a greater volume of acreage and poundage in a given

unit.

We lost the cotton industry in North Carolina that was here a few

years back, because we waited too long to get cotton into the hands of

the people and in the types of sales that could grow cotton economically, mechanically, and make money. I think that we had better

look close at this thing of selling tobacco allotments before it is too

late.

We must have mechanization, and our research and our industry

must give us the equipment to handle it mechanically.

Again, we must put it in a form that our consumer, our buyer, our

manufacturer wants it in.

I am still a little disturbed as to the helter-skelter manner of

handling tobacco. When we go to mechanization, I think we need to

go into some form of bundle or bale, or something that will get it in a

much more desirable form, better appearing to our manufacturers.

I think that we need to plan in both of these cases today, loose leaf

and the sale of tobacco allotments. I think that we need, and industry

needs, to sit down and do some planning, and each understand the

other man's problems.

Thank you, very much.

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you, Mr. Burt.

Mr. BURT. Are there any questions?

The CHAIRMAN. I believe Mr. McMillan has a question.

Mr. MCMILLAN. I would like to ask the gentleman this question:

Do you think that it is very, very important to the tobacco grower to

settle this problem within the next 30 or 60 days?

Mr. BURT. If it can be settled in the next 30 to 60 days completely,

fine—this is my opinion. I think that the farmers and the industry

as a whole need to know the answer for next year.

Mr. MCMILLAN. That is what I am thinking of.

Mr. BURT. Yes, sir, I do not think that there is any question about

that.

Mr. MCMILLAN. So that the farmers and the industry will know

what to expect in the selling season and not wait until next spring.

Mr. BURT. The later you wait the more confusion there is usually

in the marketplace and in the mind of the farmers and the companies

and the warehousemen, and everybody else.
20 TOBACCO

Mr. MCMILLAN. If I did not think that this problem was real important and should be settled immediately, I can assure you that I

would never have taken 2 days away from my campaign to be here

today—I can tell you that.

Mr. BURT. Thank you. I appreciate that. I think it is a very

important question.

The CHAIRMAN. You mentioned a marketing committee. What

do you have in mind?

Mr. BURT. Maybe this is not the right name, marketing committee.

Maybe it should be industry committee. I think that it should

be made up of people from all segments of the industry to be able to

look to each segment, to look at the other man's problems, away from

any pressures, away from any undue duress from anyone, where

they could sit down eye-to-eye across the table and discuss their

problems, one with another, and understand the situation; and, then,

these people, if they were leaders within their fields, whether it be

the farmers or the warehousemen or the companies or the consumers

or the manufacturers, then they could explain in a legible, understandable way to their own people what was happening within the

total industry. I do not think we would have this confusion that

we are having in our marketing of tobacco now if we had that understanding.

Mr. MCMILLAN. Just a few weeks ago, Congressman Lennon and

myself and Mr. Cooley and some of the others appeared before some

Department of Agriculture officials in an effort to get a 10-day

extension on this looseleaf sale, and at that time the Department

advised us that they had previously made commitments to the

exporters, that is, the tobacco exporters, that they would not have

more than a 10-day sale, and that is the reason that I think it is a real

emergency and that we should do something right away.

Mr. BURT. Yes, I think you should plan and plan well ahead, so

that everybody knows what is going to happen, and then stick to it

as nearly as possible.

Mr. MCMILLAN. Before making any commitments?

Mr. BURT. Yes, sir.

Mr. MCMILLAN. Thank you. That is all.

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you very much.

I will next call Mr. John Williamson.

STATEMENT OF BAILEY WILLIAMSON, RALEIGH, N.C.

Mr. WILLIAMSON. Mr. Chairman and mambers of the committee,

I have an explanation to make. I am Bailey Williamson. I want

to thank you and Mr. McMillan for both coming down here.

Over the years, I know of no two men who have been in Washington

who have been truly the friends of the tobacco farmers as you two

men have.

The CHAIRMAN. I am glad to hear that.

Mr. WILLIAMSON. I am appearing here for my brother John

Williamson, who is president of the Flue-Cured Tobacco Growers.

And the reason that he cannot be here is that today was his day on

the hay baler. And I was not about to change with him. [Laughter.]

He asked that his association go on record as favoring an option

system that price supports be extended throughout the entire season
TOBACCO 21

on all grades, and if there are companies who are willing to pay the

difference, then the farmers will tie the tobacco.

That is about the position of his association.

I did not realize the possibility of the subject of the sale of allotments

was going to be discussed here today. I have been informed that it

was not going to be, but if you will look at the total picutre, as I have

tried to do, to the best of my ability, I will present these thoughts:

I was invited to a conference at State College where the best minds

in the business put together papers and present them. I came to the

conclusion that it is an age of mechanization; that bulk curing and

mechanical harvesting and sale of loose leaf will fit all in one program.

I just want to say that I favor the sale of allotments across the

county lines, or anywhere else. Thank you.

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you very much.

Mr. McMillan, any questions?

Mr. MCMILLAN. I like the statement of this gentleman who has

expressed the exact sentiment of the people that I represent in South

Carolina. I want to thank you for your statement.

Mr. WILLIAMSON. Thank you.

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you, again.

I will next call on Mr. L. R. Ellis, Route 1, Clinton, N.C.

We will be glad to hear you now.

STATEMENT OF L. R. ELLIS, CLINTON, N.C.

Mr. ELLIs. Mr. Chairman and gentlemen of the subcommittee, I

am just a farmer; just a plain old farmer, Mr. Cooley. There are

about three thoughts that I have.

We propose that looseleaf sales be increased to 18 days per belt,

limiting looseleaf sales to domestic tobacco. That is the bottom part

on the stalk. That will not get up into our H tobacco, and will give

other States that handle this domestic tobacco an opportunity which

otherwise is too expensive to handle in a bundle.

Then, we suggest that looseleaf tobacco be supported at the same

price as tied tobacco on a grade basis. That will help eliminate some

of this differential in cost.

We request that enough drying plants be operated to take care of

the amount of tobacco that has been agreed upon to sell to the buyers.

That was something that was agreed upon before this crop, Mr. Cooley.

The cards were laid on the table, and they were figured out in

proportion, per pound, per amount of baskets that the companies

could handle and process, and yet we come back to the same old

situation. I think if there are enough drying plants put into operation

to take care of the existing proposition, we would not have this

trouble.

The CHAIRMAN. May I interrupt you there?

Mr. ELLIs. Yes.

The CHAIRMAN. I am told that it is difficult for them to find labor

to operate the drying facilities, even though they are available.

Mr. ELLIs. That might be true, but this applies not only to the

drying plants of the companies but it applies to me as a farmer, and,

as I stated beforehand, if the cards are laid on the table between the

committeemen of the various people and all of the segments of the

industry and it is worked out as to the amount of tobacco that can be
22 TOBACCO'

handled satisfactorily to the flow of the tobacco to the market, it

would help.

Here is another thought. We are entitled to support of 100 percent

parity on tobacco. We are working on a very small parity on our

tobacco, and if we could get the support of our tobacco crop up to

100 percent of parity that would be another factor that would come

in here and justify our hiring labor at the minimum wage cost that

is set upon us and which helps to create this situation.

Those are just a few of the thoughts I have that I wanted to make

a statement on. There are several others that I could present and

stand here and come up with.

I appreciate the invitation I received.

The CHAIRMAN. We thank you very much for your appearance.

I am certain that the committee will give consideration to your

statement.

Mr. ELLIs. Thank you.

The CHAIRMAN. I will next call Mr. John Gregory, president, the

American Leaf Organization, the Imperial Tobacco Co., Ltd., Wilson,

N.C.

STATEMENT OF JOHN GREGORY, PRESIDENT, THE AMERICAN

LEAF ORGANIZATION, THE IMPERIAL TOBACCO CO., LTD.,

WILSON, N.C.

Mr. GREGORY. Mr. Chairman and members of the subcommittee,

conditions have reached a new low in marketing tobacco—conditions

which no longer can be lived with—most of trouble having resulted

from marketing conditions created by looseleaf sales.

We recognize the problem of the farmer but also the farmer and

warehouse association has to recognize the position of the purchasing

power.

Without the purchasing power of the export trade the farmer does

not have a market for his product. This was effectively proven when

the markets tried to run this past week without some of the foreign

buyers.

It was also clearly illustrated by the slump in prices when major

buying companies had to reduce their purchases, prior to leaving the

markets, because of congestion in their plants.

There is also a definite demand in export trade for tied tobacco. A

number of companies cannot under any set of conditions use loose

leaves in place of bundle tobacco. To eliminate any one purchaser of

tobacco, of any type, however small the order, decreases the competition with the end results in hurting the grower.

The majority of the export trade is concentrated in the H and B

types of tobacco for which there is very little demand by the domestic

companies.

Looseleaf sales and fast selling is tied together.

(a) The grower is concerned about the drop in prices as the markets

progress.

This drop in prices is caused by:

a. The inability of the processors to handle the tobacco.

b. The unknown quality of future sales in later belts.

c. The inaccuracy of belt volume predictions.

d. The movement of tobacco between belts.
TOBACCO 23

Of the four factors listed above the most important is the movement

of tobacco between belts. It is in this movement between belts that

makes it difficult to assess accurately the volume to be sold in each belt.

This causes the warehousemen to fear the loss of sales that would

normally occur in his house and puts pressure on the individual to try

and entice faster sales by his customer.

It also causes the grower to seek market facilities many miles from

his home and which in turn adds to his expense and loss of time which

is sadly needed at home for tending other crops.

This movement between belts also puts the Department of Agriculture and the buying companies at a great disadvantage in estimating

future deliveries.

The Department of Agriculture, in spite of acreage-poundage control, predicted August 1 a Flue-cured crop of 1,167 million pounds.

This was raised September 1 to 1,174 million pounds and now as of

October 1, the total was decreased by 40 million pounds. This, despite

the fact that the figures were gathered by the best brains and facilities

available, can and does play havoc with buying companies' plans.

Every purchaser would like and does his best to spread his purchases

over the entire Flue-cured area so as to maintain a level profitable

buying pattern. No buyer wants to buy his requirements at a high

price and later see the same tobacco go to his competitor at a lower

price. If this happens often, some heads will roll.

If the buying organization had more time to make orderly purchases

and regulate their buying, there would be little chance of severe drops

in prices.

It has been quoted in the papers a number of times by certain elements in the business that processors should increase their facilities

to the extent that they could handle their purchases as fast and in

any form that the warehouse and farmer wish to sell. It has also

been stated that there are a number of plants sitting idle and that

these should be put into use.

As for the first, I would like to state the Imperial Tobacco now has

but two plants. We have sold a number of old plants in the past few

years because they were outmoded and of no use. The product that

we are required to deliver to our customers has changed and we have

to change with the requirements. Our largest plant, located in Wilson,

N.C., involves an investment of approximately $9 million. We

operate this plant, and our Greenville plant, for about 6 months out of

the year. To increase our capacity, which is now well over a million

pounds a day would require an additional capital investment of many

millions, which is economically impossible. In fact, we have found

there is not this space capacity that has been indicated. When we get

in a position that we need this capacity, the dealer is usually in the

same predicament that we are in. Also, using other plants that are

not operating at capacity, would involve an additional outlay to other

companies which we are not prepared to do. Besides the monetary

cost, only a very few could meet the requirements in quality control

that our branches demand of us.

Finally, we would like to recommend to the Deptrtment of Agriculture, to tobacco growers and the warehousemen, that definite steps

be taken immediately to relieve the marketing pressure:

First, loose leaf sales be limited in 1967 to the P, N, X, and C grades.

That the B and H types be supported only in bundled form.
24 TOBACCO

Second, to relieve the pressure on all segments of the industry, that

the Congress be asked for enabling legislation calling for a referendum

by the farmer-voting that the movement of tobacco between belts be

stopped.

In doing this, pressure would be taken off the warehousemen in

knowing that all the tobacco grown in his district would be sold

locally, thereby stopping the push to get in on the floor before it moves

to another belt. To the farmer it would mean that he would not

have to rush to market his crop, because he would know that it could

be handled locally, and in this manner, the buyers could know what

is to be sold in the belt and could plan a uniform, even pattern of

purchase without the violent fluctuations in prices that now prevail.

The farmer would also then have time to properly attend his other

crops, saving valuable time and expense in long cartage.

If the above is not possible, which I feel is the only way the export

trade can be held or extended, then sale poundage for each market

should be established on a historical basis. Each market should be

allotted a basic poundage (daily) which is its traditional percentage of

the total belt sales. This probably should be allotted on a basis of

what that individual market sold during the past 5 or 10 years. Such

an allotment would in itself regulate sales and would be easy to adjust

to the capacity of the buyers.

Gentlemen, before I sit down, I would like to ask—or even beg—

the Warehouse Association, the Farm Bureau, and the Department of

Agriculture to sit down together with the buyers and really tackle this

problem. It is at a serious stage. It is costing the farmer and the

processors money and undue anguish.

Speaking for the Imperial Tobacco Co., alone, our present position

is not good. The world sitaution being what it is, it could mean a

lot to the tobacco farmer, but it could also hurt him a lot. At the

present time, the tobacco that we are buying is in excess of double

what we can process and is at least one-half to three-quarters million

a day more than we can handle through various other costly means.

If we have to slow down, it will be to the growers detriment. Next

year it could be much worse.

The CHAIRMAN. We thank you very much, Mr. Gregory.

Mr. MCMILLAN. I would like to ask Mr. Gregory a question. We,

in South Carolina, wish to state that we are very proud of the Imperial

Tobacco Co. and we certainly want to work with you people all the

time. I have had questions asked me on numerous occasions as to

why they sold the three plants in South Carolina.

Mr. GREGORY. We sold the three plants because they were old

and they were of no value to us. Our method of processing tobacco

has completely changed in the last 5 years--in the last 5 or 6 years

should say. We now have to thresh all of our exports, except a very

small amount that goes into pipe tobacco. All of our cigarette tobacco

is threshed before it is shipped. None of the plants that we have sold,

even in South Carolina or North Carolina or Virginia were suitable

for this type of operation. We had to build new plants.

Mr. MCMILLAN. Do you have to untie this tobacco for threshing?

Mr. GREGORY. When it is threshed—when you thresh the tobacco

you put it through on a belt and you tip it; you tip it one way, and

the butt end of it goes another way. The tips do not go through the
TOBACCO 25

threshing. If they go through it reduces our capacity by 20 to 25

percent at a minimum.

Mr. MCMILLAN. What do you do with the tips? Do you put them

into the filters?

Mr. GREGORY. What?

Mr. MCMILLAN. What do you do with the tips; do you put them

into the filters?

Mr. GREGORY. We use all of it.

Mr. MCMILLAN. Do you buy much tobacco in Georgia?

Mr. GREGORY. If the crop is good, we buy tobacco in Georgia.

Mr. MCMILLAN. Thank you.

The CHAIRMAN. Mr. Gregory, I want to thank you for your statement, and I also want to assure all of the witnesses who have presented

statements that the transcript of all of this evidence taken here will

be made available to the officials of the U.S. Department of Agriculture

and to the public generally.

Mr. GREGORY. Thank you, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. I will, next, place into the record a statement from

Mr. Henry E. Ferrell, of Knightdale, N.C., as well as a telegram from

Mr. G. Fred Steele, Jr., and a telegram from Mr. C. U. Rogers, and

Mr. H. L. Barnhill, and Mr. J. R. Rogers of the Farmers & Tobacco

Warehouse, and a letter from W. B. Oliver. These will be made a

part of the record at this point.

(The letter and telegrams referred to follow:)

To House Committee Hearings:

KNIGHTDALE, N.C., October 14, 1966.

SALE OF TOBACCO ALLOTMENTS

Economic pressure offers no alternative but that the sale and/or lease and

transfer of tobacco allotments across county lines and eventually across state

lines must come to pass if we are to maintain the production of flue-cured tobacco

in this country as a major source of farm income. A schedule will be necessary

so as to soften the impact on the economy of those areas which, because of soil

and labor environment, would most likely sell or lease.

SALE OF FLUE-CURED TOBACCO LOOSE-LEAF

Economic pressures dictate the need for a less expensive method for preparing

tobacco for sale. A complete change-over is a must by 1970. After this date a

dealer desiring tobacco in the tied form should expect to pay an automatic fee to

be added to the bid price of the tobacco.

WATKINS ABBITT,

Chairman Tobacco Subcommittee,

Raleigh, N.C.:

Following telegram sent to Harold E. Cooley care Tobacco Subcommittee

hearings and Watkins Abbitt, chairman of Tobacco Subcommittee hearings, State

Highway Department Building Auditorium, Raleigh, N.C. by G. Fred Steele

Republican candidate for Congress Fifth Congressional District.

Following responds your invitation for interested person submit views to

Tobacco Subcommittee. Regret previous committment prevents personal appearance. Subjects announce your subcommittee deserve careful consideration.

However another potentially critically tobacco problem not receiving attention

deserved. Refer to probability that 1967 tobacco sales will have dangerous

shortage qualified graders. Poor grading will cost farmers untold millions.

HENRY E. FERRELL,

Tobacco Farmer, Wake County.

DURHAM, N.C., October 14, 1966.
26 TOBACCO

Earlier this year U.S. Agriculture Department refused reconsider ruling which in

effect drastically reduced pay of tobacco graders. Several top graders have

already quit and many others say this their last year. There are more than 400

of these vital experienced men. They are essential to fair tobacco prices and require fair pay. Inexperienced graders will destroy entire price support system

based on expert grading for more than 20 years. This is false economy by

USDA. Remind you that USDA spending up 22 percent since 1960, while farm

population down 20 percent, tobacco program apparently only one under economy

axe. Many growers and others in Fifth 'District apprehensive that our Congressmen have delayed too long in attacking the problem. Urge Tobacco Subcommittee Act now. Before best graders lost to tobacco industry. Copy sent to

United States Department of Agriculture, Washington, D.C.

Respectfully,

G. FRED STEELE, Jr.

Congressman HAROLD D. COOLEY,

Chairman, Agriculture Committee,

Raleigh, N.C.:

We are against extending loose-leaf sales for a longer period of time. Instead

of extending the time, we believe that time and grade that are to be sold loose-leaf

should reverse back to the plan 1965. Selling all grades loose-leaf for 12 days is

partially responsible for glut in market. Therefore, instead of farmers saving

money, the price is lower. If we sell our tobacco loose, we will be in jeopardy

of losing large portions of our foreign market.

WILLIAMSTON, N.C., October 13, 1966.

C. U. ROGERS,

H. L. BARNHILL,

J. R. ROGERS,

Farmers and Tobacco Warehouse.

PINE LEVEL, N.C., October 11, 1966.

Hon. HAROLD D. COOLEY, Raleigh, N.C.

DEAR HAROLD: I am sorry I will not be able to attend the meeting Friday,

about tobacco—I shall be out of town—I have talked to many of our farmers,

and we would like to have all the tobacco in 1967 sold as loose leaf—all over the

belt for the whole season, the tobacco will bring more sold this way, and due to

the labor shortage, this will help all farmers.

We would like to see this done.

Best wishes in the coming campaign.

Yours,

W. B. OLIVER.

Mr. MCMILLAN. I have a telegram that I have received from the

South Carolina Tobacco Warehouse Association signed by Mr. Marion

S. Fowler, executive secretary, which I should like to have placed in

the record. ,

The CHAIRMAN. Without objection, that will be made a part of the

record at this point.

(The telegram referred to follows:)

LAKE CITY, S.C., October 14, 1966.

Hon. JOHN L. MCMILLAN,

Tobacco Subcommittee,

Raleigh, N.C.:

As result continuing critical labor shortage and failure tobacco prices paid tied

tobacco to provide for adequate differential, grade basis, compared loose, urge

loose leaf sales period cover entire season with full price supports and uniform

grading thereon, thus giving growers optional basis for selling and ample time

sell crop thus, realize such requires "spread-out" of season as some accommodation

necessary to regulate better volume tobacco moving into trade channels, in given

period time. We shall cooperate any plan fairly and equitably applied for this

arranging sales in various belts in order meet requirements, and limitations
TOBACCO 27

processing, redrying facilities. Will gladly give data, statistics and views in

detail if desired thinks yours and committees interest.

MARION S. FOWLER,

Executive Secretary, South Carolina Tobacco Warehouse Association.

The CHAIRMAN. I will next call Mr.Wade Stephenson of the Johnston County Farm Bureau, Smithfield, N.C.

(No response.)

The CHAIRMAN. It appears that Mr. Stephenson is not here.

That ends the list of witnesses.

I would like now to ask if there is anyone else here who would like

to be heard?

If so, indicate that by holding up your hand, and we will certainly

be glad to hear you.

I would like to note the presence of Mr. Herman Odom, Commodity

Committee on Tobacco, Claxton, Ga.

Do you desire to make a statement?

Mr. ODOM. No. Thank you.

The CHAIRMAN. If there is no one else wanting to be heard,

declare the meeting adjourned.

(Whereupon, at 4 p.m., the hearing was concluded.)

0